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In this episode of The Pro Audio Suite, brought to you by Tribooth and Austrian Audio, we dive deep into a fascinating discussion about microphones, mixing secrets, and the unexpected virtues of parallel processing in audio production. AP shares a surprising discovery he made with the Austrian AUdio OC 18 and his SSL2 interface, demonstrating how versatile equipment can mimic much pricier setups. The gang also discusses trends in vocal processing, the move away from flat-sounding mics, and the latest hot trends, from hot chicken to air fryers. Robbo ventures into the realms of advanced compression techniques, exploring how parallel compression (a mixing technique used widely in music circles) can add some punch to your voice recordings. Whether you're a newbie or a seasoned pro, this episode is packed with insights and laughs, offering valuable tips and tricks that could transform your next audio project. Key Highlights: Robbo's mic discovery and its impact on sound quality. Deep dive into parallel processing and its uses beyond drums. Advanced compression tactics and settings for optimal sound manipulation. See Robbo's Parallel VO Compression Examples here: https://theproaudiosuite.com/season-7-bonus-content#episode-17 A big shout out to our sponsors, Austrian Audio and Tri Booth. Both these companies are providers of QUALITY Audio Gear (we wouldn't partner with them unless they were), so please, if you're in the market for some new kit, do us a solid and check out their products, and be sure to tell em "Robbo, George, Robert, and AP sent you"... As a part of their generous support of our show, Tri Booth is offering $200 off a brand-new booth when you use the code TRIPAP200. So get onto their website now and secure your new booth... https://tribooth.com/ And if you're in the market for a new Mic or killer pair of headphones, check out Austrian Audio. 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Today we're going to be talking about, well, a few tips that we've learned over the years. probably should kick this off because I, uh, had a, made a discovery, [00:01:00] um, this week. Because I had a session, it was actually late last week, come to think of it. But it was a session I was doing with, uh, in the morning. And in the afternoon, as I just shut down the studio, I got an email saying, Oh, can you redo this line? And I thought, well, I can't be bothered firing it up again. So what I'll do is I'll use my laptop. through the SSL to out of the booth because I've got a mic in there that goes through there straight to the laptop. Yeah, firing everything up. And I've actually set it up with the 4k button switched in. So which mic is this again? The OC 18 OC 18. Okay. Got it. Yeah. So, I sent the file off and then I got the reply of the email saying, if you changed your, if you change your settings or something and uh because if you have, I like it better. Can you continue using whatever you're using now? Okay. So, what I I'd realize there's two things at play here. One was I've been playing around with uh the 41 six and the OC 818 because the [00:02:00] OC 818 was going through the Neve, the 1073, and the 41 six was going through the grace and I just changed them around just for an experiment and I forgot to change them back. So he was getting the 41 six through the name. So it was a bit more midi full. Yeah, creamy, chocolatey, whatever. Right. Um, but I changed them back the next time I said, I'll send you two files. I'll send you what you like today and I'll send you what you historically liked before. Uh, we've 41 six with the grace. But having said that the OC 18. Through the SSL2 with the 4K button pressed in. Sounds remarkably like a 41 six through the grace. So they stand in for each other. Extra high end boost. It's bizarre. But the thing is, I was kind of thinking, okay, so I see the stuff on these threads on Facebook all the time. Should I get this mic? Should I get that mic? What should I do here? Which one should I get? And it's always like, get [00:03:00] the, um, you know, the 41 one six and a TLM one oh three. My tip is get an OC 18 and an SLSL two. And then you've got both. You've got a large diaphragm without the 4k pressed in. And then you've got this hyper sort of 41, six sound with the 4k, but it's hard to beat. Yeah. It's hard to beat the versatility with that setup and well, not, it's not hard to beat it, but it's hard to do it that simply, you know, to have a single push button that essentially changes mics, you know, and then, and then with the button in there and then with the, yeah, with the, with the pattern switch on the OC 18, you have this proximity effect. Yeah. Changes, you know, you can change, you know, you're, you're good to go. into hypercardioid and it'd be pretty Yeah. But this thing, this is, this is it. This is the OC 18 with the 4K button pressed in. And you can hear, like, it's really, really cutting. It does sound like a Well, to me, it sounds I gotta say, I mean I'll bet, I'll bet one of the problems is you get too much into the [00:04:00] OC 18 because it doesn't have the long tube. So really, it's like you want to be here, but if you get away from the OC 18 with the same distance that you would be from the 4 41 6 and you put it in hypercardioid and pop in that 4k extra, you know, like mid range, high end. Yeah. And yeah, you'll be, you'll be getting to that cut through anything sound. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I think we are so accustomed to not a flat sounding mic, right? Like we, the sound of voiceover is not a flat mic. Cause we, we moved away from a flat mic when we left ribbon mics, you know? It's the same with our food. Everyone wants like overly salted food. Yeah, or spicy. Dave's hot chicken. Hot chicken this, hot chicken that. You guys get the hot chicken trend in Australia? Oh, we get everything, yeah. Hot, hot, hot. The big, the big trend I reckon here, well, probably everywhere in the world is air [00:05:00] fryers at the moment if you're talking food, isn't it? Yeah, yeah, yeah. The air fryer. I got one in my garbage. I don't want my air fried. Well, that's cool. So, so that's your kind of, I mean, you know, that's a pretty nice secret weapon. Now, I'm wondering what you would get out of the CC8 if you did the same exact experiment. That could be interesting. I should try that one. For travel. Uh, if you wanted to have a travel, uh, solution, yeah, but I've got the CC, the CC eight with the CC eight was sounding a lot like your OC eight one eight when it was in the porta booth. Wasn't it? It was in the portabooth. Yeah. In the portabooth and the car in the car and it sounded a lot like the OC eight one eight, which is like crazy. Yeah. It's very cool. I like it. You should change your name from Mr. Big balls to Mr. Rigg. I reckon. Okay. Mr. Rigg. Mr. Is that your tip? That's my tip. I like, I reckon that should have been your tip. That, that car one, that was, that still gets me. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. That's amazing. And I, I did send that file off to [00:06:00] a guy called Chris Gates, who he's a bit of a fan of the show. He's an audio engineer here in Melbourne and he. I love the guy, but he's always cutting you off. Gatesy. Oh, there you can see the Chris Expander out there. Shut the gate, the horse is bolted. Yeah, that's right. Come on, Robert, give us this. Give us the source. Can I shit? I was hoping you wouldn't going to call me. Give us a source connect one. Yeah, just avoid airports. There's your tip. Traveling too much. I don't, what have I, um, ah, now I'm full screen. No, the pressure's on. I'll tell you what, I'll, I'll throw one out there and, and, and since I was going to do a plugin one, but listening to AP, um, Because the idea of this was we were going to do one about voiceover that we use every day.[00:07:00] Um, so there's one that, there's one that I use every day. That's probably a, it's, it's a musical thing, but I, and I don't know how much it's used in voiceover. Um, but a parallel, but a parallel bus on your voiceover. So when, when you're, when you're mixing something with voiceover, you get your, your voiceover set up nicely. Um, so that it's, it's, sorry, hang on one second. My, this is one of those things where I have very, very little experience with, which is parallel processing. Yeah. I've done a lot of parallel drum. I I'm very new to the, to the concept of parallel processing. So, so basically I'll go back. Cause I thought Pro Tools had stopped. That's all. Um, uh, I'll go back to the beginning. So mine's more of a musical thing. Mine's something that musicians use a lot. And, and George was, sorry, Robert was saying before, like [00:08:00] drums is a big thing where, where musical mixes will use parallel compression. But the idea is that you get your, your, For me anyway, you get your voiceover set up nicely so it's nicely compressed and sounding with a nice EQ. But then what you do is you send that track to, it can either be another track or a bus, whatever way you want to work. For me it's a bus because I've usually got layers of voiceover so I just send it to a bus. And on that bus you heavily compress. And you can manipulate ReaCue to whatever you want to do to get it to mix in. But the idea is that once you've got it set up and you've got that heavy compression going, you then drop that signal down, but then mix it back in so that it's just It's not there up front, but it's just making that voiceover lift and it's giving it that enough kick to punch through the music and sound effects and everything else that's going on. But because [00:09:00] that original signal is still fairly dynamic, you've got this other compressed one that's mixing in underneath that gives it enough punch to punch through. Does that make sense? I get it, I get it intellectually, I just, it's one of those like, it's like a tool, that's always been in the toolbox, but I've been afraid to Open it and use it. I don't know why. I just, I don't have that experience. You are doing parallel gating right now, except one of your gates is set to nothing. Yeah, that's true. I am mixing a mix of wet and dry. So, that's essentially what I'm, I guess that's what parallel processing is, right? It's pretty much. Some of the processing, some of the not. There's, there's those who argue that it's kind of like almost the same thing as just getting the right settings on the, Compressor and I've messed around with it And it seems like you can kind of get the same stuff But I would say that a parallel setup is way easier to dial in I can And you can get like some pretty, especially on drums, where like nothing ever falls too far away, [00:10:00] but it feels like you're never squashing the top. That's right. And it is just easy to get like, I've really only used it on drums, um, but most compressors these days, most plugins, even like the LA 2A copy of this, that, or the other thing, Almost every plug in manufacturer now puts a blend knob on the end of their compressors, it's so popular. So it used to be this trick, you'd set up the same processing on two channels, and you'd have to get the same latency so that they phase perfectly, and now it's like one knob. And most, most compressors do this. I mean, I'm used to parallel processing, quote unquote, of being something we use in, in, when we're dealing with reverb or delay. Because, of course, you need to have Dry, or if it's only reverb, there will be insanity, right? It would be unintelligible. It'd be Nick Cave. So I'm very used to Did you say it'd be Nick Cave? I said it'd be Nick Cave. Nick Cave is, he's super, super wet. [00:11:00] Right, right. Uh, reverb. His stuff is, am I right, Andrew? Like Is it Nick Cave? In what respect do you mean with Nick Cave? He's got a bunch of effects and stuff. Their mixes are like super reverb y. Super wet. Oh, God, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I thought you were making a joke because it sounds like he's in a cave. Maybe that's why he's in a church. You should do a cave recording, Robert. Um, so, um, yeah, so overly wet would be, uh, would be, uh, too much. So, so that I understand, I understand the concept. And so when we're talking about processing, we either talk about what? Serial or parallel. Is that where the, are that the two versions of Waze? Technically, yeah, it's like insert or aux send return is the way I think of it. But that's what's interesting now because a lot of insert plugins have a blend knob or a dry wet. Now they're really acting more like a parallel processor. Yeah, I don't, I don't find that quite as effective. And I, Robert said that before, and I would agree with him. I, I, there's something about the blend. [00:12:00] I think you can be more accurate with, with a, with it coming from another bus. You can, and it's easier to, if you've got a couple of, Plugins in blend mode, um, it's easier if it's on a separate bus, it's actually easier to, you know, if you need to, to ride it a little bit, it's easier to do that too, I suppose. It's easier to control. Maybe it's easier to automate. It's on a fader, I mean, it's, it's nice to have it on a hundred millimeter fader than a knob. I'll say that. But unless you're doing a setup where you're doing one heavy and one mild compression. But if you're doing one, like, the reason why I think it's less impressive on the, um, the, the blend knob, because most people set the compressor to not be too heavy. And then they only blend in a little of the straight, but really if you wanted to do more obvious parallel compression, you would put your compressor at, you know, 10 to one with a low threshold and crush it by 20 [00:13:00] decibels. And then you'd only blend in like 10, 5 percent of that compressed signal, that completely crushed signal. And the majority of it would be the dry. And then you'd have a natural sound with the, like that benefit of like, it just doesn't go down too far. Um, I'll tell you what I'll do. Do you play around with frequencies when you, when you're doing this stuff though? Because I, you know, like when you sort of get the stereo split and you're looking for gaps in frequencies where you can put a, you know, an EQ'd voice where it will sit and pop out. Is that what you're doing with this as well? Especially in radio imaging, I'll play with the EQ on that squashed parallel bus. Absolutely. Yeah. And the parallel bus itself will just like seem like you crush it enough, it'll seem like it loses low end. Because that's where like a ton of the energy is. So when the signal comes in and your brain is going like oh, I'm ready for that low end and the compressor goes nope, you're not going to get the volume. And then you hear the, [00:14:00] so compressors have a, can have an EQ like effect. I'll tell you what I can do. AP and I just finished a re launch package for a station in Singapore called 1FM. And we did a, we did a monster re launch promo, um, sort of, uh, you know, spruiking that the re launch was coming. And it's got this big operatic music happening underneath it and I've added in, you know, lots of impacts and whooshes and stuff to give it some movement and some, you know, Typical FM Gravitas. Um, but what I might do is, I'll put up a mix, I'll put a link in this video if you're on YouTube or in the show notes if you're listening to the audio one, I'll put it up on our website. Um, and I'll do a mix, I'll put the full mix and then I'll do a mix without the parallel bus. Uh, Uh, AP's voice and, and you'll just see how, how much it, it's [00:15:00] still there. You can still hear it, but the, the parallel bus, just when, when something impacts and hits, it's still sitting there. It's still right there in your face. That's the best way to explain it is to literally, I was going to ask you if you had examples of, of, of where they're being, but that would be a cool idea. I'll paste that up. Yeah. Yeah. The, the, the parallel compression thing is much more. Um, kind of known in, in drums, I'd say then using it on voice. I I'm sort of, it's something I haven't really talked about and I, and I do a podcast, um, on radio imaging with the guys from imaging blueprint who we've had on this show before. Um, but it's something that we never talk about. And I, and I was kind of interested to know, is it just me that does it on voice or is it, is it, is, is it sort of. I mean, I can't imagine, I don't really use it in, in commercial work, I suppose, unless I kind of, you know, unless you get to that point where you think, shit, this needs a bit more kick, but it's certainly not [00:16:00] on, on everything, but in it, I reckon I can't think of too many imaging projects that I've done. Done lately that I haven't used a parallel voice bus on, so. Yeah. Well, I'm in the comments. In the comments. If you use it, let me know. Yeah, yeah. I, I'm much more familiar with the concept of serial compression, in fact. Yeah. I, I don't even know if I still have it. I wish. I hope I do. Um, but I had this awesome, um. Compressor called the FMR Audio RNC, which stands for Really Nice Compressor. It's like a little third of a rack space deal, and they're like 200 bucks, but they punch above their weight. I mean, those are from like the early 2000s or something. Yes, yes, yes. So I used to have one of these and I had this in my mix bus quote unquote on my I used to do production mixing on set on film sets. So this was on your stereo master? Is that what you're [00:17:00] saying? Yeah, I had on my stereo master. That's a mono compressor. Did you have two of them? I can do stereo. Yep, it's got stereo, it's got two in, two out. Oh shit, I didn't remember that. Oh yeah, there you go. Cool. Two in, two out, and a sidechain. Yeah. So, um, so I would run that on my stereo bus, and then I would just press super nice, this button right here. And, what super nice does, and I think they explain it a bit, a little bit. RNC achieves high performance at a low cost by using a microprocessor to replicate or replace discrete side chain components. Um, so instead of having a lot of discrete parts, right? Resistors, diodes, things that make like an LA 2A. Amazing. Um, with chunks of software, thereby reducing the component cost. It still processes the main audio and analog, avoiding the problems associated with digital audio conversion. Even the problem of scratchy pots are avoided. No audio flows through the pots. Um, and so, and basically it's using [00:18:00] VCAs. Internally, right? Yeah. So it's this really interesting design of combining digital and analog, but what was cool about super nice is the really nice button. Do does it change? So what super nice did was, um, I did some reading about this while, when I first bought it, so 20 years ago, but what it did was you're, you're sequencing a series of compressors, so, and they're all at different ratios, right? So you can hit it harder and harder and harder. And it kind of hides the, um, coloring that you get from over compressing, you know, because st Doesn't that sound like a knee staging? Doesn't that sound like a knee where it, knee, I guess it does sound like a knee. Yeah. Gets you into it gradually instead of having just like a, like a point, it curves into the compression eventually where it's like flat. It's kind of a big complicated way of saying i's like, you do a soft knee. I mean, uh, I, I [00:19:00] guess. Talking, talking about radio imaging again, but for me, like, I don't have on, on my voice on Andrew's main voice track. If we go back to that promo that you'll hear an example of, um, there's not one compressor. There's, there's a sequencer plugin. So it comes in and it goes through, uh, uh, the first one is a CLA two way, which basically just takes everything that's sort of too sort of loud. Brings that down. Yeah. Then a bit of EQ and some other processing, but then it'll go through, um, the, um, Oh God, what's it called? Uh, another waves compressor. Anyway, it goes through that, but then that's got a bit of a faster compressor maybe. Uh, yeah. Sometimes I'll use the Renaissance, but the main one I use, I can see. See it, it's, it's, um, I'll put it in the show notes. Um, but it's got a faster attack and, and, and a, and a and a quicker release. So, yeah. Then that's just dealing with anything that's still a little too [00:20:00] hot and sort of bringing that down. And then in the, on the master bus for the voice where everything comes together, all, all the processing and, and, and the, yeah. parallel bus and everything, there's a bus compressor on there as well. So, so you sort of, it's the same idea by the sounds of it as what you're talking about, George is, it's not just a compressor, it's a series of compressors that give you a bit more control as you're shaping that, that waveform, I guess. Yeah. Cause I guess the guys, a lot of guys in music, they use like a 10, 70, uh, 10, um, LA to 1176, 1176. They'll use them both because they both do different things and they'll stack them together. But they're serialized. They're one and it's going through one and then it's going through the next. So I don't know if this is still going on with mastering, but um, at least 10 years ago, mastering engineers were starting to just clip the ADD converter just a little bit and clip this other thing just a little bit [00:21:00] and they weren't even, they were just literally purposely clipping things by half a DB. Yeah. And that's such a thing now that there are literally clippers. Yeah. Yeah. There are plugins that are clippers. Yeah. And, and also I remember the first time that I had anything mastered. So I did this recording on my cassette A track, mixed it down to dat. I was interning at, at what was it called? The classic digital mastering, which was funny because they did a lot of classical music too. But, um, so it's like, you know, like, They did a free mastering session for this thing. And the guy loads it into sonic solutions and then just, he's like, you know, he finds the peak and he's like, whatever, we're going to bump. Like I was, I hit it perfectly. I was like zero on the debt, you know? He's like, whatever, we're going to raise it up by like three or six. I'm like, you're going to clip it. And he's like, that's fine. They'll just be loud. That's it. Yeah. Just like, like there was no L one back then. It was just like, no, there was no maximizer at the top. Yeah. Okay. No, I is [00:22:00] one, um, the com, the compressor I like on ap. The second one, by the way, is the DPR 4 0 2, the blue one with the red LED lights that sort of go vertically. And you probably don't know it's in the wave. No, that's one of their newer ones. It's not an emulation or, or is it the b Yeah, it's an emulation. It is an emulation of hardware. 'cause I used to have a hardware one in a studio I used to work in. Yeah, it's what's what's the name of that company? bb. It's not BBE, but bb. Yeah, I think it is. BBE. No, it's not BBE because BBE makes the exciter that's like audio crack and it ruins your mix. I'm just, I'm looking in my audio suite, looking in my audio suite plugins and it doesn't say BBE, DPR, or anything like that. It takes your daughter out on a date. Here we go, hang on. Oh, I can't, can I share my screen? No, I can't. Oh, I think you can. Hang on, it's coming up. My poor old Mac's got Pro Tools running and four source connections going and God knows what else. It's [00:23:00] desperately trying to open the plug in. I was trying to show it earlier. Your Mac is buying fans off Amazon right now. Exactly. Well, well, well, we were getting onto the tangent of knee, so I just wanted to show you. Oh, you got it? Hang on. Hang on. Let me go to that. This could, this could blow everything up, you know. Here we go. If, if, if the, if the episode suddenly finishes, you'll know why. Andrew, just hit the end, the end thing. And if I go present, share screen. Here we go. Share screen. Sharing screen is easiest with two monitors. Yep. Share screen. And then you have to choose the window or browser tab. Okay, and then window, let's just go here, share. There we go. Can you see that? Yep, it's working. I just have to add it to the show. Hang on. There you go. There you go. There it is. Ooh, DPR. Yeah, that's the name of them. So, no, no, BSS. Is that the real name? BSS is, it's not BBE, it's BSS. BSS. There you go. So, so for, [00:24:00] for AP on this, I, I have a, a sort of a bit of a fast, well, a reasonably fast attack, um, and, and a similar release, but, but if you were watching this working for AP 3 dB gain reduction light would be blinking sort of, you know, indiscriminately on and off. It's not working very hard, but it's just cleaning up those, those things that are a bit higher. Which means that as you, as you work your way down the stack of compressors, you can actually compress a bit harder. Because there's nothing that's catching that's being compressed really hard, you know, so you sort of, you gradually leveling it out, which means that by the time you get to a limiter, you can actually limit really hard, because there's no peaks that are being caught and squashed radically. It's all sort of being just evenly squashed nicely. So, um, that's the thought process behind that. So I was going to show, uh, go ahead, go Robert. I was going to say, here's a setting that no one thinks about that I think can [00:25:00] make a big difference with some of the really high end compressors, like the George Massenburg. Um, you see every compressor probably has an input, a threshold, attack, release, and output, maybe. But you don't see hysteresis on a lot of compressors. Now you have to explain that now. What does that mean? You've opened that can of worms. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I think it basically has to do with like having two thresholds. I'll make myself comfortable for this. Yeah, sit back. One threshold to trigger the compression, but the other threshold that it has to maybe follow below before it, you know, compresses again. I have to re remember this, because I don't own one with hysteresis. I mean, I see this knob on plugins. I see, I see Certain plug ins, a compressor will have a hysteresis. No, I think logic hysteresis hysteresis hysteresis. I've never known I'll go with you He hold my beer says [00:26:00] Robert As he dives into this subject So it has two thresholds of essentially a low threshold and a high threshold Right. I think so. I think it's something like that because because I believe you can also have it In a, the same word, but with, uh, with compressor, with gates, you can have it too. What's the wave plugin that does that? Is it the MV one or something that's got a high and a low threshold? It sounds like the MV one there, there was one that one that Bob, uh, there was one that had a whole bunch of thresholds. It was, was kind of like what the RNC does. Um Mm-Hmm. . That was back in the day and it was that mastering engineer from Florida that put it out. MB two, an expensive piece of hardware, I'm assuming. Here you go. Hang on. I was a plugin. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. Hang on. Let me tell me if this is the one you're thinking of. Is that with a high threshold? Well, that definitely has a high and a low level. [00:27:00] Seems and that's it. Well, it's at a low level. It's sucking it up. Is this an expander and a compressor? It's, yeah, it sort of seems to be both in the one. But that's why I'm wondering whether that's what Robert's talking about. Is that the, is that what you're thinking of? Um, if I can find, here, I'll show you a picture of the definite compressor I'm thinking of. Um, because, GML, let's see, I gotta spell it out. This has become like a really deep dive on compressors, actually. It has, hasn't it? It really has, yeah. And it's made it nice. I'm looking across here, looking at my 2254 and thinking It doesn't have a history. It's got a lot of stuff in it. No, it doesn't, but it's got lots of different, um, a couple of different limiter, limiter, limiter recovery, fast attack. Is that a Neve thing? Release hysteresis. It has to do with the release timing. So here's, um, if I was to, I will find it. Let's see here. [00:28:00] I'm zoomed in too much. Okay, so how do I share my screen now? And bottom. Present. Present arms. Share screen. If Robert disappears, we know why. Share screen. Share screen. And. I guess we'll just do this. Nope, I'll do that. That'll be easiest. This one, here we go. So add it to the stage and here it is. Here we go. Do you, uh, do you, do you see that? Yep. Yep. And, and if I, uh, zoom in on this thing. So let's see here. View zoom in. How far can we zoom in? It's such a thing. It's called shortcut. Do you know that? Don't you? There you, I I just did it. I didn't, I think it was . So you go, um, timing, release, hysteresis. And you notice it has a setting here and a setting there. And it has to do, so, maybe, in here, let's see, we're going to find So George Mastenberg is probably one of the most renowned [00:29:00] hardware designers of the And what is that, like a 4, 000 compressor, probably? Yeah, I mean, everything he made is absolute, you know, money is no object. I mean, check this shit out, Crest, Crest Factor. Crest Factor. Timing in release histories is to precisely control dynamic features of musical performance when we would arbitrarily use your familiar features such as They don't tell us what it is, they just say it's cool stuff. So Maybe he doesn't really want you to know. Yeah, probably. Doesn't want to give the game away. Go and spend 4, 000 and buy one, Robert, and then come back to us. Exactly. I'll expense it. Yeah, I'll expense it, no problem. Source Elements won't mind. You just won a couple of awards, you'll be right. Well, when you were talking about me, I just wanted to show you this compressor that I probably don't understand how to use, but I've been using for 15 years. And it's the, it's the Dynamics plugin called AU Dynamics Processor. So this is the plugin that comes on Apple. It's the Apple plugin. It's the Apple Dynamics plugin. And the [00:30:00] thing about this plugin is, is it, it doesn't have a ratio. It has a ceiling control. And I still don't understand. So it's like a limiter? Yeah, that's a limiter thing. Yeah, it's very strange, but the bottom line is when I use it A ceiling and a threshold can be similar, but if you think of it, if you have infinity to one ratio and a threshold, then your threshold is your ceiling. Oh, okay. Okay. Now you've confused me, but I'll believe you. If the ratio is infinity to one, meaning you shall not pass, pass my threshold. Yeah, it's brick wall. Then your threshold is the ceiling. Right. So this funny little plugin, right? Which, which I've been using for many, many years. It's got attack release and a master output, normal, normal stuff. It's got an expander with a threshold, totally normal. You know, I use this. It's very handy. You can do a nice, gentle expander. Very, very useful, right? Then you've got the threshold for the compressor [00:31:00] and it has a headroom setting, not a, not a, not a ratio. And then you'll notice it's absolutely A knee, what you call it, a knee style, right? Yeah, that's, yeah, that's, it's a knee, James. And as you approach, as you approach brick wall, right? Well that's brick wall. Yeah, that's brick wall right there. Right. So it's very weird. I never really understand how to conceptualize the headroom. I love the style compressor, but it, well, MDT was, yeah, it works great. This is a great way to do compressors. And this is the same way MDT. Yeah, I think MDT was multi-band dynamics. And you got one of those curves for every single frequency band. Yeah, well they have a multiband version of this too, where it gets really interesting. Yeah, there you go. But considering that's a freebie, and it just comes on Apple, I mean, it's pretty damn good. What you made there, by the way, is known as a That thing you made there with the gate and the compressor, it's known as a [00:32:00] compander. And you'll see that on some, some, uh, like the Yamaha O2, I think, had a compander. It was basically your gate and expander together. Mm hmm. Mm hmm. Yeah, I think pandas have almost become extinct from you don't see them. I don't know. That's because not enough of them come anymore and and and Yamaha wants them all back from all the uh all the zoos. Yeah, it's that bamboo diet that they have trouble with. Yeah. [00:33:00] and on that note, I think we should off. Oh, man. That is definitely the end of that episode. I love how our episodes really do not have an end. They just go, boom. They really don't. It's like you're walking along, you don't see the glass door that's actually shut in front of you. Well, actually, there's a podcast I like, and they end the, the way they end it is one of them tricks the other ones into saying goodbye or bye. And so he'll say some sentence and then slip in the word bye. So it fits into the sentence, so it'd be like, So I realized it was very hard to come byyyyyyyy and then they would all say bye. And that's how they'd end the episode. Because like, nobody knows how to fucking end a damn episode. So you just ramble on, and I'm like, How do we end this fucking thing?

The Ride Home with John & Kathy! Buckle in for a Wednesday full! Like…  Is the New Testament message unique? … GUEST Dr Roger E. Olson … Emeritus Prof of Christian Theology at Baylor Univ … author of over 20 books including “The Story of Christian Theology” and “The Journey of Modern Theology”. Mary Livingston (from Vance Christie's website) … GUEST Vance Christie … writer and speaker … former pastor of Evangelical Free Church, Aurora NE  The Architecture of Truth (new book) … GUEST Rodger Woodworth … was the founding pastor of 2 interracial churches, an adjunct seminary prof, and the Director of Cross Cultural Ministries for the CCO … Rodger has a DMin in complex urban settings and is the author of “Playing Favorites: Overcoming Our Prejudices to Bridge the Cultural Divide,” and “Kingdom Holiness: Holy Living in a Challenging Culture”. Plus Does This Make Sense? And more! Thanks for riding with us on The Ride Home with John & Kathy.See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

The Ride Home with John & Kathy! Buckle in for a Wednesday full! Like…  Is the New Testament message unique? … GUEST Dr Roger E. Olson … Emeritus Prof of Christian Theology at Baylor Univ … author of over 20 books including “The Story of Christian Theology” and “The Journey of Modern Theology”. Mary Livingston (from Vance Christie's website) … GUEST Vance Christie … writer and speaker … former pastor of Evangelical Free Church, Aurora NE  The Architecture of Truth (new book) … GUEST Rodger Woodworth … was the founding pastor of 2 interracial churches, an adjunct seminary prof, and the Director of Cross Cultural Ministries for the CCO … Rodger has a DMin in complex urban settings and is the author of “Playing Favorites: Overcoming Our Prejudices to Bridge the Cultural Divide,” and “Kingdom Holiness: Holy Living in a Challenging Culture”. Plus Does This Make Sense? And more! Thanks for riding with us on The Ride Home with John & Kathy.See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Hi Friend, are you eager to improve your health and the idea of a plant-based diet has been on your mind? You want to try it, but there are also a million questions running through your mind. Like “Is this REALLY possible with my busy schedule and life?”, and “Won't it take hours in the kitchen and be too exhausting to do on top of making meals for loved ones?” Or maybe you're wondering, “Will it be bland and tasteless or make me deficient in nutrients like protein?”   If these are your questions, you're in the RIGHT place. In this episode, I'll address top worries and fears around plant-based eating, such as these common concerns I often hear about. So pull up a chair at the café table with me, and let's dive into this topic together while you sip on your favorite hot cuppa!   Next Steps: Contact -> healthnow@plantnourished.com Learn -> www.plantnourished.com Grow  -> Plant-Powered Life Transformation Course: www.plantnourished.com/ppltcourse Join the FB Community -> www.bit.ly/pbdietsuccess Apply -> Free Rapid Health Transformation Call: https://bit.ly/plantnourished Free Resource -> Quick Start Grocery Guide for Plant-Based Essentials: www.plantnourished.com/groceryguide

How about A Threesome Babe? Have you been asked to have a 3some with your spouse, Boyfriend, or Girlfriend? But first we discuss our Canadian thanks giving. What we are thankful for and amazing cooking. Then we tackle a discussion we had a few times with friends and followers.  THREESOMES For some reason this conversation came up a few times. We weren't sure if we should discuss it. But then the topic kept coming up on our feeds. Other podcasts. So we figured why not. What would you say or do? What questions would you have? We think that many questions should be asked before you jump to  yes or no.  whether your relationship is new or you've been together for a long time. Like: Is this a one time thing, Is this going to be a reoccurring thing? Who would we choose? A Friend? A stranger? or maybe a sex worker?  Why do you want this?  Are you just sowing your oats? or Because you want to be with someone else? Do you want to se your partner with someone else? Are you exploring your sexuality in general or with same sex? Will you be jealous?   Make sure you are both on the same page before you make that decision. It could really change your relationship, for the good or the bad.  Be sure...It can bring you closer or tare you apart. Good luck and have fun Our Links: Free: Nina's 1 week of clean eating E-Book Full Body Door Workout System Headoverheelsshow.com Insta @headoverheelsshow Insta Nina @NinaKako  Roger @roger_guertin Facebook @headoverheelsshow TikTok @tdot_fam You Tube @tdot_fam Email  us@hohshow.com

Folks ask about my #neurodivergent marriage.Umm… over and over. Like… “Is that even possible?”Gotta story for ya…Transcript: https://autisticaf.me/2023/08/18/neurodivergent-kiss-autistic-fairytale-or-fabulous-marriage/#AutisticAF Out Loud Podcast Listen & Subscribe: Apple https://neon.ly/mDd3e Spotify https://neon.ly/p1Vay Audible https://neon.ly/vkXa1 Stitcher https://neon.ly/vx5Zn PocketCasts https://neon.ly/NLL3O Amazon/Alexa https://neon.ly/mnOeq Support the show

