Podcasts about World Vision International

In this episode, we sit down with Michael Cerna from the Accord Network and Elli Oswald from the Faith to Action Initiative to talk about what happens when faith-based nonprofits face major funding cuts.  Spoiler: it's tough.  From staff layoffs to shifting American opinions on international engagement, Michael and Elli share the hard realities—and the hope. We get real about working with the government, why accountability matters, and how churches can step up.  Plus, Michael and Elli share their perspectives on how young leaders and global communities are sparking change in powerful ways. This episode is honest, eye-opening, and full of practical wisdom for anyone in the nonprofit or ministry world. Read more from Michael Cerna/The ACCORD network: Michael Cerna | Faith, Funding, and Foreign Aid:  https://www.nae.org/michael-cerna-relief-development-faith-government-funding-usaid-todays-conversation-podcast/ Read about how one organization in Faith to Action's network is being impacted: https://wng.org/roundups/the-usaid-closure-leaves-a-vacuum-what-will-fill-it-1740694625  Bio: Michael Cerna: Michael Cerna serves as CEO of Accord Network, a coalition of over 150 Christian organizations dedicated to global relief and development. Prior to leading the Accord Network, Cerna served in strategic and partnership roles at HOPE International, Mission: Hope, and Renew Outreach. He also previously worked at McKinsey & Company and holds a master's degree in International Management from Kennesaw State University.   Elli Oswald: Elli Oswald is the Executive Director of the Faith to Action Initiative. Before this role, she served as Director of Mission and Outreach at Bethany Community Church in Seattle. Elli also served as the Children in Crisis Research and Communications Coordinator for World Vision International's Child Development and Rights Technical Team, specializing in community-based care for children deprived of parental care. She has a B.A. from Pepperdine University and an M.A. in Cross Cultural Studies and International Development from Fuller Theological Seminary. —-- The Better Samaritan podcast is produced by the Humanitarian Disaster Institute at Wheaton College, which offers an M.A. in Humanitarian & Disaster Leadership and a Trauma Certificate. To learn more and apply, visit our website. Jamie Aten, Ph.D., and Kent Annan, M.Div., co-direct the Humanitarian Disaster Institute at Wheaton College and are the Co-Founders of Spiritual First Aid. This episode was produced by WildfireCreative  Theme Song: “Turning Over Tables” by The Brilliance Subscribe: Apple Podcasts | Google Podcasts | Spotify | TuneIn | Stitcher | RSS Follow us on Twitter:  @drjamieaten |  @kentannan Follow on Instagram: @wildfirecreativeco @wheaton_hdi (Note to the listener: In this podcast, sometimes we'll host Evangelicals, and sometimes we won't. Learning how to “do good, better” involves listening to many perspectives with different insights and understanding. Sometimes, it will make us uncomfortable; sometimes, we'll agree, and sometimes, we won't. We think that's good. We want to listen for correction–especially in our blind spots.) Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Welcome to the latest N4D podcast, in the days before the global nutrition community converges like a well-coordinated multisectoral nutrition programme, on Paris for the Nutrition for Growth (N4G) Summit 2025.In the last episode, Brieuc Pont, France's Special Envoy on nutrition and secretary-general for N4G shared his hopes and expectations for the Summit and his views on how to make investment in nutrition a political priority. Sticking with the theme, today we are lucky to be joined by Asma Lateef, Chief of Policy and Advocacy at the SDG 2 Advocacy Hub and Dan Irvine, Global Director for Health and Nutrition at World Vision International.Dan and Asma discuss with us the findings and recommendations from their joint research on how to catalyse more and better financing for nutrition in a climate where aid is declining whilst needs are rapidly increasing. They also share their hopes for conversations on resilience at an N4G that is like no other, in the current context of global aid retraction – and looking ahead to the SUN Movement's 4.0 strategy process as a key moment to accelerate progress in ending malnutrition.Please join the debate! Credits: Recorded edited and published by: N4D & Nutriat.coTheme tune: Saraweto, used with kind permission of Just East of Jazz© N4D Group 2025 Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

In this special episode of Walk Talk Listen, recorded live from New York during the 69th session on the Commission on the Status of Women (CSW69), Andrea Kaufmann, Faith and External Engagement Director for World Vision International is our guest. She discusses the growing resistance to gender equality, the importance of global solidarity, and the role of faith-based organizations. Andrea shares insights on how to strategize effectively in the current political climate and stresses the necessity of clear communication and collaboration among diverse stakeholders. The conversation touches on the Beijing Declaration's 30th anniversary, the impact of funding cuts on humanitarian efforts, and the importance of listening to opposing views in the fight for gender equality.   Listener Engagement: Share your thoughts on this episode via walktalklisten. Your feedback is invaluable to us.   Follow Us: Support the Walk Talk Listen podcast and Maurice by liking and following Maurice on Blue Sky, Facebook and Instagram. Visit our website at 100mile.org for more episodes and information about our initiatives. Check out the special WTL series "Enough for All," featuring Church World Service (CWS) and the work of the Joint Learning Initiative (JLI).

The eastern region of the Democratic Republic of Congo (DRC) has been marred by conflict for more than 30 years, since the 1994 Rwandan genocide, when almost a million people died in 100 days. Armed groups have been competing for power over the potential fortune underground. The DRC is a global leader in cobalt production and accounts for over 50 percent of the world's cobalt reserves. Phone and electric car batteries are made with cobalt.Mark Kelly is the Regional Director, Southern Africa for World Vision International. He has overseen operations in nine countries including the Democratic Republic of Congo. Steve Crilley sat down with him and asked him about the crisis that he has seen unfolding around him in the DRC.Sendungshinweis: FM4, OKFM4, 29.02.2025, 17 Uhr

In episode 170, Coffey talks with Dave Lutes about servant leadership and its implementation in organizational cultures.They discuss the definition and misconceptions of servant leadership; the importance of authenticity and empathy in leadership; balancing performance management with a servant leadership approach; the challenges of implementing servant leadership across an organization; the role of values in shaping organizational culture; and strategies for gradual cultural change.Good Morning, HR is brought to you by Imperative—Bulletproof Background Checks. For more information about our commitment to quality and excellent customer service, visit us at https://imperativeinfo.com. If you are an HRCI or SHRM-certified professional, this episode of Good Morning, HR has been pre-approved for half a recertification credit. To obtain the recertification information for this episode, visit https://goodmorninghr.com. About our Guest:David is an American-British dual national and retired ‘ordained' minister/pastor in three countries. He is a former adviser to NATO on military downsizing and re-skilling of 100k officers and family members in the post-Soviet Union era. He has more than 30 years international experience in 30+ countries at a senior strategic executive, middle management, and operational level with several global Fortune 125/250/500 companies. He is a former Global Program Director for MA-level development of leaders from 45 countries with the Christian Charity and Humanitarian Agency, World Vision International. He is now an Organizational Development, Talent Management and Training, Consultant, Master Trainer and Executive Coach and well-known conference speaker and a published author and conference presenter. He shares widely on business ethics and values and impactful HR and truly Investing in People.McCluen-Martin Associates LLC is a global influencer and values-driven culture builder focused on helping organizations invest fully in their people and achieving world-class status. National culturally sensitive and attuned, we strive to help make organizations healthy and ‘whole' by supporting its leaders lead with authenticity, transparency and with ‘servant leader' hearts. We do this through unique strategic HR consulting, executive coaching, and highly experiential training – at all levels – that not only changes the culture for the better, but also results in measurable and sustainable ROI. We help organizations identify, unlock, and develop and use talent to the full. The ultimate goal is to help people find meaning, purpose, and direction for their career and life.Under-New-Management LLC seeks to help Christian leaders and managers in any (private, public, or charitable) organization or sector, at all role levels, shape their leadership development, teamwork, and collaboration on Christian values and biblical principles. To lead, manage, and coach like Jesus. We do this through career and related life counselling, coaching, workshops, seminars, and training. The focus is on people, in all walks of life – and not only in the church or Christian organization context – but on anyone who is seeking to live and ‘work' and lead others by the values, principles and ethics of the Christian life. The ultimate goal is to help people find meaning, purpose, and direction for their career and life – ‘Under His Management'.Dave Lutes can be reached athttps://www.under-new-management.comhttps://www.linkedin.com/in/dluteshttps://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100091852101471https://www.instagram.com/undernewmanagementllcAbout Mike Coffey:Mike Coffey is an entrepreneur, human resources professional, licensed private investigator, and HR consultant.In 1999, he founded Imperative, a background investigations firm helping risk-averse companies make well-informed decisions about the people they involve in their business.Today, Imperative serves hundreds of businesses across the US and, through its PFC Caregiver & Household Screening brand, many more private estates, family offices, and personal service agencies.Mike has been recognized as an Entrepreneur of Excellence and has twice been named HR Professional of the Year. Additionally, Imperative has been named the Texas Association of Business' small business of the year and is accredited by the Professional Background Screening Association. Mike is a member of the Fort Worth chapter of the Entrepreneurs' Organization and volunteers with the SHRM Texas State Council.Mike maintains his certification as a Senior Professional in Human Resources (SPHR) through the HR Certification Institute. He is also a SHRM Senior Certified Professional (SHRM-SCP).Mike lives in Fort Worth with his very patient wife. He practices yoga and maintains a keto diet, about both of which he will gladly tell you way more than you want to know.Learning Objectives:Develop a servant leadership approach that focuses on empathy, authenticity, and employee development without sacrificing performance standards.Implement strategies for gradual cultural change by starting with small-scale initiatives and allowing positive results to create momentum.Align organizational values with leadership practices to create a cohesive and authentic workplace culture.

This week on the Speak Up Stand Out Change Lives podcast, we're thrilled to welcome Kristina Carlson, a visionary leader in the world of philanthropy and corporate responsibility. Kristina is the founder of the groundbreaking KINDd Method and serves as the Managing Director of Global Philanthropy at Carter, where she's redefining the landscape of giving and social impact.With over three decades of experience, Kristina has become a powerhouse in guiding transformational capital campaigns and advising on multi-million dollar gifts and grants. Her expertise has benefited some of the world's largest nonprofit organizations, including Habitat for Humanity International, World Vision International, and Special Olympics. But Kristina's influence doesn't stop there - she's also the go-to advisor for maximizing the philanthropic engagement of an impressive roster of clients, from former US Presidents and Fortune 500 CEOs to faith leaders and celebrities.At the heart of Kristina's approach is her personal practice of "Outrageous Kindness," a philosophy that has led to profound life lessons and, in her words, "hilarious stories in nearly equal measure." Through her work, whether it's delivering keynotes, conducting workshops, or providing individualized coaching, Kristina has helped countless individuals and organizations overcome challenges like trauma and apathy to achieve positive, lasting results.In this episode, we'll dive deep into Kristina's KINDd Method and explore how it's disrupting corporate thinking and challenging cultures of assumptions. We'll discuss her mission to inspire leaders, philanthropists, and professionals to take mission-critical actions while creating accountability systems that drive lasting change. Kristina will share insights on how she guides companies towards a triple bottom line that maximizes ESG (Environmental, Social, and Governance) principles, valuing people, the planet, and profits in equal measure.We'll also touch on a more personal note, as Kristina opens up about her journey through grief after losing her husband, and how this experience has shaped her perspective on finding purpose in life. This conversation promises to be a powerful blend of professional wisdom and personal growth, offering listeners actionable strategies to expand their impact and transform their approach to both business and philanthropy.Join us for an inspiring conversation that will challenge you to think differently about kindness, leadership, and the power of purposeful action. Whether you're a business leader, a philanthropist, or simply someone looking to make a positive change in the world, Kristina Carlson's insights are sure to spark ideas and motivate you to stand up, speak out, and truly change lives.Tune in to listen and don't forget to review the show!________________________About Kristina CarlsonWebsite https://outrageouskindness.com/Website https://carter.global/_______________________Whitney McDuffWhitney's Website The Six-Figure Speaker The Dames Group Whitter Group Standing Ovation Society ––––––––––––––––––––––––––––Track: Welcome — Declan DP [Audio Library Release]Music provided by Audio Library PlusWatch:

 - Hơn 4.000 trẻ em được tiếp cận các dịch vụ hỗ trợ phòng, chống các hình thức lao động trẻ em. Đây là thông tin được đưa ra tại Hội thảo tổng kết Dự án "Phòng chống các hình thức lao động trẻ em trong môi trường nặng nhọc, độc hại, nguy hiểm, bao gồm bóc lột tình dục trẻ em trên mạng, vi phạm các điều kiện lao động tối thiểu" (Dự án ACE) do Tổ chức World Vision International tại Việt Nam phối hợp cùng với đối tác cấp quốc gia và địa phương tổ chức hôm nay (18/9), tại Hà Nội. --- Support this podcast: https://podcasters.spotify.com/pod/show/vov1tintuc/support

ABOUT THIS EPISODE: Welcome to the Drive Thru Mom's Podcast!  The stats are astounding! According to the Faith In Action website, 80% of children in orphanages have at least one living parent. So what does orphan and care for the vulnerable look like?  How does the family unit come into play? What could be improved and how can we do our part? Today on the podcast we have Elli Oswald, a child welfare expert on orphan care sharing how we as moms can practically foster compassion and empathy in our children. Elli Oswald is the Executive Director of the Faith to Action Initiative. Prior to this role, she served as Director of Mission and Outreach at Bethany Community Church in Seattle, where she guided Bethany Community Church in various ministries to the poor and vulnerable in Seattle and around the world. Elli also served as the Children in Crisis Research and Communications Coordinator for World Vision International's Child Development and Rights Technical Team, specializing in community-based care for children deprived of parental care. She has a B.A. from Pepperdine University and a M.A. in Cross Cultural Studies and International Development from Fuller Theological Seminary. Elli has worked with a wide variety non-profit organizations, including, Union Station Homeless Services in Los Angeles. ENJOY friends and HAPPY WEDNESDAY! CONNECT WITH US: Email: lynn@drivethrumoms.com Website: https://www.drivethrumoms.com Book: Faithful Before, Faithful Again: Finding God Faithful in An Anxious World  https://a.co/d/ernpYJS Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/drivethrumoms Linktree: https://linktr.ee/drivethrumoms?utm_source=linktree_profile_share<sid=bf81e359-b976-4b95-bb82-699e19a26f2e Subscribe: Drive Thru Moms Podcast Review: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/drive-thru-moms/id1528282382#see-all/reviews  CONNECT W/ Elli Oswald Faith to Action Initiative | Faith to Action | Home elli@faithtoaction.org

Jeff Olson, Founder of Neora - a global leader in skincare, haircare, and wellness products - and Co-Founder of Live Happy, LLC. He's the bestselling author of The Slight Edge: Turning Simple Disciplines Into Massive Success. Jeff has built several multimillion-dollar sales and marketing organizations, hosted seminars in every major US city, and produced over 900 TV programs centered on personal development. Fueled by his passion for making the world a better place, Jeff devotes his free time to philanthropy - he's helped raise over $5 million for Big Brothers Big Sisters (BBBS) and World Vision International. He has addressed the United Nations on the topic of global happiness and has been inducted into the Happiness Hall of Fame.   Under his leadership, Neora has sold almost 40 million science-based products (over $2 billion in sales) and earned a #1 spot on Inc. 500's America's fastest-growing private companies list.   

Join Eastern Zone Director David Munkley, an expert in leading and managing humanitarian crises at World Vision International, as he shares valuable insights and strategies for navigating and leading during challenging times. Don't miss this opportunity to learn from one of the best in the field! David is currently in the Eastern Democratic Republic of Congo-Rwanda area has had to lead through different crises involving natural disasters and conflicts. David shares what it's like to raise a family as a humanitarian leader, particularly in a conflict zone! Keywords: humanitarian, humanitarian crisis, humanitarian work, world vision international

