Podcasts about audience audit

Welcome to a compelling new episode of Build a Better Agency! This week, host Drew McLellan is joined by familiar faces Susan Baier from Audience Audit and Brian Gerstner from White Label IQ to discuss the findings of the 2025 Agency Core research study. Together, Susan and Brian have launched Agency Core, a nonprofit initiative dedicated to providing agency owners with powerful, unbiased data about what's really going on in the agency world—and the latest results are as sobering as they are enlightening. Drew, Susan, and Brian unpack the study's in-depth findings, based on responses from over 700 agency leaders. They explore the five distinct agency segments identified, analyzing which mindsets and practices set high-performing agencies apart from their peers. The discussion covers the recurring challenges hurting agency profitability and optimism, including the ongoing struggle with building a strong pipeline, the reality of staffing issues, and a noticeable decline in overall optimism among agency owners compared to previous years. The trio digs into what's driving these trends and why, despite all the talk around new technologies like AI, the most pressing problems for agencies remain much more fundamental. You'll also hear their perspectives on the importance of specialized positioning, the power of thought leadership, formal client retention strategies, and maintaining a proactive approach to agency marketing—plus, the critical role of community and peer support in navigating tough times.  If you're looking for actionable insights and a candid, data-driven roadmap to greater agency success, this episode is a must-listen. Tune in for practical strategies and encouragement on how to move from feeling stuck to thriving, even in a changing industry landscape. By the end, you'll be equipped to make meaningful changes and inspired to take the next steps toward building a stronger, more resilient agency.  A big thank you to our podcast's presenting sponsor, White Label IQ. They're an amazing resource for agencies who want to outsource their design, dev, or PPC work at wholesale prices. Check out their special offer (10 free hours!) for podcast listeners here. What You Will Learn in This Episode: The power of niche positioning and thought leadership for agency resilience   Why so many agency owners are struggling and the importance of moving from tactical to strategic work Pipeline challenges as the top threat facing agencies today—far surpassing concerns about AI How formal client retention systems and proactive strategic thinking fuel growth The critical role of reputation: it's what others say about you, not what you say about yourself Team loyalty initiatives and their connection to agency performance and staff retention Choosing your path: the necessity of specialization versus the struggles of being a generalist

Send us a textWant access to the book? go to PlatformGrowthBooks.comUncovering Your Hidden Network: The Power of a Potential Audience AuditIn this episode, we explore the often-overlooked power of utilizing your existing network to kick-start your project or business venture. Drawing inspiration from J.K. Rowling's early days before she became famous with Harry Potter, we emphasize the significance of a small but supportive network. The episode introduces a methodology called the Potential Audience Audit to help you identify and leverage the hidden reach within your social media contacts, email lists, and personal connections. Through step-by-step guidance, you'll learn how to conduct an in-depth audit to discover your true audience potential, validate your offerings, and build momentum without the need for a massive following.00:00 Introduction: The Power of a Small Network02:15 The Audience Myth: Debunking the Need for a Huge Following03:25 Untapped Potential: Discovering Your Hidden Audience05:19 Conducting Your Potential Audience Audit: Step-by-Step Guide09:18 Putting Your Audit into Action: Leveraging Your Network12:56 Key Takeaways: Maximizing Your Audience PotentialImplement the Blogging System that 40x My Online Business! Click here to get the training video

#139 Susan Baier runs the show at Audience Audit, Inc. – a marketing firm helping small to mid-size advertising agencies stand out.    Earlier this year Audience Audit and the Agency Management Institute conducted and presented findings from The Agency Edge research series. This is the 10th year they have been running this study.    This custom research is designed to help marketing agencies better understand their clients, their prospects, and even their employees.   In this podcast, we go deep into the research findings.    If you're in the ad game you need to have a listen.    Connect with Susan: Fun With Research, or on LinkedIn, or at Audience Audit.    Want to take a look at the years of research go here: https://agencymanagementinstitute.com/agency-tools/agency-edge-research-series/   Connect with Pat at: pmcgovern@ascedia.com  If you like this pod, please take a minute and leave a review.  Your reviews are the green energy that powers this supertanker!  Thanks, for doing it – you're the best!  

In this episode of Cocktails with Friends, host Bob Cutler sits down with Susan Baier, founder and CEO of Audience Audit, to discuss the art of thought leadership and how to share your expertise in a way that truly makes an impact. Susan shares insights from her research and experience, offering practical advice on how to authentically position yourself as a thought leader, no matter your industry. Whether you're a bartender, chef, or business owner, Susan's advice will help you turn your passion into influence. Main Topics: What it means to be a thought leader How to identify and connect with your audience The importance of authenticity and providing value upfront Key Insights: Thought leadership is about teaching – It's not just about being an expert; it's about sharing new, helpful insights that others can implement. Authenticity matters – People are drawn to leaders who are approachable, relatable, and genuine, rather than overly polished or self-promotional. Provide value before asking for anything – Being relentlessly helpful and sharing your knowledge freely builds trust and leads to long-term opportunities. About the Guest: Susan Baier is the founder and CEO of Audience Audit, a firm specializing in custom attitudinal segmentation research. She helps organizations better understand their audiences to improve engagement and grow their impact. Susan is a speaker and thought leader who brings a wealth of knowledge on how to teach, inspire, and connect with your target audience. Episode Index [00:00:00] – Introduction and catching up with Susan Baier [00:02:30] – What is thought leadership? Defining the term [00:03:50] – The importance of being authentic as a thought leader [00:05:00] – Key traits of effective thought leaders: new, helpful, and relatable [00:07:30] – The role of passion and personal point of view in building influence [00:10:00] – How to connect with a specific audience and focus your message [00:12:40] – Ways to get your message out: social media, speaking, and content creation [00:16:00] – Building your personal brand as a chef or bartender [00:19:00] – Turning rants and frustrations into thought leadership content [00:21:30] – Providing value before monetization: trust-building strategies [00:24:00] – The balance between polish and authenticity in content creation [00:27:00] – Takeaways: Be authentic, be helpful, and share your expertise

In this conversation, Susan Baier shares a formative moment in her adult life when she consulted with her father, who was a world renowned plastic surgeon, about liposuction. In this discussion he suggested she get other work done instead to improve her appearance. This experience emphasized her deep-seated insecurities about her appearance and her father's lack of belief in her being good enough. It fed into to a life-long struggle with self-worth and a realization that she needed to question the voices in her head that were not her own. Over time, she has learned to recognize and challenge those voices, and to value her own perspective and the opinions of those who truly know and support her. In this conversation, Susan Baier shares her journey of healing from childhood wounds and finding self-acceptance. She discusses the importance of setting boundaries, valuing oneself, and accepting others as they are. Susan emphasizes the power of having a witness and the impact of personal connections in overcoming differences. She also highlights the need to be mindful of the media and social media's influence on our thoughts and emotions. Overall, Susan's story reminds us of the importance of boundaries, empathy, and understanding in our healing journeys.Susan Baier is a marketing master, founder of Audience Audit, and sought after public speaker.Learn more about Susan on her websiteLearn more about HopeGuide and Ryan Pink Join us on YouTube to watch full episodes Help us amplify the message!Please subscribe on your favorite podcast app!Please Rate and Review the podcast on Apple and Spotify!

My guest on this episode of Sell With Authority has spent nearly 20 years working in strategic and leadership roles focused on growing national and local client brands with award-winning, ROI-generating digital strategies. Corey Morris, President and CEO of Voltage returns for an encore interview. Corey recently released his new book, The Digital Marketing Success Plan, and I'm thrilled to dive into the insights and strategies he shares. To set the stage for our conversation, here's an excerpt from Chapter 10 of Corey's book where he touches on a significant trend in the digital marketing landscape. Quoting Corey: “A trend I'm seeing personally and can validate through feedback I see with over two dozen other agency owners — that I believe will continue to grow–is brands having less patience with agencies. On the positive side — companies want to work with agencies that know what they're doing and are the best at doing it. That means constantly bringing new ideas and thinking deeply about their business overall. Unfortunately — many companies have been burned by bad agency relationships. Whether due to talking big and not delivering, trying to be full service and do everything at a level of deep expertise, or just not being a right fit for other reasons like niche, price, strategy, etc. — most companies have had a bad experience with agencies at some point. Combine that with shorter-than-ever tenures for CMOs and the fact that so many agencies sound the same and have similar messaging — agencies are getting fired at a record rate. That means that being an expert or specialist and owning a niche is important to gain trust early, drive results, and have a quality relationship among all of the people on both sides. Shortening patience isn't a one-way street. Agencies can be different and should be — and accountability will be a factor that wins out more and more in the coming years.” Corey's observations are compelling and timely — and they resonate deeply with the challenges and opportunities faced by agencies today. I want to reinforce the relevance of his insights with some data from the latest Agency Edge research study conducted by Agency Management Institute and Audience Audit. This study aimed to quantify what clients want from their agencies, allowing respondents to choose more than one factor. Hannah Roth, our resident mad scientist and strategist here at Predictive, delved into the Agency Edge research and shared her thoughts on the implications. She summarized: “Clients want the strategy, the path, and the overall goal in nearly equal parts. To pack a powerful punch, agencies that want to attract advocates and exacting experts should offer elements of all three.” I couldn't agree more with Hannah's analysis — and it's fascinating how the data aligns with Corey's insights. This synchronicity is exactly why I invited Corey back for an encore. We explore how his book can serve as a roadmap for your agency to create winning strategies, paths, and goals for your clients. A big dose of gratitude to our presenting sponsor for the podcast, Conduit Digital. By using their expertise in streamlining, upgrading & scaling your clients…they promise to reduce your risk so you can become the best digital agency in your market in 30-days. You can find Conduit and all their helpful insights and smarts here. What you will learn in this episode: The importance of having a documented, transparent plan that aligns all stakeholders Why chasing the shiny object of AI might be leading you astray from effective, proven strategies How focus on strategic planning can help you withstand sudden changes and distractions in the marketing landscape Real-life examples of clients who thought they were profitable but were actually losing money — and how you can avoid those pitfalls Tips for agencies to provide strategic guidance and not just project execution Resources: Website: https://voltage.digital Facebook Business: https://www.facebook.com/voltagekc LinkedIn Personal: https://www.linkedin.com/in/coreymorris/ LinkedIn Business: https://www.linkedin.com/company/voltagedigital/ Twitter Personal: https://twitter.com/coreydmorris Twitter Business: https://twitter.com/VoltageKC Instagram Business: https://www.instagram.com/voltagekc/ The Digital Marketing Success Plan: https://thedmsp.com Sell With Authority EP 103: How to Get to the Top of Google, with Corey Morris Additional Resources: Website: www.predictiveroi.com Visit our newly expanded Resource Library Join us in our free How to Fill Your Sales Pipeline Facebook Group

Every year, we go out into the field to understand the biggest pain points and priorities for both agencies and clients. This year, we took data from the 2024, 2019, and 2014 Agency Edge Research studies to compare how client expectations have changed over the years. This year, the burning issue was client-agency trust — what clients look for in an agency, how an agency can retain clients, and what causes a client to look elsewhere for another agency. To help make sense of all the changes, Susan Baier from Audience Audit joins us to discuss what agencies can do and are already doing to impress clients. We'll break down the three distinct client segments that emerged, their unique attitudes towards agencies, and what factors drive their decision to hire or fire an agency partner. We also discuss how to position your agency for better alignment with client priorities. If you're looking to learn how to better position yourself to win and retain more clients in 2024 and beyond, don't miss our deep dive into the data to gain a competitive edge in your agency. A big thank you to our podcast's presenting sponsor, White Label IQ. They're an amazing resource for agencies who want to outsource their design, dev, or PPC work at wholesale prices. Check out their special offer (10 free hours!) for podcast listeners here. What You Will Learn in This Episode: What clients think agencies do really well Changes in client-agency expectations over the years Agency advocates, begrudging buyers, and exacting experts How attitudes have changed toward having a trusted agency partner Why agencies are having more in-house staff than before What agency management fatigue has done to change client-agency relationships What does agency trust look like to clients? Do clients want an agency with a niche, or generalists? What makes an agency a poor fit for a client How client-agency trust can push a client to look for a new agency

How can you leverage thought leadership to gain new followers, win new clients, keep them longer and increase referrals for your agency?Susan Baier, Founder of Audience Audit, where they help agencies create thought leadership content based on quantitative research that builds trust with potential clients, has seen thought leadership done well (with great results) and has seen it done poorly (with wasted time and money).Based on her team's on research into the topic, in today's conversation you'll hear from Susan:The 3 specific elements you have to have to execute great thought leadershipWhat potential clients want (and don't want) to see from your content effortsHow to discover your agency's point-of-view (the foundation to your thought leadership efforts) through a process Susan calls “The Rant”Resources Mentioned in This Episode:An Agency's Guide to Measuring And Improving Billable Utilization (Ebook)Connect with Susan on LinkedIn Achieving Managed Growth for Your Agency w/ Joe Sullivan 3 Steps to Owning Your Niche in 90 Days w/ Nick BennettA Simple Formula for Setting Your Growth Goals w/ Drew McLellan (Webinar)The Client (a film by Umault)Want to watch the video version of the podcast on YouTube?Check it out here: Agency Life Podcast on YouTube Have a question about today's topic? Text it to us here!Want to get more content to support your agency life? Subscribe to the Agency Life newsletter, check out past episodes & find more content at teamwork.com/agencylife. This podcast is brought to you by Teamwork.com.

On our first episode, we cover some common terms from our de Novo glossary, talk about the power of leveraging a fractional marketing team, break down some ads from the big game, and provide a path to help you find your creative unicorn.    For more information about fractional marketing, check out our blog: Do you need another employee, or do you need a Unicorn?   The conversation doesn't end here! Find us on Facebook, Instagram and LinkedIn, sign up for our newsletter, or send us an email at: info@thinkdenovo.com with the subject "Dear de Novo."            References: Agency Management Institute. “Riding the Wave.” Audience Audit, audienceaudit.com/agency-edge-research-series/ Neumann, Jen. “Do You Need Another Employee, or Do You Need a Unicorn?” Blog.Think.Denovo, De Novo Marketing , 21 Nov. 2023, https://blog.thinkdenovo.com/fractional-marketing-solution     Super Bowl Ads: E.l.f. “In E.L.F We Trust: E.L.F Cosmetics Game Day Commercial 2024.” YouTube, 7 Feb. 2024, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kjVf8ptmDmk Temu. “Temu's Big Game Ad Encore TV Commercial 2024.” YouTube, 12 Feb. 2024, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Od0aOse1wc      

In this interview, you'll learn about why emphasizing the importance of understanding audience problems and being relentlessly helpful is so important to success. Susan Baier is a marketing expert that focuses on helping business owners with research. One of my favorite parts of this interview is why it's so important to be relentlessly helpful. Highlights from the Interview Thought leadership and building trust with audiences Susan explained how research shows audiences want thought leaders addressing new, helpful perspectives from those they trust, advising focusing on problems audiences face rather than self-promotion. Developing a clear niche and problem-solving focus Susan stressed starting with the problems a niche solves before defining characteristics, advising focusing communication on problems while expanding offerings to problems on clients' journeys.  Focusing on the problem that they are struggling with. They will listen to you because they want to learn more. Being relentlessly helpful through consistent generosity Susan defined being relentlessly helpful as constantly asking "how else can I help?" within business parameters, advising generosity builds trust and differentiation for leaders, employees, and clients. Establishing organizational vision, values, and goals Susan shared that regularly revisiting goals with teams keep leaders accountable to stakeholders, advising transparency of motivations builds employee commitment to shared missions over profits. She explains that this isn't easy to do, but very important to keep everyone inspired to do great work. Showing gratitude for those who help us grow Susan thanked past leader Jay Baer for energizing their work through humor and fearlessness, advising gratitude routines remind people of leaders' positive influences and build connections. Favorite Book Check out Die Empty: Unleash your best work everyday (Amazon link). You can learn more about Susan over at Audience Audit. You can also connect with her on LinkedIn. As always, if you have any questions or want to submit a guest for the podcast that you think would be amazing, just reach out to me on the Dig to Fly website, and I'll do my best to get them on. If you enjoy the interview, please take 30 seconds to rate the Dig to Fly podcast on your favorite platform. Thanks!

