Podcasts about Joomla

This is the recording between Matt Mullenweg and Mary Hubbard on stage at WordCamp Europe 2025. They covered everything from regulation in the EU, the FAIR package manager announcement, and new education pathways, to what's next for WordPress core and the ecosystem. The session started with Mary interviewing Matt, followed by a live Q&A with the audience, tackling concerns from longtime contributors, organizers, and first-time attendees alike.Matt opened with thoughts on the European regulatory landscape, pointing out both the good intentions and friction caused by cookie consent banners and compliance rules. He emphasized WordPress' alignment with other open-source CMS projects like Drupal and Joomla, and the potential for advocacy through EU-based hosting companies. The topic of establishing a legal presence for the WordPress Foundation in the EU came up—an idea that's being considered but seen as too complex to act on right now.The FAIR project announcement got a cautious but open-minded response from Matt. While he acknowledged the potential of a federated repository for plugins and themes, he highlighted significant concerns around trust, rollout coordination, and analytics. He stressed the importance of plugin safety, org infrastructure, and recent advances in automated vulnerability scanning. Then came a rapid-fire Q&A: contributors asked about AI in WordPress, the sustainability team's future, WooCommerce's branding against Shopify, Campus Connect's expansion, funding WordCamps in underrepresented regions, and even the need to modernize internal tools like CampTix. A big highlight was the 150-hour university credit pilot launching in Pisa this month—an exciting new way to bring student contributors into the project at scale.Have a listen to the whole audio episode while you're on the go!  ★ Support this podcast ★

In this episode of Talking Drupal, we discuss the latest DOJ accessibility ruling and its implications for Drupal with special guest Josh Mitchell. Josh, a seasoned expert who has led teams in digital agencies, governments, and non-profits, sheds light on what the ruling means for state and local governments, the importance of accessibility, and steps to achieve compliance. We also explore the Sa11y module, a powerful tool for enhancing website accessibility, and compare it with the Editorially module. Additionally, we touch on the upcoming MID Camp 2025. Tune in for an insightful discussion on making web content more accessible for all. For show notes visit: https://www.talkingDrupal.com/498 Topics Can you give us an overview of the DOJ Accessibility Ruling Does this apply to federal websites When does this go into effect How does this affect current sites Hwo is Drupal positioned against this Does this rule apply to all content such as PDFs Any tips to organizations JS widgets Resources Announcement of the rule Full text of the rule - PDF Fact sheet for meeting the requirements of the rule https://www.ada.gov/resources/2024-03-08-web-rule/ https://www.drupal.org/docs/getting-started/accessibility/how-to-do-an-accessibility-review AXE Core Core issue to automate accessibility tests with Nightwatch.js Keyboard traps COTS - Commercial off the shelf software VPATS - Voluntary product accessibility template Accessibility Conformance Report (ACR) Monsido - Acquia optimize - PDF Josh's blog post Guests Joshua "Josh" Mitchell - joshuami.com joshuami Hosts Nic Laflin - nLighteneddevelopment.com nicxvan John Picozzi - epam.com johnpicozzi Kathy Beck - kbeck303 MOTW Correspondent Martin Anderson-Clutz - mandclu.com mandclu Brief description: Have you ever wanted your Drupal site to have a built-in accessibility tool that could identify things like potential color contrast issues? There's a module for that Module name/project name: Sa11y Brief history It's worth mentioning that the name is a numeronym, so spelled s-a-1-1-y, which plays off of a common way the word “accessibility” is abbreviated How old: created in Jan 2018 by Bryan Sharpe (b_sharpe) but the namespace was taken over in Jun 2024 by Mark Conroy (markconroy) of LocalGov Drupal, so the current 3.0.1 release, which supports Drupal 10 and 11, is a completely different module than the original 8.x-1.x branch. Maintainership Actively maintained, in fact this module came out of the ongoing work being done on the LocalGov distribution and profile Security coverage Test coverage: no, but the module is effectively just a wrapper for the Sa11y library, which is CMS agnostic and used in the Wordpress and Joomla communities as well The Sa11y library has its own website, which includes documentation Number of open issues: 1 open issues, which isn't a bug Usage stats: 62 sites Module features and usage We did cover the Editoria11y accessibility checker as MOTW all the way back in episode #350, almost 3 years ago, and Sa11y was mentioned at that time. Both modules have had major releases since then, so I thought this week's episode would be a chance to do an updated comparison Sa11y does include some checks that Editoria11y does not, such as color contrast checking and a readability score The Editoria11y module, on the other hand, includes site-wide reporting that would be helpful for site admins, as well as a wealth of configuration options including one or more DOM elements to use as the container to check within, a list of elements to exclude, and so on. Recent versions of Editoria11y also include an option for live feedback as you edit, which should work with CKEditor 5, Paragraphs 5 or newer, and Gutenberg At the end of the day, however, both projects are intended to provide your content editors with immediate feedback on the accessibility compliance of what they create. So, it's worth looking at the feedback each tool provides and deciding which one is more useful for your team in particular

Matt Mullenweg is the co-founder of WordPress, the open source platform powering a staggering 43% of the internet. He also serves as CEO of Automattic—the parent company of brands like WordPress.com, WooCommerce, and Tumblr—which is worth over $7 billion, with over 1,700 employees across 90 countries. In this episode, he discusses some of the most controversial topics surrounding WordPress, Automattic, and the broader open source community.—What you'll learn:• Matt's response to public criticism• Why products like Meta's Llama are “fake open source”• How his team is turning around Tumblr after acquiring it for just $3 million (after Yahoo bought it for $1.1 billion)• Why he mortgaged his home to fund San Francisco's iconic Bay Lights project• Matt's philosophy: “Don't just build a product; build a movement”• Why open source matters: “If the Founding Fathers were around today, they'd be open source advocates”—Brought to you by:• WorkOS—Modern identity platform for B2B SaaS, free up to 1 million MAUs• Vanta—Automate compliance. Simplify security.• Loom—The easiest screen recorder you'll ever use—Find the transcript at: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/the-creator-of-wordpress-opens-up-matt-mullenweg—Where to find Matt Mullenweg:• X: https://x.com/photomatt• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/mattm/• Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/photomatt/• Website: https://ma.tt/—Where to find Lenny:• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com• X: https://twitter.com/lennysan• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/—In this episode, we cover:(00:00) Introduction to Matt Mullenweg(05:10) Matt's career journey(11:15) Bay Lights project and philanthropy(17:28) How Matt got involved with open source(23:25) Why products like Meta's Llama are “fake open source”(27:14) The future of open source and how to get involved(35:25) Building a successful online community(39:12) The WP Engine controversy(50:24) Facing criticism and controversy(55:29) Addressing community concerns(01:08:29) Forking Advanced Custom Fields(01:11:15) The role of social media and public perception(01:16:43) Acquiring and reviving Tumblr(01:24:25) Automattic's acquisition strategy(01:28:51) Final thoughts and future plans—Referenced:• WordPress: https://wordpress.com/• Automattic: https://automattic.com/• CNET: https://www.cnet.com/• Akismet: https://akismet.com/wordpress/• Jetpack: https://jetpack.com/• Toni Schneider on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/tonischneider/• WooCommerce: https://woocommerce.com/• Beeper: https://www.beeper.com/• Day One: https://dayoneapp.com/• Simplenote: https://simplenote.com/• Pocket Casts: https://pocketcasts.com/• Creative Commons: https://creativecommons.org/• Audrey Capital: https://audrey.co/• Stripe: https://stripe.com/• SpaceX: https://www.spacex.com/• Calm: https://www.calm.com/• August: https://august.com/• Daylight Computer: https://daylightcomputer.com/• Keys Jazz Bistro: https://keysjazzbistro.com/• Joomla: https://www.joomla.org/• Drupal: https://new.drupal.org/• Shopify: https://www.shopify.com/• Wix: https://www.wix.com/• Squarespace: https://www.squarespace.com/• Tumblr: https://www.tumblr.com/• Gravatar: https://gravatar.com/• The Bay Lights: https://illuminate.org/projects/thebaylights/• The Bay Lights 360: https://illuminate.org/the-bay-lights-360/• Ben Davis on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ben-davis-sf/• Kinder High School for the Performing and Visual Arts: https://www.houstonisd.org/hspva• Jack Dorsey: We're Losing our Free Will to Algorithms: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9_8NganZSFI• Marc Andreessen: https://a16z.com/author/marc-andreessen/• Bill Gurley on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/billgurley/• An inside look at X's Community Notes | Keith Coleman (VP of Product) and Jay Baxter (ML Lead): https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/how-x-built-the-best-fact-checking-system-on-the-internet• Llama: https://www.llama.com/• WordCamp US & Ecosystem Thinking: https://ma.tt/2024/09/ecosystem-thinking/• As Wall Street Chases Profits, Fire Departments Have Paid the Price: https://www.nytimes.com/2025/02/17/us/fire-engines-shortage-private-equity.html• WordCamp Asia: https://asia.wordcamp.org/2025/• Justin Baldoni Hit with Defamation Suit as PR Teams Turn on Each Other over Blake Lively's ‘It Ends with Us' Smear Campaign Allegations: https://deadline.com/2024/12/justin-baldoni-defamation-lawsuit-publicist-blake-lively-1236241784/• How WordPress Hot Nacho Scandal Shapes WP Engine Dispute: https://www.searchenginejournal.com/how-wordpress-hot-nacho-scandal-shapes-wp-engine-dispute/539069/• Gutenberg: https://wordpress.org/gutenberg/• ClassicPress: https://www.classicpress.net/• Behind the founder: Marc Benioff: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/behind-the-founder-marc-benioff• Mary Hubbard on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/maryfhubbard/• Brian Chesky's new playbook: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/brian-cheskys-contrarian-approach• Founder mode: https://paulgraham.com/foundermode.html• Cow.com: https://www.cow.com/• David Karp on X: https://x.com/davidkarp• Marissa Mayer on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/marissamayer/• Alibaba: https://www.alibaba.com/• WP Engine Tracker: https://wordpressenginetracker.com/• Kumbh Mela: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kumbh_Mela—Recommended book:• Maintenance: Of Everything (in progress): https://books.worksinprogress.co/book/maintenance-of-everything/addenda/page/introduction—Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.—Lenny may be an investor in the companies discussed. Get full access to Lenny's Newsletter at www.lennysnewsletter.com/subscribe

On the podcast today we have Andrew Palmer. Andrew's journey with WordPress started almost two decades ago after transitioning from Joomla. He went on to make significant strides in the community, co-founding Elegant Marketplace and investing in ventures like Atarim and Bertha AI. In this episode, we talk about the intricacies of working within the WordPress ecosystem, comparing the free and commercial sides. Andrew shares his thoughts on the challenges of financially compensating event contributors and the importance of non-financial contributions, such as time. He discusses the absence of a structured regulatory body in the web development industry, and how he thinks this can impact trust and credibility. If you've ever thought about the complexities and commercial dynamics of the WordPress ecosystem, this episode is for you.

On the podcast today we have Andrew Palmer. Andrew's journey with WordPress started almost two decades ago after transitioning from Joomla. He went on to make significant strides in the community, co-founding Elegant Marketplace and investing in ventures like Atarim and Bertha AI. In this episode, we talk about the intricacies of working within the WordPress ecosystem, comparing the free and commercial sides. Andrew shares his thoughts on the challenges of financially compensating event contributors and the importance of non-financial contributions, such as time. He discusses the absence of a structured regulatory body in the web development industry, and how he thinks this can impact trust and credibility. If you've ever thought about the complexities and commercial dynamics of the WordPress ecosystem, this episode is for you.

Willkommen im nerdcafe. WordPress ist das meist genutzte CMS der Welt - das habe ich schon einige male erwähnt. Aber, was ist das eigentlich? CMS? In dieser Episode erkläre ich Vor- und Nachteile von CMS und zeige, was es neben WordPress noch so gibt. Was ist das nerdcafe? Hier geht es um WordPress, Hosting, Content Management Systeme und Web-Themen. Aber natürlich auch um Sicherheit, Backup und Social Media. Kurz gesagt: Um alles, was dich interessiert, wenn du mit deinem eigenen Webseite Projekt starten möchtest. ⏰ Neue reguläre Episoden erscheinen jeden Dienstag um 7:00 Uhr Die nerdcafe to go Variante erscheint unregelmäßig, spontan und meist von unterwegs. Das nerdcafe live findet Donnerstags bei LinkedIn live statt - alle Themen und Termine auf meinem Profil ☕ Machs dir gemütlich und komm gern dazu. Viel Spaß im nerdcafe. Weiterführende Episoden Episode 011 - passt WordPress zu Dir? Episode 018 - Pagebuilder vs Block Editor Episode 022 - digitale Inhalte barrierefrei gestalten Episode 038 - jimdo und WordPress Episode 043 - WordPress als Intranet Weiterführende Links / CMS und Baukasten: TYPO3 - https://typo3.org/ Joomla - https://www.joomla.de/ Squarespace - https://de.squarespace.com/ Jimdo - https://www.jimdo.com/de/

Coming up in this episode * Style it Like it's 1999 * It Violates Freedom 0! * We Turn it off and on again * and You Can Send it to LUS! 0:00 Cold Open 2:10 Going Back to 1999 23:32 Bitwarden Says "BOO!" 39:11 Turn It Off and On Again 56:02 The Windows Cliff 1:16:41 Next Time! 1:20:05 Stinger And the video version! (https://youtu.be/wXODmWq9ZZU) https://youtu.be/wXODmWq9ZZU Warm Up How to make a web page? CSS (https://www.w3.org/TR/CSS/#css) and HTML? (https://html.spec.whatwg.org/multipage/) A static site generator like Jekyll (https://jekyllrb.com) or Hugo? (https://gohugo.io) A CMS like Drupal (https://www.drupal.org) or Joomla? (https://www.joomla.org)

Show DescriptionDave's designing a new tshirt, questions for lawyers about copyrights for code projects, what does the copyright in the footer actually do, what do Dave and Chris require for personal web projects, does Jekyll get updated anymore, the Bob from Hell UX pattern, viewing ads on CNN, what about Joomla or Statamic, and how do paid fonts on the web work? Listen on Website →Links Coming home | A Working Library Release v4.3.4 · jekyll/jekyll How to Monetize a Blog The Verge Joomla CMS Craft CMS Statamic Kirby Adapts SponsorsBluehostFind unique domains, web hosting, and WordPress tools, all in one place. Empower your business or digital agency with Bluehost.

