Podcast appearances and mentions of cohen brothers

Trusting the process is a really important way to free yourself, and the film, to discover what it is.Viridiana Lieberman is an award-winning documentary filmmaker. She recently edited the Netflix sensation The Perfect Neighbor.In this interview we talk:* Viri's love of the film Contact* Immersion as the core goal in her filmmaking* Her editing tools and workflow* Film school reflections* The philosophy and process behind The Perfect Neighbor — crafting a fully immersive, evidence-only narrative and syncing all audio to its original image.* Her thoughts on notes and collaboration* Techniques for seeing a cut with fresh eyesYou can see all of Viri's credits on her IMD page here.Thanks for reading The Creativity, Education, and Leadership Newsletter! Subscribe for free to receive new posts and support my work.Here is an AI-generated transcript of our conversation. Don't come for me.BEN: Viri, thank you so much for joining us today.VIRI: Oh, thank you for having me. I'm excited to be here.BEN: And I always like to start with a fun question. So senior year of high school, what music were you listening to?VIRI: Oh my goodness. Well, I'm class of 2000, so I mean. I don't even know how to answer this question because I listen to everything.I'm like one of those people I was raving, so I had techno in my system. I have a lot of like, um. The, like, everything from Baby Ann to Tsta. Like, there was like, there was a lot, um, Oak and like Paul Oak and Full, there was like techno. Okay. Then there was folk music because I loved, so Ani DeFranco was the soundtrack of my life, you know, and I was listening to Tori Amos and all that.Okay. And then there's like weird things that slip in, like fuel, you know, like whatever. Who was staying? I don't remember when they came out. But the point is there was like all these intersections, whether I was raving or I was at Warp Tour or I was like at Lili Fair, all of those things were happening in my music taste and whenever I get to hear those songs and like that, that back late nineties, um, rolling into the Ox.Yeah.BEN: I love the Venn diagram of techno and folk music.VIRI: Yeah.BEN: Yeah. What, are you a fan of the film inside Lou and Davis?VIRI: Uh, yes. Yes. I need to watch it again. I watched it once and now you're saying it, and I'm like writing it on my to-dos,BEN: but yes, it, it, the first time I saw it. I saw in the East Village, actually in the theater, and I just, I'm a Cohen Brothers fan, but I didn't love it.Mm-hmm. But it, it stayed on my mind and yeah. Now I probably rewatch it once a year. It might, yeah. In my, in my, on my list, it might be their best film. It's so good. Oh,VIRI: now I'm gonna, I'm putting it on my, I'm literally writing it on my, um, post-it to watch it.BEN: I'mVIRI: always looking for things to watch in the evening.BEN: What, what are some of the docs that kind of lit your flame, that really turned you on?VIRI: Uh, this is one of those questions that I, full transparency, get very embarrassed about because I actually did not have a path of documentary set for me from my film Loving Passion. I mean, when I graduated film school, the one thing I knew I didn't wanna do was documentary, which is hilarious now.Hilarious. My parents laugh about it regularly. Um. Because I had not had a good documentary education. I mean, no one had shown me docs that felt immersive and cinematic. I mean, I had seen docs that were smart, you know, that, but, but they felt, for me, they didn't feel as emotional. They felt sterile. Like there were just, I had seen the most cliched, basic, ignorant read of doc.And so I, you know, I dreamed of making space epics and giant studio films. Contact was my favorite movie. I so like there was everything that about, you know, when I was in film school, you know, I was going to see those movies and I was just chasing that high, that sensory high, that cinematic experience.And I didn't realize that documentaries could be. So it's not, you know, ever since then have I seen docs that I think are incredible. Sure. But when I think about my origin tale, I think I was always chasing a pretty. Not classic, but you know, familiar cinematic lens of the time that I was raised in. But it was fiction.It was fiction movies. And I think when I found Docs, you know, when I was, the very long story short of that is I was looking for a job and had a friend who made docs and I was like, put me in coach, you know, as an editor. And she was like, you've never cut a documentary before. I love you. Uh, but not today.But no, she hired me as an archival producer and then I worked my way up and I said, no, okay, blah, blah, blah. So that path showed me, like I started working on documentaries, seeing more documentaries, and then I was always chasing that cinema high, which by the way, documentaries do incredibly, you know, and have for many decades.But I hadn't met them yet. And I think that really informs. What I love to do in Docs, you know, I mean, I think like I, there's a lot that I like to, but one thing that is very important to me is creating that journey, creating this, you know, following the emotion, creating big moments, you know, that can really consume us.And it's not just about, I mean, not that there are films that are important to me, just about arguments and unpacking and education. At the same time, we have the opportunity to do so much more as storytellers and docs and we are doing it anyway. So that's, that's, you know, when, it's funny, when light my fire, I immediately think of all the fiction films I love and not docs, which I feel ashamed about.‘cause now I know, you know, I know so many incredible documentary filmmakers that light my fire. Um, but my, my impulse is still in the fiction world.BEN: Used a word that it's such an important word, which is immersion. And I, I first saw you speak, um, a week or two ago at the doc NYC Pro panel for editors, documentary editors about the perfect neighbor, which I wanna talk about in a bit because talk about a completely immersive experience.But thank you first, uh, contact, what, what is it about contact that you responded to?VIRI: Oh my goodness. I, well, I watched it growing up. I mean, with my dad, we're both sci-fi people. Like he got me into that. I mean, we're both, I mean he, you know, I was raised by him so clearly it stuck around contact for me. I think even to this day is still my favorite movie.And it, even though I'm kind of a style nut now, and it's, and it feels classic in its approach, but. There's something about all the layers at play in that film. Like there is this crazy big journey, but it's also engaging in a really smart conversation, right? Between science and faith and some of the greatest lines from that film.Are lines that you can say to yourself on the daily basis to remind yourself of like, where we are, what we're doing, why we're doing it, even down to the most basic, you know, funny, I thought the world was what we make it, you know, it's like all of these lines from contact that stick with me when he says, you know, um, did you love your father?Prove it. You know, it's like, what? What is proof? You know? So there were so many. Moments in that film. And for me, you know, climbing into that vessel and traveling through space and when she's floating and she sees the galaxy and she says they should have sent a poet, you know, and you're thinking about like the layers of this experience and how the aliens spoilers, um, you know, show up and talk to her in that conversation herself.Anyways, it's one of those. For me, kind of love letters to the human race and earth and what makes us tick and the complexity of identity all in this incredible journey that feels so. Big yet is boiled down to Jody Foster's very personal narrative, right? Like, it's like all, it just checks so many boxes and still feels like a spectacle.And so the balance, uh, you know, I, I do feel my instincts normally are to zoom in and feel incredibly personal. And I love kind of small stories that represent so much and that film in so many ways does that, and all the other things too. So I'm like, how did we get there? But I really, I can't, I don't know what it is.I can't shake that film. It's not, you know, there's a lot of films that have informed, you know, things I love and take me out to the fringe and take me to the mainstream and, you know, on my candy and, you know, all those things. And yet that, that film checks all the boxes for me.BEN: I remember seeing it in the theaters and you know everything you said.Plus you have a master filmmaker at the absolute top Oh god. Of his class. Oh my,VIRI: yes,BEN: yes. I mean, that mirror shot. Know, know, I mean, my jaw was on the ground because this is like, right, right. As CGI is started. Yes. So, I mean, I'm sure you've seen the behind the scenes of how theyVIRI: Yeah.BEN: Incredible.VIRI: Years.Years. We would be sitting around talking about how no one could figure out how he did it for years. Anybody I met who saw contact would be like, but how did they do the mirror shot? Like I nobody had kind of, yeah. Anyways, it was incredible. And you know, it's, and I,BEN: I saw, I saw it just with some civilians, right?Like the mirror shot. They're like, what are you talking about? The what? Huh?VIRI: Oh, it's so funny you bring that up because right now, you know, I went a friend, I have a friend who's a super fan of Wicked. We went for Wicked for Good, and there is a sequence in that film where they do the mirror jot over and over and over.It's like the, it's like the. Special device of that. It feels that way. That it's like the special scene with Glenda and her song. And someone next to me was sitting there and I heard him under his breath go,wow.Like he was really having a cinematic. And I wanted to lean over and be like, watch contact, like, like the first time.I saw it was there and now it's like people have, you know, unlocked it and are utilizing it. But it was, so, I mean, also, let's talk about the opening sequence of contact for a second. Phenomenal. Because I, I don't think I design, I've ever seen anything in cinema in my life like that. I if for anybody who's listening to this, even if you don't wanna watch the entire movie, which of course I'm obviously pitching you to do.Watch the opening. Like it, it's an incredible experience and it holds up and it's like when, yeah. Talk about attention to detail and the love of sound design and the visuals, but the patience. You wanna talk about trusting an audience, sitting in a theater and that silence Ah, yeah. Heaven film heaven.BEN: I mean, that's.That's one of the beautiful things that cinema does in, in the theater. Right. It just, you're in, you're immersed in this case, you know, pulling away from earth through outer space at however many, you know, hundreds of millions of miles an hour. You can't get that anywhere else. Yeah. That feeling,VIRI: that film is like all the greatest hits reel of.Storytelling gems. It's like the adventure, the love, the, you know, the, the complicated kind of smart dialogue that we can all understand what it's saying, but it's, but it's doing it through the experience of the story, you know, and then someone kind of knocks it outta the park without one quote where you gasp and it's really a phenomenal.Thing. Yeah. I, I've never, I haven't talked about contact as much in ages. Thank you for this.BEN: It's a great movie. It's there, and there were, there were two other moments in that movie, again when I saw it, where it's just like, this is a, a master storyteller. One is, yeah. When they're first like trying to decode the image.Mm-hmm. And you see a swastika.VIRI: Yeah. Oh yeah. And you're like,BEN: what the, what the f**k? That was like a total left turn. Right. But it's, it's, and I think it's, it's from the book, but it's like the movie is, it's, it's, you know, it's asking these questions and then you're like totally locked in, not expecting.You know, anything from World War II to be a part of this. And of course in the movie the, go ahead.VIRI: Yeah, no, I was gonna say, but the seed of thatBEN: is in the first shot,VIRI: scientifically educating. Oh yes. Well, the sensory experience, I mean, you're like, your heart stops and you get full Bo chills and then you're scared and you know, you're thinking a lot of things.And then when you realize the science of it, like the first thing that was broadcast, like that type of understanding the stakes of our history in a space narrative. And, you know, it, it just, there's so much. You know, unfurling in your mind. Yeah. In that moment that is both baked in from your lived experiences and what you know about the world, and also unlocking, so what's possible and what stakes have already been outside of this fiction, right?Mm-hmm. Outside of the book, outside of the telling of this, the reality of what has already happened in the facts of it. Yeah. It's really amazing.BEN: And the other moment we're just, and now, you know, being a filmmaker, you look back and I'm sure this is, it falls neatly and at the end of the second act. But when Tom scars, you know, getting ready to go up on the thing and then there's that terrorist incident or whatever, and the whole thing just collapses, the whole, um, sphere collapses and you just like, wait, what?Is that what's gonna happen now?VIRI: Yeah, like a hundred million dollars in it. It does too. It just like clink pun. Yeah. Everything.BEN: Yeah.VIRI: Think they'll never build it again. I mean, you just can't see what's coming after that and how it went down, who it happened to. I mean, that's the magic of that film, like in the best films.Are the ones where every scene, every character, it has so much going into it. Like if somebody paused the film there and said, wait, what's happening? And you had to explain it to them, it would take the entire movie to do it, you know, which you're like, that's, we're in it. Yeah. Anyway, so that's a great moment too, where I didn't, and I remember when they reveal spoilers again, uh, that there's another one, but when he is zooming in, you know, and you're like, oh, you know, it just, it's, yeah.Love it. It's wonderful. Now, I'm gonna watch that tonight too. IBEN: know, I, I haven't probably, I probably haven't watched that movie in 10 years, but now I gotta watch it again.VIRI: Yeah.BEN: Um, okay, so let's talk doc editing. Yes. What, um, I always like to, I heard a quote once that something about when, when critics get together, they talk meaning, and when artists get together, they talk paint.So let's talk paint for a second. What do you edit on?VIRI: I cut mainly on Avid and Premier. I, I do think of myself as more of an avid lady, but there's been a lot of probably the films that have done the most. I cut on Premier, and by that I mean like, it's interesting that I always assume Avid is my standard yet that most of the things that I love most, I cut on Premiere right now.I, I toggle between them both multiple projects on both, on both, um, programs and they're great. I love them equal for different reasons. I'm aBEN: big fan of Avid. I think it gets kind of a, a bad rap. Um, what, what are the benefits of AVID versus pr? I've never used Premier, but I was a big final cut seven person.So everybody has said that. Premier kind of emulates Final cut. Seven.VIRI: I never made a past seven. It's funny, I recently heard people are cutting on Final Cut Pro again, which A adds off. But I really, because I thought that ship had sailed when they went away from seven. So with, I will say like the top line things for me, you know, AVID forces you to control every single thing you're doing, which I actually think it can feel hindering and intimidating to some folks, but actually is highly liberating once you learn how to use it, which is great.It's also wonderful for. Networks. I mean, you can send a bin as a couple kilobyte. Like the idea that the shared workflow, when I've been on series or features with folks, it's unbeatable. Uh, you know, it can be cumbersome in like getting everything in there and stuff like that and all, and, but, but it kind of forces you to set up yourself for success, for online, for getting everything out.So, and there's a lot of good things. So then on conversely Premier. It's amazing ‘cause you can hit the ground running. You just drag everything in and you go. The challenge of course is like getting it out. Sometimes that's when you kind of hit the snaps. But I am impressed when I'm working with multiple frame rates, frame sizes, archival for many decades that I can just bring it into Premier and go and just start cutting.And you know, also it has a lot of intuitive nature with other Adobe Pro, you know, uh, applications and all of this, which is great. There's a lot of shortcuts. I mean, they're getting real. Slick with a lot of their new features, which I have barely met. I'm like an archival, I'm like a ancient picture editor lady from the past, like people always teach me things.They're just like, you know, you could just, and I'm like, what? But I, so I guess I, you know, I don't have all the tech guru inside talk on that, but I think that when I'm doing short form, it does feel like it's always premier long form. Always seems to avid. Team stuff feels avid, you know, feature, low budge features where they're just trying to like make ends meet.Feel Premier, and I think there's an enormous accessibility with Premier in that regard. But I still feel like Avid is a studios, I mean, a, a studio, well, who knows? I'm cut in the studios. But an industry standard in a lot of ways it still feels that way.BEN: Yeah, for sure. How did you get into editing?VIRI: I went to film school and while I was there, I really like, we did everything.You know, we learned how to shoot, we learned everything. Something about editing was really thrilling to me. I, I loved the puzzle of it, you know, I loved putting pieces together. We did these little funny exercises where we would take a movie and cut our own trailer and, you know, or they'd give us all the same footage and we cut our scene from it and.Itwas really incredible to see how different all those scenes were, and I loved finding ways to multipurpose footage, make an entire tone feel differently. You know, like if we're cutting a scene about a bank robbery, like how do you all of a sudden make it feel, you know, like romantic, you know, or whatever.It's like how do we kind of play with genre and tone and how much you can reinvent stuff, but it was really structure and shifting things anyways, it really, I was drawn to it and I had fun editing my things and helping other people edit it. I did always dream of directing, which I am doing now and I'm excited about, but I realized that my way in with editing was like learning how to do a story in that way, and it will always be my language.I think even as I direct or write or anything, I'm really imagining it as if I'm cutting it, and that could change every day, but like when I'm out shooting. I always feel like it's my superpower because when I'm filming it's like I know what I have and how I'll use it and I can change that every hour.But the idea of kind of knowing when you've got it or what it could be and having that reinvented is really incredible. So got into edit. So left film school. And then thought and loved editing, but wasn't like, I'm gonna be an editor. I was still very much on a very over, you know what? I guess I would say like, oh, I was gonna say Overhead, broad bird's eye.I was like, no, I'm gonna go make movies and then I'll direct ‘em and onward, but work, you know, worked in post houses, overnights, all that stuff and PA and try made my own crappy movies and you know, did a lot of that stuff and. It kept coming back to edit. I mean, I kept coming back to like assistant jobs and cutting, cutting, cutting, cutting, and