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Best podcasts about XYZ

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Latest podcast episodes about XYZ

Woke & Wired - Expanded Consciousness and Entrepreneurship
186. Join Me For 11 Days Of Sharing On Social Media | Hyping You Up To Share Your Medicine with The World

Woke & Wired - Expanded Consciousness and Entrepreneurship

Play Episode Listen Later Jan 13, 2022 31:12


Over the years of being a social media guide and cheerleader for healers, artists, coaches and entrepreneurs, I've seen so many people give away their life force to how they think they “should” show up online.  What if there is no right way?  What if you start before you think you're ready? What if consistency is the key that unlocks miracles?  Let's explore it together! After seeing the transformation that 11 days of daily social media posts brought into Eric Brief's life (episode 185), I am guided to hold the space for us to do it together.  If you feel like you've been putting off showing up full out on social media until XYZ is in place… this is your time. Join me on 2.2.2022 – or anytime you see this – to build your muscle of releasing perfection and JUST SHOWING UP. Perfecting your strategy can always be introduced later on, but sometimes it's about throwing all possibilities at the wall and seeing what sticks. Experimenting. Having fun with it. And releasing the story that you're not ready! I will be doing the challenge alongside you over on @ksenia.brief Instagram.  Here's how to participate in the 11-day challenge:  Comment on the challenge announcement post on Instagram @ksenia.brief and let me know you're in! Bonus points if you share your current favorite song. Find at least 1 person in the comments to that post that you resonate with and go HYPE THEM UP on their page! On February 2-12, 2022 share on your feed DAILY! It can be a photo, a reel, or an IGTV. If daily feed posts feel way out there for you and you've been shying away from stories, do this challenge on stories instead. If TikTok is the platform that has felt like a “one day” project, maybe this is your time to take it on. Just don't sell yourself short! Choose a platform and content format that feels out of your comfort zone, but doable.  How to prepare for the Challenge:  Get clear on your intentions for showing up consistently on social media (and leave space for miracles) Go through the 5-Day Aligned Social Media Reset  Start writing down content ideas  Mentioned:  Zencastr - use code KSENIA for 30% off 185 Eric Brief: The Courageous Road to “I Am An Artist” and Finding Your Own Way On Social Media @ksenia.brief on TikTok and Instagram @ericbrief on TikTok and Instagram 5-Day Aligned Social Media Reset Episode sponsor: I'm so excited to share with you that my #1 podcasting tool since day one of this podcast – Zencastr – is sponsoring this episode. Zencastr provides crystal clear sound and gorgeous HD video. What I love about it is that it records separate audio and video tracks for me and the guest, so the editing process is a lot more customized. Plus, there's secured cloud backup, so you never lose your interviews. It's super easy to use — there's nothing to download, my guests just click on the link and we start recording. Go to zencastr.com/pricing and enter promo code KSENIA to get 30% off your first three months with PRO account. It includes unlimited audio and video recordings, hosting up to 4 guests at once, audio and video mixing and unlimited English transcriptions. You get a 14 day trial and can always downgrade to the free account if you choose to. It's time to share your story!  Connect with Ksenia:  kseniabrief.com Ksenia's email list Instagram @ksenia.brief YouTube Ksenia Brief TikTok @ksenia.brief Subscribe, rate and review the podcast on Apple Podcasts Follow the podcast on Spotify

DTC POD: A Podcast for eCommerce and DTC Brands
From DTC CPG to retail (with Jarod Steffes, CEO of Muddy Bites)

DTC POD: A Podcast for eCommerce and DTC Brands

Play Episode Listen Later Jan 12, 2022 39:16


Key Takeaways3:35 - Starting with KickstarterJarod and his partners knew they could have gone through the formal fundraising process, but wanted to get market validation first.“Having some startup cash to kind of get going, especially when you're talking about a CPG brand, it definitely helps a lot for a lot of levers. For us, sure, we could've gone out and raised money. But you know, that's like a 3-6, maybe 9-month process to go get a full round of fundraising. And we just don't want to do that. We just want to make sure the idea was worth it to other people. And so for us, Tyler, my co-founder, he started in his mom's kitchen just making samples, making things, making sure that it was a good product and so on and so forth. And for us Kickstarter was this channel where we could put up a campaign. And for those that don't know, Kickstarter, if you don't hit your goal within the 30, 60 whatever day campaign you want to do, you just don't get the money. So for us, it was like, okay, let's put it on Kickstarter. If it does really good, great. We'll get the money. And if it doesn't okay, then we'll go back to the drawing board.”9:49 - A viral launchAll of Muddy Bite's original sales were completely organic, and they sold out of product before it was even produced. This meant manufacturing was the biggest blocker.“We launched on Shopify and really from day one, I think day one we launched, we did like 25k in sales. And that was really just kind of all organic. And really from there for the next four to six months, it was like every single bag was sold before it was ever produced. We never really did Facebook ads, because it just organically every bag was sold before it's produced. And so it really was kind of this process of manufacturing. How do we increase the manufacturing? How do we speed up the manufacturing? And so it was really kind of a different kind of journey so to say, because most brands it's like, how do I go out and market this better? How do I get more customers? And it really for us, it was kind of flipped.”10:58 - Keeping customer transparencyIn the midst of constantly selling out of product, Jarod and his team made sure to keep customers in the loop so they knew what was happening.“There were some points where we maybe had 2,000 orders in the hole. And for us to catch up on those that take maybe two to three weeks. And so number one, we had full transparency with customers. The message was, Hey, we got all these orders. We can't keep up. You guys are amazing. We just need some time, please be patient. And we were really transparent with that for two to three years as we kind of got into better manufacturing for our process. And really because of that, we built a really strong foundation for customers that have followed us from day one.”11:33 - Making a small facility workMuddy Bites upgraded to a new facility…but it was still too small. They made it work as long as possible by creating night shifts and staffing with local college students.“Going from like 400 to 2,000 (square feet in facility space) was a fairly smooth process, because it was kind of that transition from Kickstarter to Shopify. But after we kind of gotten our 2,000 square foot facility and really kind of got going, we had boxes up to the ceiling and we had 30 plus employees in there. And it was jam-packed within a small facility to where after six months, whatever it was like, we needed a bigger space, but we were locked in this longer contract. And managing cash flow was super tight. So we just created a day shift and a night shift. And this was in Ames, Iowa. So we found college student. it was really easy for us to find college students that are willing to come in and work for that. So it was really kind of good for us just being in Ames because of that, finding know easy workers, so to say. But we quickly outgrew that space.”15:28 - Launching retail in the midwestIt turns out that midwest retail chains have great volume. Starting there quickly opened more doors in other regions.“Being here in Iowa, we've got Midwest chains like Hy-Vee, Fairway Foods, just to name a couple. And so that's where our starting points were for retail were, in a word, pretty nice. Because Hy-Vee, I think they have about 110 locations, like decent volume for a Midwest chain. And really once you start kind of expanding into retail to where you get maybe 500 to 1,000 doors, it's almost like a chain reaction. Because different category buyers go to different stores just to see the market and stuff like that. And so it just kind of opens up more doors. And so really from the Midwest, we expanded east, west, south, north. And it just made it a lot easier to expand.”16:34 - Using DTC to strategize with retailThe Muddy Bites online sales demographics helped the team know where retail product should be sent. This had a beneficial snowball effect on both the DTC and retail side.“Anybody in the US can order from us and we could ship. But after a while we really saw more demographics out in California and New York and Texas. Really, those are kind of the top three. And so what's nice is as we really kind of expanded to retail—we really, really expanded retail here in October, and really here in Q1 and Q2 of 2022—it's like we know where the customers are. So if we can get it in retail stores near them, it makes them go to the stores and buy it, versus paying online and paying for shipping. But also, if they can go to store, it helps us move more volume within stores. And obviously if you can move more volume, you get more doors. You get more sales, it's just kind of a win-win.”23:07 - The DTC-Retail mixUntil now, DTC and Amazon have accounted for almost all Muddy Bites sales. Jarod expects that to flip going forward.“As we finished up in 2021, our mix was like 97% DTC and Amazon, and then like 3% retail. This year it's going to be probably 75% retail, 25% DTC and Amazon. And that's without us decreasing the budgets for DTC or anything like that. It's just we're ramping up retail really, really hard. So, over one to three years or whatever, retail is kind of our end game, and we want to be everywhere that we can. And obviously that's going to mix up with the DTC side. If we could be in every single store across the country between Walmart and Target, 7-11, I would say DTC might slow down quite a bit, just because if you can go to your store and buy it for cheaper than online, then sure. But either way, it's like we get sales. Because then the stores reorder, the distributors reorder. But for us, it's really just getting in more doors and creating brand awareness.”24:27 - Growing the teamJarod and his co-founder used to wear every single hat, including running social media. Now, they've leaned into delegating to others and following there lead when it comes to innovative content, like memes.“In the early days of Muddy Bites, it was me running our socials, Tyler helping out with socials. I mean, we were wearing a million hats. We eventually got to the point where one, we can't do that. It's not sustainable. Burnout's real. And so we started just hiring key roles. Like we brought on Emma and Jessica under our social team and now they run everything. We don't tell them to do XYZ. We kind of give them full control and they've done an amazing job. And that's been a learning curve for us to hand that off. But really from there, one kind of key strategy that works really well for us as memes. If you were to tell me a year ago to post a meme, I'd think you were crazy. And our social team was like, let's just try it. And so we did. And now if you go look at our Instagram, every one of our meme posts probably gets anywhere from 500-2,000 likes. And every other post gets anywhere from like 100-400 likes. So we get a big engagement when we do memes, and we're kind of learning that like meme culture.”31:49 - Seeking funding to improve productionJarod knew it was time to pursue funding so that they could match production with demand, and grow the company into a business that can someday be acquired.“The biggest problem with our bootstrapping was that production's always gonna be kind of a holdup. It's going to kind of tie us down, so to say. We got to the point where we're like, okay. Let's get some money into the business. Let's improve our production a little bit deeper to where it's not really a production issue. It turns more into a sales and marketing issue. And so we raised some money. We did that. And really the other piece of that with raising more money was that way we can increase that production capacity, but also then expand into retail. Really for us, if we could be everywhere, that's our end game. Get acquired someday. That's kind of our goal versus just a DTC company.”39:28 - Standing out from the snack crowdDTC snack companies are all the rage, but most of them aim to be healthy. Embracing the fact that Muddy Bites is a dessert has actually served the company well.“The biggest thing with DTC right now is there's companies popping up left and right between organic, vegan, super healthy type stuff between snacks. And what's kinda nice about us, and especially when we pitch to investors or anything like that, or even retailers, it's we're not like a better for you product. We're sweet, we're not healthy. We're not trying to pitch it like we're better for you. So it actually makes retailers happy. Because we're seeing that in retail space and also DTC is like, everything's better for you, and we're not. And so that makes us a little bit different there. The other piece that's an advantage for us is we're basically creating a new category of snacks. We're not another cookie bar, we're not another Oreo. That's a big question we get from retailers is what category do you guys put us in? Are we in the crackers? Are we in the cookies? Are we in the chocolates? And so for us, it's like we're almost creating a category. So that allows us to be different.”Full video interview:  https://youtu.be/gWfyIpe_QyIJarod Steffes - CEO of Muddy BitesRamon Berrios - CEO of Trend.ioBlaine Bolus - COO of Omnipanel 

Working Capital The Real Estate Podcast
Investing in Real Estate; A Global Perspective with Colin Lynch | EP87

Working Capital The Real Estate Podcast

Play Episode Listen Later Jan 12, 2022 52:30


Colin Lynch os the Head of Global Real Estate Investments at TD Asset Management. Colin is responsible for Global and Canadian Real Estate Strategy, overseeing fund design and structuring, implementation and oversight of acquired assets for the Global Real Estate Strategy. In this role Colin manages Investments in over 1000 properties located in over 20 counties worldwide. In this episode we talked about:  • Colin's Bio & Background  • Financial Crisis  • The Canadian Market from a Global Perspective  • Post-COVID Real Estate Market Overview  • Pricing & Affordability  • Effects of Inflation  • Commercial Real Estate Culture  • Mentorship, Resources and Lessons Learned Useful links: https://www.linkedin.com/in/colinkrlynch/?originalSubdomain=ca Transcription: Jesse (0s): Welcome to the working capital real estate podcast. My name is Jesper galley. And on this show, we discuss all things real estate with investors and experts in a variety of industries that impact real estate. Whether you're looking at your first investment or raising your first fund, join me and let's build that portfolio one square foot at a time. Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to working capital the real estate podcast. My special guest today is Colin Lynch. Colin is the head of global real estate investments at TD asset management.   Colin is responsible for global and Canadian real estate strategy, overseeing fund design and structuring implementation and oversight of acquired assets for the global real estate strategy. In this role, calling manages investments in over 1000 properties located in over 20 countries. Worldwide. We just updated that now. Colin, how's it going   Colin (53s): Kid. Good. Thank you for having me here.   Jesse (56s): Thanks for, thanks for being on the show. I'm really excited to talk with you today. I think there's a number of things that we'd like to cover, but before we do, as with every guest that we have on the show would love to get a little bit of more information on your background, how you got into real estate. We talked a little how it was a bit of an unconventional approach or entrance into real estate. So take us back, take us back and give us a little bit of a, of your background.   Colin (1m 23s): Absolutely certainly unconventional approach to real estate. So first things first, I actually grew up as very much into music as a musician. And so I was one of those children that was in every sort of music class. By the time it got to high school was performing in a ton of ensembles through the, by the a hundred concerts a year, got to the end of high school, said time to explore something else.   Cause I figured I, I had learned all that I could possibly learn in music, which was incorrect, but I figured I'd at least explored app. And so I went into a business and history. So I did three things in undergrad. I did the world concerned for a music. I did a bachelor of commerce at Queens, and I did a bachelor of arts in history at Queens. And, and then, you know, graduated and it was the heyday of the leveraged buyout, boom. And my mom who said, I was way too all over the place said, you got to get a skill.   You've got to focus and you should go work for those banks because they never run into any issues, their board to stability. And so that's what I did I do to fleet, went out to investment banking and went to Morgan Stanley and got to experience the global financial crisis front and center. Ben went to, went to, to business school. And throughout that entire period, this is where you expect me to say, I had that passion for real estate, which I do, but I also had a passion for commercial aviation.   So joined McKinsey and company in Chicago, but reality was all over the world, did that stuff. And after traveling all over the world, I said, look, that's fantastic, but I'd like to come back to a city I love and a nation I love and that's in Toronto. So I did that and this is where the real estate part comes in. I had been very interested in, in a lot of political activities. And so in 2014, in January, 2014, somebody that couldn't get elected asked me to help him.   And that was the John Torrey mayoral campaign here in, in Toronto. And so 10 months later he was mayor. He asked me to work for him. I said, no. And through that conversation set of conversations that got introduced to this firm called Greystone, a firm that I had never heard of before. And, and after about a year of conversation, Greystone asked me to join. So initially I joined in strategy working for effectively the C-suite and, and then that turned into moving into the real estate world.   So that's a long way of saying I had a very unconventional introduction to the world of real estate, but it was, it was a fun story to, to live through.   Jesse (4m 26s): That's great. So in terms of the, the financial crisis component of that was that you were still a at Morgan Stanley at that, at that time. And if so, what were you doing? What were you doing for them there?   Colin (4m 38s): Yeah, I was doing a number, number of different things. I, so I started started that Morgan Stanley focused on consumer retail and financial services. So financial sponsor stories. So serving pension plans who private equity firms in the light and then also timber companies. And then, and then as, as the financial crisis unfolded that broadened.   And I basically worked across firstly every street, but spent a bit of time in real estate as well. And then from a type of activity, as I mentioned prior to the global financial crisis investment banking was doing a lot of leveraged buyouts and throughout the financial crisis also worked on things like that or in possession financing for companies going through insolvency or worked on a few, reached a sort of a few IPO's did some M and a, but at the conclusion of my term at Morgan Stanley, the governor of the bank of Canada, Mark Carney at the time requested some help on the financial stability plan for Canada that was quantitative easing effectively in Trent and requests was help design a program for the bank to implement a quantitative easing.   And so that's what I did in the last sort of four months or so of my time at Morgan Stanley. So highly unusual investment banking experience for sure. A lot of industries and a lot of different types of activities that I participated in very much a function of the global financial crisis.   Jesse (6m 21s): Yeah, for sure. I mean, it's still topical, I guess even the current environment we're in now. So I think the, the idea of just the macro economic perspective you got, I don't think it's something that's too dissimilar to some of what we're doing right now from a stimulus and, and a quantitative easing perspective.   Colin (6m 40s): Very fair point. And you know, it's interesting because prior to this environment that we're in used to tell folks about that quantitative easing program, which the bank didn't actually have to implement. And the bank was here in Canada was one of the few central banks worldwide. They didn't have to implement quantitative easing well, fast forward to 2020, and we were pretty, pretty heavy on the quantitative Beason train. So, so, you know, it's things, things change and evolve over time.   Yeah.   Jesse (7m 11s): Yeah. Fair enough. So take us to, to the Greystone, to the actual foray into real estate, you know, what, what area did you, did you initially go into, and maybe for those that don't know a little bit about what they do?   Colin (7m 25s): Yeah, absolutely. So Greystone began as the investment management corporation of Saskatchewan. So 35 years ago, thereabouts, it was a department of, of the government and it was spun out from the government and became sort of like the investment authority for the province of Saskatchewan then became owned by pension plans. And at that point looked very much like, you know, the Aimco as an example, what the government of Saskatchewan said at that point, when they spun it out was after five years, the pensions could do whatever they wanted in terms of their investment management services.   And over time management bought out most of the interests of those pensions and, and that, that time Greystone had a very small real estate portfolio. It was a full suite, so public equities and fixed income, but also had real estate. And that real estate grew from about 200 million to on, on, by the time TD came around and bought Greystone in 2018, that real estate portfolio equity was about 16, 17 billion mortgages was around, I believe at the time about 4 billion.   And so it was quite the successful run and Greystone had become a name for excellence in real estate, both equity and debt, even though Greystone began and, and still had quite a strong public equities and fixed income side to it. And so like that, I joined Ray stone working with the senior team in, and once I did a number of things around reorganizations U S expansion, et cetera, I said, look, it's time to fire me because I'm pretty much done.   And then that, you know, originated into originate the conversation, which was, you know, do you want to be a coach, I E a manager, or do you want to be a player on the team? And I looked at that and I said, you know, what, why being a player on the team looks really interesting. And so that's the path I went down. And as we've looked at the different areas in Greystone and where my passion was, my dad grew up in construction. And so I grew up with, you know, floor plans, building plans, sorry, I'm on my, on my basement floor.   You know, I had a fascination for real estate. And so I thought that would be a cool place to be. And so my foray in was working on our asset management division. And so we created a real estate asset management division in house to do a bit of that work a bit on the office portfolio, in the industrial portfolio. And then, so I worked on that, that I was also asked to help co-create the international strategy, which was taking Greystone success that we had experienced over 30 years within Canada and, and expanding that outside of Canada.   And so I worked on those two initiatives and, and then the international strategy went from strategy to being a fund. And I went from creating the strategy to running the fund and then, and then that grew, and it was quite, it's been quite a successful ride. And then I was earlier this year, asked to take over the domestic portfolio, which is that portfolio that had been around for the, for the last 30 years.   Jesse (10m 55s): Yeah. So in terms of, in terms of going into the fund model, what was it prior to that? Was it, was it raising capital for asset specific and w like, what was that transformation like?   Colin (11m 5s): Yeah, so it was actually, so on the international side, it was literally building something from scratch. So Greystone prior to launching the international head, just domestic real estate. And it was a largely one strategy on the equity side and one strategy on the debt side, diversified across property types and by risk strategies and by geography and on international there's, there were a lot of investors con we call clients that were asking us, you know, why don't you have a strategy to invest outside of Canada?   And for about a decade, the Greystone response was we hear you, but we're focused on delivering great results in Canada. And so when I came around and said, look, I really am interested in, in, in being a player on the team versus the coach, they said, great help us solve this. And so we, we literally had a whiteboard. That's how we began. And we, and we designed ground up a single, comprehensive global strategy, investing everywhere from Australia to Europe, to the U S across all the property types and all of our strategies in all formats.   So it could be a fund investment or can be a JV, or it could be a club. And, and so we designed something with a tremendous amount of flexibility, which took a long time, but it was quite fun to be able to just literally create something from scratch and then, and then to actually build it, which, you know, you have all of the legal ramifications, regulatory ramifications fro in selling Greystone to TV in the middle of bad. And now you're pro you're owned by a traded bank and they've got their own regulations and then sort of, you know, build a track record and, and take that to the market and, and raise capital and, and deploy it.   So that's been, that's been the journey on the international side and it's definitely been interesting.   Jesse (13m 11s): Yeah, that is interesting. So we had a Michael Emery on the show a few months ago from allied REIT, and we know every time I have some Canadian Canadian guests that has started or work for a large Canadian real estate company, I always ask them the comparison to the U S or globally, where you have individuals playing in our backyard for a certain amount of time. And then I can imagine just like you're alluding to here, the regulatory environment, the probably the accredited investor differences and those kinds of complexities. Well, I'm sure there was a bunch of things that were challenging, but was there one thing or one or two things that was really one of the, one of the hardest parts about that transformation or about that ability to go from not just in playing in a Canadian market, but into a global space?   Colin (13m 58s): Oh, that's a good question. Certainly the regulatory dynamic is, is, is challenging. The European union, as an example, is a highly regulated regulatory construct. And, and there's a lot of rules around if you're marketing a fund, there's something called a passport and you sort of have to have this passport that applies to certain European countries.   We have a vehicle in Ireland called the ICAP, which Cyrus collective acid vehicle runs pretty akin to accompany. So with a legitimate board and, and, and all of the infrastructure service providers, companies that service that ICAP sending that up was quite, quite, quite the work, particularly as we're getting to the ninth ending of this, of this story, right, as COVID started. And so we sort of certainly felt the heat of regulatory concern just in general, as, as we were creating this as, as COVID habit.   So that's probably a little bit of a boring answer cause folks, folks, really, not too many people get up in the morning wanting to talk regulatory details, but, you know, we had eight, eight external law firms helping us around the world on, on that, on that point. And so, you know, the, the complexity of that I think was unexpected. I would say I'd stepped back from that and say, there's a cultural difference, you know, in, in the U S for sure.   You know, I think a bit more aggressive in Canada, we've got a smaller number of participants in the market that are fair. You know, quite a number are fairly well capitalized and have very long-term perspectives in terms of ownership, property. That's not uniform around the world. And certainly the U S is a deep and liquid place. And, and, and the regional variances are quite significant, but I think that broad sort of hates a little bit more aggressive is actually probably true.   I'd say the real estate challenge for us is there's just a host of participants worldwide. And so, you know, we're active in Australia, we're active in the UK, we're active in Germany, we're active in Japan and, and finding sort of like-minded investors across all of those regions. It's just a lot to learn a lot to introduce yourself a lot of introductions to make, and a lot of subsequent sort of conversations. And then you layer that on, into, into do that in the pandemic.   And, you know, fortunately we S we did maybe three years of those introductions and, and subsequent meetings, pre pandemic, but still we've, you know, we've had quite a number of those conversations. So layer on doing, doing that in a pandemic. And it becomes a quite interesting,   Jesse (17m 2s): Yeah, a little more challenging than, than any other time or most times in terms of, if we go there on that, you know, lockdowns the government stimulus, what we we've talked about before eviction moratoriums a lot has happened in the, in the last crazy to say almost two years, how has that perspective for you? And I understand it's a big question, but how has that, how has your perspective as a, as somebody that deals with real estate on a, on a domestic and global level, you know, how has your opinion of the market and asset classes changed over the last year or two?   Colin (17m 38s): Yeah, that is a big question. So generally put, I've been reminded of the ever present role of government in our lives and in particular in real estate. And I, and I don't think that can be overstated, right? So whether, you know, the, the eviction moratoriums, or simply put closing down a lot, a lot of the retail, et cetera, and that was a global story.   And, and going through the different government programs requirements, et cetera, particularly during the first two waves of COVID was, was an exercise. And, and there's things that we know about. So the shopping malls closed, et cetera. There were other things that got a bit less play, but were also meaningful. I E different requirements for international investors use Australia as an example, there were new requirements for international investors looking to bring capital into the market due to COVID.   So, you know, that, that was interesting now to real estate foundationally. I don't think COVID has changed my perspective on the different property types. So as an example, while located office and CPDs high quality had the view that if, you know, pre COVID, if, if you're making office investments, that's probably where you want to invest during COVID, don't have, I haven't changed my perspective on it, you know, has my overall sort of thoughts on office as a property type being tempered clearly.   But I, you know, I think you talk to folks and say, and what you hear is, you know, COVID, hasn't really changed their direction of travel. I think that's, that's largely the same for me. I do think on the retail side at some point. So I used the UK as an example, where we saw a lot of devaluation of retail. At some point, you hit the level where you say, you know, the land value is, is, is higher than what folks are sort of trading in the market for.   Right. And I think in the UK, you actually have some of those situations, but I think in, in Canada, there were probably some deals to be had in the retail space, depending on the type of retail you're looking at. And that probably, that would be a different point of view than one I would have had two years ago. It's just, we've seen, you know, a lot interns evaluations over the last two years, multifamily and industrial. I mean, you know, I think we've all been very interested on the industrial story, the E the E grocery dynamic, something I'm focused on a bit, most folks don't see that being a significant concern in, in, you know, for those that own grocery boxes.   But I do think that that E grocery, even though most would say, it's fairly unprofitable for the operators. I do think it's worth watching. And, and then on the multifamily side, you know, the, the story say, Hey, everybody's moved out, Tim, we're all gonna live in, in, you know, in two hours outside of the metros or we're going to move someplace far. I think we're seeing that kind of played out to a small degree, but largely hasn't fully, and folks have moved back.   And especially in, in the U S where folks have moved back into urban Metro San Francisco's a bit sluggish on that. But beyond that CEO look at Seattle, look at Boston, you've seen, you've seen those apartment rants quite dramatically increased this year. So, you know, some, all of that up and say, not dramatic changes in my view on real estate overall, but certainly certainly reinforcement in some areas and, and deeper thinking and others.   Yeah.   Jesse (21m 57s): I think I'm probably agree with everything you just said, from my perspective of what you're saying, it sounds like very similar to our outlook. Obviously we're biased in brokerage, but on the office end, I think that there was, if you were really in tune with what was going on in office, you saw a lot of these changes really predated COVID in the lockdown, the different ways of working, the ability to have people come in on potential alternating days. So I th I share your position on downtown well located transit oriented office.   I think the story hasn't changed much for them. What's, what's been amazing is that record prices that we've seen in, in industrial and multi res industry industrial, you know, has been the darling of the industry, multi Rez. I think at the beginning of the pandemic, there was this concern that eviction moratoriums would have caused this, you know, mass vacancy, which I think just generally we didn't see, we saw people paying their rent, which I guess in theory, or in practice was kind of subsidy subsidized by the government's.   Colin (23m 3s): Yeah, no, that's right. That's right. It was. And that goes back to the first point on the large role of government in, in our society. And, and to be fair, so much of our society was underwritten by the government, especially in that first lockdown, but our multifamily it's interesting because one could juxtapose a national headline from CNN, for instance, saying nobody's paying rent and rent collection is only at 70%. And multi-family, and then what I was hearing from, from institutional owners was, oh, no, our rent collections are 95%.   And I, the worst I heard was like maybe 89%. And so, you know, that, you know, those two stats juxtapose show the importance of institutional ownership of the multifamily space and, and how that really paid off in, in, in, in, throughout the crisis, not withstanding the point that yes, government definitely helped pay the bills for a number of folks, but that really, really mattered. And also the types of multifamily that you were in, this is more of a us common than Canada, because, you know, you have a much broader spectrum in the us, but certainly some of that luxury multi-family was, was hit pretty hard in the U S but interestingly, it is bouncing back.   Now I was in Boston six weeks ago, or so touring a bit of this product and it's, you know, it was quite interesting. The bounce back has been pretty robust. So anyway, for me, the point is institutional ownership and management of, of multifamily really made a difference in, in the crisis. Yeah.   Jesse (24m 49s): And I think on that point with trip, you know, AAA or high-end multi res, I know that there was intra construction, you know, pivots from, okay, maybe let's go be like, you know, maybe we don't need the Taj Mahal, whereas prior to COVID, they might've gone for that super high end. But yeah, I think a big component of it has been, despite some of the government policies, people have continued to pay the rent. And it seems to be at least from the data that we have, that the not only the prices keep going up, but net operating income keeps going up.   So the question really from my point of view is, you know, w where do we hit the wall first and pricing or affordability, you know, what, what tempers multi rise.   Colin (25m 30s): Yeah, that's a really good question. And take it take cities like Vancouver and Toronto, which have robust shadow rental markets where that condo inventory is, is really, you know, subbing in for that luxury rental. And I candidly think that it's those owners that will have to deal with that question first versus a multifamily owners. And if I were to sort of locate myself along that spectrum, I have to think affordability's going to start being an issue one way or another.   So whether it's, you know, people are paying, you know, the income proportions after, after tax income is, is, is off the charts. I'd say as, as a proportion of rent on average, you know, in, in, in, in Toronto and Vancouver, again, to a lot of that sort of condo shadow inventory, but it's worse for folks that are owner occupiers, just based off of the, you know, the significant appreciation that has happened.   So, you know, I think it's a legitimate concern. I just don't think institutional multifamily Canada is going to be the first in line to address it. I think there's going to be some other folks who dressing at first and we'll see how it gets addressed. And then the big thing that everybody talks about in, in the public equities world is interest rates. And when will they go up and, you know, folks are concerned about inflation. And I think we genuinely are, cause it sucks that things are a lot more expensive quickly, but I think a lot more people are much more interested on how will central banks, if they decide that this inflation run is a bit more permanent than they thought, Hmm, how will they adjust interest rates to, you know, deal with that.   And, and, and there, you know, if I look at that's the challenge and the folks lined up to, to face that challenge, those multi-family owners, aren't first in line, they're probably third in line. The first SIM are probably, you know, I would say highly leveraged homeowners that have, you know, purchased a product in the last year or so.   Jesse (27m 47s): Yeah. Fair enough. In terms of moving on to a little bit more on the interest rate, inflation inflation environment, you know, we keep hearing whether this is transitory, whether inflation that we have right now, for those that don't know, I think the fed very quietly, you know, mentioned that they would no longer be targeting the 2%, you know, their, their typical target of a 2% inflation. And it kind of went under the radar, I think even from, from kind of financial news, but w what are your thoughts?   And I guess in your role at TD, obviously you have to take a pretty broad global approach. How, how, how did that decision and what you've been seeing as inflation kind of creeping up, how is that influencing or changing, if it does your opinion on, on, you know, where you think you want to lock in rates where you think that you can, you can be in, in variable environments.   Colin (28m 44s): Yeah. Good question. So numb number places, one on, on the fixed versus fair, but we, we have generally put, had a predisposition to have as much fixed as possible on the view that, you know, this environment is benign in terms of the cost of debt. And so if we could sort of lock in some of that, that's, that's quite attractive now in certain places, it's pretty hard to do that. So construction financing being one, but we're possible that's being broadly the approach and, and this, and now that's a worldwide thing.   So, you know, I think that approach was most pronounced pre pandemic in places like Japan and also in Germany and other European countries. But I think now that's a Candace point, a us point, et cetera, on the other side, which is on the property type side, that's interesting, right? Because multifamily have one year, at least a student housing and maybe eight months, maybe 12 month policing. And when you look at an inflation world of rising interest rate world, that becomes quite interesting, even pre pandemic we're down in Australia, looking at industrial, we took a lot of comfort from the structure of leases in, in, for industrial product in Australia, which have a rental escalations each year.   And it's quite quite attractive at two to 3% per year. And so some now, sorry, that's quite attractive right now, right? Hopefully, hopefully it's attractive in five years, but I think that's also important. What's the structure of the leasing in, in the property types that you're investing in. And, and it's interesting, even in the office environment today, we're seeing leasing transform a little bit. We're seeing shorter term leases, not due to inflation, just due to uncertainty in office, but the, you know, the, I guess the net benefit of what might be viewed as more challenging leasing dynamic is you might have a little bit more flexibility in the shorter term if we, if we do have, you know, rising rates due to rising inflation.   So it is a complicated point, but we, we really began thinking about it in earnest in 2020. You know, we, we thought about it in 2019 and 2018, but in 2020, as we saw some of those significant changes and by the way, on the fed. Yeah. So that was a watershed moment. At least to me, when they moved off that sort of target, they also sort of announced, I think in the September meeting to be, you know, that they would begin tapering. Now we've been tapering in Canada for awhile, but I also think that's an important announcement that probably didn't get as much press as it should.   And then the program to taper fully, I think goes until June of next year. And after that, you would, you know, at least conceivably expect that rates would begin to rise. And I think to most people that would be sooner than what most people anticipate for the U S fed to, to do so. Yes, the feds made a few announcements that I think of come beneath that radar screen.   Jesse (31m 59s): I think it's one of those things that when it comes down to the ground level for us at the property level, whether it's, you know, office leasing or retail, I think there is potential for return of, you know, we've had leases where in the nineties and eighties, you'd see these legacy leases where they didn't have step-ups discreetly, but they had, you know, each, each year your rent would rise or your base rent would rise as a function of the CPI index. So it'd be interesting to see if we go back to more of kind of targeted step-ups that really want to go up with inflation, you know, if that's going to be a big enough thing where you, you see that translate, but yeah, it's, it's definitely something that's on the interest rate side, curious for all everybody, you know, we have people on that are, I find extremely smart that will have complete opposite opinions on inflation and interest rates.   So it's one of those things where you watch carefully, but in terms of having a crystal ball for where, where rates are going to go, I mean, I think I've confidently said rates will have to go up for the last 10 years.   Colin (33m 5s): Yeah, that's right. That's right. And, and, and eating a bit of humble pie is essential when, when, when prognosticating about these saints, because it's, you know, it's, it's almost like predicting currencies. There's just so much that goes in to, to, to, you know, what the fed does or what the bank of Canada does. And, you know, you can raise rate rates quickly or slowly. You might raise some that dance through there is, there's quite a lot in there.   And then you've got geopolitics, you've got a health pandemic and, and, you know, so sitting in 2019, nobody would have anticipated, right. Where rates would be today, just nobody would have gone in that. Right. So to your point, yes, I, I definitely eat some humble pie as well.   Jesse (33m 54s): Yeah, no, fair enough. You, you control what you can control. And, you know, we were in one of those few industries where you can directly almost directly pass on inflation to your customer, but it's a interesting point, especially in the Canadian environment, when you talk about student rentals where you essentially can mark to market your rental rates almost almost annually, usually two years, three years. But, you know, for those that don't know the Canadian environment, even in multi res, even though they're one year leases, you're not really marketing to market within, you know, every year, you know, the turnover can be, depending on the asset can be quite a bit different than, than student res.   Yeah,   Colin (34m 32s): Absolutely. And that, and, and, and that will be interesting going forward, right? Because you had folks in the last year or so, depending on the market and depending on the product, and this is more of a condo shadow inventory point that moves to take advantage of some of the lower rents in the multi-res side, that due to, you know, rent control, both, you know, use Toronto or Ontario as an example, you would think that the turnover rates going to decline materially, at least in the short term, as a result and in, in the student world, you know, it's, it's doubly interesting.   So number one, you've got your normal turnover folks graduate, but you also have this year and next year cold called the bulge in the class. You've got people that might've delayed, that are now taking the class people that were at home that are now going back to campus. You've got campuses that were virtual, like Ryerson here in Toronto that are going back to in-person in January. So that re all of that combined, and then you've got international students that are coming back.   It makes it a really interesting place to be in the student world. Yeah.   Jesse (35m 50s): Yeah, for sure. Colin, I want to be respectful of the time here, but I do want to talk about the, the black opportunity fund for those that don't know what it is. I just want to, you know, before we, we ask our final questions here, I mean, just in kind of asking the question, are you able to talk a little bit about the fund moving on to kind of culture in our commercial real estate world? You know, we can talk about specifically here in our area, but I think culture is very similar, our commercial real estate culture.   So I'd like to just kind of get your view on where we're at right now, from your point of view, you know, we're what improvements from a cultural standpoint you think that we can make and, and yeah. And on that talking a little bit about the fund and what it is.   Colin (36m 37s): Yeah, absolutely. So first the culture culture in real estate, in the commercial real estate world, it is a highly congenial culture and relies a lot on personal and interpersonal interaction and the log on the power of networks. And that's just a global global point and familiarity with each other on the basis, usually of doing deals and transactions and working through situations, none of that's overly bad.   What I have found, whether it's going to expo in new Nick or whether it's going to, you know, an animal con conference in Beijing is it's extraordinarily a male and be uniform. And when I stepped back from that, I think, you know, the folks that occupy our properties are not all male and not all uniform. And we live in one of the most incredibly rapidly changing and advancing times ever, right?   We're in the fourth industrial revolution and everything literally is changing. And so how can an owner operator of real estate realistically tell their investors that they're the best in the world at what they do, but their staff is only, you know, only calls from a quarter of the population in the country or city in which they're in. I just don't think it's possible. There are smart people out there, brilliant people out there that would make fantastic real estate investors that aren't actually able to get into real estate for X, Y, Z at ABC reasons.   So I think that's a problem for the real estate industry as much or more than it is a problem for society. But if we can solve that problem, we create better outcomes. And this isn't just that, you know, this isn't a CSR thing. I E the thing at the back of the annual report and where everybody's smiling, no, this is actually a, Hey, you can do, you can create better returns by having smarter people running the strategies, running the real estate.   So what's the black opportunity fund, a billion and a half world's largest pool of capital to fund a black led black focus, black serving charities nonprofits on one hand businesses entrepreneurs on the other hand. And why, because when we went through the last two years accelerated by what happened, George Floyd, we saw a ton of organizations doing fantastic work, just subscale.   They just need a capital. And it, why? Because we thought, Hey, why don't we start an, you know, a scholarship? Well, there's a ton of organizations getting scholarships. Why don't we start an after-school program? There's tons of organizations. There are literally hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of nonprofits, by the way, didn't say charities because they don't have even the scale to get through the process to become a registered charity. So they're non-profits, but they're, you know, moms and pops doing their best with the limited resources that we, that they have.   So black opportunity for motivate contributions from corporations, governments, individuals, families, anybody, we think it's a whole, a candidate problem to scale up these charities, nonprofits on the businesses and entrepreneurs side. There are thousands of entrepreneurs and businesses, all of them virtually all of them, very small. And the number one issue statistically as surveyed is access to capital.   And there is both and a perception issue and also true difficulty accessing meaning financial institutions are less likely, and this was studied by the, the federal reserve are less likely to give to an individual of color. There, there are like more likely to be determined, to be high risk.   And as a result, individuals of color are less likely then to go to those financial institutions. So you have sort of this negative wheel created. And so we're just trying to break that and create an assessable pool of capital to provide. So that's the goal of the black opportunity fund. We have been raised capital TD just announced a couple of weeks ago, $10 million plus office space. Plus the conduct individuals, national bank announced 6 million, just over $6 million to, to the black opportunity fund.   There's been a number of other contributions, but we're early meaning we've got a ways to go. We spent a lot of time creating the infrastructure at the correct governance, the board, et cetera, et cetera. And it's been a huge effort, more than 300 folks involved. We talked to thousands of businesses and charities and all, all across the country. And that's important to geography. Folks think about Toronto and Montreal. They overlook St.   Johns and Halifax and equalizer. We want to focus completely across the country, French and English, female, and male, and, and, and also LGBTQ plus, et cetera, that is important to us. And so that's the black opportunity fund.   Jesse (42m 29s): Yeah, I think, I think for, you know, from the point of view of the industry, I think me personally, I think that's why it's important to have these carefully, these organizations do these care for careful, you know, dis w whatever you want to call them, disparate impact studies, but we're looking at what policy actually does at the end of the day. You know, we have XYZ goal for policy, but what is really happening in reality? One thing that really clicked for me was I was in business school years ago in Toronto, and we had a venture capital capitalist that was talking to our class.   And he said that he had his daughter, she was going into computer science and programming and university of Waterloo for, you know, the Americans listening pretty much our Silicon valley in Canada. And he said, he went, brought her into programming and it was an orientation. And as most people could imagine, 99.9, 9% male. And initially I remember thinking, well, you know, if, if you go into something and you have people that are interested in that and they want to do it, and it happens to be disproportionate to society, you know, that's people making, making decisions, but then you said something, I think it would always stuck with me.   And when we have these conversations, I always think about this is, he said, these are, this is the generation that's going to design the virtual reality in geography. We plan the way that we navigate the world is a lot of it is going to be on the computer. A lot of it is going to be software. Do you really want this one cohort of people, no matter how great they are with all the blind, you know, the blind side, you know, the blind spots that they have. Do you want that to be what creates the future and designs it, or do you want to have a multitude of different views where the collective blind spots, you know, create something that is very clear?   Colin (44m 22s): Yeah, no, that's exactly. That's exactly it. And the tech world to that point has had its owns for the realization. Cause you know, commercial real estate, isn't alone. I mean, I'd say broadly the investment world, same thing broadly, broadly the tech world. But if you stay, you know, I stepped back and I've, and I've posed this question and truly a few times, it's like, why, why is it that virtually all of the administrative assistants are female. And it's like, do you, do you grow up?   Are you born? And you grow up and there's an innate desire as a female to become an admin assistant that doesn't exist for males. And clearly the answer is no, at least at least my interpretation and understanding of medicine yields me to conclude. That's probably not the case. It's probably a societal expectation. But if you take it to your example or the instance of commercial real estate owners, you know, how, how is it that you will grow?   How can you grasp future trends? How will you understand how people want to live, work and play, how they want to shop the types of retailers? They w retailers that they want to go to the experience that they want to have in lifestyle oriented centers. How can you actually understand that? If it's five dudes planning out the layout of the mall, right? It just, I don't get it. So to me, it's kind of like, well, you want to, you want to draw people in so that you have these different points of view.   So   Jesse (46m 0s): You're just going to go to that mall and not have any place for, for your, any daycare to put your child.   Colin (46m 7s): Yeah. Pretty much   Jesse (46m 9s): Awesome. And okay. I've, you know, we've been very, very generous with your time here calling. We have four questions. We ask everybody on, on the show. So if you're cool, I'll S I'll send them your way.   Colin (46m 20s): Sounds good.   Jesse (46m 22s): Okay. What's one thing, you know, now in your career, you wish you knew when you started,   Colin (46m 27s): I say, boldly use using the Wayne Gretzky analogy, which is old flea. Think about where that puck is going and skate, where that puck is going versus looking at the shiny object today and going to that shiny object today.   Jesse (46m 46s): Yeah, that's great. I haven't heard that in a while B be where that thing or that puck is going to be not where it, not, where it is in terms of, we always ask guests in terms of what you would tell younger people, getting into our industry, and just generally your view of mentorship,   Colin (47m 3s): Jay mentorships, critical more than my mistakes has been not caring mentors throughout my career. As I progress, meaning I have lots of mentors as I began my career. And then you sort of, you know, go through the different levels and you know, you get busy, it falls off you, you know, whatever, it's a terrible thing. I think mentors are absolutely critical. Gives you a perspective on, on things that you're seeing today that, that person's seen in a different way, 3, 4, 5 different times, and can tell you what they did or what didn't do more important than that is a mentor calls out your bullshit.   And that's really important sometimes. And so that's valuable somebody coming into the industry today, what would I say? It is a relationship industry at the end of the day. I mean, you got to do the work you got to do well, you got to have passion for it. So if you don't have passion for real estate, don't go into real estate. So assuming you're passionate for real estate, it's a networking industry, it's a relationship industry. And so take that time to go out and take somebody to drinks.   Or if you don't drink, take them to lunch, whatever it is, because that, that is what gets your career going in the industry.   Jesse (48m 29s): Yeah, absolutely. What is one or two books or podcasts that you are constantly recommending?   Colin (48m 35s): Yeah, that's a good question. I do like Malcolm Gladwell's books a lot. I wish I could say I've got a long book list. I wish I could say I've read all the books on that book list. There's a book that comes to mind. It was it's the power of one. I read it in literally high school, but it, it, it, it just speaks to me as a story about courage and resilience that, you know, I think is beneficial today.   And if I go back to your earlier question about advice, people used to say in, I banking world, it's a marathon, not a sprint. It absolutely is. And so to run that marathon, you need resilience and you need that, you know, that, that capacity to endure, to learn, to fall down, to, you know, make mistakes and to get up even better. Yeah. That, that book, the pair, the power of one was quite, quite instrumental to me, even though I read it so many years ago. Awesome.   Jesse (49m 39s): We'll put a link up to that. And the last question, my favorite layup first car make and model.   Colin (49m 48s): So funny enough, I've never, I've never owned a car because I've always lived in, in urban centers and have, you know, subscribed to the notion of taking the subway, walking everywhere and now taking Uber's. But the first car is likely to be some form of electric vehicle. Can't say it's going to be a Tesla, but it might be a, so let's go with Tesla and some electric vehicles.   Jesse (50m 16s): I like it. That's the first guest to prospect there, their first car. And the second one that, that they've always, they've always been public transit oriented. So I think that trend is going to continue going in that direction.   Colin (50m 30s): Yeah. I was early on that train cause you know, you know, it was very unusual, but you know, just like the, not having a landline telephone, a terrain that was early on that too, but eventually I'm going to have to give them, I know I can, I can see it coming in. It's probably going to be that Evy, hopefully when those batteries are better, there you go   Jesse (50m 50s): Calling for those, for those interested in getting in contact with you or anybody that wants to see, you know, what you guys are up to, what would be the best place to reach out?   Colin (51m 1s): Yeah. So LinkedIn is, is, is good. People do reach out through that in terms of finding, you know, what we're up to black opportunity fund for bear has a good website, lots of info there. We keep it up to date as it relates to T them and global real estate and our Canadian real estate, there is a T damn website, like most websites in the, in the investment world. We don't tend to overload it with information.   So, but T them does have a LinkedIn page. And so that is also quite active. So following either TDM on LinkedIn or on Twitter, there's there's information there. And if you don't want to do either and just want to message me on LinkedIn, you can, and eventually I'll get back to you.   Jesse (51m 54s): My guest today has been calling Lynch con thanks for being part of working capital   Colin (51m 59s): Pleasure. Pleasure. It was great conversation.   Jesse (52m 8s): Thank you so much for listening to working capital the real estate podcast. I'm your host, Jesse for galley. If you liked the episode, head on to iTunes and leave us a five-star review and share on social media, it really helps us out. If you have any questions, feel free to reach out to me on Instagram, Jesse for galley, F R a G a L E, have a good one take care.

Becoming Boss Podcast
87. Upline or Leader

Becoming Boss Podcast

Play Episode Listen Later Jan 10, 2022 33:41


Are you managing your team or are you leading your team? One will keep your business stagnant and you'll be scrambling to keep up with your daily business and team's needs. The other will allow you to trust yourself, your systems, and your people.    Many people think: when I make XYZ or when I hit my next rank up, I'll become a leader in my business. But leadership doesn't just magically come with a rank. You have to intentionally develop those skills and teach them to your team. Leaders aren't born, leaders are made. The good news is that you can learn the skills to become a great leader!     Here are a few key takeaways:   The main differences between being an upline and a leader Why many people suffer from imposter syndrome after a rank up The reason a team hides from a manager and seeks out a leader Why taking radical responsibility over your results is a key trait in a leader Being a leader isn't about rank or status-it's an identity How systems help you in your ability to lead your team   Stepping into the leadership role is one of the more challenging parts of growing your business. But if you master this skill, you will have more peace, more growth, and yes: more strong leaders on your team.   Interested in Kristen's exclusive mastermind for six-figure earners in the network marketing industry? Get all the details and join the waitlist here.   Thanks for listening! Do you have a question about network marketing? Kristen can help! Drop your question here, and she just might answer it live on the podcast: https://Kristenboss.com/question   If you're ready to learn the simple process of running your social selling business online, you have to check out Kristen's live group coaching program! The Social Selling Academy: www.thesocialsellingacademy.com

Sales Game Changers | Tip-Filled  Conversations with Sales Leaders About Their Successful Careers
454: Red Hat Premier Sales Channel Leader Mike Byrd Says Your 2022 Goals Can Achieved By Doing This

Sales Game Changers | Tip-Filled Conversations with Sales Leaders About Their Successful Careers

Play Episode Listen Later Jan 10, 2022 35:32


Read the complete transcript on the Sales Game Changers Podcast website. Mike is an IES Premier Sales Leaders. Learn more here. Find Mike on LinkedIn. MIKE'S' TIP: "Figure out what your goals are. The goals aren't just, “Make my number.” Sometimes the goal is, “I need to be strategically relevant to XYZ customer,” “I need to find my own sales process, build my own sales engine.” Figure out what your top 2-3 goals are and no more than that. Then work backwards from there. Think, how long is it going to take me and what do I need to do to slowly build up to accomplishing what these goals might be? The buildup needs to be set with marker flags. Marker flags are leading indicators of success."

Facebook Ads Agency Builders
Perfecting the Art of Agency Partnerships with Yan Zhang|EP63

Facebook Ads Agency Builders

Play Episode Listen Later Jan 6, 2022 66:01


In this episode, Tyler Narducci talks with Yan Zhang the founder of XYZ Advantage, a performance marketing agency that works with some of the fastest-growing brands and agencies. Yan is an incredible leader as well as an expert in agency partnerships. XYZ specializes in performance-based marketing, bottom-of-funnel-driven SEO, and high ROI email marketing. In addition to running a highly successful agency, Yan's professional career has included titles such as financial analyst, marketing consultant, manager, and of course, fearless entrepreneur. Covered in this episode: How to leverage partnerships to scale an agency What to look for in an agency partner What it's like to go from a 9-5 to Agency Owner What the first 3 months of a startup agency look like Lessons and challenges learned while growing an agency Agency contractor models (White-label vs. Freelance vs. Employees) ... and SO MUCH MORE! In this podcast you get the latest success strategies, scaling techniques, and top-tier interviews with agency industry professionals sharing their success stories and lighting the pathway for all to follow. Learn how to go from a freelance marketer to a 7-figure agency owner. Want to skip all the "learned it the hard way" mistakes most agency owners make? Ready to implement a system that cranks out high-ticket leads, rapidly builds your team, and lands your new deals FOR YOU?

MicroFamous
What To Do When You Sell Different Things To Different People

MicroFamous

Play Episode Listen Later Jan 6, 2022 14:30


Years ago I caught an Uber and it was a nice newer black Infiniti sedan.  Along the way, the driver explains that his day job is a financial advisor and he drives for Uber on the side for extra cash because he's newer in the business. Now ask yourself, In that moment, was he an influential financial advisor to me? No, because I had already put him in the category of Uber driver. He couldn't market and sell himself to me as both an Uber driver AND a financial advisor. In my mind, there's only room for him in one category. But we're making this same mistake every day, and that's the topic of this episode. One of the missions of the podcast is to break down things that are confusing and frustrating so we can be less critical of ourselves and move forward with more calm, confidence and clarity.    So I want to dive into a common frustration we have with branding and marketing, which is how do we market ourselves when we sell more than one thing? In my opinion anyone can become MicroFamous, yet we have to be strategic, focused and consistent to get there. To reach the level of being famously influential. It's hard to be strategic, focused and consistent when our energy is pulled in a bunch of different directions.  Not to mention the fact that people automatically put us into one category. “Jeff is a business coach, Linda is a consultant, Jay is an author, etc.” Because people have a really hard time putting us into more than one category, it's hard to become famously influential for more than one thing to the same people. And when we're talking about different offers and services to the same people, that's basically what we're doing. We end up confusing people. And if you think everyone but you has their s#%t together, think again.  Even big companies who know better do this kind of thing all the time. The best example I've seen lately are the hilariously terrible Bud Light Seltzer ads. Have you seen these? So here's the backstory. Bud Light's parent company tries to get into the hard seltzer space with a new brand and it flops. So they come back with a brilliant idea to market hard seltzer under the Bud Light brand. You can see how screwed up this idea is in their own commercials. One of their TV ads starts this way: “The Bud Light logo makes people think our seltzer is a beer, so we hired recruited retired NFL players Nick Mangold to Block It Out! Now it's a mildly amusing commercial, but it's less funny when we realize we're doing the same thing when we're selling a bunch of different things.  We basically have to go around saying, “Hey I know you think I sell ABC, but I actually do XYZ! Surprise!” Of course, we know we're confusing people, we just don't know what to do about it. So we start asking ourselves questions like: How can I be more clear with my brand and my message? Could I put everything under the same brand?  Can I find one brand that allows me to do all the things I want to do under the same brand? I call that the Search for the Magic Umbrella. A Magic Umbrella is a brand or an idea that acts as an umbrella we can put over just about anything we want to do or create or sell. And I see people twisting themselves into pretzels trying to find it.  It's a very noisy, cluttered world out there. Especially online. One of the core principles of the MicroFamous system is that in order to cut through the noise, we have to deliver a Clear & Compelling Idea. An idea that is so razor-sharp clear that people understand it very quickly, and so compelling that it grabs their attention and makes them say, “Holy cow, I didn't know that thing existed. How can I learn more!?” Unfortunately, searching for a Magic Umbrella where we can market and talk about several different offers and services leads us away from a Clear & Compelling Idea....

Dig Me Out - The 90's rock podcast
#574: Interview with Terry Ilous of XYZ, Great White, and Land of Gypsies

Dig Me Out - The 90's rock podcast

Play Episode Listen Later Jan 6, 2022 60:44


Of late, Terry Ilous is probably best known as Jack Russell's replacement in Great White (“Once Bitten, Twice Shy”), a position he held from 2010 until his surprising dismissal in 2018, but from the mid-80s until the mid-90s, Ilous fronted the Sunset Strip band XYZ (“Inside Out”, “What Keeps Me Loving You”, “Face Down in the Gutter”). In this revealing conversation, Ilous shares how XYZ bassist Pat Fontaine tricked him into moving to the U.S. from France with promises of sex, drugs, and rock n' roll, the unlikely way XYZ landed a record deal with Enigma Records, working with Don Dokken on the band's 1989 debut, touring with the likes of Foreigner, Ozzy Osbourne, and Ted Nugent, the arrival of grunge and the devastating effects it had on Ilous's career for the rest of the ‘90s and how he left the music business for a number of years before being lured back in through the unlikeliest of ways (voiceover work for cartoons). Ilous has reformed XYZ and still plays shows under that band name while also releasing solo material and fronting Land of Gypsies, whose self-titled debut was released by Frontiers Music in December.   Songs In This Episode: Intro - Inside Out by XYZ (from self-titled) 12:56 - Face Down In The Gutter by XYZ (from Hungry) Outro - Don't Say No by XYZ (from Hungry)   Support the podcast, join the DMO UNION at Patreon. Listen to the episode archive at DigMeOutPodcast.com.

Dig Me Out - The 90s rock podcast
#574: Interview with Terry Ilous of XYZ, Great White, and Land of Gypsies

Dig Me Out - The 90s rock podcast

Play Episode Listen Later Jan 6, 2022 60:44


Of late, Terry Ilous is probably best known as Jack Russell's replacement in Great White (“Once Bitten, Twice Shy”), a position he held from 2010 until his surprising dismissal in 2018, but from the mid-80s until the mid-90s, Ilous fronted the Sunset Strip band XYZ (“Inside Out”, “What Keeps Me Loving You”, “Face Down in the Gutter”). In this revealing conversation, Ilous shares how XYZ bassist Pat Fontaine tricked him into moving to the U.S. from France with promises of sex, drugs, and rock n' roll, the unlikely way XYZ landed a record deal with Enigma Records, working with Don Dokken on the band's 1989 debut, touring with the likes of Foreigner, Ozzy Osbourne, and Ted Nugent, the arrival of grunge and the devastating effects it had on Ilous's career for the rest of the ‘90s and how he left the music business for a number of years before being lured back in through the unlikeliest of ways (voiceover work for cartoons). Ilous has reformed XYZ and still plays shows under that band name while also releasing solo material and fronting Land of Gypsies, whose self-titled debut was released by Frontiers Music in December.   Songs In This Episode: Intro - Inside Out by XYZ (from self-titled) 12:56 - Face Down In The Gutter by XYZ (from Hungry) Outro - Don't Say No by XYZ (from Hungry)   Support the podcast, join the DMO UNION at Patreon. Listen to the episode archive at DigMeOutPodcast.com.

the Joshua Schall Audio Experience
2021 Year in Review | J. Schall Consulting Edition

the Joshua Schall Audio Experience

Play Episode Listen Later Jan 5, 2022 11:05


How did J. Schall Consulting do in 2021? For those that only know me as a “content creator” shame on you, well I guess shame on me for not better explaining who I am and what I actually do for a living. I certainly don't make money creating content, on the contrary, it costs me a shit ton of money in opportunity costs annually but don't worry I'm not quitting anytime soon. The variety of business strategy content does serve as a great content marketing tool for my consulting company J. Schall Consulting. Believe it or not, 2022 will mark the ten-year anniversary of J. Schall Consulting. Within the last almost decade, I've successfully built my boutique consulting company into a world-renowned leader in growth strategies for clients that are positioned inside the emerging and intersecting categories of functional food, beverage, and nutritional supplements. These CPG clients range in size from pre-launch to billion-dollar companies. They are also not always traditional consumer “brands”, as 2021 brought even more diversity in projects with one-third of all projects being on the supply side of the industry. These ranged from contract manufacturers to ingredient suppliers to agricultural technology to flavor companies and everything in-between. My projects focal points range throughout the full entrepreneurial ideation to consumerization cycle, with very few areas being outside of my wheelhouse. Before I get started with some recap statistics, I would like to thank everyone for making this my most impactful year ever. I know I said that last year, but we built on that momentum and that snowball rolling down the hill is growing in size. For those that trusted me by giving me some of your attention, I'm humbled and don't take that for granted as I know the caliber of person that consumes my content and that time you give me is extremely valuable. For those that took it a step further and not only consumed but implemented something from my content into your business, you owe me dinner at the next trade show we are both at! Just kidding and thank you to those that have messaged me privately saying something from XYZ piece of content helped you in 2021. For my clients, we anticipated that 2021 wasn't going to be easy, but everyone kept a positive agile mindset. You trusted me and I can't thank you enough for being a major part of my successful year. If you can find a path with no obstacles, it probably doesn't lead anywhere, right? Digital Nomad Lifestyle = https://youtu.be/31OBQDhl-ME FOLLOW ME ON MY SOCIAL MEDIA ACCOUNTS LINKEDIN - https://www.linkedin.com/in/joshuaschallmba TWITTER - https://www.twitter.com/joshua_schall INSTAGRAM - https://www.instagram.com/joshua_schall FACEBOOK - https://www.facebook.com/jschallconsulting MEDIUM - https://www.medium.com/@joshuaschall

Agency Intelligence
Power Women In Insurance: Capitalizing on Technology To Build Your Brand Online With Stacie King

Agency Intelligence

Play Episode Listen Later Jan 5, 2022 42:23


In this episode of Power Women In Insurance, Teresa Kitchens sits down with Stacie King, CEO of Stacie King & Company and Digital Content & Communications Director at Agentero. Stacie is amazing at using online content to build brands, increase awareness and provide education to the insurance space.  Episode Highlights: Stacie shares her background and experience. (1:42) Stacie discusses her current role and responsibilities as a digital content director. (8:26) Stacie states that agents should not be afraid to embrace technological innovation. (11:41) Stacie says that listening to podcasts sparks listeners' creativity and gives the listeners new ideas they can apply to their company or work. (17:22) Stacie shares tips on how you can improve your marketing through podcasts and social media. (21:22) Stacie states that there are a lot of media options that agents can use to connect to their prospects and clients. (26:06) Stacie shares what she does when she sees a potential post she can use for her marketing. (31:56) Stacie believes that one of the most important things agents should have is LinkedIn. (33:35) Stacie shares the most important line that agents should start with. (36:15)   Key Quotes: “I wanted to show people who have had a lot of adversity, and who have got various challenges, and who overcome them and succeed and do cool things and big things in their lives, even though they've had some challenges.” - Stacie King “I encourage agents if nothing else, you don't have to be the expert at all things right? You can rely on other resources, you can rely on other people to fill in the gaps in the areas that maybe you're not as strong in.” - Stacie King “If I can teach people anything, here's the one I want you to remember: What can I do for you today? I have a lot of contacts in the XYZ industry, or I have a lot of resources at my disposal, how can I help you? That's the line that everyone needs to start with.” - Stacie King Resources Mentioned: Stacie King LinkedIn Agentero Contact Teresa Kitchens Sterling Insurance Group

MannaFM
Vitaminokkal a Covid ellen - XYZ Prekopa Donáttal 2022. 01 .04.