Today we are talking about Drupal's Popularity & Dev Experience, what could be better, and things that are great with guest Nathan Dentzau. We'll also cover Spam Master as our module of the week. For show notes visit: https://www.talkingDrupal.com/469 Topics Drupal's popularity What can Drupal to enhance popularity and enhance dev experience What is missing in Drupal What could use improvement in Drupal What about recent tooling improvements Drupal CMS (Starshot) Resources New drupal Drupal at your fingertips Laravel Next.js Document using DDEV as the recommended Drupal local development environment Just say drupal Hosts Nic Laflin - nLighteneddevelopment.com nicxvan John Picozzi - epam.com johnpicozzi Nate Dentzau - dentzau.com nathandentzau MOTW Correspondent Martin Anderson-Clutz - mandclu.com mandclu Brief description: Have you ever wanted to defend your Drupal website from webform spam using a constantly updating list of known bad actors? There's a module for that. Module name/project name: Spam Master Brief history How old: created in Mar 2018 by Pedro Alves (pedro-alves) Versions available: 8.x-1.99 and 8.x-2.50, the latter of which support Drupal versions 8 through 11 Maintainership Actively maintained Security coverage Documentation on SpamMaster.org Number of open issues: no open issues Usage stats: 449 sites Module features and usage Spam Master is a website protection technology that was originally created back in 2012, and is used across sites based on a variety of technologies, including Wordpress, Drupal, Joomla, and more It uses a variety of techniques to identify and block malicious actors, including “real-time block lists”, honeypot traps, comment analysis, and more By maintaining a list of known bad actors, tracked by IP address and email addresses used, you can also benefit from a “network effect” by being able to identify them based on malicious behavior on any of the thousands of sites using Spam Master The module claims compatibility with a variety of forms, including registration, comments, commerce, and more It includes a variety of reports you can use to understand the amount of spam your site is receiving, and the module can automatically send you an email if it believes your site has reached “Level 3” of spam targeting Spam Master does use licenses on SpamMaster.org, but free licenses are available

Why you should listenLearn the truth behind common misconceptions about cold email and how to overcome them.Discover actionable strategies to increase your cold email open rates and responses.Gain insights from an industry expert with years of experience in cold email marketing.Are you struggling with cold emails that just don't get responses? In this episode, I sit down with Damien Elsing from CLCK Digital to bust three common myths about cold emailing that are holding you back. Damien shares his expertise on what really works in cold email campaigns, how to make your outreach more effective, and how to avoid the traps that lead to low engagement. Whether you're a seasoned marketer or just starting, this episode will give you actionable insights to improve your cold email game.About Damien ElsingDamien has been a HubSpot Partner for almost ten years, and runs an Australian-based sales and marketing consulting agency. Damien's first business was selling Joomla websites door-to-door to cafes and restaurants. He quickly became interested in other (less strenuous) areas of marketing and sales, in particular, copywriting and messaging. After pivoting to a freelance copywriting business, Damien eventually grew to offer agency services, including HubSpot implementation management and content marketing. In the last couple of years, Damien has also offered B2B lead generation services using the cold email skills he developed to promote his business.Resources and LinksClck.com.auDamien's LinkedIn profileApollo.ioZoominfo.comClayPrevious episode: 558 - Breaking Through the Partner Pack to Stand Out with David PriemerCheck out more episodes of The Paul Higgins ShowPaul Higgins Mentoring YouTube channelTech Consultant's RoadmapJoin our newsletterJoin the Tech CollectiveSuggested resources

Avram shares his recent work on testing and reviewing web hosting services for Tom's Hardware. He highlights the various types of web hosting available, including shared hosting, VPS (Virtual Private Server) hosting, and cloud hosting. Avram explains the pros and cons of each type, emphasizing the importance of choosing the right hosting plan based on your needs.Choose a separate domain registrar wiselyWhen it comes to setting up a website, one of the most important decisions you will make is choosing a domain registrar. A domain registrar is a company that allows you to register and manage your domain name. While many web hosting services offer the option to register a domain through them, it is often recommended to choose a separate domain registrar wisely.One of the main reasons for this is the potential hassle of transferring your domain if you decide to switch hosting providers in the future. If your domain is tied to your hosting service, it can make the process of moving your website to a new host more complicated and time-consuming. This is because some hosting providers may make it difficult for you to transfer your domain away from them, especially if they offered you a free or discounted domain as part of your hosting package.By choosing a separate domain registrar, you have more control over your domain and can easily transfer it to a new hosting provider if needed. Popular domain registrars like Namecheap and GoDaddy offer competitive pricing and user-friendly interfaces for managing your domain. These registrars also typically offer additional services such as domain privacy protection and email hosting.Another important factor to consider when choosing a domain registrar is the renewal pricing. Some registrars may offer a low introductory price for the first year of registration, but then significantly increase the price for renewals. By choosing a reputable registrar with transparent pricing policies, you can avoid any unexpected price hikes when it comes time to renew your domain.Choose VPS for flexibility & controlWhen it comes to choosing a hosting plan for your website, the podcast highlights the importance of selecting the right option based on your specific needs. Shared hosting may be suitable for simple websites with minimal traffic, but it has limitations in terms of control and flexibility. On the other hand, VPS hosting offers a higher level of control over your server, allowing you to reboot the server, install software, upgrade the OS, and run various scripts with ease.VPS hosting, which stands for virtual private server, provides a virtual full server experience while sharing a physical server with other users. This means that you have more control and flexibility compared to shared hosting plans. With VPS hosting, you can customize your server to meet your specific requirements, ensuring optimal performance for your website.Cloud hosting provides speedCloud web hosting utilizes a network of virtual and physical servers to host websites, offering a significant advantage over traditional single-server hosting. This network of servers pools computing resources, providing greater scalability and flexibility, which enables quick changes and high uptime for your website.One of the key benefits of cloud hosting is its resilience. If any server in the network experiences issues, your site will remain operational, and its performance will not be affected. This is particularly beneficial for businesses and organizations that require high availability and reliability. Moreover, cloud hosting services provide broad platform support, including various CMS options like WordPress, Drupal, Joomla, and more. They also offer flexible pricing models, ensuring you are charged only for the resources you use.While cloud hosting can offer speed and performance benefits, it may have limitations in terms of control and flexibility compared to VPS hosting. Cloud hosting allocates resources efficiently to serve traffic quickly, making it a suitable option for websites with high traffic volumes.ConclusionThe most important thing to remember when trying to choose a host and a hosting style is that your needs will determine your choice. For some, bandwidth is an important factor. For others, the most important thing is scalability and speed. For other users, configuration is essential. But, in the end, choose the hosting style that is most useful for your needs.

¿Por qué es importante wordpress en tu estrategia de comunicación digital? - Jaime GármarLa creación de sitios web ha evolucionado desde que se masificó Internet a finales de los 90 hasta la actualidad. Contruir un sitio web antes de que terminara el siglo solía ser complejo, hasta que llegó wordpress. ¿Por qué es importante wordpress? El experto Jaime Gármar nos responde.¿Por qué es importante wordpress? (y la evolución de los sistemas de Administración de Contenidos)Los sistemas de administración de contenidos (CMS, por sus siglas en inglés) han sido fundamentales en la transformación en la manera como se crea un sitio web. Pasamos de herramientas complejas y especializadas a plataformas accesibles para cualquier persona con una formación digital básica. Los primeros sistemas: un territorio exclusivo para ingenieros y diseñadoresEn los primeros días de la web, la creación de páginas era un proceso arduo y técnico. Los desarrolladores y diseñadores web debían tener un profundo conocimiento de lenguajes de programación como HTML, CSS y JavaScript, además de familiarizarse con protocolos y servidores. La gestión de contenido implicaba editar directamente el código fuente de las páginas, lo que requería una precisión meticulosa y una gran inversión de tiempo.Los primeros CMS que surgieron en los años 90, como Vignette y Documentum, estaban diseñados para grandes empresas y requerían equipos de profesionales para su implementación y mantenimiento. Estas soluciones eran caras y complicadas, enfocadas en ofrecer funcionalidades robustas para la gestión de grandes volúmenes de contenido, pero lejos del alcance de usuarios individuales o pequeñas empresas.La democratización del desarrollo webEl cambio significativo comenzó a principios de los 2000 con la aparición de CMS más accesibles y fáciles de usar. Sistemas como Joomla y Drupal marcaron un punto de inflexión al ofrecer soluciones más amigables y flexibles. Estos CMS proporcionaron interfaces de usuario más intuitivas y funcionalidades que permitían a los usuarios agregar y gestionar contenido sin necesidad de escribir código.Aun así, la instalación y configuración inicial de estos sistemas seguía siendo un desafío que generalmente requería la ayuda de un profesional. Sin embargo, el verdadero catalizador de la democratización de la creación de sitios web fue WordPress, lanzado en 2003.WordPress: la revolución del CMSWordPress comenzó como una plataforma de blogs, pero rápidamente evolucionó para convertirse en el CMS más popular del mundo. Su éxito radica en varios factores clave:Facilidad de uso: WordPress se distingue por su interfaz intuitiva que permite a los usuarios crear y gestionar contenido de manera sencilla. Con un conocimiento básico de informática, cualquier persona puede empezar a usar WordPress en cuestión de minutos.Versatilidad: La plataforma ofrece miles de plugins y temas que permiten a los usuarios personalizar sus sitios web sin necesidad de programar. Esto ha creado un ecosistema vibrante donde los desarrolladores pueden ofrecer soluciones para casi cualquier necesidad.Flexibilidad: Desde pequeños blogs hasta grandes sitios corporativos, WordPress puede adaptarse a cualquier tipo de proyecto. Su estructura modular permite que los sitios crezcan y evolucionen con las necesidades del usuario.Nuestro invitadao Jaime Gármar nos cuenta ¿Por qué es importante wordpress en tu estrategia de comunicación digital?Jaime Gármar ha trabajado como comercial y coordinador de equipos de venta durante más de 15 años en distintas empresas y sectores como la Banca Privada o la venta de Servicios Telemáticos (de la época del fax y los inicios del ADSL). Mientras tanto, en el 2013 empezó a “cacharrear” con WordPress en sus ratos libres, enamorándose poco a poco del gestor de contenidos.En 2017 dejó un trabajo fijo en una multinacional y creó su primera empresa, Destaca SL, donde hoy trabaja como Asesor WordPress para empresas que usan (o quieren usar) WordPress para sus proyectos online; soporte & mantenimiento WordPress, desarrollo web o mejoras usabilidad y optimización. Desde entonces ha venido dando charlas, formación y colaborando de forma activa en la comunidad WordPress.En 2017 comenzó a impulsar su marca personal con la ayuda del podcast «Club WordPress», donde realiza entrevistas a emprendedores y empresarios del mundo online y que tienen algo que ver con WordPress, de una forma u otra. https://clubwpress.com/Jaime es speaker habitual en eventos de tecnología y emprendimiento donde habla, sin filtros, de sus conocimientos y experiencia en WordPress y el mundo online.Por Qué Es Importante Wordpress, Jaime Gármar, Wordpress, Sistemas De Administración De Contenidos, Sitios Web, Páginas Web, Blog podcast, Podcast Corporativo, Comunicación Organizacional, Recursos Humanos, Desarrollo Profesional, Desarrollo Personal, Comunicación Efectiva, Santiago Ríos, Mil PalabrasRecuerda por favor escucharnos y suscribirte en la plataforma que más te guste:Apple Podcast Spotify Google Podcast SpreakerDeezerPara participar, escríbeme tus comentarios a santiagorios@milpalabras.com.coRecursos recomendados en este PodcastLinkedIN: https://es.linkedin.com/in/jaimegarmarInstragram: https://www.instagram.com/jaimegarmar/Youtube: https://www.youtube.com/@JaimeGarmaWeb: https://clubwpress.com/Suscríbete al Podcast de Mil Palabras enwww.milpalabras.comDescarga GRATIS el ebook “Cómo Crear un Podcast Corporativo”https://milpalabras.com.co/ Otros podcasts recomendados de nuestra redExperiencia Tech.Las voces de los líderes que hacen posible la evolución y la transformación digital. Casos de éxito, innovación, nuevos modelos de negocio y soluciones tecnológicas prácticas para crecer las empresas.https://open.spotify.com/show/77wLRAuRqZMuIiPcaBNHsJHistorias que NutrenConversaciones con profesionales que tienen algo para nutrir tu vida en lo personal, lo profesional, lo espiritual y lo físico.bit.ly/historiasquenutrenSomos CancionesEntrevistas e historias divertidas y personales con Gente que ama la música y sabe de música. (suenan canciones completas al lado de las historias).spoti.fi/3hWr020Logística que Trasciende Aquí encuentras las voces del sector logístico con las mejores prácticas e historias que han contribuido al crecimiento económico de industrias, negocios y naciones.https://bit.ly/logisticaquetrasciendeIdeas Sin editar Reflexiones, opiniones y anécdotas interesantes sobre “cualquier cosa” que se emite en vivo, y claro, sin editar.Conviértete en un seguidor de este podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/mil-palabras--4898895/support.

Did you know that my entire business started because there was one day when I decided that I wanted to learn how websites were built so that I could interpret what the web developers were trying to ask my marketing team to do? In today's episode we're talking all things websites. I still to this day remember creating my very first website: it was on a platform called Joomla and it was sooooo bad. It's been a gradual process of learning about websites, bit by bit and ask any of my clients and they'll tell you - one of my favourite things to do is peek behind the hood of client websites. And I've now worked with almost every type of website backend from Wix to Drupal, Squarespace to Joomla, Wordpress to Shopify, and I can hands down tell you that there are great... and also not so great website builders, and, page builders. Tune into today's episode and I'll be sharing: The difference between proprietary websites and open source websites and what you need to consider The functionality you're missing out on with most of website and page builders on the market How your website might be costing you money My absolute favourite website and tech stack LINKS TO CHECKOUT Wordpress.org Get a 30 Day Free Trial of Kartra - our Course, Email and Funnel Software Thrive Theme + Page Builder LINKS + WORK WITH ME Free Case Study - How we got 1500 launch-ready email subscribers in 3 weeks Swipe our Manychat Setup (and our Instagram Story to Subscribers Sequences + more) Want to launch an online course? Jump on the waitlist here. Work with me in the Well Conceived Mastermind 1:1 Coaching FOLLOW Daily tips on growing your audience, impact and revenue (without sacrificing your life): @robynbirkin

Welcome to nohacks.show, a weekly podcast where smart people talk to you about better online experiences! In this episode, we dive deep with Guido Jansen, an Applied Cognitive Psychologist, podcast host and producer, and global evangelist at Spryker. With over two decades of expertise in psychology, e-commerce, and technology, Guido shares his unique perspective on building online communities, the role of in-person events in fostering connections, and the psychology behind user engagement.Guido opens up about his journey from the early days of the internet, navigating through the 'glory days' with a Pentium 386, to leading communities for Joomla, Magento, and Spryker. He highlights the essential role of memory in understanding data and stresses the invaluable aspects of the community that competitors cannot replicate: the peer-to-peer support, the ecosystem of developers, and the shared experiences that come with being part of a community.Moreover, Guido touches on the evolution of online forums, the importance of face-to-face interactions in building lasting relationships within communities, and how companies can foster a sense of belonging and trust amongst their members. He also delves into the psychological aspects of community engagement, discussing cognitive biases such as social proof and authority, and their impact on digital platforms.Guido's insights extend beyond the digital realm, advocating for the power of in-person connections made at events and conferences, and how these experiences contribute to the success and growth of online communities. Join us as Guido shares his wealth of knowledge, humorous anecdotes, and the psychology behind creating engaging, thriving online spaces. Whether you're a community manager, a developer, or just passionate about digital engagement, this episode offers valuable lessons on the power of community and connection in the digital age.00:00:00 - Getting to Know Guido Jansen00:01:23 - The Unique Hiring Criteria for CRO00:02:05 - The Essence of Online Communities00:04:26 - The Impact of In-Person Events on Community Building00:07:12 - The Evolution and Future of Online Communities00:12:41 - Turning Lurkers into Active Community Members00:16:53 - Building Trust and Fostering Empathy in Communities00:22:47 - Leveraging Cognitive Biases for Community Engagement00:33:25 - Conclusion and Where to Find Guido NextLinks:Guido's LinkedInCRO.CAFESprykerCognitive Biases Wiki page---Tune in for an enlightening conversation and don't forget to rate and review the episode!nohacks.showYouTubeLinkedInEpisode intro/outro music by Josh Silverbauer (LinkedIn, Analyrical YouTube) and Jacon Packer (LinkedIn, Quantable Analytics)

This week's episode features a cache deception issue, Joomla inherits a PHP bug, and a DOM clobbering exploit. Also covered is a race condition in Chrome's extension API published by project zero. Links and vulnerability summaries for this episode are available at: https://dayzerosec.com/podcast/245.html [00:00:00] Introduction [00:00:21] Cache Deception Without Path Confusion [00:07:15] Hello Lucee! Let us hack Apple again? [00:14:41] Joomla: PHP Bug Introduces Multiple XSS Vulnerabilities [00:26:37] Go Go XSS Gadgets: Chaining a DOM Clobbering Exploit in the Wild [00:38:23] chrome.pageCapture.saveAsMHTML() extension API can be used on blocked origins due to racy access check [00:42:28]

