Podcast appearances and mentions of mike ovitz

Founders ✓ Claim Key Takeaways  Best Michael Ovitz quotes: “Insecurity and ambition make a powerful cocktail.” “I didn't want to be standard in any way.”“I would have been much happier if I hadn't been so determined to appear all-knowing and invulnerable.”“Everyone stopped. I didn't stop.” Lew Wasserman's five rules that created his Hollywood empire 1. Tend to the client 2. Dress appropriately 3. Never divulge information about the firm 4. Do your homework 5. Never leave the office without returning every single phone call Michael Ovitz's founding principle for CAA1. All founding members get even equity 2. Get big fast 3. Share all clients and serve them as a group; no turf wars and no silos 4. Tell the truth 5. Create opportunities instead of waiting around for them Belief comes before ability: “I believe that nobody wants to be treated just as they are. People want to feel encouraged to become more than what they are, to become the best versions of themselves.” CAA poached talent by assumption: The firm behaved as if the talent was already their client, then made their dreams happen before ever even signing them Do the job before you are hiredKnow your customer's problem and present yourself as the solutionRealize that your “good times” are now: Thirty years from now, you will probably regret how you spent your time  Channeling Charlie Munger: Your goal in life should be to build a seamless web of deserved trust; work with the people in this web, and do life with these people – it is all about the people Read the full notes @ podcastnotes.orgAt the core of Michael Ovitz's success is his relentless work ethic and commitment to mastering his craft. 50 years ago he founded Creative Artists Agency. CAA starts out as just five young guys in a run down office and eventually becomes the most powerful agency in the world. Ovitz's autobiography explains how that happened. As the Wall Street Journal wrote: When the history of Hollywood is written, few people will have played a larger role than Michael Ovitz. This episode is what I learned from reading (for the 2nd time!) Who Is Michael Ovitz?: The Rise and Fall (and Rise) of the Most Powerful Man in Hollywood by Michael Ovitz. ----Ramp gives you everything you need to control spend, watch your costs, and optimize your financial operations —all on a single platform. Make history's greatest entrepreneurs proud by going to Ramp and learning how they can help your business control your costs and save more. ----Vesto: All of your company's financial accounts in one view. Connect and control all of your business bank accounts from one dashboard. Go to Vesto and schedule a demo with the founder Ben. Tell him David sent you. ----Founders Notes gives you the ability to tap into the collective knowledge of history's greatest entrepreneurs on demand. Use it to supplement the decisions you make in your work.  Get access to Founders Notes here. ----Join my free email newsletter to get my top 10 highlights from every book ----Founders Notes gives you the ability to tap into the collective knowledge of history's greatest entrepreneurs on demand. Use it to supplement the decisions you make in your work. Get access to Founders Notes here. ----“I have listened to every episode released and look forward to every episode that comes out. The only criticism I would have is that after each podcast I usually want to buy the book because I am interested so my poor wallet suffers. ” — GarethBe like Gareth. Buy a book: All the books featured on Founders Podcast

Founders ✓ Claim Key Takeaways  Best Michael Ovitz quotes: “Insecurity and ambition make a powerful cocktail.” “I didn't want to be standard in any way.”“I would have been much happier if I hadn't been so determined to appear all-knowing and invulnerable.”“Everyone stopped. I didn't stop.” Lew Wasserman's five rules that created his Hollywood empire 1. Tend to the client 2. Dress appropriately 3. Never divulge information about the firm 4. Do your homework 5. Never leave the office without returning every single phone call Michael Ovitz's founding principle for CAA1. All founding members get even equity 2. Get big fast 3. Share all clients and serve them as a group; no turf wars and no silos 4. Tell the truth 5. Create opportunities instead of waiting around for them Belief comes before ability: “I believe that nobody wants to be treated just as they are. People want to feel encouraged to become more than what they are, to become the best versions of themselves.” CAA poached talent by assumption: The firm behaved as if the talent was already their client, then made their dreams happen before ever even signing them Do the job before you are hiredKnow your customer's problem and present yourself as the solutionRealize that your “good times” are now: Thirty years from now, you will probably regret how you spent your time  Channeling Charlie Munger: Your goal in life should be to build a seamless web of deserved trust; work with the people in this web, and do life with these people – it is all about the people Read the full notes @ podcastnotes.orgAt the core of Michael Ovitz's success is his relentless work ethic and commitment to mastering his craft. 50 years ago he founded Creative Artists Agency. CAA starts out as just five young guys in a run down office and eventually becomes the most powerful agency in the world. Ovitz's autobiography explains how that happened. As the Wall Street Journal wrote: When the history of Hollywood is written, few people will have played a larger role than Michael Ovitz. This episode is what I learned from reading (for the 2nd time!) Who Is Michael Ovitz?: The Rise and Fall (and Rise) of the Most Powerful Man in Hollywood by Michael Ovitz. ----Ramp gives you everything you need to control spend, watch your costs, and optimize your financial operations —all on a single platform. Make history's greatest entrepreneurs proud by going to Ramp and learning how they can help your business control your costs and save more. ----Vesto: All of your company's financial accounts in one view. Connect and control all of your business bank accounts from one dashboard. Go to Vesto and schedule a demo with the founder Ben. Tell him David sent you. ----Founders Notes gives you the ability to tap into the collective knowledge of history's greatest entrepreneurs on demand. Use it to supplement the decisions you make in your work.  Get access to Founders Notes here. ----Join my free email newsletter to get my top 10 highlights from every book ----Founders Notes gives you the ability to tap into the collective knowledge of history's greatest entrepreneurs on demand. Use it to supplement the decisions you make in your work. Get access to Founders Notes here. ----“I have listened to every episode released and look forward to every episode that comes out. The only criticism I would have is that after each podcast I usually want to buy the book because I am interested so my poor wallet suffers. ” — GarethBe like Gareth. Buy a book: All the books featured on Founders Podcast

What I learned from having an intense and fun 3 hour dinner with Michael Ovitz. 1: Mediocrity is always invisible until passion shows up and exposes it.2: There's no ceiling on where you can push your profession.3: Don't be unequally yoked. Pick partners that have the same ambition as you.4: Read biographies. Know everything about the history of your industry.5. Have a profound sense of belief. The world is very malleable. 6: There's opportunity hiding in plain sight.7: By endurance we conquer. 8: Work 10% less. Optimize for the long term. 9. Surround yourself with people who will tell you the truth.10: Retirement is lame.----Ramp gives you everything you need to control spend, watch your costs, and optimize your financial operations —all on a single platform. Make history's greatest entrepreneurs proud by going to Ramp and learning how they can help your business control your costs and save more. ----Founders Notes gives you the ability to tap into the collective knowledge of history's greatest entrepreneurs on demand. Use it to supplement the decisions you make in your work.  Get access to Founders Notes here. ----Join my free email newsletter to get my top 10 highlights from every book ----Founders Notes gives you the ability to tap into the collective knowledge of history's greatest entrepreneurs on demand. Use it to supplement the decisions you make in your work. Get access to Founders Notes here. ----“I have listened to every episode released and look forward to every episode that comes out. The only criticism I would have is that after each podcast I usually want to buy the book because I am interested so my poor wallet suffers. ” — GarethBe like Gareth. Buy a book: All the books featured on Founders Podcast

At the core of Michael Ovitz's success is his relentless work ethic and commitment to mastering his craft. 50 years ago he founded Creative Artists Agency. CAA starts out as just five young guys in a run down office and eventually becomes the most powerful agency in the world. Ovitz's autobiography explains how that happened. As the Wall Street Journal wrote: When the history of Hollywood is written, few people will have played a larger role than Michael Ovitz. This episode is what I learned from reading (for the 2nd time!) Who Is Michael Ovitz?: The Rise and Fall (and Rise) of the Most Powerful Man in Hollywood by Michael Ovitz. ----Ramp gives you everything you need to control spend, watch your costs, and optimize your financial operations —all on a single platform. Make history's greatest entrepreneurs proud by going to Ramp and learning how they can help your business control your costs and save more. ----Vesto: All of your company's financial accounts in one view. Connect and control all of your business bank accounts from one dashboard. Go to Vesto and schedule a demo with the founder Ben. Tell him David sent you. ----Founders Notes gives you the ability to tap into the collective knowledge of history's greatest entrepreneurs on demand. Use it to supplement the decisions you make in your work.  Get access to Founders Notes here. ----Join my free email newsletter to get my top 10 highlights from every book ----Founders Notes gives you the ability to tap into the collective knowledge of history's greatest entrepreneurs on demand. Use it to supplement the decisions you make in your work. Get access to Founders Notes here. ----“I have listened to every episode released and look forward to every episode that comes out. The only criticism I would have is that after each podcast I usually want to buy the book because I am interested so my poor wallet suffers. ” — GarethBe like Gareth. Buy a book: All the books featured on Founders Podcast

From founding CAA to leading Universal Studios, Ron Meyer built one of the entertainment industry's most storied careers. The high school dropout and former Marine talks with Richard Rushfield about his entire legendary run, especially the events surrounding the pivotal moment in 1995 when he successfully executed a maneuver that has stymied other sharks — leaving the talent ecosystem (and ending his partnership with CAA cofounder Mike Ovitz — "a marriage gone kind of sour”) to become a studio head. He also recalls what lured him to Hollywood ("I want to be the guy in that fast car with beautiful women"), the “ferocious” competition between his agency and William Morris, his “tug-of-war” with Barry Diller at Universal (where he lasted 25 years and survived six owners), the movies he's proudest of and why he's still an optimist about showbiz. “To the day I left Universal, I pinched myself,” he says of his Hollywood journey, which ended with his exit from the studio in 2020. “I always thought it was a miracle.” Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Topics: (00:00:00) - Intro (00:03:24) - Recapping FoundersOnly Conference (00:36:36) - Helping others first (00:44:32) - Baldridge updates & the power of working hard (01:03:46) - How do you want to spend your time? (01:10:38) - Great book recs, Scribe, and the knowledge gap (01:44:38) - Unethical founders (02:00:56) - Optimizing for usefulness Links: Founders Podcast Mitchell Baldridge on X Get in touch with Mitchell David Senra on X Perplexity AI Books: Hard Drive by James Wallace So Good They Can't Ignore You by Cal Newport Born Standing Up by Steve Martin Jerry Seinfeld in GQ Zero to One by Peter Thiel To support the costs of producing this podcast:  >> Buy a copy of the Navalmanack: www.navalmanack.com/  >> Buy a copy of The Anthology of Balaji: https://balajianthology.com/ >> Sign up for my online course and community about building your Personal Leverage: https://www.ejorgenson.com/leverage  >> Invest in early-stage companies alongside Eric and his partners at Rolling Fun: https://angel.co/v/back/rolling-fun >> Join the free weekly email list at ejorgenson.com/newsletter >> Text the podcast to a friend >> Or at least give the podcast a positive review to help us reach new listeners!  Important quotes from David Senra and Mitchell Baldridge: "People don't see things as they are, we see them as we are. And so like we could write a book on this two-hour or whatever long conversation we've had and every single person's going to have a different perspective." — David Senra "I'm here to be the best in the world at what I'm doing. And then you get around other people like that. Like we just talked about Mike Ovitz. You think he was optimizing for days on the golf course?" — David Senra “I wake up every day more obsessed to the point where, like, if this continues, we're going to have to be concerned about me. And what I love is I'm really trying to go after it.” — David Senra "Books don't have to make money to make you money." — Mitchell Baldridge "Mute the world and build your own world and it's like part of building your own world you don't want to start from zero like a feral child in the middle of the woods." — Mitchell Baldridge