it just felt like something that I had a skill for, but I didn't know what my voice was in that.Like I didn't, it took me a long time to realize I could have a voice as an editor, which was so dumb, and I think I wasted so much time thinking that like I was only search, you know, like that. I didn't have that to bring. That editing was just about. Taking someone else's vision. You know, I'm not a set of hands like I'm an artist as well.I think we all are as editors and I was very grateful that not, not too long into, you know, when I found the doc path and I went, okay, I think this is where I, I can rock this and I'm pretty excited about it. I ended up working with a small collection of directors who all. Respected that collaboration.Like they were excited for what I do and what I bring to it and felt, it made me feel like we were peers working together, which was my fantasy with how film works. And I feel like isn't always the constant, but I've been spoiled and now it's what I expect and what I want to create for others. And you know, I hope there's more of us out there.So it's interesting because my path to editing. Was like such a, a practical one and an emotional one, and an ego one, and a, you know, it's like, it's like all these things that have led me to where I am and the perfect neighbor is such a culmination of all of that. For sure.BEN: Yeah. And, and I want to get into it, uh, first the eternal question.Yeah. Film school worth it or not worth it?VIRI: I mean, listen, I. We'll share this. I think I've shared this before, but relevant to the fact I'll share it because I think we can all learn from each other's stories. I did not want to go to college. Okay? I wanted to go straight to la. I was like, I'm going to Hollywood.I wanted to make movies ever since I was a kid. This is what I'm gonna do, period. I come from a family of teachers. All of my parents are teachers. My parents divorced. I have my stepparent is teacher, like everybody's a teacher. And they were like, no. And not just a teacher. My mom and my dad are college professors, so they were like college, college, college.I sabotaged my SATs. I did not take them. I did not want to go to college. I was like, I am going to Los Angeles. Anyways, uh, my parents applied for me. To an accredited arts college that, and they were like, it's a three year try semester. You'll shoot on film, you can do your, you know, and they submitted my work from high school when I was in TV production or whatever.Anyways, they got me into this little college, and when I look back, I know that that experience was really incredible. I mean, while I was there, I was counting the days to leave, but I know that it gave me not only the foundation of. You know, learning, like, I mean, we were learning film at the time. I don't know what it's like now, but like we, you know, I learned all the different mediums, which was great on a vocational level, you know, but on top of that, they're just throwing cans of film at us and we're making all the mistakes we need to make to get where we need to get.And the other thing that's happening is there's also like the liberal arts, this is really, sounds like a teacher's kid, what I'm about to say. But like, there's also just the level of education To be smarter and learn more about the world, to inform your work doesn't mean that you can't. You can't skip college and just go out there and find your, and learn what you wanna learn in the stories that you journey out to tell.So I feel really torn on this answer because half of me is like. No, you don't need college. Like just go out and make stuff and learn what you wanna learn. And then the other half of me have to acknowledge that, like, I think there was a foundation built in that experience, in that transitional time of like semi-structure, semi independence, you know, like all the things that come with college.It's worth it, but it's expensive as heck. And I certainly, by the time I graduated, film wasn't even a thing and I had to learn digital out in the world. And. I think you can work on a film set and learn a hell of a lot more than you'll ever learn in a classroom. And at the same time, I really love learning.So, you know, my, I think I, my parents were right, they know it ‘cause I went back to grad school, so that was a shock for them. But I think, but yeah, so I, I get, what I would say is, it really is case, this is such a cop out of an answer, case by case basis. Ask yourself, you know, if you need that time and if you, if you aren't gonna go.You need to put in the work. You have to really like go out, go on those sets, work your tail off, seek out the books, read the stuff, you know, and no one's gonna hand you anything. And my stories are a hell of a lot, I think smarter and eloquent because of the education I had. Yeah.BEN: So you shuttle on, what was the school, by the way?VIRI: Well, it was called the, it was called the International Fine Arts College. It no longer exists because Art Institute bought it. It's now called the Miami International University of Art and Design, and they bought it the year I graduated. So I went to this tiny little arts college, uh, but graduated from this AI university, which my parents were like, okay.Um, but we were, it was a tiny little college owned by this man who would invite all of us over to his mansion for brunch every year. I mean, it was very strange, but cool. And it was mainly known for, I think fashion design and interior design. So the film kids, we all kind of had, it was an urban campus in Miami and we were all like kind of in a wado building on the side, and it was just kind of a really funky, misfit feeling thing that I thought was, now when I look back, I think was like super cool.I mean, they threw cans of film at us from the very first semester. There was no like, okay, be here for two years and earn your opportunity. We were making stuff right away and all of our teachers. All of our professors were people who were working in the field, like they were ones who were, you know, writing.They had written films and fun fact of the day, my, my cinematography professor was Sam Beam from Iron and Wine. If anybody knows Iron and Wine, like there's like, there's like we, we had crazy teachers that we now realize were people who were just probably trying to pay their bills while they were on their journey, and then they broke out and did their thing after we were done.BEN: Okay, so shooting on film. Yeah. What, um, was it 16 or 35? 16. And then how are you doing sound? No, notVIRI: 35, 16. Yeah. I mean, we had sound on Dax, you know, like we were recording all the mm-hmm. Oh, when we did the film. Yeah, yeah. Separate. Yeah, yeah, yeah. We did the Yeah. Syncs soundBEN: into a We did a,VIRI: yeah, we did, we did one.We shot on a Bolex, I think, if I remember it right. It did like a tiny, that probably was eight, you know? But the point is we did that on. The flatbed. After that, we would digitize and we would cut on media 100, which was like this. It was, I think it was called the, I'm pretty sure it was called Media 100.It was like this before avid, you know. A more archaic editing digital program that, so we did the one, the one cut and splice version of our, our tiny little films. And then we weren't on kind of beautiful steam backs or anything. It was like, you know, it was much, yeah, smaller. But we had, but you know, we raced in the changing tents and we did, you know, we did a lot of film, love and fun.And I will tell you for your own amusement that we were on set once with somebody making their short. The girl at the AC just grabbed, grabbed the film, what's, oh my God, I can't even believe I'm forgetting the name of it. But, um, whatever the top of the camera grabbed it and thought she had unlocked it, like unhinged it and just pulled it out after all the film just come spooling out on set.And we were like, everybody just froze and we were just standing there. It was like a bad sketch comedy, like we're all just standing there in silence with like, just like rolling out of the camera. I, I'll never forget it.BEN: Nightmare. Nightmare. I, you know, you said something earlier about when you're shooting your own stuff.Being an editor is a little bit of a superpower because you know, oh, I'm gonna need this, I'm gonna need that. And, and for me it's similar. It's especially similar. Like, oh, we didn't get this. I need to get an insert of this ‘cause I know I'm probably gonna want that. I also feel like, you know, I came up, um, to instill photography, 35 millimeter photography, and then when I got into filmmaking it was, um, digital, uh, mini DV tape.So, but I feel like the, um, the structure of having this, you know, you only have 36 shots in a still camera, so you've gotta be sure that that carried over even to my shooting on digital, of being meticulous about setting up the shot, knowing what I need. Whereas, you know, younger people who have just been shooting digital their whole lives that just shoot everything and we'll figure it out later.Yeah. Do do you, do you feel you had that Advant an advantage? Yes. Or sitting on film gave you some advantages?VIRI: I totally, yes. I also am a firm believer and lover of intention. Like I don't this whole, like we could just snap a shot and then punch in and we'll, whatever. Like it was my worst nightmare when people started talking about.We'll shoot scenes and something, it was like eight K, so we can navigate the frame. And I was like, wait, you're not gonna move the camera again. Like, it just, it was terrifying. So, and we passed that, but now the AI stuff is getting dicey, but the, I think that you. I, I am pretty romantic about the hands-on, I like books with paper, you know, like, I like the can, the cinematographer to capture, even if it's digital.And those benefits of the digital for me is like, yes, letting it roll, but it's not about cheating frames, you know, like it's about, it's about the accessibility of being able to capture things longer, or the technology to move smoother. These are good things. But it's not about, you know, simplifying the frame in something that we need to, that is still an art form.Like that's a craft. That's a craft. And you could argue that what we choose, you know, photographers, the choice they make in Photoshop is the new version of that is very different. Like my friends who are dps, you know, there's always like glasses the game, right? The lenses are the game. It's like, it's not about filters In posts, that was always our nightmare, right?The old fix it and post everybody's got their version of their comic strip that says Fix it and post with everything exploding. It's like, no, that's not what this is about. And so, I mean, I, I think I'll always be. Trying to, in my brain fight the good fight for the craftiness of it all because I'm so in love with everything.I miss film. I'm sad. I miss that time. I mean, I think I, it still exists and hopefully someday I'll have the opportunity that somebody will fund something that I'm a part of that is film. And at the same time there's somewhere in between that still feels like it's honoring that freshness. And, and then now there's like the, yeah, the new generation.It's, you know, my kids don't understand that I have like. Hand them a disposable camera. We'll get them sometimes for fun and they will also like click away. I mean, the good thing you have to wind it so they can't, they can't ruin it right away, but they'll kind of can't fathom that idea. And um, and I love that, where you're like, we only get 24 shots.Yeah, it's veryBEN: cool. So you said you felt the perfect neighbor, kind of, that was the culmination of all your different skills in the craft of editing. Can you talk a little bit about that?VIRI: Yes. I think that I spent, I think all the films, it's like every film that I've had the privilege of being a part of, I have taken something like, there's like some tool that was added to the tool belt.Maybe it had to do with like structure or style or a specific build to a quote or, or a device or a mechanism in the film, whatever it is. It was the why of why that felt right. That would kind of be the tool in the tool belt. It wouldn't just be like, oh, I learned how to use this new toy. It was like, no, no.There's some kind of storytelling, experience, technique, emotion that I felt that Now I'm like, okay, how do I add that in to everything I do? And I want every film to feel specific and serve what it's doing. But I think a lot of that sent me in a direction of really always approaching a project. Trying to meet it for like the, the work that only it can do.You know, it's like, it's not about comps. It's not about saying like, oh, we're making a film that's like, fill in the blank. I'm like, how do we plug and play the elements we have into that? It's like, no, what are the elements we have and how do we work with them? And that's something I fought for a lot on all the films I've been a part of.Um, and by that I mean fight for it. I just mean reminding everybody always in the room that we can trust the audience, you know, that we can. That, that we should follow the materials what, and work with what we have first, and then figure out what could be missing and not kind of IME immediately project what we think it needs to be, or it should be.It's like, no, let's discover what it is and then that way we will we'll appreciate. Not only what we're doing in the process, but ultimately we don't even realize what it can do for what it is if we've never seen it before, which is thrilling. And a lot of those have been a part of, there have been pockets of being able to do that.And then usually near the end there's a little bit of math thing that happens. You know, folks come in the room and they're trying to, you know, but what if, and then, but other people did. Okay, so all you get these notes and you kind of reel it in a little bit and you find a delicate balance with the perfect neighbor.When Gita came to me and we realized, you know, we made that in a vacuum like that was we, we made that film independently. Very little money, like tiny, tiny little family of the crew. It was just me and her, you know, like when we were kind of cutting it together and then, and then there's obviously producers to kind of help and build that platform and, and give great feedback along the way.But it allowed us to take huge creative risks in a really exciting way. And I hate that I even have to use the word risks because it sounds like, but, but I do, because I think that the industry is pushing against, you know, sometimes the spec specificity of things, uh, in fear of. Not knowing how it will be received.And I fantasize about all of us being able to just watch something and seeing how we feel about it and not kind of needing to know what it is before we see it. So, okay, here comes the perfect neighbor. GTA says to me early on, like, I think. I think it can be told through all these materials, and I was like, it will be told through like I was determined and I held us very strict to it.I mean, as we kind of developed the story and hit some challenges, it was like, this is the fun. Let's problem solve this. Let's figure out what it means. But that also came within the container of all this to kind of trust the audience stuff that I've been trying to repeat to myself as a mantra so I don't fall into the trappings that I'm watching so much work do.With this one, we knew it was gonna be this raw approach and by composing it completely of the evidence, it would ideally be this kind of undeniable way to tell the story, which I realized was only possible because of the wealth of material we had for this tracked so much time that, you know, took the journey.It did, but at the same time, honoring that that's all we needed to make it happen. So all those tools, I think it was like. A mixed bag of things that I found that were effective, things that I've been frustrated by in my process. Things that I felt radical about with, you know, that I've been like trying to scream in, into the void and nobody's listening.You know, it's like all of that because I, you know, I think I've said this many times. The perfect neighbor was not my full-time job. I was on another film that couldn't have been more different. So I think in a, in a real deep seated, subconscious way, it was in conversation with that. Me trying to go as far away from that as possible and in understanding what could be possible, um, with this film.So yeah, it's, it's interesting. It's like all the tools from the films, but it was also like where I was in my life, what had happened to me, you know, and all of those. And by that I mean in a process level, you know, working in film, uh, and that and yes, and the values and ethics that I honor and wanna stick to and protect in the.Personal lens and all of that. So I think, I think it, it, it was a culmination of many things, but in that approach that people feel that has resonated that I'm most proud of, you know, and what I brought to the film, I think that that is definitely, like, I don't think I could have cut this film the way I did at any other time before, you know, I think I needed all of those experiences to get here.BEN: Oh, there's so much there and, and there's something kind of the. The first part of what you were saying, I've had this experience, I'm curious if you've had this experience. I sort of try to prepare filmmakers to be open to this, that when you're working with something, especially Doc, I think Yeah. More so Doc, at a certain point the project is gonna start telling you what it wants to be if you, if you're open to it.Yes. Um, but it's such a. Sometimes I call it the spooky process. Like it's such a ephemeral thing to say, right? Like, ‘cause you know, the other half of editing is just very technical. Um, but this is like, there's, there's this thing that's gonna happen where it's gonna start talking to you. Do you have that experience?VIRI: Yes. Oh, yes. I've also been a part of films that, you know, they set it out to make it about one person. And once we watched all the footage, it is about somebody else. I mean, there's, you know, those things where you kind of have to meet the spooky part, you know, in, in kind of honoring that concept that you're bringing up is really that when a film is done, I can't remember cutting it.Like, I don't, I mean, I remember it and I remember if you ask me why I did something, I'll tell you. I mean, I'm very, I am super. Precious to a fault about an obsessive. So like you could pause any film I've been a part of and I'll tell you exactly why I used that shot and what, you know, I can do that. But the instinct to like just grab and go when I'm just cutting and I'm flowing.Yeah, that's from something else. I don't know what that is. I mean, I don't. People tell me that I'm very fast, which is, I don't know if that's a good or a bad thing, but I think it really comes from knowing that the job is to make choices and you can always go back and try different things, but this choose your own adventure novel is like just going, and I kind of always laugh about when I look back and I'm like, whoa, have that happen.Like, you know, like I don't even. And I have my own versions of imposter syndrome where I refill mens and I'm like, oh, got away with that one. Um, or every time a new project begins, I'm like, do I have any magic left in the tank? Um, but, but trusting the process, you know, to what you're socking about is a really important way to free yourself and the film to.Discover what it is. I think nowadays because of the algorithm and the, you know, I mean, it's changing right now, so we'll see where, how it recalibrates. But for a, for a while, over these past years, the expectations have, it's like shifted where they come before the film is like, it's like you create your decks and your sizzles and you write out your movie and you, and there is no time for discovery.And when it happens. It's like undeniable that you needed to break it because it's like you keep hitting the same impasse and you can't solve it and then you're like, oh, that's because we have to step outta the map. But I fear that many works have suffered, you know, that they have like followed the map and missed an opportunity.And so, you know, and for me as an editor, it's always kinda a red flag when someone's like, and here's the written edit. I'm like, what? Now let's watch the footage. I wanna know where There's always intention when you set up, but as people always say, the edit is kind of the last. The last step of the storytelling process.