Las últimas noticias de Joomla: ¡Joomla es más rápido en PHP más reciente, nueva controversia entre los desarrolladores, grandes nuevos tutoriales y mucho más!: https://mastermindweb.es/actualidad/joomla-5-es-mas-rapido-si-estas-a-la-ultima

Las últimas noticias de Joomla: Plantillas para Joomla 5, reseñas del libro de desarrollo de extensiones para Joomla 5, las mejores ofertas de Navidad y Año Nuevo para los usuarios de Joomla. Además de las últimas entradas en el Showcase de MejorConJoomla.com: https://mastermindweb.es/actualidad/llenando-de-diseno-joomla-5

Descubre el potencial ilimitado de Joomla 5 con mi libro "Developing Extensions for Joomla! 5". Todo lo que necesitas saber antes de comprar el libro en este epsiodio. ¡Gracias al productor musical EvilSound por crear los jingles de Mastermind Web! Tienes todos los enlaces en las notas del episodio: https://mastermindweb.es/145-developing-extensions-for-joomla-5

Descubre los secretos más brillantes detrás de Joomla! 5. Sumérgete con nosotros en las actualizaciones de esta nueva versión.¡No te pierdas esta oportunidad de aprender y actualizarte en nuestro episodio lleno de insights y consejos para potenciar tus proyectos online! ¡Gracias al productor musical EvilSound por crear los jingles de Mastermind Web! Tienes todos los enlaces en las notas del episodio: https://mastermindweb.es/144-joomla-5-dando-a-luz-al-modo-oscuro

Las últimas noticias de Joomla: El regreso de la conferencia principal de desarrolladores de Joomla, Joomla 5 supera a WordPress 6 y una abundancia de consejos y publicaciones cautivadoras. Todos los enlaces en: https://mastermindweb.es/actualidad/nos-reencontraremos-en-2024

Las últimas noticias de Joomla: JoomlaDay EE.UU. 2024, la unconference JoomlaCamp 2024, las ventajas de usar Joomla y los desarrolladores abrazaa Joomla 5. Todos los enlaces en: https://mastermindweb.es/actualidad/prepara-tu-calendario-de-eventos-joomla

Las últimas noticias Joomla: Joomla 5 se lanzó con mejoras de velocidad, SEO y código limpio, junto con correcciones de errores, actualizaciones de seguridad y nuevas herramientas, mientras que la comunidad Joomla participó en diversas actividades, incluyendo artículos, vídeos y próximos eventos en el JoomlaVerse. Todos los enlaces en https://mastermindweb.es/actualidad/joomla-5-agita-el-mundo-con-su-lanzamiento

En este episodio, sumérgete en el emocionante mundo de los Pet Projects en Mastermind Web. Exploramos la creatividad, la innovación y cómo Joomla, ChatGPT y herramientas en línea dan vida a tus proyectos personales. Descubre cómo la pasión se convierte en realidad en el desarrollo web. ¡No te lo pierdas! ¡Gracias al productor musical EvilSound por crear los jingles de Mastermind Web! Tienes todos los enlaces en las notas del episodio: https://mastermindweb.es/143-potenciando-tu-creatividad-pet-projects-en-joomla

In this episode of the WP Minute podcast, host Matt discusses various WordPress news and topics.He starts by highlighting a WordPress.com initiative to encourage people to transfer their domain registration from Google Domains to WordPress.com. Matt also talks about a joint effort by open source projects, including WordPress, to raise concerns about the proposed Cyber Resilience Act in the European Union.He mentions an article about the new WordPress editor, Gutenberg, and concludes by remembering and honoring two individuals who made significant contributions to the WordPress community. Matt encourages listeners to subscribe to the podcast and mentions available sponsorships.WordPress.com offers to pay domain transfer fees for the first millionWordPress.com is offering to cover the transfer fee for the first million domains that move from Google to WordPress.com. This also extends the domain registration for an additional year.WordPress.com commits to matching or even lowering the renewal price that users were paying with Google Domains. This applies to over 400 top-level domains (TLDs) they offer. They also promise to keep domain prices low, only raising them if their wholesale costs increase.WordPress.com has been a domain name provider for over a decade and is committed to the open and inclusive web. They aim to support users' ability to truly own their content and identity on the web. Users don't need a site or hosting plan to manage their domains with WordPress.com.LinkWordPress, Drupal, Typo3, and Joomla join forcesOpen Source Matters, Inc. (Joomla), Typo3, WordPress, and the Drupal Association have issued a joint letter to the legislators of the European Union raising concerns about the proposed Cyber Resilience Act. This is a significant move as these four organizations collectively serve over 50% of the European websites.The organizations argue that the proposed regulation could undermine effective software practices due to its ban on “unfinished software”. They also express concern that the expansive definition of “commercial activity” could deter the contributions of many developers to open source software.The groups see this as an opportunity to explain the unique role that Free and Open Source Software (FOSS) plays in the software that underpins much of the web and to develop a model for how regulation should be applied to it. They also aim to educate legislators and policy-makers about the shared values that open source communities have with the European Union.LinkThis project is moving hella fastThe author expresses their love for Gutenberg, the block editor for WordPress, but also highlights its rapid pace of development. They note that this speed can sometimes leave developers behind, especially due to the shift from PHP to JavaScript (JS).The author discusses the challenges of debugging Gutenberg, particularly when encountering errors. They note that unlike PHP, where errors are logged in a file, JS errors are logged in the browser console. This shift in error handling can be confusing for developers used to PHP.The author criticizes the lack of proper documentation for Gutenberg, particularly when it comes to resolving specific errors. They argue that the current documentation is inadequate and that developers often have to search through GitHub issues to find solutions to their problems. They believe this is one of the reasons why some developers have negative feelings towards Gutenberg.LinkRemember those that have passedWordPress dedicates this page to the memory of those we've lost. They've shaped our project and enriched our community. As we remember their passion and commitment to WordPress and open source software, we celebrate their spirit.Forever in our hearts, their legacy endures through every line of code and every user they've impacted.LinkFrom the grab bag!Here are some other interesting links from the week.https://www.underrepresentedintech.com/webinars/sponsor/https://wptavern.com/classicpress-community-considers-re-forking-woocommerce-for-classic-commerce-v2https://jonathanbossenger.com/2023/07/28/the-state-of-wordpress-developer-tools-survey-results/https://us.wordcamp.org/2023/schedule/ ★ Support this podcast ★

On the Jukebox Podcast today we have Aaron Reimann, and he's here to look back over the last 20 years of WordPress and tease out which aspects of WordPress' evolution were pivotal in making it the CMS that it is today. We talk about the major milestones such as the addition of plugins and themes, as well as custom post types. We get into the fact that it was by no means certain that WordPress would come to dominate the CMS space at the beginning, as other offerings such as Joomla and Drupal were also creating their own solutions. We discuss the importance of Gutenberg as well as the community which binds the whole project together. Will WordPress still be the popular choice for website building? Who knows, but it'll be fun to see what the future holds.

On the Jukebox Podcast today we have Aaron Reimann, and he's here to look back over the last 20 years of WordPress and tease out which aspects of WordPress' evolution were pivotal in making it the CMS that it is today. We talk about the major milestones such as the addition of plugins and themes, as well as custom post types. We get into the fact that it was by no means certain that WordPress would come to dominate the CMS space at the beginning, as other offerings such as Joomla and Drupal were also creating their own solutions. We discuss the importance of Gutenberg as well as the community which binds the whole project together. Will WordPress still be the popular choice for website building? Who knows, but it'll be fun to see what the future holds.

El lanzamiento de la primera alfa de Joomla 5 ha despertado expectación y curiosidad en la comunidad de desarrolladores y usuarios de Joomla. Analizamos cómo esta actualización podría impactar en el desarrollo de sitios web y en las experiencias de los usuarios, brindando una visión de las prometedoras posibilidades que Joomla 5 presenta. ¡Gracias al productor musical EvilSound por crear los jingles de Mastermind Web! Tienes todos los enlaces en las notas del episodio: https://mastermindweb.es/142-una-mirada-al-futuro-joomla-5

En este episodio del podcast, descubrirás siete trucos prácticos para optimizar tu sitio web creado con Joomla. Desde ajustes de configuración hasta la implementación de extensiones útiles, estos consejos te ayudarán a mejorar la experiencia del usuario y optimizar el SEO de tu sitio web. ¡No te lo pierdas! ¡Gracias al productor musical EvilSound por crear los jingles de Mastermind Web! Tienes todos los enlaces en las notas del episodio: https://mastermindweb.es/140-siete-trucos-muy-utiles-con-joomla

Joomla incorpora una búsqueda inteligente, con un algoritmo avanzado que analiza y entiende contenido del sitio para brindar unos resultados precisos. Aprende con nosotros a añadir estas búsquedas a tu sitio y dar una mejor experiencia de uso a tus usuarios. Puedes dejarnos un comentario en: https://mastermindweb.es/138-usando-el-buscador-inteligente-de-joomla

Para tener URLs únicas en Joomla es importante conocer cómo funcionan los menús y los componentes Joomla. En este episodio repasamos cómo genera Joomla las URL y te damos algunos consejos para que tengas siempre el control de las URL de tu sitio. Puedes dejarnos un comentario en: https://mastermindweb.es/137-estructura-de-enlaces-en-joomla

¿Qué nos ofreció Joomla en 2022? ¿Ha habido avances en el proyecto? ¿Qué nos traerá Joomla en 2023? Usamos nuestra bola de cristal para ver qué podemos esperar este año. Puedes dejarnos un comentario en: https://mastermindweb.es/136-el-futuro-de-joomla-en-2023

¿Qué nos ofreció Joomla en 2022? ¿Ha habido avances en el proyecto? ¿Qué nos traerá Joomla en 2023? Usamos nuestra bola de cristal para ver qué podemos esperar este año. Puedes dejarnos un comentario en: https://mastermindjoomla.com/136-el-futuro-de-joomla-en-2023

Si queremos hacer cambios en el HTML de nuestra plantilla y no queremos perder nuestros cambios con las actualizaciones, ahora podemos crear plantillas hijas en Joomla 4. En este episodio vemos cómo crear plantillas hijas en Joomla 4 y cómo podemos trabajar con ellas. Puedes dejarnos un comentario en: https://mastermindweb.es/135-creando-plantillas-hijas-en-joomla-4

Si queremos hacer cambios en el HTML de nuestra plantilla y no queremos perder nuestros cambios con las actualizaciones, ahora podemos crear plantillas hijas en Joomla 4. En este episodio vemos cómo crear plantillas hijas en Joomla 4 y cómo podemos trabajar con ellas. Puedes dejarnos un comentario en: https://mastermindjoomla.com/135-creando-plantillas-hijas-en-joomla-4

I love a good story, and that's what we've got for you today. It's Steve Burge from PublishPress. Steve's had a long history working with open source software, and, as you'll hear, he's not going anywhere. The conversation kicks off with a bit of background about Steve. We talk about his journey with a whole variety of FOSS tools such as Joomla, Drupal, Magento and WordPress. I know this journey well, as perhaps do many of you. There was a time when there really was a no clear 'winner' in the open source CMS market. Many of the platforms were experiencing growth and there was no hint that any one solution would grow to dominate in terms of market share. Given that the landscape had so many popular choices, Steve decided he was going to create a business around serving them all, and so OS Training began. We learn about how Steve tried to grow the business, and ultimately why he moved on to pastures new. We then get into the things that Steve's involved with now, namely PublishPress and MetaSlider, which is a new acquisition. All in all then, this is a lovely conversation with a very thoughtful developer. I hope you enjoy the podcast.

I love a good story, and that's what we've got for you today. It's Steve Burge from PublishPress. Steve's had a long history working with open source software, and, as you'll hear, he's not going anywhere. The conversation kicks off with a bit of background about Steve. We talk about his journey with a whole variety of FOSS tools such as Joomla, Drupal, Magento and WordPress. I know this journey well, as perhaps do many of you. There was a time when there really was a no clear 'winner' in the open source CMS market. Many of the platforms were experiencing growth and there was no hint that any one solution would grow to dominate in terms of market share. Given that the landscape had so many popular choices, Steve decided he was going to create a business around serving them all, and so OS Training began. We learn about how Steve tried to grow the business, and ultimately why he moved on to pastures new. We then get into the things that Steve's involved with now, namely PublishPress and MetaSlider, which is a new acquisition. All in all then, this is a lovely conversation with a very thoughtful developer. I hope you enjoy the podcast.

I love a good story, and that's what we've got for you today. It's Steve Burge from PublishPress. Steve's had a long history working with open source software, and, as you'll hear, he's not going anywhere. The conversation kicks off with a bit of background about Steve. We talk about his journey with a whole variety of FOSS tools such as Joomla, Drupal, Magento and WordPress. I know this journey well, as perhaps do many of you. There was a time when there really was a no clear 'winner' in the open source CMS market. Many of the platforms were experiencing growth and there was no hint that any one solution would grow to dominate in terms of market share. Given that the landscape had so many popular choices, Steve decided he was going to create a business around serving them all, and so OS Training began. We learn about how Steve tried to grow the business, and ultimately why he moved on to pastures new. We then get into the things that Steve's involved with now, namely PublishPress and MetaSlider, which is a new acquisition. All in all then, this is a lovely conversation with a very thoughtful developer. I hope you enjoy the podcast.

En este episodio respondemos a la pregunta ¿se puede montar una tienda online con Joomla? y te enseñamos las alternativas que existen para Joomla 4. Puedes ver las notas del programa y dejarnos un comentario en: https://mastermindweb.es/134-tiendas-online-con-joomla

En este episodio respondemos a la pregunta ¿se puede montar una tienda online con Joomla? y te enseñamos las alternativas que existen para Joomla 4. Puedes ver las notas del programa y dejarnos un comentario en: https://mastermindjoomla.com/134-tiendas-online-con-joomla

Marshall Malone returns on the podcast to reflect on his ongoing road to recovery, which began once he set the goal to totally break up with sugar by his 40th birthday. Listen in as Marshall shares the habits, rituals, and affirmations that have allowed him to shed 45 pounds and counting ever since he started his journey. Always keeping in mind that beliefs are nothing more than thoughts repeated, Marshall unpacks the mental and emotional hurdles that he had to overcome on his path to cultivating a healthier relationship with food—even after crossing the 66th day mark. Molly dispels the myth that “thoughts become things”, proposing instead that “beliefs become things”. Making this paradigm shift helps us to become more gentle with ourselves as we realize that negativity is totally normal, and that there is no such thing as perfection on this journey. Once we decide to break up with sugar, the greatest thing we can do to ensure lasting success is to simply stay consistent. Episode Quotes “What was more important than losing 45 pounds was shedding the negative self-esteem that I had.” - Marshall “If you keep falling off your wagon, you need a bigger wagon.” -Molly “Weight release is an outcome, not a measure.” -Molly “The thing that changes people is self-determination.” -Molly Key Highlights Bridging the gap between knowing you can achieve your goals, to believing it Being intentional about which beliefs you decide to change Why it's normal to have negative feelings at any stage of your journey Keeping your nutrition on-point in busy or stressful times Realizing that you're on this journey for yourself, not for anyone else About Marshall Malone Marshall Malone is a multi-platform content producer with over 15 years of experience in both retail marketing and digital marketing. He has worked with some of the largest companies in the world and has experience working on multiple CMS platforms including WordPress and Joomla. In 2019, Marshall changed his career path and started working in the TV news/broadcast industry as a digital marketing specialist. In 2020, he transitioned into a creative role as Senior Producer.   I'm FULLY committed to having you stay LIGHT and AFLOAT during the Bermuda Triangle aka Holiday Season! LOTS of offerings to help you stay supported - Fireside chats, online holiday support courses, intenSati classes all on https://mollycarmel.com You can also purchase the Breaking Up with Sugar course here: https://molly-carmel.mykajabi.com/buws-course Join my mailing list for a free mini masterclass: https://mollycarmel.com/signup/ Become a part of the Breaking Up with Sugar FB Group: https://www.facebook.com/groups/buwsbook Come hang with me on social media!! IG (I love a DM!): https://www.instagram.com/mollycarmel/ YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCG1GiXHci_XlL4xMXL6-Ajg?view_as=subscriber Tiktok: https://www.tiktok.com/@realmollycarmel?_t=8V6nKJXCfJT&_r=1 Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/mollycarmel.buws

#731: WP-Tonic This Week in WordPress & SaaS With Rayhan Arif of Themeum How Do Build & Growing Plugin Business in a Highly Competitive Sector Themeum started with a small group of people who wanted to bring about change. Since its launch in 2013, the company has grown leaps & bounds with hundreds of thousands of downloads, a huge following, and representatives worldwide. As we grow each day, we help our community be better every day. Plugins Tutor LMS Qubely WP Crowdfunding https://www.themeum.com/ https://www.linkedin.com/in/rayhan-uddin-arif/ #731: WP-Tonic This Week in WordPress & SaaS With Rayhan Arif of Themeum Mahsa Amini https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-62998231 Rayhan Arif of Themeum The Main Question of This Great Interview #1 - Can you give us some background info on Themeum, i.e., its management and how many people work for the company maybe you can give some insights into the company's plans for the next 12 months. #2 - What have been a couple of the biggest obstacles that Themeum and its team have faced connected to building and marketing Tutor LMS? #3 - What are some of the biggest and particular challenges that an IT company faces, which is based in Bangladesh? #4 - What differences do you see connecting WordPress company to other open source cms like Joomla? #5 - If you go back to a time machine at the beginning of your career, what advice would you give yourself? #6 - Are there any books, websites, or online recourses that have helped you in your own business development that you like to share with the tribe?

