Podcasts about 7ps

Sunday Evening Service Sermon ( June15, 2025)Thuphanak Paunak 20:7Ps. Kap Lian Khai

Sunday Morning Service Sermon ( Dec29, 2024)ဖိတ်စာIsaiah 55:1-7Ps.Joshua Mangdeih

Can your AI models survive a big disaster? While a recent major IT incident with CrowdStrike wasn't AI related, the magnitude and reaction reminded us that no system no matter how proven is immune to failure. AI modeling systems are no different. Neglecting the best practices of building models can lead to unrecoverable failures. Discover how the three-tiered framework of robustness, resiliency, and anti-fragility can guide your approach to creating AI infrastructures that not only perform reliably under stress but also fail gracefully when the unexpected happens.Show NotesTechnology, incidents, and why basics matter (00:00:03)While the recent Crowdstrike incident wasn't caused by AI, it's impact was a wakeup call for people and processes that support critical systemsAs AI is increasingly being used at both experimental and production levels, we can expect AI incidents are a matter of if, not when. What can you do to prepare?The "7P's": Are you capable of handling the unexpected? (00:09:05)The 7Ps is an adage, dating back to WWII, that aligns with our "do things the hard way" approach to AI governance and modeling systems.Let's consider the levels of building a performant system: Robustness, Resiliency, and AntifragilityModel robustness (00:10:03)Robustness is a very important but often overlooked component of building modeling systems. We suspect that part of the problem is due to: The Kaggle-driven upbringing of data scientistsAssumed generalizability of modeling systems, when models are optimized to perform well on their training data but do not generalize enough to perform well on unseen data.Model resilience (00:16:10)Resiliency is the ability to absorb adverse stimuli without destruction and return to its pre-event state.In practice, robustness and resiliency, testing, and planning are often easy components to leave out. This is where risks and threats are exposed.See also, Episode 8. Model validation: Robustness and resilienceModels and antifragility (00:25:04)Unlike resiliency, which is the ability to absorb damaging inputs without breaking, antifragility is the ability of a system to improve from challenging stimuli. (i.e. the human body)A key question we need to ask ourselves if we are not actively building our AI systems to be antifragile, why are we using AI systems at all?What did you think? Let us know.Do you have a question or a discussion topic for the AI Fundamentalists? Connect with them to comment on your favorite topics: LinkedIn - Episode summaries, shares of cited articles, and more. YouTube - Was it something that we said? Good. Share your favorite quotes. Visit our page - see past episodes and submit your feedback! It continues to inspire future episodes.

This is the first episode of a series of unplugged, no bells and whistles solo episodes around the 7Ps of Humane Marketing. If you missed an episode you can go to www.humane.marketing/7ps To reflect upon the 7Ps for your business, get your 1-Page Marketing Plan at www.humane.marketing/1page To work on this marketing foundation in a small group, join us in the Marketing Like We're Human program. Find out more at www.humane.marketing/program

This is the first episode of a series of unplugged, no bells and whistles solo episodes around the 7Ps of Humane Marketing. If you missed an episode you can go to www.humane.marketing/7ps To reflect upon the 7Ps for your business, get your 1-Page Marketing Plan at www.humane.marketing/1page To work on this marketing foundation in a small group, join us in the Marketing Like We're Human program. Find out more at www.humane.marketing/program

This is the fifth episode of a series of unplugged, no bells and whistles solo episodes around the 7Ps of Humane Marketing. If you missed an episode you can go to www.humane.marketing/7ps To reflect upon the 7Ps for your business, get your 1-Page Marketing Plan at www.humane.marketing/1page To work on this marketing foundation in a small group, join us in the Marketing Like We're Human program. Find out more at www.humane.marketing/program

This is the first episode of a series of unplugged, no bells and whistles solo episodes around the 7Ps of Humane Marketing. If you missed an episode you can go to www.humane.marketing/7ps To reflect upon the 7Ps for your business, get your 1-Page Marketing Plan at www.humane.marketing/1page To work on this marketing foundation in a small group, join us in the Marketing Like We're Human program. Find out more at www.humane.marketing/program

This is the first episode of a series of unplugged, no bells and whistles solo episodes around the 7Ps of Humane Marketing. If you missed an episode you can go to www.humane.marketing/7ps To reflect upon the 7Ps for your business, get your 1-Page Marketing Plan at www.humane.marketing/1page To work on this marketing foundation in a small group, join us in the Marketing Like We're Human program. Find out more at www.humane.marketing/program

“If you're getting ready to jump into App Commerce, don't do it on a whim. I'd say, come on to our website and download our 7Ps, and even regardless if you do it with us or do it on your own or with any other people, anyone else, use that as your process.” In Season 7, Episode 19 of the Boss Uncaged Podcast, S.A. Grant sits down with the CEO & Co-Founder of StoreLab, Campbell Paton.

This is the first episode of a series of unplugged, no bells and whistles solo episodes around the 7Ps of Humane Marketing. If you missed an episode you can go to www.humane.marketing/7ps To reflect upon the 7Ps for your business, get your 1-Page Marketing Plan at www.humane.marketing/1page To work on this marketing foundation in a small group, join us in the Marketing Like We're Human program. Find out more at www.humane.marketing/program

Allow me a moment to share a bit of context and details about the Marketing Like We're Human aka The Client Resonator program that's starting again on March 14th. This is my flagship 3month program that is tightly linked to this podcast, because it follows the same framework: the 7Ps of the Humane Marketing Mandala. It's a deep dive into these 7Ps to help you discover who you are, what your passion is and then bring more of you to your marketing. Market from within, so to speak. But this is more than just marketing. This is building the foundation for your life's work! We start with the inner: the Passion, the Personal Power and then go to the Outer: the People, the Product, the Pricing, the Promotion and the Partnership with others. We go deep, in an intimate group, and come out transformed, with a business that we're truly aligned with. It's a hybrid program with a 30 minute video to watch each week, a beautiful workbook with deep reflection and journal prompts and then a live group call to go deeper! Who is it for? Whether you have 1 year, 5 years or 10 years business experience, it's never to late to go back to create the foundation and instead of just a business, create your life's works, so you can truly market from who you are. The best is always to hear it from other participants. Have a look at humane.marketing/program. There are plenty of testimonials and a handful of in depth case studies. Book a call with me now to discuss if this is the right next step for you at this point in your business.

In this episode of the Humane Marketing podcast, we venture into the 'P' of People as part of our ongoing exploration of the 7Ps of the Humane Marketing Mandala. Join me in a conversation with Cara Steinmann, the visionary founder of the Ravel Collective and host of the Ravel Radio podcast. Together, we delve into the art of authentic networking, emphasizing the importance of core values, unconventional approaches on LinkedIn, and the profound impact of empathy on your business relationships. Discover new insights that could transform the way you approach human connections and meaningful networking. In this episode, Cara and I discuss: Her experience with traditional networking and how she redefined it How to bring our core values to our networking How Cara uses LinkedIn to create connections, but not with a lead-generation mindset Networking for introverts How to be intentional when networking The importance of quality over quantity And so much more Ep 174 [00:00:00] Sarah: Hi, Cara. So nice to meet. Hi, you. [00:00:04] Cara: Good to see you, Sarah. How's it going? I'm good, thank you. [00:00:08] Sarah: Thanks for having me. Yeah, I really look forward to this conversation with you. I was on your podcast recently and we really [00:00:15] Cara: we're [00:00:16] Sarah: aligned, so I'm glad we have you on the humane part, marketing podcast, and talking about networking. [00:00:23] Right? So that's kind of your. Specialty and, uh, yeah, I want to just go dive right in. So tell me how did you come to make networking part of your specialty? And how did you build a community around networking? Why is networking so important to [00:00:45] Cara: you? It was kind of an accident because I don't really think of myself as a networking person and I think a lot of people probably feel that way because there's this connotation around networking that it's sort of like very businessy and very like you imagine yourself in a [00:01:00] room with very professional people and you're handing out business cards and you're talking about things that are very business related, but I think in my life, uh, in my career, I've sort of acted more as just a connector. [00:01:12] I think of it as connecting with people and building relationships. And that's usually not on a grand scale. It's one person at a time, usually in a one to one conversation. And it doesn't feel like what you would imagine networking to be. So I think maybe a little shift in the way we think about networking can help a lot of us who don't like that whole, you know, big corporate business vibe and really care more about. [00:01:36] One to one relationships and what goes on beyond the business. Yeah. [00:01:40] Sarah: That's already such a, a shift when you say relationship building versus networking. Mm-hmm. has that term work in it. Right. And so it feels like I'm the one going into this crowd and I have to work my way through it. Like, and, and yeah. [00:01:58] Collect the business cards [00:02:00] and you know, it's kind of like, yeah. [00:02:01] Cara: That, and I think. Be I think expanding our understanding of network be working beyond or even relationship building beyond thinking of who we are going to build relationships with to thinking about who we can connect so they can build relationships, because then you expand your network exponentially because then they also. [00:02:23] They also consider you part of their and both of you're part of both of their network. And then they're connecting. And then when they meet new people, they want to introduce you. So it's kind of kind of like weaving a web of connection with people that you genuinely want to talk to and spend time with and respect. [00:02:37] Sarah: It's funny you guys use that term weaving because in our community, uh, we have. One of the calls that is kind of like a networking call, um, but we actually call it net weaving. So I love that it's this idea of, yeah, we're together and we're getting to know one another, but we're weaving, uh, these [00:03:00] relationships. [00:03:00] Cara: And yeah, I love that. Yeah, we unravel. We have connection calls that are just to talk about whatever we want to talk about and connect. We had one yesterday and a bunch of us were on there just talking about what vacations we're taking and a little bit about business and what we're looking at challenges right now. [00:03:14] And then we have a small, small business mastermind where we all break off and then we have a happy hour once a month. And otherwise we're just hanging out in the community, getting to know each other and asking business related questions and personal questions. And, you know, it's about, I think it's a little bit deeper than just. [00:03:30] What do you do and who do you do it for? Like the pitch does, the elevator pitch doesn't matter so much when you know somebody. Yeah. [00:03:38] Sarah: Yeah. Yeah. You really addressed something there. It's this superficiality that I always hated at networking events that I felt like people were only listening to themselves talk and preparing what they're going to say next. [00:03:55] Listening to me and, you know, really having a conversation. And then [00:04:00] of course you add, you know, this was prior to COVID you add kind of like, you know, surrounding noise to it and you don't really hear one another and it was just [00:04:10] like [00:04:10] Cara: a nightmare. It is. It's a nightmare prior to COVID. I, I always loathed. [00:04:17] In person networking events, conferences and things like that, because it just, I knew I was going to end up in situations talking to people who really weren't necessarily a very strategic fit for like a strategic partner or referral partner, and that they would, like you said, just be waiting for their opportunity to say what they needed to say about their business and having a lot of surface level conversations because I think a lot of business culture requires you to leave the personal at home. [00:04:41] And I don't want to do that. I think we bring ourselves to our work and to our business, our core values, the way we operate. And I would rather, like we were talking about introverts before we hit record. Right. And I don't really consider myself an introvert, but when it comes to those kinds of things, I really act like one, because I would much rather have an [00:05:00] intimate conversation about things that matter than talk about, you know, What you do, what you do for people, because that's gonna, if you're an entrepreneur, you're going to find that out. [00:05:08] Anyway, we can't help but talk about that. Right. [00:05:10] Sarah: Yeah, yeah, no, it's so true. It's these deeper, meaningful connections and conversations and actually. Also pre COVID, um, there was this, uh, movement on, on LinkedIn, uh, called the LinkedIn local events. Yeah. And so me who always hated networking all of the sudden, I was like, well, these events kind of had a different tone because they, they came with topics and they were really open to this idea of. [00:05:40] Bring yourself to the conversation, bring the human side to the conversation. And so I actually put my hand up together with, um, another, uh, local friend here. And we started creating these LinkedIn local networking events. And, and we created themes, you know, where people would pick [00:06:00] cards and have really deep conversations and people loved it, people were like, Oh, this. [00:06:05] So different. Right. And then every now and then the person would walk in and you could tell, you know, they were like business suit and they probably had their stack of business cards and they're like, what is this? Why [00:06:17] Cara: are people doing here? It's funny. Cause I had, I used to host a speed networking event in Ravel and, um. [00:06:24] I actually, I learned this from a coaching program that I was in and they would do a lot of like more personal questions. And so I love that we only did it once a month and I was like, we need to do this more often. And so the challenge was calling it speed networking because what we actually do when you get there is break up into small little breakout rooms. [00:06:40] And I would. I would offer questions or topic starters, like what's the weirdest thing in your fridge right now? Like things that don't have anything to do with business, but you end up deciding kind of who you really mesh with and who you want to take that relationship further with and really get to know about them and their business and how you can support one another. [00:06:57] Cause you don't really want to support people you don't [00:07:00] care about. Right. So that's kind of the first step, I think, is deciding who you want to care about. Right. [00:07:05] Sarah: Yeah. Yeah. Before you also addressed core values. So, so huge. What do you think are the, you know, the core, or I guess there's two questions. What are the core values that we should bring to networking and why do they [00:07:21] Cara: matter so much? [00:07:23] I think we should bring our own core values to networking because the truth is we are all I like to think of them as core drivers because I think corporate culture has kind of ruined the term core values for us. We think of the little poster on the wall that doesn't really mean anything. But if you really get into your core drivers, what it means is it's what motivates you. [00:07:40] It's what drives your behavior. So my core values are freedom, authenticity and connection. And I notice when I'm in a funk or when I'm out of sorts, it's because something is going against my core values. So if you're going to network, I think you should network with people ideally who share your core values. [00:07:58] And then you'll [00:08:00] naturally network in a very comfortable way. Like when I started Ravel, I very intentionally invited, I seeded the community with women who I knew shared at least one of my core values, knowing that birds of a feather flock together. And so it worked really well because now we're up around a hundred women and anyone who's referred someone has always been an amazing fit. [00:08:18] I have to do very little background on the applicants now because if I know Maggie int introduced someone else to the group, I know Maggie and I know she's not going to introduce somebody to the group who's not a good fit because her core values align really well with mine. Yeah. So I think that makes it just so much easier to predict how someone's going to behave and what you can expect from them. [00:08:40] Sarah: Yeah, and it really defines the community, [00:08:42] Cara: right? Yeah, it makes it easier to hold that community in a shape, like my goal when I started Ravel was to create a community, just create a space and hold it in a shape, such that people would feel comfortable and vulnerable enough to connect with one another and really get to know each other. [00:08:58] And by inviting the. [00:09:00] Types of people who would be strategically aligned to be most likely to refer one another, like complimentary service providers. They're all B2B service entrepreneurs and they're women. So they have a lot in common and, you know, financial professionals who serve agencies can network with coaches who serve agencies. [00:09:17] And because they share core values, they're going to probably get along pretty well. And it makes it easy to build that kind of rapport that they need to. Want to connect with one another and see what's up in their business and say, Hey, you should talk to so and so. So it's like kind of building relationships with like the happy by product that you get referrals in business works really well. [00:09:36] Yeah. [00:09:37] Sarah: That makes a lot of sense. Usually we hear this this idea of quality over quantity. Um, you just mentioned your communities about 100 people. Um, so, so what do you think about quality over quantity in terms of the networking? Is it a, is it a numbers game or is [00:10:00] it a quality game or is it something [00:10:01] Cara: in between? [00:10:02] I think it's quality over quantity, 100%. And I think it's evolving, honestly, constantly, right? Like, so if you're, cause your business evolves, maybe you shift who you serve or how you serve that person. Um, and so maybe you have a handful of really great referral partners and. you shift your business a little bit. [00:10:21] You might have to, some of those referral partners, it might not be as strategically aligned anymore. And maybe they stay, you stay friends, but you might start looking around for different strategic partners who might be more well aligned, but it's not like you have to shift your whole network. You just start networking with a few different people and start figuring out who, who fits with you. [00:10:38] Um, and I think like a hundred is a lot of women. Like, I don't, I don't intimately know every member of the community anymore. When it was like 20 women, it was like, It was really easy. And, but what we've done is we've separated into smaller groups too. So we have a Slack channel where we have different topics. [00:10:55] We have rabble travel, and we have ADHD all day and moms. And [00:11:00] so we have these different things that we care about. And the women who gravitate to those channels tend to get to know each other well enough that. Even if they're not strategically aligned to refer one another as well as some others would be, they kind of cross pollinate between the community, the micro communities within the chant, within the community. [00:11:17] And then they say, Oh, you know who you should get to know. So there's a lot of paying it forward, introducing people to other people. That is such a, an underrated gift that you can give someone is to say, I think I know somebody who you need to know. Who would, you'd benefit from knowing each other. I mean, making a connection between two people who you think would get along is such a gift. [00:11:38] Yeah. [00:11:39] Sarah: Yeah. So true. Um, you mentioned a few times this word strategic, and I guess it's for you, it's like, well, there's a strategy to networking because again, as an introvert, This idea of networking can sometimes feel so overwhelming because we think, well, does that mean I have to network with [00:12:00] just anybody, you know, so it's like, Oh my God, I don't have the time to network with just anybody. [00:12:07] So, so what, what is a good strategy, um, that feels, you know, empathic and yet very strategic. Um, and I guess time conscious as well. [00:12:20] Cara: Yeah. Yeah. I think. Um, that's probably how most people think of it is just like, it's very overwhelming. You have to make a lot of people think there's a list you have to make and you have to contact X number of people a day. [00:12:31] And that feels very impersonal and kind of, um, like required, which doesn't feel good for a lot of people. Um, I've approached it differently. Like I spend a lot of time on LinkedIn. Um, just for networking, though, I don't spend a lot of time scrolling on LinkedIn, but if I find somebody offline, say I'm listening to a podcast or reading a book or find somebody's website online while I'm Googling or going down a rabbit hole of some kind, and I feel like they are strategically aligned with my business, meaning either they're, uh, [00:13:00] Complimentary service provider. [00:13:00] So we serve the same client, but we do different things, or we are a shoulder niche peer, meaning that we do different things or do we do the same sort of thing, but for different clients. So maybe I serve, um, the financial industry and they serve, um, like agencies or something like that. And so we can refer one another because we don't really serve the same ideal client, and this requires knowing what you want and what you're good at. [00:13:24] I don't think we are all suited to do, you know, the same thing. We're, we're all so different. I think it also, I think it's a successful networking in this way requires that you don't believe in competition. We're all so different. There's so much, so many factors that we can own as, you know, authentic to who we are that maybe somebody else doesn't want to own. [00:13:45] And if we know ourselves really well, we can understand what we do best and who we are best suited to serve. And then there's just no way that somebody else is going to bring exactly the same thing to the table that we are. So. We have to kind of get rid of that idea first. And then we're free to [00:14:00] network with people who look like they do something similar to what we do, but probably don't do exactly what we do or for the same person. [00:14:07] Um, and then you can also look for people who are, um, centers of influence coaches for, if you serve entrepreneurs, maybe you're wanting to network with coaches who serve entrepreneurs, and maybe you're a done for you service provider or something like that. So they're in a position to refer you there. [00:14:24] The people you're looking for to network with are the ones who are most likely to be in a position to refer you. So not somebody who's working in a totally different industry with clients that aren't even related to you. Um, but I don't, I don't think you have to go like search for them. I think you can listen to podcasts that are interesting to you and just start taking note of. [00:14:47] Someone who's interesting to you, who you think you might like and say, is that person in a position to refer me perhaps, and then you can just reach out to that person individually. I usually on LinkedIn because it's the easiest place to get [00:15:00] really connected with somebody. Yeah, [00:15:03] Sarah: so the idea is really to find referral partners. [00:15:07] and connect with them. [00:15:09] Cara: Yeah. And to be open about it and say, Hey, I think we have a lot in common. I think we might benefit from knowing each other. Um, I like you. I like what you're doing. Let's connect and just say hi. Mm-hmm. . [00:15:20] Sarah: Yeah. Do you then stop at the, you know, first conversation or how do you. Because it, you know, we always say in networking, you have to stay top of mind. [00:15:31] So how do you stay top of mind with this [00:15:33] Cara: person then? I don't think everyone is going to stay top of mind all the time, right? Like, you're gonna, you're gonna meet a few people who you really click with. And a few people who you don't really click with. One of the reasons that I started Ravel was because it is hard to stay top of mind when we're all busy and we're all running around doing all our stuff all day long. [00:15:52] And I don't, I'm not the kind of person, let's do, we have to do what works for us, right? If you're an organized person and you like lists and you use a [00:16:00] CRM, maybe you can stay top of mind with people in your own strategic way. I can't do that. So I put everybody in a container that I like so that I can stay connected with them in a container. [00:16:12] We, we naturally stay connected because we're having calls or somebody is asking a question and we're learning more about their business that way. And we're commenting and sharing our expertise. And so I think it's about proximity. And then if you're connected with them on LinkedIn and you're following them, you might see them. [00:16:26] It's like, The top of mind thing I think is more about the mere exposure effect than, than the top, than staying top of mind. It's just staying in front of someone who you want to, to stay connected with. And you can do that in a lot of different ways just by commenting on their stuff on LinkedIn. They see you, you learn a little bit more maybe about what they do and it don't think it has to take a long time. [00:16:46] It can take five, 10 minutes to, to go on. And in the case of LinkedIn, I would say like a lot of people suggest. That you'd be connected to a ton of people and follow a ton of people. But I find that really overwhelming. So [00:17:00] I only follow and want to be connected with the people that I really want to stay connected with because then my feed isn't really overwhelming and I can just, I can see the people that I want to stay in touch with and I can comment and like, and stay. [00:17:12] In front of them. And then they remember me. [00:17:15] Sarah: Yeah. So, so, so does that mean that you actually, you know, hide some of the updates of people who you don't want to see anymore, just so not, not to. [00:17:26] Cara: I just unfollow them or disconnect. I am a little bit ruthless that way because it's, we only have so much time and I don't really want to be connected with people that don't align with me really, really well. [00:17:36] So, you know, when I. I've been on LinkedIn for a long, long time, but my, my career has evolved. You know, if the past 15 years I'm doing very different things than I was in the very beginning. And so I, when I decided to reinvest in LinkedIn as a way to connect with people, I went in and I, I had, you know, thousands of connections and I got rid of all but 400 and some odd. [00:17:57] Because it was like, if I don't want to have coffee with this [00:18:00] person, I don't need to be on LinkedIn with them. And perhaps that's different if you're not an entrepreneur and you're trying to get a job. I don't know about that, but for my situation where I want to spend time connecting and networking with people who care about the same things I care about. [00:18:18] That means there's a lot of people I don't need to connect with. And I don't want to waste my time looking at their stuff. if I don't care about it. Right. And they don't know, so it's not mean or anything. [00:18:33] Sarah: Um, yeah, it's really interesting to, to see how, you know, usually we always hear, Oh, use LinkedIn for lead generation, right? [00:18:43] Yeah, that's not how you're looking at it. You're like, well, I, Only want the people I care about. And so they, yes, they might be potential clients or they're, you know, some other level of connection or [00:18:59] [00:19:00] network. [00:19:00] Cara: That's how you. I think that's a giant, you're speaking to something that's really important that I think a lot of people miss. [00:19:05] It's a giant mistake to go into like a community or a networking container and think you're going to sell to the people in that container. You're the benefit of being in a container with a hundred women. Is the connection to the 150 other people they know that they might be able to connect you with. [00:19:24] And yes, we buy from each other. I've purchased products and services from tons of the women inside Ravel and we buy stuff. We hire each other all the time, but it's not because we're sharing our offers and trying to convince each other to buy from us. It's because we happen to know each other really well, and we have a problem and we know that person can solve it. [00:19:42] But most of the time we're introducing someone. To another person, like I'll run. I talked to a friend of mine, or I go to an event or something, and I hear somebody has a problem. And I will say, I know somebody you should talk to. Let me connect you with so and so because I know what she does. And I like her and I know she'll do a good job. [00:19:59] Right. [00:20:00] So we're, we're building the relationships. We're not selling to people and LinkedIn is You know, a breeding ground for people doing lead gen on LinkedIn. We should be doing strategic networking. [00:20:11] Sarah: Yeah, I think that that's really the, the, the difference is not thinking of everybody who is somehow looking like a client just because they, you know, have a human body that, that you think of them as your ideal client. [00:20:29] And especially if you then think of a community where Uh, you know, the minute you bring that kind of energy into a community, the community is basically, yeah, it's destined to [00:20:41] Cara: fail. I've seen it happen in Ravel a couple of times where a couple, where a couple of people have, you know, crossed that line between, Hey guys, here's what I'm doing. [00:20:49] Check it out. Cause we want to share, we want to share what we're doing and we have a space for that, you know, but, um, a couple of people have, you know, gotten a little bit salesy with it. And it's not that they [00:21:00] get slapped down or anything. It's just that nobody responds. Right. It's just not something people are looking for in a community where we're trying to build relationships. [00:21:10] But what we do is we have calls and we connect with one another and we learn what's going on. And then we will often share on another person's behalf. One of our, one of our members, Cara, Cara Hoosier, she's getting ready to publish a book and it's really exciting because she's been through an incredible journey to get where she is. [00:21:25] It's called burnt out to lit up. And it's about. preventing yourself from burning out and what to do when you get there. And she's getting ready to launch this. She's looking for people to help her, you know, do reviews and read her book. And I was super excited for her. So instead of her getting on there and she's saying, Hey guys, look at what I did. [00:21:43] I said, can I share this with the community? Because it's really awesome. And she was like, sure. And so I said, you guys look at this, our member, our fellow friend here. is publishing a book. This is so exciting. Who wants to help her? I know that anybody else in here who is publishing a book would want the community to help them too. [00:21:59] [00:22:00] And so it's a very different message when you lift up another woman, as opposed to saying, look at me. It look at her sounds a lot different than look at me. Sure. So we help each other that way. Yeah. [00:22:12] Sarah: At the same time you as the host. What would you do? And this is not to do with networking, but just as a, you know, fellow community host, what would you do with a member, you know, several times trespasses that kind of unspoken rule that we're not selling in this community? [00:22:34] What would you do? [00:22:36] Cara: We had one instance in two years. In the last two years, we've had one instance where someone really kind of did cross the line. And I wasn't online that morning, but I got a bunch of messages from other community members who were like, Hey, we don't like this. Like we got to do something about this. [00:22:52] Um, and they were upset for me because she was trying to poach a bunch of members into a different community, which I think is fine actually, because [00:23:00] it's, I mean, I don't think poaching is fine, but I think women should have more than one community. They serve different purposes. I. intentionally keep Ravel at a very reasonable price because I want to belong to many communities, and I know that other women do too. [00:23:13] Um, but the way she went about it was really kind of gross. And so I had to respond to that because the community was saying, this feels gross and we don't want to be around this. And so I did ask, I said, we're going to go ahead and Remove you because this is not how we operate in here. I wish you know, but bless and release This might just not be the right place for you Which is important to remember because there are people have different core values people believe different things They operate different ways and just because she doesn't operate the way that we want to operate doesn't mean there's not a place Where that's totally fine for people to do, bless and release. [00:23:46] Um, so it's really more of like the community managing itself. I don't moderate and I don't tell them what they can and can't do. [00:23:54] Sarah: So, yeah, but in a way it's beautiful to have them, you know, kind of [00:24:00] show up and say, Hey, this is not how, this is not how we run here. [00:24:05] Cara: And yeah. And yeah. And that's my whole goal with the community is I don't, I'm not a coach. [00:24:10] I don't. Sell them anything other than the place inside the community, like the space. And so that's what, how I view it is. And I mean, we're kind of getting away from networking into community at this point, but I view it as myself just holding space in a particular shape. And that's my job is to make sure this play, this space is safe and a good place for people to be vulnerable and build relationships. [00:24:31] And if they can't do that, I'm not doing my job. So it has to be a safe space online. Yeah, yeah, [00:24:39] Sarah: that's beautiful. Yeah, we kind of meshed community with networking, but that's what [00:24:45] Cara: you're, that's what it is, right? Yeah, it, if when you're networking, you're building community. It just may not have a specific container it lives in. [00:24:54] Sarah: Yeah. And I also think. If we're changing that [00:25:00] term of networking into net weaving, then that's what we're really doing in a community is weaving a web together because the whole definition of a community is people being connected with each other. Not just to you as the host, right? [00:25:17] Cara: Totally. Yeah. And, and I, and this is why I use Slack, but I pay for the analytics. [00:25:23] I could use it for free, but I want to see what's happening behind the scenes, which is valuable because more than 50 percent of the conversations that are happening inside the community are in the DMs. And I know I'm not having that many conversations. There are thousands of conversations happening during the month. [00:25:36] And I know I'm not having that many. So there are a lot of private conversations happening and partnerships. Um, I introduced a couple of gals recently who are now partnering in business and, and they're super excited and doing some really amazing things. And I know that has nothing to do with me, but we're weaving. [00:25:54] These connections, not just for us, but for other people as well. And I think not, you don't even have [00:26:00] to, like, we can think of containers as smaller things, even text threads between two people or three people. Like if I have several people I want to connect with, because we all live locally, we're on a text thread together and the three of us send funny memes to one another. [00:26:12] And it doesn't have to do with business all the time. Yeah, [00:26:16] Sarah: I agree with that. It can also be more fun, right? It [00:26:18] Cara: should be more fun. Don't you think we should have more fun? I need more fun. [00:26:25] Sarah: Um, Yeah, maybe, maybe that's a good way to close with the, with the fun networking. Um, but maybe just also for people who right now, you know, there's so many communities out there yet, yet they're like, well, I don't either, I don't have the funds or I just can't decide which one to join. [00:26:45] So how can you start networking with that community as, or with that community notion without being in a community? What kind of advice would [00:26:55] Cara: you give? Um, I would say, I would say just [00:27:00] start connecting with people you enjoy. I listen to a lot of podcasts and I reach out to people who I think are excellent, either hosts or, um, interviewees, guests. [00:27:10] And I just tell them, I really, I like just start, start connecting directly with people that you admire, or you think have something interesting to say that you align with. Um, because like, there's that thing homophily, we're attracted to things that are similar to what we love or, or who we are. And so we're, they're going to be attracted to you. [00:27:28] If you share something either, I mean, location's really obvious, but beyond that, like core values or a mission or a purpose or something like that, like, I think you and I initially got connected on LinkedIn long, long ago, because I heard your podcast. And I was like, I, you're doing awesome things. We need to be connected. [00:27:45] And like, it didn't go anywhere for a long time. We had a little back and forth on, on LinkedIn, but eventually here we are trading podcast interviews. And so I think being in it for the long game and having conversations in the DMs, not expecting every [00:28:00] conversation to go somewhere, but being open to it going somewhere. [00:28:04] Yeah. [00:28:04] Sarah: And probably also not coming with this expectation that. Everyone you reach out to is gonna open your, their calendar [00:28:13] Cara: to you, you know, like, yeah, like when we connected initially, I was not expecting a one to one call. I, we live across the country, across the world from one another and we're both busy and eventually maybe we connect, but I genuinely just wanted to tell you that I really like what you're doing. [00:28:30] And I think that's people want to hear that it's people are open to hearing that you agree with them and that you like what they're doing. And if that's all it is, you've put some good energy out in the world and you can leave it at that. Right, [00:28:41] Sarah: exactly. It doesn't doesn't have to become a lead generation. [00:28:45] Cara: Yeah, it doesn't have to even become like a really intense networking like relationship there. We're going to have this whole gamut of closeness in our network, right? And we don't have the capacity to be really close. With a bunch of bunch of people like [00:29:00] 510 people, we're going to be really close with. [00:29:02] Um, and if we're all running in roughly the same circles, there's going to be opportunities for collaboration and referrals and those things. So it's a little bit of a leap of faith, but you got to just trust that if you're doing good work and you're helping people and people know you do it, that they're going to tell somebody exactly [00:29:20] Sarah: plant those seeds. [00:29:21] Yes, that's wonderful. Well, do you tell us a bit more about rattle and your community [00:29:28] Cara: and where people can find it? Yeah. The website is ravelcollective. com and it's for women B2B service entrepreneurs. So financial professionals, lots of marketers, content writers, stuff like that. Consultants. We've got some coaches, some, um, coaches for women entrepreneurs, and it's just a networking community, a really casual networking community where we Get to know each other. [00:29:50] A bunch of us are going to Mexico in a month together. I haven't met three of them, but I, and it's not an official event. I just said, Hey, I'm going to go to Mexico for a week and [00:30:00] do some like 2024 business planning. If anybody wants to join me, I've rented this house. And so it's not, you know, we probably won't talk business all the time, but. [00:30:09] It'll be fun. So we're kind of trying to put some of the fun and like person to person relationship back into business so that we can rely on, I don't know, our, our relationships to sustain us instead of, you know, just relying on ourselves. So yeah, it's 39 a month and it's month to month and it's just a space that I'm holding for women who want to build more professional relationships. [00:30:34] Sarah: We'll make sure to link to it. I always have one last question, uh, Cara, and that's, what are you grateful for today or this week, this month? [00:30:45] Cara: Oh my goodness. I think I'm most grateful for my family this week. It's there's a lot of, there's a lot of lonely people out there and I have a wonderful husband and a, an amazing son and I'm really [00:31:00] grateful for them. [00:31:02] Wonderful. [00:31:03] Thank you for having me.

Today's conversation fits under the P of Personal Power If you're a regular here, you know that I'm organizing the conversations around the 7Ps of the Humane Marketing Mandala. (If you're new here and don't know what I'm talking about you can download your 1page marketing plan with the Humane Marketing version of the 7 Ps of Marketing at humane.marketing/1page. It comes with 7 email prompts to really help you reflect on these different Ps). It's time for another short solo episode. This time I'd like to share a bit more about the 2nd P of Personal Power. I'll address: Why it's key to know your Personal Power in Humane Marketing How defining your core values dictates how you show up in the world What other personality assessments you can use to learn more about who you are How all this information helps you understand your Unique Holistic Marketing Super Power And how to bring all of that into your story Ep 173 text [00:00:00] Sarah: Hello, Humane Marketers. Welcome back to the Humane Marketing Podcast, the place to be for the generation of marketers that cares. This is a show where we talk about running your business in a way that feels good to you, is aligned with your values, and also resonates with today's conscious customers because it's humane, ethical, and non pushy. [00:00:23] I'm Sarah Zanacroce, your hippie turned business coach for quietly rebellious entrepreneurs and marketing impact pioneers. Mama bear of the humane marketing circle and renegade author of marketing like we're human and selling like we're human. If after listening to the show for a while, you're ready to move on to the next level and start implementing and would welcome a community of like minded, quietly rebellious entrepreneurs who discuss with transparency what works and what doesn't work in business, then we'd love to welcome you in our humane marketing circle. [00:00:58] If you're picturing your [00:01:00] typical Facebook group, let me paint a new picture for you. This is a closed community of like minded entrepreneurs from all over the world who come together once per month in a Zoom circle workshop to hold each other accountable and build their business in a sustainable way. [00:01:16] We share with transparency and vulnerability what works for us. And what doesn't work, so that you can figure out what works for you, instead of keep throwing spaghetti on the wall and seeing what sticks. Find out more at humane. marketing forward slash circle. And if you prefer one on one support from me, my humane business coaching could be just what you need. [00:01:40] Whether it's for your marketing, sales, general business building, or help with your big idea like writing a book, I'd love to share my brain and my heart with you, together with my almost 50. Years business experience and help you grow a sustainable business that is joyful and sustainable. If you love this [00:02:00] podcast, wait until I show you my Mama Bear qualities as my one-on-one client, and find out more at Humane Marketing slash Coaching. [00:02:09] And finally, if you are a Marketing Impact pioneer and would like to bring Humane Marketing to your organization, have a look at my offers and workshops on my website at Humane. [00:02:34] Hello friends, welcome back to the Humane Marketing Podcast. Today's conversation, well, it's a solo episode fits under the P of personal power. If you're a regular here, you know that I'm organizing the conversations around the seven P's. of the Humane Marketing Mandala. If this is your first time here, a very warm welcome. [00:02:57] You probably don't know what I'm talking about, but [00:03:00] you can download your one page marketing plan with the Humane Marketing version of the seven Ps of marketing at humane. marketing forward slash one page. That's the number one and the word page. And humane is with an E at the end. I noticed that non English speakers don't always know that human and humane are spelled differently. [00:03:24] So humane is with an E at the end. And this comes with a seven email prompts to really help you reflect on these different P's for your business. So it's time for another. short solo episode and this time I'd like to share a bit more about the second P, the one that stands for personal power. I'll be talking about why it's key to know your personal power in humane marketing, how defining your core values really dictates how you show up in the world, [00:04:00] what other personality assessments you can do. [00:04:02] News to learn more about who you are, how all this information helps you understand your unique holistic marketing superpower. How to bring all of that into your story and just create a business that is aligned with who you are and therefore, you know, also marketed from within. Who am I? That's the question here, right? [00:04:28] And so this is the other P together with passion or purpose, the first P that was completely missing in the traditional marketing model. Before we never looked at ourselves first. It was all about the customer because the customer was king. And so we had to kind of chase after this customer. So I really think it has to do with the human evolution. [00:04:54] We want to self actualize. So it makes sense to learn more about [00:05:00] ourselves first in order to then find out who's a good match for us. It's very aligned also with the inner development goals. Something that I'm recently very much fascinated by and. kind of following the movement, participating in the movement. [00:05:18] So if you haven't heard about the inner development goals, definitely look that up. It's the pendant of the sustainable development goals. But again, as the word says, it's starting within, starting with ourselves. And so it's the same here. We're starting marketing within, within, within ourselves. So it's really. [00:05:39] principle of the resonance, right? So that we find out who we are first in order to resonate with ideal clients who are aligned with us. And marketing with integrity really means marketing in our wholeness. So that's why we need to start with [00:06:00] ourselves. So the first thing we look at, and I'm sure you heard about this before, is our values. [00:06:07] You know, what are our core. Usually it's three or five. So if you haven't done this exercise yet or haven't done it recently, I really highly recommend that you look at your values again, because they actually also change. So there's a free core values assessment. If you Google personal values assessment, you'll, you'll find probably several, but Yeah, they're, they're all pretty much the same. [00:06:36] So you just pick first 10 values and then you narrow it down to five or three. And mine currently are freedom, curiosity, joy. health and honesty. So these are kind of my top five values. In her books, Brene Brown talks about her two [00:07:00] guiding values being courage and faith and how she always thinks about these main values whenever she makes a decision. [00:07:07] For example, freedom is my number one value whenever I don't feel free. I feel trapped and knowing that about myself has really helped me with business decisions. For example, I'm not an ideal fit for working with a business partner under the same company. I just wouldn't feel free to do whatever I want. [00:07:30] It also means that I do my best work with entrepreneurs who also often have this urge for freedom. A few years ago, I trained all the consultants of the local unemployment offices on how to help their clients with LinkedIn. And I really did not like it. They were not my people. They had been working at their jobs for. [00:07:55] And they didn't share this value of freedom and [00:08:00] curiosity and and the growth mindset. So yeah, looking at our values and knowing what they are and bringing them into our work and into our marketing and into our Business decisions is really really key. Another thing I talk about in the Marketing Like We're Human program under the personal P, personal power P, is the Myers Briggs personality assessment. [00:08:28] I'm sure all of us have taken that already at one point in our life. My type is INFJ, so knowing this about myself helps me understand more about my energy. That I'm more introverted and more intuitive. I'm not driven by numbers and stats. I love people but I need to refill my battery by being alone. [00:08:55] So, It's a, it's a good assessment to really know how, how [00:09:00] you're wired and it helps you again with your marketing and your business decisions because it, it teaches you how you do your best work, right? Another one we look at is the Enneagram. I don't know much about that, I think I'm a four, but it's also an interesting one to look at, so if, if that calls you maybe because of the drawing or it just speaks to you more, then definitely have a look at that. [00:09:29] Another one is the, the Strengths Assessment. So, it's called the V I A Institute of Character Strengths, and it's organized in 24 character strengths in different degrees, giving each person a unique character profile. And so, Then it also gives you kind of your six most important character strengths, and which is just also, you know, interesting to look [00:10:00] at. [00:10:00] So mine were Humility, Love of Learning, which is again similar to my Value of Curiosity, Judgment, which is the same J of INFJ. So Judgment, my Husband Tony always makes fun of me about that because I am quite a judgy also with people and say I don't like these pants Things like that, but that's not what it stands for in the Myers Briggs assessment It the J is really about planning everything ahead of time and not being so good with spontaneity And so that's very much me very You know future planning so judgment is my third. [00:10:46] Then fourth is creativity, which is still true. Then fifth is gratitude, which is also true. And then sixth is kindness. So again, it's a lot of confirmation, but knowing this about. [00:11:00] myself lets me tap into it more into, you know, bring that into my marketing. Like I call myself the mama bear of the humane marketing circle. [00:11:10] Well, it is that, you know, kindness, for example comes out of this term. So it's just informs us about different aspects of ourself that we can bring into our communication and our business. Another one of these. It's not really an assessment. It's much bigger than an assessment. I don't know what you would call it. [00:11:35] It, it is human design that is based on astrology and a very similar type of thing is, is called gene keys. So you probably either know human design or you know gene keys, but they're very similar, I would say, because they're based on astrology. And I'm a five... One generator, so there's different profiles, [00:12:00] and I am really usually full of energy. [00:12:04] That's what the generator means. I, I, you know, intrinsically create energy. And so again, just kind of learning more about this human design and it goes into a lot of depth. If you're curious about human design, I highly recommend you listen to episode 159 with Julian Cross and Hill, who is a human design specialist. [00:12:29] And you can find that episode at humane. marketing. com forward slash H. M 1, 5 9. So very, very fascinating work that I dove into a few years ago, and it's still with me. I have my report in my desk, and every now and then I take it back out. I'm like, oh, yes, that's why I'm doing what I'm doing. For example, it gave me the information that I'm actually meant to work with.[00:13:00] [00:13:00] One too many, so writing books, for example, or doing the group coaching, I thought that I was just meant to work one on one because I was an introvert and yet when the human report came out and I worked with someone on, on that. We realized, well, actually, no, it's not so much about one on one or not only about one on one. [00:13:26] So that was interesting for me. So yeah, have a listen to episode 159 with Julian Cross and Hill, who talks about human design. Yet another one is the fascination advantage. So that's more about. looking at how the world sees us rather than how we see the world. And this one really is more marketing oriented. [00:13:49] It's It's really interesting to find out also that often people see us differently from how we see ourselves. So the exact [00:14:00] words that people would use to describe us and the types of tasks that perfectly fit our personal brand and, and then it gives you these 42 personality archetypes, which seems like a lot. [00:14:16] But There's been a lot of research behind that and really it, it is, yeah, it is fascinating. And when I took it a few years ago, I came out as the maverick leader and my kind of Power was innovation and power. And now that I took it again, power stayed the same and innovation changed to mystique, which mystique is the language of listening, which also fits me well. [00:14:46] So it's just interesting to see and find out how the world sees you. And then also kind of receive this language that people would use. Well, I would never. [00:15:00] Describe myself as a maverick leader. I wouldn't put those words out there, but it's interesting to hear and see that maybe that's how people perceive me. [00:15:13] So yeah, very interesting information in that report. It used to be free. Now, unfortunately it's no longer free and it's. I think it's around 70 bucks a client you recently told me so, but I would say it's, it's, if you're interested in that kind of thing, it's definitely worth doing that once. So all these results really help us realize who we are and what we're good at and what our unique holistic marketing superpower is. [00:15:43] There's probably others. Oh, there's one I'm thinking of from Jonathan Fields called What's your SPARCA type? And that one is also a bit more like skills oriented like work oriented. So you'll find that on Jonathan Field's [00:16:00] website, or if you just Google SPARCA type and, and another interesting of these self assessments. [00:16:07] And again, we don't have to. You know, take these labels for granted. Things can change and we don't have to put ourselves into this box. But to me, it really informs us a bit about how we're wired and then. You know, we can tap into that and say, yeah let me explore this and find out how I can use this to my best advantage. [00:16:33] So, for example, if I'd work with a coach that told me that I have to speak on stage every week, that would really not work for me. I'd be totally outside of my comfort zone all the time and probably end up with a burnout in a few months. All about expanding our comfort zone every now and then, like I'm doing in a couple of weeks by going to a big summit about the inner [00:17:00] development goals in, in Sweden. [00:17:01] So again, these inner development goals that I mentioned earlier, it's just really right now at a topic that I'm fascinated. of and really interested in and so these summits are, they're, yeah, I'm an introvert as you know and so going to a big summit like that is, yeah, outside of my comfort zone, but it's. [00:17:25] Okay for me to expand that comfort zone every now and then, but for most of the time, I agree with my friend, Adam, who has this concept that he calls inside the comfort zone. And I think that's why we're doing these personality assessments and figuring out our unique, holistic superpower is that for most of the time we can operate within. [00:17:49] our comfort zone. And I really think we are our best selves and do our best work when we truly know who we are and bring all of us [00:18:00] to our work. No masks. We're not faking it until we are making it. Right? Most of the time, I would say probably 98 percent we do our best work if we are truly just who we are. [00:18:13] 2 percent of the time, yeah, we'll have to put on a little mask. And, and, you know, for me, it's usually kind of faking the small talk or, or pretending I'm fine when I'm actually having a headache, which happens a lot. But other than that. I just, you know, operate best if I'm truly inside the comfort zone and, and being my true self. [00:18:38] Another thing knowing my personal power helped me understand is that I need a lot of spaciousness in my days. Even though I call myself a conscious business coach, I don't enjoy coaching loads of clients at the same time. My brain just can't handle it. Another thing I didn't I mentioned so [00:19:00] much here is that I'm a highly sensitive person, that's, you know, it's not a, in a, in a personality assessment, but it's, it's a trait. [00:19:08] It's a personality trait. And so, Understanding this about myself that I'm highly sensitive and that my brain quite quickly probably more quickly than other people goes into overload, it just made me understand, well, I can't be this coach like other people are coaching all day long and having like six, seven coaching clients per day, it's, it's not good for me. [00:19:36] So that's why I shifted my business model to now work only with three. one on one clients at a time and they of course get then my full attention and I can over deliver because I'm not spread too thin. Besides the one on one clients, I then also offer the community and the group program and soon a second one that I'm [00:20:00] calling the business book alchemist. [00:20:02] If you're on my email list, you already know about this one. So another story that comes to about how my values helped me. Make a business decision is the story about the trademark issue with gentle marketing. If you've been in my world for a while, you already know this story that after I published the first book then called the gentle marketing revolution, I received a seasoned assist letter and was told I can no longer use that term. [00:20:33] And so. That was really, really hard, as you can imagine. But sticking to my values where a lot of people kind of even, you know, nice, like friends almost, like at least business friends told me, well, you know, maybe you can fight this. I'm sure there's, there's a gray zone because she's in the U. S. You're in Switzerland, you know, just lawyer up, get a lawyer and, and, and I'm sure you [00:21:00] can fight this. [00:21:01] And yet. That was going so much against my values. I'm like, I don't believe in competition. I believe in collaboration. I don't believe in owning stuff, especially gentle stuff, you know, gentle words. How could I, Sarah, own a word and say, this is now mine. Nobody. It's allowed to use it anymore, especially if I'm calling it a revolution, right? [00:21:29] And so it was just completely against my values to go and say, Hey, this is going to be mine. I'm going to fight for it. And so it really helped me. with my intention, intuition and, and saying, well, I need to let this go. I need to, you know, say, okay, fine. I understand legally, this is yours and I move on and find a new term. [00:21:56] And I think, yeah, the, the values and kind of [00:22:00] in my. moral principles really helped me in this in this decision, which of course wasn't easy, but in the end, I'm, I'm so glad this happened. So yeah, in conclusion, finding our personal power is all about marketing from within. Aligned with our values and really feeling a hundred percent grounded in how we're communicating and it helps you find then also the tactics that are aligned with you and tune out at the same time, all the other noise and all the other shoulds, for example, I'm not on Instagram, I'm no longer on Twitter, I've quit Facebook, I only release one podcast every two weeks now where everybody's saying, well, you should At least, you know, two episodes per week, but it just didn't work for me. [00:22:53] So I do things aligned with my energy and my personal power, the way that [00:23:00] feels good and not what the latest guru marketer tells me to do. And I really, really think. It's so helpful to know what your personal power is, right? What your personal holistic and humane marketing superpower is. And I truly enjoy helping others find their holistic and humane marketing superpower by By guiding them through this journey of finding out, well, how are you wired? [00:23:32] What's your, what are your values? What's, what's your worldview? And, and if you've read my Marketing Like We're Human book, I have a special reader offer that you can find on my website. If you go to humane. dot marketing under the tab books, it's kind of hidden away, it's under the tab books, not offerings. [00:23:51] And so you, you click at the bottom, it says special reader offer. And it's a one off power hour with me [00:24:00] that comes with a 16 page workbook that I'd like you to prepare and reflect on before our time together. So it's really, it's deep work and I'll have you. You know, look at some of these assessments and then we can figure out together, well, what is your humane and holistic marketing superpowers so that you too can tune out all the rest. [00:24:23] And maybe for you, it is Instagram, right? It's not going to be me saying, Oh, but for me, Instagram doesn't work. And so it shouldn't work for you either. It really depends on what you enjoy and how you're wired. And what your energy looks like. So if you're listening to this and think, oh, that would be really helpful, I'd love to help you and find more clarity and ease by figuring out your holistic and humane marketing superpower. [00:24:53] So again, it's at humane. marketing. And then you just look for the tab [00:25:00] books and underneath there, you'll. Find the special reader offer. I really hope you got some value from my ramblings about superpower and humane holistic superpowers. Maybe take some of the assessments that I mentioned. I think it's really, really helpful. [00:25:19] Personal Power is also the second module of the Marketing Like We're Human, aka the Client Resonator Program. So you can find out more about that by going to humane. marketing forward slash program. And if you're looking for others who think like you, then why not join us in the Humane Marketing Circle? [00:25:39] You can find out more about that at humane. marketing. com. Forward slash circle, you find the show notes of this episode at humane dot marketing forward slash H M one seven three. And on this beautiful page, you'll also find a series of free offers, the humane business manifesto, [00:26:00] and the free gentle confidence mini course. [00:26:02] As well as my two books, Marketing Like We're Human and Selling Like We're Human. Thank you so much for listening and being part of a generation of marketers who cares for yourself, your clients, and the planet. We are change makers before we are marketers. So go be the change you want to see in the world. [00:26:22] Speak soon![00:27:00]

