Podcasts about right well

Today, I really struggled with what I was going to talk about. Not because I didn't have enough ideas, but because I couldn't figure out what idea would be the best idea to talk about today. But I think that I've centered in on something that is worthwhile talking about, and it's something that I bring to my coaching clients all the time.In life, we have a variety of emotional wells we can draw from, each serving a unique purpose. From the well of validation to the well of self-esteem, friendship, career, and more, these emotional wells are essential to our well-being. The challenge often arises when we unknowingly drink from the wrong well, leading to feelings of invalidation, frustration, or unfulfillment.Join me as we explore the analogy of these emotional wells and learn how to become more self-aware, making conscious choices about which well to draw from. Are you drinking from the right well for your current emotional needs? Are you using the right source for the emotions you're experiencing?We'll discuss practical examples and tips for building your emotional ecosystem and seeking the right sources for your needs. Discover how to create validation for yourself while also understanding the value of seeking support from others when necessary.This episode is a guide to help you recognize and navigate your emotional wells, ensuring that you can draw from the right sources to promote your emotional health and overall well-being. By the end, you'll gain the tools and insights to make more conscious, purposeful choices in your life and emotional experiences.So, hit play and let's embark on this journey of self-discovery together. Tune in to gain valuable insights and strategies for living a more conscious, emotionally healthy life.Connect with me on IG @theneurodivergentceo , and don't hesitate to reach out if you need further guidance on building your personal emotional ecosystem. Whether you're looking to strengthen your self-esteem well, relationship well, or any other aspect of your emotional life, I'm here to support you.Remember, you're not alone on this journey. Let's take the first step together. Don't forget that you absolutely can book a free 20 minute mini-coaching session with me HERE

In this message titled "Drink from the Right Well", we are made to know that in life, there are different wells from which we drink, but only one satisfies.Aired on Radio HCI Today

Jordan Heiderman is a young man from small town Nebraska who has already accomplished some huge life goals, and is looking for more! Jordan has found a balance within his life that includes dog training, weight lifting, and BBQing! Tune in and enjoy another story of Common Folks doing Extraordinary things.

One little ticket could mean a big hike for your insurance rates. Gloria Haydock, Manager of Consumer and Industry Relations with the Atlantic Region of the Insurance Board of Canada, told us just how risky distracted driving can be.

While the belief is that all young people are in lockstep with liberal ideas, many flirting with socialism, the truth is that the enthusiasm of young people on the right is better financed and has some charismatic leaders who are working diligently to get those ideas to their age cohort who feel marginalized by the … Continue reading EP 661 Young Zealots on the Right Well Financed and Well Organized →

Family minister Julia Brunton speaks on the woman at the well

 Drinking from the Right Well 

I know we have heard over and over about how the election of 2020 was the most important of our lifetime. We came out, did our role but nothing ever came of it. Now again as midterms approach, we find ourselves in a place not voting for better policies which are sorely needed but voting to defeat the rise of fascism which is looking to take the country back to a place where rights are taken away and the beliefs from the minority will dictate the lives of everyone else. We can't let that happen, right? Damn I sure hope so. Link for reference on inflation: https://www.inequalitymedia.org/the-truth-about-inflation?gclid=CjwKCAjwzNOaBhAcEiwAD7Tb6E26D9OwZLNCkuLorYLP6W6BmZuhi5U8_3nC6qdxQcoOO-n36M --- This episode is sponsored by · Anchor: The easiest way to make a podcast. https://anchor.fm/app --- Send in a voice message: https://anchor.fm/correctlymistaken/message

From Sunday morning's service on September 11th, 2022. Intro Music is licensed through soundstripe.com. The Song is called Folk Road Parade by Sounds Like Sander.

Often times in this world we have been brainwashed to drink from the wrong well. To turn to the wrong coping mechanisms such as adultery or drinking alcohol. Or doing drugs. Even watching movies or tv shows. These are all sources that will only dehydrate you further. You can only quench your thirst through God, the Bible, the Holy Spirit. Through Salvation. Turn to Jesus Not the bottle. Turn to the Bible not The bottle! --- This episode is sponsored by · Anchor: The easiest way to make a podcast. https://anchor.fm/app Support this podcast: https://anchor.fm/jerry-almodoval/support

Are you always right? Even if you are... is it okay to let others win sometimes....?

Psalm 139:[14] I will praise thee; for I “AM” FEARFULLY and WONDERFULLY MADE(A NEW CREATION): MARVELOUS are THY WORKS(IN MAKING ME A NEW CREATION); and “THAT” MY SOUL knoweth “RIGHT WELL”. SO WE CAN SEE FROM THIS VERSE AND OTHERS WE CAN FEEL THE INBRED AND EXPERIENTIAL JOY OF BEING MADE A NEW CREATION, FOR IT IS JUST LIKE WALKING INTO A NEW WORLD, THAT IS, A NEW SPIRITUAL WORLD, IN WHICH NOT ONLY DO WE SEE OURSELVES TOTALLY TRANSFORMED, BUT GOD'S CREATION COMES ALIVE TO US AS IF WE WERE WALKING WITH GOD IN THE GARDEN OF EDEN, AS ADAM DID, ENTHRALLED WITH HIS CREATION ALL AROUND US. IT IS BEYOND WORDS TO CAPTIVATE THE ESSENCE OF THIS LOVING EXPERIENCE. THE NEW CREATION IS, SUCH THAT, WE INNATELY, ARE NOW, AWARE WE HAVE SPIRITUAL EYES TO SEE; SPIRITUAL EARS TO HEAR; FOR WE HAVE BEEN FEARFULLY AND WONERDFULLY MADE AND WE KNOW IT. FORMER MR. MORALITY, WHO HAD HIS FAKE MESSIAH AS A PHARISEE, WAS SO CLUELESS TO WHO JESUS WAS, THAT HE WANTED THE REBEL ROUSER CRUCIFIED, BUT NOW AS A NEW CREATION HE WRITES THIS TO HIS BRETHREN IN CORINTH: 2COR. 5: [17] THEREFORE “IF” any MAN be “IN” Christ, he “IS” a NEW CREATURE: OLD THINGS are PASSED AWAY; “ BEHOLD, “ALL” things are “BECOME” new.

In this conversation I talk to Donald Braben about his venture research initiative, peer review, and enabling the 21st century equivalents of Max Planck. Donald has been a staunch advocate of reforming how we fund and evaluate research for decades. From 1980 to 1990 he ran BP’s venture research program, where he had a chance to put his ideas into practice. Considering the fact that the program cost two million pounds per year and enabled research that both led to at least one Nobel prize and a centi-million dollar company, I would say the program was a success. Despite that, it was shut down in 1990. Most of our conversation centers heavily around his book “Scientific Freedom” which I suspect you would enjoy if you’re listening to this podcast. Links Scientific Freedom Transcript audio_only [00:00:00]   This conversation. I talked to Donald breathing about his venture research initiative, peer review, and enabling the 21st century equivalent of max Planck. Donald has been a staunch advocate for forming how we fund and evaluate research for decades. From 1980 to 1990, he ran BP's venture research program. Where he had a chance to put his ideas into practice. [00:01:00] Considering the fact that the program costs about 2 million pounds per year and enabled research, that book led to at least one Nobel prize and to send a million dollar company. I would say the program was success, despite that it was shut down in 1990. Most of our conversations centers heavily around his book, scientific freedom, which just came out from straight press. And I suspect that you would enjoy if you're listening to this podcast. So here's my conversation with Donald Raven.     would you explain, in your own words, the concept   of a punk club and why it's really well, it's just my name for the, for the, outstanding scientists of the 20th century, you know, starting with max blank, who looked at thermodynamics, and it took him 20 years to reach his conclusions, that, that matter was, was quantized. You know, and that, and, he developed quantum mechanics, that was followed by Einstein and Rutherford and, and, and a [00:02:00] whole host of scientists. And I've called, in order to be, succinct Coley's they, these 500 or so scientists who dominated the 20th century, the plank club. So I don't have to keep saying Einstein rather for that second. I said, and it's, it's an easy shorthand. Right. And so, do you think that like, well, there's a raging debate about whether the existence of the plank club was due to sort of like the time and place and the, the things that could be discovered in physics in the first half of the 20th century versus. Sort of a more or more structural argument. Do you, where do you really come down on that? The existence of the plank club? [00:03:00] W well, like, yeah, so like, I guess, I guess it's, tied to sort of like this, but the question of like, like almost like, yeah. Are you asking, will there be a 20th century, 21st century playing club? Do you think, do you think it's possible? Like, it's sort of like now right now. No, it's not. because, peer review forbids it, in the early parts of the 20th century, then scientists did not have to deal with, did not necessarily have to deal with peer review. that is the opinions of the, of the expert of the few expert colleagues. they just got on, on, Edgar to university and had a university position, which was as difficult then as it is now to get. But once you got a university position in the first part up to about 1970, then you could do then providing your requirements were modest, Varney. You didn't [00:04:00] need, you know, huge amounts of money. Say. You could do anything you wanted and, you didn't have to worry about your, your peers opinions. I mean, you did in your department when people were saying, Oh, he's mad. You know, and he's looking at this, that, and the other, you could get on with it. You didn't have to take too much attention. We pay too much attention to what they were doing, but now in the 21st century, consensus dominates everything. And, it is a serious, serious problem. Yeah. So I, I seriously believe that keeps me what keeps me going is that it is possible for there to be a plane club in the 21st century. It is possible, but right now it won't take, it won't happen. I mean, re there's been reams written on peer review, absolute huge, literature. and the, but, but most of it seems to have been written by, by people who at least favor the status [00:05:00] quo. And so they conclude that peer review is great, except perhaps for multidisciplinary research, which ma, which might cause problems. This is the establishment view. And so they take steps to try to ease the progress of multidisciplinary research, but still using peer review. Now. Multidisciplinary research is essentially is, is absolutely essential to venture research. I mean, because what they are doing, what every venture researchers, the researcher is doing is to look at the universe. and the world we inhabit in a new way. So that's bound to create new, new disciplines, new thought processes. And so the, when the conventional P, when the funding agencies say, there's a problem with multidisciplinary research, they're saying that's a problem with venture reserves. Yeah. And so therefore we won't have a plank club until that problem is [00:06:00] solved. And I proposed the solution in the book. Of course. Yeah, exactly. And so I guess, so with the book, I actually think of it as it's just like a really well done, an eloquent, almost like policy proposal, like it's, it's like you could, I feel like you could actually take the book and like hand it to. A policymaker and say like do this, I guess you could, so, I guess to put it, but like clearly nobody's done that. Right? did you, do you ever do that? Like, did you actually like go to,  government agencies or even  billionaires? Like the, the amount of money that you're talking about is almost like shockingly small. what, what are, what are people's responses of like, why not do this? Patrick Collison as being the only billionaire who has responded, I've met about, I don't know, half a dozen billionaires. And, they all want to, they all want to do things [00:07:00] their way, you know, they all want to, which is fair, which is fair enough. They all want to, sees a university through their own eyes. They are not capable of saying opening their eyes and listening to what scientists really want to do and to get what scientists really want to do. You've got you. You just can't just ask them straight off. You've got to talk to them. For a long time before they will reveal what they want really want to do. And then only a few of them will be capable of being a potential member of the plank club of the 21st century state. But it's a wonderful process. It's exciting. And I don't know why. well, I, I think I do actually, why the conventional authorities do not do this. And I believe that for, the reason this is more or less as follows that, for 20, 30 years following the expansion of the universities in about, about 1970 for political reasons. [00:08:00] no, not at all for, for scientific reasons that, there was a huge expansion in the universities and, and, and a number of academics. I really really mean it's factors of three, two, three, four, or something like that, depending on the country. Really huge. And, so therefore the old system where freedom for everyone was more or less guaranteed, which is what I would advocate freedom for everyone as a right. So, what we have done now is to develop absolute selection, rules, absolute selection rules for selecting venture researchers. And, and, and that's taken, you know, that's taken some time to develop them, but they work well. And, and, and open up the world to a complete ways, new ways of looking at it. Yeah, look, I mean, the, the, the track record seems very like very good, right? Like you, you, you, you [00:09:00] enabled research that would not have happened otherwise and led to Nobel prizes. Right. Like, I don't, I don't see how it could, what evidence one could present that your method works more so than that. and so it's, so yeah. Well, well, over the years you see, the, the scientists to work in for, for the funding agencies. they have advised politicians on the ways to ration research without affecting it. And they have come up with the way, the method of peer review, which is now a dairy girl, you know? it's absolutely essential. Yeah. Every to every funding agency in the world, I've not come across one that does not use it well, apart from our own operation, of course we don't use it. but we, we find ways around it. And that's the conventional wisdom is that there are no ways around, [00:10:00] there are no way. peer review is regarded as the only way to ensure research excellence. People keep saying that it's the only way, but we have demonstrated with the BP venture to search you and this and that UCL, that there is another way. And, and I guess so is, is, is the response from, people that you would propose this to simply that , they, they don't believe that.  they don't believe that it can work because it doesn't, it isn't peer reviewed, , is that the main contention? Any, any ideas now must, must, must survive. Peer review and venture research of course would not. And so therefore what we're saying is therefore not admissible. And now a few people, in like the 50 or so of my, my, of my supporters, very senior supporters, re regard what we [00:11:00] are doing as essential, but their voice is still tiny compared with the, you know, the millions of, researchers and, and the, I I'm the funding agencies. Now the funding agencies kept on saying that they have advised politicians over the years, that the only way to ensure to ensure, that the, that the scientific enterprise is healthy is to, is to, is to a DIA to peer review. Now. They cannot. They cannot now say, ah, yes, Raven points out. There's a serious floor. They cannot do that. And so they say they do, they do not acknowledge that I exist or that the problem exists. This is so, so just because like they have, have doubled down so hard on peer review being the acid test for research quality. That they, they just like, they can't, they're like they're [00:12:00] lash to that, man. Okay. Okay. And, so I, I know at least in the NSF, I think actually shortly after your book came out originally, so in. 2008, 2009. I read about an initiative to try to do more. I think they, they termed it like transformational research and the NSF, that was the NSF, initiative. it was pioneered by Nina fedoroff. Nina fedoroff, who's a great, another great is one of my supporters. and, she was the, she was the, I think she was the chairman of the science board or something like that, which controls the NSF. And so she set up a special task force to look at. Mainly what I was trying to do. And so, she invited me to go to Washington on three occasions and we sat in this huge room at the national science [00:13:00] foundation headquarters. And we, we, we, we had three, two or three day meetings, venture research, and they concluded that it was the only way to go. And so that's what they recommended to the NSF. But what did the NSF do with decided that th that, that, that they would accept Nina Federoff's recommendations, but they should be administered by each of the divisions separately. Well, that's, that means they don't do anything that they wouldn't do normally. and so, I guess one, one thing, I'm not sure if you mentioned it in the book, what do you think about, like HHMI Janelia and. Like sort of the effort that they do, because it is much closer to your recommendations, how Hughes you mean? Yeah. Howard Hughes medical Institute. Yeah, exactly. and specifically like they're their Janelia campus where my understanding is [00:14:00] that they give people sort of, whole free funding for five years and really just sort of let them. Explore what they want to explore, but they have to, but they, I think they insist on them going to the central laboratories. Yeah. Yeah. That is a problem. How's that? Because, well, because, scientists all have roots and they all, I've ended up where they have, you know, wherever it is and that's where they prefer to work. And so therefore in venture research, that's why we allowed them to work in their old environment. Yeah. But now with total freedom and they'd radically transformed, you know, a little segment of the, of what it's done, but they transformed it and that they would've transformed even more. Had we been allowed in 1990, if BP had allowed venture research to continue. They were th th there [00:15:00] would be more than 14 major breakthroughs because, in 1990, when BP closed us down, then we, these people no longer could rely on venture research support the, the, the essential, feedback that we gave them, the meetings that we arranged, you know, of all venture researchers, which we had to work out how the hell to do that because, you know, w th the just scientists and engineers, scientists, and engineers all came together. Yeah. And, I don't know that's been done. but anyway, right. we were no longer allowed to provide that support. And so therefore they were on their own and exposed to the full rigors of peer review in applying to funds before they were ready for it. Yeah. The successful ones are venture research, you know, people they can suddenly, you know, it's, with his ionic liquids, then he, he, he, jumped over the line [00:16:00] of, of, of, into mainstream science and it became then part of the mainstream. Yeah, and same with similar Polica and all the other people who, who, who, who was successful. But, but th th there were, there were a few groups, you know, who were left high and dry and, and they had to manage, they had to, cut their class according to the funding. Yeah.  do you keep track of people who today would make good venture researchers? but, but don't like, like, do people still still send you letters and say like, I want to do this crazy thing. No, I'm afraid. I can't, I can't do that because I would be, raising their hopes, way beyond what Mabel to provide, UCL. We've done that and we've met one person. we supported one person, Nick lane, whose work has been prodigious digitally successful. Now he could not get support. He couldn't get support from anybody. [00:17:00] Before we, we felt a bit, before we backed in. And, so I persuaded the university to cover up 150,000 pounds over three years, which is trivial amount of money. Totally. Totally. And since that time, since then, he's, now he's more or less stepped over the line and he's now become mainstream. And he's, since that time as you're right. 5 million pounds, 5 million compared to the 150,000. So that's, that's profitable, you know, as far as the university is concerned, they're profitable, but even so even with UCL, it's still not caught on. Yeah. And, do you, do you, so when I, I guess I also have a question about like, what about the people who might make really be really good researchers, but , don't even make it through to the point where, they would even like be able to [00:18:00] raise venture, venture research money in that , There's also the fact that. in venture research, you were entirely supporting people except for, believe one case, you were supporting people who are already in academia, right?  they'd already sort of gone through all the hoops of getting a PhD and, getting some sort of, some sort of position. And so do you have a sense of  how many possibly amazing people get weeded out? even before that point? Oh, I mean, to be a venture researcher, you you've got to have a university position, I would guess. or, I mean, as with, was, with, with, with the only engineer we supported, he was working for a company and we enabled them to leave and I took great care to, to, to inquire of him. He w he would have to give up his job because, you know, industrial company couldn't support him if he was working for another company. And so I had to be sure that [00:19:00] he really was serious about this. And so we arranged that he, we arranged for a university appointment for the nearest university to where he lived, which was sorry. That's was just down the road, so to speak. And, but even that created problems, he was never really accepted by the university hierarchy. And w why do you think the university, association is, is important? as opposed to just someone just, you know, just doing research, right? Like what if they had, they built like a lab in their basement or. we're doing mostly theory. And so they just sort of, they've done that. You know, people, you know, like the guy, the guy at shop, I mean, if they, if they'd done that, then of course we listened to them, but they must be, they must be reasonably proficient in, in, in, in, in what I mean, they're, they're coming with a proposal to do something. Right. And to some that you've got to, [00:20:00] you've got to have done something else. You've got to, you've got to prepare the ground, so to speak. Yeah. So getting a university appointment today is no more difficult than it was say in 1970, you still had to get up. You still got to get, you know, go through a degree. PhD may be, and, and then, convince the university that you're worthy of, appointment. But then as I said before, You, you had automatic, you automatically qualified for this modest amount of funding, at least in Britain. you automatically qualify for that, but now you're quantifying for nothing. Once you pass the, you know, you're appointed by the university, you then start this game of trying to convince funding agencies to support you. And if you don't, you're dead. Yeah, you don't get, you don't get anywhere. You've got no Tanya. So you, you, you, you, you just disappear. It says it's an unforgivable system and it's extremely [00:21:00] inefficient. Yes. Do you think, I guess the question is like, is, is efficiency even the thing that's worth shooting for it. Like, it seems like it's, it's going always going to be inherently inefficient. Because of the uncertainty. like I guess I always worry when, when, like, when efficiency comes up as a metric around research, because then you sort of start having to calculate like, okay, like how much value is this? What is our like, return on investment? Like how efficient is that? And it's just, do you think that's the right way to think about it? Well, it's certainly not a bad way. but, but mines are closed, you know, I, I've been in touch with so many people over the years, you know, I've been at this now for 20 years since, since BP terminated my contract, so to speak and I've never, and I've always, and I've always tried every single minute [00:22:00] of that 20 years to find new ways of doing this. I mean, it's big, it does sound a bit, you know, that, that th th th th th th th the, the, what I do as a large element of the crank about it, but I'm so convinced of the value of this eventual research and its contribution to humanity, so to speak. I'm so convinced that it will make an enormous contribution that I keep on going. Yeah. No. I mean, I have no money. Yeah, no, I'm not paid to do this. And the first person that I've met of the many, very rich people I've come across has been factored colorism. Who, offered to publish my book and at a fraction of the price, why only were charging for it? Why do you charge $75 for a paperback he's charging less than $20 for a, for a hardback? Yeah. Well, I think he realizes that it's important for people to [00:23:00] actually read it. That's that's good. he, took part in, just before he met me, he took part in a, in a, in a, in a, in a blog or something like that. it's on, it has a YouTube thing. And, he said he was very impressed when he met me and I, I, I, I changed the way he looked. Yeah. I changed the way he looked at the world. You know, and, and he made this, joining an hour long speech to these fellow billionaires, but no, one's come forward. No one said, you know what you wanted. Yeah. Well, I hopefully like, I mean, hopefully between the book being out and, like. You know, I, I try to recommend it to everybody. I know. so, so hopefully like we'll, we'll start to, sort of get it more into people's heads. Do do you have any good stories about, people who applied and didn't make it right, [00:24:00] because I assume that, like, I always noticed that the sort of a line between like brilliant ideas and like completely crackpot ideas is very, very thin. so did you get any, like really, really ridiculous applications? It's not that thin. I don't think it is, there were lots of people who came to me and said, you know, similar dynamics is bunk. And, and one thing that they really hate is to be asked you say, okay, I agree that it is, what do you want to do now that completely floors them. So people was a crackpot idea are automatically. disqualified because they never return. They never say what they want to do, or if they do, you know, you cannot, you keep on re repeating the same question and they eventually gave up. Now venture was search the venture researcher. I may not say we, we, we, we may not say yes for the first meeting. It [00:25:00] might be five, six, seven, eight meetings with Dudley, Hirsch, Nobel laureates. It took more than a year. Because, you know, I met him very shortly after he got his Nobel prize and he came to a meeting that I took part in a meeting of the American physical society in New York. And, and I gave a talk and there, I noticed this guy in the front row scribbling away and he came to me after each day. He said that I think I've died and gone to heaven. This was Dudley Hurst back three days after winning the Nobel prize. And he had an idea which no one would listen to. And, well, we, we, we, backed him, but I can't think of an, of people who come with crazy ideas and gone on to be, you know, to, to, to fizzle out and die if you like. And, and, and so w I w I want to dig into that because that's, that's really, I feel like you're, you're saying something like very important. [00:26:00] and that, so to sort of repeat back to you, it sounds like the people who are not crackpots are able to like go to a level of precision about action that other than people who don't know what they're talking about are not able to do. Would that be accurate? Okay. That's exactly right. And, I'm, I'm asking like very much, because I, I'm trying to do similar things and like looking at, it, and like very much in the same position where it's not always in my exact field. and so it's, it's like, what is that? That you can. Do to sort of like tease out the, like the, the difference between a good, crazy idea and a crazy, crazy idea. Well, all venture research has courses outside my own field, all of it, because I'm, you know, that was a [00:27:00] long time ago when I was a practicing scientist. And so everything is outside my, my competence, so to speak, which is another reason why the mainstream venture is searchable. The mainstream, funding agencies tend to disregard what I say because it doesn't pass peer review. Of course. Yeah. So, we are accustomed to being uncomfortable with talking to people we are, but we try to engage them in conversation that reveals what they really want to do, what they, and try to assess, what they want to do compared with the state of knowledge in that field right now, you know, they want to transform it. and you don't have to be a fellow expert to understand that. I mean, I am an expert now, but in general, things like science, you know, or engineering that the broadest possible approach to these study subjects. And I can, I can tell on everyone else can tell who was involved with this process because when I came to BP, [00:28:00] they gave me two or three very, talented people, more or less people like yourself, you know, high flyers young in their early 2030s. And they joined me for two or three or four years. And, they were, they were mainly chemists. and so, yeah, chemistry, I think, I think, only there was only one physicist. This, I think that the BP provided me with, and it didn't matter because they were all fairly, talented people, very talented people, in fact, and you didn't have to say anything twice to them, you know? And, and they took it like a duck to water. Now we never had to discuss. But, you know, when we're sitting around our little table and people would, were coming with their ideas, we never had to discuss whether someone was what we called a venture researcher. It came to immediately obvious to anybody to have to everyone around the table, that he was someone who wanted to transform thought processes in that particular [00:29:00] field, they would do something important and that, and, and then once we made up our mind, then. Then, we backed them and then they could then do absolutely anything they wanted and, you know, nothing, you know, we're not bound by the proposal they wrote to us. Yeah. But that was mainly the agency, which, which caused it caused us to, to, to select them. And mostly, I mean, most people did of course, you know, but, some of them didn't. And do you feel like. So, so I'm, I'm really interested in sort of like the, the landscape of the like untapped potential in research. And so, venture research sort of goes after people who already have an idea and know what they want to do and need money and support to do it. And I wonder if there's sort of another [00:30:00] class of people who. Could do amazing things, and, and have the right skills and mindset to do it, but almost have like either not even thought of the things yet, or, or sort of have suppressed them in order to fit into the peer reviewed research box. and they could be unlocked by either like putting them in contact with, with other researchers or, Sort of like shifting their focus. Do, do you have a set, like a sense of like, whether those people actually exist or am I just making, making that up? Well, I'm not quite clear what you're saying. I mean, the people that, most venture researchers we came across, I mean, they knew precisely what they wanted to do well eventually, and they would eventually admitted to us. What they really wanted to do, you know? but there must be mutual trust. Trust has been lost entirely in funding. [00:31:00] Nobody, you know, funding agency doesn't trust the researchers, but I found that trust is absolutely essential in this, you know, that they must trust you and we must trust them because I've said once we back someone, they can go anywhere or anywhere in any direction they want. You know, you can only do that. If there's mutual trust. And if they come across problems as inevitably, they will, you know, things, you know, then they come to us and say, look, we've got this problem, you know, can you help us to solve it? And, you know, and we, we took up a problem with a university or something like that. And we w we helped them along. And this is why when venture research was closed down in 1990, this service was no longer available. And so the 14 people who made, who made major breakthroughs subsequently, and now that's a minimum. I think there are, it would be much greater if we'd have had the support, if I was able to provide this, the support right through, right through to today. Yeah. [00:32:00] And, and, and so. Can we dig into how you build trust with researchers. So you, you have a lot of conversations with them. and like, but can you, can you unpack that? Like, I, I want to we'll have the same problem in everyday life. You know, you meet someone and you talk to them, you know, not about research. You don't have to think about research, you know? do you trust somebody? how do, how, how do you, how do you reveal your trust? How do you express it? How do they express it? And, it has to come, you know, by, by a multi, by a multitude of routes, just like in everyday life, you have to make up your mind that you would trust somebody eventually, and we'll go along with most things that they say. So it is no more of them. It's no different from that. And, in fact I've found that, that the people who've been most receptive to what I've been saying have been nonscientists, you know, people like the [00:33:00] secretary I used to be, I wish to work in the cabinet office, the secretary of the cabinet Burke trend when I was there, he was, you know, he was instantly, so what we were trying to do, you know, and, I had an ally there. Yeah. And, and yeah. And I guess why, why wasn't he? So, so if there were people in the government who were excited about this, like what sort of stopped him from being able to push through? He was, he, he, that was before I CA I went to BP and before I'd worked out the ideas of venture research, but I, I talked to him and I realized I could trust him. You know, and, which is very unusual, you know, for a very senior person, to be able to do that. And, so we didn't discuss venture to search them because I hadn't, I hadn't taken up the cudgel so to speak when I, when I in, on the April, the eighth, 1980, I went to VP. Yeah. Got it and sort of [00:34:00] switching gears a little bit, something I loved and it's like, give me a completely different way of seeing the world in the book is, your. Sort of your take down of the idea of high risk research, biggest high risk. Well, there's not, I, venture search was the lowest possible risk you can imagine, because I was convinced that they would, that the venture researchers would do something of value. You wouldn't be able to predict what it was, but they would do something of value and only had to do with, to keep talking to them. Yeah. And, unfortunately we, we can't show the graph, but I, I just, the, the sort of concept of, like with cutting edge research, the fact that there's just uncertainty about what the like, underlying probability distributions even look like. Right? Like, and, and the fact that the researcher actually knows that distribution so much more than anybody else, [00:35:00] It's just a, a much, much better way of thinking about it. because I think that people really do think of like high risk research as sort of just like this like portfolio approach to, to the world. And it's like, okay, well, like what's our expected, and this actually goes back to the, the, the idea of expected value where, why it's, it's so hard to talk about it in those terms, because. we don't know the underlying distributions. Right? Well, have why should a funding agency support high risk research? When what they're really saying is that we expect you to fail. That's what high risk means we expect you to fail. So why, why should either we measure as the researchers or the funding agency do that? I mean our approach, which goes to the lowest possible risk and the highest possible gain, much more. It's much more accessible now. Not everyone of course can be a venture [00:36:00] researcher, but, I'm convinced that every serious minded researcher, at least once in a, in, in, in a scientific career will come across an idea that will transform his is a local, field. Yeah. he, he, he did not share it or he did not reveal it to the, to peer review because he hasn't yet proved it. Yeah. Peer review only works sort of ad hoc, you know, sort of, so, after the events, so to speak, when you've actually shown that it will work, then they can say whether it's good or not. Yeah. And I guess, I don't know if you've been paying attention to sort of like the, the meta discussion around scientific stagnation. but there's, there's sort of like the argument that we've picked, although the low-hanging fruit of, of the physical world, What do you w what, and like, I get the [00:37:00] impression that you don't agree with that. So I, I always looking for sort of good counter arguments. I don't agree with that because, we're looking for people who will, grow new types of fruit. Or if you take the continental view, you know, that, that our field is a bit like a country. And, when the, you know, people like Einstein discover that country, then it leads to, to, to a wave of new research, but eventually. Then the field becomes paid out and it gets more and more difficult to make it difficult to make a new discovery. What if somebody comes along and says, there's a new continent there and I want to, I want to create it. Yeah. And they can convince you that it exists. So, either the, you know, the low hanging fruit thing, which is, works very well for particular types of fruit. But what if you come up with a new idea for fruit and you come. And that actually sort of ties back to [00:38:00] the peer review argument, which is that, peer review is very bad at allowing, sort of like new fields and therefore new contents orchards to exist. We are, we all an endowed with a w w w with a creative spirit. You know, and, it's this fundamental creative spirit that we all have and scientists, you know, perhaps, to a, to a greater degree than others though. I'm not convinced of that. and, you cannot expect that their view of the world  completely individual view of the world. Just if I have consensus. Yeah, not immediately. You can't do it right away. I mean, no, the scientists, you know, major discoveries have not been greeted with a claim. Science, Einstein Einstein's discovery were called in the times newspaper. And one is when he wrote his famous paper on relativity and the front to come and sense. That's what the time [00:39:00] said. And so it was, it wasn't a front to common sense. Yeah. It should be fair. It's still, it's still sort of is right. Like you in like, you know, it was like the universe is curved and it's like that, that actually doesn't. Even jive with my comments, that I'll be honest. university's a very, very big place. Yes. It's very, a very weird place, right? Like when you start really looking at it. Yeah. And you know, the, the, the, the, the gravitational constant, which is, the Hubble constant. So, is, is, is one 80, sorry. Th well, there's some dispute about what it is, but it's a tiny amount per million years, you know, it's a tiny difference from what we see now, how the, it would be difficult to detect. Have you, have you said, you know, [00:40:00] you've gotta look for this and this is what people are doing. Yeah. Yeah. It's something, something that I wonder. And I'm not sure like how this sort of jives with, with venture research. But what I feel like it has also happened is, people have become so specialized in like theory or experimentation or, like engineering or development, that. And like part of where, these, these new fields come from is people, sort of interacting with people that they wouldn't normally interact with. and, and so did you, did you find yourself sort of beyond that, like they're, they're the, the sort of group meetings, of the venture research community, but did you, did you find yourself, Sort of like pushing people to interact in ways that they wouldn't have otherwise interacted with. No, we never push people that way. there, there were always [00:41:00] any new interaction that came from our meeting, from the meetings they were derived in exclusively from the scientists. I mean, we w we may make one or two suggestions about a group. Well, I did, we would do, we did. In fact, the, the ant people. we're working, in the field of distributed intelligence. Now I happen to know there was a unit at the university of Edinburgh that was doing this, that this very work distributed computing, and they weren't, there were one or two experts. So I went to them and said, do you have somebody who might be interested in joining the group? And they did a man called Tuft and he went down and he, and he did, and it was a very productive exchange. But that was very rare. I mean, that, that happened, but they, the user can the other way, got it. I don't know. Maybe, maybe, or the, you know, I forgotten, it's a long time ago, you know? but, I'm just always interested in, sort of improving my mental models of like, how, like, sort of [00:42:00] the, the question that everybody have of like, where do ideas come from, right. Like, and it's like, how important is sort of like cross cross-pollination, to sort of, to, to creating new areas. Actually I'm really interested in what the day-to-day of running VPs venture research was like. I kind of in my head, imagine you like just flying around the world, and sort of like meeting scientists and, and sort of, did you, have you ever watched the Avengers? I imagine you like Nick fury. Sort of like going around to different superheroes, and sort of say like, alright, like we're gonna, we're gonna form a team. yeah. W w what was that like? Well, I'll tell you, it was a, a very difficult problem because when I first arrived, I was, you know, a single person in a single room. and, so, the research director and, you know, the [00:43:00] guy who was responsible for BPS main research activities. And he spent about 2 billion pounds a year, you know, on, on he had, and he had 2000 people working for him and, he he's, he thought I was mainly harmless, you know, so, but as the, as the, as the decade wore on, then, it became obvious because I always try to involve, see in here. BP, directors in what we were doing. I always invited them to our conferences, for example. And even the chairman, you know, came down and other senior directors came down and they could see for themselves that what I was talking was not bullshit, you know, what really serious. And, and so the idea became. embedded in, in, in, in, in a few recess director's minds that the bang, the Braven was having a bigger bang for book Cadogan will the research director and it's 2 billion a year that he was [00:44:00] spending. And, and this fed back on, on, on to the research directors approach to me and the increasingly saw me as a threat rather than as an opportunity. And eventually. In 1990, he won and we were closed down. I got a phone call from New Zealand on, on March the eighth, 1990 from New Zealand, the man, the guy, the guy, or just the, the, research director, had just retired Bob  and he gave me all the freedom. I, what I wanted. And he retired in, in 1989, it was succeeded by Buzzle Butler and Buzzle Butler was, well, I won't say what I think of him. he, he phoned me for ISA from New Zealand and, and his first thought first was hello, Don venture search has closed down. The BP can no longer afford the drain on its resources, BP. I was spending then [00:45:00] five millions a year when, you know, managing directors didn't get out of bed unless it was at least a billion. Yeah. Yeah. It, it's funny how people can get very attached to like even comparatively small amounts of money. Well, people see, tend to see value in cost. You see? and so, if a university adopts venture to search, which I hope they will then, you know, they can't release, there's no glory in spending nothing a year. Even if you have an arrangement for looking for these people, you know, even a UCL, you know, it's been 150,000 in 10 years, but you know, that's about the right number. You know, we're talking like 500 people in a century over the whole world. So any single university is likely to have one or maybe two in a decade. And so, [00:46:00] but if the arrangements were set up so that people could come forward with their ideas to talk with senior people in the university, people who had given up their own research, like I have, and you take the carrier's pleasure and their discoveries. Then, if you can find some people such that such people than ever few universities were able to do this, then it would solve the problem. And so that's what we're working on right now. So as soon as I get my book, I'll be sending it to various, which is the due to come this week. I think, you know, my, the 50 copies that Stripe send me and I can send these out. I'm not very optimistic. I'm afraid. Okay. Okay. Well, I am, perhaps I, I realized I realized, foolishly, but my, my, my theory is that, If you're not optimistic, then you're sort of doomed to failure. Like, like the, the, the [00:47:00] non optimism makes like, it, it, reinforces itself, right? Like, so, so if you're pessimistic, then it will make itself come true. we sort of, yeah, so, so we, so we need to be optimistic and, and I guess like, with, with the universities today, Like, what did they, so like if, if the money were there, like if, if the money were coming in to, to researchers, universities don't have any problem with sort of people being there, doing work as long as, as the funding is coming from somewhere else with no strings attached. Right? Yep. Yeah. Okay. So let me, every university has, I mean, UCL, I mean, it has a budget of a billion pounds, you know, it's a big university, so we're asking for a tiny amount of money, you know, the, and even that is an over estimate, you know, because most years expenditure will be zero, [00:48:00] you know, and it's only, but to have that, to be able to call on occasionally. something like 150 200,000 pounds a year. So 200,000 pounds for three years, sorry. it would be no big commitment for them to enter into it, especially if you could re entertain the hope that in a few years, the, the scientists would, would make the transmit that the transition into the mainstream and then back external funding. And just what I've done. And so, so I know that a couple of universities do give, like new professors a year or two of funding. Well, that's right. I mean, people taking new jobs are in th th their, their maximum creativity then. And so universities, it's very good investment for them, but, but, but, but, an academic now has to look [00:49:00] forward to what will happen when this, when this funding ends. Right. You know, and will he be well-placed and he's got to engineer his, his position to be well-placed to, to attract funds. And so a year or two, not enough to do venture research. And so they just, you know, it, it works, but only to a very limited extent. Yeah. And the, and the, the incentive sort of cascade backwards. Right. Cause you're looking at, and you're like, okay, well, I'm going to need to get grants. And in order to get those grants, I'm going to need to have, do you have done peer reviewed research? So I better get started on that now so that it has to start thinking about that. Yeah, no, that, that makes a lot of sense. so I guess in including, What besides simply just like reading the book and thinking about, venture research. What, what is something that you think people should be thinking about [00:50:00] that they're not thinking about enough? Well, I, I don't think you can, so you can say it like that. I mean, if you're, if you're a venture researcher or a budding venture search, then you'll have an idea and you'll, always wants to be returning to it. So, I mean, the creation of venture research therefore is a happy coincidence. You know, that it's a meeting of, of, of similar minds, if you like. And I provided the opportunity to those, 40 people, that we backed over the 10 years to do their thing. but it was a partnership. It was a partnership between us and them. I was taking a risk, you know, with BP and, you know, having to solve the problems. I had to do all the other things you say, you know, like travel the world and give, to get, cause I didn't believe we could advertise. I didn't, I didn't think we could advertise, you know, in journals and say, you know, we wanted good ideas. I had to go to universities and give talks about venture to search while people were doing. [00:51:00] And the state of science now. Yeah. And then invite proposals and then sit and listen to what people came up with. And, at each university I might get in an afternoon, I may get 20 or 30 proposals. I mean, most of them just so you as a new source of money. You know, and that was always a problem we had, even with venture researchers was convincing them that even though we were the BP venture research unit, we were not interested in getting oil out of the ground. This could help the research director and I wouldn't trust us on what he was trying to do. So I had to find a way of, of, so our strategy was completely different. So the search directors. So we're not in direct competition, but he did see me as getting direct competition because they, the senior directors, you know, were saying the bang for buck that blaming God is higher than yours. I didn't say that they did. And actually, what, what was, what is the thinking behind, Not putting [00:52:00] out a sort of like a broad, call for, for applications, but instead, going and giving a talk and then, and talking to people because my, like my gut says that makes a lot of sense, but I'm not quite sure I can pick apart. Why. Well, venture searches, Nobel prize winners are a very special breed, you know, they do not respond to a, to opportunity. I mean, they create, they create their own opportunity and they are convinced of their particular view of the world will eventually be proved. Right. And hopefully. well, for the few we managed to help, we, we enable them to do that, but, other people just happened to have to cut their clamps according to the phones that are available and have to keep doing that. So I, I, I think that, people's view is, is, of the world is, is created within what the, within themselves, in this, within their thought processes, [00:53:00] their thought processes on their creative spirit, you know, this thing, which we, we all have, allows, them to do. I mean, people like, like Einstein, you know, w w when he, he looked at the, at the world without any feedback from anyone. You know, he didn't read the literature, he didn't cite any publication in this, you know, it didn't say anything. And his Anna's mirabilis is three papers and max playing catheter to decide whether or not he was the editor of the journal that he submitted his papers to. And he had to decide whether we should publish these or sub subject them to the usual references, but he didn't and he just published them. And th th they attracted a lot of criticism that said the times for it, it's always in the front of common sense, but there's other two work, you know, for the, for the conductivity and, Brownian motion. I mean, they were major pieces of work, but he did that [00:54:00] without talking to anybody. I mean, apart from, you know, mathematical advice and things like that, which had got from various people from time to time. Yeah. So, so to, to, to sort of pull that back to the strategy for teasing out, the, like the, the high quality applicants, the hypothesis would be that like, they, they don't even, they wouldn't even be reading the, like the journal where you'd be advertising that you want applications and you sort of have to like really go and, and get in their face. Yes, you have to let it be. You have to create the environment that allows them to write to you or to contact you, or to give you a phone call and say, I want to do this. You know? And, I remember I got a phone call once from, from a lunatic who said, I have a way of launching satellites, which has been much cheaper than, than anyone else has ever had. And I said, Oh, what do you want to do? He said, Oh, I want to build a building a hundred miles high. And, and then throw out of [00:55:00] the window, you know, there's, there's been, these objects and there were, there would be an arbiter immediately. And so they would, but I asked him about, you know, what do you think are the limits on, on growth, you know, on, on, on, on building, what would the foundations for a hundred mile high building? And there was just silence then, you know, cause he realized that the Earth's crust would not support. And what's the highest structure on the world Mount Everest high is that five miles. So Y you know, w how are you going to construct something which is a hundred miles high? So, I mean, that doesn't matter. It's just an anecdote of a, of a phone call I got, but that's what, that's what constituted, And initial approach to us. That's all we asked for, that the person would, was a ring or write a paragraph or whatever it was and saying, this is what I want to do. Yeah. And you would then take them there. Yeah. That's. [00:56:00] I like that a lot, because it's, it's very, it's almost the opposite of the approach that I've seen, that you you've seen, that there are like many other places. Like you look at how, like DARPA or bell labs does it, did it. and they it's like almost the opposite where they would only ever go and be like, you, like, we want you to come and like do some awesome stuff. And so it was it's like that, like push versus pull in, in getting people into the. The the organization is, is an interesting dynamic. well, I spoke, I spoke to somebody in the cabinet office recently about that, but, you know, he, he, he knew about it. He learned, he learned about the publication of the book and he said that the government was saying the British government were thinking of creating DARPA in Britain. And I didn't think it would be a very good idea. Because not for venture to search, it would be good for other things. but, DARPA 10, it's a bit like venture capital, you know, they know what they want to [00:57:00] do. And, when I was no venture to searcher would be able to point to specific benefits flowing from their work, right at the beginning, it would not be able to do that. And so therefore they would be disqualified from applying. Yeah, I think it's actually, a really important distinction that you just made because that like what, when people say like, like research is broken, my, my hypothesis is that there is actually that they're describing at least two completely distinct problems where there's the one problem of sort of, like making more. Technology. And then there's the other problem of like discovering more new areas of knowledge. And, and venture research is very much targeted at the latter. and w distinctly from the former new fruits and new continents, you know, that's what we're concentrating on. You know, [00:58:00] the people, you know, completely new consonants, completely new fruits. So there'll be low hanging fruit will come from that, from that fruit. And, yeah, that's what we're trying to do. I think one of the biggest takeaways from this conversation for me, that I just want to double click on is. Donald's assertion that the line between genius and crack pot is not as thin as I. Used to believe. And that it may be possible to tell the difference. Bye. Really. Paying attention to how precise someone's ideas. Uh, I'm still sort of processing that, but it's. An important thing for us to think about [00:59:00]

One way or another, tomorrow is the end of everything, right? Right? Well… that’s what we’ve told to expect. The reality is, of usual, much different. will things change? Yes. Will the entire existence of human civilization come crashing to a halt? Not only no…

