Smart Agency Masterclass with Jason Swenk: Podcast for Digital Marketing Agencies

Would you like access to our advanced agency training for FREE? https://www.agencymastery360.com/training Ever feel like running your agency is just one long grind of “good enough” projects, endless deadlines, and late-night work sessions? Most agency owners start out chasing freedom, only to find themselves trapped by clients, culture challenges, and their own workaholic habits. Today's featured guest is certainly familiar with this cycle, so how was he able to build a business that works for him instead of the other way around? By focusing on clarity, culture, and constant evolution. Dan Fisher is the founder of Bottle Rocket Media, a Chicago-based video production and digital marketing firm. Before running his agency, Dan spent a decade in television, including a long stretch as an editor at The Oprah Winfrey Show. What started as “making a few videos for people” turned into a full-fledged agency after his partner joined. Today, Bottle Rocket Media blends storytelling with digital strategy to help brands communicate with impact. In this episode, we'll discuss: Data meets creativity. The agency he “thought he should build” Culture as a compass. Redefining work and energy. Subscribe Apple | Spotify | iHeart Radio Sponsors and Resources E2M Solutions: Today's episode of the Smart Agency Masterclass is sponsored by E2M Solutions, a web design, and development agency that has provided white-label services for the past 10 years to agencies all over the world. Check out e2msolutions.com/smartagency and get 10% off for the first three months of service. Leaving TV for Agency Life Dan wasn't setting out to build an agency. He was a New York kid, worked on TV production in LA, and then got tapped on the shoulder for a gig at Oprah. When he landed in Chicago, he figured he'd be there a couple of years. Ten years later, he had a family, a house, and roots that weren't going anywhere. After leaving TV (not a moment too soon, according to him), he just started making videos for people. Then his partner came on board, and suddenly it was more than a side hustle. It was a real business. That's when Dan realized he was no longer just a TV guy—he was running an agency. What TV Taught Him About Storytelling TV wasn't all glitz. Dan loved the storytelling, the cameras, the lights. However, running a daily show can crush even the strongest souls. Deadlines piled on top of deadlines. Three to four episodes a week meant three to four immovable deadlines every week. Still, it gave him his 10,000 hours. He learned how to tell stories fast, direct, edit, and manage creative teams. Most importantly, TV taught Dan the importance of knowing your audience. At Oprah, there was always an “audience of one”—Oprah herself. He'd have the version he wanted to tell, and then the version she'd actually approve. That lesson carried into agency life: storytelling isn't about you, it's about your client. You're not making an indie film; you're telling their story in a way that serves their brand. The Continual Evolvement of Creativity Bottle Rocket Media isn't trying to be Hollywood. They focus on nonfiction storytelling, documentary-style content, education-driven pieces, spokespeople, and commercial spots. What makes their approach stand out is how they marry creative instincts with marketing data. Working in the creative field never ceases to surprise Dan who, even now, expects something to land well with audiences and sees the complete opposite happen. This is why he and his team lean into A/B testing. Sometimes it's the tiniest tweak: a subject line in an email, a color shift in a graphic, or moving the ending to the front of a video. It's a reminder agency owners need: you can be confident in your craft, but the market has the final say. From Filmmaker to CEO When he started, Dan assumed he'd be miserable doing the “operations” side. But mentoring, managing, and building a team turned out to be just as rewarding as calling “action” and “cut.” He's learned the balance between doing and teaching. Having 10,000 hours of experience doesn't mean you always tell the story better than a fresh intern. It means you know how to refine, manipulate, and see perspectives others might miss. At Bottle Rocket Media, they encourage collaboration. Editors critique each other's work. Ideas bounce around. And Dan stays focused on a critical question every creative leader should ask: Am I making it better, or just making it different? From “Good Enough” to Defining Excellence It took Dan years to reach what he calls his maturity, after trying to be “the agency he thought he should be”. Eventually, after banging his head against the wall for a long time, he realized the power of clarity—both personally and professionally. He started the business as a way to make ends meet after leaving TV, but it was time to define his goals with the agency and make it his own. Once he stopped chasing someone else's model and leaned into his own strengths, everything changed. The real turning point wasn't in working harder, but in defining what success actually looked like for him and his team. Culture as a Compass Clarity doesn't just guide you, it's also something you can instill in your team. Once Dan started defining his agency's beliefs, he could attract people who truly fit. To him, if your team is not going in the same direction, then what's the point? But culture hasn't been easy, especially post-pandemic. Bottle Rocket Media runs on a hybrid model: three mandatory in-office days, with Mondays and Fridays remote. For Dan, it was about letting go of his old Gen X “first one in, last one out” mentality and adapting to a younger workforce. The result is a stronger, more unified team—even if they're not physically together every day. Redefining Work and Energy Coming from TV, where it's not rare to work up to 70 hours a week, Dan initially started his agency using the volume model, which is what he knew. Once the business was up and running, his hours were still pretty similar to what he was used in TV. Eventually, however, it got to a point where a trusted employee expressed he was at his breaking point, and Dan knew it was time to dial down. Working beyond a certain limit didn't make him better, it was just making him an ineffective leader. That shift changed how he managed his team, starting by cutting off the bottom 20% and elevating the types of projects they do. This way, with clear goals and clear deadlines, he's building the kind of leadership that creates loyalty and sustainability. Always Be Evolving The agency game changes daily. Right now, AI is shaking up video and digital marketing. What worked yesterday won't always work tomorrow. If you want your agency to survive, curiosity is the ultimate skill. Test, adapt, and don't get too comfortable. That philosophy is why Dan's agency has evolved from purely video into a full digital offering. On the video side, he had to learn how to let go and empower others. On the digital side, he leans entirely on his team's expertise. In both cases, growth depends on staying open to new approaches and trusting the right people to execute them. Do You Want to Transform Your Agency from a Liability to an Asset? Looking to dig deeper into your agency's potential? Check out our Agency Blueprint. Designed for agency owners like you, our Agency Blueprint helps you uncover growth opportunities, tackle obstacles, and craft a customized blueprint for your agency's success.

Would you like access to our advanced agency training for FREE? https://www.agencymastery360.com/training Are you wondering how AI will really change the way agencies work? Will it replace your team, or make them better than ever? Artificial intelligence continues to be at the forefront of most tech conversations, and that's exactly why agency owners can't afford to ignore it. Today's guest believes the real future of AI in agencies isn't about replacement—it's about augmentation. Humans bring the high-leverage ideas, AI scales the execution, and the magic happens in the collaboration between the two. That's why he challenges his team to master a skill first—understanding every step—before delegating pieces of it to AI. By doing so, they not only achieve stronger results but also gain the ability to explain, teach, and refine the process. For agencies, this thoughtful integration turns AI from a threat into a powerful accelerator. Josh Payne is a serial entrepreneur and the founder of Coframe, which helps businesses continuously optimize their digital experiences. Before that, he co-founded Autograph, scaling it to unicorn status within just over a year, and previously sold his first company, AccessBell, to India's Tata Group. A Stanford AI researcher and occasional lecturer, Josh has blended tech, entrepreneurship, and big-name partnerships into a career full of lessons that agency owners can apply to their own journey. In this episode, we'll discuss: The power of just asking. Should we be worried about AI? Why the human element still wins. When AI shows empathy. Subscribe Apple | Spotify | iHeart Radio Sponsors and Resources This episode is brought to you by Wix Studio: If you're leveling up your team and your client experience, your site builder should keep up too. That's why successful agencies use Wix Studio — built to adapt the way your agency does: AI-powered site mapping, responsive design, flexible workflows, and scalable CMS tools so you spend less on plugins and more on growth. Ready to design faster and smarter? Go to wix.com/studio to get started. Building Big, Fast (and What Comes After) Josh's first exit was AccessBell, acquired by Tatai Group. Then came Autograph, the NFT platform co-founded with connections in the entertainment industry that quickly attracted celebrities and athletes like Tom Brady. The company went unicorn in about a year, proof that timing, partnerships, and execution can fuel explosive growth. But Josh is quick to admit that pace sets a dangerous bar. When he launched Coframe, progress felt slower. The natural question arises: why am I not going as fast as I did last time? For any agency owner who's had one “big win,” the fear of never matching that level again is real. For Josh, it comes down to stop chasing vanity metrics and focusing on the real value you're creating. The long burn, when tied to a larger vision, often builds a stronger foundation. The Power of Just Asking One of the best stories from Josh's Autograph journey was how Tom Brady got involved. It was a simple conversation, made possible because a co-founder's family knew Brady. They took a shot, asked for a call, and suddenly, an NFL legend wasn't just an investor—he was a co-founder. They were, of course, very lucky, but the lesson for Josh was that you'll never land your dream client (or partner) if you don't step up to bat. Too many agencies convince themselves certain clients are “out of reach,” when in reality, decision-makers are more approachable than you think. Even the busiest people have time for the right conversation if you show up as a person, not a pitch machine. Separating Yourself from Your Business Identity With all these exits, Josh is still struggling with the identity crisis that comes with selling or stepping away from a company. Like Jason back when he sold his agency, Josh felt like he'd sold his soul and is still wrestling with how to separate being a tech founder from just being Josh. Your business is not your identity, as performance coach Todd Herman (the guy behind Kobe Bryant's “Black Mamba” alter ego) helped Jason understand. You're not an “agency owner” by identity. You're a creator, innovator, and strategist. Those traits travel with you into whatever you do next. Lose the label, keep the essence. Fighting the Metrics Spiral Every agency owner knows the feeling: dashboards screaming that you're 30% down from last month, the creeping panic that you're “slipping.” Josh admits he's guilty of chasing these vanity metrics too, and it's exhausting. The problem is that short-term sprints cloud the long-term vision. But focusing only on the long-term isn't right either. You can't sit back dreaming and stop executing. Josh calls it a balance game. Some days require in-the-weeds execution. Other days call for pulling up to 30,000 feet and resetting the vision. And finding ways to get into that higher-level thinking state is crucial. Finding Flow and Big Picture Clarity One of Josh's surprising hacks for perspective is the float tank, a sensory deprivation chamber where you float weightless in silence. He describes it as being suspended between sleep and wakefulness, giving him the clarity to see the forest instead of the trees. For him, a float every couple of months resets his ability to think deeply. This lucid dreaming state allows him to consciously control his thought process, which is hard to do on a day-to-day basis. There are different ways to achieve this “flow state” like flying planes or running, where focus on the task at hand frees the brain to process ideas in the background. The lesson for agency owners is that you need intentional “out of the weeds” time. Whether it's floating, running, or flying, find your version of the float tank. Should We Be Worried About AI? Where is AI really going, and should agencies be worried? Josh approaches the subject with cautious optimism. He admits there are possible negative outcomes—whole essays have been written about the risks—but he believes society still has control of its destiny. Governance, adaptation, and human ingenuity will help us navigate the “intelligence explosion” ahead. For agency owners, that perspective matters. The fear-driven narrative (“AI will replace us all”) misses the more useful question: how do we adapt to stay ahead? Josh's view is that AI will become a force multiplier, but only for those who deeply understand their craft first. At Coframe, he leads his team with the mantra: “first we are artisans, then we are automators.” Josh encourages his team to master processes as humans before trying to automate them. An artisan, he says, is someone who not only performs a task with taste and skill but can also teach it to an apprentice. If you can teach it, you can usually train AI to do it too. This is a powerful framework for agencies. Too many people treat AI as a magic shortcut, asking it to “do the thing” without knowing what “the thing” really requires. But if you've built the human expertise first, AI becomes like a hyper-capable apprentice, great at code generation, design variations, or crunching vast amounts of data, but still lacking the higher-level strategy and creative ideation that only humans can bring. Why the Human Element Still Wins Lots of people are already trying to launch “AI-only agencies.” This is a mistake. Clients don't just want data or deliverables; they want connection, guidance, and trust. Even as AI accelerates execution, the human side, like the ability to understand a client, guide their decisions, and translate insights into strategy, remains irreplaceable. This is especially true when clients don't know what to ask. Tools may say, “Ask me anything,” but most business owners don't even know where to start. That's where the agency earns its keep: by framing the right questions and then leveraging AI to deliver smarter, faster answers. AI Limitations on Emotion and Empathy Empathy remains the most valuable and, so far, irreplaceable element that AI cannot afford clients, and where human intervention continues to be necessary. However, as these models get more and more aligned, clients are starting to see cases where the AI is able to show empathy for your situation. For instance, Jason recently tested AI with his own medical challenges. After foot surgery complications, he uploaded photos of his wound to an AI tool and was surprised at how sympathetic the responses felt. It wasn't just giving data—it was offering encouragement, warnings, and even emergency advice when he tested it with old images. Josh had his own example: experimenting with fasting while using AI to predict weight loss. The model gave estimates but also warned him about the risks and refused to encourage unsafe behavior. Modern models are being trained not just for accuracy but to reflect human values, to ensure they're aligned with human interests. Balancing AI Alignment With Performance This fine-tuning process with newer AI models makes them more positive and empathetic. But there's a trade-off: aligned models can lose some raw performance on benchmarks. For agencies, this means two things: AI tools will continue evolving in personality and usefulness. The best results will still come from humans who know how to wield them—pairing empathy, strategy, and creativity with AI's speed and scale. Do You Want to Transform Your Agency from a Liability to an Asset? Looking to dig deeper into your agency's potential? Check out our Agency Blueprint. Designed for agency owners like you, our Agency Blueprint helps you uncover growth opportunities, tackle obstacles, and craft a customized blueprint for your agency's success.  

Would you like access to our advanced agency training for FREE? https://www.agencymastery360.com/training Are you stuck acting like an order taker instead of leading your clients with strategy? If you want to grow an agency that survives the competition, you need to do more than deliver pretty websites or manage ad budgets. You need to lead with strategy, prove it with data, and guide your clients through the journey—not the other way around. Too many agencies are still making decisions based on “gut feelings” instead of data, which is why today's featured guest is tackling exactly that problem—making it easier for everyone in a company to use data daily, so decisions are grounded in reality, not instinct. Pete Caputa is the CEO of Databox, a business intelligence platform built for small to mid-market companies that makes data adoption simple across teams. Before that, Pete spent nine years at HubSpot, where he famously launched and scaled the agency partner program—now responsible for billions in revenue. But Pete's journey didn't start in SaaS boardrooms. He began as an engineer, dabbled in early 2000s web apps after learning to code, and struggled through the grind of bootstrapping. his own ventures. A key pivot came when he connected with sales coach Rick Rober, who helped him sharpen his sales chops. That path eventually led him to HubSpot as the fourth sales rep and later, the architect behind the company's groundbreaking agency channel. In this episode, we'll discuss: Creating the HubSpot Agency Partner Program. Why agencies need to lead with strategy. AI as the new strategic edge. Selling strategy as a service. Subscribe Apple | Spotify | iHeart Radio Sponsors and Resources E2M Solutions: Today's episode of the Smart Agency Masterclass is sponsored by E2M Solutions, a web design, and development agency that has provided white-label services for the past 10 years to agencies all over the world. Check out e2msolutions.com/smartagency and get 10% off for the first three months of service. The Birth of the HubSpot Agency Partner Program Early HubSpot sales conversations looked familiar to many agency owners: lots of free education, lots of excitement… and lots of ghosting. Agencies wanted to roll HubSpot out to their clients, but deals rarely closed. Pete recognized the deeper problem —agencies were stuck in project-based work and living on the cash flow rollercoaster. So he set out to teach agencies to package ongoing retainers instead of chasing one-off projects. That simple but powerful shift unlocked stability and scale. Agencies suddenly had recurring revenue, longer-term client relationships, and the ability to deliver compounding value. HubSpot, of course, became the backbone of that service delivery. What started as a scrappy idea became a multi-billion-dollar channel—and one of the most successful agency programs in SaaS history. Leaving HubSpot As HubSpot scaled, so did its internal politics. Pete found himself in the middle of a growing conflict between the direct sales team and the partner channel. Instead of collaborating, the two operated like competing businesses, often clashing at the deal level. Pete saw a solution, but realized implementing it would be painful in company scaling that fast. He eventually stepped away, even though he was responsible for nearly 40% of HubSpot's revenue at the time. “It got harder to get things done,” he admitted—proof that what works in a startup culture doesn't always survive as companies mature. The Evolving Challenges for Agencies Back in the early 2000s, agencies had to convince clients digital marketing was worth investing in. SEO, social, and funnels were foreign concepts for most businesses. Agencies had to sell belief before they could sell retainers. Today, the problem isn't buy-in—it's competition. Businesses now see digital as essential, but agencies are often commoditized into executing tactics. Instead of being trusted advisors, many find themselves replaceable—either by freelancers, in-house hires, or other agencies that “do the same thing cheaper.” The risk is clear: if you're not leading clients strategically, you're just a vendor waiting to be swapped out. Agencies Need to Lead With Strategy Most agencies claim to do strategy, but really, they only use it to justify selling a tactic. Redesigning a website? They'll run some quick competitor research. Launching content marketing? They'll whip up a persona doc. But that's not strategy—it's sales collateral. Pete is now working on a framework he calls Predictable Scale. It starts with true strategy: competitive research, customer research, defining vision and mission, and setting clear objectives. Only then do tactics come into play. Most agencies don't put these together in the right sequence and, as a result, get pushed in to executing tactics. For agencies, this is the key to breaking out of the execution box and earning a permanent seat at the table. AI as the New Strategic Edge These days, agencies can leverage AI to accelerate strategy and client service. It can be as simple as using AI to run a SWOT analysis, refine your brand voice, mission and vision, and then taking all the data and use it to create a custom GPT you can run to generate client-facing plans. One mastermind member, Chris Dwyer, took this to the extreme by building a board of AI advisors (finance, marketing, sales, and acquisitions) and saw incredible growth as a result. Pete's team has also dabbled in this use of AI and created a custom GPT called Pete GPT. They feed in customer interviews, surveys, and Pete's own writing so the tool can generate content in his voice. Beyond content, AI is speeding up product feedback loops. By connecting call transcripts, chat logs, and support tickets, his product team can instantly spot customer needs and prioritize features—a process that used to take weeks of interviews. Pete also has an AI agent that handles about 50% of his agency's conversations with prospects and clients, with a customer satisfaction score of 70% so far. For agencies, the message is clear: if you're not already embedding AI into your workflows, you're falling behind. Onboarding and Client Retention Still Matter Most Not everything should be automated, however, especially when it comes to onboarding. Onboarding can make or break a client relationship in the first 60 days. Too many agencies rely entirely on Zoom and automation, missing the opportunity to build true connection. “No one meets with clients in person anymore,” he said, and it's costing them. Some of the most successful agencies in Jason's mastermind make it a priority to visit new clients in person during the first quarter. That small gesture builds trust, creates deeper bonds, and makes it much harder for clients to churn later. With competition as fierce as it is, going the extra mile in onboarding may be the simplest competitive advantage agencies can claim. Selling Strategy as a Service Pete wrapped up the conversation by introducing Databox's new program for agencies: business intelligence as a service. Until now, most agencies used Databox to report on campaign performance. But Pete sees a bigger opportunity—helping agencies package BI consulting as a strategic service. Instead of being the vendor that just improves ad ROAS or runs SEO reports, agencies can step up as partners who improve an entire company's performance. That means quarterly reviews looking not just at marketing metrics, but at sales, ops, finance, and customer success data too. For agencies tired of being “order takers,” this is the chance to finally sell strategy over tactics—and get paid for it. Do You Want to Transform Your Agency from a Liability to an Asset? Looking to dig deeper into your agency's potential? Check out our Agency Blueprint. Designed for agency owners like you, our Agency Blueprint helps you uncover growth opportunities, tackle obstacles, and craft a customized blueprint for your agency's success.

Would you like access to our advanced agency training for FREE? https://www.agencymastery360.com/training If your agency is still saying, “Sure, we can do that” to every client request, you're already in trouble. AI isn't coming—it's here. And it's gunning for the order takers. The agencies that survive won't be the button pushers. They'll be the problem solvers. The strategists. Let's break down why the old “yes to everything” model is dead—and what to do instead. The Old Way: Execution = Value Back in the day, clients would come in with half-baked ideas, you'd build what they asked for, send an invoice, and move on. That worked when execution was hard and specialized. But now? AI can crank out ad copy, designs, blog posts—even full websites—in under 30 seconds. If your agency's value is tied to deliverables, you're already replaceable. The New Way: Sell Outcomes, Not Tasks Here's what AI can't do: Diagnose the real problem. Challenge assumptions. Build trust and sell a bigger vision. That's your edge. Strategic agencies don't sell websites or ads anymore. They sell clarity. They sell outcomes. They lead the client to where they actually need to go. Think about surgeons or lawyers. They don't ask, “So what do you want me to do today?” They diagnose. They prescribe. They lead. Great agencies do the same. Real Proof: Owners Who Made the Shift Derek was stuck running a 7-figure agency that was plateauing. He and his team were working themselves into the ground for less and less money. Once he niched down and repositioned as a leader in his space, everything changed. Within a year, he scaled to eight figures. Jack almost shut down his agency before using the Agency Playbook to get clarity, reposition, and dominate his niche. Today, he runs a multi-million-dollar business. Carl stopped “doing” and started leading. Using our Foot in the Door approach, he landed a $100K cash deal plus a 20% royalty stream. These aren't outliers. They're agency owners who stopped being order takers and started being authorities. How to Make the Shift Without Burning It All Down You don't need to fire all your clients and start from scratch. You just need to change how you show up. Stop reacting. Start leading. Don't ask, “What do you want?” Instead, say, “Here's what you need, and here's the proven process to get it.” Get paid for clarity. The Foot in the Door (FITD) system shows you how to charge $2,500+ just for the initial strategy session. Because clarity is valuable—and it positions you as the authority from day one. Audit your model. If you're stuck or unclear on what to fix next, the Agency Blueprint gives you a custom diagnostic so you know exactly where to focus. Ready to stop being a doer and start being an advisor? Grab the Foot in the Door System here and start getting paid just to pitch. Or if you're not sure where the gap is, grab your Agency Blueprint here.

Would you like access to our advanced agency training for FREE? https://www.agencymastery360.com/training Which growth drivers are fueling your agency right now? For today's featured guest, the answer is clear: thought leadership. It's the single biggest driver consistently bringing his agency the best opportunities. While it can be difficult to separate genuine impact from vanity metrics, the deliberate effort to position both himself and his agency as industry experts has proven invaluable for growth. But building that kind of authority doesn't happen by accident. It requires intentional work—stepping onto stages at conferences, showing up in interviews and podcasts, and, just as importantly, encouraging your team to create and share content of their own. In this conversation, he breaks down the strategies that help expand thought leadership beyond the founder, and why agency leaders must remember: expertise is a long game, one that compounds over time to deliver lasting results. Chris Long is the VP of Marketing at Go Fish Digital, a full-service digital marketing agency specializing in SEO, paid media, and content marketing. Over the past 3–4 years, Chris has been leading the charge on marketing and sales for the agency, driving new business growth and experimenting with different channels to see what really works. Spoiler alert: it's not just ads or conferences—it's something much bigger. In this episode, we'll discuss: Thought leadership as your agency's best growth lever. Scaling thought leadership beyond the founder. Building the right systems to encourage your team to create content. Why Content ROI takes patience. Subscribe Apple | Spotify | iHeart Radio Sponsors and Resources This episode is brought to you by Wix Studio: If you're leveling up your team and your client experience, your site builder should keep up too. That's why successful agencies use Wix Studio — built to adapt the way your agency does: AI-powered site mapping, responsive design, flexible workflows, and scalable CMS tools so you spend less on plugins and more on growth. Ready to design faster and smarter? Go to wix.com/studio to get started. The Growth Lever Most Agencies Ignore: Thought Leadership Recently, Chris has taken an experimental approach to his agency's growth, testing growth drivers like Google ads, LinkedIn ads, and conferences, and found that thought leadership consistently stood as the biggest growth drivers; one that couldn't be replicated. Forget chasing the latest ad hack or praying your next conference booth delivers ROI—what's consistently driven their biggest, best deals has been showing up as experts in their space. However, thought leadership is hard to measure. It often looks like vanity metrics—views, impressions, shares. But when you zoom out, it's the stuff that actually moves the needle. The more the agency doubled down on creating content, sharing insights, and putting their expertise out there, the more deals they closed. Not just more deals but better ones, with stronger close rates. If you're still waiting for the perfect ad funnel to save your pipeline, you might be missing the obvious. Start building your authority in public. Share your wins. Share what you know. Because thought leadership compounds, and that trust is what gets prospects off the fence. Why Expertise is the Foundation You can't fake thought leadership. It all starts with real expertise. In Chris' words, “the reason someone's going to choose an agency, especially as you start to sell larger deals, is they have to be convinced you're an expert in something.” That doesn't mean you need to be the everything agency. In fact, the opposite. It could be as narrow as being “the best B2B or SaaS web dev shop.” The point is: prospects need to believe you've mastered your corner of the world. That foundation comes from who you hire, the culture you build, and how you innovate—whether that's through proprietary tools, processes, or just being damn good at your craft. In the case of Go Fish, that expertise showed up in real wins (like when their founders innovated on Geico's site and saw traffic spike 2,000%). Those moments of innovation fueled content, which positioned the agency as leaders. And that cycle of expertise, innovation, and thought leadership became a growth engine. Scaling Thought Leadership Beyond the Founder In the early days, thought leadership was usually founder-driven. You're the face, the credibility, the spark. But as Chris points out, that won't scale. At a certain point, you need the team creating and sharing insights too. For them, that meant encouraging everyone to post, write case studies, and share wins. Sometimes it was as simple as, “Hey, we crushed conversions on this client's landing page—let's write about it.” By empowering their team, they kept thought leadership flowing, even as the founders had less time for it. Thought leadership can't be a one-man show forever. As an agency grows, the founders have less time to spend on the day-to-day operations. If you want authority to scale with your agency, bake it into your culture. Train your team to see insights worth sharing. Make content creation part of the job, not an afterthought. The Biggest Mistake: Not Sharing at All So what do most agencies get wrong? They don't share anything. Too many people assume, “Everything valuable has already been said.” Or they think their insights aren't groundbreaking enough. But as Chris points out, “What's obvious to you isn't obvious to everyone else.” That's why simpley sharing SEO best practices on LinkedIn got him traction. What he thought was “table stakes” turned out to be news to his audience. And the more he shared, the more inbound leads followed. If you're holding back because you don't think your perspective matters, think again. Your experience has value—even if it feels basic to you. Building Systems for Thought Leadership If you want your team to start sharing their knowledge, you have to get intentional. At Go Fish, they didn't just hope employees would write content—they built systems: Every new hire had to write two blog posts a year. They tracked contributions in their project management system. They created two career tracks: one managerial, one based on thought leadership as an individual contributor. That last part is huge. By tying thought leadership part of promotions and career growth, they gave employees a real incentive to contribute. Chris himself went from manager (which he admits wasn't his strong suit) to a senior role via the thought leadership track. The lesson here is that if you want consistent content, make it part of how you hire, measure, and promote. Don't just “encourage” thought leadership—bake it into the agency's DNA. The Evolution of Content: From Blogs to Video Back in the early 2010s, blogs were king. One of Go Fish's founders wrote a massive guide on reputation management on the Moz blog that spun up an entire new agency vertical. That was the play then. Today, however, the game has shifted. According to Chris, video on LinkedIn and Twitter is where the biggest impact happens now. Video humanizes your agency. It takes the mystery away for prospects who are wondering: “Who would I be working with? Are they innovative? Do I trust them?” Webinars have also proven effective—letting people go deeper on topics, showcase expertise, and generate leads from long-form content. But the principle stays the same: meet people where they are, with content that builds authority. The Patience Tax: Why Content ROI Takes Years With content creation, you can't expect results in six months. Here's the brutal truth: content is a long game. To do content you can't think even on seeing results in six months. It may take years. Chris has gotten clients that thought about him when they needed an agency because they saw him speak at a conference two years prior. ROI doesn't always show up on a quarterly P&L—it compounds over years. The same goes for video content. Rarely does someone listen to one episode and instantly buy. Instead, they binge for months or years before making a move. That's why consistency matters more than intensity. As Chris said: “I post every day, whether I feel inspired or not. It's about the habit.” If you're evaluating content success after three or six months, you're cutting yourself off too early. Play the two-year game. The deals waiting for you are bigger than the “quick wins” most agencies chase. Consistency compounds. Virality is a bonus, not the goal. Strong Opinions and Deep Dives Win Attention So what type of content catches people's attention? On social media, where everyone seems to be shouting the same advice over and over, you can't be afraid to stand out. Take a stance. Neutral content gets ignored. As Chris points out: “Strong takes do well because people either comment to agree or argue. Either way, the algorithm loves it.” Go deep. Technical, niche content might feel too in-the-weeds, but it builds trust. Posts dissecting patents, experiments, or tools often outperform fluff. You may not think that really long niche content could do well, but people will absolutely watch a three-hour tutorial that proves a creator's expertise—and will come out trusting them more. This is the heart of thought leadership: demonstrating expertise in public. Clients don't want generalists. They want to see you know your stuff, inside and out. Do You Want to Transform Your Agency from a Liability to an Asset? Looking to dig deeper into your agency's potential? Check out our Agency Blueprint. Designed for agency owners like you, our Agency Blueprint helps you uncover growth opportunities, tackle obstacles, and craft a customized blueprint for your agency's success.

Would you like access to our advanced agency training for FREE? https://www.agencymastery360.com/training Are you an agency owner chasing the $1 million mark, believing that milestone will finally transform your business? Today's featured guest once felt the same way—until he got there and discovered it was all a myth. Hitting seven figures looked like success on paper, but behind the scenes he was burning himself out just to keep things afloat. In this episode, he reveals the processes that helped him escape no man's land, the critical lessons he learned about hiring, and the one thing he would do differently if he had the chance to start over. Justin Rashidi is the CEO and co-founder of SeedX, where he leads data-driven marketing strategy and operations. Justin never planned to start an agency, but what started as a tutoring gig in New York soon turned into a full-blown business. After getting past some common agency growth hurdles, he'll share what he's learned on overcoming no man's land, hiring, why he thinks like a SaaS founder when it comes to running his agency, and more. In this episode, we'll discuss: Don't fall for the million-dollar myth. Why growing fast was a problem and how he would change it. Hiring? Don't go for the entrepreneur type. Getting beyond ‘no man's land'. Subscribe Apple | Spotify | iHeart Radio Sponsors and Resources E2M Solutions: Today's episode of the Smart Agency Masterclass is sponsored by E2M Solutions, a web design, and development agency that has provided white-label services for the past 10 years to agencies all over the world. Check out e2msolutions.com/smartagency and get 10% off for the first three months of service. When “The Side Thing” Has the Potential to Become a Growing Business Justin grew up in a family where being a doctor, lawyer, or engineer was the gold standard. Entrepreneurship wasn't even on his radar. After moving to New York and starting a tutoring company, he realized business was way more fun than he expected. That small company eventually led him into freelancing—websites, marketing, whatever clients needed. The real turning point came when he and his now-wife recognized that the “side thing” they kept ignoring was actually worth building. Instead of just coasting from project to project, they doubled down and started turning Seedex into a functional, growing organization. The Million-Dollar Myth Hitting the million-dollar mark sounds like the dream milestone for agency owners. Justin admits he thought so too… until he actually got there three years into the business. In reality, it was one of the hardest stages of growth. At that point, your agency looks successful on paper, but reality tells a different story. You don't have the capital to hire senior talent. Your team is probably junior and undertrained. Processes are shaky. And you—the founder—are working yourself into the ground to hold it all together. Justin remembers that stage as “a form of hell” that helped him understand why many owners try to sell at one million. He was gaining weight, losing weekends, and burning out fast. Scaling too quickly without solid processes or proper capital can trap you in a worse spot than before. Grow Slower, Build Stronger Looking back, Justin sees one of the biggest problems for his agency was how fast they grew. If he could change anything, he would've slowed down growth. That doesn't sound sexy, but it's real. At the moment, it felt exciting to see his business grow so much. What he didn't know, however, was that scaling without processes or capital is like building a skyscraper on quicksand—it looks impressive until it collapses. He recommends two key moves for agency owners chasing growth: Build strong processes first. Make sure you can consistently deliver client success before you pile on more clients. Secure working capital. Don't wait until you're desperate for cash to get financing. Get a line of credit while things look good—because once you actually need it, banks disappear. This is one of those lessons that sounds boring… until you've lived through the chaos yourself. Thinking About Hiring Entrepreneurs? Justin Says “Just Don't” Another one of Justin's biggest realizations after hitting $1 million was that he had pushed the agency as far as his own hustle could take it. Suddenly, growth wasn't about what he could do—it was about what his team could do. As he put it, “I got myself here, now I have to get the rest of the team here too.” That's when he realized growth isn't about finding the right “how,” it's about finding the right who. That focus on hiring also came with hard lessons, Justin learned what makes an employee succeed or fail within an agency. He also learned the hard way: never hire entrepreneurs. Entrepreneurs leave within 6–12 months to chase their own ventures. Instead, hire people who want to grow inside your company, who hold themselves to high standards, and who take ownership of improving processes. Once you have those people, agency life gets a whole lot easier. You're no longer solving every problem yourself—you've got a team that can think, adapt, and solve without you micromanaging. Beyond “No Man's Land” Every agency owner eventually hits that “no man's land” stage—the space between $1M and true scale—where everything feels hard. For Justin, it didn't end with some big breakthrough moment. It faded slowly over time. Piece by piece, things got easier: better operations, employees leveling up, hiring stronger talent, having more capital, and—maybe most importantly—understanding how a business actually functions. That compounding effect created stability. And while he wouldn't call it easy, he admits the business is way more enjoyable today than it was a few years ago. Numbers Don't Lie Which KPIs you pay attention to may differ depending on your particular market. When it comes to running SeedX today, Justin thinks like a SaaS founder and focuses a lot on contract retention and contract expansion. He wants zero churn and contracts that expand over time. That's how you build a healthy, stable agency without constantly chasing short-term clients. On top of that, he keeps a close eye on profit margins - aiming for 20% and runs monthly reviews with a tight bookkeeping process. For some, the more their agency grows the harder it is to maintain margins. In Justin's case, as his business has grown, their margins have expanded. Why? Because they got better at scoping projects and started moving upmarket to clients who pay properly for expertise. The agency world is full of bad scoping, undercharging, and scope creep. Justin's team now tracks time, analyzes leakage, and runs post-project reviews to tighten estimates. Raising Prices and Playing to Win One of the most powerful lessons Justin learned once he started tracking these KPIs was the danger of undercharging. Once he was running profitably, he realized he should be charging some clients more, and at this point he was confident enough to go back to clients and renegotiate that rate. In the early days, fear drove pricing. He didn't think clients would pay more. Now he sees it differently. If a prospect won't pay what it's worth, let them go. The client that undercut you will eventually realize they made a mistake—and when they come back into the market, they'll be ready to pay at the right price. “It's like a magic $30K shows up,” he says. Since you're running operations correctly and the time is already committed, that revenue drops straight to the bottom line. That's the power of pricing confidence. So stop racing to the bottom. Raise your rates, deliver great work, and let the unprofitable clients filter themselves out. Do You Want to Transform Your Agency from a Liability to an Asset? Looking to dig deeper into your agency's potential? Check out our Agency Blueprint. Designed for agency owners like you, our Agency Blueprint helps you uncover growth opportunities, tackle obstacles, and craft a customized blueprint for your agency's success.