[00:00:00] Vonna Laue: One of the indicators for nonprofits that anyone who hears me speak knows that I'm always going to harp on a little bit, and that is available cash. Not just cash, because you can look at the balance sheet and see, wow, we've got $700,000 in cash. If that's what the board looks at and starts making decisions based on, you could find yourself in trouble because the available cash that I'm talking about takes that cash number, but then it subtracts two things out of there. [00:00:33] Vonna Laue: It subtracts the things that we're going to pay this week. So maybe we've got payroll coming up this week and we've got a bunch of accounts we're going to pay. I'm going to take that out of there. And I'm also going to take out any temporarily restricted funds that have been given by donors for a specific purpose. If those amounts are held in that cash number, I'm going to back those out. If you back out those two things, that $700,000 might be $200,000. And that board and those leaders are going to make significantly different decisions based on $700,000 versus $200,000.  Right? That's a financial metric. ++++++++++++++++ [00:01:10] Tommy Thomas: You and I have a mutual friend, Alec Hill, former President of InterVarsity. And he wrote of some of the pain and suffering he experienced while being the President of Intervarsity. And he writes, if we pause and reflect long enough, pain is a great teacher. Our character can be transformed more through a day of suffering than a month of study. As I think about your book that's coming out here in a couple of weeks, I would imagine that played into the writing of the book. [00:01:39] Vonna Laue: You are absolutely correct. So, the book is Glad I Didn't Know, and then it's subtitled Lessons Learned Through Life's Challenges and Unexpected Blessings, so it absolutely does play into that. The premise of the book is that there are a lot of difficult things that we go through that if we'd known in advance, we would have done everything we could to avoid those, but if we had avoided those, we'd have missed out on what God had planned for us and the lessons that we learned as a result of it. [00:02:12] Vonna Laue: The flip side of that is also the unexpected blessings. And when I look at things like serving on the World Vision Board, if someone had told me in advance, you're going to be on the World Vision Board. I'd have thought, okay, I need this education and I need this experience and I need to network with this person, and I'd have totally messed it up. But I just faithfully follow one thing to the next. And so would totally agree with Alec there. And I'm glad I don't know a lot of the things that I'm going to go through. And each time we go through something, it makes it a little bit easier the next time to look back on the faithfulness of God and realize, okay, we're going to come out the other side of this and there will be blessings as a result of it, even though it's a challenge at the time. [00:03:01] Tommy Thomas: What lesson did you learn from writing this book? A real practical question. [00:03:07] Vonna Laue: Yeah. One of the things that just in the process that I learned initially, I had chapters for the whole book, and I was just going to write their life stories. And then in some discussions and some just careful consideration, I realized if I did that, it would be really easy for a reader to say, oh, that's nice for that person and dismiss it. And the applicability that it had to their lives. And so, within the book, there are 16 other contributors that all contributed a story of their life that they were glad they didn't know. And so, the encouragement there and just the lesson was if we're willing to be honest with ourselves and honest with those around us, we've all got those stories and in sharing them, there is a blessing to be had both by the giver and the receiver. [00:04:09] Vonna Laue: Tommy, I had a number of people that wrote chapters that when they submitted them said something like, I needed to do that. Or it was a blessing to me to go through this, and there were a few people that I had ideas of the stories that they would contribute because I knew specific things about their life. But all of them, I just asked them to do a story. And many of the ones that I thought the story they would do was not the story. They actually contributed. And so fun to see, just how God's orchestrated that. [00:04:45] Tommy Thomas: What's the most dangerous behavior trait that you've seen that can derail a leader's career? [00:04:54] Vonna Laue: I'm going to look at, especially those who have been leading for a long time. A few years ago, I was pondering a few of the leaders that had not finished well. And, you get, I think you use the word distinguished when you introduced me and I translated that to experienced or old, one of the two, some length of time and so as I think about that, it really hit home. Partially because of the people and the disappointment that I had in the situation, but partially because I realized I'm not in the first half of my career. And so, I want to make sure that I do what I can to finish well. And so back to your question. One of the things that really came out to me was the idea of having people speak truth into your life. The more experience we gain in leadership, the scarcer it becomes to have people who will candidly share the truth with us. With time, leaders tend to surround themselves with fewer people who are ready to speak honestly and openly with them. [00:05:51] Vonna Laue: And the longer we lead, the fewer people I find that leaders have around them that are willing to speak truth into them. We talk about being put on a pedestal. That can happen in a number of different ways. It doesn't mean we're famous. Doesn't mean we have all the glory that some of the people you would think of might have. It can happen to any leader, but we rise up far enough in our career or our organization that we just don't have as many close confidants around us that will challenge us. That will speak truth. And I think that when that happens is when people are more likely to not finish well. [00:06:38] Tommy Thomas: I'm sure. Ross Hoskins at One Hope, he says, surround yourself with people who know you better than yourself and will tell you the truth out of love.  This is how we grow. [00:06:49] Vonna Laue: Amen. He just perfectly summarized what I would agree with. Perfectly. [00:06:57] Tommy Thomas: So, if you were going to write another book and this book was going to be about the burdens of leadership that only the president or the CEO can bear, what would be some of your chapter headings? [00:07:10] Vonna Laue: Have to think about that one a little bit……Chapter headings? [00:07:18] Tommy Thomas: Or topics that you think have to be talked about. [00:07:22] Vonna Laue: Yep. I think the topics definitely are similar to what was just said, choosing people that are extremely accomplished to be around you. We talk about having smarter people than you. I'm a big fan of that. I would also say working in a team. We are not as good by ourselves as we are with a team around us. And so, when you're looking at that key leadership position, you're only as good as the team that is around you. I think also you've got to have that personal and spiritual aspect to it. So encouraging leaders, I often find, and as I speak on personal leadership, when I'm at my busiest, the two things that are easiest for me to give up are my workout and my devotion time. The two things I need most when I'm busiest are my workout and my devotion time [00:08:19] Vonna Laue: The two things I need most when I'm busiest are my workout and my devotion time. And so reminding leaders that you're only as good as you are healthy. That's really important and that's, in a number of different way,s that health spiritually that health physically and the health relationally, you know that you don't sacrifice those relationships that are closest to you because you don't get the time back. We often say I'll do that when this project is over. I'll do that when this season is over. And I think all of the people listening to this podcast probably realize there is no normal, right? We used to say when things get back to normal, I'll do this. And that hectic life that we live as Americans, I think is just normal. And so those are a few of the keys that I think are so crucial for leaders. [00:09:18] Tommy Thomas: I remember when I interviewed Rich Stearns and I'm not going to remember the person's name, but he was talking about his career at Parker Brothers, and he said that there was one of the people in the family that didn't know anything at all about toys, but he knew how to hire a team and that was what made the success of Parker Brothers was this man's ability to bring people onto the team that could lead. [00:09:41] Vonna Laue: I would fully agree with that. I mentioned that I usually am doing a lot of different things. So right now, I'm serving as the COO and CFO of an organization and director of internal audit for another one and doing some audit and advisory with a third and some projects, all of that. But the way that works is the teams that are established in each of those places. Within the team, the mission's organization where I serve, the director of global services role that I have, that's like the COO role, that has operations and finance and personnel and IT and security, that's a lot just in and of itself, but I have four phenomenal directors. That they need encouragement. [00:10:31] Vonna Laue: They need a champion, and they need a sounding board. And as long as I can provide those things, they will do their roles far better than I ever could. In fact, I often say when you hire, you better keep them happy and keep them around because you probably can't do their job. +++++++++++++++ [00:10:50] Tommy Thomas:  If you were creating a dashboard to get at a nonprofit organization's health, what would be some of your dials? [00:10:57] Vonna Laue: Oh, I love dashboards. You just spoke one of my love languages there. So, one of the things that I think is key to a dashboard is that I'm a CPA, so it has to have some financial indicators on it, right? [00:11:11] Tommy Thomas: Absolutely. [00:11:13] Vonna Laue: You have to have those. And the basic ones, you're going to have some things like where you are versus, actual. And you're gonna do some trend analysis in that a little bit, I say, this way in a church. Everybody knows it's December. What season of the year is the lowest attendance and the lowest giving season? Always summer, right? And how do we know that? It's because of trends. And so, trend information can be really helpful.  So, I think that a dashboard should include trends. One of the indicators for nonprofits that anyone who hears me speak knows that I'm always going to harp on a little bit, and that is available cash. [00:12:08] Vonna Laue: So not just cash, because you can look at the balance sheet and see, wow, we've got $700,000 cash. If that's what the board looks at and starts making decisions based on, you could find yourself in trouble because the available cash that I'm talking about takes that cash number, but then it subtracts two things out of there. It subtracts the things that we're going to pay this week. So maybe we've got payroll coming up this week and we've got a bunch of accounts we're going to pay. I'm going to take that out of there. And I'm also going to take out any temporarily restricted funds that have been given by donors for a specific purpose. [00:12:46] Vonna Laue: If those amounts are held in that cash number, I'm going to back those out. If you back out those two things, that $700,000 might be $200,000. And that board and those leaders are going to make significantly different decisions based on $700,000 versus $200,000. Right? That's a financial metric. But as far as dashboards as a whole, my real encouragement there is to look at what your key drivers are. So, look at the financial pieces that you need to monitor, but also look at your non-financial and make sure that they are included in that dashboard as well. Maybe it's your turnover percentage. Maybe it's your involvement in X program. How many meals are we feeding? How many beds have we provided depending on what your program is, but that dashboard report ought to tie to whatever your strategic plan is, so the strategic things that you're looking at. Those are the guideposts of that dashboard that you're going to be monitoring to make sure that your strategic plan is being fulfilled. [00:14:00] Tommy Thomas: On a little bit lighter note, but still probably following the same track. If you were a judge on a non-profit version of the Shark Tank and people were coming to you for early-stage investments, what questions would you need solid answers to before you would open your checkbook? [00:14:18] Vonna Laue: I'm always going to want to know what their budgeting process is. Again, you're asking an accountant. I want to understand that. I want to understand who they've vetted this with. What are the focus groups that you've talked to? Who are the mentors or coaches that have processed this with you? What are your strengths? And where you don't have strengths, who are the people that you have identified and already discussed with that are going to come around you to shore up those weaknesses, if you will. So those are a few of the things that I want to make sure that this is well thought out and it's not just the flavor of the week. [00:15:00] Tommy Thomas: Let's go to board service for a few minutes. So, you're now the chairman of the World Vision Board, or the chairperson, I guess I should say. Give us some highlights of what you've learned about the Chairman's role. I know you watched Joan for several years and watched her successes, and I'm sure lack of on some days. What have you learned there?  [00:15:22] Vonna Laue: I will tell you, Tommy, when they asked me if I would consider taking the chair role, the first thing I said was, did you ask this individual? And I named someone from the Board, and they said, yes. And he serves on a couple of large for-profit boards and doesn't have the time and capacity. And I said, okay, as long as you've shown the discernment that you asked him first, we're good. But then I actually went to that individual and I said, if I do this, will you coach me? Would you be willing to debrief with me after the meetings? [00:16:01] Vonna Laue: And honestly, we just finished up meetings on Tuesday this week. And he and I have a call scheduled for Monday. And he said I'd love to do that. He graciously agreed. And so that, to me, was important. Because I didn't know the role. I had served on the board, but that role is different. And so, the relationship between the Board Chair and the CEO is obviously the most critical. We have a pretty, no, we have a very sophisticated board. I'm odd by who God has assembled in that room. And so, when I first came into it, I would say I was just trying not to embarrass myself, but they are such a gracious group of people. "To run an effective Board Meeting, I review agendas and pre-reads in advance, addressing my questions beforehand so meeting time is focused on others' concerns." [00:16:51] Vonna Laue: And it's important to me that the meetings are well run. And that means I want to see the agendas in advance and speak into those. I want to see the pre reads in advance and have gone through all of those so that if I have questions, I can answer them. I'm not asking those questions during the meeting that's reserved for others, and that those may be questions that others would have. So, let's get those addressed in the pre reads or be prepared. So, I think that the preparation that goes into the time before the meetings is critical. ++++++++++++++= [00:17:26] Tommy Thomas: So, here's a couple of quotes about boards and board chairs. And one is the Chair and the CEO must learn to dance together. And neither can stray very far from each other's gaze or proceed independently. [00:17:42] Vonna Laue: Yeah, I would agree with that. Those are two key roles in the organization. And you have to, I'll use the same analogy I used before. You better be pulling in the same direction. The Board Chair has a responsibility to be the voice on behalf of the Board, and so I feel like that's an important responsibility that it's not Vonna's opinion that I take into there. I seek wise counsel from my board and want to make sure that when I'm having conversations with my CEO, that either the board is informed about those things or that, I'm able to speak on their behalf. But on the day-to-day interactions, if you will, or week to week, those two leaders better be aligned. [00:18:30] Tommy Thomas: Another one, Dr. Rebecca Basinger. Governing boards are charged with safeguarding an institution's ability to fulfill its mission with economic vitality. To this I add, responsibility for tending to the soul of the institution. [00:18:50] Vonna Laue: In an institution like World Vision, the soul of that organization to me is very critical. And it's interesting. I chair the World Vision U. S. Board. I have the privilege of also sitting on the World Vision International Board because we are a federated model and there are World Vision offices around the world  and Christ at the center is one of them. It's our foremost principle by which we operate. And, if that's not lived out in the board, the tone at the top is critical for everything. And so, I would agree that the soul of the organization starts with tone at the top. [00:19:32] Tommy Thomas: So, it's been my experience that the good news about having successful executives on the board is they're used to getting things done. The flip side is that they might have a hard time taking off their CEO hat and putting on their board member hat at a board meeting. Have you experienced that? [00:19:53] Vonna Laue:  To the credit of the current board that I have at World Vision US, I would say I don't struggle with that there. There is a spirit of collaboration by God's grace that exists within there. And so, people are willing to share their experiences and their opinions, but they're not sold on them. They're very open. Have I experienced it in other boards? Absolutely. And one of the challenges that I see in the nonprofit sector, Tommy, is that there are experienced board members that come in with for profit expertise. [00:20:32] Vonna Laue: Which, 90 percent of the time, is fantastic. 10 percent of the time can be challenging because there are unique things. I say if you don't believe there are uniquenesses, go ask the local Ford dealership how many contributions they've received this month. You know what I mean? They don't get any of those, right. There are some unique things. There are some unique laws and regulations that either do apply specifically or specifically don't apply. And so in some board settings, I've seen where for profit leaders have a hard time taking off that hat and being able to understand the nuances that are involved in a nonprofit organization, but really, it comes down to the spirit of humility and service. [00:21:21] Vonna Laue: And one of the things that when you contacted me first, I believe that you couched it this way and said, would you be willing to be considered for board service at World Vision? And I tell people that I responded to you, I'm willing to be considered, let me pray about it. And that I said, that's not trying to buy time or push you off. I legitimately meant that because I think that you have to be passionate about a ministry or a nonprofit board that you're going to serve on. And if you don't have that passion for that particular organization, then you find another one that you can be, because I think that passion is really important in the boardroom. [00:22:07] Tommy Thomas: You and I are old enough to remember the Enron crisis and of course much has been written about it. One writer said that certainly part of the problem was that the board didn't dig deep enough into the financial situation at Enron. How do you ensure that your board members are asking the right questions? Of course, you've been a CPA, that might be an easier thing than another board chair, but I think that is critical. [00:22:35] Vonna Laue: It is, and there are so many things that we have to balance in board member selection. We want to balance Equity and Diversity. We want to balance, within that age. I just encouraged us earlier to consider younger board members and what they can contribute. One of the considerations is what is the expertise that they bring to the board and what skill sets do we need on the board? And the reason for that is to ask those right questions. If I've got an audit committee and I don't have anyone that understands audit and finance, that's problematic. And there may be some that just said, of course I can tell you I have presented to a number of audit and finance committees in my career. [00:23:27] Vonna Laue: That they didn't have an auditor finance expert in that entire committee. In this day and age, we're looking at who has digital experience, who has cybersecurity, or IT experience, and it changes over time. The needs of the board today are different from the needs of the board 10 or 20 years ago. So that's a challenge to us individually as board members to continue growing and learning. But it's also a challenge to us to make sure that we're recruiting the right board members. So, to your point, you've got people in there that can ask the questions of, is this a good investment? Is there a legal liability associated with this? [00:24:10] Vonna Laue: Have we got the right protections in place? What's the end result of this potentially going to be? We don't make a short-sighted decision that we're looking at the long-term impact. What are the reputational impacts of these? We have two roles on the World Vision U. S. board that are assigned at every board meeting. And one of those is the keeper of the core documents. So that person is responsible throughout the discussions to be considering how that discussion or that particular agenda item is tied to our core documents, if there's any implications, and one of them is the responsible skeptic, and that is a formal role that person is assigned in those board meetings, and as we're having discussion, we want somebody to be identified that will challenge and say, wait a minute, back up. [00:25:01] Vonna Laue: Let's not get into group think here. What about, and that they know that they're not just putting their opinion in their hat that they've got this particular role. So, I think those two roles have been really helpful in our setting for our board. [00:25:15] Tommy Thomas: I spoke to Dr. Linda Livingstone at Baylor.  I was asking her about this. I didn't use the word responsible skeptic. I guess I had another phrase, but she said, they usually show up. You don't have to appoint them. [00:25:28] Vonna Laue: I heard that. I heard it when she said that. And I laughed and I thought, that's a healthy board actually, for the most part, because Proverbs talks about iron sharpens iron, and that is really helpful if people are willing to speak up. Oftentimes, we're Christian nice and we don't want to challenge each other and we need to be able to speak up and make sure that all of the facts, all of the considerations are on the table. [00:25:58] Tommy Thomas: I sense that probably the role or the function of risk management has increased for a board over the last decade or two. Am I making a good observation or not? [00:26:13] Vonna Laue: The only thing I would say is that might be the understatement of the year, potentially. Absolutely. The risks that we face and maybe I'm going to oversimplify this, but I think, they used to be known, right? You've got trip hazards. That's a physical risk. You've got the risk of fraud. You put controls in place. Those were known risks. What we face now, to me, are a lot of the unknown risks. What's happening in the cyber world? What's happening with opinions? Reputational risk has increased so significantly, and because it's so easy, and I'll be careful to say this is Vonna's opinion, so please don't ascribe this to any organization that I represent, but, because it's so easy on social media and other media, avenues to state an opinion, and it becomes a perceived fact. [00:27:12] Vonna Laue: Thank you. And for an organization to then have to battle something, that's a reputational risk that we have to consider. And yet we can't control, which is a difficult place to be. [00:27:26] Tommy Thomas: Do y'all have a time in each board meeting where you talk about external threats or is that relegated to your CEO to bring those to the board?  How does that work? [00:27:38] Vonna Laue: Practically? Many of the organizations that I'm associated with have an enterprise risk management or a risk assessment process, and there are people within the organization that are specifically identified that are responsible for that. Not that they're responsible for the risks, but they're responsible to make sure that it's updated. The way that I tend to do it with some organizations is, brainstorm across the organization, pulling together leaders from the board. Leaders from different ministries or departments, people in different functional departments, IT, HR, finance, and just let them brainstorm. What are all the risks? [00:28:23] Vonna Laue: I've done this a few times and it's pretty common that you end up with 600-700 risks that are identified and then categorizing those into whatever categories are helpful for you. But things like regulatory, legal, physical, financial, reputational, operational risks. And then once you do that, you can identify what's the likelihood this would happen. And if it did happen, what would the impact be? So low, moderate and high. And that helps you distinguish, like, how significant are these risks? And when you've got them categorized like that, it stands out, like who the owner of that is, right? Those legal risks are either an in-house or an outsourced general counsel, your physical risks might be the facilities people, whoever, but having an owner for those. High and moderate risks should be mitigated through measures such as insurance, internal controls, or policies. High risks, in particular, should be continuously monitored by leaders and the board, to ensure they are well understood and managed effectively. [00:29:16] Vonna Laue: The high and moderate risks ought to have some mitigating measures in place, whether it's insurance or internal controls or policies. And to me, the high risks should always be in front of the leaders and the board. Usually that's an annual process that they would be taking a look at that to make sure that we understand these risks. We're aware of them because we're responsible for them and we also are aware of the mitigating controls that management has put in place and those seem reasonable. So, I don't necessarily feel like at every meeting, sometimes there are committees. World Vision International, I serve on the audit and risk committee. [00:29:59] Vonna Laue: We have it as a specific component of that committee. So every one of our committee meetings, there is a risk component to that we are looking at. But definitely on an annual basis, that ought to be a discussion that boards are having regardless of the size of the organization. +++++++++++++++++ [00:30:15] Tommy Thomas: This could probably be a whole podcast, but maybe we'll probably limit it. But I would be remiss if I didn't ask an artificial intelligence question. I guess that could fall under risk. It could fall under opportunity. Your thoughts as you sit at 50,000 feet looking down on the nonprofit sector, what's going to happen in the coming years that we need to be aware of? [00:30:41] Vonna Laue: I think it's all of the above. It's opportunity. It's risk. I mentioned earlier that boards are encountering different things now than they did 10 years ago, and they have to be learning individually. And as a board, this is a perfect example of that. We, as board members, have to be learning. We have to adjust to and understand this new technology. Actually, our board had the privilege of sitting in an hour-long session this past week with an AI expert. I think we all walked out of there a little terrified and a little concerned about what this looks like. And that's a great place to be, right? [00:31:25] Vonna Laue: Because it means we know that we've got to lean in. I remember a number of years ago, I think it was about 2006, Walt Wilson, who started Global Media Outreach, he had been one of the initial executives at Apple, and I remember sitting with Walt at that time, and he said, the day will come where you just use apps for everything. And I was like, what's an app? And he's like oh, you'll just push a button. And then it'll bring up all the information for that company. And you'll do everything on this app. And I don't know Walt's age exactly, but I would say he was probably in his early seventies at that time. And I was like, that's crazy. [00:32:10] Vonna Laue: And then I realized, now, he was absolutely correct. And he had the foresight to see that. And I tend to believe that's where we will be with AI. This is here. We better figure out how to harness it. We better figure out how to use it well.  Organizations are just starting to formulate AI policies, what they will allow, what they won't allow. I fully believe that we'll look back on those initial policies five years from now and laugh at ourselves. But we've got to start somewhere and the ability that it will give us and the doors that it opens. I don't think we should be scared of it. But I think that we have a responsibility to do it. Worry less about being supplanted by a chatbot and more about being outpaced by someone adept at using AI to drive corporate success. [00:32:51] Tommy Thomas: I read an article recently and the guy was talking and he said people shouldn't be worried about being replaced by a chat box or something.  They should be more worried about being replaced by somebody who knows how to use artificial intelligence to the advantage of the corporation. [00:33:09] Vonna Laue: Oh, I think that's a great line because the functions that it will be able to take the place of you probably don't need to worry about those, but yeah, the technology that goes along with it, make sure that you're one that knows that. And I'm getting articles from fellow board members on a pretty consistent basis. Some of our staff liaisons in the organizations I serve, there is a lot of information that's out there and I would just encourage any of the board members don't be overwhelmed by it. We all have other responsibilities, right? [00:33:46] Vonna Laue: None of us are going to go get a PhD in AI. But as we start to gain an awareness, I think we'll understand better what our responsibility might be as board members. [00:33:59] Tommy Thomas: Let's try to bring this thing to a close. I've taken probably more of your time than you had allocated for me today and I'm grateful.  If you could get a do over in life, what would that be? [00:34:12] Vonna Laue: I mentioned earlier, there were probably a couple of meetings, partner meetings that I wish had gone differently. Quite honestly, Tommy, that's the only do over I might take, but I am very thankful to have lived my life without regrets. And that, to your point about failures and everything else, there's value to be had in the experiences that we have encountered, and to lose out on those. I'd probably just mess something else up. So, I think maybe I'll keep the ones that I have. [00:34:50] Tommy Thomas: Do you have an “I wish I had started this earlier moment in your life?” [00:34:57] Vonna Laue: Oh, I would say the one that I've done often on, that I wish that I was more consistent about, is just memorizing scripture. So I know a lot of people that are good at that. I have gone back to that, incorporating that on a daily basis. And if that's where the foundation of my decision making is coming from, I wish that I had a little bit more of that ingrained. [00:35:25] Tommy Thomas: Final question. If you could give a younger version of yourself a piece of advice, what would it be? [00:35:32] Vonna Laue: I learned this a little bit later. It wasn't too late in life, but one of the most important leadership principles that I feel like I've learned over the years, I'd love to just close with for your group, for your audience. And I think it applies that I would have wanted to know this. As soon as I could, and that is when we have a person in a position that they're not succeeding in, we often in the Christian ministry world feel like we're Christians, we can't let somebody go and I believe that when God calls us to something, he doesn't call us to be miserable or ill equipped for it. [00:36:18] Vonna Laue: And so, when we keep somebody in a position that they are not competent or capable of, we're doing a disservice to them. To two people in two organizations, at least we're doing a disservice to that person because we're keeping them where they can't thrive. And it's very hard to make a change. When I stepped away from the managing partner role, that was incredibly difficult. Most of us don't like change. And so even if we're not happy, and fulfilled in a position, it's still comfortable. So, we're doing a disservice to them. We're doing a disservice to our organization because we don't have the right person in the job. We're doing a disservice to whoever ought to be in that position because we haven't opened it up for them to be there. [00:37:03] Vonna Laue: And we're doing a disservice to whatever organization this person is supposed to work for because we haven't released them to go do that. And so I guess I'd come full circle with something I said earlier, and that is people are the key to what we do, throughout life, in personal matters and professional matters. And so, stewarding the people in our life well is something that I think we all need to do. And it would have been great if I'd have learned that earlier on as well.   Links and Resources JobfitMatters Website NextGen Nonprofit Leadership with Tommy Thomas The Perfect Search - What every board needs to know about hiring their next CEO Glad I Didn't Know: Lessons Learned Through Life's Challenges and Unexpected Blessings   Connect tthomas@jobfitmatters.com Follow Tommy on LinkedIn Follow Vonna on LinkedIn   Listen to NextGen Nonprofit Leadership with Tommy Thomas on: Apple Podcasts | Spotify

As the daughter of an Evangelical Baptist minister, and youngest and only girl of three children, Heidi Brandow's journey to belong began with navigating childhood in a boy-dominated world of brothers, neighbors, and cousins, and exploring what it meant as a white woman to be an ally in melanated countries around the world.   Heidi Brandow is VP of Talent & Employee Success at Cohesity, and in this compelling episode she shares her transformative journey from childhood to leading complex mergers, emphasizing the profound difference between inclusion and true belonging. Discover how her unique upbringing and fearless leadership style have shaped her approach to transforming cultures in both the corporate and humanitarian sectors. By the end, you'll gain insights into practical strategies for leading diverse teams and creating environments where every individual can thrive. This conversation is a must-listen for anyone passionate about redefining workplace culture and driving meaningful change.   Guest Bio: Heidi Brandow is the VP of Talent & Employee Success at Cohesity, a rapidly growing cybersecurity and data management company. With over 25 years of experience in talent management, leadership development, and coaching, she's held executive roles at Tesla, Palo Alto Networks, and World Vision International. As a learning and leadership expert, she has long been fascinated by what drives ordinary people to deliver truly extraordinary results. She's spent her career working across multiple industries and on the ground in more than 30 countries learning what truly works (and what doesn't) to unleash learning and connect people to what matters most at work and in life.

As the daughter of an Evangelical Baptist minister, and youngest and only girl of three children, Heidi Brandow's journey to belong began with navigating childhood in a boy-dominated world of brothers, neighbors, and cousins, and exploring what it meant as a white woman to be an ally in melanated countries around the world.   Heidi Brandow is VP of Talent & Employee Success at Cohesity, and in this compelling episode she shares her transformative journey from childhood to leading complex mergers, emphasizing the profound difference between inclusion and true belonging. Discover how her unique upbringing and fearless leadership style have shaped her approach to transforming cultures in both the corporate and humanitarian sectors. By the end, you'll gain insights into practical strategies for leading diverse teams and creating environments where every individual can thrive. This conversation is a must-listen for anyone passionate about redefining workplace culture and driving meaningful change.   Guest Bio: Heidi Brandow is the VP of Talent & Employee Success at Cohesity, a rapidly growing cybersecurity and data management company. With over 25 years of experience in talent management, leadership development, and coaching, she's held executive roles at Tesla, Palo Alto Networks, and World Vision International. As a learning and leadership expert, she has long been fascinated by what drives ordinary people to deliver truly extraordinary results. She's spent her career working across multiple industries and on the ground in more than 30 countries learning what truly works (and what doesn't) to unleash learning and connect people to what matters most at work and in life.   Heidi Brandow's LinkedIn profile

Rachelle Olden is a seasoned professional with a diverse background in marketing, tech, international development, and social advocacy. As a Senior Product Marketing Manager at Google, she leads the Tech Equity Collective, an initiative to advance Black innovation in tech.  Rachelle's journey began in the U.S. Peace Corps in the Dominican Republic, followed by roles at the U.N. World Food Programme in Liberia and World Vision International in Latin America. She later joined the Clinton Foundation, the Sheryl Sandberg & Dave Goldberg Family Foundation, and the Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation, tackling social issues and advancing equity. With an MBA from Duke University, Rachelle transitioned to Microsoft, managing global industry partnerships. In 2023, she was honored as Puget Sound's 40 under 40 and included in ESSENCE magazine's inaugural Power 40 list.  Get full access to Tech Talks with Madona at www.techtalkswithmadona.com/subscribe

Listen to Rev. Dr. Rupen Das, President of the Canadian Bible Society being interviewed by veteran journalist Lorna Dueck. In this episode, Rupen reflects on his incredible history from working in global disaster management to his recent work at CBS. His global perspective has brought a unique view into the need for Scripture in the western world and Canadian culture, and how the importance of Scripture reveals the living God in Jesus Christ. This viewpoint has helped to focus the work of CBS on helping people hear God speak through His Word in Canada and around the world.---Learn more about the Canadian Bible Society: biblesociety.caHelp people hear God speak: biblesociety.ca/donateConnect with us on Instagram: @canadianbiblesocietyWhether you're well-versed in Scripture or just starting out on your journey, The Bible Course offers a superb overview of the world's best-selling book.  This eight-session course will help you grow in your understanding of the Bible. Watch the first session of The Bible Course and learn more at biblecourse.ca. ---Rev. Dr. Rupen Das is the President of the Canadian Bible Society and has come to CBS with considerable senior management experience both in Canada and internationally. Most recently, Rupen was seconded by the Canadian Baptist Ministries to Lebanon and Europe where he was involved in theological education and managing humanitarian responses to refugees. Prior to that Rupen was professor and program coordinator for Humber College's International Project Management post graduate program. He has held senior management positions with World Vision Canada and World Vision International. His consulting assignments have been with various non-governmental organizations, international agencies, the Canadian Government, and the Canadian military.Rev. Dr. Rupen Das is a missiologist who has researched and written on various aspect of contemporary Christian missions, especially issues that concern the Global South. He is the author of several books. He has been a Visiting Scholar at Harvard University, a 21st Century Fellow in the UK, and adjunct faculty at Eastern University in the US. Rupen earned his Doctor of Ministry degree from Acadia University in Nova Scotia and is Research Professor at Tyndale University in Toronto. He also serves on the Board of Trustees of the United Bible Societies.Rupen and his wife, Mamta, have two adult children, who are married with families.Learn more about Rupen Das: dascompassion.wordpress.com/rupen-das

Economic instability, wars, climate change, and a changing labor landscape have left businesses, organizations, and individuals feeling helpless and defeated. In actuality, too many people and organizations are lacking clarity and purpose. Maybe “outrageous kindness” is the change catalyst we need.My guest is Kristina Joy Carlson, CFRE, renowned philanthropy expert, entrepreneur, and speaker. A sought-after speaker and co-author of the best-selling Essential Principles for Fundraising Success, Kristina doesn't just help institutions raise money; she facilitates the transformation of people's lives, organizations, and the world through outrageous kindness.We discuss Kristina's signature KIND Method—a roadmap to a better life and a triple bottom line for businesses and nonprofits.About Kristina Joy CarlsonA sought-after speaker and co-author of the best-selling Essential Principles for Fundraising Success, Kristina Joy Carlson doesn't just help organizations raise money; she facilitates the transformation of people's lives, organizations, and the world through a practice of outrageous kindness. Three decades in fundraising and entrepreneurship and an almost decade-long gauntlet of personal loss have taught Kristina she always has control over her purpose, perspective, and actions. Leveraging that wisdom, she helps nonprofit institutions across the globe secure the philanthropic resources they need to maximize their impact, including Habitat for Humanity International, World Vision International, and Susan Komen. Founder of the KIND Method and Managing Director of Global Philanthropy at Carter, Kristina guides transformational capital campaigns, advises on 8-figure gifts and grants, creates bespoke training programs, and develops innovative technologies for some of the world's largest nonprofit organizations. She also helps maximize the philanthropic engagement of former US Presidents and other heads of state, Fortune 500 CEOs, Forbes 400 individuals, faith leaders, celebrities, and everyday people. Through her roles at Carter Global, Ketchum, and FundraisingINFO.com, Kristina has supported thousands of organizations worldwide, providing counsel on major campaigns in healthcare, education, the arts, youth organizations, national and international organizations, and smaller grassroots organizations. Her mission is to inspire leaders, philanthropists, and professionals to practice outrageous kindness as they define and take mission-critical actions, create accountability systems, and experience the magic of philanthropy. With a master's degree in Community Economic Development from New Hampshire College, Kristina lives in Oxford, Mississippi, where she starts each morning with Tazo Awake black tea and a quick round of Plants vs. Zombies.Connect with Kristina on LinkedInVisit the OutrageousKindness WebsiteCarter Global | Kristina Joy CarlsonTake my free masterclass: 3 Must-Have Elements of Social Media Content that Converts