Today's conversation fits under the P of People If you're a regular here, you know that I'm organizing the conversations around the 7Ps of the Humane Marketing Mandala. (If you're new here and don't know what I'm talking about you can download your 1page marketing plan with the Humane Marketing version of the 7 Ps of Marketing at humane.marketing/1page. It comes with 7 email prompts to really help you reflect on these different Ps). So, we're talking about the P of people or H of Humans. Only 5 years ago, if I said ‘People' you probably pictured a room full of people, or you and your clients or you and your friends going for a walk. Today, in the business context, a lot of the People stuff happens online, on Zoom. I've been working online for many years before the pandemic, so it wasn't a big change for me. I remember putting up a bonus free webinar to help teachers get acquinted with Zoom in the early months of the pandemic. Well, now everyone is Zooming. But not everyone does it well. Just the other week I watched a really quite uncomfortable Zoom call (or a teams call in that case) in a corporate setting where only the manager who was talking was on video, everyone else was hiding behind the screen. When he asked questions, there were long uncomfortable silences. I've myself had to really learn and still learning how facilitate groups on Zoom like our Humane Marketing Circle while giving everyone a chance to speak, and still keep the intimacy in breakout rooms. That's why I'm really excited to be able to learn from today's guest, Robbie Samuels. Robbie has been recognized as a networking expert by NPR, PCMA, Harvard Business Review, Forbes, and Inc, and as an expert in virtual event design by JDC Events. As a virtual event design consultant and executive Zoom producer, he helps organizations bring their events online with less stress and greater participant engagement. He is the author of three books, including his latest, ​​"Break Out of Boredom: Low-Tech Solutions for Highly Engaging Zoom Events.” Since 2016, he has hosted the On the Schmooze podcast and, since March 2020, #NoMoreBadZoom Virtual Happy Hour. In today's episode, Robbie and I talk about: How to host virtual events that feel like we're human How to facilitate bigger groups Create valuable breakout rooms How to make sure everyone gets a turn to speak How to create a feeling of community between participants Best practices to make calls engaging and fun And so much more Thanks for listening!   After you listen, check out Humane Business Manifesto, an invitation to belong to a movement of people who do business the humane and gentle way and disrupt the current marketing paradigm. You can download it for free at this page. There's no opt-in. Just an instant download. Are you enjoying the podcast?  The Humane Marketing show is listener-supported—I'd love for you to become an active supporter of the show and join the Humane Marketing Circle. You will be invited to a private monthly Q&A call with me and fellow Humane Marketers -  a safe zone to hang out with like-minded conscious entrepreneurs and help each other build our business and grow our impact.  — I'd love for you to join us! Learn more at humane.marketing/circle Don't forget to subscribe to the show on iTunes or on Android to get notified for all my future shows and why not sign up for my weekly(ish) "Sarah Suggests Saturdays", a round-up of best practices, tools I use, books I read, podcasts, and other resources. Raise your hand and join the Humane Business Revolution. Warmly, Sarah Imperfect Transcript of the show We use and love Descript to edit our podcast and provide this free transcript of the episode. And yes, that's an affiliate link. Ep 160 Ep 160 [00:00:00] Sarah: Hello, humane marketers. Welcome back to the Humane Marketing Podcast, the place to be for the generation of marketers that cares. This is a show where we talk about running your business in a way that feels good to you, is aligned with your values, and also resonates with today's conscious customers because it's humane, ethical, and non-pushy. [00:00:23] I'm Sarah z Croce, your hippie turn business coach for quietly rebellious entrepreneurs and marketing impact by. Mama Bear of the Humane Marketing Circle and renegade author of marketing like we're human and selling like we're human. If after listening to the show for a while, you are ready to move on to the next level and start implementing and would welcome a community of like-minded, quietly rebellious entrepreneurs who discuss with transparency. [00:00:52] Works and what doesn't work in business, then we'd love to welcome you in our humane marketing circle. If you're picturing your [00:01:00] typical Facebook group, let me paint a new picture for you. This is a closed community of like-minded entrepreneurs from all over the world who come together once per month in a Zoom circle workshop to hold each other accountable and build their business. [00:01:15] Sustainable way we share with transparency and vulnerability, what works for us and what doesn't work, so that you can figure out what works for you instead of keep throwing spaghetti on the wall and seeing what sticks. Find out more at humane.marketing/circle, and if you prefer one-on-one support from me. [00:01:37] My humane business Coaching could be just what you need, whether it's for your marketing, sales, general, business building, or help. Idea like writing a book. I'd love to share my brain and my heart with you together with my almost 15 years business experience and help you grow a sustainable business that is joyful and sustainable. [00:01:58] If you love this [00:02:00] podcast, wait until I show you my mama bear qualities as my one-on-one client can find out more@humane.marketing slash. And finally, if you are a Marketing Impact pioneer and would like to bring Humane Marketing to your organization, have a look at my offers and workshops on my website@humane.marketing. [00:02:33] Hi, friends. Welcome back. Today's conversation fits under the P of people. If you're a regular here, you know that I'm appreciating you and that I'm organizing the conversations around the seven Ps. Of the Humane Marketing Mandala, and if you're new here, I appreciate you just as much, and maybe you don't know what I'm talking about, but you can download your one page marketing plan with the [00:03:00] humane marketing version of the seven Ps of marketing@humane.marketing slash. [00:03:06] One page, the number one, then the word page, and this comes with seven email prompts to really help you reflect on these different Ps and kind of question all your assumptions around them. So we're talking about the P of people or the. Age of humans today, and you know, only five years ago if I said people, you probably pictured their room full of people or you and your clients, or you and your friends going for a walk. [00:03:38] But today, in the business context, a lot of the people stuff happens online on Zoom right now, I've been working online for many. Before the pandemic, so it wasn't a big change for me, but I remember putting up a bonus free webinar to help teachers get acquainted with Zoom in the early months of the pandemic because [00:04:00] none of the teachers knew how to use Zoom. [00:04:02] Of course. So everyone is zooming today, but not everyone does it well. Um, just the other week I watched a really quite uncomfortable zoom call or a teams call in that case, in a corporate setting where. Only the manager who was talking was on video, and everyone else was kind of hiding behind the screen. [00:04:25] And when he asked questions, there were like these long, uncomfortable silences and nobody answered. Not saying that silence is bad, silence is good, but in this case, if everybody's hidden behind their camera, then the poor manager obviously doesn't know what they're doing if they're even still there. So anyway. [00:04:46] Had to really learn, and I'm still learning myself how to facilitate groups on Zoom, like the ones in our humane marketing circle, while giving everyone a chance to speak [00:05:00] and still keep the intimacy in breakout rooms. So, yeah, I learned a lot over the last two years and that's why I'm super excited to be able to learn even more from today's guest, Robbie Samuels. [00:05:14] Robbie is a recognized networking expert and an expert in virtual event design. As a virtual event design consultant and executive Zoom producer, he helps organizations bring their events online with less stress and greater per participant engagement. He's the author of three books, including his latest. [00:05:36] Break out of boredom, low tech solutions for highly engaging Zoom events. Since 2016, he has hosted the Amish Schmooze Podcast and since March, 2020, the no more bad Zoom virtual happy hour. . So in this episode with Robbie, we talked about how to host virtual events that feel like we're [00:06:00] human, how to facilitate bigger groups, how to create valuable breakout rooms, how to make sure everyone gets a turn to speak, how to create a feeling of community between participants. [00:06:14] Best practices to make calls engaging and fun and so much more. As you will probably be able to tell, I really took this kind of like a, a mini coaching session for myself, and again, we're really applying this in our humane marketing circle. It's intimate, it's engaging everybody. Uh, turn or a chance to speak. [00:06:39] So if that's something you are curious about, do have a look at humane.marketing/circle. It's our community of humane marketers or entrepreneurs who want to market their business their way. We meet twice per month in an online setting. Right now it's Zoom, but [00:07:00] we'll actually change over to our own private live room on k. [00:07:05] Have a look at the details at humane.marketing/circle. And with that, let's welcome Robbie. Hey Robbie. So good to see you speak to you today. Yeah, thanks for having me here. Yeah, I'm excited. Uh, it's one of those topics, right, that five years ago we probably wouldn't be sitting on a call together, or at least not for that. [00:07:29] Probably more for networking, uh, because that's, that was your thing in the past or probably still is, but, but yeah, you kind of pivoted with the, with the pandemic and all. But yeah, I, I kind of. Dove right into it. So welcome to the Humane Marketing Podcast. I love you. You, I love to have you here. Why don't you take us a little bit into the past, but not too much, because we really wanna talk about, you know, zoom calls, group calls, [00:08:00] facilitation online, and all of that, which is the topic of your latest book as well. [00:08:05] So take us a little bit to the past and then to, to the. [00:08:09] Robbie: Well, Sarah, um, I spent over 10 years before the pandemic working to be recognized as a networking expert with a focus on networking at conferences, and that included writing a, my first book, launching a podcast. , um, creating a group coaching program, writing for Howard Business Review, doing a TEDx talk. [00:08:28] I was poised to be an overnight success 10 years in the making. Uh, my TEDx talk came out January, 2020, and by March, 2020 nobody cared. , it was sort of a, uh, not a very relevant topic to be an expert in around in-person networking because all in-person conferences and events really, Vanished. So I was trying to figure out how to show up and add value, and I wrote nine Ways to Network in a Pandemic as a, as a blog post on March 12th, 2020. [00:08:57] And one of those ways was to host [00:09:00] a virtual happy hour, which I did on March 13th. Unbeknownst to me that really launched a whole new thriving six figure business, uh, with all kinds of new revenue streams and really impacted a lot of other people's. I mean, it impacted my life, but the ripple effect is, has been extraordinary. [00:09:17] And by the end of the year, I was supporting organizations of bringing their events online with less stress and greater participant engagement. And as you mentioned, I am about to release on the three anniversary of that first virtual Happy hour, my third book, which is Break Out of Boredom, low Tech Solutions for Highly Engaging Zoom Event. [00:09:37] Sarah: Wonderful. Wow, what a comeback. Kudos to you. It must have been quite a dark night of the soul. I, I imagine that just kind of like realizing, oh my God, now what? [00:09:49] Robbie: Well, I mean, I, I accepted what was happening on March 9th because I had been paying attention to the news and mm-hmm. sort of was watching this come starting. [00:09:57] You saw this probably in January, just kinda like, [00:10:00] yeah. I was watching it kind of, kind of encroach our, our shores mm-hmm. and get closer and closer, so, I think I came to terms with it, uh, but I didn't know what to do next, and I don't like feeling that, I mean, I, I'm a person of action, so that feeling of being stuck. [00:10:14] But I was very fortunate because on uh, that Wednesday of that week, which is the 11th, I met with my peer mastermind and they gave me a kick in the pants and said, you don't think of networking as something that only happens in person. You have been building a global network for five years, virtually. [00:10:31] Why don't you go help people? And that got me outta my own way, and that's what led me to. Um, basically that night I started working on the nine ways list and, uh, published it the next day it got, you know, a good response cause it was very timely and I said, okay, I need to do one of these things. And I just looked at the list and it was 8:00 PM on a Thursday night , which is why the event is held five o'clock on a Friday cuz it was the next open spot that I could imagine calling a happy [00:11:00] hour. [00:11:00] And I didn't intend it to be a global network. A global event, but 36 countries have been represented amongst the members. Nice. Who attended I, and I'm still hosting it. Right? I'm still hosting that event. No more bad. zoom.com. Three years later. [00:11:13] Sarah: Wow. Yeah. Yeah. It's really it. It kind of demonstrates this idea of that you are not. [00:11:21] You know, you're, you're not kind of pushed into a niche, and that's where you are stuck for the rest of your life. There's a common thread to your message, right? And whether it is networking in person or now networking online and doing online meetings, Your concept or your approach to it is still the same? [00:11:41] Uh, it reminds me of my dark night of the soul where I got, you know, into a trademark mess where someone, um, was basically blocking me of using gentle marketing, which was the term I used before. And for like about two weeks, I was stuck a bit longer, Robbie, for about two weeks. I was like, well, now what? [00:11:59] [00:12:00] You know, how, how do I get out of this? And everything, everything I built, the books I published and, and two years of work and all of that. But then I realized, people told me as well, it's, well, it's not about a word. You know, you still have the community, you still have the concept, and, and so it's just mm-hmm. [00:12:17] It's great to hear those stories, I think. Right. For listeners as well to realize, well, you know, you can rebound. and, and start something new and it's still gonna be you and it's still giving you your approach, but, you know, just slightly different topic. So, so yeah, let's talk about this slightly different topic because, uh, as you, I think, uh, in one of the videos I watched from you, you said, you know, at the beginning you didn't even know you had breakout rooms, came with your free Zoom account. [00:12:48] And so yeah, that's how we all felt at the beginning of the pandemic. Been working online for years and years. So I knew Zoom, but it's true that a lot of people had like no idea [00:13:00] how to, you know, for me as well, breakout rooms was not a thing that I was using. So nowadays obviously everybody is zooming or, or teams or whatever they're using. [00:13:10] So how do you s how have you seen this evolve? Like what would you say in general? is the kind of the state of the online meetings now. Mm-hmm. . Do most people use them to their advantage and you know that it's really great. All these Zoom meetings we have, or do you hear kind of the opposite? [00:13:33] Robbie: Well, just to go back to your earlier point, the through line for me is that events are about content and connection. [00:13:39] Right. People were leaving their house and getting on planes to travel to conferences, not just for the information they would learn, but for the people they would meet. Right. And so when events became synonymous with the virtual events, I knew we needed to figure out a way to make that possible virtually. [00:13:57] Now, prior to the pandemic, An [00:14:00] online program, which was typically a webinar platform where you couldn't see participants and participants couldn't see each other. Right. It was 45 minutes of death by PowerPoint, followed by ineffectual Q and A on moderating chat . Oh God. Yeah. So I think we've come a long way in what our expectations are, but I also think it depends on the industry. [00:14:19] Because I still know, you know, I've, I've been invited to do some programming virtually for the employee resource group of like a bank or a law firm or financial sector. And like, they tend to be blown away by what I'm doing because they're using it in a very, Minimalist approach to how they use whatever platform they're using. [00:14:42] They're just like turning on their camera and that's it. And [00:14:46] Sarah: if that, because I've assisted to some of the meetings my husband has to kind of survive through and yeah, nobody is on camera like. . [00:14:55] Robbie: That's just it. So, so I think that it really is a range. I can't answer like one way, but I [00:15:00] also don't focus personally on corporate space or the workforce. [00:15:03] Mm-hmm. , I'm my book and my approach is really focusing on the presenters who have between 60 and 90 minutes to offer value to a one-time audience. now, and a lot of this can be therefore applied if you are teaching, uh, a course or a class, this is, you know, or even like a, a weekly team meeting, you can apply a lot of this to that. [00:15:25] But I think there's, there's a few more restrictions. So, for instance, I don't recommend using third party. Tools like Mentee Meter and Jamboard, which I love. But if you only have 60, 75, 90 minutes, you might lose people because if they don't, if they're not familiar and you don't know if they're familiar cuz you don't know the audience super well, you might lose them. [00:15:45] And, and if, if it's about engagement, you're gonna get 70 to 90% of people to responding to a Zoom poll. And you might get 30 to 50% actually answering. , one of these third party polls. Mm-hmm. . And so [00:16:00] yes, it's fancy, yes, it's cool , but if the end result is fewer people actually taking action and people feeling a little bit confused about something, that's not where we want people to be. [00:16:11] So I also, I really focus a lot in the book and in the work that I do on some principles around purpose first design and also quality facilitation. So I'm, I'm specifically focusing on the Zoom. As far as the technology, but those other pieces around facilitation and purpose first design are applicable to any medium, including in person. [00:16:36] Mm-hmm. . So I think there's a strong Venn diagram because I also do in-person event design consulting, and I've been doing that a long time. And then back to doing that again now that people are backed in person. So to me there's a big overlap. How you design an in-person workshop or presentation for 90 minutes and online, but then there's the outliers that you have to consider for both. [00:16:58] So I think that there's a lot of [00:17:00] potential. I've done incredible programming. I've got some great stories in the book about some really cool outcomes we've achieved by bringing people together across geographies to have really in depth conversations about important topics. . I also think that people's tolerance for the sort of boring approach, , is they really don't have any, like, I think people are zoomed out and zoom fatigue. [00:17:24] That's why I call it breakout of boredom. And, and by, by the way, breakout rooms, I went from not knowing I had access to, you know, , I dunno, my book's like 60 some odd thousand words and like 10,000 words. Almost 20% is about breakout rooms. So, [00:17:40] Sarah: yeah. So let's go there. Um, I, I wanna really have you walk us through kind of some of these, you know, yes, they're technicalities, but I think the way you explain them is always comes back to purpose. [00:17:54] You know, like what is. , what's the common [00:18:00] purpose for, uh, us to be on this call? That's how I understood it, um, when I went through this checklist that you'll share with us at the end. So let's start with the waiting room, right? Um, that's usually our first experience when we go on to a Zoom meeting. So how, if we are, if my listeners are hosting a group, uh, zoom. [00:18:24] what are some of the things that can be done? Let's just take Zoom as an example, can be done to already kind of give people this feeling of I belong, or this is, I'm a, I'm on in the right group here. Sure. Like what [00:18:39] Robbie: can we do? Well, for starters, if you're having a group meeting, stop using your personal meeting room because, uh, you, if you write, if you create a meeting, a specific meeting for. [00:18:53] Group, then the name of that meeting will be what appears in the waiting room. Um, so that'll assure people. But you can [00:19:00] also have different settings. So if you use a different link, you could set it so that participants are muted upon entry. Mm-hmm. . Now for why one-on-one calls, I do use my personal meeting ID and I don't mute people because if it's just two of us, I, I don't need you to be muted. [00:19:18] It's actually kind of an inconvenience for you to be. Right, because people start talking and I have to point out to them like, don't forget to unmute . Yeah, the usual, you're muted . Yeah. So then the other thing I would say for waiting rooms, you can customize it beyond that. And there's a bunch of different options. [00:19:33] A lot of what I'm gonna be sharing is under zoom.us, and then you go to settings, which is on the left side menu, and you can just start from the top. And actually really close to the top is waiting rooms. So there's some really cool customi customization, uh, including you can embed a video, you can put an image, you can put text. [00:19:50] Um, I sometimes have texts just says, , take a breath. You know, like, yeah. Take a, take a moment to yourself. Mm-hmm. before you come in. Yeah. But you need [00:20:00] to know that whatever you put for your customization will be what people see for all of your meetings. For that one account. So Okay. If you make a special video for like a big event you're doing, you have to then remember, put a note on your calendar to switch it back to whatever. [00:20:14] You're more general, so you can [00:20:16] Sarah: customized each waiting room separately for each meeting. It's just one you [00:20:21] Robbie: can, but you'd have to like keep going back in and remembering to switch it on and off. Right. [00:20:25] Sarah: Okay. Yeah. Okay. That makes sense. Yeah. Okay, great. So, uh, one question. Can people chat already in the waiting room? [00:20:33] I don't think so. Right. [00:20:35] Robbie: Uh, they can't, uh, right now the host can communicate with people in the waiting room. Uh, and I think that they're gonna come out with a feature where the waiting room can then respond back to the host individually. Okay. Um, they, you cannot change your name, for instance, in the waiting. [00:20:53] but the host can change your name. So there's some new features that are coming out. Okay. Um, but I also wanna go back to, [00:21:00] you mentioned purpose first design, and I, I address it as well. So I want you to think about, as people are coming into your session, they're going to be thinking, feeling, and you're doing. [00:21:11] one thing. At the end of their time together, they're gonna be thinking, feeling, and or doing something else. And then in between is the transformation, right? So if you really spend some time thinking about where they're starting and where you want them to end up, that will help you decide. The structure flow, what exercises, what kind of content, how much time to spend on things, what to put in the waiting room, whether or not to have a breakout room. [00:21:38] If so, what kind of question? What kind of, what is the goal of, even for a breakout room, like what's the purpose of a breakout room? Is it around networking? Is it for them to discuss something? Is it for them to share? Is for them to feel like they belong. Like once you understand the sort of really primary focus of each piece of it and how it fits in with that overall goal, it's gonna help you design a much better [00:22:00] quality experience for your participants. [00:22:02] So that's the purpose first design piece. And then the facilitation is just to stop confusing people by saying the incorrect thing. Like go ahead and raise your hand in chat. Never been a raised hand button in chat. I've heard that phrase a lot. Or pointing down and like pointing, uh, pointing here and saying, go to reactions when that's not where it is. [00:22:28] Reactions on your side is on he over here. So if I, if I go to tell you like, um, oh, go ahead and go ahead and, uh, go to the top right of your screen and click. I'm not pointing at the right side of your screen. . This is the right side of your screen. So that's cold mirroring . Mm-hmm. And if you were on a stage physically, you would, you would know that, right? [00:22:51] Like you would know that if you pointed to your left, they're gonna see it on the right. But when we're doing this virtually, people kind of forgot all about that. So that just [00:23:00] hurts our brains. It makes our brains work a little extra hard. And that's part of that zoom fatigue is confusing instructions. [00:23:07] Um, The person who spends a lot of time saying, um, all right, let's see. I'm gonna try to share my slides. Let's see. Oh, the file's not open. And then they like, share their desktop. And you watch them like go through everything on their desktop. You're like, uhhuh, as they like narrate every step. That's, we can all get 5% better every time we zoom. [00:23:30] Yeah. Whether we're participating, whether we're hosting, whether we're speaking. Just aim to get that little bit better. . [00:23:37] Sarah: Yeah. Yeah. There's so many small details that we need to learn, right? That, that now it's this extra layer. And actually in some of the videos you, you mentioned it's really helpful to a first, have an extra, um, screen that you can, you know, have one just dedicated screen for your PowerPoint presentation, for example. [00:23:58] Mm-hmm. , uh, [00:24:00] and even, uh, an extra person, like someone who helps you, you know, read through their questions in a q and a setting, or, yeah, just like there's so many things that we have to manage that, or we haven't even started talking about breakout rooms. But yeah, there's a lot of things going on that it, it really is sometimes helpful to have a, an extra person. [00:24:22] Robbie: Mm-hmm. , I think if, um, if you have more than 20 people, , I think it's, it starts to be a, for most people, that's where it makes sense to start thinking about having a second person. Right. But that second person, um, could be like a fellow. Uh, I, I know for instance, I know speakers who sh who support each other. [00:24:42] Right. Will they take turns? Like one will moderate chat for one person's program and then the other one will go back and moderate chat for the other person's program? Yeah. Awesome. You can train an assistant or, uh, an. or you know, a VA or even a member of your community to manage chat and manage the q and a [00:25:00] and manage, you know, all of that. [00:25:01] So yeah, it, it, it, and then, but it scales up because, you know, I, I train people on to be Zoom producers, and so Zoom producer would do all the tech, not just the chat. They would handle any technical issues that. You know, community has getting in, getting their sound to work. And then they would also, uh, manage breakout rooms and sharing slides if you need them to, any, anything needed. [00:25:27] Uh, as well as managing chat. And then there's the executive sort of, uh, event design, virtual event design that I do where I'm really providing the strategy ahead of time, training the speakers and how to look good, all that stuff. So it, there's layer. . But I would say starting with having a. Understanding of what does a good Q and A even look like? [00:25:50] Mm-hmm. , and then what kind of support you might need to pull that off. If you've only got six or seven people in a room, I think you're, you're fine on your own. Fine. Yeah. But you still have to know that [00:26:00] while I'm doing my best to look at the camera, there's something happening in chat. So I have sort of techniques where I ask people to write their question and chat, but to write the word question in all caps before their question. [00:26:13] So I'm more likely to. To see it. I also increase the font size by to 150% of the original font size in chat, which makes it a lot easier to catch when things are happening, um, off to side. So these are all little things that over time one thing becomes easier. Then you add on something else. So I'm not saying everyone has to do everything all at once. [00:26:36] That's the 5% part. Um, so I actually have a, a program called The 5% Advantage, and it's the, I launched it in May of 2020 and um, my wife was like, why would anyone wanna get 5% better ? And I said, no, no, every time it's about like continual improvement. , it's, it, it's amazing, like how much faster you will improve if you aim to just [00:27:00] keep getting a little bit better each time. [00:27:03] Sarah: I like that. Um, I do wanna ask you about breakout rooms cuz that's I think one of the things that Yeah, a lot of, uh, these. Programs, um, now include right now that we've gotten used to being on camera on Zoom, where it's not just like a webinar style anymore. And so one of the things you mentioned, um, is this idea of having clear instructions and, and I think I. [00:27:28] Really, I probably get better 5% every time I do it, but it's true that it's so essential to give clear instructions before sending people off into breakout rooms. Cuz you, you explained, you know the situation where people find themselves in the breakout room and they're like, Uh, anyone know what we have to do? [00:27:48] And, you know, they just start chatting about who they are and, and all of that. So, what's kind of like best practices about giving clear instructions, uh, for these breakout [00:27:58] Robbie: rooms? So start back [00:28:00] with the purpose first design. What is the goal of the session? The, the breakout part of this session? Um, if it's a quick icebreaker, then you can do either two people for five minutes or three for six. [00:28:11] If you can open more. I don't know, 10, 15 rooms. I would say three for. minutes is better cuz it's less likely that someone's gonna get stuck in a room by themself because of the internet. Um, failing one person. Um, but that would be like a quick icebreaker question. So they're just, they're literally just going around for a moment to say hello to each other. [00:28:30] Uh, you might do three or four people for 10 minutes. To similarities, how people go around and answer a question. Um, each person gets a couple of minutes and then that goes all the way up to, you know, a discussion where people might get, you know, it might be five or six people for 15 minutes where people really all answer a quick question, but then they dive into. [00:28:49] thoughts about that question a little bit more. So what happens is that if you just sort of throw people in a room without any clear question, uh, someone will [00:29:00] eventually unmute. Like at first they're all gonna like, look at each other. Like, what do we do here? The person who's most comfortable, um, most privileged , uh, probably has been around this community the longest is, is gonna be the one who unmutes and they may not relinquish the microphone and it might become just a. [00:29:19] A whole session of one person talking and now you're in the main room and you're like, awesome People are engaged. They're having so much fun. But that's, that's like checkbox engagement. Like in reality, one person had the mic for the whole time. So what I wanted to say is intentional engagement is that we provide not only a question that is specific, one question, not lots, don't ask the choose from three and all that, but you also provide an answer. [00:29:46] So you say, , you know, what's your biggest win of the week? Here's mine to get you thinking. Here's mine that you then put the question that you just said as the prompt in chat, and you say, if you need [00:30:00] to, you can open up chat and see the question. And let's go alphabetically. Let's go alphabetically by last name. [00:30:07] So if your last name's closest to a, you'll go first. We'll go in that order. And if you don't have a last name showing, go ahead and add it. Or you're going first. Hmm. And that way they get in their brains have already been thinking about the question. , when you tell your answer, you're sharing a story and stories ignite stories in other people's brains. [00:30:27] Mm-hmm. . So when I tell you my big win of the week, you start thinking about, well, what's my big win of the week? Mm-hmm. . So you're already a little bit primed to participate, and then you find out the order and you realize. . Ooh, there's a good chance I'm gonna be going first. , like my last name's close to a, and you're like, oh. [00:30:43] So you really are mentally repaired to unmute and jump in. Now some people get kind of cutesy about the order and they do like longest and short hair or colors of shirts or birthdays. All of those are kind of distracting. Take some time to discuss. [00:31:00] Leading. I mean I've been in so many sessions like that, that we end up talking about horoscopes cuz we were asked to like go in the order of our birthdays, right? [00:31:09] So I generally, I say like alphabetical or, or reverse alphabetical by, um, first name or last name. And if you really think a particular order would be helpful, for instance, maybe people for most experience at least experience with something you can say when you get into the breakout rooms, go to chat and put in the. [00:31:27] Of years you have with this, and we'll use that to organize, you know, most experienced, at least experience. But, um, but all that structure is actually, um, it helps people feel like they belong. And I actually think that thoughtful structure is about inclusion. It's about people feeling not just invited, but welcomed into a conversation. [00:31:49] It tells shy people and introverted people and newcomer. and people who maybe you speak a language that's different than the dominant language being used, it tells [00:32:00] them exactly what the rules are. There's no like in crowd knows how to ask questions or how to unmute. Everybody knows everything. So I think we, we, um, we as hosts and facilitators sometime like relinquish our role by saying, you all figure it out, but just like an in-person event, like people thrown together at a bar. [00:32:24] Often find the people they wanna meet. But when you structure an event at a bar and you've got name tags and people who are welcoming, you've got activities, you have people in, you know, interacting and engaging with each other. , that little bit of structure is what leads people to find each other, not just the randomness. [00:32:41] And I think online we need the similar structure to help people really find value in those breakout room discussions and wanna stay in touch. Everybody wants to find their people. Nobody wants to feel like they're the only one in the room having this challenged problem, identity, whatever it is. So I, I love [00:33:00] breakout rooms for that reason. [00:33:00] I think it provides so much community building. and then you bring them back. And I think an important part of, of breakout rooms is thinking about what kind of debrief. And by default, a lot of times the debrief is just how people use the raised hand feature. Um, or worse, worse than that would be go ahead and unmute if you have anything to say. [00:33:20] I'm like in person. You would never be like, all right folks, just start talking . It's just so weird that we do that online all the time. Um, so I would say alternate between sometimes having people raise their hand, which is self nominat. Sometimes have people write things in chat sometimes, uh, have them write things in chat, but wait to hit enter until you tell them. [00:33:39] I call that a, uh, waterfall debrief. Um, sometimes I have people nominate someone in chat mm-hmm. . So like, who shared a really great win, nominate them and let's, uh, get them to share with all of us. Um, there's just so many ways. To bring lots of voices in, not always the same. Like I'm an outgoing extrovert. [00:33:56] I, Sarah, I will raise my hand, answer a question, not knowing what the question [00:34:00] even was. , like, I'm like, sure. Mm-hmm. . But then you have people like me dominated in conversations the whole time. So the structure allows someone else to grab the mic or to be invited to grab the mic if they choose. [00:34:12] Sarah: Yeah. Thank you. [00:34:13] I'm grabbing the, I'm grabbing the mic. I'm the introvert in the room. . Um, yeah. So many good things. Two, no, I'm just gonna kind of reiterate the main takeaways for me. So first of all, yeah, the clear instructions when you send people into the breakout room and, and also what I really loved is, and what we haven't been doing in my Humane Marketing Circle community is defining ahead of time who goes first. [00:34:43] I think that is a big aha for me to really say. . Yeah. Take away that awkwardness like, you know, do you wanna go first? No, you go first. So it's like, okay. It's already clear who goes first. What my community recently asked me is actually to have two [00:35:00] minutes of reflection before they go into a breakout room so that they can. [00:35:05] Kind of think about because we kind of go deep into the, in, in the breakout rooms. But the other thing I learned right now from you is to, for them to already have my answer, um, so that it, like you said, it's a story, right? So they come in with a story, um, And I love that. One thing you didn't mention, uh, that I'm doing, and you'll tell me what you think about that is. [00:35:30] So I usually, for now, I don't go into the breakout rooms just because I, I don't have another person to help me manage it. So I'm the one sending the messages into the breakout rooms saying, okay, it's time to switch next person, you know. The three or four minutes to talk. Do you use that? Is that a good practice or do you [00:35:50] Robbie: Yeah, so, um, there's a couple things that I didn't, I didn't mention that. [00:35:54] Made me think about. One is there's a, there's a setting when you, there's an option when you set up the breakout [00:36:00] rooms that will put a countdown clock on the top. Right? Right. So it's really helpful to turn that on Uhhuh because then when everyone gets in, they know they have 10 minutes and they know how much time is remaining. [00:36:10] Um, helps 'em divide the time up equally. It helps them. Wrap their conversation up and at the end of that 10 minutes, my recommendation is to change. To be a 15 second countdown clock is default. 60 minutes. 60 seconds. Mm-hmm. But if you're watching the time countdown, and then suddenly you have a minute, there's this moment of almost walk awkward walk. [00:36:29] Awkward is when you say a big goodbye to someone at a restaurant and then discover we're both going in the same direction to your cars . That's. in person, but similarly, like you get to this point where everyone's like, all right, great, see you. Oh, 60 seconds. And then some people leave. Some people are like, oh, I have a whole nother thing. [00:36:47] I think I can squeeze in 60. Like it just, you know. So you're the [00:36:51] Sarah: countdown. It's better to have less time [00:36:53] Robbie: actually. Like Yeah, just get like, okay, we're wrapping up, we're coming back like we had, you got your 10 minutes, [00:37:00] then come back. Or to tell people, I mean, I guess if you wanted 'em to keep the 60 seconds, you can say, It's gonna be, you know, I guess just give people clear instructions. [00:37:08] Yeah. Um, and then, yes, there's a couple of ways to broadcast into the rooms. One is text only, and I, that's like walking by with a sign. Like if you were at an in-person event, you'd be walking by with a sign that said two minutes. You know, and you wouldn't say anything. You would just walk by and try to catch. [00:37:24] Not everyone would see it. You might be holding the sign behind some people's heads. Right. It's a very small font at the top. Then they have broadcast. and that is a lot more jarring if you wanted to use it. I think you need to tell people in advance, um, that you're going to say switch because it's a voice [00:37:42] Sarah: outta nowhere. [00:37:42] I never used it cuz I thought like, that is so odd if all of a sudden [00:37:46] Robbie: they hear my voice. Now, if you only had two people and it was very clearly like, you know, pairing and then switch, I could see cuz again would you in person like ring a bell and call out. Okay folks switch like [00:38:00] if you would. Think about like, yes, it's disruptive. [00:38:04] Now the problem is if you, if you have three people you don't know when they switched, like it's not as exact as science. And then there's also a way to broadcast an image, a video, or um, like a slides, like anything you can put on your screen, you can broadcast that. , um, that would be interesting to do if you had facilitators in the rooms and you wanted everyone to go through this content at the same pace. [00:38:26] You would be advancing the slides based on a certain increment of time. Facilitators would then be sort of taking questions, um, and. You would know that all the rooms were kind of moving through the content at the same pace, at the same amount of time for q and a at the end, and you'd be managing that. [00:38:44] They wouldn't be able to forward it, they wouldn't be able to annotate on it. But it is a way to like share the question. Again, it's disruptive in the sense that suddenly there's this thing on their screen mm-hmm. , um, that's, that's blocking some of them. Although they're, it's funny because the people are gonna be, uh, actually [00:39:00] over here in the image over here if they have a side by side set up. [00:39:03] So, but, um, but generally, yeah, the broadcast messaging, I would say like a two minute warning is usually really useful, like a halfway through two minutes left. But, um, the countdown clock up here is, is really, really helpful for most. . [00:39:17] Sarah: Yeah, I'll start using that. I haven't used that. I didn't know it existed. [00:39:20] And, and so thanks to your checklist, I now know where it is. So, so, um, yeah, we're coming to the end and, and so let's not forget to mention your checklist, but we started with the beginning. We went through the, you know, breakout rooms and all of that. And you said in the design, it's so important to also think. [00:39:40] you know, how are we gonna end this? So what is a good ending? What is, do you use any rituals or, um, yeah. You mentioned pictures, I think in one of the tips as well where you kind of take a screenshot of everybody. What are some good ideas for ending [00:39:56] Robbie: calls? Well, I think a lot of times calls end [00:40:00] with, well, we don't really have any time for anymore questions. [00:40:04] Like, and that's it. So if it's a presentation, I think it's really smart to. like two minutes. The end where you say, you know, oh, okay. Let me just, um, you know, those were great questions. Lemme just share some closing thoughts and then you have like the reiteration of your main point. Not, not new information, but like, it could be a reiteration of your main point. [00:40:26] It could be call to action or here are some next steps, or Here's what's coming up. , but you make sure that the, you know, if you're hosting, you give the mic back to the speaker, you thank them, you let them have two minutes, and then you take it back and say like, thank you. Here's what's happening next. So we just, you wanna think about having kind of a close, um, that isn't just, you know, wa wa we're out of time and, um, and, and gets people thinking about what do they do with this next, I, I like to do something I call calendaring, connecting, collaborating, and I do this both [00:41:00] in person. [00:41:01] as well as online when I design calendaring. Connecting, collaborating. So calendaring is you ask everyone to take a minute to think about one thing they can do in the next two weeks that they will help them move forward on this topic. And you say, great, now that you have that idea, open your calendar on your phone and find a time in the next two weeks that you're gonna be able to do that. [00:41:22] And like, look at your notes from today and. Connecting is if you're not quite sure what to do or you need some help, uh, look around to the people that you've been meeting with today and in breakout rooms and me and other. Here are some other people and resources. These are the people that you can sup, get support from. [00:41:39] Write down their names. Make sure that in those two weeks you also reach out to some of them and say hello and build a connection or deepen a connection. And then collaboration is that we're not doing any of this alone. I'd love to know. What happens next? Um, you know, lean into each other together. We're gonna build great things. [00:41:56] So, you know, this is your community. And I think that [00:42:00] particularly if, if your goal is to move people from inspiration to action, having that kind of ritualistic closure is helpful because, You know, some people will take tons of notes, but it's, it's useless without a plan. And others are just listening and not taking notes and so they, they also don't have a plan. [00:42:17] And so building some time in, and that could be 10 minutes, that could be a, a, you can really draw that out if you wanted to, or it could be something you do kind of quickly. [00:42:26] Sarah: Mm-hmm. . Yeah. I love that. And I love that. , you know, we allow ourselves to have time for that. Uh, and that really needs to be planned into the whole Yes. [00:42:37] Uh, meeting. Right. Oftentimes, like you said, you kind of find yourself just rushed at the end and it's just like, [00:42:43] Robbie: okay, bye. Best content is more. Yeah. I think too often we try to cram a lot in, I wrote my first book in order to stop doing two hour programs. Mm-hmm. , like I had been doing this two hour talk for years and years and years, and I thought if I had a book, , I could say, oh, and you [00:43:00] can read more about that in my book and not have to say every single word. [00:43:04] And so similarly today, like we're not, I haven't, I mean, literally, I almost, you know, 20% of the book is on breakout Ri, so we, we scratch the surface of it, but it gets people the information to realize that there is a new way and then they can go investigate and DIY on their own or seek out support if they need it. [00:43:22] But yeah, I, I, there's a lot of. [00:43:25] Sarah: Yeah. And since you said less content is more. Right. I think also, uh, a point you made is like, don't, don't hide behind the slides. Mm-hmm. , especially if, if we're talking about community calls and, and not, you know, some kind of corporate settings. So definitely, yeah. That's one big one for me. [00:43:46] It's like yeah, the, whenever you can show up on the camera and not behind the slide. Yeah. Yeah. Amazing. Wonderful. Well, please do share, uh, again, the name of your [00:44:00] book and that, uh, p d f that people can download and look at your videos to go and dive deeper. [00:44:07] Robbie: Yeah. So, um, the book is called Break Out of Boredom, low Tech Solutions for Highly Engaging Zoom Events. [00:44:14] Uh, it is gonna be published, uh, later this week. So I'm gonna just tell you if you go to breakout of boredom.com. , um, after March 5th or sixth, the, the link will be live and ready to go. Um, building a huge launch team right now, so reach out. If you're interested in being part of that, I'd love a review and the videos that you're mentioning, it sounds like you've done a good job diving into them. [00:44:38] they're available@robbiesamuels.com slash videos, and they're also some of the bonus content. So the book has a lot of free bonus content and the videos, which are 30. Strategy videos and my no more bad zoom settings checklist. Those are, um, one of, I think 10 or 11 resources that are, um, sort of bonus content [00:45:00] that goes with the book, though, all that's available at the breakout of boredom.com. [00:45:05] Sarah: Wonderful. Thank you so much, Robbie. I always have one last question that I ask all my gifts and that is, what are you grateful for today or [00:45:13] Robbie: this. , my wife , she's amazing. Uh, she actually recently got laid off and wasn't feeling well. And yet, despite both those challenges, has been an incredible support. [00:45:24] I've had a very busy, uh, couple of months getting ready for this book, writing and launching at the same time. Um, and she holds our family together and our house together. And she, when we got married, said, you know, , you have higher earning potential than I do cuz you're entrepreneurial. And I said you may regret them saying that [00:45:44] And here we are. Um, it's true. I I am, I've got a business cuz I had someone who really believed in me and makes space for what I'm trying to create. So it's, you all need to thank her because I've been able to do a lot of good for a lot of people, [00:46:00] uh, because there's someone in my life who believes in, what's her name, Robbie. [00:46:03] Sarah: Her name is. Hi Jess. I hope you're listening to this . Wonderful. Thank you so much for taking the time to to meet here. Thank you. Appreciate it. Thank you. So much you could I info this conversation right? I hope you took some notes. Uh, please find out more about Robbie and his work@robbiesamuels.com. And if you didn't take notes, go over to uh, find his checklist@robbiesamuels.com slash videos for his 30 plus Zoom strategy videos and checklists. [00:46:37] Uh, his podcast where I'll be a guest on soon as well, I is called on the schmooze, and you can find it on the schmooze.com. And his book, uh, again, is called Break Out of Boredom, low Tech Solutions for Highly Engaging Zoom Events. And if you're looking for others who think like you, then why not join us in the Humane Marketing Circle? [00:46:58] Find out more [00:47:00] at humane.marketing/circle. As I mentioned before, we meet twice monthly on Zoom right now, and our calls are definitely non boring and highly engaging because everyone is heard and seen. So again, humane.marketing. Circle. You find the show notes of this episode@humane.marketing slash 60 and 60 episodes. [00:47:27] Wow, I can't believe it. On this beautiful page, you'll also find a series of free offers, such as my Saturday newsletter, the Humane Business Manifesto, and the free gentle confidence mini course, as well as my two books, marketing like we're human and selling like we're human, and. Audiobook fan. Uh, this is just a reminder that marketing like we're human is now also available in audio format on Audible or anywhere else where you get your audiobooks. [00:47:58] Of course, read by [00:48:00] yours. Truly. Thank you so much for listening and being part of a generation of marketers who cares for yourself, your clients, and the planet. We are change makers before we are marketers, so go be the change you want to see in the. Speak soon.

