Podcasts about VPS

Race for the galaxy Race for the galaxy is a four player card game published by Rio Grande Games. The goal of the game is to build a space imperium and the player with most victory points wins. There's also a computer version of the game, which saves you from packing up the game after playing. Turn sequence There are five phases in turn: Explore Develop Settle Consume Produce At the beginning of turn, every player selects one of these phases and selections are revealed simultaneously. Only selected phases will be played. Player who selected a phase gets a small bonus. Explore draw two cards and keep one bonus: draw five cards and keep one bonus: draw one additional card and keep one additional card Develop place development card in play and discard cards from your hand to cover the cost bonus: -1 to cost Settle place a planet card in play and discard cards from your hand to cover the cost except military planets, which you'll conquer with your military score if it's a windfall world, produce on it Consume: use consume powers on cards to turn good into victory points you have to keep consuming until you can't anymore bonus: trade one goods card for 2-5 cards bonus: 2xVPs gain twice the victory points Produce: produce on regular planets bonus: produce on windfall planet repeat until: one empire is 12 cards big VP tokes run out score: points for cards on the table cards in the hand (+1 for each) VPs earned special rules cards on the table draw extra cards trade goods on planets add up your military score settle planets for cheaper have bigger empire limit produce on a windfall planet after discarding a card etc. Examples of cards Star nomad raiders military 2 planet, worth 1 vp +1 to military +2 cards when trading goods Terraforming robots development 3, worth 2 vp draw 1 card after placing a world discard 1 rare elements good to gain 1 card and 1 vp Public works development 1, worth 1 vp draw 1 card after placing a development discard 1 good to gain 1 vp Expansions All expansions add new cards. The gathering storm goals (first and most) extra player Rebel vs. Imperium solo play take over (conquer other player's worlds) extra player Brink of War - prestige counts as VP in the end can be used to perform actions requires two previous expansions Alien Artifacts incompatible with previous expansions 49 cards representing alien orb players can explore balance between expanding and exploring Verdict fun and quick game every player concentrates on their own imperium keep an eye what opponent is doing (trading / military) cards are dense with information Example I recorded myself playing against computer: [Race for the galaxy - three medium AIs](https://diode.zone/w/rw8z8pqeqAauENSufmgkjV). for some reason, you can't follow me outside of the instance In closing - questions, comments, feedback? Tuula@mastodon.art or even better, record your own episode

On this Wednesday topical show, Crystal chats with Maren Costa about her campaign for Seattle City Council District 1. Listen and learn more about Maren and her thoughts on: [01:08] - Why she is running [04:15] - Lightning round! [14:34] - What is an accomplishment of hers that impacts District 1 [15:46] - City budget shortfall: Raise revenue or cut services? [17:45] - Climate change [20:54] - Transit reliability [22:20] - Bike and pedestrian safety [23:24] - Public Safety: Alternative response [26:00] - Victim support [29:43] - Housing and homelessness: Frontline worker wages [31:39] - Small business support [33:45] - Childcare: Affordability and accessibility [36:37] - Difference between her and opponent As always, a full text transcript of the show is available below and at officialhacksandwonks.com. Follow us on Twitter at @HacksWonks. Find the host, Crystal Fincher, on Twitter at @finchfrii and find Maren Costa at @marencosta.   Maren Costa Maren Costa is 21 year resident of West Seattle, Seattle Public Schools mom, tech leader, and climate justice organizer. While at Amazon, Maren guided big teams and big budgets to successful results. She rallied her colleagues and co-founded Amazon Employees for Climate Justice, which used first-in-the-industry collective organizing tactics to bring international scrutiny to Amazon's climate negligence -- and resulted in multi-billion dollar climate commitments. Now, Maren is running to represent Seattle's District 1 to help lead a housed, healthy, and safer Seattle.   Resources Campaign Website - Maren Costa   Transcript [00:00:00] Crystal Fincher: Welcome to Hacks & Wonks. I'm Crystal Fincher, and I'm a political consultant and your host. On this show, we talk with policy wonks and political hacks to gather insight into local politics and policy in Washington state through the lens of those doing the work with behind-the-scenes perspectives on what's happening, why it's happening, and what you can do about it. Be sure to subscribe to the podcast to get the full versions of our Friday week-in-review show and our Tuesday topical show delivered to your podcast feed. If you like us, the most helpful thing you can do is leave a review wherever you listen to Hacks & Wonks. Full transcripts and resources referenced in the show are always available at officialhacksandwonks.com and in our episode notes. I am thrilled to be welcoming a candidate for Seattle City Council District 1 to the show today. Welcome, Maren Costa. [00:01:03] Maren Costa: Thank you, Crystal. It's a pleasure to be here, and I have to say I'm a big fan. [00:01:08] Crystal Fincher: Well, I appreciate it. I just wanted to start out by hearing - what made you decide to run? [00:01:18] Maren Costa: Yeah, that's a great question, and there's several facets to that answer, but the first one is I'm a mom and I have kids. And I think about their future, and I think about wanting to leave a better future for them than I currently see - the path that we're on - so that's a big one. And then another one is that I was in Big Tech and managing big teams and big budgets and solving big problems, but I started to get really concerned about the climate crisis, and I believe when you wanna make change, you start where you are. And I was at Amazon at the time - one of the largest carbon footprints, and also a company that was getting like an F on every rating scale for climate, this was before The Climate Pledge - so I thought - Hey, I'm gonna start where I am. I started trying to make change from within and talking to all the SVPs and VPs and that I'd met in my 15 years at the time being there, but I couldn't make any progress, and so - people just didn't wanna talk about climate. It had worked for me before where I would say like - Here's a great idea, here's why it's great for customers, here's why it's great for the business. And it would be like - Great, here's the team, here's money, go do it. But when it came to climate, it was nobody wanted to move. And so I found another way to make change. I started organizing with my coworkers and organizing around climate justice and getting thousands of tech workers to stand up and walk out. We walked out for the Global Climate Strike. I did end up getting illegally fired right at the start of the pandemic when we were also standing up for warehouse workers' safety, but the National Labor Relations Board stepped in - took Amazon to court and we won, in addition to winning all of The Climate Pledge and those other things. So just really seeing the power of collective action, the powers that workers have when we come together, and how important that is in bringing balance to the powers that be - that's a big reason. And then the third reason is I love Seattle - I've lived here for 33 years. I love District 1 - I've lived in District 1, in West Seattle, for 21 years. And I see the challenges facing our city. And I think a lot of us are frustrated with some of the seemingly intractable problems that we're facing. And I wanna take all of my skill set and my energy and put it towards trying to solve big problems for our communities. [00:04:15] Crystal Fincher: Absolutely. Well, I decided to switch things up a little bit in our candidate interview series this year, and we're implementing a lightning round in the interview. So just a series of yes or no, or either-or questions. But we'll start off with - This year, did you vote yes on the King County Crisis Care Centers levy? [00:04:39] Maren Costa: Yes. [00:04:41] Crystal Fincher: Did you vote yes on the Veterans, Seniors, and Human Services levy? [00:04:47] Maren Costa: Yes. [00:04:49] Crystal Fincher: Did you vote in favor of Seattle's Social Housing Initiative 135? [00:04:54] Maren Costa: Yes. [00:04:56] Crystal Fincher: In 2021, did you vote for Bruce Harrell or Lorena González for Mayor? [00:05:02] Maren Costa: Lorena González. [00:05:05] Crystal Fincher: In 2021, did you vote for Nicole Thomas Kennedy or Ann Davison for Seattle City Attorney? [00:05:12] Maren Costa: Nicole Thomas Kennedy. [00:05:15] Crystal Fincher: Did you vote in 2022 for Leesa Manion or Jim Ferrell for King County Prosecutor? [00:05:25] Maren Costa: Gosh, I don't remember. 'Cause I know Leesa now, you know, roughly, through campaigning. I think I voted for Leesa? I don't remember. [00:05:36] Crystal Fincher: In 2022, did you vote for Patty Murray or Tiffany Smiley for US Senate? [00:05:41] Maren Costa: Patty Murray. [00:05:42] Crystal Fincher: Do you own or rent your residence? [00:05:46] Maren Costa: I own. [00:05:48] Crystal Fincher: Are you a landlord? [00:05:50] Maren Costa: No. [00:05:52] Crystal Fincher: Would you vote to require landlords to report metrics, including how much rent they're charging, to help better plan housing and development needs in the district? [00:06:04] Maren Costa: I think so. Sounds like a good idea. I don't actually know much about that. [00:06:10] Crystal Fincher: Are there instances where you would support sweeps of homeless encampments? [00:06:21] Maren Costa: Only if people are already provided with where they're going to be safely housed. [00:06:30] Crystal Fincher: Will you vote-- [00:06:31] Maren Costa: I'm not in favor of sweeps. [00:06:33] Crystal Fincher: Got it. Will you vote to provide additional funding for Seattle's Social Housing Public Development Authority? [00:06:40] Maren Costa: Yes. [00:06:42] Crystal Fincher: Do you agree with King County Executive Constantine's statement that the King County Jail should be closed? [00:06:49] Maren Costa: Yes. [00:06:50] Crystal Fincher: Should parking enforcement be housed within SPD? [00:06:57] Maren Costa: No, but we know how complicated that turned out to be. [00:07:01] Crystal Fincher: Would you vote to allow police in schools? [00:07:08] Maren Costa: I think that's a no. I want to hear more from the schools and the people - what they want, but - [00:07:17] Crystal Fincher: Do you support allocation in the City budget for a civilian-led mental health crisis response? [00:07:24] Maren Costa: Yes. [00:07:26] Crystal Fincher: Do you support allocation in the City budget to increase the pay of human service workers? [00:07:32] Maren Costa: Absolutely. [00:07:34] Crystal Fincher: Do you support removing funds in the City budget for forced encampment removals and instead allocating funds towards a Housing First approach? [00:07:43] Maren Costa: Absolutely. [00:07:45] Crystal Fincher: Do you support abrogating or removing the funds from unfilled SPD positions and putting them toward meaningful public safety measures? [00:07:55] Maren Costa: I think that makes sense. [00:07:57] Crystal Fincher: Do you support allocating-- [00:07:59] Maren Costa: That's a yes. [00:07:59] Crystal Fincher: Okay. Do you support allocating money in the City budget for supervised consumption sites? [00:08:11] Maren Costa: That's - I'm - yes. I think I'm a yes on that one. I want to do a bit more research on that as well, but - [00:08:19] Crystal Fincher: Do you support increasing funding in the City budget for violence intervention programs? [00:08:25] Maren Costa: Yes. [00:08:27] Crystal Fincher: Do you oppose a SPOG contract that doesn't give the Office of Police Accountability and the Office of Inspector General subpoena power? [00:08:36] Maren Costa: I don't know. I don't know what that is. [00:08:46] Crystal Fincher: The ability for them to subpoena people involved in their investigations. So with the Office of Police Accountability and Office of Inspector General - people involved in doing police investigations. Would you approve a contract where they did not have subpoena power? [00:09:04] Maren Costa: I'm sorry, I still don't quite understand. Like that we would be able to subpoena police officers to testify in cases against police officers - is that? [00:09:18] Crystal Fincher: If there was a complaint made and throughout that investigation - yes, they could compel information from police officers or other people involved. [00:09:28] Maren Costa: Okay, and then so would I support a contract that didn't-- [00:09:33] Crystal Fincher: That didn't have - where those offices did not have the ability to subpoena? [00:09:40] Maren Costa: No. [00:09:42] Crystal Fincher: Okay. [00:09:43] Maren Costa: I would want to be able to subpoena officers to testify. [00:09:48] Crystal Fincher: Do you oppose a SPOG contract that doesn't remove limitations as to how many of OPA's investigators must be sworn versus civilian? Right now there are limitations - there must be, there's a cap on the number of civilians. Should that number of civilians be capped? Would you oppose a contract that didn't remove that limitation? [00:10:17] Maren Costa: No. I would not oppose a contract that didn't remove. This is the double negative that's getting me. [00:10:23] Crystal Fincher: You would only support a contract that eliminated-- [00:10:28] Maren Costa: Yes. [00:10:30] Crystal Fincher: Okay, so the limitation would need to be removed and then you would like it. Is that a correct characterization? [00:10:36] Maren Costa: Yes. [00:10:36] Crystal Fincher: Okay, I just wanted to make sure. [00:10:38] Maren Costa: Yes. [00:10:38] Crystal Fincher: Okay. Not trying to have these be gotcha questions - want to make sure that you actually understand, that we get an actual real answer. [00:10:47] Maren Costa: No, these are great questions and it makes me know how much I need to know, how much more I need to know. [00:10:53] Crystal Fincher: Do you oppose a SPOG contract that impedes the ability of the City to move police funding to public safety alternatives? [00:11:04] Maren Costa: Yes. [00:11:07] Crystal Fincher: Do you support eliminating in-uniform off-duty work by SPD officers? [00:11:14] Maren Costa: Yes. I think that's - is that like traffic enforcement and stuff? [00:11:20] Crystal Fincher: Yep. [00:11:20] Maren Costa: Yeah. [00:11:22] Crystal Fincher: Will you vote to ensure that trans and non-binary students are allowed to play on the sports teams that fit with their gender identities? [00:11:31] Maren Costa: Yes. [00:11:32] Crystal Fincher: Will you vote to ensure that trans people can use bathrooms or public facilities that match their gender? [00:11:39] Maren Costa: Yes. [00:11:41] Crystal Fincher: Do you agree with the Seattle City Council's decision to implement the JumpStart Tax? [00:11:48] Maren Costa: Yes. [00:11:50] Crystal Fincher: Will you vote to reduce or divert the JumpStart Tax in any way? [00:11:55] Maren Costa: No. [00:11:56] Crystal Fincher: Are you happy with Seattle's newly built waterfront? [00:12:03] Maren Costa: Yes. [00:12:05] Crystal Fincher: Do you believe return to work-- [00:12:07] Maren Costa: I have some complaints, but overall, yes. [00:12:11] Crystal Fincher: Do you believe return to work mandates, like the one issued by Amazon, are necessary to boost Seattle's economy? [00:12:21] Maren Costa: Probably in the interim. [00:12:24] Crystal Fincher: Have you taken transit in the past week? [00:12:28] Maren Costa: Yes. [00:12:29] Crystal Fincher: Have you ridden a bike in the past week? [00:12:34] Maren Costa: No. [00:12:36] Crystal Fincher: Have you ridden a bike in the past month? [00:12:40] Maren Costa: No. Not a bike rider. [00:12:44] Crystal Fincher: Should Pike Place Market allow non-commercial car traffic? [00:12:54] Maren Costa: I would say no. But I don't know. I don't know all the pros and cons there. [00:13:01] Crystal Fincher: Should significant investments be made to speed up the opening of scheduled Sound Transit light rail lines? [00:13:11] Maren Costa: Say again - sorry. [00:13:13] Crystal Fincher: Should significant investments be made to speed up the opening of scheduled Sound Transit light rail lines? [00:13:23] Maren Costa: Yes. [00:13:24] Crystal Fincher: Should we accelerate the elimination of the ability to turn right on red lights to improve pedestrian safety? [00:13:33] Maren Costa: Yes. [00:13:35] Crystal Fincher: Have you ever been a member of a union? [00:13:39] Maren Costa: No. [00:13:40] Crystal Fincher: Will you vote to increase funding and staffing for investigations into labor violations like wage theft and illegal union busting? [00:13:49] Maren Costa: Yes. [00:13:51] Crystal Fincher: Have you ever walked on a picket line? [00:13:54] Maren Costa: Yes. [00:13:56] Crystal Fincher: Have you ever crossed a picket line? [00:13:58] Maren Costa: No. [00:14:00] Crystal Fincher: Is your campaign staff unionized? [00:14:04] Maren Costa: No, it's just Kyler. [00:14:10] Crystal Fincher: If your campaign staff wants to unionize, will you voluntarily recognize their effort? [00:14:16] Maren Costa: Absolutely. [00:14:18] Crystal Fincher: Well, and that's the end of the lightning round - pretty painless, I hope. [00:14:24] Maren Costa: It was - that was good. That was intense - I love it. It was wonky. [00:14:30] Crystal Fincher: It was wonky - true to name. Lots of people look to work you've done to get a feel for what you prioritize and how qualified you are to lead. Can you describe something you've accomplished or changed in your district and what impact that has on residents? [00:14:50] Maren Costa: Yeah, I think that the work that I did at Amazon to bring Amazon as, both a city and a global company, into better alignment with climate justice has a direct impact in my community, particularly in the - one of the things that came out of that was their bid to buy 100,000 Rivian vans. And now I daily see those vans out in my neighborhood driving around and I'm so happy every time I see that 'cause it's like - wow, that's less pollution that's driving through my neighborhood right now. I mean, we can't, maybe, you know, there's, maybe we wish there was just fewer vans and that we were buying less in general, but when, you know, if we're gonna have those vans, it's so much better to see them being electric and I feel really proud of that. [00:15:46] Crystal Fincher: Excellent, appreciate that. I wanna ask you about the City budget. City's projected to have a revenue shortfall of $224 million beginning in 2025. Because we're mandated by the state to pass a balanced budget, the options to address the upcoming deficit are either raise revenue or cut services. Which one of those is your approach or what combination of those will be your approach? [00:16:18] Maren Costa: We should always be looking at how we can be more frugal with the resources that we have - that's a given. However, we need to raise more progressive revenue. I'm in favor of the recommendations that came out of the recent work task force assigned to progressive revenue. So things like an additional capital gains tax on top of the state tax, you know, a vacancy tax. As a climate justice advocate, I will always be interested in progressive ways that we could tax carbon. You know, anything like that where we can make doing the right thing the desirable thing, sort of like the sugar tax is, you know - that could have good benefits for climate. So we definitely need to raise more progressive revenue. It's always a challenge. There's money in our city, we can see it - but it's just hard to bring it actually into the workings of the City and turning it into things that benefit everyone here. You know, we have an upside down tax code. And so it's just - the chips are sort of stacked against us. And so we need to be more creative with the way that we generate progressive revenue. And I think that those recommendations, some of those recommendations that came out of the task force are good places to start. [00:17:44] Crystal Fincher: Absolutely. Now on almost every measure, we're behind on our 2030 climate goals, while experiencing the devastating impacts from extreme heat and cold, wildfires, floods, toxic air, you name it. What are your highest priority plans to get us on track to meet 2030 goals? [00:18:05] Maren Costa: Thank you, Crystal. That was a great question and something I'm very passionate about. You know, one of the things that I say is, you know, all of these things that we care about if we don't have a planet to live on, you know, they don't matter. And then I also say that housing is climate justice, transit is climate justice - you know, it's all connected. And so there's so much work we need to do. One of the things that I would love to do - you know, out of the gate - would be to get climate resiliency centers in every neighborhood. So making sure that maybe all 27 branches of the public library, schools, community centers, you know, churches even - that have backup power, air filtration, heat pump air conditioning - safe places for people to go in extreme weather events. So that's like the first line of defense, but we need to also go heavily on offense because as we know, and as you say, we're behind - as a city, as a nation, as a planet. And so we know that the building emissions performance standards are going to be on the table for the next council. It sounds like they won't be coming through this, you know, before the end of the year. I will want to make sure that those have teeth, that we make sure that, again, doing the right thing is the desirable thing so that you can't, you know, too easily avoid them or buy out of them. Because it's time for us to start facing the facts that we need to do this tough work to make the transition that is inevitable and that we're already behind on. We know that climate will affect the most vulnerable among us, worst and first. And this is why our unhoused neighbors, low-income communities - we need to start there with our climate work so for example, you know, fixing the flooding problem in South Park, that was a king tide combined with an atmospheric river in December and it displaced about 20 families, many of whom have still not been able to move back into their houses. And so I would want to take a look at making sure that we're starting with the historically under-invested communities first. [00:20:52] Crystal Fincher: Thanks for that. I wanna talk about transit a bit, starting off with - residents in the city are experiencing a lot of disruption and interruption in transit service and reviews are not all stellar. It seems like we really need some intervention. Recognizing that Sound Transit is a regional entity and King County Metro is a county entity, what can you do as a City councilmember to stabilize transit service? [00:21:23] Maren Costa: You know, a lot of the closures are based on, you know, maintenance and drivers - a shortage of drivers. And so doing everything we can to make sure that drivers feel safe and supported and paid well and - so that we keep as many drivers as we can and hire more - the ones that we need. And then, you know, the maintenance, I'm not sure how we could do that better, but looking into any ways that we could improve - keeping buses on the roads. I'm trying to think if there's anything else at the City level - I'd say those are the two big ones. [00:22:20] Crystal Fincher: How would you go about improving pedestrian and bicycle safety in your district? [00:22:29] Maren Costa: We have some significant like problems, you know, for pedestrian safety and bike safety in District 1. We've seen a lot of road racing on Alki, up and down California Avenue and 35th Avenue. So bringing in some of the speed bumps have been helpful and we can continue to do more of that. We've built in some, you know, traffic controls around Alki that have really improved and we just need to keep doing that. Bike lanes need to be safe, protected, connected. We are missing almost entirely a safe east-west bike connection across District 1, so that would be something I would want to prioritize. [00:23:22] Crystal Fincher: Gotcha, makes sense. Now, when it comes to public safety, other jurisdictions around the country and in our own region have rolled out alternative response programs to better support those having behavioral health crises. But Seattle is stalled in implementing what is a widely-supported idea. Where do you stand on non-police solutions to public safety issues? And what are your thoughts on civilian-led versus co-response models? [00:23:50] Maren Costa: Crystal, this is so important. When I talk to voters in my district, public safety comes up, you know, top of the list for many people. And we know that we have a shortage of officers, a sort of a nationwide problem - hiring is hard. So now more than ever, we need to stand up these police alternatives. We are feeling the pain of the fact that we haven't invested in these areas as we should have. We had one tool in our tool belt and now we're really feeling the pain of that short-sightedness. I'm in favor of bringing in civilian response. We see programs like Health One and the firefighters making good strides in that area. What was the question again? [00:24:53] Crystal Fincher: What are your thoughts on civilian-led versus co-response models? [00:24:59] Maren Costa: Okay, I don't know that I know that nuance. Civilian-led? [00:25:06] Crystal Fincher: Or responses where the person is accompanied by an armed policeman versus ones where they aren't. [00:25:12] Maren Costa: Right, I see. Yeah, I think we need more. I think we actually need more nuance there. I think we need a few tiers. You know, there are certain calls that need to be responded to with, you know, an officer with a gun. Then maybe there's officer-led civilian-back. And then maybe civilian-led officer-back. And then civilian only. And we need to make sure that we're using all types of combinations there for the appropriate call - keeping our civilian responders safe, making sure that we're not putting them in danger. But leading with civilian as often as we can, because the more we can minimize, you know, contact between armed officers and community - you know, we can keep our community safe that way as well. [00:26:00] Crystal Fincher: I wanna talk about victims. A lot of times we hear victims talked about in political conversations a lot and their concerns mischaracterized. But when talking to victims and data coming from studies involving them, two things come to the top as priorities. One, to make sure what happened to them never happens to them or anyone else again. And two, that they receive more support to help recover from what happened, to help restore what had been damaged or lost, or, you know, to help rehabilitate. And we do a really poor job of that - as a community, as a government - when it comes to assistance and support for victims. In your role as a councilmember, what would you do to better support victims of crime? [00:26:56] Maren Costa: That's a great question. I think a lot of times, as victims, people can feel very isolated and alone. And so I think like community support - community support groups, community support networks - if there are other people with that same lived experience could be incredibly helpful. And I don't know if that exists or if that's something that the City could help promote. And then I think, you know, having a channel to express that frustration - what broke in the system that made you feel, you know, victimized, where did the system, how was the system not there to support you? And being able to be heard, to make sure that the City or whatever, you know, department understands what went wrong. And then seeing that be taken seriously and seeing change and results - that is what is restorative to, I think, to victims - is knowing that you've been heard and that change happened. And so in any way that we can make sure that victims are heard, and then that we take the problem seriously and make the changes necessary to make sure that it doesn't happen again is really important. [00:28:39] Crystal Fincher: We've heard from certainly victims across the spectrum and some businesses - there's actually a business owner who wrote a column talking about wanting better support for businesses that have been victims of break-ins and theft - things like victims' assistance funds, business assistance funds, you know, to repair storefronts that are damaged or anything like that. Would that be something that you think would be helpful and that you would support? [00:29:06] Maren Costa: I do. I've heard that from a lot of businesses. I know that, you know, in some cases, there's, you know, small business insurance and you can have some of that paid for, but it's a lot of times - it's not. It's every single time that window is broken, you're paying $10,000 to have it replaced. And it doesn't - there is no support. A lot of these businesses are on, you know, shoestring budgets already. And we want to keep our small businesses alive and vibrant and they need support. [00:29:43] Crystal Fincher: I want to talk about housing and homelessness. One thing called out by experts as a barrier to the effectiveness of the homelessness response on the ground is that frontline worker wages don't cover the cost of living, especially in a city like Seattle. Do you believe our local nonprofits have a responsibility to pay living wages for our area? And how can we make that more likely with how we bid for and contract for services at the City? [00:30:11] Maren Costa: I do think we need to pay a living wage. I have met directly with people on the frontlines. They are being, as I've heard described, criminally underpaid - and I think that's accurate. The work that these people are doing on the frontlines for our city has such a massive value for our city, for our society. And, you know, not only are they undervalued almost everywhere, they're even more undervalued in some of these City positions where they could go do the same function somewhere else - you know, outside of a nonprofit or - you know, and be paid more. And I've had people say, you know, I could go work at Dick's Drive-In and make more money, you know. And the work that they're doing is highly skilled - it takes time and it's so important to build the trust. We cannot have this low-paid, high-turnover staff and expect the results that we all wanna see. And so I'm not sure how the contracts - not being a City insider, I don't know how the contracts are made or what control we have, but I would definitely be an advocate for making sure that those frontline workers are getting paid a living wage. [00:31:39] Crystal Fincher: Now, Seattle and District 1 have a really vibrant business community. Some of the largest corporations in the world are here, and so many small businesses that run the gamut of products and services are here - but they face a number of challenges. What are the top challenges that you see small businesses facing in your district and what are your top priorities for addressing those needs? [00:32:07] Maren Costa: I think that, you know, during COVID, we saw some subsidies that really helped keep small businesses alive, but I think we're still seeing the challenges. People are still kind of coming out of the shadow of COVID. In any ways that we could - and I know that a lot of that was federal money, but - you know, in any ways that we can continue subsidies that keep businesses afloat. I have a good friend who's a small business owner - my twin sister is a small business owner in District 1 - but a good friend who's just constantly bobbing, just barely bobbing above the line of staying afloat. And so we need to support these things. We need to make sure that there's different sizes of spaces for small businesses - making it really flexible - if you need 400 square feet, you can find 400 square feet. So, you know, having these shared business spaces or dividing these into smaller spaces, making retail units available on the first level of multi, you know, four-floors-and-a-corner-store, opening up zoning where we can have more small businesses throughout our communities. Just - what I usually say, like, what's good for small businesses is good for the community. Like when we know that it's working well for small businesses, we know we're doing something right. So they bring such, as you say, vibrancy to our communities and we wanna do what we can to support them. [00:33:45] Crystal Fincher: Childcare is another humongous concern for, really, the entire community. For parents of kids, childcare is often a cost - their number two, sometimes with a number of kids, number one cost. We just saw reporting that childcare is now more expensive than college on an annual basis, which is just staggering. And the availability of childcare is also a challenge. What can you do in your role as a City councilmember to help parents with this? [00:34:19] Maren Costa: We do need - I've heard that there's only about 50% of parents with kids, or the number of kids - only about 50% of the needs are met by the childcare centers that we have. So people are being forced to reach to, you know, relatives or nannies or, you know - but there's just not the space in childcare centers that we need in District 1. There's a large childcare center at the, you know, Delridge - you know, right by the Delridge on the West Seattle Bridge and Fauntleroy, I guess - that is under eminent domain for the - to the transit. And it's, you know, it's gonna be really hard to lose that center - they take care of a lot of families. And the money that is being offered for them to relocate is not anywhere near what they need to relocate. So making sure that that center gets to stay afloat, if in fact they are displaced by Sound Transit, would be incredibly important. And making sure that they're given the subsidies needed to actually rebuild their business. And then I would love to see more and, you know, smaller childcare centers distributed throughout neighborhoods so that people can, not only - you know, we would love to see people be able to live where they work, near where they work. So we're seeing a lot of displacement out, you know, into Federal Way and further out, people keep getting pushed out. But so to be able to live where you, near where you work and to be able to have childcare where you work. So making sure that some of the big businesses that go in put childcare centers in the buildings that they're in so that, you know, that's something that can work for working parents - to have childcare at your work site. And then just making sure that we're supporting the small childcare centers that are open and making a reasonable, viable business to open new ones. [00:36:36] Crystal Fincher: Now, as we close today, there are a number of voters, residents living in Seattle who are trying to make a decision between you and your opponent and who they should vote for, who most aligns with their values. What do you say to voters when they ask - what's the difference or why should I choose you? [00:36:58] Maren Costa: I think that the skill set that I bring and - the skill set, the values, and the focuses that I bring are going to be really, I think, valuable for the City going forward. So I come out of big business and big tech - I've managed big teams and big budgets, I've brought competing teams together to actually work together to get more stuff done at both Amazon and Microsoft. I think we need someone on council who actually really understands big tech. And then obviously I have a focus on climate. I think we need someone on council who has the depth of the climate justice focus that I have. And I think that my former opponents who endorsed me - the six primary opponents who came together to endorse me - speak to the level of trust that they have in me to authentically and thoughtfully lead our, and represent our district on council. They've seen me learn and listen and follow through. And I think my past experience and how I've shown up on the campaign trail speak to that. [00:38:48] Crystal Fincher: Well, thank you so much for joining us today - Seattle City Council candidate in District 1, Maren Costa. Thank you so much. [00:38:57] Maren Costa: Thank you so much. It was a pleasure to be here. [00:39:00] Crystal Fincher: Thank you for listening to Hacks & Wonks, which is produced by Shannon Cheng. You can follow Hacks & Wonks on Twitter @HacksWonks. You can catch Hacks & Wonks on every podcast service and app - just type "Hacks and Wonks" into the search bar. Be sure to subscribe to get the full versions of our Friday week-in-review shows and our Tuesday topical show delivered to your podcast feed. If you like us, leave a review wherever you listen. You can also get a full transcript of this episode and links to the resources referenced in the show at officialhacksandwonks.com and in the podcast episode notes. Thanks for tuning in - talk to you next time.