Welcome to RIMScast. Your host is Justin Smulison, Business Content Manager at RIMS, the Risk and Insurance Management Society.   Justin Smulison interviews live at RISKWORLD 2024 Tina Cameron, author of the RIMS Executive Report, Leveraging Insurance & Risk Management to Address Political Risk, about her risk management career and the winners of the 2024 Spencer RIMS Risk Management Challenge, the IIRM Hyderabad Vigilant Challengers and their risk management professor, about what it took to win the challenge. They share their vigilant path to victory by learning real-life risk management skills. Listen in for risk management nuggets of wisdom. Key Takeaways: [:01] About RIMS and RIMScast. [:15] These interviews were recorded live at RISKWORLD 2024 in San Diego with the author of a RIMS report on political risk and the winners of the 2024 RIMS/Spencer Risk Management Challenge. [:44] First, let's talk about RIMS Virtual Workshops. The full calendar of virtual workshops is at RIMS.org/VirtualWorkshops. On June 11th and 12th, we've got Applying and Integrating ERM. Also on June 11th and 12th, we have Fundamentals of Insurance. On June 18th and 19th, we have Fundamentals of Risk Management. [1:05] On July 9th and 10th, we have Managing Workers' Compensation. On July 23rd and 24th, we have Claims Management. Other dates for Fall and Winter are on the Virtual Workshops full calendar at RIMS.org/VirtualWorkshops. [1:22] Let me tell you about the new dedicated RIMScast episode that just went live, sponsored by Otoos, “Accident Prevention — The Winning Formula For Construction and Insurance”. I interviewed Dana Kfir, the Director of Customer Success at Otoos about how technology can improve safety on construction sites and how companies can use incentives to drive change. [1:52] The link to this dedicated episode is in this episode's show notes. It is complimentary for RIMS members and nonmembers. Go check it out! [2:04] RISKWORLD 2024 was a smashing success, hosting approximately 10,000 attendees. On-site in San Diego, I recorded two more interviews I wanted to share with the global RIMScast audience. I found them so insightful and they captured some of the energy we were experiencing on the exhibit-room floor. [2:31] The first interview was with a fascinating risk professional, Tina C. Cameron. She is the Senior Manager of Global Insurance for World Vision International. Tina also authored a recent RIMS Executive Report titled Leveraging Insurance & Risk Management to Address Political Risk. A link is in the show notes. [2:57] Since Tina travels worldwide, she's an authority on the subject. On Wednesday, May 8th, Tina and I found a Tiki Bar near RIMS HQ and we set up the mic to talk about the Executive Report, her work, and the many risks and challenges a risk professional or business leader must consider before setting up operations abroad. [3:22] I am pleased to share this interview with the global risk management community. Tina Cameron, welcome to RIMScast! [4:00] Tina Cameron is with World Vision International. She started her career with a degree in business finance. She also studied global economics. She got a position as a corporate cash manager. That led to a job of half cash manager, half risk manager. After that, she only took risk manager jobs. She lists the industries she worked in that gave her a broad base of experience. [4:54] Tina got her ERM and qualified for the RIMS Fellow. She also worked in mergers and acquisitions, due diligence, and audit. Tina was very interested in international matters. Her father was a world traveler and adventurer. He slept on the ground in some places. Tina has always been interested in other cultures. She wanted to be in a larger international organization. [6:03] Tina joined World Vision International, an organization in about 100 underdeveloped countries. These countries don't have all the privileges of developed countries. World Vision works to establish relationships with the government and bring humanitarian aid. They deliver humanitarian aid to poor children in the poorest countries in Africa, South America, and Asia. [6:52] World Vision International also does microloans. Tina says one of the most important things is helping girls get into school in countries where girls are not valued as highly as boys and have no access to schools. World Vision helps families get their girls into school. They pay for education and transportation so girls in those countries have an equal opportunity.  [7:43] Tina talks about Leveraging Insurance & Risk Management to Address Political Risk. The main point of the report is to prepare. You cannot go into a country with blindfolds on. You have to prepare your people and understand the country. You have to understand the government and the infrastructure. You need to develop relationships with a good network of support people. [8:46] You have to work with security firms. World Vision International has in-house security because they are in the most dangerous places in the world. Their security team prepares World Vision people to go into a country with strenuous training. A person is not eligible to go into the country without passing security training. [9:04] World Vision employs local nationals and also people from around the world to help. There are a variety of people flying in for operations. Employing local nationals creates goodwill. There are also lots of volunteering opportunities all over the world. The jobs World Vision creates are opportunities for locals to help their communities. [9:48] World Vision International is a Christian organization but they do not proselytize or force Western values on people. They go in with respect for the culture and religion. They go in only to help the locals get to the best circumstances they can with food security, clean water, sanitation, and hygiene. World Vision gives them the skills to be self-sufficient and then leaves them. [11:03] Tina says a lot of firms don't pre-plan for political risk. Then, once in the country, they ask carriers for political risk insurance. In a lot of cases, coverage will be denied to firms that are not known to the carriers. Tina wrote in the executive report the things you can do to get underwriters comfortable with your risk profile. [11:37] Carriers need to get to know you and your operations, and that you understand security. They need to know your travel. Do this ahead of time and also get your various other forms of insurance without country exclusions. The carriers know World Vision International, so they don't get normal exclusions. [12:18] We've been there since the fifties. You can't just jump in and expect to get insurance. It will either be denied or it will be extremely expensive. If you're planning on going into a new country, get with a specialist broker who understands political risk and can guide you through the process. That's when you first begin to understand your risk. Start a year in advance. [13:32] Tina's paper was written for risk managers who roll up their sleeves and put their hands in the dirt. It's necessary to do due diligence on the country. Ask yourself about the power grid, internet service, and what cell phones will work there. Can you dial out of the country? Who controls the water and power? What are the roads like, if any? What about waterways? [14:48] Are there fire stations? Are they all-volunteer? Are your people trained to put out fires? Hire outside security for your commodity warehouses. What's the flooding like? You'll want to be on high ground. We can take a lot from what we've learned here in the U.S. from natural disasters and other places where you've had losses. [16:27] Tina suggests learning the best way to secure roofing so you don't have a roof claim with every hurricane season. [16:45] You have to have a contingent supply chain plan. You may need to airdrop. Look for other suppliers. What are the cyber laws in that country? How do you handle local cash? The top person on the ground needs to have a credit card with a high limit. Emergencies can happen, including needing emergency evacuation. Extracting people requires payment in advance. [18:03] Tina discusses her participation in RISKWORLD, RIMS education, and the International Council. She and Justin give a shoutout to Gayle Jacobs, an SVP at Marsh, who advises World Vision International on political risk. Gayle Jacobs had a session at RISKWORLD 2024. [19:27] Tina, thank you so much for joining us! [19:42] RIMS plug time! Webinars! Our friends from TÜV SÜD GRC will return on May 23rd with Respond to Emerging Risks with this Winning Property Loss Control Formula. On June 6th, Evident ID makes its RIMS Webinars debut with Uncovering Hidden Risks in Your Third-Party Risk Management Program. [20:15] On June 13th, our friends at Riskonnect return to present Unlocking the Value of Business Continuity and Insurable Risk Management. Register at RIMS.org/Webinars. Webinars are complimentary for RIMS members! [20:35] The RIMS ERM Conference 2024 will be held on November 18th and 19th in Boston, Massachusetts. The agenda will be announced soon, as will a call for submissions for the ERM Award of Distinction. I'll have that link soon on an upcoming episode. [20:54] So review your organization's ERM program, and if you feel it was successful and you have the numbers and the data to back it up, compile that information and get ready to submit your ERM program for the ERM Award of Distinction. [21:09] The Spencer Educational Foundation has the goal of helping build a talent pipeline of risk management and insurance professionals. They achieve that goal in part through a collaboration with risk management and insurance educators across the United States and Canada. This also applies to not-for-profit entities. [21:29] If this description applies to you, then you should apply for a Spencer General Grant. The application deadline is July 30th, 2024. General Grant awardees are typically notified at the end of October. [21:49] The Spencer 2024 Funding Their Future Gala will be held on Thursday, September 12th, 2024 at The Cipriani 42nd Street in New York City. Links are in this episode's show notes. [22:01] My next guests flew from India to compete in person at RISKWORLD 2024 for the 2024 Spencer RIMS Risk Management Challenge. They won! The winners were The Institute of Insurance and Risk Management Hyderabad. Their team name was the Vigilant Challengers. [22:17] They won the challenge that began seven months ago with 38 universities dedicating their time and effort to address a risk management case study based on the city of Tukwila, Washington. During RISKWORLD, the field was narrowed to three university teams and those finalists presented one last time in front of the conference attendees and a panel of judges. [22:39] The Vigilant Challengers won and they also won a $10,000 prize, courtesy of RIMS and Spencer. They were led by our good friend Professor Roop Kumar Nagumantri, the university representative. I wasn't going to let them leave for a flight back to India without getting them on the show, live in person! [23:01] Vigilant Challengers of IIRM Hyderabad, welcome to RIMScast! [23:23] Justin met Professor Nagumantri in 2017 or 2018 at RIMS India. Professor Nagumantri has bolstered risk management in India. He is proud of his fantastic team, Vigilant Challengers. They have a lot of energy! It's an extraordinary experience for them. [23:57] Shivya Tuli, Elvis John, and Yagnasritha Mallavajhala introduce themselves and the area of risk management they study at IIRM Hyderabad. Risk management is not yet a popular course in India. Coming to IIRM has been advantageous to each of the Vigilant Challengers participants. Professor Nagumantri tells how he selected the team. There was a test. [26:02] How the IIRM Hyderabad team approached the Tukwila, Washington risk case study. They started by reading the city budgets and risk materials to formulate a buying approach. It took almost three months to read the materials. It took them about six months to prepare their presentation. [27:15] The Vigilant Challengers detail how they made their presentation. It was their first time on an international stage. The judges made them comfortable. At the finals, they were a bit nervous, seeing that the hall was full. Again the judges and audience made them comfortable. It was a wonderful experience. [28:10] The team used slides and technology to help their presentation. They presented like they were selling. They wanted the City of Tukwila to be better, to mitigate risks, and to get over all the risks. Their presentation was a balance of technology and individual explanations. The audience feedback was amazing and gave them a lot of confidence. [29:32] The Vigilant Challengers recommend future challenge participants to back up innovative solutions with real-world examples. The more research you do, the better your report will be. The hard work and late nights helped. The team considered the human element of working with a city. They provided a practical solution that will help the city. [30:40] Thoroughly research the subject and the audience you are addressing to relate and connect with the particular case study. Research and hard work are very important. [31:11] The team members stayed up late and worked on Zoom calls after staying at the college until 8:00 or 9:00 at night. [31:32] Professor Nagumantri says Spencer's Risk Challenge is quite extraordinary. The students began to understand how risk management is to be done. They will be good risk managers because they have seen the application of what they have read in class. They learned to do research and apply the findings to a problem. They will make good CROs. [32:29] Special thanks once again to Tina Cameron and the winning team of the RIMS Spencer 2024 Risk Management Challenge, IIRM Hyderabad Vigilant Challengers. [32:49] A link to Tina Cameron's RIMS paper, Leveraging Insurance & Risk Management to Address Political Risk is in this episode's show notes as is more information about the IIRM Hyderabad Vigilant Challengers and their victory. [33:04] Also check out last week's RIMScast episode for more coverage of RISKWORLD 2024 with some fantastic interviews, live and in person! [33:13] It's plug time! The RIMS App is available to RIMS members exclusively. Go to the Apps Store and download the RIMS App with all sorts of RIMS resources and coverage. It's different from the RIMS Events App. Everyone loves the RIMS App! [33:45] You can sponsor a RIMScast episode for this, our weekly show, or a dedicated episode. Links to sponsored episodes are in our show notes. RIMScast has a global audience of risk and insurance professionals, legal professionals, students, business leaders, C-Suite executives, and more. Let's collaborate! Contact pd@rims.org for more information. [34:29] Become a RIMS member and get access to the tools, thought leadership, and network you need to succeed. Visit RIMS.org/membership or email membershipdept@RIMS.org for more information. [34:46] Risk Knowledge is the RIMS searchable content library that provides relevant information for today's risk professionals. Materials include RIMS executive reports, survey findings, contributed articles, industry research, benchmarking data, and more. [35:02] For the best reporting on the profession of risk management, read Risk Management Magazine at RMMagazine.com. It is written and published by the best minds in risk management. Justin Smulison is the Business Content Manager at RIMS. You can email Justin at Content@RIMS.org. [35:23] Thank you for your continued support and engagement on social media channels! We appreciate all your kind words. Listen every week! Stay safe!   Mentioned in this Episode: RISKWORLD 2025 will be in Chicago! May 4‒7 NEW FOR MEMBERS! RIMS Mobile App RIMS DEI Council Spencer Educational Foundation — Grants Page — Apply Through July 30. Spencer Educational Foundation 2024 Funding Their Future Gala RIMS-Certified Risk Management Professional (RIMS-CRMP) RIMS-CRMP Virtual Workshops RIMS ERM Conference 2024 — Nov 18‒19 — Boston, MA — Call For Session Submissions by May 13. RIMS Risk Management Awards Edition 2024 Spencer-RIMS Risk Management Challenge 2025 — IIRM Hyderabad Wins! RIMS Executive Report: Leveraging Insurance & Risk Management to Address Political Risk RISKWORLD 2024 Show Daily — May 6, May 7, May 8   RIMS Webinars: Respond to Emerging Risks with this Winning Property Loss Control Formula | Sponsored by TÜV SÜD GRC | May 23, 2024 Uncovering Hidden Risks in Your Third-Party Risk Management Program | Sponsored by EVIDENT ID | June 6, 2024 Unlocking the Value of Business Continuity and Insurable Risk Management | Sponsored by Riskonnect | June 13, 2024 RIMS.org/Webinars   Upcoming Virtual Workshops: See the full calendar of RIMS Virtual Workshops RIMS-CRMP Prep Workshops   Related RIMScast Episodes: “Live! From RISKWORLD 2024” “RISKWORLD 2024 Keynote Peter Diamandis” “Climate Disclosures with RISKWORLD 2024 Session Leader Jana Utter” “RIMS 2024 Goodell Award Winner Eamonn Cunningham” “RIMS 2024 Rising Star Chelsea Andrusiak”   Sponsored RIMScast Episodes: “Accident Prevention — The Winning Formula For Construction and Insurance” | Sponsored by Otoos (New!) “Platinum Protection: Underwriting and Risk Engineering's Role in Protecting Commercial Properties” | Sponsored by AXA XL “Elevating RMIS — The Archer Way” | Sponsored by Archer “Alliant's P&C Outlook For 2024” | Sponsored by Alliant “Why Subrogation is the New Arbitration” | Sponsored by Fleet Response “Cyclone Season: Proactive Preparation for Loss Minimization” | Sponsored by Prudent Insurance Brokers Ltd. “Subrogation and the Competitive Advantage” | Sponsored by Fleet Response “Cyberrisk Outlook 2023” | Sponsored by Alliant “Chemical Industry: How To Succeed Amid Emerging Risks and a Challenging Market” | Sponsored by TÜV SÜD “Insuring the Future of the Environment” | Sponsored by AXA XL “Insights into the Gig Economy and its Contractors” | Sponsored by Zurich “The Importance of Disaster Planning Relationships” | Sponsored by ServiceMaster   RIMS Publications, Content, and Links: RIMS Membership — Whether you are a new member or need to transition, be a part of the global risk management community! RIMS Virtual Workshops On-Demand Webinars RIMS-Certified Risk Management Professional (RIMS-CRMP) RIMS-CRMP Stories — New interview featuring Manny Padilla! Spencer Educational Foundation “Leveraging Insurance and Risk Management to Address Political Risk” — RIMS Executive Report   RIMS Events, Education, and Services: RIMS Risk Maturity Model® RIMS Events App Apple | Google Play   Sponsor RIMScast: Contact sales@rims.org or pd@rims.org for more information.   Want to Learn More? Keep up with the podcast on RIMS.org and listen on Spotify and Apple Podcasts.   Have a question or suggestion? Email: Content@rims.org.   Join the Conversation! Follow @RIMSorg on Facebook, Twitter, and LinkedIn.   About our guests: Tina C. Cameron on LinkedIn Senior Manager, Global Insurance at World Vision International   The winning IIRM Hyderabad team, The Vigilant Challengers! Shivya Tuli, Yagnasritha Mallavajhala, Elvis John, and Institute of Insurance and Risk Management (IIRM) Hyderabad Representative: Kameswara Venkata Roop Kumar Nagumantri Tweetables (Edited For Social Media Use): You cannot go into a country with blindfolds on. You have to prepare your people and understand the country. You have to understand the government and the infrastructure. You need to develop relationships with a good network of support people. — Tina C. Cameron   We've been there since, I think the fifties. So, you can't just jump in and expect to get insurance. It's either going to be denied or it's going to be extremely expensive. — Tina C. Cameron   The 2024 Spencer RIMS Risk Management Challenge was an opportunity where we could explore the city virtually and get to know more about it. — Shivya Tuli   Spencer's Risk Challenge is quite extraordinary. The students began to understand how risk management is to be done. They will be good risk managers because they have seen the application of what they have read in class. — Professor Roop Kumar Nagumantri  

Stephen Ng, whom you may have seen in NBC, Forbes, Wall Street Journal, U.S. News and World Report, New York Daily News, and others. He has also been interviewed by Fox TV and Christian Television Network. Stephen is the Author of “10 Financial Mistakes You Should Avoid” which has been a wonderful resource for many of his clients. All of the proceeds from the book sales go to benefit World Vision International. Stephen is also the Founder and President of Stephen Ng Financial Group.Stephen is married, has 3 children and resides in New Jersey and Florida. Stephen is a warm and passionate communicator who loves to share his financial wisdom and insights. He served as a Deacon at Trust In God Baptist Church in New York City and was the Chairman of the Board from 2008 to 2016. Currently, he serves as a trustee for Doxa Church in New York City. Stephen attends Bell Shoals Church, in Brandon, Florida. He loves to travel and frequently speaks internationally during mission trips with his church.Learn More: https://www.stephenngfg.com/The views expressed are not necessarily the opinion of Stephen NG, and should not be construed directly or indirectly, as an offer to buy or sell any securities or services mentioned herein. Investing is subject to risks including loss of principal invested. Past performance is not a guarantee of future results. No strategy can assure a profit nor protect against loss. Please note that individual situations can vary. Therefore, the information should only be relied upon when coordinated with individual professional advice.Securities and investment advisory services offered through Osaic Wealth, Inc. member FINRA/SIPC. Osaic Wealth is separately owned and other entities and/or marketing names, products or services referenced here are independent of Osaic Wealth.Influential Entrepreneurs with Mike Saundershttps://businessinnovatorsradio.com/influential-entrepreneurs-with-mike-saunders/Source: https://businessinnovatorsradio.com/interview-with-stephen-ng-clu-chfc-cep-founder-of-stephen-ng-financial-group-discussing-ira-rescue-to-leverage-retirement-wealth

Stephen Ng, whom you may have seen in NBC, Forbes, Wall Street Journal, U.S. News and World Report, New York Daily News, and others. He has also been interviewed by Fox TV and Christian Television Network. Stephen is the Author of “10 Financial Mistakes You Should Avoid” which has been a wonderful resource for many of his clients. All of the proceeds from the book sales go to benefit World Vision International. Stephen is also the Founder and President of Stephen Ng Financial Group.Stephen is married, has 3 children and resides in New Jersey and Florida. Stephen is a warm and passionate communicator who loves to share his financial wisdom and insights. He served as a Deacon at Trust In God Baptist Church in New York City and was the Chairman of the Board from 2008 to 2016. Currently, he serves as a trustee for Doxa Church in New York City. Stephen attends Bell Shoals Church, in Brandon, Florida. He loves to travel and frequently speaks internationally during mission trips with his church.Learn More: https://www.stephenngfg.com/The views expressed are not necessarily the opinion of Stephen NG, and should not be construed directly or indirectly, as an offer to buy or sell any securities or services mentioned herein. Investing is subject to risks including loss of principal invested. Past performance is not a guarantee of future results. No strategy can assure a profit nor protect against loss. Please note that individual situations can vary. Therefore, the information should only be relied upon when coordinated with individual professional advice.Securities and investment advisory services offered through Osaic Wealth, Inc. member FINRA/SIPC. Osaic Wealth is separately owned and other entities and/or marketing names, products or services referenced here are independent of Osaic Wealth.Influential Entrepreneurs with Mike Saundershttps://businessinnovatorsradio.com/influential-entrepreneurs-with-mike-saunders/Source: https://businessinnovatorsradio.com/interview-with-stephen-ng-clu-chfc-cep-founder-of-stephen-ng-financial-group-discussing-ira-rescue-to-leverage-retirement-wealth

Stephen Ng, whom you may have seen in NBC, Forbes, Wall Street Journal, U.S. News and World Report, New York Daily News, and others. He has also been interviewed by Fox TV and Christian Television Network. Stephen is the Author of “10 Financial Mistakes You Should Avoid” which has been a wonderful resource for many of his clients. All of the proceeds from the book sales go to benefit World Vision International. Stephen is also the Founder and President of Stephen Ng Financial Group.Stephen is married, has 3 children and resides in New Jersey and Florida. Stephen is a warm and passionate communicator who loves to share his financial wisdom and insights. He served as a Deacon at Trust In God Baptist Church in New York City and was the Chairman of the Board from 2008 to 2016. Currently, he serves as a trustee for Doxa Church in New York City. Stephen attends Bell Shoals Church, in Brandon, Florida. He loves to travel and frequently speaks internationally during mission trips with his churchLearn More: https://www.stephenngfg.com/The views expressed are not necessarily the opinion of Stephen NG, and should not be construed directly or indirectly, as an offer to buy or sell any securities or services mentioned herein. Investing is subject to risks including loss of principal invested. Past performance is not a guarantee of future results. No strategy can assure a profit nor protect against loss. Please note that individual situations can vary. Therefore, the information should only be relied upon when coordinated with individual professional advice.Securities and investment advisory services offered through Osaic Wealth, Inc. member FINRA/SIPC. Osaic Wealth is separately owned and other entities and/or marketing names, products or services referenced here are independent of Osaic Wealth.Influential Entrepreneurs with Mike Saundershttps://businessinnovatorsradio.com/influential-entrepreneurs-with-mike-saunders/Source: https://businessinnovatorsradio.com/interview-with-stephen-ng-clu-chfc-cep-founder-of-stephen-ng-financial-group-understanding-long-term-care-to-leverage-retirement-wealth

Stephen Ng, whom you may have seen in NBC, Forbes, Wall Street Journal, U.S. News and World Report, New York Daily News, and others. He has also been interviewed by Fox TV and Christian Television Network. Stephen is the Author of “10 Financial Mistakes You Should Avoid” which has been a wonderful resource for many of his clients. All of the proceeds from the book sales go to benefit World Vision International. Stephen is also the Founder and President of Stephen Ng Financial Group.Stephen is married, has 3 children and resides in New Jersey and Florida. Stephen is a warm and passionate communicator who loves to share his financial wisdom and insights. He served as a Deacon at Trust In God Baptist Church in New York City and was the Chairman of the Board from 2008 to 2016. Currently, he serves as a trustee for Doxa Church in New York City. Stephen attends Bell Shoals Church, in Brandon, Florida. He loves to travel and frequently speaks internationally during mission trips with his churchLearn More: https://www.stephenngfg.com/The views expressed are not necessarily the opinion of Stephen NG, and should not be construed directly or indirectly, as an offer to buy or sell any securities or services mentioned herein. Investing is subject to risks including loss of principal invested. Past performance is not a guarantee of future results. No strategy can assure a profit nor protect against loss. Please note that individual situations can vary. Therefore, the information should only be relied upon when coordinated with individual professional advice.Securities and investment advisory services offered through Osaic Wealth, Inc. member FINRA/SIPC. Osaic Wealth is separately owned and other entities and/or marketing names, products or services referenced here are independent of Osaic Wealth.Influential Entrepreneurs with Mike Saundershttps://businessinnovatorsradio.com/influential-entrepreneurs-with-mike-saunders/Source: https://businessinnovatorsradio.com/interview-with-stephen-ng-clu-chfc-cep-founder-of-stephen-ng-financial-group-understanding-long-term-care-to-leverage-retirement-wealth

Stephen Ng, whom you may have seen in NBC, Forbes, Wall Street Journal, U.S. News and World Report, New York Daily News, and others. He has also been interviewed by Fox TV and Christian Television Network. Stephen is the Author of “10 Financial Mistakes You Should Avoid” which has been a wonderful resource for many of his clients. All of the proceeds from the book sales go to benefit World Vision International. Stephen is also the Founder and President of Stephen Ng Financial Group.Stephen is married, has 3 children, and resides in New Jersey and Florida. Stephen is a warm and passionate communicator who loves to share his financial wisdom and insights. He served as a Deacon at Trust In God BaptistChurch in New York City and was the Chairman of the Board from 2008 to 2016. Currently, he serves as a trustee for Doxa Church in New York City. Stephen attends Bell Shoals Church, in Brandon, Florida. He loves to travel and frequently speaks internationally during mission trips with his churchLearn More: https://www.stephenngfg.com/The views expressed are not necessarily the opinion of Stephen NG, and should not be construed directly or indirectly, as an offer to buy or sell any securities or services mentioned herein. Investing is subject to risks including loss of principal invested. Past performance is not a guarantee of future results. No strategy can assure a profit nor protect against loss. Please note that individual situations can vary. Therefore, the information should only be relied upon when coordinated with individual professional advice.Securities and investment advisory services offered through Osaic Wealth, Inc. member FINRA/SIPC. Osaic Wealth is separately owned and other entities and/or marketing names, products or services referenced here are independent of Osaic Wealth.Influential Entrepreneurs with Mike Saundershttps://businessinnovatorsradio.com/influential-entrepreneurs-with-mike-saunders/Source: https://businessinnovatorsradio.com/interview-with-stephen-ng-clu-chfc-cep-founder-of-stephen-ng-financial-group-discussing-how-to-grow-protect-retirement-wealth

Stephen Ng, whom you may have seen in NBC, Forbes, Wall Street Journal, U.S. News and World Report, New York Daily News, and others. He has also been interviewed by Fox TV and Christian Television Network. Stephen is the Author of “10 Financial Mistakes You Should Avoid” which has been a wonderful resource for many of his clients. All of the proceeds from the book sales go to benefit World Vision International. Stephen is also the Founder and President of Stephen Ng Financial Group.Stephen is married, has 3 children, and resides in New Jersey and Florida. Stephen is a warm and passionate communicator who loves to share his financial wisdom and insights. He served as a Deacon at Trust In God BaptistChurch in New York City and was the Chairman of the Board from 2008 to 2016. Currently, he serves as a trustee for Doxa Church in New York City. Stephen attends Bell Shoals Church, in Brandon, Florida. He loves to travel and frequently speaks internationally during mission trips with his churchLearn More: https://www.stephenngfg.com/The views expressed are not necessarily the opinion of Stephen NG, and should not be construed directly or indirectly, as an offer to buy or sell any securities or services mentioned herein. Investing is subject to risks including loss of principal invested. Past performance is not a guarantee of future results. No strategy can assure a profit nor protect against loss. Please note that individual situations can vary. Therefore, the information should only be relied upon when coordinated with individual professional advice.Securities and investment advisory services offered through Osaic Wealth, Inc. member FINRA/SIPC. Osaic Wealth is separately owned and other entities and/or marketing names, products or services referenced here are independent of Osaic Wealth.Influential Entrepreneurs with Mike Saundershttps://businessinnovatorsradio.com/influential-entrepreneurs-with-mike-saunders/Source: https://businessinnovatorsradio.com/interview-with-stephen-ng-clu-chfc-cep-founder-of-stephen-ng-financial-group-discussing-how-to-grow-protect-retirement-wealth

Pastor Chris Neiswonger of Graceview Church Southaven and host of “To God's Greater Glory”- Sunday's at 8:30 am on AM640 shares about his family, serving the International Legal Department of World Vision International, and working on T.V. shows like The People's Court, Jeopardy, and Soul Train.