Shawnna Sumaoang: Hi, and welcome to the Sales Enablement PRO podcast. I am Shawnna Sumaoang. Sales enablement is a constantly evolving space and we’re here to help professionals stay up to date on the latest trends and best practices so that they can be more effective in their jobs. Today, I’m excited to have April Terry from Planview join us. April, I would love for you to introduce yourself, your role, and your organization to our audience. April Terry: Hi. Hello everyone. Thank you so much for having me here today. I’m really excited to talk about my learnings at Planview. I am currently in Music City, USA, Nashville, Tennessee, and am the learning and development manager at Planview. Planview is the leading portfolio and resource management company and we help companies deliver on their strategies through empowering their teams, no matter how they work. So, like I said before, I’m running learning and development and really focusing on revenue enablement and supporting our revenue enablement functions. So that’s our sales, our reps, SDRs, AEs, solutions, consultants, customer success managers, as well as strategic account managers, and that’s a global team. I’ve been doing that for three years, doing a lot of work with onboarding and developing programs and really was at the start of the learning and development function at Planview. So, a little bit about me in work. Personally, I love travel and music. I’ve got a yearly bucket list. This year is 20 new experiences in 2020, and experiencing a pandemic is definitely a big one. The other years were 18 concerts in 2018 and 19 cities in 2019. So, if you love travel and music, please reach out and hit me up. I also love volunteering with school children, and I coached track, as well. So that’s a little bit about me. SS: April, I’m so excited to have you. And that sounds like a very clever way to execute every year, and the pandemic was new for most of us. We’re really excited to have you. So, you talked a little bit about your work in revenue enablement, and you also have a very unique experience as a schoolteacher. So, how do you apply some of the skills from classroom teaching to your learning and development work at Planview? AT: Yeah, well, you know, there are a ton of things that you can take from the classroom, especially around engagement, and assessment, repetitions, and probably a lot of patience too, I think. But the biggest takeaway, and I think skill that I’ve gotten from the classroom in this role is lesson planning. And that’s beginning with the end in mind. So, when we did a lesson plan or taught on how to do a lesson plan the very first thing that we had to do was fill out what the standard, the skill, competency that we were teaching was, as well as the assessment. How would we be able to truly see or hear that the student has understood and grasp this concept? They’ve mastered the skill. So, beginning with the end in mind and being able to a lesson around that I think is a huge skill. What I see in my role sometimes and in businesses, we get so caught up with just the transfer of information and just the fact that it’s brand new, and everybody has to know it, that sometimes we neglect or forget the objective and the goal that we’re trying to reach. At the end of the day, I don’t really care, we don’t really care as much about what somebody knows, what’s just stuck in their head. We care about what they can do with that information, right. The things that we can see and hear. As a track coach, if you came to me and said, “Hey, April, teach me shot.” I would say, “Okay, what’s your goal?” Because if you said, “I want you to teach me the shot put, because I want to understand what’s going on at my cousin’s track meet and support them,” is so much different than, “Hey, I want to be an Olympian, so teach me” or, “Hey, I want to be an official.” Depending on what your goal is, we’re going to have a different lesson or I’m going to have a different approach so I can get you to your end goal. So, in enablement, I think it’s important for us to remember that if we’ve got a new product launch, it’s very easy for us to just dive right into here’s the feature and the value and the pricing and the upcoming marketing campaigns and just sharing a lot of information. We really have to take a step back and think about the goal first, at the end of this presentation or when this information is distributed, what should a rep be able to do? What should that audience be able to do? Are we doing this just for awareness? Do they need to be able to pick up the phone tomorrow and articulate this value? Do they need to be able to demo something? Right? Well, we’ve got a clear understanding of where we’re headed and the goal, we can adjust our presentations and as a teacher, we would adjust the lesson to ensure that everything was adding up to provide plenty of practice and reinforcement to get us to our end goal. So, lesson planning and beginning with the end in mind is certainly the biggest takeaway that I’ve had from the classroom into this enablement role. SS: Fantastic. In your experience, how does adult learning differ from learning aimed at children? What are some of the strategies that you use to kind of help engage an audience of adult learners in your program? AT: So, one of my favorite books is Design for How People Learn. And in that book, there’s a great model for how our brains work and that our brains are shelves. So, I’ll use that model. With children, children are empty shelves, they are sponges, they are empty bookshelves just waiting to be filled. And for the most part, they look to a teacher or a parent and they immediately trust what’s coming out of their mouth. They don’t have as much maybe to contradict, right? They’re empty bookshelves, they’re just open vessels waiting to learn everything about the world. In contrast, adults are filled bookshelves. When you present information to an adult, they’re kind of choosing what to take in because they have so many books and information on their shelves already. So, I think that the biggest difference here is that children again are open and they’re ready for all of this new information and they’re empty vessels. Whereas adults, we already have a lot of information and sometimes we’re like packed to the brim with social media and everything else, it’s just so much going on that we’re not empty vessels. And the approaches that you have to take with an adult versus with a child is it’s very important that you understand maybe some pre-knowledge or you understand where an adult is coming from, what existing knowledge do they have and how is the new information that I’m going to share, maybe connect with that existing knowledge? Again, we’ve got a lot of books on our bookshelves, so if we’re able to tie this new piece of information is going to fit perfectly on that bookshelf, we’re able to get people to retain and be open for that information. Whereas with children, we could put a lot of things on their bookshelves, they’ve got plenty of room and they don’t have anything maybe to combat new information. I also think that you have to put your pride aside in that just because maybe you have authority. Sometimes we think somebody is just going to immediately listen and take in what we’ve got to say, that happens a lot with children and in the classroom. But with adults, in your brain, literally the synapses in your brain don’t care as much about authority as they care about connecting info, right? What is this new piece of information? How does that relate to the things that I already know? So, I think that if you are being engaged, not taking yourself too seriously, poking fun at yourself. I think that’s actually some similarities in between children and adults, but I think the biggest thing is that pre-knowledge and this idea of open, empty vessels versus kind of filled bookshelves. Adults, we’ve got a lot already in our heads, and so, it’s almost as if you have to, I don’t want to say, sell this new information or get buy-in but this is worth your time to take in this new information, that’s what I would say is the biggest difference. SS: I love that. And I love that book. We actually interviewed Julie for our book club podcast. She’s fantastic. AT: Oh Great. Yeah, she is. SS: I think along with a lot of the challenges that come with trying to help adult learners, retention always comes up as one of the biggest challenges. So how do you help encourage retention of the skills and knowledge that’s taught in your learning programs? AT: Yeah. So, we all know that retention is very, very important but the reinforcement of that is key, right? And I think not only the reinforcement just through a multiple-choice quiz but having it in a real-world scenario is very important. So, one thing that we’re doing currently with our customer success team is we’re doing group live trainings at the beginning of the week. And then in the team meetings, throughout the week, there are small quizzes and concepts that the teams are individually going through. And those quizzes are yes, quizzes, but they are real-world scenarios. We’re taking situations that they have been or things that they’re going to be presented with in the future and weaving some of those new concepts in. So, I’m very much a big proponent and always asking, “what does this look like in real life?” And when you’re talking about reinforcing and making sure that we’re not forgetting and following that forgetting curve, being able to apply and giving people an opportunity to apply this new information in a real-world scenario helps with the retention of that information. SS: Absolutely. Now, obviously, everyone doesn’t come into a learning program at the same level. They come from different backgrounds or knowledge or have certain skills from their past. So, how do you account for the different needs learners might have in the design of your program to kind of help with those different skill, knowledge, or experience gaps? AT: Yeah, absolutely. I think a big thing is giving folks an out when they need it. If we’ve already established that they’ve got mastery over something, we don’t want them to spend a ton of their time doing things that they already know. So, you know, one example in one of the courses that we built was exactly an opt-out opportunity where we provided, I talked about those real-world scenarios before ,we provided a real-world scenario, a few real-world scenarios, and they were able to test out of that section. And if you missed some of those key concepts within that scenario or questions, then it was an open, “Okay. You probably should go back in and really look into this,” and, you know, watch the rest of the video or whatever. So, I think giving people the opportunity to opt-out of things, that they’ve already mastered really helps with engagement within a course. SS: Absolutely now I want to pivot ever so slightly because, you know, as we started off in the podcast, we are in a radically different world this year and a lot of things have had to go remote or virtual if you will. So, what are some considerations that sales enablement practitioners need to keep in mind when having to now conduct this learning and this training all virtually. AT: You know, I think the biggest thing is engagement and excitement, and that probably is coming from you, or whoever is presenting. So, I think there is so much value in just being excited about what you’re presenting. We’re all, like you said, kind of zoomed out, fatigued and this, that, and the other. But really being excited about what it is that we’re presenting and bringing that enthusiasm and passion into everything that we’re explaining, I think is a small thing that goes a very long way. So that’s one huge thing, and it’s an easy thing to implement, right? Just being excited about what you’re presenting and getting our subject matter experts, or our presenters excited about what they’re talking about and providing that energy. The second thing I think is to give people breaks. You know, sometimes we’re very quick to fill the silence, and not pause and let people process information or take time to come up with questions. We have just a few minutes or moments of silence and we want to fill it, but I think being able to step back again and just give people a break to process information, is also something to keep in mind with conducting training virtually. And I mean in-person as well, but, certainly virtually too. SS: I think those are two fantastic tips, April. I really enjoyed this conversation. I always tend to close on this because I think at the end of the day, we all want to know what good looks like. So, I’d love to understand from you in closing, how do you measure the impact of your learning and development programs? AT: Right. So, you know, also beginning with the end in mind, and we are doing these programs because we’re looking for changes in behavior typically, and what it is that we’re solving for. And I like to think about Kirkpatrick’s training model in Training Evaluation. So, in that model he talks about first, reaction. Second, learning. Third, behavior. And fourth, result. So, number one, measuring the reaction, did people find this training enjoyable or relevant? If people aren’t finding your training enjoyable or relevant, you can kind of through retention out of the window, right. When was the last time that you walked away from a monotone speaker and thought like, “Whoa, that was riveting. I’ll remember all of that.” That engagement piece is very key. And so, we’ve got to assess, and keep that as a metric. How did people react to it? Did they find it enjoyable? But we also know that we can’t stop there. Right? We, we can’t just stop at, did they like it or not? We want to know if it was effective. So, the next thing, learning and understanding may be how confident these folks are in their understanding of the information and did they acquire the information? So, a great way to assess this would be through self-assessments. That’s another schoolteacher trick that I picked up is doing pre and post-assessments. And these are really easy to do in your program. So at the beginning, maybe of a presentation doing a one to four scale, I don’t like using fives because you’ll get neutrals, but saying on a scale of one to four, if you had to teach this to a new rep, how confident would you be? On a scale of one to four, how confident would you be before this presentation? And then after, asking that same question and hopefully you’re seeing some trends, right? That you came into it at one level, but now we’re leaving more confident. That kind of brings us into the next level of behavior. So, while number one, it’s good that people are enjoying it. Number two, it’s good that people are feeling more confident. We can’t just rely on self-assessment because we’ve all heard people that they can sing, but really should leave it to the professionals. So, sometimes we’ve got good self-assessments, but behavior is really what we’re looking at. And in level three, the behavior is asking, so how can our reps apply what they’ve learned on the jobs? Right? So, I mentioned the situational questions at play. That’s a great way to see, are you able to take this new concept and apply it to a different situation or maybe recording a pitch to the customer and going back and listening to it, right? This is what things, and what changes can we see are here within the behavior. And then finally, we’re doing all of this work and changing our behaviors because we want to see a different result. So, within this final level and the result stages, we are really tying the impact of changes to behavior to metrics in the business. We talked about beginning with the end in mind, right? That’s the whole reason why we’re doing a lot of these programs. So, now that we understand that people are finding it enjoyable, right? They’re engaged, they feel maybe more confident about the lesson or the subject now, before they came in, and went through the program. We’re seeing changes in behavior. Now we’re asking, what does that look like in the context of our business? So, if we did a training on how to write eye-catching, email subject lines, and our reps are changing their subject lines. Now we go into the data and we look at our open and close rates, right. Those are the numbers and the data and the results that we are looking for. And I think it’s important with behaviors and looking at that we’re looking for patterns and correlation. So not every increase and decrease are maybe a direct result of your training, but we can certainly see patterns within them, and we can look back at the data and if our numbers or whatnot aren’t looking where we want them, we can dive into that, and really pull out some different nuggets or areas that we should focus on and start this whole process again, building a training program that number one gets good reactions, number two helps people feel more confident, number three, leads to a change in behavior, and then number four leads to new results when we’re looking at our data and the metrics. SS: That was fantastic, April. I have greatly appreciated this conversation. Thank you so much for joining us today. AT: Yes. Thank you so much for having me and I am a big fan of Sales Enablement PRO and all of the work that you do. SS: Well, thank you so much. To our audience, thanks for listening. For more insights, tips, and expertise from sales enablement leaders visit salesenablement.pro. If there’s something you’d like to share or a topic you’d like to learn more about, please let us know. We’d love to hear from you.

Everyone hates it when the dentist tells you to floss. It’s like that thing that you know you need to do - that will prevent most of the issues with your teeth and gums yet you don’t do it. And you certainly don’t meet many people who say they LOVE flossing. Right? Well, Chrystle and Catherine are changing that and the way we think about flossing. Founded by a dentist and her self confessed lazy flosser sister, Cocofloss is on a mission to make flossing a fun and rewarding part of everyone’s self-care routine. They set out to make it a ritual to love instead of something that was a total pain in the butt. By tapping into human behaviour and taking note from brands who create stunning packaging and products that women actually want to highlight on their bathroom shelfie, Cocofloss set out to create a beautifully packaged piece that you’d be proud to display at the front and centre of your bathroom cabinet to keep it front of mind. They also took other pain points like how it felt between your teeth, the colour of floss, the smell of the floss and even what its made from to flip the current experience upside down and make this something a ritual you actually enjoy doing every single day. This episode got me wanting to floss immediately and I hope it does the same for you!LINKS WE MENTION Cocofloss Website Cocofloss' InstagramFemale Startup Club's InstagramBook: The Dental Diet by Dr. Steven LinPromotion: 15% off your first purchase with COCOBOSS through 12/31In partnership with Klaviyo, the best email marketing tool for ecommerce businesses.

Are you a control freak? Of course not! Right? Well, maybe at times. Here's a short message on letting go.

Let’s say you’re a wellness coach… so you talk about wellness. Right? Well, not exactly. Finding your talk topic is one of those things that SOUNDS easy, but if you don’t have it clear enough in your head BEFORE you start writing - you can spend days - weeks - even MONTHS wandering around in the land of ... ‘what am I even doing?!”…   When you know you want to create a signature talk - The next step is knowing your talk topic. Which is not as easy as it sounds. So - on the show today I’m sharing with you three things that are getting in the way of you getting clear on your talk topic! - and what might help - including joining my 5-Day Jump-Start Your Talk Challenge over in the Move Your Audience Facebook Group! You can sign up at bemoved.com/challenge - and by the end of Friday, you’ll be able to clearly state your talk topic!

Episode 049--Jesus Versus Strongholds We all know when it comes to a battle of Jesus versus our own personal strongholds, Jesus is going to win. Right? Well, it’s only right if we are putting our trust in Jesus instead of the stronghold we are hiding behind.  From the beginning of time, when God created Adam and Eve, we were meant to be co-creators with Him. We had a high calling. Then Adam and Eve listened to evil rather than to God and they fell taking all of us with them. They believed the evil one’s lie. This opened the door to the formation of strongholds which are actually just lies we believe that have taken root in us.  Lies come from mindsets. Mindsets affect us emotionally. Dr. Caroline Leaf says there are two categories of emotions — Faith and Fear. Faith is all the good emotions — love, joy, peace, patience, goodness, kindness, faithfulness, gentleness, self-control, grace, mercy, hope. Fear is all the negative emotions — anger, anxiety, worry, frustration, overwhelm, jealousy, bitterness, pride, manipulation. These hold us back from the good emotions which holds us back from fulfilling our destiny. These negative emotions are like chains that bind us and tie us up, so we are ineffective. These turn into lies we believe such as even Jesus can’t help us. This then becomes a stronghold we hide behind. Then we use sugar and other substances or distractions to anesthetize our pain and try not to think about how Jesus can’t help us because we too far gone.  This becomes a stronghold that keeps us captive unable to do what we were designed to do and put here on earth to do.  To get rid of a stronghold, you must take a stand against it. We are His hands and feet here on this earth, but we are allowing something as ridiculous as oatmeal cake, sugar cookies, brownies and whatever else strikes our fancy to overcome us. We are not trusting in God. We are trusting in something else. That has become like a stronghold. It is a mindset that says I have to have this food or this substance to live. That means you are trusting in what you believe is a stronghold instead of trusting in God.  So how do you put God back on the throne of your life? Submit completely to Him. Become honest and transparent before Him. Let Him into the secret places you think you’ve hidden from everyone including Him. Hand that secret stash of food to Him. Admit that you have made your stomach your god.  Own your issue. I am a sugar addict. I am a binger. I am an overeater. Act against your addiction. Throw out the sugar. Turn away from the treats at work. Take a stand and know you are living for more than sugar and flour. You have a king named Jesus and He is a jealous God. We must take a stand against the stronghold we have set up in our lives. Satan would want nothing better to whisper in your ear that you are defeated.  But I’m telling you that you are only defeated if you want to be. One destiny God has for all of us is Freedom. It is for freedom Christ has set us free, don’t be entangled again in the yoke of bondage as Galatians 5:1 tells us. Only Free people can move. Those who are bound must stay right where they are. Take a step towards freedom today. Allow God to work in your life to break the strongholds you have allowed to be set up in you. Overcomers Link: https://TeresaShieldsParker.com/overcomers-christian-weight-loss-academy/

We don’t always want to face our challenging thoughts and feelings.  It’s much easier to ignore them? Right? Well it’s worked until now. Or has it? In this week's episode we’ll explore: Where do challenging thoughts and feelings go when we ignore them? Does bringing awareness to our problems cause them to get worse?  What actually happens when we ignore our problems? What alternative ways can we deal with them - that may be more effective? Download my free “Tune In Journal” and accompanying guided meditation here.  For more information about my 1:1 coaching and group programs, check out renareiser.com.

Fuzzy logic is an approach to computing based on "degrees of truth" rather than the usual "true or false" (1 or 0) Boolean logic on which the modern computer is based.  It is a form of many-valued logic in which the truth values of variables may be any real number between 0 and 1 both inclusive.   Govind's Social:  Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/gov218/ LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/govindmohan218/?originalSubdomain=ca   Deep's Social:  Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/neuronsrcool/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/Deepneuron LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/deepprasad/   Pouya's Social: Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/pouyalj/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/pouyalj LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/pouyalajevardi/   Episode Transcript:----more----   SUMMARY KEYWORDS reality, true, logic, people, thinking, idea, language, point, universe, objective reality, humans, thought, fuzzy, experiment, paradox, nature, question, probability, false, thoughts SPEAKERS Pouya LJ, Govind, Deep   Pouya LJ  00:16 Hey guys, how's it going?   Govind  00:19 Nice, amazing. Toronto. Good weather.   00:23 Yeah, no, it's surprisingly hot. Yeah.   Pouya LJ  00:29 So it's been a while, since we talked. Let's see each of you. What's up with you. Let's start with you guff?   Govind  00:39 Well, for those that don't know, I have a startup called Virtual systems that focuses on network security using information theory, principles, and networking, to have a flat internet that's not built on data centers where data privacy can be controlled by the user, as opposed to any corporate corporation that is controlling your data, which is the case these days. So that's a little bit of my background. I like a lot of things like mathematics, philosophy, computer science, and software development.   Pouya LJ  01:11 Well, that's for philosophy. All right, I bet you the What's up? What's up with you?   Deep  01:18 Um, yes. First of all, I just want to say that just sounds like the life of a polymath, so I can really appreciate that right on COVID. Yeah, so I similar to COVID. I also run my own startup, we do quantum computing. Instead, we are looking to use quantum computers to accelerate the materials discovery timeline. Right. So right now we do a lot of things that are mostly trial and error based plus some compute, for doing materials discovery, let's say you want to discover a new cathode or new electrode material, right? How are you going to do that? We want to automate that process and and speed it up by thousands if not millions. That's our goal. It's pretty ambitious, but that's what we do you everyday, or try to do. Uh huh. Yeah. So that's what I've been up to.   Pouya LJ  02:11 Yeah. Thanks. That's amazing. Are you in Toronto?   Deep  02:14 Yes. Good.   Pouya LJ  02:15 Good. You're enjoying this weather?   Deep  02:17 Totally. Yeah. So nice. weather wise will enjoy it. Well, us.   Pouya LJ  02:21 Yeah. Well, that's true. That's going on soon. Probably next week. Still not that bad? Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. Okay. Anyways, so today, we are tackling a subject that I am very inept in? I have no idea. I mean, I know abstractly what it is, but I don't have any readings on it. I think you guys are more educated on this than me. But let's see how it goes. So we're talking about a bunch of different stuff. Actually, it's not one thing, but it's centered at logic propositions. And quantifiers. Do you want it? So this was the pathway was introduced to this conversation was introduced by golf? Do you want to start it off yourself?   Govind  03:06 Sure. Um, so when we think about logic, what comes to mind? Generally, it's things like, debate, you know, things that logic is associated with, or things like debate, and truth and false, maybe people who are in software development or would think of code. You know, there there are so many of these, these these concepts that come to your mind when you think of the word logic. You know, what, maybe maybe you guys can chime in with like, premium fallacy. When I say the word logic, one of the one of the things you think about,   Pouya LJ  03:35 no, I think I mean, I guess it depends on their perspective, as you were saying, but I think what you're saying it makes sense. I think, generally, people think about logic as reasoning, like step by step thinking. Thinking about, like, it depends, if you're asking a philosopher is a little bit different than a mathematician than a software, regular person going about their lives, not thinking about these things. But I think that just remains for most people.   Govind  04:05 Sure, what am I?   Deep  04:07 Yeah, when I think of logic, I think of two things, the more intuitive idea of logic, which is what I think every human has, right? We like to all believe that we're logical beings, right? What does that mean? We all know that mean something when I say it, but what does so I think, the intuitive idea that humans are logical insofar as they have a set of consistent rules that you can codify that have some sort of basis, right, you can derive next set of actions based on a set of let's say, axiom true principles, right. And they're logical in nature. For example, humans get hungry where you're cutting off I don't is that does that me or?   Govind  04:46 Oh, I can I can hear him fine. I think   Pouya LJ  04:48 that's me.   Deep  04:50 Do you want me to restart for you?   Pouya LJ  04:53 Okay, now that's better. Sorry. Okay. Sure. That's fine. Continue. Sorry.   Deep  04:56 Sure. So I was just saying that like from from the preset preset Something that's logical, or I would consider as logical is the idea of hunger, right? Like when a human is hungry? What would be logical next is that they're going to try to get food. Right? To me that's logical. And that and so that's an intuitive logic or system of systems are sets of logics that we just know from by nature. Then I think of the logic, when when when Govan asked me, What do I think when you know about logic, right? Like what comes to mind? Or how would I define it and whatnot. The second one is the formal, abstract idea of logic that we humans have that I think that maybe other creatures don't have. And and that's the mathematical ability or the mathematical perspective of logic, where you can look at, you can create systems like Boolean logic, you can generalize Boolean logic and look at how you can construct quantum computations in Universal computations. And propositional logic is totally different than what I just talked about. And so that's all these things are abstract logics, and it's different than the intuitive logic, sometimes.   Govind  06:07 Yeah, yeah. No, that's, that's a great way of like, you know, describing the entire breadth of what logic? Thanks. Well, I think it comes down to the concept of truth and false, right, because you have to start with things you know, are true. And then you string these things that are true in certain ways that allows you to create certain implications, right? You, you, you start with a few facts, like, as a classic one, all men are mortal. Socrates is a man. Therefore, Socrates is mortal, right? You know, you have these propositions you have you start with these facts, and then you put them together using some inference rules. But what I wanted to discuss in today's topic, as today's topic is this concept of truth and false itself. We really, as humans, we take truth and false kind of for granted as a discrete binary thing, right? You have something that's true, and it's not true, it's false. But is that really the case? And to further grounded discussion, I have a few quotes from this book. It's called fuzzy thinking. And it has it really explores this concept of how truth can be continuous or fuzzy, right? It's it's not it's not truth. It's like an on off switch. But it's actually like, on and goes all the way to off with like, several, maybe infinite steps in the way. So one quote I really like is, there was a mistake, and everyone in science seemed to make it. They said that all things were true or false. They were not always sure which things were true and which were false. But they were sure that all things were either true or false. So I thought that that is a really cool quote, because it points out this fact that this is really taken for granted, we don't really think about, you know, like, What is it? What does it mean for something to be true or false. And another quote, I think, would be interesting not to make this all the quotes I made this last one is a quote from Albert Einstein. So far as the laws of mathematics refer to reality, they're not certain. And so far as they are certain, they do not refer to reality. Because, I mean, if you say something is true or false, the universe does not give a shit, you know, universe is going to do whatever it's doing. And we're just we're just creating these models where we say, Okay, these things are true, these things are false. And, and we're going to construct our models of reality based on it. But these models of reality are pretty much mental experiments that we perform across humans right? Now, it just so happens that it happens to be incredibly good at modeling reality, to the point where people can get confused and say that reality works based on the principles that we create, and the facts that we create, the things that we assign as true or false is what is allowing reality to work the way it is. But it's it's always important to know that there's this detachment between what's reality and what's what's, you know, our our collective, our thought experiment, which is, you can call it mathematics, philosophy, whatever any anything that we have, when we come together, we have discussions, even discussions like what we're having right now. They're, they're just, like, there's a separation from this and reality. And this is kind of exemplified by what's known as the law of the excluded middle in, in logic. So where if you have a proposition a, let's say, let's just call it P let's let's work in the realm of the abstracts, if you have a proposition p p could be something like, this is a fruit or a gob is a person, you know, things like that things, something that I can assign a truth value to true or false. So the law of the excluded middle is that for all propositions P, P, or not B, that is something can either be true or not true. Now, this this sounds like stupid, simple, right? It sounds kind of like okay, sure, something can either be true or false. But now, what's crazy is that several mathematicians in over the 20th century, were actually pushing back against including this principle and logic, they were saying, No, I want to construct a mathematics which doesn't have p or not p that is, p or not P is actually not true. According to these people. They were called the intuitionists. And this cause Like a massive, massive debate back in the 20th century. But I'll pause here and I'll get some comments from you guys like what do you think such a mathematics could actually look like?   10:11 So   Deep  10:12 the first thing that comes to mind is the idea of structural realism. Structural realism basically posits that whatever scientific and mathematical understanding that we get of the universe, it does not necessarily reflect on the true structure and nature of the universe, right? So, if you have a quote, of creations that describe gravity at the macroscopic scale, that does not mean that those equations are the true structure and nature of reality. And that's important because when we're, as you sort of alluded to Govan, like when we define something to be true or false, nature doesn't give a shit. Right, so to speak. And that's like, like, interesting enough, there's a philosophical question right there. Because what if it happens that structural realism is false. And ironically, there is some sort of mathematical truism, at least in the physics perspective, that we can define, and that it is actually a true reflection of reality. It is objectively the truth. Right? Like, we may not, it may actually be possible, who knows? So there and because we haven't actually answered that, you know, what I mean, that that philosophical idea yet, whether structural realism, is true or not, is very hard to it. Yeah, extend or resolve the conflicts that have occurred in the 20th century from logic? Because this is just an extension of that. What do you think?   Govind  11:50 Um, well, I think this this, this time in history was very interesting, you know, because, well, maybe, like, some historical context would be that, you know, this is the first time you have like, several extremely smart people from across the world coming together and creating a global, you know, like, hey, let's tackle the biggest questions in, in humanity, like any point in your thinking, right? So like, and I think this kind of resulted in probability, right? probability is something that emerged from the 20th century, I mean, some could argue the roots extend way back, but you know, like the roots for everything, then way back. But the reason I bring up probability in this in this argument is like, as, as humans now in the 21st century, we, our process of science is so fundamentally grounded in probability, right? Like, to the point where our models of reality are the closest models of reality, we have use probability necessarily, right? Think of all the discussions you've had with your friends regarding COVID, or all these other things. Most people tend to make arguments related to probability and case fatality rates, you know, these kind of like, almost baseball statistics, right? Like I say, baseball statistics, just to kind of ground that and make it more like, you know, you see where I'm going with this, right? It's just that probability has created this kind of way that of making seen things our model seems so real, that you can actually see them and you can actually see their measure their impact on them. Right, this in fact, in mathematics, this the, let's call it the backbone of probability is called measure theory. Right. And I think this kind of lends itself to, well, some of the stuff you're working on, right, the quantum models of reality. So I think I think structural realism is something that is extremely effective, because it's, it's, it works on observations of reality, behind the scenes, and it actually kind of gets there. I mean, I'm using structural realism, maybe I'm, I'm conflating it with some mathematical context that are quantitation that it does not come with out of the box. I hope, I hope my point is clear.   Deep  13:51 Yeah, I understand your point completely. Um, quia. What do you think about this idea of an objective truth in nature? Um, do you think that it actually exists? And should we possess it? logic around that idea? Or the, or the rejection of the idea? Yeah. How important should that rule be?   Pouya LJ  14:12 Um, that's a very good question. Actually, I have started this long project, which is in the background for my own sake, I actually came up thought of this question a while back. I mean, everybody thought of thinks about these things, but more seriously started thinking about this insert. Getting onto some avenue to, you know, think about Yes. Is there an objective reality? And then that's literally the question to ask myself that started me on this journey. And you know, I I talk to some people from different walks of life, from psychology to philosophy to physics and what have you, some people who are at the top of their fields. I didn't. I mean, I did ask them this question, which is not the point. But from there our conversation, my conversation with them. What I got is that, no, from, from, from the real essence of the question, like the deepest sense of the question. And what I gather from all of those conversation conversations is that, again, we not the way we understand our world, our universe, maybe there is maybe there is a formalism that will get us there. But at least not with anything we have this, you know, far we've gotten discovery in science and philosophy thought. So. I, I think ultimately there is that's just a guesswork, obviously, like hypothesizing, but not in the sense that. So, let me put it this way. So for example, when GM Govan was saying that there's a spectrum of truth, I think that is, that is, that is true, until you get to the, to the resolution to the, to the, to the pixel of reality, essentially, at some point, it has to be one or the other. But we didn't get there yet. So that's my sense of it. That's my sense is that yes, it will eventually be some sort of objectiveness in reality, but it requires a better understanding of that reality that the fundamental laws of our universe, and that is not just gravity, gravity is, for example, gravity is emergent, from my perspective, and that that sense?   Govind  16:49 Well, I think you're gonna be happy, because initially, you wanted this discussion to be more about the nature of reality. And I think it's creeping into there. So I'll talk a little bit about the nature of reality as examined by Western philosophers. So there's a Descartes, notably, in the in the history of Western philosophy in like, let's say, the early modern period, which is like on 1600s, to like present day, or 1600 to 1800, is about the early modern period, we had these different movements, we started with rationalism, which is that, you know, like, we just, we just say things like, create these elaborate logical models. And then, and then we, we kind of examine, we use this as descriptions of reality. And then this kind of God rejects. And notably, Rene Descartes was kind of like a huge figure in this movement, because he said things like, the mind is its own soft, separate substance. And to tie that back to this discussion, what I was saying earlier about the realm of, of imaginary, thought experiments that we work with, in different fields like mathematics, computer science, and so on. He thought that it was its own separate universe that was completely detached from our, the universe that we live in. And he, I mean, these are the things he's saying, right? Like, I mean, he could be right, he could be wrong, but like, he's like, he's using logic as a means to tie together his his arguments. But at the end of the day, these are just things he's saying. And he's just using logic to create an elaborate story, an elaborate logical model. And this is the criticism that the next movement kind of gave to the rationalists. They were called the empiricist. People like David Hume, and I think mill or Locke, john Locke was in there. But they were like, hey, you're just saying things, you know, you're just you're just creating, you're just like, this is basically a story that I'm reading. And you're just like, Well, God is this and God is that. Savage. Exactly. And they're like David Hume, one of his famous philosophical quotes is like, you know, you can, you can't say for sure that the sun is gonna rise tomorrow, we see it rise every day. And we take it for granted, we have these explanations for it. But at the end of the day, these are just explanations, you know, I mean, at this point, they hadn't invented spacecraft and all that stuff yet, you know, they couldn't just go up there and see the sun.   Deep  19:09 Well, even then, like it did, there's still a philosophical point to that, like, even then we may not, despite everything we know, today, you know, I mean, the sun might not rise like there's   Govind  19:21 exactly that's, that's, that's   Deep  19:22 apparently physical reasons. I'm not even saying like magical reasons. But yeah,   Govind  19:26 So so they completely dismiss these, the rationalist arguments using this, it's like, if I don't see it, you know, it doesn't exist. So, you know, show me the proof, show me the reality of things. Got it. Um, and eventually, this kind of got resolved somewhat by Kant, Emmanuel Kant, who came in the, I believe, late 1700s, early 1800s. And he, he, he's like, Okay, guys, how do we resolve this? Because there's clearly some value in using logic to describe reality. And there's definitely value in talking about things that we can see and perceive and sense right. So his Way of reconciling this was to say that was to bring in the human aspect of things like how we perceive things. And he thought that that played an important role. In fact, what we call space time, were intuitions, he described them as intuitions. So humans have an intuition of space and an intuition of time, which is what allows us to perceive these things in reality. To make that more clear, he's he's telling the Emperor says, Hey, the things that you think you perceive, so clearly, maybe they're not that clear, you know, you are trapped behind your veil of perception at the end of the day. And again, like this is all to talk about the objective nature of reality, right? As humans, we can't help but be stuck behind the fact that everything we're perceiving is just what we're perceiving. There's another quote from Descartes, you know, it's, I think, therefore I am. It's one of like, the most famous quotes from philosophy, I think. But it's, it's basically that, for him thinking was such a rational endeavor, right? He thinks that just because he has this stuff running on in his head, like this voice that goes like, blah, blah, blah, and in his head, that's, that's why he knows for real, that He exists, like, no matter what, I have this thing that allows me to, like, perceive and like, you know, like, I don't know, if you guys are real, I don't know, my computer's I know, there's something going on here. You know, that's kind of his point there. And Kant was saying, you know, there's a human element of things you just can't strip away from, from anything real, right. So that's a little bit of a background in this in, well, let's say Western philosophical thinking about this, this this topic.   Deep  21:27 That's awesome. Um, and, you know, a lot of its circles, it's all circling and tying back in to itself in an interesting way. And here's what I mean by that. So, to your point about how deep you know, probability is in quantum mechanics, right? It plays a huge role, a fundamental role. For literally since the birth of it, you know, physicists both on the quantum computing and sorry, quantum physics side of things, and the classical physics side of things, believed that there should be some sort of a clear description of the wavefunction and information that we can eventually have access to and predict perfectly. So like, just, there's there was this idea that we'll eventually be able to predict the exact nature of the collapse, the wave function will know when it will collapse, and into what outcome it will collapse, rather than just knowing the probability. And you know, fast forward 100 years later, we've made essentially zero progress in making that stochastic process any less stochastic to us. And so it's really like sad react Sony, right? Like for the people who, who believe like, go when you and I've had tons of discussions about determinism and whether the universe is and Buddha unites was actually all three of us. And so quantum mechanics quickly touches on that. And then there's the objective reality question. There's the witness friend paradox. experiments, right that were recently conducted, again, two years ago, where you had two different labs instead, posing as a weakness friend, basically, it's a witness paradox is a paradox that was created in the 60s it was proposed by the famous physicist Wagner, and essentially, what he said was that if there are given the fact that the wavefunction encodes the all the possible measurables and observables, for a given observer, then the wavefunction is going to be different for different observers. And if that's true, then they're going to have eventually conflicting facts about the universe. And so he said, that's a paradox, right? And it turns out that it's true that two years ago, in those days, it is insane, because two years ago, we actually ran these quantum physical experiments where we took a well being split using beamsplitters, we essentially used quantum entangled photons. And we've been into two different labs, and you have people, you have what's called witness friends inside the lab, and then Wagner or like the observers outside the lab. And so all four people in this experiment, none of them can observe each other. We're measuring each other's photons directly, they can perform measurements to see if a measurement hasn't done, but they can't. Yeah, so that so if you want to think about it physically, they're splitting at the end of the experiment, one particle that was turned into four quantum entangled pairs, so through Bell state pairs and beamsplitters you really have these so if you want visualize that, so imagine, like I take a ball of physical ball, and I cut it in four pieces, and I give it right to four different people. Here's a weird thing about the huge We're gonna experiment what ended up happening is that Imagine if I asked those four people to look at, if I to record the color of their ball, right, let's say I cut up a red ball. And and I gave a piece to everybody, everybody has a red ball in theory right? v a piece that's red. What ended up happening is that these people, of course, were quantum mechanics, there's one caveat, right? You can expect the ball to change colors, that's fine, you can, you can expect it to change either red or green. So that's let's say, you can measure spin up, spin down totally fine. What and what what we did was, let's say I did this, I took a red ball, I gave it to four of my friends. And then they did measurements, knowing that it'll change red, green, red, green, sometimes. I, it turns out that when they did those measurements, and they all got back to each other, and they looked at their lists, and the measurements that they did on each individual piece themselves, the colors didn't add up. So So I so imagine this, like, imagine if I looked at my list, and I observed red, green, green, red, green, red, and you observe green, green, green, green, green, red. So you were looking at a different piece of the ball. How's that even possible? When I physically split the same objective ball? It's not it's, well, technically you shouldn't have been, but it is like, in fact, what's happening is that literal conflict and objective facts about reality, where you have people who participated in a physical experiment, use the same physical measurement tools and came up with different conflicting facts   Govind  26:31 that is completely wild. Yeah, no, that's physics anymore. You know, this is like something just so beyond anything.   Deep  26:41 Yeah, I mean, it is very edgy. Yeah. See? What we know, dude.   Govind  26:45 Yeah. Oh, my God. That's, that's insane. Everyone reminds me of the banach tarski paradox, right? Like, I mean, these kind of things happen on mathematics, and we're totally fine with it. Right. So the banach tarski paradox is like, imagine you have a sphere, a sphere that's composed of like, let's, let's call them like, an infinite number of droplets that are holding together this fear, right? It's like this basketball. So the banach tarski paradox says that there is a way to separate out, like, just choose all the points, like a whole bunch of these points that are in here, like these droplets, and then you take them out, and then you move them away. And these are just solely choosing the points, while granted infinite number of points, you're telling them to go somewhere else. And using this, you can actually create a perfect clone of the ball, right? You have two different copies of the ball using the exact same number of particles. So you can do all these weird things with infinity in the world of the abstract, you know, where we're fun things happen, and everyone's everyone's happy and dancing all the time. You know, like, yeah, they're like, we're okay with all kinds of crazy things happening. But man, when this spills over into reality, it's like, we all lose our shit. Because, you know, yeah, literally not believing.   Deep  27:54 That's right. That's right.   Pouya LJ  27:57 Yeah, and so, um, so what, what, what do you do, but especially because you're, you're actually very close to these experience. What does that what does that make you feel? What does that? What? What does that? Do you think it means? What does that say about that objective reality, if you will? What is your thought?   Deep  28:17 Yeah, it will, what it tells me is that there's likely some sort of, clearly a multiverse situation going on, where almost it's like, we're maybe that maybe each agent that can be concerned, considered an observer or anything that can be considered capable of measurement, right? We don't know how far that extends. We just don't know those answers. But I believe that everything that can is on some unique multiverse, and we all just have our own timelines intersecting with each other. That's what that told me. It no longer feels like, we share one objective physical space. It's like, you know, I mean, we just have like, the these rays instead. That intersect. So it, I found, frankly, I found it psychologically disturbing when I read the experiment and the results. And I don't think that there's no way around it. It's just but it's fascinating stuff. So yeah,   Pouya LJ  29:17 yeah, no, I, it does make sense. Yeah, what you're saying like, I mean, obviously, there has to be so that to me, either. There's another explanation such as the multiverse situation, or maybe there is no objective reality. Well, in a sense, at the end of the day, if you're living in a multiverse with different set of facts, and you're building all of your rules based on those axioms that you get from FX x, or whatever, a different set of axioms will say. Then, who's to say which universe is the reference universe, or the main universe or truth? So maybe maybe there isn't any objective reality which, which to me, And then that's my whole thing. That was my whole thing about this objective reality. I asked this question going in thinking, yes, there is, and we can't just find it yet. But let's pose the assumption that Yeah, no, there is no objective reality, then to me, it's a little bit more humanistic again, talk, but it just shows me how arrogant we've become of a thing called, you know, science and discovery. And we're just, we're just going forward thinking that we're supposed to know the answer to, to everything, we have to figure it out. And that and that's fine to try. But also I think it this whole phenomena should should give us some notion of Okay, there is there there should be a little bit a bit a degree of humility, in what in what we do as discoverers of this universe, which is, to me the most beautiful parts. Again, I'm like, this is being poetic as a human thing. But that's at the end of the day. That's who we are. And I think I think we should appreciate that part as well. Sorry, I'm just going to close this loop on this poem that I just composed here. But Okay, back to Golf. How does that make you feel? from someone who's a little bit more distant? Personally,   Govind  31:28 I think it's very interesting to use the word pool there because, well, since since this, this discussion has kind of been underpinned by logic and language and all that kind of stuff. There's this philosopher Martin Heidegger, his his entire take was like, we need to kind of escape from the confines of language and the kind of thinking that is inevitable, just because of language being the way it is, right? Because it's like, realistically, we all have our own personal language. It's like, I have my own language. And when I say that, I don't mean like my own version of English, I mean, my own, let's like, composition of thoughts, experiences, feeling senses, right? Like, if I remember, if I smell a perfume from my past, like, I'm gonna have like, these nostalgic experiences and all that stuff, right? And, and that really, that's part of that's a word or like maybe a phrase in like, personal language. And whenever I'm talking, what I'm doing is I'm converting from my, I'm translating from my personal language to English, right? In this case, and then and then you have to, like convert that back to your personal language. And men composition is really hard, like, how do we do it? Given this this context, but Heidegger, his his attempt to improve language, was by positing that we move to poetry as a way of expressing ourselves purely because he thought poetry had this innate ability to capture our personal language, right? Because when we write poetry, it's such a, like, poetry is a hard thing to understand, right? Like, sometimes you read poetry, and I'm like, What the heck is going on? But it's just because it's, it's the poets like attempt to try to bring out their personal language as much as possible, right. And I would argue that most of art is the same process. So I mean, in, and I want to tie this back to like, the point I made earlier about us trying to escape the confines of our own existence, right, like, the the confines of our of our human infrastructure, the way we do that, I think poetry is a very, very cool way of and it's kind of cool that emerged from this discussion as well. That's kind of a case in point.   Pouya LJ  33:23 Yeah. No, I I think so. Yes, I think I understand. So it's the least amount of filters like art, I suppose, like, closest to you as it gets, I suppose. So, so yes, I, and that's what I've been going back and forth a lot. Like I obviously, as somebody who cares about, you know, methodical thinking, logical thinking, and, you know, rationale, reason, etc. That is very valuable, especially if you if we want resolved in this in this world of ours, because at the end of the day, we can get a lot with the our version of you know, reality that we have in this very pocket that we are living in, in the whole the whole universe and in space and time. But going beyond that, I think there there has and that is where I think they kind of, you know, overlap the the field, let's call it science and art, if you will, I don't, I don't like to make huge distinction, like borderline distinction distinctions, generally personally, but I think in an entirety, society does make it very, like black and white distinction between these two, which I think there is a good amount of overlap, and that is, we're   Govind  34:44 talking fuzziness, right, it's all about being fuzzy and accepting it for what it is as opposed to what we want it to be that maybe seems more perfect to us, right? Like these molds seem more perfect to us. But the reality is, nothing is a mold like everything is fuzzy, right? Like I think the example is like such a mind. looming realization of that.   Pouya LJ  35:02 Yeah, no, that's that's true. And what one way one can raise a question. I suppose that what makes us want the I mean, I have I have one answer. But let's let me just pose the question first. What makes us as who we are humans, again, within this infrastructure, once this clarity of binary of, you know, not being fuzzy, but rather completely distinct or True or false? Well, what are your thoughts on that?   Govind  35:35 Well, I remember we actually think I think we did a podcast on this a little bit ago about like the nature of chaos, right? Some people, most people I think, are very averse to chaos, because they like things being simple and easy to understand. Right? What I mean, the more, let's say, foolhardy among us, for lack of a better word, like kind of naturally as gravitated towards chaos, because I think chaos is just such a good description of reality. But the problem is that chaos, by definition is incredibly, incredibly complex, right? So you don't you don't have the simplicity of like, you know, two plus two equals four, right? You're like, what's two? what's plus? What's four? What's the quality?   Pouya LJ  36:14 That sounds like you checked, you just say, yeah, smoke some weed or something? Like what is to man?   Govind  36:23 I thought this was Joe Rogan.   Pouya LJ  36:27 Oh, it could be anyway. No, I think so. Okay, let me go back to how about you do and don't share my thoughts?   Deep  36:38 Yes. So, first of all, it's super interesting about the nature of fuzziness, especially when we think about Zeno's paradox. Because even that is a great example. You know, I still contend that we have not resolved the paradox of why is it that we can make contact with anything, right? Why is it that I'm even touching the floor right now, despite the poly exclusion principle? And, you know, Zeno's paradox, right?   Govind  37:10 xenos paradox.   Deep  37:11 Sure. So So, so xenos paradox. It's really a family of paradoxes. But it all comes down to the fact that, I'll give you an example. Let's say that you want to reach the end of the hallway. And your rule that you impose on yourself is that you're going to have your distance in order to get to the hallway, and you'll have your distance, every single time until you get to the end of the hallway. And so let's say the, you're 10 feet away from the end of the hallway, then the next time the next move you make you're five feet away, then two and a half, then 1.25, and so on and so forth. And until you go to point 000000125, blah, blah, blah, but it'll never be zero, right? It never touches zero. So at no point, will you ever actually reach the end of the hallway. So Zeno's paradox, what basically asks, Why do you never, why do you touch the end of the hallway? Why is it that in real life, we end up making it to the other side, despite the fact that these infinite distances, you know, taking any slice of an infinite still infinite so so he just had all these questions about it. Yeah, spacetime. Very deep questions to the thousands of years ago on so and we still haven't answered them properly. And yeah,   Govind  38:34 well, I have a point about that. But I know if we are you're you're itching to talk about your, your perspective on it. Go ahead. Oh, you're on mute. Oops, sorry.   Pouya LJ  38:45 First of all, I want to say that I, I sent a photo and chat A while ago, and I think I diverted deeps attention to that kind of concept, which was I don't know if you saw the, the the rabbit or whatever it is. It wants to go get a haircut. I'll put this in the show notes, by the way, but it's a half off haircut. Did you guys see that one?   Deep  39:12 Right now? That is funny. Yeah, I'll put this   Pouya LJ  39:16 in the show notes. So that people who are listening to this, they can just find it out. But I know this is exactly what you're talking about. It'll gonna take forever. So yeah, you're right. But why do we actually get that haircut and the half of haircut eventually? No, I think so. First of all, all of these are exactly to my point that there's there's there is probably a sea of things that we just don't know about the nature of our universe, the one that even forget about objective reality, the one that we even perceive. And maybe one can make an argument that the reason with the fatalities of our of our views are the questions that we cannot answer is because of the fact that our realities are not completely overlapping the objective one, and that's where those those are the the edge cases that are actually creating these problems, perhaps. But true. Beyond that, I think there's a, there's a degree of obsession amongst many, many people, most people probably besides besides the ones who are embracing chaos, I suppose as go and was putting it, that we did a good good amount of like humanity essentially once a clear answer to two things and sometimes takes shortcuts through through, you know, ideologies that might not have, you know, rational rationale behind them. Just to get to those answer, why am I here? Why, like, because I have to be tested here to go to heaven, part of the some of the religious ideologies, or, or what is the nature of our unit? Why is the sun come up? I feel a first of all does is going to come up tomorrow or, and then we come up with these answers, and everybody through their own ways try to answer these definitively. And part of that is I think, now it's a little bit of more philosophical questions, I suppose, or answer rather thoughts, I suppose. But I think part of that is because we understand our own mortality by binary, which is the most did the deepest, probably driver of our existence, and that is either we're dead or alive, there's no, I'm half dead. I was like, well, maybe you're sick a little bit, but you're not half dead. So I and there is there's a degree that we and there's an understanding that when I die, I there's like, there's no coming back from that. I mean, I'm obviously there are exceptions, sometimes. Some people, some people, flatline they come back. But if you're flatlining for a week, you're not coming back from that, right? So so there's, there's a permanency to that experience that and and, and our deepest drive is to avoid that. So to avoid that clear, at least, at least from our mortal, mortal perspective, clear, true or false If true, being your dead and false being your life. That is clear that okay, if I'm, if I'm talking right now, as the card would say that I exist. In a more biological setup, sense, I'm not dead. And, and, and it drives all those questions, I suppose. But again, like, also going back to language as a logical tool, essentially. What do you think there's going to be a funny question, what do you think people before language would think? Would they have similar thoughts to these things? Now? I mean, obviously, in a simpler case, and not thinking like quantum physics, I suppose. But what do you think all of these are fatalities of language that we're carrying with ourselves? Or is it drive by language? Or is it more fundamental? So if we didn't have language for people who didn't invent language yet, back in? I don't know how long ago? Would they have similar thoughts? Do you think?   Govind  43:11 Well, I think we do have animals, right? Like, I mean, when we have these, you have any pets? Do you   Pouya LJ  43:17 mean no? Okay, before, but I know Okay, yeah. No, but I can understand what you're where you're going.   Govind  43:24 But when you have, like interactions with animals, I love animals. It's almost like you have this communication with them. That's that's not like you. I mean, I don't I can see versus and they probably don't understand me, unless all animals know English, and they just choose to ignore us. And they like humans are too stupid. There was a   Pouya LJ  43:43 cabal of animals deciding that this is not a good idea. Yes.   Govind  43:48 Lots of Rick and Morty episodes. But yeah, no, I think I mean, it's just that that awareness that being that's that's just there right? I think that is rooted in language fundamentally. Like I don't I don't know if we can actually get past this. This like our art like the language that we have developed evolved and developed is like it serves a very good purpose which is sharing thoughts with each other sharing these these like awareness experiences with each other right? But at the root of it all like I mean, it's all about that awareness and you brought up such a great point about death right? And how death is that binary which kind of makes us realize like you know, like there is such a thing as a clear like a clear line drawn in the in the northern sand like a line drawn in the concrete You know, this this is it like you know, there's life and then there's not life so so that that is actually such a such a great point about why negations work in this in this sense. I seem to have lost you guys   Pouya LJ  44:47 know, we can hear you. Okay. Oh, yeah, your picture froze, but I can hear you so that's good. Excellent.   Govind  44:53 Yeah. Well, yeah, that's that's the point I wanted to make. You know, it's a it's like these these ideas do exist, but I'm sure Animals have a notion of death as well. Right? And animals. Oh, yeah. Their their experiences and all that.   Pouya LJ  45:05 Yeah, no. And that's true. The notion of death is obviously at least in its more primal sense of obvious. Obviously, they're, they're trying to avoid it. But there are no but my point was, so so the rabbit holes that we go to and get stuck in it, then half of the way to the destination, and then half it, and then half of them and have it is this. My This is what is this? Now? Now this one is not as outside of language, actually, some, I'm kind of negating myself, but is a lot of these problems with language and and how we're communicating with each other. Because honestly, like, there are instances that I think I should have been thinking about this. Do I think with myself, like when there's nobody else, I don't have to communicate with anybody else. I don't need to use language, English, Farsi, whatever, to communicate with other people. But is there any any? Do I communicate with myself with my thoughts, in language or outside of language? And I've been thinking about this for a while and trying to observe it? And part of it is that, yeah, yeah, most of my thoughts are us using language. But yes, there are pockets sometimes that I feel like, there's a thought that I can't even express it to myself, using language. It's that the, maybe that that's the that's for, like, there's a fog. And I'm perceiving it. There's some sort of experience behind it. But I can't even describe that experience for us. Like, I mean, what what is like, so what is it sounds like an impression of a thought, right? Because a thought is a thought when you're able to express it, maybe? Yeah, so i think i think that that becomes super clear. Well, okay, let me let me give you so this is a, this is going to be a little bit of an exaggeration. Like, it's not what I'm thinking about. So the one that I'm thinking about is more of a thought. But think about this, when you're extremely fearful for your life at a very moment notice of, you know, hitting, you know, you have to you have to run there's there's a, there's a specific quality to that fear. And you're thinking, Okay, maybe there's a bear in front of you. And your thought is that we're going to grab this knife, but are you really thinking in terms of wars, I am going to grab this knife, you see a knife, you you want to grab it, you know what I mean? That's a thought that I'm going to grab this knife, but it's not really in any language. And that is really forced when I think I can see myself doing that, at least, when it comes to the precipice of like some sort of when it combines with some sort of very strong emotion such as, okay, I have to grab this knife or gun or whatever, shoot this bear, I'm not thinking to myself, okay, I am going to grab a gun, and I am going to pull the trigger at this. No, that's not it, you just know, right? That's a   Govind  48:01 possibility. It's like you're like, the way I think of it is like, it's almost like a design space of everything that could possibly happen given what's around you. Right? So it's like you're sampling from this design space. Like one of these events, for example, is like you picking up a knife or like, you know, you punching someone in the face. This is around you. Something like it's like these are these are just, I think the mind is really good at generating these kind of things, which is just sampling points from, from this design space of what's around us, right? Yeah. And then and then these are actions or like, these are these are impressions. Yeah. It's like, yeah, we just, we just like, we have all these things around this, like stimulus. And our mind is generating these things. And most of the time, it's like, it's pretty pragmatic. It's like, Oh, you have to put on your shoes to walk. It's like this thing you tell yourself, but you're not really thinking you're doing things. But like, sometimes it's just like random thoughts. Like it's our mind is a pretty interesting random number generator. Deep. What are your thoughts on that?   Deep  49:00 Okay, it really is. I agree with that. I mean, you can always say that, uh, you know, all of our output all of our, I've always wondered, you know, the, what is it the thousand monkey or the infinite monkey experiment or thought experiment where what would happen if you let monkeys play with a typewriter for an infinite amount of time, right? There's the idea that they would eventually create Shakespeare. And it makes me question the idea of creativity and thought, is it a linear combination of what you already know? Or is it truly something that will eventually appear emergent from random fucking monkey? Monkey actions, right? Like, what what is true intelligent creativity? So with that being said, I really had a I was thinking, though, you know, on that note about us looking at death and life is binary. That's true. We are classical creatures, like we observe the universe in classical sense, right? Everything is and so because it's macroscopic to us, I wonder, what if? What does life look like for, let's say, micro organism that doesn't experience the world classically like we do, right? What if there are, there are quantum organisms that are only experiencing the world and quantum mechanics? To them, there would be literally no such thing as a classical I am dead or classical life. What does that mean? What What does death for that organism look like? So yeah, I was just thinking about that. But you guys think,   Pouya LJ  50:34 yeah, no, you're you're dragging us into the pan psychism   Govind  50:41 the movie arrival, right? With the whole concept of like, circular time and all these things, right? Like, this is some I think, innovations of the 21st century like, exploring this, these kind of ideas. I see so many outlets for this in different TV shows and movies and all that stuff. Like this, this like convergence of everything, how everything is one and many at the same time. Right? Well, I guess the fuzziness of everything, right. Like everything is just really fuzzy. And we're, as humanity starting to accept it, which is, you know, really freakin cool.   Pouya LJ  51:12 No, no, it is. And you mentioned an arrival It reminds me of, so I think if I'm not mistaken. Okay, maybe I'm mistaken. But let me let me just make it maybe, you know, I think Stephen Wolfram was an advisor in that movie. I don't know if he really I don't know. That's that I I'm doubting myself now. So anybody out there listening. Please double check for yourselves. Don't quote me on it. But which reminds me he actually I don't know if we're familiar. Actually. I   51:40 don't know why I did a quick Google and   Pouya LJ  51:43 it is like it's okay. Yeah. And he came up with this new What is it? What do you call it? Geez. new stuff. Yeah, he is hypergraph.   Deep  51:56 Physics.   Pouya LJ  51:57 Yes. Yeah. Have you heard about that? Did you look into it?   Deep  52:01 Yeah, I   52:04 I liked it.   Pouya LJ  52:06 So what are your thoughts on that? But super quickly, I don't want to go to a different deep rabbit hole right now. But it reminded me of him when you mentioned arrival.   Deep  52:14 Sure. I mean, various.   Pouya LJ  52:16 I don't know, Dad Galvin. Are you familiar with what it is? Oh, yeah, sure. Sure. Okay. Okay. Cool. Cool. Good.   Deep  52:22 Yeah, just very briefly, I mean, the idea of like, Come complex, physical phenomena from simple rules is nothing new, right. Like that's been talked about for 100 years. What was really interesting was the idea of using causal graphs or attempting to use just like these hyper graphs to encode physical rules. Yeah, I think it's promising. I'd love to see experiments and math and more rigor. But the ideas are cool. Like Stephen Wolfram is really, like he has some fundamental thoughts there that are interesting, unique worth pursuing.   Govind  52:56 These are usually a pioneer of this kind of this kind of funky fuzzy stuff. Right, right. Yeah. Yes, geez theory so much with his work on automata and all that stuff. Well, this release. I mean, I wanted to bring back this point from about 15 minutes ago. We were talking about Zeno's paradoxes. Yeah, a conversation topic for a future podcasts definitely should be the nature of calculus, right? Because, yeah, the way we as humans, resolve Zeno's paradoxes was to create this notion of a limit, we just throw a limit on it. And we say, at some point, it does, it does converge on to this value, right? Like, and I'm like, okay, so you keep cutting the half of your hair. And at some point, you're, you're going to get a full haircut, right? Like, even if you get the convergence now that that notion of convergence, it turns out is not strongly understood by by humans. But I think that's something we need to discuss. And I it stands out for me, because this is one of the first discussions we ever had. Right? Exactly. Yeah.   Deep  53:57 Yeah, absolutely. Talking   Govind  53:58 about limits and how like, that's what I think I first realized I'm like, this doesn't make any sense, does it? It's just, we just put   Deep  54:04 it is it is a great because some that is it all stemmed from some Berkeley kid asking us like, like, about it, right? Like he's like, yeah, this like this. And then yeah,   Govind  54:15 yeah. Yeah. Cool stuff. No, but I think we should explore that in in the next podcast or though sounds good. Sounds good?   Pouya LJ  54:24 No, I think I think okay, well, we made the plan. I don't know about the dates. We'll talk about that later. But next sub subject of the next conversation will be calculus, and its origins, its fundamentals. axioms, I suppose. Okay, I think that's a good. Here's a good stopping point. We almost went full hour here. Is there anything else you want to, you know, close the loop on before we leave this conversation?   Govind  54:54 Well, for me, I think I learned so I mean, I had these thoughts about fuzzy fuzzy thinking and all that stuff. And it was Kind of like in the let's let's see the disk of my, the my external hard disk of my brain is just forgotten there. So it's great to brush the dust off. And I feel like I really kind of added to these models based on this conversation. So yeah, it was very cool. I think we achieved fuzziness today. Yes.   Pouya LJ  55:18 That's great. How about you?   Deep  55:20 Yeah, I would just say that I really appreciated the perspective of the history of history philosophy, with respect to logic, a super neat perspective that you brought to the table or Govind and yeah, just different perspectives that were shared today. Um, it's awesome. It does make things more fuzzy. And yeah, let's keep it going. Guys, I, I think that there's a lot of interesting questions. We post here today. So   Pouya LJ  55:47 okay, and if anybody wants to share their thoughts, feel free you can reach go in and deepen their respective social media, which I'm going to put in the show notes. Don't need to repeat them here. You can you can find them there.   56:01 And comment guys.   Pouya LJ  56:04 Make it make it dirty. No, keep it clean. And all right, stay fuzzy until later episode.   Deep  56:11 Cheers, guys.  