‘cause so much can change there. So there is, you know, there it will reveal itself. I do get nerdy about that. I think a film knows what it is. I remember when I was shooting my first film called Born to Play, that film, we were. At the championship, you know, the team was not, thought that they were gonna win the whole thing.We're at the championship and someone leaned over to me and they said, you know, it's funny when a story knows it's being filmed. And I was like, ah. I think about that all the time because now I think about that in the edit bay. I'm like, okay, you tell me, you know, what do you wanna do? And then you kind of like, you match frame back to something and all of a sudden you've opened a portal and you're in like a whole new theme.It's very cool. You put, you know, you put down a different. A different music temp, music track, and all of a sudden you're making a new movie. I mean, it's incredible. It's like, it really is real world magic. It's so much fun. Yeah,BEN: it is. It's a blast. The, so, uh, I saw you at the panel at Doc NYC and then I went that night or the next night and watched Perfect Neighbor blew me away, and you said something on the panel that then blew me away again when I thought about it, which is.I think, correct me if I'm wrong, all of the audio is syncedVIRI: Yeah. To the footage.BEN: That, to me is the big, huge, courageous decision you made.VIRI: I feel like I haven't said that enough. I don't know if folks understand, and it's mainly for the edit of that night, like the, I mean, it's all, it's, it's all that, but it was important.That the, that the sound would be synced to the shock that you're seeing. So when you're hearing a cop, you know, a police officer say, medics, we need medics. If we're in a dashboard cam, that's when it was, you know, echoing from the dashboard. Like that's what, so anything you're hearing is synced. When you hear something coming off from the per when they're walking by and you hear someone yelling something, you know, it's like all of that.I mean, that was me getting really strict about the idea that we were presenting this footage for what it was, you know, that it was the evidence that you are watching, as you know, for lack of a better term, unbiased, objectively as possible. You know, we're presenting this for what it is. I, of course, I have to cut down these calls.I am making choices like that. That is happening. We are, we are. Composing a narrative, you know, there, uh, that stuff is happening. But to create, but to know that what you're hearing, I'm not applying a different value to the frame on, on a very practical syn sound way. You know, it's like I'm not gonna reappropriate frames.Of course, in the grand scheme of the narrative flow with the emotions, you know, the genre play of this horror type film, and there's a lot happening, but anything you were hearing, you know, came from that frame. Yeah.BEN: That's amazing. How did you organize the footage and the files initially?VIRI: Well, Gita always likes to laugh ‘cause she is, she calls herself my first ae, which is true.I had no a, you know, I had, she was, she had gotten all that material, you know, she didn't get that material to make a film. They had originally, this is a family friend who died and when this all happened, they went down and gathered this material to make a case, to make sure that Susan didn't get out. To make sure this was not forgotten.You know, to be able to utilize. Protect the family. And so there was, at first it was kind of just gathering that. And then once she got it, she realized that it spanned two years, you know, I mean, she, she popped, she was an editor for many, many years, an incredible editor. She popped it into a system, strung it all out, sunk up a lot of it to see what was there, and realized like, there's something here.And that's when she called me. So she had organized it, you know, by date, you know, and that, that originally. Strung out a lot of it. And then, so when I came in, it was just kind of like this giant collection of stuff, like folders with the nine one calls. How long was the strung out? Well, I didn't know this.Well, I mean, we have about 30 hours of content. It wasn't one string out, you know, it was like there were the call, all the calls, and then the 9 1 1 calls, the dash cams. The ring cams. Okay. Excuse me. The canvassing interviews, audio only content. So many, many. Was about 30 hours of content, which honestly, as most of us editors know, is not actually a lot I've cut.You know, it's usually, we have tons more than that. I mean, I, I've cut decades worth of material and thousands of hours, you know, but 30 hours of this type of material is very specific, you know, that's a, that's its own challenge. So, so yeah. So the first, so it was organized. It was just organized by call.Interview, you know, some naming conventions in there. Some things we had to sync up. You know, the 9 1 1 calls would overlap. You could hear it in the nine one one call center. You would hear someone, one person who called in, and then you'd hear in the background, like the conversation of another call. It's in the film.There's one moment where you can hear they're going as fast as they can, like from over, from a different. So there was so much overlap. So there was some syncing that we kind of had to do by ear, by signals, by, you know, and there's some time coding on the, on the cameras, but that would go off, which was strange.They weren't always perfect. So, but that, that challenge unto itself would help us kind of really screen the footage to a finite detail, right. To like, have, to really understand where everybody is and what they're doing when,BEN: yeah. You talked about kind of at the end, you know, different people come in, there's, you know, maybe you need to reach a certain length or so on and so forth.How do you, um, handle notes? What's your advice to young filmmakers as far as navigating that process? Great question.VIRI: I am someone who, when I was a kid, I had trouble with authority. I wasn't like a total rebel. I think I was like a really goody goody too. She was borderline. I mean, I had my moments, but growing up in, in a journey, an artistic journey that requires you to kind of fall in love with getting critiques and honing things and working in teams.And I had some growing pains for a long time with notes. I mean, my impulse was always, no. A note would come and I'd go, no, excuse me. Go to bed, wake up. And then I would find my way in and that would be great. That bed marinating time has now gone away, thank goodness. And I have realized that. Not all notes, but some notes have really changed the trajectory of a project in the most powerful waves.And it doesn't always the, to me, what I always like to tell folks is it's, the notes aren't really the issues. It's what? It's the solutions people offer. You know? It's like you can bring up what you're having an issue with. It's when people kind of are like, you know what I would do? Or you know what you think you should do, or you could do this.You're like, you don't have to listen to that stuff. I mean, you can. You can if you have the power to filter it. Some of us do, some of us don't. I've worked with people who. Take all the notes. Notes and I have to, we have to, I kind of have to help filter and then I've worked with people who can very quickly go need that, don't need that need, that, don't need that.Hear that, don't know how to deal with that yet. You know, like if, like, we can kind of go through it. So one piece of advice I would say is number one, you don't have to take all the notes and that's, that's, that's an honoring my little veary. Wants to stand by the vision, you know, and and fight for instincts.Okay. But the second thing is the old classic. It's the note behind the note. It's really trying to understand where that note's coming from. Who gave it what they're looking for? You know, like is that, is it a preference note or is it a fact? You know, like is it something that's really structurally a problem?Is it something that's really about that moment in the film? Or is it because of all the events that led to that moment that it's not doing the work you think it should? You know, the, the value is a complete piece. So what I really love about notes now is I get excited for the feedback and then I get really excited about trying to decipher.What they mean, not just taking them as like my to-do list. That's not, you know, that's not the best way to approach it. It's really to get excited about getting to actually hear feedback from an audience member. Now, don't get me wrong, an audience member is usually. A producer in the beginning, and they have, they may have their own agenda, and that's something to know too.And maybe their agenda can influence the film in an important direction for the work that they and we all wanted to do. Or it can help at least discern where their notes are coming from. And then we can find our own emotional or higher level way to get into solving that note. But, you know, there's still, I still get notes that make me mad.I still get notes where I get sad that I don't think anybody was really. Watching it or understanding it, you know, there's always a thought, you know, that happens too. And to be able to read those notes and still find that like one kernel in there, or be able to read them and say, no kernels. But, but, but by doing that, you're now creating the conviction of what you're doing, right?Like what to do and what not to do. Carrie, equal value, you know, so you can read all these notes and go, oh, okay, so I am doing this niche thing, but I believe in it and. And I'm gonna stand by it. Or like, this one person got it and these five didn't. And I know that the rules should be like majority rules, but that one person, I wanna figure out why they got it so that I can try to get these, you know, you get what I'm saying?So I, I've grown, it took a long time for me to get where I am and I still have moments where I'm bracing, you know, where I like to scroll to see how many notes there are before I even read them. You know, like dumb things that I feel like such a kid about. But we're human. You know, we're so vulnerable.Doing this work is you're so naked and you're trying and you get so excited. And I fall in love with everything. I edit so furiously and at every stage of the process, like my first cut, I'm like, this is the movie. Like I love this so much. And then, you know, by the 10th root polling experience. I'm like, this is the movie.I love it so much. You know, so it's, it's painful, but at the same time it's like highly liberating and I've gotten a lot more flowy with it, which was needed. I would, I would encourage everybody to learn how to really enjoy being malleable with it, because that's when you find the sweet spot. It's actually not like knowing everything right away, exactly what it's supposed to be.It's like being able to know what the heart of it is. And then get really excited about how collaborative what we do is. And, and then you do things you would've never imagined. You would've never imagined, um, or you couldn't have done alone, you know, which is really cool. ‘cause then you get to learn a lot more about yourself.BEN: Yeah. And I think what you said of sort of being able to separate the idea of, okay, something maybe isn't clicking there, versus whatever solution this person's offering. Nine times outta 10 is not gonna be helpful, but, but the first part is very helpful that maybe I'm missing something or maybe what I want to connect is not connecting.VIRI: And don't take it personally. Yeah. Don't ever take it personally. I, I think that's something that like, we're all here to try to make the best movie we can.BEN: Exactly.VIRI: You know? Yeah. And I'm not gonna pretend there aren't a couple sticklers out there, like there's a couple little wrenches in the engine, but, but we will, we all know who they are when we're on the project, and we will bind together to protect from that.But at the same time, yeah, it's, yeah. You get it, you get it. Yeah. But it's really, it's an important part of our process and I, it took me a while to learn that.BEN: Last question. So you talked about kind of getting to this cut and this cut and this cut. One of the most important parts of editing, I think is especially when, when you've been working on a project for a long time, is being able to try and see it with fresh eyes.And of course the, one of the ways to do that is to just leave it alone for three weeks or a month or however long and then come back to it. But sometimes we don't have that luxury. I remember Walter Merch reading in his book that sometimes he would run the film upside down just to, mm-hmm. You know, re re redo it the way his brain is watching it.Do you have any tips and tricks for seeing a cut with fresh eyes? OhVIRI: yeah. I mean, I mean, other than stepping away from it, of course we all, you know, with this film in particular, I was able to do that because I was doing other films too. But I, one good one I always love is take all the music out. Just watch the film without music.It's really a fascinating thing. I also really like quiet films, so like I tend to all of a sudden realize like, what is absolutely necessary with the music, but, but it, it really, people get reliant on it, um, to do the work. And you'd be pleasantly surprised that it can inform and reinvent a scene to kind of watch it without, and you can, it's not about taking it out forever, it's just the exercise of watching what the film is actually doing in its raw form, which is great.Switching that out. I mean, I can, you know, there's other, washing it upside down, I feel like. Yeah, I mean like there's a lot of tricks we can trick our trick, our brain. You can do, you could also, I. I think, I mean, I've had times where I've watched things out of order, I guess. Like where I kind of like go and I watch the end and then I click to the middle and then I go back to the top, you know?And I'm seeing, like, I'm trying to see if they're all connecting, like, because I'm really obsessed with how things begin and how they end. I think the middle is highly important, but it really, s**t tells you, what are we doing here? Like what are we set up and where are we ending? And then like, what is the most effective.Journey to get there. And so there is a way of also kind of trying to pinpoint the pillars of the film and just watching those moments and not kind, and then kind of reverse engineering the whole piece back out. Yeah, those are a couple of tricks, but more than anything, it's sometimes just to go watch something else.If you can't step away from the project for a couple of weeks, maybe watch something, you could, I mean, you can watch something comparable in a way. That tonally or thematically feels in conversation with it to just kind of then come back and feel like there's a conversation happening between your piece and that piece.The other thing you could do is watch something so. Far different, right? Like, even if you like, don't like, I don't know what I'm suggesting, you'd have to, it would bend on the project, but there's another world where like you're like, all right, I'm gonna go off and watch some kind of crazy thrill ride and then come back to my slow burn portrait, you know, and, and just, just to fresh the pal a little bit, you know?I was like that. It's like fueling the tanks. We should be watching a lot of stuff anyways, but. That can happen too, so you don't, you also get to click off for a second because I think we can get, sometimes it's really good to stay in it at all times, but sometimes you can lose the force for the, you can't see it anymore.You're in the weeds. You're too close to it. So how do we kind of shake it loose? Feedback sessions, by the way, are a part, is a part of that because I think that when you sit in the back of the room and you watch other people watch the film, you're forced to watch it as another person. It's like the whole thing.So, and I, I tend to watch people's body language more than, I'm not watching the film. I'm like watching for when people shift. Yeah, yeah. I'm watching when people are like coughing or, you know, or when they, yeah. Whatever. You get it. Yeah. Yeah. That, that, soBEN: that is the most helpful part for me is at a certain point I'll bring in a couple friends and I'll just say, just want you to watch this, and I'm gonna ask you a couple questions afterwards.But 95% of what I need is just sitting there. Watching them and you said exactly. Watching their body language.VIRI: Yeah. Oh man. I mean, this was shoulder, shoulder shooks. There's, and you can tell the difference, you can tell the difference between someone's in an uncomfortable chair and someone's like, it's like whenever you can sense it if you're ever in a theater and you can start to sense, like when they, when they reset the day, like whenever we can all, we all kind of as a community are like, oh, this is my moment.To like get comfortable and go get a bite of popcorn. It's like there's tells, so some of those are intentional and then some are not. Right? I mean, if this is, it goes deeper than the, will they laugh at this or will they be scared at this moment? It really is about captivating them and feeling like when you've, when you've lost it,BEN: for sure.Yeah. Very. This has been fantastic. Oh my God, how fun.VIRI: I talked about things here with you that I've haven't talked, I mean, contact so deeply, but even film school, I feel like I don't know if that's out there anywhere. So that was fun. Thank you.BEN: Love it. Love it. That, that that's, you know, that's what I hope for these interviews that we get to things that, that haven't been talked about in other places.And I always love to just go in, you know, wherever the trail leads in this case. Yeah. With, uh, with Jody Foster and Math McConaughey and, uh, I mean, go see it. Everybody met this. Yeah. Uh, and for people who are interested in your work, where can they find you?VIRI: I mean, I don't update my website enough. I just go to IMDB.Look me up on IMDB. All my work is there. I think, you know, in a list, I've worked on a lot of films that are on HBO and I've worked on a lot of films and now, you know, obviously the perfect neighbor's on Netflix right now, it's having an incredible moment where I think the world is engaging with it. In powerful ways beyond our dreams.So if you watch it now, I bet everybody can kind of have really fascinating conversations, but my work is all out, you know, the sports stuff born to play. I think it's on peacock right now. I mean, I feel like, yeah, I love the scope that I've had the privilege of working on, and I hope it keeps growing. Who knows.Maybe I'll make my space movie someday. We'll see. But in the meantime, yeah, head over and see this, the list of credits and anything that anybody watches, I love to engage about. So they're all, I feel that they're all doing veryBEN: different work. I love it. Thank you so much.VIRI: Thank you. This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit benbo.substack.com