Mark Barabak, the veteran political reporter and columnist for the L.A. Times, has just helmed a six-part series analyzing the political evolutions across the New West - Arizona, California, Colorado, Nevada, New Mexico, and Oregon.  In this conversation, Mark talks his recent series, touches on the politics in all six of these states, and breaks down what it says about the trajectory of the region and the impact on the national landscape. He also mines his reporter's notebook to talk some of his favorite stories and personalities from 35+ years covering politics.IN THIS EPISODEMark talks how he was drawn to working in political journalism...The one state Mark hasn't covered yet...What led Mark to helm his recent series on the New West...The biggest surprise in the recent political evolution of the West...How much remains of the historical, libertarian political character of the West...How Cindy McCain has recently played an important symbolic role in Arizona politics...Mark on Governor Jared Polis and political trajectory of Colorado...Why emigration from California is not helping Republicans in the rest of the region...Mark talks the importance of Latino voters in the West...Mark's take on what it would take for Republicans to finally break through in Oregon...What Bend, OR reveals about politics in the state...How resilient is Democratic strength in the West if the party moves more to the left...How Bill Clinton muscled California into becoming a safe Democratic state...The anecdote Mark has waited 30 years to use...Mark recalls the importance of the Berman/Waxman So Cal "machine" and Northern CA's Burton "machine"...Mark's memories covering Nancy Pelosi's political career from her very first race in the 80s...Mark weighs in on the '24 California open Senate seat...The most charismatic politicians Mark has seen over the years...AND 801 Chophouse, accelerants, Joe Biden, Barbara Boxer, Harry Britt, broad libertarian streaks, Pat Brown, Ron Brown, Willie Brown, bundling, Sala Burton, George H.W. Bush, George W. Bush, California tattoos, criminal malpractice, Gray Davis, Michael Dukakis, election deniers, John Emerson, extractive industries, fingertip sensitivity, Diane Feinstein, Greek Lit, Kamala Harris, Peter Hart, John Hickenlooper, the hoi polloi, Mark Kelly, Ted Kennedy, John Kerry, Kari Lake, Adam Laxalt, Barbara Lee, Mel Levine, Bill Lunch, Maricopa County, Blake Masters, Leo McCarthy, Narragansett, Grover Norquist, Tip O'Neill, Mike Ovitz, Leon Panetta, Pablo Picasso, Katie Porter, RINOs, Ronald Reagan, Dick Riordan, Brian Sanderoff, Adam Schiff, John Seymour, Derek Shearer, Bob Shrum, sourdough bread, unhelpful quotes, Pete Wilson...& more!

IN THIS EPISODE, YOU'LL LEARN:00:03:02 - How Guy Spier's ancestors lost their family fortune and became refugees in the 1930s.00:11:41 - How Guy was shaped by this story and embarked on a quest to restore their lost fortune.00:24:20 - Why investors need to recognize that nothing is stable and everything changes.00:28:12 - Why Guy settled in Switzerland and why he worries about the future of the U.S.00:35:34 - Why he doesn't like Bitcoin or gold, preferring to own “productive assets.”00:45:11 - Why it's critical to invest in a way that's true to your own nature.00:51:00 - Why so many highly intelligent and talented fund managers end up failing.00:59:45 - How the crash of overvalued growth stocks proves again that “price really does matter.”01:03:17 - Why Nick Sleep's concept of “destination analysis” is such a valuable filter for investors. 01:14:08 - How to prosper by owning great businesses that occupy the “economic high ground.” 01:27:00 - Why it's so important to size your bets correctly and not get too carried away.01:36:31 - How Guy clones people like Warren Buffett and Mike Ovitz, yet tries to be true to himself.01:44:34 - How Buffett taught him that every person is an equal soul and should carry equal weight.01:48:38 - What Buffett figured out about the benefits of becoming more lovable and kinder.*Disclaimer: Slight timestamp discrepancies may occur due to podcast platform differences.BOOKS AND RESOURCES:Related Episode: Part 2 of William Green's interview with Guy Spier - High-Performance Habits - RWH010.Stig and Preston interview Guy Spier about his book, “The Education of a Value Investor.”Stig and Preston interview Guy Spier about his $650,100 lunch with Warren Buffett. Guy Spier's book, “The Education of a Value Investor" – Read reviews of the book.Subscribe to Guy Spier's Free Newsletter.Guy Spier's podcast and website.Guy Spier interviews William Green about his book, “Richer, Wiser, Happier.” William Green's book, “Richer, Wiser, Happier” – read the reviews of this book.William Green's Twitter.Our tool for picking stock winners and managing our portfolios: TIP Finance Tool.Check out our favorite Apps and Services.Browse through all our episodes (complete with transcripts) here.Find Pros & Fair Pricing for Any Home Project for Free with Angi.Help protect your family's financial future with TD Term Life Insurance.Invest in high quality, cash flowing real estate without all of the hassle with Passive Investing.Take the next step in your working-life or get ready for a change, by being a Snooze franchise partner. To learn more, head to Snooze.com.au and scroll down the page for “franchising”.Try out Rhoback's performance polos, q-zips, or hoodies and bring a new meaning to the word comfortable. Use the code STUDY and get 20% off your first order.Confidently take control of your online world without worrying about viruses, phishing attacks, ransomware, hacking attempts, and other cybercrimes with Avast One.Personalize your plans in improving your metabolism, reducing stress, improving sleep, and omptimizing your health with InsideTracker. Use discount code TIP to get 20% off the entire InsideTracker store.Get the most from your bitcoin while holding your own keys with Unchained Capital. Begin the concierge onboarding process on their site. At the checkout, get $50 off with the promo code FUNDAMENTALS.Reclaim your health and arm your immune system with convenient, daily nutrition. Athletic Greens is going to give you a FREE 1 year supply of immune-supporting Vitamin D AND 5 FREE travel packs with your first purchase.Support our free podcast by supporting our sponsors.HELP US OUT!Help us reach new listeners by leaving us a rating and review on Apple Podcasts! It takes less than 30 seconds, and really helps our show grow, which allows us to bring on even better guests for you all! Thank you – we really appreciate it!See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

With beginnings running clubs within London's late night comedy scene, today's guest has weaved his way through a multifaceted career becoming Senior Partner at United Agents where he shepherds the careers of none other than Ricky Gervais, Stephen Merchant, Sharon Horgan and many more.In addition to his agenting, he has Executive Produced projects including Emmy nominated hit Derek, and a multitude of high profile stand up specials. I'm very excited to hear from the (rarely heard) perspective of one of the people behind the scenes holding the industry together.Today we discuss:(01:13) Duncan's early years(03:34) Working the comedy club scene(05:55) What does an agent do? (08:09) What skills make the ideal agent?  (10:36) Advice for would-be agents (13:11) Are actors and comedians still  'discovered'?(14:39) Advice for screenwriters contacting agents(15:51) Meeting Ricky Gervais for the first time(17:10) The making of The Office (UK) (20:01) Working as an Agent/Executive Producer(21:23) Duncan's Best Advice and RCR QuickfireTo make sure you don't miss any future episodes sign up for our mailing list here!If you liked the podcast, I would be very thankful if you could leave a short review on Apple podcasts! It only takes 30 seconds and really helps us grow and speak to more interesting filmmakers.Follow Red Carpet Rookies on Instagram, Twitter or Youtube

Follow us at Apple Podcasts if you like what you are hearing. And please subscribe to The Ankler at TheAnkler.com for more interviews and stories like these.Back in the mid-'90s, Maria Farmer was a promising artist with a tiny New York City apartment who had just been commissioned to create two large installations for director James L. Brooks' film As Good as It Gets. Enter Jeffrey Epstein, a well-connected patron of the arts whom she met at a gallery showing of her work, and a friend to Hollywood figures such as Mike Ovitz, Ron Burkle, Chris Tucker and Alec Baldwin. He offered her space to create the works as an artist-in-residence at the Ohio property of Victoria's Secret billionaire Les Wexner. What followed was a now-familiar story of sexual abuse at the hands of Epstein and his literal partner in crime, Ghislaine Maxwell. Those stories were at the heart of Netflix's Filthy Rich, and also are in an upcoming HBO project from Adam McKay. The now-deceased Epstein went on to become a prolific predator of underage girls, with help from Maxwell, who was found guilty in December on five out of six sex trafficking-related charges and is facing up to 65 years in prison. But his predation could have been stopped by a 2003 Vanity Fair story about the late financier. In fact, Farmer and her sister Annie, another Epstein victim, gave their on-the-record accounts to Vanity Fair writer Vicky Ward one year earlier. But their stories never made it to print, prompting The New Yorker's Isaac Chotiner to take a closer look at the circumstances surrounding the omission and who exactly was culpable (hint: Ward comes off looking even worse than former editor in chief Graydon Carter). After that publication, Ward hit back with a pair of rebuttals (What the New Yorker Got Wrong and The Last Word on the New Yorker and Isaac Chotiner). For Farmer, who was undergoing cancer treatment and didn't participate in the New Yorker story aside from a statement (she has lymphoma and brain cancer), Chotiner got it right. “Vicky Ward was, I think, a very dangerous quote journalist because she promised our safety. And then she goes and has a drinks with the people who are the perps and befriends them,” she says of Ward, who would later describe Maxwell as “passionate” and capable of “vulnerability” in another Vanity Fair story from 2011 (both stories no longer exist on the magazine's website). Says Farmer: “She's culpable for the rapes of so many women, in my opinion, because of her not reporting what she had been told and instead befriending the perps and hanging out with them and going to bars and writing about it." Indeed, even as recently as 2016, Epstein was making the rounds at the 2016 premiere of Warner Bros.' Batman vs. Superman, prompting Ankler Hot Seat co-host Tatiana Siegel to ask a Warner Brothers executive that night “why a level three registered sex offender was invited.”When asked for comment, Ward tells Siegel today, “I did do my very best to protect them, and it kills me that I failed in 2003. That is why in 2015, I did tell the story (in The Daily Beast), with their permission and support, and also wrote what had happened at Vanity Fair.”To date, Ward has profited off her relationship to the Epstein-Maxwell stories through an Audible podcast, Chasing Ghislaine, and a Discovery+ docuseries of the same name. Farmer calls those who have profited off the stories of Epstein's victims “presstitutes.”In addition to the Ward controversy, Farmer also weighs in on Prince Andrew's stunning settlement with a fellow Epstein accuser (also represented by David Boies), and the suicide hanging of Epstein accomplice Jean-Luc Brunel in a Paris jail. As for Maxwell's planned appeal, Farmer says, “Ghislaine is shameless to put the survivors through more trauma. Of course, she does not care and is desperate at this stage.” Farmer also voices her opposition to the HBO series in the works from Adam McKay based on the work of Miami Herald journalist Julie K. Brown's book, Perversion of Justice (neither HBO nor McKay responded to requests for comment), as Brown is now being sued by two other Epstein victims for her portrayals of them. She also raises objection to Netflix's Epstein documentary Filthy Rich because of Ward's participation. (Netflix declined comment.) The conversation is sobering, and reflects a rarely-discussed rift between survivors and the journalists who cash in with their #MeToo coverage. This is a public episode. If you'd like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit theankler.com/subscribe

Adam, Bryan and Gina talk about their love of Grand Funk Railroad at the top of Part 2. They then get a look at the charming midwestern Jell-O dessert that Mike August has been enjoying, and break down an op-ed on transgender spa customers. Later, Don Brewer is on the line to discuss how incredible the music of Grand Funk Railroad sounds even to this day. Adam asks him about the glory days of his rock n roll journey, and the guys go on to listen to more great music from the band. As the show wraps up, Gina reads news stories about Eric Clapton, Australia's COVID lockdowns, and more on the horrible condo collapse in Florida. Please support today's sponsors: SimpliSafe.com/ADAM Lifelock.com enter ADAM ScottsCheapFlights.com/ADAM Check out the Knockin' Doorz Down Podcast Geico.com PlutoTV