Guest Ruth Cheesley Panelists Richard Littauer | Ben Nickolls | Eriol Fox | Justin Dorfman Show Notes Hello and welcome to Sustain! The podcast where we talk about sustaining open source for the long haul. Today, we are excited to have as our guest, Ruth Cheesley, joining us from the UK. She is an open-source advocate and Project Lead for Mautic at Acquia. We invited Ruth on this podcast because we don't seem to have enough talks from people who are part of an actual community of coders. Today, Ruth tells us all about Mautic and her job there as Project Lead, she fills us in on Drupal and Acquia, and a tool they used in managing community health called, Savannah. We'll also hear Ruth's strategy when she helped with governance, why Open Source Friday is so important, she explains how she diversifies the contributor base, and we hear her ten-year vision for Mautic she's working on. Go ahead and download this episode now to learn more! [00:02:38] Ruth explains what Mautic is, how she became the Project Lead and being on the Community Leadership Team at Joomla. [00:04:48] Find out the difference between Joomla, Drupal, Acquia, and Mautic. [00:06:17] From someone that organizes open source communities at his job, Justin asks Ruth what tools she uses, and she tells us about one called, Savannah. [00:08:54] Ruth tells us about what her strategy was when she helped with governance. [00:12:47] Richard wonders if the assessment also applies to Mautic and if Mautic is just the same as every other open source project on the web. [00:16:03] Eriol asks Ruth to tell us some success stories or things that have been tricky between different kinds of functions within the open source. [00:19:14] We learn how Ruth sees her role or the roles of other people who are being paid as being part of a sustainable path for Mautic itself, and how money has a play in the ecosystem as well as attribution. [00:21:59] Ruth explains if Acquia pays for full-time engineers and for traditional coder roles for Mautic, and she tells us about Open Source Friday. [00:24:20] Eriol wonders if there's anything people can go read or listen to around how smaller organizations or individuals can make that kind of contribution sustainable and are there things we can implement. [00:27:09] Ruth tells us about a partner's program they created in Mautic. [00:29:27] How does Ruth manage to diversify the contributor base, given that not everyone has the access or time to do that sort of work? [00:32:01] Ruth shares a ten-year vision with a three-year strategy for Mautic. [00:34:10] Find out where you can follow Ruth online. Quotes [00:09:14] “There wasn't really a community empowerment process to set up workflows and training for people to take on the releases, so the project just sort of slowed down.” [00:32:28] “It's quite tricky during longer term plans when you have lots of businesses that are depending on your software, because what one business thinks the product should do is maybe different to what another business thinks the product should do.” Spotlight [00:35:27] Justin's spotlight is Tour de Source newsletter. [00:35:46] Eriol's spotlight is Fantasy Map Generator. [00:36:20] Ben's spotlight is Roden open source bike design. [00:37:02] Richard's spotlight is Richard Matthews and his Oyster Yachts, and the Royal Naval Tot Club of Antigua & Barbuda. [00:37:46] Ruth's spotlight is Ardour, a tool to compose music. Links SustainOSS (https://sustainoss.org/) SustainOSS Twitter (https://twitter.com/SustainOSS?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Eauthor) SustainOSS Discourse (https://discourse.sustainoss.org/) podcast@sustainoss.org (mailto:podcast@sustainoss.org) Richard Littauer Twitter (https://twitter.com/richlitt?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Eauthor) Ben Nickolls Twitter (https://twitter.com/BenJam?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Eauthor) Justin Dorfman Twitter (https://twitter.com/jdorfman?lang=en) Eriol Fox Twitter (https://twitter.com/EriolDoesDesign) Ruth Cheesley Twitter (https://twitter.com/RCheesley) Ruth Cheesley LinkedIn (https://uk.linkedin.com/in/ruthcheesley) Ruth Cheesley Website (https://www.ruthcheesley.co.uk/) Mautic (https://www.mautic.org/) Joomla (https://www.joomla.org/) Sustain Podcast-Episode 109: Dries Buytaert of Drupal on Balancing Makers and Takers to Scale and Sustain Open Source (https://podcast.sustainoss.org/guests/buytaert) Drupal (https://www.drupal.org/) Mautic Open-Source Marketing Automation Project (Open Collective) (https://opencollective.com/mautic) Savannah (https://www.savannahhq.com/) Mautic Community Manifesto (https://www.mautic.org/blog/community/mautic-community-manifesto) Working in Public: The Making and Maintenance of Open Source Software by Nadia Eghbal (https://press.stripe.com/working-in-public) Google Season of Docs (https://developers.google.com/season-of-docs) Open Source Friday (https://opensourcefriday.com/) Acquia's Drupal Acceleration Team (https://dev.acquia.com/blog/acquias-drupal-acceleration-team) Acquia's response to the Mautic Community Manifesto (https://www.mautic.org/blog/press/acquias-response-to-the-mautic-community-manifesto) Mautic Community Governance Model (https://www.mautic.org/blog/press/mautic-community-governance-model) Response to Community Consultation on the Governance Model Proposal (https://www.mautic.org/blog/press/response-to-community-consultation-on-the-governance-model-proposal) Establishing an incentivised partners programme in an open source project (https://speaking.ruthcheesley.co.uk/uIAJxk/establishing-an-incentivised-partners-programme-in-an-open-source-project) Tour de Source (https://tourdesource.substack.com/) Fantasy Map Generator (https://github.com/Azgaar/Fantasy-Map-Generator) Roden (https://opencollective.com/roden) Oyster Yachts (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oyster_Yachts) Royal Naval Tot Club of Antigua & Barbuda (http://rntc.club/) Ardour (https://ardour.org/) Ardour-GitHub (https://github.com/Ardour) Credits Produced by Richard Littauer (https://www.burntfen.com/) Edited by Paul M. Bahr at Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Show notes by DeAnn Bahr Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Special Guest: Ruth Cheesley.

You need a personal brand, and you can use YouTube to create your online personal brand. In this episode, I speak with vlogger and entrepreneur Christina Gwira. We discuss how to find your niche as a YouTuber and use SEO to build your personal brand. Christina Gwira is a Toronto-based vlogger, entrepreneur, and speaker. As a life-long learner and self-starter, Christina has learned how to build websites on WordPress (and Joomla!), create graphics with Photoshop, and design in print for print with Illustrator. By 2016, she had accidentally built her web design firm NOYADESIGNS.——⭐️ Click HERE to subscribe and get access to new podcast episodes every week

Director of WordPress at Cloudways Hosting, Robert Jacobi, shares a basic understanding of cloud hosting, how it differs from shared hosting along with the basics of CDN's, site speed and more.In This Episode00:00 - Introduction03:33 - Greeting to Robert08:32 - Joomla to WP10:48 - WP owns 50% internet13:01 - Retrofit hosting15:54 - What is cloud hosting19:50 - Apartment complex23:54 - Where is the “Cloud”26:25 - Hosting on steroids28:43 - Portable containers31:56 - Redundant data globally33:31 - What is CDN36:51 - Cloudway's purpose40:47 - Making pizza43:41 - Saving time or money47:56 - What are panels53:57 - Generic panels57:52 - Cloudways over Siteground1:02:23 - Meet distinct needs1:05:50 - Next five years1:09:40 - Offload what you don't do1:13:07 - Slightly geekier clients1:17:37 - Caching pays off1:19:45 - Final thoughtsGet all links, resources and show notes at:https://joshhall.co/191

David: “What do you think the WordPress community takes for granted?” Robert: “The support of Automattic.”Excerpt #54 — "What WordPress Can Learn from Joomla"In this episode of Post Status Excerpt, David and Dan team up to talk with Robert Jacobi. Robert is the Director of WordPress at Cloudways. He has also served as president of the Joomla open source project. With his experience and knowledge of Joomla's approach to governance, contributors, and the many challenges facing open source projects, the three dive into what the WordPress community can learn from a peer open source CMS of the same generation as WordPress.Don't miss our previous episode about Drupal and what WordPress can learn from that project — with guest Amy June Hineline.Why This Matters: WordPress might be big, but it's not the only open source fish in the CMS ocean. Drupal and Joomla are the other two big names that have matured but taken their own unique paths with different governance models, cultures, and ways of getting things done. There's a lot to learn outside the WordPress bubble from other projects like Joomla as they experience unique challenges and navigate familiar ones.

Elon Musk won't be joining Twitter's Board of Directors after all. Plus, what happens when cops pull over a driverless car? And we learn about a gorilla who is spending too much time looking at smartphones. See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

"When it comes to contributing…. time is a true privilege" - Amy JuneThere are a lot of people in the WordPress community who also work (or previously worked) with Drupal, Joomla, and other open-source software projects. Amy June Hineline is Community Manager at Opensource.com. She is also a member of both the WordPress and Drupal communities. As DrupalCon 2022 approaches, Amy June shares the lessons she thinks WordPress can learn from Drupal's relationship with its contributors and open source.Why This Is Important: Drupal and WordPress are both mature open source PHP/MySQL CMS platforms that emerged in the early 2000s. They share a common goal and have similar communities, but there are notable differences between them. There are opportunities for each community to learn from the other.Every week Post Status Excerpt will brief you on important WordPress news — in about 15 minutes or less! Learn what's new in WordPress in a flash. ⚡You can listen to past episodes of The Excerpt, browse all our podcasts, and don't forget to subscribe on Spotify, Amazon Music, Google Podcasts, iTunes, Castro, YouTube, Stitcher, Player.fm, Pocket Casts, Simplecast, or by RSS.