MannaFM

Play Episode Listen Later Jan 3, 2022 30:12


Egy friss kutatás szerint nem csak a D vitamin, hanem a D és a K2 vitaminok együtt meg tudják erősíteni annyira a szervezetet, hogy ellenállóvá válik a Koronavírussal szemben, sőt a tüneteket is enyhítheti ha esetleg mégis megbetegszünk. Hogy mindennek ellenére mégis miért tehet jót ha valamilyen enyhe téli fertőzésen átesünk az kiderül ma este az XYZ-ben, ahol erről a kutatásról beszél Dr Balaicza Erika belgyógyász.

The Disciplined Investor
TDI Podcast: Tools of the Trade (#747)

The Disciplined Investor

Play Episode Listen Later Jan 2, 2022 33:46


Wrapping up a great year – Goodbye to 2021 and HELLO to 2022! In this episode, we take a moment to sharpen the saw – a deep dive looking at the tools of the trade that can help with research, charting, news and more. Starting out the year on the right foot... DECEMBER 2021 - WEBINAR REPLAY Follow @andrewhorowitz Looking for style diversification? More information on the TDI Managed Growth Strategy - https://thedisciplinedinvestor.com/blog/tdi-strategy/ eNVESTOLOGY Info - https://envestology.com/ Friday Pre-Market Run-Down Webinar Registration - https://www.triggercharts.com/webinar-pre-market-rundown-fridays/ Stocks mentioned in this episode: (XYZ), (SPY), (QQQ)

The Cutting Edge Japan Business Show By Dale Carnegie Training Tokyo, Japan

The sales process is a process with different phases and stages.  The skilled salesperson knows how to navigate their way through these phases in the conversation with the buyer.   We have a defined sales cycle in our interactions with our clients.  We build the trust, ask the key questions to understand need, present the solution, deal with pushback and ask for the business.  Of course, there is the pre-meeting preparation and the post meeting follow up, but the actual sales call runs through this cycle.  Between these key phases there are bridges we need to put in place to make the sales talk flow run smoothly.  What do you do now?  Do you have defined phases or is it looking like spaghetti, rather than a road map?   One of the key bridges is the very start of the conversation.  In Japan this usually starts in the lobby or their office, as you wait for your buyer or when they enter the meeting room their staff have shown you to.  Many Western countries have gone all modern and dispensed with business cards or meishi but what a gold mine they are in Japan.  I usually receive the meishi English side up, facing me, because that is the polite format in Japan.  I read the English side and then flip it over because the Japanese side will have better information.  If the kanji for the name is a bit on the rare side, I will mention that and ask if their family comes from a particular region where that name is more common.  This is handy because it shows them I can read Japanese, I know about Japan well enough to know their name is rare and it gets them talking.  Or I might just ask them about the position they hold inside the company.   Japan is pretty good at small talk before we get into the main business.  That is not how we do it in the West.  I remember meeting a high powered, foreign President of a major multi national here recently, who had just arrived from the US for his Japan posting.  I started with some small talk, got about five seconds into it when he announced, “Let's get down to business”.  I was fine with that but I was also thinking he was going to have a tough time in Japan, because he doesn't understand the niceties of Japanese social interaction.   Having hopefully built up a convivial atmosphere with the buyer, we get into the sales conversation proper.  Japanese salespeople won't ask the buyer questions because it is considered rude to ask the buyer, aka GOD, questions.  This means they go forth blindly delivering their pitch.  We have 155 training modules in our line up, so how would I know which ones to focus on, if I didn't ask some questions first?  Pitching is a sure formula for rejection in my experience in Japan, compared to finding out what the buyer needs.  So we need to get permission from the buyer to ask questions, as the next bridge in order to move the conversation forward.'   We do this by saying, “We did XYZ for ABC company.  Maybe we could do the same for you.  I am not sure, but in order for me to know if that is possible or not would you mind if I asked a few questions?”.  Or, we could say, “I have never been to the American Congressional Library, but I imagine it with books running from  floor to the ceiling five stories high.  I have the same thing in my brain, regarding not books but solutions for client problems.  We have such a huge line up.  In order for me to select only the most relevant, pin point solutions for your issues, would you mind if I asked a few questions, so I can narrow down what I should talk about?”.    Having been able to ask our questions, we now make the decision for the client as to what they should buy.  We only introduce those solutions and no more or we have the danger of overwhelming the client with so much detail, they can't buy anything.    Before we get into the solution, we need to use a bridge to inform them that we can help them.  We might say, “Thank you and now I understand clearly what you are looking for.  The specification, quality and speed of delivery required are all with in our capability.  Allow me to take you through the details”.  Or, “Having listened to what you need, I have refined our range, down to the best solution to fit your needs.  Please let me take you through it”.  At the end of the solution presentation process of feature-benefit-application of the benefit- evidence, we go into a trial close, as a bridge to the next stage of the sales cycle.  We say, ”So how does that sound so far?”.  We are trying to flesh out any further questions, clarifications or objections.   When we face an objection such as “your price is too high”, we need a bridge to be put in place before we attempt to answer it.  We should always smile sweetly and say, “Thank you.  May I ask why you say that?”. And then shut up, add nothing more, make no interventions, just sit there in silence until they answer us, even if we have to wait until hell freezes over.    At the end of our explanation dealing with their concerns, hesitations and objections, we just say, “So how does that sound, have I answered all of your concerns?”.  We want to know if there are any hidden objections or sticking points preventing the deal from going ahead.  If there are none, then we can just say, “Shall we go ahead?”.   This is not pushy and is especially useful in Japan, where sales are more low powered, rather than like the high powered American versions.   As we move through the different phases of the sale call, we need to link the phases together and this is why we need to have our bridges ready to go.  

The Marketing 24-7 Podcast
When It Pays To Not Listen To Your Customer

The Marketing 24-7 Podcast

Play Episode Listen Later Jan 2, 2022 6:16


Your Opinion does Not Matter Amazing products go undiscovered and companies go broke every single year because of people's opinions. Your opinion does not matter. People are afraid to push the envelope with their marketing because of all the opinions that get in the way. It's too pushy... My audience won't resonate with that kind of marketing... It'll turn them off... And it's not just entrepreneur opinions that bankrupt businesses either. It's entrepreneurs who listen to their customers' opinions. Customer opinions don't matter either. Well, not all of the time. When you survey your audience on Facebook or with an email and they boldly tell you that your new sales letter or video or marketing campaign is not attractive to them, remember this: "What your audience says and what they do are sometimes entirely different!" You know this, right? You ask people if they will buy XYZ and they all yell YES! But then you release it and… crickets! Or people will tell you they don't like your new sales message, but $175 per customer later, you take that opinion all the way to the bank! When I started the split tests for my 45- day - LinkedIn Program, I had an opinion about which Optin Page would work the best. Guess what? I was wrong big time.  The page with the LinkedIn logo won.  Go figure… Now this message should encourage you rather than discourage you, because it means you don't have to “read the stars” to be successful in business. It means that if you're willing to put your opinions aside (or should I say ego aside), and follow the math, the money, and the data to set the direction, you too can leverage the marketing secrets I present in this Podcast. That's right “the path is math.” Not opinion. Watch what people do with their credit cards. Put your opinions aside, and don't be afraid to use the methods that have millions of dollars of evidence to back them up. BTW if you'd like to check out my 45 Day Linked In Program and see a high converting optin page in action, visit petergianoli.com/Linkedin-mastery

Living the Sweat Lifestyle
Goals Galore - New ideas to consider when setting your 2022 & Beyond Health Goals

Living the Sweat Lifestyle

Play Episode Listen Later Dec 30, 2021 36:25


As the end of the year is approaching, or for anytime you are ready to put a stake in the ground and set a new health goal, this episode is for you. I'm sharing 5 new ideas to consider on how to set yourself up for success to reach your goals, as well as a handful of questions to ask yourself at the end, that could change your outlook fundamentally, so making healthy choices is easier and they come naturally vs. 'having to eat XYZ way' or 'I have to workout' - instead you'll be the person who wants to make healthy choices. Use these tools to create real results in 2022 or anytime!! *If you want to surrounded yourself with likeminded people & have a go-to place to ask any questions that come up around your goals, nutrition, working out, or anything around you achieving your goals, join us in 'The Sweat Life' FB group. Link below! *If you haven't been able to reach your health goal year after year and are ready to actually create the results you want, book a free call with the link below or text me you are interested in learning more (9540=-801-0797). We'll talk about where you are at and how I can help you reach your goal. I guarantee my clients get the results they are looking for, so no need to worry if it will work or not. It will work or you get your money back. https://calendly.com/samanthanivenscoaching/coaching-consult If you liked this episode, please be sure to share with a friend and rate us on iTunes! Make sure you don't miss a single episode, subscribe on Apple Podcasts, Stitcher, RSS, or follow on Spotify! Follow Samantha on Social Media: *Instagram - @samanthasreallife *Facebook - Samantha Nivens *YouTube - 'Ultra Health Hub with Samantha Nivens' - for health hacks, workout tips, inspiration and more! *The Sweat Life Facebook Group - https://www.facebook.com/groups/thesweatlifecollective/ Get all the tangible tips & tools (from fitness, to nutrition, to habits, to mindset, etc.) to create ALL the healthy habits to gain energy, feel better, love your body, lose weight, conquer cravings, stay motivated, be inspired, and so much more.

Real Food. Real Conversations.
How to Deal With Trauma

Real Food. Real Conversations.

Play Episode Listen Later Dec 29, 2021 37:54


It is hard to know how to deal with trauma when you're in the thick of it. Learning strategies you can easily put in place is key! When we are struggling, it's hard to have the energy to come up with ideas on how to make it through. Which is why having these tools in our back pocket is so important. Suzanne Falter is a podcaster and the author of multiple self-help titles including The Extremely Busy Woman's Guide to Self-Care. She also hosts the ever popular Self-Care for Extremely Busy Women podcast and an active Facebook group. Grab her How's Your Self-Care worksheet here! What is Trauma? According to the American Psychological Association, Trauma is an emotional response to a terrible event like an accident, rape or natural disaster. Trauma can have many forms and range in severity. Nothing prepares you for traumatic events. It is really important to seek help to navigate life after a traumatic event. The Stages of Trauma After a traumatic event, we go through a similar set of stages as we process what happened. Here is a general idea of these stages: Denial- you question the event and often can't believe it is happening.Anger- feelings of anger, getting upset and asking why this happened.Bargaining- making compromises and promises to do something if XYZ would just stop or go away.Depression- a feeling of doom, loneliness and sadness having to adjust to the truth of what happened.Acceptance- accepting the truth of what happened and starting the process to heal. Best Ways to Navigate Trauma With traumatic events comes a lot of emotional and some even physical feelings. Being able to move forward as these pass through you is hard but there are things you can do to help. Here are some ideas: Read to learn more about the trauma or strategies to help.Be open and willing to make it into a transformational experience.Telling the truth about it, instead of pretending it didn't happen.Meditation or self care practice.Exercise or any movement of the body.Eat nutritious whole foods.Surround yourself by supportive people, family, friends and support groups.Find a way to get your feelings out, like writing or painting, etc. Does Trauma Ever Go Away? A traumatic event isn't something that will go away, but it can be navigated so that life can move on and even transform into a better place. We must allow ourselves to feel each stage we pass through in order for healing to happen. Once we reach acceptance and let ourselves experience all the feelings we will be able to slowly move past them. While the pain maybe always be there in some respect, it can begin to fade. Always remember that this is not to be taken as medical advice and you should always see a licensed professional for your mental health needs.

Slate Star Codex Podcast
ACX Grants Results

Slate Star Codex Podcast

Play Episode Listen Later Dec 29, 2021 43:19


https://astralcodexten.substack.com/p/acx-grants-results Thanks to everyone who participated in ACX Grants, whether as an applicant, an evaluator, or a funder. Before I announce awardees, a caveat: this was hard in lots of ways I didn't expect. I got 656 applications addressing different problems and requiring different skills to judge. I'll write a long post on it later, but the part I want to emphasize now is: if I didn't grant you money, it doesn't mean I didn't like your project. Sometimes it meant I couldn't find someone qualified to evaluate it. Other times a reviewer was concerned that if you were successful, your work might be used by terrorists / dictators / AI capabilities researchers / Republicans and cause damage in ways you couldn't foresee. Other times it meant it was a better match for some other grant organization and I handed it off to them. Still other times, my grant reviewers tied themselves up in knots with 4D chess logic like "if they're smart enough to attempt this project, they're smart enough to know about XYZ Grants which is better suited for them, which means they're mostly banking on XYZ funding and using you as a backup, but if XYZ doesn't fund these people then that's strong evidence that they shouldn't be funded, so even though everything about them looks amazing, please reject them." I have no idea if things really work this way, but I needed some experienced grant reviewers on board and they were all like this. I took these considerations seriously and in some marginal cases they prevented funding.

The Amazon Files: The Real Truth About Selling Online

The year is coming to an end, and on this week's episode of The Amazon Files, I'm encouraging you to take a moment and review the year that's just passed before planning for 2022. Being aware of what we've achieved over the last twelve months—and recognizing where we've made mistakes—is crucial for understanding where we want to go in the future. Today, I'll guide you through some ways to make your yearly review effective and motivating so that you can head into the New Year with clear goals and confidence.   First up, I recommend taking the Marie Kondo approach and getting rid of—or at least minimizing—anything in your life that doesn't spark joy. Ask yourself if you're still excited by your business and figure out if you need to make changes based on what you've learned and experienced over the past year. Then I suggest four stages for reviewing your year—data collection, recognizing milestones, allowing space for mistakes, and setting reasonable goals—which will give you a framework for understanding and celebrating where you are in your business and where you can go in the future. I also revisit the “Start. Stop. Continue” technique as a method of taking stock of your business behaviors and how to manage them to improve your happiness in your work. Finally, I dare all my listeners to choose one goal to focus on for a year, making it the core of their decisions and actions, so that you can see how reviewing and restating our goals can help us bring them to fruition.   You can be part of the Amazon Files and Mommy Income community by joining our Facebook group with today's codeword REVIEW, where you can learn more about bundling, ask questions, and participate in the conversation with other sellers. And if you're ready to take your business to a whole new level, visit MommyIncome.com/Coach to schedule your one-on-one coaching call today.   This week on the Amazon Files:      The importance of taking time for reflection.   Ask yourself if you're still excited by your business and being mindful of your mindset.   Paying attention to what inputs you're allowing into your life and yourself.   Get to know your natural rhythm and arrange your day around the hours when you hit your stride.   Marie Kondo's ‘sparking joy' approach.   Stage #1 of reviewing your year: data collection—decide what aspects of your business you want to review and collect the numbers relating to them.   Stage #2: recognize milestones—go back through your calendar, note down what you achieved over the past year, and celebrate the milestones you've experienced, both big and small.   Stage #3: allow space for mistakes—make a list of three things maximum that went wrong during the year, think about why they happened, and write down a suggestion for how you can change it or prevent it from happening again. And don't judge yourself for it - own it.   An example of stage #3 from my own life.   Stage #4: set reasonable goals—when you're thinking about your goals for the next year, think about if you have the resources to reasonably achieve them before writing them down.   Revisiting your perfect world, making changes based on your current needs and desires, then figuring out what you need to do to make this world a reality.   How to use the “Start, Stop, and Continue” technique.   Setting one goal for your business this year and following it to completion.   Remembering why you set your goals and figuring out what you're willing to sacrifice to meet them.   The accountability that comes with sharing your goals with others.   “Whatever you put in, in your mind, in your heart, in your emotions, in your body - that's what comes out. That's the kind of energy that comes out of your body and out of your mouth and out of your heart and out of your soul.”   - Kristin Ostrander   Quotes: “We need someone to give us what I call the ‘slug and a hug,' or the ‘kiss and a slap,' where you need the tough love, but you also need the gentle forgiveness of yourself and others.”   “We do need to open our eyes, and be aware of our year and see where we want to go next year.”   “If you're in a state of mind where things are heavy and hard and overwhelming and stressful, and maybe that's affecting your sleep or your mood or things like that, the last thing we want to be doing is putting more negative energy into that space.”   “Let's be real, paying bills does not bring me joy. And I can't just get rid of them because I don't like them. However, you can make the experience of doing something that you don't enjoy more enjoyable by just being aware of it, getting it out of the way, doing it at a time in your day that is the best time for you.”   “If you're not much of a data collector, you need to become one because this is a business skill that we all need. If we want to grow our profit, we need to know what our profit is, in order to grow it, do we not?”   “We are hard-wired to look at the negative most of the time and not celebrating all of the great things that we've done. I mean, most especially women tend to point out all of the things that we've done wrong, or the bad things, or the things we're not good at. We're not really great at walking up to the plate and saying, ‘I'm great at XYZ.'”   “We look at what went wrong so that we don't repeat mistakes, so that we don't lose money, so that we don't run in fear all of the time and say, ‘Oh, I'll never do that again.'”   “We all should be in growth mode.”   “I made some mistakes. They weren't pretty. But that doesn't have to dictate the rest of my life or the rest of my business.”   “If you want to make more revenue, you're going to have to increase either your profit margin or the capital that you're spending on set inventory in order to increase it. It's just, you know, some basic simple math.”   “You don't always have to make tons of money off your first bundle, it's just getting used to the process. And once you know how to list, once you know detuned exemptions, once you get your bundle brand, things like that, then you can get all the logistics out of the way and then start to be creative.”   “That's my purpose. That's my ‘why'. That's why I sit in front of this camera and this microphone every single week, because it brings me joy to see all of you succeeding, even if it's baby steps.”   “You're ten times more likely to hit a goal that you write down and share with someone else.”   Related Content:   2022 Workshops - Coupon code: workshop50 Wholesale Bundle System Email questions Learn With Us Coaching The Amazon Files Hub   Grow Your Amazon Business!   Thanks for tuning into this week's episode of The Amazon Files, the show to help Amazon sellers along their business journey one step at a time with Amazon expert and your host, Kristin Ostrander. If you enjoyed this episode, head over to Apple Podcasts, subscribe to the show and leave us your honest review. Don't forget to share your favorite episodes with your friends on social media! Use the codeword REVIEW to join us on Facebook. Each week, Kristin hosts a live discussion on how to grow your Amazon business. Don't forget to check out our website and subscribe to our mailing list for even more resources.      

The Disciplined Investor
TDI Podcast: Would You Hire Yourself? (#746)

The Disciplined Investor

Play Episode Listen Later Dec 26, 2021 39:57


If you had to hire yourself after the job you did with your portfolio - would you? Are you making resolutions again? How about for 2022 we make some commitments to ourselves? A quick exercise on this and what to do when your portfolio makes outsized moves. End of year - what to make of the volatility - how to handle the risk. Maybe we should be asking different questions..... Join clients from over 200 countries and territories to invest globally in Stocks, Options, Futures, Forex, Bonds and Funds from a single integrated account at the lowest cost at IBKR.com Learn More at http://www.ibkr.com/ OurCrowd's investment professionals leverage their extensive network to review some of the most promising private companies and startups in the world. Check it out at http://www.ourcrowd.com/tdi DECEMBER 2021 - WEBINAR REPLAY Follow @andrewhorowitz Looking for style diversification? More information on the TDI Managed Growth Strategy - https://thedisciplinedinvestor.com/blog/tdi-strategy/ eNVESTOLOGY Info - https://envestology.com/ Friday Pre-Market Run-Down Webinar Registration - https://www.triggercharts.com/webinar-pre-market-rundown-fridays/ Stocks mentioned in this episode: (XYZ), (SPY), (QQQ)

Industry Scoop Podcast
Generational View

Industry Scoop Podcast

Play Episode Listen Later Dec 24, 2021 15:37


The ladies of Industry Scoop talk old school versus new school, old heads versus millennials, and all the XYZ generations in between. Tune in as your hosts reflect on the varied schools of thought behind so many different generations and the drastic effect social media has had on the young people of today.    From work ethic to selfies, don't miss this episode on generational mindsets and how to succeed in any industry.   KEY POINTS: - Old school vs new school mindsets - Why do younger generations have so much anxiety? - Living a life of comparisons - Where is the work ethic today? - The generation of protests - The key ingredients to succeed in any industry   QUOTABLES: “Young people are not playing when it comes to their mental health. They're protecting their mental health, opposed to us, we just got beat up.” “Social media has a lot to do with living in the life of comparisons or watching people's fake lives or pretend lives and their pretend friends and thinking that you don't measure up.”   PRODUCTS / RESOURCES: Like what you're hearing? Follow Industry Scoop on social media and share the love! Instagram @industryscoop - instagram.com/industryscoop Facebook: facebook.com/industryscoopradio TikTok: tiktok.com/@industryscooppodcast?   Follow Gill Talent on Instagram @gilltalent - instagram.com/GillTalent Visit the Gill Talent website at gilltalent.com The Industry Scoop Podcast is edited by Instapodcasts (visit at instapodcasts.com)

Speaking Broadly
A New Day Has Come

Speaking Broadly

Play Episode Listen Later Dec 23, 2021 71:36


Adam returns with a new heart, inspired by the warmth of friendship, encouragement, and service. It is time for us to take heart, and make sure those in our lives are feeling well and encouraged. Find the people in your life who have the biggest hearts and make sure that they are at peace. This show is meant as a first installment of encouragement to you to help us see that we don't have to do XYZ to feel important. We already are. There is no happiness like being nice just because. How do you know you can trust? You just can. Certainty beyond proposition: feel it in your heart. You are enough. You are a gift to everyone around you. Make good on it.

Growth Marketers - Digital Marketing Experts
86. Should I Change the Marketing Channel to Get Better Results?

Growth Marketers - Digital Marketing Experts

Play Episode Listen Later Dec 21, 2021 35:02


Welcome to another episode of Growth Marketers Podcast! Today, we'll talk about marketing channels. How to choose the best one and where does it fit in your marketing strategy? One of the most common questions we hear from our listeners and clients is, “what channel is good for doing XYZ?” Not the best question to ask, but extremely common. The thing is that when business leaders come to us for marketing help, they tend to be self-diagnosed with what they believe is the problem. They even prescribe their own treatment, giving us recommendations on what we should do, as well as the channels that they believe are best for marketing their business. Those conversations are very common among B2B organizations, so let's use this podcast as an opportunity to define what a channel really is and explain why the channel is not a strategy. We'll walk you through our process of how we go about the channel selection. We'll also talk about the questions you should ask before you decide which channel is going to be most effective for a particular campaign or strategy. Tune in! Thank you for listening! DID YOU ENJOY THIS EPISODE? Head over to iTunes to subscribe, rate, and leave us a review. If you have any questions, send us an email at GrowthMarketers@oneims.com or visit oneims.com/podcast

The Amazon Files: The Real Truth About Selling Online
Overcoming Perfectionism in Business

The Amazon Files: The Real Truth About Selling Online

Play Episode Listen Later Dec 20, 2021 39:29


Today I'm tackling an issue many of us deal with - perfectionism - and how to overcome it. Perfectionism can feel like a necessary part of becoming successful, but in fact, it's an obstacle that stops us getting what we really want. Instead of focusing on our own goals, perfectionists can get distracted by unrealistic expectations, procrastination, and anxiety about how others judge us. In this episode, I'll take you through five daily ways to resist and overcome perfectionism and make your path to success clearer and easier.   After a quick reminder that there are still seats left for the workshop in January, I start things off by going through some of the characteristics perfectionists tend to display. These include black-and-white thinking, chronic procrastination, and people-pleasing, all of which create a toxic feedback loop that prevents the perfectionist from ever achieving their goals. In order to combat these toxic tendencies, I suggest a list of five daily ways to overcome perfectionism, including setting reasonable expectations instead of impossible standards, not making assumptions, and learning to handle feedback and criticism. Finally, I recommend online therapy as a great resource to help you deal with some of the issues I talk about today.   You can be part of the Amazon Files and Mommy Income community by joining our Facebook group using code word ‘TALK', where you can learn more about bundling, ask questions, and participate in the conversation with other sellers. And if you're ready to take your business to a whole new level, visit MommyIncome.com/Coach to schedule your one-on-one coaching call today.   This week on the Amazon Files:      The Competent Wholesale Bundlers Workshop is coming up in a few weeks, and there are only a few seats left!   The first step to handling perfectionism.   Some characteristics that perfectionists tend to display.   Chronic procrastination.   How perfectionism gets in your way and causes you to give up on your dreams.   Comparing high achievers and perfectionists   Five daily ways to keep perfectionism at bay: o   #1: Set realistic expectations o   #2: Focus on small accomplishments o   #3: Stop making assumptions o   #4: Learn to handle feedback and criticism (with parameters o   #5: Enjoy the process   Social media's impact   Online therapy   ““I'm going to get tough with you. And I'm going to say some hard things. Why? Because I care. Because I love you. Because I care, because I want you to do your best, be your best, but not be perfect because none of us are. We never will be.”   - Kristin Ostrander   Quotes: “'If I make a mistake in front of others, I will not be able to recover from the humiliation. I can't handle somebody being upset with me.' Have you ever thought about those things? Those are real good indicators that you struggle with some perfectionism.”   “Procrastination is a sign of fear. And why are we afraid? We're afraid of the impossible standards that we set for ourselves.”   “Would you rather quit something big or grand or build small sustainable habits over time?”   “Most perfectionists are fueled by results, and they're fueled by a successful result. Well, if that is the gas that you put in your tank to keep moving, wouldn't you want more, more often? Would you like to put gas in your tank every single day to push you a little bit more forward?”    “Find your success in the process. Enjoy as much of the process and the journey as possible.”   “Some of you are probably thinking, ‘Oh, those small steps are just not good enough, I must perform at an XYZ level way up here.' My question to you is, ‘Or what?'”   “You don't owe anybody an explanation for your goals. You don't need anyone's permission, you don't need their approval. You could have whatever goals you want, for whatever reasons you want them, and you don't need anybody's permission or approval in order to do that.”   “Mistakes make us better. We can't learn if we're always putting out perfection.”   “Do not accept or acknowledge feedback or criticism from somebody who's not in the game. Their opinion does not write you a check, it doesn't pay your bills, so it's not relevant.”   “You can accept feedback from a professional who knows exactly what to do and how to change and tweak your ideas, and try again, and get better, and try again after that and get better.”   “Yes, those things hurt. It's just a bruise. It's not a tattoo. You don't have to wear it for the rest of your life. Bruises heal. Criticism kills nothing but our ego and our self-esteem.”   “Excellence is not perfection.”   “I think it's so necessary every year to look back, to reflect, to see what you want in the future, but also see how far you've come. Progress, not perfection.”   “Twenty years ago, that was never a thing. You weren't striving to impress somebody who lives in Arizona 3,000 miles away from you because they like to comment on all your Facebook stuff.”   “We all have this, like, negative thing, or some people do, around therapy, like, ‘Oh my gosh, she needs therapy,' right? Heck yes, I do. Thank you very much. I wouldn't be in the place I am right now without it.”   “Send it, ship it, list it. You're not going to die.”   Related Content:   2022 Workshops - Coupon code: workshop50 Wholesale Bundle System Email questions Learn With Us Coaching The Amazon Files Hub   Grow Your Amazon Business!   Thanks for tuning into this week's episode of The Amazon Files, the show to help Amazon sellers along their business journey one step at a time with Amazon expert and your host, Kristin Ostrander. If you enjoyed this episode, head over to Apple Podcasts, subscribe to the show and leave us your honest review. Don't forget to share your favorite episodes with your friends on social media! Use the codeword [CODEWORD] to join us on Facebook. Each week, Kristin hosts a live discussion on how to grow your Amazon business. Don't forget to check out our website and subscribe to our mailing list for even more resources.  

Health Coach Power Community
E173: Stressed & Scrambling? How To Run a Smarter, Smoother Coaching Business

Health Coach Power Community

Play Episode Listen Later Dec 17, 2021 27:58


Are you doing the "health coach scramble?" As the year comes to a close you might realize you never got around to XYZ in your business. Time to panic, right? Or...Michelle has an idea that will set you up for bigger success. Join this free workshop to learn how to make 2022 a smooth, smart, profitable year - HealthCoachPower.com/2022

Healthy Wealthy & Smart
569: Drs. Bryan Guzski & Tim Reynolds: Movers & Mentors in the Physical Therapy World

Healthy Wealthy & Smart

Play Episode Listen Later Dec 14, 2021 47:41


In this episode, Bryan Guzski, Director of the Orthopaedic Residency Program at the University of Rochester Medical Center, and Tim Reynolds, Clinical Assistant Professor of Anatomy & Physiology at Ithaca College, talk about their work on Movers & Mentors. Today, Bryan and Tim talk about their book, Movers & Mentors, and they get the opportunity to be the interviewers for a portion of the episode. Why is it important to have mentors? Hear about the motivation behind the book, some surprising interviews they've done, the value of having a team, finding your ‘why', and choosing when you say ‘yes', all on today's episode of The Healthy, Wealthy & Smart Podcast.   Key Takeaways “From an entrepreneurial standpoint, from a business standpoint, your partner is everything.” “Invest in [yourself] and take care of [yourself], physically and mentally, so that you can take care of your patients better.” “Challenge yourself to step beyond your comfort zone, because the benefits of that can be significant if you're willing to try.” “Find a mentor and don't fear or stray away from the imposter syndrome. Use that as fuel.” “If you never ask the question, the answer is always no.” “Trying to do it all will keep you small.” “You have to really only say yes to things that align to your values.” “Take a step back, know who you are, know your values, know what your individual mission statement is.” “He who knows others is wise. He who knows himself is enlightened.” - Lao Tzu “If you don't have the capacity for it, then don't do it.” “Stay curious.” “Continue to search for the ‘why'. It's okay not to know.”   More about Bryan Guzski Bryan Guzski PT, DPT, OCS, MBA, CSCS, is an outpatient orthopaedic physical therapist practicing in Rochester, NY working primarily with patients with spine related issues and persistent pain. Bryan earned his Doctor of Physical Therapy degree from Ithaca College in 2014, completed an orthopaedic residency program through Cayuga Medical Center and received his Orthopaedic Clinical Specialist certification in 2015, and earned a Master of Business Administration degree from Simon Business School at the University of Rochester in 2021.   More about Tim Reynolds Tim Reynolds PT, DPT, OCS, CSCS, is a Clinical Assistant Professor of Anatomy & Physiology at Ithaca College and a part-time physical therapist practicing at Cayuga Medical Center in Ithaca, NY, where he predominately treats patients with spine or lower extremity impairments. Tim earned his Doctor of Physical Therapy degree from Ithaca College in 2014 and completed both his orthopaedic residency and spine fellowship through Cayuga Medical Center, and currently helps mentor and teach in both of these programs as well.    Suggested Keywords Healthy, Wealthy, Smart, Physiotherapy, Academia, Movers, Shakers, Mentors, Prioritizing, Self-care, Self-improvement, Values, Motivation,   To learn more, follow Bryan & Tim at: Website:          https://www.moversandmentors.com Twitter:            @moversmentors                         @timreynoldsdpt                    Facebook:       Movers and Mentors Instagram:       @moversandmentors                         @bryguzski                         @timreynolds10 LinkedIn:         Bryan Guzski                         Tim Reynolds                         Subscribe to Healthy, Wealthy & Smart: Website:                      https://podcast.healthywealthysmart.com Apple Podcasts:          https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/healthy-wealthy-smart/id532717264 Spotify:                        https://open.spotify.com/show/6ELmKwE4mSZXBB8TiQvp73 SoundCloud:               https://soundcloud.com/healthywealthysmart Stitcher:                       https://www.stitcher.com/show/healthy-wealthy-smart iHeart Radio:               https://www.iheart.com/podcast/263-healthy-wealthy-smart-27628927   Read the Full Transcript Here:  00:03 Hey, Brian and Tim, welcome to the podcast. I'm happy to have you guys on to talk about movers and mentors. So welcome.   00:11 Thank you, Karen, thank you for having us today. We're sharing this sit down chat with you.   00:15 This is great, Karen, thank you so much.   00:17 Well, thank you guys for including me in your book with over 70 Other pretty illustrious folks in the Movement Science physical therapy world. So let's start with the basic question that I'm sure a lot of listeners want to know. What is the why behind the book?   00:40 Yeah. So Karen, Tim and I were going through residency orthopedic residency together. Back in 2015. We both graduated from Ithaca College in 2014. And we both entered into a residency program at ethika are in Ethica, in 2015. And as we were going through the coursework there, and kind of taking different classes and really kind of immersed in the PT literature and physical therapy, space and various different content. We started noticing a lot of reoccurring names and reoccurring themes. And so, you know, different names like Tim Flynn, Josh Cleveland, surely sermon, Stuart McGill, you know, all these all these names that, you know, names in our rehab space that I've done a lot of really cool things and have put out a lot of different research that that, you know, we follow to this day. So we started noticing those names. And Tim and I were also reading a book by Timothy Ferriss called Tools of Titans at the time. And we really liked that book. And we enjoyed it. We got a lot out of it. He interviews people like, you know, Arnold Schwarzenegger, and Oprah Winfrey. So various different industries and various different spaces. But we like the model that book and we started to ask ourselves, well, I wonder how, you know, individuals and movers and shakers within our industry would answer questions that we have. So fast forward two years. That was 2017 2018 at that point, and Tim and I started putting together a list of questions and a list of names. And at that point, you know, we kind of we kind of took it from there. And Tim has a little bit more info on how we how we came up with the names.   02:29 Yeah, so it's one of those things that we could have written a 5000 page book in regards to the movers and shakers within the physical therapy industry. And I think one of the most important things that Brian I have tried to stress is that this is a living project. This is not a one and done situation where there are movers and shakers that are currently developing and changing the practice. And so I think that's one of those things that, yes, there are people within the pages that I'm that are, we're happy to have there. But at the same time, there's so many other people would want to reach out to, and we look forward to have the opportunity to potentially talk to those individuals in the future, and are excited to see how does the profession change in the next five to 10 years and who are going to come up and literally shake the industry that we have the opportunity to be part of. And so as we started to go about this, like Brian said, we're diving into this literature, I had the opportunity to do spine fellowship after doing my orthopedic residency. And so the amount of Tim Flynn articles that I've read over the past three years was obnoxious. And so we started to make this almost like PT Dream Team, if you would, where we said okay, from, from a literature standpoint, who do we do we invest ourselves into a lot of, and like Brian mentioned, John John Childs, and we have Josh Cleveland. And then we have Tim Flynn, and the surely SARM and Gwendolyn Joel, there's these names that we have read multiple articles from and so kind of selfishly, we put together this list of people that we would really appreciate reaching out to, because we've been so invested in their in their literature over the past several years. And then from there, we kind of spread our net a little wider, because we had to see who's moving the industry from a clinical practice standpoint, right. So not necessarily from an academic or research standpoint, but from clinical practice. And who's moving it in regards to social media influencers? Because as someone who works in academia and works with the up and coming physical therapy generation, those are the people that they're following on Instagram and on Twitter, and so they're moving and shaking the industry in that format. And we looked at who's been guest speakers at recent conferences and who's putting out podcasts and how He was really trying to have the opportunity to get our profession to move in a positive direction. And so from there, we created this sort of master list, we reached out to all of them, and some have the opportunity to participate, which we're super thankful for. Some respectfully declined based on the fact that they had other stuff going on. But I think one of the things to remember, Brian is sort of given us timeframe, this was right pre pandemic, that we started to reach out to all these individuals. And what's been such a blessing is that we've been able to cast a wide net across multiple different countries across multiple different professions. But at the same time, we reach out to people in Australia, and there's Australian wildfires. And so we're trying to really respect individual's personal physical well being while navigating global pandemic while trying to also conduct interviews. And so it took us a little over two and a half years to be able to accumulate everything and be able to put everything out into a book format. But I'm super thankful to have those people within the pages. And like I said, I'm excited to have the opportunity to reach out to more in the future.   06:14 And so it takes, you know, a couple of years to get all this together. How did the two of you kind of keep the momentum going? Number one, because that's hard. And then number two, how did you kind of kind of temper your excitement and your expectations? Because I know, I'm the kind of person who's like, let's just get it done. Let's go, go go. But here, you know, you've really taken your time, over two plus years. So can you talk a little bit about that?   06:52 Yeah, I think from the outset, Tim and I both thought, I will send out some emails, you know, we'll get a handful of responses. It'll be a cool book, maybe we'll sell to maybe, you know, five, including our siblings, and parents, that sort of thing. And it really from the first batch of emails that we sent out, you know, Tim and I were really, every time we got a response, we would text each other, shoot each other an email immediately, Hey, Peter O'Sullivan responded, or David Butler responded, or Karen Litzy responded, you know, this is awesome. Like, we're actually doing this thing. So I think it you know, you spoke to momentum, Karen. And that's one thing that Tim and I, you know, we've never really hit a point where we were at a lack of that, or hit a dull moment, if you will. Because every time we got we did another interview, or we got another email, or we set up a, you know, maybe a podcast, it was definitely adding fuel to the fire. And, you know, they kept us pretty engaged and pretty excited throughout the whole thing. So, yeah, I mean, to I think if you asked us when we first sent out our emails in 2018, hey, you know, this is you're going to publish this in 2021, we'd say, No, it's going to be next year. And then life happens and pandemics happen and several other things. And, you know, it turned into a two and a half year project. But you know, it's been a lot of fun the whole time. And Tim and I still are still excited about it and excited about about the future, too.   08:16 And I think that's one of the things. There's kind of like Christmas every single time we had a response because it was super cool. You send out these, these emails, or you give a phone call to people that you've literally have had as your mentor from afar for years. And it's like, oh, my gosh, I cannot wait to have the opportunity to sit down. Like Peter, I saw that I've watched a lot of Peter softened videos from pain science standpoint, from spine fellowship work. And having the opportunity to sit down with Peter resolve them for an hour and 15 minutes was like, amazing. I was super stoked. And so so all those opportunities to talk to these people definitely continue to keep flame burning. And at the same time you talk about how do we sort of balance that, that excitement and try not to do too much too quickly. Brian and I have known each other for years, this has been such an amazing project to be able to find a partner that you want appreciate and to after two and a half years don't hate. So I think that's like a really good thing. And I think we balance each other out very well, where we're both skilled in a variety different formats. And then at the same time, after reading your draft manuscript, probably like five times through and through, you really do not want to read one more time. And there's points where we're like, I think it's good. I think we just just push it out, call it a day. And then Brian could probably agree that I'd say well, let's just read through it one more time, and then you catch one or two small mistakes. And so I think it's one of those things that just finding the right person that's willing to invest and stay motivated to push you and challenge you From an entrepreneurial standpoint, from a business standpoint, your partner is is everything. And so I think that's been one of the blessings that we've had this for this project.   10:11 Yeah, I love it, I think that's great advice is to have that person who complements you. Right and because you don't want to have just like a yes person, but instead you want something that's going to complement you and push you in, in a positive direction. And, and I will second the Peter O'Sullivan, he is just what a nice person and giving and charitable and gosh, I had an interview with him at CSM a number of years ago. And I had to ticket it. Because it was live at CSM. And we actually had to ticket it so that only 25 people could go and I it was only for students. And by the end of the interview, he was laying on the ground, you know, students and stuff. It was just so it was such a great experience, because he's just one of those very kind of electric personalities.   11:08 Definitely. very warm, very electric.   11:10 Yeah. Were there any interviews that you did that surprised you?   11:20 Um, in   11:21 a, in any way that doesn't have to be good or bad. Just surprise you because perhaps the persona that this person has, whether it be their research, social media clinical that you thought they had, and then when you interviewed them? It it surprised you?   11:46 Yeah, I would say. Obviously, when you when you interview over 75 individuals, you get a variety of different responses, you talk to a variety of different personas, devided different characteristics. And I think going into it, knowing the background of someone's, I use the metaphor of like the front cover of a book, we all have like front cover worthy attributes or accomplishments. And then it's like, well, what's on the inside of those pages. And so we see everybody's bio, and I've been on X, Y, and Z shows or published this many papers and, and so we see all that stuff. But we never really hear some of those people talk or talk personally about some of their successes and some of their failures. And so I think everybody had the opportunity to have some elements of surprise. But I think what was also cool as Brian, I made up this master list, and it was basically just based off of accomplishments and achievements, or their influence on the profession. And so, for instance, I was looking through and like talking to Michael Radcliffe, who is who is a researcher that I've read your research, but I, I never really pictured what you would look like. And I never really perceived that you would have such amazing responses within this book. So I think it was those individuals that I might not have been so invested from like falling on social media, or have watched your YouTube videos, and really getting a chance to know them in an hour, hour and a half. Those were the interviewers that really caught me by surprise, but at the same time, I think I walked away with so much more, because there is so much unknown that they're willing to offer me. Um, and so I think I think that was the most exciting part or the most surprising part for me.   13:42 Yeah, I think kind of, because of the types of questions that we asked, we really intimidate joke about this, if we want to know, you know, surely Simon's recommendations for motor control. We can find that online. We can we can Google that. Right? If we want to know, you know how David Butler opens his pain talks, we can probably find that somewhere and explain pain or explain pain Supercharged. But you know, how Heidi genetica who's the CEO of versio Excuse me? Why pte how she structures her day. And what her favourite failure is it those are things that you can't find you can't find that in textbook you can't find that online. So the types of questions that we asked really opened, opened it up to knowing these people from a different perspective, which we thought was pretty cool. I'd say that one of the individuals that really stands out in my mind, Tim actually did this interview, but I transcribe it so I got to listen to everything, literally word for word was Stanley Paris, who's one of the founding fathers of orthopaedic manual physical therapy and then the United States and North America for that matter. And I mean, this guy is is just incredible from sailing around the world to swimming the English Channel to founding St. Augustine to being, you know, a founder and president of various organizations like the guy has done it all to owning a winery or several wineries. I believe he's just, you know, a jack of all trades. And I think listening to that interview, I was like, you know, he's, I think 83 Now, and my jaw was dropped to some of the some of his answers and some of his experiences. So that was, that was really cool. But, I mean, we had so many so many great interviews, Jeff Moore was a terrific interviewer. Peter O'Sullivan, like we talked about Kelly star it gave, you know, exceptional answers. So we were really, really lucky. And, you know, positively surprised, I should say, surprise, in a positive way with with all of our guests.   15:55 Yeah. And it it, it does kind of, like an education for you. Right,   16:02 definitely. Yeah. 110% Yeah, I mean, it was one of those things. I had the opportunity to speak with Michael shacklock. Um, and such a well spoken. Such a thoughtful, mindful person. And back in residency, Brian Knight did some research with neurodynamics and your mobilizations. As I was like, Oh, my gosh, like, you're the Dude, that was like, given us all this information. And now we have the opportunity to actually speak to the source. So I think back to being like eight or nine years old, and have all these posters of Major League Baseball players up on the walls, and just like, thinking about how cool it was to have their pictures, and to think about what it would be like to play baseball with them. And now to be able to communicate with some of these movers and shakers within the industry, and have them be peers, and be able to carry out a conversation with them learn from us as much as we're learning from them in that conversation is just such a rewarding opportunity.   17:08 And do you feel like it has changed your clinical practice at all? How you are with patients? Did any of the answers or just even the interactions with some of these folks change the change the way you practice? Um,   17:24 I think yes. I would say I've slowed down, and I'm more intentional. Just based on a few, I guess, specific responses, but one that comes to mind is oh, shoot, pause. This might be a Karen, you might have to take this this out. And then wait,   17:48 wait, wait a mess up. Or 25? I   17:50 know. We were crushing it. Dude. Millet mark. I don't know. I want to say more. Mark Milligan. So we'll jump back in. Yes, I would say more mindful and intentional. And I've slowed down in my practice, one response, or several responses from Mark Milligan definitely kind of changed the way I think and operate within the clinic. And I've definitely tried to be more intentional and kind of think about my thinking a little bit more in the clinic from a specific, you know, tactical exercise prescription perspective, not so much. Because that wasn't really the focus of our book. But just, you know, Mark's mindset, and kind of his, his recommendation to all young professionals to really kind of invest in themselves and to take care of themselves mentally and physically so that you can take care of your patients better, I thought was really powerful. So yeah, I'd say, a little bit more intentional, focused, and I've slowed down.   19:00 Yeah. And I think sort of piggybacking off of what Brian was saying, less so about the actual clinical approach to what sort of treatments are you providing? And I think that was one of the the most exciting things about the book was we were not talking about what's your favorite three exercises for X y&z Because there's so much saturation, I'd say from a social media standpoint, which is great. I think that's one of the things that's challenging the profession, that anybody has the opportunity to put out content, and it's one of the curses of the profession that anybody has the opportunity to put out content. And so I think the opportunity for young graduates and PT students, and individuals interested in the Movement Science field that is sift through a lot of information to be able to find out what is truly valuable for them. And like Brian was saying, These are the answers questions that aren't necessarily within a textbook, but also probably not necessarily on people's social media channels also, right? No one really steps up to the plate and says, you know that one time when it took me three tries again to PT, school, Dad was really a good important point in time, my life, or, yeah, I remember when I failed the boards. Those are things that I think can really influence and the sort of career life changing for these individuals, who, as a current college professor, writing final exams, getting ready to watch by an influx of tears in my office in the next bout 48 hours, who perceive a failure as such a detriment to their potential growth, and well being as a person, I got a B plus on this test, all my friends got A's, I cannot necessarily navigate that situation. That's like conversation that I hear all the time. And so talking about how has things changed in my practice, I'm currently part time in the clinic, more time from an academia standpoint. So I think it's changed my communication opportunities, with the next generation, being able to literally use this book as an encyclopedia. And knowing the responses that people have given flipping to their name, and saying, I need you to read this chapter from Mike Reinhold, where he talks about becoming an expert, because you're not there yet. Because you shouldn't be there yet. Because you haven't gained clinical judgment and clinical experience. And it's going to be okay. But go read this come back in five minutes. And so I think that's how I've been able to sort of benefit from this, from this experience and how I've taken it influenced my own practice.   21:51 Excellent. And, and as a side note, Tim, the, my podcast episode coming out tomorrow, my podcast is with Silvia Zubaan. And she's a clinician 50% clinician 50% academia at St. Louis University in Washington, Washington University in St. Louis. Sure. And surely, sermons. Yeah. And it was a really nice conversation on how to navigate. She's been doing it for 15 years now. clinician and academia and academia. So it was a really nice, really wonderful conversation on how to navigate that those two worlds successfully and how to be vulnerable when you need to be and with whom, and because it can't always be great and perfect, like you just said. So if you have a chance, I would come out tomorrow, I would listen, I'm excited. Currently to edit this part out. I don't need to plug my own podcast within a podcast. He was a little self indulgent. But because you, you're kind of in a similar position. She's just been doing it for a lot longer.   23:10 That's awesome. I appreciate that. So   23:11 check it out tomorrow. It was really, like, such a good conversation. She's super cool. She should be in your next book. There. Yeah, like it. She's super cool. Yes, Silvia it's CZ you PP o n. Yeah. And she does some research and and she's written some papers and things like that, but she's super cool. Okay. So, um, is there anything? Before we sort of flipped this a little bit? Because I know you guys were like, Hey, would you like to expand on some of your answers, which, you know, is fine. So we'll flip this in, in a bit. And I'll have you guys host and I'll be your guest. But before we do that, is there anything else kind of about the process of of compiling and publishing the book, that you would love people to know, because it made such a big difference in your lives?   24:23 I think one of the blessings of our profession is the lat orality component to your growth as an entrepreneur, but also as a professional. We graduate with a clinical doctorate, or and this can be transcribed across multiple professions, but you go to school to be able to learn how to learn right and in our profession where you sit for a board certification, which gives us the opportunity to practice as a clinician within that. You can wear multiple different hats and I think what was nice with this is That title allowed for us to speak to a variety of different people and have this mutual commonality, which was physical therapy, or Movement Science or the treatment of individuals with certain pathologies. And I think this would never have happened if we didn't make ourselves vulnerable and uncomfortable. Because who are Brian and I? And why should we have the opportunity to talk to Karen Litzy? Or why should we have the opportunity to talk to David Butler? Or why should in so we had this idea, and it all stemmed from the courage to be able to reach out and ask because you never know, unless you try. And so I think sharing one of these thoughts with your listeners is, I think we all have dreams and aspirations that are slightly beyond our scope of practice. And sometimes we can limit that opportunity for us to navigate those ideas, because we are either potentially afraid of failure, or just don't know what the outcome is going to be. And so since that's an unfamiliar territory, we just assume, and therefore we never attempt. And so I think the one of the best things that I've learned from this is accepting failure for what it is, what's the worst that they're going to say? No, I do not want to be part of this, thank you for the opportunity. And the best thing that we could do is create a relationship, create a mentorship opportunity, and have sort of this professional friendship that stemmed from a cold call email. And so I would, I would recommend, at least my thoughts would be challenged, challenge yourself to step beyond your comfort zone, because the benefits of that can be significant if you're if you're willing to try.   27:02 Yeah, Brian, right. Yeah.   27:04 Yeah, I think there's some level of kind of normalization of failure and imposter syndrome within this book. And I think when you dive into it, and you dive into the responses, everyone has been there, everyone, I'm speaking to, you know, students, new graduates, young professionals here, but guess the message kind of spans anyone in any part of the PT space or industry with however many years of experience, you know, everyone's felt that level of imposter syndrome, or, or fear of failure, and the kind of ability to, to kind of push through that, overcome that and almost use that and leverage it to, to push further or overcome obstacles is really powerful. So I think of it like if you're ever kind of at the top of a mountain, in terms of, you know, imposter syndrome, if we look at it, like, like a curve or like a mountain, if you're at the top of it, then you know, what's really driving you and what's what's pushing you forward, if you're kind of somewhere along along the line on the slope, then you have some level of uncertainty, some level of fear, or some level level of imposter syndrome, and that's actually going to feel fuel you to learn more and be better be more effective. And again, one of the main themes of this book was finding a mentor and the importance of that and how valuable that can be in any, any track or any, you know, facet of our profession. So kind of find that person that's doing something similar or doing exactly what you want to be doing. And, you know, don't hesitate to reach out to them. Because we're in the, we're in the business of helping people and thankfully, we have a lot of professionals around us that that want to help other people but also want to help you know, students, young professionals, so don't hesitate to reach out. I think you'll be surprised with with, you know, the the feedback or the the return on that. So, definitely, definitely find a mentor and, you know, don't don't fear stray, stray away from the imposter syndrome use that as fuel.   29:20 Yes. And I will say I got a piece of advice several years ago from a fellow physical therapist, son. So her name's Cecily de Stefano. She's a physical therapist outside of DC. And we were in Chicago for a one night q&a With Lorimer Moseley. And the next day, we were walking around, she had her five year old six year old somewhere around there, young son with her, and she was sort of walking up ahead and he was walking Next to me, and he said this, Karen, would you like to have a play date? And I said, Well, I don't. I don't have any children. And he was like, no, just you. And I said, Oh, um, okay, well, I think we should probably ask your mom first. And then he gave me a great piece of advice. He said, Yeah, because if you never asked the question, the answer is always no. And I was like, and I said, that's the best piece of advice I've gotten in years, and you're like, five. So just to begin with what you guys said, If you never ask the question, the answer is always no. And I've never forgotten that, since he said that. And so now I just always add, ask the question, because the worst that can happen is it's no and so okay, you move on. But you never know. Unless you try. Okay, so true. So let's, uh, we'll start wrapping things up here. But now I, again, thank you for including me in this book. It's a real honor. So if you want if you guys have any questions to I guess I can expand upon or, you know, anything else that that may be? I don't know, you go ahead. Talk about being out of your comfort zone. Go ahead. And you asked me, I'll hand the mic over to you guys. And I'll see, we'll see what we can do here.   31:21 Sure. Karen, thank you, again, for being a part of this. I really liked your response. We were speaking about failure a little bit before. And I really liked your response on failure in the last comment, here you have, I'll read it right from the book, it says, failure has taught me to be more introspective to have an open mind to trust in others more. And to know that in the end, it will all work out the way it is supposed to. I was wondering if you could expand on the to trust in others more? Do you have a specific example that you're thinking of, or examples, or just, you know, have other people come in at really important times to help you out when you're, you know, in a in a, you know, event of a failure?   32:07 Well, I can't think of one person or one incident in particular, but what I will say is, I am personality type a driver. So someone who likes to get things done, who likes to be in the driver's seat who I don't need help, I don't need help, I can do it on my own, I can do it on my own. And as a result, I think that yeah, I've had failures, because I tried to do it all by myself. And it just doesn't work. You know. And so there's a great team building exercise called lost at sea. Google it, I won't go into detail as to what exactly it is. But you have to you fill out. They give you a list of things that maybe you need when you're lost at sea, and you fill them out what you think you would need from one to 15 or 16 or something like that. So you do it on your own. And then you you do it as a group? And then you find out, like, did you do better on your own? Or did you do better when you had someone helping you? And better meaning like, did you survive? lost at sea? Or were you eaten by sharks? Right? And time and time again, and the group that I did it with? Everybody did better with the group. Right? And so for me, and I learned that I took the Goldman Sachs 10,000 small business program, and it was part of that program. And the big part of that program is learning how to be part of a team and learning how to have people around you that make you better. And so I think my biggest failures came because I didn't ask for help. Because I always thought no, no, I can do this on my own, or I can handle this and quite frankly, I couldn't. And so it resulted in a failure resulted in a less than optimal outcome. It resulted in stress on me and and perhaps some mental and emotional anguish, when in fact, I could have just had a team around me ask for help. And that task probably would have been done better than if it's just me and so yeah, I always so when I said that line, I didn't have one particular person or event in mind, but rather that like sometimes you have to like suck it up, you know, and admit that you can't do things and it's okay. It's just part of life. Like I had interviewed a woman Her name's Stephanie Nikolaj and she said you know trying to do it all will keep you small and she's right. You know, you can it's hard to grow as a person as an entrepreneur as a clinician, my God if you just did everything I Your Own I mean, you'd be like, I don't know you'd stop growing from the day you graduated from college right from your PT program. So you you need the these people around you need people around you, who can lift you up and and make you a better person, a better clinician, a better entrepreneur, whatever it is. But you'll never be that evolved person if you're on your own, it's just impossible.   35:26 Yeah, I think, Karen, like the number of hats that you wear as a business owner, a podcast as a volunteer and advocate, right? You, you kind of need people like that in your ecosystem, and it for so many projects, and especially the bigger the project, it really does take a village, and you need people that specialize in certain aspects to come together as a team. You know, Tim and I have talked about this kind of checking, checking your ego at the door sometimes and just kind of leaving that, as you said, Karen, you know, kind of admit that you can't, you can't accomplish it all by yourself. So I that was a that was a really great answer. And, you know, I think you spoke to some of the points about being more introspective and having having an open mind as well.   36:09 Yeah, and being able to trust people, clearly, I have trust issues. But you know, I think finding like, like you guys said, like you found each other, you knew each other for many years, you have this really nice trust and bond. And I don't know, maybe it's like 20 years in New York has made me a cynical New Yorker or something. You know, but really finding those people that you can connect and trust that they have your back and you'll have theirs. I think it's really important.   36:37 I think, another question that I would have just to sort of elaborate on, obviously, we have a variety of individuals that are listening, right now clinicians, non clinicians, entrepreneurs, and one of the questions that we asked within the book is, what advice would you give to a smart driven college student or a young professional entering the quote unquote, real world? And I think one of the things that you mentioned, that was really valuable was that it is easy to say yes to everything, when you believe it will further your career, I would advise you to only say yes, the opportunities that align with your values and goals, as the saying goes, saying yes to one thing is saying no to something that might be a better fit. I think that's really powerful. Because I think we're in a society of more is better, or the perception that doing more is better. So knowing knowing who is listening to this and having the microphone if you would, for for a minute baseline question. Can you elaborate on that? Or if you had to give that sort of monumentous speech regarding that topic? I think that can be really valuable for a variety different people this?   37:48 Yeah. And I think that saying that saying yes to everything, or only saying yes to things that align with your values? I mean, yes, you have to really only say yes to things that align to your values. But I think that speaks to speak to that 30,000 foot view of society in general, and of social media and what we're seeing everyone else do, right, so you may scroll through your Instagram or Twitter, Facebook, Tik Tok, whatever it is, you're on. And you may say, Well, gosh, this person just, they wrote another article, or Gosh, this person speaking here, and they're doing this and they're starting an app, and they're, they've got a podcast, and how come I'm not doing all that? Should I be doing all of that, so I should be set? Why, you know, I need to be doing XY and Z and, and, you know, you've got that, that FOMO disease, you know, your fear of missing out, and then you bombard yourself with things that you think you should be doing because other people are doing them. But it's not even something you believe in, but you think you should believe in it? Because Because other people in the profession are doing it and look at how many followers they have, or, or look at all the success and I use that in quotation marks because we don't really know someone's true success out on social media, right? Because we only put the good stuff on social media, you're not going to put the shitty stuff on social media, right? And so I think this saying yes to everything. I think a lot of it is based on societal pressures, what you're seeing on social media, maybe what a colleague or someone that graduated with you like, oh my gosh, they already started their own practice. And I didn't do that yet. So I guess I have to do that. And I have to say yes to this, that the other thing and it's, I think you really have to especially now like take a step back. Know who you are, know your values know, know your what your individual mission statement is, right? I know you guys said you have a mission statement for your book, but I would challenge everyone like you have your own mission statement as whether it's a clinician or you're in academia. But really you have to know deep down what your values are, what you're willing to take and what you're not willing to take, and, and really know yourself in a very deep, meaningful way. And I'm not saying I know myself in a deep meaningful way yet, but I'm trying, right? It doesn't mean and again, it doesn't mean you have to know that. So again, that's another thing people think, Oh, I have to do this now. But you know, in researching a talk for CSM that I'm actually doing with how do you Janemba my, the part of my talk is increasing your self awareness as an entrepreneur, and how do you do that, and I came across a really great quote, he who knows others, as wise, He who knows himself as enlightened by louts Lao Tzu, la Otz, you I hope I'm pronouncing that correctly. And I saw that quote, and I thought, Oh, that's so perfect, right. Because as, as clinicians, and as physical therapists, our job is to get to know the patient in front of us or the student in front of us or whoever it is in front of you that oftentimes, I think we give away big parts of ourselves without taking it back and looking inward.   41:16 And so you kind of get this like, drain on your empathy, and your energy goes on as the day goes on. And I think that happens a lot. And in these kind of giving professions that we are in, whether you're a professor or a clinician, or even a researcher, right, you're going to give all of your energy to that. And then you see you're always looking outwardly all day. And do you take the time to come back at the end of the day and look at yourself inward? And say, Well, what, what am I doing? Like, why am I doing this? Am I doing it for the likes? Or to get more followers? Or like, what is your goal? Right? And so I think that's kind of where that saying no to things comes in, if you know, your why behind what why you're doing things. It will make it easier for you to say yes, and to say no, because it's going to align with with who you are. But that takes time, you know, so as a new as a student, or a new professional, maybe you do have that all figured out. And if you do awesome, come on the podcast, let's talk about it. How did you do it, but you know, if it takes time, and you have to kind of find your groove and, and really know, where you want your career to be headed. And some people do know that right off the bat, I didn't. But it doesn't mean that other people don't have a very clear path of where they want their career in life to go. You know. And, and there's obviously that changes here and there. But I think that's what I meant by that, quote is looking for those opportunities is to really know yourself, and what your How much are you willing to take? How much capacity do you have for XYZ? And if you don't have the capacity for it, then don't do it? Because it's going to be done like half assed, you know, and nobody wants   43:19 nothing. That's great. Yeah, great advice. Yeah, finding, finding your why and staying true to your why and finding things that that sort of line up with that to allow for you to not have that emotional, physiological draining. If you would find things that fill your cup not not dump your cup out.   43:37 Yeah, exactly. Exactly. Yeah. It's a nice way to put it.   43:42 Um, yeah. So Karen, thank you so much for, you know, kind of expanding and elaborating on some of those. You know, as Tim and I mentioned in the, in the beginning, I think when we were chatting probably before we were recording, Tim, and I want to probably get a podcast started at some point in the future. And, you know, we'd love for you to come on and be one of our guests, so we can talk more about this stuff.   44:06 Yeah, I'd be happy to. And now before we wrap things up here, where can people find you guys? Where can they get the book? Let's go. Go ahead. The floor is yours.   44:18 So we have a website. The website is movers and mentors calm on there is all of our social media information and links directly to Amazon where you can find both our Kindle version and paperback version. If you have questions, comments, please tag us send us stuff on social media. Tim and I love that we you know, we've been very fortunate we've had really engaged you know, an engaged audience up until this point and so you know, we're looking or looking for more of that and shoot us an email if you want and with with comments or feedback. We love to hear that as well.   45:00 Great. And how about where can people find you on social media? Oh, yeah. Yeah,   45:08 it's in those that thing tendons got our handles there.   45:11 Yeah. So my, you can message me on Instagram. But Tim Reynolds DPP would be my thing. That's my Twitter routes, and would be my Instagram. And we'll send you that Karen. So you can sort of tag along for the podcast. But I like Brian was saying, I think the opportunity to interact with our, with our audience is one of the most exciting things, getting somebody that reading the book from South America and is so excited to receive the book is one of the highlights of our day. And I think having the opportunity to have our our audience also send us Who do they think should be the movers and shakers in our potential upcoming volumes of this would be something that we'd really appreciate. There's so many people within the profession that we do not know of yet. And so obviously, appreciate having their insight and input in that as well.   46:08 So I'm at at Bryan, Bryan, Gaskey, and Instagram and then we're at movers and mentors, both on Instagram and Twitter.   46:16 Perfect. And all of that will be in the show notes at podcasts at healthy, wealthy, smart, calm. So before we wrap up, what is question I asked everyone, what advice would you give to your younger self? So let's say fresh out of PT school at Ithaca? What advice would you give yourself?   46:36 I would tell myself, stay curious. Because I find that when I'm curious and asking questions, that means I'm engaged. And I think engagement. If it aligns with your your purpose and your passion, then you have kind of all three things in alignment. And that, you know, lends itself to a happy, fruitful and hopefully, you know, effective career.   47:05 Excellent. Tim, go ahead.   47:08 And I would say sort of piggybacking off what we were talking about earlier, Aaron would be continue to search for the why. And it's okay not to know. And I think that's one of those things where finding your why and staying true to the values is one of those things I'll add to life journey, continue to search for that throughout the lifespan. But I think actively checking back to is this lining up with my Why would be one of the things that I would want to do, either from a journal reflecting standpoint, or just from like a quarterly check in. But then also, the acceptance of it's okay, not to know not necessarily not to know what your y is, but not to know certain things in part of your life. Um, and I think being 20 to 2324 and try to navigate your 20s. And I'm thinking that everybody in that sort of FOMO aspect is having the solutions and answers. And it is okay that you do not know yet you are enough, you will be enough, challenge yourself and have the opportunity to allow for that growth and expansion.   48:23 You guys, that is great advice. Thank you so much for coming on the podcast and sharing your book. Again. It's movers and mentors, and it's available on amazon.com. Go to their website, go to the social media. Everything again is that podcast out healthy, wealthy, smart, calm. One click, we'll take you to any thing you need for both Brian and Tim. So thank you so much, guys, for coming on.   48:49 Thanks for having us, Karen. Yeah, thank you, Karen.   48:53 Pleasure and everyone. Thanks so much for listening. Have a great couple of days and stay healthy, wealthy and smart.

