Podcast appearances and mentions of melissa doman

Learn how to effectively discuss mental health in the workplace for both supporters and individuals sharing their experiences from Organizational Psychologist & Author of "Yes, You Can Talk About Mental Health at Work," Melissa Doman. You'll learn:Why mental health conversations deserve a spot at workRealistic strategies for preparing for your mental health conversationsHelpful ways supporters can respond and take actionTeam rituals to maintain a mentally healthy teamShow NotesWeekly Newsletter Sign-Up: http://bit.ly/37hqtQW Follow Career Contessa: http://bit.ly/2TMH2QP Guest Resources:LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/melissadoman1/Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/thewanderingmel/Melissa: www.melissadoman.comBook: https://a.co/d/6HDaXjVCareer Contessa ResourcesBook 1:1 career coaching session: https://www.careercontessa.com/hire-a-mentor/ Take an online course: https://www.careercontessa.com/education/ Get your personalized salary report: https://www.careercontessa.com/the-salary-project/ Browse open jobs: https://www.careercontessa.com/jobs/ See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

Join us for a conversation on mental health at work with one of the leading voices on this topic- Melissa Doman, MA. Melissa is an Organizational Psychologist, Former Clinical Mental Health Therapist, and Author of Yes, You Can Talk about Mental Health at Work. If you are interested in learning more about Melissa's work and how she can support your organization, check out her website.

There's no doubt that mental health in the workplace has become increasingly destigmatized in recent years. While conversations about its importance have now become commonplace, they can fall flat if people don't know how to engage in these conversations effectively. In this episode of the Radical Respect podcast, Kim and Wesley speak with Melissa Doman, who unpacks her playbook for how to talk about mental health at work without messing up. about Melissa Doman:Melissa Doman, MA is an Organizational Psychologist, Former Clinical Mental Health Therapist, & Author of Yes, You Can Talk About Mental Health at Work (Here's Why And How To Do It Really Well). Melissa works with companies across industries around the globe – including clients like Google, Dow Jones, the Orlando City Soccer Club, Microsoft, Salesforce, Siemens, Estée Lauder, & Janssen. She's spoken at SXSW and has been featured as a subject matter expert in CNN, Vogue, NPR, the BBC, CNBC, Inc., and in LinkedIn's 2022 Top 10 Voices on Mental Health.

How can you address mental health challenges and improve your workplace environment? Join Lesley Logan and Brad Crowell as they explore Melissa Doman's expert strategies for navigating workplace dynamics with radical candor and effective communication. Learn why taking action is crucial and discover your options for creating a healthier work setting in today's recap episode.If you have any questions about this episode or want to get some of the resources we mentioned, head over to LesleyLogan.co/podcast. If you have any comments or questions about the Be It pod shoot us a message at beit@lesleylogan.co. And as always, if you're enjoying the show please share it with someone who you think would enjoy it as well. It is your continued support that will help us continue to help others. Thank you so much! Never miss another show by subscribing at LesleyLogan.co/subscribe.In this episode you will learn about:How to address workplace bullies with direct communication strategies.The benefits of asking for help and using support networks effectively.Steps to translate awareness of mental health issues into concrete actions.How to use radical candor to enhance workplace communication.Implementing actionable steps to drive systemic change in your organization.Episode References/Links:Melissa Doman Episode 409Melissa Doman WebsiteYes, You Can Talk About Mental Health at Work by Melissa DomaneLevate Mentorship ProgramCambodia February 2025 RetreatOPC Website40 Days of 40 - OPC WebsiteProfitable Business Accelerator ProgramRadical Candor by Kims ScottKareen Walsh Episode 397  If you enjoyed this episode, make sure and give us a five star rating and leave us a review on iTunes, Podcast Addict, Podchaser or Castbox. DEALS! Check out all our Preferred Vendors & Special Deals from Clair Sparrow, Sensate, Lyfefuel BeeKeeper's Naturals, Sauna Space, HigherDose, AG1 and ToeSox Be in the know with all the workshops at OPCBe It Till You See It Podcast SurveyBe a part of Lesley's Pilates MentorshipFREE Ditching Busy Webinar  Resources:Watch the Be It Till You See It podcast on YouTube!Lesley Logan websiteBe It Till You See It PodcastOnline Pilates Classes by Lesley LoganOnline Pilates Classes by Lesley Logan on YouTubeProfitable Pilates Follow Us on Social Media:InstagramFacebookLinkedIn  Episode Transcript:Lesley Logan 0:00  Learning, listening, understanding mental health at the workplace, and the things that you can do around radical candor is all really, really good stuff. But then you need to take a piece of that and break it down into an action that you can take because otherwise it's just a bunch of information. And if you put yourself into a place where it's like, I have to make this big dent, then that's probably also not going to happen because systemic change takes time. It just does. Lesley Logan 0:24  Welcome to the Be It Till You See It podcast where we talk about taking messy action, knowing that perfect is boring. I'm Lesley Logan, Pilates instructor and fitness business coach. I've trained thousands of people around the world and the number one thing I see stopping people from achieving anything is self-doubt. My friends, action brings clarity and it's the antidote to fear. Each week, my guest will bring bold, executable, intrinsic and targeted steps that you can use to put yourself first and Be It Till You See It. It's a practice, not a perfect. Let's get started.  Lesley Logan 1:05  Welcome back to the Be It Till You See It interview recap where my co-host in life, Brad, and I are going to dig into the supportive convo I had with Melissa Doman in our last episode. If you haven't yet listened to that episode, you are missing out. You're missing out. You missed out on a very fun conversation. She's one of those guests I had to bring back because I've been watching her be it till she sees it and her business and life just growing before our eyes. And it's really fun to have those guests back. So if you haven't listened to episode from 103, 300 episodes ago, you should also listen to that one. But first, let's talk about today. Today is August 22nd 2024 and it's Never Bean Better Day. About this day. Never Bean B-E-A-N Better Day is on August 22nd, it gives us the perfect opportunity to enjoy and spread some bean Brad Crowell 1:54  Wuv.Lesley Logan 1:55  Wuv.Brad Crowell 1:56  W-U-V wuv. Lesley Logan 1:57  Wuv with our canine companions and others. Brad Crowell 2:00  Do you love me? Lesley Logan 2:02  Yeah. But what's the bean for? Brad Crowell 2:03  I don't know yet. Lesley Logan 2:04  By loving us unconditionally to being our listening ears and cuddle buddies, our furry friends have always upheld their reputable position as women's best friend, may I add, and are ever ready to be our lifelong companions registered therapy dogs like Bean, ohBrad Crowell 2:18  Bean is the example dog today. Lesley Logan 2:20  Okay, okay, share their wuv at hospitals, schools, reading programs, behavioral therapy, group sessions, domestic violence, homeless shelters, long-term care, Alzheimer's units and anyone else in need of an emotional facelift. Interesting choice of words. Yeah, so, I guess Bean.Brad Crowell 2:37  I'm pretty sure this should be never by own better day.Lesley Logan 2:41  I know. How's that? How does that work? Bean day. Brad Crowell 2:46  Bean is the name of the dog. So it's never by own better day.Lesley Logan 2:50  Yeah. What's never for? Brad Crowell 2:53  Never been better, Never been better. Never Bean better, is the plan of words. We're changing it to never by. Okay. Now I'm explaining the joke. Lesley Logan 3:02  Well, you know what guys, not every one of these days can make sense. So, you know.Brad Crowell 3:07  Well, it's about emotional support dogs and dogs that go in hospitals and stuff like that. We're big, big fans of canines in general, as you all know.Lesley Logan 3:16  Oh yeah, you know, you can get a dog that can tell if you need insulin, or can tell if you need a different vitamin, like you can train these dogs.Brad Crowell 3:24  Or if you're having a seizure. Lesley Logan 3:25  Yeah, you guys, there's so many of these dogs around now, and also, there's so many different organizations that could help if you don't have the funds to access one of these dogs on your own. Like, it's worth advocating for yourself and finding someone who's literally raising money to do this and give it to you. So you know, know that if you have a friend in need. Okay, so.Brad Crowell 3:42  You got a friend in me. Lesley Logan 3:44  In case you had it on your bingo card. Bean day, I don't think you get much out of this. Keep singing while I do the upcoming events and travel. Okay, you guys. So eLevate applications.Brad Crowell 3:57  Oh, actually, today, the 22nd, we're what? We're in L.A. We're heading to L.A. right now. We're driving. Lesley Logan 4:01  We're on our way to L.A. today. Brad Crowell 4:02  We're driving to L.A. Lesley Logan 4:03  Yes, we're going, I'm working with my mentors for the weekend. It's actually like my little Pilates vacation for me after the tour. So there was an opportunity to teach, and I said, thank you. I feel so seen and I would like to be a student because I all have, I've just been teaching, so I'm going to do that. So I may be with my mentor, but what's really fun is that I can tell you about my mentorship program. And my mentorship program is for teachers, and it is a really fun program going into our fifth round next year, and you can still apply. And also, Brad, like, loaded up, some awesome things you can get if you like, sign yourself up. So if you have questions about it, you'll actually get all those questions pretty much answered at lesleylogan.co/elevate. You can also take a fun class with us. You can hear from past eLevate members. And also you should know that when you do graduate, it's not over. I don't go see ya. Never want to see you again. Brad Crowell 4:57  Wouldn't want to be yah. Lesley Logan 4:58  You actually joined the alumni group and we do fun retreats together. So that's for you. That's eLevate, lesleylogan.co/elevate. Cambodia retreat. Holy freaking moly, it's August. That means we are so close to going to Cambodia for fall. But you can't come to that one because it's sold out. But you can come to the February one. Brad Crowell 5:16  Six months from now. Lesley Logan 5:16  Yes, six months. Brad Crowell 5:17  There's still six months. Actually, it's literally the 23rd to the 28th of Feb. So six months and a day, Lesley Logan 5:23  Six months and a day. Brad Crowell 5:24  From now, we're gonna be back in Cambodia. The time of recording this, there's still room to join us. So.Lesley Logan 5:29  And you know what? It's not too late, because really the best time to buy a flight is like three to four months before. So truly, this is the best time to sign up and snag your spot go to crowsnestretreats.com. That is crows with a S and nest with an S in the middle, and retreats with an S at the end. So. Brad Crowell 5:50  Thanks. Lesley Logan 5:51  Two words are plural. One's not. There you go. It's a dot com on that one. Try out OPC. You guys, do you know that OPC was made for you? I just did a really fun interview where someone was asking me about, how does OPC help people ditch perfection and also prioritize themselves first and have some self-care? And I was like, oh, because you're not supposed to be perfect when you do Pilates. You're supposed to just be in practice and we constantly remind you of that in every single class, while also providing tips and ways that you can get more depth and more out of an exercise, and then reminding you that if an exercise is not right for you yet, you get to do something that is and so even if you go to a studio already, did you know that you could also be an OPC member? That's right, you could go somewhere else and still do OPC with us on your other days.Brad Crowell 6:38  Wait a minute. Are you saying two things can happen at the same time?Lesley Logan 6:42  I am, I am, and so if you want to try us out, go to opc.me/40.Brad Crowell 6:49  Yeah and I have been kicking off another webinar here from Profitable Pilates, all about if you're feeling stuck with your money in your business, whether you're a super, super small business, or you have a brick and mortar with a full team. If you're feeling stuck with your money, come join me for a free upcoming webinar called the Accelerator program, studio business growth accelerator, go to P-R-F-I-T dot biz slash accelerator. Get yourself signed up. It's totally free, prfit.biz/accelerator. Lesley Logan 7:21  Profit without the O. Brad Crowell 7:22  That's right. Profit without the O. Thanks for saying that. Lesley Logan 7:24  Biz with an I-Z. there. Brad Crowell 7:26  (Inaudible).There, that's right, B-I-Zed. Lesley Logan 7:29  Yeah. And accelerator is how you spell it. But you know, sometimes you forget how many C's are in there. So just (inaudible) Brad Crowell 7:35  There's 27 C's in there. Lesley Logan 7:37  Shut up. Before we get into it with Melissa Doman, what's our audience question to answer this week?Brad Crowell 7:45  YouTube Pilates with L said Lesley, I am dead keen to do eLevate. I'm so interested in learning more about classical Pilates. I feel so amazing to finally feel like I'm getting it. How I wonder, did Joe work with injured clients, especially when supine or loaded flexion was contraindicated? There's a lot of big words.Lesley Logan 8:06  Yeah and I like the dead keen. I think that Brad Crowell 8:08  Dead keen. I'm dead keen.Lesley Logan 8:10  Why don't we say that in the States, I'm dead keen.Brad Crowell 8:12  Keen K-E-E-N.Lesley Logan 8:13  It would just turn and now the kids would just call it DK, I'm DK. Yeah. Okay. So here's the deal. I love how in eLevate, we actually get to explore how Joseph Pilates worked with contraindications inside the group, just based on the people who come becauseBrad Crowell 8:28  What is a contraindication? Lesley Logan 8:30  Oh, like, if you have a fusion in your back, then it is contraindicated to do flexion. Or, like, it's like, it's not, it's a no-no. That's what, you see, it's a no no. It's like, if you take a medication, there's other medications that we like contraindicated. So like, it's a no-no to do this with that. So for example, she is saying, like, supine or with loaded flexion. So let me just say, in eLevate. I don't go over like, contraindication by contraindication and (inaudible) because that would take years. And that's like, there are specialties.Brad Crowell 9:06  I have. 28 teeth. Are there any Pilates things that can't doLesley Logan 9:11  Okay. Nothing's contraindicated with that. You can do all the exercises. Lesley Logan 9:14  26?Lesley Logan 9:14  All of them, still can, still can. Brad Crowell 9:16  Three?Lesley Logan 9:17  Yeah, you might all three struggle with the towel exercise. I'm just gonna be honest, you might need more than three. Depends on where the three are. So, just so you know, in eLevate with all the teachers I do go over how Joseph Pilates thought about his work, that was that he that he shared, and how he taught it to people. And that will include going over things that are contraindicated based on what you ask and also the people in the group. And then what's cool is, when you graduate, we still talk about it. Someone just had someone come in who is actually paralyzed from the waist down. And so it's like, okay, what can I do with this person? Here's what I've done. Is there anything I'm missing? And so to answer your question, What did Joe do? Just like, real quickly, he avoided the things you're not supposed to. Just didn't do it. We don't have to fix people, you guys. And also, for those who are not teachers, like your Pilates instructor, should never tell you that they could fix you. And if they did, that's a red flag. What we are here to do is balance your imbalances, and when you balance your imbalances, what ends up happening is you have fewer aches and pains. Right now. As we record this, we're about to go to a chiropractor. My left hip is out of alignment. I can tell you that right now. And so I am feeling–because I fell–I'm feeling aches and pains in my body so when I move, there are just some limitations that I have. If I were to go see Joe, he's not gonna be like, oh, let me work on this left hip of yours. No, that's out of our scope. We're not PT, unless you are. So what he would instead do is work on the imbalances. And what is really cool is I did Pilates today with this out of the line with my hip, and I had way less pain throughout the day today than I did yesterday when I had my fall. Here's the deal. It's not that Pilates completely put it back together, but it balanced some imbalances that were causing that issue. And so that's our goal, and that's what Joseph Pilates would do. And eventually, over time, some of those aches, pains, injuries just go away. Sometimes you need extra help and other things, Pilates is not magic, but Joseph Pilates would not zero in on your little issue on your right pinky toe and, like, work it to death. He would work everything else. Brad Crowell 11:13  Do you believe it's magic? Lesley Logan 11:15  Yeah. And then also, you guys, I help you have the confidence to do that with your clients, I give you like the goal of eLevate is to help you see someone's imbalances, see someone's ache and pain, and actually trust the process and choose the right exercises for them. So that's what you do at eLevate. So if you're keen on that, you should sign up. Brad Crowell 11:33  If you're dead keen. Lesley Logan 11:34  If you're dead keen.Brad Crowell 11:35  That's right. Lesley Logan 11:35  And if and for the rest of you like seriously when it comes to Pilates, make sure your teacher is not like, micromanaging your right pinky toe. You've got other toes, so there's other parts of your body. You should be moving. We're about to do a YouTube video on this, and I'm like, there's no principles because you're just supposed to move. We have to be moving our bodies. If your Pilates class is not moving you enough, then you're in the wrong spot. So come to OPC. Okay, that was a bunch of shameless plugs. Lesley Logan 11:35  If you have questions, contact us. Let us know your question and we will happily work it into the pod. Pleasantly surprised, maybe you'll end up here. All right, stick around. We'll be right back.Lesley Logan 12:13  Okay, now let's talk about Melissa Doman. She's an organizational psychologist, former clinical mental health therapist and author of Yes, You Can Talk About Mental Health at Work, Here's Why (And How to Do It Really Well). Melissa specializes in teaching businesses leaders and individuals how to have realistic and constructive conversations about mental health, team dynamics and communication in the workplace. She's also known for her open and approachable leadership style, drawing from her experience with challenging managers. She said you have to address people who are negatively affecting your mental health at work or being a bully. And this is interesting because I was just talking to this about this with our agency members because they've had a, there's a couple people who've had clients who, like, won't, don't want to pay the late cancelation, and they're bullying them like, you're not a considerate person if you're charging me for this late cancelation policy, like (inaudible) late cancel. And I was like, no, no, they're a bully. They're actually the asshole. You're not the asshole. You told them the rules, they signed, they agreed to the rule, and now they're bullying you to not follow your own rules. And I said, you have to be comfortable. Brad Crowell 13:16  A.I.T.A. Lesley Logan 13:17  Yeah, they are the asshole. And (inaudible) says this all the time, I've repeated this before in the podcast, "We have to be comfortable making people as uncomfortable as they are making us." You have to get comfortable making the person uncomfortable, right? So you don't have to make this person uncomfortable at work, but you have to address this person is making my work experience negative, and it's affecting my mental health and my ability to do my job. And when we try to bottle it up and we keep it to ourselves, it doesn't get better. And by the way, your work is probably the one that's going to suffer, and then also you're going to get in trouble for suffered work and be like this person's been bullying me. That's too late now. It's too late to say that. You should have said that before. Brad Crowell 13:56  Yeah, she actually has a phrase. You'll have to go back and listen to her episode to actually get that phrase. She did, however, the high level overview of it was to pull them aside and say hey, I just need you to know how this is affecting me. You know how what you're doing and how you're doing is affecting me. She said this is really direct and pretty challenging, I acknowledge that. But sometimes it's necessary, it's needed, and it's going to help you stand up for yourself. You're going to feel better about yourself, the whole thing. Lesley Logan 14:32  Yeah, so we have a transcript so you can actually, like, copy paste and like, memorize that to have those conversations. But y'all, if you are working around someone who's affecting your mental health at work, you actually do have the right to say that this is happening. And if you're not feeling heard or supported by your superiors, then don't let people tell you that there's no good jobs out there. I have a client who constantly says how much she hates her job. And she's like, well, I'm not going to leave because the economy is bad. You guys, there are so many jobs out there and employers are doing everything they can to keep the employees they have. You need to know this. They're, like, really, like, they're, what other benefits can we throw at people so they stay in this job? So just trust that you are actually worth what you do. And there are people that need you out there, and there's awesome things you don't have to put up with it. We have a girlfriend who was absolutely being abused by her team at work, and when she finally said something, I'm gonna be out, she waited a long time, so when she finally said something, then they said oh well, she did this to me. And now and then, nothing got solved. Got this, like it sounds stupid, but you gotta say things when they first happen, because it doesn't get easier, it doesn't get better, right? And then by the time you feel like, oh my god, I'm at the end of my rope, I'm gonna say something. It's almost like there's nothing that they can actually do that's gonna make it better. You know, so, so stand up for yourself. Brad Crowell 15:53  Yeah and also, you know, some companies have an HR team, you can also talk to them. In this case, she's talking about directly with radical candor, approaching the person who's affecting you, and she said it also like her example in the episode wasn't necessarily about someone who's abusing you, but someone who says they're going to do something and is late, someone who doesn't actually finish the job, or is passing their work off onto you, or something like that.Lesley Logan 16:21  Yeah, all that is not fun for your mental health either. Brad Crowell 16:25  It is not. Lesley Logan 16:26  And by the way, Radical Candor is a book you should read it. It's really good.Brad Crowell 16:30  Yeah, okay, so I really enjoyed what she was talking about–asking for help. It's good to ask for help. She said, It doesn't matter how much of a badass you are trying to be. Everybody needs support, and this is a really difficult thing for small business owners–and myself included–definitely understand this, you know, the way that I was raised is it's a do it yourself world and you can do it all. And you should do it all because you have no money. Can't pay someone to do it for you anyway. So you should just figure it all out on your own. And so, I took that approach from childhood all the way into everything that I ever did from music into running companies. And the end of the day, it just eats more of your time and you don't ultimately have enough capacity to do all the things that need to happen and you end up being a bottleneck. So it doesn't matter how much of a badass you're trying to be. Everybody needs support. In her case, she said her husband very directly challenged her and said, "Okay, you no longer have the option to do all this stuff because it's now affecting me, and you have to have help. So we're going to find you an executive assistant who can support you." At first she was really reticent to pass things over, to relinquish control. But now she's like, how do I get this off my plate? Right? It's completely changed her approach to everything, because she's starting to see how well, maybe smoother, things can run for her company. It was one of the things that changed our business dramatically was when I realized that years in, I was still being the bottleneck, and then from there, when we shifted that, when I started to try to get out of these things that I had taken away from everybody else and was still doing, it actually allowed things to flow much more smoothly. It's a little bit counterintuitive at first, but it's also ego, you know, oh, I'm the only one that can do this part of it, whatever. Lesley Logan 18:24  I've mentioned this on the pod, and we have had four other episodes I've mentioned it, but like, if you watch the end of My Cousin Vinny, when he finds out that Marisa Tomei's character called in someone called him the judge from New York to, like, verify and validate the type of lawyer that he was, in, you know, his first case, and he got so mad at her. He's like, I wanted to win my case by myself. I wanted to win my first case by myself. And she's like, what if you won all of your cases, all of your cases, and at the end, you had to say, thank you. Oh my god, what a nightmare. And so that was just a really interesting thing that, like, whenever we're trying to do something ourselves, and you have you, like, actually ask for help, people are not gonna go, oh my god, LL asked for help. They're gonna remember, wow, it was so fun to be on LL's team to create this thing, I could be part of this creation. And then she said, thank you. Like, it's all it's like, these are amazing, amazing things. And so we have to just remember that asking for help is not actually about you. It's about sharing and it's actually about taking other people and saying hi, I see you as someone who can do this thing that I really want to do and I want to show my team. And it's actually really fucking cool. Anyways.Brad Crowell 19:43  Yeah, stick around. We're gonna cover those, Be It Action Items next. Brad Crowell 19:46  So let's talk about those Be It Action Items. What are the bold, executable, intrinsic or targeted action items that we could take away from your convo with Melissa Doman? All right, she said, "Hey, people take things the wrong way." Which is why it is so important to be super clear in your communication. We all interpret things based on our own experiences, usually, and so it's possible that someone said something to you, didn't know that they were touching a nerve, or vice versa, that you were maybe triggering something in them. She said before you're having a conversation with someone, usually about how they're affecting your mental health, she said it's important to self-reflect and ask what is it that I didn't like about this situation? She said that people can't read minds, obviously, so that's why clear communication is so necessary. Explain what's going on for you in this scenario, state what you want the others to do or not do with the information. Hey, now that I'm telling you this information, what would be really helpful for me is x, or it would really change things if you did x, right? Then highlight why you're bringing it up to them, deciding the most important things to tell them, so they don't get lost in the detail. So just go high level, right? They don't need a 10-year backstory. You could probably just say this is really affecting me because of some past history that I had, and just leave it at that, and then go on to explain what it is that they're doing and then how it's affecting you and what you would like them to do instead. And she said just avoid over complicating the conversation. She was sharing a story about her challenging the head of HR. She was brought in for a consulting job, and it was a short term gig. She's, I don't know, maybe she was with this company for a few months, or whatever, and everyone was treating her like an outsider in a really negative way. And she was working for the HR team, and she ended up finally challenging the head of HR and saying hey, do you see what you're doing here? This is super uncool, and I don't like it, and it's not fair to me, and I know I'm not part of the team the way that you guys are, but I'm still here to do a job, and this is what's coming across. So she said that's really hard to do. She's willing to be challenging that way, because she's taught herself how to do it over time, you know,. so.Lesley Logan 22:04  I love how she laid this out, because you could be either party in this scenario, but truly, like we had, I had someone come up to me and tell me something, but would give me zero specifics, none. So not even high level, just like, just generics about how we made her feel. And I said, okay, can you give me an example? I don't want to get into it. Okay, well, how would you like me to solve this problem? I don't know. And it's like, so here's the thing, there are assholes out there, but most people are not assholes, and they don't want you to feel bad at work. They don't want to be negatively impacting you. So I love this example because she actually says, how, what to say, explain what's going on for you, and state what you want others to do or not do. And then that way they can actually go, okay, let me think, how do we make this work? Here's how we can do this. I appreciate, like I, people are not mind readers, nor can they also, if the thing that they were doing with no negative intention cause negative impact, you then want them to create another thing that could maybe, like, it's important to kind of know, and that requires all of us to have a little bit more self-awareness and to go inward. Because, again, there are dicks out there, but not everyone is walking around wanting to trigger people or wanting to activate something in people. Most people want you to be the best version of yourself that's out there. Brad Crowell 23:20  Yeah. Well, what about you?Lesley Logan 23:21  So she said, when it comes to mental health at work, awareness is great, action is better. Brad Crowell 23:26  Awareness is great action is better. Lesley Logan 23:28  And you know what? We actually talked about that with Kareen's thing. She's like, manifestation is great, but you gotta take action on it. So hello, action. It's in our intro of the episode. So she talked about like, it's one thing to have the intention to do it, but it's another thing to create the impact and so and she also stressed that, like, you might not be living a big dent, but any dent is helpful. So what does this all mean? It means learning, listening, understanding, mental health, the workplace and the things that you can do–radical candor is all really, really good stuff–but then you need to take a piece of that and break it down into an action that you can take, because otherwise it's just a bunch of information. And if you put yourself into a place where it's like I have to make this big dent, then that's probably also not gonna happen, because systemic change takes time, just does. So if you have a business, or you're working at a company, and there's been something that's going on for a really long time, like just because they're made aware doesn't mean that you just made a thing that happens. So we've got to really do what we can to make the dents we need to, because over time, a dent can get bigger and bigger and bigger if we just keep working at it. So I really like that, because it's one thing for you to listen to this and be inspired by it, but you also, you know, taking action is always gonna be better. Brad Crowell 24:38  Action brings clarity. Lesley Logan 24:39  And it's the antidote to fear. You guys, I'm Lesley Logan. Brad Crowell 24:42  And I'm Brad Crowell. Lesley Logan 24:43  Thank you so much for listening to this episode today. You want action you can take after becoming aware? You can share this episode with your friend. Brad Crowell 24:50  We're gonna ask you what action to take right now? Lesley Logan 24:52  Right now (inaudible) guess if you wonder we're not gonna tell you exactly what would make this better. What would make this relationship better between you and me? Would be, if you share this with a friend. Brad Crowell 25:01  That's right. Lesley Logan 25:01  Share this. You could text it to them. You could, like, grab their phone and look for it for them, there's so many different ways you can listen to this episode. It could be on the OPC app. It could be on Apple, Spotify, you name it. Brad Crowell 25:11  You could text it to them every single day. Lesley Logan 25:13  You could, you could do that. You want to know what I get text every single day from campaigns so they clearly have no shame. You shouldn't either. All right, loves, until next time. Be It Till You See It. Brad Crowell 25:26  Bye for now. Lesley Logan 25:28  That's all I got for this episode of the Be It Till You See It Podcast. One thing that would help both myself and future listeners is for you to rate the show and leave a review and follow or subscribe for free wherever you listen to your podcast. Also, make sure to introduce yourself over at the Be It Pod on Instagram. I would love to know more about you. Share this episode with whoever you think needs to hear it. Help us and others Be It Till You See It. Have an awesome day. Be It Till You See It is a production of The Bloom Podcast Network. If you want to leave us a message or a question that we might read on another episode, you can text us at +1-310-905-5534 or send a DM on Instagram @BeItPod. Brad Crowell 26:10  It's written, filmed, and recorded by your host, Lesley Logan, and me, Brad Crowell. Lesley Logan 26:15  It is transcribed, produced and edited by the epic team at Disenyo.co. Brad Crowell 26:20  Our theme music is by Ali at Apex Production Music and our branding by designer and artist, Gianfranco Cioffi. Lesley Logan 26:27  Special thanks to Melissa Solomon for creating our visuals. Brad Crowell 26:30  Also to Angelina Herico for adding all of our content to our website. And finally to Meridith Root for keeping us all on point and on time.Support this podcast at — https://redcircle.com/be-it-till-you-see-it/donationsAdvertising Inquiries: https://redcircle.com/brandsPrivacy & Opt-Out: https://redcircle.com/privacy