Would you like access to our advanced agency training for FREE? https://www.agencymastery360.com/training Is your agency's strategy diversified enough to withstand sudden algorithm changes? Today's featured guest—an SEO veteran—learned this the hard way. While he focused on client work, his own website grew outdated. Then one Google update hit and overnight his agency lost 80% of its organic traffic, its main source of leads. The agency eventually recovered, but not without leaving him with a powerful lesson: always invest in the three pillars of growth. In this episode, he shares his chaotic first encounter with SEO, the biggest lessons from a long career in the industry, and the “superpower” that helps him better understand and adapt to algorithm shifts. Chris Raulf is the founder of Boulder SEO Marketing and Chris Raulf SEO & AI Consulting. With decades of experience in SEO, dating back to before Google was even called Google, Chris specializes in hyper-focused SEO and content marketing strategies. He's worked with clients from local startups to major national brands, helping them dominate organic search. Fun fact: Chris is dyslexic and considers it his SEO superpower. In this episode, we'll discuss: The big mistake that led him to a career in SEO. The day 80% of his organic traffic disappeared. Why he now invests in the three pillars of growth. Subscribe Apple | Spotify | iHeart Radio Sponsors and Resources This episode is brought to you by Wix Studio: If you're leveling up your team and your client experience, your site builder should keep up too. That's why successful agencies use Wix Studio — built to adapt the way your agency does: AI-powered site mapping, responsive design, flexible workflows, and scalable CMS tools so you spend less on plugins and more on growth. Ready to design faster and smarter? Go to wix.com/studio to get started. From Big Mistake to a Full-Blown Career in SEO Chris has been in the SEO game since before most of us knew it was a thing. Back in 1995, while working in Switzerland for an American company, he watched the birth of the search engine era. The US branch of the company created something called a “website” and hardcoded German text as images on it. His first “SEO problem” was figuring out how search engines could read that German text. That curiosity grew into a passion, and eventually a full-blown career. Fast forward to today, Boulder SEO Marketing is a hyper-focused SEO agency specializing in content strategies that win. But even with all that experience, Chris learned the hard way that no one is safe from the wrath of a Google core update. The Day Organic Traffic Disappeared In 2021, business was booming. Leads were rolling in purely from organic search. Then, overnight, a Google core algorithm update wiped out about 80% of their organic traffic. Why did this happen? Outdated content. Their own site had gone stale while they focused on client work. For an agency that relied almost entirely on inbound search leads, it was like someone padlocked the front door. Chris could have panicked, but after the initial shock, he collected himself and treated this crisis as an opportunity. He gave himself one weekend to create a comeback plan. The result was a proprietary approach he calls Micro SEO Strategies—laser-targeted content plays designed to quickly recover rankings and leads. Two Pages That Saved the Agency Chris rebuilt their inbound engine with just two key pieces of content: A location page targeting “Denver SEO” that shot straight to #1 in local search and started generating leads almost immediately. An SEO packages guide that became a go-to national resource for that search term, pulling in high-quality leads from across the U.S. Within 3–4 weeks, the phones were ringing again. Inbound was back. And Chris walked away with a hard-earned reminder—never let your own marketing go stale. Don't Put All Your Eggs in Google's Basket If you're getting all your leads from one channel, you're on borrowed land. Whether it's Google, Facebook, or any single source, an algorithm tweak or platform change can crush your lead flow overnight. Jason's advice on this is to build three pillars: Inbound (like SEO and content) Outbound (targeted outreach and prospecting) Strategic partnerships (referrals, collabs, and networks) That way, if one pillar crumbles, your agency can survive. Turning Dyslexia into a Superpower Like anyone who's struggled with dyslexia (like Jason, for instance) Chris had a hard time in school. Nowadays, however, he no longer sees it as a weakness and instead credits it with his ability to “feel” the algorithm and see patterns others might miss. It's helped him build a thriving agency, one that makes most of its money from content. Both agreed, what once felt like a setback in school became an entrepreneurial advantage later in life. Do You Want to Transform Your Agency from a Liability to an Asset? Looking to dig deeper into your agency's potential? Check out our Agency Blueprint. Designed for agency owners like you, our Agency Blueprint helps you uncover growth opportunities, tackle obstacles, and craft a customized blueprint for your agency's success.

Would you like access to our advanced agency training for FREE? https://www.agencymastery360.com/training Would you ever run two agencies at once? What if splitting your brand was the smartest way to protect and grow both? Today's featured guest spotted a booming opportunity in a regulated market—but knew that advertising those services alongside his work for conservative and tech clients could hurt his existing agency. His solution? Launch a separate brand. The move paid off as the regulated market surged during the pandemic. He shares what it's like to manage rapid growth, why he built a true people-first culture from day one, and how he stays optimistic even when agency life gets messy. Greg Peters is the founder of 4B Marketing and Hybrid Marketing in Denver, Colorado. 4B focuses on tech, energy, and government sectors, while Hybrid serves regulated markets—most notably the cannabis industry. A former tech sales pro turned serial entrepreneur, Greg's journey into agency ownership may have been accidental, but what's not accidental is how quickly he scaled. They hit $1M in revenue in their second year — and his people-first philosophy became the secret weapon behind his rapid growth. In this episode, we'll discuss: Why he chose to run two agencies. Growing to $1 million in just two years. Growing during the pandemic thanks to a controversial niche. Staying positive when agency life gets messy. Subscribe Apple | Spotify | iHeart Radio Sponsors and Resources E2M Solutions: Today's episode of the Smart Agency Masterclass is sponsored by E2M Solutions, a web design, and development agency that has provided white-label services for the past 10 years to agencies all over the world. Check out e2msolutions.com/smartagency and get 10% off for the first three months of service. Running Two Agencies for Two Very Different Worlds Greg didn't set out to run two agencies. The split happened because of the cannabis side of the business. 4B's conservative government and tech clients wouldn't exactly appreciate a cannabis case study on the homepage. So Hybrid was born to serve the regulated, fast-growing cannabis market without spooking the more traditional side. This approach also positioned both agencies to thrive in their respective niches without brand confusion. For agency owners wondering when is it time to create new brands, separate brands aren't always about chasing new markets—they can be about protecting existing ones. If your positioning or client mix creates brand tension, a spin-off can give you room to grow in both spaces. From Accidental Agency Owner to $1M in Two Years Greg's path was a mix of corporate burnout and entrepreneurial curiosity. After years in tech sales and a detour into solar energy, he realized the big-company grind wasn't for him. So he launched a go-to-market consultancy for telecom.. Once creative work started flowing in—and his team started growing—he embraced the agency model. The real jump happened when he let go. In year two, Greg went from $600K to $1M by putting the right people in the right seats and empowering them to run their own “business units” within the agency. This is a shift most agency owners agree is vital to see true growth. However, it's usually uncomfortable and it takes time to make the decision to go all in. Greg made the leap quickly inspired by Richard Branson's philosophy in The Virgin Way. Years before starting the agency and as he read the book, he had already decided his mantra as a business owner should be putting people first and thus the people will put the client first. The result was a faster scale without burning out. The Pandemic Pivot: Cannabis Keeps Growing While many agencies hit pause in 2020, Greg's cannabis clients went into overdrive. With consumers stuck at home (and shopping local), demand spiked. That meant more competition, and suddenly the different cannabis providers needed more marketing to stand out. Hybrid Marketing doubled down on local search, “near me” campaigns, and brand differentiation—keeping clients top-of-mind while the industry boomed. For agency owners, this is a masterclass in following the growth. Greg didn't predict cannabis would save the year, but he positioned his agency to move quickly when the opportunity showed up. Sometimes the best growth strategy is staying close to your clients' markets and being ready to ride the wave. When the Org Chart Backfires Not every growth move is a win. One of Greg's biggest lessons came from rolling out an org chart he thought would streamline things—only to find it created confusion for clients and tension among the team. It was a gut punch, but also a turning point. He learned to check himself and remember this is only his first agency and there's still much to learn. Luckily, he was quick to strip out the toxicity created by that moment because culture eats strategy for breakfast. The goal isn't just to have a structure, it's to have one that actually works for your team and your clients. Staying Positive When Agency Life Gets Messy Greg has always naturally found himself on the more optimistic side of life. But his optimism isn't naive—it's built on grit, a strong support system, and relentless curiosity. From his wife's early encouragement (“It'll be okay,” even when the bank account said otherwise) to his own belief in learning every day, Greg credits mindset as much as skill for his success. For Greg, your network truly is your net worth and the more you can talk to people with the aim of creating a positive impact—whether that is on the financial business or helping somebody find a job or connecting them to a resource that'll help them—you put a lot of good stuff out into the universe without expectation, you'll get it back. Finally, curiosity is the most valuable trait an agency owner can have. Read widely, talk to people in and outside your industry, and always be asking, “What if?” It's that curiosity that fuels innovation, keeps you ahead of trends, and helps you navigate the inevitable ups and downs. Do You Want to Transform Your Agency from a Liability to an Asset? Looking to dig deeper into your agency's potential? Check out our Agency Blueprint. Designed for agency owners like you, our Agency Blueprint helps you uncover growth opportunities, tackle obstacles, and craft a customized blueprint for your agency's success.

Would you like access to our advanced agency training for FREE? https://www.agencymastery360.com/training Most agency owners don't wake up dreaming about selling. You want freedom, better clients, and to stop living in Slack at 2 a.m. But here's the truth: The same moves that make your agency attractive to a buyer are the ones that give you freedom as an owner. I built and sold an 8-figure agency and bought 10 more and now I'm sharing 8 elements of a sellable, scalable agency. Whether you ever sell or not, these are the foundations that make your shop stronger. Let's break them down. 1. Stop Being the Accidental Owner Most of us stumbled into agency life. That's fun—but long-term it's not a strategy. You've got to shift from “operator” to agency CEO, and that means: Setting and communicating vision (over and over). Coaching your leadership team, not everyone. Knowing your numbers. Being the face of the agency. Building strategic relationships. When your team knows where you're going, you stop being the bottleneck. 2. Build More Than Referrals Referrals are great, but if 90% of your deals are coming from “word of mouth,” you've got a problem. Getting most of your leads from any singular channel is usually a red flag. When I'm looking at buying  a business, one of the first things I'll ask is how many channels they have for building their pipeline, how can I increase those channels and make them more predictable. If I'm looking at this, you as the agency owners and CEO should too. I recommend the three-legged stool: inbound, outbound, and strategic partnerships. When you've got multiple reliable channels, downturns don't crush you. That's how my agency grew through 9/11, '08, and even COVID. 3. Predictable Revenue = Power Buyers want to know: can we forecast revenue six months out? That means retainers, long-term contracts, and expanding client accounts. If you land a $20k/month retainer, your mindset should be: “How can I build this account over time to grow it to $100k?” And don't just deliver results—show them wins constantly. Stickiness comes from proof, community, and processes that make leaving painful. 4. Don't Let a Whale Sink You If one client is 20%+ of your revenue, you're on thin ice. Does this mean that you should say no to big clients? Heck no. Take the whale and then go get more. Turn today's whales into tomorrow's minnows by leveling up your client base. 5. Leadership That Runs Without You If your agency can't grow while you're gone for six months, you don't have a business—you have a job. Owners shouldn't be doing marketing, sales, or any type of delivery. A-players cost more, but they 10x the results and give you your life back. Your job isn't to run projects, sales, or delivery—it's to lead the leaders. 6. Profitability Isn't Optional Know your EBITDA. If you're not profitable and reinvesting, you're stalling. And if you don't have a compelling growth story (even how you're leveraging AI), buyers—and clients—will pass. 7. Track KPIs Like a Pro If you can't instantly tell me your close rate, show-up rate, or pipeline health, that's a problem. Great agencies have dashboards, not excuses. 8. Get Audited Financials (Every Year) I've chatted with agency owners who thought they were making $1M profit—but after an audit, it was half that. Multiples dropped, deals crumbled. Don't let your “guesswork” numbers cost you millions. Get audited, stay real. Before You Even Think About Selling… Don't sell unless you know what's next. Plenty of agency owners with 7-figure profits and freedom think they're “done,” only to end up depressed because they tied their identity to the agency. Fix what you don't like. Keep what works. Only exit when you're moving toward something you actually want. What To Do Next If you're serious about building an agency that gives you freedom (and the option to sell someday), start here: Agency Valuation Calculator. See what your agency's really worth today. Agency Playbook. Jason's 8-system framework to shift from operator to CEO. Agency Blueprint. Get a personalized roadmap to spot value gaps and growth opportunities.

Would you like access to our advanced agency training for FREE? https://www.agencymastery360.com/training What happens when the agency you've built is just… stuck? Or when you hit a revenue ceiling, lose a major client, and start wondering if you've been playing the wrong game entirely? Those moments either break you or become the pivot points that redefine everything. In this episode, you'll hear from an agency owner who's lived through the grind growing his agency from scratch, riding out recessions, choosing a niche that would help him get out of “no man's land”. He'll discuss the strategic bet that broke through plateaus, why he still refuses to hire a COO, and the million-dollar risk that could have sunk him but ended up being a worthwhile bet on his vision. Alex Membrillo is the founder and CEO of Cardinal Digital Marketing, a 100-person specialist agency in healthcare performance marketing. Based in Atlanta, Alex launched Cardinal 16 years ago fresh out of college driven by equal parts ambition and desperation. Over the years, he's navigated economic downturns, client churn, plateaus, and tough hiring markets, ultimately transforming it from a generalist digital shop into a niche powerhouse serving multi-site medical and dental groups nationwide. In this episode, we'll discuss: Riding out recessions. Breaking plateaus and choosing a niche. Why he still prefers not hiring a COO. Alex's million-dollar bet on himself. Subscribe Apple | Spotify | iHeart Radio Sponsors and Resources This episode is brought to you by Wix Studio: If you're leveling up your team and your client experience, your site builder should keep up too. That's why successful agencies use Wix Studio — built to adapt the way your agency does: AI-powered site mapping, responsive design, flexible workflows, and scalable CMS tools so you spend less on plugins and more on growth. Ready to design faster and smarter? Go to wix.com/studio to get started. Starting from Scratch (and a Hospital Room) Alex didn't start Cardinal with a polished business plan or a stack of VC cash — he started it the day after his first child was born. After watching his dad's business nearly collapse thanks to a terrible SEO agency, Alex vowed to do better. With a fraternity brother on board and the confidence of having built a website once at sixteen, they left the hospital, started cold-calling local businesses, and selling websites. That first chapter didn't exactly go as planned. The websites flopped, but an SEO win for a kayak tour company gave them the confidence (and proof) they needed to double down on search. From there, they expanded into paid ads and built a reputation on a simple promise: If we suck, we'll give you your money back. In the wild west of 2009 SEO, when big agencies were scrambling to go “digital” overnight, this direct, performance-focused approach gave them an edge. Riding Out Recessions & Staying Hands-On Recessions shaped Alex's early leadership style. In 2009, big agencies were struggling, but lean, hungry digital-first shops could move faster and win clients. That meant Alex was doing it all—account managing 20 clients, selling new business, running QuickBooks, and hiring unpaid interns just to keep things moving. In those early days, generalists are gold. If you're too small for deep specialization, having people who can juggle SEO, PPC, and client management was critical. Even now, with a bigger team, Alex stays close to clients—spending hours each week on calls. To him, the job never ends, and the size of the clients is the only thing that's changed thus far. Hence, staying in the work keeps his perspective sharp. Breaking Plateaus by Choosing a Niche By 2016, Cardinal had hit a wall at around $3.5M in revenue. At that stage, he realized what he had wasn't really a business. You're just a very good operator that probably has one or two big clients. The problem is that if those clients leave, as it happened to him when he was around $4 million, then you're down to zero again. They'd grown by targeting four sectors—higher ed, home services, healthcare, and legal—which did help propel the agency. However, growth stalled again at $7–8M. Then COVID hit, and Alex decided to stop playing the “variety” game. Inspired by Jim Collins' Hedgehog Concept, he asked: What can we be the best in the world at? What drives our economic engine? What do we actually love doing? The answer was healthcare. They rebranded, rewrote their site, published thought leadership, and even released a book to claim their spot in the niche. They didn't fire old clients—they just stopped marketing to non-healthcare prospects and let those accounts naturally roll off. Alex does wish he would've also kept a bit of focus on higher ed, another sector where the agency really shined. Nonetheless, the bet paid off: a laser focus on healthcare has helped them grow faster, build deeper expertise, and win larger multi-site provider clients. Why Alex Still Doesn't Have a COO Alex firmly believes you can grow out of most problems, so every time he felt the agency was stuck, he went right back to improving their marketing, getting bigger clients, and hiring talented people. It's a simple formula that has kept working for him throughout the years. However, here's where he breaks from conventional wisdom: even at 100+ employees, Cardinal has no head of operations or finance. Everyone, including him, is billable. “I've made the mistake 83 times of listening to experts who say ‘Go hire a COO,'” Alex says. In his view, it's just not worth it at that point in your growth. “Do as much as you can as the owner. Have all departments report to you. You don't need middle management pushing paper. You need smart, talented people actually doing the work.” That lean structure only works if you market hard and keep new business flowing. It gives you the freedom to walk away from bad-fit clients and double down on growth opportunities. AI as Your Board of Advisors Agency owners like Alex, who see no need to hire a COO or CMO while they can still manage things themselves, can now turn to AI as a resourceful solution, treating it like an in-house advisory board. Like fellow agency owner Chris Dreyer—who built custom GPTs for CFO and COO roles and used AI to better understand the business acquisition process—Alex is now considering feeding his P&L and monthly reports into AI to spot trends, explain fluctuations, and even validate assumptions. The takeaway: you don't need expensive consultants or bloated leadership teams to get strategic insight. With the right prompts, you can cut through the noise and focus on execution, the part AI can't do for you (yet). The Million-Dollar Bet on Himself One of Alex's biggest turning points came when he bought out his co-founder. His partner had lost interest in client work, and Alex saw no way forward without full control. After a year of negotiation, he signed a deal that left him $1M in debt. For three years, he funneled $35,000 a month from profits to pay it off, losing sleep and enduring massive stress. In hindsight, it was worth it, but it took “probably 30 years off my life,” Alex says. Still, it was a defining moment—proving to himself he was willing to bet big on his own vision. Thought Leadership as a Growth Engine Cardinal's healthcare niche dominance didn't just happen—it was engineered. Alex leveraged thought leadership to own the space. From content and events to industry-specific messaging, they positioned themselves as the go-to choice for multi-site healthcare providers. He's quick to point out this approach has pros and cons, but if you want his playbook, he's happy to share it—just reach out on LinkedIn. Do You Want to Transform Your Agency from a Liability to an Asset? Looking to dig deeper into your agency's potential? Check out our Agency Blueprint. Designed for agency owners like you, our Agency Blueprint helps you uncover growth opportunities, tackle obstacles, and craft a customized blueprint for your agency's success.

Would you like access to our advanced agency training for FREE? https://www.agencymastery360.com/training Are you growing your agency with the goal of selling it one day? More importantly, are you taking the right steps now to ensure it's actually worth what you think it is? Today's featured guest has built and sold multiple agencies over the years, gaining hard-earned insights into the process. He shares what you need to know to prepare your agency for sale, the potential pitfalls and opportunities with non-competes and earnouts, and whether hiring a broker is really worth it. If selling your agency is on your horizon, or even just a long-term possibility, this episode is packed with practical advice to help you maximize your valuation and avoid costly mistakes. Sean Hakes has been building and selling digital marketing agencies since the early 2000's back when ‘SEO' wasn't a household term and websites were still coded in tables.. He's grown agencies from small side hustles into multi-million-dollar operations, navigated multiple acquisitions, and learned the hard way how to structure a deal and when to walk away. In this episode, we'll discuss: Getting savvier for his second agency sale. Not taking the highest bid, but picking the right buyer. Getting back to the game after a restrictive non-compete. Buying back his old agency. Subscribe Apple | Spotify | iHeart Radio Sponsors and Resources E2M Solutions: Today's episode of the Smart Agency Masterclass is sponsored by E2M Solutions, a web design, and development agency that has provided white-label services for the past 10 years to agencies all over the world. Check out e2msolutions.com/smartagency and get 10% off for the first three months of service. How a Major Mistake Started His Agency Journey Most agency owners start by accident, but in Sean's case, he accidentally broke a website. While working for another company, he took down their site and had to learn HTML on the fly to fix it. That crash course turned into a curiosity for web design, which turned into a small SEO and design shop in Denver around 2001–2002, back when keyword stuffing and white text on a white background actually worked. Sean's first agency wasn't huge—three or four people, a few hundred grand in revenue—but their search visibility was strong. That alone was enough to attract an out-of-state buyer. The deal wasn't life-changing money, and looking back he thinks (since he didn't know anything about valuations) that he probably gave it away, but it was enough to get Sean hooked on the idea of building, growing, and eventually selling agencies. The “Do It Better” Second Act After dabbling in landscaping, trucking, and even diamond brokering businesses following the sale of his first agency, Sean realized marketing was still his zone of genius. This time, he teamed up with a sales-savvy partner. Sean handled operations; his partner brought in a big book of business. That agency scaled to about $3 million in revenue before they decided to sell—but not before learning a hard truth about valuations: top-line revenue doesn't mean much without profit. When they first went to a broker, they were shocked to get a $100k valuation. Why so low? No recurring contracts, thin margins, and too much discretionary spending. So they spent the next year tightening up—signing contracts, cutting waste, and boosting profit. It's a lesson many agency owners dreaming of selling at some point have to learn. You may think that making millions in topline revenue means your business is worth a lot, and then you learn there are many factors that determine that price, and profit is a pretty big one in the agency space. Understanding Deal Structures (and Picking the Right Buyer) The second sale was a much more strategic process. Sean and his partner used a broker, entertained multiple offers, and discovered there are a million ways to structure a deal. The one they chose was about half cash up front, with the rest split between owner financing and an earnout. Here's the kicker: they didn't take the highest bid. Instead, they picked a private equity group that specialized in their industry and cared about their team and clients. They passed on flashier offers, like one from a New York club owner, because they valued long-term success over a quick payday. They also learned brokers are very expensive. In fact, if he could do it all over again with the knowledge he has now, Sean wouldn't use a broker. Playing the Earnout Game (and Winning It) Earnouts can be a trap, designed to look great on paper but structured so you'll never hit the target. Sean and his partner weren't having it. They stayed on the sales team, volunteered their time, and treated the earnout like a commission plan they could win. The trick for them was conservative projections. Instead of promising buyers a wild 50–100% growth rate (and setting themselves up to miss), they targeted a steady 10% growth. This set the earnout bar at a realistic level—and they smashed it. They even negotiated out their broker's cut of the earnout once they knew they'd hit it, keeping 100% of the upside. From Restrictive Non-Competes to Freedom Deals Sean's second agency sale came with a brutal seven-year non-compete—likely unenforceable, but restrictive enough to stress him out. Five years in, low on reserves, he approached the buyer with a proposal: let him start another company without poaching their clients. Instead of a fight, they offered to partner with him, gave their blessing, and even returned his old domains. That experience stood in stark contrast to another sale where the non-compete was simply, “Stay out of our 30-mile radius.” Takeaway: Non-compete terms can vary wildly. Negotiate them up front, and remember that relationships matter long after the ink is dry. The Cashless Merger That Led to a Full Cash Exit In 2011, Sean started another agency, Altitude. Five years later, he merged it with another company in a cashless deal to boost revenue and valuation. Within a year, an unexpected buyer came along with a full-multiple, all-cash offer—and only wanted one person to stay on. Sean took the deal, pocketed the money, and moved to the beach in South Carolina to run a fishing charter. “The old saying about boats, being happiest when buying and selling them, is true,” he laughs—but the experience checked a personal dream off his list. Buying Back His Old Agency In a very full-circle moment, the company that had bought Sean's agency in an earlier deal came back to him in trouble. Mismanagement, bad outsourcing, and unhappy clients had turned it into a sinking ship. Sean and his new partner jumped on the opportunity, bought it back for a fraction of what they'd sold it for, rehired many of the original team, and turned it around within months. Sometimes the best acquisition target is one you already know inside and out—especially if you can buy it back at a discount and restore its former glory. Sean's Advice to Agency Owners Thinking About a Sale Don't take the first “decent” offer. The buyer pool is bigger than you think—negotiate. Be strategic with brokers. Great ones exist, but remember that they get paid if you sell, so their advice may be biased. Control your earnout terms. Conservative projections give you room to exceed expectations and actually cash in. Relationships last longer than deals. Today's buyer could be tomorrow's partner — or seller. Do You Want to Transform Your Agency from a Liability to an Asset? Looking to dig deeper into your agency's potential? Check out our Agency Blueprint. Designed for agency owners like you, our Agency Blueprint helps you uncover growth opportunities, tackle obstacles, and craft a customized blueprint for your agency's success.

Would you like access to our advanced agency training for FREE? https://www.agencymastery360.com/training What happens when you stop chasing $30K projects and start solving real problems for smaller clients in a way that actually works? Today's featured guest had been building $32,000 websites for mid-market companies. On paper, it looked like success. But in reality, he felt stuck—unfulfilled and back in a corporate-style grind that didn't align with the kind of work or life he truly wanted. When he took a step back, he realized something important: the clients he really wanted to serve were already reaching out. These were smaller, $300K businesses with many of the same challenges agencies see across the board—but without the bloated complexity. So he made a bold pivot. He simplified his offer, created a productized service, and returned to his roots—helping people in a way that felt meaningful, scalable, and sustainable. The result? Less stress, more impact, and a business model built around freedom, not friction. Nate Freedman is the founder of TechPro Marketing and creator of MSP Sites, a productized service built specifically for Managed IT Service Providers. After years of working in high-ticket agency engagements, Nate made a bold pivot—focusing on volume, automation, and scalable coaching for small IT firms. That shift helped him grow from a $20K/month agency to a $2.5M+ business serving over 100 clients with a tight, dialed-in model. We'll explore his early missteps, the aha moment that changed everything, and the system he built to serve a niche audience at scale—without losing his soul. In this episode, we'll discuss: Pivoting to MPSs as the perfect fit. Creating a low-ticket offer. Productizing with a purpose. Subscribe Apple | Spotify | iHeart Radio Sponsors and Resources This episode is brought to you by Wix Studio: If you're leveling up your team and your client experience, your site builder should keep up too. That's why successful agencies use Wix Studio — built to adapt the way your agency does: AI-powered site mapping, responsive design, flexible workflows, and scalable CMS tools so you spend less on plugins and more on growth. Ready to design faster and smarter? Go to wix.com/studio to get started. Impostor Syndrome and the Accidental CEO Nate's background wasn't in marketing strategy or enterprise consulting. He was a self-taught internet nerd who cut his teeth writing affiliate articles and selling photo recovery software online. He studied accounting, not realizing when he picked that career that being an online marketer was an option. Right out of college, his first job was at an accounting firm, an experience he promptly hated. He felt exposed and like a fish out of water. This is a feeling he recognized years later when, the more his agency took on large, complex clients like Salesforce, the more he felt like a fraud. He was working with large corporations and felt like an impostor. It just wasn't the right fit for him. “I was putting on a kind of a facade. Like, I was pretending to be someone I wasn't… and it just wasn't me.” That realization drove Nate back to his roots: helping people who reminded him of himself. From Big Clients to Bigger Misalignment Nate didn't start small. Like many digital agency owners, his early focus was on winning big projects—$10K, $20K, even $32K website and marketing packages. And sure, those checks looked great at first… until a very good client sent him the dreaded email: “Nate, when are we going to generate leads from this?” That one question—posed by a well-meaning client already $32K in—flipped the switch. Nate realized that delivering work isn't the same as delivering results. The more he moved upmarket, the more he felt like he was back in the corporate world he hated. High-maintenance clients. Long sales cycles. No real alignment. He wasn't building relationships. He was building a façade. Finding His People: MSPs as the Perfect Fit Nate's breakthrough came when he niched down into the MSP (Managed Service Provider) space. These were former tech guys turned business owners—scrappy, smart, and stuck in the same ways agency owners often are. They didn't need $30K marketing retainers. They needed help generating leads, converting visitors, and staying in business. Nate made a gutsy move. He ditched his high-ticket proposals and started sending BombBomb videos to leads who had previously ghosted him: “You turned down my $20,352 proposal. Here's my new one: $2,000 a month, and I'll help you generate leads. I don't even know exactly what I'll do yet. I just want to help you grow.” That transparency worked. Five early adopters signed on, and Nate never looked back. Scaling a Low-Ticket, High-Impact Model What started as a simplified offer became a flywheel. Over seven years, Nate scaled his agency to over 100 monthly clients, all paying around $4,200/month. But growth at that level brings churn. With just 3% monthly churn, he'd have to invest more on sales and onboarding and close three new clients a month just to break even. However, focusing on growing this way meant turning away 75% of leads who were not at least $1 million in revenue that could afford the expense. And most of the businesses reaching out to his agency were at 200K-300K. Nate felt he could service those clients without a big investment in human resources. This sparked the next evolution: MSP Sites. The new offer targeted those MSPs doing $200K–$300K/year. These folks couldn't pay $4K/month… but they desperately needed help. So Nate reverse-engineered a low-cost, high-value offer that started at $200/month and eventually grew to include: Custom-designed websites Human chat agents CRM and booking automations On-demand courses and live office hours Weekly coaching and a client-only community He went from being “just another agency” to becoming an all-in-one marketing partner for small MSPs—at a price they could actually say “hell yes” to. Productizing with Purpose: Lessons from the Pivot This shift to a productized offer came with unexpected lessons, as Nate was confronted with a question from his past work making $32K websites or a $200 website: “Where are the leads?” He realized that whether he was going after the high end or low end of the market, he still had to provide an end result for clients. Low ticket doesn't mean low impact. He has to answer that question while still providing an affordable service, so he started layering in automation, coaching, and a structured experience This slightly raised the price to $300/month, but clients not felt like they were part of a premium program. Nate wanted to help clients not just have a website, but also generate leads, drive traffic, and close the deal. By adding live calls, email support, and a live event, Nate turned MSP Sites into more than a tool—it became a tribe. Once the service was upgraded and clients could get their website set up even faster, the problem was that now they all looked the same. Nate knew his clients deserved better, so he removed the one-click deploy and now ensures each website is custom-designed to look amazing. Of course, this also led to a rise of the set up fee, but clients were more than happy to pay for a better design. Finally, on-demand courses and live office hours were the finishing touch for his new offer and he was finally helping clients much more and building the business he really enjoys. Market Share > Margins (When You're Playing the Long Game) At some point, most agency owners fantasize about selling. Nate's no different—but he's thinking a few moves ahead. Instead of relying on private equity, his bet is on strategic acquisition by a larger company in his own niche. “The best multiple I'm going to get is from someone who wants more market share.” That's why he's focused on volume at the low end. Every small client is a slice of market share. And if you can build community, coaching, and brand loyalty into your offer, you're not just a service provider—you're infrastructure. The Next Frontier: Launching a Mastermind With 300+ paying clients, Nate's building something many agency owners should be thinking about but don't: a mastermind for your niche. Why? Because clients already trust you. They're already getting value. And when you get them in a room together—virtually or physically—magic happens. Better yet, Nate doesn't need to be the guru. The best masterminds don't revolve around one person—they're facilitated, not taught. When the room is full of practitioners, the value is in the conversations. Do Right By People (and You'll Win) Scaling isn't just about tech, pricing models, or marketing hacks. It's about people. Nate credits a huge part of his growth to partnering with E2M Solutions, which removed the HR complexity of managing a dev team in-house. More importantly, it aligned with his core value: “Do right by people. If you do that, no one's going to say anything bad about you. Even when you make mistakes.” It's simple, but in a crowded industry full of overpromising and under-delivering, that integrity stands out—and scales. Do You Want to Transform Your Agency from a Liability to an Asset? Looking to dig deeper into your agency's potential? Check out our Agency Blueprint. Designed for agency owners like you, our Agency Blueprint helps you uncover growth opportunities, tackle obstacles, and craft a customized blueprint for your agency's success.

Would you like access to our advanced agency training for FREE? https://www.agencymastery360.com/training Are you stuck chasing new clients while ignoring the goldmine in your past customer list? Does your agency feast on projects but starve for predictable revenue? Today's featured guest knows what it's like to hit a growth ceiling and being tired of the one-and-done client hamster wheel. He shares how he pivoted his agency after becoming a HubSpot partner, why he turned to project-based work after customer habits changed following the pandemic, and how he got out of the dreaded “no man's land”. Eric Baum is the CEO and founder of Bluleadz, a HubSpot Onboarding and Implementation Agency dedicated to transforming the way companies market, sell, and service their customers through the power of the HubSpot platform. He'll discuss his cash flow challenges, pricing mistakes that almost tanked the business, and how EOS helped him escape “no man's land.” If you're stuck in the fulfillment hamster wheel or scaling past $5M feels like pushing a boulder uphill... listen up. In this episode, we'll discuss: Reinventing his agency as a HubSpot partner. The real scaling struggle: cash flow. Why project-based doesn't mean profitless. Strategic partnerships are the future. Subscribe Apple | Spotify | iHeart Radio Sponsors and Resources E2M Solutions: Today's episode of the Smart Agency Masterclass is sponsored by E2M Solutions, a web design, and development agency that has provided white-label services for the past 10 years to agencies all over the world. Check out e2msolutions.com/smartagency and get 10% off for the first three months of service. Accidental Founder, Intentional CEO Back in the Yellow Pages era, Eric was running two service-based franchises and needed a better way to market them. He brought marketing in-house for PPC, SEO, web dev, and that hire didn't just turn things around. It turned into a new business. Fast-forward a few months, and other franchise owners across the country started asking for help. Eric spun that in-house team into an agency, and had 50 clients out of the gate. As many owners before have admitted to, Eric started out charging way too low—$250 to $500/month. “I don't know how I didn't go broke right out of the gate,” he laughs. And if you've ever undercharged in the early days, you'll feel that one deep in your soul. Reinventing the Agency (and Himself) Around HubSpot The turning point came when Eric discovered HubSpot and pivoted Bluleadz to become a certified partner. That's when the “real” agency began, as he started to study the industry and figure out what he had to do to be profitable, take care of his team, and do it without necessarily doing all the sales work all the time. From there, Eric leaned into strategy, profitability, and systems. He stopped trying to be the everything guy and started building an agency that didn't need him in the trenches every day. Fifteen years later, his agency isn't just thriving. It's structured, profitable, and on track to hit 8 figures. Life in “No Man's Land” – The $1M to $5M Plateau After fifteen years in the industry and getting closer to the eight-figure mark, one of the things that most surprised Eric was getting stuck in the ugly middle: the zone between $1M and $5M where a lot of agency dreams go to die. Many call it “no man's land,” and if you've been there, you know the pain. “It was up, down, up, down,” he says. “I'd grow, then lose key employees. Revenue would spike, then tank. I kept asking, ‘What am I doing wrong?'” The answer: a lack of structure. So about nine years ago, Eric implemented EOS (Entrepreneurial Operating System). That gave his agency the foundation it needed—vision, accountability, and a cadence to scale. It didn't fix everything overnight, but it got the business out of reaction mode and into growth mode. The Real Scaling Struggle: Cash Flow Even with all that success, Eric's biggest constraint today isn't clients or talent. It's cash. In the agency world, sometimes you can grow so fast that you can actually outpace your ability to fund it. As Eric explains, “Receivables stack up. You can't hire, build, or invest without the cash reserves in place to hit the down terms.” For instance, just this year his agency was down 20% compared to last year because of all the uncertainty for businesses. Sound familiar? So far, Eric's solution has been airtight payment terms. They moved away from waiting on client deliverables and toward milestone-based billing. They typically charge: 50% upfront 25% after month one 25% at month two or fixed date Not based on deliverables. Based on time. Why? Because waiting on clients kills momentum (and your margin). “We used to wait months to get that final 50%. Now we're often 100% paid before a project is even done.” Moral of the story? Set clear terms and stop letting clients hold your agency hostage. Project-Based Doesn't Mean Profitless If You Structure It Right Five years ago, 85% of Bluleadz's revenue came from retainers. Then COVID hit. Buying behavior shifted fast. Clients wanted results without long-term commitments. So Eric pivoted hard into project work—today, 80–85% of their revenue comes from one-off HubSpot onboarding and implementation projects. That means 50–75 new customers per month, each on 30 to 90-day timelines. The lesson: project-based doesn't have to mean chaos - if you systemize delivery and payment. However, Eric does admit he and his team had been failing to recapture clients for a second or third project. “We were just focused on getting new clients through the door.” Instead of nurturing clients post-delivery, they handed off the project and moved on. Meanwhile, past clients drifted—only to come back a year or two later in total chaos saying, “We lost our HubSpot guy. Can you help?” The opportunity cost was massive. They are currently working on recapturing these relationships. By reselling past clients, his agency could double or triple revenue in a year. The Triple-Team Model: Sales, CSM, Implementation In their efforts to start creating more lifetime value for customers, Eric's agency introduced Customer Success Managers (CSMs)—not just to check in, but to hunt for value. CSMs dig into each client's needs post-project, surface upsell or cross-sell opportunities, and feed them back to the sales team. Now they're farming the base, increasing LTV, and stacking wins without chasing cold leads. This third new role adds a new layer to his team's structure, which he now breaks down as: Salespeople close net-new deals and join key milestone calls.           Implementation Specialists own delivery and are the client's main point of contact. CSMs sit above delivery, watching for success gaps, retention issues, and upsell opportunities. “Salespeople are hunters, not farmers. Trying to make them farm didn't work. So we changed the model.” This layered structure gives clients clarity, keeps teams focused, and ensures no growth opportunity slips through the cracks. Strategic Partnerships Are the Future Another key reason Bluleadz is scaling so quickly is partnerships. They're one of HubSpot's top onboarding partners, and at one point this partnership drove most of his agency's net new leads. More recently, however, as they start to expand their efforts to engage past clients, only 40% of their leads come from HubSpot, while 30% comes from existing customers, and another 30% from their inbound marketing efforts, other strategic partners, and referrals. This makes for a more balanced pipeline: “Inbound, outbound, and strategic partnerships”. Those are the three pillars in the Playbook. You've got ‘em dialed in. As for Eric, he's all in on strategic partnerships, which he considers to be the way of the future. The One Thing Eric Would Do Differently If he could go back and give his younger self advice on agency ownership, Eric would say “Let go faster.” He held on too long to sales, finance, client services… all of it. And every time he finally let go, the agency grew again. Today, Eric has zero departmental responsibilities. His job is vision, strategy, and leadership—and it's paying off. Do You Want to Transform Your Agency from a Liability to an Asset? Looking to dig deeper into your agency's potential? Check out our Agency Blueprint. Designed for agency owners like you, our Agency Blueprint helps you uncover growth opportunities, tackle obstacles, and craft a customized blueprint for your agency's success.