Over 500 agencies surveyed.  Agencies from around the world with different specialities: marketing, creative, web development & PR agnecies included.Agencies of all sizes, from those with less than 10 to those with more than 500 employees.The team here at Teamwork.com recently partnered with Audience Audit, a research agency who focuses on this sort of analysis for agencies themselves, to take on an extensive analysis of the state of agency operations.In The State of Agency Operations Report, you'll find insights into how you as an agency leader (and your company) benchmark against your peers in key areas:client churntime-tracking effectivenessbillable utilization ratesover-servicing clients, andyour approach to new AI toolsThis week, we brought 3 panelists onto the Agency Life monthly livestream to discuss some of the key findings in a roundtable discussion & this week you'll get a chance to listen in if you didn't get a chance to join the discussion live.Connect with each of the panelists here:Susan Baier, Founder of Audience AuditGray MacKenzie, Co-Founder of ZenPilotNicole Pereira, Founder of  CULTURISHDownload your copy of the report here:The State of Agency Operations ReportWant to get more content to support your agency life? Subscribe to the Agency Life newsletter, check out past episodes & find more content at teamwork.com/agencylife. This podcast is brought to you by Teamwork.com.

Welcome to Business of Craft, a show designed to help entrepreneurs with fabric or fiber businesses become more successful. Our guests share best practices and teach effective marketing skills, that help crafty business owners learn to grow and scale. Let's start crafting a better business together! Today we welcome you to our kickoff for season six of Business of Craft. Leanne and Anneliese present our findings from the 2023 Craft Retailer Research project. The 2023 Craft Retailer Survey organized by Audience Audit and Stitchcraft Marketing included 923 respondents from April to May 2023. Respondents included manufacturers, distributors and retailers of craft products. The research has a margin of error of +/- 3.2 percentage points at a 95% confidence level. Four distinct attitudinal segments emerged among respondents; these are groups of craft business owners who share a set of attitudes. The data that came out of this study is going to inform a lot of the shows we have planned for this season.

“What else can I do to help?” For Susan Baier, the founder and president of Audience Audit, this question changed the trajectory of her career when she received generous assistance as a recent college graduate. She now gives back through her work with Audience Audit, where she helps businesses grow their ROI through transformational thought leadership reputations and stronger marketing. In this episode, Susan joins me to share her story and insights about how leadership can shift their mindset and find ways to be “relentlessly helpful” in their organizations and lives. 2:08 – To be relentlessly helpful, ask other what else you can do to help them and think about what you can do to help the others around you or in your organization 3:44 – Shift your mindset to think about the ways you can have an impact on others 3:54 – We all know things that someone else doesn't know 8:15 – The people with the greatest experiences and the most unique perspectives are often not sharing their information 8:40 – Being generous reaps huge rewards and builds goodwill 10:37 – Being relentlessly helpful can also be a way to break out of your own routine and make yourself feel better about your own role 12:36 – Some days may have more opportunities to be helpful than others, but there are always small gestures you can make or questions you can ask to support others 14:34 – Both overconfidence and a lack of confidence can impact the ability to be relentlessly helpful 14:54 – Organizations, not just individuals, can embrace a culture of relentless helpfulness 18:39 – Learning on the job is a critical component of advancement 19:45 – To understand what is helpful for others, you need to listen and communicate 20:33 – As you shift your mindset, you'll grow your listening skills and find more way to be helpful 22:18 – We often dismiss our own knowledge and forget to think about how our knowledge can be important to someone else, even in a small way 23:34 – Just being open and available for conversation can help others Connect with Susan Baier Audience Audit website Contact Susan      

A marketing strategist for over 30 years, Susan Baier founded Audience Audit in 2009 to help organizations understand their best audiences based on attitudes and needs rather than just demographics or purchase behavior. She develops custom segmentation research for marketers and agencies around the world, supporting their efforts to create marketing initiatives that are more relevant, more efficient, and more impactful. On this episode of Destination on the Left, I talk with Susan Baier, my research partner in our latest research study on my favorite subject of collaboration. We share the insights uncovered about how to operationalize collaboration and why we were keen to understand all the ways that tourism, hospitality businesses, and DMOs are creating successful partnerships. What You Will Learn in this Episode: The three different types of collaborators that were identified in the study Why the study focused on understanding how organizations are operationalizing collaboration and integrating it into their daily and strategic business practices The importance of collaboration as a business strategy Key attitudes towards collaboration uncovered in the survey Factors that contribute to a collaborative mindset, such as communication, open-mindedness, and active listening How collaboration can support diversity, equity, and inclusion efforts in organizations Collaboration as a Strategy Destination marketers understand the importance of collaboration as a strategy to achieve their goals. In our recent survey on attitudes towards building collaboration into internal systems, three distinct segments emerged. The first group, prudent planners, believe in a formalized collaboration process that includes clearly defined goals, financial objectives, and communication channels. They emphasize the need for a contingency plan to address unforeseen circumstances and advocate for a designated person to manage collaborations. For prudent planners, collaboration is a process-oriented activity that requires a well-structured framework. The second group of destination marketers is called enterprisers, and they are characterized by their love for collaboration. They are open-minded about the collaboration process and believe in allowing adjustments to happen organically. Enterprisers view collaborations as a competitive advantage and do not limit themselves to collaborating within the travel and tourism industry only but also with organizations outside the industry. The third group, the selective spectators, are less proactive when it comes to collaborations. They only collaborate with organizations they have some connection with, and they take a reactive approach, waiting for others to offer collaboration opportunities. Selective spectators are less confident about their collaboration process and do not see the need for collaborators to share the same values. Understanding these distinct segments is crucial for destination marketers to tailor their collaboration strategies for the best results. Traits of a Collaborative Mindset The survey found that most respondents plan to increase the number of collaborations they're involved in. The study identified communication, open-mindedness, flexibility, active listening, and being a team player as factors that contribute to a collaborative mindset. Our study encourages destination marketers to think more intentionally about collaboration and identify the pieces of their process they follow when collaborating. Resources: Website: https://audienceaudit.com/ LinkedIn Personal: https://www.linkedin.com/in/susanbaieraz/ LinkedIn Business: https://www.linkedin.com/company/audience-audit-inc./ Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/AudienceAudit/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/susanbaier We value your thoughts and feedback and would love to hear from you. Leave us a review on your favorite streaming platform to let us know what you want to hear more of. Here is a quick tutorial on how to leave us a rating and review on iTunes!: https://breaktheicemedia.com/rating-review/

“80% of the women owners that we surveyed said it's extremely important to hire and develop other women in their industry,” shares host Kiley Peters, CEO and founder of RAYNE IX. With the help of friend Susan Baier and her team at Audience Audit, Kiley conducted original research on women small business owners and how they defined success for themselves.When surveying several hundred female small business owners, the data began to show three distinct segments. These segments are the believers, support seekers, and parody perceivers. Depending on which segment they fall into, some women business owners may not actually fall into the same target audience due to mindset differences. The data showed that age and income were not really a factor and that it truly all came down to mindset. The majority of women defined success as owning their own time or schedule and reported that it is very important to them to support other women in their industries. The data from this new research study is compelling and shows the differences in how women and men approach business ownership. Women start businesses because they want flexibility, autonomy, and ownership. It's not that they don't care about profit, but it typically is not their number one priority. Quotes“You really need to understand the mindset and the psychological composition of your audience, because it's those things that are really going to matter.” (9:15-9:23 | Kiley)“This is all about flexibility, autonomy, and ownership. That's why women are starting their own businesses.” (10:36-10:43 | Kiley)“70% of respondents believe that there are inherent differences between the way men and women run businesses.” (13:07-13:15 | Kiley)“Small business specifically needs to be personal.” (15:15-15:19 | Kiley)“The number one way that women defined success for themselves was owning their own time or schedule.” (17:58-18:03 | Kiley)“80% of the women owners that we surveyed said it's extremely important or very important to hire and develop other women in their industry.” (19:54-20:03 | Kiley)LinksConnect with Welcome to ElomaInstagram: @welcometoelomaWebsite: WelcometoEloma.comWeekly Email Newsletter: bit.ly/RIXEmail Connect with KileyWorkshops: https://rayneix.com/workshops/Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/rayneix/Social: @kileypeters + Linkedin.com/in/kileypetersWebsites: RAYNEIX.com , BrainchildStudios.com, KileyPeters.comWeekly Email Newsletter: bit.ly/RIXEmailEmail: info@rayneix.com

This week is a special episode of The Home Builder Digital Marketing Podcast where we share a recorded webinar Greg did with Susan Baier of Audience Audit. In this webinar, they discuss the proprietary attitudinal research study that Blue Tangerine conducted to understand better how home buyers interact with home builders online.  https://www.buildermarketingpodcast.com/episodes/153-online-buying-behavior-research-study-blue-tangerine