Helene Cooper has type 1 diabetes, asthma, and she's Black. All of those factors increase her risks if she catches COVID 19. They're also exactly what the researchers behind one of the vaccine trials were looking for. She's now in that Phase 3 Trial and shares what it's been like. Check out Stacey's new book: The World's Worst Diabetes Mom! Helene is also a reporter for the New York Times, covering the Pentagon and has an incredible story that began well before she was diagnosed with type 1 at the age of 15. She and her family fled here from Liberia in 1972. Join the Diabetes Connections Facebook Group! In Tell Me Something Good, a few high profile birthdays and diaversaries Our episode with the Dooley Family Our episode with Dennis Goldensohn Plus, Innovations – see through is your organizational friend. Learn more organizing tips from Susan Weiner This podcast is not intended as medical advice. If you have those kinds of questions, please contact your health care provider. Sign up for our newsletter here ----- Use this link to get one free download and one free month of Audible, available to Diabetes Connections listeners! ----- Get the App and listen to Diabetes Connections wherever you go! Click here for iPhone      Click here for Android Episode Transcription: Stacey Simms  0:00 Diabetes Connections is brought to you by One Drop created for people with diabetes by people who have diabetes by Real Good Foods real food you feel good about eating and by Dexcom take control of your diabetes and live life to the fullest with Dexcom.   Announcer  0:21 This is Diabetes Connections with Stacey Simms.   Stacey Simms  0:27 This week taking part in a COVID vaccine trial. Reporter Helene Cooper has type one and asthma and says she decided to apply after she met Dr. Anthony Fauci backstage at Meet the Press. She says at first, he wouldn't really answer her questions about her odds   Helene Cooper  0:44 And finally, he just he was standing by the door to go on air as we weren't in the same segment. He just stopped at the door. He was like, Look, I'm not saying that you're a dead duck, but she just really need to not get it. Oh, God, I really need to not get this.   Stacey Simms  1:00 Helene is now in a phase three vaccine trial. She's a New York Times Pentagon reporter and talks about what it's been like doing her job and living with T1D during this pandemic in Tell me something good a couple of high profile birthdays and diversities plus innovations. Why see-through is your organizational friend. This podcast is not intended as medical advice. If you have those kinds of questions, please contact your health care provider. Welcome to another week of the show. I'm so glad to have you along. I'm your host, Stacey Simms. We aim to educate and inspire about type 1 diabetes by sharing stories of connection. My son was diagnosed with type one right before he turned two. That was back in 2006. My husband lives with type two. I don't have diabetes, I have a background in broadcasting. And that's how you get the podcast. There is so much in the news these days about the potential for a COVID vaccine. news about the trials political news about vaccines. This episode is a personal story about one woman's experience going through one of the vaccine trials. So I just want to let you know about that right up front. And a big thank you to Gillian McPhee, who in the Facebook group Diabetes Connections The Group shared the article that Helene Cooper wrote about her experience getting into the vaccine and a lot of what she shares here on the show, but I will link that up. I reached out to Helene on Twitter, and she graciously responded. Now Helene has an incredible story, even before she signed up for this trial. I mean, well, before she was diagnosed with type one at the age of 15. She and her family fled here from Liberia. And I'm going to link up that story in the show notes at Diabetes connections.com. It'll be on the episode homepage. I'd really urge you to read that. But one of the problems with the vaccine trials was all of the COVID vaccine trials is getting enough people into them. I'm also going to link up more information on that and I'm going to come back after the interview and talk a little bit more about it. I know you want to hear from Helene. And we'll get to that in just a moment. But first diabetes Connections is brought to you by One Drop. It is so nice to find a diabetes product that not only does what you need, but also fits in perfectly with your life. One Drop is that it's the sleekest looking and most modern beater My family has ever used. And it's not just about their modern meter setup. You can also send your readings to the mobile app automatically and review your data at any time. Instantly share blood glucose reports with your healthcare team. It also works with your Dexcom Fitbit or your Apple Watch. Not to mention they're awesome test strips subscription plans, pick as many test strips as you need and they'll deliver them to your door. One Drop diabetes care delivered, learn more, go to Diabetes connections.com and click on the One Drop logo. My guest this week is doing us all a huge service by participating in one of the trials for the COVID vaccine. As we recorded this interview, Helene Cooper had taken the first shot. She is due for the second in just a few days as this episode airs. Helene is a New York Times Pentagon reporter, but she says that's not why she was selected. She explains it is because she lives with type one, she has asthma, and she's black. There are not enough people from any of those groups represented in any of the vaccine trials. I tried to cover a lot with Helene and as this is an ongoing story. She was gracious enough to agree to come back on maybe a couple of weeks that she's further along and share more about her experience. So here is our talk. Hello, and thank you so much for taking the time to talk to us about your experience. I really appreciate it.   Helene Cooper  4:35 I'm happy to be here, Stacey. I've never been asked to talk to diabetics before. So this is kind of cool.   Stacey Simms  4:40 Oh, nice. Well, I always like to tell guests like you that you don't explain the difference between type one and type two. We speak the language. We get it. I'm just so interested in so many of your experiences. But let's start with the COVID vaccine trial that I saw that article came to my attention. How did you get in the trial to be If you could kind of start from the beginning,   Helene Cooper  5:01 okay, I was watching Dr. Fauci on testify, I think it was before the House. It was either July 30, or the 31st. And he said that all of these vaccine trials were getting underway. And he said they needed volunteers. And he rattled off the name of a website that you could go to to volunteer. I don't know why I did it. But I just went on to the website, and I filled it out. I said, I was type one diabetic, I put that I have asthma I did. I filled everything out and went on about my business. And then a couple of weeks later, I was in the Outer Banks. So it was like, it was somewhere around August 28, the week of august 22 23rd 24, something like that. I got a phone call on my cell phone from GW from a clinical research associate, who said I had been picked for the Maderna trial. And then I got nervous, because it's like, it's one thing when you fill out the questionnaire, and you think they're never going to call you and then they call, she said that I've been picked because I was type one diabetic, they needed to see if the vaccine was safe for people like me, I asked her a lot of questions. Because my first fear that a friend of mine had put in my head was what if they give you the vaccine, and then send you to like a high risk area and ask you to wander around without a mask or anything like that. And I thought, Well, I'm not doing that. I've been super careful for the past six months, because I think we heard pretty early on, I still remember that sinking feeling in my stomach back in February, and March where they started talking about the high risk people and seeing diabetes. And it just said diabetes, it didn't say type one or type two, which drove me crazy, because it's like, these are two different diseases. And do they mean but whatever. When I saw I had run into Dr. Fauci back in on March 8, when I was in the green room for a Meet the Press episode. And the first thing out of my mouth, I walk in, and he was sitting on the chair, and it's like, wow, look, it's like I recognized it from TV. And I was I immediately started talking to him about COVID, because that's what he was there to talk about. And I was like, Well, I'm type one diabetic and blah, blah. I was like, you know, what happens if I get it? And he was like, he kept. He wasn't beating around the bush. But he kept saying, you need to not get it. And I was like, Yeah, but what happens if I do get it? And he was like, No, you really need to not get it. And he wasn't he wasn't answering my question, but not answering my question. And I wanted to know like, okay, most people get it and there's a 98% chance they'll be fine. My like a 93% chance or what, exactly what, and finally, he just seems standing by them. He'd walked out the door to go on air, because we weren't in the same segment. He just stopped at the door. He was like, Look, I'm not saying that you're a dead duck, but she just really needs to not get it. Oh, God, I really need to not get this. So I have covered the Ebola pandemic in Liberia. In 2014. I didn't Liberia for a month during Ebola I and at the time, I understood then that I really needed to not get Ebola as well being a type one diabetic. So I put into place my Ebola protocols. I think I called them on March 8, where I was washing my hands all the time, I was staying away from I stopped touching people. I was I've been and I've been really careful. I wear masks. I only just now recently stopped wearing gloves everywhere I went that I had been doing that for a while. And nobody's come into my house except my mom, my sister and my nephew. And brother in law. I'm like, so I'm probably much more careful than most people are. Because I think we kind of have to be because there's so much we don't know, I'm just rambling at this point, not letting you ask any questions?   Stacey Simms  8:41 No, it's wonderful. A lot to unpack there as Yes. So let me go back when you said there's not a lot of information about type one and type two, we you know, in the community, we're talking about that all the time.   Helene Cooper  8:52 Yeah. One of the things everybody I've asked about it has said they don't because I went to my normal diabetic doctor, and I was asking her about this. And she said the problem they don't know. All they know is that the people who showing up in the hospitals and needing to be put on ventilators and leading and having severe reactions and get you know, and you know, getting really sick and dying. A lot of them tend to be diabetics, but then I asked, you know, are they type one are they type two, and they're certainly type two, but she seemed to think that they're type ones as well. And that's what this is based on. This is at this point. There's so much about Coronavirus that we don't know COVID-19 that we don't know. And so the whole high risk category for diabetic that has been determined simply based on the fact that these are the people who are showing up in the hospitals.   Stacey Simms  9:46 So let's talk about the vaccine trial, get the call.   Helene Cooper  9:49 I get the call. I freak out. I call my friend first I called my normal doctor but she's very super cautious and her response was like Why does it have to You. So I was like, Okay, I'll Park this somewhere for a second. And I called my friend, Kendall Marcus, who's an infectious disease specialist. Her response was immediate, she was like, vaccines are super safe, you should do it. And for Kendall to be just complete, like, usually she's cautious, too. And she's like, you got to be careful. But it was just complete. No, you should do it. And so I got a, you know, we talked through it. And she, you know, explained some very complicated sounding stuff about how they work because I thought they were going to be putting a little bit of COVID in me, and but she said that the modern no one was not that is messenger RNA is basically tricking your body into making antibodies by feeding you a little bit of mRNA, that makes your body think that it has COVID. So she was like, there's no chance that you could catch it from this, when there's no chance that you could give it to anybody from this. And so I went, I showed up for my appointment, it was on a Wednesday, they give you it's, you're there, I was there for three hours, they gave me a COVID test, the nasal swab, because if it comes back positive, you're not going to be in the truck, because there's no point of you being in the truck. They gave me a lot of time, they gave me a full physical, took blood made me take a pregnancy test. There's all this stuff. And towards the end, then, is when I got the shot where the doctor was like, Okay, you've been randomized, you know, the blind woman is like the double the unblinded person is coming. Because of course I hadn't read they told me all of that in a sheet that they sent me that read talking about that, which is my own fault. And then the nurse came in with the vaccine, and she was not even looking at me and as a reporter, I'm, like, filled with questions. It was like, Are you kidding me? Like, is that what is that? Is that the placebo? Is that the vaccine? Which one? Is it? Going through all of this? I want to make sure I you know, I'm getting the vaccine, I know placebo, and she was just like, you need to just, you know, she said nothing.   Stacey Simms  12:00 Well, yeah, if anybody else knows besides that person, then it can be, it can ruin the whole study!   Helene Cooper  12:07 I got so much s--t from people when I put that in the article that I was harassing the woman about this dude, like you're violating the sanctity of the study. But it's just like, you kind of want to know if you got the placebo vaccine. When you posted your story in my facebook group for the podcasts. People were very well they Yeah, not pleased. No.   Stacey Simms  12:30 But I can tell your personality, right? Yes,   Unknown Speaker  12:33 you can laugh. No worries.   Stacey Simms  12:36 One of the questions that actually came up in the Facebook group was whether you were the only person with diabetes in the trial. Now obviously, you don't know anybody else.   Helene Cooper  12:42 But it was. I am not because ever since I wrote that story I've gotten a lot of people have tweeted me, including type one diabetics were in the trial who have been and there's this one guy who's been so great, because he's like, let me tell you what happened to me I'm in the same type of trial. It's like his was with Pfizer. I think mine is butchering it, but it's the same technology. And he was like, the first shot felt totally normal, just like you and then the second shot, my sugar level shot up, I was sick for 36 hours and then it went away. And he was like, but it was just as if I had you know, how you get when you're diabetic with a flu, your sugar level goes high and all that kind of stuff. I was like, that means you got the vaccine. And he was like, well, be careful. You know, because just the cuz you sound like you don't think you're You got it, but I didn't I didn't think I got it when I got the first shot. And the second shot was like, Huh, so now I'm worried about the second shot.   Stacey Simms  13:32 Well, I was gonna ask you, did you have any kind of reaction blood sugar wise to the first one? Nope, nothing. I mean,   Helene Cooper  13:37 just some aches and pains. Um, some muscle joint, which I don't, I think was because I was camping on the beach. And I got like the the I got the stuffing pounded out of me by these ferocious waves was   Stacey Simms  13:51 curious if you asked your friend who said what if they give you the vaccine, and then they want you to test it by wandering around a hotspot? I can't imagine that's actually part of any clinical trial.   Helene Cooper  14:02 I would think wouldn't you do that in phase one? It's not part of phase three. But what's the What is it? Wouldn't phase one be remember? Did you see Contagion?   Stacey Simms  14:14 Right. But she did that on her own?   Helene Cooper  14:16 Yeah, but they got it tested some kind of way. How are they going to find out if it works if they don't see if it works? If they don't expose people to it? Yeah, shape or form. I mean, he was getting at. I got a lot of grief for that for putting that in the story. But I thought that was a very legitimate question to ask. And as a non medical person, that's what you're gonna wonder.   Stacey Simms  14:42 Okay, I'm gonna jump in here for just a couple of minutes. If you are wondering about that point yourself or maybe you are screaming at the two of us in frustration. Here's the real deal about how they do vaccine trials. Once participants get a vaccine will the researchers intentionally expose them, right? That's what we're talking about here. Will the researcher send a lien into a crowd of people as in the movie Contagion? Which, if you haven't seen it, it's a 2011 movie. It's all about if you haven't guessed, it's all about a pandemic. There were scientists who worked on that movie and made it very realistic and therefore quite terrifying. But to the question of did they send people who got the vaccine out into infected crowds? No, of course not. That is unethical. I did a little bit of looking into this. And so here's what most of the publications say, because there are still no effective therapies to prevent someone exposed to COVID-19. from falling seriously ill intentionally exposing patients is a no go. Instead, the idea is to observe the number and severity of naturally occurring infections. Among the many thousands of volunteer participants who receive vaccines, or placebos. If there are notably fewer infections, or milder infections among the vaccinated group, that's how they tell the vaccine is working. So I want you to take a moment and clarify that and we will go right back to my talk with Helene in just a moment. But first, diabetes Connections is brought to you by Real Good Foods. We've been enjoying Real Good Foods for almost two years now. And I got to tell you, I think with all of their new products, everything's great. But the pizza that we started with is really still our favorite. And we got an air fryer A while back. And that has really taken stuff like this to the next level. Although my I shouldn't say that because my husband still prefers to heat up the pizza, in a frying pan, or saucepan, kill, just heat it up that way. I don't know, maybe he doesn't wanna get the air fryer out. But to me, it's crisp beer, it tastes better, one less pan to wash at the end of the day, you can find out more about where to buy Real Good Foods. Our whole line is available in Walmart and local grocery stores. You can also find everything online, go to Diabetes connections.com and click on the Real Good Foods logo. Now back to my conversation with Helene, where we are finishing up talking about that movie Contagion. And obviously, that movie was worked on by experts. Stacey Simms  17:14 We've all heard all those stories but I haven’t watched it since COVID. Started, I can't bring myself out   Helene Cooper  17:16 a good No, you gotta go do it. I did it. And I like it'll, it'll, it'll make you even more careful.   I watched it in March. I was like, Oh, hell no. Stay. Oh,   Stacey Simms  17:30 I will. Alright, I'll have to go back and look at that, then what happens? Is it a second shot? And then you're done? Or do you? I mean, they'll follow you. But are you done? Not   Helene Cooper  17:38 that they follow you up? Um, there's an app that you have to answer. The first week, the app was making me answer questions every night, take my temperature and all of that. And then it's gotten bored with me, and it stopped now. So I haven't gotten any good. So then you have the second shot. And they follow up with you. They're supposed to call you every week. And you answer questions on the app, and they just track you. And so presumably, it's a two year study. But they're shooting for, you know, a few months. Yeah, very quick.   Stacey Simms  18:11 And because they're they wanted to look at people specifically with diabetes. Are they also asking you to track blood sugars and things like that? Or they're just looking for safety?   Helene Cooper  18:19 or remotely related to but which I find curious, because that's like, they have not the questions or fever, body aches, pains and all of that they didn't that none of the questions are because the questions are all for the 30,000 people. So they're no special. I'm not in a special diabetic subgroup. But   Stacey Simms  18:37 it's interesting, because you are in three subgroups, diabetes, asthma, and being a black person. Yeah. So as you said, they were looking for people, you know, do you know if they were successful trying and this is gonna sound? I mean, I asked this question they were looking for   Helene Cooper  18:53 they I don't know the answer. They at GW moderna paused its trial to expand it because at first they weren't getting enough black people. So they went and cast the net, even wider. And I think they believe they've now got a representative sampling. The people at GW said that they felt that the sampling that they were doing reflected the city of Washington DC, which means then that they had a high black population.   Stacey Simms  19:18 So listen, you have a job that I assume you cannot do, only from home. No, I can't Pentagon is your beat.   Helene Cooper  19:25 I'm home a lot. And the Times went to, you know, to send us home back in March, march 13. And they're really good about that. And I do a lot of my job right now I do at home, but it's so different. It's harder, and I do have to go to the Pentagon and I do meet sources. And so I wear the tie I was issued and 95 masks by the times and you know, full, you know, kit, full kit and 95 mask. And when I go to work, like during the protest, for instance, I did some a little bit of that went to the Pentagon when I go to meet for sources and all of that Especially when you're at the Pentagon where you have to wear a mask in the building. A lot of people don't wear masks inside their individual offices. I've been in to meet with top generals at the Pentagon who have you in the office, but they're not going to wear a mask, they will take your temperature, but I don't think I think that's pointless. Yeah, test your temperature. But once you're inside, and then they'll always say, Oh, don't you can take off your mask if you want, but I never do. And I, that's when I wear that. And 95 because that will protect me, not just because you wear a mask to protect other people primarily, but the N 95 will protect you. Even before COVID I'm curious, you know, a high powered career very busy, but also very much in when you work at the Pentagon, you're not fooling around, I'm curious if you would share a little bit about how you manage type one. Sure, your job, you have a son who's type one, so you know that it becomes like brushing your teeth, it's just something you do. I'm testing myself, you know, eight to nine times a day, I'm taking multiple shots a day. And that's just something and I've gotten really used to, I test in front of anybody, I don't wait, I don't like you know, I don't go, my sister laughs at me because I take my shots through my clothing, because sometimes you can't, you know, the needle, go through your clothing. And if you're on an aircraft carrier in the middle of something, you don't have time to go find a bathroom to you know, whatever. And it's a long time ago, one of a doctor, Dr. Joshua barzilay, in Atlanta, when I was I just moved down there in my 20s. And he said, you know, you have a choice, you can make the diabetes conform to your life, or you can make your life conform to your diabetes, and I made a choice, I was going to make the diabetes conform to my life. So I've done everything I was embedded in with the third infantry division for the Iraq war I was I've been, you know, with all special ops groups, you know, behind enemy lines, I do all of that kind of stuff. And I just I keep a tight rein on my sugar levels. But there plenty of times where I have problems, you know, I've had insulin reactions, thousands of insulin reactions there. Because if you keep in control, you're very close to low, right? You know, if you're keeping between 80 and 120. It's, I've never gotten to the point where I have figured out how to keep between 80 and 120 and not have 60s, you know, you're running around at 300 400, then yeah, you're not gonna have insulin reactions. But if you're keeping in control, then you're gonna hit lows. And so I hit I hit lows, lucky in that I still feel them. I can tell when it's coming on. I carry sugar pills around with me everywhere. They're sugar pills. In every pocketbook. I have their sugar pills in my fanny pack their sugar pills everywhere. And that's sort of how I deal with it. And so I feel fine. I've had it for what I'm 54 years old now. And I got it when I was 15. So that's a long time. I haven't had any of the my kidneys are fine. My You know, my eyesight. I can't see for s--t. But that's not because I mean,   Stacey Simms  23:11 we're all wearing glasses.   Helene Cooper  23:12 Yeah. And everything so far, knock on wood looks okay. But it's something that you just you just deal with you. I mean, which you know, I assume because you've got a son who's just dealing with it.   Stacey Simms  23:23 Do you use any tech? Or have you seen either technology insulin pump CGM, stuff like that, not your style.   Helene Cooper  23:28 I don't like the pump. I tried the pump. And I didn't like it. I tried the continuous blood monitor. And I didn't like it. So I still I use pens. I have a mantra for my long acting, and I'm on human log for my short acting. And then I have the one touch you know, and I it's five seconds. And it's really easy. My doctor is so pissed at me because she's been after me for two and I won't do it. And every year she's like, Look, it would be so I tried to Dexcom and I hated it. It's waking up in the middle of the night and striving you not. And so I stopped after one month. And so she's I mean, I'm probably gonna fold at some point, but I haven't pulled it yet.   Stacey Simms  24:06 Well, I wouldn't call it folding if you want to try it jump into the group or I know you know what you're doing. But there's some advice on how   Helene Cooper  24:12 to not make it drive you up a frickin wall. Because it? I mean, yes. Oh, I would like probably that advice, because I think at some point, I'm gonna have to just do it. Well, that's another story.   Stacey Simms  24:22 Yeah. Tell me about your diagnosis story. You were diagnosed at 15.   Helene Cooper  24:26 Yeah, I my dad was diabetic. And for some reason, I think he was type one. I don't remember his type one or type two. Because he died in 1985. And I think he was type two, but he was taking insulin regularly and fairly aggressively, which makes me think maybe he was type one and we just didn't, I don't know.   Stacey Simms  24:46 So yeah, it's at that time, too. They didn't know about Lada and all the other things.   Helene Cooper  24:50 He was diagnosed when he was like 40. So that's, I think that's why they But anyway, so that's a whole nother set. Let's not get in. Let's get into what I know. Anyway, My mom, as it turns out, now it's type two. I'm from Liberia, West Africa. And my family had moved here in 1980. I was living with my dad, my parents had split up. My mom was back in Liberia for a year and we're living my sister and I were living with our dad in North Carolina and Greensboro. And I started running to the bathroom and being thirsty all the time. I was like, 15. Then I was a junior in high school, and I started dropping weight. I was skinny. But then I got really skinny. But I thought I was but I was eating. I was so hungry all the time. And I was convinced I had blown up because I was eating like seven meals a day, and horribly hungry. And in the middle of night, I was going downstairs and drinking apple juice and eating food. And I was like, I have to be so fat. Why am I eating like this? And my mom showed up to visit us and she came to the house Liberia and she my dad came to the school to surprise me because we didn't know my mom was coming. And they came to the school to surprise me. And they got me out of my class. And I go running. I was like, why are you living with me? And he's not noticing because you're seeing the person every day   to the doctor, and I was diagnosed and I was ended up in the hospital for a week in pediatrics.   At 15 I was very outraged that they put me Yeah, true. Yeah,   Stacey Simms  26:27 I bet but they're also at 15. You have no sense of your body, right? Your thumb. Oh, yeah, I'm eating   Helene Cooper  26:33 That's amazing. Yeah, I was so convinced that I was a pig. I was like that it was like all whatever. But anyways, so that's when, and so I remember they put me on this is so far long ago is like the 80s. They put me on these three different types of insulin to start x rapid, semi tard, some other top monitored, and I was having instant reactions and then shooting up and they were trying to I would take one shot in the morning. And that was it. And I couldn't get it under control. I was I was hungry all the time. Because they had they started me on too much insulin. And so I was hungry and eating. And it was just really it was bad. And I was only testing that's back when you would test with urine. Yeah, this is all before, this is a long time ago. And so I took my insulin, but that was all I would do. I would take my insulin in the morning, but then I ate whatever I want it. And so I was completely out of control. And it took years for me to get my act together. I mean, I went through college, you know, I feel like on a wing and a prayer, I took my insulin. So I never got went to the point where I didn't take my insulin, but there was a lot of but I was eating whatever I literally whatever I want it. And it wasn't like it was that much. But it was like you need to be 10. And I wasn't testing I would go like here and test myself. And then when I got out of college, I started a job in Providence, Rhode Island. And I was working out a lot then. So things my sugar level was probably much better in was lower, but I was having insulin reactions all the time. And then when I moved to Atlanta, and I met this doctor barzilay. And that's when he told me you can do this, or you can do that. And what he did for me that was the most important thing was if you are comfortable with taking multiple injections a day, and with testing yourself all the time, you can do what you want. And that was the that was the breakthrough for me.   Stacey Simms  28:30 Right? Well, somebody gives you a plan of action, rather than saying, here's the older insulins that really don't work to your life. Here's a man. No, you followed that.   Helene Cooper  28:39 Yeah, better. No, it was great. Because once it's like, once I realized it was like if I know a knowledge is power, he if you're willing to take the shot, it's nothing I don't, it doesn't bother me. And testing my blood sugar doesn't bother me. And if he sees like, if you're willing to do that you can do you can live the way you want to live. So it's great.   Stacey Simms  28:59 Before I let you go, I'd love to talk a little bit more about the clinical trial. Okay. very beginning of it. Are you so far happy that you did it?   Helene Cooper  29:07 Yeah, I'm happy I did it. I want to be part of you know, I want to be part of the solution. No, I've none of us want to keep this going for it's like, we're all shut in and we want it over to right. And it's at some point with the you know, we're gonna have to take a vaccine anyway. So yeah, I'm glad I did it. Whether it's a placebo or a vaccine, I'd be if I dropped dead from it. I won't be glad but that I'm gonna be glad I did it. Right.   Stacey Simms  29:33 Well, there was a lot of skepticism. Yeah, people of all political persuasions, yes. races of all disease states. I mean, let's be clear, not singling anybody out here.   Helene Cooper  29:43 Any message for people listening who may have an opportunity like that to take part in a clinical trial and are hesitant follow the iron. You know, that's I'm I'm a big believer in science. So that's, I'm divorcing myself from the politics. I you know, the whole vaccine by election. De that's not even going to happen. That's irrelevant, you know, even if they have somebody, at most be an announcement, but that's not going to mean anything. And that's meaningless, you know. And so just stick to the just follow science. If we follow science, we'd be better off on COVID to begin with, and science is certainly what's keeping me alive. So,   Stacey Simms  30:19 next step for you is the second part of the vaccine. And then maybe we can follow up with you in a couple of months if that's okay. Happy to wonderful   Helene Cooper  30:28 and I'll be complaining that death they definitely gave me the placebo.   Stacey Simms  30:32 And I can give you my review of contagion.   Helene Cooper  30:34 My re review. Okay, you if you watch contagion, I will come on your show again. Alright, we'll do I've   Stacey Simms  30:39 seen it, but it's been a very long time. So we watch it. Oh, you   Unknown Speaker  30:43 won't sleep that night.   Stacey Simms  30:44 I don't sleep now. Helene, thank you so much for joining me. It was a real pleasure and so interesting, I appreciate it.   Helene Cooper  30:51 It was fun talking to you, Stacey.   Unknown Speaker  30:57 You're listening to Diabetes Connections with Stacey Simms.   Stacey Simms  31:03 More information about the Vaccine trials and about Helene story at Diabetes connections.com. Just click on this episode, click on the homepage for it. There is a transcript we do that for every episode starting this year, really excited about that people seem to really like it. And I started that in January of 2020. And I'll continue to do that. I'm also going to link up one of the many articles about the difficulty that scientists have had and researchers have had in recruiting black volunteers and other people of color to take part in these trials. And something to keep in mind is that the National Institutes of Health has suggested minorities be overrepresented in the testing at rates that are doubled for their percentage of the US population. So there's a lot more information on this as to why and how historically black medical institutions are getting involved. I thought that was very important. You know, of course, we're looking at this through the lens of type 1 diabetes. But this is something that as you listen, I think it's important to be aware of as well. And boy, do I appreciate her coming on and sharing her story. the good, the bad, the ugly, she got a lot of pushback, as you heard for that article. And I will follow up in a couple of weeks. And I'm assuming she will have the same amount of candor. Next time we talk. Tell me something good in just a moment. But first diabetes Connections is brought to you by Dexcom. And you know, we started using control IQ that is the Dexcom G6 Tandem pump software program back in late January of this year, and we're doing less work for better results. I'll say that again. less work better results with diabetes. And I say we but it really is all Benny at this point. I mean, he's 15. And you know, you think about when we first got the CGM just to show up on the pump. What was that 2017. And that was a cool feature, but it didn't do anything right. But that secret sauce in the control IQ that keeps Benny in range so much more. It really lightens the burden. I think that's the best way to describe it is a one C has come down it was already really good. We're just thrilled. Of course individual results may vary. To learn more, go to Diabetes connections.com and click on the Dexcom logo.   In Tell me something good this week. We have some fun things to share diversities and birthdays. A very, very happy birthday to the Dooley family and I'm going to wish a happy birthday to the whole family because parents Christina and Greg celebrating with their triplets, Mia, Isa and Max. And I cannot believe that these kids are 10 years old. You may know the Dooley’s better. As the Inspired by Isabella family. Isabella was diagnosed with type one as a toddler. And she and her family have just been a huge part of the diabetes online community of friends for life. So many things. And boy, these kids are just knocking it out of the park, each with their own personality and strengths of course and different hobbies. But they all really seem to come together to support Isa. Christina is one of these very creative moms. She does all the stuff that I never did or dreamed of doing. You know very crafty, very, very fun with costumes, lots of lawn stuff going on since they've been stuck at home I mean this 10th birthday. I'll see if she'll put a picture too in the Facebook group but you know number 10s all over their lawn and big cutouts for the kids hobbies. So a big Happy Birthday to the Dooley triplets to Mia Isa and Max. A big congratulations and a big diversity to Dennis Goldensohn. Dennis is a longtime listener and I first talked to him he's been on the show. I talked to him about reaching the age of 65 when Medicare kicks in, and we talked when he had just finished his first year on Medicare so I will link that up but I mentioning him now because he is celebrating 50 Two years of type 1 diabetes. And he posted in the Facebook group he has that Lilly medal that they give for, you know, for big milestones. And he wrote, Hey, everybody, thanks because he was getting a lot of really nice comments about it. The objective here is not to brag about an award, but to say yes, it is possible to live with T1D and live a productive and long life. Now that is worth bragging about and what is really possible lead by example, Dennis is also very active in JDRF. I was gonna say his local chapter, but I think we're all one chapter now in North Carolina. So he's in the Raleigh area, I'm in the Charlotte area, but he's also active as a mentor. And I really appreciate it. So congratulations, Dennis. Here's to many more healthy years. And thanks for sharing that with us. My episode last week with Jeannie Martin, who was diagnosed in the 1950s and has lived with type one for 66 years got a lot of attention. And it was it was just very well received. I mean, why not? She's fantastic. And I heard from other people who have lived with type one for a long time, who shared their stories. And Ron Doyle is one of those. He was diagnosed at age four in 1959. I am living life well. I'm a full time employee at age 65. I'm going to retire in my 70s. My Doc's told my parents, I would likely be dead before age six, but it's been a great life. And he writes, I still have all my toes at other important extremities. And Ron also shared I showed him an email back and said, Hey, thanks so much. Can I share this? And he replied, absolutely. Most people do all the good news they can get. He works full time as an IT guy, and he has a monthly radio show on tech. I'm going to link this up because his podcast, he says is tech for us gray hairs like me, I like to stay busy, Ron writes, and I will link up gray haired tech because I don't have any gray hair yet, Ron, but I probably could benefit from your podcast. And I'll put that in the show notes as well. If you have a good news story, a diversity of birthday something cool, you've done a big milestone you know, a marathon or you've you've got up Mount Everest, whatever you want to share with the community. Just reach out and let me know you can always find to be Stacey at Diabetes connections.com. Or you can post in the Facebook group every once in a while I will ask for more good news stories. I love hearing from you. Thank you so much.   My new segment innovation is all about tips and tricks, listener suggestions to make life a little bit easier with diabetes. And sometimes the innovations are big clinical trials approvals, that sort of thing. This week, I want to talk a little bit about organization with a great bit of advice I got from Susan Wiener. She is very well known in the diabetes community. She was the 2015 Diabetes Educator of the Year she's a registered dietician nutritionist, a certified diabetes educator, she's, she's the best I love Susan, I'm lucky enough to call her a friend. One of the things that she told me and she has a great book too. It's called the complete diabetes organizer. And well, that book has so much advice in it, we're just gonna focus on one little thing here. And that is being able to see what you've got in terms of diabetes supplies. So if that means you're taking the stuff out of the box doesn't mean we know we get pump supplies or Dexcom supplies or even insulin, it's in a box that you cannot see through. So her advice is to put it in a clear plastic box so you can see from the outside. Or if you really can't tell at least Mark what it is on the outside, you know, tape a piece of paper and use a sharpie and write on it or use a clear plastic shoe bag, you can put individual supplies there. I've seen people put snacks in it so the kids can get what they want, you know carb counted, snacks are separated, you know, however you want to do in your household, but everybody can see. And the one thing I would add to that is whatever you do if you're taking your diabetes supplies out of boxes, and I do this because I also use Gosh, speaking of organized, here's a little plug I use the T1Dgear, folks, there's a really wonderful small homegrown business, and they do 3d printing. And I'll link that up in the show notes as well but I use their stuff a lot. But you have to take everything out of the box, you've got to keep the labels if you need the lot number if you have an issue if you need the serial number of your Dexcom you know all this stuff. So if you don't have room to keep the actual boxes, and you're not a big like Ripper offer, a lot of people hate to keep those little strands of paper, you know, like I'll just shoot I'll rip off the front where it has all of the information or cut it out neatly. I don't cut anything neatly, I clawed off like an animal. But you could also take a photo, take a picture with your phone have the lot number and all of the information. And that way you'll know what goes with what and that way if you have to call in a Dexcom replacement or you have a box of pump in sets that are not working correctly. You'll have the information in front of you and you can call it in it's all well and good to get organized. But if you can't see when you're running out of something, and then I know the people with little kids don't get it yet, but when your teenager uses the left decks calm and doesn't tell you and leaves The box in the storage area, right or uses the last pump inset, and just hasn't said anything. I didn't realize it was the last one. That's where the yoga and meditation comes in. So you can use these tips maybe to avoid those kinds of situations. And thanks again to Susan Wiener. I'll link up that episode to Gosh, I think it's about two years, maybe longer. Now, since we've talked, it was a great episode about getting diabetes organized. I love her. Thank you so much for listening to this episode of Diabetes Connections. We have a lot of great stuff coming up. In fact, I have so much, I might have just more bonus episodes. I don't know I'm sifting through personal stories and sports stories and technology stuff. It seems like towards the end of the year, you know, we take a breath in August and the beginning of September, and then it's just a race to December. And that's how it's going this year. So I'll keep you posted. But please join the Facebook group. That's where I put most of my questions for you and pulling in that sort of stuff. Thank you to my editor John Bukenas from audio editing solutions. Thank you so much as you listen, I'm Stacey Simms. I'll see you back here next week. Until then, be kind to yourself.   Benny  41:11 Diabetes Connections is a production of Stacey Simms Media. All rights reserved. All rounds avenged