Lesley Logan sits down with Melissa Doman, an organizational psychologist and author of Yes, You Can Talk About Mental Health at Work, to discuss the importance of open dialogues about mental health in the workplace. They explore how to approach difficult conversations, the power of vulnerability, and actionable steps for fostering a supportive work environment.If you have any questions about this episode or want to get some of the resources we mentioned, head over to LesleyLogan.co/podcast. If you have any comments or questions about the Be It pod shoot us a message at beit@lesleylogan.co. And as always, if you're enjoying the show please share it with someone who you think would enjoy it as well. It is your continued support that will help us continue to help others. Thank you so much! Never miss another show by subscribing at LesleyLogan.co/subscribe.In this episode you will learn about:How companies are embracing mental health discussions.Advice for handling negative workplace dynamics.Ways to use specificity to solve workplace challenges.How intentions and impacts can differ in interactions.Insights from meeting Radical Candor author Kim Scott.The benefits of receiving and asking for support.Awareness vs. action in mental health conversations.Episode References/Links:Melissa Doman WebsiteMelissa Doman LinkedInMelissa Doman InstagramYes, You Can Talk About Mental Health at Work by Melissa DomanRadical Candor by Kims Scott (Updated Edition)OPC WebsiteOPC PerksGuest Bio:Organizational Psychologist, Former Mental Health Therapist, & Author. Melissa Doman, MA is an ​​Organizational Psychologist, Former Clinical Mental Health Therapist, & Author of Yes, You Can Talk About Mental Health at Work (Here's Why And How To Do It Really Well). Melissa works with companies across industries around the globe – including clients like Google, Dow Jones, the Orlando City Soccer Club, Microsoft, Salesforce, Siemens, Estée Lauder, & Janssen. She's spoken at SXSW and has been featured as a subject matter expert in Vogue, NPR, the BBC, CNBC, Inc., and in LinkedIn's 2022 Top 10 Voices on Mental Health. Having lived abroad in South Korea, England, Australia and traveled to 45+ countries, Melissa calls upon her global experiences to inform how she works with companies around the world. She has one core goal: to equip companies, individuals, and leaders to have constructive conversations about mental health, team dynamics, and communication in the workplace. Her work and book aim to accomplish just that.  If you enjoyed this episode, make sure and give us a five star rating and leave us a review on iTunes, Podcast Addict, Podchaser or Castbox. DEALS! Check out all our Preferred Vendors & Special Deals from Clair Sparrow, Sensate, Lyfefuel BeeKeeper's Naturals, Sauna Space, HigherDose, AG1 and ToeSox Be in the know with all the workshops at OPCBe It Till You See It Podcast SurveyBe a part of Lesley's Pilates MentorshipFREE Ditching Busy Webinar  Resources:Watch the Be It Till You See It podcast on YouTube!Lesley Logan websiteBe It Till You See It PodcastOnline Pilates Classes by Lesley LoganOnline Pilates Classes by Lesley Logan on YouTubeProfitable Pilates Follow Us on Social Media:InstagramFacebookLinkedIn  Episode Transcript:Melissa Doman 0:00  People take things the wrong way and people have triggers and people have sensitivity. So it is a two-way street. So if someone is impacting your mental health, it's also helpful to think about, wait a minute, how much of this is my stuff and how much of this is them? Because when people activate things in us, it's not usually 100% them, some of it, it is our stuff to a degree.Lesley Logan 0:26  Welcome to the Be It Till You See It podcast where we talk about taking messy action, knowing that perfect is boring. I'm Lesley Logan, Pilates instructor and fitness business coach. I've trained thousands of people around the world and the number one thing I see stopping people from achieving anything is self-doubt. My friends, action brings clarity and it's the antidote to fear. Each week, my guest will bring bold, executable, intrinsic and targeted steps that you can use to put yourself first and Be It Till You See It. It's a practice, not a perfect. Let's get started.  All right, Be It babe. This interview today is one of my dear, lovely women in my life. I'm so grateful that I got to meet her. So grateful I reached out to meet her like, please, you guys, reach out to people who inspire you and tell them. Like and we have an amazing story about that in this episode, actually. But that is how I met Mel is because I heard her on another podcast. I was like I want you on mine. She said yes. And then we met in person. And while you'll hear that, physically, you know sparkles and glitter didn't come parting out of us. I felt them. So today I have a guest back. She's been on the show before. And she's an incredible author, and we'll talk about her book Yes, You Can Talk About Mental Health At Work and why you should. And we also talk a little bit how you can talk about it at work. And then what I'm excited for you to hear is also like two women sharing what it's like to grow in their business. And I know a lot of you are small business owners wanting to start new things and be working with other people. And I think it's so important that you know, everything is a work in progress. Everything takes a lot of time. A lot of people are doing things scared and doing the best they can and I hope that this really helps you see that you can do that, too. And you can be it till you see it. And it's not about being perfect. It's about learning. So here is Mel Doman. All right, Be It babe, this is gonna be an awesome wild interview. I'm just gonna say it right now, we're gonna have the best time Mel Doman is here. She's back. And she and I finally got to meet in real life. And it was a lunch that could have kept going in fact, I would definitely remember being late for my next call. So we are so excited that you're back, Mel, just in case anyone missed your first interview, can you tell everyone who you are and what you rock at?Melissa Doman 2:48  Oh, I have been so looking forward to this. And when we got to meet up in person, I'm shocked that we didn't fart sparkles or something like that because it was just it was like a clashing of two galaxies. So I am Melissa Doman. I'm an organizational psychologist, former clinical mental health therapist and author of Yes, You Can Talk About Mental Health at Work: Here's Why… and How to Do it Really Well. So I teach businesses, leaders and individuals how to have realistic and constructive conversations about mental health, team dynamics and communication in the workplace. My clients range from really large organizations like Estée Lauder, Dow Jones, Google to midsize organizations like Orlando City Soccer Club to small mom-and-pop companies and everything in between. And I do (inaudible) virtually, in person, keynotes facilitation, (inaudible) interviews, strategic advising and on a personal note, I do a very impressive Chewbacca impression. I do.Lesley Logan 3:52  Okay, Brad is gonna be upset if I don't ask you to do it though. You know, likeMelissa Doman 3:56  It'll be your reward at the end. Lesley Logan 3:58  I love it. You got to stay till the end, stay till the end. Okay, so this happened, we happen to be talking about what one of the things that you focus on all year long during the month of May which apparently is mental health month I did not know this because I don't live by the calendar as of like today is like dog mom day I don't I don't do although people are gonna laugh because every Thursday we do use the calendar. Okay, today is change your password day. Like we do do that on Thursdays guys, but I don't actually look at the month. And what I love about you is that you're like, not about companies only focus on mental health in May you're about them focus on it all the time. And since we last had you on, do you feel that companies are more open to talking about mental health or do you feel like it's, do you feel it's just it's the same as before and you're still kind of do you feel like you've made a dent? Or you know what I mean? Like where are we at in society?Melissa Doman 4:53  Oh, yes. Oh, yes. So I actually think it's a little bit of column A and a little bit of column B and here's why. It's entirely company-dependent, industry-dependent, and in some cases, team-dependent, because you might have a company that's super open about talking about mental health, but then you have some butthead leaders who are like, I'm not taking part of my chip. So there are some companies that really took the pandemic, as a serious kick in the butt to enable these conversations in a more sustainable way for a whole host of reasons. There are other companies that are like, well, we're in endemic status now, so we can stop check-boxing and go back to what we were doing before. So it's a little bit of both, I think it really depends very much on the ecosystem in which people work, however, on a very public plateau, and you know, looking outwardly seeing all the messaging that's coming out, Oh, my God, it's everywhere. It has come so far, in the past, gosh, six years since I started subspecializing in this, it's unbelievable. I even saw and I'm very conscious, I'm on a wellbeing-focused podcast, so please forgive me for the example I'm about to give, okay? McDonald's, put out an ad that for Mental Health Awareness Month, they're taking the smiley face off of the Happy Meal, because kids have a whole range of emotions, and you don't want to tell them how they're feeling. And I was like, Oh, my God, I never would have imagined seeing something like that. Yes, it seemed to children. But you never would have seen something like that 10 years ago.Lesley Logan 6:40  I'm shocked. Melissa Doman 6:41  The Happy Meal. The Happy Meal.Lesley Logan 6:44  Yeah. It's called the Happy Meal.Melissa Doman 6:46  They took the smiley face off the box for the month of May. And I sat there, I was like, Oh, my God, this is unreal. And so you're seeing it way more in the public sphere, which is great. Some places it's performative. Absolutely. But you know, long, long story short, I think it really depends on who you're talking to, and where you're looking. Lesley Logan 7:08  Okay. Yeah, yeah. Well, I'm so happy to hear it's a little bit of calming, that's great. And I also think Melissa Doman 7:13  Oh yes, I think making sure of it. Lesley Logan 7:15  Yeah, I know, you have it. And I also think the honesty there that sometimes it is the people and I think that, you know, it can be person-dependent. And it can, yeah, that person can have such an effect on your ecosystem, your sphere of like where you're at. So you could be working for the company that has all the things and people, I don't know what they're called, people services, HR is like doing all this work to make sure everything is there. And then like, there's one person that's in front of you. And I feel like I might have talked about this a little bit on our first podcast episode together. But for the people listening who are working in a space where they feel like there's a person who's kind of affecting them being able to talk about mental health at work, do you have advice for them? Because I do think that's a be it till you see it kind of thing. You almost can't just like walk in and go, like, here vomit up all of the stuff that's going on to your mental health, but also like you also want to feel like you have the confidence and capabilities to share what you're feeling.Melissa Doman 8:13  Yeah. Well, I think it's a you know, there's two different questions in there. Because one is, you know, effectively talking about your mental health at work. The other one is letting someone else know when they're affecting your mental health at work.Lesley Logan 8:27  I don't think I've ever been able to, I think I don't work in corporate, I work for myself, because I don't know that I would be able to do the second one. Like tell the person you're affecting my mental health. Melissa Doman 8:35  Oh, I might have done exactly that at a job I had. Would you like to hear the tale? Lesley Logan 8:41  Yeah, let's do. People like, we like stories here. Melissa Doman 8:43  Oh, yes. So a boss I had before I went out on my own. And I was doing a temporary cover position for someone who's out on leave for a while. And that person who I was covering for was amazing, very good at their job. I was also good at that job. And I did it just a little bit differently. And people received it differently and in a positive way. So that person's boss looked at me very much as a placeholder to make sure to, you know, feel that I was not welcome, we'll say, and kind of resented the fact that I did very well and went out of their way to you know, sabotage me and just make sure that they told me and that I wasn't welcomed in this place, despite the success I was having. And it got really bad to the point where this person would, you know, sabotage actively like workshops I was doing trying to trip me up stuff like that. And one day, I just had enough. And I kept trying to win this person over with kindness that didn't work. And so they saw my face after one of the sessions. And I'm the woman of a thousand faces. So they said, "Are you okay?" I said, "Nope." They said, "Do you need to talk?" I said, "That would be great." And so we go into a private room. And I said, "You negatively affect my mental health at and outside of work." To which they said, "Well, what's your proof?" That was their, that was their response. I was like, Oh, my God. And I said, "Me telling you is the proof. It is the proof. I understand that you don't want me here. I understand that my contract is temporary. That doesn't mean you get an excuse to treat me poorly, sabotage me, make me feel unwelcome. You, you don't need to, like love on me like you do the rest of your team. But you need to treat me with respect. And for the remainder of my contract here. I am not going to put up with this anymore. And shame on you." This is the head of HR, by the way. I said, "Shame on you for being in a people-focused role and doing this to me." And she was floored. She was like, well, you know, just like they all do. Now listen, folks, I am more direct than most. And I realized that it was a temporary contract. And I was like, consequences be damned. But you have to be able to address people who are negatively affecting your mental health at work or dare I say being a bully. Is there a risk to addressing that? Absolutely. Absolutely there's risks. Do I recommend doing it like balls to the wall like I did? Probably not. That came from a place of desperation. But if someone is negatively impacting your mental health at work, and I know this is much tougher if it's a boss versus a colleague, so let's do an easier example, colleague, you may not want to be so on the nose. But let's say this person is like stressing you out, not communicating in an effective way, not getting stuff done, you know, whatever the reason is, it might be something that sounds like, I feel it's really important for our working relationship for me to tell you the impact that you've been having on me at work, and also how I work. I've been trying to do ABCDEFG, it's often met with XYZ. I want us to have a good functional relationship. But I experience you as making that very difficult for me. And I know this is a hard conversation, but I want to have it. So we can try and work this out. Are you open to this feedback, because we can't continue this way. Now, again, that's very, very direct. And a lot of people they don't they don't like direct feedback, even when you use radical candor, when you're, you know, giving feedback with care. And so the alternative is saying nothing, letting that person continue to do what they're doing without consequence and then your mental health goes into a ditch. So it really needs to be addressed. I'm a big fan of making sure people know that intention and impact are not the same thing.Lesley Logan 13:20  Okay, well, I want to touch on that. And I also just to say like, while it feels it can be direct actually thought that your example was quite specific. And you guys, if you go to the show notes, you can just take that little transcript part and insert ABCD as what they are and XYZ as what they are. Because here's why. Here's why I think that it can be very helpful. If you, too often, instead of being direct, we do the opposite of like, you know, you make me like feel like this. And there's and it's been, you know, for a while, and if you're not specific about what the feeling is, and when it happened, people are less likely to take you seriously or to take it seriously. Because they're Melissa Doman 14:01  And to ask for a different solution. Some of these people are asking for solution. Lesley Logan 14:07  Yeah. So I think like, if you, if you are someone who needs this, like, take that little sentence there, (inaudible) big sentence, and just try to fill in the blanks there and then use your own words. But I do know that specificity actually makes people at least listen to the conversation whether or not they choose to react to it or play along. And then if it is a colleague versus a boss, and when you go to your boss, you can say this is what I said, which is has all the specific moments of how you felt or how you're made to feel and then the instances that happen and people your boss can also take that seriously and understand exactly when the evidence when the things happen. And I think that's really, really important.Melissa Doman 14:48  Well, also coming to the table saying, you know, these things are making me unhappy. But I want to invite a conversation to try to work this out where there could be in some cases that people have no idea that they are impacting that way, there are some people who are really dense and they're like, oh my God, I had no idea. And then there's other people who will not even consider the feedback and be like, thanks for stopping by. But it doesn't mean that, you know, just because it's a hard conversation doesn't mean it's a worthy one.Lesley Logan 15:15  Do you remember? I just have to like side note, did you hear about the women who found out that they were all dating Huberman at the same time, and they all approached him and his Melissa Doman 15:26  Dating who?Lesley Logan 15:27  Huberman the podcast, or the health podcast, or the Stanford doc like the Stanford scientist, whatever, researcher, so. Melissa Doman 15:35  What is this? Lesley Logan 15:36  Okay, go down the rabbit hole, I promise you, it's everything. So you know, he's living with one woman and going through fertility with her, treatments with her. And then there was other women. And look, it sounds like maybe no one had actually had a conversation that they were in an actual monogamous relationship. So but they and they never came forward with their names. They actually came forward as a group to him and just said, hey, we found out we're all dating you like, you know, this thing. And his response was, thank you for your feedback.Melissa Doman 16:11  That makes me so sad. I love listening to him.Lesley Logan 16:15  I know I'm so sorry. Melissa Doman 16:18  Oh, no. Lesley Logan 16:18  I know. I'm so sorry. Melissa Doman 16:20  When did this happen? Lesley Logan 16:21  Early. So you guys, this is May. So I think like I want to say February, March, it came out. Oh my god, but he hasn't responded at all. He's like doing the non-response. He's doing the no response. So in your example, like he just saw, he's like, no, no, like, just gonna keep going with life as a (inaudible). It's really, it's actually a very interesting, like, observation of people.Melissa Doman 16:46  That makes me feel so achy. I'm so sad to hear that. Lesley Logan 16:49  So sorry. I'm so sorry. Because he has really good information. Yeah, but. Melissa Doman 16:53  It's the truth. Lesley Logan 16:54  And then we have to just decide, like, you know, are we listening for the information? Or do we care about the person but, anyways, (inaudible) I wanted, Brad's gonna be rolling his eyes once he hears this. Melissa Doman 17:04  I can't wait to look this up. Lesley Logan 17:05  I know. It's a worthy read. So, you mentioned intention and impact are different things. Can we expand on (inaudible)? Melissa Doman 17:14  Yes. I mean, what, gosh, what's that old crappy adage is like the road to hell is paved with good intentions, stuff like that. I say that is, you know, as an atheist who doesn't believe in that stuff. But so, the thing is that intention versus impact is really different. And if I want to, you know, keep it light for a minute, you know, for anybody who's in a committed relationship of any type, I call those the Greatest Hits fights. It wasn't what you said, it's how you said it. And then this is how it landed, you know, whatever. So the, and yes, people take things the wrong way. And people have triggers. And people have sensitivity. So it is a two-way street. So if someone is impacting your mental health, it's also helpful to think about, wait a minute, how much of this is my stuff? And how much of this is them? Because when people activate things in us, it's not usually 100% them, some of it, it's our stuff to a degree. And so before having that conversation, I think you got to talk to yourself and be like, what is it I didn't like about this? Why don't, why don't I like it? Is it really them? Do I have some stuff I need to look at, you know, what, what's the most effective way to approach this? Because oftentimes, people will go to somebody who is like stressing them out or whatever. And though, you're stressing me out, like, from ABC, like, you have to stop. And then, but that's it, there's no, here's why I'm bringing this up. Here's what I would like, instead. You know, it's, it needs to be more, you know, how do we change this trajectory as opposed to let me give you a laundry list of, you know, a laundry list of reasons why you pissed me off, and you make me like mentally sick. So that's not really a helpful way to encourage dialogue.Lesley Logan 19:08  Yeah, 'cause also, then you're asking the person who is pissing you off or stressing you out to then come up with another way on their own to like, they would just be guessing. So like, it's which means they probably will do nothing, because like, you just get stuck. Like there's two, yeah, if you tell me Melissa Doman 19:26  Or it's awkward. Yeah. If you're going to talk about your mental health, and this will go on to the other. The other question that you had, if you're going to talk about your mental health, whether it's someone who is disrupting it, or you're just struggling in general, no offense to folks who believe in clairvoyance, mind readers, mediums, people generally can't read your mind. So if you're going to be talking about your mental health, you have to tell people what's going on for you, what you want them to do with that information because if that's a very complex conversation, don't want to overcomplicate it if you don't have to. And so, most of the onus, when it comes to mental health conversations, especially at work, is on the listener, it's on the supporter. But I think if you're gonna go into that conversation, the sharer has some responsibility to do a little bit of backend prep first about the outcome that they're going for. Lesley Logan 20:19  Yeah, I think that's, I think that's very fair and very wise. And also it allows, I think the one of the reasons I love doing the show and be until you see it is like acting as if you're the person you want to be. It requires us to be reflective of things and not just go and do the same thing over and over again, expecting it to be a different result. Like you have to act differently. And you have to do things differently. And what you're asking is, like, if something's bothering you, be reflective, like, why is that bother me? What is this bringing up? How does it make you feel? And what do I want instead? And you know, and so, because then if you can figure out what you want instead, people actually do want, like, they do want you to feel good, because if you feel good at work, then everyone's going to feel better than if you areMelissa Doman 21:11  I wish that was true for every person. Lesley Logan 21:14  There's just some some assholes. Yes, that's true. Do you want to hear something? Melissa Doman 21:18  And listen, I agree with you, generally speaking, people have some shred of empathy. I will never forget that someone said to me that their boss told them and I quote, unless someone is dying, I don't want to hear about your mental health. Verbatim. Lesley Logan 21:37  So strange. Like the mental, it's so strange to me that people don't, you know, I also, here's the thing, like as a small business owner who tries very, very hard to be open to my teams need a Mental Health Day, sometimes you're like, so you want, you need a mental health day today? There's like, God, we got to work on a project. So I get it. And like part of me is like, okay, how do we make sure we have a, we pick deadlines, and we start them early enough that if anyone needs a mental health day, like it doesn't fuck the deadline, you know? So it's like, it's like the onus on me as a person who wants to be thoughtful of what if someone gets sick? What if this changes, you know, like, I've got a person on my team I know who wants to have a kid. So we're talking about things the next year, I'm like, that person might be pregnant. So like, if she's pregnant, how are we going to do that thing, just in case like, I want to, like think through and that requires sometimes a bigger team or longer timelines. So I do get as a business owner, how that can be frustrating. I do not get like not wanting to think about it all. Like, I feel like that is like you're just not gonna have a team who cares. They're gonna be thereMelissa Doman 22:42  Oh girl. You don't want to hear some of the stories I've heard, the level of dispassionate-ness I'm sure I'm not saying, dispassion, maybe that's the right way to say it, the level of dispassion is shocking. Not to me, but in general, they absolutely exist. I just spoke to someone not long ago, who, when I said, oh you're, you know, you're a leader and you're in such an amazing position of visibility and influence to influence these conversations. And again, it can't just be leaders it has to be people from any tenure position, because we're all chronologically aged. It felt, the first thing they said, and they have over 100 people reporting to them. When I say oh, well, you're in such a great position. How cool is that? And they said, Well, you just have to be really careful and dot your, and dot your i's and cross your t's, because, immediately went to the liability lens. And I was like, yes, of course, that's a concern. Yes, these things can go south, but you, you're just not ready. You don't want to if that's the first place that your mind goes, or maybe you messed that up in the past and then went poorly. So now you're off of that sauce forever. And it's you just, you, unfortunately, can't assume and it makes me sad. Lesley Logan 24:08  Yeah, it makes me sad because I like wish that their first thing was like, hey, I want it to be that, but here's what I'm worried about. Or here's what happened. Like, how do I like, like, I, you know, because like, it's not like it's been smooth sailing for like, everyone's gonna make mistakes, especially when it comes to like, especially when it actually does come to talk about mental health because at the same time as the person listening, you have your own I have my own mental health stuff, but you know, so then you're like, okay, now I'm going to take on your thing. Okay. Noted. Got it. Okay. Got it. Got to figure this out. But I think that's why I like your suggestion on how to talk about it. Because if someone came to me with like, here's what's bothering me, here's how I'm going. Here's what I want to happen. Even if I'm having not so great a mental health day I can go okay, cool. Let me take that. Let me think about it. Let me think of what I can do. You know, it doesn't feel like I'm being vomited up onto and then I've got to figure your shit out, plus my shit out.Melissa Doman 25:08  I have lost track, even after leaving clinical 10 years ago, when the number of people who go and my first question is, what would you like me to do with this information? Or, you know, how can I best help you? And they they start glitching? Because they didn't think of it. All they did was I just need to get this out. And I go well, great. But now what? So, it's, you know, I'm all about, I'm all about that good old fashioned vent. But, you know, even if you're gonna do that, tell someone I need to vent and then you know how to take the information? Lesley Logan 25:49  Yeah, I think there's just, it's almost like awareness. We all need a little self-awareness around or laws (inaudible) intelligence on like, what is it that you need? And so I mean, like, with my, my husband always wants to fix things, right? When I tell him what's going on. He was like, I want to like, he'll often say, like, what do you want with this information? I'm like, okay, you're right. So now I just say, I don't want you to fix this. I just need to be fucking pissed off about this right now. And it'll be really great if he just like got pissed off with me.Melissa Doman 26:19  Like, I had the same conversation Lesley Logan 26:21  Be mad at them with me. You know, because if, but I had to learn that because if you if you don't say those things, then they try to fix like, I want you to fix it like, and then they're just confused. Melissa Doman 26:33  They don't know. Lesley Logan 26:33  They don't know. And that's not just husbands. That's like, everyone in your life, people. So like preface what it is, it's event. I need, I have, I would like to talk about solutions. You know, I'm trying to figure out what I want. Like, you know, there's just different things. Yeah. We could talk forever. And but I, you actually brought up Radical Candor. And I think that's a great time for us to chat about, like, you met the author of Radical Candor.Melissa Doman 26:58  I did. i did. I have no chill. She was so cool about it. I can't remember if I told you this story. Lesley Logan 27:04  You can just tell me again, because I want you to, I want you to share it. Because when you so we're going to talk a little bit about your like, like big, big girl business badass pants, like at South by Southwest and like what happened but like this story makes me smile. So it's a very be it it till you see it moment, guys. Here it is. Melissa Doman 27:23  So I call Kim Scott, the queen of feedback. And I just love her Radical Candor model. That was you know, her first, her first book, The second book that just came out it's called Radical Respect. I'm like 60 pages in and I kept like, my neck was hurting I was nodding so much as I was reading it.Lesley Logan 27:46  Oh I'm behind on the times I need to get this book. Melissa Doman 27:49  It just came, you know it just came out like a week ago, like a week ago, I got an advance reader copy at South by Southwest.Lesley Logan 27:55  Oh, check you out. Melissa Doman 27:57  Well, she had a book signing, it wasn't just me. I would love to say that. But so speaking of South by Southwest, in March, and I had my keynotes and I was going to do my book signing later that day. And I saw that Kim Scott was there and I was like, oh my God. And so I unfortunately had to miss her session, but the session on book signing like an hour before mine. And so I got in line, and I was the first person in line. And I had her book in my hands. And I went up to the table. And just like in Wayne's World, I had no chill, and started moving my arms up and down and going, I'm not worthy. I'm not worthy. And I just was ridiculous. And she was so cool about it. And she's so sweet. And she signed my book. And we took a picture together, me and her and her book. And I had like the biggest shit-eating grin on my face. And I told her about what I do for work. And she's and I was doing my sign in an hour. And I said, you know, it would be the honor of my career if I could give you a copy of my book. You can totally say no, but I would kick myself if I didn't ask. And she said, yes, I would love a copy. Will you sign it? And I was like, oh, yes, Kim Scott, I will give you a copy of my book and sign it. And I was telling her how I use Radical Candor, a ton in my work on mental health at work. And she said, oh, you should come on my podcast. And I was like, for real? She's like, yeah, go talk to my manager. He's over there. So I'm currently scheduled to be on her podcast later this year. And I'm just shitting a brick with like, fear and excitement and sparkles like all at the same time because she, yeah, she's like, yeah.Lesley Logan 29:56  I don't even remember when I read Radical Candor, but I read it many years ago because I feel like it's not, it's been out for a while. But you know, there's those years of the pandemic that just all blur together. And I bought it because I had an assistant, and my husband, and one other person on the team, I'm like, I think I need to learn how to do this, I need to learn to talk to my team because I don't know. And I just really, I love her examples in that book. So I just, I'm so excited for you. It's so this is the coolest thing. I love it. Because like, first of all, I love that you actually, like, let yourself do that, because I think that is actually really cool. And probably why you got to even talk to her as long as you did. Do you know what I mean? Like, if you had just (inaudible). Like, I love your book, you know? Like, if you would just be like, and I have a book, it wouldn't have been as genuine like you're so genuine.Melissa Doman 30:53  Thanks, girl. Yeah, I actually have to give credit where credit is due my intern, who I will, she did such an amazing job, I'm going to be hiring her in a freelance capacity to do some other stuff. For me. She's amazing. She flew in all the way from Germany to support me at South by Southwest. And she ended up being like, my assistant handler, like, what do you need, like, whenever I was talking to people, like she had a copy of my book in her purse, I didn't tell her to do that. And she, when I was talking to this, like former NFL player, and I mentioned the book, she just popped out for my three o'clock, I was like, here's a copy. And I was like, oh, my God, she's the one. Lesley Logan 31:36  New SOPs for all new speaking gigs, by the way, new standard procedures.Melissa Doman 31:42  She's the one to encourage me to offer a copy of my book to Kim. And I was like, no, I'm sure tons of people are gonna do that. Like, I don't want to be rude. I don't want to seem opportunistic. And she said, you're not because just be yourself. Just be yourself and offer it to her how you would do it to anybody else. And I was like, okay, so it was because of my intern who encouraged me to do it that I did it.Lesley Logan 32:09  I love that you had someone there to help you. I think we all. So just to talk about this. You were at South by Southwest, you spoke there you presented. And you, yes, she came out to support you. But like, we all need to actually admit that, like, it's actually okay for people to support us. And it's so good to have someone there. Whether it is an intern, or someone that you can say, hey, I just need you to be here because like there's a lot that goes on at events when you and if you are not the if you're not, if you're not just an attendee if you're also speaking at them, or you're also presenting or something like, it can be very difficult to keep it all you can kind of get like I'm in my head until my presentation, I got to do these things. And we kind of get you can get a little linear. Having someone who can be outside looking in and like spotting things and reminding you of things. It's so important to have those people. When my husband comes with me to events, we actually it is, they are always the best events because if I go out, when I go to Poland to speak by myself, I come back I'm like, so there was like three people I was supposed to talk to about. I don't know that I actually did it. Did I do that? Like it's a whirlwind? And so it's easy to forget things. And so to have someone there, it's so key. Melissa Doman 33:20  Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. Having her change the entire experience for me. And every day, multiple times a day she goes, how can I support you? What do you need? How can I be helpful? There was even a moment because I was kicking myself for doing this, talk about a mental health panic. I was flying from Austin to Vegas, because then I spoke at a HR conference called transform, which is where you and I got to hang out. And so, not at the conference, but in Vegas. Lesley Logan 33:53  Yeah, you guys. The listeners did not think I was at a HR conference. They. Melissa Doman 33:58  No. So basically, I was like looking at my flight from Austin to Vegas. And I don't remember what happened. Because I think I got like it was heavily delayed or something like that. And I said, let me see if I can find a different flight In my stupidity I booked a flight for the next day, the wrong day. And then I tried to reverse it. And my seat was gone in under a minute. And I was panicking. And so she just come to my room from her hotel, and I was like, oh my god, I'm freaking out. And she goes, what can I do to help? We're gonna get this worked out. Just tell me and I was like, I'm so happy you're here. So she helped me and she like was doing other research. It all worked out fine. But you know, being a being a business of one. And now I'm at a business of like, five or six, and just remembering that, like I even opened up to so I mean, I realize, we, you and I've talked about this before, I feel I have the best assistant on the fucking planet. And I opened up to her the other day about some personal struggles I'm having and some other stuff that's going on. And she was so sweet. And she listened to me. And she, you know, we had a wonderful conversation. And she texted me actually later that night, and said, I'm really happy, we had a productive call, but I'm even more appreciative that you told me about the stuff that's going on. And like, my heart goes out to you, and I hope you're okay. And I was like, Oh, my God I love this person. It's good to ask for help. It doesn't matter. Like, how much of a badass, you know, you try to be, you know, everybody needs support. And I'm a huge, huge believer that it's a wonderful opportunity for people to support their boss, you know, managers support their team members. But I feel that's a two-way street. I really do. Lesley Logan 36:20  Yeah, well, I think like, especially when it comes to, you guys, for assistance. If you have one, like I told my executive assistant, I'm like, your job is going to have some things in my personal life and some things that are business life. And so you're going to know more about me, than the project manager does or anyone else in the team, aside from my husband, because there's just going to be things that I'm going to need help on so that I can do my job the best. And that was so hard for me to learn. My first assistant had been an assistant for a long, long time, so she trained me on what an assistant can do.Melissa Doman 36:58  Oh, mine is training me. She's training me, 100%. Lesley Logan 37:00  Totally, totally training me, like totally trained me. And she was so, so good at it. I was like, I was like, Can you do this? Can you do this? And she's like, it's my job. So you don't have to ask me if I can just, you actually can say, hey, here are the things I'd like you to do. And here's what I'd like them to be done by.Melissa Doman 37:17  Same conversation as mine. Oh my God. I literally sometimes have on my calendar. I'm not joking. I'll have like blocks with this do tasks for, her name is Alana, and I go do tasks for Alana and I told her I was like, I put my homework on my calendar to do my stuff for you. And she's like, you're ridiculous.Lesley Logan 37:38  I want to I want to say like, since you went from a business of one, and then now it's grown. And you obviously like your whole thing is like taught about mental health at work. How has that? What's the be it till you see it even doing to help yourself, like be the leader that you truly believe other people can be like, because I mean, like, you know what it is that you want to be like, was it easy to step into those shoes? Or did you find yourself taking your own homework?Melissa Doman 38:06  Oh, my God, being, being, okay, so hard. And I think that the best thing that I've been able to do, as I've been adding different folks to the team, now keep in mind, these folks are not full-time as a team of contractors, but they are my team. And I feel that what helped me transition best into that is admitting how novice I was. And basically saying, like, listen, I need to learn how to do this right. And so I'm gonna do the best that I think, but if there's anything I could do differently, I could do better, because I know they're coming from a good place. And so I always say like, please tell me, like, tell me what will help our relationship, what will help you succeed, etc. And so, for me, it was admitting how novice I truly was. And in some ways still am and how open to feedback that I want to be because I gosh, I had some terrible, terrible, terrible managers in my career. And that would be like a nightmare if I did something like that. And so yeah, that's it, admitting that I don't know how to do it all but that I'm trying to learn how to do it, you know, a little bit better a little bit more each day.Lesley Logan 39:41  I love that. That is awesome. I'm excited for you. You're gonna get, you're gonna get to do so many more things. Just so you know, because like, it's not easy to do it all yourself. There's like a lot of stuff that and by the way, like, there's a lot of times it's actually exhausting to do when you don't need to be the one that does it.Melissa Doman 39:59  Oh my god. I remember when I first started out with my assistant, that it was really because my business is my baby. And I work so hard, and I'm very detail-oriented. And it was really hard to find someone to trust. And they understood that, you know, they were like, okay, let's start with these low hanging fruit. We'll see how that goes, let's ease into it. And she really understood. And initially, because she, oh my god, she is like, amazing at the things I'm terrible at. So like process implementation, data management, you know, all these like, this, this core one-on-one set of things. I'm like, I don't want to do that. So she initially was so patient with me, because I fought it kicking and screaming, because I did everything like very manual. And now, I'm like, oh, my God, what, what can you take from me? And how do we do that? Because it's so nice to not have to worry and just have that complete trust in someone that she genuinely gives a shit. And that is so hard to find. Lesley Logan 41:01  Yeah. And also, when you know, when you start to, like, let go of the things that actually take up more brain space, because it's not natural for you, then you actually can spend more time doing the things that do come natural and do like (inaudible) why you like doing it, which means more energy and excitement and more ideas. And you can go, you know, you can go further because you've got people to help you.Melissa Doman 41:24  Exactly. So I'm in that scaling mode now. And it's, I'm not gonna lie, scary. It's tough. But I also know I need to, and my husband, probably maybe a year ago, or something a little bit less. He had a come to Jesus conversation with me and was like, you cannot continue doing everything yourself. You have to start finding people that can take stuff off your plate, and that you can trust. And this is not negotiable. And I was like, oh, fine. And it was the best lecture. I didn't want and, and needed, so.Lesley Logan 42:04  I'm glad he did that. Because it meant you had this event at South by Southwest because if you're like, you know what I mean, you wouldn't have had that it wouldn't have happened. Melissa Doman 42:14  The best part is when I have calls with my assistant, and my husband walks in and he goes, what are you talking about? And then Alana goes, we're talking about blah, blah. And so my husband's name is Matt, and she goes we're talking about blah, blah, and he goes oh fucking finally. He goes, I'm happy she's listening to you. (inaudible) You're ganging up against me (inaudible) there's two of them. Lesley Logan 42:40  Matt's gonna start sending her a Slack message just like hey, by the way, there's these other three things since she brought those up we gotta put these on the timeline.Melissa Doman 42:48  When they hear this episode, don't give them ideas. Don't give them ideas. Lesley Logan 42:52  I will say. So I wanted to, I wanted a Vespa in L.A. because like I wanted a little Vespa and you can just get a Vespa right? You don't have to like, you don't have to get a motorcycle license because they ride like a bike. But my husband's like, no, if you're gonna get a Vespa in L.A. you got to get a motorcycle license. And I was like, okay, I'll go. So my assistant, flexing the motorcycle license, school thing, whatever it is. And I did everything perfect, perfect written test every day of the practice was really great until the test, which of course, test anxiety, of course, this happens to me. All the people crash the whole time, they're crashing all the time, we get to the test, they don't crash at all. And instead, when we get to the breaking thing, I broke too soon. So they wanted me to do it again. And so when I did it again, my tire, I broke a little too hard on the on the back tire and it hit a little wet spot on paint on the parking lot. And of course, motorcycle crashes. I'm on the ground, and I failed the test. Right? So my sister was like, I'm so sorry, like, that happened, (inaudible) want to reschedule and I said, oh, we're not, we're not rescheduling. (inaudible) I'm gonna get an E-bike. He can't make me take a test for that. So like, there would be this movement like, hey, when is this getting rescheduled? And Lindsay's like, oh, I'm looking into seeing when Lesley's schedule can handled it. I'm like we're not doing we're still not doing it. So they can gang up on you. But you can, you can work it out. Melissa Doman 44:18  But it comes from a place of love and care. You know? There's different things that when we're doing it, and she'll even say to me, she's like, I know this is difficult for you. You need to remember what we're going for. And she's so patient with me. And she teaches me stuff like all the time and I really see her like as an advisor, in addition to being you know, my online business manager, my assistant like she is, she's like a trusted advisor for me. Lesley Logan 44:52  It sounds like especially as like, which, whatever she's doing evolves, sounds like she'd be a really great integrator and like could be the person who is your right hand who can then run people on the team so you don't have to, you know, that's like I'm sorry, I'm helping you grow.Melissa Doman 45:07  We might have had that conversation literally a few days ago. Lesley Logan 45:10  That's huge. Melissa Doman 45:12  Yeah. And so I think that, you know, she just like lives and breathes ops and like she justLesley Logan 45:19  Thank God for those people, if you breathe ops, you guys can work for anybody who's got big dreams, I promise you. Melissa Doman 45:26  She's amazing. And she's smart as a whip. And she's funny. And I just deep, I deeply care about her on a personal level. And you know, she, I feel deeply appreciative that she puts up with me. Lesley Logan 45:39  But I also just like a testament to the work that you do and the work that you've put out there, because it does attract people who want to work with that, and who want to be part of the vision, like the impact that you're making is really huge. And you can't you make a big impact by yourself. You have to have people that are that see your vision, but because of who you are, and how you've been putting yourself out there and the way that you have been, unapologetically, and really voicing why we have to talk about mental health, there are people who want to be part of that impact. And so you have to like celebrate yourself a little bit.Melissa Doman 46:15  Thank you. I appreciate that. Lesley Logan 46:16  You're welcome. So we're gonna take a brief break, and then we're gonna get those Be It Action Items and also the Chewbacca impersonation. All right, Mel, where can people find you, follow you, work with you, get your book?Melissa Doman 46:31  So my website is melissadoman.com. I'm also on LinkedIn, melissadoman on LinkedIn. On Instagram my handle is @thewanderingMel one word. And my book is available across all major online retailers. Amazon's the best place to get it but if you don't want to feed the Bezos machine, it's also available, you know, Target and Barnes and Nobles and all that. And, you know, if you feel like you need me to come in and crack some heads, no pun intended, to enable mental health at work conversations in your business, please reach out, I would love to help.Lesley Logan 47:11  Thank you. Okay, you've given us a lot, you gave us like some great tips on how to talk about things, but bold, executable, intrinsic target steps people can take to be it till they see it. What do you have for us? Melissa Doman 47:22  When it comes to mental health at work, awareness is great, action is better. And I think that when it comes to changing what conversations look like, it's one thing to have the intention to do it. And it's another thing to create the impact. So decide how you're going to speak differently about your mental health at work, or how you want to support others and in a different way. Because, you know, you may not be able to make a big dent, but any dent is helpful. Lesley Logan 47:50  Yeah, yeah. I like that. I like that. I think, I mean, we talked about at the beginning of the episode, in case you guys fast forward through the intro, because you've heard it so many times. I do say, action brings clarity. So like, you know, it really does. And so I think like, yes, talk about it, and then like, take the action and you'll understand more and more, you'll have more clarity around what to do next about the impact want to make.Melissa Doman 48:16  There's a reason that my tagline on my website that I trademarked is "Awareness is great, action is better." And I have to give credit again, where credit is due. My husband works in product marketing, and technology evangelism, and he's helped me so much with helping to shape my message and I always tell people, I have a crush on my CMO. I pay him, I pay him with respect and my company. He's amazing. He's so amazing at what he does, he does product marketing and technology evangelism for a salesforce partner company and I'm very deeply proud of him. Lesley Logan 48:57  That's amazing. That's so cool. You guys are a dynamic duo. Melissa Doman 49:01  We're trying to be, trying to be.Lesley Logan 49:04  Okay, can you do the Chewbacca voice for us? Melissa Doman 49:07  Oh god. Lesley Logan 49:08  Because I know, I know I have Star Wars fans especially my husband's going to listen to this. But also Hi Katie and Rachel andMelissa Doman 49:17  Okay. Ready?Lesley Logan 49:31  That's amazing. (inaudible) they'll love it and it was beautiful.Melissa Doman 49:37  Oh my god. I literally do that like as a reward to a workshop participants like if there's, if they're really engaged and not distracted by tech and they're like really present really, really doing the workshops with me. I dangle that as the carrot at the beginning and I go if you're good, if you participate, I will reward you all with this at the end. I would hold it. I would hold it if they don't.Lesley Logan 50:11  Yeah, I, well, thank you for sharing with us. And also because, hello Be It babe, you are a good listener, you made it all the way to the end. So thank you so much. Mel, you are the best, I just adore you. I'm so glad we got to finally meet in person, I got to have you back on the pod talk about what you've been up to. Because it is it I think is really important for people to see someone can have, like, publish a book and like make magic happen in their business and actually get those big, huge gets. And then also they keep going. And there's new, new moments of not just imposter syndrome, like going outside of your comfort zone and doing big things that scare you and then getting other big opportunities. So I cannot wait for your episode to come out with Kim Scott, because I'll be listening to it.Melissa Doman 50:54  Thank you so much. I'm so happy we get to meet in person, to come back on the pod and yeah, just really deeply appreciate it.Lesley Logan 51:03  Yeah. Well, y'all, how are you going to use these tips in your life? Are you going to read her book? Are you going to help talk about mental health at work? Because you should. And please share this with a friend. If you have a friend who's like even a leader or a person at a company who needs this, you know, this is how we get the word out there. And the more people who talk about this stuff, the more companies actually have to talk about these things because there's power in the workforce, really being empowered and knowing what they want to talk about and how they want to be treated. So please share this. We can spread Mel's amazing word. And until next time, Be It Till You See It. That's all I got for this episode of the Be It Till You See It Podcast. One thing that would help both myself and future listeners is for you to rate the show and leave a review and follow or subscribe for free wherever you listen to your podcast. Also, make sure to introduce yourself over at the Be It Pod on Instagram. I would love to know more about you. Share this episode with whoever you think needs to hear it. Help us and others Be It Till You See It. Have an awesome day. Be It Till You See It is a production of The Bloom Podcast Network. If you want to leave us a message or a question that we might read on another episode, you can text us at +1-310-905-5534 or send a DM on Instagram @BeItPod. Brad Crowell 52:17  It's written, filmed, and recorded by your host, Lesley Logan, and me, Brad Crowell. Lesley Logan 52:22  It is transcribed, produced and edited by the epic team at Disenyo.co. Brad Crowell 52:27  Our theme music is by Ali at Apex Production Music and our branding by designer and artist, Gianfranco Cioffi. Lesley Logan 52:34  Special thanks to Melissa Solomon for creating our visuals. Brad Crowell 52:37  Also to Angelina Herico for adding all of our content to our website. And finally to Meridith Root for keeping us all on point and on time. Transcribed by https://otter.aiSupport this podcast at — https://redcircle.com/be-it-till-you-see-it/donationsAdvertising Inquiries: https://redcircle.com/brandsPrivacy & Opt-Out: https://redcircle.com/privacy

