Podcasts about Sirna

Good morning from Pharma and Biotech Daily: the podcast that gives you only what's important to hear in Pharma and Biotech world. Metsera's new long-acting amylin injection, met-233i, has shown promising weight loss results over eight months, leading to a rise in shares. Meanwhile, CDC vaccine advisors are either being pushed out or leaving their positions. Other top stories include Sirna's expansion beyond the liver, Keros returning $375 million to investors, and ACIP members receiving termination notices. In vitro cell research is focused on slowing aging and preventing age-related diseases. Updates on Merck's oral PCSK9 inhibitor, Sanofi and Regeneron's Dupixent effectiveness, and Avidity's muscular dystrophy drug are also highlighted.The expansion of RNA therapeutics is discussed, with multiple companies aiming to target small interfering RNA to various organs by 2030. Uniqure's regulatory progress in developing a gene therapy for Huntington's disease has sparked optimism, although past disappointments for patients are noted. Perspective Therapeutics presents new data on neuroendocrine tumor treatment at ASCO25. Concerns about RFK Jr.'s vaccine campaign and its potential to increase distrust in vaccines are raised in the editorial. Cancer news, cell and gene therapy updates, upcoming events, job listings, and a call for reader suggestions on coverage topics are also covered.

Good morning from Pharma and Biotech daily: the podcast that gives you only what's important to hear in Pharma e Biotech world.At a recent U.S. Senate hearing, Health and Human Services Secretary was questioned about cuts being made to the department and his stance on endorsing the measles vaccine during a growing outbreak. The hearing was tense at times, with RFK Jr. firm on supporting the cuts but wavering on his stance on the MMR vaccine. AbbVie's ADC received accelerated approval for lung cancer treatment, FDA delays decision on Biohaven's application, and chaos ensues at the FDA's advisory committee planning office after workforce cuts. Sino Biological offers solutions for autoimmune disease research, with reagents for nearly 50 diseases. Novo Nordisk has invested $2.4 billion in a new oral obesity drug through a deal with Septerna, aiming to catch up with competitors in the oral weight loss space. AbbVie has committed $335 million upfront in a partnership with Adarx Pharmaceuticals for siRNA research, while GSK has abandoned a TIGIT therapy and instead acquired rights to a liver drug from Boston Pharmaceuticals for potential $2 billion deal. This news highlights the ongoing developments and investments in the pharmaceutical industry.

Ustadz Abdullah Amir Maretan - Kebaikan Itu Sirna

On this week's episode, Eric Schmidt, Brad Loncar, Yaron Werber, Paul Matteis, and Nina Kjellson discuss impact of tariffs on biopharma relative to other sectors, FDA updates and bright spots, data, and fundraising. The episode opens with a conversation on tariffs and the upheaval and shifts at the FDA, including the departure of Peter Marks, former director of the FDA's Center for Biologics Evaluation and Research, which has the group concerned over loss of institutional memory, history, and the ability to meet deadlines. The conversation shifts to the measles outbreak, noting concerns about public health and future regulation due to HHS reorganization plans and perceived industry inaction. The group then discusses data, including Vaxcyte's underwhelming Phase 2b data, and hopes to avoid negative vaccine sentiment. Additionally, Eli Lilly's Phase 2 data for its siRNA-based therapeutic to lower lipoprotein(a) showed promising results and Amgen and Novartis are conducting their own Phase 3 trials for Lp(a). The episode concludes with a discussion on Isomorphic Labs, which raised over $600 million, with the group praising the investment in early-stage discovery science and expressed hope that it will facilitate the company's transformation of technology into drugs. *This episode aired on April 4, 2025.

Dr. Janine Sengstack is the Chief Scientific Officer and co-founder of Junevity, a company created in 2023 with the mission of extending health span and lifespan through what they term "Cell Reset therapeutics." The company recently secured $10 million in seed funding.In this episode, Chris and Janine explore the innovative platform Janine developed during her PhD work in Hao Li's lab at UCSF, which now forms the foundation of Junevity's therapeutic approach. They discuss how the company uses computational and experimental methods to identify transcription factors that can "reset" cells from a diseased, aged state back to a healthy state while maintaining cell identity. Janine explains how Junevity is developing siRNA therapeutics targeting these transcription factors to treat age-related diseases, with a focus on metabolic conditions and other disorders that impact longevity.The Finer Details:The development of the Reset platform during Janine's PhD work and its evolution into Junevity's therapeutic approachHow transcription factors act as "managers" in cells, regulating many other genesUsing AI and machine learning to identify the right transcription factors to target based on disease and tissue-specific dataThe validation process for siRNA therapeutic candidates in cell and animal modelsJunevity's focus on diseases with large-scale transcriptional dysregulation, including type 2 diabetes, obesity, muscle wasting diseases, and osteoarthritisThe advantages of siRNA as a therapeutic modality for targeting traditionally "undruggable" transcription factorsJunevity's business strategy and timeline, with clinical trials potentially beginning in 2026Quotes:"We tackled this high risk, high reward PhD project: we were inspired by the Yamanaka factors to say, 'Okay, let's find brand new transcription factors that we can target to take cells from a diseased, old state and bring them back to a healthy state while keeping them the same cell type, never turning them into a stem cell.'""Transcription factors: I like to think of them as managers in the cell.""We think the advent of modern AI and machine learning tools to better analyze what they regulate, plus siRNA as a really well-proven therapeutic modality, really unlocks the ability to target transcription factors and really make powerful therapeutics with them.""We're thinking about using transcriptional regulation as a way to come up with novel therapeutics to treat diseases that have a big impact on people's health span and lifespan.""We want to advance our programs towards development candidates, which basically means the drug entity, and move them forward towards clinical development as fast as possible.""I would love if we had multiple siRNA drugs on the market, ideally, or in late stages of development for a wide range of longevity-related diseases... We think that there's really huge potential here for making a big impact on a lot of different really complicated diseases."Linkshttps://www.junevity.com

This interview with JACC: Associate Editor Neha J. Pagidipati, MD, FACC, and author Kausik Ray, MD, FACC, reviews Dr. Ray's phase one study on solbinsiran, an siRNA therapy targeting ANGPTL3 to reduce triglycerides and cardiovascular risk. Dr. Ray explains the study's findings, including significant reductions in triglycerides, ApoB, and LDL, with a favorable safety profile. The conversation also touches on the broader landscape of ANGPTL3 inhibitors, the implications of HDL reduction, and the anticipation of phase two results to be presented at ACC 2025.