Spiritual Dope
Amie Dean - Akashic Records: A New Way to Connect with Your Past

Spiritual Dope

Play Episode Listen Later Dec 12, 2021 58:35


Amie Dean is a certified clinical trauma counselor and an Ascension Coach. She helps driven, empathic women struggling with self-criticism and not feeling good enough, heal their inner child wounds so they can live an authentic, spiritually awakened life- true to their souls. Connect with Amy over at https://www.one-awakening.com Transcript AI Generated: Unknown Speaker 0:00 Your journey has been an interesting one up to hear you've questioned so much more than those around you. You've even questioned yourself as to how you could have grown into these thoughts. Am I crazy? When did I begin to think differently? Why do people in general appear so limited in this process? Rest assured, you are not alone. The world is slowly waking up to what you already know inside yet can't quite verbalize. Welcome to the spiritual dough podcast, the show that answers the questions you never even knew to ask, but knew the answers to questions about you, this world, the people in it? And most importantly, how do I proceed? Now moving forward? We don't have all the answers, but we sure do love living in the question. Time for another head of spiritual dub with your host, Brandon Handley. Let's get right into today's episode. Brandon Handley 0:41 Hey, there's spiritual dope. We are on here today with Amy Dean. She is a certified clinical trauma counselor and an ascension coach. She helps driven empathetic women struggling with self criticism and not feeling good enough to heal their inner child wounds so that they can live an authentic spiritually awakened life true to their souls. Two things here for you, Amy, first of all, thanks for having a short bio. Second, you know, happy to have you here. And I appreciate it. I know we try to connect you. You see you travel, kind of around a good bit last time you and I tried to connect, we weren't able to have a strong connection but happy to you know, reconnect. Right? Sometimes we set these, we set these up and we don't connect and then we never hear from each other again. So, so glad we're able to, to to to pick it back up. Thanks for being here today. Amie Dean 1:31 Yes, thank you. It really is truly a pleasure to be here. And thank you for being so flexible too. I know I do travel often and just did a four corners tour of the US over the past year and back where we started from. So now this is just the new beginning so to speak. Brandon Handley 1:49 Freight, and you're you're out in San Diego right now. Is Amie Dean 1:51 that right? I'm in San Diego. Yes. And this is home base. This is where you know, when I call home? Yeah. Brandon Handley 1:58 Yeah, fantastic. So I like to start this off with the whole idea that you and I are spirituals for universal energy, like we're the vessels where, you know, that energy is expressed. Right? And the idea is that you and I are going to have a conversation here today, you and I will, we'll have our dialogue and we'll try we'll figure it out. And then there's going to be somebody else who's listening today, that's going to pick something totally different out of what we talked about. And it's gonna be exactly what that person needs, maybe for their awakening, maybe to pick themselves off the ground through an awakening or you know, not not be so you know, not be so taken aback by their awakening, and what you know, just what is that message today that's coming through you for that person? Amie Dean 2:46 Yeah, I love how you put that, by the way to that it's, it's almost like this is the channel, right, and people are getting exactly what they need in the moment. So I would say the biggest message is that we all have an inner child, and this inner child within us, it's natural state is to be innocent and playful and loving, and completely in tune with the joy that we are naturally. But sometimes we have these wounds. And most people I would say have wounds, you know whether or not you've been through trauma, although of course trauma can make a huge impact on the you know, I would say the depth of wounds that an injured inner child part might carry. But with that being said, it's totally 100% healable to work through these wounds that the inner child carries. And often we don't necessarily see this as a stepping point on the spiritual awakening journey. Sometimes, you know, we might go to therapy, for example, and just work on our past or heal certain memories. But it really does keep us stuck. These wounds keep us stuck on the spiritual awakening path. So I'd love to impart some insights around that today and how to work through those wounds to heal them so we can awaken to our true nature as love and joy. Brandon Handley 3:57 Sure, sure. Would you would you say that these trauma wounds are often blocking us from our spiritual awakening. Amie Dean 4:09 Absolutely, yeah, I would say they are. And, you know, and also this is maybe a little bit, you know, often the left field a little bit, but I would say that when we even work to heal our trauma, this is on a conscious level, right? We're coming to it on a sense of, Oh, I know, I have this memory or I have this belief and it's keeping me stuck. And so we're coming to therapy, for example, or coaching or whoever, you know, we end up you know, moving through this kind of growth experience. But we don't always know exactly sometimes what is causing our triggers, you know, on a subconscious level. And so there can be some subconscious wounding, you know, I hear a lot from from people when they come to see me it's something like, you know, I've worked through this before, I don't know why, you know, I still have these triggers in my relationship, for example, or why I you know, still feel like, I'm just not happy, you know, in the way that I thought I could be after healing these wounds. And sometimes there's some subconscious factors there that could be keeping, you know, person from really knowing their wounds, and knowing exactly what that inner child might be going through within their within their heart. Brandon Handley 5:14 Right. Yeah, I mean, there's there's a lot there for sure. Just trying to understand. Even accessing that inner child can be a challenge, right? That admitting that there's an inner child there, and then I'm sure there's plenty people will be like, I'm not wounded. I'm fine. But I think that everybody's got a little bit of something. Right? Even if it's just a nice grape, right, address it? I think, and I don't know, would you call would you call doing this type of work similar to shadow work? Are they one of the same? Are they different yet? Amie Dean 5:47 Oh, no, that's a really great point, it is absolutely shadow work, I would say on the deepest level, can give you an example to I'm glad you brought up you know how to access the inner child or just, you know, the difficulty in accessing it sometimes. And I would say that it is a little bit more difficult on your own. But when you're working with someone directly, whether it's a friend or you know, a therapist or a coach, it can be really helpful to have somebody to see you right, And to see these different aspects of you showing up. But you know, for example, I, you know, I have clients, sometimes they'll come to our session, and they'll say, I have nothing to talk about today. And there's nothing going on, and I'm feeling pretty good, actually, everything's going fairly well, I mean, it's not great, but it's not bad. And then you know, we'll do a little bit of digging, and we'll start to, you know, go into meditation, meditation is a really big help in activating the inner child and getting to know her, or him or, you know, whichever, you know, also, the inner child can show up, as, you know, as an animal, sometimes, too, right? There's so many different ways that this inner child shows up within us. And so when we are looking at this inner child, sometimes, you know, it shows up out of nowhere, you know, in that moment in our work together, where that little, you know, little person inside says, I just need more love, or I'm not getting the kind of experience that I need right now. Or I need a break, or I'm tired of working so hard, or whatever that might be for that person. And typically, my client is taken back by it, I see the look of surprise on their face, their eyebrows are raised, and they're confused. Like, I didn't know, this was happening inside of me, I thought that everything was actually okay. And then tears, you know, sometimes will come out and they'll, you know, recognize that that's that little, you know, little self inside coming out and trying to trying to heal, trying to move through the wounding, just by being in contact with, you know, that person's higher self. And then that's a lot of the work that I do is helping people contact their higher self so they can connect with their inner child. Brandon Handley 7:42 Sure, no, I think that's pretty. One of the things that I noticed and doing some of this work, is exactly what you're saying, we were really good at lying to ourselves. I'm fine. I'm great. I'm doing I'm doing everything I need to be doing. And it's when it's when you have somebody else out there asking you that second question, it could be your spouse, you know, it could be anybody that's willing to kind of ask you the second questions. But typically, we're really good at lying to ourselves, and we feel like we're just fine. And it's not until somebody asks you what's beyond that question. Another thing that I found is that we've got a narrative that we don't realize that there are holes in, right, and we go and we share that narrative with, with a coach such as yourself, or somebody that, you know, that that we're working with. And that and those questions that there's that plank hole in the narrative, they get asked, and we're like, Oh, my God, I didn't even realize like, that was missing. I've been driving around with three wheels, right? Instead of four type of thing. So very cool. What What, um, you know, I'd love to talk about the journey to where you are today to the work that you're doing. So how did you find yourself in this line of work? Start wherever you want? Amie Dean 9:03 Yeah, what a great question. So I would say that I've always been drawn to, you know, I could even start really young, I was six years old, teaching my little sister to read. And I was thinking, I'm going to be a teacher someday. This is what I'm going to do. I just knew it and not in the way of course, that I am a teacher now. But as time went on, I realized I have something to share, I have something I want to, you know, impart to others and I really felt like a helper. And for a while there, I didn't know what that looked like. And I didn't know what that would exactly feel like, but I decided, you know, to become a coach. It just realized, you know, it just feels right. I feel like I just enjoy talking with people in this way. And I was helping, you know, my friends would come to me naturally, you know, and and ask for advice. And I realized, okay, maybe I have a knack for this and decided to become a coach and did some coaching training and then realize I had a client actually, who changed things for me pretty dramatically. This client came to me with a lot of mental health issues and a lot of challenges that they were seeing a therapist for, and then seeing me separately as their coach. And I learned a lot from her in the recognition that the coaching work I was doing was really limited as much as I wanted to help, you know, heal mind body spirit, and I felt there was a huge integrative connection with that I just didn't have the skills, I didn't have the resources, you know, as a coach. So I decided, okay, this matters to me, I know, there's absolutely need to have a much bigger picture, I think, you know, in order to understand how to heal, and how to work through things, not just on, you know, the spiritual, emotional level. But I think if I understand the mental, you know, side of things, the psychological side, then it would make a big difference for me. So I looked into going to graduate school, and I thought, you know, what, I'm going to become a psychotherapist, and I'm going to make this work. And I moved from Florida to California, and went to school, at a really small transpersonal more holistic psych psychotherapy School. And from there, I realized that this was my path that I was always meant to integrate psychology and spirituality together, and then spent, you know, a couple years really, you know, learning therapy and what that was like, and understanding, you know, the holistic side of that too, which was excellent, which 100% connects with coaching in that way. But then I realized, I really want to do coaching still. So then I just began doing both and realize there's, there's a way you can do that. So I think, you know, it just took me some time to realize that clients had certain need, right for Mind Body Spirit connection, and I didn't have the skills at the time to do that. But after, you know, going to therapy school, realize that that was going to make a big difference, I think for the clients that I was going to work with. And, of course, you know, I want to mention, you know, something important to you just in a vulnerable way, I had to go through a lot of my own trauma healing in, you know, during this journey. So as I was talking with that client, you know, we're winding back to that coaching client, I recognized in her you know, there was some mirroring trauma showing up in me, and I realized, you know, I thought that was healed, I thought I had healed my own trauma around this. And it brought up, you know, a lot of triggers for me. And so it was a journey. It wasn't just a how do I learn to help others heal, but through that, it was learning how to truly heal myself. And it was something it was a journey I never, ever could have anticipated. But I discovered, you know, who I really am through that process. So I know that it's a long journey, but I think that kind of sums up, you know, the main points of it. Brandon Handley 12:38 Right now it does, and it's great that you you already knew at a young age that hey, you wanted to help and kind of facilitate others learning and coming along their journeys. And, you know, so you go to a psychotherapist route, and then you end up at this transpersonal holistic school, I've never even heard of such a thing. So I love I love that idea. Can you talk a little bit more about what that education was like? Because, again, when I think of somebody going to a psychotherapist school, I think of like this kind of this, I don't know, what was called clinical studies, you know, that type of thing, white jacket, and when you say transpersonal holistic school, I think burning sage and you know, dreamcatchers. So, yeah, so I'd love to know, just like a little bit of how those two merged for you. And I mean, what drew you more to the spiritual side versus going straight clinical? Amie Dean 13:38 Ooh, yeah, that's good one, too. So I went to so the school I went to is called Sofia University in Palo Alto, California. And the school itself is kind of like a cohort model. And it's very different. You're right. It's not like the white wall clinical ideas, sit in a classroom and you know, listen to a lecture kind of thing. It was more overall sitting in a circle together. And it was a very small cohort, you know, of, you know, sometimes even five people in a classroom, and it was very experiential. And we did a lot of art therapy and getting to know ourselves through meditation, and then using other kinds of therapy that you probably wouldn't have heard, you know, wouldn't hear us most times, like internal family systems, or psycho synthesis and all these different, you know, they're just pointing to understanding that there is a core self, and there's an OS in here, you know, that's beyond our personality that's beyond who we think we are. And so you're right, there was, you know, this idea of the burning of stage and, you know, and understanding, you know, how to actually bring, you know, crystals into some of the work that we do, and, you know, a very deep level, it was very connective, right, it was more of a relational experience, you know, with therapy and understanding, you know, our approach. And you know, more so than here's, you know, here's what you need to learn. Now go out and kind of make that a reality. It was more like you're going to learn it here. You're going to get the experience here. And you're going to take that right into the next mixed into the next stage of your therapy work. So it felt more integrative for me, you know, just bringing that all together, we did a lot of, you know, inner somatic body work and understanding how our body, you know, connects with our mind and our spirit and really getting a hold on who we are, as therapists, you know, not so much as this is what a therapist is, right? If that makes sense, a little bit more of an eye and identity, you know, experience around that. So that was that was that school? And I would say, I would never ever go back and no regrets around that. I think that that was exactly what I needed. And leading up to why I went there. And my spiritual journey, you know, to get there was, you know, I've so I'm definitely an empath, I've always been very highly sensitive. So I've always picked up on emotions of others, you know, quite frequently, and it really caused me a lot of anxiety growing up. So I had a lot of anxiety as a young child had no idea how to manage it, or how to cope with it. And so as time had gone on, you know, I realized that I was also having the psychic experiences, in addition to the anxiety. And so then I was really freaked out, of course, right as a young child, and no understanding as to what that means, you know, I'm seeing my grandmother who had passed in the living room, and I'm having anxiety getting up every day. And so I just didn't really know how to sort through the experience, but I felt a draw. Anyway, I felt a draw to how do I figure this out? Who, who is this enemy, or what's happening inside of me. And that's when I, you know, started embarking on, you know, a totally different journey than my upbringing, which was Christian at the time. And at that point, realized, I would say, maybe in my late teens, it didn't really, you know, connect with my needs. It wasn't something that was really helping me thrive and understand who I am as a soul. And so I would say at that point, started looking into different spiritual books. And, you know, leaders such as Neale Donald Walsch was a really big life changer for me, you know, I would say, Abraham, you know, Hicks, that kind of, you know, experience to more manifestation Louise Hay, all these different authors really gave me an understanding that there's more to life than what we see and what we experienced. And then my anxiety started to subside. And I started to feel better. And I started to understand my psychic abilities a lot more and realize, okay, I'm different, maybe I'm not the same as a lot of people I know. But it's not bad, different, right. So I had to learn through that, you know, that it was just who I am. And a lot of other people were also struggling with that as well out there. And I'm feeling empathic and not knowing what to do with it. So that led me to, you know, this, obviously, the, the long journey led me to discovering who I am really, truly feeling who I am, and having a clear sense of, you know, self awareness within. And then I decided, this is my path. This is number one for me. I just felt this was my purpose. And it was like, nothing could shake that. Nothing could shake the knowing that this is my purpose now, to awaken spiritually and to help others do the same. Yeah. Brandon Handley 18:12 So lots of lots in there. Right. All good stuff. A couple things that I want to hit on is you mentioned integrative, quite a bit. And I believe that one of the biggest challenges that we have, especially in western civilization's last culture, is our ability to integrate spirituality, with everyday life, you know, we, we've got this spiritual life, and then we've got like this, this other life, and I was listening to I was listening to Alan Watts the other day, and he was talking about Hinduism. How, in Hinduism, that's the same, like there's there's no separation. Right? So what you know, when you say integrative, what do you what do you mean by that? And is it along those lines? And is that kind of some of the work that you're trying to do is get people to integrate their spirituality with the whole of who they are? Yes, Amie Dean 19:09 yes. Excellent. That is exactly what I'm pointing to. It's really all about, how can we stop separating our life? Right? How can we actually start to see that in our spiritual life or a meditative life, right is the same as our everyday life, right? The life where we have to do list of so many things you have to check off every day, and responsibilities, right, that are absolutely 100% needed. And what I find through this is mindfulness. I'm also a mindfulness teacher. So I'm a huge proponent on helping to bring people to this understanding that the more mindful we can be, the more we can bring spirituality into our everyday life and integrate it more. And that doesn't look like for example, necessarily sitting on a meditation cushion for 30 minutes a day, getting up and then doing the rest of your day and then going to bed and feeling exhausted right by the end of the day. But it's more of how do I want to start my day mindfully? What does that look like for each person, maybe you know, for each person, it's more of an informal mindfulness practice of, I'm going to make my coffee, right with awareness, I'm going to smell that cup of coffee, I'm going to really be with it, I'm going to find gratitude in the moment of it. And I'm going to do my sitting meditation, maybe, but the rest of the day, I'm going to make an intention to really notice what's happening, in my mind, what's happening in my body, what's showing up for me right now, and how can I tend to that compassionately, as I go through the day, because that's huge, I think, too, you know, if we can be compassionate with ourselves, then we can, you know, bring the spiritual dimension into our everyday life, because that's the dimension of love, right? Helping us to reconnect with with who we are. Brandon Handley 20:47 Now, that's, I mean, that's solid, right? So just bring it all in, I think another piece to that you're talking about you, you're bringing in the mindfulness, you're talking about the meditation. To me, it sounds like you're talking about overall wellness, which is kind of what's meant by holistic, and, you know, if you if you would just say whole self, right, or, or all of these things that you know, are generally going to benefit you as a holistic practice versus I think what we look at as the acute doctor, you know, we go to a doctor, you get, you know, you they work on, oh, your hand hurts, we've got a specialist for that, and, and for that person, everything's going to be about the hand, right? Because that's what they specialize in for them, you know, the hammer nails thing. And then, and then I love the idea to, you know, setting the intentions and you said 10 to it, which I like, I like the 10 to it versus nurturing piece. A lot of people are always talking about you got to nurture this, you got to nurture that nurture, nurture, nurture. That's great. Yeah, you got to nurture to a lot of things. But when you tend to your garden, you, you know, you sometimes you pull some weeds, right? Sometimes you got to sometimes you got to clear some space, sometimes you got to make way for the things that you are nurturing. And in the hole, you're tending to it. So I think that that's a great, great word to use. And then I have a great point. I mean, a question I've been asked before, and I'm really curious, what's your, what's your, what's your take is on it is what would you say the differences, you brought up the word awareness? And we're talking about mindfulness. But what would you say the difference between those two are? Amie Dean 22:22 Yeah, oh, great. So I would say that mindfulness of being mindful is just simply paying attention to the present moment, you know, and what's happening in the now, right. So for example, it's hearing the sounds in the room, right? Or feeling yourself in the chair, it's just being mindful of what's happening moment by moment. And that, you know, in my experience, anyway, creates self awareness. So mindfulness kind of leads to self awareness. And self awareness would be you know, acknowledging, oh, there's thoughts in here that maybe really don't connect, you know, with who I really feel myself to be. Right. As you mentioned, I love that metaphor around the garden, right, tending to the garden in this way. And it's, I mean, if every day we were to wake up and say, Okay, I've got a garden, right, in one way, and this garden has some weeds in it, because I'm human. And that happens. And I might need to, you know, work through that today. But how can I tend to that garden, right, the inner garden, so to speak, as I go throughout my day, you know, noticing those weeds tending to them, as you mentioned, right? Just being with them, and not maybe no, often we're tend, we tend to be in a rush, right? We tend to be busy, we tend to try and make things happen as quickly as we can. Because we want to get more done, right? It's just our culture in many ways. But we're missing that attending right to ourselves, when we're doing that when we're so doing focused instead of being focused, right? And so the more being focused we can be, which is, you know, simply being mindful, then we are truly, you know, gaining self awareness and understanding more of what's happening inside because that's the first step towards healing the inner child or any, you know, any kind of healing truly self awareness, because without that, we're gonna get lost, right? We're gonna be walking in circles and we're going to keep running through the same old cycles that have kept us stuck right in the past. Brandon Handley 24:08 Not for sure, I mean, I think that's a great way great way of putting it so I appreciate that and then you also threw in there the idea of you know, we're so busy like I gotta I gotta do this I've got to run it the next day. I've got a good day but busy doesn't always and we equate busy Yeah, working on the things with being productive. Right and sometimes right sometimes going back to the garden right? Like you don't rip out you don't rip out the you don't rip out the you know, the corn to see if it's growing right you don't you don't rip it out. Take a look at the roots to see if it's growing you leave it flip kind of suicide thing and you sit back and know again that you've got to do these other pieces in order to let it go ahead and be one of the things I want to touch on too is you know you brought up a Christian background. Also notice that you do Akashic work you doing all this? Other work again, you're smudging, you've got dreamcatchers you've got like all these other things going on how's your family take, you know, kind of where you're focused at right now? Because I think a big part of, of doing these journeys and getting into this space, sometimes we meet with resistance from family or friends who were like, What do you mean, you're doing this and this, like, you're putting a position to the fan, like your purpose and what you feel like your purpose is? Right? So what was that journey? Like for you? Amie Dean 25:29 Oh, yeah, that was a journey. So I will tell you that I know at first so one thing about my family is that they are very open minded. So that's a positive. Now my mom was not very open minded. At first, she was more, you know, your, towards Christianity and trying to help me, you know, kind of pivot my way back a little bit, you know, as I've as I've grown through this journey, but my dad was always 100% open, he's like, tell me more about this. Let's read the spiritual books together, you know, oh, the Akashic records, let's do a reading. So I think his kind of openness, you know, and his, his true curiosity around it was something that helped me to recognize that it's okay for me to explore these things. And I know not everyone has that, you know, like one parent or a friend or somebody that says, go for it, you know, what do you have to lose figure, you know, figure out what works for you kind of thing, right? And my mom was on the opposite spectrum. She's like, don't do that, you know, that's a sin. And you can't, you can't read that book, and you can't do those things. And so it was there was like, a push pull on me for a while, like, Dad is good, I'm good with this mom is not so good with this, right? And I had to kind of move through this experience of how do I be fully authentic with myself, right? Well, not, you know, creating chaos in my family around this. And over time, you know, for a while there, I just had to learn how to speak my truth and be authentic with my mom and, and really just share with her my experience of it and and also help her to see that didn't negate her experience, right? That it's okay for her to feel the way she feels and to have her Christian beliefs and to really connect with those, and that they're really not all that different. There's just different perspectives around it, right. And so she opened up a lot, I think, after a few years, she realized, Oh, this is just who my daughter is now. And I have to kind of accept that. And so there was acceptance piece that she was coming to around it. And then she'd say things to me like, well tell me more about that, you know, I want to know more about that retreat you went on, or that shamanic death and dying workshop that you did, you know, it's like, things like that, where, I mean, my mom would never have asked that. So I could tell that she was growing through my process of growth. And I tend to see that often with the clients I work with too. And in their family, sometimes it'll mirror their experience when they're healing, eventually, there's pushback, you know, and there usually is, you know, some difficulty or a lot of difficulty, and how other people, you know, experience your experience. But sometimes there's a mirroring effect, where you can start to realize that, oh, other people, actually, you know, they're growing with me, we're growing together through this, it doesn't mean we're always going to be on the same page. But it does mean that sometimes, you know, we can come together a bit more. And so my mom still has her same beliefs, you know, she's not going to the other side, necessarily with me, but she is so open to it. And she just tells me, you know, how happy she is for me that on all my purpose, and then I'm living my dream, and then I'm doing the things that really matter to me. And it took a while for her to get there. It really did. And it wasn't something I was really holding out for, you know, as I was doing, you know, my own trauma healing work, I realized, you know, what, my mom's approval, right, of course, as I was going through this, and recognized, you know, what is it's actually okay for my mom to be where she is right now with this. And for me to be where I am with this because I have to, I have to do my own healing work with that. So this is important for me. And I think over time, my mom just recognized that it was okay for me to be who I am. Because she loved me anyway. Okay, not everyone's gonna have that experience. I think, you know, of course, but having, like you mentioned a good friend, or maybe your spouse or something like that can make a huge impact. And I'll also add in that my spouse is not he is not necessarily, you know, involved in the same things I am, you know, he's not like, oh, yeah, let's go to a meditation retreat this weekend. You know, but he's 100% supportive. And I think that's the difference, right? We just need to have at least a few people in our lives, who are kind of our cheerleaders, right? They're like, I'm here for you, you've got this. And, and, you know, I love you for who you are. Because that touches on the wound, you know, the people who don't love us for who we are, then we activate our shame wound of our inner child right around not being good enough. And it can absolutely hinder our spiritual journey, right? And maybe even you know, make us decide that we don't even want to, you know, embark on that path because it's too hard or because our family doesn't understand or doesn't agree with it. Right on a deep level. So yeah, it's a really good question, though, that you brought up. Brandon Handley 29:52 So for, like, right, the talents here, especially when you're leaning into something, non convention All right, I think that that's the best way to put it, you know, larger percentage of the world is Christian and larger, even even a large percentage of them don't realize that the Bible is kind of like a, I don't know, a Snow White remake, right? Of all the things that came before it, right? And it's like, all the same exact stories are in there. But like, just because it's over here in this book, it means something different than it ever meant before. So it sounds like you know, she's she's got that genuine curiosity, because she's seeing the the kind of alignment and she's like, alright, well, you know, what the path that you're on, actually aligns kind of really well to everything I already know, I'm sure I'm not sure she's ever said that like out loud, but also have to go to the idea of, you know, I'm a parent. And, you know, it's a general thing that I would have to say is, you know, it's just wanting to make sure that your child is okay. Right. Like, it's not even so much of like, you know, worried about, you know, yeah, you are more more so like, you know, just wanting to make sure you're okay. And so I mean, to me, that's what it sounds like. And it's great that you know, that your dad was kind of there going through and being genuinely interested is sitting down, going through and looking through Akashic stuff with you as well. That's kind of fun. And, and he talked a little bit about to this, this idea of not holding on to needing her acceptance or their acceptance. And I think that I think that's really a powerful thing as well, that the idea of sure you would love it, if they understood and they were there with you and your journey. And that that might be something kind of meaningful. Yeah, but you're not attached to that, right? That doesn't necessarily mean that, that you're not going to do it. And it doesn't necessarily mean that your happiness is derived from their approval. Right? I think that's it, that's a big challenge. I mean, that Good on you for kind of, you know, being able to make those breaks. And even even in that, what else was there? Just that? That, was it, the idea that doesn't negate the truth of who she is. Right? Like, you know, so your mom, you know, doesn't, you know, she can still have her journey, you've got yours. And again, that's another another thing that I that, you know, I experienced myself and have, you know, seen from others, like, this is the way follow me, right? Like, you know, if you're not going this way, then you know, you're not living the truth of who you are. Right. And so being able to being able to look at others and realize that they're all on their journey, you're on yours, you guys all meet, I think about it, kind of like in the in the idea of Wizard of Oz, right? You know, we all kind of meet along the way to Oz, and like, you're going to get a brain you're going for our heart, I just want to go home, right? And, and, but like everybody's kind of on their own individual journey for their own individual reasons. So really cool story, I enjoy it. Another big piece of that is, a lot of us face that, right? We face this wall of, you know, I really want to I really want to step into the truth of who I am, right? I really want to go do this thing, but I'm not sure that XYZ you're going to accept it. Right? Or what are the what is everybody gonna say? And the truth of the matter is like, do you want to sit there and lay in bed at night being like, why aren't I living out my life the way I want to. And, you know, that said, thank you for sharing that journey. And then hopefully, like I said, that's going to be helpful for others who are who are kind of in that same space in place or similar journey to to know what some of the positive steps that they can take. And I'll also caveat that when I say positive, I don't mean like, you know, it's always gonna have a joyous outcome, it means that there's forward progress. When I say positive, there's, there's, you're moving forward, you're you're getting unstuck, you're moving towards wherever you're trying to move to. So let's say, you know, I reached out to you, Amy, and I'm like, I want to do some work with you. What, you know, walk me through, like, an introductory session and what we might talk about. Amie Dean 34:17 Absolutely. So there are two avenues to that. And one avenue is, you know, just spending some time first in like a consultation. So it'd be a phone call to decide number one is coaching right for you, or it's counseling right for you, because, and there's two different layers of this, right. So for example, therapy tends to be better for you know, an individual who is kind of in a in a stage where maybe they haven't done a lot of therapy already before or they have but they still have some very traumatic wounds that they're stuck in. It's almost like the survival stage, right, that they're trying to move through. And so that's, you know, typically therapy, right where we want to actually get down to the bottom of it, what is this core wound? What are some of these things that are in these memories and past you know, Your senses that are causing this wound. So that's more of like the therapy side of it. So and that's also if you know, a person's experiencing, you know, extreme anxiety or depression, or they're really having a hard time, you know, functioning on a, you know, more balanced level in their everyday life. Now, coaching is for people who say, you know, what I know I still have wants to heal, or pretty sure I do. And I'd like to find out more about what that looks like. But kind of similar to what you've mentioned before, it's for those truth seekers, almost right, the ones who are ready to kind of deepen their spiritual journey, you know, a bit more, and they want to connect with like minded people, because the coaching I do is within a group setting with other women. And in the setting, this is a place to truly heal together, because we're not on this spiritual awakening journey alone, right? We're not meant to be anyway, we're supposed to connect and heal through each other's stories and heal through each other's wisdom and compassion. So I would say that the major differences is, you know, therapy is kind of a stepping stone to the coaching work I do. Because it does help to have a really clear understanding of the whys. Why I went through this and the house and, and to have the coping, you know, skills and resources, and then the coaching is that next level, to say, but you know, I got a really clear sense, and my life is, you know, a little more balanced, or a lot more balanced. And now I'm ready, I'm ready to really dive into Who am I really? What is my life purpose? Like, what is most important to me, as a spiritual being? And how can I bring spirituality as the main source of my life? How can I truly understand who I am? And so that would be I think, that next level, you know, and, and often in the consultation, I can help, you know, person discover more about that and understand, you know, where they're at, if they're unsure, you know, where they're at in this journey. But that's usually the first step. I would say to the process. Yeah. Brandon Handley 36:52 So we've determined that I am you I am fresh out of survival mode, right? And I'm ready to go on to this, this coaching, I'm ready to deepen my spiritual journey. I love that you're creating space, and you're working primarily with women, is that correct? Amie Dean 37:10 That is yes. Primarily with women with you know, doesn't have to be developmental trauma, but women who have had some kind of level of trauma or or difficulty in, or just maybe processing through certain life events that they've been through. So And usually, of course, it always stands in childhood, even if they don't have a core memory that connects to that just yet. Brandon Handley 37:32 How do you help them connect to that core memory? What's something that you do for that? Amie Dean 37:37 Yeah, so when so not usually in the consultation? Usually, this happens in our first session together, we spent some time, you know, creating these building blocks around, what are some of these memories you do remember, what are some things that do come to mind, right, that makes sense for you. And then we just go a little bit deeper, and we go backwards in time together. So I use a meditative technique with visualization. And I use something called internal family systems as well. It's a form of therapy that allows you to go deep into your psyche, to understand different sub personalities. And these are simply, you know, different parts of us that show up in our everyday life, like our critic or perfectionist, our, let's say, you know, there's a part of you that you know, wants to, well, maybe a control part, right, I want to control my everyday experiences and creates anxiety for you. So these are parts we get in touch with, and we try to understand how do they connect to your timeline as to when the symptoms began for you? Right? So maybe for this person, it's I started having extreme anxiety at age 10. And I don't know why. Right? I don't know what caused it. So we'll just start to explore what happened, you know, around that time frame, so it's very similar to therapy in this way to you know, in discovering the core wound, but then we go into, you know, the Akashic records, and then we discover more of the whys and the hows around this core wound. And then more memory starts to become more obvious Brandon Handley 39:00 for me because I was waiting to get to the Akashic records. I'm like, can we use feel all this shit and get to the Akashic records? Because I'm ready, go there. Right, let's, let's, let's talk. Let's talk about the Akashic records. What would you say they are? And what, when, and how, how do your clients usually kind of react to what they are versus what their perception of that is? Amie Dean 39:27 Yes, so how so? Typically, it's really interesting. There's such a big interest now in the Akashic records, and most people are like, I don't really know what it is, but I just want to figure out how to access mine, right? Because it sounds so cool to know more about who I am and, and to ask questions to understand my spiritual side. But the Akashic Records really are it's just this etheric library have, really of our inner worlds, right. So I know sometimes you can think of the Akashic records is out there somewhere, right? Somewhere out there, but there's really within us and it's within the physical dimension of consciousness. And typically we're living on the third dimension of consciousness, we can think of it that way. And the third dimension is very physical, you know, we have a lot to do this is that state of kind of get things done, we are time limited. And as we move up into, you know, fourth dimension is more of the astral plane, which helps us to launch into the fifth dimension of love, which is where the Akashic records exist. From here, we're able to actually understand more of our life purpose, understand why we went through what we went through from a place of love, which is why it's such an amazing, you know, opportunity to heal. But some people, you know, they see their Akashic records. It's like a giant library of information, because it holds all of your souls records from all time. So for those who believe in past lives, it's holds your past lives, future possibilities of what could happen in the future, your life purpose, your soul contract as to why we came here, and why we're doing what we're doing, and the kind of karma that we might need to work through. So it has an immense amount of information here. It's like the internet, but you know it within you have information, so to speak. And it's powerful, really powerful. Brandon Handley 41:07 So, do you access my Akashic records? Or do you help me to access them? And then then what were we out there? Amie Dean 41:20 Yes. Oh, I like this question. So for while I was doing one to one readings for people and doing community readings for people and recognize that it wasn't really helping to, you know, provide the tools that were necessary. So I now what I do is I help people directly. So I would guide you, you know, and help you access your Akashic records, but I'd be in there with you. Hopefully, that makes sense. So it almost you know, we so the way that this works is there's a prayer process. And this prayer process helps you to get in touch with the truth of your essence, right? The love that you are. And because of that you're able to, you know, dive deeper into this love, right, the dimension of love in this way. And so the prayer is kind of like a vibrational frequency, almost, you know, that we go into together. So you would say that prayer, for example, right out loud. And I would, you know, stand you know, kind of sit with you hold the space with you. And then you would access your Akashic records at that same time. Usually, for some people, they see light, right open up after the prayer, for example, some people see the library of books show up around them. But there's a lot of different things that can happen in this way. So with that being said, I'm there as a support in the background trying to help in any way I can. And sometimes I will get information, you know, and I'll pull it in, and I'll say, what about this? What do you think about that? And then, you know, people can let me know if they're on the same page, if they feel that too, right, if they're also sensing those changes within them. So yeah, Brandon Handley 42:49 would you say it's a little bit like, yeah, would you say it's a little bit like when Morpheus is in there with Neo, and he's like, you know, stop trying to hit me and just hit me. Right? That type of thing. And then like, he just kind of back away, and he does his own thing? Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. That's it all Amie Dean 43:04 the way. Exactly. Yeah. I love that analogy. Yeah, it's perfect. That's perfect. Yeah, it's, it's a joint, it's kind of like teamwork, you know, in some way in this in this process, because they don't want to just go into your records. I was doing this for a while. And then then everyone has to keep coming to me for mention their records. And I just didn't feel like that was empowering, really. And I realized everybody can access their records. I don't need to do that for them. But I want to empower them to know how to do that. So I'm more of a teacher, I think in this way than a reader like I was in the past. Brandon Handley 43:35 Yeah, that's great. I'm gonna even spin all the way back kind of to the beginning of the conversation, where you talk a little bit about recognizing kind of how you had these psychic abilities, and that made you different. Yeah. And I would, I would almost hesitate to say you, yeah, you were aware of your psychic abilities that I think are innate in everybody. Yeah. Right. It's just, it's just you, you know, you chose to kind of chase the path and give, give yourself to that. And through things like what you're doing with teaching them how to access the Akashic records, you're like, Hey, listen, it's not just me. Right? I'm capable. You're capable. And here's how and here's what this looks like. And just kind of give yourself open openness to that. Amie Dean 44:26 Exactly. So Brandon Handley 44:28 yeah, I love what you're doing. I think I think it's a definitely think it's very cool. What um, you know, who would you say is kind of like your ideal client? Amie Dean 44:39 Yeah. So I would say that so there's a couple different clients that might be you know, interested in this work and interested in this healing. Usually, it's a person number one, they're highly spiritual, dedicated, you know, usually work with a lot of spiritually dedicated women who not to say that they feel like their spiritual life is on track, but they want their spiritual life to be on track, right? Maybe they want You know, more meditation and yoga and more of an understanding of how to deepen, right, their understanding of who they are, but they're not quite there, right. So they, the, you know, there are those people who are ready, but they don't know the path or like, help me figure it out, I'm confused about how to make this happen. So there's that. And then typically, these women tend to be highly self critical, they tend to, you know, be really hard on themselves, sometimes perfectionistic in certain ways, and tend to experience you know, anxiety quite a bit as well, they might also be empaths, you know, and really, you know, tapping into other people's emotions on a regular basis. So these women, usually to, you know, they are busy, busy, busy people, right, they're spending a lot of time, you know, just trying to make things happen. And maybe they have families that they're trying to, you know, balance out with work and their spiritual life. And, you know, coming back to our conversation around integration, they're thinking, how on earth do I integrate my spiritual life, into my everyday life of being a parent of being a friend of being a entrepreneur, maybe of being a business owner? Or, you know, being even being an employee? How do I figure this out? Right? How do I really understand my path? And my purpose in this? So it's usually people who are, they're just ready, really, they're just ready to step into their life. And they're ready, you know, they're, they're tired of living in that third dimension, you know, is one way of thinking of it, living so heavily in that third dimension of consciousness, that the dimension of love within them, that fifth dimension is not present in the way that they would hope? So that would be Yeah, that would be the right person. Brandon Handley 46:36 Thanks for Thanks for sharing that, right. So just so that people who are listening tuned in today, they have an idea of whether or not you know, that's a great fit. One of the things I like to do here is just kind of look at, I look at this podcast is kind of like a spiritual speed dating show, right? Because they're gonna tune in to looking for their next spiritual, you know, date as it were, they're looking for. And I think another thing is, too, is, is, even in the idea of, I'll go back to Hinduism, you know, you can have more than one guru, right? It's like, you know, you go to like one, and you hang out with him for a while. And you awaken certain aspects of yourself. And that's, that's what that Guru does. That's what that teacher does. And so yeah, it's okay to move on. And, and so my guess is like, you're not trying to hold these clients for life. It's like, Alright, come get what you need and move on. Right? Like, you've got what you need for me, I've given you all I can give now. Scoop, right? So says, people are kind of calling on their on their paths. This would be, I think, one or one or two of the questions that I would ask, let's see, what do we had to ask for spiritual Bachelorette number one today? Ooh, to do, let's say, how does one obtain true peace? Oh, I Amie Dean 47:59 love it. How does one obtain true peace? You know, I would say the best way to obtain true peace is to acknowledge the human condition, first and foremost, which is this negativity bias to not have true peace, right? Coming back to that shadow work, right, that we all need to do, I think on a very deep level, that, you know, we're one part of us, for example, once piece, one part of us or several parts of us do not want peace, right? For example, some parts of us want to be angry, some parts of us want to be, you know, in a state of fear, right, and some parts of us really want peace. So first maybe is to acknowledge this kind of multiplicity of our personality, right, where we're not just one person. And, you know, the, the way to obtain that is to make peace, you know, for lack of a better word, make peace with the parts of us that do not want peace, if that makes sense, right? Make peace with the parts of us that need some time to be in anger, to stew in things sometimes to to really allow that sense of mindfulness, right to bring that to our experience, instead of forcing ourselves right to move past it, which is spiritual bypass. Right? Just to get to that true peace state. So hopefully, that makes sense. Yeah, it's a journey for sure. Brandon Handley 49:11 It makes a lot of sense a in the idea of the you said two things there. I'm not super deep on spiritual bypassing, but, you know, that would be the idea of saying, you know, exactly, exactly what said, Well, there's anger there and I shouldn't have that in my life. There's this over there. And that shouldn't be my life. Like, there's like a spiritual bypassing is like, you know, when you're at the buffet, and there's like, all the things there, which makes the full buffet what it is, and then you're like, well, that shouldn't be on there. I'm not having any of that that shouldn't be on there. I'm gonna fill my plate with all the spiritual things that I think I was supposed to have. Yeah, but no pudding. Right? I can't have pudding. I love pudding, but I can't have pudding. And what I found through the Shadow Work is is understanding the There's just like you said, anger may sound like a may sound like an oxymoron, right? It's kind of part of peace. Right? You gotta you gotta you've got you can't ignore that you're feeling angry. If you ignore that you're feeling angry then there's always going to be a disturbance are never going to be peaceful sake if I'm angry. Why am I angry? What's up there? Should I keep feeling it? Okay, I'm feeling it. I'm feeling it. I'm feeling it. Yeah, I'm over it, right. Yeah, I was pretty angry. But I'm over it right like but but it to try and reject it and suppress it is gonna make it a lot like a geyser. In the end? Absolutely. Oh, yeah. Never thrown putting into a spiritual conversation before. But there it is. Amie Dean 50:50 It just comes up on its own. Right? That's right. Brandon Handley 50:54 Let's see to do trying to find one that I don't always ask. Yeah. Let's see, no longer longer to do to do. What does it mean to live in the present moment? Amie Dean 51:10 What does it mean to live in the present moment, I would say to live in the present moment means to be 100%. So this is kind of a number one, of course, coming back to living moment by moment. Right. So reminding yourself that it's not about it's not necessarily that you're not thinking about the future. And it's not necessarily that you, you know, you're not thinking about the past? Because these are thoughts that are happening, right. Thoughts happen on their own? They don't we're not thinking thoughts necessarily. They're just coming in. Right. So it's more about, can I be aware? Can I be open? Can I be just yet self aware in the moment of what's coming up for me, for example, that my thoughts are going to the future that my thoughts are going to the past, right? It's, it's this recognition that as we're present with our body, for example, right, noticing sensation, noticing emotion, can I allow that to be right, it's really the aspect of surrender, I would say, because you have to surrender in order to be present. Because you know, the idea of not being present is the opposite of surrender, right? It's about control. It's about trying to fix it's about trying to jump into the future in some way. And in this instance, so when we're trying to be present, we are understanding that surrender is the way therefore we have to surrender to this doesn't feel good to be present right now. Oh, for example, that anger is showing up, and I really don't want to be present with it. But it's here. And therefore, I'm going to invite it into my experience the best way I know how, right, which is just to maybe be gentle with myself in this moment. So there's that Yeah. To be present. Brandon Handley 52:40 Could you clarify, would you clarify, you know, the word surrender, because I think a lot of people look at surrender, as in giving, as in not standing up for myself, as you know. So when you're saying surrender, what are you saying? Amie Dean 52:56 Yes. So surrender is no, this is actually really important conversation. Because often we can think well, so we're just surrendering, we're just letting it go. And it's no big deal. And as we're doing that, we're just letting go of everything, right, which means our ability to assert any kind of, you know, maybe not necessarily control, but to assert any kind of influence over our lives in some sort of way. But it's not like that surrender is just simply noticing our experience, noticing what's arising, choosing not to fight with it, choosing not to resist it, just allowing it to be and I know that, you know, that is a process. And for many, you know, they might ask well, how do I know if I'm resisting it? How do I know if I'm surrendering? Right? And I would say that, you know, you're surrendering, when there's a sense of openness around your experience, right? There's a sense of just knowing that you're okay, as you are in that moment. And there isn't the sense of tension or tightness around a situation, right? For example, you know, if you have to make a big decision, let's say, right, and you're just going back and forth, you know, Option A or Option B, Option A or Option B, and you realize, you know, I'm not really surrendering right now, because I'm feeling stressed about this, I'm feeling tension about this, I'm feeling like I have to figure it out in some way. That would be the opposite of surrender, right? And then surrendering would be okay, this is how I feel. Right now. I'm feeling torn. There's a part of me that feels this way. There's a part of me that feels that way. And I can't make a decision. In this moment. I'm going to surrender to the knowing that this is the current snapshot of my life right now. And I'm going to be okay with that in this moment. Or at least be okay. Right, with the knowing that this is going to change because all experiences are temporary in this moment. And so there's that right, and that can help you see right that you are surrendering or not surrendering. But the big key here is that you can't just say I'm going to surrender and then okay, fine. I'm not going to make the decision. Greg's gonna make a decision either way. But the point is that as you create some space around it, a decision is made naturally. It comes intuitively through you in that moment, and it's not based on Control Data comes through your higher wisdom is one way of looking at it. Brandon Handley 55:05 Yeah, thanks for Thanks for clearing that up. Right. I think that, again, a lot of people are going to look at surrenders, just kind of rolling over and letting letting things just kind of take over, or they don't have anything that they can do about it. In that regard, you'd mentioned that you had something you'd like to share with the audience. And what was that? Amy? Amie Dean 55:25 Yes. So there is a spiritual awakening guidebook that I offer, just as a complimentary download on my website. And this is this guide book walks you through the six phases of spiritual awakening. I know we didn't get to that today. But I have the six phases that we go through on our spiritual journey. And it's 100% connected to healing our inner child. And this tells you how to go about healing that how to work through these challenges that are coming up and to determine which phase of awakening you're in. Right now. And and of course, there's an option to book a call with me that constant we talked about earlier, if that feels right. And they can download this. So would it be helpful to give the website information now? Absolutely, absolutely. Perfect. So the website is one awakening. So that's o n e awakening.us/awaken. And right there, you can just download it at that page. And yeah, then it's yours. Oh, and there's a journal with it, too. I think that's another important piece as spiritual awakening journal to integrate your daily habit. Brandon Handley 56:31 Yeah, awesome. Yeah. I think that I think that's a good point to make. I recall, when I was going through what I would call my awakening process, and reaching out to people, right. I was like, Jesus, like, Who can I talk to about this? And a couple of people that I chatted with, it was like, just, you know, also, while you're going through this, sure, there's plenty of materials you can read, and lots of things you can do. But one of the one of the things you can do that's very beneficial is to write it out, capture that kind of in the journal right? And just make sure that you're creating space and time to do that. Amy, thanks for so much for being on today. Making the time where can I send other people to connect with you today? Amie Dean 57:12 Yes, wonderful. So I would say that so I do have a Facebook community as well. And this is, so you can go to facebook.com/awakening spiritually together, you can always look that up on Facebook. And I go live every week, every other week, sometimes in the group and their spiritual awakening resources in that Facebook group. And I'm also on YouTube as well, which you can find all those links on my website, which you can find once you download that workbook. I want awakening.us/awakened Yeah. Brandon Handley 57:46 Fantastic. Thanks for being on today with us. Amy. Amie Dean 57:48 Thank you so much. It's a pleasure. And thank you to all who are listening and hopefully, this helped with your spiritual awakening journey. Thank you for having me. I mean journey. Thank you for having me. I Unknown Speaker 58:03 really hope you enjoyed this episode of the spiritual dove podcast. Stay connected with us directly through spiritual dove.co. You can also join the discussion on Facebook, spiritual dough, and Instagram at spiritual underscore Joe. If you would like to speak with us, send us an email to Brandon at spiritual dough Co. And as always, thank you for cultivating your mindset and creating a better reality. This includes the most thought provoking part of your day. Don't forget to like and subscribe to stay fully up to date. Until next time, be kind to yourself and trust your intuition.

Lessons of a Lashpreneur
Problem Clients and Policies

Lessons of a Lashpreneur

Play Episode Listen Later Dec 10, 2021 33:55


On today's episode, I'm sharing with you just how to handle the 3 most common client issues that happen in your business and how you can enforce policies effectively with less worry about being the “bad guy”. Those 3 issues are  Last Minute Cancellations due to emergency or unforeseen circumstances Fill when it really should be a full set “just do what you can” situation Refund requests And I'll share with you the policy you should have in place that addresses each issue, how to implement this policy and what the perk is to having a policy that addresses each issue. If you're interested in seeing an example of the policies I had in my lash business - you can download them at www.thelashpreneur.com/policies  And a quickie disclaimer - policies, client waivers, release of liability are all legal contracts and I advise you have any of those documents reviewed by a locally licensed attorney for enforceability and legality in your state/province. Nothing in this episode is to be construed as legal advice and is for education and entertainment purposes only.   TEACHING POINTS:  Last Minute Cancellations due to emergency or unforeseen circumstances Policy Solution - Sickness and Family Emergency cancellation policy This policy states: If you or another person in your household has an infectious or contagious illness, please contact us as soon as possible to reschedule your appointment for a later date. For your safety and that of the staff and other clients, please do not come to your appointment sick. If it is assumed you are currently sick, your appointment may be cut short or cancelled and rescheduled for when you are healthy again. A one time allowance of last minute cancellation or reschedule will be permitted for sickness or family emergency. After that, the cancellation and no show policy will be in effect. Implementation of this policy: The key to this being a long term solution to any last minute client cancellations is to have the conversation of: I totally understand XYZ came up - I want you to go take care of yourself and not worry about your appointment. This is exactly why I have the Sickness and Family Emergency policy where we offer a one time exception to our cancellation policy. Please be aware that this is the one and only allowance to our cancellation policy we can offer you and any future last minute cancellations will be charged NO MATTER WHAT. That “no matter what” is KEY in YOU communicating to the client that no matter the situation moving forward - whether they were hospitalized, severely ill, or forgot to cancel cause they were hungover - your cancellation policy WILL apply. You have proof in your text or email exchange with this client now that you made it clear in no uncertain terms that they would be charged for any future last minute cancellations NO MATTER WHAT.  Perks of this policy:  You don't have to be the bad guy when someone doesn't show up to their appt because of a legitimate cause cause you've already set the expectation that you've extended the olive branch of human decency and understanding that ish comes up AND you also have a business to run where cancellations are detrimental to the stability of the business. This eliminates the need for you extra controlling and vindictive lashpreneurs out there who go stalking clients social media pages and find out the real reason they didn't show up to their appointment. It doesn't matter if a client chooses to lie about their “emergency” or not - your business has a plan in place regardless of a legitimate excuse or not. You have written proof of a signed copy of your policies agreeing to this policy and a screenshot of the exchange with a client about the use of this policy to share with any sort of banking disputes that the client was made aware and agreed to your policies and the charge for the no show. Doesn't always guarantee a bank will side with you - but you've done your part. COVID EXCEPTION - during covid and shutdowns and strick regulations and contact tracing - we all need to be flexible and use our best judgement even if, at times, doing so goes directly against our policies. Unique situations call for unique solutions - so use your judgement and make a call that is most aligned with what feels right to you with any covid-related cancellations. Fill when it really should be a full set “just do what you can” situation Policy Solution: Fill Policy - Minimum # of extensions remaining per eye to be considered a fill This policy states: We recommend our clients to come back every 2-3 weeks for their fill appointments to ensure your natural lashes remain healthy and your extensions stay looking full. We also educate our clients on proper aftercare of extensions to ensure each client gets the maximum retention out of their lash extensions. We do require 30 extensions remaining per eye to be eligible for our fill appointments. If a client has less than 30 extensions per eye, the fill appointment will be adjusted to a full set service at the current full set price if time allows or the appointment will be rescheduled to a future agreed upon time for when a full set appointment is available. Implementation of this policy: First is the education of this policy before a client ever receives the service. You could include in your policy that you recommend following the aftercare steps provided to you at the end of your service as well as prebooking out your future appointments as a best practice to minimize the possibility of this scenario occurring. Next - educate on the importance of following aftercare and how the aftercare you recommend helps them to maximize their retention and minimize needing a new full set in the future. Lastly - when in doubt - count it out sis. If you're not sure if a client has enough extensions left  you can say “Ooo Susan - what happened? Your retention seems to have gone down a lot since your previous appointments.” and then let the client try to explain what happened. One of two things usually happens - either the lashes started falling out soon after her last appointment which is usually an issue you can troubleshoot based on your application and reviewing your notes from her last appointment that my have contributed to poor retention OR she noticed after a week or so that her lashes started falling out more which would usually be due to a seasonal shed or improper aftercare. Either way - that's a whole other episode on retention that I'll save for another day - your handling of this event is what we're focusing on today. You would then count the extensions. If she meets or exceeds the minimum # of extensions - then let her know and educate her on aftercare again so she doesn't risk being this close to needing a full set again and possibly recommending your retail items that help with retention like a cleanser. Possibly advise her on coming back in sooner than usual to her next appointment as well so she doesn't risk needing a full set and/or reminding her of your client satisfaction policy which I'll share about in a minute if she notices her lashes aren't lasting very well within the 72 hours of her last appointment so you can fix it before she needs to get a full set.  If she doesn't meet the minimum # of extensions - you could do one of two things. Give her a warning that you'll make a one time exception for today and just “do what you can” but next time it will be a full set OR say “unfortunately you don't have enough extensions remaining to be considered a fill and you need a full set. I'm going to change your appointment to a full set today OR I need to cancel today and reschedule your full set when I have an appropriate amount of time to complete the set. I recommend giving them a one time warning cause most clients aren't going to be all too excited about unexpectedly paying for a full set and staying for a longer appointment without a fair warning. But I leave it up to you if you want to offer a warning first before enforcing this policy or not. Perks of this policy: You stop feeling like you have to give away your time for free or provide less than stellar results for a client because you're rushing to get as many extensions on cause she was basically bald coming in.  This also creates the opportunity for you to educate a client on proper aftercare and often times leads to them purchasing a lash cleanser because the alternative of not purchasing your $20 cleanser is risking paying for another $150-$200 full set.  You eliminate the confrontation and confusion of having a percentage of extensions remaining which is typically where this policy goes way wrong. You can't honestly tell me you know the difference between 48% extensions remaining and 53% extensions remaining - yet you are charging a client very different prices based on your made up assumption of a clients retention. This is highly unfair to a client which is why they challenge your assessment of their lashes and most of you cave to “just doing what you can” with the time they booked or extending their service time to get them back to full but without charging for that extra time. A client can justifiably argue with you about percentage remaining all day long. A client cannot argue with a finite number when you physically count each extension remaining. So you eliminate the debate on fill or full set. Refund requests Policy Solution: Refund + Client Satisfaction policy The no refund policy would state something like: You are paying for artist time, product and other expenses used to provide you with a service. No refunds will be given for any reasons on services or product. If you are unhappy with a service or result, you may contact us within 72 hours of your appointment to discuss your concerns and if a fix can be done to address your concerns, it will be done so with a complimentary 30 minutes express fill. Any concerns brought up after 72 hours of your last appointment or if you failed to follow the proper aftercare instructions a recommended fix will be offered but at full price of the service recommended. Implementation of this policy:  This policy is great to remind every client of at the end of every appointment so you are WELCOMING them to communicate openly with you. You could say something like “My goal is to ensure you are over the moon with your results/lashes. If you get home and for any reason you're not in love with the results - please let me know within 72 hours of today and give me the opportunity to see what I can do to address your concerns.”  The key to success with this policy is to be VERY clear about this prior to any service being delivered. If you are not going over every policy in person during your consultation with a new client - then you risk a client asking for a refund AND being super pissed about it if you don't give her a refund. Knowledge of there being no refunds is how you avoid refund requests. Perks of this policy Most refund requests are due to a client being unhappy with the result and not feeling as if the experience or result was worth the money invested. There are times when this 100% warranted on behalf of the client especially if you struggle with retention. If a client's lashes don't last more than a few days - then I think all of us would want our money back for a service that didn't deliver the desired results. And I encourage my society members to take ownership and responsibility for the results they get in their businesses - which means that if you struggle with application or your application method or adhesive doesn't last more than a few days - then own it that the client's undesired results were due to your application. Most issues with an unhappy lash client within 2-3 days of their appointment is due to improper application no matter how bomb you think you are. Most of the time - it's lashes falling out way too soon because the lash artist can't get the adhesive to last. Your client shouldn't have to suffer through your learning curve unnecessarily. HOWEVER - does that mean that you give back hard earned  money? Not necessarily - hence why I like the client satisfaction part of this policy. We've already made it clear that no refunds are available ever - BUT we want to ensure happy clients. And what we can offer a client when there's an issue that is likely caused by adhesive struggles, retention issues, maybe the client didn't like the styling or the length or how sparse the lashes are - is a 30 minute free fix appointment where you spend 30 minutes just working on fixing the issues - whether it's applying more lashes where the previous ones didn't last, going longer or shorter as much as you can in the time provided, adding in more extensions if they were too sparse, etc. This 30  minute fix will make a good bit of difference to a client's unhappy results/experience. If they choose not to take you up on this - then that's on them and no refunds, so no solution.   Episode Highlights: [3:39] - The policy solution for last minute cancellations [12:50] - Recommended content of an effective Fill Policy and how to implement it [26:51] - How to implement a No Refund Policy [28:49] - How a Client Satisfaction Policy will help your business and keep your clients happy   If you're interested in seeing an example of the policies I had in my lash business - you can download them at www.thelashpreneur.com/policies Happy business building! Have a good one!  

