Podcasts about menlo innovations

Sometimes, it feels like work wasn't designed with us, humans, in mind. Human suffering at work is becoming far too common in our tech-driven world of work. It's burning us out, disconnecting us, and draining our energy. We've lost sight of the one thing that truly powers progress: people. But there's a way to break that mean cycle. A better way to redesign work to fuel joy, not exhaustion. In this inspiring Happiness Squad Podcast episode, Ashish Kothari and Rich Sheridan, CEO and Chief Storyteller of Menlo Innovations, talk about how to radically reimagine work to end human suffering in the world of technology.Richard Sheridan is the co-founder, CEO, and "Chief Storyteller" of Menlo Innovations, a software and IT consulting firm renowned for its innovative and joyful workplace culture. Disillusioned by the chaos of the tech industry, Rich co-founded Menlo in 2001 with a mission to end human suffering in the workplace. His passion for creating joyful work environments led to his bestselling books, Joy, Inc. and Chief Joy Officer, and he has shared his insights through over 1,000 talks worldwide.It's time to redesign your tech organization into a place where people feel more alive.Things you will learn in this episode:• Pair programming as a tool for collaboration and continuous learning• Replacing fear and micromanagement with clarity and trust• How laughter, energy, and joy signal a healthy workplace• Ending tech burnout through intentional systems design• The ROI of flourishing: higher quality work, retention, and impactIf you've ever questioned whether work has to be painful to be productive, this conversation offers a hopeful, proven alternative. Tune into this epic episode now.Resources:• Menlo Innovations: http://www.menloinnovations.com/ • Menlo Innovations Case Studies: https://menloinnovations.com/stories • Richard Sheridan on X: https://x.com/menloprez • Get to know Richard Sheridan: https://richardsheridan.com/meet-rich Books:• Joy Inc.: How We Built a Workplace People Love by Richard Sheridan: https://a.co/d/6C4HJbe • Books from Richard Sheridan: https://richardsheridan.com/books• Chief Joy Officer by Richard Sheridan: https://a.co/d/7F4t8HA • Hardwired for Happiness by Ashish Kothari: https://www.amazon.com/Hardwired-Happiness-Proven-Practices-Overcome-ebook/dp/B0BCXDCLX1?ref_=ast_author_mpb

Today's guest is a big deal. He's the CEO of software company Menlo Innovations and the author of two highly recommended books—Joy Inc., and Chief Joy Officer, and he joins us today to share some of the incredible insights he has gained during his impressive career. From his definition of joy at work and how he has built a very unique professional environment and culture at Menlo to the unusual interview experience at Menlo, our conversation is expansive and detailed, giving you the tools you need to adopt some of the same principles in your own leadership journey. Richard shares how he has cultivated an environment where feedback is welcomed, why he has chosen a transparent remuneration structure at Menlo, how he has set this up, and much more. Don't miss this inspiring conversation with today's deeply intentional and revolutionary guest. Thanks for tuning in! Guest Bio:Rich Sheridan is on a mission to end human suffering in technology. As CEO and Co-Founder of Menlo Innovations, he built a workplace driven by collaboration, experimentation, and joy.Once a fear-driven leader who micromanaged every detail, he discovered that joy at work isn't a luxury—it's a necessity. With a background in software and engineering (U-M BS '80, MS '82), his true passion is process, teamwork, and organizational design.Through his books, Joy, Inc. and Chief Joy Officer, Sheridan shares Menlo's story to help others create intentional cultures of joy. Because when joy leads, success follows.Key Points From This Episode: [00:00] Welcome and introduction to this episode and a catch up with your hosts.[06:40] Richard Sheridan from Menlo Innovations.[10:31] What Menlo Innovations does.[15:05] Richard's definition of bringing joy into work and how he measures it. [24:59] Why the work environment that he has built at Menlo would not be suited to everyone.[28:24] How Menlo approaches interviews differently.[34:47] The rewarding, promotion, and progress process at Menlo.[42:25] A story of how Richard realized that Menlo has excellent gender equity.[47:07] Navigating hesitation around salary transparency.[54:20] Why Richard is not transparent about his own compensation.[47:07] Managing the feedback process and making it easy for others to communicate how they feel.[01:03:58] How to book a tour at Menlo.  Quotes: “We launched Menlo in June of 2001 with a crazy mission: we wanted to end human suffering in the world as it relates to technology. We've been doing that now for almost 24 years. It worked!” — @menloprez [0:09:33] “I don't think unjoyful people can make joyful results.” — @menloprez [0:16:44] “We have an interview process where we're actually trying to weed you in, not weed you out.” — @menloprez [0:31:06] “Humans are incredibly adaptable when they are given clear expectations.” — @menloprez [0:33:21]RESOURCES: [01:03:58]Menlo Innovations Tours and Workshops FOLLOW: Follow Richard Sheridan:LinkedInXMenlo InnovationsJoy, Inc.Chief Joy Officer  FOLLOW:Follow Laura Eich:LinkedInFacebookInstagram Follow Mike McFall:WebsiteLinkedInFacebookXInstagram Follow BIGGBY® COFFEE & LifeLabTM:WebsiteFacebookXInstagramLinkedInAbout LifeLabTM ABOUT LOVE IN LEADERSHIP:At the Life You Love LaboratoryTM and BIGGBY® COFFEE, we're out to prove that financial success and healthy workplace culture aren't two separate goals. BIGGBY® COFFEE's own cultural transformation is proof that not only is it possible to have a successful company where people aren't miserable at work, but that the happier your people are, the more your business will grow. Each week, join host Laura Eich, Chief Purpose Officer at BIGGBY® COFFEE, and her co-host and BIGGBY® COFFEE co-CEO Mike McFall as they're joined by guests from around the world to learn how they are fostering a culture of love and growth in the world's most innovative and people-centric companies. Get inspired. Get real. Get ready to transform workplace culture in America with us. This is the Love in Leadership podcast.Learn more at: loveinleadershippodcast.com ABOUT THE HOSTS:Mike McFall began his journey with BIGGBY® COFFEE as a minimum-wage barista at the original store in East Lansing in 1996. Over the span of 23 years, alongside business partner Bob Fish, he has helped create one of the great specialty coffee brands in America. Today Mike is co-CEO with Bob, and BIGGBY® COFFEE has over 250 stores open throughout the Midwest that sell tens of thousands of cups of coffee each day. But more importantly to Mike and BIGGBY® COFFEE, the company is a profoundly people-first organization.Mike is also the author of Grind, a book which focuses on early-stage businesses and how to establish positive cash flow. Laura Eich is BIGGBY® COFFEE's Chief People Officer, having worked in a variety of roles at BIGGBY® COFFEE for the last 11+ years. She helped launch BOOST, the department at BIGGBY® COFFEE which ultimately became LifeLabTM — BIGGBY® COFFEE's in-house culture cultivation team designed to help people be the best versions of themselves and help companies support them along the way. In her role, Laura helps people build lives that they love through the process of building profitable businesses and robust, growth-filled careers.

If you had to describe your company's culture in a single word, what would it be? Are you super flexible and casual? Are you collaborative and inclusive?Software executive Richard Sheridan argues that one key quality is missing from too many workplaces today: joy.As CEO of Menlo Innovations, an enterprise software company based in Michigan, Sheridan deliberately focuses on cultivating joy in his company. His 2018 book, Chief Joy Officer: How Great Leaders Elevate Human Energy and Eliminate Fear, offers guidance for how to create joy at work — and why it's so important for innovation.He explains the difference between joy and happiness and how to harness joy in service of a larger project. He also discusses how, as a leader, you can model joy for your team and why joy and a culture of fear are incompatible. Key episode topics include: leadership, managing people, emotional intelligence. HBR On Leadership curates the best case studies and conversations with the world's top business and management experts, to help you unlock the best in those around you. New episodes every week. · Listen to the original HBR IdeaCast episode: How One CEO Creates Joy at Work (2018)· Find more episodes of HBR IdeaCast.· Discover 100 years of Harvard Business Review articles, case studies, podcasts, and more at HBR.org.]]>