Elli Oswald is the Executive Director of the Faith to Action Initiative, a coalition of organizations seeking to promote best practices in global orphan care.  She has served as a missions pastor at Bethany Community Church in Seattle and as part of World Vision International's Child Protection Technical Team, specializing in community-based care for children deprived of parental care.  She has a B.A. from Pepperdine University and a M.A. in Cross Cultural Studies and International Development from Fuller Theological Seminary. Family-based care for orphans world-wide is the ultimate goal. This episode with host Sue Duffield, is both informative and entertaining, as she and Elli navigate the truth about orphan care, the desperate need for support to families and the evidence of success when communities understand the need. www.sueduffield.com www.faithtoaction.org

David is an American-British dual national and retired ‘ordained' minister/pastor in three countries. He is a former adviser to NATO on military downsizing and re-skilling of 100k officers and family members in the post-Soviet Union era. He has more than 30 years of international experience in 40+ countries as a consultant and at a senior strategic executive, middle management, and operational level with several global Fortune 125/250/500 companies. He is a former Global Program Director for MA-level development of leaders from 45 countries with the Christian Charity and Humanitarian Agency, World Vision International. He is now an Organizational Development, Talent Management, and Training, Consultant, Master Trainer, and Executive Coach, and well-known conference speaker and a published author. He shares widely on business ethics and values impactful HR and truly Investing in People.McCluen-Martin Associates LLC is a global influencer and values-driven culture builder focused on helping organisations invest fully in their people and achieve world-class status. National culturally sensitive and attuned, we strive to help make organisations healthy and ‘whole' by supporting its leaders to lead with authenticity, transparency, and with ‘servant leader' hearts. We do this through unique strategic HR consulting, executive coaching, and highly experiential training – at all levels – that not only changes the culture for the better but also results in measurable and sustainable ROI. We help organisations identify, unlock, develop, and use talent to the full. The ultimate goal is to help people find meaning, purpose, and direction for their careers and lives.In this episode, we discover the following:Why it's important to believe in something bigger than ourselves.How to find the right fit for ourselves between our development and ability and the needs of the marketplace.What is the most important habit we can establish within our self-leadership?Why David is of the opinion that people don't read the Bible but they read people.With podcast host: Mark SephtonHope you'll enjoy the episode! Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Kajian MMA, 40 peratus doktor jadi mangsa buli.   Kadar inflasi tinggi jadi faktor utama kebuluran seluruh dunia. Malaysia dan Indonesia bersuara, koridor kemanusiaan ke Gaza. Pusat hiburan milik warga Bangladesh, saji tarian gelek, tumpas

[00:00:00] Tommy Thomas: A strong board of directors is essential to the success of any non-profit organization. The board of directors plays a critical role in providing guidance, oversight, and support for the organization's mission and operations.   There is no cookie-cutter or one-size-fits-all when it comes to Nonprofit Board Governance and Board Service.  However, there is a lot we can learn from people who are active on the Boards of high impact and highly effective nonprofit organizations.   Over the past 104 issues, we have devoted a lot of time to this topic.  From time to time, we will highlight excerpts from some of these conversations.   Today is the 3rd time we are compiling these excerpts.  I will have links to the previous two episodes in the Episode Notes.   Christin McClave has over 20 years of corporate leadership, beginning her career with Johnson & Johnson and serving in senior leadership in her family's large automotive aftermarket business – Cardone Industries.  Christin has served on and continues to serve on several nonprofit and corporate Boards. I've been in this business a long time and I've worked with probably 300 or 400 boards, over the last 30 years. And if I look at them, I would say a lot of the time they're males. They might be closer to my age than your age. And now things are changing. So, what are you seeing, or maybe what are you doing to lower the mean age on a board and to maybe bring more gender and ethnic diversity?  [00:01:43] Christin McClave:  So, I think we see a lot of changes in the general demographics, right?  As our society and culture are changing. The positive thing is there's so much more diversity coming up through the leadership ranks. And I think the traditional way that we've, I'll say we, because I've done it myself as well, when we've needed a new board member on a board, I instantly think about who have I worked with before? Who's like me, who thinks like me, who would be easy to plug and play into this board that I'm on? And so that's been our traditional way of pipelining onto boards. Let's find people who we know and who we know could be very quickly successful and contribute value to this board. I think what we've learned over the last couple years is that doesn't necessarily bring diversity to these boards that we are trying to diversify. And we've seen the pressure coming from the public sector the SEC, not quite regulations, but suggestions that we need a certain percentage of diversity on the public boards. And there's a lot of pressure in the market for that. And then that has trickled down its way to nonprofits and to the private sector. So, everyone is looking to diversify their boards at this point. And I think, a key piece of the job requirements that we have in the past always assumed on larger boards, I'll say. And most boards in general, everybody's wanted, okay you need to have a CEO or CFO or a C level executive. But preferably a CEO or CFO who's been in the chair before. And I've had people say that to me as well, that's what they're looking for. And I think we know just from sheer data that a lot of women and diverse candidates in general haven't had those opportunities. We are definitely developing that pipeline now and being very much more intentional. But I think like through the past few years and now looking at the talent market being as hot as it is and the demand for diverse talent we have, we are at the place we need to take a look at those very narrow criteria that we've said, oh, you have to be a C-level executive to be on a board and to be able to contribute value. And I think, now I've seen a lot more being written, a lot more being talked about, diversity coming onto boards where I'm reading someone's background and I'm like, wow, that is so cool. Maybe 10 years ago that person wouldn't have been chosen for that very significant board seat. So, I think we've opened up our criteria and have opened up our thought process and how we see people's experiences. We're looking at people's resumes really differently these days. From an HR perspective in internal, when we're screening candidates we took the requirement of having a college degree off of our requirements, probably, about 10 years ago, which was a little bit ahead of our time, but it just opened up our talent pool and we realized there are a lot of people out there that may not have a bachelor's degree but are way more experienced with their life and work experience that we were not being able to tap into because we had that very strict requirement. So, I think we're seeing that across the board at all levels, including at the board level. +++++++++++++++++++++++ [00:05:34] Tommy Thomas: Alvin Sanders, President & CEO of World Impact, a nonprofit that focuses on redemptive poverty and cultural proficiency in the urban community.  Alvin and his Board are huge proponents of the Policy Governance Model - an integrated board leadership paradigm created by Dr. John Carver.   I'm asking people these days about bringing younger people onto boards. And philosophically, do you have a position on that? And then I'll ask a follow up.  [00:06:10] Alvin Sanders: Yes, we try to hold it at nine, because we think a smaller board is better for getting things done. And I think in terms of thirds, a third of our board, we want gender diversity, a third of our board, we want age diversity, a third of our board, we want racial diversity. And then we want half and half, what I would say, marketplace people. These are business folk, and then the other half ministry people. Because if you have all marketplace people, the ministry gets lost. It's been my experience. And if you have all ministry people, the business of running the organization gets lost and it loses knowledge and expertise. So that's my philosophy of how you have you bring a board together. But you definitely need people, especially since I just read the other day that millennials now are the most dominant generation numbers wise. It's no longer Baby Boomers. It's never been my generation, Gen X. We're the forgotten generation, I think. Nobody gives a rip about Gen X, but Millennials now are it and you're just being silly if you don't have Millennials on your board. ++++++++++++++++++ [00:07:23] Tommy Thomas: Caryn Ryan, Managing Director at MissionWell, an organization that provides financial and strategic counsel to nonprofit organizations. Caryn is the former CFO for BP/Amoco and World Vision International.  She currently serves on corporate and nonprofit Boards.   I want to ask you one question then I'll close. So, my next to the last question has to do with succession planning and the board. At what point should that begin to occur? And how does the board address that without the CEO thinking “I'm a short-timer”? [00:08:04] Caryn Ryan: Okay. Yeah, that's great.  I'm dealing with that right now at one of the boards that I sit on. And I've just dealt with that last year as well. And it works both ways if it works all, all different ways. So let me just talk about one where the CEO does get the feeling. If you have this conversation that they're a short timer. I want to just say first of all, that can sometimes go back to the trust issue again, right? When there's a lack of trust between the board and the CEO then, and you bring up the succession of the question of succession planning, the first thing that goes of course into the CEO's mind is, oh, I'm getting fired.  I'm a short termer here.  So that has to again, be addressed, the trust issue, before you can have productive conversations around succession planning. But even longer term issues are going to take some time to get resolved. There's something you can always do on the succession plan that's very short term and that every single board must have in place. And that is you need a succession plan in case of an emergency. If your CEO becomes ill is hit by a bus, or whatever, you need an emergency succession plan that is an interim structure or very well thought through way that you'll manage in the absence of the CEO.  And usually, it's not going to bring out the same negative feeling for the CEO.  On the part of the CEO because they understand that, oh yeah, if I'm not there, we need to have some interim structure. And so, they'll begin helping the Board and thinking through, look, okay, if something happens to me, let's make this person on our staff the interim, or let's pull this Board Member out and see if they'll be the interim. Or they'll start to engage in the ideas for how that could work in interim a structure. And as long as you can get that interim structure put in place and everybody's in agreement that it's workable, that then gives a chance during the interim structure for the Board to go out and begin doing a search to find a replacement candidate. Regarding succession planning for a Founder – S/he just might not be willing to step aside. They might have created a whole lack of number twos in the organization who can step in, even in an emergency. It just may not be anybody. So that's a different situation where the board needs to probably, in addition to working on trust, which can be very difficult with the founder. You might be off the board if you start having those kind of conversations. But what you can do as a board is do your research. How would you do a search? You can get your research done on executive search firms who could step in and help you. You can just keep in mind, and Tommy, you're the one who should be telling your podcast listeners this, but it's a long process to do a search. You've got to set up a search committee. You got to figure out how you're going to recruit the person. You've got to have an approach. You have to execute it, you have to review the candidates. It's just really time consuming. You at least have to think through all of these, how that's a minimum thing, even if it's a founder situation. I'd say two things. Number one, for sure, have an interim emergency succession plan, no questions asked. That's an absolute minimum mandate for every board. And number two, if you're on a founder board, you have to do some special extra work along the side with networking, quiet networking, just to figure out the process and figure out how you would do, how would you do that if something did happen to your founder, if your founder's not willing to participate or help with that.  Does that make sense?  ++++++++++++++ [00:11:33] Tommy Thomas: Rich Stearns, President Emeritus at World Vision US.  Prior to joining World Vision, Rich was CEO for multiple organizations in the private sector, thus reporting to their Boards.  He cut his teeth on nonprofit Board Governance as President of World Vision US.   When I interviewed you back in 2017 you mentioned that from your perspective, the best thing that the World Vision Board did for you when you came on was you recalled an offsite retreat where y'all got introduced to each other. Could you share a little bit about that with us? I think we probably have a lot of up and coming CEOs listening and that might be an interesting discussion. [00:12:14] Rich Stearns: Yeah, I don't know how much that costs. Probably not much, but it was the best money World Vision ever spent. When I came into World Vision the Board and the CEO had what I'd call a turbulent relationship. He wasn't thrilled about his board and the way they behaved, and the Board wasn't thrilled about him in certain ways. And so, I was coming into kind of a troubled marriage, right? You could say there'd been a divorce, and I'm the new husband coming in. And so, the Board had enough wisdom to say, you know what, we should start off on the right foot here. Why don't we hire a board consultant to come in and do a two-day retreat with a new CEO to teach the Board and the new CEO, how best they should interact and communicate with one another. So, a friend of yours and mine named Bob Andringa, he's retired now, but he was in the Board consulting business. He's written at least one book, if not several. He came in and he conducted a Board Governance 101, 102 course for all of us. And gave us tools to use and dealt with different scenarios of here are the dos and don'ts for Board Members. Here are the dos and don'ts for the staff and the CEO. Here is the best way to understand your responsibility as Board Members. This is what your responsibility is, and this is what your responsibility is not. This is the role you play. This is the role you don't play. And same with a CEO, Rich, your role is this the board's role is to establish policy. I guess the best way to say it is it laid down the ground rules for a healthy relationship. And I don't think it's an exaggeration to say I had a 20-year honeymoon with my board. Not that there weren't an occasional, marital argument over the years. But it was like a 20-year honeymoon with the board. And I respected them, they respected me. My staff, when I first started, after a year, they said, boy, you've had a one-year honeymoon with this board. It's amazing. Because they'd seen some of the dysfunction in the prior years. And 20 years later, they were still saying you're still on your honeymoon. And I in terms of my response, what I attribute it to, is what I talked about earlier, Tommy, that the board knew they could trust me. I would never tell them a lie. I would never hide anything. I was completely transparent. Anything they wanted to talk about at a board meeting, we could talk about. Any numbers they wanted to see, we'd show them. If I had some bad numbers, I'd bring them to the board and say, look, this is not good, and here's what we're going to do.  They never felt I was hiding anything. And so that created trust as well. [00:15:03] Tommy Thomas: One of the guys that you've influenced over the years is Joe Mettimano at Central Union Mission. And when I interviewed Joe there, he talked about a lesson he learned from you about the president's report to the board. He would attribute part of his success to what he learned from you there. Tell us about that. [00:15:22] Rich Stearns: I started every board meeting with a president's report. So, the Board is gathered, in the case of World Vision they've flown in from all over the country, and here they are at the World Vision board meeting and remember, they're all volunteers, some are pastors, some are business people.  They're from all walks of life and so I tried to use the President's Report to basically bring them up to speed on what was going on at World Vision. What were the important issues? What were we doing about the important issues? How are the finances doing? I tried to answer as many questions as they might have in advance. Because the rest of the board meeting, the finance committee was going to meet and other committees were going to meet. And I tried to use the President's Report to cast a bit of a vision for where we were as an organization, where we're headed, what my outlook was for the coming year or the coming quarter. And I try to use the Board Meeting to really cast a vision to remind them of the mission of World Vision. Often, I would start with a trip report. I've just gotten back from the Syrian refugee crisis, and I want to tell you what I saw. I would remind them, we're sitting here in a nice boardroom, but people are dying all over the world. And our job is to intercede for them to help them to rescue those who are perishing as the book of Proverbs says. And so, trying to remind them why they were here, why World Vision was here and then look under the hood at, the financials, the numbers, the revenues, the overhead, and you had to deal with issues like real estate transactions and mundane stuff like that. I wanted to always to put it in the context of the bigger mission, vision and values of the organization. My President's Report would sometimes go 90 minutes to two hours which is a lot. But usually, the board would say that was the highlight of the meeting because that really brought them up to date on everything. +++++++++++++++= [00:17:16] Tommy Thomas: Paul Maurer, President at Montreat College.  Paul is a student of Board Governance and identifies as a “governance nerd”.  Paul is on his second college presidency and has learned a lot – some through the school of hard knocks about effective Board Governance.   And a lot of people that I talk with, there's a move toward lowering the mean age of the board and increasing diversity. What kind of experience have y'all had at Montreat around those issues? [00:17:45] Paul Maurer: We're intentionally trying to increase diversity. We've not found that to be an easy pathway, but we are we are committed to it. And on age I would just gently push back on the median age lowering. I'm very much of the Aristotelian camp that young people have less wisdom. And part of what you want for board members is wisdom. Wisdom comes with experience, and experience comes with age and the hard knocks of life and just the journey of life with gray hair and getting beat up occasionally. And I want younger people on the board, but that's less common. They're actually very hard to get on the board because they're less qualified candidates in my view, and they're uber busy with career and family. So, the young members, the 30 somethings, I have on my board, I have two of them. They're like up to their eyeballs, four or five kids each, they're CEOs or leaders in their own rights and rising in the ranks. And these people have large portfolios and enormous demands on their time. Then my 70- and 80-year-olds, and I even have a 91-year-old board member who I recruited at the age of 87. And he said to me, he said, Paul, what if I die? And I said, Bill what if I die? We're all going to die. You've got a lot of gas left in your tank. You've got enormous amount of wisdom. And you may have others who think that you're too old to be a board member. I don't think that at all. And if a day should come when your health has slipped, your metro capacities have slipped, we'll have that conversation and we'll have it openly and honestly. Honestly the seventies, eighties, and 90-year-old trustees I have are easily among my best trustees. They're phenomenal. [00:20:04] Tommy Thomas: Let's change over a little bit to the board aspect of being a president. What was the biggest adjustment that you had to make between, say, reporting to the CEO as a cabinet member and then as the President reporting to the Board? [00:20:20] Paul Maurer: Yeah, it's a great question. I'm a bit of a governance nerd. I really think about and study governance. I did that in my doctoral work. I do it as a college president in nonprofit governance. And so, the president needs clarity. What is the role of the board? What is the role of the president? What's the role of the relationship and what's the role of everyone else on campus in relationship to the board? And so, in the world of board governance, there are working boards and there are policy boards. Startups tend to have working boards, like true startups, like really small organizations. More established organizations. If they haven't transitioned to a policy board, they probably ought to consider doing so. Because you don't really want a board involved in the operations of an organization. And so, I'm deeply grateful that my board gave me the lead role in board development, meaning recruitment of new board members, training of board, the board policy manual. And we have a great board today, and they really understand that the board should not be involved in operations. That's the CEO's job but should be sure that they're being fiduciaries, that they're making sure there's a strategic plan that's being carried out their success along the way and that they manage or evaluate. They don't manage, they evaluate the presidents. They hire and fire the president, the CEO. I do think that my argument would be that it's more important for a President to be a CEO than a President. The President is, as I think of a bit of an old model for college leadership, it's rooted in what I think is not a very useful model of shared governance. I think the CEO is a better model, but you also need a CEO who's sensitive to campus dynamics and the idea that consensus really matters. And a consensus building CEO I think is the best model, but I think that the CEO also needs to be the CUO - the Chief Urgency Officer. Because things are changing so fast.    Links & Resources JobfitMatters Website Next Gen Nonprofit Leadership with Tommy Thomas Two Previous Best of Board Governance Episodes:  2023 – Best of Board Service Part 1 2023 – Best of Board Service Part 2 Episodes Featuring These Excerpts Christin McClave – Insights into Board Governance Rich Stearns – President Emeritus World Vision US – An Inauspicious Leadership Journey – Part 2 Alvin Sanders – Board Governance Caryn Ryan – Board Governance Paul Maurer – Board Governance   Connect tthomas@jobfitmatters.com Follow Tommy on LinkedIn

