Podcast appearances and mentions of rich stearns

Play Episode Listen Later Sep 3, 2024 19:38

[00:00:00] Samuel Chiang I would say to an upstart, boards are extremely demanding. And sometimes, those boards are like your father and mother, and they want to actually be helicoptering you all along. Be certain that you have people who are for you and not people who are wanting to have their agenda done through you. It's probably the number one thing, and you say, what does that mean to have people who are for you, people who are going to be praying with you through the thin and thick things, and they not only believe in the vision, but also, they will call you to accountability because they know it's good and proper for you. +++++++++++= [00:00:47] Tommy Thomas: Today, we're continuing the conversation we began last week with Samuel Chiang. In this episode, Samuel delves into the intersections of faith and technology. He discusses his journey from Taiwan to becoming a global leader in Bible translation and digital innovation. He shares insights on how artificial intelligence and emerging technologies are transforming the nonprofit sector. He also reflects on the challenges and opportunities of leading in a complex and rapidly changing world. Samuel's thoughtful perspectives offer valuable lessons for leaders in any sector, particularly those navigating the intersection of faith in technology. This episode is a must listen for anyone interested in leadership, innovation and the impact of technology on global missions. Join me as we pick up where we left off last week. [00:01:46] Tommy Thomas: If you were writing a book on the burdens of leadership that only the President or the CEO could uniquely bear, what would be some of your topics or chapters you would discuss? [00:01:59] Samuel Chiang: Yeah, so this is a very interesting question. For me, at the stage of life I'm in now and looking back, I think I would be consistent to say that the formation of the soul in a leader and in discipling and mentoring is absolutely critical. [00:02:27] Samuel Chiang: And quite frankly, I'm thankful that I have been mentored by books in many different ways. Whether it's your classic Bobby Clinton, The Making of a Leader, or your Bill Hall, he wrote a trilogy of books, Disciple Making Pastors and things like that. Those sorts of things spoke into my life very deeply and it's been a part of my practice. My practice has been, how does a leader disciple? In a workplace and really, quite frankly, in a non for profit to a for profit, both our workplaces, the discipling in both mentoring must go on in both. But when you move into a C suite level, there is an extra dimension in terms of the formation of the soul formation, in the C suites. What is it God is up to, to have individuals in the C suites and how are they dealing with things on the inside? Those are very important topics. [00:03:32] Tommy Thomas: Any books you're reading on those topics that people might learn from. [00:03:38] Samuel Chiang: Oh, there have been many different books. Probably, Jim Wilder, is a wonderful, great read. Others would be thin little books, but profound, equally. And I read them over and over, Ari Nguyen's books. I would say they're very important as well for the soul. I would say also those books are not ones in which people want to learn how to, those ones are much more feeding into the being side. How am I, and what are my biggest shadows? That is a detriment for leading others. [00:04:01] Tommy Thomas: Maybe a lighter question. If you were a judge on a nonprofit version of Shark Tank, and people were coming to you for early-stage investments, what questions have you got to have answers to before you open your checkbook? [00:04:43] Samuel Chiang: Oh, yeah. Okay. What is the problem that you're trying to solve? What is your purpose? And who is on your board? [00:04:51] Tommy Thomas: Unpack the board piece for a minute. Boards are so critical. And what are you telling an upstart about their board? [00:05:04] Samuel Chiang: Yeah. I would say to an upstart, boards are extremely demanding. And sometimes, those boards are like your father and mother, and they want to be helicoptering you all along. Be certain that you have people who are for you and not people who are wanting to have their agenda done through you. It's probably the number one thing, and you say, what does that mean to have people who are for you, people who are going to be praying with you through the thin and thick things, and they not only believe in the vision, but also they will call you to accountability because they know it's good and proper for you. [00:05:52] Samuel Chiang: And people who are for you, probably, I always look for advisors or board members who are, if you will, not only right handed, but some of them would be left handed. We need both sides of people who are highly logical, but also highly creative. And so therefore, many people who are startups, have to pivot. They have to be agile. They must think laterally and people who are very logical might not be able to pivot as quickly, but people who are highly creative could maybe see the things that the entrepreneur startup sees. So, you need a combination of both. And I will highly always recommend both men and women. The perspectives are real and they're meaningful. [00:06:46] Tommy Thomas: Do you think it's important to have someone on the board who's a logical, or a natural critic, you say you want people for you and I get that. And then I see the piece about, holding you accountable. If I remember right, I think Rich Stearns told me at World Vision at each Board Meeting, they appoint, and they got a name for this person, but this person is supposed to say, yeah, but he or she is supposed to listen and then come back with a counter argument. [00:07:17] Samuel Chiang: Yeah. Okay. The original question was about a startup. And then it applies whether you're going to have a counter argument. Would you have somebody who is going to be an appointed critic or appointed somebody who's going to say the bots. Absolutely. That would be healthy for the board. And I used the word health in a very, meaningful way. You don't need just help, but you need health in the board and the health of the board, should have somebody who's going to be an open critic, constructive, and positive. For the whole board to receive those thoughts. It's absolutely important. +++++++++++= [00:08:09] Tommy Thomas: Let's stick with our startup nonprofit. You're developing a dashboard to help the founder get at their health. What dials are you putting on the dashboard? [00:08:20] Samuel Chiang: Wow. I will say, on the dials, I would want to know, what are we measuring? And, depending on the type of nonprofits, I would say, yes, you want to measure your financial health, but you want to be able to measure your human health. You want to be able to measure your social capital health, depending on the type of not for profit. You may also want to measure your natural health. So, there's several different items to measure from your human capital, financial capital, social capital, natural capital, and then, on a dashboard, I also will want to know what is our pathway to solving the problem. [00:09:06] Samuel Chiang: For any social entrepreneur, you have to ask the question, for the Shark Tank question that you're asking. What was your purpose? What problems are you trying to solve? And who's on your board? You have to have a clear pathway to solve your problem. And then, probably, what does sustainability look like in multiple horizons? [00:09:32] Tommy Thomas: I've read two or three articles in the past six months, about the productivity of people that would be my age and your age and older. And it seems like a lot of us are pretty productive. After working your way through a career, do you have any thoughts on employing people in their upper years and what you might expect there. [00:10:00] Samuel Chiang: For people who are in their upper years, I will want to say to them, you still have a lot to offer, and that offering is for people to be taken either one sip at a time, one bite at a time. You cannot give it to them all at once. And nobody wants it all at once. It may not be relevant all at once. And I would say to be very selective on the assignments that you're going to take. Be watching out for the talent that may be placed in front of you. And it would be wonderful if the relationship developed with those talents are such that they're coming for you. So, they want to learn from you. That's a whole lot easier than if you want others to learn about you. Ao those are some initial things I would say. [00:11:07] Tommy Thomas: Let's go to succession planning. You've experienced that in different organizations. I'm sure on boards you've sat on, y'all have done it. What's the pros and cons of promoting from within to the CEO chair? [00:11:25] Samuel Chiang: Yeah, so it really depends on the season that the organization is in. Sometimes, it is better to bring somebody from the outside. I would say this in a healthy organization that's larger, if leaders develop, the way the management system works, I would say it would be, my preference would be to promote someone from within for a larger organization than to bring them out from the outside. Yeah, it does matter depending on the season the organization is in. [00:12:04] Tommy Thomas: How much of a role should the outgoing CEO play in hiring his or her successor? [00:12:11] Samuel Chiang: Again, it depends on the stage of the organization. I would say that the hiring process probably is best as a muted voice rather than an active voice, because it's really the board's responsibility. And, to have a CEO, to have an active voice, some dynamics just get weird. And then, if there's an active voice by the outgoing CEO, on the next hire, and the next hire did not go well, et cetera, too many dynamics. So better to be muted. [00:12:52] Tommy Thomas: What about the outgoing CEO maybe sticking around in an emeritus role as emeritus CEO, or even serving on the board? [00:13:03] Samuel Chiang: Yeah. I have met with a situation in one of the boards I currently sit on, the outgoing CEO or former leader is in the emeritus role. As long as there is a real understanding of that emeritus role in terms of a job description. Pretty boxy. And if there's a continued passion for that person to be in the boxy emeritus role, I'm all for it. ++++++++++++++ [00:13:37] Tommy Thomas: Let's go to a couple of quotes I wanted to get your response to. If you never color outside the lines, the picture will never change. [00:13:49] Samuel Chiang: Yeah, I totally agree. Tommy Thomas: And y'all did a little bit of that, with Wycliffe and the Seed Company. [00:13:56] Samuel Chiang: Oh, we did. And I think they still do. [00:14:02] Tommy Thomas: No matter what job you have in life, your success will be determined 5 percent by your academic credentials, 15 percent by your professional experience, and 80 percent by your communication skills. [00:14:16] Samuel Chiang: Yeah, I agree with that. And I think the communication skills are one of EQ, because I'm thinking in a smaller startup and the median size organization. Yes. Your communication skills are really you at the leader, but even at larger organizations, that communication skill could be outsourced by other people and, outsourced to someone who has your voice and writing things for you, but you yourself must have that ability to be relational with your colleagues and with people who are in your company work organization. [00:15:00] Tommy Thomas: Never tell people how to do things, tell them what to do. And they will surprise you with their ingenuity. General George Patton. [00:15:11] Samuel Chiang: Yeah, I totally agree with that. Yeah, and especially these days with all the generative AI and all that stuff. [00:15:20] Samuel Chiang: Yeah, you try to outsmart that. No, you're not going to, it's not going to happen. So, I agree with General George Patton. [00:15:28] Tommy Thomas: A lot of people have said they, I guess their persona of General Patton is that he would have never operated that way. I've not read enough about him to make a meaningful comment there. [00:15:39] Samuel Chiang: Yeah, it would. I'm still learning, so I'll have to find out. [00:15:47] Tommy Thomas: Yeah, let's go back to board for a minute. Here's a quote. The fewer board members, the better. If it's 18, I'm just not interested. Ernest Happel. [00:15:56] Samuel Chiang: I totally agree. It's very difficult. Yeah, Jesus had a reason for a dozen. [00:16:07] Tommy Thomas: Let's close this thing out with a couple of, maybe penetrating questions. If you had a do over in life to do, what would it be? [00:16:27] Samuel Chiang: Probably I would maybe want to stay at home a little bit more, travel a little bit less. In 1992 to 2000, 2001, it was 100, 120 days a year. 2002 to 2016 was about 150, 160 days a year and it went down a little bit and right now it's gone back up. I would say I would maybe want to travel a little bit less. Though I will say this. I have always asked our kids, would you like me to be gone during the week and come home on the weekends? We're taking longer trips and then staying home longer. They, without fail said, no, take short trips, always be home on the weekends. That's what we practiced. [00:17:22] Samuel Chiang: Yeah, as far as redo - No, I think other than that, I don't think there's too many things that I would want to redo. [00:17:30] Tommy Thomas: Yeah. If you could tell a younger version of yourself one thing, what would it be? [00:17:40] Samuel Chiang: I probably would say something to the effect, don't just think about discipleship and mentorship of others. Think about your interior life earlier and how God is actively creating that infrastructure, the interior life. And that's probably something I would want a younger leader to hear, learn, and experience earlier. ++++++++++++++ [00:18:11] Tommy Thomas: Tommy Thomas: Thank you for joining us today. If you are a first-time listener, I hope you will subscribe and become a regular. You can find links to all the episodes at our website: www.jobfitmatters.com/podcast. If there are topics you'd like for me to explore, my email address is tthomas@jobfitmatters.com. Word of mouth has been identified as the most valuable form of marketing. Surveys tell us that consumers believe recommendations from friends and family over all other forms of advertising. If you've heard something today that's worth passing on, please share it with others. You're already helping me make something special for the next generation of nonprofit leaders. I'll be back next week with a new episode. Until then, stay the course on our journey to help make the nonprofit sector more effective and sustainable. Links and Resources JobfitMatters Website NextGen Nonprofit Leadership with Tommy Thomas The Perfect Search - What every board needs to know about hiring their next CEO Beyond Literate Western Models - Contextualizing Theological Education in Oral Contexts - Samuel Chiang Orality Breakouts - Using Heart Language to Transform Hearts - Samuel Chiang & Avery T. Willis Connect tthomas@jobfitmatters.com Follow Tommy on LinkedIn Listen to NextGen Nonprofit Leadership with Tommy Thomas on: Apple Podcasts | Spotify