Ten Cent Takes
Issue 21: The Sandman Book Club (Part 4)

Ten Cent Takes

Play Episode Listen Later Dec 9, 2021 79:46


Things are starting to come to a head in our penultimate episode for The Sandman Book Club! Brief Lives follows the story of Dream and Delirium as they search the world for Destruction, their missing brother. Meanwhile, the next volume (The World's End) brings us another anthology with hints at what to expect in the final two volumes of the series.  ----more---- Jessika: I feel like I'm very straight passing recently. So I went out and ordered by self some doc Martins, just work there. These are my doc Martins. I am bisexual. *laughs*  Hello! Welcome to Ten Cent Takes, the podcast where we seek to find Destruction one issue at a time. My name is Jessika Frasier, and I'm joined by my cohost, the fountain of facts, Mike Thompson.  Mike: Hello. Hello. Hello. Jessika: Hello, Mike. And if you, listener, are new around here, the purpose of this podcast is to study comic books in ways that are both fun and informative. We want to look at their coolest, weirdest and silliest moments, as well as examine how they're woven into the larger fabric of pop culture and history.  This episode, we're continuing on with the fourth episode of our book club as we discuss volume seven and eight of the Sandman series, if you haven't already listened to our previous episodes on the Sandman and want to catch up, which by the way, we highly recommend we're discussing two volumes at a time. So go check out episode 15 for volumes one and two episode 17 for volumes three and four, and episode 19 for volumes five and a six,  And if you're thinking "These guys are great. I would love to show my support for this amazing podcast, but how?" Well friends I'll tell you. It really helps us. If you rate and review us on the platform you're listening through, especially apple pod pass and pod chaser, it really helps with discoverability and in helping us reach other nerdlings that just might enjoy the show. Plus it gives us that validation boost that Mike and I both being generally anxious, so need. So show us some love wherever you listen, please. And thank you. You can also tell your friends how awesome we are so they can join in on this fun.  Mike: Yeah. Uh, I definitely thrive on words of affirmation as pointed out by Comic Book Couples Counseling in our last episode. Jessika: Yes, please give us all the affirmation. But before we jump into our main conversation about volume seven and eight of the same. what is one cool thing you've read or watched lately?  Mike: I recently learned that the Books of Magic, which is a bit of a spin-off to the Sandman and a bit of sequel and a bit of something totally original, is getting the omnibus treatment. So this was actually really exciting for me because I read all the trades when I was in high school and college. And I was disappointed at how it felt like the series ended halfway through the story. And then I learned way later that DC only collected the first 50 of like 75 total issues into trades, which is why the series felt like it ended the way it did, I guess. Didn't sell that well. And so DC stopped putting them out, but DC put out an omnibus late last year, and then they're going to release another one in a couple of months. And it's going to contain the rest of the series as well as all of the different tie in books. And I wound up getting it for over half off from Target during this big deal they had on books where it was like, buy two, get one free. And they also weirdly had it for over half off. So yeah, I snapped that fucker up. Jessika: Hey hey tar-get.  Mike: I know. Right. It was great. but yeah, we've been having a lot of rainstorms here in the bay area lately, and it's kind of the perfect weather to read an oversized book, featuring the adventures of Tim hunter, who is this British teenager who's due to become the most powerful magician in the current age of man and...It's a really good read still. It's one of those books from the nineties that was originally a mini series by Neil Gaiman, and then other authors picked it up and put their own spin on it, you know? And we saw that with Lucifer as well. the books of magic had a couple of different authors, but they had prolonged runs and then they had a rotating cast of artists meanwhile Lucifer had Mike Carey at the helm guiding everything for all 75 issues. And then Neil Gaiman wrote the original miniseries for the books of magic, but then, you can still feel his fingerprints all over it, which is really cool. Jessika: Yeah, that's neat.  Mike: Yeah. There's some cool little Easter eggs in it. Like I think I mentioned in last episode during the brain wrinkles about how we actually see Hamnet, who was in the Midsummer Night's Dream issue of Sandman show up in the Books of Magic as the page of Titania, the queen of fairies. Jessika: Yeah, totally validated me.  Mike: I remember, you and I talking about that and you were like, I don't know. Did he go with Titania? And I was sitting there going, I don't know, maybe . , you know, he could have it's left open-ended no, he went with Titania, so... Jessika: yeah.  Mike: yeah. Jessika: that.  Mike: But yeah. What about you? What have you been scoping out? Jessika: Well, my good friend and a listener Noel -hey- gave me a reprint of a one-shot Image comic called Aria: The Heavenly Creatures, which was written by  Brian Holguin, illustrated by Jay Anacleto with Brian Haberlin, colored by Drew Passata Raymond Lee and Brian Haeberlin and letter by Francis Taka Naga. And I, I wanted to call them all out because the illustration, this comic is absolutely phenomenal. It's gorgeous. It's just, it's a veritable work Bart on every page and it's done in a really soft and hazy almost Dreamlike way.  Mike: Hm. Jessika: And there aren't any harsh outlines it's detailed and very lifelike and all of the fabric just looks so like rich and realistic. Noel was telling me that the character Lady Kildare was actually in another longstanding series, but this one had the rights removed to use the character. I believe, I'm not sure why. but it was set in the smokestack that was Victorian London. Hence some of the reasons for the haze, the story follows Kildare, who is from the fairy realm as she stumbles upon and subsequently sets to saving a fallen angel who was being held active by a man who runs a sideshow.  And it gives off extreme queer vibes and has an absolutely strong, and bad-ass leading lady, which, you know, I'm absolutely here for. Mike: What.  Jessika: yeah. what? Who's heard of this?  Mike: nobody told me this. Jessika: what she's a feminist who would have known.  Mike: I can't believe you're telling me this now. It's like 20 episodes. We're all alive. Jessika: This is 21. I got ya.  Mike: I'm quitting! I'm quitting right now! How dare you? Jessika: You know what, Mike? Let's move on to our next topic. Our main topic.  Mike: that series does sound rad though. I haven't heard of it before, so I'm gonna have to check it out. Jessika: Yeah, you should. It's definitely, it's very interest.  Mike: All right. Now we can move on. Jessika: Okay, let's go. Oh, right. So we are moving on to volume seven and eight of the Sandman series. So volume seven is titled Brief Lives and was published 1992 and 93 and comprises volumes 41, through 49 of the Sandman series written of course, by Neil Gaiman and illustrated by Jill Thompson and Vince Locke. Mike: Yeah. And we've seen both of these artists before in the series, like Vince Locke helps with, the short story about the Wolf people.  Jessika: That's right.  Mike: and then Jill Thompson, Jill Thompson did the, the Chibi story that we saw  Jessika: Oh, that's right.  Mike: in the parliament of Rooks issue. Her chili style drawings of Death and Dream wound up becoming their own thing. It's called the Little Endless  Jessika: Aw.  Mike: and they did them as kind of like storybooks. Jessika: That's so cute.  Mike: Yeah.  Jessika: Oh, obviously I'm going to have to go down a Jill Thompson rabbit hole.  This volume in particular is chunked into chapters. So I'm going to break down the story in that way.  so we begin chapter one with an older man making a long arduous Trek to put flowers on a Memorial for Johannah Constantine. We find Orpheus living his endless life of being just a head, not ahead of the game, Just, a literal head. He's been there. for so long that he uses his current helper for the helper's grandfather, as the task of Orpheus's care has been passed down the familial line. We cut to Delirium who is lost on and living on the streets because she cannot find her realm and is obsessively talking about her quote unquote lost brother. She has what can probably be best described as an anxiety or panic attack after wandering into a club and mistaking a cute goth woman for being her sister, Death. Desire, swoops in and takes her to her realm, but refuses to help her in the search for their brother, but suggests that Delirium visit Despair in her realm And ask if she will help. Despair also refuses to assist, but we get a glance into the brother whose identity has been kept vague up to this point, which is Destruction. We get to see a brief interaction during the black plague where Despair and Destruction for both out admiring their work. Despair then ignores a mirror page, quote, unquote from her twin Desire who wanted to talk about her and their brother and the fact that Delirium is looking for him. Mike: Yeah. And I think this is the first time that we actually see Destruction as a person. Before that he showed up in the issue where we saw Orpheus his wedding, but he was like fully clad in armor and he had like a giant helm. So it was obscuring his face. Jessika: Yeah. And we didn't ever really get introduced necessarily. We just knew that he just was like, there. Mike: Yeah. I can't remember if they out and out named him, you know, it probably would help if I went back and re-read the issue right now, but I think they, identified him as part of the family  Jessika: Yeah. That's what I think it was vague.  Mike: because he has, he has a whole, he has a whole conversation with Orpheus, after, after Eurydice dies, where he kind of consoles him. I think, right, like I'm not misremembering. Jessika: I don't remember now that was too many issues ago,  Mike: Yeah. Jessika: But he's definitely there. He definitely was there and I, and I think it was just like vague as to his ties. Like he was family, but.  Mike: Yeah. And then when he's going through the town with Despair during the black plague, he's like very gregarious and like actually much more human seeming than honestly all of the other endless, he's one of those people where he's not going about his duty somberly but he's not like delighting in it either. He's just kind of like, you know, he's just a dude. Jessika: Yeah. Yeah. He like has a job and he's doing his job, but he's he still sees what effect that takes on others?  Mike: Yeah. He feels like a much more human member of the endless than most of his siblings. Jessika: Yeah, yeah. Say so. So chapter two brings us to Dream and his realm. Where he is once again, moping over a woman who has left him instead of dealing with the grief of his lost love interest, whom he'd only known for a scant couple months. He instead orders Lucien to have her quarters in the castle be dismantled and he's causing constant rain in the Dream realm, as well as in the Dreams of mortals and Delirium shows up and is at first identified as an intruder by the gargoyles outside of Dream's castle.  Mike: I mean, does it really surprise us? That Dream is just the mopiest moper whoever moped? I know that Neil Gaiman wanted the characters designed to be like a mix of him when he was in his late twenties, cause he was this tall kind of gangly guy, crossed with Robert Smith from The Cure. Which, I mean, like, it feels like something from a cure Song where it's like, my woman left me and so I'm, causing it to rain all over my realm  Jessika: Oh my gosh, causing it to flood.  Mike: It's very much that that kind of like new wave emo vibe that I keep getting from Dream. So, you know, spot on. Jessika: Oh, it totally is though. So Delirium shows up and is again, is at first identified as an intruder by the gargoyles outside of Dream's castle. And Dream invites Delirium inside and offers her a meal and then asks her what he can help with. And it took Delirium some time to get her request out and Dream being the super patient guy he is -just kidding, he's not- was starting to get frustrated, but Delirium finally got out her request or Dream to help her find their lost brother admitting that she had already asked Desire and Despair. Dream become suspicious that Desire had something to do with Delirium, getting that idea, but Desire swears that she had nothing to do with it and urges Dream to just kick her out and refuse to help. We get a flashback from when Delirium was still Delight and her own relationship with Destruction. When Dream returns, he ends up offering to help Delirium try to locate Destruction through some of Destruction's friends. When told of this, Lucien tries to coax him out of going, but Dream admits that he just needs something to take his mind off his current malady and could use the distraction. Dramatics. He also leaves on a literal, "this is straight forward, What could possibly go wrong?" note. Which why, why set yourself up in that way?  Anyway.  Mike: I thought that was great. Jessika: We begin chapter three with a man named Ernie CapEx, who has had a Dream where he is remembering the smell of wooly mammoths, recalling that he had lived for innumerable years, yet passing a construction zone. He is hit with an entire brick wall slash building itself that accidentally fell from overhead from an active, construction zone he was passing. As CapEx emerges from the rubble. He believed himself to have gotten out of the situation unscathed yet Death, comes, and collect him, pointing to his body, buried beneath the rebel and state that he got, what everybody gets a lifetime back. The waking world Dream has brought the leery into a travel agency in Dublin, looking for an acquaintance of Dreams after much back and forth with the woman working at the front desk. Dream finally sent the message about drinking wine in Babylon before Pharamond -now called Mr. Farrell- finally came to meet them. I love that while they were waiting in the lobby, Delirium was like making frogs, like actual animate frogs.  Mike: Yeah. And I think that was called out where Ferrell is sitting there and he's like, what are they doing? And the receptionist is like, they're making frogs. like she's making them appear out of thin air. It was. Jessika: So chaotic. During their meeting, Fairmont agrees to assist Dream after recalling our Dream and help them in the past, by suggesting a different profession, they asked Delirium about the list she had mentioned of their brother's friends, and she went and bought it and included the Lawyer, the Alderman, Etain of the Second Look and the Dancing Woman. we get a glimpse of a Etain who has had a Dream about a poem. She goes to write, but it escapes her. She also narrowly escaped from her apartment as it explodes from ignited gasoline.  Mike: Yeah. She, has like a moment where she figures out that something is wrong and just needs to get out like as soon as possible. Jessika: yeah, she had the forethought to grab her purse and then held it in front of her as she broke through the window with the force of her running body, shielding herself with purse. So bad-ass. And she was just in her underwear and a tank top at the time. So lucky for her She had her purse with her and he'd go off into Kmart, some clothes and shoes. We then pan to a man who looked suspiciously like Destruction with no facial hair. And he is trying to paint. His dog, Barnabas, comes to advise him that he is hearing an odd noise from inside a room where they find a round churning pool surrounded by framed portraits. He falls at the family room and states it is an early warning system.  Dream and Delirium fly on a plane in first-class and then are picked up by a chauffeur in a classic convertible on their way to see apex chapter four begins with an alderman who was nervously perceiving an out of season Northern lights display, knowing that is an negative omen. He does a ritual and changes itself into a bear with a human shadow bites off the human shadow and the shadow takes the man's clothes and his name and identity, and goes back into the world. The bear remains a bear and forgets he was anything else prior. Meanwhile, back in the waking world, Dream and Delirium are being driven around What looks like a suburban neighborhood. And Dream is clearly looking for something or someone they roll up to Bernie Cape axes house, where they're informed by a son that his father is dead. Dream gets really pushy with the chauffeur who insists that she needs to stop to rest for the night before they start driving the 12 to 14 hours, you know, like mortals need sleep and all Mike: What was the chauffeur's name again? Ruby, right? Jessika: it was Ruby. Mike: Yeah.  Jessika: Yup. Mike: Yeah. She was rad. I actually really liked that. She was, she was a. Just a cool character, but then she also like actively pushed back on Dream and she's like, I don't give a fuck who you are. I don't care that my boss is calling in a favor. This is not how this works. Jessika: Exactly. Exactly. It's like, yeah, she definitely had solid boundaries. It was awesome. So it was going to take 12 to 14 hours to get to their next destination, which per Deliriums list is Etain of the Second Look in Ohio. Dream, finally concedes to stop and they go to a motel to Russ for the night. And in the motel, we get background on Ruby, the chauffer, who is a polyglot and all around badass. As we said, Delirium is letting herself go in order to find another one of the characters on their lists. The scene cuts to an exotic nightclub where one of the dancers is sick prior to going. While looking in the mirror. One of the other dancers who was assisting the sick dancer sees Delirium, who verifies that she is the Dancing Lady that is on the list and tells her that they will see her soon. So Dream goes back to his own realm and speaks with Lucien asking for assistance and finding some of the information they need to find their brother. Dream also recollects a situation and conversation with Destruction and the Corinthian in the 17 hundreds. But at the time Dream didn't realize that Destruction was telling him that he was going to be leaving.  Mike: Yeah. And the Corinthian, this is the same Corinthian who we saw basically as the celebrity at the serial killer convention back in the Doll's House, right?  Jessika: Yeah. it was the Doll's House. Mike: Yeah. But it was before he had really gone off the deep end, but I really dug the character design where he's kind of dressed as a French dandy and he's still rocking sunglasses, like, but he's got, he's got like the giant puffy wig and I thought that was great. Jessika: yeah, it was a nice little, a nice little.  Mike: Yeah. Jessika: Back in the motel Dream returns to his body, to firefighters, trying to get him out. Ruby fell asleep with a lit cigarette and the motel burned down, killing Ruby in the process, or so we're made to believe.  Mike: Yeah, but at the same time, it's implied that someone or something is taking out all of the leads on Destruction. And they're not sure if the Endless themselves were being targeted as well. Jessika: Yeah, exactly. Exactly.  Mike: So there's that, there's that ominous tease. Jessika: Chapter five brings us to the search for the Dancing Lady. As well as some driving lessons for Delirium. So irresponsible.  Mike: which we should note, they bring Matthew the Raven in to teach Delirium how to drive and Matthew is basically having a panic attack the entire time, trying to teach her the rules of the road because teaching Delirium, the rules of anything is not going to work. Jessika: Yeah. Well, because she tried like, initially Dream was just like, yeah, go for it. And she's like all over the road, she's like swerving in and out of stuff. She's not on the correct side. And it was just a whole thing.  Mike: no, it was, it was very good watching Matthew, just panic. And he's like sitting there squawking and flapping his wings, like crazy. It was good. I loved it. Jessika: Oh, well. And before that, I mean, they had a... the reason the Matthew out called in was because they had a run in with highway patrol and that ended with the man being plagued with feeling like bugs were crawling on him, like forever. Forever. He always was just going to feel like that.  Mike: Yeah. That was like, and that was basically Delirium. Just does it as a hand wave thing, which you know, I have that as something to talk about later on. But. Yeah. It's the first instance where we see Delirium being just as casually cruel as the rest of her siblings. Jessika: Yeah. Yup. Without really realizing it, you know, it's almost like it's not even a thought, which is even worse.  Mike: Yeah. Jessika: So they get to the exotic dance club and Tiffany -whom Delirium had been using as a conduit- and Ishtar, who we find out as a former goddess of love. So she, at one point tells Tiffany that nobody comes to really see her dance just for TNA, but after Dream and Delirium and Matthew pay a visit with Dream, extracting nothing from who we find out is Destruction's former lover, but also warning her that she might be in danger. Ishtar goes out to the stage to dance and literally goes atomic dancing her true dance. The whole club explodes with a naked, Tiffany barely making it out alive. Desire, shows up and gives Tiffany their coat and talks about how Ishtar was thinking about her desire for Destruction up until her final moment. Mike: Yeah. Well, something that was interesting about Tiffany is that Ishtar, we've gotten glimpses of her, where Ishtar is like taking care of her. And it's very clear that she has some mental issues going on as well as possibly a drug addiction. She had a drug addiction, right? Cause at one point she was trying to eat some eggs and stuff that Ishtar made for her and then she wound up puking it up. And then she winds up stumbling out of the club and surviving while Desire gives her the jacket. And then I think that kind of becomes sort of like one of those revelatory moments that we always hear about with born again, Christians, which, you know, we see later on at the very end. Anyway. Moving on. Jessika: Well, chapter six brings us back to Destruction who is trying his hand at yet another artistic endeavor. And once again, producing lackluster results, he mentions to Barnabas that now is not the time for him to Dream or else he might give up too much. Back with Dream and Delirium Dream has had enough of his sister's bullshit and basically tells her that he's fucking back off to his own realm and she needs to go back to hers. He refuses to help her any further. Mike: he's really a Dick about it too. There's a very cold delivery to it. And it's very, again, it's very cruel, where he really talks down to her and treats her like a lesser rather than an equal. Jessika: Yeah. It would be one thing to put up a boundary, which I would absolutely respect if you said, you know what I, for XYZ reason, I really can't help you at this point. Here's what I can do for you. Or I can support you in this way, but it's not even like that. He's just like middle fingers in the air. Like here I go back to my realm, like Mike: Basically just fire both middle fingers off and go deuces I'm out! Jessika: Exactly. So Delirium is very upset obviously by this treatment from her brother and his response and sulks off to her own realm. And Dream is very salty when he gets back and tells him while at a stopped dancing, which, sorry, you're no fun, but stop stomping on everybody else's rose garden. He lets Pharamond know about Ruby's demise and then Dream creates a realm for bast to come and talk. And even though he's told everyone that he is no longer looking for his brother, that is the exact question he is going to ask a very flirty Bast. Mike: right. And this is because back in Season of the Mists, when all the different gods were vying for Hell, the gods of Egypt didn't exactly have a lot to offer, but Bast said, I do know where your brother is. Jessika: Which I didn't really put two and two together, obviously. Mike: No, I mean, well, I mean, here's the thing is like back then, like, you know, and that one they hinted at at where I think they had a curtains drawn over Destruction's portrait. This was something that was a very tangentially hinted at if even that much. But it's kind of interesting to see how Neil Gaiman clearly had an idea of what he wanted to do. Like, even that far back, like we're talking at this point years back.  Jessika: Yeah. Yeah. It's definitely the long game for the plot line.  Mike: which, anything that you read by him, He always has these small seeds that he plants that wind up growing into something bigger. Like if you read American gods, which is, a dense tome of a book, and I guess there's the, the director's cut version that they released a couple of years ago, which is even longer, there's a number of small things that he has his like kind of tangental side stories, and then they wind up building into something much bigger towards the end. Jessika: Oh, it's always so cool. It's such a good story teller.  Mike: Yeah. It's just, sometimes you sit there and view people's talent and you're like, that's not fair. Jessika: No, right? So when Dream appears back in the main part of his castle, Lucien lets him know that there is some trouble in the portrait gallery and when they get there, he discovers that one of the portrait has gone black. Dun dun dun! Mike: Yeah, like solid black, like that's, that's all there is.  Jessika: Solid black. Incommunicado. Death comes to see Dream and asks him what he did to Delirium. explained there so far failed by. And Death basically told him he needed to go make up with the sister.  Mike: Yeah. I mean, like, it's basically like a smack on the back of the head. Like she is like, talking about people tired of other people's bullshit. Death is about done with dreams at this point. I think. Jessika: Yeah. She's like stopping douche and just make up with her. Good Lord. And so Dream falls into Delirium's chaotic world, which is filled with color and random pictures and words. And you find her crying, having cut off all of her already short multicolored hair. He apologizes to her admitting the he had had ulterior motives for wanting to travel in the waking world. As there was a woman, he knew that he wanted to try to look up while they were in that world.  Mike: And it's implied that it's the woman that left him at the beginning who were not actually ever told who that is, right?  Jessika: No, she gets no name. She just, she's just a plot point. You know? I love that. Yeah. No, we never, we never see her. We never interact with her. She doesn't get a name. So... too bad or not feminist on this show.  Mike: What, what was the quote that Lisa gave us in the last episode? It was like, uh...  Jessika: Oh, which one? God, we are, she was talking about nothing. There's nothing better than a woman who was empty.  That was one of them.  Mike: Yeah, that was exactly what I was thinking of. Like what better purpose for a woman than to be empty and waiting for a man to fill her hole or something? I was like, ah, god damn it Lisa. Jessika: Yeah, exactly. Oh, yup. That's just a welcome to the patriarchy. Front row seat: Every woman. Or female identifying person. So dream tells Delirium that he will help her find their brother, but in earnest. chapter seven begins with Destruction trying out yet another fine art. And this time it's the culinary arts. He is somewhere in proximity to an actual town, as he goes and picks up supplies from there and feeds the dog, Barnabas some chocolate, which don't do that, do not do that to your actual dog.  This is a special, magical dog.  Mike: I'm still not sure if that was done intentionally to show that Barnabas was like something else or if it was because Neil Gaiman didn't have a dog and didn't know what you are supposed to and supposed to not feed them. Jessika: I hope it's the former. If it's the former, it's pretty cheeky. Let's just say.  Mike: But yeah, like I legit tensed up when I read that again. I'm like...  Jessika: I did too.  My dog was sitting right next to me and I literally out loud was Like. no, no, no, no.  So. Barnabas, is it on some chocolate as he and Destruction discuss Destruction's other artistic endeavors, like sculpting, which by the way, all of these have been done with varying degrees of mediocrity so far.  Mike: And Barnabas calls it out. Like, he is blunt and it's kinda great. Jessika: Yup. He's a, no nonsense kind of guy for sure. back with dream of Delirium dream, besides that they must get their older brother involved and notified destiny. They have to find his realm using amaze or labyrinth. And he is of course expecting their arrival. The only advice a destiny can offer dream is something that he had already realized, but doesn't seem to want to be true: That he had to see a certain "oracle." Destiny also told him that the woman he loves has never and will never love him. And you will see her one more time, but that you will not like the outcome. Delirium sees Dream's distress and comes to his aid. Speaking very coherently. And with her eyes the same color when bustin, she said that she was able to do that if she wanted, but that it hurt to do it for very long and that she felt like she needed to step up for him when he was down.  Mike: I kind of love that. I thought it was great. I thought it also showed that she's actually a better quote unquote "person" than he is in a lot of ways because she did that kind of like naturally, without anyone telling her she had to. Jessika: Yeah, it was very, it was instantaneous and it was very selfless. We then get to jump into Destiny's recollection of a story in his book of destruction, calling a family meeting, where he says he's leaving and that he does not want to be found and is no longer going to be associated with the family. Each family member reacts a little bit differently to the news, but Delirium seems to be the most visually upset. So the Oracle in question turns out to be Orpheus. So Dream ends up going there, to Orpheus's island, and in exchange for destruction's location. Dream now owes Orpheus a boon. So they've very easily traversed to destruction's location by boat, where they meet Barnabas and the formal eternal being himself. Destruction meets them with literal open arms and invites them inside with beast that he has made himself, which by the way, they were just sticks about that. They didn't even want It that  Mike: It looked really good too. Like it looked like a really good meal.  Jessika: It looked like the one thing he was actually able to do well,  Mike: Yeah. Jessika: like he finally figured it out. Hey, I can cook.  Mike: Well, I mean, speaking of someone who, you know, bakes enthusiastically people generally don't care so much about how your food looks as much as they do about how it tastes. Jessika: Yeah, exactly. So chapter eight brings us to Destruction's decision. He speaks with Delirium and Dream about the reason he had left family and the fact that he was going to exit existence s Barnabas to stay with Delirium and watch over her.  Mike: Yeah. And then he reveals during this conversation that the reason that so many people that knew him have been dying was because of certain safeguards I think is how we phrased it. which, I mean, it's fine. I guess it also kind of, it drives home that the endless are not actually people and they don't feel things like guilt or shame, but I don't know. I was kind of hoping the first time that I read this, that we would get some third agent involved. Someone who is actively trying to hunt down destruction or something like that, but we didn't get it. Jessika: Nope.  Mike: It kind of got hand-waved away.  Jessika: Yeah. Yep. Just all right. Well that was because I didn't want anybody to find me, so I just gotta to make sure nobody finds me regardless of, you know, who gets in my way. And if  Mike: Yeah.  Jessika: trying, it's gonna  Mike: Cool. Cool bro. Cool. Jessika: Yeah. Pretty rough. Destruction torches the portraits and the gallery. He shrinks his sword and pool, which was rad by the way. And he puts them in, he puts them on a stick in a polka-dot handkerchief and walks literally into the stars.  Mike: Yeah. It's that like hobo stick from turn of the century artwork. Whereas the people who were just wandering the rails and stuff and they have a stick and then they have their belongings in, you know, in this little kind of sack tied to the end. Jessika: Yeah. You could tell, he was like, oh, this is what this is supposed to look like. You could tell it was like an affectation, which was kind of adorable. He's been trying this whole time to be someone else, You know, and, and even when he left, he was trying to be someone else. So it's like, man, I hope you find yourself out there.  Mike: Well, yeah, it... he's been trying to be human and this is another affectation that he's put on. To seem human. Jessika: Dream then tells Delirium that he has to go see his son. Oh. And also that dream needed to kill Orpheus.  Mike: That was such a great cliffhanger moment. Jessika: I know. I actually, I literally gasped. It's like, whoa. We begin chapter nine back to Orpheus's home island where after a bit of back and forth re dream allows Delirium to accompany him, to see his son. She says her chaotic hello, and then Death double-checks with Orpheus that this is what I wanted. They have a very meaningful conversation about their relationship and life and change. And then Dream kills  Orpheus. Dream meets up with Delirium outside where Despair has entered the scene. She shows regret and not going with delirium to find and ultimately see destruction for one final time. Delirium pieces out with Barnabas and Despair meets up with Desire who should be happy as it had accomplished what it wanted to have happen... to have Dream spill the blood of one of the family, but she is somehow still lacking proper fulfillment from the situation. Dream returns to his own realm and is unusually empathetic to everyone around them, wanting to know how people are and speaking with soft vendor, standing, leaving every person he interacts with in a state of poodle. He visits Adros who was one of the Island's caretakers and asks him to bury Orpheus in an unmarked grave. He also starts making plans to let people know that they are no longer in danger and generally thinking about the well-being of others. And that is that they're no longer in danger of being harmed by Destruction's safeguards. Dream washes his hands of the blood of his son, literally. And he remembers a flashback advice given after the Death of Eurydice. Throughout this volume, different characters have told dream in different ways that he is changing, evolving as a person, but he fought this notion up until the end of this chapter, where he seems to have made peace with his decision and accepting the fact that maybe has the capacity for change after all. So, Mike, what did you think about this volume? And do you have a favorite story or event? Mike: Yeah. I'm of two minds on this. Like the plot itself feels like this very necessary one. And it's one that moves the story of Dream and his siblings forward in a pretty meaningful way. But I also found myself continuing to realize that the Endless are these very alien beings who just happened to look human. And oftentimes they're not very kind to each other or to anyone else. And I don't really think I like most of them to be honest. I keep thinking about that moment in the club where Desire basically forces two women to fall in love and then reveals it's going to lead to obsession and stalking and I think maybe a murder. And there's just this casual cruelty that they generally seem to possess, like even Delirium. Like we talked about how she gets irritated with the highway patrolman. And then was like, you're going to think that you have bugs crawling onto your skin for the rest of your life. We see that at the end of this volume, like how it's played out. And it's really rough. He's like in a sanitarium. And, that said I will say, I think Delirium is the most human of the endless, except maybe Death, because she feels all the same things that we do. And it's somehow driven her to her current state. Like we never actually see, I don't think what caused her to go from Delight to Delirium.  Jessika: Oh, interesting. Okay.  Mike: I think it's one of those things that, that game and kind of teases out, but then just leaves us to, let us wonder about afterwards.  Jessika: Well, damn Mike: Yeah. And that said, I think my favorite thing about this volume was honestly, was Barnabas. Like I really enjoyed how he had that brutal honesty and was really funny. Whenever destruction would ask him to critique whatever piece of art he just attempted and then he agrees to go with delirium as I don't quite know how to describe this new role for him, I guess like a sanity check dog, as opposed to a seeing eye dog. Jessika: Yeah. Like maybe an emotional support dog.  Mike: Yeah. Like he, he's a cosmic emotional support dog, I guess.   Jessika: Yeah. You gotta ramp it up and you've got like cosmic powers. You have to, like, there has to be a safeguard for that kind of a, it takes a special service dog.  Mike: Yeah. But I felt like he was the best character throughout the whole story. He's funny. And he's weird. And he's also the companion that we all want our dogs to be. I'm not going to lie. Like I'm probably projecting onto him, but I've recently left a job that was incredibly stressful and was actually causing me to start having anxiety attacks. And my dog, Iggy, would clue into when I was freaking out and he would just hop into my lap and calm me down. don't think we deserve dogs and Barnabas is kind of the manifestation of why that's the case.  Jessika: Yeah.  Mike: And on that note, I know that Jill Thompson, who was the main artists for this volume based Barnabas on a real life dog who belonged to a neighbor who she said was quote, "unkind to the animal." And so she decided to like memorialize them in a comic, which kind of adds that extra emotional punch to it.  Jessika: yeah, which I'm sorry. Are we obsessed with Jill Thompson answer? Yes, we are.  Mike: A hundred percent. Jessika: Jill hit us up.  Mike: What about you? Was there anything that really stuck out to you? Jessika: I was really struck with the part where delirium is at dinner and asks. "Have you got any little milk chocolate people, about three inches, high men and women. I'd like some of them filled with raspberries and cream." She makes them kiss throughout the scene. And after a dream and delirium have left, there is one frame of the last two chocolate people, a man and a woman, which is described as such: "touched by her fingers, the two surviving chocolate people populate desperately losing themselves in a melting frenzy of lust spending. The last of their brief borrowed lives in a spasm of raspberry cream and fear." Something about the fact that delirium was both animating and then eating little candy people is just so intense and horrifying.  Mike: Yup. Jessika: And for how much of a throwaway frame it was, it really said a lot about Delirium in just that one situation, you know, even bringing it back to what you had mentioned, just that casual, like she's created a life and she doesn't even care what happens to it? She's just going to destroy it. She'll just leave it to just melt. It doesn't matter to her.  Mike: Yeah. And I mean, that's, I think part of the thing with the Endless is that they're older than gods and galaxies. At some point, when you were these beings that kind of surpass already cosmic things, I don't know, maybe. you just have that perspective where you're like, Hm, you're less than an ant and it's not because I don't like you... It's just, Hmm. Jessika: Yeah, totally. Well. We're bringing it back to the art. Do you have a favorite panel or illustration that caught your eye? Mike: Yeah. The scene where destruction is talking with dream and delirium under that starry sky, like right before he pieces out. It's one of those things where every panel feels like this legit work of art. And in the moment when he actually pieces out, it just feels simultaneously strange and surreal and totally ordinary. And I loved it. It's now one of the sequences that I think about when I think about Sandman, like I've got a couple of moments from, different stories that I've talked about in the past. Like in Men of Good Fortune and there's that three panel sequence with Hob Gadling and his face. And then, this is another one. it felt like there were a bunch of different emotions wrapped up in the entire scene. And I really liked how I just, it left me feeling satisfied at the end, which, you know, you want good art to do. And then it's not exactly a favorite art moment. But one detail that I really liked was how after Orpheus dies, which by the way, the moment that he dies is kind of cool because we don't actually see what dream did, but we see the symbol of death. And then, Orpheus is dead. But one detail that I've really liked was how after Orpheus dies and dream has blood dripping from his hands, there's a trail of red flowers, blooming where the blood hits the ground. Jessika: Yeah. That's really sweet. It was those same red flowers that he had that Orpheus had been sending up to Johanna, Constantine's memorial Mike: Yeah. Yeah. so I'm curious, like what about you? What was your favorite art moment? Jessika: Well, I actually have a tie, so you're just gonna have to hear both.  Mike: that's kind of funny because normally I'm the one where I'm like, I have two, maybe three. Jessika: I couldn't decide this time, usually very decisive, but you know. Sandman's got me like... so in chapter five they visit the exotic dance club and the illustration was super neat. They didn't have any heavy outlines. It was lit differently, you know, the, the drawing style and it just had like shapes, comprising most of the forms, which was neat. And it was a good way to show the distorting light that neon and other lights. You know, give off the appearance. And it also gives the vibe for the place they were in. The customers are also not looking at details and the reader won't get any, you know, the stage lights were also different from the backstage lighting, but the line work was the same, which was also an interesting choice. It made it feel like the club was just a world of its own, with its own visual rules.  Mike: Yeah. And the moment where Ishtar takes the stage and she kind of goes nuclear, the art style is very distinct and the way that she's drawn compared to everything else, it's like, she's no longer a concrete form. It's kind of like, she is the idea of a woman in the midst of a very real world, which I thought was a really cool way to do it. Jessika: Yeah. I think so too. Yeah, I think so.  Mike: Yeah.  Jessika: And my other favorite art moment is when Dream goes into Delirium's round  Mike: Mm.  Jessika: it's so colorful and it's a chaotic and it's hard to know where to look, to take everything in. And I found myself kind of looking at the pages far away and then up close because the little details come out when you're close, but the distance lets you see the whole big chaotic picture. So it was really neat to portray like a really neat way to portray that vibe.  Mike: Yeah.  Jessika: so Mike, do you have any final thoughts about this volume before we move on?  Mike: Yeah, I was kind of entertained at how dream threw a giant tantrum because his latest girlfriend bounced and it sort of just drove home how he's still very much a mediocre white guy in his thirties. But, but I also, I will say I did appreciate how this volume brought closure to Orpheus's story and, and how we saw some genuine emotion and regrets from Morpheus at the end of it. There's that moment where after he's having that, recollection of telling Orpheus to live, you can see him in his, I guess his throne or his personal chair or whatever it was. And he looks really sorrowful and that's, I think, the first time that we've seen. Express any true emotion other than anger? Jessika: Yeah. Yeah.  Mike: No. Jessika: Well, let's move along to volume eight and this is titled Worlds End. And was originally published in single magazine farm as the Sandman issues, 51 through 56 in 1993, written as always by our boy, Neil Gaiman illustrated by Brian Talbot, Alex Stevens, John Watkiss, Michael Zuli, Michael Alfred, Shaya Anson Pensa and Gary Amarro. This volume is another anthology. The first story is titled the tale of two cities, and it begins with a car accident where a man named Brant Tucker was behind the wheel with the car's owner, Charlene Mooney in the passenger seat. A large black-horned animal, bigger than a car was in the middle of the road, causing him to veer off and hit a tree Brant bulls Charlene from the wreckage and carries her to find help, winding up at a place called the World's End Inn. Where there are many very curious characters, similarly waiting out the storm, but this isn't a snowstorm like brand had initially thought it is a reality storm, a centaur who is touted to be a prolific healer, tends to Charlene and after drinking a very comforting honey flavored liquid Brant falls into a short coma of 15 hours and awakens to find everyone around a table, trading stories. One of the men at the table, Mr. Geharris goes on to tell a story about a man who enjoyed wandering around the city until the night that he fell or more accurately rode a train into the dreams of his city. After catching a glimpse of a silver gleaming path during his daily lunchtime walk, the man spaces out at work and leaves late missing his usual train. The train he catches is not the right one at all, as Dream as the only other passenger. And it doesn't make the usual stops instead, quickly zipping to an unknown destination when he arrives, all of the landmarks are familiar, but not quite recognizable. He comes upon another older man who tells him his theory that this is the dream of a city. He finds his way out through a familiar doorway where he was later able to read out the tail to Mr. Harris stating that he's not afraid of the dreams of the cities. He's more worried about what might happen if they wake up and decide to take over.  Mike: Yeah. And that last bit, gives, everything kind of this weird Lovecraftian kind of vibe where it's painting cities to kind of seem like they are these eldritch beings that we just happened to be living in. And I kind of dug that Jessika: Yeah. Well, I don't know. I am of the opinion that a city is a living, breathing organism in a way. I mean, there are definite veins and arteries of traffic and, there's different inner workings that make the whole thing rent. I don't know. It just, it feels alive.  Mike: what was that like the mortal engine series, like Peter Jackson produced a movie. That they based on the books about how after effectively, like a giant world war cities become these mobile entities and they wind up like roaming the world and harvesting smaller towns and villages for resources. Jessika: Oh, I Like, that.  Mike: it's a cool idea. It's one where I, I haven't read the book. I've only, I've only seen the trailers, but it looked cool. I don't know. I think it did not actually get that great a review. So I'm waiting for it to come to Netflix before I watch it Jessika: yeah. Fair. So moving on to the second story, which is titled Cluracan's Tale, and it's told by its namesake who is similarly waiting out the store. And this is the very same thorough can who was the brother to Nuala the quote unquote gift given to dream by the Fey after all the underworld drama?  Mike: right in season of the miss. Jessika: Yeah, exactly. His story takes place in the land of Fae where Cluracan is being told by her majesty the queen that he must act as an ambassador on her behalf and intervene in a dealing in Australia of the Plains. Evidently he had been planning to visit Nuala, but would have to set that aside to go on a mission for the queen. She gives him some instructional scrolls, which he was like, yeah, cool. I'll read those later and sets on his way. He's guided to the palace where he meets the psychopomp, who is basically trying to gain power of all the realms tax people and make himself wealthy and powerful. don't know if that sounds familiar.  Mike: Neil Gaiman, continuing to be oddly prescient. Jessika: Man. Cluracan bursts out an uncontrollable prediction, which lands him in jail with iron cuffs and chains. He falls into the dream realm where he sees Nuala. And when he awakes Dream is there and undoes his chains and lets him out as a favor to Nuala. Once out Cluracan spreads rumors throughout the town about the psychopomp causing the town to riot the psychopomp and his adviser. Hide out in the crypt where he is mocking. The former leaders Cluracan comes to face the psychopomp, but before he's able to do. One of the dead bodies comes back the life and fucks up the oily little man by sending them both out of a stained glass window from way high up. Cluracan was on his way back to give his queen the news when he was caught in the storm and absolutely admits to embellishing his story. Mike: Which I mean, that's kind of in keeping with Cluracan's character. He's very much the grandiose storyteller. Jessika: Yeah, exactly. So the next story is called Hob's Leviathan and is told by a young person who goes only by the name, Jim, while Brant and Charlene have come from June, 1993, Jim and the rest of the ship's crew came from September, 1914.  Mike: I actually really liked that detail because it shows the fluid nature of time throughout all of these stories that we're reading. Jessika: Yeah. Yeah. Not only time, but other realms, like, you know, we had reality budding up against the Fey realm and budding up against wherever the hell centaurs come from and all that good stuff, Jim had worked on several other ships and had finally started working on the Sea Witch. The captain reluctantly took on a passenger who we find out to be Hob Gadling during their merchant voyage and also find a stowaway. The stowaway is named Gunga Din, who told a very sexist story about how all women cheat and along the way they encounter a sea serpent. When Jim asks Bob, why nobody is talking about the sea serpent, Hob states that some things just go unsaid and who would believe that story anyway, and then reveals that he knows that Jim is actually a girl in the end. Jim says that there is only so much more time that this disguise will work, but for now they can still be called Jim. Mike: Yeah. And Gunga Din I think that's a Rudyard Kipling poem from like the late 1900s... Jessika: Oh, hence the sexism  Mike: yeah. I mean, I don't remember the details about that. I think we read that in junior year English for high school. but Rudyard Kipling stuff it has that, unmistakable whiff of colonialism. Jessika: Yeah. Colonialism is a thing. Mike: Yeah. Jessika: Golden Boy is the title of our next story and starts with Brant being a very sleepy guy. He wakens to a sandwich and miraculously hot coffee that had been left for him starts looking around the inn. He runs into another guest who states he is a seeker and follower quote, unquote, and tells the story of the one he follows. In another reality, we follow the growth of a boy named Prez Rickard who becomes the 19-year-old president of the United States with a pension for fixing broken timepieces. Now, Mike, off recording, we've talked about Prez before, I know this is a passion of yours. Would you like to give us some background on the character.  Mike: Oh man. Pres. Okay. yeah, we haven't actually talked about them on this show before, and we probably should at some point, but I, but the funny thing is we did talk about him when we were spinning up the podcast that eventually morphed into Ten Cent Takes. So there's like a last episode out there with some of this info. Prez was this comic that DC did back in the early 1970s. It was following the passage of the 26th amendment, which lowered the voting age. And basically the idea was what would happen if a followup amendment allowed teenagers to get elected to office. And the core concept was there's a kid named Prez who is named so because his mom wants him to be president one day, he becomes this local hero after getting all the clocks in his town to run on time and winds up, getting elected president after kind of thwarting, a convoluted scheme by the shady political fixer named boss smiley and Boss Smiley is a weird guy. Like I think, I think if I remember him, he's like a human person, but then he's got like a smiley face button for a face.  Jessika: Yeah. It's weird.  Mike: the problem is, is it's been a while since I read the original issues and I may be mixing it up with what's in here. And then also the followup reboot they did back in 2015, which we'll talk about that in a minute. But the seventies comic only lasted for four issues and it had some really wild stories. Like one of my favorites is he fights a legless vampire on a skateboard and he goes toe to toe with this distant descendant of George Washington, who was leading an extremist militia group. He survives it and assassination attempt on him after he comes out as pro gun control. And I need to show you that comic cover with the vampire, because he's got like, he's got a werewolf as an assistant, just like a torso and then...  Jessika: Sounds a lot like terror. Shout out to DG Chichester.  Mike: Oh man. All right. Take a look at this. Jessika: No, it's on a wheelie cart.  Mike: Uh, yeah. Jessika: I was not. Oh no, there, there, are problems.  Mike: Yeah. Jessika: Oh no. Okay. Let me just paint a picture for everyone. So we have the DC logo in the corner. It says in the middle of the cover Vampire in the wWite House! Prez: First Teen President 20 cents number for March. It's got the comics code authority, of course, which we love. So the door is being opened by what looks like, uh, some militia men, as well as a native American person. Who's very little stereotypically drawn, Mike: I believe that's character name is Eagle free.  Jessika: Oh no, I'm  Mike: Hold on.  Jessika: not loving it.  Mike: Yeah, I mean, it was, it was the early 1970s. They, uh, they weren't very politically correct.  Jessika: can't see my head shaking. It's shaking. I don't love it. Mike: It looks like the Native American mascot that you see when a team is named the Indians. Jessika: Yes, exactly. It's a little rough. you saying "We're too late, that creature's found the president!" and just as... he says Prez who, by the way, is wearing a red sweater, which has the presidential logo with Prez USA around it. So that's already funny. He seems to be in the oval office. Papers are flying everywhere and there's half a vampire on a rolly cart who by the looks of it has flown in and is now trying to bite his neck or strangle him or bite his shoulder and strangle him is what it looks like. Not entirely sure what he's going to do here. So Yeah. Mike: And that's like the final issue of Prez as well, I believe. Jessika: It would escalate into vampirism and be like, oh, where do we go from here?  Pres and a vampire.  Mike: Yeah. pres everything that I love about comics and the press books are why I collect where you just find these weird, strange, silly moments, and then you can bust it out to show to people. And they just want to know all about it. And then you guys get to talk about it for awhile. Jessika: it's the concept itself is so laughable that even if it were an option to like elect an 18 year old, like most of us would be like, I remember what I was 18. This sounds like an awful idea. This sounds like a terrible idea.  Mike: I remember what I was like when I was 30. Good Lord. I wouldn't want me when I was 30 as president. Jessika: That's what I'm saying? Yeah. I'm 35. I'm oh, Hey. I'm just now of presidential age. So nobody vote for me. Nobody vote for me. I don't want that job, but I thought my job was stressful.  Mike: Yeah. Jessika: I have like seven employees. Like I don't, I don't want to have like the country as my, as my dealings with that's a lot.  Mike: Yeah. But the other thing is that in 2015, DC did a mini series revival slash reboot of Prez. Where instead of Prez Rickard... Rickard still shows up and he's kind of like this wildly congressmen, and he's a lot of fun, the idea it's updated for the modern age, where basically you can vote via Twitter. And... Jessika: Oh, no.  Mike: and this girl who goes viral because of like a humiliating video at our fast food job, winds up getting elected president. And it's very funny and very smart. And I can't remember who wrote it, but Ben Caldwell did the art who has this wonderful style. That's kind of a mix of cartoony and then more traditional. And it it's really good. And it's also very affordable. You can find it very easily for not much money. In fact it might be on Hoopla.  Jessika: Ooh, we love Hoopla.  Mike: Yeah, let's see if it's on Hoopla. Jessika: Hey everyone. I would like to take this time to remind everyone to support your local library, to support your local comic book. You're a local small bookstore, small artists.  Mike: We are recording this on small business Saturday. Jessika: We are  Mike: So  Jessika: that's right.  Mike: press volume, one from 2015, by Mark Russell and Ben Caldwell and Mark Morales is available on Hoopla. Highly recommend it. It's a great read. Jessika: Yes. Well, thank you. So back within, the story, so that was a nice background on Prez, but back to what happened within this anthology story. So press has many trials where he's tempted by that character Boss Smiley that you had mentioned, but he declined each time wanting to work for his people instead of selling out so that he could receive the rewards offered by the creepy smiling guy. Even after his fiancé is killed and he's injured by a shooter, he still does not give into temptation after finishing his second term of office and denying want change laws so he could continue through a third, Prez hit the road and beyond some Elvis level sightings, he disappeared into the sunset. When Prez died, despite the lack of news on the subject, collectively the nation knew the tragedy that had befallen them. When Death came to retrieve Prez, he was led to gold gates in the clouds and was met by Boss Smiley. Who explains that there are other Americas, other realities that are unknown to most when Prez explains that he wants to leave to the afterlife of broken watches he was told about. Boss smiley says he will not let him leave that he has to stay with the boss. Dream shows up and puts the kibosh on Boss Smiley's plan, taking Prez out of the situation and literally disappearing in front of the boss's angry visage. Dream explains that Death was the one to call attention to this plight and that he had her the thank for his rescue. Before dream sends him off to the real afterlife, Prez gives dream a pocket watch. And the narrator mentioned that he could be out there spreading his good word or waiting to hop back into reality, but we may never know.  Mike: Yeah. And I really liked that one because it was, the Neil Gaiman spin on a classic obscure character. But I liked the idea of. this person who was in the DC universe, like, you know, a real in quotes character becoming an urban legend. And by that becoming a dream of a nation. And I liked the idea of Morpheus stepping in and being like, nah, he's, he's mine. Jessika: Yeah. Yeah. exactly. So our next story is called Cerements and begins of course, back at the World's End In. And the storyteller for this tale is named Petrefax an apprentice and Stacy has a true story about another member of the party he has with his master BlackRock. Both are from necropolis. We begin in a glass where clap Roth is teaching ways to get rid of a body and quizzes at daydreaming Petrefax Petrefax is assigned by black broth to go see an air burial that was scheduled. The party members of this gathering tell their own stories of the lore of death and the ceremony surrounding it. There was a tale about a prior city that was not showing enough respect for it that ended up being destroyed and reestablished and another that followed the search for hidden place in the city that holds a book that knows many things about death and the departed Brent becomes convinced that the end is actually just them in death, but one of the other people at the end states that they can explain the Inn and magic.  Mike: yeah, and I don't think we've seen Necropolis before now, but I know it shows up later on in the series. Jessika: this is the first time that I had. The final story is called world's end, which shows the storm breaking and the different patrons departing to their respective homes and realms. Well sort of Charlene decided that she didn't really care for her reality anyway, and wants to stay on working at the Inn. Although Brant absolutely tries to talk her into going back with him in vain. Petrefax decided that he hadn't seen enough realms and decides to leave and go venturing with Chiron the centaur. When Brant gets back, the car is in one piece without a scratch on it. And it is registered in his name. All signs of Charlene's existence have been erased from the reality in which he lives with Brant being the only person on earth to remember Charlene.  Mike: Yeah. And then it's revealed that he was telling the story to a bartender. And that basically when he got to their final destination, he called his work and said, I'm not coming back. Like everything has changed. And then he stays out there and, yeah, it was just, it was kinda, it was one of those ones that ended in a way that was kinda weirdly bittersweet it felt a little sad, even though most everybody got what they wanted. Jessika: Yeah. Yeah. I agree. Well, Mike, was there a scene or event in this volume that stood out to you?  Mike: I mean, there's a lot, actually, this is one of the volumes that I really do. Like, but the one that I always really find myself going back to is the story about Prez, which, you know, I mean, based on our prior conversation, probably shouldn't surprise anyone. I really loved how Gaiman created something that was very true to the character, but also was a totally different spin at the same time. And it really felt fun and thoughtful. And I enjoyed how biblical it felt in a lot of ways with Prez being this kind of Christ-like figure. And then Boss Smiley being the adversary. Like they even have the moment where Boss Smiley is trying to tempt him on top of a mountain. Yeah, like I just, I think that is one of my favorite of the Sandman short stories. Jessika: Yeah. That doesn't surprise me about you.  Absolutely.  Mike: What about you? Jessika: No, I really liked the part where Charlene went on a rampage about how there weren't any women in their stories except to further the plot line or be decoration.  Mike: Yeah.  Jessika: It was like, yes, girl.  Mike: I mean, even with the one about Prez it's like he has a fiancé who gets shot and that's about it.  Jessika: Yep, totally fridged.  Mike: Yup. Jessika: Yeah. And it also, I also appreciated Gaiman for actually taking the time to point this out in the narratives.  Mike: Yeah. Jessika: I mean, it would have been nice if there actually had been women in the narratives instead of him just pointing it out. You know, something to think about. Mike: Yeah. Jessika: But that is one of the things that I like about this series in general, while there are some really, really violent things that do happen to women. There are female characters who take charge and step up and act as main characters and have more of a presence. Is it the whole series? No, but I do feel that this is at least trying to be somewhat inclusive. You know, in the way cis male author. And do so. What was your favorite art moment in this. Mike: I think it was the funeral procession that we see towards the end, it's shown across several two page spreads and it's really striking and knowing what I know, it's really interesting with all the foreshadowing that the wake provides us with, but the way that it's presented, we don't know what's g

Mr. Dobalina's Wonderful World of Prank Calls
World of Prank Calls Episode 56 – Four Eyed Toothless Lame