To kick off Women's History Month, host Robert Nieminen sits down with Kellie K. Sirna, founder of Studio 11 Design, to explore her journey from launching a boutique design firm to leading one of Dallas' most sought-after hospitality design teams. In this episode of I Hear Design, Kellie shares insights on managing a multi-generational workforce, the evolving demands of hospitality design post-pandemic, and the firm's innovative approach to sustainability and wellness. She also offers valuable advice for aspiring designers looking to carve out a niche in the commercial interiors space. Whether you're a design enthusiast or a seasoned professional, you won't want to miss this conversation packed with inspiration and practical advice.

Funding for the NIH and US biomedical research is imperiled at a momentous time of progress. Exemplifying this is the work of Dr. Anna Greka, a leading physician-scientist at the Broad Institute who is devoted to unlocking the mysteries of rare diseases— that cumulatively affect 30 million Americans— and finding cures, science supported by the NIH.A clip from our conversationThe audio is available on iTunes and Spotify. The full video is linked here, at the top, and also can be found on YouTube.Transcript with audio and external linksEric Topol (00:06):Well, hello. This is Eric Topol from Ground Truths, and I am really delighted to welcome today, Anna Greka. Anna is the president of the American Society for Clinical Investigation (ASCI) this year, a very prestigious organization, but she's also at Mass General Brigham, a nephrologist, a cell biologist, a physician-scientist, a Core Institute Member of the Broad Institute of MIT and Harvard, and serves as a member of the institute's Executive Leadership Team. So we got a lot to talk about of all these different things you do. You must be pretty darn unique, Anna, because I don't know any cell biologists, nephrologists, physician-scientist like you.Anna Greka (00:48):Oh, thank you. It's a great honor to be here and glad to chat with you, Eric.Eric Topol (00:54):Yeah. Well, I had the real pleasure to hear you speak at a November conference, the AI for Science Forum, which we'll link to your panel. Where I was in a different panel, but you spoke about your extraordinary work and it became clear that we need to get you on Ground Truths, so you can tell your story to everybody. So I thought rather than kind of going back from the past where you were in Greece and somehow migrated to Boston and all that. We're going to get to that, but you gave an amazing TED Talk and it really encapsulated one of the many phenomenal stories of your work as a molecular sleuth. So maybe if you could give us a synopsis, and of course we'll link to that so people could watch the whole talk. But I think that Mucin-1 or MUC1, as you call it, discovery is really important to kind of ground our discussion.A Mysterious Kidney Disease Unraveled Anna Greka (01:59):Oh, absolutely. Yeah, it's an interesting story. In some ways, in my TED Talk, I highlight one of the important families of this story, a family from Utah, but there's also other important families that are also part of the story. And this is also what I spoke about in London when we were together, and this is really sort of a medical mystery that initially started on the Mediterranean island of Cyprus, where it was found that there were many families in which in every generation, several members suffered and ultimately died from what at the time was a mysterious kidney disease. This was more than 30 years ago, and it was clear that there was something genetic going on, but it was impossible to identify the gene. And then even with the advent of Next-Gen sequencing, this is what's so interesting about this story, it was still hard to find the gene, which is a little surprising.Anna Greka (02:51):After we were able to sequence families and identify monogenic mutations pretty readily, this was still very resistant. And then it actually took the firepower of the Broad Institute, and it's actually from a scientific perspective, an interesting story because they had to dust off the old-fashioned Sanger sequencing in order to get this done. But they were ultimately able to identify this mutation in a VNTR region of the MUC1 gene. The Mucin-1 gene, which I call a dark corner of the human genome, it was really, it's highly repetitive, very GC-rich. So it becomes very difficult to sequence through there with Next-Gen sequencing. And so, ultimately the mutation of course was found and it's a single cytosine insertion in a stretch of cytosines that sort of causes this frameshift mutation and an early stop codon that essentially results in a neoprotein like a toxic, what I call a mangled protein that sort of accumulates inside the kidney cells.Anna Greka (03:55):And that's where my sort of adventure began. It was Eric Lander's group, who is the founding director of the Broad who discovered the mutation. And then through a conversation we had here in Boston, we sort of discovered that there was an opportunity to collaborate and so that's how I came to the Broad, and that's the beginnings of this story. I think what's fascinating about this story though, that starts in a remote Mediterranean island and then turns out to be a disease that you can find in every continent all over the world. There are probably millions of patients with kidney disease in whom we haven't recognized the existence of this mutation. What's really interesting about it though is that what we discovered is that the mangled protein that's a result of this misspelling of this mutation is ultimately captured by a family of cargo receptors, they're called the TMED cargo receptors and they end up sort of grabbing these misfolded proteins and holding onto them so tight that it's impossible for the cell to get rid of them.Anna Greka (04:55):And they become this growing heap of molecular trash, if you will, that becomes really hard to manage, and the cells ultimately die. So in the process of doing this molecular sleuthing, as I call it, we actually also identified a small molecule that actually disrupts these cargo receptors. And as I described in my TED Talk, it's a little bit like having these cargo trucks that ultimately need to go into the lysosome, the cells recycling facility. And this is exactly what this small molecule can do. And so, it was just like a remarkable story of discovery. And then I think the most exciting of all is that these cargo receptors turn out to be not only relevant to this one mangled misshapen protein, but they actually handle a completely different misshapen protein caused by a different genetic mutation in the eye, causing retinitis pigmentosa, a form of blindness, familial blindness. We're now studying familial Alzheimer's disease that's also involving these cargo receptors, and there are other mangled misshapen proteins in the liver, in the lung that we're now studying. So this becomes what I call a node, like a nodal mechanism that can be targeted for the benefit of many more patients than we had previously thought possible, which has been I think, the most satisfying part about this story of molecular sleuthing.Eric Topol (06:20):Yeah, and it's pretty extraordinary. We'll put the figure from your classic Cell paper in 2019, where you have a small molecule that targets the cargo receptor called TMED9.Anna Greka (06:34):Correct.Expanding the MissionEric Topol (06:34):And what's amazing about this, of course, is the potential to reverse this toxic protein disease. And as you say, it may have applicability well beyond this MUC1 kidney story, but rather eye disease with retinitis pigmentosa and the familial Alzheimer's and who knows what else. And what's also fascinating about this is how, as you said, there were these limited number of families with the kidney disease and then you found another one, uromodulin. So there's now, as you say, thousands of families, and that gets me to part of your sleuth work is not just hardcore science. You started an entity called the Ladders to Cures (L2C) Scientific Accelerator.Eric Topol (07:27):Maybe you can tell us about that because this is really pulling together all the forces, which includes the patient advocacy groups, and how are we going to move forward like this?Anna Greka (07:39):Absolutely. I think the goal of the Ladders to Cures Accelerator, which is a new initiative that we started at the Broad, but it really encompasses many colleagues across Boston. And now increasingly it's becoming sort of a national, we even have some international collaborations, and it's only two years that it's been in existence, so we're certainly in a growth mode. But the inspiration was really some of this molecular sleuthing work where I basically thought, well, for starters, it cannot be that there's only one molecular node, these TMED cargo receptors that we discovered there's got to be more, right? And so, there's a need to systematically go and find more nodes because obviously as anyone who works in rare genetic diseases will tell you, the problem for all of us is that we do what I call hand to hand combat. We start with the disease with one mutation, and we try to uncover the mechanism and then try to develop therapies, and that's wonderful.Anna Greka (08:33):But of course, it's slow, right? And if we consider the fact that there are 30 million patients in the United States in every state, everywhere in the country who suffer from a rare genetic disease, most of them, more than half of them are children, then we can appreciate the magnitude of the problem. Out of more than 8,000 genes that are involved in rare genetic diseases, we barely have something that looks like a therapy for maybe 500 of them. So there's a huge mismatch in the unmet need and magnitude of the problem. So the Ladders to Cures Accelerator is here to address this and to do this with the most modern tools available. And to your point, Eric, to bring patients along, not just as the recipients of whatever we discover, but also as partners in the research enterprise because it's really important to bring their perspectives and of course their partnerships in things like developing appropriate biomarkers, for example, for what we do down the road.Anna Greka (09:35):But from a fundamental scientific perspective, this is basically a project that aims to identify every opportunity for nodes, underlying all rare genetic diseases as quickly as possible. And this was one of the reasons I was there at the AI for Science Forum, because of course when one undertakes a project in which you're basically, this is what we're trying to do in the Ladders to Cures Accelerator, introduce dozens of thousands of missense and nonsense human mutations that cause genetic diseases, simultaneously introduce them into multiple human cells and then use modern scalable technology tools. Things like CRISPR screens, massively parallel CRISPR screens to try to interrogate all of these diseases in parallel, identify the nodes, and then develop of course therapeutic programs based on the discovery of these nodes. This is a massive data generation project that is much needed and in addition to the fact that it will help hopefully accelerate our approach to all rare diseases, genetic diseases. It is also a highly controlled cell perturbation dataset that will require the most modern tools in AI, not only to extract the data and understand the data of this dataset, but also because this, again, an extremely controlled, well controlled cell perturbation dataset can be used to train models, train AI models, so that in the future, and I hope this doesn't sound too futuristic, but I think that we're all aiming for that cell biologists for sure