Adam opens today's show talking about getting pulled over while driving on Pacific Coast Highway on his way to the studio. The guys then take listener calls about student driver stickers, tool tunes, dudes Adam can't hang with, and schizoid personality disorder. Next up, Mike August calls in to talk about his relationships with David Sedaris, Stephen Colbert, and Steve Carell. August also talks about his time working with James ‘Babydoll' Dixon, and having to apologize to Mike Ovitz after offending him at a holiday party. Before the break, Midwestern Mom chimes in with advice for August while he's on his family vacation. Please support today's sponsors: SimpliSafe.com/ADAM Lifelock.com enter ADAM ScottsCheapFlights.com/ADAM Check out the Knockin' Doorz Down Podcast Geico.com PlutoTV

Chris Ovitz is the Co-Founder and President of OK Play. We discuss growing up in a Hollywood family, building technology-enabled media companies, life revelations during an Alabama roadtrip, "humble magnetism", launching a venture fund with the co-founder of Twitter, YouTube as a babysitter, and why the future of play is putting kids at the center of story and creation.Subscribe to our newsletter. We explore the intersection of media, technology, and commerce: sign-up linkLearn more about our market research and executive advisory: RockWater websiteListen to our weekly executive insights on Media x Commerce news: Mondays at 2pm PT on Clubhouse via @chriserwinFollow The Come Up on Twitter: @TCUpodEmail us: tcupod@wearerockwater.com---EPISODE TRANSCRIPT:Chris Erwin:Hi, I'm Chris Erwin. Welcome to The Come Up, a podcast that interviews entrepreneurs and leaders.  Chris Ovitz:There's so much guilt in general for parents, and then there's all this judgment around screen time. And I think that we forget in our little bubbles, the whole no screens thing is a privilege, that YouTube is a babysitter is real, and it's a problem. Chris Erwin:This week's episode features Chris Ovitz, the co-founder and President of OK Play. Chris grew up in LA. And like so many others, his first love was film. So he went to a Hollywood studio, but soon after, Chris became enamored with the intersection of entertainment and technology. Over the past decade, Chris has founded a handful of different companies. And most recently, him and his team are building OK Play where they're reimagining screen time for kids, and putting kids at the center of story and creation. We get into a lot of things in this episode, but a few highlights include what it's like growing up in a deeply connected Hollywood family, some life revelations during an Alabama road trip, his humble approach to building teams, and most recently, helping to launch a venture fund with Biz Stone, co-founder of Twitter. All right, this episode was a lot of fun. And Chris weaves in some pretty wild stories from his early career. Let's get into it. Chris Erwin:Let's dive back in time a little bit. Why don't you tell me about where you grew up and your childhood a little bit? Chris Ovitz:I grew up in LA. My mom and dad are both from LA. They went to UCLA. They met there. Pretty normal childhood in LA, as normal as it can be growing up in LA, lots of after school sports and just hanging out with friends, skateboarding and roller hockey and football and all sorts of stuff like that, lots of video games and film in my family. And it was a pretty traditional childhood. Chris Erwin:Okay, you are a skater as well. I was a skater growing up, I played some soccer and tennis. And then when I started hurting my ankle skateboarding, my coaches were like, "All right, that's it. Enough for you." Chris Ovitz:You were probably a much better skater than I was. I never actually got good at it. But I loved it. Yeah, I definitely spent a lot more time playing, baseball was my sport. So I played a lot of baseball growing up. Chris Erwin:Okay, cool. You mentioned that you were passionate for gaming and for film. Were there any games that you liked the most? Chris Ovitz:So I was about 15 when PlayStation 1 came out so I think that was probably the core part of my childhood gaming love and I would say Final Fantasy VII, Resident Evil. Earlier than that, I played really Super Bomberman and Mario Kart on the SNES, lots of Street Fighter, things like that. Chris Erwin:Yeah, I remember Street Fighter 2 with like Ken and Ryu and Hadouken and all that. I was like, that was a real favorite for me. Yeah, I also like being Zangief, the Russian wrestler, whatever. Chris Ovitz:Funny story, I always played as Ken Masters. And that was the name on my fake ID in high school, so yeah. Chris Erwin:Your father was in the entertainment industry. I don't know if your mother was in the entertainment industry as well. But was there any kind of like inspiration for you of the path that you want to go down as you were thinking about going to school, before you went to Brown and UCLA? Chris Ovitz:So yeah, my father was in entertainment. He started a company called Creative Artists Agency, which was one of the biggest agencies around and so it was amazing to watch and to be around. And I always thought that that was kind of the path for me. But as I got older in high school, and he had left CAA to do other stuff, he kind of left me with this big question mark on what I wanted to do. And I was like, I didn't really know what my passions were. Chris Ovitz:And so it started me on my journey. And my journey from about 18 through my late 20s was kind of a bit all over the place, but I wouldn't be who I am today without it. And my father was incredibly talented pioneer and many things in entertainment. And had I been a little more mature at 18, I think I would have realized that he was probably right, and it was best for me. So I ended up, I was fortunate enough to be accepted to Brown University. That's where he wanted me to go. I always wanted to go to UCLA because it was what I knew. Brown was amazing. I have incredible friends there. I learned a lot there. But I ended up transferring back to UCLA. I told myself that was where I wanted to go, but if I'm being honest, it was probably because I wanted to see about a girl. Chris Erwin:Okay, did you transfer like your sophomore junior year? When did you go over? Chris Ovitz:I transferred my sophomore year. So I did a year, Brown my freshman year, and then started at UCLA my sophomore year. Chris Erwin:And was UCLA what you had hoped it was going to be? Were you pumped to be there? Chris Ovitz:Yeah, it was amazing. UCLA is a great school. I had a blast. I was a history major. I just loved learning about different cultures and I studied a lot of Roman, ancient Rome and medieval history that I found that fascinating. Chris Erwin:When we were talking earlier, you said that there was some poor decisions were a pattern of your youth. So, I mean, do you bucket in like going to Brown and then going to UCLA as part of that or are you referencing something else? I'm very curious there. Chris Ovitz:For decisions, I say that a bit jokingly. But I think what I mean by that is Brown is an incredible school, and everyone would kill to be able to go there. And had I stayed there, I think it would have been amazing. But look, I was motivated by girls at that age, instead of being motivated by a passion for what I wanted to do with my life. So I think that's kind of what I did, whether it was transferring to UCLA because I had a girlfriend there at the time that I had met on winter break from Brown. I would make decisions like that, without thinking too far ahead. And I think as I got older, that's not happening. You start to think through each decision with a little more thought for the future. Chris Erwin:Well look, if there's any point in your life when you're going to be a little bit impulsive, doing that in your teens and early 20s, that's a good thing. Get that out of your system, and I would also say that having a little bit of impulse ability, or whatever the right word is, as you get older, versus not having to be so calculated all the time based on societal pressures, that's okay. Okay, so you transfer to UCLA, you graduate, and then how do you kick off your career? What type of work do you start getting into? Chris Ovitz:So again, it comes back to this really not knowing what my path was yet, not knowing what I wanted to do. I knew I loved film. The entertainment industry was in my DNA. And I knew that I wanted to be a part of it in some way, at least at that point in my life. And so I actually applied to film school. I didn't tell anyone in my family. I applied to the theater, film and television program at UCLA. I decided I was only going to tell them if I got in. I ended up getting in and had an idea that I thought I wanted to be a director. And after about a year in film school, I realized I didn't want to be a struggling artist. So I dropped out and I wanted the income. I wanted to get to work. Unfortunately, at the time, I also had suffered a really bad herniated disc and had to take some time to get a pretty significant back surgery to correct that and rehab it. And at that point, I decided to take a job. It was pretty awesome. I got the opportunity to be one of the first employees as an assistant at Paramount Vantage working for a guy named John Lesher, and that was my first real job out of college. It was an incredible experience. Chris Erwin:Awesome. And what was Paramount Vantage? Chris Ovitz:Backing up a second, John Lesher was an agent at Endeavor at the time before it was WME, and he represented clients like Scorsese and Judd Apatow and Alejandro Inarritu and all these amazing filmmakers. And he was asked to go over and run Paramount Classics, which was Paramount's independent film arm, and he was asked to rebrand it and basically start their new art house film division. I got to see him build it from the ground up. And I got to see him go through the process of building the brand, picking the brand, naming it, designing it. And there I got to really learn how important a talented team was. He had gone out and just picked the best in the industry. And then I got to watch as all these projects came together that went on to be some Academy Award winning films and really well highly, highly acclaimed films. While I was there, we were developing No Country for Old Men, There Will be Blood, all these really exciting films. But mostly, I drove the golf cart around for the most part. Chris Erwin:What a great experience I feel like right out of undergrad, and it seems that you also have some really great stories from working there about Kanye West and Judd Apatow and a few others. So please do share. Chris Ovitz:Yeah, I mean and the Kanye one's probably less interesting, but just funny. I remember him coming in for a meeting, I had to pick him in his entourage up in the golf cart and make multiple trips. And he told me he was hungry. And he asked what was on the menu, and so I had to go get him the menu from the commissary and he said he was really in the mood for grilled salmon. And so I got him some grilled salmon and brought it into the meeting and my boss was like, "What are you doing?" I was like, "Kanye wanted some food. Here it is.", and he shoo-ed me out of the office. And then the Judd Apatow story, backing up a bit. Jonah Hill was actually, before he was Jonah Hill, when he was Jonah Feldstein was in my student film at UCLA because I knew him from growing up in LA. Chris Ovitz:And Judd Apatow had come in to pitch his latest project. And I had read the script because that was one of the perks of working there. I got to be on the weekend read team and give my opinion on the scripts that they were reading. And I told Judd, and Judd had no idea who I was. I was just a kid driving a golf cart. And I said, "You need to make Jonah Hill the lead in this project." And so I'd like to think that I'm responsible for Jonah ending up in Superbad, which is probably not true. But it was funny because I was the only one, it turned out Vantage at the time, that thought we should make that movie. And so my boss John was like, "Well, if you like it so much, go and write a letter to the heads of the studio on why we should buy this film." And I did. And I was like, "This is the greatest thing ever." Chris Erwin:Hold on a second, you wrote a letter to the head of the studio for why they should buy the film Superbad. Chris Ovitz:Exactly, yes. Chris Erwin:Okay, what did you say in that letter? Chris Ovitz:I just explained why I thought it was going to be a hit. It was a very genuine, authentic letter from a nobody assistant at Paramount Vantage. But my boss respected my opinion. And he sent it to Brad Grey, who knew me and Brad was the CEO at the time. He was just a fabulous, fabulous guy, unfortunately passed away a few years ago. And they appreciated it. But they passed and it actually ended up being Warner Bros.' biggest hit that next summer. So that's my little claim to fame and moment I'm most proud of in my first job. Chris Erwin:That's an amazing story. I love coming of age movies, and Superbad is definitely very high on the list. Chris Ovitz:Yeah, I was obsessed. It was so well written, so funny. Seth Rogen, he was coming up, but he wasn't established at that point. It was a really fun read. And I was really happy to see that Jonah got cast in that part. Again, I'm pretty sure that was because of me. Chris Erwin:So that's an amazing experience. But I think you realized that entertainment wasn't for you. And you kind of changed your career trajectory a little bit. So what happens next after that? Chris Ovitz:So I think I wanted to do something that was a little more meaningful. Traditional entertainment was fine. I love stories. I think one of the reasons I started thinking about moving away, I didn't like the behavior and entertainment. There was just a lot of yelling, a lot of disrespect. It's one of the last industries where there's a true apprenticeship, which I do like about it. But everyone was kind of becoming bad Xerox copies of the bosses they had before them, and just picking up bad habits. And so there were all these things that were accepted that I didn't like, like yelling at your employees. Chris Ovitz:And so that got me starting to think about what was next. And I was fortunate enough to get hired to run business development at a early virtual world company. And this was really interesting to me, because I always loved building communities and connecting people. And this opportunity played into that in a big way, because you would, this is by the way, in about late 2005, early 2006. And we built this virtual world where you could go to virtual host virtual parties and screenings and shows, and so I was producing virtual concerts with artists like Maroon 5 and the Pussycat Dolls, Kenna. We'd set up virtual storefronts. And this is all before things like Oculus. So it was, way ahead of its time, and a lot of fun. But ultimately, it ended up being like World of Warcraft with nothing to do. It didn't really work out. But it was fun, because we were doing things like I don't know if you saw what Fortnite did with Travis Scott and other artists, these big virtual concerts. Chris Erwin:Yeah, Marshmallow and all that taking off. Chris Ovitz:Exactly. But we were doing stuff like that in 2006 at a much, much smaller scale. Chris Erwin:You mentioned how you got the job, there's a unique story behind that, right? Chris Ovitz:Yeah, so my father was quite influential, obviously. And he knew my boss at Paramount. He'd call me. He's like, "Hey, I got to borrow my son for the day." And I was like, "Sure." And so I go and fly up with my father to a couple meetings in San Francisco. My father liked to invest in tech. And he knew that I had a strong opinion about games and tech and digital media. And so he wanted me to sit in on a couple of these meetings and give my opinion. And as we're arriving at this meeting at this particular company, which at the time, it was called Doppelganger, we later changed our name to vSide, rocking small startup, only about 20 people, everyone's in the room, and they're about to make this big presentation to my father. And he's like, "I want you to observe, and then give me your opinion after Do not talk." And so of course, I talked the whole time, like, "You need to do this. I can introduce you to this person. I can help with that." I walked out of the meeting with a job offer, which was awesome. And so ultimately, my dad was happy, but he looked mortified the entire meeting. Chris Erwin:Were you intentional that you wanted to speak? Was that like acting out against your father? Or did it just naturally come up? Chris Ovitz:No, that was just because I can never keep my mouth shut. Chris Erwin:So then, right after that, we're going down this journey where you become a serial entrepreneur, I think in a few years, which we'll get to, I think a major stepping stone to that was that you went to go work at Adly, which was founded by Sean Rad, who became the founder of Tinder. So what was Adly, and what were you doing there? Chris Ovitz:Yeah, so Adly was one of the first companies to monetize the social streams for influencers, so getting Kim Kardashian to tweet on behalf of a brand. And they were pretty much the pioneer in that space. And so I knew I wanted to work in tech, but I didn't want to be in SF. The city unfortunately just wasn't for me. And I really liked my life in LA. And I was probably onto something because everyone seems to want to move down here now from up there or to Miami it seems now as of last week. Like you said, I met Sean through Dana Settle from Greycroft, who was a friend and she suggested that we think about working together, and we hit it off. And Sean's brilliant, and I was inspired by him. He's a young entrepreneur built with big, big ideas. Chris Ovitz:Obviously, I was right, in seeing something and then he moved and went on to start Tinder. But unfortunately, when we were at Adly, Facebook and Twitter weren't too excited about us monetizing their social feeds. It was ahead of its time a little bit as well. We got blocked. And that's kind of when everyone saw the writing on the wall. So after just about 10 months, that's when I departed and was lucky enough to meet my current co-founder and my co-founder of Viddy in JJ. He took a chance on me and invited me to co-found Viddy with him. And that's where my journey really gained some traction. Chris Erwin:I remember the days of when the large social platforms and tech incumbents were blocking their peers. So yeah, at Big Frame, we have built like a programmatic marketplace where our different influencer and talent clients could promote one another. YouTube shut off access to their API very quickly once they figured out what we were doing. So I definitely get the challenges there. Chris Erwin:So after this stint in Adly, but it seems like you had made the transition from like a pure play entertainment studio industry, now going into kind of like tech that's like tech talent, intersection with media as well and social. And were you feeling at this point like, "Yes, this is the path that I want to be on, that this feels much more right than where I was before this"? Chris Ovitz:Definitely. I realized that I think at that point, I realized I wanted to be an entrepreneur. I watched guys like Sean, and I was like, there's no reason I can't do this. I love creating things from scratch. I had some unfair advantages built in in the network that I had acquired and had built. I realized pretty early on that I was really good at surrounding myself with people much smarter than me, much more talented than me. And I realized that talent was everything. Chris Ovitz:I use my network to almost be an agent for the businesses that I was building or involved in. And I was able to do that at Viddy in a big way. I saw that we had something. I saw that we had a product that had market fit. It worked. JJ is one of the best product designers I've ever had the pleasure of working with. And he built a beautiful Instagram for video type product at just the right time, when everyone was craving that, when investors were craving that type of product. We met in the end of 2010. And then basically January 2011, we were starting to work on it and then we launched in April of 2011. And that's literally when Flip Cam, if you remember those handheld camcorders, they shut down in April, and we launched in April. And so it was kind of like with the death of Flip Cam was the rise of Viddy and the social mobile video wars, by the way, like our biggest competitor was Socialcam, which was started by the Justin TV guys, which ultimately became Twitch. And it was just an all out like bloodbath between us and Socialcam seeing who could grow the fastest, wild ride, wild west, extremely interesting time to be in the video space. Chris Erwin:So being a first time entrepreneur, what kind of caught you off guard or by surprise in that first experience, in going through those motions? Chris Ovitz:Once you're a founder, it's a very lonely, lonely job. And so just dealing with the emotions of the roller coaster that it is, like video ultimately was only two and a half years of my life, but it felt like 10, and so the ups and the downs. And then I think realizing how quickly you can grow something by leveraging the power of your network. We went from zero to 50 million users in a year, granted a lot of that growth came off the back of Facebook and Open Graph. Us in social can have the benefit of that. But we were the first video app to have access to Open Graph. And that was because of a relationship that we had, just shows the power of relationships and how you can use those relationships to grow things. Chris Erwin:Yeah. You mentioned that when you were at Adly, and you saw, you observed Sean, you're like, "Oh, Sean is founding these companies.", you felt empowered that you could do the same. And you felt that you had this powerful network, you had good energy to bring to the table and a certain skill set, but also awareness of what skills he didn't have. Being at Viddy, did you observe skills that you're like, "Hey, for my serial entrepreneur career to continuously progress, here's something that I really want to work on."