In this enriching episode of *Negotiate Anything*, host Kwame Christian welcomes organizational psychologist Melissa Doman to discuss the crucial topic of mental health in the workplace. Melissa underscores the importance of supporting team members who are struggling, and explores the shared responsibility in successful conversations about mental health. The episode delves into strategies for setting boundaries, effective communication, and the pivotal role leaders play in fostering a supportive environment. Navigating mental health as a skill, Melissa shares her insights on realistic conversations, avoiding toxic positivity, and addressing conflicts constructively. What will be covered: - The importance of supporting team members with mental health struggles and ensuring their job performance remains unaffected. - Challenges of setting boundaries while assuming a support role at work and communicating the need for change. - The value of realistic and constructive conversations about mental health, avoiding the pitfalls of toxic positivity. Connect with Melissa https://www.melissadoman.com/ Follow Melissa on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/melissadoman1/ IG: @thewanderingmel Buy the Book: YES, YOU CAN TALK ABOUT MENTAL HEALTH AT WORK : https://www.melissadoman.com/book What's in it for you? Exclusive Advice: Gain insights from top negotiation experts. Community Support: Connect with a like-minded community focused on growth. Personal & Professional Growth: Unlock strategies to enhance every aspect of your life. You deserve to negotiate more of the best things in life, and now you can! Don't wait—be the first in line to experience this game-changing resource.

In this enriching episode of *Negotiate Anything*, host Kwame Christian welcomes organizational psychologist Melissa Doman to discuss the crucial topic of mental health in the workplace. Melissa underscores the importance of supporting team members who are struggling, and explores the shared responsibility in successful conversations about mental health. The episode delves into strategies for setting boundaries, effective communication, and the pivotal role leaders play in fostering a supportive environment. Navigating mental health as a skill, Melissa shares her insights on realistic conversations, avoiding toxic positivity, and addressing conflicts constructively. What will be covered: - The importance of supporting team members with mental health struggles and ensuring their job performance remains unaffected. - Challenges of setting boundaries while assuming a support role at work and communicating the need for change. - The value of realistic and constructive conversations about mental health, avoiding the pitfalls of toxic positivity. Connect with Melissa https://www.melissadoman.com/ Follow Melissa on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/melissadoman1/ IG: @thewanderingmel Buy the Book: YES, YOU CAN TALK ABOUT MENTAL HEALTH AT WORK : https://www.melissadoman.com/book What's in it for you? Exclusive Advice: Gain insights from top negotiation experts. Community Support: Connect with a like-minded community focused on growth. Personal & Professional Growth: Unlock strategies to enhance every aspect of your life. You deserve to negotiate more of the best things in life, and now you can! Don't wait—be the first in line to experience this game-changing resource.

Melissa Doman is a sleep coach exclusively for children with special needs. She is back on Mother's Guide to dive deeper into the strategies and how-to's of sleep for your kids!In this episode, she shares:- the important prep work to set you and your kids up for success- the one-change-at-a-time approach to ensure long-term success- troubleshoots for when things don't go as planned- and more!Enjoy!Melissa Doman Sleep Consultinghttps://www.melissadomansleepconsulting.com/Purchase my book A Mother's Guide Through Autism:https://amothersguidethroughautismbook.com/bookSign up to get news and updates from me: https://www.mothersguidethroughautism.comTheme song: "Look at the clouds" by Tristan Lohengrintristanlohengrin.bandcamp.com

Melissa Doman is a sleep coach exclusively for children with special needs. She has helped hundreds of families by providing lasting solutions for their child's sleep struggles. In this episode, she shares:- the most common sleep struggles families with autistic kids face and what to do about it- practical steps families can take for sleep struggles- and more!Enjoy!Melissa Doman Sleep Consultinghttps://www.melissadomansleepconsulting.com/Purchase my book A Mother's Guide Through Autism:https://amothersguidethroughautismbook.com/bookSign up to get news and updates from me: https://www.mothersguidethroughautism.comTheme song: Look at the Clouds by Tristan Lohengrinhttps://soundcloud.com/tristanlohengrin/look-at-the-clouds

Tired of endless nights struggling to get your little one to sleep and waking up feeling like a zombie? We get it. But imagine a world where both you and your child wake up refreshed, ready to tackle the day. That's the dream, right? On this episode of "The Dad Central Show," we're talking about sleep – not just for the kids, but for the parents, too. Hosted by Drew Soleyn and Ed Gough Jr., The Dad Central Show is all about arming dads with the tools and knowledge they need to raise confident and successful kids. In this episode, guest Melissa Doman, a sleep consultant, shares the secrets to better sleep for both parents and their little ones. **Top Three Takeaways:** 1. **Sleep: The Brain's Spring Cleaning:** Find out how sleep does more than just rejuvenate the body. Melissa explains the brain's need for sleep to transfer and store information, and the important role of cerebral spinal fluid in spring cleaning the brain. 2. **The Power of Nutrition:** A balanced diet isn't just for physical health – it's crucial for quality sleep. Understand how nutrition impacts brain function and sleep, and the significance of addressing picky eating habits in children. 3. **Creating the Ideal Sleep Environment:** Uncover expert tips for crafting the perfect sleep sanctuary for your child. From managing light and temperature to understanding the impact of sensory activities on sleep, you'll discover how small changes can make a big difference. This episode gives lots of practical advice for parents looking to revolutionize their family's sleep habits. From understanding the science behind sleep to making tangible changes in your child's environment, you'll gain valuable insights for creating a peaceful nighttime routine. So, loosen your tie, grab a warm cup of coffee (or tea, we don't judge), and press play. Settle in for some real talk about sleep, nutrition, and setting the stage for a good night's rest for the whole family. On closing, we want to express our immense gratitude to our dedicated listeners. Your support means the world to us. We're here to serve you, so if you found this episode helpful, consider leaving us a review, liking, and sharing it with other parents in your tribe. Together, we can make a world of difference in our children's lives. As we sign off, we're leaving you with this nugget of wisdom from the episode: "The key to a good night's sleep lies in understanding the unique needs of your child. So, take the knowledge you've gained and tailor it to create a restful haven that works for your family. You've got this!" About Melissa Doman Melissa Doman is a pediatric sleep consultant, specializing in sleep training for children with special needs. She has a decade of experience teaching parents of children with a variety of diagnoses, and uses this knowledge to enhance her sleep training programs. She is passionate about empowering parents with knowledge to help their children reach their full potential. Melissa has worked with children diagnosed with Cerebral palsy, Trisomy 21, Autism, ADD/ADHD, developmental delays, and more. She loves coaching parents to get their kids sleeping well and independently. About The Dad Central Show Dads love to see their kids grow into confident and successful adults. The problem is most dads feel unsure how to get there and have nowhere to turn for help. The Dad Central Show coaches you to be your best, while bringing out the best in your family. Links for Dad Central: Website: https://dadcentral.ca The Dad Central Show: https://dadcentral.ca/podcast/ Facebook: https://facebook.com/dadcentral Youtube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCs2HyxB9nOLxyHvBMSo4TQQ Contact us at podcast@dadcentral.ca The Dad Central Show is sponsored by Dove Men+Care. Dove Men+Care believes care is the best of a man, because when men care for themselves and others, there is a positive impact. Two more great ways Dad Central helps: FREE FATHERHOOD FUNDAMENTALS EMAIL COURSE: Learn how to lead your family effectively, master time management to balance your responsibilities, and maintain a positive outlook. Enroll now: https://dadcentral.ca/fatherhood-fundamentals/ DADMENTOR MEMBERSHIP: DadMentor is the ultimate solution tailored to address the challenges dads commonly face. Join now and get a step-by-step plan, proven tools, and a community of like-minded dads who want to be a great dads: https://dadcentral.ca/dads/  7 STEP GUIDE TO STOP YELLING: Our guide is based on extensive research and experience working with parents just like you. We'll guide you through each step, offering practical tips, strategies, and exercises to help you understand your triggers, improve your communication skills, and foster a more harmonious relationship with your children, ultimately becoming a more confident and effective dad: https://dadcentral.ca/7-step-guide-to-stop-yelling/   

While distributors are proud of the culture they've crafted, far less discussed in that topic is mental health. This episode joins The Granite Group's Tracie Sponenberg and mental-health-at-work specialist Melissa Doman as they explore why mental health is a critical business conversation, how this industry can address growing mental health expectations and the benefits that can result.