If you're like me, you know Josepha Haden Chomposy is the Director for WordPress the open source project in title, but you probably don't know what she does on a day to day basis. Or that she's part of the Open Source Group Division inside of Automattic. Something I always knew, but once framed that way in discussion, was more interesting to hear. I was lucky enough to chat with Josepha for nearly an hour, so I'm breaking up the conversation in two parts. Today, part 1, we'll cover the logistics of her role, bringing WordCamps back, and the challenges with Gutenberg. Thanks to folks over at Malcare for supporting this episode of the Matt Report. If you want to support me, you can buy me a digital coffee or join the super-not-so-secret Discord group for $79/year at buymeacoffee.com/mattreport Episode transcription [00:00:00] Josepha: You say that's the easiest question, but like anyone who has spent any time with me knows that I also spend a lot of time, like, considering, like what, what, what are my, what am I doing? What, what purpose do I bring to the world? Who am I when I'm not trying to accomplish things? Like, yeah, it's easy, but it's not easy. [00:00:17] So yeah. I show stuff. I Hayden jumbo, C a WordPress projects, executive director since 2019. So I'm starting my what third year of it is that right? Yeah. Starting my third year of it, time flies.  [00:00:29] Matt: That's 30 years in COVID years, by the way.  [00:00:32] Josepha: ain't that true? Isn't that true? And before I did this, I actually was as my Twitter bio suggests very much into. [00:00:43] Digital literacy and making sure that that communities were safe and sound, because I think that communities are the foundation of everything that we try to do in the world. And so, yeah, that's me. [00:00:53] Matt: There's a lot of folks who think of community as well. It's a big marketing buzzword for sure. Right. Everyone who has a product company wants a community. But they are looking at community in probably a very lesser form definition in a silo and something to just kind of prop up either their brand or product. [00:01:12] Maybe get some feedback and get really interested. Customers. Community is a whole different ball game and scale at your level. Give us a sense of just like the daily routine. One has to go through to manage what you have to manage.  [00:01:29] Josepha: Gosh, from a community aspect or just from like me as a  [00:01:33] Matt: you wake up and you're and you look at your wall-to-wall meetings. Cause I, I imagine largely that's what you're doing is meeting talking to people, fusing ideas, together, shaking hands, dealing with folks, maybe crying and laughing and arguing. How do you do it?  [00:01:50] Josepha: I'll tell you, number one, that only about a quarter of my time, these. Is spent in meetings, which is really different from, from how it used to be. I used to spend about 60% of my time in meetings. And that was really hard just cause when you're in a meeting, you really have to stay present to, to really support the people that you're there with. [00:02:09] And, and also to really get that work done and be as fruitful as you can with it. And so about, about a quarter of my time now is in meetings. And actually like I've got, I've got a number of hats obviously, cause I'm the executive director of the WordPress project, but I also lead the source practice at automatic. [00:02:29] And so there's a lot going on there. And the best way that I have to manage it at the moment is to just kind of set focus intentions for my day. Like I used to have a day where I just worked on automatic things or when I just worked on community things. And like that's still documented out in the world, like the, the themes that I have for each day, so that like, if people had had to work with a deadline, they knew what. [00:02:55] Going to probably get to on various days so that they could time their information. To [00:03:00] me, it was super useful when I didn't have quite as big a job as I have now. But now I kind of have a day where I focus on meetings. I have a day where I focus on the strategy. I try to make sure that if I have any community things that I'm blocking, I try to get those accomplished, like before the big meetings, which generally is like Wednesdays and Thursdays. [00:03:19] So try to get and get everybody the information that they need to keep moving on time. But I actually start basically every day with about 30 minutes of mindfulness. Just no meetings, no slack open, no anything else. And just making sure that I understand what my goals are for the day, what my tasks tend to beat for the day. [00:03:41] And then I end every day with about 30 minutes of what I like to call my ta-da list instead of a to-do list, things that I got done and that I need to get done tomorrow. [00:03:51] Matt: Little positive affirmation to end the and the day you say that the open source practice is sort of a different approach. Maybe something that you wrangle are managed differently. Can you give us give the listener a sense of what that might be  [00:04:04] Josepha: At automatic or just generally do I approach open-source differently?  [00:04:07] Matt: You mentioned that you, that you either manage or work on the open source practice of WordPress is that something different than the, than the day-to-day role of the executive director?  [00:04:17] Josepha: Huh. Yes and no. So on the one hand I do, we technically are referred to as a division inside automatic. It's the open source group division. And I just, I don't know, saying division seems very clinical and. Very divisive, like splitting things into when maybe we, we need to do a bit less of that right now. [00:04:38] And so when I refer to it as open-source practice, it's a little bit, because I'm trying to make it clear that it's like an ongoing thing that we work on an ongoing thing that we do, but also to identify that it is that yeah, we do. We kind of approach it differently. So open source as a practice rather than open source as just a general methodology, I think has a wider application than just software or adjust your product. [00:05:04] I think that open source, many of those 19 lessons of open source that exists out there could be seen as just like core intentions for how to accomplish things. And when you move it away from just like, this is a core directive for how to build software and instead think of it as this open source methodology that you can use to coordinate an. [00:05:30] I think it makes a big difference to how you accomplish things in open-source projects. And so, yes, that's, I wouldn't say it's different from my work as the executive director, but I do know that people don't necessarily identify that work.  [00:05:44] Matt: Right. How big is that division?  [00:05:46] Josepha: that particular division is just over a hundred people at this point. [00:05:50] And then we also have we, the WordPress project also have the five for the future contributors who work with me and that's a little lighter [00:06:00] touch. They get about a ping or two a week from me just asking what I can help them work through. And just checking in with them generally. And there's probably like 20, 25, maybe 50, if we're generous outside of automatic that are doing that. [00:06:16] So yeah. [00:06:16] Matt: And do the core contributors that contribute to WordPress open source, open source wars, WordPress from automatic. Do they fall under that division or can folks be from any division in, at automatic to contribute?  [00:06:28] Josepha: Yeah. Most of them do a lineup in this division, but there are also because so many of automatics products are, are part of the WordPress ecosystem. There are also plenty of people that are just in automatic as a whole that are contributing to core. So, [00:06:43] Matt: And if I could just illustrate that from a non not automatic company, this could be something like a GoDaddy might have a open source division  [00:06:53] Josepha: Right. [00:06:54] Matt: and their objectives or mission would be to give back to open source. And they would say, Hey, let's give back a little bit to WordPress. Let's give a little bit to whatever Joomla or PHP or something else. [00:07:06] That's open source. You'd have this collective that, that their mission is to, Hey, we're part of this bigger company, the bigger company, isn't all about open source and we're missioned to go out and contribute to open source.  [00:07:18] Josepha: Exactly. Right. So blue host has a group like that. Goat GoDaddy does have a group like that. Google also Yoast all those, all those folks in there, others as well. I'm not, I'm not intentionally leaving other people out. It's just that there are probably like a hundred different companies and I will not be able to just rattle them all off that way,  [00:07:38] Matt: Eh speaking of GoDaddy, looking at con core contributors I don't have the pie chart in front of me. In fact, it wasn't even a pie chart, but there were lots of circles. with automatic representing the largest piece. If you were to give advice to other companies to, I don't know, spin up divisions, give more spin up open-source divisions, give back more to whether it be WordPress or another division. [00:08:00] Are there one or two, like key things. If I want to form an open-source division or to contribute more, what's the best step forward for an organization? To either measure it or approach it to rally people around it. Do you have like one or two things that you look to as a north star?  [00:08:20] Josepha: Yeah. So, firstly, if you're, if you are thinking about creating an open source team, who's either planning to give back to WordPress or just planning to give back to open source in general. There is actually a five for the future white paper that exists to just like essentially take to your, your corporate entity that says, like, this is what it means to give back to this product that has given to us. [00:08:45] And it's, I think on wordpress.org/five, I think there's a link to it right there. But if not, We'll get it done.  [00:08:53] Matt: sure.  [00:08:53] Josepha: And, and that in the end does direct you kind of, to me to make sure that you have all of the information about [00:09:00] the open source philosophies that we're working with in the WordPress project. [00:09:03] And also make sure that that, that we all kind of understand what the goals of the WordPress project are at the moment. And so there is kind of just like a kickoff call with me to see if everyone agrees, it's like any, any relationship that you're entering into, everyone should understand what we're working with first and then make that choice together. [00:09:20] So that's one thing that anyone can take a look at also if. As an employer or just as yourself, want to contribute from like a five for the future pledging perspective, but don't necessarily have the time or resources to commit like a whole team's worth. There is actually a contributor training series that you can go through that gives you the basics of like how WordPress does open source, how open source functions in software, and also covers things like how we make decisions in WordPress, all of that stuff. [00:09:54] I believe that's on wordpress.org/contributor, hyphen training or something like that. We can find the link for your show notes, but yeah, those are both excellent ways to just like take stock of what that kind of contribution tends to look like. And see if it's a good fit. [00:10:11] Matt: I I'd imagine that part of your role or part of your efforts are to knock on the doors of, of big businesses that might be leveraging WordPress and saying, Hey, I think you can donate another person or two or 20 to the cause. Do what, what, what is that like? Are those efforts fruitful for you or are there certain strategies you try to put in place before you knock on the door of, I don't know. [00:10:35] I use GoDaddy just because it's the top of mind Right. now, but I'll go daddy or Bluehost or whomever [00:10:39] Josepha: Right. Yes.  [00:10:40] Matt: government.  [00:10:42] Josepha: the government,  [00:10:43] Matt: Right.  [00:10:43] Josepha: I have never knocked on the door of the government to ask them to contribute  [00:10:46] Matt: me know when you find that door, which door is it? I don't know. Neo find another one. [00:10:51] Josepha: find another door. Yeah, no. So, yes, there is general. I don't, I call it fundraising just because I understand that like, there are. Four-ish different economies in the WordPress ecosystem and not all of them are about money. A lot of them are about time and, and other things. But so yeah, I do that outreach every year for the most part. [00:11:14] And actually met does that as well. So Matt often we'll start with like the highest decision-making levels. Cause you, you do kind of have to get some buy-in on that. Not, not this Matt, dear readers other Matt, Matt Mullenweg what was I saying? Yeah, he frequently will start at like the CEO levels of having those conversations and then they move to me to kind of have a better understanding of what it looks like, what it could look like, what we want it to look like, all of that stuff. [00:11:42] As far as like, do we, do we, do I do anything to like prepare companies for that? Not really. The fight for the future program has been an excellent experiment and has been growing for years. And, and I don't know that I have ever [00:12:00] felt the need to like prime prime, anyone for the ask of like, do you have anyone who can help us with these security patches? [00:12:09] Do you have anyone who can help us with these design issues that we have? Like, I've never felt the need to do it necessarily. But that doesn't mean it's not happening. As I mentioned, like Matt does that also, he does that outreach as well. And so if there's priming for that call from that, that outreach from me, it's probably happening there. [00:12:27] Matt: Forgive my not understanding fully of how the inner workings of automatic works, but from executive directors that I've worked with in my local community, a lot of them are for nonprofits and a lot of them are, are raising money and that's a whole large part of their job. [00:12:44] Do you do that at all for any degree of the work for the WordPress foundation or is that completely separate? Not even in your purview.  [00:12:52] Josepha: I used to do that. Yeah. is not in my purview anymore. We actually have some community folks that really have done excellent work to keep that program moving all of this, the global sponsorship programs. They do that work these days. I did use to, but, but not now.  [00:13:09] Matt: Okay. Fantastic. And speaking of the, of the foundation word camps coming back. Question, mark. We just had word camp us last year. And now I think Birmingham is next. If I, if I have that correct. Is there other others coming? Is that something that you're looking forward to proceeding cautiously with? [00:13:32] Again, I know there was something on the Tavern about no or little to no masks at the last camp. A lot of folks worried about it. What's your prediction or what's your outlook on local meetups or local camps? Sorry,  [00:13:45] Josepha: So word camp, U S actually was, was a virtual this year where it can't one state of the word  [00:13:50] Matt: state of the word, sorry. Yep. It felt like a word camp because everyone Was. celebrating it.  [00:13:55] Josepha: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, it was it was an excellent experiment and it actually was not our first in-person event. There was a word camp in severe. I want to say that that weekend right before state of the word, that was our first one back. [00:14:09] And then yes, we've got Birmingham on the calendar. We have WordCamp Europe on the calendar as an in-person event. And we have word camp us 20, 22 on the calendar as, as an in-person event. Cautiously with cautious optimism. Is that a thing I can say? We're proceeding forward with cautious optimism about it. [00:14:27] Matt: in San Diego was cautious. Optimism.  [00:14:31] Josepha: Excellent. I'll let them know. Yeah, like. I have been, I've been talking to people about this a lot this week. So much of the information that we get from, from everyday users of WordPress, about what they love and what they don't love, what they need and what they want with the software comes from those events and not having them has certainly been very difficult for the community as a whole, to, to keep on [00:15:00] top of their own resilience. [00:15:01] But, but the community of contributors, as it relates to the support of the community of users, like it really, it's very clear to me that all of our contributors feel a little bit, I don't want to say hamstrung, but like they don't have the same touch points that they used to have to make the decisions that we all have to make. [00:15:22] And so. That's the optimistic side. Like I'm optimistic that we can get back to in-person events so that we can have that, that high value information from our users of the CMS more and, and faster and better. And the cautious side is of course, that everything is changing with this from week to week. [00:15:42] At this point, like for a while, it was month to month, things were changing and now it's week to week, things are changing and, and I never want to put people at undue risk and so am prepared to make the best call that we can make in the moment. And as things move as quickly as they are. It has made it more difficult when things were just kind of progressing on a month to month scale, you had time to, to cancel things or to move them or, or whatever you had to do. [00:16:15] But in the case of Omicron that moved so quickly that, that there was a little bit of blind sightedness happening on it. So  [00:16:24] Matt: is  [00:16:24] Josepha: I don't know if I've answered your question. [00:16:26] Matt: no that you have, or you've let us to at least maybe the next question. or the maybe just helping me define a better question. Is is there more stress on the local volunteers to raise more? Because one, there might not be enough ticket sales for enough people to maybe businesses have retracted from sponsoring camps in three. [00:16:50] I think that there's less money at hand, right? To, to Dole out to word camps in the fund, for lack of a better phrase.  [00:16:57] Josepha: in the fund. Yeah. So, That's such a complicated question. We, the, so the, the WordPress community support entity has been providing still a good portion of, of the infrastructure that people need in order to organize a WordPress event. And as far as like getting fiscal sponsorship, getting financial sponsorship from local entities, I am sure that it is more stressful, but I don't know that, that we, as like the stewards of this community have said, like, you have to find more local sponsorship because we cannot commit to as much global sponsorship. [00:17:40] I don't, I don't recall that happening with any of the events that we've seen lately.  [00:17:46] Matt: got it. Got it. Let's let's shift gears back to to WordPress to Gutenberg we think back well, we have WordPress 5.9 in 19 ish, 19 [00:18:00] ish days. Right?  [00:18:00] Josepha: no one be scared. That's great. [00:18:02] Matt: Thinking back three and a half years ago, whenever Gutenberg was announced, there was mass chaos, massive stereo. My God, we've got this Gutenberg thing. [00:18:10] What is it? Don't want it everyone up in arms about it. I, for one while maybe I didn't enjoy the way it rolled out and the way it was communicated as a non-developer. Yeah. [00:18:22] And when people started using it, I was like, this is, this is, this is just software. It's going to get better. I think here we are three and a half years later, it's a much different product. [00:18:32] It's much more refined from obviously when it started. Cause it's been three and a half years. Although  [00:18:37] Josepha: you've been working on it in the background. [00:18:39] Matt: Yeah. if you were, if you were, if you were in the early beta access, you were, you were playing with it. If you knew how to download it from GitHub [00:18:46] Josepha: Those fancy people.  [00:18:48] Matt: Those fancy people. [00:18:49] I don't even know above my pay grade. [00:18:50] Although I still struggled to drag some blocks in between columns. Sometimes that's a little bit frustrating, but do you think the the time that you think it'll take the same amount of time basically is what I'm getting at for full site editing to mature and to be adopted? Or do you think this is going to be fast paced because now we've kind of experienced Gutenberg.  [00:19:08] Josepha: My short answer is I do not think it's going to take as long and I'm going to give you a long answer now. So on the one hand, I think it's true that people are now a bit more bought in. Like our users are quite a bit more bought in on on this. Change than they were in 5.0, there's, there's a reason for them to trust that it's the right direction. [00:19:29] We have consistently been showing that ever since 5.0, came out and so like, yeah, I think that on the one hand, there's a lot more willingness in public sentiment and public grace that we have at the moment. And so from that aspect, I think that that we're in a much better position than we were when we were merging things in 5.0, but also between 5.0. [00:19:50] And now we have actually heard and by we I'll just be super clear. I have heard so much that it's not necessarily the change that upset people. It was how we made the change. And I totally understand that people felt left out. They felt like it was forging ahead without them, like, there was no way they could keep up with it. [00:20:10] And I, and I understand that it like it's the Gutenberg project was and is moving along a lot faster. Then WordPress core moves along from the, from the standpoint of like how frequently they have releases. So releases every two weeks is very different from releases every four months. And so having heard from so many people in so many different areas of the project, that, that it was the way that we did it. [00:20:37] That was so upsetting. Between 5.0, and now we actually have done together a lot of work to change the way that we talk about it. And so there are a lot more consistent updates from the folks who are working consistently within the core Gutenberg spaces of things, including stuff like our performance metrics that we are [00:21:00] gauging all of the features that we're planning, the features that did get in there. [00:21:03] And the last two weeks, like we're just communicating more in that space, but also we have really re-invigorated the testing area and the triage practice, both of those practices across the WordPress EcoSys. And created a number of different places for anyone to get this kind of information and sponsored a number of different spaces, where users and developers and agency owners and, and decision makers, technical, or not have been able to get better information about what they need to know about the software. [00:21:37] And so when was 5.0 at the end of 2018? Yeah. So. Yeah. Since 2018, I would say that there are probably four or five really big projects that have helped us to move past that whole, like it's the way you did it. Like we figured out the ways that we did it, that made people mad and we've made changes to fix them. [00:21:59] They're four or five large scale things that you can see, but also a lot of just small individual things that each team or any contributor does to make that whole process a little less scary, a little more tidy, little easier to see everything that we're doing on learn right now with trying to get more and more workshops and courses and lessons out for people like, yeah, we've done a lot of work based on the feedback that I got. [00:22:24] I did a six month listening tour after 5.0, to hear how mad  [00:22:29] Matt: That was. said with a big site.  [00:22:31] Josepha: Yeah, it was, it was hard. I it's like a listening tour is hard anyway, but I spent six months going to the events with people who were the maddest at WordPress and at me and at Matt and, and did nothing, but like tell me how much you hate this. [00:22:50] And that's all I wanted to hear it. I didn't have reasons or explanations or excuses for anything like their feelings of anger were because they felt like we hadn't heard them. And so I was showing up to hear them and, and in that six months time, that is when I identified, these are the things we need to fix in the future. [00:23:10] And we have spent years fixing them and I'm very proud of that work, so.  [00:23:13] Matt: It's a perfect segue to a couple other questions. Let's get the pitchforks and the torches out folks. No, I'm just kidding. Surprise. You're on a game show. Have you seen running, man? No, I'm just kidding.  [00:23:20] Josepha: No. [00:23:21] Matt: On the listening tour I'm sure you heard things like, Oh, what we're doing here is we're just competing against Squarespace and Wix. [00:23:28] Why do we want to, this is, I'm sure you've heard that. Right. We're Prestos wants to compete against Squarespace and Wix. My response is duh  [00:23:36] Josepha: of  [00:23:36] Matt: duh. Yes, I do. Like, I want to compete against Squarespace and Wix so that we can, because I want WordPress to survive. Do you think that did one, did you hear that sentiment two, do. [00:23:48] you think that's kind of going away and feeling like, Yeah. [00:23:50] actually we do want to compete against them to, to win.  [00:23:53] Josepha: I definitely heard it a lot and I hear it a lot even now. There are, there are two sides to that [00:24:00] conversation. Cause sometimes people are like, you're competing against these things that are so tiny, why bother. And sometimes it's, you're competing against something that is not the group of, that's not catering to the group of people that WordPress wants to cater to. [00:24:14] And so like, there are two different takes on that particular argument and I see both sides of it. But also like, technology always, you have to stay relevant and you have to move fast enough to be if, if not a competitor to a tiny thing that exists now. Cause like, sure, it's not a threat if it's 1% of usage across the web. [00:24:36] But, but there is something to be said for self disruption in that way, like I like this is my favorite example to use. So like when the iPad came out and there were just. Tablets everywhere. And the iPad mini came out and everyone was like, there's no point in having an iPad mini, we do not know why apple is doing this. [00:24:56] This is the most useless thing. Like people were like, why are you even bothering? No one wants this one. Plenty of people wanted it. And to taking the opportunity to, to, to disrupt what's happening in your own ecosystem before other people can show up and, and do that disruption to you, like that's smart. [00:25:18] That's a good idea. And so I do know that Gutenberg has been a really disruptive change and that for a lot of people, it also has been a breaking change. Even if it's not like breaking websites or breaking the code or breaking your dashboard, a broken workflow is still a breaking change for you. [00:25:35] And like, that is why Gutenberg is, is as a project being done over so many years. Right. If, if you feel like asking me about, about the reason that that was the right call, I would tell you, but most people don't care. But yeah, like moving fast enough to stay relevant, slow enough to bring people with you where you can is so smart and not only for the project, but for the people who rely on the project to have better lives. [00:26:05] So, [00:26:06] Matt: True or false. This is this is not about open source WordPress, but this is about automatic. And I would say that about true or false, the challenge true or false in your opinion  [00:26:14] Josepha: We're building some caveats in here. I like it. [00:26:17] Matt: I don't wanna, I don't wanna like put you too much on the spot, but you have walls. Your opinion. [00:26:22] The challenge for automatic is on innovation and pushing the software forward and fricking everything. Woo commerce, Gutenberg, wordpress.org, jet pack. The challenges still not enough people I'd imagine to, to help produce push code to, to improve everything across the board.  [00:26:42] Josepha: you threw so many pieces in there that I cannot give a true false cause that's probably true for some and less true for others would be my guests right now.  [00:26:50] Matt: let's talk about, let's say Gutenberg true or false, not enough people to, to really refine the whole thing. Fast enough,  [00:26:59] Josepha: I don't know if you [00:27:00] can hear my stomach growling. Cause like my microphone is right down by my stomach. I apologize if you can, like, I don't have a monster in the room. It's  [00:27:06] Matt: your, your stomach. cannot answer the question.  [00:27:10] Josepha: It tried real hard. It had so many things to say. Yeah. So for gluten, so you're asking true false for gluten. Is the limiting factor that we don't have enough people. [00:27:18] Matt: Let me frame some context around it. When I interviewed Matt when I interviewed Matt back in January, 2021 [00:27:24] There's just, there's so much on the plate for automatic in terms of.com jet pack, VU, commerce, which is just a sleeping sleeping giant we don't have anything close to a WooCommerce Shopify yet. And I look at automatic and I say the biggest problem for Matt right now is just, there's just not, he can't hire fast enough to, to iterate and develop these products. There's just. It's just impossible for somebody to hire this many folks and get them up to speed to push these products. [00:27:53] I feel the same for Gutenberg. And I guess the open source answer is yeah. [00:27:58] more, maybe more people should step up or more brands and organizations that have the money hosting companies should step up to to contribute to this right. To refine the product. Like I wanna be able to drag my block in between three columns without me losing my mind.  [00:28:14] Josepha: Oh man, I have a very complicated false for you. I know. So, okay. So there are a lot of people contributing to Gutenberg and, and while we can always use more people contributing that we can not contest there is actually a different limiting factor. That's not necessarily about developers. And so. [00:28:37] I'll just get real clear. So I don't, I don't know that other people agree with me about this and, and that's their prerogative. But as someone who is looking across our entire ecosystem across our entire project from a substance, a pretty high level, with a huge number of, of data points that are coming to me from, from the community, I can say with pretty high confidence that some of the more pressing limiting factors are things like we don't have enough. [00:29:11] Essentially mid-level deciders who can say confidently, these are the black and white questions that have already been answered. This is the answer and move everybody forward. Like we have a lot of bottlenecks that are still built into that, into that product. There is also an incredibly limiting factor of our user outreach, like are unactivated community members, as I like to call them in my notes to myself are the, the community members that represent our community of users. [00:29:42] So people who don't necessarily know that the project exists, they don't necessarily know that they can like provide feedback about what is working. What's not working, what's broken. What is what could be made better? Like the lack of feedback from them. Frequently is something that is more of a [00:30:00] limiting factor than not having enough developers. [00:30:02] Now, if the entire WordPress user base showed up and was like, here's all of our feedback, like for sure, we would suddenly discover that we don't have enough developers to get those things done can confirm.  [00:30:13] Matt: Yeah.  [00:30:13] Josepha: But, but yeah, I think that our more pressing issue is around the people who can help us, like confidently say, this is the most likely decision based on what we know from Mathias, who is our primary kind of Gutenberg architect or Riyadh or whoever it is. [00:30:31] We just have such a small group of people who can do that. And that's true to an extent in the WordPress project as well. There are various things that we could blame that on COVID is a great example of a thing that might cause people to be less. Less engaged in that level of, of contribution. [00:30:52] But yeah, I think that in the hierarchy of things where I would say, yes, we definitely have a dearth of those. Those two would come up prior to developers on the open-source side.  ★ Support this podcast ★