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BOH editor in chief Kaitlin Petersen and host Dennis Scully discuss the biggest news in the design industry, including Etsy's return to its artisan roots, surging home insurance premiums and key business lessons from the 50 States Project. Later, designer Susan Wintersteen joins the show to talk about founding Savvy Giving by Design. LINKSSavvy Giving by Design Business of Home

Actor Dimitri Leonidas joins Alex in the virtual cinema this week to talk about his role in the epic new Ancient Rome TV series 'THOSE ABOUT TO DIE' - directed by Roland Emmerich and coming to Amazon Prime in the UK on July 18th. He then takes us on a trip including how a film's third act turning point should always include a SOUR SWEET. The Jack Nicholson quote that he considers the BEST in cinema. How Julianne Moore is in the MOST SHOCKING movie moment. The Cohen Brothers' film that makes him PUMP HIS FIST in the air. And an UNPOPULAR OPINION on one particular Denis Villeneuve movie. All that and more on this week's epic trip.Find us here: https://linktr.ee/triptomoviespodA Trip to the Movies is proudly sponsored by @ODEONCinemas - We Make Movies Better. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Welcome to the Nick Taylor Horror Show!As always, each episode of The Nick Taylor Horror Show explores how today's horror filmmakers are getting their movies made while deconstructing their methods and career strategies into practical insights that you can use on your own horror filmmaking journey. This includes their creative processes, funding resources, favorite books & tools, key life lessons, and much much more.Francis Galluppi is the director of The Last Stop In Yuma County, a southern-fried, hard-boiled crime thriller that plays within the traditions of Tarantino, The Cohen Brothers, Taylor Sheridan, and Elmore Leonard while still establishing a feel and style all its own. I loved this movie - it's a fun, lean and mean piece of cinema bolstered by an incredible ensemble cast including Richard Brake, Jim Cummings, Jocelin Donahue, Barbara Crampton and many more.The Last Stop in Yuma County is Francis' feature debut and the film caught the eye of Sam Raimi and ultimately led to Francis being handed the reins of an upcoming installment in the Evil Dead franchise which is really awesome news.Prior to Last Stop in Yuma County, Francis' short film High Desert Hell, won several awards, including the Wes Craven Award at the Catalina Film Festival in 2019 while his followup, The Gemini Project, won Best Science Fiction/Fantasy Short Film' at the Burbank International Film Festival in 2020.In this conversation, Francis and I get into the grueling story behind the making of Last Stop in Yuma County, which was a four plus year labor of love involving blood, sweat, tears, and mortgaged houses. This is an excellent account of true indie filmmaking, the importance of preparation, working with an all-star cast, and never giving up. I owe a big thank you to my friend David Guglielmo for putting me in touch with Francis, thank you David. Now, please enjoy my conversation with Francis Galluppi.Prepare Extensively: Preparation was crucial to Francis' process, and his level of prep was extensive and very impressive. Every shot was meticulously storyboarded and diagrammed with detailed blocking directions made months before production began. Ultimately, this prep enabled him to achieve complex and high-production value work on a relatively low budget. Francis also engaged in extensive conversations with the actors, fully fleshing out the script and characters and every line of dialogue over zoom. By the time everyone arrived on set, the team was well-prepared to hit their marks which is critical on a lower budget. Francis' process demonstrates that there's no such thing as over-preparing. All of this ensured a fairly smooth production and Francis' ability to pivot when things went wrong.Set a Deadline and Make It Happen: Francis stresses the importance of setting a hard deadline and committing to it. Waiting for perfect conditions or resources can delay or prevent the realization of a project. He emphasizes the importance of prepping before you're greenlit, which may seem counterintuitive to filmmakers hesitant to invest time in a project that may not happen. However, extensive preparation increases the likelihood of your film coming to fruition. This preparation not only creates a sense of reality and momentum for your project but also impresses producers and investors, making your project appear more tangible and ready to go and ultimately easier to greenlight.Edit Your Own Work. Francis quickly mentioned that early on directors should edit their own work because doing so is a valuable learning experience. It forces you to confront your mistakes and understand what works and what doesn't about your shooting style and directorial capability. Being able to be objective at this level will ultimately make you a better...

We cover the season/ series finale of Shogun and Dasher's pick which is the title of the movie that we used to title the episodeSupport the Show.

BOH editor in chief Kaitlin Petersen and host Dennis Scully discuss the biggest news in the design industry, including why Williams-Sonoma was fined by the Federal Trade Commission, the latest in the Cohen Brothers real estate saga, and what a noncompete ban could mean for the design industry. Later, restauranteur Will Guidara joins to introduce his new book, "Unreasonable Hospitality." This episode is sponsored by Loloi and Annie SelkeLINKSBusiness of Home's book clubBusiness of Home

This week we have one giant Minnesota Tie as we bring you this Cohen Brothers award winner from Tony's shelf. Is Margie the only likeable character? Was this really based on a true story? Do we really talk like that? Dontcha know, you should tune in now to get a true Minnesotan perspective on this classic!

MILLER'S CROSSING (1990)This week on the show, we cover the 1990 gangster film, MILLER'S CROSSING.MILLER'S CROSSING stars Gabriel Byrne, Marcia Gay Harden, Albert Finny, and John Turturro. It was written and directed by Joel and Ethan Cohen.MILLER'S CROSSING  stars Neil Maskell, MyAnna Buring, and Harry Simpson, and was directed by Ben Wheatley.✨ Subscribe, Share, and give us a 5 star review. ✨  

WELCOME BACK! WE're back with a very special series….WE'RE DOING REMAKES! This week we have a very special guest…ERIC'S DAD RUSS! This episode was so fun. It was Caleb's pick today and he decided to go with the remake of the original film from 1969….TRUE GRIT! This remake was made in 2010 and made by the Cohen Brothers. We talked about Russ's top 4 films, all the crossovers, Matt Daemon in a truly iconic role, Josh Brolin's voice, Steinfeld KILLING IT at 14 years old, and much much more. WE hope you enjoy this, we missed you Cody! Film Discussed: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠True Grit (2010) Letterboxd: Eric Peterson: ⁠⁠⁠⁠letterboxd.com/EricLPeterson/⁠⁠⁠⁠ Jared Klopfenstein: ⁠⁠⁠⁠letterboxd.com/kidchimp/⁠⁠⁠⁠ Ethan Jasso: ⁠⁠⁠⁠letterboxd.com/e_unit7/⁠⁠⁠⁠ Caleb Zehr: ⁠⁠⁠⁠letterboxd.com/cjzehr/⁠⁠⁠⁠ Ricky Wickham: ⁠⁠⁠⁠letterboxd.com/octopuswizard/⁠⁠⁠⁠ Here is a COMPLETE LIST of every film that we have done an episode for. Enjoy! ⁠⁠⁠⁠https://letterboxd.com/ericlpeterson/list/a-complete-list-of-every-the-film-snobs-episode/⁠⁠⁠⁠ Five star reviews left on the pod get read out loud!

Episode 1007   It's Part 2! Fani testifies! It is high drama. Not only that, we hear from an incredible Cohen Brothers movie character for some reason. We also hear from Fani Willis's dad, someone who has led a fascinating life. Then finally, they put Wade's ex-partner Bradley on the stand and... try to make him talk for like 4 hours. It also takes a very dark turn.   If you'd like to support the show (and lose the ads!), please pledge at patreon.com/law! For the time being, any profit over and above the costs of operating the show, will go towards repair and accountability.

Martin Scorsese's Dark Comedy from 1983 was selected by the community after a close contest with the Cohen Brothers movie on the list. We talk Blindspots, performances, social implications and DeNiro, a lot. Todd Liebenow, Matthew Simpson and Nick Rehak have lots to say about this Scorsese flop that as acquired a patina of respect over the years. We also play a fast game of Lambpardy and discuss DeNiro and Scorsese apart from one another.

This episode aired on 2/19/24. We talk about Xmen 97, Cohen Brothers, Iron Claw and more nostalgia...Bo managed to catch the new Bob Marley biopic One Love, and we get caught up on the rest of the weeks news in film!

The Nerd Skool jumps into Endgame! Random sidetracks include:   Artstar hates Jared Leto. Jeff Bridges is Rooster Cogburn 2.0 TBJ knows Hailee Steinfeld from Pitch Perfect. Wu Tang Clan is into comic books. Joe gets the Russo Brothers, the Farrelly Brothers and the Cohen Brothers mixed up. The Marvels was fun. Most of Nerd Skool would attend a red carpet in pajamas, but not TBJ. Artstar wants to be on Bluesky, Andy already is. Anton Chigurh might be Galactus. Elsa Bloodstone and Manthing are part of Werewolf By Night, and are both great in Marvel Snap. TBJ was in the Airforce and gets questioned for parking in the veteran spaces at Harris Teeter.   Buut, we do eventually get into Endgame. We promise.       Get your Nerdskool Merch:  https://www.redbubble.com/shop/ap/74089719?asc=u Music by D Jones Hip Hop!

This week we welcome Actor, Writer and Director Alden Ehrenreich to the show to talk about writing and directing his first short film Shadow Brother Sunday which he also stars in! Alrik talked with Alden about his process, what he has brought from his career as a Hollywood actor into his first short and what Francis Ford Copola's advice was for making his first film. This is also our very special 450th episode of the show so after that we will play a special round of THE GAME and chat about what we've learned in 450 episodes! Enjoy! Watch Liz's new short film Witchy on youtube: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gk5WtIOz5do Watch Alrik's new short film Parka on Vimeo: https://vimeo.com/357898693 Watch The Alternate on Tubi Out Now: https://tubitv.com/movies/702632/the-alternate Check out the ISA at: www.networkisa.org Don't forget to support us on Patreon! www.patreon.com/mmihpodcast

In this episode, we talk about the 1955 black comedy The Ladykillers. We talk about the brilliant script, wonderful comedic performance, and the production. We also touch on the 2004 remake by the Cohen Brothers starring Tom Hanks. Click and listen! Thanks for listening!

Mississippi - the sweatiest state in all of cinema becomes the star of of USofAMovie. While many may have assumed that blockbuster courtroom dramas or tip-top Cohen Brother's movies would be the obvious choice, you'd be stone cold wrong. Will introduces Ryan and Oli to Brian "Easter Island Head" Bosworth in 1991's 'Stone Cold'. They came for 'Hard Ticket To Hawaii' ridiculousness and stayed for the truly impressive explosions and action. Question is, should we get a pet lizard? Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

The director of the hilarious, R-rated talking dog movie "Strays' tells us about working with Will Ferrell and Jamie Foxx on the film, before taking us on a trip to the movies involving some wild reactions to Tropic Thunder, defending 'Love Actually" and a lot of love for Barbie. He then screens a Cohen Brothers classic for us.Find us here: https://linktr.ee/triptomoviespodA Trip to the Movies is proudly sponsored by @ODEONCinemas - We Make Movies BetterFounded in 1930, ODEON is the largest and best-known cinema chain in the UK and Ireland. We pride ourselves in delivering the very best cinema experience and cutting-edge technology.Book now at your local ODEON cinema for some big-screen movie magic! http://bit.ly/3BRaPMT Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

It is time for another Cohen Brother's gap to be filled! Bryce finally saw O Brother, Where Art Thou! A spin on one of the great, classical, epics set in the American South during the great depression starring Batman. Did Bryce love it? Listen now to find out! Naminspace.

1984's Blood Simple is surprisingly accomplished for a first movie and absolutely has all the hallmarks of later Cohen Brothers films.

This week on the WatchTower Podcast we have a hidden gem from the Cohen Brothers, “A Serious Man”! Join us as we jump into this film and discuss the unique perspective of Jewish culture, the ins and outs of how Joel and Ethan Cohen craft their stories, and many more things about this film! Help us by SUBSCRIBING, LIKING, and SHARING! #WatchTowerFilmPodcast #FilmPodcast #Cinema #IndieFilm #Film #Movies #MoviePodcast

Oscar-winning re-recording mixer & supervising sound editor Skip Lievsay takes you behind the sound on the Cohen Brothers' beloved film Barton Fink. He talks about his 38-year collaboration with the Cohen Brothers, what it was like to work on a film pre-Pro Tools, the stories behind the Barton Fink mosquito, the signature door whoosh, that never-ending hotel desk bell, and so much more! Interview by Jennifer Walden, and hosted by Asbjoern Andersen from asoundeffect.com

Music Month continues with 2013's Inside Llewyn Davis! Ben and Anthony discuss the Cohen Brothers' discursive look at the 1960s Greenwich Village folk scene, featuring a breakthrough performance from Oscar Isaac. Written and directed by Joel and Ethan Coen. Starring Oscar Isaac and featuring Carey Mulligan, John Goodman, Garrett Hedlund, F. Murray Abraham, Justin Timberlake and Adam Driver.

This week after our descent into the Breenpocalypse (seriously check episode 267 for our therapy session) we needed a serious pallete cleanser.  For us that came in the form of the 2004 film, The Ladykillers.  Deridded by critics and fans of the often celebrated Cohen Brothers, this remake of the 1955 british comedy about criminals robbing a casino by tunnelling through an elderly woman's basement is chock full of so many off the wall and darkly comedic moments.  From the need for waffles, Tom Hank's doing his best Foghorn Leghorn impression, to a yet to be super famous J.K Simmons stealing scenes as the demolition expert with IBS, Garth Pancake.   But does this movie deserve the hate or is this an under appreciated gem that has grown better with age?  We'll find out today!   DISCORD!!!  Take the conversation further!  Come check out our Discord channel where we you can interact face to face (digitally) with us.  Like our opinion or hate it, now you can tell us directly!  https://discord.gg/QWPUCGCuVC SUPPORT THE PODCAST! Do you love the show and want to show your appreciation?  Consider a one time or monthly tip in our virtual tip jar.  Our show will ALWAYS be free, but unfortunately creating the podcast is not free.  Your support will go directly to our production costs.   https://glow.fm/thecinemapsychosshow/ JDUBS VIDEO NASTIES AND NEWSLETTER Our co-host, John Wooliscroft, has a brand new film channel on youtube. Check it out and Subscribe- https://www.youtube.com/@JDUBSVIDEONASTIES Sign up for the PSYCHOS NATION, our monthly newsletter - http://eepurl.com/dhGswf FEEDBACK AND CONTACT US Gotta a movie or question you want to throw our way?  Or did we trash one of your favorite films and you want to know where to send a dead horse.  Either way, drop us a line!  We welcome your questions and dead horses.   NEW !!!  Leave us voicemail! - https://cinemapsychosshow.com/contact-us/ Email cinemapsychosshow@gmail.com Twitter - https://twitter.com/PsychosShow Facebook - https://www.facebook.com/psychosshow/ Discord -https://discord.gg/QWPUCGCuVC Tiktok-https://www.tiktok.com/@cinemapsychosshow Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/psychosshow/ Website - https://cinemapsychosshow.com/ Brian Cottington - https://twitter.com/BrianCottington John Wooliscroft - https://twitter.com/TheUnRealJWools Theme Music: TITLE: “Red Alert” AUTHOR: Jack Waldenmaier PUBLISHER: Music Bakery Publishing (BMI) WARNING: UNAUTHORIZED USE OF THE MUSIC CONTAINED IN THIS PRODUCTION IS SUBJECT TO CRIMINAL PROSECUTION. All copyrights, licensing, duplication and distribution rights are held exclusively by Music Bakery Publishing (BMI). 214-636-5887 musicbakery.com    

The boys went to Arizona. And boy, was it a TIME!Fresh off their trip to Tempe for a friend's wedding, Rog and Dylan return for this episode with clearer minds and full hearts. The desert turned them into a pair of sun devils and they were just an elevator ride away from turning into a couple of wildcats.In addition to making unforgettable memories, Rog and Dylan also watched Raising Arizona in Arizona, and enjoyed it so much, they turned it on again when they returned back to New York. The movie, which has been regarded as one of the Cohen Brothers' best, climbed to #2 of Favorite Cohen Brothers Movies for one of our host. The guys also share their favorite Nicholas Cage movie.To wrap it up, Rog and Dylan give Phoenix/Sky Harbor Airport a piece of their mind.Find out what happened in Arizona as you sip back and enjoy all the shenanigans (at least the stories we're able to share on a public forum) from the guys' first, but definitely not their last, trip to the desert.Created by upStreamhttps://www.upstreampix.com/the-wrap-beers-podcastFollow The Wrap Beers Podcast!https://www.instagram.com/thewrapbeers/https://twitter.com/TheWrapBeersDylan - https://www.instagram.com/dylan_john_murphy/Roger - https://www.instagram.com/rogerzworld/

On this episode of Made in Hollywood Mark and William interview filmmaker, Matt Warren. You may also hear irrelevant things on this episode about Delicate Arch, Brazil, Repo Man, Mad Max: Fury Road, Under the Skin, Scarlett Johansson, Film Independent, Spirit Awards, Duck Amuck, Sundance Film Festival, Autry Museum, Chad Peter, Cohen Brothers, Quentin Tarantino, Trent Harris, Echo People, Patrick Cohen, Beaver Trilogy, and Bill Hader. 