Navigating Nonprofit Leadership: Vonna Laue on Team Dynamics and Personal Growth

Play Episode Listen Later Jul 23, 2024 38:17

[00:00:00] Vonna Laue: One of the indicators for nonprofits that anyone who hears me speak knows that I'm always going to harp on a little bit, and that is available cash. Not just cash, because you can look at the balance sheet and see, wow, we've got $700,000 in cash. If that's what the board looks at and starts making decisions based on, you could find yourself in trouble because the available cash that I'm talking about takes that cash number, but then it subtracts two things out of there. [00:00:33] Vonna Laue: It subtracts the things that we're going to pay this week. So maybe we've got payroll coming up this week and we've got a bunch of accounts we're going to pay. I'm going to take that out of there. And I'm also going to take out any temporarily restricted funds that have been given by donors for a specific purpose. If those amounts are held in that cash number, I'm going to back those out. If you back out those two things, that $700,000 might be $200,000. And that board and those leaders are going to make significantly different decisions based on $700,000 versus $200,000. Right? That's a financial metric. ++++++++++++++++ [00:01:10] Tommy Thomas: You and I have a mutual friend, Alec Hill, former President of InterVarsity. And he wrote of some of the pain and suffering he experienced while being the President of Intervarsity. And he writes, if we pause and reflect long enough, pain is a great teacher. Our character can be transformed more through a day of suffering than a month of study. As I think about your book that's coming out here in a couple of weeks, I would imagine that played into the writing of the book. [00:01:39] Vonna Laue: You are absolutely correct. So, the book is Glad I Didn't Know, and then it's subtitled Lessons Learned Through Life's Challenges and Unexpected Blessings, so it absolutely does play into that. The premise of the book is that there are a lot of difficult things that we go through that if we'd known in advance, we would have done everything we could to avoid those, but if we had avoided those, we'd have missed out on what God had planned for us and the lessons that we learned as a result of it. [00:02:12] Vonna Laue: The flip side of that is also the unexpected blessings. And when I look at things like serving on the World Vision Board, if someone had told me in advance, you're going to be on the World Vision Board. I'd have thought, okay, I need this education and I need this experience and I need to network with this person, and I'd have totally messed it up. But I just faithfully follow one thing to the next. And so would totally agree with Alec there. And I'm glad I don't know a lot of the things that I'm going to go through. And each time we go through something, it makes it a little bit easier the next time to look back on the faithfulness of God and realize, okay, we're going to come out the other side of this and there will be blessings as a result of it, even though it's a challenge at the time. [00:03:01] Tommy Thomas: What lesson did you learn from writing this book? A real practical question. [00:03:07] Vonna Laue: Yeah. One of the things that just in the process that I learned initially, I had chapters for the whole book, and I was just going to write their life stories. And then in some discussions and some just careful consideration, I realized if I did that, it would be really easy for a reader to say, oh, that's nice for that person and dismiss it. And the applicability that it had to their lives. And so, within the book, there are 16 other contributors that all contributed a story of their life that they were glad they didn't know. And so, the encouragement there and just the lesson was if we're willing to be honest with ourselves and honest with those around us, we've all got those stories and in sharing them, there is a blessing to be had both by the giver and the receiver. [00:04:09] Vonna Laue: Tommy, I had a number of people that wrote chapters that when they submitted them said something like, I needed to do that. Or it was a blessing to me to go through this, and there were a few people that I had ideas of the stories that they would contribute because I knew specific things about their life. But all of them, I just asked them to do a story. And many of the ones that I thought the story they would do was not the story. They actually contributed. And so fun to see, just how God's orchestrated that. [00:04:45] Tommy Thomas: What's the most dangerous behavior trait that you've seen that can derail a leader's career? [00:04:54] Vonna Laue: I'm going to look at, especially those who have been leading for a long time. A few years ago, I was pondering a few of the leaders that had not finished well. And, you get, I think you use the word distinguished when you introduced me and I translated that to experienced or old, one of the two, some length of time and so as I think about that, it really hit home. Partially because of the people and the disappointment that I had in the situation, but partially because I realized I'm not in the first half of my career. And so, I want to make sure that I do what I can to finish well. And so back to your question. One of the things that really came out to me was the idea of having people speak truth into your life. The more experience we gain in leadership, the scarcer it becomes to have people who will candidly share the truth with us. With time, leaders tend to surround themselves with fewer people who are ready to speak honestly and openly with them. [00:05:51] Vonna Laue: And the longer we lead, the fewer people I find that leaders have around them that are willing to speak truth into them. We talk about being put on a pedestal. That can happen in a number of different ways. It doesn't mean we're famous. Doesn't mean we have all the glory that some of the people you would think of might have. It can happen to any leader, but we rise up far enough in our career or our organization that we just don't have as many close confidants around us that will challenge us. That will speak truth. And I think that when that happens is when people are more likely to not finish well. [00:06:38] Tommy Thomas: I'm sure. Ross Hoskins at One Hope, he says, surround yourself with people who know you better than yourself and will tell you the truth out of love. This is how we grow. [00:06:49] Vonna Laue: Amen. He just perfectly summarized what I would agree with. Perfectly. [00:06:57] Tommy Thomas: So, if you were going to write another book and this book was going to be about the burdens of leadership that only the president or the CEO can bear, what would be some of your chapter headings? [00:07:10] Vonna Laue: Have to think about that one a little bit……Chapter headings? [00:07:18] Tommy Thomas: Or topics that you think have to be talked about. [00:07:22] Vonna Laue: Yep. I think the topics definitely are similar to what was just said, choosing people that are extremely accomplished to be around you. We talk about having smarter people than you. I'm a big fan of that. I would also say working in a team. We are not as good by ourselves as we are with a team around us. And so, when you're looking at that key leadership position, you're only as good as the team that is around you. I think also you've got to have that personal and spiritual aspect to it. So encouraging leaders, I often find, and as I speak on personal leadership, when I'm at my busiest, the two things that are easiest for me to give up are my workout and my devotion time. The two things I need most when I'm busiest are my workout and my devotion time [00:08:19] Vonna Laue: The two things I need most when I'm busiest are my workout and my devotion time. And so reminding leaders that you're only as good as you are healthy. That's really important and that's, in a number of different way,s that health spiritually that health physically and the health relationally, you know that you don't sacrifice those relationships that are closest to you because you don't get the time back. We often say I'll do that when this project is over. I'll do that when this season is over. And I think all of the people listening to this podcast probably realize there is no normal, right? We used to say when things get back to normal, I'll do this. And that hectic life that we live as Americans, I think is just normal. And so those are a few of the keys that I think are so crucial for leaders. [00:09:18] Tommy Thomas: I remember when I interviewed Rich Stearns and I'm not going to remember the person's name, but he was talking about his career at Parker Brothers, and he said that there was one of the people in the family that didn't know anything at all about toys, but he knew how to hire a team and that was what made the success of Parker Brothers was this man's ability to bring people onto the team that could lead. [00:09:41] Vonna Laue: I would fully agree with that. I mentioned that I usually am doing a lot of different things. So right now, I'm serving as the COO and CFO of an organization and director of internal audit for another one and doing some audit and advisory with a third and some projects, all of that. But the way that works is the teams that are established in each of those places. Within the team, the mission's organization where I serve, the director of global services role that I have, that's like the COO role, that has operations and finance and personnel and IT and security, that's a lot just in and of itself, but I have four phenomenal directors. That they need encouragement. [00:10:31] Vonna Laue: They need a champion, and they need a sounding board. And as long as I can provide those things, they will do their roles far better than I ever could. In fact, I often say when you hire, you better keep them happy and keep them around because you probably can't do their job. +++++++++++++++ [00:10:50] Tommy Thomas: If you were creating a dashboard to get at a nonprofit organization's health, what would be some of your dials? [00:10:57] Vonna Laue: Oh, I love dashboards. You just spoke one of my love languages there. So, one of the things that I think is key to a dashboard is that I'm a CPA, so it has to have some financial indicators on it, right? [00:11:11] Tommy Thomas: Absolutely. [00:11:13] Vonna Laue: You have to have those. And the basic ones, you're going to have some things like where you are versus, actual. And you're gonna do some trend analysis in that a little bit, I say, this way in a church. Everybody knows it's December. What season of the year is the lowest attendance and the lowest giving season? Always summer, right? And how do we know that? It's because of trends. And so, trend information can be really helpful. So, I think that a dashboard should include trends. One of the indicators for nonprofits that anyone who hears me speak knows that I'm always going to harp on a little bit, and that is available cash. [00:12:08] Vonna Laue: So not just cash, because you can look at the balance sheet and see, wow, we've got $700,000 cash. If that's what the board looks at and starts making decisions based on, you could find yourself in trouble because the available cash that I'm talking about takes that cash number, but then it subtracts two things out of there. It subtracts the things that we're going to pay this week. So maybe we've got payroll coming up this week and we've got a bunch of accounts we're going to pay. I'm going to take that out of there. And I'm also going to take out any temporarily restricted funds that have been given by donors for a specific purpose. [00:12:46] Vonna Laue: If those amounts are held in that cash number, I'm going to back those out. If you back out those two things, that $700,000 might be $200,000. And that board and those leaders are going to make significantly different decisions based on $700,000 versus $200,000. Right? That's a financial metric. But as far as dashboards as a whole, my real encouragement there is to look at what your key drivers are. So, look at the financial pieces that you need to monitor, but also look at your non-financial and make sure that they are included in that dashboard as well. Maybe it's your turnover percentage. Maybe it's your involvement in X program. How many meals are we feeding? How many beds have we provided depending on what your program is, but that dashboard report ought to tie to whatever your strategic plan is, so the strategic things that you're looking at. Those are the guideposts of that dashboard that you're going to be monitoring to make sure that your strategic plan is being fulfilled. [00:14:00] Tommy Thomas: On a little bit lighter note, but still probably following the same track. If you were a judge on a non-profit version of the Shark Tank and people were coming to you for early-stage investments, what questions would you need solid answers to before you would open your checkbook? [00:14:18] Vonna Laue: I'm always going to want to know what their budgeting process is. Again, you're asking an accountant. I want to understand that. I want to understand who they've vetted this with. What are the focus groups that you've talked to? Who are the mentors or coaches that have processed this with you? What are your strengths? And where you don't have strengths, who are the people that you have identified and already discussed with that are going to come around you to shore up those weaknesses, if you will. So those are a few of the things that I want to make sure that this is well thought out and it's not just the flavor of the week. [00:15:00] Tommy Thomas: Let's go to board service for a few minutes. So, you're now the chairman of the World Vision Board, or the chairperson, I guess I should say. Give us some highlights of what you've learned about the Chairman's role. I know you watched Joan for several years and watched her successes, and I'm sure lack of on some days. What have you learned there? [00:15:22] Vonna Laue: I will tell you, Tommy, when they asked me if I would consider taking the chair role, the first thing I said was, did you ask this individual? And I named someone from the Board, and they said, yes. And he serves on a couple of large for-profit boards and doesn't have the time and capacity. And I said, okay, as long as you've shown the discernment that you asked him first, we're good. But then I actually went to that individual and I said, if I do this, will you coach me? Would you be willing to debrief with me after the meetings? [00:16:01] Vonna Laue: And honestly, we just finished up meetings on Tuesday this week. And he and I have a call scheduled for Monday. And he said I'd love to do that. He graciously agreed. And so that, to me, was important. Because I didn't know the role. I had served on the board, but that role is different. And so, the relationship between the Board Chair and the CEO is obviously the most critical. We have a pretty, no, we have a very sophisticated board. I'm odd by who God has assembled in that room. And so, when I first came into it, I would say I was just trying not to embarrass myself, but they are such a gracious group of people. "To run an effective Board Meeting, I review agendas and pre-reads in advance, addressing my questions beforehand so meeting time is focused on others' concerns." [00:16:51] Vonna Laue: And it's important to me that the meetings are well run. And that means I want to see the agendas in advance and speak into those. I want to see the pre reads in advance and have gone through all of those so that if I have questions, I can answer them. I'm not asking those questions during the meeting that's reserved for others, and that those may be questions that others would have. So, let's get those addressed in the pre reads or be prepared. So, I think that the preparation that goes into the time before the meetings is critical. ++++++++++++++= [00:17:26] Tommy Thomas: So, here's a couple of quotes about boards and board chairs. And one is the Chair and the CEO must learn to dance together. And neither can stray very far from each other's gaze or proceed independently. [00:17:42] Vonna Laue: Yeah, I would agree with that. Those are two key roles in the organization. And you have to, I'll use the same analogy I used before. You better be pulling in the same direction. The Board Chair has a responsibility to be the voice on behalf of the Board, and so I feel like that's an important responsibility that it's not Vonna's opinion that I take into there. I seek wise counsel from my board and want to make sure that when I'm having conversations with my CEO, that either the board is informed about those things or that, I'm able to speak on their behalf. But on the day-to-day interactions, if you will, or week to week, those two leaders better be aligned. [00:18:30] Tommy Thomas: Another one, Dr. Rebecca Basinger. Governing boards are charged with safeguarding an institution's ability to fulfill its mission with economic vitality. To this I add, responsibility for tending to the soul of the institution. [00:18:50] Vonna Laue: In an institution like World Vision, the soul of that organization to me is very critical. And it's interesting. I chair the World Vision U. S. Board. I have the privilege of also sitting on the World Vision International Board because we are a federated model and there are World Vision offices around the world and Christ at the center is one of them. It's our foremost principle by which we operate. And, if that's not lived out in the board, the tone at the top is critical for everything. And so, I would agree that the soul of the organization starts with tone at the top. [00:19:32] Tommy Thomas: So, it's been my experience that the good news about having successful executives on the board is they're used to getting things done. The flip side is that they might have a hard time taking off their CEO hat and putting on their board member hat at a board meeting. Have you experienced that? [00:19:53] Vonna Laue: To the credit of the current board that I have at World Vision US, I would say I don't struggle with that there. There is a spirit of collaboration by God's grace that exists within there. And so, people are willing to share their experiences and their opinions, but they're not sold on them. They're very open. Have I experienced it in other boards? Absolutely. And one of the challenges that I see in the nonprofit sector, Tommy, is that there are experienced board members that come in with for profit expertise. [00:20:32] Vonna Laue: Which, 90 percent of the time, is fantastic. 10 percent of the time can be challenging because there are unique things. I say if you don't believe there are uniquenesses, go ask the local Ford dealership how many contributions they've received this month. You know what I mean? They don't get any of those, right. There are some unique things. There are some unique laws and regulations that either do apply specifically or specifically don't apply. And so in some board settings, I've seen where for profit leaders have a hard time taking off that hat and being able to understand the nuances that are involved in a nonprofit organization, but really, it comes down to the spirit of humility and service. [00:21:21] Vonna Laue: And one of the things that when you contacted me first, I believe that you couched it this way and said, would you be willing to be considered for board service at World Vision? And I tell people that I responded to you, I'm willing to be considered, let me pray about it. And that I said, that's not trying to buy time or push you off. I legitimately meant that because I think that you have to be passionate about a ministry or a nonprofit board that you're going to serve on. And if you don't have that passion for that particular organization, then you find another one that you can be, because I think that passion is really important in the boardroom. [00:22:07] Tommy Thomas: You and I are old enough to remember the Enron crisis and of course much has been written about it. One writer said that certainly part of the problem was that the board didn't dig deep enough into the financial situation at Enron. How do you ensure that your board members are asking the right questions? Of course, you've been a CPA, that might be an easier thing than another board chair, but I think that is critical. [00:22:35] Vonna Laue: It is, and there are so many things that we have to balance in board member selection. We want to balance Equity and Diversity. We want to balance, within that age. I just encouraged us earlier to consider younger board members and what they can contribute. One of the considerations is what is the expertise that they bring to the board and what skill sets do we need on the board? And the reason for that is to ask those right questions. If I've got an audit committee and I don't have anyone that understands audit and finance, that's problematic. And there may be some that just said, of course I can tell you I have presented to a number of audit and finance committees in my career. [00:23:27] Vonna Laue: That they didn't have an auditor finance expert in that entire committee. In this day and age, we're looking at who has digital experience, who has cybersecurity, or IT experience, and it changes over time. The needs of the board today are different from the needs of the board 10 or 20 years ago. So that's a challenge to us individually as board members to continue growing and learning. But it's also a challenge to us to make sure that we're recruiting the right board members. So, to your point, you've got people in there that can ask the questions of, is this a good investment? Is there a legal liability associated with this? [00:24:10] Vonna Laue: Have we got the right protections in place? What's the end result of this potentially going to be? We don't make a short-sighted decision that we're looking at the long-term impact. What are the reputational impacts of these? We have two roles on the World Vision U. S. board that are assigned at every board meeting. And one of those is the keeper of the core documents. So that person is responsible throughout the discussions to be considering how that discussion or that particular agenda item is tied to our core documents, if there's any implications, and one of them is the responsible skeptic, and that is a formal role that person is assigned in those board meetings, and as we're having discussion, we want somebody to be identified that will challenge and say, wait a minute, back up. [00:25:01] Vonna Laue: Let's not get into group think here. What about, and that they know that they're not just putting their opinion in their hat that they've got this particular role. So, I think those two roles have been really helpful in our setting for our board. [00:25:15] Tommy Thomas: I spoke to Dr. Linda Livingstone at Baylor. I was asking her about this. I didn't use the word responsible skeptic. I guess I had another phrase, but she said, they usually show up. You don't have to appoint them. [00:25:28] Vonna Laue: I heard that. I heard it when she said that. And I laughed and I thought, that's a healthy board actually, for the most part, because Proverbs talks about iron sharpens iron, and that is really helpful if people are willing to speak up. Oftentimes, we're Christian nice and we don't want to challenge each other and we need to be able to speak up and make sure that all of the facts, all of the considerations are on the table. [00:25:58] Tommy Thomas: I sense that probably the role or the function of risk management has increased for a board over the last decade or two. Am I making a good observation or not? [00:26:13] Vonna Laue: The only thing I would say is that might be the understatement of the year, potentially. Absolutely. The risks that we face and maybe I'm going to oversimplify this, but I think, they used to be known, right? You've got trip hazards. That's a physical risk. You've got the risk of fraud. You put controls in place. Those were known risks. What we face now, to me, are a lot of the unknown risks. What's happening in the cyber world? What's happening with opinions? Reputational risk has increased so significantly, and because it's so easy, and I'll be careful to say this is Vonna's opinion, so please don't ascribe this to any organization that I represent, but, because it's so easy on social media and other media, avenues to state an opinion, and it becomes a perceived fact. [00:27:12] Vonna Laue: Thank you. And for an organization to then have to battle something, that's a reputational risk that we have to consider. And yet we can't control, which is a difficult place to be. [00:27:26] Tommy Thomas: Do y'all have a time in each board meeting where you talk about external threats or is that relegated to your CEO to bring those to the board? How does that work? [00:27:38] Vonna Laue: Practically? Many of the organizations that I'm associated with have an enterprise risk management or a risk assessment process, and there are people within the organization that are specifically identified that are responsible for that. Not that they're responsible for the risks, but they're responsible to make sure that it's updated. The way that I tend to do it with some organizations is, brainstorm across the organization, pulling together leaders from the board. Leaders from different ministries or departments, people in different functional departments, IT, HR, finance, and just let them brainstorm. What are all the risks? [00:28:23] Vonna Laue: I've done this a few times and it's pretty common that you end up with 600-700 risks that are identified and then categorizing those into whatever categories are helpful for you. But things like regulatory, legal, physical, financial, reputational, operational risks. And then once you do that, you can identify what's the likelihood this would happen. And if it did happen, what would the impact be? So low, moderate and high. And that helps you distinguish, like, how significant are these risks? And when you've got them categorized like that, it stands out, like who the owner of that is, right? Those legal risks are either an in-house or an outsourced general counsel, your physical risks might be the facilities people, whoever, but having an owner for those. High and moderate risks should be mitigated through measures such as insurance, internal controls, or policies. High risks, in particular, should be continuously monitored by leaders and the board, to ensure they are well understood and managed effectively. [00:29:16] Vonna Laue: The high and moderate risks ought to have some mitigating measures in place, whether it's insurance or internal controls or policies. And to me, the high risks should always be in front of the leaders and the board. Usually that's an annual process that they would be taking a look at that to make sure that we understand these risks. We're aware of them because we're responsible for them and we also are aware of the mitigating controls that management has put in place and those seem reasonable. So, I don't necessarily feel like at every meeting, sometimes there are committees. World Vision International, I serve on the audit and risk committee. [00:29:59] Vonna Laue: We have it as a specific component of that committee. So every one of our committee meetings, there is a risk component to that we are looking at. But definitely on an annual basis, that ought to be a discussion that boards are having regardless of the size of the organization. +++++++++++++++++ [00:30:15] Tommy Thomas: This could probably be a whole podcast, but maybe we'll probably limit it. But I would be remiss if I didn't ask an artificial intelligence question. I guess that could fall under risk. It could fall under opportunity. Your thoughts as you sit at 50,000 feet looking down on the nonprofit sector, what's going to happen in the coming years that we need to be aware of? [00:30:41] Vonna Laue: I think it's all of the above. It's opportunity. It's risk. I mentioned earlier that boards are encountering different things now than they did 10 years ago, and they have to be learning individually. And as a board, this is a perfect example of that. We, as board members, have to be learning. We have to adjust to and understand this new technology. Actually, our board had the privilege of sitting in an hour-long session this past week with an AI expert. I think we all walked out of there a little terrified and a little concerned about what this looks like. And that's a great place to be, right? [00:31:25] Vonna Laue: Because it means we know that we've got to lean in. I remember a number of years ago, I think it was about 2006, Walt Wilson, who started Global Media Outreach, he had been one of the initial executives at Apple, and I remember sitting with Walt at that time, and he said, the day will come where you just use apps for everything. And I was like, what's an app? And he's like oh, you'll just push a button. And then it'll bring up all the information for that company. And you'll do everything on this app. And I don't know Walt's age exactly, but I would say he was probably in his early seventies at that time. And I was like, that's crazy. [00:32:10] Vonna Laue: And then I realized, now, he was absolutely correct. And he had the foresight to see that. And I tend to believe that's where we will be with AI. This is here. We better figure out how to harness it. We better figure out how to use it well. Organizations are just starting to formulate AI policies, what they will allow, what they won't allow. I fully believe that we'll look back on those initial policies five years from now and laugh at ourselves. But we've got to start somewhere and the ability that it will give us and the doors that it opens. I don't think we should be scared of it. But I think that we have a responsibility to do it. Worry less about being supplanted by a chatbot and more about being outpaced by someone adept at using AI to drive corporate success. [00:32:51] Tommy Thomas: I read an article recently and the guy was talking and he said people shouldn't be worried about being replaced by a chat box or something. They should be more worried about being replaced by somebody who knows how to use artificial intelligence to the advantage of the corporation. [00:33:09] Vonna Laue: Oh, I think that's a great line because the functions that it will be able to take the place of you probably don't need to worry about those, but yeah, the technology that goes along with it, make sure that you're one that knows that. And I'm getting articles from fellow board members on a pretty consistent basis. Some of our staff liaisons in the organizations I serve, there is a lot of information that's out there and I would just encourage any of the board members don't be overwhelmed by it. We all have other responsibilities, right? [00:33:46] Vonna Laue: None of us are going to go get a PhD in AI. But as we start to gain an awareness, I think we'll understand better what our responsibility might be as board members. [00:33:59] Tommy Thomas: Let's try to bring this thing to a close. I've taken probably more of your time than you had allocated for me today and I'm grateful. If you could get a do over in life, what would that be? [00:34:12] Vonna Laue: I mentioned earlier, there were probably a couple of meetings, partner meetings that I wish had gone differently. Quite honestly, Tommy, that's the only do over I might take, but I am very thankful to have lived my life without regrets. And that, to your point about failures and everything else, there's value to be had in the experiences that we have encountered, and to lose out on those. I'd probably just mess something else up. So, I think maybe I'll keep the ones that I have. [00:34:50] Tommy Thomas: Do you have an “I wish I had started this earlier moment in your life?” [00:34:57] Vonna Laue: Oh, I would say the one that I've done often on, that I wish that I was more consistent about, is just memorizing scripture. So I know a lot of people that are good at that. I have gone back to that, incorporating that on a daily basis. And if that's where the foundation of my decision making is coming from, I wish that I had a little bit more of that ingrained. [00:35:25] Tommy Thomas: Final question. If you could give a younger version of yourself a piece of advice, what would it be? [00:35:32] Vonna Laue: I learned this a little bit later. It wasn't too late in life, but one of the most important leadership principles that I feel like I've learned over the years, I'd love to just close with for your group, for your audience. And I think it applies that I would have wanted to know this. As soon as I could, and that is when we have a person in a position that they're not succeeding in, we often in the Christian ministry world feel like we're Christians, we can't let somebody go and I believe that when God calls us to something, he doesn't call us to be miserable or ill equipped for it. [00:36:18] Vonna Laue: And so, when we keep somebody in a position that they are not competent or capable of, we're doing a disservice to them. To two people in two organizations, at least we're doing a disservice to that person because we're keeping them where they can't thrive. And it's very hard to make a change. When I stepped away from the managing partner role, that was incredibly difficult. Most of us don't like change. And so even if we're not happy, and fulfilled in a position, it's still comfortable. So, we're doing a disservice to them. We're doing a disservice to our organization because we don't have the right person in the job. We're doing a disservice to whoever ought to be in that position because we haven't opened it up for them to be there. [00:37:03] Vonna Laue: And we're doing a disservice to whatever organization this person is supposed to work for because we haven't released them to go do that. And so I guess I'd come full circle with something I said earlier, and that is people are the key to what we do, throughout life, in personal matters and professional matters. And so, stewarding the people in our life well is something that I think we all need to do. And it would have been great if I'd have learned that earlier on as well. Links and Resources JobfitMatters Website NextGen Nonprofit Leadership with Tommy Thomas The Perfect Search - What every board needs to know about hiring their next CEO Glad I Didn't Know: Lessons Learned Through Life's Challenges and Unexpected Blessings Connect tthomas@jobfitmatters.com Follow Tommy on LinkedIn Follow Vonna on LinkedIn Listen to NextGen Nonprofit Leadership with Tommy Thomas on: Apple Podcasts | Spotify

From Dairy Queen to Managing Partner in a National CPA Firm - Vonna Laue's Leadership Journey