Even with all of the WordPress consolidation happening, there's still plenty of opportunity ahead for the industry. There's lots of potential users, customers, and room for investment (note: we just saw the acquisition of Yoast happen by Newfold, formally EIG. If I had to guess, somewhere between a $30-50M deal.) If you though the plugin space is crowded or even more specifically the membership & LMS veritcal, then I have a surprise for you today. Nathalie Lussier, founder of AccessAlly a LMS plugin for WordPress joins us to talk about her venture in building her business. From selling online courses and building community to building and selling software — this is a fantastic lesson for all of us. Her and her team are really proving that in the a crowded market, you stand apart from the crowd by knowing who your perfect customer is and building them the perfect product. Episode Transcript [00:00:00] This episode is brought to you by paid memberships pro well, actually it's their other product. Site-wide sales at site-wide sales.com. It's a complete black Friday cyber Monday and flash sales tool for WooCommerce or paid memberships pro. Before, you know it, the deal day holidays will be fast upon us. And you want to prepare your WooCommerce or paid memberships pro website.[00:00:20] With the site-wide sales plugin, use it to make custom sale banners, targeted landing pages or apply discounts automatically in the cart. Use it to track the performance of all of these promotional features using the reporting feature, which will paint the picture of your black Friday and holiday shopping sales. I use it to help make your woo commerce or paid memberships pro store more money.[00:00:43] Get the first 30 days for free. And then it's an easy $49 a year. Check out site-wide sales.com. That's site-wide sales.com to make more money. This holiday sale season.[00:00:56] Matt: Even with all of the WordPress consolidation happening, there's still plenty of opportunity ahead for them. There's lots of potential users, customers, and room for investments notes. We just saw the acquisition of Yoast happened by new fold, formerly EIG. If I had to guess a deal somewhere between a 30 and $50 million acquisition, if you thought the plugin space is crowded or even more specifically, the membership and LMS vertical is crowded.[00:01:22] Then I have a surprise for you today, Natalie Lucier founder of access, ally and LMS plugin for WordPress joins us to talk about her venture in building her. From selling online courses and building community to building and selling software. This is a fantastic lesson for all of us. Her and her team are really proving that in the crowded space, you stand apart from the crowd by knowing who your perfect customer is and building them the perfect product you're listening to the Maryport a podcast for the resilient digital business builders.[00:01:51] Subscribe to the newsletter maryport.com/subscribe and follow the podcast on. Spotify, wherever you listen to your favorite podcasts better yet. Please share this episode, please do, because I just read that the best way to grow a podcast is word of mouth and sharing. So please share this episode with others.[00:02:09] We'd love more listeners around here. Okay. Let's get into today's episode.[00:02:13] It almost feels like a SAS software as a service. Tell us about that, that moment when you realize I'm teaching people, I might as well build the software too.[00:02:22] Nathalie: Yeah, absolutely. So I was in the like marketing and tech space and doing videos on like, how to build a popup and how to do things on your WordPress site and how to market your courses and all of that stuff. And I was teaching. In courses and also on YouTube and people who were, signing up to our free challenge.[00:02:42] We had a challenge called the 30 day list building challenge to help people build an email list and they were signing up. And it was, becoming pretty popular. So we had a lot of people logging in at the same time. And at the time. I thought we were getting attacked by hackers or something.[00:02:56] Cause we have so many logins and the way that our plugin that we were using at the time it kept pinging our CRM and every single time somebody went to any page on that site. So, we were having nightmares basically. I would wake up every morning and have to call my host to have them. Unlock us, essentially, we put my website back up and then all the people who were signing up were upset with us because, they signed up and they couldn't get what they were asking for or what we had promised.[00:03:21] So essentially my husband and I were like, okay, let's just quickly whip up a plugin to replace what we have right now, just to stop this problem. And so that's literally in one weekend we wrote the first beta beta version of access ally. And it was just to solve our own problem. Yeah. But then after that, we kind of realized like, Hey, okay, this gives us a lot of, interesting options.[00:03:40] And we started adding on and kind of building other things that we thought would be very useful for the people going through our courses and content. And that was kind of the start of what you see today.[00:03:51] Matt: So you ha I, I didn't write this down in our peer review, but what was the timeline you had popup ally first and then.[00:03:58] Then we created access ally, correct?[00:04:00] Nathalie: Yes. So we built SSLI first just to solve this problem. And we knew that someday we might release something like this, but it just felt like too big of an undertaking to do a whole like online membership or LMS or anything like that. So we ended up building popup ally next and releasing that first because we knew we could do a free version.[00:04:19] We could see how that went. Then we could do a paid version and see how that was. Being responded to and how we could handle support and all of that. And then we realized, okay, yes, we can actually do this. We have the chops. And so let's go all in on SSLI and kind of build[00:04:33] Matt: that. And I'll, I'll paint sort of the the, the picture at least of the way that I see it in my head is pop-up plugin a very, very broad market, big market.[00:04:44] Chances are anyone who might be selling courses or digital content is going to be attracted to a pop-up to use on their site to capture the visitor's attention. And, oh, by the way, we also. Have this LMS plug-in fair statement.[00:04:58] Nathalie: Yeah, it totally started off that way. It's a much broader, pop-ups are much broader.[00:05:02] And then, yeah, like you said, people who are using them to build an email list and audience, they probably will want to sell something online. So, so that pretty much leads to access ally.[00:05:12] Matt: Yeah. I want to start with something that I won't say it's a curve ball, but a little bit on the hot seat, but something that I totally enjoy what you're doing with access ally is the pricing.[00:05:22] And I think I know a lot of Plugins in the space a lot of, well, let me ask you this question. Before I dive into that, do you refer to it as a plugin or software? Like how do you feel about the product itself? I don't want to just say plug in if you feel like you're greater than that.[00:05:40] This episode is brought to you by paid memberships pro well, actually it's their other product. Site-wide sales at site-wide sales.com. It's a complete black Friday cyber Monday and flash sales tool for WooCommerce or paid memberships pro. Before, you know it, the deal day holidays will be fast upon us. And you want to prepare your WooCommerce or paid memberships pro website.[00:06:01] With the site-wide sales plugin, use it to make custom sale banners, targeted landing pages or apply discounts automatically in the cart. Use it to track the performance of all of these promotional features using the reporting feature, which will paint the picture of your black Friday and holiday shopping sales. I use it to help make your woo commerce or paid memberships pro store more money.[00:06:24] Get the first 30 days for free. And then it's an easy $49 a year. Check out site-wide sales.com. That's site-wide sales.com to make more money. This holiday sale season.[00:06:37] Nathalie: Yeah. So it is technically a plugin, right?[00:06:39] So people download it and install it. But we do see it as software, as a service, just because we are constantly developing and people have so many feature requests and things that we're constantly updating. So, and then we also offer a lot of support. So that's the service side as well. So I do feel like it's a little bit more than just like here, download this plugin and good luck.[00:06:57] It is like a real partnership. And I think that's why the price, in my opinion reflects that when people will come to the website and people also do think so. I mistake that it's a platform and that it's totally hosted. And we've talked about potentially doing that, but we do also appreciate that it's a plugin and they could work with other things.[00:07:13] And there's a lot of benefits to being in that WordPress ecosystem too.[00:07:18] Matt: That's sometimes it's a disadvantage for a bulk of visitors that come to the site and they go, oh, wait, I was looking for a plugin. This looks like a platform. Do you, have you ever noticed that a drop off in the quote unquote funnel at all, that, that you've actually paid close attention[00:07:33] Nathalie: to?[00:07:33] Usually it goes the other way where they wanted a platform and then they're like, oh wait, I need to WordPress. So most, most of our marketing so far is kind of the opposite, but yeah.[00:07:44] Matt: Yeah, I wanted to give you a sort of a fair chance to see how you disseminated between the plugin and the, and the soft.[00:07:51] As a mindset, because I think a lot of us, myself included, like I have a tiny little plugin, easy support videos. I've done other plugins in the past, which have burned a miserable failure of a death. And, but the fact of the matter is I was always kind of just like, oh yeah, it's just, it's just this plugin.[00:08:08] And I think a lot of us just have to say, no, This is a software business. Like let's, let's, let's, let's give ourselves a little bit of credit here. Like this is a software business that we're in. We're not just like this little throw away plugin, even though that's the technical term for it. And I think we could do a lot for ourselves mentally.[00:08:24] If we just have a little bit more of that, that confidence boost when, and when we look at it, because it changes the mindset, it changes how you approach it. And that's what I want to talk about with your. $99 a month. That's what access ally essentials starts with. That's one website. Very far beyond what, you might see from just, let's say a free LMS or an LMS plug-in that's $79 for the year or something like that.[00:08:49] How did you get to this pricing? Was it immediate or did you have some bumps and bruises along? That's[00:08:55] Nathalie: a great question. So we started off at 79 a month. That was before, that was the first price that we started originally a couple of years ago. But yeah, we've, we've had a lot of conversations internally and a lot of it really comes down to what value I think we really provide to people.[00:09:10] So we are pretty close to making people money, right. So we help them take payments. We have an affiliate program built in and we basically help them sell courses. All kinds of other things. So that to me shows me that we can provide a lot of value for them. And when you're comparing, what other tools they might be purchasing to do with something similar, sometimes they might be purchasing, multiple things like maybe it's multiple plugins, or maybe it's like one thing for a shopping cart, one thing for this other thing.[00:09:36] And then by the time you add up all the time, Invested in making all of those things work together. That's kind of to us a lot of value, so that's kind of how we thought about it. And then we were also just looking around at some of the competition and also what we knew we needed to charge to provide the service that we wanted.[00:09:52] So that also came into it a lot. So we have two full-time support people and US-based, they we love taking care of our teams, so they have, good salaries and benefits. And I don't think we could do that if we were trying to charge less and try to compete on the, on the pricing side, we wanted to really provide more value and then also charge well for it.[00:10:12] And there is also something that changes when somebody pays more for software, which is that they're a little bit more committed. They're really in it for the longterm. Most likely to stick as well. So like, obviously if it's too expensive for them, they're not going to sign up in the first place. So we kind of lose people that way, but we do have more people signing up and staying long-term because they know we're kind of in that partnership.[00:10:33] And a lot of times people tell us we love access ally because it lets us do all these great things. But also because every time we have a question or we have something we want to do that just quite do yet, it comes out like a month or two later. Right. So that's something we couldn't do if we were, trying to appeal to too many people at a lower price.[00:10:51] Matt: You have a degree in software engineering, this, that answer and the way you've positioned the product is what I'll say. And these are my words, not yours is a much more mature business answer than what I normally see in the WordPress space. Again, myself included, you build a product you're like, oh my God, does anybody want to buy this?[00:11:11] And then you say to yourself, I know what I'll do. I'll just make it cheap. Then somebody will certainly buy it. But you, you jumped in at an eight. 860 ish dollar a year or a little bit more at my mass. Not really good right out of the gate at 79 bucks a month. Is this the first business you've launched or this you're a second, third, fourth, fifth business.[00:11:29] Cause it sounds like you've gone through the paces a little bit before.[00:11:32] Nathalie: Absolutely. So yeah, this is not the first business. And I started off with my very first business out of college. It was all in the healthy eating space and that was kind of my training business. So I just learned like marketing and like I built my own website and all of those things.[00:11:45] And then. The kind of teaching of the online stuff and the online marketing was kind of the next one. And then this is sort of the third business I would call it and yeah, it, it definitely like we learn so much. Yeah. Yeah.[00:11:58] Matt: And this is a great thing because I think this is hard to just like, this is not a question, but much more of just like a general statement and then interested on your thoughts, but it sort of raises the value of all of us, right?[00:12:12] When you price your product like this. Well, you're getting true value. You're asking for true value. And on the other end, it's a, it's a solid business. Like you said, there are people working for us. We're paying them well, you're going to get great support. You're probably getting a higher degree of customer as well.[00:12:30] Like they're not coming in, just like, give me all this free stuff. Cause they're already paying a hundred bucks a month. So there's a different level there. There's money out there that I think a lot of people just get a fee. I get that fear factor where like, oh, I guess I do have to do a hundred bucks for the year because my God, nobody will buy it otherwise.[00:12:46] But yes, there are people who just want good stuff with great support. And that's the most important part for them is to like have somebody that's going to be there for them and stand the test of time. Right. Especially if they're a long-term WordPress user who has seen other places come and go or freelancers come and go, they don't want that.[00:13:08] Their vote of confidence is I will pay you a solid amount of money. So you stay in business and support me. Well, But it sounds like you've learned that over the years and that's how you've got to this point.[00:13:18] Nathalie: I literally had customers tell us that we know you're not going to disappear overnight because we're paying you well, and that's worth it to me.[00:13:24] Is that kind of security. And yeah, absolutely. We have that long-term vision and that long. Yeah. Stay in the game kind of energy. And I think that definitely comes across with the people that end up signing up for us. Yeah.[00:13:37] Matt: To that. I was going to put you on the hotspot, but then we kinda, we kind of shifted a little bit on your pricing page.[00:13:42] One of the check marks is top of the line support. I feel like everyone might say top of the line support, or we have the best support. What does top of the line of support mean for you and for your customers?[00:13:53] Nathalie: Yeah, we have a lot of things that we do for our customers. So everyone gets a free jumpstart calls.[00:13:58] So that means after they purchase, we get on like a zoom call with them. We help them get everything set up. We answer any questions they have. We make sure it works with the things that they're currently using or planning to use. So that's a big part of it. And then we also have a tune-up calls. Three times a month right now.[00:14:14] And so they can jump on any time they have questions or want to walk through something that they're trying to accomplish, that maybe they got stuck on. And then in terms of actually, if you get into a situation where you're stuck or anything like that in between, then we also have email support. And like I said, we have two people dedicated to that.[00:14:30] And obviously our response time varies, but right now it's like averaging at eight minutes, which is kind of crazy. So during this. So, yeah, we do have, we do a lot and then we also have really robust, message-based and videos and all of that stuff to make sure if you're more of a, self-serve kind of like, I just, I'm working at midnight.