Would you like access to our advanced agency training for FREE? https://www.agencymastery360.com/training Are you still running your agency like it's 2010? You know the setup: rigid roles, top-down management, a “just get it done” culture. If that sounds like your agency, chances are you're the bottleneck. You're stuck in the weeds, making every single decision, dealing with high churn, and wondering why output is low despite how hard everyone's working. This is the story for most agency owners at the 7-figure stage. But the agencies scaling fastest today have evolved—and we're breaking down exactly how. Why Most Agencies Get Stuck Most agency owners didn't plan to be CEOs. You were good at strategy, sales, design, or delivery. Then suddenly—boom—you're the boss. Now the team looks to you for every decision, every review, every answer. The problem isn't your team. It's the lack of vision. When there's no clear direction, your team can't lead themselves—because they don't know where the hell they're going. Once I clearly communicated the mission—“We're building the resource I wish I had”—everything changed. Decisions got made without me. Accountability rose. That's what happens when people lead toward a clear goal. Key shift: You don't need more doers. You need more leaders. Attracting A-Players (Not Babysitting B-Teamers) A-players cost more—about 20% more on paper—but they produce 10–20x more than your average B-level staffer. They don't need to be told. They take ownership. So how do you attract them? Build a brand people want to belong to. Ramblin Jackson, one of our mastermind members, calls their team “Ramblers.” It's fun. It creates identity. It's not just a job—it's a tribe. Make your job posts feel like sales letters. “Here's who we are. Here's why it matters. Here's what you'll help us build.” Ramblin even walks candidates through the hiring process on their site to build trust. Put your team on display. Show them off on your website, on social, in your wins. A-players don't just want just a job, they want purpose. Make it visible. Building a High-Performing Culture Great teams don't happen by accident. They're built on clarity, feedback, and connection. Here's how to build a culture that scales: Communicate Clearly. Use Looms instead of emails. Weekly standups. Show people what winning looks like—and support them to get there. Give & Receive Feedback. Quarterly ask: What should we start, stop, and continue doing? Then actually do something with those answers. Support Growth Paths. Not everyone wants to lead. Some want to be elite specialists. Either path is valuable—support both. Forge Connections on Purpose. Especially if you're remote. Retreats, local meetups, even casual Zooms help remind your team: we're building something together. Stop Managing. Start Coaching. Reviews are fine. But coaching is where the magic happens. Ask your team: “Where do you want to grow?” “What ideas do you have to help the company grow?” You're not just managing performance—you're investing in potential. Then teach them the 131 Method to make better decisions without you: 1 What's the issue? 3 What are 3 possible solutions? 1 What's your one recommendation? This trains your team to think like owners. Also: stop assigning tasks—start assigning outcomes. Let them figure out the how. Debrief when things go sideways, but stop micromanaging. Growth comes from ownership. Sustainability Is the Long Game You can't grow a team if they're burned out, checked out, or walking out. Here's how to protect your team's energy: Cut the fluff meetings Encourage real time off Create space for recovery (mental health days, no-meeting weeks) Celebrate wins publicly (Slack shoutouts, weekly recaps) Keep people connected—virtually and IRL Culture isn't perks. It's how people feel when they're building with you.  The traditional agency model is broken. You don't need more hands—you need more heads. Build a team of leaders. Create a culture of clarity, connection, and coaching. Get out of the damn way—and let them fly. If you're ready to attract better clients and become uncuttable, check out the Attract Masterclass. It will help you position your agency to pull in the right leads instead of just more leads.

Would you like access to our advanced agency training for FREE? https://www.agencymastery360.com/training Are you a CEO still caught in the weeds of day-to-day operations? If so, you're not building a truly scalable business. Today's episode is here to help you shift that mindset. Our featured guest is a CEO who has grown his agency by focusing on smart leadership—prioritizing culture, developing strong management structures, and intentionally making himself less essential to every meeting. Like many agency owners, he once believed he had to outwork everyone to prove his worth. But over time, he discovered that the agency performs better when he leads with vision instead of constant presence and that CEOs don't need to be grinding to be effective. In this conversation, he shares how he came to that realization, what it's meant for his agency's growth and client success, how he built a trusted A-team, and more. Kevin Miller is the co-founder and CEO of Gr0, a performance marketing agency that's exploded from startup to 200+ clients and over 80 full-time staff in just five years. Before launching GR0 in 2020, Kevin cut his teeth at Google, served as Director of Growth at OpenDoor, and was inspired to jump into the agency world by a friend who built and sold one of the first Facebook-focused DTC agencies. His background in SEO and paid media, combined with experience at both bootstrapped and venture-backed companies, gives him a rare, well-rounded perspective. Today his mission is clear: build a high-performance team that wins together. In this episode, we'll discuss: Two levers to driving growth. Why CEOs are more effective when they're not grinding. Understanding that delegation is not optional. Client acquisition that doesn't feel like sales. Subscribe Apple | Spotify | iHeart Radio Sponsors and Resources This episode is brought to you by Wix Studio: If you're leveling up your team and your client experience, your site builder should keep up too. That's why successful agencies use Wix Studio — built to adapt the way your agency does: AI-powered site mapping, responsive design, flexible workflows, and scalable CMS tools so you spend less on plugins and more on growth. Ready to design faster and smarter? Go to wix.com/studio to get started. Getting to See the Possibilities of the Agency Space Watching a friend grow and sell a Facebook-focused DTC agency helped Kevin clearly see the differences between growing a bootstrap business versus a venture-capital backed business. His friend ended up selling the business for over $100 million, which Kevin hadn't think it was possible to do in the agency space. It was an inspiring moment that led to the realization that he too could build and scale his own business, which he chose to do in the SEO niche. From Zero to 200 Clients: The Growth Playbook With just half a decade in the agency business, Kevin can see most people just can't handle it. “Every day is a different game of guacamole with all sorts of people problems.” After all, in this business our product so the best way to guarantee you're creating a safe environment where people want to stay is to over index on culture. This is how a young agency can go from scrappy startup to 8-figure beast in half a decade. It's all about building a culture that attracts and retains A-players. If your account manager leaves, that client feels like they have to start over. It can be the worst experience for a client and the best way to avoid is to create an environment where everyone feels like part of a team. Kevin runs GR0 like an NBA franchise where everyone's expected to perform at a high level, without being a burnout factory. He's also very strict about behavior. No matter how talented you are, you can never be rude to a client or other employees. It's a team-first culture with high accountability and even higher standards that has grown fast by keeping people, delivering great work, and staying crazy responsive. Two big levers driving their growth: Kevin attributes his agency's success with client to two main elements: Rapid response times: Emails, texts, Slack messages… they don't sit idle. Obsession with client results: Deliver, retain, and let referrals do the work. Additionally, he knows it's not all about attracting new business. Churn is a killer. Retention isn't sexy, but it's the secret to compounding revenue. Inside the Org Chart: A 5-Level Machine In terms of the deals the agency is closing with clients, Kevin is a big believer that there's little room to do great work on a monthly basis, which is why he prefers offering six-month contracts that will later get renewed for another six months. He's also put a lot of thought into the agency's organizational structure, which he breaks down into five levels: Executive Team VPs Associate VPs / Directors (each running a service line) Campaign Managers Contractors & Specialists As to him, his role as CEO is divided into three categories: Coach – Recruiting and leveling up 10x talent across the top team. Closer – Still active in sales, he sets expectations and closes high-value clients. Visionary – Driving innovation like launching new services (radio is next!) and adopting tools like ChatGPT for smarter, faster workflows. You'll Be Needed Less & Less as a CEO – and That's Okay Being a CEO won't necessarily come naturally to everyone, which is why Kevin has a coach that has taught him how to conduct himself and cast the vision for the agency. He's also embraced the fact that putting together a capable team will mean getting told they don't need you to pitch in on every meeting. “If someone doesn't need me in a meeting, I'm relieved. It means we've built something scalable.” A true leader should be helpful and keep the company moving forward, which is why Kevin sees his role more as someone who works for everyone at the company, as opposed to the old model where bosses were tyrants that barked orders all day. It's not easy to lead 200+ employees, and leaders nowadays recognize that the way to do so is not just having a very strong team but also being able to keep them by building a great culture. From Hustle Mentality to Smart Leadership Kevin and Jason both admit they had to unlearn the “first one in, last one out” badge of honor. Many leaders tend to think they have to outwork everyone. Kevin admits he still wrestles with showing up early to prove value—even though the company runs better when he focuses on vision, not presence. The truth is agency CEOs don't need to be grinding to be effective. They need to be accessible, and they need to build teams that run without them. “If I'm on a mountain or a golf course, and I get a call, I'll answer. But if the team doesn't need me? Even better,” Jason shares. This shift, from being the engine to being the guide rail, is one most agency owners struggle with. But letting go (and training others to step up) is the only way you get out of the weeds. Delegation Isn't Optional—It's Leadership 101 Early on, Kevin believed only he could do the work “right.” But that mindset capped his growth—and created unnecessary pressure. Effective delegation and believing in your team is what makes a great CEO. As he says now, “you have to pass the ball and trust they'll show up.” If you're asking, “How should we do this?” you're already in the weeds. The better question is, “Who on my team should own this?” If you need ideas, start with Jason's 1 3 1 method to train team decision-making is a killer takeaway: 1: What's the problem? 3: What are three ways to solve it? 1: What do you recommend? It's a simple leadership tool that trains independence—so you're not the bottleneck every time something needs approval. You Can't Build Big if You Can't Let Go If you want to make sure you have people on your team who'll step up after applying the 1 3 1 method, hire people who can manage themselves. Kevin and Jason both agree they're not built to manage micro-tasks—or people who need micromanaging. “If I'm going to manage someone, I'll expect them to do it like me, at my pace, with my level of commitment. And that's not fair,” Kevin admits. As owners, your growth is capped by how much you think you have to do. Build a team of leaders—not followers. Give direction, not checklists. And accept that mistakes are part of the process. In the mastermind, Jason and the members celebrate even the failures—because sharing missteps keeps others from repeating them. That's how real learning happens. Client Acquisition That Doesn't Feel Like Sales Now let's talk lead gen. How did Kevin's agency bring in over 200 clients? It wasn't ads. It wasn't cold emails. It was strategic referrals—and they engineered that pipeline from the ground up. In Kevin's view, cold acquisition just doesn't work well with the amount of competition in his space. Instead, he built a network of warm referrals of ~25 trusted partners. Each partner gets 10% of the monthly revenue from any referred client. But more importantly, they only recruit partners who already know Kevin and trust his team to deliver. “I'm not reaching out cold saying ‘hey, I'll pay you 10%.' I'm building real relationships with people who already trust me.” This warm referral engine is the opposite of passive referrals. It's intentional, proactive, and mutually beneficial. It scales because Kevin didn't wait—he built the network years before launching GR0. Most of the time referrals aren't scalable. However, when you do it this way—proactively recruiting the right partners—it becomes a one-to-many strategy. This is a model more agency owners should be thinking about. It's lower friction, higher trust, and most importantly: it cuts through the noise in a saturated market. Pricing, Positioning, and Playing the Long Game One thing Kevin admits he should be raising prices more often. GR0 started with $3,000/month clients and now charges $8K–$10K for the same package. But that evolution took five years. Still, their market positioning is clear: “We're expensive but fair. Not overpriced, not low-budget. Right in the sweet spot.” This ties back to the trust built with clients and referral partners alike. If the value is real and the results are consistent, the relationships last. Do You Want to Transform Your Agency from a Liability to an Asset? Looking to dig deeper into your agency's potential? Check out our Agency Blueprint. Designed for agency owners like you, our Agency Blueprint helps you uncover growth opportunities, tackle obstacles, and craft a customized blueprint for your agency's success.

Would you like access to our advanced agency training for FREE? https://www.agencymastery360.com/training Agency owners often stay stuck in delivery because they fear stepping back will tank what's working. Brent Weaver shares how he transitioned from being the “product” to leading a 300-person agency without burning it all down—and why you need to step up if you want to scale. What You'll Learn Why staying “in delivery” caps your growth How to stop being the product and build leaders around you How to set a real “North Star” so your team stops bugging you Why you need to know your numbers and stop blaming seasonality The mindset shift from VFR (gut decisions) to IFR (data-driven scale) Key Takeaways Your agency won't scale if you're stuck in delivery. You must step back and coach leaders if you want freedom and growth. Clarity kills chaos. Set a clear vision so your team can act without needing you in every decision. Use the 1-3-1 method (1 problem, 3 options, 1 recommendation) to build leaders and stop being the fixer. Know your numbers. Seasonality is often a scapegoat for pipeline problems you can fix. Every change costs churn. If your change won't grow you by at least 20%, it's not worth the churn. Stop flying VFR. Use data to run your agency if you want to scale without chaos. Are you still viewed as a ‘product' of your agency? Maybe you've considered stepping back from the day-to-day but are terrified you'll break what's working. Our featured guest is the newly appointed CEO of E2M Solutions and he shares what it's been like going from being the main “product” at an agency he built and grew, to stepping in to run a 300-person white-label agency. From losing the fear of breaking what already worked to accepting it's better if he's usually not in client call, he explains how he's grown comfortable in his new role: coaching the core leadership team, amplifying culture, and making sure hundreds of projects and thousands of tasks get executed well. Brent's journey is packed with lessons on what real leadership looks like when you're ready to grow. Brent Weaver is the CEO of E2M Solutions, a 300-person white-label agency helping digital agencies scale through web, digital marketing, and AI services. Before E2M, Brent founded and grew UGURUS, supporting agencies to niche, price, and position better. Now, instead of talking about scaling, he's deep in the trenches doing it. In this episode, we'll discuss: Stop being the product and build leaders around you How to set a real “North Star” so your team stops bugging you Why you need to know your numbers and stop blaming seasonality  Subscribe Apple | Spotify | iHeart Radio From “Gainfully Unemployed” to Leading 300 People A few months before stepping in at E2M, Brent was living the dream: building a halfpipe in his barn and enjoying long walks on his property. Then, he jumped back in, this time not to build a new business, but to lead a 300-person agency that already had a killer product, a strong culture, and a commitment to service. Brent's move is the dream scenario for many agency owners who've spent years in the grind. He joined a team that's already winning and is in the process of figuring out how to take it to the next level without screwing it up. However, running an operation that serves hundreds of clients and handles hundreds of projects every month, the stakes are bigger, the team is bigger, and the impact is bigger. It's a different kind of pressure. When You're No Longer “The Product” If you're running a 5–20 person agency, you might feel like stepping up to a 300-person team would just mean 300 people interrupting you all day with Slack pings. But Brent that's not how it works at that level. If you want to scale, you have to stop being the product. At UGURUS, Brent was often the one jumping on client calls to “fix it.” At E2M, he's focused on coaching the core leadership team, amplifying culture, and making sure hundreds of projects and thousands of tasks get executed well without him being the bottleneck. As he explains, even though he loves speaking to clients, there probably shouldn't be a situation where he HAS to jump on a call with them. Brent believes agency owners should begin stepping back from daily agency operations once the team team grows to around 20 people. At this point, you should start to think about your business's leadership structure, management structure, and spend more time thinking about the “middle” of the business vs. just the vision. Take note: If you're stuck in delivery and putting out fires, your agency won't scale. Vision: Your Agency's North Star If you've heard agency owners talk about the business “North Star,” you know how critical it is to set a clear vision your team can rally around. Your vision doesn't need to be some sappy paragraph you read before standups. It needs to be clear enough that everyone on your team can make decisions aligned with where you're going without bugging you every five minutes. At E2M, Brent and his team know exactly where they're headed over the next three to five years—and every decision flows from that. This is true freedom to Brent. His vision of freedom is not one where he has lots of time off, but rather one where he can do his job as CEO without being micromanaged and can choose his path towards the agreed strategic objectives. If you want to stop being the product at your agency and you still don't have this clarity, your team will constantly come to you, expecting you to make every call. If you want to get out of that cycle, set your North Star. Then, overcommunicate it. The 1-3-1 Method to Building Leaders If you're still solving every problem in your agency, try the 1-3-1 method Jason used: What's the 1 problem you're facing? What are 3 options you've considered? What's the 1 you recommend? Teach your team to think critically and solve their own problems, and you'll stop being the default fixer. This is how you build leaders inside your agency instead of becoming the only adult in an adult daycare. Don't Let “Do No Harm” Paralyze You For Brent, being a good leader means getting down to why things are working or not working at the agency, with the same level of detail whether things are working or not. As a leader, if you don't have a firm grip on the business and why it's going up, down, or staying the same, you can't get a clear idea of how to improve the company or not damage what's working. New CEO's often come in with the idea of “doing no harm” by changing things too much as they start. Think about it like this: Any meaningful change will cause about 20% churn. If the upside of your change isn't at least 20% growth, it's not worth it. Don't be afraid of making changes. Just remember that if you decide to change the pricing, pivot your offer, or build a new division, it better be worth the churn it will inevitably create. This mindset frees you to take the swings that actually move your agency forward. The Seasonality Cop-Out If you truly have a firm grip on the business, you'll also avoid the seasonality cop-out.. “Summer's slow.” “Everyone's on vacation.” “Budget freezes in Q4.” We've all heard it, but as Brent learned at Digital Ocean (where you either knew your numbers or got roasted), seasonality isn't causality. If you see lead flow drop in the summer, don't blame the weather. Look deeper: Are you running events that drive leads earlier in the year but have no Q3 pipeline activity? Do your ad campaigns pause when the kids get out of school? You don't fix “seasonality” with wishful thinking. You fix it by identifying the root cause, putting numbers to the impact, and designing campaigns or partnerships to fill the gap. If you want next June to be different, start planning now. Clarity over confusion wins every time. Flying VFR vs. IFR: How Agency Owners Get Stuck With both the interviewer and interviewee being licensed pilots, we of course got this banger analogy when talking about decision-making for agency owners: Visual Flight Rules (VFR): You fly by looking out the window, adjusting based on what you see. Instrument Flight Rules (IFR): You fly by instruments, allowing you to go further, faster, and more safely. Most agencies operate under VFR, making gut decisions with limited data. This approach works when you're small, but to scale, you need to fly IFR, building a data system that tells you what's working, what's not, and what needs fixing. At E2M, Brent is shifting the company to operate on data, allowing them to scale smarter and make big moves (like building out their AI and Go High Level divisions) with confidence. Do You Want to Transform Your Agency from a Liability to an Asset? Looking to dig deeper into your agency's potential? Check out our Agency Blueprint. Designed for agency owners like you, our Agency Blueprint helps you uncover growth opportunities, tackle obstacles, and craft a customized blueprint for your agency's success.

Would you like access to our advanced agency training for FREE? https://www.agencymastery360.com/training With clients increasingly expecting their agencies to leverage AI, are you waiting for client direction, or leading the way on how to use it? Today's featured guest has a unique vantage point on this shift. He runs a platform that connects clients with credible agencies while helping agencies showcase their expertise, giving him a front-row seat to what clients truly want and what agencies fear about AI. With hundreds of thousands of agencies on his platform, he's seen firsthand that the agencies standing out are the ones leading the AI conversation, not waiting for permission to start it. He'll share why educating your clients on the possibilities of AI is now a competitive advantage and how his company's new verification layer aims to bring trust and clarity to an increasingly crowded agency marketplace. Tim Condon is the Chief Revenue Officer at Clutch, the largest B2B service provider marketplace online, boasting over 300,000 agencies. Tim helps agencies showcase services, collect reviews, and attract qualified buyers. With a front-row seat to the challenges and wins of agencies across industries, Tim sees exactly how the best adapt—and how others risk falling behind. Tim has been on the show before with advice on how agency owners can separate from the pack and position their agencies for success. In this episode, we'll discuss: Is AI coming for your agency? Document your AI processes before it gets expensive. How you should be starting the AI conversation. The power of documented proof. Subscribe Apple | Spotify | iHeart Radio Sponsors and Resources This episode is brought to you by Wix Studio: If you're leveling up your team and your client experience, your site builder should keep up too. That's why successful agencies use Wix Studio — built to adapt the way your agency does: AI-powered site mapping, responsive design, flexible workflows, and scalable CMS tools so you spend less on plugins and more on growth. Ready to design faster and smarter? Go to wix.com/studio to get started. Is AI Coming for Your Agency? It Depends The elephant in every agency Slack channel: Will AI replace us? Tim sees a spectrum. Some agencies think they're immune (“We only serve local dentists, so we're safe.”), while others are already using AI to transform delivery, productizing what used to be manual labor into scalable SaaS products for other agencies. Most agencies are stuck in the middle - unsure where to begin and afraid to fall behind. Basically, if your clients are tech-savvy DIYers, yes, you're at risk. But 99% of clients aren't like that. They want the results AI brings, but they don't want to build or manage it themselves. Hence, those who adopt AI to streamline delivery and elevate their positioning—not those who ignore it or just dabble, will win. AI Isn't a Threat. It's Your Edge AI is already making agencies faster, leaner, and more profitable if they leverage it correctly: Custom GPTs for marketing, sales training, and operations Automated research and lead qualification Speeding up delivery while maintaining quality Tim shared an example of a San Francisco agency using LLMs to automate internal processes. It wasn't complicated: structured folders, an AI model to search and output organized results. Simple, but powerful. If your agency isn't at least experimenting with AI to remove repetitive manual work, you're falling behind—not because AI will replace you, but because other agencies will outpace you by using AI to do what you do, faster and cheaper. Document Your AI Processes Now (Before It Gets Expensive) AI pricing today is like Uber in the early days: cheap to get you hooked, but it won't last. AI's current affordability is saving agencies the equivalent of multiple salaries annually. Eventually, these tools will increase in price to reflect their true value. What can you do about this? Jason recommends documenting your workflows and data used to train custom GPTs or AI agents now. If pricing spikes or a model goes down, you can pivot to another provider without losing your institutional knowledge. Why Agencies Must Shift from Order-Takers to Advisors Most agencies fail not because they lack skills, but because they act like order-takers. As a clients, it's frustrating for Jason when agencies ask, “What do you want us to do?” instead of showing him what's possible. Remember that as agencies, your purpose is to solve problems for your clients. Clients (dentists, local businesses, even large brands) don't know what's possible with AI. They think it's just a fancy chatbot. If you step up to educate and advise clients on what's possible with AI, you become indispensable. Look to build systems that: Research prospects automatically before calls Automate competitor and market analysis Help clients leverage AI in their workflows Agencies that step into this advisor role, showing clients what's possible and taking accountability for delivering results, become irreplaceable. You're not just executing tasks; you're creating outcomes they can't create alone, and that's where real value lies. Don't Be Another “Nomad Agency.” Be the Real Deal Too many people who failed at running agencies pivot into teaching how to run an agency while living the “digital nomad” lifestyle, without having actually built sustainable businesses. This creates noise and mistrust in the marketplace, making it harder for real agencies to stand out. Most of the time, agency owners are accidental entrepreneurs—people who mastered a skill and were asked to help, not those who started for the lifestyle. If you're listening to this, you're likely the latter. To stand out, you need to showcase not just what you can do but what you've actually done. Your wins, client results, and case studies speak louder than lifestyle photos on Instagram. The Power of Specific, Documented Proof If you want to stand out from the fly-by-night agencies, talk specifics. Others mostly speak in generalities. Instead, credible agencies share specifics. If you can clearly articulate, “Here's the exact problem we solved for a client just like you,” then you instantly separate yourself from the pack. Tools like Clutch help because they use AI to pull themes from your reviews to match buyer intent, but your agency still needs to collect, showcase, and share detailed case studies and client stories. Documentation matters. If you're working with SMBs or mid-market clients, they want to see clear, verified results before investing. When you can present proof, it's hard for low-quality competitors to compete, no matter how flashy their pitch decks look. Start gathering your “receipts” now to future-proof your positioning. Verification Adds Trust in a Crowded Marketplace Tim's company Clutch now offers Clutch Verified as an additional trust layer. They don't just take your word for it; they check your business registration, credit history, and operating longevity to separate real agencies from “gaming-the-system” players. It's a powerful way to signal to potential clients, “We're credible, stable, and vetted.” For clients, it's a good indicator of who you'll be working with and for agencies it becomes a sales asset. When potential clients research you on Clutch, verified agencies are prioritized, giving you an edge over competitors. It's a practical, low-cost step to build trust and signal legitimacy, especially if you're competing for premium clients. Do You Want to Transform Your Agency from a Liability to an Asset? Looking to dig deeper into your agency's potential? Check out our Agency Blueprint. Designed for agency owners like you, our Agency Blueprint helps you uncover growth opportunities, tackle obstacles, and craft a customized blueprint for your agency's success.

Would you like access to our advanced agency training for FREE? https://www.agencymastery360.com/training RJ Huebert went from corporate comfort to agency chaos—and nearly lost himself in the process. In this episode, he shares what it really takes to balance speed-to-lead sales with sanity, and how he's redesigning his agency life for more freedom, better clients, and real personal wellbeing. Guest Overview RJ Huebert is the founder of HBT Digital, a Pittsburgh-based lead gen agency helping clients capture high-quality leads through digital ads that convert. Former corporate marketer turned agency founder, RJ knows both sides of the game—and why it's harder than it looks. What You'll Learn Why corporate escapees struggle more than expected in agency life The underrated power of speed in lead gen (and what most teams screw up) How to nurture not-yet-ready leads without annoying them What happens when your business always comes before your health and family How RJ is reclaiming time and rebuilding systems Key Takeaways Speed wins deals: If your sales team isn't responding within minutes, you're losing leads. Nurture with value: Use short, high-impact videos instead of stale PDFs. Even Meta is doing email wrong: Don't copy the big guys—build trust instead. Agency life means 20 clients, not one boss: And that requires stronger boundaries. Health > Hustle: RJ's learning that health, family, and freedom must come first. The solution? Systems: You can't scale or shut your brain off without them. Are you working harder than ever, but still can't turn your brain off—even on weekends? Today's featured guest is one of the many agency owners who has found it hard to find the right balance to take care of himself as well as the business. Like many agency owners, he made the leap from building someone else's business to finally building his own. But trading a cozy corporate job for the chaos of running an agency with dozens of clients wasn't as easy as it looked. He shares the real challenges of sales, why speed is still the secret to winning leads, and how he's figuring out how to convert prospects who aren't quite ready to buy. Most importantly, he opens up about the ongoing struggle to find the right balance between health, family, and keeping the agency growing. RJ Huebert is the founder of HBT Digital, a Pittsburgh-based lead generation agency helping clients pull in quality leads using online ads that actually convert. After 11 years of climbing the corporate marketing ladder, RJ got tired of building someone else's dream and decided to bet on himself—and it's paying off. In this episode, we'll discuss: Why he stopped building someone else's dream. How speed wins in lead generation. Always be first to respond. Ways to nurture leads that are not ready to buy. Why boundaries and self care are more important now than ever. Subscribe Apple | Spotify | iHeart Radio Sponsors and Resources E2M Solutions: Today's episode of the Smart Agency Masterclass is sponsored by E2M Solutions, a web design, and development agency that has provided white-label services for the past 10 years to agencies all over the world. Check out e2msolutions.com/smartagency and get 10% off for the first three months of service. Building Someone Else's Empire? Here's the Wake-Up Call Like many agency owners before starting their own business, RJ was the corporate marketing guy building someone else's business, getting them rich, while rising through the ranks and learning how to actually drive results with digital marketing. Also like many others, he hit a moment of questioning whether it was worth it after eleven years. Sound familiar? That's when he decided it was time to test if people would actually pay him for these skills. He got some clients on the side, launched a 5K race company, and eventually opened his own digital marketing agency, proving that you can take your skills and build your own agency if you're willing to start. The Attribution Struggle He Faced as an Agency Client From his experience hiring agencies on the corporate side, one of the biggest frustrations RJ encountered was the attribution nightmare. It wasn't always easy to see where the lead came from and where they were at in the pipeline. This was some ten years ago, so every agency was siloed: SEO, PPC, outdoor, TV—and each claimed leads but no one could prove it. And even today, with GA4, HighLevel, UTMs, and tag managers, the truth is: “Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't.” We're bombarded with data, but turning it into actionable insight is another story. RJ prefers to establish a baseline, track what matters, and avoid drowning in vanity metrics - like open rates—that don't impact the client's bottom line. Why Speed to Lead Still Wins Both RJ and Jason agree that speed to lead wins deals. If you're not calling leads while they're still on your website you are likely losing opportunities. Just like you probably click on the first result in a Google search, whoever calls back first is going to win. If your sales team is still waiting hours (or days) to follow up, you're leaving money on the table. Rethinking Nurture Sequences Without Being “That Guy” Even if you're not converting them right away, how are you nurturing those leads in a way that doesn't feel like overkill? First of all, replace boring white papers with short, actionable videos that deliver instant value. For example, Jason's Budget Buster video helps prospects get budgets 99% of the time, creating immediate ROI and building trust. Follow that with another bite-sized value piece a few days later. Once leads warm up, move them to your newsletter list. Have some lead magnets ready, like useful videos you can send each week to warm up that client. After that, you can move that client from the “warm-up” list to a newsletter list, so you can send them valuable content on a daily basis. Sending daily value-packed emails to engaged subscribers actually increased their domain authority and engagement. It's about quality frequency, not spam. Think about what you'd want to receive yourself, not just what you want to send. The Meta & Google Frustration We're All Tired Of Not even Meta is getting emails right, as they send multiple emails a day that don't really add much value for clients. On top of that, their reps hardly ever provide the right solutions and are mainly focused on “spend more” strategies. It's a universal frustration for agency owners, who see Meta is calling clients directly trying to cut their agency out. It's one more reason why agencies need to protect their positioning, control client conversations, and not let the platforms dictate strategy. From One Client to Twenty: The Real Agency Rollercoaster What's the hardest shift going from corporate to owning your agency? For RJ, it was going from one clear client you're focusing on at one moment to having even 20 clients, plus “trying to get clients to pay you, to keep paying you, while finding new ones, and keeping them happy.” Running an agency turned out to be way harder than he expected. Corporate can be robotic and boring, but on the bright side, you have one client: your boss. Lose that, and you're done. In the agency world, a client can fire you, but you've got 5, 10, or 20 others paying the bills. The flip side? You're always on. Even when you're “off,” your mind is stuck on proposals, scope creep, and that client's weird Slack message at 10 pm. That's one of the biggest challenges for RJ at the moment. Setting Your Priorities Straight with The Right Systems When it comes to taking care of yourself, your priorities should always be: Health, Family, Agency—In That Order. However, too often agency owners get their priorities backwards. You have a zillion things you can and should be doing and choosing the priority is the challenge. That balancing act gets easier once you build the right leadership team and put systems in place that pull you out of the weeds. But agency owners often struggle to shut their brains off, leading to constant stress, scattered priorities, and burnout cycles that can wreck family time, health, and even your love for the business. If you're stuck in the chaos, it's time to step back and prioritize what actually moves the needle in your agency. Do You Want to Transform Your Agency from a Liability to an Asset? Looking to dig deeper into your agency's potential? Check out our Agency Blueprint. Designed for agency owners like you, our Agency Blueprint helps you uncover growth opportunities, tackle obstacles, and craft a customized blueprint for your agency's success.

Would you like access to our advanced agency training for FREE? https://www.agencymastery360.com/training Still unsure what to charge for your agency services? Scared to raise your rates in case clients leave? If you're like many agency owners who are busy as hell but barely turning a profit, it's time to face a hard truth: your profit model might be broken. Fixing it isn't about selling more… it's about keeping more. In this episode, we break down the pricing strategy you need to attract high-quality clients, boost profits, and finally charge what you're worth. Stop Selling Time The first mindset shift you need: Your value isn't in the hours you clock, it's in the outcomes you deliver and the confidence you bring. If you're still selling time or generic services, AI is your biggest competitor right now. But if you position your agency as a niche expert, you become irreplaceable. Clients pay for leadership, not tasks. 3 Core Agency Pricing Models (and Where They Break) 1. Hourly Pricing Punishes efficiency: work faster, get paid less. It also attracts micromanaging clients who treat your team like task rabbits. 2. Project-Based Pricing Scope, deliver, get paid. Works for one-off builds like websites, but it traps you in feast-or-famine if you aren't stacking and upselling strategically. 3. Value-Based Pricing This is where serious growth happens. Instead of selling a website, you sell a result like converting traffic into sales. You price outcomes, not hours. Common Pricing Mistakes We see it all the time: Underpricing to “close the deal.” Using one-size-fits-all pricing. Failing to adapt pricing to market demand. Giving away strategy for free. Make Your Pricing Work for Your Growth Find your ideal client. Not everyone deserves a proposal. Shape your messaging to attract clients who want to pay for results. Know your margins. You can't price confidently if you don't know your true delivery costs. Price for profit, not survival. If you're scraping by every month, you're running a hobby, not a business. Position as a partner, not a vendor. Premium clients want an advisor, not a task-doer. Where to Start Define your freedom goal. Price to support the life you want, not just your expenses. Say your price with confidence. Nervous energy kills deals. Say it, then stop talking and let it land. Anchor to outcomes. Tie your price to the results you create, not the tasks you deliver. Treat pricing like a stock. Demand goes up, so do your rates. Use milestone-based increases. Got ten new clients? Raise your rates for the next ten. Once there's a gap between your old and new rates, circle back and raise your legacy clients. Pricing isn't just a number, it's your positioning and the path to building an agency that buys back your freedom. Go back, tighten your offers, raise your rates if they're due, and say that number with confidence. Because once you believe you're worth it, your clients will too. Want Help Making This Shift? Sick of giving away strategy for free? The Foot in the Door (FITD) System shows you how to get paid $2,500+ just to meet. No more free calls, no more tire-kickers. Grab it by clicking HERE.