Play Episode Listen Later Jul 16, 2024 28:01

[00:00:00] Vonna Laue: I started working when I was 13 at Dairy Queen. And if you work at a fast food restaurant, at least at that time, more than six or nine months, you're in a leadership position and you've got a crew that works with you. So I had that opportunity. And one of the biggest things looking back on it, and I didn't actually realize that until our girls got involved, but 4H was huge in my life. And at the time it was fun. I used to horse show and did a lot of the competitions at the county and state level. But when I then took our daughter to a 4H meeting and realized, wow, this is where I learned a lot of my leadership skills. They operate with Robert's rules of order and the kids run the meetings and they're elected to positions. And so I had that opportunity at a really young age. +++++++++++++ [00:00:55] Tommy Thomas: Our guest today is Vonna Laue. Vonna is a distinguished leader in the nonprofit sector, particularly known for her extensive work with churches and ministries. Early in her career, she served as a partner for a national CPA firm specializing in audit, tax, and advisory services for the nonprofit sector. She later took on the role as Executive Vice President at the Evangelical Council for Financial Accountability, where she focused on enhancing trust within the church and ministry communities. Her experience is widely recognized. She has authored multiple articles, co-authored three books, frequently speaks at national and regional conferences, and in 2010, she was inducted into the Church Management Hall of Fame, underscoring her significant contributions to the field. [00:01:45] Tommy Thomas: Vonna, Welcome to NextGen Nonprofit Leadership. [00:01:48] Vonna Laue: Tommy, thanks for having me. It's great to be here. [00:01:50] Tommy Thomas: I've been looking forward to this for a long time. I first met you; I don't know how many years ago it was, but, Rich Stearns, the then President of World Vision had asked me to help him find some board members. [00:02:02] Tommy Thomas: He gave me some parameters and you were the one of the ones that identified. So, I guess that was our first encounter. [00:02:12] Vonna Laue: It was and that was 2016. [00:02:14] Tommy Thomas: In the words of Crosby, Stills, Nash Young, so much water has passed underneath the bridge since then. [00:02:24] Vonna Laue: Amen to that. [00:02:26] Tommy Thomas: Let's give us a few start up questions. I'm always curious, and I don't know these things about you. Before we get too deep into your professional career, take me into your childhood. What was childhood like? [00:02:39] Vonna Laue: I always enjoy telling people that think about birth order, that I'm a fairly complicated person because I was an only child and that automatically raises some red flags for some people. [00:02:53] Vonna Laue: And then when I was eight, my parents divorced and both remarried within about a one-year timeframe, and I became a middle child in two families. So, if you're gonna play the birth order game, I'm gonna give you a lot of information to mull over in that. [00:03:09] Tommy Thomas: Where was your childhood geographically? [00:03:13] Vonna Laue: Absolutely. I grew up in South Dakota, which is one of the smallest populated states in the country. There were two stop lights in the town my mom was in and one stop light in the town my dad was in. We may get into it more, but I had the privilege of going to a Christian school. And so, I tell people there were three in my graduating high school class. It was a definitely small-town America, and everyone knew what you were doing pretty much all the time. [00:03:46] Tommy Thomas: Now we've heard these stories; Even my parents who were raised in Alabama and Georgia, they didn't have the snow part, but they had the part about walking to school five to six miles a day uphill. In South Dakota, did you have to walk to school in the snow several miles a day? [00:04:03] Vonna Laue: I walked to the bus stop, and because I went to a Christian school, we wore skirts and dresses every day. And it didn't matter if it was 20 above or 20 below. And they also didn't have snow days when I was a kid. You went to school unless it was absolutely catastrophic. So yeah, I walked to the bus stop in the snow, in a skirt, many times, every winter. [00:04:30] Tommy Thomas: Thinking back, what was the greatest gift you think your parents gave to you? [00:04:36] Vonna Laue: Actually, it was that very thing of education. When my parents, even when they were still married and we were living in a small town, they wanted me to get an education. And the best way to do that in their mind was through the local Christian school. And so, while my parents were in a mainline denomination and didn't have a relationship with Christ, that's where I went to school. And those three years and the education and the relationships that the Lord gave me there were critical for me. [00:05:09] Vonna Laue: And then when life changed drastically and over the next four years, we moved multiple times and were in different education settings. I kept begging to go back to a Christian school. And so ultimately my seventh-grade year was able to do that, in a different Christian school. And again, they agreed to that because of the education that they felt like I would receive there, but it was through that I came to Christ. So, I'm a big proponent of Christian education. And subsequently, my parents, grandparents came to Christ. They didn't know it at the time, they weren't doing it for that reason, but that was by far the biggest gift they gave me. [00:05:50] Tommy Thomas: You turned out at least initially as a CPA, was that a dream from high school? [00:05:57] Vonna Laue: It wasn't. I don't remember, sometimes there are people that remember what they wanted to do in elementary school and that's what they did. We sponsored cadets at the Air Force Academy, and one of those wanted to be a fighter pilot from the time he was five years old, had every plane hanging in his room and to this day he is a fighter pilot. That wasn't me. I didn't have that idea when I was little. When I got into middle school, I was volunteering at a hospital and thought I'd go into nursing and then wasn't really wild about nursing. And so, when I initially started taking college classes, I thought that I would major in chemistry and physics. [00:06:37] Vonna Laue: And had a semester that I was able to go to Bible college in Minnesota and wanted to take that opportunity. I knew that I couldn't finish there, but wanted to go and take some foundational courses and take things that would transfer back to a state university in South Dakota. And when I went, one of the classes that I took was an accounting class. And I took that class and I thought, this is easy. And then I looked around and realized, not everybody in this class thinks this is easy. Maybe there's something to that. And so, it was then, and I to this day wish that I had gone back to that professor, and just let him know the way that changed the course of my career. [00:07:23] Tommy Thomas: Gosh, I remember my two accounting courses in graduate school. I couldn't say that they were easy. Probably the first one was easier. We were taught our first accounting course by the CFO of Coca Cola Bottling Company in Birmingham. He brought stuff from the office every day to the classroom at night. I think that made accounting maybe a little bit more tolerable for me. [00:07:45] Vonna Laue: Yeah. Real world application, I think does make it at least a lot more enjoyable. ++++++++++++++ [00:07:50] Tommy Thomas: What's something that people are always surprised to find out about you? [00:07:53] Vonna Laue: I usually can pull a few of those out. I would say the one I would share with you and your listeners today is, I was apparently the nation's youngest emergency medical technician and always will be because they passed a regulation not long after I got licensed, but I was 13 when I licensed as an EMT. [00:08:14] Vonna Laue: So that usually surprises people. [00:08:17] Tommy Thomas: That's a good conversation starter. [00:08:21] Vonna Laue: I thought you might like that one. [00:08:23] Tommy Thomas: So, you're out of college now. You're in accounting. Can you think back to your first management job and when you had somebody reporting to you? What can you tell us about that? [00:08:37] Vonna Laue: I'm thankful. I'm going to back up a little bit just in the leadership journey because I'm thankful for the opportunities I had even when it wasn't my career, if you will. I started working when I was 13 at Dairy Queen. And if you work at a fast-food restaurant, at least at that time, more than six or nine months, you're in a leadership position and you've got a crew that works with you. So, I had that opportunity. And one of the biggest things that looking back on it, and I didn't realize that until our girls got involved, but 4H was huge in my life. And at the time it was fun. I used to horse show and did a lot of the competitions at the county and state level. [00:09:23] Vonna Laue: But when I then took our daughter to a 4H meeting and realized, wow, this is where I learned a lot of my leadership skills. They operate with Robert's rules of order and the kids run the meetings and they're elected to positions. And so, I have that opportunity at a really young age. Obviously when I came into the CPA firm, I served there 20 years and over the course of that time, started as a staff accountant and just worked my way up from there into a senior role and a manager role, a partner role, and then ultimately when I left the firm, left as the managing partner at the time of the national firm, so a lot of opportunities and challenges along the way in that, but I think probably the biggest thing is just how important people are and the way that you treat them and the relationships that you develop with them, not in a way that you're manipulative. But in a way that you truly are investing in them, that will serve you and your organization well, but it goes with them wherever they go beyond there. [00:10:37] Vonna Laue: So I look at that as an opportunity to make an investment long-term in a person. [00:10:42] Tommy Thomas: So if we could go back to that last three or four years in the CPA world, and here you are the managing partner, and you let me come into your staff meeting one day and after about five minutes, we dismissed you and I was talking to the staff and I asked them, what's the most exciting thing about working for Vonna? What do you think they would have said? [00:11:04] Vonna Laue: It's a great and scary thought all at the same time. I think that I would take them on the people journey with me, if you will. When I left and moved from our Colorado offices to the California offices, one of the things that really blessed me was one of the staff people that I worked with said, when you traveled with Vonna, she invested in the people in the hotel. When we would go to visit the same client year after year, the hotel clerks knew her because she would take time to visit with them and invest in them. I think sometimes that was annoying to people, and sometimes it was good, but created some interesting and maybe even exciting things along the way. [00:11:52] Vonna Laue: We had a brand-new staff accountant one time, and we were driving back from an audit between Denver and Colorado Springs, and there was a wreck that happened right in front of us. And this poor staff accountant hadn't worked there for a week or two, and I pulled over and threw him the keys to the car and my cell phone and told him to call 911. And I just got out, and he had no idea what this accountant was doing. So I created some excitement, I think, just by the different ways that I would interact with people. [00:12:22] Tommy Thomas: If I flip that coin, what would they say was the most challenging aspect of working for you? [00:12:29] Vonna Laue: I tend to do a lot of different things. I think you've come to know that about me over the years, Tommy. And I try very hard to let people know that my busyness is my problem and not theirs, but I think that people often are concerned that they're a bother or they're concerned they can't get time. So, I try to work with the people closest to me frequently on how best to manage. And I'm sure that's not an easy thing. [00:13:07] Tommy Thomas: Successful people are often asked, what makes you so successful? I'd like to frame the question this way, what's a factor that's helped you succeed that people from the outside probably wouldn't be aware of? [00:13:20] Vonna Laue: I'll start off with the primary one beyond the obvious one and everyone's the Lord, right? And then, and I 100 percent agree with that. If God had only ever given me what I prayed for, I'd have sure missed out on an incredible amount of opportunity. So that is a given. Quite honestly. My husband is very instrumental in my success and a lot of people don't know that because Brian's behind the scenes and most people don't know him, but I talk about being raised in a small town and we still laugh about it to this day, but I was terrified to be around people. We went to a football game one time that had a couple thousand people at it. [00:14:08] Vonna Laue: And I said, would you go get me popcorn? And he said, you can get it yourself. And he wasn't being rude or mean. He just knew that I needed to grow. And I was like, no, I don't need it. And he's like go get your popcorn. And he just has had the foresight over the years to stretch and grow me. And now I think this year I will have probably seven international trips, have the opportunity to speak to hundreds of people at a time, just amazing opportunities and that's a big part of it. But on a personal front, I think that the key to that is being willing to be stretched. That's not easy. It's a lot easier to go with the routine, to go with the things that are known. But when you're willing to open yourself up to opportunities to be stretched, to take advantage of uncomfortable situations, you get a lot more opportunity that follows. ++++++++++++++++ [00:15:11] Tommy Thomas: I'm going to make the assumption here that you've had some good mentors in life. Can you take us down that rabbit trail? [00:15:17] Vonna Laue: I love to talk about mentoring. One of the things that I found throughout a good portion of my career was that it was really hard for me to find a mentor. And the reason that I say that is because I could find godly women who would invest in me personally and spiritually, but many of them had the perspective of a stay-at-home mom and that they didn't understand why I had the desire to have a career. I love my girls who are grown now, but always laughed that they would not have wanted me at home with them all the time because I don't care that you're two. You should be able to organize your closet by short sleeve, long sleeve, skirts, dresses, get it organized. So, I had that challenge, with those women that I wanted to speak into that portion of my life. And then when I looked for someone who professionally could invest and develop me, there was almost the opposite of that. [00:16:21] Vonna Laue: And it was, you got to give everything you have to the job. You're never going to get ahead if you try to balance family. Now, obviously both of those I'm saying to an extreme, but I just had a really difficult time for a long time finding someone who understood my faith and commitment to family, as well as my desire to be excellent in my career. And over time, I have done that. Tammy Heim has been a great mentor to me and a good balance of those things. And there have been others, but it has given me a commitment that we find that for other people. So, two things I would say, one is I have a distinction of my own between coaching and mentoring. Coaching I believe is professional in nature. [00:17:10] Vonna Laue: Men and women can work together in a coaching situation. I personally believe that mentoring often flows over into more personal aspects of your life. And it's a holistic approach to family and work and all of those things. And my idea with mentoring is that it should be the same gender, because I don't want to be talking about the difficulties I'm having at home with a male counterpart. That just isn't appropriate to me. So, I differentiate those two things based on that. And I know not everyone does, but over the last couple of years have had just the extreme privilege of starting some peer mentoring groups for young ladies. And each group is three young women in similar stages of life, but in different roles and in different organizations. [00:18:00] Vonna Laue: So, they don't come in and fix each other's problems by, oh, you need this software, or you need this vendor. They really listen and help each other problem solve. And then each group has a seasoned leader in it that can contribute maybe some of the stories that she's encountered over time, or even just to be the brakes like, but you could do that, but you might consider what could happen as a result. [00:18:25] Vonna Laue: Two years ago, we started with two of those groups, we're just wrapping up the second year with five, and next month will start 10 groups committed for the following year. So excited about the opportunity to invest in other young women. [00:18:42] Tommy Thomas: So, let me take that just a little bit further and we may come back to it later. Board service has been a big part of your life, certainly in the last 20 years. In your mentoring, are you talking to these women about board service and the pros and cons and if you serve, what's your best contribution kind of thing and trying to give them some opportunities to do that, right? [00:19:09] Vonna Laue: The first board I served on was not World Vision. I want to remind people, both young people who are getting into board service, get involved in a local community board, whether that is. I served our hospital in Colorado Springs on their governmental committee. Whether it's a local chapter of some organization, the church network and Christian Leadership Alliance served on some of those, taking the opportunities to get involved in that at a more local level and then work your way up just like you would in almost anything else you do. You don't take up woodworking and become a master craftsman overnight. You start small. So, encouraging them to do that and then encouraging boards and leaders to give young people opportunity and don't expect them to come in with 25 years of experience. [00:20:10] Vonna Laue: You open the opportunities for them to come in and the things that they will contribute to your board discussions you can't imagine. So, I'm excited about what the future looks like. [00:20:27] Tommy Thomas: So, going back to personal leadership for a minute, in the book, It's How You Play the Game: The 12 Leadership Principles of Dean Smith, leadership principle #10 is making failure your friend. Can you share something from your life where this has been in play? [00:20:45] Vonna Laue: Nobody likes to fail, but it absolutely is true and the things that you learn from that and I look back on my time as Managing Partner at the firm and what a blessing that was and how gracious those partners were with me, because I would say, at least one of my biggest failures was just in how I handled the people involved there. And I just got done saying I love people and I do, but I will say all of those leaders are incredibly successful people and, no, I don't mean anything bad by this for those that are in a professional service firm, but it is so true that it's like herding cats because they all have their own realm and their own domain. [00:21:33] Vonna Laue: And they're really good at that. And I wasn't really good at bringing them all together at times and helping us find a strategic vision to go forward in, in one direction where we were all pulling in the same way. And so when I hear that quote, that's one of the things that I think about. And that's been a benefit to me in the years after that to look at, how do we get people to pull in the same direction when they have vested interests in a number of different ways? And now I serve in a mission sending organization. And there's some similarity there when you've got global workers that have their own domain in many parts of the world. God used that to equip me for some of the decisions that have to be made in this setting. +++++++++++++++ [00:22:16] Tommy Thomas: Going back to your mentoring thing for a minute, are you introducing failure to these young women? [00:22:23] Vonna Laue: I would say what I have found is that they're introducing some of their own failures and learning from each other and encouraging each other and the opportunity that it provides those of us that are the season leaders is to say, hey, like this isn't a bad thing. This is difficult. And you would have wanted to avoid this, but this is part of your growing and part of your maturing as a leader and to provide some insights there and embrace it and let them learn from each other. I would say that's probably been the best part of the failure within those groups. [00:23:03] Tommy Thomas: Frederick Wilcox said progress always involves risk. You can't steal second base with your foot on first. What's the biggest risk you've ever taken and how did it turn out? [00:23:17] Vonna Laue: One of the things that I have thought about over the years and comes from the lessons that I've talked about where I was glad, I didn't know, taking the Managing Partner role was a huge risk at the time. I remember vividly sitting with my husband and saying that if I take this role, there's no going back. Like you don't just leave that and go back into the setting where you were before. And we prayed about it and really felt like that's what we were supposed to do. And that was a huge blessing. [00:23:52] Vonna Laue: It was a challenge, like I've just said, but it was a huge blessing. And then, even bigger than that was the year that I left the firm and that was God saying, you've done what I've called you to do here, and now it's time to leave. And I had three arguments for the Lord, and Tommy, I don't know if you've ever argued with the Lord. If you haven't, I don't suggest it. You're not going to win. So just save your breath. But I had three arguments for him. Number one was I was a lifer. I've told everyone for years, I'm at this firm until retirement. I love it. I'm here. And he said, no. And I said, my second argument was this is economically stupid because he wasn't calling me to something. [00:24:42] Vonna Laue: He was calling me away from something. And he reminded me of that cattle on a thousand hills. And I was like, ah, yep. He's got that too. And then my third argument was just a little more logistical and operational. And that was that our oldest was headed to college, but our youngest was headed to high school. And I just said to him, Lord, you can interrupt. My husbands in my life, but let's not mess with our daughter going into high school. Give me four more years and maybe, and he said, no. And so, without having a job, I was supposed to give 12 months' notice. I went to the partners September 1st of that year and said to them, I believe this is a matter of obedience. [00:25:23] Vonna Laue: And I think if I don't do it, it's going to be detrimental to the firm and detrimental to our family. And they were gracious and agreed. And so, I wrapped up in four months. I had 150 or so meetings to tell clients I was leaving, and the firm was fine, network people, that I had connections with that I was moving on. And of course, what's the first question everyone asks you is, so what are you going to do? And this left-brain analytical type A personality had to look at them all 150 times and say, I don't know. And that was a challenge, but it was exactly what God called us to do at that point in time. And I'm glad that while I'm not always faithful and following through, I'm glad that we did that. ++++++++++++++++ [00:26:14] Tommy Thomas: Join us next week as we continue this conversation with Vonna Laue. Vonna shares insights from her new book, Glad I Didn't Know, which explores lessons learned from life's challenges and unexpected blessings. She discusses the importance of having people who speak truth into a leader's life, the critical role of team dynamics, and the necessity of balancing personal and professional health. Vonna also reflects on the increasing significance of risk management and the impact of artificial intelligence in the nonprofit sector. Tune in for an engaging discussion on leadership, resilience, and growth. Links and Resources JobfitMatters Website NextGen Nonprofit Leadership with Tommy Thomas The Perfect Search - What every board needs to know about hiring their next CEO Connect tthomas@jobfitmatters.com Follow Tommy on LinkedIn Listen to NextGen Nonprofit Leadership with Tommy Thomas on: Apple Podcasts | Spotify

What if there was a Nonprofit Version of Shark Tank - Volume 1

Play Episode Listen Later Dec 19, 2023 16:39

[00:00:00] Tommy Thomas: For the past six months or so I've been asking our guests the question “If there was a nonprofit version of Shark Tank and you were on the panel of potential early-stage investors, what questions would you need to have answered before you'd make an investment?” Well, again, it's just a fun question to ask that has turned into some great information that I believe people who are thinking of starting a nonprofit would find useful. The first force you'll hear is Kristen McClave from Episode 81 - Her Leadership Journey from Johnson and Johnson to Cardone Industries and Beyond. [00:00:38] Christin McClave: Oh, that's a fun question. I think first of all I would really want to understand the leader's background. The team, the person, on Shark Tank, they usually have one other person standing with them. And the Sharks are very interested in where they came from, what their experiences are, how the two or the three of them got together, and the dynamic of them working together and what skills maybe one brings to the table, the other one, fills in the gaps. I'd like to really understand that and know, that there's some experience in them building an organization. I think the other piece to that is really the passion, the drive. What is the problem or the issue the founder or the co-founders are trying to solve and what's driving that? And is that passion or is that issue really going to still be driving them in five years or 10 years? Or is it more of a short-term thing? The other piece, and I think this probably comes from my experience on nonprofit boards that are probably larger than this would be, really understanding the percentage of the budget that would actually be going to the work, the problem solving, the issue resolution, and what percentage of the budget would really be going to administration and or SG&A or overhead, however you want to say it. That may not be important for everybody, all investors, but for me it's the piece that I enjoy digging into from a financial perspective and from an accountability perspective with nonprofits that I either work with or talk to and just understanding, are they managing that equation or that ratio. And also as they get larger, they will certainly have donors, investors, fundraising questions around that in particular. And I think the third thing is I'd like to know, who is mentoring them? How do they have support built around them? Maybe they're an early-stage company, they probably don't have a board yet. But I think in the nonprofit context, it's really important to know those things and to make sure there are people that they've built into their feedback process. Maybe it's just a monthly advisor call that they have with maybe an advisor or a few advisors who meet with them on a regular basis. Because the challenge with a nonprofit, is really thinking through your revenue source. If your revenue is not coming from a product or a service, it's coming from the fundraising donation side of things. You've really got to build out some people in your network who can help you strategize about that and become really good at that. And I'll say just from personal experience, that's part of why I haven't taken on a leadership role in a nonprofit yet in my career because I feel like you have to feel called to the issue or the problem at hand. If you're going to be in a senior role of a not-for-profit organization, you've really got to have a drive and a passion for that cause. And, number two, you've got to really understand the revenue source is very different in the nonprofit space. And you really have to think about, okay, we're raising money for this cause rather than, hey, this product has this gross margin, it's a whole different mindset shift. And maybe someday I will, but for right now I'm in the for-profit space. But I love supporting and being a mentor and advisor in the nonprofit space and supporting them as much as I can. [00:04:37] Tommy Thomas: Next up is Caryn Ryan from Episode 84 - Her Leadership Journey from BP Amoco to World Vision to Missionwell. [00:04:49] Caryn Ryan: This is interesting, but really Tommy, I don't think it's any different for a for-profit than for a non-profit organization. So you're always asking do you have a good vision? And a really big and important question is, do you have the resources? And that's in terms of money but it's also in terms of the network of people to support you making steps towards your vision and making things happen. And then do you have the drive? Do you feel called for this? How do you demonstrate that? How do you demonstrate that you have the call and that you have the drive? Are you a persister? One thing that will happen for every new organization is just tons of obstacles and problems. They're nonstop. And so, you have to have that ability to persist and to say, look, I see this obstacle. Am I going to go over it, under it or around it? But for sure I'm going to go around it or get through this. And so, you need to have that kind of foundational trait characteristic. I think the difference really between a for-profit and non-profit is in where you get the money from. The Shark Tank for the for-profit might be from investors or a bank. Whereas the Shark Tank for a nonprofit might be from stakeholders, donors, grantors. So You have to make sure that the business plan reflects that. But you still have to have the money and you still have to have the people. And the sense of call might be different too. I think if you're working in a for-profit, you may have a vision around some new product or service. In the nonprofit world, your call may be even more deeply embedded. Especially if it's a religious calling. It may be something that's very right tied or connected to your faith. It doesn't matter how deeply connected it is to your faith. If you don't have the same things that a for-profit needs your chances of being successful fall. Now, God can always come in and intervene, if you're going to do your part in it, you need the same things that a for-profit does. [00:06:54] Tommy Thomas: Episode 100 was a milestone for the podcast. In the beginning I probably wondered if I would ever get that far. Here's Rich Stearns, the President Emeritus of World Vision US – An Inauspicious Leadership Journey Part Two. [00:07:11] Rich Stearns: The very first question that a Shark Tank guy would ask if you came with a new product is how is this product different from every other product that's already out in the market? In other words, nobody needs another cola drink, Coca Cola, Pepsi Cola, RC Cola. There's plenty of cola drinks out there. So, if your big idea is I'm going to do my own cola drink, the first question is why? So with a nonprofit, for example, I've seen young people that want to start up a new World Vision. I want to help the poor in Africa. And so, I'm going to start my own non-profit organization to help them. And my question is why would you do that? Because World Vision is a 3.2 billion organization helping the poor around the world. Compassion is one and a half billion dollars helping the poor around the world. Samaritan's Purse is a billion-dollar organization. So what are you doing that they're not doing? Why would I give my money to you instead of an established, successful nonprofit that's doing that work? And, a good example of a positive answer to that would be the International Justice Mission. My friend, Gary Haugen, who started it about 27 years ago now, I think, but he looked around and he said, look, there's a lot of organizations that are feeding the hungry and bringing clean water to the poor and doing microfinance. I don't see any organizations that are helping the poor with their legal problems, protecting them from corrupt police departments and representing them in court when they're falsely accused of something or getting them out of bonded labor in India by using the court system. So Gary started International Justice Mission to focus on justice and legal issues. He could have called it “lawyers without borders” if he wanted to, because essentially, he hires a lot of attorneys that go around the world and they work through the legal systems to help people who are being oppressed in various ways. So, the first question to ask is, why would I give to your charity? What is unique about it? And why wouldn't you just partner up with somebody that's already doing this work? If there are nonprofits that are doing it, the next thing you look at is the leader's vision and motivation, right? If there's a powerful leader with a powerful vision and capabilities do you believe that they, just like you'd look at a startup CEO, do they have the right vision? That's the other thing. Because it takes a lot of elbow grease to start up a nonprofit. ++++++++++++++++++ [00:09:39] Tommy Thomas: From Episode 115 Terri Esau - His Journey from Being Known As The Jingle King Of Minneapolis to Philanthropeneur. [00:09:55] Terry Esau: First of all, whatever you're pitching, it has to solve a problem and there has to be a resource to help solve that problem. Like for us, it was like, here's the problem. Kids in America are unhealthy, they're obese, there's poverty, so they can't afford a bicycle. Can help solve some of their health issues, not just physical health issues, but mental health issues, right? I call my bike my carbon fiber therapist because, you're a cyclist. It's like I get on my bike, and I go for a ride. I could be having a bad day, but by the time I get done with my ride, all that stress has just been washed away. So I'm Shark Tank. I think you'd have to go, what's the problem? What's the solution? And then on top of that you have to go, what's your strategy to bring the solution to the problem? What are the logistics? What are the resources that you need? People who give money to causes, you really have to sell them on the fact that you are going to change the world in some small way. At least in the nonprofit world. In the for profit world, then you have to prove to them that you can make your money back on this investment. For us, we say, yeah, you're not making money back on us, but you should feel really good about what you're doing to change the lives of children. [00:11:38] Tommy Thomas: From Episode 88 - Lisa Trevino Cummins, Her Leadership Journey from Bank of America to Urban Strategies Part Two. [00:11:49] Lisa Cummins: I think the question I would ask is what is your employee turnover? And because I have found nonprofits come and go and employee turnover helps me understand what your commitment is, what your ability is to lead, what your consistency is with your values. Because if you're not consistent, employees won't stay long. Maybe you can explain them once or twice, but if you have an ongoing record of employees that are leaving, then there's a problem there. The other thing I would ask is a lot of nonprofits talk about partners. Let's say, describe the continuum of partnership with these organizations. When you say your partner is this because you dropped off a leaflet at their door. Sometimes that's okay. Depends on what the goal is or is this talking about someone who you know their name, right? You know their name and you know their story and so you're trying to get at it in a deeper way. Those kinds of things. Yeah, I think those are a couple of questions I would ask. I would also ask how well, and this is important, some people will say this is a political thing and it's not. How well does your organization reflect the communities you're serving? Because if it doesn't, that means there's probably a sense of a pejorative type of approach that is not going to be that is less what could be, and it'll result in less than results than what could be. Does that make sense? [00:13:33] Tommy Thomas: And last, but certainly not least, from Episode 109 John Somerville - His Leadership Journey from Marketing Executive with General Mills to Chief Financial Officer At The University Of Northwestern St. Paul. [00:13:49] John Sommerville: I think the first question is, what need do you believe exists that your ministry or organization will serve? And how is what you're doing, how will that serve that need? Because if there's a true need I think many things follow from that. And if you have something unique that will really help meet that need, then the organization needs to exist. So I think those are big questions. And the other thing that I often ask is, who else is doing this? What I find is that there are people who are pioneers who do something for the very first time, and we write books about those people, but often what we need is I found more often that the people that are innovators they're just being novel without actually being effective and so it's important to understand the need, be able to meet the need, and then also give examples of how that works. You may have a unique spin on it, but the core of it needs to be channeled into an area that others have been successful in the past. +++++++++++++++ [00:14:51] Tommy Thomas: Next week is Christmas. And in keeping with the tradition, I followed for the past two years, I've interviewed someone from the music industry. This year, our guest is David Tolley. David is an amazing music, composer and arranger, and a tenured professor at Delaware State University. Part of David's story is that a big part of his career was launched from an inauspicious and some might say accidental appearance on the Johnny Carson Show. Join us next week to hear the rest of David's story. Links & Resources JobfitMatters Website Next Gen Nonprofit Leadership with Tommy Thomas The Perfect Search – What every board needs to know about hiring their next CEO Connect tthomas@jobfitmatters.com Follow Tommy on LinkedIn

Rich Stearns – President Emeritus World Vision US – An Inauspicious Leadership Journey – Part 2