Welcome to the Emotion at Work podcast. In today's conversation, Phil is joined by Melissa Doman, an expert in organisational psychology, a former clinician specialising in mental health, and a dedicated professional focusing on workplace mental well-being. Melissa is also the author of the book, "Yes, You Can Talk About Mental Health at Work: Here's why … and How to Do it Really Well”.   During the conversation, Melissa offers a practitioner's viewpoint on the unspoken rules and expectations surrounding emotions, emotion regulation and expression, and shares how the art of Salsa dancing serves as a meditative practice for her.   Links: Arik Cheshin Transcription-Episode-45-Emotion-at-Work-in-Emotion-Expression.pdf (emotionatwork.co.uk) Melissa Doman's book Yes, You Can Talk About Mental Health at Work, Here's Why ... and How to Do it Really Well: Amazon.co.uk: Doman MA, Melissa: 9781789563030: Books Paul Ekman Paul Ekman Books | Emotions Revealed Melissa's website Melissa Doman, M.A. | Mental Health at Work | Awareness is Great - Action is Better.™ Melissa's LinkedIn Melissa Doman, M.A. | LinkedIn Melissa Doman Instagram @thewanderingmel

Gain actionable insights into her groundbreaking approaches, empowering employees, and reshaping corporate culture. Join Lesley with guest Ryan-Mae on this podcast episode to discover the keys to creating a forward-thinking, employee-centric organization.If you have any questions about this episode or want to get some of the resources we mentioned, head over to LesleyLogan.co/podcast. If you have any comments or questions about the Be It pod shoot us a message at beit@lesleylogan.co . And as always, if you're enjoying the show please share it with someone who you think would enjoy it as well. It is your continued support that will help us continue to help others. Thank you so much! Never miss another show by subscribing at LesleyLogan.co/subscribe.In this episode you will learn about:Why more people need to speak up inside corporate walls?The human element in what HR does.Are you speaking your truth to the right people in the company?How to finding the self you need to serve in that moment.Why intent is a huge thing in the people space. Episode References/Links:Follow Ryan-Mae on LinkedInFollow Ryan-Mae on IGCheck out Blackthorn.ioMelissa Doman BookCheck out Good Call New York  If you enjoyed this episode, make sure and give us a five star rating and leave us a review on iTunes, Podcast Addict, Podchaser or Castbox.Get your 15% discount for Toe Sox – use coupon code LESLEY15Be It Till You See It Podcast SurveyBe in the know with all the workshops at OPCBe a part of Lesley's Pilates MentorshipResourcesWatch the Be It Till You See It podcast on YouTube!Lesley Logan websiteBe It Till You See It PodcastOnline Pilates Classes by Lesley LoganOnline Pilates Classes by Lesley Logan on YouTubeProfitable PilatesSocial MediaInstagramFacebookLinkedInEpisode Transcript:Ryan-Mae McAvoy: [00:00:00] We build up, like you said, we build up these stories good, bad, in between and it's, it's really a disservice to our own self to be like, but can I change the story? What? Like, how can I change the story? Some things can't change. There's loss, there's events that happen, but also you can look at that and say, okay, but what can I do now?And that's really what I'm just trying to put out there is what can you do now? And how can you change and how do you be more than just what people say you are.Lesley Logan: Welcome to the Be It Till You See It podcast where we talk about taking messy action, knowing that perfect is boring. I'm Lesley Logan, Pilates instructor and fitness business coach. I've trained thousands of people around the world and the number one thing I see stopping people from achieving anything is self-doubt. My friends, action brings clarity and it's the antidote to fear.Each week, my guest will bring bold, [00:01:00] executable, intrinsic and targeted steps that you can use to put yourself first and Be It Till You See It. It's a practice, not a perfect. Let's get started. All right, babe, how are you? Welcome to Be It Till You See It interview. I am so thrilled for this interview this week because it actually goes on like's little journey and I'm really excited for it because when I first was introduced to this person I was like, you know, that could be cool. And then I was like reading about her and I was doing a little bit of research. I'm like, you know what? Actually I think this is really cool because I too often have had people who've like, like said goodbye to the nine to five middle finger to the boss. Peace out. I'm on my own. I'm being until I see it.But we don't often interview people who are like, yeah, you can work for a place and you can actually like tell people that you would like it to be a little bit more like this, or you could be a little more like this. And also, what I'm really excited for you to hear is the humanness that can be at a corporate job. It's possible. I'm not saying it's happening at your [00:02:00] job, but it can. And maybe there's a way that you can make that happen or maybe this interview will help you seek that out. And we also talk about so many other things. This is like a nice little fun conversation that I am thrilled for you to listen to.Ryan MaE McAvoy is our guest. Melissa Doman is the person who introduced me to her. Her interview is in the show notes. It's all about like, why we need to talk about mental health at work. So, today's interview is just fun. It's a lot of fun. I learned a lot. I, I think as a person who doesn't work at a corporation, I have my own corporation.And I don't yet have like a whole HR team. But you know, we're growing into that space, as a person on that side of it, I felt like this interview gave me a lot of insight on like, what is possible, like what I can create. Because I've gotta be honest, like when I thought, oh gosh, we have to have HR team.Okay, gotta button it up, gotta find someone who's like, you know, you know, here's your paperwork. But that's not true. So it doesn't have to be that way. And [00:03:00] we all listen to this podcast whether you work for yourself, wanna work for yourself, or you work for someone else. We can't actually be the change that we wanna see in places where people get to be more human being, which is I don't think a phrase, but I'm gonna make it one. So here is Ryan Mae McAvoy. I hope you enjoy the conversation. I hope you have fun. I hope you feel like you're talking with two girlfriends and we wanna know what you said on the other side of it. And then her Be It action item is just really awesome.It's actually something I think we all need to do, no matter who you are, where you work, what you're up to, and what you wanna be it until you see it. Here's Ryan Mae McAvoy.Alright. Right. Be it babe. Here's the deal. I'm so excited because today's guest is actually a referral from another past guest. And, um, y'all remember you loved her. I'm now losing my voice because, I'm picking up on our guest today, Vegas Voice, the sexy. Yeah. So, um, We're just gonna blame it on Vegas. She was just in Vegas.I live in Vegas and sometimes that casino just takes your voice away. Anyways, today's guest is Ryan Maid McEvoy, and what I'm so excited for [00:04:00] you to hear about her is we often have entrepreneurs, people who've like left the nine to five goodbye, peace out word to your mother. I'm working for myself now, and today's guest is actually like, no, I'm in it.I'm in the space and I'm making it work, uh, for me and I really wanted to share that cuz not everyone has that opportunity or wants to. So, Ryan May, can you tell everyone who you are and what you're rocking at? Ryan-Mae McAvoy: Yeah, I am Ryan May McEvoy. Uh, my corporate self is the head of people for blackor.io. We are a SaaS company based out of New York.Uh, I say that loosely. We actually don't have an office. We're very much like work where you are. Um, I have been doing kind of HR plops in many, many fashions in a very weird, non-traditional way. I worked at an animal hospital for several years. I worked at a ski area. I moved to the Silicon Valley and kind of got that like, oh, so you're good at like being an EA and did that to like break back into the people space, um, and really just not.Having that like, oh, I just wanna [00:05:00] be like self-employed and do the van life. And it's, I think we miss a lot of, like corporate still has a lot of potential and we need people to speak up inside corporate walls to change. Not because we need to everybody to be in corporate, but there still has to be. It's always like, there's always gonna need to be the firefighters, the policemen, the garbagemen.Everybody has a spot. And so what do we do in our ourselves to make that spot as cool and as like open and wonderful as possible? Lesley Logan: Oh my God, I love this. And also so much to like things that I'm gonna highlight there. Um, especially because, um, First of all, I, my friend was in a college, like, I'm gonna go work in hr.And I'm like, what does that even mean? Like, what does that, what do you do? Like make sure people like clocked in and out on time, like signed their contracts. Like you a babysitter? Sometimes. Sometimes, yeah. But also like what sounds so cool about hr? Is that you have, you've been able to like kind of cool into different unique spaces.Like it sounds like you've been able to [00:06:00] like work in the, an animal hospital, but then now you work for this other company and you can kind of like. Put yourself in a creative space if you want to. But I wanna highlight, you said this, you're changing the way you're changing the corporate world from where you are.Like I think people are like, if I leave it and I go Van Life it, which by the way, the New York Times, the whole article on like, is Van Life really awesome? And the girl's like, this is terrible. Ryan-Mae McAvoy: I feel like, like day three, I'd be like, so this, my Instagram looks fire, but I'm gonna need like, To just go home. (Lesley: Yeah.) I'd be like, we made it to Reno guys. Time to just pack it back, pack it back to the West coast. Lesley Logan: Um, but um, but I, I love that because I think often we're like, oh, I have to leave to make things better. But actually you can, things don't change if you leave, like sometimes we, sometimes it is a better, better option to stay and like make the changes from where, where you are if it's possible.Ryan-Mae McAvoy: If it's possible. There's a couple things I really wanna capture on that. Um, I think leaving does have a powerful impact. Um, and it doesn't mean leaving has to be leaving the [00:07:00] corporate world, leaving the, the space you're in. Um, I love tech. I love startup. I think it's a very creative new age, kind of.There's cool ideas we're trying to problem solve, um, but sometimes it is leaving. I left an employer before Black Thorn, uh, that I loved. Personal relationships. I, these are people I still hold near and dear to my heart. I have a lot of love for them, and I had amazing mentors that came in. I'm like, but what about you?Like, you are not happy. This isn't filling your cup. And I think sometimes you do have to leave to like do that change. And you have to find your spot and something I, I actually highlighted this on LinkedIn a while ago. Our leadership team and our team is amazing for me. It's incredible. It is. It works for me.It is the best thing. Are there people, even in the HR worlds, I'm like, oh no, you, you would be so unhappy. We wouldn't be stoked on you. That's not a fit. And I think that's where change comes from is being able to say, why does this work for me? But if it doesn't work for you, and that's [00:08:00] okay. Um, and now finding my personal philosophy on HR is, Hrs now turning into people ops and we're touching a lot more stuff.And I always joke, there's like old school HR and I think of the lady from Monsters Inc. Where she's like, where's your paperwork? And that's still really like kind of the, the brand we have in a lot of places. And it's so much, it's so much time like trying to resell yourself. Yeah. And then be like, it's not, it's not just paperwork, it's not just compliance.It's helping people get benefits from medical care. It's talking about diversity, inclusion, and every day is a new adventure and every day is learning and finding new things. Even last week we had an employee highlight something I, I don't wanna share cuz I wanna respect their journey, but I was like, it's not even on my radar.I didn't even think about how are we not talking about this? And I. I do tend to get fired up. So now I'm like, this is my cause and I'm gonna go like talk to everybody about it so we can fix this [00:09:00] problem. But I think that's where people mistake us for like, oh, we're just checking your time card. We're just making sure you're not doing things.Lesley Logan: So, okay. This is so fascinating because like I think in every industry, no matter who's listening and where are they work, like there's the old guard of whatever that job was and then, and then there's like, Opportunity to kind of make it your, make it what is calling to you and it and, and that, and it obviously, it requires you to be in a place that honors that, but, but it sounds so cool.So can you just, like, for people who are like, hold on, back up. What's hr, whenever I got called there, I was getting written up. Um, what, what is, what is like, aside from like the Monsters Inc. Lady, what are like a typical HR and like what is it that you've made HR be so that you. You get excited about it because you're like excited about it.Ryan-Mae McAvoy: I'm excited about what I do and I think that's the thing is like typical HR is, oh, you're just here to protect the company. You're just here. My most like engaged LinkedIn post was one our, I was like, you go, here's the common [00:10:00] misconceptions. We only care about the company. We only are here to protect them.We are here for the company, but we also, I know every good people in HR person that I interact with. That's because we know it's people's paychecks. It's dance lessons for kids. It's the European vacation you want to take for your 25th, your 30th, whatever milestone in your life. If there's not the company that's a lot of people's livelihood.And so it's easy to like kind of villainize it and say, oh, well you just wanna protect the company. I. Maybe, but why? But what is my intent behind it? If it's like, oh, I just don't want us to get sued, that's probably not great. Um, I, I don't want to think that most of us come from that place. I think we do think about the people.Um, and then it was, oh, well you're just, you're a corporate and you wanna follow rules. I'm also an employee. I still get a paycheck. I use the medical benefits I take sick time. And that really kind of gets moved away from. The human element of what we do. Mm-hmm. And there's a lot [00:11:00] of hard news that comes with what we do.(Lesely: Yeah) If you're doing layoffs, if you're terminating someone, if there's an injury, if someone's not performing, yeah. We're involved, and that's a conversation. Um, my childhood best friend wanted to work together, and I, we had this really open conversation where I was like, you have to understand if it doesn't work, I have to be in that meeting.I don't have to agree personally. I can know your side. I can know their side. It's, that's my function. That is my function is being there to like, here's how we transition, here's what that conversation is. And I'm not always comfortable. There are people, I'm like, I, you can't, I won't refer you because I don't wanna ruin that.I would never work with my husband. Like, you guys are so amazing. I'm like, she's a rockstar. Cuz I'm like, we have to have our separate things. Husband is like the friendliest, nicest guy. Everyone loves him and everyone's always like, oh, it'll be so cool if you guys work together. I'm like, but how do you separate that?(Lesely: Yeah) And some people can, I know there are [00:12:00] people in HR, they work at the same company. Like we're in different departments. It doesn't matter. I, I have, I've, I have such a, like a not good poker face. If we were doing a layoff or he was getting terminated, there's no way. I'm like, Hey, what's for dinner? Also dinner.Oh, you, there's no way that would be like possible's your like, how's your resume? Like, no reason. I'm just like, just like curious. Like this is normal conversation. Right? Like, we never talk about this, but I'm just like, maybe just shoot that to me on like my personal email tonight and we'll just take a little gander.Like I never wanna be in that position. Yeah. But I also think that makes good HR people, Lesley Logan: You know, here's what like I am what I love that you're saying, cuz I know that like, I do think, and I have thought, oh, HR is this weird thing that companies hire to be there for the employees, that really it's protect the company.But the way you've explained it is like it humanizes it a little bit and to me it's almost like a Venn diagram. HR is kind of like the overlap of where like the company needs to be protected, but so do the employees and like that's where you live and wow. Do you get to be like [00:13:00] one foot on an island and one foot on a canoe at all times and like, I hope you have good inner thigh strengths.Ryan-Mae McAvoy: Well, I, I, (Lesley: together) listening to you, so now I feel like I have to go a Pilate slice. I have to go try this. So maybe that'll be my, my new set. Lesley Logan: Yeah, yeah. Side plus on the reformer is up for you. But, I think, like, I think it's what your highlight is also just like extremely, it's like being a human being in your place of work is so important.And if you are not able to be a human being where you're working, then. It's a really good sign that maybe you should go talk to your HR department and see like if you're in the right place. So like, lemme just ask if I had an HR, I mean obviously not every HR is you, but if I was at your company and I was struggling, like are you like able to see that I'm in the right position?Are you able to see like if I should be doing a different kind of transfer, are you also able to say like, Hey, this isn't the right place for you. Like what? (Ryan-Mae: So we try) What do, what do people do with, with you if as an employee, other than say, Hey, I would like you to think about this over here. [00:14:00] And that's the thing.Ryan-Mae McAvoy: So we try, we are multifaceted. We have an anonymous tool where people can say like, Hey, I'm just not feeling this. It, like, the first question is like, how was your month? How are you feeling over the month? And you, I think it's like n very unhappy, happy neutral. So we utilize those tools. We do quarterly surveys.Our leadership, and this is something I I'm beyond grateful for, this is a village effort. I don't take all the credit for this. It is not just me. There's amazing humans that I think the universe just kind of put us all in the same spot and was like, let's go, let's do this. Our COO, our CEO, everyone's like, Hey, if you're here and you're unhappy, let's talk about it.Is there another rule for you? Maybe? Is there not? Maybe, if you just say like, Hey, I actually think you're all terrible and I don't wanna be here anymore. We'd rather you tell us, we can figure it out. Instead of you just like randomly quitting in the middle of something. Cuz that's hard for you.It's hard for us. I also just don't know if people feel safe to utilize that. We really try and we [00:15:00] mm-hmm. All of our leadership is open about like, here's where I'm at today. I always sometimes joke our, I'm a cat mom. It's like a weird thing. Our cat like fell one day and I thought his leg was broken.And I was like, I have to be offline. Like, we're going to the vet and I'm just like crying and all this. And nobody was like, What is this? What's going on? Everybody's like, okay, do you need anything? Are you good? Like mm-hmm. We really try and make that. I don't know if it's util obviously, like, I'm like, I want everyone to feel safe.We do try and say like, if you don't wanna come to me, here's an alternative. If you don't wanna go to your boss, here's like, everyone's kind of allowed to go where they need to go. Yeah. But I don't think people are still super comfortable with that. And I think it comes from this is a new wave. This is a new wave of people.People you have. The older generation, and I don't, I don't wanna like classify him for like boomers or whatever because it's, there are people that are argued to that act this way because it's how they were trained. And I think it's a matter of, we're just coming into this new thing. Five years ago, mental health was kind of being talked about.[00:16:00] Now you have CEOs going, oh my gosh, I was struggling with my mental health. So I'm doing these like psychedelics under doctor care and I'm like, What, 25 year old me was like, oh, we wouldn't, we don't talk about that. Like that's not, and now it's, so it's, we are still learning too. Yeah. And I think the struggle is some of us are like, yes, let's talk about it.Let's change things. Let's build a different version of a company. And other people are still like, oh, they're gonna sue us if we talk about mental health. They're gonna, they're gonna abuse leaves. And so I think you have to. Lesley Logan: Well, it sounds like it's coming from an, It sounds like where you're at, there's a, an inherent trust.Like we believe in what we're doing and we want you to be part of it and enjoy yourself while you're here. And like, I think that like it does come from people at the top being human or at least having someone who can remind them that they're human. And I think, you know, it is true. Like I just heard the mayor of San Francisco on an interview and she was talking about like, [00:17:00] this is what she'd like to have for Ben, the guy who actually used to give everyone flowers and now he's has dementia and he lost his house.Like people, the, the people that I hear talking about mental health, I'm like, whoa, hold on. So I think it's so important, but I also think like, it sounds like it's also two parts. So if you're listening to this and you work for a company and you're like, oh, my company doesn't like that. It makes me wonder, like sometimes I think that, like, are we also the employee, are we also saying, Hey, here's what I need.Like are we actually saying what we need to the right people in the company, or are we just assuming that they won't give it to us and, and just. Putting up a block Ryan-Mae McAvoy: I think that's very much, there's just this mental like, oh, I don't know. Melissa, you mentioned Melissa Doman.Yeah. I send her book to everyone. I, I'm obsessed. We have like the coolest uni universal cosmic crossing of paths and really that's the fine. The thing I find myself saying the most is I can't solve problems I don't know about. (Lesley: Yep) So, If [00:18:00] you're not comfortable coming to me, is it the anonymous tool?Is it you going to someone else? What does that look like? Because I can't, if I don't know what's happening, I can't help it. And then the second part is always be very, very upfront. I will tell someone, like I said, we had an employee ask some really great questions last week, and I was like, Hey, it's on my radar.I'm not promising to change this in a day. A year, but I now know about it. I will keep updating you. And sh she was very grateful. She's like, we just talked about it. That was very like, yeah, helpful. And I think the biggest thing I would encourage anyone, and it's not even just hr, it's if you have a question ask, like is it uncomfortable sometimes?Yes. We did a four day work week, which is actually, I think how Mel kind of like pushed us together. I'm all about employee perks, the benefits, and I was like, you guys are out of your mind. This is not gonna work. We're 15 months in and it's working. Wow. And you're doing four days a week? [00:19:00] Yeah, we do. We have Fridays off for people to just like have a life and I think, but it was more than just one piece and it's something, it becomes a bigger thing.It's the seed of the garden. To being more than just your job. Just a parent, just a, a neighbor, just a whatever it is you identify as. And for me, I had a really rough 2021. I had some health issues. Our wedding kept getting post cuz of Covid. Life was kind of all over the place. And I joined Black Thorn. It was kind of funky.It was weird. And I was like finding myself ready to like, we have to do this for the employees and our leadership being like, yeah, we trust you. You got this. And I was like, whoa, whoa, I don't have to like fight you. Oh, okay. That's weird. And, and I explain even now, like I'm almost a year and a half in and I keep talking to people and I'm like, I still sometimes look at 'em like, do I get to do this?This is really how things are going. And I think it seeds into other things I. I gained a bunch [00:20:00] of weight in 2021. I had some really bad physical challenges. Our CEO is one of the most incredible human beings I've ever met in my life. He's super fit, and so I always felt self-conscious about it, like I felt very self-conscious about it.And we did a miles challenge in the fall of 2022. I'm also very competitive, so I was like, I'm gonna do this. I'm gonna win and it's gonna be great. And. I remember him and I were, were messaging and I was like, yeah, I did five miles. And then like, I saw your pace and it took me like an hour and a half and you did it like 40 minutes.He's like, but five miles is five miles. Why do you care? You did it. Yeah. And I was like, whoa. And so it's, and it develops into more things. Like I got up Monday morning, I'm in Las Vegas, I'm in this great hotel room, it's a party town. Got up and walked on the treadmill and I just like sent him a message and I was like, Hey, I want you to know like you affect more than just work me.(Lesely: Yeah) I know now that 30 minutes in the morning, if it's treadmill, if it's going outside and listening to a podcast, if it's going outside and having a phone call before I kind of start my day, that [00:21:00] time and that piece that I've created is really meaningful to me and I need it. Yeah, and it's something that is just really incredible and I think that when we have that openness, And we all talk about our struggles cuz he's very much like, I don't want to people just talk to me cause I'm CEO or be afraid to talk to me cause I'm CEO.Lesley Logan: Yeah. I think like, okay first of all, if you're like wondering who Mel is, you guys will link her book in the show notes. We'll also link to her episode you guys, I picked her up for the show. Ryan-Mae McAvoy: If you don't like your HR person, I will anonymously send her book to them. Cause I have been known to do like some also a little petty.Lesley Logan: Oh yeah. Let us know. Or you could, or if you're listening, just un honestly. Yes. I a guitar person. Yeah. But, it is all about talking about mental health at work and why we have to, and also it came, it's a great episode on like, like wellness shaming, which can happen at work one, everything. But, so I so just wanna put a pin on that.You feel like, who is Mel? That's what we're talking about now. I wanna also say like, you know, the stories we tell ourselves are like, so huge. Like, like, so it's like if we're telling ourselves that I can't talk to [00:22:00] hr, And HR is over there going, gosh, I really wish people talked to me. And also minding me saying, Hey, come talk to us.But you might be hearing cuz you've just told yourself a story. So it's like really? You know, it's important for you wherever you are to listen to this and like, understand what you want and like go say it and then understand that they might be able to do it tomorrow, but like at least say it so you know it's been said and you can then find out who they are and how they'll operate and if it's gonna work for you because maybe you don't need to leave or as you mentioned earlier, maybe you do.Man, oh, we had an episode on stress with Dr. Bender and she talked about how whenever we're feeling stressed out as human beings, we like to reason, we like to make up a reason and. Then that reason becomes, oh, well I got stressed out if my boss left the room. So actually it's my boss that stresses me out.Now, it might not have been your boss at all. It might have just been like something else that happened in your brain triggered something, and like then you're stressed out. So then you're leaving your job because your boss, you think your boss stresses you out. But really, it might have just been [00:23:00] like the food you ate that caused stress in your body.Like there's a lot of things. And so it's like we have to really be mindful of like how we're feeling and then. Being okay with being a human being, feeling those feelings and then talking to somebody about it so that we can actually go, oh, you don't have to feel shame about it taking however long it took you to five miles, because actually you did fucking five miles and that's pretty awesome.Ryan-Mae McAvoy: Exactly. And I think sometimes like we our own, my therapist constantly reminds me, he's like, well, the relationship you have with yourself is. The most permanent, it's 24 7. Like if you wanna walk away from your pet or your child or your husband, you can probably, hopefully take two or three minutes at the minimum, if not more.Lesley Logan: And I think it applies to more than work. I think speaking your truth, like I don't think it's the permission to go out and be like, I hate your shoes and I think you're tacky. I do think you have to speak your truth, like, Hey, I'm not comfortable with this. And I think that's something, I was actually telling someone about your podcast yesterday and I was like, she did this episode about the 40 for 40.Ryan-Mae McAvoy: [00:24:00] I just turned 39, and I had someone be like, oh my gosh, you're gonna be 40. Like, how does that feel? I was like, I'm so stoked. I'm so, so stoked because my thirties, like, I look at how it started and how it's closing out and I'm like, it can only go up from here. Yeah. Like it's only gonna go up from here.And really, It's because I really learned myself, like my good, my bad. And being able to be like, I'm just being an asshole right now. Like, this is just me. Like I'm just this, I'm sorry. Like I, and sometimes you don't know in the moment, but I think there's a lot of power professionally and personally be like, hey, wasn't my best self.No excuses, just wasn't my best self made a mistake. Here's where we're going now. Yeah, and I think that that, but I think it applies to more than just hrs or C E o. I mean, you do Pilates and you're a podcaster and you do all this other stuff, and there's probably a voice in time that's like, well, I'm on this, should I do this too?And I think there's something really powerful [00:25:00] to be like, why? Why can't I do this? Yeah. I, five years ago would not have spoken out about, yeah, I think you should be able to go to your boss and be like, Hey, va, that wasn't okay. And this is how I feel. Yeah. Now I might sometimes do it a little aggressively and have to be like, Hey, so I should, I should have toned that down.But I think we, we build up, like you said, we build up these stories good, bad, in between, and it's, it's really a disservice to our own self to be like, but can I change the story? What? Like, how can I change the story? Some things can't change. There's loss, there's events that happen, but also you can look at that and say, okay, but what can I do now?And that's really what I'm just trying to put out there is what can you do now and how can you change and how do you be more than just what people say you are. (Lesely: Yeah) Not a pun on the name, but they kind of was. Lesley Logan: Yeah. I love this so much. You know what I, first of all, what I'm loving and I hope those who are not working in a corporation are like actually like seeing this cuz like as an owner of a company like [00:26:00] I.First of all, I'm con I'm, I'm aware that like, especially as a woman in her forties who may or may not be perimenopausal, like I'll be in a meeting and I'm just like, this meeting, I'm, I don't wanna be in this meeting. (Ryan-Mae: I don't wanna do this anymore.) This meeting sucks. Whenever we have this meeting, it sucks.And my husband, whose CEO is like, yeah, I think financial meetings just suck. And I'm like, no. I think at some point they should not suck. I would like, I want to have a fun one. I wanna have like a fun finance call. Yes. But like, I think, um, Being a human being is really hard, and I think sometimes whether or not you are the person listening who's running a business and it's solo and you've got a VA or you are an employee somewhere, like it is hard to be a human being because we all think we need to be better than whatever we decided.Or we have been told we need to be better and may or may not been given the tools to do that. And there's just all this pressure and the more we can be honest with how we're feeling and like [00:27:00] acknowledge like, oh, I was actually really an asshole in that meeting. Like I was like, you guys, I am just, I'm not in a good space today.So I think I'm just gonna take myself out of this meeting. Thank you so much. I'm gonna, I'm gonna go now cuz I gotta go cry in my room, but it's gonna be, it's not your fault. Ryan-Mae McAvoy: Yeah. And I think that there's, that's powerful though. That's extremely powerful, especially because it pulls into other things. Oh, well she's just being hormonal so she can't run a company or he's not allowed to have emotion cuz he's a man, or dads shouldn't be on parental leave and things.And it ties into so many factors and we joke. I, I've been working a lot. My husband's fortunately been able to pick up some of the house stuff and somebody's like, wait, he does the laundry? I'm like, well, he wears the clothes. So yes, he does. And sometimes we don't do laundry for two weeks and we just wear, like, I'll be wearing a concert t-shirt because them out of like options.Yes. But I think that like it plays [00:28:00] into so much more than just corporate. It plays into personal and something I really try, I don't believe in resolutions cause I always break 'em. Yeah. But I always focus on like one thing that I really wanna improve. And one year it was like I just stopped drinking soda or pop, depending on where you're from because I was like, I'm just, this is like, this isn't healthy and like it's not good and it like, I just don't wanna do it anymore.And I'm just like, okay. So that's my, that's my thing for, I think it was 2019. And in 2020 I found myself having some really pivotal relationships. I probably bit off more than I can chew, not knowing what was coming early down 2020. Yes. But I really decided, I, I default to anger. My default emotion is anger.I get frustrated. I want to cuss, I wanna yell, I wanna throw things. I wanna be like up in the mix of like, oh, they suck and they're this and they're that. And, and I really was like, I need to get to a place where like I, maybe we don't see eye to eye. Maybe we've had a falling out. You can. You can be over there.I'll be at my table. It doesn't mean I wish you get hit by [00:29:00] lightning or anything. Mm-hmm. You just don't have a speed, a seat in my table anymore and that's okay. I'd rather have a table that's genuine and supportive, but it also means, it doesn't mean I have to be like, oh my God, she's the worst. Like, can you even believe?Lesley Logan: Right. You can just let it go. Yeah. Ryan-Mae McAvoy: So it's just, so every year I work on something like that, and this year I'm really trying like authenticity, like I'm not saying that right. But yeah, being super authentic. Like I know I'm too much for some people.I'm loud. I have a terrible body mouth. I hopefully, I love that you're in hr. Like I love everything about you being in hr. All right. I'm like the anti, I have a sticker in my, I was like, I'm not regular hr, I'm cool hr. But literally I like, I'm trying to be my, and I. I have to like put myself in check and be like, there are people you really admire.They're a little soft spoken. They don't, they don't love. And I constantly joke, I'm like, and then I like Kool-Aid man out through the door. I'm like, Hey everybody, what's up? Do this. And having to learn [00:30:00] like maybe they don't dislike me, but maybe I'm not their flavor. Lesley Logan: Yeah, like it's, there's all these different Kool-Aid flavors. You might not be the right, yeah,Ryan-Mae McAvoy: It might not be the right one. And I try, and I'm trying really hard to incorporate that into everything. Like, if you're a business, do I wanna spend my dollars with you? Do I believe in your principles? Do I believe in your vendors? And even it's brutal out there. We all know what's going on with the economy.We all follow the news. I feel so bad for salespeople. They're just, they're trying so hard and you don't wanna pull them. Sometimes y'all, I, I gotta call him out. Like we had a gentleman, he emailed me on Thanksgiving via LinkedIn and was like, I love everything black do's doing in the culture and the, the Boric life balance and the best.I'm like, okay, you're not in the us maybe, or I don't know, but it's Thanksgiving. So like, I'll get to you Monday. And then on Sunday he was like, did you read my email? Or what are your thoughts? Like really just gotta like connect in synergy and jive. And I was like, sir, if you actually were authentic and read anything I've ever written, [00:31:00] I have been out for four days and I sh I'm not going to respond on your pitch.Even if I need your product at this point I'm out. And I genuinely hope like you tone down the hustle, you find a company that works for you and doesn't want you just to grind 24/7. Cuz it was really sad and he like called me out. He was like, I emailed a prospect and he like made this big LinkedIn post and everyone kind of agreed with me. I was like, You respect people's boundaries? Lesley Logan: Yeah. I mean like there's awareness of yourself, an awareness of like not everyone's going to like you, and then awareness that not everyone's going to like you. So when they don't like you, it's not personal. And I think that, that's a really incredible thing I wanna highlight, like I love how each year you pick something cuz it's like a be it till you see it.Okay, this year I'm gonna be it until I see this song, dogs gonna have pop. Okay, this year I'm gonna be it till I see it as someone who like, lets go of relationships that no longer serve me and it doesn't have to be a big deal. And now you're like, okay, I'm gonna be it till I see it in my authentic way.Like I'm gonna like, this is how [00:32:00] I feel this, I work for a company that also believes this way. And so we want. We're gonna hire people, we're gonna, we're gonna buy from people who believe this way, and I think everybody, no matter where you are in your work life, we can all be until we see it in the brands we interact with and the companies we buy from and the things the, the, the, the pages on social we engage with because all of that is information that we take in and then we go off to work or whether it's for someone else or ourselves.And then we tell ourselves a story based on like these 17 things that like connected all at the same minute as you're walking into work. Ryan-Mae McAvoy: And then you pick the one and you're like, that blue shirt that John has just pisses me off every time I see him. And you're like, (Lesley: Yeah), is it it really that, or like, does he happen to just like, you got cut off in traffic this morning and he was the first person you saw, like (Lesley: Yeah)it's just really, and it, again, it plays into such bigger things. I, the world is so opinionated right now, and we all have our side and we all have our right and we're all, and I, I get it. I have firm beliefs. I have things [00:33:00] that I am not gonna waiver on and things I'm not gonna compromise on. Sometimes I don't need to yell about it, and that's something I'm learning.(Lesley: Mm-hmm.) Other people do need to yell about it, but I've also noticed by kind of stepping back, the conversations I'm having are opening doors that I never would've thought because I can hear more. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. I can hear more about someone who, I'm a straight white woman, there's a lot of things I need to learn, and it's really just like opened up the doors for those conversations and I'm like, wow, I'm actually like harder into this and I'm learning things.And now you get on the other side, everyone's got an opinion. I know when I travel, people are like, where are you from? I live in California. Oh hmm. Are you gonna come and jack up our real estate prices? I'm like, probably not. I don't know. Like this is cool, but no, maybe I just look at realtor cuz that's what I do not cuz I'm like trying to like single-handedly destroy your economy.Lesley Logan: It is the, it's the most hilarious thing. Okay. This is a total side note. Y'all we're gonna go on a tangent. I was in, I [00:34:00] was in a different state in an Uber and I said I was from Las Vegas and, and the person started talking about something that I like, didn't really actually agree with, and I didn't want to like, I didn't want to get in an argument with them.I'm an Uber, (Ryan-Mae: like dropped off on the side of the road) just trying to get, I'm just trying to like get to where I'm going. I really should. Like, I really, it should just say like, I don't wanna talk to you. And it's not cuz I'm an asshole, just cuz I got the other things. I'm in the Uber for a reason anyways, so I just said, you know, before that I was living in Los Angeles and the whole conversation just stopped and I was like, okay, well that's one way to end a conversation you don't wanna have.But it's also hilarious because like, just because you're living from someplace, moving somewhere doesn't mean you're trying to jack up the real estate. Everyone, people are allowed to move. Ryan-Mae McAvoy: I noticed this a lot. I have a, one of my dear friends is a veterinarian.Will not tell people because like it'll be the most random. Be like, what do you do? You're out like a social thing. Oh, I'm a veterinarian. I just happen to have this picture of my pet's butt. Does that look normal? And you're like, well, (Lesley: Yeah) and then it, [00:35:00] I'm sure people do it with you. They're like, oh, you have Pilates.I had this instructor and they were terrible. Or, oh, answer my HR question. I do this with, actually, we mentioned Mel previously, and I know we're trying to make this whole episode of her, I'll text her and be like, I need your professional opinion in the mental health space. Are you able, or like, I just need you to be my friend.Like, and (Lesley: Yeah), we actually brought this into our marriage. Like obviously in hr I have some, some skills and some knowledge. So my husband will have a work challenge and I'm like, okay, do you need like wife me or do you need HR me? Because I need to know what lane to be in. Lesley Logan: Yeah. And this all keeps coming back to like, I, I, it just comes back to like making, like honoring the pace that you're in and not everything has to be an argument and not everything has being antagonist again, not everyone is against you.People that you might think are on the opposite side of the aisle of any like opposite of be of your boss, opposite of the aisle, however you vote. There's actually always a Venn Diagram of like, we all just want, we want the world to be here tomorrow. Like, that'd be really awesome. [00:36:00] And if you are in a workplace as an employee, of course your boss wants things to work out.Because then they can pay you. (Ryan-Mae: Yeah) So of course they wanna hear like, they want you to work out here ideally, cuz it costs a fuck ton more to hire someone else. Ryan-Mae McAvoy: Oh my God. So does the refill, the backfill is, is a real thing, but it's also just like, and I think that's where my, my passion comes from is like there's, we get labeled and it's, oh, you're, you're a woman, you're in California, you're in Vegas, you're this, you're that.And I don't. We're more than that. We're all more than that. Mm-hmm. Every, I don't care what, what you believe in or any of that, you're not just that one thing. Yeah. Maybe you support that one thing that I'm like, ugh, not so much for me. But what are the other things that maybe we do agree on? Yeah. Even if it's something small or even if it's just like, again, finding the self that you need to serve in that moment is something that we have to, and the intent, the intent is a huge thing.And I love that you mentioned that because we find in, especially in the people space, [00:37:00] did you have a toxic workplace? Have you come from a boss that was just probably really awful to you, maybe even unintentionally, and they didn't realize it, okay, we're gonna support you. We're gonna try and set you up for success.It's also, you have to come to the table ready to like not assume every I still to this day, if I'm randomly dropping a meeting on someone's calendar, we'll send them a message or something and saying like, hey, I'm grabbing time. This is why. Because, yeah. If anybody's getting like a random meeting from their HR leader, they're like, well that was, that was a good run.So I try and be intentional with my communication cause I don't wanna cause anxiety. (Lesley: yeah, yeah) And it was, my CEO was a really great example when I first started. He like, I think I was like doing something. He's like, Hey, do you have two minutes? I'm gonna call you. And I was like, oh, I'm in so much trouble.I don't know what I did. And he's like, why do you, why did you assume that?Lesley Logan: Because we all do. Because everyone, all do, all do. So everyone just tell people why I need 15 minutes of their time. And do not say to pick your brain, just like actually say, I need, I have, I would like to talk about X thing. And people (Ryan-Mae: exactly) will actually say yes to meanings.And that's like, and [00:38:00] I'll be like, hey. Or if it's something a little sensitive, like, Hey, you've said you've got some struggle. You told me that thing I'm mentioning in the calendar, it's gonna be called this or it's gonna be this. And most of the time I'm gonna give away some of the secrets. HR people don't come for me.If you're getting terminated. HR is not usually the one sending the meeting. We just kind of like come in from the back and are like, Hey, we're here too. So that's actually, there's a lot if that helps anyone's fears. It is very rare. It does happen. I, I can't speak, I do not speak for every organization.But most of the time, and I, I also encourage people cuz we're busy. We're, I, I mean, I send things out. If you're not sure, ask if you would rather take two minutes and be like, Hey, we're you asked me to connect, or, hey, you seem short in that email most of the time it's easily explained away. (Lesley: Yeah) And I think that that's something we don't feel powered to do just in life in general.(Lesley: Yeah) Like it's very, it's very hard to be like, you just seem really snippy via text and they're like, what? No, I, I, I was at the grocery store, I was in the car, I was [00:39:00] using Siri and. Lesley Logan: Yeah, it's like, it, it's like if you either, either we all need to stop pretending that it's about us all the time, or we actually have to bring it to their attention. That, that felt a certain way is everything okay? Ryan-Mae McAvoy: And I, I think in the workplace, especially, like, I try and say, I say this to myself, I, I give this advice to employees and to fellow management and stuff in a company. None of us are really the star of the show. Like, even if you go like Steve Jobs, like everybody knows him from Apple.Yeah. He was running the company and he was doing, like, (Lesley: he didn't make the phone). He's not building the phones. And like, that's the thing is I think like it's, it's easy and again, I, this is advice I give myself when I'm like, everybody hates me and they're super mad at me. I have to be like, you're not actually like the hero slash star.You're, you're a supporting player in this movie that we're making together. And it's, it's sometimes easy to be like, okay. It's okay. Yeah, and I, I think that we [00:40:00] all inherently are our own hero and we are all our like own superstars, so it's easy to be like, oh my gosh, I bet you that Leslie and Mel were talking about me before I came on the podcast, and Mel like warned her and this and that.Instead of being like, no, Mel probably was like, Hey, you should talk to Ryan May. Like she's got some cool views. That's the of it. (Lesley: Yeah) It's easy to build it up, like you said, it all goes back to we create this narrative. And sometimes changing the narrative to ourselves, even what we say to ourselves mm-hmm.Is, is hard. And there was a, there's a book someone gifted me, it's actually about parenting and I was kinda like, this is weird, just growing up again. And it talks about, as a parent, how do you change what you've come from? And it really just kind of, it's very heavy, like into the generational trauma and stuff.But it was very much like, okay, I had kind of a weird childhood. There was some stuff. It's a lot. Big proponent of therapy if you're not your best self. But it gave me some insight on like, I can actually just choose to not be upset about that anymore. (Lesley: Yeah) Like I [00:41:00] can choose to not carry that on like Lesley Logan: We should I'll read that book, whether you're having kids or not, because take, it's like a great thing to even like, Take into the workplace and take into, or working for yourself, which you can tell yourself some whoppers, Brian, may you somehow have managed to make HR sound so fun. Ryan-Mae McAvoy: And, there's a lot of dark sides to it too. There are some, in most industries, there's some not great people. But honestly, if you, if you aren't sure, just ask. Lesley Logan: Yes. Okay. That, like right there, that's the title of the show. Okay. We're gonna take a brief break and then we're gonna find out where we can find you, learn from you, and also your beat action names.All right, Ryan, may, where do you like to hang out? You said LinkedIn? Is that your jam? Ryan-Mae McAvoy: I mostly live on LinkedIn. I'm a little bit hard to find cuz I, I have, it's just Ryan Dash May with an E and then the letter M and the Lord's P H R which is a certification for professional and human resources. I do live on Instagram.It's mostly cat photos, so if you're looking for like hard [00:42:00] hitting. Professional content? Lesley Logan: No, we got some cat lovers. They'll just come there for the cat. Ryan-Mae McAvoy: It's literally like, usually like cats. And I'm, I'm slowly becoming like a very much, I wanna get my somnia at some point. That's like my next career move.So there's usually like heym a winery here, Hey, I'm doing this. So lot of memes, I use humor Lesley Logan: Oh my God, I wanna go back to being a social media person who just put up pictures of my dogs and tequila and some memes like, oh my God, what if that could. So well and it, I missed 2005.Ryan-Mae McAvoy: Right. I'm like sometimes it was so much simpler. Yeah. But yeah, I live on LinkedIn and I actually, I love LinkedIn. I think LinkedIn is becoming like more of like my favorite social media, which is really weird.Lesley Logan: Yeah. Brad is gonna want to tell like pick your brain on that in a big way. Cuz he's like really convinced that way we should like do some stuff on LinkedIn and I'm like, I, I'm just so, I got so tired of being sold, like, I'm not gonna even say the company's name cuz I don't want 'em to come for me. But the, you know, I discuss all of them. There's being sold every single, Ryan-Mae McAvoy: There's no one, there's, there's [00:43:00] the 10 ones that are like, you said you liked yoga here we offer these 40 packages. And you're like, that's. Okay. I think I would love to talk Brad about that cuz I am a very big proponent of LinkedIn and I think the community is being built and there's so much stuff you can see that you're like, oh, I never thought of that.My new personal passion project in the HR space is second chance hiring. You made a mistake when you were younger. You have a crime. They're so, I, I could go for hours.Lesley Logan: I'm obsessed like you guys. I need another podcast if we're gonna talk about this because, I'm obsessed with Second Chance Hiring and I have a family member who literally cannot get a job he is overly qualified for because of something he did at 18 years old.And I'm like, okay, then we have to find. A criminal defense attorney and try to get this expunged from your record. It's been 20 fucking years. You haven't done shit since. Like, and that thing is crazy. And you look at, that was the thing I always joke of. He was like, oh, did you after this? I was like, maybe I'll go to law school.Ryan-Mae McAvoy: And you look at public defenders and they're [00:44:00] lacking. And so then you get a lawyer that usually bills $500 an hour and they're like, oh, you're pro bono for this guy. He's not giving you his a game. And so I'm actually doing some volunteer stuff with a company called Good Call, New York. They have an algorithm right now that if you are arrested in New York, they're gonna start going across country. They'll get you connected with Law Enfor, law enforcement representation, whether it's an attorney, illegal aid, something just to get you on the right track, no charge, low cost, and there's some orgs just doing some great work, honest jobs outta Denver.They literally are a talent platform management for finding like, hey, you have a criminal record, you know that you acknowledge it. Let's get you placed. (Lesley: Love this..) it's just such a passion project. Lesley Logan: Guys. We'll forget these links and I'll put 'em in the show notes. Yeah, I'll send them please, because, I'm like, I think.Some, there's a lot of shit going on in the world and you gotta pick something that you're passionate about and like, it can't, we all, like, if we all just donate to the world, like it's not gonna work. Like we have, like there's all these little problems at home that you can actually make a massive impact on. I love what you're talking about. Ryan-Mae McAvoy: Well, and it's not even like dollars at point. Like I literally reached out [00:45:00] to Good Call and I was like, hey, I know you guys are small. Here's what I can offer. I would love to give you 10 million to fund your project. I don't have it. I'm sorry. So we're doing those kind of things and I think it really just comes from LinkedIn now as opposed to LinkedIn. Even in like 20 19, 2020. I was connected with them cuz someone liked a post that was talking about it. And they're CEO Jelani, who's an amazing human, who I should totally connect you with.Was just like, he was like, Hey, here's my email if you have any input. And I, I just like emailed him. It was very random and cold connection like, hey, I'm some lady from California, you know, nothing about, but I'd really like to help. Oh, please do. Cuz I would love to highlight them cuz like, I would know how you even start something like that and like, It's so, there's so many good orgs.I'll send you all the links. Yeah. And I wanna highlight them, because I want more people to know and how like somehow support them. Okay. Real quick, cuz we can obviously talk forever. You're amazing. (Ryan-Mae: ditto) Yeah. Be It action items, bold, executable, intrinsic, targeted steps people can take to be it until they see it. What is your tip for them today? [00:46:00] Ryan-Mae McAvoy: Do not label yourself as one thing. You are a multifaceted human being. You are a, your career, you're a parent, you're a spouse, you're this. Serve the version of you in that moment that serves you best? Yeah, sometimes I am not. Ryan-Maeerson, I'm Ryan-Maeand I just have to be in that role.And sometimes I'm Ryan Mae who's having a really hard mental day that needs to be the cat lady on the couch with her Netflix and some mac and cheese. And I think the more you deny the layers of yourself, you become less authentic in each version. Mm-hmm. And you get consumed. I could let my job consume me if I wanted, cuz I, I, I like it.There's a lot of work to be done. I fortunately have now colleagues and people outside of my life that are like, Hey girl, take a break. How you feeling? What are you doing? Did you eat? Are you, are you watering? Did you go on a walk? Like, what are you doing? And I think you have to really acknowledge and honor even the bad parts.Like you were saying, you hate finance meetings. I think you can be like, okay, I'm LL in the [00:47:00] finance meeting. This is the worst version I'm gonna be today. Let's get it done. And that's okay. You're serving that version of yourself. Yeah. Yeah, that's, that's okay. I, my husband (Lesley: team, I hope you just heard that.I get full permission just to be that person.) They're gonna message me on LinkedIn and be like, now you have to be our HR lady. I'm in HR, this, but yeah, so it's, I think you have to deserve the good, the bad, and you have to acknowledge all of it. And you have to learn what is that there are parts of ourselves we're not gonna love.It's unfortunate. I, you can get any woowoo, love every moment of yourself,Lesley Logan: No, I had a therapist. Best advice she ever give me. She's like, you don't have to like that version of you like, like there's like that, there's an eight year old LL who likes to like freak out about money whenever I have it.And I can actually go, you know what? I heard you. Thank you. You can just go back to your seat. Appreciate it. Ryan-Mae McAvoy: I think that's like, I think that's okay. Like I struggle. I had some parental stuff and I think it's very like disarming to people when I'm like, yeah, my parents weren't the greatest.Sometimes it's not discounting the good that [00:48:00] they did. Right. It's okay. It's also, I say all the time when people are getting in new relationships and stuff. The partner I am to my husband is so much better than the RM that dated all everyone before. Yeah. Long term short term, because one, I saw the value in our relationship.I liked myself a lot more and I was more comfortable with the good, the bad, and like being that very, like being in a marriage is very intimate for like even non-sexual reasons. Like you're just, it's 24 7. Your everything, your finances, your mental health, your physical health, everything is Oh yeah, intertwined.And there's a part of me that honors, like, you know, that guy I dated before, Phil? I wasn't really good to him. I'm not saying he was great to me either. We probably weren't good for each other, but everything I took from that, I can sit here and say, here's how I'm gonna do it different and why. Mm-hmm. And I think that you have to acknowledge it.I'm the same way about money. Like I, [00:49:00] my husband's a responsible one and like, he'll be like, just buy it. And I'm like, What if we're gonna like, lose our house? Then I internalize, like people will talk about, oh yeah, I'm, I'm gonna get fired for my job, whatever. And I'm like, we have to eat Ramen. Where's all our money?What are we doing? And he's like, so we're good. Like that has nothing to do with us. And I like pull it on myself. And he's like, I don't know where this is coming from. And we talk about it and he is like, oh, my mom was a C p A, so she taught me about finances and did all this. My parents were like, good luck.Lesley Logan: Yeah. Oh yeah. No, my, my husband's parents were accountants, so, um, Ryan-Mae McAvoy: oh my gosh. I feel like we have like seven more episodes. Lesley Logan: We do. We do stuff. We do. I love this, I love that. I love just honoring the version of yourself and not just labeling yourself as just one thing. I think it gives so much freedom and I hope, and it actually allows you all to be it till you see it.So Ryan Mae be who you need to be in that moment and accept that sometimes this is not the best version of yourself. Ah. Yes, yes, yes, yes. Ryan Mae thank you for being here and sharing anytime, sharing all of your, all of your parts of you, and also making HR sound like I [00:50:00] somebody I wanna hire.Ryan-Mae McAvoy: Um, well, if you ever, I, HR goals. Now, if you ever need some advice, I'm a quick email or LinkedIn a way (Lesley: you're, you're on the list).. Love that. Um, but thank you for having me. Like, honestly. Oh. Lesley Logan: Yeah. This is so fun. This is such a fun conversation. You guys. What are your takeaways? What parts of the story like resonate with you?What parts are you actually going? Oh dang, I'm gonna use that. Let us know. Uh, tag Ryan May, um, and her cats On Instagram, yes, or on LinkedIn. Um, I'm also on there. My team makes sure, uh, and also share this episode with a friend. And until next time, be it till you see it.That's all I got for this episode of the Be It Till You See It Podcast. One thing that would help both myself and future listeners is for you to rate the show and leave a review and follow or subscribe for free wherever you listen to your podcast. Also, make sure to introduce yourself over at the Be It Pod on Instagram.I would love to know more about you. Share this episode with whoever you think needs to hear it. Help us and others Be It Till You See It. [00:51:00] Have an awesome day.Be It Till You See It is a production of the Bloom Podcast Network. Brad Crowell: It's written, filmed, and recorded by your host, Lesley Logan and me, Brad Crowell. Lesley Logan: It is produced and edited by the Epic team at Disenyo. Brad Crowell: Our theme music is by Ali at Apex Production, music, and our branding by designer and artist, Cianfranco Cioffi.Lesley Logan: Special thanks to Melissa Solomon for creating our visuals and Ximena Velazquez for our transcriptions.Brad Crowell: Also to Angelina Herico for adding all the content to our website, and finally to Meridith Crowell for keeping us all on point and on time. Support this podcast at — https://redcircle.com/be-it-till-you-see-it/donationsAdvertising Inquiries: https://redcircle.com/brandsPrivacy & Opt-Out: https://redcircle.com/privacy