[00:14:47] I know you're not gonna be online. I'm just going to finish this up and watch this video kind of thing.[00:14:51] Matt: Yeah, it's fantastic. It's one of the things I do as part of my role at cast dose is we do two weekly calls, Tuesdays and Thursdays, 12:00 PM, Eastern, same kind of thing, open office hours, or show up.[00:15:02] If you have a question, you can answer it there. We don't do phone support, which is still like a thing these days. Like people still are like, why can't I just call somebody? It's like, well, we have these two dedicated hours where you can hop on a zoom call and you can chat with us, which I think is a fairly fair approach.[00:15:16] Plus. Nearly 24 7 help desk support through Zendesk and an email and chat. So, that's a fantastic approach. I certainly like your approach of having that onboarding call that kickoff, call that alone, which I know developers, the more developer mindset folks who don't want to talk to anybody. I just want to print money with my product that I'm selling.[00:15:36] Don't ever talk to me, just buy it. Man, you can re like that's literally what you can charge. Out of the gate. Like if you just tell somebody that you buy this and I'll hop on a zoom call to help you set it up, whatever that means for your product, that's worth so much money to somebody. And it's just that one hour of your time.[00:15:53] I know there could be some chances where they knock on the door against, Hey, we're going to hop on another call. I think largely 95% of your customer base will never knock on your door again and just email you. And I think that's a fantastic approach. I applaud you for that. What else do you provide on those tune-up calls?[00:16:10] Is there anything else that you do in a more structured approach? I just leave the door open. I say, come in and show up and ask anything you want, but do you approach it with any more structure than that? Yeah,[00:16:19] Nathalie: for the most part, we just talk about what people bring to the, to the call, but sometimes we do have like new features or new scenarios and things that we've kind of seen people creating and we want to share it with them.[00:16:30] So sometimes we'll do like, okay, you're doing a teams kind of feature. So that basically means, you're selling to a bulk group of people and then here's how you set that up. And here's how they would assign other team members to the courses and that kind of stuff, or we'll do like, okay, here's what you need to know about doing this summit.[00:16:46] If you're using XSLT to run your summit, like how you do that. So we'll kind of talk about a little bit about those scenarios that are kind of either popular or that we've seen someone do really well and kind of want to share with the rest of the community.[00:16:57] Matt: Gotcha. No, that's awesome. I will, I will write that down or release it to my episode and then apply that to cast those next time.[00:17:04] I'm on my next time. I'm on my call. You started to, to say that, look, we know who our customer is. One they're paying a little bit more. We're helping them make money. Who would you say your best customer profile is for accessing.[00:17:19] Nathalie: So some of our best customers are people who are in the business space.[00:17:23] So they may not be like teaching business, but maybe they have business processes that help other business owners. So kind of that team aspect I was talking about. So, we have people who are, let's say a sales trainer, and then they've got a program that they've developed that they sell to other companies to train their sales teams.[00:17:38] Or we have someone who's doing a coaching certification. So she's a coach and she's teaching other people how to become a coach. So they will become certified in her method. So there's a lot of that kind of teaching something, but two groups of people that tends to be one of our bigger people. So we have like a dog trainer and I think, she comes in and she's, she's got groups of doc trainers in other businesses learning her methods and that kind of thing.[00:18:01] So that seems to be one of our, our ideal.[00:18:04] Matt: Yeah, no, that's awesome. That's awesome that you can identify. How can you paint the picture of how that has changed if at all, from when you first started the business? Like, did you go into the business thinking, yeah, we're going to serve this one particular set it's changed.[00:18:18] Nathalie: It's changed a lot over the years. Mostly our understanding of it. I think kind of similar people have been coming to us just based on like, who knows us and who they've recommended it to, and that kind of thing. So we've got a lot of authors and speakers and podcasters, and basically the content creators do come to us quite a bit.[00:18:34] And over the years we realized, okay, the ones who are really doing well are the ones who they have a little bit more of that leverage. They can kind of sell to more people. So that's. Evolved over time. We definitely have people who are more of the, do it yourselfers or who are just getting started.[00:18:47] So that that's great too, but I think our kind of top customer, those people who are a little bit more established and have that credibility and can kind of scale a little bit faster that way.[00:18:56] Matt: One of the questions I have written down from our pre-interview was how you navigate the competition.[00:19:00] And as we're talking, like, I'm thinking about. Like boy I don't know if you compete against anybody in the WordPress space, just because of your positioning, your brand value statements and who you, who you're serving now as customers. Do you find yourself competing with more WordPress or more SAS based or is it just a, a good 50 50 mix?[00:19:18] Nathalie: Yeah, it's a little bit of a 50, 50 split. I would say. We definitely could be more with like Kajabi and teachable and Thinkific for the most part. But we also have a little bit of competition on the WordPress side too. It just depends on like what people are familiar with when they find us. So a lot of times if they aren't familiar with WordPress and they've probably looked at LearnDash or number press or lift your LMS or something like that.[00:19:39] So they're kind of familiar more with that. Or if they're kind of. Sort of, they don't quite know what they're doing, but they just know they want an online course and they might have already looked at Kajabi or teachable or Thinkific. And so they'll kind of compare us very differently based on their background and kind of where they're coming from.[00:19:55] So we do have a lot of developers who are more comparing us to WordPress versus business owners themselves tend to compare us more to the class.[00:20:03] Matt: Yeah. If you grew up in WordPress and you only knew of the WordPress LMS plugins, you'd be like, yeah, it's a decent size market, but then once you get into like these SAS based businesses I'll keep the name.[00:20:15] I won't say the name, but I worked with a hosted LMS. It wasn't really even an LMS. It was just a membership. It had nothing to do with like learning modules or structures or anything like that. It was just a membership site. I'm trying to say this without revealing who it is, there was nothing wrong, but yeah, so it was like this blanket membership thing.[00:20:34] And it served all kinds of anyone. And I, I talked to this person and I heard what they were doing for revenue. I was like, Wow, the space is that big. Like, I can't even imagine what these other platforms that are doing that have, like, hyper-focused got great product, great marketing after this person had anything wrong, but it just made me and my eyes wide of like how big this market is.[00:20:57] Do you have a sense? Of how large the market is numbers wise for outside of the WordPress LMS[00:21:03] Nathalie: world? Yeah, so I don't know the exact numbers, but I know that sort of the LMS, like in general market is like billions of dollars and just continues to increase year to year. So it's definitely growing and obviously like with COVID and like a lot of things have changed more and more in the online direction.[00:21:20] So. Only going to keep growing in my opinion. But yeah, I don't know the exact numbers for each individual businesses, but I know that, some businesses are going public or, so there's definitely a lot of growth in this space. For sure.[00:21:33] Matt: You said you started a business with your husband.[00:21:35] Labeled co-founder too, or just painting.[00:21:40] Nathalie: He's definitely my co-founder, but I would say he is more like head of engineering and just focused on development and kind of making sure that that sort of thing is solid[00:21:49] Matt: with everything that's going on. With, COVID weird to say, cause we're like for two years, I feel like we're going two years into it, 20 years into it feels like, but at least in the podcast world, we saw a huge rush to private podcasting company.[00:22:01] Only podcasting a way to communicate internally with your organization instead of just video calls all day long. I'd imagine there's a market there for you where people started knocking on the door saying, Hey. It w maybe we don't want to sell this, but we need software that structures education to our organization out.[00:22:18] Do you feel like you're at a point where maybe having a sales team knocking on enterprise doors and like playing that game, is that something that you're interested or exploring or already doing?[00:22:28] Nathalie: That's a great question. So we do have one person on our team who's in sales, but we haven't done as much of the outreach piece.[00:22:34] So that is definitely something that is kind of. I think on our horizon essentially so far, we've been just working with the market that we know and kind of just building for them, but there's definitely a lot more potential for where we can go. And we're actually just trying to figure out like what what that looks like and kind of what, what those, like other verticals might be as well.[00:22:54] Cause we are trying to just stay focused just because I think that's easier to grow, but once we've kind of figured this out, then I do think we can kind of open up to the other verticals.[00:23:03] Matt: Is this a fully bootstrap business? Or do you have investors that salesperson when, what is their responsibilities now?[00:23:11] Is it just answering questions? Inbound questions. Does he, or she like structure custom agreements extra support, that[00:23:18] Nathalie: kind of thing at the moment, it's basically she does demos. She'll do some of those onboarding calls. So it is half, I would say customer support, half sales in that way. And then we have marketing that does more of the, like getting people to book those demos and kind of come to the website and all of that.[00:23:34] But yeah, that's something that we're like definitely like all eyes and ears open for how to, how to do that slightly[00:23:39] Matt: differently. Have you had any requests from bigger enterprises or brands, could pay more than a hundred bucks a month?[00:23:46] Nathalie: I have we've had some clients and part of it is like sometimes like a school would be interested, but then we, there's a couple of things that don't quite work.[00:23:55] Either. Have certain requirements and that we're not quite fast enough to be able to like, get up to speed on what they're needing. So we, like, I think it's kind of that tricky thing is like, we built it really for entrepreneurs. So when we have different types of institutions that come to us we might not have exactly, exactly what they want, but we have like 80% of what they want.[00:24:12] So this is kind of the, the balance of what we're working[00:24:15] Matt: on for sure. Put a an identifier on whether or not that's like a feature that you don't have, or like an administrative thing you don't have like SOC two compliance or something. Ridiculous.[00:24:28] Nathalie: Yeah. A lot of times it's like SCORM type stuff and like more more things that I don't personally have as much experience.[00:24:35] Yeah. Even just having a conversation about it is kind of like, okay. Tell me exactly what that means. It gets a little bit tricky versus where if they're talking to someone who has that experience, they're just going to be like off to the races with that. Yeah.[00:24:47] Matt: Yeah. It's another lesson. Again, just looking at your site and listening to you and how you position yourself.[00:24:53] Like, there is lots of opportunity there. And, and for other folks who are listening to this in the WordPress space, 90, but I don't wanna say 90%, but 70% of the time, like when a big enterprise knocks on your door, Your price could literally be 10 X, what you're charging now. And it has nothing to do with the features.[00:25:13] It is the time that it takes to sell them. Right. It's just the sales process. It literally like six months to a year for most of them. And then it's all this administrative stuff back and forth. And then it's your terms. How can we pay you? Right. And. People are like, wait, we don't have a credit. We're not going to give you a credit card for a month.[00:25:32] We want to pay for three years. Like, where's the, where's the legal ease around that. And it's like, if you just had like all of this templated purchasing or procurement structure in place, you could be off to the races without even adding features. And in fact, I'd say features ends up being. Down the totem pole because a marketing person gets excited and they're like, yeah, this is a great product.[00:25:54] Oh, by the way, here's the procurement team. And then you're just like, oh shit, I got to go through legal now than I have to go through InfoSec, and then I get to talk to like the CFO and they get to talk about like, structuring a contract. So, again, no real question there, but just from my own experience, like I think WordPress can do WordPress products can do better by satisfying some of those needs that just doesn't have anything to do with.[00:26:15] At the end of the day. Yeah, absolutely. You your husband to support people? I heard the sales person. That's five, a marketing person is six. How much more on the[00:26:27] Nathalie: team? Actually two marketing people right now. One person who is in people ops, and then we have two development interns as[00:26:36] Matt: well. Nice. How do you recruit the interns locally?[00:26:39] Nathalie: Yeah, so they're at the university of that. My husband and I both went to, so they have a really great program. That's like a co-op program. So we basically just post and interview and hire and it's been going really well.[00:26:50] Matt: Yeah. I would definitely say a lot of that. Some agencies and product people should definitely look locally.[00:26:55] For developers, especially in that sort of intern phase, it's great to sort of educate people locally and pray to God. They stay, don't leave the area when they graduate, because where I'm from, they leave the area when they graduate and we lose that, that great talent. When you started, how big was it?[00:27:08] Nathalie: When I started, it was just me, my husband, and an[00:27:11] Matt: assistant any, and this was going to be a broad question. Thoughts on hiring people, growing the team? What was that? Was that stressful at all? Turbulent at all?[00:27:22] Nathalie: Yeah, it was a huge learning curve. So I feel like some of our best hires we figured out. A little bit late was it was already in our community.[00:27:31] So they were already, super fans or maybe they were building websites for people using our plugin. And so they already have the talent and the know-how and he just had to like recruit them. And that, that was a big learning curve because we were posting on these very broad job boards and finding people who were just looking for a job and they don't really care about us.[00:27:50] And so when something else comes along, The end. So, that was a big kind of ruining her for us. And yeah, we're doing a lot in that, in that way. Like how can we nurture our community? How can you make their lives easier and better? And then, if they're ready for a different kind of position that fits what we're looking for, then yet we're definitely super excited about.[00:28:09] Matt: Yeah. Yeah. The whole, like, I don't know if you hear it, but I've heard it before I started or when I was starting my businesses, like hire slow fire fast and I'm like, yeah, Yeah, you just got to laugh at that. I'll be like, I just need people now. Like I don't have time to slow this process down. And then you realize that six months into it, you're like I pick the wrong person or this or this person picked the wrong place.[00:28:32] And now what do I do? And that is so true. I mentor at a local accelerator in the, and it's a nonprofit accelerator for sustainable businesses in my area and the company that I'm mentoring. Now, they're trying to launch a nonprofit for daycare for disabled children. And. They're raised. They're, they're trying to figure out how they're going to get money.[00:28:51] And they're talking about grants and funding and all this stuff. And they're like right out of the gate, we want to hire 10 people and I'm like, man, that's going to be tough. Like you don't like that process of just getting people in, especially 10 of them is going to take you. It's going to take a thousand people to talk to literally quite literally to get these 10 perfect people in the door here.[00:29:11] And it's, it is not easy. What's the next role that you think you'd be hiring?[00:29:13] Nathalie: We're actually hiring right now for a product manager and that's sort of. Me cause I've been head of product for quite a while. And it's great because I talk to our customers a lot. So I kind of know what they were looking for and how to build what they want.