Riches in Niches and How to Attract High-Paying Clients I'm excited for you to meet our special encore guest expert today — Henry DeVries. If you're meeting Henry for the first time — he's the CEO of Indie Books International. He's the former president of an award-winning “Ad Age 500” marketing agency — and — Henry is also a weekly columnist for Forbes.com. Henry was my guest for Episode 15 of the podcast, where he shared his expertise around strategies and tactics for writing a book — and then — how to use the book as your primary marketing strategy — or, as Henry likes to say — “Marketing with a Book.” We'll be sure to add a link to Episode 15 to today's show notes.  Okay — I invited Henry to join me for this encore interview so we could focus our time and attention on Chapter 5 of Henry's latest book entitled, “Marketing with a Book for Agency Owners.” He titled Chapter 5 — “Riches in Niches.” If you've been listening to this podcast for a while now — or if you've read our books — or attended any of our open-mic Q&As or live workshops — you know that here at Predictive ROI…we're big fans of building a riches in niches strategy. I'm going to quickly quote Henry from Chapter 5… Henry writes, “To attract high-paying clients, agency owners must be clear on their ideal prospects. But a target market with a problem is not enough. Agency owners also must find target clients that can afford to pay what you want to charge.”  Okay — it's here at the intersection of these two points that Henry and I focused our riches in niches discussion. How to find right-fit prospects who are willing to pay what you want to charge — and I would argue that when you do this work correctly and your content strategy is on point and generous — your right-fit prospects will be EAGER to pay your premium price. To help us get there — I asked Henry to walk us through what he calls the “10 filter questions” that you and your team can use as you work through the process of niching down.  In my opinion — Henry's 10 filter questions are critically important to the process of seeking riches in niches because if we don't get it right at the beginning — HOLY BANANAS — it's most likely not going to feel right 2-3 years into your “niche” strategy.  I promise you — if you take and apply Henry's advice and build a strategy around riches in niches — and then — have the courage to build an authority position deep in the niche (instead of being sort of committed), you consistently create helpful cornerstone and cobblestone content that shares your smarts with your audience. If you do this work — you'll not only be seen as the AUTHORITY in the niche, but your sales pipeline will go from being dry to being filled with a steady stream of right-fit clients from within the niche who are eager to work with you — AND — willing to pay your premium price to do it.  That's the recipe for riches in niches.   What you'll learn from this episode about riches in niches: Why your riches in niches strategy needs to include stories that matter and where you ought to share them Why it's so important to share the right social proof with your prospective clients How to find prospects in niches who are willing to pay what you want to charge How to identify and then properly step into the right pond within the right niche How to work through the 10 filtering questions to do the right work up front to help ensure you tap into the riches in niches     Speaker 1: (00:03) Welcome to the Sell With Authority podcast. I'm Stephen Woessner, c e o of predictive roi. And my team and I, we created this podcast specifically for you. So, if you're an agency, agency owner, a business coach, or a strategic consultant, and you're looking to grow a thriving, profitable business that can weather the constant change that seems to be our world's reality, then you're in the right place. You want proven strategies for attracting a steady stream of well-prepared right fit prospects into your sales pipeline. Yep. We're gonna cover that. You wanna learn how to step away from the sea of competitors, so you actually stand out and own the ground you're standing on. Yep. We're gonna cover that too. You wanna futureproof your business so you can navigate the next challenges that come your way. Well, absolutely. We'll help you there as well. I promise you. Speaker 1: (01:02) Each episode of this podcast will contain valuable insights and tangible examples of best practices, never theory from thought leaders, experts, owners who have done exactly what you're working hard to do. So I want you to think practical and tactical. Never any fluff. Each of our guests have built a position of authority and then monetized that position by claiming their ground, by growing their audience, by nurturing leads, and yes, by converting sales. But all the while they did it by being helpful. So every time someone from their audience turned around there, they were with a helpful answer to an important question, so their prospects never felt like they were a prospect. I also promise you every strategy we discuss, every tool we recommend will be shared in full transparency in each episode. So you can plant your flag of authority, claim your ground, and fill your sales pipeline with a steady stream of right fit clients. Speaker 1: (02:09) So I am super excited for you to meet our very special encore guest expert today, Henry DeVries. If you're meeting Henry for the first time, he's the c e o of Indie Books International. He's the former president of an award-winning ad age 500 marketing agency, and Henry is a weekly columnist for forbes.com. Henry was also my guest for episode 15 of the podcast where Henry shared his expertise around strategies and tactics for writing a book, and then how to use the book as your primary marketing strategy, or as Henry likes to say, marketing with a book. So, we'll be sure to add a link to episode 15 to today's show notes to make it super easy to find. It's a great episode. Okay, so I invited Henry to join me for this encore so we could focus our time and attention on chapter five of Henry's latest book, which is entitled Marketing with a Book for Agency Owners. Speaker 1: (03:09) He titled Chapter Five, riches in the Niches. And if you've been listening to this podcast for a while now, or if you've read our books or attended any of our open mic q and as or live workshops, you know that here at Predictive roi, we are big fans of itching. So I'm gonna quickly quote Henry here, uh, from chapter five of the book, Henry writes, to attract high paying clients, agency owners must be clear on their ideal prospects, and then he goes on to write, but a target market where the problem is not enough agency owners also must find target clients that can afford to pay what you wanna charge. Okay? So it's at the intersection of these two points that Henry and I will focus our discussion today, how to find right fit prospects who are willing to pay what you want to charge. Speaker 1: (04:05) And I would argue that when you do this work correctly and your content strategy is on point and generous, your right fit prospects will be eager to pay your premium price. To help us get there, I'm going to ask Henry to walk us through what he calls the 10 filter questions that you and your team can use as you work through the process of nicheing down. Because in my opinion, Henry's 10 filter questions are critically important to the process of seeking riches in the niches. Because if we don't get it right at the beginning, well, holy bananas is most likely not gonna feel right two to three years down the road. I promise you, if you take an apply Henry's advice and seek the riches in the niches, and then have the courage to actually build an authority position deep in the niche and not be kind of committed to the niche, so you're consistently creating helpful cornerstone and cobblestone content that shares your smarts with your prospective clients, clients in the niche, you'll not only be seen as the authority in the niche, but you will fill your sales pipeline with a steady stream of right fit clients who are eager to work with you and who are willing to pay your premium price to do it. Speaker 1: (05:29) So without further ado, my friend, welcome back to the Sell With Authority Podcast. Henry, Speaker 2: (05:36) Thank you for inviting me to talk about riches niches. You're very welcome. April, 2022, the place, Oceanside, California. I'm celebrating the eighth anniversary of Indie books. Okay? We've published over 150 authors. Life is great. I'm not happy. Okay? I'm at a crossroads. Sounds like there's a story there. You're gonna start a hospital. There's a story there. I'm at Crossroads and I go, I teach this riches and niches and I've helped so many people, and I don't feel that we've really found ours, huh? Because I had focused on consultants and coaches, okay? And there was just something missing. And the, the ponds and the groups that I, the watering holes and Pamela Slim of the Whitest Nets language, you know, the, they just weren't feeling totally right for me. Okay? So I did a, I did an exercise. I, I went on a retreat, just me in a car to a motel to think of this through, okay? Speaker 2: (06:45) Made a list of all our authors and divided them into groups, okay? And there was this one group that I liked to work with the most agency owners, because I was an agency owner. And matter of fact, indie Books International is an agency. It's a marketing agency in disguise, as a publishing company, okay? And we, we help people get speaking, but part of it was this training aspect where we train you to give speeches, get on podcasts, do these things to amplify your work. That's my word for the years, Steven. Amplify. We need to amplify our work. That's a good word. Talk about that. So I went and, and the agency owners were, and I said, well, where could I go meet agency owners? So I researched, and there were 10 places where they gather that I found, and one was called the Baba, b a b summit, build a Better Agency Summit. Speaker 2: (07:44) Uhhuh. . And it was over $2,000 to attend a little problem. I didn't have an extra $2,000, but I do cover marketing for forbes.com. I've been a paid columnist for five years. So I contacted the Baba Summit people into my surprise, they said, yes, you can have a media credential come cover us, um, at the Western in Chicago. Mm-hmm. . So meanwhile, I start to call some of these agency owners that I'd helped do their books. And I said, you know, whatever happened as a result of the book. And Tom Young, uh, one of my authors said, oh, you helped us get to the million dollar level. And then we, we leveraged that book, and now we're at 2 million a year. Um, I talked to another person and she said, oh, I didn't have any Fortune 500 companies when we started. I've tripled my revenues, and now I'm working for the one of the top five banks in America, one of the top five financial houses in America, a a billion dollar Japanese technology company. Speaker 2: (08:51) As a result of this, I'm going like, well, those are some, I said, would you, would you put that in writing? Could I put that in writing? Well, of course. Would you tell other people? You know, could I put you on video? Oh, yeah. Send anybody my way. I'm going like, okay, check. We, we've got something going here. Right? Also, they were the, um, most willing to pay. Some of them told me, uh, you know, you, you're not charging enough. This is what the agents, this is what the agency owners were sharing. They were telling me that I wasn't charging them enough, right. Uh, for what they were getting from me. Okay? So I go to the, the Baba Summit. I did not know you were involved, Steven, I knew you from being in a, a couple of appearances on Onward Nation. Um, I, I think I had written about a couple of your clients and Forbes, so that was our relationship. Speaker 2: (09:39) But I see you were one of the sponsors there and involved, and that was great. Within an hour of being there. Everything I've been teaching for the last 15 years in writing about, but unwilling to do as a service, you were preaching at, at Baba, the p baba speakers were preaching, and they had people there to do it. You know, if you wanted podcasts, you could go to predictive roi. If you wanted a, um, a proprietary research study, you could go to audience audit. So it was like, these are my people. Mm-hmm. , uh, this is so great. And I had decided then, okay, I'm going all in. Now. Let me tell you, fear never sleeps. To go all in on a target niche is a scary proposition. Um, you're worried that by declaring I work for these people, your referral sources are gonna dry up Uhhuh, . Speaker 2: (10:35) I can assure you, they do not. Right? The the other thing that happens is you're, you're afraid that somebody will read your website and go, oh, well, that's not for me. I can assure you it's not. I have people call me up and say, look, I, I know I'm not an agency owner, but, uh, I run this consulting company and could I please convince you to work with me? Right. You know, go on . I'll say, you know, and, and, uh, some have and have done wonderful projects. Meanwhile, , so I, I commit to this. This is May and I, I think I've gotta write a book. I've gotta write a book about this, but I am very busy. When am I gonna have time to write another book? So, um, and we all have different faiths, and I respect that. And, um, in, in California, I have to say the universe or the universe will manifest when I'm, when I'm out in, uh, the Midwest with you, I can say God helps those who help themselves. Speaker 2: (11:35) So, but I, I prayed on it and I prayed for time to get this book done. Be careful what you pray for . I was give, in August, I was giving five workshops for CEOs on how to persuade with a story. Mm-hmm. , uh, that's what I'm paid to speak on. I've written books on that. And on, uh, day five, I contract covid. So I'm in Memphis, Tennessee, um, thousands of miles from home. Nobody there. I have to check into this, uh, cheap motel to quarantine for a week. Yep. And, uh, my healthcare got right on it got me into a doctor who prescribed the drug, PAX Lobin for me. Mm-hmm. . So I'm on a, a five day protocol of Pax Lobin. Well, it knocked it down right away. And I thought, well, I don't wanna watch TV and I'll just start writing the book. Five days later, the book was written, you know, thank you. Speaker 2: (12:38) I'm grateful for that time, . I wish it could have been like a little more enjoyable, but I got the book done and started rolling. I know I needed refinements. So, uh, signed up with predictive roi. We did the, the 90 day program, really refined it. Um, Eric, on your team, uh, I, I love Eric dearly because he challenged me on everything. Um, he gave me pushback on everything. It wasn't like, oh, great, this, like, no, this and that. What happens if this happens? And like, oh man, that would've been a huge mistake if I'd gone that way. So, very grateful to predictive roi. And then I saw, um, workshops by you and Drew McClellan of AMI in, in Florida. Um, didn't have the money for that. Went to the board and said, we need to personally borrow money, uh, so I can go to Disney World for a conference in December and January. Speaker 2: (13:34) Um, and then when I explained it, all my wife said, a hunch. Henry had a hunch. And we bet on the hunch. And the hunch worked. So, um, I've been picking up agency clients. You told me I needed to double my prices and hire better people. I went out and did that. Yep. Um, and then when people would call me, I would give that higher price, and they didn't blink. So it all came back to what we're gonna talk about today, these filter questions. Yep. Um, agency owners pass the filter questions test for me, and I hope the filter questions help the listeners today. Speaker 1: (14:15) Awesome. Well, so let's, I, I want to tease out just one piece outta outta what you just said about the, the workshop and not, and not, and not like promoting the workshop or advertising the workshop, but your recognition about how the Baba Summit and how the workshop and how you participate in our community, how you participate in the Agency Management Institute community and, and so forth. And how you've been very strategic in, uh, aligning partnerships and friendships and all of that, because those are efforts to get deeper into the niche. And, and I'm not saying that those are not great relationships and personal relationships and turning into friendships and that kind of stuff. I, I'm, I'm not saying that those are like surfacey, they're, and they're not genuine because I know that they absolutely are. What I am saying is that they are, excuse me, that they're also indicative of when you go deep into the niche, it's about really understanding the people in the niche, really understanding the pond, really understand who is in the pond, swimming around and all of that, and developing those relationships. That's part of getting deep into the niche. Would, would you agree? Speaker 2: (15:26) Oh, absolutely. And I have to do a shout out to Susan Byer, a member of the Community of Audience Audit. And I heard you and Susan speak at the Baba Summit, and I shook her hand and, uh, gave her my card and said, I'd like to interview her for forbes.com. And, uh, she's the world's busiest woman who's going at mock five with her hair on fire. So that wasn't happening, but I, I was on, uh, a call with you and there were other people, you, you had me, I think, on a q and a talk about the book mm-hmm. , and Yep. Susan was there, and she calls me up afterwards and said, we have to talk, says this. I was where you were at a few years ago. I know who you are. Uh, and I know where you're at, and I just get deep into this. Speaker 2: (16:13) Do this, this is what you need to do. Yep. And I said, thank you. I appreciate that. Uh, what is the best piece of advice you have for me right now? Okay. She said, go to the workshops in December and January, you know, beg, borrow Steele, do whatever you have to. She says, I went from having eight clients to 40 when I went into this niche, uh, really strong. And so go there. And she says, you're gonna learn things. Mm-hmm. from the content that Drew and Steven teach, you're gonna learn more about your target audience, because you're gonna listen to them. You're gonna hear them. You're gonna have a drink with them, uh, you know, breakfast with them, and you're gonna be this listening machine at one of the agencies where I cut my teeth. Um, I was the head of research too. I was the head of creative services and research. That's a, that's a schizophrenic kind of person. Speaker 1: (17:09) I'm like, that's a bit of a juxtaposition, but o okay. Speaker 2: (17:11) Yeah. Right. Sounds and research. So I, I know about depth interviews and research and, and, uh, you know, listening. And that was so true, because you're amongst them and you can relate to them, of course. And when they tell a story, you can go, oh, I understand that. Yeah. You know, um, I've been there, done that. Um, so that's important to, you've gotta go where your target rich audience is. Um, not so much that, oh, I'm gonna find clients. I did, I will, but I wanna understand their worries, frustrations, doubts. Mm-hmm. . Um, I need, you know, the fear, uncertainty and doubt, the FUD factor. You need to know their FUD factor. And that's the number one thing they want to know. Do you understand my pain? Speaker 1: (18:07) Yeah. The, not only do you speak my language, do you speak my dialect? And when, when, when we talk through the niche deep dive, you know, like in our q and a's and in the, the WHO framework and so forth, that, that part of that starts with the first two ingredients in that are what are the problems, hence the FUD factor that you just mentioned. Then what are the stories? How can you speak to those problems within a story? Because we're just d n a wired to receive stories, right? How can we talk about the FUD factor in the form of a story? And then to your earlier point, how can we step into the right ponds to tell the stories, right? Because then they feel appropriate and, and, and, and they land correctly. It feels weird to step into a non-agency owner pond, if you will, and start talking about agency owner stories. Speaker 1: (19:01) It, there, there's incongruency when that happens, right? So like, all of this is part of the, the great recipe. You've done a great job of stepping into the pond and finding the rich in the niche or the riches in the niches. And I know that they're, you're, you're actively mining that. Let's start going through the 10 filter questions, because I think they're, not only do I think that they're smart, um, but I, but I also think that they're smartness, if you will, , uh, in the layers, right? So some of the questions are multi-layered. Some of the questions are deeper than maybe what somebody might think as they're quickly going through them, and that, oh, I don't have to answer that one. I could just bypass that one. Or I'll just, I'll focus on, you know, question two, six and 10. And that should be good. Speaker 1: (19:46) And it's not good. The 10 filtering questions are 10 filtering questions on purpose. So, so let's, let's go through them first. I'm, I'm just gonna go through them, uh, quickly and then, and then we'll go back and slice 'em apart. So, question one, are you interested in solving the problems this group has? Question two, have you worked with any already? Three, can they afford to pay you four? Are they willing to pay more for better service? Five, do they already know they need an agency like you? Six? Are they numerous? Seven, do you, uh, do you have only a few real competitors? Eight. Can you find them easily enough through listen associations? Uh, nine, can you find a target rich environment where they gather? Uh, and then 10, will you or will some make marquee clients advocates and references? Okay. So let's slice all of these apart and go through them in depth. So walk us through, number one, are you interested in solving the problems this group has and why you put that first? Speaker 2: (20:53) Okay. So first let me grab my book, my 17th book. Amazing. And Stephen, my books are my children. Hmm. And like my children, I expect them to take care of me in my old age. Okay. So let's go to chapter five and that first one. Um, are you interested in solving the problems if solving their problems doesn't energize you? It's a non-starter. Um, when I was looking at the different groups, I've done a lot with technology services companies, okay. Speaker 2: (21:24) And I thought, huh, do I wanna spend all my time with technology services companies? Um, I had a chance once to buy the agency I'd started at and worked my way up to president. And, um, I didn't know this strategy, it was just instinctive and I followed it. And we were the leader in real estate, community marketing, you know, new home communities, master plan communities throughout Southern California. Okay. Um, we had all the top people, and and you eat on that whale for years, you catch a whale, like a master plan community that's a eight, seven, you know, seven, eight year project. You bet. Um, but I didn't buy, and one of the reasons was I didn't wanna spend the rest of my life talking about cathedral ceilings and low flow toilets. You know, it was just like, uh, it didn't excite me. Yeah. So, uh, I went out on my own and formed my own lemonade stand and went looking for the, for the right niche. So agency owners, I love the problems they have. Oh, by the way, research. Yep. Number one problem for two outta three agency owners is, and you know it, Steven, the dry sales pipeline, not enough qualified prospects in that pipeline. Yep. And business development is their heartburn, it's their pain. Second problem for, uh, 50% of agency owners, not enough time to do business development. Um, should we move to two? Have you worked with them already? Speaker 1: (23:03) 1, 1, 1 more piece to to number one. Speaker 2: (23:05) Okay. Speaker 1: (23:07) Because if we don't get right what you just said, you know, that, that we're interested in solving the problems that's gonna come through also in the content. When, when, when you know that Drew and I, uh, teach the point of view piece, right? So, predictive roi, we believe, like in our core, we believe, uh, that most agencies, business coaches and strategic consultants go about business development in the least effective, most painful way possible. There's a better way we call it. So with authority methodology, yeah. That is our belief system. It is our truth. So if you're just kind of like, eh, on point number one here, which is why it's an important filter that's gonna show through in your content, that's gonna show through how you show up in the pond, right? Speaker 2: (23:51) Right. We have an energy meter. Yeah. Everybody has it. And they can tell if you have energy around this topic or not. Are you just there? Oh. Because you're trying to serve that, you know, it's like if you're not genuinely energetic about it mm-hmm. , um, nor, uh, was famous author about, uh, you know, the power of enthusiasm. You know, so if you don't have enthusiasm, right? Um, it comes across and you can't fake it. Speaker 1: (24:26) No, Speaker 2: (24:26) You can't fake sincerity. Speaker 1: (24:28) No. Cuz cuz then you look like you're trying to get rich in the niche and Right. And then that, and that feels a whole lot of yucky to everyone in the pond. So, um, okay. So let's, and Speaker 2: (24:37) By the way you just said that Yeah. The riches are not just money. Yeah. Um, there are 12 different riches, uh, that you get from a, a money finishes 12th on the list. Um, when you're, one of the riches is you love to work. You love to work because you love solving their problems. Uh, you love these people. So that comes through Speaker 1: (25:03) 100%. Yeah. When, when, when somebody goes to the Baba Summit, the builder Better Agency Summit, this May, um, as the previous two summits, when, when Drew McClellan gets on stage to do his keynote, like he has the previous two, there will be there, there will be tears, there will be shouts of joy, there will be, it's an emotional delivery of a keynote. Why? Because everyone, all 300 and plus whatever number of people who are going to be there this year will know that he is there for them. And that he not only speaks their language, his stories align with that. His passions all about helping them. It, it is clear through his words and actions that he is their guy. And, and, and that rings through. If he was there to just be playing niches in the, or riches in the niches, it, it, it, it, I mean, it would fall flat, right? It would be easy to suss out and see the difference. Speaker 2: (26:03) They were yelling, we love you, drew. It was like a rock concert. I was thinking like, what's going on Speaker 1: (26:10) Here? Right? And that does not happen by accident, right? Speaker 2: (26:12) No. And it comes across and Drew is an agency owner. Yep. And Ami is this other thing he's doing to help other agency owners. Eric, from predictive ROI stepped on my toes and said, you don't talk in any of your materials, that you're actually an agency owner right now. And, and that you know this and you know, when you get up in the morning, you have to worry about your pipeline and, and you have to worry about the clients and the billing. And I says, you don't tell 'em that you're walking the same journey. So that's important. Speaker 1: (26:48) It is important. Okay. So now, now let's move to number two. Speaker 2: (26:52) Well, have you worked with them already? And, and I've coached a thousand people on this, and we'll come up to this and they say, well, I'd like to work with, you know, maybe hospitals, healthcare. I heard there's a lot of money there. Um, or I could work with financial advisors. I said, well, you know, how many hospitals have you worked with? None. How many financial advisors have you worked with? Dozens and dozens. I said, okay, here's our answer. . You know, it's like, uh, uh, yes, you could pick a niche you've never been in and worked to get in there, but you're swimming upstream. Uh, there's a German proverb I like to quote, and it i'll, it translates like this. It doesn't matter how fast you're going if you're on the wrong road. Speaker 1: (27:40) Amen. Speaker 2: (27:42) And in fact, it's actually worse because you're getting farther away from where you need to be. Um, so you need to get the right road. And the right road is people who you've already helped you have some credibility with. There needs to be a story there that you, as you said, the stories you tell. Yeah. They need to be your stories. Your stories matter. Human brains are hardwired for stories. So you need to be telling stories for that target group. Speaker 1: (28:10) Amazing. Okay. Perfect. Uh, how about three, can they afford you? Speaker 2: (28:15) Can you, they afford you? Um, I always say money isn't everything. The author Zig Ziegler said, money is not the most important thing, you know, oxygen, but it's next to oxygen. So we need money to keep going. It's the fuel that keeps the, the rocket ship going here. And, um, some people just don't have the money, right. For you to have abundance, the abundance you need for your team members, uh, for causes you wanna support. Mm-hmm. , um, all the things you need to do requires filthy luer. No. It requires money. Yeah. Speaker 1: (28:53) Well, and that ties into number four. Are they willing to pay more for better service, uh, so that you're not having a race to the bottom right. That you can actually afford to invest in delighting your clients? Am I on the same page with you? Speaker 2: (29:05) You, you're absolutely right. So they have to see the value in the investment. Okay. So when we were in the real estate niche, um, they saw the value and they'll pay more. There was a quick story. This, um, one, one client wanted to talk to us. And I have to say he was a little shady. You know, they were, they were big, burly people, uh, outside his office and, uh, you know, so let's just say shady. And so I made the mistake as, as agency president, I said, just double the amount that we normally charge, and that way he'll kick us out is too expensive, you know? And he said, but what happened was he said, okay, you charge twice as much as anybody else. Must Speaker 1: (29:53) Be good. Speaker 2: (29:53) Well, obviously you're good . So okay, you're hired . And then, then he gave us some secret information and said, if it ever gets out, you're gonna have to look over your shoulder all the time. Do you understand what I'm saying? And I said, I understand. I walked out and my, uh, my, my account executive young sweet woman said that threat, do you really think he could cause us to lose other clients? I said, Linda, he was threatening to kill us. He would've us murdered if this got out. She was like, . Like, thankfully the campaign went well, and, and, uh, we moved on. Yeah. Okay. Speaker 1: (30:38) . Well, so I, I, here, here's, here's one of the reasons why, uh, I feel like number five is multi-layered. Um, so do they already know they need an agency like you? When, when I read it now, it could be just my lens and my bias, um, that when I read it, I think, oh, okay. It's because, you know, we've planted a flag of authority. We've, you know, become the authority in this space, in the niche and, and all of that. And you say you must educate the prospects that need an agency like yours. Um, so, so tell us all about five, because when I read five, I'm like, that's pretty meaty. Number five, Speaker 2: (31:12) Five is meaty. So you're looking for clients who hire agencies. They've worked with an agency before. They know the value proposition of the agency. They're not that people go like, eh, I could hire somebody in-house, or I could hire an agency. Yeah. You don't want those people. Hmm. Um, because they're asking the wrong questions. You know, an agency buys time by the year, sells it back by the hour, and gives you top talent. Yep. You're competing for the bottom talent who's willing to work for you. It's like the old joke about you're an astronaut. Are you comforted by the fact that your rocket was built by the lowest bidder ? You know? And, and, uh, so so you don't want that. So you want something they, they hire agencies. Yeah. And, uh, I, I landed a million dollar account when I was president of someone else's agency. Speaker 2: (32:15) Okay. And I got it from teaching. And, and somebody took the course and brought me in and, and they talked about their business for 45 minutes. I understood nothing about their business or what they did. Hmm. And then they said, our current agency is Manning, salvage and Lee, but, um, we've had a little falling out, so we need a new agency. Well, that was the first thing I understood, because I knew that agency wouldn't touch an account for under a million dollars . I thought, oh, um, I said, give me a week and I'll come back with a proposal. So I educated myself on this, uh, industry. Nobody was a specialist in it, and, um, won the account. Mm-hmm. . Um, another time I was brought in by a, um, fortune 500 company, and they had this project, and it, it, you'd say, this wasn't in my niche, it was about energy and gas and electric and new things like this. Speaker 2: (33:16) And I talked to 'em and I said, you know, I really don't think we're the agency for you, uh, because I have no background in this area. And they called me a week later and said, you had the account. And I, I went in and I said, and it was a, it was a great account. I said, um, why, why did you hire me? But I don't know this area. He said, actually, nobody knows this area. We were looking for something else. We were looking for somebody who could come in and completely dissect a problem and then explain it to our people how to implement it. Hmm. And we talked around and people said, oh, these are the four magic words in English language, by the way. They said, I know a guy, Henry DRIs mm-hmm. . And that's how he got it. So sometimes you'll be brought in for a certain skill you have that people recognize for, and, and that can work for you too. I give you permission to work for anybody. I want to stress you should market to one target niche, niche in Canada, niche in America, as in, you know, there's riches and niches, witches. Uh, so, uh, we don't even know how to pronounce the word, but we know that it works Speaker 1: (34:38) Well, it is, it is kind of funny. Uh, you've mentioned Eric a couple of times and he, he too says, uh, pronounces it as niche. But when, when you said, I know a guy that, that, uh, reminded me of something that I thought about mentioning, but then just forgot in the fact of how that that is actually an ingredient of how Drew and I define niche. And so if, if anyone listening, um, has heard, uh, Eric and I teach niche before, um, you know, yes, it could certainly be industry that's one of the ingredients in the recipe. Two, it could be your superpower as you just described, skill, right? It could absolutely be a superpower. Uh, three, maybe it's a business issue or challenge, uh, that, that you solve better than anybody else. And you're, your certain skill example was kind of teetering into that. So you're putting a couple ingredients together, which is awesome in, in the fourth. It, it could be an audience, maybe, you know, an audience better, maybe you know, an audience better than the client or your perspective client. So like when we, we knit all of those ingredients together, it becomes a pretty, a pretty strong recipe. So let's move into number six, which is, are they numerous? Speaker 2: (35:47) Ah, and, um, I'm a big fan of David C. Baker. I've written about 'em for years. Mm-hmm. , uh, wrote the, uh, the business, let's see, the business of expertise. Mm-hmm. . And in the business of expertise, he says, you need to have 2000 to 10,000 prospects in the area to really consider it. Less than that, it's, uh, too small of a fishing pond. Too much you're trying to drain the ocean. Um, so you, you find that for me, there are 7,800 small to medium sized agencies in America. That's a pond I can fish in for the rest of my life. Yep. And, uh, still have prospects I couldn't get to. Um, so that's what you're, you're looking for. Okay. Some other people along the way, they, uh, one chose pest control companies. Hmm. Um, and they became the pest control agency for America. And when people say, oh, I need an expert in pest control and, and marketing and all this is, I know a guy this works for our female listeners, I asked some of them and they said, yeah, we, we get called guys too. So it's okay. So I know a guy, you know, if you need an, an, uh, a research study for a agency, I know a guy Susan Byer out of Arizona audience audit. So it works that same way. Speaker 1: (37:12) Okay. So, so let's, let's go to, uh, seven. Um, do you have only a few real competitors? Speaker 2: (37:21) Yeah. So it's, um, if somebody says, I have no competition, I'm really worried. Yeah. Now, now as far as I've researched and, and we keep mentioning Eric Jensen, you know, helped me with this. There are no agency book guys other than me. The per is like, they're like, their whole thing is doing agency books. Yeah. Now, there are other ghost writers, there are other publishers. Sure. Those are still viable choices. Somebody will look at them as they look at me. I might have an edge that I specialize in the niche, um, but that doesn't mean I don't have competition. Um, so, but I don't have tons of people who can do the soup to nuts for planning a book, preparing, you know, I'm a ghost writer. Uh, I'm an developmental editor publishing the book mm-hmm. . And then what happens, our motto at indie books is publishing the book is not the finish line. Speaker 2: (38:24) It's the starting line. Right. It's about the journey that happens after that. And it's a marathon. Uh, because no author gets discovered. I, that's a myth out there. I'm gonna write this book and people discover me. You don't get discovered. I, I love the actress Margot Robbie, if you, if you know her, um, I do. And, and she was being interviewed and somebody said, what would've happened if you moved from Australia to America and you weren't discovered? And she said, I'm sorry. Well, what's the question says, well, what would you have done if they didn't, if you weren't discovered? She says, you thought I was discovered. I knocked on every door in Hollywood, every agent, every producer. And I kept knocking until somebody let me in and finally give an addition. I was not discovered. So as an author, you're not gonna be discovered either. You need to slice and dice that content. You need to go on podcasts. You, I have a magnificent seven things you have to do. There's a great book, 1,001 Ways to Market your book. That's the problem. There's 1,001 Way Ways to Market your book. Uh, I'll give you the seven most pragmatic things to do that are gonna get results. Speaker 1: (39:37) So is, is that something that we can, uh, either link in the show notes or share with our audience, or maybe point them to a blog post? I, I know you teach on the seven, but is there, Speaker 2: (39:47) I didn't teach on the seven and I've had articles on it, uh, in Forbes. Uh, okay, great. And, and we could link to it. Okay. Speaker 1: (39:54) Perfect. Um, so I will link to one of your forbes.com articles on that for some additional insight. Thank you for that. Um, the, the discovery thing is, is is really great. Like people think that, um, who don't know the backstory of Sylvester Stallone, he did the same thing in New York and went to every agent, uh, and, you know, did it multiple times, uh, until finally he wrote the script. And it's a really interesting story, but it's all about perseverance. So eight, Speaker 2: (40:21) The Rocky story is interesting because he also didn't know what he was worth. And one of his first meetings when they asked him how much for the screenplay, and he gave a number, the meeting was over because they thought he was an amateur. Yeah. I'm sorry, we're going to eight. Right? Speaker 1: (40:36) . All right. Can, uh, and this really speaks to your, uh, builder, a better agency example that you mentioned from, from last year. Can you find them easily enough through lists and associations? Speaker 2: (40:46) Right? You're looking for places where they go to get smarter. So the Baba Summit, they go to get smarter. The David C. Baker has a mind your own business conference where they go to get smarter. Um, there's, uh, you know, the, what is it, tan, t a a and, uh, agencies get together and they go there to get smarter. So where are these places? Pamela Slim and the whitest that calls 'em the watering holes or the ponds? Yes. So can you find them? Sometimes people come to me, there's this group they want, they're describing this psychographic, and there's, I go like, yeah, we can't buy a list of those people. They don't have any meetings where this psychographic all gathers. Hmm. Uh, so, uh, this is, this is a dry hole, uh, as they say in, in the, all this down in Texas. You got a dry hole here. Um, and no amount of fracking is gonna help you get anything out of that hole. So, uh, gee, that was probably politically incorrect. . Um, so, uh, what we need to do is find where they gather, and there's this amazing tool I have, if I could share, can I share it, Steven? Of Speaker 1: (41:56) Course you can. Speaker 2: (41:57) It's called Google . You Google, where does, you know, agency owners gather? Where do agency owners meet? Where do agency owners, uh, you know, what do agency owners read? Yeah. And, and the Google machine as one old timer called it to me. So yeah, the Google machine will, will spit out your answers there. Speaker 1: (42:20) Yeah. Well, here, here's, here's what I love about eight and nine. Um, so, so nine is, can you find target rich environments where they gathered? And you mentioned Baba, you mentioned some of the other agency centric associations when, when I think of eight and nine, I see some real cool interdependency between eight and nine. Eight. Can we buy a list of the 7,800 that you mentioned before? Yes. Uh, can then we use that list to maybe do some strategic prospecting, if you will. I wonder if this person's gonna be at the Baba Summit this year. I wonder if that person's gonna be a sponsor to the Baba Summit. And then you can start sort of pre-planning so that you can take your list and then head to nine the pond, and then make sure you're meeting the right people while in the pond. Right. Speaker 2: (43:07) Right. And there are all kinds of strategies, and you've used them, um, that there might be some pre-event, you know, a cocktail party or, uh, I know we're kicking around some kind of donut party morning donut excursion, Speaker 1: (43:21) But no running If Car Cunningham, Carly Cunningham, if you're listening to this right now, donuts Yes. Long distance running through the streets of Chicago. No, no, Speaker 2: (43:30) No. Have you seen Henry and Stephen? Do we look like marathon runners, or do we look like donut eat? Speaker 1: (43:37) I have two tight hips for peace sake. I, I'm not running. Come on. Speaker 2: (43:42) . My doctor did say that I've already eaten my lifetime supply of donuts, and I should let other people have the donuts now. But, uh, for Carly, I might, I might consent to have one in Chicago. No, the point of that is you can get together, uh, I do Q and as, uh, modeled after your campfire q and as for authors and agency owners, and I encourage people to be part of the community, come there, ask questions, to get to know other members. I, I call the 150 authors, uh, the family. Yep. And my word is I want the family amplifying each other's work. It's, it's not a quit pro quo or anything like that, but it is the law of reciprocation that the more people you help, the more you will get helped to amplify your work and share it with others. And as we said, where these gatherings are, you can do extra things. David Maister, Dr. David Maister, I recommend him. Former professor at the Harvard Business School. Mm-hmm. . Uh, he let me take one page from one of his books 20 years ago and make a career out of it. A and he always said, this is what you need to do and you need to gather, and you just don't come in and out. Um, you need to be part of the community and contributing to that community anyway. You can. Speaker 1: (45:06) Right. 100%. I I know that we're, uh, quickly running out of time. So, so bring us home with number 10. Uh, will some make marquee clients advocates and references? Speaker 2: (45:17) Well, right. If, if you have some group where they say, what would be your client, but here's the condition, you can never mention that you worked with us. Uh, this is not a good place because prospects want social proof. They want several things. They want, they wanna know that you have a proprietary problem solving process, that you're not winging it. Uh, they want to know that you have experience. Uh, they wanna know some marquee clients. They wanna be able to talk to some people that you've worked with. Um, they need all these social proofs because they can't really judge how good of a service our agency provides. Um, and everybody says the same thing. Oh, I've done focus groups with people who hire agencies. Don't say these things. Don't say how long you've been in business. Uh, they laugh at you for that. I've been golfing longer than Tiger Woods. Speaker 2: (46:09) It doesn't make me a better golfer. Okay. The other thing is, don't say we're just the right size, big enough to get the job done small enough for personal attention. They, they laugh at us for that. They say firms with five people say that firms with 500 people say that. What they wanna hear is research about their peers. Not you naming peers. But, you know, we've worked with, you know, this many people or we've done a study and, uh, our research shows, like I shared that two outta three agency owners. And the number one pain is a dry sales pipeline. Not enough qualified prospects. Yep. I surveyed over a thousand people to learn that. So they wanna learn about themselves. They wanna know that you know about them. They want to be able to tell somebody, oh, well, we hired the agency that worked for A, B, and C, and they go, oh, they're good. Um, so that's why this is important. Speaker 1: (47:07) A hundred percent love that and great way to, to, to bring us home and, and emphasizes, uh, when, when we kicked off going through that list, or actually in the introduction, um, I, I've mentioned the, the, the, the piece that you use as your bottom line to close out this chapter. You, you, you say, so I'm gonna quote Henry again here, um, what he wrote, bottom line, the more quality thinking you do upfront meaning through these 10 questions, the easier business development will be 100%. Well, well said, Henry. So I, before we go, uh, before we close out and say goodbye, um, any final advice, anything you think we might have missed? And then please do tell, uh, our audience, uh, the best way to connect with you. Speaker 2: (47:52) Thank you for asking. Sure. If anybody ask you a good question like that, you're to pause three seconds for dignity and say, thank you for asking . The, the main message is stay on the journey. And then when you do a book, is the number one marketing tool. Talking about the book is the number one fill your pipeline strategy. Yeah. So you get on podcasts, you, you give speeches, you talk about the book, the book opens the doors to do that. And also, as you taught me in Sell with authority, you can't spell authority without the word author. An author is an authority and people get your best thinking in the book. So share that with them. So for anybody in the predictive ROI world, if they wanna have a no cost, no selling zone strategy call with me on this. I'm happy to do it. Speaker 2: (48:51) Yeah. So you can just contact me at henry indie books i ntl.com. Steven will put it in the show notes, and, uh, we'll have what I call a book chat. I'll help you get clear on the goals for doing a book, what hidden assets you have to get a book done. A lot of people don't realize they're already have these assets. Uh, three, what are the roadblocks, uh, roadblocks. Don't stop agency owners, but you gotta figure a way around them, over 'em, through 'em. And then, uh, four, I'll tell you how others have gotten from where you are right now to where you want to go, because the path and the plan of others leaves the clues you need for your journey and your quest to sell with authority. Speaker 1: (49:36) Yeah. A a good friend of mine and one of my accountability partners, Don Yeager, um, often says this, this quote is not his. I just can't remember the, uh, person who originally said it. But anyway, Don often says, success leaves clues. And, and I think that that's a hundred percent correct. And Henry, uh, thank you very much for saying yes to come back to the show for this encore. And everyone, uh, no matter how many notes you took or how often you go back and re-listen to Henry's words of wisdom, which I sure hope that you do, the key is you have to take what he's so generously shared with you, the 10 filtering questions and all of the story in stories in each of those. 10, take them and apply them. Because again, the bottom line, how much work you put into the front end of this is what will determine the success. Success leaves clues, and he just gave you a bunch of them. Take it and apply it. Because when you do that through application, that's where the results will come. And again, Henry, thank you for saying yes, we all have the same 86,400 seconds in a day. And I'm grateful that you came onto the show to be our mentor and guide, uh, yet again. Thank you so much my friend, Speaker 2: (50:46) As they say at Chick-fil-A. My pleasure.