dream of this moment, I think when we can actually have in silico the opportunity to make predictions about what cell behaviors are going to look like based on a new perturbation that was not in the training set. So an experiment that hasn't yet been done on a cell, a perturbation that has not been made on a human cell, what if like a new drug, for example, or a new kind of perturbation, a new chemical perturbation, how would it affect the behavior of the cell? Can we make a predictive model for that? This doesn't exist today, but I think this is something, the cell prediction model is a big question for biology for the future. And so, I'm very energized by the opportunity to both address this problem of rare monogenic diseases that remains an unmet need and help as many patients as possible while at the same time advancing biology as much as we possibly can. So it's kind of like a win-win lifting all boats type of enterprise, hopefully.Eric Topol (12:11):Yeah. Well, there's many things to get to unpack what you've just been reviewing. So one thing for sure is that of these 8,000 monogenic diseases, they have relevance to the polygenic common diseases, of course. And then also the fact that the patient family advocates, they are great at scouring the world internet, finding more people, bringing together communities for each of these, as you point out aptly, these rare diseases cumulatively are high, very high proportion, 10% of Americans or more. So they're not so rare when you think about the overall.Anna Greka (12:52):Collectively.Help From the Virtual Cell?Eric Topol (12:53):Yeah. Now, and of course is this toxic proteinopathies, there's at least 50 of these and the point that people have been thinking until now that, oh, we found a mangled protein, but what you've zeroed in on is that, hey, you know what, it's not just a mangled protein, it's how it gets stuck in the cell and that it can't get to the lysosome to get rid of it, there's no waste system. And so, this is such fundamental work. Now that gets me to the virtual cell story, kind of what you're getting into. I just had a conversation with Charlotte Bunne and Steve Quake who published a paper in December on the virtual cell, and of course that's many years off, but of course it's a big, bold, ambitious project to be able to say, as you just summarized, if you had cells in silico and you could do perturbations in silico, and of course they were validated by actual experiments or bidirectionally the experiments, the real ones helped to validate the virtual cell, but then you could get a true acceleration of your understanding of cell biology, your field of course.Anna Greka (14:09):Exactly.Eric Topol (14:12):So what you described, is it the same as a virtual cell? Is it kind of a precursor to it? How do you conceive this because this is such a complex, I mean it's a fundamental unit of life, but it's also so much more complex than a protein or an RNA because not only all the things inside the cell, inside all these organelles and nucleus, but then there's all the outside interactions. So this is a bold challenge, right?Anna Greka (14:41):Oh my god, it's absolutely from a biologist perspective, it's the challenge of a generation for sure. We think taking humans to Mars, I mean that's an aspirational sort of big ambitious goal. I think this is the, if you will, the Mars shot for biology, being able to, whether the terminology, whether you call it a virtual cell. I like the idea of saying that to state it as a problem, the way that people who think about it from a mathematics perspective for example, would think about it. I think stating it as the cell prediction problem appeals to me because it actually forces us biologists to think about setting up the way that we would do these cell perturbation data sets, the way we would generate them to set them up to serve predictions. So for example, the way that I would think about this would be can I in the future have so much information about how cell perturbations work that I can train a model so that it can predict when I show it a picture of another cell under different conditions that it hasn't seen before, that it can still tell me, ah, this is a neuron in which you perturbed the mitochondria, for example, and now this is sort of the outcome that you would expect to see.Anna Greka (16:08):And so, to be able to have this ability to have a model that can have the ability to predict in silico what cells would look like after perturbation, I think that's sort of the way that I think about this problem. It is very far away from anything that exists today. But I think that the beginning starts, and this is one of the unique things about my institute, if I can say, we have a place where cell biologists, geneticists, mathematicians, machine learning experts, we all come together in the same place to really think and grapple with these problems. And of course we're very outward facing, interacting with scientists all across the world as well. But there's this sort of idea of bringing people into one institute where we can just think creatively about these big aspirational problems that we want to solve. I think this is one of the unique things about the ecosystem at the Broad Institute, which I'm proud to be a part of, and it is this kind of out of the box thinking that will hopefully get us to generate the kinds of data sets that will serve the needs of building these kinds of models with predictive capabilities down the road.Anna Greka (17:19):But as you astutely said, AlphaFold of course was based on the protein database existing, right? And that was a wealth of available information in which one could train models that would ultimately be predictive, as we have seen this miracle that Demi Hassabis and John Jumper have given to humanity, if you will.Anna Greka (17:42):But as Demis and John would also say, I believe is as I have discussed with them, in fact, the cell prediction problem is really a bigger problem because we do not have a protein data bank to go to right now, but we need to create it to generate these data. And so, my Ladders to Cures Accelerator is here to basically provide some part of the answer to that problem, create this kind of well-controlled database that we need for cell perturbations, while at the same time maximizing our learnings about these fully penetrant coding mutations and what their downstream sequelae would be in many different human cells. And so, in this way, I think we can both advance our knowledge about these monogenic diseases, build models, hopefully with predictive capabilities. And to your point, a lot of what we will learn about this biology, if we think that it involves 8,000 or more out of the 20,000 genes in our genome, it will of course serve our understanding of polygenic diseases ultimately as well as we go deeper into this biology and we look at the combinatorial aspects of what different mutations do to human cells. And so, it's a huge aspirational problem for a whole generation, but it's a good one to work on, I would say.Learning the Language of Life with A.I. Eric Topol (19:01):Oh, absolutely. Now I think you already mentioned something that's quite, well, two things from what you just touched on. One of course, how vital it is to have this inner or transdisciplinary capability because you do need expertise across these vital areas. But the convergence, I mean, I love your term nodal biology and the fact that there's all these diseases like you were talking about, they do converge and nodal is a good term to highlight that, but it's not. Of course, as you mentioned, we have genome editing which allows to look at lots of different genome perturbations, like the single letter change that you found in MUC1 pathogenic critical mutation. There's also the AI world which is blossoming like I've never seen. In fact, I had in Science this week about learning the language of life with AI and how there's been like 15 new foundation models, DNA, proteins, RNA, ligands, all their interactions and the beginning of the cell story too with the human cell.Eric Topol (20:14):So this is exploding. As you said, the expertise in computer science and then this whole idea that you could take these powerful tools and do as you said, which is the need to accelerate, we just can't sit around here when there's so much discovery work to be done with the scalability, even though it might take years to get to this artificial intelligence virtual cell, which I have to agree, everyone in biology would say that's the holy grail. And as you remember at our conference in London, Demi Hassabis said that's what we'd like to do now. So it has the attention of leaders in AI around the world, obviously in the science and the biomedical community like you and many others. So it is an extraordinary time where we just can't sit still with these tools that we have, right?Anna Greka (21:15):Absolutely. And I think this is going to be, you mentioned the ASCI presidency in the beginning of our call. This is going to be the president gets to give an address at the annual meeting in Chicago. This is going to be one of the points I make, no matter what field in biomedicine we're in, we live in, I believe, a golden era and we have so many tools available to us that we can really accelerate our ability to help more patients. And of course, this is our mandate, the most important stakeholders for everything that we do as physician-scientists are our patients ultimately. So I feel very hopeful for the future and our ability to use these tools and to really make good on the promise of research is a public good. And I really hope that we can advance our knowledge for the benefit of all. And this is really an exciting time, I think, to be in this field and hopefully for the younger colleagues a time to really get excited about getting in there and getting involved and asking the big questions.Career ReflectionsEric Topol (22:21):Well, you are the prototype for this and an inspiration to everyone really, I'm sure to your lab group, which you highlighted in the TED Talk and many other things that you do. Now I want to spend a little bit of time about your career. I think it's fascinating that you grew up in Greece and your father's a nephrologist and your mother's a pathologist. So you had two physicians to model, but I guess you decided to go after nephrology, which is an area in medicine that I kind of liken it to Rodney Dangerfield, he doesn't get any respect. You don't see many people that go into nephrology. But before we get to your decision to do that somehow or other you came from Greece to Harvard for your undergrad. How did you make that connect to start your college education? And then subsequently you of course you stayed in Boston, you've never left Boston, I think.Anna Greka (23:24):I never left. Yeah, this is coming into 31 years now in Boston.Anna Greka (23:29):Yeah, I started as a Harvard undergraduate and I'm now a full professor. It's kind of a long, but wonderful road. Well, actually I would credit my parents. You mentioned that my father, they're both physician-scientists. My father is now both retired, but my father is a nephrologist, and my mother is a pathologist, actually, they were both academics. And so, when we were very young, we lived in England when my parents were doing postdoctoral work. That was actually a wonderful gift that they gave me because I became bilingual. It was a very young age, and so that allowed me to have this advantage of being fluent in English. And then when we moved back to Greece where I grew up, I went to an American school. And from that time, this is actually an interesting story in itself. I'm very proud of this school.Anna Greka (24:22):It's