Ready to decode the legacy of The Tragically Hip and the enduring impact they've had on Canadian music and culture? Promise us your ears and we'll share an exciting exploration of the band's influence, creativity, and unique place in the hearts of their fans. Today, we're joined by the Emcee of Longslice Presents: Getting Hip to the Hip - An Evening for the Downie Wenjack Fund, Delhi stand-up, Pete Van Dyk. Today he plays the host on his podcast, "Live from the Dutch Hall." And he's invited jD, Pete, & Tim along for the ride. Together we reflect on our personal connections to The Hip, discuss the band's Canadian roots, and consider why their sound may not have resonated as widely beyond Canada's borders.Make sure to get your tickets for Longslice Presents: Getting Hip to the Hip - An Evening for the Downie Wenjack Fund today: https://bit.ly/GHTTHTicketsTranscript0:00:10 - Speaker 2Long Slice Brewery presents Getting Hip to the Hip. 0:00:27 - Speaker 3Hey, it's JD here and I am sans Pete and Tim at the moment, but they'll be joining us in just a few minutes. I am here to set up what is a new series within Getting Hip to the Hip. It's called Getting to Know Your MC And there will be a second installment of this called Getting to Know Your Band, And basically these episodes are designed to allow you to get inside of Long Slice Presents Getting Hip to the Hip an evening for the Downy Wend Jack Fund before that event even occurs. That way, when you buy your tickets and you can buy them at GettingHipToTheHipcom and clicking on the ticket button From there it's easy peasy you just have to show up at the event. So there's that. I would say that Pete van Dijk is a great stand-up comedian and he will be emceeing us. He's also a podcaster, hosting a show called Live from the Dutch Hall, And just recently he had Pete and Tim and myself on as guests And he graciously gave us a copy of the tape. He had it flown in live from Delhi and I'm going to put it up on our feed. It's going to be well. It's going to come up to you in just a second, So why don't I stop Blither Blathering and we'll get to Live from the Dutch Hall with Pete van Dijk and our friends Pete and Tim, as we discuss the podcast on Live from the Dutch Hall. 0:02:41 - Speaker 4Hey, hey, hey, hey. Welcome everybody to the Dutch Hall. We're coming to you live from the Pool Shed in Pine Grove, ontario, for episode 445, believe it or not. 445 times we have done this stupid thing, and this time we have roped two people from different parts of the planet and one person who was from here but had to come back here on a long journey today. That's right, and I'm very happy to have them in. All first timers, all Dutch Hall virgins, and they're here to promote a podcast, which is a really interesting concept, especially for a guy like me from Southern Ontario. The hip is really was really a band that was pivotal, pivotal, pivotal Is that right? That's right. Pivotal to a kid like me. It came up at the right time. They were like hitting it the same time that I was getting in to be in the most awesomeest part of my life, you know, and these guys, two of these fellas have no such experience at all. One of these fellas would have a very similar one, and the idea of the podcast is to let these two guys understand what us two guys feel about this band. And so I entered with these myself. Yet, jamie, yeah, you haven't really now. Oh well, i'll start off by introducing myself. I am the host of the show. In two time You're supposed to say two time, two time. There you go. President's Club Award winner, pete Van Dyke No applause, no applause. And our guest today, the one that's come from Waterford, ontario. He's a. He's a Waterford native, that's right, norfolk County boy. But he's moved to the big city and he's made a life for himself. First time here in the Dutch Hall, ladies and gentlemen, say hello to Jamie, do everybody, jamie do. 0:04:40 - Speaker 3It is great to be back. Great to be back to Norfolk. I mean great to be back in Ontario's garden. Oh yes, Thank you. 0:04:49 - Speaker 4Shout out to us and our guests And you're going to have to help me, jamie, on the last names here, let's try, i will. From San Diego, california, is Tim Lion, lion, everybody, i'll take it Yeah. 0:05:07 - Speaker 5Happy to be here. Thanks for having me. 0:05:10 - Speaker 4Thank you, Tim, And coming from Malaga, Spain. 0:05:14 - Speaker 3Malaga, spain. This is Pete from Spain. He doesn't have a last name. Yes, of course he does Marchica, pete, marchica, everybody. 0:05:22 - Speaker 4Pete Marchica. 0:05:26 - Speaker 1My middle name is is is from Spain. What's your middle? 0:05:29 - Speaker 4name From Spain. Oh, i'm joking, i'm your. You know, actually I have a. I have a nephew and his middle name, his name is this is seriously, his name is Adrian adventure Pitaski And, like it's just so, he could go around his parents name on that So he could tell people my, my adventure is my middle name, right? Wow, i love it. That's my nephew, that's real, that's my nephew, like that's that is cool. Like you want to get named. It's like your parents just made you James Bond, yeah Right. Like it is major, coolest. No, this kid's got to live up to that middle name. He's got to live life, yeah Right, yeah, hopefully he's not trepidatious of everything, yeah. 0:06:10 - Speaker 3What if he's just like an accountant, You know? 0:06:14 - Speaker 4it'll probably be cooking the books. Yeah Yeah, the name like adventure. You know that's a, that's just a gift, that's a gift from your parents, so uh, I think it's a little bit of a, a little bit of a, a little bit of a. It's a gift, that's a gift from your parents. So, uh, i want, I hope so, yeah, yeah, i hope so, or curse, or curse. Um, i wanted to say the band we're talking about is tragically hip. That's right. The band, uh, that, uh, if you the credit tragic lips, from Kingston, ontario, and for some reason the tragically hip have been a band that have uh made it in Canada. They were enormous in Canada, but as much as we tried to explain them to the rest of the band, we tried to explain them to the rest of the world, the rest of the world just didn't get them. 0:06:57 - Speaker 3No, Would you agree with that, Jamie? I would agree with that. And uh, these two are the avatars for the rest of the world. 0:07:03 - Speaker 4Yeah, And now is there a. Is there a band, uh, either in the United States or in Spain, that you would say would be like a band that is beloved in your country, but the rest of the world doesn't get it, You know. 0:07:21 - Speaker 1Tim, you want to take that one for the US Oh tough one, Yeah that is a tough one for US actually. 0:07:26 - Speaker 5Yeah, yeah, i have no idea, because I feel like if you break, i'm going to have to do some homework. 0:07:31 - Speaker 3I feel like if you break in the US, part of that breaking in the US is breaking internationally. 0:07:37 - Speaker 4Yeah, like the rest of the world will like what you guys like. Yeah, there's not much that you guys like, unless there's some guy like you know, like what's the name of that fella? He's, like you know, proud to be an American, or like the, or like one of those country guys who were really like patriotic and over the top. That might be a little bit. That's the country singer. 0:08:00 - Speaker 3What's his? 0:08:00 - Speaker 4name. That might be too much for like people outside the States. 0:08:04 - Speaker 1Yeah, that's true. No, I know what you're saying. 0:08:07 - Speaker 4You know what's the guy's name The big? Yeah, i know who you mean. See, that's me. We're from Canada. We don't know the guy's name? Danim Vast. Yeah, we got tons of them. You know how? about Spain? 0:08:22 - Speaker 1You know there's a band here called Los Planetes, which translates to the planets, if you will, and you know they're extremely popular. I mean they've got like there's a couple of the members have spinoff bands. I mean you can't you can't go to any corner of this country and not know somebody who knows Los Planetes. So they're like sort of as an indie rock band, sort of like I guess you'd say the hip did. But but yeah, dude, outside of if you mentioned Los Planetes outside of Spain, nobody knows what they're talking about. 0:08:54 - Speaker 3Yeah, i've never heard of them, yeah. 0:08:56 - Speaker 4I know that the tragically hip themselves were friends with the band the real statics out of England because they had the same issue as them. They were huge in England but the rest of the world Real statics are from the town. No, not real statics, stereophonics They say those bands were on. Oh, it was about to correct. Yes, i apologize. The real stacks actually open for the hip, yeah, but the stereophonics, and so they'd always, if they came out with an album, the hip would give an album to the stereophonics, stereophonics would give an album to the hips when they came out with a new one, because they had this mutual like kind of like, you know, like sister cities and stuff like that. 0:09:36 - Speaker 3It was like the same thing, but like sister bands, you know, i feel like the last time stereophonics played in Toronto it was post score dying and they played a hip song. Yeah, that would make a huge sense And I didn't. But I didn't know that there was that connection. 0:09:47 - Speaker 4I just thought they were just doing a tribute to oh no, they were big fans of it, like big fans of each other, and they both had the same thing. They could never break in the States and they were like huge in their own countries And even in Canada the stereophonics didn't really make too much of a splash. I just remember that having a stay song. Yeah, i like that band actually. Yeah. 0:10:07 - Speaker 5I can only think of bands from the U S that have done well outside the U S. You know like bigger tours outside the U S, but there are a ton. 0:10:16 - Speaker 1There are a ton of like Canadian bands that like have had broken through to me, for Christ's sake. You got Neil Young, you've got the Lannis, you've got Brian Adams, right, nickelback, you know. 0:10:29 - Speaker 5Nickelback. Yeah, that one band Rush. is that what they're called? 0:10:33 - Speaker 1Yeah, yeah, i mean one of the greatest bands of all time. It's a real crowd splitter rush. 0:10:41 - Speaker 3I agree Because. I've never I was never a Rush guy. 0:10:43 - Speaker 4If you don't, if you like Rush, you really like Rush Big time. I think it's like Bruce Springsteen. You know, bruce Springsteen, the guys that like Bruce, they love Bruce, Like they really like Oh my gosh. 0:10:54 - Speaker 5Yeah, we have a good friend who follows Bruce and I just Yeah, they're like, they're you and Target on that. God bless Michelle. 0:11:02 - Speaker 4Yeah, and my cousin's husband is like that, he's traveled all around to see Bruce, eh, and he knows him Like it. Just it means so much to him. Man, i envy that about him, but I just don't get it. Yeah, it just doesn't. 0:11:18 - Speaker 3I like Springsteen, but I'm not. I wouldn't do a follow along, or Yeah. 0:11:23 - Speaker 4You're in camp too, like either you love him or you're like oh, he's the boss, you know he's good. 0:11:29 - Speaker 5Yeah, i like a couple, you know I like it enough It's fine, there's lots of bands I would go see perform live if I got a free ticket. 0:11:38 - Speaker 1Right, yeah, i got free tickets to see Springsteen. That's the only reason I saw him. But back in the day I think we told this on the pod or I may have mentioned it on the pod when we did some, when we recorded, but back in the day, when I started playing in bands, like 25 years ago, you were, if you were a Rush fan, you were closeted. Like and I'm not even like joking Like in the US like if you liked Rush and you had Rush records, you were closeted. You didn't talk about it. I remember I was playing in a band with a guy named Jason Hirsch and he was our bass player and we played in a band for like seven or eight months and then one day it went over his house and it was like I found a bunch of porno mags in his corner. Like he's like, yeah, dude, i like Rush, and like the same was for Zappa, and I was like, dude, it's cool man, this is a safe space. 0:12:30 - Speaker 4I have a huge kit set up in the closet. I drummed a new apparel. That's funny man, but it was kind of that. There was like you just didn't know if you're, because they split the room, you either love it, like people hated Rush, or they loved Rush. You know, even in Canada, even in Canada, they're hardcore. I don't get it, you know. I think some It might be musicians though too, because like Rush, right, because they're technically Yeah, i mean because you just. 0:13:01 - Speaker 1The work of like the musicianship is like the fact that Geddy Lee can play His multi-instrumentalist on stage and singing is fucking stupid, yeah, like you know It's like Radiohead too. 0:13:16 - Speaker 4Right Like Radiohead, like Yeah, if the musicians get them more than the non-musicians, would you say that's true. 0:13:26 - Speaker 5I don't think so. I think Rush had a special kind of nerd dump. You know, like, if you ever knew, like a group of kids that played D&D, yeah, yeah, yeah. Like you know, like I don't know, rush has their own collective. Like, i have lots of friends who are radiohead fans and many of whom are not. 0:13:44 - Speaker 1We now ostracized the Rush crowd from Pete's podcast and now ostracized the D&D. 0:13:55 - Speaker 4I don't know. 0:13:57 - Speaker 5I saw D&D. friends, we're all good with each other. 0:14:01 - Speaker 4I've never played before. Have you done that Never? 0:14:05 - Speaker 5I won't touch a 12-side. I tried, like, when it became a thing, i tried with some kids in my neighborhood and I sat down with them and I was like are we going to drink some wine? Or you know, and that was the seventh grade Like it just felt like we were supposed to be naked or I don't know. It was just weird. Yeah, like It was really weird. I was like how far can we take role play right now? 0:14:26 - Speaker 4Yeah, you were an advanced. 0:14:27 - Speaker 5There's too much of a tease for me. 0:14:29 - Speaker 4No, i was like you were saying Dungeons Dragons makes a seemed a little like they was going to get a role. Did people wear costumes for that stuff? 0:14:37 - Speaker 5Well, no, i just felt like it was this level of intellectualism, you know, like that wasn't it being experiencing games and rush was kind of the same way, and maybe, you know, maybe the hip was too smart for the US, maybe it might be. 0:14:51 - Speaker 4It might be like there's, but I don't know how smart it was. It was like there's a. It's an interesting thing because I've only because of this podcast started. You know he's kind of reflect on you know I was a hip like, i am a hip fan and it, but I don't know if I'm associating it is just because they were around through a good part of my life. You know what I mean. Yeah, like I was young and having a good time and every show I went to or I could see them a lot, you know. So they were at a lot of like festivals and concerts that I would get a chance to go to. 0:15:25 - Speaker 3They were always on the bar, like whatever bar you go to, they were playing hip, you know yeah. 0:15:30 - Speaker 1They were like the LA. They were like Canada's version of X. If you live in LA, right, sure They were. They were still playing Cause like yeah, right, i know, but actually you could like go to any club on a given night in the 80s and 90s and that band was playing, and they're still playing. 0:15:51 - Speaker 4Yeah, they're still playing, and then I never seen a. The other thing that I think was was interesting about the hip, when you'd see them live, is like I've seen a lot of bands that would jam, you know, like they would like jam out a song, so it didn't sound like a radio version of it, like, but the hips the only one I can really say that vocalist was doing it too Like where the vocalist was jamming vocals, you know, and so you'd go to see them at a show and he'd be like gibberishing up there, you know, while they were like jamming something else out in the middle of a song, and then you'd go see the next tour and it would actually be a song that was on that album, you know, and like, do you remember seeing that too? Absolutely, yeah, i was called it breadcrumbs, right, like it was like little breadcrumbs and you're like that's going to be something like. I remember nautical disaster before it was nautical disaster, right, and then like, so, like I thought that was kind of cool, cause you kind of I don't remember another band that kind of let you in on the what's to come, you know, like, and and and let you watch the creative process, like the writing process, on stage, you know as obvious. 0:17:05 - Speaker 5Maybe the, maybe the doors, yeah, yeah, that's what's good. Jim Morrison did a fair amount of that, but there's not many. I mean, that was like lead singers riffing Yeah, there's not. Not many people are able to do that at all, is this? 0:17:19 - Speaker 4douchey. It really like it has the potential to go a little bit yourself in grandizing. You know, like, where it's like. Look at me, i'm an intellectual and you know even Jim Morrison and then Gord Downey. They both kind of you know they're like I'm not gonna do that. Their critics could accuse them of that, of being a little bit like you know in their own head or like too impressed by themselves. But I didn't get that impression from either of them but because I liked them. 0:17:47 - Speaker 3Yeah, me too. 0:17:48 - Speaker 4But and I like watching the creativity of it, you know, But doors is a perfect example, because that would be, I would say, the closest which I never got. to see them, So yeah. 0:18:00 - Speaker 1Pete, did you have you? because I don't know how much you dug into the pod, but we you know, one of the things that Tim and I struggle with is that you know, when we did the, when we did the pod, we recorded everything, because everything's recorded up into this point. Pretty much We're just kind of trickling the pods out leading up to the finale. But like a lot of folks, like you know, we had a week to digest the record and then it was week over week over week over week And, like so many people, like dude had fucking a year or two years to like and it had their whole lives to get to know this band. I think it's, you know, i'm not gonna we'll smoke up my own ass, but maybe I'll hold a little Tim's ass. But we, you know, i think it's, you know, i think it's, you know it's a little bit of a Tim's ass, but we, you know, i'm. I think it's pretty impressive because at this point, now that we're kind of all done, i fucking love this band. I mean, i've gone back and listened to the records we weren't super keen on and they're just dude, they're. I don't know what American rock fans were fucking thinking back in the day when this band was like pinky. 0:19:14 - Speaker 5Is that why? Yeah, i really think that a big part of why they didn't quote make it in the US, which they did to a degree, they just weren't selling out stadiums. But I think a big part of it had to do must have had to have been because of ill attempted marketing. Like, like, when bands go on tour, there are people behind the scenes that are doing promotions in every city. They're hanging posters, they're giving away tickets, they're talking about on the radio all of these things. You know everybody in LA who does this for a living And I talked to him briefly about it and he said marketing probably was marketing, i and can't. And I'm like, oh, you know, and the labels, when the hip was on with labels who weren't promoting them in the US, like, oh, they're gonna play in these six epicenter cities, we're gonna sell out them, sell out them more, maybe if all the Canadians show up, sure, that was, that was what happened. But man, if they were promoted more in a real way, like other bands on their US labels which I can't remember right now, i think they would have totally hit it. When they were on in my house the other day I said to my wife if this was playing in 1992, i would have been totally into it, cause we were talking about bands we were into in 1992. And some of them, like right now, i might have thought they were pretty good back then, but some of them right now I absolutely do not listen to. But if I would have, heard the hip in 1992, I would definitely be going back to albums right now, I believe. 0:20:48 - Speaker 4Yeah, it's interesting, that's really all. but with both what you guys said, it's really interesting cause I it's not what I expected, like number one, you've just let my audience know you've been, you've been through the entire catalog of the hip, which, when you said it takes you time to process a tragically hip album, i mean I remember like in real time, when these things came out and we would like line up at sunrise at midnight to get the new road apples or whatever you know. And but each album like road apples compared up to here and day for night compared to road apples, or like, or fully, completely, you know they were. they were as soon as you put in the new album you were like, ah, like this is, this isn't as good as the last stuff, and then you'd listen to it like a hundred times and then it would become your favorite album. you know, like totally. And I find Jack White like I'm a huge Jack White fan and it's the same thing with his stuff, cause he's pushing himself and he's growing, you know, and then it kind of takes you a bit to get your head around what he's trying to do And then after a while you start digging it, you know. That's a good example And I think that's. That's the kind of like I. You never liked the hip album when you first got it. You always liked it a couple of weeks later. You know, Like Is it. 0:22:15 - Speaker 5Sorry, is that true? Is that true for you, jamie? Were there any albums you just were like just had on repeat, psyched, go, go, go, go listen to it a hundred times a week. 0:22:26 - Speaker 3I was in love with like from the moment I heard it Like. So There you go, but and fully, completely too Trouble at the hen house. The first time I heard it I was like I'm not sure about this, but you're right, it was, it was, it was different, they were, they were, you're right, They, they were growing and I was stuck behind. Yeah, yeah, now that's like my favorite record. 0:22:46 - Speaker 4Yeah, yeah. 0:22:48 - Speaker 3Like like hands down. 0:22:50 - Speaker 4Yeah, and then, like I, yeah, cause yeah up to here was the only one I would say that I was like I'm in, this is everything's great. And then the only thing is that a lot of songs kind of sounded similar maybe, but but but then everything I was comparing everything up to here And then, and that's just. And then I just wasn't like like you said, i just wasn't developing like the. That's why it takes me a bit just to catch up, cause I'm slow, i'm just. You know, you're just a consumer, you're being fed, fed shit, you only know what you know And then get something new and takes you a bit. 0:23:28 - Speaker 1But you also never know how long it's going to take. I had a. I had a record I won't need to mention cause it's just not even important, but the record from a band that I really liked And when they're it took seven years. Seven years. It came out in 2007 and it wasn't until 2014 when I picked it up again And I literally thought this was the shittiest record I had ever heard. And I picked it up again and it turns out being my favorite record And it was like like it takes time, but for for what, tim and I? the gauntlet that fucking JD's put us through the last seven months, like how many? 0:24:05 - Speaker 3albums There's 14, 14 hours, 14 or 15. Yeah wow. 0:24:11 - Speaker 4And then, uh, yeah, that's crazy, man, that's crazy. So the what was I thinking? Oh, you're to um, you know, david Bowie's black star, that album, last album, yeah, yeah, same thing. I was like you know, i wanted Ziggy Stardust and I got black star. I was upset. And then, uh, you listen to it and you're like this is the greatest thing he's ever done. This is man. That album is incredible. Oh, yeah, and uh, yeah. And then the more you know the fact that he, uh, he doesn't, he, he leaves on an open note Like he doesn't, uh, he doesn't end on the top, on the home note, the number one, the one he doesn't end on, the one you know that's a and he knows he's going to die. 0:24:53 - Speaker 1You know, that's crazy, That album it's funny because I remember when I bought that album right when it came out, right after he died, because he died a couple of days before my birthday, because he died a few days after his birthday, which is January 8th Mine's a 16th and I bought it and I just didn't. I wanted to get it, i couldn't. And then a friend, when I moved back to Spain, explained to me that it was a lot of the songs are built on flamenco chords, spanish flamenco chords, and I was like get the fuck out of here. And then I we listened to it together and explained it to me And I was like, because a drummer of our band? and I was like, oh, that makes sense. And then the whole record made sense to me. 0:25:33 - Speaker 4It took years, isn't that great. That's a beautiful thing about music, our art in general. You know like, no matter what kind of the art, the comedy is the same way you can work your whole life. You're never going to know all the risks and all about it You're never going to. It's just so infinite in the amount. So like, that's what I like about it, about it, you know, like you can, you're never going to feel like you've got all the answers you know, when you find art, when you find art like that, that's timeless, that's, that's, that's the best stuff I think you know. 0:26:04 - Speaker 5Yeah, that's right. Yeah, something you can put on, i mean, just at any point in time. It's just that's, that's. Those are the keepers. Yeah, i don't know if we'll feel the same way. Pete, have you gone back to any any? Bob Rock produced albums. 0:26:18 - Speaker 1You know it's funny. I haven't yet, tim, but I really am looking forward to it because I think it's going to happen. I think eventually all end up like sending a letter Is Bob Rock still alive? 0:26:28 - Speaker 5Yes, oh, my gosh Yeah. 0:26:30 - Speaker 1Okay, then I'll send him like an apology letter and like be like Bob, i'm sorry, cause there are people that love. 0:26:36 - Speaker 3We are the same now And when it came out it was pretty universally derided. And there are people that absolutely adore that record now And I'm I'm one of them. Like, like, i really did not like that record the first time I heard it. Like I remember meeting Greg in the grocery store We were doing fully and completely at the time And I was like, so I did some pre listening and uh, wow, every song sounds the same. It's all droney, it's you know. And now I think, like depression suite is amazing. I love morning moon, um, queen of the Furrows is like weird and out there. But I but I dig it, but it's not, it's not. It still doesn't feel quite like a hip record because there's no Lang Lawn and St Clair backup vocals. You know it's, it's, it's just different. 0:27:24 - Speaker 4Yeah, do you hear that? Uh, i think it was at the Gino's or something. Uh, after CORE Downey died, uh, muse filled in and they did um, it's a, she did a cut. No, it's not, it's not. I said the wrong name FIEST, fiest. Yeah, fiest did, uh, did the vocals and it was for it's. Uh, it's a good life if you don't weaken. Yeah, it's a good life if you don't weaken and uh and. But like when the background vocals kicked in and then it was like, then you're like Oh, this is the hip. Yeah, cause before it was just a cover, you know. And then, as soon as you heard St Clair's backing, it was like Oh man, this is, this is cool, you know, yeah, yeah. 0:28:07 - Speaker 5Um, yeah, i was. I was asking Pete, because this morning when Amy was making coffee, I was like coffee girl. It just happened. So, bob, bob is coming in. Hey, knock on the door. 0:28:23 - Speaker 4Hey, i was hoping, uh, we, so this has been. This is really cool. If you guys, uh, who are listening to this show, if you want to check out this podcast and see how these two people were converted to the ways of the tragically hip um, uh, how can they find the show, jamie? 0:28:39 - Speaker 3go to getting hip to the hipcom and, uh, you can go anywhere that you find your podcasts you'll get getting hip to the hip And it is. 0:28:49 - Speaker 4It's going to all uh, culminate with a grand finale live show in Toronto on September 1st. Yes, sir, and people can get tickets for the show Same place. 0:29:00 - Speaker 3Getting hip to the hipcom and, uh, click on tickets and, uh, you know, uh, we'll get a great host for that evening. 0:29:08 - Speaker 4Well, thank you. Yeah, i'll be hosted by myself and uh, we have uh the finale of the podcast and you have uh entertaining the audience of uh. was it 50 mission cap or? 50 mission 50 mission, which is a hip cover band. They'll be playing, and where is it? 0:29:25 - Speaker 3It's at the rec room in Toronto on Bremner, right across from the sky dome. 0:29:29 - Speaker 4Oh sweet, it's going to be super fun. So please check us out And, uh, we will be running a uh draw here at the Dutch hall for a listener to get a free uh free ticket to the event. How about? 0:29:40 - Speaker 1a pair A pair. 0:29:41 - Speaker 4You can bring a friend. Thank you, that's nice, yeah, and I can even give you a ride if you want, if you're local. So we got all those things working for us, and there'll be details on that at the end of the show, but I don't want to keep these guys any longer doing business. Um does. 0:29:59 - Speaker 1This is the sky down where the blue jays play. Yeah, Oh fuck, that'd be cool. They're playing a game that they're not, they're out of town. 0:30:08 - Speaker 3Are we taking a game? for sure, yeah, Hey, pete. 0:30:12 - Speaker 1Pete, i've been wanting to tell you a joke, man Come tell you a joke, yeah, please do, just to turn After he's done. 0:30:20 - Speaker 5Then, pete, you play guitar to Pete and see if you guys can trade. 0:30:25 - Speaker 4Yeah, you have to do that. Okay, I'll trade your talents. I know two chords. 0:30:30 - Speaker 1So so you know Creedence, right. You know Creed's Clearwater, right. Yeah, yeah, ccr yeah. Yeah, so do you know what the difference between John Fogarty and Marvin Gaye is? 0:30:43 - Speaker 4No, I don't. 0:30:45 - Speaker 1So Marvin Gaye heard it through the grapevine, but John Fogarty played it through the grapevine. Yeah right, Tim, just snickered at that one. It's one of my all-time favorites Whoa man, don't tell that at the finale. Pete, let it sit there. 0:31:09 - Speaker 4Only if I'm really stuck I'm going to pull that one out of the toolbox. You're not going to speak to people like this. No, guys, i want to thank you for spending this time with me and getting to, for taking the time to get to know me and my audience. I really am excited about the podcast And I think it's going to be interesting. Yeah, i hope so. You guys got you guys did kind of shit on them a little bit right. Oh, yeah, they hold back. Yeah, but I think it is interesting to know that even some of the opinions that you held not so long ago may have already changed by the time the finale is going to be For sure. Yeah, Totally have. Yeah, yeah, that's cool, man, and I think that's kind of a testament to why I think they're worthy enough to still be concentrating on. You know is because this shit can happen. This stuff can really happen where people can be turned on to something new and it's new to them. So who cares if Gord's dead? you know, like these guys, never. You know, if you never heard it, like my daughter's. A perfect example Her and the bass player in her band. The bass player in her band said did you hear. Remember when the hip came out with those new tracks? Yeah, and they were all like 90s era sounding. 0:32:27 - Speaker 3They were like road apples. 0:32:28 - Speaker 4Yeah, yeah, they were great, you know, and my daughter's friend brought that to me and they're like, have you heard this? And then they started getting into it and it was brand new to them. Oh, that's hilarious, and so like to watch my kids get into it. What I was into is really a kick. So like, and then like, i think that this is a great example of it. And one time I went fishing in BC and the guy was Australian. That was like running our tour And I asked him about the question what in your country is the band that you guys would love and nobody else gets? Do they say midnight oil? He did say midnight oil And I go well, we all know midnight oil. You know, like beds are burning. And he goes like fuck that song. You know, like you guys don't know midnight oil. If you think it's beds are burning, look into their back catalog when they're a punk band, you know. And then, and it was way different, really Way different, and nothing like anything that made them popular, but it's so, it's. maybe there's bands like this everywhere. You know you can. I never knew about like all all that old good soul music because it never played on any radios that I got to listen to. You know, like I just found out about Al Green like five years ago, like that breaks my heart. You know where was Al Green my whole life? But so there is a lot of good stuff out there And I think this podcast kind of shines a light on that. So I think it was going to be, while we're checking out, so getting hip to the hit, check it out. Everybody And Tim, thank you very much for, for, for the, for doing this for me. 0:34:03 - Speaker 5Yeah, thanks, pete. 0:34:04 - Speaker 1Thanks Pete. Thanks JD, Good to see you guys? 0:34:07 - Speaker 4Good to see you guys. Yeah, and we will see you on September 1st Sounds great. See you September 1st, can't wait. All right, take care, guys. Okay, this show would be nothing without our sponsors at CleanFlow. If you'd like to support them, go to cleanflowcom That's K L, e, e, n, f L O dot com and check out all the great products. Lube up your life with clean flow. And if you'd like to support our show, go to patreoncom. slash dutch hall And you can join our queen, jen Husko, and being a part of dutch hall royalty. And if you're a business that's looking at any sponsorship opportunities, you can also look on Patreon and look at options there. And every time someone on our show gets a little tight ass about what we're putting out on social media, i will put that on Patreon. There was one just recently that Kevin made me not agree not to put out, so I put that on Patreon. And we also have the one that Charter's obviously banned us from putting out. It's on Patreon, so all the band materials on there. So it is well worth the money. There'll be content And you'll also get invited to special events, like my 50th birthday show that's going to be happening in October. This will happen if you are joining our Patreon, or if you even are too cheap to do that. You can go and give us $5 a year. Just E-transfer that to the dutchhallgmailcom and you will become a shareholder of our program, and shareholders get the same rights as the Patreon supporters do. So that's a way you can help us out as well. And lastly, oh, it goes to Port. Johnny's show at the Lazy Flamingo and Hus Village and Hamilton every Monday starts around 8.39 ish around there. Go to see Johnny at the Lazy Flamingo and I will be headlining there tomorrow. And that is it. That is all of our sponsors. I think you can give us some feedback at the dutchhall gmocom or we are at the tall on Instagram. That is it for sponsors, jamie. That is it for sponsors. I promise that's everything. And, of course, you got to keep getting hip to the hip. What You got to keep the lights on. I keep the lights on exactly getting hip to the hip and the go get some tickets to the grand finale, the rec room in Toronto on September 1st. Jamie, thanks again for coming in. Thank you very much. It's been really nice And, as I said, you, i've been watching you promote this thing, i've been watching you put it together and the way that you have curated it, the way that you've cared for it and the way that you've, like, put thoughtful effort into every step of it. It shows through This is being done at a high level, and I'm really proud of the effort you put in. So keep it up, and I'm going to continue to support everything you do, cause I'm real happy to know a guy like you. So thanks for coming in, buddy. 0:37:18 - Speaker 3Thanks for having me. It's great to be here. Finally, yeah, finally We worked it out. 0:37:22 - Speaker 4Yeah. So everyone that's been our show 445 tele friend shared around, be nice to each other And until next week we will see you and T see you next Thursday. 0:38:01 - Speaker 3Thanks for listening to getting hip to the hip. Please subscribe share rate and subscribe podcast, some such. Support this podcast at — https://redcircle.com/fully-and-completely/donationsAdvertising Inquiries: https://redcircle.com/brandsPrivacy & Opt-Out: https://redcircle.com/privacy