[00:00:00] Caryn Ryan: The Chairman walks up to a fence.  They're tough, but they're relational, right? They're goal driven, but they're people driven. They stick to a vision of what they have for the organization and for the Board. They tend to be performance oriented. If you have Board Chairs who don't understand the value that the board is supposed to bring it's hard for them to be performance oriented. But the best Board Chairs really understand deeply what the value this board is bringing to this organization. And therefore, because they understand that they're able to act in that way. ​++++++++++++++++ [00:00:39] Tommy Thomas: In this episode, we're going to conclude the conversation that was started with Caryn Ryan, back in Episode 84. In that conversation, Caryn shared her leadership journey from BP/Amoco to the CFO for World Vision International to her current role as Founder and Managing Member of Missionwell.  In this episode, Caryn will be sharing lessons on nonprofit board governance that she's learned over the years.  [00:01:15] Tommy Thomas: Let's change over to board service and board governance for a few minutes. Your friend John Reynolds, who himself is a pretty steeped in this area, he said, if I ever got a chance to talk to you, that we for sure needed to talk about the work you've done and the  Balanced Scorecard for Boards. Take us into that. I really hadn't thought about that from a board perspective.  [00:01:36] Caryn Ryan: Yeah. That's great. I appreciated John's support in that area at the time. And then also Maggie Bailey, who you may know who was at Point Loma.  [00:01:44] Tommy Thomas: I do know Dr. Bailey.  [00:01:46] Caryn Ryan: She's been another good friend. And somebody who really helped form some of my thoughts on governance. We served on the Board of Open Doors together. So, in 2021 I read Dean Spitzer's book on Transformative Performance Metrics. And it made me start thinking about all the problems of metrics and how might it be possible to have more positive outcomes or avoiding the downsides that he was discussing. And I started thinking some of those downsides that he mentioned over and over through the book might be surmounted if we applied biblical principles and tried to attach metrics to our faith and that leaders that led from faith might therefore be able to get better outcomes. Let me give you a couple examples. When you're using metrics in an organization usually tangible and financial results are really at the top, and that doesn't motivate people a lot of the time. And so I began to think maybe if we had some people and relationships at the top, in other words, that sort of from this biblical base of loving people that might be more but motivating and it would certainly be better connected to our faith. And then getting overconfident in the measures that the measures become the goal. Humility, this is a really important faith-based value and way of life, and perseverance in the face of issues. Those kinds of biblical and ways of living faithfully might help surmount that. And the fact that a measurement isn't trusted. I was thinking of let your yes be a yes, this idea that people get very defensive regarding failures, I thought in a faithful community, confession is at the core of reconciliation. So, I started thinking about how all these shortcomings had a biblical answer to them. And I started thinking how could we start to put together an approach that was more biblical and then allowed people's faith to be at the heart of their metrics? And as time went on I started then thinking about, okay let's take the issue of goals. That's taking a step back from the problems of metrics, but metrics are meant to - in a sense, say how we're doing on the journey of goals. So, we have, for instance, a vision. You have a vision to get to the vision, you set big goals, and then when you set the big goals, you have metrics. There're BHAGs sometimes, or there are other types of goals. And I started just then thinking about goals. Smart Goals Specific, Measurable, Actionable, Relevant to the mission and vision of the organization and Timebound And I know you've talked with John Pearson, and hearing good friends, you probably have heard him talk a lot about smart goals. Specific, Measurable, Actionable, Relevant to the mission and vision and Timebound. John uses smart goals a lot and that has impacted so many non-profits and Christian organizations for the good. It's added a lot of clarity and focus. I began to think about another lens, which is clear goals. Clear goals have come out in the last few years as another way of thinking about goals. And the CLEAR stands for Collaborative, Limited, Emotional, Appreciable and Refinable. CLEAR Goals Collaborative, Limited, Emotional, Appreciable and Refinable If you look in more detail at what those mean, they all come down to how is it that people are motivated and how is it that within a system of organization we set goals that are people sized and yet think about who they are, and it thinks about the people who the basic people are connected to as well. So I began to think about those clear goals and how people get motivated and start thinking more and more that there might be, again, that role for faith because that approach of the clear goals seemed like it tied a little bit better with the love of people. So let me give you a quick example here. Let's just see my vision. This is my vision. I'm going to use you a personal example, and this isn't true by the way, but it's just an example. My vision is to travel the world and have lots of adventures, and then I go to the doctor and the doctor says, I need to lose 50 pounds to get to a goal weight. That doctor's saying that you need to get to a goal weight, that's not motivating by itself to a lot of people. In fact, it might discourage some people or, and some people might take it to extremes, and it might compromise their muscle building and their bone density, etc, and so on. So it can have some unintended consequences. And it might be hard on my family if I stop cooking because I need to lose 50 pounds. But if my goal is to be physically fit enough to take a hike in the Swiss Alps in two years, that's motivating to me. And it might produce long-term change and it might engage my family too. So the system around me, it might have positive benefits for the system around me and it might create better health outcomes for my family too. So I started thinking that's the goal, it's to get the right motivations for people directly responsible for the goal. It's to attach the goal to something that's motivational for them. And then it's to ensure that the surrounding people and processes don't suffer any material negative consequences, that goal and in fact maybe even benefit from it. So then, that was some goal thinking that solved, finding good. And then I started thinking about balanced scorecards because balanced scorecards, really what those are is a way of expressing how you're accomplishing the sum of your goals. I began to think then about this idea of a KPI, key performance indicator that is saying that's a measure at a strategic level. So it's not a key success outcome, which is maybe something a little bit more tactical, but it's at the strategic level. And I started thinking about KPIs in particular and balanced scorecards. And how then could you take these processes, this or this idea of love for people and get that translated into some better performance metrics or better KPIs. I was working at the time with a Christian homeless organization. And I started talking with them about this as part of their strategy process, and I just noticed it resonated with their mindset. And we continued working on it with this organization. And it resulted in a scorecard initially for that organization,  which then turned out to be relatively easy to translate, concept wise, into a scorecard for a board. A KPI has both a measure and a target. Let me just give you a few examples. A KPI has both a measure and a target, and it's based on a balance set of perspectives. And so one example might be a board that wants to measure giving and getting, you've probably seen that as an issue, Tommy, and some of the boards that you work with, their concern is that the giving and getting the donations direct and indirect are not sufficient or not what the development department wants.  Some boards the chairman in collaboration with the CEO might say, this is a minimum gift. It's $10,000. If you want to be on our board, you're going to give $10,000. It's a minimum gift. Or another board might take the approach of saying, we want you to be in the top three of charities or causes that you give to now. One of those ways is more focused on people and aligning motivations and commitments than the other. And that's the difference at a board level and at an organization level that we're trying to capture. How do you make these things more motivational?  Another area for a board might be in the continuous improvement boards that have a really high percentage of directors talking about how much they love their board and are likely to be doing a good job. It could be that when it comes to your board self-assessment, if your measure is going to be based on your board self-assessment, maybe within that board self-assessment, you want to have a measure and pull that up to the KPI level about what is your board of director's net promoter score? In other words, how many people on your board are going out and talking about that board positively and inviting them to come into the board? Maybe 80% of the board, at least, should be going out and doing that. And if they are, then that's a great metric for a board self-assessment. It's a very results-oriented self-assessment. You've got a great board if everybody's out there talking about what a wonderful board you have. And it's also doing great things, by the way, for your recruitment metric as well.  [00:10:27] Tommy Thomas: That question I hadn't heard.  This is fascinating.  [00:10:33] Caryn Ryan: So, whether it's for boards or leaders, a nonprofit who wants to do this for a ministry has to tweak the methodologies that are used in the for-profit sector. But I think if they do it, they're going to get this a board or the leaders of organizations, they're going to just get a huge payback. They're just going to find that it's transformational in terms of the quality of time that they spend working on their metrics, making sure their personal motivations don't have unintended consequences and that they demonstrate the love for people. So, this is not something that I think a lot of people are thinking about, Tommy, and I can see working on this more as my role. So, mission will become less operational, but there's something in here that there's a word here that needs to be spread a little bit and different ways of thinking that we as Christians can offer to the rest of the world. ++++++++++++++++   [00:11:26] Tommy Thomas: A lot of people, most of us, would say that we've learned a lot in life through failure. In fact, maybe a lot of our stuff is learned through mistakes. If that's the truth, why are most of us so afraid to make a mistake?    [00:11:40] Caryn Ryan: I really think that it goes back to those two root causes that I was talking about before for leadership. Self-esteem and a desire for power or money or greed.  And if you have really low self-esteem, then I think you don't want to be judged. And because you don't want to be judged, then you don't take risks. And if you don't take risks, there's no reward. And then because there's no rewards, that goes and reinforces your low self-esteem. So it's this whole negative cycle of activities that just result in you not taking risks. But I would say too that if it's somebody who's power hungry, what you're going to see there is maybe not mistakes. It's more sins or heirs, of omission and commission really, that are just more, they're selfish, right? And so they're mistakes. They're either mistakes, in this life or in the next life. If you want to improve people's risk taking, you need to permit mistakes. And we need to also work on the root causes there.  We need to have systems and processes that make it safe, that don't trigger negative self-esteem, that make it okay for people to engage in risk taking, that set up rewards for risk taking. It's a kind of a whole system that we have to address if you want to fix this. But I think from a board perspective, and I know you're coming from that some of the time, there's also an issue of just needing to screen people who are willing to step past any kind of inner hesitations that they might have about, looking silly in front of their peers, for instance and who will just come out and say, it looks this way to me. And from a board perspective that seldom is going to be a mistake is going to generate a great conversation and improve outcomes for a board.  [00:13:43] Tommy Thomas: I want to go to financial accountability for a minute.  Because you live three or 400 miles south of the largest bank failure in recent days, the Silicon Valley Bank. And then you and I are both old enough to remember the Enron scandal. And in both of those situations, I think most people say the board is culpable. I guess the jury's still out on the bank but my hunch is that they'll find some culpability there. Take it. And they're not nonprofit organizations, but boards have responsibilities. How do you counsel your clients to have more candid conversations about financial accountability? [00:14:21] Caryn Ryan: That's such a great question, Tommy. I will say too, just for starters, that it's quite rare, I think for board members to have whatever it takes to come out and ask these top questions. The best of boards do, but the middle of the pack and the worst really don't. Now you start thinking then about what is in the best of boards that makes them allow conflict and allow tough questions to come out. And I think there's a variety of answers. But first, let me just say this. I want to point out an interesting statistic here because if you look at candidate or GuideStar, this is a rating entity for nonprofits. And that includes Christian nonprofits. They provide some statistics that could be of interest here to try to think through - who are the best of the best. It's not completely pertinent, but in their world, which is thousands and thousands of charities that they rank, only 5% get a ranking of gold, silver, or platinum status. And of those, it's a very limited percentage, maybe 15%, that get the platinum. So when you multiply that backwards, then it says that only about 1.5% of all the charities that get ranked get a platinum candid certification. Now, this is mainly just looking at financial results and transparencies, but I think it does show that being the top nonprofit, it's pretty rarefied world. It's that up in the stratosphere there is a top nonprofit or a top ministry. So then we code your question then about I think having a board that can ask the tough questions is a precursor to that, to being a top performing nonprofit. And so having a really great board. It is a risky proposition when a nonprofit CEO recruits only his/her friends or allies to the Board. There are barriers that we can see. I'm sure you've seen these often too, but it's not unusual for a CEO to recruit his or her friends or allies to the board. And that's never a good idea because it discourages a lot of times that friend from having an honest conversation about the nonprofit or something that's really important to their friend. And also on boards, it's not unusual to have a whole bunch of conflicts of interest. It just isn't dealt with or even surfaced by the board members. So when you have that, then you have the sometimes people aren't going to ask tough questions because they have a conflict of interest.  Another factor is that there's capability gaps. There are people who aren't able to read basic financial statements or financial reports. And I think financials, I'm coming at this from a financial perspective perhaps, but financials embody the impact of boards and their decisions, and their actions related to strategy. A board takes a decision. The decision unfolds as actions. The actions are translated into financial results. And so that's how a board gets to see how did I do with the strategic decisions that I made? But interestingly, a lot of times sports can't even read their financial statements. There's a lot of financial literacy questions there. So how can you ask tough questions if you can't read the financial statements or financial reports and understand them? And sometimes there are issues with what's delivered to boards too, in terms of information, but sometimes it's just a basic lack of understanding. I think too, there's also a fundamental issue that sometimes with boards, they don't get enough board development or board training and they really just don't understand their key role when it comes to accountability. And so, they don't understand that it's their job to ask the tough questions. These are a few things, but I think you put them all together, Tommy. And isn't it a wonder at all that any charities have boards that do ask the tough questions and that are excellent? There are a lot of pieces that all have to come together to make that happen. +++++++++++++++++   [00:18:11] Tommy Thomas: At the crux of any board is the Board Chair. Give me words and phrases that would describe the best chair you've ever seen or served under.  [00:18:20] Caryn Ryan: Okay. I would say some of the things that I've seen the chairman do… They're tough, but they're relational, right? They're goal driven, but they're people driven. They stick to a vision of what they have for the organization and for the board. They tend to be performance oriented. I think if you have board chairs who don't understand the value that the board is supposed to bring it's hard for them to be performance oriented. The best board chairs really understand deeply what the value this board is bringing to this organization. And therefore, because they understand that they're able to act in that way. So I see those are some of the characteristics that differentiate a great board leader from a less than great board leader. [00:19:11] Tommy Thomas: Do you think every board needs a glass half empty person?  [00:19:16] Caryn Ryan: Does the board need that kind of a person? No. I guess it depends on how you define that, Tommy. So, for me if you mean by that, that there's a person who can see that they're on the side of half empty, that there's upsides and downsides, right? Then maybe. But in general, I think when a board comes together, they need to be so enthusiastic, so passionate about the mission and vision. So, the ability to look at an opportunity and say, no our glass is not half empty. I know where we want to go as a board, and we're going to fill this glass, right? They're going to say, we're going to absolutely fill this glass. We're going to pivot and do what we have to do because maybe there are some circumstances out there that are making some people think the glass is half empty, but we're going to pivot. We're going to figure out what we need to do. Always moving down the field toward the goalpost, toward the vision for the organization. So I think if people can try to look at environments and circumstances and say, how do we get the most from these?  How do we use this? Change this, maybe this negative circumstance. How do we use this negative environment? How do we use this risky situation? How do we just use this to help us down the goalpost? Or if we just absolutely can't find a way, how do we dodge it for now so we can come back and get back on track later? Is there a better way for a board member to function? [00:20:39] Tommy Thomas:   Talk a little bit about the CEO Evaluation and the Board.  You've seen a lot of boards. What's some best practices you see there?  [00:20:48] Caryn Ryan: How about for starters doing it? That to me is critical and mostly what I've seen over the years are annual assessments. When it's done. What I see is annual assessments sometimes every two years. When I've helped boards, I sit on boards that I've helped. What I've done is I've stolen shamelessly from other organizations to develop an assessment. And by the way, I don't think you need to be overly concerned with whether a professional developed this assessment. Most board members know this is what's important for us and for the CEO. Just write those questions out and, go or go steal them from somebody and tweak them a bit to make them fit your circumstances. I've noticed other nonprofits are very generous in sharing that way. They're happy to say, this is my evaluation tool. But it's important too, to just do it and to remember too, it's not the tool, it's the conversation around it.  You're actually using that tool because you want to improve. If it's a Board evaluation, you want to improve the Board. If it's a CEO evaluation, you want to give it to the CEO to develop the CEO. And sometimes to make a tough decision on retention. But a lot of times it's for the development and the good of the CEO and the organization. So don't focus on the what, focus on the how, when it comes to these evaluations, and keep in mind what the goal is, right? To encourage and to support and to develop your CEO. [00:22:13] Tommy Thomas: I talked to Jerry White, The Board Chair for The Navigators International, yesterday.  And Jerry's comment was that whatever comes out in the evaluation shouldn't be a surprise.  [00:22:22] Caryn Ryan: That's quite true because if it does turn out to be a surprise, Jerry is absolutely correct. You've had a trust breakdown. The results of the Board's evaluation of the CEO should not be a surprise to the CEO.  If that happens you have a breakdown in trust and communications. When you have that big of a communications breakdown, there's a trust dynamic at work there. And that has to be treated as a separate issue and a precursor to really doing CEO evaluations. You first have to address that trust issue, what is causing the trust issue?  And you have to get that out of the way before you can then have reasonably productive conversations around an assessment.  That's such a common dynamic, Tommy. [00:22:56] Tommy Thomas: Jerry said that, I'm probably paraphrasing, but something to the effect of the evaluation should really be going on overtime and not just every 12 months or whatever.  [00:23:06] Caryn Ryan: He's absolutely right. So there should be informal feedback occurring. Some of the better boards, I've seen the chairman meeting monthly with the CEO, right? They have lunch, an informal kind of lunch. And they're having a very frank and relational though dialogue during the month about, what's going, what's going wrong. It's a chance and opportunity for linkages and feedback to the board and back. And so that in and of itself is building trust and leading to the ability for the board to have a positive session when it comes to the performance management. But I'll say this, even when that's occurring at which it does in the best board, there are going to be, because the CEO Evaluation is the sum of all, typically of all the board members. It's not always the case. Sometimes the chairman will do it, or they'll select a few people to do it, but a lot of times it's the whole board. There's almost a benefit to seeing that total perspective because maybe there's an aspect of it that's a surprise. The overall flow is in accord with what the chairman and CEO have been talking about and having dialogue on through the year. But there's a couple of points that generally come out that make that wrap up in the annual evaluation valuable. There's something about the faith life of the CEO that hasn't been addressed and it's coming out and there's a way to have a conversation in a different kind of pulling up. Over the past year and maybe even looking forward a little bit into the challenges, it's just a way of pulling up above the fray and looking with a little bit more distance at the year that can generate a couple of new revelations. But I totally agree with Jerry. There shouldn't really be a lot of surprises on that because there should be this ongoing dialogue. +++++++++++++++++++ [00:24:44] Tommy Thomas: I want to ask you one question, then I'll close. My next to the last question has to do with succession planning and the board. At what point should that begin to occur? And how does the board address that without the CEO thinking? I'm a short termer.  [00:25:03] Caryn Ryan: Okay. Yeah, that's great.  I'm dealing with that right now at one of my one of the boards that I sit on. And I've just dealt with that last year as well. And it works both ways if it works all, all different ways. So let me just talk about one where the CEO does get the feeling. If you have this conversation, they're a short termer. I want to just say first of all, that can sometimes go back to the trust issue again, right? When there's a lack of trust between the board and the CEO then, and you bring up the question of succession planning, the first thing that goes of course into the CEO's mind is, oh, I'm getting fired.  I'm a short termer here.  So that has to again, be addressed, the trust issue before you can have productive conversations around succession planning. But even longer term issues are going to take some time to get resolved. There's something you can always do on the succession plan that's very short term and that every single board must have in place. And that is you need a succession plan in case of an emergency. If your CEO becomes ill, is hit by a bus, whatever, right? You need an emergency succession plan that is an interim structure or very well thought through way that you'll manage in the absence of the CEO.  And usually, it's not going to bring out the same negative feeling for the CEO.  On the part of the CEO because they understand that, oh yeah, if I'm not there, we need to have some interim structure. And so, they'll begin helping the Board and thinking through, look, okay, if something happens to me, let's make this person on our staff, the interim, or let's pull this Board Member out and see if they'll be the interim. Or they'll start to engage in the ideas for how that could work in an interim structure. And as long as you can get that interim structure put in place and everybody's in agreement that it's workable, that then gives a chance during the interim structure for the Board to go out and begin doing a search to find a replacement candidate. Regarding succession planning for a Founder – She/he just might not be willing to step aside. They might have created a whole lack of number twos in the organization who can step in, even in an emergency. It just may not be anybody. So that's a different situation where the board needs to probably, in addition to working on trust, which can be very difficult with the founder. You might be off the board if you start having those kinds of conversations. But what you can do as a board is do your research. How you would do a search. You can get your research done on executive search firms who could step in and help you. You can just keep in mind, it takes and Tommy, you're the one who should be telling your podcast listeners this, but it's a long process to do a search. You've got to set up a search committee. You have to figure out how you're going to recruit, the person. You've got to have an approach. You have to execute it, you have to review the candidates. It's just really time consuming. You at least have to think through all of these, how that's a minimum thing, even if it's a founder situation. So I'd say two things. Number one, for sure, have an interim emergency succession plan, no questions asked. That's an absolute minimum mandate for every board. And number two, if you're on a founder board, you have to do some special extra work along the side with networking, quiet networking, just to figure out the process and figure out how you would do, how would you do that if something did happen to your founder, if your founder's not willing to participate or help with that.  Does that make sense?  [00:28:32] Tommy Thomas: Yeah. The founder conversation is probably a three or four podcast discussion that I haven't had yet. Maybe I'll have you back with two or three other panelists and we'll talk about founders because I did some research three or four years ago on that, and it's an easier said than done proposition. [00:28:49] Caryn Ryan: Yes, I totally agree, and I'd love to hear the wisdom of some other panelists on this one too, because we all encounter these founder situations.  [00:28:58] Tommy Thomas: So, let's go to my last question.  Somebody comes to you next week, they want to have breakfast or lunch, and somebody has asked them to serve on the Board of a nonprofit, and they're coming to you saying, Caryn, what should I be thinking about? [00:29:13] Caryn Ryan: I'd say, if they ask that question, they're on track to be a good board member first of all. Because sometimes people will jump into these situations without asking that very question. But what I would give somebody who's thinking about joining a board the advice is number one,  For a nonprofit Board Member - Does the mission of the organization excite my passion? Am I passionate about it? I think if you're not passionate about what the organization is doing, it's just not going to work. It's just not going to interest you inherently. So, you have to be able to see this as a way to realize or support your passion. Number two I would talk about - I would think about conflicts of interest. I was recently counseling the Executive Director of an organization who'd been asked to serve on a board where there were some competitive aspects to her organization. So we talked that through. And she in effect decided, no, there's too many conflicts of interest here for me to take that board position. Number three might be do you have the time? Okay. So, there's a real issue. You need to dig in and understand how much time is it going to take. Do you have to serve on committees? How much time do the committees take? How many, how frequently are the board meetings? Is there a retreat every year that you have to go to? So you really need to add up the time and make sure that you're able to make that commitment. I'd say those are three of the big things that I see with people. And a lot of times I'll start doing positive coaching to people too, in terms of, also, why don't you ask yourself, what development will I personally get by sitting on the Board? What will it do for me and my professional development or my development as a person and a human being? And sometimes that can make the difference. They can say, I really don't have the time to do this, but I need to do this because I really believe it's going to focus and sharpen at home this strategic skill set that I need to be successful in something else that I'm doing in life. And so, they'll do it and they'll be really glad, because they'll get that development. Just let's think about that lens too.  [00:31:05] Tommy Thomas: That's interesting.  A good friend, Joe Arms, who used to be the Chairman of the Baylor Board is the CEO of a large private sector company.  He said he makes that a part of the management training program for his employees that he encourages board participation in the nonprofit sector in Dallas as part of their grooming. [00:31:27] Caryn Ryan: I can see that you get a lot of personal development when you're a part of a board and it's where you're really learning that what you learn about governance is not so distinct from what you need to be a top senior executive in a corporation. There are just a lot of parallels there. So I can really see why he'd say that.  So he makes a very good observation. [00:31:48] Tommy Thomas:  Caryn, thank you. This has been a great conversation. I just believe our listeners have picked up some things that probably hadn't been covered in other board conversations, so thank you for taking this time with me. I really appreciate it.  [00:32:03] Caryn Ryan: Absolutely.  Thank you, Tommy. I'm so glad to have reconnected with you and been able to remember some of my fond memories with some of the people who are in your network as we've talked.  [00:32:14] Tommy Thomas:  Life has been good to me over the years, and the two men you mentioned, Nick Isbister and Rob Stevenson - both of those guys they put a lot of time into this project, and I'm grateful for their part in my life.  [00:32:26] Caryn Ryan: I'm grateful too and I can add you to my circle of gratitude now.  [00:32:30] Tommy Thomas: Our guest next week will be Alec Hill The President Emeritus of InterVarsity Christian fellowship. You may remember Alec from Episodes 18 and 19, where he and Rudy Hernandez, a former board chair at InterVarsity discuss the working relationship between the CEO and the Board Chair in a nonprofit organization.  Alec is also a prolific writer. He's a regular contributor to postings on the Christian Leadership Alliance website. One of his recent posts was titled Finding Gold in Manure. In that article Alec shares lessons that he's learned for some of the hard times in his life. And in our conversation we'll dig into some of those lessons.    Links and Resources JobfitMatters Website Next Gen Nonprofit Leadership with Tommy Thomas 2021 Distinguished Alumni Recipient Caryn Ryan, ‘79 Missionwell Website Transforming Performance Measurement: Rethinking the Way We Measure and Drive Organizational Success by Dean Spitzer   Connect Tommy Thomas - tthomas@jobfitmatters.com Tommy's LinkedIn Profile Caryn Ryan's LinkedIn Profile  

[00:00:00] Tommy Thomas: This week, we're continuing the conversation that we began last week with Paul Mauer, the president of Montreat College. If you missed that episode, we've talked about what one writer has referred to as the “Miracle at Montreat”. Today Paul is sharing lessons that he's learned about nonprofit board governance over the years.  Let's change over a little bit to the board aspect of being a president. What was the biggest adjustment that you had to make between, say, reporting to the CEO as a cabinet member and then as the President reporting to the board? [00:00:40] Paul Maurer: Yeah, it's a great question. I'm a bit of a governance nerd. I really think about and study governance. I did that in my doctoral work. I do it as a college president in nonprofit governance.  Your board policy manual really matters. It matters because your board needs clarity. The president needs clarity. What is the role of the board? What is the role of the president? What's the role of the relationship and what's the role of everyone else on campus in relationship to the board? And so, in the world of board governance, there are working boards and there are policy boards. Startups tend to have working boards, like true startups, like really small organizations, more established organizations. If they haven't transitioned to a policy board, they probably ought to consider doing so. Because you don't really want a board involved in the operations of an organization. I'm deeply grateful that my board gave me the lead role in board development, meaning recruitment of new board members, training of board members, and the board policy manual. And we have a great board today, and they really understand that the board should not be involved in operations. That's the CEO's job but one should be sure that they're being fiduciaries, that they're making sure there's a strategic plan that's being carried out, their success along the way, and that they manage or evaluate. They don't manage, they evaluate the presidents. They hire and fire the president, the CEO. I do think that my argument would be that it's more important for a President to be a CEO than a President. The President is, as I think of a bit of an old model for college leadership, it's rooted in what I think is not a very useful model of shared governance. I think the CEO is a better model, but you also need a CEO who's sensitive to campus dynamics and the idea that consensus really matters. And a consensus building CEO I think is the best model, but I think that the CEO also needs to be the CUO - the Chief Urgency Officer, because things are changing so fast.  And if the CEO is not leading change with a great sense of urgency, then I think the institution puts itself at some measure of risk. [00:03:21] Tommy Thomas: You've served on other boards, and you've reported to at least two, give me some attributes of a great Board Chair.  [00:03:29] Paul Maurer: I think the central role of a Board Chair is to manage the board. It's not principally to be a person of wealth or to be connected to persons of wealth. I don't think that's the right model for a Board Chair of a college. I think the right model is someone who understands nonprofit governance and manages the board meeting to meeting because the board ultimately is the boss of the President - CEO, only during those board meetings. So the board chair needs to constantly instill clarity in the board to encourage them and steer them away from being involved in operations from directing the presidents, and to maintaining the role of being an overseer that the CEO reports to three times a year or however many times a year that board meets. The best chairs I've worked with really understand governance and really do well in managing the board's expectations of what that governance entails.  [00:04:41] Tommy Thomas: How does a good Board Chair draw out the silent board member?  [00:04:47] Paul Maurer:  In our board meetings, we have blocks of time for plenary sessions for the big picture items. And there's always time in there for dialogue and for feedback. And there are times when we build into our board meetings. When I give my board report, I give a little bit of a board update, a little bit of a report, and then I just open the floor to questions. And so there's just this open dialogue that I have with my board during the president's report at the beginning of the day and then the middle of the day during plenary sessions. If I'm informing or bringing an action item to the board as a whole, we are sure to build in time for dialogue, deliberation, questions, understanding, and in between board meetings, I'm sending information on kind of the latest update on what's happening in my world. So, they're getting articles on a regular, semi-regular basis that if they're able to take time to read them helps keep them abreast of the most pressing issues that I'm facing on a regular basis.  [00:06:04] Tommy Thomas: So how often do you and your Board Chair, do y'all have regularly scheduled times or is it as needed?  How do y'all relate to each other?  [00:06:12] Paul Maurer: I'm aware that friendship is a tricky element in these things. I happen to have a very deep and strong friendship with my board chair, which preceded him coming on the board and he became a board member. And now as chair and I've changed my mind on this, Tommy, because there was a time earlier on when I thought that those were mutually exclusive and now, I don't think they're mutually exclusive. I think it can work very healthfully. And now I actually try to cultivate friendships with my board members in a way that I didn't early on in my first presidency, certainly not early on at Montreat. And so I think that dynamic when healthy is a really powerful part of making it work well. Any model can be abused. Any model can go awry. And I've seen that and I've heard about it an awful lot. I've experienced it. But I've also experienced the flip side of that, where a really meaningful friendship can also be the basis of a really healthy CEO-Board Chair relationship.  [00:07:34] Tommy Thomas: Can you think back as to, you mentioned early on at Montreat you hadn't gotten there yet.  What changed?  [00:07:43] Paul Maurer: In the relationship with my board chair?  [00:07:46] Tommy Thomas: Yeah, how did you make that transition from thinking it wasn't healthy to realizing that it could be healthy?  [00:07:52] Paul Maurer: I guess experiencing it along the way, initially without intending it to be that, and I went, this actually works. And so, when my current chair, when I began discussions with him about, because he had led a major healthcare nonprofit and grown it from a $25 million budget to $125 million budget. He had led a nonprofit.  He had worked in that sector for all of his career in healthcare, not in education. And so, I knew that I wanted him to be my next board chair when that time came. And so it was really then that I began to think in this kind of new model that maybe there's a way for and as I look back, I've actually had these like really healthy relationships with my past two board chairs here at Montreat. And gosh, what a better way to do it, and it really is possible. It eventually dawned on me that I could intentionally pursue that.  [00:09:01] Tommy Thomas: Do you have a term limit for your board chair?  [00:09:04] Paul Maurer: Five years, but it's year to year, up to five years.  [00:09:09] Tommy Thomas: And what about your board members? [00:09:10] Paul Maurer:  Nine years, the terms are three years renewable, two times for a nine year max with a one year minimum required off before renomination. One of the changes we made here was that every three-year term we do the board does self-evaluations for those that term and peer evaluations for those that come to term. There's an honest, self-reflective, peer reviewed process that goes through a committee on trusteeship every year for those at a term to ask the question, is this going well? Is this a time to continue on or a time to step off? And so it's not a nine, it's not a nine year. Every three years we talk about it. [00:10:08] Tommy Thomas:  Is that fairly common in the nonprofit sector from your experience?  [00:10:12] Paul Maurer: The board policy manual that we use was the work of Bob Andringa who was the CEO of the Council for Christian Colleges Universities some years ago. And Bob developed the BPM (Board Policy Manual) that we use. And as I understand it, there are 60 or 70 or 80, I think mostly CCCU schools that have adopted some version of Bob's work. And I just think it's so well-crafted and we of course made it ours with Bob's permission. And it's just a really, it's a really well done, thoughtful way to do governance. ++++++++++++++++++++   [00:10:53] Tommy Thomas: A lot of people that I talk with, there's a move toward lowering the mean age of the board and also increasing diversity. What kind of experience have y'all had at Montreat on those issues? [00:11:03] Paul Maurer:  We're intentionally trying to increase diversity. We've not found that to be an easy pathway, but we are committed to it. And on age I would just gently push back on the median age lowering. I'm very much of the Aristotelian camp that young people have less wisdom. And part of what you want for board members is wisdom. Wisdom comes with experience, and experience comes with age and the hard knocks of life. And just the journey of life with gray hair and getting beat up occasionally. And I want younger people on the board, but that's more, that's less common. They're actually very hard to get on the board because they're less really qualified candidates in my view, and they're uber busy with career and family. So the young members I have, the 30 somethings I have on my board, I have two of them. They're like up to their eyeballs, four or five kids each, they're CEOs or leaders in their own rights and rising in the ranks. And these people have large portfolios and enormous demands on their time. Then my 70- and 80-year-olds, and even I have a 91-year-old board member who I recruited at the age of 87. And he said to me, he said, Paul, what if I die? And I said, Bill what if I die? We're all going to die. You've got a lot of gas left in your tank. You've got an enormous amount of wisdom. And you may have others who think that you're too old to be a board member. I don't think that at all. And if there comes a day when your health has slipped, your metro capacities have slipped, we'll have that conversation and we'll have it openly and honestly. Honestly, the seventies, eighties, and 90-year-old trustees I have are really easily among my best trustees.  They're phenomenal. [00:13:22] Tommy Thomas: Let me get you to respond to this quote. You need a director on the board who will be a pleasant irritant, someone who will force people to think a little differently. That's what a good board does. [00:13:39] Paul Maurer: I think I would probably not gravitate toward the word irritant, and I would say I, I'd probably substitute something a little softer than that, that you want to be objective and you want to be able to deal with the hard issues. And frankly, the CEO ought to be leading the way on that, not a board member. I think it's fine for a board member to raise difficult or uncomfortable matters, and I certainly have board members who do that, and I think that's fine and it's healthy, but I think that can come by from different means, and it can come without it being quote unquote, maybe I'm just hung up on the word irritant. I think you can have really robust, difficult, honest, truthful conversations without it being irritating.  [00:14:40] Tommy Thomas: Okay. Talk about your philosophy or your use of the executive committee?  [00:14:48] Paul Maurer: I think it's vital and extremely valuable in a healthy board situation, and I'm qualifying a lot of my comments with a healthy board because I've worked for both healthy and unhealthy boards. I happen to be working for a very healthy board in my time here at Montreat. And so the executive committee functionally is a decision that needs to be made quickly between board meetings and the CEO either doesn't have the authority or just wisely wants the board to help own that decision and goes to the executive committee in between board meetings for a fast decision. Early in my time here, I used that executive committee with more frequency than I do now. But I don't have the number of fires now that I had back in 14, 15, 16, 17. And so I still use the executive committee, but it's less frequent and the larger board has fully embraced the executive committee in that way. [00:16:01] Tommy Thomas: How often do you use the executive session?  [00:16:04] Paul Maurer: Every board meeting, we have two executive sessions, one with the president and one without the president. Actually in inverse order - the first without the president. And then I'm brought back in for executive session with the president and where I'm told what was discussed in session without the president fully briefed and then engaging in a conversation where it's just me and the board in whatever they want to talk about freely, they don't feel free to talk about necessarily with a cabinet in the room. +++++++++++++++++++++   [00:16:37] Tommy Thomas: We mentioned strategic planning a few minutes ago. Does your board, are they involved in that, or do you and your staff bring that to the board?  [00:16:44] Paul Maurer: The latter in our board policy manual, the board's role is to approve a strategic plan recommended by the president and to receive updates and make sure that the CEO is making progress on the strategic plan. And so I give reports on the strategic plan, but the board is not involved in the creation of the strategic plan.  [00:17:07] Tommy Thomas: How does the CEO evaluation take place at Montreat? [00:17:11] Paul Maurer: So I submit a set of goals to the board on an annual basis that are metrics tied to the strategic plan, and they're evaluated at the end of the year.  And we, in our executive session, have a conversation about my delivery toward those goals.  [00:17:32] Tommy Thomas: Is that on an annual basis?  [00:17:35] Paul Maurer: It is in our policy manual. It is an annual activity.  [00:17:39] Tommy Thomas: How have you and your board addressed board turnover? In terms of maybe involuntary or voluntary?  I guess people decide they don't have time. They don't enjoy it. How are y'all doing with that?  [00:17:53] Paul Maurer: We've grown our board over the years, but we've certainly had people who, I had two resignations in this last run up to my board meeting last week. And they were just personal situations that they felt like they just needed to focus on some personal matters that they didn't feel like they could do justice to their service on the board. And we regretfully accepted their resignations. But in those cases, it had nothing to do with the college or the board or it was purely personal. That's mostly what we've experienced over these years. Most of our trustees go to term and we have them term out after nine years. We celebrate them and thank them. We've grown our board from our bylaws. Say that we can have between 12 and 36. It's a very wide range. When I first got here, we were in that 12 to 15 range for a number of years. Maybe ironically, maybe not. Ironically, during covid we had just a tremendous breakthrough in people saying yes to joining the board. I do a lot of board cultivation with board members who are bringing prospective trustee names to the table. We have a very robust list of prospective trustees at all times. Somewhere between 10 and 15 on our prospect list. And some go fast, some go slow, some never materialize. We're about 20 board members today.  Our target is to get in somewhere between 25 and 28. [00:19:31] Tommy Thomas: What kind of strategy do you use to keep that list at 15 to 20?  [00:19:36] Paul Maurer: Probably closer to 10 to 15. Yeah. And that's really the work of the committee on trusteeship to surface names. We also have, as we recruit new board members in, they bring fresh names to that list. So we're constantly messaging like that. That's a document. That's a living, breathing document. And some people stay on the A-list, some move to the B, some move to, we ask and they said no. We've got six or eight tabs on that spreadsheet, and it's constantly a living, breathing kind of document. [00:20:15] Tommy Thomas: This might be a mundane question, but I hear it asked a lot. Do you have a board meeting evaluation fairly regularly, or how do y'all approach that? [00:20:25] Paul Maurer:   Every board meeting, as soon as the board meeting is over, they get a email in their inbox asking them to fill out an evaluation of the board meeting. They've just finished. We give just a small number of days to do that so it's fresh in their minds. And then the Committee on Trusteeship takes that feedback which is both on a Likert scale as well as open comments available to, for them to make. And then that is discussed at the next committee on trusteeship meeting. And we're always trying to get better and refine and bring some changes to how the board meetings are conducted. And those surveys have served a very valuable role in that way.  [00:21:09] Tommy Thomas: What did you learn through Covid that you'll take forward? That maybe you didn't do before Covid in terms of board relationships and board governance? [00:21:19] Paul Maurer:   One of the observations I made during Covid was man, we're in this together. And my board chair is a public health expert, as I mentioned before and when Covid hit I remember calling him in early April and I said I don't have a clue how we're going to reopen. Can you help us? And he said I'd love to help you. And I said I've developed a friendship with the other four-year residential college presidents here in Western North Carolina. There are four privates and then a couple of major publics. Would you be willing to help them too? And he said, absolutely I would. That group of six presidents plus my board chair met on a zoom call at noon every Wednesday for a year and a half to figure out how to open residential both years of covid. And that was a powerful experience of teamwork and collaboration and friendship and setting aside the inevitable competition that exists between these institutions and saying, there's a bigger picture here, and I think the benefit of that was very great for all of us. The second thing I'd point to is that the level of fear that I observed during covid was something I'd never seen before, how widespread, how deep it was. And so the word courage became a central concept that whatever we did, we needed to really lean into the courage of critical thinking and what's best for the institution, what's best for the students and the staff here. And there was no one size fits all in Covid in vastly different circumstances in different parts of the country. Vastly different realities of the impact of covid with different age groups and so we had to make decisions for 18- to 22-year-olds in our campus and our employees. That's how we had to make decisions. And you can't possibly have state mandates or county mandates or federal recommendations fit every circumstance. And we made decisions that we believed to be in the best interest of our community. And we took some criticism for that. But overall, I would say that those who chose that kind of a pathway were probably more rewarded than not. +++++++++++++++++++= [00:24:20] Tommy Thomas: I'll ask you two final questions and we'll try to land this thing. Go to the board and the CEO's succession plan. What have y'all done there to ensure some sort of untimely succession?  [00:24:35] Paul Maurer: So we're actually just starting that conversation like literally last Friday at the board meeting with kind of keyman questions. And we haven't done a lot there on the longer question of succession. I've started thinking about that. I'd like to stay longer. I don't really have an interest in retirement. Not at this point anyway. And today I'd love to go another decade or so. We'll see what happens. But I'm increasingly of the mind that the best succession plan is to bring one or more people onto your team who may have the potential and groom them.  Talk openly about succession and see what happens with the possibility that the CEO can actually play a central role in the recommendation of his or her successor. The way the church does this, and the way colleges and universities do this, in my experience the pastor and the president really play very little role at all. Either limited or none. And the more I've been thinking about this and talking to peers about this, the less that makes sense to me. And again, in a healthy situation, the board I think could and should rightly lean on and engage at a very deep level, the CEO of the college to say, what do you think? Who do you think we should hire? What are the core competencies? Can we get that person on board? And so, what I'd like to do in the years ahead is get two or three, maybe even four people on my cabinet who have the potential capacity for becoming a college president and see if we can't raise one of them up into the role as my successor. Whether that works or not, I can't predict that, but that to me seems like a wise model if you can do it healthfully.  [00:26:43] Tommy Thomas: What are you going to say if you get a call next week from either a friend or maybe someone you don't know that says Paul, I've been asked to serve on a nonprofit board. What kind of council are you giving somebody who's considering a nonprofit board service?  [00:27:00] Paul Maurer: It ought to be done with a significant measure of time, talent, and treasure. It ought to be a major commitment of yours if you're serving on lots of nonprofit boards. Unless you're willing to put this new one at a higher level of commitment than the others, maybe you shouldn't do it. I think that the best board members of nonprofits are vested. They've got skin in the game. They're giving of their time, their talent, and significantly of their treasure. The treasure's the hardest one, I think. We ask all of our trustees to commit to Montreat being a top three philanthropic priority prior to trusteeship. And that's a stumbling block for some people. But I think in the end, it also fosters the creation of a board that has skin in the game and that really is serious about the future of the institution. It's not a casual kind of volunteering. It's a serious kind of volunteering.  [00:28:13] Tommy Thomas: It has been great. Paul, this has been so much fun. Thank you for carving out an hour and a half of your time for me. I appreciate it. [00:28:20] Paul Maurer: Tommy, I've enjoyed it very much. You ask a lot of very good questions and I'm certain that your podcasts are of great value to those in leadership and those thinking about leadership. So, thank you. ++++++++++++++++++++++++ [00:28:32] Tommy Thomas (2): Next week, we're going to conclude the conversation that we started with Caryn Ryan and Episode 84. In that conversation, Caryn shared her leadership journey from BP/AMOCO to CFO for World Vision International to her current role as Founder and Managing Member of Missionwell.   In next week's episode, Caryn will be sharing lessons on nonprofit board governance that she's learned over the years.  [00:29:04] Caryn Ryan: There's a lot of financial literacy questions there. So how can you ask tough questions if you can't read the financial statements or financial reports and understand them? And sometimes there's issues with what's delivered to boards too, in terms of information, but sometimes it's just a basic lack of understanding. I think too, there's also a fundamental issue that sometimes with boards, they don't get enough board development or board training and they really just don't understand their key role when it comes to accountability. And so, they don't understand that it's their job to ask the tough questions. ++++++++++++++++   Links and Resources JobfitMatters Website Next Gen Nonprofit Leadership with Tommy Thomas Montreat College Website The Miracle at Montreat Montreat College Facebook Montreat College Instagram   Connect Tommy Thomas - tthomas@jobfitmatters.com Tommy's LinkedIn Profile Paul Maurer's LinkedIn Profile  