called Anatolia, and it was founded by American missionaries from Williams College a long time ago, 150 and more years ago. But it is in Thessaloniki, Greece, which is my hometown, and it's a wonderful institution, which gave me a lot of gifts as well, preparing me for coming to college in the United States. And of course, I was a good student in high school, but what really was catalytic was that I was lucky enough to get a scholarship to go to Harvard. And that was really, you could say the catalyst that propelled me from a teenager who was dreaming about a career as a physician-scientist because I certainly was for as far back as I remember in fact. But then to make that a reality, I found myself on the Harvard campus initially for college, and then I was in the combined Harvard-MIT program for my MD PhD. And then I trained in Boston at Mass General in Brigham, and then sort of started my academic career. And that sort of brings us to today, but it is an unlikely story and one that I feel still very lucky and blessed to have had these opportunities. So for sure, it's been wonderful.Eric Topol (25:35):We're the ones lucky that you came here and set up shop and you did your productivity and discovery work and sleuthing has been incredible. But I do think it's interesting too, because when you did your PhD, it was in neuroscience.Anna Greka (25:52):Ah, yes. That's another.Eric Topol (25:54):And then you switch gears. So tell us about that?Anna Greka (25:57):This is interesting, and actually I encourage more colleagues to think about it this way. So I have always been driven by the science, and I think that it seems a little backward to some people, but I did my PhD in neuroscience because I was interested in understanding something about these ion channels that were newly discovered at the time, and they were most highly expressed in the brain. So here I was doing work in the brain in the neuroscience program at Harvard, but then once I completed my PhD and I was in the middle of my residency training actually at Mass General, I distinctly remember that there was a paper that came out that implicated the same family of ion channels that I had spent my time understanding in the brain. It turned out to be a channelopathy that causes kidney disease.Anna Greka (26:43):So that was the light bulb, and it made me realize that maybe what I really wanted to do is just follow this thread. And my scientific curiosity basically led me into studying the kidney and then it seemed practical therefore to get done with my clinical training as efficiently as possible. So I finished residency, I did nephrology training, and then there I was in the lab trying to understand the biology around this channelopathy. And that sort of led us into the early projects in my young lab. And in fact, it's interesting we didn't talk about that work, but that work in itself actually has made it all the way to phase II trials in patients. This was a paper we published in Science in 2017 and follow onto that work, there was an opportunity to build this into a real drug targeting one of these ion channels that has made it into phase II trials. And we'll see what happens next. But it's this idea of following your scientific curiosity, which I also talked about in my TED Talk, because you don't know to what wonderful places it will lead you. And quite interestingly now my lab is back into studying familial Alzheimer's and retinitis pigmentosa in the eye in brain. So I tell people, do not limit yourself to whatever someone says your field is or should be. Just follow your scientific curiosity and usually that takes you to a lot more interesting places. And so, that's certainly been a theme from my career, I would say.Eric Topol (28:14):No, I think that's perfect. Curiosity driven science is not the term. You often hear hypothesis driven or now with AI you hear more AI exploratory science. But no, that's great. Now I want to get a little back to the AI story because it's so fascinating. You use lots of different types of AI such as cellular imaging would be fusion models and drug discovery. I mean, you've had drug discovery for different pathways. You mentioned of course the ion channel and then also as we touched on with your Cell paper, the whole idea of targeting the cargo receptor with a small molecule and then things in between. You discussed this of course at the London panel, but maybe you just give us the skinny on the different ways that you incorporate AI in the state-of-the-art science that you're doing?Anna Greka (29:17):Sure, yeah, thank you. I think there are many ways in which even for quite a long time before AI became such a well-known kind of household term, if you will, the concept of machine learning in terms of image processing is something that has been around for some time. And so, this is actually a form of AI that we use in order to process millions of images. My lab has by produced probably more than 20 million images over the last few years, maybe five to six years. And so, if you can imagine it's impossible for any human to process this many images and make sense of them. So of course, we've been using machine learning that is becoming increasingly more and more sophisticated and advanced in terms of being able to do analysis of images, which is a lot of what we cell biologists do, of course.Anna Greka (30:06):And so, there's multiple different kinds of perturbations that we do to cells, whether we're using CRISPR or base editing to make, for example, genome wide or genome scale perturbations or small molecules as we have done as well in the past. These are all ways in which we are then using machine learning to read out the effects in images of cells that we're looking at. So that's one way in which machine learning is used in our daily work, of course, because we study misshape and mangled proteins and how they are recognized by these cargo receptors. We also use AlphaFold pretty much every day in my lab. And this has been catalytic for us as a tool because we really are able to accelerate our discoveries in ways that were even just three or four years ago, completely impossible. So it's been incredible to see how the young people in my lab are just so excited to use these tools and they're becoming extremely savvy in using these tools.Anna Greka (31:06):Of course, this is a new generation of scientists, and so we use AlphaFold all the time. And this also has a lot of implications of course for some of the interventions that we might think about. So where in this cargo receptor complex that we study for example, might we be able to fit a drug that would disrupt the complex and lead the cargo tracks into the lysosome for degradation, for example. So there's many ways in which AI can be used for all of these functions. So I would say that if we were to organize our thinking around it, one way to think about the use of machine learning AI is around what I would call understanding biology in cells and what in sort of more kind of drug discovery terms you would call target identification, trying to understand the things that we might want to intervene on in order to have a benefit for disease.Anna Greka (31:59):So target ID is one area in which I think machine learning and AI will have a catalytic effect as they already are. The other of course, is in the actual development of the appropriate drugs in a rational way. So rational drug design is incredibly enabled by AlphaFold and all these advances in terms of understanding protein structures and how to fit drugs into them of all different modalities and kinds. And I think an area that we are not yet harnessing in my group, but I think the Ladders to Cures Accelerator hopes to build on is really patient data. I think that there's a lot of opportunity for AI to be used to make sense of medical records for example and how we extract information that would tell us that this cohort of patients is a better cohort to enroll in your trial versus another. There are many ways in which we can make use of these tools. Not all of them are there yet, but I think it's an exciting time for being involved in this kind of work.Eric Topol (32:58):Oh, no question. Now it must be tough when you know the mechanism of these families disease and you even have a drug candidate, but that it takes so long to go from that to helping these families. And what are your thoughts about that, I mean, are you thinking also about genome editing for some of these diseases or are you thinking to go through the route of here's a small molecule, here's the tox data in animal models and here's phase I and on and on. Where do you think because when you know so much and then these people are suffering, how do you bridge that gap?Anna Greka (33:39):Yeah, I think that's an excellent question. Of course, having patients as our partners in our research is incredible as a way for us to understand the disease, to build biomarkers, but it is also exactly creating this kind of emotional conflict, if you will, because of course, to me, honesty is the best policy, if you will. And so, I'm always very honest with patients and their families. I welcome them to the lab so they can see just how long it takes to get some of these things done. Even today with all the tools that we have, of course there are certain things that are still quite slow to do. And even if you have a perfect drug that looks like it fits into the right pocket, there may still be some toxicity, there may be other setbacks. And so, I try to be very honest with patients about the road that we're on. The small molecule path for the toxic proteinopathies is on its way now.Anna Greka (34:34):It's partnered with a pharmaceutical company, so it's on its way hopefully to patients. Of course, again, this is an unpredictable road. Things can happen as you very well know, but I'm at least glad that it's sort of making its way there. But to your point, and I'm in an institute where CRISPR was discovered, and base editing and prime editing were discovered by my colleagues here. So we are in fact looking at every other modality that could help with these diseases. We have several hurdles to overcome because in contrast to the liver and the brain, the kidney for example, is not an organ in which you can easily deliver nucleic acid therapies, but we're making progress. I have a whole subgroup within the bigger group who's focusing on this. It's actually organized in a way where they're running kind of independently from the cell biology group that I run.Anna Greka (35:31):And it's headed by a person who came from industry so that she has the opportunity to really drive the project the way that it would be run milestone driven, if you will, in a way that it would be run as a therapeutics program. And we're really trying to go after all kinds of different nucleic acid therapies that would target the mutations themselves rather than the cargo receptors. And so, there's ASO and siRNA technologies and then also actual gene editing technologies that we are investigating. But I would say that some of them are closer than others. And again, to your question about patients, I tell them honestly when a project looks to be more promising, and I also tell them when a project looks to have hurdles and that it will take long and that sometimes I just don't know how long it will take before we can get there. The only thing that I can promise patients in any of our projects, whether it's Alzheimer's, blindness, kidney disease, all I can promise is that we're working the hardest we possibly can on the problem.Anna Greka (36:34):And I think that is often reassuring I have found to patients, and it's best to be honest about the fact that these things take a long time, but I do think