Mr. Dobalina's Wonderful World of Prank Calls

Play Episode Listen Later Dec 7, 2021 37:32


Today's show has Dwight being a 4 eyed lame, Dragonmere peeing in public sinks, RBCP inspiring an Arby's employee to ring a bell, XYZ testing

the artisan podcast
ep24 | the artisan podcast | jaime levy | ux strategist, author, speaker

the artisan podcast

Play Episode Listen Later Dec 7, 2021 44:41


Jaime Levy, Ux Strategist, Speaker and author of UX Strategy: Product Strategy Techniques for Devising Innovative Digital Solutions available in 6 languages and now also on Audible You can find Jaime on LinkedIn and on jaimelevy.com   ----------------- Katty: I've been watching your career trajectory, and I was super excited to see that you had written a book, UX Strategy and that the audio version has just come out. So I wanted to have a conversation about you, about the book, and how you started your path. One thing that I've noticed is this trend of reinvention with you from a designer to a strategist to an author to a public speaker to a professor, and how all of that's going to come together for you. I just found that fascinating, so I'd love for you to talk about your origin story and what's steps you've taken to come here. Jaime: Let's see. Well, I guess it started even before the browser when I was creating my floppy disk magazines, and I was a graduate student at NYU, and just really interested in nonlinear storytelling.  And then trying to invent this new medium like it was just this total insane dreamer thing. And I guess because of the floppy disk I made, I actually finished it, and then I successfully brought the product to market by selling it. A floppy disk that opened into a HyperCard or Director presentation. I know for all the newbies, they're like, “What are you talking about?” Don't worry, you don't need to know this old-school stuff.  But you know it used to be really hard to make interactive presentations, but the upside of all of that was that you could be the first or you could do something that is only mediocre in design. But because it was the first it was like “yay.”  That was how I started out. I was a horrible interface designer and a horrible coder. But I just kept pounding on these floppy disks, and then, the short version of it is Billy Idol bought one, and then it got launched as a commercial endeavor and then I got my gigs at EMI records and Viacom. And it all just kept going from there you know to eventually, doing an online magazine, and then getting a creative director role and just constantly working.  I really believe that if you just keep working, and applying yourself, and learning new things, that eventually you'll connect and get whatever it is that you want. Some job, or some gig, or an opportunity. And I think that relentlessness to persevere was something that has stayed with me, and I actually need to kind of manifest it now as I'm starting the next chapter of my career.  Before UX, it was called interface design and then after interface design, then it was web design and then after web design, then we had information architecture and interaction design. And by the time I got back to LA after 9/11 and the dot com thing crashed in New York, as well as, San Francisco and LA, I came back here and it seemed at that point I needed to focus.  And I should mention early on as a result of the (floppy) disk I was asked to be a part-time professor at NYU, and I did get flown around the country and the world, to speak at conferences, and I think like when you have that success when you start out you think that's normal. And so for me, it's just been catching up with my old normal, and it's a curse and a blessing, and the blessing is obvious because you're like, oh, I just want to continue to be a public speaker, I want to continue being known or recognized for my work. But the negative consequences, it's an addiction, it's like a high that you set here and you think, Oh, I always have to be at this level of an overachiever. And so, you know, in that sense I feel like I didn't engage in my own personal life, you know because I sacrificed it for my career so much and didn't really like relax into it until my 30s when I got back to Los Angeles. Katty: Interesting. I saw you actually speak about it in one of your talks. I think was your Brazil talk about being an overachiever and what that means and constantly trying to do things, new things, or do things in a new way. I found that fascinating, it went through that same reinvention theme that I recognized in what you were talking about. So thanks for sharing that. So you mentioned, the new chapter, a new iteration of Jaime. Jaime: New? It's in progress. So, you know, I did my first book and I did really well with the first book. I was insane to write a book. That was so crazy. But I just felt like UX strategy was so interesting and even though nobody was paying me to write it, you certainly don't make money off of the book. I just was like okay I'll take a year and a half and spend my savings and write a book and sit in the library. And it was really rewarding.  And so then when it came time to do a second edition, if I want to be current I did that. And I did it during the lockdown so that was kind of a good thing to do when you can't really go teach in a classroom or go run workshops in a public space. But basically, my book is now out in the second edition and is being translated into languages, and I just found out it's in German and Italian, and Portuguese this time, you know, on top of the other six languages and that's really exciting.  But the thing with the book is you need to promote it, and you know and you need to go do things to market it. Whenever you make anything whether it be a floppy disk or a website or an app or a book or you're marketing yourself as a public speaker, it's one thing that you do it, but the other half of it is in order to be successful, you just got to market yourself or your product. And it's fine when I get paid to do growth design and markets and run experiments to market other people's products. But I think, I'm kind of at least right now, I feel I'm just kind of over-marketing myself. All of a sudden I feel like, ah, can't life just be simple again? Let me just get a job ideally as a UX strategist and, you know, and that's it, let things quiet down.  And so you can say it's an existential post-midlife crisis, or maybe it's a phase but I just had a job interview with a company that I hope I get, and they were telling me that they just had written an article related to this subject about so many people basically looking at their careers and saying, “Do I even want to do this?”  I feel like COVID Hit the reset button for a ton of people and so now I'm less killing myself about, “Oh wow, I'm really not going to go crazy promoting this book because I don't feel like it? Is there something wrong with me? Or is it just like maybe I just have to accept to let people read the book. I hope they like it.” And if people ask me to speak fine, but you know, I think it's like at a certain point you have to say okay where's friction and friction is trying to go tour and do workshops at what we hope might be the end of the pandemic but isn't. You know, it's like I suffered the same fate as people who, you know we're in an orchestra, you know, or who had movies that came out. So I'm in great company of people who made their money by doing things for the public and in person and now that you know, there's no UX conferences really planned. I'm speaking at the one in Estonia, one, this year, zero last year zero the year before, you know. So it makes you say what am I going to do now? Katty: You're right, it definitely has been a reset button on many fronts. We've seen this so much with so many other candidates that we work with who are re-evaluating “I've been doing XYZ until now, do I still want to do it, do I still want to live here?” Just really evaluating everything, but I totally hear you about the book because I also wrote a book during this pandemic. I had been working on it for three years, which was far too long but that's just the length of time that it took. The circumstances where we found ourselves allowed me to finish it, so I am grateful for that. That was the silver lining in this crazy year and t it allowed me to finish it and get it out. But it's just sitting there and it's nowhere near where it needs to be... but it is what it is. It's a story I needed to get out. I got it out. Now, if people find it, awesome, and if they don't then we'll cross that bridge.  Jaime: What's your book called? Katty: It's called The Butterfly Years, and it's just my personal story dealing with grief and has nothing to do with Artisan Creative and it has everything to do with me. Obviously, as somebody who's running a company, it is going to have to come to grips with having to manage grief and make that work otherwise it permeates everything. Katty: If it helps people out there, it's there. If somebody is going through it and they need to hear somebody else's story who's been in the same boat. Then I've done my job.  Katty: Yeah, So when I heard that you had done your second edition and you had just done an audiobook. I thought you know I want to talk to her and see how that whole process was for her.  Katty: Congratulations on your interview and I hope that it ends up being the right next thing. Jaime: I hope so too. That would be great if my first interview turned into a job offer. Katty: Putting out the good vibes. Jaime: They were very surprised because it was a UX strategy position and I didn't have anywhere in my portfolio that I wrote it. I didn't want to say that I literally wrote the book on UX strategy because then they think oh she's not humble or she's too experienced so I didn't mention it. They saw something in there and I'm like, “Oh yeah, I wrote a book kind of related to UX strategy.” and they're like what's it called, I'm like, UX Strategy. I can't even own it. I can't even own it, you know, I'm just like, ahh so shocking. Yeah, you know, I want the opportunity to practice what I preach. Enough, running around with the same lectures and enough training.  I've done so much training in the last year, I think sometimes we just need to go back and forth and be okay with it. I'm not saying I'll never do workshops again, I just need to take a break from that part of it or and pursue it. So yeah hopefully something will come up for me that is enjoyable. Because I think it's important to have a job if you like and what I was shocked by when I looked at the job market this time was, oh my god there's 8,624 UX jobs in this country and 30 or 40% of them are remote, and there's actually jobs advertised for UX strategist title. It used to just be me and two other people. I don't know if my book helped define the industry but it seems like when I read the job description, it had everything that I wrote about in my book so it's a really exciting time that there's so much opportunity out there. Katty: Yeah, for sure. I'd love for you to maybe help define that a little bit, because obviously, we hear you know there's on the design side of it, UX there's XD. Now it's customer experience, employee experience. Can you talk a little bit about that I know for just what I've heard you talk about before, it's really the research and the strategy is the precursor before you even get into the design part of it. And I learned that thinking time is so important to be able to do that? Can you talk a little bit about that? Katty: A little bit of both, actually. Jaime: Sure. So I basically define UX strategy as the intersection between product design and business strategy. So business strategy is the top-level vision of an organization. How do we make money, who are our customers? You know business is defined, ultimately by their customers.  So they have a vision and the vision might be a platform, multiple products, a suite of products, or one product. And then it's like how do you really elevate that product, and bring it to market? So that when people have that first whiff of it, they're like, smells awesome. And so when I started doing discovery phases back in 2008, 2009 for Schematic and for Huge, I really fell in love with it. Because I love doing competitive research. So interesting, I mean who doesn't want to get paid to research the marketplace? And I loved the idea of finally getting to do user research. And so that was when I really became interested in it and realized that there was nothing out there that told us how to do it. I would just make things up as I went along and as I moved from different organizations, I would clean up my deliverables and take them to the next level.  And then when Lean Startup came out--People don't think of Lean Startup, as a product strategy methodology but I certainly do. It's this idea to build the smallest version of your product, get it in front of your target customer, learn from it, whether it be an alpha or prototype, extract data from these learnings and learn from it, and then iterate.  All of a sudden the discovery phase became not something like Waterfall; first, we do discovery, then we do the implementation, then we do usability testing and find out at the very end that not only does our product suck but nobody wants it. It was insane. And now all of a sudden, the discovery phase became something that can be iterative and cross into the implementation phase, and you can start building products and doing strategy, and testing it and validating it in much smaller loops all along the way. So that's what's really exciting is an opportunity to run some kind of experiments to knock out, to do rapid prototyping, to use whatever it is like sketch XD, other prototyping tools to get business concepts in front of the target users, and start doing user research that's more focused on validating a value proposition, versus, you know, is this thing usable? Even if it's really usable, but nobody wants it, then who cares if it's usable, right? Katty: Yep. Very good, and with plenty of products out there with great usability but they're sitting on the shelf. I probably have a few of them. Katty: Fantastic. You talked a little bit about this but I think, given where you are going, pivoting, and where you see the future to be for you at this juncture. What can you share with people who are either just starting out in their career path? And/or because of this past year, lost their positions, and they have to reinvent themselves. Where is it that you dig down deep to find that inspiration and that determination to just say you know what, this isn't working, let me figure out where it is that I want to go? Jaime: Yeah, I think just to be honest it's very different for someone like me with two to three decades in the industry versus somebody who's starting out. So I wouldn't give someone the same advice I would give myself, there's definitely different things going on. I can remember very well when I was starting out and the same feelings that I have now are similar. My dad gave me this great advice. When you're looking for a job, or when you're starting on your career, and when you interview with people, you want to be careful that you don't have this flashing L on your head. Loser, loser, loser.  Because people will spot this lack of confidence or low self-esteem, you know, and it doesn't matter how successful you are, or have been, like me. Because you can still have low self-esteem or imposter syndrome, and so, it's like you need to somehow put all of these fears of I suck;. I'm not gonna make it; I'm an imposter;I am so crazy that I thought I could do this film, to begin with. I'm too old or I'm too young or my portfolio doesn't have X, X, X.  I have to constantly work on this, to this minute, which is spinning a much more positive narrative in my head that, “No, no, I have something of value to give”. And then putting that negative energy into therapy, exercise, whatever you need to do to take care of yourself, but I still to this day, put it into how can I showcase my work, what's missing? You know, look at my portfolio. Okay, it has all this but it's missing, you know, this one deliverable. Well, I better make it, fake it till you make it, you know, and figure out a way to like get it in there.  And the funny thing is is they may not even ask for it on that job interview, but if it's like this thing that you think is missing, then it's going to be flashing the L on your forehead and so to me, it's like puffing yourself up and what is it going to do to make you confident for these interviews and if showing your portfolio and getting excited around the storytelling of your UX design which, it still is for me, then get that into your portfolio and any missing things.  Don't spend eight hours a day looking for a job, spend four hours and the other four hours teaching yourself a new tool because there's always going to be new things to learn. And if you're not open to learning new things, up until, you know, your 50s and 60s, then whenever that is where you're not open to new things, you better be at that last job that you're going to station yourself at, because the industry, I promise you, just keeps on changing. You know it's amazing. Katty: Gosh. Great advice. I think for all levels of career and years in the industry and also not even to have to do with business. I think for anything where we tend to sometimes focus in on the thing we don't have versus on the things that we do have it's just such a great lesson to say you know what to say we have to reshift that mindset.  There's a great book that I read a couple of years ago by this woman called Sally Helgason, and it's called How Women Rise, and she talks a lot about specifically women and how we get into this mindset of, oh, but you know what, let me work harder because I'm missing this 10% thing and not focus on the 90% that I have and it's just crazy. I see it all the time. I see it, not just in candidates I see it in myself. And putting myself out for a conversation or a talk or something and if I don't get it's like, oh, that's because I didn't talk about this. You know what, maybe just wasn't the right thing. So, yeah, great lesson. And I think also that that whole thing also speaks of desperation, and I think that that comes through, so loud and clear, it erodes the confidence that would naturally be there if somebody has worked on their craft. Jaime: Yeah and we need to in this field of product design or research, ultimately we're making something that we need to upsell, at the very end, even if it's to our boss and say yeah this is awesome, you know, and it's like, oh my gosh if we come to it from this place of fear, we're never going to sell it.  So I think it's easy to focus on the negatives for a lot of us, and we can't afford to do that in our field because we're always upselling our work. Katty: Yeah. Have you ever taken the StrengthsFinder assessment? Have you ever done that?  Jaime: No, I don't even know what that is. Katty: It's similar to a DISC or Myers-Briggs. But it focuses on your strengths. The reason I like it, we do it for our company and we talk about our strengths all the time. Its created by Don Clifton, and is now as part of Gallup and it's a personality assessment. The reason for him creating this was that he felt people focused on their weaknesses, and not on their strengths. The whole thing is about what are your top five strengths and let's lead with your strengths and not focus on a thing that is number 30 something for you, let's focus on the things that you're really good at and then find someone else who your bottom five is their top five and then collaborate. So it sounds like it's just human nature that we go there. If we could learn not to go there, it would be less, I think less of a headache for all of us. Katty: Crazy. So, I know you're teaching, you're doing online courses, you mentioned that you're doing a talk in Estonia. Are you doing that in person, are you doing that virtually? How are you managing your time and all the different places you need to be, or how did you manage your time and all the different places you need to be? Jaime: Yeah, I don't know how I'm managing my time right now yet. I'm still waiting to see where a bunch of things land. But the Estonia conference is the first onsite conference since COVID, since March of 2020. Well, basically there's very few conferences in the beginning of the year for the first quarter anyway.  So, anyway, it's Web Usability Day I think is their legacy name. But it's a one-day conference and then there's workshops, three days prior to it. It's in Estonia, it's very affordable, it's gonna bring in like a massive crowd of UX professionals. A lot of new ones but people mid-level and all over the place. And they're coming from Estonia, but they're also coming across the Baltic from Finland, and a couple of other Baltic states. So, I'm closing the conference, I guess I'm kind of headlining it, and then my workshop is one day right before that. So November 25th,iis my UX Strategy Workshop and then November 26th is the conference. It's a Thursday, Friday, so but I'll be in Berlin back in November, and then I'm doing a couple of talks, just private ones where I'm flying in. And then going back to Berlin and then I'm going to do this thing in Estonia.  I am so over this idea of more online workshops. I think they're a joke, sorry guys, but the whole point of conferences was to get people together physically in a space to network and touch base with other people and build relationships. And it seems I've done a bunch of these fake conferences, and it doesn't feel the same, they never pay and it's a joke. So I'm not into those anymore.  I'm really stoked that these people you know, the COVID cases are extremely low [in Estonia]. I've had my third vaccine. already so I'm totally going. I won't be taking too much risk but definitely, I'm really excited to be around humans and doing my thing. Katty: Yeah, humans, human connection. I'm traveling internationally for the first time since March of last year as well, and I'm going to Mexico and then to Dubai. But, I have to navigate the whole PCR test thing because I'm not going to be in the States for three days before I go so I got to figure that part out. Jaime: Yeah. It's a crazy time. I can't believe really what happened. How much the pandemic just changed everything, it's just, it's shocking. Katty: Are you seeing that in the world of products, are you seeing what's happened with a pandemic impact, whether it be design thinking or about how people are approaching research. I would imagine that it's changed how people are looking at how they go forward. Jaime: Yeah well, everything's online now. When I left Huge back in 2009, 2010. It was because I didn't want to drive in my car in rush hour to agency land in Culver City, and I didn't want to work in person, I wanted to work from home. So I've been working remote since 2010 and it's not new to me, and Cisco Systems when I worked for them as a UX strategist, everybody was a remote workforce. So finally, the rest of the world is catching up with us and learning that it is possible, and even outside of product so I think it's opening up opportunities in many ways. But, the negative consequence, and I felt this when I taught my last course at Claremont University, was that my students who were graduating, were just getting internships, but they're online.  At Facebook or wherever, and at any point in your life where you need human contact, and you need the nuance of someone kind of seeing that you're confused, and you need mentoring or you need to get the confidence to ask for help, we need that to be in person. I feel like the people that are getting the worst end of the deal is the college graduates, the people who are just starting their career who have to start it by themselves in Zoom rooms. Hopefully, there's going to be some way that it isn't just this experience of online collaboration, because I just feel even when I had my second or third cat life of getting into the UX world, I can't even imagine that I would have had the trust and camaraderie that I had with people at Schematic who came over and showed me how to wireframe when nobody was looking. So hopefully maybe there's some way that people can reach out and have people to connect with for that kind of support since they can't get it in person. Katty: The whole mentoring piece of it. Yeah, taking somebody under your wing. It's harder to do it this way. Yeah, you're absolutely right. I have some nieces and nephews who started their first year in college last year. You've worked really hard to get into the school of your choice, but you don't get a chance to really experience that. So now as a sophomore, they're getting to experience it for the first time because now some other classes are in person. So really interesting to kind of watch this new generation of those who are starting and those who are graduating, it's just a very different world, for sure. Jaime: Yeah it's crazy. It's really crazy and maybe five years from now we'll look back on that and go, Oh man, it was so great, why didn't we just do all that remote work and it was so easy. But it is weird, I just got off the phone with a client and he's just saying that he's not leaving the house and he doesn't want to get the vaccine because he almost died from a vaccine from something else a long time ago, so he's just like staying in his house for his whole life. And I just, I feel in our field where we're designing products for customers and users, it's like, “Nah, we need to have human contact and get out there.” When I'm feeling really low, I reach out to a friend and I have to dump, and say “Ugh”, and have them tell me. I just hope we don't lose everything as a result of this, online world that we live in now. Katty: I don't think so. I mean I certainly hope not. I do feel that there's a hybrid version of it that's going to be more pronounced. I mean we went to such an extreme this past year, I do think there's going to be a hybrid world in front of us. I haven't quite figured it out yet, but little by little I think we'll fall into place. Let's end on a couple of inspiration pieces. Where do you get your inspiration? Jaime: My inspiration now is probably-- I consume a lot of film. I like to have a big impact. I actually went to the movie theater, on Sunday, by myself, bought a ticket to go see Ich bin dein Mensch, I'm Your Man, a German film about a man robot who was built to learn on what a woman wants and then they program him to be the perfect partner. It was amusing, to walk into it, to have it open up and see all of Mitte Berlin and see the TV tower and see the food and see inside the flat. I miss Berlin so much right now, I felt like when I got out of there  I had just gone to Berlin. It just reminded me of all these tiny little things. So I get a lot of inspiration from being able to transport myself into different realities physically and through film, and right now, traveling is limited,but I definitely get my inspiration from seeing other cultures, other ways to live.  I lived in Berlin for most of the pandemic, and it took months, but after being there and away from here for so many months it really-- when you experience other cultures, it makes you appreciate and also find things you don't like about your own culture. But I feel like having perspective is what inspires me. Katty: Love that, and for creativity to bloom, do you need that spark of inspiration for creativity to happen, or is there another thing you tap into when you sit down to write or to do another wireframe or to create, what would you tap into for that? Jaime: I don't know, I wish I could answer that. I don't know. I spend my days at the computer then I go and walk on a trail. It's extremely important for me to get out and walk in nature and I do that every day and I listen to the same 3 podcasts. The New York Times Day thing, The Berlin Briefing, and then Doug Rushkoff's Team Human And that stuff, while I'm like in nature and walking around listening to these podcasts, again, I guess I feel transported and I feel immersed. I think that when I leave the house, and when I come back, whether I'm jogging or listening to music and weird experimental atonal music that nobody would like unless they're into weird music. That helps me really reset the crazy stuff we're telling ourselves in our head or just like being in a mundane moment. I think sitting at a computer for more than four hours, not healthy for me.   Katty: I love that. Both for creativity and inspiration, it's not going to happen nine to five necessarily looking at a little screen. To be able to get out of this and just get other influences. I find nature so healing in so many ways and my ideation just goes off the roof when I'm out and about. Jaime: Where do you go, where do you get your nature?  Katty: My favorite place is Point Doom in Malibu. It's a very easy little hike, but you are at eye level of the pelicans flying by. It's just the most incredible sensation sitting there and you see these majestic birds flying right at your eye level. So whenever I can, whether it's a birthday or an anniversary or something special, that's where I like to go.    Jaime: Nice. Yeah.   Katty: Well Jamie where can people find you?   Jaime: People can find me on LinkedIn, @Jaimerlevy. I'm on Twitter, I'm not tweeting so much. I was told I need to get on Instagram but I'm like, “What?”. And then Jaimelevy.com and then the book userexperiencestrategy.com. I'd love to just mention if people don't like to go walk in nature. I recorded my audible book at this great studio in the valley, where I grew up, and it's me reading my book and doing some impressions of myself, and it's a lot of stories and so far the reviews have been really favorable. And so if you're not a big reader like me I hate it, I don't really like reading. I can read an article but long-format, not so good. Check out my audible book if you're not sure go to userexperiencestrategy.com and listen to the first two chapters and try it on. But I'm really excited about the audible, you know for my book I self-produced it, paid for it, and it's mine. So that was important to me, you know.      

Insights with Trent Munday
You Can Find The Time. Check Your Calendar...In 127 Days #1465

Insights with Trent Munday

Play Episode Listen Later Dec 4, 2021 1:32


It never ceases to amaze me how often people say, "I'd really like to do XYZ...but I just don't have the time." You probably can find the time. Just open your calendar and keep flicking through until you find an empty slot. You may have to jump ahead 127 days from today...all the way to 10 April 2022...but eventually you will find an open slot. If it's important enough to you, you can find the time. Schedule it. Commit to it. Make it happen. #timemanagement #scheduling #priorities

Harmony in the Home
129: Strainer Parenting

Harmony in the Home

Play Episode Listen Later Dec 1, 2021 22:39


What is the most important part of parenting? As an analogy, think of a geologist sifting sediment through a strainer looking for cool rocks. All the sand comes out the bottom, and the pebbles and rocks stay inside the strainer. People, and children especially, are the same way. Let me explain! Before I was conscious — it's kind of funny, I say it like I was asleep for years of my life — I was so concerned with the parts of parenting that I had no control over! I thought, my kids will be better if I discipline them better, or if I use XYZ parenting technique. But the Universe has a way of subverting our expectations. You see, time and time again, I got little prods and promptings pushing me toward the path I needed to take: take the children's feelings into account. Whether it was from Lily explaining how easygoing it was at her grandparents' house, or from Mark in my classroom saying “I feel like she's always mad at us!” — I've learned that kids pay attention to how they feel. And this is not a political statement, or it shouldn't be. Children are small adults and they have never experienced anything before, so we should give them an edifying experience! Of course, this is all distilled down to that most famous of axioms: “people will forget what you said, people will forget what you did, but people will never forget how you made them feel.” And it's true! The big rocks that stay in your child's “strainer” are all related to how they feel. If they feel safe from belittling words or hitting or abuse, if they feel encouraged to be their best self, if they feel able to live and learn (and yes, even and ESPECIALLY make mistakes), then your parental mission is a success. So do your best to provide a safe environment where your kids can grow, because they won't remember if you always had the house clean, or if you forgot to sign a permission slip, or if you burned dinner one time or a hundred. But they will remember the feeling if you made home a safe place for children to grow. As you practice building that home, you will get better at doing it. Remember — you've got this! Subscribe on Apple! Subscribe on Android! Join my FREE parenting bootcamp! Let's Connect! Here's where you can find me: Learn more at https://www.coachingkelly.com. Find me on Instagram! Find me on Facebook!

The Overnight Trainer Podcast
Why Your L&D Job Search Isn‘t Working (And How To Fix It)

The Overnight Trainer Podcast

Play Episode Listen Later Nov 30, 2021 29:52


Are you tired of applying to L&D jobs and only getting rejections (or even worse, hearing NOTHING at all)? Chances are you're unintentionally putting yourself into what I like to call the "viscous application cycle." You apply for dozens of L&D roles (probably ones your unsure of or even overqualified for), only to receive rejection after rejection. You start to think..."If I'm not getting interviews for THESE roles, what AM I qualified to do?" and you continue down the path of throwing spaghetti at the wall, hoping that one of these roles (that you probably aren't even that jazzed about) calls you in for an interview! WOW, I'm exhausted just THINKING about that cycle.

EvoReal Talks
Setup & Design Vacation Rental Journey Part V

EvoReal Talks

Play Episode Listen Later Nov 29, 2021 29:34


Research the community calendars for your draw area, many will have a visit XYZ area website, for instance ‘visitspokane.com' as an example, set your rates and know your market. Policies: Set your rules and hold people accountable. Cancellations- Don't be too strict you may turn people away from booking. Instant book- you can limit this down, we chose those that have reviews, ID, phone, and email. Rules: Think of the likely potential damages that could be done and be specific for instance; wet clothes on leather furniture, no pets, hot items on the table, etc… Roll out the red carpet, Jessica starts the chat about the design and setup of your short-term rental. Determine your ownership style and start there. Ask yourself: What type of property do you have? How many people will stay there? Where will they eat? Where will they watch TV as a group? Measure your rooms so you can make sure to get appropriately sized furniture, be mindful of configuration and open space. Will the item need to be moved? Consider a lighter piece of furniture if so. Cube stools are perfect for adding modular seating and functionality. Will people cook at your place? Think of appliances that can be used in a dual scenario (Instapot instead of a rice cooker). Where will they sleep? Add quick capacity with a rollaway bed or a sofa bed (include instructions). Catch us next week for more great tips on design choices!

My Business On Purpose
536: How To Write An Annual Letter For Your Small Business

My Business On Purpose

Play Episode Listen Later Nov 29, 2021 8:32


You know that moment when you open the mailbox and you see the letter with your name on it? Not the spam mail, the credit card offer, or the latest internet bill. That feeling you get when you open a letter personally addressed to you, Hannah or Jason. Behind those words are thought, courage, joy, laughter, tears, surprise, or motivation. Words are powerful, especially when they are directed to you. Words matter. The thoughts and intentions behind those words matter. The way those words make you feel or react matter. Think about this. Every major global religion is all based on a holy book. Writing. The door to every major global movement or cause has typically stemmed from a book, a song, a poem, a prepared speech, or manifesto. Writing. One of our favorite phrases is, “if it is not written down it doesn't exist.” So why don't we write more often? We're scared we're not that good at it. Novelist Louis L'Amour said, “Start writing, no matter what. The water does not flow until the faucet is turned on.” One of the most powerful, durable, and recordable ways to share your human thoughts as a leader is to write them out, personally addressed to your team. Of course, you have doubts. Poet Sylvia Path helps us confront our doubt saying, “... By the way, everything in life is writable if you have the outgoing guts to do it... The worst enemy to creativity is self-doubt.” When you write a letter to your company you have immediately created recorded history. When your business is two, or ten, or forty years off into the future, those future team members and leaders will be installed with the founder's or previous owners' principles, ideas, innovations, and foundations. When you do not write a letter to your company, it gets lost to time. We are encouraging you and challenging you to write a letter to each member of your business every year and personally mail it to their home with their name on the top. The first exposure I had to a powerful annual letter is Amazon.com founder Jeff Bezos in his 1997 Amazon Shareholder letter. I used it in my first-ever coaching session with a client as we built out their Vision Story. In his letter, Bezos works through some key elements that we can put into a simple template to help you think through your powerful letter. First, Bezos begins his letter with key milestones that Amazon has achieved throughout the year. It is short and sweet and very powerful coming right out of the gate. No fluff, dive right in. You may say something like… Dear Hannah, We saw ACME, Co. grow beyond our projections by about 5% and YOU were a huge part of that. Our goal is to move beyond where we are at now and for next year become the second largest XYZ company in our county... Next, Bezos then goes on to discuss multiple opportunities that are in front of them. Even if you are staring down the barrel of a recession, opportunity is in front of you. What is it? What could your business do even if you don't know the “how” quite yet? Writing this letter forces you to see opportunity and then take the risk of sharing that opportunity. Use wisdom, use discretion, and be bold. You can do all three together. Third, Bezos begins sharing true stories that are aligned with their unique core values of “long term” and “obsess over customers”. With each of those stories, he is also diligent to layout bullet points of what the impact will be to Amazon from those stories, both the fun parts and the challenging parts. For instance, an impact of “long term” is “When forced to choose between optimizing the appearance of our GAAP accounting and maximizing the present value of future cash flows, we'll take the cash flows.” He's honest and discrete. Bezos shares what he can share, but I'm sure doesn't share everything. Also, remember that Amazon is a publicly-traded company so they will tend to be more open about their financial numbers due to their public transparency. You may wish to not share those. With whatever you write, just ask yourself, “how will this impact particular team members when they read it.” The overall goal is to celebrate, encourage, inspire, motivate, show appropriate vulnerability, and vision-cast through your annual letter. Use your discretion with how much information to share. Next, Bezos shares some key metrics that make sense to the Amazon team. What will make sense to your team? Is it the number of increased contracts signed this year compared to last? Is it the user ratings that have increased this year over last? Your performance rating? Safety metrics? What are those key metrics that matter to your team? This may be a great place to share them. Fifth, Bezos devotes an entire section just to the Amazon team... to celebrating them. He is aspirational, saying things like, “The past year's success is the product of a talented, smart, hard-working group, and I take great pride in being a part of this team.” Bezos is also sober mentioning, “It's not easy to work here... but we're building something important.” Near the end of the letter, Bezos then goes into full-on vision-casting and goal-setting mode. It is a sentence by sentence power punch to the soul of each team member as if to say, “I so value you that I'm going to stretch our horizon, so you will always have a place to RUN by doing your highest and best work.” Where are you headed? What are the broad steps that it will take for you to get there? Remember the words to the Jewish Prophet Habakkuk, “write the vision down so those who read it may run!” Finally, Bezos signs off with a two-sentence summary. This would be a great place to reinforce your mission statement saying something like, “This was a powerful year to (insert mission statement), and I am beyond grateful for you. Thank you for your work, your commitment, and for your devotion to (insert a core value here).”

My Business On Purpose
536: How To Write An Annual Letter For Your Small Business

My Business On Purpose

Play Episode Listen Later Nov 29, 2021 8:32


You know that moment when you open the mailbox and you see the letter with your name on it? Not the spam mail, the credit card offer, or the latest internet bill. That feeling you get when you open a letter personally addressed to you, Hannah or Jason. Behind those words are thought, courage, joy, laughter, tears, surprise, or motivation. Words are powerful, especially when they are directed to you. Words matter. The thoughts and intentions behind those words matter. The way those words make you feel or react matter. Think about this. Every major global religion is all based on a holy book. Writing. The door to every major global movement or cause has typically stemmed from a book, a song, a poem, a prepared speech, or manifesto. Writing. One of our favorite phrases is, “if it is not written down it doesn't exist.” So why don't we write more often? We're scared we're not that good at it. Novelist Louis L'Amour said, “Start writing, no matter what. The water does not flow until the faucet is turned on.” One of the most powerful, durable, and recordable ways to share your human thoughts as a leader is to write them out, personally addressed to your team. Of course, you have doubts. Poet Sylvia Path helps us confront our doubt saying, “... By the way, everything in life is writable if you have the outgoing guts to do it... The worst enemy to creativity is self-doubt.” When you write a letter to your company you have immediately created recorded history. When your business is two, or ten, or forty years off into the future, those future team members and leaders will be installed with the founder's or previous owners' principles, ideas, innovations, and foundations. When you do not write a letter to your company, it gets lost to time. We are encouraging you and challenging you to write a letter to each member of your business every year and personally mail it to their home with their name on the top. The first exposure I had to a powerful annual letter is Amazon.com founder Jeff Bezos in his 1997 Amazon Shareholder letter. I used it in my first-ever coaching session with a client as we built out their Vision Story. In his letter, Bezos works through some key elements that we can put into a simple template to help you think through your powerful letter. First, Bezos begins his letter with key milestones that Amazon has achieved throughout the year. It is short and sweet and very powerful coming right out of the gate. No fluff, dive right in. You may say something like… Dear Hannah, We saw ACME, Co. grow beyond our projections by about 5% and YOU were a huge part of that. Our goal is to move beyond where we are at now and for next year become the second largest XYZ company in our county... Next, Bezos then goes on to discuss multiple opportunities that are in front of them. Even if you are staring down the barrel of a recession, opportunity is in front of you. What is it? What could your business do even if you don't know the “how” quite yet? Writing this letter forces you to see opportunity and then take the risk of sharing that opportunity. Use wisdom, use discretion, and be bold. You can do all three together. Third, Bezos begins sharing true stories that are aligned with their unique core values of “long term” and “obsess over customers”. With each of those stories, he is also diligent to layout bullet points of what the impact will be to Amazon from those stories, both the fun parts and the challenging parts. For instance, an impact of “long term” is “When forced to choose between optimizing the appearance of our GAAP accounting and maximizing the present value of future cash flows, we'll take the cash flows.” He's honest and discrete. Bezos shares what he can share, but I'm sure doesn't share everything. Also, remember that Amazon is a publicly-traded company so they will tend to be more open about their financial numbers due to their public transparency. You may wish to not share those. With whatever you write, just ask yourself, “how will this impact particular team members when they read it.” The overall goal is to celebrate, encourage, inspire, motivate, show appropriate vulnerability, and vision-cast through your annual letter. Use your discretion with how much information to share. Next, Bezos shares some key metrics that make sense to the Amazon team. What will make sense to your team? Is it the number of increased contracts signed this year compared to last? Is it the user ratings that have increased this year over last? Your performance rating? Safety metrics? What are those key metrics that matter to your team? This may be a great place to share them. Fifth, Bezos devotes an entire section just to the Amazon team... to celebrating them. He is aspirational, saying things like, “The past year's success is the product of a talented, smart, hard-working group, and I take great pride in being a part of this team.” Bezos is also sober mentioning, “It's not easy to work here... but we're building something important.” Near the end of the letter, Bezos then goes into full-on vision-casting and goal-setting mode. It is a sentence by sentence power punch to the soul of each team member as if to say, “I so value you that I'm going to stretch our horizon, so you will always have a place to RUN by doing your highest and best work.” Where are you headed? What are the broad steps that it will take for you to get there? Remember the words to the Jewish Prophet Habakkuk, “write the vision down so those who read it may run!” Finally, Bezos signs off with a two-sentence summary. This would be a great place to reinforce your mission statement saying something like, “This was a powerful year to (insert mission statement), and I am beyond grateful for you. Thank you for your work, your commitment, and for your devotion to (insert a core value here).”

Create Art Podcast
WRITING/PODCASTING A NOVEL IN 30 DAYS NOV 26

Create Art Podcast

Play Episode Listen Later Nov 26, 2021 13:44


National Novel Writing and Podcast Posting Month 2021 Welcome friend to Create Art Podcast where I help you tame your inner critic and create more than we consume. I am Timothy Kimo Brien your thankful head instigator with over 20 years in arts and education. How I accomplish this is by providing you with commentary, interviews, discussions, and projects that will inspire you to create art. This month I will be podcasting daily and writing a novel in 30 days. I am participating in NaPodPoMo and NaNoWriMo again this year as I did last year and you can hear those episodes here. You will be able to listen and read along to what I wrote for the day. I like to practice what I preach when it comes to art so I am challenging myself to write and having you come along for the ride. It is my hope this inspires you to accomplish your goals with your art and if you would like to share what you are doing email me at timothy@createartpodcast.com History of NaNoWriMo and NaPodPoMo NaNoWriMo: National Novel Writing Month began in 1999 as a daunting but straightforward challenge: to write 50,000 words of a novel in thirty days. Now, each year on November 1, hundreds of thousands of people around the world begin to write, determined to end the month with 50,000 words of a brand new novel. They enter the month as elementary school teachers, mechanics, or stay-at-home parents. They leave novelists. NaPodPoMo: NaPodPoMo* is a month-long event along the same vein as National Novel Writing Month aka NaNoWriMo. The difference? Well, instead of writing a 50,000-word novel, you podcast every day for 30 days from November 1st-30th. Use any platform you desire. From full production studio to iPhone app and just about anything in between. The goal is to use the challenge of podcasting daily as a form of podcasting boot camp. The Writing So Far Good evening, everyone and Happy November 26, otherwise known as Black Friday here in America. So today, I wrote nothing, nothing at all. And that's okay, because I was having what I like to call lived experience. I went out this morning to Richmond, Virginia, which is about an hour south of where I live. And I stood in line was the 10th person in line at Record Store Day down at plan nine, which is a record store in Richmond, Virginia. And the whole way down there. I was listening to other podcasts. And specifically I was listening to Alec Baldwin. Yeah, his podcast. Here's the thing and Alan Alda has clear and vivid. In while I was doing that I was thinking about a interview that I'm going to be doing next week for my other show find a podcast about and you can find that at Find a podcast about dot XYZ. But I was being inspired while I was driving, which is a usual thing for me. And that's what I did today. That's the creativity that I did today. And that's the whole thing behind this podcast that you're listening to, is to be creative. You know, I know I say it. Gosh, this is episode 101. And I always say, you know, tame your inner critic can create more than you can sell. Well, today what I needed to do was be quiet was be present for what was happening. And what was happening was quite simply that I needed to not write today. And I am fine with that. Sometimes you have those times when you don't need to create you need to be inspired by that which is around you. And today I definitely do feel inspired because of the long drive. Because of what I went and did. Behind me. I'm playing Leonard Cohen's songs of love and hate, which is that album is now 50. It's celebrating its 50th year anniversary. I also bought Miles Davis, live slash evil, which is also celebrating its 50th anniversary. And I bought you to Gloria and I also bought Jimi Hendrix live in Paris 67. So right now I'm just listening to records, enjoying my family. And that's what I needed to do today. The novel will keep on going. I'll be working on it. You Not tomorrow morning while I play with my girls, while we watch cartoons and eat donuts, and you'll get another installment tomorrow. But today, I just needed to be silent. I needed to be around those that I loved. And doing the podcast recording, this is easy enough, I have everything, everything set up in a template, if you couldn't tell. And I know I talked about it at the beginning of the year on, you know why it's important to set up your show or set up whatever you're doing and have gold for yourself. And this is one of them. So I just thought I would talk with you right now. And first off, let you know that I appreciate all of you that do listen to the show. Secondly, I appreciate all of you that have been following the novel as it progresses. I've never written a full fledged novel. And when I started it last year at National Novel Writing Month, and national podcast, postman I was like no, yeah, I'll get you know, this novel done in a month. Sure. And I didn't, I didn't get it done. I got the 50,000 words, but I didn't get the novel done. And this year, I'm looking at the calendar. And we're getting close to the 30th. And do I think I'm gonna get it done? I'm not sure. I don't know, I might. I would like to get it done. So that way I can take it to its next phase. But if I don't get it done, that's okay, too. That's not a huge problem. Because then I can just keep on writing. Yeah. But I'm in a good spot with a novel. I am happy with it. It needs editing, it needs auto correcting. As you all know, and as you as you have been following along with what I've been writing, it is not perfect. But you know what, it's the novel. That is perfect for right now. Tonight, I will be going to Well, let me tell you what else I I went to a place called Patriot subs here in Fredericksburg, Virginia and had to Chicago dog. And a reuben sandwich. gave each of my girls a big bite of my reuben sandwich in there. Well, one girl liked it, one girl didn't. And I also got to cannolis mini cannolis. Again, one girl liked it one girl didn't are twins. That's what happens. Got my wife to Chicago hotdogs and to cannolis. And she was very appreciative. And then, you know, we just sat back and watched a, a baking challenge show on Netflix. And we've been, you know, having one of those kind of days. You know, just sometimes you need that nice, lazy day. And that's what we had today. And that's what I had today. And that was with my family today. Right now I am with you, no matter you know, where or when you're listening to this. I'm here in your ears. I'm here with you. And I just want to let you all know that it's okay. It's okay. You don't have to create every day. I don't create every day. But that's why I like these challenges because it gets me gets my juices flowing. And I'm already thinking about hey, what am I going to do in 2022. And I'm wondering what you're gonna deal. So the other thing I wanted to say is that I will be doing a poetry reading over at the place where my nephew works, which is couture a coffee shop, he does a poetry reading every Friday night. It's an open mic meeting. And I really enjoyed going to it. I am by far the oldest person there by 10 or 15 years. But when I go there and I hear these young, these young whippersnapper kids, when I, when I hear them read their poetry and read their stuff, I do overlook I whatever, you know, former, whatever silliness that they're doing, and I really pay attention to the content of what they're trying to say. And the older I get, the more I want to just, you know, wrap them all in a big hug and say it's going to be okay, you're gonna be alright. Because, you know, I wish somebody would have said that to me, way back when, and maybe people did say to me and I just wasn't it wasn't I wasn't ready to hear it at that time. That could be it. I don't know why I have a couch right next to the microphone. So that way I can go ahead and self analyze myself. But I'm going to be doing that tonight. And then after that I'll be grabbing doughnuts for my girls and then tomorrow, we'll get back to writing. So I want to encourage you in your practice, whatever it is, whether it be dance, painting, sculpture, music, writing, whatever a crafts, whatever art is your art. You're good enough, you're smart enough and Gosh, darn it. The guy behind the microphone here likes you. Alright, I really do. So have a great, as we call it here in America Black Friday, it's the Friday after Thanksgiving. Myself, I made a point to support local businesses. Do whatever you want. I mean, you know, support local businesses don't support any business. Right, Jeff Bezos, head of Amazon into your Will you in whatever you want to do. It's up to you. But I would ask you to take some time and reflect and pause and be with your family and be with those that are around you. That love you, and have yourself a great night. So this is Tim signing off for today. Timothy Kimo, Brian, your head instigator for create our podcast where we help you tame your inner critic breed more than you consume. And sometimes while we just need to sit on the couch and let y'all know what's going on in my little head. Alright, see you next time. And yes, tomorrow I'll be writing. Okay, so thank you so much for listening to today's installment of shared diary. Reaching Out To reach out to me, email timothy@createartpodcast.com I would love to hear about your journey and what you are working on. If you would like to be on the show or have me discuss a topic that is giving you trouble write in and lets start that conversation. Email: timothy@createartpodcast.com IG: @createartpodcast Twitter: @createartpod Mighty Networks: Create Art Podcast

The Solarpreneur
2 Ninja Techniques to Get Your Prospects to Drop Their Guard

The Solarpreneur

Play Episode Listen Later Nov 26, 2021 18:08


DOWNLOAD SOLCIETY APP NOW!Speaker 1 (00:03):Welcome to the Solarpreneur podcast, where we teach you to take your solar business to the next level. My name is Taylor Armstrong and I went from $50 in my bank account and struggling for groceries to closing 150 deals in a year and cracking the code on why sales reps fail. I teach you to avoid the mistakes I made and bringing the top solar dogs, the industry to let you in on the secrets of generating more leads, falling up like a pro and closing more deals. What is a Solarpreneur you might ask a Solarpreneur is a new breed of solar pro that is willing to do whatever it takes to achieve mastery and you are about to become one.Speaker 2 (00:42):What's up Solarpreneurs Taylor Armstrong here with another episode as usual here to make your time as a solar professional, much more enjoyable. And of course help you close more deals, generate more leads and referrals and dominate the solar industry. So let's jump into the episode before we get into this one, to think all of you that have gone on to leave a review or share the podcast. That's what keeps us going over here at Solarpreneur and just super grateful. It's coming up on a Thanksgiving actually in a few days as I'm recording this year and want to express my gratitude to all the listeners and all the people that have reached out to let me know that something's helps you or I made it easier to close a deal or get that next lead. That's really what we're all about here at the podcast and love hearing your feedback.Speaker 2 (01:40):So thank you. Thank you so much for those who haven't done that and wanted to give a shout out as well too. We got a recent review from a sports master 92. He says amazing. I listened for the first time last week, my team was in a slump and I made all of my reps start listening and we have had a big turnaround that quickly have in we'll keep recommending sports master 92. I love sports as well. You rock. Thanks for the good review. And so today's episode, we're going to talk about something that has been helping me quite a bit recently want to give my man a Jason newbie, a shout out something that I didn't remember, but we've been doing some trainings here in our team correlations. And I started implementing a couple of these techniques and it's been helping me immensely.Speaker 2 (02:35):Just get people to open up more, get people to listen. And those of you that knocked doors, really anyone, whether you're knocking doors or closing deals, that's what we need. We need people to open up to us. We need them to tell us what they're thinking, because really that's how you're going to gain the trust. That's how you're going to know how to overcome their objections. And really that's the goal of any fact-finding you can do as you're sitting in these. You just want people to spill the beans. You want them to tell you exactly why they haven't gone solar. Exactly what their concerns are, because guess what they tell you, those things the deal's done. They just told you exactly how to close them. Because if you can overcome those objections and answer those questions that they're having answer the reasons why they hadn't gone solar yet, boom, it's a done deal.Speaker 2 (03:23):So today we're going to talk about two techniques to ninja techniques that help your prospects open up in a way that they wouldn't otherwise. And these techniques, they come from a book called never split the difference by Chris Voss, great book, recommend a hundred percent go read it. I need to reread it. I listened to it on audible, but ton of takeaways you can get from that book. And for those that haven't heard of the book, Chris' boss, you as an FBI, negotiator would literally negotiate with you know, people doing crazy things murders, I don't know, just all sorts of different situations. And he takes what he learned and talks about how we can apply those same negotiation techniques in the business world and in cells. And so two of his techniques, Hey, the first one it's called mirroring mirroring. I can pronounce it.Speaker 2 (04:22):And then the second one is called labeling. As I'm going to tell you a little story, and then I'm going to talk about these techniques and give you some implementations, how you can start using them right away. Okay. And so I was out knocking. This was just last week. I'll be hitting some doors here and we'd done this training pretty recently. We did a little exercise, which y'all, I'll talk about it for those leading teams. It's a great exercise. You can put your team through to help with these techniques, but I'm talking to this lady and she is super closed off. She's a neighbor of the deal. I just closed a couple of days before, and I was trying to get some HOA signatures, which I've talked about this before, but one of the best ways to little hacks to pick up some quick leads, go get those HOA forms filled out here in California.Speaker 2 (05:18):I assume it's probably the same with most Safeways, but here in California, you have to go get neighborhoods signatures. Typically for these hos saying that they acknowledge, they know that their solar being installed here in California. It's nice because the laws make it so they can't deny the solar, but HOA is still typically require this thing. So I'm going, I'm getting the neighborhood signature. And of course, you know, I'm going to use that to my advantage, try and get some more appointments as I'm getting these neighborhoods signatures. And typically every time I get, I fill out these forms, typically I'd get a couple appointments out of it because it's a great regard. He got a name to drop. They know you're an installing their neighbor. And if you just kind of slip it in there, Hey, we checked out. You haven't checked out solar before I view, they'll give you an objection, whatever.Speaker 2 (06:10):So I go do this. I'm with the lady she's being super closed off. Okay. Of course I slipped that in there. I say, Hey, I noticed you don't have solar. If you guys ever looked into it. And instantly, usually they'll have a conversation with me, but this lady just instantly closes off. She's like, no, no, not interested. No Mike, whoa. I wasn't even trying to pitch it because that's the other advantage. Usually people don't look at you as a salesman if you're just coming by to get signatures. Right. But this lady right off the bat, she goes on the defense. She's saying no, not interested. No. And just didn't want to start a conversation about solar at all. Even though I wasn't coming across as salesy. So I start thinking about these two techniques, Hey, mirroring and labeling. And I'm like, all right, I'm going to put these to the test.Speaker 2 (07:00):So she goes through I finally get out of her. I go, no solar, not interested, not interested and force her to replay. Okay. Here's the first technique. I'll explain these in more depth later. But mirroring is basically you repeat the last two words that they said, or you replete some keywords. They said in the statement and force them to elaborate. Okay. So she goes, oh yeah, not interested. No, it doesn't make sense. And I go, doesn't make sense. Okay. And what's she going to do? She has to replay, says, yeah, looked into it. Doesn't work for us. It doesn't work for you. I do it again. And what I'm doing, I'm forcing her to open up to elaborate on these things. And I noticed just from doing this, it worked way better than me being like, oh, why didn't make, why didn't it make sense?Speaker 2 (08:02):Why didn't you check into it? Okay. Cause what happens is people feel like they're being interrogated sometimes when you just go after him with why? Why, why, why? And this is what every other sales person is doing. Right. They're saying why, why haven't you gone solar? Okay. So I'm trying it this way. I'm putting the Chris boss technique to the test. So it doesn't make sense. She goes, yeah, we just have a low bill. And I noticed she starts to open up way more. She starts actually giving me reasons. Okay. And then I put the other technique in the use. The other technique is called labeling. And this is where you basically summarize what you think they told you, but you put a sound like in front of it. So she said, yeah, we have a pretty low bill. Nick's expensive. So I label that.Speaker 2 (08:57):I said, oh, sounds like soar was pretty expensive when you looked into it. And she goes, yeah. Yeah. She starts telling me basically all the reasons why she didn't go solar. Okay. And I will say, I didn't end up booking this appointment. So it doesn't have a happy ending, but I did throw these techniques into place. And I noticed I got way further than I probably would have just do my typical stuff. Okay. Because typically I would just do though, why haven't you done it? Oh, well, solar different now. Here's why XYZ. But what I was doing, I was getting her to open up, open up. I was again having her, tell me all the reasons she hadn't done it and doing it in these ways with these techniques, it made it way less threatening because especially with someone closed off like this, the more you can seem like you're not trying to just be the typical sales guy trained to interrogate them.Speaker 2 (09:57):The more they're going to open up to it. So she opened up way more. Still couldn't get her to buy on an appointment. But she told me all the reasons she wasn't spending much of money. She was too busy. XYZ tried to overcome it. Couldn't but I got her to actually start talking. I got her to elaborate how much she was feeling. Okay. And I'm noticing that as I do this, people are talking way more, not only in, on the doors, but also in appointments as I'm sitting in appointments. Oh, Taylor. Yeah. You know what? Our bills are too low. Oh. Sounds like you guys looked into it before and financially didn't make sense. Yeah. We looked into it a long time ago. We looked into it like three years ago and it didn't save us any money. Save you any money. Yeah.Speaker 2 (10:51):Cause we were expecting to save a bunch and only saved us like five bucks a month. Okay. There may be. You find out that they're expecting to save, I don't know, 10 bucks a month. It's all about expectations. These are ways you can figure out what their expectations were. Hey, so you can use this with pretty much anyone, anything and anyone, any objections, but you can also use it in your daily social situations in Chris Voss talks about this, just using it in conversations. It's a way to get people to open up and just listen. Feel like they're being listened to more. Okay. So those are the two techniques and I'll read a little description of them. Okay. The first one was mirroring and that's again taking two to three key words and repeating them. Yeah. Solar is too expensive, too expensive. Yeah. We looked into it before and it costs like 40 grand, 40 grand.Speaker 2 (11:52):He just labeling or sorry. Mirroring is repeating back two to three keywords and using it to gather Intel. Hey, and then it expands what you know about them in their position. Hey, that's textbook definition right there. And then the second one again is called labeling. And that is where you basically summarize what they told you. Hey, by using, oh, seems like it costs a lot back then. Oh, sounds like you guys didn't have a good experience with what you're looking at. And those are the two. I think those are the two key phrases sounds like, or seems like, seems to be the one that Chris' boss uses more than anything. Hey, and it's important. Another thing I dug up as, as, as, as kind of researching, a lot of us tend to do phrases like, oh, what I'm hearing is, or I think, okay.Speaker 2 (12:54):And as you do a first person phrase like this, sometimes it can signal that you're the number one priority. And we don't want it to come across as, this is what we think. Okay. We want it to be about them. Cause what do people care about brain trees? Tracy says, w I F M right? What's in it for me. That's all people care about. It doesn't matter if they're saving money. It doesn't matter. What's in it for them. And what do they want? That's what these two techniques are going to dig, dig up is what do they really want? And if you can make people think, oh, this product has what I need, what I want. That's all they care about. Right? They don't care about savings, but they care about saving the planet. You're going to hit on that. And that's how these techniques can be effective.Speaker 2 (13:47):Okay. So make sure you use them again. That's mirroring and labeling, and this is just a crash course on it, but great exercise you can do with your teams. Maybe you're leading the team. Maybe you're managing or go bring this back to one of your trainings. If you're just, you know, maybe you're not managing, but go take it back to your teams. Go practice this a great exercise. We did that got me thinking way more about this is in our meetings. We had someone just go up, stand in front of the room. And he started off with like a statement. And then we just went down every single rep that was in that room. And we did either a mere statement or we did a label. So for example, I think the rep started out with a, yeah, it's been a really tough daily. I don't know, start out with just something random.Speaker 2 (14:39):And then the first rep in front, he had to say tough daily. And then the guy in front of the room, he said, yeah, I didn't get a good grade on my tests. XYZ. I don't know. He started expounding on that. And then the second one, and then you go down the line, then the next person he could do a mirror label. So you could do all sounds like it's been rough times lately. And then you're just constantly getting the person in front of the room to elaborate on what they said. Obviously keeping it in line with the topic. You're not going way off topic. Yeah. You're keeping it on track and you're trying to dig up relevant information. So think about that as you're knocking or as you're out there, closing deals, use these two techniques mirroring and labeling. Hey, it's been a game changer for me.Speaker 2 (15:28):So probably my two takeaways from the book and go read the Chris Voss book. Sorry. My mind just drew a blank. Yeah. Anyways, we'll post to it here in the show notes, go read it. Let me know if you have any takeaways or things you are using from the book. We'd love to hear it and would love to hear any other ways you're using to mirror and label your prospects in your deals are on the doors. So go out, apply this, send it to someone that has been struggling to connect with people, to book appointments out there in the neighborhoods and hope you have a great Thanksgiving. If you're listening to this before or on or after Thanksgiving, whenever it is make sure to be grateful, a great episode on gratitude. We had probably six months or so back and go look Earl Kapule. He is Mr. Gratitude. He talks a lot about how gratitude gratitude has been a game changer in a solar cells. So don't forget be grateful and all that you do keep your gratitude, gratitude journal, and let's go out and crush it this week. Go close some deals and I'll see you on the next episode. Peace.Speaker 3 (16:45):Hey, Solarpreneurs quick question. What if you could surround yourself with the industry's top performing sales pros, marketers, and CEOs, and learn from their experience and wisdom in less than 20 minutes a day. For the last three years, I've been placed in the fortunate position to interview dozens of elite level solar professionals and learn exactly what they do behind closed doors to build their solar careers to an all-star level. That's why I want to make a truly special announcement about the new learning community, exclusively for solar professionals to learn, compete, and win with top performers in the industry. And it's called the Solciety, this learning community with designed from the ground up to level the playing field to give solar pros access to proven members who want to give back to this community and help you or your team to be held accountable by the industry. Brightest minds four, are you ready for it? Less than $3 and 45 cents a day currently Solciety is open, launched, and ready to be enrolled. So go to Solciety.co To learn more and join the learning experience. Now this is exclusively for Solarpreneur listeners. So be sure to go to solciety.co and join. We'll see you on the inside. 

Profit For Coaches
Giving Thanks

Profit For Coaches

Play Episode Listen Later Nov 25, 2021 12:18


For some of us, 2021 has been incredible for our business, and we will be grateful for that and give thanks. Some people, however, have not had a great year; in fact, this year may have been terrible for you and your practice, but you can also give thanks. Whichever way your year went, there are reasons to be grateful, even if they don't seem obvious. Today, I explore why now is a great time to evaluate the year and give thanks for the good and the bad. I explain why gratitude is a good tool for assessing your goals and offer advice on how to take lessons from negative elements of the year. I also share a framework you can use to find gratitude in any situation and how being grateful for the past year will help you positively finish Q4. “You can have gratitude for anything in your life if you put it in the right context.” - Jos Willard This week on Profit for Coaches: Why gratitude is a great tool for reassessing and tracking goals How to learn from negative experiences A framework you can use to find gratitude in any situation How looking back with gratitude can help you finish the year in a good way The FREE eBook you can access today! Our Favorite Quotes: “The last part of Q4 is a good time to look at the things that you are grateful for.” - Jos Willard “Don't you let 2021 be known as the year that only did bad things for you.” - Jos Willard “Decide that you are going to be grateful for this thing that, up until now, you had decided was a terrible thing because it taught you XYZ.” - Jos Willard Helping Coaches Increase Profits Thanks for tuning into this week's episode of Profit for Coaches. Love the podcast? Head over to www.lovethepodcast.com/Profitforcoaches to leave a review! Don't forget to subscribe wherever you get your podcasts so you never miss an episode. Apple Podcasts | TuneIn | GooglePlay | Stitcher | Spotify Be sure to share your favorite episodes on social media to help me reach more great coaches and visionaries, like you. Join me on Facebook, Twitter, Instagram, and LinkedIn. For more exclusive content and information, visit our website and grab your free copy of The 4 Must-Haves for a Profitable Coaching Practice e-book.

The Accountability Coach: Business Acceleration|Productivity
How Big Thinking Can Grow Your Business

The Accountability Coach: Business Acceleration|Productivity

Play Episode Listen Later Nov 18, 2021 8:15


Do you surround yourself with dream squashers or are you surrounded by individuals who listen to your dreams for your business and urge you to pursue them? Do you think big for your business? Do you look at where your business stands today and think, “this is good enough” or “what if I try something new and it upsets the successes I've attained?” Do you give yourself enough credit to allow yourself to dream big? Remember, not every big dream has to come to fruition of a “mission accomplished.” But, every big dream may have a kernel of an action step that will help you think outside the proverbial box and could potentially spark a new idea to do something you're currently doing better, faster, or at a higher level of income producing effect? How Can Big Thinking Grow Your Business? Take a moment and ask yourself: What is your dream for your business? Do you want to be the next Amazon or Uber? Do you want to be the biggest XYZ firm in your city or part of the country? Are you looking to take your business nationwide or worldwide? Do you even allow yourself to have those big dreams? Many business owners, when asked, “What is the big dream for your business this year” will say: 1. I'd like to bring in an additional $1,000 a month. 2. I'd like to grow by 10% in clients and income. 3. I'd like to outsource some of my tasks. 4. I'll be happy to maintain the status quo. 5. I hadn't even thought of a big dream… I'm just trying to maintain my current level. This is what I call “expectation” thinking. You expect to stay where you are and that thinking leads to your getting exactly what you expected. What if you allowed yourself the audacity to say, “I'd like to grow my income by $5,000 a month” or “I want to exceed last year's sales by 50%”. What's stopping you? Is it because you're afraid to think big? What do you think would have happened if Henry Ford hadn't thought big? Would we have had automobiles? Every successful business started out as a small idea that was pushed to higher levels by an entrepreneur who thought big. Big, audacious goals don't have to become setbacks if you didn't achieve a 50% higher sales revenue. If you shot for 50% and achieved 30% isn't that a big win? It's certainly a bigger win than a 10% increase. Although if you'd considered a 10% increase you would likely have met that, but would it feel as good as aiming for 50% and attaining 30%? Probably not! How can you become a big thinker in your business? 1. Ask bigger questions. When you think big, you aim higher. When you think big you push yourself out of your comfort zone and take a chance. It's exhilarating to take that leap. Ask yourself, “What would life and my business look like if I grew the business by 40, 50 or even 60% this year?” There is no harm in asking those bigger questions. In fact, the answer to “what would it look like” may be the motivating factor in your pursuing that big goal. 2. Network with like-minded big thinkers. If you surround yourself with entrepreneurs who are always asking, “what if” you may pick up their energy and start asking your own business “what ifs.” If you surround yourself with people who are happy to go with the path their business is on and not take a detour, you will likely be pulled down that complacent path. Involve yourself with big thinkers and you will feel more comfortable announcing your big goal! Find a mastermind group of big thinkers to help you, might be an option. 3. Find out where other big thinkers got their start. Did mega-companies like Amazon, Apple, Microsoft, or Uber start out as successes? What is the backstory – the origin story for those businesses? When you know the humble beginnings of mega companies, you may find the inspiration to think bigger yourself. If those company owners hadn't been big thinkers and pushed their businesses toward large goals, they wouldn't be companies we would have heard of, right? Don't let yourself get mired in the past. If you'd tried something in the past and it didn't work, let it go. Pull that information out and ask yourself what went wrong, how you could change that today, and what experiences do you have now that you didn't then that can help? A past “failure” is simply an experiment that didn't pan out. Don't let a fear of failure stop you from thinking big. Ask yourself, “Don't you want more?” If that question makes you uncomfortable or makes you shout, “yes!” Then get started today on your next big idea! Consider these six ideas you can implement today to help you think bigger. 1. Ask bigger questions. 2. Network with other big thinkers. 3. Find big thinking experiences and join in. 4. Look at origin stories for other big thinkers. 5. Don't discard or toss out any idea, no matter how audacious it seems. From that huge, big thought may come your next spark of an idea that will grow your business! 6. Ask staff for ideas they might have to accelerate your business growth. When you're putting your big idea into practice, don't forget to plan for the infrastructure your business might need to support this big idea when it comes to fruition. Write down your income goals. Write down your goals for hiring new team members. Get a picture in your mind of what your life would look like when you achieved that big thinking goal. Don't put it off any longer. It's time to get busy! If you need help thinking bigger, reach out to me today to schedule your complimentary 30-minute consultation. Aim for what you want each and every day! Anne Bachrach The Accountability Coach™ The Results Accelerator™ To help you stay focused and on track to achieving your goals, check out these other high-value resources. Subscribe to my high-value business success tips and resources Blog https://www.accountabilitycoach.com/blog/) - Subscribe to my YouTube channel with business success principles (https://www.youtube.com/annebachrach) - Connect with me on Facebook (https://www.facebook.com/TheAccountabilityCoach) - Connect with me on Linked-in (https://www.linkedin.com/in/annebachrach) - Connect with me on Pinterest (https://pinterest.com/resultsrule/) - Connect with me on Instagram (https://www.instagram.com/annebachrach/) Take advantage of all the complimentary business tips and tools by joining the Free Silver Membership on https://www.accountabilitycoach.com/coaching-store/inner-circle-store/. Go to https://www.accountabilitycoach.com to check out for yourself how I, as your Accountability Coach™, can help you get and stay focused on you highest payoff activities that put you in the highest probability position to achieve your professional and personal goals, so you can enjoy the kind of business and life you truly want and deserve. As an experienced accountability coach and author of 5 books, I help business professionals make more money, work less, and enjoy even better work life balance. Check out my proven business accelerator resources by going to https://www.accountabilitycoach.com/coaching-store/. Get your daily Accountability Minute shot of a single, simple, doable idea, so you can start your day off on the "right foot". You can find The Accountability Minute on https://www.accountabilitycoach.com/my-podcast/ as well as on most podcast platforms and in most English-speaking countries. Author of Excuses Don't Count; Results Rule, Live Life with No Regrets, No Excuses, and the Work Life Balance Emergency Kit, The Roadmap To Success with Stephen Covey and Ken Blanchard, and more.