Are you a big fan of "Blades of Glory"? If so, don't miss out on this podcast episode featuring Dave Krinsky, "Blades of Glory" writer.Show Notes:Dave on Emmys: https://taylorwilliamson.comDave's Wikipedia: https://www.instagram.com/taylorcomedy/Dave on IMDB: https://www.imdb.com/name/nm2743976/Michael's Online Screenwriting Course - https://michaeljamin.com/courseFree Screenwriting Lesson - https://michaeljamin.com/freeJoin My Watchlist - https://michaeljamin.com/watchlistAutomated Transcript:Dave Krinsky (00:00):It's so funny in animation because we would do like a big, you know, Hank football. We'd do a big football episode with a lot of people in the crowd, and James would be like, okay, this is really streaming the animators. We can't do another big one next week. So next week we'd go, look, this is a very simple episode. It mostly takes place in the house. It's a very personal story between Hank and Bobby. He's like, Ooh, that's gonna strain the animators. It's gonna require a lot of acting . Yeah. I'm like, ok. So wait, we can't do anything.Michael Jamin (00:25):You're listening to Screenwriters Need to Hear This with Michael, Janet.Michael Jamin (00:33):Hey everyone. Welcome back to Screenwriters. Need to hear this, the podcast. I got another amazing guest today. I'm here with my many, he's been my next guest, has been my boss on many occasions. He's been my friend on one occasion, . And he's . Here he is. Boy, this guy's got good credits. So this is Dave Krinsky and he's a feature writer, show creator. He ran King of the Hill for, what was it, eight years? Eight seasons weDave Krinsky (00:59):Ran. Yeah, I think maybe seven. I can never quite keep track.Michael Jamin (01:02):Felt like eight. Right? He was a show runner, king of Hill for, for many seasons, but a writer on, I think you wrote on every single season, didn't you?Dave Krinsky (01:08):Yeah, we came in right after the first season had just aired. Right. So they were still rewriting and posting season one and starting writing season two,Michael Jamin (01:18):Jump and right in. And then also, we're gonna talk about everything, but I wanna give you a proper introduction. We wrote, co-wrote with his partner, blades of Glory. They ran a, a show called Lopez, which i, I worked on for a little bit. CRO created Silicon Valley. I've heard of that show. Also the Good Family that was a b c animated show ran Bebes and Butthead for a while executive produced movie called Extract. What, what else, what else did you, you did a lot of stuff, man,Dave Krinsky (01:46):Lady Glory. Did you mention that? Wait,Michael Jamin (01:48):I thought I said that. Didn't I not sayDave Krinsky (01:49):That? Yeah, you did. I tuned you out, Don Point. I've learned to tune you out early, soMichael Jamin (01:53):, but man, oh man, I wa how, but you also said, when we were chatting before we started recording, that you did a lot of movie rewr. I didn't even know you guys did other movie rewrites.Dave Krinsky (02:03):Yeah. So when we first came out, this was back, you know, like nineties. You really had to decide where you were. A movie writer, a TV writer. The agents didn't even talk to each other. So we had come out with some movie scripts. We just thought that was sort of the easiest way to break in. Right. And we had ended up selling a couple, we sold one to Warner Brothers. It was they bought it for Chevy Chase. And yeah. Then we got firedMichael Jamin (02:26):And they didn't make up obviously causeDave Krinsky (02:28):They, they didn't make it. We got fired and they hired someone else to rewrite. And our agent goes, that's great news. And I'm like, how's that? Great news? They go, it's not dead. If they're hiring someone else to rewrite it. And it was kind of an a-list writer, then that means it's still alive. But it ended up not getting made, although it's sort of, Ben made a few times because it was a very broad idea about a guy who, you know how we only use 10% of our brain's potential, right. While these scientists developed this serum that unlocked the other 90% instead of being injected in a, you know, good upstanding citizen like Michael Jamin. And it gets in, injected in this doofus Chevy Chase who basically becomes this like throbbing organi organism. He's got 10 times the site and after the hearing 10 times the athletic ability. So he is trying to like, make money and become famous with it.Michael Jamin (03:09):But So he was attached before there was a director or No.Dave Krinsky (03:12):So there was never even a director manager. He was attached, like Chevy Chase had a deal at Warner Brothers and Warner was looking for movies for him. So this, and then those days they were buying spec scripts left and right. Right. So they bought that from us and we spent like a long time rewriting it.Michael Jamin (03:26):So he was giving you the notes on what he wanted?Dave Krinsky (03:29):No, we never even met with him. I think, you know, I don't even know if you ever heard of it, to be honest, it really wasn't those days, Uhhuh , if you wanted a Chevy reputation movie, you bought 10 or 12 scripts and you developed until you found one that you wanted to do and brought to him.Michael Jamin (03:41):So you were dealing with his development people.Dave Krinsky (03:43):We were just dealing with Warner Brothers, Warner Brothers, and the producer. So the way it worked back then, and maybe they still did now, but the spec script market isn't really strong anymore. You would go to your agent with a spec and they'd go, okay, we're gonna send it to X producer who has a deal at Paramount and y producer who has a good relationship with Warner Brothers. And we're gonna, they're gonna go to the studios all on the same weekend and let 'em know. They have to decide. And then hopefully you get at least two offers so that you're playing 'em against each other. And that particular, we only got one from Warner Brothers, so the producer on the project we never even met until Warner Brothers had bought it. So then the producer, and it's a weird deal because we actually had a better relationship with the execs at Warner Brothers than we did with the producer. Like, we like their nodes better. So it's a weird political dynamic that you had to deal with. But we ended up selling a couple of projects that way that didn't get made. But ultimately when Blades of Gloria got made, then it was a ton of rewrite work. Michael Jamin (04:42):And then, but this was, this was during King of the Hill.Dave Krinsky (04:45):Bla Glory was during King of the Hill. I mean, we were doing our movie stuff before King of the Hill started. And, and we started looking around, you know, we sold stuff, but we weren't, we were, John and I were still sharing an apartment in Burbank and I was driving a car with no air conditioning. And I looked over at some of my buddies like Bill Martin, who was like buying a house and buying a nice car. And those guys were all on tv. And John and I were like, well, maybe we should, I mean, we always wanted to do tv but our agents just you, no, you're movie writers. So we ended up writing some TV specs scripts and then ended up getting a job in tv. But, so we were writing specs scripts, we were get assignments occasionally, or we would pitch on something, but it wasn't until Bla Glory that really was like, oh, okay, now we're getting a ton of movie rewrite.Michael Jamin (05:29):And then how did you know Bill Martin? Would you go to, did you go to college with him?Dave Krinsky (05:31):Yeah, we went to college together. So it was weird. It was like, it was me, John Bill, Peyton Reid, who directed all the Aunt Man movies. This guy John Schultz, who directed like Mike. And it was like we all kind of moved out here at the same time to try to pursue the business.Michael Jamin (05:46):Wow. I didn't even know that. And then, well, so was your, when did you decide that you wanted to be a writer? Like in high school or something?Dave Krinsky (05:53):Pretty much, I mean, I, I, this is make me sound really cool but I loved reading as a kid. I loved, you know, books. And I just loved when a story really impacted me and made me think. I was like, wow, that's a cool sort of power to have over people, to influence 'em that way. So since the time I was like 12, 13, I thought about it. And then in high school we had to write a short story for an English class. And I wrote this kind of science fiction funny story, and the teacher, you know, wrote a plus, what are you gonna do with this gift? And I was like, oh, I guess it actually could be a job. Right. So,Michael Jamin (06:24):But you think that it could be a job? Like I didn't, that didn't occur to me until I was older that you could make money in tv.Dave Krinsky (06:29):. Well, you know what I was thinking I'd be a book writer and so I went to Carolina cause I knew they had a strong English department. I took all the creative writing classes there. And since I didn't wanna really do anything else, I took whatever course I find. So screenwriting was one. Playwriting was one. And after I met John Alsk and my partner and, and David Palmer, who I worked with out here a bit.Michael Jamin (06:50):Wow. You were serious about it. Did you have to apply to those programs?Dave Krinsky (06:53):You know? Yeah, no, I mean, I, I was in the, I got accepted to the honors program, which was what I had applied for. And because of that I got to get into some of the writing classes I wouldn't have had access to anyway.Michael Jamin (07:05):So this is all or nothing for you? I mean, you, I mean, there was no plan BDave Krinsky (07:09):Well I, you know, my mom was always like, Ryan, you go to law school, you have something to fall back on. But I knew if I something to fall back and I'd probably fall back on it, you know? And, and it took us a while to get su you know, really established with Point. I could get rid of that crappy car with the o ac ac in the apartment with the oac. But if I had had the ability or the degree to do anything else, I probably would've bailed on the writing dream earlier.Michael Jamin (07:32):Right. Wow. And then, and then, so eventually you just had to move into tv and then how, I know, how did you get your first gig?Dave Krinsky (07:40):So we decided to move tv. We wrote a couple of spec scripts and I think it was Bill Martin who said, oh, you should meet Carolyn Strauss over at hbo o And Carolyn of course was, you know, at the vanguard of starting H B O when it was, yeah.Michael Jamin (07:54):Wait, he's setting up meetings for you? Like, he's like your agent now, bill? No,Dave Krinsky (07:57):It really was one of those things where it was like, we're like, Hey, we wanna get into TV doing, he goes, oh, well you should meet Ke Strauss. We like Hershey's really cool. And I think he might have told her, oh, you should meet these guys. Okay. And so we had a general with her and which was a good lesson. It was like, you know, I think we always had something to pitch. We always knew a general, everybody, you know, wants something. I can't remember if we pitched anything too specifically or not. Cuz in movies you always want to pitch an idea. Sometimes in TV it really is just a general Yeah. To see what you know. But, you know, it was a great meeting and nothing came of it. And then like nine months later we got a call from her and she goes, look, we're doing a show.(08:32): The showrunner really wants movie guys doesn't want like, just TV sitcom guys. Wow. And I thought of you guys, you, you look, look at the pilot, they shot a pilot and they sent the pilot over. It was a black and white period single camera show. David Ledon was the executive producer. Adam Resnick was the showrunner, the creator. And it was awesome. It was like the Cohen Brothers really dark funny. And we were like, yeah. So she set up a call with us. We talked to Adam for like an hour and a half, mostly about Goodfellas and the Godfather and just movies. And then they called us up, goes, look, will you the show's in New York, will you move there? And we're like, yeah, we'll move there. She goes, okay, three or four days, can you move? And we're like, yeah, what do we don't have? I don't even think we had a plant in our place, you know, our fresh food. So we moved toMichael Jamin (09:18):New York. And you got outta your rent You? Or do youDave Krinsky (09:20):Remember? We sublet Cause it was a, I think it was a 10 episode order that became an eight episode order, which is now, you know, the norm. But then was like, okay, so we're only gonna be there probably nine months of production. So we figured why give up our place.Michael Jamin (09:34):Do you think if it wasn't a good show, you would've taken, if it was a bad show, you would've taken the author?Dave Krinsky (09:40):Oh, that's a good question. You know, probably not, you know, before this happened, we were in the movie biz. We, we had a meeting with Polly Shore, right. And Polly was manager was in the meeting and his manager was a gentleman named Michael Rotenberg, who is now my manager. And, and Michael and and Sea have, you know, allMichael Jamin (09:59):Times he's our dealt withDave Krinsky (10:00):Them. He was an executor on King of the Hill. So this was before King of the Hill even. And we pitched Polly the new line, wanted to do a movie where Pauly basically, they sound of mu they wanted him to be a nanny. And we pitched like Sound of Music with Polly going around Europe and Polly was as insulting and, and, and just not a good collaborate. He was just say, Hey, who are these greasy weasels? And you know, he just goes, no, just turn the camera on and I'll be funny. And we're like, okay. But John I think had like $93 in this bank account and I might have had a little bit more. And they offered it to us and we were like, this could be our career right. Path that we don't want to be on. And we turned it down. So I think if it was a crappy show, we probably would've turned it down too.Michael Jamin (10:45):Right. Wow. You turned it down. Cuz I, you know, now you, I think now you take anything you forgetDave Krinsky (10:50):. Yeah, well certainlyMichael Jamin (10:51):It's not you, but one, one does. Right.Dave Krinsky (10:53):And it's not a bad, it's not bad advice. You gotta get in the game, you know? So we had already been in the game just enough that it wasn't like we were completely unknown. We had anything produced, so we certainly weren't a hot commodity. Right. But we really felt like, oh, this could just pigeonhole us. And it was interesting because our agent was like, okay, if you don't wanna do it, fine, but we don't really want to be rude and turn it down, so we're gonna ask for way more money than they'll ever pay you. Right. So they went and asked for like $400,000 and they were furious anyway. They're like, who the hell do you think you are asking anymore? It's just like, sorry, we just don't wanna do it. So. Right.Michael Jamin (11:31):How funny, did you, were you, when you first got on King of the, or I guess not, well I guess, you know, on Resnick's show, were you, did you, did you find it over? You were in over your head? I mean, that's how I felt when we started.Dave Krinsky (11:42):Oh yeah. Because I was always that one of those writers, and I'm sure there's plenty like that. I'm like, I don't even in college where you had to like, give your scr your scripts or your stories to people to read. I'm like, I don't wanna do this. You know? Cause I just didn't have the confidence or faith in myself. So we got to New York and we were working at a Letterman's theater. And Adam's great. I mean, he is the nicest guy. He's a super small staff. There's this John and I, this other team and this guy Vince Calandra. Right. And I just remember like sitting in the writer's room, not saying a word because I was like, I don't wanna say the wrong thing and look like an idiot. And, and in all honesty, when I got to King of the Hill, I looked around, I was like, I recognize names from seeing him on The Simpsons and you know, my judge of course. And I was inhibited there too. And I barely pitched, I think for the first couple of months I was there.Michael Jamin (12:30):Really. And then what was the moment when you felt like you could, you could test the waters?Dave Krinsky (12:36):Well, what happened was, I was just hanging out enough, like, so in the lunchroom, you know, I got to be friendly with people and people go out for a drink and then it suddenly was a social thing. And I was comfortable in that and I could start being funny that way. So by the time I got back to the room after a couple of months, it was kind of like, oh, I was just bull bullshitting with my friends, you know? And it was much easier to pitch because Right. It felt safer,Michael Jamin (13:00):Felt sa because I even remember on Kingley we had some interns, people would sit in pitching and I'm like, how did they get over their fear of pitching when they haven't been hired as a writer? .Dave Krinsky (13:10):Yeah. I mean, and it, it's a good question for young writers and, and I'm teaching a class down at Chapman now and, and I'm like, it's a tricky situation when you're a new writer, you want to talk cuz you want to prove you're mm-hmm. worthy. But if you talk too much or talk poorly Yeah. It doesn't do you any good. And it really, in my opinion, when as a showrunner, I would rather you be quiet and sort of take it all in and pitch very occasionally, then feel like you've gotta pitch stuff that ends up derailing the room.Michael Jamin (13:40):You know, I, I totally agree with you. The one thing I've said, cause I think a new, let's say there's 10 writers in a room, and a staff writer often thinks, well I better speak a 10th of the time because I'm, there's 10 people here, but they're not getting paid a 10th. They're not getting paid as much as the co-executive producer. They don't have to contribute as much. You know?Dave Krinsky (13:56):Yeah. And it's not expected. Like, I've seen plenty of horrible showrunners who are punitive and, you know, they don't make it easy for a staff writer and they're happy to fire a staff writer every season and try someone else. But John, I have always been like, look, we're gonna bring you on board. We're gonna be patient with you. You know, it's like, it's not an easy position to be in. And, and when you're a showrunner, all you want is someone to make your life easier. And if a staff writer makes your life easier one time in a season, it's almost like, okay, you know what? I got something outta you. Great. WhatMichael Jamin (14:27):About that leap from, cuz I was there for that. You were, I guess it was season 60 started running it, is that right?Dave Krinsky (14:35):Yeah, six seven was our first official year running here. Billy,Michael Jamin (14:38):What was it like for you making the le because you know, everyone, you always think, I could do this job, I could do the job better than my boss. And then you become the boss and you're like, wait a minute, this is hard.Dave Krinsky (14:47):Yeah. Well I remember when on that Resnik show, there was a consultant there, and he told us, he goes, the punishment for writing well is producing. And it's like, you know, you work your way up and you become a producer and suddenly Yeah. You're managing people, you're dealing with all the politics, the budget. And I think the, the biggest thing that happened to me was we were working, and I can't remember if you were in the room or not. Do you remember Collier's episode about that Michael Keaton did? What The Pig the Pigs are? Yeah.Michael Jamin (15:15):I was there for probably, we probably got there for the animatic part of it. So we were didn't great itDave Krinsky (15:20):Okay. So it was a really weird story and Collier's a great writer, but this was one that was trouble from the get go just because it was so bizarre. Yes. And and I remember we were working super late trying to get to it and, and I think Richard Chappelle was running the, the show at that point. And he and Greg were developing a show and they left the room and everybody left the room. There was like four of us in there, and I think Greg or Rich Dave, you get on the computer and I and King of the Hill, the room, it wasn't like a conference room, it was like a big, almost like living room with a Yeah. Scattered room. One person sat there, it kind of ran the room. We didn't have the screen showing the script, which I never liked anyway. And I was like, I don't think I can run a room. Mm-Hmm. . And I got up there and I was just like, you know, I just did what I had to do. And I remember we, you know, spent a few hours, it was late night and we kind of like gave the script rich and Greg, and they came and got, this is great, this is working. And it was like, oh gee, so I guess I can do it. Right.Dave Krinsky (16:15):So when we took over the show, yeah. I mean it definitely was like, you, so many things were harder than you would think, but some were easier too. I remember the other showrunners before we run the show would come back from pitching the story. So the network, and they go, well, we sold six outta seven of 'em. So, you know, it wasn't easy. And then when we started pitching to the network, you know, the show had been on for six, seven years. They were like, okay, good. It was like, oh, this isn't that hard. Right. The hard parts were, you know, managing the budget, managing people, managing writers, dealing with the network.Michael Jamin (16:47):How much budget were you dealing with? Like, what were you, how big was it? Like, were you what? No, I mean, like what, what exactly were you doing? You know? Oh, yeah, because I, I don't really touch the, when we were running stuff, we don't really touch the budgets, butDave Krinsky (16:58):What do you, oh, so I mean, first it was the writer's budget, which every year was like, yeah, okay. Like, who can we afford to pay? But I mean, a lot of it, you'll remember our, our line producer McKinsey would walk in and be like, you know what? Last episode had a football crowd and this episode you want to do, you know, whatever a a crowd scene at the school, we can't afford that. The budget won't. Right. You know, so a lot of it was making creative decisions based on the limitations. Although it's so funny in animation because we would do like a big, you know, Hank football, we do a big football episode with a lot of people in the crowd and Jims like, okay, this is really streaming the animators. We can't do another big one next week. So next week we'd go, look, this is a very simple episode. It mostly takes place in the house. It's a very personal story between Hank and Bobby. And he's like, Ooh, that's gonna strain the animators. It's gonna require a lot of acting . Yeah. Like, ok, so wait, we can't do anythingMichael Jamin (17:52):. There's always a reason. That's right. There's always a reason why you're gonna ruin the show,Dave Krinsky (17:57):The bank.Michael Jamin (17:58):Wow. That's so, and now and then so what ha, so then after King of the Hill, which you guys did for many years, then it went down and they then went down for, I was probably a couple years it went down. Right.Dave Krinsky (18:10):I don't remember if it was a couple years because Yeah. So the show did not get picked up. Right. And then they moved John and I and Clarissa assistant onto the lot, into this crummy little office to finish posting the shows. Right. And so we were there posting the shows and we never left. I mean, by the time we, we, it's not like we were like home and done before we left there. They, they picked the show up again for another run.Michael Jamin (18:38):What was the thinking behind canceling and then picking it up again? Like why?Dave Krinsky (18:42):From what I hear Uhhuh, it's so, you know, Fox Network ran the show. Mm-Hmm. , 20th Century Fox was the studio who owned the show. Right. And apparently the, the heads of the studio got big bonuses when they got new shows on the air that were successful. So they weren't making a ton of money.Michael Jamin (19:05):Personally.Dave Krinsky (19:06):Personally. And the other thing, apparently they owned and operated cuz everything was syndicated. You know, in those days the package was so high for them to pay. As the show got on that they were like, wow, we gotta renegotiate this deal. So when everybody started renegotiating, it seemed like, okay, let's not do it. And then ultimately, I bet it was Aria Emmanuel fought for, cuz he was always fighting for it. But, or maybe it was Rotenberg, but yes, that's whatever they just decided. Okay. They made a deal and picked us back up again.Michael Jamin (19:34):And at that point it was, it was a lot of new writers, well most of the writers had moved on, but you were still on the show. So the cause you kind of restarted the staff was almost, as I remember it was almost almost brand new. There was only a couple pre previous writers, like Christie Stratton was there,Dave Krinsky (19:51):I think Christie was there, kit was there, kit Balls, GarlandMichael Jamin (19:54):Garland was there. Sure. Okay.Dave Krinsky (19:56):Yeah. So there was definitely a core group. I remember like, I can't remember Tony and Becky came on. Right. I don't remember if that was before that or not. So I think enough people, it might have been like, nowadays there's not really a staffing season, but I think it might have been during a non-st staffing season that enough people hadn't landed somewhere that we could get, get him back.Michael Jamin (20:15):Right, right. And then after that, you guys did The Good Family?Dave Krinsky (20:20):Yeah. So that was another, you know, people wanted an animated show from us. We had, you know, we'd gotten very close to Mike on King of the Hill. So started working together a lot with him. And we had this, this show The Good Family about a very you know, PC family, sort of the opposite of Hank Hill. And I just remember, you know, everybody was like, okay, take it to Fox and it'll run for forever. And it was just like, we just wanted to do things differently. And m r c and Independent, you know, studio had came out, came after us pretty hard and said, no, we want to do this deal. We can finance it and, and you can have a better upside and more freedom and Okay. So we decided to do it and we pitched it around and a B C just made such a hard press for it.Michael Jamin (21:03):OhDave Krinsky (21:03):Wow. And yeah. And it turns out they weren't the best partners simply because they didn't have any animation on. Right. They put us on with a really bad animated show, like after Wipe Out or something. It was