? Chris Ovitz:You know, it's funny. Things that I really want to work on, I think what Viddy taught me was actually to focus on my strengths and not my weaknesses. So many people say you should, I just read a quote about Tom Brady, sorry to change the subject. But talking about how he's achieved the level of success that he has. One of his big tenets is focus on your weaknesses. And I used to do that too much. And so I think at Viddy, working with the team there, I realized that everyone was so good at what they did. If I was focusing on my weaknesses, there was always somebody that was going to do it better, be able to do that better. And so I spent my time focusing on my strengths. And that's when I think good things really started to happen. That was probably my biggest learning at Viddy. Chris Erwin:I agree with that very much, Chris. It's a lot easier to go from good to great versus going from bad to good. And as a leader, I think strong self awareness is really critical in saying, "Okay, here's where I'm good, here's where I'm not." But your job is to build a team, to resource a team, to build towards the bigger vision that the company has. And I have learned that there's a lot less friction, you can move a lot faster. And also just build a team where people are more complimentary and happy coming to work every day with that mindset, going from good to great. Chris Ovitz:Yeah, no, I absolutely agree. Chris Erwin:So Viddy though, you do end up selling to Fullscreen, is that right? Chris Ovitz:We did, yeah. So we were acquired by Fullscreen. In full transparency, I left before the acquisition because it was quite a roller coaster ride, and I was ready to move on and to figure out what's next. But we had built a relationship with George, the CEO and founder of Fullscreen early on. He was a friend, and we were always trying to find ways to partner together. So when things got tough at Viddy, it was just a natural home for the company. They had SVOD ambitions, and we had one of the most talented product and engineering teams around with expertise in video. So it was a no brainer. And as I said, I wanted to move on to what was next and I was pretty burnt out from that roller coaster. And at one point, we were the number one app in 49 countries. And then one day we weren't. And so I was just ready. I was ready for what was next. But it was great. Look, JJ went on to be the Chief Product Officer of Fullscreen. And Ken, our CTO went on to run their engineering team. But unfortunately, actually I'm working with them again today, which is really, really awesome. But we can come back to that. Chris Erwin:I think Fullscreen leveraged your technology to launch a streaming service, I think three to four years back. I remember that because I think there was like a lot of different Fullscreen talent clients are on it. And I think they also were licensing Friends and maybe Seinfeld. It was an interesting juxtaposition of content. But I think everyone's been learning what users actually want and don't want over the past half decade. All right, so after that, you do end up starting another company called Workpop, but you did a brief stint at Scopely. What was that pathway like? I think you said you were scratching this gamer itch that maybe you had but led quickly to something else, curious to the journey there. Chris Ovitz:Look, I always had the gamer itch and I'm always going to have the gamer itch. I love games and anything related to games. And the Scopely thing was interesting because I had promised myself since I was burnt out, I was going to take some time to recharge. But I was having lunch with a friend of mine who was at Scopely. And he was telling me how great it was. And they were going after all these big licenses. And frankly, it just sounded fun. And he was like, "Why don't you come join us?" At the time, they were still small, 50 or 60 people. And they had just come off this big hit for them, Mini Golf Madness, which I had kind of fun playing. And I also knew Walter Driver pretty well from back in the day. And I knew Eytan as well. They're the founders. And I figured that it would be a really fun place to go and join until I decided what was next. Chris Ovitz:Unfortunately, in a twist of fate, unfortunately for them, not for me, but they've done fine since anyways, but they roomed me and my co-founder from Workpop together on a company off site. He was the new VP of Product that they had hired out of Zynga. He used to run the With Friends platform there, and we hit it off and he's still one of my best friends. And we basically decided that night that we would eventually leave and start something together, we just didn't realize how soon it would be. Chris Erwin:This is like one of the first nights with a company at an off site, and you meet a new colleague, and you decide then and there like, "We're going to start a company together." That's pretty fast. Chris Ovitz:Basically, we hit it off, and we're like, "We need to do something." And I just had no idea that it would be that quickly. Chris Erwin:Yeah. Why do you think you guys vibe so well? What was special about him? Chris Ovitz:We had really complementary skill sets. He's extremely talented product executive and entrepreneur. He actually just launched his company yesterday called Mojo, which is a sports app for kids and actually to make coaches better and improve the youth sports experience, which I'm actually really excited about. And he's super talented. And yeah, we just knew it. Do you ever meet someone and you're like, you know you're going to be good friends and you know you're going to work well together? That's what it was like. And so we had fun working together at Scopely and we worked on some really fun products together. And then ultimately we decided to go into enterprise software. Chris Erwin:Hey, listeners, this is Chris Erwin, your host of The Come Up. I have a quick ask for you, if you dig what we're putting down, if you like the show, if you like our guest, it would really mean a lot if you can give us a rating wherever you listen to our show. It helps other people discover our work. And it also really supports what we do here. All right, that's it everybody. Let's get back to the interview. Chris Erwin:In under a year, you end up founding what's called Workpop. What was Workpop? Chris Ovitz:Back then, mobile job search was almost non existent. And so we wanted to build a better hiring experience for essential workers. So back then, most of the hiring platforms were really focused on building for the employer, and not the job seeker. And so we decided we wanted to build a better experience. And it was a great idea, started with great intentions. I went into that space because I wanted to prove that I could do something that was completely outside of media and entertainment. I wanted to show people that I can build a real company. Chris Ovitz:And I did that. But along the journey, which took me to places like selling door to door in places like Birmingham, Alabama, nothing wrong with Birmingham, Alabama, but I realized that wasn't where I wanted to be. And I realized that I needed to be passionate about the space. And I thought I could build anything and be excited about it as long as it was my team. I was super excited about the team, really enjoyed who I was working with. But at the end of the day, these companies take on a life of their own, and you need to be in a space that you truly, truly love. Chris Ovitz:And so that was probably my big learning with Workpop. Further, we went down the stack. It started as job seeking, and then it became hiring software. And we're building HR software. And then we were like smack in the middle of the HR tech space. And that's when I realized it wasn't for me. We were building a product for small and medium businesses, and it's just a really tough grind selling into that segment. Chris Erwin:You mentioned that you went to Birmingham, Alabama for a sales trip when you were at Workpop. What's that story? Chris Ovitz:Look, this is where I realized that I needed to get out of the enterprise software business. My partner and I were on a plane, and we were flying to Birmingham, and the only thing we were excited about was going to be the food we were going to eat in the south. We both looked to each other and kind of had this moment where it's like, "Do we really?". We were both media guys. He came from the game world, and we both kind of ended up in this space, because we had a good idea. And we landed in Birmingham, and we were staying in a motel and we were there to sell a Papa John's franchisee. And we're going in and we met with the HR team was run by this very nice, but like 80 year old woman, and really didn't understand how technology worked. And so we found ourselves selling to a lot of those customers, and it was draining. And when we both looked, we were like, "Where are we? What are we doing right now?" And I think that was the moment. Again, I don't want to take anything away from Birmingham, Alabama. But it just wasn't where I wanted to be in my life. If I was going on sales trips, I wanted to be in New York or Chicago or San Francisco or places like that. Chris Erwin:Yeah. When you landed and you were doing these sales meetings in person, did you guys feel like immediately out of place? What was going on there? Chris Ovitz:Yeah, we definitely felt out of place. And it just felt like we could never do enough. I mean, we were running the business but we were also selling the product. We didn't have some huge sales force. And so it just took a lot to gain even an inch. We felt like we were running miles to get those small wins. And so whether we are in Birmingham, Alabama, or Orlando, Florida, it was just all over the country selling software. It just wasn't what I was into. Chris Erwin:Yeah. Well, Chris, I want to go back to something that you said where when you founded Workpop, you wanted to prove that you could build something that's not in media entertainment. So it's interesting, because you start in the core of the media entertainment industry, you're working at Paramount Vantage for a very seasoned studio executive and talent agent. And then you do start working in and then founding some companies that are at the intersection of tech and media. So the sentiment that you wanted to prove that you could do something different, was that for you or was it for someone else? Chris Ovitz:I think when you have a successful father, at the end of the day, you have a bar that's set for you. And so you're always trying to live up to that bar. And everyone always has preconceived notions of how you're going to be or expectations of you. And I think everyone expected me to do something in media entertainment, expected me to use my network to bring influencers into something right or do something influencer related, and I didn't want to do that. And I needed to scratch that itch. And I'm glad I did it. And it taught me a lot and led me to where I am today. Chris Erwin:So what happens with Workpop? Do you stay there through a sale to another company or you depart before the acquisition? What happens? Chris Ovitz:At Workpop, about five years in, one of our investors Cornerstone was interested in acquiring the company and the team. There was a natural fit, and they had an SMB product that they wanted to expand on and it was a perfect fit. And so I stayed on through the acquisition, but I knew that I wasn't going to stay and run technology partnerships. A big public enterprise software learning management system company, that wasn't in my future, it wasn't for me, incredible company, really a big fan of the Cornerstone team. And Adam Miller, he's a great advisor to us. But if I was being honest with myself, it wasn't where I was going to continue my career. So I took some time off. I was a new father, a relatively new father. My son was about three at the time, and really started thinking about what I wanted to do next. Chris Erwin:Yeah, it's interesting to hear you talk about your realization moment there that hey, this is not where I want to be like in terms of your career and work. In an interview with Chas Lacaillade, who's the founder of Bottle Rocket Management, an influencer management company, on our podcast, he was on a road trip in Louisiana in the Bayou. He was selling water pumps. He was in LA. And then he was working for a water pump company out of Orange County. He was on this sales trip and realized there in a conversation with his coworker Buddy in the car, like, "Hey, I need to get back to LA. This is not the right industry for me." So you guys definitely have parallels in your story there. Chris Ovitz:Definitely a wake up call for me. Chris Erwin:Yeah, all right. So after Workpop, you then launch OK Play, which is the company that you're at right now. So what's the story of how OK Play came to be? Chris Ovitz:I mean look, it sounds cliche, but I wanted to create something for my son. I was a relatively new father. Son's three years old at the time. I was watching one day while he was a preschool, I was watching Won't You Be My Neighbor, which is the Mr. Rogers documentary. And I became incredibly inspired. This was a man that knew how to reach children, how to talk to them in a way that they felt heard and understood. He didn't treat them like little kids. He treated them like real people, just smaller people. And I thought that was fascinating. And the way he used the television to reach a very, very large audience was very similar to the way that the mobile devices are ever present and not going anywhere. Chris Ovitz:And so in the way that I learned how powerful community was in Viddy, I thought that we could do something similar with the mobile devices and kids today. So I think that there's so much guilt in general for parents, and then there's all this judgment and guilt around screen time. And I think that we forget in our little bubbles in our world is that the whole no screens thing is a privilege. And the YouTube as a babysitter is real, and it's a problem. And I think at the end of the day, balance is key. And I think that there's no reason we can't reimagine screen time. These devices aren't going anywhere. And so I wanted to create something. My partners wanted to create something that was screen time that wasn't leaned back, that really puts kids at the center of the story and the creation. Chris Erwin:I like how you just phrase that, where I think a lot of people look at kids' content consumption as a problem that plagues the U.S. and all these other countries. But how do you put kids in the driver's seat of that content, that story to make it productive and helpful? I really like how you position that. So you have this vision. And so then how does this start? Where do you begin building and with who? Chris Ovitz:So I immediately called JJ, who was my co-founder of Viddy. And he was at Headspace at the time consulting for them, actually. And I was like, "You got to watch this documentary." He did. He was like, "Oh my God, this is awesome. I totally see what you mean. Let's start thinking about what this could look like." We reached out to our former CTO, Ken Chung, who's one of our co-founders, and he was running a big engineering team at Snap. So he was in charge of the camera team there, very talented engineer. He was at Fullscreen as well. And he's a new father. And so he got super excited about the potential. Chris Ovitz:And then we just kept building from there one by one, reaching out to people in our network that were extremely talented, that had young kids that could get excited about this. And so it really went from that is how the idea started to when we brought a gentleman named Travis Chen in, who's an interactive play designer. And he was the Chief Game Designer at Scopely, which is where I met him, super talented guy. And he was the one that really brought the play into the mix, and how we really started thinking about learning through play as the mechanism for which we were going to achieve our goals. Chris Ovitz:And so he joined. He was the Creative Director for Games and Interactive at Bad Robot, which is JJ Abrams' company. And then before he joined us, he was at Snap running all their AR innovation stuff. And so he was just the perfect person to come in and really help us think about how we can make the phone almost like a cardboard box. So when you see a cardboard box, you see a cardboard box. When a kid sees a cardboard box, they see a rocket ship, a castle, whatever. And so we wanted to take that philosophy and apply it to the content we were creating in the phone. So I think our OK Play, the vision is about really making it kid led, but parent involved. That's