Ready to decode the legacy of The Tragically Hip and the enduring impact they've had on Canadian music and culture? Promise us your ears and we'll share an exciting exploration of the band's influence, creativity, and unique place in the hearts of their fans. Today, we're joined by the Emcee of Longslice Presents: Getting Hip to the Hip - An Evening for the Downie Wenjack Fund, Delhi stand-up, Pete Van Dyk. Today he plays the host on his podcast, "Live from the Dutch Hall." And he's invited jD, Pete, & Tim along for the ride. Together we reflect on our personal connections to The Hip, discuss the band's Canadian roots, and consider why their sound may not have resonated as widely beyond Canada's borders.Make sure to get your tickets for Longslice Presents: Getting Hip to the Hip - An Evening for the Downie Wenjack Fund today: https://bit.ly/GHTTHTicketsTranscript0:00:10 - Speaker 2Long Slice Brewery presents Getting Hip to the Hip. 0:00:27 - Speaker 3Hey, it's JD here and I am sans Pete and Tim at the moment, but they'll be joining us in just a few minutes. I am here to set up what is a new series within Getting Hip to the Hip. It's called Getting to Know Your MC And there will be a second installment of this called Getting to Know Your Band, And basically these episodes are designed to allow you to get inside of Long Slice Presents Getting Hip to the Hip an evening for the Downy Wend Jack Fund before that event even occurs. That way, when you buy your tickets and you can buy them at GettingHipToTheHipcom and clicking on the ticket button From there it's easy peasy you just have to show up at the event. So there's that. I would say that Pete van Dijk is a great stand-up comedian and he will be emceeing us. He's also a podcaster, hosting a show called Live from the Dutch Hall, And just recently he had Pete and Tim and myself on as guests And he graciously gave us a copy of the tape. He had it flown in live from Delhi and I'm going to put it up on our feed. It's going to be well. It's going to come up to you in just a second, So why don't I stop Blither Blathering and we'll get to Live from the Dutch Hall with Pete van Dijk and our friends Pete and Tim, as we discuss the podcast on Live from the Dutch Hall. 0:02:41 - Speaker 4Hey, hey, hey, hey. Welcome everybody to the Dutch Hall. We're coming to you live from the Pool Shed in Pine Grove, ontario, for episode 445, believe it or not. 445 times we have done this stupid thing, and this time we have roped two people from different parts of the planet and one person who was from here but had to come back here on a long journey today. That's right, and I'm very happy to have them in. All first timers, all Dutch Hall virgins, and they're here to promote a podcast, which is a really interesting concept, especially for a guy like me from Southern Ontario. The hip is really was really a band that was pivotal, pivotal, pivotal Is that right? That's right. Pivotal to a kid like me. It came up at the right time. They were like hitting it the same time that I was getting in to be in the most awesomeest part of my life, you know, and these guys, two of these fellas have no such experience at all. One of these fellas would have a very similar one, and the idea of the podcast is to let these two guys understand what us two guys feel about this band. And so I entered with these myself. Yet, jamie, yeah, you haven't really now. Oh well, i'll start off by introducing myself. I am the host of the show. In two time You're supposed to say two time, two time. There you go. President's Club Award winner, pete Van Dyke No applause, no applause. And our guest today, the one that's come from Waterford, ontario. He's a. He's a Waterford native, that's right, norfolk County boy. But he's moved to the big city and he's made a life for himself. First time here in the Dutch Hall, ladies and gentlemen, say hello to Jamie, do everybody, jamie do. 0:04:40 - Speaker 3It is great to be back. Great to be back to Norfolk. I mean great to be back in Ontario's garden. Oh yes, Thank you. 0:04:49 - Speaker 4Shout out to us and our guests And you're going to have to help me, jamie, on the last names here, let's try, i will. From San Diego, california, is Tim Lion, lion, everybody, i'll take it Yeah. 0:05:07 - Speaker 5Happy to be here. Thanks for having me. 0:05:10 - Speaker 4Thank you, Tim, And coming from Malaga, Spain. 0:05:14 - Speaker 3Malaga, spain. This is Pete from Spain. He doesn't have a last name. Yes, of course he does Marchica, pete, marchica, everybody. 0:05:22 - Speaker 4Pete Marchica. 0:05:26 - Speaker 1My middle name is is is from Spain. What's your middle? 0:05:29 - Speaker 4name From Spain. Oh, i'm joking, i'm your. You know, actually I have a. I have a nephew and his middle name, his name is this is seriously, his name is Adrian adventure Pitaski And, like it's just so, he could go around his parents name on that So he could tell people my, my adventure is my middle name, right? Wow, i love it. That's my nephew, that's real, that's my nephew, like that's that is cool. Like you want to get named. It's like your parents just made you James Bond, yeah Right. Like it is major, coolest. No, this kid's got to live up to that middle name. He's got to live life, yeah Right, yeah, hopefully he's not trepidatious of everything, yeah. 0:06:10 - Speaker 3What if he's just like an accountant, You know? 0:06:14 - Speaker 4it'll probably be cooking the books. Yeah Yeah, the name like adventure. You know that's a, that's just a gift, that's a gift from your parents, so uh, I think it's a little bit of a, a little bit of a, a little bit of a. It's a gift, that's a gift from your parents. So, uh, i want, I hope so, yeah, yeah, i hope so, or curse, or curse. Um, i wanted to say the band we're talking about is tragically hip. That's right. The band, uh, that, uh, if you the credit tragic lips, from Kingston, ontario, and for some reason the tragically hip have been a band that have uh made it in Canada. They were enormous in Canada, but as much as we tried to explain them to the rest of the band, we tried to explain them to the rest of the world, the rest of the world just didn't get them. 0:06:57 - Speaker 3No, Would you agree with that, Jamie? I would agree with that. And uh, these two are the avatars for the rest of the world. 0:07:03 - Speaker 4Yeah, And now is there a. Is there a band, uh, either in the United States or in Spain, that you would say would be like a band that is beloved in your country, but the rest of the world doesn't get it, You know. 0:07:21 - Speaker 1Tim, you want to take that one for the US Oh tough one, Yeah that is a tough one for US actually. 0:07:26 - Speaker 5Yeah, yeah, i have no idea, because I feel like if you break, i'm going to have to do some homework. 0:07:31 - Speaker 3I feel like if you break in the US, part of that breaking in the US is breaking internationally. 0:07:37 - Speaker 4Yeah, like the rest of the world will like what you guys like. Yeah, there's not much that you guys like, unless there's some guy like you know, like what's the name of that fella? He's, like you know, proud to be an American, or like the, or like one of those country guys who were really like patriotic and over the top. That might be a little bit. That's the country singer. 0:08:00 - Speaker 3What's his? 0:08:00 - Speaker 4name. That might be too much for like people outside the States. 0:08:04 - Speaker 1Yeah, that's true. No, I know what you're saying. 0:08:07 - Speaker 4You know what's the guy's name The big? Yeah, i know who you mean. See, that's me. We're from Canada. We don't know the guy's name? Danim Vast. Yeah, we got tons of them. You know how? about Spain? 0:08:22 - Speaker 1You know there's a band here called Los Planetes, which translates to the planets, if you will, and you know they're extremely popular. I mean they've got like there's a couple of the members have spinoff bands. I mean you can't you can't go to any corner of this country and not know somebody who knows Los Planetes. So they're like sort of as an indie rock band, sort of like I guess you'd say the hip did. But but yeah, dude, outside of if you mentioned Los Planetes outside of Spain, nobody knows what they're talking about. 0:08:54 - Speaker 3Yeah, i've never heard of them, yeah. 0:08:56 - Speaker 4I know that the tragically hip themselves were friends with the band the real statics out of England because they had the same issue as them. They were huge in England but the rest of the world Real statics are from the town. No, not real statics, stereophonics They say those bands were on. Oh, it was about to correct. Yes, i apologize. The real stacks actually open for the hip, yeah, but the stereophonics, and so they'd always, if they came out with an album, the hip would give an album to the stereophonics, stereophonics would give an album to the hips when they came out with a new one, because they had this mutual like kind of like, you know, like sister cities and stuff like that. 0:09:36 - Speaker 3It was like the same thing, but like sister bands, you know, i feel like the last time stereophonics played in Toronto it was post score dying and they played a hip song. Yeah, that would make a huge sense And I didn't. But I didn't know that there was that connection. 0:09:47 - Speaker 4I just thought they were just doing a tribute to oh no, they were big fans of it, like big fans of each other, and they both had the same thing. They could never break in the States and they were like huge in their own countries And even in Canada the stereophonics didn't really make too much of a splash. I just remember that having a stay song. Yeah, i like that band actually. Yeah. 0:10:07 - Speaker 5I can only think of bands from the U S that have done well outside the U S. You know like bigger tours outside the U S, but there are a ton. 0:10:16 - Speaker 1There are a ton of like Canadian bands that like have had broken through to me, for Christ's sake. You got Neil Young, you've got the Lannis, you've got Brian Adams, right, nickelback, you know. 0:10:29 - Speaker 5Nickelback. Yeah, that one band Rush. is that what they're called? 0:10:33 - Speaker 1Yeah, yeah, i mean one of the greatest bands of all time. It's a real crowd splitter rush. 0:10:41 - Speaker 3I agree Because. I've never I was never a Rush guy. 0:10:43 - Speaker 4If you don't, if you like Rush, you really like Rush Big time. I think it's like Bruce Springsteen. You know, bruce Springsteen, the guys that like Bruce, they love Bruce, Like they really like Oh my gosh. 0:10:54 - Speaker 5Yeah, we have a good friend who follows Bruce and I just Yeah, they're like, they're you and Target on that. God bless Michelle. 0:11:02 - Speaker 4Yeah, and my cousin's husband is like that, he's traveled all around to see Bruce, eh, and he knows him Like it. Just it means so much to him. Man, i envy that about him, but I just don't get it. Yeah, it just doesn't. 0:11:18 - Speaker 3I like Springsteen, but I'm not. I wouldn't do a follow along, or Yeah. 0:11:23 - Speaker 4You're in camp too, like either you love him or you're like oh, he's the boss, you know he's good. 0:11:29 - Speaker 5Yeah, i like a couple, you know I like it enough It's fine, there's lots of bands I would go see perform live if I got a free ticket. 0:11:38 - Speaker 1Right, yeah, i got free tickets to see Springsteen. That's the only reason I saw him. But back in the day I think we told this on the pod or I may have mentioned it on the pod when we did some, when we recorded, but back in the day, when I started playing in bands, like 25 years ago, you were, if you were a Rush fan, you were closeted. Like and I'm not even like joking Like in the US like if you liked Rush and you had Rush records, you were closeted. You didn't talk about it. I remember I was playing in a band with a guy named Jason Hirsch and he was our bass player and we played in a band for like seven or eight months and then one day it went over his house and it was like I found a bunch of porno mags in his corner. Like he's like, yeah, dude, i like Rush, and like the same was for Zappa, and I was like, dude, it's cool man, this is a safe space. 0:12:30 - Speaker 4I have a huge kit set up in the closet. I drummed a new apparel. That's funny man, but it was kind of that. There was like you just didn't know if you're, because they split the room, you either love it, like people hated Rush, or they loved Rush. You know, even in Canada, even in Canada, they're hardcore. I don't get it, you know. I think some It might be musicians though too, because like Rush, right, because they're technically Yeah, i mean because you just. 0:13:01 - Speaker 1The work of like the musicianship is like the fact that Geddy Lee can play His multi-instrumentalist on stage and singing is fucking stupid, yeah, like you know It's like Radiohead too. 0:13:16 - Speaker 4Right Like Radiohead, like Yeah, if the musicians get them more than the non-musicians, would you say that's true. 0:13:26 - Speaker 5I don't think so. I think Rush had a special kind of nerd dump. You know, like, if you ever knew, like a group of kids that played D&D, yeah, yeah, yeah. Like you know, like I don't know, rush has their own collective. Like, i have lots of friends who are radiohead fans and many of whom are not. 0:13:44 - Speaker 1We now ostracized the Rush crowd from Pete's podcast and now ostracized the D&D. 0:13:55 - Speaker 4I don't know. 0:13:57 - Speaker 5I saw D&D. friends, we're all good with each other. 0:14:01 - Speaker 4I've never played before. Have you done that Never? 0:14:05 - Speaker 5I won't touch a 12-side. I tried, like, when it became a thing, i tried with some kids in my neighborhood and I sat down with them and I was like are we going to drink some wine? Or you know, and that was the seventh grade Like it just felt like we were supposed to be naked or I don't know. It was just weird. Yeah, like It was really weird. I was like how far can we take role play right now? 0:14:26 - Speaker 4Yeah, you were an advanced. 0:14:27 - Speaker 5There's too much of a tease for me. 0:14:29 - Speaker 4No, i was like you were saying Dungeons Dragons makes a seemed a little like they was going to get a role. Did people wear costumes for that stuff? 0:14:37 - Speaker 5Well, no, i just felt like it was this level of intellectualism, you know, like that wasn't it being experiencing games and rush was kind of the same way, and maybe, you know, maybe the hip was too smart for the US, maybe it might be. 0:14:51 - Speaker 4It might be like there's, but I don't know how smart it was. It was like there's a. It's an interesting thing because I've only because of this podcast started. You know he's kind of reflect on you know I was a hip like, i am a hip fan and it, but I don't know if I'm associating it is just because they were around through a good part of my life. You know what I mean. Yeah, like I was young and having a good time and every show I went to or I could see them a lot, you know. So they were at a lot of like festivals and concerts that I would get a chance to go to. 0:15:25 - Speaker 3They were always on the bar, like whatever bar you go to, they were playing hip, you know yeah. 0:15:30 - Speaker 1They were like the LA. They were like Canada's version of X. If you live in LA, right, sure They were. They were still playing Cause like yeah, right, i know, but actually you could like go to any club on a given night in the 80s and 90s and that band was playing, and they're still playing. 0:15:51 - Speaker 4Yeah, they're still playing, and then I never seen a. The other thing that I think was was interesting about the hip, when you'd see them live, is like I've seen a lot of bands that would jam, you know, like they would like jam out a song, so it didn't sound like a radio version of it, like, but the hips the only one I can really say that vocalist was doing it too Like where the vocalist was jamming vocals, you know, and so you'd go to see them at a show and he'd be like gibberishing up there, you know, while they were like jamming something else out in the middle of a song, and then you'd go see the next tour and it would actually be a song that was on that album, you know, and like, do you remember seeing that too? Absolutely, yeah, i was called it breadcrumbs, right, like it was like little breadcrumbs and you're like that's going to be something like. I remember nautical disaster before it was nautical disaster, right, and then like, so, like I thought that was kind of cool, cause you kind of I don't remember another band that kind of let you in on the what's to come, you know, like, and and and let you watch the creative process, like the writing process, on stage, you know as obvious. 0:17:05 - Speaker 5Maybe the, maybe the doors, yeah, yeah, that's what's good. Jim Morrison did a fair amount of that, but there's not many. I mean, that was like lead singers riffing Yeah, there's not. Not many people are able to do that at all, is this? 0:17:19 - Speaker 4douchey. It really like it has the potential to go a little bit yourself in grandizing. You know, like, where it's like. Look at me, i'm an intellectual and you know even Jim Morrison and then Gord Downey. They both kind of you know they're like I'm not gonna do that. Their critics could accuse them of that, of being a little bit like you know in their own head or like too impressed by themselves. But I didn't get that impression from either of them but because I liked them. 0:17:47 - Speaker 3Yeah, me too. 0:17:48 - Speaker 4But and I like watching the creativity of it, you know, But doors is a perfect example, because that would be, I would say, the closest which I never got. to see them, So yeah. 0:18:00 - Speaker 1Pete, did you have you? because I don't know how much you dug into the pod, but we you know, one of the things that Tim and I struggle with is that you know, when we did the, when we did the pod, we recorded everything, because everything's recorded up into this point. Pretty much We're just kind of trickling the pods out leading up to the finale. But like a lot of folks, like you know, we had a week to digest the record and then it was week over week over week over week And, like so many people, like dude had fucking a year or two years to like and it had their whole lives to get to know this band. I think it's, you know, i'm not gonna we'll smoke up my own ass, but maybe I'll hold a little Tim's ass. But we, you know, i think it's, you know, i think it's, you know it's a little bit of a Tim's ass, but we, you know, i'm. I think it's pretty impressive because at this point, now that we're kind of all done, i fucking love this band. I mean, i've gone back and listened to the records we weren't super keen on and they're just dude, they're. I don't know what American rock fans were fucking thinking back in the day when this band was like pinky. 0:19:14 - Speaker 5Is that why? Yeah, i really think that a big part of why they didn't quote make it in the US, which they did to a degree, they just weren't selling out stadiums. But I think a big part of it had to do must have had to have been because of ill attempted marketing. Like, like, when bands go on tour, there are people behind the scenes that are doing promotions in every city. They're hanging posters, they're giving away tickets, they're talking about on the radio all of these things. You know everybody in LA who does this for a living And I talked to him briefly about it and he said marketing probably was marketing, i and can't. And I'm like, oh, you know, and the labels, when the hip was on with labels who weren't promoting them in the US, like, oh, they're gonna play in these six epicenter cities, we're gonna sell out them, sell out them more, maybe if all the Canadians show up, sure, that was, that was what happened. But man, if they were promoted more in a real way, like other bands on their US labels which I can't remember right now, i think they would have totally hit it. When they were on in my house the other day I said to my wife if this was playing in 1992, i would have been totally into it, cause we were talking about bands we were into in 1992. And some of them, like right now, i might have thought they were pretty good back then, but some of them right now I absolutely do not listen to. But if I would have, heard the hip in 1992, I would definitely be going back to albums right now, I believe. 0:20:48 - Speaker 4Yeah, it's interesting, that's really all. but with both what you guys said, it's really interesting cause I it's not what I expected, like number one, you've just let my audience know you've been, you've been through the entire catalog of the hip, which, when you said it takes you time to process a tragically hip album, i mean I remember like in real time, when these things came out and we would like line up at sunrise at midnight to get the new road apples or whatever you know. And but each album like road apples compared up to here and day for night compared to road apples, or like, or fully, completely, you know they were. they were as soon as you put in the new album you were like, ah, like this is, this isn't as good as the last stuff, and then you'd listen to it like a hundred times and then it would become your favorite album. you know, like totally. And I find Jack White like I'm a huge Jack White fan and it's the same thing with his stuff, cause he's pushing himself and he's growing, you know, and then it kind of takes you a bit to get your head around what he's trying to do And then after a while you start digging it, you know. That's a good example And I think that's. That's the kind of like I. You never liked the hip album when you first got it. You always liked it a couple of weeks later. You know, Like Is it. 0:22:15 - Speaker 5Sorry, is that true? Is that true for you, jamie? Were there any albums you just were like just had on repeat, psyched, go, go, go, go listen to it a hundred times a week. 0:22:26 - Speaker 3I was in love with like from the moment I heard it Like. So There you go, but and fully, completely too Trouble at the hen house. The first time I heard it I was like I'm not sure about this, but you're right, it was, it was, it was different, they were, they were, you're right, They, they were growing and I was stuck behind. Yeah, yeah, now that's like my favorite record. 0:22:46 - Speaker 4Yeah, yeah. 0:22:48 - Speaker 3Like like hands down. 0:22:50 - Speaker 4Yeah, and then, like I, yeah, cause yeah up to here was the only one I would say that I was like I'm in, this is everything's great. And then the only thing is that a lot of songs kind of sounded similar maybe, but but but then everything I was comparing everything up to here And then, and that's just. And then I just wasn't like like you said, i just wasn't developing like the. That's why it takes me a bit just to catch up, cause I'm slow, i'm just. You know, you're just a consumer, you're being fed, fed shit, you only know what you know And then get something new and takes you a bit. 0:23:28 - Speaker 1But you also never know how long it's going to take. I had a. I had a record I won't need to mention cause it's just not even important, but the record from a band that I really liked And when they're it took seven years. Seven years. It came out in 2007 and it wasn't until 2014 when I picked it up again And I literally thought this was the shittiest record I had ever heard. And I picked it up again and it turns out being my favorite record And it was like like it takes time, but for for what, tim and I? the gauntlet that fucking JD's put us through the last seven months, like how many? 0:24:05 - Speaker 3albums There's 14, 14 hours, 14 or 15. Yeah wow. 0:24:11 - Speaker 4And then, uh, yeah, that's crazy, man, that's crazy. So the what was I thinking? Oh, you're to um, you know, david Bowie's black star, that album, last album, yeah, yeah, same thing. I was like you know, i wanted Ziggy Stardust and I got black star. I was upset. And then, uh, you listen to it and you're like this is the greatest thing he's ever done. This is man. That album is incredible. Oh, yeah, and uh, yeah. And then the more you know the fact that he, uh, he doesn't, he, he leaves on an open note Like he doesn't, uh, he doesn't end on the top, on the home note, the number one, the one he doesn't end on, the one you know that's a and he knows he's going to die. 0:24:53 - Speaker 1You know, that's crazy, That album it's funny because I remember when I bought that album right when it came out, right after he died, because he died a couple of days before my birthday, because he died a few days after his birthday, which is January 8th Mine's a 16th and I bought it and I just didn't. I wanted to get it, i couldn't. And then a friend, when I moved back to Spain, explained to me that it was a lot of the songs are built on flamenco chords, spanish flamenco chords, and I was like get the fuck out of here. And then I we listened to it together and explained it to me And I was like, because a drummer of our band? and I was like, oh, that makes sense. And then the whole record made sense to me. 0:25:33 - Speaker 4It took years, isn't that great. That's a beautiful thing about music, our art in general. You know like, no matter what kind of the art, the comedy is the same way you can work your whole life. You're never going to know all the risks and all about it You're never going to. It's just so infinite in the amount. So like, that's what I like about it, about it, you know, like you can, you're never going to feel like you've got all the answers you know, when you find art, when you find art like that, that's timeless, that's, that's, that's the best stuff I think you know. 0:26:04 - Speaker 5Yeah, that's right. Yeah, something you can put on, i mean, just at any point in time. It's just that's, that's. Those are the keepers. Yeah, i don't know if we'll feel the same way. Pete, have you gone back to any any? Bob Rock produced albums. 0:26:18 - Speaker 1You know it's funny. I haven't yet, tim, but I really am looking forward to it because I think it's going to happen. I think eventually all end up like sending a letter Is Bob Rock still alive? 0:26:28 - Speaker 5Yes, oh, my gosh Yeah. 0:26:30 - Speaker 1Okay, then I'll send him like an apology letter and like be like Bob, i'm sorry, cause there are people that love. 0:26:36 - Speaker 3We are the same now And when it came out it was pretty universally derided. And there are people that absolutely adore that record now And I'm I'm one of them. Like, like, i really did not like that record the first time I heard it. Like I remember meeting Greg in the grocery store We were doing fully and completely at the time And I was like, so I did some pre listening and uh, wow, every song sounds the same. It's all droney, it's you know. And now I think, like depression suite is amazing. I love morning moon, um, queen of the Furrows is like weird and out there. But I but I dig it, but it's not, it's not. It still doesn't feel quite like a hip record because there's no Lang Lawn and St Clair backup vocals. You know it's, it's, it's just different. 0:27:24 - Speaker 4Yeah, do you hear that? Uh, i think it was at the Gino's or something. Uh, after CORE Downey died, uh, muse filled in and they did um, it's a, she did a cut. No, it's not, it's not. I said the wrong name FIEST, fiest. Yeah, fiest did, uh, did the vocals and it was for it's. Uh, it's a good life if you don't weaken. Yeah, it's a good life if you don't weaken and uh and. But like when the background vocals kicked in and then it was like, then you're like Oh, this is the hip. Yeah, cause before it was just a cover, you know. And then, as soon as you heard St Clair's backing, it was like Oh man, this is, this is cool, you know, yeah, yeah. 0:28:07 - Speaker 5Um, yeah, i was. I was asking Pete, because this morning when Amy was making coffee, I was like coffee girl. It just happened. So, bob, bob is coming in. Hey, knock on the door. 0:28:23 - Speaker 4Hey, i was hoping, uh, we, so this has been. This is really cool. If you guys, uh, who are listening to this show, if you want to check out this podcast and see how these two people were converted to the ways of the tragically hip um, uh, how can they find the show, jamie? 0:28:39 - Speaker 3go to getting hip to the hipcom and, uh, you can go anywhere that you find your podcasts you'll get getting hip to the hip And it is. 0:28:49 - Speaker 4It's going to all uh, culminate with a grand finale live show in Toronto on September 1st. Yes, sir, and people can get tickets for the show Same place. 0:29:00 - Speaker 3Getting hip to the hipcom and, uh, click on tickets and, uh, you know, uh, we'll get a great host for that evening. 0:29:08 - Speaker 4Well, thank you. Yeah, i'll be hosted by myself and uh, we have uh the finale of the podcast and you have uh entertaining the audience of uh. was it 50 mission cap or? 50 mission 50 mission, which is a hip cover band. They'll be playing, and where is it? 0:29:25 - Speaker 3It's at the rec room in Toronto on Bremner, right across from the sky dome. 0:29:29 - Speaker 4Oh sweet, it's going to be super fun. So please check us out And, uh, we will be running a uh draw here at the Dutch hall for a listener to get a free uh free ticket to the event. How about? 0:29:40 - Speaker 1a pair A pair. 0:29:41 - Speaker 4You can bring a friend. Thank you, that's nice, yeah, and I can even give you a ride if you want, if you're local. So we got all those things working for us, and there'll be details on that at the end of the show, but I don't want to keep these guys any longer doing business. Um does. 0:29:59 - Speaker 1This is the sky down where the blue jays play. Yeah, Oh fuck, that'd be cool. They're playing a game that they're not, they're out of town. 0:30:08 - Speaker 3Are we taking a game? for sure, yeah, Hey, pete. 0:30:12 - Speaker 1Pete, i've been wanting to tell you a joke, man Come tell you a joke, yeah, please do, just to turn After he's done. 0:30:20 - Speaker 5Then, pete, you play guitar to Pete and see if you guys can trade. 0:30:25 - Speaker 4Yeah, you have to do that. Okay, I'll trade your talents. I know two chords. 0:30:30 - Speaker 1So so you know Creedence, right. You know Creed's Clearwater, right. Yeah, yeah, ccr yeah. Yeah, so do you know what the difference between John Fogarty and Marvin Gaye is? 0:30:43 - Speaker 4No, I don't. 0:30:45 - Speaker 1So Marvin Gaye heard it through the grapevine, but John Fogarty played it through the grapevine. Yeah right, Tim, just snickered at that one. It's one of my all-time favorites Whoa man, don't tell that at the finale. Pete, let it sit there. 0:31:09 - Speaker 4Only if I'm really stuck I'm going to pull that one out of the toolbox. You're not going to speak to people like this. No, guys, i want to thank you for spending this time with me and getting to, for taking the time to get to know me and my audience. I really am excited about the podcast And I think it's going to be interesting. Yeah, i hope so. You guys got you guys did kind of shit on them a little bit right. Oh, yeah, they hold back. Yeah, but I think it is interesting to know that even some of the opinions that you held not so long ago may have already changed by the time the finale is going to be For sure. Yeah, Totally have. Yeah, yeah, that's cool, man, and I think that's kind of a testament to why I think they're worthy enough to still be concentrating on. You know is because this shit can happen. This stuff can really happen where people can be turned on to something new and it's new to them. So who cares if Gord's dead? you know, like these guys, never. You know, if you never heard it, like my daughter's. A perfect example Her and the bass player in her band. The bass player in her band said did you hear. Remember when the hip came out with those new tracks? Yeah, and they were all like 90s era sounding. 0:32:27 - Speaker 3They were like road apples. 0:32:28 - Speaker 4Yeah, yeah, they were great, you know, and my daughter's friend brought that to me and they're like, have you heard this? And then they started getting into it and it was brand new to them. Oh, that's hilarious, and so like to watch my kids get into it. What I was into is really a kick. So like, and then like, i think that this is a great example of it. And one time I went fishing in BC and the guy was Australian. That was like running our tour And I asked him about the question what in your country is the band that you guys would love and nobody else gets? Do they say midnight oil? He did say midnight oil And I go well, we all know midnight oil. You know, like beds are burning. And he goes like fuck that song. You know, like you guys don't know midnight oil. If you think it's beds are burning, look into their back catalog when they're a punk band, you know. And then, and it was way different, really Way different, and nothing like anything that made them popular, but it's so, it's. maybe there's bands like this everywhere. You know you can. I never knew about like all all that old good soul music because it never played on any radios that I got to listen to. You know, like I just found out about Al Green like five years ago, like that breaks my heart. You know where was Al Green my whole life? But so there is a lot of good stuff out there And I think this podcast kind of shines a light on that. So I think it was going to be, while we're checking out, so getting hip to the hit, check it out. Everybody And Tim, thank you very much for, for, for the, for doing this for me. 0:34:03 - Speaker 5Yeah, thanks, pete. 0:34:04 - Speaker 1Thanks Pete. Thanks JD, Good to see you guys? 0:34:07 - Speaker 4Good to see you guys. Yeah, and we will see you on September 1st Sounds great. See you September 1st, can't wait. All right, take care, guys. Okay, this show would be nothing without our sponsors at CleanFlow. If you'd like to support them, go to cleanflowcom That's K L, e, e, n, f L O dot com and check out all the great products. Lube up your life with clean flow. And if you'd like to support our show, go to patreoncom. slash dutch hall And you can join our queen, jen Husko, and being a part of dutch hall royalty. And if you're a business that's looking at any sponsorship opportunities, you can also look on Patreon and look at options there. And every time someone on our show gets a little tight ass about what we're putting out on social media, i will put that on Patreon. There was one just recently that Kevin made me not agree not to put out, so I put that on Patreon. And we also have the one that Charter's obviously banned us from putting out. It's on Patreon, so all the band materials on there. So it is well worth the money. There'll be content And you'll also get invited to special events, like my 50th birthday show that's going to be happening in October. This will happen if you are joining our Patreon, or if you even are too cheap to do that. You can go and give us $5 a year. Just E-transfer that to the dutchhallgmailcom and you will become a shareholder of our program, and shareholders get the same rights as the Patreon supporters do. So that's a way you can help us out as well. And lastly, oh, it goes to Port. Johnny's show at the Lazy Flamingo and Hus Village and Hamilton every Monday starts around 8.39 ish around there. Go to see Johnny at the Lazy Flamingo and I will be headlining there tomorrow. And that is it. That is all of our sponsors. I think you can give us some feedback at the dutchhall gmocom or we are at the tall on Instagram. That is it for sponsors, jamie. That is it for sponsors. I promise that's everything. And, of course, you got to keep getting hip to the hip. What You got to keep the lights on. I keep the lights on exactly getting hip to the hip and the go get some tickets to the grand finale, the rec room in Toronto on September 1st. Jamie, thanks again for coming in. Thank you very much. It's been really nice And, as I said, you, i've been watching you promote this thing, i've been watching you put it together and the way that you have curated it, the way that you've cared for it and the way that you've, like, put thoughtful effort into every step of it. It shows through This is being done at a high level, and I'm really proud of the effort you put in. So keep it up, and I'm going to continue to support everything you do, cause I'm real happy to know a guy like you. So thanks for coming in, buddy. 0:37:18 - Speaker 3Thanks for having me. It's great to be here. Finally, yeah, finally We worked it out. 0:37:22 - Speaker 4Yeah. So everyone that's been our show 445 tele friend shared around, be nice to each other And until next week we will see you and T see you next Thursday. 0:38:01 - Speaker 3Thanks for listening to getting hip to the hip. Please subscribe share rate and subscribe podcast, some such. Support this podcast at — https://redcircle.com/gettinghiptothehip/exclusive-contentAdvertising Inquiries: https://redcircle.com/brandsPrivacy & Opt-Out: https://redcircle.com/privacy

The Ride Home with John & Kathy! Buckle in for a Thursday full! Like… Is there marriage in Heaven? (What will our relationships be like with family members? Do people in Heaven know what is happening on earth? Can our loved ones come back from Heaven and speak to us? Will we know if a loved one is not in Heaven? Will we remember the bad things that happened to us on earth?) ... GUEST Rev Bill Glaze ... Bethany Baptist Church, Homewood Human consciousness as a sign of God's creation... GUEST Dr SyGarte ... biochemist who has taught at NY Univ, the Univ of Pgh, and Rutgers Univ ... He's the author of "The Works of His Hands: A Scientist's Journey from Atheism to Faith” Is God male, female, or neither? ... GUEST Dr Amy Peeler ... assoc prof of New Testament at Wheaton College and assoc rector at St. Mark's Episcopal Church in Geneva, Ill ... author of “Women and the Gender of God Is AI a threat to Hollywood's writer? why the WGA needs to get this one right — for everybody.. GUEST Alissa Wilkinson ... is the film critic at Vox.com & been writing about film & culture since 2006 ... her work has appeared at Rolling Stone, The Washington Post, Vulture, RogerEbert.com, The Atlantic, and lots of places too numerous to name ... Alissa is a member of the NY Film Critics Circle, a 2017-18 Art of Nonfiction writing fellow with the Sundance Institute, & an assoc prof of English & Humanities at The King's College in NY City .. She's co-author, with Robert Joustra, of “How to Survive the Apocalypse: Zombies, Cylons, Faith, & Politics at the End of the World” Plus Does This Make Sense? And more! Thanks for riding with us on The Ride Home with John & Kathy. May the Fourth Be With You!See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

The Ride Home with John & Kathy! Buckle in for a Thursday full! Like… Is there marriage in Heaven? (What will our relationships be like with family members? Do people in Heaven know what is happening on earth? Can our loved ones come back from Heaven and speak to us? Will we know if a loved one is not in Heaven? Will we remember the bad things that happened to us on earth?) ... GUEST Rev Bill Glaze ... Bethany Baptist Church, Homewood Human consciousness as a sign of God's creation... GUEST Dr SyGarte ... biochemist who has taught at NY Univ, the Univ of Pgh, and Rutgers Univ ... He's the author of "The Works of His Hands: A Scientist's Journey from Atheism to Faith” Is God male, female, or neither? ... GUEST Dr Amy Peeler ... assoc prof of New Testament at Wheaton College and assoc rector at St. Mark's Episcopal Church in Geneva, Ill ... author of “Women and the Gender of God Is AI a threat to Hollywood's writer? why the WGA needs to get this one right — for everybody.. GUEST Alissa Wilkinson ... is the film critic at Vox.com & been writing about film & culture since 2006 ... her work has appeared at Rolling Stone, The Washington Post, Vulture, RogerEbert.com, The Atlantic, and lots of places too numerous to name ... Alissa is a member of the NY Film Critics Circle, a 2017-18 Art of Nonfiction writing fellow with the Sundance Institute, & an assoc prof of English & Humanities at The King's College in NY City .. She's co-author, with Robert Joustra, of “How to Survive the Apocalypse: Zombies, Cylons, Faith, & Politics at the End of the World” Plus Does This Make Sense? And more! Thanks for riding with us on The Ride Home with John & Kathy. May the Fourth Be With You!See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