Today's conversation fits under the P of Passion If you're a regular here, you know that I'm organizing the conversations around the 7Ps of the Humane Marketing Mandala. (If you're new here and don't know what I'm talking about you can download your 1page marketing plan with the Humane Marketing version of the 7 Ps of Marketing at humane.marketing/1page. It comes with 7 email prompts to really help you reflect on these different Ps). In today's solo episode, I'll dive into the P of passion, and figuring out your WHY: The 17 Sustainable Development Goals and what they are Why they can help us figure out our WHY How to take those big global goals and apply them to our own personal, human level Why we're sometimes stuck on our journey to finding our why - and what to do in that case And so much more Sarah's Resources (FREE) Sarah's One Page Marketing Plan (FREE) Sarah Suggests Newsletter (FREE) The Humane Business Manifesto (FREE) Gentle Confidence Mini-Course Marketing Like We're Human - Sarah's book The Humane Marketing Circle Authentic & Fair Pricing Mini-Course Podcast Show Notes We use Descript to edit our episodes and it's fantastic! Email Sarah at sarah@sarahsantacroce.com Thanks for listening!   After you listen, check out Humane Business Manifesto, an invitation to belong to a movement of people who do business the humane and gentle way and disrupt the current marketing paradigm. 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Warmly, Sarah Imperfect Transcript of the show We use and love Descript to edit our podcast and provide this free transcript of the episode. And yes, that's an affiliate link. Ep 157 [00:00:00] Hello, humane marketers. Welcome back to the Humane Marketing Podcast, the place to be for the generation of marketers that cares. This is a show where we talk about running your business in a way that feels good to you, is aligned with your values, and also resonates with today's conscious customers because it's humane, ethical, and non-pushy. [00:00:23] I'm Sarah z Croce, your hippie turn business coach for quietly rebellious entrepreneurs and marketing impact by. Mama Bear of the Humane Marketing Circle and renegade author of marketing like we're human and selling like we're human. If after listening to the show for a while, you are ready to move on to the next level and start implementing and would welcome a community of like-minded, quietly rebellious entrepreneurs who discuss with transparency. [00:00:52] Works and what doesn't work in business, then we'd love to welcome you in our humane marketing circle. If you're picturing your [00:01:00] typical Facebook group, let me paint a new picture for you. This is a closed community of like-minded entrepreneurs from all over the world who come together once per month in a Zoom circle workshop to hold each other accountable and build their business. [00:01:15] Sustainable way we share with transparency and vulnerability, what works for us and what doesn't work, so that you can figure out what works for you instead of keep throwing spaghetti on the wall and seeing what sticks. Find out more at humane.marketing/circle, and if you prefer one-on-one support from me. [00:01:37] My humane business Coaching could be just what you need, whether it's for your marketing, sales, general, business building, or help. Idea like writing a book. I'd love to share my brain and my heart with you together with my almost 15 years business experience and help you grow a sustainable business that is joyful and sustainable. [00:01:58] If you love this [00:02:00] podcast, wait until I show you my mama bear qualities as my one-on-one client can find out more@humane.marketing slash. And finally, if you are a Marketing Impact pioneer and would like to bring Humane Marketing to your organization, have a look at my offers and workshops on my website@humane.marketing. [00:02:27] Hello, my friends. Welcome back. Today I'm recording a solo episode, and today's conversation fits under the P of Passion. So the first P, if you're a regular here, you know that I'm organizing the conversations around the seven Ps of the Humane Marketing Mandala. And if you're new here and don't know what I'm talking about, you can download your one page marketing plan with the humane marketing version of the seven Ps of marketing. [00:02:55] humane.marketing/one [00:03:00] page, the number one and the wordage. It comes with seven email prompts to really help you reflect on these different Ps for your business. So in today's solo episode, I'll dive into the P of passion, the first P and um, help you or. Hopefully plant some seeds to help you figure out your why. [00:03:26] I'll be talking about the 17 sustainable development goals and what they are, why they can help us figure out our why. , how to take those big global goals and apply them to our own personal human level. Why we're sometimes stuck on our journey to finding out our why and what to do in that case. Okay. [00:03:52] This is usually the part where I introduce my guest, but since it's just me today, I'll just introduce myself [00:04:00] again. I'm Sarah Z, as you know, the host of this podcast and founder of the Humane Marketing Revolution. I've grown up in this online marketing space, having founded my first LinkedIn consulting business in 2008. [00:04:16] Running and marketing this business for over a decade. Experiencing the rough world out there inspired me to create a global movement that encourages people to bring more empathy and kindness to business and marketing. That is my why. I call myself a hippie turn business coach because I've grown up in a small commun. [00:04:40] Here in Switzerland, which I talk about in my marketing, like we're human book. I also call myself the Mama Bear of our Humane Marketing Circle, our community of change makers and marketers who want to do marketing differently. and are part of this generation of marketers who [00:05:00] cares personality-wise, I'm a non-conformist and do business my way. [00:05:06] Even if sometimes that's, it's hard because everybody else does it differently. And so I have to keep reminding myself, but no, that way doesn't feel good. I'll do it my way. I'm a card caring, introvert and proud. So that's something I knew about myself. Uh, For, yeah, years and years. Um, what I did discover, um, fairly recently, a few years ago, is that I'm also an H S P, so highly sensitive person. [00:05:38] I'm a Capricorn, I'm a generator in the human design. I'm a type four in the Enneagram, and I'm an I N F J in the Meyers Bricks, uh, personality assessments. As I said, I'm like a mama bear. I am gentle but fierce. I do no harm, [00:06:00] but I take no shit either , so I really feel like this mama bear in front of the cave who's, you know, really protect, protecting her cubs. [00:06:10] That's how I feel like with my clients and, and the humane marketing circle. I'm extremely loyal and all my one-on-one clients have become good friends. So well, that's my self introduction for today. So with that, let's jump right in and talk about this idea of using the 17 sustainable development goals for or to help us find our Y. [00:06:37] So recently on a discovery call for the marketing like we're human program. A future participant asked me about the why. So the discovery of our why is part of the first module of that program and the P of passion. So she told me that she'd been on other programs where they just told her to, you know, figure [00:07:00] out your why. [00:07:01] and she's like, well, yeah, obviously we all kind of know now that this is part of, you know, our business and, and our marketing. But she's like, well, I felt so lost. How, how do you go about this, Sarah? Like, are you gonna help us , you know, beyond just telling us, well, now go figure it out, because it's obviously easier said than done. [00:07:25] And so that's when I mentioned that, uh, I use. Uh, among other things I used the 17 sustainable development goals to look at our why and, um, that's what I want to explain in this episode. . So let's start with the definition of the 17 sustainable development goals. So the 17 SDGs were adopted by the United Nations in 2015 as a universal call to action to end poverty, [00:08:00] protect the planet, and ensure that all people enjoy peace and prosperity. [00:08:05] So these are big goals on, you know, government. Type of goals, uh, country level type of goals. But again, I'll show you in a bit how we can use them and apply them to our human level. So let me read you the 17 sustainable Development goals. First one is no poverty. The second one is zero hunger. Third is good health and wellbeing. [00:08:30] Four is quality education, five is gender equality. Six is clean water and sanitation. seven is affordable and clean energy. Eight is decent work in economic growth. Nine is industry innovation and infrastructure. 10 is reduced inequalities. 11 is sustainable cities and communities. 12, responsible consumption and production.[00:09:00] [00:09:00] 13, climate action. 14. Life below water, 15, life on land. 16, peace, justice, and strong institutions. And 17 partnerships for the goals. So these. The 17 sustainable, uh, development goals. You can also go actually over to, uh, the global goals.org/goals website and, uh, have a look at the more information about these 17 goals. [00:09:33] And it comes with, um, kind of nice pictograms for each of the goals. So, As solo printers, coaches, healers, service professionals, these goals can obviously sound huge and overwhelming. And we might be thinking, well, how does this apply to me? What kind of difference can I make on my little one-on-one working with clients type [00:10:00] of business? [00:10:01] But the idea is not to make one of these goals. Our goal. Instead, what I ask participants of the marketing like we're human program, is to look at these goals and think about which one or two most resonate with them or with their ideal clients. What's the one thing that's most important to them, or in this case to you, dear listener, is that gender equality? [00:10:31] Is it good health and wellbeing? Is it to end poverty? , which one, of course, they're all important, but as change makers, we usually resonate more with one than others. For me, for example, it's decent work and economic growth. , so that's number eight. And the second one would be partnerships for the goals. So yeah, I noticed [00:11:00] that for myself, I want to make a difference and change the way we market so that we can use business as a lever for good. [00:11:09] Of course, I also care about zero hunger. , but it's just not in my zone of genius. I have no experience in that field. Um, I care strongly, but it's not where I can personally make an impact given the, yeah, the background and experience that I have. and my ideal clients struggle with sharing their gifts and therefore can use my help so that we all generate more economic growth together. [00:11:40] So that's why I feel strongly about the goal, decent work and economic growth. I feel like I, we, if we all had decent work that we love, the world would be a better place. business really can help to make a change for good. So something [00:12:00] that I want to promote. I also believe in a new perspective on work, which is focused on being more human and creating lives instead of just working and working and hustling and all of that. [00:12:16] and knowing more about myself. So that's has more to do with the personal power. P I'm a Capricorn, and so work in its largest sense is my topic. That's what I'm here to do in this lifetime. Um, . I just notice as much as I want to go into other topics and they do help me, you know, kind of with this work life balance, um, connecting with nature, being more artistic. [00:12:47] But what it comes down to for me is always kind of like related to the, yeah, the. , the making a living, right? [00:13:00] The, the, the money as well. The Capricorns are about work and so maybe why I am here at this moment of time, um, is also to help change this relationship to work. So I think that's why this, uh, number eight goal, decent work in economic growth, uh, speaks to me more than others. [00:13:23] So I hope you see how I had to really extrapolate from their descriptions of the un description of the goal and make it mine, because frankly, I don't really care about economic growth. Like that is so foreign language for me. But what I do care about is the way. Make a life for ourselves. The way, um, you know, justice like that, the, that, that there is enough, uh, work and that there is enough income for everybody and that work doesn't have to be such a, [00:14:00] A rough experience for us that we can care more about our work and our business and, and that business again also becomes part of the change, that as entrepreneurs, we can participate in making the world a better place. [00:14:18] So, . That's why it makes sense that my why is to bring more empathy and kindness to the business and marketing world. I hope, uh, my example kind of helps you understand how I look at these goals. They basically show us all the problems we have in our world right now. All the things that are broken and need fixing. [00:14:42] to me that's one way to find our why, find something that's bigger than ourselves that we have experienced that didn't work for us, that frustrates us, and that we want to fix. Again, I'm taking my example, is like I've been in this online [00:15:00] marketing world, business world for, you know, over a decade and it just did not work for me because I felt like. [00:15:08] You know, it's just business. Business is just business. It's not personal. That's what I always heard. And, and that just didn't no longer work for me. I'm like, no, this needs to be different. There needs to be a place for empathy and kindness in business and marketing. So that's the bigger thing. That's what, you know, keeps me going to create that change. [00:15:29] That is my why. And so it's bigger than me. Um, Because I'm not just doing it for myself, I'm really doing it kind of like, well, that's the small change I want to make. Um, and I'm not saying that's an easy process. It really isn't. It wasn't easy for myself. I, again, something I talk about in the, in the book. [00:15:55] Um, and it's not easy for the participants of my program [00:16:00] either. It, I call it the grown zone. Uh, you know, you're. Rumbling. Um, again, , the, the, the three parts of the marketing like we're human book is rumble, uh, rise and resonate. And so discovering who you are, discovering your why really is that rumbling and [00:16:22] That's why it's also the grown zone where you're just like, Oh, this is so hard. Um, and especially it's super hard for participants who come out of a corporate experience because frankly, in corporate life, nobody ever asks you what your why is. You are just basically, if the company has a why, you're like, well, this is your why now. [00:16:47] But oftentimes, companies, corporates don't have a why either. So you. You know, this is totally new. And so, yeah, it, it's not an easy process, but once you have it, [00:17:00] everything just makes sense. Everything you do is aligned with why you do it, and you keep showing up no matter how hard things are, because you kind of have this north star at your following because it comes from within as well, right? [00:17:16] It's not this, it's not this exterior thing like, I think oftentimes clients, I think that having your why is just kind of this one liner that you have to have on your website. And so they're kind of searching for something external where actually it has to come from within and it ha you have to do that in their work so that it's unshakable. [00:17:46] That's why. So, um, , they do always find their why, the participants of the, the program. It's, it's just sometimes it doesn't happen within the 10 weeks of the program. Um, and [00:18:00] you know, you sometimes you just have to plant the seeds, let it go, and then, uh, it will come when the time is ready. So, Um, I do also want to address that, uh, on occasion a person is completely stuck like I was on my journey, and, and that happens usually when the focus is too much on oneself, meaning that there's a lot of unalign that first needs to be fixed before we can go, you know, and, and fix things for others. [00:18:33] It's kind of like this, uh, analogy that we always use with the mask, um, the oxygen mask in the plane. Um, so in other words, we can't pick a why or find our why if we are still broken ourselves. We need to fix ourselves first. So we need to let go of the Y for a bit and continue walking into the labyrinth and rumble [00:19:00] with our story. [00:19:01] Um, again, that's the metaphor I use in the, in the marketing, like we're human book this metaphor of. rumbling while you walk into the labyrinth of your life. Coming to the center, standing in the middle of the labyrinth and rising in that middle, finding out how you are uniquely different, rising above, you know, the, the, the noise, and then walking back out as the new person that resonates with others. [00:19:32] that means, you know, needing to let go of old stories, limiting beliefs, gain confidence in what you're offering, um, and, and believing that that has huge value. So you really need to become whole again. Once you're whole, that's when you can go out and look for that, why that's bigger than yourself. So, um, yeah, it's really this idea.[00:20:00] [00:20:00] fixing ourselves first before trying to come up with a why that's bigger than ourselves. Um, that, that we, that feels co completely overwhelming because we are not whole yet. So, Maybe to, to wrap up again. Um, have a look at these 17 sustainable development goals, even if you are not yet on that journey to look at your why, but, um, it's just an interesting perspective to think about humanity and where we are now and all the big problems. [00:20:38] I think obviously they're formulated in this, in the, you know, terms of, in terms of goals, but really what there are is, these are the big giant problems we have as humanity right now, and that's what we're all trying to fix. Uh, they are doing that on a government level, but everybody counts right now. And so we are doing an ad on the, on [00:21:00] the human level, on the, you know, this is what I care about and this is where I'm gonna make a difference. [00:21:05] And if I'm not. An immediate or direct impact, then I'm helping my clients and they are also, uh, making an impact, right? So it's this ripple effect as well. So have a look at, uh, global goals.org/goals to find out more about each of the goals and hopefully, uh, it gives you an idea and you can pick one or two of those goals that really matter to. [00:21:34] like I said, I'm taking participants of the marketing like we're human program through this process to find their why and then make their way through the rest of the seven piece of the humane marketing, uh, mandala. So the second one is personal power, and then people, product, pricing, promotion, and partnership. [00:21:54] And it's a live program with a video course component. and the current cohort is [00:22:00] at the P of product right now. So that's where we're talking about their offering, their service pages on the website and, and all of that. And a new cohort will start in August. So you can have a. A look at the details already on humane.marketing/program, if this resonates and, uh, why not book a chat with me? [00:22:23] I'm wanting to chat with all the participants first, just to see where you're at and if this is a good fit for you. So again, humane.marketing/program. And if you. Just somewhere else in your journey right now. Maybe you already have your why you, you know, all of this. If you're just looking for others who think like you and want to do marketing differently. [00:22:49] then why not join us in the Humane Marketing Circle? Uh, again, it's our community where I'm the Mama Bear and, uh, everybody else is, is a leader in, [00:23:00] uh, in their chair. So you can find out more about that@humane.marketing For slash Circle, you find the show notes of this episode@humane.marketing slash 1 58. [00:23:14] And on this beautiful page, you'll also find a series of free offer. Such as my Saturday newsletter, the Humane Business Manifesto, and the free Gentle Confidence mini course, as well as my two books, marketing like we're Human and selling like we're human. Thank you so much for listening today and being a part of a generation of marketers who cares for yourself, your clients, and the planet. [00:23:40] We are change makers before we are marketers. So now go be that change you want to see in the world. Speak.

Today's conversation fits under the P of Promotion. If you're a regular here, you know that I'm organizing the conversations around the 7Ps of the Humane Marketing Mandala. (If you're new here and don't know what I'm talking about you can download your 1page marketing plan with the Humane Marketing version of the 7 Ps of Marketing at humane.marketing/1page. It comes with 7 email prompts to really help you reflect on these different Ps). My guest today is Teresa Heath-Wareing. Teresa Heath-Wareing is an online business, marketing & mindset expert who works with business owners from across the world, helping them to build a business and life they love. As well as inspiring members to dream big and set ambitious long term business goals, Teresa equips them with practical actionable steps to get them closer to their goals. Her holistic emphasis on the whole business, and the mindset of the business owner, enables her members to navigate the world of running a business with Teresa as their biggest cheerleader. An international best-selling author, award winning speaker and TEDx speaker. She is the host of the Your Dream Business Podcast.Teresa is recognised alongside some of the world's digital marketing thought leaders and is widely regarded as one of the UK's leading marketing influencers. In this episode, you'll learn about humane listbuilding as well as... How to get started with building an email list How to get people on to your list, in a saturated market where we all have too much email already? How to create a 'Freebie' worth downloading What about the tech? What do we send out once people downloaded our Freebie? How do we make Email Marketing humane and non pushy? And so much more Teresa's Resources Teresa's Mindset Hacks for Small Business Owners Teresa's Website Your Dream Business Podcast Connect with Teresa on: LinkedIn Facebook Twitter Sarah's Resources Watch this episode on Youtube (FREE) Sarah's One Page Marketing Plan (FREE) Sarah Suggests Newsletter (FREE) The Humane Business Manifesto (FREE) Gentle Confidence Mini-Course Marketing Like We're Human - Sarah's book The Humane Marketing Circle Authentic & Fair Pricing Mini-Course Podcast Show Notes We use Descript to edit our episodes and it's fantastic! Email Sarah at sarah@sarahsantacroce.com Thanks for listening!   After you listen, check out Humane Business Manifesto, an invitation to belong to a movement of people who do business the humane and gentle way and disrupt the current marketing paradigm. You can download it for free at this page. There's no opt-in. Just an instant download. Are you enjoying the podcast?  The Humane Marketing show is listener-supported—I'd love for you to become an active supporter of the show and join the Humane Marketing Circle. You will be invited to a private monthly Q&A call with me and fellow Humane Marketers -  a safe zone to hang out with like-minded conscious entrepreneurs and help each other build our business and grow our impact.  — I'd love for you to join us! Learn more at humane.marketing/circle Don't forget to subscribe to the show on iTunes or on Android to get notified for all my future shows and why not sign up for my weekly(ish) "Sarah Suggests Saturdays", a round-up of best practices, tools I use, books I read, podcasts, and other resources. Raise your hand and join the Humane Business Revolution. Warmly, Sarah Imperfect Transcript of the show We use and love Descript to edit our podcast and provide this free transcript of the episode. And yes, that's an affiliate link. Ep 156 [00:00:00] Sarah: Hello, humane marketers. Welcome back to the Humane Marketing Podcast, the place to be for the generation of marketers that cares. This is a show where we talk about running your business in a way that feels good to you, is aligned with your values, and also resonates with today's conscious customers because it's humane, ethical, and non-pushy. [00:00:23] I'm Sarah z Croce, your hippie turn business coach for quietly rebellious entrepreneurs and marketing impact pioneers. Mama Bear of the Humane Marketing Circle. And renegade author of marketing like We're human and selling like we're human. If after listening to the show for a while, you are ready to move on to the next level and start implementing and would welcome a community of like-minded, quietly rebellious entrepreneurs who discuss with transparency what. [00:00:52] Works and what doesn't work in business, then we'd love to welcome you in our humane marketing circle. If you're picturing your [00:01:00] typical Facebook group, let me paint a new picture for you. This is a closed community of like-minded entrepreneurs from all over the world who come together once per month in a Zoom Circle workshop to hold each other accountable and build their business in a sustainable way. [00:01:16] We share with transparency and vulnerability what works for us and what doesn't work, so that you can figure out what works for you instead of keep throwing spaghetti. On the wall and seeing what sticks. Find out more at humane.marketing/circle, and if you prefer one-on-one support from me. My Humane Business Coaching could be just what you need, whether it's for your marketing, sales, general business building, or help with your big idea like writing a book. [00:01:47] I'd love to share my brain and my heart with you together with my almost 15 years business experience and help you grow a sustainable business that is joyful and sustainable. If you love this [00:02:00] podcast, wait until I show you my Mama Bear qualities as my one-on-one client can find out more at Humane Marketing slash coaching. [00:02:10] And finally, if you are a Marketing Impact pioneer and would like to bring Humane Marketing to your organization, have a look at my offers and workshops on my website@humane.marketing. [00:02:31] Hello friends. Welcome back. I hope you're doing well. Before we dive into today's conversation, I just want to take a moment to tell you a bit about what's new in our community. The Humane Marketing Circle. As you know, that's the community for quietly rebellious entrepreneurs who are ready for something different, something new, a new way of marketing, and a new way of business building really. [00:02:58] and also a new [00:03:00] way of being in community. So here's how our community calls work. In the first half of the call, members bring their questions and we have a conversation about what works for us in marketing. For example, on one of the last calls we talked about ai. We share tools, but also discuss benefits, dangers, and overall ethical questions that AI brings up. [00:03:27] And in the second half of the call, we always go into breakout rooms to have a more intimate conversation with another heart-centered entrepreneur, which is super valuable to have kind of this one-on-one or two-on-one feedback. And this month's topic is the P of Personal Power, and we discuss how. Our core values make us and our business really different from our peers. [00:03:55] So that's the format of our calls. And in [00:04:00] 2022 we came together once per month for a call. But now in 2023 we have two monthly meetings and one of the calls is hosted by me, the other call is hosted by one of our ambassador team members in turn. So there's a small team of ambassadors, circle members who are now have stepped up and are now hosting these calls in turn. [00:04:24] And I'm just so happy to see that taking place cuz that was exactly my vision for the Humane Marketing Circle. Kind of this responsibility of the members stepping up. That means we get even more opportunity to bring our questions and learn from everyone. We're also currently transitioning to our new community platform on Cajabi, and it really looks great and has all the features that we were missing on Trello, which was the tool that we used to use before. [00:04:59] And so that [00:05:00] new platform helps us stay connected with each other, in between the calls, hold each other accountable with challenges, messaging between members and so much more. And really, I resisted this for a long time because it's just not my zone of genius to kind of facilitate these online platforms or, or groups. [00:05:22] But the members have asked for it. And so we're creating it. And actually to help me with the facilitation of this community, this online community, I also just hired a community facilitator. So not to be confused with a social. Manager who's just posting questions and, and you know, visuals and quotes and things. [00:05:46] But really, Eddie that's the name of the great guy that we hired as a community facilitator. His main role is to facilitate the interactions between members, nurture [00:06:00] relationships, and help people get answers within that online community. And Eddie studied this, so he studied community design and I'm, yeah, I'm really super excited to have him on board. [00:06:14] The best thing right now is that if you join right now, the price is still at the same low $37 per month, after a $7 for seven day trial. So you can, will also just check us out to see it. Probably join just before one of the calls to get that live interaction and see if we're the right fit for you. With the second monthly call. [00:06:39] And once the Cajabi community is fully developed and active, I'll bring the rate back up to 47 per month. But for the next few weeks, it will remain at 37 per month. And that's lifetime. So if you join now, that will always be your monthly rate. So now is a good [00:07:00] time to join us and build this different way of marketing together. [00:07:05] Well that's why we're calling it a A revolution. A humane revolution. So if you'd like to be supported by a group of like-minded individuals, I call them the quietly rebellious entrepreneurs, they're also all deep think. So if that's your kind of people that you want to hang out with and learn from and share with, then check out the details at humane.marketing/circle. [00:07:34] Okay, back to the show. Today's conversation fits under the P of promotion. And if you are already regular here, you know that I'm organizing the conversations around the seven Ps of the Humane Marketing Mandala. And if this is your first time here, big warm welcome. You probably don't know what I'm talking about, but you can download your one-page marketing plan with the humane marketing [00:08:00] version of the seven Ps of marketing@humane.marketing slash one page, the number one and the word page. [00:08:08] And this comes with seven email prompts to really help you reflect on these different PS for your business. . So my guest today is Teresa Heath Waring, and she is an online business marketing and mindset expert who works with business owners from across the world, helping them to build a business and life they love, as well as inspiring members to dream big and set ambitious long-term business goals. [00:08:37] Teresa equips them with Practic. Actionable steps to get them closer to their goals. Her holistic emphasis on the whole business and the mindset of the business owner enables her members to navigate a world of running a business with Theresa as their biggest cheerleader, an international bestselling author, award-winning speaker and [00:09:00] TEDx speaker. [00:09:00] She is the host of your dream business podcast, which where I used to be a guest as well. And Theresa is recognized alongside some of the world's digital marketing thought leaders and is widely regarded as one of the UK's leading marketing influencers. . In today's episode, I asked Teresa to come onto the Humane Marketing Podcast to talk about Humane List building. [00:09:27] Theresa and I discussed the following topics, how to get started with building an email list, how to get people onto your list in a saturated market where we all have too much email already, how to create a freebie really worth downloading. How about the tech that so many people are afraid of what to send out once people actually downloaded our freebie and our on our email list, and how do we make email marketing humane and non-pushy [00:10:00] and so much more? [00:10:01] So let's just dive right in. Here's Theresa and me talking about humane list building. . Hi Theresa. I'm so excited for our conversation. [00:10:13] Teresa: Yay. Thanks for being here. Nice too. No, my pleasure. I'm excited too. Wonderful. [00:10:18] Sarah: So we could have had. So many topics to talk about, right? Mm-hmm. . But when we first chatted I was like, well, you just finished one of your list building challenges. [00:10:29] And so I was like, oh, I think that is a good one. And we actually met on a, what was it called? Exactly, something with Authentic Marketing Summit with Marcy. And, and so I was like, oh, okay, so this is the right person to talk about humane list building. And so that's what I yeah, that's what I think where we can go. [00:10:50] But as I just said offline, I think for most people it's like, okay, that sounds like a good idea to build your email list. [00:11:00] But where do I get started? How do I get started? Yeah. So maybe just tell us a little bit about who you are and then as you can tell, We have a habit here to just dive in. [00:11:12] That is and go into the [00:11:13] Teresa: topic. I have no problem with that. So I am a a business owner, an online business owner, a speaker, a podcaster, an author. But basically I help amazing business owners, predominantly women. Not that I only work with women, but I seem to attract a lot of women who are trying to create a business and life that actually works for them and their season of life, and isn't something that they've looked at that some experts told them, it's gotta be this way, or you've gotta win this much, or you've gotta charge this much, or you've gotta earn seven figures and you've gotta do it online. [00:11:49] It's about understanding who they are and what they want and what's important to them and their season of life, because we all have other people in our world and other things in our world, and we need to [00:12:00] make sure that our business balance with those things so that we're creating. Not this monster that actually we end up going, this is not what I want to do. [00:12:09] Mm-hmm. we create something that we're going to love. So I do that and I do it in a variety of ways and, and those ways include more of a mindset, kind of motivational, inspirational side. But also I'm incredibly practical because of the fact of, I have 18 years experience in marketing now, which is a really long time. [00:12:30] And I have worked with hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of business owners during that time. . I know that sometimes you need the motivation and the inspiration and the mindset and the personal development, and sometimes you just need someone to give you a straight answer. So hopefully that's what I bring with both. [00:12:48] And one of the things that I talk a lot about and one of my, my key things I guess, that I teach on is list building. And it's so important because no matter what [00:13:00] role I've been in and I've been in, as you can imagine, many, many, many different marketing roles from, you know, heading up corporate marketing for Land Rover UK to working with a teeny tiny company that has no budget and I have to do everything. [00:13:12] So I've kind of done it all. And one thing that has never really gone away, and in fact in my mind is just going to strength to strength is email marketing. Mm-hmm. , and I think probably a few. Years back when social media really kicked in, maybe, gosh, even now. Well, I started my business eight years ago and it was probably at that point it was really getting good for business. [00:13:36] I think people thought, oh, well we have all these new amazing ways I'm gonna do this and I don't need to think about some of these old school ways. But actually that's moved. Email has moved with social media and with technology. And when you are in marketing or when, well, whether you have a business or whatever it is, and you're trying to market more options are better than less always.[00:14:00] [00:14:00] So it's so important to make sure that you've got that email list or you have another way to contact them. And the other key thing is that often, if. Communicating with your clients or your per perspective customers through social media. You don't own that platform. That platform is not you. Yours, you are marketing on borrowed ground. [00:14:17] So basically you are marketing on something that doesn't belong to you. And at any point, as we well know, because Instagram changes like the wind, that they can change something and it completely affects everything. And at the moment, you know, and I'll openly talk about stuff myself, but my own Instagram is terrible at the moment. [00:14:34] Like in terms of the engagement on the post, it's so much worse than it used to be. So we need to make sure we have somewhere else that we can market directly to our customers. So in terms of getting started, it's a couple of things, and this is why I think so many people get put off by it because it can feel overwhelming. [00:14:52] there's a few things you have to think about first. First is how are you gonna email them? And this is the bit that no one wants to think about cuz this is the [00:15:00] tech. But ultimately you can't do this without some tech, but it's not big and massive and huge and it's not fancy funnels and clever things. [00:15:11] It's just a case of you need a system that you can add email addresses to and then send an email to those people. Now you can't do it through your normal email, so you can't do it through. . If you know you're using a business address or a Gmail, or it's hosted by Gmail, or you're an Outlook, you can't send them through that. [00:15:29] And the reason you can't do that is, one, they're not designed to do that. And two, you have to have an unsubscribe on a marketing email, and you can't have that. That isn't standard. It has to be standard. So it's much safer and much smarter to get a system. Now, the one I recommend for everyone getting started is mail light. [00:15:49] Lots of people know MailChimp. Mm-hmm. . And I know lots of people are on MailChimp, and they might be like, well, why wouldn't you recommend MailChimp? I describe MailChimp. Not that they would thank me for it but I [00:16:00] describe them as like, A house. So a house that was built a long time ago, and then they had an extension put on, and then they realized they needed more rooms. [00:16:08] They added a bit over here, and then they wanted something over here and then, and basically they've built on, so mail ch MailChimp was there for a really long time, but they've added in all that functionality after the fact. And it just doesn't quite seem to flow right. It doesn't quite seem to like, it's not very intuitive. [00:16:26] It's not particularly easy. There's a couple of really funky, weird things that it does. So for me, someone like Maite who started off basically as if they bought a piece of land and go, right, how are we gonna build this? And then they built it right in the first place because obviously they, they're not that old, whereas MailChimp is old. [00:16:41] So [00:16:41] Sarah: I think that's another fact, like, you know, MailChimp is old or you know, in terms of social media, old, and so they constantly had to adapt. And so that's why it's just house stuck. I kept building on other things. Right? Yeah, absolutely. Where if, if you take a newer company, well they build [00:17:00] with this current circumstances in what we need. [00:17:02] Yes, [00:17:02] Teresa: yes, yes. And obviously there's gonna come a point where, you know, Mala light has to tweak and change and all the others do. And they do always constantly, but it's almost like, it's almost like they wanna start again with MailChimp. But like I said, lots of people use them. But if you haven't chose a system, or even if you are using MailChimp, male light really, really is good. [00:17:21] Very intuitive, really simple to use. But basically you need to. . So like I said, set that up and say, okay, now I've got somewhere where I can put emails in and I can email from Now, whether that's you then taking an email list that you've created in Excel or something like that and literally just putting it across, or whether that's you then creating something called a lead magnet or a content upgrade grade or whatever you wanna call it. [00:17:47] But basically you are creating an incentive to ask them to come onto your list. Right? Because as much as we'd like to think that people wake up one day and go, oh, I wonder if that person that I barely know or just followed on Instagram has an email, is they'd love to get on it. Like that [00:18:00] doesn't happen. [00:18:00] So even though we often have get on our list, on our website or something like that, I think if you honestly asked yourself how many people have opted in through that in the last month, I think most people would be like a few, a handful of people are opting in. If that makes, [00:18:15] Sarah: I'm gonna pause you there, Teresa. [00:18:16] Cause I wanna, before we move on to the opt-in or the freebie or the the lead magnet, I wanna come back to the tech because I think. You know, like you said, so many people will start with MailChimp or, or the question I have since you recommended mail or Light, is that a platform that can grow with you? [00:18:36] You, you would say that, you know, people with big businesses are still able to use? [00:18:42] Teresa: Yes and no. It's a great one to start with and it will certainly grow with most small business owners. Mm-hmm. , it can do an element of the automations. It has some good functionality in it and it's good. However, when I teach my course, I talk about three different platforms. [00:18:58] I talk about main light. If you're just [00:19:00] getting started, if you know how to do emails and you wanna start getting a bit fancy and having some call automations, then I use Active Campaign and it's very. Again, a lot of these platforms though, it's what you're used to. So there are, there's Convert Kit that's very similar. [00:19:15] There's Drip that's very similar, so there are lots of them out there and this is half the problem. Yeah, it's too, too much choice. way too much choice. And then the one I recommend, if you're going all in on an online business and you're having a membership and a checkout and landing pages and all this kind of cool stuff, then from a cost point of view, something like Kajabi could be really good. [00:19:35] Mm-hmm. . So what Kajabi has that the others don't is the facility to do all of that stuff and do it really well. The problem comes, so I currently use Kajabi to host my membership. However, I'm at a point now where I have a guy who builds all my landing pages for me. So I have a tech guy who does all that and they're built on WordPress. [00:19:57] And also I have some cool things like I have a [00:20:00] quiz. And that quiz had to plug into somewhere and Kajabi couldn't handle it. Mm-hmm. . So I've now moved to Active Campaign. I say now it's about a year. So I have active campaign for my emails. I have Kajabi for those other things. But when you, again, when you first get started, if you're going in the online world, the emails can't do. [00:20:19] Kajabi are great, but they can't go to the level the active campaign can do, or I wouldn't say they can. . And therefore at the beginning you don't wanna pay for two systems, which I didn't. I just used Kajabi and I kind of thought it is what it is, you know, I'll just have to go with it. And it was perfectly fine and good enough and capable for the job. [00:20:38] But active campaign now is much cooler. [00:20:41] Sarah: I love that you explained that because I think, yeah, there's one thing is like, okay, I wanna plan big and go big. Mm-hmm. and therefore I'm gonna go for something like, you know, Kajabi. Which was also my move. I went from, actually, I started out with Malechi, then went to AWeber, then went to Active Campaign, and this is over years and [00:21:00] years. [00:21:00] Yeah. And, and then now finally to Kajabi. And just like you, there's a little tiny me piece of me as like regretting the move to Gujabi. Yeah. Because once you're used to something like Active Campaign, which is built only for email. Yes. Then. Cajabi does not do the same job like it. It's just not, so, yeah, all it is to, to explain that, it obviously depends where your business is at. [00:21:26] Malar Light seems like a good place to start and you almost kind of maybe do have to plan that eventually, you know, there's gonna be a [00:21:35] Teresa: move. And like you said, how many of you had, how many have I had? I was male Chimp, then I was Drip cuz I went and did a certification over in Minnesota. Then I did Infusionsoft. [00:21:47] Right. So I went like, that was, and I mean, if you wanna go crazy, I mean Infusionsoft is insane. And then I went Kajabi and now I've added back in Active campaign. Mm-hmm. But like I said, it was just for that l that extra bit of [00:22:00] functionality. If you are sending emails, if you are wanting automations to go. [00:22:05] it will do it. You can do sequences in Kajabi. So it's not that it's a terrible system, but obviously if you just think about it, they are building a system with so many different things. So they can't put all of the focus into just the email side of it. Whereas, like I said, active campaign convert kit, that's all they do, right? [00:22:22] So therefore they can make sure that they've created the best email side they can. Mm-hmm. But again, you know, from a money point of view, you will be absolutely fine just using Kajabi If you are doing an online business, if you're not doing an online business and you at the moment if you just want to send an email or when someone clicks something, you can send an email for that. [00:22:42] Or if someone opts into something and send an email for that male male, a light, this is where I start getting more mixed up. Cuz there are so many, and obviously male to male light are very similar male. A light is perfectly good for that. And you're right, I think. , there will come a point where you go, okay, now I need more. [00:22:58] But at that point, you'll be able to [00:23:00] afford more. Whereas the beauty of starting on something like Maite is the fact that it's so low cost. Mm-hmm. . So even the paid version, the start of the paid version is like $10 a month. Mm-hmm. . Whereas I think probably now because of the size of my list, I probably pay $200 a month fr campaign. [00:23:16] So it's a big, big difference. So like I said, get started in those others and it's a pain to move. I'm not even gonna like, pretend it's not. It is a pain. It is a pain. I mean, it's not impossible. It's not difficult really. It's just the lot of work. And of course the more you have created. So when we went from well, when we went from Infusionsoft to. [00:23:39] Kajabi, that was a pain. And when we went from Kajabi to Active campaign, it took us, well, we haven't even finished, but we spent a solid week working on moving everything across and we haven't even finished. So it's not that it's impossible, it's just that it's a new system. You gotta get used to it and you have to move things across and it will take some time. [00:23:58] So, so yeah. But don't panic [00:24:00] about that. If you're just starting and money is more of the concern. If money's not the concern, then jump straight onto active campaign. Great, fine. Be brilliant. You won't need to use all the functionality necessary straight away, but it will be there when you're ready. But if money's a concern, male light is definitely where I would start. [00:24:15] Awesome. I think that [00:24:16] Sarah: was a great tech focus, you know, and it's like, because sometimes you don't get this information. Like I, like I say, like people just tell you, well, you know, start a, a mailing list. And then they're like, [00:24:27] Teresa: well, wow, which one? Yeah. And there's so many. And I think the other thing I really wanna reassure people is I am not a tech person, like, The reason I know so much about the tech is one, I've used a lot of it myself, but also in my course I identified the fact that that is the one thing that people don't teach. [00:24:45] And that's the one and main stumbling block as to why people don't finish a process. Right? So, you know, they might, so I can obviously talk about, you know, what a lead magnet is and how we use it and what it's good for and some of the key things you need to do in it. [00:25:00] And I can talk about your board onboarding emails. [00:25:02] I can talk about your sequencing, we can talk about what to email them, we can talk about how to get 'em on that email list, which is great and people can get all that. But then the problem is they would look at the tech and some people are great and they're fine, but a lot of people would go a, I dunno what platform to use b I dunno where the hell to start and I dunno how to make this work. [00:25:19] So one of the things I did in the, in the course, and I had to teach myself it in many, many, many systems is I the process that I give them, is the process that I taught them through in the course, and one of my members that came and did it, she, how old is she? She's probably in her early sixties maybe. [00:25:41] And she was like, she'd been in my membership for ages and obviously they get support from me there, but they don't get the course. But she could have asked me any question on any coaching call. That would've been fine. But she just hadn't got round to doing it. It was like, yeah, I know what I need to do. [00:25:55] Haven't quite sorted out the tech. And we did the course and she was dreading the tech bit and we get on [00:26:00] a call and she, cuz we, we do calls alongside the course so I can answer questions and I can literally go, give me your login or open it on screen and let me see and I'll point and go click that button. [00:26:11] And, but she literally came on the call and was like, I could kiss you, literally kiss you. She said, I didn't think for one second I could do that tech side. She goes, and I literally sat there with your screen on one screen and me on another and you were, the video was like, okay, so when you're here, go here and click this. [00:26:29] She goes, and I did. And then you were like, click this and do it. Which I did. She goes and I did it and it's done. And that's the thing, like it's not difficult, but the process is very weird. So again, what's interesting is a lot of the feedback I get is I would never have started where you said to start, right? [00:26:46] And it's because. , I start them at the thank you page, which seems like a really odd place to start. Mm-hmm. . But the problem is when you are setting up a landing page, it'll say, where do you want this to redirect to? And if you haven't got that set up, you can't finish your landing [00:27:00] page. Yeah. So there's all these kind of little quirks that like, because I know the processing, cause I've done the process, it's like, okay, it's not that it's, you can't do it the other way. [00:27:10] It just makes it a lot easier and a lot quicker. Mm-hmm. . So I think, like I said, for me, I don't want people to be sat there going, yeah, it's all right for you, you're tech. I'm not, I'm really not. I just had to learn it. But it means I can teach it and it means that obviously if I will probably talk about it in a layman's way, and I also have the opportunity to have some of these providers come in and do the training on, on that for me. [00:27:32] But I didn't want them to because, because I've, I've taught you to do something very specific. I want you to show how to do that specific thing rather than here's an overview of the system, this is how it works. So yeah, it's. . And like I said, the tech bit's so important. Cause that's a bit that stumbles people. [00:27:49] Yeah. And stops people. [00:27:51] Sarah: But the other thing that you just brought up is, is there's the tech, but then there's also the understanding the process. You know, it's like [00:28:00] Yeah. You have to almost like map it out and maybe Yes. Visually map it out. And so maybe you can just do that for our listeners right now. [00:28:07] Yeah. Like, yeah. Let's start with the, you know what most people call lead magnet? I don't like that language anymore in humane marketing. [00:28:14] Teresa: Cuz it's just like, no, you're right. No, because it doesn't, the visual is not nice, right? No. There's, there's no humane about it. Yeah. Cause it's a lead magnet. Let's [00:28:22] Sarah: call it a, a freebie or I actually call it a signpost where people get to, [00:28:27] Teresa: you know a hand raiser. [00:28:28] That's another thing I call it. It's like handraiser. I like that. Yeah. I love that. I'm interested in it. I wanna know more. Yeah. They raise their hand. [00:28:34] Sarah: So let's start there and then, Talk through the process of what needs to happen [00:28:38] Teresa: behind the scenes in a way. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So at the very beginning, the first thing we talk about is the, the hand raiser, the freebie. [00:28:47] And I keep it simple, so I tell them to choose something. So the first thing we have to do right at the beginning is we have to know who their customer is. And I don't just mean like, you know, what age are they and where do they shop? I mean, like, what [00:29:00] is the thing that they're really struggling with? Get to know them, speak to them, understand them, listen to them and what they've gotta say. [00:29:06] This isn't, you're not just trying to sell someone. And again, that is the point of a hand raiser. It's not a sales tool, which. , I know often can be seen as that way, and ultimately it might lead to a sale. But the idea is you as my perfect customer, as my perfect audience members, part of my community, you have a problem that I can solve because this is where my zone of genius is. [00:29:28] So I create something that addresses your problem and gives you some solutions, and you have to give them something that is good. I have downloaded that many lead magnets. I can't even tell you because this is my passion. This is what I do. Like I will drop into someone's funnel and go through it and look at it all. [00:29:46] and I've downloaded stuff that is useless, absolutely useless. And it's only just a, I want your email address. It's not a genuine, I'm trying to help you. So that's the very first thing we talk about. We need to know [00:30:00] exactly who your people are, what their problem is, and then you need to give me some very good advice to help me with that problem. [00:30:06] But we always start with a PDF download, which I know sounds very unimaginative and there's much better ways to attract your perfect audience, but they're much bigger and more complicated. So I've got a. , it was a very big process to do that quiz and I had an expert help me. So even though it might be like, well, it's just a pdf, we'll make it the best PDF they've ever downloaded, but it is. [00:30:27] So basically we find one problem and we give them five points and we say, this is how I can help you with my five points. Okay. So it's like and one thing that actually always comes up and you know, this podcast has gone for hours, by the way, cuz I can talk about this for literally hours. [00:30:42] Sarah: Well, they'll, they'll just have to come to your [00:30:44] Teresa: course, you know, well love, like, it's not a sales message, but that's, that's what it's [00:30:49] But like, so one of the things we talk about is sometimes the problem that they've got. So let's say I am a coach that helps people who have got imposter syndrome, let's say. That was my business. [00:31:00] Well, the problem is, Possible customers or people I can help might not know they've got imposter syndrome. [00:31:08] Mm-hmm. So what they do is five ways to help you get over imposter syndrome. Well, that's great if I know I've got it, but I don't know I've got it. Mm-hmm. So, one thing, and that's often a mistake, you really choose. So the thing that you need to think about with the lead magnet, with your title, with your, your freebie, and the thing you're offering them is it needs to sing to them. [00:31:27] It needs to, they need to read that and go, that's me. Mm-hmm. . Whereas if I don't know what that is, if I've never heard of the phrase imposter syndrome, but what I might know is my symptoms or what I might know is the problems that I have. So they need to get quite granular with that. So it might be that do you worry that you're gonna get found out one day question mark if I read that, and whether I knew what in Imposs syndrome was or not, and whether I, you know, thought I had it or not. [00:31:54] I would read that and go, yeah, that's me. Yeah. Mm-hmm. . So, but I would only know that and know [00:32:00] that language cause I know my customer really well. So that piece, yeah, that's [00:32:04] Sarah: unfortunately, that's often a problem, especially for coaches, right? Because they're so into their specialty or into their methods that unfortunately they're marketing [00:32:15] Teresa: the method where Yes. [00:32:16] Yeah. And they're not talking to the problem. Yeah. And sometimes people are like, yeah, but I don't wanna be negative. And it's like, it's not that you're being negative, it's that sometimes the only way, you know. So if you rephrase it and said, you know, do you fear that one day you'll be found out? I know it sounds negative, but the point is it resonates cuz that's the kind of thing I might say. [00:32:38] And what's quite nice for me and you, , I've always kind of hoped and thought that this is my superpower, is I'm able to think about who their customer might be and what their customer might say. And sometimes I am a potential customer. Yeah. Sometimes I'd be like, well actually I would never say that. This is what I would say. [00:32:55] Yeah. And it, it inevitably is not the same language because like you said, [00:33:00] when you are an expert in your world, in your field, you are gonna use the right terms. You are gonna think of, like you said, the solution. And the solution is, you know, you've got imposter syndrome and I've got tools to help you with imposter syndrome. [00:33:12] Well, I don't know. I've got that. Mm-hmm . So that's the first thing. Really understanding that customer is key. Coming up with something that is genuinely going to help them, that is genuinely going to fix their problem is the next thing. So like I said, we know downloads can be, excuse me, I'm gonna cough. [00:33:29] I'm so sorry. Yeah. I could feel it building. And I, a sneeze coming as well. I'm so sorry. I never do. That's fine. [00:33:40] Is it gone all good, ? I think so. Hope so. Sorry, sorry, sorry. So like I said, you wanna create that lead magnet, that freebie that is really good quality. So when they get it, it actually gives them something. Don't be scared about giving away too good of stuff. You're talking basics. Okay. So you're not talking like your secret source or your method or your whole, like this is how to do [00:34:00] it, start to finish, but the stuff you're telling them is really good stuff. [00:34:04] So when we're in the process, the very first thing they do is create that thing and we do it in you know, something like Canva or Adobe Express, and they get all the templates and basically they make it look nice and they create this P D F that they've got that they can give someone. Then what we do, And we do everything to get it ready before we go into tech. [00:34:26] Cuz that's the other thing, like I said, once you get into tech, you don't wanna then go, you're halfway through a process, you have to go and write some stuff and by the time you come back you're like, I can't remember where I was or what I was doing. So then what you're going to do from that point is you're gonna think about the words that you want to be on your signup page. [00:34:42] So the page that is the landing page where someone goes and goes, yes, I would like that. So based on what you've written, you write some words on that and there's a format to it and, and there's a way you can do it. But basically you're saying to them, if you have problems with this, this, this, this, or if you're struggling with this, this, this, this. [00:34:58] If you find you are this, this, [00:35:00] this, then. In this download, I'm gonna help you with this, this, this. So then you've got the copy for that and we make sure we've got some images as well. So within the template thing, we create social images and we create images for the landing page. Then you want to start writing your emails that you're going to send to them. [00:35:16] Cuz the minute they download that, you are gonna want to automate some emails. And I think the word automation scares people. It's really not that difficult. It's like when they opt in this form, send them this thing, wait a day, send them this thing, wait two days, send them this thing. So then what we do is we write all our emails and, and again there's like templates to follow and that sort of format. [00:35:37] And we got our, our titles, our subject lines, we've got our preview text, they've got our emails. So basically we have everything ready to roll. Before we go to the tech. So they literally have a Google doc of all their stuff. They have their images, they have their P D F, they have the pictures, the lot and things like as well. [00:35:57] There might be a little blurb about who you are and what [00:36:00] makes you an expert. So then what we do is when we go to the system, the thing that we start with is the, well, you can do a couple of things, but depending on what system you're using and which order it goes in. Because again, it's all different. [00:36:15] But normally you'd build a thank you page first. And the thank you page is a really simple page that acknowledges the fact that they've opted in. And it might tell them things like, make sure you check your spam cuz it might have gone in there. And if you don't get it, email us here. Or if you know you haven't found it, if you wanna link to something else on that page, you can. [00:36:32] You could always say, go and take a look at my website, or I wrote a blog on this, or whatever it is. But normally, and again, when getting started, don't over confuse yourself just. , a plain thank you page that has your logo and a nice image or whatever on it in your font saying Thank you. It's on its way. [00:36:47] And don't forget to shake your junk. So that's on the thank you page. So we'd build that first. Then what we'd probably build next is the email sequence. And again, it can depend on different systems, but you'd need to build that [00:37:00] sequence. So basically this is an automation, and you would say, okay, I want to create an automation. [00:37:05] And you might put the trigger in there. You might put the trigger somewhere else. Again, this is where different systems differ. Depends on the tool. Yeah, it does. But basically you are saying, okay when this thing happens, I want you to, and it can be like, so active campaign. It could be a tag. So when this tag is added, start this and you can decide the tag. [00:37:25] And, and we normally have decided the tag by this point. , you would start the automation. When someone gets this tag, start this thing and it'd like send them an email immediately. And then you put in your copy and your text of the email. The other thing you're gonna need to do is link to the thing that they've got and things like, the one key thing, and I saw this the other day with someone, is I opted in for their thing and they had a huge email and the link was hidden. [00:37:51] Well, they say hidden, but it was amongst a lot of texts of the thing. I actually was trying to die in load. And then there was about another four or five links of various different other things they were trying to tell me [00:38:00] to do. And a 20% off discount if I bought my first thing. And it's like, we too much, too much do too much. [00:38:06] Because then again, you're jumping straight into the sale. And again, that's not humane. That's not, we are coming from a point of serving. We're coming from a point going, I know you struggle with this and I can help because that's what I do and that's what I'm brilliant at. Mm-hmm. And yes, of course we all need to be paid. [00:38:24] And of course there are paid things that you can have. But at that point, that's too early. So the first email is just an email that says, here you go. There's your thing. Like you asked for it. There it is. And I think on the copy it normally says something like, and I'll be in touch in a couple of days to let you see how you got on. [00:38:44] And again, one thing I find, especially with a brand new sequence of someone brand new, tell them what to expect. Mm-hmm. . Okay. So in that first email, say, I'll be back in touch tomorrow, or I'll be back in touch in two days, so that when your email does fall into their inbox, they're not gonna think, oh, [00:39:00] she's hounding me. [00:39:01] Mm-hmm. , because I've already told you that this is what's going to happen. One thing [00:39:05] Sarah: that I really like doing is using numbers and brackets. So one out of five and then they know, okay, this is the first emails, then there's gonna be four more. And so I use that in all the subject lines and people really like it. [00:39:19] I use that also in like mini-series where I'm like, I'm gonna be talking about this topic over five emails. Mm-hmm. , you know that these are coming, right? Yes. So I guess especially in an onboarding series, that would be really helpful [00:39:32] Teresa: for people that like, yes, super helpful. It's a great idea. And like you said, so, and, and I think as well, people are, I know people are struggle with marketing and they really like, you know, they think it's sleazy and slimy and horrible, but as long as people know what to expect from you, it's when they're caught off guard. [00:39:50] It's when you've said to them, I'm gonna email you once a week, or I'm gonna email you once a month and then you send five in two days. Like, that's not okay. That's not. [00:40:00] Alright to do, right? So it's about being really honest and going, this is what I'm going to do. And thinking as well as serving. So I often say, when I generally talk about emails, like you have to ask yourself, who cares you well with anything we do? [00:40:15] Who cares? Like am I giving them something in that email that they're going to want to read? Am I giving them something that is going to be of value to them? Because if all I'm doing is telling them to buy my stuff, that is of no value to them. Now if I'm telling them a story that will give them a lesson or a learning, and then at the end of that email I say, and actually if you want more help with this, I can, and here's how you can get that help, then that's different. [00:40:41] So [00:40:41] Sarah: I think that's important to mention as well, because I know a lot of my clients. And, and I'm sure maybe yours as well. We, we have heart-centered clients and so they're actually, they already know that they want to serve, right? Yes. But it's the actual selling piece that's kind of difficult. And [00:41:00] so just this morning a client said to me that her subscribers told her they don't want more than one message per month. [00:41:06] And I said, I understand that. And that is good that you ask what they want, but you also need to look out for yourself because you are running a business. And so you don't just want to only serve and share great content, you still also need to sell. That's why they are on your email list. So it's finding that balance, [00:41:26] Teresa: right? [00:41:27] It is, it is. And, and like you said, it. For me, again, asking that question is lovely. And I asked it funnily enough just the other day, but I sent three emails a week. Yeah. So, and I asked them, and I said to them, I'm gonna slow down in August. Cause obviously August is our UK summer holiday and I have a daughter and a stepson and you know, hopefully might take a little bit time off at some point. [00:41:48] But for me I was like, so I'm probably gonna send like two emails a week this time. And I, and then, so I said, actually, drop me an email back and let me know what you think about that. And I've had people in the past go, I'd like less [00:42:00] and, and as long as I'm consistent, as long as I told them this is what it's going to be, and I communicate with them and I am thinking of doing less, I'm thinking of maybe just doing two a week on a Wednesday and a Thursday and I will email them going, I've been having a think and I think this is what I'm gonna do and this is why I'm gonna do it. [00:42:16] And, you know, so I think it's that communication and again, treating people like they're real humans. Yeah. Because they are real humans. [00:42:23] Sarah: I think what people get scared because they, the tech is involved and they feel like, Okay, so now this is, you know, the techy part of the business. Yeah. Where nice. It's not, you can still be yourself in these emails and, and Yeah. [00:42:37] Even though you're talking to many people, you're still talking as if you were talking just to one [00:42:43] Teresa: person. I write every email as if I'm talking to one person. Yeah. And, and I personally reply to everyone that responds. Mm-hmm. And I ask them to respond. Mm-hmm. And whether that takes me 20 minutes or three days, I'm the one that responds. [00:42:58] And my team know that they [00:43:00] leave those emails alone because that, and again, I don't have a copywriter. Right. My emails, I write them and I joke that they're probably, they're not award-winning and there's gonna be typos in them. And, and kind of, I'm sorry, but I'm not, because it's like, that's not my zone of genius writing is not necessarily my zone of genius, however, The authenticity of it and the fact of, you want to hear from me so you are going to hear from me. [00:43:24] You are not going to hear from a copywriter who has relayed a story that I've told them. So again, treating it as an additional bit of content, you know, another way to communicate with your audience, but also having that two-way thing and asking them and, and including them in the decision, I think is great. [00:43:42] I do think though, once a month is not enough, nowhere near enough, because like if I said to someone post on social media once a month, and this is the analogy I always give when I get them in the course to go right, how often are you gonna email 'em? What day? And, and initially all of them would go probably once a month. [00:43:59] And then I say to [00:44:00] them, imagine just posting on Instagram 12 times a year. What do you think that would do for the business? Do you think that would mean you get good business? No, of course it wouldn't. And we need to look at emails in a similar way, so, again, it's more about what you're putting in the email than the frequency of the email. [00:44:17] Mm-hmm. . So yeah, so, so we do the sequence emails, we've got digress there. I digressed us. But we do the sequence emails and like I said, the first one is deliver the thing. The second one might be if they're brand new to you, it might be a who you are or normally. The second one for me is, okay, so you had this thing cuz you were struggling. [00:44:34] Have you seen this? So it might be, here's a podcast I did about it. Here's an article I wrote on it. Here's a video I've done on it, but it's helping them further. And then from that point you might introduce yourself, you might explain more about your, what you do, you might then, and some of my email sequences on email, four or five. [00:44:52] But again, you don't have to do this from day one. It gives 'em a video of something that's particularly. Pertinent to what they've downloaded or a [00:45:00] sneak peek into the membership because actually they downloaded a mindset thing and the membership has mindset calls in it. And then, because I have products at the end of it, I might go, if you're interested, actually you might wanna join the club or you might wanna have a look at the club. [00:45:13] And then my last email will say and, and it, this is only cause I'm leading into products that, or a service or whatever. If you are not, then you don't do this. But my last email says, you're not ready. No worries. So basically as well, and the automation is very cool, but I don't teach this. I can teach it to someone who asks, but this is not what I would tell you to get started with. [00:45:31] So for instance, in my funnel, in active campaign, at the end of every email, I have a section in the, in the process that says, did they sign up to the club? If they did, don't send them anything else. If they didn't send them this, did they sign up to the club? If they didn't, don't send them anything else. [00:45:47] If they did, if if they did, don't send 'em anything else. They didn't. And that's what I send them. No worries. That's fine. I see. And that's exactly the [00:45:54] Sarah: thing. You can't do it Cajabi like [00:45:56] Teresa: none of this is no, no, no, it's not right. No. [00:46:00] Yeah. You need a system. And I think, I think. , fairly confident. You can do an element of that in Malechi not Malechi Mailer light [00:46:09] I told you I'd get confused. Yeah, there is an element of that. You can do a mailer light, but you can't do that in Kajabi, which is why again, when switch back, I can afford it. I switched back. Yeah. But again, you know, even saying to at the end, no worries. I've offered you this thing. I think it could be cool, but you don't want it. [00:46:24] And because I very much believe in humane marketing, I don't do close and open on stuff unless it's a course, like build My List where I work with you along it, which means I obviously have to have an intake cuz we all start at the same point. But other than that, my membership is always open, so I just really nicely say at the end, no worries, I'm always here and now you're gonna start getting my regular emails, which, and I tell them what the deal is with the regular emails. [00:46:48] So, so those things. That kind of un onboarding is, is kinda key. So you need all those emails written, which they already are by this point, and then you put them into your system. So then you've got an automation, you've got a thank you page, [00:47:00] you've probably got a tag. And then the next thing we go in and do is probably set up the form again, depending on what system you're in. [00:47:06] So we set up the form first, because on a landing page, you're gonna need to put the form in it, but you can't set up the form without having stuff to link to it because it'll say, well, what do you want to do with this form? And if you haven't got a like, okay, once they filled in the form, go to this thank you page. [00:47:19] Or once they filled in the form, subscribe them to this automation. So that's why we're kind of working backwards and up. So then we do the form bit. And then once we've done the form bit, we then build the landing page. And then once we've done the landing page, all the social media posts are already written, already done. [00:47:36] So it should be as easy as. So then you'll have the link for your landing page. And then it should be as easy as, here's your social media post that you've already created. Shove the link in there when they click through to it. The rest should be absolutely fine. And then obviously we do an element of testing. [00:47:51] I test it, they test it, make sure everything looks right, reads right, and all that sort of good stuff. But yeah, it's not where the process that we go through as the [00:48:00] consumer is we see a social media post. We go through to a landing page, we put in a form, we then go to a thank you page. We then get an email. [00:48:09] We don't create it in the same process because that's not the process that's easy enough for us. Yeah. So, yeah. And I know it sounds big. It does [00:48:18] Sarah: sound right. Overwhelming when you hear it like that. Yeah. But it, it's like anything, it's definitely like Marie Felia would say it's figure outable and once you have figured it out the first time, you can just rinse and repeat. [00:48:32] That's it. The system and the process. And you will come up with different opt-ins and free. [00:48:37] Teresa: Yeah, and I had, and, and again, I promise you, I never came on here to go buy my thing. But had an amazing testimonial. The day I say testimony she just told me, but it was still amazing. One of my members bought Build My List cuz like I said, it's not included in the membership cause it's a very specific and it's followed me along. [00:48:53] So like I said, we'll literally go, has everybody done this now? Let me see it. Has it look yet great? Right once to the next thing. Because I know people need [00:49:00] that gain ability, but she had done the course the very first time I ran it and she actually hadn't been as present in the course as she wanted to because she was doing a tax return or something at the time and the timing just wasn't right for her. [00:49:13] And she actually got one of her team to go through and do the work, so. Mm-hmm. , they actually went in and did the stuff. and they did it and she obviously hadn't done it. And so then it comes a year later and she decides she needs a new lead magnet and cuz the other one had been performing well, but obviously it's nice to have a few, and again, I explain about, you know, why you would want different ones for different things. [00:49:35] And so she decided she wants a new one and she went back to the course and went through the lessons and came on one of my calls and was. I've done it, , I've just done it and, and like I literally just went back and, and did exactly what you said and I've done another one. And she was like, that's amazing. [00:49:53] And then she's doing another one. And it's like, that's the point, like by going through it with you like [00:50:00] that. And even when I'm talking about different systems, the way I try and explain, and obviously you know, you have different systems to choose from, but the way I try to explain it is if you understand what you are trying to do or what you need to do, even if you then go to a different system, you know, okay, I need a page or a landing page, which might be called a website on some things. [00:50:21] Or it might be called a site, or it might be called a page, or it might be called a landing page and I need some kind of form or opt-in or pop in, pop up. So again, where's that gonna be? And I need another page for a thank you page, and I need some kind of automation and I need something to trigger it. So even if you're moving and changing, The, like you said, the idea for me is I teach you the understanding of it and then you can rinse and repeat it. [00:50:44] Mm-hmm. , because, I dunno about you, Sarah. One of the things I found in the online space and, and talking of humane marketing and doing the right thing for our customers is, and one thing that I've been complimented on, which is lovely, is that I don't set my members [00:51:00] up on my students up to always need me. [00:51:02] Mm-hmm. , my aim is to give them the tools and the strategies and it's the empowerment for the empowerment Exactly. To do it themselves again. Yeah. Rather than, okay, I'm gonna give you so much and then, you know, if you want the rest, you're gonna have to come and do this, and do this and do this. Right. It. No, I am so over the moon and she just ha so happens to also be a member as well. [00:51:25] But even, and I, and funnily enough, when I was doing the challenge, I re-interviewed some of the past member some of the past students. And again, they said exactly the same. They were like, I did another one and I did another one. And the other thing that's really lovely actually is I have some marketers come to me and say, can I use it for clients? [00:51:41] And I'm like, if you are, you can come and learn the skill and learn the process and then offer that as a service. And then you can now be, I can create your opt-in, I can set up your email and absolutely fine. You can use my tools and my strategies and my stuff. That is fine if, as long as that's giving you another skill [00:52:00] and you are obviously not selling the corso, as long as you're using the things, that's fine. [00:52:04] And, but I love that. I love that we empower people to, to do those things so they don't have to come back to me and go, I'm gonna have to join again cuz I can't remember how to do it. [00:52:13] Sarah: Yeah, I, I just had my first group in the Humane Marketing Circle go through my book, the marketing, like we're human and they organized everything themselves. [00:52:24] So basically it's member organized and they got together, you know, amazing during three sessions, worked through my workbooks that are available for free. And so I'm like, this is exactly what we need. You know, we don't need more gurus. We need people to get empowered and then do it themselves. Just get the tools and then do it themselves. [00:52:46] And you are so right. And I think, yeah, this conversation here has been so helpful because people are like, Okay. I'm getting the big picture and I'm really getting the details and, and, and maybe they can just, you know, do it themselves now that, that [00:53:00] would [00:53:00] Teresa: be great. And for summits, right? More than enough on the challenge. [00:53:04] I had a number of people, in fact, a huge percentage of people that we talked about, you know, this is how you come up with an idea. These are sort of things that I consider and then they'd come to. , the coaching call I did alongside it. And then the next day they're like, I've created it. Yeah. And I'm like, that's amazing. [00:53:19] Awesome. Yeah. And then, and I had actually, and I'd never had this before, but I had two people actually within the five days create the thing and then they got bit stuck with the tech. Cuz obviously I can only go into so much on a challenge about that. But then they post in the group and I was like, have you changed up to that? [00:53:35] Do this to this? And they were like, I can't honestly believe you're helping me do this. Like Yeah. But you've come into the challenge trying to achieve something and you are working really hard to achieve it. Why wouldn't I help you to achieve it? Mm-hmm. Yes. I know I have a course that teaches all this, but you are so far ahead already. [00:53:51] Yeah. And I would've literally left you at the last hurdle. And, and [00:53:55] Sarah: basically they only needed that missing piece and Yeah. [00:53:58] Teresa: Yeah. And if I hadn. [00:54:00] Thought about them in the way I do and treat my audience the way I do. I'd been like, well that's fine cuz that's in the course. So if you wanna buy the course, it looks there to do that. [00:54:07] And it was like, no, this woman and the woman I was talking about, she has a young child. It was like an 18 month old and it was like, I know how difficult it was for you to turn up and go through the challenge because of how busy you are and managing the child and all this, and the fact that you've done all this. [00:54:23] and, and it was really early in the morning, and I don't, I normally, I get up and I have a morning routine and I don't look at my phone straight away. But for whatever reason, I sat in bed and I was looking at my phone and that message came up. So she'd obviously got up before a child or a child had woken her up or whatever, and gone back to sleep. [00:54:38] So she's messaging me and it was like, I don't know, six feet in the morning and I'm like, do this. And then she came back, I'm stuck on this. Try that. Okay, that works. Okay, you need to change this. And at the end of it, she was like, I can't believe. Like, but you've just done that. And it's, and like I said, why wouldn't I? [00:54:51] Mm-hmm. , you know, I'm setting people up to succeed, not to need me and buy my stuff if they don't need to. [00:54:57] Sarah: Yeah. Yeah. Ah, this [00:55:00] has been wonderful. Thank you so much for sharing so much wisdom and, and tackling the tech, because , I think, yeah, it really, people are gonna take a lot from that. If, if you would add one last tip in terms of, you know, maybe also the content, how to make it humane, you