Andrea Kaufmann is World Vision's Director of Faith and External Engagement. She has worked in international development, humanitarian and advocacy work for two decades—serving in programme management, technical leadership, communications and relationship building roles. She convenes and supports a number of groups promoting the rights and flourishing of children—including the Faith Action for Children on the Move network as well as the Weekend of Prayer and Against Hunger group. She serves on the World Bank's Moral Imperative, the Board of Joint Learning Initiative for Faith and local communities and Arigatou International Advisory Group. She is passionate about the evidence-based role of faith and faith actors in development and humanitarian work and works to build cross-sector relationships to drive positive impact for children.   The social media handles of World Vision International are: Facebook, Twitter, Instagram and LinkedIn.   The songs picked by all our guests can be found via  our playlist #walktalklisten here.    Please let me/us know via our email innovationhub@cwsglobal.org what you think about this new series. We would love to hear from you.   Please like/follow our Walk Talk Listen podcast and follow mauricebloem on twitter and instagram.  Or check us out on our website 100mile.org.  We also encourage you to check out the special WTL series Enough for All about an organization called CWS.  The 11th 100 mile walk campaign will continue until the summer, find more info via de 100mile.org website. Or go straight to our fundraising page.

[00:00:00] Caryn Ryan: At the end of the day, sometimes it's the simplest questions and sticking with the simplest, high-level questions that matters for solving problems and creating transformation. Because I remember one of the first questions I asked the traders was, “Where did the oil go that you thought you were trading?” They didn't know where the oil had gone. And so, we spent a lot of time having to come back to that question and analyzing, digging through years of data and models that would go from trading models that went from the floor to the ceiling. But we always had to come back to that basic question, “Where did the oil go?” ++++++++++++++++++++++++ Our guest this week is Caryn Ryan, the founder and managing member of Missionwell.  Missionwell was formed out of the belief that nonprofit organizations should benefit from the same efficiency and expertise as the for-profit sector, despite the significant resource differences between the two sectors.  Caryn spent 20 years with Amoco Corporation and BP plc, and then later with the merged company BP / Amoco. She was recruited by World Vision International, where she served as their Chief Financial Officer. Caryn was an early champion for virtual and shared services models for the nonprofit sector. Let's pick up on my conversation.  [00:01:20] Tommy Thomas: Before we dive too deep into your professional career, let's go back to your childhood. I'm always curious about how people got their start. What's your happiest memory of your childhood?  [00:01:30] Caryn Ryan: That's an interesting question. I'm not sure I have a single happiest memory, but certainly one of my happiest memories is a trip to downtown Detroit. I lived just north of Detroit growing up, going shopping with my mom and my grandma and my sister and getting a new winter coat, and shopping at Sanders. Have you heard of Sanders?  [00:01:48] Tommy Thomas: No, we didn't have that in the south, I don't think.  [00:01:51] Caryn Ryan:   They're a local chocolatier near Detroit, and sometimes even out here on the west coast, you can find chocolate from them. But we had a hot fudge sunday after we went shopping. So, it's a wonderful memory.  [00:02:03] Tommy Thomas: Thinking back on that, what was the greatest gift you got from your parents?  [00:02:07] Caryn Ryan: My perseverance. My parents themselves came from families that didn't have much and so they had come through a kind of late depression era and they knew the value of a penny and they knew that to get ahead, you had to really persevere. And they passed that on to their kids.  [00:02:26] Tommy Thomas: What are people who don't know you always surprised to learn about? [00:02:30] Caryn Ryan: A lot of people meet me through my company Missionwell.  And they assume that I'm an accountant, and that I like the details, but I don't and I'm not. And over time as time goes on, usually they see that I'm more of an analyzer of leaders and situations and work and, a really pragmatic solution finder, a really persistent person looking for solutions. I'm an entrepreneur, although, who would have thought it?  And I'm a reasonable strategist. And those who are extra observant will probably also be able to tell that my work is my Christian mission in life.  [00:03:07] Tommy Thomas:   When you went to college how did you decide on your major?  [00:03:10] Caryn Ryan: Hey, I'm from Detroit.  It's the Motor City. And growing up in a rather poor family, I wanted security. So, I thought right away I'm going into business in some capacity. I didn't have any idea what aspect of business, so I double majored in economics and psychology for my undergrad and for my MBA. I added finance and information technology and some organization development and organizational behavior. So, it was all general business-oriented, but with a core of finance and HR-ish kinds of things. And that's pretty much been what I've stuck with throughout my entire career. It's always been something to do with business whether that's a non-profit business or a for-profit business, and something to do with that core of finance and HR, but then a whole bunch of things peripherally around that, that those can branch out into a whole lot of things. [00:04:02] Tommy Thomas: Thinking back to the first time you had a staff to report to you, what do you remember about that?  [00:04:08] Caryn Ryan:  That would've been in the Financial Analysis Department of Amoco production, that's part of the old, pre-BP, part of the oil and gas exploration production division. There. And I have to say, I was a mediocre boss at best. I didn't see the role as servant leadership initially. I really saw it as leading a production team to goals. And in addition,  I had a boss at the time who was a great example of how not to treat people. But as my time in that seat progressed I learned that every boss has to protect their people. They have to advocate for them, and they have to develop their staff. And these are the things that allow people to flourish. And to this day maybe just based on how tough that job was, one of my joys is mentoring young people and bringing them along. And going back to that bad boss, as the years have gone by, I've thought about that bad boss from time to time. And I think that people who don't treat other people well, usually have one or two things going on in their life. Tommy one, they either have really low self-esteem and they must assuage that by criticizing and tearing down other people. Or two, they're motivated by greed and power. Understanding that has helped me quickly diagnose, is this a person type A or is it a person type B when they're really behaving badly. And if it's an issue of self-esteem, there's a way you can work with people over time to just bring them up, help them feel better about themselves, and help them transform how they interact in the world.  And I think that's part of our job too. So, he taught me a lot.  [00:05:44] Tommy Thomas: We can learn from sometimes less-than-ideal circumstances that's for sure. In September of 2002, you were living in London, you have a senior-level finance position with BP, probably very well compensated, I would imagine. What happened to cause you to leave the private sector and take that CFO job with World Vision International?  [00:06:04] Caryn Ryan: It was really lovely working in London. I thought you might ask that question. I had my family with me and I bought and remodeled an old home in Hamstead for the family, and we had an amazing life with fun schools for the kids and lots of travel and adventures. But if I step back from that, go back about five years before I'd already started noticing in the late, mid to late 1990s before the merger of Amico and BP that something was missing in my life. And this feeling grew while I was in London. And until around the year 2000, I went to a choir practice at the American Church in London. And I saw a poster and it was for an Alpha class and I was convicted. I needed to go and talk to my pastor about it. And he tried to persuade me not to, and I said, no, I need it. I need it. And I went to this Alpha class. It was 10 weeks long, and these questions about faith just poured out of me. And I was talking about Doubting Thomas in the Bible. That was me. And I told God eventually that if he would speak to me plainly on two big life questions, I'd be his person forever. And he did, for better or for worse, he did. He spoke to me in the Holy Spirit that week of the Alpha class, and very clearly in very plain language, and advised me what I needed to do. And I have been his person ever since. Although I'll never be the type of Christian who believes easily, and definitely I was a late comer to having a really true deep belief. But it's a commitment and it's a promise. And entrances, interestingly, I left Amoco with BP at that time without a job about two years later. But shortly around that time when I took the Alpha class, BP very generously referred me to Nick Isbister, who you know.  And he is a consultant or coach who looks at motivated abilities. And during this time when I was wrestling with various issues including my career, I cannot tell you how much his SIMA profile meant to me. As I was really trying to decide whether to stay or leave BP, where was I going next? And it was really part of God's gift to me. He was part of God's gift to me. And to see my gifts laid out so beautifully and my motivated abilities laid out so clearly really helped me move forward. And it helped me take that step to give my notice to BP and really have the view of, God has a plan and I just want to see what adventures are out there next. And I've used his profile from time to time. I go back and read it and review it and just try to understand this is still me and, what do I need to pay attention to now?  And it's been amazing.  [00:08:37] Tommy Thomas: So did World Vision come looking for you, or did you go looking for them?  [00:08:41] Caryn Ryan:  After I left BP I made a matrix about 57 different things, and over the next few months I whittled away at those to try to figure out what I should do. And when I got it down to the top three, I was like I don't think being a CFO was the problem. I like that. I don't think I was in the right place in a for-profit. I think I need a nonprofit or a Christian organization. And I had one-third criteria also, but around that time that I'd just gotten that narrowed down, I got a call from somebody else who you know, which is Rob Stevens. And he said to me, are you interested in a CFO role with World Vision International? And I paused for a minute, and I said, is that a Christian organization that helps kids overseas? And he said yes. And I started thinking, isn't that amazing? This hits these top criteria that I've just spent months trying to get whittled down to. And I said, yes, I'm interested. And it went from there. So, he shepherded that process. And I did end up working at World Vision for over three years.  [00:09:49] Tommy Thomas: Was that in London?  [00:09:52] Caryn Ryan: No, that was actually World Vision, out here in California.  After I left BP, I moved back to the United States, to Chicago, and then that's when Rob connected with me, and then I ended up moving out here to California.  I love it here. And I'm staying here. I've been here ever since.  [00:10:11] Tommy Thomas: So, years ago, probably, I guess probably about the time, that you were doing that transition. I was doing some work for World Vision in Seattle, and I had the privilege of recruiting a guy named Atu Tandon from Citibank. And about six months after Atul started to work at World Vision he gave me a call.  He is an Indian fellow, so he had that clipped British Indian accent. And he says, Tommy, If we had this many meetings at Citibank, we wouldn't have had a bank. And he just was overwhelmed by the number of meetings at World Vision. My question to you is, what was the biggest surprise you had from leaving something like BP to going to the nonprofit world in World Vision in particular?  [00:10:58] Caryn Ryan: That Atul, he is so efficient. I can see where World Vision's style of just having so many meetings to build consensus would make him go crazy. But for me, when I went there, I mentioned earlier that although I've been a Christian nominally since my baptism as a baby in the Catholic Church. And spent a lot of my entire life going to church in my twenties and thirties.  I actually view my actual timing of becoming a truly committed Christian as the beginning of that Alpha class I talked about. That's when I intentionally said to God, I'm yours. But it was so late, it was in my early forties before Christianity meant more than just going to church on a Sunday and sending my kids to Sunday school programs or singing in the choir or volunteering at all these to do all these financial and HR tasks. So it was shortly after that commitment that I went to World Vision, and I have to say that I expected something different from the industrial sector that I had just spent 20 years working in. And it was a surprise to me that it was an organization of regular people with similar people issues to any for-profit I'd ever worked at. And I just had to go back and think, okay, wait a minute. Okay. The 12 Apostles were, for the most part, just really regular guys. But they were just called to be where they were. It's not that they were people who were outstanding in any way. In fact, they were ordinary people. And at World Vision, it was the same thing. It's just a strong sense of being people being called by God. But they're regular people and they have regular problems, and they're like all people. They're broken. And that was a surprise. I just felt like it was going to be something different, that I'd be working at some higher plane. But it was really a great lesson that people are people with all the usual awards and that Christians or we're all just in need of God's grace. +++++++++++++++++   [00:12:55] Tommy Thomas: Looking back over 20 years in the private sector, what was the greatest experience or lesson you learned there that you were able to take forward? Transformation emerges from tackling problems. [00:13:02] Caryn Ryan: I think it would have to be that transformation emerges from tackling problems. When I was in London, working at BP after the merger of Amoco at BP, my business unit experienced a very tiny little loss. Maybe 100-150 million - in one month. And it was just big enough to get the attention of the CEO of BP you know Sir John or Lord John Brown. And that was while I was serving as the CFO of BP's Global Oil Trading Operations. And I had to take responsibility for that loss. And for all of these financial calls that were actually outside of my direct reports, they were spread all the way across this huge global trading operation where oil and gas were just traded in and out day and night, and I had to dig into that loss. Why did we have that loss? Even with a lot of pushback from these genius traders, who said you wouldn't understand.  I had to find all the weak controls, diagnose some pretty complex issues, and bring in teams of people and experts to help. And we did. We brought in smart staff and great consultants, a new compliance officer, and it just really professionalized our services and made us stronger and really better as a result. So what I took away was that digging in and taking responsibility for that loss and working it through in detail, was really the start of a journey toward transformation. And so you can't look at a problem and think, oh my gosh, I'm doomed. Or, this is just a problem. That problem is probably going to be an opportunity for you. And I've seen this over and over. If you dig into a problem from that problem, if you work at it, you can get transformation and you can end up in a much better place than where you were. And even if people think you're wrong early on, and if you just need to persist through, get the job done, work through the problem, and then later you'll see as I did that it was transformative. And people tend to come around over time, even if it takes a long time, and they'll say, wow, it's really good that you did what you did and wow, we really saw some good things happen as a result of you and your team of people who came in to figure out why things went wrong. And I guess another thing that comes to mind here is that at the end of the day, sometimes it's the simplest questions and sticking with the simplest, high-level questions that matter for solving problems and creating transformation. Because I remember one of the first questions I asked the traders was,  Where did the oil go that you thought you were trading? They didn't know where the oil had gone. And so, we spent a lot of time having to come back to that question over and analyzing, digging through years of data and models that would go from trading models that went from the floor to the ceiling. But we always had to come back to that basic question, where did the oil go? And that really helped guide us through and get to the bottom of it. And by getting that simple question asked, everything changed about how we traded oil over the next few years. So that kind of led me also into thinking that re-engineering is important and that even now at Mission I go back to a lot of my re-engineering experiences and when we have a new church or a new ministry, or a new nonprofit that comes and works with us at Missionwell, we like to re-engineer, rethink, how do they do their work? What are the problems they're facing? Doing that and solving those problems even if we have to push through some barriers with our business partners, really helps us deliver high-quality services. And it gives them more time to focus on the mission and it can become a piece of their transformation. So, this idea of viewing problems as opportunities for transformation, I think is important for me and for our teams at Missionwell, and probably for more people, more than they think.  [00:17:00] Tommy Thomas:  So of all the work you've ever done, what's the most ambitious project you've tackled?  [00:17:07] Caryn Ryan: That project I just mentioned might have been one of them, that was very all-encompassing. But another one that comes to mind is at Amoco, and this was before I moved to London. We implemented SAP and SAP is an integrated end-to-end business and financial system. And it affected everybody on how they worked. Just everybody across the entire organization. At that time, I was working in the chemical sector of Amoco and what I did there is I just found a great leader to come in and take that job. I had an inside track just from the networking I had done, and I just knew somebody who had the skills to do this. And after she came, she helped the chemical sector, and our sector did better than most in terms of implementing this. It was happening across the entire corporation, and our sector did better than most. And when I was then transferred to another downstream sector the one that retails oil and gas and has some refineries, I brought her in there because they had so many problems that they couldn't even, this is for a huge Fortune 15 company. They couldn't close their books. They didn't know how they were doing in terms of trucking oil back and forth to refineries. Everything was not working. Nothing was working. And when she came in, just bringing in the right leader, just calming things down focusing on the right problems. There was so much that needed to get fixed. And she really just had the expertise to do it. So you really just have to bring in the right person. But it wasn't just her, it was the whole team. It was all the leaders. It was pretty much this commitment that we have to get in and solve this problem. Knowing it wasn't going to be easy, knowing that it was going to be messy and complicated, but it was such a high priority. You just, we all knew it was a top priority. And the team, because they understood that it was such an important priority. Everybody was involved, and this was hundreds of people, hundreds and hundreds of people. Everybody got involved and took their piece and parts and just worked on delivering it so we could get the business back up and running and get the books closed and make sure that the downstream operations were functioning with the information that they needed. [00:19:22] Tommy Thomas: With ambition I guess can come risk.  What's the biggest risk you ever took in business?  [00:19:27] Caryn Ryan: I might go more personal on the risk side.  Maybe one of the biggest risks I've taken with starting Missionwell.  While from a business perspective, the risk was not having enough capital or knowledge or understanding. I risked a lot of my own savings and my earnings potential. And I knew that if we failed, I was responsible for my staff losing their jobs and my business partners losing services that can be difficult to get filled. So I think that was a pretty big risk. And my SIMA profile, if you were to read it, says  I'm an overcomer and a maximizer in that I persist through obstacles. And all those things have been true. And I think if you go into a situation where you're taking risks and you understand what risks you're taking then you'll manage them and the rewards that you get are really incredible. It's been all the time at Mission Oil and our growth over the last few years has just been amazing. We recruit better and stronger people. We don't need as much capital now. And we just help so many organizations with great missions. Taking risks - you have to do it.  No pain, no gain.  Risk is the pain of managing it is significant, but the rewards are definitely worth it. ++++++++++++++++++++   [00:20:44] Tommy Thomas:  You mentioned hiring and building a staff. What's the main thing you're looking for in a senior person?  [00:20:50] Caryn Ryan: Right now, essentially our recruiting is guided by our values. I'm looking for a fit in terms of, is this a person who really believes that nonprofits and or religious organizations matter in the world? And if that box is checked, we can proceed. And then we ask, does this person value people? And do they know how to value people and how to motivate people? And then we'll ask relative to our partnering value, is this a person who can relate well to others? Is it a person who can help them? And they need to be able to pass that too. And then relative to principles, we're looking for character, good, really good character in people. So we are looking for people who can talk to us about character and when they've used aspects of the character to make decisions. And then finally we'll look at process and ask, is this a person who really knows how to look at, we're in the business of offering services, so they need to be able to look at work as a process and say, how can we make this better, faster, smoother work better for our business partners? And if they can hit all those and have the technical or functional expertise that we need, then chances are they're going to be a good fit.  [00:22:01] Tommy Thomas: Wow. So, what does the interview process look like for you? Say you spot somebody, and you think this looks good.  What does the interview process look like from start to finish? Is it a day, is it a week?  [00:22:12] Caryn Ryan: The interview process at my company starts out with our HR department. They do a variety of pre-checks, pre-screens, and then depending on the seniority of the person I might do up to three meetings with the person. And those are typically via Zoom because we're oftentimes hiring people to work remotely. Even now moving from our regular professional staff to the leadership level. We're looking to start moving more and more remote with that. So sometimes I don't even meet our staff or our senior people now in person. It's strictly via Zoom. So, we've learned how to form relationships. We've learned how to test and assess. We've learned how to talk to people on Zoom and make the connections that we need to make with them and do the assessments that we need to do. It helps that one of my HR staff is actually remote too, so she really deeply understands remote recruiting. And by the time a candidate comes to me, they've been pretty well vetted by my team. And I will dig in on the leadership qualities sometimes so that the questions that I'll ask are similar even to some of the questions you're asking me. Tell me about a time when you faced a big decision and how did you handle it? So, we're looking for not only the values match, but to some extent what are the leadership competencies that are going to be needed for that particular job. And asking them to come back with behavioral or observational data to us so that we can actually get a feel for how they actually operate day to day. We allow people a lot of time to ask us questions too. We're always constantly trying to stop and pause. It's not a one-way decision. We know that.  We also allow a whole lot of time to answer questions when we bring a person on. That's not the end. We know that a great orientation for the person is important. If they're going to be a fit, they need to be oriented really well. And we need to do a lot of check-ins with them early on to just be sure things are working okay for them. So, we view it a little bit holistically, you have great job descriptions posting appropriately doing the right amount of interviewing with people, and then making sure that they get settled in when they come. ++++++++++++++++++++++   [00:24:27] Tommy Thomas: I want to change gears a minute and say that if you were on a nonprofit version of a Shark Tank show and you had nonprofit organizations presenting their case to you, what are you going to have to know really well before you open up your checkbook? [00:24:46] Caryn Ryan: This is interesting, but really Tommy, I don't think it's any different for a non-profit, than it would be for a for-profit organization. So, you're always asking, do you have a good vision? And a really big and important question is, do you have the resources? And that's in terms of money but it's also in terms of the network of people to support you in making steps towards your vision and making things happen. And then do you have the drive? Do you feel called for this?  How do you demonstrate that? How do you demonstrate that you have the call and that you have the drive? Are you a persister? One thing that will happen for every new organization is just tons of obstacles and problems. They're nonstop. And so, you have to have that ability to persist and to say, look, I see this obstacle. Am I going to go over it, under it, or around it? But for sure I'm going to go around it or get through this. You need to have that kind of a foundational trait characteristic. I think the difference really between a for-profit and non-profit is where you get the money from. The Shark Tank for the for-profit might be from investors or a bank. Whereas the Shark Tank for a nonprofit might be from stakeholders, donors, and grantors. You've got to make sure that the business plan reflects that. But you still have to have the money and you still have to have the people. And the sense of call might be different too. I think if you're working in a for-profit, you may have a vision around some new product or service. In the nonprofit world, your call may be even more deeply embedded. Especially if it's a religious calling. It may be something that's very right-tied or connected to your faith, but it doesn't matter. It doesn't matter how deeply connected it is to your faith. If you don't have the same things that a for-profit needs, your chances of being successful fall. Now, God can always come in and intervene,  but if you're going to do your part in it you need the same things that a for-profit does. Our guest next week will be Jerry White. Jerry's a retired United States Air Force Major General, and a former International President of The Navigators. Earlier in his career, he worked in the startup days of NASA as a professor at the Air Force Academy. [00:27:23] Jerry White: We prayed and told the Air Force, send us anywhere you want. Just give me an engineering job somewhere. And with absolutely no hint from me or any input from anybody that I know, the Air Force sent me to Cape Canaveral in the New American Space Program. Tommy, I didn't even know what it was, and I became a mission controller, got right smack in the middle of all of the new stuff that the Air Force was doing. The manned flights, the Mercurys, the Geminis, Atlas, Titan, Polaris, you name it. And every conceivable kind of rocket. And in that, I got a new glimpse of the future.   Links and Resources JobfitMatters Website Next Gen Nonprofit Leadership with Tommy Thomas 2021 Distinguished Alumni Recipient Caryn Ryan, '79 Missonwell Website   Connect Tommy Thomas - tthomas@jobfitmatters.com Tommy's LinkedIn Profile Caryn Ryan's LinkedIn Profile  