It's Thursday AND the first day of the NFL Season. Fan or not, we are definitely entering Fall-mode as we talk about a recent privacy study that puts Auto at the bottom of the list. We also take a look at how the potential strike may roll out. Finally, we look at the most expensive Toyota coming soon to the US of A. Show Notes with links:A recent report by the Mozilla Foundation, the company most known for its privacy-first browser Firefox, has labeled modern cars as the "worst privacy nightmare" highlighting extensive data collection practices, from basic personal information to sensitive data like genetic details.“While we worried that our doorbells and watches that connect to the internet might be spying on us, car brands quietly entered the data business by turning their vehicles into powerful data-gobbling machines,” says Mozilla in the report.The study revealed 92% of automakers provide minimal control over user data, and 84% share it with external partiesNotably, Nissan and Kia collect data on users' sexual activity. Mozilla couldn't verify if any automakers met its data encryption and theft protection standards, highlighting the fact that dating apps often provide better security details than cars.Mozilla spent over 600 hours on the study, which is far more than than typical. Tesla ranked lowest. In an unprecedented move, the UAW is considering a simultaneous strike against Detroit's Big 3 automakers. This potential action, involving nearly 150,000 workers, could severely drain the UAW's $825 million strike fund. Strategists debate the sustainability of such a strike, alongside the potential for major financial impacts and production losses for the automakers."Let me assure you, the VPs, myself, all the leadership at this level, the bargaining committees, we understand how to manage this," Fain said in response to a worker's question on the issue during a Facebook livestream in early August. "We have a plan. Come Sept. 14, if these companies don't deliver, they're going to see that plan unfold."When on strike, workers receive $500 per week plus potential health coverage from the Union while funds remainNot wanting to be left out of the ultra-lux game, Toyota has unveiled a revamped plug-in hybrid version of its prestigious Century model, often dubbed the 'Rolls-Royce of Japanese cars'. Traditionally reserved for Japan's elite, the $170,000 luxury car, known for its classic elegance and superior craftsmanship, will now be offered to a global audience, signaling Toyota's ambitious move into the international luxury market.McKinsey forecasts indicate faster growth for the luxury car market, especially in the price range of $150,000 to $299,000 10%, 300-500k 9%, over 500k 14% Hosts: Paul J Daly and Kyle MountsierGet the Daily Push Back email at https://www.asotu.com/ JOIN the conversation on LinkedIn at: https://www.linkedin.com/company/asotu/ Read our most recent email at: https://www.asotu.com/media/push-back-email ASOTU Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/automotivestateoftheunion

In this episode, Bill and Bryan tackle a unique challenge: creating a video for sales leaders, VPs, CEOs, and presidents. The goal is to explore crucial yet often overlooked sales skills. Discover how advanced LinkedIn proficiency, the ability to convey complex ideas clearly, belief as a skill, and effective planning can transform your team's performance. Get practical tips and insights to enhance your sales abilities and stay ahead in the ever-changing world of sales. Don't miss this opportunity to elevate your team's game. Stay tuned for the upcoming video on the Advanced Selling Podcast website, and start mastering these essential skills today. ================================= Want our "Insider Secrets?" Go to http://advancedsellingpodcast.com/insidersecrets to get them right now! The Insider program is open for enrollment. If you have not checked out our small learning group, go to http://advancedsellingpodcast.com/insider to join today! If you haven't already, make sure you join us in our LinkedIn group: http://advancedsellingpodcast.com/linkedin. Looking for more sales training like this podcast? Download our FREE audio program, The Ultimate Pre-Game. http://ultimatepregame.com =================================

In this episode, Cory Miller and Corey Maass discuss the progress with their product and plans for marketing. They mention ordering stickers and preparing for WordCamp US. They also talk about the importance of having a clear name for the plugin and creating a frictionless process for potential customers to sign up or make a purchase. They talk through their pitch and refine their messaging. They also brainstorm different ideas for promoting the product, such as creating unique business cards or flyers and offering branding and listing websites on a page. They also discuss the importance of having a clear and concise pitch to explain the product to potential customers.Top Takeaways:Product Differentiation: The conversation highlights the importance of presenting a unique value proposition for a product. The speakers emphasize how OMGIMG transforms ordinary images into polished and engaging content, which sets it apart from traditional image solutions.Visual Presentation Matters: The speakers discuss the significance of visuals in content sharing. They emphasize how compelling images contribute to engagement and sharing on social media platforms. This insight underscores the need for visually appealing content.Simple and Clear Pitch: The speakers craft a concise and clear pitch for the product. They focus on highlighting the problem (unappealing images) and the solution (OMGIMG's transformational capability) in a straightforward manner, ensuring potential users quickly understand the product's benefits.

Get FREE Sales Leadership Resources at go.transformedsales.com/podHighlights[00:51] - From an SDR who grew a company to $70 Million to starting his own company.[04:50] - The Journey Up: Moving up in his sales career.[08:08] - Shifting careers to get more fulfillment.[10:09] - Going from an account executive position to become VP of Sales.[13:09] - Why he took a 75% pay cut and how it paid off.[15:46] - Leveraging his years of sales experience to start his own company.[20:46] - Why it's important for VPs of sales to become financially fluent.[25:41] - The power of empathy in sales leadership.In this episode of the Transformed Sales Podcast, I interviewed Tommy McNulty, the Founder and CEO of Rhythm, a venture-backed SaaS startup using AI to find and monitor areas for profit maximization. Prior to Rhythm, Tommy was the Head of B2B at NerdWallet, overseeing a team of 80+ and a $70M revenue P&L. Tommy joined NerdWallet via the acquisition of Fundera where he helped grow the company from $0 to $50M in revenue over five years. Tommy started his career as an SDR and AE at ZocDoc.Tommy McNulty shares his remarkable journey from an SDR who elevated a company's revenue to $70M, to spearheading Rhythm. From his vast experience, Tommy sheds light on the nuances of ascending the sales hierarchy, the essence of financial fluency for VPs, and the indispensable role of empathy in sales leadership. His insights underscore the core belief that profound skill development can lead to unprecedented opportunities in the sales domain. Tune in to learn about that and more from Tommy. You'll get a lot of valuable insights out of it.Quotes“If you have big aspirations, you have to throw yourself into the fire” - Tommy McNulty“Get the idea of money, success, and showmanship out of your head, and build as much skill as you possibly can because that skill will meet an opportunity and then you'll just take off” - Tommy McNulty“VP of Sales will have to become financially fluent and be capable of digging deep into a P&L and making decisions based on that P&L” - Tommy McNulty“As a sales leader, you have to make decisions and some of those decisions are difficult decisions. You have to have the courage to make them” - Tommy McNultyLearn More About Tommy McNulty in the Links Below:LinkedIn - https://www.linkedin.com/in/tommcnulty1/Twitter - https://twitter.com/rhythmtommyWebsite - http://www.onrhythm.ioEmail - Tommy@onrhythm.ioConnect with Wesleyne:Wesleyne's Website - https://transformedsales.com/Wesleyne on LinkedIn - https://www.linkedin.com/in/wesleynegreer/Wesleyne on Facebook - https://web.facebook.com/wesleynegreerWesleyne on Twitter - https://twitter.com/wesleynegreerEmail Her at

Sales and marketing alignment is huge, and historically, sales and marketing haven't been best friends. Steven Nghe, Head of Marketing and Communications at Kloeckner Metals, discusses when Kloeckner Metals realized that sales and marketing had changed, and they needed to change with it. He discusses the digitalization of more multidimensional and complex marketing practices that need to be enhanced for sales and marketing to make selling manufacturing more efficient. He also discusses how he gained trust from VPs on marketing being a worthwhile investment by exposing what marketing really is.