Mike Savage was convicted of 89 counts of money laundering, mail fraud, wire fraud, tax fraud and sentenced to 17 and a half years in federal prison. He's a former radio personality, television news anchor, and has been described as a criminal mastermind. These days he's an adjunct professor teaching Bible Theology and Psychology, and co-hosts A Savage Perspective podcast with his wife Cynthia, Mike authored the book, A Prisoner's Perspective: Redemption of a Criminal Mastermind.   Website: https://www.mikesavagebooks.com/Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/mikesavagebooks/Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/mcsavage89/Twitter: https://twitter.com/mikesav78418   (Transcript is a guide only and may not be 100% correct.) Emily OlsenWherever there are shadows, there are people ready to kick at the darkness until it bleeds daylight. This is Bleeding Daylight with your host Rodney Olsen. Rodney Olsen  Welcome to Bleeding Daylight. Just a quick reminder that you can find Bleeding Daylight wherever you listen to podcasts, and you can connect with us on Facebook, Instagram and Twitter. Today’s guest was convicted of 89 counts of money laundering, mail fraud, wire fraud, tax fraud and sentenced to 17 and a half years in federal prison. His remarkable story of life transformation and a wife who stood by him throughout everything is inspiring. Mike Savage was jailed for his beliefs. His beliefs were that he could get away with his crimes without getting caught. He's a former radio personality, television news anchor, and has been described as a criminal mastermind. These days he's an adjunct professor teaching Bible Theology and Psychology, and co hosts A Savage Perspective podcast with his wife Cynthia, Mike authored the book, A Prisoner's Perspective: Redemption of a Criminal Mastermind. Today, we get to explore his colorful life on Bleeding Daylight. Mike, thank you so much for your time. Mike Savage  Well, it's a pleasure to be here. Thank you for inviting me. Rodney Olsen  I know that the question on everyone's mind is what did he do to get sent to prison? Tell me about the days before you were caught. Mike Savage  The best way to put it I try not to go into too much detail for two reasons. One, I don't want to glorify my sin and second, I don't want to give anybody any ideas of what to do to make extra money. I was a radio talk show host I was making very little money doing that in the 1980s when I was approached to do some work overseas which had to do with transferring large sums of money. It could be cash, sometimes other types of wire transfers, that sort of thing. Well, I made a little money to begin with and then suddenly discovered, you know, there's a lot more that could be made. So I got involved with doing that and so it was international money laundering. And then, in the United States, there's two there were two forms of money laundering. One was just general money laundering, and the other was international money laundering. I was convicted of both 89 counts of money laundering, mail fraud, wire fraud, tax fraud and so the sentence was 17 and a half years in federal prison. Rodney Olsen  And I'm wondering now, about those people who knew you at the time, I imagine they didn't even know that this was going on. So this would have been a real surprise, especially for those people who were used to listening to Mike on the radio. He's a good guy, and suddenly you sent off to prison. Mike Savage  Right? Well, no one knew what I was doing. My family didn't know the people that I was working with the time did not No, I had two lives. I had one the the family man, the working guy was working in Napa, California at the time on a radio station there. And no one had any idea. None whatsoever. I mean, I kept it totally away from them. The other side was the criminal side, which was an entirely as a Jekyll Hyde type of personality. The nice guy, the funny guy who was on the radio, the controversial guy on the radio suddenly became an entirely different person when it came to running a crime business and, and necessarily, so you can't be a nice guy when you're criminal, and being around other criminals. And so there was two different distinct Mike Savages at that time. Both liars, both cheating doing things that he shouldn't have been doing. I want to make this clear I accept responsibility for my crime I went to trial was proven guilty. I was guilty, I am guilty. I take responsibility. I don't want to downplay any of that, like, I was a nice guy to get caught up and stuff. That wasn't the case at all. I was not that people try to pay Oh, it wasn't a pretty nice guys. No, I was a liar. I was a liar. And I was really, really good at it. And until the Lord broke me down, I probably would have stayed on that path and ended up dead. But the amazing thing through all of this was that my wife, Cynthia, who had no idea what was going on, until the federal government, organized crime, Task Force, FBI, IRS, US Postal Service. Everybody came busting into our house, and she was six months pregnant at the time. And they took her away from it to reduce the stress. They told me that until you talk with us, we're not bringing her back. Well, they actually took her to breakfast, you know, they're being hard guys. And so my choice at that point was to I could have confessed and gotten much Last time, but instead I became the tough guy. And so this thing drew out and dragged out for over two years before we actually went to trial. Rodney Olsen  So that day, this is the time that your wife finds out of what's been going on, you say that you weren't prepared to admit it to the authorities who came busting down your door. What did you say to your wife? Mike Savage  I told her it was a mistake. They had the wrong person. I lied. I was a liar. I was unsaved. I was I was trying to cover my tracks trying to figure a way out of this and so I lied, and because she loves me so much, and she stayed with me through the entire incarceration. She's with me today in the other room, right? We're still together. And I got out in 2007. She loved me so much. She went along with with what I was saying she she would believe and that was it. It wasn't until much later that I would confess anything to her. That's after I'd been in prison for over two years. Rodney Olsen  So at that stage, she believes that an innocent man has been sent to prison. She has no idea at this point that you were absolutely guilty. Mike Savage  Yeah, that's right. And she was raising our children at the same time and sacrificing to come see me visit me in prison every other weekend. six hour drive each way six and a half hour drive from where she was living in the in the Napa area to Lompoc, California. So yeah, I was I was a rotten guy, truly a rotten guy. Rodney Olsen  And what did that do to the trust in your relationship? When finally you admitted that over those two years of getting to trial, and then a couple of years into the sentence, all these years of continuing that lie? And you suddenly say, Well, actually, I did it. What happened to the trust between the two of you? Mike Savage  It grew, it grew because she has always been trustworthy. To me and our relationship always been trustworthy, even though when I was trying to come up with reasons we should divorce While I was in prison, all this type of thing, she wouldn't have any of that at all. This is the the book honestly started out as an homage to her, and quickly morphed into oh my gosh, this is all about God. Only God could do this. Only God could bring a woman into my life before I got caught. Stay with me after I got caught through all the lies through all the stuff, stay faithful to me. And when I finally told her, she forgave me, she forgave me. Rodney of all of all the things I expected forgiveness was not one of them. But that was what came absolutely, totally, completely. And our relationship grew from from then on even further. If it could, I mean, it just it it mushroomed after that the idea of being able to just confess and say yeah, you know, look, I was I was bad. I got caught up and stuff. I had no business getting caught up in And I mean, the title of the book, the whole thing of the criminal mastermind is irony in the 1980s, and in the United States, they had this war on drugs and so forth. And I was convicted under drug statutes, even though drugs weren't part of the crime and every person that had more than one person working for them, was considered a criminal mastermind in the indictments. It was a it was like a template that was filled out if there was a kid on the street slinging drugs to and he had two or three people that work for him. He was a criminal mastermind it was the is the irony that everybody's a criminal mastermind at that particular time. I wasn't a criminal mastermind, I'd never been in trouble in my life. I just got greedy, and I fell for it and it was exactly the wrong thing to do. But it was a decision that I made willingly. I wasn't tricked, or duped into it. And then once I found out I was pretty good at it, then I expanded the enterprise and went from there. So that was, you know, that's just the way it is. I mean, I saw somebody say something about, you know, Mike never takes acceptance of response, but I did read the book, you know, I, I'm thinking I'm losing everything, including my wife and instead, God gave me the greatest gift, you know, eternal life and returned me to my wife. We've just continued to grow since then. Rodney Olsen  And I imagine that label of criminal mastermind is really a masterstroke by the police because as soon as you're labeled, that you're going into court and assumed to be guilty if you're being called at a criminal mastermind, and still, they have to prove the guilt and, and obviously, as you've said, that was there but that's a great way to put the jury on your side right from the start, Mike Savage  Right? This this type of crime will never have to we have to stand up to that stop. It'll never happen again. I mean, come on. I was before Bernie Madoff or any of these other people are doing anything and and it didn't stop or slow down. Anything people are going to send because they're centers, there's gonna be crime because there's criminals. You're not going to make an example. I mean, here in the US, and I'm not sure about Australia, we have the capital punishment or that sort of thing. But in the United States, certain states do. And there's even a federal law that allows under certain circumstances, but people are still killing people. Even though there's there's the capital punishment. So it speaks to the inherent evilness of man's heart. Mine in particular. I mean, it was a dark dark place, Rodney, it wasn't a again, I don't come across as Oh, I was a nice guy. I really was not a nice guy. There's a lot of things I wouldn't tell you about because I don't think the audience would be ready to hear that. When God reached down he had to come down a long way to grab hold of Mike Savage. Rodney Olsen  You said that you had to eventually admit your guilt to your wife. Was there a part of you that found it difficult to even admit that to yourself? Were you kidding yourself to some degree and thinking, well, this is all justified, I need to make a living and this is my way to do it? Or did you just know straight out, I'm absolutely guilty? Mike Savage  No, I lied to myself. I felt like I was caught up in something that I couldn't get out of. I'll be honest with you I prayed even when I was an unbeliever I remember praying the last couple of years before I got caught caught please get me out of this. This this is let me just get out of this. This is this is killing me this double life is I got to get out of this and the answer the prayer because I got I got arrested and put in prison. I was out of it. And I'm not making a joke there. I'm serious. I mean, that was that was an answered prayer. I see it now as an answered prayer. But at the time. My whole thought process was justification. I'm justifying this. This is what I do. If it was against the law, I would have been caught or I would know that it was against the law. All the justification in the world I would pour into my, but knowing deep down inside you know, that's a lie Mike. But going against that, no, no, no, I got to keep going. Gotta keep going. Gotta keep going. And I had people dependent on me, not just my family. But the crime people that I was they were dependent on me. So trying to stop wasn't really an option. I needed someone to help and God did help. I mean, there was that's a thorough cut when you go to prison. That's it. There's no coming back on this type of thing for me. I don't know what had been happened would have happened if I hadn't been saved in prison. I don't know what would have happened when I got out, or if I would have gotten out, you know, because it was just it was a dark, dark time where there's just no hope whatsoever of change. But initially, it was all justification. This is what I do. This is who I am. It's gonna be fine. I can handle this. All the lies you tell when you're trying to justify sin. Rodney Olsen  And as for the money that you are making, through your, your job as a criminal mastermind. All this money. How much did you make and how did you hide that away from the people that knew you? Mike Savage  in the 80s it really wasn't that much of a problem. Remember? There's no cell phones, there was no internet, the most advanced technology was faxing things from from one place to another. So moving money around was extremely easy transferring from one bank to a bank overseas or bank overseas to places in the United States. It wasn't a difficulty at all. I mean, that there weren't these limits on how much you can transfer now without reporting it to the Internal Revenue Service here in the US. So those laws and those things weren't in effect at that time. The amount that I was convicted of was $2 million, which back then was was quite, I mean, still quite a bit. Now. What am I saying? But I mean, back then it was even it was meant even more, but there was considerably more than that. That was moved around and that I got commissions on being able to do stuff. And the government traced virtually every penny of it and any property that we had that I had at the time, was seized and forfeited to the federal government. The banks overseas they talk about they have all the secrecy, you know, They rolled over instantly when the federal government asked them for the information. So they were able to track it, but it was they they got all the money that was left at the time of things that I hadn't bought or, or given to others or that sort of thing. It was it was millions of dollars. And it was it was very easy to do back. Rodney Olsen  You mentioned that you had an encounter with God whilst you were in prison, that he did answer the prayer that you prayed even before knowing if he was real or not and so often I find that that's the way that we pray for an answer, and we get the answer we didn't expect, but that is the answer that God brings. Mike Savage  Right. Rodney Olsen  How far into your jail term did that actually happen? Mike Savage  It was it was about two and a half years in. So the first I was first sent to the penitentiary in Lompoc, California. You know, it was classified as white collar criminal, all this kind of stuff, a civilian organized crime. They never proved any of that but I mean, they sent me to accidentally sent me to the penitentiary that they had misclassified my level of security supposed to be sent to a correctional institution which is a low, but I was sent to a very high level prison. So I was there for a short time till that got changed. And that I was transferred to the Federal Correctional Institution in Lompoc, which is right across the street from penitentiary. And I was assigned to the kitchen duty where I quickly ingratiated myself with some people there and began making alcohol for sale to the other prisoners. It's called pruno. And it was made with bread and yeast and sugar and I won't give the recipe out someone by trying it and going blind. But we would make that and so I had a little side hustle going on doing that I was also one of the guys making book, you know, for taking bets on football games and baseball games, basketball games, all that kind of stuff. So I fell right back into a criminal lifestyle. So I got into prison. So that was I was it was great. You know, it was where I got this. Now I can do this for the next you know, few years. But then about 18 months in I get transferred out of the kitchen where I was doing all this stuff to the chapels office the chaplains office and I became the lead chapel clerk. And I I didn't ask for the transfer obviously and and I went in and asked the chaplain, Why are you transferring me in here? Because I saw you on the on the compound he says, you know, Holy Spirit spoke to me about you and so I'm I wanted you to come work for me. And I said I look I don't know God I don't know any other stuff. You know, I've got time to do I'm not trying to sit around with a bunch of Bible thumpers or you know, Quran thumpers because like 13 different religious groups there you know from Muslims, Jews, Mormons, Jehovah Witness, Wiccans, all these Catholics, everything that you can think of right? So I don't want to be around people. Come on. He says now just give it a try. So I'm there and I know you gave me the responsibility for being in service. And then after the services are over with making sure everything was straightened out, everything was sorted, everything's cleaned out, ready for the next group ready for whatever was going to be coming in. And so over a period of six months, I'm going to all these different services, right? And not just Protestant service, I'm going to all of them and thinking this is the worst job in the world. Everybody thinks they're right. Everybody's got away to God, and we got to do this. You got to do that. Come on, come on. So the thing that I hated most was going to Protestant services. Because there was always this altar call at the end, where you know, you want to accept Jesus Christ as your Savior, come forward, say this prayer, you'll be saved and I'm like, okay, right. I'm sitting in the back. And it was it had been a particularly rugged week for me. I'd argued with Cynthia, I wanted to divorce or over the phone and so I want to divorce now you're not going to divorce me? She was she's just adamant, there's not gonna be a divorce. So I'm miserable. I've got, you know, a million years left on my sentence. I mean, this is 1990s I don't get out until 2007. And I'm thinking, you know, that's Buck Rogers time back since 2000. Oh, that's far, far away. And I'm miserable and depressed and angry because I can't make the pruno anymore. I'm upset about not being able to involve the gambling and do any of this stuff at all. And I sat through so many of these Protestant services, I probably could have given the sinner's prayer, even being an unbeliever. It's just and so this particular night, I'm angry, I'm depressed, frustrated, I'm sitting in the back waiting for these guys, just the volunteers that come in and, you know, volunteers before come in and see me and let me pray for you. They put their hands on, oh, God tells me you're not going to do any more of your sentence. You're going to go home soon. And you know, truly rockin it every single day of my sentence, so none of their prophesizing work but I didn't know at the time I was just irritated. Just Just a miserable person. As I'm sitting In the back and vice of rotten week, I said, You know what, God, I'll tell you what if you're real, if you really are real, and all this stuff I've been hearing for these months is true. Show me something. Just show me something. And the guy's going into the sinner's prayer at the same time, and I'm just seeing it together. Show me something. Because I don't. This is his last chance. Show me something. And Rodney, I started crying. I don't cry. I'm not a crier. Never been a crier. But I start crying not not like crying, but like, weeping. And all I can describe, and I don't expect everybody to go through this. I don't expect a lot of people necessarily gonna believe me when I say this, but suddenly it's like a synapse in my brain that had been dormant fired and all those sermons I sat through, and all those things teaching seminars that I sat through and all the stuff that I was so miserable having to do. I suddenly understood, I got it. I understood and I, and I believed. It made sense to me for some reason, while I'm weeping like a baby, this, I'm a big guy, I'm 6'3" at the time, I was like, 280, now I'm 220 Thank You, Jesus. But this big old guy weeping in the back, and actually believing for the first time, not only in God, that God loved me. And I just, that's how I that's how I got saved. As I don't everybody goes through that I'm just this is just what happened to me. It's just what happened to me. And it was at synapse firing. All that stuff filtered through. I could understand what was being said. I wanted a closer relationship with with this person, who when I asked him to prove something to me, made me cry. You know, I've just kept my head down, waiting for everybody to leave. Now, usually the volunteers come and we say something. Nobody said he left. And so I finished up cleaning up the thing left with back to the, to the to the cell, and just laid there quietly, trying to figure this stuff out. A couple of days later had to go back to work. I go in and see the chaplain, I say, Look, let me tell you what happened. So I told him, he said, I've been waiting for that. Like, it's just, I've been waiting for this, Mike, this is this is great news don't. And I said, Well, that's, that's great news for you. But I have no idea what to do. I said, I am I supposed to go to every Bible study? I'm supposed to go every service one, what am I supposed to do? And he said, Just be patient. This is let's let's let's pray together. And we did. And let's see what God would have you do. About a week later, I was enrolled in seminary because I wanted to know If, like in the first chapter of John, when it says that, that Jesus is God, I remembered from the Jehovah Witnesses when they read it so that Jesus was a god. So the first thing I wanted to do was see in the Greek what it actually said, he says, we're gonna need to go to seminary. I said, Yeah, give me the Strong's Concordance, and let's go through this. And so when I saw, I said, Okay, then I was in, then I, all I wanted to do was learn. And I was 30 something years old. And all I wanted to do was learn about God. And so over the next, you know, what was 13 years? That's all I did was I learned, I went to seminary. I got my degrees. I'm trying to figure out okay, when I get out what am I called to do? And the chaplain was gone by then other chaplains are talking, Oh, God, I'll show you that. But you're called to be a Pastor Mike. And I was saying, that's cool. You know, that's great. I only have to work on what Wednesday to do a Bible study. And then Sunday, I preach and I'm rest of the week mine pretty much, right? So I had obviously, I had no clue as to what a pastor did. But I became a teacher. And I began teaching the other inmates and stuff that I was learning. And, you know, I would preach, got to the point when I transferred Finally, when my custody dropped far enough down, I was transferred to a camp in Taft, California. And we put together a choir, and we would go out and sing in the local churches, and I would preach, and it was, so it Okay, well, you know, I'm not, I'm an okay, preacher, I don't know. But I'm really a teacher and a counselor because I was counseling guys and doing things like that. And so it was it was a metamorphosis, you know, over the over the period of time from from this cocoon of prison to where coming out, you know, what am I going to be? Am I going to be, you know, an ugly duck might be a butterfly, you know, what's this and you shouldn't be the person I want you to be like, and so that's kind of in a nutshell, from you just asked me about salvation, but I kind of felt like you need to see the whole story of how it played out. It wasn't a Oh, I've got this now. My life has changed. This is a road to Damascus thing. There was no road to Damascus God had me do every single day of my time. And my wife waited for me every single day of that time, and suffered greatly by doing so. But she stayed nonetheless. And I mean, that's kind of tell you, I mean, it's amazing that our youngest child became a police officer a year and a half ago. How's that? People say God doesn't have a sense of humor. How's that for a sense of humor, but I mean, it's just been kind of a that type of a metamorphosis is taking place. Rodney Olsen  So you were able to undertake those seminary courses whilst you're in prison. I guess that's one way of making sure that you have the time to study. Mike Savage  Yeah, you know, I'm I don't know how many people you know, who have read all of Calvin's Institute's who've read most of the Pentecostal literature on preaching worship, teaching that story. thing, read through most of the word biblical commentaries, I went through all those. When I wasn't in the chapel. I was either at the weight pile, or I was in myself reading books. And if I could get away with reading books while I was on duty at the chapel, I did that too. I mean, I, I read every commentary I could get my hands on. I read different versions of the Bible. I learned the the Greek and the Hebrew writings, I can't pronounce it people laugh at me when I try and read it out loud because I didn't have anybody teaching me how to save the words. But that and I did some time with a priest and he was walking me through the Latin rights and Latin masses and, and going through those things. And so I had this this opportunity to get a world class education doing that. I was just amazed. You know, what I look back now. I'm amazed. But it was it was a rare opportunity. And I'm really glad I took that time to be able to read rather than you know, just In the stuff that I was starting out doing, Rodney Olsen  it certainly has been a big change around. And you mentioned that initial chaplain who saw you out there and just felt the Holy Spirit saying, There's something about this guy, you need some sort of connection. Do you ever get a chance to catch up with him once you left prison? Mike Savage  Thank goodness for Facebook, right? He found me. He knew when I was getting out, and we weren't allowed to communicate while I was in prison, but he had retired. And when I got out, he contacted me. So we have been in contact. This is just a wonderful, wonderful man of God. And there was there's another chaplain that I met at Taft that I'm still in contact with also he's retired as well. Just wonderful men of God that were instrumental in keeping me on the right path when I got to Taft, that there were some extreme rough edges because I'd been at higher level institutions and going into a camp it was entirely different. I had higher level institutions swearing is de rigueur, you know, it's part of the the process. So he, he had to work on my swearing, I had a tendency to, I felt like there were certain times where only a certain word would do you know, and I know that sounds strange for Christians but I have saved in prison I was educated in prison. So the the rough and he he worked as hard as he could to get those rough edges off of me and and I have to give him a lot of credit for, for having a lot of patience. There was times I would just I was amazed at some of the stuff that people would say that were the lower level institution. I mean, it's as low as it was no fence around it, not the walk off if you wanted to. But I mean, the people who come in were just straight from the streets where I've been in prison for over a decade. So if there was some some fisticuffs and other things that occurred just kind of leave it at that, but he I'm telling you, Rodney was the the Mike Savage of today is entirely different than the one that made it into that prison camp at the end for the final two years of a sense of Oh man, so that it's a It was a process and God always put the right people there to take care of that. Rodney Olsen  There is a thought for some people that once you come to meet with God, you accept Jesus. There's that salvation that we talk about in Christian circles, that life gets pretty sweet after that. But you're saying that that's not quite the case. You still had to serve out that sentence. And that goes against the way that some people would like to believe. Mike Savage   I had guys tell me, you just need to claim your way out of here. You just need to claim your way out Mike because God loves you. I said, show me one person that's claimed their way out of prison. Just one. I said, let's take a look at the scriptures. You know, where did Paul end up? Where did Peter end up? In prison. As if there's anybody that could have walked out? It's those two but they chose to stay. Why? Because their faith in God. I have faith in God that he's going to make now there weren't times that I wasn't still talking to Father and saying, hey, look, you know, this is this is good to go. I'm ready to go. But the thing is that the books that I read one of them was the practice of his presence by Brother Lawrence. Are you familiar with that book? Rodney Olsen  I've certainly heard of it. Yes. Mike Savage  Oh, that's the only way I pray anymore is this constant conversation I mean, whether I'm, you know, scooping dog poop in the backyard, or whether I'm cooking dinner, or whether the Bible open in front of me, He and I are in a conversation. When I teach prayer. When I teach the theology of prayer, one of the first things I tell the students is, from here on out for this for this semester, when you finish praying to God, do not say amen. Unless you're praying over food, because we don't want the food to get cold but other than that, we're forbidden from saying amen, because that's like hanging up the phone. You're done. Maybe he's not. And so would you be in conversation? And the first time I said that, I got reported to the Academic Dean who calls me to his office, I'm teaching heresy. I explained to him what I said, and he says I've never thought of that. That's a good point. And so the first lesson is for them. I want you to sit there for one minute, close your eyes and think about nothing but God just just got for one minute. Everything else is gone. Close your eyes. I'm timing. And of course, I'm a big guy. So these students are intimidating in prison. So they are their best right? At the end of one minute, okay, who was able to keep their mind on God for one minute without any intrusive thoughts, and whoever raises their hand, I'm going to call a liar, because there was no way you could do that. It takes practice. It takes effort. It takes building a relationship where you can be in conversation, and I learned that from Brother Lawrence. And Brother Lawrence said that even when he would forget when he would get caught up in the mundane things of life, God would call him back and we've got did call him back by the Lord's didn't have to fall down and apologize, guys, I know how you're from. Let's just continue where you left off. And they would have that communication. The same way Jesus did with his disciples when they were walking to me that was prayer. They're walking and talking to me, you're talking to God, that's perfect. He's talking back. That's the best form of prayer. So Those types of books made a big difference in my life. I didn't learn that in seminary. I just found the book and read it. It happened to be in the prison library. And it was it was a life changer for me. I mean, I walk around the backyard talking to God out loud. And occasionally some of the neighbors say you're talking to me. I know. Sorry. I was just thinking out loud cuz I don't tell him talking to God because I don't want him to think I'm crazy, right? But I do. Talk to him just like that every day. Walk around the house, my dogs will look at me. They know he's talking to God. He's not talking to us. My wife puts up with it, which is brilliant. I don't even realize I'm talking out loud to God but he brought me through so much. Why am I gonna give up on him now? Why? Why wouldn't I keep praying that way? Is our life terrific? Yeah. Because we're together. Doesn't mean we have millions of dollars or any of that type of thing. Sometimes it's tough to find a job, you know, for an ex con, who's a professor, an adjunct professor, rather than being a tenured professor. Sometimes it's tough, but he's never let us down. We went through hurricane Harvey a few years ago had bunch of stuff destroyed. God built it right back up. Went through another hurricane a couple of months ago. God was right there with his to do it again. And so it's kind of hard to doubt him. After all I've been through over the time being in prison and looking back and seeing what He did, it is hard to doubt that He's not going to do the right thing moving forward. So I mean, why would I doubt that will be the reason for that. He's never let me down before Why would he suddenly do that? Rodney Olsen  At the end of your sentence, you're released and even though your wife Cynthia has stood by you all this time, was it like studying a new relationship coming out and having to set boundaries again and, and just begin again, from a new point? Mike Savage  To a degree. Now understand when I left to go to prison, there was no cell phones, internet. Starbucks was just kind of starting type of stuff in California. When I get out, she hands me a cell phone. As I don't need his cell phone. I need to call anybody No, for 15 years you had to call me I wouldn't be able to call you. Okay. All right, I'm cell phone. I thought the internet was like a big library that everything was true on it. You can look stuff up. So I was anxious to to try that. But my behavior in prison. I'll give you an example. I got home shortly before Thanksgiving. And on Thanksgiving, the whole family came over right there stand in the house and I was talking all this. Well, 10 o'clock at night, you know, I was tired. So I went to bed. And Rodney when I say went to bed. I just got up and left and went to the bedroom, went to bed. And I got up the next morning. And Cynthia says, Are you mad? I said mad, what would I be mad about? I'm happy. I'm home. You know, this is great. I'm happy to be with you. You went to bed last night. You didn't say good night to anyone. Well in prison, you don't go around. Okay, night night, everybody. I didn't even dawn on me and I suddenly realize That that, you know, they talk about being institutionalized the idea that you become used to routines and institutions so you carry them with you. That's exactly what it happened. And so I had to learn to do those sort of things. Another example of that a few weeks later, Cynthia and our youngest son, we're going to the grocery store, get out the car, walk in a parking lot. This lady comes running up to Cynthia with a clipboard, asking if she registered to vote. And Cynthia is very polite, very elegant woman professional. She's director of case management for three hospitals here in Corpus Christi. Just a terrific lady. She goes, Yes, I have. Thank you. Okay. And so Jessie and I are beginning to talk. I mean, he's, he's a teenager. And so we were kind of struggling to establish a rapport. Me being there all the time. So we're talking about sports, we're talking about American football. And so we're going back and forth about football. We're still talking or walking up the street. There. All of a sudden ladies in front of me says, Did you register to vote? I just walked around or continue talking to Jesse. And we kept going. She comes around a second time gets right in front of me. I said, Did you register to vote? And I just walk around again, still talking to Jesse, third time, almost to the store. She She comes around, answer me, did you register to vote, but you don't point at people in prison like that you don't get in their face like that. I mean, it's just not something that's done unless you're looking for a fight. And so I informed her loudly that I was an ex con, I wasn't going to be able to vote, and that I just had 15 years in prison and the she needed to not stand in front of it. Only I used a lot of swear words to do it loudly and I'm a Christian at the time. Okay. But this is I'm acting, I'm acting out, you know, like, and so she kind of withers and goes away. I see Cynthia pull up the hood on her jacket and go into the store quickly. Jesse is my youngest son just beaming. He's, he's so happy. smiling. His old man just, you know, swore at this lady. I, you know, there's a little bit of the Holy Spirit convicting me. But sometimes the Holy Spirit wouldn't convict me until there was a lesson that had to be learned in the right lesson, the right person that we learned that lesson was there. Excuse me. Well, when I walk in, Cynthia's got her hood up. Got the grocery cart, trying to speed away, Hey, where are you going? Come here, come here. Let me let me push that for you. And it's what's wrong? And she said, you just you realize that you just very loudly swore at this lady and told everyone in hearing range that you're an ex con. Yeah. She said, there's nothing wrong with that, other than the swearing and being loud is nothing wrong being an ex con. But she says the people who heard you, they don't know what you did to go to prison. So they might think they're in the presence of a murderer or rapist or child abuser or something like that. You might consider that in the future beforehand. And that's when the Holy Spirit came said, Yeah, like, come on. Settle down. trust in me. Let me guide you a little. I had to learn that lesson that way. So there were a couple of times that I can remember right off the top of my head. That things did not go well. Yeah, I was a Christian. Yeah, I was saved. Yes, I believe all of those things, but I still had to change coming out of prison. So Cynthia and I, my relationship was great. She would support me through anything. But the children were kind of like, Who is this guy? Now? Well, Jessie loved the idea of the tough guy, ex con dad coming out. Daughter, not as much, oldest son not as much. So I had to learn to readapt into society. At the same time, be true to God, and be true to who he made me, which is sometimes I can be maybe a little loud or sometimes I can be a little, you know, demonstrative and in how I talk and I don't mean swearing, but I mean, I get close. Stop. I hardly ever do it from the pulpit anymore, right? No, I'm just kidding. I've. But it's one of those things I had to get back into me. Because I was a guy from the 80s coming out in 2007. You know, I it was rough inside prison. I mean, it's not I've been through riots. I've been through solitary confinement more times than I can count, but I never went to solitary confinement until after I was a Christian. Because I was always under suspicion for something because with the stuff that I used to do, I wasn't doing more so he must be doing something worse. So there was a change and things had to occur and I had to grow as a person as God wanted me to be outside of prison. And and that's that's been an ongoing process. Rodney Olsen  Tell me a little of what life is like now. Very different to those prison days. And I'm sure that God is still teaching you lessons. But what does life look like for you today? Mike Savage  When I turned 60, which was a year and a half ago. I thought, Okay, that's it. I'm done. You know, that's it. It's 60 that's old. You're finished. You know, we're going to, okay, I'm going to retire, and then slowly fade away. But it's, it's it hasn't been that way at all. I wrote the memoir. I've written a novel that I'm working on now. I finished up a dissertation for my doctorate in psychology over the last few years. And so today I'm an adjunct professor, I teach online, occasionally I go into the classroom. I enjoy being in the classroom. I enjoy teaching students and and challenging them and having fun with them. But I enjoy the time alone with God. I can see what was so appealing to to Francis Merton and his writings a Roman Catholic monk, a Trappist monk, about that this solitude of being God. And so there are days when I have contact with them. No one but Cynthia, and I can, I'm content with that. There are other days that I'll have me doing interviews, or we'll be interviewing people have classes, and I'm busy going back and forth. And it's fine. But any problems that arise, I always put into the perspective of what I've been through in the past and how God was faithful with that. And I've been in prison riots where, you know, things got ugly in a hurry, and he still protected me. And so, I always give the example of this way in prison when they say that brother is gonna stab you in the back. They mean it literally. It's not like it's not a metaphor of, he's going to say something bad about you. So there's this perspective that I've been that I've been given by God, that it's okay to be alone. Because you're not alone because you're with God. It's okay if if people don't always remember your name or they're not struck by this interview or by reading one of your books are. That's okay. That's okay. And so my life is one of pleasant solitude at times of pleasant action at times, but of trying my best to be led by God and whatever he wants me to do it and sometimes that's moment to moment because sometimes I can get a little restless, I'll admit. And that's time of Okay, we'll pick up the guitar. You know, let's just talk Mike why you play your little chords, or, you know, let's let's write some more. Let's edit some more. This is a quiet more contemplative time and I've described it to Cynthia as being in solitary confinement, with privileges. But I mean, it's a good life. Our children are all grown. We have five grand sons. It's an enjoyable life because I see it through how God wants me to see it in times that I get restless. I realize I'm just being kind of a knucklehead and just to settle down. Rodney Olsen  I'm going to put some links to your website in the show notes at bleeding daylight dotnet. But for anyone listening, what's the easiest way for them to get in touch with you? They want to pick up a copy of your book and delve further into your story or listen to the podcast. Where should they go? Mike Savage  Well, I made it pretty simple. If they want to buy the book, it's on Amazon. It's called a prisoner's perspective, the redemption of a criminal mastermind. So it's right there on Amazon. If you're interested in finding out more about me or for whatever reason that may be, you can go to MikeSavageBooks.com. That's, that's the website and I'm also on Facebook and Twitter and Instagram. And I'm not a master of any of those, but I am capable of returning messages. So if I can at least do that, but the that's the best way to get in touch. I appreciate your you're putting those out there. Thank you, Rodney very much, Rodney Olsen  Mike. It has been a delight hearing your story to hear where you've come from and where God has you headed and I'm sure that the story is not over yet but thank you so much for your time today on Bleeding Daylight. Mike Savage  Thank you very much. Emily OlsenThank you for listening to Bleeding Daylight. Please help us to shine more light into the darkness by sharing this episode with others. For further details and more episodes, please visit BleedingDaylight.net 

Happiness. It’s 2020 and I have a feeling that many of us could use a dose of that. Right? Well, you’re in luck because Kim Strobel, happiness coach, joins me to talk about how to be happier. Happiness isn’t always born from unicorns and rainbows. In fact, you’ll hear how Kim’s happiness coaching was born out of her own trauma, darkness, and suffering.  Together we discuss toxic positivity, why turning off negative feelings isn’t helpful, and the importance of putting your happiness first. Kim also shares some of the happiness habits we can practice in order to increase happiness levels. Finally, we also explore the Arena of Bigness, what it means, and how to step into the Arena with courage and do really hard things.  In this episode you’ll hear: Kim opens up about her struggle with mental illness and what that looks like in her life now. (5:20) Why today’s culture of positivity and the conventional formula for happiness is wrong. (21:30) Putting your happiness and wellbeing at the forefront is of the utmost importance. (23:54) We all have a set baseline happiness default. Kim talks about how we can work to retrain the brain to feel happy even when struggling through tough times. (26:47) How somebody who feels as though they are living a small life can step out of that and into the Arena of Bigness. (42:08) http://yourkickasslife.com/354  

Expensive market? Busy with a career and other priorities? There are a lot of compelling reasons to consider turnkey investing in a more affordable area – where a local "operator" sells you a tenanted property designed to pump out cashflow from day one.All you have to do is "turn the key," hand things off to a property manager and... voilà! You're rich. You can now kick back and sip margaritas on the beach. Right?Well, it's a little more complicated... as you'll learn today from seasoned turnkey investors Whitney Hutten and Lance Robinson. Both have bought rental properties from turnkey operators in several different markets, and they tell us all about the highs and lows, reveal what they wish they would have known, and offer candid advice for anyone considering this niche.When you're done with this show, you'll know the exact questions savvy investors ask prospective turnkey providers about neighborhoods, construction warranties, property management contracts, and how operators handle evictions and major repairs. You'll also know how to handle a home inspection to ensure you know exactly what you're getting into!Look – there are a lot of turnkey operators active on the BiggerPockets forums. A lot of them are great teachers, too. But this episode is told from the investor/customer's perspective... and it's well worth a listen – or two!In This Episode We Cover:What turnkey investing isDoing due diligence to find a trusted turnkey operator Why it's always worth flying out to walk the property before purchasingHiring your own home inspector!Whitney and Lance's turnkey winners and losersManaging your property managerHandling an evictionThe role of cash reserves when buying turnkey propertiesThe "BRRRR-key" business modelAnd SO much more!Links from the ShowReal Estate Rookie Facebook GroupFelipe's InstagramAshley's InstagramBiggerPockets PodcastQuickbooksBiggerPockets CalculatorsDavid GreeneTurnkey ReviewsBiggerPocketsBiggerPockets ForumsAppfolioBuildiumZillowApartments.comFEMADeal Check StessaQuickbooksCheck the full show notes here: http://biggerpockets.com/rookie29

Website for Bill Hortz: www.innovationdevelopment.orgTranscript:Diane Dayton  0:02  This is Changing the Rules, a podcast about designing the life you want to live, hosted by KC Dempster and Ray Loewe, the luckiest guy in the world.KC Dempster  0:13  Good morning, everybody. Welcome to Changing the Rules. I'm KC Dempster. And I'm here with my co host Ray Loewe. And it is we've we've had a little hint of the upcoming fall season this morning. had to put a jacket on when we left the house.Ray Loewe  0:28  Yeah, so it's wonderful outside.KC Dempster  0:30  So just briefly reminding our listeners that Changing the Rules is a podcast about how people handle change in their lives and how they handle rules. And we're given rules from the day we're born. And most of the time they are intended to keep us safe and help us learn how to live successfully in society. But over time, as we get to be adults, many, many of the rules are not relevant to us anymore. And in fact, they can actually inhibit what we want to do. need to do in order to be successful. So we have what we call the luckiest people in the world. And one of the things that the luckiest people in the world do successfully, is they change the rules to fit what they need to do so that they can achieve the successes that they do.Ray Loewe  1:16  You just enjoy expounding on that, don't you?KC Dempster  1:19  Just pushed that button.Ray Loewe  1:20  Well, you know, I think what it is, is you were raised as a little Catholic girl and you're good and you never broke rules. And now all of a sudden you get to break rules. And and you know why the people that break the rules tend to be some of the luckiest people in the world. And I've been following luckiest people in the world now for 45 years, trying to figure out how I can hang out with more and more of these people because they're fun people and the luckiest people in the world have one big characteristic and a whole lot of little ones. But the big one is that they personally designed their own lives. And once they've designed them, they step into them and they live it to the fullest, and we have a guest today, we're gonna take a break first. So don't panic over that KC, you get your break. But But when we come back and talk about our guest, our guest has done several things. I think he certainly handles rules really well. And he came out of one industry that was fraught with rules and into a new business where the rules can be bent and broken and all kinds of things are based on innovation. And that's what we're going to talk about. The other thing that Bill, our guest yhat's his name bill is does is he tends to follow things that are fascinating and motivating. And that's always been one of the things that I've admired about him. He doesn't get bogged down into details, he goes where the action is, and we'll find out about that in a couple minutes. So, Taylor, we need a short break.Diane Dayton  2:56  You're listening to Changing the Rules with KC Dempster. and Ray Loewe the luckiest guy in the world. We will be right back with more exciting information.KC Dempster  3:06  Welcome back, everybody. And before we get into our interview, I wanted to take a quick moment to thank our sponsors for our virtual Friends Connection conference happening  tomorrow. And our first sponsor is an organization called Springpoint Choice, and their generosity is allowing us to bring the conference to our participants at no no cost. Springpoint Choice is a membership based program for adults aged 55 and older, which offers the option to continue to live in their own home, protect their income and assets against future long term care costs, and have the added assurance of quality care when needed. If you want more information you can call Springpoint Choice at 866-778-3255. That's Springpoint Choice and we're so glad to have them as part of our Friends Connection family. Our second sponsor is to Passero'ss Coffee Roasters, and we want to thank them again for their generosity which is helping us in supporting our event tomorrow. And Passero's Coffee Roasters has three locations in the Philadelphia region. It's not only a family run business, but it's been serving the Philadelphia region for more than 30 years. And they also roast and sell their own organic coffee beans online. So I will attest personally that I have tasted one of their coffees. It's called Black Dog, and I have to say it is the best coffee I've ever had. So again, thank you to Passero's Coffee Roasters. You can find them at passeroscoffee.com. That's p a s s e r o s coffee.com.Ray Loewe  4:53  Okay, we get to go on, right. Okay, well, we certainly are thankful to our sponsors and without them, we wouldn't Be able to continue to do all these things at no cost. But today we have a great guest. And it's a gentleman that I've known for a good number of years. In fact, I've spent quite a bit of time traveling and giving presentations with him throughout the financial law planning and financial advisory services business. And Bill Hortz when I met him was a regional sales manager or national sales manager for Oppenheimer mutual funds. And the next time I met him, he was running an outfit called the Institute for Innovation Development. And his title was deanKC Dempster  5:44  not president butRay Loewe  5:45  not not president, not CEO, Dean and Bill Hortz Say hi to everybody.Bill Hortz  5:51  Hello, everybody. And as to the dean title, I just couldn't help it, but wanted to be the Dean Wormer...I just had the opportunity and I took it.Ray Loewe  6:08  Oh I think it's a wonderful title, and it's a sign of your creativity and the way you think outside the box which is one of the reasons why I know you're one of the luckiest people in the world. The first question I want to ask you here, is you left the world of financial planning, financial advising a very structured world, and you developed this Institute for Innovation, what caused yo to do this and what happened here because it's a big change in your life.Bill Hortz  6:42  But in very good stead in starting up this, this new Institute to be able to work across businesses and partner strategic partnerships and, and the like, but when I was at Oppenheimer funds, you know, a major industry, a major player in a major industry, there was set ways of doing things, you know, very, very set ways of doing things. And we were always trying to push the boundaries to see how we could do it a little better, more interesting. And I started going to global cross industry, Business Innovation conferences, and very interesting organizations that just lit a fire under under me when I was talking to them. And so in your industry, how do you do what you do? What do you mean you did that? You know? What do you mean you didn't talk to the CEO in the development of this innovation initially What do you you know, it just started bringing out that one, there is a very different dynamic that's business dynamic that's starting globally cross industry. And the fact that there are new tools and ways to deal with this new dynamic, and that's what really led me to really explore this more fully. And, and the key thing I determined is the biggest challenge in financial services and these financial services industry, as well as every other industry is that there is this new dynamic of an accelerating rate of change. There are other challenges. There are plenty of them. But nothing is so fundamental. This is the ground by which on which businesses are standing On is going through this tectonic change. It's a new dynamic. It's, it's, we always had to deal with change. But it used to be generational, you know, in two, three years, right? A whole industry can go mammoth, mammoth change. So that was the first thing when I started the Institute, it was for it to be a a platform or a magnet, right? a central place where I could start curating what what are the what is to deal with this type of acceleration? There's coolbox called innovation. So let's really try to curate and find out exactly what is innovation. And how are other industries doing it and let's try to share these ideas, these these these ideas with you You know, with with others in the financial services industry, which is where I focus now, but this is true of any industry, these tools can help any industry. But I did focus in continuing financial services by focusing this institute in business innovation.Ray Loewe  10:19  You know, one of the things that you hit me with at first when I started talking to you, since you took over this institute or created this institute, is when I went to business school, the Wharton School used to tell us well, you're going to go into business, you got to have a 25 year plan. Right? Well, 25 years so many things happen anymore. And and then I talked to you and you're working with businesses that have a three month plan, maybe right or a six month plan. So yeah, the world is not the same and and we have to we have to move with it or is gonna leave us behind.Bill Hortz  10:56  Well, you know, the, the thing that the institution The good news. I mean, the challenge the institute is is trying to be strategic strategic is you got to focus on what what is the biggest, major challenge for businesses today. And that's the accelerating rate of change. And if accelerating rate of change, other things follow from that, you know, you need tools to address that new dynamic. And that's where I'm focusing on business innovation, tools, approaches, ways of thinking that are different, which help you how do you how do you compete, how do you operate in an environment that is changing so quickly? And like you mentioned, a business plan, you know, there's a there's an old saying that says a business plan after months of delivery of formulating it, getting the hundred pages and all that and putting in binding it and all that kind of stuff, you know, doesn't you know, doesn't exist beyond the first you know, the very first contact wth the client. It's building from your head but then you're going into the real world, and all of a sudden so you have to build from the client, not from your head. And  that's why new companies are using a new tool which is called the business model canvas, and it's a great tool because if you're running any kind of company, it doesn't matter, size, scope, industry, one page, nine blocks, it forces you to look at your business strategically, who exactly are your key clients, what exactly is the value proposition you're giving them, what are the tools you're using to deliver that value proposition, what are the costs, what are you charging and it's visual and you can collaborate with other people in your firm, and it teaches you how to pivot, which is a big word today, if, if the environment is going to keep changing, you can't come out with one idea you're done, you know, and focus on competitive advantage in this one space. It's going to keep changing. So you need to know how to keep pivoting or changing or experimenting. And there's these great tools like a business model canvas that makes being more innovative in how you run your company, and much more easy to do than even using the traditional tools. You know, doing one year, your strategic plan or you know, business.Ray Loewe  13:46  Now, you know, that's particularly evident in the last year because those people that had the 30 or 100 page business plans have major renovations to do in their plan.KC Dempster  13:57  They're probably using it as a door stopRay Loewe  13:59  Yeah. I think the whole idea is it got torn up and thrown away and, and so here's the perfect example of we all know the world is going to change. You know, we we all look not only at the virus thing we look at the forest fires, the climate issues that are going on the the hurricane that's about to hit your house next week Bill, and, and all of those things that we have to pivot with I love that word pivot. So take a minute if you can, and give us a couple of insights of some of the things that you think are going to change just because the world has changed so much for us in the last several months.Bill Hortz  14:40  You know, the, the nature of what's gonna change is the problem. We don't know, right? How do We know, you know if there's a dynamic who changed though, and that's what you focus on. So the institute is really trying to focus on this dynamic Which means that have to, the most important thing you have to do is build your business plan your model your way of, of doing business, from your clients, not from your head, not from your corner, not from your experience. See, in the old days, experience and expertise was Hey, this worked before this will work again, this is a different dynamic, okay, things are changing so, so quickly that you have to keep very close to your clients. That means talking to them that surveys that but deep dive, I mean really talking to them, you know, what are your fears? What are your goals, what, what types of things could you ask for us, you know, have advisory boards of your clients, I mean, so the most important thing to address what's going to change is stay very, very, very close and your clients in Build and innovate, you know from them. Now, let me give you a working definition of innovation of what this process is, you know, when when you say innovation, the way we've defined it as a working definition, right? innovation is the ongoing execution of new ideas that create client value. We break that up, okay? ongoing, if we're in if we're in an environment of ongoing change in accelerating change, that's not stopping. It will not stop. It'll keep, you know, building on itself. So. So innovation is a mindset or a commitment to ongoing consistency. Not you came up with one great idea, you're done. No. All right. What's your next step? You have to have an ongoing nature, plus to execution, ongoing execution. You have to try things you got to put it into the world. You have to you know, Take that idea, you know, and use it and see if clients really are responding to it. So it's the ongoing execution of new ideas. And it's not just ideas, it's new ideas that create client value. So you're going to innovate. When people start saying, boy, I like that idea that's different, or I like it's easier to work with you. Or, boy, you're really talking my language and explaining things different ways. So it's when you really create the value for the client that you're going to get innovation. So to deal with change. That's the way you should have a mindset of having this ongoing execution of new ideas that create value and this way, you're on top of change no matter where it's going. Because you're you're you're you're working in lockstep with it. Or at least you're executing your resources as a business owner, to be more of an entrepreneur. Moving with that change.Ray Loewe  18:03  Yeah, you know, that's a great definition. And that really helps clarify things. Everything is client centric. Everything is based on flux. You got to pivot with what's going on in the world. And, and, you know, I want to thank you for your time, unfortunately, our time is over already. It just flies on this time period. And, and evidently, we didn't pivot fast enough.KC Dempster  18:31  But one of the things that I just want to emphasize is communication. And I know Bill mentioned it, but communication is probably at the root of most problems that we face today. And, and I think that, as business owners, they didn't use to communicate with their customers as much because they felt like Well, I have the product that they need. But now it's not. It's not that easy. You have to, as you say, bring value and help them To understand why they need your product,Ray Loewe  19:02  yeah, and what are you doing today when you can't go out and have lunch with them? You know what what are the things are going on in the background and you know, Bill's got a host of great ideas on he's well published and we can't give you the list on the on the air. It's just not going to work. But we will put in our notes about the podcast, how you can reach bill how you can find down about this whole concept of innovation that that he's putting in in a different way through being the dean. I, you know, I'll never get over that Bill. But, you know, I want to take a minute and thank you for being with us. And you know, we'll have to have you back again, as we come out of this cya environment that we're in and see what the new innovations are as we go. But thanks for being with us. And I think everybody that's listening to this interview, can see where Bill is certainly one of the luckiest people in the world. He pivots well Let's take a quick break and come back and close up.Diane Dayton  20:06  You're listening to Changing the Rules with KC Dempster and Ray Loewe, the luckiest guy in the world. We will be right back with more exciting information.KC Dempster  20:16  Welcome back, everybody. And I have to say that I really enjoyed our interview today with Bill Hortz. And just want to remind everybody that we are having our Virtual Friends Connection conference tomorrow, September 16, at 12 noon, and if you want to join at the last minute, we might have a couple of seats still open, go to our website, theluckiestpeopleintheworld.com and click on the button to register.Ray Loewe  20:44  Yeah, and sign up. We're gonna have an exciting person to talk to us a little bit, and then we're going to close up with our mixologists coming in and inventing for us a luckiest people in the world cocktail. So why See you guys next week. Everybody have a safe time.Diane Dayton  21:02  Thank you for listening to Changing the Rules, a podcast designed to help you live your life the way you want and give you what you need to make it happen. Join us in two weeks for our next exciting topic on changing the rules with KC Dempster and Ray Loewe the luckiest guy in the world.  