Organizational psychologist and author Melissa Doman, MA joins IMS Client Success Advisor and podcast host Adam Bloomberg for a special series in honor of Mental Health Awareness Month. In this episode, they discuss employee assistance programs and balancing mental well-being with a stressful career. (Part 3 of 3)View the video version on YouTube. Visit our website for more of the IMS Insights Podcast.IMS has delivered strategic litigation consulting and expert witness services to leading global law firms and Fortune 500 companies for more than 30 years, in more than 40,000 cases. IMS consultants become an extension of your legal team from pre-suit investigation services to discovery and then on to arbitration and trial. Learn more at expertservices.com.

Organizational psychologist and author Melissa Doman, MA joins IMS Client Success Advisor and podcast host Adam Bloomberg for a special series in honor of Mental Health Awareness Month. In this episode, they discuss mental health in the legal field and how to focus on mental well-being during high-stress situations like trial. (Part 2 of 3)View the video version on YouTube. Visit our website for more of the IMS Insights Podcast.IMS has delivered strategic litigation consulting and expert witness services to leading global law firms and Fortune 500 companies for more than 30 years, in more than 40,000 cases. IMS consultants become an extension of your legal team from pre-suit investigation services to discovery and then on to arbitration and trial. Learn more at expertservices.com.

We like to imagine that there's a clear distinction between our work-selves and our non-work-selves. But the stressors that impact our mental health don't really make that distinction. So, when our work is suffering because of our mental health, and our mental health is suffering because of work, who's responsible for addressing that? In this final episode of Hold On, a national call-in show about our mental health, Anna talks to organizational psychologist Melissa Doman, author of Yes, You Can Talk About Mental Health at Work...Here's Why (And How To Do It Really Well), about how and when to address mental health issues in the workplace, and listeners call in with questions and stories.   

Organizational psychologist and author Melissa Doman, MA joins IMS Client Success Advisor and podcast host Adam Bloomberg for a special series in honor of Mental Health Awareness Month. In this episode, they discuss the importance of mental health conversations at work, how leaders can set the example, and why post-pandemic stress levels are so high. (Part 1 of 3)View the video version on YouTube. Visit our website for more of the IMS Insights Podcast.IMS has delivered strategic litigation consulting and expert witness services to leading global law firms and Fortune 500 companies for more than 30 years, in more than 40,000 cases. IMS consultants become an extension of your legal team from pre-suit investigation services to discovery and then on to arbitration and trial. Learn more at expertservices.com.

The current job market, lay offs, threats of recession, and stock market situation is making many people ask: What the heck is going on? We try and answer some of that and discuss the ramifications of all of this on people's mental health at work and at home. To help us, we are joined by our friend, Melissa Doman. We discuss all of the above, and ways people canmanage their work related mental health issiues, the way corporations can better handle off-boarding and layoffs, and much more. As always, it's a lively, informative conversation, totally off-the-cuff, and open-minded. Melissa Doman, MA is an Organizational Psychologist, Former Clinical Mental Health Therapist, & Author of Yes, You Can Talk About Mental Health at Work (Here's Why And How To Do It Really Well). Melissa works with companies across industries around the globe – including clients like Google, Dow Jones, Microsoft, Salesforce, Siemens, Estée Lauder, & Janssen. She's been featured as a subject matter expert in Vogue, the BBC, CNBC, Inc., and in LinkedIn's 2022 Top 10 Voices on Mental Health. Having lived abroad in South Korea, England, Australia and traveled to 45+ countries, Melissa calls upon her global experiences to inform how she works with companies around the world. She has one core goal: to equip companies, individuals, and leaders to have constructive conversations about mental health, team dynamics, and communication in the workplace. Her work and book aim to accomplish just that.To learn more about Melissa, her work, or the book - please visit www.melissadoman.comThe Psychology Talk Podcast is a unique conversation about psychology around the globe. Your host Dr. Scott Hoye discusses psychology and mental health trends with practitioners and experts to keep you informed about issues and trends in the industry. Dr. Hoye is a clinical psychologist and the director of Chicago Psychology Services, in Chicago, IL., USA. https://psych-talk.comhttps://www.instagram.com/psychtalkpodcast/https://www.facebook.com/psychtalkpodcasthttps://chicagopsychservices.com

In today's show, you will meet Melissa, a certified Sleep Sense Consultant. She discuss sleep issue of kids with special needs and offer helpful tips. She also do services in Pennsylvania and around the world. Check out her website: https://www.melissadomansleepconsulting.com/   "The best dividends on the labor invested have invariably come from seeking more knowledge rather than more power." -Wilbur and Orville Wright   Please donate to the show in order for us to continue supporting parents with special needs children https://www.patreon.com/thenakedparentpodcast. Your donation is greatly appreciated.

Remember the “good old days” when employees were told to leave their feelings, their personal wellbeing, their personal baggage at the door? My, oh my, how things have changed. While many leaders acknowledge the importance of mental health in the workplace, they are a long way from figuring out how to do it right. That's why we consider ourselves lucky that the renowned organizational psychologist Melissa Doman took some time out of her busy schedule to help us decode the why, how, and what of mental health in the workplace and find better ways to achieve success. Who is Melissa Doman? Melissa Doman, MA is an Organizational Psychologist, Former Clinical Mental Health Therapist, & Author of Yes, You Can Talk About Mental Health at Work (Here's Why And How To Do It Really Well). Melissa works with companies across industries around the globe – including clients like Google, Dow Jones, Microsoft, Salesforce, Siemens, Estée Lauder, & Janssen. She's been featured as a subject matter expert in Vogue, the BBC, CNBC, Inc., and in LinkedIn's 2022 Top 10 Voices on Mental Health. Having lived abroad in South Korea, England, Australia and traveled to 45+ countries, Melissa calls upon her global experiences to inform how she works with companies around the world. She has one core goal: to equip companies, individuals, and leaders to have constructive conversations about mental health, team dynamics, and communication in the workplace. Her work and book aim to accomplish just that. To learn more about Melissa, her work, or the book, please visit www.melissadoman.com.

In this episode I am speaking with Melissa Doman, MA, Author of Yes, You Can Talk About Mental Health at Work (Here's Why And How To Do It Really Well). We talk about mental health in the workplace and why now more than ever this is so important to be talked about in the workplace.  Her book is a fantastic handbook on how to approach this sensitive conversation in the workplace.  We addressed the approach of self-advocacy in the workplace as an individual contributor and a leader, the “toxic positivity trend”, and so much more.  This episode is dedicated to all who are in the workplace and managing mental health. I genuinely wish I had Melissa's book back in the day in my corporate life, her book is a must-have in each team.    From the amazon book listing: Taking a realistic approach, through research, stories of lived experience and applied techniques that anyone can use, the book includes information on:- How we bring our beliefs and experiences around mental health and mental illness into the workplace The importance of understanding how the language we use, consciously or unconsciously, impacts us Ways to manage the challenges around having mental health conversations at work ‘How-to' conversation guides Concrete tips on ways to action this education individually or at a team level After reading this book, you'll feel empowered and equipped to have constructive, meaningful conversations about mental health in your workplace     About Melissa: Melissa Doman, MA is an Organizational Psychologist, Former Clinical Mental Health Therapist, & Author of Yes, You Can Talk About Mental Health at Work (Here's Why And How To Do It Really Well). Melissa works with companies across industries around the globe – including clients like Google, Dow Jones, Microsoft, Salesforce, Siemens, Estée Lauder, & Janssen.   She's been featured as a subject matter expert in Vogue, the BBC, CNBC, Inc., and in LinkedIn's 2022 Top 10 Voices on Mental Health. Having lived abroad in South Korea, England, Australia and traveled to 45+ countries, Melissa calls upon her global experiences to inform how she works with companies around the world. She has one core goal: to equip companies, individuals, and leaders to have constructive conversations about mental health in the workplace. Her work and book aim to accomplish just that.