A marketing strategist for over 30 years, Susan Baier founded Audience Audit in 2009 to help organizations understand their best audiences based on attitudes and needs rather than just demographics or purchase behavior. She develops custom segmentation research for marketers and agencies around the world, supporting their efforts to create marketing initiatives that are more relevant, more efficient, and more impactful. Susan and her Audience Audit team have been conducting “The Agency Edge”, an annual segmentation study of agency clients, alongside Drew McLellan, CEO of Agency Management Institute since 2014. Susan and team are also our research partners here at Predictive ROI when we step into the field to conduct our annual research. What you will learn about in this episode: How the attitudinal segments of Audience Audit's research are defined The 3 goals Susan and her team had in mind when they decided to conduct their latest research study What Susan and Audience Audit's research results show about how agencies are prioritizing their marketing efforts How an agency's reputation and thought leadership play a role in business development The importance of defining a clear niche What differentiates an agency from its competitors in the eyes of a right-fit client Resources: Website: https://audienceaudit.com/ LinkedIn Personal: https://www.linkedin.com/in/susanbaieraz/ LinkedIn Business: https://www.linkedin.com/company/audience-audit-inc./ Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/AudienceAudit/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/susanbaier Additional Resources: Visit our newly expanded “Resource Library“ Join us in our free “How to Fill Your Sales Pipeline” Facebook Group LinkedIn: www.linkedin.com/in/stephenwoessner/