Play Episode Listen Later Aug 21, 2023 34:59

[00:00:00] Rich Stearns: I learned early on, just the importance of, I've said this earlier, being truthful and being a person of integrity in the workplace, you never get caught in a lie if you don't lie. And so, some of my early bosses drill that into my head. Bad news delivered late is terrible. Bad news delivered early is the best thing. If you have bad news, deliver it early. And don't try to hide things when they're going south. Tell the boss or the management that you've got a problem early on. +++++++++++++++++++++ [00:00:28] Tommy Thomas: Thank you for joining us today. We're continuing the conversation we began last week with Rich Stearns President Emeritus of World Vision US. Today we will continue with Rich's leadership journey. We'll also be discussing the all-important topic of board governance. I'm so grateful to Rich for taking time from his schedule to talk with me. As we mentioned last week, the search that JobfitMatters conducted that brought Rich to World Vision literally set our practice on a trajectory that helped make the firm into what it is today. Let's pick up on the conversation we started last week. If you were creating a dashboard for a nonprofit to get at their health, what might the dials look like? How do you tell if a nonprofit is healthy? [00:01:19] Rich Stearns: This is one of my pet peeves. You've got these services like Charity Navigator and almost all of these services focus on financial metrics. What's the overhead? What's the balance sheet look like? What's the recent growth been over the last two or three years? Basically, those things have very little to do with whether a charity is a good charity, a well-performing charity, or a poorly performing charity. So, the only thing that really matters is the kind of impact that the nonprofit is having. It's about impact. So, let's say it's a homeless ministry, right? What matters in a homeless ministry is how many of their clients actually get out of homelessness and go on to lead independent lives. That's really the outcome that you're looking for in a homeless ministry. And sometimes homeless ministries talk about how many beds they have and how many nights off the street they give their clients. But just giving somebody a safe bed for the night doesn't solve their problem, right? So, you can say we put 300 men to bed every night, in this homeless shelter, and the next day they're on the street again and then the following day they come back to the shelter and there's nothing wrong with providing some safety for a little bit, but ultimately, you're looking for the cure, right? How do we help these men, if they're men, get out of homelessness and get into more productive lives? But none of these charity evaluation websites talk about impact because it's so hard to measure. And it could be that the charity with the greatest impact also has high overheads. So, they get a negative rating from Charity Navigator, even though they were having a tremendous impact on the people that they're serving. You always try to get inside the charity and say, what kind of work are you doing? And are you making an impact? Now, after that, you start to look at finances. So, at World Vision, we got into the clean water business a number of years ago. So then there's a measure called impact per dollar spent. The cost to bring clean water to one person for life through World Vision is $50. So, you tell a donor that for $50, I don't know what your water bill is, but mine's higher than $50 a month. But for $50 I can bring clean water to a person for life in Rwanda. And then I say, how many people do you want to bring clean water to? How big a donation can you make? So that's impact per dollar, right? Impact per dollar spent. And that's the other thing I tend to look at. [00:03:50] Tommy Thomas: Kind of a similar question. I've been asking this the last month or so and I've gotten some fascinating responses. If you were a judge on a nonprofit version of the shark tank and nonprofit startups are coming to you for early-stage funding, what questions have you got to have solid answers for before you open your checkbook? [00:04:10] Rich Stearns: The very first question that a shark tank guy would ask if you come with a new product is how is this product different from every other product that's already out in the market? In other words, nobody needs another cola drink, Coca-Cola, Pepsi Cola, RC Cola. There are plenty of cola drinks out there. So, if your big idea is I'm going to do my own cola drink, the first question is why? So, with a nonprofit, for example, I've seen young people that want to start up a new World Vision, right? I want to help the poor in Africa. And so, I'm going to start my own non-profit organization to help them. And my question is why would you do that? Because World Vision is a $3.2B organization helping the poor around the world. Compassion is $1.5B helping the poor around the world. Samaritan's Purse is a billion-dollar organization. So, what are you doing that they're not doing? Why would I give my money to you instead of an established, successful nonprofit that's doing that work? And, a good example of a positive answer to that would be the International Justice Mission. My friend, Gary Haugen started it about 27 years ago. He looked around and he said, there are a lot of organizations that are feeding the hungry and bringing clean water to the poor and doing microfinance. I don't see any organizations that are helping the poor with their legal problems protecting them from corrupt police departments and representing them in court when they're falsely accused of something or getting them out of bonded labor in India by using the court system. So, Gary started International Justice Mission to focus on justice and legal issues. He could have called it “Lawyers Without Borders” if he wanted to, because essentially, he hires a lot of attorneys that go around the world, and they work through the legal systems to help people who are being oppressed in various ways. So, the first question to ask is, why would I give to your charity? What is unique about it? And why wouldn't you just partner up with somebody that's already doing this work? If nonprofits are doing it, the next thing you look at is the leader's vision and motivation, right? If there's a powerful leader with a powerful vision and capabilities you believe, just like you'd look at a startup CEO. Do they have the right vision? That's the other thing. Because it takes a lot of elbow grease to start up a nonprofit. [00:06:40] Tommy Thomas: Frederick Wilcox said progress always involves risk. You can't steal second base with your foot on first. What's the biggest risk you've ever taken and how did it come out? [00:06:51] Rich Stearns: Let me mention the Parker Brothers thing again. So, getting Parker Brothers into video games was a huge risk. We had to take our foot off first base because we had to hire 180 people. We had to create almost another whole company and another whole capability within the company to enter this new marketplace. Cost a lot of money, and a lot of investment upfront, and I would say the outcome was both good and bad. So initially for a couple of years, we doubled the size of the company. We had huge growth, huge profit. But then about two years in, the whole video game market collapsed. It had been a bubble and it collapsed. And when it collapsed, we had seven of the top ten selling video game cartridges in America. From our startup position, we had been very successful. But once the market collapsed, you couldn't give those products away. They were selling video game cartridges, three for $10 in a barrel at Toys R Us because the market was glutted with people trying to get into that market. It was a little bit like the Dot Com bubble in 2000. So anyways, all that profit we made. We had to give it all back over the next few years. That's one of the reasons I got fired from Parker Brothers. But I tried to persuade Parker Brothers to stay in there, hang in there, right? Because video games are going to come back. But they decided that it was too risky. They wouldn't stay in. And of course, we now know that the video game market is bigger than all of Hollywood combined in terms of revenues. And it's bigger than most professional sports. And so had we stayed in video games, we would have probably had huge opportunities in the future, but that was a huge risk to take. And when you take a risk, you bet big, and you lose big, or you win big. I think the other risk was the AIDS campaign that I did with World Vision, because there was a possibility that HIV and AIDS would turn the American church against us. People say, why are you doing this? Why are you helping people that were affected by this, disease that's sexually transmitted? I thought you were about helping children. And so, we had to get our messaging right with AIDS. We took a bit of a risk to go there, but in the end, it really paid off because what people learned about World Vision is that we would tackle the most difficult issues in the most difficult places. And that earned us a lot of respect from pastors and donors. Because nobody else was doing it at the time, nobody else was willing to take that risk. And we did, and ultimately a lot of organizations followed us a few years later. But that was another pretty risky venture. [00:09:39] Tommy Thomas: What's the best piece of advice anybody's ever given you? The best piece of advice that I have received is to be truthful and be a person of integrity in the workplace. You never get caught in a lie if you don't lie. [00:09:41] Rich Stearns: The best piece of advice that I would say, first of all, I learned early on, just the importance of, I've said this earlier, being truthful and being a person of integrity in the workplace. You never get caught in a lie if you don't lie. And so, some of my early bosses drill that into my head. Bad news delivered late is terrible. Bad news delivered early is the best thing. If you have bad news, deliver it early. And don't try to hide things when they're going south. Tell the boss or the management that you've got a problem early on. One piece of advice I got during a difficult time, I can't remember where I was, probably at Parker Brothers. It was a difficult year and one of my coworkers said, what you have to understand, because most of us, we're afraid we're going to lose our job or we're afraid something's going to happen to us. And he used to say, remember this company needs you more than you need them, right? Because if you're a good worker and you're productive and you've got good ideas, the place you work for needs you more than you need them. And I learned that later as a CEO looking for good people. When I had good people working for me, all I want to know is how do I keep them? How do I motivate them? I need them more than they need me because they can find another job, but it's going to be hard for me to find another person of that caliber. So, the importance of retaining really good people struck me. +++++++++++++++++ [00:11:09] Tommy Thomas: You've been out of office for a couple of years now, but let's go back three or four years. If you had invited me to one of your staff meetings and then we had dismissed you, and I asked the team what's the most difficult thing about working for Rich? What might I have heard? [00:11:27] Rich Stearns: I don't know. I want to say you have to ask them that question. You've interviewed some of the people that worked for me in the past. But I would probably say I tended to be an idea machine, that in a particular meeting, I would throw out 20 new ideas. What about this? Or what about that? What if we did this? And what I learned is that when you're the CEO people are frantically taking notes on everything that comes out of your mouth. Let's say you throw out 20 ideas. They're likely to leave that meeting and spend the next month pursuing all 20 of those ideas. And I realized that I had to tell people, look, I'm going to throw out a bunch of ideas in this meeting. I want you to throw out ideas too. Not all my ideas are good. Number one: Don't be afraid to challenge me just because I'm the president. In this room let's think of ourselves all as equals. Everybody in this room has got good ideas and we need to challenge ideas. Some are good, some are bad, some are worth keeping, and some are not. They're like panning for gold, right? I realized that I needed to give people permission to challenge me as a leader and to challenge me in front of other people. I used to say, if you don't challenge my ideas, you're not very useful to me because I need other people to help me evaluate which of these ideas have merit and which ones really don't. And if you can't contribute to that, why are you at the meeting? You realize that they probably say Rich threw out too many ideas at the meeting. And I left wondering which ones do I really focus on? So I think that could have been frustrating sometimes for people. [00:13:04] Tommy Thomas: What do you think they would have said was the most rewarding part? [00:13:09] Rich Stearns: I don't know. I like to feel that people enjoyed working for me. I tried to create a sense of camaraderie among my teams. I tried not to lead like the imperial CEO that I'm the boss and you're not. Or I'm here on the organization chart, you're down here. So I tried to be more of a collaborative leader. Hey, we're all a team and every member of the team is important. All these people that work for me are made in the image of God and they have incredible talents, ideas, backgrounds, uniqueness, unique gifts, and talents. Everyone's gifts are different. And you've all got great ideas. And I tried to, especially in the latter half of my career, I started to see that all these people that work for me are made in the image of God and they have incredible talents, ideas, backgrounds, uniqueness, unique gifts, and talents. Everyone's gifts are different. Everyone's abilities are different. And when you start seeing that kind of symphony of talent in front of you, you're like an orchestra conductor and you say, how can I bring the beautiful music out of these talented musicians that I have working for me? I might have a CEO who was brilliant. In fact, you knew one or two of my CEOs who would have been terrible at marketing, right? But he was a brilliant CFO. And so, I recognized that and made sure that I relied on him and leaned into him for his giftedness. Then over somewhere else, I've got a really talented person in product development coming up with new products. And so, you bring that talent out. Ultimately, a leader is like that orchestra conductor. How do you get all these really gifted musicians, each gifted in a different way to play together so that what comes out is a beautiful symphony instead of, discordant, loud sounds that are unpleasant. I like to think that I could create a positive work environment, positive culture for the team. And what I learned about success in the workplace is that teams of people that work well together and feel valued and are in a healthy culture, they're much more productive than people in a negative difficult culture. Culture matters a lot and leaders tend to create culture. [00:15:20] Tommy Thomas: Here's a quote I'd like you to respond to: “When you're sitting around the table with your leadership team, you never want to be the smartest person at the table”. [00:15:29] Rich Stearns: I love that quote. And actually, one of my first, I'll go back to Parker Brothers, the President of Parker Brothers, Randolph Parker Barton, when I joined was the family vestige or holdover from the old company that had been acquired by General Mills. Mr. Barton was, how do I say it? Not the most capable leader. He didn't have a Wharton MBA. He didn't come up through other consumer products companies. He inherited his job because he was a family member. He knew a lot about toys and games, but he wanted to hire the smartest, most gifted, talented people he could find and let them do what they were capable of doing. And he developed a reputation from within General Mills, the parent company, for having some of the brightest up-and-coming leaders in the whole General Mills organization, which was much bigger than Parker Brothers. And he basically did it by hiring well and then delegating a lot of authority and influence to the smart people that he hired. He never felt threatened by them because he realized that as long as he kept hiring the best people, he would get the best performance for his division. And General Mills would reward him as the president with bonuses and compensation, increase and all of that. I learned from him to hire really the best people you can, to try to find people smarter than you or smarter than you in their field. Hire the best people you can. Try to find people smarter than you or smarter than you in their field. So again, a CFO who is much better at finance than I am, or hiring a head of human resources that's much more gifted than I am in human resources. A General Manager or a President is really a generalist, right? The orchestra conductor can't play all those instruments, so they need people that are really good at the violin, really good at percussion, really good at clarinet and woodwinds. And when you get the very best musicians working for you, that's when the beautiful music starts to happen. +++++++++++++++ [00:17:34] Tommy Thomas: Let's just switch over to board service. I think board service is hard at any level. Talk to me about the board chair. What's the primary function of the chairman of the board? [00:17:49] Rich Stearns: I think the primary function of the Board Chair is to manage the board. We used to have 18 board members at World Vision. It was a pretty large board. And you got 18 people in a room that are all pretty smart. They're all from different walks of life and they've got ideas and suggestions and things of that nature. The Board Chair's main job is to manage the Board. That Board Chair reminds the Board that their job is governance, a policy role. And the Board Chair has a very important role in focusing the board on the job at hand. You're not necessarily here for everybody to throw in their ideas. We have a professional staff to run the company or run the organization. The board chair reminds them that their role is a governance role, a policy role. Certainly, their ideas can be offered, but it's really the role of the CEO and the staff to determine whether those ideas are effective or usable. I think the board chair really must control the work of the board and direct it in the right ways. And he's basically herding, 10, 12, 15 other board members, to focus on the job at hand. The other role of the Chair is to be close to the CEO so that the CEO and the board chair are on the same page. The Board Chair can deliver some difficult information to the CEO if let's say the performance is poor or other board members have a problem with the way the CEO is conducting the meetings or leading the organization. The Board Chair is often the messenger that brings that information to the CEO, hopefully in a way that's redemptive instead of crushing, that, how can I help this CEO be more successful by giving feedback to him from the board? The board chair is really a pretty critical pivotal role. [00:19:37] Tommy Thomas: I know your past Board Chair for the last few years of your time at World Vision. What was the key to you and Joan working together so well? The key to a CEO / Board working relationship comes down to mutual respect. [00:19:45] Rich Stearns: I think it comes down to mutual respect. I think Joan had a lot of respect for me. I was a long-serving CEO of World Vision by the time she was Board Chair. She had a lot of respect for me, my capabilities, and what I'd accomplished at World Vision over those years. But I also had respect for her and her position. I always respected the Board Chair's position because in my worldview, the board chair and my board in a Christian organization, that was God's way of holding me in the organization accountable. These people were accountable before God for this ministry that was entrusted to their care and their governance care as board members. And I never saw the board as an adversary, I always saw them as really a gift that they were there to keep us on the right track, to keep us out of trouble, to ask the tough questions that needed to be answered to make sure we were financially solvent, to make sure we stayed on mission. And by respecting their role they could see that I respected them, which caused them to respect and trust me more. A board relationship is very much about trust. If if the board trusts the leader who's leading the organization and that leader's team that's a critical ingredient. And the leader has to trust the board not to do inappropriate things or get involved in inappropriate ways and not to be disruptive and if you have mutual trust, which the chair often negotiates that, or referees that, or tries to ensure that you're off to a good start with a board CEO relationship. [00:21:24] Tommy Thomas: When I interviewed you back in 2017 you mentioned that from your perspective, the best thing that the World Vision Board did for you when you came on was you recalled an offsite retreat where y'all got introduced to each other. Could you share a little bit about that with us? We probably have a lot of up-and-coming CEOs listening and that might be an interesting discussion. [00:21:45] Rich Stearns: I don't know how much that costs. Probably not much, but it was the best money World Vision ever spent. When I came into World Vision the Board and the CEO had what I'd call a turbulent relationship. He wasn't thrilled about his board and the way they behaved, and the Board wasn't thrilled about him in certain ways. And so, I was coming into kind of a troubled marriage, right? You could say there'd been a divorce, and I'm the new husband coming in. And so, the Board had enough wisdom to say, you know what, we should start off on the right foot here. Why don't we hire a board consultant to come in and do a two-day retreat with a new CEO to teach the Board and the new CEO how best they should interact and communicate with one another? So, a friend of yours and mine named Bob Andringa, he's retired now, but he was in the Board consulting business. He's written at least one book if not several. He came in and he conducted a Board Governance 101, 102 course for all of us and gave us tools to use and dealt with different scenarios of the dos and don'ts for Board Members and the dos and don'ts for the staff and the CEO. Here is the best way to understand your responsibility as Board Members. This is what your responsibility is, and this is what your responsibility is not. This is the role you play. This is the role you don't play. And the same with a CEO. Rich, your role is this. The board's role is to establish policy. I guess the best way to say it is it laid down the ground rules for a healthy relationship. And I don't think it's an exaggeration to say I had a 20-year honeymoon with my board. Not that there wasn't an occasional marital argument over the years. But it was like a 20-year honeymoon with the board. And I respected them, they respected me. My staff, when I first started, after a year, they said, boy, you've had a one-year honeymoon with this board. It's amazing. Because they'd seen some of the dysfunction in the prior years. And 20 years later, they were still saying you're still on your honeymoon. And in terms of my response, what I attribute it to, is what I talked about earlier, Tommy, that the board knew they could trust me. I would never tell them a lie. I would never hide anything. I was completely transparent. Anything they wanted to talk about at a board meeting, we could talk about. Any numbers they wanted to see; we'd show them. If I had some bad numbers, I'd bring them to the board and say, look, this is not good, and here's what we're going to do. They never felt I was hiding anything. And so that created trust as well. The board knew they could trust me. I would never tell them a lie. I would never hide anything. I was completely transparent. Anything they wanted to talk about at a board meeting, we could talk about. +++++++++++++++++++++ [00:24:34] Tommy Thomas: One of the guys that you've influenced over the years is Joseph J. Mettimano, the President at Central Union Mission in Washington, DC. And when I interviewed Joe he talked about a lesson he learned from you about the President's Report to the Board. He would attribute part of his success to what he learned from you there. Tell us about that. [00:24:53] Rich Stearns: I started every board meeting with a President's Report. So, the Board is gathered, in the case of World Vision they've flown in from all over the country and here they are at the World Vision board meeting, and remember, they're all volunteers, some are pastors, some are business people. They're from all walks of life and so I tried to use the President's Report to basically bring them up to speed on what was going on at World Vision. What were the important issues? What were we doing about the important issues? How are the finances doing? I tried to answer as many questions as they might have in advance. I started every board meeting with a President's Report. I tried to use the President's Report to basically bring them up to speed on what was going on at World Vision. What were the important issues? What were we doing about the important issues? How are the finances doing? Because the rest of the board meeting, the finance committee was going to meet and other committees were going to meet. And I tried to use the President's Report to cast a bit of a vision for where we were as an organization, where we're headed, what my outlook was for the coming year or the coming quarter. And I try to use the Board Meeting to really cast a vision to remind them of the mission of World Vision. Often, I would start with a trip report. I've just gotten back from the Syrian refugee crisis, and I want to tell you what I saw. I would remind them, we're sitting here in a nice boardroom, but people are dying all over the world. And our job is to intercede for them to help them to rescue those who are perishing, as the book of Proverbs says. And so, trying to remind them why they were here, why World Vision was here, and then look under the hood at the financials, the numbers, the revenues, the overhead, and you had to deal with issues like real estate transactions and mundane stuff like that. I wanted to always put it in the context of the bigger mission, vision, and values of the organization. My President's Report would sometimes go 90 minutes to two hours, which is a lot. But usually, the board would say that was the highlight of the meeting because that really brought them up to date on everything. My President's Report would sometimes go 90 minutes to two hours, which is a lot. But usually, the board would say that was the highlight of the meeting because that really brought them up to date on everything. [00:26:46] Tommy Thomas: I've done a little bit of speaking here over the past three or four years, most of it pre-pandemic on succession planning and one of the things that we talk about in that is how much of the outgoing president's identity is tied up in his or her current job. You've been away now for almost two years, any reflections on that? Did you have any trouble walking away? [00:27:11] Rich Stearns: No, I didn't actually. I talk about this a lot. We had a very orderly succession process when I left World Vision. In 2015, I hired a Chief Operating Officer, and he worked under me for three years, learning the ropes. He then became a candidate to succeed me, although the board did a nationwide search. They ultimately selected him. But about two years before I retired in an executive session of the board, I said, look I'm planning to retire. I had a contract that expired in two years, and we renewed my contract every five years for 20 years. And I said, at the end of this contract, I'm planning to retire and I'm giving you a gift right now. The gift is number one, I'm leaving without any drama, it's like you're not having to talk at the bathroom breaks about when is the old guy going to retire, when is he going to leave, I'm retiring, I want to retire at the top of my game, not at the bottom of my game. And that's a gift to you because now as a board, you can focus totally on how can we have the best transition process. How can we use this time to find the very best candidate to replace Rich? And you don't have to worry about any of the drama or that I'm going to be clinging to power and so long story short, Tommy, they did a very good job. They did a pretty thorough search. They took a lot of advice from me because I said a lot of nonprofits do this very poorly. And some of the nonprofits that I shared with them during my 20 years at World Vision, some of these nonprofits that were peer organizations had 10 CEOs come and go. And I said that's very unhealthy for an organization to have 10 years. And the reason they had 10 CEOs is because their nonprofit volunteer board continued to make bad decisions about who to hire, so I wanted to help them make a good decision about who to hire with all the facts on the table and knowledge. So then I retired, and I had a nice retirement party. We had a passing of the torch to my successor, Edgar Sandoval, who was the COO under me for the last three years. Then I walked away, and I know a lot of people really have a struggle in retirement and they feel like they've lost their identity. I felt like I gave everything I had for 20 years. I gave World Vision everything I had to offer. It's somebody else's turn. I sensed it was time for fresh leadership. I was 67 years old I had a family, a growing family, grandsons, a wife that I had been away from for a lot of months during my time at World Vision, traveling internationally and I was ready, and I looked at retirement as this is my sabbath rest after a 45-year career. [00:30:01] Tommy Thomas: Bringing this thing to a close. What's something that you would have liked to have told a younger version of yourself? [00:30:09] Rich Stearns: You know a couple of things come to mind. One is comical - a career is a very long time. In your 20s or 30s, you're in a particular job in a particular industry or sector and your career seems you're focused on this year, right? You're right now, this job, maybe you're thinking about what would my next job be, but in a 40-some-year career, you can do a lot of different things, and if you feel like I used to, I tell young people, if your current job is not your dream job, and it probably isn't, think of it as a stepping stone toward your dream job. Because every job you have gives you more information, more experience. I'm good at this. I'm not good at that. I like this kind of environment. I don't like this kind of environment. You're learning more about yourself and hopefully, the next job you have, the next company, or whatever organization you work for becomes a better and better fit, and more and more like your dream job, the dream situation that you'd like to be in. So don't get too impatient. A career is a very long time. Look at me. I started out selling shaving cream for Gillette. I ran a toy company. I was there for nine years. I spent 11 years at Lennox China selling fine china, crystal gifts, and things like that. Then I spent 20 years at World Vision. I've had three or four different careers during my 40-some years, and then developed a fifth career as an author. I've written four books now. You can do a lot of things in 40 years. Even if you don't like your current job, take heart. There's hope your next job may be the one that you really love and really fits you well. One other thing I'd say, this is a little piece of managerial advice, the most powerful tool in a leader's vocabulary is encouragement. You motivate people a lot more with encouragement. Hey, that was a great idea you had at the meeting today. Wow, I loved your contribution to that discussion. The most powerful tool in a leader's vocabulary is encouragement. You motivate people a lot more with encouragement. That report you gave was fantastic. With that kind of affirmation, people just thrive and they bloom when they get a compliment from the boss. The problem is, as bosses, we often like to lead with criticism. Yeah, I didn't like the way you ended that presentation. Or, 90% of the presentation could have been fabulous, but you didn't like their last two slides. And you think, oh, so what do they hear? I failed. The boss didn't like it. And that diminishes people. It crushes their spirits. You attract a lot more bees with honey than you do with vinegar. There's a time for correction. And even correction is more easily digested when it's preceded by praise and encouragement. I think it's a superpower that a leader who really encourages people, we've all raised kids, and your kid will bring home some crazy drawing from first grade. And what do you do? You praise it and say, I love the way you drew that pumpkin for Halloween, I love the way you drew that house. We praise them. We encourage them. We need to find ways to praise and encourage our staff, and our teams. And then again, correction, when needed, obviously in the right circumstances, but encouragement is powerful. Tommy Thomas: Thank you for joining us today and thanks to Rich Stearns for sharing his leadership journey with us. I've put links to all of Rich's books in the episode notes, along with some that he and his wife Reneé wrote together. Several months ago, we began to put a transcript of the podcast in the episode notes. Many of you have commented on how helpful this is to you. Links and Resources JobfitMatters Website Next Gen Nonprofit Leadership with Tommy Thomas World Vision Books by Rich Stearns: Lead Like It Matters to God: Values-Driven Leadership in a Success-Drive World by Richard Stearns The Hole in Our Gospel 10th Anniversary Edition: What Does God Expect of Us? The Answer That Changed My Life and Might Just Change the World by Richard Stearns Books by Rich and Reneé Stearns: God's Love For You Bible Storybook by Richard Stearns & Reneé Stearns He Walks Among Us: Encounters with Chris in a Broken World by Richard Stearns & Reneé Stearns Connect Tommy Thomas - tthomas@jobfitmatters.com Tommy's LinkedIn Profile