Would you like access to our advanced agency training for FREE? https://www.agencymastery360.com/training A surprise $10K tax bill nearly knocked Pete Kleinjan off course—but he learned that trusting experts, keeping perspective, and staying outcome-focused is what turns agency chaos into long-term growth. If you're facing curveballs, this episode is your mindset reset. What You'll Learn Why SEO isn't what you sell, it's what it gets your clients. The tax mistake that cost $10K (and what Pete did right). How to lead through chaos with perspective, not panic. Why timeless principles beat trendy tactics every time. How realness (not AI avatars) builds lasting trust. Key Takeaways Clients buy outcomes, not SEO jargon: Sell the lakehouse dream, not the traffic report. Tax mistakes can kill momentum. Hire experts early: A $10K bill could've derailed everything, but Pete owned it and leveled up his support team. Stay resilient when the storm hits: Business will test you. What keeps you going is clarity, not hustle. Tools change, principles don't: Focus on client results, clear communication, and solving problems—not shiny new platforms. Authenticity wins: Forget perfect video. Scrappy, honest content builds trust that converts. Sell what they need, not what you want to deliver: Pete got a client for life by solving a $0 “do not index” issue. That's value. What's the most unexpected challenge you've faced as an agency owner? How did you handle it when things went sideways? Agency life is full of curveballs, and the only way to keep your business alive is by maintaining perspective and resilience when the unexpected hits. Today's featured guest once thought he would lose all the progress he'd made with his agency when the state hit him with a surprise $10K sales tax bill he didn't even know existed. But now, he looks back and laughs, recognizing that getting through it came down to trusting the right professionals and staying the course. He firmly believes that keeping your business afloat for the long haul means remembering why clients hire you in the first place — and that focusing on the outcomes that matter is what builds trust and closes deals. Pete Kleinjan is the founder and owner of Tiger29, an SEO agency that helps local small businesses achieve their sales goals. His agency isn't a sprawling team of 50; it's a small, sharp crew focused on what small business clients actually care about: more phone calls, more leads, more sales. In this episode, we'll discuss: The real reason clients want SEO. A lesson on team + preparedness. Perspective & resilience when things go sideways.  Why you should focus on what won't change. Subscribe Apple | Spotify | iHeart Radio Sponsors and Resources This episode is brought to you by Wix Studio: If you're leveling up your team and your client experience, your site builder should keep up too. That's why successful agencies use Wix Studio — built to adapt the way your agency does: AI-powered site mapping, responsive design, flexible workflows, and scalable CMS tools so you spend less on plugins and more on growth. Ready to design faster and smarter? Go to wix.com/studio to get started. The Real Reason Clients Want SEO (And Why We Overcomplicate It) Pete's first job right out of college was doing credit card collection. It was awful but it trained him in being on the phone multiple hours a day having difficult conversations, which led to his next job selling wheelchair-accessible vans. As a salesperson, he quickly realized the key to more sales wasn't grinding harder—it was getting more qualified leads. After he communicated his drive to help bring in more leads, the company's developer threw him a Wikipedia link to SEO, and Pete dove in, learned FTP, and started tweaking pages himself. That hands-on hunger turned into a full-fledged agency by 2009. It's a story he still tells prospects because he knows clients don't want SEO; they want what SEO brings. They want sales, the Cadillac, the lakehouse dream—not rankings or traffic screenshots, and leading with that terminology could just push them away. Pete urges agency owners to remember this because it speaks to what small business owners care about: “How do I get more of the customers I want?” When you lead with jargon, you lose your prospect. Lead with the transformation. The Unexpected $10K Sales Tax Bill (And a Lesson on Team + Preparedness) A couple of years into his agency, Pete received a letter from the state labeled “sales tax review” (not audit, but let's be real—it was an audit). Turns out, in South Dakota, consulting services are taxable, and the state decided local SEO link-building and citation placement fell under “taxable consulting.” This little “surprise” ended with Pete writing a $10,000 check to the state. For a moment, Pete considered fighting it and asked his attorney brother for advice. However, his brother put it in perspective for him: pay the $10K or pay a lawyer to sue and likely have the state fight you all the way to the Supreme Court. It wasn't fun, but it was the best decision for his peace of mind. For him, the big takeaway was: Hire a good bookkeeper and CPA who know your local tax nuances. You don't want to be the expert in tax law, just like your clients shouldn't have to be experts in SEO. Pete chose not to pass that bill back to his clients because it was his mistake, and it would be unfair. But it also taught him to be proactive in areas outside his zone of genius by building a team of experts who handle the boring (but crucial) details. Perspective and Resilience When Things Go Sideways Pete's tax story caused sleepless nights at the time, but looking back, he laughs about it. Because here's the hard truth about agency ownership: Money challenges, curveballs, and “surprise” bills are going to happen. Your ability to weather these storms without spiraling is what separates owners who build sustainable agencies from those who burn out. When you've been in the game long enough, you realize it's never all rainbows, and there's always something around the corner that could trip you up. But when you remember why you're in business—to build a life you love, not just a bigger agency—it becomes easier to shake off setbacks and focus on what matters: your health, your team, your freedom, and your ability to keep moving forward. Focus on What Won't Change In a recent interview, Jeff Bezos was asked about how he thought things would change in five years. His answer was that instead of obsessing over what will change, he prefers focusing on what won't change. No matter what, clients will always want results. They'll always want things on time. They'll always want problems solved by real humans who care. Whether you're using AI, TikTok or any other platform, those core truths will remain. We can often get distracted by tools and trends (AI, new social platforms, “the next algorithm hack”). But the tools in your box will change; your job—to deliver transformation to clients—will not. Build your business around timeless principles like clear communication, trust, and delivering results, and you'll outlast any trend. AI, Avatars, and Authenticity With the coming wave of AI avatars, deepfakes, and synthetic influencers, how should agency owners use these tools while maintaining authenticity? Yes, you could deploy an AI influencer for your agency, especially if you're camera-shy. But as Pete shared, their social media commandment #1 is “it has to be real.” Their scrappy videos may not be as polished as some big agencies, but they convert because they're authentic, quirky, and genuinely helpful. In a future where clients may question if what they see online is real, your authenticity will become your moat. Using AI should amplify your agency's personality, not replace it, so let your realness be your competitive advantage. Selling What Clients Need, Not What You Want to Sell A small business owner struggling for two years with a site that wouldn't show up on Google. Why? A simple “do not index” box was checked in WordPress. Everyone else was trying to pitch her a free “strategy call” (AKA sales call), but Pete charged for an SEO Power Hour, solved her problem immediately, and won her trust. The takeaway for Pete was that it's good he didn't default to “selling a new website” when a client came for SEO. Don't push a service because it's your highest margin offer. Sell what they actually need. When you do, you become their trusted advisor, not another expense they're trying to cut. Do You Want to Transform Your Agency from a Liability to an Asset? Looking to dig deeper into your agency's potential? Check out our Agency Blueprint. Designed for agency owners like you, our Agency Blueprint helps you uncover growth opportunities, tackle obstacles, and craft a customized blueprint for your agency's success.

Would you like access to our advanced agency training for FREE? https://www.agencymastery360.com/training Running an agency can feel like chaos on repeat—clients, team stress, and no clear direction. You're not alone. Today's featured guest has built and sold a $3M+ agency, kept employee turnover under 5%, and is now launching a focused, values-driven agency built to thrive in today's market. He shares some hard-won lessons on building a culture your team will never want to leave, attracting clients who respect your expertise, and creating the clarity and focus you need to scale without burning out. If you're an agency owner who's tired of the chaos and wants a clearer, saner path forward, this conversation will give you a roadmap worth following. Colin Hetherington is the founder of the newly minted Common Good in Dublin, but he's no rookie. Before that, he co-founded Zoo Digital, growing it past $3M a year before it was acquired, and even earlier, he pitched and built agency.com's Dublin presence when Ireland barely had broadband. After building and scaling agency.com Ireland, Colin and two colleagues grabbed coffee after a client meeting and decided, “There's a better way to do this.” It wasn't a grand plan with a 50-slide deck. It was a hunch—and a leap of faith. In this episode, we'll discuss: Why he believes in taking the leap before you're ready. Build systems or burn out. How to keep turnover at less than 5%. Why focus is the ultimate power move. Subscribe Apple | Spotify | iHeart Radio Sponsors and Resources E2M Solutions: Today's episode of the Smart Agency Masterclass is sponsored by E2M Solutions, a web design, and development agency that has provided white-label services for the past 10 years to agencies all over the world. Check out e2msolutions.com/smartagency and get 10% off for the first three months of service. Look for the Venn Diagram Sweet Spot Colin's first experience in digital marketing came when he worked for an agency in San Francisco back in 1999. At iTraffic, subsequently taken over by Agency.com, he learned about what was called at the time ‘internet advertising', and five years later he pitched the idea of setting up Agency.com in Dublin.  Their developing edge was putting strategy, creative, and technology under one roof at a time when agencies treated digital as an afterthought. That unique combination allowed them to win big clients like the National Lottery and the Irish Tourism Board with a tiny seven-person team. In just two years, they went from zero to driving 12% of the group's revenue and Colin and his partners felt ready to grow their own business. Hitting Their Stride with Innovation Zoo launched in 2008, right before the Great Recession and right as businesses started pulling back and budgets evaporated. However, they were able to adapt by winning some solid clients and partnering quietly behind the scenes with agencies that couldn't handle digital in-house. They found scrappy ways to deliver big ideas on smaller budgets, often using student illustrators or leaner production. By 2015, they'd grown the team to fourteen people and were hitting their stride with their original formula of combining strategy, creative, and technology under one roof that led them to work with big names like Redbull. After bringing innovation to countless brand events, Colin's agency started focusing on UX and got an important partnership with one of the largest banks in Ireland. While not every flashy innovation won new business immediately, it got them on pitch lists and made their team proud. Hiring Before You're Ready Colin's hiring strategy has always been taking leaps of faith. Instead of hiring one by one, they'd hire in threes or fours—betting on themselves to fill the pipeline. This was even back when they couldn't forecast beyond five months. For Colin, there was no use in debating and agonizing over these leaps for weeks when the team was already stretched for 1–2 months straight. Playing too small can be riskier than making bold, smart bets and, as they learned over time, taking those leaps of faith paid off every time. Every time they made that leap, the new team members were busy almost immediately. Build Systems or Burn Out On the other hand, Colin was not as quick to scale processes as they grew the team, which resulted in many projects being delayed and clients rightly unhappy about the situation. At one point, Colin was heading to a client meeting with that sick-to-your-stomach feeling that they were about to get fired for missing deadlines. They didn't get fired, but the client laid it out: “We love you, but can you ever deliver on time?” That wake-up call pushed Colin to bring in operations help, implement systems, and build scalable processes so they could grow without chaos. This next step also required them to admit they just weren't great project managers and needed outside help to build the foundations to grow the business. Culture Is What You Live, Not What You Write Colin managed to keep his agency's employee turnover at less than 5% by putting a heavy focus on culture while he was at Zoo. It's easy to slap a “values” page on your agency's website. He understood that reducing churn meant reducing time spent on getting people up to speed, for instance, but he also understood that culture isn't what you write down—it's what you live. For Colin, it all came down to leadership and how the leadership team delivers culture. For starters, they treated people like adults, trusting their team to own their work without micromanagement, and recognizing that work is just one part of life. When hard times hit, like during COVID, Colin and his partners were transparent. They had to temporarily reduce salaries but promised to pay it back when the storm cleared—and they did. That act of integrity built trust in a way no ping-pong table or Slack emoji ever could. Your Values Attract the Right Clients (and Repel the Wrong Ones) If you've ever worked with a nightmare client—the kind who demands everything yesterday, disrespects your team, and thinks paying your invoice is a license to treat you like dirt—yyou know the toll it takes on your team and energy. On this, Jason and Colin agree: it's better to walk away. Colin has learned that sharing the unspoken values you hold as a team don't just keep your culture healthy; they also shape the clients you attract. The best, longest-lasting client relationships he had were with organizations that shared similar values around respect, partnership, and clear communication. As to the nightmare clients? Those relationships were doomed from day one because the values were out of sync. Focus Is the Ultimate Power Move After selling Zoo, Colin is launching his new agency, Common Good, with one big lesson in mind: Focus beats everything. Instead of being a generalist, Colin is zeroing in on serving state and civil service organizations in Ireland. He believes these organizations are doing important work that deserves to be communicated well—and that clear positioning will set them apart in a market where every agency says the same thing about their “process, portfolio, and people.” What's more, Colin isn't trying to build another 60-person agency. He's embracing the shift in the market toward lean, senior teams that can deliver high-quality work without unnecessary bloat. If you're still in the grind of your first agency, it's normal not to have perfect clarity yet. You have to try things, learn what drains your energy, and double down on what gives you energy. The sooner you build reflection time into your schedule, the sooner you'll find your agency's true direction. It may be hard to take the time to really think about these things. The day-to-day of running an agency can drown you in Slack messages, client calls, and fires to put out. But stepping back—even for a few hours each week—to reflect on where you're going and why can be the difference between a business that drifts and one that thrives. Do You Want to Transform Your Agency from a Liability to an Asset? Looking to dig deeper into your agency's potential? Check out our Agency Blueprint. Designed for agency owners like you, our Agency Blueprint helps you uncover growth opportunities, tackle obstacles, and craft a customized blueprint for your agency's success.

Would you like access to our advanced agency training for FREE? https://www.agencymastery360.com/training Buying another agency sounds like a shortcut to scale — but if you skip the wrong step or miss the wrong promise, you might inherit more problems than profit. But how do you actually approach due diligence to ensure a seamless, profitable acquisition? Today's featured guest learned these lessons the hard way. What started as a promising deal quickly revealed cracks, forcing him and his partner to navigate unexpected challenges to pull the agency through. In the process, he discovered the key questions you must ask before buying another agency and the hidden details that can make or break your investment. If you're an agency owner thinking about using acquisitions as a growth strategy, today's conversation will equip you with real-world insights to avoid costly mistakes and set your agency up for a smoother, successful expansion. Matt Marchetta is an agency owner with two decades of experience who recounts his journey in the industry, from starting his first web design business in high school to pivoting into e-commerce and ultimately becoming a digital nomad. He teamed up with a partner to acquire Growth Labs, a lead generation shop focused on outbound. He goes over some of the challenges and crucial lessons learned during the acquisition process, particularly concerning due diligence, unforeseen client guarantees, and the original owner's significant personal brand influence on the agency's client base. In this episode, we'll discuss: Why buy another agency in the first place? Due diligence traps that cost real money. The ROI guarantee that almost blew up the deal. 4 questions you must ask before your next acquisition Subscribe Apple | Spotify | iHeart Radio Sponsors and Resources This episode is brought to you by Wix Studio: If you're leveling up your team and your client experience, your site builder should keep up too. That's why successful agencies use Wix Studio — built to adapt the way your agency does: AI-powered site mapping, responsive design, flexible workflows, and scalable CMS tools so you spend less on plugins and more on growth. Ready to design faster and smarter? Go to wix.com/studio to get started. From Solo Hustle to Ecom Growth Machine Matt started his agency journey as a kid who just wanted to work for himself and quickly learned the hard way—like many do—that running a business isn't just about being good at the work, it's about learning the business of business. It's a time he remembers fondly as a great foundation for his business education. He pivoted early from generalist design and dev work into e-commerce, riding that wave as it grew. Over time, he layered in Facebook ads, video production, and photography to support product marketing for his clients. And while many were stuck in offices, Matt was ahead of the curve, running remote from day one, carving out a lifestyle business that let him travel, stay flexible, and keep agency life fun. In fact, he never thought seriously about the possibility of selling his agency, since it's something he really enjoys doing and didn't think he'd ever get an offer that would compare to what he thinks it's worth. Why Buy an Agency? So why would a guy who loves the freedom of his own agency buy another one? Simple: leverage and evolution. Matt and his current business partner decided it was time to level up their respective agencies. They were both tired of being generalists and saw an opportunity to specialize, automate, and potentially transition out of day-to-day client grind by acquiring a business with the right foundation. They didn't go hunting for a big fish they couldn't afford. Instead, they targeted a sub-seven-figure agency they could buy at a fair multiple, with the goal of systemizing and growing it. Enter Growth Labs, an outbound lead gen agency specializing in cold email marketing. What They Looked For Before the Purchase Matt and his partner moved fast but smart: Profit and Loss: They dug into five years of P&Ls, noticing the typical COVID spike, post-spike drop, and finally profitability as the owner prepared to sell. Adbacks Reality Check: The books had plenty of “personal expenses” that, once removed, showed a clearer, stronger profit picture. Pipeline and Clients: They signed an NDA to peek at client lists, learning that the agency's lead gen often came from the owner's personal brand and reputation—great for credibility, but also something they'd need to replace with systems. Recurring vs. One-Off: They checked churn, recurring revenue, and how the business handled its leads and delivery so they wouldn't be buying a leaky bucket. Fast Close, Strategic Future In true operator fashion, Matt and his partner put in an offer quickly (about three weeks after initial discussions) and agreed on a 1.3x EBITDA multiple. They wanted the former owner to stick around for a transition period, ensuring continuity while they layered in their own systems and strategic direction. Everything looked clean. The seller had a strong personal brand. The books checked out (after adbacks). The plan was clear: earnout over three years, phased transition, and keep the seller involved for 12 months to ensure smooth client handoff and he agreed to do it. Then the cracks appeared. The ROI Guarantee Bomb While poking around Slack before the official handover, Matt found discussions about an ROI guarantee with a disgruntled client. The seller brushed it off as a “Horoszi-level mistake from years back.” No big deal, right? Wrong. Turns out, most new client contracts still included these ROI guarantees—often unwritten, often unenforceable, and often unrealistic. Combine that with underperforming cold email campaigns, and you have a recipe for churn, complaints, and a legal minefield. What was supposed to be a 2-month campaign turned into 12-month obligations with clients expecting a magical ROI that the agency couldn't verify, let alone control. 4 Lessons Matt Learned (So You Don't Have to) In hindsight, Matt admits they moved too fast. A few weeks wasn't enough because due diligence should take longer than you think. His advice for agency owners is not to feel pressured—take the time to ask uncomfortable questions and look for patterns and keep these 4 aspects in mind: Don't just check contracts. Check promises. Matt discovered clients were sticking around for the wrong reasons—and the wrong terms—due to handshake promises that should've been flagged during due diligence. Thoroughly analyze client data and churn patterns. Analyze the available metrics to determine whether or not clients are actually reaching goals. In his case, Matt found that using AI would've helped him uncover that consistent MRR masked a perfect churn pattern: lose three clients, gain three clients, every month. AI could've shown these patterns in minutes. Expect that when the seller leaves, 80-90% of their lead gen leaves with them. If the agency's pipeline depends on the owner's personal brand, you need a plan to replace that before you wire funds. Dig deeper into why the seller is selling—and why they started. Was the agency a real business solving a real need, or just a personal brand ATM for the founder? That origin story tells you how the business was run and what baggage you're buying. The Silver Lining Was it all doom and gloom? Nope. Matt discovered that despite the outdated “spray and pray” cold email approach, the agency's foundations were solid: a capable team, strong email infrastructure, and processes that could be upgraded with AI personalization and scalable systems. Instead of throwing in the towel, Matt is now rebuilding Growth Labs into a smarter, tech-enabled lead-gen agency aligned with the future, not the past. And despite the headaches, Matt and his business partner are still hungry for more acquisitions, now with clear systems and smarter questions in hand. They're even considering rolling up a group of specialist agencies as their next move. Do You Want to Transform Your Agency from a Liability to an Asset? Looking to dig deeper into your agency's potential? Check out our Agency Blueprint. Designed for agency owners like you, our Agency Blueprint helps you uncover growth opportunities, tackle obstacles, and craft a customized blueprint for your agency's success.

Would you like access to our advanced agency training for FREE? https://www.agencymastery360.com/training We've been talking about AI on this podcast for years — not just as the next shiny tool, but as the biggest shift agencies will face this decade. Yet most agencies still haven't done more than dabble. Meanwhile, their competitors (or even their clients) are using AI to move faster, make sharper decisions, and drive results that leave everyone else scrambling to catch up. If you're still on the sidelines, you're already behind. Today's guest is clear about the game-changing role of AI in the agency world. He argues it's not just about making your shop more efficient — it's about driving better client results, delivering faster, deeper insights, and adding to your bottom line. Agencies that fail to embrace AI risk being outpaced by clients who bring it in-house or by competitors already using it to gain an edge. To stay competitive, you have to take a forward-thinking approach that uses AI to scale operations, increase client value, and keep your best people. Phil Parrish is the co-founder & President of PrograMetrix, a boutique programmatic advertising agency that also crushes it in paid search and paid social. Celebrating their 10-year anniversary this past April, Phil's team has stayed nimble, focused, and mighty — helping clients dominate their digital paid media while driving real, measurable results. He'll discuss his vision on AI, how he's using it as a multiplier, and why that are not already adapting their processes to include this technology, will be exposed. In this episode, we'll discuss: Navigating pipeline churn anxiety. Delivering quick wins with AI. Why agencies that don't adapt will get exposed. Focus on the wins, not just the tasks. Subscribe Apple | Spotify | iHeart Radio Sponsors and Resources E2M Solutions: Today's episode of the Smart Agency Masterclass is sponsored by E2M Solutions, a web design, and development agency that has provided white-label services for the past 10 years to agencies all over the world. Check out e2msolutions.com/smartagency and get 10% off for the first three months of service. Betting on Yourself (And Getting Clients to Bet on You Too) Phil didn't stumble into agency ownership by accident, but he didn't overcomplicate it either. He built strong client relationships over the years, recognized the moment when he thought, “I can do what this company does — why not do it for myself?” and took the leap. With clients ready to follow, he launched PrograMetrix and started generating revenue quickly, sidestepping much of the risk that keeps many would-be agency owners stuck. The takeaway? If you've built trust and consistently delivered, clients will follow when you launch your own shop. Relationships and results are your best startup capital. Navigating Uncertainty Without Panic Every agency owner hits moments of chaos—those “Are we going under?” nightmares that keep you up at 3 AM. So far, Phil's journey hasn't quite hit the “we can't make payroll” panic, but pipeline uncertainty and client churn anxiety were very real, especially during COVID-19. Ironically, the pandemic ended up being a huge growth driver. As trade shows and in-person events vanished, clients who were spending six figures on live events had to redeploy budgets digitally. PrograMetrix was perfectly positioned to catch that wave. “You've got to have a good business plan, offer strategic value, make smart bets, and stay laser-focused when your back's against the wall.” It's a solid reminder: when chaos hits, the cream rises. The agencies that pivot fast come out stronger.   AI: Beyond Social Posts and Rocket Emojis Let's get real: most agencies are looking at AI like it's a shortcut to crank out social posts and blog content (and yes, that's part of it). But Phil's approach is a level above—he's integrating AI deeply into PrograMetrix's operations to enhance speed, insights, and performance, not just save a few hours per week. In his view, agencies that have depended on time as their inventory and work on the basis that the more time they can utilize the more revenue they can drive will struggle unless they modernize operations using AI. For its part, Phil's agency is building a proprietary product using a licensed data warehouse, pulling data from all their platforms (The Trade Desk, Meta, Google, TikTok, LinkedIn, etc.), and using AI to run advanced queries and develop unique optimization techniques. The end goal would be to deliver faster, clearer, and more impactful insights that clients can't get by simply logging into their ad accounts. The bottom line: If your agency isn't embedding AI into how you operate and deliver, not just as a tool to “save time,” clients will either bring it in-house or go with an agency that does. The market is moving, and speed and value are non-negotiables if you want to win and retain serious clients. Delivering Quick Wins and Story-Driven Insights Mid-market and enterprise clients dropping six to seven figures on ad spend need to feel your authority and your velocity from day one. They need to breathe easier knowing your agency has it handled, and they need to see progress fast, or they'll be out. Using AI, Phil's agency uncovers insights like: Path to conversion (impressions and touchpoints before a sale) Channel impact across the funnel Audience segment insights Messaging that drives real ROI They're not just sending reports but turning complex data into actionable stories for their clients. If you're still measuring your agency's success by how much time you can bill rather than how much impact you can deliver, it's time to rethink your model before your clients rethink you. Why Agencies That Don't Adapt Will Get Exposed Look, AI isn't going to wipe out agencies. But it will wipe out agencies that are stuck operating like it's 2015, coasting on outdated processes, and sending the same recycled reports clients can pull themselves. AI is like the giant scoreboard in baseball, showing every advanced stat in real-time. Agencies that are half-assing delivery can't hide anymore. If you're running bad ads, AI will show your client you suck, and you'll get fired. (Like the agency I just fired.) AI won't kill the agency model, but it will expose agencies not using best-of-breed tools to deliver value faster. AI as a Multiplier, Not a Threat — and Saves Him $200K Phil is using AI as a force multiplier to: Deliver faster, clearer insights for clients Optimize campaigns for even a 2-3% lift that compounds over time And they're doing this without having to invest in new talent at the rate they otherwise would have. As Phil says, “if we can skip hiring one or two traders, that's a $200K swing to the bottom line.” And it's not because he doesn't value his team—he's investing in making his team better. AI helps smart people do better work, get better results, and actually enjoy their jobs. Clients see more value, your agency scales efficiently, and your team sticks around longer, reducing churn and recruitment costs. It's About Buying Wins, Not Just Doing Tasks If you've seen Moneyball, know Billy Beane reinvented baseball by focusing on “getting on base,” not vanity stats. Agencies should think the same way: What are your “get on base” moves that drive client results? Are you outcome-driven and problem-solving, or are you a task rabbit waiting to be replaced by AI? When clients have big challenges, do they come to you first, or are you stuck doing low-value production work? If it's the latter, it's a sign to reposition your agency now. If you don't, you're writing your own exit letter from the industry. Make AI Use Mandatory, Not Optional As an agency leader, it's time to go all-in on integrating AI across all SOPs, not just as an add-on for the leadership team. Why? Because this tech: Makes employees more valuable in the marketplace Makes them happier by removing annoying, low-leverage tasks Keeps your team aligned with your agency's growth goals Before they started using AI prompts to understand how to optimize a campaign or improve performance, their campaign managers were conducting huge Excel exports. Now they can focus on strategy. If you're the only one using AI in your agency, you're toast. You need to lead, train, and require your team to use these tools to become outcome-focused problem solvers rather than task executors. Stop Being Fearful. Start Doing If you're feeling fear around AI, that's normal. But you'll stay scared if you don't start using it. Phil's team didn't wait for a perfect moment; they're actively building, testing, and refining AI use across their delivery and ops. The agencies that will win over the next 3-5 years aren't the ones worrying about AI—they're the ones using it to solve bigger problems faster for their clients. Do You Want to Transform Your Agency from a Liability to an Asset? Looking to dig deeper into your agency's potential? Check out our Agency Blueprint. Designed for agency owners like you, our Agency Blueprint helps you uncover growth opportunities, tackle obstacles, and craft a customized blueprint for your agency's success.

Would you like access to our advanced agency training for FREE? https://www.agencymastery360.com/training Let's get real for a second. 40% of CMOs are cutting agency budgets this year. (Not hype. That's from Gartner's 2025 CMO spend survey.) If you're still out there selling tasks instead of outcomes, blending in like every other “me too” agency, you're not just at risk—you're probably already on the cut list. But here's the good news: Some agencies aren't just surviving right now. They're growing like crazy. Why? Because they're leading. They're essential. They're uncuttable. Vendors Get Cut. Partners Stay. Here's what most agencies are still doing: Taking orders. Waiting for direction. Hoping results keep the client around. But when CMOs tighten budgets, they don't cut true strategic partners—they cut vendors and noise. In-house teams and AI are replacing basic production. If your agency doesn't feel essential, you will get replaced. Period. You know what else CMOs are cutting? Agencies that over-promise, under-deliver, and ghost clients after the deal closes. I've hired a few agencies over the past couple of years, and I can say most agencies have the slick branding and a confident talk, but once the deal is closed execution just falls apart. I've seen this more times than I can count. Communication fades away and no one takes ownership This is what CMOs are frustrated with. They're not just making cuts to save money. They're doing it after getting tired of disappointments. Joey Coleman says it best: “Most clients don't leave because of price; they leave because they don't feel seen, heard, or supported in the first 100 days.” Remember that while agency teams get excited and start high-fiving each other once the deal closes, the client is sitting there thinking, “Did I just waste my budget?” That gap between your excitement and their anxiety is where trust is either built or destroyed. And it's true. Our mastermind member Marty took that to heart, redesigned his client experience, and grew to a multi-million-dollar agency because he didn't wait for tasks—he led, flew out to meet clients, set clear expectations, and became indispensable. Make Yourself Uncuttable You want to stay off the cut list? Lead. Own the relationship. Here's how: 1. Find Quick Wins Fast Don't wait six months to show value. Launch something in the first 30 days. Fix something they didn't even ask for. Send a Loom video explaining how you improved their funnel. Let them say, “These people move fast.” 2. Overcommunicate When Things Aren't Working Most agencies go quiet when results dip. Leaders say, “Here's what's happening, here's what we're changing, here's what to expect.” Transparency builds trust. 3. Be a Resource, Not a Responder Stop waiting for tasks. Show up with new hooks, funnel fixes, better angles. Be the call they make when anything breaks in their business, not just when they need a landing page. 4. Take Ownership, Not Orders Stop asking, “What do you want us to do next?” Start saying, “Here's what we're doing, and here's why.” That's how you shift from vendor to partner. 5. Productize and Simplify If it takes you 30 minutes to explain what you do, you're in trouble. Make your offer outcome-driven, simple, and memorable. Like the PR agency that said, “We turn publicity into pipeline.” That sticks. Real Results from Agencies Leading This Way Just look at Brittany, who stopped winging it, joined the mastermind, and committed to leading: Revenue up 35% in a quarter Profit up 41% Churn dropped 32% SEO and social revenue doubled And she didn't get there with a fancy hack. She got there by leading and building trust. This Isn't Just About Staying Off a Cut List It's about building an agency that deserves to grow—one that earns trust, delivers outcomes, and leads. Want a place to start? Pick one of these actions today: Tighten your onboarding. Call a client you haven't talked to in a while. Launch the damn thing you've been sitting on. Because the agencies that win aren't waiting for permission or praying for renewals. They're leading, earning trust, and making themselves uncuttable.   If you're ready to attract better clients and become uncuttable, check out the Attract Masterclass. It will help you position your agency to pull in the right leads instead of just more leads.

Would you like access to our advanced agency training for FREE? https://www.agencymastery360.com/training Is churn currently a problem with your agency clients? Are you aware of the reasons they decide to leave? It may be time to think hard about your onboarding process, client communication, and generally the ways you're ensuring client satisfaction. The difference often comes down to positioning: are you operating as a trusted advisor or simply completing tasks? Today's special guest knows that agencies that prioritize client satisfaction, embrace accountability, and focus on becoming trusted advisors rather than mere task completers are the ones that create truly loyal clients. As our Agency Scale Specialist, Darby Copenhaver, has closely observed the growth trajectories of numerous mastermind members and constantly communicates with them in their journeys. In this conversation, he and Jason get into the importance of strong communication and transparent onboarding processes to combat buyer's remorse and build trust. They also address the strategic use of AI to enhance efficiency and results, stressing that while AI can automate tasks, human connection and understanding clients' evolving needs remain paramount for long-term partnerships. In this episode, we'll discuss: How to prevent your clients' buyer's remorse. Your onboarding might be the problem. Stop ignoring current clients. Your secret retention weapon: ongoing discovery. Subscribe Apple | Spotify | iHeart Radio Sponsors and Resources This episode is brought to you by Wix Studio: If you're leveling up your team and your client experience, your site builder should keep up too. That's why successful agencies use Wix Studio — built to adapt the way your agency does: AI-powered site mapping, responsive design, flexible workflows, and scalable CMS tools so you spend less on plugins and more on growth. Ready to design faster and smarter? Go to wix.com/studio to get started. Why Your Clients Might Not Love You (Even if You're Getting Results) Ever feel like you're crushing it for clients, but then they ghost you or churn unexpectedly? There are several reasons why this could be happening and ways to stop it before it kills your momentum. Here's the truth: buyers remorse sets in immediately after a client signs. It's your job to kill that remorse with rock-solid communication and a frictionless onboarding experience. Most agencies think they're good communicators because they answer emails. But clients want more than tasks checked off. They want to feel seen, understood, and confident they made the right decision. If you're not proactively communicating wins (and misses), or if you let your PMs control the narrative without your oversight, you're setting yourself up for churn, no matter how “good” your delivery is. Your Onboarding Might Be Pushing Clients Away As Jason knows from recent experiences as a client, most agencies' onboarding is just an exhausting homework dump on clients who already told you their goals in the sales calls you recorded. Why are you making them repeat themselves, fill out giant forms, or wait for your scattered follow-ups? Your clients didn't hire you to do more work. They hired you to get results while saving them time. Break your onboarding into clear, easy phases, Reset expectations, Use the data you already have (like call transcripts and AI sorting) to fill in the blanks yourself. If you set clear timelines, communication rhythms, and how success will be measured in that first meeting, you'll position yourself as a trusted advisor, not another vendor barking for “assets” they've already shared. This is what makes clients relieved to work with you instead of stressed. Communication: Simple, But Rarely Done Right It's so important for any business to show that you're trustworthy, and you'll show that by doing what you say you'll do, when you say you'll do it. Too many agencies fail to communicate delays, let tasks slip, and think a monthly dashboard is enough. It's not. Dashboards alone mean nothing to most clients. Some need a quick Loom, some need Slack check-ins, others need a simple “Here's what we did, what's next, and why it matters.” Customizing your communication style shows your clients you're paying attention to them, not just copy-pasting your agency SOPs onto their business. This is how you become a trusted advisor, the person they call with challenges (not just tasks). That's how you become irreplaceable. So, which measures are you implementing at your agency to ensure - not just assume - that you know your clients are happy, not only with the results presented but also the overall experience? Want Clients to Stick Around? Be Human When was the last time you called a client you didn't personally sell or deliver on, just to check in and say, “Hey, I'm the CEO, here's my number if you need anything”? Most agencies never do this, but it's one of the simplest ways to build relationships that survive budget cuts and economic slowdowns. If clients only see you as a transaction, you're the first thing to get cut. If they see you as a partner, they'll fight to keep you. Want to take it further? Fly out and have dinner with your top clients once a year. Exchange stories, show them you care, and watch how your retention and upsells climb. Stop Leaving Money on the Table by Ignoring Current Clients Agencies love to yell, “We need more leads!” But often, your easiest growth is sitting right in front of you. If your clients trust you, they'll come to you with new problems—many of which you can solve or connect them with someone who can. This positions you as a problem solver, not an order taker. Instances like this are a great opportunity to be strategic, guide them, and reinforce how much you value the relationship. Results are awesome, but that value is what will take from being transactional to being a value relationship they'll fight to keep in times of economic uncertainty. Why Ongoing Discovery Is Your Secret Retention Weapon If you're selling to clients you can't grow with, you're setting yourself up for frustration. Too many agencies say “yes” to clients who aren't ready, don't want help, or can't commit to scaling. It's like hiring a personal trainer while refusing to stop eating cake every night. They might pay you, but they won't get results—and they'll blame you when they don't. And what about after you've found the right clients? Darby believes too many agencies forget that discovery isn't just for the sales process. Every client interaction should be a sort of ongoing discovery. Agencies that retain and grow accounts are constantly in ongoing discovery mode. As you bring success to clients their needs will evolve, their businesses shift, and what worked four months ago might be irrelevant today. If you're not in tune with those shifts, your agency becomes stale, and you'll get replaced. A challenge for agency owners: How are you staying aware of what's changing in your clients' businesses? Are you proactively checking in, asking about priorities, and aligning your services to what's happening right now? Or are you stuck on autopilot, delivering what they hired you for while missing what they actually need today? Stay curious, stay in discovery, and you'll stay essential. Communication Clarity: 411 vs. 911 To prevent the typical disconnect when clients are unsure of who to reach out to and for what, Darby and Jason recommend this simple but powerful tactic brought by Agency Mastery member, Travis. He tells clients exactly who to reach out to for “411” (info & updates) vs. “911” (emergencies). This eliminates confusion, speeds up communication, and prevents small issues from turning into big frustrations. And when you mess up—and you will—own it fast. Clients don't want spin or silence. They want the truth — fast. One agency Jason used messed up an ad so badly it was embarrassing, and instead of calling to own it, they hid behind Slack messages. Don't be that agency. Mistakes happen. What matters is how quickly and humanly you fix them. Be Human. Clients Crave It. At the heart of retention and growth is human connection. If your agency relationships feel like sterile transactions, you're replaceable. Clients want to feel seen and understood. If everything you share sounds like sugarcoated wins while their results lag, they'll start doubting you. Long-term, high-value clients come from humanizing your interactions—having real conversations, admitting mistakes, sharing wins, and being upfront about challenges. Clients don't want perfect robots; they want partners they trust. Don't Fear AI - Use It to Win Do clients want their agencies to use AI? Overwhelmingly, yes. They just don't what you to use it just to write articles and create crappy images, brands want their agencies using AI to get better results. According to a survey conducted by Audience Audit, 77% of brands are more likely to hire an agency seen as an AI expert, yet only 32% think their current agency is. This is a massive opportunity. But here's the key: don't use AI as a crutch to replace human strategy. Use it to collect, analyze, and interpret data faster so you can bring clients valuable insights and make micro-adjustments that drive real results. Clients want done-for-you solutions that leverage AI under the hood while preserving a human relationship on the front end. Just remember that clients don't care about your systems, your dashboards, or your internal processes if they don't lead to results. They want outcomes with as little friction as possible. AI can help you cut busywork, speed up insights, and refine strategy—but it's your human understanding and relationship that keeps clients paying, referring, and expanding their contracts. Do You Want to Transform Your Agency from a Liability to an Asset? Looking to dig deeper into your agency's potential? Check out our Agency Blueprint. Designed for agency owners like you, our Agency Blueprint helps you uncover growth opportunities, tackle obstacles, and craft a customized blueprint for your agency's success.