just like not a good fit. Right. So, but it ends up, you know, the bottom fell outta the industry right after that cuz Rotenberg would call us up and goes, you know, your numbers would be a top 10 show like within two years. Right. We would've been like, fine. But at that moment just wasn't good enough numbers.Michael Jamin (21:30):And then, and then came, then they brought back Beavis and Butthead, which you guys ran, which was so interesting cuz that was a whole different experience that, that was all freelance. That's why you guys called us, Hey, you wanna write a briefs and Butthead? We're like, yeah, we'll do that.Dave Krinsky (21:43):Yeah. I mean, who wouldn't wanna have an opportunity do that? Right. Yeah. So Mike, they've always begging Mike to bring it back and he was always like, yeah, the situation has to be right. And he just felt like the timing was right. And he had some stories he wanted to tell and he loves doing them. I mean Yeah. You know, as he always said, king of the Hill requires a ton of effort for a little bit of output. Bvis requires a little bit of input for a ton of output. You know, people just love it and it's funny. Yeah. so yeah, so I mean, the budgets weren't super high and we couldn't license music anymore. I mean, and when Mike originally did it, it was all music videos because M T V owned all those videos. Right. But the world had changed so suddenly we were doing Jersey Shore and, and a lot of other like, reality shows. Cause that was the only sort of material we could get mm-hmm. . Michael Jamin (22:29):Yeah. But we, that's, we did like, because I remember we brought, you guys brought us in, there's a, there was a woman, a couple women in Detroit, it was so cold in the deed, had a song so cold in the deed. ColdDave Krinsky (22:40):In the de Yeah.Michael Jamin (22:41):And I don't remember how it happened, but I, I think I commented on on her, maybe on her YouTube channel or something. I go, this is a great song. And she went with nuts. She's like, oh, thank you so much, . She's, so, yeah,Dave Krinsky (22:53):It was a weird sort of viral head, I think almost before things really went viral. And it was just like a homemade video about, you know, living in Detroit and Michael Jamin (23:01):And how did you find all that stuff?Dave Krinsky (23:03):Mike had found it and just thought it was really funny and really interesting. And soMichael Jamin (23:06):He was just surfing the internet looking for like, real cheap stuff that he could get.Dave Krinsky (23:11):I don't even think it was like with an eye toward Bes, but he also was in this little network of like, Knoxville and Spike Jones. They all like send each other stuff. So I don't know where he got it from, but I think he just saw it. And, and, and you know what, I, I don't know, he's never said, but that might have been. But just to bring Bes back where he is just like, oh my God, they'd have so much fun with this.Michael Jamin (23:30):Hey, it's Michael Jamin. If you like my videos and you want me to email them to you for free, join my watch list. Every Friday I send out my top three videos. These are for writers, actors, creative types. You can unsubscribe whenever you want. I'm not gonna spam you and it's absolutely free. Just go to michaeljamin.com/watchlistMichael Jamin (23:54):And then okay. So then what, what came after that?Dave Krinsky (23:58):So yeah, blades of Glory was in the middle of the King of the Hill era. Right. and then I guess Silicon Valley really would be the, the next big thing that,Michael Jamin (24:10):And Okay. How did you guys come up with that idea? Which is a pretty big hit.Dave Krinsky (24:15):Yeah. So that was an interesting confluence of events where Mike had been in talks with H B O, they really wanted to do something with him. And Scott Rudin wanted to do something in sort of the gaming space. Mm-Hmm. . So they were sort of circling around this tech world. And Mike's like, I'm not a gamer. I don't know that well, but Mike was an engineer, you know, electrical engineer, so he knew, you know that world well. Yeah. but John was reading the, the Steve Jobs book by Walter Isaacson and saw this quote in the book where it's like Bill Gates was making fun of Steve Jobs goes, he can't even code.Michael Jamin (24:48):Yeah.Dave Krinsky (24:49):So John had this idea. He goes, well that's a really funny world. And his, his brother was an electric engineer, so he knew that world as well. And you know, so we pitched an idea to Mike doing something that Mike goes, well, I would love to do that. So then when we pitched it to H B O, they were like, yeah, this sounds great.Michael Jamin (25:04):Sorry. Right. So you wrote the pilot shot it and you were, and then like what people don't understand is like the process for shooting a pilot or, you know, like it's a big deal. It's like a lot of work. It's like even casting is a lot of work.Dave Krinsky (25:18):Yeah. And it, it was a lot of work and, and you know, there's a lot of round, I mean, after to, you know, really it was pretty high on it even after our first draft. It felt like it was gonna move in the right direction. And I do remember them calling him saying, okay, we wanna shoot a pilot mm-hmm. . and we had just done a show for Nat Geo before this where the budgets, the budgets were, you know, very low. I can't remember what they were, but, so HBO calls saying, you know, look, the pilot's gotta, the budget's gotta have like a four or five in front of it and we're like 400, 500 grands ton, but we can probably do it. It was like, no, no, no. Four or 5 million, million(25:52):. And they, they actually forced us to go up to Silicon Valley to shoot for a few days, bring the whole company up and we're like, there's nothing up there. We can shoot this in la. You know, and we ended up shooting like on the side of a freeway and we had a couple establishing shots of Google and Facebook and Right. And stuff. But, you know, HBO does things and they want it to be authentic so you know, all the credit in the world to them. Right. and then, yeah. Then when we did an edit, it was interesting cuz the pilot to Silicon Valley has a very big subplot of these two women in LA who are tired of the LA scene and they go up to Silicon Valley cuz the guys are rich and nice and and nerdy. And they meet our heroes in the first episode. And h HP was like, yeah, you know, we don't want this storyline. We don't think we need it. So those poor actresses got cut outMichael Jamin (26:37):Mm-Hmm.Dave Krinsky (26:37): and yeah. Crushing. Crushing. Yeah. It's gotta be, gotta be tough to see a show be that and you're,Michael Jamin (26:44):And you were cut out of it. Yeah. Yeah. What now when you, I know you, you teach at Chapman, it's so interesting cuz some people are like, is film school worth it? It's like, it depends on who you get as your teacher. Like, honestly, it's like it, you know and I'm sure they're very lucky to have you. What do you, you know, what is it, what's it like with these kids? You know, what are you teaching them? What are, where are they coming from, I guess?Dave Krinsky (27:06):Yeah, so the class is writing for adult animation. So, you know, half hour animation was like King of the Hill and, and, and things like that. But you know, as you well know, writing for animation is very similar to writing for anything. You know, it, it really is. You still need your three x structure and everything you can just go a little crazier with with things. And yeah, I asked them all, you know, beginning, because it, a lot of people still ask me, is it worth going to film school? Look, film school's expensive if you can afford it. Mm-Hmm. , it's not a bad thing. And I think what these kids are getting, and I said kids, but a lot of 'em are in their twenties. I think one's in his thirties, Uhhuh, . They're writing constantly. Someone's making to, that's good.(27:45):They're in LA so they're exposed to people, you know, not Pam or something, but like me who have done it in the business. We're not just academics who have published books about things. You know, and, and you know, you know, Brian Behar is down there, there's a bunch of Jill Con, there's a bunch of people down there who are like, done stuff. And last week or the other day, Damon, the guy who did La La Land, I can never say his last name in Whiplash. Yeah. He was speaking tonight. Austin Butler's speaking. Like, they just have a ton of people coming through. So you have exposure to all these people who have done things. Yeah. You also have connections that, you know, if you don't go to film till you just have to move to LA and try to, you know, try to build yourself. So yeah. So I think it's a, it's a good thing if you can afford it. If you can't afford it, it is not, it is not worth stretching to do it because, you know, we moved to LA and we started networking and meeting people and kept writing and, you know, that's really how most people do it. DoMichael Jamin (28:40):You feel you have to beat misconceptions out of them? You know,Dave Krinsky (28:45):I think this is my first class and I'm teaching second year grad students. Mm-Hmm. , so they're fairly savvy.Michael Jamin (28:53):Okay.Dave Krinsky (28:54):I think they've been exposed to it enough that there's not a ton of misconceptions, but there are big gaps in their knowledge. Just, you know, as it would be with anybody who, who hasn't been in the business. So, look, I teach them things about structure. Things like things they've probably heard before, but in ways that, you know, I, here's mistakes I've made before. You know, having a scene have to carry double duty and a half hour show is really difficult cause you have to change gears within the middle of a scene. You know, keep it simple. So things like that, I should, but they definitely light up more to my more anecdotal stories. Like, what's it like to be in the room? What's it like to work for a showrunner who's, you know, marginalizing you. What I remember I talked to the other day, I go, yeah, so we have this if come deal. And I could say, I go, wait, do you guys know what NIF come deal is? And they're like, no. I was like, oh, okay. Well let me explain that. So Right.Michael Jamin (29:45):What do you tell 'em about the showrunners? Who, who, who marginalized you? What's your, what's your advice on that? I wanna hear it.Dave Krinsky (29:51):Yeah, you know, it's just tough. I mean, I just keep stressing to them that most showrunners are under so much pressure and stress. All they want is someone to make their life easier. Mm-Hmm. . So, you know, the better you can do that, you know, the better off you'll be. And sometimes it's uncomfortable, but you need, like you, well I guess you weren't there at the beginning, but the king of the hill, you know, Greg was running the show and he had so many things you were on, so he was barely in the room. Right. So you didn't really know what he wanted. You didn't know if your story was gonna work. So if you saw em in the break room or saw em in the hallway, you would be like, Hey Greg, this is what we're doing. You know, you try to get feedback from em.(30:31):So that's what I tell them. I go do get as much from the showrunner as you can. And some of them won't give you anything as they're not rooting for you to succeed, but get as much as you can from them when you can, because it doesn't do you any good to try to figure out what they're doing. I mean, you have to do that to some level. The more you know what they want. And that's why I tell these, you know, these kids are doing beat sheets and outlines. I'm like, be as specific as you can. Don't cheat yourself because I'm gonna read stuff you gloss over and go, oh, I guess they know what they're doing. Right. And then when you gimme a script and I'm like, wait, what if you had done that in your outline? I could have pointed it out at that stage.Michael Jamin (31:06):Right, exactly. And when you say, cause when you say you know, you just helped the showrunner out, like, to me, what I want as a showrunner, what I, I just want a draft that doesn't need a page one rewrite. That's how I feel. I mean, is that what you're talking about?Dave Krinsky (31:20):Pretty much, yeah. I mean, or look, if you're someone who can, who can, you know, have the joke or the story fix in the room that gets you all home sooner, then that's fine too. I mean, you know, I mean, at King of the Hill we had such a big staff, it's an animated show. There were people who turned in great drafts. There were people who weren't great draft fighters, where were great in the room. You know, so in those days you could build a big enough team that, you know, you could have a pinch hitter and a utility field or designated here. Now the staff are so small, you really do want someone, but you're right. I mean, to get that draft mm-hmm. that needs a ton of work, you're like, okay, this sets us back so much on everything else now we can't, now I can't be in the editing room now. We can't push that next week's story forward. It's like, now we gotta dig in on this one.Michael Jamin (32:03):And, and what, what is, I mean that's exactly, yeah, that's exactly the panic that I, I I used to feel. But what did you, what is the advice, like, cause the industry's really changing so fast now. Like what is the advice you give these kids get out of film school in order to get into the business?Dave Krinsky (32:20):Yeah. I te look, it's tough. You know, I always try not to be too negative about it because it's always been tough. It's just tough in a different way. Right. you know what I tell them is like, look, the movie business is extraordinarily difficult. Mm-Hmm. . So if you want to be a movie writer, that's fine. But, you know, I urge them like, TV seems to be a cleaner path. Yeah. It used to be with movies, at least you could write a spec at some control where TV had to hope somebody hired you. So now, you know, I say, look, if you have a good movie idea, think about it as a series because, you know, a-list actors are all doing tv. You know, there's a, there's, and obviously TV is in a, isn't a great state right now with just the quality of it. Yeah. but yeah, I mean, you really do just have to, the basics are right, right, right. Mm-Hmm. and network, you gotta be in LA you gotta be hitting all the places because you never know. Look, that meeting with Carolyn Strauss, we had like, it was a good meeting. It wasn't like, ah, we've made it, we've met Carolyn Strauss and it wasn't until nine months later that something on the game of it. Right.Michael Jamin (33:19):Right. So it's really about getting in those circles.Dave Krinsky (33:21):Yeah.Michael Jamin (33:22):Yeah. I mean I, yeah, I remember people say that all times. Do I have to be in la? I'm like, you don't have to do anything you don't want, but you know, this is where the fish swim. You know?Dave Krinsky (33:32):Yeah. I mean the, the thing is, and I think you've probably said for, it's like the material doesn't really speak for itself. Mm-Hmm. , like in movies, it used to like a good specs script would find, you know, a, a buyer mm-hmm. , you know, now there's very few ideas that someone's gonna go, well, I don't care who this comes from, I want to do it. You know, and there's, there's very few scripts that are good enough that any anybody's gonna be like, I'm gonna put this on the air. It happens. They are out there. But the vast majority of the time it's, I've been hanging out, I've been going to, you know, upright citizens for grade. I've been going, oh, I've been helping out on a student film. Right. Hey, that kid I helped out is now on the desk at uta. Does UTA even exists anymore? I don't know. You know, myMichael Jamin (34:15):Agent? Yeah. I'm not sure.Dave Krinsky (34:15):Yeah. It's c aa and it's like, you know what, he wants to be an agent, so he's trying to hustle. So he's gonna hand the script over to, and suddenly you have a meeting, you know, with an agent, a real agent. So that's how it mo mostly happens. And you gotta be in LA for that.Michael Jamin (34:30):Yeah, exactly. That's how I feel.Dave Krinsky (34:33):Yeah.Michael Jamin (34:34):So what now I know you also, oh, I wanna mention your, your book. Is it you, you and John, your partner are of the, like, of all the writing teams I've known, even writers I've known, like you guys are the most entrepreneurial, it seems like you, like, you know, there nothing, there's a, there's a path to do it and then there's always like, well let's figure out how else we can do them. You know, you're always like the hustle doesn't end and it's create, it's always like creating opportunities for yourself.Dave Krinsky (34:59):Yeah, I mean certainly. And John's much, much better at that than, I mean he has a very entrepreneurial spirit and I enjoy it though. I like doing things differently. But he's very innovative in the way he thinks he's been in Europe for since, for Covid and for a lot of that. Mm-Hmm. just, you know, kicking the tires in the international market and making some headway there. But like, I remember like a couple of years ago we hooked up and were producing this writer who had done a academy award, docu a nominated documentary, and he had a half hour sitcom and he was he was crypt camp, so he was in a wheelchair and it was a character was about his story. And it was a really cool story. And Obama's company was attached to it. And it was like, this is a great, I mean it's a great script, great project, you know, and we go to Netflix a Zoom pitch and they literally were like this.(35:47):But as soon as the camera came on, you're like, okay, this isn't gonna be a sale. Mm-Hmm. , I mean, we knew it from the get go. Good lesson is you still pitch your heart out cuz you don't wanna ever have to blame yourself. If they don't buy it, they don't buy it. But so was like, what, you know, it's a great pro. Everything was great about it, but you don't know what they want and you just have so little control. So as we say, like shopping around town with our briefcase full of wears like Willie Loman is just not an appealing thing. So, you know, John had met this, this Irish actor, a guy named Richie Stevens, and he was pitching a friend's story and you know, that story wasn't quite hooking John. And then Richie started telling him about his own life and he was a recovered alcoholic drug addict gangster.(36:29):Right. And he is like, oh, that's interesting me, I want you to meet Dave. So we all sat down together, I'm like, I just had a fascinating life, a fascinating story. Like that's a great story to tell. Right. And and it was John's idea too. He was like, rich, you did the 12 steps of, you know, recovery. And he goes, yeah. He goes, let's tell your story in 12 steps. And that lends itself to a very nice TV show. Mm-Hmm. . But we were like, do we really want to go pitch a TV show? And so we said, you know what if we could write this as a book, cuz it lends itself to a book really. Well, 12 chapters. The 12 steps. Right. And I always wanted to write a book from the time I was 12, you know but then we'd have an IP and Hollywood loves an ip, you know, they love it If it's a,Michael Jamin (37:12):You still had to pitch it as a book. I mean you still have to pitch cuz you had to pitch it as aDave Krinsky (37:15):Book. Yeah. It's not like that's an easy path either. Yeah. But look, we had been out here long enough, we knew, you know, Jake Steinfeld Body by Jake who had published several successful books. He goes, well let me introduce you to my book agent. She publishes a lot of nonfiction authors. We'd pitched to her, she said, okay, this is a good hook. I think I can sell it. She turned around and sold it to a publisher. So then, you know, then we wrote the book, which took a while, but it's like now we have a book, which is an ip, which we can set up and we have much more control over it. Yeah. And we're making very good headway and setting it up as a TV show now.Michael Jamin (37:48):Right. Cuz you're bringing, you're bringing more to the table, which is why I always say, what else can you bring to the table? Yeah, yeah, yeah. And I, yeah, and it's an interesting read. I Yeah. Read it. Wonderful. So yeah, I give give you guys a lot of credit, a lot of credit, a lot of hustle.Dave Krinsky (38:03):Well look, a lot of it comes from boredom. And, and in all honesty, there's certain things we can do because of our track record. So when I'm advising like younger writers, I'm like, well, this won't necessarily work for you. Right. But you really do. I mean, the business has become so consolidated. It's a, it's a weird, it's also a weird business where like almost the quality or success of the entertainment doesn't matter. I mean, Apple's trying to sell mm-hmm. , you know, iPhones, Amazon's trying to sell everything else in the world so it doesn't have the same sort of metric as it used to when you were pitching a show. So it, it, it's difficult. But you know, like I met this young writer and she wrote a script that I really liked a lot mm-hmm. and, you know, we tried to set it up around town and have a ton of luck.(38:44):And then we learned she has dual citizenship, I guess triple citizen from Belgium and from France mm-hmm. . And it's like, oh, an American writer who's got, you know, some talent who can go over to the EU and tap into the money over there with their subsidies because she has a, is a huge thing. So now we're making headway on that. Right. So there's a lot of different angles that anybody's starting out might have access to that they can do instead of really just waiting for an agent or a writer or a studio to notice them.Michael Jamin (39:14):Right, right. Stop begging, stop begging, start making, making things happen yourself. Yeah. Yeah. I think so. Well tell, well tell us tell me what the name of that, that book so they can find it on Amazon.Dave Krinsky (39:25):It's called The Gangster's Guide to Sobriety.Michael Jamin (39:27):Yeah. He's a charming fella.Dave Krinsky (39:29):That guy. Yeah. You know, he's a real Irishman with the Irish accent and like, if you read the book, I mean, he did some horrible things and he's always like shocked that people are nice to him cuz of the horrible things he's done. But he's also a very gentle, sweet guy. He was just an, he was an addict and, and he made a lot of bad decisions from there, butMichael Jamin (39:45):Right. Dave Krinsky (39:46):But yeah, he is a good guy. He'sMichael Jamin (39:47):A good story. Yeah. A lot of good stories. Dave Krinsky, I'd give you a hug ifDave Krinsky (39:52):You I wantMichael Jamin (39:53):One , if you weren't on Zoom. Thank you so much. Thank you. Is there anything, any other parting words that we can get from you or anything, any other wisdom? Is that, or we tap, tap you out?Dave Krinsky (40:03):I don't know about wisdom, but I know that you know, a lot of people are, are tuning into you and checking your stuff out. And I just remember at King of the Hill and we've worked together on a bunch of shows, like you were always the fastest guy in the room. I was always just so amazed and, and jokes never translate. And it was your joke, so you'll sound like an idiot. But I just still remember we're all sitting in the writer's room and someone comes in and says, oh, I was down in Century City and I saw that Bewitched movie with will Ferrell and a Nicole Kidman. Yeah. And they go, how was he goes, well, I didn't really get to see it all because there was a fire alarm in the fire department came, came in and you yell everybody out, there's a bomb on the screen.Michael Jamin (40:38):, I don't remember that at, I have no memory of that at all. . My other, myDave Krinsky (40:44):Other favorite memory of King of the Hill was, you remember sitting in that back chair mm-hmm. taking a hole.Michael Jamin (40:50):Yes. And I have, I found a picture of it that was, I'll explain for the, for the, for our viewers we had, right. So there was a while on King of the Hill when we were working like 20 hours a day , and I felt like a hostage. And I had this one big chair that had big wooden legs on it. And I took like a thumb tack and I started digging a hole like the Shawshank Redemption. Redemption. Like I was digging a hole out of the . And then, and it took, it took months to finally when I finally broke through, I put a picture of Rita Hayworth on it so you couldn't see him as digging . And this is ballsy for a new guy. Cause I was like, you know, I was destroying furniture and I was telling everyone that I was not happy to be there 20 hours a day.Dave Krinsky (41:33):. Well, the thing we all, we all kind of bought into this fantasy that when you broke through we'd be free. Right. And it was so depressing when you broke through and we were like,Michael Jamin (41:43):We're allDave Krinsky (41:43):Back to work.Michael Jamin (41:45):I, I remember Garland was particularly interested in it. She's like, well, you know, because she was like, what are you gonna get through? Oh, funny. That's so funny. I'm, I'm glad you reminded that cuz I forget everything. That's the va the advantage of working with people if they can remind me of these stories. I don't remember any of that. I don't remember that that be whichDave Krinsky (42:04): Yeah. No, it was very funny. But no, I this was a pleasure and I I love what you're doing and I think, you know, you're giving information to people that's kind of hard to get anywhere else. You can learn craft, you can learn certain things, but you have so much input that's useful on a day-to-day level for aspiring writers. So good on you.Michael Jamin (42:20):Thank you so much Dave Krinsky, thank you again. AndDave Krinsky (42:24):Pleasure to see youMichael Jamin (42:25):Everyone. So yeah stay tuned. We had more episodes coming up next week. Thanks. And yeah, we have what else we got? We got a free webinar once a month. Sign up for that on my website, michaeljamin.com and my free newsletter. All good stuff. Go to michaeljamin.com and you can find it. Alright everyone, thank you so much.Phil Hudson (42:44):This has been an episode of Screenwriters. Need to Hear This with Michael Jamin and Phil Hudson. If you'd like to support this podcast, please consider subscribing, leaving your review and sharing this podcast with someone who needs to hear today's cycle. For free daily screenwriting tips, follow Michael on Instagram, Facebook and TikTok @MichaelJaminWriter. You can follow me on Instagram, Facebook, and TikTok at @PhilAHudson This episode was produced by Phil Hudson and edited by Dallas Crane. Until max time, keep writing.