00:00:00] Corey Berrier: Welcome to the Successful Life Podcast. I'm your host, Corey Berrier, and I am here with Shreya. I mess everybody's name up, Shreya, but I actually think I said your first name right?  [00:00:15] Shreya: You did. Congratulations.  [00:00:18] Corey Berrier: Lu. I usually mess up like Bob's name. Like, I don't know what it is. I don't know what it is. I don't know. [00:00:25] Corey Berrier: But anyway, dude, I'm so glad that you're here. I'm super glad to get into this conversation with you. But first Shreya, tell everybody a little bit about who you are. Whatever you would like to tell them about you and take it. Take  [00:00:39] Shreya: it's away. Awesome. Well, first of all, thanks for having me, Corey, and inviting me on the show. [00:00:44] Shreya: A little bit about me is I work with Joe Crisara at Service mvp. I was in H V A C as a comfort advisor, and he trained me in the field I fell in love with H V A C and operations and processes. So, I started working with him, and now I help companies all around America, Hawaii Canada, and Australia, find solutions to implement processes at their business, reach their goals, and completely change the culture of their company. [00:01:17] Shreya: And it's very rewarding for me. And it is my dream job. So it's a little bit about me. That's  [00:01:22] Corey Berrier: awesome. Yeah. So also I need, and I don't want to steer the conversation too far, but I do wanna congratulate you on it. Being eight years sober. It's a super big deal. Thank you. You're very welcome.  [00:01:36] Shreya: Thank you so much. [00:01:38] Corey Berrier: So you mentioned that you, I assume obviously travel a lot as, as well as work with people all over the club base. You've traveled all around, you implement processes. What would you say is, your favorite thing that you implement as, as far as your processes and or systems go  [00:01:54] Shreya: with processes and systems? [00:01:56] Shreya: I would say the basics of, you'd think that, at most companies they were, there would be some sort of sales process with the technicians or the maintenance techs. There's usually none at all. It's. You know, there's no communications training. They're, you have no idea what they're doing. [00:02:16] Shreya: They're just free-ranging it. So it's the classic benchmark in the home sales process that Joe does. Because the main part of it is one thing called Magic Moments. I don't know if you've heard of that, but it's building the client's self-esteem and a sincere way where you are telling the truth is very important. [00:02:34] Shreya: Because people buy emotionally, you know, and reflecting the, changing the technical into the emotional. So no more ratings and over-technical jargon. It's, you know, this is the effect the system has on your family to keep them a healthy and safe type of thing. So I think the basics of that because once you change [00:02:55] that, It completely changes an entire company. [00:03:00] Shreya: The revenue, the happiness of the employees working there they start to love their jobs because at the end of an appointment, they're, I remember when I started doing it, at the end of every appointment, I was laughing, drinking coffee on the couch with my clients. And I had the best. I loved my job. [00:03:19] Shreya: I started loving people when I started connecting with them in this way. So I hear that a lot from technicians all around America where they get emotional when say when they talk about their job and the people that they meet. So it becomes something a lot more than money, you know? [00:03:39] Corey Berrier: Yeah. Because when money is, you know, when you're thinking about, when you're thinking about the money, you're thinking about, you know, how much the job's worth. , you're missing the point. And ultimately customer knows what you're there for. They know if you're there to charge them a bunch of money that you shouldn't be, they can sense the incongruency in your body language. [00:04:03] Corey Berrier: They can sense the incongruency in your tonality and maybe they don't know that, that they can pick up on those things. In fact, most people don't know that they're picking up on those things. They just know you're not their person. Right. They don't really know why. Right. So it's not Yeah it's not selling. [00:04:23] Corey Berrier: It's interesting cuz when I think when people think about sales, they do think about the slime ball car salesman or the slime ball car salesman. Right. I don't even really think that most car salespeople are slimeballs. I just think that's the adage that has been played in people's minds for so long. [00:04:41] Corey Berrier: Totally. That we have to fight against that. that bs, is part of the reason I love working with people in the trades because they experience the same stuff that salespeople experience. Right. They experience, oh, it's just a plumber. Oh, it's just a whatever, where it's just a sales guy. It's the same thing. [00:05:00] Corey Berrier: Right? Totally. We get truly exactly the same.  [00:05:02] Shreya: Totally.  [00:05:04] Corey Berrier: And so I can relate to, I can relate to that, which is why I love working with contractors. Anyway, I don't know. I got off on a little bit of a tangent there.  [00:05:13] Shreya: That was perfect. mean, it's spot on. It's, is it sales or is it service? It's like this is just great service. [00:05:20] Shreya: Great service, naturally. turns into sales, you know, when you're focusing on the process, on serving those people. I'm a servant when I'm out there on the field to give them custom and relevant solutions for them and their family and giving them the freedom to choose and taking the time to get to know them and just being sincere and pure in my motives. [00:05:43] Shreya: And the result happened to be a lot of money because, the service is so high, you know? [00:05:50] That's right.  [00:05:51] Corey Berrier: And the intention, it, the intentions, everything. And I think it's a lot of what we're talking about here. And it's not about, really the truth of the matter is you really shouldn't have to sell. the product or service. [00:06:01] Corey Berrier: Once you get to the house, you do need to connect with the person. You do need to, and when I say connect with the person, let's be clear. Don't ask 'em, you know what, how the weather is outside that is not connecting with the person. Exactly. That's a filler BS question that everybody knows is just a BS filler question. [00:06:18] Corey Berrier: And so you can ask the sales question, so it's like a dead red flag if you ask a stupid question. So totally. Maybe don't talk as much. Look around and observe and figure out something that actually you can relate to and talk about that. Right. And that's just one example,  [00:06:36] Shreya: but go ahead. [00:06:36] Shreya: Totally. About their children, and their family. That's the easiest one, cuz for me is I really do care about that. That's something I know that if somebody has a family, that's something that I care about. I care about the health and safety of their family, so it's really easy for me to find sincerity there personally. [00:06:55] Shreya: So I go straight to that. Thank you so much for taking the time out your day, taking the day off work to meet with me so that you can make sure that your family is safe and healthy. There should be more people like you out there. That's sincere. You say that to somebody. People have started crying, I swear people have started there because people don't talk to each other like that anymore. [00:07:18] Shreya: That's right. It's shocking to them that somebody would look them in the eyes, say that with all sincerity and make them feel good about themselves. Oh, thank you for appreciating me, kind of thing, and acknowledging that and actually listening to me. It's so sad. How I can tell that's so rare for people in their lives. [00:07:39] Shreya: Whenever I do that by, based on their reaction, I can tell how much they don't get that, you know, and that raises their self-esteem. People with high self-esteem pick better solutions for themselves and their families. That's a scientific fact if I'm gonna pick something cheap, it's because I don't feel like I deserve it the premium one. [00:08:00] Shreya: But if I feel good about myself, it's like, yeah, you know what? We are a good family and I do work really hard. I deserve hospital-grade air in my house. Yeah, I do. You know, it's that simple.  [00:08:12] Corey Berrier: I totally agree. And I believe, and it drives me absolutely nuts when I hear companies that won't, that don't use financing like that is, I think that is the craziest thing. [00:08:23] Corey Berrier: Right. I know, you're like, at the end of the day you're literally, and I'm not saying this from a company standpoint like you're. , you're not providing a service for that customer that truthfully, probably 75% of them are gonna  [00:08:37] Shreya: take. Yep. And that's why your close rates are at 30%, and 20%. Cuz you can only reach [00:08:45] 20% of people with the options that you have. [00:08:48] Shreya: It's not accessible to the masses. So how to increase your close rate is one. You learn how to talk to different types of people, not just the easy ones, but everybody, no matter what their culture, their background, whether they're in a trailer or a mansion, you care about all of them and give them all consistent service. [00:09:08] Shreya: And two, you offer to finance and give them the opportunity to even have the possibility to get the job. As you said, it's most people in America, need payments on an investment like that. Do you know? Absolutely. It's crazy. Still no financing. I most It's crazy.  [00:09:28] Corey Berrier: Yeah. And it's crazy. And what we hear is, well, I don't wanna pay the finance fee. [00:09:31] Corey Berrier: And I'm like, you're already paying credit card fees. What do you mean? Like Is it really that much? Wait a minute, you're making a profit, right? You're making money on the job. Right? So is your, you really wanna just say, screw the finance company and their fee so you don't make more money. That just it does not add up in my  [00:09:48] Shreya: the brain. [00:09:49] Shreya: Also increase the price. If you're offering more service, that's okay. If you're offering that is a service that you started offering at your company to your clients, that's what price is based off of is value of service. Right? If you have 24 7 service now, when you didn't before you raise your prices to meet up to the labor that it takes to do that. [00:10:14] Shreya: that, that's totally okay. That's totally ethical to do. You just pay for it. The client pays for the service to have the payments. That's,  [00:10:24] Corey Berrier: and they're happy to pay for good service because they know the good service. They don't have to worry about that. It's just like you have, you pay car insurance, so you don't have to worry about if you get into a rat. [00:10:34] Corey Berrier: Granted, most states make you pay it, but even if they didn't, most of us would have car insurance because we don't wanna have to pay for our car if we wreck it. It's the same  [00:10:42] Shreya: thing. Exactly. It's the same, it's peace of mind. Yep.  [00:10:46] Corey Berrier: Yeah, absolutely. It's a hundred percent and time. Alright, so I want you to walk me through one of the things that I want you to walk me through is your call by call process like [00:10:58] Corey Berrier: Yeah. Here's what I wanna understand. I want to understand how it works. In the house, walk me through. Okay, so you've got a comfort advisor. He has a group of technicians under hi underneath him that hopefully are working well together. How does that look when the technician gets to the house and at what point do you pipe in through, I'm assuming Zoom. [00:11:19] Corey Berrier: does that work? Can you walk me through that?  [00:11:22] Shreya: Yep. Great question. I like this question cuz it's the perspective of when they're in the house which is what, I don't get asked that a lot, but it's an important question to picture what it's gonna look like. So the technician goes in the home and the technicians and the customer's point of view, it's [00:11:40] just like normal, right? [00:11:41] Shreya: He's going through his his process, asking his questions, doing his diagnosis, most importantly, building his relationship, spending the time with that client, right? And this whole time, a call by call manager. A call by call coach, a quality control manager. Everyone has a different name, they wanna use, but whatever is on the backend, right? [00:12:06] Shreya: Actually in an. On let's say service tighten for example, just because that's a good example cuz that's the best I've seen in how to use it because you could watch everything happen in real time on there. So one is the technician is checking in with the quality control manager. They know on their list of calls with all these technicians, which ones are like most likely to be turnovers, right? [00:12:30] Shreya: So he's prepared for that in advance. Also, they're communicating with him throughout the call to update the quality control manager. So when it gets to the point of offering solutions, repair solutions is when you would find out it's a turnover or not. So our process specifically is the client. [00:12:52] Shreya: The whole point of it is with the technician, they get a lot of commitments on replacement before they turn it over. It's not, I just wanna see some options. I don't know. It's not that it's, they're saying no to the repairs. And actually when I was doing it, they were saying yes to replacement before they saw the options. [00:13:12] Shreya: Yes, I wanna go ahead and replace it. When can we get it done? Well, whoa. Well let's look at the options first and make sure that we have something. We're almost like slowing them down, right? That's why I believe in process because when they communicate in a certain way, that is the result. [00:13:27] Shreya: Scientifically, psychologically, they're selling themselves, right? We're not trying to convince them to do anything. So when it comes for the turnover, he builds more scarcity calls in the call and says, Hey, I know you're really busy. , but I have this client here, you know Corey, and oh my gosh, he's such a cool guy. [00:13:46] Shreya: They do a magic moment right there, you know, while they're introducing them. It's so beautiful. I love this process. And then they, once they agree to it we hop on Zoom and I do a Zoom presentation of the options while the tech technician is sitting there still with the client, because they're the one that built the most rapport. [00:14:04] Shreya: They need to be there the entire time. And you know what's funny is what happens when the technician does it right? I know if they did it right or not. When they look over to the client looks over to the technician and asks them, which one should I choose? , yes. It was consistent, like my best. [00:14:26] Shreya: What that I knew were tight on the process and he's whatever's best for you and your family because we're at the, we're not pick the premium, no, [00:14:35] whatever's best for you and your family. You know what's best for you and your family, you know what I mean? Statistically, they're gonna pick mid plus or premium. [00:14:43] Shreya: That's just the statistics of what they usually pick with this sort of process. And so the, basically, the point of this process is two things. One is you are a sales coach to a group of technicians. It's not enough to anymore, this is the pass. We have technology. We don't need to oh, this guy isn't doing the process, or he is doing something wrong on his option sheets. [00:15:05] Shreya: Let's hold the training next week. , that's how it is Now with call by call, it's no, we're correcting it and we're training while you're building them before they're even shown to the client to eliminate the possibility of the job being done wrong in the first place. It's better service for the technicians and for the company and for the client because it's faster and more efficient. [00:15:31] Shreya: It, they're not spending hours longer waiting for that comfort advisor to come out. And then the other thing, it's scalable. So I can close five to six calls a day more, you know, is I can do that all day. If I'm going out to each individual house, I usually did, you know, three or four calls a day type of thing. [00:15:51] Shreya: It would take a really long time. So one better communication with the team. Instant and constant sales training and a scalable process to where you can close a lot of different calls every day. It save on gas and overhead. It's one of my favorite processes for sure. So you  [00:16:11] Corey Berrier: have That's, that was great explanation by the way. [00:16:16] Shreya: Okay. I was hoping I, like you get ,  [00:16:18] Corey Berrier: you no, you did great. You did great. So essentially you, this is one, one of the things that drives me the most nuts is, I know, and I don't know the exact percentage, but you might of what? I'm gonna say it's probably 70% that once that service technician, the way it used to be, once that service technician left the house and there's a two, a three, a four or five hour gap between the selling technician to getting there, to get there. [00:16:47] Corey Berrier: I'm pretty sure it's around a 70% chance that you're not gonna sell that customer. Oh, yeah. Once that technician leaves. So it always bothered me that process always it is the most backward thing to me I've ever seen. I don't understand. I don't get it. I don't, and I guess it processes Correctly. [00:17:08] Corey Berrier: Like what you're telling me it makes so much sense, right? It correct. I, it, I can't believe that everybody's not doing this, but. Say I don't know why.  [00:17:19] Shreya: I don't know why they're, I know why it's been secret. To be fair, this has been a process that has been mastered by, some of the most respected companies in the trades, [00:17:30] right? [00:17:30] Shreya: It's something though that has been always very mysterious to people. There's not a lot of content and training about it because I think that, you know, maybe it's it was just secret is this is the thing that we like to do, that we scaled with. But thank I, I mean, thank God the culture now and the trades is about sharing, you know, it's about this works for us and there's enough for everybody, so here you go. [00:17:53] Shreya: And so we're starting to see that a lot more now, I think in the last couple of years, which is why people know about it.  [00:18:01] Corey Berrier: That makes sense. So let me ask you this, I wanna go back real quick. So when the service technician, do, they always jump on Zoom most of  [00:18:08] Shreya: the time. The quality control manager, and the call-by-call manager. [00:18:13] Shreya: Yeah. With the customer. Yeah. Yeah. That's, that is essentially the goal to get to. But some people start out with how I started out. I was still doing it in person. I just, basically, we had a performance group and I had better communication with the technicians or I go with them on the whole call if I don't have any calls myself. [00:18:34] Shreya: If it's the slow season, I'm not at a call and riding in the truck with a technician. There's no excuse. I should not be sitting around in my truck or at the office. I got told off by Joe about that. I was like, I don't, they're not giving me any calls and it's so slow. And he gets off your ass. [00:18:53] Shreya: Why aren't you? There are clients. So nobody on your team is on an appointment right now. And he had me go to every single call throughout the whole day late at night. I mean, with the technicians to be a real part of the team, give real service to them. It's crazy. And let  [00:19:11] Corey Berrier: I ask you the side, the byproduct of that is you built an unbelievable relationship with every technician that you  [00:19:20] Shreya: rode with. [00:19:21] Shreya: Oh my gosh. was like, yeah, it's where I, anything I needed that's a leader too, is that's what I learned about leadership, because, you know, I think about I was a 20-year-old woman. Running the team of technicians in my first year of H V A C. Like they're . That's pretty, I had to . Yeah, . So they're like, who do you think you are telling us what to do is ju you know, all those pro. [00:19:49] Shreya: That's the reason why I earned my respect to them, to where it came to a point where I could tell them anything that I needed. And they're like, yes, sir. I mean, they're like little soldiers kind of thing. So, and there was no issues with culture or getting them to do what I really needed them to do because I learned how to communicate and be a true leader and do everything I'm asking them to do and realize that leadership is, I'm a servant to these guys. [00:20:15] Shreya: I'm here to service them. I'm here to, you know, make sure that they do the best they can. Any mistakes they make is my responsibility and it's [00:20:25] on me. That is what I learned about leadership from Joe.  [00:20:29] Corey Berrier: That. And that is, oh, I agree with that wholeheartedly. So also it gives you the opportunity to really listen to what they're saying about it, it doesn't even have to do with work. [00:20:41] Corey Berrier: Right. In fact, that's where you really win that person over the confident person in you. Yeah. Is by taking the time and listening to whatever maybe they have going on. And maybe you don't care, maybe you could care less what it is, doesn't matter. But as long as you're listening and you're paying attention and responding accordingly lots of times people just want somebody to listen to them. [00:21:03] Shreya: Yeah. Yeah, cuz it gets shut down. You know, they don't, they're, or they're scared to communicate the truth. I'm like, what's really going on? Do you know what's really going on? You could talk to me. And they're open about it and they feel comfortable and because of that, I could also hold them more accountable. [00:21:21] Shreya: And they don't get offended or sensitive. They know because they know my intentions are to help them and that usually what they do, what I need them to do to help them, they benefit from it. It's always about that, you know? So that's what they start to build that trust. Cuz they have evidence that every time, I'm like, Hey, you know, we're gonna do this cuz it's better service and just trust me on this. [00:21:46] Shreya: Just try it a couple of times. That's all I'm asking. They try it, it works, it, you know, the proof of it working. And then the more that happens, the more that they're coming up to me and asking me what to do. They're asking me for more training. They're saying, we wanna go to total immersion, you know? [00:22:06] Shreya: Well,  [00:22:06] Corey Berrier: I bet you also are the first to say, I made a mistake.  [00:22:11] Shreya: Yes. Which is hard. I mean, that was really hard. It is hard. That was a really hard one because I'm not like naturally the most humble person. That's my. No. So the, it's the hardest part is yeah, learning, humility, and leadership and being like, you know what? [00:22:31] Shreya: Ugh, you, you can't do that cuz I didn't train you correctly. This is on me. It was really hard to start doing that. But the more I started to do it and the reactions I would get, I was like it started to just make me feel really good. And I enjoyed it, but it's always very difficult at first. [00:22:48] Corey Berrier: You and I both have had some similar experiences in our life that have prepared us. to recognize these things, to recognize when, and I'll savor me when my ego is taken over when Corey wants to make the decision. Or I want my outcome, or I won't fill in the blank. And when that happens and I'm not thinking about other people, things go sideways for me. [00:23:16] Shreya: Absolutely.  [00:23:17] Corey Berrier: And we learned, for me, I've had to learn a [00:23:20] lot of hard lessons. I still learn hard lessons, but I'll tell you one thing that, that I am grateful for is for the ability to be able to recognize when things are my. And because it's not always been that way. It's not, I've not always taken responsibility. [00:23:38] Corey Berrier: In fact, most of my life I didn't take responsibility until about 13 and a half years  [00:23:43] Shreya: ago. Yeah, specifically 13 and a half years ago, .  [00:23:48] Corey Berrier: Yeah. And it wasn't necessarily my choice. Like it was a choice, but it wasn't a want Mitchells.  [00:23:53] Shreya: An illusion of choice. You, it's it's this or, you know, [00:23:57] Shreya: Yeah. Complete this thing that's unthinkable. Yeah. Yeah. You have to at a certain point.  [00:24:01] Corey Berrier: We already mentioned that you're eight years sober, so I got, I want to ask you I wanna say again, that's such a big deal. It gets to be a lesser of a big deal as the years rack up. [00:24:10] Corey Berrier: But what, you know, can you just maybe take us through a little bit of that story? Cuz I know nothing about the story at all, so I'd love for you to take it, whatever you're comfortable with sharing. I'd  [00:24:22] Shreya: love to hear it. . Yeah. Yeah, that's absolutely fine. I definitely, I've shared a little bit about it. [00:24:28] Shreya: Like I, I did impulsively on stage at Profit Rocket because I really wanted them to understand the depth in what we do. It's not just, oh, I make a bunch of, no, this is this is something very deep what we do. It seems like it's not surface level. And I just wanted them to know and tell the truth to them that, you know, like I've been homeless in my life. [00:24:51] Shreya: I've been a drug addict in my life, you know? I had terrible relationships with everybody I knew. I, and I was gonna die at a certain point, where my dad was planning my funeral. That. That's what happened. And that's important to know is people kept saying, you should share a little bit about that. [00:25:11] Shreya: And I was like, oh, it's just it's dramatic and it's shocking. So I just feel weird. Oh, by the way I was a drug addict for most of my life and I almost died. I was homeless. And then, you know, and then I found refuge in in service, in spiritual practices, God, for me personally. [00:25:35] Shreya: And in a complete lifestyle change, basically. Just like what you talked about, it was, I had two choices is I'm gonna die, and I've always been full of excuses and blaming everybody. For all of my problems. And I it was almost like a spiritual experience in a way where I all of a sudden something happened where I was like, oh my gosh, I am, I'm either gonna die or there's I had hope. [00:26:05] Shreya: For some reason that I could change my life because I met a couple of people that have done it. That's the only reason is my mom is the same way as [00:26:15] me, right? She had been a, an alcoholic and drug addict her whole life, and she went to jail and she left us, you know, at a young age and all of that. And she got sober and visited me and just, and shared. [00:26:30] Shreya: Her experience with me about how she changed her entire life and she's devoted her life to service and helping people and working and contributing to society and all of those things. And I followed her footsteps, basically. I got a chance and I took the chance very seriously, like my life depended on it, and really have been doing that ever since, for eight years straight without any vacations. [00:26:56] Shreya: It's a lot of hard work for me to stay diligent about what I do, which it's all self-development is, no matter how tired I am, is I just, I believe that service is the purpose of my life especially when I'm out there, you know, not at work, not getting paid for it, just to do it. [00:27:17] Shreya: That's how I've stayed sober. I could say that's the most important thing and how I've stayed sober is relationships with people and trying just to be as unselfish as I possibly can over the last eight years, you know? So it's hard. It's hard cuz it's so natural. It like naturally comes up. [00:27:40] Shreya: Selfishness, self-centeredness. Fear is big, you know, and I have to basically have faith that I just tell myself, Hey, I've had proof in evidence in the past throughout the eight years that everything turns out okay as long as I do the right thing and I don't mess it up, . And I just think back to that and then I'm like, okay, let's just keep going then  [00:28:08] Corey Berrier: and you're, you are right. [00:28:09] Corey Berrier: You're absolutely right. So interestingly, you said something interesting, you said, well, as long as we don't get in the way, and as long as we don't try to control things, so I'll share this is a, I can't share a ton of detail about it, but you'll get the context of it. Let's just say over the last 35, 40 days, this shit I'm getting ready to tell you has happened. [00:28:31] Corey Berrier: So I've been trying to get my daughter, she's not biologically my daughter, but I've raised her since she was four. So she's basically, she's my kid, right? . And we got a call from C P S. Yep. And Bobby, obviously I didn't have anything to do with me or I wouldn't be sitting here telling you that. [00:28:49] Corey Berrier: Probably, yeah. . So anyway, it has something to do with her her biological dad and I can't get into too much of it cuz it gets into slander and all that shit and whatever. Sure. Yeah, but here's the point of me bringing that up is that I've tried to, to, and the word control is well, control is [00:29:10] appropriate in this situation. [00:29:11] Corey Berrier: Not control, like control every move of somebody. That's not the control I'm talking about. Just right. Trying to get things to fit the way I need 'em to fit or the way I think they need to fit so they turn out the way they need to turn out later in life. My daughter I'm talking about here, right? [00:29:28] Corey Berrier: In other words like discipline and so on and so forth. And it's been challenging. And the reason it's been challenging is cuz I got away from the relationships that you and I just talked about. I got away from that place that you and I that where we got sober. And. until these, there was a slew of other things that happened in the midst of all of this garbage with him. [00:29:52] Corey Berrier: And so a lot of stuff has been uncovered and the reason it's been uncovered is because I finally I thought I was gonna lose my mind and so I, I literally didn't have any other choice than just to ask God to fix it, to ask God to show my wife the things that I needed her to see so I could not think I'm losing my mind because it's felt like I've been also have h adhd. [00:30:18] Corey Berrier: So there sometimes there are lots of times shred that I can see five or six steps ahead lots of times. And this is why I'm really good at what I do, because I know when you're getting ready to make a dumb mistake. Right. I just know I may not be able to tell you exactly how you're getting ready to make it, but I know if you make this move. [00:30:38] Corey Berrier: It's gonna go sideways. If you make this move, it's gonna go right. Yeah. And so the same experience a absolutely right? Yeah. And it's, you can't you can't teach that. You can't teach experience and exactly. Not a right. So, so I had to just thank God that I got back into where our relationships are, the relationships that we're talking about, because it has given me a it's given me a new outlook on how to go about things because I've been playing God. [00:31:12] Corey Berrier: Yeah. And my way doesn't work. . You would think I would know that by now, . But clearly  [00:31:17] Shreya: not. I'm always back and forth on it too. . It's that's why it's work. I mean, it's real work. It's not just, I've decided this and it's like this forever. It's on a daily basis. I have to ask myself certain questions like, how important is this life to me and how much work am I gonna put into keeping it? [00:31:38] Shreya: is, the reality is, would I be willing to give away all of the things that this life has given me in order to keep? It actually has to be the question for me, because sure, that's not the case. It's, you know, it's not the case. I don't have to give up my career, my car, all my nice things that I got, you know, all the cool stuff. [00:32:00] Shreya: But if it came down to it, I would, in a heartbeat, I would in a [00:32:05] heartbeat, . And anytime that the question is, no, I wouldn't, there's a problem is my motives aren't right. I probably don't feel very good. I don't quite like people that much in that moment. You know this, and I'm ungrateful for everything that I've gotten. [00:32:20] Shreya: And there's no poison, like un like in gratitude. That's right for drinks, it's poison. And that's what, anytime I feel bad or anything, or I'm frustrated, it's, I'm ungrateful. I'm just I'm really, sometimes it's very, it goes down to very simple things like you said. It's well, you just, I just gotta trust God right now. [00:32:41] Shreya: That's it. Let it go and trust God because this is not something that I can manage. There's a lot of things I can do, and I take action when I can and when I should. And the rest of it I have to, you know, trust that something bigger than me is gonna take care of it. And whatever way that it does that is the right thing. [00:33:06] Shreya: Yes. Is it's, that's hard. That's real faith because you don't know what it's gonna be. . And  [00:33:14] Corey Berrier: that's the thing though. And it's, and that's just it, right? For people like you and me, we want to know the end result. Yesterday.  [00:33:22] Shreya: Oh yeah. . Right? That's why I love processes and operations so much because they're all like formulas where if you do this, you get this result. [00:33:34] Shreya: It makes me feel so safe inside. I'm like, ah. It's always the same no matter what, where your company is. What kind of people you, no, seriously. It's almost like insane that I see all these different companies from these different places that they all think they're different. we're different. Here's why. [00:33:52] Shreya: and we're different than human psychology and science, right? . And as soon as it's implemented, it's like surprise. It's the same as as everyone else, and there's a lot of comfort in that. I think that's a big reason why I like it. It's so predictable. You know, I think,  [00:34:11] Corey Berrier: yeah, I think a lot of the reason that people stay in the same, doing the same shit over and over is because, and I'm sure you'll agree with this, a lot of the people that we work with or our clients, their dad handed their business down or their grandpa handed their business down and grandpa told dad, this is how we do shit. [00:34:30] Corey Berrier: Dad told you this is how we do shit. And you're still doing shit. Grandpa did it.  [00:34:34] Shreya: Right? Right, exactly. Yeah, because that's  [00:34:38] Corey Berrier: how granddad did it. Granddad's been gone, dude. He's 150 years old.  [00:34:44] Shreya: Right. And that might have worked back in the day one and two, if anything, back in the day, probably the service. [00:34:52] Shreya: Was even better. Like maybe, I don't know. That probably I could imagine that back in the day, two [00:35:00] generations ago, it was, you know, with hospitality and kindness, no cell phones, no social media you know, maybe service was 10 times better than the grand  [00:35:12] Corey Berrier: zero generation zero doubt. It was 10  [00:35:15] Shreya: times better. [00:35:16] Shreya: I've never thought about that before.  [00:35:17] Corey Berrier: Interesting. Well, so I, you know, I don't know how old you are, nor am I asking, but, so I'll be 45 years old in March. And like I re I'm not that old. At least I don't, he myself as that old. But I remember, like I grew up, also grew up in Mayberry, so that probably doesn't help this case. [00:35:33] Corey Berrier: You, you may not even know what Mayberry do you know what I say Mayberry. Oh my god. The Andy gr Have you ever heard of the and Andy Griffith show?  [00:35:41] Shreya: Yeah. Yeah. That's Mayberry. Oh, okay. That's where you're from? Yeah,  [00:35:47] Corey Berrier: that's where I'm from. . Yeah, I know. So why did I say that? Why did I tell you that? What would I just say before that? [00:35:54] Corey Berrier: Adhd. Sometimes that happens. What was I just saying before that ,  [00:35:58] Shreya: we were talking about service and where you grew up.  [00:36:01] Corey Berrier: Oh yeah. Yeah. So yeah, so there was like a little convenience store right at the corner and like we would go in there and you know, talk to the owner and hang out and yeah, it was exactly like you would picture it was 35 years ago. [00:36:15] Corey Berrier: Like totally you know, there was no credit, like people had credit cards, but like the store would just say, oh, you don't have the money. Yeah, just get us. So when you come  [00:36:23] Shreya: back, you just pay because we know your parents and we know your family and we see you every day. And yeah, it's the anti-social nature today is why, I mean, programs like ours exist is like people don't know how to talk to people. [00:36:40] Shreya: People don't know how to display and express emotion is terrifying to them. That's what we teach people to do. And it's funny, once they do that it changes their life. I've seen people cry when they graduate, total immersion because it's much deeper than that and they don't even know it. It's not just about HVAC and talking to clients. [00:37:03] Shreya: It's a lot deeper than that. It's how you talk to your wife, your children, your family. , you know how you communicate with them and let them know that and reassure them that you love them and you care for them. And here's why. And how could I be of service of you to you and how could I actually listen to you when I get home? [00:37:25] Shreya: These moments, these relationships make up their life, right? The most important people in their lives. That's why people cry because they realize that, oh my gosh, this is how I should be talking to my wife. And then they start to think about the ways that they talk about their wife now, or talk to their wife now and maybe they ignore half the stuff she says and they're on their phone for three hours when they get home and they haven't seen her [00:37:55] cuz they've been working three days. [00:37:57] Shreya: That's a reality. And I relate to that too. That's how I know . I relate to that. Well, guess what?  [00:38:03] Corey Berrier: If you don't have somebody at home that can help you, you can't work three days straight. So that's like your biggest team member should be like, who, if you wanna call partner or wife, whatever it is. [00:38:15] Corey Berrier: Totally. Look I couldn't do the things that I do without my life. And I know most business owners couldn't do the things they do without their life. Exactly. I have a question. So I, I wonder if part of that reason when you just said that, you said they realize when they graduate they realize these things and these things are clicking. [00:38:34] Corey Berrier: I wonder if it's also because this is the first time that they've ever invested in themselves and maybe that investment in themselves has maybe gained some value in their own mind.  [00:38:48] Shreya: that is, yeah, that's perfect. Because we do have people, technicians that pay out of pocket to go to the training a lot that are that committed. [00:38:56] Shreya: They coworker, the introduction I had, he paid out of pocket three times to go to three se separate Joe Cera trainings. And he made large investments from his personal, and if anything, that's even better than the company paying for it because of what you said is they're gonna use it, they're gonna savor every moment of that because they made the investment in it themselves. [00:39:21] Shreya: So they're committed to it. It's not some free ride that they get, you know, that they're gonna take advantage or take for granted. But if they pay for it, they're more likely they outperform everybody in the class when they pay for it. So. That's funny you said that cuz we've talked about that a lot. [00:39:39] Corey Berrier: It's really true. Think about the kid that gets a full ride scholarship, and I don't mean every kid to college. Yeah. Or the kid that bust his ass or ass and make and goes through school and they have to pay for it themselves. It's a different person  [00:39:52] Shreya: coming outta that college. Oh my gosh. And you know, there's so many books on this. [00:39:55] Shreya: Like even like the classic where I learned this for the first time was thinking grow Rich. This blew my mind when he talked about how, this is just from his words, not a quote, but how, you know, rich kids have a disadvantage in the market that is a handicap. And I'm like reading it like, what are you talking, you know? [00:40:17] Shreya: I was like, what is this? Right. Full, right. and I continue, oh my god. Business is supply and demand. Right? You need to know what people need and they want, but if you never needed or wanted anything in your life, and you're disconnected from society because you're sheltered. You don't need or want, you have everything you could ever want or need. [00:40:44] Shreya: You can't understand business the same way that people that are a part of [00:40:50] that group, they know what people need or want. And that's why. And it's an advantage to, to be someone that is needed and wanted, you know, and starved like that is an advantage. Even on Shark Tank some of the billionaires on there and they won't invest in people that grew up a little too privileged. [00:41:15] Shreya: I heard them talk about that recently too. And say the same perspective of, because, you know, they think that they might know everything. And they didn't put the elbow grease into it. And there needs to be humility if I'm gonna work with somebody that's willing to learn and puts the work in, but doesn't throw money at the problems type of thing. [00:41:33] Shreya: So I mean, a little it's just, you know, what I've read and it's helped me through not feeling bad for myself if I wasn't set up a certain way. So I think it's a positive thing for people like that that, oh, well I didn't get this. That's why I'm not there. I didn't get help. That's why I'm not more successful. [00:41:51] Shreya: But if I had it, I would be way more successful. That mindset is poison. Once again. It's absolute poison and it's bull. It's just not true. It's  [00:42:02] Corey Berrier: not true. And you know, you can't believe everything you think.  [00:42:07] Shreya: Right. That's, yeah, absolutely. dude. But literally dangerous.  [00:42:12] Corey Berrier: Literally it really is, I mean if you think about, I'll just take a simple example. [00:42:16] Corey Berrier: Depending on I don't watch the news, but depending on if you do watch the news or which channel you're watching will depend on how you're thinking. Right? And that's the point of the news. It's not to inform you, it's so you'll  [00:42:28] Shreya: be informed of thinking fear-based thinking. Yeah. Fear-based poison, worst thing at fear-based thinking, all of those things will happen. [00:42:36] Shreya: Like I, I mean, I swear my mom is I have an example of this in my life. My mom is the most fearless person I've ever met, almost to an extreme where it's scary . And that's how I see her. Oh my gosh. Right? My dad is very overly. Fear, fearful person, you know, is like always, oh my God, what if I get cancer? [00:42:58] Shreya: What if you get cancer? Ah, you know, that sort of thing. So I've watched them my whole life and I feel like, you know, my mom, nothing ever happens to her. That's right. Nobody, you know, she's almost careless and nothing ever happens to her though that it matters because she just doesn't think about it. [00:43:19] Shreya: Which sounds So, look at the shit we've done. Look at what we've done. Yeah. But we've been fearless.  [00:43:26] Corey Berrier: Right. But we've done, yeah. I've done extremely fearless shit that I definitely, oh, me too. Should , right? Like our fearless stuff is pills in comparison to what? Like normal people don't really know. Like stuff that we've gone through. [00:43:40] Shreya: Yeah. For legal reasons. I'm not gonna talk about it on this show. . Hundred [00:43:45] percent .  [00:43:45] Corey Berrier: I'm totally cool with that, but I'll tell you a really funny story. Alright. So, and I don't know these two I know them now, but, alright. So I was in Vegas, this is one of the craziest stories that I had During my craziness, I moved out to Vegas with a bunch of cocaine, right? [00:44:01] Corey Berrier: Yeah. I got out to Vegas, I went out on a train and I met the, I went out a train, took me five days to get there, which was the most ridiculous thing ever. I get out there and I'm I meet this guy from the east coast and he bring, he, he asked me if I wanna do a line with him. So I said, yeah, of course. [00:44:17] Corey Berrier: Well, it was crystal meth and I, dude, I I didn't do crystal meth. Yeah. I didn't know. I didn't, knows. Almost ate my face off, right? Yeah. So as, let's just call it, two weeks later, I'm sitting on the couch in this guy's apartment. I lived downstairs with these two people I didn't even know. [00:44:32] Corey Berrier: Right. I was just a bum really at that point. Not a bum. I got kicked outta the house I was in cuz of the drugs, but the, to be truthful, right? So I'm sitting on the couch with these two guys. One of them name is Stormy and the other guy's name is Ed. They know each other from a maximum security prison. [00:44:46] Corey Berrier: All right. I am from Mayberry and I dress exactly like I do today. Like I did not fit in at all in that scenario, right? So we're sitting there and both of these guys are on each side now and we're watching the news and both these dudes come up on the five o'clock news. They had robbed a casino the night before. [00:45:06] Corey Berrier: I can't imagine what my face looked like. I think I did pretty good cuz I made it out alive. Yeah, they didn't say a word. They didn't say a thing about. and I'm sitting there I really don't know if I'm going to exit this place. And the guy, after they left the guy said, yeah, I don't know how you're still sitting here. [00:45:24] Corey Berrier: I said, me neither, but I ain't gonna be sitting here no more. I'm out. Yeah. .  [00:45:28] Shreya: Oh my gosh, that's so cra I've had the same story. I mean, in a different way. It, but the same setting. Same. And then I realize, I'm like, I don't think I'm ever gonna leave. You know, that realization of with the drugs and the environment and the person that's in front of me, I'm like, I don't think that I'm gonna, I'm gonna die tonight, basically. [00:45:55] Corey Berrier: Well, it too much friction. Crazy to try get out. Right? Because you're hook on drugs, you're probably drinking, you've got some, probably something you like there. Right. But all those things. Things, yeah. Crush  [00:46:06] Shreya: you. . Yeah, that's crazy. It's, I mean, it makes sense if we're doing similar things, we ended up in similar places with similar experiences because there is a, it's a culture, there's a, yeah, like a whole culture around, you know, when you're doing drugs, when you're drinking you end up with the same people and the same places, even if they're states apart. [00:46:26] Shreya: It's the same people in the same places. And it's crazy the comparison of that to now I think about that every day of my eight years. I make sure I do, cuz I'll forget [00:46:40] and I'll, you know, be entitled to this life. But I, in my morning routine is I sit there and my meditation is, I remember what I used to be. [00:46:49] Shreya: Ooh. I just sit there and it seems like dark, but, and you should think about like sunflowers when you're meditating , but I don't, I think about what I used to be like and the most terrible times of my life. And then I w So cuz then when I go out in my car and I'm like, wow, look my car, you know, look how nice it, oh my God, I have a car. [00:47:14] Shreya: I live in my own place. The smallest things blow my mind after I do that and I go throughout the day, I walk in the office and my heart's full. Like with all the things I'm grateful for. I just found it. It works for me to think of the negative things in a way and remember what it was like. So I have a perspective shift when I look at my life today and wow, how is this even possible kind of thing. [00:47:41] Shreya: So I don't take it for granted. that  [00:47:44] Corey Berrier: makes more sense to me than probably anybody you've ever told it to. . I literally, I'm sitting here she's exactly right. You don't remember where you've, you don't remember a lot of those things. I don't go visit a lot of those times because not, I don't necessarily shut the door, but sort of, right. [00:48:00] Corey Berrier: Yeah. Just want to just not think about all that garbage  [00:48:03] Shreya: because it's terrible. I mean, it's, it is understandable. Understandable, but there is a positive outcome to it. Which is just like with anything, the most terrible stuff, that story one you could help a lot of people with going through stuff like that. [00:48:18] Shreya: You know, and you're uniquely qualified to do so and help people that maybe other people wouldn't understand stuff like that.  [00:48:26] Corey Berrier: Do you think maybe that's why you decided to open your mouth on stage?  [00:48:31] Shreya: Yes. for sure. I just felt it. It was just yeah, because then of course a lot of people walked up to me. [00:48:39] Shreya: and told me a lot of stuff is like when I, as soon as I'm vulnerable and I open up, as much as I don't like to do it, I know that the effect is the people around me will open up to me and allow me to be of service to them and to help them. Which is the only reason why I do it, honestly, because I hate doing it. [00:48:59] Shreya: I don't wanna be seen as this weak-willed kind of person especially as a woman in the trades. I'm so, oh no, like nothing bothers me. I'm strong-willed person, so I don't love it. You know, just in case somebody might see me that way. If they know that I was a drug addict or an alcoholic, then hey, that's their opinion. [00:49:22] Shreya: They're entitled to it. That's totally fine. But yeah, that, that means that some people might say, oh, well, you know, she couldn't control herself. That's A weak-willed person. I think that's the fear behind not sharing it. Up till [00:49:35] recently.  [00:49:36] Corey Berrier: My guess is the person that makes that statement is the exact person that needs to hear you. [00:49:42] Shreya: Yeah. The, yeah. Hearing the story helps. That's a good point. Is not the result. But like the story is like, yeah, if you grew up and you grew up in a household where that's what everyone does, it's what everyone does. That's what we all do. We all drink, we all do drugs. For as long as I can remember. I mean, it's just, it's normal. [00:50:04] Shreya: It's the normal lifestyle ever. You only know your product, of your environment, and then you live that way. And then if you're lucky enough to get. , you better not take it for granted. , that's like we're talking about. Cuz you can go right back.  [00:50:19] Corey Berrier: Yeah, a hundred percent. So, you know, I didn't, I actually, we haven't really hit on the fact that you do work in an extremely male dominated industry. [00:50:27] Corey Berrier: Forgot . Yeah. So maybe we, maybe that, you know, maybe we should talk about that for a quick second. Cause you're having unicorn to a decree. I know some females that are in the trades, but I don't know a ton, so. Right. Tell me how do you navigate that? How did you know, look, I understand, and this is gonna sound completely sexist, probably, but I don't give a shit. [00:50:49] Corey Berrier: Go ahead. The best dispatch people are usually gay and they're hard as hell. Right? You don't fit that picture at all. But that's of the personality that needs to handle a group of technicians, but you're not totally that person. So help me understand how you, how do you, I'm just kidding. [00:51:06] Corey Berrier: Well,  [00:51:07] Shreya: well, I can say that. How do you know I'm not gay and hard as ? Well, I, I  [00:51:11] Corey Berrier: dunno if you're gay. I don't know about that part. But you don't look like the profile. Let me say that. . I suppose that is a very good point. I should have probably not said that. Cause I don't know. I don't know which side of the fit you fall. [00:51:24] Corey Berrier: I have no idea. And it doesn't matter to me. Like I don't care. But , you may be so fucking uncomfortable. I don't know what to do.  [00:51:32] Shreya: This is why I love this. [00:51:43] Shreya: No, I just messing if you  [00:51:46] Corey Berrier: well. So really like you're No, I said it and actually, I know you know this, I said it quite the opposite. You're, you fit, you're totally opposite than the normal person. That would be dealing with this people, because you Yeah. Are pretty, you are, you look fairly young. [00:52:00] Corey Berrier: Like you, like I'm sure you've not, I'm sure you haven't gone through this situation with no terrible comments. Let me just say that.  [00:52:08] Shreya: Oh my God. Yeah. . Right, right. I, you know, it's, first of all, I wast a dispatcher, but I know what you're saying about dispatch. I was a comfort advisor. Right. So, sure. And, but I do, I totally understand what you're saying about certain types of personalities really fitting into certain job titles because it, there can't be a fear of communication and a [00:52:30] job that is communication. [00:52:31] Shreya: You gotta be, you know, , it's a communication job, so somebody that is not to scared to tell it how it is, and hey, we need to do this to get this job done. Right. You with me? Let's go. Okay. Y yeah. You can't move on to your next call. Until you do it the right way. When it comes to women in the industry, something I learned recently that I didn't know is from like Leslie Harpo and Cassie Pound. [00:52:56] Shreya: They were talking about how there are a lot of women in the industry but we don't know them. They're just not Facebookers. And I'm like, that actually makes sense because I'm thinking, oh my gosh. Like I, I have a handful of women that I follow and I look up to but I wish there was more. And they're like, no, there's a lot more [00:53:15] Shreya: We just haven't introduced them yet. So that's why I'm excited for their podcast cuz they're gonna bring these women that they know that nobody else knows, that runs successful companies in the trades and introduce them to everybody. Which I think is so cool cuz maybe we just, yeah, maybe we just don't know that they're out there because they're not social media people. [00:53:35] Shreya: That's it. I  [00:53:35] Corey Berrier: mean, look, if I wouldn't, if I could never post another Facebook post in my life, I'd be cool with that. So guess what? Most people we work with are a lot like us. I don't know about you, but available a lot like me. So you're, that is such a fascinating point.  [00:53:49] Shreya: I, thought it was super because I was always on the, in my stand is I talked about this on the last one is really I just don't separate myself from people in the industry. [00:54:00] Shreya: I was in the car business, which is a male dominated industry, and then I went into H V A C. So , it's just, it's always been the case. But really my, actually my whole family, they're all in the trades. Women women, pipe fitters iron workers owners of H V A C C. It's in my blood to be fair to be in the trades, it literally, I'm born to be in the trades. [00:54:24] Shreya: That's what I believe. So, and it was just normalized to me. It wasn't, we, it's not weird to get up an at up in an attic or on a rooftop to, to do a job. That's not weird. Why does it make a difference that I'm a woman, they didn't put implant. That in my mind, my. That's I could give them the credit for that because I was set up for success from my family. [00:54:47] Shreya: They didn't tell me stuff like that, that, oh, you know, usually don't do stuff like that. You stay in the office. Right. They were like, no go get the wood chipper and and throw go. And then they'd have me do stuff, you know? And the boys and the girls, we would always do the same stuff. On the ranch, you know what I mean? [00:55:06] Shreya: So that, that's pretty much, I think why I grew up like that. So when I came in, it was just normal to me, and I wish that more women had the opportunity to grow up with that same mindset, but it's just not the truth because the world tells them that they belong in certain positions and they just don't know they have a choice [00:55:25] to go that way. [00:55:26] Shreya: So I just like to spread the message of you have a choice and it means self-esteem, financial freedom for you. This is a job that makes you feel really good and powerful about yourself when you get it done. Like when I go up in the attic, in the rooftop and they're looking at me like, holy shit, , and they're seeing what I'm doing, it makes me feel so good about myself when I do work like that, you know? [00:55:51] Shreya: And the guy that's like, you know what? I don't want a woman doing this work in my house. , you need to go back and send somebody else. All I do is I'm like, sir, I totally understand. Just let me do my job and then if you don't like it, you can kick me out. But let me just get started. And I just like water off a duck's back. [00:56:10] Shreya: Like it, it can't. So you have  [00:56:13] Corey Berrier: customers, so you actually have customers that I obviously you've had  [00:56:16] Shreya: customers that say that to you. Oh yeah, absolutely. And like I said, how I often would you say? I wouldn't say super often. I would say it's happened, I mean, three times in that year, and then the rest of the times they let me do it, but they're like rolling their eyes like it's a joke. [00:56:34] Shreya: And I really had to prove myself is like I had to do the job better. Well, why'd they call you?  [00:56:39] Corey Berrier: Why'd they, why did they call you if they could do it themselves better  [00:56:43] Shreya: than you? Oh, exactly. Yeah. And that's a part of the conversation. But I just I took the humility route. I laugh it off. [00:56:50] Shreya: I said, I know right. But hey, let me , right? And that's how I've gotten through this job, to be honest, is I, if someone says a joke and it's maybe a little, I mean, you know what, maybe I'll just laugh at it and not take myself too seriously, to be honest, that's worked really well. had people making some jokes on a picture of me speaking like, oh, no wonder they were listening to her. [00:57:14] Shreya: Hey, you know, all that stuff. And I thought it was kinda funny. . I thought it was kinda funny, you know, I was like, it's stupid, but I'm like, haha. And then I move on with my day. There's a lot of power in that and you can't change the way the world is. You have to adapt yourself to the way it is. [00:57:36] Shreya: That's the way it is. People are gonna tease me a little bit. They're gonna undermine me. I just focus on doing my job the best that I can and just prove them wrong from doing right, not get defensive, not make them feel bad either, because they don't know what they don't know. They're not trying, usually they're not trying to be spiteful or mean. [00:57:58] Shreya: They just don't understand. So to have empathy, laugh, move on, prove I'm wrong. That's it.  [00:58:08] Corey Berrier: Lots of times the empathy is you know, I feel bad. That person's such an idiot. Now I don't say that to 'em, but I'm like, damn, dude. Like it would suck to be  [00:58:15] Shreya: that stupid. Totally. It would totally suck. Yeah, it would suck. [00:58:19] Shreya: Like it would be [00:58:20] way harder to go through. You just don't understand social cues and situations and how to talk to people. I get it. I, if anything, I've totally been like that in my life where I was the kind of person. I had no filter. I'd say anything I wanted to anybody and it's, it was scary shit. [00:58:44] Shreya: is not appropriate. Not, it was like rough around the edges, like I'll , you know, cuz that I just grew up like that, communicating that way. So it took a lot of unlearning. So I think that's why too, I just can't get that mad at them because that's a  [00:59:01] Corey Berrier: fascinating, that's a fascinating thing you said. I mean, it's odd that you'd say you would have to unlearn those, you know, that kind of tho oh, let's call 'em behaviors because that's normally the opposite. [00:59:12] Corey Berrier: So, and it's interesting that you bring it up because I'm a deep personality. You're a deep personality. We, you know, we communicate a very interesting way and lots of times. . If you're not a D personality or even if you are a D personality, you may take us the wrong way. And the intention was never there. [00:59:32] Corey Berrier: But we just don't like a lot of shit. We just get straight to the point and just get it done. I don't need to answer 35 questions about it if you just follow exactly  [00:59:40] Shreya: what I said. It's so funny you said that. I went on a rant about that yesterday, . I'm like, cuz there's this book actually, it's called Letters to Manny and it's about being a soldier, a worker, right? [00:59:53] Shreya: And basically I'm giving this letter to Manny and you can tell the confidence by the worker by what happens after you give that letter to them. Are they like, yes sir. And they go and do it and figure it out? Or are they like, well, what's Manny's last name? What time do I have to do this? Do I have to do it now? [01:00:13] Shreya: What's the priority of this It, it's a book about that. And it's that shows You know, immaturity in the way that you're able to work and produce. If there's too many questions, it's like that. Yes. Yes, sir. I'll figure it out. Right. ,  [01:00:29] Corey Berrier: I think a lot of those questions too are fired at, you know, the right hand man, the general manager, whoever the service, whoever's of the service technicians. [01:00:39] Corey Berrier: Yeah. And here's what I believe and here's what I, my experience shows that person is putting out a lot of fires. That person is answering a whole bunch of God a minute questions. That truthfully, he doesn't even need to answer, but that's his full-time job is answering stupid ass questions.  [01:00:59] Shreya: Was that the ultimate sales machine? [01:01:01] Shreya: Was that ?  [01:01:03] Corey Berrier: Well, I love that book, but yeah, it's oh, got a minute. Yeah, probably. So , yeah, I got five minutes or got a minute manager or whatever. Yeah, I think that is where I got that.  [01:01:12] Shreya: Yeah. It's a God a minute, the god a minute [01:01:15] meetings are, they take a, it's so, such a, such bad time management and I realize, oh my God, all my meetings are, God, A minute meetings [01:01:23] Shreya: Yeah. Yeah. So here's an easy way to  [01:01:25] Corey Berrier: fix that. If you can't, what would you do if I wasn't here? and shut the door. Right? Right.  [01:01:31] Shreya: Yes, I want these people to have the gumption, the confidence and the confidence to, you know, complete the job right for that client. Make an executive decision is, that's what mostly what I do is it's like this is the best thing, this is the best thing for the client and if I even made a mistake, I'm willing to face the consequences. [01:01:55] Shreya: Sure. Let's go. Let's do it. Let's do it right now, . Just get it done.  [01:01:58] Corey Berrier: So what, so why do you think, most technicians, I know the answer to this, but I would love to hear you think, why do you think most technicians have a hard time making that executive decision? What do you really think the reason is?  [01:02:14] Shreya: Ooh, when it comes to technicians,  [01:02:18] Corey Berrier: if you've got a guy that should be able to make this decision, but he never makes the decision, he always calls first. [01:02:23] Corey Berrier: Why do you think he always calls  [01:02:24] Shreya: first? When he, what is an example of what he's supposed to be doing? Because I believe that there's not much to make a decision on that a technician shouldn't have to, because the process is tight and they should never be discounting anything. That's the only thing that they would have to be making a decision on is can I discount this job? [01:02:44] Shreya: No, we don't discount. Right? We don't do that. That's what I, that's just my automatic is, I don't know what it'd be because there's a process that's followed in a specific way. An example might be, hey, they don't know what job they want, but they know they w