Kelsey Hightower joins Corey on Screaming in the Cloud to discuss his reflections on how the tech industry is progressing. Kelsey describes what he's been getting out of retirement so far, and reflects on what he learned throughout his high-profile career - including why feature sprawl is such a driving force behind the complexity of the cloud environment and the tactics he used to create demos that are engaging for the audience. Corey and Kelsey also discuss the importance of remaining authentic throughout your career, and what it means to truly have an authentic voice in tech. About KelseyKelsey Hightower is a former Distinguished Engineer at Google Cloud, the co-chair of KubeCon, the world's premier Kubernetes conference, and an open source enthusiast. He's also the co-author of Kubernetes Up & Running: Dive into the Future of Infrastructure. Recently, Kelsey announced his retirement after a 25-year career in tech.Links Referenced:Twitter: https://twitter.com/kelseyhightower TranscriptAnnouncer: Hello, and welcome to Screaming in the Cloud with your host, Chief Cloud Economist at The Duckbill Group, Corey Quinn. This weekly show features conversations with people doing interesting work in the world of cloud, thoughtful commentary on the state of the technical world, and ridiculous titles for which Corey refuses to apologize. This is Screaming in the Cloud.Corey: Do you wish there were cheat codes for database optimization? Well, there are – no seriously. If you're using Postgres or MySQL on Amazon Aurora or RDS, OtterTune uses AI to automatically optimize your knobs and indexes and queries and other bits and bobs in databases. OtterTune applies optimal settings and recommendations in the background or surfaces them to you and allows you to do it. The best part is that there's no cost to try it. Get a free, thirty-day trial to take it for a test drive. Go to ottertune dot com to learn more. That's O-T-T-E-R-T-U-N-E dot com.Corey: Welcome to Screaming in the Cloud. I'm Corey Quinn. You know, there's a great story from the Bible or Torah—Old Testament, regardless—that I was always a big fan of where you wind up with the Israelites walking the desert for 40 years in order to figure out what comes next. And Moses led them but could never enter into what came next. Honestly, I feel like my entire life is sort of going to be that direction. Not the biblical aspects, but rather always wondering what's on the other side of a door that I can never cross, and that door is retirement. Today I'm having returning guest Kelsey Hightower, who is no longer at Google. In fact, is no longer working and has joined the ranks of the gloriously retired. Welcome back, and what's it like?Kelsey: I'm happy to be here. I think retirement is just like work in some ways: you have to learn how to do it. A lot of people have no practice in their adult life what to do with all of their time. We have small dabs in it, like, you get the weekend off, depending on what your work, but you never have enough time to kind of unwind and get into something else. So, I'm being honest with myself. It's going to be a learning curve, what to do with that much time.You're probably still going to do work, but it's going to be a different type of work than you're used to. And so, that's where I am. 30 days into this, I'm in that learning mode, I'm on-the-job training.Corey: What's harder than you expected?Kelsey: It's not the hard part because I think mentally I've been preparing for, like, the last ten years, being a minimalist, learning how to kind of live within my means, learn to appreciate things that are just not work-related or status symbols. And so, to me, it felt like a smooth transition because I started to value my time more than anything else, right? Just waking up the next day became valuable to me. Spending time in the moment, right, you go to these conferences, there's, like, 10,000 people, but you learn to value those one-on-one encounters, those one-off, kind of, let's just go grab lunch situations. So, to me, retirement just makes more room for that, right? I no longer have this calendar that is super full, so I think for me, it was a nice transition in terms of getting more of that valuable time back.Corey: It seems to me that you're in a similar position to the one that I find myself in where the job that you were doing and I still am is tied, more or less, to a sense of identity as opposed to a particular task or particular role that you fill. You were Kelsey Hightower. That was a complete sentence. People didn't necessarily need to hear the rest of what you were working on or what you were going to be talking about at a given conference or whatnot. So, it seemed, at least from the outside, that an awful lot of what you did was quite simply who you were. Do you feel that your sense of identity has changed?Kelsey: So, I think when you have that much influence, when you have that much reputation, the words you say travel further, they tend to come with a little bit more respect, and so when you're working with a team on new product, and you say, “Hey, I think we should change some things.” And when they hear those words coming from someone that they trust or has a name that is attached to reputation, you tend to be able to make a lot of impact with very few words. But what you also find is that no matter what you get involved in—configuration management, distributed systems, serverless, working with customers—it all is helped and aided by the reputation that you bring into that line of work. And so yes, who you are matters, but one thing that I think helped me, kind of greatly, people are paying attention maybe to the last eight years of my career: containers, Kubernetes, but my career stretches back to the converting COBOL into Python days; the dawn of DevOps, Puppet, Chef, and Ansible; the Golang appearance and every tool being rewritten from Ruby to Golang; the Docker era.And so, my identity has stayed with me throughout those transitions. And so, it was very easy for me to walk away from that thing because I've done it three or four times before in the past, so I know who I am. I've never had, like, a Twitter bio that said, “Company X. X person from company X.” I've learned long ago to just decouple who I am from my current employer because that is always subject to change.Corey: I was fortunate enough to not find myself in the public eye until I owned my own company. But I definitely remember times in my previous incarnations where I was, “Oh, today I'm working at this company,” and I believed—usually inaccurately—that this was it. This was where I really found my niche. And then surprise I'm not there anymore six months later for, either their decision, my decision, or mutual agreement. And I was always hesitant about hanging a shingle out that was tied too tightly to any one employer.Even now, I was little worried about doing it when I went independent, just because well, what if it doesn't work? Well, what if, on some level? I think that there's an authenticity that you can bring with you—and you certainly have—where, for a long time now, whenever you say something, I take it seriously, and a lot of people do. It's not that you're unassailably correct, but I've never known you to say something you did not authentically believe in. And that is an opinion that is very broadly shared in this industry. So, if nothing else, you definitely were a terrific object lesson in speaking the truth, as you saw it.Kelsey: I think what you describe is one way that, whether you're an engineer doing QA, working in the sales department, when you can be honest with the team you're working with, when you can be honest with the customers you're selling into when you can be honest with the community you're part of, that's where the authenticity gets built, right? Companies, sometimes on the surface, you believe that they just want you to walk the party line, you know, they give you the lines and you just read them verbatim and you're doing your part. To be honest, you can do that with the website. You can do that with a well-placed ad in the search queries.What people are actually looking for are real people with real experiences, sharing not just fact, but I think when you mix kind of fact and opinion, you get this level of authenticity that you can't get just by pure strategic marketing. And so, having that leverage, I remember back in the day, people used to say, “I'm going to do the right thing and if it gets me fired, then that's just the way it's going to be. I don't want to go around doing the wrong thing because I'm scared I'm going to lose my job.” You want to find yourself in that situation where doing the right thing, is also the best thing for the company, and that's very rare, so when I've either had that opportunity or I've tried to create that opportunity and move from there.Corey: It resonates and it shows. I have never had a lot of respect for people who effectively are saying one thing today and another thing the next week based upon which way they think that the winds are blowing. But there's also something to be said for being able and willing to publicly recant things you have said previously as technology evolves, as your perspective evolves and, in light of new information, I'm now going to change my perspective on something. I've done that already with multi-cloud, for example. I thought it was ridiculous when I heard about it. But there are also expressions of it that basically every company is using, including my own. And it's a nuanced area. Where I find it challenging is when you see a lot of these perspectives that people are espousing that just so happen to deeply align with where their paycheck comes from any given week. That doesn't ring quite as true to me.Kelsey: Yeah, most companies actually don't know how to deal with it either. And now there has been times at any number of companies where my authentic opinion that I put out there is against party line. And you get those emails from directors and VPs. Like, “Hey, I thought we all agree to think this way or to at least say this.” And that's where you have to kind of have that moment of clarity and say, “Listen, that is undeniably wrong. It's so wrong in fact that if you say this in public, whether a small setting or large setting, you are going to instantly lose credibility going forward for yourself. Forget the company for a moment. There's going to be a situation where you will no longer be effective in your job because all of your authenticity is now gone. And so, what I'm trying to do and tell you is don't do that. You're better off saying nothing.”But if you go out there, and you're telling what is obviously misinformation or isn't accurate, people are not dumb. They're going to see through it and you will be classified as a person not to listen to. And so, I think a lot of people struggle with that because they believe that enterprise's consensus should also be theirs.Corey: An argument that I made—we'll call it a prediction—four-and-a-half years ago, was that in five years, nobody would really care about Kubernetes. And people misunderstood that initially, and I've clarified since repeatedly that I'm not suggesting it's going away: “Oh, turns out that was just a ridiculous fever dream and we're all going back to running bare metal with our hands again,” but rather that it would slip below the surface-level of awareness. And I don't know that I got the timing quite right on that, I think it's going to depend on the company and the culture that you find yourself in. But increasingly, when there's an application to run, it's easy to ask someone just, “Oh, great. Where's the Kubernetes cluster live so we can throw this on there and just add it to the rest of the pile?”That is sort of what I was seeing. My intention with that was not purely just to be controversial, as much fun as that might be, but also to act as a bit of a warning, where I've known too many people who let their identities become inextricably tangled with the technology. But technologies rise and fall, and at some point—like, you talk about configuration management days; I learned to speak publicly as a traveling trainer for Puppet. I wrote part of SaltStack once upon a time. But it was clear that that was not the direction the industry was going, so it was time to find something else to focus on. And I fear for people who don't keep an awareness or their feet underneath them and pay attention to broader market trends.Kelsey: Yeah, I think whenever I was personally caught up in linking my identity to technology, like, “I'm a Rubyist,” right?“, I'm a Puppeteer,” and you wear those names proudly. But I remember just thinking to myself, like, “You have to take a step back. What's more important, you or the technology?” And at some point, I realized, like, it's me, that is more important, right? Like, my independent thinking on this, my independent experience with this is far more important than the success of this thing.But also, I think there's a component there. Like when you talked about Kubernetes, you know, maybe being less relevant in five years, there's two things there. One is the success of all infrastructure things equals irrelevancy. When flights don't crash, when bridges just work, you do not think about them. You just use them because they're so stable and they become very boring. That is the success criteria.Corey: Utilities. No one's wondering if the faucet's going to work when they turn it on in the morning.Kelsey: Yeah. So, you know, there's a couple of ways to look at your statement. One is, you believe Kubernetes is on the trajectory that it's going to stabilize itself and hit that success criteria, and then it will be irrelevant. Or there's another part of the irrelevancy where something else comes along and replaces that thing, right? I think Cloud Foundry and Mesos are two good examples of Kubernetes coming along and stealing all of the attention from that because those particular products never gained that mass adoption. Maybe they got to the stable part, but they never got to the mass adoption part. So, I think when it comes to infrastructure, it's going to be irrelevant. It's just what side of that [laugh] coin do you land on?Corey: It's similar to folks who used to have to work at a variety of different companies on very specific Linux kernel subsystems because everyone had to care because there were significant performance impacts. Time went on and now there's still a few of those people that very much need to care, but for the rest of us, it is below the level of things that we have to care about. For me, the signs of the unsustainability were, oh, you can run Kubernetes effectively in production? That's a minimum of a quarter-million dollars a year in comp or up in some cases. Not every company is going to be able to field a team of those people and still remain a going concern in business. Nor frankly, should they have to.Kelsey: I'm going to pull on that thread a little bit because it's about—we're hitting that ten-year mark of Kubernetes. So, when Kubernetes comes out, why were people drawn to it, right? Why did it even get the time of day to begin with? And I think Docker kind of opened Pandora's box there. This idea of Chef, Puppet, Ansible, ten thousand package managers, and honestly, that trajectory was going to continue forever and it was helping no one. It was literally people doing duplicate work depending on the operating system you're dealing with and we were wasting time copying bits to servers—literally—in a very glorified way.So, Docker comes along and gives us this nicer, better abstraction, but it has gaps. It has no orchestration. It's literally this thing where now we've unified the packaging situation, we've learned a lot from Red Hat, YUM, Debian, and the various package repo combinations out there and so we made this universal thing. Great. We also learned a little bit about orchestration through brute force, bash scripts, config management, you name it, and so we serialized that all into this thing we call Kubernetes.It's pretty simple on the surface, but it was probably never worthy of such fanfare, right? But I think a lot of people were relieved that now we finally commoditized this expertise that the Googles, the Facebooks of the world had, right, building these systems that can copy bits to other systems very fast. There you go. We've gotten that piece. But I think what the market actually wants is in the mobile space, if you want to ship software to 300 million people that you don't even know, you can do it with the app store.There's this appetite that the boring stuff should be easy. Let's Encrypt has made SSL certificates beyond easy. It's just so easy to do the right thing. And I think for this problem we call deployments—you know, shipping apps around—at some point we have to get to a point where that is just crazy easy. And it still isn't.So, I think some of the frustration people express ten years later, they're realizing that they're trying to recreate a Rube Goldberg machine with Kubernetes is the base element and we still haven't understood that this whole thing needs to simplify, not ten thousand new pieces so you can build your own adventure.Corey: It's the idea almost of what I'm seeing AWS go through, and to some extent, its large competitors. But building anything on top of AWS from scratch these days is still reminiscent of going to Home Depot—or any hardware store—and walking up and down the aisles and getting all the different components to piece together what you want. Sometimes just want to buy something from Target that's already assembled and you have to do all of that work. I'm not saying there isn't value to having a Home Depot down the street, but it's also not the panacea that solves for all use cases. An awful lot of customers just want to get the job done and I feel that if we cling too tightly to how things used to be, we lose it.Kelsey: I'm going to tell you, being in the cloud business for almost eight years, it's the customers that create this. Now, I'm not blaming the customer, but when you start dealing with thousands of customers with tons of money, you end up in a very different situation. You can have one customer willing to pay you a billion dollars a year and they will dictate things that apply to no one else. “We want this particular set of features that only we will use.” And for a billion bucks a year times ten years, it's probably worth from a business standpoint to add that feature.Now, do this times 500 customers, each major provider. What you end up with is a cloud console that is unbearable, right? Because they also want these things to be first-class citizens. There's always smaller companies trying to mimic larger peers in their segment that you just end up in that chaos machine of unbound features forever. I don't know how to stop it. Unless you really come out maybe more Apple style and you tell people, “This is the one and only true way to do things and if you don't like it, you have to go find an alternative.” The cloud business, I think, still deals with the, “If you have a large payment, we will build it.”Corey: I think that that is a perspective that is not appreciated until you've been in the position of watching how large enterprises really interact with each other. Because it's, “Well, what customer the world is asking for yet another way to run containers?” “Uh, this specific one and their constraints are valid.” Every time I think I've seen everything there is to see in the world of cloud, I just have to go talk to one more customer and I'm learning something new. It's inevitable.I just wish that there was a better way to explain some of this to newcomers, when they're looking at, “Oh, I'm going to learn how this cloud thing works. Oh, my stars, look at how many services there are.” And then they wind up getting lost with analysis paralysis, and every time they get started and ask someone for help, they're pushed in a completely different direction and you keep spinning your wheels getting told to start over time and time again when any of these things can be made to work. But getting there is often harder than it really should be.Kelsey: Yeah. I mean, I think a lot of people don't realize how far you can get with, like, three VMs, a load balancer, and Postgres. My guess is you can probably build pretty much any clone of any service we use today with at least 1 million customers. Most people never reached that level—I don't even want to say the word scale—but that blueprint is there and most people will probably be better served by that level of simplicity than trying to mimic the behaviors of large customers—or large companies—with these elaborate use cases. I don't think they understand the context there. A lot of that stuff is baggage. It's not [laugh] even, like, best-of-breed or great design. It's like happenstance from 20 years of trying to buy everything that's been sold to you.Corey: I agree with that idea wholeheartedly. I was surprising someone the other day when I said that if you were to give me a task of getting some random application up and running by tomorrow, I do a traditional three-tier architecture, some virtual machines, a load balancer, and a database service. And is that the way that all the cool kids are doing it today? Well, they're not talking about it, but mostly. But the point is, is that it's what I know, it's where my background is, and the thing you already know when you're trying to solve a new problem is incredibly helpful, rather than trying to learn everything along that new path that you're forging down. Is that architecture the best approach? No, but it's perfectly sufficient for an awful lot of stuff.Kelsey: Yeah. And so, I mean, look, I've benefited my whole career from people fantasizing about [laugh] infrastructure—Corey: [laugh].Kelsey: And the truth is that in 2023, this stuff is so powerful that you can do almost anything you want to do with the simplest architecture that's available to us. The three-tier architecture has actually gotten better over the years. I think people are forgotten: CPUs are faster, RAM is much bigger quantities, the networks are faster, right, these databases can store more data than ever. It's so good to learn the fundamentals, start there, and worst case, you have a sound architecture people can reason about, and then you can go jump into the deep end, once you learn how to swim.Corey: I think that people would be depressed to understand just how much the common case for the value that Kubernetes brings is, “Oh yeah, now we can lose a drive or a server and the application stays up.” It feels like it's a bit overkill for that one somewhat paltry use case, but that problem has been hounding companies for decades.Kelsey: Yeah, I think at some point, the whole ‘SSH is my only interface into these kinds of systems,' that's a little low level, that's a little bare bones, and there will probably be a feature now where we start to have this not Infrastructure as Code, not cloud where we put infrastructure behind APIs and you pay per use, but I think what Kubernetes hints at is a future where you have APIs that do something. Right now the APIs give you pieces so you can assemble things. In the future, the APIs will just do something, “Run this app. I need it to be available and here's my money budget, my security budget, and reliability budget.” And then that thing will say, “Okay, we know how to do that, and here's roughly what is going to cost.”And I think that's what people actually want because that's how requests actually come down from humans, right? We say, “We want this app or this game to be played by millions of people from Australia to New York.” And then for a person with experience, that means something. You kind of know what architecture you need for that, you know what pieces that need to go there. So, we're just moving into a realm where we're going to have APIs that do things all of a sudden.And so, Kubernetes is the warm-up to that era. And that's why I think that transition is a little rough because it leaks the pieces part, so where you can kind of build all the pieces that you want. But we know what's coming. Serverless also hints at this. But that's what people should be looking for: APIs that actually do something.Corey: This episode is sponsored in part by Panoptica.  Panoptica simplifies container deployment, monitoring, and security, protecting the entire application stack from build to runtime. Scalable across clusters and multi-cloud environments, Panoptica secures containers, serverless APIs, and Kubernetes with a unified view, reducing operational complexity and promoting collaboration by integrating with commonly used developer, SRE, and SecOps tools. Panoptica ensures compliance with regulatory mandates and CIS benchmarks for best practice conformity. Privacy teams can monitor API traffic and identify sensitive data, while identifying open-source components vulnerable to attacks that require patching. Proactively addressing security issues with Panoptica allows businesses to focus on mitigating critical risks and protecting their interests. Learn more about Panoptica today at panoptica.app.Corey: You started the show by talking about how your career began with translating COBOL into Python. I firmly believe someone starting their career today listening to this could absolutely find that by the time their career starts drawing to their own close, that Kubernetes is right in there as far as sounding like the deprecated thing that no one really talks about or thinks about anymore. And I hope so. I want the future to be brighter than the past. I want getting a business or getting software together in a way that helps people to not require the amount of, “First, spend six weeks at a boot camp,” or, “Learn how to write just enough code that you can wind up getting funding and then have it torn apart.”What's the drag-and-drop story? What's the describe the application to a robot and it builds it for you? I'm optimistic about the future of infrastructure, just because based upon its power to potentially make reliability and scale available to folks who have no idea of what's involved with that. That's kind of the point. That's the end game of having won this space.Kelsey: Well, you know what? Kubernetes is providing the metadata to make that possible, right? Like in the early days, people were writing one-off scripts or, you know, writing little for loops to get things in the right place. And then we get config management that kind of formalizes that, but it still had no metadata, right? You'd have things like Puppet report information.But in the world of, like, Kubernetes, or any cloud provider, now you get semantic meaning. “This app needs this volume with this much space with this much memory, I need three of these behind this load balancer with these protocols enabled.” There is now so much metadata about applications, their life cycles, and how they work that if you were to design a new system, you can actually use that data to craft a much better API that made a lot of this boilerplate the defaults. Oh, that's a web application. You do not need to specify all of this boilerplate. Now, we can give you much better nouns and verbs to describe what needs to happen.So, I think this is that transition as all the new people coming up, they're going to be dealing with semantic meaning to infrastructure, where we were dealing with, like, tribal knowledge and intuition, right? “Run this script, pipe it to this thing, and then this should happen. And if it doesn't, run the script again with this flag.” Versus, “Oh, here's the semantic meaning to a working system.” That's a game-changer.Corey: One other topic I wanted to ask you about—I've it's been on my list of things to bring up the next time I ran into you and then you went ahead and retired, making it harder to run into you. But a little while back, I was at a tech conference and someone gave a demo, and it didn't go as well as they had hoped. And a few of us were talking about it afterwards. We've all been speakers, we've all lived that life. Zero shade.But someone brought you up in particular—unprompted; your legend does precede you—and the phrase that they used was that Kelsey's demos were always picture-perfect. He was so lucky with how the demos worked out. And I just have to ask—because you don't strike me as someone who is not careful, particularly when all eyes are upon you—and real experts make things look easy, did you have demos periodically go wrong that the audience just didn't see going wrong along the way? Or did you just actually YOLO all of your demos and got super lucky every single time for the last eight years?Kelsey: There was a musician who said, “Hey, your demos are like jazz. You improvise the whole thing.” There's no script, there's no video. The way I look at the demo is, like, you got this instrument, the command prompt, and the web browser. You can do whatever you want with them.Now, I have working code. I wrote the code, I wrote the deployment scenarios, I delete it all and I put it all back. And so, I know how it's supposed to work from the ground up. And so, what that means is if anything goes wrong, I can improvise. I could go into fixing the code. I can go into doing a redeploy.And I'll give you one good example. The first time Kubernetes came out, there was this small meetup in San Francisco with just the core contributors, right? So, there is no community yet, there's no conference yet, just people hacking on Kubernetes. And so, we decided, we're going to have the first Kubernetes meetup. And everyone got, like, six, seven minutes, max. That's it. You got to move.And so, I was like, “Hey, I noticed that in the lineup, there is no ‘What is Kubernetes?' talk. We're just getting into these nuts and bolts and I don't think that's fair to the people that will be watching this for the first time.” And I said, “All right, Kelsey, you should give maybe an intro to what it is.” I was like, “You know what I'll do? I'm going to build a Kubernetes cluster from the ground up, starting with VMs on my laptop.”And I'm in it and I'm feeling confident. So, confidence is the part that makes it look good, right? Where you're confident in the commands you type. One thing I learned to do is just use your history, just hit the up arrow instead of trying to copy all these things out. So, you hit the up arrow, you find the right command and you talk through it and no one looks at what's happening. You're cycling through the history.Or you have multiple tabs where you know the next up arrow is the right history. So, you give yourself shortcuts. And so, I'm halfway through this demo. We got three minutes left, and it doesn't work. Like, VMware is doing something weird on my laptop and there's a guy calling me off stage, like, “Hey, that's it. Cut it now. You're done.”I'm like, “Oh, nope. Thou shalt not go out like this.” It's time to improvise. And so, I said, “Hey, who wants to see me finish this?” And now everyone is locked in. It's dead silent. And I blow the whole thing away. I bring up the VMs, I [pixie 00:28:20] boot, I installed the kubelet, I install Docker. And everyone's clapping. And it's up, it's going, and I say, “Now, if all of this works, we run this command and it should start running the app.” And I do kubectl apply-f and it comes up and the place goes crazy.And I had more to the demo. But you stop. You've gotten the point across, right? This is what Kubernetes is, here's how it works, and look how you do it from scratch. And I remember saying, “And that's the end of my presentation.” You need to know when to stop, you need to know when to pivot, and you need to have confidence that it's supposed to work, and if you've seen it work a couple of times, your confidence is unshaken.And when I walked off that stage, I remember someone from Red Hat was like—Clayton Coleman; that's his name—Clayton Coleman walked up to me and said, “You planned that. You planned it to fail just like that, so you can show people how to go from scratch all the way up. That was brilliant.” And I was like, “Sure. That's exactly what I did.”Corey: “Yeah, I meant to do that.” I like that approach. I found there's always things I have to plan for in demos. For example, I can never count on having solid WiFi from a conference hall. The show has to go on. It's, okay, the WiFi doesn't work. I've at one point had to give a talk where the projector just wasn't working to a bunch of students. So okay, close the laptop. We're turning this into a bunch of question-and-answer sessions, and it was one of the better talks I've ever given.But the alternative is getting stuck in how you think a talk absolutely needs to go. Now, keynotes are a little harder where everything has been scripted and choreographed and at that point, I've had multiple fallbacks for demos that I've had to switch between. And people never noticed I was doing it for that exact reason. But it takes work to look polished.Kelsey: I will tell you that the last Next keynote I gave was completely irresponsible. No dry runs, no rehearsals, no table reads, no speaker notes. And I think there were 30,000 people at that particular Next. And Diane Greene was still CEO, and I remember when marketing was like, “Yo, at least a backup recording.” I was like, “Nah, I don't have anything.”And that demo was extensive. I mean, I was building an app from scratch, starting with Postgres, adding the schema, building an app, deploying the app. And something went wrong halfway. And there's this joke that I came up with just to pass over the time, they gave me a new Chromebook to do the demo. And so, it's not mine, so none of the default settings were there, I was getting pop-ups all over the place.And I came up with this joke on the way to the conference. I was like, “You know what'd be cool? When I show off the serverless stuff, I would just copy the code from Stack Overflow. That'd be like a really cool joke to say this is what senior engineers do.” And I go to Stack Overflow and it's getting all of these pop-ups and my mouse couldn't highlight the text.So, I'm sitting there like a deer in headlights in front of all of these people and I'm looking down, and marketing is, like, “This is what… this is what we're talking about.” And so, I'm like, “Man do I have to end this thing here?” And I remember I kept trying, I kept trying, and came to me. Once the mouse finally got in there and I cleared up all the popups, I just came up with this joke. I said, “Good developers copy.” And I switched over to my terminal and I took the text from Stack Overflow and I said, “Great developers paste,” and the whole room start laughing.And I had them back. And we kept going and continued. And at the end, there was like this Google Assistant, and when it was finished, I said, “Thank you,” to the Google Assistant and it was talking back through the live system. And it said, “I got to admit, that was kind of dope.” So, I go to the back and Diane Greene walks back there—the CEO of Google Cloud—and she pats me on the shoulder. “Kelsey, that was dope.”But it was the thrill because I had as much thrill as the people watching it. So, in real-time, I was going through all these emotions. But I think people forget, the demo is supposed to convey something. The demo is supposed to tell some story. And I've seen people overdo their demos with way too much code, way too many commands, almost if they're trying to show off their expertise versus telling a story. And so, when I think about the demo, it has to complement the entire narrative. And so, sometimes you don't need as many commands, you don't need as much code. You can keep things simple and that gives you a lot more ins and outs in case something does go crazy.Corey: And I think the key takeaway here that so many people lose sight of is you have to know the material well enough that whatever happens, well, things don't always go the way I planned during the day, either, and talking through that is something that I think serves as a good example. It feels like a bit more of a challenge when you're trying to demo something that a company is trying to sell someone, “Oh, yeah, it didn't work. But that's okay.” But I'm still reminded by probably one of the best conference demo fails I've ever seen on video. One day, someone was attempting to do a talk that hit Amazon S3 and it didn't work.And the audience started shouting at him that yeah, S3 is down right now. Because that was the big day that S3 took a nap for four hours. It was one of those foundational things you'd should never stop to consider. Like, well, what if the internet doesn't work tomorrow when I'm doing my demo? That's a tough one to work around. But rough timing.Kelsey: [breathy sound]Corey: He nailed the rest of the talk, though. You keep going. That's the thing that people miss. They get stuck in the demo that isn't working, they expect the audience knows as much as they do about what's supposed to happen next. You're the one up there telling a story. People forget it's storytelling.Kelsey: Now, I will be remiss to say, I know that the demo gods have been on my side for, like, ten, maybe fifteen years solid. So, I retired from doing live demos. This is why I just don't do them anymore. I know I'm overdue as an understatement. But the thing I've learned though, is that what I found more impressive than the live demo is to be able to convey the same narratives through story alone. No slides. No demo. Nothing. But you can still make people feel where you would try to go with that live demo.And it's insanely hard, especially for technologies people have never seen before. But that's that new challenge that I kind of set up for myself. So, if you see me at a keynote and you've noticed why I've been choosing these fireside chats, it's mainly because I'm also trying to increase my ability to share narrative, technical concepts, but now in a new form. So, this new storytelling format through the fireside chat has been my substitute for the live demo, normally because I think sometimes, unless there's something really to show that people haven't seen before, the live demo isn't as powerful to me. Once the thing is kind of known… the live demo is kind of more of the same. So, I think they really work well when people literally have never seen the thing before, but outside of that, I think you can kind of move on to, like, real-life scenarios and narratives that help people understand the fundamentals and the philosophy behind the tech.Corey: An awful lot of tools and tech that we use on a day-to-day basis as well are thankfully optimized for the people using them and the ergonomics of going about your day. That is orthogonal, in my experience, to looking very impressive on stage. It's the rare company that can have a product that not only works well but also presents well. And that is something I don't tend to index on when I'm selecting a tool to do something with. So, it's always a question of how can I make this more visually entertaining? For while I got out of doing demos entirely, just because talking about things that have more staying power than a screenshot that is going to wind up being irrelevant the next week when they decide to redo the console for some service yet again.Kelsey: But you know what? That was my secret to doing software products and projects. When I was at CoreOS, we used to have these meetups we would used to do every two weeks or so. So, when we were building things like etcd, Fleet was a container management platform that came before Kubernetes, we would always run through them as a user, start install them, use them, and ask how does it feel? These command line flags, they don't feel right. This isn't a narrative you can present with the software alone.But once we could, then the meetups were that much more engaging. Like hey, have you ever tried to distribute configuration to, like, a thousand servers? It's insanely hard. Here's how you do with Puppet. But now I'm going to show you how you do with etcd. And then the narrative will kind of take care of itself because the tool was positioned behind what people would actually do with it versus what the tool could do by itself.Corey: I think that's the missing piece that most marketing doesn't seem to quite grasp is, they talk about the tool and how awesome it is, but that's why I love customer demos so much. They're showing us how they use a tool to solve a real-world problem. And honestly, from my snarky side of the world and the attendant perspective there, I can make an awful lot of fun about basically anything a company decides to show me, but put a customer on stage talking about how whatever they've built is solving a real-world problem for them, that's the point where I generally shut up and listen because I'm going to learn something about a real-world story. Because you don't generally get to tell customers to go on stage and just make up a story that makes us sound good, and have it come off with any sense of reality whatsoever. I haven't seen that one happen yet, but I'm sure it's out there somewhere.Kelsey: I don't know how many founders or people building companies listen in to your podcast, but this is right now, I think the number one problem that especially venture-backed startups have. They tend to have great technology—maybe it's based off some open-source project—with tons of users who just know how that tool works, it's just an ingredient into what they're already trying to do. But that isn't going to ever be your entire customer base. Soon, you'll deal with customers who don't understand the thing you have and they need more than technology, right? They need a product.And most of these companies struggle painting that picture. Here's what you can do with it. Or here's what you can't do now, but you will be able to do if you were to use this. And since they are missing that, a lot of these companies, they produce a lot of code, they ship a lot of open-source stuff, they raise a lot of capital, and then it just goes away, it fades out over time because they can bring on no newcomers. The people who need help the most, they don't have a narrative for them, and so therefore, they're just hoping that the people who have all the skills in the world, the early adopters, but unfortunately, those people are tend to be the ones that don't actually pay. They just kind of do it themselves. It's the people who need the most help.Corey: How do we monetize the bleeding edge of adoption? In many cases you don't. They become your community if you don't hug them to death first.Kelsey: Exactly.Corey: Ugh. None of this is easy. I really want to thank you for taking the time to catch up and talk about how you seen the remains of a career well spent, and now you're going off into that glorious sunset. But I have a sneaking suspicion you'll still be around. Where should people go if they want to follow up on what you're up to these days?Kelsey: Right now I still use… I'm going to keep calling it Twitter.Corey: I agree.Kelsey: I kind of use that for my real-time interactions. And I'm still attending conferences, doing fireside chats, and just meeting people on those conference floors. But that's what where I'll be for now. So yeah, I'll still be around, but maybe not as deep. And I'll be spending more time just doing normal life stuff, maybe less building software.Corey: And we will, of course, put a link to that in the show notes. Thank you so much for taking the time to catch up and share your reflections on how the industry is progressing.Kelsey: Awesome. Thanks for having me, Corey.Corey: Kelsey Hightower, now gloriously retired. I'm Cloud Economist Corey Quinn, and this is Screaming in the Cloud. If you've enjoyed this podcast, please leave a five-star review on your podcast platform of choice, whereas if you've hated this podcast, please leave a five-star review on your podcast platform of choice along with an angry comment that you're going to type on stage as part of a conference talk, and then accidentally typo all over yourself while you're doing it.Corey: If your AWS bill keeps rising and your blood pressure is doing the same, then you need The Duckbill Group. We help companies fix their AWS bill by making it smaller and less horrifying. The Duckbill Group works for you, not AWS. We tailor recommendations to your business and we get to the point. Visit duckbillgroup.com to get started.

