Sustain

Guest Qianqian Ye Panelist Richard Littauer Show Notes In this episode of Sustain, Richard hosts a conversation with Qianqian “Q” Ye, an artist, creative technologist, and educator who recently led the p5.js project, an open-source JavaScript library designed to prioritize accessibility and diversity in learning to code. Q shares her journey from an architectural background to contributing and eventually leading p5.js, a library created by artists for artists with a strong focus on visual feedback and accessibility. They discuss the importance of decentralizing leadership, setting boundaries to avoid burnout, and empowering contributors to ensure the project's sustainability. Key topics include the role of care work in open source, the community-driven evolution of p5.js, and strategies for maintaining a collaborative and inclusive environment. Q also highlights the significance of providing clear documentation and recognizing all forms of contributions to foster a welcoming community. Press download now to hear more! [00:001:01] Q explains what p5.js is and how it teaches people to code. [00:02:11] Q shares her journey from former architect turned creative technologist and highlights her community progression through translation and outreach. [00:04:19] Why is p5.js different? Q emphasizes the output is art, not code, making it more inclusive and intuitive for beginners. [00:05:40] Richard inquires about the p5.js community and contributors and Q tells us there are 700-800 contributors officially recognized. [00:06:33] Q elaborates on the relationship with the Processing Foundation. P5.js operates semi-independently under its support, and she talks about the staff size for p5.js. [00:07:49] Q believes the traditional open source volunteerism is problematic and the Sovereign Tech Agency provided funding to support mentors and contributors. [00:09:19] Q's essay “Care Work in OSS” explores the invisible labor behind software projects and advocates for recognizing emotional labor and decentralized decision making. [00:10:15] We hear about the rotating leadership and inclusivity and how documentation and mentorship is the key to smooth transitions. [00:13:18] Q talks about the translation stewardship with a decentralized structure with language-specific stewards and using inclusive onboarding and translations. [00:15:31] Richard questions preventing burnout in stewards and Q elaborates how p5.js handles this and why access includes joy and inclusivity. [00:18:05] We hear how decisions about feature acceptance are made through community review and discussions, as well as how some users challenged the access-first policy. [00:20:15] Balancing art and community is discussed here as Q clarifies that open source and the arts often conflict due to individualism vs. collectivism. [00:21:48] How does Q help the open source community learn and give credit to other people well all the time? She gives routine shoutouts in release notes, social media, and seeks to credit all contributions, not just code. [00:24:48] Q shares how she deals with emotional burnout and boundaries and tips for setting boundaries. [00:28:18] What's next for Q? She's returning from maternity leave as Manager of Community and Partnerships for the Processing Foundation, and focus on building relationships and discussing sustainable funding at UN Open Source Week. [00:29:32] Find out where you can follow Q and p5.js on the web. Quotes [00:08:00] “I strongly believe that the volunteer-based model in open source is very problematic, and I've been trying to experiment different ways on doing thing alternatively.” [00:09:55] “OSS appears faceless, but there are so many people behind OSS.” [00:11:17] “Creators and maintainers of OSS carry bias of their own when they maintain the software.” [00:16:20] “Having to say no helped us to clarify the vision for the p5.js project.” Spotlight [00:30:01] Richard's spotlight is the book, Things Become Other Things by Craig Mod [00:30:50] Q's spotlight is two contributors, Dave Pagurek and Kenneth Lim. Links SustainOSS (https://sustainoss.org/) podcast@sustainoss.org (mailto:podcast@sustainoss.org) richard@sustainoss.org (mailto:richard@sustainoss.org) SustainOSS Discourse (https://discourse.sustainoss.org/) SustainOSS Mastodon (https://mastodon.social/tags/sustainoss) SustainOSS Bluesky (https://bsky.app/profile/sustainoss.bsky.social) SustainOSS LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/company/sustainoss/) Open Collective-SustainOSS (Contribute) (https://opencollective.com/sustainoss) Richard Littauer Socials (https://www.burntfen.com/2023-05-30/socials) Qianqian Ye LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/in/qianqian-ye-23693364/) Qianqian Ye Website (https://qianqian-ye.com/) p5.js (https://p5js.org/) p5.js Access Statement (https://p5js.org/contribute/access/) All Contributors (https://allcontributors.org/) Processing Foundation (https://processingfoundation.org/) Sovereign Tech Agency (https://www.sovereign.tech/) Lauren Lee McCarthy (https://get-lauren.net/) Making p5.js by Lauren Lee McCarthy (https://medium.com/processing-foundation/making-p5-js-fd293ba91a32) UN Open Source Week 2025, NYC, June 16-20 (https://www.un.org/digital-emerging-technologies/content/open-source-week-2025) Things Become Other Things by Craig Mod (https://craigmod.com/ridgeline/174/) P5.js 2.0 and an open source philosophy by Dave Pagurek (https://www.davepagurek.com/blog/p5-2.0-philosophy/) Designing an addon library system for p5.js 2.0 by Kenneth Lim (https://dev.to/limzykenneth/designing-an-addon-library-system-for-p5js-20-3d4p) Credits Produced by Richard Littauer (https://www.burntfen.com/) Edited by Paul M. Bahr at Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Show notes by DeAnn Bahr Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Special Guest: Qianqian Ye.

Guest Federico Mena Quintero Panelist Richard Littauer Show Notes In this special Maintainer Month episode of Sustain, host Richard Littauer chats with Federico Mena Quintero, a foundational GNOME hacker and board member. Federico shares his journey from learning image processing in high school, becoming a key contributor to the GIMP project, and founding the GNOME desktop environment. He discusses the historical context, challenges, and achievements of GNOME and open source development. The conversation delves into the importance of maintaining infrastructural software, adapting to new technologies like the Rust programming language, and the socio-economic factors influencing the open source community's demographics. Press download now to hear more! [00:01:29] Federico describes GNOME as the “surface of your desk”- the visual and interactive layer of the Linux desktop. [00:02:16] Federico started writing image processing programs in high school and discovered GIMP (GNU Image Manipulation Program) and began contributing plugins. Encouraged by positive feedback, he continued developing filters and building community resources. [00:10:20] The proprietary Motif GUI toolkit used by GIMP prompted the creation of GTK (GIMP Toolkit), a free alternative. GTK was split from GIMP and became a foundation for GNOME. Miguel de Icaza learned about modular component design from Microsoft and brought those ideas to the GNOME team. [00:14:48] Federico explains KDE was already launched but used the non-free Qt toolkit and GNOME was created as a fully free alternative using GTK. [00:17:58] They discuss GNOME's long-term success which has thousands of contributors and institutional backing from its foundation. [00:21:06] Federico reflects on his privilege. He never had to apply for his first job because he was recruited and recognizes the barriers to entry for underrepresented communities. [00:24:32] The conversation turns to global south and diversity. Federico discusses the limitations on who can participate in open source due to time, money, and societal roles, and notes that women and people outside the Global North often face greater barriers. [00:30:37] Richard inquires what Federico means by “maintaining infrastructure.” He explains that open source today is less about new features and more about keeping infrastructure working. [00:32:59] Federico talks about a recent project to replace a vital but abandoned infrastructure component and emphasizes the need for sustainable maintenance strategies. [00:36:25] Federico became maintainer of Librsvg image rendering library from C to Rust. [00:40:00] Find out where you can follow Federico on the web. Quotes [00:31:10] “Software doesn't rot, but the environment around it changes.” Spotlight [00:40:57] Richard's spotlight is the book, 1491: New Revelations of the Americas Before Columbus. [00:41:49] Federico's spotlight is two books: Malintzin's Choices and James. Links SustainOSS (https://sustainoss.org/) podcast@sustainoss.org (mailto:podcast@sustainoss.org) richard@sustainoss.org (mailto:richard@sustainoss.org) SustainOSS Discourse (https://discourse.sustainoss.org/) SustainOSS Mastodon (https://mastodon.social/tags/sustainoss) SustainOSS Bluesky (https://bsky.app/profile/sustainoss.bsky.social) SustainOSS LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/company/sustainoss/) Open Collective-SustainOSS (Contribute) (https://opencollective.com/sustainoss) Richard Littauer Socials (https://www.burntfen.com/2023-05-30/socials) Federico Mena Quintero Blog (https://viruta.org/) Federico Mena Quintero Mastodon (https://mastodon.social/@federicomena@mstdn.mx) GNOME (https://www.gnome.org/) GIMP (GNU Image Manipulation Program) (https://www.gimp.org/) GTK (https://www.gtk.org/) Librsvg (https://github.com/GNOME/librsvg) 1491: New Revelations of the Americas Before Columbus by Charles C. Mann (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1491%3A_New_Revelations_of_the_Americas_Before_Columbus) La Malinche (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/La_Malinche) Malintzin's Choices by Camila Townsend (https://archive.org/details/malintzinschoice0000town) James by Percival Everett (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_(novel)) Credits Produced by Richard Littauer (https://www.burntfen.com/) Edited by Paul M. Bahr at Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Show notes by DeAnn Bahr Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Special Guest: Federico Mena Quintero.

Guest Sarah Rainsberger Panelists Richard Littauer | Abby Mayes | Eriol Fox Show Notes In this special Maintainer Month episode of Sustain, hosts Richard, Abby, and Eriol talk with guest, Sarah Rainsberger, a documentation lead at Astro, who shares her journey from teaching high school mathematics to becoming an open source contributor. Sarah elaborates on her approach to documentation, emphasizing the importance of clear, supportive, and inclusive communication to onboard new contributors effectively. She also discusses using low-tech tools like Chromebooks and cloud-based editors for open source contributions. The episode highlights the strategies employed by the Astro Docs team to recognize and value contributions. Press download now to hear more! [00:02:30] Sarah shares her background, role at Astro, how she got involved in documentation that started by fixing a bad choir website, and why she chose Astro over Gatsby and quickly became a key contributor. [00:06:49] She reflects on the moment she connected her work with the concept of “open source.” [00:07:54] Sarah talks about becoming a leader using Chromebook, taking lessons on Scrimba, and using cloud tools like CodeSandbox and Gitpod, the Astro community embracing her methods, and how she built a reputation as someone making meaningful contributions regardless of hardware. [00:14:24] Sarah explains how docs are “self-serve support” and essential to project success. [00:16:28] The conversation turns to combatting the stigma that docs are low value and Sarah addresses the false perception that documentation isn't real development. [00:18:28] Sarah shares that Astro has over 1,000 docs contributors and details their intentional process of welcoming, crediting, and celebrating new contributors. [00:24:37] How does Astro handle lower-quality contributions? Astro uses the motto: “Not worse than what we had before.” They edit or mentor rather than reject, to build confidence and retain contributors. [00:29:12] Astro maintains a separate documentation site (“D Squared”) that outlines its processes for contributing to documentation. [00:33:25] Sarah shares where to find her work at the Astro Docs and where to find her. Quotes [00:05:26] “If I'm going in, let's go all in.” [00:12:50] “I have chosen to maintain low tech.” [00:12:59] “I am known for my evil devices.” [00:14:36] “Docs are so important to a project that you want someone else to use or contribute to.” [00:15:28] “Docs is the most scalable type of support that you can have.” [00:16:37] “Everyone complains about docs until it's someone else's project.” [00:26:51] “PRs don't just fall out of the sky; they are effort, and they are work.” [00:27:05] “There is some motivation behind this PR.” [00:31:41] “Several of our maintainers started by translating the docs.” [00:31:49] “If you want to find mistakes in your English docs, you want translators.” Spotlight [00:34:40] Abby's' spotlight is CommunityRule. [00:35:04] Eriol's spotlight is State of Docs. [00:35:19] Richard's spotlight is Nathan Schneider and the Protocol Oral History Project. [00:36:08] Sarah's spotlight is Better GitHub Co-Authors. Links SustainOSS (https://sustainoss.org/) podcast@sustainoss.org (mailto:podcast@sustainoss.org) richard@sustainoss.org (mailto:richard@sustainoss.org) SustainOSS Discourse (https://discourse.sustainoss.org/) SustainOSS Mastodon (https://mastodon.social/tags/sustainoss) SustainOSS Bluesky (https://bsky.app/profile/sustainoss.bsky.social) SustainOSS LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/company/sustainoss/) Open Collective-SustainOSS (Contribute) (https://opencollective.com/sustainoss) Richard Littauer Socials (https://www.burntfen.com/2023-05-30/socials) Abby Cabunoc Mayes GitHub (https://abbycabs.github.io/) Eriol Fox GitHub (https://erioldoesdesign.github.io/) Sarah Rainsberger Website (https://www.rainsberger.ca/) Sarah Rainsberger Mastodon (https://mastodon.social/@sarah11918) Non-code contributions are the secret to open source success (The ReadME Project) (https://github.com/readme/featured/open-source-non-code-contributions) Astro (https://astro.build/) Astro Docs (https://docs.astro.build/en/getting-started/) Contribute to Astro (https://docs.astro.build/en/contribute/) Gitpod (https://www.gitpod.io/) Scrimba (https://scrimba.com/home) Hugo Server (https://gohugo.io/commands/hugo_server/) CommunityRule (https://communityrule.info/) State of Docs (https://www.stateofdocs.com/2025/introduction-basic-stats) Better GitHub Co-Authors (https://github.com/delucis/better-github-coauthors) Sustain Podcast-Episode 85: Geoffrey Huntley and Sustaining OSS with Gitpod (https://podcast.sustainoss.org/85) Sustain Podcast- 2 episodes featuring Nathan Schneider (https://podcast.sustainoss.org/guests/nathan-schneider) Credits Produced by Richard Littauer (https://www.burntfen.com/) Edited by Paul M. Bahr at Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Show notes by DeAnn Bahr Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Special Guest: Sarah Rainsberger.

Guest Kade Morton Panelists Richard Littauer | Eriol Fox Show Notes In this Maintainers Month episode of Sustain, host Richard Littauer and co-host Eriol Fox talk with cybersecurity expert Kade Morton from Arachne Digital. The conversation dives into how Kade's unconventional path through criminology and international relations led him into cybersecurity and open source. They explore the unique challenges of sustaining open source security tools, particularly for human rights activists and under-resourced groups, the tension between proprietary and open solutions, and how geopolitical contexts and human motivations influence modern digital threat landscapes. Hit download now to hear more! [00:01:41] Kade explains his work is split between a day job working security operations and a startup he runs called Arachne Digital. [00:02:51] Kade tells us about his background, how he got into cybersecurity through self-teaching and open source, and how his criminology and international relations studies informed his interest in cyber threats. [00:05:17] Kade discusses the open source projects he maintains, specifically ‘Thread.' [00:06:50] We learn about the difficulty of getting others invested in better tools and Kade discusses challenges explaining open source values to corporate environments. [00:12:26] Richard asks whether closed-source software is more secure and Kade highlights how most real world exploits target proprietary software. [00:14:57] Eriol brings up security perceptions in non-tech orgs using digital tools. Kade shares how Arachne Digital offers free services to vetted human rights orgs and he they discuss challenges balancing funding and access in human rights cybersecurity. [00:19:17] Richard reflects on monetization models for sustaining open source cybersecurity. Kade explains his company avoids fear-based marketing and promotes awareness instead. [00:22:40] Kade outlines how their threat-informed defense model works. [00:25:42] Eriol asks what changes could help improve open source sustainability. Kade discusses feeling out of place in both government and open source spaces and emphasizes cross-pollination between sectors to reduce polarity. [00:28:29] Richard introduces the concept of “digital sovereignty.” Kade warns of the risks of splintering the internet through nationalism and advocates for a balanced middle ground between centralization and fragmentation. [00:31:41] Kade shares where you can find his work on the web. Quotes [00:13:44] “It's mostly proprietary software that's being hacked.” [00:29:40] “The internet is the world's largest shared resource.” Spotlight [00:32:56] Eriol's spotlight is a repository called: The Design We Open. [00:33:49] Richard's spotlight is 1Password and Robin Riley. [00:34:31 Kade's spotlight is a shoutout to Mitre for TRAM and Justin Seitz who wrote a blog post on a project called, Searx. Links SustainOSS (https://sustainoss.org/) podcast@sustainoss.org (mailto:podcast@sustainoss.org) richard@sustainoss.org (mailto:richard@sustainoss.org) SustainOSS Discourse (https://discourse.sustainoss.org/) SustainOSS Mastodon (https://mastodon.social/tags/sustainoss) SustainOSS Bluesky (https://bsky.app/profile/sustainoss.bsky.social) SustainOSS LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/company/sustainoss/) Open Collective-SustainOSS (Contribute) (https://opencollective.com/sustainoss) Richard Littauer Socials (https://www.burntfen.com/2023-05-30/socials) Eriol Fox GitHub (https://erioldoesdesign.github.io/) Kade Morton LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/in/kade-morton-34179283/) Arachne Digital (https://www.arachne.digital/) Arachne Digital LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/company/arachne-digital/) Arachne Digital (Medium) (https://arachnedigital.medium.com/) Arachne Digital (YouTube) (https://www.youtube.com/@Arachne_Digital) Arachne Digital (Bluesky) (https://bsky.app/profile/arachnedigital.bsky.social) Arachne Digital (GitHub) (https://github.com/arachne-threat-intel/) Thread-GitHub (https://github.com/arachne-threat-intel/thread) The National Digital Forum (NDF) (https://www.ndf.org.nz/) The New Design Congress (https://newdesigncongress.org/en/) Open Technology Fund -Security Lab (https://www.opentech.fund/labs/security-lab/) The Design We Open (GitHub) (https://github.com/sprblm/The-Design-We-Open) 1Password (https://1password.com/) TRAM (https://github.com/mitre-attack/tram) Searx (https://github.com/searx/searx) Credits Produced by Richard Littauer (https://www.burntfen.com/) Edited by Paul M. Bahr at Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Show notes by DeAnn Bahr Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Special Guest: Kade Morton.

Guests Ben Nickolls | Andrew Nesbitt Panelist Richard Littauer Show Notes In this episode of Sustain, host Richard is joined by guests Ben Nickolls and Andrew Nesbitt to discuss the ecosyste.ms project. They explore how ecosyste.ms collects and analyzes metadata from various open-source projects to create a comprehensive database that can help improve funding allocation. The discussion covers the importance of funding the most critical open-source projects, the existing gaps in funding, and the partnership between ecosyste.ms and Open Source Collective to create funding algorithms that support entire ecosystems. They also talk about the challenges of maintaining data, reaching out to project maintainers, and the broader implications for the open-source community. Hit the download button now! [00:01:58] Andrew and Ben explain ecosyste.ms, what it does, and how it compares to Libraries.io. [00:04:59] Ecosyste.ms tracks metadata, not the packages themselves, and enriches data via dependency graphs, committers, issues, SBOMs, and more. [00:06:54] Andrew talks about finding 1,890 Git hosts and how many critical projects live outside GitHub. [00:08:37] There's a conversation on metadata uses and SBOM parsing. [00:12:49] Richard inquires about the ecosystem.ms funds on their website which Andrew explains it's a collaboration between Open Collective and ecosyste.ms. that algorithmically distributes funds to the most used, not most popular packages. [00:15:45] Ben shares how this is different from previous projects and brings up a past project, “Back Your Stack” and explains how ecosyste.ms is doing two things differently. [00:18:59] Ben explains how it supports payouts to other platforms and encourages maintainers to adopt funding YAML files for automation. Andrew touches on efficient outreach, payout management, and API usage (GraphQL). [00:25:36] Ben elaborates on how companies can fund ecosyste.ms (like Django) instead of curating their own lists and being inspired by Sentry's work with the Open Source Pledge. [00:29:32] Andrew speaks about scaling and developer engagement and emphasizes their focus is on high-impact sustainability. [00:32:48] Richard asks, “Why does it matter?” Ben explains that most current funding goes to popular, not most used projects and ecosyste.ms aims to fix the gap with data backed funding, and he suggests use of open standards like 360Giving and Open Contracting Data. [00:35:46] Andrew shares his thoughts on funding the right projects by improving 1% of OSS, you uplift the quality of millions of dependent projects with healthier infrastructure, faster security updates, and more resilient software. [00:38:35] Find out where you can follow ecosyste.ms and the blog on the web. Quotes [00:11:18] “I call them interesting forks. If a fork is referenced by a package, it'll get indexed.” [00:22:07] We've built a service that now moves like $25 million a year between OSS maintainers on OSC.” [00:33:23] “We don't have enough information to make collective decisions about which projects, communities, maintainers, should receive more funding.” [00:34:23] “The NSF POSE Program has distributed hundreds of millions of dollars of funding to open source communities alone.” [00:35:47] “If you have ten, twenty thousand really critical open source projects, that actually isn't unachievable to make those projects sustainable.” Spotlight [00:39:35] Ben's spotlight is Jellyfin. [00:40:20] Andrew's spotlight is zizmor. [00:42:21] Richard's spotlight is The LaTeX Project. Links SustainOSS (https://sustainoss.org/) podcast@sustainoss.org (mailto:podcast@sustainoss.org) richard@sustainoss.org (mailto:richard@sustainoss.org) SustainOSS Discourse (https://discourse.sustainoss.org/) SustainOSS Mastodon (https://mastodon.social/tags/sustainoss) SustainOSS Bluesky (https://bsky.app/profile/sustainoss.bsky.social) SustainOSS LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/company/sustainoss/) Open Collective-SustainOSS (Contribute) (https://opencollective.com/sustainoss) Richard Littauer Socials (https://www.burntfen.com/2023-05-30/socials) Ben Nickolls LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/in/benjamuk/) Andrew Nesbitt Website (https://nesbitt.io/) Andrew Nesbitt Mastodon (https://mastodon.social/@andrewnez) Octobox (https://github.com/octobox) ecosyste.ms (https://ecosyste.ms/) ecosyste.ms Blog (https://blog.ecosyste.ms/) Open Source Collective (https://oscollective.org/) Open Source Collective Updates (https://opencollective.com/opensource/updates) Open Source Collective Contributions (https://opencollective.com/opensource) Open Source Collective Contributors (https://opencollective.com/open-source) Open Collective (https://opencollective.com/) 24 Pull Requests (https://24pullrequests.com/) Libraries.io (https://libraries.io/) The penumbra of open source (EPJ Data Science) (https://epjdatascience.springeropen.com/articles/10.1140/epjds/s13688-022-00345-7) FOSDEM '25- Open source funding: you're doing it wrong (Andrew and Ben) (https://fosdem.org/2025/schedule/event/fosdem-2025-5576-open-source-funding-you-re-doing-it-wrong/) Vue.js (https://vuejs.org/) thanks.dev (https://thanks.dev/home) StackAid (https://www.stackaid.us/) Back Your Stack (https://backyourstack.com/) NSF POSE (https://www.nsf.gov/funding/initiatives/pathways-enable-open-source-ecosystems) Django (https://www.djangoproject.com/) GitHub Sponsors (https://github.com/sponsors) Sustain Podcast-Episode 80: Emma Irwin and the Foss Fund Program (https://podcast.sustainoss.org/80) Sustain Podcast- 3 Episodes featuring Chad Whitacre (https://podcast.sustainoss.org/guests/chad-whitacre) Sustain Podcast- Episode 218: Karthik Ram & James Howison on Research Software Visibility Infrastructure Priorities (https://podcast.sustainoss.org/218) Sustain Podcast-Episode 247: Chad Whitacre on the Open Source Pledge (https://podcast.sustainoss.org/247) Invest in Open Infrastructure (https://investinopen.org/) 360Giving (https://www.360giving.org/) Open Contracting Data Standard (https://standard.open-contracting.org/latest/en/) Jellyfin (https://opencollective.com/jellyfin) zizmor (https://github.com/zizmorcore/zizmor) The LaTeX Project (https://www.latex-project.org/) Credits Produced by Richard Littauer (https://www.burntfen.com/) Edited by Paul M. Bahr at Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Show notes by DeAnn Bahr Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Special Guests: Andrew Nesbitt and Benjamin Nickolls.

Guests Marianne Bellotti | Greg Wilson Panelist Richard Littauer Show Notes In this episode of Sustain, host Richard Littauer talks with Marianne Bellotti, author of *Kill It with Fire, *and Greg Wilson, co-founder of the Carpentries, about what happens to your code when you leave your job and how to make sure it survives. They discuss their new paper, "10 quick tips for making your software outlive your job (https://arxiv.org/abs/2505.06484)," and share practical strategies for protecting, documenting, and sustaining code in open source, research, and civil service environments. Whether you're preparing for a job change or want to future-proof your work, this conversation offers real-world advice for developers and researchers alike. Hit the download button now! [00:03:04] Greg and Marianne talk about challenges in code sustainability. [00:05:46] Greg speaks about how scientists often prototype rather than build production quality code. [00:09:48] We start with Step 1 in the paper: “Consider your threat mode.” Greg explains the different plans needed for individual vs. systematic departures, Marianne speaks about the importance of understanding code lifecycle-some code has a “fruit fly” lifespan others a “tortoise” one, and Richard adds to think about reframe threat modeling around future usefulness. [00:15:53] There's a discussion on Step 2: “Get sign-off on releasing it publicly.” [00:21:30] Greg discusses Step 3: “Choose an open license” and emphasizes to stick to well-known licenses (MIT, BSD), don't write your own, and he shares a funny story. [00:25:29] Richard talks about Step 4: “Put your code somewhere safe” and shares to upload code to GitHub, Codeberg, OSF, Zenodo, etc. Greg suggest peer-to-peer methods like torrents could help long-term preservation and Marianne emphasizes the importance of verified identities when sharing. [00:29:21] Marianne introduces Step 5: “Document your code.” Greg shares that most documentation goes unread and LLMs could help mine useful documentation from conversation records and Marianne emphasizes to focus on “how to run it” first and tests are a part of your documentation. [00:35:17] Step 6: “Make your code reproducible.” Greg and Marianne discuss using tools like Docker, uv for Python lockfiles, etc., for dependency management. [00:36:23] Step 7: “Make your code citable” and Step 8: “Encourage community adoption.” Richard mentions to add a CITATION.cff file so others can cite your code and Greg mentions a great book he read that changed the way he viewed this called, Marketing for Scientists, by Marc Kuchner. [00:38:49] Step 9: “Write a succession or sunsetting plan.” Marianne shares to define success and failure criteria for projects explicitly. [00:40:36] Step 10: “Talk about what you're doing.” Greg emphasizes to celebrate and grieve project endings properly and Richard encourages listeners to check out the paper, read it, and if you see something missing you can contribute back. [00:43:12] Fnal thoughts from Greg and Marianne: Organize collectively to protect science and code sustainability and find your team. Quotes [00:12:10] “Weapons begin as toys.” [00:14:09] “All code is throwaway code.” [00:27:34] “Sooner or later every library burns.” [00:29:44] “Most documentation is never read by anybody because it's not answering the questions that you actually have.” [00:41:05] “Take some time to celebrate and to grieve.” Links SustainOSS (https://sustainoss.org/) podcast@sustainoss.org (mailto:podcast@sustainoss.org) richard@sustainoss.org (mailto:richard@sustainoss.org) SustainOSS Discourse (https://discourse.sustainoss.org/) SustainOSS Mastodon (https://mastodon.social/tags/sustainoss) SustainOSS Bluesky (https://bsky.app/profile/sustainoss.bsky.social) SustainOSS LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/company/sustainoss/) Open Collective-SustainOSS (Contribute) (https://opencollective.com/sustainoss) Richard Littauer Socials (https://www.burntfen.com/2023-05-30/socials) Marianne Bellotti (Medium) (https://bellmar.medium.com/) Marianne Bellotti LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/in/bellmar/) Greg Wilson GitHub (https://www.linkedin.com/in/greg-wilson-a26510b6/?originalSubdomain=ca) Greg Wilson LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/in/greg-wilson-a26510b6/?originalSubdomain=ca) “10 Quick tips for making your code last beyond your current job” (draft) (https://docs.google.com/document/d/1jk0R8VL8lq1-LIbW9D5qwCkvxfXEobP0-RqSYF-4Io4/edit#heading=h.2ijt9lezevm3) Kill It With Fire by Marianne Bellotti (https://nostarch.com/kill-it-fire) Marketing for Scientists: How to Shine in Tough Times by Marc J. Kuchner (https://www.amazon.com/Marketing-Scientists-Shine-Tough-Times/dp/1597269948) Codeberg (https://codeberg.org/) Zenodo (https://zenodo.org/) OSF (https://osf.io/) Credits Produced by Richard Littauer (https://www.burntfen.com/) Edited by Paul M. Bahr at Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Show notes by DeAnn Bahr Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Special Guests: Greg Wilson and Marianne Bellotti.