Join me as I discuss the best picture Oscar winner from 2007, the Cohen Brothers' masterpiece: No Country for Old Men

Who's balloon's are these? / The "scrum" has to go. (It might.)   To advertise on our podcast, please reach out to sales@advertisecast.com or visit https://www.advertisecast.com/TheJeffWardShow  

Back with us is Fan-Favorite guest Keith Huang to discuss a slice of Americana, the Cohen Brothers' Raising Arizona! Keith delivers a special treat in the form of a surprise, brand new, FAN-FAVORITE GUEST! Naminspace.

Best alcoholic beverages you've ever had? Top Moments from the Past Year? Have you (luke) been doing your skincare? What Catholic thing you just can't get behind for whatever reason? What is your favorite day of the week? do you and your significant other share music tastes, if not, how do you deal with that? Words or themes that come to you about 2022? Words or themes for 2023? Words/Themes for celebrities? Cohen Brothers next hit: a western? writing stuff? what's new? Chrismation at infancy: why is the East right? A canonized saint that you think of for your co-host? What are the holiday traditions that need to go away and what new ones do you want to start? Thoughts on Expeditionary Force: Failure Mode? (gomer nerds out!) Best advice for a new dad? Favorite Karaoke song to sing in front of people and favorite in the shower? WHY HASN'T GOMER LOOKED AT MY EMAIL AND SENT ME MY MCCARRICK STICKER?! How do you keep going when physical/mental health is in the garbage? How is your ADHD going? Bird's eye view on the Mr. Frank Pavone thing? Why doesn't Luke like any Catholic people? j/j but not really.

Kelsey and Mark have been stricken with something awful and would like to give their audience an update. Also, they'll be reviewing Damien Chazelle Babylon in theaters on Friday, December 23rd, and their Geriatric Cinematic will be 1991's, Barton Fink. The Cohen Brother's classic film is available to rent on Apple TV, Amazon, YouTube TV, and other VOD services. 

The RP bois break down another Cohen Brothers film. Will they like it as much as the others they've reviewed?