In this HCI Podcast episode, Dr. Jonathan H. Westover talks with Melissa Doman about building the skill set, mindset, and behaviors required to discuss mental health, mental illness, and stress at work. Melissa Doman, MA (https://www.linkedin.com/in/melissadoman1) is an ​​Organizational Psychologist, Former Clinical Mental Health Therapist, & Author of Yes, You Can Talk About Mental Health at Work (Here's Why And How To Do It Really Well). Melissa works with companies across industries around the globe – including clients like Google, Dow Jones, Microsoft, Salesforce, Siemens, Estée Lauder, & Janssen. She's been featured as a subject matter expert in Vogue, the BBC, CNBC, Inc., and in LinkedIn's 2022 Top 10 Voices on Mental Health. Having lived abroad in South Korea, England, Australia and traveled to 45+ countries, Melissa calls upon her global experiences to inform how she works with companies around the world. She has one core goal: to equip companies, individuals, and leaders to have constructive conversations about mental health in the workplace. Her work and book aim to accomplish just that. Please consider supporting the podcast on Patreon and leaving a review wherever you listen to your podcasts! This episode is sponsored by/brought to you by BetterHelp. Give online therapy a try at www.BetterHelp.com/HCI and get on your way to being your best self. Check out Ka'Chava at www.Kachava.com/HCI. Check out BELAY here. Check out the HCI Academy: Courses, Micro-Credentials, and Certificates to Upskill and Reskill for the Future of Work! Check out the LinkedIn Alchemizing Human Capital Newsletter. Check out Dr. Westover's book, The Future Leader. Check out Dr. Westover's book, 'Bluer than Indigo' Leadership. Check out Dr. Westover's book, The Alchemy of Truly Remarkable Leadership. Check out the latest issue of the Human Capital Leadership magazine. Each HCI Podcast episode (Program, ID No. 592296) has been approved for 0.50 HR (General) recertification credit hours toward aPHR™, aPHRi™, PHR®, PHRca®, SPHR®, GPHR®, PHRi™ and SPHRi™ recertification through HR Certification Institute® (HRCI®). Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Melissa Doman is a special needs sleep coach and a child brain develop-mentalist. In 2009 she started training as a DOMAN method coach. She now works with children using the DOMAN Method which helps develop children with special needs. Each day, she saw kids who had come from blindness to seeing and reading, from complete immobility to crawling and walking, and more! You can find Melissa here https://www.melissadomansleepconsulting.com/about-melissa/ and also on her instagram https://instagram.com/specialneedssleepcoach?igshid=YmMyMTA2M2Y= here is the book on thr Doman Method on Amazon The Doman Method: From Special Needs to Wellness (The Doman Method® Series) https://amzn.eu/d/ejb3KkK

Yes, You Can Talk About Mental Health at Work. That's the name of Melissa Doman's book, which provides guidance on how to do exactly that, really well. After realizing the common denominator between all her patients was none of them felt they could talk about their mental well-being at their jobs, Melissa left her clinical psychology practice to combat the problem at its source. In this episode, Melissa shares how she's changing the system one business at a time and empowering people to have constructive conversations about mental health. As you listen, you'll hear why we need to go farther than awareness—it's about learning how to share with purpose when integrating personal conversations into professional settings. Quick Links: Connect with Melissa: https://www.linkedin.com/in/melissadoman1/ Learn more about Melissa's work: https://melissadoman.com Connect with Andrea: https://www.linkedin.com/in/leaderdevelopmentcoach Learn more about HRD: https://hrdleadership.com/

Laurie Battaglia is CEO of Aligned at Work and her personal mission it to wake up leaders of organizations who think they can delay inevitable change. She is a futurist, a strategist, and a connector of people and resources. She believes in balancing people and profit in business for a sustainable future. A lot of times we think in terms of our teams needing either leadership training or diversity training when in reality they are the same thing. Great leaders must have an eye on diversity and inclusion because people coming into the workforce expect that. It's no longer a "nice to have." It must be integrated into the workplace. So in this episode we're talking about Diversity, Equity and Inclusion (DEI) and how it intersects with leadership and management. What you will learn ... It's about more than hiring diverse people; it's about including them. How inclusion has evolved into belonging What is JEDI (and it has nothing to do with Star Wars!) How you can become a JEDI leader in your organization Why it's important to have experiences, be an observer, before you have an opinion Resources [BOOK] Belonging At Work: Everyday Actions You Can Take to Cultivate an Inclusive Organization by Rhodes Perry, MPA [BOOK] Yes, You Can Talk About Mental Health at Work: Here's Why ... and How to Do it Really Well by Melissa Doman, MA Belonging At Work Summit (online DEI event): https://www.belongingatworksummit.com/ Laurie's Website: https://alignedatwork.com/ LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lauriebattaglia/ Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/alignedatwork/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/alignedatwork YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC95fhX57K2BQAQ7WvdQrdvg Get the full show notes and more information here: https://unleashedconsult.com/podcast/ Please click the button to subscribe so you don't miss any episodes and leave a review if your favorite podcast app has that ability. Thank you! © 2022 Danny Ceballos

On this encore episode of the Psychology Talk Podcast Dr. Hoye is joined by Melissa Doman. Melissa is an Organizational Psychologist, Former Clinical Mental Health Therapist, and Author who specializes in mental health at work.Melissa has presented and consulted for international, national, and local organizations and Fortune 500companies across industries and globally, including clients like: Estée Lauder, Salesforce, Siemens, Janssen, Charlotte Tilbury, Bumble and bumble, Legal & General, and many more. Melissa holds an M.A. in Counseling Psychology from Adler University and a B.A. in Sociology with a minor in Communications from The George Washington University. Melissa and Dr. Hoye discuss her new book, “Yes, You Can Talk About Mental Health at Work, Here's Why, and How to do it Really Well.” Melissa's book covers:* How we bring our beliefs and experiences around mental health and mental illness into the workplace* The importance of understanding how the language we use, consciously or unconsciously, impacts our interactions with others* Ways to manage the challenges around having mental health conversations at work* Step-by-step ‘how-to' conversation guides, alongside practical tools Concrete tips on ways to action this education, individually or at a team levelMelissa's Website/Book Link: https://melissadoman.com/yes-you-can-talk-about-mental-health-at-work-bookThe Psychology Talk Podcast is a unique conversation about psychology around the globe. Your host Dr. Scott Hoye discuss psychology with mental health practitioners and experts to keep you informed about issues and trends in the industry. They also tackle mental health trends and issues in their home: Chicago.https://psych-talk.comhttps://www.instagram.com/psychtalkpodcast/

As we round out May and Mental Health Awareness Month, I am so excited to share with you a conversation with Melissa Doman where we discuss how to identify your mental wellbeing non-negotiables, the role personal accountability plays in mental health, and if you need it - a kind kick in the ass from Mel to empower you to care for yourself and your wellbeing on a daily basis.Mel is an organizational psychologist and the author of the book, Yes, You Can Talk About Mental Health at Work (Here's Why and How to Do it Really Well), and her mission is to teach companies, individuals, and leaders how to have constructive conversations about mental health in the workplace.So friend, join us now as Mel and I talk about how to have constructive conversations about mental health in the workplace and at home.P.S. If you would love a chance to win a copy of Mel's book, Yes, You Can Talk About Mental Health at Work, then head over to Instagram and join the giveaway in my stories!ResourcesFull Show NotesJoin the LBD Collective Open House (for free!)Love LetterLBD Collective Health Coaching Services @mskatehouse Connect with Mel DomanMelissa Doman@thewanderingmel LinkedInMel's ResourcesYes, You Can Talk About Mental Health at Work, (Here's Why and How to Do it Really Well)The Subtle Art of Not Giving a F*ck: A Counterintuitive Approach to Living a Good Life by Mark MansonMindset: The New Psychology of Success by Carol S Dweck

How was your lunch today? Did you take time to get outside or did you work right through it? Clare and LL recap a powerful conversation around workplace wellness and well being shaming. Listen to determine your game plan for balancing your workday and setting boundaries in your daily life. If you have any questions about this episode or want to get some of the resources we mentioned, head over to LesleyLogan.co/podcast. If you have any comments or questions about the Be It pod shoot us a message at beit@lesleylogan.co . And as always, if you're enjoying the show please share it with someone who you think would enjoy it as well. It is your continued support that will help us continue to help others. Thank you so much! Never miss another show by subscribing at LesleyLogan.co/subscribe.In this episode you will learn about:Check in to LL hobbies The comeback to well being shaming Personal recognization of mental health in the workplace Starting the workplace wellness conversation Setting the correct boundaries, even outside workWhat envy really tells you Episode References/Links:Book: Yes, You Can Talk About Mental Health at Work: Here's Why and How to Do it Really Well.  If you enjoyed this episode, make sure and give us a five star rating and leave us a review on iTunes, Podcast Addict, Podchaser or Castbox.ResourcesWatch the Be It Till You See It podcast on YouTube!Lesley Logan websiteBe It Till You See It PodcastOnline Pilates Classes by Lesley LoganOnline Pilates Classes by Lesley Logan on YouTubeProfitable PilatesSocial MediaInstagramFacebookLinkedInEpisode Transcript:Lesley Logan 0:01  Welcome to the Be It Till You See It podcast where, we talk about taking messy action, knowing that perfect is boring. I'm Lesley Logan, Pilates instructor and fitness business coach. I've trained thousands of people around the world and the number one thing I see stopping people from achieving anything is self doubt. My friends, action brings clarity and it's the antidote to fear. Each week, my guests will bring Bold, Executable, Intrinsic and Targeted steps that you can use to put yourself first and Be It Till You See It. It's a practice, not a perfect. Let's get started.All right, everyone. Welcome back to the Be It Till You See interview recap where my co host is my bestie, Clare Solly. She's back and we are going to dig into a real talk convo I had with Melissa Doman in our last episode. If you haven't yet listened to interview, go back, listen to it. Oh my gosh, it is so fired up. So fun. Like it's probably the most fired up, you'll hear anyone when they're talking about mental health, awareness and well being shaming. So then you can go back, listen to that one, come back and join us. You can listen to Clare and I riff on it and then go back. But Clare Solly, my slingshot friend, if you're on the YouTube channel, you saw the necklace she's wearing. She is one it was our guests on episode 19. She's done a couple of recaps with us. And that's because Brad is currently in Cambodia while we're recording this. So, Clare, thanks for being here.Clare Solly 1:34  Hi, thanks for having me back. I'm excited. I'm remote from New York this time. I was remote from North Carolina the last year two times.Lesley Logan 1:42  I know. It's we're just like catching you wherever. And it's so fun. And also I'm just really I'm excited that you got to be, you get to listen to this. So y'all, this is the first recap we're doing right after the interview (Clare: Right after.) So normally it gets produced there's a whole thing. We listened to it a couple more times, we talk about it, because we wanted to get Melissa on and to get this episode to your ears during Mental Health Awareness Month while you're thinking about it. I should be thinking about it all the time. But while everyone's actually thinking about it right now, we had to do a little fun like, this is a trial. So we'll hear how it goes. You let us know how we're doing on this recap. So anyways, thanks for being here. Real quick, everyone, June 5th is the start of the Control Your Balance Challenge. So this is a free challenge where I am actually helping people who own a reformer or other Pilates equipment, do a more advanced exercise and that doesn't mean that you have to have it down by the end of the week. We don't do perfect, we do progress. But if you are scared to do a control balance off on the reformer or control balance on the mat because it is weird. It's a somersault into an arabesque and somersaulting back on I hear ya, not a dancer. Those words made no sense to me when I was learning it, but I'm here to help break it down. My OPC teachers are joining us so you can go to onlinepilatesclasses.com to sign up for this challenge. Again, it's free and it's one week long, and you're gonna get lots of different classes, tips and tools to do some advanced scary work. So anyways, that's next week and alright, Clare, we normally have an audience question, but something tells me you are resurfacing that?Clare Solly 3:19  Yes, since I am a guest hostess. I have a question for you. You and I've been chatting a bunch lately. I know that you're doing the author's way, no, The Artist's Way. (Lesley: The Artist's Way) So you and it's funny every time you talk about this, it makes me giggle because I think you're a person that always does all the things. But I want to, I want to check in on your hobbies you were testing out new hobbies. So the question is, do you have a new favorite hobby yet? And what is it or do you have a hobby that you will never do or that you just experienced recently?Lesley Logan 3:55  That's a good question. So I have to say I tested out this hobby of laying by the pool and I loved that. (Lesley and Clare laughs) No, I was at a cabana and people were bringing me all the things and so there is something really luxurious about that but I have to say I don't know if you'd call it a hobby more as a habit but I want to make sure that once a month I am laying poolside somewhere if that means I have to get a hotel pass in my local area, I will. I just went to a casino yesterday and they did not need my hotel room key and I won't say which hotel it was because I don't want to blow their cover. But I know and I'm going to be using that pool (Lesley laughs) so that's not my hobby. I will say I enjoyed the macro may that was really fun. I was supposed ... do a loom thing, someone was gonna let me borrow their loom and I have not been able to get my hands on that yet but I really do like the idea of it. I think I'm where I'm currently in my life, I'm having fun dabbling, but I'm not ready to commit anything yet because I'm also enjoying doing nothing. And something about hobbies is it's easy for me to busy myself with them. And I'm really trying to get a mental health. I'm really, really trying to make sure that I'm actually spending time with myself and not just like being busy all the time. So currently I do like the lira. It's painful. It's fun, makes me feel really cool. I do like little macro may but I'm not ready to go and like go to the craft shop and invest in anything or buy a group pass yet.Clare Solly 5:29  I mean, my mom's favorite hobby is napping. So I think between your pool side and her napping, (Lesley: Yeah) I am a fan. Lesley Logan 5:37  Yeah, you're like I'm in for both. I'm in for both. So anyways, I would love to hear what people are doing for their hobbies because I think it's it's fun to see what people call a hobby and like how it can be beneficial. And also like, knitting can also be a great way to decompress, too. So I just, yeah, I right now I'm just trying to make sure that I'm not overworking myself, even with my hobbies.Clare Solly 5:59  And if you have suggestions for Lesley, tag her at the @be_it_pod on Instagram. (Lesley: Yeah) ... doing your hobbies. (Lesley: Yeah) Um,Lesley Logan 6:06  What's your favorite hobby, though? Is it writing? (Clare: Mine?) Well, you were, you write for work. That's not talking.Clare Solly 6:11  I mean, hmm. I don't know. I mean, I feel like like, and this is why I giggle whenever you say it, because I feel like anything that we start out trying as a hobby ends up being we find a way to make money out of it. (Clare laughs) So I would say like writing is my hobby, but I feel like it's like it's a side profession at the moment. (Lesley: Yeah) Um, I feel you know, what my favorite hobbies got to be reading. Like, I've always been an avid voracious reader. Especially like, I'm a self help junkie. So I'll go read a self help book, just like to see if I'm in alignment and whatever. (Lesley: Yeah) Or like, I love a good romance, like goofy (Lesley: Yeah) like, you know, My Best Friend's Wedding. Like those kinds of rom-commie, (Lesley: Yeah) you know, Bridgerton I'll read all that stuff. So,Lesley Logan 7:00  Yeah, I do love, I love to read. You know, you just made me remember that one thing that I've, again, I'll end up making money out of it. But one thing that I want to have the time for, and I'm trying to build our schedule around so it's not really a hobby as much as it's like a goal to do something is, I really want to be a tequila sommelier and there is tequila school in Mexico. And I found a school that has like, one month, six week, eight week, three months, programs. You better believe I've researched like how do I buy a rental house there? How many dogs can I have at it? How can Brad and I live in Mexico while I do Visionary Officer learns about tequila. (Lesley laughs)Clare Solly 7:38  Oh my gosh. I can see the future of Pilates retreats. Take Pilates by day and takes tequila by night. Lesley Logan 7:45  The tequila and Pilates. Yeah. Feela tequila. That's what we call it. (Lesley and Clare laughs)Clare Solly 7:51  Alright, sign up below.Lesley Logan 7:54  Anyways, let's talk about Melissa Doman.Clare Solly 7:56  Melissa. I would love to talk about Melissa Doman. This was so exciting me hear this in real time, like I was jumping up and down in the background. While I was taking notes on YouTube, we're talking. Melissa Doman is an Organizational Psychologist, a Former Clinical Medical Health Therapist and Author of a book you need to write down and get in the show notes. Yes, You Can Talk About Mental Health at Work (Here's Why And How To Do It Really Well). Melissa works with companies and across industries around the globe, including small companies you might not have heard of like Microsoft, Estée Lauder, Salesforce, Siemens. She's been featured featured in magazines and articles on, in Vogue and on the BBC and CNBC, about the great resignation, mental health at work conversations about the Ukraine crisis and more. This woman has lived all around the world and it was just, it's an amazing conversation. So definitely go listen to it again ...Lesley Logan 8:56  Yeah. I agree, I really am so grateful. She said yes. Because I think that I mean, it's so easy to find people who like, "Yeah, let's talk about mental health." And she's like, fired up. She's like, "We all gonna be talking about mental health. Here's mine." I mean, she like literally is leavi... living, speaking breathing version of her book, I believe.Clare Solly 9:14  Yeah, well, that was nice. Because I didn't feel shamed when she was talking about I felt, I ... energized like (Lesley: Yeah) these are the things I'm going to go be proactive about. Anyway, sorry, I'm getting ahead of myself. What was your favorite thing that she mentioned?Lesley Logan 9:29  Okay, so you have to write this down. I even said it in the in the episode, I said wri... everyone go to the show notes and write this down. By the way on the lesleylogan.co site, we have all the transcripts so you can actually just like copy and paste things that you love that people say by the way, hint, hint, text it to yourself, text it to a friend. So one thing I loved that she said was well being sha... on well being shaming, doing things so let's say somebody basically it's like if somebody like says, "Oh, must be nice, you get to leave work earlier. Must be nice, you could go on a run on your lunch break." That's that's well being shaming. And so she says your response should be, "Doing things to manage my well being practices a healthy adult thing to do. Can you help me understand why you don't agree?" And I just love this because I'm sure you're like, "Oh my God, I have to stand up for myself. Oh my God, do this." But, you know, if they're like that, it's because someone else made, showed them that and like embodied that and implify and showed that and they saw people getting rewarded for that. And you can actually be the person that says, "This is actually, this is actually not a must be nice thing. This is actually how I show up and be your coworker. Can you tell me why that's a problem?" And they might a solid healthy person might go, "Oh, wow, that's really cool." And you know, some people won't change, but I just really, I really liked that she brought that up. And I love that she gave us a comeback for those well being shamers.Clare Solly 10:52  Yeah, well, um, this this goes with what I was saying to I mean, she mentioned that she's a recovering people pleaser, which I'm... That was one of the things I was like, "Yes, me, me." So yeah, I totally understand that. And like, it's, there's ways to reframe where you're not apologizing, you're not. Because anytime you apologize, that's you trying to people, please. And if you reframe it, and put it out there, like, "This is who I am," then, then you're not trying to make others pleased by anything. And that sort of goes along with that the thing that I took from it. (Lesley: Yeah. What's your thing?) Mine was, you people need to understand or there's an understanding of that people have different levels of needs and ways they work. And also, part of that, too, is people don't know what you need unless you tell them. So (Lesley: Yeah) ... this is part of the conversation about like, the email after work, and I'm one of those people like I panic, when I'm like, "Oh, my gosh, my boss sent me an email (because I work in corporate America). My boss sent me an email, I need to respond to it right now. And it's like, no, she was just sending it right then because it was on her mind right then." (Lesley: Right) And I, it wasn't until I had the conversation with her like three months in that I I didn't understand that she just needed to get it out of her brain. She didn't need me to respond. She just needed to let go of it.Lesley Logan 12:12  Yeah, yeah. And that's, and like of course, she would assume that because she's emailing you. But that's something like I, you know, I try to do with our team is like, I mean, we have people live all over the world. So we're going to talk on Slack, Monday and email all day long. So the assumption is, you don't need to respond. Unless I say it's an emergency, I can't find this thing. But then I'll probably just call you if it's an actual emergency, I'm just gonna pick up the phone and be like, "I'm so sorry, I am calling you after work hours. I can't find this thing." I've had to do that twice before. And I felt like a jerk. But I was just like, "I'm really sorry, this is I just need two seconds of emergency. I can't find this thing." And most people don't mind that because it's respectful of their time. But I also you know, I've had people who've responded to me after hours when I've said something. And I was like, "Oh, I didn't, I didn't realize you worked this late. Is everything, okay?" (Clare: Oh, that's a good one.) Because I don't want the team to be a bunch of workhorses. I want them, you know, I want them to get their job done. And they should be able to get it done. And the amount of hours we've we've allotted for it. And if they can't, I want them to let me know. So that we can figure that out because some things can be automated that they were doing, right? But it does require the the you telling your boss, "Hey, it stresses me out when you email me at 8pm." And then your boss going, "Oh, I'm just, this I was just thinking about it. I didn't actually expect you're..." Like, you know, we make assumptions. And so it's like we have to have, we're human beings have to have a conversation. And I love that Melissa talked about that so many times in and it's like, be clear, be kind and like tell people what you need and why why you need it. Yeah.Clare Solly 13:51  Yeah. And again, like, I know, you mentioned in the pod in the recording, that, you know, you're a small business owner, you have several people that listen to this podcast that are small business owners. I think a good piece of advice for anybody who owns their own business, is to make sure you leave the door open for questions to be asked. You know, for anybody that works for you, so that way if it you know if you get to a point, because again, unless the door is opened, like I didn't know that I was, you know, having to ask questions. (Lesley: Right) But then also people like me who work four bosses, like ask the questions like tell people what you need, and ask what the expectation is.Well, for example, one of our team members had came to me and she said, "I'm can... I'm actually over my hours every single week." and I was like, "Oh, how long have you been this way?" She's like, "four months" and I was like, "Okay. In the future, if it goes on longer than a week to two weeks, can you just like pipe in and say, 'hello, I'm heading over my hours. I'm being overworked.' We don't know. All we know as you're getting your work done. You know, (Clare: Yeah) so I hate that that happened. I feel terribly about it, let's fix it. And also I ca... so this doesn't happen the future, here's how it needs to be so that we can support you." And and that's, you know, it's it basically it's like, unless someone's a total dickhead, both people have to have a conversation about where the line got crossed, and who allowed who to cross it, who crossed it, and how do we not cross it again. (Lesley laughs)Yeah. Well and she talked about having the moment of like, blowing up or exploding, and like, you have to do the prep work before that. And it's, you know, conversations like this are scary conversations until you have them. And then after you've had them like, again, it's it's anything else. It's it's practice. (Lesley: Yeah) So just have the conversation. A lot of times some people will respect you more on the other side for having the conversation.Lesley Logan 15:51  Yeah. And also, if it doesn't go the way you want, well, now, you know, and you're not wasting any more time. Like going, "Oh, my God, they don't listen to me. They don't do this." It's like, yep, they don't listen to me. And I now have to decide if this is a place that I want to work at. Or, you know, where do I want to take my expertise? And what team do I want to be part of, you know, so yeah.Clare Solly 16:15  And perfect. Speaking of taking your expertise, places, should we get in this BE IT action items? (Lesley: Yes, I love these.) All right, so let's talk about what bold, executable, intrinsic or targeted action items can we take away from your conversation? I took away and I loved the way she phrased this. And she said it a couple of times, the crucial conversational literacy, everyone needs to have a modicum of knowledge about mental health in the workplace. I (Lesley: Yeah) just thought that was just a like, "Go out and make sure you understand who you are, and what rights you have in your workplace to create a safe and a good working environment for you mentally. "Lesley Logan 17:02  Right. Like, I love that because it's like, we can't see those people who work for someone, you can't expect your bosses to be enlightened around to this. And like, literally look out for every moment of your mental health and well being while they're running a business. And bosses, you can't expect your team to come at you with all their mental health stuff and actually speak up you have like everybody has to be educated for what they're about what educated in their roles and where they need to go when, when they need some mental health and well being support, or some education or some needs. And so I think it's like, it really does require and she said this in the thing, like we have to come together as a team, and we have to actually go, "What does that look like? Why do we care about that?"Clare Solly 17:46  Yeah, and, and, you know, unless you're starting the conversation, and actually this is a this can start at water coolers, like this can start at the kitchen, this can start as you're waiting to join a Zoom meeting, like or as you're waiting for everybody to join a Zoom meeting, just start chatting about mental health in the workplace. Like, the more we bring this to the forefront. Even if you feel like you're not affected at this moment, the more we talk about it, the more we make other people comfortable about the conversation and empower them to go have the conversation if they need to.Lesley Logan 18:19  Yeah, well and also like this moment is like if you're not being impacted in this moment with your mental health, this is the best time to have those conversations. (Clare and Lesley laughs) You can then actually have it and you're not like what she said when she had her fuzzy brain like, "We're trying to stay alive and this part is like waaa. (Clare: Yeah) I'm overwhelmed. No one is listening to me." (Clare: Yeah) So I yeah, I think it's like the what I really love is like we, she in no way are the leaders in the company is to blame for mental health in the company but also in no way are the employees scot free and like we all have to take part in owning our mental health and well being, being clear on what we need and asking for it. And understanding that they're going to have ask and requests where they are and somewhere in the middle we all have to meet and if we can't, then you may have to like ask yourself, what else or options do I have that might not be the right place for you? And that's okay, too.Clare Solly 19:17  Yeah, yeah. So just start the conversation. Lesley, what was your BE IT action item?Lesley Logan 19:22  So she first of all what I love is just like take action. You have to take action. Like and hello, action brings clarity, it's the antidote to fear. So especially if you're scared to talk about mental health at work, take one of these actions and and I just want, I just like the simplest thing is like read her book and I know it's for mental health in the workplace. And I know a lot of you might work for yourself or you might work in a small team, but I feel like within a family it's really important to be like I feel to me families are another business like they all, they have bills, there needs to be a lot of income we have goals and vacation these things, right. So like to talk about you can implement these things. And I think it's really important because sometimes someone in the family is gonna be going through something. And it's going to require the whole family to be like, "Okay, what do you need right now to help you get through this busy time?" Like, that's really, you know, like when we're really crazy in a launch, we actually have to tell everyone in our Vegas family, "Hey, here's the deal, we are in a crazy time right now. That means no extra dogs can be here. That means we're having dinner delivered. If you want to come over for dinner, you have to leave after dinner." Like ...Clare Solly 20:27  You even message me sometimes you're like, "Hey, girl, I'm not gonna be able to talk this next week, because (Lesley: Yeah) I got a launch going on." (Clare laughs)Lesley Logan 20:34  Yeah, yeah. And also like learning to say that so that I don't get pissed off when people are bothering me. I'm like, well, they don't know. They don't know. And so read this book, everyone, it's that's in the show notes. I'm really, really am excited about what what she is doing. And I really think that the more responsibility we can take for ourselves in our mental health, the easier it is for us to ask for that at work, to ask for that with our partner, to ask for that from ourselves. And then and then we can really change the world. You know, in this way, I just, I really believe in it. So but it does mean that we all have to take responsibility for taking care of ourselves and understanding what our mental health and well being needs are and stop shaming people. Like if you say, please, please, please remove this. If you say it "must be nice for her", even in your head about something that they're doing. Let that be a flashlight to something that you wish you were doing for yourself. People who have boundaries are not rude. They're not bitches. They are people who have had I need these boundaries in my life. I get people who say I asked people, they said I was really cold. Because, you know, they came to visit and I only was available for like, a window of time. And I'm like, "Okay, if I had made myself available to you the whole time, I you would have hated me because I have to, there are things I have to do. So that I can show up and be this person. I'm not this person every like, like, I'm not like a light switch." (Lesley laughs) You know? So I think we have to we all ... with this wasn't a BE IT action item, but I'm making it one. Watch the well being shaming you have towards yourself, your friends, your co workers, because you use it as a flashlight of what you're actually needing in your life and, and actually see them as like, "Oh, wow, look at that person taking care of themselves." Like what if we saw that in people instead of like judging it?Clare Solly 22:22  Yeah, that's great. That's so great. (Lesley: Yeah) In, in a, in acting school, we always, we weren't supposed to like pick apart people we were, we were supposed to say, "I wish you would do da da da," instead. So it turns into a positive. (Lesley: Oh) But I like yours better. I like flashlight for yourself better. (Lesley: flashlight)Lesley Logan 22:41  Yeah, I like well, you know, I like I think it was my therapist, I was really, I got upset at myself for how I handled something. And she goes, "The problem is not how you handled it. The problem is the judgment you have toward yourself." (Clare: Yeah) Whenever you are like this see as a flashlight of where you still have to do the work. And I was like, "There's more work." (Lesley laughs) (Clare: Yeah ...) There's more work to be done. But I think you know, it's like, whenever you're envious of somebody, there's a flashlight of something you're really wanting for yourself. And maybe you didn't know that. So like, "Oh, thank you so and so for letting me know, I really want to be going for a run on my lunch break. Or I want time on my lunch break for myself." So Clare, I'm so excited. You got to be part of this. (Clare: Yehey) I'm gonna make... and Brad needs to listen to this obvious because we have a company but you you are on the other side of this. So I like have a company, you work for companies and I have to do a little shout out. Because you the first time we had you on the podcast, you were manifesting a job and you got a job offer with like more money than like whatever you (Clare: Yeah) asked for. Right? And then so that was like in your whole episode like manifesting money and then ... two weeks ago you were like manifesting a new job and we were doing manifesting stuff and not only did you get a new job, you got a really frickin awesome job. And you got paid more money than you asked for. (Lesley laughs)Clare Solly 24:05  Yeah, I was I was told by the recruiter. No, no, they don't pay over this amount. And they're paying me, they offered me more than the amount that they told me the more than I was asking for more than they told me that they wouldn't. So it was ...Lesley Logan 24:21  Yeah. (Clare: manifesting) So... Manifest. So Clare Solly, you can find her on Instagram at @youwontbesolly and so you can find her, she does manifestation stuff. She's a writer, she's got books, she teaches you how to write. So make sure you check all those things out but also like she is a prime example. To me, I just heard this and I feel like you're the walking example of that. Like don't take a 'no' from a person who can't give you a 'yes'. Right? Because like you could have listened that recruiter and you could have been like, "Okay, I'm just gonna get this and that's fine." But instead you like went into it like, "I'm still I'm open to receiving all that is there and this is what I want. And this is like in my dream world. And I like and here and here's more. And here's all of this and here's we're gonna guarantee you." And like (Lesley and Clare laughs) it exists out there. So y'all don't take a 'no' from someone who can't give you a 'yes', manifest (Clare: Yeah) what you want, and it'll be ... You had clarity and a vision around it. And that's why it comes to you.Clare Solly 25:18  Yeah, exactly. And it sometimes shows up in different ways. Like, it's not a straightforward way, sometimes like mine was very straightforward. But sometimes it comes at you at different directions. So manifest what you want, and it'll show up.Lesley Logan 25:30  Oh, I love you so much. Thanks for being my slingshot, buddy.Clare Solly 25:34  I love you. Thank you for being my slingshot, friend. I'm so glad we do things like this together.Lesley Logan 25:39  I know and also everyone let us know how you enjoyed this recap where we went off the fly straight off of ... Amanda and Brad will let us know how we did. (Lesley and Clare laughs) We're just here being it till we see it and you should do the same. So y'all what were your favorite takeaways? What are your BE IT action items? Are you going to read a Melissa's book? Let us know by screenshotting this. Tag the @be_it_pod, tag @youwontbesolly, tag Melissa Doman, the @wanderingmel. And let us know how the this impacted you and what you're going to do about mental health and well being in your life. Until next time, Be It Till You See It.That's all I got for this episode of the Be It Till You See It podcast. One thing that would help both myself and future listeners is for you to rate the show and leave a review. And follow or subscribe for free wherever you listen to your podcast. Also, make sure to introduce yourself over at the @be_it_pod on Instagram. I would love to know more about you. Share this episode with whoever you think needs to hear it. Help us and others BE IT TILL YOU SEE IT. Have an awesome day!'Be It Till You See It' is a production of 'As The Crows Fly Media'.Brad Crowell 26:49  It's written produced, filmed and recorded by your host Lesley Logan and me, Brad Crowell. Our Associate Producer is Amanda Frattarelli.Lesley Logan 27:00  Kevin Perez at Disenyo handles all of our audio editing.Brad Crowell 27:04  Our theme music is by Ali at APEX Production Music. And our branding by designer and artist, Gianfranco Cioffi.Lesley Logan 27:12  Special thanks to our designer Jaira Mandal for creating all of our visuals (which you can't see because this is a podcast) and our digital producer, Jay Pedroso for editing all video each week so you can.Brad Crowell 27:25  And to Angelina Herico for transcribing each of our episodes so you can find them on our website. And, finally to Meridith Crowell for keeping us all on point and on time.Transcribed by https://otter.aiSupport this podcast at — https://redcircle.com/be-it-till-you-see-it/donationsAdvertising Inquiries: https://redcircle.com/brandsPrivacy & Opt-Out: https://redcircle.com/privacy