Guest Dirkjan Ochtman Panelist Richard Littauer Show Notes In this special Maintainer Month episode of Sustain, host Richard speaks with Dirkjan Ochtman, a long-time open source contributor and Rust advocate. They dive deep into what it's like maintaining critical infrastructure libraries, the motivations behind taking over "abandonware," and how funding ecosystems like GitHub Sponsors and thanks.dev help sustain low-level dependencies. Dirkjan also reflects on how Rust's design lends itself well to long-term maintainability and shares thoughts on the challenges of burnout, context switching, and ensuring project continuity. Hit the download button now! [00:01:33] Dirkjan explains how he chooses which projects he's maintaining, being passionate about memory safety via Rust, and maintaining tools like Rustls, Hickory DNS, and Quinn. [00:03:14] Dirkjan describes his motivation for maintaining abandonware and sees it as providing value to the community. [00:04:23] ISRG funds Dirkjan's work on memory-safe DNS and TLS libraires, and they are replacing C-based libraires with Rust equivalents. [00:05:33] Dirkjan uses thanks.dev to help fund maintainers through the full dependency graph and revenue is limited but promising. [00:08:06] Richard brings up Tidelift and Dirkjan mentions it's not yielding results for Rust projects yet because the Rust ecosystem is smaller. [00:09:30] We hear Dirkjan's journey into Rust, starting in Python but frustrated by lack of type safety and performance, and creating his own compiler before appreciating Rust's complexity. [00:12:20] Dirkjan talks about his transition from Python to Rust. [00:13:39] Dirkjan uses PyO3 to create Python bindings for Rust libraries. [00:15:31] Richard wonders why projects become unmaintained and Dirkjan responds that people have life events, job changes, or shifting interests. [00:17:11] How are unmaintained projects flagged? Dirkjan uses the RustSec Advisory DB to detect projects with no active maintainers. [00:18:47] Dirkjan avoids burnout as a maintainer by keeping the scope narrow, only responds to PRs, doesn't overcommit, and focuses on high-efficiency, low-effort maintenance. [00:19:51] Rust has a strong system, built-in unit tests, great CI support, and Dirkjan encourages atomic commits to simplify code review. [00:21:28] Dirkjan speaks about languages that are more maintainer safe. [00:22:18] Richard brings up attack vectors and the ‘left-pad incident.' Dirkjan shares how he builds trust via his public GitHub record. [00:24:17] We hear Dirkjan's offboarding and succession planning as he explains handing off projects like Askama and promoting multiple maintainers to reduce bus factor. [00:26:08] Dirkjan's long-term vision for OSS sustainability is he hopes to move higher in the stack and wants to make high-quality software easier to build. [00:27:38] Dirkjan explains why he prefers to do asynchronous collaboration over pair programming. [00:28:52] Dirkjan discusses Rust's long-term ecosystem stability. [00:31:09] Find out where you can follow Dirkjan on the web. Quotes [00:03:23] “You call it abandonware and I call it a dependency that has a million users.” [00:19:02] “[When I take on a project], I don't take on the burden of proactively improving the project.” [00:19:11] “I will be there when someone submits a PR." [00:20:37] “I ask folks to make small changes: atomic commits.” Spotlight [00:31:37] Richard's spotlight is Allan Day. [00:32:20] Dirkjan's spotlight is Xilem. Links SustainOSS (https://sustainoss.org/) podcast@sustainoss.org (mailto:podcast@sustainoss.org) richard@sustainoss.org (mailto:richard@sustainoss.org) SustainOSS Discourse (https://discourse.sustainoss.org/) SustainOSS Mastodon (https://mastodon.social/tags/sustainoss) SustainOSS Bluesky (https://bsky.app/profile/sustainoss.bsky.social) SustainOSS LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/company/sustainoss/) Open Collective-SustainOSS (Contribute) (https://opencollective.com/sustainoss) Richard Littauer Socials (https://www.burntfen.com/2023-05-30/socials) Dirkjan Ochtman LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/in/dochtman/?originalSubdomain=nl) Dirkjan Ochtman Blog (https://dirkjan.ochtman.nl/) Dirkjan Ochtman Mastodon (https://hachyderm.io/@djc) Dirkjan Ochtman GitHub (https://github.com/djc) Dirkjan Ochtman Bluesky (https://bsky.app/profile/djc.ochtman.nl) Rust (https://www.rust-lang.org/) Rustls (https://github.com/rustls/rustls) Hickory DNS (https://github.com/hickory-dns/hickory-dns) Quinn (https://github.com/quinn-rs/quinn) Internet Security Research Group (ISRG) (https://www.abetterinternet.org/) Let's Encrypt (https://letsencrypt.org/) Automatic Certificate Management Environment (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Automatic_Certificate_Management_Environment) PyO3 user guide (https://pyo3.rs/v0.15.1/) Sustain Podcast-Episode 108: Sarah Gran and Josh Aas: Sustainable Digital Infrastructure with Memory Safe Code (https://podcast.sustainoss.org/108) Sustain Podcast-Episode 148: Ali Nehzat of thanks.dev and OSS Funding (https://podcast.sustainoss.org/148) Tidelift (https://tidelift.com/) RustSec Advisory Database-GitHub (https://github.com/RustSec/advisory-db) Askama (https://docs.rs/askama/latest/askama/) Allan Day's GNOME Blog (https://blogs.gnome.org/aday/) Xilem (https://xilem.dev/) Credits Produced by Richard Littauer (https://www.burntfen.com/) Edited by Paul M. Bahr at Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Show notes by DeAnn Bahr Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Special Guest: Dirkjan Ochtman.

Guest Michelle Barker Panelist Richard Littauer Show Notes In this episode of Sustain, host Richard Littauer welcomes Michelle Barker, Director of the Research Software Alliance (ReSA), for an in-depth conversation about the critical yet often overlooked role of research software in open science. Michelle shares her journey from sociologist to open science advocate, unpacking how ReSA fosters global collaboration to support software developed for research. Together, they explore what it means to build “social infrastructure” in the open source ecosystem, the challenges of aligning international stakeholders, and how ReSA is shaping the future of research through strategy, connection, and community-driven solutions. Press the download button now to hear more! [00:01:58] Michelle explains how she got involved in open science and open source software. [00:04:35] Why Research Software? Michelle shares that ReSA was founded to coordinate globally on research software, which lacked unified international representation unlike open data. [00:07:21] We hear about ReSA's engagement strategy and the three main strategies: knowledge sharing, stakeholder collaboration, and governance evolution. [00:09:37] ReSA includes RSEs as one of many stakeholders and works broadly across funders, policymakers, infrastructure providers, and more. [00:10:26] Research software is defined as software developed within a research context to solve a research problem and most is open source but not all. [00:13:12] Richard asks about tracking engagement, and Michelle shares it's hard to quantify outcomes, but standard metrics include newsletter subs, citations, and forum attendance. [00:15:08] Michelle explains the role of social infrastructure. [00:17:37] What's hard about being a social infrastructure? Michelle talks about the challenge of how to motivate groups of people to work together. [00:19:52] Michelle shares her personal approach to networking: research, targeting key individuals, emotional engagement, and strategic planning for conferences. [00:24:35] A new strategy plan is rolling out and Michelle shares what's different. [00:27:32] ReSA is working to establish research software as its own recognized field. [00:29:57] Michelle recognizes shared challenges of both open source and research sectors. The keys to success are spotlight wins and demonstrate value through supported infrastructure and recognized contributions. [00:30:40] Find out where you can find out more about ReSA. Spotlight [00:31:11] Richard's spotlight is the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration (NOAA). [00:31:48] Michelle's spotlight is Softcite. Links SustainOSS (https://sustainoss.org/) podcast@sustainoss.org (mailto:podcast@sustainoss.org) richard@sustainoss.org (mailto:richard@sustainoss.org) SustainOSS Discourse (https://discourse.sustainoss.org/) SustainOSS Mastodon (https://mastodon.social/tags/sustainoss) SustainOSS Bluesky (https://bsky.app/profile/sustainoss.bsky.social) SustainOSS LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/company/sustainoss/) Open Collective-SustainOSS (Contribute) (https://opencollective.com/sustainoss) Richard Littauer Socials (https://www.burntfen.com/2023-05-30/socials) Michelle Barker LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/in/michelledbarker/) Research Software Alliance (ReSA) (https://www.researchsoft.org/) ReSA LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/company/research-software-alliance/) ReSA Mastodon (https://fosstodon.org/@researchsoft) ReSA Bluesky (https://bsky.app/profile/researchsoftware.bsky.social) Sustain Podcast-Episode 264: Neil Chue Hong on the Software Sustainability Institute (https://podcast.sustainoss.org/264) USRSE'25: Philadelphia, PA Oct 6-8, 2025 (https://us-rse.org/) US-RSE (https://us-rse.org/) NOAA (https://www.noaa.gov/) Softcite (https://github.com/softcite/softcite_dataset_v2) Strategic Report Overview (https://docs.google.com/document/d/1XAioZINde902hlujD9hIaiIK5Eagx7w5XP9f8Q7P0KU/edit?tab=t.0#heading=h.lbr59vck876) Full Strategic Report (https://docs.google.com/document/d/1-nyor44kBo5v6lb92ajjzJmYFJ-TXLcafyUz9luQMVk/edit?tab=t.0#heading=h.iiwcx8uz2jje) Defining Research Software: a controversial discussion (https://doi.org/10.5281/zenodo.5504016) Credits Produced by Richard Littauer (https://www.burntfen.com/) Edited by Paul M. Bahr at Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Show notes by DeAnn Bahr Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Special Guest: Michelle Barker.

Guests Eriol Fox | Allen “Gunner” Gunn | Leslie Hawthorn | Abby Cabunoc Mayes Panelist Richard Littauer Show Notes In this special episode of Sustain, Richard has a discussion with guests and fellow hosts Eriol Fox, Abby Cabunoc Mayes, Leslie Hawthorne, and Gunner, about the recent virtual Sustain event discussing the current state and future of sustaining open source software. The conversation covers a broad range of topics, from the impact of AI on open source and the complexity of corporate funding, to the importance of succession planning and the need for a continued focus on equity and inclusion. The group also express gratitude to the community and highlight the necessity of creating safe spaces for deep and meaningful discussions about the human aspects of open source. Future events and potential topics are also teased. Hit the download button now! [00:01:45] Gunner shares an event summary starting on the evolution of SustainOSS, and talks about the topics ranging from usage metrics, donor programs, geopolitical barriers in FOSS, and details the working sessions. [00:03:34] Everyone shares their personal takeaway from the event. [00:09:57] We hear about the conversations that were missed at the event and what everyone would like to talk about in the future about sustaining open source. [00:17:56] Gunner briefs us on the next event with a possibility of another forum focused entirely on AI, and Richard proposes exploring digital sovereignty and how it intersects with open source principles. [00:19:39] We end with final thoughts from everyone: Gunner expresses gratitude for the community, Abby is grateful for the space and conversations, Leslie gives a shoutout to UN Open Source Week for fostering global cooperation, Eriol praises Jonah Duckles for putting out “Ten Simple Rules for Academic Open Source Collaborations with Industry,” and Richard encourages listeners to keep contributing and engaging with the Sustain community. Links SustainOSS (https://sustainoss.org/) podcast@sustainoss.org (mailto:podcast@sustainoss.org) richard@sustainoss.org (mailto:richard@sustainoss.org) SustainOSS Discourse (https://discourse.sustainoss.org/) SustainOSS Mastodon (https://mastodon.social/tags/sustainoss) SustainOSS Bluesky (https://bsky.app/profile/sustainoss.bsky.social) SustainOSS LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/company/sustainoss/) Open Collective-SustainOSS (Contribute) (https://opencollective.com/sustainoss) Richard Littauer Socials (https://www.burntfen.com/2023-05-30/socials) Eriol Fox Website (https://erioldoesdesign.github.io/) Allen “Gunner” Gunn LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/in/allen-gunn-acab/) Leslie Hawthorn LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/in/lesliehawthorn/) Abby Cabunoc Mayes Website (https://abbycabs.github.io/) Monki Gras 2025 (https://monkigras.com/) UN Open Source Week 2025 (https://opencommons.org/UN_Open_Source_Week_2025) Ten Simple Rules for Academic Open Source Collaborations with Industry by Jonah Duckles, Dan Sholler, Beth Duckles (https://orgmycology.com/10-simple-rules-for-academic-industry-collab/) Credits Produced by Richard Littauer (https://www.burntfen.com/) Edited by Paul M. Bahr at Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Show notes by DeAnn Bahr Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/)

Guest Sean Goggins Panelist Richard Littauer Show Notes In this episode of Sustain, host Richard Littauer chats with guest Sean Goggins, a tenured full Professor of Computer Science at the University of Missouri. Sean discusses his extensive involvement in the open source community, particularly through his work with the CHAOSS Project, a Linux Foundation initiative focused on understanding and improving open-source project sustainability. Their conversation covers Sean's academic background, his role in CHAOSS, the importance of distributed leadership, and how metrics can impact the sustainability of open source projects. Sean also shares insights into his teaching methods, the challenges of maintaining open source software, and the future direction of his work on CHAOSS and Augur. Hit the download button now! [00:01:25] Sean shares that he's a professor specializing in software engineering, algorithms, data science, and visualization, and he discusses his tenure status and passion for research and open source work. [00:02:41] Sean explains how open source leadership is distributed rather than centralized. [00:04:45] We hear how the CHAOSS Project emerged from studying open source governance and leadership. Sean and Matt Germonprez started working on open source collaboration data and a metrics-focused discussion at a Linux Foundation Summit that led to the founding of the CHAOSS Project in 2017. [00:08:23] Richard asks Sean how he balances research, teaching, and open source. Sean discusses how he splits time between research (40%), teaching (40%), and service (20%), with CHAOSS being a major part of his research efforts. [00:13:27] Sean explains that the Augur Project was born out of a need for structured open source data tracking. [00:15:18] Richard asks Sean if he teaches his students about open source, and he explains that he uses CHAOSS and Auger to teach students about GitHub collaboration, pull requests, and open source workflows. [00:19:25] Sean shares his insights on research and open source. He emphasizes his involvement in maintaining software and aiding organizations in making sense of CHAOSS metrics through Augur, which has given him a deep understanding of open source development. [00:20:44] Sean explains why he thinks metrics help make projects more sustainable and how the CHAOSS community has benefitted from fostering a welcoming environment for both technical and non-technical contributors. [00:25:23] We hear some challenges within CHAOSS where it's been difficult to build a strong developer community around CHAOSS software tools and maintaining open source software requires significant effort. [00:28:11] He goes further to explain how to be a better project and that there's potential for improving project sustainability through structured mentoring and governance. [00:35:07] Sean shares CHAOSS Project's future and research goals. Quotes [00:03:46] “Distributed leadership: this exists in most of open source. There's not often a single individual who drives an entire project.” [00:09:18] “You have 40% of your time for teaching, 40% of your time for research, and 20% of your time for service.” [00:12:15] “There's a challenge of being a university professor. The advantage is you can do what you want, the challenge is that you have to set your own boundaries.” [00:23:12] “A leading indicator for community health is how many newcomers you have coming in over time.” [00:28:14] “How can I have a better project? It's the same as going to a family reunion and saying, ‘How can we be a better family'?” Spotlight [00:37:25] Richard's spotlight is BibtexParser. [00:38:21] Sean's spotlight is Stuart Geiger. Links SustainOSS (https://sustainoss.org/) podcast@sustainoss.org (mailto:podcast@sustainoss.org) richard@sustainoss.org (mailto:richard@sustainoss.org) SustainOSS Discourse (https://discourse.sustainoss.org/) SustainOSS Mastodon (https://mastodon.social/tags/sustainoss) Open Collective-SustainOSS (Contribute) (https://opencollective.com/sustainoss) Richard Littauer Socials (https://www.burntfen.com/2023-05-30/socials) Sean Goggins Website (https://www.seangoggins.net/) Sean Goggins X (https://x.com/sociallycompute) Nora McDonald Website (https://www.noramcdonald.net/) Nora McDonald-Commonwealth Cyber Initiative (https://cyberinitiative.org/research/researcher-directory/mcdonald-nora.html) Sustain Podcast- 3 episodes featuring guest Georg Link (https://podcast.sustainoss.org/guests/georg-link) Sustain Podcast- 2 episodes featuring guest Dawn Foster (https://podcast.sustainoss.org/guests/foster) Matt Germonprez-Univ. of Nebraska Omaha (https://www.unomaha.edu/college-of-information-science-and-technology/about/faculty-staff/matt-germonprez.php) The Linux Kernel Maintainer Summit-Tokyo, Japan 2025 (https://events.linuxfoundation.org/linux-kernel-maintainer-summit/) Alfred P. Sloan Foundation (https://sloan.org/) CHAOSS (https://chaoss.community/) CHAOSS-GrimoireLab (https://chaoss.github.io/grimoirelab/) CHAOSS-Augur (https://github.com/chaoss/augur) Kelly Blincoe-University of Auckland (https://profiles.auckland.ac.nz/k-blincoe) James Howison (https://james.howison.name/) Sustain Podcast- episode 218 featuring guest James Howison (https://podcast.sustainoss.org/guests/james-howison) Sustain Podcast-episode 243 featuring guest Elizabeth Barron (https://podcast.sustainoss.org/guests/elizabeth-barron) Sustain Podcast-episode 65 featuring guest Brian Proffitt (https://podcast.sustainoss.org/guests/briant-proffitt) Sustain Podcast-2 episodes featuring guest Duane O'Brien (https://podcast.sustainoss.org/guests/duane-obrien) Sustain Podcast-episode 200 featuring guest Stuart Geiger (https://podcast.sustainoss.org/guests/geiger) Digital Infrastructure Podcast- 2 episodes featuring guest Rayya El Zein (https://dif.fireside.fm/guests/rayya-el-zein) BibtexParser (https://bibtexparser.readthedocs.io/en/main/) Stuart Geiger (https://css.ucsd.edu/people/profiles/sgeiger.html) Credits Produced by Richard Littauer (https://www.burntfen.com/) Edited by Paul M. Bahr at Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Show notes by DeAnn Bahr Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Special Guest: Sean Goggins.

Guest Neil Chue Hong Panelists Richard Littauer | Justin Dorfman Show Notes In this episode of Sustain, hosts Richard Littauer and Justin Dorfman talk with Neil Chue Hong, Director of the Software Sustainability Institute (SSI). They discuss the SSI's mission to sustain software used in research, the institute's history and funding, the role of research software engineers, and the newly launched Research Software Maintenance Fund (RSMF) with £4.8 million dedicated to supporting research software. Neil shares insights into the collaboration, training initiatives, and policy work done by the SSI to promote sustainability in software development. The episode also touches on the impact of large funding initiatives like those from the Chan Zuckerberg Initiative and the evolving role of software development in the age of large language models (LLMs). Hit the download button now! [00:01:44] Neil explains SSI's mission and purpose. [00:02:27] Richard inquires about SSI's funding model and how long SSI has existed. Neil explains SSI is a government funded collaboration via UK Research and Innovation (UKRI), and it was founded in 2010 and is funded through 2028. [00:05:03] Richard highlights SSI's impact and Neil discusses how SSI helped establish “Research Software Engineer (RSE)' as a recognized role. [00:08:20] SSI's annual Collaborations Workshop (May 13-15 in Stirling, UK) is mentioned, and Neil recalls a pivotal collaboration with Greg Wilson (Software Carpentry), which expanded training programs. [00:11:16] Neil explains that the SSI has evolved from consultancy to training, community initiatives, and policy advocacy to scale its impact and ensure long-term sustainability in research software. [00:13:57] Richard introduces SSI's new £4.8M Research Software Maintenance Fund (RSMF). Neil explains it supports maintaining existing research software and it's funded by the UK's Digital Research Infrastructure Programme (UKRI). [00:16:54] A question comes up about the geopolitical impact of this funding and Neil states the UK is maintaining leadership in research software sustainability, not just focusing on national capability. [00:20:54] Neil defines research software products being targeted by the RSMF as software used beyond its original development team. [00:22:54] Richard asks if £4.8M is a significant investment and Neil explains this is comparable to past UK research software grants.. [00:25:10] Neil acknowledges Chan Zuckerberg Initiative (CZI) for improving funding models for research software. [00:29:45] Justin asks how LLMs are changing research software engineering. Neil compares LLMs' impact on software development to smartphones revolutionizing photography. [00:34:05] Find out where you can connect with UKRI, SSI, and with Neil on the web. Quotes [00:02:07] “We've got this motto: Better Software, Better Research.” [00:29:03] “You can define what is clearly sci-fi, you can define what is clearly research software, but making an arbitrary cut-off point is really hard.” Spotlight [00:35:13] Justin's spotlight is ghostty. [00:35:40] Richard's spotlight is Olympus Tough cameras. [00:36:34] Neil's spotlight is The Carpentries and Cinema For All. Links SustainOSS (https://sustainoss.org/) podcast@sustainoss.org (mailto:podcast@sustainoss.org) richard@sustainoss.org (mailto:richard@sustainoss.org) SustainOSS Discourse (https://discourse.sustainoss.org/) SustainOSS Mastodon (https://mastodon.social/tags/sustainoss) Open Collective-SustainOSS (Contribute) (https://opencollective.com/sustainoss) Richard Littauer Socials (https://www.burntfen.com/2023-05-30/socials) Justin Dorfman X (https://twitter.com/jdorfman?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Eauthor) Neil Chue Hong LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/in/neilchuehong/) Software Sustainability Institute (SSI) (https://www.software.ac.uk/) Save the date for Collaborations Workshop 2025 (CW25)-SSI (https://www.software.ac.uk/news/save-date-collaborations-workshop-2025-cw25) UKRI awards the Software Sustainability Institute £4.8m to strengthen research software maintenance in the UK (SSI) (https://www.software.ac.uk/news/ukri-awards-software-sustainability-institute-ps48m-strengthen-research-software-maintenance) Digital Research Infrastructure Programme (UKRI) (https://www.ukri.org/what-we-do/creating-world-class-research-and-innovation-infrastructure/digital-research-infrastructure/) Sustain Podcast- Episode 43: Investing in Open Infrastructure with Kaitlin Thaney (https://podcast.sustainoss.org/guests/kaitlin-thaney) Sustain Podcast- Episode 230: Kari L. Jordan on The Carpentries (https://podcast.sustainoss.org/guests/kari-jordan) Sustain Podcast- Episode 235: The State of Open Infrastructure 2024, from IOI with Emmy Tsang (https://podcast.sustainoss.org/guests/emmy-tsang) Open Source in Academia Map (https://sustainoss.org/academic-map/) ghostty (https://ghostty.org/) Olympus Tough camera (https://explore.omsystem.com/us/en/tough) The Carpentries (https://carpentries.org/) Cinema For All (https://cinemaforall.org.uk/) Credits Produced by Richard Littauer (https://www.burntfen.com/) Edited by Paul M. Bahr at Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Show notes by DeAnn Bahr Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Special Guest: Neil Chue Hong.

Guest Alison Hill Panelist Richard Littauer Show Notes We're kicking off the new year of Sustain with host Richard Littauer discussing sustaining open source software with guest, Alison Hill, VP of Product at Anaconda, and a cognitive scientist with a PhD in psychology. Alison shares her journey from academia to industry, emphasizing the importance of statistics and data science in her career. She explains her role at Anaconda, focusing on developing secure and compatible distribution of Python packages and managing the community repository, Anaconda.org. The conversation covers the significance of product management in open source projects, particularly those with corporate backing, and how these roles can help in balancing user needs and business goals. In addition, Alison shares her thoughts on the challenges and strategies for maintaining open source projects without corporate support and touches on the ‘palmer penguins' project. Click to download now! [00:01:13] Alison discusses her transition from academic research in cognitive science to industry and data science, emphasizing her passion for statistics and education. [00:02:41] Alison explains her work at Anaconda, focusing on product management and the Anaconda distribution, aiming to ease the use of Python and R packages in the industry and academia. She also elaborates on other projects she oversees, including Anaconda.org and its role in supporting open source projects and enterprise needs. [00:05:17] We hear how Anaconda sustains itself financially through enterprise offerings and the balance of supporting open source while maintaining a business model. [00:07:14] Alison shares her previous experience as the first PM of data science communication at Posit (formerly RStudio) and her role in enhancing data science education and product development. [00:12:49] Richard and Alison explore the challenges of sustaining open source projects without corporate backing and strategies for maintaining personal and project health in the open source community. Alison discusses common mistakes companies make by confusing project management with product management in open source projects. [00:17:18] Richard asks about the skills needed for developers to adopt a product-oriented approach. Alison suggests that successful product-oriented developers often have high empathy for end-users and experience with the pain points at scale, which helps them anticipate and innovate solutions effectively. [00:20:49] Richard expresses concerns about the sustainability of smaller, community-led open source projects that lack corporate backing and the structured support that comes with it. Alison acknowledges her limited experience with non-corporate open source projects but highlights the difficulty in maintaining such projects without institutional support, and she shares her personal challenges with keeping up with open source project demands. [00:27:41] Alison stresses the importance of clear goals and understanding the implications of joining larger ecosystems, reflects on the need for clarity about the desired outcomes when joining larger ecosystems, and shares examples of successful and unsuccessful engagements in such settings. [00:29:52] She discusses alternative sustainability models, including paid support and subscriptions. [00:33:00] Alison brings up the example of Apache Arrow and the challenges it faced with corporate sponsorship. [00:34:23] We wrap up with Richard acknowledging that not all open source projects require significant funding or formal business models, and Alison explains the ‘palmerpenguins' project she did at the beginning of COVID. [00:37:07] Find out where you can follow Alison on the web. Quotes [00:22:18] “What is the minimum level of support you need to not feel like you're drowning?” Spotlight [00:38:14] Richard's spotlight is Bernard Cornwell. [00:38:39] Alison's spotlight is the book, Impossible Creatures. Links SustainOSS (https://sustainoss.org/) podcast@sustainoss.org (mailto:podcast@sustainoss.org) richard@sustainoss.org (mailto:richard@sustainoss.org) SustainOSS Discourse (https://discourse.sustainoss.org/) SustainOSS Mastodon (https://mastodon.social/tags/sustainoss) Open Collective-SustainOSS (Contribute) (https://opencollective.com/sustainoss) Richard Littauer Socials (https://www.burntfen.com/2023-05-30/socials) Alison Hill, PhD Website (https://www.apreshill.com/) Alison Presmanes Hill, PhD LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/in/apreshill/) Alison Presmanes Hill GitHub (https://github.com/apreshill) Anaconda (https://www.anaconda.com/) Anaconda.org (https://anaconda.org/) The Third Bit-Dr. Greg Wilson (https://third-bit.com/about/) Sustain Podcast-Episode 64: Travis Oliphant and Russel Pekrul on NumPy, Anaconda, and giving back with FairOSS (https://podcast.sustainoss.org/guests/oliphant) Intercom on Product Management (https://www.intercom.com/resources/books/intercom-product-management) Sustain Podcast-Episode 135: Tracy Hinds on Node.js's CommComm and PMs in Open Source (https://podcast.sustainoss.org/135) Hadley Wickham (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hadley_Wickham) palmerpenguins-GitHub (https://allisonhorst.github.io/palmerpenguins/articles/intro.html) Bernard Cornwell (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bernard_Cornwell) Impossible Creatures by Katherine Rundell (https://www.penguinrandomhouse.com/books/743371/impossible-creatures-by-katherine-rundell-illustrated-by-ashley-mackenzie/) Credits Produced by Richard Littauer (https://www.burntfen.com/) Edited by Paul M. Bahr at Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Show notes by DeAnn Bahr Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Special Guest: Alison Hill.

Guest Brian Muenzenmeyer Panelists Richard Littauer | Abbigail Cabunoc Mayes Show Notes In this episode of Sustain, host Richard Littauer is joined by co-host Abigail Cabunoc Mayes and guest Brian Muenzenmeyer, a seasoned open source contributor. Brian shares his journey in web development, his experiences with burnout, and insights from his new book, Approachable Open Source. Some key topics discussed include contributing to open source projects, community building, maintaining balance, and funding models for sustainability. This episode emphasizes the role of diverse contributions and the importance of creating accessible avenues for all kinds of contributions in open source. Press download now to hear more! [00:01:40] Brian discusses his book, which offers practical advice for navigating open source. He reflects on his career journey, from early contributions to burnout and recovery. He shares his humble beginnings with jQuery Mobile and the steps that led him to maintain major projects like Pattern Lab. [00:04:21] Brian opens up about his experience with burnout and how it influenced the writing of his book. [00:06:42] Brian emphasizes the importance of designing sustainable open source communities. [00:08:41] Richard, Brian, and Abby explore the concept of “pace layers” in open source, highlighting the dynamic balance between innovation and stability. [00:14:10] Chapter 7 in Brian's book is discussed where Brian advocates for corporate contributions to open source and shares tips for individuals looking to get involved. [00:20:04] Brian provides practical advice for maintainers, including time management, fostering diverse roles, and creating approachable entry points for contributors. [00:25:01] The conversation delves into the challenges of improving diversity in open source communities and the importance of celebrating successes. [00:28:39] Find out where you can get Brian's book, Approachable Open Source. Digital copies are available worldwide, and physical copies shipping to the U.S. and Canada. Quotes [00:05:29] “There isn't a dichotomy between consumption and contribution.” [00:13:48] “The work that we're doing isn't really for us. If you're making open source, it's not really for you, you're sharing it with the world.” [00:20:28] “If you look at a mature open source project and try to emulate it at the outset, you're going to be disappointed and you're going to feel like you're always behind.” [00:23:09] “You don't need permission to do your job.” [00:23:41] “You're already empowered to fix things that you see are broken.” [00:23:57] “Instead of buying a maintainer a coffee, spend a coffee cup's amount of time looking at their issue log.” Spotlight [00:30:05] Richard's spotlight is Stephen Colbert. [00:30:38] Abby's spotlight is Calibre. [00:30:54] Brian's spotlight is his good friend, Geoff Pursell (https://github.com/geoffp). Links SustainOSS (https://sustainoss.org/) podcast@sustainoss.org (mailto:podcast@sustainoss.org) richard@sustainoss.org (mailto:richard@sustainoss.org) SustainOSS Discourse (https://discourse.sustainoss.org/) SustainOSS Mastodon (https://mastodon.social/tags/sustainoss) Open Collective-SustainOSS (Contribute) (https://opencollective.com/sustainoss) Richard Littauer Socials (https://www.burntfen.com/2023-05-30/socials) Abby Cabunoc Mayes X (https://x.com/abbycabs) Brian Muenzenmeyer Website (https://brianmuenzenmeyer.com/) Brian Muenzenmeyer's Bluesky (https://bsky.app/profile/brianmuenzenmeyer.com) Brian Muenzenmeyer LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/in/brian-muenzenmeyer-91a77554/) Approachable Open Source By Brian Muenzenmeyer (https://approachableopensource.com/) Colin Dean-GitHub (https://github.com/colindean) Pace Layers Thinking: Paul Saffo and Stewart Brand @ The Interval (https://longnow.org/ideas/stewart-brand-pace-layers-thinking-at-the-interval/) Ship Faster By Building Design Systems Slower By Josh Clark (https://bigmedium.com/ideas/design-system-pace-layers-slow-fast.html) Ecosyste.ms (https://ecosyste.ms/) Ecosystem Funds: Curated Support For Your Critical Software Dependencies By Ben Nickolls (https://opencollective.com/opensource/updates/ecosystem-funds-curated-support-for-your-critical-software-dependencies) Stephen Colbert (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stephen_Colbert) Calibre (https://calibre-ebook.com/) Credits Produced by Richard Littauer (https://www.burntfen.com/) Edited by Paul M. Bahr at Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Show notes by DeAnn Bahr Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Special Guest: Brian Muenzenmeyer.