This week on the Progressive Agency podcast, I welcome Susan Baier to the show. She's been a marketing strategist for thirty years and began her company, Audience Audit, in 2009. Susan helps marketing organizations understand their best audiences based on attitudes and needs, rather than just demographics or purchase behavior. Susan shares how research can build your credibility as a thought leader, and give you a year's worth of valuable content for your audience. Hear insights about: What is attitudinal research and how can you do it with qualitative research tactics How attitudinal research helps marketing agencies and their clients get better results What types of advice do consumers want from their thought leaders Why research helps thought leaders with both strategic and tactical advice How research adds credibility to thought leadership Relevant and Impactful Attitudinal research can make your marketing initiatives more relevant, efficient, and impactful. My guest this week on the Progressive Agency Podcast, Susan Baier, knows that firsthand. She has been a marketing strategist for 30 years and began her company, Audience Audit, in 2009. Today, Susan helps marketing organizations understand their best audiences based on attitudes and needs rather than just demographics or purchase behavior. She shares how research can make thought leaders more credible and offer more valuable content ideas for marketers and agencies. Proving Them Wrong Many people think that attitudinal research can only be conducted through quantitative measures, like surveys. However, Susan Baier proves them wrong with her company Audience Audit. She uses qualitative research tactics, like focus groups, to understand the reasoning behind a buyer's decision. During our conversation, Susan explains how marketing agencies can benefit from understanding the intent of their unique audiences. Aiding the Buyer's Decision In today's world, buyers conduct so much of their own research before making a purchase. Typically a buyer has already decided to work with you before you have the opportunity to sell to them. This means that your content and credibility as a thought leader are doing most of the work for you. Susan explains how conducting attitudinal research helps you create relevant content for your audience while increasing your credibility in your industry. Listen to the episode to learn more: How to Connect with Susan Baier: Websites: https://audienceaudit.com Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/AudienceAudit/ LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/susanbaieraz/ Twitter: https://www.twitter.com/susanbaier About Susan Baier: A marketing strategist for over 30 years, Susan Baier founded Audience Audit in 2009 to help organizations understand their best audiences based on attitudes and needs rather than just demographics or purchase behavior. She develops custom segmentation research for marketers and agencies around the world, supporting their efforts to create marketing initiatives that are more relevant, more efficient, and more impactful.

A marketing strategist for over 30 years, Susan Baier founded Audience Audit in 2009 to help organizations understand their best audiences based on attitudes and needs rather than just demographics or purchase behavior. She develops custom segmentation research for marketers and agencies around the world, supporting their efforts to create marketing initiatives that are more relevant, more efficient, and more impactful. What you will learn about in this episode: How Susan helps agencies and organizations use research to position themselves as thought leaders for their audiences What genuine thought leadership looks like — and how research builds a solid platform for it Why getting results that surprise you or contradict what you previously thought is a GOOD thing, and why it's important to be vulnerable with your followers How thought leaders can be “relentlessly helpful” for their audiences, and what that means for your business Why Susan always says that your research is “like a cupcake, but YOU are the icing” How you can infuse your unique perspectives, insights, and expertise into your research — and why it's so important to do so Ways to turn your research into a helpful, engaging, and sustainable source for content Resources: Website: https://audienceaudit.com Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/AudienceAudit/ LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/susanbaieraz/ Twitter: @susanbaier

How can research help generate more revenue for your agency? In this episode of the Innovative Agency podcast, guest Susan Baier discusses three unique ways to utilize research to increase your ROI. Susan is a Marketing Strategist & Researcher at Audience Audit. During our conversation, she shares her thoughts on the benefits of conducting research for your agency - not just your clients. What you will learn in this episode: How agencies can leverage research for revenue generation What are the benefits of conducting research for agencies rather than clients How thought leadership impacts the return on investment (ROI) for agencies What three things thought leaders need to do, and how does research aid these efforts Why research reduces the amount of outbound selling needed How to utilize research to identify your niche and attract ideal clients How to monetize your agency research, and create additional revenue opportunities Why agencies should collaborate with other agencies with the same audience Bio Susan Baier is an Audience and Marketing Strategist and Researcher of Audience Audit (www.audienceaudit.com). Susan is sought after by marketing agencies and their clients for her attitudinal segmentation research supporting thought leadership and marketing. Resources: Website: audienceaudit.com YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCWGXg7e0se0MO4L8bKhCfiw Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/AudienceAudit LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/audience-audit-inc

Guests:Susan Baier is the CEO of Audience Audit and has been a marketing strategist and researcher for more than 30 years. She crafts custom attitudinal segmentation research for agencies and marketers for B2C, B2B, and higher-ed organizations including Gap, AT&T, Jayco, Tufts University, and more.Drew McLellan is the CEO of Agency Management Institute and has been in the advertising industry for more than 30 years. He advises hundreds of small- to mid-sized agencies on how to grow and become more profitable.Topic: Drew and Susan discuss their findings from the eighth annual Agency Edge Research Series, using input from approximately 1,200 clients in the U.S. spanning multiple industries. This study explores how clients feel about their organization's ability to endure the recession, the actions they've already taken, and how likely they are to make changes that could either positively or negatively affect their agencies.Five things you'll learn from this episode:The three segments of agency clients: the committed (25%), the concerned (42%), and the close (33%)How to determine which segment a client falls in to best serve them as an agencyThe challenges and opportunities created by clients with a strong preference for in-person agency relationshipsWhy brands are choosing to work with more than one agencyHow the Great Resignation affected agencies and brandsQuotables“We've seen a consistent trend where folks are working with more than one agency. Drew talks about this a lot where it's really not sort of a one-agency world anymore, and agencies need to work with each other on behalf of a client that they're collaborating with.” — @SusanBaier“When an agency says, "We're a full-service integrated agency," clients scratch their heads and say, "How could you possibly be good at everything?" And so, I think the agencies that have specialized, like you have, Jason, give themselves and their clients both an advantage and a relief that you're not trying to be everything to everybody.” — @DrewMcLellan“It's very difficult to see clearly the label on the outside of a bottle when you're inside the bottle. And so, part of what an agency always brings to their clients is an informed outside perspective.” — @DrewMcLellanGuests' contact info and resources:Susan's Twitter Susan's LinkedInDrew's TwitterDrew's LinkedInAudience AuditAgency Management InstituteAdditional Resources: Agency Edge Research Series Episode recorded: Dec. 1, 2021Sponsored by:On Top of PR is produced by Axia Public Relations, named by Forbes as one of America's Best PR Agencies for 2021. Axia is an expert PR firm for national brands.On Top of PR is sponsored by ReviewMaxer, the platform for monitoring, improving, and promoting online customer reviews.About Your Host:Jason Mudd is a trusted adviser and dynamic strategist for some of America's most admired brands and fastest-growing companies.  He founded Axia Public Relations in July 2002. Forbes named Axia as one of America's Best PR Agencies for 2021.Support the show (https://www.buymeacoffee.com/OnTopofPR)

Understanding how clients view the agency relationship is key to making the most of that partnership. Every year since 2014, AMI and Audience Audit have brought you The Agency Edge Research Series to hopefully give helpful insights into what clients and prospects are looking for when working with agencies. The 2020 research correctly indicated that 2021 was going to be very robust for agency business. This year's study was built to better understand the thinking behind this growth on the client side, in particular how this explosion in engagement affected how they thought about their agency relationships. The Agency Edge Research Series is a collaboration between AMI, Audience Audit, and Dynata. Where other studies focus on industries or the size of client companies, we were interested in how these clients were feeling about a handful of topics. Audience Audit's Susan Baier is here to give an overview of the 2021 findings. In this episode of Build a Better Agency, Susan and I explain the methodologies used in creating the Agency Edge Research Series. We give an overview of the three client segments that revealed themselves, explain how an agency can diagnose clients and prospects in order to best serve what they are looking for. In the show notes below you will find a link to the 17-page executive summary and we hope this information will help you make the most of your client relationships. A big thank you to our podcast's presenting sponsor, White Label IQ. They're an amazing resource for agencies who want to outsource their design, dev, or PPC work at wholesale prices. Check out their special offer (10 free hours!) for podcast listeners here. What You Will Learn in This Episode: The methodologies used in the Agency Edge Research Series The insight that revealed itself for the first time this year The focus of this year's study How the three segments of this study are defined: Committed, Concerned, and Close How agencies can diagnose clients and prospects to know what segment they are in Ways to work best with each segment How agencies can manipulate the data for their own needs

A marketing strategist for over 30 years, Susan Baier founded Audience Audit in 2009 to help organizations understand their best audiences based on attitudes and needs rather than just demographics or purchase behavior. She develops custom segmentation research for marketers and agencies around the world, supporting their efforts to create marketing initiatives that are more relevant, more efficient, and more impactful. What you will learn in this episode: Why it's respectful to “leave some people out” when identifying your ideal customer How having a clear niche impacts the success of your business How Susan was able to discover her ideal target audience The difference between an agency and an organization  What three things you should focus on when determining your target audience Why demographics often don't matter when identifying your ideal customer How to use your content to communicate your niche and attract better referrals  Resources: Website: https://audienceaudit.com (https://audienceaudit.com) LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/susanbaieraz/ (https://www.linkedin.com/in/susanbaieraz/) https://www.linkedin.com/company/audience-audit-inc./ (https://www.linkedin.com/company/audience-audit-inc./) Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/AudienceAudit/ (https://www.facebook.com/AudienceAudit/) Twitter: @susanbaier  https://twitter.com/susanbaier (https://twitter.com/susanbaier) This podcast uses the following third-party services for analysis: Podcorn - https://podcorn.com/privacy Podtrac - https://analytics.podtrac.com/privacy-policy-gdrp

