Podcast appearances and mentions of David Maister

As small business owners, sales can be one of the most daunting aspects of business. Sales are tied to so many negative stereotypes that just feel “icky”. But in this episode, I'm talking with Frances Pratt, author of More Sales, Less Marketing: How to Take the ‘Yuck' Out of Selling to challenge that perception and redefine what sales should be about. We're talking about the differences between marketing and sales, the power of storytelling, and the importance of understanding your ideal client (and how YOU can help THEM). Here's what you'll learn in this episode:  -> Discover how to reframe selling away from being pushy, and more about genuinely helping your clients. -> Understand the nuances that define sales and marketing (and how they SHOULD work together). -> Use storytelling to connect with your clients and make basic sales concepts more relatable. -> Know how to access your clients' pain points and tailor your messaging directly to their needs. -> Learn how to tailor your direct proposals so they're effective and focus on your client's needs. -> Redirect objections from clients into opportunities to deepen the conversation and build deeper trust. -> Discover how to lean on credibility, reliability, and intimacy to build stronger relationships with your clients. Mentioned In This Episode: HerBusiness Network: https://her-business.lpages.co/request-an-invitation/?utm_source=Website&utm_medium=General&utm_campaign=membership-waitlist The Trusted Advisor by David Maister, Charles Green and Robert Galford: https://www.amazon.com.au/Trusted-Advisor-20th-Anniversary/dp/1982157100 More Sale, Less Marketing on Amazon: https://www.amazon.com.au/More-Sales-Less-Marketing-selling/dp/1763768805/ Metisan - Improve Your Sales Results: https://www.metisan.com.au/

David describes the differences in what kind of people principals should hire during the early stage of their creative firm's development when it's all about “what we can afford,” the middle stage when it's about “what we need,” and then the later days of an agency when it's about “what we can learn.”   LINKS “How Your Hiring Strategies Change” by David C. Baker for punctuation.com “The Problem of Standards” by David Maister

Influencing is an advanced communication skill that is helpful for change management in the business analysis field. Susan and Scott talk with guests that have had success with influencing skills. Abigail Gaddy and Heath Butler share the benefits of using influencing skills as well as the potential pitfalls if it's overused. Business analysts often need to work with various stakeholders, including executives, project managers, subject matter experts, and technical teams. Effective influencing skills allow business analysts to gain support, build relationships, and guide stakeholders towards shared goals and decisions. These skills help reduce resistance to necessary changes, articulate a clear vision, inspire others to take action, and promote collaboration. Additionally, negotiation skills are frequently used by business analysts to resolve conflicts and reach agreements among stakeholders. Influence is part of the Interaction Skills illustrated in the Business Analysis Competency Model. Interaction skills are one of the six underlying competencies for business analysis professionals, so influence is important. Overall, influencing skills play a crucial role in the success of business analysis initiatives by facilitating effective communication, collaboration, and decision-making. Join us for another engaging conversation on Business Analysis Live! RESOURCES: Business Analysis Competency Model - https://www.iiba.org/professional-development/business-analysis-competency-model/ The Trusted Advisor by: David Maister, Charles Green, and Robert Galford Do you have questions about this topic or have an idea for a different topic? Ask us a question at ⁠⁠⁠live@iiba.org⁠⁠⁠ or leave us a ⁠⁠⁠voice message⁠⁠⁠ on our podcast homepage.  Business Analysis Live is hosted by: - Susan Moore, Community Engagement Manager at IIBA - Scott Bennett, Manager, Business Analysis at IIBA International Institute of Business Analysis (IIBA) is a non-profit professional association serving the field of business analysis.  As the global thought leader and voice of the business analysis community, IIBA actively supports the recognition of the profession, and works to maintain global standards for the ongoing development of the practice and certifications.   #businessanalysis #influence #influencing --- Send in a voice message: https://podcasters.spotify.com/pod/show/iiba-org/message

This week on the Uncharted Podcast, Dr. Andy Roark and practice management geek Stephanie Goss are deep in conversation after reading a mailbag question from a licensed veterinary technician who work with a hospital that is growing and changing in a lot of WONDERFUL ways! Their team is working together, they are establishing strong standards of care that support their clients and their patients with excellent client service. The team is all in on the changes and growing the practice this way. The problem is there seems to be a disconnect between the team vs. the hospital leaders when it comes to "leading" the team. In their meetings and a lot of interactions with the team, the direction the hospital leaders seem to take is all about numbers & the financial advancement of the business. This is rapidly dividing the team - they already lost a few good people over the hyper focus on the business and numbers and this tech is worried they are walking down a path they can't come back from! This is a great set of questions to discuss - Let's get into this... LINKS Are long wait times negatively impacting your veterinary clinic's client satisfaction and team morale? Discover how to turn wait times into an opportunity to enhance the experiences for everyone in your practice! Join Uncharted's very own Tyler Grogan, CVT in an engaging workshop that combines the fields of operations management and psychology to explore the study of waiting in lines, also known as queue theory. You will dive into the research covering a range of topics including: Common queueing behaviors – what can we let people do more of? Appointment syndrome – what is the sticking point of appointments? David Maister's Laws of Service The concept of queue rage (and how to avoid it!) The eight factors to consider in the psychology of waiting according to David Maister. You'll also interact during practical activities to discuss case examples and develop customized queue management systems that you need in your individual practice right now, with a focus on managing client expectations, effective client communication, team communication, and increasing value through queue experiences. Get ready to walk away with practical solutions to manage the different ways people wait in veterinary medicine, and tools to start making wait times work for you! When: September 13, 2023, 8:30-10:30 PM ET/5:30-7:30 PM PT $99 to register, FREE for Uncharted Members All Links: linktr.ee/UnchartedVet Do you have something that you would love Andy and Stephanie to role play on the podcast - a situation where you would love some examples of what someone else would say and how they would say it? If so, send us a message through the mailbag! We want to hear your challenges and would love to feature your scenario on the podcast. Head over to the mailbag and submit it here: unchartedvet.com/mailbag

What are these Reflections with Actions' episodes all about? After every five guest interviews, Amy Rowlinson reflects on each of the individual episodes and focuses in on specific topics pulling on different threads and diving deeper to explore elements that piqued her interest. In this episode, Amy shares her Reflections with Actions from these five recent podcast episodes: 341 Inspiring Business Minds with Dr Tamer Shahin 342 Silent Legacy with Joe Glover 343 Trust in Action with Tony Underwood 344 Intergenerational Communication with Renée Lee Rosenberg 345 Sport is Life with Ian Stafford   KEY TAKEAWAY “What sits at your foundation of purpose? What is it that you are building upon? What matters most to you? Are you creating moments that matter? My invitation to you is to focus on WHY.”   BOOK RECOMMENDATIONS* The Infinite Game by Simon Sinek - https://amzn.eu/d/5ZfGfAq The Trusted Advisor by David Maister, Robert Galford and Charles Green - https://amzn.eu/d/ixHiR7y   B1G1 – Could your business be a B1G1 Business for Good? Absolutely! If you would like to understand how your business could make a difference to the world, please reach out to me here and I can share more about how it works. If you do choose to join B1G1, please use my unique code BM16478. When you join through our code, 50 days of access to education are given to children in the world.     ABOUT THE HOST - AMY ROWLINSON   Amy is a Life Purpose Coach, Podcast Strategist, Top 1% Global Podcaster, Speaker and Mastermind Host. Amy works with individuals to improve productivity, engagement and fulfilment, to banish overwhelm, underwhelm and frustration and to welcome clarity, achievement and purpose.       WORK WITH AMY Amy inspires and empowers entrepreneurial clients to discover the life they dream of by assisting them to focus on their WHY with clarity uniting their passion and purpose with a plan to create the life they truly desire. If you would to focus on your WHY or launch a purposeful podcast, then please book a free 20 min call via www.calendly.com/amyrowlinson/enquirycall     KEEP IN TOUCH WITH AMY Sign up for the weekly Friday Focus - https://www.amyrowlinson.com/subscribe-to-weekly-newsletter   CONNECT WITH AMY https://linktr.ee/AmyRowlinson   HOSTED BY: Amy Rowlinson   DISCLAIMER The views, thoughts and opinions expressed in this podcast belong solely to the host and guest speakers. Please conduct your own due diligence.   *As an Amazon Associate I earn from qualifying purchases.

NUGGET CONTEXT Stephen speaks about the Trust equation that is often attributed to Charles Green and David Maister. He reconciles his model around Trust with the various variables in the Trust Equation (Credibility, Reliability, Intimacy and Self Orientation). He also goes on to make the distinction between being Trustworthy and Extending Trust in a relationship. GUEST Stephen M. R. Covey is an American writer and public speaker and the author of the books: The SPEED of Trust, Smart Trust, and Trust & Inspire: How Truly Great Leaders Unleash the Greatness in Others. He is the co-founder and CEO of a company called CoveyLink Worldwide and former President and CEO of Covey Leadership Center. He happens to be the son of Stephen Covey, the author of the pathbreaking book - 7 Habits of Highly Effective People.  In our conversation, we spoke about how Stephen broke away from his father's shadows and created an identity for himself over time as a thought leader by building credibility on the business front. We spoke at length about his recent book - Trust and Inspire. I loved his distinction around being Trust and Inspire in Paradigm but Command and Control in the moment. He also speaks about “Enlightened Command and Control” which gives people a false sense of having evolved their leadership style. Highly relevant piece of work in this world of complexity and possibility.  Published in April 2023. HOST Deepak is a Leadership Advisor and an Executive Coach. He works with leaders to improve their effectiveness and in helping them make better decisions specifically around organizational and career transitions. He currently runs Transition Insight (www.transitioninsight.com) and works with leaders to handle phases of transition thoughtfully. He has worked as an Operations Consultant with KPMG in UK, Strategy Consultant with McKinsey in the US and as a Leadership Consultant with EgonZehnder (a Swiss Leadership Advisory firm) where he helped companies recruit CEOs, CXOs and Board Members and worked on Leadership Development. Deepak is a certified CEO Coach and is an alumnus of IIT Madras, IIM Ahmedabad and London Business School. His detailed profile can be found at https://in.linkedin.com/in/djayaraman OTHER GUESTS 1.Vijay Amritraj 2.Amish Tripathi 3.Raghu Raman 4.Papa CJ 5.Kartik Hosanagar 6.Ravi Venkatesan 7.Abhijit Bhaduri 8.Viren Rasquinha 9.Prakash Iyer 10.Avnish Bajaj 11.Nandan Nilekani 12.Atul Kasbekar 13.Karthik Reddy 14.Pramath Sinha 15.Vedika Bhandarkar 16.Vinita Bali 17.Zia Mody 18.Rama Bijapurkar 19.Dheeraj Pandey 20.Anu Madgavkar 21.Vishy Anand 22. Meher Pudumjee 23.KV Shridhar (Pops) 24.Suresh Naraynan 25.Devdutt Pattanaik 26.Jay Panda 27.Amit Chandra 28.Chandramouli Venkatesan 29.Roopa Kudva 30.Vinay Sitapati 31.Neera Nundy. 32.Deepa Malik 33.Bombay Jayashri. 34.Arun Maira 35.Ambi Parameswaran 36.OP Bhaat 37.Indranil Chakraborty 38.Tarun Khanna 39. Ramachandra Guha 40. Stewart Friedman 41. Rich Fernandez 42. Falguni Nayar 43. Rajat Gupta 44. Kartik Hosanagar 45. Michael Watkins 46. Matt Dixon 47. Herminia Ibarra 48. Paddy Upton 49. Tasha Eurich 50. Alan Eagle 51. Sudhir Sitapati 52. James Clear 53. Lynda Gratton 54. Jennifer Petriglieri. 55. Matthew Walker 56. Raj Raghunathan 57. Jennifer Garvey Berger 58. BJ Fogg 59. R Gopolakrishnan 60. Sir Andrew Likierman. 61. Atul Khatri 62. Whitney Jonson 63. Venkat Krishnan 64. Marshall Goldsmith 65. Ashish Dhawan 66. Vinay Sitapati 67. Ashley Whillans 68. Tenzin Priyadarshi 69. Ramesh Srinivasan 70. Bruce Feiler 71. Sanjeev Aggarwal and T. N. Hari 72. Bill Carr 73. Jennifer Wetzler 74. Sally Helgesen 75. Dan Cable 76. Tom Vanderbilt 77. Darleen DeRosa 78. Amy Edmondson 79. Katy Milkman 80. Harish Bhatt 81. Lloyd Reeb 82. Sukhinder Cassidy 83. Harsh Mariwala 84. Rajiv Vij 85. Dorie Clark 86. Ayse Birsel 87. Ravi Venkatesan E2 88. Pradeep Chakravarthy 89. Dan Pink 90. Alisa Cohn 91. Ayelet Fishbach 92. Thomas Wedell-Wedellsborg 93. Raghu Ananthnarayanan 94. Tarun Khanna EP2 95. Manjari Jaruhar 96. Ethan Kross 97. David Bradford 98. Jeffrey Pfeffer 99. Michiel Kruyt 100. Christopher Clarey DISCLAIMER All content and opinions expressed in the podcast are that of the guests and are not necessarily the opinions of Deepak Jayaraman and Transition Insight Private Limited. Views expressed in comments to blog are the personal opinions of the author of the comment. They do not necessarily reflect the views of The Company or the author of the blog. Participants are responsible for the content of their comments and all comments that are posted are in the public domain. The Company reserves the right to monitor, edit, and/or publish any submitted comments. Not all comments may be published. Any third-party comments published are third party information and The Company takes no responsibility and disclaims all liability. The Company reserves the right, but is not obligated to monitor and delete any comments or postings at any time without notice.