Guest Alexander Petros Panelist Richard Littauer Show Notes Join host Richard Littauer as he dives into the world of open source sustainability with Alexander Petros, core maintainer of htmx and freelance software engineer. Today, they explore the evolution of HTML, the power of lightweight web protocols, and the broader implications of open-source software for the future of the web. Alexander shares his insights on building sustainable digital infrastructure, using simple tools effectively, and rethinking web development paradigms. Hit download now! [00:01:40] Alexander explains htmx as a lightweight front-end JavaScript library enhancing HTML capabilities. [00:03:16] There's a discussion about HTML's design for behavior and interactivity and a comparison of traditional HTML with modern practices, including JavaScript-heavy frameworks. [00:05:50] We hear the origins of htmx, how it started as a jQuery extension called intercooler.js, and the evolution during the pandemic to a standalone library. [00:09:16] Alexander explains building for the long term, why lightweight, adaptable systems matter, and reflects on the durability of early web standards and tools. [00:12:17] Richard inquires about what Alexander envisions a hundred years from now with htmx. [00:14:57] Balancing simplicity and scalability is discussed about HTML's capabilities for large-scale applications and why many developers overcomplicate solutions unnecessarily. [00:17:40] Alexander critiques over-reliance on tools like Docker and large-scale build systems and advocates for simpler development environments like SQLite. [00:19:42] Alexander talks about why open source frameworks like React solve organizational problems for tech giants. [00:25:42] Richard tells us he's been spending time on the International Code of Zoological Nomenclature as a foundational system for species classification and Alexander speaks about the challenges of contributing to protocols governed by large corporations and why HTML remains a uniquely sustainable and universal platform. [00:28:22] Richard asks Alexander if he's thought about the 1000 year approach to the work he's doing. [00:32:21] Find out where you can follow Alexander and his blog online. Quotes [00:13:11] “The web is going to be the most effective delivery mechanism for software for the next couple of decades.” [00:14:12] “If we look at the tools that we have available today, which tools can we use that are most likely to get us to that fifty, hundred year useful piece of software?” [00:24:06] “Different structural project models produce very different software.” Spotlight [00:33:11] Richard's spotlight is the International Code of Zoological Nomenclature. [00:34:07] Alexander's spotlight is better-sqlite3. Links SustainOSS (https://sustainoss.org/) podcast@sustainoss.org (mailto:podcast@sustainoss.org) richard@sustainoss.org (mailto:richard@sustainoss.org) SustainOSS Discourse (https://discourse.sustainoss.org/) SustainOSS Mastodon (https://mastodon.social/tags/sustainoss) Open Collective-SustainOSS (Contribute) (https://opencollective.com/sustainoss) Richard Littauer Socials (https://www.burntfen.com/2023-05-30/socials) Alexander Petros Website (https://alexanderpetros.com/) Alexander Petros LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/in/apetros/) Unplanned Obsolescence (Alexander's Blog) (https://unplannedobsolescence.com/) Building the Hundred-Year Web Service with htmx- Alexander Petros (YouTube) (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lASLZ9TgXyc) htmx (https://htmx.org/) Sustain Podcast-Episode 238: Julia Evans and Wizard Zines (https://podcast.sustainoss.org/238) xkcd-927: How Standards Proliferate (https://xkcd.com/927/) Julia Evans Blog (https://jvns.ca/) International Code of Zoological Nomenclature (ICZN) (https://www.iczn.org/) better-sqlite3 (https://github.com/WiseLibs/better-sqlite3) Credits Produced by Richard Littauer (https://www.burntfen.com/) Edited by Paul M. Bahr at Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Show notes by DeAnn Bahr Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Special Guest: Alexander Petros.

Guest Robert Douglass Panelist Richard Littauer | Abby Cabunoc Mayes Show Notes In this episode of Sustain, hosts Richard Littauer and Abby Cabunoc Mayes speak with Robert Douglass, Entrepreneur in Residence at Open Strategy Partners, to delve into sustaining open source projects. They explore Robert's extensive history with Drupal, the role of Open Strategy Partners, and the innovative Drupal Certified Partner Program designed to address the maker-taker dilemma in open source. The episode also covers the recently launched RFP templates aimed at promoting open source software and certified partners. Robert shares insights on gamification, the economic aspects of contributing to Drupal, and future initiatives to ensure the continued sustainability of open source projects. Hit download now to hear more! [00:01:49] Robert shares his background in the Drupal ecosystem and his involvement with Open Strategy Partners, which provides strategic content marketing for B2B tech companies focusing on open source. [00:02:43] Robert explains Open Strategy Partners' focus on supporting open source projects and mentions clients like DDEV and TYPO3. [00:04:06] Richard and Robert discuss what it means to be an entrepreneur in residence, with Robert explaining his role in developing new products for Open Strategy Partners and the books he has written. [00:05:52] Robert reflects on the early days of Drupal and the challenges in making open source sustainable. He notes how the community was initially driven by passion, with few paid opportunities. [00:08:05] Robert introduces the Drupal Certified Partner Program, a system for supporting Drupal sustainability by encouraging companies to contribute both time and money. [00:10:03] The conversation covers how Drupal's contribution system gamifies the support companies provide to the ecosystem. Companies can earn contribution credits, which are visible on Drupal.org and benefit their reputation. [00:15:41] Abby asks about the potential downsides of gamification, especially regarding diversity. Robert explains how placing the system at the company level may mitigate some negative impacts. [00:18:17] Richard inquires about the financial structure of the Drupal Certified Partner Program. Robert clarifies that the funds collected support the Drupal Association's core mission, including maintaining Drupal.org and organizing events. [00:21:33] Robert discusses the development of RFP (Request for Proposal) templates to encourage companies to consider certified open source providers, explaining how this initiative promotes sustainability in the ecosystem. [00:25:56] Robert describes how the RFP templates allow purpose-driven organizations to incorporate open source values in their procurement process, aligning with their missions. [00:27:00] Robert invites listeners to explore and utilize the RFP templates, which are available under a Creative Commons Zero license, encouraging others to adapt and improve them. [00:29:47] Find out where you can follow Robert and his work online. Quotes [00:08:57] “Open Source is like a free puppy.” Spotlight [00:30:30] Abby's spotlight is Common Sort thrift shop in Toronto. [00:30:52] Richard's spotlight is Wikidata. [00:31:21] Robert's spotlight is Chad Whitacre and Sentry. Links SustainOSS (https://sustainoss.org/) podcast@sustainoss.org (mailto:podcast@sustainoss.org) richard@sustainoss.org (mailto:richard@sustainoss.org) SustainOSS Discourse (https://discourse.sustainoss.org/) SustainOSS Mastodon (https://mastodon.social/tags/sustainoss) Open Collective-SustainOSS (Contribute) (https://opencollective.com/sustainoss) Richard Littauer Socials (https://www.burntfen.com/2023-05-30/socials) Abby Cabunoc Mayes X (https://x.com/abbycabs?lang=en) Robert Douglass LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/in/roberttdouglass/) Open Strategy Partners (https://openstrategypartners.com/) Open Strategy Partners Blog (https://openstrategypartners.com/blog/) Building Online Communities with Drupal, phpBB, and WordPress by Robert Douglass, Mike Little, Jared W. Smith (https://www.drupal.org/node/1850002) Drupal Certified Partner Program (https://www.drupal.org/association/become-a-drupal-certified-partner) Drupal (https://www.drupal.org/) How to Write an RFP for Open Source Solutions: Featuring Drupal Certified Partners (https://www.drupal.org/association/blog/how-to-write-an-rfp-for-open-source-solutions-featuring-drupal-certified-partners) OSP: Supporting Drupal Certified Partners (https://openstrategypartners.com/blog/osp-supporting-drupal-certified-partners/) Sustain Podcast-Episode 148: Ali Nehzat of thanks.dev and OSS Funding (https://podcast.sustainoss.org/148) Common Sort (https://commonsort.com/) Wikidata (https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Wikidata:Main_Page) Chad Whitacre LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/in/chadwhitacre/) Sentry (https://sentry.io/welcome/) Credits Produced by Richard Littauer (https://www.burntfen.com/) Edited by Paul M. Bahr at Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Show notes by DeAnn Bahr Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Special Guest: Robert Douglass.

Guest Giulio Carvalho Panelist Richard Littauer Show Notes In this episode of Sustain, host Richard Littauer talks with Giulio Carvalho, a civic tech practitioner and program manager at Open Knowledge Brasil, about the importance of open data and civic engagement in Brazil. They discuss the role of civic tech projects in promoting transparency, such as Querido Diário (Dear Diary), an open-source project aimed at centralizing municipal data for better access by citizens, journalists, and activists. Giulio shares insights on the challenges and successes of maintaining open-source projects within a developing country, particularly in the face of competition from large tech corporations. Press download now to hear more! [00:01:36] Giulio explains the Civic Innovation Ambassador Network, and the network's impact on political transparency pledges made by politicians for open data and transparency is highlighted. [00:04:16] There's a discussion about how the pledge focuses on open data and government transparency, relating it to broader movements of open knowledge, and Giulio mentions the Law of Information Access established in Brazil, emphasizing the legal obligations for government transparency. [00:06:49] Richard compares the efforts to the U.S. Freedom of Information Act (FOIA), prompting a discussion on open data and transparency initiatives in Brazil. Giulio discusses specific projects in Brazil that allow citizens to request information anonymously. [00:10:10] Giulio introduces the Querido Diário project, designed to make official acts published in municipal gazettes accessible to the public. [00:15:22] The funding, development, and challenges of sustaining the Querido Diário projects are discussed, noting the support from various grants and partnerships. [00:21:17] The conversation shifts to the broader impact and goals of Open Knowledge Brazil in promoting open data and supporting civic tech initiatives. [00:23:34] Challenges in building a sustainable project with widespread municipal interest are discussed, along with strategies for managing community contributions and maintaining active development. [00:30:01] Richard and Giulio reflect on building grassroots tech movements in the global south and the challenges posed by proprietary technologies from more developed regions. [00:35:12] Find out where you can find Giulio's work and where you can get involved with Open Knowledge Brasil. Quotes [00:30:46] “If we build something by us for us, we can actually build great stuff.” Spotlight [00:38:10] Richard's spotlight is Alexander von Humboldt. [00:38:58] Giulio's spotlight is pretalx. Links SustainOSS (https://sustainoss.org/) podcast@sustainoss.org (mailto:podcast@sustainoss.org) richard@sustainoss.org (mailto:richard@sustainoss.org) SustainOSS Discourse (https://discourse.sustainoss.org/) SustainOSS Mastodon (https://mastodon.social/tags/sustainoss) Open Collective-SustainOSS (Contribute) (https://opencollective.com/sustainoss) Richard Littauer Socials (https://www.burntfen.com/2023-05-30/socials) Giulio Carvalho LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/in/ogecece/) Querido Diário (https://queridodiario.ok.org.br/en-US/sobre) Open Knowledge Brasil (https://ok.org.br/) Open Knowledge Brasil-GitHub (https://github.com/okfn-brasil) Civic Innovation Ambassadors (https://embaixadoras.ok.org.br/) Paper Past Magazines and Journals (https://paperspast.natlib.govt.nz/periodicals/) Alexander von Humboldt (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alexander_von_Humboldt) pretalx (https://pretalx.com/p/about/) Credits Produced by Richard Littauer (https://www.burntfen.com/) Edited by Paul M. Bahr at Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Show notes by DeAnn Bahr Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Special Guest: Giulio Carvalho.

Guest Devin Stein Panelist Richard Littauer Show Notes In this episode of Sustain, host Richard Littauer talks with Devin Stein, CEO and Founder of Dosu. Today, they discuss the challenges of sustaining open source software, the role of AI and LLMs (Large Language Model) in automating support and maintenance, and the ethical considerations surrounding AI usage. Devin explains Dosu's approach to creating a living knowledge base to assist engineering teams and open source maintainers. Also, the conversation dives into how Dosu interacts with users, maintains quality control, and addresses the environmental impact of AI. Hit download now to hear more! [00:01:43] Devin discusses Dosu's purpose which helps engineering teams' software by structuring engineering knowledge into a knowledge base, and the tool supports open source by addressing common questions, triaging issues, and identifying project ownership. [00:02:46] We hear about how Dosu uses LLMs to create a “living knowledge base” that supports open source workflows, such as issue resolution and knowledge sharing. [00:04:48] Devin explains that Dosu is focused on automating support tasks, not generating code directly, and he fills us in the user base and funding. [00:06:17] Devin tells us that revenue comes from platform teams and open core companies using Dosu internally and through a per-seat pricing model. [00:08:03] We learn how Dosu aims to reduce maintainer burnout by handling repetitive inquires, allowing maintainers to focus on unique issues. [00:10:38] There's a discussion on users' positive reception to fast responses via Dosu and how Dosu aims to assist, not replace maintainers, providing first-pass answers or guidance. [00:12:00] Richard expresses a “net positive” sentiment but admits to initial scepticism about GitHub Actions and automation in open source. Devin shares a similar story of entering open source for community interaction, initially contributing through GitHub, and receiving positive feedback. [00:14:49] Richard inquires about managing customer expectations for accuracy and Devin acknowledges the challenge and explains that Dosu is designed to adapt by learning from past issues and solutions, and how human-in-the-loop workflows help maintainers refine Dosu's responses. [00:18:19] A question on ethical and legal use of LLMs is brought up, as Devin hopes for more transparency and alignment on LLM licensing and legal frameworks in the future. [00:21:14] Devin explains that Dosu's knowledge base will soon be accessible, providing transparency for users and maintainers about its data sources. [00:24:49] Richard questions about how AI companies are ensuring their models don't reinforce these biases and asks about measures in place to improve AI responses. Devin emphasizes their approach to LLMs, which focuses on treating the AI as a tool rather than imitating human behavior. [00:26:55] The topic of addressing human elements and consistency is brought up and Devin explains that Dosu's design keeps responses consistent and supportive, and maintainers and users can provide feedback and adjust responses to align with community needs. [00:31:23] Devin talks about Dosu's strategy focusing on helping become contributors without taking over human roles in open source, and maintainers still have the primary role in guiding substantial project changes or complex contributions. [00:33:34] Devin acknowledges the environmental concerns around AI usage and hopes for more sustainable practices and optimizations in the future. [00:34:30] Find out where you can follow Devin and Dosu online. Spotlight [00:34:59] Richard's spotlight is Avatar: The Last Airbender. [00:35:25] Devin's spotlight is sqlc. Links SustainOSS (https://sustainoss.org/) podcast@sustainoss.org (mailto:podcast@sustainoss.org) richard@sustainoss.org (mailto:richard@sustainoss.org) SustainOSS Discourse (https://discourse.sustainoss.org/) SustainOSS Mastodon (https://mastodon.social/tags/sustainoss) Open Collective-SustainOSS (Contribute) (https://opencollective.com/sustainoss) Richard Littauer Socials (https://www.burntfen.com/2023-05-30/socials) Devin Stein LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/in/devstein/) Devin Stein X (https://x.com/devstein64) Devin Stein GitHub (https://github.com/devstein) Dosu (https://dosu.dev/) SOPS (https://github.com/getsops/sops) Sustain Podcast-Episode 61: Melissa Logan on Marketing Open Source Effectively and Sustainably (https://podcast.sustainoss.org/guests/melissa) Maintainer.io (https://maintainer.io/) OSS Maintenance as a Service: Helping maintainers maintain their code by Richard Littauer (https://medium.com/@richlitt/oss-maintenance-as-a-service-helping-maintainers-maintain-their-code-f9717e4990ad) Open source contributor agent architecture repo-Oscar (https://go.googlesource.com/oscar) Avatar: The Last Airbender (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Avatar:_The_Last_Airbender) sqlc: A SQL Compiler (https://github.com/sqlc-dev/sqlc) Credits Produced by Richard Littauer (https://www.burntfen.com/) Edited by Paul M. Bahr at Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Show notes by DeAnn Bahr Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Special Guest: Devin Stein.

Guest Kailash Nadh Panelist Richard Littauer Show Notes In this episode of Sustain, host Richard Littauer sits down with Kailash Nath, CTO of Zerodha, to delve into the dynamics of funding and sustaining open-source projects. They explore the establishment of Zerodha's FLOSS/Fund, which allocates a million dollars annually to support pivotal open source projects and discuss the development of the funding.json format to streamline grant applications. The conversation also covers the challenges of creating such funds, including regulatory hurdles, and aims to make financial assistance globally accessible. From detailing efforts to revive India's open-source communities through the FOSS United Foundation to highlighting the obstacles and innovative models in funding open-source software, the episode provides a comprehensive look at both global and Indian perspectives. Hit download now! [00:01:14] Richard brings up the FLOSS/Fund, a $1 million annual commitment to open source projects. Kailash confirms that the fund is still active and explains how it recently became more structured and a small team has been formed to manage the logistics of the fund. [00:02:48] The FLOSS/Fund has been created to publicly commit to supporting open source in a structured way. Kailash points out that while other companies give donations to open source, there are few structured initiatives from large organizations. [00:04:33] Kailash expresses frustration that few billion-dollar companies have set up similar initiatives to support open source projects. [00:06:24] Kailash explains that the FLOSS/Fund is open to the global open source community and target systemically important projects like libraries and widely used software tools. [00:08:14] Richard inquires about the application process and Kailash explains instead of traditional grant forms, projects must create and publish a “funding.json” file. [00:10:35] Kailash shares that the structured application method is designed to avoid the usual awkwardness of fundraising conversations and streamline the process. [00:13:31] The two discuss the difficulty maintainers face when articulating the importance of their projects, particularly for maintainers who may not have strong written communication skills, Kailash emphasizes that the funding.json method does not replace narrative descriptions but simplifies signaling. [00:16:17] The conversation switches to global scope and prioritization as Kailash tells us Zerodha's open source contributions are not limited to projects they directly use, the fund is open to all global projects, and Zerodha hopes to support projects that are crucial for open source infrastructure. [00:17:09] Kailash discusses the complexity of sending money internationally from India. [00:18:59] We learn the goal is not to make funding.json go viral through financial incentives, but to organically grow adoption if the tool proves valuable. [00:20:49] Richard and Kailash explore the broader challenges of sustaining open source projects beyond funding, such as building healthy communities and incentivizing the proper use and citation of open source infrastructure. [00:25:32] Kailash discusses the Indian open source ecosystem. [00:30:29] Kailash explains how Zerodha's initiatives aim to push the Indian industry to give back more to the open source community. He hopes that their efforts will inspire other companies to set up similar initiatives. [00:32:12] Find out where you can donate to Floss fund and follow Kailash online. Spotlight [00:32:56] Richard's spotlight is his first grade teacher, Mrs. Barril. [00:33:25] Kailash's spotlight is Jim Martsolf who introduced him to “webmastering.” Links SustainOSS (https://sustainoss.org/) podcast@sustainoss.org (mailto:podcast@sustainoss.org) richard@sustainoss.org (mailto:richard@sustainoss.org) SustainOSS Discourse (https://discourse.sustainoss.org/) SustainOSS Mastodon (https://mastodon.social/tags/sustainoss) Open Collective-SustainOSS (Contribute) (https://opencollective.com/sustainoss) Richard Littauer Socials (https://www.burntfen.com/2023-05-30/socials) Kailash Nadh LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/in/kailashnadh/) Kailash Nadh Website (https://nadh.in/) Zerodha (https://zerodha.com/) funding.json (https://floss.fund/funding-manifest/) Sustain Podcast-Episode 153: Kailash Nadh and the FOSS United Foundation (https://podcast.sustainoss.org/153) FLOSS/Fund (https://floss.fund/) FFmpeg (https://ffmpeg.org/) Zig (https://ziglang.org/) Sustain Podcast-Episode 247: Chad Whitacre on the Open Source Pledge (https://podcast.sustainoss.org/247) Open Source Pledge (https://opensourcepledge.com/) Announcing FLOSS/fund: $1M per year for free and open source projects-post by Kailash Nadh (https://floss.fund/blog/announcing-floss-fund/) Credits Produced by Richard Littauer (https://www.burntfen.com/) Edited by Paul M. Bahr at Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Show notes by DeAnn Bahr Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Special Guest: Kailash Nadh.

Guest Thomas Karagianes | Jonathan Romano Panelist Richard Littauer Show Notes In this episode, host Richard Littauer discusses the journey and impact of Eterna with developers Jonathan Romano and Thomas Karagianes. The conversation revolves around Eterna's role in RNA research through user-contributed puzzle solutions, emphasizing community engagement and educational outreach. Topics include the integration of hybrid intelligence, where human intuition complements AI in scientific discovery, and the significance of explainable AI in motivating player participation. The episode also touches on the ethical considerations in collaborating with for-profit entities, the development of accessible COVID vaccines, and low-cost tuberculosis diagnostics. Hit download now to hear more! [00:01:24] Jonathan describes Eterna, a platform where players solve puzzles to contribute to RNA research. [00:02:12] Thomas explains that Eterna focuses on RNA complexity and its importance in modern science, like mRNA vaccines and how Eterna engages players in folding RNA sequences and testing them in labs. [00:04:36] Richard asks if the project is open source and Jonathan says its partially open source and explains the technical limitations that prevent full openness. [00:05:26] We learn about Eterna's community with around 100,000 total players, and a core group of about 30-40 who regularly engage in scientific challenges. [00:07:31] Thomas discusses ongoing efforts to make the game more accessible and increase community engagement through educational outreach and simplifying the tutorial system, and Eterna is used in classrooms as a teaching tool. [00:09:47] Jonathan explains how some Eterna players become code contributors, staff members, and even lead authors on academic papers. [00:13:32] We hear about the funding of the community. [00:15:56] Thomas discusses how Eterna integrates AI to assist players but stresses the importance of human intuition in tackling unique challenges and Jonathan explains how Eterna uses hybrid intelligence, combining AI and human input for better research outcomes. He highlights how Eterna's community has contributed to important research, including COVID-19 vaccine development and tuberculosis diagnostics. [00:22:29] Thomas shares that Eterna attracts players who enjoy breaking the model or exploring boundaries, making the game engaging and motivating for them. [00:27:48] Jonathan and Thomas discuss the ethical considerations of partnerships, especially with for-profit companies, and the need to engage the community in decision-making processes. [00:31:41] Jonathan shares how you can contribute to Eterna and how to join the developer community on GitHub. Quotes [00:10:10] “Minimally, whenever there is a scientific publication that comes out of Eterna from players contributions, there is a consortium author on the paper. That will include everyone who has submitted a solution.” [00:14:21] “There's definitely this pattern - and you can even see it in the code- where open source code passes from grad student to grad student.” [00:19:14] “Hybrid intelligence is an underused buzzword.” Spotlight [00:33:16] Richard's spotlight is The Internet Archive. [00:34:23] Jonathan's spotlight is txircd, a modular IRC daemon written in Python. [00:35:32] Thomas's spotlight is Bioconda. Links SustainOSS (https://sustainoss.org/) podcast@sustainoss.org (mailto:podcast@sustainoss.org) richard@sustainoss.org (mailto:richard@sustainoss.org) SustainOSS Discourse (https://discourse.sustainoss.org/) SustainOSS Mastodon (https://mastodon.social/tags/sustainoss) SustainOSS LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/company/sustainoss/?trk=public_profile_volunteering-position_profile-section-card_full-click&originalSubdomain=in) Open Collective-SustainOSS (Contribute) (https://opencollective.com/sustainoss) Richard Littauer Socials (https://www.burntfen.com/2023-05-30/socials) Thomas Karagianes LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/in/thomaskaragianes/) Jonathan Romano Website (https://luxaritas.com/) Jonathan Romano LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/in/luxaritas/) Eterna (https://eternagame.org/) Eterna Project Information (https://eternagame.org/about) Eterna OpenVaccine (https://eternagame.org/challenges/10845741) Eterna OpenTB (https://eternagame.org/challenges/10845742) Eterna OpenKnot (https://eternagame.org/challenges/11843006) Eternagame-GitHub (https://github.com/eternagame) Foldit (https://fold.it/) RNA (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RNA) Hybrid Intelligence (Springer Link article) (https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s12599-019-00595-2) Mapping Citizen Science through the Lens of Human-Centered AI (Human Computation article) (https://hcjournal.org/index.php/jhc/article/view/133) Practical recommendations from a multi-perspective needs and challenges assessment of citizen science games (PLOS ONE article) (https://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0285367) Mountains Beyond Mountains by Tracy Kidder (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mountains_Beyond_Mountains) Internet Archive (https://archive.org/) txircd (https://github.com/elementalalchemist/txircd) Bioconda (https://bioconda.github.io/) Reamde by Neal Stephenson (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reamde) Credits Produced by Richard Littauer (https://www.burntfen.com/) Edited by Paul M. Bahr at Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Show notes by DeAnn Bahr Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Special Guests: Jonathan Romano and Thomas Karagianes.

Guests Caleb Connolly | Pablo Correa Gómez Panelist Richard Littauer Show Notes In this episode of Sustain, host Richard Littauer is joined by guests Pablo Correa Gómez and Caleb Connolly to explore the development and sustainability of postmarketOS, an open-source Linux distribution designed to extend the life of mobile devices. The team dives into the project's mission, governance, and the community-driven nature of its work. They discuss the challenges related to funding, primarily through grants and Open Collective donations, and the significance of upstreaming Linux kernel support to collaborate with other communities like Alpine Linux. The conversation also highlights the growth of the postmarketOS community, encouraging contributions from both technical and non-technical supporters, and the importance of comprehensive documentation. Additionally, issues of privacy, telemetry, and user support are examined, alongside the steps towards making postmarketOS more professional and economically sustainable. Press download now to hear more! [00:01:30] Pablo explains postmarketOS and its mission to empower people to have full control over their devices and promote sustainability. [00:02:12] Caleb talks about the governance of postmarketOS that started with a few contributors working on a package repository on top of Alpine Linux and overtime more maintainers were added. [00:03:59] There's a discussion on the structure of the team, how the community around hardware components forms sub-communities bases on common SOCs, and the focus on improving tooling and the ecosystem rather than building a product for end users. [00:06:29] Richard discusses the massive, refurbished phone market and asks about how postmarketOS fits into this ecosystem. Caleb shares their experience working on the OnePlus 6 phone and explains the technical process of making the device work on upstream Linux and the challenges of hardware enablement. [00:10:05] Pablo explains that the project is largely funded by volunteer work and Caleb describes the challenges in deciding which devices to prioritize for hardware enablement and how all hardware work so far has been done by volunteers. [00:14:09] On the importance of upstreaming, Pablo explains that postmarketOS works hard to contribute back to the Linux ecosystem rather that maintaining device-specific patches and postmarketOS is downstream to Alpine Linux but contributes much of its work upstream to maintain sustainability. [00:20:09] Richard asks about how the project builds shared context and onboards new developers and Pablo and Caleb explain how the project relies on its wiki page to provide extensive documentation and how the pmbootstrap tool makes it easier for new contributors to get started with porting new devices to postmarketOS. [00:25:01] Richard asks about telemetry and how the team tracks their impact. [00:25:39] Pablo talks about how they receive community feedback through events like FOSDEM and have seen an increase in donations, social media engagement, and community members. [00:28:39] Caleb reflects on the pros and cons of collecting telemetry, which could help guide development but may also create unwanted challenges by focusing too heavily on specific devices. [00:31:30] What are Pablo and Caleb most excited about for the next year? Pablo is excited about professionalizing the project, starting to pay contributors, and scaling the project's growth sustainably, and Caleb jokes about looking forward to the “pre-market OS.” Quotes [00:12:00] “We are trying to grow organically, bit by bit, and be able to pay people to do core things where volunteer work doesn't reach.” [00:15:06] “In the environment we live in, where you have X amount of code per update, it is totally unsustainable.” [00:16:18] “As a distro, we predominately put together the pieces that other people give us.” [00:19:13] “Downstream patches allow to experiment, but long term are a burden. That's the same for every project.” [00:19:22] “The sustainability goes beyond reducing waste and also goes into the social ecosystem and how we maintain projects.” [00:30:33] “We know we are not ready for end users, but we need to build the structure and economic support.” Spotlight [00:32:32] Richard's spotlight is DOSBox. [00:33:03] Pablo's spotlight is FOSDEM and the FOSDEM team. [00:33:57] Caleb's spotlight is processing.org. Links SustainOSS (https://sustainoss.org/) podcast@sustainoss.org (mailto:podcast@sustainoss.org) richard@sustainoss.org (mailto:richard@sustainoss.org) SustainOSS Discourse (https://discourse.sustainoss.org/) SustainOSS Mastodon (https://mastodon.social/tags/sustainoss) Open Collective-SustainOSS (Contribute) (https://opencollective.com/sustainoss) Richard Littauer Socials (https://www.burntfen.com/2023-05-30/socials) Caleb Connolly Website (https://connolly.tech/) Caleb Connolly-treehouse (https://social.treehouse.systems/@cas) Pablo Correa Gómez Website (https://postmarketos.org/core-contributors/#pablo-correa-gomez-pabloyoyoista) Pablo Correa Gómez LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/in/pablo-correa-gomez/) postmarketOS (https://postmarketos.org/) postmarketOS (Open Collective Contribute) (https://opencollective.com/postmarketos) Gnome Shell & Mutter (https://blogs.gnome.org/shell-dev/2022/09/09/gnome-shell-on-mobile-an-update/) postmarketOS Devices (https://wiki.postmarketos.org/wiki/Devices) Sustain Podcast-Episode 195: FOSSY 2023 with Denver Gingerich (https://podcast.sustainoss.org/195) Software Freedom Conservancy (https://sfconservancy.org/) FOSSY 2025:July 31-August 1 (https://2025.fossy.us/) linaro (https://www.linaro.org/) postmarketOS Wiki (https://wiki.postmarketos.org/wiki/Devices) pmbootstrap (https://wiki.postmarketos.org/wiki/Pmbootstrap) compost.party (https://compost.party/) pmbootstrap v3 by Caleb Connolly (https://connolly.tech/posts/2024_06_15-pmbootstrap-v3/) DOSBox (https://www.dosbox.com/) FOSDEM 2025 (https://fosdem.org/2025/) Processing (https://processing.org/) Credits Produced by Richard Littauer (https://www.burntfen.com/) Edited by Paul M. Bahr at Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Show notes by DeAnn Bahr Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Special Guests: Caleb Connolly and Pablo Correa Gomez.