that they find it reassuring that someone is on it essentially, and that there will be some progress as we move forward. And we've made progress in the very first discovery that came out of my lab. As I mentioned to you, we've made it all the way to phase II trials. So I have seen the trajectory be realized, and I'm eager to make it happen again and again as many times as I can within my career to help as many people as possible.The Paucity of Physician-ScientistsEric Topol (37:13):I have no doubts that you'll be doing this many times in your career. No, there's no question about it. It's extraordinary actually. There's a couple of things there I want to pick up on. Physician-scientists, as you know, are a rarefied species. And you have actually so nicely told the story about when you have a physician-scientist, you're caring for the patients that you're researching, which is, most of the time we have scientists. Nothing wrong with them of course, but you have this hinge point, which is really important because you're really hearing the stories and experiencing the patients and as you say, communicating about the likelihood of being able to come up with a treatment or the progress. What are we going to do to get more physician-scientists? Because this is a huge problem, it has been for decades, but the numbers just keep going lower and lower.Anna Greka (38:15):I think you're absolutely right. And this is again, something that in my leadership of the ASCI I have made sort of a cornerstone of our efforts. I think that it has been well-documented as a problem. I think that the pressures of modern clinical care are really antithetical to the needs of research, protected time to really be able to think and be creative and even have the funding available to be able to pursue one's program. I think those pressures are becoming so heavy for investigators that many of them kind of choose one or the other route most often the clinical route because that tends to be, of course where they can support their families better. And so, this has been kind of the conundrum in some ways that we take our best and brightest medical students who are interested in investigation, we train them and invest in them in becoming physician-scientists, but then we sort of drop them at the most vulnerable time, which is usually after one completes their clinical and scientific training.Anna Greka (39:24):And they're embarking on early phases of one's careers. It has been found to be a very vulnerable point when a lot of people are now in their mid-thirties or even late thirties perhaps with some family to take care of other burdens of adulthood, if you will. And I think what it becomes very difficult to sustain a career where one salary is very limited due to the research component. And so, I think we have to invest in our youngest people, and it is a real issue that there's no good mechanism to do that at the present time. So I was actually really hoping that there would be an opportunity with leadership at the NIH to really think about this. It's also been discussed at the level of the National Academy of Medicine where I had some role in discussing the recent report that they put out on the biomedical enterprise in the United States. And it's kind of interesting to see that there is a note made there about this issue and the fact that there needs to be, I think, more generous investment in the careers of a few select physician-scientists that we can support. So if you look at the numbers, currently out of the entire physician workforce, a physician-scientist comprised of less than 1%.Anna Greka (40:45):It's probably closer to 0.8% at this point.Eric Topol (40:46):No, it's incredible.Anna Greka (40:48):So that's really not enough, I think, to maintain the enterprise and if you will, this incredible innovation economy that the United States has had this miracle engine, if you will, in biomedicine that has been fueled in large part by physician investigators. Of course, our colleagues who are non-physician investigators are equally important partners in this journey. But we do need a few of the physician-scientists investigators I think as well, if you really think about the fact that I think 70% of people who run R&D programs in all the big pharmaceutical companies are physician-scientists. And so, we need people like us to be able to work on these big problems. And so, more investment, I think that the government, the NIH has a role to play there of course. And this is important from both an economic perspective, a competition perspective with other nations around the world who are actually heavily investing in the physician-scientist workforce.Anna Greka (41:51):And I think it's also important to do so through our smaller scale efforts at the ASCI. So one of the things that I have been involved in as a council member and now as president is the creation of an awards program for those early career investigators. So we call them the Emerging-Generation Awards, and we also have the Young Physician-Scientist Awards. And these are really to recognize people who are making that transition from being kind of a trainee and a postdoc and have finished their clinical training into becoming an independent assistant professor. And so, those are small awards, but they're kind of a symbolic tap on the shoulder, if you will, that the ASCI sees you, you're talented, stay the course. We want you to become a future member. Don't give up and please keep on fighting. I think that can take us only so far.Anna Greka (42:45):I mean, unless there's a real investment, of course still it will be hard to maintain people in the pipeline. But this is just one way in which we have tried to, these programs that the ASCI offers have been very successful over the last few years. We create a cohort of investigators who are clearly recognized by members of the ASCI is being promising young colleagues. And we give them longitudinal training as part of a cohort where they learn about how to write a grant, how to write a paper, leadership skills, how to run a lab. And they're sort of like a buddy system as well. So they know that they're in it together rather than feeling isolated and struggling to get their careers going. And so, we've seen a lot of success. One way that we measure that is conversion into an ASCI membership. And so, we're encouraged by that, and we hope that the program can continue. And of course, as president, I'm going to be fundraising for that as well, it's part of the role. But it is a really worthy cause because to your point, we have to somehow make sure that our younger colleagues stay the course that we can at least maintain, if not bolster our numbers within the scientific workforce.Eric Topol (43:57):Well, you outlined some really nice strategies and plans. It's a formidable challenge, of course. And we'd like to see billions of dollars to support this. And maybe someday we will because as you say, if we could relieve the financial concerns of people who have curiosity driven ideas.Anna Greka (44:18):Exactly.Eric Topol (44:19):We could do a lot to replenish and build a big physician-scientist workforce. Now, the last thing I want to get to, is you have great communication skills. Obviously, anybody who is listening or watching this.Eric Topol (44:36):Which is another really important part of being a scientist, no less a physician or the hybrid of the two. But I wanted to just go to the backstory because your TED Talk, which has been watched by hundreds of thousands of people, and I'm sure there's hundreds of thousands more that will watch it, but the TED organization is famous for making people come to the place a week ahead. This is Vancouver used to be in LA or Los Angeles area and making them rehearse the talk, rehearse, rehearse, rehearse, which seems crazy. You could train the people there, how to give a talk. Did you have to go through that?Anna Greka (45:21):Not really. I did rehearse once on stage before I actually delivered the talk live. And I was very encouraged by the fact that the TED folks who are of course very well calibrated, said just like that. It's great, just like that.Eric Topol (45:37):That says a lot because a lot of people that do these talks, they have to do it 10 times. So that kind of was another metric. But what I don't like about that is it just because these people almost have to memorize their talks from giving it so much and all this coaching, it comes across kind of stilted and unnatural, and you're just a natural great communicator added to all your other things.Anna Greka (46:03):I think it's interesting. Actually, I would say, if I may, that I credit, of course, I actually think that it's important, for us physician-scientists, again, science and research is a public good, and being able to communicate to the public what it is that we do, I think is kind of an obligation for the fact that we are funded by the public to do this kind of work. And so, I think that's important. And I always wanted to cultivate those communication skills for the benefit of communicating simply and clearly what it is that we do in our labs. But also, I would say as part of my story, I mentioned that I had the opportunity to attend a special school growing up in Greece, Anatolia, which was an American school. One of the interesting things about that is that there was an oratory competition.Anna Greka (46:50):I got very early exposure entering that competition. And if you won the first prize, it was in the kind of ancient Rome way, first among equals, right? And so, that was the prize. And I was lucky to have this early exposure. This is when I was 14, 15, 16 years old, that I was training to give these oratory speeches in front of an audience and sort of compete with other kids who were doing the same. I think these are just wonderful gifts that a school can give a student that have stayed with me for life. And I think that that's a wonderful, yeah, I credit that experience for a lot of my subsequent capabilities in this area.Eric Topol (47:40):Oh, that's fantastic. Well, this has been such an enjoyable conversation, Anna. Did I miss anything that we need to bring up, or do you think we have it covered?Anna Greka (47:50):Not at all. No, this was wonderful, and I thoroughly enjoyed it as well. I'm very honored seeing how many other incredible colleagues you've had on the show. It's just a great honor to be a part of this. So thank you for having me.Eric Topol (48:05):Well, you really are such a great inspiration to all of us in the biomedical community, and we'll be cheering for your continued success and thanks so much for joining today, and I look forward to the next time we get a chance to visit.Anna Greka (48:20):Absolutely. Thank you, Eric.**************************************Thanks for listening, watching or reading Ground Truths. Your subscription is greatly appreciated.If you found this podcast interesting please share it!That makes the work involved in putting these together especially worthwhile.All content on Ground Truths—newsletters, analyses, and podcasts—is free, open-access.Paid subscriptions are voluntary and all proceeds from them go to support Scripps Research. They do allow for posting comments and questions, which I do my best to respond to. Many thanks to those who have contributed—they have greatly helped fund our summer internship programs for the past two years. And such support is becoming more vital In light of current changes of funding and support for biomedical research at NIH and other US governmental agencies.Thanks to my producer Jessica Nguyen and to Sinjun Balabanoff for audio and video support at Scripps Research. Get full access to Ground Truths at erictopol.substack.com/subscribe