Riches in Niches and How to Attract High-Paying Clients I'm excited for you to meet our special encore guest expert today — Henry DeVries. If you're meeting Henry for the first time — he's the CEO of Indie Books International. He's the former president of an award-winning “Ad Age 500” marketing agency — and — Henry is also a weekly columnist for Forbes.com. Henry was my guest for Episode 15 of the podcast, where he shared his expertise around strategies and tactics for writing a book — and then — how to use the book as your primary marketing strategy — or, as Henry likes to say — “Marketing with a Book.” We'll be sure to add a link to Episode 15 to today's show notes.  Okay — I invited Henry to join me for this encore interview so we could focus our time and attention on Chapter 5 of Henry's latest book entitled, “Marketing with a Book for Agency Owners.” He titled Chapter 5 — “Riches in Niches.” If you've been listening to this podcast for a while now — or if you've read our books — or attended any of our open-mic Q&As or live workshops — you know that here at Predictive ROI…we're big fans of building a riches in niches strategy. I'm going to quickly quote Henry from Chapter 5… Henry writes, “To attract high-paying clients, agency owners must be clear on their ideal prospects. But a target market with a problem is not enough. Agency owners also must find target clients that can afford to pay what you want to charge.”  Okay — it's here at the intersection of these two points that Henry and I focused our riches in niches discussion. How to find right-fit prospects who are willing to pay what you want to charge — and I would argue that when you do this work correctly and your content strategy is on point and generous — your right-fit prospects will be EAGER to pay your premium price. To help us get there — I asked Henry to walk us through what he calls the “10 filter questions” that you and your team can use as you work through the process of niching down.  In my opinion — Henry's 10 filter questions are critically important to the process of seeking riches in niches because if we don't get it right at the beginning — HOLY BANANAS — it's most likely not going to feel right 2-3 years into your “niche” strategy.  I promise you — if you take and apply Henry's advice and build a strategy around riches in niches — and then — have the courage to build an authority position deep in the niche (instead of being sort of committed), you consistently create helpful cornerstone and cobblestone content that shares your smarts with your audience. If you do this work — you'll not only be seen as the AUTHORITY in the niche, but your sales pipeline will go from being dry to being filled with a steady stream of right-fit clients from within the niche who are eager to work with you — AND — willing to pay your premium price to do it.  That's the recipe for riches in niches.   What you'll learn from this episode about riches in niches: Why your riches in niches strategy needs to include stories that matter and where you ought to share them Why it's so important to share the right social proof with your prospective clients How to find prospects in niches who are willing to pay what you want to charge How to identify and then properly step into the right pond within the right niche How to work through the 10 filtering questions to do the right work up front to help ensure you tap into the riches in niches     Speaker 1: (00:03) Welcome to the Sell With Authority podcast. I'm Stephen Woessner, c e o of predictive roi. And my team and I, we created this podcast specifically for you. So, if you're an agency, agency owner, a business coach, or a strategic consultant, and you're looking to grow a thriving, profitable business that can weather the constant change that seems to be our world's reality, then you're in the right place. You want proven strategies for attracting a steady stream of well-prepared right fit prospects into your sales pipeline. Yep. We're gonna cover that. You wanna learn how to step away from the sea of competitors, so you actually stand out and own the ground you're standing on. Yep. We're gonna cover that too. You wanna futureproof your business so you can navigate the next challenges that come your way. Well, absolutely. We'll help you there as well. I promise you. Speaker 1: (01:02) Each episode of this podcast will contain valuable insights and tangible examples of best practices, never theory from thought leaders, experts, owners who have done exactly what you're working hard to do. So I want you to think practical and tactical. Never any fluff. Each of our guests have built a position of authority and then monetized that position by claiming their ground, by growing their audience, by nurturing leads, and yes, by converting sales. But all the while they did it by being helpful. So every time someone from their audience turned around there, they were with a helpful answer to an important question, so their prospects never felt like they were a prospect. I also promise you every strategy we discuss, every tool we recommend will be shared in full transparency in each episode. So you can plant your flag of authority, claim your ground, and fill your sales pipeline with a steady stream of right fit clients. Speaker 1: (02:09) So I am super excited for you to meet our very special encore guest expert today, Henry DeVries. If you're meeting Henry for the first time, he's the c e o of Indie Books International. He's the former president of an award-winning ad age 500 marketing agency, and Henry is a weekly columnist for forbes.com. Henry was also my guest for episode 15 of the podcast where Henry shared his expertise around strategies and tactics for writing a book, and then how to use the book as your primary marketing strategy, or as Henry likes to say, marketing with a book. So, we'll be sure to add a link to episode 15 to today's show notes to make it super easy to find. It's a great episode. Okay, so I invited Henry to join me for this encore so we could focus our time and attention on chapter five of Henry's latest book, which is entitled Marketing with a Book for Agency Owners. Speaker 1: (03:09) He titled Chapter Five, riches in the Niches. And if you've been listening to this podcast for a while now, or if you've read our books or attended any of our open mic q and as or live workshops, you know that here at Predictive roi, we are big fans of itching. So I'm gonna quickly quote Henry here, uh, from chapter five of the book, Henry writes, to attract high paying clients, agency owners must be clear on their ideal prospects, and then he goes on to write, but a target market where the problem is not enough agency owners also must find target clients that can afford to pay what you wanna charge. Okay? So it's at the intersection of these two points that Henry and I will focus our discussion today, how to find right fit prospects who are willing to pay what you want to charge. Speaker 1: (04:05) And I would argue that when you do this work correctly and your content strategy is on point and generous, your right fit prospects will be eager to pay your premium price. To help us get there, I'm going to ask Henry to walk us through what he calls the 10 filter questions that you and your team can use as you work through the process of nicheing down. Because in my opinion, Henry's 10 filter questions are critically important to the process of seeking riches in the niches. Because if we don't get it right at the beginning, well, holy bananas is most likely not gonna feel right two to three years down the road. I promise you, if you take an apply Henry's advice and seek the riches in the niches, and then have the courage to actually build an authority position deep in the niche and not be kind of committed to the niche, so you're consistently creating helpful cornerstone and cobblestone content that shares your smarts with your prospective clients, clients in the niche, you'll not only be seen as the authority in the niche, but you will fill your sales pipeline with a steady stream of right fit clients who are eager to work with you and who are willing to pay your premium price to do it. Speaker 1: (05:29) So without further ado, my friend, welcome back to the Sell With Authority Podcast. Henry, Speaker 2: (05:36) Thank you for inviting me to talk about riches niches. You're very welcome. April, 2022, the place, Oceanside, California. I'm celebrating the eighth anniversary of Indie books. Okay? We've published over 150 authors. Life is great. I'm not happy. Okay? I'm at a crossroads. Sounds like there's a story there. You're gonna start a hospital. There's a story there. I'm at Crossroads and I go, I teach this riches and niches and I've helped so many people, and I don't feel that we've really found ours, huh? Because I had focused on consultants and coaches, okay? And there was just something missing. And the, the ponds and the groups that I, the watering holes and Pamela Slim of the Whitest Nets language, you know, the, they just weren't feeling totally right for me. Okay? So I did a, I did an exercise. I, I went on a retreat, just me in a car to a motel to think of this through, okay? Speaker 2: (06:45) Made a list of all our authors and divided them into groups, okay? And there was this one group that I liked to work with the most agency owners, because I was an agency owner. And matter of fact, indie Books International is an agency. It's a marketing agency in disguise, as a publishing company, okay? And we, we help people get speaking, but part of it was this training aspect where we train you to give speeches, get on podcasts, do these things to amplify your work. That's my word for the years, Steven. Amplify. We need to amplify our work. That's a good word. Talk about that. So I went and, and the agency owners were, and I said, well, where could I go meet agency owners? So I researched, and there were 10 places where they gather that I found, and one was called the Baba, b a b summit, build a Better Agency Summit. Speaker 2: (07:44) Uhhuh. . And it was over $2,000 to attend a little problem. I didn't have an extra $2,000, but I do cover marketing for forbes.com. I've been a paid columnist for five years. So I contacted the Baba Summit people into my surprise, they said, yes, you can have a media credential come cover us, um, at the Western in Chicago. Mm-hmm. . So meanwhile, I start to call some of these agency owners that I'd helped do their books. And I said, you know, whatever happened as a result of the book. And Tom Young, uh, one of my authors said, oh, you helped us get to the million dollar level. And then we, we leveraged that book, and now we're at 2 million a year. Um, I talked to another person and she said, oh, I didn't have any Fortune 500 companies when we started. I've tripled my revenues, and now I'm working for the one of the top five banks in America, one of the top five financial houses in America, a a billion dollar Japanese technology company. Speaker 2: (08:51) As a result of this, I'm going like, well, those are some, I said, would you, would you put that in writing? Could I put that in writing? Well, of course. Would you tell other people? You know, could I put you on video? Oh, yeah. Send anybody my way. I'm going like, okay, check. We, we've got something going here. Right? Also, they were the, um, most willing to pay. Some of them told me, uh, you know, you, you're not charging enough. This is what the agents, this is what the agency owners were sharing. They were telling me that I wasn't charging them enough, right. Uh, for what they were getting from me. Okay? So I go to the, the Baba Summit. I did not know you were involved, Steven, I knew you from being in a, a couple of appearances on Onward Nation. Um, I, I think I had written about a couple of your clients and Forbes, so that was our relationship. Speaker 2: (09:39) But I see you were one of the sponsors there and involved, and that was great. Within an hour of being there. Everything I've been teaching for the last 15 years in writing about, but unwilling to do as a service, you were preaching at, at Baba, the p baba speakers were preaching, and they had people there to do it. You know, if you wanted podcasts, you could go to predictive roi. If you wanted a, um, a proprietary research study, you could go to audience audit. So it was like, these are my people. Mm-hmm. , uh, this is so great. And I had decided then, okay, I'm going all in. Now. Let me tell you, fear never sleeps. To go all in on a target niche is a scary proposition. Um, you're worried that by declaring I work for these people, your referral sources are gonna dry up Uhhuh, . Speaker 2: (10:35) I can assure you, they do not. Right? The the other thing that happens is you're, you're afraid that somebody will read your website and go, oh, well, that's not for me. I can assure you it's not. I have people call me up and say, look, I, I know I'm not an agency owner, but, uh, I run this consulting company and could I please convince you to work with me? Right. You know, go on . I'll say, you know, and, and, uh, some have and have done wonderful projects. Meanwhile, , so I, I commit to this. This is May and I, I think I've gotta write a book. I've gotta write a book about this, but I am very busy. When am I gonna have time to write another book? So, um, and we all have different faiths, and I respect that. And, um, in, in California, I have to say the universe or the universe will manifest when I'm, when I'm out in, uh, the Midwest with you, I can say God helps those who help themselves. Speaker 2: (11:35) So, but I, I prayed on it and I prayed for time to get this book done. Be careful what you pray for . I was give, in August, I was giving five workshops for CEOs on how to persuade with a story. Mm-hmm. , uh, that's what I'm paid to speak on. I've written books on that. And on, uh, day five, I contract covid. So I'm in Memphis, Tennessee, um, thousands of miles from home. Nobody there. I have to check into this, uh, cheap motel to quarantine for a week. Yep. And, uh, my healthcare got right on it got me into a doctor who prescribed the drug, PAX Lobin for me. Mm-hmm. . So I'm on a, a five day protocol of Pax Lobin. Well, it knocked it down right away. And I thought, well, I don't wanna watch TV and I'll just start writing the book. Five days later, the book was written, you know, thank you. Speaker 2: (12:38) I'm grateful for that time, . I wish it could have been like a little more enjoyable, but I got the book done and started rolling. I know I needed refinements. So, uh, signed up with predictive roi. We did the, the 90 day program, really refined it. Um, Eric, on your team, uh, I, I love Eric dearly because he challenged me on everything. Um, he gave me pushback on everything. It wasn't like, oh, great, this, like, no, this and that. What happens if this happens? And like, oh man, that would've been a huge mistake if I'd gone that way. So, very grateful to predictive roi. And then I saw, um, workshops by you and Drew McClellan of AMI in, in Florida. Um, didn't have the money for that. Went to the board and said, we need to personally borrow money, uh, so I can go to Disney World for a conference in December and January. Speaker 2: (13:34) Um, and then when I explained it, all my wife said, a hunch. Henry had a hunch. And we bet on the hunch. And the hunch worked. So, um, I've been picking up agency clients. You told me I needed to double my prices and hire better people. I went out and did that. Yep. Um, and then when people would call me, I would give that higher price, and they didn't blink. So it all came back to what we're gonna talk about today, these filter questions. Yep. Um, agency owners pass the filter questions test for me, and I hope the filter questions help the listeners today. Speaker 1: (14:15) Awesome. Well, so let's, I, I want to tease out just one piece outta outta what you just said about the, the workshop and not, and not, and not like promoting the workshop or advertising the workshop, but your recognition about how the Baba Summit and how the workshop and how you participate in our community, how you participate in the Agency Management Institute community and, and so forth. And how you've been very strategic in, uh, aligning partnerships and friendships and all of that, because those are efforts to get deeper into the niche. And, and I'm not saying that those are not great relationships and personal relationships and turning into friendships and that kind of stuff. I, I'm, I'm not saying that those are like surfacey, they're, and they're not genuine because I know that they absolutely are. What I am saying is that they are, excuse me, that they're also indicative of when you go deep into the niche, it's about really understanding the people in the niche, really understanding the pond, really understand who is in the pond, swimming around and all of that, and developing those relationships. That's part of getting deep into the niche. Would, would you agree? Speaker 2: (15:26) Oh, absolutely. And I have to do a shout out to Susan Byer, a member of the Community of Audience Audit. And I heard you and Susan speak at the Baba Summit, and I shook her hand and, uh, gave her my card and said, I'd like to interview her for forbes.com. And, uh, she's the world's busiest woman who's going at mock five with her hair on fire. So that wasn't happening, but I, I was on, uh, a call with you and there were other people, you, you had me, I think, on a q and a talk about the book mm-hmm. , and Yep. Susan was there, and she calls me up afterwards and said, we have to talk, says this. I was where you were at a few years ago. I know who you are. Uh, and I know where you're at, and I just get deep into this. Speaker 2: (16:13) Do this, this is what you need to do. Yep. And I said, thank you. I appreciate that. Uh, what is the best piece of advice you have for me right now? Okay. She said, go to the workshops in December and January, you know, beg, borrow Steele, do whatever you have to. She says, I went from having eight clients to 40 when I went into this niche, uh, really strong. And so go there. And she says, you're gonna learn things. Mm-hmm. from the content that Drew and Steven teach, you're gonna learn more about your target audience, because you're gonna listen to them. You're gonna hear them. You're gonna have a drink with them, uh, you know, breakfast with them, and you're gonna be this listening machine at one of the agencies where I cut my teeth. Um, I was the head of research too. I was the head of creative services and research. That's a, that's a schizophrenic kind of person. Speaker 1: (17:09) I'm like, that's a bit of a juxtaposition, but o okay. Speaker 2: (17:11) Yeah. Right. Sounds and research. So I, I know about depth interviews and research and, and, uh, you know, listening. And that was so true, because you're amongst them and you can relate to them, of course. And when they tell a story, you can go, oh, I understand that. Yeah. You know, um, I've been there, done that. Um, so that's important to, you've gotta go where your target rich audience is. Um, not so much that, oh, I'm gonna find clients. I did, I will, but I wanna understand their worries, frustrations, doubts. Mm-hmm. . Um, I need, you know, the fear, uncertainty and doubt, the FUD factor. You need to know their FUD factor. And that's the number one thing they want to know. Do you understand my pain? Speaker 1: (18:07) Yeah. The, not only do you speak my language, do you speak my dialect? And when, when, when we talk through the niche deep dive, you know, like in our q and a's and in the, the WHO framework and so forth, that, that part of that starts with the first two ingredients in that are what are the problems, hence the FUD factor that you just mentioned. Then what are the stories? How can you speak to those problems within a story? Because we're just d n a wired to receive stories, right? How can we talk about the FUD factor in the form of a story? And then to your earlier point, how can we step into the right ponds to tell the stories, right? Because then they feel appropriate and, and, and, and they land correctly. It feels weird to step into a non-agency owner pond, if you will, and start talking about agency owner stories. Speaker 1: (19:01) It, there, there's incongruency when that happens, right? So like, all of this is part of the, the great recipe. You've done a great job of stepping into the pond and finding the rich in the niche or the riches in the niches. And I know that they're, you're, you're actively mining that. Let's start going through the 10 filter questions, because I think they're, not only do I think that they're smart, um, but I, but I also think that they're smartness, if you will, , uh, in the layers, right? So some of the questions are multi-layered. Some of the questions are deeper than maybe what somebody might think as they're quickly going through them, and that, oh, I don't have to answer that one. I could just bypass that one. Or I'll just, I'll focus on, you know, question two, six and 10. And that should be good. Speaker 1: (19:46) And it's not good. The 10 filtering questions are 10 filtering questions on purpose. So, so let's, let's go through them first. I'm, I'm just gonna go through them, uh, quickly and then, and then we'll go back and slice 'em apart. So, question one, are you interested in solving the problems this group has? Question two, have you worked with any already? Three, can they afford to pay you four? Are they willing to pay more for better service? Five, do they already know they need an agency like you? Six? Are they numerous? Seven, do you, uh, do you have only a few real competitors? Eight. Can you find them easily enough through listen associations? Uh, nine, can you find a target rich environment where they gather? Uh, and then 10, will you or will some make marquee clients advocates and references? Okay. So let's slice all of these apart and go through them in depth. So walk us through, number one, are you interested in solving the problems this group has and why you put that first? Speaker 2: (20:53) Okay. So first let me grab my book, my 17th book. Amazing. And Stephen, my books are my children. Hmm. And like my children, I expect them to take care of me in my old age. Okay. So let's go to chapter five and that first one. Um, are you interested in solving the problems if solving their problems doesn't energize you? It's a non-starter. Um, when I was looking at the different groups, I've done a lot with technology services companies, okay. Speaker 2: (21:24) And I thought, huh, do I wanna spend all my time with technology services companies? Um, I had a chance once to buy the agency I'd started at and worked my way up to president. And, um, I didn't know this strategy, it was just instinctive and I followed it. And we were the leader in real estate, community marketing, you know, new home communities, master plan communities throughout Southern California. Okay. Um, we had all the top people, and and you eat on that whale for years, you catch a whale, like a master plan community that's a eight, seven, you know, seven, eight year project. You bet. Um, but I didn't buy, and one of the reasons was I didn't wanna spend the rest of my life talking about cathedral ceilings and low flow toilets. You know, it was just like, uh, it didn't excite me. Yeah. So, uh, I went out on my own and formed my own lemonade stand and went looking for the, for the right niche. So agency owners, I love the problems they have. Oh, by the way, research. Yep. Number one problem for two outta three agency owners is, and you know it, Steven, the dry sales pipeline, not enough qualified prospects in that pipeline. Yep. And business development is their heartburn, it's their pain. Second problem for, uh, 50% of agency owners, not enough time to do business development. Um, should we move to two? Have you worked with them already? Speaker 1: (23:03) 1, 1, 1 more piece to to number one. Speaker 2: (23:05) Okay. Speaker 1: (23:07) Because if we don't get right what you just said, you know, that, that we're interested in solving the problems that's gonna come through also in the content. When, when, when you know that Drew and I, uh, teach the point of view piece, right? So, predictive roi, we believe, like in our core, we believe, uh, that most agencies, business coaches and strategic consultants go about business development in the least effective, most painful way possible. There's a better way we call it. So with authority methodology, yeah. That is our belief system. It is our truth. So if you're just kind of like, eh, on point number one here, which is why it's an important filter that's gonna show through in your content, that's gonna show through how you show up in the pond, right? Speaker 2: (23:51) Right. We have an energy meter. Yeah. Everybody has it. And they can tell if you have energy around this topic or not. Are you just there? Oh. Because you're trying to serve that, you know, it's like if you're not genuinely energetic about it mm-hmm. , um, nor, uh, was famous author about, uh, you know, the power of enthusiasm. You know, so if you don't have enthusiasm, right? Um, it comes across and you can't fake it. Speaker 1: (24:26) No, Speaker 2: (24:26) You can't fake sincerity. Speaker 1: (24:28) No. Cuz cuz then you look like you're trying to get rich in the niche and Right. And then that, and that feels a whole lot of yucky to everyone in the pond. So, um, okay. So let's, and Speaker 2: (24:37) By the way you just said that Yeah. The riches are not just money. Yeah. Um, there are 12 different riches, uh, that you get from a, a money finishes 12th on the list. Um, when you're, one of the riches is you love to work. You love to work because you love solving their problems. Uh, you love these people. So that comes through Speaker 1: (25:03) 100%. Yeah. When, when, when somebody goes to the Baba Summit, the builder Better Agency Summit, this May, um, as the previous two summits, when, when Drew McClellan gets on stage to do his keynote, like he has the previous two, there will be there, there will be tears, there will be shouts of joy, there will be, it's an emotional delivery of a keynote. Why? Because everyone, all 300 and plus whatever number of people who are going to be there this year will know that he is there for them. And that he not only speaks their language, his stories align with that. His passions all about helping them. It, it is clear through his words and actions that he is their guy. And, and, and that rings through. If he was there to just be playing niches in the, or riches in the niches, it, it, it, it, I mean, it would fall flat, right? It would be easy to suss out and see the difference. Speaker 2: (26:03) They were yelling, we love you, drew. It was like a rock concert. I was thinking like, what's going on Speaker 1: (26:10) Here? Right? And that does not happen by accident, right? Speaker 2: (26:12) No. And it comes across and Drew is an agency owner. Yep. And Ami is this other thing he's doing to help other agency owners. Eric, from predictive ROI stepped on my toes and said, you don't talk in any of your materials, that you're actually an agency owner right now. And, and that you know this and you know, when you get up in the morning, you have to worry about your pipeline and, and you have to worry about the clients and the billing. And I says, you don't tell 'em that you're walking the same journey. So that's important. Speaker 1: (26:48) It is important. Okay. So now, now let's move to number two. Speaker 2: (26:52) Well, have you worked with them already? And, and I've coached a thousand people on this, and we'll come up to this and they say, well, I'd like to work with, you know, maybe hospitals, healthcare. I heard there's a lot of money there. Um, or I could work with financial advisors. I said, well, you know, how many hospitals have you worked with? None. How many financial advisors have you worked with? Dozens and dozens. I said, okay, here's our answer. . You know, it's like, uh, uh, yes, you could pick a niche you've never been in and worked to get in there, but you're swimming upstream. Uh, there's a German proverb I like to quote, and it i'll, it translates like this. It doesn't matter how fast you're going if you're on the wrong road. Speaker 1: (27:40) Amen. Speaker 2: (27:42) And in fact, it's actually worse because you're getting farther away from where you need to be. Um, so you need to get the right road. And the right road is people who you've already helped you have some credibility with. There needs to be a story there that you, as you said, the stories you tell. Yeah. They need to be your stories. Your stories matter. Human brains are hardwired for stories. So you need to be telling stories for that target group. Speaker 1: (28:10) Amazing. Okay. Perfect. Uh, how about three, can they afford you? Speaker 2: (28:15) Can you, they afford you? Um, I always say money isn't everything. The author Zig Ziegler said, money is not the most important thing, you know, oxygen, but it's next to oxygen. So we need money to keep going. It's the fuel that keeps the, the rocket ship going here. And, um, some people just don't have the money, right. For you to have abundance, the abundance you need for your team members, uh, for causes you wanna support. Mm-hmm. , um, all the things you need to do requires filthy luer. No. It requires money. Yeah. Speaker 1: (28:53) Well, and that ties into number four. Are they willing to pay more for better service, uh, so that you're not having a race to the bottom right. That you can actually afford to invest in delighting your clients? Am I on the same page with you? Speaker 2: (29:05) You, you're absolutely right. So they have to see the value in the investment. Okay. So when we were in the real estate niche, um, they saw the value and they'll pay more. There was a quick story. This, um, one, one client wanted to talk to us. And I have to say he was a little shady. You know, they were, they were big, burly people, uh, outside his office and, uh, you know, so let's just say shady. And so I made the mistake as, as agency president, I said, just double the amount that we normally charge, and that way he'll kick us out is too expensive, you know? And he said, but what happened was he said, okay, you charge twice as much as anybody else. Must Speaker 1: (29:53) Be good. Speaker 2: (29:53) Well, obviously you're good . So okay, you're hired . And then, then he gave us some secret information and said, if it ever gets out, you're gonna have to look over your shoulder all the time. Do you understand what I'm saying? And I said, I understand. I walked out and my, uh, my, my account executive young sweet woman said that threat, do you really think he could cause us to lose other clients? I said, Linda, he was threatening to kill us. He would've us murdered if this got out. She was like, . Like, thankfully the campaign went well, and, and, uh, we moved on. Yeah. Okay. Speaker 1: (30:38) . Well, so I, I, here, here's, here's one of the reasons why, uh, I feel like number five is multi-layered. Um, so do they already know they need an agency like you? When, when I read it now, it could be just my lens and my bias, um, that when I read it, I think, oh, okay. It's because, you know, we've planted a flag of authority. We've, you know, become the authority in this space, in the niche and, and all of that. And you say you must educate the prospects that need an agency like yours. Um, so, so tell us all about five, because when I read five, I'm like, that's pretty meaty. Number five, Speaker 2: (31:12) Five is meaty. So you're looking for clients who hire agencies. They've worked with an agency before. They know the value proposition of the agency. They're not that people go like, eh, I could hire somebody in-house, or I could hire an agency. Yeah. You don't want those people. Hmm. Um, because they're asking the wrong questions. You know, an agency buys time by the year, sells it back by the hour, and gives you top talent. Yep. You're competing for the bottom talent who's willing to work for you. It's like the old joke about you're an astronaut. Are you comforted by the fact that your rocket was built by the lowest bidder ? You know? And, and, uh, so so you don't want that. So you want something they, they hire agencies. Yeah. And, uh, I, I landed a million dollar account when I was president of someone else's agency. Speaker 2: (32:15) Okay. And I got it from teaching. And, and somebody took the course and brought me in and, and they talked about their business for 45 minutes. I understood nothing about their business or what they did. Hmm. And then they said, our current agency is Manning, salvage and Lee, but, um, we've had a little falling out, so we need a new agency. Well, that was the first thing I understood, because I knew that agency wouldn't touch an account for under a million dollars . I thought, oh, um, I said, give me a week and I'll come back with a proposal. So I educated myself on this, uh, industry. Nobody was a specialist in it, and, um, won the account. Mm-hmm. . Um, another time I was brought in by a, um, fortune 500 company, and they had this project, and it, it, you'd say, this wasn't in my niche, it was about energy and gas and electric and new things like this. Speaker 2: (33:16) And I talked to 'em and I said, you know, I really don't think we're the agency for you, uh, because I have no background in this area. And they called me a week later and said, you had the account. And I, I went in and I said, and it was a, it was a great account. I said, um, why, why did you hire me? But I don't know this area. He said, actually, nobody knows this area. We were looking for something else. We were looking for somebody who could come in and completely dissect a problem and then explain it to our people how to implement it. Hmm. And we talked around and people said, oh, these are the four magic words in English language, by the way. They said, I know a guy, Henry DRIs mm-hmm. . And that's how he got it. So sometimes you'll be brought in for a certain skill you have that people recognize for, and, and that can work for you too. I give you permission to work for anybody. I want to stress you should market to one target niche, niche in Canada, niche in America, as in, you know, there's riches and niches, witches. Uh, so, uh, we don't even know how to pronounce the word, but we know that it works Speaker 1: (34:38) Well, it is, it is kind of funny. Uh, you've mentioned Eric a couple of times and he, he too says, uh, pronounces it as niche. But when, when you said, I know a guy that, that, uh, reminded me of something that I thought about mentioning, but then just forgot in the fact of how that that is actually an ingredient of how Drew and I define niche. And so if, if anyone listening, um, has heard, uh, Eric and I teach niche before, um, you know, yes, it could certainly be industry that's one of the ingredients in the recipe. Two, it could be your superpower as you just described, skill, right? It could absolutely be a superpower. Uh, three, maybe it's a business issue or challenge, uh, that, that you solve better than anybody else. And you're, your certain skill example was kind of teetering into that. So you're putting a couple ingredients together, which is awesome in, in the fourth. It, it could be an audience, maybe, you know, an audience better, maybe you know, an audience better than the client or your perspective client. So like when we, we knit all of those ingredients together, it becomes a pretty, a pretty strong recipe. So let's move into number six, which is, are they numerous? Speaker 2: (35:47) Ah, and, um, I'm a big fan of David C. Baker. I've written about 'em for years. Mm-hmm. , uh, wrote the, uh, the business, let's see, the business of expertise. Mm-hmm. . And in the business of expertise, he says, you need to have 2000 to 10,000 prospects in the area to really consider it. Less than that, it's, uh, too small of a fishing pond. Too much you're trying to drain the ocean. Um, so you, you find that for me, there are 7,800 small to medium sized agencies in America. That's a pond I can fish in for the rest of my life. Yep. And, uh, still have prospects I couldn't get to. Um, so that's what you're, you're looking for. Okay. Some other people along the way, they, uh, one chose pest control companies. Hmm. Um, and they became the pest control agency for America. And when people say, oh, I need an expert in pest control and, and marketing and all this is, I know a guy this works for our female listeners, I asked some of them and they said, yeah, we, we get called guys too. So it's okay. So I know a guy, you know, if you need an, an, uh, a research study for a agency, I know a guy Susan Byer out of Arizona audience audit. So it works that same way. Speaker 1: (37:12) Okay. So, so let's, let's go to, uh, seven. Um, do you have only a few real competitors? Speaker 2: (37:21) Yeah. So it's, um, if somebody says, I have no competition, I'm really worried. Yeah. Now, now as far as I've researched and, and we keep mentioning Eric Jensen, you know, helped me with this. There are no agency book guys other than me. The per is like, they're like, their whole thing is doing agency books. Yeah. Now, there are other ghost writers, there are other publishers. Sure. Those are still viable choices. Somebody will look at them as they look at me. I might have an edge that I specialize in the niche, um, but that doesn't mean I don't have competition. Um, so, but I don't have tons of people who can do the soup to nuts for planning a book, preparing, you know, I'm a ghost writer. Uh, I'm an developmental editor publishing the book mm-hmm. . And then what happens, our motto at indie books is publishing the book is not the finish line. Speaker 2: (38:24) It's the starting line. Right. It's about the journey that happens after that. And it's a marathon. Uh, because no author gets discovered. I, that's a myth out there. I'm gonna write this book and people discover me. You don't get discovered. I, I love the actress Margot Robbie, if you, if you know her, um, I do. And, and she was being interviewed and somebody said, what would've happened if you moved from Australia to America and you weren't discovered? And she said, I'm sorry. Well, what's the question says, well, what would you have done if they didn't, if you weren't discovered? She says, you thought I was discovered. I knocked on every door in Hollywood, every agent, every producer. And I kept knocking until somebody let me in and finally give an addition. I was not discovered. So as an author, you're not gonna be discovered either. You need to slice and dice that content. You need to go on podcasts. You, I have a magnificent seven things you have to do. There's a great book, 1,001 Ways to Market your book. That's the problem. There's 1,001 Way Ways to Market your book. Uh, I'll give you the seven most pragmatic things to do that are gonna get results. Speaker 1: (39:37) So is, is that something that we can, uh, either link in the show notes or share with our audience, or maybe point them to a blog post? I, I know you teach on the seven, but is there, Speaker 2: (39:47) I didn't teach on the seven and I've had articles on it, uh, in Forbes. Uh, okay, great. And, and we could link to it. Okay. Speaker 1: (39:54) Perfect. Um, so I will link to one of your forbes.com articles on that for some additional insight. Thank you for that. Um, the, the discovery thing is, is is really great. Like people think that, um, who don't know the backstory of Sylvester Stallone, he did the same thing in New York and went to every agent, uh, and, you know, did it multiple times, uh, until finally he wrote the script. And it's a really interesting story, but it's all about perseverance. So eight, Speaker 2: (40:21) The Rocky story is interesting because he also didn't know what he was worth. And one of his first meetings when they asked him how much for the screenplay, and he gave a number, the meeting was over because they thought he was an amateur. Yeah. I'm sorry, we're going to eight. Right? Speaker 1: (40:36) . All right. Can, uh, and this really speaks to your, uh, builder, a better agency example that you mentioned from, from last year. Can you find them easily enough through lists and associations? Speaker 2: (40:46) Right? You're looking for places where they go to get smarter. So the Baba Summit, they go to get smarter. The David C. Baker has a mind your own business conference where they go to get smarter. Um, there's, uh, you know, the, what is it, tan, t a a and, uh, agencies get together and they go there to get smarter. So where are these places? Pamela Slim and the whitest that calls 'em the watering holes or the ponds? Yes. So can you find them? Sometimes people come to me, there's this group they want, they're describing this psychographic, and there's, I go like, yeah, we can't buy a list of those people. They don't have any meetings where this psychographic all gathers. Hmm. Uh, so, uh, this is, this is a dry hole, uh, as they say in, in the, all this down in Texas. You got a dry hole here. Um, and no amount of fracking is gonna help you get anything out of that hole. So, uh, gee, that was probably politically incorrect. . Um, so, uh, what we need to do is find where they gather, and there's this amazing tool I have, if I could share, can I share it, Steven? Of Speaker 1: (41:56) Course you can. Speaker 2: (41:57) It's called Google . You Google, where does, you know, agency owners gather? Where do agency owners meet? Where do agency owners, uh, you know, what do agency owners read? Yeah. And, and the Google machine as one old timer called it to me. So yeah, the Google machine will, will spit out your answers there. Speaker 1: (42:20) Yeah. Well, here, here's, here's what I love about eight and nine. Um, so, so nine is, can you find target rich environments where they gathered? And you mentioned Baba, you mentioned some of the other agency centric associations when, when I think of eight and nine, I see some real cool interdependency between eight and nine. Eight. Can we buy a list of the 7,800 that you mentioned before? Yes. Uh, can then we use that list to maybe do some strategic prospecting, if you will. I wonder if this person's gonna be at the Baba Summit this year. I wonder if that person's gonna be a sponsor to the Baba Summit. And then you can start sort of pre-planning so that you can take your list and then head to nine the pond, and then make sure you're meeting the right people while in the pond. Right. Speaker 2: (43:07) Right. And there are all kinds of strategies, and you've used them, um, that there might be some pre-event, you know, a cocktail party or, uh, I know we're kicking around some kind of donut party morning donut excursion, Speaker 1: (43:21) But no running If Car Cunningham, Carly Cunningham, if you're listening to this right now, donuts Yes. Long distance running through the streets of Chicago. No, no, Speaker 2: (43:30) No. Have you seen Henry and Stephen? Do we look like marathon runners, or do we look like donut eat? Speaker 1: (43:37) I have two tight hips for peace sake. I, I'm not running. Come on. Speaker 2: (43:42) . My doctor did say that I've already eaten my lifetime supply of donuts, and I should let other people have the donuts now. But, uh, for Carly, I might, I might consent to have one in Chicago. No, the point of that is you can get together, uh, I do Q and as, uh, modeled after your campfire q and as for authors and agency owners, and I encourage people to be part of the community, come there, ask questions, to get to know other members. I, I call the 150 authors, uh, the family. Yep. And my word is I want the family amplifying each other's work. It's, it's not a quit pro quo or anything like that, but it is the law of reciprocation that the more people you help, the more you will get helped to amplify your work and share it with others. And as we said, where these gatherings are, you can do extra things. David Maister, Dr. David Maister, I recommend him. Former professor at the Harvard Business School. Mm-hmm. . Uh, he let me take one page from one of his books 20 years ago and make a career out of it. A and he always said, this is what you need to do and you need to gather, and you just don't come in and out. Um, you need to be part of the community and contributing to that community anyway. You can. Speaker 1: (45:06) Right. 100%. I I know that we're, uh, quickly running out of time. So, so bring us home with number 10. Uh, will some make marquee clients advocates and references? Speaker 2: (45:17) Well, right. If, if you have some group where they say, what would be your client, but here's the condition, you can never mention that you worked with us. Uh, this is not a good place because prospects want social proof. They want several things. They want, they wanna know that you have a proprietary problem solving process, that you're not winging it. Uh, they want to know that you have experience. Uh, they wanna know some marquee clients. They wanna be able to talk to some people that you've worked with. Um, they need all these social proofs because they can't really judge how good of a service our agency provides. Um, and everybody says the same thing. Oh, I've done focus groups with people who hire agencies. Don't say these things. Don't say how long you've been in business. Uh, they laugh at you for that. I've been golfing longer than Tiger Woods. Speaker 2: (46:09) It doesn't make me a better golfer. Okay. The other thing is, don't say we're just the right size, big enough to get the job done small enough for personal attention. They, they laugh at us for that. They say firms with five people say that firms with 500 people say that. What they wanna hear is research about their peers. Not you naming peers. But, you know, we've worked with, you know, this many people or we've done a study and, uh, our research shows, like I shared that two outta three agency owners. And the number one pain is a dry sales pipeline. Not enough qualified prospects. Yep. I surveyed over a thousand people to learn that. So they wanna learn about themselves. They wanna know that you know about them. They want to be able to tell somebody, oh, well, we hired the agency that worked for A, B, and C, and they go, oh, they're good. Um, so that's why this is important. Speaker 1: (47:07) A hundred percent love that and great way to, to, to bring us home and, and emphasizes, uh, when, when we kicked off going through that list, or actually in the introduction, um, I, I've mentioned the, the, the, the piece that you use as your bottom line to close out this chapter. You, you, you say, so I'm gonna quote Henry again here, um, what he wrote, bottom line, the more quality thinking you do upfront meaning through these 10 questions, the easier business development will be 100%. Well, well said, Henry. So I, before we go, uh, before we close out and say goodbye, um, any final advice, anything you think we might have missed? And then please do tell, uh, our audience, uh, the best way to connect with you. Speaker 2: (47:52) Thank you for asking. Sure. If anybody ask you a good question like that, you're to pause three seconds for dignity and say, thank you for asking . The, the main message is stay on the journey. And then when you do a book, is the number one marketing tool. Talking about the book is the number one fill your pipeline strategy. Yeah. So you get on podcasts, you, you give speeches, you talk about the book, the book opens the doors to do that. And also, as you taught me in Sell with authority, you can't spell authority without the word author. An author is an authority and people get your best thinking in the book. So share that with them. So for anybody in the predictive ROI world, if they wanna have a no cost, no selling zone strategy call with me on this. I'm happy to do it. Speaker 2: (48:51) Yeah. So you can just contact me at henry indie books i ntl.com. Steven will put it in the show notes, and, uh, we'll have what I call a book chat. I'll help you get clear on the goals for doing a book, what hidden assets you have to get a book done. A lot of people don't realize they're already have these assets. Uh, three, what are the roadblocks, uh, roadblocks. Don't stop agency owners, but you gotta figure a way around them, over 'em, through 'em. And then, uh, four, I'll tell you how others have gotten from where you are right now to where you want to go, because the path and the plan of others leaves the clues you need for your journey and your quest to sell with authority. Speaker 1: (49:36) Yeah. A a good friend of mine and one of my accountability partners, Don Yeager, um, often says this, this quote is not his. I just can't remember the, uh, person who originally said it. But anyway, Don often says, success leaves clues. And, and I think that that's a hundred percent correct. And Henry, uh, thank you very much for saying yes to come back to the show for this encore. And everyone, uh, no matter how many notes you took or how often you go back and re-listen to Henry's words of wisdom, which I sure hope that you do, the key is you have to take what he's so generously shared with you, the 10 filtering questions and all of the story in stories in each of those. 10, take them and apply them. Because again, the bottom line, how much work you put into the front end of this is what will determine the success. Success leaves clues, and he just gave you a bunch of them. Take it and apply it. Because when you do that through application, that's where the results will come. And again, Henry, thank you for saying yes, we all have the same 86,400 seconds in a day. And I'm grateful that you came onto the show to be our mentor and guide, uh, yet again. Thank you so much my friend, Speaker 2: (50:46) As they say at Chick-fil-A. My pleasure.