When you saw the title of this podcast, what was the first thing that popped into your mind? Like “Is it too late to lose weight? Too late to go back to school? Too late to be a lawyer? Is it too late to find love? To climb Mount Everest?” What would be your end to that question? As you think it over, there are some reasons why you may come up empty handed…because life is pretty good right now. We've all been raised (those of us who are 50 or more!) to not ask, not put yourself first, and not have that on your mind. That it's not good to want. My Guest: Sheree Clark is a Midlife Courage Coach, television show host, inspiring speaker and accomplished author. Sheree has written and presented on topics ranging from finding your passion to overcoming career burnout. Her Fork in the Road coaching practice keeps her busy working with clients one-on-one and in groups on creating an authentically fulfilling life. In her personal time, Sheree and her cat Lotus work on their yoga poses. Questions We Answer in This Episode: Why do you think it takes guts or courage to be your best version of yourself? Shouldn't that be easy? How would someone know when they're not living up to their own potential or living their purpose?  How does a woman feel if she's there?  Do you think it's ever okay to “settle” and to just be where you're at, even if it's not your ideal or vision? What would you say to someone listening who feels THEY are not at their best and they want more from life? Connect with Sheree: Talk Series for Midlife Women: Free Talk Series January 16 – 31, 2023. Come find out how to thrive courageously in Midlife. Connect on Social: Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/ForkRoad/ Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/forkintheroadiowa/ Other episodes you may like: The Gratitude Podcast: https://www.flippingfifty.com/gratitude/ Why Creativity Matters More in Midlife Movement (how to get it): https://www.flippingfifty.com/creativity-matters/ Why It's So Hard to Change Health Habits (and What to Do): https://www.flippingfifty.com/change-health-habits/ Proof It's Never Too Late (and How to Do It): https://www.flippingfifty.com/never-too-late/

Cody J. Wisniewski is a Senior Attorney for Constitutional Litigation with Firearms Policy Coalition and a Young Voices contributor. He joined to discuss his recent piece in National Review, ‘Everything We Don't Like Is a Loophole': Gun Controllers' Mantra. https://www.young-voices.com/advocate/cody-wisniewski/ https://twitter.com/TheWizardofLawz Firearmspolicy.org This episode is sponsored by BetterHelp.  Give online therapy a try at Betterhelp.com/gml and get on your way to being your best self.    Join the private discord & chat during the show! joingml.com   Invest in your future & your human capital today  natescrashcourse.com   Like our intro song? https://www.3pillmorning.com Advertise on our podcast! Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

“If you made somebody laugh, then you have a spark of what it takes and you just have to work at it.” - Kalen JordanWatch this episode on YouTubeKalen Jordan:Kalen's company, Commercehero.ioKalen on Twitter: @kalenjordanBrian Casel:Brian's company, ZipMessageBrian on Twitter: @casjamThanks to ZipMessageZipMessage (today's sponsor) is the video messaging tool that replaces live calls with asynchronous conversations.  Use it free or tune into the episode for an exclusive coupon for Open Threads listeners.Quotes from this episode:Quote 01:Brian Casel: I'm really curious about this concept of moving from one business that you spend multiple years on to the next, right? Like Is there any set of criteria or big concepts like, oh, like it's got to check these boxes, whatever the idea ends up being like, it's got to be this and it definitely can't be that like?  Kalen Jordan: Yeah, that's, that's a great question. So I'm sick of recruiting, even though I felt like I did it in a way that I was happy with the way I did it. I just I'm just tired of it. Like it's tired of it. Also, the building model for Commerce Hero, I think, was kind of innovative for a recruiting thing, which was monthly. So you pay 12% on a monthly basis for up to 12 months.Most of them just charge you upfront for like the whole year of salary or whatever. And so but it would end after 12 months. So after 12 months, they're there, they're done. And if they hire somebody else, then, you know, they pay But I wanted something that is recurring. I was one of the criteria.I wanted them, the payments to not end And beyond that, I think really beyond that, like, I feel like I've been in like a slow-moving mid-life crisis for like five years or so. And I've just been trying to figure out what I really want to do, what I'm excited about. I, you know. And so basically the criteria is like, what's something I'm interested in?What's something I'm really excited about? And it's it can be challenging when your interests can change from day to day, month to month, whatever but I think I have a tendency to take an idea and run with it. And then, you know, a year later, you go, do I even want to be doing this? But you got to keep doing it kind of a thing.Quote 02:Brian Casel: A big value to a company with their people. Are there network effects? Right. Especially people in like sales and biz dev and things like that like how much can they leverage their network to bring opportunities to the business? And yeah, a company buying this for their employees is almost like buying a network for that. Yeah.A company makes its employees more networked.Kalen Jordan: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Community. Yeah. It's a similar, I think, value prop to when you send an employee to a conference, they're going to learn, they're going to you, they're going to learn from the top from formal talks. They're going to learn from networking with people. They're going to be pumped that you sent them to a conference. So it's a kind of a, you know, a simplified version of that.Quote 03:Brian Casel: And I've heard that before from other communities like they were just active in the community and then they became a moderator and then. Kalen Jordan: Right. Right. I think that I think could be part of it. Although I've kind of embraced the idea. I'm just going to work solo. I get weird about equity. I get weird about partnership percentages.But the thing that I'm excited about is not having a product that I have to build. It's just slack and so then it's really all going to be about the network, the people vetting the people, and this, you know, selling it right Like doing the outreach around it. And as I think about that, I go, you know, maybe that's more my sweet spot is like not trying to build the product itself.Brian Casel: Yeah.

A large gathering of resistance fighters join Spike in answering the important questions of the day. Like… Is it true there's no ESPN in India? Or… Why don't tall astronauts get wings? And… Would you recognize a flehmen if you … Continue reading →

Your lover doesn't give you reassurance, so now what? In order to get some clarification, we need to ask ourselves questions! Like: Is this a deal breaker? Why do I need assurance? Is this about my insecurities? Do they lack the space & emotional intelligence? Enjoy our talk! --- This episode is sponsored by · Anchor: The easiest way to make a podcast. https://anchor.fm/app Support this podcast: https://anchor.fm/lifeandthegoodvibes/support

Welcome to this week’s episode of the Thinking Big Podcast.    Today I welcome America’s #1 money mentor, Chris Naugle to the show.   Chris empowers entrepreneurs, and business owners with the knowledge of how money works.    Chris is driven to deliver the financial knowledge that fuels lasting freedom. To date, he has spoken to and taught over ten thousand Americans.   His success includes managing over 30 million dollars in assets in the financial services and advisory industry and tens of millions in real estate business, with over 200 transactions and an HGTV pilot show since 2014, and is the author of two books, including Mapping Out The Millionaire Mystery   My biggest takeaways from this episode are: How to become your own bank, and have money start working for you. The lies, or misinformation we have been told about how money works. I can now get a Money Gun!   Today we will be Think Big on money and how to use it   Connect with Chris Naugle https://www.chrisnaugle.com/ https://www.linkedin.com/in/thechrisnaugle https://www.facebook.com/thechrisnaugle https://www.instagram.com/thechrisnaugle/ Connect with Sean Osborn at Thinking Big Coaching http://www.thinkingbigcoaching.com https://www.instagram.com/thinkingbigcoaching/ https://www.facebook.com/thinkingbigcoaching/   Episode Transcript Well, everyone I want to welcome Chris Naugle to the podcast. He is the number one money mentor, and before we get too much into what you do, me and my wife had had a disagreement for the last. I'd say six to eight months that I'm hoping you can help with.   Oh,   yeah.   Okay, I want to go buy a money gun. You know, just load up money in there and just shoot that shit everywhere. I wanted money gun. She thinks that's not a wise investment of my money. What do you mean? You cannot go wrong with the money gun?   Oh my god. She doesn't think money guns a good investment here. See? I'm gonna prove that it is Hang on one second. All right, I did. I wasn't prepared for this. But let me show you how important a money gun   There we go. See?   That gotta have a money gun. So when she watches this recording, and sees that man Oh, man, it might just look like a bunch of things going at the camera. But those are hundreds.   So I am I am going to get a money guy. That's that's the first thing I'm gonna do. Come see. I knew it. I knew it. I knew it. I knew it.   Got it now.   Yeah. God, see, Snoop made it look so damn good that I just have to get one. So there we go. That's that's a no brainer. Now. Now getting into so my audience you know, a lot of my audience is young entrepreneurs, people who are new into their career, new into possibly doing a side hustle new into trying to get have their money, start working for them instead of them working for their money. And that's where I know that you can add absolute tremendous value to, to my tribe and to my listeners. Before we start, what are some? How did you kind of get you know where you are? What drove you to do it? Because to me, you know, success leaves clues. And knowing a little bit about your journey on on, you know, where you came from, and, you know, kind of where you get your journey where you are usually loved to hear those stories?   Sure. I mean, you know, from a young age, you know, and I love you know, what you teach and what you talk about, she talks a lot about imagination and dreaming. And that's kind of where I began, you know, I grew up in a lower middle class family mom didn't have any money and dad wasn't really in the picture. And I had to just imagine things, you know, I wanted to be a pro snowboarder, and I wanted to skateboard in a dirt bike. And I couldn't just have those things. I couldn't just say, Hey, Mom, let's go buy a dirt bike, or Hey, I want to snowboard I had to first visualize it. Now, a lot of my upbringing was that was dreaming, visualizing so deep that you know, I would draw pictures of me doing it and then at night, I would literally dream about me actually doing that. And, you know, by the, you know,   trying to remember how old I was like 15 or so, I was so dead set on being a pro snowboarder because I watched all the VHS tapes of these pro riders. And that's all I want to do. So that materialized and I did become a pro snowboarder, but it's not like you could just think of it and then all the sudden happens you have to go out there and do what everybody else is unwilling to do. So that's kind of like a lot of how my upbringing was right to my first clothing line that I started in mom's basement. And that was just a dream. I actually hated my job. I worked at a restaurant I was degraded so badly that that job led me to the point where I said, I'm done trading hours for dollars. And the only alternative is what call, I got to make money somehow to go on these snowboard trips. So started printing shirts with my art teacher Mr. Mahal ski and selling them in backpacks. And then I'd get friends that would come in, and I'd say, Hey, I'll give you a shirt if you helped me sell these to people in school, and it just one after another. And then on the snowboard journeys, we would stop at the stores, you know, along the way, and I'd map them out on a back then we didn't have GPS, just so everybody knows I'm a little older, we have actually a map, and we'd map out all the shops, and we'd stop and ask him to sell the clothes and that materialized. And by 17. I'm like, you know, this whole, traveling around with a bag of clothes is cool, but I want my own store. And that became my next big dream. And that dream almost led me to my first like, you know, failure. I don't want to say failure. But you know, where you get to a point and everybody tells you you can't do something. There's no way that's possible. There's no way that's going to happen. You're a fool. That's a stupid idea. You're going to lose it all kid, you know, like that movie, you'll shoot your eye out, kid. Well, that was that was me. And I almost gave up. And I remember I needed 70 grant to open fat man board shops in 1994. And I couldn't find 70 grand I had no idea how to raise it. Every bank said no. But I, I got one bank that said, Hey, if you can collateralize the loan, we'll give you 70 grand. And to me, I didn't even know what the word meant. And they told me and I'm like, great, I've got a 86 Audi 4000, I've got a dirt bike and a baseball card collection Will that do? And they said now we're thinking something a little bit more. My mom knew that this was like the thing that stood in the way of me chasing my dream and not and she put her house the only thing she had in the world I grew up in a 700 square foot two bedroom ranch out in Lockport, New York. And she put that house on the line so that I could get that loan and chase that dream. And that's, that's where life got interesting. Because I was becoming a pro snowboarder, now I had these stores and I had a whole new obligation that was don't fail or mom and you want mom and me lose the house, you know, I don't have a place to live. So that's a lot of pressure on a 17 year old man. That's where it began. And I'll never forget, you know, everything started going well. And by the early 2000s, I had multiple stores was highly leveraged. And then the.com crash hit and I really had to make some decisions, I was either gonna deliver pizzas or go do something and I put my resume out. And I got calls from Wall Street firms of all places. And that's kind of where the story begins with money as I landed in Wall Street, it was just like the movie Wall Street with Michael Douglas. I mean, that was what I was chasing. That's kind of in my mind what being a stockbroker was even though it's not it, that's what I envisioned. And I dove in. And at first, it was a temporary thing. But it ended up being something I was really good at something I really enjoyed. And I still continued running my stores, but I wasn't working in the store anymore. And I remember who's kind of weird like a pro snowboarder, because at that time had gone Pro. And now all of a sudden, every day I'm wearing a suit, kind of like messes with your mind, who actually you actually have to, you know, mindsets, everything, you actually have to kind of separate, you know, that whole two sides, like one side is I'm going to wear my jeans, my hoodie, my beanie. And then the other side is, I'm going to go be an advisor, I'm going to put the gray suit on with the black tie. And I'm going to do that thing. And that was hard for me. But I was really, really good at the advisor role and I was working on my stores not in them anymore. So the stores actually started doing a lot better. And that's when I started learning a lot about money and stocks and bonds and everything was like a dream. You know, at that point, I was making more money than I'd ever made. And, you know, I was running my stores doing the pro snowboard thing. And hash man, I remember like from 2004 to 2008. It was just like a fantasy world. And I remember, you know, I flipped a couple houses 2006 and seven in 2008. I decided to dive in and I bought a dilapidated paint store to convert it into a strip mall where my main Batman store was going to be and I mean, you know exactly where I'm going. Because in 2008, many of you will remember what happened. Some of you might be too young, but in 2008 was the great recession that thing hit me like a Mack truck and I was one payment, one payment from being bankrupt. And at that point, that was my first like crush. You know, a lot of people realize that and I remember, you know, I was so beat up so down in the dumps that I came home to my girlfriend who had just moved into my house like, you know, all of us have that girlfriend that moves into the house, right? You show up one day and our bags are there. Or maybe that's just me, but I like to think everybody goes through that. And I came home to her and I said Sweetie, I need your help. I need your help paying the mortgage. I need your help paying the utilities. And by the way, my friend Pete's gonna move into that bedroom and my friend Jessica is going to move in into the bedroom upstairs. Any questions that go? Yeah, well, I thought I had a 5050 shot it 150 percent she was gonna walk out the door and never come back. And I had a 50% shot that she was gonna at least help with some of it. And I think she kind of liked me because she actually did stick around. And, you know, we're now married, we have a 10 month old, but so you can see where that one went. But that's how I made it through that time. It was it was hard. Working from 4am till 10 o'clock at night, I had a lot of changes. But that was my first crash and then 2009 to 14 and I'm going to get right to the point of how I learned what I did here. I got into real estate real heavily and I I thought I was doing everything right I read the books, I you know, I'd watch some videos, and I just dove in and I got up to 36 units I was so proud of myself. I'm like, Oh my god, I got this real estate thing figured out and and everybody that's in real estate knows that nine to 14 man was that a good time to buy because everything was on sale and sometimes on sale. 70%. So I amassed 36 units at great prices. But where I made the mistake is I didn't understand how money really worked. And by the 37th unit, the bank said no more. You don't fit in a little box, we're gonna we're not going to give you this next mortgage. And I thought that was it. But that led me to getting a little behind. Then they froze my lines of credit so I couldn't finish units and then then that story in 14 and I had to sell all 36 units in a went quick. I remember I was having a hard time making ends meet. We me and my wife are well she's my fiancee then But me and Larissa had just bought our dream house, I had the two Audi's in the garage, you know, everybody envisions like you get to that point where you're doing well, but now all of a sudden, everything was crumbling under me again, this is like the third time this has happened in my life. So you can see, I'm on this crazy roller coaster. Right? I have money and then I then it's all gone. And then I have money and assets. And then it's then it's all gone again. And this one hit me the hardest because I really thought I'd figured it out. I thought I'd made it. And then all of a sudden, just one turn of events, one change, one thing happens. And now all of a sudden, I'm right back at the bottom and life is falling apart. I'm selling that dream house, I'm selling the audio in the garage, I'm selling all my rental properties. And I just felt so defeated. And I had dreamed this life I dreamed up this house I dreamed up that as for in the garage, like all these things, I had dreamt and imagined them happening. That just all fell apart. And I'll tell you the next part is pretty miraculous. And what happened in it was I got a postcard to go to a three day seminar to learn how to flip houses. And I didn't want to go, you know, I wasn't going to the seminar to learn how to flip houses, but they were giving away a free iPod Shuffle. And I was like, I gotta have that.   So I want like a money gun.   It's just like, you go to an event and someone shoots the gun at you, you know, it's like, you're just thinking that so I go there, and I was so bored. I'm like, I'm the advisor in this room. And these guys, you know, you don't have an ego, I'm not gonna lie. You know, you go through life. And you know, you think you make it and you get an ego. And it's hard to shed that ego. But two guys got up in front of Mike and Greg. And they start talking about money. them like I perk up I'm like old money or now we're talking about something my life. And they start talking about money in real estate and what they're doing and how they're using it, how they're being the bank, and I've never heard the be the bank thing. Like my hat says BYOB. A lot of people like oh, bring your own beer. Well, no, it's become your own bank. And that's what they're talking about. And they started saying things that I'm like, listening to and I'm like, No, it doesn't work that way. Oh, no, it can't be that way. You're doing what? How are you? You know, I start questioning. All these things are saying and these are the two rock stars, these guys were very successful. One had an a&e show. And all of a sudden, by the end of that event, I mean, I remember they do their call to action. I was the first guideline, credit card getting maxed out for money that my lawyer said moved back in and I thought she was going to kill me. But I knew that I had just heard something that was about to change my life. And what they talked about was that one thing that changed my life and it was so simple. And that's what I liked about it was like all I had to do to do what they were doing is change one thing in my life. And at that moment, 2014 I began that transformation that change. And that's when everything changed at that after that I started going to masterminds and I had mentors, and I couldn't afford any of this. I want everybody to be clear to remember I just lost just about everything. So when people think about this, like oh, you must have had all this money. No, folks, I did not you know what I had? I had a VISA credit card, same one I still have today. And I max that sucker out. Over and over. I just I knew I had to have what these people knew. Because I knew the answer to why I was riding this roller coaster was lying in the secrets of the wealthy. I knew that these wealthy individuals knew how to do it, and I didn't and I needed to bridge that gap.   That's, that's very interesting because a lot of people won't, or don't spend the money to learn, they don't. And the way I look, the way I always look at is I would rather spend a few $1,000 and compress, you know, two to 10 years in two months, you know, learning what other people what other other people know. And then people who don't invest in other programs just aren't going to get very far. Now Now, one of the things you said I'm an I'm an out date you a little bit. So and we actually have kind of parallel back backgrounds a little bit. So I grew up in Colorado, and I was a skier. But this was way before snowboarding wasn't really even a thing back then. And I was actually and I was actually Hawking t shirts. That said, Give me Rossignol or give me head. Because those are the two big ski brands.   My at the end of my first I had snowboards was my number one sponsors, really.   So you know, and I was in like, I don't know, maybe sixth grade hockey and give me Rossignol or give me head. T shirts. So brings it brings back brings back some some memories. So what are you so money does not work the way that we think it truly does not. And there there is things that people with money know that people without money, don't know, there's assumptions, there's lies, there's, you know, just the perception of what what money really is, you know, what are some of the things that I don't know about money that I need to know about money,   it's easy. We are brought up and it's no one's fault. We're brought up in a society in a world where we're literally lied to every single day about what money is how money works, and everything else. And the biggest mistake, all of us make, and myself included until I learned what we're about to talk about is we are not in control of our money, we have been taught our entire life to give up control of our best dollars, like I'm holding $100 bill, like we've been taught to take these dollars, and give them to somebody else, deposit them in somebody else's bank. And we just think that that's right, we think that's normal. And then when things happen, like my story, we're not in control of the dollars that we need to take advantage of the opportunities that present themselves, because we've already given up control because somebody somewhere convinced us that we are not capable of being a good steward of our own money. And I'll tell you break it down to every one of you, nobody, even a high level financial advisor like I was for 16 years, nobody will ever care more about your money than you do. So why? Why do we give up control of our money? The tool? Because that's all money is a tool? Why do we give it to somebody else? Why do we deposit money in the bank? Ask yourself, why do you do that? That's the simplest thing. You know what? Like, let me ask you, why do you deposit money in the bank?   Because that's just what we do. That's what we've been taught. my paycheck goes directly into the bank app, I never see it.   And it's because of what you just said, because that's what you've been taught to do with your money. And you just don't even think anything of it. What if I were to tell you that the bank makes 400 to 13 100% more money than you do on your dollars? Like you're like most people when I say that? No, they don't they can't they lend it out at six. And I'm making wonder if you're only making five? No, they're making 400 to 13 100% more than you are because what they're doing is they're moving your money continuously and consistently. I mean, most people when they take money into the bank it take this $100 and give it to the teller, you know, what do you think happens? You think when you hand that money to the teller the teller takes your $100 bill and puts it in a little box in the back with your name on it. Heck, no man that the money that bank takes your money and lends it out in those little glass cubicles, and does make 400 to 13 100% more because they're making the margin and they're giving you next to nothing. And we just think that's okay, folks, that's not okay. It's not okay. And then when you need your money, let's say you got a large sum of money or 10,000 or more in the bank and you want it all because you got a great opportunity. Go to the bank and try to take all your money out. Try just just, you know, a lot of people tried doing this back during COVID in March in April, and they realize the true fact they wouldn't give you all your money. They're like, well, we can't give you it all now and you're just you know, in most people are just like all that stuff. Okay. Well, can I just come back like houses were like, almost like we're asking permission for the bank to give us our money back, folks. You're brainwashed. You're brainwashed and listen, like I'm seeing this and I get so passionate about this because that was me. I just thought this is okay. And then not only that, like what else do we do like if any of you listening like have a job or you have a business that has retirement account, you get your paycheck and before you even get it, the money goes into that form. One key thing that you've been told by everybody is exactly what you should do to save for that fictitious day called retirement. Or when you're going to sell off on your sailboat out into the water. Very few people ever do that to see, you know, statistically only five out of 100 people are going to be financially secure at the age of retirement. So right there lies the problem. And the problem is our whole life, what we've been trained to do is to conform to what somebody else tells us, our future life should look like 5% only five of those 100 created their lifestyle and created their financial futures. And that is where the problem is. You all wait including me have forgot how to create.   And if we don't create it ourselves, no one is going to create a course they're definitely not back there trying to create the wealth bores now do you think the stock market? I'd like to get your insight on the stock market? Do you think it's a game? Again,   it's a fixed game. Yeah. And it's going to crash and burn in 2022 and 2023. And that's very controversial. I say that I upset people. You know, like, no, it's not, it's not going to crash Listen, like it will crash and to will in 2000.   Yeah. It To me, it's, it's all a perception of what people think it has. No, there's a lot of it that doesn't have merit on the back end, how things are valued, or, I mean, I lost millions in 2000 when the stock market when the dot bubble hit, millions just disappeared, literally, literally overnight. And so what do you think about like, you know, the hedge funds and like the the GameStop thing it to me that that just shows the complete when when a group of people could go and just obliterate a hedge fund. To me I kind of giggle when I saw that. I'm sorry, but   I thought it was great, man, I wish I could have went out and patted all those retail investors that played that game and but you know, they didn't beat the hedge funds. A lot of people like oh, we won this. No, no, you didn't you actually lost but you proved the point. And you proved the point that the hedge funds are not Invincibles you know, they can be beaten in now in today's digital world, if people band together keyword if people come together for a unique, you know, a uniform goal. And that goal was Hey, we're gonna drive GameStop up, then you actually can be traveling. But the problem is, unfortunately, it's called FOMO. Okay, fo mo fear of missing out. That's one of the most dangerous things I just did a recording the 10 biggest mistakes investors make and that's one of them is FOMO. People think when when GameStop was going up. Now let's look let's think about GameStop. Because everybody remembers this. It's pretty recent. When that was going up, like where did people forget the GameStop. On its best day, its greatest year was a $20 stock in its best day. And it got to $500. And people thought that it was a good thing to buy. It's called FOMO. It's just the same thing. When you go to the casino, and everybody's winning, and you see everybody like winning, you're like, Oh, my God, I'm missing out, put it all on black, and then you lose it on you're like, Well, that was stupid. Like, well, that's GameStop. That was stupid. I see in GameStop. I mean, I'm a professional trader been doing it. 20 years, I understood everything that was happening. I understood the short side the cover, you know, I understand why they were able to beat that because they pushed it so high that that hedge fund couldn't cover anymore, and they just had to just lay their cards down. But the thing is, is the retail investors actually lost that battle because they all jumped in it at the top and some of them didn't get out. And that's, you know, one of the biggest mistakes here's, here's the easiest rule. If anyone wants to make money in investing, here's his golden ticket. This is how you make money and you'll never be wrong. Follow three rules. Rule number one, buy low. Rule number two, sell high. Rule number three, don't lose money. And you know what the best part about rule number three, is it happens automatically when you do one in two. So why is it that every single person that invest unless they're a trader or professional trader? Does the complete opposite? In most people like No, they don't think about it right now. Are people piling money into the stock market? Absolutely. Why is the stock market going up like crazy right now? It's because people are piling money in, they get their stimulus check. A lot of people are dumping it in the market. Where's the market? all time high. So what are what are people actually doing and what do people do? They put they buy high? And then what do they do when the market goes down? Fear sets in and they sell   low? And what do they all do lose money. They do the exact opposite of what they get on they do everybody the second starts going down, people are gonna get beer kicks in and they're gonna, they're gonna sell. They're gonna say shit, sell it all, sell it all. And here's the thing that people who know what's going on. They're selling right now sitting back. When it goes back down there, they're getting. So I actually did that one year. So I think it was in 2008. I'm like, Mother, I'm not gonna do this again. I saw it going down. This wind went way down. I took out A loan on my 401k as much as they would do it when the stock market I think was like 13 or 14,000 at the time, and then I put it in an account. And then when, when the stock market was down to like three or 4000, I put it all back in. I just knew that. Because when I got burned in in 2000, with all that I, I started paying a little more attention to how the stock market, I'm no pro by any means. But I start paying attention. I'm like, Okay, I'm gonna try getting ahead of this. I pulled all this money out of it, and then put it back in when it was low. I probably lost it all since then. But you know, it's,   yeah, I did the right thing. And that's a hard thing to do. How did you feel when you were buying into that market when it was all crashing around you and you're listening to everybody around you losing money in every paper and every news channel is all you're losing? It's it's all going to fall apart? And here you are, you're buying because you just knew that you should do this. But what did it feel like to actually buy during that?   I was giggling he for once I might win something.   Now a lot of people when they actually do it, they're supposed to do they actually have fear doing it. They're buying into a market going down and mentally they're so like, it's I don't know what they call it. But when the markets are going up, there's something inside of us that makes us feel warm and fuzzy and excited. You know, it's going up. But when it's going down fear is there. And it's hard to want to buy an oil I don't know if I should it's going to go lower, of course it's going to go lower. Well, I'm going to buy in when it gets to the bottom, you'll never get the bottom and you'll never get the top you can't time the market. So the best thing to do is just when it goes down you just start buying systematically and consistently just by you know and it's it's funny you mentioned about like selling right now what are the wealthy doing right now? Like we're so everybody listening to this, you know, right now we're we just turned into April of 2020. What are we in 2021 COVID happened and we all forgot about what year it was, but 2021 and the wealthy individuals, I know, multimillionaires and billionaires are all selling my real estate portfolio that I built up over the last six years selling, selling just listed another three properties. I just sold two, I started with 91, about a year and a half ago, and I'm down to I'll be under 20. And people must think Oh, are you crazy? Like Is something wrong? Like do you need the money? Oh, absolutely not matter of fact, I don't need the money at all. But I do understand the principle of what I just said rule number one is buy low. I did that. Rule number two, sell high, the market is high. So I could hold these. But what why to ride the next cycle back down? Why would you do that? And that's the thing like with stocks? Why in the heck would you ever buy a stock and just you know, buy it at the top and you feel good? And then all sudden, you're just like, well, if it goes down, I'll just ride it out. No, you won't. And 90 plus percent of the people that buy stock or mutual funds or ETFs, don't ride it out. They've just conditioned you in your mind to believe that invest for the long haul you'll be okay, but no one ever does. Because when it actually happens, it's a different reality. Fear kicks in. But then reality happens next. And the reality is I lost my job. I don't have any money to pay my mortgage, I can't pay my kids college tuition. And Heck, I can barely put food on the table. And I got all this money sitting in my 401k. And I was supposed to ride this out because it's like 40% down I What are you gonna do? You're gonna you're going to put food on the table for your family? Are you going to worry about your retirement accounts loss you're going to sell? Of course you are and you're going to take major losses, which are then real, and then you're going to pay taxes folks like this is what people do. So why would you do that? Just do the opposite of everybody else, and you will probably be way better off.   And that that's in anything in life. If you see a herd of people doing something, do the opposite. Don't do what they're doing. Because you you will know I know that you do a lot of stuff in in real estate and I'm part you know, with COVID. You know, COVID happened. You see all of these companies, you look at downtown's now, like downtown Houston, I'm in Houston. And you see a lot of these high rise buildings that were businesses that they're now figuring out, hey, we might not need that real estate, we can do a lot of stuff from home. I'm person I'm waiting for a boom of conversions where people real estate investment trusts REITs come in, and they say, okay, we're gonna convert these two housing to living. Are you seeing anything in that in the real estate? I just think there's gonna be such a big thing in the in the business side, you know, we're companies are not going to need the space that they have that they currently have. And how is that can be repurposed? And how can we position ourselves to take advantage of possibly some of that real estate that I think is going to happen? It might not be in a year might be in three or four years, but it's going technology is getting better? More and more companies are going to go remote. And I think a lot of that real estate is going to be converted to something. I don't know what but something.   You're absolutely correct. You know, one of the biggest things that this country lacks is affordable housing in there's a massive need. for affordable housing, there's, there's not enough rentals for the amount of people there's people that will you know, very soon I don't know when when they stopped with this moratorium bullshit scuse my language, but there's gonna be a massive, like problem with people's mortgages with some, you know some companies that own some of these larger facilities, they think they're not going to be able to stabilize some of these buildings. Again, like you said, it might not be a year or two years or down the line, it's not going to be immediate, but you're going to have a major transition because these big sky rises that used to hold all these people, all those people are working from home on channels like this, or zoom. They're not in those offices. So how are these companies going to afford to pay all those rents? And, you know, pay all those overheads? They're not? So yeah, I think you're gonna see a massive switch, that these commercial spaces are going to start converting into living spaces you're already seeing in strip malls, you're seeing strip malls, be converted into self storage facilities, you're seeing old box stores like Kmart, and that being converted into storage facilities, Heck, even Walmart's so you're already seeing it happen. Because the world's changing, Amazon is obviously needing more warehouse space. And so is every single business in the world, because they're all going digital, and it's changing time. So how do you capitalize on that? Well, you get ahead of it first, but now would be too early. Because if you buy now, real estate way too high. And remember the rules, you got to always go back to the rules buy low, not high. And then what's going to happen, though, is when all this does settle. And the government, you know, stops with this modern monetary theory nonsense of printing, which they're just trying to drive inflation, if you see the price of things going up, folks, that is just your dollars becoming weaker, it doesn't mean that things are going up in cost, your money is becoming weaker, because the Fed is trying to do that they're trying to create inflation. But the problem is, it's not working. And it won't work. Because this thing's gonna all blow up and crash and burn. This is the largest experience or experiment in our history with the financial systems. And I don't think it's gonna work. And so to most economists, they don't think it's going to work. So if it doesn't work, what does that mean for you? It's not good. Because if you got all your eggs in the baskets, where they want you to put your money, stocks, bonds, mutual funds, ETFs, that's where they want you to put your money, then you lose it all. But you know what, when when you lose, somebody else gains when the Fed increases inflation. Who wins the government do when when milk is double the cost of gas is double the cost when lumber goes up? 40% Oh, sorry, just did who loses? Not the government you do, the government wins, because the the deficit in the money they owe is now cheaper, because they can pay it back with weaker dollars. You see, that's the whole game. And there's only a couple ways to get ahead of this. And you got to just change. So a lot of people like well, it's all over. What am I going to do now? I don't know. I guess I'm just going to try to enjoy my life and hope for the best until this whole thing explodes, as says, you know, says this Chris Naugle guy, I know, there's more hope than you can believe. And it's so simple. You just follow what the wealthy to do change one thing. And that is where your money goes first, and then I'll teach, you know, and that's what we do with BYOB or the money multiplier. We teach people exactly how to do that. And how to do the same thing that the banks do the same thing that the wealthy do with their money. And it's something that's been done for hundreds of years, and it will not fail, and it will not crash and burn, and you will come out on top. And that's the beauty. It's like I can say that with the utmost certainty because it has to work.   Yeah. It always has. So is that Yeah, I know. You talk about your infinite banking. You know that that philosophy of of what you do that concept of what you do it? That is exactly what it I mean that is that exactly what you're discussing our Thursday, I'm thinking what,   what I learned in 14 was I sat there talking to you know, this guy, Mike Baird, about real estate, and he was lending me money. And he starts talking about this thing, you know, and call that his private bank. And awkward. That sounds cool. Tell me more about this private bank thing. I didn't learn that and Wall Street school. He starts telling me and he's going into it. I'm like, Wow, that's awesome. Wow, it's guaranteed to it's tax free. Come on, like, Dan, someone's lying to you. But keep going, keep going and telling me all this stuff that he's doing Oh, yeah, I can put money in and take it out immediately. And I still make uninterrupted compound interest on every dollar even though I took the money and I'm just like, Dude, what is this thing? And then he tells me, and I lean in, I'm like, someone's lying to you, man. I'm sorry, Mike. But I'm an advisor. And this is not how that thing works. And he leans into me and he says, Chris, if it doesn't work that way, then how have I been lending money to you all this time from this? And how has it worked? exactly the way I just explained I sat back huh? You got a point there. So Mike, how do I learn this thing? He's like, I can't teach it. I just use it. So call this Brent guy and you know, and that led to me watching a 90 minute video that was my my toll if you will to be able to talk to this brand guy. And that 90 minute video is what changed my life and I If anyone wants to know what a privatized bank is, you guys are not probably going to be ready for what I'm going to tell you. But a privatized bank is you creating your own bank, but not at a bank, at an insurance company, and you do it with a vehicle you all know and probably don't like called whole life insurance. Oh, that's right. But it's not the whole life you buy from an insurance professional or insurance store. It's a very specially designed and engineered whole life design that can get really the only people that know how to do this are the people that only do this, your financial advisors, I I'm hard pressed to find a financial advisor that actually understands this. They say they do because they, you know, they're like me, they think they know everything. No disrespect. But believe me, guys, you know, you think you know everything about money. And then when they actually learn about it like I do, they're like, I didn't know it could do that. I didn't know it worked that way. I didn't know I could give up my commission so that the client actually has access to 60 to 90% of their money immediately. Yeah, well, you should have studied with the Rockefellers, the Rothschilds, and what every bank in this country has been doing for hundreds of years. And that's so my   financial, so my financial advisor that pulls up in a beat up, Camry might not know about how to how money works,   I find, you know, and I know a lot of advisors, and you know, a lot of them get mad at me, because I kind of beat up on them a little bit. But I've earned the right to, and I always tell them, I say you don't understand this. Well, yeah, I don't know what whole life is, again, exactly. You don't understand how this work, right? Otherwise, you'd be doing this. But then they don't do it. Because they don't want to give up their commissions. They don't want to, I mean, let me let me ask you this, your financial advisor that pulled up in that beat up, Camry, like, do you think he'd be willing to give up 90% of his income so that you could have access to 90% more money?   Absolutely not,   you're absolutely correct. And that's the whole name of the game. In order for privatized banking to work, the way that it works for the banks in the wealthy, somebody's got to give up a lot. And that somebody is that the money mentor, the advisor, or the IBC practitioner that knows how to build this, they have to give up their commission so that you have access to your money. And then that's where the fun begins. So once you get somebody that's actually willing to do that, and actually, I got to go back to that camera, because that's funny in Wall Street, when I was when I was an advisor, one of the jokes was, you know, why do people pull up to Wall Street in a Rolls Royce to take advice from some of you that took the subway and and very true. Most of the clients that I helped, and that I've dealt with had way, way more money than me, but for some reason, they took advice from me, it was a weird dynamic, but that gets the guy's got to think about that. We should all be taking our advice from the people who have done it, who have made it and who are living what we would articulate as the perfect day. And if you're not taking your advice from that person, or actually getting guidance on that, then you're doing it wrong, and you're learning about the big lie even more, you're doing everything backwards so that somebody else can have control of your money and make money on it. And that's that's what privatized banking does. It puts you in the driver's seat in in 100%, control of your money. And what else it does is it puts a perpetual tailwind behind your money. Think about an airplane right? airplanes. When they fly. They're either flying with a tailwind or headwind. And when you have a tailwind, you're like, oh, the pilot comes on and says, oh, we're going to arrive 30 minutes early, we had a nice tail, and you're like, That's sweet. The plane didn't have to work any harder, didn't have to fly any faster, nothing had to change. But we got here 30 minutes faster. What you don't realize that plane was going 150 miles an hour faster than it was the other time when you were on the plane going the other direction. The headwind is not something that most people think can change, but it can't. And it's it can change with something that Albert Einstein talked about a lot called compound interest. But let's add one word to that on interrupted compound interest. Imagine this, I'm just gonna do a visual if I can't, because I'm a visual thinker. Imagine I have $100. And let's say I change one thing, this $100 that normally would go into someone else's bank, you actually took this advice, and you say, you know, I'm going to change where this money goes first. So you change and you put this money into this specially designed and engineered whole life. So I got $100 that I just put into it. And I don't get caught up in the numbers, folks. It's just an example. Like, should be more than that. But now I get $100 there. What does the insurance company Give me that my bank doesn't? Well, right now in 2021. All the insurance companies we use which are mutually owned dividend paying insurance companies pay a guaranteed 4%. So does your bank pay you 4% on your deposits?   Hell no.   There you go. That's the right answer. Hell no. They don't barely give you 1%. So now I'm better off there. But then the insurance company because their mutual says hey, every year based on our surplus assets, we're gonna give you a dividend. So I'm like, Wow, that's cool every year. Yeah, it's not guaranteed, but we've paid dividends out for over 100 years, and we're gonna probably pay dividends for the next 100. So now listen, I'm not just making four I might be making six. So now I'm making 6% on my money. That's way better than the bank. But now, the reason I put the money in the bank is because I've been lied to and taught that. That's the Any place that can put money and take it right back out, and Oh, God, I gotta have my money. How many of you listening to this right now, when you look at your bank account on that piece of paper, you get warm and fuzzy, but the more there is there, the more money you have in somebody else's bank, the more you're losing the game, just so you know. But that's what you you feel warm about that, because you're like looking at it, you like touching it, that means your money's not working. Your money has to be working everyday because you only have so many hours in the day, most people work 40 to 80 hours a week. And after that you're just shot, right? So if you can't work any more hours, then how can you make more money? Well, I can get a raise, I can do things more efficiently, I can find a better job, I can start a hot side hustle. But you are always going to be research restricted by the number of days or hours in the day, you can only make so much the problem, or the thing that you need to do is you need to stop thinking about how much money you can make by trading hours for dollars, you need to start thinking about your dollars going to work because most people have equity in their homes have money sitting in 401, K's and money sitting in the bank accounts. And you know what, I want you to visualize this. Because this is the way I learned it. You come home after a really hard day, you open the front door of your house, you're exhausted, it's late, you just want to go to bed and you look over into your living room and you catch a glance of your couch and on your couch is your money. Your Money is literally sitting on your couch laughing eating potato chips spilling all over drinking your soda watching TV. And it's been doing this every day for the last week, the last month last year, and it looks over at you and it says What did you have another hard day? Because that's what you do, folks? you lent money was exactly it's exactly what in laws except for the money actually would go to work your in laws won't go to work. You could walk over to your money, you can say you know what, tomorrow, you're going to go to work, you're never going to get a vacation, never gonna come home, you're never ever going to stop working until the day you're gone. And your money would be very thankful because finally you gave it a purpose. People just don't know how to make money work. So let's go back to that one, change that $100. We put it into that bank. And we know the banks paying us better interest guaranteed. We know it's paying us a dividend. But now what about liquidity? You put your money in the bank? Because you can take it back out? Well, yeah, we have liquidity. In the first couple years, you might not have 100% access to all the money. But how much do you have 60 to 90% in the first year. So let's say I put 100 in and I want 90 back, I can go immediately in the first 30 days and take 90 out. Now that was your regular bank and you started with 100 new took 90 out how much money is still earning interest in your regular bank $10. The remaining amount in my bank, this privatized bank, which is the specially designed whole life $100 is still in my account. And I'm holding $90 like literally I've got no I'm just holding a bunch of money I'm holding $90 in my hand and $100 is still in the bank earning 4% plus the dividend. How can that possibly happen? Well, this 90 I'm holding in my hand, it's not even my money. See the insurance companies have all the money and they will gladly lend me money and alone of nine Duff. So all I do is I go online, I click a button, no application no credit check in 36 hours later, the money's in my hand I'm holding $90. Where did the 90 come from? Is what people typically asked me? Well, it came from the insurance company's general account. Yeah, I get that. But why would they just give it to you? And why wouldn't they ever want that loan back because you told me that I don't have to pay the loan back, who's making loans and not asking for the money back insurance companies. Why? Because all they did is when you took that contract out, they promised two things promise to pay you 4% guaranteed. And they promised you a death benefit the day you graduate from this world, or this earth or whatever you want to call it graduate means Dodgers so everybody knows. So what they do is they take this $90 and they subtract it from my death benefit, it's the same thing to the insurance company someday they got to pay that death benefit out. So it doesn't matter if I use it while I'm living or when I'm dead. They're just going to give me this $90 is the loan, they're gonna charge me interest on it, but not more interest in what I'm earning on my money. So now I literally have an arbitrage on money. And I'm holding $90 now the most important thing is, you just learned how to make uninterrupted compound interest on your money. But now you got 90 bucks. So what are we going to do with this 90? We're going to go put it on black? are we actually going to do something productive and make this $90 that wants to go sit on my couch? But really doesn't. We got to make it work. So where is it gonna work? could work in real estate? It could work? How about even easier how many people you know, have credit card debt. So let's just assume somebody's got a visa. And they're paying, you know, it's just for simple math. The visa is $90. Okay, that's their balance. And they're paying, you know, 10 bucks every single month on that visa trying to pay that $9 balance off, but visa is charging them 20% every single year. That's the headwind. So even though you're trying your hardest to pay this debt down, it just never seems to get paid down. Welcome to the world. Welcome to what you've been taught us credit card game. That's the game. So now let's change that game. I have $90 in my Hand of the insurance companies money that would, it just means that I'm going to get somebody when I die gets $90 less. So I got this money, I'm going to pay these off. And then what I'm going to do is I'm going to take the $10 that I used to get the visa, and I'm going to change the name on the check. Because I'm not going to stop paying the $10 that I used to get my visa, let's be smart about it. Let's be an honest banker. I'm going to change the name on that $10 check. And I'm going to write Chris naugles Bank, and I'm going to put that $10 back into my bank. So what just happened? Well, some people are like, well, you took a loan from your private bank, that whole life thing you're talking about. You paid off visa, then you took the $10 you were given visa and you put it back in your in your account. Okay, great. You draw circle, you just went full circle. But in doing that I made money twice. I made money once on the 4% plus dividend. Okay, that arbitrage and then I made money twice, because I just recycled and recaptured 20% that I used to just give away. You see, when I teach people about money, I teach them that the biggest rotor or the biggest problem to most rotor of wealth is not so much that your ability to make money, you're good at that. It is the simple fact that you give all your money away to somebody else's bank, you do visa, Amazon, car payments, mortgage payments, all your money goes to somebody else 90 cents on every dollar goes to somebody else to build Well, why don't we start there, instead of working hard or taking on more risk, let's start taking back the money we're giving away to everybody else. If I can make 20% by just paying myself a $10 check instead of visa, man, that's wrong. And that's Yeah.   And that's such easy money to get back as I mean, people are pushing out hundreds or 1000s of dollars per month, on interest fees, that they're just pissing in the wind, you're never gonna see that never didn't get it back. Never gonna be now. So I did something back. I'd say maybe five years ago, and people thought I was stupid. And they said, yo, you never do that. That's the wrong thing to do. And I'm like, well, and again, I'm no financial person. I'm like, I would rather borrow from myself than a bank. So we were going to go buy a new car. And I said, well, rather than go get a note and pay them, even if it's 2.9%, or 3%, I'm going to go take a loan out of my 401k, which is already my money. I know it's not going to build the interest. I know that's stupid. But if I'm still going to be paying the money regardless, I would rather be paying myself that 3% interest in it going back into my 401k I know that's probably the stupid thing to do. But I'm like, why would I pay someone else interest when I can pay myself vendors? And what you're saying is the exact same thing, but instead of doing a promo 401k you're doing it from a, you know, from your from your other source? That is to me that that is a Oh, that's see, you're teaching stuff that people just don't know. I know people just don't understand that and don't know.   But let's talk about that. 401 K, so yes, am I I'm using the only difference between what you just described using a loan from your 401k. And what I'm doing with this specially designed whole life policy, the private bank is I'm earning uninterrupted compound interest in the 401k isn't because when you take a loan from your 401k, the money actually comes out of the 401k. It's no longer invested. But the cool thing about what you said, and I teach this as well, you took the money from your 401k that was just sitting there in the market. And you're just like, you know, I'm going to, I'm going to be the bank, and I'm going to basically finance my car. So you paid for the car, then you you should have taken and figured out how much the car dealership would have charged you per month to finance that car to you. And let's just say it was 500 a month, you take the $500 a month that you would have given away to somebody else for a car payment, and you pay the $500 a month back to your 401k it's the same thing. But now every penny of that $500 is going back into an account that you own that you control and that you benefit from. And the coolest thing people don't take loans from 401k sometimes is like Yeah, but I got to pay interest on that loan. Yes, you do. And that interest goes back into your account. It doesn't go to the financial company. It doesn't go to your employer it goes back into your account by law. Yeah, that's a pretty sweet thing. You just gave yourself a guaranteed interest rate. Plus you got yourself a shiny new car on the driveway. Yeah,   love it. Yeah, yeah, so and people but in all the people like advisors like that stupid you never pull money I'm like, but I'm gonna pull them 30 1000s gone regardless at that I've got the car. So either I'm going to be paying my own interest or I'm gonna pay someone else. The money's gone either way, you know, so it's   and why was that? Why do you think they would tell you that stupid why because managing it   because there's less money for them. They now control less money and it's in their financial best interest for me to keep my money there than to pull it out and use it myself. it to me You always follow the money. If if people are doing something some way it's because someone's making some money and they don't want to lose they don't want to lose that money. Now I've been to your you know, I've been to your site I've been looking at a lot of your love your stuff, the best way to Get in touch with you is just going to you're going to your website and all the people listening, it's going to be in the show notes. So you don't have to write this down. But it's gonna be in the show notes feel click, but you've got some great stuff up on your website, from your webinars, from your classes from your real estate, there is so much free, that's the thing, free valuable information. And you have you have courses and you have, you know, stuff that I'm actually going to do this, I've got to learn this stuff, because I'm, I'm sick of paying, paying everybody else. And I had the concept. I just don't know how to, I don't know the means to do it correctly. But go to Chris naugle.com. And that is the you know, all of your stuff is is up there.   I give everything away for free, including my book. I mean, you can go to the website and get my book mapping out the millionaire mystery or the private money guide. Totally free. I mean, I'm not gonna pay the shipping to your house, but you can have the books for free. And where that came from his remember those that hard time. When I hit in 14, I went to my first mastermind out in California with this guy, Greg, and he was like, just a superstar, right? And I remember paying all this money to go there. And I caught him. I got him aside and I said, Greg, give me the best advice. I'm down on my luck, like what is the best advice you can give me and he puts his hand on my shoulder and he says, Chris, I'm gonna give you the best advice. I can give you any in liens. And he says, give your best stuff away for free. And then he walks away. And I'm like, really, dude, I just paid five grand to come to this mastermind. That's the best thing you got. For me. I'm like suffering here. I'm broke. And that's what you tell me. If folks, it was the greatest advice somebody could give me because it goes back to the core universal law. If you give you get, I give it all away for free. So thank you for bringing that up.   Yeah, you can't you cannot get without giving. And here's the you know, here's another mental thing that people think they think that you know, the stuff that I teach and the stuff that I do. It's all out there for free anyways. It's, it's I just can put it in a different maybe a different format different way. But it's all out there. So yeah, giving it away for free. And it's like money, it goes against what we're taught that, you know, you got to hoard that stuff. You got to keep it like you know, that's, you know, your information is your goal that that's your company. You can't do that. But it does not work that way. It does not so, great stuff up there. Great stuff up there. And all the listeners I'm telling you, you don't know what you don't know. Go to the website, go to Chris Naugle comm go to the website and look at the three webinars, the free stuff that's up there, get the book, you've got two books up there, it, it this stuff's free. So why would someone This is what always gets me so you got all this great information up there. And people still won't a lot of general public still won't go do do that. And it just blows my mind. You probably spent years writing your book you spent you know 20 years of knowledge going into that book, and stuff that you're teaching and I can go there and get that for free. It's just blows my mind that people do not take these journeys to learn what other people people who who have made it are always willing to share their experience share their knowledge to grow other people. So again, thank you so much great stuff and I'm I'm telling you I'm up there and I think I might bring back the give give me Raj Nord give me head   you should gotta bring that back. And if I can just say cuz everything we were just saying can be summed up with a quote and this is I think, why people don't do things. And it's a quote that Will Rogers said he said the biggest problem in America is not what people don't know. The biggest problem in America is what people think they know that just ain't so. Stop taking advice from people that hold you down that hold you back that don't empower you stop taking advice from your broke ass brother in law and go out there and create yours future the way you want it to be.   Absolutely. Oh, again, Chris, thank you so much for for taking the time out today to be on the show. And and give you know give give back to your my community. And thank you so much. And just thank you that that's all I can say. It's great, great stuff. Thank you. Great talking with you.   You as well.