Mentorship is so valuable, especially in hospitality. Today Dan interviews Kellie Sirna, Owner and Principal of Studio 11 Design. Kellie shares her journey through 20 years in the hospitality design industry, highlighting key milestones such as the purchase and renovation of a historic building, the expansion of her business with sister companies specializing in branding and art, and the challenges of entrepreneurship. They explore the importance of mentorship, the evolving landscape of hospitality design, and navigating through the pressures of business restructuring. Kellie also discusses her vision for the future, including international expansion and the development of Studio 11 Design-branded residences. The conversation offers insights into the ups and downs of running a successful design firm and emphasizes the power of collaboration, trust, and perseverance.Takeaways: Actively seek out mentors or become one yourself. Reach out to industry leaders for coffee meetings to gain insights.Focus on building and maintaining trust with clients. High trust levels can result in more creative freedom and better project outcomes.In design projects, delve deeply into the local neighborhood's story rather than relying on broad stereotypes or generalizations. This makes the design more authentic and engaging.Consider expanding available services such as branding and art installations within your firm to maintain a cohesive narrative and offer comprehensive solutions to clients.Invest in creating a collaborative and enriching workspace for your team to foster loyalty and productivity.Explore new and innovative project types, such as multifunctional spaces or projects in unique locations, to stand out and attract interest.Quote of the Show:“ The people in hospitality, we're a different breed. We live and breathe hospitality. It's who we are.” - Kellie SirnaLinks:LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/kellie-sirna-9847445/ Website: https://studio11design.com/ Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/studio11design_/ Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/brandbottega/ Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/curationbylouverne/ Shout Outs:0:40 - Hospitality Design Magazine https://hospitalitydesign.com/ 0:42 -  Condé Nast https://www.condenast.com/ 0:43 - Forbes https://www.forbes.com/ 0:43 - Wall Street Journal https://www.wsj.com/ 6:24 - Duncan & Miller Design https://duncanmillerdesign.com/ 7:04 - Stacy Elliston  https://www.linkedin.com/in/stacy-elliston-11305a9/ 21:55 - Ed Kuester https://www.linkedin.com/in/edkuester/ 26:21 - Greg Clay https://www.linkedin.com/in/greg-clay-25772010/ 28:00 - Kevin Barry https://kevinbarry.com/ 28:34 - Countrypolitan https://www.countrypolitannashville.com/ 28:45 - Thompson Hotels https://www.hyatt.com/thompson-hotels 29:26 - Hilton Garden Inn https://www.hilton.com/en/brands/hilton-garden-inn/ 36:12 - Chris Alvarado https://www.linkedin.com/in/christopher-m-alvarado-2911647/ 40:05 - Kelly Wearstler https://www.kellywearstler.com/ 43:35 - Hutton Hotel https://www.huttonhotel.com/ 