Gut Check Project
Brain.FM Dan Clark & Kevin Woods, #64

Gut Check Project

Play Episode Listen Later Nov 18, 2021 79:02


Eric Rieger  0:00  Hello gut check project fans and KB MD health family, I hope that you are having a great day. It is now time for a new gut check project episode and guess what? Brain FM is in the house. That's right. Brain FM ceo dan Clark and chief scientist, Kevin Woods. Join us on the show today to talk about an incredible application of sound improving your life solving anxiety, sleep issues. Focus just an incredible tool that I can personally say I've used now for well over a year so as my family so as kids who has kids family, and so have several of our patients, they love brain FM so I don't want to spoil a single thing is an awesome, awesome episode. So let's get to our sponsors and get straight to talking to Dan and Kevin. We of course are always sponsored by atrantil. My co host Kenneth brown discovered, formulated and created atrantil to give to his patients to solve issues that are similar to IBS to give them all the polyphenols that they need for their daily lives whether they be athletes or they have gut issues or they just want to stay healthy. Go to love my tummy.com That's love my tummy.com Pick up your daily poly phenols today and of course unrefined bakery, let me just say some unrefined bakery. My wife is gluten free eater. She's got celiac disease. So I stopped by there and I picked up from unrefined bakery for my wife's birthday. I nice pumpkin pie. It was delicious. You would have no idea that was a gluten free product. It just tastes like awesome pumpkin pie. So go to unrefined bakery.com If you've never ordered from there before use code gut check and save 20% off your entire first order they deliver to any of the connected 48 and or you can you can just stop by go to unrefined bakery.com If you happen to be in the north Texas Metroplex area, and I think they have four locations. So just check them out and they got awesome stuff cupcakes, breads, various snacks that otherwise you may think I have to remain keto or I have to remain gluten free now. I can't have these awesome foods. That's just not true. Check out unrefined bakery.com today use code gut check for 20% off and last but not least go to KB MD health.com. And soon we will be featuring the signature package of course which includes atrantil CBD and of course you can also get not only CBD and atrantil there you can also pick up so if you're feigns That's right, Brock elite and broccoli pro exclusively available from physicians and guess what my co host he's a physician so we get to sell it and we bring it to a cost that you can't get anywhere else. So check out KB MD health.com Today Alright, let's get to some brain FM right now.Hello Gacek project fans and KB indie Hill family welcome to episode number 64. I'm your host Eric Rinker, joined by my awesome co host, Dr. Kenneth Brown. And honestly you got a an awesome intro to make here for everybody.Ken Brown  3:52  Yeah, so we're super excited. This is something I'm extremely passionate about because we have the CEO and the lead scientist for a product that I believe in. I love I have my patients use. I have my staff use I have all my family use, and it is called Brain FM, this if you have any trouble focusing if you have any trouble sleeping, if you have any trouble with anxiety, there is a really, really cool way to correct this. And we've got the owner and CEO, Dan Clark here, and Kevin JP woods, Ph. D. Super smart, and they're going to explain to us why well quite honestly why it's so effective on me why it's so effective on my patients. And one of the most exciting things we've been trying to do this for quite a while now pre pandemic, we realised Eric and I realised that when we tried this on a few patients at the endoscopy suite, not only did patients have a better experience, they were calm going into it. They woke up quicker and almost you vigorously every patient loved without question. And so I'm so excited because they're here in town visiting from New York because we're going to end up actually doing an official study where I think it's going to be groundbreaking. I think we're going to be able to change how people feel about outpatient procedures like colonoscopies decrease the anxiety. And it's not just anecdotal. It's because there's science behind it. There is a growing movement with this, and I am just absolutely thrilled episode 64 is probably going to be our biggest episode, ever to date.Eric Rieger  5:33  I would imagine so and I don't want to take away time from you all feeding in but just so that y'all know, this is 20 months in the making, I mean, Coronavirus, COVID hit, and derailed all of our effort to really we should, we should be 20 months further down the road of actually implementing this. And it's really for patient benefit, which is what we talk about here all the time. This will enhance the experience, I believe, for people who come through and have procedures. So, Dan, Kevin JP, what's happening?Unknown Speaker  6:02  Yeah, glad to be here. Thanks for having us.Eric Rieger  6:04  Well, thanks for coming all the way down to Texas. How's Dallas, amazing, amazing. NotUnknown Speaker  6:09  my first time in Texas, everything is enormous. The streets are three times as wide as they are in New York. I tried across the street, and I just keep on walking. Keep on walking.Eric Rieger  6:19  Well, awesome. So yesterday was your first time to join us at the GI suite? And for honestly, I don't want to steal anything. But what was your impression that you thought you might see on an application of your technology? And then how do you see it fitting in kind of how Ken and I have been trying to experience it ourselves?Unknown Speaker  6:39  Yeah, sure. So first, let's maybe tell everyone what the technology is. And then we can talk about how we jumped in and started this whole process. The backstory is actually interesting. So basically, brain FM, we make functional music designed to help people focus, relax, or sleep better. And mostly, we have a consumer product, where we have 2 million people that use us to jump into focus or switch into relax, or help them sleep. And we've been having really great success there. We have papers and some things in review in nature, which we're really excited about. So it's evidence and science backed. There's some really novel ways which we use music to basically switch you into that state. And I'll let Kevin, jump into that maybe come back to that and some of the science. But what's interesting is while we're chugging ahead on that, what my girlfriend actually she starts going to get a tonsillectomy. And she's signs her life to me, we're dating for six months, I now know we're in a serious relationship. And, and I realised that I'm terrified, and I'm not even getting surgery. And she's very scared. She's never been under before. And I realised at that point that we can use the same things that we're using science to advance on our consumer angle, we can use it in relax in a medical grade setting. Remember calling up Kevin and saying, Hey, can we do anything? And he starts looking at the literature, he starts looking at other things. He goes, Yes, I actually think we can improve it a lot. I pitched that to you guys. When we met. Yeah, like I think we met probably three months later. Just a coincidence. And you'd love the idea. And that's when we became here. So it's really cool. It's been definitely long time in the making. But it was amazing. When we were doing it some some yesterday. And then one gentleman woke up. And he was so he was so he was almost emotional. He was so happy. He's like, every single time I wake up, this is like the worst or most traumatic thing that can happen. And I was using this music and I woke up. And it was it was it was fine.Unknown Speaker  8:46  And I've done this several times before without music. Yeah.Unknown Speaker  8:49  And that's the thing that we're trying to do is how do we help people relax into surgery, and then wake up, non groggy alert, and in being able to get on with their lives without, you know, making this traumatic, because a lot of people are so scared. And I know for me personally, it was really cool to see you guys doing the art form that you have, because I was able to see that it isn't scary. There's this there's this almost like divider between people that are non medical and medical have and for being able to cross over it and bring a bridge, using some of our music, I think is really what we're set up to do.Eric Rieger  9:27  So it's interesting that that, honestly, it was really awesome. I think that the first person that y'all got to see feedback from was somebody who was so engaged and immediately wanted to tell you all about it. And I only just want to just so the audience understands exactly what Dan's describing because it was awesome. So kid, I saw this multiple times before they even got here when we use brain FM as an experiment, but essentially this particular patient, he wasn't high high anxieties per se for him his singular case, but he had a history of waking up erratic very emotional, hard to console, not very comfortable in his surroundings as he was emerging. He even told you all, he feared how he was going to wake up. Yeah. How would you describe that you saw him wake up.Unknown Speaker  10:12  My goodness, he was he was happy. He looked straight in the eyes. And he thanked us on a personal level. And that meant so much. And just knowing that he had those prior experiences, and that he saw such an enormous difference, and I remember him saying, How can I recommend this to people? How can I tell people? Whoa, hold up, we're not ready for that quite yet. But yeah, he was ready to tell the world he was just so excited. And theEric Rieger  10:38  credit, the greatest thing is, it's non invasive, meaning that I don't have to inject a new drug brand doesn't have to use a new scope tip or something new, gigantic piece of equipment. I mean, this is something that we can apply. It's practical. And it's gave us real results in appreciable results. AndUnknown Speaker  10:57  it's enjoyable to absolutely. And that's the thing about music is it is familiar to people, they understand it. And yet we have this music with a scientific twist on it. Right? We have a dive into the science later. But you know, it's not exactly the music that you know, but it still is entertaining and fun to listen to. And as something that can distract you, while you're you know, lying there maybe worrying about the procedure you're about to undergo. So, you know, it's art and science coming together in a really special way. Yeah,Unknown Speaker  11:25  yeah. And I think what's cool about it is, to Kevin's point, people for 1000s of years have always used music, right to be able to control their environment, right. And, you know, there's been people that have tried with this in medical settings. But it's, it's always lacking some of the results, some of the things that are proven in science that this can make a better experience, what we're really trying to do is combine both worlds between, you know, auditory neuroscience with Kevin's background, and with a product that can be brought into these experiences that isn't, is more than a placebo. It's something that is shown to have an effect, and it makes everything better. So it's a win for the patient. It's a win for the the clinic, it's a win for everyone involved, because everything just becomes a little bit easier with something that everyone's already used to, which is music.Eric Rieger  12:20  Again, I know that whenever you've had to had conversations with patients before they come in for their very first colonoscopy, the level of fear and anxiety for somebody who simply has never even endured a procedure before it can be very real, and oftentimes occupies a lot of the time in the clinic for either you or Megan, or one of the nurses or the MA's to really kind of talk them off the ledge. So what have you seen incorporating something like brain FM so far?Ken Brown  12:46  Alright, so my personal experience, before we even get to the patients, I would say that, but what I really liked is that my day begins. Every every morning, I start my day, I switch from the evening brain FM sleep, because I go to sleep with it. So my day begins was switching it to focus. I come down, I do my French press, which I say French press because Eric gifted me this French class, he's like, dude, quit, quit using drip coffee. It's like French press is the way to go. That's why boil the water, I have my brain FM on, I'm in the focus mode, I put that in focus, because I know within five minutes that my brain is ready to really do this, I'm put the coffee on. I do the French press fire up the computer. And then I start looking at my chart. So within 15 minutes, I am literally ready to roll. Because there's a lot of stuff I have to do. I then go to work to go work out, do whatever I do in my day. And then when I come home, then my wife and kids know this. And everybody has. We all use brain FM we all use it for the exact same things. My kids use it to study, I use it to get my day going, and I use it to put myself down. So I'm such a big believer. And then when we had our first what 30 People that we did at the endo centre, yeah. It's very easy to say, hey, trust me on this. I've experimented with it. All my employees use it. I use it, my family uses it. And what, just like you said being on the other side of this medical experience, even will today Nasreen was talking to these guys. And she said, even though I've scheduled 10s of 1000s of these when it was my turn to do it, I was nervous. And we gave her brain FM to do and she said to you guys, that immediately I calmed down. And now she's had several different procedures since then, and she doesn't care at all. She's like, I know, I'm gonna get in there. I know, I'm gonna wear this, I'm going to calm down. I know I'm gonna go to sleep, and I'm going to wake up and it's going to be refreshing and I'm going to feel good. So she can now tell my patients that she's like, Don't worry about a thing. Because one of the things that really and you and I talk about this all the time and we've had several podcasts, colon cancer is the second leading cause of cancer death in the United States. Colon cancer comes from colon polyps, we have a cure. And you saw that yesterday you are with us, we have a cure. So you and I have this urgency that if you're anxious about having a done, if you're scared, if you know somebody that had colon cancer, if you know somebody that complained about their colonoscopy, anything to get you into the clinic to get those polyps removed, because it saves your life. So now, when we have this opportunity to offer something, to make it a more, a more pleasant experience, not only more pleasant, because we're going to get into the site, we keep saying we're going to get into the science because that's coming the thing, that's the coolest thing. And I'm I want to thank both envision healthcare and and search, that they're being open minded about this. I'm really excited to get all my partners in G IA, looking at this, because I really kind of feel like this is a win win win win. We spoke with Dr. Ackerman, who's been co host, multiple, multiple times, when we spoke with Dr. Ackerman. He said it he's like, yeah, he's like, you just it's it's a no brainer, it's zero risk, potentially might help. And this is somebody who hasn't used it yet. When he realises he's like, Oh, when I said potential, I should have changed that word. He's like, it'll help. And that's what we're gonna end up trying to figure out. So what I love about it is it is just a way to say, look, get it done. Any worries you have, I'm gonna take one layer of that away, the second you show up. And that's what I'm excited about. Because ultimately, it's just a way, if you're worried about it, just make the appointment. We'll handle everything else. Yeah,Unknown Speaker  16:45  I think it's it's interesting, too, because a lot of people that at least from my experience, right, the first time you're going to something like this, you focus on these negative thoughts. So you're trying to push out of your head by using music, which we're used to. And again, we'll get on the science last time we hear that, but it's something that we can focus on something else. So instead of the fears or something else, we can focus on the music that we're listening to, and know that we're in really good hands at a centre that's willing to invest in technology, and try new things. For better patient experience.Ken Brown  17:20  I would like to just comment on that right there a centre that's willing to invest in technology. You're exactly right. Because when you've been meeting with people, they're saying, you know, we would like to be the Apple version of delivering health care like this.Unknown Speaker  17:33  Yeah. I mean, well, it's interesting, because if you look at Apple, right, why, why do people want to be Apple, it's because they do things more, they're not the first to do things always. But the first to do things extremely well and extremely thought through. So they take their time. They they're not, you know, first to market sometimes, but other times they are and they when they are they're the dominant factor. And I think it comes down to really finding solutions that truly do work that truly do make a difference. And that are long term solutions rather than the not right. And when we're talking to other people that are looking to be the apple of healthcare, it does take an investment, it does take a chance, like a leap of faith into trying something new. But I think that the the return on that are exponential in patient satisfaction and repeat visitors, people that are actually showing up for appointments because they're less scared because we have a solution for that. But but more with with all the other things that we're learning on as byproducts like efficiency and helping so that's the stuff that we're really exciting, because it's still focused on patient experience first, but there's so many other things that come from patient experience being better. Let meKen Brown  18:49  get your take on this real quick. Since you guys did see this from the other side. Yeah, you saw what happens with me and my partners with the staff with the camaraderie how everyone there really is there for one ultimate goal and that's to take care of people to help in any way we can, meaning that we can fix diseases. I just want your take on the how the patients felt and where they came through. And certainly when we started using the technology, because people do need to hear it's easy for a doctor to say oh go go get this done because you should but I love that you're like this is the first time I've seen this and it's it's it's beautiful to watch how you guys as a team. Yeah, everyone.Unknown Speaker  19:32  Well, I think it really comes shines through that that's true and everyone it has a great teamwork. I went from my perspective, it looks like everyone's there because they're like we have to be a players because we're saving people's lives. And that comes in from the RNs that we saw from the people in the lobby from from how you guys are showing up and and giving great bedside manner joking around everyone's having a good time. because you guys are in a great line of work where you're, again, saving people's lives, and even just talking to some of the the nurses there in our ends, you know, they're not just trying to make the experience where they're processing people, I thought that was really great. Where it's not like, oh, let's get this person with an IV and all these other things as fast as possible. It's like, no, like, Okay, you're sensitive, you've never gotten a needle or an IV or whatever. Let me figure out how to make it. So it's less obtrusive, or less intense. And I thought that was really great. And that's when why we're so excited. We're trying to say, hey, we're gonna add this brain FM thing into it. And they're like, that's gonna make our job even easier. And that was, that was really fun to say,Eric Rieger  20:43  I love the fact that that's what you said, because what I see brain FM being, I know that it's for the patient, but truly, the person who's going to see the benefit repeatedly is going to be the nurse who's already trying to be exactly what you said, to make sure that it's not a cattle call for the GI centre, or really any surgery centre. Yep, that wants to be appealing to the patient, but at the same time, allow their staff to all be really really good at not everybody is great at talking or, or joking appropriately with a patient and make them come down at ease. But if you could have something that was somewhat of an equaliser, yes, yes, that's been proven and tested, etc. That looks to me like something like brain FM could easily fit that mould really decreasing the burden on the staff that's checking.Unknown Speaker  21:31  Absolutely. And we were talking earlier about the fellows that we saw yesterday that had this great experience coming out and said that, you know, in previous cases, that he'd come out crying and distress and you think, not only the stress on him, but the stress on the nurses that would have to, you know, deal with them in that situation and calming down, and how that loads day after day on nurses that have to deal with that. Right. And, you know, to be able to relieve some of that burden is just absolutely enormous. And by the way, and what I saw at the centre yesterday was, you know, not only the nurses clearly care about people, but also just extremely efficient, and how quick the process was people with people going through, you know, and I had never been to a GI centre like that before, did not know what to expect. We were struck out. Yeah, how fast the whole thing was, it was amazing.Unknown Speaker  22:17  Yeah, I think investing, you know, in something like this is investing and also your employees, you know, they see that we were talking to believe it was Alexis. And she's like, this is ice 1000 People wake up a week. And I'm just today I can tell you that those people are waking up faster. And that's, that's something which, when, especially now trying to hire people in the in the world that we live in right now, you want to work at a company that is leading the charge and is something that you can feel really good about working there, because not only are they taking care of you, but they're taking care of everyone else. And I think that that really shone through yesterday as well.Eric Rieger  22:56  I think we're really lucky honestly can have G IA in this position to help us do this. Because it seems to me like this this lot. And we've talked about this on the show before but this company wants to be a an innovator, not just some big Gi Group. They want to help establish what should be some some good norms instead of some of the the throwaway old norms they want to be the ones that emerge southern think this is this is only going to pay a compliment to that.Ken Brown  23:23  Yeah. And I want to point something out when you're talking about the efficiency and all that, you know, let's what you did see is the efficiency in the preoperative and post operative, but you saw in the room that it was consistent, it was Eric and I focused. My technician, Mackenzie, we you guys saw that. It's just it's right there. It's the same process. And so by not worrying about the patient's concerns, or the concerns are alleviated when they come in, and I know that they're going to wake up in competent hands, I get to focus 100% on taking care of what I'm looking at with the endoscope. Eric gets to focus 100% on making sure that that patient is sedated and I work as a team and you saw how that is that the the flow of the room. And that's what's beautiful about the centre there. We're at that, although it's the efficiency sometimes people think oh, well, that that feels like you're moving too fast. No, the spot where we slow down is in that route.Unknown Speaker  24:22  Right? Yep. Yeah, we definitely saw that. Yeah, by efficiency. I just meant as a as somebody coming into the centre for procedure, I would be out of there in less than an hour, which was amazing to me. I always thought that outpatient procedures and you know, my take all afternoon I'd be sitting around all day, did not see any of that. It was really amazing.Eric Rieger  24:41  Yeah, it is a whole nother dynamic. Beyond that and why this is a good setup. But I do think it's a great setup because we huge exposure for something like brain FM so we can really prove this concept. So let's get into it. What in the world is brain FM? How does it work? He's rubbing his hands together.Unknown Speaker  25:00  Here we go, here we go. All right,Ken Brown  25:02  before you even get into this, let's at least can I, I love being around I love being the stupidest person in the room. And yesterday, I'm by far, I just felt like I'm just like playing catch up with Kevin all day long. It's just that you are wicked smart, and certainly have the credentials to prove it. And the way your passion towards this you the whole story. So before we even get into the science, oh, I was out last time.Eric Rieger  25:35  I was trying to follow the flow here.Ken Brown  25:38  How in the world? Did you become a PhD in this? Like, what is the path?Unknown Speaker  25:43  Sure, sure. Well, let's see. I was first interested, I think in the study of consciousness, I want to understand subjective experience. Why it is the case that we should experience anything at all rather than nothing? Why isn't it the case that humans are simply zombies with nothing on the inside, but you know, objects in the world, that kind of thing? Well, it turns out, it's hard to make a living as a consciousness research researcher. But it is possible to make a living as an attention researcher. And of course, attention and consciousness are very closely linked, at least in the sense that you tend to be conscious of what you're paying attention to. So I went into attention research in neuroscience. And within attention, I went into Auditory Research. Being a lifelong musician, just interested in sound in general, there's something magical about sound, right? It's ephemeral, you don't see it, it's in the air. And yet, it's so important to our daily lives, as you're experiencing right now. And so there's this magic about it. And I want wanted to understand, you know, the principles of how do you attend to sound in the world, right. And often, we're in these situations where we're trying to listen to the person talking to us in front of us, but there are other people talking around us, right? Or maybe we're on a busy street corner. Or say we're listening to a piece of music and just trying to hear the guitar part, but ignore the drums. And so there's this notion of a spotlight of attention in listening to things, right. And with the eyes, it's simple to understand how that happens, because you can move your eyeballs around, and you can point your eyes and things right? Well, we don't point our ears at things. We do that with our brain, right? And so if I'm sitting at the dinner table, and I want to listen to the person next to me, instead of the person in front of me, I don't have to turn my head to do that. I do something in my brain, right, that changes the spotlight of my attention so that I'm eavesdropping, right? And what is that process? How does that work? So I became very interested in that. I studied it in undergrad and then then went on to grad school, and did my dissertation on something called The Cocktail Party Problem, which is exactly the problem I've just described. And again, you know that the eyes being a two dimensional sheet, objects already arrived on the retina separated, right, but the eardrum is not a two dimensional sheet that your drum is a one dimensional receiver where you just get pressure over time, sounds mix in the air before they arrive at the ear. And it's the brains problem to unmix those sounds right? This is absolutely fascinating computational problem. So I study that for seven years. And in the process of doing that, I developed some methods to do online auditory experiments, which hadn't been done before. And long story short, you know, the, the old guard in auditory computational neuroscience would have said, Oh, I have have to bring people into my sound attenuated chamber, I have to make you wear my calibrated headphones. And therefore I can only run two subjects a day. Well, it turns out that if you do things online and use the right methods, you can collect 100 participants that day. And the date ends up being roughly the same, you know, with a few more participants, you can even out the noise that's otherwise introduced, but slightly messy online methods. It turns out, it's a massively more efficient way to run experiments. And one day, by chance in the supermarket, I ran into an old colleague of mine, so excited about these methods, I went on and on and on. And she had just hooked up with brain FM. And in that she was a consultant for them. Wow, bright brain FM, this, you know, wonderful company, they're doing functional music. And they really need somebody to, as you know, as a team of one to run lots of lots of experiments, behavioural experiments to figure out, you know, what is the ideal background music for doing, you know, XYZ. And I jumped on that immediately. I started consulting for brain FM, even before I defend what yours is,Eric Rieger  29:27  do you think, Oh, thisUnknown Speaker  29:28  would have been 20? Nothing? No, no, no, no. 1819 2018 Oh, yeah. Yeah, bless. Yeah. Say I defended in 2018. Yep. And so six months before that, I was I was consulting with Brian FM and, and I remember the day that I defended my dissertation, I signed the employment contract with Brian. Nice, very, very happy day.Unknown Speaker  29:49  snagging right out.Ken Brown  29:51  any room at all? And theUnknown Speaker  29:53  rest? Yeah, the rest is history. And it was gone to do some really incredible things. We got a grant from the National Science Foundation to look into music for ADHD. Out of that has come a this beautiful piece of work that has behavioural experiments has fMRI brain scanning and has EEG, and another method of looking at brain physiology. And we combined all of these methods to essentially show how our focus music works. Yeah, the results are really great. The papers currently in peer review at nature. We're really excited to see how that goes. Yeah, so that's currently currently where we're at with brain FM. Super excited to explain how it actually works. But maybe, since Yeah.Eric Rieger  30:41  We have to round out and ask Dan. Dan, you mentioned maybe on this podcast, my memory is already fuzzy, but you didn't found brain FM but you hopped on it. The moment that you saw there was an opening so why don't you to go over how you got here?Unknown Speaker  30:56  Yeah, so I have a very interesting story that's different than Kevin so I, I started making websites when I was 13. I loved it. I thought it was like a nother kind of video game that you could play. And I am a sucker blackbelt. So I made martial arts websites made the first one for my school, and they went from getting 30 leads to 130 leadsKen Brown  31:19  sorry, somebody that's done martial arts his whole life. What second degree and what? Mixed martialUnknown Speaker  31:23  arts so it concentrated in jujitsu? Krav Maga, Muay Thai and Cuba.Eric Rieger  31:28  Sweet. Yeah, Lucinda Drew.Unknown Speaker  31:32  So yeah, so I did that for a while. And I went to make martial arts websites because I made it for one person. He's like, can you make it for all my friends. And before I was out of high school, I had 20 clients were dropped out of high school, ended up having, you know, 40 clients at one time. And so my first business when I was 20, travel the world and came back and I said, I wonder if I can do this again. Maybe I got lucky. And I started working with businesses and bringing them online and building lead generation businesses and started doing more and more complicated things like POS systems, I started doing digital advertising became digital director of a company at a like 24 years old. And from the outside, I made it you know, I was making more money than my parents, you know, like travelling around the United States selling million dollar contracts. But I didn't I hit this point where I didn't feel like I was as really like helping people like I did when I was teaching martial arts. Because we used to use martial arts as a vehicle to take a kid from being not really confident or sure of himself into a leader into being someone and I'm I'm an effective that I was really shy, I got bullied on mercilessly in fifth grade. I was a little chubby and, and martial art transformed me. So even though I made success, you know, financially, I didn't really find success success personally. And, you know, I had this life or death situation, which is a whole nother podcast to talk through. And I realised I need to quit my job, quit my job, I came across brain FM, like three months later, when I was looking for what I should do, I knew I wanted to work in tech, again, to help people. I remember using it the first time and being blown away. Because I used to work from 10pm to 4am, because that's where I could find my flow state, right. Like, I could find that magic zone where I could just jump into things. And I remember taking my headphones off the first time and being like, this is too good to be true. This is no way this is working. I was super speculative. And I was I was this is just music, right. And I remember trying I save 24 hours and then used it still worked. My diet still worked. And it was it was perfect. Because it was something that allowed me to switch into focus whenever I wanted to. And from then I was like this is going to be something that changed the world. I called the people that created the company like 12 times, I actually started working for free and absurdly the tech team becoming CEO and then purchasing the company. So wild ride, never never intended to do that. But along the way, you know, obviously Kevin, Kevin and I are together as well as a lot of other great team members. We're really trying to use brain FM as a tool to help people be their best self, their best best version of themselves. And while we are doing that consumer you know now we get to do it in the medical space and help people have best health that they can have. And that's something that's we're really excited about isEric Rieger  34:40  awesome stories it y'all linked by passion, which I find really endearing for the process.Ken Brown  34:46  So we're doing so at at atrantil and certainly with the practice and everything we really like to discuss what is the what is our collective why what is my why? What is the the companies Why if we're all on the same way, what I'm just hearing, I'm just writing little notes here. I'm like, wow, both you guys driven by the Why have you have this knowledge, Kevin, that you are like, wow, this could really, it's so I come from this music background and I understand this and I can do this. And Dan, you have this incredible like, this is where I came from I, I need to I'm it's not a money thing. It's a The why is how do we get everyone else on the same page. And we hooked up because we're in that car that one day, we were being shuttled to the to the meeting we're going to and the why was wow, that sounds like that could really help my patients and you're like, the more I think about I think I can and I like when the y's align. And you can move that forward and get more people doing it. The beauty of brain FM is that you can teach people that they are capable of their Why suddenly they can unleash that. So when I meet with so many people that have irritable bowel syndrome, and which is associated or small intestinal bacterial overgrowth, SIBO, Crohn's, ulcerative colitis where they're kind of consumed by negative thoughts and anxiety. And there's that brain gut access, that Kevin's nodding, because he's like, that's definitely the cool part. So I want to affect the brain by protecting the gut. Kevin knows so much about the brain that we realised we're kind of meeting there were so I think that this collective why if we could expand this circle of why into okay, we now know that am Serge and envision is getting the why they're like, yes, we can do this. And now we can get the why going with the doctors going, we all can have this collective why, which is one thing, how do we get more people to have a better experience in healthcare and ultimately, collectively improve the health of everyone? You guys are doing it to the brain? I'm trying to do it through the budget.Unknown Speaker  36:58  So yeah, well, that's.Ken Brown  37:03  So I love hearing that story. I didn't know that. I mean, we've talked to me for hours and hours. I did not know that's a really, really cool story.Eric Rieger  37:10  Just a brief primer on, on how we all linked up there, because you just barely hinted at it is we you and I had met in snow skiing together, you have snowboarding on snow skiing, had a great time. And then we decided to ride together for the summer meeting. Yep, to the same group and share a shuttle. No pretence at all, we just got hopped into conversation about how are things going. And it probably took about 10 miles or a 70 mile ride. Before we determine, wait a second, there's something there is something here. Yeah. And so anyway, that's that's just my short version on how I showed up here today.Ken Brown  37:49  I love it a lot.Unknown Speaker  37:50  So I guess without further ado, should we talk about what's here and talk about some of the science?Unknown Speaker  37:54  Yeah. Finally, all right,Ken Brown  37:57  now we're gonna get into some cool stuff. All right, this is if you are, if you're listening to this, get a pen and a piece paper out because this is cool, cool, cool stuff. This is not just listening to music, I love that.Unknown Speaker  38:09  And so the trick with this is always to make it you know, straightforward and understandable. And hopefully, you won't need pen and paper to understand what's going on here. So simply put, a lot of neural activity activity is rhythmic, right? These rhythms, slow, fast, everything in between. And the rhythms in the brain support, perception, cognition, and action, essentially, those three things that the brain does. One that you may have heard of, are delta waves when you're sleeping, that's probably you know, the most common widely known one. But their rhythms are all sorts of different speeds that support pretty much you know, anything that you're doing in your daily life. And the idea behind brain FM, is, it's music that's specifically engineered to drive these rhythms in the brain called neural oscillations, or if you'd like brainwaves to drive your brainwaves in targeted ways, right? To support whatever you need to be doing, right. And so for example, we know what brainwaves in the focus brain look like? They're at particular speeds in particular regions. And so what we do is we say, okay, let's use the odd, let's use the auditory system as input for neuromodulation. Right? And so how can we use an auditory input to drive your brainwaves into the state that we know supports focus, right? And so we figured out that out and that's what we have our paper that's coming out shortly on, but because the principle is using the auditory system as a neuromodulator it's not just a one trick pony, right? So we can support focus, we can support relaxation, we can support sleep, and now we're discovering that we can, you know, support people going under and waking up from anaesthesia as well. So it's really it's a delivery method for you know, driving your brain into whatever state you need for, for what you need to be doing. Right. And so again, this is, you know, it's what we call functional music, which we'd like to make the distinction between that and, you know, what you might call art music with a capital A. Right? Which is that, you know, in modern times with artists and albums, there's a conception of music as something that primarily exists for self expression and for beauty and to connect to your audience. Well, things haven't always been that way, right. And if you go back 500 years, 1000 years, it's not about artists and albums. It's about music that is designed to do things for people, for example, you know, a lullaby a lullaby is a perfect example of ancient functional music. Because the point of a lullaby is not to sound beautiful. Maybe you also want that, but the point of a lullaby is to put a baby to sleep. Right? And similarly, you know, you have music that was used to help people do physical labour, right? Or music to march to if you're in an army, right? And the point of marching music is not to sound beautiful is to make people walk in lockstep, right. Another good example is dance music, right? And dance is a perfect example of this principle of rhythms in the brain and rhythms in the world. Which by the way, is called entrainment. That's a concept that you may be familiar with, which is, rhythms in the brain reflect rhythms in the world?Ken Brown  41:22  Yeah, what threw me off a little bit. Sorry.Eric Rieger  41:24  Just to catch up on everyone on on the vocabulary. I want to hear your just brief explanation of neuromodulation Sure, I've entrainment is another might have been one more, but just just to keep everybody on the same? Sure.Unknown Speaker  41:35  Sure. Sure. So neuromodulation is just a broader term that refers to, you know, inducing a change in the brain through an external stimulus, right. It could be a magnetic field, it could be electrical currents. But it could also be sensory stimulation, right? In this case, auditory system. And treatment is a form of neuromodulation, where you're providing a rhythmic input to induce a rhythmic response from the brain, right. And so you have this oscillating system, neural circuits of the resonance frequencies. And so you're basically pushing on this neural circuit in a rhythmic way and a response in a rhythmic, rhythmic way. And because the brain has this property of training to things around it, then you can drive the rhythms in the brain to help support what you need to do. Okay, which is, yeah, we're where I started. Yeah, it's pretty straightforward and simple example of that coming back around as dance, right? That's one that everybody understands. You hear the rhythm and the music and your body moves to that. And that's entrainment and what's called the auditory motor system, right? And also, by the way, if you want to know, how quickly does it take for brain FM to kick in, which is a question that we always get asked, I asked back, Well, how long does it take between when you hear dance music? And when you want to dance? Yeah, right? The answer is, it depends on how closely you're attending to the music, right? It depends on how intense the beats are. And all that's true for brain FM as well. But you know, the real answers, maybe 30 seconds, maybe a minute, if you're not really listening, if you're in the right mood, maybe 10 seconds, right. But that's the sort of timescale and ballpark timescale when you're talking about rhythmic entrainment in the auditory system. And interesting thing about dance music, right, is that the functional properties of dance music are completely dissociated from the aesthetic properties of dance music, right? Yes, you can listen to music that sounds terrible, and still makes you want to dance. And that's a perfect demonstration of functional versus art in music, right? And so what we've done in brain FM is we've said, okay, you know, we know entrainment is the thing, but instead of, you know, relatively slow rates that you will bounce to, you know, you can actually drive the brand very fast rates that support focus, or very slow rates that support sleep. And that's anything in between, and everything in between. And that's the principle.Unknown Speaker  43:47  What's really cool about it as well is in addition to all the things that Kevin is saying, we're also able to do it through sound, where it's something that is not obtrusive, or it stops you from what you're doing. So for example, in focusing, it's it's not something that you have to watch, or like meditation, you meditate, and then you focus this is as long as you are doing the activity. So what's nice about it is usually our work is visual, to why adding music to it, it's allowing us to focus better and work like we normally would. And the same thing in hospitals, right? And in the clinic that we were just at is this is music that you put on top. And it doesn't take away from the experience. People can still you know, hear what you're saying instructions, it's not something that they're putting over their eyes. One interesting thing about music compared or sound compared to light is what like one out of 18,000 people are epileptic,Unknown Speaker  44:47  right, the light can occasionally induce epilepsy, but music will not. Yeah, sound induced epilepsy is not only extremely rare, but it's also not due to rhythms. It's triggered by you know, things that have to do with your past. So the sound of a car crash or something might trigger trigger epilepsy for sound. Whereas with light, it's a very automatic thing where once you hurt once you hit a certain frequency of light flashing, you know, if you have that kind of photosensitive photosensitive epilepsy, it'll set you off. Not so with music, so it's extremely safe. Yeah, so,Unknown Speaker  45:19  so sound is really this perfect medium to apply to things that we're already doing, whether it's relaxing, sleeping, or going through surgery, but it's also something that's incredibly safe. Because we have all of these things that we've evolved to have that protect us from sound, the worst thing that can happen is maybe it's too loud. That that's, you know, very, that's, that's actually not even probably going to happen because of the way commercial headphones are made. You know, it's a very safe thing to add to your regimen.Eric Rieger  45:51  So what do y'all call this particular technology? And then how did you arrive at this technology? Because I know it's not the first iteration of utilising sound, you've even said, you know, it's been years ago from the lullaby to now. So what's this call that we're bringing in uses? Sure.Unknown Speaker  46:06  Well, I think we like to call it brain FM. It's it Yeah, it is. It is unique. We have, you know, patents on the process that we use to make this music because it is so unique, you know. Let's see. There are other methods of training the brain for example, you could flashlights that people like we were just saying, but you can't get your work done. If you're having lights flashed at you. Right? There's there's a conflict there. So Sam is really a great way to do it. Yeah, I don't think we have a really good name for the technologyKen Brown  46:40  there. Let me ask you a quick question. So I'm somebody that I own a different centre someplace else, like, oh, yeah, I heard this podcast you know what we're gonna do? I love Coldplay, so I'm gonna make everybody listen to Coldplay as they get in there. Because Coldplay does it for me. Explain the difference?Unknown Speaker  46:55  Yeah. So before we do that, I think so obviously, brain FM as a company, you know, we do have patents like, like Kevin saying, I would just say that every time we the reason why we call it brain FM is because every time we learn more, we actually grow and build and change brain FM. So it's an ever evolving thing, where brain FM was five years ago, and where it is now. And our understanding of the brain and even the music we produce different. As far as this of what we're making for health care. This is really brain health, that we're really focusing on as a pursuit, and it is different than our consumer product. And Kevin can share some of the things that we arrive to it. And it actually it's funny, because Coldplay was one of the control groups that we did that dimension. So when you when we first started talking about, hey, I think this is something that we could do. I think I share that story of my girlfriend. We were saying, I remember telling Kevin, I was like, Hey, can we make relax? We just play a relaxed music. And he's like, Yeah, we could but let me check to check. And he started finding all this free search, which I'll just like Kevin say, but it was just incredibly exciting. Because from that start, we were able to eventually build a product that blew the wall to off everything that existed so far, we can see that with science.Eric Rieger  48:14  So that's that's kind of where I was going. So I when you and I very first got engaged with this topic and what brain FM was. I think one of the first questions that can ask is how does this compare to some someone utilising binaural? Beats? Yeah, and then that that's really kind of what I was getting at is that that is more or less in, correct me if I'm wrong, but static in where it is. And just as you described, y'all have been evolving and finding new applications for brain FM proprietary applications. Whereas by neuro is a great discovery. However, y'all are evolutionsUnknown Speaker  48:55  on Yeah, I'll start and then I'll give it to Kevin. So you know, this, like we were saying before, it has been tried to be done forever. Sure, functional music lullabies those existed for 1000s of years. And then a lot of people are familiar with music that they they play to elicit a response. So when you go to spas, you hear the waterfalls and the relaxing, you know that because you're trying to have a relaxing experience. What we've done is we've taken that to another level. Now, to your point, binaural beats isochronic tones, those have existed for a long time. And that's when for anyone that hasn't heard about this is when you play one frequency in one year and one frequency in the other. And they basically combined in your brainstem, right? And that creates entrainment in your brain. But it's not as precise as what we're looking for. It still has effects but they're diminishing or they're not. They're not as rigorous as we'd like to know that this is 100% effective. So when we were creating brain FM, it was well this is something that's there but how How could we make it more effective? And Kevin, I'll share in a second, but the difference between is instead of modulating frequencies, we actually modulate amplitude. Mm hmm. Kevin, you want to explain that?Unknown Speaker  50:12  Sure. Yeah. So I can talk about by now binaural beats specifically. And Dan is absolutely right, you have two different frequencies coming in the two different ears. The difference between those frequencies creates beating in the brainstem, essentially, that if you were to take two sine waves of slightly different frequencies, sum them together, what you would end up with is amplitude modulation, basically interference between two very similar assignments. So for example, I've 400 hertz and one year 410 Hertz in the other ear, in the brainstem, I'm creating a 10 hertz amplitude modulation, okay, right dude with some of those things. Now, the issue? Well, there's several issues. One is that the brainstem was limited and how strongly it can pass those modulations up to the cortex, right, the cortex has a high level of the brain where all the interesting stuff happens. So even if you have, you know, it doesn't matter how loud those frequencies are in your two years, the the level of modulation created in the brainstem will cap out at a certain amount. But if you put that modulation directly in in each ear, instead of relying on the brainstem to produce it, you can get a much stronger response from cortex, right. So in terms of the strength of entrainment, and binaural beats is also about entrainment right? It's about producing this modulation, that then in trance cortex, the strength of that entrainment is much less than binaural beats because it is produced, because modulations produced by the brain instead of existing in the sound signal, right? A practical issue is that with binaural beats, you're limited to listening to tones. So when you listen to binaural beats, what you're hearing is, and one year and and the other year, I love that song. Exactly. No one loves that. Right? And so what we've done in brain FM is we found a way to insert modulation into music, right? So that it's enjoyable, and you get those effects as well. Right?Unknown Speaker  52:04  Yeah. And we can we can send over a demo if you want to stitch it to the end of this podcast so people can see here. Well,Eric Rieger  52:11  that's honestly one of the coolest parts is is the fact that y'all can y'all can put the effective portion of brain FM inside the genre that anybody wishes to listen to. That's right. It's one of the coolest things because I was even asking you when you were first describing Oh, is it? Is it country to go to sleep? And is it hard rock to wake up? And he said, actually, it's whatever you want, for anything that you want. And I thought that was the coolest explanation, because you're not limited to some type of genre, just simply because that's how you need to feel.Unknown Speaker  52:42  Absolutely. And to be clear, you know, most music is rhythmic, and therefore most music has amplitude modulation in it. But it's not targeted in the way that brain FM is, right. It's it's a byproduct of the artists doing their thing. So if you're listening to Coldplay, right, they have a mix of whole notes and half notes and whatever, you know, musical things are going on and do that they have amplitude modulation at all sorts of different frequencies happening, right? If they're at, you know, 120 BPM and they're playing whole notes, then they have, you know, one hertz or whatever it is maybe two hertz. But with brain FM, what we're saying is, okay, we know the frequency that we want the brain to hit. So we're going to directly insert amplitude modulations, at exactly 16 hertz, or, you know, whatever it happens to be, and make those the dominant modulation frequency in the brain. Whereas with music, you have all these overlapping frequencies. And you know, the, the target is to make it sound beautiful not to drive the brain into a certain solitary state. Right. And so, by the way, with Coldplay, we did this very large online study, we had 200 participants in this, we gave them a standard questionnaire called the profile of mental states looking at, among other things, tension and relaxation. And we had Coldplay as a control. We had brain FM, we also had another piece of music very fascinating. That was made by music therapists and was hailed as the most relaxing song in the world, it was used in multiple studies, it was shown to reduce blood pressure to similar extent as benzodiazepines to for people undergoing surgery. And we found that we beat that would be called Les by a mile. And we beat that song as well. You know, error bars were small relative to the difference between them highly, statistically significant. So that was very cool to see.Ken Brown  54:21  So the last part again, one more time, because it's based on science. And what I said Coldplay, kind of jokingly because I like Coldplay, and that didn't realise that they actually studied that. And so this was compared to a scientifically or supposedly scientifically derived music considered the most relaxing music in the world and I guess you paid yourself you like you went you just went immediately to the deepest water you could findUnknown Speaker  54:46  that's exactly right. We we did the hardest tests, we always try to give ourselves the hardest test. By the way, it's a track called weightless by Marconi union is extremely Google will you'll find it was CNR CNN article written about it, and we said okay, if this is the king of the hill, We're going to beat it. And we did. Wow.Unknown Speaker  55:03  Yeah. And we do that from some of the things that Kevin was talking about earlier, which were there's online experiments. So think about it, you know, we can actually test 1000s of people, and we know all the knobs to play. So not only are we doing these neural phase locking these amplitude modulation, we actually do other things in music, like 3d sound. So when you're in some of our relaxing music, we actually shift some of the sound from right here to left here, almost like you're in a hammock, sometimes, we have different BPM rates, different kinds of genres specific to make you feel more relaxed. And as we learn more about you, and what you prefer, we can actually have even a better response. And, you know, getting back on track on some of the stuff that we're doing with you guys, and hopefully more people in the future. We started looking at this from a science based procedure and saying, Okay, this is what the world says is the most relaxing music in the world. Let's beat it. And I believe it would be like, like 50 50% or 5%. It's a pretty pretty demonstrable, especially compared to,Ken Brown  56:08  just to clarify that was like, first iteration, you guys continually improve what you're goingUnknown Speaker  56:13  Oh, yep, yep. And now it just comes down to so we have improved sense and now it's comes down to doing clinical trials with real people to say okay, we've improved as much as we can outside the environment. Now let's make it better in the environment and continually testEric Rieger  56:29  one or something else that that you mentioned, Kevin, that I feel like is, is maybe even just glossed over as we're talking about comparing it to Coldplay or or waitlist, is you said benzodiazepines also. So now you're talking about comparing sound to a drug and a bit of die as a pain, of course, is what we use, if you're curious, that's verse said, that's out of and that's value. These are things that people religiously take for, as an analytic try to stop that. So the fact that you didn't just go to the deepest water and sound, you went straight to the heart of what we use and anaesthesia, chemically to allow people to alleviate their anxiety, and that's quite measurable.Ken Brown  57:11  Alright, so let's bring that up because you said religiously tape. But the reality is, is that benzodiazepines have an extremely addictive potential as well. Correct. So people that suffer from anxiety and using those medications to try and get through that there are tremendous rich,Eric Rieger  57:27  so in before we hit on that just just the array of benzo and benzo like drugs. I mean, it doesn't just stop with those three, you're talking also about Xanax, Ambien, senesce, those, all of those fit at some level to be maximum GABA agonist. So when you say that what you have by comparison is something that's effective. We don't know this today. But potentially y'all could be unlocking a way for people not to be dependent upon taking these drugs to to get better sleep to alleviate their anxiety, etc. Yeah,Unknown Speaker  58:02  I mean, this is definitely a road that we see could be possible. Obviously, there's a lot of work to be involved involved right now. But we do have testimonials of users that, like reach out and they say, Hey, I haven't slept well in 10 years. And I tried brain FM a lot last night, and I've been on Ambien, I've been on Lunesta, and I slept better than any drug I've ever taken. Right. And now we're I'm not here saying that this is a cure or treatment. Yeah. But this could be an alternative approach where maybe you can take less trucks, or you can do this before you try drugs, or, you know, whatever. And, you know, I think that gives someone more control and freedom.Ken Brown  58:41  As someone who tries to incorporate different lifestyle modulations to improve my life to try and incorporate these different things with my patients. When we talk about let's talk about benzodiazepine addiction, we can get into the fact that benzos works similar to alcohol. So I work with a lot of patients with liver disease, and we try and get over that. Well, the beauty that I really like about this is that just like you said, when you meditate to try and focus, you are meditating, and then you're going to try and have focus. What I love is I'll actually stack this kind of stuff. I will and Eric's a big sauna fan also. And so I will put my brain FM on I will go into the sauna, and I will do breathing exercises all at once. And I love is absolutely you know, it's I'm, I feel like I'm focusing on my breath. I know that I'm getting that neuromodulation that's going to happen anyways and start stimulating that area to try and do that. And I'm getting the benefits of the sauna that's there. And so just we're not saying that one thing does something or other but when we start on my lifestyle modifications, this is like one of the easiest as the other stuff you need a sauna like when I tell my patients I'm like you know sauna therapy is good. I don't have access to it. Okay, do you let's do some breathing and some meditation. I can't I'm super busy and whatever. Okay, how about just putting some headphones on? Yeah. How about that? Let's start with that and see what happens.Unknown Speaker  1:00:11  And it's something that, you know, one of the reasons why I was so attracted to the company in the beginning was, it isn't just for, you know, people that it is for everyone. It doesn't actually matter if you speak English or not, none of our none of our music is created with lyrics. And one thing I think we glossed over is actually we have in house composers that are makeup, that's gonna be my next question. Yeah. So we have people that have toured with some of the greatest bands ever, which, you know, I don't know if we can disclose, but some really great talented musicians. And they're, they're taking this in making this from a functional approach, where it's music that sounds great, it's music that has all the scientific effects, and all the knobs turned the right way to have the effect we're trying to, you know, get for the user. But it's also not necessarily music, that is going to be your favourite song. Because that's not the goal, right? The goal is to make an effect that can be measured in your brain, and is not just sometimes it's every time, whether you're trying to relax, you're trying to sleep, you're trying to focus,Unknown Speaker  1:01:13  and it's music that will sit comfortably in the background. So for example, with our focus music in particular, you know, a lot of people don't realise that. If I'm a music producer, normally, my job is to grab your attention. My job is to make music punchy, and make you sit up and distract you from whatever you're trying to do. Right. And so we've we've flipped the script on that, and we say, Okay, well, we know the tricks they're using to make music punchy and grabbing your attention. Let's do the opposite. You know, what can we do to make music still sound good and be entertaining, but help you work by not distracting you? Right? And because we have a different target than everybody else who ended up making different music than everybody else.Eric Rieger  1:01:50  So figuring this out, you some people say they're an audio file, I would say that You are the supreme audio file doctor. Yeah, no, no. But not not only that, you also play guitar. And we talked about this briefly yesterday. So when you have when when y'all team up with your composers to come in house to build stuff? Just just how does it happen? How do y'all know what sounds good for it to match together? And you're like that that'll work here? I mean,Unknown Speaker  1:02:19  absolutely well about it. They're much better musicians than I am. For starters, my job is to annoy the heck out of our musicians by saying, that's a bit too good. That's, uh, you know, that that melody that you made, it's too catchy, you know, oh, that that percussive part as normal music, it would be totally awesome. Yeah, right now, you know, we're not trying to grab people's attention. And so just sort of to remind them of the science and the target and that kind of thing. But,Eric Rieger  1:02:47  so what was the session? Like for them? Are they there for like, four hours, and they're cutting one track? Or?Unknown Speaker  1:02:52  Oh, they make enormous quantities of music. They're so good at it. In terms of a session, so they work in Ableton, you know, okay, yeah. So they have DAWs we have proprietary software that plugs into Ableton that helps us layer the science on top of music, essentially, that's what what's happening. And the principles of composition they use from the ground up, are meant meant to support whatever mental state right? So, you

The Inventive Journey
"Start Small With Your Purchases" The Inventive Journey Podcast For Entrepreneurs w/ Seth Goldstein

The Inventive Journey

Play Episode Listen Later Nov 17, 2021 36:22


Start small. Be methodical with your purchases. You might think you need XYZ to do your job. How can you go about doing that with what you have? Let's say it's a small business that once to start doing website design. You don't need adobe creative suite. You don't need this five hundred dollar a month piece of equipment to do stuff. How can you figure out how to do it with a text editor? How can you figure out how to do it with what you have on your computer? Or what can you use the trial for? A lot of companies give you a trial for a month. Try for a month. --- Send in a voice message: https://anchor.fm/the-inventive-journey/message

Prickly and Blooming
Texas Women: Laura

Prickly and Blooming

Play Episode Listen Later Nov 17, 2021


In this episode of Prickly and Blooming, Laura speaks with host Jessie Browning about taking care of herself after her first panic attack. She shares how that moment forced her to address many different things including her mommy drinking and how a Facebook ad motivated her to scale it back. She also discusses why she's at her best when she's a working mom versus being a stay at home mom. Episode Timeline: [00:01] Intro [02:44] Laura's relationship to Texas [05:36] Meet Laura [06:34] Her first panic attack [11:15] Taking care of herself [17:19] Virtual therapy [19:50] Her drinking journey [26:48] Stay at home mom vs working mom [36:15] Taking care of her health [42:32] Her walk with the Lord [46:09] Jessie's rapid fire questions [51:31] Contacting Laura Resources Mentioned: Enneagram Type Seven This Naked Mind: Control Alcohol: Find Freedom, Rediscover Happiness & Change Your Life by Annie Grace Dark Night of the Soul Standout Quotes: “If my cup gets a little low, I immediately feel it and I immediately know I need to do XYZ.” -Laura [17:08] “I stuck it in the garbage. I lifted up paper...

Working Without Pants - For Agency Owners & Consultants
206: Why To Consider a 4 Day Work Week

Working Without Pants - For Agency Owners & Consultants

Play Episode Listen Later Nov 16, 2021 8:44


Traveling or engaging in other activities outside of work is always great. But trying to fit in a full week of work in a three- to four-day period to accommodate these activities can be stressful if not approached correctly. Instead of feeling anxious about getting everything done, I've found it's best to re-prioritize work and focus on the essentials.   In this episode of the Working Without Pants podcast, I share my journey of how I've come to love a three- to four-day workweek while still being able to accomplish everything I need to.    My first tip if you're feeling overwhelmed while trying to manage work with play is to take a step back and ask yourself, “What happens if I don't get XYZ tasks done this week?” What you'll find is that many of the things you're stressing about can be pushed back without any consequences. Making this paradigm shift isn't about making an excuse to be lazy, but rather it's about supporting your mental health while being fully engaged on the days you are working.    Minimizing your workweek can actually bring about more productivity on the tasks that really matter and allow you more freedom to pursue your interests outside of work.   Want to work with me as an advisor? Visit jake-jorgovan.com/coaching Resources: https://www.vidyard.com/podcast/nopants/ https://contentallies.com/ https://www.leadcookie.com/

Real Estate Marketing Dude
How To Build A Never Ending Pipeline With Sherri Johnson