Would you like access to our advanced agency training for FREE? https://www.agencymastery360.com/training Do you invest in training high-potential employees to grow into leadership roles—or do you prefer to hire seasoned pros from the start? There's no one-size-fits-all approach to building a great team, but today's featured guest has a clear philosophy: when it comes to agency growth, he prefers to develop A-players from within. For him, building the bench is just as important as building the business. Hamlet Azarian is the founder and CEO of Azarian Growth Agency, an agency that works with mid-market venture-backed startups helping them build their go-to-market strategies. He discusses his agency's "build them up" strategy, focusing on continual learning and curiosity through an academy, webinars, and internships, rather than solely hiring seasoned professionals. He'll address the common agency challenge of talent retention, noting that positive experiences can still lead to future referrals and positive word-of-mouth, even if employees eventually move on. It's an interesting episode where we dive into the importance of human capital and fostering a supportive, value-driven environment for agency success. In this episode, we'll discuss: Growing talent from scratch. Promote those who are ready to shine. The secret to employee retention.  Subscribe Apple | Spotify | iHeart Radio Sponsors and Resources E2M Solutions: Today's episode of the Smart Agency Masterclass is sponsored by E2M Solutions, a web design, and development agency that has provided white-label services for the past 10 years to agencies all over the world. Check out e2msolutions.com/smartagency and get 10% off for the first three months of service. From Go-to Fixer to Full Agency Before he was running his own growth agency, Hamlet was the go-to fixer for venture-backed startups in the trenches of pre-product chaos. VCs brought him in as a high-paid consultant to help fragile startups figure out product validation and go-to-market traction — a risky sandbox where there's barely a product and hardly any money. As the companies he touched turned into multi-million-dollar powerhouses, word got around, more VCs lined up, and the Azarian Growth Agency was born. So as he recalls, it wasn't exactly an accidental start, but considering he was helping startups that could barely write a check, he could not see it turning into a full agency in the beginning. A Culture of Relentless Learning One thing Hamlet doesn't compromise on is curiosity. If you run an agency, you know yesterday's marketing tactic is today's LinkedIn meme. So instead of hiring only ‘seasoned experts,' He invests in creating lifelong learners. How? He built Azarian Growth Academy, which trains up-and-coming marketers on the exact growth strategies his agency deploys for high-stakes startups. Add to that a monthly Growth Lab webinar, Udemy courses (4,000+ students and counting), and a robust internship pipeline — and you get a team that knows not just what to do, but why it works. Education is really central for Hamlet so his people don't just follow checklists — they evolve with the market because they understand the principles behind the tactics. Growing Talent from Scratch (and Letting Them Fly) Does it work? Hamlet shares a story that answers that better than any hiring manifesto. One intern joined as a college senior, left, and rejoined when Hamlet officially hung out his agency shingle. When he saw her application, Hamlet immediately hired her, as she knew her aptitude, passion, and even her weaknesses. Within 6 months, she was running paid ads. By year one, she was pitching clients solo. By year two, she was leading teams and today she's a senior department head. The lesson here is drive and curiosity should be backed with training, opportunity, and real trust. The payoff is massive loyalty and in-house expertise that's molded to your agency's playbook — not someone else's. Promotion by Performance, Not the Calendar Forget annual reviews and rigid promotion ladders. Hamlet's approach is simple: Learn fast, deliver results, get rewarded. To him, some people shine faster than others and, as the agency owners, you don't to limit that potential. Of course, you want to prepare them for the new role, so he tests emerging talent on internal agency projects before putting them on client accounts. If they mess up, the agency learns — not the client's bank account. It's a safe sandbox for risk-taking and skill-building, with performance as the only true gatekeeper to moving up. Flexibility: The Secret Sauce to Keeping Good People How can you keep that talent from jumping ship the second they hit senior level? You don't always. And Hamlet says that's perfectly fine. Even with AI evolving daily, Hamlet's clear that an agency's real moat is people — smart, motivated, curious people who feel trusted and supported to do their best work. Tools change. Channels come and go. But the humans who run them? That's your agency's real asset. In his view, the agency's success is predicated on the owner's ability to bring in talented people on to the team and provide a great environment that encourages them to stay. And the definition of “great” in this case may vary from individual to individual, but Hamlet finds that more than  perks or a foosball table or free LaCroix, it's about freedom. People need room to live their lives — whether that's hopping on a plane to Italy with the kids, or working flexible hours so family time doesn't clash with client deadlines. When people feel understood and trusted, they stay longer. And if they do leave? They become allies, not competitors. Many send referrals back. Some boomerang and return. And nearly all say, “That's where I learned how to do great work.” That reputation becomes your best recruiting tool — a self-feeding loop of great people wanting in. Experience vs. Fresh Eyes: A Never-Ending Balancing Act There's a million ways to grow an agency and there are no easy answers when it comes to hiring. Even if you hire the “experienced pro,” they can become rigid and slow to adapt — a death knell for early-stage growth marketing where experimentation rules. Hamlet's advice is don't bet the farm on resumes alone. Bet on mindset. Surround yourself with good people who share the same values. Look for curiosity, a love of learning, and the ability to fail, recover, and share lessons. Skills can be taught. Hunger can't. Define what you believe. Hire for it relentlessly. Train for skill, reward growth, and build an environment people don't want to leave — and if they do, they still sing your praises. Do You Want to Transform Your Agency from a Liability to an Asset? Looking to dig deeper into your agency's potential? Check out our Agency Blueprint. Designed for agency owners like you, our Agency Blueprint helps you uncover growth opportunities, tackle obstacles, and craft a customized blueprint for your agency's success.

Would you like access to our advanced agency training for FREE? https://www.agencymastery360.com/training How are you positioning your services as essential rather than optional, and accurately measuring growth and profitability to sustain long-term success? How are you measuring your agency's growth and profitability? Today's featured guests unpack how they scaled their PR shop past the million-dollar mark in under four years — and their journey offers valuable insights that any agency owner can apply immediately. Learn why they prefer growing the agency as partners, as opposed to sticking to being solopreneurs, how they've been tracking their growth, and how to over-communicate with clients openly so that choosing you is the easiest decision. Caitlin Copple and Holly Conti are the co-partners of Full Swing PR, an agency that offers senior-level PR services to help amplify clients' story or cause and takes pride in creating authentic, lasting relationships with clients. They discuss their unique partnership dynamics, their approach to quarterly planning and KPIs, and their philosophy on "practicing what you preach" in the agency world. They also emphasize the importance of understanding client needs, demonstrating value, and the shift from focusing merely on publicity to generating tangible client pipelines. In this episode, we'll discuss: Breaking the visionary and integrator partner mold. Making sure to walk the walk in your own business. How to make your business a ‘must-have'  Subscribe Apple | Spotify | iHeart Radio Sponsors and Resources This episode is brought to you by Wix Studio: If you're leveling up your team and your client experience, your site builder should keep up too. That's why successful agencies use Wix Studio — built to adapt the way your agency does: AI-powered site mapping, responsive design, flexible workflows, and scalable CMS tools so you spend less on plugins and more on growth. Ready to design faster and smarter? Go to wix.com/studio to get started. Breaking the Visionary-Integrator Mold Caitlin started Full Swing solo, but always kept Holly in mind as the ideal partner for her business after they met working at an agency. It took some time, though, since Holly was first pregnant when Caitlin started the agency and then busy being a mom to a newborn. However, her involvement progressed, first as a moonlighter, then the agency's first employee, and eventually becoming the co-pilot Caitlin had always envisioned. Founder duos often get asked about who identifies as the “visionary” or the “integrator.” In their case, Caitlin and Holly both think big and get in the weeds. They take turns in both roles, which makes it complicated, but it works with a dose of brutally clear communication and mutual respect. Why work like this? It all comes from their beginnings as working moms in the business. As they explain, they initially treated it like a job share tagging each other in and out in the early days so they could both keep the wheels turning — and the babies fed. Partner Up or Burn Out Some agency owners do prefer to fly solo, but for the ones stuck doing it all alone — losing sleep over payroll, client churn, or the next contract that might vaporize overnight — Caitlin and Holly are living proof that a solid partner is worth their weight in gold. Having someone to say “we got this” when a contract gets pulled from underneath you is priceless. Sure, partnerships are basically work marriages (with all the ups and downs). But good ones make the tough days survivable — and the big wins that much sweeter. Walk Your Talk or Get Called Out Do you make sure your agency is practicing what you preach? Or are you one of the agencies that just “can't find the time” to work on their own website or marketing? Too many agencies hide behind ‘we're too busy with client work' while their own site looks like it was built in 1997 by a drunk intern. In their specific case as a PR agency, Caitlin and Holly practice the tenacity they teach their clients to have. “PR is about tenacity. It's not enough to do good work. People need to see you doing it.” Just like they tell clients to show up consistently, be visible, and ask for what they want. They make sure to do the same. Furthermore, putting yourself in your clients' shoes as small business owners will help you intimately understand the challenges they face and understand the investment they're making on your agency and how much they're betting on the results you can bring. For Caitlin, this means taking people “from publicity to pipeline,” because she understands as a small business owner how important it is to have four time the sales you need to meet your annual budget. In other words, treat your own agency like your most important client — or watch it slowly bleed opportunities. Quarterly Planning, KPIs, and the Secret Sauce So much can change in just one year (as we all have seen with the last couple of years). In the six years they've been in business, Caitlin and Holly have been through a pandemic, an AI revolution, and the economy doing somersaults. At this point, planning once a year and forgetting about it seems like a rookie move. They still set annual goals, of course. But quarterly check-ins are essential to running the day-to-day behind their million-dollar PR engine. Their leadership team meets every week to ensure that quarterly plan is still reality-proof. Revenue is Cool, But Calls Are King Although they do have a topline revenue goal and a profit margin goals for the agency, their north star isn't revenue — it's discovery calls. After realizing there was much more to building a profitable business than hitting the $1 million mark, Caitlin and Holly have been focusing more on pipeline and conversion rates. They know that if they keep discovery calls flowing, the revenue follows. Right now, if they book 10 calls with good fits, five become paying clients. That's a predictable pipeline. Pro tip: Track leading indicators religiously — site visits, key page hits, opt-ins, booked calls, and conversion rates at each step. If something's off (like calls dropping off, or deals stalling), they fix that exact leak before it kills the next quarter. So, if you're still flying blind, eyeballing topline revenue in your QuickBooks and calling it planning —you're normal… but you're leaving money on the table. How to Make PR (or Any Service) a Must-Have In this economy, how to get clients to see your work more as a must-have than a “nice-to-have”? In down markets, budgets get slashed — but essentials don't. So how do you become an essential? You don't chase anyone who's just looking for a PR vanity headline. You focus on clients who want a pipeline, not just press. If you're having a hard time to get clients to see you as an essential, you may be talking to the wrong people. Think about your ideal clients. What do they believe? What are their challenges? If you define your ideal client and start targeting them, you'll attract people who truly see the value you can bring to their business. Over-Communicate. Then Double It Caitlin and Holly share their process openly with prospects. Step by step. No secrets. Some agencies worry they're giving away the farm. Newsflash: they're not. Clients want to trust you know what you're doing — but they don't want to do it themselves. Everyone loves steak but no one wants to butcher a cow. Their transparency means no confusion, no scope drama, and no “you didn't say that” fights later. It's all upfront. And they even turned this transparency into a smart private podcast: “How to Hire a PR Agency” — a brilliant piece of sales enablement they send to prospects to handle all the FAQs before a call. That way, discovery calls stay focused where they should be: the client's business. Do You Want to Transform Your Agency from a Liability to an Asset? Looking to dig deeper into your agency's potential? Check out our Agency Blueprint. Designed for agency owners like you, our Agency Blueprint helps you uncover growth opportunities, tackle obstacles, and craft a customized blueprint for your agency's success.

Would you like access to our advanced agency training for FREE? https://www.agencymastery360.com/training Ever thought about niching down, then bailed because it sounded too painful? Or maybe you tried, but ditched it when things got awkward? Today's guest proves why sticking it out is worth the initial pain — not just to find your niche, but to find the perfect business partner too. Meet Daniel Moscovitch, founder of Flooring Pros Marketing, a digital marketing agency focused on helping established flooring businesses throughout the US & Canada cement their position as the best in their market. He started as a generalist - doing SEO for pretty much anyone with a website and a pulse. However, unsatisfied staying just another “me too” shop competing on price and freebies he doubled down on a single, very specific industry. If you're thinking “That sounds brutally hard…” you're right. And that's exactly why his story is worth paying attention to. In this episode, we'll discuss: Moving beyond simple SEO to offer comprehensive solutions. How clarity helped him find perfect alignment with his second business partner. Leveraging AI for strategic decision-making and process improvement.  Subscribe Apple | Spotify | iHeart Radio Sponsors and Resources E2M Solutions: Today's episode of the Smart Agency Masterclass is sponsored by E2M Solutions, a web design, and development agency that has provided white-label services for the past 10 years to agencies all over the world. Check out e2msolutions.com/smartagency and get 10% off for the first three months of service. Picking a Hard Niche is One Thing. Surviving It is Another. Daniel didn't just decide to niche down overnight. He did what most agency owners do: listened to advice on the matter, got inspired, and then slammed into reality. The first big obstacle he did not expect was letting go of “easy money” and legacy clients to go all-in on a focused market. He knew it was the right call but dropping old accounts and income streams wasn't fun. Next, it was building trust in a market that didn't trust marketers. Turns out, flooring companies aren't like your typical trades. They're often run more like retail stores than contractors. Multiple locations. Bigger payroll. Savvier buyers. And they've been burned by bad marketing agencies before. So just ranking them on page one of Google was not enough. Daniel learned fast that his new niche didn't just want leads they wanted the whole system: branding, follow-up, sales process, outreach, repeat business. In other words: the actual solution not just SEO. Because the real lesson here is about getting under the hood of your client's real pain points, not just selling your “service of the month.” Authority is Earned One Small Win at a Time If you're wondering why Daniel didn't quit (although he did consider it many times), it wasn't because niching was easy. He stuck with it because he saw the momentum stacking up: A podcast appearance got him in front of flooring pros. A trade show speaking gig landed him more eyes. He sponsored a Facebook group. He kept learning exactly what flooring clients actually needed and then built the solutions, piece by piece. One client turned into two. Then five. Then fifteen. Today Daniel's agency is firmly planted as the go-to marketer for flooring pros. He now has the authority, pricing power, and clarity he didn't have as a generalist. Key Takeaway: Don't Quit When it Gets Awkward Daniel didn't win because flooring was “easy money.” He won because he stuck with it long enough to know more about flooring marketing than any other agency out there. Most agency owners quit when it gets awkward - or flip niches too fast. Bottom line: the best niche isn't the easiest — it's the one you hang with long enough to become the undeniable authority. Clarity First, Everything Else Second When he started his SEO agency, Daniel was living in Tel Aviv, working at an SEO agency. Since not a lot of people knew about Search Engine Optimization there, it seemed like an opportunity to go on business on his own, which he did alongside another American friend who also wanted to start his own business. That partnership worked fine for the first couple of years, until it didn't. After Daniel moved back to the US, the relationship felt like playing Tug-of-War. They lived on different time zones, had competing interests and visions and the best call was for each to continue on their own path. It wasn't easy. Daniel has spent the last two years picking up the pieces and setting a new vision for his business. Who are we? Who should we not serve? What kind of agency do we actually want to be? That search for a new stage attracted a new partner — someone who brought the exact pieces Daniel needed, at a moment when he finally had the clarity that's so hard (and so damn profitable) to get right. Only after that did he attract a new partner - someone who brought missing business expertise and industry knowledge. That alignment supercharged sales and positioned them to charge more and work with better clients. AI as an Unexpected Business Therapist Daniel admits: he's a strategist, not a “numbers guy.” But instead of hiring an expensive consultant, he leaned heavily on AI tools like ChatGPT to interrogate his processes, nail down his goals, and even fix onboarding gaps that caused early-client headaches. Great owners use AI not to replace people, but to think better and move faster - especially when you can't see your own blind spots. Pro tip: Have AI interview you about your agency goals. It forces clarity you might avoid on your own. Rebuild Processes Before You Scale With ChatGPT as a voice he can bounce business ideas off of, Daniel has been working on developing clearer processes. While he used to shy away from these conversations, afraid to uncover huge flaws in the business, he now happily dives into deep strategy work to improve client communication and expectations. For instance, the first 100 days with a new client can feel like a ghost town and that can spook even the best-fit clients. Daniel's fix? Using AI and team workshops to tighten internal and external communication, so clients stay engaged while you work. This is crucial for avoiding churn and turning strategy into execution faster. There's No One-Size-Fits-All Path Daniel's advice for agency owners is to avoid comparing themselves to peers at all cost. Everyone is on their own path and success is better defined individually. Had he followed common advice, he would've never gotten into a second partnership, which has really helped the agency's growth. Furthermore, his growth was slower by choice, but deeper because he focused on getting the right clients and the right team before chasing pure revenue. As Jason says: “There's no silver bullet - only silver pieces you combine into your own version of success.” Do You Want to Transform Your Agency from a Liability to an Asset? Looking to dig deeper into your agency's potential? Check out our Agency Blueprint. Designed for agency owners like you, our Agency Blueprint helps you uncover growth opportunities, tackle obstacles, and craft a customized blueprint for your agency's success.

Would you like access to our advanced agency training for FREE? https://www.agencymastery360.com/training Let's get real. If you're stacking your agency's foundation on $20/month AI tools, congrats—you're in the honeymoon phase. But don't confuse cheap for stable. This ain't gonna last. We're in the Uber moment of AI. Remember those $3 rides in 2015? Promo codes flying like candy? Everyone thought, “This is amazing.” Then BOOM—same ride today costs $30, and you don't blink. Why? Because they normalized the spend. AI is doing the same damn thing right now. The Calm Before the Price Surge I was chatting with an agency owner the other week—four-person team doing the work of twenty. She's saving close to $800K in salary using AI. Impressive? Hell yeah. But also? Fragile. Because when AI replaces two full-time employees, it's not going to stay cheaper than lunch forever. These platforms are buying loyalty today so they can raise rates tomorrow. And when they do, the agencies who built real systems will survive while the rest scrambles. Automation Without Documentation = Fragile AF Here's the trap I see all over the place: Agencies getting lean and mean with automation… but not documenting jack. So when a tool changes, prices spike, or a platform shifts—what happens? They're rebuilding from scratch. Again. Smart operators are using AI to build leverage, not just save time. And they're documenting the whole playbook outside the tools. Prompts. Logic. Decisions. Workflows. Everything. Because they know when OpenAI changes the rules (and they will), they'll just pivot—without panic. 3-Phase AI Survival Plan (That Actually Makes You Money) Phase 1: Audit + Adapt List every AI tool you use. Ask: “If this cost 10x tomorrow, what breaks?” Document your workflows without AI. Don't skip this. You're looking for landmines now, so you're not surprised later. Phase 2: Build AI-Augmented IP Productize one service using AI—but don't lean on it 100%. Build templates based on your brain, not just the bot's. Train your agents and save the training outside the tool. Think like a software company, not a freelancer with ChatGPT. Phase 3: Future-Proof Your Value Sharpen your skills. AI is smart, but notstrategic. Build one offer that works with zero automation. Stay close to smart operators. This is a gold rush. Don't go it solo. This Isn't Anti-AI. It's Pro-Sanity. AI is a tool. It's not your team. It's not your strategy. And it's definitely not your moat. Use it. Document it. But don't depend on it. Because when the rules change—and they will—the agencies that built real systems and resilient IP will still be standing. Want a plan to build smarter leverage in your agency? Check out the Agency Playbook. It's the 8-system framework we've used to help agency owners like Derek Champagne scale from 7- to 8-figures in under a year.

Would you like access to our advanced agency training for FREE? https://www.agencymastery360.com/training Ever wonder what separates a $1M agency from a $30M agency? It's not just better SEO or more employees. It's how you run the business behind the scenes. We sat down with today's featured guest to dig into what's powered his insane growth from barely crossing seven figures back when we first met… to now staring down $35–$40 million in pure service revenue. He's sharing some great advice on the evolution of his role as CEO, his new-found love for podcasting, and all kinds of golden nuggets for agency currently in the “no man's land”. Chris Dreyer is the CEO of Rankings.io, a law firm marketing services agency that delivers exceptional results for attorneys without compromising on customer service. He'll discuss his agency's substantial growth from under a million to over $30 million in revenue, his reliance on data and key performance indicators (KPIs), the transformative role of AI in various aspects of his operations, the importance of in-person client meetings for building relationships, and much more. If you're still guessing your numbers or putting off tracking your team's time — you'll want to pay attention. In this episode, we'll discuss: The CEO's true job. Hidden agency growing pains. The key to client happiness. In-person hustle and outbound sales. Subscribe Apple | Spotify | iHeart Radio Sponsors and Resources This episode is brought to you by Wix Studio: If you're leveling up your team and your client experience, your site builder should keep up too. That's why successful agencies use Wix Studio — built to adapt the way your agency does: AI-powered site mapping, responsive design, flexible workflows, and scalable CMS tools so you spend less on plugins and more on growth. Ready to design faster and smarter? Go to wix.com/studio to get started. Why Data Became Like a Religion Back when Chris and I first locked ourselves in a tiny Atlanta room for a workshop, Rankings.io was barely peeking over the $1M mark. He was still deciding who to serve and how. Fast forward about 8-9 years to today, and he says there's no bigger reason for his success than his top-to-bottom data obsession. Most agency owners track just enough to feel busy: a few pipeline numbers, maybe close rates if they're fancy. But Chris tracks everything. He knows the lifetime value of a client paying $5K a month versus $10K a month. He knows exactly how each account manager's retention rate impacts revenue. He even scores sales reps like a fantasy football league. And it's not just vanity metrics. If an account manager is great at keeping clients but terrible at preserving the original retainer size, they fix it. If time tracking shows poor utilization? They fix it. It's relentless. The big unlock for him was getting a real CFO to build this machine — and shifting from QuickBooks to more robust systems like Sage. No more flying blind or hoping for the best. If you don't know your LTV, churn, win rates, and retention by the exact dollar, you're leaving growth up to luck. How AI Became His Secret Weapon (and Why You Should Care) Most agency owners dabble in AI: a blog here, a few prompts there. Chris has gone full cyborg. Every single month, his team uploads their entire reporting package into ChatGPT. They don't just glance at dashboards — they get an AI board of advisors that points out trends, flags issues, and even suggests campaigns based on sales funnel leaks. If they have clients applying but not booking, the AI says: launch a re-engagement sequence. If they're not sure why the expense spike looks off, the AI will cross-check it with your event calendar. Chris used to hate looking at financials — now AI does the heavy lifting. When it comes to AI agents, they're not doing as much and prefer to use AI assistants for content, link building, and optimization. He even has an AI board of advisers with different personalities. This isn't replacing people. It's leveling them up. It's like strapping a rocket to every role — so you can do more without burning out your team. If you're not leaning on AI for context and next steps, you're probably making slower (and worse) decisions than your competitors. The CEO's True Job: Gotta Catch ‘em All Now that he's running an agency pushing $40M in service revenue (not pass-through, real revenue) Chris defines his role as: “Playing people Pokemon. Gotta catch ‘em all. I get the clients, and my president keeps them.” He sets the vision, runs point on marketing and sales, hosts the podcast, and stays the face of Rankings.io. Meanwhile, his right-hand man, Stephen, owns retention and delivery. This split lets Chris hunt big opportunities without getting bogged down in fulfillment fires. It's the perfect example of how an owner's role must evolve. If you're still stuck in the weeds, wearing every hat, and calling that “leadership” — you're capping your agency's growth. The goal isn't to do everything. It's to build a team that does everything better than you ever could alone. And Chris's story is living proof. The Hidden Growing Pains Nobody Warns You About Ever heard of the dreaded “no man's land” for agencies? For Chris, it began after he crossed the $8M to $10M mark and things got painfully awkward fast. In this stage, you're forced to hire the roles that don't directly bring in revenue: HR, finance, middle managers. Suddenly, your once-scrappy margins start leaking everywhere. It feels counterintuitive, all these new salaries, and yet no extra billables. But here's the catch: this is the awkward but necessary step that'll set you up with the infrastructure to move from $10M to $15M, $20M or beyond. This is generally the zone where you feel like an imposter CEO — one foot in the hustle, one foot in the corporate world you swore you'd never build. The truth is, every growing agency owner faces this inflection point. And if you get it right, you build a structure that can handle scale. If you get it wrong, you risk staying stuck at the same revenue ceiling year after year. You Can't Turn It Off — And Maybe That's Okay Most founders agree they find it difficult to turn their business brain off, and honestly, they don't want to. Business is the hobby. While their kids are at soccer practice, their brain is rewriting the service agreement or tweaking a proposal. Sure, there's a cost. Vacations come with podcast episodes in the car. Weekends sometimes mean scanning P&L spreadsheets. But, as Jason and Chris admit: the key to staying sane isn't to “balance it perfectly” — it's to have the right partner who gets the obsession. Because when you're building a business that supports dozens, even hundreds of families, switching it off just isn't realistic. So you find the support system that lets you go all in and come home for dinner. Why Core Values Actually Matter Early on, you might roll your eyes at “company core values.” Chris admits he did and saw it as just a lot of fluff. But once you're managing 50, 100, or more people, vague values don't cut it — you need a shared language to protect the culture. His agency now runs on three non-negotiables: Excellence (do great work, always) Execution (don't just talk, get it done) Grit (stick with hard things for the long haul) While he used to rely on platitudes like “team player” — he sees now that the wrong person will be weeded out fast as long as the core values are clear. He also bails at the mention of “work-life balance” in an interview. Because for this team, the culture is built for people who like working hard. The Surprising Key to Client Happiness Think your killer case studies will keep clients happy forever? Think again. Client happiness is very subjective and your biggest churn risk isn't bad work — it's bad relationships. Sure, you can track Net Promoter Scores all day. But real retention comes from catching early warning signs, which Chris calls “saves”. A client going quiet, missing calls, or hinting they're not vibing with an account manager should be signs to take action, if you start tracking them, as he has. And here's the overlooked move more agencies need to revive: visit your clients in person. Everyone's got Zoom fatigue. Booking a flight and breaking bread goes a long way toward making you not just a vendor, but a trusted partner. How In-Person Hustle and Outbound Hunting Keep You on Top Even with all the fancy dashboards, AI copilots, and mega forecasting tools, Chris and his president still jump on planes to shake hands with clients. They even budget for it. When you're running a high-ticket service where each client can be worth $125,000 or more over their lifetime, dropping a couple grand to show up in person is a no-brainer. It's how you show you care more than the next guy who's sending templated emails and hiding behind Slack. Chris's take is simple: Want to stand out? Do what you say you're going to do. Show up. Make your clients look like heroes. When a big-name CEO flies out to see you — even if you didn't sell them the deal — you remember that. Big relationships should get the handshake treatment. Using AI for Confidence in an Agency Acquisition Chris didn't buy another agency until he was already pushing $30 million, while most owners pull that trigger way earlier to leapfrog plateaus. Why wait? According to Chris, he didn't have the confidence to do it. Until AI changed that. He used ChatGPT to run diligence questions, draft the LOI, check for financial holes, and sanity-check the entire earnout structure. Sure, he has a great CFO — but that AI second brain made the whole thing faster and way less intimidating. Now that he's got the first deal under his belt, he's hungry for more. That's how scale works: get clarity, take the shot, rinse and repeat. Pro tip: If you're scared to buy, partner, or hire, dump your numbers into AI. Ask it what it would worry about if it were buying you. It'll show you every skeleton in the closet — so you can fix them now. Why Outbound Sales is Your Insurance Policy Chris used to be very resistant to doing outbound but now it is saving him from the Google rollercoaster. Inbound is sexy when it works. But we all know it can be feast or famine. Algorithms change. Referrals dry up. And you're stuck hoping this month's pipeline looks like last month's. After getting tired of hoping, Chris built an outbound team that's now about 30 people deep. He's got BDRs making 50 high-quality calls a day, sending out handwritten notes with books, running multi-channel outreach, and gifting prospects to cut through the noise. Each practice area has its own sales enablement rep feeding lists, building sequences, and arming the closers with context. It's consistent and it means Rankings.io can hunt, not just fish. Big lesson: if you don't control at least three lead sources (inbound, outbound, and strategic partners), your agency's growth is on borrowed time. Don't put all your eggs in Google's basket. Outbound is insurance. Do You Want to Transform Your Agency from a Liability to an Asset? Looking to dig deeper into your agency's potential? Check out our Agency Blueprint. Designed for agency owners like you, our Agency Blueprint helps you uncover growth opportunities, tackle obstacles, and craft a customized blueprint for your agency's success.

Would you like access to our advanced agency training for FREE? https://www.agencymastery360.com/training How does a print designer become the founder of a thriving strategic web agency? Spoiler: It wasn't all smooth sailing. But this agency founder figured out how to stop being the bottleneck, leverage systems and AI, and make his agency way more profitable along the way. It all began by creating a digital brain for his agency. In this episode, Shawn Johnston, owner of Forge and Smith, a Vancouver-based agency shares how he's been building bespoke WordPress sites for 13+ years. He'll share his story—and some seriously smart tips for agency owners looking to scale and create more freedom in their agency. In this episode, you'll learn: Why documenting your processes is key to scaling How to use AI to build a “digital brain” for your agency How to step out of day-to-day work and empower your team Tips for focusing your team on high-value, strategic work Subscribe Apple | Spotify | iHeart Radio Sponsors and Resources E2M Solutions: Today's episode of the Smart Agency Masterclass is sponsored by E2M Solutions, a web design, and development agency that has provided white-label services for the past 10 years to agencies all over the world. Check out e2msolutions.com/smartagency and get 10% off for the first three months of service. From Print Design to Web Agency Owner Like a lot of us, Shawn didn't set out to build an agency. He started as a print designer back in 1996, cranking out newspaper ads when CSS came on the scene, sparking heated debate at the office over whether it would change the internet or not. Shawn got curious, taught himself to code, and started building sites on the side. What started as a hobby turned into freelancing… and when the 2008 housing collapse hit, he went all in. He hustled hard on Craigslist, building $1,500 WordPress sites and quickly realizing he was making more than his day job. This gave way to his first lesson in business: Hustle works early on, but you can't scale without systems. When He Knew It Was a “Real” Agency Starting out, Shawn was able to handle all the WordPress development, design, and strategy by himself. By setting up some repeatable pieces, he was able to grow his client list, with some of them coming back for site support. As projects stacked up, however, he hit a wall: He couldn't sell, deliver, and support all at once. He decided his first hire would handle client support, so he could free up time for higher-value work. From there, he slowly backed himself out of development… then strategy… then design - replacing himself piece by piece. Of course, this didn't automatically erase all the agency's problems. Initially, it only created a new set challenges. Adding new pieces to the team made their lack of documented processes very clear. For a while, the handoff confusion created meant everything continued to run through Shawn... The real issue was that there was too much knowledge trapped in his head. Why Documented Processes Are the Key to Scaling The obvious solution was to start documenting everything from UX components to strategy guides to build quality standards. From that point on, everyone knew who was responsible for what and at what point. The goal wasn't to limit creativity but to empower the team to make smart decisions without running to Shawn for answers. For Shawn, a focal point of this shift had to be underlying the agency's why. Everyone on the team had to be very clear on: Why do we work with clients the way we do? Why are we doing things this way and not that way? Making sure everyone understood the overall goals would inform the decision-making, cultural aspects, and would help the team work cohesively. Documented systems = freedom for you and clarity for your team. Win-win. The Next Step: Creating a ‘Digital Brain' for Your Team Fast forward to today, and Shawn is using AI to level up even more. He records and transcribes sales calls, discovery calls, and proposal work—then synthesizes it into a knowledge base his team can actually use. No more “Shawn said this one thing on a call” confusion mid-project. The team can look back at the records and apply direction to move forward without him. We've talked about the next step with AI for agency owners: train an AI assistant on your agency's entire knowledge base. That means training it with everything you have in your knowledge bank, including: Past client insights Brand guidelines Design patterns Sales conversations Internal processes Apply these practices ASAP so that your team can tap that knowledge instantly — without pinging you for answers. Think of it as your agency's “digital brain” and the key to your freedom. Why Low-Code + Prebuilt Systems Are Boosting Profits One of Shawn's smartest moves has been leaning hard into reusable systems and low-code tools. He's baked strategy into UX components, aligned dev processes with design frameworks, and streamlined builds so 80% of each site is repeatable. That frees the team to focus on the 20% that really matters—the strategic stuff that drives results (and justifies premium pricing). More profit, faster delivery, better outcomes. Everybody wins. Ready to Stop Being the Bottleneck in Your Agency? If you're tired of everything running through you and want your team making smart decisions without constant handholding. Then it's time to plug into a community of agency owners who've figured this stuff out. Inside the Agency Mastery Mastermind, you'll learn exactly how to: -Document and systematize your agency's IP -Leverage AI to scale your team's capabilities -Increase profit margins with smarter processes -Step fully into the owner seat—so you can lead, not grind You don't have to figure this out alone. Come hang out with the smartest agency owners scaling today.