Age range, gender, income - these are the demographics marketers have built their business on for years. However, those traditional categories ignore the most important part of the buying process: the complexity of human behavior and decision making. In this episode of OUTdrive, Cliff visits with Susan Baier for an in-depth look into using quantitative attitudinal audience segmentation research to serve clients. Susan is the head honcho at Audience Audit, a research company that specializes in thought leadership, audience segmentation and brand equity. She developed her expertise in audience-based marketing research over more than 30 years in marketing strategy, product and brand management, research, and strategic planning. Susan has an MBA in Entrepreneurship and Marketing and has held senior positions at Fortune 100 and Fortune 500 firms, as well as marketing agencies. Tune in to this week's episode of OUTdrive to understand integrated marketing from Susan's perspective. We dive into research based on human complexity, a layer of consumers that your traditional demographics are missing. You don't want to miss it! What you'll learn:  What is quantitative attitudinal audience segmentation research and what can it do for your business Why traditional demographics of age, gender, and income are no longer working Susan's advice on developing a thought leadership plan Utilizing the personas that audience segmentation research can outline for you Pinning down the “why” before starting new research What qualities make a good researcher and how to wield bias as a tool Susan's advice for young professionals and entrepreneurs taking those first steps  Industry insight on the “rural migration,” and how marketing has evolved in the wake of the pandemic

In this episode, Chris Tieri explains how to use your strengths to develop your personal brand. As a Gallup Certified Strengths Coach, Chris talks about how she discovered her passion for coaching, how to use your strengths finder results and how to build your personal brand around your strengths. Listen for Chris's definition of a brand and what research can do to help. 3:06 – Chris explains how she started out wanting to be an interior designer but found herself having more of a passion for advertising. 5:58 – Chris describes why and how she transitioned from being an agency owner to strengths coach.   7:52 – Nancy and Chris talk about their strengths. 10:15 – Chris talks about her passion project – Laughter, Leadership, Mothership, Wine. 13:32 – Chris shares how she uses strengths finder for her clients. 18:03 – Chris talks about what she has learned about effective leadership from COVID-19. 24:17 – Chris defines a brand. 30:34 – Chris explains how to strengthen your personal brand. 38:03 – Chris describes how research can help with branding. 37:40 – Chris shares some resources she enjoys.   Quote options “The brand is really the image someone holds in their eyes, so it is the feeling they get.” – Christine Tieri, Gallup Certified Strengths Coach at Chris Tieri Corporation   Links: Sugarloaf: https://www.sugarloaf.com/ Audience Audit: https://audienceaudit.com/ How great leaders inspire action TED Talk: https://www.ted.com/talks/simon_sinek_how_great_leaders_inspire_action?language=en Seth Godin Purple Cow: https://www.amazon.com/Purple-Cow-New-Transform-Remarkable/dp/1591843170 Linchpin: https://www.amazon.com/Linchpin-Are-Indispensable-Seth-Godin/dp/1591844096 Tribes: https://www.amazon.com/Tribes-We-Need-You-Lead/dp/1491514736 Daily Blog: https://seths.blog/   Listen to Chip Carey's episode.   Activate the PR Maven® Flash Briefing on your Alexa Device.  Join the PR Maven® Facebook group page.    About the guest:     Christine Tieri is a business and leadership brand strategist, national speaker and Gallup-Certified Strengths Coach. Focusing on her own strengths of vision, ideation, and strategy, Chris works with her clients to discover their unique strengths, make a meaningful impact on those they lead, and set up strategies to accomplish their wildest goals for success. A former ad agency owner for nearly 25 years, Chris knows a thing or two about brand building, strategic messaging, and three-martini lunches.   Looking to connect:           Email: chris@christieri.com LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/christieri/ Twitter: @christieri

A marketing strategist for over 30 years, Susan Baier founded Audience Audit in 2009 to help organizations understand their best audiences based on attitudes and needs rather than just demographics or purchase behavior. She develops custom segmentation research for marketers and agencies around the world, supporting their efforts to create marketing initiatives that are more relevant, more efficient, and more impactful. Destination on the Left is joined again by Susan Baier to discuss the impact collaboration has on the travel and tourism industry. Susan is the founder of Audience Audit, a research firm that studies the attitudes behind consumer behaviors and beliefs. Susan teamed up with our host Nicole Mahoney to conduct a study about the far-reaching effects of coopetition, where perceived competitors accomplish something bigger than themselves by coming together. What You Will Learn: An overview of the findings from Susan and Nicole’s research study on collaboration The impact collaboration has on the travel and tourism industry How perceived competitors can use coopetition to accomplish something bigger than themselves by coming together How attitudinal research works, and why it is more effective in our industry The industry-wide sentiment toward collaboration in travel and tourism The three different types of collaborators and how each one affects the group dynamic Where tourism professionals are seeking resources on collaboration Collaboration in the Pandemic Susan Baier is back for another episode of Destination on the Left to discuss the impact collaboration has on the travel and tourism industry. She is the founder of Audience Audit, a research firm that studies the attitudes behind consumer behaviors and beliefs. Susan teamed up with host Nicole Mahoney to conduct a study about the far-reaching effects of coopetition, where perceived competitors accomplish something bigger than themselves by coming together. As we transition into a new year during these difficult times, it is important to understand how our organizations can use collaboration to navigate new challenges and measure our success. Data That Aligns With Your Goals There is an overwhelming amount of data available to destination marketers, but it is often the case that only a small portion of it aligns with our goals. So much data is virtually useless to us and as a result, we approach marketing strategy with expensive blind spots. While two individuals in a marketing segment may appear similar on the surface, they likely have two completely different sets of needs and problems that cannot be addressed with one blanket communication tactic. Attitudinal research offers a solution for destination marketers by providing them with targeted research based on needs and attitudes instead of demographics and purchase behaviors. There is a Demand for Collaboration The goal of Nicole and Susan’s study was to understand the industry-wide sentiment toward collaboration in travel and tourism. There were approximately 161 completed responses in the initial survey, providing enough data for the results to be statistically significant while offering a wide spectrum of attitudinal differences to compare with the results. The interesting thing about research is that it doesn’t always prove that you don’t know what you’re talking about—sometimes it has the opposite effect. This study reinforced the willingness to collaborate in all segments of the travel and tourism industry, with 76% of respondents having collaborated with direct competitors. What does this mean for you? It means there are an abundance of new opportunities to overcome challenges of the pandemic if you are willing to seek them out. This is huge for travel professionals from all walks of life. Website: https://audienceaudit.com/ LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/susanbaieraz/ https://www.linkedin.com/company/audience-audit-inc./ Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/AudienceAudit/ Twitter: @susanbaier We value your thoughts and feedback and would love to hear from you. Leave us a review on your favorite streaming platform to let us know what you want to hear more of. Here is a quick tutorial on how to leave us a rating and review on iTunes!: https://breaktheicemedia.com/rating-review/  

In this episode, Susan Baier, founder and CEO of AudienceAudit shares her thoughts on what is thought leadership and how to become a thought leader with original content. Audience Audit is a market research firm that develops custom attitudinal segmentation research for smart marketing agencies and their clients in a wide range of industries. Insights she shares include: What Is thought leadership?Are business leaders actively looking for thought leadership contentDoes thought leadership need a unique point of view before publishingWhen should you consider a thought leadership approach?What businesses could benefit from thought leadership content marketingWhere should thought leadership come from within a businessWhat are the benefits of thought leadershipThe problem with most B2B thought leadership strategies and why they failHow to create thought leadership contentWhy original research provides a competitive advantageWhy attitudinal research provides far more valuable insightsBest ways to conduct and use attitudinal research with examplesHow to get thought leadership content out of subject matter expertsHow to best leverage the power of your thought leadershipHow to ensure your original research-backed thought leadership content will drive business objectives

Our episode guest is Susan Baier, president of Audience Audit. Susan has been a marketing strategist and researcher for more than 30 years and specializes in analyzing audiences.Five things you’ll learn from this episode:What are the three types of PR agency clients?Why doesn’t hiring an agency based on size or spend guarantee it will meet your needs as a client?When is the best time to initiate the conversation about campaign research?How can research save you money? Why do assumptions not make you dumb?Quotables“Agency clients are really different, and it doesn’t have anything to do with how big they are or how much money they have.” — @susanbaier“I think it’s a fallacy to assume that a big client means more money.” — @susanbaier“Everybody thinks they need to have a PhD in statistics to talk about research, and that’s certainly not true, but you do have to have some comfort around it.” — @susanbaierIf you enjoyed the episode, would you please leave us a review?About Susan BaierA marketing strategist and researcher for more than 30 years, Susan is an audience specialist. She crafts custom attitudinal segmentation research for agencies and marketers for B2C, B2B, and higher ed organizations including Gap, AT&T, Jayco, Tufts University, and more. Contact info and resources:Website: audienceaudit.comLinkedInFacebookTwitter: @susanbaierAgency Edge Research 2020 Additional Resources:ReviewMaxer: http://reviewmaxer.comAxia Public Relations: https://www.axiapr.com/ Presented by: ReviewMaxer, the platform for monitoring, improving, and promoting online customer reviews.About your host Jason MuddOn Top of PR host, Jason Mudd, is the CEO and managing partner of Axia Public Relations. He is a trusted adviser and dynamic strategist for some of America’s most admired brands. Since 1994, he's worked with American Airlines, Budweiser, Dave & Buster’s, H&R Block, Hilton, HP, Miller Lite, New York Life, Pizza Hut, Southern Comfort, and Verizon. He founded Axia in 2002.ReviewMaxer On Top of PR brought to you by ReviewMaxerSupport the show (https://www.buymeacoffee.com/OnTopofPR)

Learn the three ways brands are responding to the current economic climate and why you shouldn’t ditch your marketing efforts during a recession with Susan Baier, president of Audience Audit and Drew McLellan, CEO of Agency Management Institute.Five things you’ll learn from this episode:What three ways brands are responding to the economic climateWhy brands who are actively building attention and being aggressive in their marketing efforts will win out over their competition when the recession is overHow to work with an outside agency during this time of uncertaintyWhy agencies are the best resource to aid their clients during an economic downturnWhy you should never stop telling the story of your brand Quotables“You can't stop running your business and making good decisions just because the economy is not as robust as it was.” — @DrewMcLellan“There's always opportunity if you are wired to look for and take advantage of that opportunity.” — @DrewMcLellan“When a brand goes dark during an economic downturn, they lose market share, they never get back. And a brand who accelerates and amplifies their voice during a downturn gains market share that they never lose.” — @DrewMcLellan“Companies of all sizes want their agencies helping them strategically and they're really looking to them for advice.” — @susanbaier“Agencies have a bird's eye view on what's working not just for you, but for their other clients.” — @DrewMcLellan“I think it's important to remember that agencies and clients are a symbiotic relationship. They work well together, they survive together.” — @susanbaierAbout Susan BaierA marketing strategist and researcher for more than 30 years, Susan is an audience specialist. She crafts custom attitudinal segmentation research for agencies and marketers for B2C, B2B, and higher ed organizations including Gap, AT&T, Jayco, Tufts University, and more. About Drew McLellanFor almost 30+ years, Drew McLellan has been in the advertising industry. He started his career at Y&R, worked in boutique-sized agencies, and then started his own agency in 1995, which he still owns and runs. Additionally, McLellan owns and leads Agency Management Institute, which advises hundreds of small to mid-sized agencies on how to grow their agencies profitability through agency owner peer groups, consulting, coaching, workshops, and more.Contact info and resources:Agency Edge Research 2020Twitter:Susan Drew LinkedIn: SusanDrewWebsite: Audience AuditAgency Management InstituteAbout your host Jason MuddOn Top of PR host, Jason Mudd, is the CEO and managing partner of Axia Public Relations. He is a trusted adviser and dynamic strategist for some of America’s most admired brands. Since 1994, he's worked with American Airlines, Budweiser, Dave & Buster’s, H&R Block, Hilton, HP, Miller Lite, New York Life, PizzaReviewMaxer On Top of PR brought to you by ReviewMaxerSupport the show (https://www.buymeacoffee.com/OnTopofPR)

How are clients thinking about and reacting to both COVID and the recession it triggered is on every agency owner’s mind. Will our clients go dormant? How are they approaching 2021 budgets and plans? Because we know this is vital intelligence for you, we decided to make that the focus of the 2020 Agency Edge research project. You’re going to find the data insightful and a relief. The Agency Edge research series is a collaboration between AMI, Audience Audit, and Dynata. Audience Audit’s Susan Baier joins me to walk you through the highlights of the research findings and what you should do next, based on what we learned. We believe the insights will help you strengthen your relationship with your current clients, dodge some potential landmines, and navigate your biz dev prospecting with more success. After you listen to the podcast, be sure to grab the 30-page executive summary from the show notes. A big thank you to our podcast’s presenting sponsor, White Label IQ. They’re an amazing resource for agencies who want to outsource their design, dev or PPC work at wholesale prices. Check out their special offer (10 free hours!) for podcast listeners here. What You Will Learn in This Episode: Findings from the 2020 Agency Edge Research Study How agency owners are feeling as they deal with the impact of COVID and the recession The 3 distinct segments that capture agency owner sentiment in 2020 How the agency relationships of respondents have been impacted by COVID and the recession What clients want out of their agencies during COVID and the recession Why the data from the latest research study paints a more optimistic picture than we’d feared New opportunities for gaining market share in 2020

A marketing strategist for over 30 years, Susan Baier founded Audience Audit in 2009 to help organizations understand their best audiences based on attitudes and needs rather than just demographics or purchase behavior. She develops custom segmentation research for marketers and agencies around the world, supporting their efforts to create marketing initiatives that are more relevant, more efficient, and more impactful. What you’ll learn about in this episode: How Susan and her team conduct studies and use the organic data they have collected to identify common, shared attitudes between respondents and identify patterns Susan breaks down the four categories of thought leader audience and shares how they came to these identification labels How the information discovered through the study can be used to better identify, reach, and be helpful and relevant to your audience How the results indicated that 62% of people surveyed would be more likely to recommend a business service provider if that provider is also a thought leader What key lessons the results from the survey offer about the importance of thought leadership, marketing, and their impact Why trust is a vital key for connecting with your audience and all four categories of thought leader audiences Why saying that you are a thought leader doesn’t mean you actually are, regardless of your audience or your content, and why trust is the determining factor Why it is important to remember that you can’t be an expert at everything and that you need to focus on your niche Why navigating times of crisis successfully requires a “relentless focus” on your target audience and being helpful How tailoring your message to each of the four distinct groups can help you engage your audience better and can help your message resonate Resources: Edelman Trust Barometer Special Report: Trust and the Coronavirus: https://bit.ly/2OJNapv Website: https://audienceaudit.com/ LinkedIn: www.linkedin.com/in/susanbaieraz/ Additional Resources: Sell With Authority by Drew McLellan and Stephen Woessner: https://amzn.to/39y7x13 Predictive ROI Free Resource Library: https://predictiveroi.com/resources/ Stephen Woessner’s LinkedIn: www.linkedin.com/in/stephenwoessner/