Jeanne Martin was diagnosed with type 1 diabetes at age ten, in the 1950s. Technology was very different back then, of course, but so was the medical community's reaction. Jeanne was told she would never have children and if she did, she wouldn't live to see her children grow up. Today, Jeanne not only has a daughter, she's also a grandmother. She shares what she’s learned along the way. We also talk to Jeanne's daughter Jessica, who talks about growing up with a parent who has type 1. In Innovations, find out why when it comes to keeping track of long and short acting insulin, a CDE says invest in rubber bands. This podcast is not intended as medical advice. If you have those kinds of questions, please contact your health care provider. ---- Other episodes with amazing people living long and happy lives with T1D: Richard Vaughn was diagnosed in 1945 Judith Ball was diagnosed in 1941 ---- Check out Stacey's new book: The World's Worst Diabetes Mom! Join the Diabetes Connections Facebook Group! Sign up for our newsletter here ----- Use this link to get one free download and one free month of Audible, available to Diabetes Connections listeners! ----- Get the App and listen to Diabetes Connections wherever you go! Click here for iPhone      Click here for Android Episode Transcription Stacey Simms  0:00 Diabetes Connections is brought to you by One Drop created for people with diabetes by people who have diabetes. By Real Good Foods real food you feel good about eating and by Dexcom take control of your diabetes and live life to the fullest with Dexcom.   Announcer  0:24 This is Diabetes Connections with Stacey Simms.   Stacey Simms  0:30 This week, Jeanne Martin was diagnosed with type one at age 10. Back in 1955. She's had to fight a lot of doctors along the way, including one who told her she would not live to see her child grow up.   Jeanne Martin  0:45 And my reaction was I told my husband that guy can go walk up the street and get hit by a bus tomorrow. I'm not going to go along with that. That's was my reaction. I got mad. I didn't buy into it. I didn't get depressed because I Just thought he was full of baloney.   Stacey Simms  1:00 Jeanne was right. She's now a grandmother. And she shares what she's learned along the way that made her question and stand up to doctors like that. We're also joined by her daughter, Jessica, who shares with like growing up with a parent who has type one in innovations this week why a diabetes educator says invest in rubber bands. This podcast is not intended as medical advice. If you have those kinds of questions, please contact your health care provider. Welcome to another week of Diabetes Connections. I am so glad to have you here I am your host, Stacey Simms, and we aim to educate and inspire about type one diabetes by sharing stories of connection. My son was diagnosed with type one right before he turned two that was back in 2006. My husband lives with type two diabetes. I don't have diabetes. I have a background in broadcasting and that is how you get this show. I spent 20 plus years and local television and radio news. I've been doing this show for more than five years now and I don't remember Ever putting the topic of the show to a vote, but I did that for this week, I put up a poll in our Facebook group, it's Diabetes Connections, the group, I have a couple of interviews. I'm usually a few weeks ahead with interviews in the can. And I asked the group to vote on which interview they wanted to hear next, and everybody chose Jeanne, I cannot say blame you. I am always amazed at the strength of these people, the stories of people who are living well with diabetes for 50 60 70 years. I mean, you think about it, before blood glucose meters were a thing. I mean, they weren't available to the 1980s. And this was a time that we're talking about with Jeanne before some doctors would even know about different types of diabetes. I was shocked to learn that that for a very long time, it was just diabetes and you treated it with a one shot a day, or then they would say juvenile diabetes. And you couldn't possibly have that if you were an adult and you're just on and on. And if you're new to the show, I've done several interviews with people who were diagnosed in the 50s in the 40s. And they've lived with type one for 70 years. And I will link those up with this episode. You can also search with a very good search engine at Diabetes connections.com. We're up to more than 320 episodes. So if you want to Google keywords like living long or 60 years with diabetes, that sort of thing. You can find that on the website. Before I get to the interview. I want to read something that was sent to me it's actually a review on Apple podcasts. I'm really bad at asking for reviews and keeping up with reviews. If you want to leave one up man, I would love it. Whatever podcast app you listen on, there is a way to leave a rating or review. This one came in from Shelley. Now her name is not on this but I know who this is because we featured her. We featured her son in a recent show. So Shelley wrote I love this podcast so much. I learned so much from listening especially enjoyed the tech episodes with Dexcom and Tandem etc. As the mom of a newly diagnosed four year old. I have found much needed encouragement and tips for helping and thrive with diabetes. Also, cannon was excited to hear you mention him swimming in the lake. Surely thank you for writing that. Yeah, we talked about cannon she had sent a picture into the Facebook group about him burning off the glucose. She said swimming in the lake pan swimming is one of those ways where Benny used to just those little kids just swim with every part of their body. They used to go low all the time in the pool. It's a little bit different. Now you know, a 15 year old does not swim like a four year old. But surely thanks for sending that review in. It's always nice to get reviews like that. And if you like the show, truly the best thing to do is to tell somebody about it tell somebody in the diabetes community. That's the best way to get the word out. All right, Jeanne and her story in just a moment but first diabetes Connections is brought to you by One Drop, getting diabetes supplies is a pain. Not only the ordering and the picking up but also the arguing with insurance over what they say you need and what you really need. Make it easy with One Drop. They offer personalized tester plans plus you get a Bluetooth a glucose meter test strips lancets and your certified diabetes coach, subscribe today to get the test strips for less than $20 a month delivered right to your door. No prescriptions or co pays required. One less thing to worry about. not that surprising when you learn that the founder of One Drop lives with type one, they get it One Drop gorgeous gear supplies delivered to your door 24 seven access to your certified diabetes coach, learn more, go to Diabetes connections.com and click on the One Drop logo.   I feel like I've known Jeanne Martin for as long as my son's had diabetes. That's almost 14 years. And that's because while I have never met Jeanne in person, I have been friends with her daughter Jessica Graham for even longer than those 14 years. We met when Jessica was in public relations here in Charlotte, and I was working as a health reporter for a local TV station. And later we were on the board of our local JDRF chapter together. I cannot believe it has taken me this long to share Jeannes story. She is just incredible. I was able to talk to Jeanne and Jessica, about living well with type one for 66 years. Jeanne and Jessica, thank you so much for joining me. I've known Jessica for so long, but I don't know so much of this story. I'm so excited to talk to you both. Thanks for coming on.   Jeanne & Jessica  6:17 Thank you for having us. You're very welcome.   Stacey Simms  6:20 Jeanne, I got to start with you. Because you have lived with type 1 diabetes now for more than 65 years. Let me just start out by saying How are you? How are you doing?   Jeanne Martin  6:30 I'm doing great. I think I'm doing just fine.   Stacey Simms  6:35 What do you mind if I ask what technology you use how you manage anything you'd like to share?   Jeanne Martin  6:40 Well, I checked my blood sugar with little contrast test strips. And I shoot nice. Well, I take shots   Stacey Simms  6:49 you can say brands, we’re all friends here.   Jeanne Martin  6:51 Yeah, I say I shoot myself   four times a day. I see my doctor every six months. Well, that's about it.   Jessica Graham  7:01 She does not use a pump or   Stacey Simms  7:04 any of that. No, if you don't mind, let's go back. Do you remember what it was like when you were diagnosed? You were 10 years old. Do you remember anything about that time?   Jeanne Martin  7:13 Oh, yes, I do very much. We lived in a very small town, not far from the Mayo Clinic. We just lived there a couple years. My friend's mother mentioned to my mother that I was drinking a lot of water and going in the bathroom a lot and she thought maybe my mother should have me checked out. So we did in the small town with the with the doctor there said, Well, she's either got diabetes or TB. Well, I didn't know what diabetes was. And I knew what TB was. So I thought, Oh, please don't i don't want TB. I'll have the other and so so the little basically country doctor didn't know what to do. So anyway, so they sent me to St. Mary's, which is public Have the Mayo Clinic. And they tested me and for sure that's what I had. So I had to stay there. I think it was five years. I didn't do all this stuff with the diets. And they wouldn't let me leave until I could get myself a shot. But I was active. And I don't really remember too much about it. The doctor were very nice, and everybody was very helpful. And back then you had glass syringes and needles and you couldn't check your blood sugar. You had to pee on the stick, and they sent me home and my mother had to weigh everything, and I had to watch what I ate. But other than that, that's about it. Then I just basically went on with my life. Did you   Stacey Simms  8:46 really? Were you able to jump back in go to school, do all the things you wanted to do with that time?   Jeanne Martin  8:51 Yeah, I did.   Stacey Simms  8:52 Mm hmm. It seems like such a different time, right. I'm just trying to think,   Jeanne Martin  8:55 Oh, yeah, it was a very different time and when I first got married, Remember, I had to boil my syringe once a week, we had to do that. And I was still peeing on a stick. And I only had one shot a day back then all through, you know, school. And of course, I didn't want to tell my friends when I was in high school. That's what I had. But of course, my mother told my best friend's mother. So everybody knew it, but I didn't know they knew it. Oh, wow.   Stacey Simms  9:25 Anyway, moms are sneaky that way. But yeah. The you know, the regimen was so different. You had one shot a day, right? And then you had to kind of eat around that shot. Did you have problems as a teenager? Did you do remember, you know, any issues or were you able to buy I would assume by routine and by figuring out what to eat, you know, how did it work out for you?   Jeanne Martin  9:47 Well, I didn't run into any problems when I was a teenager. And I do remember I don't know how I would go not very often, my friends and I and I would have hot fudge sundaes. Believe it But other than being bad like that, I lived at home and my mother, kind of watch what I ate. And I didn't need a lot of sweets. You know, it was my mother's management, not mine. And I came home for lunch all during school. And I didn't start taking more shots until about, oh, I don't know, maybe 45 40 years ago.   Stacey Simms  10:23 Yeah. It's so different to think about because we're talking about I mean, if doing my math correctly, you were diagnosed right? In the early 50s 1950s.   Jeanne Martin  10:30 Right? And 1955   Stacey Simms  10:33 Yes, so the routine was completely different. I mean, as you're listening, you got to understand not only one shot a day, but no blood sugar home meters, right. You're still checking. How often did you check done by check? We mean, pee on the stick.   Jeanne Martin  10:50 I probably did it maybe once a day. I honestly don't remember that. Not a lot. It's very different now. And somehow, I think my pancreas has always worked a little bit because I don't take much insulin. And I'm very, I don't want to say touchy with it, but I don't have to take a lot. And when I was diagnosed at the Mayo Clinic, they said that yes, my pancreas was working a little bit. That's what they thought. And I still think that's the case because I just don't need much insulin. And and I watch what I eat. I do, but you know, I'm not 100% I mean, I do have cookies,   Stacey Simms  11:30 but you're told us you were eating hot fudge sundae. So the cat is out of the bag…   Jeanne Martin  11:35 That was in my youth. You know, I do take care of myself. Now. I check myself four times a day, shoot up four times a day and I watch myself better now because I know better. I'm more wiser.   Stacey Simms  11:48 I'm curious to growing up. Did you know anybody with Type One Diabetes and if not, when did you meet somebody with no,   Jeanne Martin  11:55 I never knew anybody. I didn't know anybody with any kind of diabetes. It wasn't in my family, so none of my relatives had it. No, during high school I did not know, as an adult. I have met very few type one diabetics, I know they're out there, but very few. And it's kind of fun when I do just to kind of say, Well, you know, compare notes, so to speak. Sure.   Stacey Simms  12:21 Just let me ask you a couple of questions. Because the perspective of a kid, you know, we're all adults now. But a child growing up with type one in the house and the type one is in the parent is not something that I've talked a lot about on the podcast. What's your earliest memory of your mom and diabetes?   Jessica Graham  12:38 Well, I don't ever remember it not being there. And that was more because I worried about her than it was her. There was never literally and I'm, I mean, this literally, there was never a day when my mom said, Oh, I don't feel well or Oh me, you know. My sugar is off, or I just don't feel good today, never. And so it was nothing that she did. I just knew that if mom started acting funny, I needed to get the orange juice. So I remember that I never had a problem with shots. And I think that's because I always saw you give yourself a shot. So it was just, it was always there. The other thing that I remember is that I was always told that it skipped generations. And so I do remember I don't even know if you remember this. But I remember at one point when I was little, I told mom that I didn't want to have kids until there was a cure, because I didn't want my kid to have type one. And I she got really mad. My mom never got mad. But she got upset at that and told me that was absolutely you know, the wrong attitude to have and that she had a great life and it didn't have any impact. And so that was the end of that but it was just always there. So just always a part of life. Jeanne, I'd love to hear your perspective. On when Jessica who now has a I want to say a tween a teenage Yeah, yeah. just turned 13 Yeah. Wow.   Stacey Simms  14:07 I want to hear your reaction Jeanne to when she said that! Right back to Jeanne answering that question but first Diabetes Connections is brought to you by Real Good Foods. True story from my house. Benny came downstairs the other night, open the freezer door, looked in it close the door and said who ate the mint chocolate chip ice cream. And I had to say it was the I finished it off. Sorry, Benny. But they're Real Good Foods. Ice cream is really good. We had a vanilla chocolate and mint chip this last time I promised him I would buy more and I have to get the peanut butter kind as well. We haven't found the ice cream yet in our grocery store freezer so I get that online but our grocery store carries a lot of the meals and they are so good and super easy and basically just heat them up. If you have an air fryer. It's even better They have everything from pizza to breakfast sandwiches to bowls, these new bowl meals that are really nice entrees. Find out more, check out that mint chocolate chip ice cream for yourself. It stays frozen. They they package it up the right way. I was worried about that, but no need to worry should have known. Just go to Diabetes connections.com and click on the Real Good Foods logo. Now back to Jeanne answering my question about her reaction. When Jessica told her she was really concerned about having children.   Jeanne Martin  15:33 Well, I didn't want her to dwell on it. And I didn't want her not to have kids. You know, it's so much more advanced nowadays. And there's so much more that they can do. And I always do hope for here. I mean, I've been hanging on that for a long time, but you never know, one of these days. No matter what your problem is. You just have to get along and do the best you can and get along with your life and not dwell on it. And I've never dwelled on it.   Stacey Simms  16:02 Well, I'm curious too, because now we know and I've heard that too. it skips generations. We know it absolutely does not. But I'm curious Jeanne, you know, when you decided that you wanted to have children? Did anybody try to talk you out of it? This was a very different time for diabetes.   Jeanne Martin  16:14 Well, I was told that I would have a hard time having a child. And so we put up for adoption. And we were waiting to hear and I went to the doctor and thought I had a tumor but the tumor was Jessica. So I thought, okay, so we said, you know, we were going to have a baby so we don't need to adopt and they said, Well, why don't you wait to see if everything is okay. And I said, okay, because the doctors told me that Jessica only had a 40% chance of being born alive. So we waited and she was screaming and kickin, so she was Fine. So we stopped the adoption because we didn't need two babies at one time. And I didn't see her for I think it was like two or three days. She was in an incubator because her blood sugar was low when she was born, but then after that, she was fine. And I was fine. And that's it.   Stacey Simms  17:19 I'm sorry. I'm still on the tumor.   Jessica Graham  17:24 Well, and I'll add to that, because, you know, she won't tell you this part, but because she was diabetic, she couldn't have any medicine or or painkillers. When I was born, and you were in labor, what, 24 hours? No, no,   Jeanne Martin  17:39 it was, I don't remember 13 hours. So it was a   Jessica Graham  17:42 ridiculously long and I was stuck behind a piece of cartilage. And so I wasn't coming out. So she went through hell delivering me. But it all worked out. Yeah.   Stacey Simms  17:54 Oh, worked out. things really have changed. I mean,   Jeanne Martin  17:58 Oh, yes. And I also was I would not live to see my child grow up. Now I've got a 13 year old grandson.   Stacey Simms  18:07 But let's talk about that, because I've heard that from so many people diagnosed not only in the 50s, but even as late as like the 70s and 80s. This Doomsday of you're not going to live past 30. And I know that for many people, that unfortunately was the case, there was not the care. There was not, you know, whatever they needed, but it seemed as though in some ways, the doctors, I don't know, I don't want to editorialize here, but they seem to have this Doomsday approach. And when you were told that Jeanne, what was your reaction? I mean, I think a lot of people would have said, well, what's the point? Oh,   Jeanne Martin  18:37 I'm kind of stubborn.   And my reaction was, I told my husband, that guy can go walk out in the street and get hit by a bus tomorrow, and I just, I'm not going to go along with that. That's was my reaction. I got mad and he did die. A younger The age that I am now is a matter of fact, the guy that told me that I didn't buy into it. I didn't get depressed because I just thought it was full of baloney. I love it.   Stacey Simms  19:10 All right, this is getting interesting now. I do love it. Jessica. I know your mom is sitting right there. But you're doing great Jeanne, obviously with with your shots and with your checking, but the technology has advanced. I'm going to assume, Jessica, that you guys have had a lot of discussions about this. And your mom has said no. And you're respecting that don't put words in your mouth. But I'm curious how have those conversations happened?   Jessica Graham  19:36 Oh, yes. And I don't mind saying it with her sitting right here. So I don't mind that she doesn't do the pump because I understand. I mean, she's had incredible control for 60 some years and so i don't i don't blame her that but I want her to have a blood sugar monitor because she tends to go away Low, and she goes low at night. And it's been a problem as I call it a problem. Whenever she goes low it to me it's a problem. And so while she keeps great control, and I mean, it's her life, right, and it's her decision to make, I wish that she would get some of that electronic help with the monitoring of it. So yeah, we have that conversation a lot. But I lose.   Stacey Simms  20:26 That's a difficult situation. You know, we, as parents of children with type one have these conversations, especially once there were certain age, and I'm going to say, as young as four or five years old, where it really has to be up to the person to buy into it and say, Yes, I want this technology. And I would imagine and I'm just imagining having this conversation with my mother, who I think you have a lot in common with with Jeanne. And I think it would go that well. Yeah, well stubborn, but also you're doing very well.   Jessica Graham  20:52 Yeah, and Exactly. That's why I mean at the end of the day, what am I going to do right now I can only put in my two cents but that that is is the one thing that I wish you would do. And my dad to his credit. I mean, he's kind of grown up with this too, right? And so he's a great monitor strangely, he knows when it's the middle of the night and she's having a hard time. But I don't like to rely on that.   Unknown Speaker  21:17 But again, I lose   Jeanne Martin  21:19 stubborn. Well, let me cut in here. But the doctor prescribed a new kind of insulin that I've been taking. I don't know six months now and I have not had any trouble at night. Oh, good.   Stacey Simms  21:32 We don't have to use it in the show. Are you taking Tresiba?   Jeanne Martin  21:34 It's Tresiba. Yeah. And I have not had any trouble at night. Since I've been on that. Yeah, that's a good thing.   Stacey Simms  21:41 But my son uses an insulin pump. But long story short, we had him on Tresiba with the pump for a while because teenagers use the most ungodly amount of insulin that you could imagine. He's coming out of it. So we did away with the trusty bow, but boy, it's like the best long acting we've ever used. I'm curious too, and the bridge kind of skipping around chronologically. Hear but I mentioned earlier that there were not blood sugar meters for home use when you were diagnosed. Do you remember when you started using one of those maybe the 80s   Jeanne Martin  22:09 Well, I thought it was great because then I really knew what was going on. I mean it just it was very helpful because and that's why I checked myself a lot because you can't guess how much it's I mean, you can guess kind of how much insulin but you really can't without knowing what your blood sugar is to my mind. I mean, I think that's what's helped me keep control in Yeah, I don't like to stick my fingers but I mean, I'm so used to it now just comes second hand to me, so it made a big difference. What really made a big difference to is having plastic syringes that don't have to boil. Tell me   Stacey Simms  22:49 more about that. When did that switch? Not Not Not necessarily like what year but tell me more about that. What do you remember kind of the transition? Did you just one day throw all the glass ones out? What happened? Right   Jeanne Martin  23:00 Yeah, I did. I guess the doctor told me that these were available. And so I bought them and and use them. And then you know, he used it, throw it out. And it just, it made a big difference. It's just like, oh, gosh, you know, this is getting easier. Well, and you know, it was a lot easier. I mean, it sounds like a small thing, but it was a no to boil, you know, syringes once a week and needles once a week. And so this was great.   Jessica Graham  23:28 When did you I don't remember you ever boiling? Was that in the 60s or   Jeanne Martin  23:32 70s? No. Well, I must know. I don't think when you were born. Other times, I must have used the plastic ones. Yeah. Because I don't remember doing that either. When you were born.   Stacey Simms  23:43 You know, Jeanne, it's interesting. You said it seems like a little thing. I think for someone who has my perspective. My son was diagnosed in 2006. When we basically have I think we have all of the technology. At least it was on the drawing board if not available at the time. It wasn't as good as it is now. Just 1314 years later, but it was there. And so to think about transitioning from peeing on a stick to a blood sugar, meter glass syringes, to plastic syringes, these are monumental changes. I don't think it was a little thing. I can't imagine how much of a difference that made. I mean, the needles had to even feel different. They were more comfortable, I assume.   Jeanne Martin  24:20 Oh, well, it was it was like one size needle with the glass syringes, and they weren't that small. And now, you know, you can get all different kinds of sizes. Jessica, do you remember growing up?   Stacey Simms  24:32 It sounds like your mom's diabetes was not front and center, as I'm sure she would not have wanted it. But are there any things that stand out? You know, when you were a teenager? I'm trying to think his parents are just super embarrassing to begin with?   Jessica Graham  24:44 Honestly, no, because it just my mom wouldn't let it be the center. I mean, you're absolutely right about that. She she would never have wanted that. And I don't remember there being anything that happened when I was a teenager. That was odd. She She had one episode. I guess I was a teenager when you broke your ankle. She was we discovered that she couldn't drink champagne. She had a glass of champagne. I mean, literally a glass and the next morning passed out and broke her ankle because it messed up her blood sugar so badly that I don't remember anything ever. Embarrassing or weird or no, not not at all again, I I remember when I was a younger teenager, like if you started acting strangely, I needed to get you orange juice like I vaguely remember that but and that went for anybody. Like I think if anybody started acting strangely, I would have ended them. Shoes. But   Stacey Simms  25:43 Jeanne, did you have a career did you work? Did you work at home? Tell me a little bit about what you you know what you did?   Jeanne Martin  25:49 You know, I work during high school, I worked at clothing stores and I worked at a bakery. And then after school, I worked at a real The state office. And I guess that was it because it was the board of realtors, because I had to quit them when I got pregnant with Jessica. So that was it. And then when my husband started his company, I worked for him. I did the payroll and things like that.   Stacey Simms  26:19 Jessica, what led you to JDRF? I mean, we had met Previous to that, but we connected again at the Charlotte chapter.   Jessica Graham  26:25 I led community outreach for Harris Teeter, but didn't formally get involved. They were supportive of JDRF, but didn't formally get involved in a board capacity until I got to Time Warner Cable, and they were also involved with JDRF. And so I joined the board at that point, and was on the board for, I don't know, six or seven years, I think, and shared it in there. But I think I knew about JDRF through mom, like I think you just always supported them. Yeah, um, if I'm not mistaken, the world. organization was born the year I was born. Just another thing that has always been a part of my life. And I was really excited to get involved with the chapter because yeah, as you sort of already mentioned, the parents of type one diabetics are really involved. But there really aren't many children of type ones out there. There weren't at the time. It meant a lot to me to be involved and to be part of it.   Stacey Simms  27:24 I'm just curious, your mom, Jeanne, you just seem so laid back. And I've talked to several people who have lived with diabetes for this long who are I want to say relax, because obviously you're not, but who are more of the, hey, I'm taking care of it. We don't need to talk about it. You know, I'm not surrounded by people with type one. And then there are people who are younger, or we've been diagnosed more recently, who are really a big, big, big part of that community and want and need to kind of breathe that air. And I was curious, Jessica, was it surprising for you to kind of be involved in JDRF and be around people who were more like well, I am talking about every day and I am going to tell you more about it.   Jessica Graham  27:58 Yeah, I mean, it was it was definitely Different, because that's just not how it was in my house. I mean, it wasn't a big secret or anything. But Mom definitely didn't advertise it. And it certainly wasn't part of her identity. It was very, very different. And I really loved to one be involved that I really loved getting my mom in that community, like I would take her to the gala and that kind of thing. And she really is such an inspiration to a lot of people, especially those who are newly diagnosed because they can see somebody who really, I mean, has had a full, long, wonderful life with it. And so it's not this Doomsday message. And so she's really, I think, a real inspiration for that. And I think too, she's a great inspiration for how important attitude is an outlook is because she's never let it define her and she's never really Let it limit her. And I think she's really inspirational. So yes, it was very different to be around different people with it. But also it was really exciting to just to be able to share her with that community.   Stacey Simms  29:12 Jeanne, what's your reaction to have your daughter sitting next to you and saying, what an inspiration she thinks you are?   Jeanne Martin  29:17 Well, I think that's very nice. It's very complimentary. I never thought of myself that way. But I'm glad she sees me that way.   Stacey Simms  29:26 I know my listeners are going to want to know, a few more little details. Jeanne, do you exercise a lot? Have you always been active? Are you more kind of laid back about that too? You know, that's one of the things that people always ask me about.   Jeanne Martin  29:37 No, I say I'm pretty active. Well, since we've lived here almost the whole time. I would go to the why three days a week. I don't do that now because I suppose and when I was younger, I played golf, and did a little bit of tennis. I've always gardened Well, not always but for a long time I went out in the They are dug in the dirt and that type of thing. And I try to walk about a mile a day. I mean, I walk more, but I go for a mile walk, or more. I tried to do it every day, unless it rains. I do it early when it's hot, because the heat affects my blood sugar. I run into trouble easier. And I don't know if that's the same with other people. But anyway, that's what it is. Yeah, I think I'm pretty active.   Stacey Simms  30:27 Yeah, you're very active. Jessica, I'm curious, have you. You mentioned that you were worried about your son having type one and he's 13. Now, do you still think about that? It's in the back of your mind. Is it something that you've ever had checked out? Anything like that?   Jessica Graham  30:41 Um, yes. So I worry about it every day. But I don't   I try not to think about it. And I certainly have never mentioned it and   Unknown Speaker  30:49 we had   Jessica Graham  30:50 it chat once and I forget why you've charged it. Yeah, maybe. Maybe you were the one anyway. I feel like I had it checked once and I don't remember why maybe he was thirsty that day. But I do worry about it a lot. And I mean, literally every time he says I'm thirsty, because I'm just a little neurotic that way, but I don't talk about it at all. Like he would have no   Unknown Speaker  31:14 idea. I don't   Jessica Graham  31:16 think anybody would know that. But yeah, I worry about it a lot. But then again, I think, well, if he ever were to develop it, oh, my gosh, he has the world's greatest teacher to help him navigate it. So that puts my mind at ease. When he was very, very small. I found a test that he could have done. It might have even been when he was born. I mean, it was he was really, really young. And I think it was down in Florida, talking about TrialNet Yes, that must be what it was. And we just decided   Stacey Simms  31:49 not to do that. And I think I talked to you about it and talked to my mom about it. And she, I think suggested that we not do it and I decided not to so Well, Jeanne, let me then ask you about that because you would, as Jessica said, you know, he would have such a great role model and teacher, God forbid something would happen like that. So let me just ask you, what would your advice be for a newly diagnosed adult or a newly diagnosed family facing something like this now in in 20?   Jeanne Martin  32:19 Well, it depends the age of the kid. I think when you're a teenager, I think it is be harder on the kid because, you know, you don't want to be and maybe it's because I'm a girl and maybe it's back then you don't want to be different. I mean, you know, you want to blend in as a teenager, you don't really have enough self confidence to just say, Okay, I've got this and I'm gonna deal with it. I mean, I'm not saying that kids don't but I would think that's a harder age. But I guess I would just be very positive and all the things that can help. At the same time, it was would be your his responsibility to see He does try to do what he should do with diet and exercise and taking this medicine. I have a niece who came down with it when she was 10. And she never did well with it. She didn't do what she was supposed to do. And over the years, she's had all kinds of complications. And she just got very depressed with it. And you have to be positive. But you the kid himself, has to take responsibility for himself to do what he should do. And I strongly believe in that.   Stacey Simms  33:36 Thank you both so much for joining me today. It was amazing to learn about your story, Jeanne, and I'm so glad, Jessica that we were able to do this. Thank you for being on the podcast.   Jeanne Martin  33:45 Thank you for having us. Yes, thank you. It was nice meeting you via the computer.   Announcer  33:55 You're listening to Diabetes Connections with Stacey Simms.   Stacey Simms  34:01 I shared some photos in the Facebook group that Jeanne and Jessica sent me, I was so happy to finally get a chance to talk to her. And you know what, after that interview, she sent me an email with some advice for Benny, which I thought was really, really nice. Now he is, as you've heard him here on the show, he maybe he's a little too confident, but he's very independent and very confident. But Jeanne has some really nice words just about you know, not letting diabetes stop you and keeping a good attitude that has served her well. And I really appreciate that she took the time to do that this community is just great. All right, innovations is up next. And we have a very low tech solution to a very scary problem. It has to do with rubber bands. All right. I'll explain that in just a moment. Diabetes Connections is brought to you by Dexcom. And we started with Dexcom back in the olden days before share. So trust me when I say using share and follow apps make a big difference. I made a lot of people who don't realize that when Dexcom launched you could not see numbers not only on your phone, but you could not share than with anybody else. But now it's such a great system. And Benny and I set parameters about when I'm going to text him or you know how long to wait all that it helps us talk and worry about diabetes less when he is at asleep over or goes on a trip. It gives me peace of mind. It also helps if I need to troubleshoot with him, because I can see what's happening over the last 24 hours and not just one moment. The alerts and alarms that we set help us from keeping the highs from getting too high and help us jump on lows before they're a big issue. Internet connectivity is required to access separate Dexcom follow app. To learn more, go to Diabetes connections.com and click on the Dexcom logo.   As you know I am the queen of diabetes mistakes I wrote a whole book about why I think mistakes are great. It's the world's worst diabetes mom real life stories of raising a child with type one. But I will say that making mistakes is also incredibly scary at times. And the one mistake that I think almost everybody with time wonder who's a caregiver for someone with type one has made is mixing up the long acting and the short acting when you're on MDI, whether it's the beginning or you've been doing this for a while, I've been enough Facebook groups where I see this happening. It's once in a blue moon for the individual. But it seems like almost every week somebody is coming in and saying, Oh, my gosh, I did this. I'm so scared. What do I do? Right? Well, one of the best tips I ever heard on is so simple. And I heard it from a CDE. And I'm so embarrassed that I don't know their name. And I'm so sorry, if this was you, email me Stacey at Diabetes connections.com. And I will give you credit, but what you do is this, whenever you have a new vial or a new pen, have long acting and do this on the long acting only take a rubber band and wrap it around the pen or the vial. Just wrap it around a couple times. You know, make sure it's not loose, it's not sliding around. And then every time you pick up your long acting, you will know that it feels different. It's got those rubber band bumps on it and If you do this often enough, really doesn't take that long, maybe two weeks, your fingers will start to associate that feel with the long acting. So if you make a mistake if you accidentally grab the wrong pen, your hand and your brain will instinctively know that something is wrong. Now, this is not proven. I haven't seen any studies on it. But this is advice that was given to me that I've heard other people use. And it really does make sense. It is incredible that after all this time was different kinds of insulin, that the pens are pretty much exactly the same. The Lantus vial, I remember might be a little skinnier, right? It looks a little bit different. But when you're moving quickly and automated, like a lot of us are, I mean, I could do that Tandem cartridge in my sleep, whereas when we first got it, I thought, oh my god, this is so complicated. I've got to lay everything out on the table. We did the Animas pump for 10 years, I could definitely feel that thing blindfolded. You just get used to your routine and how things are Feel so if you just wrap the rubber band around the long acting, you will get used to the feel of it. Let me know what you think. Does that make sense to you? Has anybody tried that? And if you've got an innovation like that This segment is for everything big and small. That makes living with type one just a little bit easier. Let me know I would love to hear from you.   Just a little personal update before I let you go, this has to do with insurance. We've had some employment situation changes around my house, which means I have already spent far too much time on the phone. I decided to start taking advice from one of our previous guests from Melissa Lee, who said when you have insurance issues, you should start with the diabetes companies and work backward. So I called Dexcom and Tandem and I said hello, I have changed insurance. What do I need to do? And they were very helpful. The bad news is my new insurance means we have to order from a third party supplier and it's Edgepark. Edgepark. If you're listening, please, please handle this. Well, we were with Edgepark years ago and I hate to disparage anybody. But let's just say let's turn this into a positive. I felt that it was such a gift for the last five and a half years to order directly from Tandem and directly from Dexcom. I am sad to see those days in my rear view mirror. So I will keep you posted on how it goes. I'm currently as I'm recording in the limbo of an Edgepark representative, we'll get back to you. We have plenty of supplies. I have a great support system if I need anything, so I'm not worried about Benny. But man, although I'm a liar, because I did say to him, you know, before you rip anything off your body, so bad before you take off that sensor or that inset, come talk to me, and make sure that it's okay to do so. Isn't that terrible? I mean, I'm laughing because we really are fine. But it just makes me crazy how expensive this stuff is, and how difficult the process is to order what you need. So I will keep you posted on that. Hopefully, it'll all go smoothly. But this is not my first rodeo. So I'm anticipating navigating a not so smooth road. I'll let you know. Thank you so much to my editor, John Bukenas from audio editing solutions. Thank you all so much as you listen, I'm Stacey Simms. I'll see you back here. Next Until then be kind to yourself.   Benny  41:07 Diabetes Connections is a production of Stacey Simms Media. All rights reserved. All Wrongs avenged