Is the whole simply a sum of its parts? In this episode, Jacob Stoller and Andrew Stotz discuss what happens when you divide a company into pieces and manage them separately - and what to do instead. TRANSCRIPT 0:00:02.5 Andrew Stotz: My name is Andrew Stotz, and I'll be your host as we dive deeper into the teachings of Dr. W. Edwards Deming. Today, I'm continuing my conversation with Jacob Stoller, Shingo Prize winning author of The Lean CEO and Productivity Reimagined, which explores Lean and Deming management principles at the enterprise level. The topic for today is myth number one, the myth of segmented success. Jacob, take it away.   0:00:30.4 Jacob Stoller: Great to be here with you, Andrew. And yeah, before I dive into that myth, I'd like to just start with a quote by Albert Einstein. "There is no failure in learning, but there can be in refusing to unlearn." Now that's something that's gonna occur over and over when we talk about the different myths. And the fact is, as many people have observed, unlearning can be a lot tougher than learning. So I think we always have to keep that in mind. So I want to tell a little story which kind of illustrates just how deep this unlearning can go. And this was told to me by Rich Sheridan, who has a company called Menlo Innovations, they're a software development company. And very interestingly, the theme of his work has been about joy in work. Sounds familiar?   0:01:28.3 AS: I love it.   0:01:28.5 JS: Well, he didn't really discover Dr. Deming until he had already written two of his books. So it just shows to me that there's some very underlying truths behind what Dr. Deming was teaching. But anyway, the story Rich tells is that he had his family in for a wedding. And they had a new office they'd moved into, so everyone wanted to see it. So he brought his granddaughter in, an eight-year-old. And he said, well, where do you sit, pop-pop? And he said, right here. Here's my desk. Here's my computer. And the granddaughter looked at his desk and was puzzled. You know, she said, well, where's your name? You got to have your name somewhere. And so, I mean, Sheridan was amazed. He says, I thought, wow, she already has it in her head that as CEO, I should have a corner office with a placard that showed how important I am. And you know, I felt a little embarrassed. She was somehow implying that I can't be much of a CEO if I didn't have a placard with my name on it.   0:02:35.5 JS: And she's only eight. So no, here's a CEO that's just really, really, you know, ahead of a lot of people. You know, he understands a lot of the Deming principles. And he sees just how deeply people hold these myths. She believed that there's this pyramid structure and there's got to be a CEO at the top and there have to be all these departments and people reporting to various people, et cetera, et cetera. So this really, this belief she had is really, it's sort of the pyramid that Dr. Deming described. And Dr. Deming actually wrote, he said, in The New Economics, you know, his last book, he wrote, this book is for people who are living under the tyranny of the prevailing style of management. And he talks about the pyramid. And I think that kind of encapsulates everything we're dealing with in terms of beliefs. And I'm just going to read it because he was so concise about saying it. "The pyramid only shows responsibilities for reporting who reports to whom. It shows the chain of command and accountability."   0:03:55.3 JS: "The pyramid does not describe the system of production. It does not tell anybody how his work fits into the work of other people in the company. If a pyramid conveys any message at all, it is that anybody should first and foremost, try to satisfy his boss and get a good rating. The customer is not in the pyramid. A pyramid as an organization chart, thus destroys the system, if ever one was intended." So I've never seen a more pointed description of the prevailing style of management. But think of this young girl at age eight, you know, I mean, and a lot of them, what happens is they go to school and they learn. And then maybe they eventually go to business school. And then sometime, maybe 30 years later or something, this person, this young woman is being told, we're not going to manage according to a pyramid anymore.   0:04:54.3 JS: We're gonna change the whole structure. We're gonna respect people and we're gonna respect their opinions. And we're not gonna assume that all these departments automatically fit together like building blocks. We're gonna work to define a system. All these things that Deming taught, you know, how do you think she's gonna react to that? You know, we're talking about things that this person has believed, not just from training in business school, but for years and years. So I think that kind of underlines the task we all have in terms of learning and unlearning. It's just an enormous thing we have to deal with, which is why I think it's important to look at the myths and various myths. And that's why I really worked to define those. So, when we...   0:05:46.5 AS: I would just highlight one thing about, if we go back to maybe, I don't know, constructing the pyramids, it was all about power and force, you know, get things done. It was about power and force. And I think what Dr. Deming was saying at a very, you know, many, many decades ago, he was saying that power and force are just, you know, a tiny factor in the world of business. The real motivating factor is intrinsic motivation, satisfying the customer, working together. Those types of things are the forces that will bring a much better outcome in your business, rather than just having an organizational chart that just shows the flow of power and force.   0:06:30.4 JS: Exactly. You know, and I think that if you look at the pyramid structure, it's actually a great system for consolidating power. So it works that, and, you know, but if you start to look at producing quality products and services for customers, it doesn't work at all. And, you know, so we need a new kind of logic, not this kind of logic. If we really do, like I say, we want to produce excellence. And if we want to have productivity as our competitive advantage, right?   0:07:06.4 AS: And one thing I just want to, for the listeners and viewers out there that may get confused, like what is a pyramid chart? We're talking about an organizational chart with a CEO, you know, and the like at the top, and then all the different department heads and the people below them. So Dr. Deming referred to that, and Jacob's also referring to that as a pyramid chart. Let's continue.   0:07:27.5 JS: That's right. Yeah. Yeah. Thanks for clarifying that. Okay. So that gets us to myth number one, because, and myth number one is the myth of segmented success. And the idea behind it is that the productive resources, this is a myth, this isn't true, but according to the myth, the productive resources of a company can be organized as a collection of independent components. The whole equals the sum of the parts. So this is essentially the glue that holds this org chart structure together. If that myth were true, then that org chart structure would be perfect for organizing a productive organization. But it is a myth. And what we see is that when you run a company according to that, with that assumption, you get into all kinds of trouble.   0:08:20.5 JS: And I'll just give you a very simple example. We have, let's say we have a company that does heating, ventilating, air conditioning, and they're selling stuff to industry, various machines, and they're installing them, and they're servicing them, all that kind of thing. Right? So let's say there's the end of the quarter and the sales rep has to make his or her numbers. Now salespeople are rewarded based on their sales numbers. Production people or the service people are rewarded based on their numbers, on how many service calls they satisfy or whatever. So installation people are rewarded for how much installing they do. So everybody's got quotas, and they're all sort of independent like components. So you get this sort of negative chain reaction where the sales rep does a big deal to make the numbers at the end of the quarter. He brings it in, the bell rings, you know, hooray, this person's made his numbers, he gets to go to Hawaii or whatever it is. Right?   0:09:27.6 JS: But let's supposing to get that deal, that's a big deal, it's high volume. So guess what? Low margin. And guess what? Maybe the sales rep had to make a few concessions to get that deal. Maybe the sales rep didn't reveal all the fine print to the customer, you know, in sort of the rush of getting the deal. So after the deal, the next quarter, well, the service department's got problems now dealing with this order. The installation department's got problems. So both of these departments have to hire extra people, have to pay overtime. So the end of that quarter, their numbers are going to look bad. Right? So that's a classic case. But it just happens over and over and over again, because you have all these different business entities compensated based on their own separate objectives as if they were separate companies. And yet that's glorified, that's seen as entrepreneurial. We'll run our department as a business, as a profit center. But they don't consider the whole overall system. So that's the kind of the tragedy, I guess, in modern business. And again, it's assuming that everything is kind of gonna work out if you manage them independently.   0:10:53.2 AS: And I was thinking that, you know, the head of the sales department is gonna be rewarding the salesperson for what they're doing. And if the head of the manufacturing or service department could anticipate that this deal that the salesperson's closing is gonna cause a lot of problems because of, you know, they're rushing it and they're trying to give great terms to get something under a deadline. There's just a very difficult for the head of the sales department to listen to that complaint to the head of, let's say the service department as an example, because they're being judged by the numbers they're delivering in their department by their boss. And so they got to kind of let it happen.   0:11:33.5 JS: Yeah. Yeah. And this is by the way, based on a real life story. And this is a company called Air Force, I think, Air Force One, it's called actually, and it's based in Ohio. It's a heating, ventilating air condition company. I could say HVAC, but they use the acronym. And they worked with Kelly Allen. And very soon after working with Kelly, they got rid of sales quotas and put everybody on salary. And the whole thing took off, you know, as the CEO told me. They're getting better deals, customers are happier, veteran sales reps are helping the younger ones close deals. Everyone's helping everybody. And the business is really, really expanded rapidly. You know, they've, I think, doubled or tripled their revenues in the last three or four years. So yeah, these things, when you get rid of these artificial barriers, businesses can really take off. And we got all kinds of case studies showing that.   0:12:45.3 AS: Yeah. And for the listeners and viewers out there, like, wait a minute, I can't do this. You know, my salespeople, they only are gonna work when they're incentivized individually as a department. I think the first thing that I would say is listen to what Jacob's telling you, listen to the stories that you're hearing and think about it. You don't have to move on it. I think that transformation in the way that you think about, you know, things takes time. And the natural reaction, when you hear something new, you know, you started with the idea of unlearning the natural reaction, when you hear something new is to say that can't work, but just keep that open mind as we continue through myth number one. So why don't you continue on, Jacob?   0:13:25.3 JS: Yeah, well, and as Kelly Alley, Kelly Allen you know, made some points on that. First of all, he said, you don't go in with your guns blazing and just take away the sales quotas. He said they worked very carefully so that CEO understood the whole system, how all the parts interact. And then once you understand the system, then you're in a position. Often people go in prematurely, remove all the sales quotas and you get chaos because people don't understand all the dependencies that are there. So it's really, really important, I think to manage the change in a responsible way. And again, as Kelly says, you've got to understand the system and how it works.   0:14:10.4 AS: Great. And I think you have more stories to tell.   0:14:14.2 JS: Oh yeah. Well, I actually a wonderful one. It's, and it's not just sales quotas, by the way, it's any kind of rating and ranking system. And one of the real classics is the, a company called Bama, Bama Foods, which is, uses Deming's principles. And the CEO, Paula Marshall, actually might've been this little girl, eight-year-old girl who was looking for the desk of the CEO 30 years later, because she started working with Deming just by accident, really, because she had taken over the company business at a young age and she, they were trying to deal with some quality problems. And she went to a Deming seminar and Dr. Deming asked who in the audience is the CEO? And she was the only one that raised her hand. And so he said, will you come and , be part of a study group? So that's how she got to work and got to become actually today's the only living CEO that's actually worked directly with Deming, or the only active CEO that's actually worked with Dr. Deming.   0:15:32.4 JS: But anyway, she started to talk with Dr. Deming about the problems they were having and he said, and she described a rating and ranking system that they had had, and they had spent, I think millions of dollars even back then with a very, very reputable consulting firm. And it was one of these things where they rank people on a scale of one to 10. And the idea was let's make all our people accountable. That's how we're going to get quality. We'll have accountability. Everybody has to be rated by their managers and we'll create some fear and we'll create some incentive for people to work harder and solve our problems. Well, the first thing Dr. Deming told her is get rid of that rating and ranking system. So it was very, very hard for her at first, you know, she'd spent a lot of money on it. And she said, you know, but eventually she said she realized that it wasn't helping the company. It wasn't doing anything, but it was still very, very hard to let go of that idea. But eventually she did. Eventually she got on a conference call.   0:16:40.3 JS: They got rid of it and the results were just incredible. She said by the, you know, everyone had hated the system and it just turned the conversation around. I mean, instead of saying, well, here's why I've ranked you, Andrew, on, I've only given you a seven instead of a nine. We would be having a sort of a constructive conversation about the problems you're facing in the workplace, how we can make things better, how can we work together, that sort of thing. So it was, it became much more constructive and much more cooperative. And they were able to evolve to a whole system where teams of people work together to solve problems. But without taking away that system, it would have been very, very difficult to do that 'cause, you know, well, that means that person will be ranked higher than me maybe, you know.   0:17:31.2 AS: And we know very well in the area of sports that, you know, great coaches are not sitting there ranking and rating and ranking their employees and beating them over the head with that. They're trying to identify the strengths and weaknesses. How do we, you know, build this team so that we can beat the other teams? And that really requires coordination. And if you do rating and ranking type of thing, you start to destroy coordination. And for those people that are thinking, of course, you know, I'm terrified to look at this and remove my rating and ranking. One thing you can do is take, you know, five or 10 people that you respect their opinion within the company and ask them how they feel about the rating and ranking system. And you'd be surprised what you hear.   0:18:15.3 JS: Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah, for sure. Right. And, but yeah, about the sports team, I guess. Yeah. I mean, there's some documentaries on the Chicago Bulls, you know, and I think they had some very good stories about teamwork and stuff like that.   0:18:30.5 AS: Well, Phil Jackson was amazing in that the documentary on Netflix was great, The Last Dance. But what you can see and you can hear it from the players, I think Dennis Rodman was a great example where Phil Jackson understood how to deal with this kind of disruptive kind of situation and guy. How do you deal with that and get the most out of him on the court in a way that still follows the values of yourself and your team? And he just showed that very well in that. And so I think that that was a great example of how you coordinate your resources.   0:19:08.5 JS: Yeah, a great example, I think, for people to watch. Yeah, 'cause it really does. It does really show that.   0:19:15.3 AS: You know, you were talking to me about just before we turned on the recorder about Deming was a scientist and physics and all this, some things I never even thought about. But maybe you can tell us a little bit about your thoughts in that area.   0:19:28.4 JS: Yeah, you know, I mean, I think that, first of all, the when you look at the traditional pyramid and all the traditional style of management, I mean, that's really based on reductionism, cause-and-effect. Essentially, it's Newton, you know, it's Newton's golden principles. So you have a business system that's built on 17th century logic, basically. And so what I think is wonderful about Dr. Deming, I mean, we think of him as this philosopher. But here he was, Dr. Deming in the 1920s, getting his PhD in mathematical physics. So at the time he's doing his PhD, I mean, there's Heisenberg developing his uncertainty theorems, all that kind of stuff was just exploding. And the whole view that people had of the physical world was just being turned upside down. So Dr. Deming was very, very cognizant of that.   0:20:35.2 JS: You know, when it started, you know, with statistics, but gosh, you know, science of psychology was changing too. And I think Deming, you know, when you read him, he was really thinking like a scientist. You know, this is the way the world works. And was very, very sensitive about all the components of that. You know, the science of the way people think and what motivates them. You know, he knew that people aren't motivated by sticks and carrots. And we'll talk about that later. He knew that there are limits to how much you can know if you're not right there in the workplace. You know, he understood all that because of variation. But I think when he was introducing those ideas, people really weren't thinking that way. I think they are a bit more today, but he was really a pioneer in that.   0:21:33.4 AS: Yeah. In fact, I was just looking at, he got his degree in mathematical physics from Yale university in 1928. So yeah, there was a lot going on in the world then.   0:21:46.3 JS: Sure was. Yeah. So yeah. And he, I guess he's very patient with us. You know, you think of someone having a degree like that talking, you know, over everybody's heads, but I think he really developed the style of communicating.   0:22:06.5 AS: So what else you got for us on this topic? I think you had some takeaways that you mentioned some four points or some other items.   0:22:14.3 JS: Sure. Yeah. I can, I did summarize at the end of the chapter just to sort of a bluffers guide, I guess, to, you know, this myth of segmented success. But, you know, first of all, you know, as we were just saying, conventional management practices are based on an outdated view of the world that emphasizes reductionism and predictability and ignores the influence of complexity and interdependencies. So you don't see how things actually affect each other in a company. Operating companies so that interdependencies are reflected in management practices and understood by all employees enables wide engagement in improving quality and productivity. To create a strong team environment, managers need to remove barriers such as siloed incentive plans and clearly communicate the aim of the organization. And finally, recent lessons from supply chain disruptions during the COVID epidemic show how segmentation extends beyond the walls of a company and how closer collaboration with supply chain partners can prevent such disruptions.   0:23:41.3 AS: So how would you, let me ask you, how would you wrap everything up in a very short statement? What do you want people to remember?   0:23:53.4 JS: I want people to remember that just because it says so in an org chart doesn't mean that that reflects the way things actually happen.   0:24:05.7 AS: Yeah, that's a great one. And I think we're trained, and this is where Dr. Deming used to say that, you know, what we're being taught in management schools, you know, is the wrong thing. And this is exact type of thing where we're talking about this concept of the, you know, the org chart and the way power flows and all of that stuff. So yeah, great points.   0:24:28.4 JS: Yeah. Not only in management school, but in grade school, you know, when we're rating and ranking kids before they even know how to learn and read, even before they know how to read and write.   0:24:41.2 AS: Yeah. And that brings us back to that first story where a kid walks in and what has she seen? She's seen the teacher and the principal with the name tag at the front, in front of the class.   0:24:53.4 JS: Exactly. Yeah. Yeah. And I don't know if we can keep talking, but you know, Rich Sheridan also discovered a drawing, which is actually, it's a diagram in The New Economics, but it shows how people's creativity and joy in work and stuff are systematically destroyed throughout their lifetime. They're constantly put down by teachers, principals, and they go to college and university and there's competition. And then they go into the workplace and they're rated and ranked. And it just destroys the natural of joy in work that people have and the enthusiasm people could have in the workplace.   0:25:39.5 AS: And for those listeners out there who used to listen to The Wall by Pink Floyd, Roger Waters was talking about how the school system was just pounding out any creativity, any fun, any joy. And so it's not unusual. And it's the case in many educational systems around the world. And so I think, you know, this is a good reminder of, you know, joy in work. And also this idea of segmented success. I think you had a statement that you said to me just before we started, which I thought summed it up perfectly, which was the whole doesn't equal the sum of the parts.   0:26:18.3 JS: Yeah, that's exactly. And we can basically reduce it all to that.   0:26:28.4 AS: Yeah. So I'm going to wrap up there. So for ladies and gentlemen, I think that's a great description of myth number one in Jacob's book, but I think ending it with this, the whole doesn't equal the sum of the parts, helps us all to realize that, you know, just bringing competition between different people and different units within an organization does not bring the optimum output. Jacob, on behalf of everyone at Deming Institute, I wanna thank you again for the discussion and for listeners, remember to go to deming.org to continue your journey. You can find Jacob's book, Productivity Reimagined at jacobstoller.com. And this is your host Andrew Stotz. And I'll leave you with one of my favorite quotes from Dr. Deming. We've been talking about it today. "People are entitled to joy in work".

Rich Sheridan is the CEO and co-founder of Menlo Innovations, a software development company based in Ann Arbor, Michigan. He's the author of the books Joy, Inc. and Chief Joy Officer: How Great Leaders Elevate Human Energy and Eliminate Fear. In chapter three of Chief Joy Officer, Rich says “If there is a core tenet upon which I would build my leadership life, and in doing so inspire those I led, it is this: love wins every time.” He then goes on to relate one of the most famous passages of the Bible, 1 Corinthians 13: 4-8, to the qualities of a loving leader. Whether or not you're a religious person – in fact, that verse is used often in even the most secular of wedding ceremonies – the relation of what the verse says to the qualities a leader should have is powerful. Rich talks about this chapter on this podcast. However, we encourage you to pick up his book and read for yourself. That chapter alone may affect the way you approach your responsibility for those entrusted to your care in your organization.

Rich Sheridan, CEO and Chief Storyteller at Menlo Innovations (and author of Joy Inc. and Chief Joy Officer) joins us for a meandering chat. We talk about building a culture free from fear, the power of storytelling in the office, and the benefits of making two people share one computer.