Tugboat Institute® member Dave Thrasher grew up watching his father found and build a company. When it came time for him to step into leadership, Dave was ready to take what his father had built and scale it. In the end, he founded his own offshoot of his father's Evergreen® company, which is run today by his brother Dan, and he started the work of scaling, always with an eye to maintaining his core Evergreen values.  In this Tugboat Institute talk, Dave shares his learning about the ways Evergreen companies can scale successfully. Many of them are the strategies used widely by companies of all types, but he has modified where necessary to ensure that as he scales, his growing company stays fully aligned with the 7Ps principles and the Evergreen mindset. He has had astounding success. Listen and be inspired to explore new growth opportunities in an Evergreen way.

Tugboat Institute® member Dave Thrasher grew up watching his father found and build a company. When it came time for him to step into leadership, Dave was ready to take what his father had built and scale it. In the end, he founded his own offshoot of his father's Evergreen® company, which is run today by his brother Dan, and he started the work of scaling, always with an eye to maintaining his core Evergreen values. In this Tugboat Institute talk, Dave shares his learning about the ways Evergreen companies can scale successfully. Many of them are the strategies used widely by companies of all types, but he has modified where necessary to ensure that as he scales, his growing company stays fully aligned with the 7Ps principles and the Evergreen mindset. He has had astounding success. Listen and be inspired to explore new growth opportunities in an Evergreen way.

Today's conversation fits under the P of Product of the 7Ps of Humane Marketing. Today I'm speaking to an online bestie based in Norway. Solveig Petch [she/her] who goes by Petchy is a brand strategist and designer for values-driven business owners who want to build brands their way; without compromising their integrity or resorting to predatory business tactics. She believes that building an impactful and profitable brand can be done without screwing people over or working yourself into a pulp. From her home office in rural Norway, Petchy crafts strategic brand identities for clients all over the world. She's passionate about helping business owners discover and define their brands' unique purpose and personality, find the confidence to own their sh*t — and tap into their uniqueness to spark meaningful connections and attract more of those omg, yes! clients. She is also the creator of the Brand it!™ framework, and host of the Brand it! with Petchy podcast. In this episode, you'll learn about building community through your email list as well as...   Personal branding vs. branding: what's the difference Branding vs marketing: what's the difference there? Pros and cons of using our name in our brand Alternatives if we're not branding our name? What if you have outgrown your current brand? Branding architecture What's the future of branding? And so much more Solveig's Resources   Solveig's Website Brand it! with Petchy Podcast Mini Email Course Brand Archetype - A Quick Guide Connect with Solveig on: LinkedIn Facebook Instagram   Sarah's Resources Watch this episode on Youtube (FREE) Sarah's One Page Marketing Plan (FREE) Sarah Suggests Newsletter (FREE) The Humane Business Manifesto (FREE) Gentle Confidence Mini-Course Marketing Like We're Human - Sarah's book The Humane Marketing Circle Authentic & Fair Pricing Mini-Course Podcast Show Notes We use Descript to edit our episodes and it's fantastic! Email Sarah at sarah@sarahsantacroce.com Thanks for listening!   After you listen, check out Humane Business Manifesto, an invitation to belong to a movement of people who do business the humane and gentle way and disrupt the current marketing paradigm. You can download it for free at this page. There's no opt-in. Just an instant download. Are you enjoying the podcast?  The Humane Marketing show is listener-supported—I'd love for you to become an active supporter of the show and join the Humane Marketing Circle. You will be invited to a private monthly Q&A call with me and fellow Humane Marketers -  a safe zone to hang out with like-minded conscious entrepreneurs and help each other build our business and grow our impact.  — I'd love for you to join us! Learn more at humane.marketing/circle Don't forget to subscribe to the show on iTunes or on Android to get notified for all my future shows and why not sign up for my weekly(ish) "Sarah Suggests Saturdays", a round-up of best practices, tools I use, books I read, podcasts, and other resources. Raise your hand and join the Humane Business Revolution. Warmly, Sarah Imperfect Transcript of the show We use and love Descript to edit our podcast and provide this free transcript of the episode. And yes, that's an affiliate link. Sarah: [00:00:00] [00:01:00] [00:02:00] [00:03:00] [00:04:00] Hey pet so good to hang out with you today.  Petchy: Hello, Sarah. And likewise, thank you so much for inviting me.  Sarah: Oh yeah. When I looked at, , you know, our conversations, me being on, your podcast and doing some other things together, all of a sudden I'm like, I'm pretty sure I have PE on the podcast already and I realized I hadn't. So I'm [00:05:00] so glad we get this chance now to, yeah. To talk about branding. , I think I did tell you that we're featuring this episode under the P of product of the humane marketing podcast or humane marketing mandala. And so, yeah, it's this idea of creating a product and what we kind of discussed before, , recording is this idea of, well, how, how does branding fit into us being the product? Maybe a lot of entrepreneurs. That's what it is. We are the product, we are the brand. , and so, yeah, that's what we wanna talk about today. So maybe just kind of, yeah, take us right in there. I don't do long introductions. I kind of already introduced you in the, in the intro. So just take us into this concept of branding that quite honestly, I think you know this, and, and I know it, it's a scary thing sometimes for entrepreneurs, this word [00:06:00] branding, it sounds so official. And, and so, yeah. Tell us your approach to brand.  Petchy: Yeah. So, when we spoke before this, this recording session, we were chatting a little bit about, you know, why do you actually need a brand? So maybe that's a good starting point. We can look at at that and then go into what a brand is. Mm-hmm and isn't, and then we'll just take it from there. So the thing with branding is. Some people are like, well, do I, do I really need a brand? But the thing is you already have a brand and that is whether you like it or not. So the question, I guess, is more, is it's a deliberate brand that you are actively taking control of. And that's, I think where a lot of especially smaller business owners go a bit wrong because they have a misconception in their heads about what a brand actually is. So. Because a brand, [00:07:00] a lot of people tend to think it's just the logo, the colors and how your visual brand looks. Right. But that is really just the tip of the iceberg. And your brand is really it's. What other people think of you mm-hmm and that's something that you just cannot ever be a hundred percent in control of. Cause you can't go into people's. Brains and dictate, you know, this is how you should feel about my brand. , so you can't control it fully, but you can try and steer people's. Views of your brand in the right direction. So a brand is what other people think of you, but branding is what you do to try and influence how people see your brand. Yeah. Yeah. And within branding. So branding are the actual activities that you do, right. , and that can include a lot of things like positioning, messaging, your brand identity, of course. , but. Your brand [00:08:00] identity, isn't just the visual either. It's your verbal brand identities. So all of those actions that you take to try and influence people's perception of your brand, that is branding I love that so much. So actually that cleared  Sarah: up a little bit. Yeah. That, that definition of a brand is what people think of you, , when, when not there often, right? yeah. And then, and then branding is what you do. Also, let me do the question. Well, then what's difference between branding and marketing. Obviously we know that we overlap on certain things, but what would you say is the difference between branding and marketing?  Petchy: I, I would say that branding is more who you are and how people see you and then, or how you want people to see you. And marketing is more how you tell people about who you are, like, how do you talk about your products? How do you talk about your brand and how do you reach [00:09:00] those people that you need to reach your ideal? Audience and those like marketing activities, I guess, is like, what do you do to get your brand out there? right.  Sarah: Okay. So there's the brand, which is again, what people think of you branding. You said it's doing the thing. So, so because marketing, you said is then communicating, right? Yes. That would be a good word for community. Yeah. That's a really good way of putting it. And so when, when you say branding is doing, what is the doing.  Petchy: That can look so different from brand to brand. But it's those, so it's, it's your visual identity. It's how you speak as well. It's how you put yourself out in the world. So I think. For, for smaller business. And it's really important to re remember that your, your visual branding is actually just a tiny, tiny piece of the whole branding puzzle. Mm-hmm . Yeah. You also [00:10:00] need to, once you've established your brand's foundations and you brand core, and you know who you are, you know what you stand for, you know, your values, you, you rock solid on that part. Then you have to go out and like actively. Infuse that into every activity that you do for your brand. Right. So, and that, isn't just when you go to do your marketing, but it's also when you, , so say when you recruit people, how you build your company culture, that has to be rooted in your brand's core, but also how you treat people when they come to you with complaints, for instance, on like, so your customer service representatives, how should they. Behave when they act on behalf of your brand. Right. What, where do you spend your money? You know, when you invest your money or buy services from, from other brands, are you conscious of where you're putting your money and whether that's aligns with your core values? [00:11:00] Because if, if there's a mismatch there. People are going to figure it out and it's not going to be good for your brand. Let's just put it that way.  Sarah: Yeah. Yeah. It's so good. And, and thank you for those examples. , I'm currently working with the, a company for, LinkedIn profile for their executives and they did send me their branding guidelines and it's like a document with like a hundred pages or so. And so. That shows that, , they have clear guidelines about their brand and yes, that includes visuals. But it, for example, I always ask, what kind of tone do you want your LinkedIn profile to have? And so they have examples of tone in that branding document. So that would be the difference between marketing and again, branding is it's yes, it's doing things, but it's more like guidelines for how you are then gonna market. and that's my thinking or my understanding of it.  Petchy: Yeah. So your, your brand [00:12:00] strategy in a way is what informs every single business action that you take, right? Including marketing. Yeah, I guess. Yeah. , cuz you could put it that way.  Sarah: That's good. Yeah. We often hear the term also personal branding. So where does that come in and how is that different from, you know, the branding that we're talking. Petchy: Well, I kind of guess it's, it's in the name. There's a clue in the name, personal branding is more like how, how are you putting yourself out into the world and how are you being conscious about how you want other people to see you? But what I find is that with smaller businesses, smaller brands, where there is one person who is the main, character of the brand, I guess, or product of the brand. As, you said earlier, I find that the. Get really blurry mm-hmm between like the personal brand and the actual brand. And to a certain extent, I think that's how it has to be for the smaller brands. If that makes  Sarah: sense. [00:13:00] Yeah. Yeah. That's true. Because at least for my humane marketing, I always say bring more of you to your marketing because who I mainly talk to is entrepreneurs, but I even feel like the, the bigger brands. We do have this trend of wanting to make it more personal. So it, I would say personal branding somehow even applies to bigger brands. , it is just that it's probably gonna be more worldview and value oriented than specific to just one person,  Petchy: right? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I would say that. I actually, I don't think that as a solo business owner or a small business owner, that you can remove yourself a hundred percent from your brand mm-hmm. Because with the smaller brands, you, you just, you can't rely as heavily on sheer size, you know, or your market share or, or your reputation. So that personal connection, that human to human connection becomes more important, really because you wanna build trust. [00:14:00] And that trust is much, much easier to gain for a smaller brand, if there's a personal connection, human to human. So I guess that's a strong argument in itself. Mm-hmm um, whereas like a big household brand that everybody knows about, they probably don't need that same level of human to human connection in the, in the big scale of things, but on, on a more personal level, The human to human connection becomes important. And that's when it's really important that, so if you, if you are a small brand now, and then you have big plans and you grow, and then you are becoming a bigger brand that human to human connection will go, it will trickle down into your employee level rather than yourself. And that's when it's important that your employees are on board with the brand values and the brand approach and like the brand personality so that they can act. On behalf of your brand. Yeah. And create, create those connections yeah.  Sarah: For your brand. And that's [00:15:00] not easy. That's not an easy job, especially if you have like a huge brand, every, store clerk and everybody needs to be informed about those values and  Petchy: yeah. Yeah. That's where it can fall apart. If you aren't clear on those foundations. Right. Day one. Yeah, because if you are not clear on them yourself, and then as your team grows, it's going to get more and more difficult to communicate that to your team so that they can take that and act on it. So I would say. Even, that's why it's so important, even for the smaller businesses to have a think about these things, even if it's still just the early days or even if it's still just you Sarah: Yeah. Quotation marks for, for those who are not watching the video. yeah. Yeah. What it makes me think also obvious is, if you are just a one, person brand, , a lot of the first things you need to decide is yeah. On the [00:16:00] name of your business and on your domain name that you're gonna reserve your website. And so there's always this question. Well, do I use my name? As my brand or as my website domain or, or do I use, you know, a name for my business and then use that as a domain name. So kind of like, what are the pros and cons of using your name or not using your name?  Petchy: Oh, well again, this is very individual. Yeah. So I guess my. My first thing that I wanna say is you don't have to do anything if it doesn't feel right for you. So it is not like you have to use your name to build a, like a brand centered around you as a person. And it totally depends on your circumstances. , for some people it really makes sense to use their name and they want to use their name, that comfortable using the name and putting it out there. Maybe they know that, okay, I want this business to be centered around me. Maybe it's not even going [00:17:00] to grow. And that in that case, it just really makes sense to, , to use your name as a brand name and build on that personal brand. But there are businesses who are run by just one person who also like, can absolutely have a very different brand name. Right. So I think. I think it's very personal decision to make, and it depends a little bit on what, what is it that you're putting out there? So for a, for a coach, for instance, or someone who works with a very sort of tight closed, personal connection with their clients, it maybe makes a lot more sense to be using your name. Whereas if you are selling a product or if you're selling or a program, a one to, oh, a program or one to many mm-hmm , , Service then it makes more sense to have a, a brand name that's separate from your own name. Right. But that doesn't mean that you have to [00:18:00] remove yourself completely from your brand. , So I, I guess what I'm saying is it, it kind of gets down to brand architecture and how you want to build the layers of your brand as the founder. Sarah: Mm we'll get to that term in a minute. Cuz I think there's more to UN unpack under the term brand architecture. Now we're getting like super into it. , now we're gonna get geeky. exactly super geeky. , Yeah. What, what came up for me also is, you know, kind of my evolution of, of brand. So I have my website, Sarah and acro, and that's where I built my LinkedIn consulting, brand over the last decade or so. And so that was. , very clear to me, this is me as the LinkedIn consultant and, and, and I never, obviously you can't use LinkedIn in the brand, so that was already kind of a limitation, I guess, in that yeah. Needs to be taken into consideration. You can't just make up a brand name using, you know, [00:19:00] existing terms and, and names. , and then. You know, started thinking about the gentle business revolution and, and gentle marketing and, and, you know, the story behind that trademark mess. And so that's kind of another thing that I guess if you go with a brand name, then you are really, and I did not realize that I just went, you know, very naively into that thing. , but you do get into other territories where all of a sudden. It's not just your name anymore. , you're claiming a brand name and, you know, the story that happened to me, , you know, it published a book two weeks after I got a seasoned desist letter that I cannot use that name, gentle marketing anymore. So in a way it does feel like there's more considerations to think of when you are using you. Words and make up your own brand name rather than just using your cause. Nobody can, [00:20:00] you know, kind of season desist your name. That's your name? You are. No,  Petchy: nobody can, nobody can go after you using your name. So there's safety in that, of course as well. Yeah. But I guess if you are a person who isn't super keen on being the face of your brand, Then one way to do that is to focus, your efforts more on like branding your products or your services, or maybe your signature method, finding like a brand name for those. And then. Still remaining in the background or the foreground, however much you're comfortable with as the creator of So, , for instance, I have a, a framework that I've, , spent probably 20 something years developing. , and I call it the branded framework and I then can say that I'm, I'm the creator of that framework, right? Yeah. So if that, at some point, if that grows bigger than me, Yeah. I don't know if it will. , , I don't have any fixed plans for that, but if it does, if it, if it blows up and it gets bigger than me, [00:21:00] then I can still be, I can still, say that I'm the creator of that framework. Yeah. Yeah. So I would then possibly lead with my framework rather than leading with my name. Exactly. You would take a new domain name. What's right. Yeah, what's right. And what's wrong.  Sarah: Is no, it's very individual and it's a personal choice. It's personal choice. And it comes back to your definition of success. And yet it's not an easy choice because so often we hear either one or the other being the right. Decision, right. Oh, you gotta scale and go big and you want to exit, you know, your, your business at one point and that's why you need a brand or on the other hand is no, you want that personal connection. And that's why you need to use your name as your brand. Well, the pens, you know? Yeah. You need to actually think about how you see this business. Do you want to grow it? And if you don't, well, you're perfectly fine using your name and, and, and for me, even if you do. [00:22:00] You  Petchy: can still use your, your name. Exactly. You see? I mean like, yeah, you see big brand names based off a real person's name all the time where you know that they are this huge brand with lots of employees, worldwide presence. And it's still exactly person's name at the top. There's no  Sarah: correct answer. Really? No. And I  Petchy: think that's something that's one of my pet peeves in the business world. This whole notion that my way is the right way. And then you have three or four different people claiming that it's their way. That it's the only way. Right. And really there is no right or wrong answer. It's only down to you what path you like to take. Yeah. And, and you can course correct along the way. So if you, if you start out using your own name for instance, and you feel like that's not. It's not quite right. Then you can, you can twist it and you can take a different turn.  Sarah: Yeah. You know, what I noticed do Petchi is it's, it's easier for people to [00:23:00] be told this is the right way, right? They're like, oh, this is the easy answer that I, you know, I'm looking for. And so. When we tell 'em, oh, it's up to you, you know, you have the choice then they're like, oh, I don't know. And then, so really what we're saying here is like, if you feel like you are don't know which way to go, well, sit with it, then actually do the work and figure out, well, what. Do I want to do with this business? Do I want to grow it? What's my definition of success, all these questions that take some deeper work, because yeah, the gurus day will tell you, it's only this way or it's only that way. Mm.  Petchy: And of course it's easy. It's I mean, I like the idea of just being able to take someone else's approach and make it work for me outta the box. But I think in reality, That works for very few people. Yeah. And I see it all the time when I work with my clients and the work that I do with my clients. [00:24:00] I will never design just a logo for a client for instance, and that BEC that's because I, I need them to do that deep in a work first, so I can do a, a good job and the resistance there to actually go and do that deep work is, is present in. 90 something percent of all of my clients when they come to me and they're like, oh, I just need a logo. I just wanna want it to look good. And oh, do I really need to look into these deep questions? It's, it's hard. and I'm like, well, you really do need to. And that's why the process takes longer than just like a couple of weeks to, to complete as well, because these are. Really big, really heavy questions and they take time to process. , yeah, for,  Sarah: I really feel like we do the same groundwork because it's the same with the clients who just want marketing, you know, they just want clients. And so it's like, okay, just tell me how I need to market. Right. Do I need to be on Facebook on Instagram? Like, no, you need to actually go into [00:25:00] these deep questions. And I feel like. That's what we have in common. You then go into branding and I go into marketing, but the deep core level, figuring out, you know, who you are and what you want that needs to come first in both cases.  Petchy: It does. Yeah. And what I will say also is after that initial period of resistance and feeling like, oh, it's too hard. It's too big. I can't do this. Once they start to. Like find the little golden nuggets within themselves that, that they already had. Like, all of this is already, inside. You, you just need to extract them. And sometimes you just need someone to help you. like, right. , that sort your thoughts around things, but really nobody else. But you can do the actual work of doing that in a work. And, and then. What I find is when people start to find those golden nuggets within themselves and they have those aha moments, they emerge on the other side [00:26:00] of that, really quite what feels like a bit of a Rocky road to them, I think. And they emerge with such clarity. Mm-hmm . That it's, , it's amazing to see the transformation and how they then talk about their brand or talk about themselves as a brand differently. Yeah. Afterwards  Sarah: mm-hmm. Yeah. Yeah. It's, it's kind of like the, the labyrinths I talk about in the marketing, like we're human book, you go in you rumble, you have to ask all these deep questions, then you stand in the middle of the labyrinths you rise. You realize how you are different, , from everybody else. And then you walk back into the world and you resonate, right? Because you are now clear and you can tell these stories that, yeah. That just resonate with people. And that's what the branding. Does you know that deep foundational branding, not the, not the logo, the logo doesn't do that. Right. Cause there's not, yeah, not enough deep inner work. , that's amazing. [00:27:00] Yeah. I wanna, I wanna kind of come to some other questions as well. Well, the, actually that term that you mentioned, , before brand architecture. So tell us a bit more about that and the different layers of brand.  Petchy: Yeah, I'll, I'll try and, uh, make it, oh, well, simplify it a bit.  Because brand architecture can be really complex, but we can also think about it in really sort of simpler terms. So in essence, brand architecture, it's the layers of your brand. So how many levels. Does your brand have, and on the one side you have what we call a branded house. And on the other extreme, you have what you call a house of brands. And then of course there are all sorts of hybrid models that you can adopt in the middle there. And a lot of us smaller business owners will probably find ourselves towards, leaning towards a hybrid model or, , maybe a, a [00:28:00] branded house. So somewhere towards that end of the scale. , and that's because we are naturally, we are naturally the focus of our brands, but we then might have certain product brands that then lie on the next level. Below us like, so if you, if you place yourself as the mother brand of your brand, , Sarah is, , on the top there mm-hmm and then you have your, your method, that's kind of a subbrand to your main brand , and any other like product or services that you decide to brand separately. So it's brand architecture is more about figuring out how all of these little puzzle pieces, , fit together. Mm. And then. You can also look at whether you want that. Do you want there to be a difference between your personal brand, , and your corporate brand because, and that goes back to what we were just talking about as well. And it's, it's really is up to you how visible you are as the brand owner. So if you're leaning more towards a [00:29:00] corporate brand, then you would perhaps not use your own name so much, but if you're leaning more towards. A personal brand, you would lead with your name. So, or in the corporate  Sarah: brand brand, just be featured as like the founder or yeah, mm-hmm  Petchy: yeah. And I mean, you have examples of this. So you have some of the big household brands where, you have Unilever, for instance, they obviously that's the mother brand, but it's not really that visible. When you go out and look into the world, you don't really see the mother brand as much because you see the, the sub brands, you see the product brands, right? They are the ones who take center stage. , and the reason why a lot of these like bigger brands that have a lot of different products do it that way is because it then allows them to go into the marketplace and compete. Against itself, if you know what I mean, they can have several different products, very distinct product brands, so, and they can be competing against [00:30:00] each other. Mm-hmm  Sarah: so that would be the, the house of brands. Right. That would be the more the  Petchy: corporate model. That's more of the corporate line. So for instance, if you have a very. A very strong, but hidden mother brand. Maybe they do lines of cleaning products. Maybe they even do like two different brands of washing powder, like detergent mm-hmm because they are structured in that way. They can do that. Like they can put the brands up to like against each other. But that's not the approach that most small business owners take. So we are more in the, on the other end of the scale, where, where we just focus on building a, like a solid core around ourselves. And then you can decide whether you want to have a prominent role in that, or whether you wanna step back a little bit and let your approach or your signature service. If you. Those to [00:31:00] lead instead. So it's, it's just figuring out like the prominence of the different levels as well and how it all works together. But, I dunno if I mentioned it to you, but I do have a little guide on this. Just a one page PDF that I will happily let your listeners. Have so I will send that to you. Sarah: Oh, awesome. Sarah, I'll definitely make sure that they can download that because I think that's when it gets complex as well. As you know, we were talking before we, , recorded this idea of what, if you have outgrown your brand and now you need to rebrand and you know, all these questions. Well, what do I need to change? How do you communicate about it? That's when it gets complex. And that's when people really need to ask for help from someone like you, because then it can quickly get in into very messy brands. Right. where it's like, yeah, I see it all the time. It's like that one times it's like that and yeah, it's just kind of gets confusing. Petchy: It's [00:32:00] one of the scenarios that I come across. The most, actually, when I work with my clients is some, they, they will come to me. They already have a brand and they they're doing fairly well with that, but it feels like something's a little bit off. It's not feeling aligned anymore. , and maybe they feel like they've outgrown their brand, as you said. And, and yeah, I think that's when it becomes even more important to take that step back and look at the foundations before you do anything else, because maybe that was the missing piece, right? , from the previous brand and a lot of the. I find that they don't have to throw everything out of the window and start all over a lot of the time we can take what they have and we can mold it and we can tweak it and we can turn that into the next iteration of the brand. So it's not, it's not always necessary to go right back. Yeah. Start from scratch.  Sarah: I have a very personal question about my brand. You know, I have the humane marketing. it's more of. An idea as a brand, because my company is not [00:33:00] called humane marketing. , the website is humane marketing, and then I have marketing, like we're human selling, like we're human. Those are the, the books. So would you say marketing, like we're human and selling? Like we're human are kind of like the subbrands, even though I'm, I'm not really branding them, but I'm often talking about. This idea of selling or marketing or now LinkedIn, like we're human. Is this kind of a sub-brand even though I'm not really, you know, branding it per se. Mm. Yeah, I  Petchy: think it's kind of just naturally falling into the category of sub-brand. Okay. , maybe you're just doing it sub subconsciously , but, and it feels like natural, but also I feel like you are a whole approach. The whole sort of human centered way of doing things has potential to become a brand. Of its own something bigger than you eventually. Yeah. Like if, if that is the direction that you wanted to take it,  Sarah: That's so humane marketing. That's kind of the reason why I, you know, didn't [00:34:00] put it under my name. I was like, well, if I'm. Wanting to create a movement, then it's not all about me. It's about the movement and the idea behind the movement. And, and so that's why I went with humane marketing and the trademark and, and all of that. So, so yeah, I, I was just wondering, you know, what is this. A subbrand in a small business example. So for you branded, you said, that could become a its own subbrand eventually. So, so I'm thinking maybe marketing, like we're human is another example. Petchy: Yeah. Yeah. I would say that's, that's exactly how it would work. And then, , for now maybe you are more prominent than humane marketing. Yeah. But at some point you might find. That the roles change and that's okay. And you can then make a conscious decision of whether you want to lead with yourself or whether you want to lead with your approach or your method or your movement. Yeah. , but also it kind of gives you a lot of [00:35:00] cred too. If this thing grows bigger than you. If you managed to create this worldwide movement. Then imagine what effect that has on your personal brand to be able to go out there and say with confidence and pride that, hi, I'm Sarah, I'm the creator of this movement, you know, I'm the founder of this. Yeah. So they all, they're all connected.  Sarah: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I see how the personal brand plays into that now. Yeah. There's there's one, kind of final topic I wanted to touch upon. And that's this idea of the future, you know, what does the future of branding looks like? Which direction are we going in in terms of branding? Petchy: Oh, well, I, I don't think I have a crystal ball , but I, the way I see it and the way I'm experiencing it as, as a part. Like the business world right now [00:36:00] is that those personal connections are going to become even more important for, for brands as we move forward, because people are craving that human connection. People are craving to be seen, to be heard, to be taken seriously by a human and not, and to not just feel like there are a number in a sales spreadsheet or. Or in a CRM system. Mm-hmm I know for myself that makes me feel very, it feels like it's dehumanizing somehow. So yeah, those genuine, genuine connections, and not trying to present yourself as anything other than what you are not trying to con people just, just. Don't be an asshole. Sorry. Am I allowed to swear on your yes, that's fine.  Sarah: totally fine. Yeah. And it's funny. Cuz just yesterday I, I got on a call from, with a new circle member, a human [00:37:00] humane marketing circle and I offered these coffee chats and. The guy actually said, you know, I really appreciate having this chat with you. I was really impressed by this human connection, cuz usually in these memberships, we don't get that. And, and that proves what you just said. It's like, Yeah, we're, we're used to just being a number, right. We're used to kind of just paying monthly subscriptions, but not actually counting as, as human beings or not having that connection with the, you know, the, the other people or the founders. So I think, I think you're totally right. What about in terms of go ahead. No, sorry.  Petchy: I was just saying, I think we're moving from the sort of spray and pray approach to a more. Focused, deeper, but narrower kind of connection. Yeah.  Sarah: Yeah. The, which also maybe means, you know, smaller businesses, not giant, [00:38:00] you know, kingdoms of, of businesses. Like some of the big names had in the past, You know, smaller communities, but very meaningful communities. I, I think that's where we're, we're heading. Yeah.  Petchy: I think there will still, we will still see those big brands as well, because they are so established by now that they, they just own a certain market share by now. But. When you see a lot of smaller brands emerging, it's, it's a lot easier for people to find a brand that really resonates with them, you know, that they really feel onboard with this brand's vision and what they're trying to do and the values and what they stand for. And that connection of feeling like you are a part of something. Yeah. And not just a, an invisible, insignificant little, little puzzle piece. Mm-hmm I think that becomes more important for. People wanna feel like they're making a difference or that they're doing good. Right. And, , whatever that [00:39:00] might be. So, I mean, I will find a lot of brands out there that stand for the complete opposite of what I stand for. But there will be people who resonate with them too. Yeah. And then I can go and find the brand that resonates with me. Mm-hmm and then that, that's my way of being able to influence the world in that direction. I wanna see it is choosing what brands I support and what brands I buy from. Right.  Sarah: What about visually? , I remember you and I talked about the visual aspect also of future design. , what's your, future vision.  Petchy: Ah, this is a big question as well. , there's this term that I've seen, going round the block, lately and it's de branding Okay. so the, some of the like bigger, more established brands have ditched, slightly complex logos and gone back to basics with just the, the sort of flat logos, very simple like logo types. , and I've seen. Some like [00:40:00] controversy around it as well. And like, people are like, oh, what do you think of this before and after? And you have a lot of designers, especially the younger designers going, oh, why are they doing that? Now? They don't look like, you know, they are not distinct anymore. They just look like one of many. And for me, I'm classically trained. I'm a bit of a dinosaur. I'm gonna age myself enough for saying this, but I'm trained the old school way to. To develop visual identities. And especially if we talk about the logo, that it should be able to work in its simplest form. Right. And then, so that was, that was the initial approach. And then like maybe in the, the old days, you didn't have all of the, digital channels that we have now in all of the different reproduction methods for. Digital print and all of that. And so your logo had to be simple, right? It had to communicate in a, in a really simple, way and be really distinct, , just in one color and just flat. [00:41:00] So that's where like I come from and then you can add things to it. And I think with the, with technology, just moving so fast, we were able to do so many things to these logo. So easily, we could just like add a drop shadow, or we could add a gradient or we could make it look fancy or we could animate logos and and somewhere in that, I think we lost the simplicity. That's really powerful. Mm-hmm because we just started adding things because we could . Right. , and the way I see it now is more brands are returning to. The basics, because even though we have now, all of these options are how to, how to place our logo. And really, we aren't limited to anything, but it's, it's just going back to the basics and  Sarah: seems, seems to be a movement kind of everywhere. Right. And it's, it's bad to me it's going in the right direction and we need to simplify everywhere, you know? [00:42:00] Yeah. And that's  Petchy: not to say that you can't start with a simple logo and add something fancy to it, but it's. Then you will always have that really solid recognizable icon that, that you can go back to. So, okay. So all of these special effects, they're all just fashion, you know, they're all just like trends, pleading trends. So maybe one year gradient logos are all the rage. Everybody wants a gradient logo and they're like a year after. That trend is gone and it's nice then to have a, just a clean, timeless logo that you can revert back to him and then yeah, tweak it. Sarah: I'm just also thinking, you know, about. I don't know, printing, for example, like every time you print such a complicated logo while you use more ink. Right. And, and so just sustainably thinking also it, it [00:43:00] needs to go into the direction of simplifying and going back to basics and, and yeah, to me, that seems to the right direction. Anyway, I think we kind of got lost. Just like, yeah, everywhere. We got lost with technology and robots and chatbots and all of that. And now we just need to come back to basics and,  Petchy: and, but there's no wonder I'm, I'm an early adopter of all like kinds of technology. I love new technology. I love new gadgets. So I get that. It's, you know, it's fun to play with. But I don't think we should lose the sight of the basics and right where we came from either. So finding a striking a balance there, I think is good. Yeah. Is the future of branding finding that sweet spot and what works for you? Mm-hmm yeah. So not necessarily looking to a different brand or other brands, like bigger brands to figure out what's right for you. Don't don't just copy. Just. That sort of introspective mm [00:44:00] wonderful things.  Sarah: This has been really great. Thanks so much. Petchi for having this conversation and sharing so much wisdom. I always, I think for inviting me. Yeah. Thank you. I always ask one last question, , before you share where people can find you, but what are you grateful for today or this week? Petchy: , today, well, not just today and not just this week, but just this, this year or this decade. , I'm just really grateful for living in a very safe country. I have food, I have clothes. I have a roof over my head and a wonderful family. And, that's something to be grateful for. I think in these. These times where we see what's happening around the world. Yeah.  Sarah: Yeah. Happy for you. Thank you. Share with us where people can find you and, mention maybe that PDF. Do you want to just send me that or is there a link that, , I can,  Petchy: , yeah, I can send you that. Afterwards and you can put it wherever you, you. [00:45:00] Yeah. So wish, , yeah, no, the best place to go and find me and learn more about me online is my website. You'll find everything there from like my approach, , and what I'm all about and ways to work with me and how to find me in other channels. And that's pet.co. , I also hung out on Instagram quite a lot. And on LinkedIn. But you won't probably see me pop up in your feed because the action is all in the sort of DMS and, , and that, but it's petri.co on, on Instagram as well. If you wanna follow along there. And, , like I said, my feed is a static evergreen, nine grid. So the best way to connect with me on there is just to slide into my DMS and say, hello. .  Sarah: Wonderful. Thanks so much. This was amazing. I learned a lot. So thank you for that pet. Thanks for being here.  Petchy: Thanks for having me.[00:46:00] [00:47:00] 

In this muse episode I talk about how the the current economic situation impacts our pricing as entrepreneurs.  And why instead of raising my prices, I decided to go against the grain and lower the fee of my membership, the Humane Marketing Circle *** Pricing is also one of the 7Ps that we discuss in detail during the Marketing Like We're Human program, my flagship program that I'm running again with a live cohort starting August 25th. It will run over 8 weeks and is a hybrid program, part video tutorials and workbooks, part weekly live calls where we deepen these concepts. If any of this resonates, please take some time to look at humane.marketing/program for a very detailed description of the program as well as a 19-minute behind the scenes video and then book a chat with me to see if it's a good fit.