This episode is available on:* Spotify* Apple PodcastsToday we talk about building and thriving a consulting business based on our combined SEO and consulting experience of over 10 years.In this episode of Contrarian Marketing, we cover:* How to transition into a consultant role* What makes one a good consultant* Why Neil Patel Digital works as an SEO brandKey Takeaways* Many people do not understand SEO and accept mediocre work as ‘quality output'. Thus, real SEO experts can use this gap as a good opportunity to grow in the SEO industry.* Focus on gaining experience in-house or at an agency before venturing out as a consultant.* Work on creating a strong referral network by building a trustworthy personal brand among your peers and clients.* Learn to pitch and sell your expertise with confidence* The best way to get promoted is to make a switchThere is potential in consulting for the SEO industryEli shares why there is a huge untapped potential in the SEO industry for talented experts and where the opportunity lies:“I don't know him (Neil Patel). I don't know his practices. I've never worked with him. But I do think that Neil Patel and Neil Patel Digital, in particular, demonstrate the massive upside there is in this (SEO) industry. He was recently on the My First Million podcast, and I think he said they do over a hundred million dollars a year in revenue – most of it from SEO. That's the potential.There are so many companies out there that don't understand SEO.”He also shares his experience with PRNewswire on how people accept not-so-great quality output, and true experts can tap onto this potential to deliver great work:“I remember PR Newswire approached me pre-Covid about this webinar and they were charging  $900 to go to this webinar and – they sold it to their customers. There are so many people out there that don't understand marketing. They don't understand SEO.Then, they look at Neil Patel, PR Newswire, and all these other agencies who may not do the kind of work that we think is of high quality, but everyone else thinks it's of high quality. And to me, that's the potential of this industry.”The key is to build a strong personal networkKevin shares how his 12+ experience in the SEO industry via his job, speaker opportunities, and personal branding efforts helped him successfully transition into an independent consultant role:“How people perceive you, whether you're an agency or a consultant, is incredibly important, and I have never thought about it more than right now.  I have been active in this industry for 12-13 years now. I've worked even at Shopify and did things outside of SEO, but I'm still recognized as an SEO (expert).But having the blog, having spoken at conferences and all that kind of stuff has contributed massively. I was lucky to get a full portfolio of clients before I even announced that I am a consultant now.So, a strong network helped immensely. People were so kind to connect me with clients and all that kind of stuff.”Eli agrees by sharing his personal experience about the power of sales and having a strong network:“There was a company I talked to recently, which I was referred to by someone I sat next to at my very first job 16 years ago. So the longer time you spend within companies, the bigger network you'll build, and some of the best deals that I have signed have come from my former coworkers – they've referred me, and they've been at these companies. You have to build that expertise within your network.I don't have a blog, but I wrote a book, which really helps in closing deals.But it's so much more important that you have a network that can refer things to you, whether it's investors or friends, or past coworkers or past clients – that's where you're going to get so many things. And I've met some terrible consultants who do just fine because they have that network.”First, get hands-on experience in the industry Kevin also advises that its crucial to get legit experience in your industry before getting into consultation:“You and I were both fans of Alan Weiss's Million Dollar Consulting and how he approaches this practice. One of the things that he preaches is to be out there to build a brand, put content out, and demonstrate your expertise.I think that's something that you need to do to send out, and build a reputation, and this is also something that needs to be built on (top of) experience, right?So if somebody would really ask me – Hey, I'm a college grad, should I become a consultant?I would actually say, – No, that's a stupid idea. You need to gain experience first. As somebody new to the industry, I think you need to learn from others first – for which an agency or in-house is your best bet.”Be confident about yourself and your workEli shares his experience of an encounter with a confident consultant and how being confident helps build trust and close deals.“I have seen some fantastic consultants and I'd say the thing I learned the most from is a guy named Aaron Sheer, who unfortunately passed away many years ago. So I was working at this startup and Aaron Sheer was our SEO consultant.He did well – like he was a consultant for eBay and Zappos. The one thing I really learned from him was his level of confidence.So he would come in, and the team would say – should we do ‘A' or ‘B'?And he would say – you should definitely do ‘A', and they would say – how do you know?And he'd say – you're gonna do ‘A', like, this is my experience. He was super confident about it.And then it failed. ‘A' totally didn't work, we got less traffic.And he'd say, –  well, there was a 99% chance it would. Unfortunately, it fell into the 1%. I'm super confident my recommendation was right. I'm never wrong, but it happens to be that I don't know everything. I'm not Google. And I learned that confidence from him.And that's what people look for in consultants – an external expert who's not doing what those internal experts are doing for them, or they don't have an internal team, and they're looking for an expert to really weigh in and give them a point of view and not someone who's just going to be doing busy work.The real upside is saying – I will solve your SEO problems.I learned that from Aaron Sheer – he was super confident. I don't know whether he helped us grow or didn't help us grow, but everyone certainly thought he helped us grow.I think the most important thing for building a successful consulting career is really understanding sales. And it's not just about whether you can close the deal, but can you continue to have that confidence and direct your clients that they want to keep working with you because you know what you're talking about.”Build a good reputation among your peersKevin shares how your reputation in the industry is important for making it as a consultant:“I think putting yourself out there is a critical element.As you said, the network, and sales (are important), but then being visible in the industry and being perceived as someone in the industry who is good (is crucial too). I think it's often underestimated, but SEO is actually a smaller industry than most people would think – people know each other and people are getting asked.So, you have to make sure that your peers respect and appreciate you.”What can you learn from Neil Patel's brand?Eli thinks that the SEO industry's black-box nature makes it necessary to build a reputation that instills trustworthiness and expertise:“I don't think SEO's that hard or differentiated –  it's pretty basic.I think if you were to do SEO for CNN, or if I were to do SEO for CNN or Neil Patel would do SEO for CNN or Rand Fishkin – the results and the recommendations would be very similar. The problem with the SEO industry is that it's hard. You have to trust. It's a black box.We really don't know exactly how this is going to work. It's not like paid marketing – I spent this money, I returned this amount, should I spend more? I don't know, but I will spend more and I'll find out.You don't have any of those insights (for SEO), so it comes across as how confident are you in the ability of the person hired to give the right recommendations.”Kevin adds further about Neil Patel's ability to retain clients:“I think the art is to not only get in through a really good pitch but then also keep clients and keep delivering. That's always where, where I would love to just peek behind the scenes for once.”Eli also mentions how the SEO industry mostly re-packages data from SEO tools as recommendations, and how Neil Patel's ownership of tools like Answer the Public, and UberSuggest act as trump cards in sales pitches:“There was a company I talked to last week that raised this insane amount of money and they're using an agency. I showed them Ahrefs, and they said – oh, our agency uses it. We don't have access to it.I'm like, why wouldn't you just buy a trust for $120 a month? You don't need to spend $5,000 a month with a kid doctor. So, the data's there – their agency is packaging it and telling them what a fantastic job they're doing because they're using Ahrefs. There are basic tools within our industry – Ahrefs, Semrush, SimilarWeb, etc, and everyone else is just packaging and representing it.Neil Patel Digital owns some awesome tools, like, he has UberSuggest and they bought Answer the Public. So they have some of their tools, but they bought them, they didn't create them. I'm certain that when they go into a pitch, they are like –  these are your keywords, this is your content gap.So the whole industry is relying on the same tools and the same data, making the same recommendations – it's just how you sell it.”The best way to get a promotion is still switching companiesWe asked you via our LinkedIn post to share what you think is the best way to get a promotion. Interestingly, switching companies was said to be the most effective method to make your way ahead on the ladder.Eli supports this insight by sharing his example of getting promoted:“I tried to switch companies when I was moving to Singapore and I got a new job. I was at Survey Monkey at the time, and when I went to give notice, they convinced me to stay and I got a 40 raise. So, I got a 3-level massive promotion, and it was completely unintentional. I wasn't trying to negotiate it for it, but I do think this is valid.I think that companies don't necessarily appreciate their employees until they're gone and you could threaten to leave and get that promotion and you force them to really say – oh, we do appreciate you, and are willing to pay you more, willing to promote you. Or we could just go to another company who will appreciate us – I think that's the sad reality.With the layoffs, people might be scared to ask for promotions, but the truth is, the employees that are still within a company, they're even more valuable.I also always looked at other people and watched them rise in the company and they went from junior to senior pretty quickly. They seemed to have it all together. And the thing is, they were good at positioning how to do what they're doing.”Kevin adds further how one should work towards being ‘seen' by their managers:If you think that you have proof to back that (your promotion) up, it's totally fine to go and ask for a promotion. As you said, you might not get a big promotion as you did in 2019, but I also agree that just because layoffs are happening, that does not mean that no one should get a promotion or that you should not get a promotion.I think the art is in making the case well and having proof and having a fit with your manager. Meaning knowing what your manager wanted in the first place and then delivering.You also don't want to just do stuff, but you want to make sure your manager sees it, your manager's manager sees it, and other people see it too.”We discuss a few more views shared around getting promoted in our previous episode 9: Marketing predictions for 2023.Show NotesBook recommendations:* Million Dollar Consulting: The Professional's Guide to Growing a Practice by Alan Weiss – the book shares a time-tested model for creating a flourishing consulting business, while incorporating and focusing on the many dynamic changes in solo and boutique consulting, coaching, and entrepreneurship.* The Trusted Advisor by David Maister –  learn how to build credibility, respect, and trustworthiness with clients and prospects.* Trillion Dollar Coach: The Leadership Playbook of Silicon Valley's Bill Campbell by  Eric Schmidt – the book shares management lessons from legendary business executive and coach Bill Campbell. He mentored some of the most successful modern entrepreneurs and has played an important role in the growth of several prominent companies, such as Google, Apple, and Intuit.Join the conversationSubscribe to the newsletter for a free summary, key takeaways, and community content once a week.Would you like us to host ‘The Contrarian Marketing Conference?'What should it look like? – Should it be online or in person? Recorded or live?Reach out to us and let us know whether there should be some summit, conference, or mastermind – happy to take your input!Enjoyed this episode? – Subscribe to Contrarian Marketing on Spotify/Apple podcasts/Youtube to listen to past episodes and get notified of upcoming releases.Thank you!Eli and Kevin This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit www.contrarianmarketingpodcast.com