In this episode, Bill sits down with Rhea Wessel, founder of the Institute for Thought Leadership and author of "Write Like a Thought Leader." They dive deep into the world of thought leadership and its critical role in the success of sales professionals, VPs of sales, and business owners. Rhea shares her expertise on externalizing knowledge, a process of taking your expertise and framing it in a way that's useful and engaging for your audience. She explains why salespeople should be the content producers and thought leaders, rather than passing the baton to marketing. Discover how to create captivating content, build trust, and differentiate yourself in a crowded market. Tune in to learn the secrets of effective thought leadership and how it can elevate your sales game to the next level.Learn more about Rhea at https://rheawessel.com/If you'd like to learn more about how Bill can help you and your team reach your potential, go to https://billcaskey.com

Today I sit down with Lindsey Roy. I was introduced to her through a mutual connection who thought she would be a great fit to be on the podcast. After some research, I was blown away by her story and was so grateful when she agreed to come on the show.  10 years ago, Lindsey was in a serious boating accident, which lead to an amputation. Then just 10 months ago, she underwent a double lung transplant. Not only has she kept a positive outlook during these trials, but she has continued to win at work, and at home. She is a successful business leader with Hallmark, a wife for 15 years, and a mother to 2 kids. Her story is one of resilience and faith that I think all of us could learn and be encouraged by.   In this episode, you'll discover…  What is the key trait to winning at work and at home? (2:08) Lindsey opens up about her accident. (5:23) How did God show himself during her trauma? 9:17) Lindsey's double lung transplant (15:42) Communication. Express your needs. (26:52) You can't feel grateful and fearful at the same time. (35:24)   Lindsey's Bio: A tragic boating accident while on vacation almost claimed Lindsey¹s life and left her with an amputated left leg, severely injured right leg, and injured right arm. Through a challenging recovery process, Lindsey learned impactful lessons on how to harness disruption and find clarity in the chaos. A fresh voice on the speaking circuit, Lindsey has been heralded for her authentic style and universal message. Lindsey has spent over eighteen years in the corporate environment, leading teams in innovation, digital development, and product merchandising. She was named Vice-President at Hallmark Cards at just thirty-two years old, one of the youngest VPs ever in a company with over a 100-year history, and in the top 1% of brands worldwide. Lindsey combines her unique life experience, corporate background, and emotional intelligence to truly connect with audiences.   What's Next?  Have you read Rise and Go?! Rise and Go is a resource for you to get back up quicker. It was just released on Amazon and Audible. You can find out more about it here! I pray the content helps you as much as it has me and my clients. Thanks for your support in helping leaders win at work and at home! Are you crushing it at work but struggling at home? If you want to learn how to win at home, then go to https://CoryMCarlson.com/subscribe and download your free copy of “10 Ways To Win At Home.” If you're looking for a resource to help you with these times when your work is now in your home, check out my book Win At Home First on Amazon. Forbes Magazine rated it one of 7 books everyone on your team should read.

Missed our live event on "Empower Your Leadership: How to Navigate Job Search Challenges with an Executive Mindset"? Don't worry! The replay of Episode 95 from the Executive Career Upgrades Podcast is now available!Join hosts Tim and Kristina Madden as they provide unwavering support to ambitious Directors, VPs, and Executives, guiding them through the intricate job search journey with confidence and an executive mindset.In this power-packed episode, you'll gain access to essential tools and insights to conquer the job market and stand out as a top-tier candidate. Tim and Kristina will share practical strategies to refine your personal brand, master the art of networking, and exude executive presence throughout the job search process.Discover how to leverage your leadership skills, craft a compelling professional narrative, and excel in interviews and negotiations. Transitioning to a new role demands a positive mindset and flexibility, and this episode will empower you to embrace change and seek opportunities for growth.Tune in to draw from real-life experiences and insider tips, ensuring you're well-prepared to seize the executive-level position you deserve. Join us as we replay Episode 95, "Empower Your Leadership: How to Navigate Job Search Challenges with an Executive Mindset," and elevate your career journey with confidence and poise. Ready to unlock a world of executive opportunities? Schedule a complimentary career breakthrough session with one of our Executive Career Advisors today at: https://execupgrades.com/podcast/.Catch the replay of "Empower Your Leadership: How to Navigate Job Search Challenges with an Executive Mindset" now and take the first step towards an exceptional executive career!

Missed our live event on "Conquering Burnout: Performing at Your Peak as an Executive"? Don't worry! The replay of Episode 94 from the Executive Career Upgrades Podcast is now available!Join hosts Tim and Kristina Madden as they provide unwavering support to Directors, VPs, and Executives, helping them recognize and combat burnout's impact while fostering a leadership style that prioritizes self-care and drives results.In this episode, you'll discover invaluable strategies and insights to identify early signs of burnout and develop proactive measures to overcome it. Learn the art of balancing ambition with self-care, creating a work environment that promotes well-being, and building resilience to thrive in the face of adversity.Tune in to gain real-life experiences and practical advice that will empower you to perform at your peak without compromising your health and happiness.Don't let burnout hinder your path to success! Take the first step towards an exceptional executive career by scheduling a complimentary career breakthrough session with one of our Executive Career Advisors today at: https://execupgrades.com/podcast/.Catch the replay of "Conquering Burnout: Performing at Your Peak as an Executive" now and make your career soar to new heights!

On this week's podcast, we sit down with Mirela Mus, Founder and CPO of Product People, as we unbox the career progression in product management. We decode the vital differences between various product leadership roles, from VPs to Directors and Heads of Product. Listen as Mirela details her incredible journey into product management and discusses how Product People has set themselves apart by focusing wholeheartedly on career opportunities and meeting client needs.Featured Links: Follow Mirela on LinkedIn and Twitter | Product People | 'No Rules Rules: Netflix and the Culture of Reinvention' book by Reed Hastings and Erin Meyer | Open Roles at Product People

The VPs people and the Biden Administration is trying to trying to give a makeover to the person with the worst ratings in history. Will it work? --- Send in a voice message: https://podcasters.spotify.com/pod/show/foruncommonsense/message

Join us for an exclusive interview with Simon Chou, Chief Marketing Officer of BC Jobs and the Host of Marketing on Mars Shares , as he provides invaluable insights from top CEOs, CMOs, VPs, and founders about the current and future trends in marketing.  Learn how these business leaders are emphasizing the importance of building a strong community and implementing effective tactics and channels to succeed in enterprise-level brands. Gain valuable insights into the strategies that are driving success in today's dynamic marketing world.

Can you guess the Number one topic I get asked by female Directors and VPs new in their role?   How do I truly become that confident, charismatic, cool, calm, and collected executive in the eye of the storm? Why are they asking this?   Because they are tired of faking it.   Like a duck that appears to be gliding on the surface, but constantly paddling furiously beneath the surface.   They worked so hard to land the promotion.   They are now taking home $500K a year.   But deep down, they wonder if they can sustain the success.   In this podcast episode, I share a VERY simple yet powerful tactic that will build your character from deep within so you can become that powerful leader everyone wants to follow.   Click to listen   INTERESTED IN WORKING WITH US? Begin by applying for a call (http://cycprogram.com) FREE TRAINING Register for The Catapult Your Career Bootcamp (http://thecatapultbootcamp.com) GET IN TOUCH Linkedin: https://www.linkedin.com/in/stellaodogwu/ Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/_intelle/ Email: contact@intelle.us Text: 949-519-4554

Fredrik snackar med Roberto Chaves om VR och 3D på nittiotalet. Roberto gick från demoscenen till att bygga hela utvecklingsmiljöer och motorer för att driva nittiotalets VR-hjälmar från vanliga PC-burkar. Tunga VR-hjälmar, egna drivrutiner, prestandaoptimering, och resor till flera världsdelar var alla delar av resan. Mot slutet diskuterar vi även Robertos intryck av Apples nya Vision pro-headset och känner att framtiden är spännande den också. Ett stort tack till Cloudnet som sponsrar vår VPS! Har du kommentarer, frågor eller tips? Vi är @kodsnack, @tobiashieta, @oferlund, och @bjoreman på Twitter, har en sida på Facebook och epostas på info@kodsnack.se om du vill skriva längre. Vi läser allt som skickas. Gillar du Kodsnack får du hemskt gärna recensera oss i iTunes! Du kan också stödja podden genom att ge oss en kaffe (eller två!) på Ko-fi, eller handla något i vår butik. Länkar Roberto Commodore 64 Basic Google cardboard Gräsklipparmannen Trailer för Gräsklipparmannen VR på sextiotalet VR-vågen på nittiotalet Demogruppen Cascada VGA TCC 93 AutoCAD Windows 3.1 Sound blaster 16 Windows NT OS/2 Sun Solaris Visual C++ Pentium Mosaic Doom Silicon graphics IRIX Onyx MIPS RISC Polhemus magnetisk tracker DOS4GW Borland turbo C++ Symantec C++ TI TMS34020 TI TMS34082 - massor med VRAM Gouraud shading BSP - binary space partitioning Kaiser electro-optics VIM 1000 - VR-hjälm Stereoskopisk 3D Environment mapping Phong shading Prosolvia Eizo-skärmar Funhouse Z-TV ISDN Cycore - gjorde Final effects och andra program för filmindustrin och byggde egen dator lite senare Cosmonova Amiga 1000 Video om Disneys VR-Aladdin och VR-labb PDF om Disneys Aladdin-VR-åktur 3DFX Första DirectX kom 1995 Shutter glasses Voxlar Nyckelben Sega rally ILM Baywatch Cult 3D IBM:s Cellprocessor Virtuality var företaget och VR-maskinen som stod på Gröna lund Dactyl nightmare var spelet Roberto med vänner gjorde en förbättrad version av Vision pro Hololens och Hololens 2 Varjo XR-3 ARKit Apples WWDC-presentationer från 2023 om Vision pro Elvatums Macbook air Foveated rendering Doom VFR Move-kontrollerna Titlar VR på 90-talet Det var snabbt då Det fanns inga 3d-acceleratorer på den tiden Hade man 8 MB RAM så var det en bra dator Tidiga C++-kompilatorer En tidig GPU Saker som ser bra ut på effektiva sätt Hur ser ett nyckelben ut i tre dimensioner? En plugin för alla webbläsare Fortfarande stor och skarp VR känns kul just nu

FRIENDS AND ENEMIES Welcome to another recording of The Canadian Bitcoiners Podcast. Sponsored by EasyDNS! All of your web hosting, GPG email, VPS hosting (for your Bitcoin Node, BTCPay Server or Nostr Relay) and more. Use code "CBPMedia" for a juicy discount! Sponsored by Bull Bitcoin! The CBP recommends Bull Bitcoin for all your BTC needs. With their new kyc-free options, there's never been a quicker, simpler, more private and (most importantly) cheaper way to acquire private Bitcoin. Use the link above (mission.bullbitcoin.com/cbp) for $20 on your first buy, and take advantage of all Bull Bitcoin has to offer. This week we welcome Joseph Barbuto, economic historian and forecaster, and proponent of The Economic Longwave Theory. We discuss the key elements of Longwave, some of the signposts we've seen, key reasons for inflating Canadian housing, testosterone replacement therapy, and much more. We thank Joseph for his time, and very much look forward to having him back on The CBP. As always, leave us some feedback on Apple Podcasts - your ratings and reviews help the show grow - or reach out to Joey and Len on Twitter, leave us a note on our Reddit posts, or drop a comment on our YouTube channel. We appreciate all the support and feedback, and hope you'll come back for more! Join our Discord group for more CBP and a great community! --- Send in a voice message: https://podcasters.spotify.com/pod/show/canadian-bitcoiners/message

FRIENDS AND ENEMIES Welcome to another recording of The Canadian Bitcoiners Podcast. Sponsored by EasyDNS! All of your web hosting, GPG email, VPS hosting (for your Bitcoin Node, BTCPay Server or Nostr Relay) and more. Use code "CBPMedia" for a juicy discount! Sponsored by Bull Bitcoin! The CBP recommends Bull Bitcoin for all your BTC needs. With their new kyc-free options, there's never been a quicker, simpler, more private and (most importantly) cheaper way to acquire private Bitcoin. Use the link above (mission.bullbitcoin.com/cbp) for $20 on your first buy, and take advantage of all Bull Bitcoin has to offer. This week we welcome Ryan MacLeod, @NuclearBitcoinr, for a discussion on nuclear energy, Bitcoin and more. As always, leave us some feedback on Apple Podcasts - your ratings and reviews help the show grow - or reach out to Joey and Len on Twitter, leave us a note on our Reddit posts, or drop a comment on our YouTube channel. We appreciate all the support and feedback, and hope you'll come back for more! --- Send in a voice message: https://podcasters.spotify.com/pod/show/canadian-bitcoiners/message

Today's episode is a little special, in that it features four amazing insights from four outstanding CMOs and VPs of Marketing. Allison MacLeod, CMO of Flywire, shares why CMOs need to think like CROs. Juliette Kopecky, CMO of LinkSquares, outlines what marketers can gain from sitting in on sales calls. Scott Neuman, Vice President of The post What 4 marketing leaders think about setting revenue goals, storytelling, & new tactics appeared first on WebMechanix.

Ohan Oda works at Google on an AR feature in Google Maps called Live View that he was showing off during the demo session at the XR Access Symposium. It adds some screenreader support for geospatial browsing where users can search for nearby landmarks and businesses, and Oda wanted to get some feedback and raise awareness for these accessibility features in Google Maps. I had a chance to catch up with Oda where he elaborated on how his team's finding that most sighted users were not returning to some of the Google Maps features that had implemented the Virtual Positioning System (VPS) technologies. VPS extrapolate features from Google Streetmaps and translate it into an AR feature via computer vision that serves as a more precise version of GPS. They found internally that it was blind and low-vision users who were returning to these features more frequently because they were using them as an essential assistive technology whereas it was less useful for sighted users who could use other landmarks and street crossings as a way to orient. Oda is wanting to lean more into the accessibility use cases of these XR features in order to be a technological driver of innovation with AR. He speaks about the default utilitarian design approach of developing new features to address the largest potential target audience, which means has meant that accessibility functionality has traditionally been deprioritized by management. He wanted to show off these features to the XR Access community, and give a heads up that these features may be coming soon. The features still have to work their way through the beta testing process before being deployed, and he's hoping that applying these universal design principles to these XR features in phone-based AR will create new assistive technology use cases that drive more feature development in the future. This is a listener-supported podcast through the Voices of VR Patreon. Music: Fatality

FRIENDS AND ENEMIES Welcome to another recording of The Canadian Bitcoiners Podcast. Sponsored by EasyDNS! All of your web hosting, GPG email, VPS hosting (for your Bitcoin Node, BTCPay Server or Nostr Relay) and more. Use code "CBPMedia" for a juicy discount! Sponsored by Bull Bitcoin! The CBP recommends Bull Bitcoin for all your BTC needs. With their new kyc-free options, there's never been a quicker, simpler, more private and (most importantly) cheaper way to acquire private Bitcoin. Use the link above (mission.bullbitcoin.com/cbp) for $20 on your first buy, and take advantage of all Bull Bitcoin has to offer. This week we welcome Ivan Makedonski, Chief of Staff for Breez, for a wide ranging discussion on Lightning economics, the future of payments, and much more. As always, leave us some feedback on Apple Podcasts - your ratings and reviews help the show grow - or reach out to Joey and Len on Twitter, leave us a note on our Reddit posts, or drop a comment on our YouTube channel. We appreciate all the support and feedback, and hope you'll come back for more! --- Send in a voice message: https://podcasters.spotify.com/pod/show/canadian-bitcoiners/message

FRIENDS AND ENEMIES Welcome to another recording of The Canadian Bitcoiners Podcast. Sponsored by EasyDNS! All of your web hosting, GPG email, VPS hosting (for your Bitcoin Node, BTCPay Server or Nostr Relay) and more. Use code "CBPMedia" for a juicy discount! Sponsored by Bull Bitcoin! The CBP recommends Bull Bitcoin for all your BTC needs. With their new kyc-free options, there's never been a quicker, simpler, more private and (most importantly) cheaper way to acquire private Bitcoin. Use the link above for $20 on your first buy, and take advantage of all Bull Bitcoin has to offer. This week: Larry Fink's About-Face Kids Stealing Millions Ledger Forces The Recover Update KuCoin Shotgun KYC Binance and BUSD Wobbling BRICS, USD, Failure to Launch One Trillion in 34 Days And much more As always, leave us some feedback on Apple Podcasts - your ratings and reviews help the show grow - or reach out to Joey and Len on Twitter, leave us a note on our Reddit posts, or drop a comment on our YouTube channel. We appreciate all the support and feedback, and hope you'll come back for more! --- Send in a voice message: https://podcasters.spotify.com/pod/show/canadian-bitcoiners/message

This week, with Bob Cotton, we get an insight into what it takes to be a Technology Executive Coach. After having been involved in running implementation projects in various parts of the world, Bob decided to branch on his own and help the CIOs and VPs of IT into their day-to-day decision making and strategy.In this episode, you can learn lessons from the career path of a consultant who has been both a tech leader as an employee and as an independent consultant!#consultinglifestyle #consulting #technologyleadership #leadership #executivecoaching #cioadvisory #cio #uk #us #multicultural #coaching #coach Support the showTo get in touch with Diogene Ntirandekura, the host of the show: Linkedin Profile community page for coaching Instagram profile

Ett somrigt prylsnack. Kristoffer frågar om Fredriks mikrofon, Fredrik frågar om Kristoffers alla tangentbord (och blir sugen på fler), och så diskuteras Apples Vision pro trots att Kristoffer inte vet om han vill prata om det. Visst vore det fint om vi byggde saker som behövde färre resurser för att göra samma sak? Som Apples datorer med M-kretsar. Fredrik är mer positiv och tror det kan bli något, även om det är massor av resurser för att öppna sitt Excelark på ett nytt sätt. Microsofts hetsiga sätt kan få vad som helst att bli töntigt. Fredrik har fixat med Obsidian på telefonen. Obsidian är orimligt klockrent för vad det gör. Olika muskelminne för olika tangentbord. Kristoffer har skaffat fler och mindre tangentbord och fascineras av hur han fritt kan växla layout på vissa tangentbord, men bara en layout på andra. Det är spännande med hjärnplasticitet. Vad skulle Kristoffer göra om han designade sitt helt eget tangentbord? Ett stort tack till Cloudnet som sponsrar vår VPS! Har du kommentarer, frågor eller tips? Vi är @kodsnack, @tobiashieta, @oferlund, och @bjoreman på Twitter, har en sida på Facebook och epostas på info@kodsnack.se om du vill skriva längre. Vi läser allt som skickas. Gillar du Kodsnack får du hemskt gärna recensera oss i iTunes! Du kan också stödja podden genom att ge oss en kaffe (eller två!) på Ko-fi, eller handla något i vår butik. Länkar Shure SM 7 B Thomann Shure SM 57 Shure beta 87A Marco Arments mikrofonlista Focusrite Vocaster two - Fredriks ljudgränssnitt Six colors om Vocaster two Audient ID14 MKII - Kristoffers ljudgränssnitt Audio hijack Hololens Vision pro Snow crash Obsidian Dataview Obsidians inställningar och teman är kopplade till valvet - Fredriks inställningar nollställdes för att han satte upp ett nytt valv på iCloud drive Maestral Öppna buggar i Maestral Paste URL into selection Obsidians publiceringsfunktion Imac G3 Imac G4 Kuben Dana Sibera skapade bilder på hårdvara som aldrig fanns En annan sammanställning av Siberas hårdvaruskapelser ZSA - som gör Ergodox-EZ och Moonlander Intervjun med Kristoffer om hans arbetsverktyg Preonic Ferris sweep Hands down-layouten Beekeeb Chocofi wireless Corne Totem, av GEIST DASBOB Keezyboost40 - med stor LCD Kailh choch sunset 42keebs.eu Ramaworks M50-A Waterfowl Sofle Kyria Dygma defy Dygma raise Microdox bud - tangentbordet som såg ut “lite som ett splittat Planck” med aluminiumcase Cantor Piantor QMK Home row mods Titlar Smör i örat Bluetootha till trummorna Följ med mig till guidekabelns slut Jag är så väldigt ointresserad Mer datorkraft än någonsin Mindre resurser till att göra samma sak En idé om att saker ska bli bättre Jag kan öppna mitt Excelark nu Saker som är gjorda av trä och metall En dröm om något bättre Jag har inte den drömmen Claes Hemsworth Orimligt klockrent Där kan jag bara skriva hands down Utanför EU och handbyggt Rita sin egen PCB Bara skift på tummen Jag vill ha färre tangenter

EPISODE 101 - Overclocking has made it's way to our play area so we look at what Overclock hacking is, what VPS, how to find Overclockable portals and how NOT to do an overclock - because I just suck at glyph hacking and now I also suck at Overclocking as well. Show Links Developer Facing Map - https://storage.googleapis.com/lightship-maps-staging/developer-portal/index.htmlhttps://storage.googleapis.com/lightship-maps-staging/developer-portal/index.html Prime Tips Webpage - https://podcasters.spotify.com/pod/show/prime-tips Prime Tips YouTube Channel - http://bit.ly/PrimeTipsVideoBecome a Prime Tips Supporter - http://bit.ly/PrimeTipsSupportSubmit a Tip or Make a Request  - http://bit.ly/PrimeTip and we will make sure to make you famous if we use your tip.To subscribe to Prime Tips find us on Itunes, Spotify, iHeart Radio or wherever you get your podcasts. --- Send in a voice message: https://podcasters.spotify.com/pod/show/prime-tips/message

FRIENDS AND ENEMIES Welcome to another recording of The Canadian Bitcoiners Podcast. Sponsored by EasyDNS! All of your web hosting, GPG email, VPS hosting (for your Bitcoin Node, BTCPay Server or Nostr Relay) and more. Use code "CBPMedia" for a juicy discount! Sponsored by Bull Bitcoin! The CBP recommends Bull Bitcoin for all your BTC needs. With their new kyc-free options, there's never been a quicker, simpler, more private and (most importantly) cheaper way to acquire private Bitcoin. Use the link above (mission.bullbitcoin.com/cbp) for $20 on your first buy, and take advantage of all Bull Bitcoin has to offer. This week we welcome Drew Armstrong, President and COO of Cathedra Bitcoin (TSXV: $CBIT) for a discussion on the wild 18 months that was, the vertically integrated miner, the importance of innovation, and the male urge to conquer. We thank Drew for his time, and will absolutely have him back in the future. As always, leave us some feedback on Apple Podcasts - your ratings and reviews help the show grow - or reach out to Joey and Len on Twitter, leave us a note on our Reddit posts, or drop a comment on our YouTube channel. We appreciate all the support and feedback, and hope you'll come back for more! --- Send in a voice message: https://podcasters.spotify.com/pod/show/canadian-bitcoiners/message