Rich Stearns – President Emeritus at World Vision US – An Inauspicious Beginning to Leadership

Play Episode Listen Later Aug 15, 2023 31:39

[00:00:00] Rich Stearns: Tommy, one of my favorite quotes, and I don't even know who said this originally, but it goes like this, never trust a leader without a limp. And what that is basically saying is that a leader who has only known success is not completely formed as a leader. It's often been said, we learn much more from failure than we do from success. It's also been said that it's harder to pass the test of prosperity than it is to pass the test of failure. ++++++++++++++++++++++ [00:00:28] Tommy Thomas: Thank you for joining us for the 100th episode of Next Gen Nonprofit Leadership with Tommy Thomas. And thank you to all the guests and listeners who've made this possible. My guest today is Rich Stearns, the President Emeritus of World Vision. I wanted Rich as my guest today to celebrate this milestone for the podcast because he inadvertently has played such a pivotal role in my career as a search consultant. My former colleague, Rob Stevenson, and I conducted the search that brought Rich to World Vision as their President. I don't think I'm exaggerating to say that for the next 10 years or so after Rich started at World Vision either Rob or I would receive at least one call a month and usually more from a nonprofit organization with the question. Were you the guys who brought Rich Stearns to World Vision? We would respond, yes. Their next comment would be something like, we need a new CEO. Can you bring us somebody like Rich? So, in many ways, the good work that Rich did for world vision was a launching pad for what is now JobfitMatters Executive search. I have a lot to be thankful for. Let's pick up on the conversation I had with Rich. So let me give the listeners a little bit of context for how I know Rich. It was the summer of 1997. It was a hot July afternoon and I get a phone call from a friend in Los Angeles saying, did you know Bob Seiple is retiring and World Vision is putting out an RFP for the search? And I said, no, I didn't know that. And he says you need to bid on that search. So, I called my colleague up in Minnesota, Rob Stevenson. And oddly enough, he had received a call that morning from a friend of his in Minneapolis that said, did you know Bob Seiple's retiring? And you need to bid on that search. Rob and I put our material together and we submitted a proposal and lo and behold, we got accepted. And as Rob tells the story, we rejoiced for about 10 minutes and then we asked ourselves, what have we gotten ourselves into here? So, Rich, I don't know if you've heard that story, but that's how we got into it. Maybe tell us a little bit about your initial thoughts when Rob first called you. [00:02:45] Rich Stearns: It was actually a funny story, before that, Tommy, that just shortly after that search was begun and you guys were selected, I got a call from a friend of mine who worked at World Vision and was actually my donor rep. I was the CEO of Lenox China at the time, and he was my major donor representative and also a good friend. We went back quite a few years and he said to me, Rich I've been praying this last week because Bob Seiple announced his retirement. And I've just been praying for World Vision because I really want the organization to find the right successor to Bob and this, that, and the other thing. And he said, but something really strange happened this morning in my quiet time. As I was praying, he said I don't know how to say it, but to tell you that the Holy Spirit told me that you're going to be the next President of World Vision. Your friend Rich is going to be the next President of World Vision. And I laughed out loud. I said, that's ridiculous. I said, I'm selling fine China to the wealthy, Bill. I don't know anybody on the World Vision Board of Directors. And besides, I'm not available, interested, or qualified to do the job. But other than that, I'm a perfect candidate. That was almost a year before. I actually eventually took the job and it's quite an amazing story overall and the way God used you and Rob as well. [00:04:12] Tommy Thomas: That was the first time we'd ever put an ad in the Wall Street Journal and a trustee on the World Vision Board said we need to advertise in The Journal. And we did. And as I remember, maybe your HR guy, he clipped that and showed it to you. [00:04:26] Rich Stearns: I had a VP that worked for me at Lenox, and he sent me a handwritten note and it basically said, Dear Rich, I was reading the Wall Street Journal today and I saw this ad and it was a little, one column ad president for World Vision. And he said, I read this ad and it sounded like you and I just wondered if you had seen it. And then he said, P.S. This was really a dumb thing to do, to send a want ad to the CEO of my company. I hope you don't leave. You're a great CEO and please ignore the fact that I was looking at the want ads. And so anyway, I saw that ad and it sent a shiver up my spine because, months earlier, my friend, Bill had made this prophecy that I was somehow going to become the President of World Vision. [00:05:11] Tommy Thomas: When Rob called you, do you remember your thoughts or feelings? [00:05:15] Rich Stearns: Yeah, I spent a good part of the call telling Rob that I was not qualified for the job. It was a big Christian organization that focused on global poverty. I knew nothing about global poverty. I had never been to Africa. I had never done any fundraising. I had no theological training to work at a Christian organization, no MDiv degree, or anything like that. And for heaven's sake, I was selling fine China to the wealthy. So, I just said, I just seem like a terrible candidate for this job. And by the way, Rob, I'm not really available either. [00:05:54] Tommy Thomas: And Rob prevailed, he stayed with you and ultimately you did accept it. How have your feelings changed over 22-23 years now? [00:06:04] Rich Stearns: As I got further into this process with Rob, very reluctantly, I was the runaway bride, if you remember that movie but, this was a job I hadn't sought. I didn't want. I was actually somewhat terrified. I hope they don't pick me because I would be a complete washout in that job. I would fail. I don't have the right experience for it. In retrospect, those next 20 years at World Vision were the best years of my life. And I learned a huge lesson about trusting God for the outcome. When God calls you, if you listen to His call and you heeded His call, he'll catch you. He'll travel with you. One of my favorite quotes is from William Sloan Coffin, who was once the President of Yale many years ago, and he said, I love the recklessness of faith. I love the recklessness of faith. First, you leap. And then you grow wings. First, you leap. And then you grow wings. And that's a little bit of what it's like to answer a call from God. First, you leap. God wants your obedience. And only then do you grow the wings to fly. And you can look at people in the Bible like Moses or David or Peter. They had to leap in faith, take a leap of faith, and then God provided what they needed for the task at hand. [00:07:21] Tommy Thomas: I want to change over to your time at World Vision, but before we go there take us back to your childhood and tell me what was it like growing up in the Stearns household? My dad was an alcoholic and on his third marriage. And when I was about ten that marriage failed. [00:07:29] Rich Stearns: Tommy, I had a pretty rough family background. Neither of my parents went to high school. My mother did a couple of years of high school. My father dropped out of the eighth grade. My dad was an alcoholic and on his third marriage. And when I was about ten that marriage failed. My parents divorced and the bank foreclosed on our house and my mother, my sister and I were kicked out and had to find an apartment to rent. It was an inauspicious beginning, and as a little boy, my world fell apart when I was about ten years old. [00:08:04] Tommy Thomas: I suppose there would be a happy memory from that. What would be your best memories of childhood? [00:08:10] Rich Stearns: First of all, that I survived it which is for God's grace. I had an understanding at a pretty early age, 12 or 13. I had an older sister that helped me a little bit, but she basically said, look, our escape route from this lifestyle is education. And if you can get good grades and you can get into a good college, your life doesn't have to turn out like our dads, you could really make something of yourself and it's all about education. And that was my focus starting in maybe junior high and through high school. And, I have to say, my childhood, other than the family issues, I had a pretty normal, happy childhood. We lived in a little suburban community, went to a good school, I had good teachers who believed in me in many cases. I had a good group of friends who came from families whose parents were professionals and more stable families. And I've spent a lot of time at other kids' houses, with their families. And so anyway, I think the community somewhat compensated for the problems that I had at home. [00:09:20] Tommy Thomas: When you came out of high school, how did you make your college decision? [00:09:22] Rich Stearns: That's also a funny story. So, my best friend first of all, when I was in junior high school and I wrote letters to all eight Ivy League colleges asking for their catalogs, which was pretty presumptuous. But my sister told me the best colleges of all are Ivy League schools. And there were eight of them. One of them, Cornell University, was just 50 miles from my home in Syracuse. And at that stage in my life, the biggest dream I had was maybe I could go to a school 50 miles away, and I could drive there, right? And so, in my senior year of high school, I told my mother, I really think I'd like to apply to Cornell University. And she just burst out laughing. She just said that's ridiculous. How are you going to pay for Cornell University? She said, I don't have any money and your father's a drunk and he's not going to help you. And you can't go to Cornell, and I said I don't know Mom, but I'm going to find a way. I'll get scholarships. I'll do something. That's not the way you want your parent to encourage you when you're making a big decision. I did the application on my own and sent it in. It was the only college I applied to. And not only did I get in, but I got a scholarship and then I got another New York State Regent Scholarship. And this buddy of mine who also went to Cornell, we ended up going together. And he was my roommate freshman year. He's still my best friend. We're still in touch all these years later. So, getting to Cornell was a huge step for my life and that really opened all the doors that came after that in terms of further education and job opportunities. And I guess you could say I successfully escaped my childhood situation and found a way to overcome it. +++++++++++ [00:11:05] Tommy Thomas: What's something that people are always surprised to know about you? [00:11:11] Rich Stearns: Often people are surprised to know about my family background, right? Because when you graduated from two Ivy League schools, people think you must've been born on third base or born with a silver spoon in your mouth. And that wasn't the case for me. But I think today one of the quirky things about me is I collect comic books from the 1950s and 60s. So you wouldn't think I was a comic book collector but for some reason, they bring back a lot of memories of my childhood because partly growing up they were a form of escapism for me. I could escape from my crazy world by looking at superheroes like Superman and Spider-Man and fantasizing about a different kind of world where the good guys always win, and the bad guys always lose. And so anyway I have quite a collection of comic books. [00:12:01] Tommy Thomas: Successful people are asked all the time, what makes you successful? I'd like to frame the question a little differently, and that would be, what is a factor that has helped you succeed that most people wouldn't know about? [00:12:14] Rich Stearns: This also relates a little bit to my family background, but I understood as a teenager that I didn't have a safety net, right? So I was either going to make it on my own or I was not going to make it, but I didn't have anything to fall back on. I didn't have family wealth. It wasn't like I could move back in necessarily with my parents. So when I got to Cornell, I just thought I've got to succeed or die. It's like graduate or bust because, in fact, I remember one summer I was driving a taxi some of the summers during Cornell and even when I was in business school, the summer before business school. And there was another college kid my age driving a taxi with me to make money. And that Fall he decided, I'm not going back to college. I'm making pretty good money driving a cab, and I'm just going to stay driving a cab. He said, you ought to think about it, Rich. And I said, my dream is that someday I'm going to ride in the backseat of a cab because I saw that as something rich people did. They wrote in the backseat of cabs. I'd never ridden in the backseat of a taxi. So, just understanding that I didn't have a safety net and that, I had to make it or bust motivated me. Now, I think later in my career, Tommy, the success factor for most leaders, I think, is the ability to get along with people to win their trust and respect, to motivate people around you who are part of your team, to treat people the right way and develop a group of people that respect you for your ideas. And those people are very helpful in your career, ultimately, because if you're successful managing those people, you're probably going to do pretty well in your career. [00:13:58] Tommy Thomas: Most of us, if we've been around very long, we've had our mettle tested two or three times some of us come out better than others. Can you share with us a time when you had your mettle tested and how you came out of it? [00:14:09] Rich Stearns: I'm quite proud of this accomplishment. Most leaders can't say this, but I got fired twice in the space of one year, early in my career. It's a long story that I won't tell, but being fired twice was devastating. I was in my mid-thirties. I had three kids, and a mortgage to pay, and I got fired twice in the space of one year. I was in my mid-thirties. I had three kids, and a mortgage to pay. And of course when you're fired from a job, so much of your identity is wrapped up in your title and where you work, what we do. It can just be very devastating when that is kicked out from under you, not to mention the financial insecurity and things that go along with that. God actually used that in my life to really deepen my faith and kind of drive me back to him. If I'm honest with myself, I would say in the first 10 years of my career, I was very successful. I became a CEO by the age of 33 and everything I touched seemed to turn to gold. And I thought, wow, this is sweet. This is going to be a great life. I've made it. And now I've made it to the top of this company. And then all of a sudden, the winds changed. I got fired and found another job. I got fired from that and then found myself totally derailed. But I think what God was trying to do is say, Rich, I'm going to take you out of the game and sit you on the bench. The coach needs to do a little work with you. I think what was happening is I was forgetting that my first job is to be an ambassador for Christ in the workplace, that's really my calling. That's the calling of every Christian. It's from II Corinthians 5 where Paul says, we are therefore Christ's ambassadors as though God is making his appeal through us. And so, wherever you work, whatever you do, if you're a follower of Christ, you're supposed to be His ambassador. And the other job you have is really your cover job, right? It's almost like you're undercover and whatever you do, you might be a professor, you might be a businessperson, or a teacher. And what God taught me over the course of those two years, I was unemployed for about a year looking for a job, and there's no more helpless feeling than being unemployed and hat in hand, basically asking people if they'd consider hiring you. You have no power. All you can do is make phone calls and apply for jobs, answer want ads, those kinds of things. I think what God was really teaching me is to get your priorities straight. And when you've done that, I'll put you back in the game. And there was this memory from my childhood catechism classes. I grew up Catholic and we had to memorize the answer to this question, why did God make me? And the answer was to know Him, to love Him, and to serve Him in this world. And it dawned on me, it was like a flash of insight, that's what I've been missing. Wherever I work, my job is to know God, to love Him, and to serve Him in that place and I can do that being unemployed, I can do that as a taxi driver, or I can do that as a CEO. But wherever I am and whatever I'm doing I can try to know God better, to love Him and serve Him in this world and that's what I took with me into my next job, which was at Lenox China. [00:17:20] Tommy Thomas: Thinking back early in your career, who was the first person that saw leadership potential in you and maybe set you on the track? [00:17:30] Rich Stearns: I'll talk about two different people. The first one was a negative influence. My first job was with Gillette out of business school, Gillette in Boston, and I was in sales administration analyzing, 30 cent coupon promotions and things like that and I wanted to get into the brand management marketing side of things. And so I worked with HR to set up some interviews and basically, it all came back that says, you're not cut out for this. You're not cut out for marketing. And I'll never forget the HR VP said, marketing is a young man's game and you're already two years behind, and I said, I'm 25. I said how young do I have to be? I'm 25 years old. I'm too old? And he said we don't think you have what it takes. You can have a great career here in sales, but we don't think you have what it takes for marketing. And of course, I said I got an MBA from the Wharton Business School in Marketing. It's what I really want to do. So, he was just this negative voice. You can't do it. You're going to fail. A few months later, I applied for this job at Parker Brothers Games, which was an entry-level marketing assistant job. And I went in to resign and he told me, you're making a big mistake. You're going to fail at that and you're going to regret this decision. So anyway, off I went to Parker Brothers the next week, and seven years later, I was the CEO of Parker Brothers having risen through the marketing organization to do every job from vice president to executive vice president and into the president's job. So I left this negative guy and my first boss at Parker Brothers was an encourager. He was a guy that said, you can do this. You can do this. He gave me assignments and he said, I trust you, you can do it. And he just believed in me. He sent me to New York to shoot TV commercials by myself. I'm 26 years old. I'm managing a director in an ad agency and the actors on stage, on set, and I'm shooting TV commercials of my own. So he caused me to really believe that I could do it and that made a huge difference in my motivation and my outlook. ++++++++++++++++++ [00:19:27] Tommy Thomas: What's the most ambitious project you've ever tackled? [00:19:30] Rich Stearns: I can think of a few. When I was at Parker Brothers, think about this. It was a hundred-year-old board game company we all know, Monopoly, Clue, Sorry, Risk, those games. We used to jokingly call it tortured cardboard. We're in the tortured cardboard business. They used to be called parlor games back in the 1890s. When nobody had television or radio or anything like that. And I had this idea to get the company into video games. And so, long story short, I had to sell the senior management. Remember I'm in my twenties. And I had to sell the senior management - don't think of us as a board game company, think of us as a home entertainment company. In the future, games are going to be played on video screens. And these were the early days, the early Atari games. And so I persuaded them to give me a shot at it. And again, long story short, within 18 months, I had hired 180 people. Engineers, software designers, game designers, technicians, marketing people, hired a whole separate sales force. And we doubled the revenues of a hundred-year-old company in about 18 months to two years. So Parker Brothers sales went from $125 million, I'd say in 1980 to $250 million by the end of 1982. It was a huge challenge and pretty amazing. And that's ultimately how I ended up being promoted to CEO. But I would mention World Vision though, as well. So early on at World Vision as the new guy, I saw what the AIDS pandemic was doing to children and families in Africa. And it was largely unknown in the United States. AIDS was a stigmatized disease of the homosexual community. Christians had wanted nothing to do with AIDS. And when I told my marketing team at World Vision that I thought we needed to really embrace this AIDS crisis, raise a lot of money and help these people. There were 13 million orphan children in Africa because of AIDS and many widows and lots of grandmothers that were raising their grandchildren because their parents had both died. My marketing guy said, our donors won't give to this. We're a G-rated ministry and AIDS is an R-rated issue. This is about human sexuality and Christians are not interested in this. And my marketing guy said, our donors won't give to this. We're a G-rated ministry and this is an R-rated issue. This is about human sexuality and Christians are not interested in this. In fact, he did a Barna survey to prove that he was right. And I think that survey showed that only 3% of evangelical Christians said they would definitely be willing to help children that had been orphaned by AIDS. And I said we're going to go there anyway we're going to do it anyway, because it's the right thing to do. And God help us if we remain silent, in the face of this huge crisis in Africa. And so, we did. We went after it and it was a huge challenge because I had to convince my own people to do it. My own team didn't want to go there, and they were the first people I had to convince. And for about the next five years, every speech I gave, every person I talked to, it was about HIV and AIDS in Africa, what it was doing to children and families, and how World Vision was going to help. And I think we raised more than half a billion dollars over those years to respond to the AIDS pandemic. [00:22:46] Tommy Thomas: It's been said that most of us learn the most from our failures. And so, my question is, if that's the truth, why are we all so afraid to fail? [00:22:54] Rich Stearns: Tommy, one of my favorite quotes, and I don't even know who said this originally, but it goes like this, never trust a leader without a limp. And what that is basically saying is that a leader who has only known success is not completely formed as a leader. It's often been said, we learn much more from failure than we do from success. It's also been said that it's harder to pass the test of prosperity than it is to pass the test of failure, and that prosperity can ruin people in many ways. And we all know how that can happen. You see it with Hollywood movie stars and other people that have risen to high positions but have a great fall ahead of them because of their arrogance and their pride. But failure hurts, failure forces us to face our own shortcomings and limitations. But when we face our shortcomings and imitate limitations, we become more whole as people and more whole as leaders. We have more empathy for people that have failed, maybe people in the future who will work for us, who have failed at something or made a bad decision. It makes us humbler as leaders and much more sympathetic to other people that are struggling at a particular point in their life. So, when I came back from being fired twice, I was a much more empathetic leader than I had been before. I was much more aware of the people around me and the struggles they might be having. And much more aware of my role as a leader in trying to help them succeed, and help them overcome some of their shortcomings. And so yeah, I think failure is, it's trite to say, but it's really character building and an important step in a leader's development I believe. [00:24:43] Tommy Thomas: Sticking with that thought, we look across the landscape and we see a lot of leaders who have fallen and went down a wrong track. What do you think is the most dangerous behavior that you've seen derail leaders' careers? [00:24:56] Rich Stearns: I'd mention a couple of things. I think one is pride and arrogance, right? You get too big for your britches. You're bigger than life. We see this in some of the mega-church pastors that have failed, right? They're surrounded by fans who adulate them. Maybe they're surrounded by staff who are always praising them. Every word that comes out of their mouth is being praised and it can go to their head if you don't have an accountability group or if you don't have your feet rooted on the ground and you can start to get into riskier behavior and you start to think you're invincible and nobody can touch you. So I think that kind of arrogance can be part of it. This is related, but it doesn't always come with fame. I think leaders who become, I guess I'd say a lack of integrity, It's if you start as a leader. I've seen leaders who go down this path of losing their integrity, starting to do shady things, telling lies in the workplace, and playing office politics in a negative way. Saying bad things about their coworkers. Bending the truth or fudging the numbers or, telling the boss what he or she wants to hear instead of the truth. I've seen leaders who go down this path of losing their integrity, starting to do shady things, telling lies in the workplace, and playing office politics in a negative way. Saying bad things about their coworkers and man, integrity is like an anchor. Partly because I was a Christian, but my non-negotiable as I was coming up through the ranks is I was always going to tell the truth to my boss, to the people I worked for, to the people that worked for me, that what you saw was what you got. I was never going to deceive anybody. I was never going to hide anything. I was just going to be very transparent about the way things really were, whether it was the sales numbers or the market share or whatever it was. And when you commit to that, when you commit to that integrity, both relationally and in terms of the way you speak and the things you say, it's like an anchor that keeps you rooted in the right place. It keeps you rooted. Yeah, that's often said if you don't tell any lies, you don't have to remember what lies you told. If you always tell the truth, you never have to get your story straight because you're not deceiving anybody and people trust you. I worked for family-run companies, Parker Brothers, when I started was still run by Mr. Parker. And then I went to work for Lennox and that was owned by a family, the Brown family in Kentucky. And when you work for a family-owned company, it's their money, right? It's their money. It's their company. And they put the highest value on integrity in their leaders because you're not just messing with some shareholder's money, you're messing with my family's money. My family's legacy. And so, they put a very high value on integrity. And I learned a lot from the culture of those companies. When you work for a family-owned company, it's their money. It's their company. And they put the highest value on integrity in their leaders because you're not just messing with some shareholder's money, you're messing with my family's money. [00:27:44] Tommy Thomas: At what point in your corporate career did your Christian life begin to grab hold and inform you? [00:27:52] Rich Stearns: I would say right from the beginning. I had a sense right from the beginning that I was a Christian. I used to put a Bible on my desk. I wouldn't be an undercover Christian, so the people would know. I always think it's helpful for people in your workplace to know that you're a Christian because that way you're not as tempted to get involved with the dirty jokes and the workplace behavior that might be inappropriate the way you talk about people or to people. And if you have a Bible on your desk and people know you're a Christian, it keeps you honest, right? These people know I'm a Christian. They're watching me. And I need to conduct myself in such a way that I don't bring shame to the Lord, right? So I always had a sense that I wanted to be a person of integrity in the workplace and that somehow would reflect positively on my faith and the Lord that I served. And might lead to conversations about faith where, somebody might say, hey, what's different about you or, tell me more about your church and those kinds of things that happened over the years. So those, I think from very early on, I did say a few minutes ago though, that by the time I got to be CEO at 33, my work was so all-consuming, it was just an all-consuming thing that I was beginning to compartmentalize my faith. It was still there, but it wasn't the first thing I thought about when I got up in the morning. It was like, I got to get to work. I got to do this. I got to do that. I've got to accomplish these things. And that's when, as I say, the Lord took me out of the game, put me on the bench, and said, hey, we need to get our priorities straight here. Are you willing to put me first in your life? In fact, my leadership book, Tommy, that I wrote a couple of years ago the first real chapter is about surrendering as Christians. As leaders, our first job is to completely surrender our careers and our lives to the Lord. And once we've surrendered our career to the Lord, then it's his to do with as he pleases. And we're there to just be good ambassadors to serve him, whether our career goes up or down or sideways, we can still be a good ambassador for the Lord. +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ [00:30:06] Tommy Thomas: I hope you've enjoyed this conversation with Rich as much as I have. I'm always amazed to learn about the early years of someone's life and how things turn out in the end. Next week we will continue to explore Rich's leadership journey. He's been very candid and transparent in the conversation thus far. That will continue next week. Links and Resources JobfitMatters Website Next Gen Nonprofit Leadership with Tommy Thomas World Vision Books by Rich Stearns: Lead Like It Matters to God: Values-Driven Leadership in a Success-Drive World by Richard Stearns The Hole in Our Gospel 10th Anniversary Edition: What Does God Expect of Us? The Answer That Changed My Life and Might Just Change the World by Richard Stearns Books by Rich and Reneé Stearns: God's Love For You Bible Storybook by Richard Stearns & Reneé Stearns He Walks Among Us: Encounters with Chris in a Broken World by Richard Stearns & Reneé Stearns Connect Tommy Thomas - tthomas@jobfitmatters.com Tommy's LinkedIn Profile