Joe has a book “Agile Kata” in the making, if you like to be the first to know when it launches, please visit www.agilekatabook.com.Transcript: Agile F M radio for the agile community. [00:00:09] Joe Krebs: All right, thank you for tuning into another episode of Agile FM in the Agile Kata series. Today I have two guests with me, actually three guests with me. I have Dan Roman and Richard Sheridan from Menlo Innovations. We have Dexter with us in the background. He might or might not. Contribute to this recording as he's a dog, Dan is a frontline worker at Menlo.He's a a lead, but he's also primarily a software developer. We're going to talk a little bit about Kata in development and obviously Richard Sheridan, author of the books, The Chief Joy Officer and Joy Inc. Is it fair to say you're the Chief Joy Officer of Menlo. [00:00:54] Rich Sheridan: A chief storyteller is the more typical title they give me here.[00:00:59] Joe Krebs: Awesome. All right. The chief storyteller, Richard and Dan, welcome to the podcast.[00:01:04] Dan Roman: Thank you for having [00:01:05] Rich Sheridan: us. Thanks Joe. Good to see you. [00:01:08] Joe Krebs: Yeah. Good to connect. And this episode we're going to focus a little bit on development. We want to talk about how do teams build agile teams? How do they build a product?Here in particular software development products. Now, Dan you are, as far as I know from a website, your keynoting together with Richard there is, you have a focus on software for manufacturers of medical instruments and software for space researchers. So this is. This is I would say complicated, complex stuff you're working on and as far as I can tell and we talked about that during our visit in in Ann Arbor, where you guys are located, that there is no formal process like Scrum or Kanban or like to the book extreme programming deployed at Menlo Innovation.Is that correct? [00:02:01] Dan Roman: 100%. We have plenty of people who come and visit and we'll see what we're doing and find that what we're doing matches with one of their models. So we didn't set out to be agile, but agilists who come in say, Oh, Menlo is agile, or we have lean practitioners come in and they say, Oh, Menlo is lean.But our processes, we never started from a place of. We want to be agile. Let's do it this way or we want to be lean. Let's do it that way. [00:02:27] Joe Krebs: As you're obviously working with different kinds of companies and clients. And obviously also with different kinds of products you guys are creating. Now, I would be interesting because.There is a term that's being used, I was told, on the floor at Menlo, this is run the experiment. That seems to be a frequent term. Can you just specify, either one of you, what that means, or maybe both, right? And how that comes into play, working in agile ways. [00:02:55] Rich Sheridan: I would say, Joe, that phrase is born out of a background philosophy at Menlo that says, let probably pump fear out of the room.We think that fear is a culture killer. Filler fear is a mind killer. I think there's a line in doom that says something like that. And so if someone has a new idea here, rather than. Hey, let's form a committee to write a policy on that. I do. Let's take a meeting. Our inclination is to take action with that simple phrase.If somebody has an idea, somebody else might see. Great. Let's run the experiment. See what happens. And that can typically the things we try are on fairly small scale. We don't upend the whole place every week to try some new, crazy new way of working. But usually it is some small incremental change to an existing process or an enhancement to the way we do things here.Because somebody believed that there was a problem to solve and this experiment may help us address that problem. Again, trying it and see how it works. And the experiments that succeed are the ones that last a long time and others might just thritter away because they didn't actually solve an actual problem.Probably more often than not an experiment. Morphs over time. We had the original idea, we tried it, it didn't work the way we hoped. We try something a little different. [00:04:23] Joe Krebs: So it could go into either direction. So when we talked about this a little bit about the experimental part and obviously I'm very public about my my work and my interest in Kata and scientific thinking through Michael Rother and Jeffrey Liker.We, we met in Ann Arbor. And obviously when you hear the word experiment in connection with Kata , then it becomes, obviously the question is, how does this whole setup look like in Menlo? How do you guys operate? How does this all work? Do you guys have a product owner within Menlo? Do you guys have scrum masters?Do you guys have project managers, agile coaches? What do people listening to us right now have to imagine when they just picture Menlo and cannot visit you guys in person? [00:05:10] Rich Sheridan: It's probably valuable to know, just for your listeners, a little bit of background on what Menlo does for a living, where we make our money.We are doing custom software development on behalf of our clients. So Dan has done a lot of projects for us over the years that he's been here. He will work in with manufacturing companies who are trying to enhance their ERP systems. He'll work with furniture retailers who are trying to improve how things happen on the sales floor.So all these companies are coming to us because as Joe, everybody in the world needs software to run their businesses these days. And so we are bringing in clients from every industry imaginable to come in and work with us. We have a fairly simple structure to our team. The teams that Dan is a part of that are working on those various projects will consist of a project manager who is typically paired with we'll call it a product owner on the customer side of the equation.And for us, the customers are the people who are paying us to do this work. They aren't necessarily be going to be the end users, almost never the end users. Software building. We have a set of people on our team that have a very fun and unusual title and a great role called high tech anthropologists, and their job is to understand the humans that will one day use the software, the end users in software.Then we have our software development team, which comprises the biggest part of our company. And then Formal quality assurance role that works alongside the software development team. So every project at Menlo has some component of each of those four pieces. And and we work on a weekly iterative basis here.essentially right sizing every project for exactly the workload, right sizing it with the types of people it needs. We're more in the discovery phase. There'll be more high tech anthropology. If we're more in the software development phase, there will be more people like Dan on the project. The project manager and the QA teams are shared amongst variety projects, and they are they are constant throughout the course of each of the projects.In any given moment in time, we're a team of about 50 people. We have, probably right now, I'm going to guess about 15 different projects. at various stages. Some of the projects are large. They'll have 8 to 10 people on them. Some of the projects are small. They only have a couple. And it's probably worth noting that we pair.That pairing is a big construct here. That was an early experiment that took hold in the 23 years ago when we founded Menlo. And it has never let up since. [00:07:44] Joe Krebs: So running the experiment seems to be something like a, for testing and verifying the process in place, like programming, right? Is this an interesting, is this you have read about it, you, the teams might try it and find Found it useful, like many teams found their programming useful, right?So it's an interesting thing. So you're using that kind of experimentation approach for the process you're using, but you're also using experimentation for building the products for your clients. And that's where I want to go a little closer here. So you have your how do you protect your end user, your users?Your clients or your customers that are the product owner or acting out that role. If you want to say it this way. But then how do these requests come in? There's a ton of teams that are there that are using user stories product backlogs, ordering activities, refinement activities planning, sprint planning activities, and so on.How does this all look like at Menlo? How do you guys incorporate that if you work in different ways? I would be curious to hear. [00:08:42] Rich Sheridan: Yeah, the biggest starting point and starting is always hard for every project is starts with our high tech anthropology team and really attempt to answer three questions and use a lot of experiments to get to the answers to these questions.What problem are we actually trying to solve different than perhaps the one even the customer presented to us? Who exactly are we trying to solve this problem for? What types of people? And we'll use personas and persona maps for that exercise. But a lot of that discovery work is done out in the field.And so a lot of the early experiments are to be able to find these typical end users of the products we're working on out in the world. And that is often where some of the key experiments start early on. I'll give you a fun example, way back in our earliest days, long before anybody had iPhones or any kind of GPS devices, we were working with a company that wanted to create lanyard type devices that people who were on cruise ships would use to navigate the cities they would arrive in as the cruise ships pulled into port.And so imagine they had around their necks, they had these GPS driven devices with moving map displays and that sort of thing. So we had to figure out simple questions like do people know how to read maps? Because, if you ask a group of people, do you know how to read maps? Everybody would say, absolutely, I know how to read a map.If you ask people to read maps, you find that hardly 50 percent of people know how to read maps. And so it would be very expensive to try and do this on a cruise ship. We did get one cruise ship ride throughout the course of this project. But before that, we went to a local theme park here, locally here, just to watch people try and use maps.So we would run into that. with them. We would walk up to them with a map in our hand and say, Hey, can you show me where the Edison exhibit is? And we obviously have the map in our hand and we would see if that people would grab the map and what they would do with it and how they would orient it. And 50 percent of the people said, Oh, I can never read these things.See that circle I over there, the information booth, you should go ask them. So we found out right away that about 50 percent of people self report they don't know how to read maps. But this was really early experimental data that we could collect very inexpensively around what kind of challenges would people get to if they don't know how to read maps and we're creating a device that's supposed to allow them to navigate a city.And we get very creative. We try and do things inexpensively. And then ultimately we experiment with the potential designs, often with paper based prototypes to see what will actually work for people. Once we get into the actual software development, once we've secured that we understand what design and work for them, then there's a lot of other experiments that Dan and his fellow developers here at Memo will use.Sometimes those experiments are technical ones, technological ones. Sometimes it's most of the time, I would say they're often human ones because we were often working with developers. And our client sites, we have to figure out how to work with them, given the way we work. [00:11:55] Joe Krebs: Dan I'm curious, like just to take it to the software development side and take advantage of you being here on on this podcast as well, right?So it's a great insight to see business and the leadership of the organization, but also to see the actual implementation of these products, right? So let's say we're doing these visioning techniques and obviously as a. As Richard pointed out, there's a lot of cost savings finding out early on that people can read a map, right?Could you imagine you were building something assuming they can read a map? That would be a very costly detour later on. But I want to go a little bit deeper because there's so many teams, agile teams out there that are preparing for sprint planning activities or iteration planning. And they're using user stories or and then they're basically have planned everything and laid it out and implemented.You guys have through that experimental process, a different thing in place. I think it's much more lightweight, if I'm not mistaken. Can you walk the listeners maybe through once these requests come in and you're actually in the software development part of how you're still using experiments for that?[00:13:00] Dan Roman: Sure. So to as Rich was telling us about those experiments, it reminded me a little bit that every development iteration at Menlo, I would argue, is itself an experiment. So the beginning of the iteration happens after a show and tell, where the software development team will actually have the client or customer demo back to the development team the work that was accomplished for the previous iteration.And then based on that demo we'll authorize the next week's worth of work which comes out to some 40 planned hours worth of work. And when I think about Kata, I think about declaring a desired future state. And that's ultimately what we're doing. When we set out a plan for the iteration, we're saying the plan is we will end up in a state where these cards have been completed and there'll be completed in this effort.And then the rest of the iteration is the steps that we as a development team take to try and realize that. Future state. And then by the time we get to the end we'll basically start the cycle over again, which will again reminds me a little bit of Kata where we'll compare. All right, we started with a plan to get to this future state.We've run the iteration for a week. Let's compare where we are compared to where we want to be. And ultimately, all of that happens through obviously the software developers doing the work, but that all happens through . The story cards, which are our fundamental unit of work and these are three by five index cards on which are written the work items that the developers will go and implement and our quality advocates will go and test.And typically our high tech anthropologists are part of writing in the first place. .[00:14:28] Joe Krebs: Is there still like, are you pulling from an organized formal product backlog as so many scrum teams? are doing, or is this process a little bit more ad hoc and fluid based on the work you did in previous iterations where you're getting instant feedback from your customers and how does that all look like?The show and tell, that's where this comes together, I would assume. [00:14:50] Dan Roman: Yep. That's a very good question. So it's a little bit of all of the above. So what Rich was alluding to at the beginning of our engagements, the high tech anthropologists will do a lot of the Upfront work of describing here's based on our research and our observational data, what we believe the application needs to do.And that sets as a starting off point for the engagement itself. But over the course of every engagement, we are also discovering new work. So over the course of a given iteration, as the developers are doing work, they might write. They may write other story cards or the quality advocates may write some story cards or even at show and tell the client might may say, Oh, we didn't think about the fact that the user might need to do this certain thing.One of the fundamental rules that Menlo is that everyone can write a story card. Now just because you've written a story card doesn't mean that it'll get authorized or that'll get put on a weekly iteration. But we are certainly collecting the scope that's being executed nonstop over the course of the engagement.[00:15:49] Joe Krebs: How does maybe I love this story cards, right? Obviously, there is a story to be told and collaborated on as a team. How detailed are you? As teams now within Menlo, how detailed are you with the planning activities? Are you planning very ad hoc? Is this like in subgroups or pairs or how let's say, this, these requests are coming in.You have these stories and you're experimenting, I would assume also on those. How detailed are those or all the questions? [00:16:22] Rich Sheridan: Yeah. The important element of our planning that I think probably differs from many development teams is how collaborative it is with our customers. Number one, we're putting together at a high level a story mapped version that might map out a year or two worth of key milestones for this client broken down into achievable goals that might run.Okay. A month, two, three, four months. And then we start laying out the story cards for that very first goal. And the customer is standing alongside of us choosing these story cards that should go into that plan. Obviously we're giving them some advice from a technical standpoint as to if there's a more appropriate sequence of things that makes more sense, but we really want the business feeling like they're driving this we often find it When we hear of other teams challenges in planning and estimating and that sort of thing, you often find that it's an adversarial relationship with the business sponsors, where somebody is I can't believe it's going to take that long, or you need to get this done in a shorter amount of time.Our approach isn't to try and argue against the importance of a date or features within that date, but to simply argue with the data of here's what fits, given your budget, given your burn rate, given the team size we have. And then it's a question of, can we make responsible trade off decisions with our client to get to that particular goal?And then, as Dan said, on a weekly iterative basis, we're going to review the progress against our original plan. Because, no plan actually holds up once it hits reality. So we're going to get, sometimes we get more done than we expected, sometimes we get less done. But that weekly visit into what exactly do we get done in the weekly opportunity to now look ahead in that longer plan and say, okay, what we've learned now, should we make adjustments to the plan?Have we discovered new things that need to be done? Should we write story cards and estimate those story cards? Should we take some things off that we originally thought should be part of the plan in favor of newer, more important things? Collaborative planning happens on a week by week basis on all of our projects.I think the most fun thing I see happen is that often we use paper based planning techniques, which is again, unusual for software teams to use paper. Typically in the earliest part of our planning, all of our story cards are on white paper. But as time goes on, and as customers start to get nervous that we don't seem to be making as much progress, we often switch to, say, hot pink paper for things that were newly discovered or that somebody raised their hand in a meeting and said, hey we didn't think of this when we talked to you about it originally.And so we'll write that story card up, we'll estimate it, but when we put it in the paper based planning process, we make it hot pink. And over time, what you can see is The actual physical real estate of our planning sheets being taken up by more and more hot pink work Which essentially says hey, there was a lot of stuff for some reason we didn't discover early on Yes wrong with that, but let's at least acknowledge With this, these colorful pieces of paper that we are now three months into this project and 25 percent of the things we're working on are things neither one of us thought of at the beginning of the project.That can be really helpful to maintaining executive sponsorship of a project because. Now we can have explicit discussions about new things that came in. It isn't some theoretical wave your hands in the air. There were a few new things that came along. No, it is clear what the new things are that came along because it's on this different color.[00:20:18] Joe Krebs: Yeah. Creating truly a partnership, right? With with the business the clients in this case do to showcase this, right? And obviously as a client, I would assume they're all very happy with us to see that. They are late changes are being incorporated some way or the other, and [00:20:34] Rich Sheridan: happiness is an interesting word in this.So it would be fun to believe that the people on the other side of the planning table at Menlo have all of the power and all of the authority to make these changes. But typically they're reporting up to an executive somewhere that has some other budgetary constraints. . We're not so much trying to make happy customers out of this process.We're trying to make informed customers so they can have intelligent conversations when they go back to their offices to say, Hey, I thought you were going to have all of this. What happened? And what you really want to do is give them the physical artifacts they need to be able to create a story. scale all the way up, perhaps to the CEO of the company to figure out why is this project where it's at right now.[00:21:27] Joe Krebs: . That's a good point. And thanks for clarifying. I think makes makes perfect sense. Dan Richard's mentioned the word a few times. I want to go a little bit deeper. That's the word estimates. Are you guys estimating there's a lot of different kind of estimation techniques out there.Agile teams are using, I'm just curious with this approach where you're going into more experimental activities, if estimation is actually still a thing here, or if it's an, if so, how lightweight it is. [00:21:58] Dan Roman: Sure. So to start right off the bat, yes, we do estimate it's part of that weekly iteration cycle.So every development team is sitting down and looking at the cards in play, as well as cards likely to be played in the future and estimating those story cards. That takes about an hour of time for regardless of the size of the dev team and we estimate in hours and in powers of two. So a given story card at Menlo would sit between two hours and 32 hours again on that power of two spectrum which can feel pretty radical for some organizations where things like velocity.I know that's a very popular way to, Fibonacci numbers as a means of calculating velocity or t shirt sizes, another sort of abstraction. I think that there are a couple of things that necessitate, or at least why we as Menlonians prefer that method. One is because estimating in hours is a universal language that when we get to that planning game after the show and tell with our stakeholders.There's no need to do any translation between 13 Fibonacci points or a medium t shirt size. We can say we've got 40 hours of effort for a given pair to plan for. And this card is 16, and that's 16 hours worth of work. And that's something that is instantly understandable by our stakeholders.I think part of the reason that we as a team are able to do that and Not in all cases, but in some cases, why other teams choose those kinds of abstractions at Menlo. We have a very healthy relationship between the technical folks who are doing the work and the project managers and stakeholders who are authorizing and planning the work.And that's manifest in this sort of contract. That's very explicit and part of, as I understand it, our project management training. There's a dual responsibility for maintaining our estimates. So any software developer pair that's doing work on a card. As soon as they know they're going to miss the estimate.So if Rich and I were pairing on a story card and we were on an eight hour card and we started to realize, Oh, wait, this is bigger. This is going to be at least double that. This is a 16 hour card. Now we have a obligation to go out to our project manager, for example, Lisa, she's one of our PMs and telling her, Hey, Lisa, we are working on this card.It was originally estimated as an 8, but because of these reasons, we see it as a 16. That's our half of the sort of contract. The other half of that is the one that lives on Lisa's side, or the PM's side, which is to say, Thank you for your estimate, and smile. And that sounds like a really simple little strategy, but it's That kind of strategy that sucks the fear out of the room that would otherwise inhibit Rich and I from volunteering that information or giving an honest, updated estimate on the card.And that's why a lot of other teams can run into those abstractions is because it's scary or painful when you let some set of stakeholders know, oh, this thing we originally estimated will take a day is now going to take more than that. Yeah, [00:24:59] Joe Krebs: well, there's definitely a lot of controversy out there about.Estimation and the techniques and in communicated and sometimes they're so like inflated to o just to be safe, depending on what organization and teams you work for. So that's, does not seem to be the approach at Menlo and obviously you guys. I've taken an expert estimate on the work at that time and see what, what comes out of it.Once you start working on it very interesting thing. Now you just mentioned that I want to follow up on that word too, because I think the listeners out there who are. Used to agile coaches scrum masters, et cetera, et cetera. They are probably not saying did he just say the word project manager?Did he just use that term? And because that sometimes that is a term that has been removed and replaced and you guys are using it actively, as far as I understand what's the role of a project manager at? Menlo, if you're working so in so agile ways and in experiments and et cetera what would be the role of a project manager other than nodding and saying, thanks for your estimate and smiling.[00:26:09] Rich Sheridan: So the primary role of a project manager at Menlo is to be the voice of the customer, people who pay us to do the work when the customer isn't in the room. And so their job is to answer questions from the development team about the general direction of the project, where it's going, how we're going to get there, what what the overall overarching goals for the project are if the cause, if the project manager doesn't know they will reach out to the client who isn't imminently available every time we want to reach out to them.That's why we need somebody who's advocating on their behalf when the client isn't around or not available by phone and that sort of thing. The the other role important role project manager does is to help the team remove obstacles. Dan and his pair partner will be rolling along and a card gets stuck.Have a question, need to reach out to somebody, you can just let Lisa know and say, Hey, Lisa, I just want to let you know we're stuck here. We wrote to the client. We're waiting for an answer. We're going to red dot that card, which means they're going to stop it. We're going to move on to the next card in the lane.And if there's anything you can do to help remove that obstacle, that would be awesome. Project managers also keeping close track. Our customers are spending a lot of money with us, so keeping close track on the budget relative to the total budget relative to the burndown for that budget, all those kinds of things.I guess there's a tremendous amount of, financial oversight that comes with every one of our projects, we're often working on projects that run into the millions of dollars. And so project managers are helping manage that part of the process with us. And you're also making a lot of decisions alongside people like Dan is to what should the composition of the team be this week.So it's a very collaborative role for the people doing the work I mentioned before we pair, we switch the pairs every five business days and. over time, systematically rotate people in and out of the projects to avoid burnout, to avoid towers of knowledge issues, all that kind of stuff. And the project managers will work very closely with the team to figure out what would be the best composition of people who should pair with whom who who would be good candidates for these story cards, that sort of thing.[00:28:27] Dan Roman: I think there's one element that's important too for Menlo, but I would also argue this is true of other organizations. But the roles and the titles that we have for the work that each of us as Menlonians do does describe a primary role. But that is not to say that the team is not responsible for also doing some of the other responsibilities of the other roles.For example, I am primarily a software developer at Menlo. But on a day to day basis, I am contributing to the conversations Rich is talking about where it's planning the resources for the project, making sure that the customer is appraised of any changes to the plan or keeping in mind the decisions that we're making today and what impact that has on the end user, the way that our high tech anthropologists might be considering.So I think it's one of those things where it's like we, we have those titles and those roles to an easy heuristic to generally describe what we do within Menlo, but at the end of the day, there's actually a lot of blending or blurring of the lines that exist between our individual roles.[00:29:30] Joe Krebs: Yeah. I think that's also it speaks to the self managing aspect of agility in general. Now I'm so thrilled to have you both on this podcast episode, because we had in this Kata series so far, we had different topics. We talked about transformational cultural things. I, this is a and I think that's a really great, wonderful episode.I believe it's a wonderful episode that really focused on Developing in agile ways, but in a non prescriptive or existing frameworks. That are out there and you can almost say like, when I listen to your conversation. It's almost it's almost sounds like cherry picking, right? Of how we're using this concept, or we are estimating, but a little bit different, or we have paper, but some of them are pink.And and so what I and working in pairs and we're shifting pairs and the way of how you operate with clients rather than the product owner being in house, the product owner is the actual client. So there's a lot of things. So there are some terminologies or project manager, just to name another one versus a scrum master.And what's really fascinating, I think, is for one of the goals of this episode is to show existing Agile teams if something's not working with an existing framework or with the process they have chosen, as you guys said, run the experiment, right? Try something new. Adjust your process. That's one element.And maybe you find ways of changing the way of how you currently work with breaking something. Obviously, that is recommended, but you're saying it's not working for us. That's not us. And that would be whatever you shared about. Menlo and the culture, but there's also the way of using this way of working to build the product itself, right?So there's two aspects to it, shape the process, how you want to work, but also the way of how you build a product for your clients. So I want to thank you guys for that. That is really nice. Thank you. [00:31:22] Rich Sheridan: You bet. Yeah. I think our general philosophy is all of these tools, methodologies, ways of thinking have value to offer and why would we constrain ourselves to simply one of them?Why don't we borrow pieces and parts? And put, I think for us, we do refer to our general system of work here as the Menlo way of working. . And but if you probed, you would see we borrowed all these pieces from this so we don't find ourselves resisting any of them. We find ourselves embracing them, looking at them deciding, oh, that might work here.And every project has its own unique, qualities to it as well. I [00:32:02] Dan Roman: think one of the pieces that reminds me of is the notion that when we're designing our process, we're setting out to solve a problem and our problem isn't that we're not doing agile. It's not that we're not doing scrum and we need to start doing scrum.We're trying to provide value to a customer on a frequent and consistent basis such that they can respond to feedback and make planning decisions. There are times when that desire or attempt to solve that problem will line up pretty closely with what Agile might seem like or Lean. But at the end of the day, it all starts from let's solve a problem and the absence of some predetermined process is not itself a problem.. [00:32:42] Joe Krebs: Yeah. This is, that's wonderful. And then maybe a good word to end the the podcast episode here together. And obviously there is. An opportunity to take a tour with Menlo and see that all in action. So I invite the listeners to go and reach out to you. There's a, there's tons of tours you guys are doing on a yearly basis.Ann Arbor is the place to visit in Michigan. And and then they can see all what we just talked about in action.[00:33:08] Rich Sheridan: And one of our experiments during the pandemic were virtual tours that we continue to this day, even though. The in person tours have resumed. , [00:33:17] Joe Krebs: even cooler. So this could be done just from your couch.Thank you so much. [00:33:22] Dan Roman: Thank you.​