BGBS 059: Chris Kirby | Ithaca Hummus | It's Simple.Ithaca Hummus. America's fastest-growing hummus brand founded by Chris Kirby: CEO, trained professional chef, and mustache aficionado. Chris's career identity began in the restaurant world before he gained the courage to declare that he had a different path to follow, and returned to school. It was a tough decision to make, but this pivot lead to Chris stumbling upon a certain, special chickpea dish that needed his help. Did Chris Kirby find hummus or did hummus find him? We may never find out. From here we learn about the birth of Ithaca Hummus, which shot from a farmer's market stand to 7500 stores nationwide today using a small, yet big-hearted team of 8. We can't wait for you to hear all about Chris's journey to get here. Fair warning: After all that mouth-watering hummus talk, you may find yourself checking out ithacahummus.com/where-to-buy for your nearest retailer selling this delicious dish. We speak from personal experience. Quotes[17:27] It's almost like admitting failure, you know? Kind of like, “Oh, I thought one thing, and now, I don't think that anymore.” And it's not failure—it just feels like it in the moment. [25:32] It seems so simple on its face, and it really is at the end of the day. But you know, sometimes those simple ideas are the ones that really have the most impact. [29:43] I can't remember a moment where I had any hesitation that I was going to throw myself full-fledged at this. I think in the beginning like what was so just fueling me was having something of my own for the first time and just being able to experience these little success points along the way. [39:46] Our mission is to introduce America to its new favorite brand of hummus and we've got some proof points that we're actually, really doing that. And I think that's what gets us all excited on the team at Ithaca hummus is thinking about the success that we've been able to demonstrate on a mid-size scale, not full blown quite yet and dreaming about like, “Well, what happens when our distribution is four times the size that it is now?” ResourcesLinkedIn: Chris Kirby Website: ithacahummus.com Where to buy: ithacahummus.com/where-to-buy Podcast TranscriptChris Kirby 0:02 We were at the farmers market but also in the morning, I would deliver hummus to natural food stores and coffee shops and things. I just remember going in and seeing that just one had been purchased. And that was so energizing for me to just think that like, wow, like, I put that here yesterday and now someone that I don't even know like, picked that up and it's in their refrigerator and they're eating it right now. Like, wow, what a cool feeling that is and so there was a bunch of stuff like that, you know, that I've heard other people call entrepreneurial currency that I just latched on to and really use to energize. Marc Gutman 0:44 Podcasting from Boulder, Colorado. This is the baby got backstory Podcast, where we dive into the story behind the story of today's most inspiring storytellers, creators and entrepreneurs alike big back stories and I cannot lie. I am your host, Marc Gutman, Marc Gutman, and on today's episode of Baby Got Backstory. We are talking hummus. Yep, that delicious snack inside dish made of chickpeas. And before we get deep into hummus, trust me, you're gonna love this one. A gentle reminder. If you like and enjoy the show, please take a minute or two to rate and review us over at Apple podcasts or Spotify. Apple and Spotify use these ratings as part of the algorithm that determines ratings on their charts. Better yet, please recommend this show to at least one friend. Maybe while eating hummus. It's time we bring the world together over the common love of the Baby Got Back story podcast and hummus. Which brings me to today's guest, Chris Kirby. Chris is a trained professional chef, and the founder and CEO of Ithaca Hummus, which is available in over 7500 stores nationwide. At the recording of this episode, back in 2013, Chris left his successful restaurant career as a chef to go back to college. And this is where it dawned on him. hummus needed his help. And he got to work perfecting a simple lemon garlic hummus recipe. and a month later he was selling it at the Ithaca farmers market on the weekends. And Chris's story is one of the entrepreneurial dream of taking what you love and finding a way to make a living at it. As you'll hear, I'm not sure if he found hummus or if hummus found him. But what Chris did find was a way to take something that already existed and make it better. And that's what being an entrepreneur is all about. He made it so much better, that he and the team if the gothamist are now shipping approximately 30,000 containers of hummus per week. That's a lot of hummus. But Chris Kirby didn't always know the hummus was in his future. And this is his story. I am here with Chris Kirby, the founder and CEO of Ithaca Hummus, Chris, thank you for coming on the show. So appreciate it. And like let's hop right into it. You know, I normally have a big dossier of questions for you. But as I was doing some pre show research I was on your website and most intriguing to me is your own bio on the website and a couple things that really stood out to me You say you're a ping pong champion. I'd like to hear a little bit about that. Chef Pitbull lover, but more importantly, mustache. afficionado. Tell me a little bit about that. Like the word is becoming a mustache afficionado come from Chris Kirby 4:02 Well, I luckily have my mustache on today. And you know, I wanted to be a little bit out there and embellish a little bit on the bio. But I've had a mustache since my son was born and went out to lunch with a friend. Like, right around the time my son was born had this mustache grown and he was like, You know what, I think you could be like one of those dads that just always has a mustache. And I had never thought about it that way and all of a sudden I just committed to it. Yeah, I'm really into it trimming with scissors. And you know, the whole nine yards is fun. Marc Gutman 4:37 Hashtag mustache dad. I love that my father had a mustache I was like is like, like kind of his defining attribute was he always had a mustache. So that's really, really great. And so let's hop into it. You know, Chris, you're the co founder of ethika hummus. We're gonna talk a little bit or a lot a bit about hummus and that's a baby got backstory first. We haven't dove deep on chickpeas and hummus yet, so I'm excited to do that. But when you're ready young boy, I mean, were you into hummus. Was that something that was even on your radar when you were? Let's just say like eight, nine years old? No, Chris Kirby 5:06 Not at all. I was really into food, and daytime TV cooking shows like Jacques papan. And Julia Child like, I would watch them daily. But Thomas didn't enter my life until much later on. Marc Gutman 5:22 And so tell me a little bit about those shows and what life was like for young Chris. I mean, most people today take for granted that we can just go to YouTube or go to a chef's page or a channel and catch up on all these shows. But like a Julia Child show that guy there was like, PBS, I was like some weird fringe kind of stuff. So kind of take me back there a little bit and tell me about what your childhood was like. And what turned you on to cooking at such a young age? Chris Kirby 5:45 Yeah, well, I had a great childhood, I was really fortunate to come from a loving, supportive family. Both my parents were great role models. My dad was the first one in his family to graduate college. And my mom's like, the most selfless person that I know. But I come from a family of four kids, which isn't huge, but for us, it was a lot. And my parents had to be somewhat selective with limited time and money. And that seemed difficult at times. But looking back, you know, I had everything that I needed to thrive and really learn the value of hard work from them. Why did I love cooking shows so much? That's such a good question. And it gets to like the core. And maybe it's a combination of like something so tangible, and like process. And also, I'm a visual learner. So I loved being able to watch and hear and just learn and get explanations behind. Like, why you tie a chicken this way? and etc. So it's a good question. I don't know, really, what about me really turned me on to that. But I know it stuck Marc Gutman 6:50 Yeah, and so were either of your parents in the restaurant space, or in the cooking or anything like that? Did you get that from them? Or was this something that was unique to Chris and just your thing? Chris Kirby 7:01 No, my mom was a good cook. I'm from Maryland. So there are some like food, rituals. They're like blue crabs and things like that, that really showed me how good food can be when it's prepared the right way with fresh ingredients. But neither one of my parents were in the food industry now. Marc Gutman 7:19 And so at that point, were you. So you're looking at cooking shows, you're enthralled by them? Are you actually kind of getting the ingredients together and trying to attempt some of these things. I mean, I always remember those shows were so interesting, because it took me forever. Like I just had this disconnect I could never understand like how they always had like these perfect bowls of ingredients, always measured out. Like for some reason, I just didn't understand that. They pre measure the ingredients, you know, like I was like, Wow, it's like, they've always got these perfect, like amounts of ingredients that they're just dumping into the recipe. And it was always just like really hard for me to I was like, that's so complicated and cool. But were you taking these and were you actually cooking? Or were you just like, was this a little bit of escapism? Were you just kind of thinking, wow, someday maybe Chris Kirby 7:59 I was experimenting horribly, like I think most people when they first get involved in cooking and excited about it, they enter the like, empty out the spice cabinet phase, like as the first one. And so I spent a long time there making things like, Hey, I made this try and people would be very polite and kind of choke things down now and again, but I just like tinkering around and then this was like a creative expression way to do that. Yeah, I was definitely practicing what I was inspired by watching on TV. I wouldn't say I was following verbatim though. Marc Gutman 8:37 Yeah, how serious were you? I mean, Was this something you were doing after school? and on weekends? It was it like something that was personal or private to Chris or Was this something that was starting to take over was this showing up at school was this showing up as a bit of a this is called a healthy obsession, for lack of a better word, Chris Kirby 8:54 I guess when it started to become real for me was I got my first job when I was 14 washing dishes at the local restaurant. And I remember looking at the cooks on the line and just idolizing them. I was like man, look at how fast and organized and efficient and just working so hard and doing such a good job and they just look badass to me. And at that time, my dream was to go to the Naval Academy, being from Maryland that's like a something that's in front of you right there. But I had this discussion about idolizing these line cooks at work with a guidance counselor in high school and she was like you know what, you sound really passionate about this, maybe you should think about culinary school. And that was kind of the direction and push that I needed to like really be confident about a path at that age and I just kind of geared towards that. Marc Gutman 9:48 That's crazy like at a young age like if someone you know I've talked about this before, but if someone just gives you permission tells you like hey, like you can do this I can influence it can have and really be pivotal and you're like oh I can like that's Really, really cool. And so when you talk about these line cooks and the chefs being badass, I mean, is that what you were really into? Was it the technical aspect? Was it almost like you saw them as like these great technicians or even craftspeople or artists, however you want to define it? Or were you enthralled with what was on the other end of the plate? You know what having a great meal man, like, Where were you following? on that spectrum? Was it more about like, kind of that technical skill? Or was it more like, hey, like, food is this like, amazing thing that brings people together or whatever it might be, I don't want to put the words in your mouth. Chris Kirby 10:31 I think it was a little bit of both. I think at 14, I was more, I think intrigued by like the badass theory of it. And then as I developed into my own career and culinary school, I started to really appreciate the technical side and the processes and the ingredients and the importance and then ultimately, got into my career as a chef and really started to fall in love with my ability to influence people's outlook on food and their diet. And I would get really motivated anytime someone said that they didn't like an ingredient like beets or something and wanted to change that Marc Gutman 11:11 Chip on your shoulder about beets or just to show people that they can be a good ingredient or something like that? Chris Kirby 11:16 Anything. Yeah, any of the above like chicken breasts always dry? Like, okay, well, I will make one that that isn't. And I think it was much about like having a little bit of an ego of like, trying to show that I can do something as it was about the ingredient, but healthy mix, like anything. Marc Gutman 11:35 And so sounds like that you were getting into high school, you decide to go to culinary school. Any doubts there? I mean, were your parents totally cool with that? Did they have any reservations? Or like, what was going on there? Did they say maybe you should look at other things? Or were you just like, gung ho and plus? Sounds like you abandon your dream of Annapolis. And I don't know how serious that was, like within your family or anything. But what's going on there as far as culinary school and the general attitude of everyone around you? Chris Kirby 12:01 Yeah, it was a big discussion at home. Because I was very serious about Annapolis, and the Naval Academy, I had an uncle who went to the Naval Academy, and I was really inspired by him early on. And I think my parents just felt like, Wow, what a drastic difference this would be. And how would that impact your life and his parents do? You know, they're just trying to look around corners and want to see their kids make the best decisions? And they were definitely concerned about the lifestyle that would come with being a chef, in the worst case, you know, that's where their mind went as normal, I guess, you know, is that going to be sustainable for the life that I may want to live one day, and ultimately, I ended up confronting all those things later in life, but they were totally concerned about it. Marc Gutman 12:50 And as he went to culinary school, where'd you end up going to culinary school? Chris Kirby 12:54 Johnson and Wales in Charlotte, North Carolina. Marc Gutman 12:57 I don't know much about culinary school. So was that something that you had set your sights on? Like, you're like, Hey, this is like where I really want to go? And if so why? Chris Kirby 13:03 I wouldn't say so. It was like, I knew that. I wanted to move south, a little warmer. And so I think that was probably in all honesty, the biggest draw the CIA is in Hyde Park in upstate New York, which was like colder than Maryland. And Johnson and Wales had just built this brand new campus in Charlotte. And they're also renowned culinary school. And I think that was ultimately what drove that decision, was it it was in North Carolina? Marc Gutman 13:32 And did you have any sense like of what kind of food you were drawn to what kind of cuisine what you wanted to do? Or at that point? Was it all exploration? Chris Kirby 13:40 It was very exploratory. I didn't have like a passion for any one specific cuisine or culture. In fact, kind of the opposite. I think at that stage, what was fascinating to me, it was like, there's a noodle in every single culture ever. There's some kind of grain dish, and it's just variation from one part of the planet to another based on abundance of other ingredients. And so I just wanted to learn more. I think from a cuisine perspective about how that all comes together and how everyone seemed to make it work. Marc Gutman 14:14 Did anything develop at Connor school? Did you start to see a path or a light? Or how did that shape up for you? Chris Kirby 14:20 I would say, Oh, really evolved at the beginning of culinary school. I also, I've always had a very entrepreneurial mindset. And so I would listen to some classmates talk about like wanting to work in fine dining, and it would make me think like, well, that's kind of like, stupid, because that's only 4% of the industry and really difficult to make money at and how is that going to actually work for you? Didn't seem like very good odds. And so in coronary school, I was definitely more like, how do I make really great food for the masses, and kind of like, focus on that, that actually evolved, you know? When I got into restaurants, I did become really passionate about fine dining, French cuisine and just the classic, you know, European techniques and recipes. Marc Gutman 15:10 And so when you left culinary school, it sounds like you had a bit of a worldview where you're like, Look, I'm going to make food for the masses. I mean, what was the plan? What did you think you were gonna do? When you left culinary school, Chris Kirby 15:22 I never really had ambition to be like a chef on TV, or I think I was what seemed most attainable and realistic. And the biggest goal that I could set for myself at the time was owning a restaurant group, like a bunch of restaurants with different concepts. And that didn't last very long. But I think if I did have a clear thought, at that time period, that was probably it. Marc Gutman 15:45 Done. So what happened, what changed your you know, we all come out of school and training we like with big vision and idealistic. And then I think the world shows us kind of how it's going to react as well. And we got to make some changes. So what happened for you? Chris Kirby 15:57 Well, I just kind of got burnt out on the lifestyle, and I was in it big time, just working like crazy. And alcohol fueled, and you know, that ended up kind of being something that I had to come to terms with later in life as well. And I can just feel it, this isn't gonna lead where I think I ultimately want to go. And it just something inside of me just felt like, I've got to do something different and maybe take a different path. I don't know what that is. But after about seven years, I felt like I needed to make a change. Marc Gutman 16:31 That's what that point like, where are we like, what restaurant? Are you working at? What's your title? What's your role? What's going on for you? Chris Kirby 16:38 So I went from working in Baltimore, where I grew up to Washington, DC, fine dining, French restaurant, then out to Las Vegas, then to Austin, Texas, which is where I ultimately stayed the longest. That's where I made the decision. After about three or four years of living in Austin, I was the chef at a wine bar in downtown Austin called mulberry. And yeah, I was just ready to ready to move on. Marc Gutman 17:04 That must have been hard. I mean, you know, you've spent a good chunk of your life at this point. As a chef, that's your identity, you declared it that's your training. I mean, how to be hard to make that decision was? Chris Kirby 17:20 It was I mean, I think I knew that I needed to make it long before I actually mustered up the courage. It's almost like admitting failure, you know, kind of like, Oh, I thought one thing, and now, I don't think that anymore. And it's not failure, it feels like it in the moment. But it definitely took a lot for me to leave my life in Austin, and all my friends. And what I ended up doing was moving back to Baltimore and going back to community college for a year to figure things out, really, and then apply and think about the next step. Marc Gutman 17:54 And what did you study and figure out? Chris Kirby 17:56 I took some basic courses, basic business, accounting, finance, things that I could really tap into that entrepreneurial spirit that I knew I had. So I did a year at community college, and ended up applying to a handful of schools to finish my bachelor's degree. And Community College was really just like, let's be smart about this, like, let's take the courses that I can transfer and like, into whatever the next school would be Marc Gutman 18:28 Yeah, and where was that? Chris Kirby 18:29 Shockingly, I ended up getting into the hotel school at Cornell, which sounds like very fancy Ivy League, and it is, but I was like, shocked when I got in. And I was out of place there, for sure. I was 26. And all my classmates were 18. And I'm convinced to this day that the way that I got in was my essay, you know, how you write the letter and everything and as part of the application and I told them exactly what I was going to do. I said, I'm going to come to Cornell, and I'm going to start a business as soon as I get there. And I'm going to use all the professors as consultants, and I'm going to take everything that I'm learning and apply it in real time to the business that I build. I don't know what that's gonna be I'll figure it out when I get there. But yeah, I think that's what sparked their interest. Marc Gutman 19:22 Did you know when you went to Cornell, I mean that this business that you're gonna start that you didn't know what it was, but you knew what you wanted it to be? Did you know it was gonna be in the hospitality space? Because Cornell I mean, as you know, and but most of our listeners might not know, I mean, that's one of the best, if not the best hospitality programs in the country. I mean, it's renowned for that. And so thinking that were you like, hey, like, I'm gonna do something in this food slash hospitality space. Are you just not sure? Chris Kirby 19:51 Yeah, I totally did. I wanted to figure something out that I can parlay like all the experience and knowledge of food that I had built. And definitely stay in that lane for my own business. But yeah, my girlfriend at the time, and now what I think I told her that maybe what I'll do is I'll go to Africa, and I'll work at a McDonald's and learn the like processes of how they make that work on such a huge scale, and then apply like just better food to that down the road. That was one of many, many ideas. And I'm shocked that she listened to that was like, Okay, yeah, it sounds good. It's a little far fetched. But… Marc Gutman 20:32 So did you work at McDonald's? Chris Kirby 20:34 No, I didn't end up doing that. No, no, no, no, I didn't, you know, the hotel school there as I knew it was right for me, because everything was tailored toward the hospitality industry. So I got it, you know, it wasn't totally outside of my purview of what I understood. And so they say that instead of ball bearings, they talk about biscuits, and you know, and like economics and finance, which is true. So just tailored to what I already know. Marc Gutman 21:01 So you show up at Cornell, you're all fresh face, you have big dreams, you're an old freshmen. What was the first business idea? was it? Was it like a hummus? Or was it something else Chris Kirby 21:10 It was, I knew within a week of being an Ithaca, that this was a product that was missing in the local food economy and food scene. There's a an amazing farmers market, the Ithaca farmers market, that it didn't take very long, you know, I spent a weekend at the farmers market, and hit up greenstar Co Op, which is the local natural food store. And I was looking for what I could do locally that would be successful, but also on a national level, like, what's a category or type of food that's available in grocery stores that needs the most help from someone like me. And I just felt like that's where I could add the most value. And hummus just happened to check both of those boxes. Marc Gutman 21:59 This episode brought to you by Wildstory. Wait, isn't that your company? It is. And without the generous support of Wildstory, this show would not be possible. A brand isn't a logo or a tagline. or even your product or a brand is a person's gut feeling about a product service or company. It's what people say about you when you're not in the room. Wildstory helps progressive founders and savvy marketers build purpose driven brands that connect their business goals with the customers they want to serve. So that both the business and the customer needs are met. This results in crazy, happy, loyal customers that purchase again and again, in this is great for business. If that sounds like something you and your team might want to learn more about, reach out@www.wildstory.com. And we'd be happy to tell you more. Now back to our show. Why hummus? Like why did it Need help? Like what don't we get? Because I go to the market and ton of hummus. There's other competitors out there like what did you see? Chris Kirby 23:10 So hummus is you know, I think most people would agree if you eat a lot of hummus that the best time is comes from like a local restaurant or a local producer. It's made fresh and some of the nationally available stuff and brands like it's just kind of a little bland, and not really all that exciting, certainly not as good as it can be when it's fresh. And so I saw first of all the opportunity to be that local hummus in Ithaca. And on a longer view, the opportunity for someone like me to figure out how to replicate that quality on a national level through the commercialization process. How do we commercialize something that's as high quality as a local product without totally ruining and destroying all the things that make that local product good in the first place? Marc Gutman 24:00 And I'm so just intrigued and amazed by this because I mean hummus, like you probably know better than I have done our research on this. It's been around for 1000s of years, right? Like This isn't like, like hummus has been around for you know, much longer than just about everything. And we've had it and it's so it's not like also, I mean, this isn't like the 60s and like the advent of like natural foods. I mean, I find it just so interesting that there was this opportunity. And so prior to all this, like were you sitting around, were you kind of like this, like hummus snob or hummus kind of sewer where you're like thinking like, Oh, this isn't good, or they, but it was purely looking at it more from a business perspective. Chris Kirby 24:37 Yeah, it was trying to recognize an opportunity that I could take advantage of now and in the future. And that's how I would describe for me at least when I say I haven't this entrepreneurial mindset, it's just looking at things and thinking like, I could do that better. You know, maybe there's a way What if we change this or did this better did this different and you know, yeah, they're brilliant. 1000s of ideas that spark out of that way of thinking, and this just happened to be one that was like, Man, this really clicks, I don't need to reinvent Thomas, I just need to make really good, authentic commerce available to the mass market. Marc Gutman 25:17 And as you went, and you told your girlfriend at the time, now your wife, or you told your professors, hey, I am going to be the hummus king of Africa, then I'm going to be the hummus king of the nation. Where did they say Chris Kirby 25:30 Mixed reactions? You know, I mean, it seems so simple on its face, and it really is at the end of the day. But you know, sometimes those simple ideas are the ones that really have the most impact. Marc Gutman 25:44 So maybe walk us through a little bit like what happened. So you're at Cornell, and you're going to use your professors as your unofficial board and your consultants and you have this idea for hummus, like, what happens? Do you just start blending in your kitchen? Like, how do you how to kind of get this thing going? Chris Kirby 25:59 Yeah, so first of all, food safety is something that I was very well trained on as a chef and I had never produced a product made for resale. That plus like, how do I start a business? How do I form an LLC? Or now what do I is an S corp or a C Corp? Or what? So those two questions like forming the business and figuring out how to operate and make this product safely so that it could be distributed to people and they weren't going to get sick? were the first two things that I tackled, and then it became about where am I going to make it and where am I going to sell it. And I was very lucky to find a summer camp in Ithaca that had a food safe kitchen and you know, everything that I needed, basically to get started. For $200 a month, I rented this place and would go and make test batches and eventually, like batches for sale at night. And I would take it to the farmers market on the weekend and sell it there. Marc Gutman 27:00 And so prior to this, how would you rank your level of hummus chef or had you shut up any hummus prior to this? Or like, are you just kind of figuring this out at this point? Chris Kirby 27:11 Yeah, so I had had some hummus training, you could say, throughout my voluntary career, I was really close with one of my friends in DC at the restaurant I told you about who was Lebanese and he would make on Sundays when it was his turn family meal. And hummus was always a big part of that. And what I loved about his hummus compared to like the stuff you could buy at the grocery store was the fresh lemony, like garlicky, it was just tasted fresh, very intense flavor wasn't bland or boring at all. So yeah, I learned how to make comments from my buddy fi's all. And that's basically the recipe that I used when I started at the comments and still use today. Marc Gutman 27:52 Yeah, in addition to it being fresh, like what makes a great hummus, like what's everyone else getting wrong? And what's it good doing right with what you can share? Obviously, Chris Kirby 28:01 I can be totally open about what we do. I think I've got to be very careful because hummus is one of those like regionally funny things like Israeli hummus is very different than Lebanese hummus. Lebanese hummus is what we make it's lemony, a lot more fresh lemon, less tahini, Israeli hummus has a lot more tahini in it, and it doesn't really have the fresh zing like the product that we make. So to me, what makes it great is very fresh ingredients. From a package perspective. I think where it goes wrong for a lot of brands is they actually heat the product after it's blended and everything is you know, mixed in. When you think about what that does to food when you heat it up fresh lemon juice or even garlic, for example, like it really changes the flavor profile. And for me, I think it's just really important to capture that fresh, raw flavor of the ingredient. Marc Gutman 28:54 Before I forget, what's your favorite dipping apparatus into the hummus? What do you think's the best Dipper? Chris Kirby 29:01 Also not like historically culturally accepted? I wouldn't say but I'm a big raw broccoli. I like raw broccoli and cauliflower. For my homies Personally, Marc Gutman 29:12 I love that. So here we are. I imagine you're at this summer camp, you're renting out this kitchen you're if you've got like hummus everywhere. You're like trying to figure it out. What's going on? Are you just like, and you're going to school, by the way if I got this right, so like are you like, enthralled with this? Are you like just no one can take the wind out of your sails or any given point. Are you like, what did I get myself into? Like I'm putting a big bet on hummus right now. Like Like what was going on for you right there. Chris Kirby 29:38 It's funny, and I don't know why I felt so strongly about it. But I can't remember a moment where I had any hesitation that I was going to throw myself full fledged at this. I think in the beginning like what was so just fueling me was like having something of my own for the first time. And just being able to experience like these little success points along the way, like, we were at the farmers market, but also in the morning, I would deliver hummus to natural food stores and coffee shops and things. I just remember going in and seeing that just one had been purchased. And that was so energizing for me to just think that like, wow, like, I put that here yesterday, and now someone that I don't even know, like, pick that up, and it's in their refrigerator. And they're eating it right now. Like, wow, what a cool feeling that is. And so there was a bunch of stuff like that, you know, that I've heard other people call entrepreneurial currency that I just latched on to and really use to, to to energize me. Marc Gutman 30:44 And so that's all like, good and gets you going. But imagine like, you're selling at some coffee shops and some natural grocers, your your local, you're at the farmers market. At what point do you look at this thing and go like, it could be bigger than that, you know, this could actually be a business not like, a bit of a hobby, like when do you like really start to get the sense that maybe I'm onto something and I have to think to that, at some point, you're starting to gain maybe a little bit of tension from your competitors and other people in the space. So that's sometimes a good thing, because it means you're becoming relevant. But it also has to be a little scary. So like as you're growing like, what's going on? Are you thinking like, how do I take this to the next level or just kind of enjoying the ride? Chris Kirby 31:28 I'm always thinking about what's the next step? What's the next step? For sure. I think what really keyed me on to thinking that this really could be big was the reaction that I would get from people at the farmers market. I mean, anyone that I speak with now about how do I start a food or beverage, you know, business, I always recommend starting out in a channel where you are standing face to face with people who are potentially going to be your customers, and just sampling them and getting their reaction to getting their feedback. And in some cases, because if you do that enough, and you've got the right product, and you're getting the right reaction from people, and that alone will tell you like, wow, if I could just make this bigger, how could it not be successful? If I could do that the right way? I just felt like I was onto something for sure. And you know, also, I think it didn't hurt that I was in Ithaca, New York, which is a very granola kind of town. It's like the old saying, if you can make it here, you can make it anywhere Well, in the hummus, business and ethic in New York. I think that's definitely true. Marc Gutman 32:40 And so what did you do? I mean, how did you make that leap? Like, how did you take it from farmers market to something bigger, like regional and then national? Chris Kirby 32:49 Yeah, very, very incremental steps. When I started, we had a seven day shelf life on the product. So it was like, how do we get it to 14 and then 20, and then 25 and 35? And same thing with distribution? It was what can I physically deliver out of the back of my car? And how many farmers markets can we go to in a weekend with more people to grow the business, which was all we could figure out how to do it the time, especially with a very, very short shelf life, it was really the only thing that we could do. But over time as awareness of what we were doing, and the brand and the product grew, so did the shelf life and so did the size of our business and revenue and profit and just was a great way to just fuel from within, you know, kind of take the scrappy, not go out and raise a ton of money like way too early route, and I'm so glad I did it that way. Marc Gutman 33:47 And is it self funded? Or do you end up going out and raising money to fuel the growth? Chris Kirby 33:52 We eventually did raise money from our manufacturer Actually, I moved on from the summer camp kitchen into a factory of my own which was like the dream like I built out this 10,000 square feet of like, it was insane. I felt like Willy Wonka. But after I like got into that and started managing it, it was insane and just way more than I could handle at the same time as everything else. So ultimately, I ended up partnering with le Desiree foods in Rochester, New York not far from us and Ithaca and after a year of just manufacturing the product they wanted in and couldn't think of a better more strategic partner than not Marc Gutman 34:31 so incredible. And so you started this business with nothing more than an idea started $200 a month rental in a summer camp kitchen. didn't really even know too much about hummus other than having experience from Sunday dinners. And here you are on the website it says you're the fastest growing hummus company in the nation which is an incredible accolade. So what does going from nothing to today? What does it go look like in terms of sighs and how much hummus Are you pumping out? Chris Kirby 35:04 Well, we're still very, very small and scrappy. We're a team of eight people, which is incredible to me. And I mean, to a degree, I think you could look at all of us very experienced and knowledgeable and smart, hard working all that stuff. But in one way or another, I think anybody on our team would admit, like, I have no business doing what I do every day sometimes, which is, I think, a healthy thing. So we very much have that like small, scrappy mentality, which I love. And we went from that farmers market stand and a couple stores in Africa to today, we're at 7500. stores nationwide, and how much how much do we produce? It's a really good question, I would say, of the containers that you buy in the store, 10 ounces, you know, 25 to 30,000 of those a week at this point, and growing. Marc Gutman 35:56 So does that like blow your mind? Like, would you say that number that is? Chris Kirby 35:59 Like crazy. It's it's not? It's not? I used to, you know, well, we used to apply every label by hand. And actually, when we started, we didn't buy labels, because we couldn't afford them. We just put paprika oil on the top for a little bit of like branding, and to think of going from there to where we are now is definitely mind blowing, in hindsight, Marc Gutman 36:21 In terms of that volume of actual packages, like how do you purchase chickpeas? Like is it by the bushel is it by the crazy by the ton, Chris Kirby 36:32 It's by the train load, actually, our facility has a rail that comes in to the back of it. And it's awesome, because when I first started buying chickpeas, I would like go to restaurant depot and like get a sack of chickpeas. And then eventually I got hooked up with some growers out in Washington State in Pullman, Washington, actually. And they would put it on a rail car from Pullman to this depot in Chicago, and then we would buy it, buy the pallet from there. And yeah, we've moved up in the food chain. And now we just get the rail car strength sent straight into the factory, which is really cool. Marc Gutman 37:11 How many rail cars of chickpeas are coming your way? on a regular basis? Chris Kirby 37:16 I'd have to check on that. So don't quote me. But I think we're definitely moving through multiple rail cars a month at this point. Marc Gutman 37:23 That's so cool. And what's hard about this like, like you said, it's simple sounds like it's all gone pretty much to plan but like What don't we know, like what's really hard about doing what you're doing and maintaining ethika Hama spray and ethika hummus brand? Chris Kirby 37:39 Yeah, if I portrayed it as overly simplified, I can guarantee you that it has not been just so many challenges that I never thought in the moment, sometimes I would be able to overcome that just, you know, end up ended up working out, I would say, what's been hard for me consistently throughout the business is learning how to grow myself professionally and as a leader, as fast as the business has grown. And as fast as my team that I rely on needs me to grow and really step into that role the best that I can. Marc Gutman 38:15 So how are you doing that? What kind of things are you doing to fuel your own growth and to become a better leader? Because I think that's something that a lot of entrepreneurs, look, none of us are born entrepreneurs number is born with this knowledge, we learn it, we educate ourselves, we come up a lot of times out of need, rather than you know, being ahead of time. It's like we're catching up or something of that nature. But like so what are you doing to stay up to speed and make sure that you're developing as a leader, Chris Kirby 38:40 I spend more time now just not just thinking and not feeling like I've got to make decisions and do things like so quickly. And so just off the cuff sometimes. So I've definitely slowed down a little bit. And I've really tried to not react to things or overreact to things as much as I am naturally inclined to do. I've also surrounded myself with some great people, and I could name names, but everyone on my team and even some people outside of the team that I'm more open with in terms of weaknesses now so that they can understand that and they can help backfill and I don't know, this is a long winded, probably more complex answer a complicated answer than I wish I could give. But I don't know, I just if I can sum it up, I've just tried to be more self aware and transparent about what that actually looks like. Marc Gutman 39:35 And as it relates to the business, like what are you most excited about right now? Is there something happening with Ithaca or something that you see in the future that is keeping you going and keeping you excited? Chris Kirby 39:46 Well, our mission is to introduce America to its new favorite brand of hummus and we've got some proof points that we're actually like really doing that and I think that's what gets us all all excited on the team at ethika. hummus is thinking about like, the success that we've been able to demonstrate on a mid size scale not full blown quite yet and dreaming about like, well, what happens when our distribution is four times the size that it is now. And we've had that much more time in market to generate that much more awareness and that much more trial? What kind of impact is that going to have on the category and on the diets of Americans in the grander scheme? Marc Gutman 40:34 Is that the metric? Like Is that how you will know that you're America's favorite brand of hummus? Chris Kirby 40:40 Well, I would say, share of category would be that metric. But how will we know that we've accomplished that goal? I don't know. I think we just day by day focused on what can we do today, to grow a little bit more and keep pushing the ball down the field. Marc Gutman 40:56 And as we come to a close here, Chris, like, I want you to think back to that young boy who is watching Julia Child is watching those cooking shows and just thinking, being intrigued by cooking. And what if he ran into you today? What do you think he'd say, if he saw what you were doing? Chris Kirby 41:14 I don't think he would fully understand it. And probably just think it's like boring. Start cutting up some chickens or something so that I could this is more exciting, you know, but at the same time, I think if he would probably think it's pretty cool. You know, if he really understood it, and could think about it the way I think about it now, I certainly do. And I'm having a lot of fun and very fulfilling and rewarding a lot of hard work, but I feel grateful and blessed every day. Marc Gutman 41:44 In that is Chris Kirby, founder and CEO of Ithaca hummus. As I reflect on our conversation, so much of what Chris shared resonated with me. But if I were to highlight one thought, it was his comment about making the switch from being a chef from declaring that his dream had changed. And he wanted to do something different. And while it could be labeled as a failure, it wasn't. It was merely a change in what he wanted in his evolving world view. And as I think back on my own pivots, my own changes that I've at times labeled as failures. This is a resonant reminder that they weren't failures at all. Just a change in what I wanted. A big thank you to Chris Kirby and Ithaca Hummus team. We can't wait to see you become the number one hummus brand in America and then the world. We will link to all things Chris Kirby and Ithaca Hummus in the shownotes. And if you know of a guest who should appear on our show, please drop me a line at podcast@wildstory.com our best guests like Chris come from referrals from past guests and our listeners. Well that's the show. Until next time, make sure to visit our website www.wildstory.com where you can subscribe to the show in iTunes, Stitcher or via RSS so you'll never miss an episode a lot big stories and I cannot lie. You other storytellers can't deny. ‍