when kids really learn the most. So you can go on a treasure hunt with your child, you can do a fire rescue, you can run a candy factory and the kid is at the center of these stories, and they're creating them and then they're creating a piece of content that they can share with their family members. Chris Erwin:And is it intended for co-consumption, where it's both the parent and the child consuming and participating in the experience at the same time? Chris Ovitz:Absolutely. So it's all about this staring versus sharing, right? We want to get away from the mind numbing, like kid in zombie mode, create truly interactive content that is active and engaging and parents are included. I think this comes back to, so our other co-founder, who's our chief scientist, Colleen Russo Johnson. She's our child development expert and kids media expert. She did all this research on kids absorbing more when the parents are involved. So she did a bunch of research on Daniel Tiger, just the spiritual successor to Mr. Rogers. And I discovered her in an article in The Atlantic, in which she was quoted, it was the article is about ChuChu TV, which is basically like the Cocomelon of India. And she was talking about this study that she did, that kids learn the social and emotional concepts, learning concepts in Daniel Tiger much more quickly, and they absorb much more when the parent is actually watching it with them and engaging with them while they're watching it, than when they're just staring at it alone. Chris Ovitz:And so we took a lot of that and built what you see in OK Play today. And because of that article, we reached out to her, she started advising us and the and we're like, "You're perfect. You need to come join us and build this." And she was like, "This is my life's work in an app. This is awesome." And yeah, we just kind of built an all star team and just went after it. Chris Erwin:Yeah, this makes me think of have you heard of Nike Adventure Club? Chris Ovitz:I have not, actually. Chris Erwin:I think we wrote about this, maybe now almost like a year and a half ago. But essentially, Nike came up with like a subscription club for their shoes that brings both parents and kids together. So kids can go into the app with their parents and say, "Oh, I like these shoes. I like the story behind them.", learn about them, learn about their environmental impact when they are discarded. And then you sign up for the shoe. And then I think you can get replacements like once every six months or 12 months. And then along with the shoe also comes games and experiences and things you could do it like the local playground or at home. And it's this really cool idea that feels very similar to what you're describing. Chris Erwin:It seems like the timing for what you're building is just perfect. Also, I think back to the FTC settlement with YouTube, I think like a year and a half ago, where there's now going to be limited monetization for a lot of the kids content channels. And particularly with all the extremist content and the political backlash and what's happened over the past six months, I think there's a very strong desire for safer content destinations just overall, but particularly for our youth. So have you sensed that, that there's kind of this unique momentum and tailwind that you have in the market right now? Chris Ovitz:Definitely, there is. But I think it's very difficult for kids app developers and kid content creators. I think the privacy laws aren't making it any easier. They're only getting stricter, and they're a gray area and they're a moving target, which makes it tough. And the lawmakers aren't technologists. And so in some cases, the laws don't make any sense and just really don't apply. That said, children's privacy is, there's nothing more important, and we have to protect our kids online. But I would say it's getting very, very difficult to create this content because of the privacy laws. So you got to be, when you're thinking about making this content, you got to abide by a strict set of rules, you got to make sure you're not having outbound links that are triggering browsers, you got to gate everything. Social interaction can be a big no, no, but there's ways to do it creatively that are safe for the child. It's definitely the wild west right now, a little bit. Chris Erwin:Yeah. So it feels like you'd have to staff up that department and that need differently than say, what Complex or BuzzFeed would have to staff their digital and production and user experience team. So what does that mean for you guys? Do you have a bigger legal team? Or how do you incorporate that into your workflow? Chris Ovitz:Incredible lawyers, we all are just very aware of what's going on as far as privacy is concerned. There are specific certifications you can go out and get such as kidSAFE to let parents know that your app is safe for children. You just have to be on top of it and pay attention. Chris Erwin:So it seems like a fun part of this too just in the product development, like do you go out and you work with parents and kids to get an idea of like, "Hey, what would get you excited? We want to do some alpha testing." I mean, clearly the founding, the executive team that you guys have brought, brings a lot of personal experience, like you guys are all parents. How do you get inspired and get in the mindset of these children to design something that's really special for them? Chris Ovitz:So several ways. So we do a lot of play testing. We have a really vibrant community of parents and kids that will test things with. Another thing is we have to remember how to be kids. Kids are experts at play, right? We are not, somehow as an adult, you forget that. And so I think being a parent makes it a lot easier. I'm always building Lego or something like that with my son. I found myself as we've started this company, I'm watching children's cartoons and consuming all the content there is online and finding my favorite shows to draw inspiration from and then look, I'm probably the person that is contributing creatively least to what you see in the app, and I rely on our very talented creative team that lives and breathes this stuff to build these experiences and do this programming for children Chris Erwin:Got it. Within the app, is there a certain game or experience that's your favorite right now? Chris Ovitz:Right now, yeah. My favorite is probably Fire Rescue. So you take a picture of your face as a child, and it puts them in the story. And this little character that we have Twiggle, who's the cutest thing on earth in my opinion, invites you on this journey to go be brave with them to basically go to an emergency call. And you end up having to get there and get a couple of characters out of the tree. And they ask you to take pictures of your face and all these different emotions. And it's got really awesome music in it and it's fun. You literally created your own mini show, you can then share with your family members. And so my son loves it. And it's fun to play with it. Chris Erwin:Cool. So there's a storyline but you take a photo of like a selfie. And then that goes into one of the characters in the game. Chris Ovitz:Yes, it puts yourself into the story. It's like an interactive story and you're literally putting yourself in it. And then what happens is, is you'll draw the firetruck. You'll draw the skylines, you'll draw the tree, and then it puts it all together into this interactive story. And you get to then watch it. So it's like you're literally creating, it's almost like you're creating the storyboards for the show. And then we magically put it together and the kid feels like they've just created this really awesome interactive story. Chris Erwin:The character's name is Twinkle, the cutest character on Earth as you said, right? Chris Ovitz:Yeah. Chris Erwin:And this is called Fire Rescue? Chris Ovitz:Fire Rescue, yeah. So if you go into the OK Play app, it will be one of the first stories you see. Twiggle is one of our main characters, almost like our guide, and they take you through this adventure. And they do it. We also have Twiggle's Treasure Hunt. And so you go on a pirate adventure to find treasure and you draw the sea monster and you find out the sea monster isn't actually mean. It's actually trying to help you and a lot of really awesome morals in the story. And it all comes from a place of social emotional learning. It's designed by all of our Ph.D.s and advisors that are awesome. Chris Erwin:Oh wow, any of this content, is it licensed from a third party or is this all incubated in house? Chris Ovitz:It's all done in house. So we have an incredibly talented creative team. We're doing all of our animations, all of our own production, all of our own voiceover stuff. Chris Erwin:Wow. Do you ever get involved in any of the voiceovers or any of the brainstorming or anything like that? Chris Ovitz:Thankfully, no. I am not a fan of being on camera, on audio, anything. So hopefully I do you justice today. Chris Erwin:Got it. Have you already raised seed funding for this or was this just funded by the founders? Chris Ovitz:We did raise seed funding. So we have incredible investors. We've actually raised, we closed our series A over the summer. We've raised $11 million to date. Investors like Obvious Ventures, Forerunner, Lego Ventures, which is Lego's investment arm, Collab+Sesame, which is Sesame Workshop's fund with Collaborative Fund, Dreamers, which is Will Smith's fund. We have a ton of incredible investors. Chris Erwin:Awesome. As I think about fundraising, and then you also talking about the documentary about Mr. Rogers, I think about the impassioned plea that he makes to Congress to have funding, I think for PBS and for his program. It's such a beautiful segment in that film. The gentleman who is running the forum is like sold within five to 10 minutes, and Mr. Rogers gets the funding that he needs. So I don't know if that became part of your pitch or you harnessed that energy as you were raising this first round of funding, but I love that anecdote. Chris Ovitz:Absolutely. We love it too. And look, that was a picture of him and a quote from him. It was the first slide of our deck and that hooks everyone. It's very hard to root against a group of people that want to build something as meaningful as Mr. Rogers did. I'm by no means saying we're going to be the next Mr. Rogers but we would definitely try as hard as we can every day to live by his philosophies and build as much of that into our app as we can. Chris Erwin:Got it. So where does OK Play go next? What are you building towards in 2021? Chris Ovitz:It comes back to this staring versus sharing thing. I think we want to get away from this mind numbing, staring kid zombie mode type of content. And we want to build something that's truly interactive. We're building this new media format in which kids are really the star of what they're creating, and lets them create these adventures that they can then share with their family and friends. And it's all rooted in social emotional learning, and teaches kindness and curiosity and empathy and skills that they need to translate into the real world. Chris Ovitz:And I think now more than ever, it's super important. You have so many children at home, that they can't go to birthday parties, that can't interact with other kids, I talk to so many of my friends that have young kids that when this pandemic started, they were just at the age where they were about to start preschool. And so they interact mostly with adults, and then they'll see another small person, another child, and it's almost like they don't even know what to do, they don't have those skills yet. And so they've been deprived of this social interaction. And so if there's anything we can do to help with these skills, I think we're doing a good job. And so that's what I would love to see us accomplish this year is really reaching more families, and just helping parents and helping parents know that it's okay to take a moment, that just because their child is playing for 15 minutes on an app, it's not the end of the world. Not all content is created equal, and I think balance is key. And it's really, really important that parents give themselves a break. Chris Erwin:Cool. All right, so I have that now, to go back a little bit more personally about you. I think this is like at least the third company that you've found in your career. And you have expressed that in certain previous companies that you realized burnout and you knew when you had to kind of change things up. And I know that your wife Ara is also an entrepreneur, has her own business. You're building OK Play. You're also an investor, which we'll talk about a little bit and you have a young son. So do you feel like that you are stretched in the Ovitz household? Chris Ovitz:Yes. Look, a two entrepreneur household is very tough. I have one child, I don't know how people with multiple do it. You definitely make sacrifices, and my wife and I are not going to sacrifice our son for work. We're just not. So we do our best. I think it's made us much, much more efficient human beings. You just have to, there's no time for the nonsense. And so you just have to be really, really good planners. She's brilliant. I'm very lucky to share a household with an entrepreneur that awesome. Chris Erwin:I like that balanced mindset. I think that's absolutely critical. And more entrepreneurs need to assume that. So okay, we're about to get to the rapid fire. But before we do, Chris, why don't you tell us about, it seems that you do some investing on the side. You've done angel investing in your past but I think that there's a new fund that you're a part of. So what is that all about? Chris Ovitz:About 10 years ago, I was fortunate enough to interview at Twitter, and I met Biz Stone. And he's one of the co-founders and I kept in touch with him. We became friends, he ended up advising a couple of my companies. He was on the board of one of them. And he always said that if he ever formalized his angel investing, which by the way, he has one of the most incredible angel portfolios in history, from Slack to Square to Pinterest to BeyondMe, all of these unicorns. And I think that's because of the way he connects with entrepreneurs and how genuine and authentic he is. Chris Ovitz:But anyways, he said if he was ever going to formalize his portfolio into a VC fund, then I would be one of his first phone calls. He held true to that, and invited me to help him build his first investment fund. It's a $200 million fund. We invest in early stage companies that build the future of health, work, wealth, and play. And it's a lot of fun. I get to see incredible entrepreneurs and see how I can help them. I love connecting the dots. I believe that I'm good at connecting the dots that other people don't always see. And I love putting people together, and as I said, building community. And so I like to think of us as more of an investment group as opposed to a fund and just investing in great people. Chris Erwin:Awesome. Chris, I have to say that we've kind of gotten to know one another through the preparation for this podcast and our conversation right now. Something that stands out to me is that it seems that you have this incredible magnetism to you. Because the people that you attract around you too, whether it's launching a new investment fund or creating the founding teams for companies or recruiting someone from an article that you read, you clearly have a very, very special skill of being able to do that. What defines your magnetism? What is it about you that brings people towards your orbit? Chris Ovitz:It's a good question. I've never really thought about it like that and I appreciate you saying that. I think authenticity and just being comfortable with who I am. And that's what people get when they see me. There's nothing, I'm not positioning, trying to be something I'm not. A lot of people are threatened by people smarter than them. I want to be around as many amazingly talented people as I can get my hands on. And I think it's about building real trust and giving people the attention they deserve. And so it really just comes down to being genuine and being a good friend. And I think that builds trust with people. And then, so when you reach out to them, you're able to make things happen, because there's trust. Trust is everything. Chris Erwin:Yeah, I think that's really beautifully said. So cool. All right, so now we're on to the rapid fire round. So Chris, the rules are as follows. I'm going to ask you six questions. The answers are intended to be brief, one to two sentences, could even just be one to two words. Do you understand the rules? Chris Ovitz:I understand the rules. Chris Erwin:Awesome, all right. First one, proudest life moment. Chris Ovitz:Becoming a father. Chris Erwin:Great. What do you want to do less of in 2021? Chris Ovitz:Sitting in front of a computer. Chris Erwin:Okay. And what do you want to do more of? Chris Ovitz:Seeing friends in real life. Chris Erwin:I think many people would say the exact same right now. What one to two things drive your success? Chris Ovitz:Success is relative. But assuming someone thinks I'm successful, then it would be wanting to set the best example I can for my son. Chris Erwin:Very nice. All right, last handful of questions here. Advice for media executives going into 2021. Chris Ovitz:Dust off those social skills. Chris Erwin:What do you mean by that? Chris Ovitz:I mean, we're spending so much time on Zoom and in front of a computer that I think people may have forgotten how to interact with each other in the real world. Chris Erwin:Yeah, hopefully you haven't lost your magnetism ability. Chris Ovitz:I hope not. Chris Erwin:It's your key asset. All right, last couple here. Any future startup ambitions? Chris Ovitz:Always. I have an idea deck, some worse than others, but they're probably more of my future. Chris Erwin:Where do you keep your ideas? Chris Ovitz:Probably shouldn't tell people this but in my head. Chris Erwin:That way people can't access them, right? Chris Ovitz:Very true. But hey, if the idea is something that someone can cannibalize that easily, then it's not a great idea. Chris Erwin:Agreed. All right, last one Chris, this is an easy one. How can people get in contact with you? Chris Ovitz:They can feel free to email me chris@okplay.co. Chris Erwin:Awesome. I really appreciate you being on the podcast today, Chris. This is a lot of fun. Chris Ovitz:Hey, Chris. I appreciate you inviting me on and yeah, I hope people enjoy it. Chris Erwin:Hey, listeners, before you go, one final reminder. We love hearing from all of you. So if you have any thoughts on the show, any ideas for guests or any feedback at all, please email us. You can reach us at tcupod@wearerockwater.com. All right, that's it everybody. Thanks for listening. Chris Erwin:The Come Up is written and hosted by me, Chris Erwin and is a production of RockWater Industries. Please rate and review this show on Apple Podcasts. And remember to subscribe wherever you listen to our show. And if you really dig us, feel free to forward The Come Up to a friend. You can sign up for our company newsletter at wearerockwater.com/newsletter. And you can follow us on Twitter @tcupod. The Come Up is engineered by Daniel Tureck. Music is by Devon Bryant. Logo and branding is by Kevin Zazzali. And special thanks to Andrew Cohen and Mike Booth from the RockWater team.