In this episode of Story Talks, we welcome Sona Sherratt of Ashridge where she designs, teaches and client directs on several executive education programmes with clients such as SAB Miller, Swarovski, Heineken, Erste Group Bank, Avis, Beazley Insurance Group and Continental. Sona has designed and delivered senior leadership and general management programs for clients around the world. Sona has co-authored a book entitled ‘50 Biggest Management Dilemmas Solved' which was published by Pearson in January 2014. Together we discussed an area close to her heart, something she's been researching and writing about extensively as part of her doctorate: Psychological Safety. This is a broad word that we broke down in terms of benefits and the consequences of not creating a psychologically safe working environment. We covered a lot of ground, managing to discuss the concept of "quiet quitting", the "big resignation",  the "trust equation", and leadership challenges in a VUCA world (Volatile, Uncertain, Complex, and Ambiguous.) We break these down and leave you with practical tools to navigate a work place and work force that are increasingly complex and where the stakes couldn't be higher.For instance, you'll learn about lazy questions versus questions that move everyone forward, something that isn't so difficult to implement, and could make a big difference in your day to day interactions. Finally, as you know by now, we always ask our guests about an experience that shaped who they are today, and Sona did not disappoint with an answer that is highly relatable and yet unique in its circumstances. It involves moving from India to the US when she was 10, not speaking the language, and walking on an escalator for the first time. Enjoy!  Links and resources to learn more:For more on Sona: https://www.linkedin.com/in/sonasherratt/For more on Ashridge: https://www.hult.edu/ashridge/For more on the work of Carol Dwek, influential American psychologist: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carol_Dweck For more on "quiet quitting": https://www.nytimes.com/2022/08/23/style/quiet-quitting-tiktok.htmlFor more on David Maister and the Trust Equation: https://trustedadvisor.com/why-trust-matters/understanding-trust/understanding-the-trust-equation

Can you think of a top business book exclusively for professional services firms? If so, your list is probably short and presumably headed by any title from David Maister. In this episode, a new book for this industry is introduced, The Boutique: How to Start, Scale, and Sell a Professional Services Firm by Greg Alexander.In this conversation, we talk about elephant and rabbit hunters, the one-thirds of billings, the only three types of firms in existence, and two critical metrics that buyers of professional services firms are examining closely.

This is a revisited episode from Season 4, Episode 1. Chris Lord has successfully built several Management Consulting businesses in Southern California, most recently as the General Manager for Slalom Consulting, where he led the Practice's growth from under $2 million in 2010 to $30 million in 2015. After ‘retirement' in Dec of 2015, he founded his own firm, Bridge Builder Coaching, to help Military Veterans through tough transitions in their lives. Bridge Builder Coaching helps Veterans transition out of Military service and into the corporate world through personal 1-on-1 coaching, assessments, networking, introductions, and facilitation. What you will learn in this episode: Why Chris's Elephant is the question "how do you put everything into your professional passion and still deliver the best of yourself outside your work?" Why it's important to find the right balance and not bury yourself in your profession even if you love what you're doing Why everyone has an ego, and why your ego plays a big role in stepping into your passion without letting it overwhelm you How Chris's current role helping Military vets switch gears to find their new lives mirrors his own efforts to find balance and follow his calling Why listening to the people around him helps Chris stay grounded, and why you should read "The Trusted Advisor" by David Maister, Charles Green and Robert Galford Why fear causes people to focus on themselves instead of others, and why it's important to attain a balance between selflessness and selfishness in your relationships How Chris recognizes his fear of not being accepted, and how he has worked to overcome his fear Why Chris has realized that it's important to allow himself to be vulnerable and trust in others not to tear him down Resources: Connect with Chris Lord on LinkedIn: http://www.linkedin.com/in/clord1/ (www.linkedin.com/in/clord1/) This podcast uses the following third-party services for analysis: Podcorn - https://podcorn.com/privacy Podtrac - https://analytics.podtrac.com/privacy-policy-gdrp

Jeff Meade is the President of Meade, a management consultancy for marketing agencies. He is responsible for growing an agency's revenue past $20 million and landing another one on the Inc. 5000. In this episode of Leaders of Consulting, he talks about his diagnostic called Agency Roadmap, and how it allows him to determine the businesses' true problem and help the businesses identify their desired outcomes. Jeff also discusses his Four Benchmarks of an Agency's Life Cycle, and the processes involved therein. Additionally, he shares how his mindset was changed by a book written by David Maister. Mentioned on the episode: http://www.themeadecompany.com/ (Meade) https://www.themeadecompany.com/agencyroadmap (Agency Roadmap) https://davidmaister.com/books/mtpsf/ (Managing the Professional Service Firm) by David Maister https://www.marketingprofs.com/articles/2022/47251/the-four-benchmarks-of-an-agencys-life-cycleand-how-to-profit-from-them (Four Benchmarks of an Agency's Life Cycle—And How To Profit from Them) Connect with Jeff Meade on https://www.linkedin.com/in/jeffmeade/ (LinkedIn)

There isn't much more important in agency life than the relationships you build with your clients. And yet, building client relationships is something I have never received any formal training in. It's just something you learn on the job. What if I tell you there's an equation for what forms great client relationships. Better still, what if I invited an agency pro and expert on client relationships to explain it? Look no further. In the latest episode of Through the Line, Paul Phillips joins me to explore the ‘Trust Equation', developed by David Maister in his famous text, The Trusted Advisor and what this means for improving agency and client relationships.

A worried leader seeks help finding balance between going with the flow and giving himself a larger voice.Visit our Tools bin for free PDFs to help you achieve The Look & Sound of Leadership.This episode is tagged in three categories in the Podcast Library:AssertivenessManaging YourselfRelationship BuildingFive related episodes you might listen to are: 21Eliminating Distractions59  Focus in the Face of Distractions 30Self-Knowledge as Leadership184    The Focused Executive142    The Mindful ExecutiveTom also talked about two books in this episode:“Flow: The Psychology of Optimal Experience”by Mihaly Csikszentmlhalyi“The Trust Advisor”by David Maister, et al Thanks to everyone who posts reviews, and thanks so much for your kind words! Let us know how we can support your growth and development. Be in touch with us here. Until next month, be well!Tom and The Look & Sound of Leadership team. 

The influence of David Maister's work on professional firms continues to this day despite the fact that he retired in 2009. While Ron and Ed have some problems with his reliance on efficiency and metrics, his book True Professionalism: The Courage to Care about Your People, Your Clients, and Your Career stands out for its insight into what it really means to be a professional. In this episode, we will explore this book and share our thoughts about what Maister did and did not get right.

The influence of David Maister's work on professional firms continues to this day despite the fact that he retired in 2009. While Ron and Ed have some problems with his reliance on efficiency and metrics, his book True Professionalism: The Courage to Care about Your People, Your Clients, and Your Career stands out for its insight into what it really means to be a professional. In this episode, we will explore this book and share our thoughts about what Maister did and did not get right.

The influence of David Maister's work on professional firms continues to this day despite the fact that he retired in 2009. While Ron and Ed have some problems with his reliance on efficiency and metrics, his book True Professionalism: The Courage to Care about Your People, Your Clients, and Your Career stands out for its insight into what it really means to be a professional. In this episode, we will explore this book and share our thoughts about what Maister did and did not get right.