Description: This SHINE podcast interview is with my friend, colleague, and Chief People Officer Siminia Simion.  In this interview, Siminia and I speak about a few very important themes. First we speak about how we can increase our conscious “inner game” skills to be skillful in asking for what we desire and negotiate anything.  We talk about how we can embody skills of empathy and humility to be compassionate leaders during hiring and layoffs.  I use a powerful coaching framework to guide Siminia in how to ask for more in a future negotiation.  Lastly, we share important topics of what you can negotiate for in the initial interview and offer stages of a professional role. This inspiring episode will empower you to own your worth, identify and ask for the tangible and intangible needs you deserve.  Episode Links: Simina Simion Ask for More Book by Alexandra Carter How to Ask for a Raise SHINE Links: Thank you for listening. Want to build a high trust, innovative, and inclusive culture at work? Sign up for our newsletter and get the free handout and be alerted to more inspiring Shine episodes  Building Trust Free Gift Carley Links: LinkedIn Consultation Call with Carley Book Carley for Speaking Leading from Wholeness Learning & Developmen Carley's Book  Executive Coaching with Carley   Well Being Resources:  Inner Game Meditations Inner Game Leadership Assessment   Social:  LinkedIn  Instagram Website  Shine Podcast Page    Imperfect Shownotes Hi, welcome to the shine podcast. My name is Carley Hauck. I'm your host, this is the fifth season of the shine podcast. I started the shine podcast as a way of doing research for my book on conscious leadership in business. And you will find interviews with scientists, researchers and business leaders on the intersection of conscious inclusive leadership, the recipe for high performing teams and awareness practices. My book debuted in 2021 Shine ignite your inner game of conscious leadership and was voted one of the best books to read in 2022. By mindful magazine, I facilitate two episodes a month of the shine podcast.    And before I tell you about the topic for today, please go over to Apple podcasts or your favorite podcast carrier and hit the subscribe button so you don't miss any future episodes. The focus of this season is on the essentials for wellbeing. And that encompasses the intersection of our personal well being the collective well being of our workplace, and how that fosters and nurtures the planet's well being they are all connected. I focus on well being this season, because I really want to crack the code and inspire folks to prioritize their individual well being and therefore that will transcend into the collective and the planet's well being.    And I have developed a inner game leadership assessment that I gave out to 100 different leaders last year. And the leadership assessment is based on the framework of the inner game, which is what we're cultivating on the inside to be conscious leaders. And it shows up on the outside when we cultivated the certain qualities. And two of the nine leadership competencies that were lowest from the sample of 100 leaders were psychological and physical well being. Therefore, that is why we are focusing on well being and if you're curious about where your strengths and gaps are, around the qualities to become a conscious leader, you can take the assessment and find out your score for free. I recently opened to the assessment tool to the public and the link will be in the show notes.    Now on to our episode. I am so excited to have this conversation about how to ask for more. And really wonderful practical tips for negotiation. Samina. Thank you so much for being here. Arlie thank you so much for having me. I'm excited to chat with you today. Well introduce yourself to all of these wonderful listeners.   So my name is Amina I, I am a mom, I'm a wife. I am a people leader in the tech world. And I'm also an immigrant. And I came to this country about 13 years ago with big dreams and a passion to add value. And here I am today hopefully being hopeful that I've learned a lot and I grew a lot as a person and as a leader.   Thank you and what country did you emigrate from?   I was born in Romania.   Mm hmm. Lovely. Well, we connected because of the people tech Partners Group that I have been kind of Yeah, just immersed in the last year so many incredible people leaders in that group. And then I also found out that you were good friends with an pal who is another shining light leader in my life. So I'm again just really happy that we've been able to foster this new connection and relationship and I am going to just tee up the podcast a bit so folks know what we're going to be talking about.    So Samina and I are going to speak about some of her inner game conscious leadership qualities that have supported her to be the incredible chief people officer that she is. And we're going to talk a little bit more about what has been challenging for her as a CPO, especially given the current economy and the future of work climate. And then we're going to run through a negotiation conversation, that will be me being the coach. It's one of the wonderful hats that I wear. And then really working through a framework that is going to be something that you can apply to yourself, or to support somebody else as they're trying to figure out their negotiation terms for a new role. Or frankly, it could even be how do you negotiate buying a new house or car or a conversation with your partner? I mean, it's all clickable.    And then we're going to talk about what kinds of things can we negotiate for with roles at the beginning and even you know, when the offer has been given? And specifically, what should female executives be asking for Samina is also going to share some tips. And then at the very end, I will record this coaching framework that Sumeet and I are going to roleplay together so it's packed, it's going to be so great. And let's go ahead and start. So the intersection of this podcast really talks about conscious leadership, high performing teams awareness practices, Samina, I know you're a bit familiar with the framework of conscious leadership that I've developed, there's nine different qualities. And you have read my book. So what leadership quality do you feel is your strongest and which one is an opportunity for growth?   Great question. And I feel that resilience is one of my strongest qualities. And probably the second after that is empathy. And the third is humility. But I'll talk about resilience a little bit more. Yeah, it started from, you know, early age, when I realized that I needed to be courageous in order to grow. And I took a few steps, including the one to relocate into a completely new country and start from scratch my career, my community, and realized very early on, that is not always a smooth sailing. And you're going to experience turbulences, and I'm a big fan of Brene, brown, and I like to, to share this point of view with folks that I'm coaching and folks that I work with, you're not going to experience growth, if you're afraid of embracing the suck. And in order to experience that growth, it's it's worth knowing when it's too early, to move away from a situation. I'm a big believer, especially as a female executive, that there are different rules around when executives are departing, departing a company and a role. Ideally, you're never running away, when it's hard. Ideally, you, you stick to it, and you try to solve the problems that you're seeing in front of you and continue to add your value in terms. In times of turbulence, I think that's one of my main qualities. And the thing that helped me experience the most growth in my career, you're probably seen by looking at my profile that I like staying for a long period of time, especially in tech that rarely, a lot of people are staying for five, six years, I've experienced that at least once and experienced a couple of three years Steens in you, especially at a startup, you see a lot of changes. And those are great opportunities to learn and understand how a business is evolving and how you are evolving as a leader.    So that I would say that that's probably my my, my main superpower. And the second one that I care deeply about as a people leader and as a leader, as an as a leader in general is empathy is really trying to understand how others are feeling and what is their perspective, to be able to craft programs, Paulus's interventions that make sense, and they don't feel disconnected from the reality. The third one that I think it's a non negotiable, it's humility. It's it's humbleness, and humility. Knowing that you can do it all you it really takes a village to build something exceptional.    And you need to have the strength and self awareness to realize that you cannot be good at everything. And it's okay and highly recommended to hire and build teams around you with people who have the qualities that you don't or they're passionate about the things that you might be passionate but you might not have the superpowers to do them really, really well.    And that's what I've no Based on how I conduct myself and how I how I like to continue my path as a leader, thank you. To summarize, even though you did it so well yourself, out of the nine different ones, you have listed resilience, which the way you're describing it. And the way that I actually talked about in the book is a growth mindset. You know, how is this challenge for me? How is it a gift, what am I going to learn from it, and then empathy and humility and humility to your point is really about asking for support, you know, acknowledging your vulnerability that you don't know everything, and then asking people to come in and join you and, and help delegate those things that you don't know, so that you empower other people to step in and create this incredible culture. Thank you.   What about one that is an opportunity for growth, right now, I've thought about this for quite some time, and an opportunity for growth is carving out time, for my well being, there is a tendency to constantly prove the world that you can do more faster, better, smarter, but what I've learned on my own by experiencing, you know, sometimes challenging times is that if you don't recharge your batteries, you're not gonna go too far, I have a tendency to jump all in. And I had a tendency to really want to see results immediately prove value, as soon as possible. But what I've learned through hard lessons is that you can't control it all.    And even if you dedicate yourself 150%, to something, there are so many variables at play, there is no guarantee that just by working hard and doing all the right things, and being always on something that's gonna be successful. As we evolve and grow as human beings, our identity is becoming a well rounded identity, you're not only the professional who works in tech, you're the man who you know, educates and takes care of other human being and how they're going to behave in this world, you're a partner to someone you are a daughter, into someone, a member of the community, there are so many opportunities to give back and add value, the way you see yourself and define yourself should not come only from one angle.    So with that in mind, while I will always want to excel in what I do, I'm also becoming more and more aware of the multiple roles that I'm assuming in this world and how I'm showing up in all of them. Because it has to be a balance, it has to be a work life integration, it has to be moments when you give more on one side, and when you give more on the other side, depending on what's happening in life. And that's what I'm trying to transition into and feel good about the fact that you're not always going to be your best self or on your best foot on on your top game, depending on what's happening in life. And that's okay.   I hear you are nourishing the well. So that you have what you need to then bring your best is a growth opportunity. And so that actually goes into the next question that I was going to ask that I know you and I have talked about, you know, off the record, which is one of the bigger challenges I think that people like yourself in your role have been navigating with the current economy and future of work is there have been a lot of layoffs. And so, being that you're a leader that leads from love that has a lot of empathy.    How have you navigated in your career, how to really send people off with care and compassion, because I've talked to lots of folks and leaders and people that have been the ones that have, you know, delivered it and have been on the receiving end, and it's typically not done with a lot of consciousness, but I know that you do it differently. So share a little more on that. How are you taking care of yourself and then being able to take care of these people in the most graceful kind way that you can under the circumstances, right?    Yeah, no, and I'll start with the beginning. As a leader, you always join the company thinking about how the company is going to grow, how to build the businesses gonna succeed, how the great people you have on board are going to grow in their careers and grow as as professionals and as human beings and Then something happens. And it, especially in the last few months, or in the last few years, if we think about the pandemic, where things are not going, according to the plan, no matter how hard everyone is trying, the economy is turbulent there are headwinds in the market. And sometimes you need to make very hard decisions.    And some of those hard decisions involve cutting people cutting jobs. And throughout my career, and I've been doing HR for more than 15 years internationally. In Europe, in the US, I work with companies based in in Asia, I found that no matter how much exposure to situations like this, you have as a people leader, if you lead from a point of love, and care and empathy, it's going to be very hard to not be emotionally impacted by something like this. I remember the first layoff that I had to do in the US it's happening, at least in my career, it happened more often after I relocated to the US, and I started to be a people leader. And I remember thinking about how these people have houses, they need to pay for the houses, they have children, they have family members, they need to take care of, they need to put food on the food on the table, they need to pay their bills, and I was thinking, wow, losing your job is one of the most dramatic, traumatic experiences someone can have.    And the fact that the company is not growing fast enough, or it doesn't optimize stores profitability fast enough, or it needs to look better on paper for whatever is going to happen next, it doesn't make the impact of these decisions, less stressful for the people on the receiving end. So as a people leader, I've always thought about if I would be in these people's shoes, and by the way it can happen at any point in anyone's careers, what would be my preference in how I would like to be treated? What will mean to me that I'm being laid off with respect, where I still keep at least some of my self esteem, that I've built throughout the years in my career, in what will help me land in the best possible way on my feet, right?    And I thought about it. And I talked to people that was questions, who were let go senior professionals, folks in the beginning of their careers. And I looked at the data on how much savings people have in the US if something like this happens. And the reality is that not a lot of people have a lot of savings to count on. And I really try to think about a couple of things, one, from an economical perspective, what is a decent package that's going to help people land on their feet, given that it takes between three to five months to find a job.    Yet, it seems like in Dec is around three months, even now with distributed market, because a lot of new jobs are being created. So that's one variable that went into the model. The second one was one, the economical terms are being approved. And there is some, you know, safety net for at least two or three months, and there is health insurance on the table as well. Because unfortunately, America is a country that does not offer that by default, and you have to pay for it. And it's quite expensive. Then I went into how do we communicate? How do we communicate with care with empathy? How do we make sure that everyone feels that they're still respected on their way out, even though we need to share some pretty terrible news?    How can we make sure we partner with the employees who are being terminated to equip them with the skills that they need to apply for unemployment to revamp their resumes to prep for the interview, it's really hard to have your confidence that after being laid off, and we're talking in this market about multiple rounds of layoffs, I have friends and people who are very close to me and my family who got laid off multiple times, once in COVID, one or two times now, that takes a toll on self esteem, how you're showing up in the world. Let's not even go to negotiating an offer you're hoping to get over all you can even think about asking for more optimizing for the best possible result. Totally.    I'm always thinking about one, give them the package that it's going to provide a softer landing, landing to make sure they have health insurance. Three, make sure you communicate with empathy and care for prep them for what they need to do ideally in the first week or month after a layoff make sure people are equipped on how to get their benefits back on employment, how to claim Cobra and then really help rebuild that confidence by looking at the resumes the LinkedIn profile, practicing interviewing, introduced introducing people of two companies looking for great talent so that everyone can, as quickly as possible get back on their feet. It's a traumatic experience. And if as leaders, we don't do it with a lot of care, it's going to backfire. And it's not going to help one the company is not going to help the brand is not going to help help the leaders attract new team members, when when the market gets better, is not going to help the society in general,   To bring myself into the mix of this, I started interviewing and applying for internal director and VP roles and learning and development in 2020. And it is now 2023, there were two offers and 2020. They were rescinded because of layoffs. So for me being that I'm still in it, still interviewing, still applying some of what I've experienced is that there are 1000 people to the one role that I'm applying for, I had a job tell me an employer rather tell me that they had 4000 plus 4000 people applied to the role that I applied for.    And so, you know, depending on your industry, because there's not a lot of learning and development people even though they are so we need to equip leaders with the right tools to lead the organization. But it, it's trying, so I, you know, I can definitely relate, and I think some of your tips are really helpful. So let's move into our negotiation conversation. Let's pretend that you are getting ready to have a conversation because you've been given an offer. And I'm going to wear the hat of coach and this is a framework that you can apply to any negotiation that you're having. But I'm just gonna tee it up. So Samina, it's so great to see you. I'm so excited for you that you have this new offer that you're considering. And tell me a little bit about the context, what is the offer? What do you feel excited about? And then we'll go from there.   I'm very excited about the offer that I just received, because it's for a company that solves hard problems. I see the signs of really healthy culture. It seems that a company is financially stable, especially in this market, and they have enough runway. And it feels like there is product market fit and the company can continue to grow.    If if they execute according to the plan. So that excites me quite a bit because that means we can create more jobs, we can really scale or what we're offering to the market here in the US, potentially internationally. It's really creating the foundation for building something that is intentional, and it can scale intentionally, and really create that force multiplier in delivering business results. So that's what excites me. I'm also excited about the terms of the offer.   Let me let me just paraphrase quickly what I heard you say. So I hear that you're very excited about this offer for a few reasons. One, it's a company that is solving hard problems. And I hear that that is really motivating for you you want to work for a purpose driven organization, I also hear that there is a healthy culture on the inside. So the leaders that are leading it are conscious, and you want to work with that type of leadership, and be able to really contribute. I also hear that they have a runway that allows them to be able to be secure, you know, financially stable in this economy in this market. And therefore you can scale intentionally did I miss anything you did not spot on.   And you were about to elaborate a little bit more something else you feel excited about tell me and I feel excited about the economics of the offer because I find them being fair. And I'm saying fair for a reason. I care deeply about fair. Of course I care about optimizing a really good offer and really good terms but as a people leader, I'm also keeping an eye on internal equity among peers, making sure that you know while is the right type of offer for the valid right I bring it also that doesn't, you know break the stability internally because that's that's another problem then that can be created and It's pretty painful to solve for once it's there.    So I'm looking at a lot of the things and while you know the monetary aspect is important, and don't get me wrong is very important. And life is expensive right now, there are other elements of an offer that make it an absolute no brainer.  What I'm hearing is there's tangible needs, and there's intangible needs that would make this a yes. Like an absolute Yes. So what do you need that's tangible? And what do you need? It's intangible.   I think from a tangible perspective, you need to make sure that you're fairly compensated, you're compensated at the market. And now here, hopefully, it's going to be an easier conversation in the next few years, because of the pay Transparency Act. Really good progress, really good momentum is not a black box anymore. When you start applying and interviewing with companies, you kind of know, you know, where they are, what are the bands, so you know, is it for me, or if it's, or it's not, for me, for example, if you're in California, and you interview for a leadership role, and they pay you 100k, you're probably going to say this is not for me, I cannot afford to leave here, right? So that that simplifies the conversation quite a bit.    Now, every company is different, every company has a different philosophy in terms of pay, some companies are going to pay your 50th percentile, others are going to pay your 75th percentile, others are going to be more aggressive on the variable, others on the on the base, it different flavors, right. But at the end of the day, if it's fair, if it's market for the role, how much funding they have, if they're a private company, how much ARR they have done all of that, you kind of know where you are, and what ballpark.    Now the non tangible things are very important when it comes to the new reality after COVID. What kind of life do we want to have as people and as professionals? What is more valuable to me? Or what is the environment that really works for my life? And how I want to craft my life? Am I an in person, type of professional or I'm a remote type of professional? Do I value to have flexibility? Or do I value routine and being in the office every single day? Because that's the environment that that I'm thriving in? And that's how I build connections, and there is no right or wrong answer. I don't believe in one size fits all, I don't believe that only remote is the way to go. And I also don't believe that only in office is the way to go. I think there are different situations, different businesses, and particularities that are helping leaders make the decision if it's in office, or if it's hybrid, or if it's remote, right. But a lot of candidates have preferences.    And they've done it both ways. And people feel strongly about it still did seems like the opportunities are not as many as they used to be for the remote roles. And a lot of the companies are starting to bring people back to in office five days a week or hybrid. But if you ask in your negotiation come conversation about remote like how would you ask that very openly?   What is the what is the culture at Company X? What is the expectation right now? Do we have what is the policy? Right?   Do we think the policy is gonna change if it's going to change? Is there a framework in which the leadership is going to make the decision for example, I remember when we started COVID, at one of my previous companies, and I told people and I promise, I'm not going to promise the model is not going to change, I can't promise that I don't know how the world is going to evolve. I don't know what's going to be needed from a business perspective. But what I can promise is that I'm not going to surprise people with two weeks notice that up starting two weeks from now, we're going to be back in the office.    And I promised all the invoices that we're going to give them and each other a six month heads up to be able to adjust and change our lives accordingly to either adjust to the new reality that we are trying to create or to vote with our feet and say, this is probably not the right fit for me and where I am in life today. Therefore, it's probably better for me to depart the business.   Yeah, totally. I'm going to ask you two more coaching questions. And I know that this is probably going to be something we'll continue to talk about and something that I'd love for you to even journal about. But we're getting clear on what are the tangible what are the intangible needs? And then I want to ask, what is your concern? What What concerns do you have about this role? And then lastly, like what would make this an absolute yes for you? Should I start with the concerns? Yeah, let's go there.   Ah, Mmm hmm. That's such an interesting question. It really depends on the company and the stage of the company. So it's really hard to, to answer it without having a clear example in front of me, right? Talking about hypothetical businesses. But the examples are mostly around the opportunity in front of you, as a leader in front of me as a leader, in what skills are needed to nail that stage of growth, or turbulences, or whatever is happening in the company, I would be very interested in what is the next stage of growth after the current one? And do I have the potential to grow and scale with the company because I have a clear idea in my mind that I'm open to be challenged by other leaders in the industry that executives are a great fit for a particular stage of growth.    And after that, it needs to, you know, a little bit of a self assessment needs to happen to really ask yourself, am I the right leader for the next stage of growth in this company or not? And that takes a lot of courage and self awareness, to be able to, and humility to be able to have that conversation with yourself. But every time I'm looking at an opportunity I'm looking at, can I get can I grow and scale with the business? What if they grow really fast? Why did they grow Not so fast, and they experienced a lot of turbulence is how much resilience? Do I need to show? And at what point and right like, How much am I willing to be in that turbulent time? How long is it going to be right? I think that goes back to the psychological and physical well being the balance of it all. What are you saying? Yes, yes, exactly.   Exactly. And that's a good, that's a good internal conversation to have with yourself as a candidate, to really run towards something and not to run away from something. Yeah, I'm a big believer in when someone starts a new role, when you're looking at the non tangibles, and obviously, the tangibles as well. At the end of the day, to feel really good about the opportunity and to know deep down inside your soul that you're running towards something. Because if you're running towards something, no matter how hard it is, no matter how many turbulences you're going to experience, no matter how good of a fit, you are for the next three stages of growth, and maybe you're great for one or two, and you need to fire yourself before stage three, because the company needs a different type of leadership, you're going to do it with a lot more passion, if you don't find those connections.    And at the end of the day, being passionate about something, it's probably one of the strongest predictors. I've seen in my in my entire career journey. Now what can break a decision or what will make a decision a no brainer in someone in my role in my shoes, or in your shoes, it comes back to the chemistry between the leadership team or between you and your manager. There are so many flavors of the ice cream at this level, especially when it comes to leadership roles in everybody. All a lot of people got to leadership roles, because they've done great work in their careers. They accomplished a lot. They worked hard, they worked hard. I don't think at this level, it comes a lot to do you have the skills to do it. It's about how you do it. How do you how do you invite the other partners to your table so that you can make progress together? Influence and collaborate? I hear?    Yeah, I think it comes down to that. And it comes down to that chemistry between the people working together. So it sounds like you're getting really clear on the tangible and the intangible. And then also what I'm hearing is, what would make this a total? Yes, is the chemistry of the other leaders. So they're dating. Both ways. And in order to be ready to marry someone, both sides need to do their due date a few years.   Yes, but both sides need to do their due diligence and to make sure that why the moral compass of the other party to how they operate best when they are best on or when they are not at best. And you know, what kind of master sometimes shows up if they're stressed or under resource or you know, all sorts of things that can happen in organizations. Probably that's the most important factor that I'm taking into into consideration when saying yes, and going to the altar with with a new company.   Yeah, yeah. Thank you for sharing all of that. So in the last couple of minutes and I'll I'll share this framework of some of these questions that I asked semina at the end. So you want to listen all the way to the end. So you get those questions you can actually ask yourself, or you can ask another person that is also negotiating something important in their life. But what are some tips that you might give to anyone listening but especially to female executives? What can they start to negotiate in the initial interview stages?  And what can they negotiate that you would recommend? You know, during the offer,  and the early interview stages, I would clarify the tangibles. I would make sure I get as much clarity as I as I can around those aspects in the late stage of an interview the offer stage, I think it's time the industry to normalize the fact that executives meaning VPs and above should have some protection in place, right. We've seen rounds and rounds of layoffs. We've seen consolidations, we've seen a lot of headwinds, and turbulence is happening in the market. And it's still not common to see severance clauses as part of the all of the executive contracts.   Well, I live in California. And I don't know if this applies to executives, but California is an at will state. So they can they can let you go for any reason, even if you didn't do anything wrong. So that doesn't create a lot of security in me as someone that really wants to get married. If you want to be a prenup, yes. And also, if you want to be the executive who's gonna mention the unmentionable in the room who's gonna have the crucial conversation? So it's gonna challenge the status quo. You can't really have those if you're thinking well, do I have money to put food on the table for my kids? Do I have money to pay my mortgage or my rent, when I'm thinking about getting married with someone meaning in this case, starting a new job as a leader, there is a lot of risk on both sides, right?    The companies want to get it right. You want your leadership team, ideally, to encompass your core values to model the right behaviors to really drive the business forward. As a leader, you want to make sure that you're not going to be micromanage, you're gonna be respected for your opinion, and the expertise that you're bringing to the table, you also want to be able to challenge the status quo nicely, you're gonna require psychological safety, it's not just a check in the box, that's one of the very first things that I assess, and you got to build at the beginning. Totally.   So when you want to have psychological safety, but also move the needle forward, challenge the status quo, I find it hard to be able to address it and addressable. When you're thinking about, well, do I have money to provide food for my family to pay for the house to take care of the kids are other people you need to take care of as a as a as a human being, when that variable is taken care of.    And you know that no matter what happens, you're going to have a little bit of a softer landing, because it takes about six months on average to find your net next executive gig, the psychological safety that that relationship, and that pre negotiated contract creates for VPS. And above. It really benefits really beneficial for both parties involved in this, of course, the company is going to protect itself in a similar way. You you know you're going to assess performance, you're going to have OKRs, you're going to measure it if people are not hitting the goals, obviously, you're going to make the hard choices, and you're going to let people go but a found that it's easier to build that psychological safety. If there is clarity around if this doesn't work out. What are what are both parties getting out.   Right? What's Yeah, totally. What is our agreement? What is our agreement, having those hard conversations up front are so important. So that's what I'm hearing is a really big takeaway. That's what you can start to have in the interview process, like you're assessing for that. You know, what happens when things get messy? is psychological safety a check in the box or not? Can we have these hard conversations and people still want to be kind and collaborate? And then what are our agreements when things get messy, you know, which isn't doubtedly going to happen because we can't control so that's kind of what I'm hearing. Go ahead.    There's there's one good example of this work is the negotiation phase before you decide if it's a yes or if it's a no, that's providing a lot of insight into how the future relationship is going to be. How can you work together to solve a challenge and you're coming from On slightly different angles here, you're trying to meet somewhere in between. And are you approaching this? How are you having those crucial conversations without breaking the relationship by a fair fairness is a key value for you.    Yeah. Samina this was so helpful. I imagine it's going to be helpful for so many people not only just talking about how do we support people in layoffs kindly, but also how do we negotiate in a way that is really empowering ourselves and making sure that we're setting ourselves up for success? Thank you so much. And if there's anything else you want to leave our listeners Feel free, we will be linking your contact in the show notes. And if there's anything else you want me to send out, please let me know or share it with folks right now.   The only message I have for for people listening to the podcast is knowing their value and not being afraid to ask for what is fair. And what's their worth. It's doesn't come natural, it doesn't come naturally for if you're a woman in tech, if you're a female executive, if you're a minority, but it's the absolute right thing to do. And there are mentors out there. And I love mentoring people on how to do it gracefully, and change some of the practices in the industry. So thank you so much for having me, I love this conversation. And I hope we can meet again and continue our chat.   I love it, we will. I am loving this conversation.    And as we prepare for this podcast interview to come to a close, I'm going to leave you with three things that will really help you to embody the confidence to ask for what you desire, and what you deserve. And if we don't ask for it, we have no opportunity to receive it to receive it. So I'm going to break this down into three parts.    One, I'm going to lead by example, and make a bold request so that I can receive what I desire and what I'm deserving. And hopefully that will be an inspiration to you.    Number two, I'm going to share the coaching framework that I used with Samina to help her discern what was her negotiating power and and what were her concerns and what did she really want. This is something you can journal about for yourself, or you can utilize it with others to help them in their negotiations. And this can be applied to anything that you're negotiating for.    And then number three, I'm going to share what you can actually negotiate for in the new opportunity and professional path that you are seeking. Alright, you ready? Here we go. So I have had the great privilege and opportunity to serve some wonderful companies, leaders and teams in my business in the last decade. LinkedIn, Pixar, Clif Bar, Asana, capital, one Bank of the West, and then tech adventhealth, I am so grateful. And since 2020, I have known I wanted to join in an internal capacity in directing learning leadership team and org development. And it's been a crazy couple of years in the job market and in the world at large. And I am having some incredible conversations with folks right now exploring the right opportunity. But at the end of the day, it's all about the right fit.    And you might be asking, Why do I want this, I want this because I know that this path is where I can create the most influence and have the deepest positive impact with the internal people in the company and therefore, what the company is actually doing in the world. And I'm here to influence business to be a force for good in the world. So if you're an executive search or in the C suite, or you're working for a company where you just think Carly needs to be here we need Carly we need her wisdom and her passion and her skills. Then reach out to me I would love to know your challenges so I can help you can reach out to me on LinkedIn or you know just ping my website there's there's lots of links in the show notes and how to get in touch. If you also are aware of a role that is coming up that hasn't been posted, and you think you know I could help in a full time or fractional capacity reach out. I would love to help and love to have that conversation.    Number two, let's go over the negotiate Shin coaching framework that I use with Samina. Now, these are things that you can ask yourself, you can journal about, or you can actually roleplay this with another person. So first you want to share the context, what is the role? Or what is the thing that you are negotiating for? And then if you're doing this with another person, you want to summarize what you heard them say, summarizing what you heard them say, not what you think you heard them say, right? This allows people to feel heard and to feel seen. And we all want that. And then after you summarize that, you also want to say, Did I miss anything? And that gives them an A chance to elaborate or clarify, then you want to actually follow up with another question and you ask them, What do you need? What are the tangible and intangible needs?    And it might even be helpful to ask them, what would this look like if you had these needs met? Right? Because then, then the person might even recognize that they didn't need that, or they want something different? And then you would ask them, What are your concerns and asking for more, this is where the fear might come in. Or they recognize that there are parts of this role or parts of this opportunity, that aren't quite aligned. And then you would ask them, okay, so now that you've gotten clear, what's the next step? And as a coach, you always want to hold that person accountable to the next step. So you might say, how do we check in about this next step? Right?    Okay. So that's the coaching framework. And again, this can be applied to yourself, or to someone in your life. And then the next thing that is really going to be helpful for you, if you're exploring a new role is to understand what you can negotiate for in the interview. Ultimately, your satisfaction hinges less on getting the negotiation right and more on getting the job, right. So you want to really understand for who are your teammates? Who's your boss? What's the work life balance look like? How is this going to be a full guest for you?    So here's some things that you can negotiate for. So you want to ask about the remote policy in this company. And you heard Samina and I talked about that, you want to ask about whether there's bonus pay and equity. You want to know if there's matching money. So for example, maybe you've worked in other roles where you are accustomed to a 12% match, what is the match in this iteration? You want to know what the vacation policy is? Is it three to four weeks? Can it be reevaluated after the first week of service? Do you have the option to do any side work? If that's a passion, like maybe you have a podcast that you want to have outside of this scope and responsibility? You might want to ask for that. If you need to be in an office or in the same time zone?    Do they offer relocation pay? If professional development is important to you probably is especially if you're listening to this podcast, then how do they support you in your personal and professional development? What is the stipend for that? Is there a certification that you want or a conference that you'd really love to go to every year? Ask for all of us upfront? What's the health insurance coverage? Ask about travel, if you have to travel for work, whether it's domestically or internationally. We all know travel takes a toll on the body, mind and soul. So perhaps there's a negotiation upfront where you can say if I'm traveling to a different timezone or internationally, Can I tag on a couple of days where I can actually enjoy the city before I have to rush right back? Right?    Find out if there are any partial clauses for times of separation, where it is not your fault for the reason that they're having to let people go as mean and I were talking about earlier in the interview. And then you might also want to ask if there might be a retention bonus after the first year. And one of the questions I also really love to ask is how will I know that I'm being successful in this role, and that's not necessarily negotiation, but it is in a certain sense of what is expected of me in the first month in the first 60 days, 90 days, like really getting clear on that with the hiring manager with the senior people leaders.    The other thing that's a negotiation, qualifier for me is how much sponsorship are you getting from the senior people leaders because that's going to allow you to actually have more influence and be more successful.    Okay, those are some of the things that I think will be really helpful for you in navigating, asking for more. So how are you going to ask for more whether it's at work, or it's at home?  If you enjoyed this episode, please give me a five star review, share it with friends, family or colleagues on LinkedIn. We're all in this together and sharing is caring. I have some incredible interviews coming on in the podcast in 2023. So make sure you subscribe. And thank you so much for tuning in.