Good Morning Onward Nation — I’m Stephen Woessner, CEO of Predictive ROI and your host. Thanks very much for taking the time — please know — it’s always an honor to have you here. Today’s episode is going to be a solocast — where it will be just you and me exploring a topic with some real depth. And this episode is Part 2 of the solocast from several weeks ago that I entitled, “How to Market Your Way through the Crisis.” If you missed that episode — click here to listen to Part I. I will start off with a quick refresher of the highlights from Part 1 and then we will take a deep dive into what I wanted to share with you today so that you can continue marketing your way through the crisis — and — to put yourself in the very best position possible to come roaring out the other side. In Part 1 — I shared a number of 3rd-party research sources that showed the importance of not freezing in place as a result of the crisis…how to keep you imaginative skills running at full capacity…and…that the companies who came roaring out of the last 6 recessions where the ones who made progressive decisions and were not prevention-focused. The progressive companies smartly reduced operating expenses in order to boost financial efficiency — and — 75% of the companies did not reduce the workforce because they realized that to do so…would mean cutting into the muscle of the operation and would negatively affect their ability to come roaring out…when the economy was on the rebound. Instead — the progressive companies doubled down by making significant investments in R&D, marketing, equipment, facilities, and a variety of other strategic investments. I shared multiple examples back in Part 1…Episode 933 in case you want to look it up in your listening app…and again…the link is in today’s show notes. We also took a deep dive into the forms of marketing where progressive companies made their investments. Because what they didn’t do was spent loosely on advertising or other sorts of broad promotional tactics. Instead — they focused their efforts around strategies that would help them build trust in their brands…plant their flag of authority even deeper in the niches and industries they served. Which was super smart and synced up perfectly with the recent research study that my Predictive ROI team conducted alongside our research partner, Susan Baier, founder of Audience Audit. There is — without a doubt — a direct financial correlation between your authority position and financial ROI. And much of that is due to the critical importance your prospects and clients place on TRUST. So let’s peel this back a little bit more so we can explore it. We are entering the era of the authority. While you may already be tired of the phrase of “thought leader”, the truth is there aren’t that many of them…and there are even fewer occupying that status in the niches you and your team serve. Thought leaders don’t write content that any other agency, coach, or consultant could claim. Thought leaders don’t write about anything and everything — and thought leaders don’t compete on price. And their time — your time — is now. Why am I saying that so definitely? For the last 20-years — the global PR agency, Edelman has conducted research that examines who and what consumers trust and how that trust influences buying behaviors. I shared some of the results of their special March study during my Market Your Way Through the Crisis webinar several weeks ago… But if you weren’t able to attend — you can find the free replay here and I also included the full slide deck…all 199 slides that I used. No email required — happy to share it with you and your team. Some of the biggest takeaway’s from Edelman’s research is that consumers assign a high level of trust to people they believe are “just like me.” When you think about how ratings, reviews, and influencers affect their audiences — you can see the power of that belief. Now — it’s also important to not get hung up on the fact that the study involved 33,000 CONSUMERS from 27 countries. First off — that’s a huge sampling of people — and second — even if you are selling B2B — which my guess is you are — people are people…so if people put this much emphasis on trust in their personal lives…you better believe they behave the same way while at work making even larger buying decisions. But — here’s what’s interesting. Edelman’s research isn’t about celebrity influencers. Edelman is documenting the rise of the common man and woman influencer. It’s noteworthy because it gives statistical validity to the idea that real people as influencers and the impact they can have on behalf of their business. The research asked participants to rank what attributes made an influencer believable and trustworthy. The relatability of the influencer was nearly twice as important as the influencer’s popularity. In other words…when consumers see themselves in an influencer, they were far more likely to follow and trust that influencer. So — it’s not about having a million followers…it’s about being someone you can relate to and connect with. For this very reason — if you’ve been avoiding putting together a content strategy where you share your depth of expertise in your niche — I recorded this solocast just for you — so that you rethink that decision. Onward Nation — the data is all on your side. Now — let’s continue to peel back the curtain to get a look at some of the attributes of someone who is a true authority. If you were asked to think of an authority on any subject, who would come to mind? What about them designates them as an authority? What’s true about them? And what does someone have to do to earn and keep the title of authority? My co-author of Sell with Authority, Drew McLellan, CEO of Agency Management Institute, and I would argue that there are 10 Truths to someone being seen as an authority. Let’s do a quick review… Truth #1: They have a focus area or subject matter expertise. Truth #2: They don’t just repeat what everyone else is saying. Truth #3: They have a public presence where they share their expertise. Truth #4: They don’t stray from their area of expertise—think specialist versus a generalist. Truth #5: They aren’t equally attractive to everyone. In fact, they probably bore most people to tears. Truth #6: They’re significant—which is different from prolific—in terms of content creation. Truth #7: They don’t create any generic content that someone with far less knowledge or experience could have just as easily written. Truth #8: They’re perceived as an educator in some way. Truth #9: They have a passion for their subject matter. Truth #10: They have a strong point-of-view, which is the foundation of all of their content. A true authority has something specific to teach us, and they want to be helpful or illuminating. They’re eager to share what they know because they have a genuine passion for it, and they don’t fear giving away the recipe to their secret sauce (or so it’s perceived). That confidence and generosity are contagious. Their expertise is something specific groups of people (their sweet-spot prospects) are hungry to access. So Onward Nation — to call them an expert, a thought leader, an authority, a sought-after pundit, advisor, or specialist…doesn’t matter. They’re all words for the same thing — a trusted resource who has earned that trust by demonstrating and generously sharing the depth of their specialized knowledge over and over again. Now — let’s hook this back to the Edelman research for a moment. Want to know what made an influencer even more compelling to the research participants? The one attribute that ranked higher than the trust we have in “people like me” is the trust we have in highly educated experts. The only three groups of people we trust more than people like ourselves are company, industry, and academic experts. Why? Because experts are often afforded the highest level of confidence and trust because they have a depth of knowledge in a specific industry or niche. So why in the world wouldn’t you capitalize on that, Onward Nation? Instead of writing generic content that look like every single one of your competitors, which is what many agencies, coaches, and consultants do because it’s so much easier and they feel compelled to create something and don’t want to invest the time necessary to go deep, deep, deep. Or — they feel that they should be paid to share their smarts and don’t want to just give it away for free. Ouch. My hope is that as we get started in this solocast — my words are serving as a very loud battle cry for you. My hope is you see that now is the time to share your smarts and to double down on being helpful to your niche. Now is the time for you to jump into the trenches alongside your prospects and clients — who are just as concerned as you are about everything going on — and to begin giving away the best of what you’ve got — and when you do that — you will build so much trust that it will be difficult for you to contain it. There’s a huge upside for you and your team to do this now. As I said earlier — there are very few thought leaders (and even fewer in the niches you serve)…which means if you can still be one of the early adopters if you commit and boldly step out into this strategy right now. Okay — now let’s turn our attention toward Part 2…how long will this effort take — and — how do you go about doing it? Drew and I are often asked, “How long does this take?” The answer is yes. Meaning — we can’t give you a precise time frame for you because it’s different for everyone. There are many factors, including: The consistency of your content creation The quality of your content — are you saying something fresh or just repeating old news? The amount of time and effort you spend promoting your content The hunger of your audience. Some are starving and will gobble up everything you share, others will only consume the tastiest of offers But — building your authority position is clearly not a get rich quick scheme. At a minimum, you should count on it taking six months to a year before you reap any significant benefit from your efforts. By year two — you should be dancing a jig at how well it’s working. And by year three — you should be well-established as the authority you are. On occasion — a single podcast episode, video, or book will catapult someone into the spotlight and earn them a huge payout. But that’s the exception, not the rule. Don’t count on being the exception or you risk being super disappointed and it could derail all of your hard work. So — I’m going to make an assumption here…that all of the data I have shared with you during Part 1 of this solocast…as well as the 75-minute webinar that I taught several weeks ago…along with everything shared up to this point in this episode has shown you the very significant upside to you doubling down and building your authority position. If so — awesome — so let’s turn our attention toward some of the key things you will need in order to make that happen. There are three essentials to building your authority position. And they are: 1) narrow niche, 2) a strong point-of-view, and 3) being findable in multiple places. Let’s take a closer look at each. Narrow is Gold The first essential in creating an authority position is recognizing that the narrower your audience, the better. It allows you to be quickly discovered and identified as someone your target audience needs to pay attention to, all because you’re speaking their language. Ultimately, this means you can build an audience much faster. Once you’ve built the audience, and you genuinely know them and what they need, you can provide additional value by creating products and services you can sell. If you choose to keep serving everyone as a generalist, you can still absolutely monetize a more generic position of authority (say you’re a business coach, for example), but if you want to get to this more quickly, you need to be ruthless in terms of focus. I agree — it seems counter-intuitive. Most business owners focus on quantity in terms of audience. Many believe they need a massive audience to hit their sales and financial goals. But — the data shows that this isn’t true. You’re actually in a much better position if you’re in front of the right micro audience where nearly everyone is aligned with your ideal client avatar. Would you rather speak directly to 100 of your right-fit prospects…who are perfectly aligned with your ideal client avatar — or — be on stage in front of 10,000 people where there is zero probability that any of them are your prospects? And yet, when it comes to business development, most business owners toss out a huge net, hoping that the right species of fish will swim in so we don’t go hungry. Intellectually, we get it, yet our choices often suggest we’re still focusing on quantity, not quality. Here’s the reality — you don’t need a million downloads to get your podcast sponsored. You don’t need to speak at 50 conferences to have someone walk up and ask you some questions that lead to a proposal. And you don’t need to be on the bestseller list to use your book as an amazing biz dev tool. You just don’t. Most agencies, coaches, and consultants get this completely backward. They create broad, generic content as opposed to something that captures the interest of their ideal prospects. The content is fluffy and doesn’t invite anyone to ask questions or lean in to learn more. But if you were to hone in on your specific audience and ignore the rest of the world (remember, one of the traits of an authority is that most people could care less about their content), the audience does lean in. They do ask questions, and they will eventually put you on a shortlist of prospective partners to consider. And when you do it exceptionally well, you will be the only one they consider. You Need a Strong Point-of-View Here’s what we know for sure. Your industry (no matter what it is) and the world around us are both experiencing change at an unfathomable rate, and it’s only going to get faster. How you communicate nowadays, at best, is on the fly. But the one thing that will not change is that unique cocktail that defines our authority position. It’s the combination of our area of expertise with the strong point-of-view we apply to that area of expertise. Our point-of-view is what we know to be true, and it’s this truth that defines how we approach the work and how we add value. For example, Predictive ROI’s point-of-view is the most agencies, coaches, and consultants go about sales in the less productive, most painful way possible. They get thwarted by gatekeepers at every turn. As a result — they cannot build long-term relationships with their Dream prospects. When we layer that point-of-view, on top of our knowledge and expertise around how to grow an audience, nurture leads, and increase sales by helping our clients Sell with Authority, it’s easy to see how and where we can be of help. It tells us who to serve and how to best serve them. That’s evergreen. You and your team should have a similar combination. You need to have an opinion about the work you do on behalf of your clients. You need a strong point-of-view about the marketplace, your audience, or your product or service. As you fight for a prospect’s attention, you must differentiate yourself. You’ve got to plant a flag in the ground and claim ownership. You need to stand out against the sea of competitors. That authority position—your area of expertise plus your strong point-of-view—becomes the flag you plant. It’s you laying claim to what is uniquely yours—the ability to serve a specific industry, niche, audience, etc., because of what you know and what you believe. It holds you firmly in place no matter what else changes. It becomes part of your differentiation equation. And you need both halves of the whole. Without the point-of-view, even industry-specific content becomes claimable by others. Granted, it narrows the field, but there are certainly others who work in the same industry or niches that you do. If you can take your content (blog posts, white paper, podcast interviews, etc.) and swap your competitor’s logo for yours without anyone noticing, your content isn’t as unique to you as you’d like. That’s what we mean by claimable. But don’t get too finite about this. I’m not suggesting you’re going to create an authority position no one else can replicate. Odds are, no matter what your authority position, a handful of others could claim it, too. But that’s your goal—a small handful, rather than every competitor out there. Just to be clear, your point-of-view is the truth you overlay onto your niche or industry-specific expertise. It’s an insight that influences the work you do. The ideal scenario for building your authority position is one in which you have the one-two punch of a point-of-view paired with that narrow audience or topic area. That’s a powerful combination. You can carve out a more superficial authority position with just one of the two elements, either a point-of-view or niche expertise, but the consequence is, if you’re going to only include half of the one-two punch, you’re going to share your unique position with more competitors. At some level, you probably already know what you point-of-view is — but you don’t recognize it as such. Odds are, you either take it for granted because you talk about it so often, or you just need to dig a little deeper to find the gold in what you’re already teaching, talking about, and using to build the recommendations you make to clients. You just have to peel the onion back several layers to get to something that’s genuinely different enough that you can own it. You Can’t Be a One-Trick Pony Essential number three is that an authentic authority is not a one-trick pony. Meaning — you can’t create content so narrow it only works on one channel. An expert doesn’t have just one book. Or just a podcast. You can’t place all of your bets on one horse (or pony). The problem is that whatever pony you rode in on is not going to be the popular pony forever, and you can’t rely on all of your prospects consuming that specific channel. You need to be more findable, which means you need to have your authority-positioned content in more than one place. If you’re going to build an authority position — you have to answer the question, “How does my point-of-view come to life across multiple channels?” Your goal is to create the impression that you’re everywhere. The good news is that it doesn’t take that many channels to make that happen. You need a cornerstone channel and some cobblestones. When Drew and I wrote about cornerstone content in our book, Sell with Authority, what we meant was content that’s big and meaty, so it can be sliced and diced into smaller pieces of content—what we call cobblestones. The definition of cornerstone is that it is the first stone placed. If you were constructing a building, you would carefully set that first stone because you know all the other stones will be set in reference to the cornerstone. When you take that cornerstone content and break it up into infographics, quote cards, blog posts, tweets, guest appearances on someone else’s podcast, etc., that’s your cobblestone content. The combo of your niche expertise and your unique point-of-view should be woven into every piece of content you create. In some cases, it will be overt, and in other cases, subtle. But it should always be present to some degree. Some experts or influencers try to be everywhere, but that stretches them pretty thin pretty quickly. All you need are a few channels spot-on for your audience that you consistently feed with new content. You need a single cornerstone and at least two or three cobblestone channels. From there, you can use your social media channels to spotlight both. Just remember, your cornerstone is the primary channel through which you consistently deliver useful content that helps your audience do their jobs better. And it needs to be meaty enough that you can slice and dice it into multiple cobblestones. Think of the cobblestones as info-snack-sized pieces of content like a quote graphic featuring your podcast guest that someone might stumble upon and be interested in enough that they are led to your cornerstone content. New York Times best-selling author Jay Baer shared the importance of info-snacks during Episode 305 of Onward Nation. You need both cornerstone and cobblestone content. But you don’t need dozens. Cornerstones, by their nature, require a much more significant time investment. Which means you don’t have time to create too many. Far better to do one exceedingly well than to stretch yourself too thin, and better to be consistently present in a few places as opposed to occasionally showing up everywhere. And — you want to build something you can sustain for the long haul, and unless you’re going to make being an authority your full-time gig — it’s better to start with one. Your cornerstone, and at least a few of your cobblestones, need to be built on media you own and control, not on someone else’s platform. That might be your website, a book you write, research you conduct, or your own podcast series. You can use channels like Instagram, Facebook, or LinkedIn to highlight your efforts, but your cornerstone content shouldn’t be housed there. You don’t want to go to the effort of creating content only to have some third party (like Facebook) decide to take it down or charge people for accessing it. While you don’t want to build your cornerstone content on a media channel you don’t own, that doesn’t mean you don’t want to be on other people’s channels. If your cornerstone content is targeted and tied to your point-of-view, and you’re consistent in creating smaller pieces of content from that cornerstone, you’re going to get noticed. That’s all you need to get invited onto other people’s channels. One of the key elements about being an authority is that you don’t want everything to remain on your owned channels. You want to leverage other people’s spheres of influence, and when you appear as a guest on their show or whatever channel they own and control, now they’re endorsing you, telling other people how smart you are, and introducing you to an entirely new audience. That amplification expands your audience exponentially once you have built the foundation that earns the invites. But they will roll in, in a variety of ways. You’ll be invited to: Speak at conferences Be a guest on podcasts Write bylined articles for publications Sit on a panel of experts Serve on a board Write a regular column Teach a class Be part of a webinar series Be interviewed as a source by the media And that’s just the tip of the iceberg. On occasion, your cornerstone channel will shift. This shouldn’t be because you’re getting bored or are indecisive. It should be driven by your audience, reactions to your efforts, and potentially, media consumption trends. The content itself doesn’t shift, but how you deliver the content might. When I started executing this authority strategy for Predictive ROI, book writing was my cornerstone channel. I was creating a lot of content for publications and was being published in publications like Forbes, The Washington Post, Inc. Magazine, and other media about once a month. And much of that content was sliced and diced off of my books on search engine optimization and social media that I wrote while I was teaching at the university. But then in May 2015 — when we ran into revenue challenges at Predictive — and that pushed my team and I to launch the Onward Nation podcast as part of our pivot. And the growth of the podcast quickly eclipsed my written content and took over as our cornerstone content channel. And then we have added some cobblestones into the mix with our YouTube channel, weekly emails for our community, as well as conference presentations. And — we’ve even worked the cornerstone content process backward…with several episodes being instrumental in helping me write our bestselling book, Profitable Podcasting…and after 3-years…is still one of the best selling podcasting books on the market. For a complete breakdown on how to create cornerstone content — I encourage you to go back to my solocast in Episode 676 of Onward Nation. Okay — let’s come full circle and bring this in for a landing. Nothing about this recession has been — or will be easy. To come roaring out of it on the other side will take a lot of hard work, discipline, and generous spirit in doubling down to be helpful. But if you do — the data is on your side. If you take this time and commit to building your authority position…you will put yourself and your business in the best possible position when the sun begins to shine once again. This is the time, Onward Nation for you to grab hold of those silver linings — they are there — if you’re willing to look hard enough. Thanks for taking the time to be here and for sharing a portion of your 86,400 you have today…with me. I’m grateful and I look forward to you being back for our next episode. Until then — double down — and onward with gusto!