[00:00:00] Lindy Black: I know in my own life having seen that the test is not when things are smooth. The test is when the road is bumpy and the water's choppy to really see what you're made of and how deeply you can dig to the place of learning to love as well as listen and respond with character and quality.  +++++++++++++++++++++++++ [00:00:22] Tommy Thomas: Today, we're continuing the conversation with Lindy Black of The Navigators that we started last week. In my research for the conversation with Lindy, I read about the impact that journaling has played in her life. Let's pick up the conversation there.  In my preparation for the conversation, you indicated to me that you practiced journaling. Yes. How did that get started?  [00:00:51] Lindy Black: When I was in college, a long time ago I was taught how to have a daily time with the Lord. You answered three basic questions. So what did I read? And what did the passage say? What did I learn from it and what did I want to do? Now it can be framed in all different ways, but those three questions and the encouragement took a whole year, and I had this lovely little book that had every day of the year, and so I, they said if you do this for a year, you will gain depth. In your relationship with God, you'll also begin to observe things, patterns you can go back through and read it and see what God was teaching you that year. That was a long time ago, but that was the seed of where I am today in journaling. Now, I do not journal every day. I don't record everything. I use my journal to hit highlights of something God has done. It's a place where I process things about our children, our grandchildren, or other people who, as I'm writing things out, I'm praying and I'm dialoguing with the Lord. Things become clearer. I also learned, I don't know the first person to tell me this, but they used a multicolored pen and their thoughts were always in black ink. But when a specific verse or a key insight that they felt was significant from the Lord, they would put that in red. So, when you flip back through your journal, it's pretty apparent when something very significant popped up. So, my journals are very much a place for recording progress. I generally put the hard things in my journal.  I don't know if that's good or bad, but I find that's a place, a safe place for me to process what's going on.  [00:03:02] Tommy Thomas:   When you're mentoring someone do you encourage them to journal? [00:03:06] Lindy Black: Sometimes. It depends on the scenario. Some people are averse to writing. It is not a place that brings blessing and joy and you have to find that out. I'm thinking of a woman in particular, she is such an external processor to have to sit and write is just brutal for her.  And so you don't want to put that on somebody who doesn't like it. The thing though that I do try to encourage all people that I engage with is by at least recording the high spots of what you're learning and you're hearing a theme all the way through this, the word Learn, Learning, Learner. You just can't remember, oftentimes those really spectacular moments when you had a breakthrough. You either have an insight into a person you're working with or supervising or an experience with one of your kids, an engagement with your spouse, or a team event that really, may have just gone horribly, but by writing it out, did those big things. Then you can go back. Someone encouraged me to read through my journal at the end of each year and see what themes were there and what I was, what was going on, and what I was learning. That has been a very valuable discipline for me because it, on the one hand, encourages me that I'm not the same. I've been growing, I've been becoming more of who God intended me to be. And it also lends to having concrete pieces, meaty pieces to share with others to encourage them on their journey.  [00:04:55] Tommy Thomas: In some of the material I read about you that at some point you got involved in Trueface Leadership Catalyst. And I wonder if there's a short story behind that, and then how has that impacted you as a leader?  [00:05:07] Lindy Black: We had what we called a mentoring intensive, and that was the first time I met Bill Thrall, one of the leaders at that time of Trueface Leadership Catalyst.  And I had also read The Ascent of a Leader, which is one of their books from, I guess it was written about 30 years ago now.  So, there were principles there that about you want to continue to grow in competence and character. If you only grow in character but not competence, you're going to be a truncated leader. If you grow in competence, but your character doesn't continue to make progress, you will implode. You absolutely will implode. So I'd read the book and then Bill Thrall was part of our mentoring intensive and there were some key things he introduced me to. And one of those was a definition of humility, trusting God and others with me. That definition right there changed my life. So, for me to walk in humility with God and others meant I entrusted, I trusted myself, who I was, my good, bad, and ugly. The whole thing was humility, particularly with God and then also with others. So, there were some jewels that began to change me both from that book as well as from those early meetings with Bill Thrall that went on to be a part of the High Trusts Leader course they offered and a number of other things. I did some teaching with Bruce McNichol and that has been a great privilege for me. And today I am two and a half years in of being a board member. And my greatest motivation there was to be able to give back to a ministry that has really meant a great deal to me.  +++++++++++++++++++++++++   [00:07:04] Tommy Thomas:  You stepped down at Christmas from your role on the national leadership team.  What's it been like so far, to let go of that and look toward this next season?  [00:07:15] Lindy Black: It's mostly been good, but there have been some harder things too. So, the good is that I have a whole new level of flexibility and freedom that I haven't for quite a while, and that is, I think I just have deep joy in that and not having to race out the door early most mornings to make it to a meeting. Just not having the volume of work to do brings that about. So that's been really good. I've found that we've been able to do a little bit more with our family. We have three married children and 12 grandchildren. Have some flexibility there. I also think just not getting up so early has been great. I'm averaging about an hour more of sleep, I think, than I have. That does wonders for the soul. That's the good part. And I'm having a few more different kinds of opportunities that are bringing a lot of blessing and satisfaction to my heart. That's some of the good, alright. The other part is, it's probably twofold. One is I really miss the intense and challenging dialogues. I mean that positively with my teammates. I miss that. I still, of course, can see them and have relationships, but it's just not quite the same. And there are days when I just really miss the team interaction, and I miss not having the consistent time I did with the individuals.  And most days I'm able to handle the fact that I'm not in the center anymore and I don't know everything going on. And being content to let go of that is largely okay, but sometimes there's that feeling of being left out and I'm not in the center where I've lived, especially for the last 13 years.  So mostly good and some hard.  [00:09:27] Tommy Thomas: Occasionally I do some speaking on succession planning, and I guess one of the things I've observed, and maybe this is more true for men as they begin to think about transition and next season, is that they don't realize how much of their identity is tied up in the job.  Did you face any of that?  [00:09:44] Lindy Black: I can't speak for all women, but my observation is that I've had a little easier time than some of the brothers in stepping out. I don't know if part of that is because my leadership opportunities came a bit later. Some of my real significant opportunities came after our kids were, they were graduating from high school and beginning the journey to college. That may be a factor there, I think.  I never thought I would've had the privilege to do what I'm doing, so I really feel like I'm the most blessed to be able to have had those opportunities.  And I just love, I love being home.  I love it. I don't even mind doing laundry and cooking. I actually enjoy all that. So, there's so much of my life that is still present and rich and growing. So, I love working.  I don't think I'm a workaholic, although I've bordered on that sometimes in the past. But I love being active and working, so I can still do that at this stage. And I don't feel that my identity was wrapped up in a career in the same way that some of the men that I'm working with have walked through that. ++++++++++++++++++++   [00:11:07] Tommy Thomas: That's encouraging.  I want to go to a section of the podcast that I always enjoy, and that's getting people to respond to some quotes.  I'm just going to go through some quotes and maybe you'll speak from experience or observation, but so the first one let's go. Dr. Martin Luther King said, “The ultimate measure of a person is not where they stand in moments of convenience, but where they stand in moments of challenge, moments of great crisis in controversy”. [00:11:36] Lindy Black: Wow. I That rings so true. And I know in my own life having seen that the test is not when things are smooth.  The test is when the road is bumpy and the water's choppy to really see what you're made of and how deeply you can dig to the place of learning to love as well as listen and respond with character and quality.  [00:12:04] Tommy Thomas:  Ben Zander, the Conductor of the Boston Philharmonic, said, “The conductor doesn't make a sound, the conductor's power depends on his ability to make other people powerful”. [00:12:17] Lindy Black: Wow. I love that. I love it. If I were to give you a little one-sentence job description, it's been to be able to see that happen with our children.  But also, with those I've worked with. [00:12:36] Tommy Thomas: Frederick Wilcox said, “Progress always involves risk. You can't steal second base and keep your foot on first.” [00:12:47] Lindy Black: Whoa. As I'm listening to that and I immediately went in my head, it's Lindy, where do you have your foot on first base, but you're wanting to be on second? [00:12:59] Tommy Thomas: President Eisenhower said, “In preparing for a battle, I've always found that plans are useless, but planning is indispensable”.  [00:13:08] Lindy Black: That pokes into, if you are not as a leader, willing to adjust, adapt, and move with new circumstances piling in, in other words, I'm going to work my plan no matter what. You are going to be one disappointed, frustrated leader, but having done your planning.  Wow. I love that one.  [00:13:30] Tommy Thomas: Here's one from Thomas Edison. “Genius is 1% inspiration, 99% perspiration.” [00:13:42] Lindy Black: Oh yes. I mean it building what is on your heart in your dream? Or a new idea. Oh, it is like privilege, but that 99% sweat and labor.  [00:14:01] Tommy Thomas: “When you're sitting around the table with your leadership team, you never want to be the smartest person at the table.”  [00:14:08] Lindy Black: I've never heard that before.  But see, that to me ties into this whole aspect of humility and also of drawing the best of each other, out of others.  [00:14:22] Tommy Thomas: Let's see here. So, here's one from a guy, Warren Benes. He was writing back when I was in graduate school, so this comes from days gone by. “Too many companies believe people are interchangeable. Truly gifted people never are. They have unique talents. Such people cannot be forced into roles they're not suited for, nor should they be. Effective leaders allow great people to do the work they were born to do.”  [00:14:55] Lindy Black: See I really agree with that. My question or challenge to that would come in that you have to do a variety of things, much of which you will not be great at before you can get to the place where you do know who you are, what you're made of, and where your strengths are. So, if you introduce that to someone who is 25 years old that may be difficult because they need some real-life experiences and leadership opportunities to understand what they're made of.  [00:15:26] Tommy Thomas: Booker T. Washington said, “ Success is to be measured not so much by the position one has reached in life, but by the obstacles he's overcome.” [00:15:35] Lindy Black:  Wow. I think sometimes it's hard to remember some of the obstacles, perhaps that one. Yeah, to be able to know and be able to give. Give great things. Have a heart of gratitude for those things.  [00:15:52] Tommy Thomas: So I'm not going to be able to pronounce this person's name. I know she was from France. Let's just leave it at that. “If you want to build a ship, don't drum up people to collect wood, and don't assign them tasks and work. Rather teach them to long for the endless immensity of the open sea.” [00:16:10] Lindy Black: Yeah. Keep focused on the vision as opposed to the nitty gritty detail.  [00:16:16] Tommy Thomas: “Many ideas grow better when transplanted into another mind than the one where they sprang up” from Oliver Wendell Holmes. [00:16:24] Lindy Black: I wonder what he was picturing when he said that. If he was Ricky recognizing the reality that sometimes people who can dream dreams may not be able to have the know-how to see it actually come to be.  [00:16:41] Tommy Thomas: That's where my mind went when I read that. Some people, yeah, they're dreamers, they're vision casters, they're vision setters.  That same notion, I think needs to be planted into minds as somebody that can execute.  [00:16:53] Lindy Black: That's interesting you say that Tommy because I feel like that describes where my best contribution has been, particularly these last 12 years because I've worked with some incredible visionary leaders. And so you have this incredible vision, this motivating, charismatic personality, and then you have people who are going to be the most impacted. But how do you bridge from the people who are in everyday life living out the vision to the grander of what they're presenting? You don't just need a detailed plan, but you need to know how to win hearts all the way along the way.  And I think that's something I've really enjoyed being able to do. [00:17:42] Tommy Thomas:   “The single biggest problem in communication is the illusion that it has taken place.” George Burns. [00:17:53] Lindy Black: I love that because you, because most people think, I said it, so therefore it's been communicated, and you have no idea what was heard. [00:18:04] Tommy Thomas: “No matter what job you have in life, your success will be determined 5% by your academic credentials, 15% by your professional experiences, and 80% by your communication skills.” [00:18:20] Lindy Black: Wow - I have not heard that one before, but that is very true. And understanding communication is always two-way.  It's never one way. [00:18:27] Tommy Thomas: Here's one from Peter Drucker. “The most important thing in communication is to hear what isn't being said.” [00:18:35] Lindy Black: Oh yeah. So how do we help people grow in that skill? I don't know. Do you think that can be learned or is it innate? What do you think?  [00:18:46] Tommy Thomas: I don't know. I guess I got to believe we can learn to become better listeners. But to hear something that's not being said, that's got to have a little bit of intuition. A group is a bunch of people in an elevator. A team is a bunch of people in the elevator, but the elevator is broken.  [00:19:09] Lindy Black: Because they have to be a team at that point. They can't just be their own people stuck together. [00:19:14] Tommy Thomas: Leadership is engaging other people to deliver desired results.  [00:19:19] Lindy Black:  And I think if it's only about you determining the desired results, it will be limited. But if it is the group deciding what the results need to be, it'll put you further down the road.  [00:19:33] Tommy Thomas: There's great power and authenticity. Oscar Wild said, “Be yourself. Everyone else has been taken”. St. Catherine of Sienna, put it this way. “Be who God meant you to be, and you'll set the world on fire.” So maybe think back and maybe get off the response and maybe get a little deeper here. Give me some things, some of the things that you've learned about authenticity over the years. [00:19:57] Lindy Black: There are two words that I think are significant here. One is transparency and one is vulnerability. I can be transparent and be very honest, but there's a glass wall up. So you can see who I am, that's a way to describe it. You see me, but you can have no connection or impact or voice with me. But vulnerability is being honest with others, an individual or others. But you give, but you're vulnerable. But as you're vulnerable, you actually open the way to engage with other people and not just, oh, you can see me, but you have no access or entrance into my mind, heart, or life. So, authenticity in and of itself means being real, but I think you can be real and transparent and alone and isolated, and you can be real and be vulnerable because you're opening up your heart to the influence of others. I think that's part of humility.  Can I go back to being authentic? I think you have to be careful not to entrust the deepest parts of yourself to people who will not handle that carefully. And that's probably been one of the things that I would say has been a hard place for me, and that is I so much enjoy knowing others and having them know me, having been hurt a couple of times with offering more of myself than what that person was able to hold. In kindness and love and carefulness, that's been, that's a hard one. You don't want to become jaded. You don't want to put a wall up. But you do have to learn to be wise in how much you share with different people.  ++++++++++++++++++++   [00:22:05] Tommy Thomas:   What do you understand today about your life that you didn't understand a year ago? [00:22:15] Lindy Black: I would say not at a level 10, but at a very middle of the road. I have learned that I really am dispensable. I am not indispensable. Other people can do things. They may not do things the way I would do them, but it doesn't mean they're not able to do things in a way that to carry. The function, having just stepped out of my role, that's a really big deal to me. So, I think I've been able to move from, I'm like, picture your hand clenched. I must do this. I know how to do this. I am super critical to the process, the future, whatever. And little by little, I've been able to feel my hand opening up over the course of this last year in a way that it doesn't go to the place where I am not valuable or needed or important, but being able to say I trust others carrying this baton forward and I can let go. And that's been probably, I would say it's on some days that's been a little harder than I would care to admit, but it has been.  [00:23:32] Tommy Thomas:   If you could go back in time, what would you tell a younger version of yourself?  [00:23:37] Lindy Black: I would say a couple of things.  First, failure is rarely fatal. That failure is a normal part of growing up and maturing. That's one thing I would've needed to, I wish I had heard that often, and maybe I did hear it, but I didn't receive it and I didn't believe it. I would say secondly,  learn to be kind to yourself. I've been driven in a variety of ways most of my life. And I've grown up in some ways being able to not take myself quite as seriously but learning to be kind to myself and taking care of myself. I would've benefited to have heard that more often in my younger years. I think I've learned to do that, but it has been, I feel a little later in life than I wish it had been. I'd say the other thing is because when God opens doors, say yes and walk through those. Don't hold back even if you have no idea where this open door is going to lead.  [00:24:48] Tommy Thomas: Thinking about younger women in leadership, Lindy, what are your observations there about the ways that we might can improve that as a society and as a culture? [00:24:59] Lindy Black: Yes. Great question. I feel my number one encouragement is to pay attention to the emerging women leaders in the span of your business or your organization. Most of them lack confidence in what they think they can bring. And some of that, it's a very interesting ambiguity that can go on. I think in women want to lead, they want to make a significant contribution, but they hold back or they're fearful. My number one encouragement is to pay attention to the emerging women leaders in the span of your business or your organization. And that could be for a number of different reasons, but it's that push-pull, and wise leaders, wise mentors and coaches will be able to pay attention and help emerging women leaders be able to understand more about themselves.  It is my experience that these emerging women leaders may need a bit more, I would call it a more defined pathway to run in. And you could really serve them by saying, this is what I would like for you to do. I believe you can do it, go after it. As opposed to just prove yourself and it is wide open. I would think emerging leaders need a bit more of a defined pathway. They also need a great deal of emerging women leaders of affirmation and feedback. I find that in general, women don't get as much of that in the workplace as perhaps their male counterparts and they need it, I'd say even more so keep those things in mind.  [00:26:43] Tommy Thomas:  Can that come from a male supervisor as well as a female supervisor?  [00:26:48] Lindy Black: Yes, definitely in my own life, most of the most significant influencers in terms of supervisors, they've been men. I don't even know, Tommy, in the last 20 years, I haven't had a supervisor that was a woman. And their paying attention to what I need to develop to bring the best contribution possible has been invaluable. And my observation is not many women have that in the workplace, especially in higher levels of executive leadership, there are just many more men in those roles than women. And so, I've had the incredible privilege of serving under several. So yes, absolutely, male supervisors can do that. Now, the best combination would be to have an excellent supervisor, be they male or female, but then also have a woman being able to walk alongside in a coaching, mentoring capacity. So both. What comes through to me is often insecure. I don't know my way; the world has completely changed the landscape for women in their jobs and careers. It's new. Women haven't walked in the place that the world is today. And I think that landscape, we're going to need to understand more and more how do we help women in their season that they find themselves. How are we going to meet them where they are and bring them the development they need because they're hungry to receive that training and development? ++++++++++++++++++++++++ You can see from these two conversations with Lindy, what a blessing she's been to The Navigators. I'm sure that the leadership there is glad that she will continue to walk along the side of their emerging leaders.  Our guest next week will be Caryn Ryan.  Caryn spent 20 years with Amoco Corporation and BP Plc.  And then later with the merged organization BP/Amoco. She held key finance positions in London, the Soviet Union, Chicago, and Houston. She was recruited by World Vision International, where she served as their Chief Financial Officer. She will be sharing her journey from BP/Amoco to World Vision to her current role as Founder and Managing Member of Missionwell. [00:29:16] Caryn Ryan: I was a mediocre boss at best.   I didn't see the role as servant leadership initially. I really saw it as leading a production team to goals. And in addition, I had a boss at the time who was a great example of how not to treat people. But as my time in that seat progressed, I learned that every boss has to protect their people. They must advocate for them, and they have to develop their staff. And these are the things that allow people to flourish. And to this day maybe just based on how tough that job was one of my joys is mentoring young people and bringing them along.    Links and Resources JobfitMatters Website Next Gen Nonprofit Leadership with Tommy Thomas The Navigators TrueFace - Lindy Black The Assent of a Leader   Connect Tommy Thomas - tthomas@jobfitmatters.com Tommy's LinkedIn Profile Lindy Black's LinkedIn Profile  

In this episode of the OX for GOOD Podcast, we're talking with Cam Watson, head of global brand, campaigns, and digital marketing for World Vision International. Cam was previously the Chief Marketing Officer at Alpha. He lives with his family in Oxfordshire. In this conversation, Cam talks about leveraging strategic and creative tools to evoke different kinds of emotion: joy, delight, and even anger. The goal, in all of this, is to turn apathy into action, as Cam says: "We need to inspire people out of feeling comfortable and grey and neutral about the topics; to actually inspire them to action.”   In particular, we explore a global project that Cam led across 30 markets: A World of Firsts. In that project, Cam and the World Vision team partnered with OX to tell stories of “firsts” of children in poverty — their first ride home from school, their first day with a belly full of food, and more. The campaign took a global audience into the magic of those moments, and allowed the World Vision team in each nation to customize the story to their locale. In hearing Cam's own story, we hear how the advent of the internet awakened him to a world of possibilities, and we explore how he is pushing his team to new technological frontiers.   Thanks for joining us on the OX for GOOD Podcast where we believe that world class creative shapes a better world. There's good our world needs you to do; we're here to help.  

Reward Sibanda teaches from Revelation 5:6-14 on creating circles of community as a reflection of God's creative design. Slides available at http://bit.ly/3JveJ3k  Reward is the Associate Pastor at UPPERROOM Church in Dallas, TX and the Senior Advisor for Church and Community Relations at World Vision International.

Dr. Chawkat Moucarry, an Arab Christian from Syria, developed a passion from a young age to build bridges of understanding between Christians and Muslims. His work with university student ministries, World Vision International, and Veritas Forum in France—where he lives and serves today—has all been focused on promoting interfaith dialogue built on relationship. Chawkat is the author of several books that explore these topics, including his most recent, "Islam on Trial: Globalization, Islamism, and Christianity." In part two of his conversation with Chris, they discuss Chawkat's new book, which provides non-Muslims with a foundation for understanding Muslim faith and practice, and highlights shared common ground between Christianity and Islam. They also touch on the nuanced religious landscape of France, where Chawkat lives and serves. To learn more about and purchase Dr. Chawkat Moucarry's newest book, "Islam on Trial," visit: langhamliterature.org/islam-on-trial

Dr. Chawkat Moucarry, an Arab Christian from Syria, developed a passion from a young age to build bridges of understanding between Christians and Muslims. His work with university student ministries, World Vision International, and Veritas Forum in France—where he lives and serves today—has all been focused on promoting interfaith dialogue built on relationship. Chawkat is the author of several books that explore these topics, including his most recent, "Islam on Trial: Globalization, Islamism, and Christianity." In part one of his conversation with Chris, he shares about growing up as a Christian in the Middle East, his compassionate approach to apologetics, and how his background spurred on his desire to seek mutual understanding and respect between Christians and Muslims. To learn more about and purchase Dr. Chawkat Moucarry's newest book, "Islam on Trial," visit: https://langhamliterature.org/islam-on-trial

Tony Rinaudo arrived in Africa optimistic that his tree-planting efforts would reverse the damages of deforestation and drought. His efforts failed abysmally, but one day he stumbled on a solution that had been right at his feet the whole time. His new methods have led to the regeneration of more than 200 million trees in Niger alone.Guest:Tony Rinaudo, author of "The Forest Underground: Hope for a Planet in Crisis" and Principal Climate Action Advisor for World Vision International

Name: Rev'd Dr. Lynn ArnoldCurrent title: Reader in Public Theology and Church HistoryCurrent organisation: SBC college AustraliaDr. Lynn Arnold AO was formerly a Member of the SA State Parliament, Cabinet Minister, and Premier. Subsequently, he has been Chief Executive Officer of Anglicare SA, after eleven years with World Vision International. In this role, Lynn is responsible for overseeing South Australia's largest non-government agency promoting ‘justice, respect, and fullness of life for all. Anglicare SA has over 1500 staff and 1000 volunteers with an annual budget of approximately $100 million and works in the areas of aged care, families, vulnerable people and communities, housing, and economic participation. Now an ordained Priest in the Anglican Church, Dr. Arnold ministers out of St Peter's Cathedral, with a special focus on ministry to the city of Adelaide and on encouraging dialogue on public issues from Christian perspectives.Lynn is the National Co-Chair for Anti-Poverty Week, a member of Anglicare Australia Council, Chair Trustees, Don Dunstan Foundation and one of three South Australian Reconciliation Ambassadors. Lynn holds a Ph.D., as well as a Bachelor of Arts and Bachelor of Education from the University of Adelaide. He also holds a diploma in Senior Company Administration from the Escuela Superior de la Alta Dirección de Empresas (ESADE) in Barcelona, Spain. In 2004, he was awarded the Order of Australia (AO) for his services to Australia through the South Australian Parliament as Premier, and internationally through development and humanitarian aid assistance. In 2001 he received the Centenary Medal for his services to the Australian community.Prior to his appointment at Anglicare SA, Lynn served as Senior Director (Board Development & Peer Review) for World Vision International. In that capacity, he was responsible for assisting fifty-four World Vision boards and advisory councils around the world. Prior to assuming that role in October 2006, Dr. Lynn Arnold had been World Vision's Regional Vice-President for Asia and the Pacific since 2003. In that role, he oversaw the implementation of more than 1,500 projects aimed at providing health care, education, clean water, food, shelter, and technical expertise to millions of people in Asia; this involved an annual budget of about $US250m in addition to the expenditure of the Asian Tsunami Relief program which also came under his responsibility (this latter program involving a total expenditure of over $US350m over the life of the program).Before taking on this role, Dr. Lynn Arnold had served for six and a half years as Chief Executive Officer of World Vision Australia. Under his leadership, World Vision Australia increased revenues by 126 percent and reduced operating cost ratios by fifty percent. During this time he also served on a number of professional boards including the Australian Foreign Minister's Aid Advisory Council, and the Australian Council for Overseas Aid (now ACFID).Before joining World Vision in 1997, Lynn Arnold served for 2½ years as an executive consultant with a large Spanish media company, helping to direct investment growth. Between 1979 and 1994 he served as a member of the South Australian Parliament including over 11 years in Cabinet. His service in government included ten years serving in a wide range of senior ministries (including Education, State Development, and Agriculture), he also served as Premier from 1992-1993.Lynn Arnold is married to Elaine and they have five children, including two sets of twins, and two grandchildren.Resources mentioned in this episode:Free Download of The Leadership Survival Guide (10 World-Class Leaders Reveal Their Secrets)https://store.consultclarity.org/lead...The Leadership Conversations Podcasthttps://open.spotify.com/show/4IB6V41...The Jonno White Leadership Podcasthttps://open.spotify.com/show/2p8rvWr...The Leadership Question of the Day Podcasthttps://open.spotify.com/show/6eZ4lZ2...Clarity Websitehttps://www.consultclarity.org/7 Questions on Leadership Serieshttps://www.consultclarity.org/large-...We'd Love To Interview YOU In Our 7 Questions On Leadership Series!https://www.consultclarity.org/7-ques...Subscribe To Clarity's Mailing Listhttps://www.consultclarity.org/subscribeJonno White's eBook Step Up or Step Outhttps://store.consultclarity.org/step...Jonno White's Book Step Up or Step Out (Amazon)https://www.amazon.com/Step-Up-Out-Di...