As a society, our daily lives are made up of moments in the office, staring at a computer screen, communicating with our coworkers, just simply working. In honor of mental health awareness month, Melissa Doman, an Organizational Psychologist and author brings to light real conversations that can help improve your workplace wellness and tips to achieve a better work-life balance.  If you have any questions about this episode or want to get some of the resources we mentioned, head over to LesleyLogan.co/podcast. If you have any comments or questions about the Be It pod shoot us a message at beit@lesleylogan.co . And as always, if you're enjoying the show please share it with someone who you think would enjoy it as well. It is your continued support that will help us continue to help others. Thank you so much! Never miss another show by subscribing at LesleyLogan.co/subscribe.In this episode you will learn about:Learning the new language of mental health at workWell Being shaming How to communicate what you need The gender stereotype in the workplaceIntention vs. impact * Talking about how people need to be clear about intentionFinding the what workplace wellness looks likeWho the best person to encourage you in workplace health?BIO: Melissa Doman, MA is an Organizational Psychologist, Former Clinical Mental Health Therapist, & Author of Yes, You Can Talk About Mental Health at Work (Here's Why And How To Do It Really Well). Melissa works with companies across industries around the globe – including clients like Microsoft, Salesforce, Siemens, Estée Lauder, & Janssen. She's been featured as a subject matter expert in Vogue, the BBC, CNBC, and Inc. Magazine about the Great Resignation, mental health at work conversations about the Ukraine Crisis, and more. Having lived abroad in South Korea, England, Australia and traveled to 45+ countries, Melissa calls upon her global experiences to inform how she works with companies around the world. She has one core goal: to equip companies, individuals, and leaders to have constructive conversations about mental health in the workplace. Her work and book aim to accomplish just that. To learn more about Melissa, her work, or the book - please visit www.melissadoman.comEpisode References/Links:InstagramBook: Yes, You Can Talk About Mental Health at Work: Here's Why and How to Do it Really Well  If you enjoyed this episode, make sure and give us a five star rating and leave us a review on iTunes, Podcast Addict, Podchaser or Castbox.ResourcesWatch the Be It Till You See It podcast on YouTube!Lesley Logan websiteBe It Till You See It PodcastOnline Pilates Classes by Lesley LoganOnline Pilates Classes by Lesley Logan on YouTubeProfitable PilatesSocial MediaInstagramFacebookLinkedInEpisode Transcript:Lesley Logan 00:00Hey, Be It it listener. Well, we had to have to put this woman on this particular month and we worked move mountains to get MST and EST and PST timezones to collide in order for us to get you this guest. And so first of all, thank you for listening to Be It pod, without your listens, without your reviews, without your comments and shares. We can't bring amazing guests like this. So because of you we are and I'm so grateful. I heard Melissa Doman on another podcast and I was like, "Holy frickin moly." Yes, I have to have you hear her words? Because one of the biggest things I see from people being it till they see it is not listening to your mental health and well being needs like not actually listening to them. And if you don't listen to them, then you can't be your full self. And if you can't be your full self, how are you going to be it till you see it? So, Melissa Doman is incredible. She has a book we have in the show notes. And she's going to give an honest conversation like truly honest conversation around mental health well being. What is well being changed? Why we have to stop doing it in the workplace? But also these are all tools you can use in your life. So May is Mental Health Awareness Month. I would love for us all to be more on board with her and out about our mental health throughout the year, but wanted to get her in here on this month while we're all thinking about it. So let us know what your favorite takeaways are as you listen to Melissa Doman. Welcome to the Be It Till You See It podcast, where we talk about taking messy action, knowing that perfect is boring. I'm Lesley Logan, Pilates instructor and fitness business coach. I've trained thousands of people around the world and the number one thing I see stopping people from achieving anything is self doubt. My friends, action brings clarity and it's the antidote to fear. Each week, my guests will bring Bold, Executable, Intrinsic and Targeted steps that you can use to put yourself first and Be It Till You See It. It's a practice, not a perfect. Let's get started All right, Be It listeners. I'm freakin stoked for today's guest. I have Mel Doman, Melissa Doman here today. And one, I heard this woman's amazing words about mental health well being in the workplace, and I was like, "We have to talk about this." She is an expert. And because it's May, when you listen to this is mental health awareness month. So of course we have to talk about that. But also, I just I know how, how much our mental health affects us being it till we see it. So I wanted to bring an expert in here to talk about that. Mel, let you tell everyone who you are, and what you rock at?Melissa Doman 02:39Oh, I've so been looking forward to this conversation. So, I am Melissa Doman. I am an Organizational Psychologist, former Clinical Mental Health Therapist and Author of Yes, You Can Talk About Mental Health at Work: Here's Why and How to Do it Really Well. So what I do at my core is I help organizations, leaders and individuals learn how to constructively talk about mental health at work. It's not sunshine and rainbows. It's not a dark, deep depths. It's somewhere in between, because that is the human condition. And this is not just a wellbeing thing. It's not just a DEIB thing or accessibility thing. This is a crucial, conversational, literacy development thing, period. Every person needs some modicum of ability to have these discussions in the world of work going forward, not negotiable. And so I tend to be the spoonful of honesty helps the education go down. (Lesley and Melissa laughs)Lesley Logan 03:39I love that. I mean, first of all, I love your drive towards this and your passion towards it, because ... (Melissa: Oh, thank you.) Yeah, I mean, I mean, obviously, for good reason. But also, I do think people do the dance, or they have someone come in or they hire someone in HR, and they're like, "Okay, you know, here's this" but we've we've come a long way with the with the mental health in the workplace and met people even talking about mental health with their friends and family. And we also have so much more to go. (Lesley laughs)Melissa Doman 04:09The thing is, we're trending in the right direction, you know, a bunch, a bunch, a bunch of people who came before me, laid in the groundwork for this to even be possible. So, you know, I tend to joke that I went from the back end job of being the clinical therapist, to the front end job of being the organizational psychologist who's trying to help people share their toys better in the workplace ... (Lesley laughs) Make no mistake, the workplace is just, you know, a playground, but we're all older and have different toys and there isn't a jungle gym. It just happens to be who gets to CEO. (Lesley: Yeah) So it's so, a lot of folks are trying to do what they can, when they can with what they have. But it has to be done differently. And so (Lesley: Yeah) I do all of my talks with companies or trainings or any of that, very much steeped in reality, because if you're not setting people up for the challenges of these sorts of conversations or what to do if it goes wrong, or changing the language you use, the mindset you use, you're just setting them up for failure. Right? So it has to be lead with purpose and intention, as opposed to we need to talk about it, we need to talk about it. And most people are like, "Where do I put my hands? I don't know what to do."Lesley Logan 05:30Right. They're like, "I don't know where it is. Where do I start? What's the starting point?" (Melissa: Right) And then also (Melissa: Exactly) like, I'm sure you, I'm sure a lot of people are afraid to get it wrong. Because (Melissa: Yes) and like, we're gonna get it wrong. I was just listening, re listening to Brené Brown's Dare to Lead and she says, "You're gonna screw up (Melissa: Yeah) 3,571 times trying to be empathetic." (Melissa: Yes) (Lesley laughs)Melissa Doman 05:48I have shit the bed more times than I can count. But I had to do that, to get to where I am now. (Lesley: Yeah) And so it's a slow burn. It's not like the matrix where you can plug the skill set into the back of your head overnight, although I'm sure people in biotech are working on that. (Lesley: Right) But it's going to take practice, and it's going to take mistakes, and there are literal scripts. I'm not playing, literal scripts in my book, here's what to say, here's what not to say. Here's why to say and not say those things. (Lesley: Yeah) And it's learning a new language, really.Lesley Logan 06:23Yeah. So okay, I want to I want to definitely talk about workplace and I also want to talk about because we have a lot of people who even work for themselves. So they are their own everything, (Melissa: Yeah) they're having all. And so what, what are some things that you see happening as far as like, even ? What do you see like far as like, shaming goes when people are like trying to give themselves well being like, I'm trying to like trying to get themselves balanced, and then they kind of like, you know, get in their own way of doing that. And what are some signs that they're on the right track?Melissa Doman 06:56So there's a concept that I wrote about in the book called Well Being Shaming. And the reason that I love talking about this is, it happens all the time, even now. And people just didn't know what to call it. So for example, we'll say in the before time, that if you didn't want to stay till eight o'clock in the office, and you tried to leave at five to have some sort of semblance of integration, of not living at work, and someone might say something like, "Oh, must be nice to leave at five o'clock," or "Oh, must be nice to go for a run on the lunch hour." I wish I had your easy schedule. You know what that is? Number one, that's people being just total buttheads. (Lesley: Yeah) And number two, it's just them holding up the status quo, or they're secretly jealous, and they they feel envious, that you're doing something that they can't or they're too scared to do. Or they really genuinely believe that you shouldn't be doing that. (Lesley: Yeah) And so that sort of well being shaming is unconscionably wrong, especially now. And that shit still happens, by the way, despite the fact that there's a pandemic and mental health is in the front and center of most conversations. So the response that I always tell people, to tell folks like that, who are discouraging you from engaging in healthy, reasonable practices to manage your emotional well being is as simple as this. Doing things to manage my mental health is a healthy adult practice. Can you help me understand why you don't agree? (Lesley: Ooh, I love that.) What are they gonna say? (Lesley: Right) What are they gonna say? (Lesley: Right) Right.Lesley Logan 08:36And also, like, first, they might be saying it because someone said it to them. And that's the workplace they grew up paying... (Melissa: There paying forward.) Yeah, and so they're just making sure we all gotta be, we all gotta stand this line. This is the line. This is a playground I played in. But also like, whether you're in a workplace, or, you know, family (Lesley laughs) must be nice. That, you know, I definitely get that a lot from some family members. And I know it's not a personal attack. I know it's them, not me and I ... (Melissa: It's their stuff.) It's their stuff. But it is like, yeah, okay. You don't have the weight of 25 people's payrolls on your brain, on your mind every day. This, this is what I this is what it takes for me to show up every day, so that I can be the best version of myself to pay them. (Melissa: Yeah) You know, and so I think like, that is a great, everyone it's in the show notes, write that down, copy and paste it, you can put it in text messages, or respond to (Melissa; Yes) this because we also they're never going to stop unless someone brings it to their attention that what they're doing is... (Melissa: thousand of ...) you know.Melissa Doman 08:36And and notice you're not even being defensive. You're you're making a statement and asking a question. Doing things to manage my mental health is a healthy adult practice. Can you help me understand why you don't agree? (Lesley: Yeah) That's it. And so I always tell people, please tell me how far they, their mouths dropped to the floor because they just what can you say to that?Lesley Logan 10:01Yeah. And (Melissa: So) it might, it might be exactly if they are someone who's never had this brought to their attention that they can even ask for for (Melissa: Exactly) things that support their mental health, it's going to help them see that. And if they (Melissa: Exactly) are someone who has been told this many times, they need to hear it more, they need to hear 17 to 21 touch points is how much it takes these days. So (Melissa: Oh my gosh. Yeah) isn't that crazy? Yeah. So okay, um, when people are, people listening to this are maybe thinking, "Okay, Melissa, I love this. I want to actually leave work at this time. But I don't want to feel bad about it." How do they have this conversation with a co worker? Or the or the gatekeeper (Melissa: Yeah) that that stands in their way? You know, how do they explain this to them?Melissa Doman 10:44So the challenging thing is that each workplace and even each team has their own set of kind of written and unwritten rules, so to speak. So this really depends not even on the company or the division, but the team. So you have to take this information and adapt it realistically, based on the situation you're in, there's no one size fits all. And so even now, with the fact that lots of folks are doing hybrid working, or they're doing you know, full time remote, some organizations are forcing people to go back in the office full time, which is a whole nother kettle of fish. And the thing is that it's about understanding that people have different levels of needs, people have different ways of working, different ways that energize how they work. And so it's not enough to say to someone, you know, I have to stop at five every day. There has to be, these are the reasons that I want to work this way. And this is how it's going to help me to feel good and to do good work. And so if you're going to share these sorts of things, people are not mind readers, no offense to people who believe in psychics, but I don't want to shit on anyone's beliefs. So people don't know what you need, unless you tell them. (Lesley: Yeah) Seriously, people don't know the type of help you need unless you tell them, people don't know what you want them to do with the information you share. Unless you tell them, they will fill in the blanks if you don't. (Lesley: Yeah) So if you need to say to a colleague, you know, I'm really trying not to be tethered to my email 24/7. You know, I'm gonna start putting my working hours in my email signature. And I'm going to try to honor that. And I'm going to ask that other people do as well, people do that now, where they write their working hours in their signature, and say, "I respond, you know, in these hours, if that doesn't work for you don't feel pressure to reply," and really just putting that boundary out there. And there reasonable ones, by the way, (Lesley: Yeah) And so if it's to a manager, who is like a horse blinders on, and they they wear their stress, like a badge of honor, you guys might have different expectations and needs. So it's not about pulling each other to the other side. Because when has that ever worked well, with (Lesley: Right) my human condition? The answer is never. And so just being clear about what the needs are, what the boundaries are, and being very clear about the why. And (Lesley: Yeah) also that it's not going to negatively impact because you do have a responsibility and a job. So just make it so clear that there was no room for confusion. And ask yourself, if your your, your requests are reasonable, you know, if your whole team works, you know, let's say I'm just gonna give a number nine hours a day. And you say you want to work six hours a day, that that may not be seen as reasonable, unless there are ways that you can make that up, or there has to be some sort of logic behind it, not just because you want it. (Lesley: Yeah. Right. Because it may be ...) So be practical pragmatic.Lesley Logan 13:52It may be that, that you may also just need to switch jobs then if like, if you really only can work six hours, and the the agreed (Melissa: Right) upon work schedule was nine hours, (Melissa: Right) and that's not you. And that's okay, too. It's also like, it's also goes both ways. You don't want to be shamed for your well being. But we also have to understand (Melissa: Right, they have them too.) that like, there's other expectations.Melissa Doman 14:13Right. (Lesley: Yeah) And I want to make it so clear. And I have lost track the number of times I've said this, you leaving a job, or even leaving an industry because it doesn't feel right for you anymore is not quitting. You're not giving up or any other ridiculous synonym that you might be thinking about. That's you making an emotionally intelligent decision and disengaging from something that doesn't work for you anymore. (Lesley: Yeah) It's really that simple.Lesley Logan 14:43Yeah, that's so keep that's ann I you know, if you're listening to this, and you're like, "Lesley, I don't really go into many workplaces or like I go into a studio and I leave." I feel like you can use all of this like around your family with your kids. You can say, "Hey, I would really love to play with you. I'm going to have to wait until this time and here's why." (Lesley laughs) No, their children, so good luck. But like, you, what if you talk with them.Melissa Doman 15:06Yeah but you even communicating with parents and siblings is like that, too, regardless of age. Come on. I have to be so clear with my parents when I'm like, "I don't need you to fix this for me. I just need you to listen." (Lesley: Yeah) And they just ignored it anyway. Well, what about this? Da, da, da, da is like. (Lesley and Melissa laughs)Lesley Logan 15:25Oh my God. Okay, so let's say let's like, let's tie into like people not listening or (Melissa laughs) you know the well being. What like, when it comes to, you know, our mental health well being? First of all, it does require us to have some idea of what it is that our needs are. (Melissa: Yeah) So what are what are... Do you have tools or tips that you would maybe have this in your book that you tell people, like do these things so that you can figure out what you need at your workplace? Or do these things you feel like you need in life? Yeah.Melissa Doman 15:56There is, in fact, an entire chapter dedicated to that. (Lesley: Really cool.) So it's basically an entire chapter just explaining not only how to talk about your own mental health at work, but all the pre work that you need to do. So there's a lot of self assessment that needs to go on first, before you even do that. Because oftentimes, people are driven to this point of desperation, where they need to talk about it, but because they get to that boiling point, they just word vomit all over other people. And then when people are like, well, I don't know what you want me to do weather respond the wrong way. And that's not through any fault of their own. A lot of people are conditioned to do that, that we hold it in until we go pop. (Lesley: Yeah) So the nice thing about and again, this is super practical, step by step very, you know, personalizable. Where you got to ask yourself, what are your concerns about talking about this at work? Is this your stuff? Is this an environment that you've witnessed in your organization? If you have concerns, where do those come from? And be very clear about that? If you feel unsafe talking to your manager, is that you think because you have bad past experiences with other managers? Or is your manager an asshole? You know, (Lesly: Yeah) there's so many questions, you got to ask, you know, where did these feelings come from? And then what do I want to share? Who do I want to share it with? Why do I want to share it? What do I want them to do with that information? (Lesley: That's a good question.) These are the questions. Because a lot of times like it feels like what I'm seeing is like 100% of the onus is on the listener, that's some bullshit. People need to also take some responsibility and how they pipe up and ask for help. (Lesley: Yeah) And people don't know what you need, unless you tell them. (Lesley: Yeah) And so it has to be both ways.Lesley Logan 15:58I really love that. It's, it's a both ways thing. Because I do know that like, I've been someone who like waits until it's like a boiling point. But then it's like, well, now what do I want them to do with it? And how do we ...Melissa Doman 17:42And so activated that you you don't even know the answer?Lesley Logan 17:53You don't know and so I think like, if it does come to a point where like, we have to have some enough self awareness on a daily basis to understand like, where am I at today so that... How am I receiving this? And how, what do I want people to do with it before it becomes a point where you can't even, you can't even know where to go? Yeah, Yeah, yeah.Melissa Doman 18:22Right. Because when you when you get in that state, I'm sort of nerd out for a minute if that's okay. (Lesley: Yeah) When you get in that state, and your body and brain are going into survival mode, your prefrontal cortex that makes us uniquely human, it's our personality, conscience, logic, all those adult words, that basically shuts off. So the other parts of your brain that are more geared towards survival, like the amygdala, like the fight, flight, freeze, response, and all that stuff, is all jacked up and pumping you full of adrenaline and cortisol. So when you're having those feelings, or even if you're in like a depressive episode, or you've been traumatized, or whatever it is, your ability to place a logic filter on those things is heavily diminished. So it's better to try and get a sense of what is that I actually need to ask for when you're not in that state. Because when you get in that say, it's really damn hard and that's not your fault. Your brain is like, "We can't handle that right now. Shut up. We're trying to just keep you alive." That's literally what it is, like the two parts of the brain are like, "Fuck you. No, fuck you." Lesley Logan 18:23We don't have time for this. You waited too long. You didn't ...Melissa Doman 19:39Yeah. This is why we can't have nice things.Lesley Logan 19:43Oh my God. I just pictured the brain. I feel like a cartoon character. You know, what I do also think is really important about this. I hope everyone's hearing is like you may to end up going to work and telling your ... (Lesley laughs)Melissa Doman 19:57I might have a plushy brain.Lesley Logan 19:58Or just a plushy brain. You, this is why to watch the YouTube channel, everyone ... (Melissa laughs) to be plushy brain. But we if we don't do this, so let's say, you if you do this and you go and tell your boss and your boss is like, whatever I'm not here for the mental health, we did a meeting, and that's all we're doing here, we're checking a box. (Melissa: Those people still exist, by the way.) And they do and but if you don't do this, then whenever whether or not you leave that whe... or not you think that boss is actually gonna be receptive or not, you're still taking you with you wherever you go. And you're just (Melissa: Yeah) going to repeat the same, you can have a boss that actually talks about mental health. But if you aren't practicing what that barometer feels like for you, you're going to, you're going to miss the opportunity to have a good boss who's going to listen. Right?Melissa Doman 20:43And, and the thing is, and I want to be very clear, there are a whole variety of reasons why managers do or don't talk about mental health, we cannot assume there are a keep in mind, you know, leaders are fallible creatures, like the rest of us, they're humans first, say the job second, so give them just like a teeny bit of grace. (Lesley: Yeah) And so there are a whole host of reasons that they may or may not talk about it, it doesn't mean make it right. But it could be a bit of the they don't know how to start, or they screwed it up in the past, or they're very old school. And that's just not something you talk about at work. And so there are lots of reasons for that to occur. So the only thing you really can do is not only to you know, self organize those questions I was talking about, but if it's really something they avoid, try to understand why, you know, not in like an accusatory way. But like I noticed, you really seem like you don't want to talk about this. I don't want to assume the reason. Can you can you tell me? And so I distinctly remember, and I will never forget, keep in mind, I used to work in corporate as well, I was also equally tortured by managers that I described as emotionally constipated. (Lesley laughs) (Lesley: I've been with that.) And I'll never ... Oh my gosh, putting it mildly. So I will never forget one manager in particular, where it was very clear that this person practice favorites in the team and was like, just not a psychologically safe leader. I didn't make the favorite list. So I was treated as such. And it even got to the point where this manager was trying to kind of sabotage me sometimes in some of the stuff I was doing in the business. And when I don't hide my emotions, so this person noticed on my face that I didn't look pleased. And they said, "Are you okay?" I said, "No." They said, "You want to talk about?" I said, "Yeah." So after months of being terrified of this person, because make no mistake, they were absolutely a bully. And there were other people that this person bullied. And I sat down. And the first thing I said, was and this is true, you negatively impact my mental health at and outside of work to which they said, "Well, what's your proof?"Lesley Logan 22:04That's an interesting response. That's a really weird response. What's your proof?Melissa Doman 23:04Very, very, like sociopathic if you ask me, but I don't want to like clinicalize this. And I just laid it out. And because that person who's not willing to give me what I needed, the only other choice was to draw a boundary that I was not willing to accept that behavior anymore. (Lesley: Yeah) So you may not be able to give me what I need, but you are sure as fuck not going to abuse me this way anymore. (Lesley: Yeah) And so once I was had the, the strength to stand up to this person, the overt abuse stopped. But some, some managers cannot give you and won't give you what you need, because they don't even know how to do it for themselves. Or there could be (Lesley: Right) a whole host of other reasons. But you are chronologically aged adult and need to act as such.Lesley Logan 23:58Yeah, first, I think it's like it took, it took so much courage, and like probably a boiling point to get you to, to do what you did. But I also think I probably would have been like shaking in my pants trying to do it. I know every time I set myself ...Melissa Doman 24:13I was. I have nightmares about this person.Lesley Logan 24:16Yeah, but let's talk about that because I, I feel like, I feel like that's a being raised as a woman. And I don't I don't know that. Maybe I'm wrong. Maybe maybe even people identify as males have a similar problem, like standing up to a boss. But like, I know, every time I had an abusive boss, where I felt like, "Oh, we got to be here, I actually need to work through my breaks. I need to do this." Cause that's what everyone's doing. It, I don't I remember thinking, I can't say, "I don't want to do this" or I you know, I just felt like as a as a, as a woman. I had the hard time of like standing up for myself. They might is that is it a gender thing or is it goes across the board?Melissa Doman 24:54So that's a very valid question. And the answer is kind of all the above. So there's so many factors that go into that. So obviously, there is the gender piece. And on top of that, there's also culture of origin, family of origin. Religion, there are lots of things that influence our belief as to whether we can or should stand up for ourselves. But in you know, when we're talking about gender, you know, historically, people who identify as female, were taught to be more relational, to not be boundary setting to be more flexible, to be more accommodating. What that's really code for is just people being allowed to step all over you without being sorry. (Lesley: Yeah) And on top of that, what I also noticed lots of like, super boss, bitches, who I've like the biggest respect for, is when they do put those boundaries down, or they do say their opinions. They follow it with a sorry. (Lesley: Yeah) And I just did this a few days ago to achieve level person who was one of my clients. And she kept saying, "Da, da, da, sorry, da da da, sorry, da da da, sorry." I said, "Excuse me, ma'am, you need to stop apologizing. What do you have to apologize for?" And she goes, "I know, it's a problem. "And I was like, "I'm a recovering people pleaser. (Lesley: Yeah) I know how to recognize gotta stop saying sorry. Like, you have nothing to be sorry for." And so but also, there's lots of men who struggled with that too. And sometimes you can have, you know, introversion that can also be a factor or conflict styles. That can also be a factor depending on how your conflict relationship wasn't primary caregivers, or past relationships. There are lots of things that can shape or side self permission, and how we talk about these things. But when we're talking specifically about gender, women still, in many, many circles are taught that being clear and assertive and decisive and boundary setting makes you a bitch. (Lesley: Yeah) Or makes you difficult, or whatever other ridiculous synonym. And there are some women who mask their aggression as those other things as an excuse, and we can be honest that those people exist. But generally speaking, that's not the case. (Lesley: Yeah) So it's really again, when it comes to that boundary setting and stuff like that, again, tying it back to mental health, especially as a female leader in the business because they still get shit. It's if they're like, "Well, I can you stop being so emotional, or whatever ridiculous thing that someone would say like you're a leader now you need to keep it together." Oh, my God, I can't. I have two words, Jacinda Ardern. That's it, I have nothing else to say like, she's the best. (Lesley: Yeah) And then and then it becomes talking about and managing my mental health is a healthy adult practice and something good that a leader can and should do, regardless of gender.Lesley Logan 28:09Well, I feel like that's a really amazing thing we can all think about with mental health. It's like a lot of people, there's a lot of things to think about mental health awareness month and all and everything. I think it's amazing that people are, like, I love that my father talks about he's 70 years old, like he's reading what happened to you. And he, you know, I know, it's really great. He's, I'm really, he's like, "Oh, maybe that's what's wrong with me, and my mother never helded me." And I'm like, "I'm just learning about this now. You were never held? Well, that makes a lot of sense." You know, but like, on the other side of this is a whether you're a leader or an employee in a business, when I'm the throw line here, and it's like a, you have to actually look into your own mental health first, you actually have to talk about your own well being and there can be no well being shaming of yourself so that when you (Melissa: Right) go into a workplace, now you can have an absolute bigger conversation, you can either be the the teacher that needs to be in the team, or if you are the leader, you can actually start to talk to your team about, hey, at and this team, we work, we work on, we work with mental health, I want to make sure we're we're adult well being. I want to make sure that your work schedule is working for you, as best as the company can allow it to work for it. Like we have, there has got to be a compromise. But I feel like it has to come from the person first so it can go to the team.Melissa Doman 29:25It does and on top of that, you know, I and there's an exercise for this in the book as well. I encourage every single team to have their own, "why we give a shit about mental health" sort of statement. In the team, not the company because every team is different in a company. Your own little micro ecosystems. Why do you all actually care about this? What is being flexible and giving each other some damn grace look like in this team? What does it look like when you create a culture of understanding not shaming around mental health? What does it look like when you are bandwagoning? And using things as an excuse that invalidate the story of others? And why we're not going to do that, you know, there has to be a come to Jesus very honest conversation about what those values are going to look like in practice, because oftentimes, people say, "Well, this is important." And then people go, "I don't know what that looks like." (Lesley: Right) So you got to sit down and actually work it out together. (Lesley: Yeah) It doesn't have to hurt.Lesley Logan 30:30No, it doesn't have to hurt in it. And it keeps coming back to like, do you said the questions already, but also like, why? (Melissa: Why?) ... why? Like, whether you're having a conversation with a co worker, or a family member or yourself, here's what I believe, here's what I need. And this is why I need it. And this, like, here's what we believe, as a team, this is what it looks like. And this is why we believe it.Melissa Doman 30:52And going even further than that, you know, sometimes your colleague or your manager is not the best person to help you. You have to keep in mind, they're not your therapist, they're not your psychiatrist and not your doctor, they ain't your mama. So sometimes there are certain things that your colleagues or your boss can and should help you with, and just be decent human beings. And sometimes they're not the best people to help you and you can't hold them responsible to be. (Lesley: Right) Sometimes it needs to be talking to a therapist, calling the AAP, speaking to HR, talking to your partner. And for example, when I was in clinical practice, if someone came to see me that what they were struggling with was really not in my wheelhouse. It was unethical and ineffective for me to keep treating them. So, I connect him somebody who can help them better than I can. (Lesley: Right) So it's about understanding, sometimes, you know, the folks in the workplace should be the ones to connect and support, and sometimes not.Lesley Logan 31:52Well, and sometimes it's like, you figure that out with your therapist, your partner, somebody and then you go ...Melissa Doman 31:57Or even your boss. Like the boss, "I feel like I can't be the one to help. Here are the people who can."Lesley Logan 32:02Yeah, yeah. And then, and then you can and then therefore, you can actually work it out. And you can figure out what you need. And then you can say, "Hey, here's what I need. And here's how it helps the team or here's how it helps the business or here's how it's going to help you." What compromise can we make so that my (Melissa: Right) mental health can have some, it's, you know, I do think like, we, I would love for every leader out there, including myself to be, you know, the most amazing at supporting mental health. But when you said it already, we're not mind readers, we're also human beings. There's responsibilities on everybody. So if we go with it, that everyone's doing the best they can, we all know that there are some people who could do better, but they're doing the best they can, and they're still not meeting your needs, you have to say something, because they can't know. And they probably want to help you if they can.Melissa Doman 32:48And also, there's not one way that that one person can meet all of those needs. I mean, it's just some people can't can't and won't give you what you need. And so you have to be prepared to take action of what how am I going to manage my own mental health? How am I going to manage the circumstance? How am I going to manage my expectations and my needs, who can meet these for me and who can't. And because anything short of that is just a waste of time, seriously. And so being ready to take action, because no one is responsible for managing your mental health except for you, the organization and your leader are responsible to have a duty of care and create a psychologically and physiologically safe environment for you to work. But then you need to carry the baton in terms of managing your own mental health, and you can't hold anybody else responsible. If they're terrorizing you, or bullying you or not giving you any sort of recognition or any way of meeting your needs. A conversation can happen in terms of how that's impacting you, because people are oftentimes not even aware of how they impact others. (Lesley: Yeah) But once you have that conversation, you're still responsible for how you take action to manage things, whether that's staying at that company with that person or not.Lesley Logan 34:12Right. It's like if you say you want X boundary, but then you keep letting people push into that boundary or abuse that boundary. It's ... (Melissa: Like they don't care.) They don't care. Like you still have to stand up for the boundary, like, "Hey, remember I said this is and you agreed and now you're crossing the line. If you're not going to be able to do that, then it might not be the right place for you. Or he might have to figure out another way to pull that boundary," you know, and it's hard. It's it's not easy to hold boundaries, that's for sure. But that's (Melissa: very uncomfortable) very uncomfortable, especially ... (Lesley laughs)Melissa Doman 34:44Well, people also don't like when you put down boundaries. People like to do what they want when they want.Lesley Logan 34:50Yeah, but there's also like, I do believe too that some people do want to know how to love, respect, and work with (Melissa: Yes) and you know, if they knew that every time They emailed you at five o'clock. It was actually upsetting you when they were really just emailing you because they're about to leave. They weren't expecting a response from you like, wouldn't that be a great conversation to have? It's like, "Hey, you email me every day at five o'clock, and it stresses me out." And it's like, "Oh, okay, well, I'll just have it. I'll have that boomerang to come at 6am tomorrow. When do you want email to come?" Yeah.Melissa Doman 35:18And the thing is that intention versus impact can be miles apart. And people are very creative, putting in the reasons why you did or didn't do or say something. So that is why I am just all about crystal clear, clarity, about intention.Lesley Logan 35:39Yeah. Yeah, I think that's a great, that's so great. Oh, my gosh, we could keep talking, obviously, (Melissa: forever) forever because I love you. And I love what you're talking about. (Melissa: I love you) And it's so honest, you know, like, we're not this is not a sugar coated, like, let's have a (Melissa: No) mental health, it's like to have very good mental health well being, you have to know what you want, you have to state what you want, why you need it, and then you have to be intentional about it. You know, and like, we all if we all are doing it for ourselves, it's so much easier to have that and hold that space for others. And so you can inspire other people to do it for themselves if you're doing it for you, too.Melissa Doman 36:15And the thing is, you know, human beings are naturally social creatures. We naturally lean on each other, we want to have that sense of belonging and safety and security, that is a natural human thing. It also needs to be balanced with taking some individual responsibility, that doesn't make you selfish, it doesn't mean that you're being totally isolationist and not allowed to lean on other people, you need both. And so that's why while I deeply appreciate all of the advocates and activists who have come before me saying, we need to talk about this, we need to talk about this. But then there's no practical implementation to enable people with the skill set to do so based in the reality that we all exist, not the hashtag tagable one that's created on social media. So I am a, I sometimes feel like I'm a cold splash of water to the face and a hot poker up the ass to some people. But it seems to work because they keep wanting me to talk about it. SoLesley Logan 37:16Yeah, well, I also think people just appreciate honesty, you know, like clear, kind and being honest, because it is refreshing, even if as a poker. (Melissa: Oh thank you. I appreciate that.) Melissa, where do you, where where can people find your book? Where can people talk to you more, can they hear more about how to implement this and take care of their mental health and well being?Melissa Doman 37:35So if you want someone to come in to be a sweet, swift kick in the ass to your organization, to have a better understanding of what mental health and mental illness actually are, and how to talk about it. You, well and constructively, don't be a stranger, reach out to me on my website, melissadoman.com, you can also add me on LinkedIn. My book is available, you can either get to through my website, or it's also available on Amazon. And my Instagram handle is @thewanderingmel. And my Twitter handle is Melissa Dolman LLC. Don't hesitate to reach out if I can help your company. And as a reminder, the name of the book is Yes: You Can Talk About Mental Health at Work: Here's Why... And How to Do it Really Well.Lesley Logan 38:22I love this. I really am so excited because so many people that listen to this do work somewhere. They don't just work from their house, they work somewhere. (Melissa: Yes) (Melissa laughs) And you know, I do believe that sometimes the thing that holds us back from the next thing we're going to do is the energy zapping, mental health draining thing that's happening at the workplace. And so if that can be a better source of love and support, then it's easier for you to do the thing that you're here on this planet to do. So, before I let you go. We have we asked everyone BE IT action items, bold, executable, targeted or intrinsic things people can do. So they can be it till they see it. So what do you have for us as far as mental health goes as far as BE IT steps?Melissa Doman 39:03So, I'm obviously very happy that you folks tuned in to hear me yak at Lesley for an out for an hour. What I would really prefer is you did something to action, this education, whatever that looks like. If that means reading the book, if that means trying to learn more about mental illness, if that means sharing about your own mental health with your boss or supporting a colleague that you know has been struggling, please take action immediately because it is a damn mess out there. And there is no reason that you cannot take concrete practical steps to show authentic care to yourself or someone else. And mental health at work is never going away. So it's your choice about when you want to take part in that journey. And please, please take the steps to develop this conversational literacy whatever resource that is and do not sit on this education because education without action is a big fat waste of time.Lesley Logan 40:06Yeah. Well, when this one woman I listened to she says, "Information without integration is constipation." So (Melissa: Ah, that's so much better.) ( Lesley laughs) And that great. I love that one. So anyways, well, gosh, thank you so much for being here. Thank you, really for just, you know, educating us in so many ways and also allowing people to go, "Yes, that's exactly how I wanted to be at work." (Melissa laughs) I'm sure, a lot of people are like nodding their head along with you like,"This would be amazing." So a lot of people feel seen. Y'all how are you going to take action? How are you going to take action towards supporting yours or other people's mental health at work in your life? Do us a favor, screenshot this, tag @thewanderingel, tag @be_it_pod and let us know your takeaways. And if you're like, "Lesley, I don't even share things on my Instagram. It's private." Then text this to a friend, a colleague, your boss, say "Hey, this would be really amazing" so that they can hear the amazing tips that you just heard today and also we can help others Be It Till You See It. That's all I got for this episode of the Be It Till You See It podcast. One thing that would help both myself and future listeners is for you to rate the show and leave a review. And follow or subscribe for free wherever you listen to your podcasts. Also, make sure to introduce yourself over at the @be_it_pod on Instagram. I would love to know more about you. Share this episode with whoever you think needs to hear it. Help us and others BE IT TILL YOU SEE IT. Have an awesome day! 'Be It Till You See It' is a production of 'As The Crows Fly Media'.Brad Crowell 41:44It's written produced, filmed and recorded by your host Lesley Logan and me, Brad Crowell. Our Associate Producer is Amanda Frattarelli.Lesley Logan 41:55Kevin Perez at Disenyo handles all of our audio editing.Brad Crowell 41:59Our theme music is by Ali at APEX Production Music. And our branding by designer and artist, Gianfranco Cioffi.Lesley Logan 42:08Special thanks to our designer Jaira Mandal for creating all of our visuals (which you can't see because this is a podcast) and our digital producer, Jay Pedroso for editing all videos each week so you can.Brad Crowell 42:20And to Angelina Herico for transcribing each of our episodes so you can find them on our website. And, finally to Meridith Crowell for keeping us all on point and on time.Transcribed by https://otter.aiSupport this podcast at — https://redcircle.com/be-it-till-you-see-it/donationsAdvertising Inquiries: https://redcircle.com/brandsPrivacy & Opt-Out: https://redcircle.com/privacy