Alvin Sanders - The Crucible of Life and Leadership

Spiritual Life and Leadership

Play Episode Listen Later Jul 12, 2023 31:58

[00:00:00] Alvin Sanders: The hardest decision I had to make concerning my own personal level of leadership was the decision that I made in 2007 to leave the pastorate and to work for the denomination. And the thing that got me was the President who unfortunately has passed away, Bill Hamill, he asked me the question, he said, Alvin, do you want to influence one church or do you want to influence 1500 churches? And honestly, I had to ask to myself, and I said I want to influence 1500 churches. +++++++++++++++++++++++ [00:00:34] Tommy Thomas: Our guest today is Dr. Alvin Sanders. On his LinkedIn Profile it says, President and CEO of World Impact, Adjunct Seminary Professor, Advocate for Redemptive Poverty Work, Husband, Father, Author, Mentor, and Loves Sports. I imagine we could do a podcast episode on all those titles, particularly the one about sports. But today I want to focus on Alvin's role as the President and CEO of World Impact, and in particular their work as an advocate for redemptive poverty. Alvin, give us your elevator speech on World Impact. [00:01:17] Alvin Sanders: World Impact started about 52 years ago and we're trying to solve the problem that 95% of the world's pastors have no formal ministry training. We believe that we provide effective ministry training that's affordable and accessible as part of the solution to that problem. And our theory of change is that trained urban pastors lead to healthier churches, which leads to them impacting their community toward flourishing. [00:01:45] Tommy Thomas: Good. You got that one down. [00:01:46] Alvin Sanders: That's good. I don't know if that was 30 seconds or not. I got it. [00:01:50] Tommy Thomas: To our listeners, Alvin and I met, at least for me, in an unusual way. I was conducting the CEO search for the City Gospel Mission in Cincinnati, and I did my LinkedIn research and I liked Alvin's background. I thought he might be a good candidate. So, I called him, and he said, no, he was pretty committed to World Impact, but then he turned the tables on me. He says we need a couple of additional cabinet members. Would you be interested in helping us? And next thing I knew Alvin had recruited me to help him with two searches. I didn't have to submit a proposal or anything. So, Alvin, I guess I owe you a big thank you for trusting us with that work. [00:02:26] Alvin Sanders: You did an excellent job. I have two awesome team members, and we're a better organization because of your work. [00:02:34] Tommy Thomas: Thank you. Take me into a little bit of your background. I'm always curious how people got their start. What do you remember about your childhood that maybe has contributed to the man you are today? [00:02:44] Alvin Sanders: Yeah, so I'm a military brat. My father was in the Air Force for 30 years and we lived globally. For instance, I spent four years in Okinawa, Japan during my formative language years, and I don't remember this, but I've been told that I used to be able to speak fluent Japanese, so I wish that I could conjure that up again, but I can't. But that had a big effect on me. Because I grew up what's called a third culture kid. And you can look that term up, but it's essentially a person who could see into different cultures while not being in them, I would say you grow up organically, culturally flexible. That's probably the easiest way to describe it. And so that led me to ministry. I've been in ministry for 32 years. I started in ministry at 21. Worked at a variety of places but they always had a connection to the urban context of making disciples there. And I worked with the Evangelical Free Church of America planting an inner-city church in the city of Cincinnati. I worked for the aforementioned City Gospel Mission before that under their president who's no longer with them, Roger Howell. And then I also worked for the Evangelical Free Church of America denomination, running their All-People initiative. And then I came the World Impact as a Senior Vice President in 2015 and then became president in 2017. And this is where I hang my hat. [00:04:06] Tommy Thomas: So, growing up all over the world, what was high school like for you? [00:04:10] Alvin Sanders: My dad ended up retiring in Columbus, Ohio, so that's where I spent most of my time. And that's where I went to high school. [00:04:17] Tommy Thomas: And when you got to college, how'd you pick a major? [00:04:21] Alvin Sanders: The first major that I picked was Physical Therapy, and the first college that I went to was Bowling Green State University near Toledo, Ohio. And while on campus I got very involved with a campus ministry. None of the major ones, but just a small one that was started by a fellow student. And it was during that time I said, man, I think God's calling me to do this full time. So, I ended up transferring to Cincinnati Christian University and as they say, the rest is history. [00:04:52] Tommy Thomas: What's something that people might be surprised to know about you that maybe is not on your LinkedIn profile or not in any writing anywhere? [00:05:01] Alvin Sanders: Oh, let's see. That I'm a homebody. Much to my wife's chagrin. A perfect day for me is doing nothing. It is sitting in my recliner downstairs with food and drink and watching good sports or good news stories or whatever, but I love to do nothing. [00:05:27] Tommy Thomas: Now that would come as a surprise just from my working with you because in our relationship, you've been out and about and upfront and returning from a speaking engagement or headed to one. [00:05:38] Alvin Sanders: Yes, and I'm sure that's probably what plays into those times when I don't have anything to do. I cherish them. [00:05:43] Tommy Thomas: Take me back to your first management job when you actually had somebody that you were responsible for. What do you remember about that? [00:05:51] Alvin Sanders: The crazy thing, it was both a blessing and a curse, was the first ministry position I've ever held. I had pretty significant responsibilities. And I learned I can be an intense person. God bless the first people that I had to supervise and the first volunteers I had to direct because with a military and athletic background and an intense personality – I'm sure those people got fried. I was probably a marine minister; I would say so to speak. And what I remember is God's providence and blessing the success of the things that I did. And I also had a lot of learning lessons about what it means to really invest and treat people with respect and dignity. [00:06:44] Tommy Thomas: You've had a long career in ministry and I'm sure you've had times that have “tested your mettle”. Maybe can you take us into one of those and what you learned or maybe didn't learn from it? [00:06:55] Alvin Sanders: The biggest, one of those things, Tommy, that tested my mettle was when me and my wife planted at a church in inner-city Cincinnati. About six months into the church planting experience, there was a police shooting of a young black teenager by a white police officer. This was spring of 2001 and the neighborhood in which we planted a church where the shooting took place exploded in civil disobedience. And you want to talk about the crucible of ministry and trying to figure out what to do. We were young church planters. Six months in just trying to get a church together and draw people, and then all of a sudden, this thing happens. And we learned to depend upon God and that Proverbs, I think it's Proverbs 3:5-6, trust in Lord and all that you do and lean not on your own understanding. In all thy ways, acknowledge him and he shall direct your paths because there's no strategic plan for planting a church in the middle of a race riot. There just isn't. So, we really learned what it means to trust the Lord and invest in people deeply, invest in a neighborhood deeply so that we can both improve the lives and hearts of the people as well as the neighborhood and pursue the common good. And so, that changed the trajectory of my life. [00:08:15] Tommy Thomas: So yeah, pursuing the common good. What did that look like, could you take us into how you executed that? [00:08:22] Alvin Sanders: Yes. It starts with the philosophical bent of you have to be deeply committed to the people of the neighborhood and the place that it's in. There are no walls to the church. The people who are typically in communities of poverty, folk come in there and they don't have a deep commitment to them. They come and go as they please. They don't have a long-term commitment to them. And so, in terms of the people, it's just a biblical process of, evangelism, discipleship, helping them become better people in Christ. But in terms of commitment to place we utilized very heavily a concept called asset-based community development, or ABCD, where you map out the assets of a community. Because when it comes to communities of poverty, in a lot of places, people always look at what's wrong with the community. Asset-based community development says every community has things that are wrong. What's right with the community? And look at what's right with the community and see how you can be. How you can fill the glass up, so to speak. If the glass is half full or half empty is the negative stuff half full? Is the water in the glass? So how do you raise the level of water, so to speak? And so, when we did our asset-based mapping, we saw that what the community did not have was many services for the working poor. Yeah, because most of the people who are in poverty are working. They're not the folks standing on the corner saying, please, brother, can you spare a dime? They're not those people. Not that those people aren't in poverty, but that's not what the face of poverty looks like. The face of poverty in the United States looks like a single mother with kids who's working a service industry job. And so, we really began a ministry towards that group. Working with my wife to establish a food pantry and health check center in the back part of the church. So, we established a food pantry that people could utilize once a month because that's really all they needed once we did our surveying. And that helped them stretch their check. They could come in, they could get the groceries, and they maybe had money for three weeks, but then this would be the fourth week. And then also while they were there, we partnered with Xavier University with their nursing student program, and nursing students would be in the back and they could get they can get diabetes check and things of that nature. And then if they had any health issues, we would refer them down the street to a local health clinic. And then we also had a person, one of our staff members who would sit in the back and say, hey - anybody have any spiritual concerns or any spiritual or anything, you want us to pray for this, that or the other, or just see general life advice from the Word then they could go stop there. So, we had a three-stop shop where people could come get their food, they could get their health checked, and then they can be ministered to spiritually as well. [00:11:28] Tommy Thomas: Obviously most of my experience with you has been in the hiring mode. And I probably know a little bit of the answer to this next question. But for people who wonder what a CEO looks for in senior leadership, take us into some of the qualities that you're looking for in leaders. [00:11:43] Alvin Sanders: Yes. Basically, and I don't remember which guru I got this from, or what book I read it from, so it's not original to me. But there are two main characteristics that I always look for in my team. Can they do the job right and can they do the job well? Can they do the job right has to do with their moral character and whether or not they fit into our core values at World Impact. So we screened for that, and then we hired you all to screen for can they do the job well. That has to do with skillsets and the abilities that people may have in order to do the job description that we have designed for that particular job. Can they do the job right? Can they do the job well? Those are the two big things that I look for in my team to contribute to the leading of World Impact. [00:12:35] Tommy Thomas: I remember, and yours was the first, and I guess so far the only client I've had that used this thing, I think you called it a circle of voices. And I thought that was cool. And every listener may use it in their work. I don't know. But take us into that. [00:12:49] Alvin Sanders: When we're making major decisions, we don't do it for every decision. We do it only for major decisions. We do a circle of voices and again, I don't remember where I picked this up from, but what we do is whatever the decision that we have to make, we give to everybody around the table, you have to speak for at least two minutes, but no more than five minutes and give your perspective on what decision we need to make and why, and it's like you're in court, you're a lawyer, make your case for why, what do we, what do you think we need to do and why? And nobody else can speak while that person is speaking. And then I'm literally the timekeeper. So you only get five minutes. You must speak for at least two minutes, but you only get five. And then after each person has spoken, then we open the floor up for dialogue and debate and come to a collaborative decision. [00:13:52] Tommy Thomas: On the flip side of that, and I hadn't been with you on this, but what goes into how you finally decide somebody's got to go and what have you seen the best way to do it? [00:14:02] Alvin Sanders: We try to err on the side of grace. And we believe in weekly feedback. So, our supervisors theoretically are coaches. So theoretically, if we say you're to supervise someone, it's because we believe that you can coach that person to be a better person who contributes to the mission of our organization. So, if someone is constantly not living up to what we desire for them to do within our organization, then we utilize the tool that everybody else utilizes a Performance Improvement Plan or PIP. And some people think, once I've been PIPPED that's just the time period that you have for me to work until I have to find another job. But that's not what we utilize it for. Hopefully, we really want to say, hey, we want you to improve. And there have been people that we have put on Performance Improvement Plans that they actually emerged out of that, and they kept going. And then after a PIP, if you still aren't doing what you need to do, then we just have a brutally honest conversation with the person. Just say, hey, it's not working out here for you. It's time for you to transition out. We always work hard to get people to self-select out. And 90 - 95% of the time, that's what happens. We are long-suffering. We practice the spiritual discipline of patience. It's no surprises. The only people who get fired from our organization are people who do egregious violations of our core values. If you do an egregious violation of our core values, then you must go, because we've communicated our core values to you. Core values to us are not just some booklet that sits on a shelf. We actually live them. We do things to catalyze them. So, most people that get fired, they've egregiously violated, but the overwhelming majority of people who are World Impact transition out. If they're not, we help them figure out how to transition out and self-select. [00:16:15] Tommy Thomas: You mentioned you were in senior leadership fairly early on. Who were some of the mentors in your life and how did that play out? [00:16:23] Alvin Sanders: Yeah, I've had several mentors the aforementioned City Gospel Mission and Roger Howell. He was my first boss who really helped shape and mold me into the person I am today. When I worked in Chicago for two years and I worked at a place called Circle Urban Ministry, Glen Kayron was someone who invested in me deeply. When I did my PhD studies Dr. Michael Dantley, who's a prominent African American pastor in the city of Cincinnati, as well as he was a professor at Miami University, and I studied under him. He played a key role in my development as well. [00:16:59] Tommy Thomas: Did these people see something in you, and of course I guess your bosses, they can understand that. But did mentors see something in you and seek you out, or did you see something in them and figured you'd be better if you could sit under their tutelage? [00:17:16] Alvin Sanders: Well, it's a combination of both. And I actually left one out that he's probably the person who saw the most in me at the beginning, and that's a gentleman ny name of Dr. Jonathan Burnham, who his church, Hope Evangelical Free Church, was the parent church of my church, River of Life church. And he saw me as a tremendous leader. Way more than I did. I had leadership characteristics, but I was extremely raw and rough around the edges, and Jonathan Burnham really invested in me and my family and helped us when we planted River of Life Church. And those seven, eight years I spent under his tutelage were tremendous. [00:17:56] Tommy Thomas: I never phrased this question exactly right, but I guess I'm looking for when you recognized, and maybe you acknowledged that you did have leadership potential and some of those rough edges began to smooth and you felt more comfortable moving. Do you remember that? [00:18:11] Alvin Sanders: I'm arrogant enough to have never thought I wasn't a leader. It was never about that for me. What it was about for me was getting more polished. If I was in the room, I was going to lead, that's just the way it was going to go because that's the way my personality type I'm told, so the old Myers Briggs, I am an ENTJ, and I'm told that's a characteristic of that personality type that we either lead or we influence. The head leaders, we take our ball, and we go home. That's basically our personality type. Okay. So, for me, it was a matter of how to be a good godly leader. How to get polished to be able to do that instead of just leading rough shot and wild. [00:18:56] Tommy Thomas: Thinking about your team do y'all have any team-building exercises that you use that you found effective as you try to bring this group together? [00:19:05] Alvin Sanders: We have a meeting rhythm as a team. We get together for 90 minutes every four or five weeks, and then once a quarter we do a two-and-a-half day offsite. And the offsite is a combination of relationship building as well as business items. During our 90-minute time together, we always start our meetings off by sharing one good thing. What's one good thing professionally or personally that's happened to us since our last time together? We also always have prayer time together. And during our offsites, we have extended sharing, and extended prayer because I have a saying that I care much more about who you are as a person than what you do. And we live that. And we live that out. And that's the biggest thing that we do as an executive team in order to, for us to be glued to one another. [00:20:03] Tommy Thomas: So y'all have operated as a virtual organization from a long time ago. And obviously, it's worked, or you wouldn't be doing it. Tell us a little bit about that. [00:20:13] Alvin Sanders: Yes. We were virtual before it was cool to be virtual. And the prior president to me, Efrem Smith, he's the one who implemented that. And then when I came in being virtual can be done, but you have to be very intentional about relationship building, like the things that I just talked about. Operating a virtual ministry can be done but you must be VERY intentional about relationship building. We have monthly prayer times where we have all staff get on Zoom for an hour, and half that hour we spend in prayer, both large group and small group. And in the other half, we highlight two staff members where we just do some lighthearted questions and answers and let everybody get to know one another. Once a year we gather all staff together for one day of team meetings, and then two and a half days of really just fun. And investing in one another and encouraging one another around one of our core values. Because we have five core values. So, we do a theme each year. So, we do a lot of intentional relationship-building. And we just experimented with something that we're probably going to keep and that it's in the spring. We've had regional gatherings, so we have staff spread off all across the country and we gather staff for a day in Cincinnati, a day in Wichita, Kansas, and a day in Long Beach. And based on where you lived, you went to one of those locations and we had some training and team-building time. So really to sum it all up, it's intentional relationship building. [00:21:45] Tommy Thomas: What was the biggest lesson on the positive front that your team took out of Covid relative to management and leadership? [00:21:54] Alvin Sanders: Wow. The biggest lesson. [00:22:00] Tommy Thomas: Something that you might take forward. You might think COVID is gone, but we're still going to probably do that. [00:22:04] Alvin Sanders: Actually, you know what? It's what we just talked about because we weren't doing all that before covid. We were virtual, but we weren't gathering, we were not utilizing the tool of technology like we do now, and we were not gathering like we do now. [00:22:21] Tommy Thomas: I thought early on that Covid was bound to have some kind of silver lining and usually everybody that I talked to, there's some kind of silver lining for it. [00:22:32] Alvin Sanders: And that's what it was because we weren't we started praying online together because this is a serious time. We want to pray for our country and pray for each other. Let's get online once a month and all pray together. And it was like, you know what? This is pretty awesome. Let's keep doing it. [00:22:47] Tommy Thomas: What's the most dangerous behavior or trait that you've seen derail a leader's career? [00:22:53] Alvin Sanders: The number one thing I think that either makes or derails a leader's career is emotional intelligence. Having self-awareness of your strengths and your weaknesses and adjusting accordingly. Being able to look at others and not see them as an object in your way or just, not as human beings and people actually caring about them and their work and their contribution. The number one thing I think that either makes or derails a leader's career is emotional intelligence. Having self-awareness of your strengths and your weaknesses and adjusting accordingly. As well as them as people, individually, people who do not have good emotional intelligence. Eventually, the house burns down. That's what I've seen. [00:23:39] Tommy Thomas: It's been said that we learn the most from our failures or our mistakes. If that's true, why is it that most of us are so afraid to fail? [00:23:48] Alvin Sanders: I don't think you can learn, Tommy, unless you do fail. I have a weird goal and that's to fail every day. Because if I'm not making mistakes, that means I'm not pushing myself to be the best person I could be. Because no one knows everything. The way you get to learn things is you have to fail at it first. It's impossible to know something until you have some failures. It's impossible to know something until you have some failures, and then in those failures, you say, okay, what can I pick up and learn from this? And then you move forward. [00:24:19] Tommy Thomas: I was talking to Alec Hill, the President Emeritus of InterVarsity, or maybe it was Rich Stearns. I forget which one. But anyway, they said, “Never trust a leader who doesn't have a limp”. [00:24:31] Alvin Sanders: Yeah - Amen on that. [00:24:33] Tommy Thomas: I know you're a busy man and yet you've talked about how you like to rest and enjoy. How do you and your wife handle work-life balance in your leadership role? You know what, I'm contrarian on that. I think it's impossible to have work-life balance. [00:24:45] Alvin Sanders: You know what, I'm contrarian on that. I think it's impossible to have work-life balance. I don't like to look at it that way. I like to look at it as seasons. There are seasons of busyness and then there are seasons of Sabbath and rest. And that's how I view my life and that's how my wife and I do that now. We're empty nesters now. Yeah, we're much less busy than we used to be. We're still busy. But I think like I said I'm a contrarian and I believe that it's impossible to have a work-life balance or I just never figured out how to do it. It's just, look, I live my life in 90 days sprints, right? And I go, okay, honey, this is what my 90 days is going to look like. The month of July, not going to see you much. But look here, in mid-August, I'm taking 10 days off. We'll be together. So it's quarter-like to me, it's seasons. And it's seasons of super busyness and then seasons where you're not so busy and when you're not so busy, you make sure to take time to connect relationally with the people who are most important to you. [00:25:52] Tommy Thomas: What's the hardest decision you've had to make in leadership? [00:26:03] Alvin Sanders: There's been a ton. The hardest decision I had to make concerning my own personal level of leadership was the decision that I made in 2007 to leave the pastorate and work for the denomination. And the thing that got me was the President who unfortunately has passed away, Bill Hamill, he asked me the question, he said, Alvin, do you want to influence one church or do you want to influence 1500 churches? And honestly, I had to ask myself and I said, “I want to influence 1500 churches”. And that was a super tough decision because our church, the Church River of Life. We still go there, by the way, even though we don't pastor there. Me and my wife says that's our third child. We have two wonderful daughters and River of Life. We basically feel like that's our third child. So, it was literally like leaving your child to someone else's care when we left that. [00:27:03] Tommy Thomas: You worked for a great guy in Bill Hamill. I had the privilege of knowing him over the years and it was always good. I always loved my time with Bill. [00:27:11] Alvin Sanders: Great man. A great man of God. [00:27:14] Tommy Thomas: Changing up maybe on a little bit lighter note, if you were a judge on a nonprofit version of Shark Tank and you had deep pockets, what questions would you have to have solid answers for before you would back one of these startups? [00:27:33] Alvin Sanders: I don't know about specific questions, but I know the things that I would screen for. I would screen for the person - do they know who they are and what they want to do? Essentially, that's where my big questions would be about. Do they know who are they solidly? Can they solidly define who they are as a person and as an individual? And can they solidly describe where they think they want to go? And take then, therefore, take the organization that they're leading. [00:28:06] Tommy Thomas: On the same line of thought, if you were developing a dashboard for a nonprofit to get a look at their health, what are some of your dials going to be? [00:28:19] Alvin Sanders: I would want to look at how they do with staff development and stability. What kind of people are they hiring? What kind of things are these people doing? Are they organized correctly? The org chart, things of that nature. I would also want to look at their systems and how they do things and what are their processes and how do they get things done. What are the tools that they use? Are they correctly dialed into technology and things of that nature to help them achieve their mission? And as well as the obvious one is financially, how are they doing financially? What's their revenue generation look like? Are they built? Really, if you take those things together, then you can make a determination. Are they built for sustainability for the long haul? [00:29:07] Tommy Thomas: If you could go back to a time and tell your younger self one thing, what would that be? [00:29:12] Alvin Sanders: Relax. Relax. Not that serious. Slow down. Why are you running so hard? Where are you trying to go? Stop and smell the roses. [00:29:26] Tommy Thomas: If you had a do-over in your career, what would it be? [00:29:30] Alvin Sanders: I would say in the generality, there were probably opportunities. Here let me give a little bit of context. Okay. God is very merciful to me in that there are opportunities that I turned down, which for whatever reason, circle back to me. And then the second or third time, I recognized it for the opportunity that it was, and I took it. So, the one do over, I would say just speaking in generalities, is being able to recognize opportunities for what they are right off the bat. And not having God have to circle back for me. [00:30:24] Tommy Thomas: I'm thankful to Alvin for taking time from his schedule to join us today. After we stopped recording. I told him that we could have talked for another hour. I really enjoyed the time with him. I'll post links to Alvin's work with world impact in the show notes. As well as links to some of the books that he has written. [00:30:24] Tommy Thomas: Thank you for joining us today. If you are a first-time listener, I hope you will subscribe and become a regular. You can find links to all the episodes at our website –https://jobfitmatters.com/podcast/. If there are topics you'd like for me to explore my email address is tthomas@jobfitmatters.com. Word of mouth has been identified as the most valuable form of marketing. Surveys tell us that consumers believe recommendations from friends and family over all other forms of advertising. If you've heard something today that's worth passing on, please share it with others. You're already helping me make something special for the next generation of nonprofit leaders. I'll be back next week with a new episode until then stay the course on our journey to help make the nonprofit sector more effective and sustainable. Links and Resources JobfitMatters Website Next Gen Nonprofit Leadership with Tommy Thomas Alvin Sanders - World Impact Uncommon Church: Community Transformation for the Common Good by Alvin Sanders Redemptive Poverty Work by Alvin Sanders Bridging the Diversity Gap: Leading Toward God's Multi-Ethnic Kingdom by Alvin Sanders Connect Tommy Thomas - tthomas@jobfitmatters.com Tommy's LinkedIn Profile Alvin's LinkedIn Profile