Real Estate Marketing Dude

Play Episode Listen Later Nov 12, 2021 36:53


Quite often on the show, what you'll hear me say is stuff along the lines of "Hey, you are just a salesperson chasing another check if you are only counting the commission as the real value of closing a transaction instead of leveraging your transactions. When I was selling real estate, the goal of the listing was not to sell the damn house, the goal was to leverage the house for additional buyer leads brand building, and certainly to solidify the relationship with the person that we represented. It's never a matter of just selling a house. So today, Sherry Johnson is going to walk us through exactly what she calls sort of the gold mine pipeline. She's a coach nationally. She's been doing this for years, and she's got a wealth of knowledge. She sold for almost 10 years, then went into leadership and management with a huge company, Howard Hanna Real Estate. There, she grew the sales volume of 750 agents from 600 million to 1.7 billion in four years. Today, she provides solutions for agents, individual agents, teams, large teams, mega teams, and also provides management and brokerage executive level coaching for companies.Three Things You'll Learn in This EpisodeWhy you should be running a business and not being a salesperson chasing a checkWhat the goldmine pipeline system isHow to grow your sales volumeResourcesSherri Johnson CoachingReal Estate Marketing DudeThe Listing Advocate (Earn more listings!)REMD on YouTubeREMD on InstagramTranscript:So how do you attract new business, you constantly don't have to chase it. Hi, I'm Mike way ambassador, real estate marketing. This podcast is all about building a strong personal brand people have come to know, like trust and most importantly, refer. But remember, it is not their job to remember what you do for a living. It's your job to remind them. Let's get startedWhat's up ladies and gentlemen, welcome another episode of the real estate marketing dude podcast, another Friday here, and actually, this show is gonna go live tomorrow. So this is like real time, like, I'm low on shows, and I'm loading up. But it's a good one. I was just on her podcast. And I know the last few weeks, I've been doing a lot more like training and whatnot. But I wanted to bring on a coach. And she's got a really cool system. Quite often on the show, what you'll hear me say is stuff along the lines of like, Hey, you are just a salesperson chasing another check. If you count the real value of closing a transaction that only commission you have on that deal specifically, and not leveraging your transactions, the next one. So when I was selling real estate, the goal of the listing was not to sell the damn house and it was gonna sell fucking house. The goal, the goal was to leverage the house for additional buyer leads brand building, and certainly to solidify the relationship with the person that we represented. Because it's never a matter of selling a house. Like my goal is to sell everyone for houses and under referred into for more relationships that I can read, rinse and repeat the same damn thing. So we're talking about running a business and not being a salesperson chasing a check. So our guest today is Sherry Johnson is going to walk us through exactly what she calls sort of the gold mine pipeline. She's a coach nationally. She's been doing this for years, and she's got a wealth of knowledge. So without further ado, let's go ahead and welcome Miss Sherry Johnson to the show. Sherry, how are you and thank you for joining us.Hey, Mike, thanks for having me. I'm excited to be on your awesome podcast and talk about this. Yeah, it's gonna be to be hopefully one of your best episodes I have, I think.Let's go in. I want you to tell everyone, just brief background, who the hell are you? Where do you come from how you been doing this, and then we'll get into it.Awesome. So I am in Cleveland, Ohio, born and raised, and I've been a real estate broker for 25 years, I'm going to 26 I was a top agent at a company we had two huge independent companies here in Cleveland. So I sold for almost 10 years, I then went into leadership and management with a huge company, Howard Hanna real estate. They're huge. We had, I think I had 750 agents in my territory after managing a couple of offices. Through the goldmine pipeline system that I created, when I was an agent, grew the sales volume of those 750 agents from 600 million to 1.7 billion in four years. And that was done through aggressively coaching and helping agents through the go my pipeline, but also, you know, going after being a listing agent, and as you said, selling three to five houses off of every listing and also, you know, getting clients for life and building a 90% referral base. So four years ago, or maybe now almost four and a half years ago, I started sharing Johnson coaching, which was a life goal of mine since I was 27 years old to have my own national speaking coaching and consulting company. We provide solutions for agents, individual agents, teams, large teams, mega teams, and then we also provide management and brokerage executive level coaching for companies and we are our preferred coaching company for some of the large brands. But at the end of the day, it's all about giving and adding value to agents to help them compete and win at higher level and grow really amazing businesses while working smarter, not harder. And, you know, not getting distracted by a lot of things out there. lead sources can come we're gonna talk about that, where can you go deep and one of those is with your database, or client base, also known as and I think we you know, there's there's lots of ways to do this business. I think agents just need to focus and have a system and a strategy and that's what I'm gonna deliver today for you with the goldmine pipeline. I have two kids by the way, I didn't mention that.Manage that you managed to finally get a couple kids in there through all this.I love my daughter Tori and 14 year old son Matthew, they're like little awesome individual. Many people they're just amazing. And they inspire me every day and I'm a big runner. I run half marathons and I love to run and I love I love real estate. I'm just like so stoked to be here. So thanks. Cuz you're amazing. And you were amazing on my podcast, by the way, sothank you. Yeah, well, um, let's get into it because you're exactly right. When you say there's a system, they're running this business. And I think we're the why so many agents like fail from the beginning is because they don't approach it like a business or have a system to it, they approach it, like you're working in for a sales position, and you're working for someone that hires you to go out and sell stuff each and every month. And you can't run a business that way. It just won't work. It just, it doesn't work. I mean, statistically, and I hate saying that cliche, but 87% of agents fail after five years. And that's because for reasons that's four out of five people don't make it. And I think a lot of it has to do with what they're being taught at the very beginning. Cold calling door knocking and you're burning people out, you're so you're taking like a bunch of sales, people who aren't even really sales, people are trying to mold them into salespeople, and then it just turns into an ugly mess. So let's get into this gold mined pipeline and start from square one, I want you to walk me through sort of give me what are we going to focus on first, and let's go through sequential order, so everyone could sort of follow it,I send out so you are the CEO of your business, you're gonna call yourself CEO, but you have to run out like a business, as Mike just said. And, you know, it's, it's not just gonna happen, like people, I think, get the get their license, and they mistakenly think that everyone in their sphere is gonna use them, which happens at some point, it will happen. But you have to have a plan. And we can't hope that people are just going to use, you can't hope you're going to do this business, you have to actually have a plan and make it happen, and be intentional and on purpose and what the goldmine pipeline is going to do for you. And what's so great about this pipeline, Mike is that it works, no matter what someone's current production is, okay, so if someone's already doing eight or 10, or 15 million or 20 million, they can use it to do 10, or, you know, to grow their business double or triple it, I have agents that are doing 100 million that use this system, everyone on their team is on it. So it doesn't matter what your current production is brand new, or you've been licensed for a long time. So it doesn't matter your years of experience, it doesn't matter your current production, this will create what I love the most which every agent, the reason 87% fail, is they don't ever develop consistent or predictable monthly income and they sell a house one month, don't sell a house the next month. And it's this ugly roller coaster issue. So perfectly stated. It's like, they just don't have enough people. And the biggest thing I've seen over these 26 years of leading and developing agents is that they have like two to three people that they focus their time and attention to over a 30 to 40 Hour Work Week, you've seen this movie, doing research for those three to five people. And they just don't have enough people that are having have conversations with enough people. And so while agents discount the ones who say, I'm not going to do anything for six to 12 months, they don't put them on a list, they never follow up with them. And what I say is opportunities are not lost. We didn't lose those opportunities. Those people went and bought a house eventually and listed their home with somebody else. So opportunities are lost, they go to someone else go my pipeline system will help alleviate that and not have that happen anymore. When you lose that listing. You know, agents will say to me Why didn't believe these people because they said they weren't going to do anything for a couple of months. And two weeks later the house is you know, frickin listed. And there's a sign in the yard or they see an MLS and they're like whiplash thinking How did this happen? And I'm like, Well, you didn't maximize the opportunity. And you didn't overcome their objection to listen, somebody else did. The what the goal my pipeline system will do is create consistent and predictable monthly income, which I love. So you're starting out and you want five grand a month or eight grand a month or 10 or 12,000 a month or more. You can create consistent and predictable monthly income by having more people on the list and taking everybody I mean, do we really care when I meet somebody at an open house and they don't know they started looking, you know, my line is hey, I work with you at your pace and your speed. Whether this takes two weeks, two months or two years I'm not going anywhere. Right and we take out that like Parana pneus of like I only want to work with you if you're ready now and and so when people like that they like that I'm not going to show houses for two years for God's sakes that's another problem people do but I'm saying is keep them on your list because even the two year person is going to sell in less than two years Okay, they just haven't wrapped their head around that yet. So what happens is they agents are spending all their time and attention on these two to three people they consider a buyers and if those things don't pan out Mike what do we have? We have like a big fat wellthis is what happens when you do I mean it's why the peaks and valleys everyone spends time on the two to three you close them you're like shit, I need two to three more. Then you spend two to three months trying to find those two, three more than you rinse and repeat the same fucking thing over and over again. And that's why the average agent only sells six to nine houses. I could trip over six to nine sales a year. But I want to point out something that you said, it's really good. You're right, you have to, it's like, you meet someone in an open house, you have a good conversation, you know that if they were ready now that they would probably work with you, you just either get that feeling or you don't. And same thing, if it comes off a lead online, you're like, hey, you have a good rapport with somebody, Okay, I gotta, this guy's gonna buy a house. But the problem is, he's not gonna move here till about nine months. So How the hell am I gonna stay in touch with them? Listen, folks, if you just like continuously, every time you communicate with them, for the first time that you meet them to the time they're ready, if it's always about work, you're fucking slick salesman, at least in their eyes. And there's a way to humanize and nurture that relationship through other ways that you're not always having to talk about work, like trust me, once you meet someone first, and you establish the point that your agent, like, great, I got your an agent, okay, but doesn't mean that every time you talk to him in the future, you're gonna be like, written by anybody where he saw you already. So think about that salesperson that did that to you. Usually, it's in the form of a financial planner. And every time they come up to you, they just keep coming after you, you're like, your ego ready to go, we're gonna go dinner, like, I know, you're trying to sell me something, and then we get turned off. So I'm really interested to see how you're going to position this Go right ahead, keep going.So the goldmine pipeline will actually cast a wider, bigger net, so that you're having more conversations with more people at varying stages of their home buying or selling process. And so some of those people are going to be a, but that might look like a right now, some are going to be be some are gonna be C and then in the pipeline, where we define a, b, and c is like, A, it's going to be 70. In the next 60 days, they're given Lister or bi, B would be up to six months, and C would be over six months, right? And what happens is we actually take your list instead of Mike, everyone has a list of leads, and we take the list, and you actually monetize the sales value of each of those people. So if you're in an average $400,000 market, and you have 10 leads, that would potentially be listing prospects, even if you haven't even spoken to them yet, you just know they might be a possible listing. And even when you know you're getting 10 of those leads for 100,000 apiece, we're at 4 million already right now, just intend. Now you say okay, Sherry, I've got 20 potential sellers, at varying stages of ready to sell. Now I met 20 times 400, a pop or $8 million. And I haven't even talked to you about your buyer side, potential client relationships yet. So think about this. So now go to page two on the form, and the strategy and we're gonna look at all buyers, okay, same thing, identify what timeframe they're in roughly A, B, or C ranking, and then put a value for them. And when we add that up, and it's 10, we've got another 4 million if it's 20, we have another 8 million. And so if you have 20, buyer leads and 20. Let's do it. So it's many of you do, you're sitting on what I call unrealized business, when you look at it in terms of monetized value, not because we look at people as $1 sign sale, but because if you saw what's on your pipeline right now, and it was $16 million, I think you'd feel like the Rockstar agent that you are or could be, right? So coaching is not making people great. It's actually bringing out your potential of what you have. And you just don't realize youhave given potential.When agents come to me and they say, oh my god, here's a here the two bad examples everybody resonates with. They come to me and they say I have these three things that are happening. And I'm going out of town for you know, four days. I said, okay, can any of them happen before you get them any signed before you leave now? Okay, great. Let me know if you need anything. Well, two of them got listed. When was one was an expiring listing for 350 that got listed by you know, it's sold, actually. The other one got listed. It was 215. And it was that lifted by another agent in the office. She lost that so both those deals are gone. Before the four days are up. She comes into my office. My name is Jane, God bless her and she says you're not going to believe this. And I said why? She said my buyer that was going to write for 450 bought a for sale by owner. And I said, well, obviously you have other people in the pipeline. She said no. And this is what we hear. I was counting on those three things. She's crying, she was counting on a commission. I'm gonna sucks people. This is not how you This is why you are failing. And so to be totally blunt, it's like, oh my god, okay. So now as you said, we have to start over 90 days, two months it takes to cultivate, so then conversely with a better story, so you cannot just have three eggs and The basket people, it just it's not the way to do this business and you'll hate it. It is an up and down financial roller coaster. And again, any one of those blows would have been would have sucked just one of them all three, she didn't have if she had 25 or 30 more people to go talk to you, okay, she could have absorbed those hits. And then and and failures, you know, as out of her control a little bit. But like she could have gone to those other 25 to 30 leads, she didn't have anything in the backlog. So on the on the opposite spectrum. I had an agent come to me, one of the office and she came in and she said, You know, I feel like a loser 15 year veteran. Okay, she said, I feel like a loser. I said, Well, you're not a loser. She said, But I only have four buyers. And I said, Okay, handle the forum, I said, how many people you're talking to about listing their house? And she's like, well, I have a lot of those I said, are touch that have a ton of them. They said, Well, what's a ton? And like she said, I have 25 of those at least. And I said, if 25 listing leads, and you're telling me you're a loser, right? She said, Yeah. And I said, How many of those people are moving out of state? And she said, none of them and I said, Okay, so you have 54 pieces of business right here. Go fill this out, write down the numbers, fill in the blanks write down that value of each one of those potential sale, she came back 12 and a half million dollars. Okay, she's hugging me. She's feels like 10 She feels like 10 million 12 million. And And the truth was she about a 225 average sale price. And what I what she said to me, Mike is this, and this is where we fail again, she said to me, Well, none of these people are asking me to list their house. And I said they're not going to like we know what to do when a lead says Hey, Mike, I'm ready to sell my house. Hey, Cherie, like, I'm ready to go, I already bought a house and moving my leases up, I've already sold my house, I need to do this. Now. We know what to do when people call us. And when they do. What happens for these agents is it shows up in a blue frickin Tiffany box with a white bow on it, it's a gift. It happens once in a while. And it doesn't certainly doesn't happen often enough for people to make 150 or $350,000 a year. So if you want to be an agent that's making more money, you have to go make this happen. And so I said to her, they're not going to you have to add value and get yourself appointments of these people and get them excited about moving and go see their house. And so once you fill this pipeline up, she had, again, 54 pieces of the business 24 or 25, listing leads, and 29 buyer sides. And I said to her, you don't have any dialogue scripts, or talk tracks or strategies to get an appointment. So you need to come to life coaching each come i training and Thursday, whatever it was, and I'll teach you how to get appointments. So we fail, and we suck miserably as an industry at adding value to convert leads into clients and then getting appointments. So if you you could actually work a smaller number of people and just be more effective with a better strategy and get more business than trying to throw you know, whatever.I mean, these are these are conversations. All right. These are. So these are so in would you say within the last three to six months? What's what's timeframe, like how often? What should we call these as like conversations that you guys have had, whether you're buying or selling with consumers, over a periodof what? Well, whatever it takes. So people stay on this list really until they buy or die or tell you to stop calling and most people are not going to tell you to stop calling unless they have bought something. So I followed up with it with a lead from an open house Mike for 11 months, I didn't show houses for 11 months, I followed up with a 45 second voicemail that I left people that said, hey, Sherry Johnson, with XYZ company, I sent you some less days I'd love to show you these houses when you're ready like no this day or this day. They didn't call me they didn't call me. And there are many coaches out there that say after someone goes shoo, you know, dump them after the third time. That's not my strategy at all. If they're just not calling me back, that's okay. I actually would call and laugh and say, Hey, tell me if you want me to stop calling and I will. But I probably won't. I'm gonna I'm gonna call you again next month. I'm going to call you again next month. And what happened is these folks were like, in the 11th month, which coincidentally happened to me November, they said to me, Sherry Johnson, you are the only person that stayed in touch with us. We'd like to listen and sell our house. Can you come over this week now? I was like, yeah, and then I and then here's what's crazy. They listed and bought with me and then less than two years in less than two years they did it again. And that time the house I sold them was for it was a 450 list and they bought for 650 and this is a repeatable and the fortune is in the follow up people it is how long did it take me to make those two calls a month, right? It did. I made two calls. Add value, I stayed in touch. And really those people had I not stayed in touch with them 11 months. So here's what's cool. The Goldmine pipeline is like the Alaskan pipeline, it goes on forever. And you're sitting on a goldmine if you build a big enough backlog of people, like I used to sell 75 houses. And I had about 125 good leads on my list at all times. And so you can very mathematically with my formula, figure out exactly how many people have to be on the pipeline that you're going to convert over, you know, the next 636 12 months, you need business six months from now. So when somebody says they're not ready, that's okay. That's awesome. I actually need business eight months from now, because I don't know where that sales gonna come from. And this is funny, Mike, this actually came from me sitting around as an agent, saying, where's my next deal coming from? I did about three and a half million my first year in 1996, when we still had books, and we weren't online, really MLS books. And, and I was like, where am I getting my next sale? So I would write down everybody, because I'm even remotely talking to you. And then I would write down everybody about buying. And I would add it up. And I would I would be like, Look, I could do 8 million look, I could do you know, it'sfunny, I used to run around the notepad. That's how I kept track, as I said, but the white notepad and I remember having like 10 pages of people, I would just go through those names every day. And I would write my last notes. There's no system of follow up, and it's okay, follow up on this one, or I'd add it to my paper calendar. And follow up on it. So let's get into the communication part. Sure. How are we staying in touch? What's the conversation? Like? Are you reaching out on phone? Are you hitting any given them through email? So let's just take the average person that you have a conversation with, but I think where people get stuck is like, alright, they're not ready. But what the fuck do I say to them during this time? So like, let's get through the nurturing content? And how are we nurturing these people until they're ready, because you can't, you have value but you can't always be like, by you got it, it's there's a thin line, right? There's a you can always just be like, you can't be that slick salesman, but you can also be that non aggressor either, because that also says something. So what is the communicationyou're doing? Once somebody comes into your fold into your environment, they go on everything, right, you get their email, and you add them to your, your, your Facebook group, that's a private group that only your clients and past clients and family friends referral sources are in, you start to build a relationship with them. And, you know, if you identify at the beginning, you say here, I have an exclusive homebuyer guide that has everything I need to know about buying a home, I tell agents to take the explicit homebuyer guide, we give them one, but if you don't, if you already have one, and break that into like 15 emails, if they're gonna buy with you and list with you, you use that campaign and you say, it's never too soon to have me over to look at your house, I'm not coming to list it. I mean, I am coming to list it. But I want to come there first and see the house. Because I add value to the process before you go to Home Depot or hire a contractor. I can tell you, I could save you time and money and tell you exactly what to do with that slight floor in the back hall that you're thinking needs to go because you haven't sold a house in 15 years. And you don't know that today's buyers love slate. So you can add value early on. And then what happens is those people are like, You know what, we met you and now we're excited and the interest rates and this and that, we're gonna move it up, and now we're going to buy and move sooner. So I would put them on a very good email campaign doesn't have to be complicated. You don't have to spend a ton of money on a CRM, you can if you have a CRM, these come with those, you could just develop 16 emails that go out over time, with different points where you would say, you know, I'm still here, I'm if you're looking, if you're ready, still thinking of making a move? You know, for your SI people, I think your follow up, you know, a lot of times people make the mistake of thinking a C person is a C person six months after they put them on the list. And it's like, they could have changed, and you just, you're remembering that you made them a C, but that was six months ago or three months ago, they might see people turn into eight people very quickly. And you want to be the one that maximize that opportunity. So I would I would call them I would put them on an exclusive buyer program. Like everyone says, Well what's so exclusive? Well, it's yours number one and you are different than every other agent. So if you don't know that sit down over the weekend or this tonight and say what am I doing that's different than everybody else. My homebuyer guide was my listing tool like I used it as a prop and it got me more listing appointments because I would talk about the buying side but then I would quickly sort of identify you know, I want to come into your house that helps me to see your house while I'm out looking for a house for you. I can see your room sizes, your furniture, colors, things you love about your house and you You heard about your house. And they're like, Oh, no one's ever done that. That makes sense. And I just say, that's how I do things. I want to come see your house, what's in their house. Now we're talking about listing it. Now we're talking about a time frame. It shortens the sale process. And if you all would listen for like a second, here you are salespeople, like we said at the beginning, and your job is to get appointments, like nothing happens. You're not going to write an offer, not going to write a listing contract. If you don't have appointments in your in your schedule this week, it's not going to happen again. And I don't want that to happen is you have bills to pay and your whole family thing. Sure, you know, outworking and I want you to be in that 13% That's actually making money. So go my pipeline, over time should be carried around with you. And when you get lower, you start to see that you sold everything, if Bill your calendar by going back to that thing and saying okay, well to a bar.Like seriously, just go out to a family party. Okay, get together, like, oh, yeah, you have Thanksgiving, like this time that Thanksgiving, Christmas, Halloween, all the parents that were just trick or treating around the neighborhood's 10 to 15% of the people that you're walking around are moving this year, and all of them have referral for you. But here's what we're talking about is talking about building your audience building your list over time and building the wider net. She mentioned something that was important. The Facebook group, not all communication always has to be about real estate, that drip campaign should references just one touch through emails. But if they're also the Facebook group, or friends on Facebook, she's probably also talking about the news restaurant in the community. Right, right. She's also talking about a picture with her fabulous kids. She mentioned earlier, I'm sure it's mixed and matched somewhere in there. And it all starts by that little homebuyers guide you have what's the hook? That was the what gave you the excuse? So like, do you guys have any tools? Or do you guys have any content you own, you guys have any original content that will position you as an expert, like you have to have the basic tools and know your brokerages site is not good enough, because that's their tool, not yours. And you need your own brand. I mean, that's what people are hiring. Soyeah, it could be it could be educational, you could do a video series on your homebuyer guide, put on your YouTube channel and say, Look, if you're interested this is this is available for a minute already. In the meantime, I'm not going anywhere I work at your pace, your speed if we need to, if we need to move that up quicker, I will. But in the meantime, I'm going to put you into our system. And I'm going to share with you we do stuff on you know community involvement, we do a lot for the community, it's just other stuff outside of buying and selling and you're gonna love it because it's all great information. And it's part of the community, we all live work and play, I think that say, I love having conversations that have nothing to do with real estate, because you're at the center of those. So if you haven't done a networking event where you put four or five or eight women together that could all help each other, you know, do that. You're the, you're the center of those things. And when eventually the someone's gonna say, Hey, how's the real estate market share, and you're gonna start talking about the real estate market, everywhere you go. And like you said, this, you know, I made $18,000 at the carwash because I said real estate and I and I was available. And I I capitalized on talking to someone, which is again, what you're supposed to be doing, you know, if you don't like the word prospecting, I say talk real estate to everyone you meet, everywhere you go, you're gonna bump into people, Kid event, sports event, a work event, holiday event, birthday, whatever, you can make money in this business so easily, if you would just think about serving with, you know, value add a value driven strategy, the goal mind pipeline, what's so cool about this is that on the very last page of the pipeline, we separate the A's from the A, B, and C. And when we look at all A, B, and C, it's a pretty big number 16 20 million, whatever. When you just look at the A's, you're able to now forecast like a business owner, what your sales and listings will look like over the next two months. And ultimately what your cash flow will look like which again, we never see that we agents or make money, make no money, right? You don't have to be in that feast and famine, you can actually look at and say I'm I should, over the next two months, make this and this and now you're saying predictability, predictability, I now am in control of my business and you can make whatever you want. You want to double your business, double the amount of appointments should go on, put more people on the pipeline. And by the way, I almost forgot to say like if someone says they have a referral for you like this one guy friend of mine, Josh said I have a referral and my neighbor wants to sell and we're like in a park There's no way I'm getting that information right then. And I said, great, cool that his neighbor, they live in a 650 plus neighborhood. So I'm going to write on the goldmine pipeline under listing lead Josh's neighbors 650. Why cuz I want to remind myself to call the lead referral source, right? Otherwise, that's going to go through the cracks, I'm going to see that house listed and be like, Oh, my God, I talk to somebody and be pissed at myself. Now, you won't be because you put Josh's neighbor 650 on the go my pipeline sheet as a reminder, as a placeholder until you get the clients actual information. So this system is like simple, but it's brilliant, if I may say so. And I've helped 1000s of people like that we're gonna quit the business, say, You know what, I did this. And now I've already sold 3 million. I mean, we take people from a million and a half to 6 million in one year, we take people from six to 60, and so on. So you know, if you want a copy of this, I'm happy to you know, go to just email me, man, you rock at Sherry Johnson comm. We'll put that in, in your podcast if you want. But I'll give you the system, the form and the ways to maximize it. It is a simple system we have provided also in an Excel spreadsheet for people who like it, most agents don't like Excel. But the bottom line is talking to more people. And using this as this is your list to follow up with every week. And if you can't follow up, because your scripts soccer you feel like you just can't you're dead ending everywhere, then, you know, hire somebody hire coach, though, listen to some free content that is out there.So easy, though. Like, it's so easy, like you can't, if you can't follow up? No, I'm just gonna tell them I quit the business like you're not, it's not gonna work like this is really simple. And I don't want to be the negative Nancy over here. But you'll just be honest, like if this is really simple, so I want to, it's so similar to how I used to run my business back home. So here's what I walk you guys through this. And we'll wrap this up and get Sherry's info. So you guys can get a copy of this thing, you definitely get it. But I used to carry a yellow pad in my back pocket. It's how I got started. At four o'clock in the morning in the nightclubs during bottle service, I'd be getting everyone's drunk email addresses and phone numbers. And when conversations for me to get them to start talking about a house was always asking them what they do first, and they always have to ask you what you do next. And it always opened up the conversation for real estate. So like if I knew that 10 to 15% of the market moves every every night, or every night, every year and every night when I go out. I know that I'm just looking for 10 to 15 people to talk to I don't know yet. What I ended up doing was building an email list and a direct mail lists, just friends and family some conversations with real estate or not. But I would always add them to my direct mail list, which meant they got my next touch each and every month. I always add them to my email list, which meant they got my next touch and I wasn't ever talking about real estate. I was just building an audience and it still worked. I was I was I was wishing people happy St. Patty's Day in town where the bar specials were. I was wishing people happy Valentine's Day. My direct mail pieces were just like toilet humor. Fun facts have nothing to do with real estate. But what I realized is that if you have brand associated on communication, whether it's a shirt, you're wearing a hat, you're wearing the sign and Sherry's video right here behind her I know she has Sheri Johnson coaching, she's not doing that on accident. She's doing that on purpose, because you might not be listening to the audio of this. You might be watching the video and um, she's branding, branding, branding, but that consistent communication, because you're right 80% of those people that you have conversations with, end up hiring the first person they meet with when they're seriously ready. So just because you have that one conversation up front, like it's your job to continuously follow up and you don't always have to follow up in a way that involves them, like hogtied them and sending them into a house and getting them pre approved. Like you could just be in relationship with people but it starts by consistent communication to the same audience over time, not only build your brand, but get those people that you're talking to once to actually come back. Well put Jerry, I love it. Why don't you go ahead and give them your website again, so they can know we'll get this all wrapped up?Absolutely. So you can find us at Sherry Johnson calm and that is Sh e r i Johnson. No t so Sherry Johnson sh t ri johnson.com. If you're listening to this, and in there is a on demand webinar on the go mind pipeline that you can download in a minute and just put in fillable form it'll email the the download of this very strategy as a web. It's on our it's on demand, an on demand webinar. The other thing you can do is send an email to you rock at Sherry johnson.com and ask for the goldmine pipeline and mentioned this podcast if you want or just say I want a copy of the Gulf, my pipeline, we'll send it out to you right away. And we have you know, my podcast is you Rock cherry Johnson, are you rock to share Johnson podcast, which is really fun. You can listen to our exclusive interview with Mike because it was fantastic and it was awesome. And yeah, that's how you can find us love to love to share anything with any of you whether you want coaching or you just want some really good free content, I have a tendency to give out a lot of just helpful staff to help you and if you do want coaching, we're happy to help any of you. You could also see all of the coaching programs on my website.Love it. Thank you Sherry class, give her a call. Look her up guys and thank you guys for listening another episode of the real estate marketing dude podcast. I appreciate you guys each and every month. Why don't you guys go ahead and follow us on social if you'd like to contact us seeing subscribe to the show, follow us on Instagram, Facebook, YouTube, subscribe to that channel. And you know if you need more real estate marketing help, we'll script that and distribute all your video content for you without making you look like a total loser on camera will make you look really really really cool. And I think you're gonna be happy with the results. So why don't you give us a shot? Visit us at real estate marketing do.com real estate marketing dude.com We appreciate you guys listen another episode. See you next week. Thank you for watching another episode of the real estate marketing dude podcast. If you need help with video or finding out what your brand is, visit our website at WWW dot real estate marketing do.com We make branding and video content creation simple and do everything for you. So if you have any additional questions, visit the site, download the training, and then schedule a time to speak with a dude and get you rolling in your local marketplace. Thanks for watching another episode of the podcast. We'll see you next time.

The Marketing Agency Leadership Podcast
Franchise: Focus, Scale, and BOOM!

The Marketing Agency Leadership Podcast

Play Episode Listen Later Nov 11, 2021 30:31


Adam McChesney, Owner, and Partner at St. Louis, Missouri franchise of Hite Digital, a service digital marketing agency with 15 locations. Adam's agency provides logo design, branding services, website design, search engine optimization, paid advertising, and recently launched Hite CRM, a technology-based software based on GoHighLevel's white-labeled CRM.  The goal? “To create an ecosystem that . . . helps us generate more business for them, . . . turn(s) those leads into customers, and then turn(s) those customers into walking billboards for our clients.” He wants to “turn a client's business into “a scalable model” that helps them reach their goals and helps them get more out of what they put in.” Adam says over 75% of his clients are in a home-service or contracting-type industry. Before Hite, Adam sold medical devices for around five years. When Covid hit, he decided he wanted to get into marketing. His background in prospecting, sales, and growing business gave him the skills he needed to get clients. He studied up on website building, ranking, and paid ad production so he could do the work.  He started his agency in July of 2020 and grew it “from basically nothing up to 30 or 40 clients,” but then came the problems. A lot of issues – fulfillment, account management, and scaling – were breaking the agency and its business. Adam started looking for ways to outsource. After he became “official” with Hite in June of this year, he doubled his agency's monthly revenue in 90 days . . . jumping from $30K to $60k a month. Hite Digital at the corporate level handles processes, systems, fulfillment, and some of the prospecting and administration services, leaving Adam with the time and energy to focus on prospecting, selling, growing, and scaling his business. Daily franchise calls with other franchise owners cover different business topics – each week starts with sales, then progresses through mindset, general operations, product, and on Friday, family-oriented personal sharing – providing a rich source of franchise “lessons learned,” but, more importantly, supportive relationships. The franchise has allowed him to leverage the resources and abilities of about 150 full-time team members and 15 distinct locations, and do work at a scale that a small, independent agency could not. Adam feels the franchise certifications, high-profile sponsorships, and publicity have increased his “validity” . . . he no longer has to sell himself as an individual product. With Hite corporate providing the processes and systems (“Sales are not going to outperform and out-scale bad processes and systems,” Adam warns), he now has the time to be “hyper-focused on what's going to take this agency and continue to grow.” He then concludes, “The things that are happening behind the scenes – strategy, everything like that – have continued to stay the same One key to finding quality clients? Adam is in a number of mastermind groups where he meets with business owners from all over the country on a regular basis. Many of the people in his mastermind groups are his clients or become his clients . . . and those people refer new clients to him, as well. Adam feels personal branding contributes to his ability to get and retain clients, because people know, like, and trust him based on the relationship created before they even consider a partnership. Adam is available on Instagram: @adamlmcchesney or on his agency's website at: hitedigital.com/st-louis Transcript Follows: ROB: Welcome to the Marketing Agency Leadership Podcast. I'm your host, Rob Kischuk, and I'm joined today by Adam McChesney, Owner and Partner at Hite Digital St. Louis, obviously in St. Louis, Missouri. Welcome to the podcast, Adam. ADAM: Yeah, Rob. Thanks for having me on. Super excited to be here today. Appreciate you having me here today. ROB: Excellent to have you on the podcast. Why don't you start off by telling us about Hite Digital St. Louis? Tell us what you all are doing, what's exciting there, what clients seek out. ADAM: Yeah, absolutely. Hite Digital St. Louis is a franchise operation of Hite Digital. Hite Digital has 15 locations as of this recording today, and I'm lucky enough to be the owner/partner here in St. Louis, Missouri. We're a full-service digital marketing agency. We do everything from logo and branding, website design, search engine optimization, paid advertising, and we've recently launched our own CRM as well. We do things a little bit differently over at Hite. Some really cool things that we have in the works. But we are a franchise model, so we leverage the resources and the abilities of about 150 full-time team members and 15 different locations. It has allowed us to do a lot of things at scale that, if you were basically your own little hyper-agency like I was before merging with Hite, you just couldn't do. Some really exciting things we have going on. ROB: It's a really interesting model, and I think it's one we really haven't encountered before on this podcast. How did you become aware of Hite, and how did you get drawn in? I'm sure that's a process; I'm sure there's some aspirations of what you can build on your own, what you can build together. It's probably a journey. ADAM: Absolutely. It's definitely been a journey. I've been an agency owner full-time now since July of 2020. Quick backstory on me: I was in the medical device sales field for about five years. Worked my way up through multiple companies and was pretty successful, but right as COVID was going on, I realized I didn't know if this was necessarily for me. I'd always wanted to take marketing full-time to see what I could do, helping local businesses – especially during such a unique time that we were seeing with the pandemic. So, in July of 2020, I left. My background, my strengths are really in prospecting and sales and growing business, so I never really had any issues finding people that were interested in allowing me to do their marketing and advertising. And then I was taught through courses and programs and a lot of self-teaching how to build a website, rank a website, do all the paid ads. So, I could sell and then I could also do it, which was nice, but it also brought its own set of problems for fulfillment and account management and scaling. As I took my agency from basically nothing up to 30 or 40 clients, I had a lot of issues that were breaking the agency and the business as a whole. I started looking into ways to outsource. Hite Digital was one of those ways that I was looking. Hite Digital in the past had been a white label fulfillment company for agencies that obviously didn't want to do the work internally. So, transitioning over to this franchise model – I had heard about it; never heard anything like it. I thought, “Wow, this is way too good to be true.” They handle the processes and the systems, they handle the fulfillment, they handle some prospecting and admin stuff. For me, it was a perfect storm where I was at in my agency to be able to continue and focus on what I wanted to do, which is prospect and sell and grow a business. ROB: It's really fascinating. It sounds like the whole delivery aspect of the business is something you don't really have to worry about on a day-to-day basis. ADAM: That's correct. ROB: But then with that also comes – you still do have to sell something that is aligned to what Hite can deliver as an organization. How do you think about the alignment between what you're selling and what's being delivered? ADAM: Luckily, I had a taste of what Hite was able to do before I came on as a franchise. I knew a couple other people that were already franchisees of Hite, I had seen it from a white label standpoint, and most of what I'm selling today was also what I had previously sold and also done myself. So, for me, it wasn't much of a transition. The biggest transition for me was to get out of a lot of the mundane tasks of the day to day. So, managing the accounts, managing the projects, building a website myself – all the things that in theory were good for me in the beginning to get access to knowing how to do it and be able to better sell what I was selling, but it got me very focused on the things that weren't going to grow and scale a business. ROB: What kind of territory do you have, then? Is it St. Louis in fact, and someone else might come in and do Kansas City or Nashville? You've got about 100 miles? What's your range? ADAM: Basically, right now I'm the only one in Missouri. I can't remember the specifics on the range. I want to say it's about 120 miles that I can remember. For example, in the state of Texas we have four franchisees down there. We don't really necessarily have a boundary of where we can do business, being digital marketing. There's not any caps on anything like that. But I want to say it's about 120 miles in terms of where another franchise would be opening. ROB: Got it. It reminds me – the NBA operates kind of like that too, and they seem to be doing all right for everyone there. [laughs] When it comes to prospecting, you almost get to go out and prospect a bit more unencumbered with the day to day of the operations, which is fascinating. Quite often in the medical sales field, it's I think a little bit similar. How do you think about which kinds of clients you're working with locally? ADAM: Where I really got my start was online networking. I'm in a variety of different masterminds where likeminded people are coming together. I'm meeting business owners all the time, and whether I'm working with people within those masterminds as clients of mine or they're referring people to me, most of my clients were all over the country. This has now given me an aspect to start doing some cool things locally in terms of networking, getting my name out there from a standpoint that actually means something. When I am the product, the service, and everything, and I'm telling people, “Hey, this is what I've got,” no one really understands that. Now I can send them over to Hite Digital, show them all the team members that we have, all the certifications, all the sponsorships, all the stuff that has been written about Hite Digital throughout the publications. It has a lot more validity. So, I'm more proud to be able to go and show that and do that, and it's given me access and more time to be able to do it. Personal branding is such a big aspect of where I've been able to get clients, keep clients and retain clients, because people know, like, and trust me based on the relationship that we've already created before even coming into a partnership together. ROB: Where does that lead you? Are there particular verticals or sizes of companies? Is there a typical client right now in St. Louis for you? ADAM: Most of the clients I have are in the home service or contracting space. That's really where I got my start and where I'm heavily involved from a client standpoint. But transitioning over to Hite, we've been able to work with clients of all shapes and sizes and a variety of different industries. Even started getting into the ecommerce space, which I had never been into before. There's really not a cap, but if I had to say, majority of my clients, 75% and above right now are all in a home service or contracting type industry. ROB: Got it. That certainly makes sense from a services perspective, whether you're talking about SEO, whether you're talking about paid search. All of those kinds of things, you need a certain kind of website; you need to be distributed certain places. You can definitely see how there's a lot of them, and you're prospecting probably looks a little bit similar on that side too, going to the medical. There's lists of these people. You can find them, you can build trust with them, and keep on going. Does that transfer? ADAM: Exactly. That absolutely does. ROB: You mentioned the CRM product, then. Is that a Hite central offering? What does that look like? ADAM: Yes. We partnered with GoHighLevel to create a technology-based software of their white label CRM. It's called Hite CRM. We launched it probably about two months ago right now. We've started to have some people adopt it. But essentially, we want to create an ecosystem that not only helps us generate more business for them, but able to obviously turn those leads into customers, and then turn those customers into walking billboards for our clients. The strategic part about what we do isn't just getting them more lead flow or more calls; it's how we turn your business into a scalable model that helps you reach your goals and helps you get out more of what you put in. ROB: That part makes sense. I do wonder – and this is always a little bit of a tricky art between that transition from sales to delivery in terms of relationship. You mentioned relationship, you mentioned retention. How do you think about the ownership of the relationship when a client goes from sales in your office to delivery, which is across the world, and certainly has to be at a level of quality – but it seems like the boundary of who owns the account is a little bit trickier than maybe if you had everything in-house. ADAM: Absolutely. Technically, we still obviously have it in-house. My account managers that I have are full-time. They just work with my clients. We have created the relationship and created that on a very high level. People obviously do business with me because they know, like, and trust me, and then I transition to not necessarily completely step away from the account, but “Hey, here is Kevin or Moe that's going to be able to take care of you on a daily basis.” The problem in agencies, as you grow and scale, and the issue I was having, is I was lucky if I was able to hop on a call with a client that was paying me a good amount of money once per month. In that, I wanted to make sure that the customer service was to a tier above where I had it and that we were still getting the results, that we were getting the correct reporting, that we were building efficiencies around how we do things for our clients. The aspect of the touching of each account and to the effectiveness we've been able to do it has completely gone through the roof in the transition. Obviously, that comes with me stepping back and delegating and putting processes and systems in place so I'm not the face of the day-to-day communication. But at the end of the day, the things that are happening behind the scenes – strategy, everything like that – has continued to stay the same. ROB: What does it look like? What's maybe the most extreme example of what it looks like to scale a city as a Hite franchisee? What's the limit? There's almost an unlimited amount of business. ADAM: Yeah, there's unlimited amount of business. Ideally, I think in the future we create physical offices, we have all these different things. Being able to work remote and pretty much anywhere in the world, I think there's a ton of opportunity just with one location. Just to give you an idea, I came into Hite officially June of this year, and by stepping away from the account management, by stepping away from the fulfillment and the admin tasks, I've been able to double my agency in 90 days. We went from about $30k a month to over $60k a month. And really all that is attributed to me being able to step away and not have to worry about “When's this project going to be due?” or “How am I going to figure out how to get all of these reports out to these clients and then hop on calls with them, and then hopefully for 30 minutes to an hour a day focus on my personal brand and also prospecting?” Those things tend to go in the backseat when you have to figure out the projects and the account management. For me, I've been able to be very hyper-focused on what's going to take this agency and continue to grow. ROB: A lot less fires to fight, for sure. A flipside of that, I would think, is maybe having fewer people around you when it comes to having a table of different opinions to help challenge the business, to move it forward, to think of what's next. How do you think about finding peer support and things to drive you forward in that way? ADAM: Luckily, the support system with the franchise model at Hite is absolutely phenomenal. We have a daily franchise call. Each day of the week is a particular sector or topic of the business. Today was sales, getting the week started off right. Tomorrow is mindset. Then we have general operations, product, and then family-oriented personalized stuff. So, we talk together on a consistent basis, even though we are completely on opposite ends of the country or the world or wherever we're talking. I think by having all of this communication and collaboration in the last 90 days, what's also taken me is I'm finding new ways to put different twists on my business based off of what all these agency owners are doing, because we're all in it together. If someone is finding success in a certain area, we're going to share it with the team because we want to grow and scale at its height. If you were to just have a daily call with 15 agency owners, I don't know how many people are going to start sharing their secrets every single day of the week to help you grow. You might get one or two things. But we're able to do this thing at scale and really help a ton of clients, a ton of people, and do it on a consistent basis. So that's been a really cool part. ROB: Right. From a geography perspective, there's no competition. You can be fully transparent. Someone can tell you exactly one account they're having a hard time with, they're weak, they're dying, the client's at risk, and you can't go steal that client. There's nothing you can do. That's their client, and they need the help to succeed, and you can learn from it. ADAM: Yeah, it's been phenomenal. To also give you an idea, we have one of our owner/partners who's in Nashville, and he's a real estate investor himself. He got into the space for being a real estate investor, to try to grow and scale his wholesaling company. He's jumped on calls with me to talk real estate with potential clients that he's never going to see anything from. No one's ever going to take time out of their day to do that if you're not a part of something like we have going on at Hite. ROB: One thing that seems like it would be tricky – and I'm sure they've solved it – how do you handle the question of product offerings and pricing? Because it seems like there's a lot of room for transparency there. There's a lot of room for you to try to mark up a service 10 times the rack rate. There's room for Hite to mark up a service 10% and tell you to just deal with it. How does that balance work from the pricing as it flows through to a client? ADAM: We have our fulfillment costs of what we pay per project or per service offering, what have you, and then we have “Hey, here's what we recommend selling it for.” You can sell it for what you want. If you want to package something together, if you want to offer X, Y, and Z free for 90 days or at a percentage off, you have the complete ability to do that. Clients are never really getting access to what our cost is on anything, so you then can go and say, “Hey, here's what I want to do in my business to be able to get to XYZ goal, and I'm going to reverse-engineer back knowing your costs.” So yeah, we haven't had any issues with it thus far. ROB: It's an interesting thing. It also allows you to be entrepreneurial because you can assess the market conditions locally, the competitive situation. It all makes sense. It still feels like selling, sounds like. ADAM: Yeah, it does. The huge thing for us is we've been able to get access to opportunities that we would've never gotten access to if we were just our little agency here in St. Louis. We were the VIP sponsor out at Traffic & Conversion. We got a ton of exposure there. We're a sponsor on Dave Ramsey's podcast. There's a lot of things you can now do when you have 15 locations that are all pooling things together. We have an opportunity generation department that helps out with our prospecting and even sets appointments for us. There's a lot of really cool things you're able to do when doing it at scale. ROB: Absolutely. That did ring a bell, actually. I have listened on the EntreLeadership Podcast. I have heard Hite Digital. It did ring a bell, and part of me wondered how much that sponsorship cost. I don't expect you to know that, but… [laughs] ADAM: I don't know it. [laughs] ROB: It's probably something you wouldn't do on your own. ADAM: Yes, exactly. ROB: Very good. Adam, you've done your own agency, you've chopped the delivery part off now and freed yourself to focus on some strengths; what are some lessons you've learned on your journey leading the agency that you might go back and tell yourself if you could rewind the clock and try to play Back to the Future and tell yourself what you ought to have known? ADAM: There's a variety of different things. It's only been 15 months of doing this full-time, and I've had a lot of success, but I've made a lot of mistakes, so the list could be very long. But I think the biggest thing for me, being a sales rep in my past, is sales are not going to outperform and out-scale bad processes and systems. When I first started running this full-time, I leave medical device, I leave a very lucrative industry, benefits, security, all those different things, and the shiny object is “Just go get sales. Take whatever product or service you can get in here and start selling it. Get people in the door.” Which was fine to an extent, but then my weakness – and why it's been such a great transition into Hite – is the processes and the systems. It's the organization. It's the fulfillment aspect. Trying to outsell bad processes and systems is never going to be the answer, and I think so many agency owners experience those problems where they're just focused on the shiny object, which is that next deal or that next month's worth of retainers, when not focusing on a process or system could set you back next month, 90 days, 6 months from now, and keep you from scaling to grow your business.  ROB: Sure. A lot of the processes are handled for you. How do you think about the processes that are not handled for you? How do you think about keeping consistency? Is there a playbook you're pulling from Hite? Is there a playbook you're writing yourself? How do you keep those account managers locked and loaded? How do you think about the next zero on the size of the business? ADAM: There's definitely a playbook and framework from Hite, but with how we do our business – to give you an idea, not everyone is going to have an account manager based on where they're at in their franchise. I happen to have two of them due to the size of our franchise. There's different dynamics that are coming in. I'm doing things a little bit differently than someone else is doing them based on our comfortability and based on where we're at with our clients and what projects we have going on. I'm managing it and learning new things each day, because I've really never managed people in a full-time aspect, especially in the account manager role, and I've also never been just an account manager. So, there's a variety of different factors that are going on. The next level in my agency is to bring in an integrator type person with digital marketing experience that really knows how to grow and scale an account management team, eventually a sales team. That way, I can really focus on what I'm doing best, which is at the top, strategizing, growing, and scaling the franchise itself, and not in the day to day still when it comes to managing people and the operations aspect. ROB: That lets you focus also on bringing in a very interesting sort of integrator, because you're not talking about a full-scale ops and delivery integrator. You can think about it as a different sort of organization, probably bring a more specialized integrator into that role. ADAM: A specialized integrator, one that's done SOPs, one that's done the product and the service aspect of what you do, and that likes doing it. Because at the end of the day, I think a lot of people are put in positions or pivoted to be an integrator when really they could be a visionary type of person or someone that doesn't like “I'm going to check the boxes and do all these different things.” My mind races at 1,000 miles per hour, and I need someone to help reel that in, and when we do have a good idea or a new process and system that could take the business to the next level, have someone that can run and put it into place and actually make it work. ROB: Absolutely. You've mentioned there's different scales of these franchises; there's one-man/one-woman shows. You've got a couple people around you. With the visibility that you have, what's the biggest you've seen a franchise get so far, and what does it look like from a work structure? ADAM: The franchise model is actually not even a year old. It's super new. We have people that have come in with agencies of all sizes, and then also people that are brand new to running their own agency, which I think is really cool. I think on the spectrum of where things are at, our average agency – we just saw the numbers today – is doing almost $30,000 a month. That's between all the agencies that are out there. Our agency here in St. Louis is definitely the largest in terms of I have two full-time people. I think everyone else pretty much at least has another full-time person or is working towards that. From a monetary standpoint, those things are going to be on every which end of the spectrum. But the average is right around $30,000, which is pretty healthy for 15 and only being a year old. ROB: Yeah, and you're setting the pace then a little bit, creating what this looks like. I wondered up front what it looked like perhaps from a pride perspective, because you start your own business and then you're merging, you're rebranding. But it almost sounds like a way to think about it is it's a way of making a bet and investing in growth. You're saying, “I think if I take this path instead of another one, I'm going to rebrand, I'm going to gain this halo over me” – and I guess some podcast ads, and this conference, plenty of other lead routes. But sometimes a merger is an ego battle, and it sounds like this is a little bit more of an investment strategy. ADAM: Yeah. It was a concern for me, to be honest. I was a lot more concerned with the way that I thought it was going to go versus how it actually did. For me, it wasn't so much the ego, but it was that I was the product, the service, and the everything. Basically, taking feedback and taking how the customers at the time and eventual customers took it, I took all that stuff personally. Some was good, some was not so good, and there were areas of opportunity. But for me, it was more so we each have our own commitment at Hite, and we're committed to so many different things of helping people, empowering people. I am the commitment to live a more whole, well-rounded life. If I want to do that, the way I do that is by impacting as many people as possible. I can only impact so many people if I'm doing everything, and I don't have the support, I don't have what I have now at Hite. Now, in 90 days, I've already grown the business double to what it was already at before, which was helping a lot of people. It's really cool to see even what we'll have at the end of the year and then this time next year. We're able to fulfill our commitments at a higher level, and in the process of that we're obviously going to lose clients that maybe we wouldn't have lost if I stayed and did my little agency. But we have to look at the bigger picture. I have to look at the bigger picture and what's best for me, my family, my agency, and everything else that's included. ROB: For sure. When you're looking ahead, Adam, at the next year, if we were to catch up a year from now, what's going to be new from the Hite Digital fulfillment mothership, and what will be different in St. Louis? What should we be looking forward to? ADAM: I alluded to earlier, over the next three to six months, I really want to bring in an operations integrator type manager to help take this business and plug up the holes that are here. What I think that allows us to do is to grow our team here in St. Louis – adding that person that would be local here in St. Louis, potentially adding some sales managers, more account managers. But getting very strategic on the partnerships and the things we're doing, investing in relationships, investing in masterminds to make sure that we're impacting not only as many people as we possibly can, but the right people, the right clients to come in here. The more people we're able to work with on a consistent basis, it's really going to help everyone win. I think in terms of Hite, we have ambitions of taking it from 15 franchises – I don't know what the end goal looks like in terms of a specific number of franchisees, but I think the people we're bringing in are all quality. They fit the bill of what makes Hite, Hite. And the best part is we're attracting all of these people. We're bringing in agency owners that we're connected to in our market, we're in other masterminds together. There's just a uniqueness to what we're doing. I think that continues on over the next couple months and throughout the years. ROB: Excellent. Adam, when people want to find and connect with you and Hite Digital St. Louis, where should they go to find you? ADAM: The easiest place is going to be my Instagram account. That's @adamlmcchesney. That's where I'm probably the most active in terms of messaging back and forth with people. You can also go to hitedigital.com/st-louis and find our information there in terms of what we offer and everything we have going on here at Hite Digital St. Louis. ROB: Excellent. Adam, thank you for coming on. This really does uncover a model we haven't talked about a lot on this podcast. It's a different path. It's clear it's working for you, it's exciting, and I think we're going to hear more about it. Thanks for coming on and sharing your experience, sharing your vision and leadership thus far, and we can't wait to see where it all goes. ADAM: Thank you very much. It was a pleasure to be on. Super excited for the future. ROB: Thanks so much, Adam. Take care. Thank you for listening. The Marketing Agency Leadership Podcast is presented by Converge. Converge helps digital marketing agencies and brands automate their reporting so they can be more profitable, accurate, and responsive. To learn more about how Converge can automate your marketing reporting, email info@convergehq.com, or visit us on the web at convergehq.com.

Fit Mother Project Podcast
The Invisible Burden

Fit Mother Project Podcast

Play Episode Listen Later Nov 10, 2021 3:39


It is no secret that Mothers are truly the unsung heroes of today's families.  The amount of work, errands, tasks, and support mothers do day in and day out is never-ending. It's keeping the household and family running. It's planning birthday parties and family activities. It's running to the grocery store while waiting to pick up the dry cleaning.  It's making sure the kids and spouse have everything they need… often putting themselves and their health last. It can feel like an Invisible Burden... an evergrowing weight carried on the shoulders of many moms.  And our society expects mothers to carry this load without question.  What happens when we carry additional weight…?  Our bodies are stressed and challenged in a magnitude of ways that can lead to stress, poor health.  The Invisible Burden can lead to weight gain, constant low energy, hormone imbalance. It can lead to being stretched beyond reach.  What's worse is that hardworking mothers like you bearing this burden, are often not seen or acknowledged for carrying the contributions and the acts of the family.  If you're a stay-at-home mom, society often expects you to carry the invisible burden without question. If you're a working mom, you're also expected to carry the invisible burden just as much while working to provide an income to your family.  You have so many important things pulling you in different directions that it often means you put yourself… and your health… last. I'm Dr. Anthony Balduzzi, Founder, and CEO of the Fit Mother Project and the host of this podcast… and I get all of this. Growing up… my dad died when I was 9 years old… and my mom became a widow with two young boys… and she had to fight to raise us and keep our family together. I started the Fit Mother Project and created this podcast with the sole purpose of helping create stronger and more powerful mothers through losing weight without restrictive diets, crazy workouts, or the image of “being perfect.” Our Fit Mother team has helped over 10,000 women become a stronger more fit version of themselves and we know this podcast will help you do the same on your journey to a better you.  You can take care of your family and work… and still make time for yourself and your health. I'll show you how XYZ. It's time for you to put yourself and your health first.  To get notified of new episodes, follow the Fit Mother Project Podcast on Apple, Google Podcasts, Spotify, and wherever else you get your Podcasts.  You can also subscribe to our youtube channel, Fit Mother Project to watch the full episodes and more.  I'll see you in the episodes. 