When I hear coaches and consultants talk about partnering, my ears perk up. Not because I'm a big believer in partnerships (as you're about to see).  It's because I'm listening for the real reasons they want a partner. Most of the time I hear things like: We would have a lot of fun building something together We have complementary skill sets We have similar audiences Then in podcasting, there's this one, We want to start a podcast together, so we need a way to monetize it. And there's nothing wrong with any of those impulses. I started my first podcast with a partner, and we weren't sure how we would monetize it.  Now it makes us 6 figures a year.  However, partnerships are tough to sustain over the long run. It's really hard for two partners to put in the same amount of effort, energy and focus into a project for years and years. At some point, one partner will feel like they're putting in more than the other partner.  Sometimes even both partners feel this way.  That's why in partnerships like law firms, profit goes into a pie and the pie gets split along the lines of seniority or billable hours.  Dividing the pie “fairly” is really hard - even for firms who have decades of experience. In one of my favorite books of all time, Managing the Professional Service Firm, consulting legend David Maister devotes 50 pages of the book to partnership issues. It's all the nitty gritty stuff people don't think about until they're already in a partnership, like… Partner performance counseling (year end appraisals, self-evaluations & feedback) Partner compensation (billable hours, seniority, rainmaker vs. operations activities) Strategic decision making, goal setting and aligning incentives with strategy Partner relationships (partner archetypes, managing partners, division of powers) In other words, making a partnership work is complicated. In fact, Maister said that it was fairly common for a firm to bring him in for consulting, and the result was one or more partners leaving. One of my clients says having a business partner is like getting married (except you don't get to make out with them). So there's a lot of potential for friction. So here are 3 questions to help you make good decisions on partnerships… 1. Do I really have to give up equity to build this business? Look for ways to hire people, and where you can't hire a skillset, create joint ventures, revshare or commission agreements with pre-agreed caps, all in writing. 2. Could I pay for the skills and expertise instead of partnering up? Partners are permanent, so make sure their skills are permanently needed.  Chances are, you only need a certain skill set for a short time.  Think about Steve Jobs and Steve Wozniak. One was a visionary marketing genius, the other was the tech genius who actually made stuff work in real life. They needed each other. But even the tech genius was a skill that could be hired out. Steve Wozniak was crucial in the early days, but it was Jobs' drive and vision that made Apple a trillion-dollar company.  3. Could I create a sense of mission and camaraderie within my team, instead of with partners? Entrepreneurship is lonely. Part of the draw of partnership is the sense of community and shared mission. The good news is, you can still have that without giving up equity. Look for ways to create that sense of community and shared mission by building a team of contractors or employees. Get them fired up about your mission and their role in creating a new future for themselves and others.  Everything that is truly valuable to others takes energy, effort and focus to succeed.  In some cases, partnership can be greater than the sum of its parts and produce amazing things with less effort. Yet I've noticed that a major allure of partnership is the assumption that it will take less effort, energy and focus to succeed. And that's a dangerous...

Market your niche to people by talking about what you don't do instead or saying that you do everything. Otherwise, your competitors will control that narrative. Sean Campbell explains in today's episode how his company helps other companies successfully direct their messaging. Welcome to Pillars of Wealth Creation, where we talk about building financial freedom with a special focus in business and Real Estate. Follow along as Todd Dexheimer interviews top entrepreneurs, investors, advisers and coaches. Sean Campbell has been training, mentoring, and educating all his life. An exceptionally well-regarded conference speaker and author, Sean has delivered talks for Fortune 50 companies and top tier conferences. He has also been the author of several books on technical as well as business topics. Sean has also been a professional services firm owner for over 20 years. His professional services work has spanned consulting engagements with the Fortune 50 and startups you've heard of, the sale of his first professional services company, and the growth of delivery, sales, marketing, and operational practices inside professional services firms. In short, Sean brings a wealth of knowledge when it comes to surviving and thriving as a service firm owner or the leader of a practice area inside a larger services firm. 3 Pillars 1. Discretionary time 2. Read 3. Once you learn something, tell someone about it 4. Read something you disagree with Books: Managing the Professional Services Firm by David Maister, The Hard Thing About Hard Things by Ben Horowitz, and books by Alan Weiss You can connect with Sean at www.cascadeinsights.com or sean@cascadeinsights.com Sign up for the May 2-3 Northstar Real Estate conference now at www.NorthstarUnlimited.live and use code EARLYBIRD for $100 off your ticket. Interested in coaching? Schedule a call with Todd at www.coachwithdex.com Connect with Pillars Of Wealth Creation on Facebook: www.facebook.com/PillarsofWealthCreation/ Subscribe to our email list at www.pillarsofwealthcreation.com Subscribe to our YouTube channel: www.youtube.com/c/PillarsOfWealthCreation

Episode 24. In today's practical episode, Rob & Martin offer up practical advice and tips for accounting practitioners on "What Works for Accountants on Turning Intentions into Action." Good ideas and thought-out plans are easy. It's the execution and implementation that accountants struggle with, until they start using these tips. Key takeaways from this episode include: ✓ why many accounting practitioners are technically smart but still struggling to upskill in other basic areas of professional competence ✓ why action trumps training when it comes to growing accounting firms ✓ shout out to David Maister, author of Trusted Advisor, Managing the Professional Services Firm and Strategy & the Fat Smoker ✓ why it is easier for so many comfortable or complacent accountants to do nothing than to stretch themselves ✓ the secret formula for progress in accountancy practice growth ✓ why it's not a coincidence that accountants who prioritise pipeline win the best clients with the best fees and the most interesting work ✓ the impact of small, incremental steps, and an example of one simple thing an accountant could do to win more business ✓ why it's difficult for accountants to be growth-minded when work traditionally 'lands on their lap' ✓ the power for accountants of making just one phone call to make something good happen ✓ the many things accountants and CPAs can do with their discretionary, non-chargeable time to create more career and business opportunities ✓ a simple refutation of the 'I don't have time' excuse offered by many accounting professionals ✓ free download for listeners: "A 5 Step Plan for Accountants to Create New Growth Opportunities" https://accountinginfluencers.com/growth-opportunities-accountants ✓ 5 simple but effective things to do every day to create significant new career opportunities, greater influence, a better network and new business conversations ✓ the futility of strategising and planning big things but not actually doing anything about it NOTE TO LISTENERS: The Accounting Influencers Podcast is a CPE-accredited daily radio-style show with four segments coming out every Monday which are repeated on the other 4 weekdays as standalone episodes, plus a bonus 'from the client's perspective' episode on Saturdays. On Sundays, listeners get a short min trailer for the coming week's episodes. Every Tuesday the show gives you a relevant news topic from the accounting and fintech world with a direct application to accountants, CPAs and bookkeepers. Great to stay informed and build your commercial acumen. Every Wednesday and Friday, we feature an uncut interview with top authors, leaders, thinkers and performers in the accounting and fintech world. Every Thursday the show gives you a practical 'here's what works' tips concerning a key challenge, need or strategy for accountants, CPAs and bookkeepers. Great to stay current and keep your skills topped up. Finally, every Saturday gives listeners a bonus episode which focuses on the buyers of accounting services - the clients themselves. In particular how they feel, react to and experience their interactions with accountants. That includes why they buy or don't buy, why they move or stay and why they think how they think about you, your firm, your prices and your offerings. Martin and Rob love to hear from the show's 20,000 unique listeners in 144 countries around the world. If you like the show, leave a review wherever you listen, and please recommend the show to your friends and colleagues.

David Maister's book, “Managing the Professional Services Firm” is quite honestly one of the most important and impactful books any business owner can read. It's also the book that began my friendship with executive and leadership coach, Pat Scopelliti.  It was only right that I brought him on as the first guest of One Book! David Maister's book is a must-read for anyone who wants to think strategically, have “meta-conversations”, and diagnose the core problems in a business.  In this episode, The Consigliori and I discuss why this book is so near and dear to us, and the most impactful takeaways from it.  Three Things You'll Learn In This Episode  The big insight from David Maister that applies to everyone “This is boring, but are you doing it?” When we approach a book with this question, we can fully dive into its applications and extend its reach. You have to approach with the mindset that there is an application somewhere that you're going to agree with that you're not doing.  Every company is a professional services firm whether you know it or not  In a professional service, you have knowledge that applies to the customer that they don't have, and they come to you because they want your counsel. Whether you're Costco or a lawyer, if you can help them solve their problems, you're in a professional services moment.  The big payoff of Managing the Professional Service Firm Maister forces you to think strategically and have meta-conversation about business. It's about being able to look at someone's business and instantly get a sense of what's going on and what the core problem is.   Guest Bio  Pat is The Consigliori. He is an executive leadership and recruitment coach. Every Don needs his Consigliori. His failures must be analyzed, his successes celebrated. His limitations must be identified, fought, defeated and obliterated. His strengths and potentials must be fully employed, grown, leveraged and fulfilled. No Don can complete this ongoing mission without the right aid, at least not as powerfully as he will with his Consigliori's help. For more information, visit https://www.theconsigliori.com/ (https://www.theconsigliori.com/).  https://www.amazon.com/Managing-Professional-Service-David-Maister/dp/0684834316 (Managing the Professional Service Firm) by David Maister 

The first episode in which Carolyn explores the power of David Maister's Trust Equation, and shows how to build credibility with others as a part of building their trust. Credible people ‘just know their stuff'. What can you do to have others experience you that way and thus build trust with your team, your clients and your boss?

There are many paths to success in a law firm.  I've emphasized on this podcast that growing your practice is a good place to start.  Having your own clients gives you a sense of ownership that is hard to achieve when you are just servicing firm clients.  If you have your own book of business, there is more opportunity to focus on the work you enjoy and the clients you like.   For some, getting involved in the management of a firm is another way to find more fulfillment.  But it is not for everyone. I once heard someone say that managing a law firm is like being the only fire hydrant in a town filled with dogs. David Maister and Patrick McKenna put it another way in their book First Among Equals.  When you are running a professional services firm, you must lead through influence rather than authority. In this episode, I have a great conversation with David Rosenblatt who has been one of the longest serving Managing Partners in the Boston legal market.  He has served as Managing Partner at Burns & Levinson since 1998. During that time, David has seen a lot of changes in the practice of law and a lot of changes at his own firm. A few months ago, the firm announced that David would be stepping down from the role in 2023 and I thought it would be a great opportunity to speak to David and get him to reflect on his experience. In this episode, we talk about David's career, the changes he has seen, what has been most fulfilling for him, what advice he has for lawyers thinking about law firm management, and a host of other topics.

Zum 20-jährigen Jubiläum gibt es eine komplett überarbeitete Neuauflage. Für mich wieder ein Ausflug in die Vergangenheit, denn David Maister – der Altmeister der Kanzleiberater – kenne ich aus meiner Zeit, als ich bei Hübner & Hübner in Wien gearbeitet habe. Zusammen mit Cordula Schneider diskutiere ich über die zeitlosen und neuen Ideen. Denn was für Maister der „Trusted Advisor“ ist, ist für uns die Beraterkanzlei.

Chris Lord has successfully built several Management Consulting businesses in Southern California, most recently as the General Manager for Slalom Consulting, where he led the Practice's growth from under $2 million in 2010 to $30 million in 2015. After ‘retirement' in Dec of 2015, he founded his own firm, Bridge Builder Coaching, to help Military Veterans through tough transitions in their lives. Bridge Builder Coaching helps Veterans transition out of Military service and into the corporate world through personal 1-on-1 coaching, assessments, networking, introductions, and facilitation. What you will learn in this episode: Why Chris's Elephant is the question "how do you put everything into your professional passion and still deliver the best of yourself outside your work?" Why it's important to find the right balance and not bury yourself in your profession even if you love what you're doing Why everyone has an ego, and why your ego plays a big role in stepping into your passion without letting it overwhelm you How Chris's current role helping Military vets switch gears to find their new lives mirrors his own efforts to find balance and follow his calling Why listening to the people around him helps Chris stay grounded, and why you should read "The Trusted Advisor" by David Maister, Charles Green and Robert Galford Why fear causes people to focus on themselves instead of others, and why it's important to attain a balance between selflessness and selfishness in your relationships How Chris recognizes his fear of not being accepted, and how he has worked to overcome his fear Why Chris has realized that it's important to allow himself to be vulnerable and trust in others not to tear him down Resources: Connect with Chris Lord on LinkedIn: http://www.linkedin.com/in/clord1/ (www.linkedin.com/in/clord1/)  Additional Resources: Kindle version of thehttps://www.amazon.com/Slaying-Onion-Unveil-highest-potential-ebook/dp/B094C6S7RZ/ref=sr_1_1?crid=1CQSDOLNATAJ7&dchild=1&keywords=april+ballestero+slaying+the+onion&qid=1624598750&sprefix=april+balleste%2Caps%2C199&sr=8-1 ( Slaying the Onion Book ) https://www.onelightacademy.com/courses/slaying-the-onion (Buy Slaying the Onion Book here) and receive a signed copy, the course, and access to a community This podcast uses the following third-party services for analysis: Podcorn - https://podcorn.com/privacy Podtrac - https://analytics.podtrac.com/privacy-policy-gdrp

Charles (Chas) Boinske is a Wealth Manager and the Chief Visionary Officer of Modera Wealth Management, a company that provides thoughtful financial counsel to discerning individuals and organizations. Chas was co-founder of his own RIA, Independence Advisors, before he and his team joined Modera in 2021. As Wealth Manager at Modera, Chas helps clients develop financial plans, implement wealth management strategies, and manage investment portfolios. In his capacity as Chief Visionary Officer, Chas drives the strategic direction for the firm. Chas, whose career in the industry spans over 30 years, has become a nationally recognized and trusted resource for complex financial issues experienced by institutions and individuals with high net-worth.   Chas joins me today to discuss the power of cultivating relationships, whether it's among a team or with clients. He shares his professional journey, including how he started his own independent firm at a time when the independent RA model was relatively unknown. He underscores how investing and reinvesting in the development of your team impacts client service and describes the role of getting support from other people. He also shares how he became interested in fly fishing, how it became an avenue for him to interact with clients, and highlights the importance of being human to establish real relationships with clients.   “You'd think you'll have to wow people with your knowledge, but that's already expected. What's not expected is your ability to develop a relationship with that client.” - Chas Boinske   This week on The Model FA Podcast:   Chas' beginnings in the financial industry and how he pivoted to start Independence Advisors Taking risks, and the emotions Chas felt when he made the leap to found his independent firm Overcoming the fear of failure as an entrepreneur and what reassured Chas on his path How getting support and constructive feedback reassured Chas that he and his company were on the right track Three ways to get referrals from clients in a comfortable way The peak amount of assets Independence Advisors amassed before merging with Modera The challenges Chas experienced as he built his book of business How investing in your team and staff can impact your service to customers Traditional AUM niches and niching down a wealth management company on a passion Chas' passion for fly fishing and how it helps him build better relationships with clients Why Chas never attempts to be aggressive about business when inviting clients to fly fishing What a “Class A” stream is and the pleasures of fly fishing The Trusted Advisor, its impact on Chas, and why other financial advisers should read it The importance of connecting with clients on the human level   Resources Mentioned:   Book: The Trusted Advisor by David Maister, Charles Green, and Robert Galford Book: Delivering Happiness: A Path to Profits, Passion, and Purpose by Tony Hsieh Interview with David DeCelle: Paving Your Way to Financial Success | Remindermedia   Our Favorite Quotes:   “Don't let fear rule you. Know in your heart that you want to help and fulfill that larger vision for the person you're trying to serve.” - David DeCelle “To take care of your customers, take care of your staff. The more they become designated, trained, and evolved, it upticks their confidence and allows them to help clients better.” - David DeCelle “When you're authentic about a passion like fly fishing, you don't have to turn it into a commercial for your company. People will be interested in what you do as a profession tangentially.” - Chas Boinske   Connect with Charles Boinske:   Modera Wealth Management The Wealth Cast Email: charlesb@moderawealth.com Modera Wealth Management on LinkedIn Modera Wealth Management on Facebook Charles Boinske on LinkedIn Charles Boinske on Instagram Charles Boinske on Facebook     About the Model FA Podcast   The Model FA podcast is a show for fiduciary financial advisors. In each episode, our host David DeCelle sits down with industry experts, strategic thinkers, and advisors to explore what it takes  to build a successful practice — and have an abundant life in the process. We believe in continuous learning, tactical advice, and strategies that work — no “gotchas” or BS. Join us to hear stories from successful financial advisors, get actionable ideas from experts, and re-discover your drive to build the practice of your dreams.    Did you like this conversation? Then leave us a rating and a review in whatever podcast player you use. We would love your feedback, and your ratings help us reach more advisors with ideas for growing their practices, attracting great clients, and achieving a better quality of life. While you are there, feel free to share your ideas about future podcast guests or topics you'd love to see covered.    Our Team: President of Model FA, David DeCelle   If you like this podcast, you will love our community! Join the Model FA Community on Facebook to connect with like-minded advisors and share the day-to-day challenges and wins of running a growing financial services firm.