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Bruce Russell and JoAnn Street both know their Wild Turkey distillation and family history like the back of their hand. Both have been brand ambassadors but are now transitioning to new roles. While JoAnn is developing the hospitality side, Bruce is learning the ins and outs of the distillery. This show dives into the personalities of these two as we discuss the effect of bringing fresh faces to the distillery and how they plan on keeping traditions alive. Show Partners: Barrell Craft Spirits blends cask strength, high quality spirits to explore the effects of different distillation methods, barrels and aging environments. Find out more at BarrellBourbon.com. Receive $25 off your first order with code "Pursuit" at RackhouseWhiskeyClub.com. Show Notes: Episode 186 we feature Pam Heilman of Michter’s Distillery 150 bottles remaining from 4 barrels of Pursuit Series This week’s Above the Char with Fred Minnick talks about fake whiskey. JoAnn, do you want to get into working in the distillery? Bruce, are they going to make you join the union? How are you related to Jimmy? How did you decide to get into the family business? Talk about being a female in whiskey. What does it mean to be new blood in the company? Tell us about your background and how it will help with working in the distillery. Did they have a daycare for you at the distillery when you were young? What is your favorite Wild Turkey product? Do you see yourself living in Lawrenceburg? Give us your typical brand ambassador spiel for 80 proof and 101. Tell us about Rare Breed and Kentucky Spirit. Why is 101 Rye important? 0:00 There's those 0:00 weird beetles that we got out here. 0:02 Yeah. Does that what does that mean that they're like stink bugs and know what they are? Yeah, yeah, at least that's what I know 0:16 that say that one for the blooper reel. 0:29 Welcome back. This is Episode 199 of bourbon pursuit. I'm one of your host Kenny. And to go through a little bit of news back on episode 186. We featured Pam Hyman of Victor's distillery. Pam talked about her extensive history working in bourbon that began at the Booker no plant. She's had a long tenured career and was named the master distiller Victor's back in October of 2016. However, last week, Pam announced she is retiring from actors, and Dan McKee will be taking over as the new master distiller. We wish him all the best in her retirement, and you can look forward to hearing her one last time when we release her interview with Fred Minnick at the Kentucky Derby museums legend series. It might be the worst kept secret in history, and I think it even gets a mention in today's episode, but the fourth wild turkey masters keep released titled Cornerstone will likely be a nine year old rye according to the filings with the TTP. The label describes it as the cornerstone as a Kentucky straight rye whiskey batch 0001 bottle at 109 proof aged a minimum of nine years and approved by Eddie Russell. However, we all sort of knew this was coming for a while. also kind of fun to note, if you go in a barrel, pick a wild turkey there is going to be a few ride barrels just for sampling fun. Just another reason to love those Russell's. We've had both our guests back on the Russell's family episode, which was 175. But this time, Joanne and Bruce get to have a moment in the spotlight. Both know their wives, Turkey distillation and family history like the back of their hand. We know this firsthand. Because on our last Russell's reserve barrel pic, we have Joe in actually giving us the tour for the podcast. And this show dives into their personalities. Because these two are very vibrant. They know what they're doing. And we discussed the effect of bringing fresh faces into the distillery and how they plan to keep some of these traditions that me as you understand here in a little bit how it try to keep those alive. We've got about 150 bottles remaining from our four barrels of pursuit series. These are ranging anywhere from 10 to 14 years old. And we're excited, we're going to be bringing two new more barrels in May. One last one of these is actually going to be a five year week from Finger Lakes distilling. And you can get information about these barrels such as their proof and the story behind them as well as you can get them shipped to your door at pursuit spirits.com. Now sit back and relax and here our friend Joe over a barrel bourbon. And if you want here more Joe, make sure you follow us on all our social media channels because our next live recording at downwind bourbon bar is going to be featuring Joe Beatrice of barrel so make sure you stay tuned for that. And as always, you've got Fred Minnick with above the char. 3:16 Hi, this is Joe Beatrice from barrel bourbon. We blend cast right high quality spirits to explore the effects of different distillation methods, barrels and ag environments. Use our store locator to find a retail or a bar near you at barrel bourbon calm. 3:30 I'm Fred Minnick, and this is above the char 3:34 and a recent Twitter survey. I asked the question, do you think fake Pappy Van Winkle is in circulation and American retailers and restaurants? 86% of the 861 voters said yes. Now my followers tend to be a little bit more cynical and on the whiskey geek side. But think about this for a moment. Some of the most enthusiastic people and all of spirits American whiskey fan 4:01 tend to think that there's fake Pappy Van Winkle in circulation. 4:06 That means someone is going to be buying a fake bottle or poor of Pappy Van Winkle. Now, how is this possible? And the times we live in? How is it possible that we can continue to face these types of issues, fraudulent activity on something as as benign as an American whiskey? It's ridiculous. But we've seen it in scotch, there are people serving time in prison for wine. We even had the Pappy Van Winkle heist a few years ago where Buffalo Trace employees stole from their own employer and tried to resell it. 4:45 The fact is, as long as people can make money, it will always happen people will always try to circulate fraudulent bottles into the marketplace. And there's not a whole lot we can do about it. But there is one thing, one thing that everyone out there can do. And that's putting an end to the selling of empty bottles on eBay. Get on eBay right now and just search Pappy Van Winkle empty bottle. Now I came across one that was selling for $700 and the guy had empty in quotation marks. And you know, frankly, I just saw read and kind of went off on it and Instagram. But he was really probably trying to sell a full bottle now that I think about it. But nonetheless, you will still find a number of Pappy Van Winkle bottles for sale. You'll also find empty orphan barrels and Buffalo Trace antique collection and four roses limited editions and you'll see older mixers bottles being for sale. And there's they serve no purpose to be sold as empty bottles, other than to for someone to refill them at another time. because no one's sharing the shit making candles, armor lamps. So if you're someone who's putting an empty bottle in eBay, I just want you to know that you're part of the problem. Oh, you may need money. I understand that. And if you've done a once, you know, I hope you got the funds you needed. But if it's consistently happening, and this is part of a business plan that you have or this is something that you hope to break in and become like a special follow on eBay. Well then sir, ma'am, you are causing us a whole lot of headaches and American whiskey right now. Because there's a good chunk of us who do not trust that good Pappy Van Winkle, or Buffalo Trace antique collection is legitimate. And if you are selling MTS on eBay, you are one of the biggest pariahs in American whiskey right now. There I said it. 6:55 Think about that, if we can put an end to selling empties on eBay, we may be able to put a dent in some of the fraudulent activity we've seen on the secondary market. And worst case scenario in retail or in restaurants. So I don't know what to do about it. It's not illegal. 7:16 People can do what they want with an empty bottle. But if you have an empty bottle, display proudly on your mantel, or take it outside and break them on the fucker with a sledgehammer. I don't care. But don't put it on eBay. 7:31 And that's this week's above the char this this subjects get me pretty pissed off. So if you have something that might piss me off, hit me up on Twitter, or Instagram at Fred Minnick. That's at Fred Minnick. Until next week. Cheers. 7:48 Welcome back to the episode of bourbon pursuit the official podcast of bourbon. Kenny here recording once again in Lawrenceburg at wild turkey Hill, home of wild turkey bourbon. And this has been a serious recordings that we have been doing. However, we have two new guests to the show that had not been on previously because we have had Jimmy and Eddie on. And we've got a few of the wild turkey super fans that have been on before as well. But this one we kind of looked at and we said there's got to be some more faces, right. And there's a lot of new faces that are starting up and become better the younger generation of bourbon, or what Fred and some other cells are starting to call this even the media people like the new regime of it, right because we've got a lot of people that are older authors and they're trying to do something different and we're doing podcast now. And now we've got some new blood that are starting to enter the the whiskey world in itself. So with that, I'm going to go ahead and introduce our guests. So we have got Bruce Russell, who is the global was the global brand ambassador gonna go ahead and introduce yourself. 8:48 Yeah, how's it going, guys? I was just the brand ambassador, there's just only ever one of us I was like all of them whatever there would be I would do. 8:57 But now they've got me transitioning to be more than a story hopefully take over and 9:02 do a lot of the same stuff that dad Jimmy did. So we'll talk about that one then we also have Joanne and Joanne is it st them I saying that correctly? Okay. 9:09 Yeah, so I do a little bit of brand ambassador work but I also help out and the visitor center with you know, all the events and whatnot that go on kind of all over the place. 9:19 So let's go ahead and that's a that's a good way to kind of kick started so you you're going in and doing a lot of like the events and stuff like that Do you do you want to follow in any other footsteps to like get into the the distillation, the warehouse, the actual jobs of what's actually happening inside of the distillery now. 9:34 So for me, I have a little bit of a different story, like Bruce grew up coming to the distillery whereas I grew up in Tennessee, and then decided to move up to Kentucky. But right now I'm committed. Great. 9:47 Thank 9:47 you. I think I'm liked a little bit more now and the Russell family because 9:51 you don't wear like a bunch of orange around the house. Okay, so you're not a volunteer went 9:54 to the University of Kentucky. So okay, well, pretty hard cats fan. But for me, I think I'm just still trying to find my way in this industry. And right now I'm really enjoying the marketing aspect of the job, and just really getting to interact with different bartenders and people who truly love what you do here. And it makes me more passionate and want to be better at my job, as well. So for right now, I think, let Bruce, Eddie and Jimmy make all the good juice. And then I'll just be out there talking about it sharing the wild turkey love. 10:22 So you don't have any dreams or aspirations to want to do that. 10:25 Maybe in the future. But right now I'm enjoying what I'm doing. 10:28 Maybe like a summer internship, something like that to learn the distilling operation. 10:33 Yeah, we'll see. I think once Bruce gets here, I've learned a lot from him. We're kind of really good buddies, and definitely who I look up to the most. So I'm sure once he gets back here and kind of doing his thing, I'll probably be very intrigued in that as well. But I'm really enjoying what I'm doing right now. So 10:47 awesome. And so Bruce will will kick that over to you. So you have been now you live in Austin, Texas right now. Correct. 10:55 Kind of kind of all right. So I haven't lived there much this year. So he's got a home back. 11:02 They've got me moving back for sure. Permanently here in Kentucky, January one. It was actually supposed to be sometime this year. So my jobs kind of in a transition phase where I've really probably spent the most time here in Lawrenceburg at the distillery this year, as opposed to 300 days on the road last year, but I'm still doing a little bit of the ambassador work. We've hired somebody to take over as a national level ambassador, but I guess they don't. They don't they treat everybody a little bit nicer than us. So they didn't make your family. Yeah, they didn't make him travel 315 days. So he only has the West Coast. So I'm filling in a little bit on the East Coast, Joanne's feeling a little bit on the east coast and some of the smaller markets. 11:38 So you guys are starting to understand what it's like to live in the Delta sky lounge. 11:43 Exactly. Yeah. And we are Delta 13 through me, dad, Jimmy, I think all of us. 11:48 Yeah, we've we've talked about it, to an extent, at least with Eddie and I, because I was a Delta person at one point when I was traveling. So we talked about sky lounges and sort of how you get used to 11:58 lean and do while they weren't Southwest. With his wild turkeys. So yeah, and Jimmy was buddies with herb. And like, I think that's kind of how that wild turkey thing got started. 12:08 But now I've 12:09 worn by bugs out here, by the way. So if you see us on camera, and we're dodging we even it's, it's because we're just bug just flying everywhere. And we are recording outside. So if you hear trucks going on the background, it's because of the limestone quarry that they are just trucking stuff in and out of, you know, it was funny, we were actually recording another episode and trying to figure out, you know, where Bruce was going to start coming into here, because Eddie actually was part of the Union when he started coming in here. And Jimmy was sort of laughing a little bit because he made him do that. Now they're going to make us start joining the union to and sort of work your ranks up you think, you 12:44 know, the know, and it's a cute story now, but 12:50 he wasn't as cute back in the day, there's, you know, there's some real animosity between him about how that got started. I don't even think that many originally wanted to work here. You know, now they are, they work well together, we make amazing whiskey. 13:04 But I won't have to do the exact same thing dad did. His dad was kind of forced to go the union without a college degree. And I'm coming in with a little bit of background in the job and with a degree in some chemistry under my belt and stuff and been having doing the apprenticeship. So I would assume that I'm going to have to do the same type of things. But I probably won't be a union employee. I'll probably be a company employee, but their plan is to get me as soon as possible into the warehouse. And one thing we did forget to mention is so you are Eddie son. 13:35 Oh, yeah. So we got forgot to get all about the family lineage. Point. So 13:40 yeah. Jimmy Russell Mini is what we call it means it is our grandfather, Eddie occur master distillers, my father, and then he is joins uncle. But as far as Walter, he's concerned, you know, Jimmy me was not the first one to work here. My grandmother worked here before he did, and was basically the reason he got a job here. And then his father had worked here even before my grandmother did. And as far as I know, his grandfather was maybe the first person to work in a distillery here in Lawrenceburg, and Anderson County. And he worked at the Old Joe plant, which I believe was the precursor to what eventually became for roses. 14:19 So talk about your side, like, did you did you look at coming into this and saying, like, I just, I just need a job guys. Like, can we can we have some fun here? Or did you have this aspiration of wanting to be a part in the family business? 14:34 Yeah. So growing up, I always went to different events that they threw, like outside of the distillery, whether it be bourbon festival, or like the national Wild Turkey Federation down in Nashville. And I've always kind of had interest in it. But when I turned 21, I started out giving tours at the visitor center and just kind of working there as a summer job. And the longer I was there, the more passionate I got about it. And when you really get here, and you see what Jim Eddie do here, and then what Bruce has done the past few years, you just kind of you love it, you can't get out of it. It's addicting. And when you see that passion, you don't want to do anything else. 15:10 You use that word passion a lot right about what you what you see inside the family. Yeah. So are you looking at making this a lifelong career Wild Turkey? Are you looking this is like this is this has been fun? 15:21 No, I'd love to, I'd love to work here. And it's not just the family, it's the people. A lot of our employees have been here for very long time. And I think that says a lot to our company and who we are as a brand, that it's not just Jimmy and Eddie that have been here forever. We've got people that have worked here, 2030, 4050 years. So you saying there's other 15:38 people we should have on the podcast to be saying to me, 15:42 if you want to 15:43 tell you the real truth, maybe you don't like that. 15:47 So yeah. 15:49 So another question for you. While you're still we're talking on Joanne here, kind of talk about what it is being you know, we will talk about being sort of a younger generation here in a second. But you've been very female, because right now you have a lot of females that are starting to make their presence, you've got fond Weaver of uncle nearest you've got Marian eaves of castle and key. You've got the bourbon women's society that's starting to grow on hundreds of members now. So do you do you see this as like a great push for for, you know, involvement of women into whiskey to 16:22 absolutely and I've got to be a part of women and whiskeys a lot. So their Instagram page, they've got a ton of followers, but also just the support. Because I'm sure like Jimmy said back in the day, it really wasn't gentleman's drink and not so much anymore. And he likes saying that i think i think he does. Yeah, 16:38 he's got he got this little like, twinkle in his eyes, like, 16:41 just a demand. 16:42 Maybe maybe the good old days. I don't know. 16:44 It's awesome. It's a great time to be in the industry. It's booming right now. And it's not just whether it be brand ambassador work, but bartenders and just industry in general is, is growing insanely right now. And I'm just thankful to be a part of it. 16:59 So let's talk about sort of new blood, right? Like what it means to be new blood in here. Do you do you think that this is because Jimmy it said it before right? It's it's an old man's drink it was something that just just kind of just pretty stagnant for a while DC is a new regime or new blood coming in? That's kind of reinvigorating this market. 17:18 Absolutely. I would definitely say so. And it's it's everywhere. And I don't think it's just in bourbon or whiskey. I think it's in all of the industry whether it be the beer or the vodka or the gin. Think it's everywhere everybody's kind of coming together and realizing women have a pretty powerful role in this industry and it's just exciting to be a part of it. 17:38 And Bruce What about you because you know you're going to be I guess going head to head with say Freddie no here in a few years right? 17:47 Oh, not head to head he's bigger than me. I'm not mad. 17:51 Oh, hello, Freddie. I love that family. There's very little competition I don't even consider me and Freddie the new regime that is not new regime he's just trying to do is granted did he's just trying to make Booker proud really. And that's kind of what I'm doing just trying to make Jimmy Pro. So I think you'll probably see some more old school stuff from us then you will maybe our peers as far as age is concerned. This new wave of distiller this new wave of industry person is really exciting. For the most part. Now here I can tell you one thing we have as big of a problem as you see in other places. 18:24 But here in Kentucky we've got a ton of 18:28 young and just younger people than dead and Jimmy that are making amazing product when you look at stuff 18:35 and people that are just involved maybe not even at the master quote unquote master distiller level but there's the people in there making it there's a young guy out there, that 18:44 new contract is still right there in Bardstown bourbon company, and they're making crazy good juice, we went out there and checked it out with blaze news, Mr. Hargrove out there making some good stuff, Drew over there will it's doing some crazy cool stuff, Mariana, they're canceling key. He's doing some crazy cool stuff. There's this group of people, especially here in Kentucky, the folks over at angel's envy, are doing some really cool stuff that and that younger generation, I'm really excited to see because all these people are either from here and had family involved, or they're doing it in a way that I think you can be proud of. But I will say that there is some bad that's come from, 19:24 Oh, here we go go with the dirt and not dirt. But I 19:27 do think that there's something about every 25 to 35 year old person with a chemistry degree. distilling. aspirations now, like we talked about before, calls himself a master distiller and finds seven angel investors to build them a distillery in their band choose that they don't want to really talk about and be honest about like, there's a good side and a bad side. 19:48 Not only to the young, younger, influence and kind of influx into our industry, but also there's money to be made now. And for most of Jamie and dad's career, there was no money to be made. So the people doing it more people that loved it. Now, you know, you see a little bit of both. But with people like Freddie and the family over there at angel's envy, and drew and Marianne, and I mean, even dad and his generation, when you look at Fred and dad and somebody a car owner, Danny, we're good hands here in Kentucky. Absolutely. Yeah. 20:21 So I want to kind of touch on something else that you were talking about there, too. We talked about, you know, the chemistry degrees and all that sort of stuff, kind of talking about your background of sort of what's going to lead you into the distilling path, right. I mean, you're going to take an apprenticeship underneath your dad sort of learned from the ranks. 20:40 So I think the my kind of education will be twofold. 20:46 It'll be mostly hands on work, the academic aspect of distilling that the chemistry component. 20:55 I've spent a lot of time studying, researching and learning from the people that we have here on our technical team and our old distillery supervisor and dad. And that's what I've always been most interested in. Before I wanted to work here. I was going to school trying to be an engineer. So you know, I've always been a tinkerer taking things apart, figuring stuff out, it's always been very interesting to me, where most of my production will be now is learning how to actually do it by hand. Even though all this is automated is very important for dad and Jimmy to pass along. how it's done, kind of the way that Jimmy used to do it. That way I know, oh, when this when this shit breaks, when this shit breaks, isn't going right, in a distillery does not run correctly, almost ever. Anybody anytime you go to the store, and like oh, everything's running great. It's usually not 21:46 everything, something's always wrong. And I need to know why. Because that's where a master distiller really comes in to play now. You know, and some people I guess, are just figureheads. But a lot of these guys whether the consumer base another they're not are in their work. But a master is doers and stern pots anymore. He's not hand crushing grain or, you know, he's not sitting on top of a 200 degrees still having to take proofs and temperatures like Jimmy would. It's all automated now. Right? We're master distiller really comes in handy is, how to remedy something that's going wrong. 22:18 Or how to make something maybe even better in that automated process. And that's the stuff you've got to learn. You only learn that by being here, Jim, you can go in and smell the fermentation say, I left that sitting there too long starting to smell spicy. Until I was here for a decade, and trying to actually listen and learn. I had no clue what that meant. But now when you go in, you smell it. And you can tell, oh, we've had secondary fermentation come in. It's kind of smells like vinegar and spices, pepper. And it's stuff like that. You just have to kind of be here and pick up 22:49 there for some reason Jimmy and dad don't. They don't teach you. They just figured you know, you listen, you learn, you know? Yeah, it's got to do time. It's experience. 22:57 Yeah. And you're gonna figure out the hard way. I 23:00 don't know if I'll ever make whiskey is as good as Jimmy did in his prime. I think. 23:05 I know, I'm boss, because he's my grandfather. But when you try that Turkey that he was making when cost was not a factor, he was probably losing money hemorrhaging money, probably by making whiskey the way he did. And that stuff in the 70s and 80s and early 90s. That stuff is incredible, right. And so my goal at the end of my apprenticeship is just to make some things happen, you know, if I can make something that's got a little bit of that old school, wild turkey phone, because we got away from it for a while. There's this weird time in the 2000s, where our stuff is a little bit inconsistent. It doesn't have that same kind of wild turkey. Overall flavor. It's not as complex as flavorful. It doesn't have that deep funk that some of that other stuff has. 23:47 Now we're getting I think back to that, yeah. When you taste somebody limited editions, like the Russell's limited editions are like that decades are 23:56 you man, you take some of these single barrels that that people come and buy some of the best of we've ever made in the history of artist story. And so I'm excited about getting to learn how to do it, but also trying to do that same stuff that Jimmy always did. 24:07 Yeah, I mean, that was actually one thing that I had asked your dad, when we started looking at the growth of the brand, how everything is pretty much that's not running at full bore, right? It's about three quarters capacity, something like that at the at the current time. So there's going to be a day when agent stock is going to be there, right? And you can be able to say, well, we're looking, I'll go fill a few barrels with 107, right? Because you can do a run and I'll just go fill 600 barrels, and then yeah, then maybe you'll be able to look at having those releases where they are reminiscent of those old days. And it could be eight year wild turkey one on one, you know, going into the barrel 107. And it might be able to pick up some of that that old. 24:48 So here's something I'll tell you. And really, I'm trying to tell your listeners 24:53 is that if you all want to see stuff like that, even if we have so here's how it kind of works with us is even if we do have backstage to be able to do that thing, we have to not necessarily get permission. But you know, you gotta convince your overlords 25:05 exactly, 25:06 there needs to be a kind of a program and a plan involved. And they really want to see that it's going to be worth their time, even if it's not sold that you know, needs to generate something. And so one thing that I like to tell bartenders, but it goes the same for people that would be listening to this somebody that's an enthusiast or considers himself a bourbon geek or bourbon nerd or collector. 25:24 If you want to see stuff like old incher proof, if you want to see everything going on to filter this stuff that I see people yelling about on bourbon Reddit or on people's blogs or on comments on Patreon and stuff. 25:36 Not only your online, purchase, use your purchasing power, purchase the stuff like that tell people when you're at tastings or at these events, you know, hey, I would really like to see some wild turkey from one on seven. Because that's what matters it. You never know, you could be talking to the right marketing person at the right time. And all of a sudden, because this has happened with us. I heard from this guy that we would really like this kind of thing. It's like yeah, we been trying to tell you that for 15 years, but the one right consumer the one right time of one right place can get something like that through. So we want to do all this kind of stuff like one on seven injury proof, we want to 26:10 go back to making you know, maybe some even smaller batches, then we're doing that are how proof maybe non to filter barrel proof, maybe something like the Kentucky donut legend series. 26:21 There you go. But 26:22 to be able to do that, you know, we need you guys to 26:24 There you go. So there's a there's a call to action for all the listeners out there 26:29 who will help us a lot when you all fight for the old school style whiskey that we want to make for sure. 26:33 There you go. So one of the things that we didn't ask when we started this, because typically when we have somebody we don't really need to watch Jimmy Nettie, because it's Jimmy and Eddie but with you all. And it's typically what we ask all our guests is kind of like, how did you get into bourbon? Like what was? Do you remember that first? Like time that you either consumed it? Or was it something that you know? I'm sure. Probably you come in here and actually just having to go to get delivered daycare here. Did you have to come to date here at the distillery 27:00 the day here for me, I think it was called like Keith James. It was a guy that worked under dad that I always used to hang out with and I was a kid. And I think he knew I got you a bug again. I think they keep knew if he had the basically the boss's grandkid with him that he could do whatever he wanted. It worked. So we just hang out. No, no daycare. 27:19 But if you want to go ahead first on the whiskey thing. 27:22 I mean, for me, I guess definitely in the past few years my my interest in it, my left words grown a lot and just getting very fortunate to taste a lot of different things. Especially a lot of our old school stuff like Bruce was talking about earlier, the stuff that Jimmy was making the 70 in the 70s in the 80s as some of my favorite stuff. And personally for me like Russell's 98 is one of my if probably my favorite product that we've ever made here before. I just tend to like that sweeter that vanilla Carnival in those Bourbons that we make here. So for me, I'm a big Russell's advocate. And the whole entire line I really enjoy 28:01 when I was 12 I know that's not what they want to hear. So 21 this is 28:06 all about being authentic. But when I was 12 28:10 around then I might have been 13 my brothers nine or 10 28:15 dad took us in gave us some whiskey and who you all probably know as bad and Jimmy is not really who they are at home. They're very stereotypical Southern patriarchs a family's stern don't speak. 28:30 disciplinarians. tough on you. And dad at home does not speak he hadn't spoken me probably four times my whole life except for maybe good game or bad game when I mean a 28:40 lot of it, there's There seems to be a consistent generational thing between the fathers in these families is 28:46 I'm the kind of the gregarious one so I'll just force everybody to talk to me, even if they don't want to 28:52 talk to a brick 28:52 wall. Yeah. But when, whenever I was about that age, dad took me and Jake, besides my younger brother's name, and 29:00 took probably 30 or 45 minutes to explain to us the importance of the product and kind of like his involvement in it. And he could tell he's very proud about a thing that I'd never seen him. He'd never been proud of anything like that before in his life, except maybe my mom like that's the kind of look he had on his face. And that's when I knew me, my brother both, you know, he never got into this. And at that time, I didn't want to do this. But I knew this is special. Because dad doesn't really care about anything besides us. His dogs, you know, maybe hunting and fishing. 29:32 He really cared about that whiskey. And I knew like, Oh, this is cool. Because before then All I knew is Jimmy's. Everybody's boss me because he had a big office in dad is not anybody's boss because he did not know he was just the norm. He smelled like everybody else smell it smelled like sweat, and motor oil. And like aging whiskey is the best smell of the world when I was a kid kind of smells like when you drove up to the stereo, what it's smelled like, but I he was a normal worker. So I didn't even know him probably 15 or 16 that like 30:06 Jimmy was different. He wasn't just like an employee. You know what I mean? Yeah. But even at 12 I knew whatever this was, it matters because it matters today. 30:16 So what was that? That turning point for you? Whether it was a few years ago that you said? Yeah, sure I can I can get into the family business. Because it sounded like you were lying 30:26 thing happened to me that happened to dad that happened to Joanne 30:30 Jamie was forced into his job. But my grandmother but we all took summer jobs. 30:37 Dad did not start off wanting to work here. He was playing football at Western hitchhiked up here. didn't have a car back then granny made him get a job at this story summer job he just never will have same thing happened to me. Basically, same thing happened to join. Whenever I was 21. I got a job here given tours. I had worked a million jobs and stuff farm stuff, working Kroger, the meat department organ and FedEx moving boxes. Dad was like withdrawal would be a lot easier. know everything at the distillery already, you can just give a tour and talk about yourself. It's like cool, and this little place right next to where we're at. So the one room home that they've kind of converted into an event space. 31:14 And I gave tours and thought I'm gonna make my 10 bucks an hour and give these tours and it'd be easy six hour day job. And I'll go back to Lexington and party up with UK kids. And about a month in. 31:27 I started getting questions from people, I started to get groups like probably the people that listen to this podcast. What's amylase enzyme? I've heard that before? Like, you know, why is your yeast proprietary? Why does that matter? Or you would get questions that I would have no clue what it was, which would be like, why do you all run your steals hotter? And why is low proof even a good thing? Because I just knew low proof. I went through proof or distillation proof. That's because that's what maybe says because tastes good. And then once I realized I don't have the answers that started to pick the brains. And again, it was a situation where you had two guys in your family. 32:01 They really don't open up about much. And then as soon as you start talking bourbon, all of a sudden you start to push Yes. 32:09 And that's when I knew like oh, I need to stick around here and at least figure out what's going on. Because this is cool. And this in that time I was still thinking maybe I'd go be an engineer or do something like that. 32:21 And it was probably the end of that summer when I knew I'm probably never gonna leave. 32:27 And now you know I'll never leave the bourbon industry. I love it the people 32:34 and the opportunities afforded my family's changed my fam the opportunity to travel around the world and meet people that don't look like us and sound like ghosts and it girl by ghosts it's changed me for the better a lot. So this industry's done a lot for us. And we're very appreciative. 32:49 So the other thing is, you know, being a little bit younger, you know, you're you're talking about going party back with the Lexington boys and something like that. So do you see yourself actually living here in Lawrenceburg? Or do you see yourself maybe coming from Lexington or Louisville everybody can eat from the city now love where I'm from. I love Lawrenceburg. 33:05 And it's a great place to grow up. It's great place to raise a family but you gotta you gotta have a Yeah, there's a little a little more I've got I've got to make the family before I move somewhere where I 33:16 tell me Tinder isn't like a big thing and Laura's knowledge. 33:18 It's pretty tough going out on dates when every single single woman within probably five years of me I'm either related to dated before I dated their sister, you know, it's a small community. Everybody knows me and everybody knows my best times and my worst time Yeah, and that's rough here. In South probably have to go to over Lexington. I'm not gonna say I'm never going to live here because Lawrenceburg town, it's home. Like I went to school at Anderson County. I went to the same high school that Jimmy went to same buildings and everything. I went to church right down here growing up in this little community called Tyrone that is the most little country church in the world. 33:56 And that it made me who I am. And I love it. Maybe when living in Austin, so it's gonna be awesome. Yeah, six 7000 people or whatever it is. Yeah, 34:06 the live music scene and Lawrenceburg just isn't the same. 34:09 Well, now there's a guy right down there Jared Stratton, who disagrees pretty good. Yeah. 34:15 take your word for it. 34:17 So who knows you could be here long enough and you'll get your own scooter down there. 34:21 That's good. It's pretty cool in about 50 That's what he said he's 34:24 got a license plate on and do some turn signals 34:26 I really want to because you know we know we're back in town I really want to get the the chief of police to come down here like fake arresting from drinking and driving on us. 34:37 That'd be a good one. What about you Joanne do you actually live around here? Do you commute like what's your what's your 34:42 went to school and Lexington I still live there right now. But think I'm going to be making the move to local by the beginning of the year just for work. bigger market. As you know, Lexington it's not super big, definitely a college town. But there's only so much you can do there. So I'm excited to make the move to global get to a little bit better, bigger city. Because I did grow up in Nashville. I grew up in a small town about 20 minutes south of Nashville so much bigger than Lawrenceburg. It 35:08 was like if they gave you an ultimatum gotta move to Lawrenceburg. We would 35:11 do it absolutely i mean granted Joe and made me live here. I get free breakfast every Saturday 35:17 enforcer to be complaining to me. 35:20 Like I'm spending the night at your house. I gotta get I gotta get out of here. 35:28 You've probably heard of finishing beer using whiskey barrels. But Michigan distillery is doing the opposite. They're using beer barrels to finish their whiskey. New Holland spirits claims to be the first distillery to stout a whiskey. The folks at Rock house whiskey club heard that claim and had to visit the banks of Lake Michigan to check 35:45 it out. 35:46 It all began when New Holland brewing launched in 97. Their Dragon's milk beer is America's number one selling bourbon barrel aged out in 2005. They apply their expertise from brewing and began distilling beer barrel finish whiskey began production today thousand 12 and rock house boozy club is featuring it in their next box. The barrels come from Tennessee get filled with Dragon's milk beer twice, the mature bourbon is finished and those very same barrels. Rocco's whiskey club is a whiskey the Month Club on a mission to uncover the best flavors and stories from craft distillers across the US. Along with two bottles of hard to find whiskey rack houses boxes are full of cool merchandise that they ship out every two months to members in over 40 states. Go to rock house whiskey club com to check it out. And try a bottle of beer barrel bourbon and beer barrel rye. Use code pursuit for $25 off your first box. 36:37 So I want to kind of just kind of take it back, talk a little bit more about the whiskey right because both of your ambassadors you both know it inside and out. So kind of because this is this is, you know, every show is going to feature a little bit different kind of angle on the wild turkey story. And since you guys know the product sets really well. Let's just go through them just kind of real quickly to give our listeners kind of a different understanding that they wouldn't necessarily get from me Eddie or Jimmy when we're talking stories, right? So So let's start at the like the at one in one on one and kind of like give us the give us a typical spiel that you would usually do when you're out in Ambassador is the word we're 37:13 all good at when you do one on one. And that one's a little bit more difficult. 37:17 A bit different. Yeah. 37:18 So at one is a was not the original one on one is. So it was kind of a take on that that came out under the promo, I believe, regime when they were a parent company, and they had decided that they wanted to have a competitor for the 80 proof set. And like most 80 proofs, you know, surprise surprise to no one on this, listen to this, or 45 years old. And they had chosen to go down that same route. And so for a very long time, we had an 80 proof wild turkey that was in when people say 45 years old. Hopefully everybody knows that means it's probably all four years old. And every now and then a fat might squeeze in you know. And so when the best whiskey in for a long time in you've I've heard on this podcast, I'm sure you're aware that it's very hard to get Jimmy to say anything bad about anything that's ever happened the distiller he's a very, very proud company, man, very proud, very positive. And he just don't want to hurt anybody's feelings. And if you get him on Sometimes he'll say what he thinks. But he did not like that at PR never did. And now he admits it. And I think by the end of the ad, he used to tell people kind of like wink, wink, why would you drink the ad if you could get the one on one, because not only was it a four year old product, but it's proof down. It's just not what he liked. But then, after he bought us and I thought I think it's one of the smartest things they've done, they realized that we didn't care for the product. And that's probably a big reason why I didn't sail because when your two main phases of the company, they're on the road debt and Jimmy, when people ask him to drink the 80 proof, and they refuse outright, and go to something else that tells you all. And so they decided to let's change it. And that is one of the few things that they gave that almost full rein on it. He said, Well, I don't think that it's a problem that we have a proof down thing, I just think the whiskey is not good. And so we changed the product. And what you see now is at one is no longer any four or five, it's now going to be six, seven and eight year old bland average age right around six and a half years. And what he wanted is he wanted an 80 proof product that going to stand up in a cocktail. That's one of the reasons why I think one on one is so industry friendly is 101 proof. And we're known for having a big kind of in your face flavor. And it stands up if you add sweetener, you add modifier is you're going to still taste the whiskey or the raw. It wasn't the case for 80 proof. And I think it was just a 39:37 it's night and day better. And I've seen all the reviews come out that have compared the old ad to the 8181 just kicks its tail. That's one of the few things that was kind of in that Jimmy era that just I didn't think was a very good product. But I know it wasn't up to him to make it. So what you have now is that blend of 678 right at 81 proof is a large batch. So both it one on one American honey, these products, they're right around 1500 barrels mingled together for that one batch as opposed to like 150 or less on those small batches. And what we're looking for is kind of the classic wild turkey flavor profile, but a little bit lighter, a little bit, I guess brighter and a little bit more crisp, maybe fruity almost is the way I would describe it. I think it's a lot less of that kind of combo vanilla and a lot more like honey fruit, it's kind of a lighter thing. They it is a different blend than the one on one. I think that's something that consumers don't know. It's not the same bland, it's not the same age, they're completely different batches. One on One is older journal talking about that. And we do want at one to have a different kind of flavor profile 40:41 at doing that for a particular market. Because you know, talking about the bourbon aficionado of somebody that's semi educated. Did you really think that they're going to go for the 81 or they should probably not 40:56 bourbon aficionado, the only thing we would make was masters keeps. 41:00 That's not what everybody needs. Everybody likes different stuff. I'm not an expert in wine at all. I can't even really say one that will. 41:09 But 41:12 yeah, when I whenever I drink my bottle of two buck Chuck or whatever it is, I'm as happy as a lark. Yeah, just like I'm sure whoever enjoys like the 81. That's their go to drink their enjoyment. It's, it's for maybe a more of a beginning consumers for somebody that wants something low proof or something a little bit more sensible. 41:31 or four bar because there's a lot of bars that want wild turkey is their base product. But we don't want a one on one raw are not inexpensive, especially for well, or rail products. So if you go to a bar, and they have one on one or one on one, right as their, their bourbon and coke order or whatever, that's a good bar, it's been in a lot of money on their product. Most people don't want that they want something a little bit less expensive at ones for that kind of bar too. But we have seen a pretty big growth on the offspring to which is exciting because it like you were talking about a lot of the consumers that are going to be on this are going to be listening to this are going to want more probably Rare Breed spirit, private barrels, the limited stuff. 42:11 Nailed it. 42:13 We've got those consumers like they're already on our side and we make stuff specifically for them. So it's really fun to see when you walk into a liquor store. And there's somebody that's like, looking through what bourbon should I get? Oh, well, Turkey. Well, now at one's not at all anymore. It's wild turkey bourbon. So that's what they're going for. 42:29 And I think if you try that it does give you a kind of a good representation of what wild turkey can be. Yeah, one on one. And when you go to Rare Breed or like a Russell 2002, it just continues to be I think even more and more, quote unquote, wild turkey. I think at once like a really good entry point, maybe long branches to now. There we go. 42:49 So go ahead is a little bit of one on one. Yeah, 42:51 absolutely. So um, started back in like the late 30s. Early 40s is when we first started making one on one it was eight year one on one. One thing, one story that really stood out to me that Bruce told in the warehouse one day when we were doing a barrel pick was it really stood out because back then four year old bourbon was really what everybody was getting. And I guess when you put a big on a bottle and one on one, people kind of get drawn to it. So that's kind of what built our company. It's cool to see one on one still do so well. It's still our number one best selling product. Like Bruce said it does tend to be a little bit older. So Seven, eight, sometimes maybe a little nine is thrown in there as well. But for those long 43:28 old book 10 year old and this year, yeah. Oh, yeah. Yeah. Short on it, I guess because long range or something. There's a little bit older in this year. 43:34 Yeah. But for the longest time, all we were making was one on one and one on one. Right. And one of the coolest stories that I've come to know is that without the bartending industry without 43:46 off Prem on prem, we would just still be one on one and one on one right. We would not have Russell's we wouldn't have Kentucky spirit, we wouldn't have rare breed, because that's not what the market wanted back in the day. So it's really what Bill our company, it's still who we are today. One thing that I really respect about Eddie and Bruce is that they will never step on what Jimmy's done here. Like Eddie talks about a little bit earlier. One on one wall is we want to one Rare Breed will always be rare breed Kentucky spirit will always be Kentucky spirit. Those are kind of Jimmy's babies. But the one on one, like I said is a little bit older than the 81 tends to be a little bit spicier, a little bit bolder kind of that in your face bourbon. A lot of people tend to say it reminds them of their college days. Which is 44:25 funny. It's funny because we all we all talk about one way more 44:29 money than I did in college. I used to drink whenever I was broken couldn't steal anything. Yeah, Kentucky gentlemen a mountain dew. 44:34 I was a Kentucky Tavern guy. So I was Kentucky. But we wouldn't every once while I had a pet a buddy cuz I'm a nerd. Right? I work in tech. And so every time I had to go fix something form or reboot his girlfriend's router, whatever the fuck it was at the time. It and he would always be like, he was like, Hey, we're gonna go get a bottle one on one and drink it tonight. Yeah, yeah, we'd shoot it back then we're kind of like I was like, now I'd probably like savor and sip it. But back then we were shooting it right. I don't know. Understand. 44:59 I still you never know. 45:02 But it's I mean, that's probably one of the biggest the biggest things I get, especially working in the visitor center when people come in, oh, I drank this back when I was in college. Like, that's how I know it is what it is and why it's around but tend to be older, a little bit spicier. 101 proof, definitely stand up in a cocktail. Definitely our oldest product in my opinion, it's we're going to get that spice it kind of takes over your palate a little bit compared to a few other things in our portfolio that tend to be a little bit sweeter. 45:28 What's quite the statement to say it's the oldest one because you got a rare breed as well. So 116 is pretty easy to drink. No, yes, that's that's just that's just back porch. Country Day sipping whiskey right there. 45:38 One thing I'll say about the one one that I think is kind of cool that people probably don't realize when they look at the history. And I think this is like kind of in your face to some of the crowd that maybe listens to this podcast, one on one started off as a contract brand. So when people that aren't super educated about how contract works, yeah, don't Pooh Pooh contract brands, some of a really great artists pretty good. But what it is what how it kind of it all started, artist story was already making that recipe and something similar. A guy that went on a turkey hunt got some of our whiskey from our distillery that he was already purchasing, and fell in love with it and was one of the few people that probably ever existed that was wealthy enough to turn an inside joke into a brand. And it had become kind of an inside joke with him. And these guys on this hunting trip. Oh, this is Tom's wild turkey whiskey. And they fell in love with it. And then he started to promote it locally. And it was a contract brand. He owned it the label owned the name. And we made the whiskey for him here out of our distillery back when we were still Anderson distilling company when it was owned, I think even by the repeat. 46:42 And then by the time we were quote unquote, owned by the Austin Nichols company, Austin Nichols was then kind of merged or owned by completely different company. And so anytime when we were the label was owned by Austin Nichols. It was kind of a contract situation. And we were making good stuff out of here. So it was a good contract situation. And Walter, you just kind of took over we were the JT s brown distillery more so than anything else that was our big product. And really the only thing that we made back then that's still around, I think, although I think we made Dowling whiskey back then, too. And I think it might still be around, but I'm not sure. Jimmy thing seems to think it is. But all of his like facts and figures or stuff from from back when he was drinking 20 years ago. 47:23 I'm not sure he's not he's not hitting it as hard as he used to 47:26 know he's not not unless I make him. 47:28 Yeah. Because now it's YouTube that are taken over hitting it hard 47:32 on the right. But you know, once every four or five months, whenever we're all out somewhere, especially like he has certain places he really likes Chicago is probably his favorite market. Definitely. Because he has a lot of friends there. And an old school people are still around there. But when you get him with some old school buddies, he'll still stay out of 456 in the morning. He the mind is willing. And I think that the The palate is willing. He's just getting up here and age. Yeah. But if you if you hung out with him all day today and drink whiskey, he'd stay here with you till Friday, if you want to do. Absolutely. 48:06 So let's go hit hit a few other ones real quick. So talk about rare breed a little bit. Who wants to take that one? 48:12 Yeah, I mean, I'll talk a little bit about it. So it started back in 91. When we did the first batch, I think Eddie said we've made about 13 batches. Now. 48:20 There's like 12 or 13 different proofs that we've done, 48:23 that we've done. So making a new one every few years, but right now, it's going to be six, eight and 12 years old. So Jimmy really, really loves whiskey that is six to 12 years old. So he basically took those three years that he loves the most put together out of barrel proof. And that's what made Rare Breed so been around since the 90s. The previous batch was at a 112 point eight. So it's a small batch bourbon for us, that's about 150 to 200 barrels coming together. And then right at barrel proof, so chill filter it right a barrel proof not on any water to that product whatsoever. So it's a cast cask strength, or barrel proof bourbon, and right now it's sitting on 116 eight and it tends to be there a lot of my opinion there are a lot of flavors that go on in the rare breed just because it does have so many different years in it. When you get down to kind of the nerdy science part about whiskey and especially agent in a barrel different years produce different flavors so for me six is really really where you get that spice and the rare breed The A is kind of where you get a little bit more of that vanilla Carmel okie flavor and then that 12 is really getting kind of rounded out bringing more a little bit more of that sweetness kind of that that chocolate Enos I guess Eddie would say nuttiness on the back end of the product. Gotcha. 49:38 real cool. And then what we Kentucky spirit Russell's right, those are kind of still fall in the same right single barrel will actually Russell's doesn't technically have to be single barrel does it? Or is it? There's four Russell's products. So two single barrels and two small batches. configs spirits probably the next one, that we would go with every like doing the ambassador thing because we usually do like all the turkey stuff and then the Russell stuff. So rare breed and spirit kind of have a similar story where those aren't original ideas from me. And I think he just saw his friends do something and thought it was cool and did his version. So Rare Breed came about just two years after Booker's You know, that's not a coincidence. And but for the longest time, maybe mini nor, as far as I know, talking to Freddie Fred and, and remembering what I do from when I was a kid Booker never wanted to do a single barrel neither to Jimmy. They thought that it would be a disgrace to the brands because you would lose consistency and the right you can never be perfectly consistent barrel the barrel. And that's why most of the people listen to this podcast and myself included think the single barrel stuffs probably the coolest stuff that comes out all these distilleries because you can taste 50:47 every day, it's something different. You 50:48 could taste the barrel there Fred Minnick picked out or you could taste a barrel that the like I was just up in New York with the beast masters guys or whatever, or you taste one that an ABC store picks up, they're all going to be so wildly different, some super weird and funky some, just like retail some supply. And he hated that. And still doesn't completely get behind. Because the consistency bothers him so bad. And so it took him forever. So Booker's 89 Rare Breed 91 will bite and come out in 84. But took him 10 years to finally admit, he's playing stuffs pretty cool. Maybe we should do our version. And so he kind of wanted to do the same thing over did Elmer wanted to basically make the best version of that ancient age juice he could. And Jimmy wanted to go about making the best version of one on one he could and I still tell people that's the only way you're getting kind of the Oh gee, the original one on one just can tell you spirit in that retails all we can be at least eight years old, one on one in the bottles not anymore unless you're getting it from Japan. So if you want that old school, at least eight year old one on one proof, kind of flavor profile experience the way to go. It's probably 51:58 the least talked about least and over. 52:02 Most forgotten about product that we have on our line now that the Russell's single barrels have come out and a lot of people have gone to those with a private barrel program. And with rare breed been so good lately. 52:14 I really think people should should give spirit a chance if they haven't had in a while. It's a delicious product. And when you find that right barrel might be the best thing we make. Yeah, that stuff is so good. And I know some people get caught up in the will Russell's is 110. And it's one on one. Sometimes water helps. Sometimes you find that right? That right barrel that you prove it down, you know, 1015 proof points and that water opens it up. And it's just super tasty. 52:38 We're getting small bugs over here. 52:39 But I agree with Bruce definitely because I think Kentucky spirit is my favorite product and just kind of like our standard portfolio, but definitely doesn't get the love that it deserves for being eight year one on one kind of like that. Oh, gee stuff. 52:51 Where's me they change that bottle? 52:53 Yeah. 52:55 It could be the fact it could be the only reason people bought now is because of that goal bought onto it scares me because not very much of it is bought. And so I don't want anything to happen to that product. 53:03 Right? Well, you should probably just save like a few pallets of it in the back. So you can just go have your own little special releases of your own spirit. 53:10 Don't think that's not already done. Yeah. Here's a few, quote unquote, empty barrels out here, you know, there you go. 53:18 That's smart. So we're gonna, we're gonna get towards the end of this. So if there's any other products that you want to quickly touch on real quick, that kind of educate the consumers. Yeah, I 53:25 would love to touch on one on one raw, a little bit more. It's my favorite product that we make you're in, you're out because you're the right guy. But it's not because it's my favorite to drink that probably the single barrel raw or maybe a revival right now really like, but I think one on one rise very important to us, because it's very important to the bartending industry. 53:49 It's what they've traditionally kind of held as their own. And the thing that they've always kind of supported. Wild Turkey with is putting one on one rise, the bass cocktail and spirits are in Wales. And it only exists today in its current form because of our dinner. And I think this is a good story to tell your listeners, whether they work in the industry, or they're enthusiasts, or they run their own blogs or podcasts or whatever, that you all matter people that really the people that enjoy our product, and people that are passionate about our product they matter to us. So one on one raw went away for a while, we made very little raw for very long time, one day, kinda in the first season, spring, one day in the second season, fall winter, and 54:32 didn't have enough. Part of that is because we didn't forecast enough part of that is forgiven happen. So we lost six months worth of our on to accidental thing that our buddy Connie did. And we didn't have enough. So in the late 2000s, I think might have been around 2010, 2011, 2012, 54:51 right in there. 54:53 One on one route went away. And compared to Tom came out with 81. And nothing faith we can get by by just lowering the proof a little bit. And we couldn't get by a lot of people got very angry, especially people that were had to use that for decades is there? 55:11 Well, yeah, they're raw. If you ask for a Ronnie, that's what they're going to give you. And so 55:18 a guy by the name of Eric Asher, who's a good buddy of mine, now that he's almost like one of the family owns bars in San Diego, New York. At that time, I think maybe working in San Francisco started an online petition, first time I ever seen this happen to petition a supplier and also kind of speak out and say, if you are going to get one on one on one route, we're not going to carry any more competitive products. In he was the guy that kind of mattered, you know, he made himself mad, or he was loud and proud about what he did and took bartending seriously. And, and because of his passion, and because he got a lot of other people to kind of side with him and sign up on this kind of like online petition or group or whatever it was completely Listen, and they came out with a product after just two or three years of her being off the shelf. And it's we don't where it's not even an allocation anymore, we have plenty of it, and have had plenty of it for a year to the one on one or at least 56:11 in that's why it's kind of my favorite product, because it's a product that is very near and dear to me because I enjoy it so much. Because one on one rise, the only reason why we make any rat to begin with, because it's the thing that kind of makes money on the wrong side. But also because it's a good example of what a person that can be passionate can take what they can do what they can get done. You know, you had a question from from Dave Jennings earlier, Robert. It's another good example like this dude just made a hobby, his hobby into almost like a full time job. Even though he has another job in like, we talked about him in the company when we're doing meetings and stuff like did you see that thing he said? Or did you see that timeline that he did like bars? Like Is this right? Can we use this? Like, should we pay him 57:00 he's doing a better job than a lot of people we paid to do that kind of stuff. And if you're even if it's not wild turkey if you're listening into this, you're passionate about whiskey about bourbon. If you're a Buffalo Trace fan or a Jim Beam Stan, are you only like 400 year old family state will it? That's cool. Be passionate about that, almost to the noxious level and kind of good things happen. Because we like that we like when somebody shows up and gets that know that look I was talking about earlier the den Jimmy have on their face on their passion about something like when dad was talking about that whiskey. That's the kind of look that makes me excited when somebody comes in. And dad's like, I got something that we haven't even put out yet for Detroit. And you see that guys, I was like, you know, you think that at home the moon at that point. That's the best part of this job to see people get excited about what we do. 57:51 Absolutely. Well, that's good. That's I'm gonna go ahead and end on that note, because there's gonna be one that we're never gonna forget because we're all going to walk away with mosquito bites after this. 58:01 So I want to kind of quickly wrap it up. If there's anybody that people want to get in contact with you social media, go ahead and let them know so they can find you. Twitter, Instagram, 58:10 I'm Joanne Street. It's pretty basic on all social media aspects. 58:14 You said of yourself called yourself. 58:19 That was karma right there. 58:22 My Instagram is Russell's rock. I don't use social media very much. And I think my Twitter is Bruce Russell one on one. 58:31 I'm on Reddit too. You'll see me like pop around on bourbon Reddit