Today's short solo-episode fits under the P of Passion. As you know, the Passion is the first of the 7Ps of the Humane Marketing Mandala. Passion or Purpose. They go hand in hand. We start out with that P to make sure we create a business and marketing that feels good, even long term. If we build a business just for money-making, we'll probably get bored of it or even end up hating it. So today, I'm sharing my story of the first business I created out of circumstance and what it taught me down the line once I started losing my passion for it. In this episode, you'll learn about what to do if you lost your passion My first business created out of circumstance Looking for your why Questions to ask yourself to find your why and so much more   Sarah's Resources Watch this episode on Youtube (FREE) Sarah's One Page Marketing Plan (FREE) Sarah Suggests Newsletter (FREE) The Humane Business Manifesto (FREE) Gentle Confidence Mini-Course Marketing Like We're Human - Sarah's book The Humane Marketing Circle Authentic & Fair Pricing Mini-Course Podcast Show Notes Email Sarah at sarah@sarahsantacroce.com Thanks for listening!   After you listen, check out Humane Business Manifesto, an invitation to belong to a movement of people who do business the humane and gentle way and disrupt the current marketing paradigm. You can download it for free at this page. There's no opt-in. Just an instant download. Are you enjoying the podcast?  The Humane Marketing show is listener-supported—I'd love for you to become an active supporter of the show and join the Humane Marketing Circle. You will be invited to a private monthly Q&A call with me and fellow Humane Marketers -  a safe zone to hang out with like-minded conscious entrepreneurs and help each other build our business and grow our impact.  — I'd love for you to join us! Learn more at humane.marketing/circle Don't forget to subscribe to the show on iTunes or on Android to get notified for all my future shows and why not sign up for my weekly(ish) "Sarah Suggests Saturdays", a round-up of best practices, tools I use, books I read, podcasts, and other resources. Raise your hand and join the Humane Business Revolution. Warmly, Sarah Imperfect Transcript of the show We use and love Descript to edit our podcast and provide this free transcript of the episode. And yes, that's an affiliate link. Sarah: [00:00:00] [00:01:00] [00:02:00] Welcome back humane marketers. Today's short solo episode fits under the P of passion. If you're a regular here, you know that I'm organizing the conversations around the seven PS of the humane marketing. Mandalah in a, this is your first time here, a big warm welcome. Maybe you don't know what I'm talking about, but you can tell. Your one page marketing plan with the humane marketing version of the seven P's of marketing@humane.marketing forward slash one page. That's the number one. And then page it comes with seven email prompts to really [00:03:00] help you reflect on these different PS for your business and marketing. So as a, you know, the passion P is the first of the seven PS of the humane marketing Mandalah passion or Perth posts. They kind of go hand in hand and I used them interchangeably sometimes. So we started out with that P to make sure we create a business and marketing that feels. Even long-term right. If we build a business just for the money, we'll probably get bored of it or even end up hating it down the road. And so my first business wasn't a passion business. It was a, what I call a circumstance business back then we had just arrived in California. So I had to. Corporate job here in Switzerland, I was working at an international business school in, in marketing and other related things. And so we arrived in [00:04:00] California. I settled put the kids up, but preschool and daycare, and then eventually started out my own business. And at the time I thought I'm going to go into being a virtual assistant. So that was the first business idea I had. But then back in the days, that was in 2006, 2007. It was like in the middle of the social media, boom, everything, Twitter was brand new. Facebook was kind of also in the starting blocks. And so I learned all about using social media for my own business. And then I thought, wait a minute, if I can do. That launch a business for my own. I can help other entrepreneurs and small businesses with their social media as well. And I was kind of, I w I wouldn't say passionate about it, but I enjoyed doing. And so that was what I decided I would do. And so when we moved back to [00:05:00] Switzerland in 2010, I then kind of pivoted to LinkedIn only to focus in on LinkedIn because that's where I saw a need over here in Switzerland. Some of the other social platforms weren't big yet. Like Facebook people were using it for personal need, but not on a professional side where LinkedIn, they understood. Okay. We can use that for our business. And so, yeah, it was a circumstance business. It also really. Fit me well for about a decade, because I was able to raise our boys at the same speed. I grew my business, so it served its purpose, but damn, after these 10 years or about around that time, I really disrespected a big rule in the Santa Croce household. And that is leave at the top of the demand. So Tony, my husband, and I often say that to each other mate, let's make sure we leave at the top of the mountain. [00:06:00] So what we mean by that is like leave or, or, or yeah, go or, or don't do it again before things turn back. And, and that's the rule. I didn't respect because slowly but surely things started turning bad. I started to lose my passion for LinkedIn. I started to hate marketing my LinkedIn business. Well, that's actually a good thing because it led to the humane marketing revolution. But yeah, I really, I really just kind of lost passion for, for this. Not passion related business. So I yeah, it made me realize I didn't build my business around a passion or. So I did what I always did back then. I went into the doing mode. I started looking for my why, and it really just almost drove me crazy. I remember having these [00:07:00] long conversations with my friend, Valerie and just saying, look, I think I just don't have a why. I don't know. It's I can't find it. I'm not passionate about this LinkedIn thing, but I don't know what else. Should be my why. It felt like I needed a why so badly because everyone else had one. And of course also biggest Simon Sinek said you had to start with the why, but nothing came and it really was a source for anxiety for me. So. Nothing came until I finally surrendered and let go. And yes, I also broke down and wept on that tear. The therapist's chair is saying that I was done with this whole marketing stuff. But that's literally when answers started coming to me, not long after that moment, I then had an epiphany that told me to reserve the gentle business revolution, domain name, and yeah. That the rest [00:08:00] is kind of history. That's, that's when the idea of gentle marketing and then, you know, the story about humane marketing and the trademark and all of that. So literally I had to let go and say, okay, Maybe I don't have a why or doesn't matter, I'm just gonna like go of this idea of passion and purpose and in that's when it started coming to me. So when the participant in the marketing, like we're human program, posted a comment in our Trello board this week that she was stuck with her. Why. I told her exactly that don't pressure yourself to find your passion. And instead, I kind of invited her to ask some of the following questions. So this is kind of, I'm quoting what I said to her. What if you never worked with a client ever again, what would you do? How would you know you are enough without ever making any more. [00:09:00] Your why might not be business-related at all, but since it's you, you can bring it into business. Maybe it's environment related, animal related universe related relationships related. What did you enjoy doing when you were a kid? If nothing comes, don't try to find the answers. They will show themselves. Just keep asking the question. So, if any of this resonates in, you're stuck with your why as well. I really just highly recommend you let it go and just surrender. The more you hate marketing, the more I suspect there's something wrong at the core either you're no longer passionate about your business or you've been following the wrong marketing and device, because if you're really passionate about your business and marketing, From within bringing all of you yourself to your marketing, it really should [00:10:00] just flow. And if it doesn't, I suspect you're still doing things that are not aligned with who you are and, or maybe also your whole offering is no longer aligned with who you really are. That often happens when people are told that they have to choose a niche and end up choosing something that after a while, no longer works for them. If you're stuck in any of these situations, I truly believe the marketing like where human program could help you. It's more than marketing. It's really humane business building. It's about creating the foundations for a sustainable business. So. It'll go back to enjoy communicating with your ideal clients. You can have a look at the program. You can take it online right now. It also comes with a full year of humane marketing circle community. So a monthly call to come and ask your questions and be in community. Or you can wait for the group experience, which I'll host again this [00:11:00] August. So again, you can find out all the details@humane.marketing forward slash pro. I hope does has helped you and maybe, you know, of someone else who is stuck with their, why? If so, I'm not going to say, share this episode, but, but maybe give them also that permission to just surrender and let it go. Because I really think it does contribute to the anxiety and that's the opposite of what we want. Right. A purpose. Shouldn't be. The result of more anxiety, it should be just like the result of surrendering and dressed and let it letting it come to you. So I hope this resonated with you. You find the show notes of this episode@humane.marketing for slash H M 1 3 8 on this beautiful page. You'll also find a series of free offers. Such as my [00:12:00] Saturday newsletter, the humane business manifesto and the gentle confidence mini course, as well as my two books marketing, like we're human and selling. Like we're human. Thank you so much for listening and being part of a generation of marketers who cares for yourself, your clients and the planet. And if you're looking for others who think like you, then why not join us in the humane marketing? Find out more@humane.marketing forward slash circle. We are change-makers before we are marketers. Now go be the change you want to see in the world. Speak soon.

Today's conversation with Siobhan Jones about why writing a book is good for your business fits under the P of Product in the 7Ps of the Humane Marketing Mandala Siobhan Jones is a Writing Mentor, Self-Publishing Coach, and founder of The Unlocked Creative. Writing has always been on Siobhan's heart. After going from trauma to triumph Siobhan realized she had a story to share, a purpose to pen and a reason to write. She realized that she was called to help women stop hiding and go after their writing dream. Now, Siobhan helps women to plan, write and publish their first book. Siobhan lives in Canberra, Australia with the loves of her life; her daughter, husband, and two talkative cats. When she's not writing you can find Siobhan spending time with her family, patting cats, drinking coffee, imagining cactuses and sheep, and running (not all at the same time). Siobhan's favorite quote: "Don't wait. The time will never be just right." - Napoleon Hill In this episode, you'll learn why writing a book is good for your business, and... The self-publishing process The pros and cons of self-publishing (and how your ego plays a role) An idea of costs related to self-publishing Why writing a book is good for business Ways to make time for writing your book while running your business How to put your inner critic on mute and write your business book The structure and/or discipline of writing and so much more. Siobhan's Resources   Siobhan's Website The Unlocked Creative Podcast Get the Time to Write guide and find more time to write your book! Connect with Siobhan on: Instagram Facebook Facebook Group   Sarah's Resources Watch this episode on Youtube (FREE) Sarah's One Page Marketing Plan (FREE) Sarah Suggests Newsletter (FREE) The Humane Business Manifesto (FREE) Gentle Confidence Mini-Course Marketing Like We're Human - Sarah's book The Humane Marketing Circle Authentic & Fair Pricing Mini-Course Podcast Show Notes Email Sarah at sarah@sarahsantacroce.com Thanks for listening!   After you listen, check out Humane Business Manifesto, an invitation to belong to a movement of people who do business the humane and gentle way and disrupt the current marketing paradigm. You can download it for free at this page. There's no opt-in. Just an instant download. Are you enjoying the podcast?  The Humane Marketing show is listener-supported—I'd love for you to become an active supporter of the show and join the Humane Marketing Circle. You will be invited to a private monthly Q&A call with me and fellow Humane Marketers -  a safe zone to hang out with like-minded conscious entrepreneurs and help each other build our business and grow our impact.  — I'd love for you to join us! Learn more at humane.marketing/circle Don't forget to subscribe to the show on iTunes or on Android to get notified for all my future shows and why not sign up for my weekly(ish) "Sarah Suggests Saturdays", a round-up of best practices, tools I use, books I read, podcasts, and other resources. Raise your hand and join the Humane Business Revolution. Warmly, Sarah Imperfect Transcript of the show Sarah: [00:00:00] Hi, Chavon. How are you today?  Siobhan: Hello? I am so well, how are you?  Sarah: I'm good too. Yeah. And you just mentioned you, you moved house and as an introvert and highly sensitive person that it feels always like, oh, that is a big thing. I dunno how, how you feel, but to me, moving is a big.  Siobhan: It's a big thing and it's always surprising how much stuff. Actually exists that  Sarah: we don't use. Yeah. Yeah. You collect things over time and then it's a good opportunity to get rid of some stuff as well.  Siobhan: Yeah, it absolutely is. Yes. But, but subtly, I think sometimes you have to do it a bit subtly. Yeah.  Sarah: Yeah. Nice. Bye bye. This is the second time you actually get to chat and talk. I was on your podcast and now you're here talking to us about book writing, and I'm really excited to [00:01:00] dive into this topic. First of all, also, because I've just gone through that last year and then also. Curious to hear what you think about it. And you kind of brought up this conversation around, you know writing a book can be good for your business. And so we'll dive into that, but maybe before we start I'd be curious to have you share a bit, you know, how you became a book writing, mentor, how you, how do you decide, okay. That is what I'm going to do.  Siobhan: This is a, this is a great question and I'll try and keep it. The short version, not the long version. A few years ago, I was sort of having some doubts about my career in communications in government. And I wasn't sure what to do. And I thought, you know, I've spent so many years practicing this communication craft, helping clients to [00:02:00] essentially market their services and programs to the public. And I just didn't want to progress with promotions anymore. And I wasn't sure what the heck to do. And so I thought, well, what was, you know, what was the thing that I love to do as a kid? Because I really wanted to connect deeply with something meaningful because one of my core values is meaningful work or impact. And I. Yeah. Thought back to when I was a child and just absolutely loved to write stories and remembered how I wanted to be April from the teenage mutant ninja turtles, but maybe not so much of a reporter, more of a. Telling the truth and whatever that is. So I really went on this a bit of a journey. I started writing children's picture books, [00:03:00] and then I began writing and reconnecting with the spoken word through my podcast, which really lit me up. And then. Helping other people to start that writing process themselves. And it was just, you know, I think the hardest thing about starting to write is starting to rise.  Sarah: Yeah. Yeah. This is so good. I love that you went back to your childhood. I, I tell that to my clients or it's part of the humane marketing approach is like, well, how do you figure out what your past. About or what your, why is, or, you know, guy kind of does big purpose word? Well, oftentimes it is, you know, going back to what you'd like to do as a child. And I love that you did that in order to figure out then while you know, what is, is, is it that I really want to do so good. Yeah. Thank you.  Siobhan: Thank you. Yeah. And [00:04:00] I hope that, you know, people listening who might be in a career transition or not really sure of the next step knows that they're absolutely not alone. Sarah: Yeah. Yeah, exactly. So, so then you, you started writing children's books, but I think eventually you also kind of pivoted into this whole idea of helping others with their book. Right. Tell us what you learned in that journey of then writing your own business books, so to speak that work for  Siobhan: you. This is, this is also one of those see I'm a very, I really like to plan things in my life and this was yet again, one of those things that was completely unplanned. I. I spoke with, I have a business coach and, you know, I was speaking about how I would like to get my children's picture books, published the stories published in the [00:05:00] traditional sense. And she really questioned me on it and said, well, why wouldn't you just self-publish them? And I thought, I have resistance to this idea. Why do I have resistance to this idea? And then I thought I'm going to go after this because what I find happens with me is that I get resistance there for a reason. And thankfully I have people kind of like signposts, helpful souls along the way to help me really get back on the right path. And Question and reflect why I might be resisting things. So I, I really did some discernment work and thought, I don't actually want to self publish the children's picture books yet they need more work, but I will go ahead and self publish. And it was just a matter of them deciding what that, what that was going to be. And the thing that I had had done. [00:06:00] You know, I'd had lots of content available on my podcast for free, and many of those things were really quite practical steps and strategies that people can take to, you know, when they're learning about how to start writing, how to make it a habit and then, and then how to go on and, and self-publish, but what I wanted to do was actually self-publish my own. So that I could help other people from that extra layer of experience that I think is absolutely crucial whenever you are teaching people or helping others to reconnect with their own writing or creative inspiration. So that's sort of the journey of what I've been on. And honestly, self publishing. It's just opened a whole new world for me. And I know that it's, it's something that. You know is not, you know, it hasn't been around for hundreds of years, but the technology at the moment [00:07:00] is allowing quite a large growth in that industry. So there's lots of opportunity.  Sarah: Yeah. Did you end up publishing your children's books? The traditional way?  Siobhan: Not yet. I am still working on those. So I think for me, I I definitely would like to, and it's something that I will pursue, but I have another project up my sleeve at the moment. So. That that's that's something that I'm focusing on this year is this new project, which is actually writing a memoir. So it's something that I haven't done before and am really, really excited about where it can lead. I just think, you know, I, I kind of boxed myself in thinking I'll just be a children's picture book writer, but this is opened up that other door for me as well to think about. Well, there are actually other kind of formats and categories of variety, and it's [00:08:00] just immense this opportunity that we have to really express that express ourselves creative. Sarah: Right. Yeah. Yeah. It's interesting. Cause I went through the same thing when I thought about, you know, do I self publish? Do I publish within, you know, the traditional way? And, and there's obviously two camps. If you do search online or, you know, if you work with coaches and one will tell you, this is absolutely the only way. And then others tell you, well, you can be just as I was going to say successful, but a. That's not really the word I want to use, but you can get the book out there and attract the right people even with self-publishing. And so I really also had to think about, for me, what really was the driving factor, as well as the timing because I, I just felt that my books were very Timely, like they needed to come out now. Not, you know, when I eventually [00:09:00] found an editor as sorry, I publisher and it just like I had to get them out now. So I think that makes a huge difference. Even I'm talking to friends who are kind of hybrid publishing, so meaning they have some kind of a support with the publishing. They actually do print the book. And even there there's like the time it takes as much longer even though you pay for those, you know, you pay up front and it takes much more time to actually get the book out and there's delays. And where in the self publishing process. I feel like you are really the driver of this thing. Of course there's, you know, editing if you're hopefully gonna go through some editing phases, but, but you are in much more in control than if you work with the traditional way. Would you agree with that? Is that also your experience?  Siobhan: Absolutely agree with that. You know, with some of the benefits of self-publishing, as you would know, [00:10:00] Sarah, you own the rights to your book rather than the publisher owning those rights. You, you know, like you've just said, you don't have to wait around for months for a publisher to reply to your query letter. You know, you get to choose with the suppliers that you want to work with along the way. So people like editors and graphic designers, it's a huge, it's a huge advantage. Being able to. Personally tos the people that you're going to be working with collaboratively, which is another gorgeous part of, you know, self publishing and creating this thing and birthing and into the world. I think, you know, you get to craft your own journey, your own steps along the way. And you know, in the time of. That really matters to you and your, your life priorities. So I, these are the things that, to me were really meaningful [00:11:00] and things that I hadn't really thought about prior to finding out more about self publishing. Sarah: Yeah. Yeah. It's so important. And, and I know countless stories of people who worked with a publisher and kind of felt like they had. You know, Ben their integrity just a little bit, because we didn't really feel exactly aligned you know, the cover didn't look like they wanted it to look, or they had to use a certain title just because it's sold more because obviously the publisher's job then is to sell as many books as possible. So, so yeah, it's really also, I think in my opinion, it's really a question of ethics as well. It's like, Are you okay. You know, going really with the big publisher to go after more book sales in a way I'm hesitating to bring this up, but I think there's also a question of ego in this game. This, if you look at the people who [00:12:00] have, you know, published with with the real publisher that. It does sound still good. Right. And maybe that's also why we had resistance to go with self-publishing. It's like, oh, but that's not the real thing. You know,  Siobhan: it's like a hundred percent.  Sarah: My ego gets a little hit if I'm not really publishing the real traditional way. So I think there's some deeper inner work to do there. Siobhan: I love that you brought that up, because that was definitely a piece of my own resistance. And particularly towards children's picture books. I had one of the self publishing platforms that I help people to navigate. A representative from there actually said, you know, pretty much you can publish any type of book. We don't, I wouldn't necessarily recommend children's picture books. And I thought, oh, that's curious, because it has to do with the, [00:13:00] with the quality of the paper and the book material. And her sense was that. Children's picture books, you know, getting, getting there where she's at the point where she has to really try to see that it's self-published but other books are probably better done you know, in, in other genres and with other types of materials available. But yeah, really, for me, it was like, I remember having a conversation with my husband about it saying. You know, I would really like to have these particular stories published by a publisher by, you know, a real industry publisher as someone who's known. And he just looked at me and said, isn't that just an ego thing? And I went, oh, so I really liked these conversations. People that you can trust about how you're feeling. And I, and I absolutely agree with you. [00:14:00] It did require some work on the ego. And you know, I think another thing to remember as well is that if you are thinking, if you're really. Kind of hanging on this idea of being traditionally, traditionally published. There are people today who have self-published and then had their material picked up by traditional publishers, because they've seen that it's successful in the market, which is primarily what publishers are looking at. So that's something to keep in mind as well.  Sarah: Yeah. The backup plan you're telling your ego. Well, there's always that chance.  Siobhan: Exactly. Calm down. Sarah: Okay. That's great. I love that word sharing kind of openly about this eco stuff that's going on. Yeah. When you're deciding, you know, which way to go. Let's talk about. You know, just in general, why writing a [00:15:00] book and having a book can be good for a business an entrepreneur coach consultant any type of service entrepreneur. Siobhan: Absolutely. So I think for me, there are five key things. The first, the first benefit is relationship. So, you know, for entrepreneurs and solopreneurs, you can really build that one-to-one intimate knowing relationship with your, with your client or your prospective clients. So it is a form of long. It is long form content, which helps to really create and nurture. The knowing relationship between you, the author and the person with the expertise in a particular area, which is what you're telling through your story in your book and that real connection through your, through the language and stories that you're telling about the expertise, but also with fragments of [00:16:00] yourself strewn throughout the book that your client's going to resonate with. So, you know, I think. It helps your client to understand your values as well. And, and what you stand for, which is either going to repel or attract people. So you know, but it's, it is a really powerful medium. So that's the first thing I would say. The second is, you know, It's you providing a transformation to someone, you know, whether it's a solution that you might have that's related to, I don't know, say you're a vegan chef or something, you know, a solution to meal planning during the week and your story of how you got to w how you meal plan as a vegan, you know, it's, it's something that you can teach really easily through a book format. So. You know, I think transformation doesn't have to be necessarily transforming your whole life, but pieces [00:17:00] of your life that eventually lead to greater change. So that's number two. Number three is, and I mentioned a little bit about this before, but you're showing that you do have expertise in this particular area, so of your business and really You're building your credibility by having this essentially, it's one of the tool tools that you have in your toolkit as a business owner. You know, you can also have greater visibility when you're connecting with other business owners and collaborating with other people on, you know, who can help you to promote your book, but also establishing those relationships I think is really crucial. So that's the third thing. And the fourth thing is. It's low cost. And when I say that, I say it with a caveat because you can make it as expensive as you like to produce your book. Essentially, you can make it, you can do it on a pretty tight budget. You know, if you don't want to [00:18:00] produce a printed book, you can produce an ebook and they're much less less expensive to produce, obviously because there's no printing cost involved. And the actual purchase price of e-books is much lower because. You know, the person isn't ordering and they don't have to have a physical book delivered. So that's number four is low cost. And the fifth thing is something that's probably overlooked a little bit. And it's that you get to be creative. So. You know, you get to really hone your message. You really get to clarify it and be really clear about what it is and, you know, even redefine it if you need to. So that's, that's a huge benefit. And even eventually you can repurpose the content that you have in your book. So. They're just the five benefits of why having a book in your business is a good idea. Sarah: Yeah, I love all of them. I think my favorite one is definitely the number one, the relationship [00:19:00] because. I do feel like you it's it's, it's like a podcast. But it's even, it's different because you don't hear the voice, obviously, but since it's long forum, it's really like you're, you know, spending depending on the length of the book, but you're spending a few hours. With you know, with the author and oftentimes I don't know how many people read books like I do in their bed, but oftentimes like you don't really cozy kind of surroundings. And so you feel like really you're getting up close to, to the, the author and yeah, I think that, that makes a huge difference. And of course, You know, and that depends how much you also bring a view to your book as the author. Just like in humane marketing you know, we bring a lot of us to our marketing. I definitely encourage the listeners. If you are writing a book, do bring parts of you to your book as [00:20:00] well. That's where their relationship really gets deeper. And like you said, people get to see your values. I think that's, that's so important. Yeah. I wanted to also follow up on the, on the cost. Maybe we can just go a bit deeper there because if you know, if you're completely new to this, like I had no idea what it would cost to, to write a book, whether it's self-published or, or not. So can you maybe share some insights there for our listeners?  Siobhan: I am. I'm very happy to do that. So you know, I mentioned the vague statement that you can do it for as much, or as little as you like, really it's all about, you know, the time and the investment that you have that you're willing to make in publishing your book. So what I always recommend is that you decide on your budget first and then you allocate, you know, particular Not percentages, but you [00:21:00] prioritize things like editing and book cover design, because these are the things that are going to attract or repel your readers. And, you know, one of the biggest bug bears that people have about self-published books is the quality. So there are. People are getting much better at doing this well, but I think especially in the early years of self, the self publishing industry, you know, there was some people who would just, you know, publish whatever they liked without editing. And I know. Everyone listening would absolutely never think of doing that ever, but it's just something to be mindful of. And that I emphasize in my courses that I have available is that quality. You really need to prioritize that because again, The book that you're producing represents your standards and your values and your readers will either be attracted or repelled by those. [00:22:00] So but going back to costs, you know, that, like you mentioned, there are agencies that do provide kind of that hybrid publishing model. They tend to be I would say, you know, literally for me, when I was doing the research around this upwards of $5,000 you know, going up very quickly to, you know, tens of thousands of dollars to 10 tens of thousands of dollars. Yeah, exactly. So you're, you're right there. You know, or you can take the reins and enjoy stepping through the self publishing process yourself as an example, my book you know, I published it in under three months and I didn't say. A strict budget, but I published it with a budget within a budget of 1500 Australian dollars. So that's around, I'd say probably 800 or 900 us dollars. And that included all of the setup costs my you know, inter [00:23:00] international standard book number. ISBM. Graphic design and editing and all of those things. And I didn't promote very much though. However, so that's, that's what I advise people to do. I just really wanted to produce this book to just, you know, see if I could do it and see what the process was like. But definitely from my perspective, I think that's that. Fairly inexpensive way to do it. And I did engage a professional graphic designer who did both the type setting. So setting the type, the font, all of that sort of thing, as you would be aware, Sarah, and the actual design of the book cover and all those sorts of things as well. I went to a professional editor for two of the three editing steps. So I did my own structural editor. But then the, I actually, sorry, I had two editors. I [00:24:00] neglected to mention that, but I chose to have two different editors for the two different types of editing, which is not a hundred percent necessary, but I did choose to do that. So, you know, there are ways and means you can, you can pull one lever and you can spend more in one area than in another. But for me, I put most of my funding into the quality aspects of producing the book, because that was the thing that was really crucial to me in producing the book. So does that answer your question  about  Sarah: that? And what I would add is you know, there's the quality of the book in terms of. You know, spelling and, and the paper and the design and the formatting. There's definitely a quality aspect of that. But then there's obviously the quality of the actual. Content, the writing the, how your big idea comes [00:25:00] through, you know, is there any kind of structure in your thoughts? And that to me is, is just as important, if not more than the actual quality in terms of, you know, is there any spelling mistakes you can read a very. You know, good quality book in terms of yet there's no spelling mistakes, but then it's like all over the place and you're like finished reading the book and you have no idea what you actually just read. So that's why to me, there's also cost related to maybe working with someone like you or, you know, someone I do also kind of work on the big idea. I don't do the same work as you in terms of. You know how to actually write it, but let's come up with this idea that your book is going to be about so that you have a structure and, you know, you know, there's three chapters. There's going to be three sub [00:26:00] chapters. So there's a good flow in the book because otherwise. Yeah, I feel that that's really a big part of the, of the, of the quality of the book as well. So maybe you can share a bit what your role is in, in helping your clients with some of that, right?  Siobhan: Oh, absolutely. So I. I 100% agree. And in fact, it's, it's quite amusing that, you know, I started off speaking with you today, talking about how I remembered when I was a child, you know, what I love to do, and that actually continued, you know, through university. My major was writing and cultural studies. So you know, I think absolutely you can have a beautifully wrapped gift with nothing in it. You know, it's, it's absolutely, you can definitely have that. But that's not going to engage people. It's not going to excite people, inspire people[00:27:00] help them to see the world differently. Really the true power of books I believe. And you know, I think in terms of, you know, the structure is one thing, ideas that's where you need to start really is what is, what is, what is this book about? What is this book about? And being super, super clear on what that is and not letting anything else. Come into the story that isn't part of that big theme that you're writing about. So, you know, I could talk for hours about this. So really it's about, you know, you need to make sure that you spend that time to allow yourself to have the space, to come up with the ideas. And then the big idea, the big theme for the book that is the universal theme. That's going to connect with your readers. Deeply human level. And yeah. So, you know, makes sense now that I'm speaking on humane [00:28:00] marketing, because I'm talking about the human connection here, but you must have that down. Pat, before you pick up your pen to write, you must have your core idea, you know, and, and that can take a lot of time to get to get right. To really you know, I think one of the things in Western society in particular is that we don't allow enough stillness to allow those ideas to come in and really marinate on them and, and let them take shape. So, you know, you would know about this because I believe that your, you know, in your book, Everything flows really well. And you've got a beautiful, like I said to you a little while ago, Sarah, that I felt like I was just sort of sitting, having coffee with you. And you were taking me on this journey and that's exactly how you want to feel when you're reading a book and really deeply connecting with the author. So I would start there. [00:29:00] Then there's, there comes the most difficult part, I believe, which is actually. Sitting down and writing a really messy first draft and that has to be done. Whether you plan it. Then, or you just write and then restructure divides people into two camps, which are the, the, the, the pantsers people who fly by the seat of their pants and the planners. And so I have struggled over the years to realize that I, my approach to writing had been pantsing, but I'm actually a life planner. So you know, it's hilarious the way that creativity works.  Sarah: Yeah. It's funny. When I think about me, I'm an inf J so the J stands for judging, but, but really what it is. Planning everything. And so that's what my life looks like. And so that's how I wrote my [00:30:00] books and managed to write two books in a year. It really is that structured approach, but I can totally see that it works, that you know, the other camp can work as well. It just depends what your natural superpowers are in. You know, like more creative approach, that's just how you are wired. Then I don't see anything wrong with that. It's just, it's just different.  Siobhan: I I need to sort of correct myself a little bit there because you, you always need structure. Your book is always going to need structure. In terms of the method of how you go about it. Yes. Yeah. There's people are very different. So yeah. Unfortunately for people who don't like structure, it's, you know, it's part of, it's part of writing a book and it's part of what makes, you know, it's like part of constructing a house. You need the [00:31:00] pillars to be standing strongly, to be able to build. Beautiful framework for people to glide through that house. So you absolutely need structure. Yes.  Sarah: I find like, it's almost like if you. Naturally structured then you probably won't need as much guidance with that. Maybe you need more kind of mental on blocking, you know, it's like mental guidance, confidence coaching, that kind of support or creativity writing where if you are naturally just creative and you can write for hours, then you need more help with the structure. Do you agree with  Siobhan: that? I think it, yeah, it's, it's very individual and, you know, depends on what you, how you best learn to write and also then how you apply that. So, yeah, we're, we're all quite unique in that and it's, it's really about, [00:32:00] you've kind of hit the nail on the head there. So it's about. Working out your best writing life and how you write with inspiration and how you motivate yourself to write the story that's meaningful for your readers and for you. Because, you know, ultimately you're not going to sit down and spend hours writing something that isn't meaningful for you as well. So I think that's something else. That is kind of overlooked a little bit is just the sheer enjoyment of the process is really important. Like if you don't enjoy writing it or. You are under no obligation to do it at all. It's really about, you know, is this a medium that lights you up? And you know, if you enjoy reading books and you're entertaining the thought of writing and you have this kind of deep little flame inside that says, write the book, write the book, write the book. Then [00:33:00] I believe that's absolutely there for a reason. I think what I primarily do is, is really guide people to understanding the process of oh, first of all, accepting. The hardest part of writing is actually sitting down and writing and making it a habit in your life and integrating it into your life. And I help people with the time management side of that. And and when I say time management, I don't mean, you know, providing them with the schedule, but actually really looking at their values and life priorities and identifying, you know, if writing is one of those, well, how do I. Ref like that, you know, how do I have that reflected in my schedule? And then, then assisting them with the strategies and tools to be able to integrate it. And I think. You know, I have a couple of courses available. One of them goes through, you know, how to write and finish your first draft so that messy draft process starting to write, making it a habit [00:34:00] and then writing the thing, actually doing it. And then for people who want to continue on and actually do want to self publish. There's the, there's the author, the unlocked author rather which steps people through the whole process. So it's really about I feel like one of the really big barriers to starting to write and then going on to self publish. Is the sheet overwhelmed about all of the information that's just available everywhere and trying to sift through that and work out well, this person writes for four hours a day, this person, you know, gets up at 4:00 AM and this person writes at 11:00 PM, which one's right for me. And it is always going to be about what's uniquely, right? For you as a writer.  Sarah: So important. Do not think you have to do it. You know, everyone else is telling you more except for them. Yeah. Yeah. So are these [00:35:00] courses the main part of your work, do you also work one-on-one tell us a bit more about how you.  Siobhan: Yeah. So I, I do have these courses. So, you know, the first one I mentioned is called the writer unlocked and it's actually the book that I produced is the book version of that course. So I provided it in another medium, which goes back to what I was saying earlier about the great thing about books is that you can repurpose them. But it really is for people who want to. Right. And just need that guidance. And I do have an online community community that people can join for that accountability. Because I talk a lot about that in the course. And again, it's unique to you. One form of accountability, you know, my form of accountability is not going to work for everybody. So understanding those really. Those really important key parts of taking, writing into your life as a practice, [00:36:00] really. So yeah, so that definitely those, that course, and then the self publishing course, which is the unlocked author. But I do offer one-on-one services, mentoring services for people who are feeling particularly stuck. I tend to find that you know, one of the main things that happens for all right I've only ever had one author who said that they don't experience it, but is the inner critic and strategies to help people to basically put that thing on mute because it can be done. It won't go away. Won't go away. But you know, we're all familiar with that mute button now, so we can do that. We can put it on Butte and right.  Sarah: Nice. Yeah, that's wonderful. I think you also have a free guide that tell us a bit about that and we'll share the link in the show notes.  Siobhan: Yeah, absolutely. Thank you. And I think, you know, I say that one of the hardest things is starting to write. I [00:37:00] think the other thing is the idea of time. So particularly for entrepreneurs and solopreneurs, who. Trying to work out. Okay. Well, you know, if you've decided that writing a book is for you or you're thinking about it, then one of the barriers can be, how do I actually fit this into my life? And so I created the time to write guide and you can get it for free, from bit dot L Y slash time to write guide. And in that guide, you get essentially a way to identify. Where you truly do have time because you do, if you prioritize it and it means something to you and you value it, and there is a schedule in there for you to plan that writing time in I've also provided a few options for you as well. If you're really struggling with those limiting beliefs which is supported through the unlocked creative podcast as well. So that's also for.  Sarah: Wonderful. [00:38:00] Yeah. I'm glad you mentioned that the podcast as well, and people can own so well put the link to, to our episode when I was a guest on yours so that people can go check that one out. So yeah. Thank you so much. Shawan this was delightful. I always have one last question and that is what are you grateful for today? Or this.  Siobhan: Thank you so much. It's just, first of all I'm grateful for being here on the show with you because I absolutely adore speaking with you. And so that's one thing, but I'll go another one, which is honestly, it's summer here in Australia, and I had this delightful run this morning in the cool air and it was. Sarah: Nice. Yeah, it's winter here, but it's, it's pretty blessed today as well. Wonderful sunshine. So thank you. Yeah. Thank you for hanging out and, and, and really kind of shining a light on this book publishing [00:39:00] process. I think people will really appreciate the honesty with which we shared here today. Cause I find that. Like, you know, a lot of these things that are completely new to us, we just have no idea. We have these, maybe these, or we do have some ideas, but often they're wrong. And so hopefully this has helped some listeners to really kind of get a deeper understanding of that process. So thank you so much for  Siobhan: sharing. Shawan. Thank you. Thank you. It's a pleasure.

Join Catholic evangelist and bible teacher, Hector Molina as he explores the Mass Readings for the Eighth Sunday in Ordinary Time, Year C.Mass Readings:Sir. 27:4-7Ps. 92Lk. 6:39-45"A Walk in The Word" podcast is a weekly bible study and reflection on the Sunday Mass readings led by International Catholic evangelist and bible teacher, Hector Molina.WATCH: View this video version of this podcast on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/c/hectormolinacatholicevangelist?sub_confirmation=1 SUPPORT:  Become a Patron & Co-Producer of A Walk in The Wordhttps://www.patreon.com/hectormolina/

Physical Evidence của thương hiệu bạn là gì, và quan trọng hơn, đâu là PE đặc sắc nhất? Sau đây là series chia sẻ kiến thức cơ bản và suy nghĩ cá nhân mình về 7Ps trong marketing, phiên bản ngành F&B với một chút hình dung vào năm 2022. Mỗi ngày chúng mình sẽ cùng bàn về một chữ P để khép lại năm 2021 với một nền tảng kiến thức về Marketing vừa đủ, và bước vào 2022 một cách sẵn sàng hơn nhé!

Yếu tố với cá nhân mình là khô khan nhất, nhưng thực ra cũng low-key quan trọng không kém gì Product và People, là đây. Sau đây là series chia sẻ kiến thức cơ bản và suy nghĩ cá nhân mình về về 7Ps trong marketing, phiên bản ngành F&B với một chút hình dung vào về 2022. Mỗi ngày chúng mình sẽ cùng bàn về một chữ P để khép lại năm 2021 với một nền tảng kiến thức về Marketing vừa đủ, và bước vào 2022 một cách sẵn sàng hơn nhé!

Con người là những ai, và quan trọng hơn, quan điểm về con người trong ngành F&B có gì nên thay đổi trong năm tới? Sau đây là series chia sẻ kiến thức cơ bản và suy nghĩ cá nhân mình về về 7Ps trong marketing, phiên bản ngành F&B với một chút hình dung vào về 2022. Mỗi ngày chúng mình sẽ cùng bàn về một chữ P để khép lại năm 2021 với một nền tảng kiến thức về Marketing vừa đủ, và bước vào 2022 một cách sẵn sàng hơn nhé!

Find out more about the program at humane.marketing/program    Welcome to the last episode of 2021 on the Humane Marketing Podcast. If you're a regular here, you know that I'm organizing the conversations around the 7Ps of the Humane Marketing Mandala. (If you're new here and don't know what I'm talking about you can download your 1page marketing plan with the Humane Marketing version of the 7 Ps of Marketing at humane.marketing/1page. It comes with 7 email prompts to really help you reflect on these different Ps). This episode is a bit different from other episodes, and if this is your first time here, you may be better served by listening to some previous episodes. Because I'm dedicating this episode to the upcoming Marketing Like We're human program, my flagship program for quietly rebellious entrepreneurs. After a 2 year hibernation I will run this live with a small group of changemakers and I'll be honest now that I have a small group that already said yes, I'm starting to get super excited to run this again. Yes, I've run this program before, in 3 beta rounds with three different groups. We've co-created it so to speak. But then the world stopped. And my world stopped too. First because I took time off to write the MLWH book, and then because of the trademark mess, and then because I wrote SLWH. But now I'm back. And the program has again my full attention. And it will be the best edition yet. Because of what we've gone through collectively and we're more ready then ever for a Humane Marketing Revolution. And also because of what I've gone through, what I've created in the two years, and who I've become. By chatting with the people who were interested in joining (and all four I've chatted to have joined) we've realized together that this is a program for deep thinkers. It's a program for mature human beings. And by mature I don't mean having a business of a certain revenue, like some others require. That doesn't matter here. Whether you're just starting out or have 20 years experience, it doesn't matter. By mature I mean having the maturity to - go deep, look at who you are and show up as who you are - question all your assumptions regarding marketing, business and success - think of your business as a lever for good, not just a way to pay your bills - invest in yourself - realize that it's the intangible stuff, like confidence, finding yourself, clarity that will help you find serenity in your entrepreneurial journey - believe in abundance, not scarcity The Marketing Like We're Human program is truly a dance between the BEING and the DOING. We start with the BEING. The Ps of Passion and Personal Power are all about us, who we are, how we want to show up in the world and how we're perceived by others. This is the rumbling part of the MLWH book Only then we look at our people. Very different from every other marketing program which always starts with the avatar. Because we want to really find resonance, attract our ideal clients because they are interested in who we are and what we stand for. I know you might have worked on your ‘ideal client' before. But this is different. This is deeper. A past participant said that this is THE most extensive work on her ideal client she's ever done. That's what gives you clarity. And don't confuse that with niching. I don't believe in niching so much. You can have different clients in different niches. But what unites them is your worldview. After People we also look at Product (or Service) and Pricing. While money is not usually a Humane Marketer's main motivator, money makes all of it easier: making money gives you the confidence to trust yourself making money allows you to feel safe and grounded so that you can do the work you want to do making money helps you making a bigger impact, beyond paying your own bills In short, money gives you choices! Working ON your business and on your marketing is an investment that leads to being able to make more money. People want to pay money for things that are valuable to them. So it's key that you're able to communicate that value in your marketing. In order to do that, you first need to realize your worth (and trust that you can actually charge what you're worth). Worthiness, value, confidence, pricing, money... We don't shy away from discussing all of these topics in the 'Marketing Like We're Human' program. And here we'll also bring the Humane Selling into the conversation. We'll end with Promotion where we find and commit to one vehicle or platform for our marketing and then Partnership, which helps us see that we're not alone and that marketing is so much more fun with others. This round in January is a hybrid program, meaning that besides the video tutorials (which I'm re-recording as we go, so in a way we're also co-creating again) and the beautiful and intense workbooks, we also meet once per week in a 75-minute Zoom call to go deeper into these topics. And by deep, I mean deep. Because if you want to bring more of you into your marketing, you need to show up as the whole you. I will lead the way with showing up with vulnerability and therefore creating a safe zone for everyone else. If you're looking for clarity, groundedness, less doing and more being, ways to promote your services that feel good, more money but joyful money, than this program will help. I'm not just looking for butts in seats. I'm wanting to have a human conversation with everyone to make sure this is a good fit for you at this time. And, I'm wanting to create some magic in the group. For this magic to happen I'd love a handful more participants who bring that special energy and who are ready to be uplifted and supported by our group of fellow Humane Marketers. If that's you, let's chat. If you haven't already, please check out the invitation at humane.marketing/program page which includes a 19-minute behind the scenes video from me. And if it resonates, click on the button to schedule a 15-min chat with me. If possible before the holidays so I can give you the 100$ off early bird discount which expires at the end of the year. If you schedule our chat now, even if that's in the new year, I'll still apply the early bird. Why now? Because it's time. Because the world needs you. And in order for the world to know about your offering, you need to market your business. I don't know if I'll run the live program again this year. And I'm not just saying that to create fake urgency. It's not in my calendar right now. If I feel like there's a real need and people are asking me for it, then I might. But I just don't know right now. So if you've seen my emails about this, or other communications, let's get on a Zoom call and have a Human Conversation about it, even about the money piece. Really. I hope we get to chat soon Book a slot with me by clicking on one of the buttons on the invitation page at humane.marketing/program Thanks so much for listening to the podcast and being part of a generation of marketers who cares - for yourself, your clients and the planet!!! Happy New Year! I'll be back next year with a new season of episodes. Speak soon  

Chiến lược bán của bạn là ưu đãi giảm giá, hay xây dựng nội dung? Bạn có những công cụ truyền thông nào trong tay để thực hiện chiến lược bán ấy? Sau đây là series chia sẻ kiến thức cơ bản và suy nghĩ cá nhân mình về về 7Ps trong marketing, phiên bản ngành F&B với một chút hình dung vào về 2022. Mỗi ngày chúng mình sẽ cùng bàn về một chữ P để khép lại năm 2021 với một nền tảng kiến thức về Marketing vừa đủ, và bước vào 2022 một cách sẵn sàng hơn nhé!

Năm 2022, bạn sẽ lựa chọn những đâu làm địa điểm kinh doanh của mình?  Sau đây là series chia sẻ kiến thức cơ bản và suy nghĩ cá nhân mình về về 7Ps trong marketing, phiên bản ngành F&B với một chút hình dung vào về 2022. Mỗi ngày chúng mình sẽ cùng bàn về một chữ P để khép lại năm 2021 với một nền tảng kiến thức về Marketing vừa đủ, và bước vào 2022 một cách sẵn sàng hơn nhé!

Giá và chiến lược giá thì khác gì nhau? Trong năm 2022, thương hiệu F&B của bạn cần biết gì về giá? Sau đây là series chia sẻ kiến thức cơ bản và suy nghĩ cá nhân mình về về 7Ps trong marketing, phiên bản ngành F&B với một chút hình dung vào về 2022. Mỗi ngày chúng mình sẽ cùng bàn về một chữ P để khép lại năm 2021 với một nền tảng kiến thức về Marketing vừa đủ, và bước vào 2022 một cách sẵn sàng hơn nhé!

Sản phẩm trong F&B là gì? Biết là có cả đồ ăn, đồ uống và trải nghiệm rồi, nhưng thế nào là một "trải nghiệm"? Sau đây là series chia sẻ kiến thức cơ bản và suy nghĩ cá nhân mình về về 7Ps trong marketing, phiên bản ngành F&B với một chút hình dung vào về 2022. Mỗi ngày chúng mình sẽ cùng bàn về một chữ P để khép lại năm 2021 với một nền tảng kiến thức về Marketing vừa đủ, và bước vào 2022 một cách sẵn sàng hơn nhé!