In today's fast-paced business landscape, it's easy to get caught up in chasing short-term outcomes. But what if I told you there's a better way to achieve lasting success? Join us as guest, Katie Anderson, Shingo Publication Award recipient, will dive into the principles of the Shingo Model and uncover the transformative power of her book, Learning to Lead, Leading to Learn. You'll understand the core principles that have propelled Toyota to unparalleled success; discover how to cultivate a culture of continuous improvement and high performance in your organization; gain insights from Isao Yoshino, a 40-year leader at Toyota, on the pivotal role of people-centric leadership; learn how companies like Menlo Innovations and Barry-Wehmiller have leveraged Leading to Learn to achieve exceptional results; and equip yourself with practical techniques to set direction, provide support, and develop yourself as a leader. Take the opportunity to shift your perspective from chasing outputs to fostering a culture of learning and growth. To learn more, please visit https://shingo.org/articles.

Joe has a book “Agile Kata” in the making, if you like to be the first to know when it launches, please visit www.agilekatabook.com.Transcript: Agile F M radio for the agile community. [00:00:05] Joe Krebs: Thank you for tuning into another episode of Agile FM. Today, I have Dr. Jeffrey Liker with me. You probably know from a, I would say, famous book with the title The Toyota Way. That is a book we want to talk about today a little bit, but there's so much, much more about Jeff, he is a professor of industrial and operations engineering at the University of Michigan.He's president of Liker Lean Advisors, and as I said, he wrote not only the Toyota Way, but he also wrote, if I did the count right, nine other books. That relate to Toyota, and there are two books that more recently were published and we'll have a chance in a different episode to talk about those.One was in June, 2023, Giving Wings to her team with Tilo Schwartz, and we have Engaging the Team at Zingerman's Mail Order and that's more like a comic if you want to see it this way, and he co authored that with Eduardo Lander and Tim Root, so that is the The list of books if I haven't missed anything, but we want to talk a little bit about the Toyota way before we do that.Welcome to the show though, Jeff. [00:01:13] Jeffrey Liker: Thank you. Joe. [00:01:16] Joe Krebs: Awesome. So the Toyota way initially released, I believe 2000, somewhere three, two, somewhere that this book we're talking about is the Toyota way. Second edition. This is also very important. We're talking about the second edition of which, which was released somewhere in the year 2021. Timeframe. [00:01:34] Jeffrey Liker: Yes. Three, about two years old. [00:01:36] Joe Krebs: Yeah. And but there is something that happened in that book that is fundamentally different in, in terms of I, I don't know all the change log and everything, but there's one fundamental change, and that is the inclusion of scientific thinking.[00:01:52] Jeffrey Liker: Right, right. A little over five years ago, Mike Rother than I jointly gave a presentation and the book hit my book Toyota Way was 20 years old. So the 20 year anniversary, and his book to Toyota Kata was, I believe, 10 years old, and. We started talking about the relationship between the two.Mike was one of my students and he had practiced lean transformation for many years and was very familiar with the Toyota way and all the concepts of Toyota and studied Toyota. And then he came up with this thing called Toyota Kata. And I had to kind of struggle to sort of figure out what it was and what he was trying to add to what we know about Toyota.And. What he really did was to reverse engineer what Toyota, we call him Toyota Sensei. Sensei is like a master teacher. So what the Toyota Sensei, who are experts on the Toyota production system, do when they work with a new client outside of Toyota, how do they teach it? And they always teach by doing.And he had a chance to see a lot of companies that these different Toyota masters worked with and their masterpieces. And. Asked the question, What do they have in common? And they're all very successful, like they almost won't even bother working on a project unless they can at least double productivity.And that just happens almost automatically. And so he knew that they got great results. But the question is, what are they doing. And in fact, each of these masters. It has a bit of an ego, and they think that they're doing it the right way and the best way, and nobody else can do it that way, the way they do, but he found an underlying pattern, which he called scientific thinking, and what he noticed is the first thing they do is they grasp, they call it grasp the situation in Toyota, they go in, they see what's going on, they talk to the top leaders, and they ask, what is it that they're trying to accomplish?What is their goal? What is their purpose? What are their goals? Why do they want to learn about lean management? What is their vision for what happened? If they were successful, then they go to the Gemba where the activity is, and it could be a factory that they work. They've worked with where they gave you injections for COVID 19.They've worked with where they made ventilators for COVID 19. They've worked with software houses where they develop software. They don't really care when they will go to the Gemba and they'll see the process and understand the current conditions. So then they'll go back, they'll grasp the situation generally, and then they'll go back and they'll say, here's where you're at.Here's the challenge for you. Yeah. And the challenge is always big, you know, like we will double productivity or we will reduce costs by 30 percent or something pretty big based on the needs of the company may have runaway late deliveries and there's paying a ton for a premium freight.And we'll say we will eliminate all shipping and then they will go back to the Gemba with a team of people from the company. And they will teach them how to see, how to understand the process as it is. And Mike calls this the current condition. And then the people in the company will basically wait and expect answers, solutions from the masters.So what do we do? And the masters will say, that's my question to you. What are you going to do? You see where you are, you see where you want to be. You see all sorts of opportunities. What do you think you should be working on first? And then based on what they say the students say, they they may ask them to go back and look some more.Or they may say, why don't we try it? Usually what these people come in the company, come up with, because it's a big challenge, they come up with a fairly big thing and they, it might be, for example, in a manufacturing facility, moving equipment around and laying it out as a cell and They said a personal last one.Can you do this? And they'll say something like, well, we have to talk to engineering and we have to make sure customers okay with this. We have to line up the maintenance people move the equipment. So, I think we really stretch it. Maybe we could do it in a week. And then the trade master will say, good, I'll be back tomorrow and that like starts the process. Now, of course they can't do it in a day what they might have to do it. They can't get all the approvals. So what the person is trying to get them to do is. You don't have to do a hundred percent in one step. Let's try something that's doable and then see what happens.And then we can learn from it. And then we can think about based on that, what our next step is. Usually what happens is the, like, for example, if they lay out a cell. It'll be a disaster. You'll move the equipment together and they'll realize that the equipment has maintenance issues and it's breaking down and everything stops because they don't have inventory anymore.And usually they can't, they barely make product and the you know, the mentors say, that's okay. Let's start working on the problems down now that we see what the problems are. You were hiding them before. Now let's start working on the problems one by one. So Mike saw that, and he saw it enough times, that he realized that what the, these Master thinkers were doing.We're not teaching tools and methods like most of the Westerners were doing with lean. They were teaching a way of thinking. Yeah. And it was actually very scientific. What's your goal? What's your current condition? Right. You know, fairly precisely with measurements and direct observation. And then let's not try to in one step get to the challenge.Let's break down the problem. And all we really need to understand is our first step. And then after that, our second step, our third step, and each of these steps were structured like experiments. They might ask them, what do you think will happen if we make the cell? And then, you know, the people will say, Oh, well, our productivity will go up or quality will go up.Let's see what happens. Yeah. It's a disaster. Yeah. So what did we learn from that? We learned that we have a lot of problems that we've been hiding. And now we can see the problems we have to solve them. So, and also they're trying to teach the value of running the experiment, learning from it, which then gives you the next step and gives you the next step.So that became the basis for what. Mike call Toyota kata. The other part of it was in the meantime, he was studying about neuroscience and cognitive psychology and how we learn and there's a lot of literature that suggests that none of us are natural scientific thinkers, right? We're driven more by biases and the desire to know things, whether we do or not.So we want a lot of certainty. And we want to be right. We're going to, in fact, fudge the data to make it appear that we're right. That's called confirmation bias, which is really strong in humans. So he realized that to change people, to start to think and act scientifically requires fundamental behavior change.That's right. Yeah. It means changing our habits. And then he asked the question, how do you change habits? And the literature on, on, on cognitive psychology and neuroscience, as well as Practical experience, for example, with coaching sports teams, it all says the same thing, which we have to practice repeatedly with feedback.And it's very common enough times it becomes a new habit. So then he said, asked, how do you, how can we practice scientific thinking? And he said, first, we need a model, which we have, which is challenge current condition, first short term target condition, then experiment, then second target condition and experiment.Then third target condition and experiment. And. Then he said, how can we teach this? And each of those steps has some associated ways of thinking and tools and think practice routines, things to practice. So he laid that out in what he calls the Toyota Kata practice guide, which is pictures and step by step instruction, like, Like a recipe book and he came up with kata, which comes from the martial arts, which mean small practice routines to teach us complex skill by breaking it down and trying the pieces one by one karate.They'll have the first kata and move the second kata until you learn the first kata. That's right. Correctly. So it's an evolution. Yeah, and usually think about, you know, taking a music lesson until you can play the very simple piece. They want. Go on to the next more complicated piece. All right. So, that led to the whole Toyota Kata, which is a model plus the practice routines.And as you practice them, you begin to think more naturally in a scientific way. [00:11:20] Joe Krebs: Right. So what's interesting is so when I started looking at Mike Rothers work right on, on Kata, and obviously I read your first edition, came in to the second edition and it just like became more and more eyeopening is these habit changes or like a habits we have and habits we want to change that's the same in the agile community, right?So we have certain habits of how we. build software or how we release software and go through transformation and all these cultural changes. So it's just like this meta skill. If you want to see it this way, that, that's that's fascinating when I came across this now, I do want to make sure that If I understand this right, this is obviously not that in 2021 Toyota started with scientific thinking.It was there before, right? It is like something that was carved out as something like it should go into the Toyota way as this core thing. So if you look at [00:12:10] Jeffrey Liker: Yeah. So that was the, we ended up giving a presentation where we said Toyota way and Toyota Kata play well together as if there were separate things.And then thinking about some more, I realized that scientific thinking really underlies. What I called in the Toyota way, the four P's of the Toyota way. The first was philosophy, which I refer to as long term systems thinking. And the second is lean processes. The process of trying to work toward one piece flow.And the third is developing people. In problem solving, which is the fourth "P" and I realized these all are connected through scientific thinking, right? And if you're not thinking scientifically, you can't do any of them. For example, you can't be a system thinker. Yeah. If you're a jelly non scientific thinking is reductionist.We assume every individual tool operates on its own. So we implement Kanban to get inventory reductions and we implement standardized work to get productivity improvements. So we're seeing isolated tools as opposed to a whole system, which is what Mike called the Toyota production system. So with that, I then started to rethink the book from the point of view of scientific thinking, being at the center.And also realizing that you can't really talk about lean as if it's a bunch of mechanistic pieces that you individually build and then they just all suddenly fit together. You have to talk about more of an evolutionary learning process. Yeah. Organization. [00:13:48] Joe Krebs: Yeah. This is interesting. So, I have never consulted for Toyota myself but I was told that the word Toyota Kata does not really, it's not a use, it use Toyota.[00:13:58] Jeffrey Liker: That was not their word. It was Mike's. [00:13:59] Joe Krebs: Exactly. Yeah. [00:14:00] Jeffrey Liker: Description from the outside of what he learned in Toyota. And then he went further and say, the Japanese sensei, they tend to be pretty mysterious Yeah. Yeah, it's light. For example, do it tomorrow. Yeah, we'll come and see. So what should I do now? What do you think you should do now?Yeah. So they tend to be mysterious, but he realized that if we want to mass distribute this to people that don't have access to those magical Japanese, we need a very explicit and simple methodology. So he developed in great detail, this methodology that in Toyota, they wouldn't think they had to use because they, what they say is that from the day you enter the company, the culture is so strong.You begin to learn Kaizen. [00:14:49] Joe Krebs: Yeah. Interesting. So, what was that one of the reasons why you decided to call that core scientific thinking, or was it more like, because it's the thinking and not the tool, it's not the pattern [00:15:00] Jeffrey Liker: thinking now it turns out. You go back to the first Japanese pamphlet. Really? It was a document for the first Japanese document that describes the Toyota production system.It says that it's based on scientific thinking. So for people in Toyota, that's not. Unusual. It's not a stretch, but they, and they think of scientific thinking more empirically than theoretically. So there's theoretical science where we just. In the abstract. And then we deduce from that things and we apply the abstract model to a problem.And then there's inductive science where we look at the phenomena and the empirical reality. And then we induce from that principles and solutions. And so in Toyota, they learned that you need very specific solutions to very specific problems. Yeah. Not general solutions to a whole general class of problems.So you need both to some degree, but they're much more focused than most on solving this problem right here, right now. Yeah. So when they see product development in software, we're developing a software program, they see it and maybe they see it as a part of product development, but they're not going to come in and say, here's your 10 step roadmap to great software.They're going to ask, what is your problem? What are you trying to accomplish? What's your goal? Let's go look at your current process. So they want to know the specifics of your situation and your goals. And they want you to learn how to think scientifically, to learn for yourself how to achieve whatever goals you have and adapt and adjust as the environment changes.[00:16:45] Joe Krebs: It is, it's fascinating also when I open up your new book, the second edition, right? There's also a thing where you design a I don't know if that's the content of your masterclass. I do know that you're teaching a lot of masterclasses but it's really the transition from a mechanistic lean, right?Organic lean. And if I go through the list of the organic lean, this is just like, it just translates for me, for somebody who has been now, you know, using, learning, applying Kata thinking more and more it just links like one, one, one to one, like two to the scientific thinking too, right? [00:17:17] Jeffrey Liker: Yeah, the other part is that whatever performance improvement program you have, Whether it's lean or agile or theory of constraints or whatever.If you look at it from what I call mechanistic point of view, then you're trying to fit square pegs in the round holes, you know, your problems, I want your problems to fit into my model. . and the other expression pill uses, if you have a hammer, everything looks like a nail.So, You can apply Lean, you can apply Agile, you can apply Six Sigma mechanistically, or you can apply any of those things organically. You start organically, you start with a problem. You want to engage the people who understand the Gemba the reality the best. And you want to teach them how to think differently about their process.So they developed the skills of problem solving and performance improvement, and you expect to be surprised and you expect that you won't know the answers until you start digging in and trying things, Mechanistic point of view, you, I have the solution and I'm going to sell you the solution, even though I've never been in your place.I've never seen your process. I don't know anything about. Yeah, I have the solution for you. That's kind of taking this abstract solution and assuming it's going to apply in the abstract to any similar type of problem. Staying at that theoretical level. [00:18:49] Joe Krebs: This is this could I want to just take one example.You know, I want to hear your opinion about this as you do teach these classes, right? When you are surrounded by leaders in those workshops, and you do talk about something like, yeah, I find like the right line here. It's not about like organic, Lean. It would be, it's not a project. It's a journey.Right. And I would just like to hear like what kind of responses, what do you hear when you introduce a concept like this, in terms of continuous improvement and it's a journey or it's a. From a cultural perspective, it's not like an initiative that starts here and ends in by the end of March or any arbitrary date you, somebody might pick it as an ongoing activity that obviously shifts from a leadership perspective, entirely the view, like, what did you hear when you challenge people?