Guest Batool Almarzouq Panelist Richard Littauer | Amanda Casari Show Notes In this episode, hosts Richard Littauer and Amanda Casari are joined by Batool Almarzouq, Honorary Research Fellow at the University of Liverpool and Research Project Manager at the Alan Turing Institute. They discuss Batool's work in open science, including her involvement in the Open Science Community Saudi Arabia, localization efforts, and the challenges of connecting global and local open science initiatives. The conversation covers Batool's efforts to make research more accessible and open in the Arab region, the concept of localization vs. translation, her experiences with translation management systems, and the importance of community and mentorship in advancing open science. Batool shares insights from her collaborations with various groups and the influence of Latin American communities on her work. Press download now to hear more! [00:02:11] Batool explains her roles at various institutions and how she promotes open science in Saudi Arabia and globally. [00:03:31] Batool discusses the difficulties Arab researchers face in engaging with open science, including language barriers and the Western focus of many initiatives. [00:04:50] Amanda asks about the vision for open science in Saudi Arabia and Batool talks about open science values in the Arab world and the cultural significance of knowledge sharing pre-colonization. [00:07:56] Batool talks about localization efforts and bridging the gap between Western and Arab scientific norms. [00:11:04] There's a discussion on how Batool connects researchers and community leaders in Arab countries, the grassroots nature of the Open Science Community Saudi Arabia, and the importance of local engagement. [00:14:20] Batool details the technical tools used for localization, challenges with translating right-to-left languages, and the importance of building open source tools for internationalization. [00:20:20] There's a conversation on the difficulties in securing funding for localization efforts and the importance of empowering local communities to take charge of their own knowledge production. [00:23:43] Batool shares insights on working with Latin American communities, shared challenges in open science, and the importance of community-led initiatives. [00:25:33] We hear Batool's thoughts on the importance of mentorship, community, and collective action in creating meaningful change. [00:27:51] Find out where you can follow Batool and her work online. Quotes [00:06:56] “One of the things is that science used to be more transdisciplinary.” [00:11:18] “We have our own full-time jobs, there's no system that we use in place recording or creating things. It's more about connecting people and creating that space for this discussion to grow.” [00:25:51] “There's two places I get a lot of value from outside of academia: engaging with community practice and finding mentors.” [00:27:17] “Finding people who relate to you, relate to your ideas, and also help you articulate them better and see what other people are trying to do gives you a lot of power.” Spotlight [00:28:27] Amanda's spotlight is PyLadies. [00:29:22] Richard's spotlight is American Atheists. [00:30:14] Batool's spotlight is Alycia Crall, Richie Moluno and Goodnews Sandy. Links SustainOSS (https://sustainoss.org/) podcast@sustainoss.org (mailto:podcast@sustainoss.org) richard@sustainoss.org (mailto:richard@sustainoss.org) SustainOSS Discourse (https://discourse.sustainoss.org/) SustainOSS Mastodon (https://mastodon.social/tags/sustainoss) Open Collective-SustainOSS (Contribute) (https://opencollective.com/sustainoss) Richard Littauer Socials (https://www.burntfen.com/2023-05-30/socials) Amanda Casari Linktree (https://linktr.ee/amcasari) Batool Almarzouq LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/in/batool-almarzouq-093366a1/) Batool Almarzouq Website (https://batool-almarzouq.netlify.app/) The Alan Turing Institute (https://www.turing.ac.uk/) The Turing Way (https://the-turing-way.netlify.app/index.html) Open Science Community Saudi Arabia (https://osc-ksa.com/) Open Science Community Saudi Arabia-Zenodo (https://zenodo.org/communities/1231231664/records?q=&l=list&p=1&s=10&sort=newest) Ramsey Nasser-GitHub (https://github.com/nasser/) Translation management system (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Translation_management_system) Crowdin (https://crowdin.com/) JSQuarto (https://github.com/Open-Science-Community-Saudi-Arabia/JSquarto) PyLadies (https://pyladies.com/) American Atheists (https://www.atheists.org/) Alycia Crall (https://carpentries.org/blog/2021/07/introducing-the-carpentries-director-of-community/) Richie Moluno (https://realrichi3.github.io/) Goodnews Sandy (https://goodnewssandy.netlify.app/) Credits Produced by Richard Littauer (https://www.burntfen.com/) Edited by Paul M. Bahr at Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Show notes by DeAnn Bahr Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Special Guest: Batool Almarzouq.

Guest Juan Pablo Alperin | John Willinsky Panelist Richard Littauer Show Notes In this episode of Sustain, host Richard discusses the importance of maintaining open access to research with guests Juan Pablo Alperin and John Willinsky from the Public Knowledge Project (PKP). The conversation covers PKP's history, the development of their open-source software, Open Journal Systems (OJS), and its impact on scholarly publishing. They dive into the integration with other open-access initiatives, the role of AI in future projects, and the challenges faced in balancing sustainability with the rising demands of their growing user base. The episode also touches on community-driven translations and the importance of creating equitable access to knowledge, especially for communities in the global south. Download this episode now! [00:01:20] John explains PKP's commitment to open access, starting in 1998 with the goal of making research publicly available. [00:02:35] Juan describes Open Journal Systems (OJS) as the flagship open source software of PKP, which facilitates research publication worldwide. [00:04:57] The conversation touches on the peer review process, the importance of making scholarly knowledge open, and how PKP encourages open access through their platform. [00:07:44] John and Juan explain how OJS allows academics and institutions to manage the entire publishing process, from submission to peer review and publication, while maintaining the integrity of research. [00:11:54] John discusses the intersection of open source and open access, noting the successes and challenges that remain in the fight for free and equitable access to research. [00:13:52] Richard inquires about where the funding is coming from, and Juan explains. [00:16:49] The guests highlight how commercial publishers have embraced open access, though often in ways that perpetuate inequalities, such as through article processing charges (APCs). [00:21:09] The discussion touches on sustainability, both in terms of funding PKP and the broader scholarly ecosystem, and the risks of commercializing access to knowledge. [00:25:23] Translation and localization efforts are discussed and how PKP's platform supports multiple languages, enabling access to knowledge across diverse linguistic communities. [00:31:42] The challenges of integrating non-Western and indigenous knowledge systems into scholarly publishing is discussed. [00:35:57] Juan and John share the hurdles PKP faces in terms of keeping up with community demand and ensuring long-term sustainability. [00:39:41] Find out where you can learn more about the projects online. Quotes [00:12:20] “This was going to be Rhetware, that is, it was rhetorical.” [00:13:07] “Open access is close to 50% of the research in the world that's published this year will be freely available to the public and researchers everywhere.” [00:14:55] “An important part of our sustainability is that we provide hosting services for the software.” [00:36:40] "As the community has grown, so have the demands and expectations of the project.” Spotlight [00:41:07] Richard's spotlight is Kawawachikamach, Quebec, [00:41:54] Juan Pablo's spotlight is the project, pandas. [00:42:31] John's spotlight is Mattermost. Links SustainOSS (https://sustainoss.org/) podcast@sustainoss.org (mailto:podcast@sustainoss.org) richard@sustainoss.org (mailto:richard@sustainoss.org) SustainOSS Discourse (https://discourse.sustainoss.org/) SustainOSS Mastodon (https://mastodon.social/tags/sustainoss) Open Collective-SustainOSS (Contribute) (https://opencollective.com/sustainoss) Richard Littauer Socials (https://www.burntfen.com/2023-05-30/socials) John Willinsky LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/in/john-willinsky-714a1b241/) Juan Pablo Alperin Mastodon (https://mastodon.social/@juancommander) Public Knowledge Project (PKP) (https://pkp.sfu.ca/) Public Knowledge Project (PKP) Community Forum (https://forum.pkp.sfu.ca/) Public Knowledge Project (PKP) GitHub (https://github.com/pkp) Open Journal Systems (OJS) (https://pkp.sfu.ca/ojs/) Kawawachikamach, Quebec (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kawawachikamach,_Quebec) pandas (https://pandas.pydata.org/) Mattermost (https://mattermost.com/) Copyright's Broken Promise: How to Restore the Law's Ability to Promote the Progress of Science By John Willinsky (https://direct.mit.edu/books/oa-monograph/5507/Copyright-s-Broken-PromiseHow-to-Restore-the-Law-s) Credits Produced by Richard Littauer (https://www.burntfen.com/) Edited by Paul M. Bahr at Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Show notes by DeAnn Bahr Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Special Guests: John Willinsky and Juan Pablo Alperin.

Guest Nolan Lawson Panelist Richard Littauer | Eric Berry | Justin Dorfman Show Notes In this episode of Sustain, Richard, Justin, and Eric revisit an unreleased interview with Nolan Lawson from 2020. They discuss Nolan's experience as a former maintainer of PouchDB, the emotional labor of being an open source maintainer, and the challenges that led him to step away from such high-profile projects. Nolan also shares his thoughts on the impact of reputation-driven development, open source community dynamics, and his journey towards a healthier relationship with open source. The conversation delves into the candid realities of burnout and the personal sacrifices often made by unpaid open source contributors. Nolan highlights his transition to more sustainable open source practices and his new interests including his work on a Mastodon client called Pinafore. Download now to hear more! [00:01:43] Nolan explains his background with PouchDB and shares his fascination with databases and browser technologies. [00:02:58] Richard shares his personal connection to PouchDB, mentioning how he discovered Nolan through his work on the project. [00:03:26] Nolan talks about his blog post form 2017 titled, “What it feels like to be an open source maintainer,” which reflected on the emotional toll and burnout he experienced for maintaining PouchDB. [00:05:33] Justin reflects on the impact of Nolan's blog post, describing it as a “shot heard around the world” in the open source community. [00:06:48] Eric asks why Nolan and other maintainers stay involved in open source despite the challenges. Nolan explains that reputational benefits and personal interest in the technology were initial motivators for staying involved. [00:10:27] Eric asks Nolan how he realized it was time to step away from maintaining PouchDB. Nolan shares that personal life changes helped him reassess his involvement in open source and reflects on advice he received from other maintainers. [00:14:36] Richard emphasizes the personal and emotional investment many maintainers have in their projects and Nolan acknowledges the privilege of being able to work on open source, but also the challenges it poses for maintainers who feel they cannot leave. [00:21:13] Nolan shares stepping away from PouchDB has improved his mental health and personal relationships and he maintains smaller open source projects. [00:24:00] Nolan explains the importance of being personally invested in a project and realizing when it's time to move on and Justin reflects on his own experience of stepping away from maintaining a project after years of involvement. [00:26:00] Eric asks if funding could have made a difference for Nolan's involvement in open source, and Nolan shares that he avoided funding, preferring to keep his work as a “labor of love.” [00:26:52] What is Nolan currently doing? He talks about maintaining a Mastodon client and focusing on personal projects that bring him joy. [00:30:00] Richard discusses the importance of balancing open source work with personal life and the need for a sustainable approach to maintaining projects. [00:30:46] Eric highlights the vulnerability and self-awareness Nolan has shown in discussing his open source journey, thanking him for sharing his experiences. [00:33:13] Find out where you can follow Nolan on the internet. Spotlight [00:33:41] Justin's spotlight is Metabase. [00:34:16] Eric's spotlight is Parametric. [00:35:08] Richard's spotlight is IPFS. [00:35:22] Nolan's spotlight is fake-indexeddb. Links SustainOSS (https://sustainoss.org/) podcast@sustainoss.org (mailto:podcast@sustainoss.org) richard@sustainoss.org (mailto:richard@sustainoss.org) SustainOSS Discourse (https://discourse.sustainoss.org/) SustainOSS Mastodon (https://mastodon.social/tags/sustainoss) Open Collective-SustainOSS (Contribute) (https://opencollective.com/sustainoss) Richard Littauer Socials (https://www.burntfen.com/2023-05-30/socials) Justin Dorfman X (https://twitter.com/jdorfman?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Eauthor) Eric Berry X (https://x.com/coderberry?lang=en) Nolan Lawson Blog (https://nolanlawson.com/) Nolan Lawson Mastodon (https://toot.cafe/@nolan) “What it feels like to be an open source maintainer” (Blog post by Nolan) (https://nolanlawson.com/2017/03/05/what-it-feels-like-to-be-an-open-source-maintainer/) PouchDB (https://pouchdb.com/) Pinafore (https://pinafore.social/) Salesforce (https://www.salesforce.com/) Working in Public: The Making and Maintenance of Open Source Software by Nadia Eghbal (https://press.stripe.com/working-in-public) Metabase (https://www.metabase.com/) Parametric (https://github.com/ismasan/parametric) IPFS (https://www.ipfs.com/) fake-indexeddb (GitHub) (https://github.com/dumbmatter/fakeIndexedDB) Credits Produced by Richard Littauer (https://www.burntfen.com/) Edited by Paul M. Bahr at Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Show notes by DeAnn Bahr Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Special Guest: Nolan Lawson.

Guest Gina Häußge Panelist Richard Littauer Show Notes In this episode of Sustain, Richard chats with guest Gina Häußge, the creator and maintainer of OctoPrint, a web interface for 3D printers. Gina shares her journey in open-source development, discussing how she transitioned to working full-time on OctoPrint through crowdfunding. She talks about managing burnout, maintaining a healthy community, and the complexities of balancing development with user demands. Gina also explains the importance of API stability for plugin developers and her approach to keeping the project sustainable. The episode highlights Gina's creative solutions, such as the introduction of an achievement system to engage users and encourage project support. Press download now to hear more! [00:01:38] Gina shares how she combats the stress and emotional toll of dealing with entitled users by using a heavy bag and playing the “DOOM” soundtrack. [00:03:24] Gina explains OctoPrint and all its features. [00:06:00] Richard inquires about Gina's approach to governance and how she maintains a healthy community while preventing burnout. Gina explains her gut feeling-driven approach to building the project and how it turned into a larger community. [00:08:51] Gina talks about how she transitioned to a four-day work week to protect her mental and physical health, and how it improved her productivity and well-being. [00:10:34] There's a discussion about the importance of API stability for OctoPrint's plugin developers, and Gina explains her efforts to maintain backward compatibility and avoid breaking plugins with every new release. [00:14:34] Richard asks how Gina manages community communication with forums, Discord, and other tools. She mentions the importance of searchable forums for documentation over real-time communication platforms like Discord. [00:16:58] A conversation comes up on the “third-party licenses” file on OctoPrint's GitHub, and Gina explains it's to ensure proper credit and transparency. [00:18:45] Gina discusses how some early architectural decisions for OctoPrint were based on gut feeling and she talks about the complexity of modernizing the UI due to the large plugin ecosystem and technical debt. [00:23:21] Gina shares her discomfort with self-promotion but explains how essential crowdfunding is to keep OctoPrint alive, and she highlights a post she wrote about financial concerns and how it led to a significant increase in support. [00:27:09] Gina shares how she introduced a fun achievement system into OctoPrint to engage users and gently remind them about supporting the project. [00:29:50] Find out where you can follow Gina and OctoPrint online. Quotes [00:18:58] Why this Thirdpartylicense.md file: “It felt like the right thing to do.” [00:19:29] When did your gut feeling fail: “Architectural decisions throughout the lifespan of OctoPrint when I didn't know anything better.” [00:20:42] “A plugin system like OctoPrint is both a feature and a curse.” [00:23:54] “I hate being in the spotlight, I hate marketing myself, but I do love doing this work.” [00:24:17] “I feel like I'm actually making a difference and if I want to keep doing that, then I need funding.” Spotlight [00:30:45] Richard's spotlight is Eric Berry, an excellent human. [00:31:05] Gina's spotlight is the Advanced Bash-Scripting Guide. Links SustainOSS (https://sustainoss.org/) podcast@sustainoss.org (mailto:podcast@sustainoss.org) richard@sustainoss.org (mailto:richard@sustainoss.org) SustainOSS Discourse (https://discourse.sustainoss.org/) SustainOSS Mastodon (https://mastodon.social/tags/sustainoss) Open Collective-SustainOSS (Contribute) (https://opencollective.com/sustainoss) Richard Littauer Socials (https://www.burntfen.com/2023-05-30/socials) Gina Häußge LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/in/ginahaeussge/) Gina Häußge Website (https://foosel.net/) OctoPrint (https://octoprint.org/) OctoPrint GitHub (https://github.com/OctoPrint/OctoPrint) OctoPrint Third Party Licenses GitHub (https://github.com/OctoPrint/OctoPrint/blob/master/THIRDPARTYLICENSES.md) Eric Berry X (https://x.com/coderberry?lang=en) Advanced Bash-Scripting Guide by Mendel Cooper (https://tldp.org/LDP/abs/html/index.html) Credits Produced by Richard Littauer (https://www.burntfen.com/) Edited by Paul M. Bahr at Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Show notes by DeAnn Bahr Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Special Guest: Gina Häußge.

Guest Juliana Barros Lima Panelist Richard Littauer Show Notes In this episode of Sustain, Richard Littauer talks with Juliana (Jules) Barros Lima, a full-stack developer and marketing director at Associação Python Brasil. They explore Jules' involvement in organizing and supporting Python events across Brazil, including her work with PyLadies Recife and Python Brasil. The conversation dives into the challenges of fostering diversity and inclusion in open-source communities, touching on Jules' "atomic diversity" framework for engaging local, regional, and national groups. They also discuss the impact of the pandemic on the Python community, the importance of mentorship, and the role of diverse organizing teams in creating codes of conduct that are empathetic and effective. Jules emphasizes the significance of leadership development, community collaboration, and stepping out of comfort zones to strengthen open-source communities globally. Download now to hear more! [00:01:57] Jules gives an overview of the Associação Python Brasil, what they do, and the challenges of managing a large community. [00:03:39] Jules discusses recent events organized and supported by the association and mentions that Python Brasil 2024 will be held in Rio de Janeiro and expected to have at least 300-500 attendees. [00:04:49] Jules discusses the importance of recognizing different regions' unique cultural and economic situations within Brazil. [00:06:31] We learn about the importance of subgroups and identity-based communities like PyLadies, and Jules shares insights from a talk given at PyCon US about amplifying diversity within Python communities and introduces the concept of “atomic diversity.” [00:11:43] Jules highlights how the pandemic impacted Brazil's Python community and discusses efforts to rebuild the community through open source tools and events. [00:14:07] Richard asks about how Brazil's Python community fits within the larger global context and how Brazilian developers can bridge these gaps. Jules mentions that the community is still recovering and growing, the challenges with language barriers, and emphasizes the significance of maintaining open discussions and using GitHub. [00:17:12] Richard and Jules discuss the importance of having diverse organizing teams and codes of conduct (COCs). [00:23:03] Jules offers insights into the organizational challenges faced in building inclusive events and communities. One key takeaway is the importance of engaging and listening to minority groups, such as PyLadies and Rails Girls, and the need for mentorship to help build leadership within underrepresented communities. [00:26:52] Jules stresses that community work is about giving back to the people and organizations that helped individuals grow. [00:31:32] Jules shares strategies to foster new leadership by giving people manageable tasks and responsibilities to build confidence, engaging the community through social media, storytelling, and the need for cross-community collaboration. [00:36:00] Find out where you can follow Jules online. Spotlight [00:36:39] Richard's spotlight is ‘cat' Command. [00:37:08] Jules's spotlight is the project, Querido Diário (Dear Diary). Links SustainOSS (https://sustainoss.org/) podcast@sustainoss.org (mailto:podcast@sustainoss.org) richard@sustainoss.org (mailto:richard@sustainoss.org) SustainOSS Discourse (https://discourse.sustainoss.org/) SustainOSS Mastodon (https://mastodon.social/tags/sustainoss) Open Collective-SustainOSS (Contribute) (https://opencollective.com/sustainoss) Richard Littauer Socials (https://www.burntfen.com/2023-05-30/socials) Juliana (Jules) Barros Lima Website (https://bento.me/julesbrlm) Python Brasil 2024 (https://2024.pythonbrasil.org.br/) Associação Python Brasil (https://apyb.python.org.br/index.html) APyB (Python Brasil Association) (https://apyb.python.org.br/) APyB Tarefas (Tasks) (https://github.com/apyb/tarefas) APyB Comunidade (Discussions) (https://github.com/apyb/comunidade/discussions) PyLadies Recife (https://recife.pyladies.com/) PyLadies (https://pyladies.com/) Rails Girls (https://railsgirls.com/) Querido Diário (https://docs.queridodiario.ok.org.br/pt-br/latest/) Credits Produced by Richard Littauer (https://www.burntfen.com/) Edited by Paul M. Bahr at Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Show notes by DeAnn Bahr Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Special Guest: Juliana Barros Lima.

Guest Jenn Turner Panelist Richard Littauer Show Notes In this episode of Sustain, host Richard Littauer interviews Jenn Turner, a content strategist at Fastly and part of the Glitch team. They discuss Jenn's unusual journey from journalism to open source, the challenges of being a non-technical contributor in a technical field, and the importance of effective communication in open source projects. Jen shares insights about maintaining work-life balance, the role of community in sustaining open source, and the impact of social media changes on community engagement. They also touch on strategies for non-technical contributions to open source and the value of humanities skills in tech. Hit download now to hear more! [00:01:57] Jenn shares her journey into open source. [00:05:09] Richard asks how Jenn navigated being an editor through the world of open source. She emphasizes that many brilliant coders lack the communication skills necessary to bring communities along and highlights the importance of developing critical thinking skills through humanities courses. [00:07:25] Jenn talks about how editors and writers can play an essential role in promoting and communicating the value of open source projects. [00:08:30] We learn that Jenn had to deal with the pressure to learn how to code early in her career, but she recognized coding wasn't her passion. [00:10:38] Jenn explains how she contributed to Node.js community by writing newsletters and serving on the community committee. [00:11:56] Richard and Jenn discuss the challenges of identifying as non-technical while contributing to technical spaces. [00:14:58] Jenn shares how she decoupled her identity from her occupation to prioritize time with her daughter. [00:17:23] We hear advice from Jenn for non-technical people looking to join a project in open source. [00:21:18] Richard and Jenn discuss the importance of event organizing in the open source space, encouraging listeners to get involved with organizing conferences. [00:23:09] Jenn reflects on the challenges of social media and community engagement, and she shares how Glitch and Fastly try to create meaningful conversations in their forums to foster a more centralized community. [00:32:06] There's a conversation on the importance of having a style guide for social media to ensure consistency and fun communication. [00:34:00] Find out there you follow Jenn and find her work online. Quotes [00:05:16] “One of the funny things about the tech industry is how much emphasis is put on the ability to code.” [00:05:24] “You could be the world's most intelligent coder but have no skillset to bring a community along.” [00:13:42] “Truly no one's value is creating code on a project; it's their thought process and all of the intentions and goals and things that they're working towards.” [00:23:33] “You have to have a level of cultural fluency in order to be able to authentically connect with your audience.” Spotlight [00:35:13] Richard's spotlight is Nolan Lawson. [00:37:12] Jenn's spotlight is Lynn Fisher's website, lynnandtonic.com. Links SustainOSS (https://sustainoss.org/) podcast@sustainoss.org (mailto:podcast@sustainoss.org) richard@sustainoss.org (mailto:ricahrd@sustainoss.org) SustainOSS Discourse (https://discourse.sustainoss.org/) SustainOSS Mastodon (https://mastodon.social/tags/sustainoss) Open Collective-SustainOSS (Contribute) (https://opencollective.com/sustainoss) Richard Littauer Socials (https://www.burntfen.com/2023-05-30/socials) Jenn Turner Website (https://jennturner.glitch.me/) Jenn Turner Mastodon (https://mastodon.social/@jennwrites) Jenn Turner LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/in/jennwrites/) Glitch Blog (https://blog.glitch.com/) Glitch (https://glitch.com/) Fastly (https://www.fastly.com/) Human JavaScript by Henri Joreteg (https://read.humanjavascript.com/) Sustain Podcast-Episode 59: Jenn Schiffer on Satire, Coding, Why Teaching OSS is Super Important (https://podcast.sustainoss.org/59) Sustain Podcast-Episode 244: Jan Lehnardt & Alba Herrerías Ramírez of Neighbourhood.ie (https://podcast.sustainoss.org/guests/jan-lehnardt) Sustain Podcast-2 episodes featuring guest Tracy Hinds (https://podcast.sustainoss.org/guests/hinds) Sustain Podcast-2 episodes featuring guest Ashley Williams (https://podcast.sustainoss.org/guests/williams) Whichlight (https://whichlight.com/) Anil Dash Website (https://www.anildash.com/) Robbie Augspurger Website (https://www.robbieaugspurger.com/) Digital Savvies (https://digitalsavvies.com/) Nolan Lawson Website (https://nolanlawson.com/) Lynn Fisher Website (https://lynnandtonic.com/) Credits Produced by Richard Littauer (https://www.burntfen.com/) Edited by Paul M. Bahr at Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Show notes by DeAnn Bahr Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Special Guest: Jenn Turner.

Guest Lorenzo Sciandra | Mirko Swillus Panelist Richard Littauer | Abby Mayes Show Notes In this episode of Sustain, host Richard Littauer and co-host Abby Mayes are joined by Lorenzo Sciandra and Mirko Swillus from the Sovereign Tech Fund (STF) to discuss the launch of the "Fellowship for Maintainers" program. Funded by the German government, STF is dedicated to supporting open-source sustainability by funding maintainers, especially those who work on multiple projects. Lorenzo and Mirko explain how the program aims to bridge funding gaps for solo maintainers, provide mentorship, and ensure global inclusion. The episode also highlights the program's goals, the application process, and the broader impact on global open source sustainability. Hit download now to hear more! [00:01:28] Richard discusses the Sovereign Tech Fund. [00:02:52] Lorenzo highlights the launch of the “Fellowship for Maintainers” program. [00:04:16] Mirko explains that the program is a pilot, starting small and adopting an iterative approach to learn with the community and designed to fill gaps for solo maintainers who work across multiple projects. [00:06:23] Richard asks why STF is focusing on funding individuals rather than specific projects. Mirko explains maintainers often perform important but unseen work, such as security triaging, code reviews, and documentation. [00:08:45] Abby asks about the results of the survey STF conducted in preparation for the fellowship program. Mirko reveals results and insights about the survey and gives a shout-out to their communications manager, Pohen Shiah. [00:10:58] Lorenzo talks about mentorship being a key part of the fellowship and the goal to help fellows set goals and provide support beyond financial assistance. [00:14:14] Lorenzo explains the flexible, personalized nature of mentorship versus coaching and discuses common challenges and Mirko talks about the balance between full-time jobs and maintaining open source projects and explores the idea of part-time maintenance and considers making room for small freelance maintainers. [00:18:59] Richard asks why the program isn't supporting more maintainers for fewer house each week. Mirko explains how the pilot is designed to experiment with different models. [00:20:29] Richard questions how STF will ensure diversity in selecting fellows and Mirko explains how STF is committed to global inclusion and how freelancers can apply. [00:22:22] We learn how STF will measure success with a discussion on how it be evaluated through various metrics and external experts will also help STF define success metrics for the fellowship. [00:26:39] Richard inquires if STF has reached out to other countries to expand the program. Mirko explains that STF is building global awareness of the program and the European Union and other entitles have shown interests. [00:28:24] Find out where to apply and the application process. Spotlight [00:30:23] Abby's spotlight is Yoga Mamas Toronto, the community. [00:31:06] Richard's spotlight is his friend, Jamie McQuilken. [00:31:53] Lorenzo's spotlight is Proton. [00:32:47] Mirko's spotlight is Signal app. Links SustainOSS (https://sustainoss.org/) podcast@sustainoss.org (mailto:podcast@sustainoss.org) richard@sustainoss.org (mailto:richard@sustainoss.org) SustainOSS Discourse (https://discourse.sustainoss.org/) SustainOSS Mastodon (https://mastodon.social/tags/sustainoss) Open Collective-SustainOSS (Contribute) (https://opencollective.com/sustainoss) Richard Littauer Socials (https://www.burntfen.com/2023-05-30/socials) Abby Cabunoc Mayes X (http://x.com/abbycabs?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Eauthor) Lorenzo Sciandra LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/in/lorenzo-sciandra/) Lorenzo Sciandra Website (https://kelset.dev/) Mirko Swillus LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/in/mirko-swillus-3a0714191/) Mirko Swillus chaos social (https://chaos.social/@mechko) Sustain Podcast-Episode 17: How Formidable Supports Open Source With Lorenzo Sciandra (https://podcast.sustainoss.org/17) Powen Shiah LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/in/powenshiah/) Sovereign Tech Fund Mission (https://www.sovereigntechfund.de/mission) Sovereign Tech Fund-Fellowship for Maintainers Introduction (https://www.sovereigntechfund.de/news/introducing-the-fellowship-for-maintainers) Sovereign Tech Fund Fellowship for Maintainers Application (https://www.sovereigntechfund.de/news/apply-to-the-fellowship-for-maintainers) Sovereign Tech Fund-Fellowship for Maintainers Program (https://www.sovereigntechfund.de/programs/fellowship) Sovereign Tech Fund-Fellowship for Maintainers FAQ (https://www.sovereigntechfund.de/programs/fellowship/faq) Yoga Mamas-Toronto (https://www.torontoyogamamas.com/) Proton (https://github.com/ValveSoftware/Proton) Signal (https://github.com/signalapp) Credits Produced by Richard Littauer (https://www.burntfen.com/) Edited by Paul M. Bahr at Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Show notes by DeAnn Bahr Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Special Guests: Lorenzo Sciandra and Mirko Swillus.