Small Biz Buzz hosts Crystal Heuft and Scott Martineau are joined by Susan Baier, the owner and founder of Audience Audit, who talks about attitudinal segmentation and identifying an audience that actually works for a small business. As a small business owner, your audience is not based on what it looks like. Your audience is based on the problems your small business is solving, and who has them, and why your customers haven't solved them already–that is attitudinal segmentation. “In our research, what we're doing is looking at populations, customers, prospects, whatever it may be, B2B, B2C, and saying, we can look at company size for these people, or we can look at their age or their gender, but instead let's look at the kinds of attitudes that they have about this category, the kinds of experiences they've had in the past, the things that are important to them and the things that aren't, and let's group people that way,” said Baier. “You don't have to choose just one audience, but you have to be super clear, for the audiences that you choose, and choose is the operative word,” Baier continued. “The ones that you want to serve, the problem that you want to solve, you have to be crystal clear about why they're looking, and what is involved in their choice, and who they're putting you up against, so that you can provide relevant marketing content, product services, whatever it is.” “Who” is not the question you have to answer in marketing. “Why” is the question you have to answer and find your niche. Tune in for more.

With a talent for creating special events that blossomed while working for my dad’s car stereo shop, I got my start in marketing at Frontier Field in Rochester and I began serving as the executive director of the internationally known Lilac Festival. Later on, I headed the Canandaigua, New York Business Improvement District while also performing projects for the tourism promotion agency Visit Rochester. In 2009, I founded Break the Ice Media, with more than 20 years of experience in tourism marketing. I now host “Destination on the Left”, a highly successful tourism marketing podcast. As a business owner, I know what it takes to be successful. I founded BTI to help businesses tell their brand story through public relations, digital and traditional channels. I have the ability to uncover unique marketing opportunities and develop marketing and public relations initiatives that help clients build long-term success. In this solocast episode of Destination on the Left, we look at the highlights from day two of our Destination on the Left Virtual Summit. What You Will Learn in This Episode: The highlights from day two of the Destination on the Left Virtual Summit How you can use live video and video to increase exposure and attendance at events and destinations How to improve your communication strategy through demographic research How to employ traditional branding tactics as a DMO Why DMOs can benefit from the dramatic change in Chinese travel trends How you can leverage influencer marketing to generate awareness and drive visitation at their destinations Destination on the Left Virtual Summit: Day 2 On day one of the virtual summit, we were graced with some amazing speakers. If you missed our recap of their presentations and want to revisit them, make sure to check out “Destination on the Left Virtual Summit Recap: Day 1, with Nicole Mahoney.” This episode will follow suit with a recap of day two and all of the fabulous presentations that came with it. We dive into the talking points presented by marketing gurus Reagan Burns, Susan Baier, Matt Stiker, Humphrey Ho, and Stacy Jones. We cover a wide variety of topics based on current industry trends and marketing best practices, including: Using Live Videos at Events and Tourism Destinations: Reagan Burns of Lime Creative provided valuable insights into creating live video, and explained how video can increase exposure and attendance at events and destinations. Going Beyond Demographics and Finding the Visitors’ ‘Why?’: Susan Baier of Audience Audit shares a new perspective on targeting. She explore how destinations can move beyond the typical demographic categorization of audiences and market in a way that answers the visitor’s question of “why”. What Destination Marketers Can Learn From Non-Destination Marketers: Matt Stiker of Garrand Moehlenkamp looks at destination marketing through a wide-angle lens and discusses the fundamental components of powerful branding. Changing Chinese Traveler and Travel Trends: Humphrey Ho of Hylink Digital discusses the shift from group travel to FIT (free, independent travelers) and how smaller destinations can take advantage of prospective Chinese visitors doing their own research online. Using Pop Culture to Market Your Brand: Stacy Jones of Hollywood Branded talks about how destination marketers can use celebrities and influencers to generate awareness and drive visitation at their destinations. If you weren’t able to take part in the amazing Destination on the Left Virtual Summit, don’t fret! You can still watch all of the presentations on our website. Just purchase an all-access pass by visiting www.destinationontheleft.com/summit and enjoy! Otherwise, keep an eye out for an upcoming announcement for our next summit in Spring 2020. We hope you can join us. Resources: Email: nicole@breaktheicemedia.com Website: www.destinationontheleft.com/summit Website: https://breaktheicemedia.com/ Twitter: @Break_TheIce Facebook: @BreakTheIceMedia Episode Transcript

Marketers know that the value of data from the past helps them strategize for the future. However, it may be time to gather data in a different and proactive way. Why not try an organic and mathematical approach? Today’s guest is Susan Baier of Audience Audit, a marketing research company. She describes how attitudinal research can be more effective than demographics research. Susan explains the difference between audience and customer research.   Some of the highlights of the show include: Audience Audit: Attitudinal audience segmentation research that gains quantitative insight into audiences trying to be reached via marketing efforts Attitudinal Research: Understanding how opinions, assumptions, perspectives, and preconceived ideas affect purchase decisions Qualitative vs. Quantitative Research: Each offer value, including quantitative statistically significant insights of things affecting some of your audience Marketers need to answer ‘Why?’ by providing reliable data Audience Research: Only listening to customers, can create skewed perspective Who is your sample? Talk to past, present, and potential customers in the market to solve a problem that you understand Where to find your audience? Don’t rely on a single source; understand audience via email subscriber list, customer files, and social media platforms Why are people here? What kept them from getting help sooner? Focus on what problems your company’s products and services solve, not on what they do What does CMT stand for? Write compelling content using existing customers language/lingo to attract a similar audience What method(s) to use to gather research? Survey of connotative data; avoid pushing your assumptions that artificially stratify people and don’t make sense What doesn’t matter? 95% of studies that identify attitudinal segments reveal that company size, gender, household, and other factors aren’t important Crafting Questions: Remove bias from data gathering and analysis processes to improve product positioning, audience targeting, and personas  Segmentation: Understand, implement, and use information/data Links:  Audience Audit How To Do Remarkable Customer Research With Rand Fishkin From SparkToro [AMP081] Gartner  Magic Quadrant Content Marketing Platform SurveyMonkey SurveyGizmo Qualtrics CoSchedule Marketing Software Suite

Every year we partner with Audience Audit to conduct research that we know will benefit agency leaders. This year, we decided to re-visit some of the questions we initially asked in 2014 to see if there had been significant shifts. In some ways, the results showed a consistent trend and in some other areas, there’d been some pretty significant changes. In the 2019 study we included clients from the US, Canada, Australia and the UK and there were over 1,000 respondents who participated. In this episode we’ll walk you through some of the most significant ah ha moments in the study in terms of what clients value, how they view us, and the kinds of work they think we do best. We will also talk about some of the new questions around agency specialization and agency owner involvement in key accounts. Listen in as Susan Baier, president of Audience Audit and I explore the insights and talk about the implications of this new research. We’d also like to invite you to join us on November 12th (if you’re listening to this in real time) as we walk folks through every single question and data point in a live webinar just for you! A big thank you to our podcast’s presenting sponsor, White Label IQ. They’re an amazing resource for agencies who want to outsource their design, dev or PPC work at wholesale prices. Check out their special offer (10 free hours!) for podcast listeners here: https://www.whitelabeliq.com/ami/. What You Will Learn in this Episode: What remained steady and what shifts we saw from the 2014 study The three distinct audience segments we uncovered and how each of them view agencies Why over 50% of all respondents work with an agency who is 200+ miles away from them How you can get the complete download during the webinar on November 12th Ways to Contact Susan Baier: Website: www.audienceaudit.com Email: susan@audienceaudit.com Twitter: @susanbaier

Susan Baier has been a marketing strategist for a long time, both on the agency side and the client side. Throughout her career, Susan noted that people often stick to two types of audience segmentation strategies: demographic or behavioral. While these strategies can provide valuable insights, Susan had a new goal that she wanted to achieve. She wanted to be able to offer audience segmentation to small and mid size agencies that was based on attitude. In other words, why do people do what they do. So, at the beginning of the Recession, Susan founded her company, Audience Audit. Our latest guest on The Innovative Agency, Susan talked with us about different types of segmentation studies, using research to differentiate your agency, and how to use your intellectual capital to generate additional revenue.

Susan Baier, Head Honcho at Audience Audit, joins the Content Experience Show to discuss better audience segmentation through attitudinal personas.   Special thanks to our sponsors: Vidyard Uberflip Convince & Convert: Four Ways to Fix Your Broken Content Marketing   In This Episode How to find meaningful information for segmentation How to conduct research to build attitudinal personas How to balance “deep dives” with archetypal personas Why typical demographic information is ineffective for segmentation   Resources Uberflip Convince & Convert Audience Audit Satan: His Psychotherapy and Cure by the Unfortunate Dr. Kassler   Visit contentexperienceshow.com for more insights from your favorite content marketers.  

In this episode, Stacy speaks with Susan Baier about the most effective ways to build buyer personas when working with new clients. 

My guest today is Susan Baier, head honcho at Audience Audit, a company specializing in attitudinal audience segmentation research.  We chat about how crafty businesses can harness the power of segmenting for better customer engagement.

Susan Baier founded her company, Audience Audit, in 2009 in order to help organizations understand their best audiences based on attitudes and needs rather than just demographics or purchase behavior. With 30-years of experience as a marketing strategist, she develops custom segmentation research for marketers and agencies around the world, supporting their efforts to create marketing initiatives that are more relevant, more efficient, and more impactful. What you’ll learn about in this episode: How Audience Audit gives small to midsize businesses access to marketing research The importance of focusing on an audience when building a business The two questions that help define your audience Why you should stop focusing on the demographics of your audience Why you need to identify the problem your audience is trying to solve The importance of building the audience you want to work with Why you should use your website as a sales tool How to use your website to target the clients you want to work with The importance of working with clients that are the right fit for your business Why you should not rely on searches for exactly what you sell Ways to contact Susan: Website: www.audienceaudit.com Email: susan@audienceaudit.com  

Susan Baier has been a marketing strategist for 30 years, and now help organizations figure out their ideal audiences. She supports marketing agencies with custom attitudinal segmentation research and helps small business owners learn how to think about their audiences in a way that helps them develop their positioning, content, messaging and marketing strategies.

Susan Baier began her career as a brand manager for companies like Dial and Conoco-Philips. She also worked agency side and within client companies in their research departments, honing her skills as a research professional. Recognizing that primary research was often too expensive for small to mid-sized agencies, she launched Audience Audit, where she conducts quantitative attitudinal audience segmented research. She helps her agency clients develop marketing strategy for their clients based on customer insights. They find it much easier to develop messaging, strategic plans, and business development plans with real data that helps them understand how customers who look (demographically) the same behave in very different ways and what motives those choices and behaviors. Over the past few years, AMI and Audience Audit have partnered together for studies on how business owners find agencies, their attitudes towards working with agencies, and more.   What you’ll learn about in this episode: Our 2016 Agency Workforce Report What made our 2016 research different from other research projects we’ve done in the past How we crunched our data The three types of agency employees that we found in our research: agency advocates, prosperity partners, and “millennial mindset” (and why the majority of millennials don’t fall in the “millennial mindset” group) What your agency can do to have less “millennial mindset” employees than average Why the opportunity to learn and grow is the most important thing to all employees (especially millennials) How to give your employees ways to learn and grow that don’t break the bank Why your employees have to be willing to come back from training and events ready to teach the rest of your agency Why treating your employees fairly does not mean treating them equally Why making agency advocates happy is easy (and how to cultivate them into the agency leaders of tomorrow) Why you have to help prosperity partners develop their own brand Why you should avoid using the word millennials Ways to Contact Susan Baier: Website: www.audienceaudit.com Email: susan@audienceaudit.com Twitter: @susanbaier Resources: 2016 Agency Workforce Report AMI Audience Audit Webinar One on One Meeting Form We’re proud to announce that Hubspot is now the presenting sponsor of the Build A Better Agency podcast! Many thanks to them for their support!

Susan Baier began her career as a brand manager for companies like Dial and Conoco-Philips. She also worked agency side and within client companies in their research departments, honing her skills as a research professional. Recognizing that primary research was often too expensive for small to mid-sized agencies, she launched Audience Audit, where she conducts quantitative attitudinal audience segmented research. She helps her agency clients develop marketing strategy for their clients based on customer insights. They find it much easier to develop messaging, strategic plans, and business development plans with real data that helps them understand how customers who look (demographically) the same behave in very different ways and what motives those choices and behaviors. Over the past few years, AMI and Audience Audit have partnered together for studies on how business owners find agencies, their attitudes towards working with agencies, and more.   What you’ll learn about in this episode: How the research that Audience Audit does differs from a lot of the research that’s out there How your agency can leverage research inside your agency-client relationships The ways agencies can better sell the value of research to existing and prospective clients Why agencies can’t build their business around “shiny toys” The ways research has changed and why agencies shouldn’t be afraid to bring it to clients that they haven’t done research with in the past How bringing research to clients can give them a sense of relief and make it easier for your agency to retain their business A specific example of how this kind of targeted research helped a client in a big way The mistakes agencies make when trying bring research into their shop Why niche really matters when it comes to research Baby steps agencies can take to start incorporating research Ways to contact Susan Baier: Website: www.audienceaudit.com Email: susan@audienceaudit.com Twitter: @susanbaier Resources: 2015 research 2014 research We’re proud to announce that Hubspot is now the presenting sponsor of the Build A Better Agency podcast! Many thanks to them for their support!