Hello friends, this week I'm reflecting back on my business and my life like probably many of you. Celebrating wins, releasing stuff and forgiving so I don't start 2022 with emotional baggage. Death, rebirth and growth. Those are the three words that come up for me when I think about 2021. Sounds a bit dramatic when I hear myself saying it out loud. But I did really go through a dark night of the soul and came out wiser on the other side. On LinkedIn I prompted people to share about the 3 things they are most proud of this year: for me it was writing the 2nd book, Selling Like we're human', going through a major set back and rebouncing from it and the new brand and how it fits all together. I encourage you to also sit down and think about your 3 wins. And don't stop there. Also think about your personal wins. BEING and DOING. Who we become is just as important as our professional achievements. The podcast is one of the things in my business that I really enjoy. It gives me great joy to have these conversations and go deep into certain topics that all have to do to a certain extent with the 7Ps of Humane Marketing. So I will continue to have them in 2022. I might tweak the format a bit, still working on that, but yes, it continues to be part of my offering in 2022. As you know, I'm not having any sponsors, so the only sponsor is myself - and the members of the Humane Marketing Circle, because the membership fees help me cover the costs for the podcast. The Circle is closed right now, but we'll open again in February 2022 to welcome new members with open arms. If you'd like to be informed when we open again you can sign up to the waiting list (I need to find a better term for that) at humane.marketing/circle But if you feel that you have benefitted from listening to the Humane Marketing podcast, learned new information, gained new insights and perspectives, were introduced to new people whom you're now following, I invite you to consider supporting this podcast with a financial contribution. There are different ways you can do this: - You can buy one of my books, Marketing Like We're Human or Selling Like We're Human - You can make a gentle donation via the link sarahsantacroce.com/donation - or if you're in Switzerland you can send me a Twint to 076 489 99 73 Everything will go right back into the podcast. For the podcasters among you, you know how much work it is. And yes, I have a tiny team who helps me, whom I pay every month to edit the episode and help me share it on Social. Your support really means a lot to me. I'll get back to each one of you. And if you buy the book, just send me a quick email to sarah@sarahsantacroce.com or leave me a voicemail at humane.marketing/ask so I know that you're supporting my work this way. Thanks so much for listening to the podcast and being part of a generation of marketers who cares - for yourself, your clients and the planet!!! I wish you a peaceful festive season. I'll be back next week with a final episode about the Marketing Like We're Human program that starts in January. Merry Christmas and Happy Holidays Speak soon

Today's conversation fits under the P of Partnership, the last P of the 7Ps of Humane Marketing. Sometimes Partnership applies to other humans, in today's case it's a partnership with you and the truth. For this conversation about The Future of Truth, I invited Kayleigh O'Keefe. Kayleigh O'Keefe is the USA Today Bestselling author of The Younger Self Letters and the founder of Soul Excellence Publishing, the publishing house for soulful, successful business leaders. She helps leaders share their stories of personal growth and transformation in multi-author, individual, and team books. The company has published two international bestsellers in 2021 - Leading Through the Pandemic: Unconventional Wisdom from Heartfelt Leaders and Significant Women: Leaders Reveal What Matters Most. Prior to founding the company, Kayleigh spent over a decade as an advisor to Fortune 500 executives with CEB (now Gartner) and as a commercial leader at Snapdocs, a real estate technology company. She also hosts The Kayleigh O'Keefe Show podcast where she shares unconventional personal growth advice for ambitious, conscious leaders. In this episode, you'll learn about building effective websites that combine tech and humane business practices and...   The opposite of truth How we got to a place where so many people are looking for the truth and only a few really share it ? How the truth matters in business and marketing What does it mean to be authentic? and so much more. Kayleigh's Resources   Kayleigh's Website Soul Excellence Publishing The Kayleigh O'Keefe Show Connect with Kaileigh on: LinkedIn Instagram Facebook   Sarah's Resources Watch this episode on Youtube (FREE) Sarah's One Page Marketing Plan (FREE) Sarah Suggests Newsletter (FREE) The Humane Business Manifesto (FREE) Gentle Confidence Mini-Course Marketing Like We're Human - Sarah's book The Humane Marketing Circle Authentic & Fair Pricing Mini-Course Podcast Show Notes Email Sarah at sarah@sarahsantacroce.com Thanks for listening!   After you listen, check out Humane Business Manifesto, an invitation to belong to a movement of people who do business the humane and gentle way and disrupt the current marketing paradigm. You can download it for free at this page. There's no opt-in. Just an instant download. Are you enjoying the podcast?  The Humane Marketing show is listener-supported—I'd love for you to become an active supporter of the show and join the Humane Marketing Circle. You will be invited to a private monthly Q&A call with me and fellow Humane Marketers -  a safe zone to hang out with like-minded conscious entrepreneurs and help each other build our business and grow our impact.  — I'd love for you to join us! Learn more at humane.marketing/circle Don't forget to subscribe to the show on iTunes or on Android to get notified for all my future shows and why not sign up for my weekly(ish) "Sarah Suggests Saturdays", a round-up of best practices, tools I use, books I read, podcasts, and other resources. Raise your hand and join the Humane Business Revolution. Warmly, Sarah

This episode is part of a 12 days of Christmas read-along of the Selling Like We're Human book, recorded in 2021. The book follows a similar concept to what you're already used to here on the Humane Marketing show with the 7Ps of Humane Marketing and the Marketing Like We're Human book: we start with the being and then go into the doing. The 3 parts of the Selling Like We're Human book are : Being, Knowing and Doing (compared to Rumble, Rise and Resonate of the Marketing Like We're Human book) Today I'm reading a small section of Part 5 called Together we can reinvent Selling     Excerpt from Selling Like We're Human, Part 5 called Together we can reinvent Selling   The Potential for the Future “To sell is human,” said Daniel H. Pink, and I agree. By adding an e to the end of “human,” we also make it humane, gentle, and kind! That's the way it was always supposed to be, and we're slowly finding our way back to it. We are being asked to reinvent the way we do business, the way we market, and the way we sell. Besides that human interaction, there's a new societal and environmental factor to be considered. It's our responsibility as Humane Sellers to consider the triple wins at every sale. Here is the potential for the future: • A world where selling is ethical, transparent, and sustainable. • A world where money is not the only way we measure impact. • A world where selling doesn't rely on manipulation and shady persuasion techniques. • A world where salespeople do the right thing because they also want to sleep well at night. • A world where entrepreneurs who use ethical selling are the ones that not only make the biggest impact; they also make the most money. And they use that money to make the world a better place. Humane Selling will contribute to making it a reality. The Humane Creed >> Download a beautiful pdf of this Creed to share on Social Media We run our business to make a positive difference and to support ourselves financially. Similar to B Corporations, we balance purpose and profit. We are here to serve, but we are not martyrs. We are in business. We embrace gentleness throughout our business. We treat clients, potential clients, and employees with kindness and empathy. Being gentle doesn't mean that we're pushovers. We believe in integrity and authenticity. We just want to be ourselves in order to do our best work. We don't use authenticity as a buzzword. It just means that we show up as who we are, in integrity. We cultivate community. In order to build a sustainable business, we invest in creating community, not just systems. We ensure fairness. We care deeply about creating win-win-win situations. Win for the world, win for our clients, and win for ourselves. We make the world a better place. Everything we do aims to make this world we live in a better place: our products and services, our relationships, our communications. We align who we are with what we do. We don't change who we are in order to do what we do. We're the real deal. We aim to bring back the human connection marketing and selling. As much as we love technology, we always prioritize the human connection in our marketing and selling activities. We approach marketing and selling from a place of abundance. We know that there is an abundance of clients waiting for us. We are gentle visioneers. We are part visionaries, part pioneers. We are a new species of gentle souls who reinvent marketing and selling. >> Download a beautiful pdf of this Creed to share on Social Media This excerpt is from Part 5 called Together we can reinvent Selling If what you heard today resonates with you and made you curious about the book, I invite you to get your copy of the new Selling Like You're Human book at humane.marketing/book2. You can also download the whole 1st chapter for free to see if it resonates. And I'm also planting a seed about my 'Marketing Like We're Human' program that I'll run in its live edition starting at the end of January 2022. This is where we take all these concepts from the two books as well as the 7Ps of Humane Marketing to a much much deeper level in an intimate group learning experience. Find out more at www.humane.marketing/program Get your copy of the 'Selling Like We're Human' book ! Get the new Selling Like We're Human book HERE! Sarah's Resources (FREE) Sarah's One Page Marketing Plan (FREE) Sarah Suggests Newsletter (FREE) The Humane Business Manifesto (FREE) Gentle Confidence Mini-Course Marketing Like We're Human - Sarah's first book Selling Like We're Human - Sarah's second book The Humane Marketing Circle Authentic & Fair Pricing Mini-Course Podcast Show Notes Email Sarah at sarah@sarahsantacroce.com Thanks for listening!   After you listen, check out Humane Business Manifesto, an invitation to belong to a movement of people who do business the humane and gentle way and disrupt the current marketing paradigm. You can download it for free at this page. There's no opt-in. Just an instant download. Are you enjoying the podcast?  The Humane Marketing show is listener-supported—I'd love for you to become an active supporter of the show and join the Humane Marketing Circle. You will be invited to a private monthly Q&A call with me and fellow Humane Marketers -  a safe zone to hang out with like-minded conscious entrepreneurs and help each other build our business and grow our impact.  — I'd love for you to join us! Learn more at humane.marketing/circle Don't forget to subscribe to the show on iTunes or on Android to get notified for all my future shows and why not sign up for my weekly(ish) "Sarah Suggests Saturdays", a round-up of best practices, tools I use, books I read, podcasts, and other resources. Raise your hand and join the Humane Business Revolution. Warmly, Sarah

This episode is part of a 12 days of Christmas read-along of the Selling Like We're Human book, recorded in 2021. The book follows a similar concept to what you're already used to here on the Humane Marketing show with the 7Ps of Humane Marketing and the Marketing Like We're Human book: we start with the being and then go into the doing. The 3 parts of the Selling Like We're Human book are : Being, Knowing and Doing (compared to Rumble, Rise and Resonate of the Marketing Like We're Human book) Today I'm reading a small section of Part 4 called Beyond Business and Selling     Excerpt from Selling Like We're Human, Part 4 called Beyond Business and Selling As entrepreneurs, we know that business is never just about business. Adopting Humane Selling will not only impact how you feel about making offers and having gentle sales conversations, it will change the way you relate to other human beings and it will probably also change your priorities. Because once you know who you really are and you are okay with that, when you feel grounded in your worth and know the value of what you offer, then you are ready to show up as your true self—no masks—and have a beautiful conversation with other human beings. Whether that is in a sales conversation, at a yoga retreat, in the line at the grocery store, or with your partner, it doesn't matter. But here's a little word of warning: the work won't be done by just reading this book. Inner work is an ongoing thing. You'll have good days and then you'll have setbacks where you will have to go back to remind yourself of your truth, your values, your worth. Just going through the #anchors of the book will help on those days when self-doubt takes over. #vulnerabilityalert In the spring of 2020, after having run The Gentle Marketing Revolution Program (now called the ‘Marketing Like We're Human' program) with three live beta groups in 2019, I wanted to host it again. After a free five-day Gentle Marketing Intensive, I planned to gently lead people into the sales conversations. There was plenty of interest in the free intensive, and almost 200 people signed up. But guess what? Not even one person signed up for the paid program! Of course you could blame Covid. But not really. In fact, May 2020 would have been a great time to attend an online program. So no, it wasn't that. It was some other timing factor: people just weren't ready for that message in 2020. Did it hurt? Of course it did! Luckily, I had my tools and rituals to go back to that reminded me of my worth, even without a single sale! Considerations, Tools, and Rituals to Help You Integrate #woowooalert Some of these practices may be too woo-woo for you. :-) Just pick those that you're comfortable with. Box Breathing If you're nervous before getting on a sales conversation, try box breathing. It's an easy breathing technique that immediately calms down your nervous system and helps you relax and re-center. Here's how it works: Step 1: Find a comfortable position (seated or lying down). Step 2: Inhale for four seconds. Belly expands. Step 3: Hold the air in your lungs for four seconds. Step 4: Exhale for four seconds, emptying all of the air in your lungs. Belly contracts. Step 5: Hold your lungs empty for four seconds. Step 6: Repeat for five minutes, or as long as necessary to feel refocused and relaxed. I like to visualize the four sides of a square (2D box?) to help me remember where I'm at with my inhales and exhales. Visualization Talking about visualization … If that's your thing, you could also visualize your Serene Garden and the beautiful conversation you're about to have with your client. Visualize it as if it already is so. If you're like me and appreciate some help with the visualization process, look for the guided meditation called “The Secret Garden” on the free Insight Timer meditation app. This excerpt is from Part 4 called Beyond Business and Selling If what you heard today resonates with you and made you curious about the book, I invite you to get your copy of the new Selling Like You're Human book at humane.marketing/book2. You can also download the whole 1st chapter for free to see if it resonates. And I'm also planting a seed about my 'Marketing Like We're Human' program that I'll run in its live edition starting at the end of January 2022. This is where we take all these concepts from the two books as well as the 7Ps of Humane Marketing to a much much deeper level in an intimate group learning experience. Find out more at www.humane.marketing/program Get your copy of the 'Selling Like We're Human' book ! Get the new Selling Like We're Human book HERE! Sarah's Resources (FREE) Sarah's One Page Marketing Plan (FREE) Sarah Suggests Newsletter (FREE) The Humane Business Manifesto (FREE) Gentle Confidence Mini-Course Marketing Like We're Human - Sarah's first book Selling Like We're Human - Sarah's second book The Humane Marketing Circle Authentic & Fair Pricing Mini-Course Podcast Show Notes Email Sarah at sarah@sarahsantacroce.com Thanks for listening!   After you listen, check out Humane Business Manifesto, an invitation to belong to a movement of people who do business the humane and gentle way and disrupt the current marketing paradigm. You can download it for free at this page. There's no opt-in. Just an instant download. Are you enjoying the podcast?  The Humane Marketing show is listener-supported—I'd love for you to become an active supporter of the show and join the Humane Marketing Circle. You will be invited to a private monthly Q&A call with me and fellow Humane Marketers -  a safe zone to hang out with like-minded conscious entrepreneurs and help each other build our business and grow our impact.  — I'd love for you to join us! Learn more at humane.marketing/circle Don't forget to subscribe to the show on iTunes or on Android to get notified for all my future shows and why not sign up for my weekly(ish) "Sarah Suggests Saturdays", a round-up of best practices, tools I use, books I read, podcasts, and other resources. Raise your hand and join the Humane Business Revolution. Warmly, Sarah

This episode is part of a 12 days of Christmas read-along of the Selling Like We're Human book, recorded in 2021. The book follows a similar concept to what you're already used to here on the Humane Marketing show with the 7Ps of Humane Marketing and the Marketing Like We're Human book: we start with the being and then go into the doing. The 3 parts of the Selling Like We're Human book are : Being, Knowing and Doing (compared to Rumble, Rise and Resonate of the Marketing Like We're Human book) Today I'm reading a small section of Part 3 on DOING, Chapter 10 called 'After the Sale: Onboarding & Offboarding'     Excerpt from Selling Like We're Human, Part 3: DOING, Chapter 10: After the Sale: Onboarding & Offboarding Onboarding If you reached the end of the book, or almost, and think to yourself, “Yes, I adhere to the ideas outlined here and having beautiful sales conversations in my Serene Garden sounds lovely, but actually I'd still rather avoid them all together and have clients just call me and say ‘I'd like to work with you. So and so spoke very highly of you and recommended your services,'” then pay extra attention to this part of the book. While it's important to focus on the gentle sales path, it's equally important to not just take things for granted once you get the sale. Like John Jantsch says in his excellent book The Referral Engine: “The sale is not complete until the customer is so happy that he or she confidently makes referrals.” That's our goal in this chapter. The Mistake of Seeing Small Items as “Leads” While a sale might look like the final destination of your gentle sales path, it's often only the midpoint of your client's journey with you. Especially in the online world, people often like to “try out” what it feels like to be in our world, so they make a small snack-sized purchase like an e-book, a summit, or any other small item. But this is where the nurturing begins! One might think that it's not worth spending too much time and effort on the onboarding journey of such a small dollar amount, but quite the opposite is true. When I was writing the first book and knew nothing about self-publishing, I came across all kinds of marketing and publishing schemes. Quite a few of them were “self-publishing gurus” who sold the idea of publishing a book as a lead magnet. The idea per se is not bad; it all depends on the intention of the author. If the intention is “I've written this beautiful book and I want to share this knowledge with as many people as possible so they can apply it in their business,” then I see nothing wrong with sharing your book for free, or almost free. If, however, the intention is “Let me write a quick (crappy) book and use it to get thousands of new leads so I can then sell them my two thousand dollar program,” then I'm ready to bet that this author doesn't care whether her content works for me or not. She cares about selling those programs and only uses her book as a lead magnet. Small items matter. Someone reading your book, attending your summit, or participating in a free webinar is entering your sales path, and every step of the way counts! Adam Kawalec, business mindset coach, did this really well with his Authentic Business Building and Marketing Summit. He told me that as long as he could keep up, he created a personal welcome video message for everyone who signed up. Yes, a custom-made video for each participant. Talk about feeling heard and seen! By doing that, Adam showed that each person counts to him and that it wasn't about the numbers, but about each individual who showed up. Remember Adam's “move the pay line” concept? In the service business, we call the phase after the monetary transaction “onboarding.” We're bringing a new client on board. Yes, money has been exchanged, but maybe your client is still a bit nervous about your collaboration or about the purchase they've made. It's your job to put them at ease, welcome them, and show them how you roll. The more personalized your onboarding, the better. When I signed up for coaching with Jenny Blake, I received the most gorgeous bouquet of white lilies I had ever seen. It was such a beautiful surprise. And after signing up to work on the HumaneGen Marketing Design with Nela, I was impressed by her onboarding process as well. Not only was it efficient, it was beautiful as well. She used a custom-designed Trello board to layout the whole design process for me and explain each step. The board also served as an efficient way for us to communicate and have all the history of our exchanges in one place. Nela didn't copy that process from a pre-existing framework she downloaded from some well-meaning site. She designed it for her customers. Think about your onboarding process. Is it clear and efficient? Is it beautiful? Maybe even whimsical? How does it make your client feel? No matter how big or small the sale, really focus on the details and how this experience of doing business with you will make people feel. It may be just ten dollars for a book at the beginning, but this reader just might turn into your most loyal heartfelt promoter. Pay attention to the little things! Customer Service Another important phase after the sale is the customer service. As a reader of this book you get access to a whole collection of free resources (www.humane.marketing/book2). This is a way for you to deepen the learning, reflect on what you've read, and integrate it into your work. To me, that falls into the phase of customer service. If I have your best interest at heart, I want you to really use the knowledge of this book and not just read it and move on. Yes, I do have a full program available as well, and I'm hoping to work one-on-one with some of you, but you can totally do everything on your own with the resources I give you. #vulnerabilityalert When I created my first online course, The LinkedIn Profile Quick Fix, I hadn't considered that I'd need to offer customer service for participants of the program. Given the duct tape system I used, there was no way for members to ask questions in an easy format like a forum for example. So I quickly found myself answering customer e-mails at all hours of the day. Not fun! Not fun for them, and not fun for me either! Think about your customer service. Is it efficient? Is it personal? How does it make your client feel? As service providers, we don't have to deal with repairs. But we do have to address customer questions. Also listen to my conversation with Stacy Sherman about the customer experience in episode 109 This excerpt is from Part 3: DOING, Chapter 10: After the Sale: Onboarding & Offboarding If what you heard today resonates with you and made you curious about the book, I invite you to get your copy of the new Selling Like You're Human book at humane.marketing/book2. You can also download the whole 1st chapter for free to see if it resonates. And I'm also planting a seed about my 'Marketing Like We're Human' program that I'll run in its live edition starting at the end of January 2022. This is where we take all these concepts from the two books as well as the 7Ps of Humane Marketing to a much much deeper level in an intimate group learning experience. Find out more at www.humane.marketing/program Get your copy of the 'Selling Like We're Human' book ! Get the new Selling Like We're Human book HERE! Sarah's Resources (FREE) Sarah's One Page Marketing Plan (FREE) Sarah Suggests Newsletter (FREE) The Humane Business Manifesto (FREE) Gentle Confidence Mini-Course Marketing Like We're Human - Sarah's first book Selling Like We're Human - Sarah's second book The Humane Marketing Circle Authentic & Fair Pricing Mini-Course Podcast Show Notes Email Sarah at sarah@sarahsantacroce.com Thanks for listening!   After you listen, check out Humane Business Manifesto, an invitation to belong to a movement of people who do business the humane and gentle way and disrupt the current marketing paradigm. You can download it for free at this page. There's no opt-in. Just an instant download. Are you enjoying the podcast?  The Humane Marketing show is listener-supported—I'd love for you to become an active supporter of the show and join the Humane Marketing Circle. You will be invited to a private monthly Q&A call with me and fellow Humane Marketers -  a safe zone to hang out with like-minded conscious entrepreneurs and help each other build our business and grow our impact.  — I'd love for you to join us! Learn more at humane.marketing/circle Don't forget to subscribe to the show on iTunes or on Android to get notified for all my future shows and why not sign up for my weekly(ish) "Sarah Suggests Saturdays", a round-up of best practices, tools I use, books I read, podcasts, and other resources. Raise your hand and join the Humane Business Revolution. Warmly, Sarah

This episode is part of a 12 days of Christmas read-along of the Selling Like We're Human book, recorded in 2021. The book follows a similar concept to what you're already used to here on the Humane Marketing show with the 7Ps of Humane Marketing and the Marketing Like We're Human book: we start with the being and then go into the doing. The 3 parts of the Selling Like We're Human book are : Being, Knowing and Doing (compared to Rumble, Rise and Resonate of the Marketing Like We're Human book) Today I'm reading a small section of Part 3 on DOING, Chapter 9 called 'A Beautiful Sales Conversation'     Excerpt from Selling Like We're Human, Part 3: DOING, Chapter 9: A Beautiful Sales Conversation   Focus on How You Make Them Feel And so we find ourselves at the end of your sales path, in the middle of your Serene Garden, under the big old oak tree. The weather is warm, and there's a slight breeze. Bees are buzzing, birds are chirping, and a small swarm of blue butterflies is sailing through the air. You've made some chilled herbal tea and are getting ready to sit down with your ideal client to have a beautiful conversation, a sales conversation. On the following pages you'll find some suggestions on how to hold the space for this encounter. Take what feels good, skip what doesn't. But most importantly, remember the following: 1. You are having a conversation with smart, conscious clients. They have done their research, gone through your path, rested at several signposts, and decided that they want to talk to you and find out how you can collaborate. 2. Treat them with humility. Hear and see them. They come to you as whole human beings, potentially in a vulnerable place because they are asking for your help. 3. And most of all, focus on how you make them feel. This is not about you and your sales pitch, your checklist, or the money in your bank account. Forget about you; shift the focus to them. When I asked my clients, they often put speaking on stage at the same anxiety level as a sales call. It's scary because you make yourself vulnerable and risk being rejected. I've heard all kinds of public speaking advice, but it was only when l met Victoria Lioznyansky that something clicked. Instead of going on and on how public speaking is all about your message and that you shouldn't think about yourself but instead focus on your message, she said the following: “If you're not thinking about your audience and how you're trying to make them feel, your message is not going to resonate quite as much.” – Victoria Lioznyansky That's when the penny dropped. The same advice applies to your beautiful sales conversations: focus on how you make them feel! Ditch the Sales Script I know it can feel scary to think about going into your sales conversation without a script. But trust me on this! Take that seven-step sales script you downloaded off some well-meaning site and get rid of it. It doesn't help you in your Serene Garden. Prepare for Your Call That doesn't mean you'll just wing it and go into your call completely unprepared. Quite on the contrary: we'll come overprepared so that once we're in the garden, we can just relax and listen. Actually, that's worth an anchor. #anchor Just because we're not following a step-by-step sales script doesn't mean that we just wing it. Instead we come overprepared so that once we're in our Serene Garden, we can lean back, listen, and hold the space for our client. Here's how I suggest you prepare for the call: 1. Reread your client's answers from the intake form; write down some notes. 2. If you have an “icebreaker” question in your intake form, maybe start the call with a reference to it. 3. Look at your client's website, especially at what they're offering or what they contacted you for. 4. Bonus: subscribe to your client's newsletter or free download to get a feel for the way they communicate. 5. Spend some time thinking about which offer will most likely be a good fit for this client. Have the details of this offer ready if you need them. Design your Gentle Sales Conversation At the end of this chapter, you'll find a mandala with bubbles in it. I refer to it as the Creativity Mandala. If you've read the first book, you might already be familiar with it. I'd like you to use this as a tool to design YOUR unique, nonlinear, and beautiful sales conversation. But before you do that, we need to address two more things about your conversation: better questions and respecting objections. Robots Ask Robotic Questions Aaaah!!!! That's me screaming upon hearing the typical “On a scale of one to ten, how likely are you to want to solve this problem now?” question for the hundredth time. That's the problem with scripts and templates. Eventually, everyone sounds like a robot reading the same questions off a document. If you instead flip the script around, or, like in our case, completely ditch the script, you are: 1. Forced to truly listen to your potential client 2. Come up with better questions The gap-selling method and related seven-step frameworks will have you uncover the pain, or the gap, so that you can then sell the magic solution. This leads to a doer attitude: find out what's wrong and fix it. And it also often leads to taking the power away from the client because all he sees is the problems and he then feels cornered into having to buy if he wants to solve his problems. With Humane Selling, we want to give the client the power back. And we want to make her see the opportunity, not just the problem. Instead of making it a conversation about negatives, we change it to a positive exchange focused on the client's possibilities, goals, and aspirations. So instead of using the same old template questions, we need to ask better questions that lead us into a deeper conversation so we can fully understand our client's situation. This excerpt is from Part 3: DOING, Chapter 9: A Beautiful Sales Conversation If what you heard today resonates with you and made you curious about the book, I invite you to get your copy of the new Selling Like You're Human book at humane.marketing/book2. You can also download the whole 1st chapter for free to see if it resonates. And I'm also planting a seed about my 'Marketing Like We're Human' program that I'll run in its live edition starting at the end of January 2022. This is where we take all these concepts from the two books as well as the 7Ps of Humane Marketing to a much much deeper level in an intimate group learning experience. Find out more at www.humane.marketing/program Get your copy of the 'Selling Like We're Human' book ! Get the new Selling Like We're Human book HERE! Sarah's Resources (FREE) Sarah's One Page Marketing Plan (FREE) Sarah Suggests Newsletter (FREE) The Humane Business Manifesto (FREE) Gentle Confidence Mini-Course Marketing Like We're Human - Sarah's first book Selling Like We're Human - Sarah's second book The Humane Marketing Circle Authentic & Fair Pricing Mini-Course Podcast Show Notes Email Sarah at sarah@sarahsantacroce.com Thanks for listening!   After you listen, check out Humane Business Manifesto, an invitation to belong to a movement of people who do business the humane and gentle way and disrupt the current marketing paradigm. You can download it for free at this page. There's no opt-in. Just an instant download. Are you enjoying the podcast?  The Humane Marketing show is listener-supported—I'd love for you to become an active supporter of the show and join the Humane Marketing Circle. You will be invited to a private monthly Q&A call with me and fellow Humane Marketers -  a safe zone to hang out with like-minded conscious entrepreneurs and help each other build our business and grow our impact.  — I'd love for you to join us! Learn more at humane.marketing/circle Don't forget to subscribe to the show on iTunes or on Android to get notified for all my future shows and why not sign up for my weekly(ish) "Sarah Suggests Saturdays", a round-up of best practices, tools I use, books I read, podcasts, and other resources. Raise your hand and join the Humane Business Revolution. Warmly, Sarah

This episode is part of a 12 days of Christmas read-along of the Selling Like We're Human book, recorded in 2021. The book follows a similar concept to what you're already used to here on the Humane Marketing show with the 7Ps of Humane Marketing and the Marketing Like We're Human book: we start with the being and then go into the doing. The 3 parts of the Selling Like We're Human book are : Being, Knowing and Doing (compared to Rumble, Rise and Resonate of the Marketing Like We're Human book) Today I'm reading a small section of Part 3 on DOING, Chapter 8 called 'From Sales Funnel to Gentle Sales Path'     Excerpt from Selling Like We're Human, Part 3: DOING, Chapter 8: From Sales Funnel to Gentle Sales Path   The Sales Funnel Revisited We all know the spiel by now. I give you my e-mail in exchange for something I want and need. It could be a checklist, it could be a one-page marketing plan, it could be a video series . . . Once I enter my name and e-mail, I'm smart enough to know that you'll send me more than just that thing you promised me for free. Nothing is free. Instead, I'm being lured into your funnel. The more sophisticated the funnel, the bigger the chance I will end up buying something—or eventually, the whole store. Because, quite frankly, some of these funnels have an addictive quality embedded. And there are plenty of gurus who will teach you the “art of the funnel.” To be clear, getting someone's e-mail is a good marketing strategy. The old saying “the money is in the list” is a valid statement if, and only if, you preface it with “the relationships get developed through the list.” So getting your ideal clients' e-mails so that you can communicate with them is key. What I'd like us to revisit is the sales funnel. You know, the typical thing: Step 1: Start with a freebie and get their e-mail address. Step 2: Send them a few valuable e-mails. Step 3: Get them to buy an offer under $50. Step 4: Upsell them to your higher offer. Etc. What if we change the term “funnel” to “path” and think of it as a get-toknow- you path? I used the above image previously in the Marketing Like We're Human book, but I'd like to expand on this idea here, given that this is a book about selling. There are a few major differences between the funnel and the path. Our intention: Whereas in the funnel our main goal is to get that first sale from everyone, our objective in the path is to introduce our new visitor to our world. We can do that by sharing our story, our values, our worldview, and why we do the thing we do. Of course we still want our visitor to buy from us, but we have no specific agenda on how or when that happens. The client's experience: When we lived in California from 2006 till 2010, I had the “pleasure” of attending a gazillion birthday parties as our boys were at the prime age for those events. The first few times, I was shocked at the proceedings of these get-togethers. I truly felt like a sheep in a funnel. “Deposit your gifts on that table please. Then take off your shoes and proceed to the trampoline area (or whatever the activity of the day was). Have fun!” After some jumping, a few minor injuries, and a melt down or two, it was pizza time. “Go wash your hands. Here's your pizza slice and a few carrot sticks. Okay, everyone had enough? Let's do the cake!!” After the happy birthday song, it was already time to say goodbye as the next group was waiting at the door! “Thanks for coming, everyone! Trevor had a great time!” Poor Trevor didn't even get to open his gifts. No time for that . . . I'm exaggerating, of course, but that's how I sometimes feel when I'm being rushed through one of these funnels. “Hurry please, I don't have all day. Buy something and make room for the next person.” Instead of rushing our clients and pushing all of them through the same funnel, we want to invest in them, empower them to make their own choices, and give them options and different paths they can take in our world. I consider myself a smart and conscious human being (street smart, that is ;- )). And I want to work with people who are equally smart and conscious. I want them to understand that's how I think of them. I want them to feel that I truly care and that they can trust me. The length: Building that trust takes time. And if we're rushing someone, we can immediately lose their trust. They see right through it and walk away. If we think of it as a path instead of a funnel, we adapt a more long-term perspective which allows us to build value, trust, and ultimately a relationship with our visitor. The language: By changing the term “funnel” to “path,” we're setting the example that words matter; language matters. Brené Brown talked about the impact of dehumanizing language in politics on one of her podcast episodes (Brené on Words, Actions, Dehumanization and Accountability). “Dehumanization is the most significant driver of insurrection and it always starts with language. We are all responsible for recognizing it, stopping it, and holding people accountable for dehumanizing language and actions.” Shaming and lack of empathy are at the center of dehumanization. Sure, it's quite extreme to compare dehumanization on a political level with marketing and selling, but hear me out. When we use techniques and language that lack integrity and empathy and instead focus on shaming and making people feel less than, aren't we dehumanizing our clients? Aren't we treating them as numbers, or as sheep that we want to push through a funnel? In our gentle sales paths, we use language that shows that we understand, that we care, and that we're here to help whenever they are ready. Income Follows Impact My friend Adam Kawalec, a Swedish business mindset coach, came up with this great concept he calls “moving the pay line.” He makes the point that when people first enter your sales path, they aren't really sure what value you can provide. So it's really up to you to highlight your value through impact. Because, as Adam says (and I agree with him), income follows impact. “Seth Godin says that ‘marketing is the tax you pay for not being remarkable.' If you want to be remarkable, you need to make an impact, a difference big enough that people are willing to either pay for it or talk about it. So the way I see it, income follows impact. In business, it doesn't always look like that though. I sometimes see entrepreneurs holding back until they get paid. This makes it hard for a prospect to know if they want or should work with you—because they have not yet seen or experienced what it is that you really do for your clients. I am suggesting that you ‘move the pay line.' Picture yourself at the beach. Pick up the stick that's lying next to your feet. Now draw a vertical line in the sand. That line represents the moment you get paid. On the left of that line is the before and on the right of the line is the after they pay you. We spend hours thinking about and listing all the things we do and what happens once our clients pay us and we start working together. All the extra features, benefits, and amazing results they will either have, do, or be as a result of working together. I am inviting you to move some of the things from the ‘after they pay me' side over to the ‘before they pay me' side so that you can make an impact before they pay you, giving them an experience of what you do rather than explaining the concept of what you do.” Can you see how this creates impact and influences the ‘know, like, and trust' factor right away? In my experience, following my ‘income follows impact' motto, I spend less time (if any) trying to ‘convince' someone to work with me, and it has allowed me to become remarkable, talked about, and referred to.” The Path that Leads to the Serene Garden Let's go back to our garden analogy and imagine that our product sale or sales conversation is a lovely, Serene Garden somewhere at the end of these paths. Sreela shared this in the Gentle Sales Lab: “The journey [to the Serene Garden] will look different for each client, because someone will climb some stone steps and take a birdseye view before coming down to it, others will go straight ahead along a tarmac road, preferring the short route, and another still will take a paved path, leading down to another section of the gardens, from which your particular secluded garden may be in clearer view for him to decide. Maybe the latter person only makes decisions once they have seen the wider context in which the offer sits.” And while the paths may look different for each client, the destination is the same: your Serene Garden. And . . . even if the journey is different for everyone, every client will want to take some rest, sit down, consider their options, and decide about where to go next. That's where the signposts come in—and the Marketing Rule of Seven(ty). Another Cliffhanger... This excerpt is from Part 3: DOING, Chapter 8: From Sales Funnel to Gentle Sales Path If what you heard today resonates with you and made you curious about the book, I invite you to get your copy of the new Selling Like You're Human book at humane.marketing/book2. You can also download the whole 1st chapter for free to see if it resonates. And I'm also planting a seed about my 'Marketing Like We're Human' program that I'll run in its live edition starting at the end of January 2022. This is where we take all these concepts from the two books as well as the 7Ps of Humane Marketing to a much much deeper level in an intimate group learning experience. Find out more at www.humane.marketing/program Get your copy of the 'Selling Like We're Human' book ! Get the new Selling Like We're Human book HERE! Sarah's Resources (FREE) Sarah's One Page Marketing Plan (FREE) Sarah Suggests Newsletter (FREE) The Humane Business Manifesto (FREE) Gentle Confidence Mini-Course Marketing Like We're Human - Sarah's first book Selling Like We're Human - Sarah's second book The Humane Marketing Circle Authentic & Fair Pricing Mini-Course Podcast Show Notes Email Sarah at sarah@sarahsantacroce.com Thanks for listening!   After you listen, check out Humane Business Manifesto, an invitation to belong to a movement of people who do business the humane and gentle way and disrupt the current marketing paradigm. You can download it for free at this page. There's no opt-in. Just an instant download. Are you enjoying the podcast?  The Humane Marketing show is listener-supported—I'd love for you to become an active supporter of the show and join the Humane Marketing Circle. You will be invited to a private monthly Q&A call with me and fellow Humane Marketers -  a safe zone to hang out with like-minded conscious entrepreneurs and help each other build our business and grow our impact.  — I'd love for you to join us! Learn more at humane.marketing/circle Don't forget to subscribe to the show on iTunes or on Android to get notified for all my future shows and why not sign up for my weekly(ish) "Sarah Suggests Saturdays", a round-up of best practices, tools I use, books I read, podcasts, and other resources. Raise your hand and join the Humane Business Revolution. Warmly, Sarah

This episode is part of a 12 days of Christmas read-along of the Selling Like We're Human book, recorded in 2021. The book follows a similar concept to what you're already used to here on the Humane Marketing show with the 7Ps of Humane Marketing and the Marketing Like We're Human book: we start with the being and then go into the doing. The 3 parts of the Selling Like We're Human book are : Being, Knowing and Doing (compared to Rumble, Rise and Resonate of the Marketing Like We're Human book) Today I'm reading a small section of Part 2 on KNOWING, Chapter 7 called 'Manage Your Sales Energy'     Excerpt from Selling Like We're Human, Part 2: KNOWING, Chapter 7: Manage Your Sales Energy   I'm in the middle of cooking dinner, a veggie stir-fry, when my phone rings. I don't know about you, but my friends never call around that time. Sure, we often chat over WhatsApp to check in on each other, but we never call. So I immediately cringe because I intuitively know it's a telemarketing call. I pick up, and sure enough, after a quick “hello,” he fires his first question at me: “Madam, do you prefer red or white wine?” I politely thank him and say that I'm not interested in taking part in his survey, wish him a nice evening, and hang up. I don't get upset at him. He's just doing his job. But I am amazed that these calls still happen in 2021!! I'm not sure if in this particular case he actually wanted to sell me red or white wine; it might have indeed just been a survey. But the point is that telemarketing is still alive. There are still companies who invest money in it because they work with the old sales model based on quantity: the more sales calls you make, the more you sell. And from what I've read, there's no end in sight for these annoying interruptions. In fact, they might get even more disturbing as telemarketers get access to more data and will rely on AI to make the calls more customized to their “targets.” Imagine the following scenario: “Good evening, Ms. Santacroce. I trust you're well. Does your husband enjoy his new Weber barbeque? Making some ribs tonight? And you're in charge of salads, am I right? Well, I'm reaching out because we have a sale right now on our latest model of the Magicmix. Because after all, you can't eat grilled meat every night, right?” I'm of course exaggerating and using gender assumptions! So yes, unfortunately, telemarketing shows no signs of exiting the scene anytime soon. But luckily we don't have to rely on call centers to sell our services. Furthermore, I suggest that we forget the whole “more is better” approach. It's just not true that you always sell more if you make more sales calls. Here are two examples of what I'm thinking: When I asked Emma-Louise, business and mindset coach, to share about her 100 percent close rate on my podcast, she replied: “For full disclosure, I no longer have my 100 percent close rate. I actually had three people say no in a week recently! However this was partly due to my coach encouraging me to get on calls even if they weren't ideal clients (so I knew it was unlikely two of them would invest based on their stage in business).” I'd say that confirms that talking to the right clients, at the right time is what matters. If you're going after a 100% close rate (and I'm not suggesting you should), then just increasing the number of people you're talking to is not necessarily going to get you there. Lynn Dutrow, an advisor, mentor and coach, shared the following experience with me: “As a counselor, selling can feel slimy, especially if you haven't done your work around your money story. It is also easy as a ‘helper' to function from two false assumptions: 1) you want to help ‘everyone' and 2) a butt in the seat (and getting paid) is better than an empty seat. One client who helped me with this was a particularly complex client that my intuition had told me was not a good fit for my skill set. As we neared the end of our complimentary session, she wanted to keep talking past our end time. While this was earlier in my career, I had already managed to learn how to have boundaries around keeping time in session so I changed my hat from clinician to business owner in order to schedule another session (I still thought being ‘nice' was more important than being honest about us not being a good fit). The client took offense to my businesslike manner and accused me of being more concerned with making money than helping her. While uncomfortable, I had a ‘light bulb' moment and took the opportunity to share with her that helping people is my job and that with any job, there is a necessary structure (session time) and an exchange of money for services rendered. I also admitted that I thought we were not a good fit and gave her the names of three other potential counselors. That's when I made note that it was time to let those two assumptions go!” Saying no when you're not a good fit takes courage but it will be so worth it in the long term. Again, it's not about the quantity but about the quality. On the other hand, Cathy, a participant of the Gentle Sales Lab wrote: “I've realized through our discussions that I'm not so bad on the sales side, as my sign-up rate is very good when I do actually speak to someone. The problem is I don't speak to that many people!” So what these two reactions tell us is that: Talking to more people doesn't always mean more sales Talking to the wrong people = no sales :-( No sales conversations = no sales :-( Sales conversations with the right people at the right time = sales :-) Doing More Doesn't Always Get Us More In this chapter, we talk about protecting your energy with healthy boundaries and not following my example of the overgiving burnout, where I spent my day talking to people without making sales. And in case you're thinking, “I'd actually rather avoid sales calls altogether,” stay tuned and be ready to be surprised by the complete reframe of the traditional sales call in Part Three. This excerpt is from Part 2: KNOWING, Chapter 7: Manage Your Sales Energy If what you heard today resonates with you and made you curious about the book, I invite you to get your copy of the new Selling Like You're Human book at humane.marketing/book2. You can also download the whole 1st chapter for free to see if it resonates. And I'm also planting a seed about my 'Marketing Like We're Human' program that I'll run in its live edition starting at the end of January 2022. This is where we take all these concepts from the two books as well as the 7Ps of Humane Marketing to a much much deeper level in an intimate group learning experience. Find out more at www.humane.marketing/program Get your copy of the 'Selling Like We're Human' book ! Get the new Selling Like We're Human book HERE! Sarah's Resources (FREE) Sarah's One Page Marketing Plan (FREE) Sarah Suggests Newsletter (FREE) The Humane Business Manifesto (FREE) Gentle Confidence Mini-Course Marketing Like We're Human - Sarah's first book Selling Like We're Human - Sarah's second book The Humane Marketing Circle Authentic & Fair Pricing Mini-Course Podcast Show Notes Email Sarah at sarah@sarahsantacroce.com Thanks for listening!   After you listen, check out Humane Business Manifesto, an invitation to belong to a movement of people who do business the humane and gentle way and disrupt the current marketing paradigm. You can download it for free at this page. There's no opt-in. Just an instant download. Are you enjoying the podcast?  The Humane Marketing show is listener-supported—I'd love for you to become an active supporter of the show and join the Humane Marketing Circle. You will be invited to a private monthly Q&A call with me and fellow Humane Marketers -  a safe zone to hang out with like-minded conscious entrepreneurs and help each other build our business and grow our impact.  — I'd love for you to join us! Learn more at humane.marketing/circle Don't forget to subscribe to the show on iTunes or on Android to get notified for all my future shows and why not sign up for my weekly(ish) "Sarah Suggests Saturdays", a round-up of best practices, tools I use, books I read, podcasts, and other resources. Raise your hand and join the Humane Business Revolution. Warmly, Sarah

This episode is part of a 12 days of Christmas read-along of the Selling Like We're Human book, recorded in 2021. The book follows a similar concept to what you're already used to here on the Humane Marketing show with the 7Ps of Humane Marketing and the Marketing Like We're Human book: we start with the being and then go into the doing. The 3 parts of the Selling Like We're Human book are : Being, Knowing and Doing (compared to Rumble, Rise and Resonate of the Marketing Like We're Human book) Today I'm reading a small section of Part 2 on KNOWING, Chapter 6 called 'Calculate Your Worth'     Excerpt from Selling Like We're Human, Part 2: KNOWING, Chapter 6: Calculate Your Worth   Time Is money. Or Is It? The reason why many of us don't like selling is because we are not comfortable discussing prices and investments. There are many reasons for this, society making money a taboo being one, our own uncertainty about our prices being another one. But if we have worked on our Unique Value Proposition, we have a good idea of the value we deliver. This information now helps us calculate the monetary compensation we'd like to ask for in exchange for providing that value. In order to get to that number, let's look at some different ways we can price our products or services. Four different strategies come to mind: 1. Hourly Despite being the most commonly used, hourly pricing has its limitations. While it's useful to benchmark your fees in the market, it's also less than ideal to convey the value of your offering. Your offer is more valuable than the exact amount of time you're spending with the client. For example, Cathlin offers a group coaching program in which participants get to spend one hour on Zoom with her per week. The program also comes with self-study material such as video tutorials and worksheets. The value that people are getting from this program is much greater than just the four hours on Zoom per month. 2. Cost Cost-pricing is common among retailers. For example, the keystone pricing method simply doubles the wholesale price. This pricing method provides an easy starting point that is likely to ensure some profit. Since this book is mainly read by service-based entrepreneurs, one could think cost-based pricing doesn't apply to us. But not so fast . . . You do incur costs to run your business, don't you? Your phone, printer cartridges, gas for your car, etc. Let's not forget to calculate these costs into our fees. 3. Market Some level of market research is always helpful. What are others in your field charging? Our clients are smart and savvy and they will have done some research and seen other people's prices. While you don't have to charge the exact same prices, it will help you understand what kind of prices your ideal clients have most likely seen before coming to you. 4. Value Value-based pricing is the fourth strategy, and the one we'll spend some more time looking into in this chapter. It's a combination of all four pricing strategies, our Unique Value Proposition, and the outcomes we promise to our clients. You Are Worth More Than Just Your Time When you price your services based on time units, you get underpaid. And you develop a very unhealthy relationship with time. Time really is money when you're only getting paid for your time! #vulnerabilityalert My early years in business were a constant juggle between taking care of our boys, managing the house, and trying to build a business. I felt like I was never completely focused on one task. And of course I never had time for myself. I never had time, period. I was rushing the groceries, getting annoyed at people who seemed like they had time to waste, I was checking e-mails while the kids were doing their homework, and I wasn't fully there for my husband Tony either. Tempus fugit was my modus operandi. It was not until reading The Pursuit of Time and Money: Step into Radical Abundance and Discover the Secret to a Meaningful Prosperous Life by Sharon L. Spano that I realized that I had the same scarcity approach to time that I did to money. I highly recommend this book. It's based on thorough research, and Sharon explores the paradox of time and money from a human developmental lens that supports people in transformational change. So in this chapter we'll unpack this idea of value versus time. Because you bring so much more than just your time to your clients. You have experience, tools, IP (intellectual property), and you're delivering outcomes. And that doesn't have anything to do with time . . . But, we'll start with the easy part: your pragmatic costs. Calculate Your Pragmatic Costs In order to get to a price that's based on value, it's still a good idea to start by calculating your costs. You need to figure out approximately how much it's going to cost you to deliver what you're doing for your clients. So let's think about the different costs you incur when working on a client project. Used Time There it is again. Of course, you'll be spending time on your client. But it's not just time that you spend working directly with the client. For example, if you're giving a ninety-minute workshop, you will have to prepare for that workshop. You have to research the client's industry and prepare the PowerPoint slides, worksheets, or handouts. All of this takes your time. It's simple math: time used x your hourly rate. You need to run those numbers so that you know the total cost in terms of time used. Paid Time If you have an assistant or other employees, add their time x their hourly rate to the cost. Lost Time If you're traveling to the client's location, or another venue, you should also take into consideration the time that you've lost. To take our example of the ninety-minute workshop again, if you're running it online, then it really only takes you ninety minutes, plus approximatively twenty minutes for setting up the call. But if you have to travel to another city, you lose at least half a day, if not the full day. Because instead of working on another client, you're spending the day in transit, maybe prepping for the workshop. This is a cost that you should include in your price. Overhead Costs As the owner of a small business, even if it's a micro business, you have overhead costs. I'm thinking of your monthly rent, taxes, insurance, office supplies, and utilities (phone bill, electricity, etc). Of course you can't calculate these costs to the penny; that's why we often just think of overhead costs as a flat fee. The important thing is that you see that you have these expenses. Because if you forget to work them into your prices, you'll always end up with the short end of the stick. Tools You Need to Run Your Business As online business owners, we usually don't have big rents and other infrastructure to take into consideration. However, there are quite a lot of costs involved in keeping the “lights on” online. Here's my list of monthly expenses towards tools, hosting, and other web related things: Hosting (website, podcast, videos): • Siteground • Amazon S3 • Libsyn • Vimeo • Kajabi Security (password and website): • Roboform • Vaultpress Client work: • Acuity Scheduling • Zoom Podcast: • Descript Accounting: • Receipt Bank Social Media: • Post Planner We don't calculate our pragmatic costs because we want to include them in our proposals. They are for our eyes only. Evaluate Your Intangible Value [Growth] Okay, we're going from the left-brain territory (costs) to the right brain territory (feelings). The way I see it, value-based pricing is this dance between those two brain hemispheres. Yes, we want to know our pragmatic numbers and costs, but now we also need to address the area that is a bit more difficult to measure. I once attended a round table with a bunch of really smart people discussing the topic “what gets measured and what doesn't get measured.” The think tank discussed questions like: • What values, behaviors, and things do we tend to measure? What don't we? • Why do we measure what we do? • What are values, behaviors, or other qualities we could measure but do not? What was fascinating to me was the conclusion that we're facing a paradox in this twenty-first century. On one hand, there is an explosion in data and measurement. Artificial intelligence, algorithms, and robots are all the results of this attention to facts, figures, and statistics. This data can be used for good, or for evil. On the other hand, we're also seeing a trend toward favoring nonmeasurable qualities. In his book A Whole New Mind, author Daniel H. Pink writes, “We've progressed from a society of farmers to a society of factory workers to a society of knowledge workers. And now we're progressing yet again—to a society of creators and empathizers, of pattern recognizers and meaning makers.” How do you measure empathy, purpose, and meaning? I've always disliked working with “aggressive” business income goals. They just never worked for me as I was not motivated to work harder just to get to that certain monthly or yearly goal. But that was another thing you just did in business. In December, you had to sit down and come up with your new income goal for the next year. The manifesting people took it even a step further and came up with mantras that you were supposed to repeat in order to attract that magical goal. Again, it never worked for me and instead was cause for frustration and self-doubt. So at the end of 2018, my friend Valérie and I decided that we were not going to work with business goals anymore. Instead, we wanted to measure our success in joy and the difference we make with our work. How do we measure that? Well, the happiness of our clients is one statistic we can look at. Referral rates are another. Our own happiness of course as well, reflected in our nightly gratitude journal. But as you can see, this area is less black-and-white, less numbers and more feelings related. This was a long-winded intro to intangible value. Another way to explain intangible value is the value that you give to your clients, but it's invisible right now. So on one hand you have your tangible value that's visible to your client right now. For example, the time you spend on Zoom with them, the “Done for You” LinkedIn profile, the copy for your new website, etc. But now let's get into the intangible or invisible value. I'll leave you with a Cliffhanger here... This excerpt is from Part 2: KNOWING, Chapter 6: Calculate Your Worth If what you heard today resonates with you and made you curious about the book, I invite you to get your copy of the new Selling Like You're Human book at humane.marketing/book2. You can also download the whole 1st chapter for free to see if it resonates. And I'm also planting a seed about my 'Marketing Like We're Human' program that I'll run in its live edition starting at the end of January 2022. This is where we take all these concepts from the two books as well as the 7Ps of Humane Marketing to a much much deeper level in an intimate group learning experience. Find out more at www.humane.marketing/program Get your copy of the 'Selling Like We're Human' book ! Get the new Selling Like We're Human book HERE! Sarah's Resources (FREE) Sarah's One Page Marketing Plan (FREE) Sarah Suggests Newsletter (FREE) The Humane Business Manifesto (FREE) Gentle Confidence Mini-Course Marketing Like We're Human - Sarah's first book Selling Like We're Human - Sarah's second book The Humane Marketing Circle Authentic & Fair Pricing Mini-Course Podcast Show Notes Email Sarah at sarah@sarahsantacroce.com Thanks for listening!   After you listen, check out Humane Business Manifesto, an invitation to belong to a movement of people who do business the humane and gentle way and disrupt the current marketing paradigm. You can download it for free at this page. There's no opt-in. Just an instant download. Are you enjoying the podcast?  The Humane Marketing show is listener-supported—I'd love for you to become an active supporter of the show and join the Humane Marketing Circle. You will be invited to a private monthly Q&A call with me and fellow Humane Marketers -  a safe zone to hang out with like-minded conscious entrepreneurs and help each other build our business and grow our impact.  — I'd love for you to join us! Learn more at humane.marketing/circle Don't forget to subscribe to the show on iTunes or on Android to get notified for all my future shows and why not sign up for my weekly(ish) "Sarah Suggests Saturdays", a round-up of best practices, tools I use, books I read, podcasts, and other resources. Raise your hand and join the Humane Business Revolution. Warmly, Sarah