Welcome to the seventh episode of the Power Shift Edition podcast season, another beautiful collaboration between Danielle Strickland and World Vision. We are connecting with people at the intersection of power shifting around the world, including World Vision staff.  In this episode, Danielle interviews Reverend Christo Greyling. Christo is the Senior Director for Faith and External Engagement at World Vision International. God has been on a unique journey with Christo. In September 1987, Christo, a haemophiliac, tested positive for HIV. He publicly disclosed his status in 1992, while serving as a reverend in the Dutch Reformed Congregation of Windhoek-West in Namibia. His vision was to be a witness for Christ amid his situation while helping the church and others to respond to HIV with compassion and constructive action, which lead to the initiation of the Christian AIDS Bureau of Southern Africa. After he completed his Masters in Public Health, he joined World Vision and led the development of the Channels of Hope methodology which has catalysed nearly 600,000 faith leaders in 48 countries to respond to difficult development issues such as child protection, maternal and child health, HIV, gender and Ebola. He is passionate to walk alongside the church in their calling towards holistic ministry. In this Christo works towards meaningful partnerships and collaborate with Churches and faith actors to meaningfully contribute towards God's calling to ensure all children have life in all its fullness and can live in communities without violence. For more on all the things Danielle Strickland, go to daniellestrickland.comFor more information on Infinitum Life, go to infinitumlife.comFor more information on the Women Speakers Collective, go to womenspeakerscollective.comFor more information about Brave Global, go to braveglobal.orgCheck out these other collaborations with World Vision:Right Side Up course: Videos & activation guide from Season 1, on beatitudes:  https://www.worldvision.org/church/resources/rsu_curriculum Prayer Postures: https://www.worldvision.org/church/resources/prayerrhythms Soul Care for leaders: https://www.worldvision.org/church/resources/right-side-up-soul-care-with-danielle-strickland Resilient Leadership for Kingdom Come (pastor specific): https://www.worldvision.org/church/resources/resilient-leadership-for-kingdom-come Infinitum Prayer Days: https://infinitumlife.com/prayerday 

Welcome to the second episode of the Right Side Up Power Shift Edition season of the podcast. Another beautiful collaboration with World Vision and Danielle Strickland with their workers from around the world. We are also connecting with people who are at the intersection of power shifting around the world.  In this episode, Danielle is interviewing Andrew Morley the president and chief executive officer of World Vision International.Andrew Morley became President of World Vision International in early 2019, having been Chief Administrative Officer and Chief Collaboration Officer since January 2016.He joined World Vision after leading and building successful international organizations. He has worked for brands such as Google Mobility Motorola Mobile, Sky Television, Harrods Group and Ford Motor Company and was the CEO of Clear Channel UK. Andrew is married to Vanessa and they have two teenage children, Lewis and James.Andrew has BA Honours degrees in Marketing and Theology. He is a member of a long-distance cycling team and enjoys running. Follow Andrew on Twitter @andrewmorley0"I know the importance of our mission, and the more I witness our global impact, the prouder I am of our approach to development and relief."For more on all the things Danielle Strickland, go to daniellestrickland.comFor more information on Infinitum Life, go to infinitumlife.comCheck out these other collaborations with World Vision:Right Side Up course: Videos & activation guide from Season 1, on beatitudes:  https://www.worldvision.org/church/resources/rsu_curriculum Prayer Postures: https://www.worldvision.org/church/resources/prayerrhythms Soul Care for leaders: https://www.worldvision.org/church/resources/right-side-up-soul-care-with-danielle-strickland Resilient Leadership for Kingdom Come (pastor specific): https://www.worldvision.org/church/resources/resilient-leadership-for-kingdom-come Infinitum Prayer Days: https://infinitumlife.com/prayerday 

Sign up for She Leads Church '22 Virtual Conference for freeMimi Haddad serves as president and CEO of CBE International and as an adjunct associate professor of historical theology at Fuller Theological Seminary. She is a graduate of the University of Colorado and Gordon-Conwell Theological Seminary (Summa Cum Laude). She holds a PhD in historical theology from the University of Durham, England. Haddad received an Honorary Doctorate of Divinity from Palmer Theological Seminary of Eastern University 2013. She is serves in leadership with Evangelicals for Justice and is a founding member of the Evangelicals and Women Study Group at the Evangelical Theological Society. Mimi is an award-winning author and has written more than one hundred academic, popular, and blog articles. She has also contributed to over fifteen books, most recently: “Helping the Church Understand Biblical Gender Equality,” “History Matters: Evangelicals and Women,” and “Human Flourishing: Global Perspectives,” in Discovering Biblical Equality: Complementarity Without Hierarchy (IVP, third edition forthcoming); “Ideas Have Consequences,” in Created to Thrive (CBE International, 2021); “Examples of Women's Leadership in the Old Testament and Church History” in Women in Pentecostal and Charismatic Ministry, part of the Global Pentecostal and Charismatic Studies Series 21 (Brill NV, 2016); Is Women's Equality a Biblical Ideal? with Sean Callaghan (second edition coming in 2021). Haddad has been also published in journals, magazines and blogs, including Ashland Theological Journal, The Campbellsville Review, Catalyst, Christian Ethics Today, Christianity Today, Evangelical Fellowship of India, Evangelical Fellowship of India Commission on Relief, Sojourners, William Carey Development Journal, Missio Alliance, Her.meneutics, Mutuality, and Priscilla Papers.Mimi has taught for colleges and seminaries around the world. She has served as a gender and theology consultant with World Relief, World Vision International, and SASA! Faith Beyond Borders. Haddad served as convener of the Issue Group 24 for the 2004 Lausanne III Committee for World Evangelization. Mimi writes, teaches, and speaks on matters related to development, justice, faith and gender. Mimi and her husband, Dale, live in the Twin Cities (Minnesota) and are involved in local ministries.Mimi is co-host of CBE International's Mutuality Matters podcast segment, “Global Impact: Egalitarian Activism and Human Flourishing.” Upcoming Speaking EngagementsRequest Mimi to Speak/EndorseCBE-Published Resources by Mimi HaddadNon CBE Resources by Mimi HaddadThe A World of Difference Podcast is brought to you in partnership with Missio Alliance.Stay In Touch: Connect on Facebook and Instagram with thoughts, questions, and feedback. Rate, review and share this podcast with anyone that would love to listen.   Find Us Online: @aworldof.difference on Instagram and A World of Difference on Facebook, on Twitter at @loriadbr & on Clubhouse @loriadbr.https://linktr.ee/aworldofdifference or loriadamsbrown.comInterested in one-on-one or group coaching on how to live a life that makes a difference? Check out: https://www.loriadamsbrown.com/coachingDid you know that podcasts are a great way to grow your personal and business brand voice?Here's the secret, we all want to feel connected to brands we buy from. What better way to humanize a brand than through sharing your story on a podcast.Kitcaster is a podcast booking agency that specializes in developing real human connections through podcast appearances.If you are an expert in your field, have a unique story to share, or an interesting point of view-- it's time to explore the world of podcasting with Kitcaster.You can expect a completely customized concierge service from our staff of communication experts. Kitcaster is your secret weapon in podcasting for business. Your audience is waiting to hear from you.Go to https://kitcaster.com/difference/ to apply for a special offer for friends of this podcast.Mentioned in this episode:Do you want to go deeper?Join us in Difference Makers, a community where we watch and discuss exclusive content that truly makes a difference. Give us $5 a month (the price of a latte), and join in on the conversation with our host Lori and others who want to make a difference. We'd love to have you join us!PatreonJoin Difference MakersJoin us in our membership community for exclusive content for only $5/month at https://www.patreon.com/aworldofdifference. We go deeper with each guest, and it makes such a difference.PatreonThis podcast uses the following third-party services for analysis: Chartable - https://chartable.com/privacyPodtrac - https://analytics.podtrac.com/privacy-policy-gdrp

https://www.sheleadschurch.com/she-leads-church-22?ref=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.sheleadschurch.com%2Fa%2F2147504181%2FDH8PbUnB (Sign up for She Leads Church '22 Virtual Conference) for free Mimi Haddad serves as president and CEO of https://www.cbeinternational.org (CBE International )and as an adjunct associate professor of historical theology at Fuller Theological Seminary. She is a graduate of the University of Colorado and Gordon-Conwell Theological Seminary (Summa Cum Laude). She holds a PhD in historical theology from the University of Durham, England. Haddad received an Honorary Doctorate of Divinity from Palmer Theological Seminary of Eastern University 2013. She is serves in leadership with Evangelicals for Justice and is a founding member of the Evangelicals and Women Study Group at the Evangelical Theological Society.  Mimi is an award-winning author and has written more than one hundred academic, popular, and blog articles. She has also contributed to over fifteen books, most recently: “Helping the Church Understand Biblical Gender Equality,” “History Matters: Evangelicals and Women,” and “Human Flourishing: Global Perspectives,” in https://cbeinternational.christianbook.com/discovering-biblical-equality-complementarity-without-hierarchy/9780830828340/pd/828346?event=ESRCG (Discovering Biblical Equality: Complementarity Without Hierarchy) (IVP, third edition forthcoming); “Ideas Have Consequences,” in Created to Thrive (CBE International, 2021); “Examples of Women's Leadership in the Old Testament and Church History” in https://www.amazon.com/Pentecostal-Charismatic-Ministry-Global-Studies/dp/9004332529 (Women in Pentecostal and Charismatic Ministry), part of the Global Pentecostal and Charismatic Studies Series 21 (Brill NV, 2016); https://cbeinternational.christianbook.com/womens-equality-biblical-ideal-part-series/9781939971944/pd/971946?event=ESRCG (Is Women's Equality a Biblical Ideal?) with Sean Callaghan (second edition coming in 2021). Haddad has been also published in journals, magazines and blogs, including Ashland Theological Journal, The Campbellsville Review, Catalyst, Christian Ethics Today, Christianity Today, Evangelical Fellowship of India, Evangelical Fellowship of India Commission on Relief, Sojourners, William Carey Development Journal, Missio Alliance, Her.meneutics, Mutuality, and Priscilla Papers. Mimi has taught for colleges and seminaries around the world. She has served as a gender and theology consultant with World Relief, World Vision International, and SASA! Faith Beyond Borders. Haddad served as convener of the Issue Group 24 for the 2004 Lausanne III Committee for World Evangelization. Mimi writes, teaches, and speaks on matters related to development, justice, faith and gender. Mimi and her husband, Dale, live in the Twin Cities (Minnesota) and are involved in local ministries. Mimi is co-host of CBE International's https://www.cbeinternational.org/library?f%5B0%5D=topic%3A263 (Mutuality Matters) podcast segment, “Global Impact: Egalitarian Activism and Human Flourishing.”  https://www.cbeinternational.org/persons/mimi-haddad#block-authorupcomingspeakingfilter (Upcoming Speaking Engagements)https://www.cbeinternational.org/persons/mimi-haddad#block-requestmimitospeakendorse (Request Mimi to Speak/Endorse)https://www.cbeinternational.org/persons/mimi-haddad#block-authorresourcesfilters (CBE-Published Resources by Mimi Haddad)https://www.cbeinternational.org/persons/mimi-haddad#block-authornoncberesourcesfilters (Non CBE Resources by Mimi Haddad)The A World of Difference Podcast is brought to you in partnership with https://www.missioalliance.org/ (Missio Alliance). Stay In Touch: Connect on Facebook and Instagram with thoughts, questions, and feedback. Rate, review and share this podcast...

Is it fair for development agencies to make vulnerable communities dependent on them for help? This has been the pattern for some organisations for many years. Slowly but surely we are beginning to have a different conversation about development. In this conversation with Gertrude Kabwazi we discuss: Integrating Indigenous knowledge as a baseline for service delivery Addressing the roots of poverty Deliberately celebrating the wins and gains Gertrude Kabwazi has been promoted to Executive Director of Yamba Malawi, bringing more than 27 years of experience as a development practitioner and social justice activist to the role. Her expertise in working with both local and international organisations uniquely positions her to lead the organisation, develop community-focused interventions and activities and serve thousands of children each year. Prior to joining Yamba Malawi in 2019, she worked at Advancing Girls Education in Africa, World Vision International, and Concern Universal, among others. Quotes: "The first primary care giver is the parent" "Poverty is a pandemic" "Even when the gains are being made, sometimes people don't want to talk about the gains. We love to talk about the losses more" "Poverty is highly politicised" "Communities must see the progress they are making"   Connect with Gertrude: Instagram: @yambamalawi LinkedIn: Gertrude Kabwazi   KNOW your Roots, Grow your Purpose   LINKS: Message Africana Woman with Chulu on WhatsApp. https://wa.me/message/E3N7TH7RZSS4P1 +260978470395   Website: https://www.africanawoman.com/    Socials:  Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/chulu_bydesign/  Facebook:https://www.facebook.com/africanawoman    Join the Africana Woman Visionaries: https://www.facebook.com/groups/africanawomanvisionaries    Africana Woman Blog: https://www.africanawoman.com/blog

Welcome to The Nonlinear Library, where we use Text-to-Speech software to convert the best writing from the Rationalist and EA communities into audio. This is: Introducing Animal Empathy Philippines, published by Ging Geronimo on January 25, 2022 on The Effective Altruism Forum. Hi, everyone! I am excited to announce the launch of Animal Empathy Philippines (AEP), a spin-off organization of Effective Altruism Philippines. We are a new organization dedicated to community building work on effective animal advocacy (EAA) in the Philippines. Grant from the EA Animal Welfare Fund As EA Philippines' incubatee, AEP is supported by a $64,000 grant from the EA Animal Welfare Fund. Last December, three of us at EA Philippines (Kate Lupango, Janaisa Baril, and I) received a 1-year, 1.53 FTE grant from them to do community building work on EAA in the Philippines. The grant is split into the following: 0.73 FTE for me 0.4 FTE for Kate Lupango 0.4 FTE for Janai Baril Shifting to An Animal Advocacy Career I (Ging Geronimo) learned about EA after joining EA Philippines' 9-week Intro to EA Discussion Group held last May to July 2020. I took the Giving What We Can Pledge and started volunteering for 5-6 hours/ week at EA Philippines in December 2020. Prior to launching AEP, I worked for five years at the National Economic and Development Authority, the Philippines' socioeconomic planning body, as a Communications and Stakeholder Engagement Associate. Since September 2021, I've been engaged as a Consultant for the World Bank's Technical Assistance project to the Department of Agriculture. Kate Lupango is one of the co-founders of EA Philippines. She's a Funding Accountant at World Vision International and taking Master's in Community Development at University of the Philippines Diliman. Kate was a former intern at Faunalytics and has over four years of experience in farmed animal advocacy. Janaisa Baril is a Communication and Events Volunteer at EA Philippines. She has helped with EA PH's Local Charity Effectiveness Research, social media content, and monthly newsletters. Janai attended our 9-week Intro to Effective Animal Advocacy Fellowship, which motivated her to take action for farmed animals. She has a degree in Development Communication from University of the Philippines Los Baños. Why work on Farm Animal Welfare in the Philippines? The Philippines ranks 10th worldwide in terms of total farm animals alive, most of which are finfish and chickens, and yet there's relatively very little work being done on farmed animal welfare. As of December 2021, there are only four organizations working on farmed animal welfare (FAW) in the Philippines. These include the Philippine Welfare Society (PAWS), Animal Kingdom Foundation (AKF), Fish Welfare Initiative (FWI), and Tambuyog Development Center.PAWS has been at the forefront of animal advocacy in the Philippines. They recently introduced a set of standards called The Better Chicken Option to educate local restaurants and consumers on better broiler chicken welfare. We've had meetings with PAWS, AKF, and FWI and we learned that the lack of high-quality candidates for jobs was the biggest bottleneck for establishing new programs or scale-up of those existing ones. Thus, it was clear to us that doing community building work on EAA is how we can make the greatest positive impact on farmed animals. Focusing on community building will enable us to multiply our impact by increasing the number of Filipinos who will take action for farmed animals. Why we launched and what our goals are Animal Empathy Philippines was conceived after EA Philippines conducted its first EAA fellowship last year. We thought that building a community of effective animal advocates would spark Filipinos' interest in farmed animal advocacy. Through AEP, we aim to: Build, grow, and sustain a community of effective animal advocates; Expand talent pool in EA-aligned animal welfare organizations; and Kick-start a coalition of local farm...

This episode is the conversation with Pete Howard, Leadership Consultant with Christian Relief, Development and Advocacy organization hosted by Dr. Subodh Kumar, Chief Data Officer with World Vision International. This conversation touches upon the three theological virtues of Beauty, Goodness and Truth and its importance to Christian Relief, Development and Advocacy organization. In this broken world, through our M&E work we are witness through our relationships and work of God's beauty, goodness and truth.

God has a Radical Abundance of Vision for you and me. How do we find it? Start by learning to be available in the small moments of life. Global leadership development coach, David Lutes, shares his experience working with some of the largest corporations in the world to help them find and execute their corporate vision. We'll explore how God's truths revealed in scripture are equally relevant and effective in business, the church, and the family.Guest bio:David Lutes is an American-British dual national and an ‘ordained' minister/pastor (Church of the Province, South Africa/C of England UK, Vineyard Fellowship, South Africa) and recent ‘lay' co-pastor in Dubai, former school chaplain, coach and manager in the US, South Africa and UK – and Christian – for over 50 years. He is a former semi-pro baseball player in South Africa in the early ‘70s, former adviser to NATO on military down-sizing and re-skilling of 100k officers and family members in the post-Soviet Union (5 countries) – as well as an adviser to several former Soviet governments and training institutes on leadership transformation. He is a former Global Program Director for MA-level development of leaders from 45 countries with the Christian Charity and Humanitarian Agency, World Vision International. He is now an Organizational Development, Talent Management and Training, Consultant, Master Trainer and Executive Coach and well-known conference speaker and more than 30 years international experience in 30+ countries at a senior strategic executive, middle management, and operational level with several global Fortune 100/250/500 companies. An author and conference presenter, He shares widely on business ethics and values combined with Biblical insights to help Christian leaders and managers professionally, effectively, and authentically honor and serve God in the workplace. David is the husband of Olena; father to Dara, Stuart, Olga and Michael. Presenter and Executive Coach Presenter and Coach for ‘Know Yourself, Be Yourself, Become Your Calling' – 2½-day retreat or public presentation for those seeking God's direction in their lives and careersPresenter: ‘God'Stalking' and ‘Word in Deed! So, What's Your Story?' – companion public motivational talks and workshops'Shaloming Leadership' – the calling and responsibility of managers and leaders to have ‘wholeness in work and life' as their priority Writer/Author Contributing Author to ‘Your Dose of Motivation – Become Who You Are – Discover the Authentic You' (Amazon)Author of ‘The Authentic Christian Manager' – A Straight-from-the-Shoulder Daily Devotional for Christian Managers and Leaders Who Seek to Serve and Honor God in the Workplace –www.authenticchristianmanager.comWorkshop – ‘Prayin'Stormin' – Finding God's Purpose and Direction for Crucial Business and Church DecisionsSupport the show (https://www.patreon.com/radicalabundance)

Dr. Mimi Haddad serves as president and CEO of CBE International and as an adjunct associate professor of historical theology at Fuller Theological Seminary. She is a graduate of the University of Colorado and Gordon-Conwell Theological Seminary (Summa Cum Laude). She holds a PhD in historical theology from the University of Durham, England. Haddad received an Honorary Doctorate of Divinity from Palmer Theological Seminary of Eastern University 2013. She is serves in leadership with Evangelicals for Justice and is a founding member of the Evangelicals and Women Study Group at the Evangelical Theological Society. Mimi is an award-winning author and has written more than one hundred academic, popular, and blog articles. She has also contributed to over fifteen books, most recently: “Helping the Church Understand Biblical Gender Equality,” “History Matters: Evangelicals and Women,” and “Human Flourishing: Global Perspectives,” in Discovering Biblical Equality: Complementarity Without Hierarchy (IVP, third edition forthcoming); “Ideas Have Consequences,” in Created to Thrive (CBE International, 2021); “Examples of Women's Leadership in the Old Testament and Church History” in Women in Pentecostal and Charismatic Ministry, part of the Global Pentecostal and Charismatic Studies Series 21 (Brill NV, 2016); Is Gender Equality a Biblical Ideal? with Sean Callaghan (second edition coming in 2021). Haddad has been also published in journals, magazines and blogs, including Ashland Theological Journal, The Campbellsville Review, Catalyst, Christian Ethics Today, Christianity Today, Evangelical Fellowship of India, Evangelical Fellowship of India Commission on Relief, Sojourners, William Carey Development Journal, Missio Alliance, Her.meneutics, Mutuality, and Priscilla Papers.Mimi has taught for colleges and seminaries around the world. She has served as a gender and theology consultant with World Relief, World Vision International, and SASA! Faith Beyond Borders. Haddad served as convener of the Issue Group 24 for the 2004 Lausanne III Committee for World Evangelization. Mimi writes, teaches, and speaks on matters related to development, justice, faith and gender. Mimi and her husband, Dale, live in the Twin Cities (Minnesota) and are involved in local ministries.Upcoming Speaking EngagementsRequest Mimi to Speak/EndorseCBE-Published Resources by Mimi HaddadNon CBE Resources by Mimi HaddadStay In Touch: Connect on Facebook and Instagram with thoughts, questions, and feedback. Rate, review and share this podcast with anyone that would love to listen.  On Clubhouse @loriadbr. Find Us Online: @aworldof.difference on Instagram and A World of Difference on Facebook on Twitter at @loriadbr https://linktr.ee/aworldofdifference or loriadamsbrown.comInterested in life coaching? Check out: https://www.loriadamsbrown.com/coachingIf you are facing some big decisions, here is a pro tip that helps.Mentioned in this episode:Join Difference MakersJoin us in our membership community for exclusive content for only $5/month at https://www.patreon.com/aworldofdifference. We go deeper with each guest, and it makes such a difference.PatreonDo you want to go deeper?Join us in Difference Makers, a community where we watch and discuss exclusive content that truly makes a difference. Give us $5 a month (the price of a latte), and join in on the conversation with our host Lori and others who want to make a difference. We'd love to have you join us!PatreonThis podcast uses the following third-party services for analysis: Chartable - https://chartable.com/privacyPodtrac - https://analytics.podtrac.com/privacy-policy-gdrp

Dr. Mimi Haddad serves as president and CEO of https://www.cbeinternational.org/?gclid=CjwKCAjw3_KIBhA2EiwAaAAlimrmgZsvxcB2_gyg7S93CJgDqrwFdsIUrVOG8nTvwKyHo3xVo5JrQBoCOi4QAvD_BwE (CBE International )and as an adjunct associate professor of historical theology at Fuller Theological Seminary. She is a graduate of the University of Colorado and Gordon-Conwell Theological Seminary (Summa Cum Laude). She holds a PhD in historical theology from the University of Durham, England. Haddad received an Honorary Doctorate of Divinity from Palmer Theological Seminary of Eastern University 2013. She is serves in leadership with http://www.evangelicals4justice.org/ (Evangelicals for Justice) and is a founding member of the Evangelicals and Women Study Group at the https://www.etsjets.org/ (Evangelical Theological Society).  Mimi is an award-winning author and has written more than one hundred academic, popular, and blog articles. She has also contributed to over fifteen books, most recently: “Helping the Church Understand Biblical Gender Equality,” “History Matters: Evangelicals and Women,” and “Human Flourishing: Global Perspectives,” in https://cbeinternational.christianbook.com/discovering-biblical-equality-complementarity-without-hierarchy/9780830828340/pd/828346?event=ESRCG (Discovering Biblical Equality: Complementarity Without Hierarchy) (IVP, third edition forthcoming); “Ideas Have Consequences,” in Created to Thrive (CBE International, 2021); “Examples of Women's Leadership in the Old Testament and Church History” in https://www.amazon.com/Pentecostal-Charismatic-Ministry-Global-Studies/dp/9004332529 (Women in Pentecostal and Charismatic Ministry), part of the Global Pentecostal and Charismatic Studies Series 21 (Brill NV, 2016); https://cbeinternational.christianbook.com/is-gender-equality-a-biblical-ideal/mimi-haddad/9781939971265/pd/971265 (Is Gender Equality a Biblical Ideal?) with Sean Callaghan (second edition coming in 2021). Haddad has been also published in journals, magazines and blogs, including Ashland Theological Journal, The Campbellsville Review, Catalyst, Christian Ethics Today, Christianity Today, Evangelical Fellowship of India, Evangelical Fellowship of India Commission on Relief, Sojourners, William Carey Development Journal, Missio Alliance, Her.meneutics, Mutuality, and Priscilla Papers. Mimi has taught for colleges and seminaries around the world. She has served as a gender and theology consultant with World Relief, World Vision International, and SASA! Faith Beyond Borders. Haddad served as convener of the Issue Group 24 for the 2004 Lausanne III Committee for World Evangelization. Mimi writes, teaches, and speaks on matters related to development, justice, faith and gender. Mimi and her husband, Dale, live in the Twin Cities (Minnesota) and are involved in local ministries. https://www.cbeinternational.org/persons/mimi-haddad#block-authorupcomingspeakingfilter (Upcoming Speaking Engagements)https://www.cbeinternational.org/persons/mimi-haddad#block-requestmimitospeakendorse (Request Mimi to Speak/Endorse)https://www.cbeinternational.org/persons/mimi-haddad#block-authorresourcesfilters (CBE-Published Resources by Mimi Haddad)https://www.cbeinternational.org/persons/mimi-haddad#block-authornoncberesourcesfilters (Non CBE Resources by Mimi Haddad) Stay In Touch: Connect on Facebook and Instagram with thoughts, questions, and feedback. Rate, review and share this podcast with anyone that would love to listen.  On Clubhouse https://www.joinclubhouse.com/@loriadbr (@loriadbr). Find Us Online: https://www.instagram.com/aworldof.difference/ (@aworldof.difference) on Instagram and https://www.facebook.com/A-World-of-Difference-613933132591673/ (A World of Difference) on Facebook on Twitter at https://twitter.com/loriadbr...