FRIENDS AND ENEMIES Welcome to another recording of The Canadian Bitcoiners Podcast. Sponsored by EasyDNS! All of your web hosting, GPG email, VPS hosting (for your Bitcoin Node, BTCPay Server or Nostr Relay) and more. Use code "CBPMedia" for a juicy discount! Sponsored by Bull Bitcoin! The CBP recommends Bull Bitcoin for all your BTC needs. With their new kyc-free options, there's never been a quicker, simpler, more private and (most importantly) cheaper way to acquire private Bitcoin. Use the link above for $20 on your first buy, and take advantage of all Bull Bitcoin has to offer. This week: ETF Dialogue Begins What Becomes of Coinbase Post-ETF Swan/Custody Canadian Rebate Season The Cost of Green Energy France Riots The Environment for Bitcoiners Going Forward And much more As always, leave us some feedback on Apple Podcasts - your ratings and reviews help the show grow - or reach out to Joey and Len on Twitter, leave us a note on our Reddit posts, or drop a comment on our YouTube channel. We appreciate all the support and feedback, and hope you'll come back for more! --- Send in a voice message: https://podcasters.spotify.com/pod/show/canadian-bitcoiners/message

Fredrik hälsar på Carl-Johan Kilhlbom och får lära sig om utvecklingsmetodiken Shape up - en metodik som vill hålla undan för micro management och ge team maximalt med utrymme att fokusera och få bra saker gjorda. Carl-Johan går igenom processen från början till slut, och diskuterar fördelar, utmaningar, och sätt att lösa problem. Riktigt små team - sammansatta efter behov och intresse - jobbar väldigt fritt med avgränsade projekt i sexveckorscykler. En längre cykel betyder inte att man inte itererar inom cykeln - det gör man såklart precis hur mycket man vill. Men, det är teamets sak hur man gör på bästa sätt. Hur skulle det kännas att inte ha någon backlog? Att ha tid att städa och testa nya saker, utan att ha något gammalt hängande efter sig? Och att inte bli avbruten under arbetets gång med en massa uppdykande saker? Shape up kan hjälpa till med allt det! Ett stort tack till Cloudnet som sponsrar vår VPS! Har du kommentarer, frågor eller tips? Vi är @kodsnack, @tobiashieta, @oferlund, och @bjoreman på Twitter, har en sida på Facebook och epostas på info@kodsnack.se om du vill skriva längre. Vi läser allt som skickas. Gillar du Kodsnack får du hemskt gärna recensera oss i iTunes! Du kan också stödja podden genom att ge oss en kaffe (eller två!) på Ko-fi, eller handla något i vår butik. Länkar Carl-Johan Under utveckling - en tidigare podd Fredrik drev Carl-Johan var med i Under utveckling avsnitt 31 Shape up Got.rb Got milk? Got.js Got UX Varvet Planima Nordic Ruby Kodkata 37signals Basecamp Teamtailor Shape up-boken Signal v noise - bloggen Shaping in a nutshell - introduktionsvideo till Shape up Scrum Fixed time, variable scope Mise en place Retrospektiv Titlar En majoritet av konferensen var paus Det stora värdet av en konferens Närbesläktat med Ruby Så långt från micromanagement som möjligt Mandat att fatta beslut Ticket factory Inte samma fälla En riktning för en lösning Inga fasta team Det är alltid ett nytt projekt Det finns ingen projektledare Full autonomi för teamet Bra inblick på en lagom nivå Prata om att lösa saker tillsammans Hitta kärnan En hel liten del av kakan Ta ansvar för produkten En sorts brist på mångfald Aptit på projekt

In this episode, Scott and Ryan discuss the importance of referrals in building an effective sales strategy, including the key components of a referral process and the importance of consistency. They also discuss using AI for sales, with Ryan sharing tips and tactics for implementation. Scott promotes his coaching program, Startup Selling, and encourages listeners to email him for a free consultation. About our Guest:  Ryan Stanley is the Founder and CEO of Whale Boss where he helps Technology Founders grow from $1M-$30M through the principles he used to achieve the same results personally. Ryan Has taught over 800 CROs, VPs, or Leaders his proprietary Enterprise Sales frameworks for startups and companies like Google, Amazon Web Services, Stripe, Salesforce, Uber, etc.   Some of the topics that we covered are:   - AI and chat GPT In sales - Effective ways to ask for referrals  - Examples of how AI is being used by SaaS founders. Links & Resources:    Website: www.ryanstaley.io/ LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ryan-staley/ Podcast:https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-scale-up-show/id1527278610   Thanks so much for listening! Tell a friend or ten about The Startup Selling Show, and please leave a review wherever you're listening to the show.  

FRIENDS AND ENEMIES Welcome to another recording of The Canadian Bitcoiners Podcast. Sponsored by EasyDNS! All of your web hosting, GPG email, VPS hosting (for your Bitcoin Node, BTCPay Server or Nostr Relay) and more. Use code "CBPMedia" for a juicy discount! Sponsored by Bull Bitcoin! The CBP recommends Bull Bitcoin for all your BTC needs. With their new kyc-free options, there's never been a quicker, simpler, more private and (most importantly) cheaper way to acquire private Bitcoin. Use the link above (mission.bullbitcoin.com/cbp) for $20 on your first buy, and take advantage of all Bull Bitcoin has to offer. This week we welcome Natalie Smolenski who makes her CBP debut. Natalie has become an important voice in Bitcoin for her ideas and warnings related to CBDCs, the transition to digital dollars, and more. We thank her for her time, and look forward to having her back. As always, leave us some feedback on Apple Podcasts - your ratings and reviews help the show grow - or reach out to Joey and Len on Twitter, leave us a note on our Reddit posts, or drop a comment on our YouTube channel. We appreciate all the support and feedback, and hope you'll come back for more! --- Send in a voice message: https://podcasters.spotify.com/pod/show/canadian-bitcoiners/message

FRIENDS AND ENEMIES Welcome to another recording of The Canadian Bitcoiners Podcast. Sponsored by EasyDNS! All of your web hosting, GPG email, VPS hosting (for your Bitcoin Node, BTCPay Server or Nostr Relay) and more. Use code "CBPMedia" for a juicy discount! Sponsored by Bull Bitcoin! The CBP recommends Bull Bitcoin for all your BTC needs. With their new kyc-free options, there's never been a quicker, simpler, more private and (most importantly) cheaper way to acquire private Bitcoin. Use the link above (mission.bullbitcoin.com/cbp) for $20 on your first buy, and take advantage of all Bull Bitcoin has to offer. This week we welcome Luke Broyles. Luke is a relatively new Bitcoiner working on a film to help orange pill as many as possible. You can support his work here. We appreciate Luke making time for a late evening rip! As always, leave us some feedback on Apple Podcasts - your ratings and reviews help the show grow - or reach out to Joey and Len on Twitter, leave us a note on our Reddit posts, or drop a comment on our YouTube channel. We appreciate all the support and feedback, and hope you'll come back for more! --- Send in a voice message: https://podcasters.spotify.com/pod/show/canadian-bitcoiners/message

FRIENDS AND ENEMIES Welcome to another recording of The Canadian Bitcoiners Podcast. Sponsored by EasyDNS! All of your web hosting, GPG email, VPS hosting (for your Bitcoin Node, BTCPay Server or Nostr Relay) and more. Use code "CBPMedia" for a juicy discount! Sponsored by Bull Bitcoin! The CBP recommends Bull Bitcoin for all your BTC needs. With their new kyc-free options, there's never been a quicker, simpler, more private and (most importantly) cheaper way to acquire private Bitcoin. Use the link above for $20 on your first buy, and take advantage of all Bull Bitcoin has to offer. This week: The UK Stimulates, Blames Zelda Blackrock and Self Custody Ledger Continues to Fail Its Users Bank Error in Ukraine's Favour Prime Trust Deal Evaporates Apple vs Damus CBDC Debate Intensifying Taleb Blows It And much more As always, leave us some feedback on Apple Podcasts - your ratings and reviews help the show grow - or reach out to Joey and Len on Twitter, leave us a note on our Reddit posts, or drop a comment on our YouTube channel. We appreciate all the support and feedback, and hope you'll come back for more! --- Send in a voice message: https://podcasters.spotify.com/pod/show/canadian-bitcoiners/message

FRIENDS AND ENEMIES Welcome to another recording of The Canadian Bitcoiners Podcast. Sponsored by EasyDNS! All of your web hosting, GPG email, VPS hosting (for your Bitcoin Node, BTCPay Server or Nostr Relay) and more. Use code "CBPMedia" for a juicy discount! Sponsored by Bull Bitcoin! The CBP recommends Bull Bitcoin for all your BTC needs. With their new kyc-free options, there's never been a quicker, simpler, more private and (most importantly) cheaper way to acquire private Bitcoin. Use the link above (mission.bullbitcoin.com/cbp) for $20 on your first buy, and take advantage of all Bull Bitcoin has to offer. This week we welcome Nick AKA NobodyCaribou, who needs no introduction anywhere in the Canadian Bitcoin space. Nick and Len discuss all things Bitcoin and Freedom. A big thanks to Nick for his time, we look forward to having him back on The CBP. As always, leave us some feedback on Apple Podcasts - your ratings and reviews help the show grow - or reach out to Joey and Len on Twitter, leave us a note on our Reddit posts, or drop a comment on our YouTube channel. We appreciate all the support and feedback, and hope you'll come back for more! Don't forget about the TWO Canadian conferences debuting this year! https://canadianbitcoinconf.com/ https://bitcoinrodeo.com/ Grab some tickets, meet some Bitcoiners, have a good time. You know the drill. --- Send in a voice message: https://podcasters.spotify.com/pod/show/canadian-bitcoiners/message

FRIENDS AND ENEMIES Welcome to another recording of The Canadian Bitcoiners Podcast. Sponsored by EasyDNS! All of your web hosting, GPG email, VPS hosting (for your Bitcoin Node, BTCPay Server or Nostr Relay) and more. Use code "CBPMedia" for a juicy discount! Sponsored by Bull Bitcoin! The CBP recommends Bull Bitcoin for all your BTC needs. With their new kyc-free options, there's never been a quicker, simpler, more private and (most importantly) cheaper way to acquire private Bitcoin. Use the link above for $20 on your first buy, and take advantage of all Bull Bitcoin has to offer. This week: The Canadian Bitcoin Conference Wrap Up The ETF Debate Funnels for New Bitcoiners Canadians Living In Debt Based Poverty Taiwan and US Weakness And much more As always, leave us some feedback on Apple Podcasts - your ratings and reviews help the show grow - or reach out to Joey and Len on Twitter, leave us a note on our Reddit posts, or drop a comment on our YouTube channel. We appreciate all the support and feedback, and hope you'll come back for more! Don't forget about the TWO Canadian conferences debuting this year! https://canadianbitcoinconf.com/ https://bitcoinrodeo.com/ Grab some tickets, meet some Bitcoiners, have a good time. You know the drill. --- Send in a voice message: https://podcasters.spotify.com/pod/show/canadian-bitcoiners/message

FRIENDS AND ENEMIES Welcome to another recording of The Canadian Bitcoiners Podcast. Sponsored by EasyDNS! All of your web hosting, GPG email, VPS hosting (for your Bitcoin Node, BTCPay Server or Nostr Relay) and more. Use code "CBPMedia" for a juicy discount! Sponsored by Bull Bitcoin! The CBP recommends Bull Bitcoin for all your BTC needs. With their new kyc-free options, there's never been a quicker, simpler, more private and (most importantly) cheaper way to acquire private Bitcoin. Use the link above (mission.bullbitcoin.com/cbp) for $20 on your first buy, and take advantage of all Bull Bitcoin has to offer. A little pre-conference cross-over with Green Candle and friend of the show Mark Jeftovic - some bonus content just a bit outside of the usual schedule for CBP. Enjoy! As always, leave us some feedback on Apple Podcasts - your ratings and reviews help the show grow - or reach out to Joey and Len on Twitter, leave us a note on our Reddit posts, or drop a comment on our YouTube channel. We appreciate all the support and feedback, and hope you'll come back for more! Don't forget about the TWO Canadian conferences debuting this year! https://canadianbitcoinconf.com/ https://bitcoinrodeo.com/ Grab some tickets, meet some Bitcoiners, have a good time. You know the drill. --- Send in a voice message: https://podcasters.spotify.com/pod/show/canadian-bitcoiners/message

Creativity and innovation are essential for success in today's fast-paced business world. However, many companies need help fostering a culture encouraging experimentation and risk-taking. In this podcast episode, Robbie Phoenixx discusses the importance of understanding and motivating employees, leveraging creativity in intelligence work and marketing, and building a data-driven culture. He also shares his experiences in developing offer concepts, understanding the marketplace, and taking breaks to recharge creative energy. Whether you're a midline employee or a senior leader, this episode offers valuable insights on infusing creativity into your business for predictable success. Robbie Phoenixx is a competitive intelligence expert, music artist, keynote speaker, and marketing advisor. He has worked with several Fortune Thousand Titans, such as Live Nation, Verizon, and AT&T, contributing well over $254 million to them.  He is a music artist who earned over 30 million song plays and a daytime Emmy submission in his debut release. Robbie is a keynote speaker and strategic marketing advisor, sharing with entrepreneurs and top business leaders how to leverage one's creative advantage to become their competitive advantage.  He has overhauled the performance of three strategic products by conducting intensive competitor pricing research, contributing to well over 40 million sales room growth in just six months. He has been recruited to collaborate directly with chief marketing officers and VPs of product and marketing, global pricing to build a large-scale database, earning well over $120 million in Fortune 1000 sales and $108 million plus in sales pipeline in just six weeks. Some areas we explore in this episode include: The importance of understanding and motivating employees for successChallenges of finding high-performance individual contributors in large companiesCombining creativity and competitive intelligence for successInfusing creativity into your business for predictable successDiscovering the significance of intelligence work in salesImportance of "why" in leadershipLeveraging creativity in offer management and executionCreating a culture for competitive advantageLeveraging creativity in the workplaceUnderstanding the marketplace and growing businessAnd much, much more.