The Bledsoe Show
How to Use Language for Your Benefit

The Bledsoe Show

Play Episode Listen Later Nov 8, 2021 58:11


00:00.83 mikebledsoe Today we're talking about language. Some people may say that's boring and the reason and and ah I won't name the show language probably for that reason. Well, we'll say something clever on this episode between max and myself. And and then name it that but we wanted to really talk about it because we found it to be a very important subject for us to focus on I know for myself. It's helped me to ah. Not only communicate better with other people I think most people go oh you're better at language you could probably communicate better and in ah in an effective way that other people will will hear what you have to say in the way you want it to be received but also just for myself just for. Deliberately using language to reduce the own confusion I have in my own mind to work things out to become more certain about ah how I am approaching things and about what's going on in the world and I think anyone who does not put their attention into language. Um. Is going to be extremely limited in their ability ability to be productive and effective in the world today. So I always think about language is a major component in the expansion of consciousness and if someone's interested in that and they leave that part out then there are. Ah, they're missing out on on a huge huge piece Max. What? what got you into focusing in on language and going. Wow this is something important to pay attention to. 01:45.43 Max Shank It's the only tool we have for interaction other than physical touch which can be violent or nonviolent or body language. So everything. We communicate to ourselves and 1 another is done with this framework of language you have the deeper stuff which is ah feelings which don't necessarily need language to exist like you can be afraid or you can be aroused or you could be a little bit of both. For example. Um, I feel like the way that we are taught language is probably the worst way possible. So it almost sets you up for failure and you know I've always wanted to get as powerful as possible. And you realize at least I realized I was spending like hours and hours and hours in the gym and in a fighting gym doing kickboxing and Moai and kravmiga and all this stuff and you know you realize like that's not very practical like the. The likelihood of a violent interaction is really low Plus if you really want want to be good at that. You should just get a a weapon and get really good with that and then take it a step further. It's like ah some guy will just write a check and like win. Everything. 02:59.86 mikebledsoe Um, yeah, as. 03:16.10 Max Shank Like if you're able to communicate really well and put deals together and organize a group of people toward the same goal. That's where that pen is mightier than the sword comes from. So yeah, exactly So the the whole ah premise of getting. 03:24.10 mikebledsoe You can just hire somebody to beat somebody up, you know at that point. 03:35.47 Max Shank Physical power is like ridiculous ninety nine percent of the time now I do think it's very worthwhile to cultivate physical strength and mental strength can stem from physical challenge like if you carry a pack up a mountain. It's going to be. Physically challenging but that physical challenge is going to give you a huge mental challenge as well. Um, with communication There's only 1 goal really which is to transmit the message you intend. And that's I think the first place that people get gummed up is they don't even know what they're trying to communicate and you have to consider the audience so there needs to be just like a computer There's a sender and a receiver and it has to be. Um, understandable and in order for a human being to understand it has to be communicated to them in a way that resonates with them has to be communicated in a language that they clearly understand and you can't have too many bits. In a short amount of time. So like for example, when you download something off the internet. There's a download rate essentially and you can't go beyond that because the computer will start to miss things like you can't give too many bits. Per unit of time and so if I tell you hey mike remember this sequence of numbers. It's a 4 7 q l 1 2 3 8 11 b 1217 you're going to be like I don't know what the heck you're talking about now. 05:23.80 mikebledsoe She. 05:26.10 Max Shank If I stretch that over a much longer set of communication I can probably get you to remember all those things especially if I tell it to you in a story but by and law which is why? Ah so many stories were just. Told they weren't even written so we can go like way back like the way before we had written language we had spoken language so you have to be really clear on what you're trying to communicate and you can't give too many bits. Otherwise it gets lost So that's. I think 1 of the big things I've noticed both professionally and personally is people try to say too much and their core message gets lost right. 06:14.83 mikebledsoe Right? Well I think um, 1 of the key things that you said there is that I'm not going to repeat you verbatim. But basically what I heard was people don't people aren't considering. The result of their communication before they communicate or while they're communicating my experience is that most people are trying to satisfy a feeling if I when I speak I Want to feel a certain way. 06:37.85 Max Shank Right. 06:51.73 mikebledsoe And it might be ah exactly the yeah, the feeling the the desire to be heard and understood is ah is a very common 1 when we study sales and marketing we go. Oh if you can just make the customer feel heard and understood. 06:52.14 Max Shank Like a desire to be heard kind of thing. 07:08.27 Max Shank Right? totally. 07:09.83 mikebledsoe They'll buy almost anything from you. Even if you know as long as they if you people feel hurt and understood so infrequently that if when it happens it's a standout experience and there they they then. 07:23.37 Max Shank And that's. 07:28.69 mikebledsoe Get into this place where they know like and you know they like and trust you at least in that in that situation but 1 1 of the things I've come to ah realize is so many people are communicating for to solve for short term insecurities. They don't understand the long-term consequences of their communication most of which is there just communicating things that are like you were saying confusing people are confused by it and ah 1 of the ways that I that I have improved. My ability to communicate is really thinking. What is what is the result I'm trying to achieve with this information and the the more knowledge I've accumulated the the less knowledge I tend to lay out for someone to take on at a time. Spread it out as you were saying you know I could give you everything that you need to know in a weekend to to run your business effectively. But your ability to grok that and then put it into practice. It's just it's too much too Fast. It's not. Not going to get the desired result. 08:43.34 Max Shank Yeah, So if you're communicating for self-gratification instead of conversion I think it's a really big mistake and I think it shows a lot of insecurity people tend to use a lot of 10 dollars Words. Or twenty dollars words it doesn't matter how much the words are but complicated words that people don't really understand as well and the more confident you are the less you feel a need to talk just to talk. And the less you feel a need to fill up the gaps in silence because you're like oh I'm I'm afraid the other person will start talking and then I'll lose my turn. So. 09:25.75 mikebledsoe I used to do that I used to I would like I would throw a lot of ums in there. So I could stretch out what I was saying so no 1 could interrupt me I was signaling. Oh don't don't speak because I still have something to say. 09:40.71 Max Shank And if you're smart It doesn't come out as an um, it's just another bit. You may not say um or Hm or and ah ah you it may just be I start talking about something else. So I keep the the conch shell right? the. 09:44.70 mikebledsoe A. 09:59.40 Max Shank The the talking stick. Ah, if you don't have a ah goal. It's fine. You know you don't want to like over analyze your whole life like I do in every word you say. But if you're just having um, if. You're communicating with someone. There should be a goal like I have a little checklist actually I can pop through real quick. So um, step 1 is who are you sending this to which is your audience step 2 is what do you want them to change or do which is the call to action. Ah, why should they which would be the benefits plus the supporting Features. What are the consequences. So the heaven or hell how will you inspire hope which are stories and steps make it feel easy and possible and how much. Time effort and cost will it take so what is the cost of what they're doing and when you realize that basically every bit of communication is you're you're trying to get someone to take a specific action at least when you start getting into ah writing and sales. Which is persuasion relationships are the same thing like I think you should take out the trash and I will do this instead and there are all kinds of ways that you can break it down. But if you don't know what you're trying to achieve at the very outset then it's it's fun. It's a conversation. It's a stream of consciousness boom boom boom back and Forth. There doesn't have to be a clear outcome involved. But I think that's where writing gives you a lot of clarity because you start structuring your ideas with. Supporting arguments. You know you have a premise like I think you should exercise in the morning for x y and z and here's the benefits that you get from it and you realize that you can't put. Too many bits in there and it forces you to consolidate your ideas into something that is digestible. 12:08.98 mikebledsoe Yeah, and you said you said maybe you should not do what I've done which is put your your communication and and thoughts through constant analysis. But I found a lot of successful people. They may not be doing. Putting their thoughts through constant analysis currently or or putting a lot of attention into it. But I think going through a period of time where that happens ah a little a little thing that I've done and and I've challenged other people to do is to. Get rid of words in your vocabulary for a period of time and a word that gets Overused. So if you're using over usinging a word a word that I I think I still overuse. But I've got a lot better which is the word like. Which is extremely common for our generation. There's a lot of likes and you cut that 1 word out and you go well, that word's useful, but then you start when you cut it Out. You realize the majority of the use of that word that I I use it for is not Useful. It's wasted space. 13:23.37 Max Shank It's filler. It's filler. 13:24.36 mikebledsoe It's filler and and it can be confused if any filler creates more confusion by the way. Ah, and yeah, and so by removing that sometimes when it is useful I then have to go search for another word. And it's in its place. So 1 of the ways that I I train myself is I put a rubber band around my wrist and if I if the word slips through my lips I take a little band and I snap it on my Wrist. So I give myself a little little feedback. 13:49.14 Max Shank Ah. 14:01.70 Max Shank Do you worry that? um, you'll have to eventually upgrade to a shot collar just to get the same sensation. 14:01.39 mikebledsoe On that. Ah. 14:07.59 mikebledsoe Ah, yeah, I've thought about that I actually was thinking about taking 1 of those shot collars and just putting it on my my nether regions in that just to really you know drive the point home now. How far does it go? ah. 14:14.21 Max Shank Oh wow. 14:20.32 Max Shank It um, it only goes 1 way typically. 14:24.50 mikebledsoe Ah, well the the rubber band The rubber band is good because I've also been in I've been on stage before and snap my wrist. Ah and people go you know and I point out this is what I'm doing so it it becomes a social thing too is. 14:37.69 Max Shank Right. 14:41.77 mikebledsoe Oh I'm I'm showing everybody that I'm I'm making this mistake it. It brings it. It brings more of like a social awareness say I just said it a social awareness around what's going on and which brings more attention to it which causes me to be better about it. 14:53.22 Max Shank Um. 15:01.63 mikebledsoe So. 15:02.50 Max Shank What's also fascinating is that when you appear more fallible people like you more like the thing that people hate most is the perfect guy. So interestingly enough so if you use. 15:05.59 mikebledsoe Yeah. 15:18.30 Max Shank Language like the common man and you go and um, you know what is that word? Oh yeah house like what's a you, you just? um, kind of develop that persuasion through affect. Rather than just having the simplest and most direct message possible because usually you are talking about persuasion of some kind you're persuading them to buy to try or to cry or to laugh or something like that. There's ah, there's a goal there. 15:48.94 mikebledsoe Well people really value your intent I think a lot of people value intention over results. So even if you are fallible and you're you're going at least I'm trying people go oh you know, give you a little golf clap. 15:51.36 Max Shank And just having. 16:04.25 Max Shank Well whatever they believe your intention is right? So I think for your own psychological organization. You want to have the most clarity possible. 16:08.26 mikebledsoe No. 16:21.64 Max Shank Like essentially you want to have a triangle your triangle describes the main point and then each point of the triangle is the 3 like sub points of that. So. There's ah, a really solid clear precise structure to everything you're saying. But just communicating something in the simplest way possible isn't necessarily the most persuasive using stories and analogies that really make you feel certain things can be really beneficial even though they might seem. Superfluous or unnecessary like that word superfluous is a fun word to say but the fact that it means unnecessary and it's unnecessarily complicated is really hilarious. 17:21.77 Max Shank These long pauses are really good for podcasting. You told me. 17:24.77 mikebledsoe I did but then zencastr put this this little thing in the production where it cuts out anything over 1 point, 2 seconds it cuts it down in 1 point, 2 seconds. So it makes makes the pauses actually. Okay. 17:38.90 Max Shank Whoa. So the folks at home won't get the full experience of that awkward pause. 17:46.96 mikebledsoe Ah, 1 thing I find very interesting is when I when I started getting hip to the power of language I ah was really disgusted At. You know, maybe people aren't doing it on purpose. Maybe they are who knows yeah I was I was disgusted with well I stay disgusted about this. So. It's not like it's not as if this was a new feeling about this but education the the systematic government run. 18:05.94 Max Shank It's a really strong emotion. 18:22.50 mikebledsoe Education system really focuses on spelling things correctly and grammar. But what I notice is there's a ah lack of focus on definition of certain words. 18:29.41 Max Shank Oh. 18:41.90 mikebledsoe Ah, it's more about can we make it look pretty or are we following the rules of of ah you know don't put this word in front of this word and don't put this word at the end of the sentence and while completely leaving Out. You know how words shape our thoughts which shape our mind and and which words are helpful and which words won't be might be harmful and if you put them. You know if you follow this word with this other word. What's that doing to your mind and you know it. That hits me along with you know we teach algebra which no 1 hardly ever uses once they get out of high school. But no 1 knows how to balance their books. No 1 understands money the thing that they're constantly surrounded by so my my experience of language in regard to education is similar to that. 19:23.74 Max Shank So so. 19:36.71 mikebledsoe Mathematics and that ah you learn how to jump through all these hoops for the purpose of getting a good grade. But how are these things impacting your your life and being successful and so most of what I learned I was a very like reading and writing was. Was what I did. That was my best subjects and math was you know a little bit tougher for me but I look at all that and I go as as much as I learned about reading and writing and I was gotten these amazing grades. 19:57.70 Max Shank So. 20:13.53 mikebledsoe It wasn't until I was in my thirty s that I really started learning language in a way that was actually helpful for me. It's not complicated. 20:20.37 Max Shank And it's not complicated. Good good communication either. I think what you said at the beginning about understanding how language shapes thought and that's the truth is language shapes thought. And of course your thought shapes the language that you use so it's a feedback loop but what I tell people is that everything about you that is not an animal is laid out with language. So every. Concept above your instincts is language driven. What is okay to do and what is not okay to do what is good to do what is bad that whole ah knowledge of good and evil thing that's all that's all language. That's it's basically. Anti-instinual pretty much so everything that we do that is not just pure animal instinct is laid on a foundation of language so you have to be really or you don't have to be but it's good to be very considerate of what language. You accept I mean we've talked about it I think in a past podcast even the concept of slavery is heavily based on the definition like that is a possibility so every every like thing we have and everything we have in place. Is laid out using words. It's conditional phrases if this then this every law is there's no such thing as ah laws. It's more crimes are defined. And punishments are also defined and sometimes they're left up to the discretion of the judge or something like that. But usually we define a crime we define a punishment we define a contest and we define a prize for that contest but everything. Outside of your base instincts is language so getting clear on how you would like to be and realizing that it's all just your perception that colors the world outside of instinct so you have instinct and then you have your. Individual perception. That's a that's a huge revel is revelation. That's enough to make anyone go crazy. Basically. 22:54.44 mikebledsoe Yeah, yeah, and and there's language shaping thoughts. So first I think most people think about language and they think about communication and but the the shaping of thoughts and really. Going inwards and go what is the language of my mind. How is the language of my mind playing out when I sit quietly when I say quietly and I notice oh these are not words that are coming out of my mouth but these are words that are running through the mind. What is. 23:28.44 Max Shank Right? what. 23:32.30 mikebledsoe How is that shaping my perception of this moment. What is what feelings? What feelings are associated with those words those words create a feeling um and and being curious about that and anyone who starts diving into how language shapes their thoughts. 23:35.27 Max Shank Totally. 23:51.85 mikebledsoe And you start making small tweaks. Oh I'm going to remove this I'm going to add this a game we call Play is with our coaching is the 1 word game is bring up a a common thought that comes up in your mind in this situation Cool What if we just changed 1 word. And we have them write out the thought right now write it out with 1 word change does that change how you feel and almost every time someone goes. Yeah I feel different because I took the not out of that is it accurate. Yes, or no, maybe yes, maybe no okay. 24:12.43 Max Shank And. 24:31.27 mikebledsoe What's the next word we would have to change to make this a more accurate statement. So what we do is we if if I I think a mistake that happens with in coaching that I see a lot of times as people go, you're doing it like this. Why don't you just try it like this and it's like and it's as if you changed 10 words of their. 24:33.35 Max Shank Have. 24:50.36 mikebledsoe Thoughts all at once going back to what you were saying before giving them bits giving them small bits so large and so shaping the mind 1 word at a time I'm going to use a piece of sandpaper to get us there instead of an axe and. 25:06.49 Max Shank Like challenge change to ah but opportunity. For example, that's ah, that's a good 1 Yeah feels different. 25:08.33 mikebledsoe Ah, exact. Yeah, exactly. So yup, that feels different when you say and then all of a sudden the ability to see opportunity opens up whereas challenges that word tends to focus possibility and. And just vision so really getting in the practice of recognizing how these thoughts shape how we think which shape how we perceive the world and and what our options may be and then we have language outside of ourselves which was I think about the thought of culture. 25:47.24 Max Shank Spot Then what. 25:48.11 mikebledsoe So all these concepts that I've used to look inwards in my own ability and then you know communicating with people who are closest to me in relationship. But then I start looking at the thought of culture. What are the what are the memes that come and. Not the memes you see on Instagram I mean those those do qualify those are a a version of these memes but a meme is a is it is a snippet of narrative. There's a meme in our culture of this and that and this yeah. 26:06.91 Max Shank 1 26:17.81 Max Shank Like sorry tourette's sorry to write oh sorry? Sorry oh I'm sorry I'm sorry oh my god Jesus like is everyone really so sorry, all the time I used to do the same thing I have now gone. 26:24.21 mikebledsoe Yeah, yeah, yeah, maybe. 26:37.81 Max Shank Completely the other way where I'm really cautious anytime I do say that because I'm not sorry like really. 26:45.61 mikebledsoe No well I had someone recently is that I don't mean to cut you off, but and then and then just start kept talking I go I stopped him and I said yes you did and they go and there's a ah group of people in they go. 26:55.89 Max Shank No yeah. 27:04.76 mikebledsoe I Did what you meant to cut me off and they go and they kind of go. Ah, you said that and then you just kept on talking and they go oh shit I go I Go don't feel bad about it I'm just bringing this to your awareness you can cut I cut people off all the time but I don't tell people I don't. 27:09.95 Max Shank Right? You know. 27:20.71 Max Shank Um, right. 27:23.95 mikebledsoe Started off by saying don't mean to cut you off cause like it's bullshit. 27:28.76 Max Shank I'm not sexist but ladies are way better at cooking. 27:33.39 mikebledsoe Yeah, yeah, so so I start thinking about the thoughts of culture. Ah you know in the last year and a half it's been very. It's been on loudspeaker on social media. The the memes that the Instagram memes are are somewhat like those are cultural memes as well. 27:39.53 Max Shank Ah. 27:50.33 Max Shank No doubt. 27:51.74 mikebledsoe Ah, and I think that if we when we go down to the core of culture. We actually do find law and those are the words that are laid out. They're not. It's not really law I Hate calling it law. It's it's policy So a group of people got together. 28:08.29 Max Shank Crime and punishment. 28:11.37 mikebledsoe Yeah, the kind of punishment conversation. You're having they they create a policy and you know they argue about which words we should use and what order and and we put them on this piece of paper and then and then we'll convince these policy enforcers that will tell you that they're here to protect and serve. But. 28:19.89 Max Shank Her. 28:31.28 mikebledsoe Really their job is to enforce policy and what you end up with is people don't really I don't think they actually recognize how important how our law is the foundation of culture and. 28:46.63 Max Shank Ah, it's weaponized language. 28:50.92 mikebledsoe Exactly I like that it's policy slash Weaponized language. 28:55.62 Max Shank I Mean there's nothing.. There's nothing more ah like sneaky and coercive than drumming up these ah rules with punishments attached. In a language that the average person can't understand and when you think about how people have tried to control each other it really did go from the stick to the pen. You know the big guy with a big stick was like ah so like suppose I'm. Like a 200 and fifty pound monster with a club and you're just whatever your size is what are you like 1 sixty or something. Okay, so so suppose I'm like a yeah suppose I'm like a viking monster and I'm like hey there Mike ah I was just thinking I would I would take your house and your wife. 29:38.28 mikebledsoe Yeah, 5 8 1 sixty not a big guy. 29:51.87 Max Shank And ah and if you're not cool with that I'll I'll hit you with this stick until you're dead and for a long time that was how it worked basically. But then 1 day you were very clever and you were like hey hey hey whoa you don't want to do that because then you'll burn in hell forever. 29:58.25 mikebledsoe E. 30:10.38 Max Shank I Mean you've heard about fire right? It's really hot burns it hurts and plus if you if you don't kill and murder then you go to heaven which is the it's the best I mean what? what do you like. 30:13.90 mikebledsoe Ah, well this is this is what the catholic. 30:21.27 mikebledsoe Well, this is how the Catholic church got a hold of the Knights The Knights were an unruly crew. So the. 30:28.66 Max Shank I mean you would be too if you had ultimate power to stick somebody anytime. 30:33.10 mikebledsoe Yeah, they the Knights ah a knight on a horse with armor could take out a Hundred peasants with ease. Ah and there's um, there's a. 30:44.23 Max Shank A Hundred I think if those Hundred peasants had stick hundreds a lot I don't think so. 30:54.54 mikebledsoe There's ah I was surprised by the statistics I was reading in That's to say he's on a horse a Knight a knight on a horse with let's say like a broadsw sword or something like that like most peasants aren't gonna touch him. He's gonna. 30:57.50 Max Shank Maybe it feeds on a horse. 31:05.90 Max Shank Ah. Most will run away. That's true. That's what happened with the the I think it was the Incas or something. It's a big It's a big difference I was talking about this at a party. Yeah. 31:11.35 mikebledsoe Run right through him anyways, even if we say 25 whatever to huge difference so difference between like ah having a gun and a tank. 31:28.28 Max Shank I Mean the difference between stick and no stick is actually pretty huge already. So it's just an arms race. But then we have this now instead of the rules of engagement of physical battle. It's the rules of engagement of stories and that's how we got to cooperate in. 31:43.60 mikebledsoe Yeah, look yeah and and going back to what you're saying is the well what I was saying is the ah you come about making up a story of you're going to burn in hell. 31:47.00 Max Shank In such big groups. We believe in the same tree spirit or something like that. 31:58.60 Max Shank Right. 32:00.49 mikebledsoe Which is basically what the catholic church did the catholic church came to the Knights and said hey you guys are doing a lot of raping and pillaging we got to get us under control so they created what's it called ah chivalry. 32:06.00 Max Shank Right. 32:16.50 Max Shank So so. 32:18.51 mikebledsoe They created Chivalry so Chivalry Chivalry is a narrative like oh you want to be a chivalrous Knight because if you're chivalrous then you'll get the reward that you're looking for well being ah having Chivalry is the modern day citizen. 32:21.79 Max Shank Ah. 32:29.78 Max Shank It's like ethics right? we were talking about a few podcasts ago. 32:36.86 Max Shank Um, ah. 32:38.48 mikebledsoe So being a chivalrous knight is the same thing as being a good citizen today. Oh aka good slave and so the yeah, an obedient slave. 32:42.37 Max Shank A good citizen right? right? obedient I Think yeah yeah. 32:54.98 Max Shank I Mean you don't want a disobedient slave that like totally defeats the purpose if you can't see the value of owning a slave then you're just kidding yourself I mean I can totally understand everyone has tried to enslave not everybody. But. 32:59.62 mikebledsoe Yeah, it makes they're difficult hard to. 33:14.68 Max Shank Ah, so many so much slavery in the history of mankind. It's like hey do I want to do this work or do I want to sit on a horse with a whip while this other guy does the work I get it I get it. 33:24.45 mikebledsoe Yeah, if you look at Western Society We have the least amount of slavery where I'd say we have the least where we're sitting in the in a world of like the least harsh slavery in all of human history. 33:36.25 Max Shank And probably best for women's rights ever I mean you know about the bros before hose amendments. That's what I That's just what I call them So it's easy to remember we gave. 33:43.55 mikebledsoe Now. 33:53.30 Max Shank We're really losing her female audience right now. Ah we gave ah black guys. The ability to vote before women before white women and I just I just find that pretty funny because just before that black people were enslaved here. 33:59.86 mikebledsoe Oh that's right. 34:11.90 Max Shank But women were not enslaved but we just fast-track dudes to like yeah you can you could call the shots with a not you ladies though, you ladies no no and so you think about how that has accelerated so much and then in other parts of the world like I don't know. 34:11.48 mikebledsoe E. 34:30.17 Max Shank The middle East For example, it's very clear pecking order right of who's in charge. But I think there have been some costs of that like for example, like ah in the. 34:33.27 mikebledsoe Um, yeah. 34:48.32 Max Shank Normal hollywood stories. Let's say the simpsons you know Homer simpson is an oaf married with children al Bundy is an oaf. So I think 1 of the things that is quite harmful and a little bit insidious is this. Male weakness where he's like always trying to like get sex with the lady and he's a dumb guy and he's like I mean even at the highest level we do this weird thing where presidents will be like oh well I got to check with the wife first to see if it's okay and you're like whoa this is like. What is going on here like this weak. Ah male figure is probably pretty destructive to the hearts and minds of our culture. 35:39.22 mikebledsoe Yeah I ah um, will get away from such touchy subjects for a secondc I'll make it maybe a little more palatable here. Ah yeah, 1 of the. 35:51.94 Max Shank I Think that's what you're here for. 35:57.96 mikebledsoe But we ah if we want to look at the power of narrative if we look at tv shows we look at ah what happens in Tvs and movies who's always the oaf it like that. It's the personal trainer if you're the personal trainer. The coach you're you're dumb. He's a dumb meathead. 36:14.92 Max Shank I am. 36:17.52 mikebledsoe But then they make entire television series about these Genius doctors that are saving. People's lives in the Er emergency room but and so and on what the narrative is personal trainers are dumb miaheads and on the other end is these doctors are are complete geniuses. 36:26.31 Max Shank Um, ah but. 36:37.29 mikebledsoe And so we have an entire culture that doesn't want to listen to people who are telling them how to be healthy but will do anything somebody Lab coat will have on and it's really how it's been played out. That's the narrative but the yeah and. 36:49.51 Max Shank Um, that's the appeal to authority that's that's 1 of the 2 main fallacies that we make appeal to authority and ad hominem attack and that goes right back into our language conversation because those are the 2 main things you see. 37:00.49 mikebledsoe Well well couldn't the narrative be couldn't the narrative be that people who are say health coaches are fucking geniuses and they have the authority and you should listen to them because they know better. And medical doctors are are there just in case, you don't listen to the Health Guys. You know, just in case you were you were making poor decisions Now you got to go see this guy. You dumb Ass. So what? Ah what would it take for that that narrative to be painted. 37:30.60 Max Shank Well. 37:36.83 mikebledsoe And I mean I think we go back to law right? There are laws regulating Medicine way much more heavily than they are the health industry. So I see that I see the health and well there's ah, there's a way. Ah, okay, let's get into semantics here right? until we have yeah. 37:44.72 Max Shank Oh yeah. 37:54.79 Max Shank That's all we've been doing. 37:56.47 mikebledsoe The Healthcare care industry right? people talk about Healthcare industry and then you know people go? Oh it's not the Healthcare care industry. It's the sick care industry and which is more accurate. Um, and people don't want to hear that they they like oh that's true, but they don't really dig into it. 38:06.35 Max Shank No. 38:16.50 mikebledsoe But ah, the way I've been thinking about more lately is we have a medical system and then we have a health system where we have a health industry and then we have a medical industry and the medical industry is not the health industry and the health industry is not the medical industry and the medical industry is getting all the attention it gets. People are listening to medical doctors are listening to all this but the the health industry has got if anything ah a more diminished voice ah over the yet last year and a half people like people who are more health oriented and preventative like. 38:36.26 Max Shank And. 38:55.50 mikebledsoe Mercola or rob wolf or abel james all these I I have many personal friends who have been censored and ah, what's it called shadow band. 39:09.42 Max Shank We could do. We could do a whole show on censure censorship I think it's always bad though I think that is such a slippery slope because as Thomas Soul rightly Puts its. Not about what will we do? It's who will decide what we do so who gets to be the arbiter of what is true and what is not true and just from ah an uncommon sense standpoint What is the gain. 39:35.60 mikebledsoe Yeah. 39:49.11 Max Shank From silencing people why why would that happen in the first place 39:56.73 mikebledsoe You don't want competing narratives. 39:59.83 Max Shank Yeah, you have to protect your authority right? because the reality is people are very uncomfortable taking responsibility for their own lives. We've been taught from a young age. Let's put that responsibility on someone else, but. Where goes the responsibility also goes the power. So the reality is in America most most death maybe like 80 percent is self-caused by ah by a variety of things and that's a really high number. People commit suicide directly way more than they murder each other which I think shows how kind we ah really are at heart we would rather kill ourselves way higher. Yeah, it's like four x yeah, it's like. 40:46.30 mikebledsoe We have a higher suicide rate than a murder rate is that what you're saying um I'm not familiar with these stats I'm not familiar with murder rates. 40:57.50 Max Shank Yeah, it's not high. It's really low like we barely murder people at all relative to how much we kill ourselves directly with like a toaster in the bathtub or a bottle bottle of pills. 41:05.10 mikebledsoe Yeah I think we've lost more more soldiers in the united states more soldiers to suicide than than battle in the last twenty years 41:14.74 Max Shank Yeah war seems really really tough and then so I have to add on to that statistic people would be like wait 80 percent of people get self-destruct yeah because if you sit on a couch for. 40 years and eat tons of cheetos or whatever your snack of choice is and you become very very fat like you're responsible for when you get diabetes didn't kill you you killed yourself and diabetes was just the way that you ultimately died. So. Most people kill themselves with their choices and there's a distinction I want to make and it's between fault and responsibility because I think if you see a fat kid. That's the parent's fault for sure. But if that. Fat kid grows up to be a fat adult then it's still their responsibility to decide whether or not they want to get healthy so it may not be their fault that they were set up in that situation I mean a lot of people have challenges or opportunities and. 42:17.85 mikebledsoe Yeah, yeah. 42:29.61 Max Shank Think it's going to be tougher. No question but you still have to accept that responsibility and once you realize that most people kill themselves quickly or slowly you start feeling that responsibility once again. For your own life and I think that's extremely valuable in terms of how how you live. 42:54.41 mikebledsoe Yeah, the the fault and responsibility distinctions. Great. That's something um you know at our previous Conversation. We talked about collapse distinction and what you're saying there is people that there what I What we've seen is a collapse distinction around fault and responsibility. And ah, it's a common phrase I've used in coaching which is and may not be your fault but it is your responsibility and I think's I think it's good for people to hear that because fault comes with a lot of times associated with guilt. 43:21.50 Max Shank Great. 43:32.70 mikebledsoe Um, it's my fault now I feel guilty about it when someone stuck gets stuck in and dwells in guilt. They usually have a hard time making the change necessary because now they start now when guilt arises a lot of the behavior that comes out of guilt is punishing 1 ne's self and. 43:49.21 Max Shank You know for 1 43:50.97 mikebledsoe You're going to punish yourself by either making it worse or not changing so you have to get to a place of like looking at fault even if it is your fault is getting to a place of of forgiveness and then that way you can move into being responsibility and I think about responsibility as. Simply the ability to Respond. Do you have the ability to respond yes or no, okay, well then you're responsible now you can choose whether you're going to respond or not, that's that's up to you but again, we're back at choice and so I I think what you said was really important for people to hear is. 44:15.22 Max Shank Great. 44:27.97 mikebledsoe Fault and responsibility because when we look at if I look at Politics. For instance, there's a lot of people. What what? you'll hear them say is when something goes wrong. They we need to figure out who's responsible but they don't actually go look for responsibility. Because they would all have to look at themselves what they do is they they start looking at who to blame? Yeah, so it's like now they're looking at whose fault it is and who they can blame so they can they can ah externalize the shame and guilt so that they can then. 44:49.44 Max Shank The whipping Boy. Right. 45:04.66 mikebledsoe Keep doing whatever the fuck they wanted to do in the first place and while making the public at large you know angry at somebody and manipulating them. So so it's yeah. 45:11.69 Max Shank Doesn't work. It doesn't work once you once you blame,, There's no end to the blaming. That's it. It's 2 Thousand year old book says that we it's It's not that we don't have access to the information. It's that. We let our ego get in the way we want to find retribution. We want to put the responsibility onto somebody else. We want to get ourselves as far away from the bad thing as possible because we want to think of ourselves as good and. That's also the primary barrier to change is we get so attached to the story that we've built up for ourselves I'm good because X Y Z or even I'm bad because X y Z people tend to hang onto them just as tightly which is so. 46:00.42 mikebledsoe E. 46:05.39 Max Shank Fricking Weird right? You are stuck in this story of you and you are trying to get as much permanence as possible. That's what people mostly chase is they want permanence.. That's why um. When we're Dead. We Want little condos for ourselves. Still we want We want to like sit in a graveyard. We're like I'm still here I'm still here hey story of me still here not going anywhere I will last as long as this funny shaped rock and it's a crazy thing that we do So Everything comes back To. Story Story Story. The mass behaviors are story driven everything that we do professionally is often just to find Love. That's what's so funny if I show. That I can protect which in our era now is a house car and a retirement fund and you know you go up a boat a plane an island. 47:12.49 mikebledsoe I'll tell you this yeah, that's accurate and when ah when ah dating my my girlfriend. Ah when she first saw me with with firearms and she saw how good I was with them. She was like oh my god I'm um. Just so turned on right now and I yeah, ah okay I was just I'll just trying to show you how to shoot. But. 47:37.18 Max Shank That's very natural desires to be feel protected and I think that would you say that's the primary reason that ladies go for a wealthier. Dude It's for protection. It's for safety. 47:48.89 mikebledsoe Yeah, well, there's there's but there's protection and then there's provision as well as so ah and they go hand in hand First you got to protect? Yeah, but well. 47:51.36 Max Shank You know that's the that's the bottom of Maslow's hierarchy 48:01.18 Max Shank We don't want to collapse distinction. Those. 48:07.63 mikebledsoe You protect first and then provide second you know yeah, all that all that comes down to safety. Yeah. 48:08.74 Max Shank Um, well we could just call it safety Can you keep me can you keep me safe. Can you keep me safe and well you know the more simple language we can use in this particular case the better it is and. 48:23.90 mikebledsoe Well, there's ah I've also ah gone on the other side of that which is looking at not so much about ah a lot of the safety he has to do with what we want to avoid but also ah how you were how you experienced love as a child. So some people. 48:38.75 Max Shank Ah. 48:41.48 mikebledsoe Especially the the experience with their father whether you're a man or a woman your experience of your father. What was his how did you experience him? What was your fondest memories of him right? So ah for me. Ah I first. 48:52.28 Max Shank Here. 48:59.50 mikebledsoe Remember my my father as as a teacher whereas I noticed some people they saw their father as a provider or a protector and so that's how they show up in relationship so they'll show up because that's how they experience love so on the safety side that's well, it's about avoiding things but on the love side. 49:00.78 Max Shank Earth. And. 49:18.89 mikebledsoe About what we want to move towards and so if you can create safety then the next thing we we look at is well how did you experience your father and ah, how did you experience love from. How did you know that your father loved you like I know that my father loved me because of the way because he taught me and here I am I become. My primary role in my my work is to be a teacher and that's that's my way of showing love and so I also recognize the women that I date tend to be teachers in some way or or they lead in some way instead of I don't care if they make a lot of money because I Never really saw my dad as like. 49:40.16 Max Shank Earth. 49:56.88 mikebledsoe The primary role in him his life wasn't to provide for me but I'm not a lady in a lot of women I talked to that's how they experienced their dad as oh they provided me protected me all that and so that's what they look for. 49:58.77 Max Shank But you're also not a lady. 50:09.10 Max Shank Right? That makes a lot of sense I think we should call our podcast traps and treasures I really do I thought about it a lot I think that's the best 1 we have and it describes look. The reality is. 50:20.47 mikebledsoe I Think it is too. 50:27.90 Max Shank The average person could never listen to another podcast again and live totally well like that's what's so ironic about this experience for me is a lot of the time I feel like people just need to stop taking in so much input just just sit there. Quiet. With a piece of paper and think about what you really want like what is what is treasure mean to you? What does trap mean to you and that's what's so interesting about nurturing is we're implanting watch out for this look out for these. You're going to like these These are really bad. 50:50.69 mikebledsoe Yeah. 51:05.20 Max Shank And as I've said before for Gorillas it's so simple because they're like don't eat this green plant do eat this green plant and it's just do this Don't do this do this don't do this so that's what learning that's how learning can let you skip the line a little bit. Otherwise you have to experience every pain and fire Firsthand. That's the the big advantage of learning secondhand hey if you touch the fire you'll burn your hand now you can believe me. You can burn yourself on the fire and learn for yourself and I think we would agree that you do learn better through Firsthand experience but some things you don't want to risk you don't want to risk it for that traps and treasures. 51:55.79 mikebledsoe Yeah, we now have the name the show traps and treasures now that's right, it's not it's not mike and Max or does a Maxim mike which 1 of us was first. Um. 52:02.31 Max Shank With max and mike with Max and mike by the way I will um I I quit I quit unless my name is first. 52:14.70 mikebledsoe Ah, um that's okay that's okay um I actually don't care that much I I care like I care like 1 percent. Yeah I like 1 percent. Maybe yeah. 52:24.81 Max Shank He cares? he he cares. He just wants to look cool. He cares. 52:33.78 mikebledsoe If I if if you didn't care at all my name First you care if you care 2 percent like I fucking give it to them. Um, so we got to subtitle this there's got to be like what's our. What's our mission statement here. 52:34.28 Max Shank Um. 52:49.47 mikebledsoe Is for traps and treasures. Yeah, who's the audience. What are we helping them with. 52:49.79 Max Shank For for traps and treasures. 53:01.96 Max Shank I mean maybe we can think about this a little bit before we just kill our airtime today. Yeah, let's do some more long awkward pauses I like it. 53:06.29 mikebledsoe Um, it's the best way to end the show and the show with that. We're gonna do some ah research on this if anyone has any suggestions fire him over. So um, yeah in it. 53:20.83 Max Shank That's ah I was thinking that you know there are there are traps and treasures within and without we can go into what to look out for. In a business partner or a romantic partner and we can also look out for what kind of thought patterns that we engage in and how we communicate with ourselves and how we I always talk about framing the experience. How you frame the experience. So for example, it's pretty windy and cloudy today in Southern california but I like it and I appreciate a sound such like a hippie but basically I really appreciate the the difference I like to see the. The wind blowing the leaves around and it looks very textured and cool and it's it's a nice change of pace and then the other experience the other frame of that experience is oh it's it's cold and I I hate this cold weather and it's so windy today and I think. The way that we frame our experience with language is really the only way to be happy ultimately because happiness is sort of like a fleeting feeling and it just depends on what you compare it to probably a better. Goal would be to remove as many of the ego barriers as possible and just flow with the natural rhythms of nature which is what we talked about last week so I think the traps and treasures within and without are. Totally framed by language so it can be languages like a knife you can stab yourself with it or you can perform surgery and save life. 55:30.23 mikebledsoe Beautiful. 55:31.69 Max Shank Language is also the ultimate leverage tool of human beings more than anything by far because it's allowed us to transcend space and time with our ideas and build upon them progressively. So if you want to learn how to use the best. Leverage tool we've ever come up with that's probably a good return on investment for your time. I mean if you just practiced your ability to communicate really practiced for like 2 hours a day within a year you'd be in the top five percent. So no matter what your personal interests were. You could be successful at them. I mean that's how that's how powerful it is I mean you don't need to do anything else you you can have the little phrase you can tell or be told. 56:15.32 mikebledsoe You'd probably be in the top 1 percent. 56:29.46 Max Shank And if you want to dig a hole That's great, but wouldn't you rather come up with a good plan and tell someone else where to dig the hole. But either way you got to tell or be told that's language. 56:35.15 mikebledsoe Um, but you know the highest paid highest paid positions in the world would be salespeople and ceos job. 56:47.10 Max Shank Because they can move people. 56:50.49 mikebledsoe Yeah, and well the job as Ceo is to communicate a vision that enrolls people into gets them excited to do a thing to create the future which he made up with his words or she and then the same with a salesperson I mean sales is just a conversation. 57:00.93 Max Shank Ah. I Love that in a lot of companies. The person who sells the most gets more than the Ceo because that a lot because that is the most important thing and once you realize that that interaction. 57:12.47 mikebledsoe That happens a lot. 57:24.87 Max Shank With the customer I mean you and I have some experience in salesmanship and marketing and what's correct I bet you do ah the the value of being able to. 57:31.76 mikebledsoe I Crush sales now. It's so much fun. 57:44.15 Max Shank Put together a message that converts that you can leverage is crazy because it's not something that everybody can do ah language everybody most powerful tool We have. 57:52.77 mikebledsoe Yeah, it's rare. Yeah yep, or we'll call it there call it there make sure to go to Maankank Dot com. 58:02.24 Max Shank Available to us. Call it there I like it. 58:12.37 mikebledsoe And Max shank and all the other platforms. 58:15.74 Max Shank Make sure you check out mike underscore blood. So on Instagram thank you for joining us for traps and treasures with max and mike. 58:20.54 mikebledsoe I Sure that's me. 58:30.45 mikebledsoe Um, later.

The Modern Therapist's Survival Guide with Curt Widhalm and Katie Vernoy

Therapists Shaming Therapists An interview with Katie Read about therapists shaming each other when they raise their fees or start playing bigger. Curt and Katie talk with Katie about the puritanical culture within the therapist community that leads to group think, public shaming, and milquetoast messaging to mitigate their fear that anything different will be attacked. We look at reasons behind this (jealousy, guilt, shame, and moralism) as well as what therapists can do to step outside of this culture to create more success.   It's time to reimagine therapy and what it means to be a therapist. To support you as a whole person and a therapist, your hosts, Curt Widhalm and Katie Vernoy talk about how to approach the role of therapist in the modern age. Interview with Katie Read, LMFT, Six Figure Flagship Katie takes lessons from her nearly-20 successful years in the field to help clinicians grow...then OUTgrow...their practices. Immediately upon licensure, Katie was made Director of a large Transitional Aged Youth program in Oakland, CA. Later, she was recruited to Direct one of Sacramento's largest Wraparound Programs, and from there she moved into the role of Director of Clinical Supervision, personally supervising 40+ interns towards licensure. Concurrently, Katie had private practices in multiple cities, taught graduate psychology students, and wrote and created therapist training materials. Katie is also a special needs mom and loves helping other moms tune into their own intuition and lead their best-possible lives by taking the sometimes-scary leap into following what's best for them, deep down. She is the creator of: The Clinician to Coach® Academy, The Clini-Coach® Certification, and the Six-Figure Flagship™ Program. She's a little bit obsessed with helping therapists get profitable doing the creative, out-of-the-box, authentic work you're called to do! In this episode we talk about: How therapists are treating each other The concept of trolling, piling on, shame The Article in the Atlantic – New Puritans – and the concept of the illiberal left How identity plays a role and the group dynamics within therapist Facebook groups The shaming related to increasing your fees Katie Read's origin story as an on the street social work The value placed on sacrifice and avoiding guilt for the difference in privilege when working with clients who are impoverished Socially-prescribed perfectionism, self-imposed perfectionism The fine line about what is acceptable to charge or make as a therapist Cancel culture and the lack of allowance for errors Echo chambers, factions, and exclusion The fear of dissenting opinions The low context of the internet paired with the high context nature of a therapist's job Milquetoast messaging to avoid getting attacked Dialing down authenticity to fit into what is acceptable Challenging our financial mindset Cultural and societal factors that frame us as cheap labor The seeming requirement for therapists to suffer in order to understand our clients The reality of therapists as business owners Therapist guilt for “earning money” Feminized professions and the expectation of doing things out the goodness of our hearts Rapidly changing social rules versus entrenchment in what has been How this identity shift is spilling over into real life Jealousy, guilt, and shame, and moralism The best therapists have the worst impostor syndrome How to navigate when you're a therapist going against the grain The importance of every therapist doing their own money mindset work Our Generous Sponsor: Trauma Therapist Network Trauma is highly prevalent in mental health client populations and people are looking for therapists with specialized training and experience in trauma, but they often don't know where to start. If you've ever looked for a trauma therapist, you know it can be hard to discern who knows what and whether or not they're the right fit for you. There are so many types of trauma and so many different ways to heal. That's why Laura Reagan, LCSW-C created Trauma Therapist Network.  Trauma Therapist Network is a new resource for anyone who wants to learn about trauma and how it shows up in our lives. This new site has articles, resources and podcasts for learning about trauma and its effects, as well as a directory exclusively for trauma therapists to let people know how they work and what they specialize in, so potential clients can find them. Trauma Therapist Network therapist profiles include the types of trauma specialized in, populations served and therapy methods used, making it easier for potential clients to find the right therapist who can help them.  The Network is more than a directory, though. It's a community. All members are invited to attend community meetings to connect, consult and network with colleagues around the country. Join our growing community of trauma therapists and get 20% off your first month using the promo code:  MTSG20 at www.traumatherapistnetwork.com.   Resources mentioned: We've pulled together resources mentioned in this episode and put together some handy-dandy links. Please note that some of the links below may be affiliate links, so if you purchase after clicking below, we may get a little bit of cash in our pockets. We thank you in advance! Katie Read's program: Six Figure Flagship Article in the Atlantic – The New Puritans by Anne Applebaum   Relevant Episodes: Therapist Haters and Trolls Advocacy in the Wake of Looming Mental Healthcare Workforce Shortages In it for the Money? Overcoming Your Poverty Mindset (with Tiffany McLain) Not Your Typical Psychotherapist (with Ernesto Segismundo) How to Overcome Impostor Syndrome to leave your Agency Job (with Patrick Casale)   Connect with us! Our Facebook Group – The Modern Therapists Group  Our consultation services: The Fifty-Minute Hour Who we are: Curt Widhalm is in private practice in the Los Angeles area. He is the cofounder of the Therapy Reimagined conference, an Adjunct Professor at Pepperdine University and CSUN, a former Subject Matter Expert for the California Board of Behavioral Sciences, former CFO of the California Association of Marriage and Family Therapists, and a loving husband and father. He is 1/2 great person, 1/2 provocateur, and 1/2 geek, in that order. He dabbles in the dark art of making "dad jokes" and usually has a half-empty cup of coffee somewhere nearby. Learn more at: www.curtwidhalm.com Katie Vernoy is a Licensed Marriage and Family Therapist, coach, and consultant supporting leaders, visionaries, executives, and helping professionals to create sustainable careers. Katie, with Curt, has developed workshops and a conference, Therapy Reimagined, to support therapists navigating through the modern challenges of this profession. Katie is also a former President of the California Association of Marriage and Family Therapists. In her spare time, Katie is secretly siphoning off Curt's youthful energy, so that she can take over the world. Learn more at: www.katievernoy.com A Quick Note: Our opinions are our own. We are only speaking for ourselves – except when we speak for each other, or over each other. We're working on it. Our guests are also only speaking for themselves and have their own opinions. We aren't trying to take their voice, and no one speaks for us either. Mostly because they don't want to, but hey.   Stay in Touch: www.mtsgpodcast.com www.therapyreimagined.com Our Facebook Group – The Modern Therapist's Group https://www.facebook.com/therapyreimagined/ https://twitter.com/therapymovement https://www.instagram.com/therapyreimagined/   Credits: Voice Over by DW McCann https://www.facebook.com/McCannDW/ Music by Crystal Grooms Mangano http://www.crystalmangano.com/   Transcript (Autogenerated) Curt Widhalm  00:00 This episode is sponsored by Trauma Therapist Network.   Katie Vernoy  00:04 Trauma therapist network is a new resource for anyone who wants to learn about trauma and how it shows up in our lives. This new site has articles, resources and podcasts for learning about trauma and its effects, as well as a directory exclusively for trauma therapists to let people know how they work, and what they specialize in so potential clients can find them. Visit trauma therapist network.com To learn more,   Curt Widhalm  00:27 Listen at the end of the episode for more about the trauma therapist network.   Announcer  00:31 You're listening to the modern therapist Survival Guide, where therapists live, breed and practice as human beings to support you as a whole person and a therapist. Here are your hosts, Kurt Wilhelm and Katie Vernoy.   Curt Widhalm  00:47 Welcome back modern therapists, this is modern therapist Survival Guide. I'm Curt Widhalm with Katie Vernoy. BLEEP you! This is the podcast where we talk about all things therapists, therapy related, therapist communities. And we are talking about the ways that we treat each other and a lot of this happens in the online groups. You know who you are. And   Katie Read  01:20 But do they?   Curt Widhalm  01:22 I think they do. Well, helping us here in this conversation today coming back to the show. Our good friend Katie Read. So before we before we start shaming the shamers.   Katie Vernoy  01:37 For shame!   Curt Widhalm  01:39 Tell us a little bit about yourself and what you're bringing into the world.   Katie Read  01:44 Hi, I'm Katie Read. Thank you for having me back. I missed you guys. We haven't been around here for a while.   Katie Vernoy  01:50 I know!   Katie Read  01:51 Good to be back. Although I did get to see you in person at the conference recently, which was amazing. So anyway, you can find me over at six figure flagship dot com. I do. One of the things that plenty of therapists like to shame, which is encouraging therapists who are creative who had that little spark that maybe someday they want to outgrow the therapist office, I... whispering under my hand here, I help them do that. Lest all the shamers jumped out at us. That's what I do. But I have like you been very active in therapists groups over the last couple years, and been often just shocked by the level of shaming that can happen in these groups. And it's so funny, I don't know about you guys. I've told this to other people, non therapists, like neighbors, friends just being like, Yeah, it's amazing. Those groups, people are astounded to hear that therapists would shame one another like it would never occur to them that therapists would be because they think of us all as being nice and wonderful and accepting and loving and caring and empathic, and all of these things. And I know we all three have had conversations in the background, like why does that fall apart on the internet, and I really do think it's just on the internet. It's not in person. It's just on the internet, but on the internet and therapists group. So not that I have any grand answers for this. But I'm super interested in this conversation today.   Katie Vernoy  03:18 We've talked about this in some ways before, and we'll link to those episodes in the show notes that we've got a therapist, haters and trolls. And there's a couple others, I'll look at them when I'm getting ready to put this together. But to me, I think the biggest thing that I see that that has always been shocking to me is the the piling on, that happens at someone put something out there, it becomes given that that is wrong and bad. And somebody has an opinion that this is wrong and bad. And then there's the defenders, but then there are the piler on-ers, is that is that a word? The people that then cosign on this negative information. And then all of a sudden, it's like the snowball effect. And there's like, hundreds of comments, and you are horrible and all of this stuff. And I think that there is an element of this that I think we do want to call people out when they're doing things that are harmful. I think the the criteria for what is harmful sometimes feels a little bit wiggly to me   Curt Widhalm  04:26 I kind of started looking at this more from just kind of a an academic approach. And what sparked this, for me was an article in The Atlantic called the new Puritans by Anne Applebaum. And it's an incredible article, we'll link to it in the show notes. But it starts to talk about the illiberal left, which many therapists politically identify in kind of this political compass of the left side. And what happens in echo chambers like there pice groups is that it becomes many people coming with a desire for positive social change and social mores are changing that. We've seen this happen not only in society, but in our field over the last 20 years. But what happens seemingly is, we're developing this this collective identity in these groups that becomes part of our own identities and seeing other people acting even slightly different than how we would act ends up becoming almost there's harm to our own self identity that needs to be processed and spoken out against when it comes to things like, hey, I want to raise my fees on my clients by $5 per session.   Katie Read  05:51 I find this one absolutely fascinating because I, I don't think I've ever seen a post go by in a group where a therapist has said, Hey, I'm thinking about raising my fees, and have not gotten at least some very heavy negativity thrown their way. Which is so fascinating to me. Because if you step back and you look at any career on Earth, we assume about every human being in the world, that you will always be on a quest to kind of step up to the next level in your career step up to the next level in your income. This is understood if anyone tells you they've gotten a raise, they've gotten a promotion, you say congrats, that's great. When therapists who are self employed, who have only themselves to answer to they are their own bosses, and when they say it's time for my yearly raise, and I have earned my yearly raise this year, and they attempt to give it to themselves, what do the therapist communities often do? Jump in with really crazy stuff really crazy? Oh, I don't know, I didn't get into this career to make money. I couldn't imagine putting my clients under that kind of strange, just really, really deeply shaming words coming at them. And I find it fascinating. You know, and I'm not exactly sure where it comes from. But it's interesting, because in prepping for this podcast, I was thinking about my early days as an intern and, and I do wonder, probably, at least for me, this was part of it. I spent many years even before I went to grad school, I was doing social work type roles in very, very, very impoverished areas. And then during grad school, I was working with foster kids. And then after grad school, I was an on the street social worker in inner city, Oakland, with teenagers and young adults, most of whom were homeless, or they were sex workers or drug addicts, gang members, like Oh, terrible, really difficult lives, right, like really terrible life situations. And I was dead broke, that job paid next to nothing, it was an internship job. And in a way, coming home to my crappy apartment, where people got mugged right outside in broad daylight and eating my ramen noodles, because that was all I could afford. I didn't have to feel so guilty going into work the next day, because my life was certainly better than my clients lives were at that time. But it was still rough, like things were still rough at my end. And I wonder if I remember at the time, I would say to people, I would say, this is the hardest work you can imagine doing. But if you can do it, you just have to do it. Because these people just need the help. And they need the support. And they need people on the street. And I had this very grand idea of what it was to be an on the street social worker doing that kind of work, and, and staying poor for it. And oh, it took me a long, long time to realize that I had to put the air mask on myself first, you know, like on the plane, like it took me a very long time to come to that change. But I wonder if some part of that for a lot of us does start because I think many of us do start in those types of jobs, those types of internships where you're seeing such poverty, you're seeing such difficult lives and you do feel a guilt around that.   Curt Widhalm  08:57 Even in your story here. Part of what I'm hearing is you lead that off with this is unique to therapists. So you're already framing this as part of therapist identity means that you have to do these certain things. Look at the shame that we put on people who go straight from grad school into private practice, like they are bypassing part of that identity. And, you know, the echoes of the criticisms is, well, that's such a privileged place to come from that you didn't have to go through this with all of these other clients. And a big part of that is in this identity becomes this thing called socially prescribed perfectionism that you must do this because what you're doing reflects on me and in combination with socially prescribed perfectionism comes this self imposed perfectionism that I must act this way. Yeah. And if other people whose identities reflects on the same way as mine And that's not how I see myself doing, I have to deal with that internal conflict, and it's much easier to tear you down than it is for me to wrestle with. All right, you do you and I'll do me and we'll both potentially help out the people that we're best suited to help out with.   Katie Read  10:19 That's so interesting. And it's so true. And I wonder. So like, I'm thinking about the people who I did know from grad school who came from different backgrounds who did go straight into private practice and whatnot. And you do wonder, do they feel any of that guilt? Do they carry any of that with them? Does that bounce off of them that they're like, what I was doing exactly what you just said, Curt, like what I was meant to do, I was helping the people I was meant to help. This is where I'm well suited. It's just interesting.   Katie Vernoy  10:45 And it's, it's something where this idea of perfectionism what what resonated for me was this, it's very thinly defined. And not only have I heard the, the negative backlash around charging a high fee, and and I don't know, necessarily that I've seen a lot of the negative feedback with I'm raising my fee by $5 Next year, but it's anybody that has a premium fee gets roasted. And anyone that talks about charging very little or being on insurance panels, also gets roasted, because you're undervaluing the profession, you're, you're making it harder for me to make money. And so there's this really fine line of what's acceptable,   Katie Read  11:27 Acceptable, huh.   Katie Vernoy  11:28 And so this this perfectionism around, I can't, I can't make too much, but I also can't charge too little. It just it feels very crazy making. And I think this, this notion of we're trying to validate our own identity through making everyone else be like us, or like, what the collective has decided is okay, feels kind of scary.   Curt Widhalm  11:57 And the extension of this goes beyond just, you know, the parent comments in some of these, these groups, that there becomes almost this effort to cancel people across multiple posts, that there seems to be so little room for error, and especially in late, like I said, social mores changing of, you know, a lot of the things that I see is, you know, not doing the emotional work or not doing the education work for other therapists who are potentially asking questions around things like critical race theory and involving, you know, wonderment about communities that they might not have experience with that. While there is validity on both sides is I've seen some of this extension go across, you know, bringing up these kinds of arguments across separate posts across separate days, weeks, even months, that his efforts towards this cancel culture esque type thing that serves to only make this problem even worse, by creating even stronger echo chambers of we're only going to listen to people who think exactly like us. And what ends up happening is we get these factions of, you know, well, here's the group of like minded people who sit over here. And here's the group of like minded people who sit over here, and here's the people who are okay with microwaving fish in the office, and they're okay in their own corner. But then it just makes it to where it's uninviting for anybody to have any kind of a dissenting opinion. Because and this is particular to the internet groups that you brought up. Here at the beginning, Katie, internet culture is very, very low context. And therapists are very, very high context people. This is a sociological phenomenon, that high context is understanding people where they're coming from, you know, we spend years studying how to get the high context of our clients. And we're used to communicating with people in this very, very high context sort of way. And then you get like one paragraph on a Facebook post to be able to try and explain something to somebody else. And it's just this very, really low context like fast moving group of people who kind of opt in and opt out but aren't consistently there. That makes it really enticing to pick on well, you're missing all of these high context things that just it's critical, and it's something that because of internet culture, therapists aren't used to having to receive information in that low context sort of way in embracing how we communicate online. Mind. In other words, we think that we're really smart in some areas of our life, and therefore all areas of our life should be really smart. But the internet is not that place.   Katie Read  15:11 And the internet dumbs us down. Well, it's interesting. And a moment ago, I just lost my train of thought you had said something a moment ago that   Curt Widhalm  15:18 I do that to people.   Katie Vernoy  15:20 Just keep talking, it's   Katie Read  15:22 10 minutes back. There was something I just lost it   Katie Vernoy  15:27 Well, keep thinking because I had something you know, a few minutes back when you were talking about your, your experience as kind of an on the on the streets, social worker and having to overcome that self imposed identity around if I am not so privileged, I don't feel guilty going to work. How did you work to overcome that? Because I think we're looking at being shamed for it. And and you did it within that culture, like I know, that I would imagine you have probably been shamed for for what you do, as you know, a six figure flagship even having that is so money title. So right, having the right so and so actually, how do you how have you gotten through it, I guess.   Katie Read  16:12 Yeah. And I can tell my story, but it's interesting, because you just reminded me of what Curt had said that I had wanted to comment on. Because it's all related. You had to Curt the end. And even Katie had said previously, there's this very narrow band of what kind of therapists are willing to accept as appropriate. And because the echo chambers are loud, and because the pile on culture is intense, within therapists groups, what happens is people are terrified to speak. And so we end up with very very milquetoast messaging. That doesn't challenge that doesn't potentially disagree, we end up with people who only want a message in ways that they will not be attacked for because as we all know, it's very painful and scary. If someone's coming at you online, some stranger online and other people are piling on and everyone would love to avoid ever having that situation. So we dial down what is true, what is authentic, what is important, we dial it down into what we hope will fit this narrow little brass band of appropriateness. And it's interesting like us, for me, it took me years and years. I mean, I eventually went from we eventually moved my husband and I to a different town, I opened up a small private practice. And it's funny, I was one of those therapists, and I was in California, where therapy rates are high. But I was the person where I was charging $90 an hour. And I was the person who set it like this, when a new client came in or called me and said, What's your fee? I went? Well, it's 90. But I can slide I can slide. What do you need, I mean, I can do whatever you need, I can really I get whatever you need, whatever you need, like that was me all the time. Because again, I was still carrying this guilt, about even charging that much and feeling like well, I couldn't even afford to go see me for therapy. So how can I think somebody else's, I was very much in my clients pockets. And what was really interesting was, I had been in this office for a while, you know, I rented my time other people came in and out. And there were several interns in the office, all supervised by this one supervisor. And I was speaking with one of the interns when we were crossing paths one day, and at this point, I had been a licensed therapist. For years, I had worked my way through community mental health up to being a program director, I had taught grad school, I had done all these things. And I was still charging this low rate because of my own internal money issues. And this intern, I don't know how we got on the subject. But she said, Oh, yeah, our supervisor now she was still in grad school. There's a person in her first year of grad school, an intern seeing clients. And she said, Well, our supervisor won't let us start any lower than 125 as our hourly rate, we're not allowed to slide under that they were private pay 125 for the interns. And my mind was blown. That here I was with years of experience behind me years of training behind me. And I it really in that moment hit me I was like I am doing this wrong. I am absolutely doing this wrong. And I need to start working on this. And some of it was working on my money mindset, honestly, for me, doing what I eventually did and wanting to outgrow the office that was motivated by different things like we moved states and then I wasn't licensed for a year while I went through the licensure process in a new state. So my path out of the office and outgrowing the office was sort of organic. It wasn't a pre plan type of thing. It just happened that I moved into coaching and ended up loving it. But within the coaching world, you really really get challenged very quickly on your financial mindset. And you really actually learn very quickly that the norm in the rest of the world is if you bring great value into someone's life, you are well paid for it. And we therapists continually underestimate the great, great, transformative, wildly important value that we bring into people lives. And whether you choose to continue to do it in the context of therapy or to write a book, or to go on a speaking tour to do any of the number of things that therapists can go out in the world, and do, we do by virtue of our passion, our education, all of these things, we bring great value we bring about great transformation in people's lives, and in most of the rest of the world, that would be naturally richly rewarded. But because of sort of the culture, and I honestly think part of it is just the culture of how government even is set up that we need to be able to have cheap labor to go out and work with the people who need help the most. And so many of us, like we said, started off in community mental health in some form, or in schools, which are very underfunded just, we start off as sort of cheap labor. And it's hard to get out of that mindset that we should always remain just cheap labor, or that what we do is not that highly valued in society where, of course, I don't know about you, I remember, every therapist I've had, and I remember them dearly. And they were hugely impactful at those times in my life, and every one of your clients and everybody out there listening. It's the exact same way, you're hugely impactful.   Curt Widhalm  21:14 You know, as I'm listening to this, and going back to that piece by Anne Applebaum, she makes mention of The Scarlet Letter as kind of this this parallel of what's going on with the liberal left. And the thing about this is one of that one of the major themes from the scarlet letter is the the priest who impregnates Hester, I'm forgetting his name right offhand. But he is seen as more virtuous because his sermons have so much empathy, from his own sins that there's almost this parallel what's going on with the groups here that we're seeing of like, we have suffered this injustice. And therefore we're better at what we do in relating to our clients, because we've done this. And especially when it comes to things like privilege and fees in this kind of stuff. It's like, you're, you're not able to relate to your clients as well. Because you haven't done this suffering, and you haven't done this, and therefore, you must suffer in order to be able to be a better therapist.   Katie Read  22:21 Yeah, yeah. Yeah, that's so interesting, isn't it. And so as some of that just coming down, is that just back to that therapist skills, we were talking just today, I had my meeting with my folks in my clinic coach, six figure flagship, and we were talking, there's one therapist, she's putting an unbelievable amount of work into an event that she's producing just probably hundreds of hours of her labor is going into this work. It's a passion project. She's so excited about it. And she came to the group and she said, I'm donating all the proceeds to charity. And I was like,   Katie Vernoy  22:56 Oh, wow.   Katie Read  22:59 And so we really, we took it apart a lot, like we coach through it a lot in the group. And today in our meeting, and I was, like, you know, like part of this here is that we are also business owners. And when you put in hundreds of hours of unpaid labor on something, you actually need to retain at least the majority of your profits, so that you can reinvest them into your own business, so that you can stay afloat, have savings of money for like all the things that we need to do. But really, to me, what I was hearing was therapist skill was I don't want it to look to anyone, like I'm trying to actually make any money. I want it to look like out of the goodness of my heart, I'm putting on this big event for all my fellow therapists to learn and grow. But God forbid someone think I might earn money from doing this. Yeah. And so it's just it was fascinating, because I don't think there's any other profession, where they would even consider for a minute giving every single bit of all this labor, all this unpaid labor straight to charity, without a second thought, maybe with many second thoughts, but feeling like this is what I should do.   Katie Vernoy  24:05 Yeah, yeah, I just I think about teachers, I think about oftentimes nurses, part of it is kind of feminized professions do have this this impact where the majority of the folks in those professions are non male. And so there is an expectation, this is something we should be doing out of the goodness of our hearts. And it seems very mercenary if we would ask for money for it. You know, there are, you know, during the pandemic, these poor teachers, were finally getting recognition for what they actually do for folks' kids. But as soon as you know, even even well into the pandemic I started to get because I work with some teachers. I was started hearing that people were complaining that the teachers weren't doing enough and we're paying their salaries and why aren't they doing enough? And it's like, whoa, you know, or if they go on strike that is just heartless. So it's heartless. And it's kind of like would you work for the salary that they work for? And then we've seen the same with the Kaiser therapists. That was one of the things that happened. We see the same with nurses.   Curt Widhalm  25:11 I mean, our episode, recently where we talked about, you know, let's just throw more Subway sandwiches at therapists,   Katie Vernoy  25:19 workforce shortage at episode that we just put up.   Curt Widhalm  25:21 Yeah, it's just it's throwing more Subway sandwiches at therapists because, you know, how dare you ask for money. And part of this is as a field that our median age is higher than many other fields. And that anytime that we have a field that has rapidly changing social rules to it, it makes it to where, especially with fields that are older, like ours, the entrenchment becomes a lot more rigid. And so I think that that's contributing to part of this, too, is that there's, there's this almost cultural battle that we're facing within our field that is leading to a new identity. And if we're honest about it, we contribute to that a lot here in the podcast, we do call out things that we don't like, including calling out other therapists calling out other therapists. So we do encourage you to let us know your thoughts and feelings on this publicly in any of the therapist groups. But this happens, systemically it happens individually as well. And, you know, I do see this happening outside of the therapist groups, and actually it is spilling over into in real life as well. To hearing this, you know, from some of the practices, hiring people, where I think rightfully, employees entering into the workforce are asking for living wages. And it is a power balance shifts that is leading to things like some of the workforce shortages that we talked about in the other episode.   Katie Read  27:14 Let me ask you, Curt, because as you were talking about sort of the field being a little bit older, in terms of median age and whatnot, I wonder, and I'm curious, just either of your thoughts on this. Do you feel like so let's say you are out there, whatever age you are, really, but you're a therapist, you've kind of become acclimated to the 50k a year therapist average median income, you've kind of surrendered yourself to the fact that you have a very hard job that you can't talk to anyone about, that you are bound by ethics and confidentiality, that you don't get to come home and vent about your day, you have to keep a lot of things bottled up. And at the same time, you know, you're probably worried every month, if you have a $400 car bill this month, it's gonna throw you over the edge, you're not going to have a cushion for that. And then you go into a therapist group, and you see somebody who says, I charge 200 an hour in my area, and I'm doing great and everything's fine. Do you think part of this backlash is just that feeling of threat, that you can't do that or that you haven't chosen that or that you haven't gone to do whatever it is you need to do internally, whatever that sort of money work is that you need to do to actually start charging closer to your worth as an experienced person in the field?   Curt Widhalm  28:30 Absolutely. 100% think that a lot of where we socially prescribe other therapists to be comes from our own anecdotal histories. And our inability is to deal with our own crap when it comes to our relationships to money, our relationships to our professional identities, that and, you know, this even happens in things that I see like in law ethics workshops, that I teach that it's not even just about money thing, but just how much we distance ourselves from other people who make mistakes. You know, if somebody's name shows up in the spider pages, the disciplinary actions, how quickly are to just like, unfriend them or take them off of our LinkedIn connections? Even if it's something that might points closer to us, you know, you see this and things like people who admit to not being caught up on their notes and just kind of the furthering away, you know, these are ethical and legal responsibilities that we have in our profession. And as compassionate people we tend to have very little compassion for the other people in our profession. When they don't do the same kinds of steps that we think that we should be doing or have been doing all along ourselves.   Katie Vernoy  29:52 You're really saying jealousy, guilt and shame.   Curt Widhalm  29:54 Yes!   Katie Vernoy  29:56 Because I think of like the especially I think with the environment around you, Katie, which is like the six figure flagship, it's people outgrowing the office, it's that kind of notion of very successful, you know, I'm going to make a lot of money, I'm going to, I'm going to live a life. And and you don't argue that that comes easily. I saw your post on kind of hustle seasons. And so I appreciate that. But I think that there's this notion that you can work really hard, create something that's more sustainable and make a lot of money. And I think there's a jealousy there, either of the energy that you personally have. I know I'm jealous of your energy. And then there's also the success that people have, I think there's a jealousy there. And so then it's that kind of like, well, I didn't want it anyway, like that. That's wrong, because I don't think I can get it. I'm jealous that you have it. And so I don't really want it. And this, there's all of these moral reasons and moralizing around why I don't want it. I think what you're talking about Curt is kind of this guilt and shame over, I've been doing things wrong. I can't do that, because it goes against these self imposed values and morals that I've put around being a hard worker, that is one of the people and I am not going to I'm not in this for the money. And I'm doing this because it's so valuable. And even thinking about money is so mercenary and wrong. And so there's that guilt and shame of wanting more, but feeling like it goes against either the collective morals or the personal morals. And so to me, it's like if we think about guilt, shame, and jealousy, I mean, the fact that there is so many of those emotions that come out in these public shreddings, in these social media groups or on pages or whatever, like it just it seems strange to me, that therapist would would have those in such huge, huge, impactful ways.   Katie Read  31:54 It's interesting, too, because I was just putting together a workshop where we talked about how typically the best therapists tend to have the worst imposter syndrome. And I think imposter syndrome falls into what you're talking about, and the fact that because we all tend to be pretty intellectual, pretty academic, you know, even those of us who are super heart led, we all still have like our little academic streak. And I think that we all walk around with this belief that if I am not the top researcher in a particular field, I have nothing to say it's very black and white. If I am not the absolute most published person in this particular theory, I should just sit down and shut up, I know nothing, as opposed to being able to see all the gradients, being able to see all of the expertise that everyone has and that you can bring in that could benefit so many more people. If you were brave enough to kind of fight your own imposter syndrome. Stand up, talk about what you know, help even more people that way.   Katie Vernoy  32:55 Yeah.   Katie Read  32:56 But we get very caught in that. Because this will not win a Pulitzer, I might as well not even write it. I might as well not even try it. And I just want what's the point? What's   Katie Vernoy  33:06 and and how dare you, other person that is doing this? How dare you do that? Because I've decided, even though I may have more knowledge than you   Katie Read  33:17 Yes,   Katie Vernoy  33:17 that I'm not good enough to speak on it. So how dare you!   Katie Read  33:20 How dare you? Exactly. Oh, isn't that so true. And I do think this is what we see play out in therapists groups. And I do think it's terribly sad, because at the end of the day, to me, I always think the lay public are the only losers here. Because when you choose to not speak out, when you choose to not share what you know, when you choose to not be open and vulnerable, and who you are, and say, I know I might not be the world renowned expert on XYZ. But let me tell you a little bit about what I do know, because you might think it's interesting. And I think the thing a lot of therapists don't realize because we're sort of taught to write dissertation style for everything is that the average person doesn't want that. They do want the little tidbit. They do want the little micro snippet that you pulled from an interesting article you read that you couldn't get out of your mind yesterday, share that that's what they want to because it'll get into their head too and it'll help them in their life just like it helps you they don't need your full scope dissertation on anything.   Katie Vernoy  34:19 Yeah.   Curt Widhalm  34:20 So is the answer and stop hanging out with other therapists?   Katie Read  34:29 I don't know let's vote should we go around and vote? I you know it's interesting though, you I definitely think it's something that we talk about in our group is that we talked about how when you even when I when I first started doing the most basic stuff, offering like copywriting for therapists offering basic marketing for therapists in this tiny little way like putting a post on Facebook Hey, need help with your copywriting? You know, these tiny little ways? I had rude people I had predicted people I know going well that's never gonna go anywhere. What are you even doing? Why are you doing that? And so I just want all my students like any time, you are going against the grain a little bit breaking the mold a little bit of what it means to be a helping professional, because what I believe at the end of the day is what you call it doesn't matter as much as what you're actually doing. Are you out there helping people in some form? Is your internal calling to be out there helping people in some form? Great, are you doing it? If you are, and if you feel good and authentic, and you know that you are living out your calling that you are truly helping people in some form? Does it matter if you call it therapy today, and maybe tomorrow, it's consulting, and you have consulting clients, and maybe the next day you build an online course where you help people and maybe you go speak at a school the next day, doesn't matter what form it's in, that you're helping people as long as you are authentically helping people what you were called to do, does the name matter? So you can hang out with a therapist like that. Kurt,   Katie Vernoy  36:00 I hear you saying that hanging out with therapists who have that broader perspective that aren't so tied into the Puritan culture is probably helpful for folks that are really coming, that are pushing against the grain in some way. And and I really resonate with that, because I think that's, that's why we found each other and   Katie Read  36:18 That's what you've done   Katie Vernoy  36:22 We've been trying, you know, we don't we don't avoid the purity culture, we just try to push back against it. But I think it's, it's something where when you're really trying to step out and help people in a bigger way, it is, it is important that you find the right people to spend time with because you can get tamped down by purity culture,   Katie Read  36:40 You can. Well, and I should say this, like for a lot of us, I know for me, when I was I think it is important for therapists to do money work on ourselves, go read the self help books, go, you know, sign up with Tiffany...   Curt Widhalm  36:53 GO DO YOUR OWN RESEARCH!   Katie Read  36:58 I think it's important to do that. And I think it's important to hang out with people who get it and have done it. And I think for all of us to, there is a way that you can feel good about what you charge and feel good about what you give back. And that that is going to be different for everyone, whether it's that you do a couple free or cheap sessions every single week, or you give a certain amount to charity every year, like whatever that looks like for you. You can still set this up in a way where you're not going to feel like a greedy bastard, for earning a good living where you still know that you are I mean, for me, when I started outgrowing the office, honestly, my entire motivation was security. My husband worked at a large multinational corporation that was doing layoffs, rolling layoffs every single month. And every single month, it felt like we were going to be any minute we were going to be homeless because he was going to get laid off. And that was the bread and butter of the family. And what then and all I really wanted was some security. And so that drove me and I was like I said we had moved states. And so I didn't have a license in my new state. I couldn't just go open a therapy office, it drove me to get creative and do something else. But I think when your motivation comes from that, like there's, I don't know, a lot of therapists who are like, I'm gonna go get rich so that I can have seven maaser body it's like, it's just not who we are, you know, like, that's just not what we're doing here.   Katie Vernoy  38:16 Well, we do have to end here, but but I think we also if there is a therapist that wants to get ready to get seven Montserrado for months, seven months. Go for it do. So before we close up, where can people find you?   Katie Read  38:30 Six Figure flagship.com is the main program that we run right now it's an application only program for mental health therapists who do want to outgrow the office, that is the best place to find me. And otherwise, I'll just be kind of hanging out with you guys.   Katie Vernoy  38:44 I love it. Always again, it   Curt Widhalm  38:47 We will include a link to Katie's websites in our show notes. You can find those over at MTS g podcast.com. And follow us on our social media join our Facebook groups modern therapists group and   Katie Read  39:01 Or we will shame you.    Curt Widhalm  39:03 we actually have a really good group that seems to   Katie Read  39:08 No I said we will shame them for not joining it, we find them.   Curt Widhalm  39:14 Some we will post those links and until next time, I'm Curt Widhalm with Katie Vernoy And Katie Read.   Katie Vernoy  39:20 Thanks again to our sponsor, Trauma Therapist Network.   Curt Widhalm  39:24 If you've ever looked for a trauma therapist, you can know it can be hard to discern who knows what and whether or not they're the right fit for you. There's so many types of trauma and so many different ways to heal. That's why Laura Reagan LCSW WC created trauma therapist network. Trauma therapist network therapist profiles include the types of trauma specialized in population served therapy methods used, making it easier for potential clients to find the right therapist who can help them. Network is more than a directory though it's a community. All members are invited to attend community meetings to connect consults and network with colleagues around the country.   Katie Vernoy  40:01 Join the growing community of trauma therapists and get 20% off your first month using the promo code MTSG20. At trauma therapist network.com Once again that's capital MTSG, the number 20 at Trauma therapist network.com   Announcer  40:17 Thank you for listening to the modern therapist Survival Guide. Learn more about who we are and what we do at MTS g podcast.com. You can also join us on Facebook and Twitter. And please don't forget to subscribe so you don't miss any of our episodes.