Guest Chad Whitacre Panelists Richard Littauer | Eriol Fox Show Notes In this episode, host Richard Littauer and co-host Eriol Fox interview Chad Whitacre, a key figure in the open source community and Head of Open Source at Sentry. Today, they delve into the challenges and strategies related to sustaining open source projects, focusing on Sentry's efforts to fund open source through various initiatives, including the ambitious OSS Pledge. The discussion covers the history of Sentry's commitment to open source, the creation of a comprehensive funding program, and the launch of the OSS Pledge. The pledge aims to encourage companies to contribute financially to open source by establishing a social norm. Chad also touches on the broader impact and potential of open source foundations and platforms in allocating funds and supporting maintainers, highlighting the importance of making open source a core part of company culture and brand identity. Press download now to hear more! [00:01:50] Chad provides a brief history of Sentry, its evolution from an open source project to a start-up, and its commitment to support open source projects. He discusses Sentry's open source funding program, its growth over the years, and the company's budget plans for the current year. [00:04:04] Chad talks about the importance of other companies joining Sentry in funding open source projects and mentions the launch of the “Open Source Pledge.” [00:05:05] Chad explains that funding open source is part of Sentry's brand marketing, similar to how large companies sponsor events for brand visibility. [00:07:48] Richard asks about the potential dilution of Sentry's brand by encouraging other companies to join the funding efforts. Chad explains that the “Open Source Pledge” requires companies to contribute a minimum of $2,000 per developer annually and share their contributions publicly. [00:11:37] Eriol expresses concerns about the focus on developers, noting the importance of other roles like designers in the open source ecosystem. Chad acknowledges the different roles in open source and discusses how Sentry focuses on funding dependencies critical to their tech stack. [00:14:56] Chad talks about the role of open source foundations, especially in light of new European regulations (CRA), and their potential to steward funds more effectively. [00:18:55] Richard questions how foundations can pay developers under U.S. law, leading to a discussion on the need for potential changes in how foundations operate. [00:21:48] Eriol appreciates the “Open Source Pledge” for providing a vocabulary and structure to involve organizations and companies in supporting open source. [00:23:06] Chad talks about the upcoming media campaign to promote the pledge and the aim to establish a new social norm around funding open source. [00:25:13] Richard asks how the pledge ensures that funds given are truly no-strings- attached to which Chad responds that platforms like GitHub Sponsors typically enforce a no-strings-attached culture, and the pledge doesn't directly handle funds but incentivizes companies to contribute through established platforms. [00:27:56] Richard seeks clarification on how the pledge ensures contributions don't come with expectations of ongoing development work from maintainers. Chad emphasizes the need for adding more financial support to the open source ecosystem and fostering collaboration among platforms, foundations, and maintainers. [00:33:49] The conversation concludes with a brief mention of Fair Source, another initiative Chad is involved in. [00:34:14] Find out where you can follow Chad and his work online. Spotlight [00:34:56] Eriol's spotlight is a project called, Cofacts. [00:35:45] Richards's spotlight is his high school advisor, Rob Kyff. [00:36:25] Chad's spotlight is Kim Coggin, a dry stack stonewaller. Links SustainOSS (https://sustainoss.org/) podcast@sustainoss.org (email) (mailto:podcast@sustainoss.org) richard@theuserismymom.com (email) (mailto:richard@theuserismymom.com) SustainOSS Discourse (https://discourse.sustainoss.org/) SustainOSS Mastodon (https://mastodon.social/tags/sustainoss) Open Collective-SustainOSS (Contribute) (https://opencollective.com/sustainoss) Richard Littauer Socials (https://www.burntfen.com/2023-05-30/socials) Eriol Fox X/Twitter (https://x.com/EriolDoesDesign?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Eauthor) Chad Whitacre LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/in/chadwhitacre/) Chad Whitacre Blog (https://openpath.chadwhitacre.com/) Chad Whitacre X/Twitter (https://x.com/chadwhitacre_?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Eauthor) Sentry (https://sentry.io/welcome/) The Future of FOSS Foundations by Chad Whitacre (https://openpath.chadwhitacre.com/2024/the-future-of-foss-foundations/) Open Source Pledge-GitHub (https://github.com/opensourcepledge/osspledge.com) Open Source Pledge (https://osspledge.com/) Fair Source (https://fair.io/) Cofacts (https://github.com/cofacts) Rob Kyff (https://www.creators.com/author/rob-kyff) Rob Kyff-The Word Guy (https://www.creators.com/features/rob-kyff-word-guy) Kim Coggin-Laurel Stoneworks (https://www.laurelstoneworks.com/) Credits Produced by Richard Littauer (https://www.burntfen.com/) Edited by Paul M. Bahr at Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Show notes by DeAnn Bahr Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Special Guest: Chad Whitacre.

Guest Divya Mohan Panelist Richard Littauer Show Notes In this episode, host Richard Littauer welcomes guest Divya Mohan, Principal Technology Advocate at SUSE, as they discuss her journey into open source and her role in advocating for SUSE's projects. The conversation delves into the importance of community involvement, the goals of CHAOSS Asia, and the challenges of fostering a cohesive open-source community across a diverse continent. They also explore the necessity of standardization within the CHAOSS project to ensure trust and reliability, highlighting cultural differences in open-source adoption across Asia. Additionally, Divya shares insights on bridging gaps in FOSS education, overcoming language barriers, and new initiatives, including efforts to include Oceania and focus on disabled Asians in the open-source community. Press download now to hear more! [00:01:30] Divya explains her journey into open source and her current role in advocating for projects without focusing on marketing or selling. [00:02:24] She elaborates on SUSE's focus on cloud-native projects, SAP, and Edge, while mentioning that she was the sole technology advocate until recently. [00:03:02] Divya discusses her responsibilities, including creating awareness materials, live streams, and courses around SUSE's projects, particularly focusing on open source projects. [00:04:22] Divya emphasizes the importance of community involvement in open source projects, mentioning that while the core maintainers are SUSE employees, the wider community is encouraged to contribute. She also clarifies that SUSE projects are inherently open source from the beginning. [00:07:42] The conversation shifts to Divya's involvement in CHAOSS Asia, a regional chapter of the CHAOSS project, and she talks about the goals of CHAOSS Asia, which include discovering unique challenges of open source communities in Asia, building a database of these communities, and working on the standardization of metrics. [00:11:42] The discussion delves deeper into why standardization is necessary for CHAOSS Asia, particularly focusing on the regional differences and the need for a trusted seal of approval. [00:13:26] Richard questions the necessity of ISO standards for open source projects, and Divya explains that it's about providing a clear definition of what is accepted within the metrics, drawing parallels with the open chain standard. [00:15:39] The conversation returns to the ISO standard, with Divya noting that the demand for a standard came from Asian companies, highlighting the cultural and regional differences in the IT industry. [00:17:14] Richard and Divya discuss the diverse approaches to open source contributions across different Asian regions and the challenges of fostering a cohesive open source community across such a diverse continent. [00:19:03] Divya shares insights on the varying governmental and business support for open source in different Asian countries, and the fragmented nature of FOSS education across the continent. [00:22:17] Divya touches on the language barriers within CHAOSS Asia and how they're addressed through transcription tools and subgroups. She also mentions new initiatives, including a focus group for disabled Asians in the open source community. [00:23:26] Richard and Divya discuss the inclusion of Oceania in CHAOSS Asia and expresses hope for more participation from Oceania. [00:24:40] Find out where you can follow Divya and CHAOSS Asia online. Quotes [00:22:50] “OSS projects are the best example of how asynchronous communities can give something of value.” Spotlight [00:25:36] Richard's spotlight is Stephen E. Thorpe. [00:26:44] Divya's spotlight is Savitha Raghunathan. Links SustainOSS (https://sustainoss.org/) podcast@sustainoss.org (email) (mailto:podcast@sustainoss.org) richard@theuserismymom.com (email) (mailto:richard@theuserismymom.com) SustainOSS Discourse (https://discourse.sustainoss.org/) SustainOSS Mastodon (https://mastodon.social/tags/sustainoss) Open Collective-SustainOSS (Contribute) (https://opencollective.com/sustainoss) Richard Littauer Socials (https://www.burntfen.com/2023-05-30/socials) Divya Mohan LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/in/divya-mohan0209/) Divya Mohan's Website (https://www.divyamohan.com/) Divya Mohan X/Twitter (https://x.com/Divya_Mohan02?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Eauthor) SUSE (https://www.suse.com/) CHAOSS Asia (https://github.com/chaoss/chaoss-asia) CHAOSS Metrics and Metrics Models (https://chaoss.community/kb-metrics-and-metrics-models/) Stephen E. Thorpe (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stephen_E._Thorpe) Savitha Raghunathan LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/in/savitharaghunathan/) Credits Produced by Richard Littauer (https://www.burntfen.com/) Edited by Paul M. Bahr at Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Show notes by DeAnn Bahr Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Special Guest: Divya Mohan.

Guest Brian Douglas Panelist Richard Littauer Show Notes In this episode of Sustain, host Richard Littauer talks with Brian “bdougie” Douglas, founder and CEO of Open Sauced. They discuss the multifaceted aspects of sustaining open source projects, Brian's journey in developer advocacy, and the unique goals of Open Sauced. Brian shares insights from his experiences at GitHub and Netlify, elaborates on concepts like lottery factor and the significance of unique issue authors, and tackles the challenges of maintaining open source sustainability. He also explores the balance of addressing enterprise needs while supporting smaller, less visible projects and emphasizes the importance of education and community engagement in open source. Press download now! [00:01:54] Brian discusses his background at GitHub and Netlify, his role in promoting GraphQL, GitHub Actions, Codespaces, and the inception of Open Sauced. [00:03:08] We hear about the features of Open Sauced's dashboard which enhances GitHub insights, OSSF scorecards, and workspace customizations for managing multiple projects. [00:04:31] Open Sauced's business model is currently founded by VC money and aims to serve large organizations with significant open source dependencies, and Brian talks about the team size and funding history. [00:06:08] Brian elaborates on Open Sauced's long-term sustainability plan, focusing on enterprise-level solutions for open source project observability and contributions. [00:09:31] There's a discussion on how Open Sauced interacts with open source communities and the importance of real-world testing and contributions to open source projects. [00:11:06] Richard highlights the FOSS Funders initiative, encouraging companies to support open source projects financially and through active participation. [00:12:44] Brian shares insights on effective metrics for evaluating open source projects, emphasizing the importance of engaging with unique issue authors rather than focusing solely on superficial metrics like pull requests, and discusses his approach to starting meaningful conversations in the open source community. [00:16:08] Brian explains why he renamed “Lottery Factor” to “Contributor Absence Factor,” and discusses the Pgvector project to illustrate the importance of understanding the “Contributor Absence Factor” and the sustainability concerns when a project relies heavily on a few contributors. [00:18:20] We learn more about how Open Sauced sources its data, including their use of GitHub's events feed and their development of the “Pizza Oven” tool to generate insights from Git repositories. [00:20:21] Richard and Brian discuss the challenges of maintaining an open source ethos when dealing with large companies' internal projects, avoiding becoming merely service providers for large corporate entities. [00:24:14] Brian discusses the long-term implications of open source projects that receive substantial funding or become integrated into larger corporate frameworks. [00:27:27] Richard brings up the difficulty many open source projects face in accessing significant funding and Brian shares his vision for supporting less prominent open source projects drawing analogies from his personal experiences. [00:32:42] Richard questions the “up the chain” analogy, comparing it to a pyramid scheme or academia's tenure track. Brian acknowledges the need to support contributors at all levels, not just those at the top, and he introduces the concept of a S Bomb to provide transparency about project dependencies. [00:39:36] Find out where you can follow Brian on the web. Spotlight [00:40:17] Richard's spotlight is Mr. Carreras, an awesome music teacher. [00:40:59] Brian's spotlight is Dawn Foster at the CHAOSS Project and the CHAOSS Practitioner Guides. Links SustainOSS (https://sustainoss.org/) podcast@sustainoss.org (email) (mailto:podcast@sustainoss.org) richard@theuserismymom.com (email) (mailto:richard@theuserismymom.com) SustainOSS Discourse (https://discourse.sustainoss.org/) SustainOSS Mastodon (https://mastodon.social/tags/sustainoss) Open Collective-SustainOSS (Contribute) (https://opencollective.com/sustainoss) Richard Littauer Socials (https://www.burntfen.com/2023-05-30/socials) Brian Douglas- Open Sauced (https://app.opensauced.pizza/u/bdougie) Brian Douglas Website (https://b.dougie.dev/) Brian Douglas GitHub (https://github.com/bdougie) Brian Douglas X/Twitter (https://github.com/bdougie) The Secret Sauce Open Sauced Podcast (https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-secret-sauce/id1644263270) The Secret Sauce Podcast: ‘The Future of Cloud Native and AI with Brendan Burns' (https://podcasts.apple.com/fr/podcast/the-future-of-cloud-native-and-ai-with-brendan-burns/id1644263270?i=1000658092259) Open Sauced (https://opensauced.pizza/) Renaming Bus Factor #632 (CHAOSS community) (https://github.com/chaoss/community/issues/632#issuecomment-2152929617) FOSS Funders (https://fossfunders.com/) Andrew Kane GitHub (https://github.com/ankane) Chad Whitacre Website (https://chadwhitacre.com/) Fair Source (https://fair.io/) CHAOSS (https://chaoss.community/) Your Copilot for Git History (Open Sauced) (https://opensauced.pizza/docs/features/star-search/) Open Sauced GitHub (https://github.com/open-sauced/pizza) InnerSource Commons (https://innersourcecommons.org/) Sustain Podcast-Episode 148: Ali Nehzat of thanks.dev and OSS Funding (https://podcast.sustainoss.org/148) Learning in Public with Kelsey Hightower (Curiefense) (https://www.curiefense.io/blog/learning-in-public-with-kelsey-hightower/) Welcome to Wrexham (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Welcome_to_Wrexham) Sustain Podcast-Episode 159: Dawn Foster & Andrew Nesbitt at State of Open Con 2023 (https://podcast.sustainoss.org/guests/foster) Dr. Dawn Foster Mastodon (https://hachyderm.io/@geekygirldawn) About the CHAOSS Practitioner Guides (https://chaoss.community/about-chaoss-practitioner-guides/) Credits Produced by Richard Littauer (https://www.burntfen.com/) Edited by Paul M. Bahr at Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Show notes by DeAnn Bahr Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Special Guest: Brian Douglas.

Guests Jan Lehnardt | Alba Herrerías Ramírez Panelist Richard Littauer Show Notes In this episode of Sustain, host Richard Littauer engages with Jan Lehnardt and Alba Herrerías Ramírez from Neighbourhoodie, a consultancy company based in Berlin and the Canary Islands. The discussion delves into Neighbourhoodie's work on sustaining open source projects, their collaboration with the Sovereign Tech Fund for enhancing open source project's bug resilience, and the technical and ethical facets of their consultancy services. Insights are shared into their past and current projects, including PouchDB, CouchDB, and their contributions to humanitarian causes, emphasizing their focus on creating a sustainable impact in the open source community. Press download now to hear more! [00:01:55] Jan explains the origin of Neighbourhoodie, which began with the Hoodie open source project, how the company evolved, the decline of the Hoodie project due to timing and resources, and how CouchDB and PouchDB continued to thrive. [00:04:27] Richard asks about the company's name and its novelty domain, and Jan gives an overview of Neighbourhoodie's size and slow and steady growth, and their focus on a positive work environment. [00:05:51] Jan gives a detail explanation of CouchDB and PouchDB's functionality, particularly their offline-first and synchronization capabilities, and how this has been used in critical projects like the Ebola vaccine. [00:08:41] Richard asks about maintaining ethical work practices and avoiding projects that conflict with Neighbourhoodie's values. [00:09:53] Jan discusses how Neighbourhoodie balances reinvesting in open source projects and expanding the company, focusing on professional services around CouchDB and PouchDB. [00:11:53] Alba describes her role in leading Sovereign Tech Fund (STF) projects within Neighbourhoodie, and how they engage with various projects to offer support. [00:13:31] Jan explains the STF's Bug Resilience Program. [00:16:33] Richard asks about the potential ethical dilemma when third-party consultants like Neighbourhoodie might be taking work that could have otherwise gone to maintainers themselves. We hear how Neighbourhoodie, the projects, and the STF agree on statements of work, including milestones and time estimates, to ensure fairness and proper allocation of resources. [00:21:23] We learn from Jan that dealing with low-quality bug reports isn't a primary focus of their work, but improving test coverage, dependency updates, and CI/CD processes helps mitigate these issues as a side effect. [00:22:54] Alba talks about the different types of projects they work in, such as OpenPGP.js, Sequioa, Yocto, PyPi, Systemd, PHP, Log4j, and reproducible builds. [00:23:49] Jan discusses the challenges and learning opportunities that comes with working across diverse projects, each with its own set of tools, communication styles, and cultural contexts. [00:25:29] Richard reflects on the complexity of open source sustainability and Alba describes how they research projects and identify areas where they can provide the most help, tailoring their approach to the specific needs of each project. [00:27:25] Jan explains that they don't dictate solutions but rather collaborate with projects to address their most pressing needs, often helping to mediate between different parts of a project to find common ground. [00:30:07] Jan explains how they educate clients to take responsibility for the scripts they deliver, unless there's a long-term support contract in place. [00:32:00] We learn how the Neighbourhoodie transition was organic and not part of a grand strategy and how they continue to contribute to open source through their consulting work. [00:34:54] Richard questions the choice of open source as the main focus given its limitations, and Jan explains that open source is widely understood and accessible, making it a practical choice for their work. [00:37:35] Alba and Jan share some highlights and fun things from their work. [00:39:32] Find out where you can follow Jan and Alba online. Quotes [00:02:19] “The goal was to have two separate entities so that when the company puts out an open source project in its own name, and then the company goes under, and the project goes away, we wanted to not have that.” [00:24:08] “If you do software long enough, you realize that the technical problems are just the sideshow and everything else you have to solve things on the people layer instead of the technology layer.” [00:25:06] “The current monoculture of everything is on GitHub is not the only truth out there.” [00:35:34] “Open source is the thing that everybody understands.” Spotlight [00:40:57] Richard's spotlight is Gregor Martynus. [00:41:54] Jan's spotlight is AdonisJS. [00:42:45] Alba's spotlight is PouchDB. Links SustainOSS (https://sustainoss.org/) podcast@sustainoss.org (email) (mailto:podcast@sustainoss.org) richard@theuserismymom.com (email) (mailto:richard@theuserismymom.com) SustainOSS Discourse (https://discourse.sustainoss.org/) SustainOSS Mastodon (https://mastodon.social/tags/sustainoss) Open Collective-SustainOSS (Contribute) (https://opencollective.com/sustainoss) Richard Littauer Socials (https://www.burntfen.com/2023-05-30/socials) Alba Herrerías Ramírez LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/in/alba-herrerias-ramirez/) Alba Herrerías Ramírez Website (https://www.albaherrerias.dev/) Alba Herrerías Ramírez Mastodon (https://mastodon.social/@albaherrerias) Alba Herrerías Ramírez email (mailto:alba@neighbourhood.ie) Jan Lehnardt LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/in/jan-lehnardt-750b0816b/) Jan Lehnardt Website (https://writing.jan.io/) Jan Lehnardt Mastodon (https://narrativ.es/@janl) Jan Lehnardt email (mailto:jan@neighbourhood.ie) Neighbourhoodie Software (https://neighbourhood.ie/) CouchDB (https://couchdb.apache.org/) Sovereign Tech Fund (https://www.sovereigntechfund.de/) Bug Resilience Program (STF) (https://www.sovereigntechfund.de/programs/bug-resilience) Sustain Podcast: 2 episodes with guest Daniel Stenburg (https://podcast.sustainoss.org/guests/stenberg) Gregor Martynus-GitHub (https://github.com/gr2m) AdonisJS (https://adonisjs.com/) PouchDB (https://pouchdb.com/) Credits Produced by Richard Littauer (https://www.burntfen.com/) Edited by Paul M. Bahr at Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Show notes by DeAnn Bahr Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Special Guests: Alba Herrerías Ramírez and Jan Lehnardt.

Guests Elizabeth Barron | Luis Cañas-Diaz | Dawn Foster Panelist Richard Littauer Show Notes In this episode of Sustain, host Richard Littauer is joined by three guests, Dawn Foster, Elizabeth Barron, and Luis Cañas Diaz, to discuss the CHAOSS Project's recent development of Practitioner Guides. The show delves into the purpose of these guides, which are designed to help open source projects interpret and utilize metrics to improve community health and sustainability. The guests explain the significance of metrics in open source projects, the challenges of defining and making them accessible, and how the guides can benefit different types of projects, from large corporations to individual developers. Topics covered include the background and format of the guides, specifics on the metrics discussed, and the practical applications and improvements these guides aim to facilitate. Go ahead and download this episode now! [00:01:53] Dawn fills us in on the connections between the guests and their collective work on the CHAOSS Practitioner Guides. [00:02:33] The conversation shifts to the specifics of the CHAOSS Project, highlighting the international community involvement and various working groups focusing on different aspects of open source projects like corporate OSPOs, university OSPOs, and diversity and equity initiatives. [00:04:21] Luis describes the origin and work of Bitergia and its collaboration with CHAOSS Project, particularly in developing tools like Grimoire Lab. [00:06:07] Richard turns the discussion to the CHAOSS Project's Practitioner Guides, where Dawn discusses the purpose of the introduction guide in the series, designed to help users understand and apply metrics effectively across various open source contexts. [00:09:48] There's a discussion on the format of the guides, emphasizing their accessibility, ethical considerations in data handling, and how they're designed to be adaptable to different needs. Luis highlights the need for CHAOSS and Bitergia projects to provide actionable insights rather than just more metrics. [00:12:18] Elizabeth and Dawn explain the broader goal of the guides to not only provide metrics but also helps users interpret and apply these to drive tangible improvements in open source projects. [00:13:44] We learn about the target audience for the guides and how they cater to both large organizational structures (OSPOs) and individual project maintainers. [00:15:04] Dawn explains what the Contributor Sustainability Guide focuses on, emphasizing strategies for sustainable contribution and community involvement in open source projects. [00:16:42] The discussion centers on renaming the “bus factor” metric to “contributor absence factor” to avoid the negative connotations of the original term, Luis emphasizes the relevance of metrics, particularly in small projects, and Dawn explains that the guides focus on a few key metrics per guide, chosen for their ease of understanding and minimal requirement for data collection. [00:20:47] Richard inquires about the effectiveness of metrics in identifying if a project is on the wrong path, prompting a discussion on the goals of a project and how metrics align with those metrics. Elizabeth and Dawn stress the importance of aligning metrics with project goals and involving project contributors in discussions about what metrics are most relevant. [00:23:26] The discussion continues with considerations on how metrics should supplement, not replace, expert judgement and involvement in project management. Elizabeth and Richard discuss the potential for projects to start with community growth in mind and the challenges in measuring and guiding such growth. [00:27:07] The conversation switches to the remaining guides not yet covered, with Richard asking about the guides on Responsiveness and Organizational Participation. Dawn explains the Responsiveness guide, with its focus on key metrics like time to first response, time to close, and change request closure ratio. Elizabeth and Luis share why this is one of their favorite guides. [00:32:12] We hear about the broader applicability of the guides. Richard questions if the guides are only for corporate-driven projects or if they can serve more relaxed open source environments. Dawn and Luis emphasize that the guides are valuable for a variety of stakeholders, including foundations and volunteers. [00:33:49] Find out where you can look at the Practitioner Guides online. Quotes [00:06:34] “At the CHAOSS Project we have a whole bunch of metrics, and we have tools or software that help you gather those metrics.” [00:06:56] “There is no one-size-fits-all approach to interpreting metrics.” [00:14:00] “A lot of these guides were designed with OSPOs in mind. They're all useful to anyone who's managing a project.” [00:18:45] “For metrics, the bigger the project, the more useful they are.” Spotlight [00:34:43] Richard's spotlight is Johnny Wilson, an eBird reviewer. [00:35:23] Elizabeth's spotlight is a project called Clocker. [00:36:19] Dawn's spotlight is Nadia Eghbal's book, _Working in Public: The Making and Maintenance of Open Source Software, _and her paper, “Roads and Bridges: The Unseen Labor Behind Our Digital Infrastructure.” [00:37:18] Luis's spotlight is Moodle, the OSS learning platform. Links SustainOSS (https://sustainoss.org/) SustainOSS Discourse (https://discourse.sustainoss.org/) podcast@sustainoss.org (mailto:podcast@sustainoss.org) SustainOSS Mastodon (https://mastodon.social/tags/sustainoss) Open Collective-SustainOSS (Contribute) (https://opencollective.com/sustainoss) Richard Littauer Socials (https://www.burntfen.com/2023-05-30/socials) Elizabeth Barron Website (https://www.elizabeth-barron.com/) Elizabeth Barron LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/in/elizabethn/) Luis Cañas-Diaz Website (https://sanacl.wordpress.com/) Luis Cañas-Diaz LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/in/canasdiaz/) Dawn Foster Website (https://fastwonderblog.com/) Dawn Foster LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/in/dawnfoster/) CHAOSS (https://chaoss.community/) CHAOSS slack (https://chaoss-workspace.slack.com/join/shared_invite/zt-28p56bayt-67TRjdA4yJWQmUd4hCzULg#/shared-invite/email) CHAOSS Practitioner Guides (https://chaoss.community/about-chaoss-practitioner-guides/) Johnny Wilson-Ventures Birding Tours (https://www.birdventures.com/Johnny-Wilson.html) Clocker (https://abhishekbanthia.com/clocker/) Working in Public: The Making and Maintenance of Open Source Software by Nadia Eghbal (https://www.amazon.com/dp/0578675862/) “Roads and Bridges: The Unseen Labor Behind Our Digital Infrastructure” by Nadia Eghbal (https://www.fordfoundation.org/work/learning/research-reports/roads-and-bridges-the-unseen-labor-behind-our-digital-infrastructure/) Nadia Asparouhova (Eghbal) Website (https://nadia.xyz/oss/) Moodle (https://moodle.org/) Sustain Podcast featuring Nadia Eghbal (https://podcast.sustainoss.org/guests/nadia) Credits Produced by Richard Littauer (https://www.burntfen.com/) Edited by Paul M. Bahr at Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Show notes by DeAnn Bahr Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Special Guests: Dawn Foster, Elizabeth Barron, and Luis Cañas Diaz.

Guest Ben Cotton Panelist Leslie Hawthorne Show Notes In this episode of Sustain, host Leslie Hawthorn is joined by guest, Ben Cotton, the Open Source Community Lead at Kusari and former Fedora Program Manager. Ben discusses his career path, the importance of intentional program management in open source projects, and shares insights from his book, 'Program Management for Open Source Projects.' The conversation covers the evolution of engagement in open source communities, the impact of professionalization, and the challenges posed by AI in maintaining open source inclusivity. They also touch on the current trends of corporate involvement in open source. Press download now to hear more! [00:01:38] Ben mentions that he wrote his book to see his name on a cover but also explains the practical reasons for writing it, aiming to assist with the program management of open source projects. [00:04:42] Leslie mentions Karl Fogel's book and discusses how engagement with open source often starts with a technical interest but deepens due to human interactions within the community. [00:05:28] Ben shares his background in synpotic meteorology and how an unexpected opportunity led him to maintain software for weather data visualization, which paved his way into system administration and eventually open source. [00:10:43] Leslie and Ben discuss the evolution of participation in open source projects, noting changes in the community's structure, barriers to entry for newcomers, and the importance of fostering a respectful and inclusive environment for all contributors. [00:13:43] Leslie discusses the trend towards older participants in open source projects and attributes it to the professionalization of these projects and she expresses concerns about how the focus on AI development might limit open engagement in open source projects. [00:16:46] Ben remarks on the ease of using modern technology like Linux systems, contrasting it with earlier experiences that required more user involvement and customization. Leslie shares the potential benefits of AI, envisioning a future where technology adapts to individual needs, like assisting her visually impaired daughter. [00:23:07] Ben reflects on generational differences in technology use and stresses the importance of understanding the impact of our technological choices on future generations, especially concerning environmental sustainability. [00:27:24] Leslie brings up a question from Richard who was interested in hearing Ben's view on program management in open source projects, and how it differs from the role of a developer who manages projects. Ben explains that roles in open source differ from corporate roles as individuals often wear multiple hats, switching between developer, designer, and documenter tasks. [00:30:15] Leslie reflects on the challenges of task switching and the potential for burnout among open source maintainers, particularly those without corporate support. Ben suggests that open source maintainers allow newcomers to handle low-risk tasks to prevent burnout and maintain engagement. [00:34:21] Leslie shares the grief she hears from friends about the typical career progression for developers into management roles, which may not align with their passions, emphasizing the importance of finding fulfillment in one's tasks. [00:35:24] Ben discusses the challenging corporate attitudes towards open source as economic conditions shift. Leslie expresses dissatisfaction with how corporations have historically invested in open source communities, suggesting that even when funding was plentiful, investment was inadequate. Spotlight [00:40:56] Ben's spotlight is WeeWX. [00:42:44] Leslie's spotlight is the great city of Berlin, Germany. Links SustainOSS (https://sustainoss.org/) podcast@sustainoss.org (email) (mailto:podcast@sustainoss.org) richard@theuserismymom.com (email) (mailto:richard@theuserismymom.com) SustainOSS Discourse (https://discourse.sustainoss.org/) SustainOSS Mastodon (https://mastodon.social/tags/sustainoss) Open Collective-SustainOSS (Contribute) (https://opencollective.com/sustainoss) Richard Littauer Socials (https://www.burntfen.com/2023-05-30/socials) Leslie Hawthorn X/Twitter (https://x.com/lhawthorn?lang=en) Leslie Hawthorn LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/in/lesliehawthorn/) Ben Cotton Mastodon (https://hachyderm.io/@funnelfiasco) Ben Cotton Website (https://funnelfiasco.com/) Ben Cotton LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/in/bcotton/) Kusari (https://www.kusari.dev/) Program Management for Open Source Projects by Ben Cotton (https://pragprog.com/titles/bcosp/program-management-for-open-source-projects/) Producing Open Source Software by Karl Fogel (https://producingoss.com/) WeeWX (https://weewx.com/) Berlin (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Berlin) Credits Produced by Richard Littauer (https://www.burntfen.com/) Edited by Paul M. Bahr at Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Show notes by DeAnn Bahr Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Special Guest: Ben Cotton.