Would you like access to our advanced agency training for FREE? https://www.agencymastery360.com/training Have you ever found yourself grinding endlessly, only to pause and think, “Is this really what I signed up for?” Maybe you started your business chasing freedom—only to end up feeling trapped by the very thing you built. It's a common trap: the belief that working harder and enduring more pressure will eventually earn you the right to enjoy life after a big exit. But as today's guest discovered, you don't need to wait 10 more years to start living. What you really need is a clearer why, a stronger structure, and the right people around you—people who understand your vision and support your growth. Blake Denman is the president and founder of Rickety Roo, a remote agency specializing in SEO and paid search marketing. He'll discuss his unconventional path into entrepreneurship, which was influenced by a personal injury, and the importance of designing your business and life around personal values, not just growth for growth's sake. He also shares his time management strategies, how he uses AI for self-reflection, and his perspective on the mental load of entrepreneurship. If you're an agency owner still doing everything—from ops to admin to taxes—you'll relate to his story. In this episode, we'll discuss: Strategic hires that might results in your identity crisis. Designing your life before it designs you. Time audits, energy filters & the “$5K task” rule. Figuring out what you actually want. Do you thrive in chaos? Manufacture some healthy pressure. Subscribe Apple | Spotify | iHeart Radio Sponsors and Resources Wix: Today's episode of the Smart Agency Masterclass is sponsored by Wix Studio, the all-in-one platform designed to help agencies scale without the headaches. With intuitive tools, robust native business solutions, and low maintenance, Wix Studio lets your team focus on what matters most—delivering exceptional value to your clients. Ready to take your agency to the next level? Visit wix.com/studio and discover how Wix Studio can transform your workflow, boost profits, and strengthen client relationships. The Moment that Forced Him to Slow Down Blake didn't set out to build an agency. Like a lot of agency owners, he fell into it. What started as freelancing to pay the bills while he finished school and pursued a different career path took a hard left turn—literally—when a serious bike accident landed him with a traumatic brain injury. That moment forced Blake to slow down. Rebuild. Rethink. And when he got back into client work, he realized something: just because you can do it all doesn't mean you should. Like many agency owners, he hit the familiar ceiling of capacity. So he started hiring. First contractors. Then a coach in 2019. That's when the game really changed. The Pivot Point: Strategic Hires (and the Identity Crisis That Follows) When you've built your agency from the ground up, letting go isn't just hard—it can mess with your head. One of the pivots that really made a difference in Blake's agency was the strategic hires that required him to let go of some areas of the business. For instance, when he finally handed over operations. “I was like that John Travolta meme—just looking around wondering what to do with myself.” And that's the truth no one talks about: letting go of operations isn't just a tactical decision. It's emotional. You've tied your identity to being the guy who does everything. And suddenly… you're not. That shift sparked something deeper—what Blake calls “identity paralysis.” Not a crisis, but a freeze. A moment of, “If I'm not the operator, who am I now?” Spoiler: that question is the start of real CEO-level growth. Designing Your Life (Before It Designs You) Most agency owners plan every quarter like a military op: KPIs, OKRs, revenue targets. But how many plan their life that way? Blake started mapping his ideal year: the trips, the purchases, the experiences. Then he calculated what income he actually needed to live that life. We're mostly led to believe those goals are too far away, but the first time he did this he was just $1,500/month off. So many agency owners think they need to sell their business to finally live the life they want. But often, you don't need to sell—you just need to restructure. What if the business could serve your life now instead of being the thing you have to escape? Time Audits, Energy Filters & the “$5K Task” Rule Most people say they value their time but let it slip through their fingers, which is why you need a time tracking method that works for you. After trying a few, Blake got a framework from one of his early coaches. He categorizes his weekly tasks into four buckets: $5, $50, $500, and $5,000/hour value. If you think your time is worth $5,000 but the time audit shows its mostly spent in the $5 or $50 buckets, congrats—you've just diagnosed why your growth is stuck and your energy's tanked. To his surprise, this is what happened to Blake, who was spending way more time than he thought on the $5 and $50 columns. You don't scale by doing more. You scale by doing less of the wrong things. What Do You Actually Want? If your agency isn't giving you time, freedom, and joy… what the hell are you building it for? Blake now runs his agency with zero calls on Mondays. Focus time is blocked. The calendar is color-coded. And most importantly, the business doesn't need him 60 hours a week to grow. He also has the whole team on Brain.fm, a tool that uses science-backed audio to get you in the zone faster. Some would call that a lifestyle business, but so what? Lifestyle business can be extremely profitable too. Why not build your business around what you like and don't like? People who  struggle for 20 years to then sell their agency find that after all their work they have maybe ten years left to do the things they want to do. Lessons for the Owner-Operator Ready to Evolve If you're reading this and feeling that twinge—that mix of burnout and “I want more” clarity—take these cues from Blake: -Let go of the identity that your agency is you. -Map your ideal life, then build your business to fund it. -Hire for elevation, not just delegation. -Your value isn't in the tasks you do. It's in the vision you hold. From the Hustle Hamster Wheel to the Hedonic Treadmill You want the 8-figure agency, right? So did Blake. Until he realized that every time he hit a new goal, he'd feel good for a week… maybe five days. Then it was back to baseline. This is what's called the Hedonic Treadmill—and agency owners live on it without realizing it. We chase growth for growth's sake. Or worse, for external validation—from peers, clients, even family. Blake stopped to think about what was next after he had the money. Was he supposed to save it? Spend it? Did he even need that much? Define what you want your life to look like, and build your agency to support that. Don't fall into the trap of chasing growth for validation more than for yourself. If you let go of the idea of just hitting a number, surround yourself with the best team and clients, and set your priorities, you'll be able to go after what you really want and live your best life. Agency Owners & the Calm in the Chaos Most agency owners have had the type of upbringing that's them great under pressure. Calm in chaos. Laser-focused when everything's on fire. Of course, this can also become a trap if you start creating chaos just to feel normal. For instance, you may seek pressure to push you into action. In his case, after years of needing the chaos, Blake turned to Claude to figure out a way to manufacture chaos without the disastrous consequences. His AI coach creates a “painful penalty” for missing a goal. For instance, donate $1,000 to a political group you can't stand if you miss a revenue target. That'll light a fire. Point is: for some people motivation isn't just about dreaming big. If you need some added pressure to get working engineer consequences that make staying small more painful than pushing forward. Do You Want to Transform Your Agency from a Liability to an Asset? Looking to dig deeper into your agency's potential? Check out our Agency Blueprint. Designed for agency owners like you, our Agency Blueprint helps you uncover growth opportunities, tackle obstacles, and craft a customized blueprint for your agency's success.

Would you like access to our advanced agency training for FREE? https://www.agencymastery360.com/training What really happens after you sell your agency? Brent Weaver, founder of UGURUS, knows firsthand — and it wasn't the beach-and-cocktails story most agency owners imagine. In this second half of our conversation, Brent opens up about what really happens after you sell a business, why his team stuck around (when they had every reason to bolt), navigating the shift from entrepreneur to executive within a corporate machine. He also lays down a fresh perspective on where agencies are headed in the AI era — and why human advantage is still your biggest asset. If you missed Part One, go back — it sets the emotional stage. This one dives into the raw aftermath. Brent Weaver is a veteran digital agency founder who scaled UGURUS, sold it not once, but twice, and is now charting a new course inside a larger ecosystem. But behind the polished LinkedIn update is a journey filled with doubt, identity shifts, and deep loyalty to team and customers. In this episode, we'll discuss: What no one tells you about life after a big exit How Brent is using AI at scale inside E2M Why “human advantage” still wins in an AI-driven world The risk agencies face if they treat AI like a gimmick How to protect clients from the “accountability gap” AI creates Subscribe Apple | Spotify | iHeart Radio Sponsors and Resources E2M Solutions: Today's episode of the Smart Agency Masterclass is sponsored by E2M Solutions, a web design, and development agency that has provided white-label services for the past 10 years to agencies all over the world. Check out e2msolutions.com/smartagency and get 10% off for the first three months of service. What Really Happens After the Deal Closes When most agency owners fantasize about the big exit, they think freedom, cash, maybe a beach. But Brent paints a more nuanced picture: “Selling is one of the most emotional business events you can go through. You feel every end of the spectrum — excitement, fear, uncertainty.” And no, he didn't tell the team beforehand because he wasn't even sure himself. Looking back, he remembers asking himself: ‘Is this what I want? What's going to happen to our customers? Our team?' Spoiler: Nobody left. Because Brent didn't cash out and disappear. He pushed hard to give people incentives to stay, rolled up his sleeves, and stayed to help 10x the next chapter. Brent's first acquisition with Cloudways was scrappy, entrepreneurial, and chaotic in a good way. But once DigitalOcean came into the picture everything changed. Some of the team joined a small company where they had a voice — then suddenly, it was all process, approvals, structure. And not everyone loves that. More recently, after staying at the newly-acquired agency, Brent took a step back from a direct client-facing role. At the same time, he had a bigger role in the back office, so despite people not seeing him as much, they also knew he was still around working on the business. To his knowledge, no one left because of the acquisition. The agency saw the normal amount of churn for the business but all clients and team members knew that Brent was trying to provide a sense of continuity after the sale. Why the Learning Curve is Shorter — and Scarier BBack when Brent started learning about the business, he had no idea how to write a proposal. He didn't know anyone in the industry who could orient him, and ended up writing one in the only format he knew: a high school essay. It was bad. It talked about his interests, why he was trustworthy and why they should hire him. Comparing that experience from the early 2000s to now, where kids are doing triple backflips on BMX bikes at age 12 because they can watch the trick 10 minutes after it's invented on Instagram, the speed at which someone can learn anything now is incredible. And even overwhelming. For agency owners, this means two things: There's never been a better time to start. There's never been a harder time to stand out. AI, Meta, and the Future of Agencies Ever since WordPress came out, everyone thought agencies were dead. To Brent, all it did was create more demand for people who knew how to use it. Same with Meta's new tools or any AI platform. Brent's take is clear: The tools will make advertising more accessible. But that will actually increase demand for agencies who know how to go deeper. In his view, there's no world where his old restaurant client — who had a flip phone and a fifth-grade education — was ever going to run his own ads. He just wants to cook. Translation: AI doesn't replace relationships. It just raises the bar on what value you're bringing to that relationship. Infusing AI Horizontally Across a Business: Brent's New Role at E2M The reality is, even in the AI era people still crave trust and connection. Even in a world where AI is analyzing spreadsheets and diagnosing ad performance better than most marketers, the decision to act still comes down to a human being. “I look at a spreadsheet,” Jason says, “and I want to throw up. But I put it into AI, and suddenly I get clarity.” That's the shift—AI can sift through the noise, but humans still make the call. Business owners aren't about to turn over their bank accounts to a voice assistant. There's always going to be a place for a trusted advisor—someone who knows the game, who gets results, and who's got skin in it with you. For agencies, that's the edge. If you can interpret the data and turn it into action, you're still wildly valuable. This isn't about one person nerding out on ChatGPT after hours. AI isn't a tool for the top—it's a mindset for the whole team. At E2M, he's stepping into a leadership role to help infuse AI horizontally across the company. That means operations, creative, sales—everyone using AI not as a crutch, but as a co-pilot. The agencies that survive the next wave will be the ones who stop treating AI like a gimmick and start treating it like a business partner. Brent's advice: don't wait. Start now, even if it's nights and weekends. Fire yourself from every job you're not elite at. And that now includes jobs that AI can do faster, better, and at scale. "Leverage these tools to gut-check your deliverables,” he says. “You owe it to your clients.” The Legal Line and the Accountability Gap But it's not all upside. Brent drops a crucial warning about accountability. AI might be amazing at cranking out contracts, pitch decks, and even deal structures—but if it screws up, who takes the hit? If chat tells you to jump off a bridge, and it goes south, you're not suing OpenAI,” Brent jokes. You're just canceling your $20 subscription. And that's where real coaches, consultants, and experts still matter. There's a human soul to leadership, and a layer of accountability AI can't (and maybe shouldn't) touch. The smart play? Start with AI to generate, then apply your judgment to validate. Do You Want to Transform Your Agency from a Liability to an Asset? Looking to dig deeper into your agency's potential? Check out our Agency Blueprint. Designed for agency owners like you, our Agency Blueprint helps you uncover growth opportunities, tackle obstacles, and craft a customized blueprint for your agency's success.

Would you like access to our advanced agency training for FREE? https://www.agencymastery360.com/training 00:00 The "Poppi" acquisition and winning by being different 00:30 Brands need agencies to help them “stand out” 01:30 Agency's role: From vendor to transformation partner 02:00 Transformative client results through positioning 02:50 Five tactics for agencies to help clients win differently 04:10 The "Hell Yes" framework for brand building   Pepsi just dropped $2 billion to acquire Poppi. Let that sink in. A gut-health soda brand that didn't even exist a decade ago is now a multibillion-dollar player — without some bloated VC war chest or Super Bowl ads. Why? Because they didn't just sell a drink. They sold vitality without boredom. Just like Liquid Death isn't selling water. They're selling rebellion in a can. This matters to you because your agency clients are still playing the safe game. Bland branding. Forgettable messaging. Funnel tweaks and ad spend tricks. But the world doesn't reward better. It rewards different. And that's where you come in. Your Agency's Real Role You're not here to push pixels or track conversions. You're here to make your clients matter. To help them stop blending in and start building brands that get followed, shared, and loved. In this episode we'll break down exactly how to do that—with a proven playbook called the “HELL YES” Framework. But first, let's look at what these breakout brands got right. The Big Brand Lessons (You Should Be Using) Help Clients Define What They Believe in (And What They're Against). Poppi didn't sell soda. They sold gut health. Liquid Death didn't sell water. They sold identity. Brands that break out don't try to be better. They choose to be louder about what they stand for. Build a Brand that Lives Beyond The Product. Help them create their presence in culture. What's the founders point of view? What's the audience they want to turn into a community. From reels & TikTok make sure that message is out there. Package. Reframe offer as outcomes, not service. Teach them to Create Demand. Help them post scroll-stopping content that really builds trust from someone that'll want to learn more. Help Them Become Known for Something. Your clients will need a signature method that is repeatable and has a catchy name. That's how they'll own a category. The HELL YES Framework (How to Build Brands That Get Followed) Here's the full breakdown from Jason's playbook: H – Hook with a Belief Choose a bold POV. Rally people around something real. Don't try to please everyone—draw a line. E – Elevate the Outcome Sell transformation, not tasks. Rename and reframe. “The Visibility Engine” beats “SEO setup” every time. L – Lead with Culture Get them living where the culture lives—Reels, TikTok, Shorts. Turn content into a vibe. L – Lock in Their Framework Give their offer a name. A method. A repeatable process. That's how they own a category. Y – Yield to Simplicity Kill the fluff. Be painfully clear. One offer. One CTA. No jargon. E – Engineer the Experience Make onboarding and delivery unforgettable. Brand the process. Delight people. S – Share the Wins Loud Don't just toss out metrics—tell the story. Make the transformation the headline. Real Talk: You're Sitting on the Solution You've already got the skills. The strategy. The services. What your agency really needs is a sharper positioning and a clearer method — just like Zach and Jack did. Whether you're stuck pitching work that doesn't excite you anymore or just tired of clients treating you like a vendor, the shift starts here. And if you're ready to build a brand that people don't just buy from, but believe in… Let's stop chasing better. Start building bolder. Because when your agency leads movements, not just marketing—you become unforgettable. Agency Mastermind Still feel like you're winging it? You're not alone. Most agency owners hit a plateau because they're stuck in the business, buried in decisions, and disconnected from people who get it. The agencies killing it and scaling faster found out they needed to be in the right room. Go to https://www.agencymastery360.com/agency-mastery and get access to a community of agency owners sharing their data, deals, strategies, and mindset shifts.

Would you like access to our advanced agency training for FREE? https://www.agencymastery360.com/training How do you turn a $99 course, launched before it was even fully built, into a 7-figure coaching business? Today's guest did just that. And he's here to share why scrappier beats slick every time. If you've ever second-guessed launching messy, this episode will feel like validation. Brent Weaver is on the show talking about his start with UGURUS, the valuable learning that can come from starting before everything's in place, and why what came after selling his business wasn't exactly what he had expected. Today we kick off a two-parter with Brent Weaver, the founder of UGURUS, who went from building websites in high school to launching one of the most successful coaching programs for digital agency owners. If you've ever second-guessed your “build it as you go” approach — or wondered whether selling $99 courses online could ever turn into something real—this episode will feel like a shot of validation. In this episode, we'll discuss: Launching and selling without a net. The real reason Brent Weaver sold UGURUS. The unexpected, gut-punch part of selling.  Subscribe Apple | Spotify | iHeart Radio Sponsors and Resources Wix: Today's episode of the Smart Agency Masterclass is sponsored by Wix Studio, the all-in-one platform designed to help agencies scale without the headaches. With intuitive tools, robust native business solutions, and low maintenance, Wix Studio lets your team focus on what matters most—delivering exceptional value to your clients. Ready to take your agency to the next level? Visit wix.com/studio and discover how Wix Studio can transform your workflow, boost profits, and strengthen client relationships. Building Something Before It's Built In 2012, Brent's agency was building on a tool called Business Catalyst, which led to a side project called BC Gurus, a blog for Business Catalyst users that eventually turned into a full-fledged business. That little blog became a membership site where his team posted business content on how to grow a Business Catalyst agency and, after selling his agency, was the seed for what eventually became UGURUS, a platform offering training and coaching to help agency owners close more deals and scale their businesses. Just as they were preparing to move forward with the site without the Business Catalyst element, as this tool had been discontinued, Brent found the name UGURUS had just gone up for auction. It all seemed serendipitous as they easily won this auction and the new stage of the business began. Lessons in Launching (and Selling) Without a Net Throughout their journey, Brent and his team learned something that every agency owner needs to hear: you don't need everything figured out before you start. And in fact, if you try to, you'll likely never launch at all. The early success of their $200 self-paced course helped them build an audience. But it wasn't until they started offering deeper, high-ticket coaching that things clicked into place. Selling a few $2,000 seats was way more scalable than chasing thousands of low-ticket customers. They did all of this without the luxury of a huge marketing budget or slick automation. Just hustle, relationships, partnerships, and a whole lot of belief in what they were doing. This is something Brent and Jason have both experienced. They agree it's better to go out, execute with what you have, and get feedback, rather than waiting for the perfect moment. Brent Weaver on Building, Selling, and What Came Next Brent and his team didn't start with a fully polished product. In fact, when they first launched their flagship 10K Bootcamp, they spent all their time selling it before creating it. In their view, if they couldn't sell it, they wouldn't build it. But they sold it. About 30 seats at $2,000 a pop. Of course, it did help that they weren't starting from scratch. They had a list of about 10,000 emails from their time running BC Gurus, which helped immensely. And then they had one week to create the first session. What followed was a whirlwind of late nights and Adobe Connect calls (for those who remember what that was) as Brent stayed one step ahead of each week's live session. It was clunky. It was imperfect. But it worked. Why? Because Brent was committed. He responded immediately to the slightest client dissatisfaction. He personally handled delivery. And he overdelivered wherever possible. That scrappy MVP became the foundation for a business that helped thousands of agencies get out of the feast-and-famine cycle. This kind of growth doesn't happen when you wait for the stars to align. It happens when you ship early, listen hard, and iterate fast. The $22,850 Lead Magnet That Took 6 Minutes to Create Let's talk about lead magnets that actually convert. The first product Brent ever sold was a gloriously titled “the $22,850 Website Proposal.” That wasn't a gimmick. It was a real client proposal that closed a big deal—with cross-sells, recurring revenue, and multi-location projects all baked in. Instead of building something fancy, he stripped out client details, dropped it into a Google Doc, and gave it away. Six minutes of work. Hundreds of thousands of downloads. The lesson? Your most valuable assets are often sitting in a dusty folder, not in your imagination. Proof beats polish every time. The Real Reason Brent Sold UGURUS So why sell a successful business? For Brent, it wasn't burnout—it was the pull toward a bigger vision. After buying out his co-founder and riding the COVID rollercoaster, things just weren't lighting him up anymore. Then came Cloudways—and more importantly, a series of conversations with their CMO, Santi. In a way, he was no longer getting what he wanted from the business, and the more he spoke with Santi, and saw what they were doing with their platform, the more he dreamed about turning that into an agency growth community. Hence, what started as co-branded webinars and strategy calls evolved into shared vision sessions. Eventually, Cloudways pitched an acquisition. The appeal? A chance to bring agency coaching to a massive platform with 13,000+ agency users. Brent saw an opportunity to merge purpose with scale and went all in. When the Buyer Gets Bought Here's the plot twist: just ten months after the acquisition, Cloudways got acquired by DigitalOcean, and suddenly UGURUS was a small fish in a billion-dollar pond. DigitalOcean was focused on AI, GPUs, and hardcore infrastructure—not coaching communities. So eventually, Brent's team and vision were sidelined. He stayed on. He fought for his team. But like he says—when you sell, it's no longer yours. And if the buyer shifts priorities, you've got to live with it. That's the tradeoff. Don't Sell Unless You Know What's Next The hard truth here is don't sell unless you know what you're waking up to the next day. Brent thought he had his next chapter lined up. He had a six-month transition plan. A roadmap. But then came the cultural disconnect. Engineering talk at happy hours. Roadmaps that had nothing to do with agency growth. The adventure he signed up for didn't look like what it became. That's the gut-punch part of selling. You can have a clean exit and still feel like you lost something. That's why clarity before the exit is non-negotiable. Next Time on Part Two: What really happens after the exit? Brent pulls back the curtain on post-sale culture shock, why some big opportunities fizzled, and how his next move with E2M caught even him by surprise. You won't want to miss this. Want to Build an Exclusive, Scalable Agency That Clients Line Up For? Our Agency Blueprint helps you identify growth bottlenecks, build community-driven strategies, and position your agency as a category of one.

Would you like access to our advanced agency training for FREE? https://www.agencymastery360.com/training What if one bad hire wrecked your agency? What if the red flag you're dismissing tanked your margins? Most agency owners learn these lessons the hard way. But you don't have to. In this episode, Collin Slattery shares the red flags, hiring mistakes, and leadership shifts that helped him build an agency that's not just growing—but growing sane. He's here to share stories that can help you shortcut the pain and build smarter, sooner. From pricing hesitations to over-hiring juniors to waiting too long to fire a bad hire, he brings great insights about what not to do—and what to fix fast. At the end of the day, the goal isn't just growth—it's sane growth. Collin Slattery is the founder of Taikun Digital, an agency that primarily focuses on the e-commerce space, doing Facebook ads, Google ads, and creative landing pages for clients. He'll share his scrappy beginnings, the mistakes that cost him (and taught him), and the non-negotiables he's learned about red flags and respecting your own time as an agency owner. His strategy now is simple: only do the work that's uniquely his. Delegate the rest. And when hiring, pay for people who love the stuff you hate. In this episode, we'll discuss: How to spot sales-process red flags before they cost you. Why hiring friends usually fails—and how to do it right if you must. What to do before a big client leaves—so you're not scrambling. The hiring mindset that leads to faster, saner growth.Subscribe Apple | Spotify | iHeart Radio Sponsors and Resources E2M Solutions: Today's episode of the Smart Agency Masterclass is sponsored by E2M Solutions, a web design, and development agency that has provided white-label services for the past 10 years to agencies all over the world. Check out e2msolutions.com/smartagency and get 10% off for the first three months of service. Starting with $300 and a Canadian Pharmacy Right out of high school—class of '07—Collin started making money online during what he calls the "Wild West" days of digital marketing. Think bootleg Canadian pharmacies, early Google Ads, and cracked versions of Adobe software. One of his first official clients was a skincare brand called Spa Technologies, which he charged $300 a month to handle “all the web stuff”—from email and SEO to advertising and site updates. He even landed a local government gig in New York early (back when procurement was a little less formal). It wasn't glamorous, but it was enough to plant the seed for what would eventually become his agency. Eventually, Collin took the boutique route. He leaned into complex client problems and bespoke solutions, found his zone of genius, and grew from there. Hiring Red Flags During the Sales Process One of the most expensive lessons agency owners learn, and one Collin has relearned, is ignoring red flags during the sales process. It's amazing how anyone can forget to trust their gut when they need the money, but Collin has learned this lesson by now. From clients with unreasonable expectations who ghost meetings to those who show up late or treat your time like it's optional, he has learned to put a limit. Today, he waits five minutes—max—for a prospect to join a call. If they don't show, he's out. Because if someone doesn't respect your time on the sales call, they're definitely not going to respect your process, boundaries, or team later on. The biggest red flag for Collin is clients who offload all responsibility. If they're promising to be your “best client ever” or insisting they'll deliver everything you need “right away,” it's worth digging deeper. Of course, clients who are too involved can also be a problem. However, the agency can't be more invested than they are in their own success. To prevent this, establish a pricing structure where at least 50% of the project is paid upfront, with clear dates for the remaining payments.. This can help irresponsible clients get moving on what they're supposed to deliver, although Jason shares a story about a client who paid 100% upfront (before kickoff!) but delayed the project by not providing what was promised. That's why process and payment timelines matter. If you don't control scope and expectations from day one, you'll pay for it in time, profit, and sanity. When One Bad Hire Derails Everything Collin's been on both ends of the hiring spectrum—over-prioritizing skill and under-prioritizing culture fit… then swinging the other way and hiring people he liked without checking if they actually had the skills. Spoiler: Neither approach worked. On top of that, he's been guilty of stubbornly keeping people too long, thinking he could “fix” them. However, he's now confident that owners can usually know on Day 1 if they made the wrong hire. Week 1 if you're generous. People usually start with their best foot forward, so if that's shaky, it's a red flag. The real game-changer was learning to trust his gut early and cut things off quickly—for everyone's sake. Hiring Friends? Set Very Clear Expectations Should you hire friends or family? Most agency owners will say no—and Collin would've agreed… until one friend hire actually worked out. There were many factors that contributed to this, including expectations, where the agency is at, and the person's character. The first time he hired his best friend, it was a disaster. The second time, it was a former mentee who had already sold his own agency, knew the ropes, and was a perfect culture fit. They were open, direct, and mutually respectful—and it worked. The lesson? If you do go down the friend/family road, set clear expectations, give both parties an exit ramp, and value the friendship above the business if things go sideways. The Secret to Real Growth: Do Less of What You Hate According to Collin, delegation and self-awareness are the great drivers of his agency's success. He focused on hiring people to do the things he was either bad at or dreaded doing—even if he was good at them, because chances are someone else loves the stuff you hate doing. That mindset shift allowed Collin to get laser-focused on what he does best—sales, marketing, and solving complex “math problems” for e-commerce clients. Now he wakes up looking forward to work instead of dreading it. When a Big Client Bails, Your Margins Matter More Than Ever Recently, Collin's agency lost its biggest client temporarily due to the pressures of the new tariffs. Instead of panic, his response was grounded and strategic. He's built his agency to survive losses like this and encourages agency owners to do the same, by thinking about pricing, hiring, and not sabotaging your own sales engine. Thanks to this mindset, the agency had healthy profit margins baked in. If losing one client sends you into a tailspin, you're probably not charging enough. You need to build your business in a way that you can survive losses without cutting down. That's not just about pricing—it's about operating with margin as a mindset. One of the biggest mistakes agency owners make is hitting pause on sales because things feel good. Collin's advice is to always be selling. And if capacity is tight, don't pause—raise your prices. Pro tip: Implement a sliding scale strategy. Every few clients, bump your pricing and track retention. You might find that you're working less for more. Want to Grow Fast? Hire Ahead of the Demand Let's talk about one of the hardest lessons agency owners learn: hiring too late. Collin admitted he brought on clients he couldn't serve well—and paid the price in churn and stress. This year, he's trying a different strategy by hiring ahead of the demand. And not just anyone—hire senior people. Yes, it's a luxury. But it's also how you buy back your time and protect your client relationships. Junior hires sound good on paper—cheap, trainable, full of potential. But they require time and energy you may not have. As Collin explains, the real value of a senior hire is autonomy because they can own it from day one. ”At the end of the day, if you don't build margin into your agency, one bad month can wipe you out.” Do You Want to Transform Your Agency from a Liability to an Asset? Looking to dig deeper into your agency's potential? Check out our Agency Blueprint. Designed for agency owners like you, our Agency Blueprint helps you uncover growth opportunities, tackle obstacles, and craft a customized blueprint for your agency's success.

Would you like access to our advanced agency training for FREE? https://www.agencymastery360.com/training Is your agency falling behind in the AI revolution—while competitors pull ahead? If you've handed off AI adaptation to your team and progress still feels sluggish, you're not alone. The uncomfortable truth? Delegating AI could be the biggest threat to your agency's future. Today's guest, Brandon Na, has seen firsthand how agencies rise—or fall—in the face of disruption. From early SEO days to the AI era, he's learned what it really takes to lead through change. And it starts with not outsourcing the future. Many employees feel more fear than excitement about AI—worried it could signal the end of their careers. Instead, agency owners should be very involved in this process and actively try to identify team members who are excited to learn about AI and already experiment with it on their own time. The agencies that will thrive aren't the ones that delegate AI innovation down the chain of command but the ones that build transformation strategies around those natural innovators.    Brandon Na is the founder of Seattle Organic SEO, as well as a venture capital pro and acting CMO. His path into agency life started with a simple desire to never have to do cold sales. So instead, he hacked his way into visibility through SEO. This path took Brandon to South Korea, where he helped scale an education company by 1,400%. He eventually returned to the U.S., launched his agency, and dominated the search rankings in a matter of months—all from a handshake mentorship deal with a guy exiting the space. In this episode, we'll discuss: How you can avoid losing your way after ‘making it'. Will SEO survive AI? Why you shouldn't delegate AI adoption.  Subscribe Apple | Spotify | iHeart Radio Sponsors and Resources Wix: Today's episode of the Smart Agency Masterclass is sponsored by Wix Studio, the all-in-one platform designed to help agencies scale without the headaches. With intuitive tools, robust native business solutions, and low maintenance, Wix Studio lets your team focus on what matters most—delivering exceptional value to your clients. Ready to take your agency to the next level? Visit wix.com/studio and discover how Wix Studio can transform your workflow, boost profits, and strengthen client relationships. From Amazon to Agency Life (And What Jeff Bezos Taught Him About Leadership) Brandon started out working at future giants like Amazon and Expedia and could've had a very different career had he stayed. Working at tech giants like Amazon and Expedia might sound glamorous today—but back then, it wasn't. Low pay, stock options that seemed worthless, and a corporate culture that left him unimpressed taught Brandon an early lesson: big titles don't equal strong leadership. From his experience with Bezos, he learned that big titles don't always mean big character and that leadership—true leadership—isn't about prestige, but about clarity, adaptation, and purpose. Next, Brandon had his first try at entrepreneurship with a real estate practice before he ever touched agency work. Knowing by experience that sales was just not for him, he wondered how to get people to find him, which naturally led him to find SEO. In the early days of SEO, Brandon decided to master the craft before launching his agency. He took a few years to learn, test his skills, and leverage some contacts before starting his agency. Why So Many Leaders Lose Their Drive After Hitting Big Milestones Seeing how big CEOs started and how they've evolved, one wonders how they manage to turn it all around. How do they get to a point in their leadership where the stories go from being terrible at managing employees to making history? For Brandon, it's about never getting too comfortable once they have the money. These trailblazers who have managed to conquer the world will not just retire and live a quiet life, they'll just choose other ways to create and make an impact. Many of them eventually move into venture capital or find other passions. It's an advisable path for agency owners who end up selling their businesses, because otherwise they can end up losing their sense of purpose. If you're chasing the next milestone remember that if you don't define your purpose beyond the hustle, the success will feel hollow. Growth Comes from Pressure - So Turn It Up Although living through the pressure of working in tech during those early years was not easy, Brandon now looks back and can see it with different eyes. As he has learned from his work as CMO: “If you're stuck on a problem—make the problem bigger.” Because being too comfortable, you can lose your edge. It may take time, since with AI, market shifts, and internal team chaos pulling us in every direction, it's easy to lose clarity, but if you focus on finding that problem you'll grow. It can sound counterintuitive, but in his experience bigger problems force bigger focus, more urgency, and better thinking. It's easy to spin your wheels when you're “fine”—but when the pressure's real, you find out what you're made of. Can SEO Still Win in an AI World? When a friend of Brandon told him he barely used Google anymore, he assumed it was because as a computer engineer, he was just ahead of everyone else in these trends. However, just five weeks later he realized he also was now using AI. After years in SEO, even he finds himself turning to AI tools like ChatGPT instead of even opening Google. So is Google still relevant, or has AI already taken the crown? The bottom line is the way people find information is changing. And that has massive implications for how your agency helps clients get found. Whether you're creating blog content, developing ad strategies, or running full-scale marketing campaigns—AI is in the mix now. Platforms like Gemini, Claude, Perplexity, and even custom-trained agents are already out in the wild. And they're fast. Ultimately, the game is changing fast, and agencies that aren't adapting might already be falling behind. If your agency is still running fully human-powered workflows while other teams are using agents to ideate, write, design, test, and iterate faster than you can blink, you're already behind. But don't panic. The solution isn't panic—it's leadership. Don't Delegate the Future—Own It One of the biggest traps agency owners fall into is just telling their team to “Figure out how to use AI,” and walking away. The reality is your team may not be motivated to lean in. Many employees view AI as a threat to their job—not a tool to make them better. Instead, try: Identifying the team members already experimenting with AI tools. Giving those people the mandate and the resources to go deeper. Investing in training and testing to see what works—and what doesn't. And most importantly, lead the charge yourself. The agencies that survive the next 3–5 years won't just be the ones doing better creative—they'll be the ones moving faster, thinking smarter, and leading with tech. Do You Want to Transform Your Agency from a Liability to an Asset? Looking to dig deeper into your agency's potential? Check out our Agency Blueprint. Designed for agency owners like you, our Agency Blueprint helps you uncover growth opportunities, tackle obstacles, and craft a customized blueprint for your agency's success.

Would you like access to our advanced agency training for FREE? https://www.agencymastery360.com/training What if scaling your agency wasn't about adding clients—but building a community that fuels growth from within? During Covid lockdowns, today's featured guest felt the need to turn his clients into a community, hosting events where they could get to know each other and build relationships. To this day, it remains one of the best changes he's introduced at his agency. With a dedicated community, a focused niche, and a cap on the amount of clients the agency takes, he created a sense of exclusivity that turned his agency into a “category of one” business that continues to thrive. Join us as he unpacks how his agency journey began, how he accidentally ran into his exclusive niche, and the ways he found to turn clients into members. Oli Luke is the founder of Orange & Gray, a hearing healthcare marketing agency that's not just thriving—it's become a “category of one.” He shares how going ultra-niche, building a true community, and capping client growth actually led to bigger success. His story offers agency owners a powerful blueprint for growth by focusing less on volume and more on depth. In this episode, we'll discuss: The power of creating scarcity. Choosing community over clients. Why client selection will save you headaches. Using AI to have a bigger impact with clients.  Subscribe Apple | Spotify | iHeart Radio Sponsors and Resources E2M Solutions: Today's episode of the Smart Agency Masterclass is sponsored by E2M Solutions, a web design, and development agency that has provided white-label services for the past 10 years to agencies all over the world. Check out e2msolutions.com/smartagency and get 10% off for the first three months of service. Creating Category Leadership with Your Agency Oli started in the marketing world as early as fifteen years old, running a “questionably illegal” business that relied on marketing savvy more than morals. That spirit of experimentation, however, continued to evolve into something far more focused and in 2017 he launched a niche agency focused solely on hearing healthcare. Like many agency owners, Oli knows the pain of being a generalist—serving anyone and everyone just to keep the lights on. But once he committed to a hyper-niche model, everything changed. “We help a very specific type of business,” he explained. “There's only about 2,000 potential clients in the world for us. So we're not looking for quantity—we're looking for quality.” According to Oli, once you're playing in such a specific arena, you're playing against maybe three competitors, which helps you become very good at that sweet spot. By focusing on a tight, underserved market, Oli's agency was able to create a “category of one” positioning. It wasn't just another agency—they were the agency for hearing healthcare and that kind of positioning is gold. The Power of Capping Growth and Creating Scarcity Here's something you don't hear every day: Oli has no plans to scale his agency to the moon. In fact, he's capping it at 100 clients. “We don't want more. We want depth of relationship,” he said. This kind of intentional limitation creates natural scarcity and urgency and real, earned exclusivity. Prospects know there's a limit, so they know if they leave coming back will mean paying significantly more. It's a model Seth Godin once praised: deep focus, selective intake, and high trust. Oli's clients know they're one of the few, which raises the bar for everyone—team, clients, and prospects. Community Over Clients: How COVID Changed Everything Oli's most unexpected move—and perhaps his most impactful—came during COVID when, like many agency owners, he had to rethink everything. Prior to that, he ran a very traditional agency, with one-to-one relationships with clients that mostly didn't know each other. This all changed during COVID, when amid the shutdowns and uncertainty, Oli's team started hosting weekly “campfire chats” to bring them together. That simple shift sparked a powerful transformation. “We almost pivoted from being just a marketing agency and to being a communications company,” he said. By bringing clients together, the bonds formed turned into something more powerful than any campaign. That organic community—born out of crisis—evolved into something deeper. Today, Oli's agency doesn't just have clients; they have members. And the community has only grown since the days of the campfire chats. For him, there's nothing more powerful than getting people together, especially in this new AI era where human connection will become increasingly rarer and more important. There are monthly calls, print newsletters, annual events, and even an Austin Powers-themed meetup in London for their U.S. clients. The community is more than a retention tool—it's a moat. Members feel like they're part of something elite, something valuable. It's not just about services; it's about belonging. Why Client Selection Matters As established, if you're running an agency and not building a community of your clients, you're missing one of the biggest strategic advantages available today. Yet, it may lead to competition – some of those clients won't want to be in the same room as their competitor. That's why your client selection matters. You can't afford to bring in clients who don't align with your values, even when you're in startup mode and tempted to say yes to everyone. Learning this will take some time, but it'll always be worth it because, more than just executing for them, you're making them part of something bigger—giving them access to relationships, tools, and strategies that help them grow. And that, right there, is what makes the difference. Finding a Niche... by Accident Like many agency owners, Oli didn't start with a clear niche. In fact, his entrance into the hearing care industry in the U.S. was totally accidental—through a client speaking engagement in Houston. Back then, he had a small marketing company in the UK and a client who was doing work as a speaker in the US hearing care industry and invited him to one of his events. There, Oli shared some ideas with the audience. Just tips that seemed obvious to him in the marketing industry but were eye-opening to his listeners in the hearing care industry. He was asked to help some in that audience implement these ideas and, before he knew it, he had found a niche. When the Market Shifts, Community Wins It's easy to panic when markets get weird. And let's face it—we're in a weird season right now. But the truth is, these “down” times are often where the biggest opportunities lie. Remember 2008? 2000? COVID? Each one of those eras had agency owners panicking—and also created massive opportunities for those willing to adapt. When your competitors pull back, you lean in. And it's not just theory. Community-first strategies during downturns can redefine your agency. They create stickiness, loyalty, and value beyond deliverables. People remember who helped them weather the storm—and they stick around. This is especially true for agencies that have found their ideal niche and have therefore found a way to be of significantly more value than just the doing. These agencies are in a position to lead their clients through these changes and provided much needed leadership. The AI Evolution: Smaller Teams, Bigger Impact There's a lot of noise about AI replacing agencies. But let's get real: Agencies aren't going away. They're just changing. At the end of the day, agencies are the middle man between someone having a problem and arriving at the solution. People will still need help, they'll just be able to do more with less people. What used to take 100 employees might now take 30—or even 10. The work doesn't vanish—it evolves. It becomes smarter, faster, and more strategic. You still need strategy. You still need people making decisions. But with AI, your execution becomes more powerful. And your clients know this. They're not oblivious. Bigger brands are already coming to agencies saying, “We want the same output with fewer people—powered by AI.” If you're not ready to answer that call, you'll get left behind. That's why understanding AI—and being able to communicate your expertise in it—is going to be a game-changer. Supercharged Workflows with AI Agents One of the ways agencies should start leveraging AI is by creating their own internal AI agent using ChatGPT. For instance, you can use it to train that agent with: Case studies Client challenges CRM data Brand voice Once you do that, share it with your team so they can start using it to write a blog post, a LinkedIn update, or any kind of content—and it generates something better than most humans would. This is where the future's headed. Not to replace humans—but to empower your team with incredible leverage. You're not building a bot to do your job—you're building a smarter team that gets more done. One More Tip: Start a Podcast Even with all his experience and success in choosing a niche, creating community, and using AI, Oli maintains that starting a weekly podcast was the best move he ever made for the business. It drove client attraction, retention, education, and brand recognition. And with AI, it's never been easier to create high-quality content consistently. If you're not creating content—especially in podcast form—it's time to rethink your strategy. Want to Build an Exclusive, Scalable Agency That Clients Line Up For? Our Agency Blueprint helps you identify growth bottlenecks, build community-driven strategies, and position your agency as a category of one.