What I learned from reading Overdrive: Bill Gates and the Race to Control Cyberspace by James Wallace.Upgrade now to automatically unlock every full length episode. You will get access to 180 full-length episodes available nowhere else. A new episode is added every week. Learn the key insights from biographies on Steve Jobs, Elon Musk, John D. Rockefeller, Coco Chanel, Andrew Carnegie, Enzo Ferrari, Dr. Suess, Estee Lauder, Jeff Bezos, Warren Buffett, Charlie Munger, Phil Knight, Joseph Pulitzer, Arnold Schwarzenegger, Bill Gates, P.T. Barnum, Edwin Land, Henry Ford, Walter Chrysler, Thomas Edison, David Ogilvy, Ben Franklin, Howard Hughes, George Lucas, Levi Strauss, Walt Disney and so many more. Subscribe now by tapping this link.

The biographies you never knew you needed! Lean about how the finances of Ghostbusters breaks down, plus: Bernie Brillstein was in John Belushi and Dan Aykroyd’s corner, making Saturday Night Live, the Blues Brothers, and trying to make Ghostbusters happen. Plus, Muppets! Agent Mike Ovitz ruled Hollywood for a time, and got great deals for Ghostbusters’ principal players. Also, surprisingly, a great pal with Bill Murray. Frank Price was a pioneering TV producer who later oversaw Columbia Pictures and Universal. Learn how he had confidence in the Ghostbusters movie, and what happened to him afterwards.   https://www.patreon.com/rossmaywriter   For 2020, patrons’ donations will be used to purchase toys for children at Victoria Hospital this Christmas.