Guests Tracy Hinds | Ashley Williams Panelist Richard Littauer Show Notes On today's episode of Sustain, host Richard Littauer is joined by guests, Tracy Hinds and Ashley Williams, to discuss the structural inequities and funding issues in open source. The episode delves deep into the misaligned incentives in the open source community, how regulatory and policy awareness is growing, and the potential for government regulations to create opportunities for open source maintainers. The conversation also covers the roles of various open source foundations, the impact of large corporations, and the need for more effective advocacy and compensation avenues for contributors. Tracy and Ashley announce their involvement in a working group focused on the European CRA legislation, aiming to bridge gaps between maintainers and policymakers. Press download now! [00:02:22] Ashley responds to Richard's comment about everything being “totally screwed” in open source, but also points out misaligned incentives. She discusses the economic challenges of open source, such as the failure of sustaining efforts and its broader economic impact. [00:04:54] Richard mentions his other podcast “Open Source for Climate” which focuses on leveraging open source technology to combat the climate crisis. [00:06:10] There's a discussion about potential regulatory and policy changes affecting open source, highlighting the need for a more equitable system. Ashley delves into economic theories relating to open source, particularly the concept of externalities and potential regulatory solutions, and upcoming regulations like the software bill of materials. [00:10:05] Tracy stresses the importance of involving open source maintainers in policy discussions to avoid misrepresentation by larger organizations alone. [00:11:47] Richard and Ashley discuss the representations of open source interests in policy making, particularly the dominance of large companies and the potential exclusion of individual maintainers. [00:16:04] Ashley critiques many language-based foundations for their minimal contribution to ecosystem, using Node Foundation as an example of one that has been beneficial due to its library ecosystem, notably NPM. [00:17:35] Tracy acknowledges the efforts of the Python Software Foundation (PSF) and Open Collective in fostering ecosystems that support paid contributors, emphasizing the importance of these roles for sustainability. [00:19:50] Richard notes that while centralized support like AWS services vouchers are helpful, these foundations do not effectively facilitate crucial conversations between maintainers and governments regarding open source regulation and standardization. [00:21:52] Ashley reflects on her experience as the Individual Membership Director at the Node Foundation, discussing the challenges of representing a diverse community within open source projects and foundations. [00:24:45] Tracy mentions her role as the first community seat director on the board, highlighting the evolution and ongoing adjustments in community representation within foundation governance. Also, she discusses the importance of involving individual maintainers in regulatory discussions. [00:27:47] Tracy talks about the economic opportunities in open source, facilitated by platforms like GitHub Sponsors and Patreon, which help reduce barriers for maintainers seeking financial support for their projects. [00:29:20] Ashley puts a small spin on Tracy's optimistic view, noting significant opposition to the empowerment of small open source businesses, primarily due to corporate-dominated structures and antitrust-friendly environments in tech. She argues that open source has been consolidating. [00:33:29] Ashley fills us in on where you can follow her and their future discussions. She mentions a working group at the Eclipse Foundation focusing on CRA legislation, announcing an initiative to gather maintainer feedback on this legislation through a reading group. [00:35:42] Tracy mentions where you can find her online. Quotes [00:03:30] “We have open source – people who maintain open source don't really make a lot of money from it. Attempts to sustain open source have largely failed.” [00:06:24] “Every OSS hacker is also incentivized to be a lawyer.” Spotlight [00:36:32] Richard's spotlight is Jingna Zhang and her new social network, Cara. [00:37:25] Tracy's spotlight is the book, Working in Public: The Making and Maintenance of Open Source Software. [00:38:09] Ashley's spotlight is exercising for mental health. Links SustainOSS (https://sustainoss.org/) SustainOSS Discourse (https://discourse.sustainoss.org/) podcast@sustainoss.org (email) (mailto:podcast@sustainoss.org) richard@theuserismymom.com (email) (mailto:richard@theuserismymom.com) SustainOSS Mastodon (https://mastodon.social/tags/sustainoss) Open Collective-SustainOSS (Contribute) (https://opencollective.com/sustainoss) Richard Littauer Socials (https://www.burntfen.com/2023-05-30/socials) Tracy Hinds X/Twitter (https://x.com/hackygolucky?lang=en) Tracy Hinds Mastodon (https://mastodon.social/@hackygolucky) Sustain Podcast-Episode 135 featuring Tracy Hinds (https://podcast.sustainoss.org/guests/hinds) Ashley Williams Twitter (https://x.com/ag_dubs) Ashley Williams LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/in/ashleygwilliams/) Sustain Podcast-Episode 145 featuring Ashley Williams (https://podcast.sustainoss.org/guests/williams) Open Source Initiative (https://opensource.org/) OSS for Climate Podcast (https://ossforclimate.sustainoss.org/) Eclipse Foundation (https://www.eclipse.org/org/foundation/) Jingna Zhang (https://www.zhangjingna.com/) Cara (https://cara.app/login) Working in Public: The Making and Maintenance of Open Source Software by Nadia Eghbal (https://www.amazon.com/Working-Public-Making-Maintenance-Software/dp/0578675862) Sustain Podcast-Episode 51 featuring Nadia Eghbal (https://podcast.sustainoss.org/guests/nadia) Credits Produced by Richard Littauer (https://www.burntfen.com/) Edited by Paul M. Bahr at Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Show notes by DeAnn Bahr Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Special Guests: Ashley Williams and Tracy Hinds.

Guest Yo Yehudi Panelist Richard Littauer Show Notes In this episode of Sustain, host Richard Littauer is joined by Yo Yehudi, Executive Director of Open Life Science (OLS), who discusses the importance of sustaining open source and scientific research. They cover topics such as the transition of OLS from a life sciences focus to all sciences, the importance of sharing scientific work openly, and strategies for building inclusive and sustainable communities within open source projects. Yo also touches on the challenges of funding and supporting volunteer-driven initiatives, their approach to managing volunteer contributions, and insights from their doctoral research on open source project sustainability. Hit download now to hear more! [00:02:19] Yo describes OLS as an organization helping scientists to share their work globally, addressing the common issue of data loss when scientists leave academia without sharing their work. [00:02:56] The conversation explores how OLS has expanded to include all sciences, not just life sciences, and even fields outside of traditional scientific disciplines. [00:03:46] Yo critiques the traditional methods of scientific communication, highlighting the importance of sharing code and computational methods alongside traditional manuscripts. [00:05:55] Richard and Yo discuss the inclusive definition of a scientist, emphasizing curiosity and rigor over formal educational credentials. [00:07:28] There's a discussion on OLS's operational scope and strategic focus to prevent “scope creep,” emphasizing training, mentoring, and incubation projects. [00:09:57] Yo details the team size and funding strategy of OLS, mentioning how they transitioned from a volunteer-based to a funded organization. [00:00:00] Richard discusses the challenge of differentiating OLS for funding in a competitive space filled with similar organizations. Yo explains that OLS views similar organizations not as competitors but as potential collaborators, striving to differentiate by working together and clearly defining each other's unique roles. [00:16:20] There's a discussion on volunteer contributions and avoiding exploitation. [00:17:49] Richard and Yo discuss the challenges of altering the mindset around volunteer compensation and ensuring that project contributions are recognized and supported financially. Yo explains how OLS had adapted its approach to offering support, ensuring it meets diverse needs efficiently. [00:20:44] The conversation shifts to how OLS assists open source practitioners in publishing their work and code effectively, emphasizing the importance of flexibility and thoughtful sharing practices. [00:22:34] Yo highlights changes in OLS's teachings, particularly focusing on equity and the experience of marginalized individuals in open source communities and talks about open access publishing. [00:25:13] Yo acknowledges that using platforms like GitHub and arXiv could be viable options for sharing scientific work, providing it's done responsibly, respecting privacy, and not including sensitive data. [00:26:12] Richard draws a parallel between the challenges faced by scientists needing traditional publication credentials and open source contributors needing recognition for their contributions outside mainstream channels. Yo shares their personal stance on working within the capitalist system to bring about change. [00:28:45] Yo details their doctoral study focused on the longevity of open source projects, noting their findings that the metrics used did not predict project sustainability as expected. [00:32:23] Yo announces their recent successful defense of their doctoral thesis, emphasizing the importance of practical and community-focused approaches in open source projects. [00:33:36] Find out where you can learn more about Yo and their work online. Quotes [00:04:10] “Science is everything else we see.” [00:04:20] “Science uses a lot of code to create outputs, to visualize the work they're doing, to understand things….code and computations come into science in so many different ways.” [00:18:53] “We had a very low uptake, which was surprising, and then we changed the way we asked people to ask for money, and we had more [people ask for funds].” [00:27:50] “The fact that open source really was founded pragmatically as a way to exploit free labor makes me uncomfortable.” [00:33:14] “Make sure you have functional friendly humans.” Spotlight [00:34:22] Richard's spotlight is the book, _Joseph Banks: A Life _by Patrick O'Brian. [00:35:12] Yo's spotlight is InterMine. Links SustainOSS (https://sustainoss.org/) SustainOSS Discourse (https://discourse.sustainoss.org/) podcast@sustainoss.org (mailto:podcast@sustainoss.org) SustainOSS Mastodon (https://mastodon.social/tags/sustainoss) Open Collective-SustainOSS (Contribute) (https://opencollective.com/sustainoss) Richard Littauer Socials (https://www.burntfen.com/2023-05-30/socials) Yo Yehudi Website (https://yo-yehudi.com/) Yo Yehudi LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/in/yoyehudi/) Open Life Science (OLS) (https://openlifesci.org/) Sustain Podcast with host Abigail Cabunoc Mayes (https://podcast.sustainoss.org/hosts/mayes) Mozilla (https://www.mozilla.org/en-US/) [Joseph Banks: A life by Patrick O'Brian](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/JosephBanks:ALife)_ InterMine (http://intermine.org/) Credits Produced by Richard Littauer (https://www.burntfen.com/) Edited by Paul M. Bahr at Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Show notes by DeAnn Bahr Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Special Guest: Yo Yehudi.

Guest Deb Goodkin Panelist Richard Littauer Show Notes This episode of Sustain features host Richard Littauer having a conversation with guest Deb Goodkin, the Executive Director of the FreeBSD Foundation. They discuss the history, development, and distinct characteristics of FreeBSD as an operating system independent from Linux, and the foundational support provided by the FreeBSD Foundation. The conversation delves into the organization's efforts in software development, security, community engagement, and plans to increase diversity. They also highlight the celebration of FreeBSD Day and Deb's passion for maintaining and promoting FreeBSD. Press download now to hear more! [00:00:55] Deb explains her role and clarifies that FreeBSD is an independent operating system, originally derived from Unix developed at Bell Labs. [00:02:27] Richard mentions “BSD” stands for “Berkeley Software Distribution.” Deb confirms the existence of the BSD license and its relevance. [00:03:27] Deb admits it's challenging to determine the number of FreeBSD users due to the nature of the BSD license but estimates hundreds of thousands based on device usage. [00:04:08] Deb distinguishes the FreeBSD Foundation from the FreeBSD Project, explaining the foundation's role in supporting the project and the community through funding, development, and advocacy. [00:06:47] Deb compares the FreeBSD Foundation to other foundations like the GNOME Foundation and the Linux Foundation, emphasizing FreeBSD's focus on software development and community support. [00:08:15] Deb reveals most of the foundation's funding comes from corporate sponsors. She highlights the foundation's increasing focus on security in response to global standards and government guidelines, mentioning FreeBSD's involvement in security research and development. [00:12:45] There's a discussion on the foundation's approach to policy and standards, noting the limited resources but emphasizing the importance of corporate and community input in deciding priorities and projects. [00:15:52] Richard questions Deb about feedback mechanisms used to gauge the FreeBSD community's concerns about security. He wonders about the participation dynamics. Deb details the communication channels within the FreeBSD community, mentions a recent community survey and what the responses revealed, and explains the 1% negative feedback. [00:19:56] The conversation shifts towards diversity and inclusion within FreeBSD, questioning the foundation's strategies to enhance geographical and demographic diversity. Deb discusses the foundation's efforts to increase gender diversity, mentioning initiatives targeting women, especially through involvement in computing events and universities. [00:24:05] Richard inquires about the prevalence of women in executive roles within open source foundations, sparking a conversation on gender dynamics in leadership and the intense dedication required in these roles. Deb shares her admiration for the passion and intelligence within the FreeBSD community and emphasizes the foundation's commitment to supporting the project and its people. [00:26:51] Why is Deb so passionate about FreeBSD? She reflects on her deep connection with the community, her continuous learning in the field, and her desire to see the project thrive long-term. [00:29:06] Richard acknowledges the upcoming FreeBSD Day, and Deb shares how it showcases the uses of FreeBSD with a week of activities. [00:31:26] Find out here you can learn more about FreeBSD and Deb's work online. {00:33:34] Richard asks about the FreeBSD logo, confused by the demon mascot. Deb clarifies that the mascot, named Beastie, is a playful representation related to the UNIX's background processes (daemons) and not an actual logo. Spotlight [00:35:34] Richard's spotlight is Philip Pullman's Trilogy book series. [00:36:12] Deb's spotlight is Michael Lucas's book, Absolute FreeBSD. Links SustainOSS (https://sustainoss.org/) SustainOSS Twitter (https://twitter.com/SustainOSS?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Eauthor) SustainOSS Discourse (https://discourse.sustainoss.org/) podcast@sustainoss.org (mailto:podcast@sustainoss.org) SustainOSS Mastodon (https://mastodon.social/tags/sustainoss) Open Collective-SustainOSS (Contribute) (https://opencollective.com/sustainoss) Richard Littauer Socials (https://www.burntfen.com/2023-05-30/socials) Deb Goodkin X/Twitter (https://x.com/dgoodkin?lang=en) Deb Goodkin LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/in/deb-goodkin-b282924a/) FreeBSD Foundation (https://freebsdfoundation.org/) 2024 FreeBSD Community Survey is Here-FreeBSD Foundation (https://freebsdfoundation.org/blog/2024-freebsd-community-survey-is-here/) FreeBSD Foundation YouTube (https://www.youtube.com/@freebsdfoundation2324) The FreeBSD Project (https://www.freebsd.org/) His Dark Materials by Philip Pullman-Wikipedia (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/His_Dark_Materials) Absolute FreeBSD by Michael W. Lucas (no starch press) (https://nostarch.com/absfreebsd3) Credits Produced by Richard Littauer (https://www.burntfen.com/) Edited by Paul M. Bahr at Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Show notes by DeAnn Bahr Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Special Guest: Deb Goodkin.

Guest Julia Evans Panelists Richard Littauer | Amanda Casari Show Notes In this episode of Sustain, host Richard Littauer and co-host Amanda Casari talk to Julia Evans, a zine artist and programmer from Montreal. The discussion delves into Julia's journey in creating educational zines about technical topics like strace, Bash, and Git. Julia shares insights into her unique approach to making complex tools more accessible, how she uses feedback and beta readers to refine her work, and the importance of writing about stable technologies. The episode also touches on Julia's balance between art and sustainability, her collaborative work with her team, and highlights the significance of community-driven knowledge sharing. Press download to hear much more! [00:01:44] Julia explains her approach to creating zines, starting with the desire to simplify the usage of complex tools like strace. [00:03:14] Julia discusses her background as a programmer and the thematic focus of her zines, including making technical topics like Bash scripting more approachable. [00:04:54] Amanda praises Julia's method of demystifying technical concepts through zines. Julia shares the challenges of creating zines on complex topics like Git, discussing how user feedback helps refine content. [00:07:14] Julia details the iterative process of creating zines, including using beta readers and feedback tools to enhance the clarity and usefulness of her guides. [00:11:50] The discussion shifts to how Julia selects topics for her zines, focusing on technologies with strong backward compatibility guarantees, ensuring that the content remains relevant and accurate over time. [00:15:59] Richard questions Julia about her preference for creating zines over other formats like video tutorials or classes, despite the potential reach and educational impact of those mediums. She explains her preference for zines, highlighting her affinity for print and writing, and he challenge with video formats. [00:19:13] Julia discusses her transformative experience at the Recurse Center, which greatly enhanced her understanding of computer systems, inspiring her to help others feel like “wizards” who fully grasp their tools. [00:21:39] Julia mentions co-founding “bang bang con,” a conference focused on short, insightful talks about programming, and confirms the availability of these talks online. [00:22:46] Richard asks Julia about “weird stuff” she likes to do with computers. She describes creating a DNS server that open shares queries, reflecting her passion for making the invisible aspects of computing visible. [00:24:43] Julia reveals how she funds her zine-making and educational endeavors through sales, which has allowed her to focus full-time on this work and even hire help to manage operations, enhancing sustainability and enjoyment of her work. [00:26:05] Julia reflects on the unpredictability of her success, expressing hesitation to offer advice on replicating her business model due to its unconventional nature. [00:27:47] Julia shares her approach to team building and sustainability, focusing on treating and paying her collaborators well to endure ongoing successful partnerships. [00:28:44] Find out where you can purchase Julia's zines and find her online. Quotes [00:02:19] “I would have all these questions, what are people using this tool for?” [00:02:45] “I wanted to show people that this is not that big of a deal.” [00:06:26] “This is what I wish someone told me when I started using this tool.” [00:17:08] “I don't usually want to learn a book's worth of information about a topic. I'm a generalist.” [00:17:40] “My dream when learning about something is I just want to talk to someone who's really, really smart for two hours and they'll tell me everything I need to know.” [00:21:11] “You can do weird stuff!” [00:24:07] “I just thought it would be cool to make it, so I did.” [00:26:34] “Once I saw that I was working, I started to ask, is it sustainable? What do I need to learn about marketing to make it a sustainable business?” [00:28:29] “I try to be the last client to get fired. That's my dream.” Spotlight [00:29:43] Amanda's spotlight is she finally got to attend csv,conf,v8. [00:30:40] Richard's spotlight is Rafik Draoui. [00:31:26] Julia's spotlight is Atuin, a really nice way to search your shell history. Links SustainOSS (https://sustainoss.org/) SustainOSS Twitter (https://twitter.com/SustainOSS?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Eauthor) SustainOSS Discourse (https://discourse.sustainoss.org/) podcast@sustainoss.org (mailto:podcast@sustainoss.org) SustainOSS Mastodon (https://mastodon.social/tags/sustainoss) Open Collective-SustainOSS (Contribute) (https://opencollective.com/sustainoss) Richard Littauer Socials (https://www.burntfen.com/2023-05-30/socials) Amanda Casari X/Twitter (https://x.com/amcasari?lang=en) Julia Evans Blog (https://jvns.ca/) Julia Evans Mastodon (https://social.jvns.ca/@b0rk) Julia Evans X/Twitter (https://x.com/b0rk) Julia Evans GitHub (https://github.com/jvns) strace (https://strace.io/) Write Useful Books by Rob Fitzpatrick (https://writeusefulbooks.com/) Space Jam (https://www.spacejam.com/1996/jam.html) Recurse Center (https://www.recurse.com/) Sustain Podcast-Episode 146: Anjana Vakil on the Recurse Center, Outreachy, and Learning to Code (https://podcast.sustainoss.org/146) !!Con 2024 (bang bang con) (https://bangbangcon.com/) Gazouilli by Rafik Draoui (https://github.com/rafikdraoui/gazouilli) Wizard Zines (https://wizardzines.com/) Wizard Zine on strace (https://wizardzines.com/zines/strace/) New zine: How Git Works! by Julia Evans (https://jvns.ca/blog/2024/04/25/new-zine--how-git-works-/) Mess with dns (https://messwithdns.net/) Csv,conf,v8 (https://csvconf.com/) Rafik Draoui GitHub (https://github.com/rafikdraoui) Atuin (https://github.com/atuinsh/atuin) Credits Produced by Richard Littauer (https://www.burntfen.com/) Edited by Paul M. Bahr at Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Show notes by DeAnn Bahr Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Special Guest: Julia Evans.

Guest Max Jones Panelist Richard Littauer Show Notes In this first ever cross-over episode of Sustain and Open Source for Climate, host Richard welcomes guest Max Jones, a data scientist and open source software developer who works at Carbon Plan. Max discusses the importance of open source in bringing about effective climate action, the role of Carbon Plan in building accessible data products and tools, and how being a nonprofit is advantageous for open source development. The conversation also touches on funding models for open source projects in nonprofits, including support from individual donors, grants, and collaboration with governmental and private entities like NASA and Microsoft. Additionally, Max shares insights into the development of tools for better visualization of climate data, the impact of open source on climate action, and the challenges of ensuring software and data accessibility and reproducibility. Press download now to hear more! [00:02:50] Richard outlines Max's background in open source software development focused on climate action, including his leadership role at Carbon Plan. [00:03:31] Max discusses the mission of Carbon Plan, emphasizing the importance of transparency and accessibility in climate solutions. [00:04:23] Max describes his role in leading open source initiatives at Carbon Plan. [00:03:23] The conversation shifts to the practical aspects of running a non-profit focused on open source projects, including funding mechanisms such as grants from NASA. [00:06:58] Max explains one of their projects that involve tools for visualizing large-scale climate data to assist cities in planning and decision-making. He mentions how these tools are designed to be accessible to both scientists and the general public. [00:08:13] There's a discussion about community engagement with their tools, noting that while many people reach out with questions or feature requests, there have been few contributions in terms of pull requests. [00:08:53] Max reflects on a collaboration with the Washington Post using their tools to inform public understanding of climate projections. [00:10:37] Max discusses the broader use of the tools by various agencies and the importance of transparency for reproducibility in research. [00:11:24] Max emphasizes the importance of reproducibility in open source projects across academia, industry, and the non-profit sector, and he acknowledges the challenges in ensuring that external users can engage with and reproduce their computational workflows. [00:12:56] The conversation shares insights into building a community around open source projects, particularly through involvement with the Pangeo project, which supports reproducibility and scalability in earth science workflows. [00:14:08] Max talks about the importance of finding common needs across different fields to promote broader collaboration and integration and mentions the Zarr project. [00:15:51] We hear about the size of the team at Carbon Plan which includes various roles. [00:16:28] Richard inquires about the funding landscape for open source projects at Carbon Plan. Max mentions the initial funding received through collaborations with NASA and Microsoft. He emphasizes the importance of ongoing government and agency support for both new tools and the maintenance of existing software. [00:17:51] Max talks about contributing back to open source communities, highlighting the practice of reporting bugs and engaging with upstream dependencies to improve tools. [00:18:38] The necessity of open source for transparency in climate solutions is discussed, contrasting with closed source companies that sell proprietary products to governments. Max argues for the importance of open source in ensuring accountability and better outcomes in climate solutions. [00:20:07] Max discusses the broader aspects of open resources, such as leveraging open standards, data, and hardware. He mentions collaborating with other organizations to tackle scalable computing challenges. [00:21:18] The conversation shifts to the environmental impact of computational work, with Max acknowledging the need for more efficient workflows and the broader implications of their organization's focus, which includes understanding and adapting to climate change impacts. [00:24:15] Richard and Max discuss the challenges of making data sets public in a market-driven environment. Max emphasizes the role of nonprofits in pushing for greater transparency and the potential impact of their work on broader technological practices. [00:26:09] Finally, Max highlights a new project called OffsetsDB, and tell us where you can follow him and his work online. Quotes [00:03:44] “We believe that it's necessary to have transparency and accessibility in our research, data, and tools in order to accomplish the mission.” [00:06:17] “I don't think we can have great climate solutions unless they're open and accessible, especially to the communities that are most impacted by these problems.” [00:11:47] “I would love to see more emphasis on reproducibility outside of academia as we push towards a more transparent model.” Spotlight [00:27:42] Richard's spotlight is an article he read and liked, “The Brazilian Special-Forces Unit Fighting to Save The Amazon.” [00:28:07] Max's spotlight is an open access perspectives article called, “The Origins of the Generic Mapping Tools: From Table Tennis to Geoscience.” Links SustainOSS (https://sustainoss.org/) SustainOSS Discourse (https://discourse.sustainoss.org/) SustainOSS LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/company/sustainoss/) Sustain OSS BlueSky (https://bsky.app/profile/sustainoss.bsky.social) SustainOSS Mastodon (https://mastodon.social/tags/sustainoss) podcast@sustainoss.org (mailto:podcast@sustainoss.org) Open Collective-SustainOSS (Contribute) (https://opencollective.com/sustainoss) Richard Littauer Socials (https://www.burntfen.com/2023-05-30/socials) Max Jones GitHub (https://github.com/maxrjones) Carbon Plan GitHub (https://github.com/carbonplan) Carbon Plan (https://carbonplan.org/) Pangeo (https://pangeo.io/) Zarr (https://zarr.dev/) OffsetsDB (https://carbonplan.org/research/offsets-db) “The Brazilian Special-Forces Unit Fighting To Save The Amazon” (The New Yorker) (https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2024/04/08/the-brazilian-special-forces-unit-fighting-to-save-the-amazon) “The Origins of the Generic Mapping Tools: From Table Tennis to Geoscience” by Paul Wessel (https://agupubs.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/pdf/10.1029/2023CN000231) Credits Produced by Richard Littauer (https://www.burntfen.com/) Edited by Paul M. Bahr at Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Show notes by DeAnn Bahr Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Special Guest: Max Jones.

Guests Eva Maxfield Brown | Boris Veytsman Panelist Richard Littauer Show Notes In this episode of Sustain, host Richard Littauer engages with guests Eva Maxfield Brown and Boris Veytsman to explore their co-authored paper, "Biomedical Open Source Software: Crucial Packages and Hidden Heroes." The paper focuses on identifying crucial but often overlooked software dependencies in biomedical research. The discussions delve into how the study used data from two million papers to map these dependencies, revealing both well-supported and undermaintained software components vital to scientific research. There's a conversation on the methodological challenges and the concept of "Nebraska packages," which are essential yet potentially undermaintained elements crucial to the software stack used in both industry and science. The conversation also covers broader implications for software sustainability, security, and future research directions, including improving how software contributions are tracked and recognized within scientific careers. Press download now to hear more! [00:01:47] Richard dives into the paper co-authored by Eva and Boris. Boris explains the origins of the paper, starting from a workshop at CZI aimed at accelerating science through sustainable software, leading to the analysis of software used in biomedical research. He highlights the focus on identifying crucial yet often unmentioned software dependencies in research software, which he labels as “unsung heroes.” [00:05:22] Boris provides findings from their study, noting that while many foundational packages were cited, there are significant packages that, despite their critical role, remain uncited. [00:06:43] Eva discusses the concept of “Nebraska packages,” which are essential yet potentially undermaintained components that are crucial to the software stack used in both industry and science. Also, she elaborates on the methodological challenges of determining which packages to include in their analysis, particularly in terms of dependencies that vary between different users and contexts. [00:09:42] Richard reflects on the broader implications of their discussion for the open source community, particularly in terms of software sustainability and security. Eva emphasizes the importance of security across all fields and discusses the potential impact of software bugs on scientific research and the need for robust software infrastructure. [00:12:04] Boris comments on the necessity of well-tested tools in the scientific community, given that many scientists may lack a strong background in software development and training. [00:13:47] Richard quotes from the paper discussing the absence of cycles in the network of software packages used in science, indicating a more robust design compared to general software. He questions this in light of earlier comments about scientists not being great at coding. [00:14:08] Eva explains that the paper's findings about acyclic dependencies (DAGs) might seem surprising given the common perception that scientific software is poorly developed. She notes that while scientists may not be trained in proper software packaging, the Python environment helps prevent cyclic dependencies. [00:17:31] Richard brings up “Katz centrality” which is discussed in the paper, and Boris clarifies that “Katz centrality” refers to a concept by Leo Katz on network centrality, explaining how it helps determine the importance of nodes within a network. [00:20:13] Richard questions the practical applications of the research findings, probing for advice on supporting crucial but underrecognized dependencies within software ecosystems. Eva addresses future research directions, including improving ecosystem matching algorithms for better accuracy in linking software mentions to the correct ecosystems. [00:22:50] Eva suggests expanding the research to cover more domains beyond biomedicine, considering different software needs across various scientific disciplines. Boris discusses the potential for targeted interventions to support underrecognized contributors in the scientific software community aiming to enhance their prestige. [00:27:22] Richard asks how the research team plans to map dependencies to individual contributors and track their motivations. Boris responds that while they have gathered substantial data from sources like GitHub logs, publishing this information poses ethical challenges due to privacy concerns. [00:28:45] Eva discusses her work on linking GitHub profiles to academic authors using ORCID identifiers to better track contributions to scientific software. [00:31:42] Richard brings up the broader impacts of their research, questioning whether their study on software packages centrality within the scientific community is unique or if there are similar studies at this scale. Eva acknowledges the need for more comprehensive studies and cites a previous study from 2015 that analyzed developer networks on GitHub. Boris adds that while there is extensive literature on scientific citation networks, the study of dependencies is less explored. [00:34:38] Find out where you can follow Boris and Eva's work and social medias online. Spotlight [00:37:06] Richard's spotlight is Deirdre Madeleine Smith. [00:37:29] Eva's spotlight is Talley Lambert. [00:38:02] Boris's spotlight is the CZI Collaborators. Links SustainOSS (https://sustainoss.org/) SustainOSS Twitter (https://twitter.com/SustainOSS?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Eauthor) SustainOSS Discourse (https://discourse.sustainoss.org/) podcast@sustainoss.org (mailto:podcast@sustainoss.org) SustainOSS Mastodon (https://mastodon.social/tags/sustainoss) Open Collective-SustainOSS (Contribute) (https://opencollective.com/sustainoss) Richard Littauer Socials (https://www.burntfen.com/2023-05-30/socials) Eva Maxfield Brown X/Twitter (https://x.com/evamaxfieldb) Eva Maxfield Brown Website (https://evamaxfield.github.io/) Eva Maxfield Brown GitHub (https://github.com/evamaxfield) Boris Veytsman X/Twitter (https://x.com/BorisVeytsman?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Eauthor) Boris Veytsman Mastodon (https://sfba.social/@borisveytsman) Boris Veytsman LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/in/boris-veytsman-50a1162/) Chan Zuckerberg Initiative (CTI) (https://chanzuckerberg.com/) “Biomedical Open Source Software : Crucial Packages and Hidden Heroes” (arXiv) (https://arxiv.org/pdf/2404.06672) “A large dataset of software mentions in the biomedical literature” (arXiv) (https://arxiv.org/abs/2209.00693) xkcd Dependency comic 2347 (https://xkcd.com/2347/) Dataset Artefacts are the Hidden Drivers of the Declining Disruptiveness in Science (arXiv) (https://arxiv.org/abs/2402.14583) Directed acyclic graph (DAG) (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Directed_acyclic_graph) Katz centrality (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Katz_centrality) Sustain Podcast-Episode 136: Daniel S. Katz on The Research Software Alliance (https://podcast.sustainoss.org/guests/katz) Sustain Podcast-Episode 159: Dawn Foster & Andrew Nesbitt at State of Open Con 2023 (https://podcast.sustainoss.org/guests/nesbitt) Sustain Podcast-Episode 218: Karthik Ram & James Howison on Research Software Visibility Infrastructure Priorities (https://podcast.sustainoss.org/guests/james-howison) ORCID (https://orcid.org/) Mapping the Impact of Research Software in Science- A CZI Hackathon (https://github.com/chanzuckerberg/software-impact-hackathon-2023) Deirdre Smith Academia (https://pitt.academia.edu/DeirdreSmith) Talley Lambert GitHub (https://github.com/tlambert03) Credits Produced by Richard Littauer (https://www.burntfen.com/) Edited by Paul M. Bahr at Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Show notes by DeAnn Bahr Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Special Guests: Boris Veytsman and Eva Maxfield Brown.