FRIENDS AND ENEMIES Welcome to another recording of The Canadian Bitcoiners Podcast. Sponsored by EasyDNS! All of your web hosting, GPG email, VPS hosting (for your Bitcoin Node, BTCPay Server or Nostr Relay) and more. Use code "CBPMedia" for a juicy discount! Sponsored by Bull Bitcoin! The CBP recommends Bull Bitcoin for all your BTC needs. With their new kyc-free options, there's never been a quicker, simpler, more private and (most importantly) cheaper way to acquire private Bitcoin. Use the link above (mission.bullbitcoin.com/cbp) for $20 on your first buy, and take advantage of all Bull Bitcoin has to offer. This week we welcome Blake Davis and Danny Condon of Blockware Solutions. Blockware is an all-encompassing mining solution, with owned data centres, more than 300,000 rigs sold, and a boatload of in-house expertise. Thanks to the two men for their time this evening. As always, leave us some feedback on Apple Podcasts - your ratings and reviews help the show grow - or reach out to Joey and Len on Twitter, leave us a note on our Reddit posts, or drop a comment on our YouTube channel. We appreciate all the support and feedback, and hope you'll come back for more! Don't forget about the TWO Canadian conferences debuting this year! https://canadianbitcoinconf.com/ https://bitcoinrodeo.com/ Grab some tickets, meet some Bitcoiners, have a good time. You know the drill. --- Send in a voice message: https://podcasters.spotify.com/pod/show/canadian-bitcoiners/message