Welcome to Harmonic Evolution podcast. I'm Joe Heller, your host, your guide, and I am honored to have Reverend Michael Shane. Reverend Shane is a physical medium and a spiritual teacher Reverend Shane has spent his life connecting with the Ascended Masters of Shambala to bring forth their teachings and principles into the world this three-dimensional world we live in. Reverend chain offers healing instruction, direction direct application, so individuals can strengthen and fully realize their connection to the spiritual world, their guides and their masters as well as work directly with the Ascended Masters. In the lady masters of Shambala, if a student seeks the calling, so welcome, Michael, this is a real thrill to have you here because there's just so much I want to get into. And it's just like, Wow. I mean, they're obviously there's so few physical mediums on the planet. So why don't we start there? Because I'm sure people and I've met James Vaughn, Prague and a few others. So can you talk about the difference between a physical medium, and then a just a traditional, I guess, medium, and how you kind of came down this path?Well, the differences between mediums. And the first thing I want to say one isn't any better, or any less than the other. All gifts given to us by God and everybody has one it's just a question or an issue of finding what it is. But there are differences I mean, with everything, you know, you Like in a football team, you have your quarterback and you got your offense Do you know? But there's mental mediums like you mentioned James Vaughn, Prague and John Edwards who are very, very talented individuals that speak to meet people's loved ones to give closure and information to those that are grieving. And they do that through hearing him seen spirit. Hmm, that's what a mental mediumship is. In reality, it has nothing to do with the mind. See, but they call it mental mediumship in more you probably be better to call it spirit connection mediumshipor psychic mediumship. Then you have the trance mediums which are those that go into trance and as Spirit will come into their body and utilize the physical body to communicate to people or like a seance mic. Or that one's a seance. Yes. Okay, but it's usually done in red light. Where the idea of a transfiguration medium came from, because in a red light setting in a dark room, when the medium is inside the seance cabinet, not using a seance trumpet, the spirit comes into the body, their body tends to, to kind of shift and change into a very close, familiar appearance of the spirit that's taking over the body. Wow. And then you end up seeing all these different orbs and things floating around. And it's a pretty exciting thing. The other one is handwriting medium I'm sure your listeners and yourself have heard of Sir Arthur Conan Doyle, yes, his wife was a hand handwriting medium. And what would happen is an automatic handwriting medium would use the opposite hand to write from what they normally write with. So if you're right-handed, the spirit world would use the left hand if you were left-handed, they would use the right because then your control factor isn't as connected to the opposite side as it is the one that you normally use. So it's easier for spirit to use. Now if you use both, then I guess they just flip a coin go and I'd actually heard that before in reading some of Dolores cannons stuff is that when let's say she You're gonna connect for the past life through her client. And that past life was left-handed, they would write in the left hand and it would be anything from a completely different language, such as even ancient languages like Sanskrit or cuneiform or Sumerian cuneiform. So it's fascinating the way that this can kind of come through the body.Oh, we are truly all of us are connected. You see, especially the mother to their child, some mothers through what they call a symbiosis of their record. Uh-huh. their child could be on the other side of the world. And they're going through some sort of trauma, and the mother on the opposite side of the world can feel it. Yeah. To give you an example, everyone knows who Gladys Presley was. Elvis Presley's mother, yes. She always knew when he was on the road when something was wrong. And she would describe what she was feeling to him when he would call and in one specific incident, their car caught on fire and they had you know, in his mom saw the fire and all of that. And so she was really connected, the more connected that one person is depending on how sensitive you are and how emotional one it can be. To net would that also apply to obviously twins, correct? Same thing. And then what if a twin because you might have one twin that's a star seed and then one twin that may just be incarnate as in this world for the multiple times and maybe not a star seed. So I understand those maybe have a less of a connection or it does it really matter do you think?I don't think it matters because they're hanging out in the same space for No see mom? Yeah, you know and they're together pretty much their whole life at least when they're at home anyway.But, the connection, because we're all connected, is still there. So I would think that it wouldn't matter. I don't know for sure, but I would think that it would matter I I have known some twins in my life and I even know a set of twins that still wear the same clothes. Wow. And they're my age now.Wow. So they're 31 ish.Yeah, thank you.So yeah, I interrupted you, you were talking about the red light and apportioning and so I know you weren't going to finish that story. Because then I really want to ask you your origin story like all superheroes because your talent, your ability, and I know all gifts are equal, but it's pretty amazing. What you can do in this gift from the Ascended Masters that has, I guess, open some gates for people to see a greater understanding of the otherworldly realms through you?Um, well, in regards to the Transfiguration, red light sans, I pretty much told you about as much as I can there. I could probably talk about it for over an hour, but just that one, that one element alone.But in my case, how I got involved was I really didn't have a choice.You're volunteered.In my grandmother. She knew Marjorie Crandon. I don't know who that is. She was one of the old mediums the one that passed the Houdini test.Wow.And Houdini tried to get upset because she keeps passing in His tests and so he tried to set her up as a fraud on his own and got caught by the Spirit that was coming through her. And so he, and he still hasn't paid her to $10,000 reward to pass his test. So well, I would imagine the interest on that now she'd be it's probably a pretty good paycheck.Yeah, I would think so. That was what 1920s Yeah, I think so. I would say $10,000 now, could be worth close to 2 million, maybe nice. I don't know. My math isn't very good. So anyway, um, that led her to meet an individual in Seattle, Washington, who was studying this book called The Eurancher book and had these teachings of these masters from Shambala. And this comes from the Theosophical Society. Helena Blavatsky. Yeah, the optical society. She was the first medium physical phenomena medium to introduce the Ascended Masters to the physical world. The three there's a picture of her sitting in a chair with three of those masters standing behind her. That was St. Germain comes to me and l Moria.And if I'm correct, Michael, is she the first woman that was ever trained by Tibetan masters?That's correct. That is correct.You know, as James Brown says, in one of his songs, it's a man's world. In those days, it kind of was right, though today. It's not. You know, I'm not sure whose world this is right now.Well, like going back to the future. I think the professor would tell Marty whenever you Do Marty don't go to 2020?Yeah.Yeah. And look at what happened. Um, well, the point, though, I mean, Michael, I mean, you're up. But yeah, back in those days you had What? Helena Blavatsky. And then Alice Bailey. I mean, two women that really kind of shaped spirituality the world we live in today.Yes. And in fact, Marjorie Crandon, who I mentioned earlier, she was instrumental in how women got the right to vote. Wow. She was married to an upper-class surgeon, Dr. I believe it was in Philadelphia. Somewhere in that arena, and she had these gifts that her husband thought it was kind of neat. So he would have so his elite, rich, upper-class people will come over to his house and she would do events and stuff and every once in a while, she Go out and do stuff publicly you know and when he was working because you know if you're a surgeon you're not home that often, right? And that was even the case in those days. And she is in a seance, a spirit by the name of I believe his name was Dr. Black Hmm. Or no, that was Edgar Casey's sleeping prophet. He got his information from a spirit called Dr. Black. You don't read much about that anymore.For some reason, but that was the case but she had a spirit that came through and told all of these upper-class women in society, you know, in society to go down to the White House under designer outfits and pick it for the right to vote. Well, they took it one step further than that. They did get into their designer outfits. They went down to the White House with their signs and everything. But they chained themselves to the White House fence.Wow, wow, that's crazy.I actually read about that happening. Not the part about the seance. You have to go into another area to find that information. But that was one of the instrumental reasons why women got the right to vote. Awesome, which they should have been given the right to vote, you know, after the scenario with Jesus because He was teaching equality, that women were just as important as equal as men were.That's correct. And a lot of people don't realize how many women followers Jesus had. Mary Magdalene was actually my understanding, a high priestess from Egypt, which is one of the That they communicate well together is because they were very aligned with their teachings and eventually became his wife.Yes, I wasn't gonna go down that path. But yes, tantric sex in a whole type of which could be a whole different podcast for us, Michael, just to kind of give a little thing.I've been writing a book about his life including the missing years His Spirit has come to me and told me all these different stories that's also about his life in I'm not sure if everything is good that he has told me I'm going to write it in there because I'm worried about the controversy that may arise because of some of the information but yes, it was Mary Madeline's parents are from Egypt. She was actually born in Israel.I did not know that. But that's interesting. And But to your point, I would think that with everything breaking loose in 2020, this is the Great Awakening, I would say included because, I mean, there's been so much controversy around Jesus's as you were just talking about missing years and obviously those of us that are kind of following that path know that he was in India and receive certain teachings and, and other places that he had traveled to, which are not in the doctrine, probably in the archives in the Vatican.Like his master teacher, Maitreya, who, yes, in India, you know, wonderful master teacher, he is so anyway, to my story is a long story. So I'm going to make it I'm going to give you the short of it, please, if I know how to do that. When my mother was 15 years old, she was she went to this church called me The Aquarian foundation in Seattle Washington not too far from where they just recently had all the riots and stuff.Interesting and she was 15 years old and she was told by a spirit in a seance through a medium by the name of Reverend Keith Milton Reinhart that she was going to have a baby boy that was going to be born July 4 1963 11:59 am and that I would have these gifts this boy would have the similar gifts as the medium wow trained by the by this medium and that she wasn't to raise me that the church would raise me as an avatar nice now my I do have a little bit of an ego but not to the point where I think I'm some sort of avatar or God child like they treated me in those days they put like a big blue stripe on your right here, Michael I think that's yeahI'm no I'm not going there.But we know we know what your next Halloween costume is gonna be.I think it was gang stuff.Every once in a while I come out wearing robes and stuff. But that's for another purpose not to be egotistically inclined there. So I ended up being born on July 2 1963 1159. Wow, everything was correct. Except for the day. They missed the day by two days. But I've always been told that was because I was in a hurry over here. So I was born on a Tuesday. And I was in my very first seance that following Sunday. And I didn't make a sound through the whole seance.Wow, that's an interesting baptism.Yeah. And, you know, because there's a higher consciousness that's getting training this you know, that I mean, I might have been in that, you know, little body Google, you know and stuff but there's another part of us that's that exists called the heart consciousness mind. Yeah. Know, the heart-mind consciousness,especially that age because you're wide open you just came in, right? I mean, you are wide open and most of us aren't like six years old.Right? And it was I remember my birth and I remember those days even to details of people were wearing and I told my grandparents, what my grandfather was wearing. When he came to see me through the glass at the hospital. You know, remember, remember those days used to go stand behind the glass. There's my son, you know, that kind of thing?Yeah, with a cigarette, right? This is my son in the hospital. Right?And, and... Oh, I lost my thought.So you would just be in your seance you were able to tell everybody what they were wearing what they were doing kind of like an out of body experience. When you do like a transition from this world and you're in you get pulled back, you could see everybody in the hospital room in the circle.It was a chaotic day because I died three times. And my mom died twice. Wow. While I was trying to be born. And I believe I was saying you know what, I don't want to deal with this. I'm out of here.After seeing your soul is like God no, no, thank you.But so because of in those days religion was a big stickler in the hospitals. So the doctor went out and told my grandparents you know, which one do you want us to save? Because some religions save the mother other religions even child right like crazy. My grandfather, I was told this because I wasn't out there to see it. But he grabs the doctor by his white coat. tells him you say both of them were you better not show your face out here again. And he ended up saving both of myself and my mom. I love that story. You know. And then I, my grandmother was the lady that helped Reinhardt do the books, she set up the event, she ran the church for him. And all he had to do was come in and do his thing. And I ended up living with her and a few other people in the church as kind of passed around like a hot potato there for a while. And those were what I call my happy years.So do you think you're just kind of indoctrinated in this higher energy and you're playing kind of like the old Frank Sinatra song playing in the stars are among the star so it just kind of like permitted within your physical avatar your body?Well, to be honest, I milked it for everything I could up to me on a Sunday and say they would call me a little queasy because I was named after my biological birth name is Keith Milton, Lester. Okay. And I was named after him. And they would ask me if I if I had breakfast, I'm hungry. You know, they would take me over to the Safeway where they had this deli to buy me some breakfast. But really, all I wanted was a milkshake.And I'll get one, right.Yeah. And my grandma would say, don't do that. You know. I got a lot of good memories from those days. And I was, you know, was treated very special spoilt. People would give me money, candy, birthdays and Christmases were just undescribableWow, payment in advance. I like that.Yeah. And people would, I mean, I'm four or five years old people want me to come up and do healings on them? Uh,well, I was gonna ask you about that. So, obviously, we talked briefly about the A portion. I want to jump back into that in a second. But I also believe through some of the material I read, that you do hands-on healing and remote distance healing, is that correct?Correct. Now, when I was about six years old, Saint Germain whispered in my ear, now you do know you're not healing these people. And I thought about that. I said, What do you mean? You are aa avenue a vehicle, a tool. Think of yourself as a hammer. The Hammer does not build the house until someone comes along and picks it up. And I think he what he was doing was trying to help me not to lose my egotistical, negative side, right. Don't get into that I heal you. And truthfully, you're being used as a vehicle to help people believe in themselves enough to heal themselves.Right But that's also something you were chosen for. I mean, not all of us are chosen for something like that, especially, it's six years old. That's, that's pretty amazing.It was and, and it's just I think it's wonderful and amazing, but I also feel that Everybody, you know, has the ability to heal themself. I agree. Because, you know, they're the ones that created the issue in the first place. Yep. No, if you're the one that writes the map to the treasure, right, then you should probably be able to find the treasure.Exactly, yeah, we just become disharmony, disharmonious. We don't really know how to get back in sync. And so, I kind of see us as a, if you will cymatic wave pattern that, like Dr. Emoto. His work, when you have this corrupt is just negative or disharmonious thinking the whole wave becomes disharmonious, which causes corruption. Aging does disease within the avatar of the body.Right. And disease will eventually come into disease.Right, exactly. So let's jump back to reporting because I find that fascinating And I want my listeners to really kind of get their head wrapped around it. And I through the videos, I was like, wow, this is like so crazy cool. Because I'm watching you a port in reporting really is kind of, I guess opening a spiritual gate through different parts of your body. And what's the physical mediumship is, is you're actually bringing through gold jewels, I mean a number of different things, including, I think one we were talking before the show, a 1300 karat with Sapphire, Blue Sapphire. And then one of the other really fun ones for me was when you were talking about holding a class and there was a puppy in a car and the puppy was like going crazy and you imported the brought the puppy in or Saint Germain brought the puppy in, and he jumped out of your belly and onto the lap of the owner and it was in your class. I mean, I was like, had to wrap my head around porting living like puppies. I was like, Oh my god, that's so cool. Ever needs to go shopping again?Well, I remember that day that was in Renton, Washington. And we were doing a seance and there was my helper. Her name was Pat. She had this dog named chipper and we left with my car was parked just outside of the window next to the dance room. Uh huh. This little dogs out there, get get get get, you know, and people were getting cranky because they couldn't hear what spirit was saying. And one guy says, you know, he makes a comment about getting a refund because you know, and the next thing you know, and I'm in trance, so I didn't know this, it happened. And so the dog comes through and jumps out into the audience in pitch dark conditions and is able to find The, you know, hit her, her owner. And so jumped up in her lap and sat quietly for the rest of the seance. Now that gentleman afterward wanted my car keys and I go, what do you want my car keys for? And he says, I want to go look in your car and see if there's a recording device with a dog barking. And so he goes out and he looks he doesn't find anything.Are you serious? Okay, I thought he was like joshingNo, and he was in a suit, you know, with a tie and a suit coat and everything. So he asked, he says, Can I go under the house because there was this the section where you can crawl under and right in the old houses right on the pier beam. Yeah, this house was built in the 1920s. Right. And he goes under there. He takes his coat, jacket coat off, but he goes under there. With his tie his shoes, his slacks, and nice shirt and all that, you know, and as soon as he sees under there for 45 minutes now what he's looking for is a trap door. Right? Right. And he doesn't find anything and he notices no one's been under there because of where the cobwebs were and they were undisturbed when he ruined his outfit. I mean, when he came because it rained the day before. And, but he just couldn't wrap his mind around and says I just don't believe it. And so he never went public or anything to say anything negative and never seen and heard from him again. But, um, you know, it's just hard for people to imagine now.Well, Michael, to that point real quick. I mean, even for me because I was like, Okay, I can see a porting or bringing through the spiritual realm non Living materials like joules and go, but when I watched that video, I was like, really living materials can be imported through a body that's like crazy and it's like, could give a whole new meaning to the virgin birth if you will, because it's just something that was kind of beyond my comprehension I've got I got my head wrapped around it now, but it was like, wow, that's and I would imagine, even as a physical medium, there's probably very few physical mediums that can aport living material through their body.Um, I have not heard of any I'm not even Keith Reinhardt. But that doesn't really mean it doesn't take anything away from anything that any of them I'm sure, you know, but you got to think in terms of quantum physics. In reality, there is no distance between point A and point B. Okay, the closest distance between two points is not a straight line. It's where you take the two points and put them in the same space and time. So you're folding space and time, which is where the reality of, of existence really is. Because the past, present, and future exists simultaneously, like for instance, right now, you're still going through your childhood. And you're also going through your future, and you're going through the now. It's just this element of your consciousness is here. There's another element of your consciousness. That's is in the tomorrow, and another one that's in the past. You see yesterday, well, that's brilliant. As a matter of fact, right before we jumped on this call, I did a video for my YouTube channel, and I talked about past lives and future lives. And then I threw some monkey wrenches in there around. They don't need to be linear so you can actually go back and have a past life that wasn't there from a current life because you've developed something in this life. That needs to be developed in the past life, he actually has it in this lifetime. So looking at the observer being the observer observed who's being the observer. So it's really kind of a house of mirrors, if you will, which is interesting because I understand exactly what you're saying in that perspective. It's fascinating. That you're right, it's the points are together, there is no separation. It's almost like being on a computer, hard drive people, like run and play these games and climb mountains and swim through rivers and rowboats, but that one piece of code never moves from that one spot on that hard drive. And yet, they're all over the world, but that one piece of code are in the game, and that one piece of code never moves.Right? And it's kind of like an illusion. Right? And we are sitting in the illusion everything that you see around us. Is it the way that it truly is? And I have come to realize that the physical world in the spirit world are one in the same?That's why we loved ones and spirits and stuff are still there with us that we sometimes see them. Because we're, we're in the same space as they are, because of the conscious mind and the experience that we're going through relative to this side of the veil. We see this right. See. I was working with a scientist. His name was Edward Wilson. lived in Boulder, Colorado up in the mountains. He was the very first scientist to test me at the heartmath Institute in California.Oh, yeah. Great. Great place. Yes, yes.I met Dr. Childers. He was a he was a riot.Raleigh is his first name I think. Well, Raleigh, I think is his first name. Yeah, Holly. Yes.A wonderful man. I don't know if he's still alive or not. This was back in the 90s. But who knows he could still be around but anyway, he was studying the healing effects of sound. Yeah, as a time heartmath you know, so in one of the scenariosI was in trance describing the crucifixion of Jesus. Wow. Because I, I was astral projecting my consciousness back to those to that time. And the machine that they had me hooked up to stated that I believed what I was seeing wasn't saying that I was really seeing what I was describing. But it was basically saying that I believed it. Meaning I wasn't making it up. I was seeing it in my mind and It was there even down to the emotional level of the experience. And I gotta say, the Mel Gibson movie has nothing on what really happened to the poor guy. Wow. Do you know? I did a seance I believe it was in Lilydale New York and his finger we were doing a paraffin wax fingerprint where he materialized his hand and he put his hand down in the wax and the finger was broken.And, and I was told that that was because when he was being tortured one of his fingers, you know, was was was, was broke, right when he was on the cross. He was tortured. Are you talking about when he was actually carrying across the city when he was trying to when they were trying to nail him on his wrists, the hammer, went hit the finger and it broke his finger and twisted it back. Wow. And so it showed that on the handprint but with Ed Wilson I then did what a thing of the past life regression. This gentleman that I was that was working with me at the time. His name was Reverend Weston Bailey, who recently passed away a couple of years ago. He basically is the guy that brought me out of lethargy. You know, I was going down the deeper rabbit hole in those days.I understand life. but anywayI would astral project myself out of my body into the throat chakra of the individual. I'd be able to go in and see past lives, medical issues, childhood stuff, present-day stuff. I'd see all this stuff by etherial. And I described I'm looking at his blood.And I'm describing something that I thought was kind of peculiar. I said, I see these Jelly Bean, looking things being devoured by these round plate looking things. And Mr. Wilson stood up in the chair. He turned absolutely white and said, I don't believe this. I just don't believe this. But it happened was I had described as leukemia. Now, nobody that was there in the room other than Him, knew he had leukemia.Wow.And if you looked at it under The microscope that's what it looks like. And, and only people that knew that he had leukemia was him, his doctor, his wife, his wife wasn't there and I didn't know his doctor and, and so there was no way that I could have known that he had leukemia. So he, so that led me to a place called the heartmath Institute. I'm sorry, the subtle energy and in energy medicine organization, which used to be out of Boulder, Colorado, and another group, a gentleman by the name of Jerry Pittman, PhD.He also passed away a number of years ago, and he did some studies on me too. And then recently, another gentleman out of Heidelberg, Germany, a car cruise, huh. He did. Some thermal imaging infrared he was actually there present with his equipment when I did the 1300 carat Sapphire. Wow, that's that was under scientific conditions. Wow. And then he did a voice analysis where he was testing my voice along with the other voices that were coming through the seance. And all five of them came from different voice signatures which is not even rich little could have created that.I would say that most of my listeners probably don't know who this little is. But if you get a chance Google Rick's a little look up some of his YouTube videos because he's a classic comedian that had all these crazy voices. It was just a brilliant guy.So he did a really good Nixon.He did Exactly, yes. And of course, some of our listeners probably don't know who Richard Nixon is. I am not a crook.Well, Mike, we have something in common because I was actually born in 63 as well. So we are kin kindred spirits from back in the day of. Yeah, unfortunately, the JFK assassination. So a couple of questions is so the 1300 carat and I know that you go through incredible prep relative to making sure that in the scientific conditions, you're put in a box, your mouth is taped, you're kind of handcuffed to a chair. So there's really no way you can fake these jewels and gold and jewelry coming through. I mean, you're just there's just no way I mean, you're searched and all this sort of stuff. You're never left alone. So when you aport these, these items, let's say you've mentioned a trance Is there like a gate that opens Can you see the port, the apportioned, let's say the jewel or the ring or whatever it might be? Can you see it in your mind's eye before it comes out? Or does it just come out? And it's just it's, I guess everything selected by the Ascended Masters, mostly Saint Germain. I'm just as surprised as everybody else. It's a really, I don't, I don't. I don't, I'm not completely 100% in my body in the first place. Okay, and I don't know what's coming through and even when they're coming out because there's a process. Let me briefly give you a, please. I was gonna ask you about how to get into a trance state and what the real processes will sit once I'm in the cabinet.And yes, I do this spontaneous, where I'm not in the cabinet like I did with Wayne Dyer. I did it just right in front of them before he went into the cabinet. The first part of it anyway. And so, St. Germain will have located objects that he's going to Through that they have been programmed and energized for specific people from their guides and master teachers. And he then puts it on this makeshift table and Shambala. It has kind of a bowl and it's a table concave, okay? concave so it does, you know, step don't roll out or whatever. Then his heart opens up his heart chakra. And from that heart chakra, this silver energy will come out of his heart chakra into the Conclave of the table where the objects are. And then the objects including the table, really lose their physical appearance and in turn into their natural appearance, or, which is energy in motion.Okay, so so this is the table concave table on St. Germain in Shambala, in the theoretic realm is there he's doing that there and it just turns into energy and then just reports where you are in the physical.Well, then he lists the energy up with the will of the silver energy. And then this vortex opens up which looks like mercury that's moving in a counterclockwise motion.Mercury, the planet or Mercury, the element, the element the liquid or Well, it's not really a liquid but it looks like a liquid, you know, which is interesting because a lot of free energy in ancient times has been tied to mercury. And Sir Isaac Newton. Most people obviously know him for the law, gravity, that's an ad, but he was actually more of a proponent instead you're of alchemy, and he actually died of mercury poisoning.Yep. Yep.alchemy is a lost art and that's what St. Germain is doing in the process of the application. So once the energy of these objects goes into the vortex Immediately appears through my body somewhere because space and time is has been folded into the same space and time which in reality is never separated. It's always been that way, right? Okay. And so then when it hits this what we call the third dimension, the air, you know the oxygen the light, it will turn into a gas from the energy into a gas and then into a fluid which people will see that part is that the ectoplasm Michael, is that the ectoplasm?Well, it's a fluid, it goes through a fluid state it goes from a gas, the objects Okay, was from a from the energy to a gas to a fluid, and then it solidifies once it hits the light into the object and it was interesting and if you touch them too soon, they can do dissipate right away, you have to be careful. And, and so that's the process. And then I go back into the cabinet to kind of get myself together and again, people are organizing them. And then I come out and I call people up. And they receive an object with a message from there, from whoever gave it to them. And for healing for knowledge for the message, and also to get them to start thinking about what really is this world has to offer, you know, so and the first time I ever recorded myself as I was seven years old.We can't afford it yourself. You mean you transitioned into a different dimension or time station? The first time I ported an object?Okay, okay. Okay. Okay.Yeah. Um,I was playing in a dirt pile out behind my house.And I was playing. I don't know kids don't do this anymore. But I was playing with army men. I did that. Yeah, we're good. Well you did, but I mean, the kids today they're playing with their little and hide stuff, you know, right? Um, even bicycles are becoming obsolete, right? So I started feeling this nauseousness in my stomach.And then this cloud of ectoplasm came out of my stomach, about three feet in front of me three feet above the ground and this object drops into the dirt. And I pick it up and I look at it. I didn't know what it was. You know what kind of gemstone it was Iris. I'm all excited. I knew what it happened. I ran up to my mom. And she looks at it and immediately she thinks I stole it from someone she knew. She calls this person up because we had spent the weekend at this person's house to calls her up and says can you go look in your you know your jewelry box? And she looks she says no, no that my appetites still there from the medium Reinhardt. And so then my mom knew Oh, well, this, this happened. Well To this day, you know, I was when I was seven I'm 57 now 50 years ago. She sheets, I haven't seen it. She keeps it. It's awesome. What a great story, an 88 carat white Sapphire.So two quick things, um, the ectoplasm So can you talk a little bit about what Ectoplasm is because I think that's something that many of my listeners may not have a concept of. I mean, we remember the movie Ghostbusters, where they talk about the ectoplasm. So what is it from a from the Ascended Masters perspective what would be best for people to go read Charles Roget's work because he's the one that actually coined the word ectoplasm. Hmm. Okay, but relative to what I know ectoplasm is really a lifeforce energy that comes from your soul through your seven bodies, past your silver cord into the physical body down into your nervous system, which gives us energy to keep things moving, like your heart beating, being able to breathe, having the nerve fluid to move through the nervous system, and everybody has that only one out of every millions child is born produces enough ectoplasm to produce phenomena on its own, right. And that's usually kids that have overactive adrenal glands. You Know the kid that that won't sit still right? No matter what you do plasm would be in a sense, like, key or ci or real. So an energy, lifeforce that's, that's used to create this or the chemical by-product of the soul. Okay. Interesting. I called that before. That's my analogy.Okay. And the second thing I just wanted to point out to my listeners is that all these incredible it's not just jewels, its rings, it's all kinds of things that have like symbology. You give these to the people that are in the workshop. I mean, St. Germain is you mentioned brings these through with a message, and it's, I don't know, hundred thousand dollars or whatever it might be of jewels that you report in a workshop. And then one of your attendees gets one of these because it's specifically been gifted to you to bring into this realm for them is that correct?Yes um, there's gemstones are mostly the what the objects that come through me because most of the people that come to my events are women. Ah, you know and women like those little sparkly gemstones every once in a while. silver dollars will come through, some of them still encased in plastic that never been touched. Wow. I'm different origins of the world I've had gold coins come through from a 10th of an ounce to a one-ounce gold coin. There's a couple of times that I have hoarded gold nuggets. And there are people can actually tell you where the nugget came from. So these nuggets actually came out of Alaska.  Right, because I know that gold has a specific radiation signature that you can track to whichever mine in the world it came from.Now the funny part of this is some people think I'm regurgitating this stuff right now. Especially when that Stephen star guy on British got talent and talent came out and started swallowing, pool balls and things like that. But any guests or biologists would tell you regurgitator is don't swallow the objects. For one thing that Sapphire I brought through was two and a half pounds. Not only was it bigger, a lot bigger than my esophagus. my esophagus would not have been able to push that up from my stomach.You know, right, well into your point before we jumped on, it's a recording. You actually said it broke a tooth I believe because it was so shattered this tooth here and dislocated this job.Wow, you think St. Germain would be like a game like or not? Like?People have asked, Well, why would Ascended Master put you through that kind of pain? Well, they don't. It's by my choice for one thing, and I don't feel pain anymore during this process, because now, through the years of doing this my specific master teacher is Jesus, which is why I'm writing about it. It feels like he's holding my heart. You see? Hmm. And I don't feel the pain. Now. I do feel pressure. And sometimes it's uncomfortable. Now. I do feel the pain after like, like, for instance, when I was on the plane, my tooth was killing me. Right. My father wasn't really all that happy for a while, you know? And so, but every single person that comesEvery once in awhile, it's not the case, but most of the time everyone that comes will receive an object. St. Germain will make sure to the best of his abilities that everyone received something because there are 100 people in the room and one person doesn't get an object. That person's not going to be happy.Yes, I can.And it's also one point I wanted to finish.I honestly can't afford to give away all this stuff. So you know, me Bert purchasing this stuff. I mean, people that are really close in my life right now are aware, you know that. I'm not buying this stuff. Right. You know, to give away. con men never give away their props in the first place. Right, but I'm no longer In the mode to try to prove myself or convince people are going to believe or not going to believe it's, it's what St. Germain says. We're proof is needed. no proof will suffice. We're proof is not needed. no proof is necessary.So what is the craziest thing you've recorded Michael?Besides a puppy, we already talked about the puppy.Well, it's two things are actually three things.About three and a half years ago. I have a video of this and I was going to post it, but I was warned and then I thought better of it. So I only give I've only given this video to a certain couple of people.But in an event with the help of Saint Germain, ad ported a hamster out of my chest and a corn snake out of my mouth. The corn snake came first. Then the teddy bear hamster came out and he tried to escape now can you imagine these women were in the fifth row? What was happening with them when this little hamster was running across the carpet. And this wasn't excited conditions everybody saw it happen. And you can see it happen in the video. And, and we were told though, prior to the snake, we weren't told about the hamster.And so we had that it happened. So that's the one of the things that I would say. And then the other was a set of It was a wooden box probably. Well, it was a pretty good-sized box up about maybe eight inches tall. Maybe 12 inches wide in both directions.It was handmade and hand-carved.Inside the box was some red velvet and you can tell that the material was old and laying in the red velvet was to handmade solid Silver Goblets and underneath where the stick underneath the stem where the thing that holds the goblets up was st remains Hallmark.Wow, his is hearts.Yeah, his Hallmark. Wow. And hebrought that through The bummer is that night someone broke into my temple install it.Unbelievable.And I knew I was I kept telling myself I should, I should turn around and go get it and take it home. But I wanted it to be in display so people can see it. Right?Well, obviously St. Germain knew that. I mean, these people will probably needed it more than you did. There are no coincidences, right hand the way everything unfolds.Now in regards to the message that comes through, if there's any more than 40 or 50 people, obviously, not everybody gets an individual message, right? It's more than that. Because I've had up to 503 people during an app that seance and everybody got an airport. But everybody got the same message.Oh, right. So would you say that would be like maybe a soul group that for some reason got entangled and came together?Well, keep in mind, past, present, and future so the Masters already know Who's coming? Right?If you really sit down to think about all of this stuff, two things are going to happen. One is if you're having a glass of wine, you'll probably stop drinking. If you're not having a glass of wine, you might start drinking. If you really sit down to think about it, you know, because I mean, even Einstein knew something about all of this. That's where he left that unfinished formula. MC square equals two, right? That's an unfinished formula, and we still haven't been able to figure it out. But the answer to his formula, I believe, has a lot to do with a lot of what we're doing, but it's not just me. There are other people doing it. You know, there's other mediums that I've met from physical mediums to mental mediums. I even met a medium that did mediumship with her toes.How do you do mediumship with your toes? That'sI have no idea how she was doing it, but it was working.And yeah, and then you have the one that's kind of playful. And that's the table tipping.You know, right. Right. Right. Right. For sure. Yes. Yes. So jumping back to what I got one quick question and then kind of a wrap-up question because I've had you on for about an hour and I could talk to you for two or three hours and hopefully we get a chance to do this again and didn't dive deeper. I do want to mention before I ask this next question is you can find Michael at Michael Shane calm and it's -- m y ch e l s h n e So Michael with a Y. And he's got his training courses up there. He's got a YouTube channel. Yeah, so just really cool stuff. So if you want to go down this rabbit hole, I highly recommend you check Michael out because, well I'm fairly well versed in quantum physics. Michael has actually blown my mind a little bit as well as I saw in the puppy thing that just and now I think but the God was in St. Germain and the snake I'm just like, wow, the snake, just kind of wondering what kind of reaction the women in the room and with the snake.They had more of a reaction with the hamster than they did the snake. That's right. Now I have asked the Masters not to do any more live objects through my physical body anymore. Because I actually ended up taking on the fear that the snake was having.Oh, wow, I can see that sick for two weeks. So I that The Masters, you know, no more of that. But I do want to say in October coming up the end of September through the second week of November, I'm going to be in Detroit, Michigan, Ohio, Pennsylvania, Erie, Pennsylvania, Rochester, New York, and the lily Dale area, which is called Cassadaga, New York to go on a road trip, and because, you know, as we all know, US citizens are not allowed to go to any other countries, right.So I'm doing this road trip, where we will be following the COVID guidelines and all that for those out there that are wondering about that. So that's coming up, if anyone's in those areas that might want to check it out. out. They can get ahold of me like you said, either at info at Michael Shane calm or Michael at Michael Shane calm and just go to my website which is Michael chain calm.Okay, fantastic. Yeah, it's exciting and you do so much more than what we just had a chance to talk about getting into psychometry and other things and I guess it depends on where and what people want to learn from you from healing techniques to the mediumship to it, I'm just fascinated that you just have this collection of gifts. So let me kind of jump back and ask a question because one of the things that struck me because we talked about heart math, and the heart chakra and the high heart, but you talked about going into the gentleman's throat chakra, why the throat chakra, were you that something divine guidance? Were you able to see the Leukemia I mean, I would think that you would?chakra is where the silver cord connects to the physical body which is at the base of the skull, okay. And the silver cord is what gives us physical life. Once that is severed physical death occurs, but it takes up to in earth language three days, which goes to the issue of, you know, Jesus rising in three days or no, there's a lot of things that happens in threes. Number three itself, but there are people that have been pronounced dead and then two or three days later they're waking up in the freezer, you know, you've heard stories,right? It actually back in Europe, but in the I know my mom's from a very old town for the 1700s in North Carolina, Beaufort, and they actually had bells that you where you're buried, and you could pull a string and a bell would ring above ground in case they buried you while you're still alive to your point which is People were really feared of that, which is where the outcome of embalming comes in place. So you don't wait no, come back. Right. And, you know, plus there were all kinds of stuff that people are afraid of death, but death is no different than being born. It's just being born into a different reality leaving, you know, one room to go into the next room. Right? But the only thing about death that I worry about is I don't want it to hurt.Exactly. Well, there's that glass of wine again. I do have one final question because it just dawned on me which because you're talking about the silver cord attaching to the back above the neck, which is really the ninth chakra and that's what I've been taught the mouth of God. I'm just wondering about your thoughts of the importance and we may go down a rabbit And we may just you might want to say, well, Joe, we'll just table that. But I'm just curious about the importance of the pineal gland because I personally, my guides have shown me the pineal gland is not all that important. It's really just kind of a whole concept, but I'm just curious how you look at the pineal gland because there's such a heavyweight and burden that's put on you've got to decalcify you got to do this getting that and one of the things my guides had showed me was no just go up in the etheric, you have your third body there's no calcification there as an example, well the first thing I want to say is if you go down that rabbit hole, my rabbits will talk to you. Nice.  Okay, so the petite the deal and pituitary glands are not actually for the physical body. It is a tool that is brought in from the ethereal realm to be used. As we start to develop, for instance, if you were to take a four-dimensional or three-dimensional picture of the inside of the brain, beyond the physical mass part, all the little synopsises and stuff. In the middle, there is an empty dark space which holds room for us to evolve. And the pineal, the pituitary gland is there for that very reason. Plus, it also helps you connect to the gifts which come from the ethereal realm by nature, to help you produce the site to see certain things that are in the future, but you're not actually traveling into the future. The future is already right there. Right. Okay. So the argument is whether they were important or not, relative to the physical part of it, probably not so much. But when it comes to the bigger picture, they're very important. It's like, it's kind of like the appendix. You know, medicine doesn't really know its true purpose. But one of the things that I've been told is it is a cleansing area for ectoplasm as it goes to the Kundalini, which helps us develop our creativity, and the seances and the mediumship part of the ectoplasm as well. But if you end up losing that, it bypasses that organ and goes directly to the Kundalini. And that could be a tough scenario because now you're getting the whole whack on your, on your Kundalini, instead of it just being gradually and cleaned.Right? Exactly like it'll gain whack a mole. Right, just for you.Yeah. You know. So there's a lot to understand about the physical body and I, personally, I'm not well versed in what that is. I'm a medium, not a doctor, you know, or a scientist. I get certain information from my guides and master teachers. But if they gave me too much information, especially stuff that I couldn't possibly understand, that would change the whole direction of where I'm supposed to go karmically. So, um, you know, I'm not, I'm not a brain person. I'm really good at history. But when it comes to math and things of that nature, I just best stay out of those conversations.I agree. I'm playing with the abacus myself. So with that, thank you, Michael. It's been a pleasure. So again, Michael Michael m y ch a e l s h a n e.com  He's got these courses. Gosh, if you're in the upper part of the US I think he mentioned area Indiana, Rochester, New York, which is kind of like a foreign country with that...Erie, Pennsylvania...Oh, Erie, Pennsylvania.  Okay. Okay, so and I guess all of this is on your website. I don't have that pulled up in front of me right now.Not yetBut I haven't actually added anything to my website for a long time. Because I've been having problems with it with the emails and stuff and but I am planning on attempting to put these dates now that I've received them today. on there so people can go to that or if they don't see it on my website, they can get a hold of me through the website. Well, and then ask or befriend me on, on messenger. And I would just you know, you gotta say who they are. Don't just leave right there. You know? And make sure they have a profile because they don't have a profile. I don't approve it.Perfect. Yeah, that's exactly how I connected with you originally was on Facebook. So thank you. It's been a mind-expanding, conscious expanding experience just visiting with you just wow. I mean, what can I say is, and I would say that anybody that probably sits in your presence is going to have just this vibe of fluid energy that just kind of ignites their whole structure as you're reporting so what an experience I look forward to meeting you in person and hopefully get a chance to join one of these workshops in the near future.I look forward to thanks for tuning in evolutionary trees. Enjoying the show? Please rate and recommend Joe and the harmonic evolution podcast on iTunes, overcast, or wherever you tune in. Be sure to tell a friend and share these evolutionary insights you learned today with your tribe. Become an emissary for evolution. You can get more great evolutionary insights to expand your consciousness at www dot Joe heller.com. Be sure to tune in to our next episode. Until then, May there heavens been shine brightly upon you. As always, this show is offered to you in love

We actually made it! Right? Well as long as theres gonna be NFL games the TNC boys are here to break em down! First whos the best team in the league? Then every game is picked while the guys tell you who and what to look for in Week 1. Enjoy!

Being a Freelancer, the everyday struggle is to find your Target Audience. Right? Well, many freelancers and Solopreneurs have asked me about how to target their Audiences. Confused about which type of business you should target or reach out in order to get good projects for your freelancing business or agency? THEN, no worries! I am here to help you to sort it out “How to target Clients for your Freelance Business”! In this episode, I am going to share with you how I can help you to target Clients for your Freelance Business. --- Send in a voice message: https://anchor.fm/abhisekonline/message

With two generations of golfers already in the family, it would be natural for young Gail Owen to pick up a club and join them on the Hampstead Golf Course on the north side of London. Right? Well, let's not jump to conclusions. Gail did pick up a club, but with no real intent, and it was only when a friend bought her some golf lessons for her birthday that she started to play. Fast forward just a year and Gail finds herself in a doctors office and on the receiving end of the words, "Well you've got multiple sclerosis.” There was little by way of sugar coating. The words, although direct, came slowly but hit hard. Listen to the story of Gail Owen. These profiles are now in the third year and are supported by PING.

Today Andrew Henderson invites Micheal Kerr on from Northern Ireland and we discuss the difference between antibiotics and probiotics. Truly it all leads to gut health and quite frankly starts at soil health.

Buy a product from China. Slap your own label on it and ship it to amazon.com. Thats how you sell on amazon. Right? Well, not exactly. In this episode I talk about my rise and fall on amazon or more like fall and fall. Selling on amazon or looking to? This is for you. Because this episode is not the generic boring information that everyones talking about on you tube. I've been there made the mistakes so you can be the guy that makes it work to the envy of all your buddies that have to work 9-5. ===IF YOUR LOOKING FOR A SHORTER VERSION THE 7 REASONS ARE AT 18:40min=== Please note that some small brief parts of the recording have intermittent static. It was my recording software. I rectified it halfway through. Sorry. Thanks for listening. Do you just flat-out need more leads for your business? But don't know where to start? Its confusing I know. Whats worse is every guru seems like a shark... On the hunt to sell you a $1000 course. I felt the same. The secret... You have to become a better marketer. The best marketer always wins. Join my group. I share everything for FREE to help YOU. Join Here

Are you losing clients?  Do you have clients decreasing the packages and projects you are working on? Especially during the pandemic, you have to be adaptable and ready to pivot. Being proactive and communicating with your clients and knowing what is most important to your client right now can prevent them from pulling the plug. In this episode, you will learn how to stay ahead of your client and be clear about the accomplishments you are making and the return on investment that you are delivering. Here are some things we covered in this episode: What clauses you should have in your contract When to give your clients grace When to expect your clients to pull back Why you should be proactive in how you communicate with your clients The importance of sharing wins with your clients Sharing reports with your clients to explain their return on investment When to reach out to clients for contract renewal Be adaptable and ready to pivot during the pandemic Be strategic and specific in what you offer to your clients Know where your clients can get wins right now How to have conversations to get a sense of what you can offer your client The importance of a monthly or quarterly recap of accomplishments How to respond to a client that wants to decrease After listening to this episode, share your action steps and take-aways with our group: Mastering Your Freelance Life With Laura Connect With Laura: Follow Laura on Facebook Join Laura’s Community Subscribe to the Podcast Subscribe to Laura’s YouTube Channel Read the Transcript: Hey, Welcome back to another episode of advanced freelancing. It's been quite a while since you heard from just me. Right? Well, get ready. I've got several solo episodes coming your way. And due to listener requests, I'll be transferring back to more solo episodes in the near future. So you'll still hear from some freelance experts from other communities in places from time to time. But it's very clear that most of my listeners love listening to some of these solo episodes, kind of peppered in with expertise from other guests. Today. I want to talk about something that's really challenging for a lot of freelancers and seems to be coming up a lot more now as a result of the pandemic, what do you do when a client wants to pull the plug wants to cancel or wants to decrease the packages and projects you're working on now, any business can make this decision for any reason at any time, right? Sometimes they might just be going through a challenging time with their company. Their marketing budget has been decreased. They're pivoting and offering something entirely new. There's really so many different reasons that companies can naturally come up against the situation. But of course, anytime that we're facing a recession or something like the pandemic, when questions are being raised about any project that's on the table, in any expense in the business, you can definitely anticipate this becoming more likely with some of your clients. Now, just because a client wants to have a conversation about decreasing or dropping the project entirely doesn't mean that's the end of the story. Now, definitely. If this is a bigger client and they've already talked about it with their internal team and come to the decision that the project needs to halt entirely, or they need to cancel the contract and pay the kill fee for canceling early. There's very little you can do at that point in time, but you want to get to the point where that is very rare, right? We don't want our clients blindsiding us with information that they've decided to cancel everything and throw out the baby with the bathwater with no notice for us. Most of you should have clauses inside your contract that require the client to give you a certain amount of notice. Now, if their business is going bankrupt if they're shutting their doors if this has happened to me if the owner of the company passes away and it's really influx, who's going to take over. Those are situations where you might not get the required notice. And you probably want to give your clients a little bit of grace. If they're going through something especially difficult, but otherwise your clients should adhere to what's listed in the contract. As far as how long with advanced notice they need to give you that the contract is ending. So it's most likely to happen towards the end of the month towards the end of the quarter and towards the end of your contract, right? Because these are naturally times when companies and teams are going to be taking a look at where they're spending their money or monitoring performance of campaigns to make that decision. So you never want to let your clients get to the point where they are having those conversations without any input from you. This does not mean that you are there and are present for the actual meeting. No, it actually means that you are doing some outreach prior to these natural endpoints where you're sending the client a report you're discussing what's gone well, and what can be improved, where you've made some type of outreach, essentially, where you haven't let the situation just set it and forget it, right? That's what we don't want is to deliver work for our clients. And then at the end of a three-month contract, one week before the contract is up, when you realize you need to get it to renew, that shouldn't be the only time you're reaching out to your client to initiate the renewal conversation. You want to have a positive relationship throughout the length of the contract to make it much easier for them to be excited about reconsidering it. And if there's no input from you, their team is looking at this in a very simple, there is no gray area situation. They're looking at, what is their return on investment and how much money are they spending on working with you? If you've listened to this podcast for any amount of time, I always talk about if you are negotiating only on money or on price, it is nearly impossible to back yourself out of that corner. And so we don't ever want the conversation to be only about the amount of money that they spend on your projects. This is especially true when you're working on things that are a long game, like growing an organic social media following or SEO writing or things that just take some time to get traction. We want to set our clients up with reasonable expectations when they start working with us and keep in communication with them over the lifetime of the project. So that you've kind of set yourself up for a win with the renewal conversation. You're not waiting until the company reaches out to you about the conversation. You are reaching out to them a few weeks in advance to discuss some of the achievements that you've already had. Now, if you have got some big wins for the client since you started working together, this anticipating a renewal conversation should definitely include that. Let's imagine that you're a writer who published articles for a client. And those got picked up by traditional media and shared all over the internet or went viral or had hundreds of comments, or really got great engagement on Facebook. The client probably told you about those accomplishments, or you saw them organically as you worked on the project, but now is the perfect time to remind them of some of the wins you've gotten because at the end of a contract, it's so much easier for a client to look back and go, Hmm, I don't really remember all the great things that happened, but I do remember how I wanted this to perform better or there's any other negative aspects. You don't want the conversation to be about that. So direct the conversation pre-renewal by highlighting some of the things you've done well. Now, if your client seems open to it, i.e. they haven't had a company-wide meeting and already made the decision to cancel your contract. This preemptive work will really set you up to at a minimum, have a conversation with the client about what their next step is. And it's very possible that in light of the pandemic or other issues, the package that you proposed previously doesn't work anymore. It might not be as simple as just renewing what you're already doing. You have to be willing to pivot and be adaptable in these situations because all businesses are being asked to, to do those things. And so you have to pivot and be adaptable on behalf of your clients, by thinking carefully about what they need the most right now. So if that is something different than what you proposed three months ago, six months ago, a month ago, bring that up to them and suggest different things that might be more helpful. I'll give you an example from one of my coaching clients, there was a prospective client for this coaching client that really wouldn't benefit from the current offerings that the freelancer had. And I've had the situation myself recently, where normally I would recommend blogging to just about all of my clients, but I was working with an attorney who just had no website presence at all. It made no sense for the first thing I recommended to him to be, yes, you need to be blogging eight times a month. He didn't even have the website structure built out properly. He had no technical SEO elements on his page. And so when I wrote the proposal, it was very specific to where his business was at right there. And when my freelance coaching client went back to the prospective client and said, you know what? I don't think that blogging, you know, continued blogging is going to make sense for you. What I am going to recommend is writing great lead magnets and having some email newsletter copy, because you've already built up a following on your email newsletter list. And this is going to be the place where you can get the most sales right now. So as freelancers, it's on us to be mindful of situations happening in the greater economy and marketplace that are forcing our clients to have tough conversations. We have to be there with them. And in order to continue on the path of being taken seriously, as a true partner of your freelance clients, you have to be willing to pivot and adapt to. If you've known for a couple of weeks that your client is struggling financially, but they really believe in your work. Don't just turn around and offer them a renewed contract at the same rate, with the same volume of work, be sensitive to that, think about where they can get wins right now, what is really going to be meaningful for their business right now, this gives them a chance to feel that continued positive relationship with you, that you have their best interests in mind, that you're not just selling things to sell things you're being very strategic and specific in what you offer to your clients. So if a client brings up to you, this idea that they're thinking about decreasing the contract, one of the best things you can do is try to have a conversation around this and not over email, an actual video conversation or a phone conversation about some of where the challenges are at. They may be misperceiving things, and you want to have the opportunity to correct that before they make a rash decision, like ending your contract altogether. So for example, maybe the client had unrealistic expectations about how a Facebook ad campaign was going to perform or how involved it would be to truly update all of the development tools and plugins on your website. If they had unrealistic expectations. And those weren't caught at the beginning of the relationship, they might simply be thinking about ending things because the project just isn't where they anticipated it to be. So if a project has gone off the rails, this is a good chance for you to step in and say, this is where we're at right now. Here are the next couple of things we're focusing on. And here's when you can expect to receive them, having conversations with clients, we'll also give you access to data that you will not find anywhere else. You will get a really good sense of what you can offer to the client, if anything, just by having these conversations, right? So it's really up to you to be the one to take that forward action step, to ask the client, if you can chat about things to do a monthly or quarterly recap of all the things you've done within the project, it makes them feel good that there's still forward progress being made on some of their goals and remove some of that easiness about just saying, you know what, we're going to cancel this project altogether because it's a money issue. Now, if you get on the phone with your client, you're hunting for information about why they're not happy, why they're thinking about decreasing things. If there's something that you're at fault for in this conversation, by all means, own up to it. Just simply say, you know what? I do apologize for that. These were the circumstances around how that happened, and here's what I've put in place to make sure that isn't going to happen again, or here's how we've gotten back on track. Since that point, if they were hoping for different results, you can kind of talk about some of the things that might have contributed to those results or not. Right. Um, I definitely have seen a lot of the metrics with my clients around the pandemic. They're all over the place, right? Like web searching, podcast listening, it's all over the place. And so it's much less consistent than it was in the past. And it's your responsibility as a freelancer to have those conversations with your clients and say that, you know, this is the reason why this has happened. And here's how I've pivoted our strategy a little bit, um, to be mindful of that. So as an example, running Facebook ad campaigns for a company, one of the things that I've learned recently is because people are on their phone more they're at home more, they're spending a lot of time online, a lot of time on social media. They're more receptive to ads in some cases, but they're also much more likely to get annoyed with ads if they see them too many times. So Facebook measures something known as a frequency score, which is how often the same people are seeing the same ad. And if you see the same ad on Facebook or anywhere else over and over, it just annoys you to a certain point, right? You've seen it. You've already made the decision not to engage with it, and that can decrease the effectiveness of your campaign. So where previously my strategy might have been to swap out the copy and creative on Facebook ads every couple of months, that's become more frequent. Now, as I watched that frequency score very carefully, and I'll tell my clients like, you know, some of these strategies we've implemented that have been successful in the past in nonpandemic situations or whatever situation is going on. They're not working right now. And here's how I'm going to recommend that we pivot and adjust that this is where your client sees you as a strategic partner. You have their best interests in mind. You're recognizing when something isn't working and you're adjusting it. Now, if a client just wants to decrease the quality and cost of their overall project, working with you, it is your responsibility to think about whether there's any way to salvage the relationship. If it could do a great deal of damage for them to quit altogether, you need to tell the client that, and not from the perspective of, I don't want to lose your income as a freelancer, but from the perspective of this is important for me to tell you that if you choose to stop working on your SEO efforts, if you suddenly stopped posting on LinkedIn, when you've built a great following there, there's going to be impacts from that. That will be very hard to build back from once you make that decision. So you might not recommend that the client proceed exactly as they were prior to making the decision to drop or decrease the size of the project. But what you are going to do is to make some recommendations with what I call things going on low maintenance mode, right? Maybe it's not achievable for them to be posting on LinkedIn every day. Maybe it's not affordable for them to be paying you to post on LinkedIn every day. This is where you put on your hat as a strategist and say, how can I salvage this relationship? Not only to make sure that I keep the relationship and some of the revenue from it, but do the thing that the client needs the most right now, if people aren't engaging with their posts on LinkedIn, the way that they were in the past, maybe you recommend dialing it down to just two times per week. That way they don't lose all of the traction. They'd built up by being really active on that platform. But you're also not stressing them out with a high bill, paying a freelancer to do it five times a week. So see how important it is to get on the phone and have these conversations because your clients want to hear how you strategize through things. They want to hear you own up to when things maybe aren't performing as well, or the project hasn't been delivered as well, or communication wasn't as professional as they anticipated, but that's not where you leave it. You leave with a next action step of what you recommend they do going forward. And when you can do this, honestly, with integrity and recommend things that are going to benefit the client. Now, even if that does mean honoring their original request to cancel the, or decrease the size of the project, it's far better to do that than to come across as desperate and trying to keep the relationship just for the sake of keeping it. So there's lots of things that you can do when a client talks about needing to be mindful of their budget or being concerned that they're not getting great results, but you don't want those conversations to happen after it's too late, you need to be proactive in how you reach out to your clients and how you structure these conversations. You might just be able to save a relationship altogether. Now, listeners, many of you already know that my second book, The Six-Figure Freelancer is coming out on October 20th, 2020. By pre-ordering the book you'll get four exclusive bonuses and you'll be involved and entered in giveaways and other opportunities for prizes. You can learn more about those bonuses and the book by going to sixfigurefreelancebook.com. Thanks again for tuning in. Meet Laura: Laura Briggs is empowering the freelance generation. Through her public speaking, coaching, and writing, she helps freelancers build the business of their dreams without sacrificing all their time, family, or sanity. Laura burned out as an inner-city middle school teacher before becoming an accidental freelancer with a Google search for “how to become a freelance writer.” Since then, she’s become a contributor to Entrepreneur, Business Insider, and Writer’s Weekly. She worked for more than 300 clients around the world including Microsoft, Truecar, and the Mobile Marketing Association. She’s delivered two TEDx talks on the power of the freelance economy for enabling freedom and flexibility and how it’s being used to address the technical skills gap in the U.S. Laura is the host of the Advanced Freelancing podcast, a sought-after public speaker on the gig and digital freelance economy, and a freelance coach focused on aspiring six-figure freelancers. Laura’s books, courses, and coaching have reached over 10,000 people. As a military spouse, Laura is passionate about serving her community and founded Operation Freelance, a nonprofit organization that teaches veterans and military spouses how to become freelancers and start their own business.

When you get saved, all your problems disappear.....RIGHT? Well...not really. Be encouraged, you really are becoming new - one day at a time. This week, Kingdom Speak is challenging you to strategize. Are you playing from day to day, or are you living the "Long Game"?  The full episode drops Friday at 2pm EST!