Guest Emmy Tsang Panelist Richard Littauer Show Notes In this episode of Sustain, host Richard Littauer welcomes Emmy Tsang, the Engagement Lead at Invest in Open Infrastructure (IOI). Emmy introduces the mission of IOI, which focuses on increasing investment in and adoption of open infrastructure to promote equitable access and participation in research. The discussion delves into what constitutes 'open infrastructure,' the need for nuanced definitions, and IOI's efforts in providing evidence-based tools, strategic support, and funding pilots within the space. Emmy also highlights IOI's inaugural 'State of Open Infrastructure 2024' report, set to serve as an annual resource for understanding the open infrastructure landscape. They discuss the report's contents, including analysis of funding, governance trends, and policies affecting open infrastructure, and Emmy invites feedback from the community to improve future iterations of the report. Press download to hear more! [00:01:04] Emmy explains IOI and how it provides tools and recommendations, strategic support, and runs funding pilots. [00:02:14] There's a discussion on the growth of the IOI team and the importance of a global perspective, as well as an explanation of IOI's funding and fiscal sponsorship by Code for Science and Society. [00:03:47] Emmy explains open infrastructure as a spectrum and the importance of context and mentions the five criteria for defining open infrastructure. [00:07:37] Richard asks Emmy for clarification on the definition of infrastructure on the context of open infrastructure. She tells us a broader definition as services and technologies relied upon by researchers and scholars and gives an example. [00:10:34] Richard questions how IOI integrates community feedback into their work. Emmy explains IOI's privileged position to consider open infrastructure at an ecosystem level, mentions the Infra Finder tool for open infrastructure discovery, and her role as an engagement person. She also mentions shifting power in funding decisions and increasing accessibility of funding to low and middle-income economies. [00:15:32] The “State of Open Infrastructure 2024” report will launch on May 28th. Emmy discusses the topics covered in the report, explains how they used their Infra Finder tool, and the data from the report will be shared openly via Zenodo. [00:19:38] Richard appreciates the scope and ambition of the report and wonders about the primary audience of the report and its relevance to open source maintainers. We learn the report is targeted at funders, but also relevant to maintainers and developers of open infrastructures. [00:25:16] Emmy responds on how they reach out to potential infrastructures and encourage storytelling through their work and engagement. She explains the unique perspective IOI brings to the concept of infrastructure and emphasizes the importance of defining success and sustainability for open infrastructure. Also, she mentions the “Graceful Transitions” section in the report, highlighting organizational changes in infrastructures. [00:30:18] Richard agrees on the need for personal and emotional discussions about transitions in open source projects. Emmy invites listeners to participate in community conversations about the report's chapters and shares details on the upcoming community conversations and how to join the mailing list for updates. [00:32:40] Find out where you can read the report and follow Emmy on the interwebs. Quotes [00:04:14 ] “We find it easy to put open into really clear binaries, you're open or not open, etc, etc.” [00:04:43] “Most of the time these binaries don't really make sense.” [00:06:29] “We're viewing open infrastructure more as a spectrum.” [00:26:42] “What does success and sustainability mean for open infrastructure?” Spotlight [00:34:24] Richard's spotlight is the book, The (Big)Year That Flew By by Arjan Dwarshuis [00:35:10] Emmy's spotlight is the Digital Infrastructure Insights Fund. Links SustainOSS (https://sustainoss.org/) SustainOSS Bluesky (https://bsky.app/profile/sustainoss.bsky.social) SustainOSS Discourse (https://discourse.sustainoss.org/) podcast@sustainoss.org (mailto:podcast@sustainoss.org) SustainOSS Mastodon (https://mastodon.social/tags/sustainoss) Open Collective-SustainOSS (Contribute) (https://opencollective.com/sustainoss) Richard Littauer Socials (https://www.burntfen.com/2023-05-30/socials) Richard Littauer email (mailto:richard.littauer@gmail.com) Richard Littauer SustainOSS email (mailto:richard@sustainoss.org) Emmy Tsang X/Twitter (https://twitter.com/emmy_ft) Emmy Tsang Mastodon (https://mastodon.cloud/@emmyft) Emmy Tsang LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/in/emmy-tsang-11aa793b/) Sustain Podcast-Episode 43: Investing in Open Infrastructure with Kaitlin Thaney (https://podcast.sustainoss.org/guests/kaitlin-thaney) Invest in Open Infrastructure (https://investinopen.org/) Code for Science & Society (https://www.codeforsociety.org/) ggplot2 (https://ggplot2.tidyverse.org/) The Astropy Project (https://www.astropy.org/) Roads and Bridges: The Unseen Labor Behind Our Digital Infrastructure (https://www.fordfoundation.org/work/learning/research-reports/roads-and-bridges-the-unseen-labor-behind-our-digital-infrastructure/) Infra Finder (https://infrafinder.investinopen.org/solutions) Call for proposals: Open Infrastructure Fund by Emmy Tsang (https://investinopen.org/blog/open-infrastructure-fund-pilot-cfp/) 2024 State of Open Infrastructure Report (https://investinopen.org/state-of-open-infrastructure-2024/sooi-foreword-2024/) Zenodo (https://zenodo.org/) Arjan Dwarshuis (https://arjandwarshuis.com/about) Digital Infrastructure Insights Fund (https://infrastructureinsights.fund/) Credits Produced by Richard Littauer (https://www.burntfen.com/) Edited by Paul M. Bahr at Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Show notes by DeAnn Bahr Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Special Guest: Emmy Tsang.

Guest Simon Vansintjan Panelist Richard Littauer Show Notes In this episode, host Richard Littauer and guest Simon Vansintjan dive into the topic of open-source sustainability in the music industry. Simon, a long-time friend of Richard and a seasoned coder and designer, introduces Mirlo, an innovative online platform he's working on that combines elements of Bandcamp and Patreon to enable direct financial support for musicians. Mirlo, an open-source project built with a full-stack TypeScript, Express, Redis, Postgres, and React, aims to provide an alternative to traditional music streaming services by focusing on direct artist support and community engagement. Simon discusses the challenges and benefits of building Mirlo as a cooperative, the intricacies of its development and funding model, and the broader implications of open-source principles in creating a more equitable and sustainable ecosystem for musicians. Hit download now to hear more! [00:01:38] What is Mirlo? Simon explains it's an online record store where users can buy digital music directly from musicians and provide monthly support, similar to a combination of Bandcamp and Patreon. [00:02:32] Simon discusses Mirlo's open source status and its tech stack, which includes TypeScript/JavaScript, Express, Redis, Postgres, and React. [00:03:13] Richard inquires about the origins of Mirlo, and Simon describes his work with Resonate, issues with legacy code, and the decision to create Mirlo to explore sustainable business models without venture capital. [00:04:16] We hear that Spotify isn't profitable as Simon discusses the challenges streaming service face, which led Mirlo to adopt a different model. [00:05:04] Simon explains Mirlo's co-op structure, focusing on worker empowerment and non-hierarchical decision-making, contrasting it with Resonate's multi-stakeholder co-op model. [00:08:57] Richard asks about Mirlo's sustainability model. Simon describes Mirlo's revenue model, which includes taking a small cut from each sale, user contributions that cover server costs, and plans for grants and a Kickstarter campaign. [00:10:23] Simon explains the complexities of starting as a nonprofit and the decision to form an LLC for greater flexibility. [00:11:03] Richard questions the distinction between artists and worker owners. Simon discusses the different models for including musicians as co-owners, ongoing experimentation with the co-op structure, and the importance of recognizing musicians' contributions to Mirlo. [00:13:07] The conversation turns to contributors to the GitHub codebase, and Richard mentions a couple of contributors and wonders if they have equal shares as worker owners. Simon explains that neither contributor is a worker owner, and he talks about the challenges in tracking contributions for co-ownership. [00:16:28] Simon highlights the slow process of building trust and the challenges posed by financial constraints, emphasizing the need for time and money. [00:18:29] Richard shifts focus to the codebase and notes the absence of contributing docs, asking about the onboarding process for new contributors. Simon explains their use of a Discord server for feedback and onboarding. [00:20:18] Richard questions the benefits of being open source for Mirlo, and Simon emphasizes all the significant benefits of being open source. [00:21:30] Mirlo's competitive space is brought up and Simon acknowledges the moral aspect and mentions Mirlo's near feature parity with Bandcamp, excluding merch and label support. He explains the Mirlo isn't necessarily trying to compete directly with major platforms but aims to create a diverse, open, and transparent internet space. [00:23:52] Simon explains the Kickstarter rewards, including a compilation album and merch, and when it ends. [00:25:31] Richard praises Mirlo's intentional cooperative approach and its efforts to maintain and grow the platform sustainably and Simon encourages listeners to go check out Mirlo, mentioning he has purchased music from the platform. [00:26:19] Find out where you can follow Simon online. Quotes [00:16:46] “A lot of [this project] is built on trust. It takes a long time to build trust with people.” [00:20:25] “The code is much better for [being open source].” [00:21:06] “Being open source generates trust.” [00:22:05] “We're noticing that people care about it being a co-op, and that people care about it being open source.” Spotlight [00:27:12] Richard's spotlight is Ryo Fukui, a Japanese jazz pianist. [00:27:48] Simon's spotlight is the book, “Noise Uprising: The Audiopolitics of a World Musical Revolution.” Links SustainOSS (https://sustainoss.org/) SustainOSS Bluesky (https://bsky.app/profile/sustainoss.bsky.social) SustainOSS Discourse (https://discourse.sustainoss.org/) podcast@sustainoss.org (mailto:podcast@sustainoss.org) SustainOSS Mastodon (https://mastodon.social/tags/sustainoss) Open Collective-SustainOSS (Contribute) (https://opencollective.com/sustainoss) Richard Littauer Socials (https://www.burntfen.com/2023-05-30/socials) Simon Vansintjan Mastodon (https://mastodon.social/@simon@social.coop) Sustain-Episode 129:Per Ploug and the Spotify FOSS Fund (https://podcast.sustainoss.org/129) Resonate (https://resonate.coop/) Mirlo (https://mirlo.space/) Mirlo Kickstarter: Musicians as worker-owners in co-operatives (https://mirlo.space/team/posts/26/) Ryo Fukui (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ryo_Fukui) Scenery (Ryo Fukui album) (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scenery_(Ryo_Fukui_album)) Noise Uprising: The Audiopolitics of a World Musical Revolution by Michael Denning (https://www.versobooks.com/products/83-noise-uprising) Credits Produced by Richard Littauer (https://www.burntfen.com/) Edited by Paul M. Bahr at Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Show notes by DeAnn Bahr Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Special Guest: Simon Vansintjan.

Guest Dr. Carlotta A. Berry Panelist Richard Littauer Show Notes In this episode, host Richard Littauer engages in a conversation with Dr. Carlotta Berry, a Professor in the Department of Electrical and Computer Engineering at Rose-Hulman Institute of Technology and a passionate advocate for diversity in STEM. Carlotta shares her journey from an undergraduate student rarely seeing diversity in her field to becoming an engineering professor determined to change that narrative. She discusses her work at the Children's Museum of Indianapolis, emphasizing the importance of making STEM accessible and exciting for all, especially girls and underrepresented minorities. She also dives into her motivations behind founding two nonprofits, Black in Engineering and Black in Robotics, highlighting their roles during the racial reckoning and the importance of maintaining momentum in diversity efforts amidst societal backlashes. Additionally, Carlotta touches upon her engagement with open source communities, particularly in robotics, to further democratize STEM education. The discussion also covers her unique approaches to connecting with younger audiences through hip hop slam poetry on TikTok and the significance of representation in every aspect of STEM, from academia to community initiatives. Press download now to hear more! [00:01:05] Carlotta tells us about the Children's Museum of Indianapolis and describes it as one of the largest children's museums in the world, detailing its features and her role there in STEM and robotics activities. [00:02:00] Richard comments on Carlotta's extensive education and asks about her journey from PHD to her current position. She explains her motivation for pursuing a PhD was to become an engineering professor and to represent diversity in the field. [00:02:59] Carlotta recounts that her PhD experience was relatively smooth compared to her undergrad challenges, highlighting the focus on subjects she loved. [00:04:57] The conversation turns to Carlotta's involvement with nonprofits, particularly ‘Black in Engineering' and ‘Black in Robotics', and she shares the origin of these groups. She talks about the purpose of ‘Black in Engineering' and its relevance in the current political climate. [00:08:26] Richard inquires how Carlotta stays motivated amid setbacks in civil rights progress. Carlotta cites the resilience of past civil rights leaders as inspiration and emphasizes the role of true allies. [00:10:41] The discussion shifts to open source, and Carlotta outlines her work in STEM communication and her involvement with open source hardware through her robots, the ‘flower bots'. Also, she acknowledges she has built a community primarily through social media engagement. [00:15:16] Carlotta explains Rose Bot's origin, related to her school's mascot, and its connection with various STEM outreach and education initiatives, such as Rosie, Lily, and Daisy bots. She celebrates the success of her program in increasing enrollment and diversity in computer science and software engineering, as well as her own department. [00:17:50] Richard inquires about Carlotta's day-to-day activities and how she manages everything. She clarifies she's a workaholic with a high teaching lead at a teaching-focused school and does not balance well, yet she is passionate about her work, and she details her daily schedule. [00:20:25] What is Carlotta's mentoring approach for young women in STEM? She emphasizes honesty and support for her students, sharing her own struggles and the importance of community and resources to navigate the difficulties in engineering education. [00:23:46] Richard asks Carlotta what changes she would suggest for the broader open source community to increase diversity and representation in STEM. Carlotta advises against working in silos, stressing the importance of education about open source, reaching beyond typical recruitment spaces, and creating diverse testing groups. [00:26:35] Carlotta shares her strategy of code-switching and the importance of connecting with people and listening to them. She encourages students to pursue what is authentic to them and to avoid forcing themselves into careers they are not passionate about. [00:29:21] Richard inquires about hip hop slam poetry, and Carlotta shares that she used hip hop slam poetry as a method to connect with younger audiences and teach them about STEM on TikTok. [00:31:03] Carlotta talks about her books and describes her passion for romance novels and her decision to write black STEM romance novels to represent black women in science and engineering positively. [00:33:19] How does Carlotta balance her mission with her personal aspirations? She explains her mission serves her internal validation, aiming to improve the STEM experience for black and female students and thus contributing to a more diverse and inclusive future. [00:35:18] Find out where you can read more about Carlotta and her work. Quotes [00:09:57] “Yeah, and is that supposed to be a problem? So, I got my PhD because of affirmative action. Is that better than your Twitter scholarship? I say yes!” Spotlight [00:36:15] Richards's spotlight is Corina Newsome. [00:36:42] Carlotta's spotlight is Dr. Brandeis Marshall. Links SustainOSS (https://sustainoss.org/) SustainOSS Twitter (https://twitter.com/SustainOSS?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Eauthor) SustainOSS Discourse (https://discourse.sustainoss.org/) podcast@sustainoss.org (mailto:podcast@sustainoss.org) SustainOSS Mastodon (https://mastodon.social/tags/sustainoss) Open Collective-SustainOSS (Contribute) (https://opencollective.com/sustainoss) Richard Littauer Socials (https://www.burntfen.com/2023-05-30/socials) Dr. Carlotta A. Berry X/Twitter (https://twitter.com/noiresteminist) Dr. Carlotta A. Berry LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/in/carlotta-berry-phd/) Dr. Carlotta A. Berry Website (https://www.noiresteminist.com/) Dr. Carlotta A. Berry Instagram (https://www.instagram.com/drcaberry) Dr. Carlotta A. Berry TikTok (https://www.tiktok.com/@drcaberry) Children's Museum of Indianapolis (https://www.childrensmuseum.org/) Rose-Hulman Institute of Technology (https://www.rose-hulman.edu/) Black in Engineering (https://blackinengineering.org/) Black in Robotics (https://blackinrobotics.org/) Corina Newsome (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corina_Newsome) Dr. Brandeis Marshall (https://www.brandeismarshall.com/) Credits Produced by Richard Littauer (https://www.burntfen.com/) Edited by Paul M. Bahr at Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Show notes by DeAnn Bahr Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Special Guest: Dr. Carlotta A. Berry.

Guest Susan Kennedy Panelists Richard Littauer | Eriol Fox Show Notes In this episode, hosts Richard Littauer and Eriol Fox chat with Susan Kennedy, a program manager at the Open Technology Fund (OTF), to explore the intricacies of sustaining open source technologies. OTF, a nonprofit organization, plays a vital role in promoting internet freedom in oppressive regimes by supporting the development of anti-censorship and anti-surveillance technologies. Funded by the U.S. Congress but operating independently, OTF aids in navigating the challenges attached to open source project sustainability and maintenance. Susan outlines OTF's fund mechanism, highlighting its commitment to supporting open source projects that are pivotal for internet freedom. Also, the episode shines a light on the newly initiated FOSS Sustainability Fund by OTF, designed to specifically address the financial and logistical hurdles facing open source technologies today. Press download to hear more! [00:01:41] Susan explains the OTF's role as a non-profit promoting internet freedom through anti-censorship and anti-surveillance technologies, mainly funded by the U.S. government but operates independently. [00:02:37] There's a comparison of OTF to Germany's Sovereign Tech Fund, emphasizing differences in funding despite both being government funded. [00:03:51] There's a discussion on how OTF funds projects like Signal despite potential congressional controversies. [00:04:15] Susan introduces the FOSS Sustainability Fund aimed at supporting open source technologies for internet freedom. [00:06:15] Susan gives details on the scale of the FOSS Sustainability Fund, mentioning financial contributions from other private donors alongside U.S. government funds. [00:07:34] We find out the details of eligibility criteria for FOSS Sustainability Fund applicants, as Susan emphasizes projects with a track record and active community engagement. [00:09:00] Susan discusses the outcomes from the pilot funding round, focusing on the importance of community meetings and interaction. Also, she talks about exploration of sustainability as a lifecycle, including potential sunsetting of projects, emphasizing that sustainability might look different for each project. [00:13:17] Susan talks about exploration of sustainability as a lifecycle, including potential sunsetting of projects, emphasizing that sustainability might look different for each project. [00:15:19] Richard questions the approach of funding projects that are charismatic and grant-savvy, instead of focusing on lesser-known but critical projects, questioning the open application process. Susan defends the open application process of the Internet Freedom Fund, explaining it allows for a broader reach and inclusivity, ensuring opportunities for lesser-known projects to apply. [00:17:06] Richard asks if a small, unrelated project like ‘right pad' used by major projects can apply, leading to a broader discussion on the relevance of small projects within significant tools. Susan responds by focusing on the end-users' needs, emphasizing the importance of even small projects if they are critical to larger tools like Tails. [00:18:51] Susan highlights the two-phase application process designed to guide applicants efficiently, providing feedback and advice on project fit and impact, and she describes the iterative application process. [00:19:51] Eriol discusses the advisory aspect of OTF's application process, noting the interaction and intention of their approach which aids applicants in refining their proposals. They raise concerns about projects using sustainability funds to tackle debt and asks how OTF views the alignment of tech debt resolution with user-centric sustainability. [00:21:34] Susan elaborates on distinguishing between tech debt and sustainability, advocating for a balanced approach that includes both technical fixes and enhancements in user engagement and governance. She stresses the importance of having user feedback mechanisms and long-term strategic planning as part of sustainable development, derived from consultations with funded projects. [00:23:36] We learn about OTF's lab services, which support projects beyond funding, in areas like security, usability, design, and communication, enhancing the holistic support structure for open source sustainability. [00:26:44] Richard asks if there are expectations for funded projects to help guide their peers toward more sustainable practices. Susan explains that while OTF shares a list of alternate funding sources with applicants, the field remains underfunded, and stresses the importance of sharing learning publicly to help educate other funders and enhance funding efforts. [00:28:07] Richard questions if there are requirements for projects to support their dependencies or the broader ecosystem. Susan clarifies that while there's no mandate for projects to fund their dependencies, OTF looks for projects that consider and support their dependencies as part of their roadmap. [00:28:31] What is Susan's long-term vision for the fund? She wishes for significantly more funding to support a greater number of projects and hopes for netter coordination among funders and an increased focus on essential aspects of sustainability. [00:29:32] Find out where you can learn more about Susan and the OTF online. Quotes [00:04:35] “Since OTF started back in 2012, we have only supported open source technologies.” [00:08:04] “We're looking to maintain and sustain.” Spotlight [00:31:56] Richard's spotlight is Naulakha (Rudyard Kipling House) in Vermont. [00:32:27] Eriol's spotlight is talking to Code for Japan folks and their podcast called “Chit-Chat Code Civictech Insights.” [00:33:36] Susan's spotlight is thinking deeply about FOSS Sustainability after reading IDE's, ‘Roadwork ahead: Evaluating the needs of FOSS communities working on digital infrastructure in the public interest.' Links SustainOSS (https://sustainoss.org/) SustainOSS Twitter (https://twitter.com/SustainOSS?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Eauthor) SustainOSS Discourse (https://discourse.sustainoss.org/) podcast@sustainoss.org (mailto:podcast@sustainoss.org) SustainOSS Mastodon (https://mastodon.social/tags/sustainoss) Open Collective-SustainOSS (Contribute) (https://opencollective.com/sustainoss) Richard Littauer Socials (https://www.burntfen.com/2023-05-30/socials) Eriol Fox X/Twitter (https://twitter.com/EriolDoesDesign?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Eauthor) Susan Kennedy LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/in/susan-mary-kennedy/) Susan Kennedy email (mailto:susan@opentech.fund) Open Technology Fund (https://www.opentech.fund/) Open Technology Fund X/Twitter (https://www.opentech.fund/) Open Technology Funds (https://www.opentech.fund/funds/) Free and Open Source Software Sustainability Fund (https://www.opentech.fund/funds/free-and-open-source-software-sustainability-fund/) Introducing the FOSS Sustainability Fund Pilot Projects (OTF) (https://www.opentech.fund/news/introducing-the-foss-sustainability-fund-pilot-projects/) Naulakha (Rudyard Kipling House) (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Naulakha_(Rudyard_Kipling_House)) Chit-Chat Code Civictech Insights Podcast (https://podcasters.spotify.com/pod/show/chitchatcode) ‘Roadwork ahead: Evaluating the needs of FOSS communities working on digital infrastructure in the public interest.' (https://recommendations.implicit-development.org/) Credits Produced by Richard Littauer (https://www.burntfen.com/) Edited by Paul M. Bahr at Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Show notes by DeAnn Bahr Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Special Guest: Susan Kennedy.

Guest Velda Kiara Panelist Richard Littauer Show Notes Today, host Richard has a conversation with guest Velda Kiara, a passionate open source developer. Velda discusses how open source has helped businesses, how it benefits both coders and non-coders, and how it can lead to career growth. She also talks about the challenges of open source, particularly in terms of finances and the sustainability of projects. The discussion also turns to Velda's attendance at OSCA fest in Lagos, Nigeria, and her involvement with Black Python Devs. Velda shares her personal journey of contributing to Django and other Python projects and tells us about her experience joining programs like Djangonaut Space and contributing to projects like Novu. Press download now to hear more! [00:00:10] The episode opens with Velda highlighting the ins and outs of open source, acknowledging that it allows for the use of software that businesses can monetize. She appreciates the good that comes from open source despite the criticism of some corporations. She acknowledges the pros and cons of open source, expressing hope that the pros will eventually outweigh the cons. [00:02:21] Richard introduces Velda and praises her answer and asks if she'd like to change her initial statement. Velda stands by her answer, expressing willingness to continue the discussion for further insights on open source. [00:03:31] Velda confirms her attendance at OSCA fest, mentioning he talk on building APIs with Django, DRF, and Open API, and discusses the importance of sustainability in growing the open source community in Africa. [00:04:34] Richard inquires about Velda's involvement with Black Panther Devs, and she explains the inception, its objectives, and activities like workshops and meetups that support the community. [00:07:12] The conversation shifts to encouraging newcomers to join open source, emphasizing roles beyond coding, such as project management and writing. [00:09:08] Richard and Velda discuss the challenges designers face in open source and the potential career benefits of contributing to open source, even for non-developers. Velda shares how open source helped her gain experience and improve skills, which is beneficial at any career level, and she discusses the “level up” aspect of open source and the learning opportunities it provides. [00:12:00] Richard explores into the sustainability of open source for late-stage careers and the challenges maintainers face. Velda suggests using open source for mentorship and ensuring project continuity by engaging contributors and sharing maintenance responsibilities. [00:14:02] What currently excites Velda about open source? She expresses her excitement about contributing to Django after building many websites with it and her positive experience at DjangoCon US, which she found to be an inclusive community. Also, she discusses Djangonaut Space, an eight-week program designed to assist new contributors like her in contributing to the Django framework or third-party packages. [00:16:28] Velda mentions her contributions to other Python projects, such as Novu, and her new experiences working with SDKs. She reflects on the learning process in open source and shares her excitement for exploring various Python projects and talks about how she started a newsletter called, “The Storytellers by Tales.” Quotes [00:12:36] “If you eventually want to not let the project die, you could easily use open source as a way to mentor another person who's going to help you maintain for a while if you want to retire or stop writing code in general.” Links SustainOSS (https://sustainoss.org/) SustainOSS Twitter (https://twitter.com/SustainOSS?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Eauthor) SustainOSS Discourse (https://discourse.sustainoss.org/) podcast@sustainoss.org (mailto:podcast@sustainoss.org) SustainOSS Mastodon (https://mastodon.social/tags/sustainoss) Open Collective-SustainOSS (Contribute) (https://opencollective.com/sustainoss) Richard Littauer Socials (https://www.burntfen.com/2023-05-30/socials) Velda Kiara X/Twitter (https://twitter.com/VeldaKiara) Velda Kiara LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/in/veldakiara/) Velda Kiara Website (https://veldakiara.notion.site/veldakiara/Velda-Kiara-46aec24028fd4e8dbdba003097c18b5b) Black Python Devs (https://blackpythondevs.github.io/) KJay Miller (https://kjaymiller.com/) Djangonaut Space (https://djangonaut.space/) Novu (https://github.com/novuhq/novu) Sustain Podcast-Episode 169: Dawn Wages of PSF on organizing communities, ethical licenses, and more (https://podcast.sustainoss.org/169) Credits Produced by Richard Littauer (https://www.burntfen.com/) Edited by Paul M. Bahr at Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Show notes by DeAnn Bahr Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Special Guest: Velda Kiara.

Guest Kari L. Jordan Panelist Richard Littauer Show Notes In this episode of Sustain, host Richard welcomes guest Dr. Kari L. Jordan, the Executive Director of The Carpentries, to discuss the organization's mission, challenges, and strategies for fostering an inclusive community that teaches data and coding skills. We explore topics like sustaining open source projects, the importance of teaching open source tools and practices, and how The Carpentries contribute to the ecosystem. The conversation dives into the funding strategies, volunteer engagement, accessibility, and the future goals of The Carpentries, including spreading skills in data science and coding across diverse linguistic and geographical communities. Also, we'll touch on broader issues such as equity in tech and the potential avenues for increasing participation of underrepresented groups in open source and data science. Press download to hear more! [00:02:03] Richard asks Kari about The Carpentries work, and she gives her elevator pitch, emphasizing their mission of teaching inclusive data and coding skills. [00:03:23] Kari discusses how The Carpentries incorporates open source principles in teaching various aspects, including community management and code of conduct. Also, she outlines the adjacent communities to The Carpentries, mentioning rOpenSci and the Center for Scientific Collaboration and Community Engagement. [00:05:15] Richard jokes about The Carpentries being well-funded, and Kari clarifies their actual funding sources and the crucial role of volunteers. [00:07:15] Kari details how the nine paid staff of The Carpentries structure their work across curricula development, workshops and instruction, and community engagement. [00:08:59] A question comes up about The Carpentries success metrics, and Kari speaks on their goal to build global capacity in essential data skills for informed decision-making. [00:11:56] Discussing the ethical use of data, Kari explains The Carpentries alignment with the FAIR Principles to ensure data management is equitable and accessible. [00:14:47] Kari highlights the importance of recognition and appreciation in open source contributions, and speaks about the diversity in forms of appreciation, from LinkedIn badges to DOIs for contributions, and the necessity of different incentives. [00:17:34] Kari acknowledges the divide and discusses how individuals in The Carpentries often pick a focus, be it teaching or lesson development, though some do cross over between data and open source contributions. [00:19:37] Richard probes into the potential contribution of ‘data people' to the burnout of open source maintainers and whether they should also contribute to the maintenance. Kari agrees on the correlation but suggests it might be a confidence issues and emphasizes the need to educate these individuals on the importance of their contributions. [00:21:12] Richard seeks a clearer definition of what constitutes a contribution within The Carpentries, and Kari responds by referring to their Code of Conduct which clarifies that contributions are welcome as long as they adhere to it. [00:22:45] What is Kari's long-term vision for The Carpentries? She envisions their lessons being taught in hundreds of languages and spreading their educational model without a reliance on strong internet connections and mentions currently having a multilingual open source glossary called Glosario. [00:25:26] Kari talks about the hardest part of her job, which is that volunteer capacity and revenue generation are current organizational priorities. [00:28:29] What would Kari focus on in open source if she wasn't with The Carpentries? She expresses her desire to concentrate efforts on equity and inclusion, specifically increasing the involvement of people of color in open source within the U.S. [00:31:20] Richard asks Kari what she's really excited about for the future of The Carpentries. She shares her enthusiasm about potential strategic alliances with other organizations to share resources and thrive together, and the creation of resources for communities to run their own inclusive events. [00:32:58] Find out where you can follow Kari online. Quotes [00:06:46] “We've supported workshops in over 64 countries, and it's because of our volunteers.” [00:09:31] “We know that decisions that impact our lives are made with data.” [00:10:48] “Before I came on staff at The Carpentries, I had never heard of R, Python. I had never heard of GitHub, and I have a PhD.” [00:16:07] “Appreciation is different depending on what's important to you.” Spotlight [00:33:55] Richard's spotlight is Nisha Ghatak, from NeSI, who ran two of The Carpentries workshops he attended in New Zealand. [00:34:21] Kari's spotlight is OpenRefine, a very powerful open source tool. Links SustainOSS (https://sustainoss.org/) SustainOSS Twitter (https://twitter.com/SustainOSS?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Eauthor) SustainOSS Discourse (https://discourse.sustainoss.org/) podcast@sustainoss.org (mailto:podcast@sustainoss.org) SustainOSS Mastodon (https://mastodon.social/tags/sustainoss) Open Collective-SustainOSS (Contribute) (https://opencollective.com/sustainoss) Richard Littauer Socials (https://www.burntfen.com/2023-05-30/socials) Dr. Kari L. Jordan X/Twitter (https://twitter.com/drkariljordan) Dr. Kari L. Jordan Mastodon (https://mastodon.social/@drkariljordan) Dr. Kari L. Jordan Website (https://kariljordan.com/) Dr. Kari L. Jordan GitHub (https://github.com/kariljordan) Dr. Kari L. Jordan LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/in/kariljordan/) The Carpentries (https://carpentries.org/index.html) Center for Scientific Collaboration and Community Engagement (https://www.cscce.org/) rOpenSci (https://ropensci.org/) FAIR Principles (https://www.go-fair.org/fair-principles/) The Nine Core Values of The Carpentries (https://carpentries.org/values/) Glosario (https://glosario.carpentries.org/) Nisha Ghatak-NeSI (https://www.nesi.org.nz/news/2024/01/nisha-ghatak-nesi-training-lead-elected-global-training-community-board-directors) OpenRefine (https://openrefine.org/) Credits Produced by Richard Littauer (https://www.burntfen.com/) Edited by Paul M. Bahr at Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Show notes by DeAnn Bahr Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Special Guest: Kari L. Jordan.