Would you like access to our advanced agency training for FREE? https://www.agencymastery360.com/training Ever dreamed of building a $100 million agency, selling for a massive payday, and seeing your name in headlines? It sounds like the ultimate win. But what happens when that dream starts to crack under pressure? I've live through that and it fell apart fast. Not because we didn't grow but because we skipped the hard stuff. The boring stuff. The stuff that no one talks about when you're scaling fast. If you're an agency owner chasing scale, considering a sale, or wondering if your current path is sustainable, this is the truth bomb you need. The Highs: Acquisitions, Headlines, and the $100M Mark Let's start with the dream. A few years ago, I was part of an agency that had a bold plan: acquire successful agencies (each doing $1M+ in EBITDA), pay half in cash and half in equity, and build a powerhouse primed for an epic exit. And it worked… for a while. 10 agencies acquired Over $100M valuation $8M+ in EBITDA But underneath the surface, cracks were forming. The fast growth masked deep structural issues. The Downfall: Debt, Boardroom Drama & Chasing the Wrong Goals The downfall wasn't due to lack of revenue or bad acquisitions—it was bad decisions behind the scenes. Every new agency came with debt, and as soon as you start taking on debt, you commit to maintain a certain growth level with the banks, a pace that was frankly unsustainable. To keep the bank away, we needed to keep buying more agencies. However, when board politics stalled future acquisitions, everything ground to a halt. No growth = default = collapse. The worst part was that founders who sold for a mix of cash and equity saw their second payday vanish. Why? Because they sold control—and lost the ability to steer the ship. What We Got Wrong (So You Don't Have To) Let's break down the key mistakes most agencies make when chasing fast growth—or a flashy exit: No Unified Vision: There was no clear post-acquisition mission across agencies. There was only focus on money and fast growth. No Specialization: Everyone was selling everything to everyone—no authority, no leverage. No integration team: Unless you fully integrate agencies across systems they won't add as much value as you hope. Each agency continued to operate under separate slack channels, tools, separate chaos. They each stayed in their own lane and as a result it all felt like small businesses operating under one logo. No Standard Offerings: Each agency had its own pricing, tools, and processes. No Leadership Alignment: Power was handed to the wrong board members who didn't share the vision. As a result, it was impossible to scale sustainably. The Right Way to Scale: Build Something You Actually Want to Keep If you're feeling stuck in your agency—juggling sales, delivery, hiring, and managing—it's time to stop and recalibrate. Start with this simple exercise: Draw a circle around your fist on a piece of paper. Outside the circle: list everything you hate doing in your agency. Inside the circle: write what you love doing. Now start building your team and systems around that, with clarity instead of complexity. Most agencies don't need more people, they need more focus. You need clear goals, accountability, and owning your niche. Remember: generalists survive, specialists scale. The more specific your positioning, the faster you'll grow. 5 Core Takeaways for Smarter Agency Growth Build Around Your Zone of Genius Design your role around what you love. Delegate the rest. Get Focused More people won't fix chaos. Clear goals, roles, and offers will. Own Your Niche Generalists survive. Specialists scale. Productize Your Offer One clear offer. One repeatable outcome. One path to scale. Don't Chase the Exit—Build a Business You Don't Want to Escape Freedom isn't selling. Freedom is clarity, systems, and loving what you've built. So if you're fantasizing about selling, slow down and ask yourself: Why? The grass isn't greener on the other side—it's greener where you water it. So don't just build to sell. Build to love what you've built. The right growth, the right systems, and the right people will make your agency unstoppable—and valuable, whether you exit or not. Want the full playbook? Grab a copy of Accelerating Your Agency and learn the exact framework behind sustainable, scalable, and enjoyable agency growth.

Would you like access to our advanced agency training for FREE? https://www.agencymastery360.com/training If you're the visionary still stuck doing the work, you're not scaling—you're surviving. Joaby Parker knows that loop well. From launching his agency straight out of college to nearly burning out and walking away, his story is a masterclass in doing too much, too long. In this episode, you'll hear how Joaby broke free from the grind, stopped bottlenecking his team, and built a business that scales without him. He shares his journey from founding his first agency right out of college to walking away and returning to agency life with a new approach and mindset. He reveals what caused his early plateau, why he left to work client-side, and how returning to the agency world taught him how to lead, grow, and eventually let go of the creative and account management roles that were holding him back. Joaby Parker is the founder and CEO of Cover 3 Growth Partners, a strategy-first agency based in Logan, Utah, focused on food and CPG brands. With a background in creative marketing and brand development, Joaby's approach combines practical business strategy with creative execution. He discusses how his passion for marketing and working closely with various agencies inspired him to start his own and reflects on the challenges of the early years, the gradual momentum they built, and how he learned that building a successful agency isn't about doing more. It's about doing less of the wrong things—and putting the right people, values, and systems in place so you can grow without burning out. In this episode, we'll discuss: The turning point that made him leave his first agency and come back stronger. How his mindset around delegation and trust evolved. Why being a visionary means you're probably a bad manager—and that's okay. Subscribe Apple | Spotify | iHeart Radio Sponsors and Resources Wix: Today's episode of the Smart Agency Masterclass is sponsored by Wix Studio, the all-in-one platform designed to help agencies scale without the headaches. With intuitive tools, robust native business solutions, and low maintenance, Wix Studio lets your team focus on what matters most—delivering exceptional value to your clients. Ready to take your agency to the next level? Visit wix.com/studio and discover how Wix Studio can transform your workflow, boost profits, and strengthen client relationships. Why Joaby Chose the Agency Path: Early Missteps & Major Momentum Joaby had a purposeful entry into the agency space, after developing a passion for marketing working with several agencies on the client side at Health & Fitness. He had the opportunity to work hand in hand with many agencies and knew he would someday want to run one himself. After a few years of learning experience, he and his partner made the jump to start their own agency. Being quite young, their first few years with the agency were marked by a lack of direction. Their first big turning point came after securing a contact with Chemdry that led to a complete rebrand of this company. Soon after, when HomeDepot acquired the carpet cleaning business, Joaby and his partner had the opportunity to assist in this transition period, helping all Chemdry franchisees take advantage of this new HomeDepot partnership. This is really when the business took off and Joaby and his partner started to deal with other aspects of scaling. The Breaking Point That Made Him Go Back to His Roots Growth flatlined. Burnout crept in. Joaby's agency hit the ceiling—and he couldn't figure out why. Turns out, it wasn't a marketing problem. It was a management problem. Initially, Joaby attributed this stagnation to geography—living in a small town seemed to be limiting their growth potential, especially during a time when digital outreach was much more challenging than it is today. Around this same time, an existing client presented Joaby with an opportunity to join their internal team. It was a great opportunity and a needed break from the agency life so he accepted, after securing another partner that could take over his contributions at the agency. It felt like going back to basics for him and gave him the time and space to think about what went wrong at that agency. Looking back, he sees the reason for that first agency's plateau was a lack of processes. While referrals from existing clients provided a steady stream of work, they were insufficient for sustained growth, which ultimately led to a plateau in growth. Ultimately, they struggled to find opportunities to get in front of people to do more work. This scenario is all too familiar for agency owners. They typically reach a breaking point where their small founding teams can no longer handle the client load. The natural response is to hire more staff, which increases revenue but often decreases profit margins—leaving owners feeling trapped and pressured. The key differentiator between agencies that remain stuck and those that break through to the next level is making the strategic decision to raise prices rather than simply adding more bodies to the team. You Don't Need to Do It All—You Need the Right People Looking back, Joaby now realizes he could have pushed the agency to that next stage of growth, but at the time, the pressure felt overwhelming. He still wasn't good at running an agency, just good at working in one, and although it seemed like the business was evolving, the reality was that Joaby had more costs than ever and was working more hours than he ever had before. At that moment, the opportunity to go back to work on the client side seemed like an escape. Joaby admits that, for most of his career, he was a bad business manager. If you're reading this as a visionary-minded agency owner—which many are—you might recognize yourself in his story. Rather than forcing yourself into an ill-fitting management role, the solution is to build a team that amplifies your natural strengths. This means hiring self-managing professionals or dedicated operations managers who can handle the day-to-day business mechanics, freeing you to focus your energy where it creates the most impact. The common objection to this approach is cost: "I can't afford to hire that level of talent."If this is your case, then the easiest solution will always be to raise your prices. How to justify that raise? Narrow your focus. When you become the go-to expert for a particular niche, you'll discover clients who are willing to pay for your true value rather than treating your services as a commodity. Stop Running the Mouse—Start Leading the Team These days, Joaby's creative involvement is way down from what it used to be. For many years, most of the agency's creative work still needed his approval in some way or another. However, at one point he and his partner realized that, whenever he wasn't stuck doing the creative work the agency grew and once he did go back to it, the agency stagnated. Agency growth is often limited by the founder, not the market, not the clients, and not even the team. When he focused on building and leading—growth resumed. If you're still running the mouse, reviewing every piece of creative, or handling every big client call, you're not leading—you're doing. And that's the bottleneck. It took Joaby some time to learn this. In fact, other than overseeing creative, he was also main account manager, where he didn't do the best job, since he couldn't fully focus on that area. In the end, client complaints about lack of focus helped Joaby recognize that it was time to hire account managers and start delegating. Scaling an agency isn't about doing more—it's about doing less yourself. By embracing your role as a leader, not a doer, hiring smarter, and building a team around your vision, you create the space for sustainable growth. Whether you're stuck in the grind or unsure how to let go, the answer isn't working harder—it's building better. Do You Want to Transform Your Agency from a Liability to an Asset? Looking to dig deeper into your agency's potential? Check out our Agency Blueprint. Designed for agency owners like you, our Agency Blueprint helps you uncover growth opportunities, tackle obstacles, and craft a customized blueprint for your agency's success.

Would you like access to our advanced agency training for FREE? https://www.agencymastery360.com/training Most agency owners screw up their first sales hire. Why? Because they either hire the wrong person, or refuse to let go of control. Travis Hoechlin used to think building a sales team was a waste of time—until he realized he was the bottleneck. In this episode, you'll hear how he went from solo closer to leading a performance-driven team that fuels his agency's growth. Travis Hoechlin is the CEO of Rise Up Media, a marketing company specializing in law firm services. He shares insights into his journey from working at a large agency to starting his own and discusses the challenges of stepping out of a comfortable position and the motivations that ultimately led him and his business partner to take the leap into entrepreneurship. Travis also shared his experience building a top sales team, his logic behind hiring experienced seller instead of going for junior salespeople he could train, and how he keeps his team motivated and competitive. In this episode, we'll discuss: What most owners get wrong when building sales teams. The hidden cost of overlooking your top performers. How to hire competitive closers who don't need babysitting. Incentives that actually work (even with a remote team). Subscribe Apple | Spotify | iHeart Radio Sponsors and Resources E2M Solutions: Today's episode of the Smart Agency Masterclass is sponsored by E2M Solutions, a web design, and development agency that has provided white-label services for the past 10 years to agencies all over the world. Check out e2msolutions.com/smartagency and get 10% off for the first three months of service. The True Cost of Overlooking Top Performers Travis began his career working for one of the largest agencies in the industry. Despite previously owning a mortgage company, he and his current business partner found themselves settling into the comfort of corporate life—big paychecks, steady accolades, and a sense of stability. But deep down, Travis always knew he wanted to build something of his own again. It wasn't until a disagreement with his former boss that he finally made the leap. Looking back, he wishes he'd made the move sooner. Still, the way it unfolded taught him an important lesson. As one of the agency's top sellers, Travis had earned a spot in their elite President's Club—or so he thought. When he was unexpectedly passed over, it became clear that his contributions weren't truly valued. That moment of frustration became the catalyst for change. Sometimes, it takes a setback to shake us out of complacency. Travis's story is a powerful reminder: comfort can be deceiving, and top performers often leave not because of the work, but because their impact isn't fully recognized. For agency owners, it's a call to action—acknowledge your best people, or risk losing them. The Journey from Seller to Sales Leader As one of the top salespeople at his former agency, Travis was a natural fit to lead sales at his own. But like many high-performing sellers, he was hesitant about building a sales team. Great salespeople don't always make great managers—and Travis wasn't sure he could find others who would match the drive and success he brought to the table. His competitive nature added another layer of resistance. The idea of hiring someone who might rival his performance didn't sit well with him at first. But over time, realized that no matter how strong he was on his own, two or three skilled salespeople giving their all would far outperform his solo efforts. That mindset shift changed everything. Once he found the right people—sales pros who believed in the agency's mission—Travis stepped back. He moved out of the day-to-day sales role, choosing instead to support the team and help them succeed. After all, they had taken a chance on a growing agency, and he felt a responsibility to help them thrive. Many agency owners struggle with this transition. It's hard to let go of what you're great at. But as Travis discovered, tying your value to a single role—especially one you refuse to let go—can turn you into your agency's biggest bottleneck. Growth requires trust, delegation, and a willingness to lead from the side, not just the front. Strategy for Building a Premium Agency Sales Force Once Travis fully committed to building a sales team, he hit the ground running—bringing on two salespeople to start, then two more just a few months later. Since then, he's made it a habit to hire two to three new sales reps each year, fueling the agency's continued growth. While many agencies try to save money by hiring junior reps, Travis believes that route often costs more in the long run. He only recruits experienced, high-performing sales talent since inexperienced hires need extensive training, close management, and time to ramp up—resources many growing agencies simply can't afford to spare. Instead, Travis looks for people who are naturally competitive, hungry to earn, and confident in their ability to close. In his view, a good salesperson can sell anything. If a new hire hasn't sold agency services before, he keeps their focus simple for the first 30 days: just book him meetings. From there, he leads the calls while they shadow, learn, and build the confidence to eventually run the sales process on their own. Additionally, rather than hiring one rep at a time, he prefers onboarding two or three at once. Sure, not all of them will work out—but with multiple hires, at least one or two typically stick, and you're not back at square one. Plus, the healthy competition that comes from a group ramping together drives performance. When top salespeople are surrounded by peers who are also gunning for results, it pushes everyone to level up. For Travis, building a sales team isn't just about offloading calls—it's about creating a high-performance culture that multiplies results and drives the agency forward. Incentives That Actually Build Culture—Even Remotely Travis understands that great salespeople are driven by more than just commission—they thrive on competition, recognition, and rewards. In corporate environments, these high performers are often motivated by bonuses, contests, and incentive trips—and Travis knew his agency needed to offer the same kind of energy to attract and retain top talent. Having been the top seller at his previous job, he experienced firsthand how powerful the right incentives can be. So, he implemented a clear and compelling incentive structure for his team: hit an annual sales target of $850,000, and you qualify for an all-expenses-paid trip to a luxury destination, such as their recent five-day retreat at the Four Seasons in Costa Rica. But it's more than just a reward—it's a shared goal that unites the team. With about a third of his salesforce working remotely from across the globe, these trips serve as a rallying point, fostering camaraderie, motivation, and culture. This blend of healthy competition and team connection is critical in sales. By setting ambitious but achievable goals—and celebrating those who reach them—Travis has built a culture where individuals are motivated to win, and the entire team moves forward together. Do You Want to Transform Your Agency from a Liability to an Asset? Looking to dig deeper into your agency's potential? Check out our Agency Blueprint. Designed for agency owners like you, our Agency Blueprint helps you uncover growth opportunities, tackle obstacles, and craft a customized blueprint for your agency's success.  

Would you like access to our advanced agency training for FREE? https://www.agencymastery360.com/training Ever build a business that “looked” successful—but left you feeling empty? Jeff Hilimire sure did and then he did something about it. In this episode, we unpack how he turned a successful agency career into a mission-driven movement—building purpose-led businesses, launching a global volunteer initiative, and writing books that challenge how we think about impact. Today's featured guest always genuinely enjoyed agency life—something he quickly realized was the exception, not the norm. That realization led him to a mission: helping others discover greater meaning in their business journey. Whether it's through his books, his leadership, or his venture that unites developers to build websites for nonprofits in just 24 hours, he is all about turning intention into action. We have the pleasure of welcoming back Jeff Hilimire, the podcast's very first guest, nearly eleven years ago. He shares what drives him to help business owners build purpose-driven companies, why he started writing books, and how he carved his own path in the publishing world. You'll also hear about his latest work with Purpose Group, his thoughts on operationalizing purpose, and how to lead with clarity through times of crisis. In this episode, we'll discuss: Why he made it his mission to help entrepreneurs build purpose-driven businesses. Using the concept of ‘Dream Small' to build a network of volunteers to help non-profits. How he embedded his books with his unique vision.  Subscribe Apple | Spotify | iHeart Radio Sponsors and Resources Wix: Today's episode of the Smart Agency Masterclass is sponsored by Wix Studio, the all-in-one platform designed to help agencies scale without the headaches. With intuitive tools, robust native business solutions, and low maintenance, Wix Studio lets your team focus on what matters most—delivering exceptional value to your clients. Ready to take your agency to the next level? Visit wix.com/studio and discover how Wix Studio can transform your workflow, boost profits, and strengthen client relationships. From Joke Websites to Purpose-Driven Business Empire Jeff's journey in the agency world began with simple curiosity in 1996 when, as a college student, he built joke websites with a friend. Eventually, they figured if they made it a business, they could keep doing what they loved, which led to building several sites for free and a humble start with their first paying client, Jeff's aunt, who paid them $250 to build her business' website. Jeff has done a lot since being on the podcast's first episode talking about that first agency. He's been founding, growing, and selling businesses over the last 25 years. He has also been a board member of several initiatives and written six books just since 2019. His latest venture is the Purpose Group, where he and his team acquire and reinvigorate small businesses by training more inspired and engaged employees through their Purpose Playbook™ methodology — which is very much linked to the knowledge Jeff has been sharing through his books, teaching entrepreneurs to build purpose-driven businesses, and helping them find that same joy he's always found in his different businesses. Start with One: How Dreaming Small Can Change Everything In Jeff's experience, many people never go after their dream projects because it feels too big and daunting to start. Instead, he believes it's best to start small and give that first step. If your goal is to help people, then help at least one person. This is the premise behind Jeff's book Dream Small, which helped him grow his venture 48in48, an initiative born out of the idea of getting his team to help non-profits build websites. It would give them the satisfaction of helping someone while giving two selected non-profits a functional website in 48 hours. The plan gradually grew to include thousands of volunteers who offered time and expertise to help these non-profits for one weekend. Since developing this idea, Jeff has held 35 events with 7,500 volunteers around the world pitching in to help build 1,300 websites for non-profits. And while these numbers are great, he knows that had he started with that in mind, the project would've probably never taken off. People needed to see it was possible at a small scale before committing to do more. Tired of Boring Business Books? So Was Jeff Back when Jeff wrote his first book, he wanted to bridge the gap between traditional business thinking and entrepreneurial mindset. Having repeatedly encountered CMOs who resisted innovation with claims that they "couldn't take that chance," Jeff wanted to share his conviction that business was all about taking risks. Initially, he intended to deliver a straightforward business manual and approached the writing process as such. However, he has personally never enjoyed those books, which became apparent as he navigated through the content and found that the rigidity of a traditional format stifled his creativity. Hence, he tried a different approach and embraced storytelling—creating characters and scenarios that embodied the entrepreneurial spirit. This is when Jeff found joy in the writing process and he's continued developing stories within the same fictional universe. Furthermore, after facing multiple rejections from traditional publishers, Jeff applied his risk-taking philosophy to launch his own small publishing house. Today, this venture works with approximately 25 authors and actively seeks innovative approaches to business storytelling. Becoming a Better Leader by Setting a Purpose Beyond Profit In his case, Jeff started out as the programmer in his partnership and oversaw that aspect of his agency's operations for some time. The moment he hired someone else to help him with that task, he immediately recognized there were much better-qualified developers and that his own time would be better spent growing the agency. In fact, he believes agency owners who have limited capacities and require help from the start can actually scale faster since they won't get caught up working in the agency and can focus on growth. When founders recognize their limitations and delegate from the beginning, they avoid becoming trapped in day-to-day operations to focus exclusively on strategic growth opportunities. Despite this operational insight, Jeff initially lacked a sophisticated vision beyond the vague goal of "eventually selling." It took time and experience for him to develop a more nuanced understanding of valuations and how different exit timings would affect the agency's ultimate value. His strategic thinking evolved only after navigating through multiple mergers and sales. The most profound transformation in Jeff's approach came years into his business journey when he began thinking about purpose beyond profit. While he had always wanted to create a workplace where people enjoyed their work and developed professionally, he eventually expanded this intuition into a deliberate focus on organizational culture and consciously building values into the business foundation. Do You Want to Transform Your Agency from a Liability to an Asset? Looking to dig deeper into your agency's potential? Check out our Agency Blueprint. Designed for agency owners like you, our Agency Blueprint helps you uncover growth opportunities, tackle obstacles, and craft a customized blueprint for your agency's success.

Would you like access to our advanced agency training for FREE? https://www.agencymastery360.com/training Are you doing great work but still feel like your agency's stuck in neutral? The truth is, talent alone doesn't scale a business. In this episode our guest, Stephen Woessner—author, agency growth strategist, and founder of Predictive ROI—reveals why most agencies hit a ceiling... and how to break through with a smarter, more strategic approach. From developing a true methodology to showing up with content that teaches, we dive into what's working now (and what's not) when it comes to agency growth, client expectations, and scaling with intention. If you've ever relied a little too heavily on referrals, be unsure of your niche, or found yourself winging it without a real system—this one's for you. Tune in to learn how to enhance your agency's approach to attracting clients and scaling your business! Stephen Woessner is the founder of Predictive ROI, an agency that helps clients build predictable and repeatable ROI so they can focus on doing the work they love alongside clients they choose. With over 30 years of experience, including a six-year stint in academia, Stephen discusses what's working right now to get more leads, why getting specific is vital for agencies, and why the journey to scaling your journey requires patience, as well as methodology. Stephen also hosts the "Onward Nation" and "Sell with Authority" podcasts and is the bestselling author of five books, including his latest, “Sell With Authority". In this episode, we'll discuss: Why you should be ridiculously specific. Developing a true methodology to showcase your process. How a softer approach can lead to bigger wins. Subscribe Apple | Spotify | iHeart Radio Sponsors and Resources E2M Solutions: Today's episode of the Smart Agency Masterclass is sponsored by E2M Solutions, a web design, and development agency that has provided white-label services for the past 10 years to agencies all over the world. Check out e2msolutions.com/smartagency and get 10% off for the first three months of service. The Power of Specificity (and Content That Teaches) Stephen has had a long career in the agency world, starting thirty years ago, before ROI was a thing, and working alongside agencies and consultants — teaching them how to build their authority within the markets they serve. He worked six-years in academia while also sharing his knowledge in his first books on Viral Social Networking and SEO. The expertise shared in these books got him requests to work as a consultant for different businesses, which led to him starting his own agency in 2009. At his agency, Stephen commonly works with agencies and consultants that are going about sales and new business development in the least effective, most painful way possible. In fifteen years, he's seen a lot in the business and now brings his own perspective on what's currently working in the agency space. According to him, success comes from being ridiculously specific—about who you serve, what you offer, and how you market it. It's not about flashy gimmicks or one-size-fits-all strategies. Agencies that clearly communicate their expertise and share their knowledge generously (even for free!) are the ones building long-term trust. With the many AI tools available for marketers nowadays, there just isn't a valid excuse for not putting your own content out there to attract clients with valuable tips that show your expertise. These should be small, actionable pieces that solve real problems. That kind of generosity leads to high-quality leads who already trust you by the time they reach out. While the tools might not be polished yet, they show just how easy it is now to create content and show up consistently. The key is that agencies need to be intentional, have a point of view, know their clients' real pain points and speak to them clearly. Raise the Bar or Get Left Behind Today's clients are smart. They're looking for specialized, strategic partners—not generalists who throw spaghetti at the wall. Agencies that develop a true methodology, a real system for delivering results, stand out. It's not just about the work—it's about the process behind it. Simply put, a solid methodology builds trust. It shows prospects that you know what you're doing and that you've done it before. And yes, it's a big part of what makes an agency sellable down the road. If you're familiar with games like “Age of Empires,” the process of building your methodology will be a lot like starting scrappy in the stone age—just you, maybe a freelancer or two. But as you gather resources (aka leads, a team, and tools) and build systems (onboarding, sales, and delivery processes), you level up. The methodology evolves as you grow—and mastering each stage is what gets you to the next one. The path to growth requires structure, clarity, and an intentional approach. If you're still winging it with no repeatable system in place it might be time to rethink the game plan. How a Softer Approach Can Lead to Bigger Wins Other than a methodology, the journey to the top will also require patience. Scaling an agency is rarely instantaneous and each stage of development comes with its own challenges and learning experiences. Agencies at various levels of growth face unique challenges, and the aspiration to leap from a level two to level thirty-seven—is just unrealistic. You need to experience the wins and losses that truly gives you the expertise to sustain growth and learn to appreciate that they've prepared you for the next challenges and goals. Jason was actually confronted with this lesson while preparing for his latest event, which although did eventually sell out, but did so much more slowly than he would've liked. In the end, the team made the decision to stop being pushy about promoting the event and instead try to be more inviting. A pushy attitude will likely be met with resistance. Instead, a gentle nudge or an invitation to explore creates a sense of curiosity and openness. By reframing the conversation from one of pressure to one of invitation, he was able to build trust and rapport. People are more likely to engage when they feel they have the autonomy to make choices without feeling coerced. This is the same principle that drives successful business generation. Instead of being pushy, make sure you're sharing case studies, insights, or even hosting webinars that allow prospects to learn and engage with the agency's expertise. Trust that you're offering great value that resonates with the target audience, encouraging your audience to lean in and explore further, rather than overwhelming them with hard sells. Creating Content That Draws the Right Clients In So what is the type of content agencies should be creating to get prospects to lean in? The first thing that may make you feel like you're screaming into the void is trying to attract just any client who can sign a check. Successful companies have shown that focusing on a select group of high-performing clients can lead to tremendous success. This does not mean that if you start to work with plumbers you'll have to work with that niche in perpetuity. A niche can also be a specific problem you solve or an area you serve, not just an industry. When you focus on "right fit" clients, you'll attract people you genuinely enjoy working with who choose to stay with your business long-term. When agency owners narrow their focus, they can tailor their offerings to meet the unique needs of their chosen niche. This not only enhances the quality of service but also simplifies the content creation process. Once the target audience is identified, agencies can generate relevant and engaging content that addresses the specific problems and pain points of their clients. At this point, you can focus on sharing content that makes a lasting impression. By providing valuable information upfront, you'll no doubt capture the attention of potential clients and build credibility. Do You Want to Transform Your Agency from a Liability to an Asset? Looking to dig deeper into your agency's potential? Check out our Agency Blueprint. Designed for agency owners like you, our Agency Blueprint helps you uncover growth opportunities, tackle obstacles, and craft a customized blueprint for your agency's success.

I've been paying an agency to run our Meta ads and for some time Meta itself has been reaching out to take over the account. Let that sink in. The same platform your agency relies on is actively trying to cut you out of the picture. The worst part? This is just one example of a much bigger shift. Big tech is building tools that create entire campaigns—copy, design, video, testing—without a human in sight. Your strategist? Replaced. Designer? Replaced. Copywriter? Gone. I get it. It's a hard pill to swallow, but it isn't necessarily the end of agencies. It's just the end of the ones that built their model on tasks. So what's the future for agencies? Agencies Built on Tasks Are Already Obsolete Let's get real: if you're still selling deliverables, your agency's already falling behind. What AI can't replicate is leadership. At the end of the day clients want results and direction. Smart agencies are not selling tasks anymore. They're selling thinking. Here's how they're staying ahead: 1. Productize the Thinking, Not the Task Most agencies sell what they do – SEO, ad management – Clients don't care that you “run Facebook ads.” They want results. Instead of saying “We run ads for local businesses,” say “We help local gyms get 100 leads in 30 days with a proven 3-step system.” You just went from vendor to strategic partner that sell a system that scales. Productizing your thinking means turning your knowledge into a framework. When you package your thinking and your strategy as something like “The 30-Day Lead Domination System” or “The 5-Step Authority Engine” your expertise becomes a product. That's what scales. 2. Sell Speed and Certainty Speed is an agency superpower. Most clients aren't losing to competitors—they're drowning in indecision. They don't need more options—they need momentum. So skip the six-week strategy plan. Instead of saying “We'll optimize your funnel,” offer quick wins: “We'll launch your highest-converting offer by Friday.” Certainty is what closes deals. Clarity is what makes them stick. 3. Own Your Niche Generic is dead. The riches are still in the niches. Solve a very specific problem for a very specific group of people. The more specific your promise, the more profitable your agency will become. 4. Use AI—But Don't Compete With It Don't just talk about AI—implement it. Show your clients how to use AI to streamline workflows, automate leads, and improve reporting. Become the AI Sherpa, not the tool. If you're not guiding your clients through AI, someone else will. 5. Build Client Community Want to be irreplaceable? Connect your clients to each other. Host virtual meetups. Build a mastermind. Facilitate introductions. Create spaces for idea-sharing. AI will never replace real human connection—and your clients are craving it. We've seen this firsthand with the agency mastermind: community is the real secret weapon. 6. Be the Guide, Not the Gun Execution is cheap. Clarity is priceless. AI will never replace someone who can build leads. Be the one who filters the noise. Be the coach. Once you step into that role, I can promise you your value will skyrocket. So, Did Zuck Kill the Agency Model? Not Even Close. He didn't kill it—he evolved it. The agencies that lead, think, and adapt will be the ones that thrive. Those that keep selling tasks will get replaced. Agency Mastermind Still feel like you're winging it? You're not alone. Most agency owners hit a plateau because they're stuck in the business, buried in decisions, and disconnected from people who get it. The agencies killing it and scaling faster found out they needed to be in the right room. Go to https://www.agencymastery360.com/agency-mastery and get access to a community of agency owners sharing their data, deals, strategies, and mindset shifts.

Would you like access to our advanced agency training for FREE? https://www.agencymastery360.com/training AI isn't coming for your agency—it's already here. And if you haven't set clear guidelines for how your team (and your clients) engage with it, you're already behind. In this episode, one agency founder shares how he went from AI skeptic to strategic adopter—rewriting his workflows, client communications, and pricing strategy to future-proof his business. Join us as we explore how to move beyond simply offering AI-enhanced services—and start leveraging AI to boost profitability, streamline operations, and establish your agency as a leader in this new era. Paolo Vidali is the founder of Hidden Gears, an agency specializing in e-commerce and Shopify. With over a decade of experience in design, development, and digital marketing, Paolo shares his journey into agency ownership and discusses the challenges and rewards of building a small, distributed team across the US and Europe, as well as the factors that are informing his evolving policies on AI use. In this episode, we'll discuss: Why expertise will still set you apart in the era of AI. How Paolo went from AI skeptic to viewing it as mission-critical. How you can change your agency's game by integrating AI into your operations.  Subscribe Apple | Spotify | iHeart Radio Sponsors and Resources Wix: Today's episode of the Smart Agency Masterclass is sponsored by Wix Studio, the all-in-one platform designed to help agencies scale without the headaches. With intuitive tools, robust native business solutions, and low maintenance, Wix Studio lets your team focus on what matters most—delivering exceptional value to your clients. Ready to take your agency to the next level? Visit wix.com/studio and discover how Wix Studio can transform your workflow, boost profits, and strengthen client relationships. Making a Low-Risk Jump to Entrepreneurship Paolo sees his road to owning an agency as accidental, in the sense that it was never the plan to do it full time. Initially working for a digital marketing agency focused on B2B and lead generation, he began freelancing on the side. A couple of years into this, however, he realized the work he was doing on the nights and weekends was scalable and something he could ultimately grow. Back then, the jump to entrepreneurship seemed like a move he could realistically make without risking much of the low-cost lifestyle he led at the time. If anything went wrong, he'd just go back to working for an agency. He ended up building a successful organization he has intentionally kept small to maintain the close client relationships and team cohesion that have become hallmarks of his business model. How AI Went from “Maybe” to Mission-Critical After being in the world of e-commerce for over a decade, Paolo has witnessed firsthand the evolution of digital marketing and the rise of platforms like Shopify. And although he initially didn't believe the AI hype, it soon became apparent that the landscape was shifting dramatically. It was time to establish policies that dictated how staff and contractors would interact with this technology, so the agency would always be involved in how they experimented with it. The team's approach to AI evolved in two parallel tracks: externally, they carefully calibrated AI integration based on individual client preferences, while internally conducting tests to identify operational efficiencies. Years later, what Paolo originally envisioned as merely a future service offering has instead become fundamental to the agency's internal operations, with AI tools now dramatically reducing time spent on previously labor-intensive tasks like content creation, customer support, and data analysis. Why Expertise Will Still Set You Apart & How This Can Affect Your Pricing Predictably, one of the concerns around AI as its usage spread was around agencies becoming obsolete. In reality, Paolo can clearly see the difference between his team using AI, with many hours dedicated to understanding the technology and using it effectively, and any random person using the same tools. Now the challenge becomes how much value to place on that knowledge when it comes to their overall prices. Should they charge based on the time saved through automation, or should they consider the expertise required to generate quality outputs? Much like Paolo's mother can still out-Google him thanks to her deep understanding of information retrieval as a librarian, professionals in the field now possess the knowledge to input data effectively and assess the quality of the results produced by AI. This is why agencies should be charging on a value-based model instead of hourly rates. The technology certainly aids in finishing the tasks a lot sooner, but it's the agency's knowledge of the tools that helps complete the task efficiently. ChatGPT Changed the Game—Now Agencies Have to Raise Theirs Paolo's team is conducting systematic A/B testing to evaluate AI's potential impact on their agency workflows, quantifying time savings and process optimizations to determine where technology genuinely enhances value. To foster innovation while maintaining control, Paolo encourages staff to explore diverse AI tools during personal time and share promising discoveries, while implementing strict data protection protocols. Client information can only be processed in secure, isolated environments that prevent data from being incorporated into learning models, which led to his specific ban on Deepseek. AI has already found practical applications throughout the agency. Paolo personally leverages it for copywriting and proposal refinement, appreciating how it enhances professionalism and improves success rates. His team is also using AI for drafting content, something clients are notified about and an area where they are aware the AI results will still need to be fact-checked and revised. In his view, the use of AI has to be justified as being something that adds to the process to save time, cut costs, and improve results, rather than simply being a crutch. Overall, Paolo does think that the way people now shop for and consider content services and content marketing has forever been changed. He's already seen a decline in companies' investment in SEO, since clients feel there's no need if they can just ask ChatGPT to write that content. Despite this shift, he remains confident that agency expertise produces superior results. The challenge facing agency owners now is strategic adaptation—integrating AI capabilities while demonstrating their distinctive value in an evolving digital landscape. Do You Want to Transform Your Agency from a Liability to an Asset? Looking to dig deeper into your agency's potential? Check out our Agency Blueprint. Designed for agency owners like you, our Agency Blueprint helps you uncover growth opportunities, tackle obstacles, and craft a customized blueprint for your agency's success.