[00:19:39] Jeffrey Liker: When I teach the masterclass, the people that usually come have titles like director of continuous improvement, vice president operations excellence and then I'll get some people who might be the head of operations or plant manager, but and you're probably this is self selection, but they all agree when we talk about it.That the approach they have used in the past was very mechanistic and the approach that they believe, particularly after they see it in Toyota. So we do this with Toyota is they see the value of engaging all the people and Leaders acting more as coaches than as disciplinarians. And they said, that's what we need.So they, they conclude they want to move toward a more organic approach, but then they also feel a little bit concerned and nervous because I said, you know, my boss's boss expects immediate measurable results from everything we do with lean. And if you're telling me that it takes time, if you're telling me that it takes investment in developing people.And there's a gap, a time gap between the investments we make in developing people, for example, teaching them using Kata and the results that we get, we're going to have a hard time selling that. So what we ended up concluding usually is that you need both, that there is some value in the experts coming in with the tools, eliminating waste and streamlining processes and getting.Quick results on a more expansive part of the organization. Cause these people are coming in with big companies. They might have 30 or 40 or 50 manufacturing plants and the, and that there's a value in piloting within a smaller area, some of the deeper approaches to changing ways of thinking and changing culture with the successes you have in those models.You have something to sell to the senior management, come and see this and see how much better they perform. So that's usually the kind of vision they have is that they have to somehow find a balance. And I have a slide that shows like, the balance of justice and they have to find a balance between the more mechanistic, quick, short term and superficial approach.Deep and a mile wide. And that's deploying the tools and then the more deep one inch wide, a mile deep, the more deep approach to developing people one by one that you would be doing with Kata. So they have to find a balance between those things, and they have to figure that out there through their own scientific thinking journey.They have to figure it out inside their company by trying things by experimenting. So I asked him instead of leaving here with a whole bunch of solutions. that you're going to bring and implement your company, think about one big challenge that would really make a difference. Your ability to deploy lean, sell lean and define that as a challenge.Then the next, what do you do next? And they said, well, we have to solve the problem. Okay. So how do you solve the problem? Do you go back there and say, we need standardized work. We need employ work groups that we saw at Toyota. And they said, no, those are solutions. We have to understand the current condition.First. That's a great, wonderful.[00:23:09] Joe Krebs: Back to scientific thinking.. This is awesome. Your book was initially the first edition came out as we said of. Several years ago, 2002 or something like that. Why do you think at least from the, from an agile perspective there's other terms floating around. I don't want to go into pick any, right, because it's not a complete list necessarily, but why do we.I see like a lack of of these terms actually like being used on a more broader level, right? You have sold so many books and people are looking at this and saying this is wonderful material, but the implementation, it seems to be slow in the transition. Like taking companies to lean or even in, in agile transformations, is it, do you think it has something to do with the the culture, like, like, for example, using Japanese terms or something like that?[00:24:01] Jeffrey Liker: Yeah, I don't think that so much. I mean, I think there is sometimes a sense that since this is a car company and you have a stereotype picture in your mind of what a car company does. And the first thing you often think about is the assembly line, where you have cars running down the assembly line and people are attaching things to the car.And you say, well, that doesn't look anything like what I do, so therefore, it doesn't apply to me. So there's a lot of that, you know, we're different. And it could be anything. It could be that we're a manufacturing company, but we make chemical products. It's not like cars going down the line. Or it could be that we're a finance company and we don't make any physical products.Or it could be that we work with a mining company that does iron ore mining in Australia and we go and we blast and we dig and we have this big batches of stuff. And how do we get to one piece flow? So, the the problem is that you have to shift your thinking from manufacturing. Mechanical solutions.Like I'm trying to look over here to get solutions that apply in an obvious way to me. You have to shift that thinking to there are some general principles here that have been abstract abstracted that I can then bring to my operations and the people who are well trained and lean or in Kata get very comfortable going into any new environment and not knowing What the solutions are, and then digging in and trying to understand the current condition of that operations.So this idea of I think the first easy thing to do is to copy solutions like a template. But if you give me a template, I'll just superimpose on my process and I know what to do. And the harder thing is to take a more abstract concept, like I need to define a challenge., even when I take my classes and I asked them to define a challenge, they struggle, you know, the challenges we want to have a culture of continuous improvement.Well, that's way too abstract. And then if they say, well, the challenges we would want, we'd like five suggestions per employee. That's way too specific. . So finding the right level of the challenge, you know, itself challenging challenges are thinking. And then what do you look at in the current condition?If it doesn't look like a Toyota plant where you can say it takes 60 seconds for each car and we can break down the steps of attaching window wiper into a reach that takes 2 seconds and, you know, They that's their current condition analysis. Your current condition analysis may be very different if you don't have a routine repeating process.But there are ways to understand the current condition in any sort of process. And even and I remember Deming saying that if you don't think you have a process, you can't improve anything. So, that even that idea that, you know, we develop software, and every software project is different. And the process is that we understand what the customer wants, and we do it.There's no process beyond that. You know, so that Just understanding there are processes, there are habits, there are routines that you have and you need to shine a light on them and understand them, and then figure out from where you are how to start to move in the direction. of the ideal model you have in your head.That, you know, it takes a, it takes thinking. Yeah. It's thinking is tiring. [00:27:36] Joe Krebs: Well, that's my recommendation to all of the listeners out there. When I went down the journey and extracted. By doing exactly what you just said, like looking at that material and extracting information saying like, okay, this is not about Toyota.This is not about this. This is about, you know, how would this apply a map to the agile world? I'm just calling it agile Kata out because of the making a dereferencing it to the Toyota. Brand, let's say in this particular case, but the thinking is the same in terms of the scientific thinking, but surrounding it with agile principles and, you know, [00:28:12] Jeffrey Liker: last thing I'd like to say is that as I dug into agile and you and I met.Menlo Innovations, which is kind of a benchmark for Agile and software development. And I looked at what they're doing there, which Richard Sheridan we're doing. And I saw lots of similarities to the Toyota way. And I saw also a lot of similarities to Toyota Kata. And I met, worked on Zingerman's mail order with Tom Root, who is one of the owners.He was originally an IT guy. So the backbone of the mail order business is the IT system. And what I discovered, and I've talked to you and I've talked to a lot of different IT people, what I discovered is that a lot of the concepts of scientific thinking are actually quite natural for programmers, you know, see, if I think in terms, if I say we need to think in terms of systems and how the parts interact, and I go into a manufacturing environment, they might think Treat me like I'm from another planet, but the software guy will say, of course, and then the idea that you have to have a vision for what the software is going to do and understand the customer.And then you have to break that down into small elements of some sort. Call them features, and then you need to develop one feature at a time and then compile them, make sure they work together as a system, and then build the next feature and compile it. And it's a step by step learning process, breaking the big problem into small pieces and then solving each problem one by one.That idea just you know, a software program said, how do you do it any other way? So the high level model of the Kata makes perfect sense. Within the world of software development, but how to do that in a sort of structured systematic way and make it part of the culture and natural.For example at Menlo Innovations, they do unit testing. And if I say unit testing to a software program and say, of course, we know what that is. Let's go and see your program and show me the unit test you've conducted. Exactly. And this kind of, yeah, and it's got to be hopefully more and more examples like this, right?Than than the one you're naming. And so I think somebody might be listening to this. Or reading the second edition of your book of the Toyota way might be building these bridges to whatever environment they are in, right? About in, in the Toyota way I do write about Menlo innovations. And so I, so that's another thing I did in the new edition is add more service examples and software examples and examples from other places, which I didn't have at the time I wrote the original book, I was just describing.So that's in the book. And it. The thinking way is still the same and one of the things that happened with Richard and to tell you the truth is that he started to get kind of turned off by a lot of the agile examples he was seeing, because they like the lean folks were often simply using a tool.Be that agile was almost equivalent to writing things on post it notes. Yeah, and he has all culture. He calls it deliberate culture. He had to develop the whole culture. Out of pairs, paired programming and programs learning from each other and sending what he calls technical anthropologists out to the customer to really deeply understand the Gemba and how they're using software and getting the customer in week by week, every single week to test the software and give feedback to the team.So there's a whole set of practices that he had to create as the standard for the culture of Menlo. That it took an awful lot of work and it was much more than buying a lot of post it notes. [00:32:08] Joe Krebs: Yes, and maybe that was one of the reasons why he decided when we all agreed on we're going to meet in Ann Arbor and it was in September 23 we'll all come together and it was Mike it was you and several others and Richard Sheridan was the first one who says and count me in and I'm offering my office space for this because it's so important.[00:32:25] Jeffrey Liker: So yeah, well he yeah so he didn't understand Kata at first but then I understood it. And he said, yeah, that's pretty much what we do. Isn't it? Then he had to, you know, he then added some things to what they do because they weren't working in a deliberate way using the scientific approach of kind, but the overarching way that they worked and developed all their software was very much the vision, current state, right down to small pieces, solve one problem after another with very quick feedback.Correct feedback, then get it to work. One of the interesting things about Menlo innovations projects, cause they're developing customer software, none of it's off the shelf. And they, if they do a one year project in the 52nd week, the only thing they have to get right is one week of work because 51 weeks of work works perfectly.So there's basically zero, almost zero rework and they have a hundred percent customer satisfaction. The customer takes the software out of the box and they just start using it.. [00:33:37] Joe Krebs: I want to thank you Jeff for some insights on the second edition of the Toyota Way. If the second edition is It's only somewhat successful as the first edition in terms of sales of books.Thousands of books will be sold and thousands of readers out there will be exposed to scientific thinking and it's a good thing through your materials. I want to thank you for that. And also, yeah, just like, to everybody out there, if you are interested go to the show pages, I'm going to list Jeff's books and obviously ways of learning about Kata in a way to apply that in the agile context, I have some additional pointers here of where to go, what to do first and second, and obviously the Kata Bookshelf is growing thanks to you, Jeff, too, and and many more ways to learn about scientific thinking.Thank you, Jeff. [00:34:27] Jeffrey Liker: You're welcome. It's my pleasure, Joe. Take care then.

Heidi Helfand is the author of Dynamic Reteaming, which outlines practical strategies for orchestrating successful team and company org changes. Her work is informed by more than 20 years in the tech industry at notable companies like AppFolio, Procore, and Expertcity/GoToMeeting. Today, she dedicates her efforts to sharing her knowledge through workshops, comprehensive courses, and consultative services, helping organizations navigate and optimize their team structures. In this episode, we discuss:• The importance of reteaming and reorging• The benefits of embracing reteaming• The five patterns of reteaming: one by one, grow and split, merging, isolation, and switching• Examples of successful reteaming• Why stable teams are not always ideal• How change can lead to great career opportunities• The RIDE framework for decision-making• Advice on how to set up isolated teams for success• The anti-patterns of reteaming and the challenges that can arise• Tactical tips for becoming a better listener—Brought to you by:• Productroadmap.ai—AI to connect your roadmaps to revenue• Hex—Helping teams ask and answer data questions by working together• Ahrefs—Improve your website's SEO for free—Find the transcript for this episode and all past episodes at: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/episodes/. Today's transcript will be live by 8 a.m. PT.—Where to find Heidi Helfand:• X: https://twitter.com/heidihelfand• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/heidihelfand/• Website: https://www.heidihelfand.com/—Where to find Lenny:• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com• X: https://twitter.com/lennysan• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/—In this episode, we cover:(00:00) Heidi's background(03:40) How Heidi got involved with reteaming and reorgs(07:37) Advice for people dealing with reorgs(11:56) The benefits of change and the RIDE framework(17:11) The five patterns of reteaming(20:00) The power of isolation(27:38) Advice on how to be successful by isolating small teams(33:27) Supporting and protecting internal startups(34:33) The one-by-one pattern(36:44) The grow and split pattern(39:20) The merging pattern(42:14) The switching pattern(50:18) Anti-patterns of reteaming(52:49) Embracing change and growth(58:48) How to become a better listener(01:01:28) Lightning round—Referenced:• Dynamic Reteaming: The Art and Wisdom of Changing Teams: https://www.amazon.com/Dynamic-Reteaming-Wisdom-Changing-Teams/dp/1492061298• O'Reilly: https://www.oreilly.com/• Procore Technologies: https://www.procore.com/• Kristian Lindwall on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/kristianlindwall/• Chris Smith on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/chrissmithagile• Transitions: Making Sense of Life's Changes: https://www.amazon.com/Transitions-Making-Changes-Revised-Anniversary/dp/073820904X• Pat Wadors on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/patwadors/• The Four Steps to the Epiphany: Successful Strategies for Products That Win: https://www.amazon.com/Four-Steps-Epiphany-Successful-Strategies/dp/1119690358• GoToMyPC: https://get.gotomypc.com/• Teamwork: https://www.amazon.com/Teamwork-Right-Wrong-Interpersonal-Communication/dp/0803932901• AppFolio: https://www.appfolio.com/• SecureDocs: https://www.securedocs.com/• Citrix: https://www.citrix.com/• The Culture Code: The Secrets of Highly Successful Groups: https://www.amazon.com/Culture-Code-Secrets-Highly-Successful/dp/0804176981• Tuckman's stages of group development: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tuckman%27s_stages_of_group_development• Rich Sheridan on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/menloprez/ • Menlo Innovations: https://menloinnovations.com/• Drive: The Surprising Truth About What Motivates Us: https://www.amazon.com/Drive-Surprising-Truth-About-Motivates/dp/1594484805• Toyota Kata: Managing People for Improvement, Adaptiveness and Superior Results: https://www.amazon.com/Toyota-Kata-Managing-Improvement-Adaptiveness/dp/0071635238• Paulo Freire: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paulo_Freire• Jon Walker on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jwalker/• Managing Corporate Lifecycles: https://www.amazon.com/Managing-Corporate-Lifecycles-Ichak-Adizes/dp/9381860548• The Adizes Institute: https://www.adizes.com/• John Cutler on Lenny's Podcast: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/what-differentiates-the-highest-performing-product-teams-john-cutler-amplitude-the-beautiful-mes/• Co-Active Training Institute: https://coactive.com/• Co-Active Coaching: The proven framework for transformative conversations at work and in life: https://www.amazon.com/Co-Active-Coaching-Fourth-transformative-conversations/dp/1473674980• Creating Intelligent Teams: https://www.amazon.com/Creating-Intelligent-teams-Anne-R%C3%B8d/dp/186922583X• The Surprising Power of Liberating Structures: Simple Rules to Unleash a Culture of Innovation: https://www.amazon.com/Surprising-Power-Liberating-Structures-Innovation/dp/0615975305• Facilitator's Guide to Participatory Decision-Making: https://www.amazon.com/Facilitators-Participatory-Decision-Making-Jossey-bass-Management/dp/1118404955• The Bear on Hulu: https://www.hulu.com/series/the-bear-05eb6a8e-90ed-4947-8c0b-e6536cbddd5f—Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.—Lenny may be an investor in the companies discussed. Get full access to Lenny's Newsletter at www.lennysnewsletter.com/subscribe