172. The Courage to Disappoint, a Quick Conversation with Tod Bolsinger and Markus Watson

Play Episode Listen Later Jul 11, 2023 8:36

Tod Bolsinger and Markus Watson reflect on a quote from Rich Stearns focusing on courageious leadership, which often means disappointing your own people at a rate they can absorb. The conversation highlights the importance of leaders calling people to their better selves and standing up for what is right, even if it means facing challenges from within their own tribe. Tod Bolsinger also shares his insights on how to develop courage through healthy relationships with partners, friends, and mentors.Tod Bolsinger and Markus Watson discuss this quote from Rich Stearns in Episode 105: Courageous Leadership."Leaders have to make difficult decisions and difficult decisions require courage."Ep. 105 is a conversation about Rich Stearns' book, Lead Like it Matters to God.TIMESTAMPS:[00:01:12] Leadership requires the courage to disappoint your own people in order to fulfill the mission and make necessary changes.[00:03:28] Leaders must lead people through a process of transformation; without change, they are not needed. To reach the promised land, transformation took 40 years for Moses's people, but he had to be faithful and pass it down to the next generations. Leadership today requires courage to call on the better nature of people and lead them through transformation.Q&A:1. What challenges can people-pleasers face when they need to disappoint others, particularly their friends?Answer: People-pleasers can struggle with the fear of hurting their friends, and may feel an extra sense of obligation to keep them happy.2. How can people develop courage?Answer: Surrounding oneself with supportive and encouraging individuals who prioritize the mission over the individual can help develop courage.3. What is the role of disappointing people in adaptive leadership?Answer: Adaptive leadership involves making tough decisions that may disappoint one's own people for the sake of achieving a larger goal or mission.4. How can courage help in leadership?Answer: Courage is essential in leadership, as it allows leaders to call people to their better selves and stand up for what is right, even if it means facing challenges from their own community.5. What can "partners" and "friends" offer leaders in challenging situations?Answer: Partners should be more committed to the mission than to the individual, while friends should care about the person but be willing to provide honest feedback.6. What is the role of mentors in leadership?Answer: Mentors play a vital role in helping leaders be the best they can be in service of the larger mission.Learn how to lead your church into ministry that matters. Check out my online course, Engaging God's Mission.

god church conversations leadership mission christianity courage ministry leaders greatness neighborhood missional disappoint lead like courageous leadership adaptive leadership tod bolsinger bolsinger rich stearns

Lead Like It Matters to God

Christian Doctor's Digest

Play Episode Listen Later Apr 20, 2023 43:06

Rich Stearns, President Emeritus of World Vision U.S., talks about his ministry and leadership influence, as well as his book Lead Like It Matters to God. RESOURCES FOR THIS EPISODE: Give to CMDA CMDA Bookstore Email CMDA Matters 2023 CMDA National Convention Lead Like It Matters to God by Rich Stearns CMDA Go App Center for Well-Being The Leadership Journal from a Leader's Journey by Pastor Bert Jones

god leader emeritus lead like leader's journey rich stearns

145. Championing Leadership from the Margins, with Beth Birmingham and Eeva Sallinen Simard, authors of Cultures of Belonging

Spiritual Life and Leadership

Play Episode Listen Later Jan 3, 2023 40:46

Beth Birmingham and Eeva Sallinen Simard are the authors of Creating Cultures of Belonging: Cultivating Organizations Where Women and Men Thrive. In this episode, we discuss what it means for churches and organizations to develop cultures of belonging. Not just cultures of inclusion, but cultures in which those who tend to be on margins actually have the opportunity to shape the church or organization when they are in positions of leadership.THIS EPISODE'S HIGHLIGHTS INCLUDE:Beth Birmingham and Eeva Sallinen Simard are the authors of Creating Cultures of Belonging: Cultivating Organizations Where Women and Men Thrive. Beth Birmingham is the facilitator for the Christian Alliance for Inclusive Development and professor at Eastern University.Eeva Sallinen Simard is project director at World Relief.While missional organizations largely serve women and children and are staffed largely by women, only about 15% of executive leadership are women.Eeva Sallinnen Simard tells us that in the largest NGOs in the U.S., only 5% of executive leadership are women.Beth Birmingham says we have adopted a toxic leadership model in missional spaces that contradicts the teaching of scripture.Missional organizations tend to demand a very masculine form of leadership.Eeva Sallinen Simard explains that a culture of belonging is one that not only welcomes women and minorities, but also allows them to contribute to the development of and even change the organization.To change a systemic problem, you need a systems approach.Beth Birmingham suggests that, rather than spending leadership development funds on experienced senior male leaders, missional organizations should spend those funds on young women still learning and growing in their leadership.Men in leadership tend to get uncomfortable with conversations about inclusion, often asking themselves, “What does this mean for me?”Eeva Sallinen Simard says organizations need to make declarative statements about the imago dei in all people and their calling to lead.Organizations that don't believe women can be called to roles of leadership should be forthcoming with that information so that women who want to grow in their leadership can serve in a place where their calling will be affirmed.Beth Birmingham believe that when we humble ourselves and surrender our agendas, God will pour out his blessing in other ways.RELEVANT RESOURCES AND LINKS:Books mentioned:Creating Cultures of Belonging, by Beth Birmingham and Eeva Sallinnen SimardBeth Birmingham:LinkedInInstagramEeva Sallinen Simard:LinkedInInstagramThe Christian Alliance for Inclusive DevelopmentChurch Leadership InstituteRelated episodes:Ep 28: Empowering Women in Ministry, with Tara Beth LeachEp 105: Courageous Leadership, with Rich Stearns

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Leading Like it Matters to God

iWork4Him Podcast

Play Episode Listen Later May 20, 2022 32:52

god rich conference outcome emeritus world vision rich stearns

Leading Like it Matters to God

iWork4Him

Play Episode Listen Later May 20, 2022 33:13

In this interview from the most recent Outcome's Conference, we talk with Rich Stearns, the President Emeritus of World Vision, about keeping your marriage and your faith strong, leading with values, and what a thriving ministry looks like. As to this last bit, Rich relates thriving in faith and ministry to the core mission of World Vision: to restore the dignity of the poor and bring hope to the hopeless. Isn't this what we should all be doing? When we work to bring dignity and hope to everyone in our sphere of influence, our teams, organizations, and clients thrive.Plus, Rich discusses his new book Lead Like It Matters to God: Values-Driven Leadership in a Success-Driven World, which was selected as the Christian Leadership Alliance book of the year. Surrender and sacrifice are just two of the 17 values that he outlines in this new book. Rich's writing style is easy and the lessons are long lasting – be sure to pick up a copy today!Guests: Rich StearnsMinistry/ Workplace: World Vision

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Relieving Some Pressure from Your Pastoring - Richard Stearns - 04 FrontStage BackStage with Jason Daye

FrontStage BackStage with Jason Daye - Healthy Leadership for Life and Ministry

Play Episode Play 17 sec Highlight Listen Later May 10, 2022 45:47

If you're looking for opportunities to remove some of the pressures of pastoring while still honoring God and being faithful in your ministry, then this conversation is for you. In this episode of FrontStage BackStage, host Jason Daye is joined by Richard Stearns, president emeritus of World Vision, as they discuss the gift of value-driven leadership that can transform your life and ministry.Dig deeper into this conversation: Find the free Weekly Toolkit, including the Ministry Leaders Growth Guide, all resource links, and more at http://PastorServe.org/networkSome key takeaways from this conversation:Rich Stearns on success-driven culture: "We are breathing this colorless, odorless gas of success that we almost don't even notice, because it's just everywhere. And then you have to ask the fundamental question, Does God care if we're successful? Does he want us to be successful? Or is there something else?"Rich Stearns on trusting God with the outcomes: “Once you've surrendered the outcomes...it's very liberating. It's very freeing, because it no longer depends on me. God is just calling me to be faithful, to take the gifts and talents he's given me and to use them with diligence, and do the best I can.”Rich Stearns on balance in life and ministry: "You need balance in your life. You need time with your family, you need time to recharge your batteries, you need to delegate things to other people made in the image of God who are gifted and called. You have to extract yourself from certain decisions and certain meetings and say, I'm just going to trust the people around me to do it."----------------Looking to dig more deeply into this topic and conversation? FrontStage BackStage is much more than another church leadership show, it is a complete resource to help you and your ministry leaders grow. Every week we go the extra mile and create a free toolkit so you and your ministry team can dive deeper into the topic that is discussed.Visit http://PastorServe.org/network to find the entire Weekly Toolkit, including the Ministry Leaders Growth Guide (Our team pulls key insights and quotes from every conversation with our amazing guests. We also create engaging questions for you and your team to consider and process, providing space for you to reflect on how that episode's topic relates to your unique church context. Use these questions in your regular staff meetings, or other settings, to guide your conversation as you invest in the growth of your ministry leaders.)Love well, live well, and lead well ----------------Complimentary 1-hour Coaching Session for Pastors http://PastorServe.org/freesession----------------Follow PastorServeLinkedIn http://linkedin.com/company/pastorserveTwitter http://twitter.com/pastorserveInstagram http://instagram.com/pastorserveFacebook http://facebook.com/pastorserve----------------Connect with Jason DayeLinkedIn http://linkedin.com/in/jasondayeInstagram http://instagram.com/jasondaye

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Jesus, Poverty and the Least of These with Rich Stearns

Discipleship Lab

Play Episode Listen Later Feb 14, 2022 36:09

Conversations that help us learn, live and love the way of Jesus.

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Rich Stearns on Leading Like it Matters to God

Leading Forward: Building Healthy Leaders for Healthy Organizations

Play Episode Play 48 sec Highlight Listen Later Sep 27, 2021 47:08

Richard Stearns is President Emeritus of World Vision US. He was the longest-serving president in World Vision's history, from 1998-2018. Prior to that, he was a senior executive at Parker Brothers and then CEO of Lenox China. On this episode of Leading Forward, Rich joined Matthew Hall and Ben Dockery to discuss his most recent book, Lead Like it Matters to God: Values-Driven Leadership in a Success-Driven World. Links from this episode:@RichStearns (Twitter)Lead Like it Matters to God: Values-Driven Leadership in a Success-Driven WorldWorld VisionReview Leading Forward in Apple Podcasts and let us know what you think of the show.Keep up with the show on social media: Twitter // Facebook // Instagram

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105. Courageous Leadership, with Rich Stearns, author of Lead Like It Matters to God

Spiritual Life and Leadership

Play Episode Listen Later Jun 22, 2021 42:57

Rich Stearns, author of Lead Like it Matters to God, served as the President of World Vision from the mid-1990's until just a few years ago. In that time, World Vision took on the African AIDS pandemic—and through Rich's leadership helped many of us get a better understanding of what was really happening in that crisis, and of the children whose lives were being shattered by that pandemic.THIS EPISODE'S HIGHLIGHTS INCLUDE:Rich Stearns is the President Emeritus of World Vision and the author of Lead Like it Matters to God.Rich Stearns came to faith after reading Miracles, by C.S. Lewis, and through the influence of his wife (then fiancé).Rich was CEO of Parker Brothers Games and Lenox China.Rich was initially not interested in being the President of World Vision.The call to serve World Vision was a lot like Jesus' call to the “rich young ruler.”Total surrender is essential for faithful leadership. Sometimes we surrender some parts of our lives, but not others.In the 1990's, Rich Stearns was called to deal with the AIDS pandemic in Africa. This was an incredibly difficult and adaptive leadership challenge.Listening is critical for healthy and effective leadership.The job description of every follower of Jesus is that we are Christ's ambassadors in the world.We must sacrifice our ambitions for Christ's ambitions for us.In addition to his book, Rich Stearns has a podcast titled Lead Like it Matters to God, where he interviews senior Christian leaders.RELEVANT RESOURCES AND LINKS:Books mentioned:Lead Like it Matters to God, by Rich StearnsMiracles, by C.S. LewisRich StearnsLead Like It Matters to God podcastWorld VisionReviews help listeners find this podcast. To leave a review of Spiritual Life and Leadership:Click HERE.Click on the link that says, "Listen on Apple Podcasts."In the window that opens, click the button that says, "Open Link." This will open iTunes.To the right of the Spiritual Life and Leadership logo, click "Ratings and Reviews."Under the heading, "Customer Reviews," click on the button that says, "Write a Review."Select the number of stars and write your review.Click submit.Thank you!— Links to Amazon are affiliate links.Click HERE to find out more about the Church Leadership Institute's 18-month Online Adaptive Capacity Cohorts.

CNLP 424 | Rich Stearns on How to Beat Failure in Leadership, the Value of Persistence, and What For-Profit and Non-Profits Can Learn From Each Other

The Carey Nieuwhof Leadership Podcast: Lead Like Never Before

Play Episode Listen Later Jun 22, 2021 76:33

The Carey Nieuwhof Leadership Podcast is a podcast all about leadership, change and personal growth. The goal? To help you lead like never before—in your church or in your business.

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Ep. 57 | Rich Stearns on Leadership and Suffering

The Heal Podcast

Play Episode Listen Later Jun 14, 2021 57:45

The former CEO and president of World Vision US for twenty years, Richard Stearns joins us today for a conversation about global suffering and God's sovereignty and mystery through it all. We talk about Rich's new book, Lead Like it Matters to God, and how Rich led World Vision through the HIV/AIDS crisis. Rich Twitter: @RichStearns Lead Like it Matters to God: https://amzn.com/0830847308 The Hole in Our Gospel: https://amzn.com/0785229183 He Walks Among Us: https://amzn.com/1400321867 La Misma Luna Movie: https://amzn.com/B001CQOGM4 Tera IG: @terabradham Tera Website: terabradham.com Heal Website: thehealministry.com

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May 28, 2021

The Common Good Podcast

Play Episode Listen Later May 29, 2021 70:22

(00:00-8:01): Brian and Aubrey shared their thoughts on Rich Stearns' tweet, “Why do so many American Christians think that the Christian faith will bring happiness and prosperity? The fact that 11 of the 12 disciples died as martyrs should tell us something about the kind of commitment God demands. God calls us to obedience not happiness.” (8:01-23:29): Raul Ries, Pastor of Calvary Chapel Golden Springs, Vietnam Veteran, Master in Kung fu San Soo, and Host of Somebody Loves You, heard weekdays at 3PM on AM 1160, joined Brian and Aubrey to chat about his testimony, the ministry of Somebody Loves You, how we can encourage and pray for members of the military, and his documentary, “Taking the Hill.” Learn more about Pastor Raul at somebodylovesyou.com (23:29-32:28): Brian and Aubrey reacted to a Twitter video from Jon Gordon, “No Energy Vampires Allowed! Gandhi said, "I will not let anyone walk through my mind with their dirty feet" and neither should you.” (32:28-42:40): Brian and Aubrey chatted about what school will look like in the fall. They also discussed “Mayor de Blasio's decision to reopen NYC schools at 100% capacity with no remote option in September.” (42:40-51:34): Brian and Aubrey shared their thoughts on Frank Viola's tweet, “Sometimes God will deliver you FROM trouble. Oftentimes He will deliver you THROUGH it.” (51:34-1:01:13): Brian and Aubrey shared their TOP FIVE Ice Cream Flavors. Aubrey's #1 pick was Salted Caramel and Brian's #1 pick was Black Cherry. (1:01:13-1:10:21): Brian and Aubrey shared uplifting articles from the Good News Network: Man Inspires Town During Lockdown—Spelling Out Messages with Rubber Duckies in Front Yard Google Flies in To Help Girl Scouts With Cookie Sales Shortfall – Delivering Thousands of Boxes Via Drone Sheldon the Dog Flunked Out of Service-Animal Training, But Became an Ace at Sniffing Out Arson Landmark Malaria Vaccine is 77% Effective, Tackling One of World's Biggest Killers of Young Children Penguin in Antarctica Leaps into Passing Tourist Boat – Enjoys the Respite See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Lead like it Matters to God - Rich Stearns

The Leadership Show

Play Episode Listen Later May 23, 2021 25:09

The former President of World Vision US tells Andy Peck about his career in leadership, why poverty needs the professionals and lessons from his new book Lead Like It Matters

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Jenny Yang: Courage

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Play Episode Listen Later May 19, 2021 46:41

"I think people think about courage as a lack of fear. And I don't think it's not having any fear. I think courage is acting despite your fear to take a step in the right direction to do the right thing. And a lot of times, I think when it comes to leadership, you need to have the courage to do the right thing and to do the unpopular thing." Jenny Yang, Senior Vice President of Public Affairs at World Relief and the Co-Chair of the Refugee Council USA Advocacy Committee. In this episode, Jenny discusses the courage it takes to combat societal issues such as racism, the courage needed to make tough and unpopular decisions, and the courage to enrich and encourage those with whom you work. Join Rich Stearns as they discuss how to lead courageously in a world which increasingly needs courage. You can buy Rich Stearns' new book Lead Like it Matters to God now.

WorldVision President Emeritus Rich Stearns on Servant Leadership in the Nonprofit World

The Better Samaritan Podcast

Play Episode Listen Later May 17, 2021 43:25

Rich Stearns wants to flip the script on leadership. In his new book, Lead Like it Matters to God, he writes that God doesn't actually look for success. He looks for faithfulness. Join the Better Samaritan email list to receive a discount code for this and other IVP titles! Highlights: How God uses seasons in the wilderness (in Rich's case, getting fired twice in one year!) to refine our hearts Why faithfulness is more important that success Why it's freeing to surrender your career What humility really looks like in the workplace The one superpower every leader can and should use What the best organizations do in impoverishes communities How development work has changed in the last 50 years Questions we asked Rich: How is this leadership book different? Which values should young professionals, especially those working in a humanitarian or justice field, work on first? What if I feel called, but can't find a job in that area? How can we know when it's time to move from private sector to nonprofit? How do we think through both the immediate and structural barriers to eliminating poverty? Resources: Rich's podcast: Lead Like It Matters to God "On Being a Good Neighbor", sermon draft by the Rev. Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr. This episode produced by Laura Finch Theme Song “Turning Over Tables” by The Brilliance Subscribe: Apple Podcasts | Google Podcasts | Spotify | TuneIn | Stitcher | RSS Follow us on Twitter: @kentannan | @drjamieaten | @laura_e_finch | @RichStearns (Note to the listener: In this podcast, sometimes we'll have evangelicals, sometimes we won't. We thinking learning how to do good better involves listening to lots of perspectives, with different insights and understanding with us. Sometimes it will make us uncomfortable, sometimes we'll agree, sometimes we won't. We think that's good. We want to listen for correction. Especially in our blind spots.) Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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Jo Anne Lyon: Reinvention

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Play Episode Listen Later May 12, 2021 43:58

"Reinvent your vision, reinvent what's needed, because what's needed next year is not what you did five years ago. Always be looking around the corner at what's next." Jo Anne Lyon has not only had to reinvent her personal life, but also the way leadership looks and what our world needs. Through her work founding the non-profit World Hope, as well as being the first woman to lead a major denomination, Jo Anne knows what it takes to think outside the box and make change happen where change is needed. Join Rich Stearns as these two discuss what it takes to be an effective, adaptable leader. You can buy Rich Stearns' new book Lead Like it Matters to God now.