On this episode of the Psychology Talk Podcast, Dr. Hoye is joined, once again, by Melissa Doman, MA. Melissa is an Organizational Psychologist, Former Clinical Mental Health Therapist, & Author of Yes, You Can Talk About Mental Health at Work (Here's Why And How To Do It Really Well). Melissa works with companies across industries around the globe – including clients like Microsoft, Salesforce, Siemens, Estée Lauder, & Janssen. She's been featured as a subject matter expert in Vogue, the BBC, CNBC, and Inc. Magazine about the Great Resignation, mental health at work conversations about the Ukraine Crisis, and more. Having lived abroad in South Korea, England, Australia and traveled to 45+ countries, Melissa calls upon her global experiences to inform how she works with companies around the world. She has one core goal: to equip companies, individuals, and leaders to have constructive conversations about mental health in the workplace. Her work and book aim to accomplish just that.On this episode, Melissa discusses leadership and mental health at work during difficult times: •Environmental, Social & Governance in the Workplace•Leadership during war time•Leadership during the pandemic•Melissa Doman's interview with Inc. Magazine•Ways to open up about mental health concerns Melissa Doman's Website: https://melissadoman.comMelissa's Interview with Inc. Magazine:https://www.inc.com/rebecca-deczynski/ukraine-crisis-supporting-employee-mental-health.htmlThe Psychology Talk Podcast is a unique conversation about psychology around the globe. Your hosts Dr. Scott Hoye and licensed clinical professional counselor Kyle Miller talk about psychology with mental health practitioners and experts to keep you informed about issues and trends in the industry.https://psych-talk.comhttps://www.instagram.com/psychtalkpodcast/

Melissa is an organizational psychologist and the author of the new book “Yes, You can talk about mental health at work… here's why”. She helps equip people, companies and leaders constructively talk about mental health and mental illness in the workplace. The Mental Corner Podcast is a show hosted by Harry Potvin where guests from all different backgrounds come on weekly and discuss the many different aspects of Mental Health and how we can change society, and ourselves for the better.    Melissa's Socials:  Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/thewanderingmel/ Website: https://melissadoman.com Harry's Socials:  Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/thementalcorner/    WE HAVE MERCH!!! Hit this link to cop yours now: https://www.thementalcorner.com/shop

Wellbeing shaming: What is it? Is it happening to you? How do you navigate it without making things awkward? For this week's episode, I'm bringing in Melissa Doman, organizational psychologist, former Clinical Mental Health Therapist, and mental health at work specialist. She's also the author of Yes, You Can Talk About Mental Health at Work...Here's Why (And How To Do It Really Well). We talk about how to make the most of an uncomfortable scenario, and how to stick up for your own personal boundaries during your 9-to-5. SOCIAL @thewanderingmel @emilyabbate @hurdlepodcast OFFERS Green Chef | Go to Greenchef.com/hurdle130 and use code hurdle130 to get $130 off, plus free shipping Inside Tracker | Go to InsideTracker.com/Hurdle to get up to 20% off your purchase. On-Demand Goal Setting Workshop JOIN: THE *Secret* FACEBOOK GROUP SIGN UP: Weekly Hurdle Newsletter ASK ME A QUESTION: Leave me a voice message, ask me a question, and it could be featured in an upcoming episode! --- Send in a voice message: https://anchor.fm/hurdle/message

We're long overdue for a candid discussion about mental health and mental illness in the workplace. In this episode of the Transform Your Workplace podcast, Brandon Laws sits down with Melissa Doman, an Organizational Psychology expert, to talk about the necessity of breaking the stigma and cultivating a culture of transparency when it comes to mental wellbeing. And, as the Great Resignation continues to take its toll on businesses of all industries and sizes, it's a conversation we can't afford to ignore. TAKEAWAYS Many employees don't feel comfortable broaching the topic of mental health in the workplace. Mental health is more than workplace wellness; it is about accessibility, diversity, equity, inclusion, leadership development, and learning and development across an organization. People are nervous to speak up about mental health issues because they may be misunderstood and compromise their jobs or career paths. We must normalize experiencing and talking about uncomfortable negative emotions. The COVID-19 pandemic hit the “go button,” forcing businesses to realize that they really need to talk about and change their approach to mental health. A QUICK GLIMPSE INTO OUR PODCAST

Harvey Brownstone conducts an in-depth interview with Organizational Psychologist, Melissa Doman, Author of “Yes You Can Talk About Mental Health at Work”About Harvey's guest:Melissa worked for years as a clinical mental health therapist in private practice, employee assistance programs, and university settings. She transitioned from the clinical sector into organizational psychology for a crucial reason. Countless people who came to see her for counseling had something unfortunate in common — they felt they couldn't be open about their struggles at work.  So, she left the clinical sector to make an impact at the source — the workplace.Melissa has spoken, presented, and consulted for organizations and Fortune 500 companies across industries and around the world, including clients like: Microsoft, Estée Lauder, Salesforce, Siemens, Janssen, Charlotte Tilbury, Bumble and bumble, Legal & General, and more. She has been featured as a subject matter expert by the BBC, CNBC, digital publications, local television shows, international and national conferences, summits, and mentoring programs. After a decade of fieldwork, Melissa compiled all of her training, field experience, and expertise into her new book: Yes, You Can Talk About Mental Health at Work…Here's Why (And How To Do It Really Well). She also served as the consulting subject-matter expert for the manuscript and wrote the foreword for the soon-to-be-released Beat Stress at Work: How to Balance Your Ambition With Your Anxiety by Mark Simmonds.Melissa is a prominent thought leader in the United States, United Kingdom, and the European Union. Having lived abroad in South Korea, England, Australia and traveled to 45+ countries, she calls upon her global experiences to inform how she works with companies around the world. She uses these experiences to highlight how cultural differences and personal experiences impact how we perceive mental health, stress, and mental illness. And, how we bring these beliefs into work.Melissa also holds an M.A. in Counseling Psychology from Adler University and a B.A. in Sociology with a minor in Communications from The George Washington University. While in clinical practice, she held several licenses at the state and national level and achieved certification through a Stanford University-sponsored program as a Chronic Disease Self-Management Educator. Her goals are simply this - to use her background and experience to:Equip people, companies, and leaders to constructively talk about mental health and mental illness in the workplace. Help them build the skillset, mindset, and behaviors to do this.Have realistic and constructive conversations about it.Put mental health in the workplace at the forefront of everyone's minds around the world. For more interviews and podcasts go to: https://www.harveybrownstoneinterviews.com/https://www.linkedin.com/in/melissadoman1https://www.instagram.com/thewanderingmelhttps://www.youtube.com/channel/UCohugrElLgr_X4_hZNibOHw#MelissaDoman  #MelissaDoman1  #harveybrownstoneinterviews

As the climate around mental health at work continues to evolve, one thing is clear: These conversations are becoming non-negotiable in workplaces around the globe.And while simply having these conversations is a step in the right direction, it's important to ensure that the conversation are constructive and impactful in a positive way.Today, Melissa Doman joins me to share her expertise on this topic and discuss some of the major themes in her book that really resonated with me. We hit several different points on having constructive mental health conversations at work, including how we can develop the skill set to have these conversations, the science behind why we should, counterproductive mental health at work trends, what not to do, and more. Improving mental health at work is a shared responsibility for the benefit of our collective wellness. Whether you are in a leadership position or not, tune in and get practical tips on taking action within your organization.About Melissa Doman:Melissa Doman is an Organizational Psychologist, Former Clinical Mental Health Therapist, and author who specializes in mental health at work. Melissa works with international, national, and local organizations and Fortune 500 companies across industries and across the globe – including clients like Salesforce, Siemens, Estée Lauder, and Janssen. She has also been featured in the BBC and CNBC about the mental health aspects of the Great Resignation. She also has an international perspective on her work as she's lived abroad in South Korea, Australia, and England and traveled to 45+ countries. Mel has one core goal: to equip companies, individuals, and leaders to have constructive conversations about mental health in the workplace. Her book just came out in October, with the specific goal of doing just that.To learn more, you can visit her website and connect with her on LinkedIn, Instagram, and Twitter.Mentioned In This Episode:Yes, You Can Talk About Mental Health at Work by Melissa DomanFollow Mental Health In Minutes on FacebookJoin the monthly digital subscription

On this episode of the Psychology Talk Podcast Dr. Hoye is joined by Melissa Doman. Melissa is an Organizational Psychologist, Former Clinical Mental Health Therapist, and Author who specializes in mental health at work.Melissa has presented and consulted for international, national, and local organizations and Fortune 500companies across industries and globally, including clients like: Estée Lauder, Salesforce, Siemens, Janssen, Charlotte Tilbury, Bumble and bumble, Legal & General, and many more. Melissa holds an M.A. in Counseling Psychology from Adler University and a B.A. in Sociology with a minor in Communications from The George Washington University. Melissa and Dr. Hoye discuss her new book, “Yes, You Can Talk About Mental Health at Work, Here's Why, and How to do it Really Well.” Melissa's book covers:* How we bring our beliefs and experiences around mental health and mental illness into the workplace* The importance of understanding how the language we use, consciously or unconsciously, impacts our interactions with others* Ways to manage the challenges around having mental health conversations at work* Step-by-step ‘how-to' conversation guides, alongside practical tools Concrete tips on ways to action this education, individually or at a team levelMelissa's Website/Book Link: https://melissadoman.com/yes-you-can-talk-about-mental-health-at-work-bookThe Psychology Talk Podcast is a unique conversation about psychology around the globe. Your hosts Dr. Scott Hoye and licensed clinical professional counselor Kyle Miller talk about psychology with mental health practitioners and experts to keep you informed about issues and trends in the industry. They also tackle mental health trends and issues in their home: Chicago.https://psych-talk.comhttps://www.instagram.com/psychtalkpodcast/

Are you or do you know someone who is having problems with sleep?Well, join Reid Miles as he hosts this episode with his next guest who can help you with your sleep issues. She is Melissa Doman, a sleep expert for the neurodivergent. We talk about what you can do to hopefully get a better night's sleep as well and we find out that her own kids are on the spectrum as well.Melissa Doman's website: https://www.melissadomansleepconsulting.com/Reid Miles personal podcast:https://www.mentalhealthnewsradionetwork.com/our-shows/inside-the-aspergers-studio/

With everything that transpired in 2020, the discussion of mental health at work became an increasingly important component of a healthy, enduring small business. How can you make an impact and create an open culture surrounding mental health at your workplace? Organizational Psychologist and Author Melissa Doman noticed a major theme of work-related mental health issues in her experience as a former clinical mental health therapist. Blending her clinical background with her organizational field experience, she addressed the issue at its core - hosting talks and workshop sessions in actual workplaces. Now, she's compiled all of her learnings from the field into a guide on discussing mental health at work with her new book, Yes, You Can Talk About Mental Health at Work: Here's Why (and How to Do it Really Well) and shared her insights on the podcast. What we discussed: How Melissa's clinical background led her to specialize in mental health at work in an organizational setting How Yes, You Can Talk About Mental Health at Work: Here's Why (and How to Do it Really Well) came to be and the writing process Why we need to talk more about mental health and mental illness at work How HR professionals in small and medium-sized businesses can best approach the mental health at work discussion Why certain mental health at work trends are counterproductive and potentially destructive How small businesses can avoid the pitfall of counterproductive mental health at work initiatives Examples of how businesses have been coached or helped through the process

In today's episode, I will be talking with "Melissa Doman" In regards to Navigating Sleep for Special Needs Children

Hey guys and gals, in todays episode, I talk with Melissa Doman who is a sleep specialist. We talk about how certain things affect sleep, from the time you go to bed to the enviorment of the room.  Should the room be totally dark? What temp is the perfect sleeping temp? These are just a few of the questions I talk to her about about, I also ask her if she has sleep issues and what does she suggest for getting a good night sleep.

Hey guys and gals, in todays episode, I talk with Melissa Doman who is a sleep specialist. We talk about how certain things affect sleep, from the time you go to bed to the enviorment of the room.  Should the room be totally dark? What temp is the perfect sleeping temp? These are just a few of the questions I talk to her about about, I also ask her if she has sleep issues and what does she suggest for getting a good night sleep.

Thanks to the pandemic our working lives seem to be in a constant state of change, with more uncertainty and new challenges arising almost on a daily basis. As lockdown eases, we will have to adopt new ways of working yet again.  Across the country people are being called to return to work and go back to normal but what is normal? The pandemic raised awareness of the importance of managing mental health at work, which includes talking about the mental and emotional challenges we face, or the stress of integrating work and home life or the difficulties of navigating the lack of social interaction in a virtual working world. The new normal includes workplaces, where physical, mental and emotional wellbeing of employees is the primary concern of managers. Long gone are the days when managers could sweep these issues under the rug. The post pandemic workplace is human.  In todays episode Melissa Doman, Author, Organizational Psychologist, Former Clinical Mental Health Therapist and Mental Health at Work Specialist will be joining us on the show to share why the pandemic has given us a permission slip to be human at work and how we can use this as an opportunity to improve our working lives. 

Hello, Hello, Hello everyone.. Hope you are all well. Welcome Back to Maddie chat show Podcast and another great episode. I've got a wonderful guest Melissa Doman, M.A. she Organizational Psychologist, Former Clinical Mental Health Therapist. Mental Health at Work Specialist & Author. Melissa uses her former clinical experience and current organizational psychology work to inform her practical and solution-focused approach that she uses with clients in her work. Her main goal is to equip them to build the skillset, mindset, and behaviors required to discuss mental health, mental illness, and stress at work. Having lived on 4 continents and travelled to more than 45 countries, Melissa calls upon her experiences working with professionals from around the world in her work, and is a prominent thought leader in the United Kingdom, United States, and Europe. Melissa also has a book coming out in October 2021 about changing perceptions of mental health & mental illness, with a practical guide on why & how to have constructive conversations about mental health at work. Thank you for Come on this journey with Maddie to Empower the world to chat!

On the show chatting with Ricklyn this week is Melissa Doman, an Organizational Psychologist, Former Clinical Mental Health Therapist, & Mental Health at Work Specialist.  Melissa equips companies, individuals, and leaders to have constructive conversations about mental health in the workplace. Melissa has spoken, presented, and consulted for international, national, and local organizations and Fortune 500 companies across industries and across the globe – including clients like Salesforce, Charlotte Tilbury, the NHS, and the Independent Publishers Guild. She is also currently writing a book that will be published in October 2021. In this episode, you will learn:  How to support managers to have supportive conversations within the right context with employees Understanding how your company’s Employee Assistance Programme works will benefit the employees you support How you can care for your own mental health as an HR leader   Connect with our host:  LinkedIn  Website   Connect with our guest:  Website Email: melissa@melissadoman.com Her book Yes, You Can Talk about Mental Health At Work: Here’s Why (and how to do it really well) is available on Amazon and Google Books for pre-order. 

Welcome! I am delighted to have you join us today! Please allow me to introduce  Melissa Doman is a sleep consultant for special needs families who feel frustrated and overwhelmed by their child’s sleep problems.  They’ve had it with sleepless nights, anxiety, stress-filled days, and doctors who say their child's sleep issues can't be fixed.  Melissa helps kids sleep better and independently so parents can see their child grow, thrive, and use these sleep skills for years to come. Melissa Doman has a decade of experience teaching parents of children with a variety of diagnoses and uses this knowledge to enhance her sleep training programs. In this episode we discuss some of the following: Discover some common sleep disorders and solutions  What is a Doman Method and how can this help me and my special needs child Learn how a sleep coach can aid in your overall wellbeing.  You can find Melissa Doman through her website at: https://melissadomansleepconsulting.com/ Share with someone that needs to be inspired, empowered, and needs sleep.  Don't forget to like, comment, and subscribe. Best Health, Mo Akins

Certified Sleep Consultant, Melissa Doman, shares easy-to-implement and effective sleep training strategies that give everyone in your household a good night's rest.  Learn more about this episode on our website: www.mothersofmisfits.com

In today's episode I interview SN Sleep Consultant Melissa Doman. Melissa and I discuss the hot topic of sleep that so many of us SN mothers need more of. Melissa offers advice for both us and our families, narrowing in on bedtime rituals and rhythms, natural sleep aids and jet lag remedies. Melissa also shares her top 5 tips for ensuring a good night's rest. Enjoy the show! Melissa Doman is a certified Sleep Sense Consultant and has ten years of experience working with parents and their young children in Philadelphia and around the world. You can contact Melissa at: Melissa's Website Sign up for her Sleep Tips. Melissa's YouTube channel. Melissa's Instagram Page Please visit the MST website and follow us on IG @momsspecialtoo. For collaborations email Anika at: momsspecialtoo@gmail.com.

A larger percentage of the ADHD population — kids and adults alike — struggle with sleep. Your child might have a hard time falling asleep or staying asleep during the night, or both. When kids aren't sleeping, parents likely aren't getting adequate sleep either and that takes a toll on the entire family. In this episode of the Parenting ADHD Podcast, I'm talking with sleep consultant, Melissa Doman, about all things sleep. We discuss why sleep challenges arise, strategies to help your kids fall asleep and stay asleep, and even how to get kids sleeping in their own beds. If your child (or you) struggle with sleep, this is an episode not to be missed. 

PeopleHum talks to Melissa Doman, M.A. on how the psychology of human behavior comes first than anything, they are people first. If you like the podcast, please follow the channel, so we could keep producing more content like this!