DETAILS | Chief Joy Officer Rich Sheridan reminds us of a somber reality: many lead lives of quiet desperation AT WORK and go to their graves with a song still in their hearts. But it doesn't have to be this way. We dive into Rich's powerful journey from despair to profound inspiration. Like many of us, he chased the wrong career success metrics; it wasn't working, and he knew he had to change himself. Rich has deep empathy and wisdom for professionals, asking the same powerful questions he asked: What do I want out of my career?  Why don't the traditional definitions of success and achievement make me happy? Given all that has happened, what needs to change to get to the next best version of me and my career? For over a decade, from the heart of Menlo to global stages, and through his bestsellers, "Joy, Inc." and "Chief Joy Officer," Rich has been illuminating a potent message: Everyone deserves to experience Joy at work, and we can build a workplace that people love! We explore joy as a tangible metric, how to define and measure Joy at work, the characteristics of a joyful leader, the power of running experiments, and how to lead with inspiration instead of fear. GUEST | Richard Sheridan—entrepreneur, business leader, and author—is best known as the co-founder, CEO, and “Chief Storyteller” of Menlo Innovations, a software and IT consulting firm that has earned numerous awards, acclaim, and press for its innovative and positive workplace culture. Rich's bestselling books Joy Inc: How We Built a Workplace People Love and Chief Joy Officer have inspired tens of thousands, and his message of joyful leadership has been featured in press outlets ranging from Inc, Forbes, and New York magazines to Bloomberg, U.S. News & World Report, NPR's On Point podcast, NPR's All Things Considered, and the Harvard Business Review. Rich was inducted into the Shingo Academy in 2022 for his work supporting the principles of organizational excellence. OVERVIEW | Are you ready to ADAPT and REINVENT YOURSELF for the most disrupted and digital workforce in history? What would it feel like to belong and not get stuck? It is estimated over 1 billion people will need reskilling by 2030, and more than 300 million jobs will be impacted by AI  — work, identity, and what it means to be human are rapidly changing. Join hosts Nate Thompson and Alex Schwartz and the TOP VOICES in the Future of Work to uncover how to meet this dynamic new reality driven by AI, hybrid work, societal shifts, and our increasingly digital world. Discover why a Future of Work Mindset is your key to prepare, navigate, and thrive! We are grateful you are here, and welcome to the TDW Tribe! www.thedisruptedworkforce.com

It's episode 95 and the highlight is Tracy & Elisabeth's interview with Rich Sheridan, the CEO and Chief Storyteller at Menlo Innovations. Rich's ingeniously Lean-incognito workplace sparks joy in all who enter. Menlo recovered from Covid with their best year to date, and Rich explains why. For Hot Apps, the AI exploration continues. This time it's some free help with project presentations. And for Q&A it's the Praise Paradox. We all want to be acknowledged, but we don't often see ourselves as the source of praise for others. Why is that, and what can we do about it?   0:00 - Intro 01:23 - What's on the Menu? 02:32 - Hot Apps SlidesAI.io (Chrome Extension) 10:09 - Q&A "How do you handle the Praise Paradox?" 19:58 - Featured Guest Rich Sheridan 46:46 - Upcoming Events New Workshop 10/24: "Value Stream Mapping Unleashed" October Webinar 10/19: "Causal Reasoning: Lean Special Sauce for Root Cause Analysis" New Bestselling Book, "Picture Yourself A Leader" New Lean Parody Video, "Baby Got Tools!"   Thanks for Listening!   Listen to more podcasts at JITCafe.com.   Link to the video version of this podcast: https://www.jitcafe.com/post/running-the-experiments-at-menlo-innovations-with-rich-sheridan   Find us on: - Apple Podcasts - Podbean - Spotify - RSS Feed: https://feed.podbean.com/JITCafe/feed.xml

Are you ready to elevate your business success by harnessing the power of collaboration? In this episode, we sat down with Rich Sheridan, CEO of Menlo Innovations to understand how he has driven Menlo Innovations to success through teamwork and innovation. Tune in to this episode to discover: Actionable strategies to transform your workplace into a hub of teamwork and innovation. Insight into Menlo Innovations' collaborative approach and how you can apply similar principles to boost efficiency, quality, and innovation within your workplace. Real-world examples of successful collaboration across various industries. Check out our blog for more ways to improve the impact of your experience strategy for your customer and company.  

Join us on the latest episode of our podcast as we sit down with Richard Sheridan, an extraordinary entrepreneur, author, CEO, and Chief Storyteller of Menlo Innovations. Richard shares valuable insights into transforming the way we do business, eliminating managerial weaknesses, fostering efficient communication, and building trust with customers. Discover how Menlo Innovations has created a work environment where software emergencies are rare, enabling employees to enjoy their work and deliver exceptional results. Don't miss this enlightening conversation with a true visionary in the industry. https://theleaneffectpodcast.com/ https://www.facebook.com/TheLeanEffectPodcast https://www.facebook.com/groups/272448766629082/ https://www.linkedin.com/company/the-lean-effect-podcast/ Insta: @theleaneffectpodcast Twitter @EffectLean Guest: Richard Sheridan https://www.linkedin.com/in/menloprez/ rsheridan@menloinnovations.com Host: Mark Dejong: https://www.linkedin.com/in/mark-de-jong-investor-lean-advisor-0288695/ Mark@4ppartners.ca https://www.4ppartners.ca Phone: 1-778-807-9691  

Episode page with transcript, video, and more My guest for Episode #220 of the My Favorite Mistake podcast is Rich Sheridan, the co-founder, CEO, and “Chief Storyteller” of Menlo Innovations, a software and IT consulting firm that has earned numerous awards and press coverage for its innovative and positive workplace culture. He's the author of two books — first,  Joy, Inc.: How We Built a Workplace People Love, and then his latest, published in 2019, Chief Joy Officer: How Great Leaders Elevate Human Energy and Eliminate Fear. I've interviewed Rich twice in my “Lean Blog Interviews” podcast, we've crossed paths at conferences, and I've been able to visit the Menlo Innovations office in Ann Arbor (2014). In this episode, Rich shares two favorite mistake stories from his time as a senior leader at a previous company. Why did one mistake change his life? How did the second mistake help him put himself in the CEO's shoes? Rich also kindly endorsed my new book: “At Menlo Innovations, one of our favorite phrases is ‘Make Mistakes Faster!' It's not that we like making mistakes, we just prefer making small mistakes quickly rather than BIG mistakes slowly. The difference comes from creating a culture where we are safe to share our mistakes. In The Mistakes That Make Us, author Mark Graban teaches all of us how to do this and shares story after real story of the benefits. It would be a BIG mistake to ignore this wisdom!” Questions and Topics: Why the title “chief storyteller?” How do you define “joy” in the workplace? What's your role as CEO in helping others find joy or be joyful? Joy vs. happiness? Deming connections: pride, fear Why is eliminating fear so important to you and Menlo? You say, “one of your favorite phrases at Menlo Innovations is ‘Make Mistakes Faster!” — tell us more about that…  “Fear makes bad news go into hiding…” “Let's run the experiment” — tell us more, “try stuff and see if it works” Being open to small mistakes as a way to avoid big ones? An experiment in working with you? “Without the stories, Menlo doesn't make sense” Paired work Please follow, rate, and review via Apple Podcasts, Podchaser, or your favorite app — that helps others find this content, and you'll be sure to get future episodes as they are released weekly. You can also financially support the show through Spotify. You can now sign up to get new episodes via email, to make sure you don't miss an episode. This podcast is part of the Lean Communicators network. --- Support this podcast: https://podcasters.spotify.com/pod/show/favorite-mistake/support

Staff and employee annual reviews help assess where teams need additional help, guidance and development. If only they weren't so painful...Enter Menlo Innovations, an IT consulting firm and custom software development firm that appears to have found a better way to analyze team performance and deliver constructive feedback.

In this episode, Rich Sheridan and I discuss the impacts of implementing a culture of storytelling. What You'll Learn: 1. Why are you called the Chief Storyteller at Menlo? 2. Why is storytelling such an important part of your company's culture? 3. What kinds of stories are relevant to tell? 4. How do you curate stories? 5. How do you build a storytelling culture? About the Guest:  Rich Sheridan, CEO and Chief Storyteller at Menlo Innovations, is a successful entrepreneur and author of two best-selling books—Joy Inc.: How We Built Workplace People Love and Chief Joy Officer: How Great Leaders Elevate Human Energy and Eliminate Fear. Rich's passion for inspiring organizations to create their own joy-filled cultures has led him to address audiences across the world—through four continents and 18 countries (and counting) as well as throughout the United States. Links: Click here to learn more about Rich Sheridan Click Here to learn more about Menlo Innovations Click here for more information on Rich Sheridan's books Click here for The Lean Solutions Summit  --- Support this podcast: https://podcasters.spotify.com/pod/show/leansolutions/support

Wow, it is that time of year again and both of your hosts (Just Nate and DK) are both on vacation again at the same time and they could not find the time record a new episode this week.  So they did what they do best and had a conversation about one of their favorite guests from this year.   Listen in as your hosts "Just Nate", Dennis K along with guest speaker Chris E talk to the CEO and Chief Story Teller of Menlo Innovations, Richard Sheridan.  The Smalls team is a huge fan of Rich and everything that Menlo stands for.  The team talks through all the ups and downs that Menlo Innovations have had in order to break the mold and how they created a joyful place to work.  Menlo's mission is:  "End human suffering in the world as it relates to technology.®"  Rich tells stories throughout this nearly hour long podcast as he talks about how they were all focused on delighting others with the work of our hears, our hands and our minds.  Rich states the key to success and how they have been so successful is they set out to make a culture where your more likely to take action than to take a meeting. A key to Rich's success is he had a different goal than most.  His goal was to try to succeed, where others goal is to try not to fail.  Don't let failure get in your way, run the experiment and if it don't work, try something else and learn from the mistake. It sounds simple, Create a Intentional Culture! We can't suggest Rich's books enough, you can find them at nearly any books store or online, see links to both books below from Amazon. Joy Inc. - https://www.amazon.com/Joy-Inc-Built-Workplace-People/dp/1591845874/ref=sxts_sxwds-bia-wc-rsf1_0?cv_ct_cx=joy+inc.&dchild=1&keywords=joy+inc.&pd_rd_i=1591845874&pd_rd_r=d686b69d-d465-4f2e-a0fb-6e8c751ccfed&pd_rd_w=pNf5t&pd_rd_wg=S9ISd&pf_rd_p=e0f994a8-a359-40a9-8917-dadca71c7184&pf_rd_r=QSASTN1ZB45FCMCXDMAK&psc=1&qid=1610928792&sr=1-1-526ea17f-3f73-4b50-8cd8-6acff948fa5a Chief Joy Officer - https://www.amazon.com/Chief-Joy-Officer-Leaders-Eliminate-ebook/dp/B07B2KHQCS/ref=sr_1_4?dchild=1&keywords=joy+inc.&qid=1610928832&sr=8-4 Listen in to the other podcast that Rich mentions the Bossless Office by Tom Ashbrook.  -  https://www.wbur.org/onpoint/2013/06/20/bossless-office Read the article that Rich mentions from New York Magazine by Matthew Shaer, The Boss Stops Here  -  https://nymag.com/news/features/bossless-jobs-2013-6/ To find out more about Rich and his team at Menlo Innovations check them out on the web.  https://menloinnovations.com/ To hire Rich to come speak at your event you can book him here:  https://richardsheridan.com/ From the team here at "The SmallsCast Podcast", thank you Rich, it truly was an honor and pleasure having you on the show! To find out more about the Smalls or become a member, please check us out at www.thesmalls.org To contact Just Nate:  justnate@thesmalls.org  — Send in a voice message: https://anchor.fm/thesmalls/message Support this podcast: https://anchor.fm/thesmalls/support www.patreon.com/thesmalls --- Send in a voice message: https://podcasters.spotify.com/pod/show/thesmalls/message Support this podcast: https://podcasters.spotify.com/pod/show/thesmalls/support

Dave was joined by Rich Sheridan, CEO and Chief Storyteller at Menlo Innovations, Speaker, and Author of "Chief Joy Officer" and "Joy, Inc." at the NEHRA 2022 Conference in this live edition of The Hennessy Report. Rich describes the truly unique culture at Menlo, with leaders traveling from around the world to tour their workspace and hear the team's stories. Whether it's working in teams of two on one computer, managing and conducting performance reviews with no "managers" but as a group, or pitting candidates towards each other rather than against - judged on how they support their rival - Rich paints a culture of true joy. You don't want to miss this unique episode of The Hennessy Report. Tune in now!

Conference Keynote Speaker Rich Sheridan, CEO and chief storyteller at Menlo Innovations, speaks with IISE's Frank Reddy about the experience of attending the Lean Six Sigma & Data Science Conference 2022, Sept. 19-21 at the Hyatt Regency Perimeter in Atlanta. Follow #Lean6Data2022 on your favorite social media platforms to keep up with all the conference activity.

Menlo Innovations is a software development company that has been around for 21 years. As the CEO and Co-Founder, Richard Sheridan travels the world telling people about what his company does. They are not an ordinary tech company, their mission is to bring joy to the tech world and end suffering as it relates to technology. They have discovered and built an amazing culture that grasps human energy because they believe in 'running the experiment'. Rich has authored two excellent books, Joy Inc. and Cheif Joy Officer, wherein he tells the story of Menlo innovations. You will want to hear the stories Rich shares and learn from what he has done with his company over the past two decades. This is a must-listen!

Episode page, video, transcript, and more My guest for Episode #448 of the Lean Blog Interviews Podcast is Rich Sheridan, co-founder, CEO and “Chief Storyteller” of Menlo Innovations, a software and IT consulting firm that has earned numerous awards and press coverage for its innovative and positive workplace culture. He's a returning guest from Episode 189 back in 2014 — the same year that I had a chance to visit the Menlo Innovations office. We talked then about his first book Joy, Inc.: How We Built a Workplace People Love. His latest book, published in 2019, is Chief Joy Officer: How Great Leaders Elevate Human Energy and Eliminate Fear. Rich is giving a keynote talk, “Lead With Joy and Watch Your Team Fly!”, at the Michigan Lean Consortium annual conference, being held August 10-11 in Traverse City. I'll be there and I hope you'll join us. Today, we discuss topics and questions including: For those who didn't hear the first episode, how would you summarize “The Menlo Way”? And how has “the Menlo Way” evolved over the past 8 years? Why is “eliminating fear” so important and what drains joy from the workplace? “Tired programmers make bad software” Sustainable work pace Paired work – Erika and Lisa Individual performance reviews? “We've eliminated bosses” — nobody to review you, the team gives feedback, develops growth plan “Let's run the experiment” Toyota talks about the need for humble leaders — why is humility such an important trait? Do you hire for humility or try to screen out those without much humility? No longer say “we hire for culture fit” “Not an interview, an audition” Leadership lessons from the pandemic– 4 blog posts In “Chief Joy Officer” you write about the proverbial “mask” that leaders feel pressured to wear… masking how we really feel. Were you able to be your authentic whole self at work, fears and all, during the early stages of the pandemic? “Scared and panicked” – was it OK to share that with the team? “They're all adapting” – as a result of everything we've been doing for 19 years The podcast is sponsored by Stiles Associates, now in their 30th year of business. They are the go-to Lean recruiting firm serving the manufacturing, private equity, and healthcare industries. Learn more. This podcast is part of the #LeanCommunicators network. 