Would you like access to our advanced agency training for FREE? https://www.agencymastery360.com/training Is remote agency life really the dream? While many chase the freedom of working from anywhere, the reality is far more complex. In this episode, Lisa Larson-Kelley shares how she built a high-performing remote team—without sacrificing culture, communication, or control. Today's featured guest decided long ago that she prefers the remote option and shares what really makes remote work actually succeed. For her, it comes down to two crucial elements: Creating a solid structure for clear communication and aligned goals Hiring people who thrive in self-led, remote environments Tune in to hear how she built these systems into her agency—and how she still prioritizes meaningful, in-person connection to strengthen team culture. Lisa Larson-Kelley is the CEO and founder of Quantious, a marketing enablement agency specializing in B2B tech companies. Her agency has worked with some of the biggest tech companies in the world, starting with Adobe and building relationships that would later take them to work with Google and Meta. Currently, she's looking forward to leveraging this experience working with big companies to create lasting relationships with smaller startups and mid-market companies as well. She talks about the challenges and benefits of running a remote agency, how she finds talent suited for remote work, and how implementing EOS in her agency operations improved her business' structure, communications, and employees accountability. In this episode, we'll discuss: How EOS gives structure and accountability. The traits she looks for when hiring remote talent How she keeps team culture strong with in-person retreats Why remote work isn't “easier”—but can be better with the right systems.  Subscribe Apple | Spotify | iHeart Radio Sponsors and Resources E2M Solutions: Today's episode of the Smart Agency Masterclass is sponsored by E2M Solutions, a web design, and development agency that has provided white-label services for the past 10 years to agencies all over the world. Check out e2msolutions.com/smartagency and get 10% off for the first three months of service. A Pivot Fueled by Adversity Lisa began her professional journey as a developer, then transitioned to freelance consulting. Seeing she had a knack for explaining technical processes, she took some writing courses and expanded her abilities into content writing. Lisa's freelance work soon attracted several major tech companies. The growing demand for her services prompted her to hire her first intern through Craigslist, initially viewing this expansion as an extension of her freelance business. However, when her husband fell seriously ill, Lisa's need to provide financial stability for her family motivated her to formalize and grow her operation into a proper agency. What had started as individual consulting work had evolved into a full-fledged business born of both opportunity and necessity. Why Lisa's Agency Thrives Remotely—And How Yours Can Too Since founding her agency, Lisa has maintained a primarily remote operation. She did try to run the team from an office a little before Covid restrictions came to send everyone home again, but was finding it tedious, with common complaints about people's choice of food or annoying habits. It seemed as though petty distractions disappeared once they returned to remote work. As the owner of a remote agency, Lisa admits this modality isn't easier—it's just a different kind of hard. To truly succeed, agency owners who want a remote team must take care to carefully choose people suited for this type of work. Some people really do need the presence of someone keeping them accountable. These people find that on-site work provides them a sense of structure and that the interaction with teammates helps improve their performance. Lisa looks for workers who are able to self-manage and are results-oriented. Her team always has access to managers through Slack, of course, but they mostly prefer to manage their work and their time to better fit their lifestyles. Remote teams can leverage technology to enhance collaboration and communication, using tools like video conferencing, project management software, and instant messaging platforms allow team members to work together seamlessly, regardless of their geographical location. Assessing Candidates' Adaptability to Remote Work Not everyone is suited for remote work, so after assessing a candidate's suitability for the role based on their skills and experience, Lisa also looks to identify whether or not they are suited to work in this modality. If you have struggled finding workers who thrive in a remote setting, try to use assessments and structured interview questions to gauge a candidate's suitability. For instance, asking about their strategies for maintaining accountability can reveal much about their potential success in a remote setting. Furthermore, candidates who have previously navigated remote roles often have the skills and mindset necessary to thrive in similar environments. This experience can translate into a more seamless integration into a remote team, as these individuals are likely already familiar with the challenges and best practices associated with this working style. How EOS Can Transform Your Remote Agency Operations The Entrepreneurial Operating System (EOS) has helped many agencies create the sense of structure that some remote teams may be missing. In it, every worker has their goals, so they know what they're working towards, as well the agency's goals for the quarter, so everyone can grow in the same direction. It wasn't immediately easy or intuitive for Lisa to implement EOS into her agency processes. She read the book and tried to self-implement it unsuccessfully. It wasn't until she was introduced to an implementer who could help her with the process and keep her accountable that she felt she was on the right path with this system. With expert guidance, structured meetings became the cornerstone of Lisa's agency operations. These non-negotiable, regularly scheduled sessions ensure team alignment and individual accountability. Using Ninety software, Lisa's team conducts highly organized meetings with clear agendas and built-in timers that keep discussions focused on measurable outcomes and actionable tasks. This systematic approach eliminates wasted time while fostering a culture where team members understand their specific responsibilities. This framework helps Lisa establish high-level objectives aligned with her agency's vision, then break these down into manageable steps by working backward from desired outcomes. For instance, if an agency aims to achieve $20 million in top-line revenue and $10 million in net profit, how does this cascade down to individual team members? This clear linkage between daily activities and long-term objectives helps create a culture of accountability and proactive engagement. Structuring Professional Growth in Remote Agencies Part of the changes introduced with the use of EOS was establishing clear pathways for employee growth, something that employees themselves asked for. While tenure still influences senior positions, the agency's COO developed a three-stage framework that provides visual clarity for professional development. Seed: Your ground-level tasks for any particular role. Blossom: Demonstrating confident competence and Independence in that role. Bloom: Preparing for advancement to the next position. Interestingly, this framework is not necessarily linear recognizing that personal circumstances may cause employees to move between stages. If an employee shifts from "Blossom" back to "Seed," management initiates supportive conversations to discuss their situation and explore potential paths forward based on the employee's choices. This is an important initiative that all agency owners hoping to scale their agency should consider as it forces you to think about ways to scale your team and locate the leaders that will help take the pressure off you as you start to delegate responsibility to them. Furthermore, you'll be taking action to help your team take ownership of their roles, thus increasing retention as you motivate individuals who could get frustrated if they don't see growth opportunities. How In-Person Retreats Build Camaraderie in a Distributed Workforce Running a remote agency takes a lot of organization, structure, and also an appreciation for in-person connection. Lisa understands that while tech keeps teams connected, it can't replace the depth of real, in-person connection.. Hence, to encourage team bonding, she organizes a team retreat, that most recently took the team to Puerto Rico, for a few days of team building activities, but mostly to just be together in the same space. This is a great lesson for agency owners who want to run a remote agency. Building camaraderie through in-person connections will also have practical implications for agency growth. In-person retreats and gatherings can serve as platforms for discussing career aspirations, setting goals, and mapping out pathways for professional growth, as well as fostering stronger relationships, enhanced communication, and a more cohesive work environment. Do You Want to Transform Your Agency from a Liability to an Asset? Looking to dig deeper into your agency's potential? Check out our Agency Blueprint. Designed for agency owners like you, our Agency Blueprint helps you uncover growth opportunities, tackle obstacles, and craft a customized blueprint for your agency's success.

Would you like access to our advanced agency training for FREE? https://www.agencymastery360.com/training What if scaling your agency didn't mean more stress, but less? Discover how Devon Hayes and Amanda Joyce turned partnership into freedom—and how you can, too. If you're an agency owner ready to stop grinding and start growing, this episode is for you. These two entrepreneurs joined forces as partners specifically to navigate this growth journey together—and witnessed how this strategic decision created the growth, impact, and freedom they had always envisioned. Tune in to discover their realization that scaling represented not an additional burden but rather the crucial shift from merely sustaining their businesses to expanding them intentionally and the ongoing challenges they continue to face as they adapt to this exciting new chapter in their entrepreneurial journey. Devon Hayes and Amanda Joyce aren't just agency owners—they're proof that collaboration can unlock freedom. With deep experience in PR, construction, and financial services, they share the lessons they learned the hard way—so you don't have to. They are co-founders of Elevation Marketing, a company specializing in the home services niche, including roofing, custom home building, and plumbing. They share their journey of coming together after running their own agencies and what inspired them to start their first businesses. Additionally, they'll share what drove them to choosing their current niche and the lessons they're still learning about building their client pipeline and going beyond being referral-based. In this episode, we'll discuss: Joining forces to unlock freedom. Finding the winning niche. Why scaling is worth the fear.  Subscribe Apple | Spotify | iHeart Radio Sponsors and Resources Wix: Today's episode of the Smart Agency Masterclass is sponsored by Wix Studio, the all-in-one platform designed to help agencies scale without the headaches. With intuitive tools, robust native business solutions, and low maintenance, Wix Studio lets your team focus on what matters most—delivering exceptional value to your clients. Ready to take your agency to the next level? Visit wix.com/studio and discover how Wix Studio can transform your workflow, boost profits, and strengthen client relationships. Joining Forces to go From Solo Struggles to Shared Success Before meeting, Devon and Amanda were forging separate paths as agency owners, both yearning for greater freedom and support in their professional lives. Devon worked some time doing marketing for companies in engineering and construction and moved on to the financial industry thinking the bigger paycheck would be enough to make her happy.  However, just nine months later she felt like a prisoner of the corporate world, while her husband – a business owner – enjoy the flexibility to pursue passions like snowboarding. Inspired by his freedom, she leveraged her corporate contacts and industry knowledge to launch her own business, determined to reclaim control of her time. For her part, Amanda started working for an agency right out of college. Armed with a degree in PR and journalism and zero knowledge about the digital marketing world, she quickly developed expertise and built her own client relationships. As her confidence grew, she realized she didn't want the constraints of office-based work. Since it was the early 2000s, the thought of working remote was unimaginable and something she would have to pursue on her own. Finally, she started her own small niche agency in 2007. Of course, both women soon discovered that entrepreneurship wasn't the straightforward path to freedom they'd envisioned. Their businesses brought stress, sleepless nights, and the weighty responsibility of delivering results for clients. The service-based nature of their work meant constantly seeking ways to improve outcomes, often making it difficult to maintain focus amid competing priorities. When Devon and Amanda finally joined forces in 2019, they brought together the valuable lessons each had learned about the industry and business ownership—creating a partnership built on shared experience and complementary strengths. A Collaboration to Unlock Freedom and Have a Higher Impact Even before joining forces, Devon and Amanda were working together in several projects and found they complemented each other very well. In fact, Amanda felt their projects together were the ones causing her less stress. While working with Devon meant she had someone covering for her while she was on vacation, for instance, the clients from projects she was handling by herself wanted her attention 24/7. Both women had achieved a level of success that allowed them to pay their bills and maintain a comfortable lifestyle but realized that to truly thrive, they needed to shift their focus from merely sustaining their businesses to scaling them. More than just a desire for more revenue they understood the benefits that would come from collaboration. Wearing multiple hats and managing every aspect of their businesses was unsustainable. Instead, merging their strengths and resources, would allow them to create a more efficient operation that allowed them to focus on their core competencies. Furthermore, Amanda liked the idea of having someone to discuss her ideas with, something she missed from her days of corporate work and that can be invaluable for agency owners who constantly feel isolated and burdened by their responsibilities. The Pivot that Paid Off: Finding Their Winning Niche Even though Devon and Amanda initially targeted the roofing industry, they quickly lost focus and found themselves working with an eclectic mix of clients across dog training, cannabis, IT, and other unrelated sectors. This scattered approach, while diverse, undermined their ability to establish a distinctive brand identity. Thankfully, they later found their footing through their engagement with the Breakthrough Academy, a contractor coaching group. By connecting with contractors in various trades, including electricians and landscapers, they discovered a niche that aligned with their strengths and expertise. Soon they were delivering exceptional results for clients in plumbing, electrical, and landscaping businesses and – even though they hesitated to make it official – they had a niche. Furthermore, coming together proved to be the best decision once they realized that the home services market was saturated with subpar providers, and hence scaling their business was also an opportunity to reach a broader audience and amplify their message as credible thought leaders. This mission directly inspired their podcast as a platform to spread their message and positively impact an industry often plagued by questionable practices. The next challenge they face is expanding beyond referral-based growth to develop a sustainable client acquisition pipeline. Why Scaling Your Agency Is Worth the Fear Although Devon and Amanda ultimately decided to scale their business to reach a wider audience, many agency owners initially resist growth, fearing it will only increase their workload and responsibilities. While expanding and managing a larger team may seem daunting, the ability to focus on the aspects you love while delegating tasks that others could handle more effectively proves tremendously rewarding. Amanda, for instance, was excited to find people who excelled in areas where she struggled and empowering them to thrive. Once she did, she was able to delegate all the content creation work she had been handling and focus her time on different areas. This is a step that agency owners will get to enjoy not only when they find the right talent but specifically when they find self-managing professionals who take ownership of their work. It's a move that will take you to a remarkable milestone —the moment when new clients are successfully onboarded without requiring any involvement from the founder. Do You Want to Transform Your Agency from a Liability to an Asset? Looking to dig deeper into your agency's potential? Check out our Agency Blueprint. Designed for agency owners like you, our Agency Blueprint helps you uncover growth opportunities, tackle obstacles, and craft a customized blueprint for your agency's success.

Would you like access to our advanced agency training for FREE? https://www.agencymastery360.com/training How are you adapting to the many changes in the industry and economy? For many agency owners this is a golden era for the business. Of course, not everyone will thrive—success depends largely on your ability to adapt. In this episode learn how our guest has mastered adaptation through several economic downturns over the years, emerging from each crisis as a more prepared and confident leader. Today, he shares the pivotal moments when his agency could have joined countless others in closing their doors, but instead discovered pathways to emerge stronger than ever. Tune in to learn how he navigated each crisis, how embracing remote work has enhanced nearly every aspect of his agency's culture and operations, and why he firmly believes that despite—or perhaps because of—today's challenges, there has never been a better time to be in the agency business. Dan Kahn is the founder of Kahn Media, an integrated marketing agency specializing in automotive and luxury brands. He shares insights into his journey in the marketing world, starting with public relations and evolving into a diverse agency model. Dan also looks back at the different ways he handles times of economic downturns in his agency, and how his leadership was shaped by these times of turmoil. Additionally, he introduces his newer venture, TRED, an outdoor recreation-focused agency emphasizing experiential marketing. In this episode, we'll discuss: 3 ways to weather economic downturns. Learning to be a better leader for a remote team.  Focus on the media, not the message. Subscribe Apple | Spotify | iHeart Radio Sponsors and Resources E2M Solutions: Today's episode of the Smart Agency Masterclass is sponsored by E2M Solutions, a web design, and development agency that has provided white-label services for the past 10 years to agencies all over the world. Check out e2msolutions.com/smartagency and get 10% off for the first three months of service. Sometimes Bigger Clients Doesn't Equate to Big Success Dan grew up watching his father weather the volatile nature of business ownership and promised himself he'd never subject himself to such instability. However, his passion for automobiles guided him along a path from automotive journalism to PR work, and ultimately to founding his own agency. Hence, his entrepreneurial journey began with a strong foundation in the automotive industry, where he built a solid reputation working with notable clients like Lotus and Maserati, and handling high-profile events such as the SEMA automotive trade show. However, his ability to adapt was truly put to the test during the pandemic. When the world came to a standstill in 2020, many businesses found themselves grappling with significant revenue declines and uncertainty about the future and his agency was no exception. Dan found that while most of his corporate clients were pulling back, smaller clients like Lotus were easier to innovate with and willing to test new approaches. This is how he came up with the idea of handling car delivery services directly to journalists. With automotive press fleets locked down and journalists confined to their homes, Dan and his team were gaining lots of attention with this stunt, to the point that they achieved greater media exposure than larger competitors like Porsche. 3 Ways to Face Times of Economic Crisis 1. Grow stronger as a leader According to Dan, he was a different type of leader back when he faced his first economic downturn in 2013 and, as a result, defaulted to putting everything on his shoulders. Having experienced consistent 50% growth for several years, he felt the agency was doing well enough and he could lay back on doing new business development. Unfortunately, this decision coincided with some critical financial decisions. They had relocate to a more expensive town while taking on higher office rent and lost two big clients in one week. His world came crushing down, he burned through his savings, and it took a lot to get through that situation. With no delegation strategy in place, Dan shouldered the entire burden of recovery himself. His dreams of reducing his workload vanished as he struggled to lead the team through this crisis. While the agency eventually recovered and emerged stronger than before, the experience took a toll on his health. 2. Innovate and pivot quickly When the global shutdown of 2020 threatened Dan's agency with another economic disaster—particularly since events accounted for 30% of their revenue were canceled in rapid succession, Dan found himself in a better position to face the situation this time. He had a good leadership team, excellent client relationships and the agency was overall better prepared to figure out how to stay afloat during lockdowns. Rather than shouldering the burden individually, Dan and his leadership team collaborated closely with clients to develop innovative alternatives and pivoted quickly to create virtual experiences that maintained audience engagement despite physical restrictions. 3. Execute the highest levels of service Finally, the agency's latest critical moment happened last year, during economic shifts that hit many industries. Clients were pulling back on expenses as Dan had just launched a second agency, which requires a huge amount of capital. In part, it was the result of normal economic cycles during an election year but Dan admits it was also the result of poor planning on his part. After spending much of 2023 investing the first agency's profits into the launch of the second agency, it hit him in December that clients' annual contract renewals weren't going as smoothly as he'd hope. He started to see just how bad Q1 of 2024 could be if he didn't course correct. Once again, he relied on his team, who were tasked with continuing to execute at the highest level while he focused on business development. He also started focusing more on growing existing clients, after years with a laser focus on new business development, and invested some of his own savings into pulling the agency back up. Dan was also honest about the agency's situation with some key clients, who agreed to pay the year in full with a discount. Finally he put a heavy focus on delivering the best customer experience – aiming to become undeniable – following the teachings of Unreasonable Hospitality, by Will Guidara. The team all read the book and were instructed to apply those principles with each client. The result? Q1 was still a mess but things turned up by Q2 and by the end of the year they had record revenue and profits. Choosing Results Over Proximity Like many agencies, Dan's business runs most operations on remote, with only five to six team members coming into the office on a regular basis and some coming in once or twice a week. Although this shift does make it harder to get everyone on the same page and focused on the same target – and it does make training harder –, Dan admits it's better in almost every other aspect. Most critically, the remote structure grants access to an elite talent pool—a priority Dan values far above physical proximity. Whether team members work part-time from Alaska or elsewhere, his focus is on results rather than location. With a leadership philosophy that has changed from micromanaging to inspiring, he understands you need to trust your team to work remote. This comes after a lot of personal development work as he learned to listen more effectively and improve as a leader by taking guidance from his own team. This then led to identifying some necessary changes in the agency's culture, including replacing senior staff members who lacked leadership qualities. Now, instead of managing his team and overworking himself, he takes the time to enjoy his life. Finally, coaching and therapy have also help Dan open his eyes to the importance of diverse personality types within a leadership team. While he used to expect his team to tackle any situation exactly as he would, he now appreciates that this kind of mindset can lead to chaos in the team. Instead, varied perspectives in decision-making processes can lead to much better results. Why this is a Great Time to be an Agency Owner With traditional media on its deathbed, Dan believes this is actually the golden age for agency business, positioning communication professionals at the forefront of media evolution. He sees this as the optimal moment to launch podcasts and establish dominance in emerging media channels. Not everyone will adapt to these changes, and some agencies are struggling because of this. However, if you can adapt and make the best of this unbelievable moment in time with innovations like AI and much more freedom to be creative and innovative, you stand poised to thrive. Furthermore, nowadays people are much more willing to work with smaller agencies, relieving agency owners from the expectations of having a huge team or a fancy office. Instead, you get to focus on the ideas and building the best team possible with people from all over the world, which makes it a great time to be in this business. Do You Want to Transform Your Agency from a Liability to an Asset? Looking to dig deeper into your agency's potential? Check out our Agency Blueprint. Designed for agency owners like you, our Agency Blueprint helps you uncover growth opportunities, tackle obstacles, and craft a customized blueprint for your agency's success.

Would you like access to our advanced agency training for FREE? https://www.agencymastery360.com/training Do you feel stuck in your agency journey? Are you trying to figure out the next step to grow? Don't know what you don't know but you DO know something is holding you back? These can be hard questions to figure out when you feel you have little to no support to help you identify areas of improvement and make necessary changes. This featured guest felt her agency was doing well with their defined niche, and capabilities. However, something was missing — as an owner, she felt isolated. This all changed when she joined an agency owner community where she could openly share her doubts and struggles while receiving actionable feedback and support. This pivotal decision transformed not only how she operated her business but also accelerated her personal development as a leader. Discover her experience building a business, the defining moment when she first identified as a true entrepreneur, and the two critical pivots that marked significant milestones in her agency's growth trajectory. Jennifer McPherson is the owner of Chickenango Marketing Solutions, a specialized marketing agency focusing on public involvement and marketing for engineering, construction, oil and gas utility clients. She shares her journey from spending 27 years in marketing roles within engineering firms to launching her own agency seven years ago. She discusses the motivation behind her transition and the challenges of building a business from the ground up. Jennifer reflects on the moment she realized her agency had truly become a real business and why the mastermind community has meant so much in the growth and self-improvement she's experienced in recent years. In this episode, we'll discuss: Community as the solution to agency owner isolation. Stop relying on project-based work. Finding fulfillment in the agency journey.  Subscribe Apple | Spotify | iHeart Radio Sponsors and Resources Wix: Today's episode of the Smart Agency Masterclass is sponsored by Wix Studio, the all-in-one platform designed to help agencies scale without the headaches. With intuitive tools, robust native business solutions, and low maintenance, Wix Studio lets your team focus on what matters most—delivering exceptional value to your clients. Ready to take your agency to the next level? Visit wix.com/studio and discover how Wix Studio can transform your workflow, boost profits, and strengthen client relationships. The Leap from Corporate Marketing to Agency Founder Jennifer spent most of her career working on marketing roles within engineering firms, taking the step to venture on her own just seven years ago. Feeling a need for a change in direction, she set out to create an agency that would focus more on the engineering, construction, and oil & gas niche. Building her business, Jennifer quickly discovered that agency ownership extended far beyond simply practicing her marketing expertise independently. It demanded she master numerous aspects of running a company and navigate countless unexpected challenges. Despite these hurdles, she didn't fully perceive her venture as a legitimate business until she began hiring employees. Suddenly, her agency was no longer just a personal side hustle but an enterprise supporting other people's livelihoods, adding a profound layer of responsibility to her role as founder. 2 Pivots That Changed the Agency's Growth Trajectory In the years following her agency's launch, Jennifer achieved notable success and growth. Despite her professional achievement, she felt increasingly isolated in her role as an agency owner. Without connections to peers facing similar challenges, she lacked a support network of individuals who truly understood her unique experiences. Looking back, two important shifts got her out of that place: Community. Discovering Agency Mastery was a complete game changer for Jennifer. (This isn't just a shameless plug — but if not us, then find your people!) In addition to being the support she needed, this agency owner community also completely changed the way she ran her agency. With the mastermind's support, she went from figuring things out on her own to hiring a Chief Operating Officer, implementing efficient systems, and shifting her focus from being an operator to a true leader. The community also helped Jennifer get over the need to compare her success to others. The inherently competitive nature of the agency world often fosters unhealthy comparisons based on incomplete information about others' successes. Through her mastermind involvement, Jennifer gained insight into fellow owners' challenges, recognizing most face similar obstacles. She's also learned that community, a laser focus, and the right systems are the only things that will help you get by during rough patches. Predictable Cash Flow. Another pivotal moment was restructuring her business model to reduce dependency on project-based work. Her agency's focus on public involvement had previously meant operating on a project-by-project basis, a very difficult model to sustain since you're always choosing a next project and not building recurring revenue. With this pivot, her agency can now focus more on growth and building a pipeline to secure recurring revenue. This way, she is finally stepping out of being in the business to working on the business and focusing on its future. She is able to see that the future of her agency is beyond just her involvement. Finding Fulfillment in the Agency Journey Entrepreneurs often become fixated on end goals—whether it's selling a business, achieving financial independence, or reaching a certain level of market dominance. However, to make your business journey a truly fulfilling one, you'll need to do more. The journey of entrepreneurship is not just about hard work and determination. Luck and having the right team and community all play a role in what you enjoy doing and what you come to know as your agency's success. Many agency owners may feel frustrated by the daily grind and dream of selling their agency to feel free, but come to miss team work and sense of accomplishment after selling. Recognizing that the journey involves both struggle and triumph allows entrepreneurs to appreciate their efforts and find value in the process. In her experience, Jennifer loves the relationship building and connections as much as she loves winning. This is why she has come to define success as a journey is rich with learning opportunities, personal growth, and meaningful connections that contribute to a fulfilling entrepreneurial life. Do You Want to Transform Your Agency from a Liability to an Asset? Looking to dig deeper into your agency's potential? Check out our Agency Blueprint. Designed for agency owners like you, our Agency Blueprint helps you uncover growth opportunities, tackle obstacles, and craft a customized blueprint for your agency's success.

Would you like access to our advanced agency training for FREE? https://www.agencymastery360.com/training Have you ever turned to freelancers to grow your agency's capabilities? What about using fractional support once you realized you couldn't do everything as the founder and face of the agency? What if the key to sustainable growth isn't building a massive in-house team, but leveraging the right fractional support at the right time? Today's guests are two agency owners who turned a modest freelance setup into a thriving multimillion-dollar business—largely through referrals and the strength of their personal networks. They share how a flexible team of contractors became their secret weapon, offering the agility to scale without the overhead of a traditional agency structure. Tune in to learn how former competitors found a way to build a successful collaboration and why fractional support was a big part of their operation from the start. Sydney Mulligan and Lauren Aquilino are the co-founders of Emmie Collective, a for-hire network of elite independent & freelance marketing, sales, and revops consultants with big tech energy. They share their journey of entrepreneurship, reflect on their backgrounds as former competitors in the marketing industry, and the bond that brought them together. Sydney also recounts her experience of being laid off while on maternity leave, which sparked the idea for Emmie Collective while Lauren discusses her transition from freelancing to building a business as demand for her services grew. In this episode, we'll discuss: Why the fractional model was the best option for bootstrapping an agency. When should the agency owners stop being the face of the agency? External funding vs. control in agency growth.  Subscribe Apple | Spotify | iHeart Radio Sponsors and Resources E2M Solutions: Today's episode of the Smart Agency Masterclass is sponsored by E2M Solutions, a web design, and development agency that has provided white-label services for the past 10 years to agencies all over the world. Check out e2msolutions.com/smartagency and get 10% off for the first three months of service. When Competitors Become Co-Founders Before forming their partnership, Sydney and Lauren worked at competing agencies while also participating in Marketo's customer champion program. Their paths diverged when both eventually left their respective agencies—Lauren to pursue freelance work, initially planning for just 10 hours weekly during summer to rest after quitting her job. However, her freelance business quickly expanded beyond expectations, growing to 20 hours weekly and requiring additional contractor support. Meanwhile, Sydney had taken an in-house position but faced an unexpected setback when she was laid off during her maternity leave. As she navigated the job interview process, she began conversations with Lauren, who was contemplating transforming her freelance operation into a formal business. Lauren recognized Sydney as a valuable potential partner—in fact, the only person she would consider building a business with. After discussing their business vision, they decided it was time to meet face-to-face. Their first in-person meeting in Florida became what they jokingly refer to as their "speed dating" session. During this three-day encounter, they exchanged ideas and developed business plans while Sydney cared for her six-week-old baby. The meeting proved decisive—by the time they both landed back home, they had confirmed their mutual desire to build an agency together. Why the Fractional Model Is Best for Bootstraping an Agency Their participation in the customer champion program helped Sydney and Lauren establish strong reputations within a specialized niche market. With this foundation, they were able to launch their agency business with a strong base of referral clients. One unexpected advantage they discovered was the relative ease of attracting consultants eager to work with their new agency. Anticipating potential staffing challenges typical for startups, they had proactively designed their business model around freelancers and contractors. This strategy allowed them to sidestep the common industry pressure of requiring employees to meet specific billable hour quotas. Instead, freelancers had the flexibility to determine their own workload and schedules. To this day they continue to work with consultants, firmly believing that fractional support provides clients with optimal access to senior specialized expertise. By leveraging fractional experts, their agency effectively addresses specific client challenges, enhances operational efficiency, and frees internal resources to focus on strategic growth initiatives. When Should the Founders Stop Being the Face of the Agency? Balancing Growth and Client Relationships Sydney and Lauren's agency growth eventually confronted them with the challenge of hitting the limit on what they could do by themselves. With the agency growing, more and more clients and consultants coming in, and traveling for events, it just got to be too much. Sydney recalls a particularly stressful period when she felt overwhelmed, unable to keep track of their growing client base and the myriad responsibilities that came with it. They recognized they could no longer manage everything alone. When an agency owner clings to control it causes issues with bottlenecking, even become an operational issue and their agency's biggest profit leak. For Sydney and Lauren, was time for a change and the first crucial step was hiring a fractional account manager to ensure there was someone else keeping track of every client. This not only alleviated some of the burdens on Sydney but also allowed them to focus on strategic growth rather than getting bogged down in day-to-day operations. It's not an easy shift to make, and quite tricky for Sydney and Lauren, who built the agency on the back of their own networks and therefore are still the face of it. They continue to wrestle with how much to pull back, risking that clients feel they no longer interact with them. For those facing similar challenges, it's worth noting that even prominent agency leaders like Gary Vaynerchuk maintain their status as organizational figureheads while having minimal involvement in daily operations. This successful transition typically requires thoroughly training team members in core agency values to ensure consistent decision-making and actively promoting team capabilities to clients—emphasizing that a dedicated team provides superior service compared to founder-only support. External Funding vs. Control in Agency Growth After bootstrapping their business, Sydney and Lauren now face the question of whether or not to take on funding to continue to scale. While they recognize the potential advantages that investment capital could bring—accelerated expansion and resources for recruiting top talent—they also remain cautious about the significant tradeoffs involved. Most of all, they worry about the fundamental shift from being independent business owners to essentially working for investors since "once you start raising money, you'll always be raising money"—with a continuous cycle of accountability to external stakeholders. For the time being, they continue to prioritize maintaining complete control over their growth trajectory, preferring the stability and autonomy of their current approach even if it means potentially slower expansion. Do You Want to Transform Your Agency from a Liability to an Asset? Looking to dig deeper into your agency's potential? Check out our Agency Blueprint. Designed for agency owners like you, our Agency Blueprint helps you uncover growth opportunities, tackle obstacles, and craft a customized blueprint for your agency's success.

Would you like access to our advanced agency training for FREE? https://www.agencymastery360.com/training Do you have a sales system in place for showcasing your agencies services at a low-cost price point that creates an easy “yes” for your prospects? Many agencies are giving away insights in order to land big projects. However, a well-crafted foot-in-the-door offer helps you close clients faster by giving them a taste of what it's like to work with your agency, but also allows you to qualify whether a prospect is the right fit for your agency and team. Today's featured guest shares how productizing his offer helped streamline his sales process and communicate a clear value proposition. Furthermore, after building his strategic foot-in-the-door offer, he's been testing different pricing models to make it an easy “yes” for prospects while still attracting high-quality clients. Discover practical insights on scaling your agency, improving your sales strategy, and boosting conversion rates with intentional, value-driven offers. Spencer Powell is the founder of Builder Funnel, a digital marketing agency with roots in direct mail. He shares his journey transforming his family's direct mail business into a digital marketing powerhouse, discusses strategies for converting clients faster and easier, and talks about his recent experience building a foot in the door offer, which he is currently in the process of adapting and testing. Spencer has been on the show before talking about the game-changing move to get paid for strategy instead of giving away ideas and research for free. In this episode, we'll discuss: How a productized offer can revolutionize conversions. Building a successful foot-in-the-door offer. How could rethinking the entry-level pricing benefit sales? Subscribe Apple | Spotify | iHeart Radio Sponsors and Resources Wix: Today's episode of the Smart Agency Masterclass is sponsored by Wix Studio, the all-in-one platform designed to help agencies scale without the headaches. With intuitive tools, robust native business solutions, and low maintenance, Wix Studio lets your team focus on what matters most—delivering exceptional value to your clients. Ready to take your agency to the next level? Visit wix.com/studio and discover how Wix Studio can transform your workflow, boost profits, and strengthen client relationships. Three Generations of Marketing Evolution and Adaptability Spencer's marketing roots run deep as part of a family legacy. His grandfather established a direct mail company that his father later acquired in the 1990s. Demonstrating entrepreneurial spirit early on, Spencer launched his own social media business as a side hustle immediately after college. The family business reached a turning point when Spencer's father attended an industry event where he heard direct mail was becoming obsolete. Recognizing the need to evolve, he invited Spencer to help transition the agency into the digital era. Together, they developed the agency's brand, realizing that having a niche would be an important to create a competitive advantage. This new direction proved so promising that they eventually sold off the direct mail division to concentrate fully on growing their digital brand. As the final step in this transformation, Spencer ultimately purchased his father's ownership stake and continued driving the business forward. How a Productized Offer Revolutionized Conversion Rates Like many agency owners, Spencer allowed himself to be in the sales seat for far too long, with an offer that included building custom proposals for all incoming prospects – a time-consuming process with unpredictable returns. The first step out of this was productizing his offer, which led to the creation of the "Remodeler Marketing Blueprint," a fixed-fee service providing clients with comprehensive one-year marketing strategies. This productized approach served dual purposes: it systematized the sales process while establishing a clear value proposition. Clients were offered to either implement the strategies independently using provided resources or hire the agency for full execution. By doing so, his agency not only streamlined their sales process but also established a clear value proposition and the agency's conversion rates soared from 15% to 70%. Despite this success, a one-year marketing plan was still a huge undertaking and there was opportunity to develop an even more accessible entry-level offering that could serve as a true foot-in-the-door product. 3-Step Agency Sales System to Build a Foot-In-The-Door Per Jason's suggestion, Spencer and his team borrowed the structure to build a foot in the door strategy and set up a discovery call – ranging from 15-30 minutes – which they use to assess if the prospect is a good fit, in the right industry, and are asking for services that the agency offers. If this discovery call is a success, the team will move on to selling a marketing framework call, a $497 call where they do an exhaustive run through of their website, look into their SEO and ads, and walk them through their Attract, Convert, and Measure framework. At the end of the call, the client will either take what they've learned and implement it themselves, move on to the next step of working with his agency, or ask for their money back. The framework was a success, with 35.5% of those who participated in the framework call converted into clients last year. Jason emphasized that the initial discovery call should evaluate whether prospects would be good long-term agency partners rather than just qualifying them for the framework call. Following this advice, Spencer encourages his sales team to book as many calls as possible, to get the practice they need to start discerning which prospects would actually move ahead to work with the agency and which never intended to get beyond that call. Implementing these steps was a real game changer for Spencer, who can now continually tweak, update, and improve it by recording the sales calls and review them with the team to highlight successes and room for improvement. All in all, the structure of an offering ladder will make it easier for the prospect, the sales team, and overall for the agency to offer value and better qualify clients. Rethinking Entry-Level Pricing Now, Spencer is in the process of reviewing his agency's foot-in-the-door pricing, by lowering it from the current $497 to around $197. Why charge less? Spencer finds that prospects often need to consult with higher-ups before committing to the current Price, which either slows down the process or could be the end of that interaction. However, these sorts of instances could indicate they're not speaking with a decision-maker, which agencies ideally should be when it comes to selling a foot in the door. For now, early results indicated a promising trend, with a notable increase in the number of scheduled calls and successful conversions. On one hand, this is a positive development, but it could also mean that the lower price point is also attracting prospects who are not the agency's ideal client. The team is exploring different ways to frame this pricing adjustment, such as positioning it as a limited-time offer or explaining that while the agency barely breaks even at this price point, it serves to identify genuinely interested prospects. They're also careful to clarify that this special rate doesn't reflect their standard hourly billing, which is substantially higher. It's something that Spencer will continue to evaluate with his team. If the lower price helps them acquire more clients monthly, it may prove beneficial in the short term and something they can revise in a couple of months looking, for instance, at client retention and how those relationships ultimately played out. Do You Want to Transform Your Agency from a Liability to an Asset? Looking to dig deeper into your agency's potential? Check out our Agency Blueprint. Designed for agency owners like you, our Agency Blueprint helps you uncover growth opportunities, tackle obstacles, and craft a customized blueprint for your agency's success.