While becoming a true expert in our particular field and subject of interest can lead us throughout our career, being a successful engineer requires much more than being extremely good at our craft. There are people skills we inevitably need to learn, soft skills related to project management we need to understand, and as today's guest will prove, sales skills. Today on the show, Isaac interviews Mark Wainwright, a marketing and sales professional with 25 years of experience working for and with professional services firms—civil engineering firms fall into this category. Building upon his past experience in the field, he has now been running his own sales consulting business for the last few years and has helped a broad spectrum of professional services firms with their marketing and business development functions, from civil engineering to architecture to financial management. By differentiating marketing activities from sales activities and explaining how the lack of a sales culture within the company can hurt the organization's future work, Mark sheds light on the importance of learning and practicing sales skills at every level of the company. He goes on to mention how engineers can use the skills they already have to become better part-time salespeople, as well as the importance of pricing based on both the effort required from the firm and the value created for the buyer in our long-term, low-volume, high-dollar industry. Resources (some links are affiliate links) Mark Wainwright (Website) - https://www.wainwrightinsight.com Managing The Professional Service Firm, by David Maister - Amazon Link The Trusted Advisor, by David Maister, Robert Galford, and Charles Green - Click here To Sell Is Human: The Surprising Truth About Moving Others, by Daniel Pink - Click here The Win Without Pitching Manifesto, by Blair Enns - Click here Getting Things Done: The Art of Stress-Free Productivity, by David Allen - Click here The Ultimate Civil PE Review Course - https://civilpereviewcourse.com The Ultimate Civil FE Review Course - https://civilfereviewcourse.com Check out our Youtube Channel for more content, live sessions, and much more - https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCPeFLBZ2gk0uO5M9uE2zj0Q If you need exams, solved problems, or courses, make sure to check out our home base. We can definitely help you on your journey to become a professional engineer. - https://civilengineeringacademy.com Reach out to Isaac - isaac@civilengineeringacademy.com --- Send in a voice message: https://anchor.fm/civilengineeringacademy/message

Welcome to episode 1 of the brand new podcast, Strategy and the Virtual Controller. The podcast title comes from David Maister's great book Strategy and the Fat Smoker. We often (or even usually) know what we should be doing in both personal and professional life. We also know why we should be doing it and (often) how to do it. Figuring all that out is not too difficult. What is very hard is actually doing what you know to be good for you in the long-run, in spite of short-run temptations. The same is true for accounting and bookkeeping firms.Your hosts Penny Breslin and Damien Greathead have worked with thousands of accounting and bookkeeping firms around the world helping them navigate the rapidly changing public accounting landscape.Penny highlights the book The Robots are Coming by Andres Oppenheimer. Check it out at https://amzn.to/3g9ORLhThis podcast is designed to help listeners focus on what's important in building their firm for the long term!Connect with the hosts and send them your questions:Penny Breslin - LinkedIn | @PennyB57Damien Greathead - LinkedIn | @Damien_GH

Today’s guest, Brian Caffarelli is a partner at STS Consulting who helps his clients grow their revenues and margins through a broad spectrum of sales effectiveness and relationship management strategies. Using a unique combination of his prior sales expertise and the organizational psychology insights he has gained through working at STS Consulting, Brian assists organizations in selling better and more effectively by helping them see the value of putting trust before the sale. In today’s episode, he explains that what makes selling so difficult is the fact that buying is equally difficult, and it’s important to put yourself in the position of the buyer in order to meet them where they are on the buyer journey and best serve their needs. Tuning in, you’ll learn more about the buyer journey, from problem to deal, and come to better understand the trust equation, a concept borrowed from The Trusted Advisor by David Maister, Charles Green, and Robert Galford. Ultimately, what has served Brian in his career was taking the ‘trust before sale’ concept to heart and realizing that it wasn’t about helping the buyer understand him, but rather about helping the buyer understand themselves. This is an insightful conversation full of practical advice and wisdom, so make sure not to miss it!Key Points From This Episode:An introduction to Brian Caffarelli and his career trajectory.Brian explains that what makes selling difficult is the fact that buying is equally difficult.The value of the ability to guide someone in making an informed and competent decision.Hear about the buyer journey and why it is so important to meet them where they are at.How conflict can arise when the seller doesn’t take the time to understand the buyer's problem, which is step one on their journey.Understanding the partner before the deal and putting trust before the sale.The trust equation: earn credibility, demonstrate reliability, create an environment of professional intimacy, and manage out your self-orientation.The emotional, affective, or heart-oriented elements of the equation that are most powerful.Find out what intimacy means in this context and how to create it.Creating intimacy at scale with many different personality types, starting with listening.Why part of listening is asking really good, thought-provoking questions.Why Brian believes it’s all about helping the buyer understand themselves.The important role that showing vulnerability plays in earning the trust of others.Learn more about self-orientation and how to go about minimizing it.Some practical advice for listeners: think like a buyer, earn their trust, and be their guide.One question the buyer should ask the seller: what would you do in my shoes and why?Brian describes his proudest career moments; helping sellers realize selling isn’t so bad.Hear his number one key to success, which is understanding trust comes before the sale.Links Mentioned in Today’s Episode:Brian Caffarelli on LinkedInStrategic Talent SolutionsThe Trusted AdvisorKent Ritter

https://youtu.be/G19ULglIHE4 Steve Preda condenses his personal experiences into six key reasons why you should work businesses that interest you. These six reasons reflect a symbiotic relationship or two-way street that benefits both you and your client.    --- Why Work With Businesses That Interest You Today's episode I'd like to talk to you about why you should work with businesses that you're interested in. And this is an idea that I picked up from David Maister's podcast and it really made me thinking because it really is a huge driver if you work with companies that interest you then those companies really benefit from working with you in turn. So it's kind of, it's a two-way street. And I just want to share with you some of the ideas that came to my mind about why I love to work with companies I'm interested in and how they benefit from it. And obviously my favorite field is professional and technology services. So this is the kind of companies I love to work with. Here are the six things that I love to work with these companies. I'm just going to list them out for you and then I'm going to deep dive into each of them and explain what I mean by that, how it helps. So these reasons are curiosity, excitement, depth, experience, transfer of best practices, and connections with industry players and resources. So let's take them one at a time. So first one is curiosity. I don't know about you, but for me curiosity has always been a huge driver. Whenever I was curious about something, I would get really motivated to learn as much and understand as much of that topic as possible, whatever the topic was. Early in my career, I was hired by an injection molding company and I knew nothing about injection molding I thought I better dig in and I read you know I ordered from Amazon a couple of books on injection molding and I read everything about it and I could talk with the owner much more intelligently and they were excited to work with me. Curiosity is the compass that directs our journey into the unknown. The more we seek, the more we understand, driving a profound motivation to unravel the intricacies of any subject.Share on X So curiosity is a huge driver and that takes me to the next one which is excitement. So if I am curious about something I'm going to dig in and the more details I find out, the more I understand what are the underlying drivers of that topic, the more excited I get about this whole thing. And when you get excited about a topic, it really starts to mobilize your thinking. So the way it works for me is I'm kind of a great sponge, I soak everything up and then I get to a point where I'm overfilled with information and then it starts to flow out of me as in the form of ideas. And this is what really benefits your clients. When you get to the stage that your ideas start to flow, then it helps you get your best thinking mobilized for the client. Now your clients will probably want to work with someone who understands their industry and who, because obviously whatever you do, whether you're an attorney or an accountant, you're a technology professional, an engineer, whatever you do, whatever is your profession, it is taken for granted that you know that, right? So the client, when he approaches you, they will assume that you know your profession. What is going to differentiate you is not knowing your profession, but can differentiate you in the eyes of your client is that you know their profession, they know what make them think. You can only do that by specializing and drilling deeper into what they are doing, and then you can use their terminology, you understand their language, you start to understand the problems at a deeper level, and then you can relate to them better as well as well as them can relate to you. The whole relationship changes. It's going to be a much more intimate relationship. You're going to be seen as part of the inner circle. You'll be seen as a person who get them and then they wil...

Download a year’s worth of https://www.leadershipactionlist.com/ (weekly action steps to improve your leadership) for FREE! Charles Vogl is an award-winning author, speaker, and executive adviser. For the past decade, his work has focused on advising leadership within global organizations including Google, LinkedIn, Facebook, Airbnb, and Twitch. He is a regular guest lecturer at Yale School of Management and a founding member of the Google Vitality Lab, a collaborative partnership focused on the world’s most pressing health and well-being challenges. He is the author of the international bestseller The Art of Community and co-author of the new book Building Brand Communities: How Organizations Succeed by Creating Belonging. LEADERSHIP INSIGHTS A brand community needs to serve both the individuals and the organization. A brand is any organization that promises value. A mirage community is something that a brand calls a community but has no substance or connection. Seven areas where communities can serve organizational goals: Innovation, talent recruitment and retention, customer and stakeholder retention, marketing, customer service, advancing movements, and bringing people together. It is vital to know 1. Who you want to bring together, 2. Why they want to come together, and 3. How they want to grow into something new or better. Despite brand communities needing to serve the business, they must also serve individuals. No one wants to join a community that just wants to extract from them. We are living in the loneliest era in human history. People are desperate to be more connected. Invite people to join your community. QUESTIONS TO INSPIRE US TO ACTION What is some lesson, saying, or experience that continues to influence your leadership to this day? Experience serving in the Peace Corps—specifically observing a communal way of living and the need for justice. Use three descriptors to finish this sentence: “A leader is…” Patient, humble, and committed. What is a question that leaders should be asking either themselves or others? Do we really understand what is going on here? What book would you recommend to leaders? The Trusted Advisor by David Maister, Charles Green, and Robert Galford If you could get every listener to start doing something THIS week to help them be a better leader, what would it be? Make sure you are not doing it alone. As a general life principle, is it better to ask “why?” or “why not?” Why?” because we need to know the reason we are committing to something. CONNECT WITH CHARLES Website: https://www.charlesvogl.com/ (https://www.charlesvogl.com/) Website: https://www.buildingbrandcommunities.com/ (https://www.buildingbrandcommunities.com/) CONNECT WITH JOSH Instagram: https://instagram.com/joshuafriedeman (@joshuafriedeman) Email: josh@friedemanleadership.com Want a FREE list of weekly action steps to improve your leadership? Download the https://www.leadershipactionlist.com/ (Leadership Action List) TODAY!

Calling all our math geeks! We’ve got an equation for you and the result is trust. Go figure! (Figure! Ha!) Anyway … here are the key pieces: credibility, reliability, intimacy, and self-orientation. We’re going to show you how it works with examples you can probably relate to. The equation comes from David Maister, author of The Trusted Advisor. 

In this extended podcast, Gerry Riskin reflects on 40 years leading and advising leaders of professional firms. He discusses how to lead with courage, manage partner performance, support dispersed teams and how to use after action reviews. He also reflects on his own journey, from his desire at an early age to be a lawyer, his passion for business management and the profound influence of David Maister on his life.