On this THL Refresher, we bring you the first interview we did with Richard Sheridan, the CEO and Chief Storyteller of Menlo Innovations. Menlo is a company that builds custom software, whose mission is to “end human suffering in the world as it relates to technology.” Like Barry-Wehmiller, Menlo has a unique culture which they want to share with the world.  We call it Truly Human Leadership, they call it “the business value of joy.” Rich talks with us about leadership, Menlo and his book, "Joy Inc."

"When the work of your heart, your hands, and your mind is done to serve others with delight, that is joy."  That is the mantra of Rich Sheridan, Co-Founder of Menlo Innovations, a software development company that is known the world over for its intentionally joyful culture.   In this episode, your host, Andy Goram talks to the international speaker and best-selling author of Joy Inc., and Chief Joy Officer about what it takes to create an intentionally joyful culture. But don't be fooled by the word joy.  This isn't a lesson in how to be more happy-clappy at work.  Far from it.  This is about working hard, as a team, with a clear sense of purpose and an empowering spirit of experimentation and trust. ----more---- Join The Conversation Find Andy Goram on LinkedIn here Follow the Podcast on Instagram here Follow the Podcast on Twitter here Check out the Bizjuicer website here Check out the Bizjuicer blog here Download the podcast here ----more---- Useful Links Follow Rich Sherdian on LinkedIn here Follow Menlo Innovations on LinkedIn here Follow Rich Sheridan on Twitter here Follow Menlo Innovations on Twitter here Follow Menlo Innovations on Instagram here Check out the Menlo Innovations website here Check out the Menlo Innovations blog here Find Rich's book Joy Inc. here Find Rich's book Chief Joy Officer here Find John Naisbitt's book Megatrands (1982) here Find Kent Beck's updated book Extreme Programming here ----more---- Full Episode Transcript Get the full transcript of the episode here

Rich Sheridan has published two books on the concept of bringing joy to the workplace. After an illustrious career, Rich has focused his personal activity on the development of culture and people. As a result, they've been able to hire 22 new employees during the pandemic while losing only 4. Listen in to glean insights on the ways Menlo Innovations obsessive compulsion with culture has allowed this marketplace leading position.

Join Drew & Sam as they bring CEO, Chief Storyteller, and co-founder of Menlo Innovations, Richard Sheridan. Author of two great books, including Chief Joy Officer that we will discuss next episode, Richard explains how he is so full of joy. The best part? He explains how he has spread that joy and how you can do it too! Whether it's pizza or programming Joy can drive your team. Speaking of pizzas, learn Richards favorite toppings, hint he believes in “run the experiment” so pepperoni may not make it.

In this episode, Richard Sheridan, Entrepreneur, author, CEO, Chief Storyteller, and co-founder of Menlo Innovations, discusses the software equation of lean. He highlighted how systems with short communication and feedback loops perform better. Rich discussed how they created the culture in Menlo, where 20,000 people from across the world have been in the last two years to learn about their magical culture. https://theleaneffectpodcast.com/ https://www.facebook.com/TheLeanEffectPodcast https://www.facebook.com/groups/272448766629082/ https://www.linkedin.com/company/the-lean-effect-podcast/ Insta: @theleaneffectpodcast Twitter @EffectLean Guest: Richard Sheridan https://www.linkedin.com/in/menloprez/ rsheridan@menloinnovations.com   Host: Mark Dejong: https://www.linkedin.com/in/mark-de-jong-investor-lean-advisor-0288695/ Mark@4ppartners.ca https://www.4ppartners.ca Phone: 1-778-807-9691  

This week's guest is Richard Sheridan. Ron and Rich discussed Rich's two books, Joy, Inc. and Chief Joy Officer. Rich also shared what qualities he thinks make a good leader. An MP3 audio version of this episode is available for download here. In this episode you'll learn:  The quote that inspires Rich (3:01) Rich's background (7:22) About Joy, Inc. (10:01) The importance of humility (14:04) What Rich would change (20:24) A story about Borders books (30:31) Advice for facing uncertainty (32:35) What Rich hopes people will say at his funeral (38:15) Podcast Resources Right Click to Download this Podcast as an MP3 Rich on LinkedIn Joy, Inc. on Amazon Chief Joy Officer on Amazon Menlo Innovations GA 003 | Learn What Joyfulness and Lean Thinking Have in Common with Richard Sheridan GA 070 | Menlo Innovations with Richard Sheridan GA 213 | How to Lead with Joy with Richard Sheridan GA 300 | Leadership, Teamwork, and Taking Flight with Richard Sheridan What Do You Think? What other characteristics should a leader have?

How can we create a workplace people love? In fact, most of the challenges faced by organizations today, are not technology-related rather they are human problems. So, the question is- How do we organize humans more effectively?This time on The xMonks Drive, Richard Sheridan co-founder and CEO of Menlo Innovations, joins us to explain how humans impact organizations.Richard Sheridan is a co-founder, CEO, and "Chief Storyteller" of Menlo Innovations, a software and IT consulting firm that has received multiple awards and news coverage for its innovative and positive working culture.Richard, the CEO of Menlo Innovations, became disillusioned in the course of his career in the tumultuous technology world. He was consumed by a single thought: things could be better. Much, much better. He had to figure something out. Why can't a workplace be brimming with friendship, human vitality, creativity, and efficiency?Rich co-founded Menlo Innovations in 2001 with the goal of putting an end to workplace hardship. Rich's passion for building happy workplaces inspired him to write Joy, Inc.: How We Built a Workplace People Love, which became a best-selling and generally acclaimed book. His second book, Chief Joy Officer, proves that a pleasant and engaging leadership style is genuinely beneficial to a company's bottom line.

Today's episode features a compilation from two leaders in the B2B industry who decided to grow their company through focused CX efforts, while placing a strong importance on team and employee development. You'll hear from Andy Schulkind, the VP of CX at Domino North America, and Rich Sheridan, CEO of Menlo Innovations. Both leaders place a high value on developing a trained, supported, and efficient internal workforce which serves as a strong foundation for delivering great customer experience.

We welcome Rich Sheridan, Chief Storyteller for Menlo Innovations and author of "Chief Joy Officer" and "Joy, Inc.".  This is how transformation takes place.  When a leader learns from mistakes, gets out of the way, and empowers the amazing people that are part of their organization, that's when remarkable things happen.  Consider this a component of how to reinvent the workplace.Click HERE to find Rich's book "Chief Joy Officer"Click HERE to find Rich's book "Joy, Inc."Have a BOSSHOLE STORY of your own?  Click HERE to inquire about being on the podcast!HERE ARE MORE RESOURCES FROM REAL GOOD VENTURES:Never miss a good opportunity to learn from a bad boss...Click HERE to get your very own Reference Profile.  We use The Predictive Index as our analytics platform so you know it's validated and reliable.  Your Reference Profile informs you of your needs, behaviors, and the nuances of what we call your Behavioral DNA.  It also explains your work style, your strengths, and even the common traps in which you may find yourself.  It's a great tool to share with friends, family, and co-workers.Follow us on Twitter HERE and make sure to share with your network!Provide your feedback HERE, please!  We love to hear from our listeners and welcome your thoughts and ideas about how to improve the podcast and even suggest topics and ideas for future episodes.Visit us at www.realgoodventures.com.  We are a Talent Optimization consultancy specializing in people and business execution analytics.  Real Good Ventures was founded by Sara Best and John Broer who are both Certified Talent Optimization Consultants with over 50 years of combined consulting and organizational performance experience.  Sara is also certified in EQi and a member of the CAPA Pro membership network supported by The Table Group.  RGV is also a Certified Partner of Line-of-Sight, a powerful organizational health and execution platform.  RGV is known for its work in leadership development, executive coaching, and what we call organizational rebuild where we bring all our tools together to diagnose an organization's present state and how to grow toward a stronger future state. 

Ron Quartel's roots in extreme programming lead him to develop FAST Agile (fluid scaling technology), where people form a marketplace around the work. We talk about FAST Agile and the 2 year experiment he ran using it and why the team decided to discontinue it. He shares why he loves 10% time, hackathons and Open Space; and how T-shaped colleagues grow through the give and take of both mentoring and coaching. Lastly, he challenges us with an idea for modernizing the pair programming model (popularized at Menlo Innovations) to incorporate more freedom. About Ron: https://www.fastagile.io/home (Fluid Scaling Technology) https://ronquartel.medium.com/ @FSTAgile Resources mentioned: INSPIRED: How to Create Tech Products Custoners Love by Marty Cagan https://svpg.com/inspired-how-to-create-products-customers-love/ The Lean Startup by Eric Ries http://theleanstartup.com/

In today's episode, we discuss joy in the workplace with Rich Sheridan of Menlo Innovations. Listen in to learn why culture is such an important piece of attracting and retaining top talent. Rich and Bryan talk about the benefits of an intentionally joyful culture, and how it can help build relationships and grow businesses. Guest: Rich SheridanCEO and Chief StorytellerMenlo Innovationshttps://www.linkedin.com/in/menloprez/Host: Bryan Powrozekhttps://claytonmckervey.com/employee/bryan-powrozek-cpa-cgma-mba/Denise Askerhttps://claytonmckervey.com/employee/denise-j-asker-iom-mm/

In the season 3 opener, host Corey Mohn is joined by Chief Storyteller & CEO of Menlo Innovations, Richard Sheridan. Richard is not stranger to the CAPS community and he joins the podcast after making a high impact on our Summer Bash participants. In addition to being an entrepreneur, Richard tells the stories of his company and the people who make it powerful. This episode is the perfect kick-off to our season - this discussion gets at the heart of what we do: making education exciting, transformative and future ready.Richard Sheridan is a sought after author and public speaker. If you are interested in asking him to speak to your group, you can find more information at richardsheridan.com. You can also learn more about Menlo Innovations in Ann Arbor, MI by taking their virtual tour at Menlo Innovations Tour.The Network team is crazy about Richard's books: Chief Joy Officer and Joy, Inc. These books dive into several of the topics Corey and Richard talk about during this episode.Our new podcast music comes from: Forever by MusicbyAden https://soundcloud.com/musicbyadenCreative Commons — Attribution-ShareAlike 3.0 Unported — CC BY-SA 3.0Free Download / Stream: https://bit.ly/forever-musicbyadenMusic promoted by Audio Library https://youtu.be/CRknG2QC2mc

This week I'm talking with Richard Sheridan, the co-founder of Menlo Innovations where his team's mission is to end human suffering in the workplace. Richard is also the author of Joy, Inc. - How We Built a Workplace People Love and Chief Joy Officer. In this episode, Rich and I talk about his company Menlo Innovations and the importance of having a balanced and satisfying work culture, including how you can bring about a culture change in your own organization. What You'll Learn This Episode: Menlo Innovations and the process of finding and training Menlonians Teaching culture internally and externally Pairing- What it is and how it's done How pairing helps the customer How to start a culture change in your organization About the Guest: Menlo Innovations CEO Rich Sheridan became disillusioned in the middle of his career in the chaotic technology industry. He had an all-consuming thought…things can be better. Much better. He had to find a way. Why couldn't a workplace be filled with camaraderie, human energy, creativity, and productivity? Ultimately, Rich co-founded Menlo Innovations in 2001 to end human suffering in the workplace. His unique approach to custom software creation is so surprisingly different, that 3,000 people a year travel from around the world just to see how they do it. His passion for creating joyful work environments led to his bestselling and widely celebrated book, Joy, Inc. - How We Built a Workplace People Love. His highly anticipated second book, Chief Joy Officer, came out December 4, 2018 and will continue to prove that a positive and engaging leadership style is actually good for business. Important Links: https://menloinnovations.com/ https://richardsheridan.com/ --- Support this podcast: https://anchor.fm/leansolutions/support

It was an incredible joy (pun intended) to chat with Richard Sheridan in this episode. His books, Joy, Inc. and Chief Joy Officer  have been an incredible inspiration to me on my own leadership journey, and his friendship even more so. In this episode, we talk about the Great Reckoning of 2021,  the perspectives and fears of leaders, the joy that is found in uncertainty, and more. You don't want to miss this one! Disclaimer: : As an Amazon Associate I earn from qualifying purchases. Support the show

Up next on Pass the Secret Sauce, we have Richard Sheridan ─ the CEO, co-founder and Chief Storyteller at Menlo Innovations - a custom software design and development company in Ann Arbor, Michigan. His unique approach to custom software creation is so surprisingly different, that 3,000 people a year travel from around the world just to see how they do it. He has a passion for creating joyful work environments which led to his bestselling and widely celebrated book, Joy, Inc. - How We Built a Workplace People Love.  His highly anticipated second book, Chief Joy Officer will continue to prove that a positive and engaging leadership style is actually good for business. In this episode we discuss: Richard's favorite books that gave him hope in his career  [4:40] How his upbringing influences his way of communicating with people  [6:20] Writing his first two-line program that won an international programming contest  [8:30] The catalyst that made Richard leap into starting his own company  [13:00] The major problem in the software industry ─  the tower of knowledge problem  [19:00] Teaching cultural norms to their workforce; where the concept came from  [21:00] The productivity level of people working together [24:55] How much they spent on the unique process of their workforce [28:30] Making demonstrable software for clients every five days  [30:45] Types of clients they worked with  [32:10] Challenges they typically face in their workforce [36:30] Books  authored by Richard ─ Joy, Inc., Chief Joy Officer [38:45] How does the remote process look like [40:20] Quotable Quotes A high-performing team creates lasting value on a software project. It's isn't the efficiency of the programmers; it's about the effectiveness of the results that those programmers create   Links to sources and tools Get to know Rich: richardsheridan.com Virtually' visit the Menlo Software Factory - we offer free virtual tours weekly Learn more at menloinnovations.com Stream other PTSS episodes: TECH Thanks for listening. Don't forget to like us on Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/passthesecretsauce to get updates on new episodes. If you haven't already, please follow and leave a review for our podcast, we'll really appreciate it. And as always, don't forget to pass the secret sauce. Support our podcast If you're a fan of the show, there are three simple things you can do to support our work: Subscribe, rate and review: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/pass-the-secret-sauce-by-matt-shields/id1506940483 the podcast on iTunes or wherever you subscribe. Tell a family member, friend, or colleague about the show. Subscribe to us on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCJ5eItxsGWyGKC91zd1pzbA and follow us on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/pass-the-secret-sauce-podcast This podcast is hosted by