Sentry is an application monitoring tool that surfaces errors and performance problems. It minimizes the need to manually look at logs or dashboards by identifying common problems across applications and frameworks. David Cramer is the co-founder and CTO of Sentry. This episode originally aired on Software Engineering Radio. Topics covered: What's Sentry? Treating performance problems as errors Why you might no need logs Identifying common problems in applications and frameworks Issues with Open Telemetry data Why front-end applications are difficult to instrument The evolution of Sentry's architecture Switching from a permissive license to the Business Source License Related Links Sentry David's Blog Sentry 9.1 and Upcoming Changes Re-Licensing Sentry Transcript You can help edit this transcript on GitHub. [00:00:00] Jeremy: Today I'm talking to David Kramer. He's the founder and CTO of Sentry. David, welcome to Software Engineering Radio. [00:00:08] David: Thanks for having me. Excited for today's conversation. What's Sentry? [00:00:11] Jeremy: I think the first thing we could start with is defining what Sentry is. I know some people refer to it as an error tracker. Some people have referred to it as, an application performance monitoring tool. I wonder if you could kind of describe in, in your words what it is. [00:00:30] David: You know, as somebody who doesn't work in marketing, I just tell it how it is. So Sentry started out doing error monitoring, which. You know, dependent on who you talk to, you might just think of as logging, right? Like that's the honest truth. It is just logging just a different shape or form. these days it's hard to not classify us as just an APM tool that's like the industry that exists. It's like the tools people understand. So I would just say it's an APM tool, right? We do a bunch of things within that space, and maybe it's not, you know, item for item the same as say a product like New Relic. but a lot of the overlap's there, so it's like errors performance, which is like latency and sort of throughput. And then we have some stuff that just goes a little bit deeper within that. The, the one thing i would say that is different for us versus a lot of these tools is we actually only do application monitoring. So we don't do any since like systems or infrastructure monitoring. Meaning Sentry is not gonna tell you when you need to replace a hard drive or even that you need new hard, like more disk space or something like that because it's just, it's a domain that we don't think is relevant for sort of our customers and product. Application Performance Monitoring is about finding crashes and performance problems that users would associate with bugs [00:01:31] Jeremy: For people who aren't familiar with the term application performance monitoring, what is that compared to just error tracking? [00:01:41] David: The way I always reason about it, this is what I tell new hires and what I would tell, like my mother, if I had to explain what I do, is like, you load Uber and it crashes. We all know that's bad, right? That's error monitoring. We capture the crash report, we send it to developers. You load Uber and it's a 30 second spinner, like a loading indicator as a customer. Same outcome for me. I assume the app is broken, right? So we also know that's bad. Um, but that's different than a crash. Okay. Sentry captures that same thing and send it to developers. lastly the third example we use, which is a little bit more. I think, untraditional, but a non-traditional rather, uh, you load the Uber app and it's like a blank screen or there's no button to submit, like log in or something like this. So it's kind of like a, it's broken, but it maybe isn't erroring and it's not like a slow thing. Right. Same outcome. It's probably a bug of some sorts. Like it's what an end user would describe it as a bug. So for me, APM just translates to there are bugs, user perceived bugs in your application and we're able to monitor and, and help the software teams sort of prioritize and resolve those, those concerns. [00:02:42] Jeremy: Earlier you were talking about actual crashes, and then your second case is, may be more of if the app is running slowly, then that's not necessarily a crash, but it's still something that an APM would monitor. [00:02:57] David: Yeah. Yeah. And I, I think to be fair, APM, historically, it's not a very meaningful term. Like I as a, when I was more of just an individual contributor, I would associate APM to, like, there's a dashboard that will tell me what's slow in my application, which it does. And that is kind of core to APM, but it would also, none of the traditional tools, pre sentry would actually tell you why it's broken, like when there's an error, a crash. It was like most of those tools were kind of useless. And I don't know, I do actually know, but I'm gonna pretend I don't know about most people and just say for myself. But most of the time my problems are errors. They are not like it's fast or slow, you know? and so we just think of it as like it's a holistic thing to say, when I've changed the application and something's broken, or it's a bug, you know, what is that bug? How do we help people fix it? And that comes from a lot of different, like data signals and things like that. the end result is still the same. You either are gonna fix it or it's not important and you ignore it. I don't know. So it's a pretty straightforward, premise for us. But again, most companies in the space, like the traditional company is when you grow a big company, what happens is like you build one thing and then you build lots of check boxes to sell more things. And so I think a lot of the APM vendors, like they've created a lot of different products. Like RUM is a good example of another acronym that lives with an APM. And I would tell you RUM is completely meaningless. It, it stands for real user monitoring. And so I'm like, well, what's not real about monitoring the application? Well, nothing's not real, but like they created a new category because that's how marketing engines work. And that new category is more like analytics than it is like application telemetry. And it's only because they couldn't collect the app, the application telemetry at the time. And so there's just a lot of fluff, i would say. But at the end of the day too, like developers or engineering teams, it's like new version of the application. You broke something, let's tell you about it so you can fix it. You might not need logging or performance monitoring [00:04:40] Jeremy: And, and so earlier you were saying how this is a kind of logging, but there's also other companies, other products that are considered like logging infrastructure. Like I, I would think of companies like Paper Trail or Log Tail. So what space does Sentry fill that's that's different than that kind of logging? [00:05:03] David: Um, so the way I always think about it, and this is both personally true, and what I advise other folks is when you're building something new, when you start from zero, right, you can often take Sentry put it in, and that's good enough. You don't even need performance monitoring. You just need like errors, right? Like you're just causing bugs all the time. And you could do that with logging, but like the delta between air monitoring and logging is night and day. From a user experience, like error monitoring for us, or what we built at the very least, aggregates the errors. It, it helps you understand the frequency. It helps you when they're new versus old. it really gives you a lot of detail where logs don't, and so you don't need logging often. And I will tell you today at Sentry. Engineers do not use logs for the most part. Uh, I had a debate with one of our, our team members about it, like, why does he use logs recently? But you should not need them because logs serve a different purpose. Like if you have traces which tell you like, like fast and slow in a bunch of other network data and you have this sort of crash report collection or error monitoring thing, logs become like a compliance or an audit trail or like a security forensics, tool, and there's just not a lot of value that you would get out of them otherwise, like once in a while, maybe there's like some weird obscure use case, but generally speaking, you can just pretend that you don't need logs most days. Um, and to me that's like an evolution of the industry. And so when, when Sentry is getting started, most people were still logs. And if you go talk to SRE teams, they're like, oh, login is what we know. Some of that's changed a little bit, but. But at the end of the day, they should only be needed for more complicated audit trails because they're just not a good solution to the problem. It's just free form data. Structured or not, doesn't really matter. It's not aggregated. It's not something that you can really use. And it's why whenever you see logging tools, um, not even the papertrails of the world, but the bigger ones like Splunk or Cabana, it's like this weird, what we describe as choose your own adventure. Like go have fun, build your dashboards and try to make the logs useful kind of story. Whereas like something like Sentry, it's just like, why would you waste any time trying to build dashboards when we can just tell you when something new is broken? Like that's the ideal situation. [00:06:59] Jeremy: So it sounds like maybe the distinction is with a more general logging tool, like you mentioned Splunk and Kibana it's a collection of all this information. of things happening, even though nothing's necessarily wrong, whereas Sentry is more Sentry is it's going to log things, but it's only going to log things if Sentry believes something is wrong, either because of a crash or because of some kind of performance issue. People don't want to dig through logs or dashboards, they want to be told when something is wrong and whyMost software is built the same way, so we know common problems [00:07:28] David: Yeah. I, i would say it's about like actionability, right? Like, like nobody wants to spend their time digging through logs, digging through dashboards. Metrics are another good example of this. Like just charts with metrics on them. Yeah. They tell me something's happening. If there's lots of log statements, they tell me something's going on, but they're not, they're not optimized to like, help me solve a problem, right? And so our philosophy was always like, we haven't necessarily nailed this in all cases for what it's worth, but. It was like, the goal is we identify an actual problem, like close to like a root cause kind of problem, and we escalate that up and that's it. Uh, versus asking somebody to like go have to like build these dashboards, build these things, figure out what data matters and all this because most software looks exactly the same. Like if you have a web service, it doesn't matter what language it's written in, it doesn't matter how different you think your architecture is from somebody else's, they're all the same. It's like you've got a request, you've got a database, you've got some cache, you've got all these like known, known quantity things, and the slowness comes from the same places. Errors are structured while logs are not [00:08:25] David: The errors come from the same places. They're all exhibiting the same kinds of behavior. So logging is very unstructured. And what I mean by that is like there's no schema. Like you can hypothetically like make it JSON and everybody does that, but it's still unstructured. Whereas like errors, it's, it's a tight schema. It's like there's a type of error, there's a message for the error, there's a stack trace, there's all these things that you know. Right. And as soon as you know and you define those things, you can just build better products. And so distributed tracing is similar. Hypothetically, it's a little bit abstract to be fair, but hypothetically, distributed tracing is creating a schema out of basically network annotations. And somebody will yell at me for just simplifying it to that. I would tell 'em that's what it is. But, same goal in mind. If you know what the data is, you can take action on it. It's not quite entirely true. Um, because tracing is much more freeform. For example, it doesn't say if you have a SQL statement, it should be like this, it should be formatted this way, things like that. whereas like stack traces, there's a file name, there's there's a line number, there's like all these things, right? And so that's how I think about the delta between what is useful information and what isn't, I guess. And what allows you to actually build things like Sentry versus just build abstract exploration. Inferring problems rather than having user identify them [00:09:36] Jeremy: Kind of paint the picture of how someone would get started with a tool like Sentry. Do they need to tell Sentry anything about their application? Do they need to modify their source code at all? give us a picture of how that works. [00:09:50] David: Yeah, like one of our fundamentals, which I think applies for any real business these days is you've gotta like reduce user friction, right? Like you've gotta make it dead simple to use. Uh, and for us there were, there was like kind of a fundamental driving constraint behind that. So in many situations, um, APM vendors especially will require you to run an agent a basically like some kind of process that runs on your servers somewhere. Well, if you look at modern tech stacks, that doesn't really work because I don't run the servers half my stuff's in the browser, or it's a mobile app or a desktop app, and. Even if I do have those servers, it's like an entirely different team that controls them. So deploying like a sidecar, an agent is actually like much more complicated. And so we, we looked at that and also because like, it's much easier to have control if you just ship within the application. We're like, okay, let's build like an SDK and dependency that just injects into the, the application that runs, set an API key and then you're done. And so what that translates for Sentry is we spend a lot of time knowing what Django is or what Rails is or what expresses like all these frameworks. And just knowing how to plug into the right signals in those frameworks. And then at that point, like the user doesn't have to do anything. And so like the ideal outcome for Sentry is like you install the dependency in whatever language makes sense, right? You somehow configure the API key and maybe there's a couple other minor settings you add and that gives you the bare bones and that's it. Like it should just work from there. Now there's a lot you can do on top of that to enrich data and whatnot, but for the most part, especially for errors, like that's good enough. And that, that's always been a fundamental goal of ours. And I, I think we actually do it phenomenally well. [00:11:23] Jeremy: So it sounds like it infers things about the application without manual configuration. Can you give some examples of the kind of things that Sentry knows without the user having to tell it? [00:11:38] David: Yeah. So a good example. So on the errors side, we know literally everything because an error object in each language has all these attributes with it. It, it gives you the stack trace, it gives you a lot of these things. So that one's straightforward. On the performance side, we use a combination of leveraging some like open source, I guess implementations, like open telemetry where it's got all this instrumentation already and we can just soak that in, um, as well as we automatically instrument a bunch of stuff. So for example, say you've got like a Python application and you're using, let's say like SQL Alchemy or something. I don't actually know if this is how our SDK works right now, but, we will build something that's aware of that library and make sure it can automatically instrument the things it needs to get the right information out of it. And be fair. That's always been true for like APM vendors and stuff like that. The delta is, we've often gone a lot deeper. And so for Python for example, you plug it into an application, we'll capture things like the error, error object, which is like exception class name exception value, right? Stack trace, file, name, line number, all those normal things, function name. We'll also collect source code. So we'll, we'll give you sort of surrounding source code blocks for each line in the stack trace, which makes it infinitely easier to consume. And then in Python and, and php, and I forget if we do this anywhere else right now, we'll actually even allow you to collect what are called stack locals. So it'll, it'll give you basically the variables that are defined almost like a debugger. And that is actually, actually like game changing from a development point of view. Because if I can go look in production when there's an incident or a bug and I can actually see the state of the application. , I, I never need to know like, oh, what was going on here? Oh, what if like, do I need to go reproduce this somehow? I always have the right information. And so all of that for us is automatic and we only succeed like, it, it's, it's like by definition inside of Sentry, it has to be automatic. Like if we ask the user to do anything whatsoever, we're failing. And so whenever we design any product or anything, and to be fair, this is how every product company should operate. it's gotta be with as little user input as humanly possible. And so you can't always pull that off. Sometimes you have to have users configure stuff, but the goal should always be no input. Detecting errors through unhandled exceptions [00:13:42] Jeremy: So you, you're talking about getting a stack trace, getting, the state of variables, source code. That sounds like that's primarily gonna be through unhandled exceptions. Would you say that's, that's the primary way that you get error? [00:13:58] David: Yeah, you can integrate in other ways. So you can like trigger our API to capture an, uh, an exception. You can also, for better or worse, it's not always good. You can integrate through logging adapters. So if you're already using a logging framework and you log their errors there, we can often capture those. However, I will say in most cases, people use the logging APIs wrong and the data becomes junk. A good, a good example of this is like, uh, it varies per language. So I'm just gonna go to Python because Python is like sort of core to Sentry. Um, in Python you have the ability to log messages, you can log them as errors, you can log like actual error objects as errors. But what usually happens is somebody does a try-catch. They, they capture the error they rescue from it. They create a logging call, like log dot error or something, put the, the error message or value in there. And then they send that upstream. And what happens is the stack trace is gone because we don't know that it's an error object. And so for example, in Python, there's actually an an A flag. You pass the logging call to make sure that stack trace stays present. But if you don't know that the data becomes junk all of a sudden, and if we don't have a stack trace, we can't actually aggregate data because like there's just not enough information to like, to run hashing on it. And so, so there are a lot of ways, I guess, to capture the information, but there are like good ways and there are bad ways and I think it, it's in everybody's benefit when they design their, their apt to like build some of these abstractions. And so like as an example, when, whenever I would start a new project these days, I will add some kind of helper function for me to like log an exception when I like, try catch and then I can just plug in whatever I need later if I want to enrich the data or if I wanna send that to Sentry manually or send it to logs manually. And it just makes life a lot easier versus having to go back and like augment every single call in the code base. [00:15:37] Jeremy: So it, it sounds like. When you're using a tool like Sentry, there's gonna be the, the unhandled exceptions, which are ones that you weren't expecting. So those should I guess happen without you catching them. And then the ones that you perhaps do anticipate, but you still consider to be a problem, you would catch that and then you would add some kind of logging statement to your code that talks to Sentry directly. Finding issues like performance problems (N+1 queries) that are not explicit errorsz [00:16:05] David: Potentially. Yeah. It becomes a, a personal choice to be fair at that, at that point. but yeah, the, the way, one of the ways we've been thinking about this lately, because we've been changing our error monitoring product to not just be about errors, so we call it issues, and that's in the guise of like, it's like an issue tracker, a bug tracker. And so we started, we started putting what are effectively like, almost like static analysis concerns inside of this issue tracker. So for example, In our performance monitor, we'll do something called like detect n plus one queries, which is where you execute a, a duplicate query in a loop. It's not necessarily an error. It might not be causing a problem, but it could be causing a problem in the future. But it's like, you know, the, the, the qualities of it are not the same as an error. Like it's not necessarily causing the user to experience a bug. And so we've started thinking more about this, and, and this is the same as like logging errors that you handle. It's like, well, they're not really, they're not really bugs. It's like expected behavior, but maybe you still want to keep it like tracking somewhere. And I think about like, you know, Lins and things like that, where it's like, well, I've got some things that I definitely should be fixing. Then I've got a bunch of other stuff that's like informing me that maybe I should take action on or not. But only I, the human can really know at the end of the day, right, if I, if I should prioritize that or not. And so that's how I kind of think about like, if I'm gonna try catch and then log. Yeah, you should probably collect that data. It's probably less important than like the, these other concerns, like, like an actual unhandled exception. But you do, you do want to know that they're happening and whatnot. And so, I dunno, Sentry has not had a strong opinion on this historically. We're just like, send us whatever you want to capture in this regard, and you can pay for it, that's fine. It's like usage based, you know? we're starting to think a lot more about what should that look like if we, if we go back to like, what's the, what's the opinion we have for how you should use the product or how you should solve these kinds of software problems. [00:17:46] Jeremy: So you gave the example of detecting n plus one queries is, is that like being aware of the framework or the ORM the person is using and that's how you're determining this? Or is it at more of a lower level than that? [00:18:03] David: it is, yeah. It's at the framework level. So this is actually where Open Telemetry causes a lot of harm, uh, for us because we need to know what a database query is. Uh, we need to know like the structure of the query because we actually wanna parse it out in a lot of cases. Cause we actually need to identify if it's duplicate, right? And we need to know that it's a database query, not a random annotation that you've added. Um, and so what we do is within these traces, which is like if you, if you don't know what a trace is, it's basically just like, it's a tree, like a tree structure. So it's like A calls B, calls C, B also calls D and E and et cetera, right? And so you just, you know, it's a trace. Um, and so we actually just look at that trace data. We try to find these patterns, which is like, okay, B was a, a SQL query or something. And every single sibling of B is that same SQL query, but sort of removing certain parameters and stuff for the value. So we'll look at that data and we'll try to pull out anomalies. So m plus one is an example of like a fairly obvious anti pattern that everybody knows is bad and can be optimized. Uh, but there's a lot of other that are a little bit more subjective. I'll give you an example. If you execute three SQL statements back to back, one could argue that you could just batch those SQL statements together. I would argue most of the time it doesn't matter and I don't need to do that. And also it's not guaranteed that that is better. So it becomes much more like, well, in my particular situation this is valuable, but in this other situation it might not be. And that's where I go back to like, it's almost like a linter, you know? But we're trying to infer all of that from the data stream. So, so Sentry's kind of, we're kind of a backwards product company. So we build our product from a technology vision, not from customers want this, or we have this great product vision or anything like that. And so in our case, the technology vision is like, there's a lot of application data that comes in, a lot of telemetry, right? Errors, traces. We have a bunch of other streams now. within that telemetry there is like signal. And so one, it's all structured data so we know what it is so we can actually interpret it. And then we can identify that signal that might be a problem. And that signal in our case is often going to translate to like this issue concept. And then the goal is like, well, can we identify these problems for people and surface them versus the choose your own adventure model, which is like, we'll just capture everything and feed it to the user and they can figure out what matters. Because again, a web service is a web service. A database is a database. They're all the same problems for everybody. All you know, it's just, and so that's kind of the model we've built and are continuing to evolve on and, and so far works pretty well to, to curate a lot of these workflows. Want to infer everything, but there are challenges [00:20:26] Jeremy: You talked a little bit about how people will sometimes use tracing. And in cases like that, they may need some kind of session ID to track. Somebody making a call to a service and that talks to a database and that talks to other services. And you, inside of your application, you have to instrument some way of tracking. This all came from this one request. Is that something that Sentry can infer or is there something that the developer has to put into play so that you can track that sort of thing? [00:21:01] David: Yeah, so it's, it's like a bit of both. And i would say our goal is that we can infer everything. The reality is there is so much complexity and there's too much of a, like, too many technologies in the world. Like I was complaining about this the other day, like, the classic example on web service is if we have a middleware hook, We kind of know request response, usually that's how middleware would work, right? And so we can infer a lot from there. Like basically we can infer the boundaries, which is a really big deal. Okay. That's one thing is boundaries is a problem. What we, we describe that as a transaction. So like when the request starts. When the request ends, right? That's a very important boundary for everybody to understand because when I'm working on the api, I care about the API boundary. I actually don't care about what the database is doing at its low level or what the JavaScript application might be doing above it. I want my boundary. So that's one that we kind of can do. But it's hard in a lot of situations because of the way frameworks and technology has been designed, but at least traditional stuff like a, a traditional web stack, it works like a Rails app or a DDjango app or PHP app kind of thing, right? And then within that it becomes, well, how do you actually build a trace versus just have a bunch of arbitrary labels? And so we have a bunch of complicated tech within each language that tries to establish that tree. and then we annotate a lot of things along the way. And so we will either leverage Open Telemetry, which is an open format spec that ideally has very high quality data. Ideally, not realistically, but ideally it has high quality data. Every library author implements it great, everybody's happy. We don't have to do anything ever again. The reality is that data is like all over the map because there's not like strict requirements for what, how the data should be labeled and stuff. And not everything even has that data. Like not everything's instrumented with open telemetry. So we also have a bunch of stuff that, unrelated to using that we'll say, okay, we know what this library is, we're gonna try to infer some characteristics from this library, or we know what maybe like the DDjango template engine is. So we're gonna try to infer like when the template renders so you can capture that block of information. it is a very imperfect science and I would tell you like it's not, even though like Open Telemetry is a very fun topic for people. It is not necessarily good, like it's not in a good state. Could will it ever be good? I don't know in all honesty, but like the data quality is like all over the map and so that's honestly one of our biggest challenges to making this experience that, you know, tells you what's going on in your database so it tells you what's going on with the cash or things like this is like, I dunno, the cash might be called something completely random in one implementation and something totally different in another. And so it's a lot of like, like data normalization that you have to deal with. But for the most part, those libraries of things you don't control can and will be instrumented. Now the other interesting thing, which we'll see how this works out, so, so one thing Sentry tries to do there, we have all these layers of telemetry, so we have errors and traces, right? Those are pretty high level concepts. We also have profiling data, which is very, very, very, very low level. So it's usually only if you have like disc. I like. It's where is all the CPU time being spent in my application? Mostly not waiting. Like waiting's usually like a network call, right? But it's like, okay, I have a loop that's doing a lot of math, or I'm writing a bunch of stuff to disc and that's really slow. Like often those are not instrumented or it's like these black box areas of a performance. And so what we're trying to do with profiling data, instead of just showing you flame charts and stuff, is actually say, could we fill in these gaps in these traces? Like basically like, Hey, I've got a long period of time where the app's doing something. You know, here's an API call, here's the database stuff. But then there's this block, okay, what's that function or something? Can we pull that out of the profiling data? And so in that case, again, that's just automatic because the profile actually knows everything about the application and know it. It has full access to the function and the stack and everything, right? And so the dream is that you would just always have everything filled in the, the customer never has to do anything with one minor asterisk. And the asterisk is what I would call like business context. So a good example would be, You might wanna associate requests with a specific customer or something like that. Like you might wanna say, well it's uh, I don't know, Goldman Sachs or one of these big companies or something. So you can know like, well when Goldman Sachs is having performance issues or whatever it is, oh maybe I should focus on them cuz maybe they pay you a lot of money or something. Right. Sentry would never know that at the end of the day. So we also have these like kind of tagging contextual APIs that will say like, tell us some informations, maybe it's like customer, maybe it's something else that's relevant to your application. And we'll keep that data associated with the telemetry that's like present, you know, um, but the, at least the telemetry, like again, application's just worth the same, should be, there should be a day in the next few years that it's just all automatic. and again, the only challenge today is like, can it be high quality and automatic? And so that, that's like to be determined. [00:25:50] Jeremy: What you're kind of saying is the ideal is being able to look at this profiling information and be able to build a full picture of. a, a call from beginning to end, all the different things to talk to, but I guess what's the, what's the reality today? Like, what, what is Sentry able to determine, in the world we live in right now? [00:26:11] David: So we've done a lot of this like performance detection stuff already. So we actually can do a lot now. We put a lot of time into it and I, I will tell you, if you look at other tools trying to do tracing, their approach is much more abstract. It's like your traditional monitoring tool that's like, we're just gonna collect a lot of signals and maybe we'll find magic anomaly detection or something going on in it, which, you know, props, but that can figure that out. But, a lot of what we've done is like, okay, we kind of know what this data looks like. Let's go after this very like known quantity problem. Let's normalize the data. And let's make it happen like that's today. Um, the enrichment of profiles is new for us, but it, we actually can already do it. It's not perfect. Detection of blocking the UI thread in mobile apps [00:26:49] David: Um, and I think we're launching something in April or May, something around the, that timeframe where hopefully for the, the technologies we can instrument, we're actually able to surface that in a useful way. but as an example that, that concept that I was talking about, like with n plus one queries, the team built something using profiling data. and I think this, this might be for like a mobile app more so than anything where mobile apps have this problem of, it's, you've got a main thread and if you block that main thread, the app is basically frozen. You see this on desktop apps all the time. You, you very rarely see it on web apps anymore. But, but it's a really big problem when you have a web, uh, a mobile or desktop app because you don't want that like thing to be non-responsive. Right? And so one of the things they did was detect when you're doing like file io on the main thread, you know, right. When you're writing a disc, which is probably a slow thing or something like that, that's gonna block the whole thing. Because you should just do it on a separate thread. It's like an easy fix, potentially may not be a problem, but it could become a problem. Same thing as n plus one. But what's really interesting about it is what the team did is like they used the profiling data to detect it because we already know threads and everything in there, and then they actually recreated a stack trace out of that profiling data when it's surfaced. So it's actually like useful data with that. You could like that I or you as a developer might know how to take and actually be like, oh, this is where it happens at the source code. I can actually figure it out and go fix it myself. And to me, like as like I, I'm still very much in the weeds with software that is like one of the biggest gaps to most things. Is it just, it doesn't make it easy to consume or like take action on, right? Like if I've got a, a chart that says my error rate is high, what am I gonna do with that? I'm like, okay, what's breaking? That's immediately my next question. Right? Okay. This is the error. Where is that error happening at? Again, my next question, it, it's literally just root cause analysis, right? Um, and so that, that to me is very exciting. and I, I don't know that we're the first people to do that, I'm not sure. But like, if we can make that kind of data, that level of actionable and consumable, that's like a big deal for me because I will tell you is like I have 20 years of software experience. I still hate flame charts and like I struggle to use them. Like they're not a friendly visualization. They're almost like a, a hypothetically necessary evil. But I also think one where nobody said like, do we even need to use that? Do we need that to be like the way we operate? and so anyways, like I guess that's my long-winded way of saying like, I'm very excited for how we can leverage that data and change how it's used. [00:29:10] Jeremy: Yeah. So it sounds like in this example, both in the mobile app blocking the UI or the n plus one query is the Sentry, suppose, SDK or instrumentation that's hooked inside of your application. There are certain behaviors that it knows are, are not like ideal I guess, just based on. people's prior experience, like your own developers know that, hey, if you block the UI thread in this mobile application, then you're gonna have performance problems. And so that way, rather than just telling you, Hey, your app is slow, it can tell you your app is slow and it's because you're blocking the UI thread. Don't just aggregate metrics, the error tracker should have an opinion on what actual problems are [00:29:55] David: Exactly, and I, and I actually think, I don't know why so many people don't recognize this gap, because at the end of the day, like, I don't know, I don't need more people to tell me response times are bad or anything. I need you to have an opinion about what's good because. The only way it's like math education, right? Like, yeah, you learn the basics, but you're not expected to say, go to calc, but, and then like, do all the fundamentals. You're like, don't get a calculator and start simplifying the problem. Like, yeah, we're gonna teach you a few of these things so you understand it. We're gonna teach you how to use a calculator and then just use the calculator and then make it easier for everybody else. But we're also not teaching you how to build a calculator because who cares? Like, that's not the purpose of it. And so for me, this is like, we should be helping people sort of get to the finish line instead of making them run the entirety of the race over and over if they don't need to. I don't, I don't know if that's a good analogy, but that has been the biggest gap, I think, in so much of this software throughout the industry. And it's, it's, it's common everywhere. And there's no reason for that gap to exist these days. Like the technology's fine. And the technology's been fine for like 10 years. Like Sentry started in oh eight at this point. And I think there was only one other company I recall at the time that was doing anything that was even similar to like air monitoring and Sentry when we built it, we're just like, what if we just go deeper? What if we collect all this information that will help you debug the problem instead of just stopping it like a log aggregator or something kind of thing, so we can actually have an opinion about it. And I, I genuinely, it baffles me that more people do not think this way because it was not a hard problem at the time. It's certainly not hard these days, but there's still very, I mean, a lot more people do it now. They've seen Sentry successful and there's a lot of similar implementations, but it's, it's just amazes me. It's like, why don't you, why don't people try to make the data more actionable and more useful, the teams versus just collect more of it, you know? 40 people working on learning the common issues with languages and frameworks [00:31:41] Jeremy: it, it sounds like maybe the, the popularity of the stack the person is using or of the framework means that you're gonna have better insights, right? Like if somebody makes a, a Django application or a Rails application, there's all these lessons that your team has picked up in terms of, Hey, if you use the ORM this way, your application is gonna be slow. Whereas if somebody builds something totally homegrown, you won't know these patterns and you won't be able to like help as much basically. [00:32:18] David: Yeah. Yeah, that's exactly, and, and you might think that that is a challenge, but then you look at how many employees exist at like large tech companies and it's, it's not that big of a deal, like, , you might even think collecting all the information for each, like programming, runtime or framework is a challenge. We have like 40 people that work on that and it's totally fine. Like, and, and so I think actually all these scale just fine. Um, but you do have to understand like the domain, right? And so the counter version of this is if you look at say like browser applications, like very rich, uh, single page application type experiences. It's not really obvious like what the opinions are. Like, like if, if you, and this is like real, like if you go to Sentry, it's, it's kind of slow, like the app is kind of slow. Uh, we even make fun of ourselves for how slow it is cuz it's a lot of JavaScript and stuff. If you ask somebody internally, Hey, how would we make pick a page fast? They're gonna have no clue. Like, even if they have like infinite domain experience, they're gonna be like, I'm not entirely sure. Because there's a lot of like moving parts and it's not even clear what like, like good is right? Like we know n plus one is bad. So we can say not doing that is the better solution. And so if you have a JavaScript app, which is like where a lot of the slowness will come from is like the render times itself. Like how do you fix it? You, you can't actually build a product that tells you what to fix without knowing how to fix it, right? And so some of these newer and very fast moving targets are, are frankly very difficult for us. Um, and so that's one thing that I think is a challenge for the entire industry. And so, like, as an example, a lot of the browser folks have latched onto web vitals, which are just metrics that hopefully tell you something about the application, but they're not always actionable either. It'll be like, the idea with like web vitals is like, okay, time to interactive is an an important metric. It's like how long until the page loads that a user can do what they're probably there to do. Okay. Like abstractly, it makes sense to us, but like put into action. How do I optimize time to interactive? Don't block the page. That's one thing. I don't know. Defer assets, that's another thing. Okay. So you've gotta like, you've gotta build a technology that knows these assets could be deferred and aren't. Okay, which ones can be deferred? I don't know. Like, it, it, it's like such a deep rabbit hole. And then the problem is, six months from now, the tech will have completely changed, right? And it won't have like, necessarily solved some of these problems. It will just have changed and they're now a completely different shape of problem. But still the same fundamental like user experience is the same, you know? Um, and to me that's like the biggest challenge in the industry right now is that like dilemma of the browser at the end of the day. And so even from our end, we're like, okay, maybe we should step back, focus on servers again, focus on web services. Those are known quantities. We can do that really well. We can sort of change that to be better than it's been in the past and easier to consume with things like our n plus one detections. Um, and then take like a holistic, fresh look at browser and say, okay, now how would we solve this to make sure we can actually really latch onto the problems that like people have and, and we understand, right? And, you know, we'll see when we get there. I don't think any product does a great job these days for helping, uh, solve those problems. . But I think even without the, the products, like I said, like even our team would be like, fixing this is gonna take months because it's gonna take months just to figure out exactly where the, the common bottlenecks are and all these other things within an application. And so I, I guess what I mean to say with that is there's a lot of opportunity, I think with the moving landscape of technology, we can find a way to, whether it's standardized or Sentry, can find a way to make that data actionable want it something in between there. There are many ways to build things on the frontend with JavaScript which makes it harder to detect common problems compared to backend [00:35:52] Jeremy: So it sounds like what you're saying, With the, the back end, there's almost like a standard way of doing things or a way that a lot of people do it the same way. Whereas on the front end, even if you're looking at a React application, you could look at tenant react applications and they could all be doing state management a totally different way. They could be like the, the way that the application is structured could be totally different, and that makes it difficult for you to infer sort of these standard patterns on the front end side. [00:36:32] David: Yeah, that's definitely true. And it, it goes, it's even worse than that because well, one, there's just like the nature of JavaScript, which is asynchronous in the sense of like, it's a lot of callbacks and things like that. And so that already makes it hard to understand what's going on, uh, where things are happening. And then you have these abstractions like React, which are very good, but like they pull a lot of that away. And so, as an example of a common problem, you load the application, it has to do a lot of stuff to make the page render. You might call that hydration or whatever. Okay. And then there's a completely different state, which is going from, it's already hydrated. Page one, I, I've done an interaction or something. Or maybe I've navigated a page too, that's an entirely different, like, sort of performance problem. But that hydration time, that's like a known thing. That's kind of like time to interactive, right? But if the problem is in your framework, which a lot of it is like a lot of the problems today exist because of frameworks, not because of the technology's bad or the framework's bad, but just because it's abstracted and it's really hard to make it work in all these situations, it's complicated. And again, they have the same problem where it's like changing non sem. And so if the problem is the framework is somehow incorrectly re rendering the page as an example, and this came up recently, for some big technology stack, it's re rendering the page. That's a really bad problem for the, the customer because it's making the, it's probably actually causing a lot of CPU seconds. This is why like your Chrome browser tabs are using so much memory in cpu, right? How do you fix that? Can you even fix that? Do you just say, I don't know, blame the technology? Is that the solution? Maybe that is right, but how would we even blame the technology like that alone, just to identify why it's happening. and you need to know the why. Right? Like, that is such a hard problem these days. And, and personally, I think the only solution is if the industry sort of almost like standardizes on a way to like, on a belief of how this should be optimized and how it should be measured and monitored kind of thing. Because like how errors work is like a standardization effectively. It may not be like a formal like declaration of like, this is what an error is, but more or less they always have the same attributes because we've all kind of understood that. Like those are the valuable things, right? Okay. I've got a server rendered application that has client interaction, which is sort of the current generation of the technology. We need to standardize on what, like that web request, like response life cycle is, right? and what are the moving targets within there. And it just, to me, I, I honestly feel like a lot of what we use every day in technology is like beta. Right. And it's, I think it's one of the reasons why we're constantly always having to up, like upgrade and, and refactor and, and, and shift dependencies and things like that because it is not, it's very much a prototype, right? It's a moving target, which I personally do not think is great for the industry because like customers do not care. They do not care that you're using some technology that like needs a change every few months and things like that. now it has improved things to be fair. Like web applications are much more like interactive and responsive sometimes. Um, but it is a very hard problem I think for a lot of people in the world. [00:39:26] Jeremy: And, and when you refer to, to things feeling like beta, I suppose, are, are you referring to the frameworks people are using or the libraries they're using to support their front end development? I, I'm curious what you're, you're thinking there. [00:39:41] David: Um, I think it's everything. Even like the browser APIs are constantly shifting. It's, that's gotten a little bit better. But even the idea like type script and stuff, it's just like we're running like basically compilers to make all this code work. And, and so the, even that they're constantly adding features just because they can, which means behaviors are constantly changing. But like, if you look at a real world example, like React is like the, the most dominant technology. It's very well designed for managing the dom. It's basically just a rendering engine at the end of the day. It's like it's managed to process updates to the dom. Okay. Makes sense. But we've all learned that these massive single page applications where you build all your application logic and loaded into a bundle is a problem. Like, like, I don't know how big Sentry's bundle is, but it's multiple megs in size and it takes a little while for like a, even on fast fiber here in the Bay Area, it takes a, you know, several seconds for the UI to load. And that's not ideal. Like, it's like at some point half of us became okay with this. So we're like, okay, what we need to do is go back, literally just go back 10 years and we need to render it on the server. And then we need some stuff that makes interactions, you know, highly responsive in the UI or dynamic content in the ui, you know, bring, it's like bringing back jQuery or something. And so we're kind of going full circle, but that is actually like very complicated because the way people are trying to do is like, okay, we wanna, we wanna have the rendering engine operate the same on the server and is on as on the client, right? So it's like we just write one, path of code that basically it's like a template engine to some degree, right? And okay, that makes sense. Like we can all get behind that kind of model. But that is actually really hard to make work with a lot of people's software and, and I think the challenge and framers have adopted it, right? So they've taken this, so for example, it's like, uh, react server components, which is basically just like, can we render it on the server and then also keep that same interaction in the ui. But the problem is like frameworks take that, they abstract it and so it's another layer of complexity on something that is already enormously complex. And then they add their own flavor onto it, like their own opinions for maybe what the world way the world is going. And I will say like personally, I find those. Those flavors to be very hard to adapt to like things that are tried and true or importantly in this context, things that we know how to monitor and fix, right? And so I, I don't know what, what the be all end all is, but my thesis on this is you need to treat the UI like a template engine, and that's it. Remove all like complexity behind it. And so if you think about that, the term I've labeled it as, which I did not come up with, I saw this from somebody at some point, is like, it's like your front end as a service. Like you need to take that application that renders on the server and the front end, and it's just an entirely different application, which is annoying. and it just calls your APIs and that's how it gets the data it needs. So you're literally just treating it as if it's like a single page application that can't connect to your database. But the frameworks have not quite done that. And they're like, no, no, no. We'll connect to the database and we'll do all this stuff, but then it doesn't work because you've got, like, it works this way on the back end and this way on the front end anyways. Again, long winded way of saying like, it's very complicated. I don't think the technology can solve it today. I think the technology has to change before these problems can actually genuinely become solvable. And that's why I think the whole thing is like a beta, it's like, it's very much like a moving target that we're eventually we'll get there and it's definitely had value, but I don't know that, um, responsiveness for low latency connections is where the value has been created. You know, for like folks with bad internet and say remote Africa or something, like I'm sure the internet is not a very fun place for them to use these days. Some frontend code runs on the server and some in the browser which creates challenges [00:43:05] Jeremy: I guess one of the things you mentioned is there's this, almost like this split where you have the application running on the server. It has its own set of rules because it, like you said, has access to the database and it can do things that you can't do in the browser, and then you have to sort of run the same application in the browser, but it's not quite the same application because it doesn't have access to the same things in the browser. So you have this weird disconnect, I suppose. [00:43:35] David: Yeah. Yeah. And, and, and then the challenges is like a developer that's actually complicated for you from the experience point of view, cuz you have to know somehow, okay, these things are ta, these are actually running on the server and only on the server. And like, so I think the two biggest technologies that try to do this, um, or at least do it well enough, or the two that I've used, there might be some others, um, are NextJS and remix and they have very different takes on how to do this. But, remix is the one I use most recently. So I, I'll comment on that. But like, there's a, a way that you kind of say, well, this only runs on, I think the client as an example. And that helps you a little bit. You're like, okay, this is only gonna render on the client. I can, I actually can think about that and reason about that. But then there's this thing like, okay, sometimes this runs on the server, only this part runs on the server. And it's, it just becomes like the mental capacity to figure out what's going on and debug it is like so difficult. And that database problem is like the, the normal problem, right? Like of like, I can only query the database on the server because I need secure credentials or something. Okay. I understand that as a developer, but I don't understand how to make sure the application is doing what I expect it to do and how to fix it if something goes wrong. And that, that's why I think. , I'm a, I'm a believer in constraints. The only way you make progress is you simplify problems. Like you just give up on solving the complicated thing and you make the problem simpler. Right? And so for me, that's why I'm like, just take the database outta the equation. We can create APIs from the client, from the server, same security levels. Okay? Make it so it can only do that and it has to be run as almost like a UI only thing. Now that creates complexity cuz you have to run this other service, right? And, and like I personally do not wanna have to spin up a bunch of containers just to write like a simple like web application. but again, I, I think the problem has not been simplified yet for a lot of folks. Like React did this to be fair, um, it made it a lot easier to, to build UI that was responsive and, and just updated values when they changed, you know, which was a big deal for a long period of time. But I feel like everything after has not quite reached that that area, whereas it's simple and even react is hard to debug when it doesn't do what you want it to do. So I don't know, there, there's so gaps I guess is what i would say. And. Hopefully, hopefully, you know, in the next five years we'll kind of see this come to completion because it does feel like it's, it's getting closer to that compromise. You know, where like we used to have pure server rendered apps with some weird janky JavaScript on top. Now we've got this bridge of really complicated, you know, JavaScript on top, and the server apps are also complicated and it's just, it's a nightmare. And then this newer generation of these frameworks that work for some types of technology, but not all. And, and we're kind of almost coming full circle to like server rendered, you know, everything. But with like allowing the same level of interactions that we've been desiring, I guess, on the web. So, and I, fingers crossed this gets better, but right now I do not see like a clear like, oh, it's definitely there. I can see it coming. I'm like, well, we're kind of making progress. I don't love being the beta tester of the whole thing, but we're kind of getting there. And so, you know, we'll see. There are multiple ways to write mobile apps as well (flutter, react native, web views) [00:46:36] Jeremy: I guess you, you've been saying this whole shifting landscape of how Front End works has made it difficult for Sentry to provide like automatic instrumentation and things like that for, for mobile apps. Is that a different story? Like is it pretty standardized in terms of how do you instrument an Android app or an iOS app. [00:46:58] David: Sort of, but also, no, like, a good example here is like early days mobile, it's a native application. You ship a binary known quantity, right? Or maybe you embedded a web browser, but like, that was like a very different thing. Okay. And then they did things where like, okay, more of it's like embedded web browser type stuff, or dynamically render content. So that's now a moving target. the current version of that, which I'm not a mobile dev so like people have strong opinions on both sides of this fence, but it's like, okay, do you use like a, a hybrid framework which allows you to build. Say, uh, react native, which is like arou you to sort of write a JavaScript ish thing and it runs on both Android and mobile, but not really well on either. Um, or do you write a native, native app, which is like a known quantity, but then you may maintain like two code bases, have two degrees of expertise and stuff. Flutters the same thing. so there's still that version of complexity that goes on within it. And I, I think people care less about mobile cuz it impacts people less. Like, you know, there's that whole generation of like, oh, mobile's the future, everything's gonna be mobile, let's not become true. Uh, mobile's very important, but like we have desktops still. We use web software all the time, half the time on mobile. We're just using the web software at the end of the day, so at least we know that's a thing. And I think, so I think that investment in mobile has died down some. Um, but some companies like mobile is like their main experience or one of their driving experience is like a, like a company like DoorDash, mobile is as important as web, if not more, right? Because of like the types of customers. Spotify probably same thing, but I don't know, Sentry. We don't need a mobile app, who cares? It's irrelevant to the problem space, right? And so I, I think it's just not quite taken on. And so mobile is still like this secondary citizen at a lot of companies, and I think the evolution of it has been like complicated. And so I, I think a lot of the problems are known, but maybe people care less or there's just less customers. And so the weight doesn't, like, the weight is wildly different. Like JavaScript's probably like a hundred times the size from an investment point of view for everyone in the world than say mobile applications are, is how I would think about it. And so whether mobile is or isn't solved is almost irrelevant to the, the, the like general problem at hand. and I think at the very least, like mobile applications, there's like, there's like a tool chain where you can debug a lot of stuff that works fairly well and hasn't changed over the years, whereas like the web you have like browser tools, but that's about it. So. Mobile apps can have large binaries or pull in lots of dependencies at runtime [00:49:16] Jeremy: So I guess with mobile. Um, I was initially thinking of native apps, but you're, you're bringing up that there's actually people who would make a native app that's just a web view for a webpage, or there's React native or there's flutters, so there's actually, it really isn't standard how to make a mobile app. [00:49:36] David: Yeah. And even within those, it comes back to like, okay, is it now the same problem where we're loading in a bunch of JavaScript or downloading a bunch of JavaScript and content remotely and stuff? And like, you'll see this when you install a mobile app, and sometimes the binaries are huge, right? Sometimes they're really small, and then you load it up and it's downloading like several gigs of data and stuff, right? And those are completely different patterns. And even within those like subsets, I'm sure the implementations are wildly different, right? And so, you know, I, that may not be the same as like the runtime kind of changing, but I remember there was this, uh, this must be a decade ago. I, I used, I still am a gamer, but. Um, early in my career I worked a lot with like games like World of Warcraft and stuff, and I remember when games started launching progressive loading where it's like you could download a small chunk of the game and actually start playing and maybe the textures were lower, uh, like resolution and everything was lower fidelity and, and you could only go so far until the game fully installed. But like, imagine like if you're like focused on performance or something like that, measuring it there is completely different than measuring it once, say everything's installed, you know? And so I think those often become very complex use cases. And I think that used to be like an extreme edge case that was like such a, a hyper-specific optimization for like what The Warcraft, which is like one of the biggest games of all time that it made sense, you know, okay, whatever. They can build their own custom tooling and figure it out from there. And now we've taken that degree of complexity and tried to apply it to everything in the world. And it's like uhoh, like nobody has the teams or the, the, the talent or the, the experience to necessarily debug a lot of these complicated problems just like Sentry like. You know, we're not dealing with React internals. If something's wrong in the React internals, it's like somebody might be able to figure it out, but it's gonna take us so much time to figure out what's going on, versus, oh, we're rendering some html. Cool. We understand how it works. It's, it's a known, known problem. We can debug it. Like there's nothing to even debug most of the time. Right. And so, I, I don't know, I think the industry has to get to a place where you can reason about the software, where you have the calculator, right. And you don't have to figure out how the calculator works. You just can trust that it's gonna work for you. How Sentry's stack has become more complex over time [00:51:35] Jeremy: so kind of. Shifting over a little bit to Sentry's internals. You, you said that Sentry started in, was it 2008 you said? [00:51:47] David: Uh, the open source project was in 2008. Yeah. [00:51:50] Jeremy: The stack that's used in Sentry has evolved. Like I remembered that there was a period where I think you could run it with a pretty minimal stack, like I think it may have even supported SQLite. [00:52:02] David: Yeah. [00:52:03] Jeremy: And so it was something that people could run pretty easily on their own. But things have, have obviously changed a lot. And so I, I wonder if you could speak to sort of the evolution of that process. Like when do you decide like, Hey, this thing that I built in 2008, Is, you know, not gonna cut it. And I really need to re-architect what this system is. [00:52:25] David: Yeah, so I don't know if that's actually the reality of why things have changed, that it's like, oh, this doesn't work anymore. We've definitely introduced complexity in the sense of like, probably the biggest shift for Sentry was like, it used to be everything, and it was a SQL database, and everything was kind of optional. I think half that was maintainable because it was mostly built by. And so I could maintain like an architectural vision that kept it minimal. I had the experience to figure it out and duct tape the right things. Um, so that was one thing. And I think eventually, you know, that doesn't scale as you're trying to do more and build more into the product. So there's some complexity there. but for the most part you can, it can still