Mark Baldino is a design industry expert with over 20 years in UX and Human-Centered Design. He's a co-founder of Fuzzy Math, an award-winning UX design and innovation consultancy located in Chicago with clients worldwide. Along with building and sustaining a 20-person design studio, he's helped build and train UX teams for some of the largest companies in the world. Fuzzy Math’s call to action “Do good work. Be good people” is embedded in all of Mark's work as he advocates for “goodness” in design: producing work we are proud of as designers and that positively impacts the lives of those who use digital products and services every day. Mark has led projects across complex and regulated industries including Allstate, Hyatt Hotels, Microsoft and GE Healthcare.   Questions   Your bio said that you're a UX and Human-Centered Design Organization, Fuzzy Math. But maybe give us some background behind why you decided to name the company that and just how you got into what you're doing today. Customer experience, user experience, user design, those words sometimes are used interchangeably in navigating different experiences for customers across different industries. Could you share with us what is so different about what you guys do that really helps to enhance the customer's experience? Let's say, for example, you're looking at your strategy for 2021 coming out of this year that we've all had, that has been extremely different from any other year we've all experienced. How would you demonstrate or justify the return on investment of focusing on UX? Why is it important? How is it really going to transform your business? Why should you give attention to it as you would give attention to any other budgeted item for your business plan? Could you share with us one or two things that a company should take into consideration in managing their digital spend in the age of COVID? Could you share with us how do you stay motivated every day? Can you share with our listeners what's the one online resource, tool, website or app that you absolutely can't live without in your business? Could you share with us maybe one or two books that have had the biggest impact on you, maybe a book that you've read recently or a book you read a very long time ago, but it definitely had a great impact on you. Can you share with us what's the one thing that's going on in your life right now that you're really excited about? It could be something that you're working on to develop yourself or something you're working on to develop your people. Where can listeners find you online? Do you have a quote or saying that during times of adversity or challenge, you’ll tend to revert to this quote, kind of helps to get you back on track or just keep you focused. Do you have one of those?   Highlights   Mark’s Journey   Mark stated that Fuzzy Math is a unique name, it served them well for the past 11 and a half years. The term Fuzzy Math, it does mean something in the real world, for them it speaks about the duality of the work that they do in the user experience and human centered design processes.   So kind of the fuzzy part is they're working with humans and they're trying to understand them and they are complicated and complex and sometimes they say one thing and do another. So it can be hard to design products and services to meet their needs. And the way they do that is kind of the math side, which is a little bit more of the robust process they follow sort of a thorough user center design process they lead their clients through.   It kind of makes sense of what humans are saying and doing and allows them to build products that better meet their needs. So it's kind of the analytics and process side, which is the math solving for the human psychology and fuzzy side, which is the humans.   What Fuzzy Math Does to Enhance the Customer’s Experience   Mark shared that their process is about putting customers or users at the center of everything they do. So, one of the reasons they use the term “User” is because it really focuses in on their use of a specific, in their case, they're designing a lot of web based applications or mobile applications.   Customer can mean a lot of different things to a lot of different people and so you thinking about customers from the brand perspective, from a marketing perspective, business perspective, and they try to get a little bit more narrow and think about who is this human sitting in front of a computer and what are they doing every day? And how do we make their experience more efficient and effective and satisfying for them?   And that doesn't always take into account the brand, for example, which again, brand and customer get aligned a lot. They try to break that out, they don't think in terms of brands, if they're working for a company that is a brand, they're really thinking about, what is this person's experience with your product and with your service and how can they architect it to better meet their needs?   And so, it's really about putting a user at the center of everything that they do and advocating for them and their needs. And that sometimes pushes against what might make the most sense from like a sales or a marketing perspective.   And that's okay, there can be a natural tension between those. But for their purposes, it's let's give users a voice at the table here and advocate for their needs, which might push against some other considerations of a business.   So it's a slightly narrow lens to focus it on and really say who is this human being that, again, is sitting in front of a computer, has to use this digital product and service and how can they make them happier people, while they're using these products.   The Importance of Using UX to Transform Your Business   Mark shared that he would think that the year that everyone's just had really, really gives them a sense of why they should be investing in digital. So you can take healthcare, for example. But you could say the same for some retail, that’s brick and mortar, maybe a higher education.   So healthcare and higher education, they have two things in common, which is they have these large, vast physical spaces that they've invested billions of dollars in. A hospital in 2020 looks nothing like a hospital did in 1980. They are gorgeous structures; they look more like hotels.   And so, the idea is when you step in, that experience that you get when you enter the atrium of a modern hospital is supposed to give you a sense of what's going to happen behind the scenes, behind the doors, is this amazing high tech, high touch. Again, it almost feels like you're stepping into a luxury hotel and that's how you want to be treated. Well, guess how many people were using those front doors during COVID? No one.   Hospitals were busy, but they were not coming through the front doors and stepping in and getting a sense of this is where I want to spend money, it was much more from an emergency perspective.   But instead, the digital front door of hospitals became the center point, and hospitals that had invested in 2019 and previously in their digital front door were much better positioned to handle kind of customer service, user experience, patient services, provide those in a much more effective and meaningful manner. And so, if you invested in 2019 or before, let's say that that dollar you spend in 2019 was worth ten times as much in 2020 and nothing to say it's not going to be just as valuable moving forward.   So the idea is that people are experiencing brands and products or services overall, they're experiencing digital first or have experienced digital first and a lot of people are digital, they live digitally, they think that that's a normal thing. But you have to think of these industries where there was a physical component to it and they had invested in that physical component.   And now, you're not taking a college tour and deciding on a college based on how fancy the building is, you're probably making that based on what the digital experience you're going to get and whether you can tell that they've actually invested in that in that digital experience.   So, even though he thinks we saw a lot of budgets get tightened in 2020, given uncertainty, what we've seen in this quarter and what we're expecting to continue to see in Q1 is that those budgets are getting reoriented towards kind of the digital experience. And so, he actually thinks it's kind of an easy sell, it's not one that he has to make. But he thinks for people internally is to say….. “If we haven't invested in our digital infrastructure, now is the time if we want this business to be sustainable, we can also have to shift maybe the organization overall towards spending more on these digital first experiences and not maybe spend as much in something like physical infrastructure.” Me: Agreed. Great. So that definitely will allow people to have greater justification for why they need to make this type of investment and, of course, how it will impact their business in the long term.   Managing Your Digital Spend in the Age of COVID    Me: Now, let's say, for example, we have a business and they're looking to go into this. What are maybe one or two ways that you think you could probably suggest to them that they could be able to better manage their digital spend in the age of COVID. Because a lot of people feel like they're in contracting mode. I've listened to many podcast interviews and I know a lot of organizations that would have done a year in planning in terms of what they're going to invest into, they're now doing short term plans like three months, six months, because they just don't know what to expect.   So, with that in mind, maybe could you share with us one or two things that a company should take into consideration in managing their digital spend in the age of COVID?   When asked to share what a company should take into consideration in managing their digital spend in the age of COVID, Mark shared that he thinks they need to think short and long term, if you're too narrow in your focus of this few months, he has heard that as well, “Hey, we have two months to make impact.”   You can only do so much in in two months. And so, they're helping a lot of their clients with is put roadmaps in place which allow for a strategic view, which is three years out, even if there's a large amount of uncertainty in said industry. But that has a really tactical, they're doing two to three month chunks of work. So what can they accomplish in a short term that's going to move the needles and some KPIs. But what is their vision for the longer term. And inside of that, something that they don't do a lot of crisis management for their clients, but all of their clients and frankly, all human beings went through a crisis this past year.   And he doesn't mean to say that we're going to experience another one, but there's nothing to say that this couldn't happen again in two years down the road. So, while you're thinking strategically long term, while you're solving stuff in the short term, you need to invest in an infrastructure that's going to allow you to pivot quickly during a point of crisis.   Again, he hates to go back to the healthcare example, but it's an easy one these days. A lot of websites and customer service teams were very unprepared for the deluge of visitors.   In some cases, he heard 3000% increase in web traffic. So that's the technical architecture going to support that but can we respond to that many requests? And so, this shouldn't be a poll that is a blip on the radar for 2020, people need to invest in crisis management and how they can respond and how their digital products and services respond during a crisis like this.   So, again, they're trying to map out what the long term improvements to customer experiences are over a 3-year period, they're trying to help their clients adjust and make some changes incrementally along the way that are going to move the needle in a two or three month time frame and start to think about what it looks like when a crisis hits again and how teams responds and how technology responds and how we can utilize technology to respond during those points of crisis.    How Mark Stays Motivated   Mark shared that fear is a big motivator, just to be quite honest, he thinks in 2020. It is this sense of fight or flight; you need to keep the business going. It's not a great long term motivator because it just wears you down a little bit. So, he tries to spend time away from his computer and that keeps him motivated to get back to the computer. He works a lot with his hands, crafts, furniture building, light construction, it's a lot less cerebral and it's a lot more physical.   And he finds it when he’s able to step away from the computer and start to work on physical products or physical projects, he yearns to be back in front of the computer because there's something about the amount of change you can influence or impact through the work that they do as designers. And that's really, really powerful. And it's not just about him and a closet he’s building or a piece of furniture, that's personally rewarding for him. And he enjoys that.   But a lot of the products they work on are with bigger businesses and thousands, sometimes hundreds of thousands of people are using these tools every day. And there's a lot of power in being able to make those tools more satisfactory and joyful for humans. And so, this kind of this exponential push that they can make in people's lives through the tools that they redesign but sometimes when you're so focused on what's the next sale they're going to make? He does primarily sales at Fuzzy Math these days, he doesn't do a lot of design himself. You sort of miss that larger picture. So, to stay motivated, he gets away from the computer, he works in the in the physical world, and then that really pulls him back to the computer because he can get just a different perspective on what it is they do it Fuzzy Math and how they're helping people.   App, Website or Tool that Mark Absolutely Can’t Live Without in His Business   When asked about an online resource that he can’t live without in his business, Mark shared that it's going to sound standard, but email. He'd love to say Slack, but his team loves Slack as a digital tool, he thinks it's enabled the business to function better specifically remotely. But as many times as people try to remake email and make that experience better, there's a reason we all use it, it's very easy, it's quick to communicate with people. And so, it's a boring answer but it's where he’s at almost every minute of every day is in his inbox and he uses it as a way to manage tasks and to do’s, kind of a zero inbox person. He has a number of ways and filters to clean his inbox and make it an efficient mechanism for me.   But he has been using it since AOL, so early 90s. He has been using email for a while. He is very comfortable with it and he can be a creature of habit sometimes and it takes a while for him to shift into something else. As boring as it sounds, he feels like email is consistent and for him it's something he can always rely on as a tool to know what's coming into his business, what's going on in his business and what does he need to do every day. So, maybe not the most inspiring answer, but it's an honest one. If you ask him what he can't live without at this point, it’s email.   Me: Definitely, don't feel bad about sharing email because it's important. And it's an excellent communication tool and it does definitely allow for some level of accountability, paper trail you can go back in. I've pulled up emails that I've sent to people from three, four or five years ago just to make reference to maybe a conversation that was had that maybe you just need to bring back to the forefront based on what you're moving on with currently. So it really, really is an excellent resource. So I'm not going to negate your application.   Books That Have Had the Greatest Impact on Mark   Mark shared that there are two books that have probably had the biggest impact on him. The first is Managing Professional Service Firm by David Maister. It's an old book, the 90’s. It has been updated a number of times. It basically gave him all of the tools to build a professional services firm and how to think about his team and himself and leadership structure and consulting in general. A lot of consultants started as practitioners, he did. And they built consultancies because there's work out there. But running a business is very different from doing design work and so, Managing Professional Services Firm, he calls it his Bible in terms of if he has a question, he goes there first.   He spent a few months in Argentina last year during the winter to escape awful Chicago winters and he read Let My People Go Surfing, which is by the founder of Patagonia. And that's just a fantastic book, it's part bio, which is just great to understand how and why Patagonia was founded. But also there's a business component to it and how you can run kind of an ethical business and what you can look out for and how you can guide your company and he’s a firm believer in the ethos and values that Patagonia sort of imbues in its products and services.   But there's a real honesty to the book in terms of, in a perfect world, no one needed more clothes and Patagonia would go out of business and they don't hide from that fact, they sort of explain it.   And so, he just found it a really refreshing read and he thinks people that like that book, he thinks are people that he would kind of enjoy in the real world to talk to.   So it's been kind of a book that he keeps an eye or an ear out for if people have read it, because he thinks that if they read it and enjoyed it and found value in it, they probably have a similar set of values to him and those can be some of the best of friends, first of all, but kind of professional relationships when there's a bit of a value overlap.    What Mark is Really Excited About Now!   Mark shared that internally and it's about developing their people. They've started a (DEI) Diversity, Equity and Inclusivity initiative at Fuzzy Math, it's about 18 months old and that's by far been the most rewarding part of 2020, because they made a lot of progress there. The initiative was not started because they had a crisis of diversity, equity and inclusivity on the team, it was because people thought that there was room that they could grow as a firm, even as a team of 20.   And so, two employees came to them and said, “Hey, we think we should invest time and energy into this, that there's some room for growth here.” And Ben, is his business partner and him, “Okay, what's kind of what's the plan? Help us along here.” They eventually brought in a third party consultant who's been a tremendous resource for them.   And it's really reoriented how he thinks about growth at the company and proper growth and their role potentially in equity and inequality in the design industry, how they hire people and retain them, how they can maybe train people who don't have a formal background in what they do, how they can create apprentice and mentorship internship programs.   And they've been doing all of this, but they haven't done it with the lens of DEI and obviously this past year there's been worldwide attention specifically through Black Lives Matter and they started the process ahead of that but it really it dovetailed well as it there was a specific focus on it globally and certainly in the United States. And for them to have a forum for their team to communicate about their concerns and then be able to plan for what the future looks like.   So, they have a two-year roadmap for how they're going to improve DEI at Fuzzy Math and it's not just a one stop shop, they didn't just write a DEI statement and put it on their website. In fact, it's not on the website yet because they are taking a very thorough, kind of methodical approach to this.   And it's a long term change of the composition of the people at Fuzzy Math and their backgrounds. How you can have a voice at Fuzzy Math, what hiring, retention, growth and career paths. A lot of things he didn't put in the DEI bucket; his team did because they felt that they were important in terms of communication from the founders down to the team.   So it's been a tremendous learning experience for him, it's been great to see because it's been team led, his team has driven this and that's super rewarding as a business owner to see people care so much about but the company and more specifically about each other, to want to invest time and energy into DEI.   Me: Sounds good. Okay, so we will definitely be following that journey eventually when it becomes public. And you may serve as a benchmark for other organizations that may want to take on that same kind of initiative.   Where Can We Find Mark Online   Website – www.fuzzymath.com   Mark shared that if you go to the resources section on their website, there's a newsletter, encourage people to sign up for the newsletter. They don't spam you. They send out one new sort of newsletter every month, which includes a topic of their interest. Sometimes it's is very specific to design and designers.   Recently it's been about kind of the business value of design and the ROI of design. And then they include some links and articles that they have read in the past month that they enjoy. They have the benefit of living and breathing UX every single day, and not everyone has that, so they try to pull some resources together for people.   If people want to reach out to him, his email is mark@fuzzymath.com, he’s happy to answer emails, chat, schedule, some time to connect, whether it's about starting a career in design or whether you have a potential project.   Quote or Saying that During Times of Adversity Mark Uses   Mark shared that he doesn't really have a quote, there's just sort of saying, he doesn't know where it's attributed to, it's around, do you have a strategic plan? Yes, it's called doing things. He thinks people sometimes worry too much about strategy and less about execution and has tried to make his career about kind of execution and doing and he considers himself a bit of a doer.   So, it helps him when he’s thinking about where Fuzzy Math’s going to be in 5 years or 10 years, people sometimes ask that question and he doesn't always have a clear picture, he just has to remind himself that they just have to continue doing what they've been doing for 11 ½ years, it's made them successful, bunch of happy clients and happy users along the way.   So, if you're ever concerned about what to do next, just do. Start creating, start building, don't spend too much time thinking or planning because execution is all that matters at the end of the day.   Please connect with us on Twitter @navigatingcx and also join our Private Facebook Community – Navigating the Customer Experience and listen to our FB Lives weekly with a new guest   Grab the Freebie on Our Website – TOP 10 Online Business Resources for Small Business Owners   Links   Managing The Professional Service Firm by David H. Maister Let My People Go Surfing: The Education of a Reluctant Businessman by Yvon Chouinard    The ABC’s of a Fantastic Customer Experience   Do you want to pivot your online customer experience and build loyalty - get a copy of “The ABC’s of a Fantastic Customer Experience.”   The ABC's of a Fantastic Customer Experience provides 26 easy to follow steps and techniques that helps your business to achieve success and build brand loyalty. This Guide to Limitless, Happy and Loyal Customers will help you to strengthen your service delivery, enhance your knowledge and appreciation of the customer experience and provide tips and practical strategies that you can start implementing immediately! This book will develop your customer service skills and sharpen your attention to detail when serving others. Master your customer experience and develop those knock your socks off techniques that will lead to lifetime customers. Your customers will only want to work with your business and it will be your brand differentiator. It will lead to recruiters to seek you out by providing practical examples on how to deliver a winning customer service experience!

Marsha’s early jobs included being a California Raisin. I couldn’t resist this. Marsha drops a lot of books and articles worthy of our attention: Phoenix Project by Gene Kim, Kevin Behr and George Spafford Booster Rockets in the Workforce – article by Phillip Shoemaker Marsha’s recommendations – never use password123! or anything similar. She references 2 Factor Authentication – Here is more if you are lost on this. Also password managers. Trusted Advisor by David Maister is the first book that new team members at ScaleSec are asked to read ScaleSec uses Gusto.com as their HR portal I told Marsha about the Savannah Bananas and their owner, Jesse Cole. Marsha told me about a small book that I was compelled to read right away - The Difference by Subir Chowdhury Marsha’s last book recommendation is How to Talk So Kids Will Listen & Listen So Kids Will Talk by Adele Faber Marsha is on LinkedIn or you can email her at marsha@scalesec.com

In this episode, Steve Preda discusses three types of professional service firms in terms of their organizational structures, pricing structures, and overhead. He then describes how these factors interact to produce varying degrees of profitability and scalability.   Time Stamps   [0:27] Introducing the inspiration for this episode, David Maister's book, Managing the Professional Service Firm. [0:49] Stating the three types of firms — brains firms, gray-hair firms and efficiency firms. [1:09] Type 1: Brains Firms. [1:11] Defining brains firms — typically composed of a handful of highly paid and deeply knowledgeable experts. [1:29] The pricing structure of brains firms — hourly — and specific examples of brains  firms — top-notch criminal attorneys, top-notch doctors, taxation experts and accountants who specialize in vintage cars. [2:02] The organizational structure of brains firms — two to three partners and a few administrative staff such as paralegals or secretaries.  [2:30] Type 2: Gray-Hair Firms. [2:34] Examples of gray-hair firms — corporate law or family law firms.  [2:45] The services that people expect from gray-hair firms — people who might not be cutting-edge but who know their stuff, provide comfort and will not screw up their client's case. [3:28] The structure of gray-hair firms — typically composed of three to four partners, senior employees and junior administrative staff. [4:00] The pricing structure of gray-hair firms — the partners make money and take a cut on their junior or senior employees. [4:20] Type 3: Efficiency Firms. [4:22] Defining efficiency firms — a classic professional services firm with a pyramid structure. [4:30] Describing the junior people at efficiency firms — auditors or analysts who are talented but not deeply knowledgeable and work long hours. [5:04] Types of senior people at efficiency firms — audit seniors, managers, senior managers and partners. [5:12] The path to partnership in an efficiency firm — nine to fifteen years and encouragement to leave if an employee does not make partnership. [5:26] The pricing structure of an efficiency firm — the partners make the most money and leverage the cheaper labor of lower-level employees. [6:20] Comparing the different types of firms in terms of profitability and how buyable they each are. [6:33] Brains firms have the highest short-term profitability due to low overhead and strong expertise at the very beginning. [7:00] Gray-hair firms have the second highest short-term profitability. They have more overhead than brains firms and require some grooming of senior employees. [7:49] Efficiency firms have the lowest short-term profitability. They have high overhead and require lots of training of junior employees. [9:26] Efficiency firms have the highest long-term profitability. The numerous junior employees sustain the firm and make money. [10:00] Brains firms have the second highest long-term profitability. They are robust against recession because the demand for strong expertise remains. They also have low overhead costs. [10:32] Gray-hair firms have the lowest long-term profitability. Their higher overhead costs, compared to brains firms, are not sufficiently balanced out by the benefits of having more employees. [10:53] Efficiency firms are very buyable. The exit of partners does not impede profitability due to the pyramid structure consisting of many employees. [11:32] Gray-hair firms are the second most buyable in that they do have assets to sell, provided their partners are all not too close to retirement. [12:19] Brains firms are the least buyable because if the partners exit or retire, the firm does not have much to offer. [13:05] Overview of the three types of firms in terms of profitability and how buyable they each are. [14:13] Call-to-action for comments & questions.   Conclusion Have you made similar observations to Steve about profitability and scalability when working at brains firms, gray-hair firms or efficiency firms? Which of these structures would you choose if starting your own professional service firm? We'd love to hear your comments and questions! Here are some resources that you might find helpful: Traction Equity Website Book a Free Consultation with Steve Join a Webinar with Steve Managing the Professional Service Firm by David Maister https://StevePreda.com

How can you improve your business by giving 5 smiles to your customer from waiting to making a purchase? Listen to David Maister's law of service explained and his 8 aspects of waiting which give clues to how we can win over our customers; which is really free and effective public relations.Satisfaction = Perception - Expectation.1. Unoccupied time feels longer than occupied time.2. People want to get started.3. Anxiety makes waits seem longer,4. Uncertain waits are longer than known, finite waits.5. Unexplained waits are longer than explained waits.6. Unfair waits are longer than equitable waits.7. The more valuable the service, the longer the customer will wait.8. Solo waits feel longer than group waits.Public relations is not just about media relations, it's about how we treat our customers. The reason for this is because people who deal with our companies now can share their experiences not just with the company but via their own social channels.If you like this podcast, then subscribe to our newsletter herePlease visit our blog post on PR for business please visit our site:https://www.eastwestpr.com/blogs/I also talk about SPEAK|pr - our 5 Step Methodology for entrepreneurs to manage their own PR. Do please come and download a free copy along with our Technology Applications Director with over 100 free marketing apps listed. http://www.eastwestpr.com/speakprFind us on Twitter @eastwestprJim James is the Founder and Managing Director of the EASTWEST Public Relations Group. He recently returned to the UK after 25 years in Asia where he was an entrepreneur. Whilst running EASTWEST PR, he was the Vice-Chairman of the British Chamber of Commerce in China, he also he introduced Morgan sports cars to China, WAKE Drinks, founded the British Business Awards, The British Motorsport Festival, EO Beijing, and was the interim CEO of Lotus cars in China. Support the show (https://www.eastwestpr.com/podcast-speakpr)

In this episode, the 20th episode to date, we discuss trust. What do we mean by trust, how does it relate to sensemaking and news (and fake news)? We discuss for example how the Swedish COVID situation is reported in international media, and the distinction between truth and truthfulness in journalism. We discuss what makes people trustworthy, and the importance of knowing yourself and authenticity in trustworthiness. We also discuss one other important aspect of trust, which is “not lying” and what we can learn about trust from children and teenagers. We introduce the trust equation (David Maister), and we define the different elements of the equation: the trust equation argues that we should maximise credibility (which comes from experience and subject matter expertise), reliability (quality and timeliness, and managing expectations truthfully) and intimacy (authentic connection, openness and vulnerability), whilst minimising self-orientation (people with low levels of orientation on self and high levels of empathy, curiosity and focus on others are easier to trust and executive coaches are the best dates, trust us!)

Have you ever picked a line at the store only to realize that you chose the longest, most slowly moving line? Have you ever waited forever to receive a shipment and then felt like they owed you an explanation for what could possibly take that long? Have you ever had such a great time laughing and talking in line with other people that you didn't even notice how long you waited?   If you answered yes to any of these questions, then you are a typical customer with common perceptions of waiting in a Customer Experience. Years ago, David Maister wrote a paper called "The Psychology of Waiting Lines." Maister suggests that sometimes waiting in lines can seem longer than it is. Gretchen Rubin, the author of The Happiness Project, wrote an article on Psych Central that details eight reasons that waits seem longer.   This episode of The Intuitive Customer explores the psychology of waiting and what you can do to mitigate it for customers. We address Rubin's eight reasons and share what you can do about them to promote customer-driven growth.

Have you ever picked a line at the store only to realize that you chose the longest, most slowly moving line? Have you ever waited forever to receive a shipment and then felt like they owed you an explanation for what could possibly take that long? Have you ever had such a great time laughing and talking in line with other people that you didn't even notice how long you waited?   If you answered yes to any of these questions, then you are a typical customer with common perceptions of waiting in a Customer Experience. Years ago, David Maister wrote a paper called "The Psychology of Waiting Lines." Maister suggests that sometimes waiting in lines can seem longer than it is. Gretchen Rubin, the author of The Happiness Project, wrote an article on Psych Central that details eight reasons that waits seem longer.   This episode of The Intuitive Customer explores the psychology of waiting and what you can do to mitigate it for customers. We address Rubin's eight reasons and share what you can do about them to promote customer-driven growth.