In a lengthy interview, Bob Illes and I discuss his early years; starting a radio comedy show at USC; Digby Wolfe; winning a contest to write for Tennesse Ernie Ford; Mike Ovitz; writing monologues for Bill Cosby; meeting Groucho Marx and Peter Sellers; writing for the Lily Tomlin special and winning an Emmy; The Super Emmy; writing the Sanford & Son episode, "Lamont, Is That You", The Smothers Brothers NBC reboot; Mickey Rose; Chevy Chase; Don Novello; Joe & Sons, One Day at a Time, getting dressed down by Norman Lear and his mea culpa; What's Happening!!, Captain and Tenille Show, Fernwood Tonight, winning another Emmy for the last year of The Carol Burnett Show, America 2-Night; Peeping Times; The Mary Tyler Moore Hour; Steve Allen Comedy Hour; Catherine O'Hara, Flo, Private Benjamin, No Soap, Radio; Silver Spoons; Jason Bateman, John Houseman; The Cracker Brothers; Milton Berle; Double Trouble, Sylvan in Paradise, Jim Nabors; Courtney Cox; Jackie Bison Show; Harry Shearer, Stan Freberg; Amen; Sherman Hemsley; favorite episode; getting cancelled by NBC because Johnny Carson retired; age ranges in sitcoms

When you upgrade to the Misfit feed you will get access to every full length episode. These episodes are available nowhere else. More exclusive episodes are added every month. As a bonus you will also get lifetime access to my notebook that contains key insights from over 285 podcasts and lectures on entrepreneurship. Founders is the Costco of podcasts. You won't believe the value you get for such little money. Upgrade now by tapping this link.

What I learned from reading Samuel Bronfman: The Life and Times of Seagram's Mr. Sam by Michael R. Marrus.The story of Sam's rise to fame and fortune from a hard life on the Canadian frontier is inherently dramatic and yet touches a familiar nerve in a broad spectrum of the population. There is something in Sam's response to his disappointments that most people recognize in their themselves. [0:01] I found out about the Bronfman family on Founders #53 Mike Ovitz when Mike Ovitz brokered a deal that led to Seagram buying MCA Universal for $5.7 billion. [2:58]Generational Inflection Point: A single individual that changes the trajectory of his entire family for generations to come [3:35] Why did his family have to flee Russia? [6:42]Sam was ashamed of the poverty is family endured and NEVER forgot it [10:45] Sam starts running his own hotel at 23 [14:35] Sam figures out a new plan to overcome the powerful temperance movement / The good ones know more. — David Ogilvy [18:00] The advantages of Sam's mail order strategy + Copying and improving on his competitors [20:12]Some people just want it more [22:23]Sam would tell you to focus on the long term [24:26]Sam would tell you don't waste any opportunity and be a learning machine [31:50]Sam would tell you to learn from the best [35:44]Sam would tell you to think big and appeal to interest [37:20]Sam's view on money / Go First Class [42:04]After prohibition is lifted Sam goes on a buying spree / Default aggressive [48:53]Sam does something brilliant: He repositions whiskey as a luxury product [53:02]Sam's personal curriculum [57:30]How Sam's business survived WWII [59:00]The company proved to be one of Sam's shrewdest moves; bought with only $50 million in borrowed cash it was sold [by his heirs] in 1980 for $2.3 billion [1:03:35]—“I have listened to every episode released and look forward to every episode that comes out. The only criticism I would have is that after each podcast I usually want to buy the book because I am interested so my poor wallet suffers. ” — GarethBe like Gareth. Buy a book: All the books featured on Founders Podcast

Will Larson on Greater Than Code, Marcus Blankenship on Software Engineering Radio, Sonal Chokshi on Software Engineering Daily, Roman Pichler on Being Human, and Dave Thomas and Andy Hunt on Hanselminutes. I’d love for you to email me with any comments about the show or any suggestions for podcasts I might want to feature. Email podcast@thekguy.com. And, if you haven’t done it already, don’t forget to hit the subscribe button. This episode covers the five podcast episodes I found most interesting and wanted to share links to during the two week period starting September 2, 2019. These podcast episodes may have been released much earlier, but this was the fortnight when I started sharing links to them to my social network followers. WILL LARSON ON GREATER THAN CODE The Greater Than Code podcast featured Will Larson with hosts Jessica Kerr, Arty Starr, and Rein Henrichs. Will talked about systems thinking, specifically referencing Donella Meadows’ Thinking in Systems: A Primer. As a sixteen-year-old, he was exposed to systems thinking by his economics professor father. They talked about how to bring about change in complex systems and Rein brought up Virginia Satir’s change model.  They talked about various forms of dysfunction, with an example being tasks that are marked as completed by developers without first doing the work of validation. Will’s own example is that executives never miss their goals; they just redefine the goals so that they hit them. There is a certain level of seniority where you can never be held accountable because you are the accountability function. Getting back into the topic of how to change complex systems, Will referenced the book, The First 90 Days as a great explanation of the need to go slow and observe before you try to change things. He says that the “great man theory” has been out of style for decades in the study of history, but is still in style in tech as the most causal way to understand how change works and also the most comforting. Rein talked about how the heroic individual myth is the other side of the coin to the scapegoat. Just as you pile all the blame onto the scapegoat, you pile all the credit onto the hero. He says that cultures that engage in hero myth-building are also likely to engage in scapegoating. Will says he himself has not seen much scapegoating at the companies he works at, likely because those cultures were unwilling to hold folks accountable for their work, but he has seen the hero myth at every company he has worked. Will then spoke about the 10x engineer myth. Will says he meets people who have been in tech for six or seven years who have the idea that they are almost done with their career. It may be due to the “senior engineer after two years” phenomenon where the career path is not well-defined and a lot of companies don’t know how to take advantage of the skills of people with 15 to 20 years of experience. A second reason is that the industry is an overwhelming and draining environment and people choose to opt out of it. As a result, we have very few engineers who have been around long enough to witness the long-term consequences of their brilliant ideas. Apple Podcasts link: https://podcasts.apple.com/ca/podcast/142-modeling-constraints-in-human-systems-with-will-larson/id1163023878?i=1000446345964 Website link: https://www.greaterthancode.com/modeling-constraints-in-human-systems MARCUS BLANKENSHIP ON SOFTWARE ENGINEERING RADIO The Software Engineering Radio podcast featured Marcus Blankenship with host Travis Kimmel. They talked about motivation, specifically motivation of engineering teams. Marcus says that motivation is the desire to get things done and every engineer coming out of school is motivated from day one. If you get one of these people hired onto your team and, two years later, they are demotivated, suffering from PTSD, scared to offer ideas, and figuring they are just a cog in a machine, your problem is your company or your team, not the engineer you hired. Marcus says he is doing secret research on motivation as he is now interviewing candidates for a job and asking them why they are looking to leave their current job. Nobody says, “Pay.” Often the answer is a lack of alignment with their boss or their company, resulting in the engineer losing the desire to contribute because of a relationship problem. These engineers are not stick-in-the-muds that are angry they don’t get to use COBOL anymore. Something happened where instead of having their ideas valued and heard and being part of the discussion, they somehow got disconnected from their boss. In the seventies, Marcus says, researchers discovered a strong correlation between positive employer-employee relationships and the amount of job satisfaction, quality of work, turnover intentions, and amount of promotions. We are thirty-five years into a few thousand scientific studies that continue to prove that the relationship one has with one’s supervisor matters more than any other factor when it comes to job performance and job satisfaction. Marcus says that a supervisor’s one true job is to create a trusting relationship with the people that report to you. Travis shared his own experience in having one-on-ones with his supervisors that felt to him like they were trying to artificial manufacturing a relationship because there was no indication of what the goal of the meeting was.  Marcus says that good one-on-ones are bi-directional. One-on-ones in which the boss just gets status updates from the subordinate and gives new marching orders are often dissatisfying for both parties. Another flawed kind of one-on-one is where it is all about the employee. Such one-on-ones are not effective and neither party likes these either. Marcus suggests that we apply to our one-on-ones the same Agile thinking that we apply to our work. Every month, at one of your one-on-ones, do a retro on the one-on-one. Talk about why you are doing them, what value you’re getting from them, and how to make them better. They talked about psychological safety. Marcus says a lot of managers don’t realize that they are not in a good position to measure psychological safety based on their own gut. He says tools like Claire Lew’s knowyourteam.com, officevibe.com, and other anonymous survey tools can help. When we become a manager or team lead that has you supervising or leading, we forget that we are in a position of power. Travis added that leaders need to be careful about what they say casually so that it doesn’t get taken as a mandate. Apple Podcasts link: https://podcasts.apple.com/ca/podcast/episode-374-marcus-blankenship-on-motivating-programmers/id120906714?i=1000445260176 Website link: https://www.se-radio.net/2019/07/episode-374-marcus-blankenship-on-motivating-programmers/ SONAL CHOKSHI ON SOFTWARE ENGINEERING DAILY The Software Engineering Daily podcast featured a16z podcast host Sonal Chokshi with host Jeff Meyerson. Jeff started out by asking why a VC firm decided to start a podcast. Sonal says that a16z has always had a culture of writing, blogging, and sharing ideas. This led them to develop an editorial operation from which the podcast naturally followed. Jeff asked what lessons from blogging apply to podcasting. Sonal sees podcasting as the next evolution of blogging because of its similar intimacy and a similar feeling of authenticity. The difference, she says, is that podcasting is a community and a movement.  Sonal talked about her favorite a16z episodes, including an episode on emojis. She loved it because everybody understands how to use emojis but there is a lot of deep tech and governance involved in making emojis possible. That episode, she said, encapsulates the whole a16z podcast: the intersection of technology, people, politics, context, culture, and humanity.  Jeff brought up a16z’s connection to Mike Ovitz’s Creative Artists Agency. Having read Ovitz’s book and noticed how it portrays Ovitz as a workaholic, Jeff asked Sonal how she finds balance while drinking from the addicting technological firehose. Sonal says there is a lack of nuance in the debates about screen time and work/life balance. Apple Podcasts link: https://podcasts.apple.com/ca/podcast/a16z-podcasting-with-sonal-chokshi/id1019576853?i=1000446547922 Website link: https://softwareengineeringdaily.com/2019/08/09/a16z-podcasting-with-sonal-chokshi/ ROMAN PICHLER ON BEING HUMAN The Being Human podcast featured Roman Pichler with host Richard Atherton. Richard asked Roman what a product manager is. Roman says a product manager is someone who takes an idea and helps bring it to life, launch it, make it successful, and keep it successful. Richard asked about the distinction between a product manager and Scrum’s notion of product owner. Roman sees the product owner as a product management role, but methodologies like SAFe have redefined the product owner to be a tactical role, misunderstanding the intention behind the role and the practicalities such as answering questions from the dev team, refining backlog items, and answering support and sales questions. He says there is too much focus on the details and this risks losing sight of the big picture. To do a good job for users and for the business, Roman says it is helpful to have people looking after digital assets with the right qualifications, skills, organizational support, authority, and autonomy. He says the term “mini-CEO” appeals to some product people because it indicates that product people need a certain level of authority, but a CEO would have marketing and sales functions under their control and product people do not. Richard asked what talents Roman had to develop to be a great product person. Roman started out as a programmer and began to help business groups come up with new products. What helped him most was to boost his own understanding of how business works and the second most important element was letting go of being interested in how digital products work and focusing instead on who benefits from them. Apple Podcasts link: https://podcasts.apple.com/ca/podcast/72-to-manage-products-is-to-care-with-roman-pichler/id1369745673?i=1000446514943 Website link: http://media.cdn.shoutengine.com/podcasts/4081235a-554f-4a8f-90c2-77dc3b58051f/audio/9b2501e7-e618-46f6-8f41-abd69c871211.mp3 DAVE THOMAS AND ANDY HUNT ON HANSELMINUTES The Hanselminutes podcast featured Dave Thomas and Andy Hunt with host Scott Hanselman. Scott started by asking whether Dave and Andy knew at the time they wrote the Pragmatic Programmer 20 years ago that they were writing what would become a seminal work. Dave said that both of them were stunned by its success. The book was intended as a way to clarify their own thoughts based on their experiences as consultants in which their clients all had the same kinds of problems: inconsistent builds, the shipping of untested code, and impossible-to-change designs. Scott asked about the importance of the name of the book. Andy said that there was a strain of thought at the time the book was written that was dogmatic and they deliberately pushed against such approaches. Dave pointed out that this was harder on their readers because it forced them to figure out for themselves what works for them. They got into a discussion of what kind of educational background one needs to be a successful programmer. Dave revealed that he is currently teaching classes at SMU to, he says, corrupt the youth by teaching them things like functional programming, and because traditional computer science education is poorly serving the industry and the student. People are coming out of university with tens or hundreds of thousands of dollars of debt and, in terms of their value in the industry, they are not much different from people who are coming out of eight-week bootcamps. He teaches third or fourth year undergraduates and graduate students and he has found that none have been shown any form of testing. He would much rather hire someone who had the right attitude, was smart, and who could talk to people and he could show such a person how to code while on the job. Andy added that he gets the feeling that most computer science programs are there to teach you to become a professor of computer science rather than a problem-solver. What Andy says people need to learn, and what university education is not providing, are problem-solving skills. Apple Podcasts link: https://podcasts.apple.com/ca/podcast/pragmatic-programmer-celebrates-20-years-dave-thomas/id117488860?i=1000446461596 Website link: https://hanselminutes.simplecast.com/episodes/the-pragmatic-programmer-celebrates-20-years-with-dave-thomas-and-andy-hunt-VBmLw9lP LINKS Ask questions, make comments, and let your voice be heard by emailing podcast@thekguy.com. Twitter: https://twitter.com/thekguy LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/keithmmcdonald/ Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/thekguypage Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/the_k_guy/ YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/c/TheKGuy Website:

What I learned from reading Who Is Michael Ovitz? by Michael Ovitz. Those whom the gods wish to destroy they first give a gift [0:01]Michael's first jobs + finding his first love [7:02]the foul-mouthed magnates [19:49]starting at the bottom / being hungry for knowledge [24:50]I don't want to be standard in any way [32:30]the revolt begins and the founding of CAA [36:05]know the history of the industry you are in [46:30]a warning for all entrepreneurs [53:44]what influenced CAA's culture [59:27]becoming the thing you hate [1:02:10]a typical day's schedule [1:07:00]problems with co-founders [1:11:30]the fastest animal on the field [1:15:13]I was tired / The end of Michael Ovitz's time at CAA [1:19:15]Ron is gone [1:25:07]a new beginning / meeting Marc Andreessen [1:32:00]reconciliation [1:38:00]—“I have listened to every episode released and look forward to every episode that comes out. The only criticism I would have is that after each podcast I usually want to buy the book because I am interested so my poor wallet suffers. ” — GarethBe like Gareth. Buy a book: All the books featured on Founders Podcast

What up podcast!!! Just jammin to Jamiroquai, talkin about my workout slump I figured out how to break...just follow @davidgoggins and that will do the trick. And I need your help choosing a safe efficient car...lookin at the CRV, Terrain, Forester. Thoughts? email me :) ned@happymondayco.com Number one thing is safety....And a nugget from @garyvee’s podcast where he interviewed @michaelovitz...Michael said, think of your career as a train leaving the station...Build something slow, thoughtful, strong, and lasting...love that. Check out his book Who is Michael Ovitz Rock this day podcast!! I appreciate you :) -Ned

Mike Ovitz, a cofounder of Creative Artists Agency and former president of The Walt Disney Company, says there are many parallels between the movie and music industry of the 1970s and 1980s and Silicon Valley today. When it comes to managing creatives, he says you have to have patience and believe in the work. But to get that work made, you have to have shrewd negotiating skills. Ovitz says he now regrets some of the ways he approached business in his earlier years, and advises young entrepreneurs about what he's learned along the way. He's the author of the new memoir "Who Is Michael Ovitz?" Editor's note: This post was updated September 26, 2018 to correct the title of Ovitz's book.

RICHARD KONIGSBERG was one of the youngest agent trainees to ever be promoted at ICM. But Richard ditched the powerhouse talent agency to become an actor himself. Five years later, he returned and was made an agent for a second time -- but not before having to serve another tour of duty as assistant to one of the most demanding agents in the biz. EXPLICIT (45:56)      EPISODE NOTES: My first job in the entertainment business was at the powerhouse talent agency International Creative Management. I started in January 1988 and in the two-plus years I was there, I assisted agents in both the motion picture and television departments. And despite witnessing a lot of ego and pressure-driven theatrics and bad behavior, I was very glad to be at ICM because at that time it was one of “the” places to work in Hollywood. From the Los Angeles Times (Column One – By Amy Wallce – Dec. 11, 1998): "In the '80s and early '90s, talent agents ruled the industry. Movie studios and television networks found themselves beholden to International Creative Management, the Creative Artists Agency and the time-tested William Morris Agency, the "big three" agencies that had a lock on most A-list stars. Agents made big money for both their clients and themselves, charging the TV networks, for example, huge so-called packaging fees to assemble talent for shows. Even for the most famous actors, it was often unclear who needed whom more: agent or client?" And as far as agents and clients go, they didn’t come any bigger than ED LIMATO and his megawatt roster, including: Richard Gere, Mel Gibson, Michelle Pfeiffer, Denzel Washington, Nicholas Cage, Steve Martin, Matthew Modine and Diana Ross. As RICHARD KONIGSBERG tells me: “Mike Ovitz’s company CAA might have had more stars, but as individual agents go, Ed Limato had the best client list of any agent in town.” Richard was one of the youngest agent trainees to ever be promoted at ICM, which came after spending two very intense years working as one of two assistants to the notoriously demanding Limato: “I was putting in at least 11-hour days. I was there at 7:30 in the morning. We took no lunch. We assistants worked through lunch, and we did not leave the office until he was actually seated at dinner. He used to eat dinner 5 nights a week at a restaurant called Morton’s. When his guests arrived, we were allowed to leave. But there were many, many times dinner would be over and he would be calling the office and we were still there.” But the stress and sacrifice that came with the job paid off for Richard. At the age of 23, he became a bona fide agent in ICM’s motion picture department. However, shortly after his promotion was announced, Richard had a surprising announcement of his own – he was leaving the agency: “I was scared. I was insecure. I wasn’t prepared for what was being put in front of me. So, I left and I thought maybe I should be an actor. I said, ‘Look. We represent a lot of people and they’re making a good living. And they’re not that talented.’” Richard got a job as a waiter, started taking acting classes, and began going on auditions. But fairly quickly, he realized that becoming a working actor wasn’t going to be as easy as he thought – or at least hoped – it would be. “I realized that I was not built for that kind of rejection. But then I had to figure out how to get back into the business.” And that would take Richard quite a while. He was eventually hired back at ICM. Not as an agent – at least not right away. No, in order to get back on track for promotion he was required to work again as Ed Limato’s assistant for nearly a year. “That was a hard pill to swallow. Here I am showing back up with my tail between my legs. That was tough. Not because of my age. That was never an issue. But explaining to people that I had to work for a guy that I worked for 5 years ago and go back and be his assistant again.” But, once again, it paid off. “I was made an agent at 23, then I was made an agent again like at 28. And I worked as an agent until 2007 when I was fired.” But that’s just the half of it, because ultimately this episode is the candid, firsthand telling of an unexpected love story. It’s a touching tale of a deep and life-changing friendship that Richard formed with Ed Limato – a friendship that ended up transcending and outliving the power, prestige and pressures of making multi-million-dollar movie deals. BP   Many thanks to the composers of the music featured in this episode royalty free through Creative Commons licensing: 1. "Jazzy Funky" by TA2MI - blocsonic.com/releases/bsmx0154 2. "Nesting" by Blue Dot Sessions - sessions.blue/sessions/ 3. "Slider" by Blue Dot Sessions - sessions.blue/sessions/ 4. "Sunset Stroll" by Poddington Bear - soundofpicture.com 5. "Chill Wave" by Kevin MacLeod - incompetech.com 6. "Pensacola Twilight" by Lee Rosevere - leerosevere.bandcamp.com 7. "Tranceless" by Blue Dot Sessions - sessions.blue/sessions/ 8. "Parade Shoes" by Blue Dot Sessions - sessions.blue/sessions/

Hollywood has always served a dual role, as both a reflection of the times is operates in  and a projector sending out its light showing the broader changes taking place in society. Just as the original Hollywood moguls, people like Warner and Selznick and Mayer, represented a generation that changed the “white shoe” world of business, people like the founders of CAA, men like Mike Ovitz and Ron Meyer, personified and were the apotheosis of  the buttoned down world of Wall Street coming to Hollywood in the 70’s and 80’s.  Like every business, things would continue to change. A new generation would emerge.  The old guard would be pushed out, or burn out and a group of so called young turks would emerge.  This ongoing story of the history of CAA is both Shakespearean in its drama and contemporary in subject.  It’s that story that my guest James Andrew Miller tells in Powerhouse: The Untold Story of Hollywood's Creative Artists Agency. My conversation with James Andrew Miller: 

PEOPLE! It behooves us to bring you a very special edition of the podcast this week... Anne Beatts is a writer, producer, professor at USC and Chapman, and true legend of comedy. She has a sketch writing course coming up July 30th through August 1st at Wordspace (http://wordspace.net) in the Los Angeles neighborhood of Atwater Village. In our conversation, she shares her philosophies on the differences between writing and performing for radio, stage, stand-up, and screen, and her thoughts on Los Angeles comedy clubs, improvisation, spontaneity, and writing the funny down for later. She was the first woman to become editor at National Lampoon, both the magazine and radio show. As one of the first writers hired by Lorne Michaels, she won the Emmy for her work on "Saturday Night Live," where her and Rosie Shuster created such characters as Uncle Roy, Fred Garvin: Male Prostitute, and Todd and Lisa (whose popularity literally put the word "nerd" in the dictionary). She created the cult TV hit "Square Pegs," which launched Sarah Jessica Parker's career and featured musical performances by The Waitresses and Devo, introducing punk rock characters on TV... sorry, sorry, "new wave" (different head). We talk about dealing with the network, a difficult Mike Ovitz, and a conveniently placed Dwayne "Dobie Gillis" Hickman in trying to see her vision through for the show. She also helped revamp the first season of "A Different World," and created the characters that would later usurp Lisa Bonet's Denise Huxtable as the leads on the show - Whitley and Dwayne Wayne. Besides Beatts' literary and television works, she also wrote the book for Leader Of The Pack, the Elle Greenwich Broadway musical. We discuss her upcoming classes, how she made her way as a woman in a male-dominated industry, the questionable ethics behind how money is made with internet content, why Gary Shandling is more like Craig Kilborn than Yoda, where Jim Hightower has got it right (but where he got it wrong), the recent GQ issue on comedy, why "Modern Family" is both good and bad (and "According To Jim" is just bad), the genius of Mitch Hedberg, the insanity of Michael O'Donoghue, a prank Bill Murray played on her before his "Square Pegs" appearance, a joke she wrote for Chevy Chase that he tried to sandbag, and many more memories from her 40 years in comedy. For more information on Finding Your Comedic Voice, contact Wordspace at info@wordspace.net. Or, contact Anne Beatts directly at Beattsclass@aol.com, or 310-273-1637. This episode also features the music of The Bouncing Souls (http://bouncingsouls.com)