This episode is part of a 12 days of Christmas read-along of the Selling Like We're Human book, recorded in 2021. The book follows a similar concept to what you're already used to here on the Humane Marketing show with the 7Ps of Humane Marketing and the Marketing Like We're Human book: we start with the being and then go into the doing. The 3 parts of the Selling Like We're Human book are : Being, Knowing and Doing (compared to Rumble, Rise and Resonate of the Marketing Like We're Human book) Today I'm reading a small section of Part 2 on KNOWING, Chapter 5 called 'Know Your People'     Excerpt from Selling Like We're Human, Part 2: KNOWING, Chapter 5: Know Your People   From “People Buy Stuff” to “People Buy People” As one of the early adopters of LinkedIn consulting, I had to learn that my skills and even ten-plus years of experience just weren't enough anymore. Sure, when I first started offering LinkedIn coaching ten years ago, I was pretty much the only one with that specialty, at least in Switzerland. But as time went on and LinkedIn got more and more popular, more competition and young talent arose from every nook and corner. It was time for me to have a good look at my UVP as well as my people—the kind of people I enjoyed working with and who enjoyed working with me! Because I once and for all realized that I wasn't just selling LinkedIn coaching, I was selling myself. I talk in detail about “finding your people” in the Marketing Like We're Human book. I cover topics such as bringing more of you to your marketing so that it resonates with your people, connecting with them through authentic stories, and showing them that you care. In this book, I'd like to focus on the more sales-related aspects: getting into their heads and knowing their antihero. Get into Your People's Heads Empathy plays an important factor in Humane Marketing and Selling. Listening deeply and figuring out how people feel gives us a clear advantage in a sales path that's not purely transactional. I talk about empathy in the Marketing Like We're Human book. But there's another skill in selling that's similar to empathy but has to do more with people's heads than their hearts. It's called perspective-taking. Perspective-Taking vs. Empathy Psychologists report data that shows that empathy and perspective-taking require distinct neural circuits in the brain. Different brain regions can be distinguished for empathy for negative emotions, empathy for positive emotions, and Theory of Mind, the expert term for perspective-taking. While both are crucial, perspective-taking is just as relevant in sales because it has to do with the capacity to reason and represent others' intentions, goals, and motives. As the seller, I am motivated to understand my buyer's mental state and intentions, which allows me to make predictions about their actions, and also to influence these actions. For example: I'm on a call with a potential client who tells me that she wants to up-level her business, but right now she's really struggling, charging minimum rates and working long hours. I can hear it in her voice that she's frustrated and sad, but I also hear some kind of resignation at not knowing how to change her situation. In this case, I first show empathy: “Been there, done that, and I hear your pain.” But then I switch over to perspective-taking, gently pointing out incorrect view on the matter and presenting a new perspective in an abstract manner. I use my empathy and perspective-taking not to just come up with a completely unrealistic “magic wand” scenario, but to help her to step out of her own false belief bubble and draw a new scenario. If I only show empathy, I might submerge my own interests and not get the sale. So perspective-taking meets somewhere in the middle to really create win-win situations. Here's a list of the main differences between empathy and perspective-taking: Empathy: Perspective-taking: - feelings - thoughts - sharing someone's emotional state - taking someone's perspective - heart - head The bottom line is that both perspective-taking and empathy are required in Humane Selling. Empathy will help you get into people's hearts, and perspective-taking gets you into people's heads. #woowooprompt This is an important concept to understand, especially if you're a more “feeling person.” Yes, we need more empathy in our sales conversations, but that doesn't mean we only rely on feelings. It's the combination of heart AND mind that will give your ideal client this feeling that they can trust you and want to work with you. Who's Your People's Antihero? While we're in people's heads, let's dig around a bit longer. Actually, that sounds a bit gross, but you know what I mean. What we're trying to get to is old memories or stories that your clients have stored in their mind somewhere. And I'm not talking about old romances, but experiences that have to do with the problem they are trying to solve. Because most people come to you, with some kind of baggage. They have most likely tried other solutions that either just didn't work or, worse, really left them disgusted and disillusioned. In the example of Humane Marketing, it's “Bro” or “Hype Marketing.” That's my people's antihero. They are sick and tired of marketers who tell them to send out four cart-closing e-mails, launch a huge Facebook Ads campaign, or build a manipulative funnel in ClickFunnels. If you are a wellness coach, your people's antihero is probably the “quick results, six pack in six weeks” type of scam. If you are a restaurant owner, your ideal client's memory is full of bad dining experiences. If you are a writing coach, your people may have come across someone that promised them they'll have a book written in two months. If you are a web designer, your people may come to you with a half-done website and a story in their head that “all web designers are crooks.” If you are a car salesman . . . You get the picture. :-) On the next page I'll invite you to reflect on your ideal client's backstory. Why is it so key to have spent some time reflecting on this? Because it helps you with perspective-taking—and even empathy—when you know what your people have tried before without success and are frustrated or angry about. Because often they don't tell you these stories, which in their eyes feel like failures. But if you mention that other clients have come to you for these exact reasons, they feel an immediate alignment with you and your values. The Antihero Is Not Always a Person Maybe your ideal client is just starting out and hasn't had any bad experiences yet. But what they have done is shopped around and seen what's available. Dina, a web designer, told me that her people are frustrated with the jargon they see on most of her competitors' sites. Things like SEO, Google Ads, ranking. etc. are overwhelming her nature-focused clients. All they want is a beautiful-looking site and someone who takes care of the rest. So in Dina's case, her people's antihero is the whole industry that keeps pushing those buzzwords. So knowing that about your ideal client helps you paint a picture that makes your client understand that you're on their side. If you are unsure who your client's antihero is, start by listening. You can listen directly while in actual conversation with your clients, or you can listen indirectly by doing research on Twitter, LinkedIn, Facebook, or on other forums or groups where your customers are present. Pay close attention whenever you hear or see the words “rant.” :-) That's when clients give themselves permission to really voice their opinions about anything they dislike, and often it's about their antihero. #anchor This concept of the antihero deserves an anchor. It helps you understand your client better (perspective-taking), and by addressing this topic, you show that you “get it” and are on the client's side. This excerpt is from Part 2: KNOWING, Chapter 5: Know Your People If what you heard today resonates with you and made you curious about the book, I invite you to get your copy of the new Selling Like You're Human book at humane.marketing/book2. You can also download the whole 1st chapter for free to see if it resonates. And I'm also planting a seed about my 'Marketing Like We're Human' program that I'll run in its live edition starting at the end of January 2022. This is where we take all these concepts from the two books as well as the 7Ps of Humane Marketing to a much much deeper level in an intimate group learning experience. Find out more at www.humane.marketing/program Get your copy of the 'Selling Like We're Human' book ! Get the new Selling Like We're Human book HERE! Sarah's Resources (FREE) Sarah's One Page Marketing Plan (FREE) Sarah Suggests Newsletter (FREE) The Humane Business Manifesto (FREE) Gentle Confidence Mini-Course Marketing Like We're Human - Sarah's first book Selling Like We're Human - Sarah's second book The Humane Marketing Circle Authentic & Fair Pricing Mini-Course Podcast Show Notes Email Sarah at sarah@sarahsantacroce.com Thanks for listening!   After you listen, check out Humane Business Manifesto, an invitation to belong to a movement of people who do business the humane and gentle way and disrupt the current marketing paradigm. You can download it for free at this page. There's no opt-in. Just an instant download. Are you enjoying the podcast?  The Humane Marketing show is listener-supported—I'd love for you to become an active supporter of the show and join the Humane Marketing Circle. You will be invited to a private monthly Q&A call with me and fellow Humane Marketers -  a safe zone to hang out with like-minded conscious entrepreneurs and help each other build our business and grow our impact.  — I'd love for you to join us! Learn more at humane.marketing/circle Don't forget to subscribe to the show on iTunes or on Android to get notified for all my future shows and why not sign up for my weekly(ish) "Sarah Suggests Saturdays", a round-up of best practices, tools I use, books I read, podcasts, and other resources. Raise your hand and join the Humane Business Revolution. Warmly, Sarah

This episode is part of a 12 days of Christmas read-along of the Selling Like We're Human book, recorded in 2021. The book follows a similar concept to what you're already used to here on the Humane Marketing show with the 7Ps of Humane Marketing and the Marketing Like We're Human book: we start with the being and then go into the doing. The 3 parts of the Selling Like We're Human book are : Being, Knowing and Doing (compared to Rumble, Rise and Resonate of the Marketing Like We're Human book) Today I'm reading a small section of Part 2 on KNOWING, Chapte4 3 called 'Get Clear On Your Value'     Excerpt from Selling Like We're Human, Part 2: KNOWING, Chapter 4: Get Clear on Your Value   KNOWING Overview: Your Value, People, and Worth I've made this mistake several times in my LinkedIn consulting business: I created a new product or service, and then ran out to sell it. Or tried to sell it. And failed. It wasn't the quality of the product that was the problem. It's that I rushed it and didn't take the time to “KNOW” a few things first. Let me explain. After writing Marketing Like We're Human, I noticed in our Humane Marketing Circle that members often talked about marketing when they were actually referring to selling. And in addition to that, my book launch coach mentioned to me that her analytics showed that there were actually more searches for selling than there were for marketing. So that showed me that there was a need. But I had never in a million years thought of writing a book about sales, so I really needed to think it through. These were some of the questions that went through my head: • WHY would I write a book on selling? Because there's a fine line between marketing and selling, and humane marketing actually helps with selling; also because there seemed to be a need from my clients. • HOW would my book be different? It would completely turn traditional sales upside down, and just like Humane Marketing, it would be about selling with integrity. • WHO would this book be for? Heart-centered entrepreneurs who tried red selling and hated it and were looking for a different way, as well as for readers of my first book. • WHAT'S the value of such a book? The value is in the uniqueness for people who are craving a radical approach to something they find a necessary evil. • HOW would my book make people feel? It would make them feel relieved, empowered, and encouraged. After listening to our hearts, we will pause and focus on our minds in this second part of the book that's all about KNOWING. You can touch your head if it helps you to embody it. This part of the book gives us clarity about our value and our worth, as well as who we're really serving with our offer. As with everything we do, we bring our own values, transparency, and an emotional connection. Again, remember the yoga analysis from Part One. This is still important and deep work you're doing. And in Part Three, we'll bring it all together and into practice during our beautiful sales conversations. People Buy What's Valuable to Them Let's talk about the Unique Selling Proposition, more commonly referred to as the USP. Have you heard that term before? Here's the Oxford Reference definition from their website: A product benefit that can be regarded as unique and therefore can be used in advertising to differentiate it from the competition. The concept is not now as popular as it was, as not every product can have a USP. The first sentence describes it as the one thing that makes your business better than the competition. What surprised me was the second sentence. Apparently the USP has lost in popularity because in today's market, where everything has already been invented and claimed, it's very difficult to find a truly unique selling proposition. What do we do instead? How do we position our offer as unique? Because what's still true is that people buy what's valuable to them. And on top of that, they have way more choice than they had a decade ago. They are smarter, better educated, and in many cases, up to 60 percent further along the buying journey before you even get a chance to speak to them. So how do we demonstrate that our products or services are unique and have value? That's what we're going to work on in this chapter. What's the Value You're Selling? When we talk about value, we always look at it from the perspective of our clients: what are their wants and needs, what they're experiencing now, and how you can help them. In the introduction, I mentioned the often-used term gap selling. By definition, there is a focus on the negative, on the gap that the client finds himself facing. So this whole sales technique revolves around making the client realize how big this gap is and then come to the conclusion that without help, he can never crawl out of that abyss. I'd like to introduce you to another term that describes the same concept, but focuses on the positive: value-based selling. Value-Based Selling vs. Gap Selling In the humane approach to selling, we also consider our clients' perspective and listen to their wants and needs and what they are struggling with now, but instead of focusing so much on the gap, we rest our attention on the transition and how we can help them get there. The difference is subtle, but I'm sure you'll immediately get which one is which in these two examples: “You've told me that you're currently not getting enough clients. This situation is hard on you because you're struggling to pay the bills, which creates tension with your husband, and you're often shouting at your kids. But it doesn't have to be that way. You can easily sign with three high-paying clients each month, and instead of arguing with your husband, head to the gym together and have a nice lunch afterwards, while the kids are still at school.” Or “I hear your frustration with not getting enough clients right now. Building a business takes time. While I can't promise that you'll have a boatload of new clients within three months, I can help you get to the next level, focus on leadgenerating activities, and help you systematize your business so you don't feel like you always have to work more and more. I can help you prioritize those activities that get you the biggest return on investment.” The first example uses the typical gap-selling method, making people realize how shitty their situation is and then waving the magic wand to sell them a utopia that they have only limited control over. The second example uses a more humane value-based selling approach. While the value in getting help is still clear, it is presented with integrity. No exaggerated promises, no magic wand. This excerpt is from Part 2: KNOWING, Chapter 4: Get Clear on Your Value. If what you heard today resonates with you and made you curious about the book, I invite you to get your copy of the new Selling Like You're Human book at humane.marketing/book2. You can also download the whole 1st chapter for free to see if it resonates. And I'm also planting a seed about my 'Marketing Like We're Human' program that I'll run in its live edition starting at the end of January 2022. This is where we take all these concepts from the two books as well as the 7Ps of Humane Marketing to a much much deeper level in an intimate group learning experience. Find out more at www.humane.marketing/program Get your copy of the 'Selling Like We're Human' book ! Get the new Selling Like We're Human book HERE! Sarah's Resources (FREE) Sarah's One Page Marketing Plan (FREE) Sarah Suggests Newsletter (FREE) The Humane Business Manifesto (FREE) Gentle Confidence Mini-Course Marketing Like We're Human - Sarah's first book Selling Like We're Human - Sarah's second book The Humane Marketing Circle Authentic & Fair Pricing Mini-Course Podcast Show Notes Email Sarah at sarah@sarahsantacroce.com Thanks for listening!   After you listen, check out Humane Business Manifesto, an invitation to belong to a movement of people who do business the humane and gentle way and disrupt the current marketing paradigm. You can download it for free at this page. There's no opt-in. Just an instant download. Are you enjoying the podcast?  The Humane Marketing show is listener-supported—I'd love for you to become an active supporter of the show and join the Humane Marketing Circle. You will be invited to a private monthly Q&A call with me and fellow Humane Marketers -  a safe zone to hang out with like-minded conscious entrepreneurs and help each other build our business and grow our impact.  — I'd love for you to join us! Learn more at humane.marketing/circle Don't forget to subscribe to the show on iTunes or on Android to get notified for all my future shows and why not sign up for my weekly(ish) "Sarah Suggests Saturdays", a round-up of best practices, tools I use, books I read, podcasts, and other resources. Raise your hand and join the Humane Business Revolution. Warmly, Sarah

This episode is part of a 12 days of Christmas read-along of the Selling Like We're Human book, recorded in 2021. The book follows a similar concept to what you're already used to here on the Humane Marketing show with the 7Ps of Humane Marketing and the Marketing Like We're Human book: we start with the being and then go into the doing. The 3 parts of the Selling Like We're Human book are : Being, Knowing and Doing (compared to Rumble, Rise and Resonate of the Marketing Like We're Human book) Today I'm reading a small section of Part 1 on BEING, Chapter 3 called 'Boost Your Sales Confidence:'     Excerpt from Selling Like We're Human, Part 1: BEING, Chapter 3: Boost Your Sales Confidence   Overcome the Expert Fear The second most frequently asked question, after your name, is probably “what do you do for a living?” From that short answer of what we do for work, others will make assumptions about our societal level, income, ambition, etcetera. No wonder people feel defined by what they do. In the entrepreneurial world, we make up our own job titles, so there is less comparison. But there's still peer pressure, and often people get grouped into different categories based on the number of zeros in their revenue. I won't get into my rant about the six-figure and seven-figure marketing headline club. I talk about that extensively in Marketing Like We're Human. Besides the income, there's also pressure to “be an expert.” I admit, I even used it in my LinkedIn business, where my tagline was “I help you position yourself as an expert on LinkedIn.” What does that have to do with selling, you ask? Quite a lot. Picture this: your muscles tense up just a bit, you clench your jaw, you unconsciously hold your breath. If your child walked in the door right now, you'd probably shout at him, shut the door, and turn the key this time. You're on high alert because you're just about to enter an important sales call on Zoom. You're in “expert” mode! Feel familiar? Maybe it's just me, but that's what many of my sales calls felt like when I was selling big LinkedIn consulting packages. I put so much pressure on myself and was afraid to lose face in front of my bigshot client. So How Can We Overcome the Expert Fear ? According to Wikipedia, an expert is “a person who has a comprehensive and authoritative knowledge of or skill in a particular area.” Okay, that's pretty impressive. What probably scares you is the word “authoritative,” which means a) Able to be trusted as being accurate or true; reliable, clear, authoritative information”; and b) Considered to be the best of its kind and unlikely to be improved upon. Fair enough, that's pretty scary! Reframing the discussion What if we replaced the word “expert” with “specialist”? It's not as exclusive, and if you call yourself a specialist, it means that you specialize in this topic and have valuable knowledge and skills in this area. And this can be true even if it's early in your entrepreneurial adventure. Because maybe you don't have ten years of experience offering this type of service, but you have previous experience—maybe from a corporate career, maybe outside of work—that you can tap into. You may also have passions and interests which aren't on your CV or your LinkedIn profile but which make you an interesting and well-rounded person that people feel attracted to. You don't have to know absolutely everything, because of course there's always room for improvement. And there's room for that transparency in a sales call! Bring More of You to Your Sales Transparency, vulnerability, authenticity, empathy . . . All these words, at their essence, have a common denominator: truth and sincerity. What people want now more than ever is the truth. They don't want a fake version of you, they don't want a cookie-cutter template approach, they don't want to be sold to via a robotic-sounding script, and they surely don't want your phony sympathy. What they really want is more of you, the real you. “How do I bring more of me to my sales, Sarah?” I don't have all the answers, because only you can be more of you. Have you ever eaten an artichoke? Not one from the can, a real one. It's that spiky thing that looks like a flower. You cook it in the pressure cooker and then you slowly work your way to the center, pulling off the outer petals one at a time. You can dip the leaves in olive oil and balsamic vinegar and then pull them through your teeth to remove the soft, pulpy portion of the petal. Don't try to chew the petals. They are not meant to be eaten. Once you've made it to the center, you still need to remove the choke, a crown of pointy fibers that can literally make you choke, so don't eat them. Hallelujah, you've found the artichoke heart! Sounds like a laborious journey, but believe me, it's so worth it! Cut the heart into pieces, season it, and enjoy! The journey to find the real you is similar. You need to peel back the layers of outside influences, conditioning, and adopted beliefs before you find the soft center—your real, authentic you. Here are some reflections to discard some of these outer layers to bring more of you to your sales: 1. Stop comparing First and foremost, you need to stop comparing yourself to everyone else. “Hah! Easier said than done!” I know. I still catch myself mindlessly scrolling through LinkedIn, envious of other people's inspiring posts; livestreams, which I can never get myself to do; and of course, my biggest procrastination: other people's launches. But whenever I do, I catch myself much faster than I did a few years ago, and I remind myself that this person is not me. This person has a different personality, different way to recharge their energy, different definition of success, different business model, etc. Comparing yourself with other entrepreneurs is only fruitful when you classify it as research and do it for a good reason, like, for example, when you're researching prices (we'll get to that in Part Three). 2. Ditch the script There are thousands of templates and sales scripts out there. The entrepreneurs who provide them (at least most of them) have good intentions. They are trying to help you. The problem is, as we've seen in Emily's story, it's not really helping! So ditch that script right now. Discard that sales funnel template with the four cart-closing e-mails with the rest of the artichoke petals. People are sick of these predictable e-mail series that have been used for decades now. Instead, keep reading in order to give yourself the permission to bring more of you to your sales. And in the integration part, you'll find some considerations on how to structure your sales conversation, but without making it a linear script to follow. 3. Take yourself less seriously Whenever I'm asked in a podcast interview what I would tell a younger version of myself, I say “Sarah, dear, please take yourself less seriously.” #vulnerabilityalert It's true. It's maybe one of my biggest regrets looking back at thirteen years of business. I wish I'd had more fun. I wish I had felt less like I needed to prove something. I wish that I had understood earlier that I'm good enough and that showing up as I am is sometimes good enough. I think someone who can take themselves less seriously comes across as more confident, not less confident. Being more casual in marketing and sales is a sign of confidence. How can you take yourself less seriously in these situations? Maybe you share an embarrassing story that happened to you. Maybe you share with more vulnerability. Maybe you admit that you don't have it all together 4. Have your values top of mind That's it; you have arrived in the middle and discarded the choke. Now it's time to focus on you! If you haven't gone through the exercise of choosing your top five core values in a while (or never), I highly recommend revisiting it. You'll find the full list of values in the Marketing Like We're Human book or, if you prefer to do this exercise online, the Barrett Values Centre offers a free online version in exchange for your e-mail: http://bit.ly/topvalues. Knowing your actual core values has merit on both personal and professional levels. And in sales, it will really help you with decision-making. I give you an example: Joy is one of my core values. So when I listen to my body and don't experience a sensation of joy when talking to a prospect, I'd rather pass on the opportunity. It happened in 2019 when I was invited to be a LinkedIn trainer for a new offering for CEO's. I said yes. But then of course Covid happened and the whole project got delayed. Then they reached back out early 2021 and invited me to a four-hour “let's meet and brainstorm” session with the organizers and the other three trainers. At the time, I couldn't say exactly why (well, other than the fact that I wasn't excited by blocking out a whole afternoon without getting paid), but it just didn't feel right. So after some encouragement from my business besties Valérie and Laurence, I took all my courage and called the guy to tell him I'd rather leave the opportunity to someone else. And I gave them the name of one of my colleagues who I know would be a better fit for this project. Thinking about this again now, I realize that it didn't align with two of my core values: joy and curiosity. 5. Slow down the sale In order to have an authentic experience with the real you, we need to slow down—way down. “I've been on your mailing list for six months now.” I hear that all the time. Sometimes they'll say a year. Trust isn't built overnight. In order to really get to know you in this online world, you need to give people more time. It's the exception to the rule that someone hears you on a podcast and immediately wants to hire you. And it's rare that someone buys your signature program after just going through a few onboarding e-mails. That doesn't mean you shouldn't mention it, I think you should, but you shouldn't feel disappointed if they don't buy immediately. If we want people to make empowered buying decisions, then we need to allow them more time. The same goes for sales conversations. If your prospect needs time to think about it, then give them that time. Not endless amounts of time, because that wouldn't be fair to you, but for example twenty-four or forty-eight hours. There's so much more spaciousness when we don't apply the pressure of time. 6. Go woo-woo #woo-wooprompt I truly believe that any kind of grounding practice helps your confidence with sales. Just like our oak tree from the Serene Garden is more stable thanks to its deep roots, you will also feel more grounded and confident. A regular grounding practice will help your body posture and your confidence. Whether it is yoga, prayer, breath work, chakra work, visualization, or meditation doesn't matter. All of these techniques help you anchor yourself and deepen your connection with Mother Earth. So if woo-woo is your jam, I say bring more of that to your sales. Who says you can't start your sales conversation with three deep breaths in order to be in the present moment and get rid of any money-related stress? These are just a few ideas on how to bring more of you to your sales. Find what works for you. Remember the artichoke analogy to peel back the layers of conditioning. And of course, the best way to find out is to “do the work.” This excerpt is from Part One on Being, and from the third chapter called 'Boost Your Confidence'. If what you heard today resonates with you and made you curious about the book, I invite you to get your copy of the new Selling Like You're Human book at humane.marketing/book2. You can also download the whole 1st chapter for free to see if it resonates. And I'm also planting a seed about my 'Marketing Like We're Human' program that I'll run in its live edition starting at the end of January 2022. This is where we take all these concepts from the two books as well as the 7Ps of Humane Marketing to a much much deeper level in an intimate group learning experience. Find out more at www.humane.marketing/program Get your copy of the 'Selling Like We're Human' book ! Get the new Selling Like We're Human book HERE! Sarah's Resources (FREE) Sarah's One Page Marketing Plan (FREE) Sarah Suggests Newsletter (FREE) The Humane Business Manifesto (FREE) Gentle Confidence Mini-Course Marketing Like We're Human - Sarah's first book Selling Like We're Human - Sarah's second book The Humane Marketing Circle Authentic & Fair Pricing Mini-Course Podcast Show Notes Email Sarah at sarah@sarahsantacroce.com Thanks for listening!   After you listen, check out Humane Business Manifesto, an invitation to belong to a movement of people who do business the humane and gentle way and disrupt the current marketing paradigm. You can download it for free at this page. There's no opt-in. Just an instant download. Are you enjoying the podcast?  The Humane Marketing show is listener-supported—I'd love for you to become an active supporter of the show and join the Humane Marketing Circle. You will be invited to a private monthly Q&A call with me and fellow Humane Marketers -  a safe zone to hang out with like-minded conscious entrepreneurs and help each other build our business and grow our impact.  — I'd love for you to join us! Learn more at humane.marketing/circle Don't forget to subscribe to the show on iTunes or on Android to get notified for all my future shows and why not sign up for my weekly(ish) "Sarah Suggests Saturdays", a round-up of best practices, tools I use, books I read, podcasts, and other resources. Raise your hand and join the Humane Business Revolution. Warmly, Sarah

This episode is part of a 12 days of Christmas read-along of the Selling Like We're Human book, recorded in 2021. The book follows a similar concept to what you're already used to here on the Humane Marketing show with the 7Ps of Humane Marketing and the Marketing Like We're Human book: we start with the being and then go into the doing. The 3 parts of the Selling Like We're Human book are : Being, Knowing and Doing (compared to Rumble, Rise and Resonate of the Marketing Like We're Human book) Today I'm reading a small section of Part 1 on BEING, Chapter 2 called 'Clear your Own Objections:'     Excerpt from Selling Like We're Human, Part 1: BEING, Chapter 2: Clear Your Own Sales Objections   Ground Yourself in Your Own Worth Often, the two terms ‘self-worth' and ‘self-esteem', are used interchangeably. But they are actually not the same and there's a reason we start with selfworth. Self-worth is the foundation. Remember the big tree in the middle of our secret garden? The reason that tree stands so beautiful and proud is because it's grounded, thanks to its roots and its strong trunk. That's what self-worth does: it grounds you and makes you believe that you're fundamentally worthy. The Cambridge Dictionary defines self-worth as “the value you give to your life and achievements.” Whereas self-esteem comes after self-worth, and it is about feeling confident and feeling good about yourself. Without going into too much detail, since that's beyond the scope of this book, low self-worth is caused by two main reasons: 1. Wounds caused by childhood trauma; and 2. Self-protection to shield us from our fears. Core wounds often lead to underlying beliefs that we carry about ourselves, things like “I'm bad,” “I'm stupid,” “I'm fat,” and “I don't deserve to be happy.” To work on core wounds, you need more than a few pages in a book. If that's something you're dealing with, please see a licensed therapist to help you work through that. The second reason is the one that we want to take a closer look at here. What's that fear we're protecting ourselves from in the context of selling? The fear of rejection and abandonment from others. When we have low self-worth, we're constantly trying to please others. I wrote about my underselling and overgiving burnout in Marketing Like We're Human. Below is the abbreviated version: #vulnerabilityalert She has come from a world where she was constantly underselling herself, keeping herself small because of different reasons. First it was her upbringing that told her she was part of the working class and so the working class has to be small. She was also feeling inferior because she didn't have a university degree and so she always compared herself to people with higher education. She said the only way to be loved, accepted, and successful was to give and give and give. Until she had an overgiving burnout. She felt angry and decided that she was done with giving. She would be tough from now on. Until she realized that being tough wasn't in her nature. She didn't want to be tough. She wanted to be gentle and kind. And that's when she received the call to adventure. She crossed the threshold and looked at her money story. She met the enemy. There were a lot of stuck emotions in her sacral chakra. She didn't want to betray the values of her dad, who fought all his life for the rights of the working class. Not being part of the working class anymore meant betraying her dad. But then she realized that there was another way. That she didn't have to betray the core values that her family raised her with. Fairness, equality, freedom, justice, kindness, sustainability, making a difference—these values were still the same. So she realized that what her dad was fighting for on a political level, she could now make her mission in the business world. And that's how the Gentle Business Revolution was born. She now creates a community, a movement, a revolution for people who want to make the world a better place through their business. She is no longer so much focused on the monetary outcome; she cares deeply to create this community, and money will come to her as a consequence of the energy she puts into the creation. She feels safe, and she knows she will bloom. The overgiving becomes our protection, as we have never really dealt with those childhood fears of being rejected. In my case it was the fear of being rejected by my dad and the community I grew up in. So by overgiving and underselling myself, I gained the temporary love of others, which made me feel safe. But had I not done the deep inner work, the cycle would have gone on and on, and to this day I would still be lacking the fundamental sense of self-worth. Are you ready to clear your own objections and really own your worth? Your Worth Does Not Depend on the Sale #vulnerabilityalert “I no longer want the amount of money I make to impact how I feel. My worth is not dependent on the level of my success.” That's what I wrote in my journal at the end of 2016 in answer to the prompt “How do you want to change next year?” I think that's such a key concept to understand when you are new to selling. Your worth is not dependent on the number of zeros in your revenue! Your worth is not dependent on whether you fill your next course or not! Your worth does not decrease if you don't make your goal this month! And your value doesn't decrease based on someone's inability to see your worth. In plain English: you're not a failure if people don't buy your stuff! Your worth is innate. You're good enough. In her famous 2010 TEDx talk in Houston on “the power of vulnerability,” Brené Brown, a research professor at the University of Houston Graduate College of Social Work, shared about her many years of research around the topic of shame. Why the shame? Because in this culture driven by a mainstream idea of success, most of us believe we're “not good enough . . . not thin enough, rich enough, beautiful enough, smart enough.” That fundamental fear of rejection, this open wound, leads us to protect ourselves with masks (or other armor) and not really let others see us as who we really are. Better to avoid being vulnerable than risk letting our guard down. However, Brown also talks about a smaller group of people who seemed to have found a better way of living the “wholehearted” way. She describes them as human beings for whom being good enough is “good enough.” They show up with courage and vulnerability, accepting that they are imperfect and are not afraid to be transparent about their flaws. Grounded in this deep sense of their fundamental acceptance, they open themselves to whatever life brings. When you start selling from this new perspective—knowing that you're good enough, whether you make that sale or not—that's when things will change for you. #vulnerabilityalert “I need some time to think about it.” Whenever I heard that sentence after a sales call, my energy dropped and my mood changed. This heavy feeling invaded me, and a loud voice inside my head started screaming, “You see! You're just not good at this; nobody wants what you're selling!” It wasn't until I started to focus on my “enough” that things started to change! In December 2016, I wrote in my diary: “I no longer want the amount of money I make to impact how I feel. My worth is not dependent on the level of my success.” I had to go deep, do the work (with a therapist), let go, and remind myself with a daily mantra: “I am enough.” Today I am no longer attached to the sale. If it feels right, I'm delighted. If it's not meant to be, I don't take it personally, and I move on. #serenegardenmoment Picture yourself in your Serene Garden. You have no clients right now, but yet you feel calm, at peace, and know deep inside that you are good enough because your worth does not depend on the sale. You are still you. Just like a tree is still a tree even when it loses his leaves. #anchor This idea of grounding yourself in your own worth is really important to understand and the reason we start with BEING before we get to the KNOWING part, where we'll talk about the value and worth you provide to your clients. They are separate concepts and not to be confused. Your Unique Value Proposition, which we will talk about in Part Two, has nothing to do with your innate worth. Your innate worth is not dependent on sales or sign-ups. No one can take it from you, or give you more of it. Whenever you doubt yourself, come back to this anchor. This excerpt is from Part One on Being, and from the first chapter called 'Clear Your Own Objections'. If what you heard today resonates with you and made you curious about the book, I invite you to get your copy of the new Selling Like You're Human book at humane.marketing/book2. You can also download the whole 1st chapter for free to see if it resonates. And I'm also planting a seed about my 'Marketing Like We're Human' program that I'll run in its live edition starting at the end of January 2022. This is where we take all these concepts from the two books as well as the 7Ps of Humane Marketing to a much much deeper level in an intimate group learning experience. Find out more at www.humane.marketing/program Get your copy of the 'Selling Like We're Human' book ! Get the new Selling Like We're Human book HERE! Sarah's Resources (FREE) Sarah's One Page Marketing Plan (FREE) Sarah Suggests Newsletter (FREE) The Humane Business Manifesto (FREE) Gentle Confidence Mini-Course Marketing Like We're Human - Sarah's first book Selling Like We're Human - Sarah's second book The Humane Marketing Circle Authentic & Fair Pricing Mini-Course Podcast Show Notes Email Sarah at sarah@sarahsantacroce.com Thanks for listening!   After you listen, check out Humane Business Manifesto, an invitation to belong to a movement of people who do business the humane and gentle way and disrupt the current marketing paradigm. You can download it for free at this page. There's no opt-in. Just an instant download. Are you enjoying the podcast?  The Humane Marketing show is listener-supported—I'd love for you to become an active supporter of the show and join the Humane Marketing Circle. You will be invited to a private monthly Q&A call with me and fellow Humane Marketers -  a safe zone to hang out with like-minded conscious entrepreneurs and help each other build our business and grow our impact.  — I'd love for you to join us! Learn more at humane.marketing/circle Don't forget to subscribe to the show on iTunes or on Android to get notified for all my future shows and why not sign up for my weekly(ish) "Sarah Suggests Saturdays", a round-up of best practices, tools I use, books I read, podcasts, and other resources. Raise your hand and join the Humane Business Revolution. Warmly, Sarah

This episode is part of a 12 days of Christmas read-along of the Selling Like We're Human book, recorded in 2021. The book follows a similar concept to what you're already used to here on the Humane Marketing show with the 7Ps of Humane Marketing and the Marketing Like We're Human book: we start with the being and then go into the doing. The 3 parts of the Selling Like We're Human book are : Being, Knowing and Doing (compared to Rumble, Rise and Resonate of the Marketing Like We're Human book) So today we start with an excerpt from Part 1, BEING, and Chapter 1: Change Your Perspective. So much of my work has to do with changing your perspective and doing things differently, and selling is no different.   Excerpt from Selling Like We're Human, Part 1: BEING, Chapter 1: Change Your Perspective   Selling Is Human In various old dialects, the word selling had a completely different meaning and vibe than it has today. Here are a few according to the Etymology Dictionary: Old English: sellan “to give, furnish, supply, lend; surrender, give up; deliver to; promise” Old Norse: selja “to hand over, deliver, sell” Old High German: sellen “to give, hand over, sell” Gothic saljan: “to offer a sacrifice” If we go even further back, before the introduction of money, men traded goods and services using the bartering system. Goods were exchanged for food, tea, weapons, and spices. The history of bartering dates all the way back to 6000 BC. So yes, Daniel H. Pink was right to call his book To Sell is Human. It's human, and since it's human, it starts with an “inside job.” You can change your mindset and make your own selling rules. But to do that, you need to dig deeper than the typical book on sales would dare to go. You see, selling has to do with money. And whenever there's money involved, there's some baggage. We'll unlock your personal objections to selling, shine a light on the hidden shadow stories, and then you'll start with a fresh slate, with renewed confidence that you can sell, according to your own rules. Oh, and as an introvert, let me address the most widespread myth about selling: no, there is absolutely no evidence that extroverts make the best salespeople! Sure, extroverts are good at small talk and socializing and tend to have more assertiveness and less scruple to ask for their worth. They tend to come across as more confident and show more enthusiasm and energy. And extroverts are more likely than introverts to be firm and even forceful, refusing to take no for an answer. But introverts are very good listeners, they are empathic, pay attention to details, are less self-oriented, and are therefore very good at considering the needs, interests, and values of customers Well, it turns out, Daniel H. Pink had this conversation about extroverts versus introverts in sales with Adam M. Grant, Organizational Psychologist, who took on the challenge to dig deeper and wrote a research paper entitled Rethinking the Extraverted Sales Ideal: The Ambivert Advantage. In it, Grant makes a point, based on a study of 340 outbound call-center representatives, that there is no relationship between extroversion and sales revenue. He argues that the ambivert, the person in the middle of the scale, is the best at selling. Like amphibians, they have the skills from both worlds and can adapt their sales style to any given situation. I think that's good news for everyone, whether you're an intro-, ambi-, or extrovert. It shows that anyone can become good at selling, no matter your personality type. Let's move on to debunk some other myths or beliefs you may have about selling. Selling is a Conversation, Not a Unidirectional Download Since selling is most often taught to us entrepreneurs as a thing we need to DO, it always felt to me like a one-directional conversation where I was the one responsible for the talking, convincing, and pitching. So not true. Selling is a conversation where the BEING matters just as much as the DOING. The following story from fellow Sales Lab participant Emily Shull shows this well: I found a training program online and did a lot of research on it. It just called to me. It seemed to be a perfect addition to my current coaching practice as it would build on my skills and interests, and would give me another tool that would allow me to go deeper with my clients. As a behavioral money coach, my aim is always to get to the emotional root of the problem instead of just addressing symptoms. The client and I are usually able to get there together, but once in a while, that root is elusive. This training would give me a cool method to help them get there. I was really excited about training in this method because it felt like an intuitive and organic next step in crafting my coaching practice. So I was ready to sign up, but had to book a call with a representative to enroll. I began by giving a brief but enthusiastic summary of my practice and how training in this method would complement my services. I guess I was expecting him to use that opportunity to elaborate on the training and then describe (and agree) how it would work well in my practice. But he didn't. Instead, he was simply checking off a list of questions, never really listening to my answers. He spoke very quickly, which is always a turnoff for me. I realized he had a script and would not deviate from it, even though so many of the questions, and my answers, were repetitive. I found myself thinking that it felt like a sleazy attempt at mind control. Ask a question three times in order to get the prospective client to convince themselves of how much they need and want the program. I didn't need to be asked three times. I was sold before the sales call. Instead, the conversation nearly unsold me. It made me question whether the program was run with integrity. In the end, I did enroll, and as soon as I began the program, my enthusiasm returned. Emily Shull, Certified Money Coach (CMC) What went wrong here? Unfortunately, Jake (not his real name) most likely followed some kind of sales script that made the whole thing feel very robotic. To Emily, it didn't feel like there was a connection. It felt like she could have sat there without saying a word and he would have gone through each step of his script without ever checking in with her. And that's exactly where most of the advice about sales fails. It's taught as a skill the seller needs to learn in order to convince the buyer. And since we all love lists or steps, the typical sales conversation is taught in a linear and one-directional way of some kind: step one: discover the problem; step two: make them see the gap; step three: offer the solution; step four: overcome objections; step five: close the deal. As the seller, you have to do everything— with willpower and skill. But if we only focus on the doing—in other words, making our way through these steps—then we completely forget that the conscious client doesn't just buy with his head, but also with his heart. So who you are matters for at least 50 percent of your chance at a successful sales outcome, if not more. And let's not forget Maya Angelou's famous quote about how you make people feel: “I've learned that people will forget what you said, people will forget what you did, but people will never forget how you made them feel.” This excerpt is from Part One on Being, and from the first chapter called 'Change your Perspective'. If what you heard today resonates with you and made you curious about the book, I invite you to get your copy of the new Selling Like You're Human book at humane.marketing/book2. You can also download the whole 1st chapter for free to see if it resonates. And I'm also planting a seed about my 'Marketing Like We're Human' program that I'll run in its live edition starting at the end of January 2022. This is where we take all these concepts from the two books as well as the 7Ps of Humane Marketing to a much much deeper level in an intimate group learning experience. Find out more at www.humane.marketing/program Get your copy of the 'Selling Like We're Human' book ! Get the new Selling Like We're Human book HERE! Sarah's Resources (FREE) Sarah's One Page Marketing Plan (FREE) Sarah Suggests Newsletter (FREE) The Humane Business Manifesto (FREE) Gentle Confidence Mini-Course Marketing Like We're Human - Sarah's first book Selling Like We're Human - Sarah's second book The Humane Marketing Circle Authentic & Fair Pricing Mini-Course Podcast Show Notes Email Sarah at sarah@sarahsantacroce.com Thanks for listening!   After you listen, check out Humane Business Manifesto, an invitation to belong to a movement of people who do business the humane and gentle way and disrupt the current marketing paradigm. You can download it for free at this page. There's no opt-in. Just an instant download. Are you enjoying the podcast?  The Humane Marketing show is listener-supported—I'd love for you to become an active supporter of the show and join the Humane Marketing Circle. You will be invited to a private monthly Q&A call with me and fellow Humane Marketers -  a safe zone to hang out with like-minded conscious entrepreneurs and help each other build our business and grow our impact.  — I'd love for you to join us! Learn more at humane.marketing/circle Don't forget to subscribe to the show on iTunes or on Android to get notified for all my future shows and why not sign up for my weekly(ish) "Sarah Suggests Saturdays", a round-up of best practices, tools I use, books I read, podcasts, and other resources. Raise your hand and join the Humane Business Revolution. Warmly, Sarah

Go to bitly.com/humanemarketingworkshop to sign up *** Hello Humane Marketers! I'm hosting an Encore of the Marketing Like We're Human workshop. Last time I gave you way too little notice, so I decided to host an encore. In fact, I enjoyed the experience of these workshops so much last month, I decided to run them on a bi-monthly basis going forward. It's a 75 minute human experience in which you can expect good content, real humans and two free tools, one of them you already know, which is the 7Ps of Markeing. I'll start with an explanation about why so many of us dislike marketing - and why we need to come back to doing 'Marketing Like We're Human' We'll pause to 'see' our fellow Humans on the call and acknowledge each other. I know having the video on all day can be exhausting, but if you can turn it on even just for this moment, that would be amazing. Then I'll share two simple and yet amazing free tools you can use to find your way back to marketing your business in a way that's aligned with your values. Both tools are free and available as a download on my site. We'll work through the first 3 Ps of the HM mandala and then I'll let you finish them on your own. In the 2nd part, we'll take a detour into the human brain, to help you see the importance of using more of your right brain and making marketing more fun & joyful! We'll end with a creative exercise to imagine this new way of marketing for ourselves. In this part we'll divide into breakout rooms so we can each share and learn from each other. I'm not offering a replay because I want you to really experience it. So hopefully you can join us Go to bitly.com/humanemarketingworkshop to sign up

Hello Humane Marketers! I'm coming to you with a super quick episode today because I realized I mentioned on the last episode that I'd give you more info about the free 'Marketing Like We're Human' workshop, and then completely forgot. Or, only shared it on Social and my email list, but not here. So we had our first workshop yesterday and it was a really beautiful and hopefully inspiring exchange. And there's another one tomorrow, Friday September 24th. So if you're listening to this on Thursday 23rd, or Friday morning there's still time to sign up at bitly.com/humanemarketingworkshop It's a 75 minute human experience in which you can expect good content, real humans and two free tools, one of them you already know, which is the 7Ps of Markeing. I'll start with an explanation about why so many of us dislike marketing - and why we need to come back to doing 'Marketing Like We're Human' We'll pause to 'see' our fellow Humans on the call and acknowledge each other. I know having the video on all day can be exhausting, but if you can turn it on even just for this moment, that would be amazing. Then I'll share two simple and yet amazing free tools you can use to find your way back to marketing your business in a way that's aligned with your values. Both tools are free and available as a download on my site. I'll go into more details of what 'Marketing Like We're Human' looks like and what the main ingredients are. We'll take a detour into the human brain, to help you see the importance of using more of your right brain and making marketing more fun & joyful! We'll end with a creative exercise to imagine this new way of marketing for ourselves. In this part we'll divide into breakout rooms so we can each share and learn from each other. I know it's last minute, and I'm not offering a replay because I want you to really experience it. So hopefully you can join us tomorrow, it's at 1pm Swiss time, 7am New York for those early risers. But if you can't join us, be assured I'll host it again in the not so distant future. Go to http://www.bitly.com/humanemarketingworkshop to sign up See you then 

In this episode of The Marketing Slice, we explore the 7Ps of the marketing mix: a staple when it comes to developing a solid marketing strategy.If you would prefer to read about the marketing mix, you can do so right here. What are the 7Ps of the marketing mix? The concept was developed in the 1960s, and originally included 4 Ps: ProductPricePlacePromotion It was then later expanded upon in the 1980s to include 3 additional elements: Physical evidencePeopleProcessThis formed the extended marketing mix that we know today as the 7 Ps of the marketing mix. With the right set of guidelines, marketers are able to strategise and develop campaigns that work towards gaining and retaining highly valuable customers. The 7Ps of the marketing mix can act as a well-structured checklist for marketers who aim to create an effective strategy that achieves their goals and evolves the business to the fullest extent.Now that you know what the 7Ps of the marketing mix are and their origins, listen to this episode to dive a little deeper into each aspect.  If you're struggling to manage all your data and become an omnichannel brand, why not book a demo of Hurree's data unification and segmentation platform here or email any of your questions to me at stevie-rose@hurree.co. It's time to get your tools talking and we can help you do it!

#130: Are you struggling to convert leads on your website or attract the right clients in the first place?It seems simple enough, write on your website what problem you solve and how you solve it. Make it look nice and elegant and the customers should be flowing in, right? However as our guest today explains in this episode, we often forget that we also need to reframe it from the customer's point of view. How would they describe their problem, ergo, what are they searching for on the internet when trying to solve their problem?  Robby Fowler is a branding and marketing strategist who specializes in helping personal brands create profitable websites from the ground up. With a background in design and communication, he started his own personal brand in 2001. Robby's work stretches across a range of clients and customers. From large corporate client work, to non-profits…from SMBs to entrepreneurs and personal-brands—he's plied his skills and honed his craft. Nowadays you'll find him helping personal brands clear the fog of marketing, branding, and business strategy shrouding profitable websites. His knack for clarity and simplification helps ideas stick and brings transformation—both for leaders and their businesses. He regularly shares his insights on his podcast, Brand ED. So as you can see, he knows his stuff! In this episode, we delve into his background of music and working in the ministry, to working with startups in the early 2000s and building his own personal brand when such terms didn't even exist yet. This episode is jam-packed full of great ideas, so let's get to it!  Learn How You Can Have a Profitable Website... [03:01] Robby details his journey and how his background gave him all the tools he needs to successfully run his company [6:11] Why you shouldn't feel pressured that you don't have that "perfect" background when starting a business [12:12] Life-giving brand - what is it?  [18:11] Why websites from personal brands don't or often have trouble turning a profit [27:38] 7Ps that will help you set up the perfect framework to write your website around [34:59] Should you list your price on your website?  Important Links & Mentions in this episode:https://robbyf.com/ (Robby's Website) https://youarethebrandbook.com/ (Mike Kim's You are the Brand Book) https://www.powerofoneframework.com/masterclass (Access the free masterclass/Kelly's on-stage presentation about the Power Of One Framework) https://www.christianceolearninghall.com/ (Learn more about Christian CEO Learning Hall) https://kellybaader.com/review (Subscribe + Review on iTunes) https://kellybaader.com/Spotify (Subscribe + Listen on Spotify)     Remember, YOU Matter! See you in the next episode.   