Guest Stephen Okonkwo Panelist Richard Littauer Show Notes In this episode of Sustain, the OSCA 2023 series, host Richard welcomes Steve Okonkwo, a multidisciplinary designer who actively contributes to the Open Source Community Africa (OSCA). Steve sheds light on his role in enhancing user experience through thoughtful design, particularly for OSCA, and shares his dedication to continue elevating the design team's work. Richard and Steve discuss the Sustain sub-event, the importance of design in open source, and the intricacies of conference planning around open source products. Steve also touches on the significance of research, the need for transparency in open source communities, and his personal journey and future aspirations within the design landscape. Press download now to hear more! [00:01:07] Steve tells us about his career as a multidisciplinary designer and his work in open source. He discusses his focus on improving user experience through design, including website and brand identity design for OSCA. [00:02:01] Richard compliments the OSCA's branding, particularly the orange logos, and Steve mentions that OSCA has been his primary focus, and he plans to continue supporting their design team. [00:02:55] There was a large attendance at the last OSCAFest and a Sustain sub-event. Steve tells us he was the design facilitator for the design side of Sustain. [00:03:40] Steve highlights key points from OSCA discussions, including the growing opportunities for designers in open source and the importance of contributing to project aesthetics. [00:05:30] The conversation shifts to the iterative nature of web design and user experience, and Steve emphasizes the importance of research and testing in design updates to prevent overwhelming users. [00:06:37] Richard discusses the uniqueness of working with open source communities and the need for transparency. Steve talks about his approach to working with open source, emphasizing transparency, communications, and commitment to quality. [00:08:09] Richard asks about building a conference around open source products, and Steve shares insights from OSCAFest, including showcasing new tools like Penpot. [00:10:15] Richard inquires about challenges in designing the OSCA festival, and Steven mentions issues with physical artwork and space design. [00:11:02] What's next for Steve? He talks about his current role as a multidisciplinary designer in Spokane, Washington, and his aspirations in open source design. [00:12:06] Find out where you can find out more about Steve's work on the web. Quotes [00:05:19] “They always say in the tech industry, the web is never done.” [00:05:45] “Research is a very important part of design.” Links SustainOSS (https://sustainoss.org/) SustainOSS Twitter (https://twitter.com/SustainOSS?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Eauthor) SustainOSS Discourse (https://discourse.sustainoss.org/) podcast@sustainoss.org (mailto:podcast@sustainoss.org) SustainOSS Mastodon (https://mastodon.social/tags/sustainoss) Open Collective-SustainOSS (Contribute) (https://opencollective.com/sustainoss) Richard Littauer Mastodon (https://mastodon.social/@richlitt) Richard Littauer Instagram (https://www.instagram.com/richlittv3) Steve Okonkwo Twitter (https://twitter.com/steveanthny) Stephen Okonkwo LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/in/stephenokonkwo/) Steve Okonkwo Website (https://read.cv/steve990) Penpot (https://penpot.app/) OSCA (https://oscafrica.org/) OSCA Festival (https://festival.oscafrica.org/) Credits Produced by Richard Littauer (https://www.burntfen.com/) Edited by Paul M. Bahr at Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Show notes by DeAnn Bahr Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Special Guest: Stephen Okonkwo.

Guest Yani Bellini Saibene Panelist Richard Littauer Show Notes In this episode of Sustain, host Richard welcomes guest Yani Bellini Saibene from Argentina. Yani, with a rich background in open source community management, shares her journey into the tech and open source world, and highlights her roles as the rOpenSci Community Manager, R-Ladies Project Lead, and Vice President for the Board of Directors for The Carpentries. The discussion dives into the challenges of funding, sustainability of volunteer-based models, and the importance of including diverse voices in open source development. The conversation also explores the economic disparities and cultural differences affecting contributors form the global south and how building strong local communities can empower individuals by providing them with tools, knowledge, and a sense of belonging in the wider world. Press download to hear more! [00:01:47] Yani describes her start as a researcher at INTA while at university, her degree in computer science, and her initial work developing software and teaching scientists to use computing tools. She also details her career progression and her master thesis at INTA. [00:04:49] We hear about the foundation and global expansion of R-Ladies, as Yani emphasizes community strength and the organizers' passion. She discusses the flexibility and inclusivity of the chapters, and the support and resources shared among the community. [00:08:56] Richard questions about the distinct roles and activities between rOpenSci, R-Ladies, and The Carpentries, which appear to have similar goals in teaching R, and Yani explains the different objectives of the three organizations. [00:12:50] Yani lists the funders, including the Chan Zuckerberg Initiative, Sloan Foundation, and others. She describes the funding models for R-Ladies and Carpentries and the challenges of sustaining such community-oriented projects. [00:14:52] Richard inquires about the role of the board of directors in establishing post-grant funding. Yani explains The Carpentries' membership model where institutions pay for benefits like workshops and instructor training, she mentions the perks for members, discusses the challenges of maintaining services without sufficient membership or grants, and highlights cultural and financial barriers in Latin America. [00:20:17] Richard is curious about cultural barriers and asks for further insights into overcoming cultural barriers and the limitations of translations. Yani discusses her personal journey with the English language and its importance in coding beyond syntax and shares some data from a recent study that was done, and the paper is called, “The manifold costs of being a non-native English speaker in science,” from PLOS Biology. [00:24:42] Yani discusses additional studies, mentioning the Linux Foundation report on English as a barrier in open source contribution and its influence on perceived expertise. [00:25:55] Richard asks Yani about the point at which translation efforts start to yield benefits for the community and inquires about the visible impacts and dividends from investments in internationalizing materials. Yani cites examples of immediate benefits, and discusses her involvement in translating educational materials, which has supported teaching many Spanish speaking teachers. [00:32:38] Richard raises concerns about the possibility of global exploitation through talent extraction from non-English speaking regions. Yani addresses the issue of local versus international business compensation and the ethical implications for non-profit organizations. [00:36:30] We hear Richard's concerns about how to have conversations about open source contributions and community building in a non-extractive way and he wonders if it's feasible to collectively support open source maintainers financially. Yani explains the concept of three “currencies” in any job: money, heart, and brain. [00:39:16] Yani discusses the champions program at rOpenSci, where stipends were important for participants to allocate time to the tasks and do an excellent job. [00:41:05] Find out where you can follow Yani online. Quotes [00:06:17] “In R-Ladies, you have enough informality and enough expertise to make this a special place to learn.” [00:18:26] “There is little funding for maintaining what you already have.” [00:20:40] “I have to confess that I approached the English language because I loved code.” Spotlight [00:42:26] Richard's spotlight is a book he's reading called, Theodore Rex. [00:43:10] Yani's spotlight is a friend and someone she works with at R-Ladies, Athanasia Mo Mowinckel. Links SustainOSS (https://sustainoss.org/) SustainOSS Twitter (https://twitter.com/SustainOSS?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Eauthor) SustainOSS Discourse (https://discourse.sustainoss.org/) podcast@sustainoss.org (mailto:podcast@sustainoss.org) SustainOSS Mastodon (https://mastodon.social/tags/sustainoss) Open Collective-SustainOSS (Contribute) (https://opencollective.com/sustainoss) Richard Littauer Socials (https://www.burntfen.com/2023-05-30/socials) Yani Bellini Saibene GitHub (https://github.com/yabellini) Yani Bellini Saibene Mastodon (https://fosstodon.org/@yabellini) Yani Bellini Saibene Website (https://yabellini.netlify.app/) Yani Bellini Saibene LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/in/yabellini/) Teaching Tech Together (https://teachtogether.tech/) R-Ladies (https://rladies.org/) The Carpentries (https://carpentries.org/index.html) rOpenSci (https://ropensci.org/) The manifold costs of being a non-native English speaker in science (PLOS Biology) (https://doi.org/10.1371/journal.pbio.3002184) Chan Zuckerberg Initiative (https://chanzuckerberg.com/) Sloan Foundation (https://sloan.org/) Drive: The Surprising Truth About What Motivates Us by Daniel H. Pink (https://www.danpink.com/books/drive/) Theodore Rex by Edmund Morris (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theodore_Rex_(book)) Dr. Athanasia Mo Mowinckel (https://drmowinckels.io/) Credits Produced by Richard Littauer (https://www.burntfen.com/) Edited by Paul M. Bahr at Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Show notes by DeAnn Bahr Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Special Guest: Yani Bellini Saibene.

Guest Adewale “Ace” Abati Panelist Richard Littauer Show Notes In this episode, host Richard Littauer sits down with Adewale “Ace” Abati, a staff developer advocate at TBD and member of the Open Source Community Africa. Today, they discuss Ace's work in building a decentralized future of the web and advocating for open protocol and Web5 technology. Ace provides insightful perspectives on the pressure of content creation, the importance of repetition for skill acquisition, and the role of community in open source project management. The conversation also touches on Ace's ‘Made. In. Nigeria.' project, a website that highlights the contributions of Nigerian developers to the open source community. Hit download now to hear more! [00:00:42] Ace talks about his role at TBD, advocating for decentralized technology and Web5, an open protocol for user-controlled identity and data across platforms. [00:01:25] We hear the difference between open protocol and open source, to which Ace confirms that while Web5 is open source, it is also a protocol that allows building on top of it. Also, Ace explains the relation of Web5 to blockchain. [00:02:21] Ace shares his journey to Amsterdam, starting from working at Code Sandbox, an online code editor, and moving for new experiences. [00:03:11] The conversation shifts to the topic of Nigerian developers in open source and the diaspora. Ace discusses his project ‘Made. In. Nigeria.' highlighting the contributions of Nigerian developers both locally and abroad. [00:04:19] Ace introduces Buzz, a recent project on the list that uses OpenAI's Whisper for audio transcription. [00:04:50] The discussion moves to Ace's activities as a staff developer advocate and his hobbies, including YouTube and video game streaming. [00:05:46] Richard questions if creative individuals in the open source community burn out faster due to the constant need for new content. Ace agrees and discusses the pressures of project maintenance and content creation. [00:08:19] Richard talks about a designer in Australia and his YouTube video where he drew an Ibis every day for a year and what happened, then brings up the concept of repeated practice, and he asks Ace if he finds the skills gained from daily activities useful for the future. Ace sees the value in repetition for learning but doesn't plan to repeat the exact same activities. [00:10:46] Ace previews a new version of the Made. In. Nigeria. project website focused on the stories behind the developers of the projects listed. [00:12:47] Find out where you can learn more about Ace on the web. Quotes [00:06:39] “At the end of the day we are not machines.” Links SustainOSS (https://sustainoss.org/) SustainOSS Twitter (https://twitter.com/SustainOSS?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Eauthor) SustainOSS Discourse (https://discourse.sustainoss.org/) podcast@sustainoss.org (mailto:podcast@sustainoss.org) SustainOSS Mastodon (https://mastodon.social/tags/sustainoss) Open Collective-SustainOSS (Contribute) (https://opencollective.com/sustainoss) Richard Littauer Mastodon (https://mastodon.social/@richlitt) Richard Littauer email (mailto:richard.littauer@gmail.com) Richard Littauer Sustain (mailto:richard@sustainoss.org) Richard Littauer blog email (mailto:richard@burntfen.com) Adewale “Ace” Abati X/Twitter (https://twitter.com/ace_kyd) Adewale “Ace” Abati Website (https://adewaleabati.com/) Adewale “Ace” Abati LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/in/acekyd/) Adewale “Ace” Abati YouTube (https://www.youtube.com/acekyd) Adewale “Ace” Abati Instagram (https://www.instagram.com/illusionsbyace) TBD (https://developer.tbd.website/) Made. In. Nigeria. (GitHub) (https://github.com/acekyd/made-in-nigeria) Made. In. Nigeria. (https://www.madeinnigeria.dev/) Buzz (https://github.com/chidiwilliams/buzz) The drawing advice that changed my life (YouTube) (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M6NsEDwHHiE) Credits Produced by Richard Littauer (https://www.burntfen.com/) Edited by Paul M. Bahr at Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Show notes by DeAnn Bahr Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Special Guest: Adewale “Ace” Abati .

Guest Jacob Kaplan-Moss Panelist Richard Littauer | Amanda Casari Show Notes This episode of Sustain explores the challenges and dynamics of funding open source projects. Host Richard Littauer and co-host Amanda Casari welcome guest Jacob Kaplan-Moss, Board Member and Treasurer of the Django Software Foundation, and Security Architect at Latacora. The discussion covers Jacob's recent blog post on the criticism faced by open source maintainers who seek compensation, highlighting the backlash encountered from seeing grants to selling T-shirts. The conversation also explores the ethical use of open source software, the importance of supporting maintainers financially, and the complexities surrounding the definition and licensing of open source software. Additionally, this episode touches on the personal connection to open source, the struggle for maintainers to find sustainable funding models, and the potential impact of high net worth individual donations. Download this episode now to hear more! [00:00:53] Richard highlights Jacob's association with Django and his role as a security architect and brings up a blog post Jacob wrote about the experience of being an open source maintainer. He shares examples of maintainers who face undue criticism for monetizing their open source work in various ways and his thesis. Also, Richard endorses the Blue Oak Council and PolyForm Project. [00:06:24] Amanda appreciates the blog's message about the sustainability of open source and the need to pay maintainers. Jacob recounts the largely positive reception of his post but also addresses the critical and unproductive responses, and he clarifies his stance on the importance of formal definitions of open source. [00:10:14] Richard suggests the term “Big Tent Open Source” and discusses the importance of having standards to precent open washing while also encouraging diversity in licensing. Jacob uses the term “monogamish” as an analogy for a more flexible approach to open source licensing. [00:11:46] Amanda discusses her background in releasing various types of open source work and how it sometimes differs from web apps, and touches on the complexities of open source licensing. She asks Jacob about his concerns regarding the adoption of open source in larger systems, and he shares his experience with government technology procurement, stressing the necessity of precise definitions of open source in that context. [00:16:40] Richard shifts the conversation to ethical considerations of open source work, specifically when software is used for harmful purposes, like state interventions. Jacob gives us a nuanced view on the ethical use of open source software and the impossibility of drawing a clear line between good and evil uses. [00:20:56] Jacob provides insights into the Django Software Foundation's current scale, funding, and staffing, highlighting the significant impact even a small increase in funding could have, and he discusses the challenge of scaling funding across the vast number of open source projects to achieve broad sustainability. [00:23:16] Jacobs talks about the potential of engaging high net worth individuals and family foundations for donations as they may be more receptive than corporations. [00:24:54] Richard discusses the groups privilege and raises the question regarding giving back to open source or to the broader community, and Jacob explains he avoids judging others' financial decisions but acknowledges his own better-off position and the personal moral obligation he feels to give back. [00:27:05] The conversation shifts to Richard asking Jacob how to support each other's capitalist ventures while contributing to the open source community. He suggests congratulating individual successes and learning from them, while also being comfortable criticizing the systems and institutions that may be at odds with open source values. [00:28:53] Find out where you can learn more about Jacob on the internet. Quotes [00:01:40] “There's this dynamic that happens around open source, where when someone takes money, someone always shows up to criticize them for it.” [00:04:07] “Anytime an open source maintainer figures out a way to get paid to build a lifestyle, at the very least comfortable, we should be celebrating that.” [00:06:46] “The community has coalesced around a definition of open source as defined by the OSI. I was like wait a minute, how are you conflating the open source community with one foundation? I don't agree with this conflation of the OSI speaks for all open source.” [00:13:39] “If you work in technology for the government ling enough, eventually you come to realize that every problem is a procurement problem.” [00:18:16] “Even the MIT license is, do whatever you want, just don't sue me.” [00:22:18] “To reach a point where I would say that open source as a whole is broadly sustainable, I would want every single project to have that level of funding associated with it.” Spotlight [00:30:11] Amanda's spotlight is a book coming out next month called, “Software Engineering for Data Scientists.” [00:30:42] Richard's spotlight is the book, “Better Living Through Birding: Notes from a Black Man in the Natural World.” [00:31:20] Jacob's spotlight is the PolyForm family of licenses and the book, “Producing Open Source Software: How to Run a Successful Free Software Project.” Links SustainOSS (https://sustainoss.org/) SustainOSS Twitter (https://twitter.com/SustainOSS?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Eauthor) SustainOSS Discourse (https://discourse.sustainoss.org/) podcast@sustainoss.org (mailto:podcast@sustainoss.org) SustainOSS Mastodon (https://mastodon.social/tags/sustainoss) Open Collective-SustainOSS (Contribute) (https://opencollective.com/sustainoss) Richard Littauer Socials (https://www.burntfen.com/2023-05-30/socials) Amanda Casari X/Twitter (https://twitter.com/amcasari?lang=en) Jacob Kaplan-Moss LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/in/jacobian/) Jacob Kaplan-Moss Website (https://jacobian.org/) Jacob Kaplan-Moss Mastodon (https://social.jacobian.org/@jacob) Django Software Foundation (https://www.djangoproject.com/foundation/) Django (https://www.djangoproject.com/) Latacora (https://www.latacora.com/) Jacob's Blog post: “Paying people to work on open source is good actually” (https://jacobian.org/2024/feb/16/paying-maintainers-is-good/) Blue Oak Council (https://blueoakcouncil.org/) PolyForm Project (https://polyformproject.org/) PolyForm Licenses (https://polyformproject.org/licenses/) Pamela Chestek LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/in/pchestek/) Sasha Magee X/Twitter post on government procurement (https://twitter.com/sashax/status/941036458307076097) 18F (https://18f.gsa.gov/) What you should know about Vermont's proposed wealth taxes (Vermont Edition) (https://www.vermontpublic.org/show/vermont-edition/2024-02-12/what-you-should-know-about-vermonts-proposed-wealth-taxes) Software Engineering for Data Scientists by Catherine Nelson (https://www.oreilly.com/library/view/software-engineering-for/9781098136192/) Better Living Through Birding: Notes From a Black Man in the Natural World by Christian Cooper (https://www.penguinrandomhouse.com/books/671722/better-living-through-birding-by-christian-cooper/) Producing Open Source Software: How to Run a Successful Free Software Project by Karl Fogel (https://producingoss.com/) Credits Produced by Richard Littauer (https://www.burntfen.com/) Edited by Paul M. Bahr at Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Show notes by DeAnn Bahr Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Special Guest: Jacob Kaplan-Moss.

Guest Subomi Oluwalana Panelist Richard Littauer Show Notes On today's episode, Richard engages in a conversation with Subomi Oluwalana, Co-founder and CEO of Convoy, an innovative company specializing in open source Webhooks gateway solutions akin to Kong but focused on Webhooks, with features like rate limiting and circuit breaking. He delves into the intricacies of balancing a genuine open source philosophy with profitability drawing parallels with GitLab's model and emphasizes the importance of community and transparency in open source projects. The discussion also covers Convoy's positive reception in Nigeria, Subomi's distinctive experience with Y Combinator, his thoughts on the evolving perceptions of open source as a business model, and advice for aspiring open source entrepreneurs. Press download now to hear more! [00:01:14] Subomi tells us about Convoy, and he describes Convoy's service as analogous to Kong but for Webhooks, highlighting its functionalities. [00:01:52] Richard questions Subomi about Convoy's open source model and what aspects remain proprietary, and he discusses the balance between being genuinely open source and profitable. [00:03:12] The conversation shifts to community importance in open source projects, with Subomi explaining the wide range of developers Convoy serves. [00:04:56] Richard sites Subomi's blog post on sustainability and questions how Convoy maintains its product market while ensuring the sustainability of its open source project. Subomi speaks on the delicate balance of stewardship in open source, advocating for transparency and a clear understanding between the community and the company. [00:08:07] Richard steers the discussion towards the role of VC funders and Y Combinator's support for open source projects. Subomi describes Y Combinator's growing openness to open source companies and the changing perceptions of open source as a viable business model. [00:09:17] The conversation touches upon Subomi's unique experience as a Nigerian company in Y Combinator, particularly as a DevTools company. [00:11:07] Subomi shares the positive response Convoy has received in Nigeria, detailing their engagement with the local tech ecosystem. [00:11:40] Richard asks for Subomi's advice for those in the OSCA or developing countries looking to start an open source business. [00:13:06] Find out where you can learn more about Subomi and Convoy on the web. Quotes [00:02:11] “We wanted to be open source, but we also wanted to make money.” [00:05:03] “Open Source is the ultimate form of sustainability. 92% of SaaS companies fail regardless of funding or growth. Failure of your business should not bring down my infrastructure, nor force me to redesign my system architecture when I'm not ready to do so. Providing open source software is the highest form of care for sustainability for your users.” [00:06:57] “It's very important to be transparent with the community with the direction you are taking. That, in my opinion is the biggest problem that we face as open source founders.” [00:08:15] “Y Combinator has become a good home for open source companies.” [00:09:23] “There hasn't been any open source DevTools company from Nigeria in YC.” [00:12:32] “The abstractions you think are needed in your organization are most probably needed elsewhere.” Links SustainOSS (https://sustainoss.org/) SustainOSS Twitter (https://twitter.com/SustainOSS?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Eauthor) SustainOSS Discourse (https://discourse.sustainoss.org/) podcast@sustainoss.org (mailto:podcast@sustainoss.org) SustainOSS Mastodon (https://mastodon.social/tags/sustainoss) Open Collective-SustainOSS (Contribute) (https://opencollective.com/sustainoss) Richard Littauer Mastodon (https://mastodon.social/@richlitt) Richard Littauer email (mailto:richard.littauer@gmail.com) Richard Littauer Sustain (mailto:richard@sustainoss.org) Richard Littauer blog email (mailto:richard@burntfen.com) Subomi Oluwalana X/Twitter (https://twitter.com/subomiOluwalana) Subomi Oluwalana LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/in/subomi-oluwalana-one/) Convoy (https://getconvoy.io/) Why Open Source? by Subomi Oluwalana (Convoy blog) (https://getconvoy.io/blog/why-open-source) Y Combinator (https://www.ycombinator.com/) Credits Produced by Richard Littauer (https://www.burntfen.com/) Edited by Paul M. Bahr at Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Show notes by DeAnn Bahr Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Special Guest: Subomi Oluwalana.

Guest Ciarán O'Riordan Panelist Richard Littauer | Leslie Hawthorne Show Notes In this episode, host Richard Littauer and co-host Leslie Hawthorne engage with Ciarán O'Riordan, Senior Policy Advisor from Open Forum Europe (OFE), diving into the intricacies of the Cyber Resiliency Act (CRA) and its implications for the Free and Open Source Software (FOSS) community. Ciarán shares his journey from software development to policy advocacy, emphasizing the critical role of policy work in shaping the future of open source. He provides an in-depth analysis of the CRA, highlighting concerns about its initial draft, the involvement of the FOSS community in shaping its final form, and the potential challenges and opportunities it presents. The discussion also touches on other significant legislative developments in Europe, such as the Product Liability Directive and the AI Act, and their potential effects on open source software. Press download now to hear more! [00:01:25] Ciarán explains how he became a Senior Policy Advisor, his passion for policy work, tracing his journey from a software developer in Dublin to his 20-year career in Brussels focusing on policy advocacy, including his recent position at OFE. [00:06:08] Leslie asks Ciarán for a summary of the Cyber Resilience Act (CRA) and its specific implications for the free and open source software ecosystem. Ciarán contrasts the initial and final versions of the CR, detailing the changes made, the lightened obligations for free and open source software, and the ongoing compliance challenges for commercial distributions. [00:11:02] Leslie inquires how software foundation's responsible for producing commercialized software are impacted by the Cyber Resilience Act. Ciarán explains that the final version of the Act introduces a new category called “Open Source Stewards” for entities like software foundations, which have a reduced set of obligations without fines. He also mentions the timeline for the CRA, stating in will come into force around summertime 2027, after being officially signed. [00:16:09] Richard asks about the CRA's impact on individual non-European developers, like himself, who have repositories on platforms like GitHub or GitLab. Ciarán responds that the specifics of how the CRA will affect such developers will become clear once the standards are developed. [00:17:55] Ciarán clarifies the role of software foundations is to provide services or procedures for compliance, which may vary across different foundations. [00:19:36] Richard wonders who benefits from this Act, and Ciarán discusses the justification for the CRA, which is cost-based, comparing the cybersecurity costs with compliance costs. [00:21:31] Leslie asks about the process of creating standards for CRA compliance and how average FOSS developers can influence these standards and questions the best ways for FOSS developers to get involved in influencing the outcomes beneficial to the FOSS ecosystem. Ciarán notes that working on standards and policy is complex and compares it to contributing to software development on short notice. [00:26:07] Ciarán discusses OFE's multi-layered structure and the FOSS community list, which serves as a base for information sharing and connection. [00:27:24] Richard questions the impact CRA on individual developers with numerous dependencies in their projects. Ciarán reassures that there is no immediate cause for panic as the CRA will not come into force until summer 2027 and many details will be clarified in the coming years. [00:28:39] Leslie shifts the discussion the Product Liability Directive (PLD) and its relevance to the FOSS ecosystem and Ciarán goes in depth about it. [00:33:36] Find out where you can learn more about Ciarán and OFE on the web. Quotes [00:04:58] “We'd love to have better cyber security, especially if it just falls from the sky.” [00:22:31] “Working on standards and policy in general is about as complex as working on software development.” [00:24:00] “In terms of getting involved, two important things: First is getting in contact with other people, and the second is the need to do some work on your own initiative without having been brought into some of these groups.” Spotlight [00:35:35] Leslie's spotlight is the Open Source in The European Legislative Landscape devroom. [00:35:59] Richard's spotlight is the book, “Better Living Through Birding.” [00:36:42] Ciarán's spotlight is two books: “Thy Neighbour's Wife” and “The Life Show.” Links SustainOSS (https://sustainoss.org/) SustainOSS Twitter (https://twitter.com/SustainOSS?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Eauthor) SustainOSS Discourse (https://discourse.sustainoss.org/) podcast@sustainoss.org (mailto:podcast@sustainoss.org) SustainOSS Mastodon (https://mastodon.social/tags/sustainoss) Open Collective-SustainOSS (Contribute) (https://opencollective.com/sustainoss) Richard Littauer Socials (https://www.burntfen.com/2023-05-30/socials) Leslie Hawthorne LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/in/lesliehawthorn/?originalSubdomain=de) Ciarán O'Riordan LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/in/ciaranor/?originalSubdomain=be) Ciarán O'Riordan- Presentation of the Cyber Resilience Act (YouTube) (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DuQ-QBNezLg) OpenForum Europe (https://openforumeurope.org/) OpenForum Europe Events (https://openforumeurope.org/events/) OpenForum Europe Open Source (https://openforumeurope.org/open-source/) Open Source Policy Community List (https://groups.google.com/a/openforumeurope.org/g/foss-community) Sustain Podcast-Episode 125: Astor Nummelin Carlberg of OFE on the Economic Impact of Open Source (https://podcast.sustainoss.org/guests/carlberg) Product Liability Directive 1985 (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Product_Liability_Directive_1985) Open Source In The European Legislative Landscape devroom (https://fosdem.org/2024/schedule/track/eu-policy/) Better Living Through Birding: Notes From A Black Man In The Natural World by Christian Cooper (https://www.penguinrandomhouse.com/books/671722/better-living-through-birding-by-christian-cooper/) [Thy Neighbour's Wife by Liam O'Flaherty](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ThyNeighbour%27sWife) The Life Show by Chi Li (https://www.amazon.sg/Life-Show-Chi-Li/dp/7559421903) Credits Produced by Richard Littauer (https://www.burntfen.com/) Edited by Paul M. Bahr at Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Show notes by DeAnn Bahr Peachtree Sound (https://www.peachtreesound.com/) Special Guest: Ciarán O'Riordan.