Compared to conventional methods of energy generation, like fossil fuels, greenhouse gases emitted from renewables are little-to-none; making them the cleanest, most viable solution to prevent environmental degradation. In this episode, we invite Brandy Giannetta, Senior Director at Canadian Renewable Energy Association, to discuss renewable energy and the realistic strategies for increasing its supply to permanently replace the remaining carbon-intensive energy sources in Canada. Related Content & Links: https://hydroottawa.com/ Websites: Canadian Renewable Energy Association https://renewablesassociation.ca/ Linkedin: https://www.linkedin.com/in/brandy-giannetta-45872539/ Transcript: Dan Seguin  00:02 Hey, everyone. I'm Dan Seguin from hydro Ottawa. And I'll be hosting the think energy podcast. Are you looking to better understand the fast changing world of energy? Join me every two weeks and get a unique perspective from industry leaders as we deep dive and discuss some of the coolest trends, emerging technologies, and latest innovations that drive the energy sector. So stay tuned as we explore some traditional and some quirky facets of this industry.  Hey, everyone, welcome back. This is the ThinkEnergy podcast. We've all heard the saying 'it's not easy being green'. But when it comes through renewable generation, is that true? With all the scientific evidence out there, being a climate change denier is becoming more and more synonymous with being a flat-earther. It's clear that humans have been polluting our atmosphere with carbon dioxide and other global warming emissions. NASA, the World Health Organization and the United Nations say we have to change the way we live, work and play. As we face our own extinction, what is the answer? Do we have the courage to be green? Are we okay with it not being easy. That brings us to renewable energy. How easy or difficult is it? How does it improve our health, environment and economy? Where is Canada at? And are we on track to becoming a global climate leader? Are we leveraging renewable energy within the electricity system. And do we have enough new renewable capacity to power our energy needs compared to conventional methods of generation like fossil fuels, greenhouse gases emitted from renewables our little to none, making them the cleanest, most viable solution to prevent environmental degradation. Renewable sources of electricity have powered Canada for more than a century. According to Natural Resources Canada, renewable energy sources currently provide about 17% of Canada's total primary energy supply, with wind and solar as the fastest growing in the country. So here's today's big question. What is a realistic strategy to increasing the supply of renewable energy so that we can permanently replace the remaining carbon intensive energy sources in Canada. And what would the global impact be? Joining me today is Brandy Giannetta. From the Canadian Renewable Energy Association, Brandy is a regional director responsible for promoting, communicating and advocating for adoption of the associations policies, with political representatives, members of government, media, and other key stakeholders and decision makers. Brandy, welcome to the show. Maybe start us off by talking about the Canadian Renewable Energy Association. its mandate and why it's important for Canada. Brandy Giannetta  03:46 Sure thing! Well the Canadian Renewable Energy Association: We are a national Industry Association is we we see ourselves as the voice for wind energy, solar energy and energy storage solutions, here in Canada with the goal of powering Canada's energy future. So our association really works to create the conditions for modern energy solutions vis-à-vis stakeholder advocacy, public engagement at several different levels. So we are a multi Technology Industry Association and we are new. We are looking again to provide that unified voice for renewable energy as well as energy storage across Canada. So we're the product of uniting what was the Canadian Wind Energy Association with what was the Canadian solar industry association so CANWEA and CANSIA our well-known names as having had decades of advocacy in Canada on behalf of the wind sector in the solar sector in Canada. And now we're one new expanded Industry Association, so very exciting, which also now includes, of course, energy storage. So that's in recognition of that pivotal role that energy storage is going to play alongside those renewable technologies as we look to transform Canada's energy mix. Dan Seguin  04:59 What is the Canadian Renewable Energy Association's role in transforming Canada's energy mix? Brandy Giannetta  05:08 Right? So Well, our new joint venture as one's association is really going to enable our members as well as the association itself to secure what we think is going to be a larger piece of the fat future energy pie that could normally have been achieved as single technologies or single entities. So our technologies having common interests in common characteristics will with respect to that policy, energy policy, you know, climate policy, different markets and regulatory frameworks throughout Canada, and really advocating within those commonalities to support the deployment of all of the technologies or solutions. So I didn't mention in the front that we have over 300 members within our association that represent that full scope of the sector. So we're really uniquely positioned to do that as an industry association, but I see some really sort of specific aspects of how we will do that. In what our strategy will entail. And I alluded to a little bit around the advocacy side, providing access to credible and timely information, and industry engagement. So that's an internal process, as well as an F front facing sort of public facing engagement role that will play. So as a national Industry Association, as I mentioned, we will be active at the federal level from an advocacy perspective, but will we're also present in multiple jurisdictions across Canada. So we advocate for policies that focus on that transition to a clean economy, but it's powered by renewable energy solutions. So that's really the key there. What are what are one of the things we'll be working toward is to create new opportunities, but also to remove the existing barriers that are stopping us from realizing those, those solutions and ultimately, that will enhance the deployment of our technologies throughout the country, and what we really consider to be safe and sustainable, environmentally friendly manner, but also a big part of that advocacy side and credible information and front facing side of what we do will be to increase public awareness of our technologies as they stand. But also, most importantly, the benefits that they provide that they're already providing to communities throughout Canada. And across the future, the potential to do even more. So federally, we have, you know, number one priority is to make sure that we're well positioned to contribute to economic recovery, particularly in a COVID situation that we're in right now. But also as a unified voice for the renewable side and energy storage, we're going to really try to help navigate Canada to an emissions reduction targets, we're going to create good jobs, we're going to stimulate the economy, you know, we're going to be present in urban centers and rural centers and indigenous communities. So we have so much value to offer. And as a collective effort, we're really going to try to influence those public policies that are really energy focused and economic stimulus focus to be able to do that. And we can do it because they'll probably say this a lot. We're a really scalable set of resources and when you put us all together, we're really well suited to power that transition. Dan Seguin  08:03 How is your association positioned to deliver clean, low cost, reliable, flexible, and scalable solutions for Canada's energy needs? Brandy Giannetta  08:14 Well, I'm glad you said it first, because I think I'll be repeating myself a lot, because that's the key. We're low cost, we're reliable. You know, we offer flexible, scalable solutions. So we have a headquarters in Ottawa, we're nationally, you know, present. But we also have people in the key regions across Canada from east to west and centrally and connect in Toronto. And we definitely look to influence regionally regional policies as well as national policies. And we definitely have a public facing communication side where we're advocating for energy solutions that will leverage the value proposition that renewables and energy storage provide together. So we're going to have what I talked about a little earlier with that internal forum for dialogue for our members that enables us to really collaborate provided opportunities for the stewardship of our technologies but also the growth of the industry across Canada and Canadian economies. So renewable energy and energy storage, as I noted, have a really important and central role to play as we transform our Canadian energy mix. And we see electricity markets adapting to these transformational demands to not only decarbonize, but as a result, electrify new sectors with clean electricity resources. So that reality has really been a huge driver in that tremendous new market opportunity for renewable energy and energy storage together. As we sort of get more comfortable with what that transition looks like and what it entails, our electricity system here in Canada is really going to need increased, actually, I would say significantly increased amounts of renewable energy, energy storage and at the utility scale. So our grids need to be powered by clean supply of renewables backed up by energy storage, and we need to make sure that they remain affordable, reliable, flexible, and scalable, as you noted, so that's going to mean, you know, large utility scale deployment of renewables and energy storage, but also a significant uptake and sort of mobilization of those behind the meter application. So distributed energy resources, for example. And putting that new collaborative framework in place like we've done at our association, is going to fully be able to allow us to fully leverage that opportunity. Dan Seguin  10:23 Let me ask you this. Is the renewable energy industry primed to enter a new phase of growth driven largely by increasing customer demand and cost competitiveness? Are you seeing a culture shift? Brandy Giannetta  10:38 Definitely, yes, there has been and it's, it's, I would say, Now more than ever, that we are realizing that culture shift and we're starting to see things materialize as a result of that shift. So ultimately, the needs and the wants of Canadian consumers have evolved but they're continuing to evolve. So you know, energy technologies: these aren't the only thing. It's markets that are innovating. The costs are coming down, as we all know, to a significantly affordable level. Business models as a result are also changing, not just here in Canada, but globally. So it's a global trend. It's not unique to Canada, we are well poised to follow those global trends and capitalize on the learnings and advancements of technology as well as the market and business structures that have evolved as well. So renewable energy and energy storage as solutions. Focused approaches are really increasingly contributing to those electricity grids and energy systems at a large scale, which in that what that means is that we're enhancing the reliability aspect and offerings, the flexibility of the technologies. And because we're super scalable, as I told you, I'll talk about that a lot, because it's certainly an attractive aspect of the advocacy side. The scalability of our energy production and use in Canada and abroad is really a factor there because we can do it at whatever scale needed for whatever system You know, is being sought. So a consciousness about the environment continues to grow alongside that. So we got energy policy and economic stimulus, but we also have environmental policy and the drivers for decarbonisation, and electrification of the sectors that aren't traditionally powered by electricity, like cars and transportation like but a large scale as well as buildings are really increasing the demand for energy solutions that are non-emitting affordable, scalable, flexible, and all of those great things. And that's something that obviously our industries can provide. So our vision really, ultimately is to ensure that renewable energy being solar and wind and energy storage on top of that are playing that central role as we transform the mix so that we can continue to provide those solutions across the board. Dan Seguin  12:43 Randy, do you believe that renewables like wind and solar can help deliver the Clean Power jobs needed for sustainable economic delivery? Brandy Giannetta  12:55 For sure, I mean, the calls for an economic recovery right now that are grind Clean Energy and Climate Action are increasingly growing and becoming more prevalent across the across the globe. We've got the International Energy Agency, for example, who called this a historic opportunity, you know, despite the fact that we're in a global pandemic, and there are many crises to manage. We're taking our cues from the International Energy Agency as a proper agency seeking, you know, recognition that we have an opportunity upon us that is historic and in its nature, the International Monetary Fund as well has its leadership has come out to say that we must do everything within our power to make it a green recovery. So right here in Canada, we in particular, are signatories to a public letter, which has asked Canadian governments to pursue a resilient recovery to the COVID situation in particular. So we've got hundreds of signatories representing over a you know, I think over 2000 now, Canadian companies that are right here, you know, headquarters here in Canada that have signed that letter seeking campaign. In order to pursue federal and provincial governments to commit to a clean recovery and resilience plan, so the the renewable energy sector as well as energy storage industries, we're making a case for those policies, energy policies, economic stimulus, packaging, recovery policies that are, you know, threefold, we need to make sure that they're economically timely and long lasting, so right time, right place, and that they are sustainable, making sure that they're environmentally sound. So there needs to be that environmental sustainability attached to those policies. And then eminently feasible, they have to be practical, realistic and actually implementable with a proven success here in Canada or elsewhere. So that we can capitalize on that and truly, you know, make that history that the International Energy Agency has referred to. So our federal government stimulus and recovery efforts in particular, I think our focus right now for us because we think that those efforts can create jobs, they can spur clean tech innovation. They will encourage economic diversification across many sectors, not just the energy sector, but also ultimately we're going to cut carbon pollution while doing that and why not because that illness causing you know, air pollution is something that we can tackle at the same time while we grow our economy. And really what we're looking to do is make Canada more resilient country, and we want to do it on the back of our energy sector. So we really believe that's important. And we do believe that those initiatives taken in support of economic recovery also allow us to address all those significant other challenges like climate change. So it's really important that we invest in wind energy and solar energy and in energy storage at appropriate scales and in appropriate locations, so that we can deliver the jobs, the economic benefits, making sure that today we're realizing those benefits, and then building out that longer term infrastructure that's sustainable, it's going to provide a really strong foundation for a lot more investment down the road. And again, jobs economic activities going to all spur as we as we build out those little as of tomorrow, Dan Seguin  16:01 so climate adaptation and resilience stand out as rapidly emerging areas of employment as a result of climate change impacts, what types of careers are in demand? And at what rate are jobs in clean energy sector growing? Brandy Giannetta  16:20 That's a great question because you know, the numbers are there. So we know the stats, and we can say it all those figures. And I'll talk a little bit about that. But the jobs are exciting. And there's no limit to the types of jobs one of the greatest stats that I love. And I check it out every year as the annual numbers come out of the US in particular is the wind turbine technicians and solar technicians that has continuously year over year over the past several years, ranked as one of the fastest growing occupations in the United States. So that's really exciting because that resonates here in Canada as well as we build out our industry. In fact, we did a wind energy supply chain study in Alberta, a few years back and it really detailed the breakdown of the jobs required just for a wind farm in particular And it was varied from the very, you know, technical and professional engineering requirements, geotechnical type requirements siting and negotiation of land agreements, and the regulatory advocacy work as well as environmental side of that. There's also, you know, the broader procurement construction side and you know, transportation logistics, you know, setting up a crane and having that that broader service industry attached to the evolution of the sector. So it's really a significant cross section of very technical and professional quality career type positions, research driven things from environmental sustainability, and then the, you know, the heavy lifting of the transportation and construction side of things. So there's a lot of, we're seeing offshoots of service jobs as well. And one of the large one of the aspects of the solar side, especially behind the meter, and that large uptake of solar installations behind the meter has created a lot of opportunities is very labor intensive. And we're seeing from the solar industry, significant numbers on manufacturing, sales, distribution and wholesale careers. We've got the installation community as well across Canada growing at an exponential rate, operations and maintenance will remain a significant portion of a sophisticated workforce. And then as I said, that offshoot service industry that supplies the services to those things. So as you can see, it's not a shortlist of jobs. It is, is a varied and like I said, extensive list of job opportunities that will continue to evolve and grow. Now, if you want to talk about statistics, the rate that it's growing at, we have already over 300,000 people employed in the clean energy sector in Canada. So that number has continued to grow by close to 5% every year, and it's slated to continue to do so which just to give you some perspective is about a third faster than Canada's economy as a whole and its growth rate, which is just under 4%. So by 2030, the projections that we're relying on today show us that there will be over a half a million Canadians employed and gainful full time lucrative careers in the clean energy sector, across the country. And that's going to be, you know, thanks in part to continued commitment to climate policies, to programs that are supporting robust clean economy type stimulus, and that growth rate will continue to evolve as a result. So it's very good news, Dan Seguin  19:21 Brandy, in a world where distributed energy resources are increasingly valued. I'd love to hear your views on both the wind and solar value proposition as compelling options and how customers can more actively manage their demand. Brandy Giannetta  19:39 Right? Well, I have to go back to the old you know, the the reference to scalability, wind energy, solar energy, even energy storage - extremely scalable. What that means, as I as I noted earlier, is that these technologies, you know, they're well positioned to transform our energy system, but they can provide solutions at a micro level or a macro level. So at the micro level, distributed energy resources can be deployed in a number of ways to empower the customers that are seeking those technologies. And then of course, then scaled according to a very unique set of needs as defined by the customers themselves. And they're affordable. So more and more energy customers of all types, as I think I said this already, or they're seeking, you know, clean, affordable, safe, all of those all of those buzzwords and properties and principled approaches to pursuing these technologies as solutions. And ultimately, they're less and less focused on a single technology to provide it. Is it smart? Does it make sense does it fit all those boxes being checked, you know, whether that's wind, solar or storage at the scale that's required. That's really that's the value of that as a solution of these technologies as a solution option, and they're multifaceted. So I think that really there's definitely clear public desire, obviously for clean and affordable as we've noted many times, but those solutions behind the meter, so smaller scale applications, Like rooftop solar panels, personalized home energy storage systems, things like that are going to continue to evolve and provide those solutions at other larger rate. And the innovation behind those distributed energy resources is really what's, you know, allowing us to be poised to meet the demands of today's customers, but we evolve those offerings for the future needs and wants as well. So that transition again, clean, renewable sources, is very important. And the impact for the consumer and ultimately, our economy and environment are what's really driving the value proposition there. Dan Seguin  21:33 As solar and wind power come closest to meeting three key energy consumer priorities—cost-effectiveness, decarbonization, and reliability—what role will they play with microgrids and self-sufficiency? Brandy Giannetta  21:50 Oh, great question. Again, all those buzzwords but important ones right. They're really principled realities and, you know, criteria that we're aiming towards So the successful and enhanced uptake of micro grids and self-sufficiency will be motivated as long as we continue to meet those principles and those criteria. So remember flexible, scalable, and portable. So we've got a micro level, you know, distributed energy resource, and we can deploy it in a number of ways. So I talked a little bit about in the previous question about, you know, based on what the customer's needs and wants are. So, you know, some really, you know, tangible examples of that are converting remote communities that aren't grid connected, so they have no wires and no transmission access. And they've been running on diesel generators for decades for generations really. And we're going to convert those to sustainable micro grids, we're going to use solar panels, we're going to use industrial size storage, whether that's batteries or otherwise, and maybe even a wind turbine or two, if it makes sense. You do it to scale. And now you've got a remote community that's self-generating, you know, non-emitting, and it's quite independent. And that's, that's a success story in and of itself. Distributed energy resources, can really promote increased energy self-sufficiency. And through other examples that are a little simpler even like deployment of rooftop solar in neighborhoods, you know, we're going to use it to heat your house your water instead of the electrical or gas hot water heater, maybe you're using it to heat your pool. So you're not running you know, another gas line or gas system in your urban areas, but also providing electricity more broadly like bigger installations on hospitals and colleges and universities and schools like that municipal buildings, all of those are all you know, fall into the bucket of distributed energy resources which promote self-sufficiency and ultimately, renewable energy powered things like charging stations for electrical vehicles is enhanced. You know, I would say ultimately, self-sufficiency, proper and enhanced reliability go hand in hand because you can couple that with energy efficiency, electric vehicles, charging as well as discharging and smart grids and even certain demand response measures. So the list goes on and on. You know, we can unpack them but though it's quite, I would say quite lucrative. And again, it all comes back to the fact that scales scalability. Dan Seguin  24:09 Brandy, can you help me understand what the role of storage plays in the deployment and advancement of renewable energy? Brandy Giannetta  24:17 Oh, sure. Well, on a larger scale like utility side, the technologies renewables can be deployed in complimentary ways to supply and support our broader electricity grids. Or they can be used as a co-located or hybrid resource with facilities like wind projects, wind farms and solar projects. Adding energy storage in order to firm that utility scale offering of energy to the grid, so firm power, or capacity, if you will, but by working together, the renewables and energy storage present a broader and more diverse range of not just firm energy offerings, but for customer seeking other things that diversity in tech technology provides scale grid services and other products for lack of a better word to the grid operator. And then ultimately, if you're looking at a smaller scale to the customer, as standalone efforts to enhance the needs that they have identified, sometimes that's offsetting their peak demand use and other aspects and applicability of the energy storage component can be used that way. So, the scale varies large scale utility grid offering to smaller scale behind the meter solutions is a really energy storage in particular, as a technology has a central role to play in that in that transformation to be able to make those solutions tangible and affordable and implementable. Dan Seguin  25:48 Now for the million dollar question, how is Canada faring as a global climate leader? In your opinion, what is the low hanging fruit and what has the potential to have the biggest impact to the industry and maybe the world? Brandy Giannetta  26:06 Well, sure, Canada is in a great position already, because we are starting from a spot of having strong renewable and non-emitting electricity base. So there remains also a massive untapped potential for wind, solar and hydro resources to continue to be developed. And so I would say that we're as one of the best countries or countries best position to eliminate our fossil fuel use any electricity generation in particular. And then the abundance of our resources means that we're then also well positioned to support significant increase in non-emitting or renewable electricity supply to power those other fossil fuel intensive industries, like I mentioned earlier transportation and buildings. So we do need to move away from fossil fuels for those other industries as well. And we can do it on the back of the electricity sector in Canada, as it currently stands, but we can also evolve that significantly because we already have the resources. And I think the number is associated with deep decarbonisation and vision that we need to increase our electricity production by two or three times to reach our sort of net zero GHG emission targets. And we already, like I said, have all of those resources available to us to do that. So it's a matter of the will and, you know, transitioning to that, as a global leader, we can really, I think, step ahead of the crowd and shine. Dan Seguin  27:26 What is exciting you about the renewable energy industry right now? Brandy Giannetta  27:33 Well, we're on the right side of history, we always have been but now more than ever, I think the stars are really aligning, you know, we've got decreasing costs, our customer demand and knowledge is growing at a rate. I don't know that any of us could have predicted a few you know, a decade ago, that emissions free zero marginal cost fuel, it's never going to go away. It’s here to stay. It’s scalable, it's flexible, and it’s decentralized. All of those buzzwords, which we can unpack any single one of them. That's exciting. But really put them all together. And I don't know, how exciting is that? Like, I don't know if I'm if I'm making the assumption, but I think it speaks for itself, like we are in a really good place right now, for all those reasons, and we need to be excited about it. Dan Seguin  28:15 Here's my last question, Brandy. What keeps you up at night? Brandy Giannetta  28:21 Well, you know, I think governments across Canada, you know, they need to take the politics out of the energy sector. And the decision making processes really need to be based on fair and transparent competition. You know, we've all, you know, leveling that playing field for us all and taking the politics out of it, because that decision making process really needs to be aimed at providing the best solution to clearly define problems without the politics and that's not to say there's not a role for governments and energy policy. There certainly is, but sound policy, stable investment signals, those things need to outweigh the politics in order to realize that, you know, progress and innovation it’s so ripe for the picking. And I think our good friend Geddy Lee, a Canadian icon, says it best when he said "progress has no patience, but something's got to give." So those are the things that I stay up at night thinking about. Dan Seguin  29:11 Brandy, we've reached the end of another episode of the thick energy podcast. How can our listeners learn more about you and your association? How can they connect? Brandy Giannetta  29:23 Well, like I said, we are new. So we've got a brand new shiny website up and running. It's renewablesassociation.ca. We're active on Twitter and LinkedIn, mostly, we've got Facebook and maybe a couple of other social channels. But we're going to continue to be evolving those sites over the summer in both English and French, which is very exciting and very important to us as a national Industry Association to be fully bilingual. So I would say that your best efforts reach out vis-à-vis our website. We're a small but mighty team, and so we're listed there and you can contact us centrally through the website is probably your best bet. Dan Seguin  29:57 Again. Thank you so much for joining me today, I hope you had a lot of fun. Brandy Giannetta  30:02 I sure did. Thank you so much for the opportunity. I really appreciate it. Dan Seguin  30:07 Thank you for joining us today. I truly hope you enjoyed this episode of The ThinkEnergy podcast. For past episodes, make sure you visit our website hydroottawa.com/podcast. Lastly, if you found value in this podcast, be sure to subscribe. Cheers, everyone.

In this bonus episode this is a previous recording of a strong life chat I did with my man Zach Even Esh on IG!  In Zach's words " What a BEAST of a STORY do I have to share with you this Morning. My friend of 10+ years, Coach Gags, shared his story, actually, his JOURNEY of losing 100+ lbs since we've met. Gags and I met when he attended 1 of my seminars sometime around 2009 or so, maybe 2008. Perhaps it was a business seminar, I don't recall. It's all a blur sometimes :) From there, Gags attended The USC Cert and then EVERY seminar I put on since then, he attended and CRUSHED. Gags would come and assist in coaching The USC Cert and he would OWN the stage when he spoke. He is a PRO through & through. The guy is ALL heart. And I gotta tell ya, that is NOT the norm in this industry. There are some cut throat, back stabbin' SOBs running these streets, unfortunately. You'd think otherwise, right? You'd think a "Coach" is Living the Code. Heck, if you're gonna talk about it you assume these people are Living it? Right? Well,unfortunately, this is not always the case. Many Coaches will burn and stab others just to sell​ ​their latest program or course. And some Coaches, heck, they'd burn friendships and even their own family to make that next sale. It's a shame. It's heartbreaking. It sometimes makes me feel embarrassed to be a ​ ​part of this industry. Hence, why I often say, I am NOT part of this "fitness industry". But NOT Gags. Gags is all heart. ALL. HEART. I Love this guy. Seeing him succeed on all levels as he is now with his health, his business, his mindset...... it honestly makes me feel good in a way that is tough to describe. I LOVE seeing the GOOD guys win. Gags has overcome MANY obstacles and tough times. Every time I see him, he's got a smile on his face. It reminds me..... When I come around to organizing the next Underground Strength Conference, I HAVE to get Coach Gags to be a speaker. He can lift a car or teach you to lose 100lbs. He walks the walk while others only TALK about it. As I love to say...... REAL RECOGNIZE REAL. " Awesome to have him as a friend and mentor over the years!  Looking for online programming and coaching? Click below http://www.gaglionestrength.com/gaglione-power/ Sign up for a trial workout here http://www.gaglionestrength.com/programs/ Schedule a consult using link below  https://gaglionestrengthconsults.as.me Looking for additional resources to support your goals?   Use these Helpful Links below to kick start your gains and support our team!   GS Approved Supplements  GS Approved Powerlifting Gear and Equipment   GS Approved Food and Nutritional Support    GS Approved Guided Programing 

Hi everybody. Thank you so much for being here today. I am so excited to introduce you to the owner of The College Investor. His name is Robert Farrington. He's with us today. Robert, you want to say hello? Robert Hey Carey and Everyone, thanks so much for having me. I'm excited to be here. Cool. And you're, you're out in sunny, Southern California. I'm here in Atlanta. So, um, it's nice place to be during this time of year, especially. No, it's great. I I'm blessed to be able to be here. Awesome. Well, tell us a little about yourself and how you got started with your company, the college investor. Definitely. So I started the college investor, honestly, as a side hustle. When I was finishing college, I had always been passionate about making money investing and, uh, you know, I wanted to share my random thoughts on the topic with people. And I, you know, I really love technology and websites and I saw some other bloggers starting and I was like, you know, I can, I can start a blog and share my thoughts as well. And so that's honestly how it started over 10 years ago now at this point in time. And it's just really grown into a full on, uh, you know, media company at this point in time. But it started just as me wanting to share my random thoughts and kind of evolved quite a bit from there. Wow. That's amazing. And are your customers teenagers, college students, parents? Can you tell us a little bit about who, who, um, you help? Yeah, Definitely. So I started really just wanting to share my thoughts mostly with young adults, right. But at this point in time, I would say most of the people we help are anywhere from college graduates to families, to people approaching retirement. Um, you know, we don't get too many young people and we don't get too many retirees, but everyone in the middle there, um, seems to be who we help. And sadly, I think that kind of reflects more on how who's dealing with student loan debt. Who's trying to get started in life. Who's trying to get investing than anything else. So, um, yeah, we have a really broad range of people we help. That's awesome. Such a needed thing. And I don't think people really know where to turn. So your blog helps with discovery online. Right? And that's it? I mean, So student loans is one of our bread and butter topics and, uh, it's hard because there are so many options out there and there are so few tools out there to help people and the tools that we have, like they don't, people don't trust them because it's like our loan servicers, and they're the ones that are part of the problem. And so, you know, it's really hard for people to get an independent resource, to help them navigate their student loan debt. Um, and then in turn, you know, start building wealth and navigating personal finance because, you know, sadly it's not something that's usually taught in school and, you know, a lot of people's role models might not have been the best in terms of showing them how to do it. That's so true. Yeah. I've heard that, like kids have to move home after college and, um, gosh, with the, with that pandemic now it's even harder to find a job. So can you tell us yeah. What, what services do you provide and can, can you kind of take us through like the buying journey online? Like where did they discover you and kind of, how does it go from there with the various interactions? Yeah, definitely. So, I mean, we're a traditional media site. So the services we really provide are just trying to provide the best in depth, comprehensive knowledge that you can have when it comes to personal finance topics. Um, we do a broad range of editorial content. We also review as many products and services as we can find to give people an honest opinion on, you know, what's legit, what's not legit, what's the best, what's not the best. Um, you know, we do have some products and services as well. We have lone buddy, which is our DIY student loan software. You can put all your information in and, you know, it'll tell you the best outcome for your student loans. Um, but really like, I really want to educate and that's really the bread and butter of what the college investor is. It's designed to educate people on their student loans on their money. And, you know, we really try to be top notch and search we're on social or on video or on audio because I'm also a big believer in meeting people where they're at. And, uh, you know, if people really listen to podcasts, like listen to this show, right? Like they're listening to audio, so can we connect with them there? But you know, there's also a good contingent of people that love YouTube and love videos. So how do we connect with them there? And then of course there's always the traditional reading and searching for things on Google and we want to connect with them there as well. Yeah. Awesome. You sound really savvy like, because you've been and also have been in business for 10 years. That's funny. Yeah. You know, it's, it's hard. I mean, we didn't start there though. I think it's important to, if you're starting out like pick one lane and then iterate as you go forward, because it's a lot of work too. That's right. And you really want to listen to your customers and find out what they're needing and kind of pivot from there. Would you say you're like, are you finding that people are having a harder time now managing their college debt and earning income? Like have you shifted at all since COVID has hit Oh yes. A hundred percent. So it's sad because, you know, there's just topics now that we didn't touch on until now. So unemployment stimulus checks, uh, how to navigate some of the small business loan programs. Um, what's out there for side hustlers, people that were driving for Uber and door dash. How did that, how does that work in the new unemployment system? Um, and these are topics that historically, I mean, in 10 years, we've never really had to dive in and talk about, and, you know, people don't really care so much about other things when they're like, I don't have a job today and I don't know when I'm going to be working again, like what can I do today? And so it's really been important for us to put out the best content we can as fast as we can, but it's also been challenging because I mean, it's been a fire hose of information coming out of Washington DC. And it seems like these programs are changing and shifting and, you know, new proposals are coming out all the time. And so there's also a ton of misinformation out there. And so for us, it's really cutting through all that misinformation, trying to get people what's accurate and timely, um, so that they can, you know, help themselves today. Yeah. That's, that's really so important. And also with mental health now that, you know, they, the reports are saying that mental health in the world really is really getting worse and worse because of the challenges that people have financially, you know, with the relationships that might not be so great at home and stuff like that. So I would think like you providing support and some reassurance that there is a way there are there answers, you know, would probably help a lot of people. Do you have, do you have any stories? I know that's not like something we necessarily talked about, but I was just wondering if any good stories or examples? I mean, it's, it is sad. I do see a lot of it. I mean, sadly, one of the things that has increased in trending a lot is suicide and student loan debt. And a lot of people see that as the option. And it is really heartbreaking because there's a lot of options out there that is definitely not a good option. And, but people don't know how to navigate it. And when people are in such desperate straights and there's not a lot of answers out there and there's definitely no one to help you. And now in this remote day and age where like, you can't necessarily have like someone with you, like it's all virtual, it's even more challenging. So it is definitely challenging. It's sometimes sad to see, but that's why we also try to be there is that source of education be there as those tools and resources so that hopefully people find the answer before it's too late. Yes.... Do you have a Facebook group? I know I went on all your social media. You're on a lot of different platforms. Do you, do you do help people connect with each other? So they don't feel like they're alone?  We Do have a large Facebook group, ....probably about 24,000 people in it.  you know, I keep it pretty vague cause it's, it's the investing and personal finance Facebook group and it's all for people that are interested in money topics. And so yeah, we do find a lot of connection and things in there, but it's hard because, you know, it runs the gambit of people's personal financial situations. I mean, you have to have so many people and so many diverse perspectives that even in a Facebook group type setting, it's hard to foster connections. And then the other challenge with money topics is that there's a lot of people that prey on other people, insurance salesman or, you know, unscrupulous financial planner. And so sometimes when people do open up, I mean, they just get unsolicited, you know, direct messages and, and things. And you know, so it's, it's very challenging to, you know, make sure people connect, but you know, you have to remember you're online and people try to take advantage of that as well. I hadn't thought of that. That's so true. And then it's just the main maintaining it, like, and making sure as the owner of the group that you like, see if there's any inappropriate comments and stuff like that. Right. Yes. So, I mean, we're very vigilant. We're very vigilant on it.  We do. We have a good moderator team and, you know, we have all the Facebook alerts set up. So when people comment certain things it flags right away, but where they get around it is through those direct messages. So I would say like every two weeks we have to remind our group, if you get an unsolicited direct message, please let the moderator team know so we can take action and remove it. And I've been known to publicly shame some of these unscrupulous insurance salesman. I'll reach out to their companies and organizations and say Hey, you need to follow up with this individual.... Who's violating your company, social media policy, and you need to follow up because it drives me nuts. Especially I rag on insurance people a lot, but it really usually is insurance salesmen, not financial planners. And they do not have the best interests of you at heart. They are trying to sell you on a product that you probably don't need. And it drives me nuts. Yeah. Well, I have a friend that is in that industry and she said that, and this isn't true for all., but she said that the management was still kind of pushing the salespeople as if it weren't like COVID and like just like pushing them so hard. And so you sometimes kind of wonder like how much of is coming from the leadership and doing the right thing for the customer and having the salespeople be the, the interacting face and yeah, it can, it can be so easy online and can be kind of dangerous to people if they're in a vulnerable situation as to what's real, what's not real, what should I pay attention to?  Yeah, my rule of thumb though, is, you know, no one in this world is going to care more about your money than you. So always go into every conversation with that in mind, you know, anyone that's out there trying to help you probably isn't going to care as much as you do because they have no reason to.  Yes!  And start young and they're always there. Time is on your side when you're younger, I can attest to that. So what, what are some of the most important things you think that the younger generations need to know about personal finance? I think the biggest thing for me is that it starts with getting organized and this might sound counterintuitive to like a personal finance conversation. But honestly, there's just so many moving parts today to everyone's money. Right? You have different incomes, you got side hustle, income, your job income, you have multiple accounts, probably got a bank account, a savings account. You got maybe a 401k. Maybe you have an IRA. And then like you have a bunch of expenses. You might have a credit card or a debit card and you're charging. So it starts with just getting organized with your money. And the other thing that's hard about this is everyone's different. So like I'm an app guy, right? So I like to have my finances on an app on my phone. And that's where I'm most comfortable, but I'm not everybody. Some people really like Excel spreadsheets. Other people really like planners and pen and paper and writing stuff down on like a paper calendar. So the real thing is, is find whatever style works for you and get organized with your money because you can't make an informed decision about what to do. If you don't know where everything is, what's coming in, what's going out. Like, should you budget better? I don't know. Are you organized? Should you try to get a side hustle? Like, I don't know. Do you need to earn more money? Like if you're not organized, you can't make the next financial decision. Hm. Good point. Yeah. And just not putting it off, like, there are different types, like you said, it's individual and there's some different types of people and some people avoid, some people worry, some people don't, you know, they're so generous. They give, give all their money away to other people like theirs. Yes, totally. And if you put, if you don't know what's happening, like you can't even make the decision. And I, and I will tell you that in 10 years of working with people, helping people, talking to people that 99% of people that are struggling, it all goes back to this organization. And well, if I ask I'm like, well, like what's your budget look like I don't have one. Or, or like, what's the shortfall? Like, are you short a hundred bucks a month in your monthly expenses? Like where do you, what, what is it? And they couldn't tell me how much debt do you have? I don't know. When are you going to pay off that debt? I don't know. Um, you'd just be, it always starts with knowledge. Like if you get organized, you know, where everything is, then you can decide like maybe, maybe all you need to do is cut $50 off your monthly expenses and you will be in the black and you'll be rocking and rolling, and you can do that easily, but maybe there's a bigger gap here. Maybe it's a $500 gap. Maybe you need to look at getting a second job or a side hustle or asking for a raise at work. But like, we can't even figure that out if you don't have it all laid out and organized and know what's going on. Yes. So knowledge is power and reality as well. Like when you get organized in whatever way that is, like you said, it's a variety of different ways to get organized, but then you have it in front of you. And, you know, you have that knowledge which has power to move forward and then take steps that, you know, really help, help get to the next, next level and security financial stuff. Exactly. And that's the thing is, you know, personal finance is personal. Right. And so I can't tell you, I can't just say it's a blanket, one size fits, all thing. Like it definitely is a personal conversation And accountability. Would you say that, like your services kind of help people with any accountability at all? Or do you not really track that? Yes, we don't really track it because it's hard. I don't also want to get in the business of being the data collector. Um, you know, it is personal, right. And there's also a lot of laws and regulations and rules and other things around all that kind of stuff. Um, but really it's about, you know, getting organized, but then we can take the next steps and I love being there to guide out. Like, let's, let's talk about budgeting and let's talk about earning more. I'm a big believer of the earn more mindset, like, uh, you know, yeah. There's probably some fat, we can all cut from our budgets, but like, is there a way you can go out and side hustle and earn a little bit extra and then live a lifestyle you'd like to live more of instead of like really cutting down to nothing. I love that. That's huge right now, like on, on tiktok, do you, have you ever gone on ticktock ? I'm a fan of tiktok. We were really doubling down on tiktok and I follow a lot of the financial influencers and others and, I'm all about, I'm all about tictok! Speaker 1: (16:19)All right. Let's talk tick tack for a little bit then, because I actually have not touched on this yet in our series. And so this would be a great start since you're a fan. So how did you get on, when did you get on and kind of what, what is, what are you finding as far as like what people like? So, I mean, I've been, I've been on the platform since last fall, so probably about nine months now, but we didn't start creating content until earlier this year. I really just like consumed. I just consumed a lot of content seeing what was working, what's not working and I'm still figuring out I'm not by an expert by any means. But the one thing I love about tiktok is that even if you don't have a huge following on tiktok, your posts have a very good chance of going viral. If you're following trends and talking about interesting things and, or just being interesting. And so a lot of people think tic talk is like about dancing to music and, you know, yeah, that's a good chunk of it, maybe 50%, but I would say the other 50% is, you know, just people talking, being interesting, being funny, being entertaining in some way, shape or form. And, and for us on talking about money on Tech-Talk, it's the same concept. It's like, how do we make something short, sweet, interesting, and entertaining in a, you know, 15 to 60 second video. And so, you know, we try to use some of the music sometimes, or some of the trending themes, because some of them are kind of like jokes effectively, but you have to kind of know what's going on, on tiktok to follow the joke and you integrate your own concepts into it. And so I find it to be a lot of fun and you can go down a rabbit hole of watching tiktok videos for like an hour. And you're like, Oh my God, where'd my afternoon go?! For sure!  I've heard people say that they've gone even longer, like three, four hours. Yeah. And then sometimes like it just this morning, as a matter of fact, it was early and I love Italians. And, there's a Italian guy and his mother and they are so cute and funny and I'd realize, Oh, I haven't been on tiktok for a few days. Maybe I missed some of his, their videos. And so you can click on just like with Instagram y'all if you're not on tiktok yet is you can click on their bio, like ontheir name or whatever it shows their channel. And then you can go and see all of their posts just like Instagram. So I consumed like six or seven of their videos that I had missed,.... which, ticktock for business as something that's real, you can use hashtags, you can, like Robert was saying, do things that are trending, make it entertaining, also educational. So it's to attract the attention of, like Robert said earlier, where people are. so that's cool. And, and I think a lot of people have this misconception that tiktok is all teenagers. And, you know, there is a lot of teenagers on there, but you know, your content and your, whatever you are will attract your audience because there are over 60, there are a lot there's I think a parent's over 30 hashtag. Like there are a lot of adults on the platform as well. And there are so many different industries and niches, and here's a great example. Um, we're thinking about redoing our backyard and it's kind of like a dream board wishlist kind of thing right now. Right? Well, I'm scrolling on TechTalk and I found a local landscape designer on tiktok. I loved his work. I reached out to him and he's going to come out and we're going to talk about things. And so like, I don't know, result in any business, but when you're thinking about it for your business, whatever your business is, there is things on there that, I mean, your business should be on tick talk. If you want to connect with people that are engaged in that audience. And it's a huge audience. I mean, I don't know, you can kind of talk about all kinds of things. I see woodworking, I see a lot of construction. We're doing remodeling stuff. So maybe that's my feed right now. Right. But I see a lot of those kinds of trades showing up in my tiktok feed. It had, the algorithm definitely picks up and how you went about it is exactly what is recommended and what we recommend to get on the platform first and just start discovering what other people are posting and what people are doing, and kind of just get familiar with it. And, you know, if you start now, if, if you can make it relevant to your business and make it relevant to your customer is that, you know, it's going to benefit you a year or two years from now. And you can also share the videos on other platforms so you can save the videos and then post them in, on another platform. Do you ever do that, Robert? Oh, yeah. And I mean, that's the thing is like, if you're already kind of doing short format things, if you're on YouTube or Instagram using Instagram stories, like, I mean, it's like a natural repurpose bit and, uh, you know, you might as well be there for minimal extra effort, but, uh, you know, when you look at the growth of things, you know, tick talk is definitely on the growing end and you know, some of these other platforms are not growing as much anymore. And so, you know, it's get there early claim, your stake, be one of the early influencers in your space. And, you know, maybe it fails, but you will have learned something because I think video, however, its purpose is going to be around forever. So Absolutely. Yeah, I think that will happen was when stories came out, people got comfortable and then started really liking the short form. And, you know, you're just sitting, waiting for an appointment. So, you know, for them to call you from the lobby or whatever, and you can just real quickly go online, be entertained, discover something, learn something, whatever it is. And then, you know, we got used to that. And then now that tiktok's you can post a 15 second video or, or a 60 second video on tiktok. And,so yeah, we're at, and I love your enthusiasm about it, Robert. So before we wrap here, what other platforms are working well for you? Like you mentioned YouTube - what is your favorite, would you say? Or is it tiktok? Well, it's hard. I don't know, like my personal favorite social media platform right now is Reddit. I would say Reddit is my home base of not necessarily for my business, but as a personal social media consumer, I I'm a Redditer and I love it.  I think every business should be on Reddit. You should own your own subreddit. And I think you need to engage where your audience is. So the one thing about Reddit, right, is it's, it's, it's made up of subreddits, which are kind of akin to Facebook groups, right. Um, and there's groups on every single topic under the sun. And it's, I want to say that Reddit is, I am betting that within the next 12 to 18 months, Reddit is going to surpass Facebook. I think it's already like the now it's like, I think it's tied or just beat Instagram in terms of monthly visitors per month, uh, in terms of traffic. And so it's just, it's just continuing to grow. Whereas some of the other platforms are declining, but, uh, there's, your, your audience is on Reddit. You can subscribe to subreddits and you can become, you know, a voice on there and your things. And I just think it's, it's got such a better user interface. It provides a better curated content than it does for like Facebook and other things. So I am a huge Redditor. That is so interesting. I I've not heard anyone else say that. So I think that is just awesome. And it reminded me when you were saying that this weekend I Googled something and the answer was on Reddit. Yup. And that Reddit comes up in all the search results. And I would say that, you know, and granted it is my primary social media platform. But if you look at my social media referrals to my website read, it's usually fourth. I'm right there. You got the, you got Facebook, you got Pinterest, you got Twitter. And then read it, usually beats all the other ones. Um, and it's usually, it's very quality traffic because I'm talking about things that are related to what I'm doing. Right. And so it just all works out. Nice, great information. You, you seem so savvy. I love it. I'm so happy that you joined us today and I'm sure you inspired a lot of people. where can people find you, your website, social media, wherever you want to send people? Yeah, definitely. So our website is the college investor.com. If you like to listen to podcasts, we have the college investor audio show, and then we're on pretty much every social platform out there at the college investor. So whatever is your favorite, maybe you're not a Redditor like I am, but we're out there on pretty much everybody's social media platform. Yay. Awesome. Thank you so much, Robert. This was a thrill and I really appreciate your time and, hope you have a great rest of your week.

rebecca@goodeggconcepts.comwww.theluckiestpeopleintheworld.comDiane Dayton  This is changing the rules, a podcast about designing the life you want to live, hosted by KC Dempster and Ray Loewe, the luckiest guy in the world.KC Dempster  Good morning, everybody. If we sound a little excited today, it's because Ray and I are actually back at Wildfire studios in Woodbury, New Jersey for our first on site podcast since this whole bit of nonsense began. And, you know, Ray is the luckiest guy in the world if you were to ask him, and he's nodding his head. But, you know, we talk about lucky people and one of the things we believe about lucky people is that they make their own rules and when we talk about rules, you know, from the time we're born, people are setting rules for us, it could be parents or teachers or churches or employers, you know, even the the communities and so forth. And for the for the most Part I think rules are meant to protect us and to guide us. But sometimes as we get older, they become less relevant to us there and they can actually be more restrictive. So the luckiest people in the world recognize this and they start to make their own rules, rules that are meaningful to them meaningful to their lives. And once they get comfortable with that, and they're on top of it, they are free to be themselves.Ray Loewe  Yeah. And I am so excited to be out and about and the wonderful Taylor's scoured the studio for us, so I feel like like safe. I have my own little greeny microphone cover. It goes home with me. Okay. And wow, I bet our listeners don't have one of those. They probably don't. Okay, so the luckiest guy in the world. the luckiest people in the world are people that I've been studying for most of my adult life and I've been looking at them from the standpoint of These are exciting people to me, you know, they always seem to be doing something. That's right. They always seem to be happy. They always seem to have a glow around them. And so when I started studying them, I did it for two reasons. The first one was kind of selfish. Okay, these are the people that I wanted to hang out with. All right. The second one was kind of selfish to this was the kind of person that I wanted to be. and changing the rules is something that the luckiest people in the world handled really well. It's one of the mindsets that they seem to get control of and they don't let these darn rules get in the way they have their own little Greenie microphone caps. Okay, they do whatever it is, you know, to get out in the world and allow them to get going. And uh, we have a guest we're going to introduce in a couple seconds over here and she is definitely one of the luckiest people in the world and she doesn't let anything get in her way. Okay, so so these mindset so we're gonna To talk about today, our number one a when we introduce the Rebecca in a moment, okay, you're gonna find out that she certainly handles changing the rules, right? She doesn't like get rules getting her way, or change upset, at least not for long. She also is incredibly creative. And she always, always, always finds a positive solution for everything, okay? And when you're done, she finds a way to take what she's learned from this thing and weave it into the future. So it's not just something that put out a fire. It's something where, where she finds that creativity and makes it move forward. So we're going to do is, well, let me get my definition of, luckiest people in the world and we're taking a short break, then we're going to come back and bring in Rebecca. Okay, so So, I've developed this definition of lucky people, okay. And it's a little different than the definition because I don't think winning the lottery connotes a lucky pereson. I certainly would like to do that. Okay. But the luck we're talking about is deeper. It's that stuff that that, you know, just gets into you, and it makes life go well. So the luckiest people in the world are those people that personally design their own lives. And don't let the rules go away. They personally designed what they want. And then they take control of their lives and they go on and they live it to the fullest. So that's the definition we're going to use. And Taylor, let's take a short break. And we're going to come back and introduce Rebecca Hoffman.Diane Dayton  You're listening to changing the rules with KC Dempster and Ray Loewe the luckiest guy in the world. We will be right back with more exciting information.Ray Loewe  Okay, am I am I you are back back. Okay, so I'm Rebecca Hoffman is out there somewhere in Chicago area. I think okay. You know, the rumor has it. Yeah. This is this is like the middle of The country where everything goes right and where lucky people live, right? So hi. Say good morning, Rebecca.Rebecca Hoffman  Good morning, Ray and KC, how are you? We're Well,Ray Loewe  okay, so I am absolutely fascinated. The name of your company is Good Egg Concepts. Yes. Where the heck did that come from?Rebecca Hoffman  So before there was an internet, there was just life, right? I feel like a comedy bit, right. And then the internet came along. And at some point, I was living in Miami at that time, some, there was an opportunity to create an email handle so that you could correspond with people around the world. And I said to a friend, what should my email handle be? and the person said, you know, you're a good egg, you should be the good egg, blah, blah, blah. And so I did become that and it was just my email handle, and then it became sort of a moniker and then as time wore on, my little consulting practice, I think at some point, I was doing some consulting work and my accountant said What is the name of your business? You need to register it and I said, Well, it's Good Egg Concepts and that's how it started.Ray Loewe  So when you're driving along though, in your cross country truck outfit you under your handle is good egg.Rebecca Hoffman  You're right. That's right. If I ever if I ever become like a cross country hauler, that will be absolutely. Cool.Ray Loewe  Cool. So I met I met you Rebecca long ago, I think it was I think we were talking about 2012 2013, something like that. So it's been a while. And and I had a very, very unique experience. After I met you. I was introduced to you, as a marketing consultant to help me get this whole concept of the luckiest guy in The world moving. And you did something that was incredible for me. I have no idea how you did this. But I have to tell you, this has been the core of the way I'm running my business. So I told you some stories of my travel, I told you about an airplane in Africa. I told you about penguins in Antarctica. I told you about other things. And you just came back to me and you said, you know, these are great stories, but they're missing the ending. They're missing. Would you call them parables? Mm hmm. Yeah. Yeah. And that's right. And all of a sudden, these stories are everywhere in my life right now and and more are coming online. So you know, I just have to thank you.Rebecca Hoffman  Well, you're most welcome. And I can say that when I met you, I was quite taken with your stories. And as a person who works in marketing and strategic communications, and brand building, I'm always interested in storytelling because that is really the essence of every good brand, or story or position or offering. And so when we met and you told me a few of these stories, they were so unique and different. And your goal in telling them wasn't just to tell them but to also help people learn from them. It made sense to think of them as parables as teachable moments, as, you know, really great stories that a person won't forget and could easily turn around and tell another person and say, I heard a great story the way people do.Ray Loewe  Well, they're used in almost every presentation we make. And KC is helping me write a book. And these are feature components of the book.So So, let's tell some stories. Okay. So So, here you are, you're a business woman, you have this marketing practice. You are also a mom, how old are your kids?Rebecca Hoffman  They are 10 years old and 13 years old.Ray Loewe  Oh, boy. Okay. And, and we got through last year, sort of together and insane, or not insane. And all of a sudden, not only the rules change, but life changed, right? So what happened? How did you how did you treat this and I'm excited to learn about this because you're so creative. Well, so youRebecca Hoffman  No, it's interesting. I'm no different than anyone else. The first reaction was some combination of fear and confusion, what's going on what's happening. And from a business standpoint for the first week or two, I think it was mid March, at least in the Chicago area when we really knew that we needed to close down and hunker in and just be in our houses. I had had a sense way before that, because I kind of followed the news story from January. And so I was somewhat prepared in the home, but not emotionally prepared like everybody else. And so here we were mid March, the school just closed and then I found myself standing by a lagoon with my kids on a Friday...school had shut down and we brought some snacks to feed the ducks. And I said, I think we're going to be doing this for a while, and we're standing outside in fresh air. And you know, in that moment, I remember thinking, I wonder what this will be like. And so probably the first week or two, all the business people that I work with all my clients logically went silent.It was like, it was like, you know, when you go outside before a storm and there's no birdsong and you drain, right? Right, no calls, no meetings, suddenly everything's just shut tight. And we, you know, I, I sent to my husband because I've been working in a private practice of my own devising for years. When the market gets rough, my business tends to go quiet. And I said, I think it's gonna be really quiet. And he said, That's okay. You know, everything comes back and fine. And so then probably seven to 10 days passed, and my phone rang. And it was one of my clients saying, Oh, we want to work on our website. And I said, not a bad idea. And the next thing you knew, we were buying ads everywhere. We were writing new copy for the website to explain how they would continue working zoom calls, suddenly, all the clients came back to life. Right, everybody realized this was the moment to shore up the digital footprint. Look at the online profiles, look at the website, look at the social media profiles and contemplate first, how they should appear. And to your point, right, what story should we tell because now we have Have a lot of people working from home who have time to read. They're not commuting in their cars. And I said to my clients, the whole stable of them, I said, you know, all that time, you would have spent commuting between meetings and in person things, that is your marketing time now. So everybody went to work, and my clients really did go to work. And actually, in some respect, I was busier than I'd ever been, which is a strange sensation in the middle of this difficult moment where people are really suffering and we don't know the directionality of things. And there's real fear. Right, the fear moved, the fear moved into more of let's let's continue to work, let's find a way and I think as human beings, we're creative, we're adaptable. It's unpleasant to have to pivot like this. But so we did. And that's what we did when we just continue and it hasn't stopped. We've been working all the way through on all kinds of creative enterprises related to the telling of why a business matters why an organization is relevant, how we can connect with audiences that would careRay Loewe  Did All you're clients do that?Rebecca Hoffman  Most Yes. Okay. So and I should I should put a little asterisk. The majority of my clients are professional services type organizations like law practices, consulting practices educational, like college prep practices. So I am I'm working less with organizations that had to shut and couldn't do anything like a hair salon. Right. So So a lot of my clients could continue to work. And there was a perception, especially in the legal community and consumer community. Well, the courts are shut, we can't continue. But in fact, the courts move to zoom and, and conference calls. And in fact, a lot of legal proceedings move faster and less and less expensive because the attorneys didn't have to go and sit in the courthouses and file things and bill for that. Right. Things moved quicker. So there were some weird efficiencies that started to appear that were almost inadvertent, right.KC Dempster  I have a friend whose divorce was done online.Rebecca Hoffman  That's correct. So I work with A lot of divorce practices, Family Law practices and the divorces are moving very quickly if both parties were willing to do this in a kind of technologically new way, right? Unfortunately, they're trapped in the same house. They can't get out. Right? Well, not in this case. But yeah, in some instances, yes. So there were issues of, you know, concerns for domestic violence and safety concerns about alcohol and drug abuse. And I think those are still continuing because things aren't ironed out. We are more relaxed now sociologically. But from a professional standpoint, through my work, we were able to continue to advertise to people and let people know that these resources are still available, you may not be able to sit together in a room. However, the resources are still available and functioning for consumers. Yeah, that was a big message to tell. So it was a giant pivot in March and April. Okay, so which we did not we didn't expect it Right, right.Ray Loewe  Yeah. two quick things. So So okay, you got your companies, the companies you work for going How did affect you? You personally, I mean, you know, obviously you probably weren't in the car as much What, what? what went on and what happened to your family here.Rebecca Hoffman  So, you know, professionally I wasn't in the car. That's true. And then I had to sort of find my footing. I'm very fortunate to have a house where everyone could work. The kids have their digital school, my husband was now working from home instead of it as corporate headquarters where he normally would be, we're traveling. And suddenly our home felt like a small office, and we had to load in some additional supplies like paper and toner and really like a like a little tiny office building. So personally, it was very interesting that everyone had to find their footing and everyone did. So in our in my particular family, we all worked and we continue to work. And it's been okay, maybe better than okay.Ray Loewe  I don't I don't know if it was okay. You were whining on the phone the other day that you couldn't go to museums.Rebecca Hoffman  That's true. And that's a good reminder. So you know, I do think about those things. Like, what are my friends and I discussed this, like, what are the things you miss the most. And I thought at first, when all this happened, I would miss the restaurants, I would miss all of the stuff that was our normal life. And in fact, we shed our personal schedule, largely all the activities that kids would have been doing gone. all the places we might have gone to gone. But the thing that still remain that I miss the most real sort of cultural interactions, the human moments in museums, I'm one of those people who visits museums whenever I can. And it can be indoor outdoor, but I think those are still missing in our life and that you can't replace those human moments walking through Sculpture Gardens, walking through galleries, contemplating the creative output of other people when it's all digital. Maybe you can look online, it's not the same experience. Exactly. So that that's been a loss.Ray Loewe  And feeding the ducks didn't quite do it, huh?Rebecca Hoffman  No, but you know, feeding the ducks was pleasurable. 0became something that we look to do, right?KC Dempster  I'm sure the ducks were very happy,Rebecca Hoffman  very pleased with experience completely and all the stale snacks that I brought out.Ray Loewe  Well, it cleaned out the pantry. So So how are you going to take this going forward? I mean, we all kind of learn a lesson from this. But what did you learn that you're going to take forward when I'm not going to say we return to normal I hate that word. It's the new better the new, better environment we're going to be in after this is over with.Rebecca Hoffman  That's correct. And I think that one of the things I know as a person who works in creative space is I would tell this to my clients and it applies to us personally, which is, life is dynamic. Things are a work in progress at all times. And that iterations of experiences and things and moments are something we should look forward to. So right so it's not like, hey, when we return back to normal things will be okay. Again, right. It's more that when we emerge from this moment that we're in who knows how long This last right it's months, weeks I who knows, right?But when we emerge from this, and we will, what will we be like, and that will be our next version. So like, you know, computer programmers called version 1.0 2.0 3.0. And I actually work with my clients frequently to say, your business marketing should be version 6.0 that you're at, and that's where you are, and you must sort of accept where you are. So if you had a business, and you had marketing, and then it shifted, you're now in version 2.0. And if after all of this happens, you go on and shift things. Again, you're in version 3.0. So we personally as a society, are going to version x point O, of whatever world we live in, and ideally, the world that we live in is the one that we try to make as nice as we can. And that, you know, that to me seems like a critical action to take both personally and professionally.Ray Loewe  Well, cool. Well, we're unfortunately we're at the end of our time already. So you know, thank thank you for being with us. And Rebecca is certainly will One of the luckiest people in the world I would agree. And we're gonna see writing for Saturday Night Live one of these days soon.Rebecca Hoffman  I know one of these days. Okay, that will happen right and then I'll have you in the audience with KC.Ray Loewe  Taylor, let's take a quick break and a quick break and we'll come back with that closing remarks.Diane Dayton  You're listening to changing the rules with KC Dempster and Ray Loewe the luckiest guy in the world. We will be right back with more exciting information.KC Dempster  And here we are back again to get ready to say goodbye but I wanted to touch back to something that Ray was talking about before we brought Rebecca on and he was he was talking about the luckiest people in the world and and his definition of luck. And you know, you would be tempted to say that somebody who won the lottery was lucky. But the definitions in the in the dictionary kind of center on that that luck when we say Somebody has lucky we're referring to something that happened to them that they didn't have that came out of the blue, that they didn't have anything to do with and, and what we're trying to say is that we don't necessarily ascribe to that definition. In fact, I was at a meeting many, many years ago, and somebody said that luck is a combination of preparation and opportunity. And that makes much more sense to me. And so people who win the lottery do do some preparation, they go buy the ticket, somebody who doesn't buy a lottery ticket doesn't win the lottery. So So that's our definition of lucky people. And sometimes lucky people get hit by life events that derail them, like we just did with this pandemic. And but the lucky people, as Ray said, they, they find a way to adapt to the changes, they find a positive solution in that adaptation, and then they make it into they filter it into their plants.Ray Loewe  Going forward, as Rebecca was saying, we're not going to go back to the way things were. We're going to go back to adaptation. 2.0 Yeah. Isn't that wonderful? Yeah. So show in closing here we have a brand new website. Yeah, yeah, www and either the luckiest guy in the world or the luckiest people in the world, whichever you choose. And if you want to hang out to some extent with people like Rebecca, you got to join us on the website, you got to join our luckiest people in the world community. And you got to continue to listen to our podcast and we will be back next week with an exciting new guest. Very interesting story. Yes. So join us next week. Thank you.Diane Dayton  Thank you for listening to changing the rules. A podcast designed to help you live your life the way you want, and give you what you need to make it happen. Join us in two weeks for our next exciting topic on changing the rules with KC Dempster and Ray love the luckiest guy in the world. 