In this episode Dan & Danny are joined by Erin (@Icelebpretty). Erin is a 27 year old former vine star, from Charleston SC, that's currently popping on IG. She sits down with the guys to school them on who women dress up for, discuss the difference between like and lust, and debate if it's possible to have sex with someone multiple times without feelings being involved. As Always, let us know your thoughts by rating and reviewing on Apple Podcasts or wherever you listen to Podcasts. We are also on Youtube! Search "livingsinglepod" and be sure to SUBSCRIBE! Be sure to follow @livingsinglepod on Instagram & Facebook for additional weekly content! Time Stamps: 6:13 Who do Women Dress up for? 15:24 How do men distinguish Lust from Like? Is loosing feelings after sex a thing? 19:15 Is it possible to have sex with someone multiple times without feelings being involved? 25:16 Dan & Danny debate whether you should give a woman your best shot, the first time you have sex with her.

I guess I got ahead of myself. I've been talking about author branding, but I didn't describe or define it. And in this world of author branding, you may be wondering, “Uh...what's an ‘author brand'?” Sorry to leave you full of questions. Like: Is it the logo you design and the colors you choose for your website? Is it the font you use for your name? Is it the banner image you use on Facebook or the photo that shows up in Gravatar? Is it the art on your book cover? Is an author brand more about voice and style? Is it tied to the subject matter you're known for? The topics you tackle? Is your brand revealed in the way you manage your Instagram feed and select images for your blog? Maybe all this talk of “brand” sickens you. “Seriously?” you're thinking, “Brands are for jeans and perfume and hotdogs, not writers!” Thinking of yourself as a brand feels slick, commercial, and product-y. “Brand” sounds like marketing manipulation or sales-speak. “I'm a Writer, Not a Brand!” “I'm not a brand!” you're shouting. “I'm a person! A writer! An artist!” And of course if you're shouting that, you're right—absolutely right. We are not neon signs to flick on and flash in a window or a color palette and typography design hoping to entice interest. We are people—people who love words. We tell stories. We pour out our hearts and hold out hope to the world. We're essayists, memoirists, novelists, poets. We are artists. (But I Would Love Readers to Read My Work) And yet, if we seek publication, we're trying to draw interest. If we're doing more than write in a journal, we must be hoping to find readers for our articles, our poetry, our short stories, our books. If we write for the public, we want to impact people. If we're honest, we'd love readers to read our work, wouldn't we? Readers Default to “Brands" And readers face a lot of choices. When a person shells out money for a book or sinks time into reading an article, she wants to be pretty sure it's worth it. So she's choosy. Sure, she'll read someone new, especially on a friend's recommendation, but she tends to gravitate to the writers she has come to know, like, and trust. She turns to those writers who turn out content that consistently addresses her need or lifts her up or makes her think or laugh or sigh. She reads the writers she knows will help meet her need. She probably doesn't think of it this way, but she turns to author brands. A Brand Is a Promise So that's a way to think of brands and writers. How can we become that trusted writer who consistently addresses a reader's needs or lifts her up or makes her think or laugh or sigh? How can we offer an unspoken, informal promise of sorts, that when a reader finds us and reads our words, he will get to know us and we'll deliver content in the same general vein. If, for example, I don't use four-letter words in my content then suddenly spew a stream of them unexpectedly, I broke my “promise,” so to speak, and went off brand. I blindsided my readers who had come to trust my tone and turn up my podcast or read aloud my articles within earshot of their conservative grandmother or grade school kids. A Brand Accumulates, Forms, and Strengthens Over Time Whether intentional or random, everything we write and send out—from social media updates to podcast episodes—is leaving people with an impression about who we are and what we're like. Over time, one blog post, magazine article, short story, or poem at a time, you're becoming known for something. Over time, you gain visibility. And over time, your brand is forming and strengthening into something. A group or groups of people are beginning to recognize you. You can see how it does involve a lot of different elements, including our subject matter, our tone, and, yes, even the colors on our website, our author photo, the cover art on our book covers, and the style of our logo. What Comes to a Reader's Mind

I guess I got ahead of myself. I’ve been talking about author branding, but I didn’t describe or define it. And in this world of author branding, you may be wondering, “Uh...what’s an ‘author brand’?” Sorry to leave you full of questions. Like: Is it the logo you design and the colors you choose for your website? Is it the font you use for your name? Is it the banner image you use on Facebook or the photo that shows up in Gravatar? Is it the art on your book cover? Is an author brand more about voice and style? Is it tied to the subject matter you’re known for? The topics you tackle? Is your brand revealed in the way you manage your Instagram feed and select images for your blog? Maybe all this talk of “brand” sickens you. “Seriously?” you’re thinking, “Brands are for jeans and perfume and hotdogs, not writers!” Thinking of yourself as a brand feels slick, commercial, and product-y. “Brand” sounds like marketing manipulation or sales-speak. “I’m a Writer, Not a Brand!” “I’m not a brand!” you’re shouting. “I’m a person! A writer! An artist!” And of course if you’re shouting that, you’re right—absolutely right. We are not neon signs to flick on and flash in a window or a color palette and typography design hoping to entice interest. We are people—people who love words. We tell stories. We pour out our hearts and hold out hope to the world. We’re essayists, memoirists, novelists, poets. We are artists. (But I Would Love Readers to Read My Work) And yet, if we seek publication, we’re trying to draw interest. If we’re doing more than write in a journal, we must be hoping to find readers for our articles, our poetry, our short stories, our books. If we write for the public, we want to impact people. If we’re honest, we’d love readers to read our work, wouldn’t we? Readers Default to “Brands" And readers face a lot of choices. When a person shells out money for a book or sinks time into reading an article, she wants to be pretty sure it’s worth it. So she’s choosy. Sure, she’ll read someone new, especially on a friend’s recommendation, but she tends to gravitate to the writers she has come to know, like, and trust. She turns to those writers who turn out content that consistently addresses her need or lifts her up or makes her think or laugh or sigh. She reads the writers she knows will help meet her need. She probably doesn’t think of it this way, but she turns to author brands. A Brand Is a Promise So that’s a way to think of brands and writers. How can we become that trusted writer who consistently addresses a reader’s needs or lifts her up or makes her think or laugh or sigh? How can we offer an unspoken, informal promise of sorts, that when a reader finds us and reads our words, he will get to know us and we’ll deliver content in the same general vein. If, for example, I don’t use four-letter words in my content then suddenly spew a stream of them unexpectedly, I broke my “promise,” so to speak, and went off brand. I blindsided my readers who had come to trust my tone and turn up my podcast or read aloud my articles within earshot of their conservative grandmother or grade school kids. A Brand Accumulates, Forms, and Strengthens Over Time Whether intentional or random, everything we write and send out—from social media updates to podcast episodes—is leaving people with an impression about who we are and what we’re like. Over time, one blog post, magazine article, short story, or poem at a time, you’re becoming known for something. Over time, you gain visibility. And over time, your brand is forming and strengthening into something. A group or groups of people are beginning to recognize you. You can see how it does involve a lot of different elements, including our subject matter, our tone, and, yes, even the colors on our website, our author photo, the cover art on our book covers, and the style of our logo. What Comes to a Reader's Mind