Say It Skillfully® is a show that helps you to benefit from Molly Tschang's expert guidance on the best possible ways to speak your mind at work in a positive and productive manner. In Episode 84, Dave Whorton—entrepreneur, investor and CEO & Founder of the Tugboat Group™—joins Molly and shares a powerful journey to redefining a capitalism that goes beyond shareholders to serving society. When his father sat him down and said, “You need to carry your weight,” Dave took his responsibility to heart, applying at HP for what he figured would be a janitor job. Experiencing the “caring for people” culture that founders Bill & Dave created imprinted on him. After Berkeley engineering (“best school I could afford”), the feeling of paycheck-to-paycheck, “In Search of Excellence” and wanting to be an owner steered his career. He shares his unlikely and unexpected first entrepreneurial experience, landing in consulting at Bain and venturing into venture capital at Kleiner Perkins (yes, John Doerr reached out, not how it usually works…though Dave did not immediately take up his offer!). He talks through his decision-making to delay pursuing his passion to run a company and immense learning in supporting start-ups—Google, AutoTrader and Amazon. Going on to found Tugboat Ventures® in 2006 and co-found 4 companies, including drugstore.com and Good Technology, Dave shares the pivotal seed planted when one of his entrepreneurs said, “I hate your (VC) model.” “Let me tell you about my people, my purpose, and our impact,” vs. “your get-big-fast and exit model”. The possibility of less transactional and more enduring were intriguing to Dave and led to creating a vibrant community of Evergreen leaders and companies. He's open about this most compelling entrepreneurial chapter—one that recognizes how ownership is critical, strategic & underappreciated and offers staying private as a means to go deeper than wealth generation and public recognition sought after in capital markets. Dave founded Tugboat Institute® in 2013 to connect, support and inspire purpose-driven leaders of Evergreen® businesses, for which the “7Ps” principles are the defining characteristics: Purpose, Perseverance, People First, Private, Profit, Paced Growth, and Pragmatic Innovation. The “7 Ps” can prevent you from outstripping your financial resources, culture and management team's capacity to learn, grow and improve. With revenues from $10M-$10B and 10-290 years old, the Evergreen® companies show how the longest living companies most innovative. Curiosity, can-do, an eye for opportunity, and exceeding expectations are constants in Dave pursuing his true north. Tune in to hear his journey, inspiring us to know no boundaries and to commit to taking action so that all can be safe, seen and heard to achieve our true and best selves. Molly's Thought for the week—thank you Dave! Evergreen leaders and their businesses are the opportunity for capitalism at its best. Learn more: www.tugboatinstitute.com

Say It Skillfully® is a show that helps you to benefit from Molly Tschang's expert guidance on the best possible ways to speak your mind at work in a positive and productive manner. In Episode 84, Dave Whorton—entrepreneur, investor and CEO & Founder of the Tugboat Group™—joins Molly and shares a powerful journey to redefining a capitalism that goes beyond shareholders to serving society. When his father sat him down and said, “You need to carry your weight,” Dave took his responsibility to heart, applying at HP for what he figured would be a janitor job. Experiencing the “caring for people” culture that founders Bill & Dave created imprinted on him. After Berkeley engineering (“best school I could afford”), the feeling of paycheck-to-paycheck, “In Search of Excellence” and wanting to be an owner steered his career. He shares his unlikely and unexpected first entrepreneurial experience, landing in consulting at Bain and venturing into venture capital at Kleiner Perkins (yes, John Doerr reached out, not how it usually works…though Dave did not immediately take up his offer!). He talks through his decision-making to delay pursuing his passion to run a company and immense learning in supporting start-ups—Google, AutoTrader and Amazon. Going on to found Tugboat Ventures® in 2006 and co-found 4 companies, including drugstore.com and Good Technology, Dave shares the pivotal seed planted when one of his entrepreneurs said, “I hate your (VC) model.” “Let me tell you about my people, my purpose, and our impact,” vs. “your get-big-fast and exit model”. The possibility of less transactional and more enduring were intriguing to Dave and led to creating a vibrant community of Evergreen leaders and companies. He's open about this most compelling entrepreneurial chapter—one that recognizes how ownership is critical, strategic & underappreciated and offers staying private as a means to go deeper than wealth generation and public recognition sought after in capital markets. Dave founded Tugboat Institute® in 2013 to connect, support and inspire purpose-driven leaders of Evergreen® businesses, for which the “7Ps” principles are the defining characteristics: Purpose, Perseverance, People First, Private, Profit, Paced Growth, and Pragmatic Innovation. The “7 Ps” can prevent you from outstripping your financial resources, culture and management team's capacity to learn, grow and improve. With revenues from $10M-$10B and 10-290 years old, the Evergreen® companies show how the longest living companies most innovative. Curiosity, can-do, an eye for opportunity, and exceeding expectations are constants in Dave pursuing his true north. Tune in to hear his journey, inspiring us to know no boundaries and to commit to taking action so that all can be safe, seen and heard to achieve our true and best selves. Molly's Thought for the week—thank you Dave! Evergreen leaders and their businesses are the opportunity for capitalism at its best. Learn more: www.tugboatinstitute.com

Today's conversation fits the 3rd P, the P of Product of the Gentle Marketing Mandala. If you're a regular here, you know that I'm organizing the conversations around the 7Ps of the Gentle Marketing Mandala. In our case, product can often be replaced with 'service'. So today's episode is all about fine-tuning your product or service offering and I'm talking to Annie Schuessler about making small experiments in the early stages of your business. Annie is a business coach and the host of the podcast Rebel Therapist® Podcast. With her Rebel Therapist®Programs, she helps therapists, healers, and coaches make an impact beyond a traditional private practice. And while we use the word 'therapist' quite often on this episode, I want you to know that everything we share here does not only apply to therapists but pretty much to anyone wanting to put together a program for their clients. [Tweet ""The best way to grow a business is to get into conversations with other service providers and invite them along" - Annie Schuessler"] On this episode, you'll learn about fine-tuning your product or service offering as well as... How we know which product to create ((online course, group coaching, digital product, membership community, live retreat etc) Where to start when creating a new program What to do if people don't sign up How to know when it's time to pull the plug How to focus on simplicity in your offering and much more... Annie's Resources Annie's Website Annie's Free Trainings Rebel Therapist™: A Podcast For Entrepreneurs Who Want More Connect with Leslie Twitter LinkedIn   Sarah's Resources (FREE) Sarah’s One Page Marketing Plan (FREE) Sarah Suggests Newsletter (FREE) The Gentle Business Manifesto (FREE) Gentle Confidence Mini-Course The Gentle Marketing Revolution Kickstarter Campaign The Gentle Business Circle The Gentle Business Revolution Authentic & Fair Pricing Mini-Course Podcast Show Notes Email Sarah at sarah@sarahsantacroce.com Thanks for listening! After you listen, check out The Gentle Business Manifesto, an invitation to belong to a movement of people who do business the gentle way and disrupt the current marketing paradigm. You can download it for free at thegentlebusinessrevolution.com. There’s no opt-in. Just an instant download. Are you enjoying the podcast?  The Gentle Business Revolution show is listener-supported—I'd love for you to become an active supporter of the show and join the Gentle Business Circle. You will be invited to a private monthly Q&A call with me and fellow Gentle Marketers -  a safe zone to hang out with like-minded conscious entrepreneurs and help each other build our business and grow our impact.  — I’d love for you to join us! Learn more at sarahsantacroce.com/circle Don’t forget to subscribe to the show on iTunes or on Android to get notified for all my future shows and why not sign up for my weekly(ish) "Sarah Suggests Saturdays", a round-up of best practices, tools I use, books I read, podcasts, and other resources. Raise your hand and join the Gentle Business Revolution. Warmly, Sarah

Proper Preparation & Planning Prevents Pretty Poor Performance was the first set of 7Ps that I learned. When I moved from IT Support Engineer and Consultant in to Internet Marketing I learned about a different 7Ps, the 7Ps of Marketing: Listen to learn about the 7Ps of Marketing and how they can improve your business.

In our Podcast we didn't really didn't have the opportunity to touch on Sarah's background, however we thought it was worth mentioning in these notes.On her website sarahsantacroce.com, Sarah describes herself as " I’m a Hippie turned Business Coach"  She goes on to share the following:  "I grew up in a peace & love environment called the Colombina, a community living experience co-owned by my parents and their friends. It was normal to me, but abnormal to everyone else.  I was taught early on that I was very privileged to be born in a society that has everything and that this privilege came with a responsibility: take care of our world and take care of those who are not as privileged as me."Sarah explains that the 'gentle business revolution" is a call for more empathy and kindness in the business world.  We brought up the "guerilla marketing" and equated it to a "gorilla" in regards to the sounding the same and the "gorilla" being a very powerful animal, however, not equated to "kind and empathetic."  Sarah says it should be a gentler animal sound.Human connection is something that seems to have been slowly eliminated from the business world.  Through the time of COVID, people have had more time to be aware of the intrusive nature of those marketing.  The initiation of building a relationship has not been as apparent.Sarah has a LinkedIn consulting business for over 12 years and trains them to build the personalized connection, yet still finds that there are competitors that have created a method of "mass" connections, which takes away from the "human aspect" of the messages.We have to slow down, Sarah explains.  Everyone wants everything so fast these days.  We need to be gentle.Sarah has a book that just came out called The Gentle Marketing Revolution available at https://sarahsantacroce.com/the-gentle-marketing-revolution-book/ .  For a signed copy you can contact Sarah on LinkedIn @SarahSantacroche.  You can also download a free 7Ps of Marketing and other free resources at https://sarahsantacroce.com/start-here/For more information about Gentle Business Revolution visit https://sarahsantacroce.com/#entrepreneurmind #succeeding #entrepreneurspirit #successminded #inspiration #change #education #lifelessons #buzzsprout #podcast #podcasting #Spotify #GooglePodcast #TuneIn #stitcher #ApplePodcast #iHeartRadio #Pandora #PodcastAddict #Podchaser #Deezer #Listennotes #Overcast #Pocketcast #Castro #CastPost #iamthatgal #liftyourstory #liftyourstorypodcast #iamthatgal #thatgalwiththatguy #sarahsantacroche #gentlemarketing #gentlebusinessrevolution #businessrevolution

Prior Proper Planning Prevents Piss Poor Performance That's the famous 7Ps mantra that our guest today uses to be successful in his business. Lance Abernathy is the owner of the custom tactical knife company, Sniper Bladeworks. His survival field knife called MAMU appeared in Discovery Channel’s Man, Woman, Wild. Prior to making knives full-time, Lance's background was in law enforcement. His duties included being a sniper, SWAT team leader, detective and Deputy Sheriff. During this interview, you’ll learn… The significance of having an organized, disciplined and structured business and life Why you need to ask for help and don't do business alone Why marketing yourself is necessary To find out more about Lance, visit https://www.thethoughtleaderrevolution.com/.

Ps. 28, 302 Chronicles 24:17–22Acts 6:1–7Ps. 118Acts 7:59—8:8

11/01/20 - The 7 "I Am" Statements: I Am the Resurrection and the Life Today's ScriptureJohn 11:1-7, 17-441 Peter 1:6-7Ps. 55:22John 11:27John 11:33John 11:22Luke 24:1-3John 11:25-26John 11:40

10/25/20 - The 7 "I Am" Statements: I Am The Good ShepherdSermon Notes Todays ScriptureJohn 10:11-18John 10:11John 15:13John 3:16John 10:12-131 Peter 5:7Ps. 23 Luke 19:9-10John 10:16

* He explains why "Bold Brands Win" is more than a mantra or a tag line. * Why his business model prevents him from taking on a really big client. * Dave explains his 5A MarCom strategy when speaking to your target audience. * He also shares why the original 4Ps of marketing needs to be 7Ps. * What's working on Social Media right now.

Dave Whorton is an entrepreneur, business leader, education reformer, and investor. Dave founded four companies including Good Technology and Drugstore.com. He also worked for three venture capital firms, Kleiner Perkins Caufield & Byers, TPG, and Interwest. A small angel investment that Dave made in 2005 opened his eyes to an alternative way of supporting seasoned entrepreneurs who wanted to build large, profitable, innovative businesses that they would run privately for their lifetimes. In 2013 he founded The Tugboat Institute, a membership organisation designed to support Evergreen leaders and their companies over the very long term. "We believe in the vital importance of humans coming together to create and grow enduring, private businesses that make a dent in the universe." - Tugboat Institute (https://www.tugboatinstitute.com/about-us/) Standout Quotes * "How do you help a company have good hygiene? A very important component of that is how you develop the family members into the business" - Dave Whorton [31:44] * "If you feel your company is deeply purpose-driven and meant to have a significant impact for a long time in the world then you do think naturally about it from a standpoint of stewardship" - Dave Whorton [34:04] * "How can I take this incredible asset and move it forward before handing it over to the next steward?" - Dave Whorton [34:16] * "I think it's really important to develop a work ethic in your kids, I don't care what level of wealth you have" - Dave Whorton [45:50] Key Takeaways * The 7Ps that makes a company evergreen: Purpose, Perseverance, People First, Private, Profit, Paced Growth and Pragmatic Innovation [21:44] * Entrepreneurs have to be very clear with CEOs about what they want from their investing partners [39:37] * Dave describes some qualities that he observed to be common among evergreen leaders which mostly include being introverted and humility [23:46] * Developing a work ethic at a young age is critically important and also exposing them to the importance of saving [46:11] Episode Timeline: * [00:48] Mike introduces Dave and tells us a little about him * [02:06] Dave shares his backstory and work background in more detail * [17:20] The Tugboat group and how it's evolved over time. * [21:44] The 7Ps that makes a company evergreen: Purpose, Perseverance, People First, Private, Profit, Paced Growth and Pragmatic Innovation * [23:46] Dave describes some qualities that he observed to be common among evergreen leaders which mostly include being introverted and humility * [30:18] How does Tugboat support generational transitions of family members or other closely held businesses? * [34:04] if you feel your company is deeply purpose-driven and meant to have a significant impact for a long time in the world then you do think about naturally about it from a standpoint of stewardship; How can I take this incredible asset and move it forward before handing it over to the next steward? * [39:37] Entrepreneurs have to be very clear with CEOs about what they want from their investing partners * [45:33] Dave shares his thoughts on generational wealth and legacy building in contrast to a focus on the children developing a work ethic and inheriting nothing. * [49:29] The failure Dave faced that eventually took him on a journey to where he is today. For more episodes go to BusinessOfFamily.net (https://www.businessoffamily.net/) Sign up for The Business of Family Newsletter at https://www.businessoffamily.net/newsletter (https://www.businessoffamily.net/newsletter) Follow Mike on Twitter @MikeBoyd (https://twitter.com/MikeBoyd) If you feel it's appropriate, I'd so appreciate you taking 30 seconds to Leave a Review on iTunes (http://getpodcast.reviews/id/1525326745), I receive a notification of each review. Thank you! Special Guest: Dave Whorton.

>> Did you miss the previous episodes? Check them all out at www.sarahsantacroce.com/penney Today, Penney and I are back with this special summer series of 6 episodes where we take a look at the 7Ps of Gentle Marketing from an old perception vs new perception. I want you to know that this is not your regular episode, In continue to post those on Fridays. This summer special is not available on my site and I encourage you to subscribe to the podcast on your favorite app to receive the notifications for these bonus episodes. These episodes are raw, non edited. Just real human conversations about the old and the new perceptions. We recorded them over two afternoons in June and had just a blast. This is the 6th and final episode in this series and today we talk about the P of Promotion.  >> Did you miss the previous episodes? Check them all out at www.sarahsantacroce.com/penney

Today, Penney and I are back with this special summer series of 6 episodes where we take a look at the 7Ps of Gentle Marketing from an old perception vs new perception. I want you to know that this is not your regular episode, In continue to post those on Fridays. This summer special is not available on my site and I encourage you to subscribe to the podcast on your favorite app to receive the notifications for these bonus episodes. These episodes are raw, non edited. Just real human conversations about the old and the new perceptions. We recorded them over two afternoons in June and had just a blast. This is the 5th episode in this series and today we talk about the P of Pricing.  There are no shownotes for these special episodes so make sure you subscribe to get notified when the next episode goes live. 

Today, Penney and I are back with this special summer series of 6 episodes where we take a look at the 7Ps of Gentle Marketing from an old perception vs new perception. I want you to know that this is not your regular episode, In continue to post those on Fridays. This summer special is not available on my site and I encourage you to subscribe to the podcast on your favorite app to receive the notifications for these bonus episodes. These episodes are raw, non edited. Just real human conversations about the old and the new perceptions. We recorded them over two afternoons in June and had just a blast. This is the 4th episode in this series and today we talk about the P of Product.  There are no shownotes for these special episodes so make sure you subscribe to get notified when the next episode goes live. 

Today, Penney and I are back with this special summer series of 6 episodes where we take a look at the 7Ps of Gentle Marketing from an old perception vs new perception. I want you to know that this is not your regular episode, In continue to post those on Fridays. This summer special is not available on my site and I encourage you to subscribe to the podcast on your favorite app to receive the notifications for these bonus episodes. These episodes are raw, non edited. Just real human conversations about the old and the new perceptions. We recorded them over two afternoons in June and had just a blast. This is the 3rd episode in this series and today we talk about the P of Partnerships.  There are no shownotes for these special episodes so make sure you subscribe to get notified when the next episode goes live. 

Today, Penney and I are back with this special summer series of 6 episodes where we take a look at the 7Ps of Gentle Marketing from an old perception vs new perception. I want you to know that this is not your regular episode, In continue to post those on Fridays. This summer special is not available on my site and I encourage you to subscribe to the podcast on your favorite app to receive the notifications for these bonus episodes. These episodes are raw, non edited. Just real human conversations about the old and the new perceptions. We recorded them over two afternoons in June and had just a blast. This is the 2nd episode in this series and today we talk about the P of People.  There are no shownotes for these special episodes so make sure you subscribe to get notified when the next episode goes live. 

Today, Penney and I are back with this special summer series of 6 episodes where we take a look at the 7Ps of Gentle Marketing from an old perception vs new perception. I want you to know that this is not your regular episode, In continue to post those on Fridays. This summer special is not available on my site and I encourage you to subscribe to the podcast on your favorite app to receive the notifications for these bonus episodes. These episodes are raw, non edited. Just real human conversations about the old and the new perceptions. We recorded them over two afternoons in June and had just a blast. Episode 44 is a good intro to Penney Peirce and how she sees the world. So if you haven't yet, listen to that one first. And also the first of the Summer series about Passion and Personal Power. Penney can blow your mind, literally speaking. Every now and then she lost me and my small mind just couldn't follow her out there thinking. And rather than just nodding my head, I told her : woah, you lost me. I don't get it. So if you're open to some woowoo, some mind blowing concepts about the intuitive age and where we're heading, I think you'll absolutely enjoy these conversations. If on the other hand woowoo and energy talk is not your thing, then maybe skip them... after at least listening to this first one. So, today we talk about the first two Ps: Passion and Personal Power. There are no shownotes for these special episodes so make sure you subscribe to get notified when the next episode goes live. 

Today's episode kicks off a whole Summer series of conversations around the topic of the 7Ps of Gentle Marketing! My guest today is Penney Peirce. Penney Peirce is a respected clairvoyant empath, visionary, author, and popular lecturer and trainer. She is one of the early pioneers in the intuition development movement, specializing in intuition development, inner energy dynamics, expanded perception, transformation, and dream work. She has worked throughout the US, Europe, Japan, South America, and South Africa since 1977, coaching business and government leaders, psychologists, scientists, celebrities, and those on a spiritual path about the hidden dynamics of what makes for true success. She is the author of ten books, including Transparency: Seeing Through to Our Expanded Human Capacity, Leap of Perception: The Transforming Power of Your Attention, Frequency: The Power of Personal Vibration, and The Intuitive Way: The Definitive Guide to Increasing Your Awareness. In addition, Penney has written: Be the Dreamer Not the Dream: A Guide to 24-Hour Consciousness, Dream Dictionary for Dummies, The Present Moment: A Daybook of Clarity and Intuition, and the Bits & Pieces series of eBooks. In this episode, you’ll learn about living in your home frequency & attracting the right clients as well as… Resonating at your home frequency What is resonance The difference between frequency and personal vibration How we bring our frequency into business and marketing Left brain right brain connection Much more! Penney's Resources Penney's Website Diamond Light Meditation - Find Your Home Frequency Find Penney on Twitter Connect with Penney on LinkedIn Penney's Facebook Sarah's Resources (FREE) Sarah’s One Page Marketing Plan (FREE) Sarah Suggests Newsletter (FREE) The Gentle Business Manifesto (FREE) Gentle Confidence Mini-Course The Gentle Business Circle The Gentle Business Revolution Authentic & Fair Pricing Mini-Course Podcast Show Notes Email Sarah at sarah@sarahsantacroce.com Thanks for listening! After you listen, check out The Gentle Business Manifesto, an invitation to belong to a movement of people who do business the gentle way and disrupt the current marketing paradigm. You can download it for free at thegentlebusinessrevolution.com. There’s no opt-in. Just an instant download. Are you enjoying the podcast?  The Gentle Business Revolution show is listener-supported—I'd love for you to become an active supporter of the show and join the Gentle Business Circle. You will be invited to a private monthly Q&A call with me and fellow Gentle Marketers -  a safe zone to hang out with like-minded conscious entrepreneurs and help each other build our business and grow our impact.  — I’d love for you to join us! Learn more at sarahsantacroce.com/circle Don’t forget to subscribe to the show on iTunes or on Android to get notified for all my future shows and why not sign up for my weekly(ish) "Sarah Suggests Saturdays", a round-up of best practices, tools I use, books I read, podcasts, and other resources. Raise your hand and join the Gentle Business Revolution. Warmly, Sarah

Dr. Eugênio Franco do @dosesdeemergencia conversa conosco sobre os principais tópicos da Intubação de Sequência Rápida, incluindo a mnemônica TOPZERA, que se mostra como uma melhor alternativa em relação aos conhecidos "7Ps".

Dr. Eugênio Franco do @dosesdeemergencia conversa conosco sobre os principais tópicos da Intubação de Sequência Rápida, incluindo a mnemônica TOPZERA, que se mostra como uma melhor alternativa em relação aos conhecidos "7Ps".

Dr. Eugênio Franco do @dosesdeemergencia conversa conosco sobre os principais tópicos da Intubação de Sequência Rápida, incluindo a mnemônica TOPZERA, que se mostra como uma melhor alternativa em relação aos conhecidos "7Ps".

Hymn 21Bibeltext Rom 15:7Ps 104:1-12IngångL - Herre öppna mina läpparAlla - så att jag kan förkunna ditt lovL - Gud, kom till min räddningAlla - Herre, skynda till min hjälp. Ära vare Fadern och Sonen och den helige Anden. Nu och alltid och i evigheters evighet. Amen. HallelujaHymnPsaltaren 104:1-12Antifon - I höghet ¶ och härlighet är du klädd, du sveper dig i ljus som i en mantelA- Lova Herren, min själ! *Mäktig är du, Herre, min Gud,B - i höghet och härlighet är du klädd, *du sveper dig i ljus som i en mantel.A - Himlen har du spänt ut som ett tält, *ovan skyn har du timrat din sal.B - Du gör molnen till din vagn *och far på vindens vingar.A - Du gör vindar till dina sändebud *och eldslågor till dina tjänare.B - Jorden har du ställt på stadig grund,*den kan aldrig i evighet rubbas.A - Urhavet täckte den som en klädnad,*vattnet stod högt över bergen.B - Det flydde för ditt rytande,*när du dundrade tog det till flykten,A - uppför bergen, ner i dalarna,*och stannade där du bestämt.B - Du satte en gräns för vattnet:*aldrig mer skall det täcka jorden.A - Du låter källor rinna upp och bli till strömmar *som forsar fram mellan bergen.B - De ger vatten åt alla markens djur,*vildåsnor släcker där sin törst.A - Vid dem häckar himlens fåglar *och sjunger bland täta löv.Alla - Ära vare Fadern och Sonen och den helige Anden * nu och alltid och i evigheters evighet. AmenAntifon - - I höghet och härlighet är du klädd, du sveper dig i ljus som i en mantelBibelläsning - tystnadResponsoriumL - Välsignad vare Gud, från nu och till evig tidAlla - Välsignad vare Gud, från nu och till evig tidL - Från solens uppgång till dess nedgång,Alla - från nu och till evig tid.L - Ära vare Fadern och Sonen och den helige Anden.Alla - Välsignad vare Gud, från nu och till evig tid.Benedictus ( Sakarias lovsång ) Antifon - Välsignad ¶ är Herren, vår GudA - Välsignad är Herren, Israels Gud, *som besöker sitt folk och ger det frihet.B - Han reser för oss frälsningens horn *i sin tjänare Davids släkt,A - så som han för länge sedan lovat *genom sina heliga profeter,B - frälsning från våra fiender *och från alla dem som hatar oss.A - Han visar barmhärtighet mot våra fäder +och står fast vid sitt heliga förbund, *den ed han svor vår fader Abraham:B - att rycka oss ur våra fienders hand och låta oss tjäna honom utan fruktan, *rena och rättfärdiga inför honom i alla våra dagar.A - Och du, mitt barn, skall kallas den Högstes profet, *ty du skall gå före Herren och bana väg för honom.B - Så skall hans folk få veta att frälsningen är här med förlåtelse för deras synder *genom vår Guds barmhärtighet och mildhet.A -Han skall komma ner till oss från höjden, + en soluppgång för dem som är i mörkret och i dödens skugga, *och styra våra fötter in på fredens väg.Alla - Ära vare Fadern och Sonen och den helige Ande, *nu och alltid och i evigheters evighet. AmenAntifon - Välsignad är Herren, vår Gud.Bön inför dagenL - Gud, du reste mig upp från natten till denna dagens ljus.Alla - Tack, Jesus Kristus, för de gåvor du ger mig, varje dag och natt, varje natt och dag. Jag vill tillbe dig med hela mitt liv. Jag vill söka dig med all min kraft.Jag vill lovsjunga dig och ära dig med allt jag gör och är.Tyst bönL - I Dina händer Gud, lägger jag min dagAlla - AmenHerrens bönL - Vår Fader, Alla - du som är i himlen. Låt ditt namn bli helgat. Låt ditt rike komma. Låt din vilja ske, på jorden så som i himlen. Ge oss idag det bröd vi behöver. Och förlåt oss våra skulder, liksom vi har förlåtit dem som står i skuld till oss. Och utsätt oss inte för prövning, utan rädda oss från det onda. Ditt är riket, din är makten och äran, i evighet. Amen.Slutbön och välsignelseL - Gud, du skapade min själ och vävde den samman. Du skapade min kropp av stoft och aska. Alla - Välsigna du min kropp.Välsigna du min själ.Välsigna du min tro.Välsigna du mitt liv. Amen

In this podcast, you're going to learn the fundamental features that are integral to making your market segmentation strategy a success.This podcast includes 3 key actions and the benefits of actioning each point. Number 1: Set your objectivesThis includes S.M.A.R.T. goals and objectives, and how they can benefit you. Number 2: Utilize every aspect of the marketing mixThis includes an explanation of the 7Ps of the marketing mix, the 4Es of experiential marketing, and the benefits of implementing them both in your market segmentation strategy.Number 3: Establish your target audienceThe final part of your market segmentation strategy checklist involves data gathering & analysis, and buyer personas. vDiscover our range of other resources to help improve your marketing strategy including guides, infographics, blogs and videos over at https://www.hurree.co/resources.Enjoy! 

Staying ahead of the digital-marketing-game can be tough, especially in a world of constantly evolving trends and practices. Queue: The Marketing Mix.The marketing mix is an acronym that encompasses 7Ps: Product, Place, Price,  Promotion, Physical Evidence, People, and Processes. In this podcast, you're going to learn how every aspect of this awesome little acronym takes you one step closer to success: by analyzing, and therefore optimizing, your business according to each ‘P' of the marketing mix, you can ensure that your marketing strategy is as streamlined as possible as it keeps your employees happy, your customers satisfied and your business efforts flowing. Discover our range of other resources to help improve your marketing strategy including guides, infographics, blogs and videos over at https://www.hurree.co/resources.

 LinksVictoria Doxat https://www.linkedin.com/in/victoria-doxat/ https://victoriadoxat.com Books:Influence – Robert Cialdini: https://amzn.to/2ITaRtf Enjoy the Episode - Happy Marketing!www.marketingstudylab.co.uk https://www.linkedin.com/in/petersumpton/ https://www.facebook.com/groups/marketingstudylab/ https://twitter.com/cousinp81(@cousinp81)   The communications mix and the marketing mix are two very different things, but they are also intertwined, which we’ll find out about later on. First, let’s meet Victoria Doxat, a copywriter who specialises copy, - or should that be content…… Victoria will explain the difference in a minute - for B2B clients ranging from entrepreneurs and SMEs, to large corporations. It takes a special kind of person to be able to go deep into topics that others may find boring and turn them into readable and valuable content, but Victoria does this by producing articles, case studies and even white papers and is anything but boring. Oh, Victoria is also a Philosophy Lecturer, as you do, with all that free time, because copywriting is easy, right?   Takeaways - So it seems there is a bit of a difference between content and copy. Victoria explained that copy aims to sell something, whereas content provides the audience with the information they need to make a valid decision….. but is there a real difference? I’ll let you decided. As long as it has good intentions, it’s all good for me. - There are some tips that Victoria kindly shared with us that can be used in most writing situations. Including Marketing Assignments: - Write for a specific purpose and remember this (always have the brief, task or question in from of you) - Use headings and structure to make your writing easy to follow and a basis for the main topics you want to cover - Then , do your research – research the simple things first. Remember Google is your friend for this in most instances - Start to slot your findings under each appropriate heading - And finally, once you have done this, you can start to structure your assignment or content and make it readable. This doesn't have to be done until the other steps are complete, so don’t think you have to get it right first time or that it can’t change later on. It’s a process, not carved in stone. - When writing assignments or in an exam, make sure you are making it interesting and don't be afraid to get creative. We’ve heard this before but it’s worth reiterating – Remember who is reading your content and make sure it resonates with them, but in our own language, our tone, so it is undeniably yours.   Top Tip – The Comms Mix and Marketing Mix Confusion This is a very brief, but massively important tip and its about, what so many do without noticing it and this is confusing the Extended / Digital Marketing Mix (7P’s) with a Marketing Communication Mix. Now they are intrinsically linked and you cant have one without the other, but in short: Extended / Digital Marketing Mix = 7Ps. Covering all elements such as price and people which we have been discussing on the previous eight episodes (no I haven’t gone mad, one was a round-up of the 7P’ s). Marketing Communications Mix = Is part of the Promotional element of the 7Ps. Think of this as the elements that your consumers actually see and are engaged by – the tip of the marketing mix iceberg – your content, communication channels and calls to action if you like. Don't get the two mixed up or confused. The world won’t end, but I’m not prepared to try it to see if it would!   Music Featured on this Podcast:Sleepy in the Garden Lobo Loco www.musikbrause.de Creative Commons License

In dieser Folge erfährst du, wie du mit Hilfe der 7Ps dein Marketing strategisch ausrichtest und so nachhaltig erfolgreich Kunden gewinnst. Facebook: www.facebook.com/Maraswortgeschichten/ Instagram: www.instagram.com/Maras_wort_geschichten/ Gratis Workbook für deinen Kundenavatar: bit.ly/marasbrandnews Wenn dir die Folge gefällt, dann hinterlasse eine 5-Sterne-Bewertung, abonniere den Podcast und gib mir ein Feedback auf iTunes. Vielen lieben Dank und sonnige Grüße.

Allez Le Business! Join Stephen & Spongebob Squarepants for some last minute tips, tricks, and stress busters before A Level Business Paper 1 tomorrow. We tackle the 7Ps (what else were we going to cover?), labour productivity, capacity utilisation and the top stuff. Ideal for preparing you for your A Level Business Paper 1 exam (and frankly chilling out a little bit). For more info, check out https://www.senecalearning.com/blog/a-level-revision/.

Welcome to the 14th muse on the Introvert Biz Growth podcast, the show where I talk to introverts who grow their business and make a difference. I’m Sarah Santacroce, your host. It’s time for another muse episode, unedited, raw content. No intro music. No bells and whistles. I share these muses to make you think, to inspire you, to break the rules and to invite you to be part of the Gentle Business Revolution. In muse 13, two weeks ago I shared my vision of The Gentle Business Revolution and invited you to join its Gentle Business Alliance. Go back to that episode if you’ve missed. Today’s episode is focused on Anxiety-Free Marketing, the building block of The Gentle Business Revolution. The main mission of the Gentle Business Revolution is to bring more kindness and empathy to the business world. And who says business, says marketing. And as you might know, I’ve been part of this Online Marketing world for over a decade. So it was clear to me that the way we could bring more gentleness to the business world would have to start with a different way of marketing. I've been wearing a mask in marketing for many years. I've lost track of my authenticity countless times in an effort to blend in, to belong, to succeed. I was marketing my business wearing a Chameleon Suit. That suit gave me comfort, because it was fitting for any kind of situation, any kind of client. And with that suit on, I was so adaptable: I blindly followed advice of all the big marketing gurus out there. I tried a little bit of everything. I changed my color depending on the situation. But no more I’m sick and tired of faking it. And I’m sick and tired of seeing other people fake it and using manipulation in marketing. I decided it was time for a different approach! A way to market my business authentically & with integrity. According to my values & beliefs. A gentle & kind way. Without anxiety. Without fear of how other people will think of me. And that's what I'd like to share with you. In January of this year I launched the building block of The Gentle Business Revolution, a new kind of marketing program that I called Anxiety-Free Marketing. 10 brave souls took me up on my invite and joined me on this journey. We spent 10 weeks together, we laughed, we cried, we co-created a marketing paradigm shift, a holistic way to market ourselves. Leisa Peterson, who’s also my personal business coach was one of the participants and I’m excited to share this interview with her where she shares her experience. Interview with Leisa Well, I just announced a 2nd beta round of Anxiety-Free Marketing and here’s why: I see this as my life’s work, together with the Gentle Business Revolution. So if this is supposed to have the impact I want it to have, I know I need to co-create this program together with the ideal client. Too many times have I just created something because I thought there was a need, and then have it be a complete flop. When my mom and I looked at my astrology themes for this year ‘Learning’ was the big one. And boy am I learning. I’m learning to trust in the process. I’m learning to not be perfect. I’m learning what people yearn for. I’m learning that sometimes showing up is good enough. I’m learning to open my heart and let people in. I’m learning to accept myself just the way I am. And it’s all good.   So let me tell you a bit more about Anxiety-Free Marketing Anxiety-Free MarketingTM is a different kind of marketing program. It is a 8-week live virtual training program that reveals an unconventional approach to marketing so that you can grow a successful business that is no longer kept small by fear of what others think. It is designed to not only help you grow your business with ethical marketing practices but also create a more meaningful life – and make the world a better place. Anxiety-Free Marketing is based on a re-modeled version of the 7P’s of Marketing.   This new model is represented in the form of a Mandala, with ourselves in the middle so we can market from within. Why a Mandala ? Because when I looked at the traditional version of the 7Ps and thought that I want to represent marketing as a process coming from within ourselves, this visual of a Mandala came to me. I had been coloring mandalas in the past, so it was intriguing me to do more research. I spoke to some experts and took a course on Mandalas and finally came up with my own representation of the 7Ps of Marketing in the form of a Mandala. My son drew it for me and everything in AFM is now based on this Mandala, even the logo. What I like about it is that the definition of a mandala is that it’s a creative process. It is creative process that brings us closer to centre. Mandalas are also described as cosmic diagrams - attempting to represent the essential elements of the macrocosm in an ordered, coherent manner. Exactly. All the 7Ps (Passion, Personal Power, People, Product, Pricing, Promotion and Partnerships) are essential elements of anxiety-free marketing. And we as the marketer are the center. We market from within. In AFM we cover each of the Ps in one module, oscillating back and forth between the being and the doing, the inner work and the outer work. Who is it for? It is for Heart-centered entrepreneurs who feel anxiety around marketing their business AND Entrepreneurs who are tired of the traditional marketing model and are ready for a paradigm shift. This is not a beginner course, it applies to all levels, whether you’re just starting out or have been in business since 20 years. So if any of this speaks to you, I’d love to have you join us for this 2nd beta round and help to co-create this marketing paradigm shift. We start on May 6th and you can find out all the details on http://www.anxietyfreemarketing.com. I’m also hosting a free 1-Page Marketing Plan workshop on April 26th if you’d like to attend that one first. Details are on the same page at http://www.anxietyfreemarketing.com And if you’re listening to this podcast after May 6th you can still visit http://www.anxietyfreemarketing.com because I will turn this into an online program with video content that gives you access to attend one of the live courses in either January or September. So visit http://www.anxietyfreemarketing.com now or send me an email to sarah@sarahsantacroce.com for more info.   Thanks for listening.

Welcome to the 6th muse on the Introvert Biz Growth podcast, the show where I talk to introverts who grow their business and make a difference. I’m Sarah Santacroce, your host. If you’re new here, then I want you to know that this is not the usual format of my regular episodes. I post a new show every other Friday, and it’s always a conversation with a fellow introverted entrepreneur who uses his or her introverted superpowers to make a difference. These shows are edited by Tim, my professional podcast editors who also creates amazing shownotes pages.   But today’s episode is a muse, unedited, raw content. No intro music. No bells and whistles. I share these muses to make you think, to inspire you, to break the rules and to eventually invite you to the Gentle Business Revolution, when it’s ready. Today’s muse is again composed of 2 parts: first I muse by myself about Mandalas and how they relate to Marketing and then I’ll also share a quick conversation I had with Tom Schwab, another previous podcast guest, fellow introvert and friend of mine about the topic ‘Marketing with Integrity’. So let’s talk about Mandalas and Marketing. I want to start out by reading a quote by Raj Sisodia. " The 21st Century Marketing Paradigm reflects a customer centric mindset that turns marketers into healers where our role is to cure, restore health, soundness and spiritual wholeness." It's a beautiful quote, isn't it?  If you’re on my mailing list you might have seen that I’m currently beta-launching a new kind of marketing program. As I was coming up with the outline for this program I kept thinking back to this quote. And then when I researched the 7Ps of Marketing online, a traditional Marketing model, I saw it very clearly Yes, the Conscious Marketing process is represented in the form of a Mandala. Why a Mandala? "Mandala" is sanskrit for "circle", "essence", or "container". Any creative process that happens in circle can be referred to as a mandala. It is creative process that brings us closer to center Mandalas are cosmic diagrams - attempts to represent the essential elements of the macrocosm in an ordered, coherent manner. Carl Jung, in his exploration of his own interior life, began to make mandalas and discovered how good the process was for helping him peel away the layers and get to his center. He used them in therapy to help others get to their center. So the mandala will guide participants through the program as we discover the conscious version of the 7 Ps. Passion Personal Power People Product Pricing Promotion Process Curious? I’m creating this program for you, dear fellow introvert. The working title is ‘Anxiety-Free Marketing for the Conscious Entrepreneur’. I’m looking for a small group of business owners who are tired of the main stream marketing advice that gives us anxiety and are looking for a  more holistic approach to marketing, one that is aligned with our values, with our strong moral principles. I invite you to check out this Marketing Paradigm Shift that will help you to finally achieve your true potential of a quiet leader. Go to sarahsantacroce.com/anxietyfreemarketing to check out all the details. We start on January 3rd. And now as promised, here’s my conversation with Tom Schwab about the topic ‘Marketing with Integrity and what that means to him. Thanks for listening ! Thanks so much for listening to this muse. Again, if the Mandala idea and the idea of Anxiety-Free Marketing piqued your interest, please check out sarahsantacroce.com/anxietyfreemarketing Have a wonderful week

Czy śmierć jest dobrym tematem na pierwszy podcast? Nieco kontrowersyjny, dotykający tabu odcinek mający swoje źródło w emocjach towarzyszących naszej podróży do Nepalu. Przede wszystkim chcielibyśmy wprowadzić Was w temat hinduizmu, z dużym naciskiem na jego filozofię życia i śmierci, przeprowadzimy Was przez ceremonię pogrzebową w obrządku hinduistycznym, by zastanowić się skąd wynika tabu śmierci i czy jest nam ono do czegokolwiek potrzebne? Podcast Podróże Słoni o podróżach w głąb, odkrywaniu kultury, religii i prawdziwego życia w różnych zakątkach świata.

This Sunday's Readings:Ezek 2:1-7Ps 1232 Cor 12:2-10Mark 6:1-6

Tras el éxito de su podcast insignia ‘IdeaCast’ ‘Harvard Business Review’ lanzará dos nuevos podcasts. Entérate de las tendencias del podcasting en cinco minutos. NotiPod Hoy: Tu resumen diario para mantenerte al día con el podcasting Tendencias ‘IdeaCast’ lleva doce años produciéndose y recibe más de un millón de descargas mensuales. ‘Women at Work' (‘Mujeres en el trabajo) y 'Dear HBR' (‘Querido HBR’) son los nuevos podcasts. Según El Blog MediaPost la revista quiere explorar a los podcasts como un medio de ingresos viable a medida que se mueve más a la esfera digital. ‘Women at Work’, que se lanzó esta semana, es una serie emergente que cubre el género y el lugar de trabajo, ‘Dear HBR’, es un programa de consejos que cubre los dilemas del trabajo y se lanzará el 6 de febrero. ↳ Lección: La popularidad de artículos en un blog nos puede indicar la necesidad de un nuevo podcast. ‘Mujeres en el trabajo’ surgió cuando Maureen Hoch, editora de HBR.org, notó que algunos de los artículos más leídos en el sitio eran sobre investigaciones relacionadas con el género en el trabajo. Después del auge del movimiento #MeToo, Hoch pensó que podría haber una audiencia para un podcast sobre este tema. ¿Cómo aplicar las 4P del marketing a un podcast? Las tradicionales 4P de la mezcla de mercadeo han sido: Producto (¿Qué beneficios ofreces a tus clientes?), Precio (¿Qué valor tiene lo que provees?), Punto de venta (¿Qué canales de ventas y formas de comercialización utilizaras?) y Promoción (¿Cómo vas a dar a conocer tu producto o servicio?). El blog de ‘Zencastr’ explica en un artículo cómo aplicar estas 4P de marketing para comercializar un podcast. Pero cambiaron la “P de producto” por la “P de podcast”. También añadieron otras tres extendiéndolas a 7Ps. Las 3P adicionales son: personas (¿Cómo te vas a relacionar con los oyentes para que regresen?), procesos (¿Cuales son los procesos que usarás para minimizar los costos?) y Posicionamiento de marca (¿Cómo conseguirás que los oyentes relacionen tu marca con el tema del podcast?) Tonia Maffeo, directora de marketing de la nueva empresa ‘Voxnest’ aseguró a NotiPod Hoy que los podcasters que usan ‘Spreaker’ y ‘Blog talk Radio’ no tienen porqué preocuparse. Tonia dijo en el audio de nuestro podcast que ‘Hive’ es un CMS mucho más complejo que lo que conocemos y permite gestionar grandes cantidades de contenidos. Dice Tonia: “Hive es una herramienta mucho más profesional pensada para los publicadores o los grandes productores de contenido”. ¿A quién pertenece tu podcast? en un artículo del Blog ‘Pacific Content’ (una empresa que produce podcasts para terceros) analizan por qué deberías repensar el flujo RSS de tu podcast. Recomiendan hospedar el feed del podcast en una URL que poseas y controlas. Ellos aseguran que no es difícil mantener la propiedad del flujo del RSS de tu programa. Pero requiere trabajo adicional. En ‘Pacific Content’, usan FeedPress para alojar las fuentes de los podcasts de sus clientes. Luego, utilizan el nombre de host personalizado de ‘FeedPress’ para habilitar las redirecciones ‘CNAME’ del dominio propiedad de sus clientes a ‘FeedPress’. ↳ Algunos podcasters lo configuran a través de ‘FeedBurner’ de Google habilitando su función ‘MyBrand’. Esto es muy riesgoso porque el futuro a largo plazo de ‘FeedBurner’ es incierto. Mantente al día. El mundo del podcasting está cambiando diariamente. Recibe en tu correo electrónico, de lunes a viernes, información sobre las tendencias del podcasting y recursos útiles para actualizar tu estrategia, crear o llevar un podcast a un nuevo nivel. Únete y recibe el boletín de Vía Podcast en tu email. ¡Subscríbete y no te pierdas nada!  

This Sunday's Readings:Isaiah 45:1-7Ps. 961 Thess 1:1-10Matt 22:15-22

Thursday, January 21, 2016Memorial of Saint Agnes, Virgin and Martyr====================================== 1Sm 18:6-9;19:1-7Ps 56:2-3,9-10a,10b-11,12-13Mk 3:7-12 Response: In God I trust; I shall not fear.

Sunday, January 10, 2016The Baptism of the Lord====================================== Is 42:1-4,6-7Ps 29:1-2,3-4,9-10Acts 10:34-38Lk 3:15-16,21-22 Response: The Lord will bless his people with peace.

Foundations of Amateur Radio Amateur Radio is as much about having fun as it is about learning. Sometimes they go hand-in-hand, sometimes not so much. The 7Ps of Amateur Radio are as valid today as they were 100 years ago, Proper Planning and Preparation Prevents Piss Poor Performance. Amateur Radio Planning can take many forms, but the basics include creating a permanent checklist. The notion of creating one every time means that you forget every time what you learned last time, so if you create a permanent one and then revise it from time-to-time, you'll be able to incorporate lessons learned, like "bring the radio face-plate control cable", and "bring the quarter inch jack adaptor", so you don't end up repeating the same lesson over and over. Test your gear at home. Not just turn it on, but set up the mast, check that you have guy wires and anchors. Check that you have enough coax to connect your antenna to your radio, spare batteries, etc. One trick I learned recently is to have a red and green label or elastic band. Attach the appropriate colour to your batteries, so you can instantly see if the battery you're lifting up is charged or not. Look at maps, bring instructions to get to places, look at Google Earth and remember that power lines might not show up on a satellite map, but they're sure going to annoy you when you get on air. Street view is handy to check out power-lines. Try different antennas. Verticals are easy to setup, but sometimes depending on your location they can be noisy. Dipoles need two supports, but an inverted V only needs one. Wire antennas can be simple to make and cheap to get bits for and repair, but they're not like the yagi you left at home. A really helpful comment I read from Julie VK3FOWL and Joe VK3YSP is that you shouldn't be embarrassed by your hobby. Be seen, be visible, talk to people. You'll be amazed at the amount of interest you get, people are curious, they'll sticky-beak whenever they can. Amateur Radio is not the only thing you can do when you're out and about. Go for walks, go hiking, fishing or drink beer around the campfire, whatever floats your boat. Just like you can see stars at night in the bush, you can hear radio when you're away from interference. You'll hear stuff you never heard before and likely you'll get hooked into either astronomy or radio in the bush, or both. There is much more to discuss about planning, but the basic premise is that it pays to think through the activity, the process of packing, driving, setting up, operating, living on-site, packing up and driving back. Think about food, safety, emergencies, fuel, and remember, Amateur Radio is not worth dying over, this is a hobby. Laugh, have fun, be merry. Yes, in case you're wondering, the 7Ps don't come from Amateur Radio, but just like the US Marine Corps Antenna Handbook, search for "r3403c", we can learn lots from them about both antennas and planning. I'm Onno VK6FLAB