Rich Stearns: Lead Like It Matters to God

Stetzer Leadership Podcast

Play Episode Listen Later May 11, 2021 36:29

In this episode of Stetzer Leadership Podcast, Ed is joined by Rich Stearns, President Emeritus of World Vision International. Rich is the author of several books, including the best-selling, award-winning The Hole in Our Gospel. He also wrote Unfinished, as well as two books with his wife, Reneé – a children’s Bible storybook, God’s Love For You, and a 90-day devotional, He Walks Among Us. His most recent release, and the focus of this conversion, is Lead Like It Matters to God: Values-Driven Leadership in a Success-Driven World. In this book, "Stearns shares captivating stories of his life journey and unpacks seventeen crucial values that can transform leaders and their organizations." He joins the podcast to share more about the leadership wisdom he's gained through the years.

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Ron Blue: Money

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Play Episode Listen Later May 5, 2021 43:21

"The paradox of prosperity is that the more you have, the more confusing life becomes because you have more choices. One of the principles is that giving is the only way you can break the power of money. This is why the Matthew 6 passage is so critical: 'Where your treasure is, there your heart will be also.'" Entrepreneur and author Ron Blue joins Rich Stearns today to talk about the various ways money impacts our lives. Listen in as they talk about the importance of humility, generosity, and knowing where your money is going. You can buy Rich Stearns' new book Lead Like it Matters to God now.

S2E4 - Rich Stearns | Lead (& Live) Like It Matters To God

Bold Love Podcast

Play Episode Listen Later May 3, 2021 61:44

As an evangelical Christian, Rich Stearns dives into a wide array of topics that are needed to help mend divides within his own tribe and relationships with those that are not. Topics from morality, caring for one another regardless, leadership in a diverse world, helping those in seek of refuge, and several tidbits of wisdom he's compiled on leadership along his journey. Stearns is an author and President Emeritus of World Vision, one of the world's largest nonprofit humanitarian organizations. Over his two decades with the organization, Rich built a strong leadership team focused on bringing corporate best practices to the nonprofit sector. He traveled to more than 60 of the nearly 100 countries in which World Vision has a presence. He served as a prophetic voice, calling on the American church to respond to the AIDS pandemic in the early 2000s and later raising awareness of the global refugee crisis and global poverty. As a thought leader, Rich appeared regularly in media outlets such as Christianity Today, FOX News, CNN, NPR, Charisma News, and Relevant magazine. Rich is the author of several books, including the best-selling, award-winning The Hole in Our Gospel. He also wrote Unfinished, and most recently published his new book “Lead Like it Matters to God”. SHOW NOTES: Pastor Bob Roberts Jr Blog Lead Like It Matters To God - Rich Stearns Hole in Our Gospel - Rich Stearns Bold as Love: What Can Happen When We See People the Way God Does About Pastor Bob Roberts Jr Dr. Bob Roberts, Jr. is the founder of GlocalNet, a non-profit dedicated to mobilizing the church for transformation in the public square, founder and chairman of Glocal Ventures Inc (GVI) and co-founder of Multi-Faith Neighbors Network (MFNN), a multifaith organization committed to creating international religious freedom through intentional cross-cultural relationships. He is also currently the Senior Global Pastor at Northwood Church and host of the Bold Love podcast. Bob has contributed or been featured on the World Economic Forum, Fox Business Channel, Washington Post, New York Times, Huckabee Show, Religious News Service, C-Span, Templeton Religions Trust, El-Hibri, Christianity Today, Outreach Magazine and more. Bob is a graduate of Fuller Theological Seminary (Doctorate of Ministry), Southwestern Baptist Theological Seminary (Masters of Divinity), and Baylor University (BA). He and his wife Niki have two children and three grandchildren. Click Here for Full Bio

Dr. Nicole Massie Martin: Diversity

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Play Episode Listen Later Apr 28, 2021 45:28

"I have seen God move the most powerfully in my life when I've allowed for another diverse perspective that wasn't my own. And I value leaders who intentionally look for the unheard voice and intentionally ask the question, 'Who's not at the table?'" Dr. Nicole Massie Martin is a pastor, author, professor, and founder of Soul Fire International Ministries. Through her life and her career, she has made it her goal to empower those around her - especially women, who have been ignored in Christian spaces for so long. Hear what she has to say about the importance of diversity, the role men have to amplify women, and more. You can buy Rich Stearns' new book Lead Like it Matters to God now.

Gary Haugen: Purpose

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Play Episode Listen Later Apr 21, 2021 46:58

"At the end of the day, what matters? Not so much the skills and qualifications that you may have - although God will use those - but that God is with you where you're going. That's always been an encouragement to me." Gary Haugen, founder of the International Justice Mission, joins Rich Stearns today to discuss what it means to find and pursue your purpose, even when others don't necessarily see the point. Learn more about the International Justice Mission here, and you can buy Rich Stearns' new book Lead Like it Matters to God now.

Lloyd Reeb: Significance

Being Human with Steve Cuss

Play Episode Listen Later Apr 14, 2021 52:50

"If you define success as using what I have for my own benefit, and if you just define significance as using what I have to be a blessing to others, then the pursuit of success alone will always fall short. You know, Jesus said it's better to give than to get." Lloyd Reeb, Executive Coach at the Halftime Institute, understands the delicate relationship between success and significance. He uses this knowledge to help individuals find their calling, helping them to find the balance between success and significance in their lives. You can order Rich Stearns' new book Lead Like it Matters to God now.

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S6E14 - Rich Stearns

Play Episode Listen Later Apr 12, 2021 49:57

The amazing Rich Stearns (online @RichStearns) joins Steve Cuss to talk about being fired as CEO twice in a year, rapidly learning while leading, global poverty, and his excellent new leadership book! Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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S6E14 - Rich Stearns

Managing Leadership Anxiety: Yours and Theirs

Play Episode Listen Later Apr 12, 2021 49:12

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A conversation with Rich Stearns

Listening In

Play Episode Listen Later Apr 9, 2021 47:44

This week, hear Warren Smith's conversation with the former president of World Vision, Rich Stearns.

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Tami Heim: Surrender

god president surrender heim rich stearns

Play Episode Listen Later Apr 7, 2021 52:01

"When we're facing great duress or stress or uncertainty, we just have to say, 'What, God, do You need me to do?' And I say yes to Him before I even know what the answer is." Being a female leader of a significant Christian organization is a rare accomplishment. Tami Heim, the current President of the Christian Leadership Alliance has led with faith, courage and passion, and has discovered the fundamental importance of surrender as the starting point for Christian leadership. Listen to this insightful interview with a leader who has met one challenge after another over the course of her remarkable career. To learn more and sign up for the Outcomes Conference here, and you can order Rich Stearns' new book Lead Like it Matters to God now.

Episode 111 - Richard Stearns

Dawson Now

Play Episode Listen Later Apr 7, 2021 50:53

This week Scott Dawson Speaks with World Vision President Emeritus, Richard Stearns about his new book, "Lead Like It Matters to God". As President Emeritus of World Vision U.S., Rich Stearns continues to share his leadership influence by writing and speaking on behalf of the organization. He had the longest tenure of any president in its global history, serving from 1998 to 2018. Over his two decades with the organization, Rich built a strong leadership team focused on bringing corporate best practices to the nonprofit sector. Logging 3 million air miles, he traveled to more than 60 of the nearly 100 countries in which World Vision has a presence. He served as a prophetic voice, calling on the American church to respond to the AIDS pandemic in the early 2000s and later raising awareness of the global refugee crisis and global poverty. As a thought leader, Rich appeared regularly in media outlets such as Christianity Today, FOX News, CNN, NPR, Charisma News, and Relevant magazine.

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Lead Like It Matters to God (Alan with Rich Stearns)

Unhurried Living

Play Episode Listen Later Apr 5, 2021 37:06

Leadership matters to God. The way leaders lead matters perhaps more to God. We who would serve the people of God as leaders are invited to do so in the way of Jesus—the Spirit of Jesus. We often say that you do not need a position of leadership to be a person of influence. Today, I’m pleased to have as my guest Rich Stearns, President Emeritus of World Vision and author of the new book Lead Like It Matters to God. We’ll talk about some of the core values that have guided his leadership over the decades. I’m glad you’ve joined us for today’s episode of the Unhurried Living podcast.

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Edgar Sandoval: Perseverance

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Play Episode Listen Later Mar 31, 2021 51:27

"I put so much value on perseverance as a leadership trait because achieving breakthrough outcomes is not easy. In fact, giving up early when things are not going well is a constant temptation." Edgar Sandoval understands perseverance better than most. Arriving in the US from Venezuela when he was 18, he worked his way from Burger King cook to Proctor & Gamble executive, to now being the CEO of WorldVision. Join Rich Stearns as they discuss the relationship between surrender and perseverance, and how our humble steadfastness is ultimately glorifying God. You can preorder Rich Stearns' new book Lead Like it Matters to God now.

Eugene Cho: Sacrifice

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Play Episode Listen Later Mar 24, 2021 48:03

"I think surrender is a word that we love to preach about, but it's a bit more challenging when we're called to embody it and live it in our own lives." Joining Rich Stearns today is Eugene Cho, former pastor, current CEO of Bread for the World, as well an author and social justice advocate. For Eugene, a life of leadership means a life of sacrifice and surrender. In his own life, he has had to sacrifice comfort, money, and familiarity in order to follow the path he felt God wanted him on. For more information on Eugene's life and ministry, please visit eugenecho.com. You can preorder Rich Stearns' new book Lead Like it Matters to God now.

Gov. Bill Haslam: Humility

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Play Episode Listen Later Mar 17, 2021 50:51

“The thing I come back to about being a leader is that humility is at the core of it. No matter what you do. And to me, humility is a mark of whether or not you get it - whether or not you get the Gospel.” Today, Rich Stearns is joined by Gov. Bill Haslam, former governor of Tennessee, as well as president of the Pilot Oil Co. For Gov. Haslam, there is a right way and a wrong way for Evangelicals to engage in politics, business, and leadership - and he is passionate about doing it the right way. The right way, according to Gov. Haslam, is by having a 'faithful presence' in the public square, and by understanding that humility in leadership is what matters to God. You can preorder Gov. Haslam's book Faithful Presence and Rich Stearns' new book Lead Like it Matters to God now.

Introducing: Lead Like It Matters to God with Richard Stearns

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Play Episode Listen Later Mar 8, 2021 1:41

Character is more important to God than accomplishments. In this podcast, Rich Stearns explores a critical leadership question: How should Christian leaders live out their faith at work? Over the course of his career, Rich Stearns has been a CEO of a toy company, a luxury goods company, and a large Christian ministry. On each episode, he'll be talking with a seasoned Christian leader to explore their leadership journey, and they values and qualities they believe to be most important in a leader.

Episode 40: How World Vision Works

All Ears: The Team World Vision Podcast

Play Episode Listen Later Mar 5, 2021 33:26

In this episode, Lyndsey is joined by special guest Don Lee as they do a deep dive into how World Vision works. In the words of former World Vision U.S. President, Rich Stearns, “Solving poverty is rocket science,” and this conversation really captures the beautiful intricacies and complexities of what it is that we’re moving our feet for.

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S6E08: Why God Cares About Values-Driven Leadership // Rich Stearns, World Vision President Emeritus

The Flourishing Culture Podcast

Play Episode Listen Later Feb 22, 2021 43:16

You're really going to love today's podcast episode. Listen to one of the most recognized Christian leaders of this generation. He challenges us to lead like it matters to God. Stay tuned as Rich Stearns talks about his new book. I'm delighted to welcome one of the most outstanding Christian leaders of our generation. Rich Stearns is President Emeritus of World Vision, and author of the soon-to-be-published book, Lead Like it Matters to God: Values-Driven Leadership in a Success-Driven World. These are two mileposts of a tremendous career filled with lessons, insights, and influence that continues to advance God's work on earth. Rich, so glad to have you here on the Flourishing Culture Podcast. Find full show notes here https://www.bcwinstitute.org/podcast/why-god-cares-about-values-driven-leadership-rich-stearns/ Share the Love If you enjoyed this episode, please rate it on Apple Podcasts and write a brief review. https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-flourishing-culture-podcast/id1060724960?mt=2 Follow our Host Follow our Host, Al Lopus, on Twitter https://twitter.com/allopus Follow our Host, Al Lopus, on LinkedIn https://www.linkedin.com/in/allopus/ Email our host at info@bcwinstitute.org

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The Gospel as a virus – Rich Stearns

Q Ideas

Play Episode Listen Later Feb 2, 2019

Our attempts to engage culture have more often seemed to enrage it. Rich Stearns of World Vision questions what we have turned the gospel into. Have we made it safe? Have we kept it from become infectious?

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Episode 05: Rich Stearns

Unedited with Cameron Strang

Play Episode Listen Later Dec 17, 2018 62:59

On today’s episode, Cameron sits down with author and former World Vision president Rich Stearns. Rich was a very successful corporate CEO, which you’ll hear about, and he left it all for something more significant. For the last 20 years he’s led World Vision USA, the largest Christian humanitarian organization in the world. World Vision works in relief efforts, holistic development and advocacy—working with children, families and communities to overcome poverty and injustice. World Vision has a unique strategy of holistic change. They work in communities to make sustainable impact affecting education, health care, economic development, and the promotion of justice. The goal is always to eventually hand the keys over and leave. They work with local leadership to give a hand-up, not just hand-outs. It’s not hyperbole to say that Rich Stearns’ vision, faith and leadership has literally saved millions of lives and changed the world. Rich’s story shows how the gospel—the whole gospel—was always meant to be a world changing social revolution. And it’s a revolution that begins with each of us.

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The Way Home: Rich Stearns on human dignity and the Great Commission

The Way Home Podcast

Play Episode Listen Later Aug 2, 2018 28:16

This episode is part of a special series of podcasts in conjunction with the release of The Dignity Revolution: Reclaiming God's Rich Vision for Humanity. In this series, Dan is bringing together leaders and thinkers whose work helps Christians think well about what it means to be human. He has traveled all over the world…

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The Way Home: Rich Stearns on human dignity and the Great Commission

The Way Home Podcast

Play Episode Listen Later Aug 2, 2018 28:16

christians humanity great commission way home human dignity rich stearns

Rich Stearns: World Vision is the Emergency Room of the Planet

The ChurchLeaders Podcast

Play Episode Listen Later Jul 25, 2018 39:08

Rich Stearns, the president of World Vision talks about ways your church can be involved in helping the poor and desperate around the world.

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30 - Rich Stearns on Faithful Philanthropy

Conversing

Play Episode Listen Later Jul 10, 2018 46:25

Rich Stearns, president of World Vision U.S., reflects on international development, insights from his leadership, and the whole gospel. For more resources for a deeply formed spiritual life, visit Fuller.edu/Studio.

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Walking to Bring Clean Water to Poverty Stricken Areas of the World

Charisma Connection

Play Episode Listen Later Jan 31, 2018 14:44

World Vision tackles the root causes of poverty to build hope and make an impact in a child's life. Rich Stearns, President, World Vision U.S., shares what World Vision is doing to bring clean water to poverty-stricken communities and how water impacts their lives to open doors to new opportunities. Seek out what you can do to help when you listen to this interview.

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Politics and the person

Capitol Conversations

Play Episode Listen Later Jan 30, 2018 31:10

Travis Wussow, ERLC VP for Public Policy, interviews four panelists during the 2018 Evangelicals for Life conference. The panel, "Politics and the Person: Why Legislation Matters for the Pro-Life Cause" includes Tim Goeglein (Focus on the Family), Charles Camosy (Fordham University), Denise Harle with (Alliance Defending Freedom), and Shannon Royce (U.S. Dept. of Health & Human Services). On Demand Video of 2018 Evangelicals for Life More videos: Playlist of Facebook Live content from EFL Playlist includes Russell Moore, James Lankford, Joni Eareckson Tada, Rich Stearns, Ann Voskamp, and more. Pain-Capable Unborn Child Protection Act Explainer via ERLC.com iTunes | Google Play | Stitcher | Tune in

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Brave, Part 3: Bravery is loving the Least - Rich Stearns

National Community Church Audio Podcast

Play Episode Listen Later Nov 19, 2017 32:20

Following Jesus is pretty clear: we're called to love the most vulnerable, the poor, the least of these. Rich Stearns, president of World Vision explores the good news of global poverty and how we're called to serve and support refugees around the world.

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Episode 068 | East Africa Hunger Crisis: Rich Stearns

Q Podcast

Play Episode Listen Later Aug 7, 2017 26:14

Drought. Food shortages. Conflict. These are deadly forces that children throughout East Africa are facing. Areas in South Sudan and Somalia are on the brink of catastrophe. Kenya and Ethiopia face severe drought. Tens of thousands of children could starve to death because of food and water shortages. But this crisis isn't hitting the news as it should. 25.5 million people, our brothers and sisters, are at risk of starvation. This hunger crisis is likely to be the most devastating since we were kids and witnessed Ethiopia's famine. Rich Stearns (President, World Vision US) and Gabe Lyons share a heartfelt conversation on the details and scope of this hunger crisis and what you can directly do about it today and the days to come. Want to learn more about the hunger crisis and what you can do? FAMINE & HUNGER IN AFRICA: WHAT YOU NEED TO KNOW MAKE AN IMPACT THROUGH GIVING & SHARING

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Faith and Foreign Aid

Today's Conversation

Play Episode Listen Later Jul 15, 2017 34:27

Poverty-focused international aid addresses a host of public health, disaster relief and food security issues, and promotes religious freedom and human rights. Though it is a very small portion of the U.S. budget, it is often on the chopping block. In this podcast, you'll hear NAE President Leith Anderson and Rich Stearns, president of World Vision […] The post Faith and Foreign Aid appeared first on National Association of Evangelicals.

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The importance of reaching refugee children – Rich Stearns & Khalil Sleiman

Q Ideas

Play Episode Listen Later Jul 15, 2017

The importance of reaching refugee children - Rich Stearns & Khalil Sleiman

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Episode 061 | Refugee Children: Rich Stearns & Khalil Sleiman

Q Podcast

Play Episode Listen Later Jun 22, 2017 29:55

There are 1.9 billion children in the world, 400 million of which live in extreme poverty. With so many suffering the consequences of war, displacement, and circumstances outside of their control, how can we inject life, hope and promise for a future they can hardly imagine? Rich Stearns, President of World Vision, and Khalil Sleiman, who grew up as a Syrian refugee, will remind us how we take care of the world’s most vulnerable matters—not only for this moment, but for generations to come.

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Rich Stearns

LCBC Church Sermons

Play Episode Listen Later May 21, 2017 36:32

As a church, one of our core values is making a difference on a global scale—how can we an impact where it’s needed most? Richard Stearns, President of World Vision, speaks to us on how coming together in a small way can lead to making a big difference.

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The Way Home featuring Rich Stearns

The Way Home Podcast

Play Episode Listen Later Mar 23, 2017 29:19

What motivates the CEO of a luxury goods company to leave it all behind to work on behalf of the most vulnerable around the world? How can Christians both proclaim the gospel and live it out by serving the neediest around the world? Today my guest is Rich Stearns, President and CEO of World Vision,…

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As president of World Vision U.S., Rich Stearns calls Christians to action on the greatest needs of our day. He is driven by his passion to raise awareness and support for poverty and justice issues. Today, he continues to leverage his influence by boldly calling churches to engage with the Syria refugee crisis and follow Jesus into the hurting places of our world.

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A Matthew 25 Moment for the American Church - PDF

UPC Sunday Sermons

Play Episode Listen Later Jun 19, 2016

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A Matthew 25 Moment for the American Church - Audio

UPC Sunday Sermons

Play Episode Listen Later Jun 19, 2016 23:02

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Building Bridges: Poor & Fragile (with Rich Stearns, President of World Vision)

Faith Community Church of Hopkinton

Play Episode Listen Later Sep 27, 2015 30:06

Rich Stearns, President of World Vision, addresses the church's responsibility to reach out and help people who live in a fragile nation. A fragile nation is an area of the world where people do not have clean water, sufficient food, physical safety, adequate education or employment. God clearly calls His church to be aware of the people in their communities and in the world who need help in meeting their basic needs for life.

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The Secure Podcast - Episode 3

Secure w/ Rick Dunham

Play Episode Listen Later Jan 23, 2014 2:55

“Many of Jesus’ words about money involved warnings. Jesus recognized that the chief competitor to our dependence on Him is our money. When we have enough cash, food, and possessions, we can become self-reliant. Therefore, money is not seen by God as a benign and neutral thing. Money is power, and power competes with God for supremacy in our lives.” – Rich Stearns, President, World Vision US and author of The Hole in Our Gospel writing in the introduction to Secure: Discovering True Financial Freedom Money is one of the most powerful forces in our life. In fact, it’s always been that way. Going back thousands of years, Isaiah warns the people of Israel to not be enamored with the wealth of the nations around them because of how it will seduce them. In this latest podcast I talk a little about my personal “epiphany” and how God led me to scripture to better understand money’s seductive power to lead me away from Him.

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First Person: Best of 2013

Play Episode Listen Later Jan 2, 2014 24:00

For the final program of 2013, Wayne Shepherd has chosen a few of the many interview highlights of the past year. Clips include Keith and Kristyn Getty, Rich Stearns, Cathey Anderson, Papa Joe Bradford, Buddy Greene, and Alistair McGrath.

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First Person: Best of 2013

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Play Episode Listen Later Jan 1, 2014 23:59

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Rich Stearns

The RELEVANT Podcast

Play Episode Listen Later Oct 4, 2013 69:41

This week we talk to humanitarian and president of World Vision, Rich Stearns. Rich has a new book out called Unfinished that explores our calling to live out the whole Gospel. We also introduce you to a great new indie/folk band, The Lonely Wild, deal with the impending reality of lightsabers, and discover a new app to help us find our “heartpoints.” Trust us, you won't want to miss this one--- Send in a voice message: https://anchor.fm/relevant-podcast/messageSupport this podcast: https://anchor.fm/relevant-podcast/support See acast.com/privacy for privacy and opt-out information.

Rich Stearns

The RELEVANT Podcast

Play Episode Listen Later Oct 4, 2013 69:41

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First Person: Rich Stearns

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Play Episode Listen Later Apr 11, 2013 24:00

The President of World Vision, Rich Stearns, talks with Wayne Shepherd about the message of his new book, Unfinished, Believing Is Only the Beginning.

First Person: Rich Stearns