今晚的【精油女王香談室-科技賦能大補帖】將帶你探索基因科技如何引領生技產業的未來！ 主持人 Stephanie 特別邀請了博睿生醫董事長 鄭朝廣Jon ，為大家深度解析 生技製藥新趨勢，並探討 siRNA 技術在基因治療中的創新應用。 飛碟電台 精油女王香談室 http://www.uforadio.com.tw/ 本集亮點： 生技產業的全球趨勢及台灣的競爭優勢與挑戰 siRNA 技術如何改寫疾病治療，帶來基因療法新希望 產學合作、基因編輯及未來生技產業的國際化展望 與精油女王Stephanie ㄧ起深入了解生技產業的前沿動態！ #基因科技 #siRNA#生技產業#精油女王香談室#科技賦能#健康未來#生物科技 直播線上收聽 http://www.uforadio.com.tw/ 下載飛碟APP，讓您收聽零距離 IOS： https://reurl.cc/3jYQMV Android：https://reurl.cc/5GpNbR 精油女王香談室 Podcast Apple https://lihi.cc/2jPxd Spotify https://lihi.cc/qopvD KKbox https://lihi.cc/HiD7K -- Hosting provided by SoundOn

Ustadz Maududi Abdullah, Lc. - Kesedihan Akan Sirna

CME credits: 0.25 Valid until: 22-11-2025 Claim your CME credit at https://reachmd.com/programs/cme/fcs-and-shtg-are-we-meeting-need/20306/ Patients with familial chylomicronemia (FCS) and severe hypertriglyceridemia (SHTG) suffer from multiple complications, the most severe being acute pancreatitis. Current therapeutic agents, which include fibrates, omega-3 fatty acids, statins, and niacin, are generally ineffective. There are new developments with investigational siRNA therapeutics that silence APOC3, a key regulator of triglycerides and triglyceride-rich lipoproteins. Recent presentations have highlighted outcomes of trials evaluating APOC3 siRNA therapeutics in patients with FCS or SHTG. Drs. Ray, Goldberg, and Ballantyne discuss the findings of these trials, including the PALISADE trial and SHASTA-2 trial with plosaziran, and the potential implications for patients with FCS and SHTG. =