On this episode of the Healthy, Wealthy and Smart Podcast, Jenna Kantor guests hosts and interviews Javier Carlin on the art of listening.  Javier A. Carlin is the Clinic Director at Renewal Rehab in Largo, Florida. He is originally from Miami, he graduated with his Doctoral Degree in Physical Therapy at Florida International University and is a Certified Strength & Conditioning Specialist through the National Strength & Conditioning Association. In this episode, we discuss: -The difference between nosy curiosity and coaching curiosity -How to frame questions to dive deeper into conversations -Verbal and nonverbal signals to watch for during client interviews -How your clinic environment can help develop deeper client relationships -And so much more! Resources: Javier Carlin Facebook Javier Carlin Instagram  Life Coaching Academy for Healthcare Professionals Phone number: (305) 323-0427   A big thank you to Net Health for sponsoring this episode! Learn more about the Redoc Patient Portal here.   For more information on Javier: Javier A. Carlin is the Clinic Director at Renewal Rehab in Largo, Florida. He is originally from Miami, he graduated with his Doctoral Degree in Physical Therapy at Florida International University and is a Certified Strength & Conditioning Specialist through the National Strength & Conditioning Association. Javier has always had a passion for health and fitness and his mission in life is to help you get back to doing the things that you love to do, pain-free. His goal is to inspire people to live a healthier, happier, more fulfilling live through simple and effective wellness principles; proper nutrition coupled with a great exercise routine and good sleeping habits works wonders in how you feel inside and out! Javier enjoys spending time with his family, he loves being by the water either soaking up the sun on the beach or on a boat! He is an avid traveler, enjoys exploring new places and experiencing different cultures. He also has an adventurous side; bungee jumping, skydiving, rollercoasters, cliff diving! For more information on Jenna: Jenna Kantor (co-founder) is a bubbly and energetic girl who was born and raised in Petaluma, California. Growing up, she trained and performed ballet throughout the United States. After earning a BA in Dance and Drama at the University of California, Irvine, she worked professionally in musical theatre for 15+ years with tours, regional theatres, & overseas (www.jennakantor.com) until she found herself ready to move onto a new chapter in her life – a career in Physical Therapy. Jenna is currently in her 3rd year at Columbia University’s Physical Therapy Program. She is also a co-founder of the podcast, “Physiotherapy Performance Perspectives,” has an evidence-based monthly youtube series titled “Injury Prevention for Dancers,” is a NY SSIG Co-Founder, NYPTA Student Conclave 2017 Development Team, works with the NYPTA Greater New York Legislative Task Force and is the NYPTA Public Policy Committee Student Liaison. Jenna aspires to be a physical therapist for amateur and professional performers to help ensure long, healthy careers. To learn more, please check out her website: www.jennafkantor.wixsite.com/jkpt Read the full transcript below: Jenna Kantor (00:04): Hello. Hello. Hello. This is Jenna Kantor with healthy, wealthy and smart. I am here with Javier Carlin, thank you so much for coming on. It is an absolute joy Javier. As a physical therapist. He runs a clinic. What is the name of your clinic that you run? Javier Carlin (00:21): It's renewal rehab. Jenna Kantor (00:23): Renewal. Rehab. In what area though? In Florida. Cause you're part of a chain. Javier Carlin (00:27): Yeah, it's in Largo, Florida. So close to Clearwater. Jenna Kantor (00:30): Yes. I feel like the key Largo, Montego baby. What are we going to make it? I feel like that's part of a song. Right? Well thank you so much for coming on. You also, Oh, you also do have an online course. What's your online course? Javier Carlin (00:45): Yeah. Yeah, so it's a life coaching Academy for health care professionals where I teach healthcare professionals how to become life coaches and get their first clients. Jenna Kantor (00:54): Freaking awesome and perfect timing for that right now with everything. Corona. Thank you so much for coming on during this time and giving us both something to do. I wanted to bring Javier in because he has a skill, a magic skill that if you don't know him or you do know him now, you know, he is a Supreme listener. The first thing we did when we got on this call is, he goes, he just asked me questions just to listen what's going on. And I don't, of course I try to emulate it, but I'm not as good at him. You know, like I asked a few questions and I didn't deep dive as well as he does. So I want to dive into his brain and with this pen that I have holding and I'm going to part the hairs, get through the skull into the cerebrum. And so we can really deep dive into how your brain works when you are learning more about others, the art of listening. So first of all, thank you for having that skill. Javier Carlin (02:08): Yeah, no, absolutely. I honestly had no idea I had it until someone brought it up. And then looking into, it's kind of one of those things where, you know, I guess you have a skill. But you don't really know it. And then you try to dissect, okay, what exactly am I doing? Right? So, you know, leading up to this interview, I'm like, okay, let me actually think about this and reflect on what it is that I do. And what is it that I don't do? So that I can actually, you know, hopefully provide some value throughout the next few minutes. Jenna Kantor (02:40): Yeah, I would love to know. I think I want to just go into our conversation even before hitting the record button. What was in your brain when you first came on? Was it, Oh, I want to know what's going on. I'm just honestly like what was in that led you to start the conversation that way? Javier Carlin (02:58): That's a great question. So to be honest, I mean, I haven't seen you in a long time. We haven't spoken in a while. And so, I really, you know, did want to know what's been going on in your life? I've seen your, you know, posts on Facebook, but really had no idea what it is that you've been working on. And I always know you're up to something. So I really had a deep desire to really find out exactly what you've been working on and the people that you've been impacting. Just to know. I don't know. It's like, it's just natural for me. So, yeah. Jenna Kantor (03:38): You're like a curious George. Javier Carlin (03:40): Exactly. Yes. Jenna Kantor (03:42): Do you think that is a big base of it? It's just true curiosity. Javier Carlin (03:47): Yes. I think it's a curiosity and definitely curiosity. I'm always you know, really in tune with what people are doing. Cause I feel like it just, you know, looking deeper at it. I feel like there's, it just, I come from a place of always wanting to learn more about someone, deeply understand what they're doing and why they're doing it. Cause I think there's a lot to say about that. And it's very similar with you know, health care professionals in the sense that we're working with patients all day and we are truly, really trying to figure out you know, what's going on and where they want to get to and understanding really what they truly want the outcome to be when it comes to us helping them throughout, you know, our physical therapy and other rehab professions. And it's no different. Like that's the same, the same curiosity that I have when I, you know I'm serving patients I have with people in general. So I do believe that curiosity is a big thing and having the curiosity that's a, not in a nosy curiosity but more of like a coaching curiosity and really figuring out what's behind the words that someone is saying. Jenna Kantor (05:02): What do you mean by nosy versus coaching? Would you mind going into more depth on that? Javier Carlin (05:09): So, yeah, absolutely. So I believe, and this is, you know, there's a clear you know, when you're having a conversation with a friend, you're not really thinking about all these things. And then I think deeper into the coaching side of things, you start to think about the specific things. So when it comes to a nosy curiosity, there's always a story that someone's telling you and sometimes the story isn't even related to what the person is actually dealing with. So people use the story to kind of, let's see how I can put this to separate themselves from the interaction that you're having. Cause it's sometimes it's stuff for us to have conversations with people and really get deep down into our own emotions. So the story around it as you know, as someone who's dove into life coaching the story is actually at times something to distract people from that. And sometimes what I mean by nosy curiosity is that we actually get involved in that story, which has nothing to do with why the person is talking to you in the first place. Jenna Kantor (06:09): So it's like this superficial, superficial kind of thing, superficial thing, right? Javier Carlin (06:13): So instead of being nosy and it's the actual story and talking about the people that were in their story, we want to, you know, kind of separate that from the actual person and have a conversation about them and why that situation affected them as a person, not, you know, bringing everyone else. So that's what I mean by nosy. And he knows he's trying to get involved in their story and you know, getting involved in not just their emotions but everyone else's emotions and why they hate their boss and why this and why that. So it's really separating that from what they're telling you. Jenna Kantor (06:45): Hmm. I like that. Yeah. Yeah. Could you just keep talking cause I don't even know what question to ask next just because I'm really taking that in right now. Just tell me something else more about listening. Cause I know you came prepared just because when you're going into this, you just opened up a world of how much, I don't know, just from even that concept. So I feel a bit of the, honestly a lot of loss of words for it because just even that concept of the superficial versus diving deep down in, I guess my next question would be then when you deep dive in and you're getting, doing those investigative questions to really find out what really is the core of what's going on, how do you phrase your questions too? Because you're probably going to get to some real personal stuff. How do you do it delicately with them? So that way as you are deepening, deepening your listening, you're not invading their space. Javier Carlin (07:54): That's a beautiful question. So, I think a lot of it comes before you know, before you dive into that. So you know, you've heard of obviously you're building rapport, building trust, and at the end of the day, if someone's coming for help it typically comes with an idea that, okay, I'm going to have to, if I want someone to help me, then I have to open up to them. Otherwise, you can't really help someone. So I think, you know, it comes with that understanding and I think a lot of it also comes from coming from a place of neutrality. So not tying your emotions and your ideas and your thoughts and your beliefs and your opinions to what the person is telling you. Jenna Kantor (08:37): That's hard. That's hard. Yes. Very hard. Yeah. Javier Carlin (08:41): It really is. And, that's where, you know, that's when someone can actually feel that you're trying to either push them in a direction that they don't want to go, or that's where that nosy type of know feeling comes in, where they're like, Oh, like why are you, why are you asking me that? But I think the second thing is whenever you make an opposite, whenever you make a statement that's more of an observation or a fact Javier Carlin (09:08): As opposed to, you know, something that's a bit more emotional, you want to always end with a question. So as an example, a question. So after every statement you want to end with a question saying, Hey, you know, what's true about that? Or what comes to your mind when you hear that? Those, two questions allow you to kind of pull yourself from Hey, listen, what comes to your mind when I say that? As opposed to I'm saying this because Hey, you should do this or you should do that. Or you know, that came out like pretty that that came out as if, you know, instead of saying, Hey, you sound angry. Right? It's saying, okay, like what, you know, when I heard that it sounded like you, you know, there was some anger and what's true about that and now you're giving them the ability to respond back to that. Javier Carlin (09:57): So now it's more of an observation as opposed to kind of like telling them, or you know, letting them know, Hey, you sound angry. Right? There's more emotion to that. It's more of like, Hey, you're coming at me now. That's when someone can get a bit defensive or feel like their space has been invaded. But when you just state a fact and then ask them a question, it makes it a lot easier to have that conversation moving forward. I hope that, does that make sense? Jenna Kantor (10:25): Yeah, that does. That does big time. It actually connects, it brings it back to a conversation I had with my brother. I'm going to go a little deep on my own thing. I remember my older brother and I don't have a good relationship, but this is back in high school and there's a point to this that's not just about me, even though if anyone knows me, I love talking about myself, but he, I remember there was one evening where he was more of a night elephant, and we started talking. It was a rare time, was a rare opportunity when you just get into a deep conversation about life and anything and we were already at least an hour or something in and I'm just feeling my eyes shut on me. And I remember going through this like I have two options to continue this conversation to continue this conversation with him. Jenna Kantor (11:29): So I remember I had this opportunity to continue the conversation and force myself to stay awake and I felt like it was a very vital conversation. There was this little thing that was like, if I cut this off, it will be cutting off something big in our relationship. Me not being here to be part and present when he's open and being open to talking to me, for me to be able to hear what he has to say. Do you think that and it has over time now we don't have more. We have more solidly not a strong relationship. Do think there are conversations like that that exists that if you are not present and listening and you push it away too soon, it could actually cause damage to that relationship long term. Javier Carlin (12:33): Oh, 150%. Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. Yeah. Yeah. and you know, it's tough. You know, diving back into exactly, you know, what you were feeling and how you're feeling and why perhaps that conversation was maybe at that time of interest or something that, like you were saying, you know, you felt like maybe falling asleep. Javier Carlin (13:03): So, you know, there's a lot to it that we could dissect really. But yes, I do agree with that. I think what happens in many conversations especially, you know, looking into it even deeper, it's, you know, when people have make offhand comments you know, short little statements in between the conversation that you're having. Most people are quick to kind of just let that pass. But that's what the person truly deep, deep inside is actually feeling and really wants to talk about. Everything else is just surface level. So, you know, exploring those offhand comments goes a very long way. And that's when people really know that you're truly focusing on them. And listening to them and that's where you get into those deeper conversations now. Again, back to the story that you just shared. There's so many different factors when it comes to that, but I definitely do believe that that can have a massive impact on, you know, the relationship moving forward and with anyone with, you know, your patients, your clients, people remember how you made them feel and that really, really sticks. Jenna Kantor (14:19): Yeah, you guys can't see me, but I'm like, yes. Hey man, I feel like I just went to church on that. But it's how you made them feel. So then, back to the clinic, you could have say a busy time, a lot of people, a lot of patients and everything and your time is running short. How do you cater to these conversations? If you see that there needs to be more time or if you do need to cut it shorter, how do you continue to feed that relationship, that trust? So you can have find an opportunity maybe later to spend more time listening to them. If you don't have it right then. Javier Carlin (14:52): That's a great question. I think there's several different ways to do it. I'll speak to more cause there's a tactical way of doing it and that's, you know, with I guess you can call it, you know, nature and the relationship through other methods with text messaging, emails and all those things. Right. Where you feel that connection with someone and continue to develop that relationship over time through sometimes automated, you know, systems and or where you're actually just sending a mass email, you know, once a week where it can still actually help to build a relationship. Right. But on the other front, you know, with our clinic specifically the way that we do that, because we do work as a team cause we are, you know, we do have insurance based model. Javier Carlin (15:40): So we do see several patients an hour. Because of the team that we have where for us specifically, it's a PT, two PTAs and two techs. Once we have a fully established clinic and got into that point that is where the PTA is that we have actually step in to treat the other patients that are there. And if I noticed, cause there's a lot of so when it comes to listening, there's, you know, when people say active listening, active listening really is it's not just listening to the words that are coming out of someone else, someone else's mouth, but also painted with everything else that's going on the unsaid, right? You really want to explore the unsaid. And that comes with a body language. You know, a visual cue is a body posture. You know, the way someone says something, their tone, their pace, right? Javier Carlin (16:28): And obviously as you get to know someone, you really get to feel how they feel when they're having a great day and when they're having a not so good day. So, you know, not letting, again, kind of like not letting offhand comments go. You don't want to let those, the visual kind of feedback that you're getting you don't want to let that go either. So, when you do see someone that's in that specific state where they might be disappointed, angry, upset, frustrated, you want to make sure that you address that right there. And then, and the way that we do that specifically at the clinic is we take them into the evaluation room and we can do that because of the fact that we work as a team, everyone on the team knows exactly what every single patient should be doing and knows them at a deep level so I could actually step out and have that deeper conversation with whoever needs it at that time. Javier Carlin (17:20): We'll sit for, you know, five, 10, 15 minutes, however long we need, really to explore what is going on at a deeper level so that we can ensure that they don't drop off. Cause typically what happens is that when you don't, when you just kind of let that go, that's where you get a patient call in to cancel and then it happens not just once, but twice, three times, four times, and then they ghost you. So that's how we handle that situation. Jenna Kantor (17:50): Absolutely. Absolutely. I think that's a really important thing to put into place. So for clinics alone, how would you, if they don't have something set up and say they're a busy clinic and they don't have something set up where people can have the time to necessarily sit and listen, how could they start implementing that in order to improve the relationships with their patients and then they're showing up? Javier Carlin (18:13): Yeah, that's a great question. And I think there's so many variables depending on how the clinic is set up and ran. I believe that, you know, I think as you know, obviously as physical therapists ourselves, I think our first instinct is to always like go to like the physical, right? Like, you're feeling this way today. Okay, don't worry. Like, we're going to make you feel better after this. It's like, wait a second. Well maybe the person, maybe for those initial 30 minutes, they don't even need, you know, therapeutic exercises or whatever it is that we're prescribing them for that day. Maybe they just need to have a conversation, right, for 20, 30 minutes and just to let it all out. And those 30 minutes of actually just talking to them just because we can't bill for that time technically. That's going to be the difference maker between them actually seeing the results longterm and dropping off. So it's making that clear distinction and deciding, okay, what this person needs at this point in time is not, you know, to do a core exercises or to get manual therapy. What they need is to just have a conversation about what's going on in their world. Cause ultimately that's what matters the most event. Jenna Kantor (19:28): So yeah, true question. I think that was great. That was good. I just want you to know, okay. So then during this time, the Corona virus, what has your clinic been exploring on a listening standpoint with the switch to virtual to try to fit those needs? Like, I don't know, it's kind of an open ended question for you to interpret this however you'd like. Javier Carlin (19:58): Yes. So I think, you know, it's been, to be honest, it's been a challenge. And the biggest reason why is, you know, knowing that tele-health existed for, you know, the last year, two years, et cetera. And, has been existing, we didn't really make a push to have that as an additional service. So what's happening now is that it's like physical therapy, right? A lot of people still don't know what physical therapy is and it's not something that they necessarily want. It's just something that they need. Right? So, same thing with telehealth. It's something that, you know, now we're adding to things that people don't know, which is physical therapy and telehealth. And now we're, you know, most people are now trying to figure out, okay, how can we push tele-health without, you know, having any like, previous conversation about this. Javier Carlin (20:53): So that's where the challenge lies is that you have people who are, you know, the ones who do know what physical therapy is. We're coming in and you know, when they think of PT, they have this, you know, they have this picture in their mind because it's what they've been doing for the past, you know, X amount of weeks and now you're trying to get them to jump on to a different type of platform to, you know, provide a service that in their minds can only be done in person. So what we've seen started to do is we've started to offer complimentary telehealth visits. So the first visit is completely free 15 to 20 minutes in length. And offering that first, you know, giving the patient an opportunity to experience what it's like and showing them how valuable it can be. Javier Carlin (21:39): And then from there deciding to make an offer for them to actually purchase, you know, X amount of business. And typically, you know, your time is your time, so you want to typically charge the same that you would an actual in person session. But because this is so new, we have decided to offer it at a very, very low rate. So that barrier to entry is a lot less, especially in this time where you know, people's finances might not be at their all time high, or at least, they're not going to say, they're a little bit more reserved with what they're spending their money on. People are still spending money, but with what they're spending their money on. So that's how we're handling that now. A lot of, you know, constant communication through text messages, emails and just listening. Jenna Kantor (22:34): Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah. That's amazing. Thank you so much for coming on. Is there anything else you want to add in regards to the art of listening that you think is a key point for people to take home with them? Javier Carlin (22:47): Yeah, so I think the last thing, and this is actually a quote from Stephen Covey and I have it here cause I didn't want to butcher it, but basically he says most people do not listen with the intent to learn and understand. They listen with the intent to reply. They are either speaking or preparing to speak. So that's it. Jenna Kantor (23:09): That's great. That's a really good quote. Sums it up. Yeah. Well thank you so much for coming on Javier. How can people find you on social media? What are your addresses on Facebook, Instagram, all the above? Javier Carlin (23:32): Sure. So I'm on Instagram. I'm at @drJavierCarlin. So dr Javier Carlin on Facebook have your Carlin's so you can just look me up there and friend request me. I do have life coaching Academy for healthcare professionals a Facebook community. So you can always jump into that as well with a podcast coming out soon. And I think that's it. If you want to send me a, you know, text message and just link up my phone number is (305) 323-0427 to have a conversation. Jenna Kantor (24:05): I love that. I love that so much and if you guys want to see or hear him in action, if you're in the group or even in his future podcast, you'll see from the way he interviews and speaks with people how he really uses his curiosity and deep dives and learns more and listens so well. Just watching him in action alone, aside from just even experiencing it yourself, you'd be like, Oh wow, he's good at this. I feel very listened to, thank you so much for coming on. Everyone jumping in, thank you for joining and have a great day.   Thanks for listening and subscribing to the podcast! Make sure to connect with me on twitter, instagram  and facebook to stay updated on all of the latest!  Show your support for the show by leaving a rating and review on Apple Podcasts!

America is a democracy! Sure? We've never had a monarch! Right? Well today we're telling the story of Joshua Abraham Norton...Emperor of America and Protector of Mexico....in a 100 PERCENT true story we tell the story of the unofficial ambassador of San Francisco while we also sneak in a little history of the 49' Gold Rush. Emperor Norton is not an episode to be missed!

Mark It Down! Ohio State's winning streak against Michigan has to end someday, right? Right? Well, we're running with that assumption for the next installment of our weekly kick-off podcast.Doug Lesmerises is back, at least for the first half of this episode in which he, Nathan Baird and Stephen Means predict what year Michigan will rise up and beat the Buckeyes. They explain what roster dynamics, coaching dynamics and other factors play into their predictions.From there we turn to the other stars of the show: The Subtext subscribers who make their predictions on when this OSU winning streak will end. Some see a potential interruption in the near future. Some went the full Ray Bradbury approach and looked far into the future for the Wolverines' next victory.If you're not already a Buckeye Talk Subtext subscriber, text 614-350-3315 for breaking news and analysis and to participate in the polls and comments on the Daily Pod. See acast.com/privacy for privacy and opt-out information.

Virginia Purnell:Welcome to EntrepreneurConundrum with Virginia Purnell, where growing entrepreneurs share how they get visible online.Hi Everyone. Today I'm talking with James Hurst about how he incorporates marketing automation in his business. James is a veteran online marketer starting on eBay in late 2000. He is the creator of multiple softwares including ClickFunnels Follow Up Pro, which is a ClickFunnels Affiliate software as well as a creator of Email Slurper 3000, he has created five online courses including make Power Wheels Faster and Build an AWS IOT button slack bot step by step. He is a ClickFunnels dream car winner and a respected affiliate for multiple other softwares. He and his wife Amanda, reside with their four boys in Springfield, Utah.Welcome James.James Hurst:Hey, thank you so much for having me.Virginia Purnell:Thanks for being here today. So tell us a little bit about yourself.James Hurst:Okay, so yeah, like the intro kind of said, I've been doing this for quite a while ever since. I've been selling things since on eBay. And then I got into, I've worked for an agency doing pay-per-click, been doing SEO, I had a local business, so I kind of always had some business going on in some computer aspect of it. You know, website, lead gen and since you can tell even already, I'm like a little bit all over the place. I've kind of settled in a little bit as an affiliate marketer, which is good because that means I can, you know, if I think something's really cool and interesting, I can go check it out, review it, you know, make a blog or make a video post about it and then I can go to the next thing and, and review that.And so I'm kind of realizing that yeah, I don't just have one, one particular niche, but I kind of just, I kind of enjoy, enjoy soaking, soaking up a little bit of everything, if that makes sense.Virginia Purnell:So, whatever catches your fancy the moment, right?James Hurst:Yeah.Virginia Purnell:What inspired you to become an affiliate marketer?James Hurst:Affiliate marketer? Well, one of the big, one of the bigger products that I promote is ClickFunnels. And just this idea of making a sale once and then getting paid for it multiple times on the backend. So a big shift you'll see in the industry is everyone wants to sell a subscription. Seems like whether it's Netflix or ClickFunnels or Active Campaign, most or even Adobe, the Adobe softwares, they're wanting to sell a subscription so they can have a recurring residual income model so they can probably forecast better and everything.And so I figured, Hey, if I'm going to, if I'm going to sell something, why not sell something that people will use, you know, month in and month out. And then if I truly put in enough work and build up a big enough base, then it really is something that I could, I could take, you know, two weeks a month off from work, quote unquote work and, and still have that revenue coming in. That seemed like a very, that's seemed like a very powerful model. Something worth investing. Your limited amount of time into it is doing the work once and getting paid for it over and over again. I think whether that principle, I find itself, you know, in software, if I'm, if I'm creating a software, I work hard once, make a software, sell it over and over again. If I make a YouTube video that's really valuable, it sits there on YouTube and unlike Facebook where you know, the video's gone a couple of days. No, it's down in your feed on YouTube. It will grow, you know, in three years. It's just growing in, in, in views and it's essentially working for you. So this idea of doing work once, getting paid for it for the rest of your life, or at least for a good two, two to five years is something that I've always, always kind of have front and center when I'm working.Virginia Purnell:Well, what's nice about what you're doing, like with affiliate offers versus trying to sell someone a subscription is you did all the work at the front where now it's up to that company to keep those clients there. So you don't have to try to keep them there all the time.James Hurst:Exactly. And there's pros and cons to that too, which means that, you know, some of that's out of my hands. Like if that company doesn't support people very well, you know, or it's too complicated or the support, the support process is too, you know, then it's out of your hands. Whereas you know, if it is my own product and I've actually, one of the things you introduced was Email Sluper 3000 I'm just in the process of changing that from a one time fee to a small monthly fee. So I'm actually getting my feet wet myself as a product owner for Email Slurper 3000 of what's that like to have my own subscription, my own subscription based product. And it's exciting to think about, you know, and this one's only $7 a month. And so I just kind of dream about, you know, even just a thousand people.Like what if I had a thousand people paying $7 a month, then I could count on that. I could basically count on $7,000 a month, you know? And I would probably have some, you know, I would probably know about how much I'm growing at the time. And that's really, it's a really powerful model to be able to predict your, your monthly revenues, right? To have some sort of consistency there, whether it's on an affiliate residual model or whether it's software as a subscription for yourself. And I'm just doing that with ClickFunnels and Stripe. So I just set up, set up a recurring product in Stripe and I tie that back to ClickFunnels. And that's how I'm, that's how I'm doing that.Virginia Purnell:Utilize the platform that's paying you.James Hurst:No, and that's, yeah, typically, typically I don't....it's not a hard and fast rule that I have to be using the product, but it's typically a natural, a natural thing to promote the things that I recommend, you know, as a, as someone that puts my own name on the line for what the things that I recommend I, I'd have a hard time, you know, pushing things that I don't really believe in,Virginia Purnell:Which says a lot too. Because then if other people know that you recommend a product, then they're more likely to trust you too, right?James Hurst:Yep. Yep. And now the tricky thing, like, I don't know if you've heard of Kajabi or not. I have, yes. Yeah. So I have Kajabi as an end user. I've purchased many courses that have, so I know what Kajabi is like as an end user. Unfortunately, to promote it as an affiliate, you actually have to purchase, you have to, you have to be a paying member of Kajabi. And so that, that is it. That is an obstacle is that there's some programs that you have to be a paying member, and have to be able to promote them. And that's actually, in a way, it's a good, it's a good thing and a bad thing because it means that it means that the, the, the amount of competition that you're competing with, with other affiliates is going to be much less because you have to be a paying member to do it.So the trick is if I wanted to be, you know, if I'm paying for ClickFunnels, which does membership sites, and then why would I want to go and pay extra just to be using Kajabi so I can promote Kajabi or do or do a compare and contrast. So at a minimum I would not be afraid to start up a free trial of these softwares. You can, I mean within 14 days or a month you can do a good comparison review, that kind of thing. And actually have a, make an, an opinion about, you know, about the two different softwares. But if you wanted to go all in, it's tempting because I think Kajabi is great too. It's tempting to want to just say, well, I've got to figure out how a way to be, you know, to break even on my Kajabi subscription.Maybe throw, maybe throw a course up in there. And so that's, that's tough. There's another program too that I'm like that it's like, I don't use it, but I want to know about it and promote it. So I bought like sheep, like a lifetime version of it. So I could have access, make tutorials, do you know, do comparisons, and be knowledgeable about the subject. But yeah, it's a lot. It's, it's a lot. Definitely pros and cons to whether you have to pay or not to be able to promote, to be a paying member, not to promote something.Virginia Purnell:Yes. And like you said, like it, put something on Kajabi and then hope to get your investment back out of it. Right?James Hurst:Yeah. Yeah. 'Cause I'm pretty well ingrained. I have, I've got quite a bit of stuff in ClickFunnels so it would be, it would be a ton of work to get everything of mine out of there and I'm okay. You know, I'm kind of, my role out there is kind of to be the guy that does know, Hey, what's better, good job, your ClickFunnels for this purpose, what, you know, go high level versus ClickFunnels. And so as an affiliate, you know, I don't have, I mean I, I've done well as a ClickFunnels affiliate, but to try to, even though there's, we have bias for the things that we promote, I think the best way is to be an affiliate for both products. Do a review and, and be an affiliate for both. Let's say this is my honest opinion of this one. For these people. Here's my honest opinion of this. These ones for those people, I don't care which one you think is better for you. This is, here's my thing and here's, and either one or they're both my affiliate link. You know what I mean? Yeah.Virginia Purnell:So what do you look for when you go to promote an affiliate as an affiliate for a company?James Hurst:So I look for, I look for some excitement around something, right? I, you know, if I hear one person talking about it, that's one thing. If I hear it again and again and again, right? I see, I look, I'm joining the Facebook group. I can see kind of the trajectory of how it's growing and I kind of listen to it on the Facebook group. Are people complaining? Are people asking questions? What's, you know, people are there to support kind of. You just kind of get a vibe for the product and then like Kajabi, like for example, what's my experience like as an end user and just seeing, just basically keeping an ear to the wall on products that people seem to love. Right. And, and it seemed to be growing. I mean if it's not, it's nothing. There's no, I don't know, other than just intuition of, of just keeping your eye, keeping my ear to the wall on and what people are talking about, yeah. For what else I'd like to promote.Virginia Purnell:How do you stand out from all the other competition on the products that have a lot of affiliates promoting them?James Hurst:No, it is kind of crowded at the same time. A lot of people fizzle out too. Man. I, it has been a grind. Like, luckily I love, luckily I enjoy the grind. Otherwise I wouldn't like it, I'm just like, ah, this is not where the thing you do want to throw in the towel sometimes. But yeah, like I've been trying to grow like my YouTube channel and it's just like, it's literally, it's like one subscriber and then two days go by and then another subscriber and it's just, it's like pushing, like pushing the, you know, a rock up a Hill, but in the hopes that someday that thing will start rolling back down and, and gain that momentum. But how do you stand out? So yeah, even just showing up consistently, right. Will will separate you. Like that was really going to be consistent at first.And I had a thing that said, okay, you've got to publish at least one thing a week. Right. Whether it's a YouTube video, a blog or something. I tend to like video. Personally. I'm doing a lot of teaching, I'm opening up softwares, looking at, I'm teaching, that kind of thing. But yeah, I kind of had to commit to myself to show up at least once a week. And if you're really, you know, if you're really going to go all in, you've got to show up. You got to show up daily, right? If you're at the forefront of what you're doing, you should be having cool stuff that you're doing or thinking about or coming up with and sharing that with your audience. And there's also this idea of like when you're first getting started, like you may not be, you may not feel like you're the expert, but like pick that thing you want to be the expert in and start going deep on something.Like I just picked up a tool, I kind of literally picked up a product like a week or like a week and a half ago and I dove in, figured things out and then I made a, I made a tutorial on it. And I'm like on the first page of YouTube for this thing, I even feel like it's some of the best training out there. Like, it doesn't take that much. There's always going to be people that are like behind where you are and ahead of you. And so just don't worry about that, but just help anyone. Just whatever's on, I don't know, whatever's on your mind, you'd be surprised how quickly you can become like, you know, this little mini expert on a certain, on a certain topic.Virginia Purnell:I like how you said not to worry about the people in front of you because there's going to be people behind you that are just where you were not long ago. Right,James Hurst:Exactly. And in this case, like this specific case, like I'm on, I'm like a week, I'm like a week ahead of these people. Like I just, you know, but the fact that I took the time and that's actually a really cool place. It's easy to, Oh my goodness. Someone was just doing a tutorial on the most simple thing and people were raving about, you know, like, Oh my gosh, this is, you know, I was just like, you kidding me? Like I can't, like I almost would've never bothered. Like it seems so simple that why would I bother to make a, you know what I mean? But people need to just completely like step-by-step to talk to me like I'm a third grader or a fifth grader type thing and it's so it's, it's good to kind of make that. So I debated sometimes whether to make tutorials like as I'm learning it because then it's like, so let's say like an unboxing, like let's say I'm going to unbox this thing and figure it out right here, live in front of you so you can like kind of seen any like how hard is this thing to figure out?But instead, instead I think it's better to unbox the thing, get it all set up or take it for a drive and then like not too far out, but like just like a week or two out, then go back and make that video of the review about it. Because once you get a year or two out from the product, you forget what it's like to not know what, you know what I mean? You're, you're, you have a bias, you kind of forget what it's like to not know how to use something. So try to try to make that tutorial, you know, when it's still fresh on your mind when you are confused, you know, much better be able to relate to people when they're just getting started with something. So, yeah.Virginia Purnell:A little bit ago you had mentioned that one of your goals is to grow your YouTube channel. Do you have any other goals or how that you're hoping to achieve in the next year or two?James Hurst:Yeah, so I actually, I have a day job. I'm a computer programmer by day in AWS and it's good, it's a good, safe, secure, you know, job. I've been there five years, great people have been happy there, generous, you know, health benefits and generous paid vacation. Right. And so the, you know, the, a big dream would be to be able to have that stability in, in online marketing space to be able to, you know, typically make that big leap. Right. And I always debate whether I could or should. And then something like, you know, the Coronavirus happens and be like, Oh my gosh, I'm grateful to have so stability. You know, when things are crazy and you know, and, and so in the meantime, you know, I'm paying off, you know, paying off my car that paying off some debt, you know, trying to strengthen my position, my cash position, like with, with cash reserves and savings.And so, yeah, so the you know, a big goal would be to, you know, to go a hundred percent online, but at the same time like I don't want to, I dunno, there's, it's, I kind of in the mix of aye, I don't want to just just work from home and like have a bunch of like clients necessarily and like have 10 bosses instead of one and S but you know, I've been spoiled a little bit in having passive and cause I know what, I know what it's like to have passive income coming in and so in, in some ways the constraint to say, no, James, you have to figure this out with your little, with your, you can't, you can't have having extra time be a crutch, right? You need to think about these things in a way. Like you can, like, yeah, you know, you can't rely on making 40 hours of YouTube content a week to feel, I don't know.I'm trying to find that balance if I don't want to trade my time for money, right. I don't want to trade my time for money. But at a certain, there's a certain amount of that that you have to do to convert it into, you know, an asset. But I, I'm very, yeah, very cautious on, on how I, on how I think about things. So like I can make 40 different YouTube videos or I could make one awesome YouTube ad, right? That hopefully is for converting people for selling and then pushing that out to, you know, on a, as a YouTube ad. And so I'm very, I'm very cognizant of that. So I'm, I think I'm trying in a way that's like, I'm trying to figure out how to do scale things with having some of that security of the job. You know, cause I, there's, as an entrepreneur, you're, you're spending money on things and sometimes they work and sometimes they don't. It's, it can be kind of brutal.Yeah, exactly. And advertising has been, I know the average advertising, like figuring out either a Google ads, YouTube ads, Facebook ads, like you know, I, I, I've had some success I've had success and failure with, with ads and so I know that, you know, you gotta get eyes, you gotta get eyeballs on your, on your offers and different things, whether it's affiliate offer or your own offers. But this space, there's a, there's a, it's an extremely long learning curve, which I enjoy. I just recently, like I don't like, I haven't done well with Facebook ads, but I was just like, at the minimum, if someone comes to my site, let's say I have like five or 10 people coming today for whatever reason, visiting my Facebook profile or YouTube, let's say just have five or 10 people a day, no big deal. I at least like James to retarget those people.Those should be like, that should be cheap. That should be cheap ads. And so, and also even before you run normal traffic to your offers, you would want to have the retargeting piece set up anyways. So I'm having like this breakthrough of like at least setting up your pixel and setting up a retargeting ad. And then when that's there, then you can go to the next step, which is try to maybe send some cold traffic or any of your warm traffic that does come. At least you're going to be able to stay in front of them. I don't, I kind of have this other idea, which is I don't have the budget to be in front of everybody all the time, but I should try to be in front of, I should try to be in front of a few people wherever they go. Once they've come into my world, I should hold on to them. And you know, with Instagram and Facebook and Facebook marketplace and how people are interconnected, if they, you know, with the retargeting, they could come in from Google and I could retarget them on Facebook. Right? Yeah. So I think that's a powerful principle, which is at least retarget your traffic,Virginia Purnell:Which is good to think about too, because a lot of people say it's between like 7 - 12 times of them seeing you before they'll actually buy something from you.James Hurst:Exactly. Exactly. So yeah, like I said, you know, I don't have thousands of people coming to my stuff, but for the five or 10 people that are, I should, I should feel like I'm everywhere now. And with today's modern, you know, advertising platforms, that's, that's very possible. There's still, but yeah, I mean there's still lots to learn. I was just happy because the other day I saw an advertisement of myself, you know, I saw on my own feed my own ad. I was like, yes, I retargeted myself. Virginia Purnell:You're doing a good job. Right?James Hurst:So, but yeah, there's so much, there's so much, there's so much overwhelm. There's so many shiny objects. And I actually, I know everyone says avoid them. I kinda like them. And yeah, from Facebook ads, YouTube ads, and making video tutorials and podcasts and blogs and YouTube channels and Facebook groups. And this cool tool in that cold tool. I mean they're, they're all great, but golly, use up a lot of time if you don't, aren't strategic with it all. Right. Yeah, exactly. Exactly. You like to share that we haven't talked about yet today? Well, you know, I would love to just, I'd love to just make people aware of a few of the things that you know, I have made. So you talked about CF Follow Up Pro. Basically if you're a ClickFunnels affiliate you get a, you get a commission's report and in the commissions report there's the name, the email, the product that they purchased and it looks like an Excel spreadsheet and it pretty much is a spreadsheet.Right? Well, the stuff that I came up with was I took, if you're familiar with Zapier, I took those, the spreadsheet and I put it into, into Google sheets and from Google sheets I put that into a Zapier, which puts it into Active Campaign, which is my email tool. And those are, this is what it does. Let's say you sign up through my link for ClickFunnels for a free trial that would end up in the report, your email, your name, the fact that you're trialing, and today's date. I take all that information, I put it into Active Campaign, and 30 minutes later I've got an email out to you saying, Hey, welcome to click. Congratulations on your free trial, right? And then I drip out. Then two days later I say, Hey, it's been a couple of days. Just want to check in with you.Have you, have you made your first funnel yet? Are you stuck on anything? How can I help? Right? And then four or five days later, Hey, here's a free training. A couple of days later, this is in 14 days, Hey, show me your funnel that you've made. Here's a free training. Here's a share funnel. Just a few little things, keeping in touch. And what's really cool is I built up these automations that one of the, one of them, what it does on day 15 the email, the email automation, it asks the question, it says, Hey, does this person, does it still say that they're trialing or have they converted over to a paid subscription? Okay. Because if they pay, then there'll be another row in the spreadsheet that says your name and it says, you're on the startup plan and you paid, and I made $38 and 80 cents.Okay. So the automation, it looks at that and it says, Oh no, I don't see another record in here for her. That came through a, it's the last thing I saw was that there was a, that it was trialing, so that flips a switch that branches and it says, Oh, Hey, it looks like you didn't continue your trial with ClickFunnels or whatever with ClickFunnels. Hey, you know what? Something wrong? You need to make your trial longer. Do you need, you know, what did you get stuck on something? It's that. It's that feedback. And some people will, some people will never hear back from right. Other people will reply and say, Oh gosh, I was so busy. You know, they got sick, whatever. I'd love to. If I get this extended or you know, I couldn't get my domain set up. It was just a pain, you know?And so you get that feedback of why are people falling through the cracks? Same thing for a refund. If my little automations, they listen, quote unquote listening for a refund, boom, that kicks off an automation emails. Hey, it looks like you refunded. Let's like he refunded your last month. Did you know you can downgrade, you don't have to cancel. You can, you can downgrade to the smaller plan. You know, maybe they don't know. You're just trying. And so to have those emails going out perfectly that right time, like it's very, very powerful. And that's a, that's a tool I built. The other one, which is really, really cool too. There's a few competitors out there, but the other one's called Email Slurper for 3000. And do you have a, you have a Facebook group yourself? Virginia Purnell:Not quite yet. James Hurst:Not quite yet. So Facebook groups are really powerful. It's a great way to kind of congregate, you know, your audience, right? Whether it's your podcast listeners or people that are buying your tools or that want to get your trainings, things like that. And so a lot of people have Facebook groups and you get three questions as an admin to kind of filter out the spam of the internet. And you could say like, why do you want to join? How did you hear about us? Do you, you know, do you agree to follow the group rules of no spamming, no, no, this or that. What we did was marketers, we took those three admin questions and we said, well, we're going to use one of them to say, Hey do you would like this free training, a lead magnets, enter your email address, okay, enter your email address. And then another question could be, imagine this.Imagine, imagine the question is, do you have ClickFunnels? And they put yes or no as the answer. So now you're getting some market research about you, about your audience. And then you have another third question you could say, you know, what's your biggest, what's your biggest concern when it comes to getting visibility right out on the internet? What's, what's your biggest question about YouTube? So now you're getting ideas about content you can create. Well, where are people getting stuck? They're coming to you as the expert. Where are people getting stuck? What kind of content could you make? Let's say 50 people come in and they all have these top five questions. You can directly speak to them. Okay, so what my tool Email Slurper 3000 does is it takes, most importantly, it takes that email address, it puts it into a Google sheet, which it gets picked up by Zapier.I put that into my Active Campaign. And then I email people, Hey, welcome to this group that you just joined. Okay? And so I have a group that people are literally finding it every single day without me doing anything like just the way it's named, the amount of buzz around it. And people come and join every single day. He emails her, they put their email in email, super picks them up, and I started and I started dripping them 10 emails. This one I'm doing, it just has a little Amazon affiliate link that says a related thing, right? So you're just, you email out related products and services and so I just say, Oh, this is cool. You're welcome. This group, here's a link for this thing the next day. Oh, you should know about this. Oh and here's the link if you want to get it.I just every single day for like seven days anyways, so Email Slurper it. If you hit, if you didn't have Email Sluper, you'd have to copy that email address out of there. You have to copy it out of there manually. If you hit, approve, if you, if you hit approve its just gone. Facebook does not save the answers to those questions anywhere. That's a, that's a big painful moment when someone learns that for the first time that you, you know, if, if you didn't copy those emails, they're gone. So Email Slurper grabs them out of there and puts them into your tool. Here's a really cool thing to do, which I came up with is remember how I asked like you have ClickFunnels, yes or no? Yes I can take, I can take the answer to that question and map that to a custom field in my auto responder and then I can have an automation. What I'm, when I'm dripping them out, I can have an automation say, how did they answer that question if they, if they said no to the ClickFunnels, do they have ClickFunnels? Yes or no? Then I can send them other emails say, Hey, let me tell you about ClickFunnels and here's my, here's my link, right, to get them on a free trial of ClickFunnels.Does that make sense? It does and it makes me really excited. Well good. It's actually, I mean it's actually really cool cause I mean I just love, I love automation. Like you know, just little things like, and it's so simple. Do you have ClickFunnels, yes or no, and then the auto responder says, what do they say to the answer to that question? They say, yes. Okay, well don't bother telling them more about ClickFunnels. Did they say no? Then tell them this, you know, and then your third question, you could also branch them another, you know another way. The key with that question is it has to be something you can't say, what's your favorite color? Red, right. It can't be a free response. It has to be something that I can like, you know, get ahold of and and ask does it stay yes or no, like past to be something specificVirginia Purnell:And then information that you can utilize down the road. Right?James Hurst:Yeah, exactly. And I mean it's great. It's great. Let's, let's say this, they say no to ClickFunnels. I may be, I may be happy to, I may be happy to just do it with email automations. Like, okay, here's a trial ClickFunnels. You should try this, try that. Or if it's important enough or high value enough, you could then say, you could even send yourself an email and said someone just joined your group and they said they're very interested in your nine 97 plan. Then you notify them to get on the phone with this or get over on the Facebook messenger. So depending on the value of that thing, you know you might want to escalate your personal involvement. So those are good tips too.Virginia Purnell:I'm glad we talked today, so it was awesome. How can people find out more about you or find you online?James Hurst:So I'm pretty active on Facebook. Facebook.com/OJHurst, I think is my profile. I have a website, JamesHurst.com and find me there. So either of those two places. I have a Facebook group kind of geared around affiliate marketing and ClickFunnels, that kind of thing. I also have one on live streaming, the live streaming practice with James Hurst. There's just a few of us in there and we just practice that up and try to get better at the live stream, which I think is something everyone should, you know, should get better at and take advantage of. I think live, I think live video is a huge kind of untapped opportunity.Virginia Purnell:I really appreciate you being on here, James.James Hurst:Well, thanks so much. Nice visiting.Virginia Purnell:Have a great day.James Hurst:See ya.Virginia Purnell:Thank you so much for joining us today. Be sure to subscribe and leave some love through a review and I'll catch you on the next episode. Links of Interest:DistinctDigitalMarketing.comhttps://www.facebook.com/ojhurstJamesHurst.com

The first trait (which is not in any particular order) in my Godly Helpmate Miniseries is Obedience. WOOhoo! Right? We'll take a look at what this may mean for you with some scripture. I'm praying that you have a blessed week :) Kell!

The best adverts are the ones that make us cry, or laugh, or both! Right? Well not quite. In this episode, Phil Barden, author of the best selling consumer psychology book Decoded, explains the science behind adverts that really work, why emotion is important but not everything, and gives an analysis of the best ad from 2019. Phil's book Decoded: https://amzn.to/2EXoIMl Phil's agency Decode: https://decodemarketing.com/en Sign up to our mailing list: https://bit.ly/2Myvc8z

Black On Both Sides Episode #81 Corona is over, right? Right? Well then why is Georgia open? Wait, everyone is back open? Kunta thinks the flattened curve is about to unflatten to a new level of death. The administration is now saying that Wuhan is responsible for letting the virus escape from a lab. Who […]

PLUS: Elizabeth has the Dirt Alert, :30 Pop Culture Challenge and Blinded By The Item AND we're looking for the Girl Scout Cookie Dealer of the Day!

Lead Pastor Wes Terry talks about "Drinking From The Right Well" out of John 4:1-32. This message is part of the series "Pathways: A Fail-Proof Plan For How To Grow Spiritually." This message was preached on September 17th, 2017.

It Was No Rumor! Apple Releases Official Podcasts App! In last week's episode, I shared the rumors and speculation that surrounded the idea that Apple might release a standalone Podcasts App for iOS. Earlier this week, Apple actually released such an app. Personally, I'm thinking that they may have rushed it out the door due […] The post 266 Apple Gets Podcasts App Right! Well Almost! – Take Your Community On A Cruise – And My Thoughts On The Freemium Model & More! appeared first on The Cliff Ravenscraft Show.