Wow, it is that time of year again and both of your hosts (Just Nate and DK) are both on vacation again at the same time and they could not find the time record a new episode this week. So they did what they do best and had a conversation about one of their favorite guests from this year. Listen in as your hosts "Just Nate", Dennis K along with guest speaker Chris E talk to the CEO and Chief Story Teller of Menlo Innovations, Richard Sheridan. The Smalls team is a huge fan of Rich and everything that Menlo stands for. The team talks through all the ups and downs that Menlo Innovations have had in order to break the mold and how they created a joyful place to work. Menlo's mission is: "End human suffering in the world as it relates to technology.®" Rich tells stories throughout this nearly hour long podcast as he talks about how they were all focused on delighting others with the work of our hears, our hands and our minds. Rich states the key to success and how they have been so successful is they set out to make a culture where your more likely to take action than to take a meeting. A key to Rich's success is he had a different goal than most. His goal was to try to succeed, where others goal is to try not to fail. Don't let failure get in your way, run the experiment and if it don't work, try something else and learn from the mistake. It sounds simple, Create a Intentional Culture! We can't suggest Rich's books enough, you can find them at nearly any books store or online, see links to both books below from Amazon. Joy Inc. - https://www.amazon.com/Joy-Inc-Built-Workplace-People/dp/1591845874/ref=sxts_sxwds-bia-wc-rsf1_0?cv_ct_cx=joy+inc.&dchild=1&keywords=joy+inc.&pd_rd_i=1591845874&pd_rd_r=d686b69d-d465-4f2e-a0fb-6e8c751ccfed&pd_rd_w=pNf5t&pd_rd_wg=S9ISd&pf_rd_p=e0f994a8-a359-40a9-8917-dadca71c7184&pf_rd_r=QSASTN1ZB45FCMCXDMAK&psc=1&qid=1610928792&sr=1-1-526ea17f-3f73-4b50-8cd8-6acff948fa5a Chief Joy Officer - https://www.amazon.com/Chief-Joy-Officer-Leaders-Eliminate-ebook/dp/B07B2KHQCS/ref=sr_1_4?dchild=1&keywords=joy+inc.&qid=1610928832&sr=8-4 Listen in to the other podcast that Rich mentions the Bossless Office by Tom Ashbrook. - https://www.wbur.org/onpoint/2013/06/20/bossless-office Read the article that Rich mentions from New York Magazine by Matthew Shaer, The Boss Stops Here - https://nymag.com/news/features/bossless-jobs-2013-6/ To find out more about Rich and his team at Menlo Innovations check them out on the web. https://menloinnovations.com/ To hire Rich to come speak at your event you can book him here: https://richardsheridan.com/ From the team here at "The SmallsCast Podcast", thank you Rich, it truly was an honor and pleasure having you on the show! --- Send in a voice message: https://anchor.fm/thesmalls/message Support this podcast: https://anchor.fm/thesmalls/support

Listen in as your hosts "Just Nate", Dennis K along with guest speaker Chris E talk to the CEO and Chief Story Teller of Menlo Innovations, Richard Sheridan. The Smalls team is a huge fan of Rich and everything that Menlo stands for. The team talks through all the ups and downs that Menlo Innovations have had in order to break the mold and how they created a joyful place to work. Menlo's mission is: "End human suffering in the world as it relates to technology.®" Rich tells stories throughout this nearly hour long podcast as he talks about how they were all focused on delighting others with the work of our hears, our hands and our minds. Rich states the key to success and how they have been so successful is they set out to make a culture where your more likely to take action than to take a meeting. A key to Rich's success is he had a different goal than most. His goal was to try to succeed, where others goal is to try not to fail. Don't let failure get in your way, run the experiment and if it don't work, try something else and learn from the mistake. It sounds simple, Create a Intentional Culture! We can't suggest Rich's books enough, you can find them at nearly any books store or online, see links to both books below from Amazon. Joy Inc. - https://www.amazon.com/Joy-Inc-Built-Workplace-People/dp/1591845874/ref=sxts_sxwds-bia-wc-rsf1_0?cv_ct_cx=joy+inc.&dchild=1&keywords=joy+inc.&pd_rd_i=1591845874&pd_rd_r=d686b69d-d465-4f2e-a0fb-6e8c751ccfed&pd_rd_w=pNf5t&pd_rd_wg=S9ISd&pf_rd_p=e0f994a8-a359-40a9-8917-dadca71c7184&pf_rd_r=QSASTN1ZB45FCMCXDMAK&psc=1&qid=1610928792&sr=1-1-526ea17f-3f73-4b50-8cd8-6acff948fa5a Chief Joy Officer - https://www.amazon.com/Chief-Joy-Officer-Leaders-Eliminate-ebook/dp/B07B2KHQCS/ref=sr_1_4?dchild=1&keywords=joy+inc.&qid=1610928832&sr=8-4 Listen in to the other podcast that Rich mentions the Bossless Office by Tom Ashbrook. - https://www.wbur.org/onpoint/2013/06/20/bossless-office Read the article that Rich mentions from New York Magazine by Matthew Shaer, The Boss Stops Here - https://nymag.com/news/features/bossless-jobs-2013-6/ To find out more about Rich and his team at Menlo Innovations check them out on the web. https://menloinnovations.com/ To hire Rich to come speak at your event you can book him here: https://richardsheridan.com/ From the team here at "The SmallsCast Podcast", thank you Rich, it truly was an honor and pleasure having you on the show! --- Send in a voice message: https://anchor.fm/thesmalls/message Support this podcast: https://anchor.fm/thesmalls/support

Rich Sheridan, CEO of Menlo Innovations and best-selling author, shares stories about how and why the concept of Joy in the workplace is such a practical as well as an attainable goal. Rich is a gifted storyteller in particular when he tells stories about his leadership journey. www.menloinnovations.com

In my conversation with Kris, she mentioned hiring for values fit, not necessarily culture fit. I think that makes sense, because hiring for culture fit certainly has its downsides – there was a ludicrous example of the investment banking firm that only hired former male Lacrosse players, because they wanted people who fit the culture so to speak. That got me thinking about what we are actually hiring for now. Because the shelf life of technical skills is getting shorter, organizations are realizing it's actually easier to hire agile learners who communicate effectively and work well as a part of teams. Then, those employees can be taught the technical skills they need because they are adaptable and coachable. And this is what's happening out there in the real world. On https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/reinventing-the-job-interview/id1346314086?i=1000472139819 (Adam Grant's podcast, he focused an entire episode to reinventing the job interview), or as Richard Sheridan, CEO of Menlo Innovations would describe it, “two people sitting across a table lying to one another.” Instead of traditional interviews, Sheridan brings in about 50 people together in what he calls an audition. The people interviewing them have no access to resumes, they encounter the human being before they look at a piece of paper and establish a narrative. The candidates are put in all kinds of scenarios to assess their teamwork. For example they're given a single desk between two and observed for who hogs or shares the space. When there aren't enough resources provided for the activities, how will the candidates behave towards their teammates who they may also see as competitors? In fact, one of the challenges was to get your partner to a second interview! Interesting elements of this: Employees get to choose the new additions to their own culture, empowering them, giving them agency, investing further in them to create and build the culture from the ground up They focus on human soft skills – humility, teamwork, communication, and they don't even look at a person's professional background or acumen The interview challenges in no way reflect the challenges of the workplace, they simply provide an insight into whether or not you will make the people around you better Who is elevating the performance of the people around them? They are not focused on individual performance, but team performance. Ultimately, organizations are hiring people for how well they fit their organizational culture, for soft skills, for the ability to learn. Then they provide those teams access to high-quality learning opportunities for the specific skills they need, knowing that if they are a strong team and strong learners, there are no problems they cannot tackle. They are adaptable, they are resilient. They believe in each other. And when the next inevitable unpredictable event happens, they are equipped to pivot quickly, learn new skills, and keep the ball rolling. This is why companies are investing so heavily in learning programs that empower their teams. Because team and learning culture are intertwined! These guys are not looking for deep expertise, they are looking for able learners. As Adam himself says: He wishes they hired people not on credentials, but on the motivation and ability to learn. Less on invisible unreliable gut feelings, but on unstructured questions and challenges that actually relate to the world at hand. Investing in agility and using hiring methods that assess it can set you up to shape the future.  That's echoed in Daniel Coyle's fantastic Culture Code He says: “Individuals aren't really individuals. They're more like musicians in a jazz quartet, forming a web of conscious and unconscious actions and reactions to complement the others in the group.” You're don't necessarily want just the best individuals, you want the best orchestra! And collaboration allows groups to learn and grow together, and ultimately to be more...

An organization focused on relationships, trust, reasonable workload, vacation, work-life balance... sounds like a dream job.   A dream that is possible when a goal of the organization is long-term sustainability.   Beyond that, adding joy and recognition that employees have lives outside of work to the recipe has a powerful impact on employee attraction and retention and every measure of business success. My guest for this episode is Rich Sheridan, CEO and Chief Storyteller at Menlo Innovations. His two best-selling books—Joy Inc.: How We Built a Workplace People Love and Chief Joy Officer: How Great Leaders Elevate Human Energy and Eliminate Fear outline the culture philosophy Rich and his cofounder lead by every day.   Listen in as Rich shares the story of his evolution of leadership and finding the formula for thriving in the organization. It is all about more lift and less drag. 

This episode features Rich Sheridan, CEO and Chief Storyteller at Menlo Innovations. The COVID-19 pandemic has had a varied effect on business and Menlo felt the impact of the highly contagious virus right away.   Having survived economic turmoil several times in 19+ years, the first 100 days of the pandemic lock-down were some of the scariest Rich had felt in years.  Despite great fear that Menlo wouldn't survive, the business many have called the most agile organization in the world found a way to survive, adapt, sustain with intent to emerge stronger and thrive again.  Listen in to hear how the intentional culture built many years ago supported the return of joy to Menlo amidst the storm of the pandemic.  

Listen in as your host "Just Nate" and Dennis (CEO) talk to the president of Defense Management Company, Inc (DMC Inc), Matt Betzmer. Matt walks us through his journey of starting up his own DoD firm. Matt does not hold back on this episode, he tells it like it is, the good and the bad. If you are thinking about opening your own company or you already have and just want to listen to someone that has been through it or going through it as we speak, listen in. DMC Inc. does not have a website yet, it is in the middle of development. The company focuses on DoD Training, Education, Missile Defense, Space Systems, Operations, etc. Just Nate mentions two great books by a wonderful Author by the name of Richard Sheridan, CEO and Chief Story teller of Menlo Innovations. Joy, Inc.: How We Built a Workplace People Love - https://www.amazon.com/Joy-Inc-Built-Workplace-People/dp/1591847125 Chief Joy Officer: How Great Leaders Elevate Human Energy and Eliminate Fear Hardcover - https://www.amazon.com/Chief-Joy-Officer-Leaders-Eliminate/dp/0735218226/ref=pd_lpo_14_t_0/138-7642473-6170433?_encoding=UTF8&pd_rd_i=0735218226&pd_rd_r=dc8942c1-8b91-4ef5-9b1d-4540a28cfd4d&pd_rd_w=lJmY1&pd_rd_wg=5tTKl&pf_rd_p=7b36d496-f366-4631-94d3-61b87b52511b&pf_rd_r=W20T2R4Q1Z1YCF4NNVA4&psc=1&refRID=W20T2R4Q1Z1YCF4NNVA4 --- Send in a voice message: https://anchor.fm/thesmalls/message Support this podcast: https://anchor.fm/thesmalls/support

Rich Sheridan is a keynote speaker, the author of Joy Inc., Chief Joy Officer and is best known for helping create Menlo Innovations in Michigan. Check out the full show notes at TheAgileWire.com   YouTube: https://youtu.be/Y-DC8BE41Xw Twitter: @AgileWire

Episode 41 of the Modern Agile Show features an interview with Rich Sheridan (@menloprez), president of Menlo Innovations in Ann Arbor, Michigan and the author of Joy, Inc. and Chief Joy Officer. Rich describes some of the lessons he learned from the innovative entrepreneurs who run Zingermann's Deli as well as the book, The Great Game Of Business. Such learnings include open book finance, great customer service, how to take care of people and how to collaborate with others in every aspect of a business. Rich describes his company's mission, which is to end human suffering in the world as it relates to technology. He compares the work of human systems to flying an airplane, including the “lift” of human energy, the “thrust” of a purpose-driven mission to pull people forward, limiting the “weight” of bureaucracy and the “drag” of fear. We discuss the difference between how the Wright Brothers learned to fly as compared to the failed experiments of the well-funded, celebrated scientist and secretary of the Smithsonian Institute, Samuel Langley. Rich talks about how he created his company after first experiencing his “personal trough of disillusionment” during an earlier part of his career. We talk about how important safety is to human performance, how fragile safety can be and the importance of “pumping fear out of the room.” Rich describes why he calls himself a Chief Storyteller, the role of Joy in his company and the importance of being a purpose-driven organization.

My guest today is Richard Sheridan, the founder of Menlo Innovations and author of “Joy, Inc.” and “Chief Joy Officer.” He shares an inspirational guide for those seeking joy in the challenge of leading others and pushes readers to think, act and lead different. Too many live in quiet desperation. It's Richard's mission to bring those people out of those lives and thrive in whatever workplace they are in. Before Menlo Richard was in a job that by all definitions he should have loved. He was creating art and making a real impact in people's lives, however he was not happy. He realized he had created a culture where nobody at his company could make a move without his approval. He knew the company could not move forward any faster than him. Shedding the “smartest guy in the room image” was an important part of culture Richard wanted to instill wherever he went next. The topic his books Joy, Inc.: How We Built a Workplace People Love and Chief Joy Officer: How Great Leaders Elevate Human Energy and Eliminate Fear. In this episode of Trend Following Radio we discuss: Extreme programing Running experiments Trusting your team What is Joy? Killing ideas vs. action oriented Index cards Jump in! --- I'm MICHAEL COVEL, the host of TREND FOLLOWING RADIO, and I'm proud to have delivered 10+ million podcast listens since 2012. Investments, economics, psychology, politics, decision-making, human behavior, entrepreneurship and trend following are all passionately explored and debated on my show. To start? I'd like to give you a great piece of advice you can use in your life and trading journey… cut your losses! You will find much more about that philosophy here: https://www.trendfollowing.com/trend/ You can watch a free video here: https://www.trendfollowing.com/video/ Can't get enough of this episode? You can choose from my thousand plus episodes here: https://www.trendfollowing.com/podcast My social media platforms: Twitter: @covel Facebook: @trendfollowing LinkedIn: @covel Instagram: @mikecovel Hope you enjoy my never-ending podcast conversation!

What difference does JOY make in the workplace and how can you find JOY in leading others? Richard Sheridan joins Kevin to discuss how a joyful culture can bring about business results. He is the CEO and co-founder of Menlo Innovations and author of Joy, Inc.: How We Built a Workplace People Love and his latest book, Chief Joy Officer: How Great Leaders Elevate Human Energy and Eliminate Fear. Richard recognizes that leadership occurs at every level within an organization and challenges us to become a better version each day. Further, the people we are leading need to know we are real and we support their growth through our vulnerability. Richard also says that if you are in the Ann Arbor area and want a tour, just reach out. In this episode learn more about 1. Joy and culture. 2. Loving and authentic leaders. 3. Importance of storytelling to leaders.

Today's guest on “The Process” is Rich Sheridan.In the late 90's Rich was a high powered executive at a software company making lots of money.The only problem, despite his outward successes, is that he was absolutely miserable with a capital M.After the company he was working for was sold during the internet bubble, Rich and a couple of partners set out on a quest to create the software business they had always dreamed of working at.That company they created was Menlo Innovations, known worldwide today for their innovative culture that is build around one simple mission … creating more joy in the workplace..In our conversation you're going to learn Rich's exact systems and processes he and his team use to shape Menlo into the amazing company it is today.You'll also learn:- Actionables you can do in your own life to improve your relationship with your bosses.- The only way Rich has found to build more trust with your co-workers and teammates.- Why Menlo employees bring their babies to work with them and the (hilariously) unexpected benefits of that policy.- How to battle against the 6 sources of influence working against major behavioral changes (AKA - Why the failure rate of New Year Resolutions is 92%)And much, much more.Rich is a gem and a wealth of knowledge and I hope you come away from this interview ready to embrace your inner fears and run experiments in your own life that have the potential to change everything.To listen to this episode of "The Process with Brad Wilson" podcast, click that download or play button now.Join my email newsletter at: http://www.MentallyInvincible.com/TheProcessFollow @the_process_podcast on InstagramReach out to me directly at brad@mentallyinvincible.com

Brandon Laws and Tyler Meuwissen discuss the book Joy, Inc: How We Built a Workplace People Love by Richard Sheridan. In the episode, Brandon and Tyler discuss some of the most unique human resource practices Menlo Innovations is putting into practice in their business, such as hiring, recruiting, office set up, how people work together, purpose, and much more.