[00:29:27] But I also know I could be doing other things too. So it's kind of just freeing myself up a little bit so I can do more of the marketing and the sales and kind of the things you were talking about, like, okay. Like what's next, like lifting my head up a little bit and yeah.[00:29:39] Matt: Looking bigger picture. Is that where you would focus more on marketing sales?[00:29:42] If you were to alleviate[00:29:44] Nathalie: yourself? It, yeah, more marketing and sales, more interviews like these, more things like that where I can be a little bit more publicly visible and kind of get the word out for access to LA. Yeah.[00:29:55] Matt: Let's talk about the marketing side of it. How, without giving away the secret sauce, what, what has been your best approach to reaching these customers?[00:30:03] Previously you built your own audience. I assume you still leverage that same audience. What other areas are you getting into or how are you expanding that?[00:30:11] Nathalie: Yeah. So a lot of, I think my success is from list-building and building that community in the beginning and just having a lot of alignment with what they wanted and also like what we were offering.[00:30:22] And so we've done so much in the list, building realm, like we did a free challenge, we've done a like free, essentially a free video course where people like opt in and then they get a free video every day for 30 days. And that was probably. Lead magnet that was so super successful. And then, yeah, like, YouTube podcasts I've pretty much done all of the marketing things and kind of took a break for the past year and a half just because I had a baby and then obviously pandemic and so many things happened, but yeah, I feel like there's so much in the space of marketing that works really well.[00:30:52] I will say I don't tend to jump on. Like flashiest things. So I deleted my Instagram account. I'm not on Tik TOK, I'm not doing it clubhouse. Like I know there's been quite a few trends of like new platforms and new things, but I try to stick to things that work long-term. So for me, that's like SEO, YouTube videos.[00:31:09] Like those are the kinds of things that once you put it out there more and more people will find them over time. So to me, that is a really good long-term kind of investment on the marketing.[00:31:18] Matt: Yeah. Yeah. I find Instagram to be challenging personally myself, even though I shouldn't, I just like podcasts, you should be able to, like flex in that area.[00:31:27] Is that what the kids say on Instagram? Like flex in that area and it should work well, but it doesn't, especially on like the WordPress site. It's like, there's nothing really flashy. That's going to be like excited. Like here's a picture of the dashboard with a filter on it. Like, what are we going to do here?[00:31:40] I get so jealous when I look at like other companies and other brands, right. Cool, like collabs, like backpacks, collabing with like these other makers or creators, like, ah, it's such an awesome way. You can't do that with WordPress is nothing there. It's fun and exciting. It's a challenge for sure.[00:31:54] What about you hinted before. That maybe you kind of explored the world of SAS. I know you said you wanted to be hyper-focused or you are hyper-focused even if it wasn't full on SAS, would you go and kind of pivot to supporting a Drupal or Joomla or another platform at all? Is that anywhere on the radar, SAS or otherwise?[00:32:14] Nathalie: Not so much the other off of WordPress. If we were to do more of a SAS, we would probably just take WordPress and host it and kind of do it. Like plug and play one click button. Your site is ready kind of thing. Which I know other platforms like Rainmaker have done, like they took WordPress and they sort of, Close it off a little bit.[00:32:32] So that's something we thought about and we've tested doing like hosting with the seam and things like that in the past. But also we know that our people tend to be power users and they want to be able to install other things and kind of make it work with other stuff. And that's kind of the beauty of WordPress.[00:32:45] So we don't want to like cut off the best part. So yeah, we kind of, we explore it like almost every year. We're like, what about now? What about now? But I don't think it's really the right move.[00:32:56] Matt: Yeah. Yeah. What about this is also kind of marketing kind of product, but what about partnerships in the WordPress space?[00:33:05] Advice or success that you've seen or not that you've seen in the space that you can speak towards partnering other plugins and, or e-commerce plugins or marketing plugins or anything like that.[00:33:15] Nathalie: Yeah. There are certain plugins that are positioned to do amazing things in terms of partnerships. So I know like WP fusion is an amazing one that they work with so many different things.[00:33:25] And so we've integrated with, with them. And there's a couple of other plugins that we've integrated with. But I would say our biggest integration partners are actually the CRMs and the email marketing systems that we integrate with. So they're kind of outside of WordPress, but we do integrate tightly with them.[00:33:38] So that gives us that ability to like co-market with them. And we're all listed on their websites and stuff as an integration options. So that has been really nice for us too. And people who are really looking for something that deeply integrates with that, they tend to come to us because of that. So.[00:33:53] Yeah. I almost feel like WordPress is awesome. And also there's other tools that most people are using. So just thinking about at that level too. So for example, we don't have an integration with zoom, but we used to have an integration with Google Hangouts. And so we would have, people could start a Google hangout from inside their membership site.[00:34:10] And so I think that's something too it's like, how can you connect to things outside of WordPress? Sometimes that people use a lot as well. So those are some, some things we've done in the past and some things that are still working well for[00:34:20] Matt: us, this seems to be a recurring. Trend in my last few interviews.[00:34:25] Is is integrations. Ad-ons, when to make those there's a million places you probably want to integrate with, I'm sure there's a million people who have requested things to integrate with. How do you find that balance? Because at the other end of it, and people are probably sick of me saying this already.[00:34:41] Is there is that the, the overhead of an integration that just doesn't become as popular as you thought it was going to be MailChimp, even though MailChimp's popular, let's just say MailChimp fell off the face of the earth. Then it's like, man, I got a half a dozen people over here using MailChimp and I still get to support this.[00:34:55] Add on how do you make the decision on when to support one or when to make one? And co-brand with one, two at the same time. Yeah.[00:35:03] Nathalie: So we currently integrate with five different email marketing systems. And the first one, we just build it for ourselves. Like, like I said, so that one was an easy, easy. Yes. And then after that, we looked at their biggest competitor essentially.[00:35:16] And so we went with that one and then. We noticed a trend where a lot of people were switching from both of these two to a third one. So then we integrated with that one. And then the next two are kind of just, they were all being compared a lot. So that kind of made sense to integrate at that time.[00:35:30] But yeah, we have, we have people constantly asking us to integrate with new payment systems and some people maybe in Europe can't use certain systems or in other parts of the world where they can't use Stripe, for example. So we definitely get a lot of. And I think it's exactly what you said.[00:35:46] Sometimes it comes down to numbers and if we've only had one person ask for it, like, I'm sorry, it's just probably not going to have it right now. And also integrations do change, right? So they changed their API and then we have to test and maintain and make sure it still works the way that promised or, that used to at least.[00:36:01] So that's been a bit of a trick. The situation over the years, because as those companies that we integrate with change and mature we have to kind of keep up with that. So that's definitely been a bit of a tricky thing. And we do have a whole backlog of integrations that people have asked for.[00:36:14] And we did keep our ears open. We keep track of each person that asks for it. And then when the numbers kind of tick up high enough, then that's kind of, usually when we pull the trigger on them,[00:36:22] Matt: I'm looking at the integration page now. I actually don't see a MailChimp. Has MailChimp not been requested or you just refuse to support the monkey?[00:36:29] Ah, yes.[00:36:30] Nathalie: So we've had a lot of people ask for it. I've never[00:36:32] Matt: said that on the air before it refused to support the monkey. I don't know where that came from, but sorry, go ahead.[00:36:36] Nathalie: That's hilarious. Yeah, no, we've definitely had. For MailChimp and our reasoning for not integrating so far is that they didn't have the functionality that we needed in terms of tagging and automation.[00:36:47] So we tend to integrate with the kind of more advanced CRM that do a lot of like cool things. And that basically think back to access LA after. And I know they've added a lot over the years, so we're probably gonna be revisiting, revisiting that again soon, but yeah, for now yeah, there's definitely people who've asked for it and.[00:37:02] Matt: I noticed that the footer there's a page called discover experts. Find an expert. I forget the title of it. It looks like there's a 20 ish or so maybe more if I actually filtered through and started searching how does this program work and what have been the, the positives and negatives of trying to build something like this off the ground, get something like this off the ground, because I know it's difficult to wrangle folks together to really get something of value here.[00:37:30] Yeah.[00:37:30] Nathalie: So we started our certification program. I think it was. Six years ago. So, it's been quite a few years in the making and the first round of it was in person, you had to fly out, we taught you everything there was to know about access ally and building sites and really kind of digging in. And it was a huge, it was a $10,000 program to sign up.[00:37:51] So it was definitely like, you're jumping in all in and that commitment level kind of connected with the people who were ready for it. So that really jumps start the program. And, a lot of those early people have had, hundreds of clients sent their way because of, being early adopters and kind of pioneering some of the things that we did with them and giving us feedback to improve the product and all of that.[00:38:11] So that's kind of how it started and then it's really kind of shifted over the year. So now it's an online things, so they don't have to come and fly out and meet us and learn the software. We actually teach them online. And basically what we do is we. Make sure they're really great at what they do.[00:38:25] And then we kind of filter them out based on what they're focused on. So some people only work with one CRM, that's their jam. They're super awesome at it. Other people love to do the design aspect of the site. Other people are more on the course development. So how to design the course in like the content and modules and all of that.[00:38:41] So we kind of have people doing different types of things. So we know kind of who to recommend when somebody comes to us and doesn't want to do their own setup and do all that.[00:38:49] Matt: Yeah, that's fantastic. And putting a price tag on it is very smart and I'm just like thinking in my head, how can I, how can I do that too?[00:38:58] Like, that's such a, that's such a great idea. I I've, I've, I've known about obviously certification programs. A lot of them again, when you're looking at the top it's it's, it's all paid. I again, when I look at the things happening in WordPress, because we're so I don't want to say desperate, but we're just so like desperate to get people excited.[00:39:14] We're like, just any, if you could fill out this form, you're a partner. Like if you can get through the capture, you win. They're like, okay, that's the bar we're setting for ourselves. But no, it's great that it's paid. And then, obviously don't have to tell you, but once people are paying for it they're spreading the word.[00:39:29] They want you to succeed. You want them to succeed and it's just those positive inertia in, in that direction. So that's fantastic. That's great to see that, that program, that program working before we hit record, you mentioned that you have a F potentially a new theme coming, anything that you can hint at about that release and why you started to be.[00:39:48] Nathalie: Yeah. So we've actually been working on it for about a year, which is like insane, but it's one of those things where we wanted it to be just right. And there's a lot of options for themes and builders and like Burke and so many things that people can choose from to make their sites look great. And the reason we decided to do our own theme is really just menus.[00:40:07] I know it sounds so simple, but when you have a course and you have our multiple courses with a different menu on each course, it's a lot of work to set up those menus on all those pages and. So that's kind of one of the biggest benefits it will save then you access LA theme. And then it also integrates with all the progress tracking.[00:40:23] So you can kind of see, like, as you're going through like little check marks show up beside your menu and you have your little progress bar that shows you how far ahead you are in a course or program. So we just wanted to make it easier for our customers to make things that look great out of the box if they don't want to hire a designer.[00:40:38] So that's kind of our thinking with that.[00:40:40] Matt: Yeah. Yeah. That's no, that's great. That'll be a huge, I'm sure, again, and just from my work with other LMS plugins, that's, that's always the hangup. It's like, I've got this perfect theme and it serves like all of my marketing and how I want my blog to look and how I want my homepage to look.[00:40:55] And then you install the LMS and it's like, that is the ugliest progress bar I've ever seen in my life. No, it looks like, I don't know what it is like this looks like a geo city site that I built, 30 years ago. Why is it looks so terrible is because it's not styled for it. Right. And it's, that's a huge crux of WordPress and plugin integration.[00:41:13] Are you excited about anything Gutenberg related? That's going to make your life easier for the plugin, for the theme.[00:41:19] Nathalie: Yeah. I really want to love Gutenberg and I think it's getting there, like, no, no, I really think it's we're close. And I think that a lot of people had a lot of. Emotions, let's put them around.[00:41:32] And and I think that we're really, really like if we're not there yet, I think we're like super close to actually having that. So we're actually going to be recommending people, use Gutenberg with theme. So if people don't have another option that they prefer, and I think that's going to be really amazing.[00:41:46] So XSL, it comes with blocks already, so it can do all the things that it needs within that area. I like kind of your main part of your content for your courses and stuff. So I'm super excited about that. And it's actually something I want us to go into more, like, I think that's direction. I really want the plugin to go into Morris, making the blocks even better.[00:42:03] So yeah, I'm definitely all in on Gutenberg, but I think that there's still a lot of resistance from people who are more familiar with it, or maybe haven't played enough with it and feel a little bit of that. Yeah, not too sure about it yet.[00:42:17] Matt: Yeah. In the beginning, everyone was sort of just, throwing their hats off saying why, why, why, why, why do we have this?[00:42:23] But you know, over, over time, like we all should have known like any soft first version of a piece of software. You, we all know it's not, it's not the, the version we are really gonna fall in love with. And it's taken a few years. I certainly enjoy it, but yeah, there's still some things where I'm just like, I literally can't drag this block into a column.[00:42:42] Like the most basic thing I should be able to do ever. I can't do those are some frustrating points and then there's some other awesome points. And I was making a landing page for, at castles today. And, and like the quick commands of like the forest lash and you just hit I, and an image pops up or P for power, like that stuff navigating that is it's fantastic.[00:43:06] Like, it just makes that stuff so much easier, but yeah, there's still some pain points and I think, I think it's going to be another year, maybe two until it's really smooth, especially with full site editing.[00:43:18] Nathalie: Right? Yeah. I feel you on that. And I think it's like, just. Keeping the hope right. That we'll get there and like, just keep them at it, keep it going and just putting our support behind it too.[00:43:29] I think as business owners, we have to say like, no, this is the direction we're presses going in. And we have to put our support behind that too. So that's. Yeah,[00:43:38] Matt: for sure. Natalie Lucier is founder and CEO access. ally.com checkout access, ally.com. If you haven't, if you have a customer or a client or you want to launch your own LMS, check out access, ally.com, Natalie, anywhere else you want folks to go to say thanks.[00:43:52] No, that's[00:43:53] Nathalie: that's fine. Thank you[00:43:55] Matt: stuff, everybody else. My report.com my report.com/subscribe. Join the mailing list. And if you want your weekly dose of WordPress news and under five minutes, the WP minute.com. ★ Support this podcast ★