Creating a podcast that can help you grow your coach/consultant business comes down to a number of key factors. When you have an idea or a flash of insight about what could be a great podcast, it’s important to ask ourselves whether it’s the right idea and the right time for the idea.  I recently revisited a decision making matrix from David Maister’s book Managing the Professional Service Firm, and I was interested in how well it could be applied to the decision of starting a podcast. How do you know if the idea suits your vision and has the ability to endure?  In this episode, I run through 8 thought provoking questions to lead you through determining how solid your podcast idea is, and how to avoid falling into the traps many coaches and consultants find themselves in.

In this episode host, Jack Marino Jr. speaks with Artie Pennington, a business and estate planning attorney, about why business owners should have an estate plan. This episode will guide you through the essential things you need to know when creating an estate plan for your business as well as for your personal estate. You’ll also learn what happens to your assets if you do not have an estate plan in place. Subscribe Apple | Google | Spotify | Stitcher Show Quote "Always plan ahead. It wasn’t raining when Noah built the ark." -Richard Cushing Resources Hunt, Pennington, Kumar, Dula-– Reach out to Artie’s firm for a consultation about estate and succession planning.  David H. Maister -- Artie Pennington recommends the work of David Maister if you’d like to learn more about how to operate as a professional.  Key Takeaways  1) You need an estate plan for your business that is based on your desired outcomes. This plan will protect your business and your family.  2) Everyone needs a will. Start with a will and a trust when you begin your personal estate planning. 3) Don’t assume that everything will automatically go to your spouse and kids. Make a plan to protect them.  Show Notes

et the book here*: The Trusted Advisor - By David H. Maister https://amzn.to/2Aizhrs A comprehensive summary of the book "The Trusted Advisor" which is one of the most recommended books for consultants - providing highly valuable advice on how to conduct (management) consulting services and how to deal with clients properly.

In this, the second of we hope many episodes featuring Ed Kless and Rachel Fisch, our co-hosts talk about disruption in the accounting profession. But before you roll your eyes and click past this episode, Rachel and Ed have a different take on the topic. In short, they don't think it is the technology that is at the center, but rather it is just an enabler.  Some links Book: Only the Paranoid Survive by Andy Grove Book: The Future of the Professions by Richard and Daniel Susskind Book: True Professionalism by David Maister

David and Blair each share a list of things that they wish agency principals would do more of to take their firms to the next level of success.   Links   "The Problem of Standards" by David Maister 2001

Today's guest is Michael Mahony, Co-Founder of the Berkeley Partnership. Michael was one of four founding partners of The Berkeley Partnership, growing it from an idea to where it is today. In 2018 Michael retired from Berkeley and now works with a number of consulting firms, helping them shape their business strategies. Founded in 1990, The Berkeley Partnership is an independent Management Consultancy who work with many household names and global organisations helping them to develop strategies and transform their businesses. The Berekely partnership are unique in a number of ways and have successfully grown their business whilst doing the opposite of what most people would consider conventional consulting wisdom. They are industry agnostic, only recruit from the upper grades in Consulting, have an extremely low partner to Consultant ratio and are heavily focused on limiting the amount of travel their consultants have to do when delivering for their clients. The fascinating thing about Berkeley is that they've been able to build a thriving business by doing all of this and as Michael explains in our conversation, they've create a place that the partners and consultants want to work.  Knowing some of the Berkeley story, I had always been intrigued by their model and how they'd been so successful while pursuing such an unorthodox approach. So when I was introduced to Michael, I jumped at the chance to get him on the show. We cover so many interesting topics in this episode including: What led Michael and his Co-founders to Launch Berkeley and how they managed to survive their early years, launching the business just before the 1991 recession. The Berkeley Partnership business model and how the team decided to set the firm up as they did. And Michael's advice to others thinking about launching their own consulting business I really enjoyed this conversation with Michael and it was great to get so much advice and insight from someone who has been involved in the industry for as long as he has. If you're a partner thinking about how to improve your own business or a Consultant thinking about going out on your own then this interview is a must listen. You can get in touch with Michael through his LinkedIn - https://www.linkedin.com/in/michaelmahony1/ This episode is brought to you by Create Engage the Digital Marketing agency for the disruptive Management Consultancy. Specific things we discussed in the show: The Berkeley Partnership - https://www.berkeleypartnership.com/ Trust Based Selling by Charles Green - https://amzn.to/2Uynsc6 Managing the Professional Services Firm by David Maister - https://amzn.to/2D0OcYA On the Psychology of Military Incompetence by Norman Dixon - https://amzn.to/2K613Pj

Today's Guest is Matt Rogan, Matt is chairman and co-founder of Two Circles. Exclusively working with sports rights-holders, Two Circles is part strategy consultancy, part digital agency, and part data and analytics house. Since co-founding the business in 2011, Two Circles has grown rapidly to a team of 150 people across the UK, North America and Europe. Following the sale of the majority stake in the business to WPP in 2015, Matt took up the role as Chairman. Supporting and challenging the Two Circles management team to deliver bigger and better results across all areas of the business. In addition to his role at Two Circles Matt is a published author and has been featured in the likes of the Harvard Business Review and the Journal of Sports Management. We go in to detail on a whole range of topics in this interview including: What led Matt and his co-founders to start Two Circles and the structures they put in place to set it up for success. Leading a ‘millennial' team and the lessons for anyone looking to grow a young, dynamic organisation. The importance of process and systems in building a business, even at the start up phase, and how this helped Matt and the team grow rapidly avoiding many of the issues that new businesses face. How Matt and his co-founders achieved work life balance while leading a rapidly growing business. What to do if you're a graduate looking to follow a career in sport. And much much more! I really enjoyed this conversation with Matt and took so much away from what he had to say. If you're looking for clear, practical advice on how to grow your own consulting business or practice area then you're going to love this interview. You can find out more about Two Circles at – http://insidetwocircles.com/ You can find out more about Matt on Linked In – https://www.linkedin.com/in/mattrogan/ And Twitter – https://twitter.com/mattrogansport?lang=en Or drop him an email at Matt.Rogan@insidetwocircles.com Specific Things We Discuss In the Show: Lane 4 - https://www.lane4performance.com/ Adrian moorhouse - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adrian_Moorhouse Dom moorhouse - http://dommoorhouse.com/ Greg Searle - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greg_Searle Mastering Soft Skills by Julian Vyner - http://amzn.eu/d/fsSA1L0 Players by Matthew Futterman - http://amzn.eu/d/fDflklv Managing the professional services firm by David Maister - http://amzn.eu/d/jc9ee62

In this episode, Damien Martin shares his career journey to becoming National Tax Assistant Director at BKD.  He began his career as a music major at UC Berkeley, before going on to finish his Masters in Taxation at Golden Gate University. Before becoming a director at BKD, he cultivated an expertise in working with high-net worth individuals on estate planning. In this episode you will learn, 1. Why Damien chose tax as his focus in accounting 2. How he is positioning his firm as a place of value as tax filing becomes more automated Resources mentioned: 1. Damien's LinkedIn 2. Annette Nellen 3. Damien's Twitter 4. Simply Tax podcast 5. Trusted Advisor by David Maister   This episode is brought to you by Money & Mimosas.

Simon Dennis is co-founder of Gate One (www.gateone.co.uk). Gate One are an award winning Business Transformation Consultancy who specialise in Digital, Operating Model and People Change. Since founding the business Gate One have grown rapidly going from an idea to £25m cumulative revenue in their first 5 years trading. As well as their award winning Consultancy offering Gate One also runs its own internal Start Up Incubator. Giving their team the opportunity to explore their own entrepreneurial ambitions and help grow new business ideas alongside the Consultancy. The latest idea to go through the Incubator, Pinga (http://pinga-app.com/), has seen some great early success and is looking to grow rapidly, something we discuss in today's episode. Simon and I first met when I was deciding whether to stay in Consulting or pursue a start-up idea that I had. Throughout our conversations about joining Gate One it was clear that Simon and his team were looking to do it differently and create something unique in the Consulting industry. I ended up pursuing the start-up idea (sadly unsuccessfully) but Simon and I have stayed in touch ever since and I've had the pleasure of watching as Gate One have gone from strength to strength. We cover a whole range of topics in this episode including: How and why Simon and his Co-founders started Gate One Gate One's unique ‘ripple' approach to Consultancy What you should think about if you're looking to make the move from a big Consultancy to a small one Simon's top books for anyone looking to climb in Consulting or start their own business The Gate One start-up incubator and much much more! You can find out more about Simon on his Linked In page – https://www.linkedin.com/in/simon-dennis-28416b1/ or drop him a message at Simon.Dennis@GateOne.co.uk Specific things we discuss in the show: Simon's Recommended Reading List: Managing the Professional Services Firm by David Maister - http://amzn.eu/8gfLD5m Start with Why by Simon Sinek - http://amzn.eu/dU3ZgMq Drive by Dan Pink - http://amzn.eu/6Nne2Xr Mindset by Carol Dweck - http://amzn.eu/h2fAzeu The Icarus Deception by Seth Godin - http://amzn.eu/73hkExk Quiet Leadership by David Rock - http://amzn.eu/71y201l Happiness by Design by Paul Dolan - http://amzn.eu/3kEqGr2 Bounce by Matthew Syed - http://amzn.eu/icRAp5S Crossing the Chasm by Geoffrey A Moore - http://amzn.eu/7SiieF4 The Founder's Mentality by Chris Zook and James Allen Pinga – http://pinga-app.com/ Acai Berry - https://www.webmd.boots.com/healthy-eating/guide/acai-berries-health-benefits

Dom Moorhouse is a business advisor, angel investor and serial entrepreneur. In 2004 Dom founded Moorhouse Consulting which he grew from nothing to a business that he sold for c.£20,000,000 less than 5 years later. After leaving Moorhouse Dom set up his advisory business ‘the 5 year entrepreneur' to provide mentorship and guidance for owners of Professional Services firms on how they can achieve the same success that he did. Dom is also an advisor and board member to multiple Professional Services firms and is currently focusing on his latest venture, Method Grid (www.methodgrid.com), which we discuss further in the Podcast. We cover so many topics in this episode including: The importance of life and career planning and how it has helped Dom achieve what he has How Dom founded, grew and sold Moorhouse Consulting The importance of cultural values that your team actually buy in to Building high performance teams and some of the pitfalls to watch out for as your Consultancy grows What you can do to ensure that the next Consultancy you move to is the right place for you The importance of health and relationships in building a successful Consulting career And so much more! You can find out more about Dom on his Linked In page – www.linkedin.com/in/dom-moorhouse-2abb6a/ and his personal website www.DomMoorhouse.com Specific things we discuss in the show: The Definitive Business Plan by Sir Richard Stutely - http://amzn.eu/fpJZhpI Managing The Professional Services firm by David Maister - http://amzn.eu/b695YsR Strength In Depth - Pairs CrossFit race - https://strengthindepth.com Tim Wigham - https://timwigham.com Perpetual Insights (PI) Recruitment - http://www.perpetualinsights.com Bath CrossFit - http://crossfitbath.com Why We Sleep by Mathew Walker - http://amzn.eu/eHQbDhc A C Grayling - http://www.acgrayling.com Growth Mindset - Mindset - Updated Edition: Changing The Way You think To Fulfil Your Potential by Dr Carol Dweck - http://amzn.eu/8UBerxb Show Me The Numbers by Steven Few - http://amzn.eu/aFgbpQ2 The Visual Display of Quantitative Information by Edward Tufte's - http://amzn.eu/6TSIR91 Paul Collins - https://www.linkedin.com/in/pecollins/ Getting Things Done: The Art of Stress Free Productivity By David Allen - http://amzn.eu/aC2KDRg The Primal Blueprint: Reprogramme your genes for effortless weight loss, vibrant health and boundless energy by Mark Sisson - http://amzn.eu/8Tx47Sd Method Grid – www.methodgrid.com

The recruitment industry isn’t just about the provision of equipped employees to the companies that seek them. A huge part of the industry deals with the day-to-day business that builds formidable recruitment firms that expertly serve companies. What forces act upon this business and what book has made an impact on industry knowledge and practices? […]

Episode Summary Lylan Masterman is a Venture Capital Investor at White Star Capital and a Kauffman Fellow. Lylan shares helpful tips for selecting good board members as well as being a good board member yourself. At White Star Capital, Lylan focuses primarily on late Seed and Series A investments, but he does offer advice on how an entrepreneur can successfully navigate between Series A to Series B rounds. Listen in for more! What Was Covered 04:05 - How did Lylan get started? 08:45 - You have to do your homework about the investors that you're pitching. 13:00 - How did Lylan become a Kauffman Fellow? 14:20 - Does Lylan have any advice on how to be a good board member? 19:00 - At Kauffman, Lylan learned how to best define your personal brand vs. your firm's brand. 21:10 - A nice person who isn't helpful is simply not all that valuable. 23:15 - What is White Star Capital? 24:15 - What are some of the differences about being a VC based in New York vs. San Francisco? 26:05 - How did Lylan get involved with the Dollar Shave Club? 28:25 - What makes a good pitch? The story behind the company. 30:25 - What are some of the thing that help someone get from Series A to Series B? 32:10 - What has your board of directors done for you lately? 33:35 - Lylan shares the formula for trust.   Tweetables Be nice and helpful. Time, effort and mental energy. Have a personal brand that is memorable. Quality of team more important the more money you raise.   Links Mentioned J Robinett Enterprises John Livesay Funding Strategist Lylan Masterman Website Lylan on LinkedIn Dollar Shave Club Website The Trusted Advisor by David Maister and Robert M. Galform Want the Transcription? Click Here to Download Crack The Funding Code! Register now for the free webinar Share The Show Did you enjoy the show? I'd love it if you subscribed today and left us a 5-star review! Click this link Click on the 'Subscribe' button below the artwork Go to the 'Ratings and Reviews' section Click on 'Write a Review'

When starting your solo practice, figuring out how to price your services can be very difficult. Many new lawyers undercut the market or undervalue what they have to offer. Additionally, in this emerging market of flat fees, they have to consider their strategy for setting legal rates. When charging for hourly legal services, what should be the lowest starting rate? How should a solo lawyer structure a system for flat fee pricing? What are the signs of undercharging and how should attorneys convey the value of their services to the client? On this episode of New Solo, Adriana Linares interviews attorney Ted Waggoner about how lawyers should set their fees, hourly versus flat fee pricing, and educating clients about the true value of their legal services. When starting a new practice, Waggoner explains, lawyers should set their fees based on expenses, investment, the client's budget, and, of course, profit. Each attorney will adjust these fees based on mistakes and experience. However, Waggoner also encourages lawyers to think like business people; have a discussion with the client about how valuable the legal services are and set fees accordingly. Lawyers need to establish a relationship with their clients in order to manage their expectations, educate them about value and benefits, and scope out the case. Waggoner also emphasizes the importance of research through blogs or consultants such as David Maister, Alan Weiss, and Ron Baker. In the end, he says, the fees are set to what the client wants to pay and is willing to pay, and whether the lawyer accepts that amount. Ted A. Waggoner is the managing partner at Peterson Waggoner and Perkins, LLP in Rochester, Indiana. Waggoner has been an active presenter for lawyers Continuing Legal Education seminars, having lectured at the Solo and Small Firm Conference on topics such as Fundamentals of Successful Solo and Small Firm Practice; Tough Moments with Clients; and Selling Your Client's Business. Waggoner has also contributed to articles in the ABA Journal and other ABA publications. Special thanks to our sponsor, Solo Practice University.

Team MMOM discusses all aspects of waiting in line this week. Armed with David Maister’s The Psychology of Waiting in Lines, Kip, Russ and Dutch tackle what Disney does right, what needs to be fixed, and the science of waiting. Kip has the Backpage.

Welcome to episode #76 of Six Pixels Of Separation - The Twist Image Podcast. There has been a ton of buzz about David Maister showing up (and presenting) at PodCamp Boston 2. I took the opportunity to sit down with Maister and the results are a fascinating conversation about how Marketing is really connecting in this day and age. Saul Colt also coughs up a couple of hairballs (literally) in his latest installment of, The World According To Saul Colt, and C.C. Chapman shares some PodCamp Boston love.  Enjoy this conversation... Here it is: Six Pixels Of Separation - The Twist Image Podcast - Episode #76 - Host: Mitch Joel. Running time: 54:08. Audio comment line - please send in a comment and add your voice to the audio community: +1 206-666-6056. Please send in questions, comments, suggestions - mitch@twistimage.com. Hello from Beautiful Montreal. Subscribe over at iTunes. Comments are now live on the new Blog - sixpixels.com/blog. Facebook Group - Six Pixels of Separation Podcast Society - please join (we have over 1115 members). Check out my other Podcast, Foreword Thinking - The Business And Motivational Book Review Podcast - sponsored by HarperCollins Canada. Foreword Thinking - episode #7 is now live and features Ben Mezrich - author of the books, Rigged, Bringing Down The House and more. BarCamp Montreal 3. Audio Comment – Tim Coyne – The Hollywood Podcast. The World According To Saul Colt. PodCamp Boston. In Conversation with David Maister from PodCamp Boston 2. Managing the Professional Service Firm. The Trusted Advisor with Charles H. Green and Robert M. Galford. The new book - Strategy And The Fat Smoker. Six Points of Separation – Six Ways To Re-think Unconferences: 1. Whiteboard. 2. Fee. 3. Camp fire. 4. Speakers. 5. The rules. 6. Self-organized. Six Pounds of Sound with C.C. Chapman - Managing The Gray - Accident Hash - The Advance Guard. Bill Grady – ‘Let's Sit & Smile'. Please join the conversation by sending in questions, feedback and ways to improve Six Pixels Of Separation. Please let me know what you think or leave an audio comment at: +1 206-666-6056. Download the Podcast here: Six Pixels Of Separation - The Twist Image Podcast - Episode #76 - Host: Mitch Joel. Tags: accident hash advance guard advertising ben mezrich bill grady business cc chapman david maister digital marketing facebook foreword thinking hollywood podcast itunes managing the gray marketing motivational books podcamp podcast podcasting saul colt six pixels of separation social media marketing tim coyne twist image