Jeff Bridges and John Goodman star in one of the Cohen Brothers' most iconic films. This podcast abides. Check out Storyblocks and their Unlimited All Access Plan at: https://www.storyblocks.com/TJM Get Athletic Green's AG1 today at: https://athleticgreens.com/TJM Thanks to MANSCAPED for sponsoring the video! Get 20% OFF + Free Shipping at http://manscaped.com/tjm20 The next episode will be: Mission Impossible 4 Twitter: https://twitter.com/TJMpod Email: hello@theyrejustmovies.com

Welcome back to purgatory!!! This week the boys are back to talk the Cohen Brother's masterpiece No Country for Old Men from 2007 adapted from the Cormac Macarthy book of the same name. The film stars Josh Brolin, Javier Bardem, Tommy Lee Jones, Kelly Macdonald and Woody Harrelson. Thanks for checking us out and if you like to find the rest of our back catalogue go to podbean.com Music in the intro and outro by Carter Burwell from the No Country for Old Men soundtrack

Abortion has been a major topic since the final verdict or Roe VS Wade which determined that each state could decide whether or not to legalize abortion. I sat down this week with Avi and Mottie Cohen, who are brothers to close friends of mine Levi and Shua Cohen. (Credit to Levi for making this happen). We discussed abortion according to Jewish law, the question of morality being subjective, and our thoughts on transgenderism and the trajectory of western society. Leave your comments! Make sure to subscribe to and check out Avi and Mottie's podcast Jewish Thoughtflow on Spotify and all major audio platforms. SUBSCRIBE, LIKE, AND SHARE! --- Send in a voice message: https://anchor.fm/rafael-pinsky/message

Hey there, fans of laughter and nostalgia! Strap in for a blast from the past as we share our deep love for the comedic genius of the 90s. We're talking about the icons who shaped an era of hilarity: John Candy, Chris Farley, Adam Sandler, and let's not forget the brilliant women like Tina Fey, Goldie Hawn, and Reese Witherspoon. Remember The Waterboy? What about Big Daddy, Happy Gilmore, and Billy Madison? We're unearthing all those hilarious scenes that had us rolling on the floor laughing, before ROFL was even a thing. We're also going a little offbeat, so brace yourself for some honest chatter about realities like receding hairlines and the (not-so-fun) adventures with Rogaine.Now, who's ready for some Lebowski time? We're revisiting that Cohen Brothers classic and talking about the unique detective stories they spun. We've got Jeff Bridges, John Goodman, Julianne Moore, and even a late Philip Seymour Hoffman cameo to discuss. We're also shining the spotlight on another 90s favorite, Friday. With Ice Cube's brilliant writing and John Singleton's deft direction, this one's impossible to forget. We're also diving into a discussion about the upcoming animated sitcom, 'Married with Children' and its potential differences from the original in the time of a pandemic.Finally, we're rounding off with a tribute to the black comedy directors and writers who've made their mark on the industry. Whether it's Donald Glover's genius, Jordan Peele's creativity, or the iconic contributions from Robert Townsend and Tyler Perry, we're celebrating it all. We're even touching on the latest YouTube trends and comparing them to the comedy gold we grew up with. And as we wrap up, we're reminding ourselves to keep it real. The biggest numbers, we've learned, come from authenticity, not selling out. This episode is our little homage to the era that defined comedy for us. So, come join us on this laughter-fueled journey down memory lane!For full video highlights click the link or find us on YoutubeThe Best 90's Comedy Movies Vol.1 highlights - YouTube

Although growing up in the industry and becoming a multi-generational yard owner is impressive, starting as a first-generation recycling facility deserves a whole new level of appreciation. Brothers John and Nicholas Cohen, owners of NJC Scrap Metal Recycling in Hempstead and Bay Shore, NY, join Pile of Scrap at the 2022 ISRI National Convention to discuss where they see themselves in five years, what it's been like to work with family, and how important it is to hold the value in doing “old school” business.

Today with On The Edge Podcast, we're talking with Matt Epenshade who has his own podcast called the Cut And Splice Podcast. Matt is a cinematographer, and for the most part, we're gonna be talking about movies today. If you're interested in movies, then this is the podcast for you! HEADS UP: I'm not sure what happened here, but the audio on this podcast is NOT GREAT. It's a great conversation though so I still wanted to get this out there for you all to hear. We start off with some political talk about the movie industry. The industry historically leans left, but lately it seems like it's maneuvered itself to more far left and less liberal. What does ‘below the line' and ‘above the line' mean in the movie industry? What does a cinematographer do? Scott and Matt discuss their favorite movies. Scott talks about why he never trusts the academy because Shakespeare in Love beat a much, much better movie, Saving Private Ryan. Because of this, Scott has avoided watching other Oscar winning movies because of their poor taste. A discussion about War Movie “Come And See” One of Matt's must-watch movies is Dark City. It turns out that The Matrix is basically a rip-off of Dark City, down to even using some of the same set pieces. Why do people love the movies so much? A discussion about The Cohen Brothers. Movies are created to entertain, however some movies seem to exist to disturb people. The creators of these movies must know that they will never be a cinema blockbuster, so why are they made? A discussion about Libertarianism in the movie world. How do movies represent Libertarian values. Matt discusses that ‘the best libertarian movies are movies that are accidentally libertarian.' A discussion about the Kyle Rittenhouse trial and outcome, and more importantly, the American people's opinions about the whole situation that are largely misinformed. Scott discusses how he got his DUI. The story of what happened and manipulation that he experienced during the trial very well may be why he is a libertarian and not a republican. The discussion continues about falsely accused people and how there is an inherent bias in our justice system. There is a book called “Three Felonies A Day” which in short, is about how every American on average commits well, three felonies a day. Some people are still in jail for marijuana crimes in states where marijuana is perfectly legal. This is just another example of how our justice system is overblown and how our country has a love relationship with locking people up. Free Solo was a great movie that make your palms sweat the entire time. Scott and Matt discuss other movies that make your palms sweat! Best and worst Star Trek movies. What is the worst movie that you love?

Today with On The Edge Podcast, we're talking with Matt Epenshade who has his own podcast called the Cut And Splice Podcast. Matt is a cinematographer, and for the most part, we're gonna be talking about movies today. If you're interested in movies, then this is the podcast for you! HEADS UP: I'm not sure what happened here, but the audio on this podcast is NOT GREAT. It's a great conversation though so I still wanted to get this out there for you all to hear. 1:00 - We start off with some political talk about the movie industry. The industry historically leans left, but lately it seems like it's maneuvered itself to more far left and less liberal. 5:00 - What does ‘below the line' and ‘above the line' mean in the movie industry? 7:00 - What does a cinematographer do? 11:00 - Scott and Matt discuss their favorite movies. 16:00 - Scott talks about why he never trusts the academy because Shakespeare in Love beat a much, much better movie, Saving Private Ryan. Because of this, Scott has avoided watching other Oscar winning movies because of their poor taste. 21:00 - A discussion about War Movie “Come And See” 34:00 - One of Matt's must-watch movies is Dark City. It turns out that The Matrix is basically a rip-off of Dark City, down to even using some of the same set pieces. 36:20 - Why do people love the movies so much? 39:00 - A discussion about The Cohen Brothers. 41:00 - Movies are created to entertain, however some movies seem to exist to disturb people. The creators of these movies must know that they will never be a cinema blockbuster, so why are they made? 46:40 - A discussion about Libertarianism in the movie world. How do movies represent Libertarian values. Matt discusses that ‘the best libertarian movies are movies that are accidentally libertarian.' 56:30 - A discussion about the Kyle Rittenhouse trial and outcome, and more importantly, the American people's opinions about the whole situation that are largely misinformed. 1:03:50 - Scott discusses how he got his DUI. The story of what happened and manipulation that he experienced during the trial very well may be why he is a libertarian and not a republican. 1:10:00 - The discussion continues about falsely accused people and how there is an inherent bias in our justice system. There is a book called “Three Felonies A Day” which in short, is about how every American on average commits well, three felonies a day. 1:25:00 - Some people are still in jail for marijuana crimes in states where marijuana is perfectly legal. This is just another example of how our justice system is overblown and how our country has a love relationship with locking people up. 1:31:20 - Free Solo was a great movie that make your palms sweat the entire time. Scott and Matt discuss other movies that make your palms sweat! 1:33:35 - Best and worst Star Trek movies. 1:40:00 - What is the worst movie that you love?

Are YOU excited about Succession? Hear the panel discuss it for several weeks in a row! Also featured: celebrity sightings, Star Wars discussion, acquiring car sickness, Cohen Brothers comedy, and power recliners. A SMALL DESCRIPTION OF EPISODES PULLED FROM: (Ep. 212) Pre-show. Brandon is buying Jump Force only because it's going to be delisted. Tim tells stories about his Kotaku videos, and knows the difference between Windows 10 Home and Windows 10 Professional. Frank sounds better. Helpful computer tips are shared. (Ep. 213) Pre-show. Tim reveals more details about his Minnesota mansion and dives into last night's Succession. Brandon can't imagine what would make him watch that show. The idea of a Succession bonus episode is discussed. (Ep. 213) Mid-show technical difficulty. Frank drops out, so Tim takes the opportunity to discuss his network storage setup, and last night's Succession. Jaffe talks about The Jar Jar Trilogy. Star Wars opinions are delivered. (Ep. 213) (Content warning: pretty gross car sickness story) Extended break. Tim has advice for young'uns, and has been going to the movie theater. Brandon shares a story about car sickness and another one about the soundtrack of O Brother Where Art Thou. Celebrity sightings are discussed and compared. (Ep. 214) Pre-show. A Starbucks unionized! Fuck Kellogs (UPDATE: strike has finished, congratulations to Kellogg's workers!!) Tim's goblin hole requires assistance, but he has power recliners so it's not all bad. Everything you've heard about New York apartment building pettiness is true. Jaffe tries making a Succession Friend.

Dang! What a wonderful conversation with Barbara Cohen (Farm Accident, Little Lizard, Brother Sun Sister Moon, etc). After honing her musical chops here in the Twin Cities, she's spent the last 20 years in LA composing film and TV scores. Now she's back. We talk about her amazing journey and what the future may hold. Give this one a listen, she's great!Support this podcast at — https://redcircle.com/brian-oake-show/donationsAdvertising Inquiries: https://redcircle.com/brandsPrivacy & Opt-Out: https://redcircle.com/privacy

In this episode of Parallel Fiction, Heather and Jeff try to look for that pot of gold and break down the meaning of Luck.  Whether it be from perseverance, or breaking a family curse, the two discuss stories where luck plays a big role in the protagonist's life. Jeff starts off the first presentation segment with the movie Logan Lucky starring Channing Tatum and Adam Driver.  Jeff takes us through the story of the Logan brothers, who are planning a heist despite lifelong bad luck.  Jeff emphasizes the stellar cast, with standout performances from Daniel Craig and Riley Keough.  Heather and Jeff's banter about the other cameo's in the cast make this film seem like a top contender for Jeff's rating. Fun Fact!  The standard "This movie is a work of fiction" disclaimer gets a little twist at the end: "Nobody was robbed during the making of this movie. Except you." Heather picks up the second segment of presentations with her review of classic novel The Joy Luck Club.  Heather takes us through the plot with some funny side bars with Jeff.  Despite the heavy nature of the novel, Heather makes the characters and many storylines easy to digest. Fun Fact! The film adaptation of The Joy Luck Club was the first Hollywood feature film with an all Asian Cast. Following these reviews, Heather and Jeff dive into commonalities between the two works such as divine luck, breaking an unlucky streak, contagious luck, feeling lucky, and luck meeting experience. Listen in to hear Jeff and Heather's candid thoughts on the masterpiece scenes of each story, how Logan Lucky and The Joy Luck Club compare, and how Jeff and Heather relate the two. Share this episode with everyone who can use a great story! Heather's rating for The Joy Luck Club:  Nice – A classic novel that may be a little too heavy to read quickly.  Very thought provoking. Jeff's rating for Logan Lucky: Super  Nice – A hidden gem of a movie with a stacked cast and the perfect type of dry humor that fans of Cohen Brother's movies will appreciate.  Definitely a must see from Jeff. Watch Logan Lucky here: https://www.amazon.com/Logan-Lucky-Farrah-Mackenzie/dp/B074SWRQ15 Read The Joy Luck Club here: https://www.amazon.com/Joy-Luck-Club-Novel/dp/0143038095 About Parallel Fiction:Parallel Fiction is the perfect supplemental companion to all of the stories you consume. We will be covering movies, television, books, graphic novels, video games, and music whenever it applies. Learn more about things you love, and get to know us a little bit better as we give you a peak into our lives and opinions. Connect with us:Email Jeff & Heather: Parallelfictionpod@gmail.comFollow us on Instagram: www.instagram.com/ParallelfictionFollow us on Twitter: www.twitter.com/ParallelfictionConnect with us on Facebook: www.facebook.com/Parallelfictionpod

Joined by another fantastic guest and man of constant sorrow, Joel Christensen, we trace the unbroken line from Homer to Mumford & Sons through the Cohen Brothers. Is this more or less of an Odyssey adaptation than its directors let on? What makes Odysseus Odysseus? How does myth meet a nostalgia for a certain visage of the American South? Is Clooney too charming to be the man of many ways? Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

It's our first installment of a 4200 part series "Skinny Mat Finds A Religion". We will interview every active religion and at the end of the series Mat will choose. In this episode we explore Dudeism, a religion based around the 90's  Cohen Brothers cult classic film, The Big Lebowski. We Interview his Archdudeship Dwayne Eutsey about all things Dudeist. Theme music and underscore was written and recorded by DJ Flandelicious with help from Rachel Delgado. Skinny Mat Finds a Religion Theme was composed by DJ Flandelicious, Lyrics by John Oliver Smith and Vocals by Katie Marie Jones.We'd like to thank his Archdudeship Wayne Eutsey for enlightening us on the Dudeist way. He's co written a book called the Abide Guide that's available on Amazon or on the website dudeism.com where you can be ordained as a Dudeist Priest.Find out more on our website www.smtinfoilhat.comSupport the show (https://www.patreon.com/skinnymatsbunkertapes)

Justin Dyck is a Canadian director who just released Anything for Jackson, now streaming on Shudder. Anything for Jackson is definitely one of my favorite horror films of the year - it really delivers the goods. It's scary, funny, emotionally poignant, and an extremely unique and different take on ghosts and demons. All in all, it's a hell of a time and I highly recommend it. Ironically enough, Justin made Anything for Jackson after making a large number of commercial family films in Canada, which despite the genre really paved the way for his technical abilities as a director. We talk more about Justin's backstory, the making of Anything for Jackson, and how he pulled off the movie's fantastic creature effects in today's episode of The Nick Taylor Horror Show. Now, without further ado here is Justin Dyck.  Here are some key takeaways from this conversation with Justin Dyck.  Tap into the economy of experience. This is a common theme among indie filmmakers but it bears repeating. One of the keys to achieving high production value on a low budget movie is to tap into people's yearning for experience. Justin was able to get a killer DP for Anything for Jackson for less than his usual fee because he wanted more diverse IMDB credits. This rule also can apply to actors; Justin cast a bunch of very experienced TV actors, whose experience on very big shows tended to get and boring while his indie horror movie offered them a fun and fresh experience so they signed on for substantially less than their usual fee. The movie also offered them an opportunity for more focused screen time which is important for actors as well. Doing this effectively all boils down to the experience you can provide to your cast and crew. If you can't pay a lot, you have to make it worth their while by going out of your way to make the experience valuable and enjoyable. So find resourceful ways for your movie to provide high-value people opportunities to learn, to do something different, get more exposure, or just to have fun.  There's humor in realism. There are a number of humorous moments in Anything for Jackson, and they were so natural that they seemed unintentional. The way Justin described the movie's funny moments was by comparing them to Cohen Brothers movies, where you have ordinary people in extraordinary circumstances which is really on display in Fargo. Observing how real, every-day people respond to crazy scenarios creates a juxtaposition that's naturally humorous. Justin also cited Blue Ruin as a prime example of this, which I highly recommend. So, if you're looking to raise the levity of your horror film by using humor, it can be as simple as adding a dose of realism by being truthful. This will let the laughs shine through in very natural but unexpected ways.  Don't turn down any opportunities. Justin entered the industry wanting to make horror movies but was instead, offered the opportunity to direct a family film. Instead of thumbing his nose at the opportunity, he took it because he knew that the experience would be valuable for him as a director. Justin did such a great job on that movie that he ended up being asked to direct multiple other family movies. Despite the fact that these were not necessarily the movies he wanted to be directing, making them became his day job, where he was able to learn countless lessons about working with actors, the pace of the set, camera equipment, and the technical sides of directing. He also built a killer network of crew members, producers, and actors. As far as day jobs go, this is a dream come true for any aspiring filmmaker, because when it came time to direct Anything for Jackson, Justin was able to draw from years of very hands-on experience and executed a great movie with very smooth production. This is a serious reason to consider saying yes to opportunities that are not exactly what you're looking for at the time because they can make you a better filmmaker.   Thanks for listening! Don't forget to subscribe, and follow the show on Instagram at @IMNickTaylor and on Twitter at the same handle.  ----- Produced by Simpler Media

This week Alrik and Liz welcome back previous 'Get Shorty' Filmmaker Felicia Pride on the show to talk about how she moved to LA at 35 and forged her filmmaking career through her own sheer will and hustle. Felicia talks about the steps she took in crucial points in her career, how she hit career milestones for herself and how she managed to sell a feature, land management and get staffed in a writers room all in the same year. This episode is a must listen if you feel like you missed your chance to have the career that you wanted because it really just shows that putting in the work and staying focused on your goals really pays off. We also have short filmmaker Parrish Stikeleather on the show to talk about his short film 'Long Drive to Yadkin' which we have deemed as a serious ode to the Cohen Brothers!