Aptamer Group PLC (AIM:APTA) CEO Dr Arron Tolley takes Proactive's Stephen Gunnion through recent announcements that highlight significant progress in the company's targeted drug delivery solutions. Tolley explained that Aptamer's focus on precision medicine aims to tackle the challenges of systemic drug administration, offering targeted solutions to improve patient care and reduce side effects. In its latest deal, a genetic medicines customer has selected to progress to the final commercial development phase for Aptemer's Optimer delivery vehicles. The company's collaboration with the US biopharmaceutical partner showcased Optimer's capability for specific cell-type targeting, validated through successful in-house and external testing. This achievement supports Aptamer's pipeline, including an associated siRNA liver fibrosis project and partnership with AstraZeneca, and emphasises the potential for faster clinical development. "The value will come through access to the intellectual property," Tolley noted, describing how the company's strategy pivots on commercial milestones and licensing agreements. Looking forward, Tolley shared optimism for more deals as the pipeline moves through late-stage negotiations. Visit Proactive's YouTube channel for more industry updates, and don't forget to like, subscribe, and enable notifications for future content. #AptamerGroup #DrugDelivery #PrecisionMedicine #Biotech #GeneticMedicine #PharmaceuticalResearch #CEOInterview #ProactiveUpdates #OptimerTechnology #Biopharma #ProactiveInvestors #invest #investing #investment #investor #stockmarket #stocks #stock #stockmarketnews

TORINO (ITALPRESS) - Un lavoro di totale apertura e ascolto verso i cittadini, per soddisfare le loro richieste di sicurezza. Al contempo, la priorità delle azioni di contrasto alla criminalità organizzata, sulle cui infiltrazioni al Nord e anche in Piemonte c'è ormai un'ampia letteratura. Sono queste le linee guida indicate dal nuovo questore di Torino Paolo Sirna, originario di Capo d'Orlando in provincia di Messina, che si è insediato oggi, dopo la recente esperienza a Catanzaro. "Il compito di produrre sicurezza è sempre più arduo, esiste un clima di condizionamenti che si riflettono sulla nostra realtà - ha detto il neo questore di Torino - Spesso abbiamo a che fare con persone vulnerabili e indifese, il nostro compito è tutelare tutti. Vogliamo agire in maniera più partecipata e coinvolgente, attivando maggiori canali di ascolto". E aggiunge: "Al contempo, lavoriamo per garantire lo sviluppo economico di questo territorio e la sua crescita culturale".xn3/tvi/gsl

TORINO (ITALPRESS) - Un lavoro di totale apertura e ascolto verso i cittadini, per soddisfare le loro richieste di sicurezza. Al contempo, la priorità delle azioni di contrasto alla criminalità organizzata, sulle cui infiltrazioni al Nord e anche in Piemonte c'è ormai un'ampia letteratura. Sono queste le linee guida indicate dal nuovo questore di Torino Paolo Sirna, originario di Capo d'Orlando in provincia di Messina, che si è insediato oggi, dopo la recente esperienza a Catanzaro. "Il compito di produrre sicurezza è sempre più arduo, esiste un clima di condizionamenti che si riflettono sulla nostra realtà - ha detto il neo questore di Torino - Spesso abbiamo a che fare con persone vulnerabili e indifese, il nostro compito è tutelare tutti. Vogliamo agire in maniera più partecipata e coinvolgente, attivando maggiori canali di ascolto". E aggiunge: "Al contempo, lavoriamo per garantire lo sviluppo economico di questo territorio e la sua crescita culturale".xn3/tvi/gsl

Dr. Paul Alexander Liberty Hour – Yet it is happening ‘while you sleep.' The ‘powers at be' are rolling this out and mainstreaming it, and we seem powerless. But if we do not stop this now, our lives will be changed negatively forever, for there have never been proper clinical studies, particularly studies that could ‘exclude' harm. No study has been or is slated to demonstrate safety in this era of mRNA technology. The evidence clearly shows that...

Roquefort Therapeutics CEO Ajan Reginald joined Steve Darling from Proactive to share the promising results of their STAT-6 siRNA program, demonstrating efficacy in a validated in vitro model of immunological disease. siRNA therapeutics represent an innovative class of medicines that utilize RNA interference to disrupt gene messaging and downregulate target proteins. Roquefort Therapeutics' siRNA specifically targets STAT-6, a key transcription factor involved in signaling pathways that mediate Type 2 inflammatory responses, driven by cytokines IL-4 and IL-13. Reginald highlighted that the siRNA significantly reduced STAT-6 levels compared to multiple controls in preliminary experiments, confirming the potential of this approach for inflammation and immunology. Further methodology and results will be disclosed at a future scientific conference or through a peer-reviewed publication. The company is actively seeking an out-licensing deal with Big Pharma for its STAT-6 siRNA program. The positive results from these recent experiments, combined with previous positive oncology data, bolster the program's appeal to potential partners. Roquefort Therapeutics plans to keep the market updated on the progress of these negotiations. #proactiveinvestors #roqueforttherapeuticsplc #lse #roq #drugdiscovery #pharma #bigpharma #sirna #stat-6 #invest #investing #investment #investor #stockmarket #stocks #stock #stockmarketnews

In this episode, Ayesha spoke with Kirk Brown, PhD, Vice President of Research at Alnylam Pharmaceuticals. Alnylam is focused on developing RNAi medicines to transform the way diseases like cardiovascular and neurological diseases are treated. Dr. Brown's preclinical work combining stable siRNA designs with alternative conjugation strategies has enabled potent, long-lasting silencing across the CNS following a single intrathecal administration.  In addition to driving RNAi platform innovations, Dr. Brown leads a team of CNS target biologists at Alnylam and serves as the research lead for ALN-APP, the first clinical CNS RNAi program. In this episode, Dr. Brown discusses the promise and evolving landscape of RNAi therapeutics across various therapeutic areas and Alnylam's approach to developing innovative RNAi medicines. For more life science and medical device content, visit the Xtalks Vitals homepage. https://xtalks.com/vitals/ Follow Us on Social Media Twitter: https://twitter.com/Xtalks Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/xtalks/ Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/Xtalks.Webinars/ LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/xtalks-webconferences YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/c/XtalksWebinars/featured

Good morning from Pharma and Biotech daily: the podcast that gives you only what's important to hear in Pharma e Biotech world.Clinical trials often fail to meet their enrollment goals and schedules, leading to significant financial losses. A new playbook offers solutions to address common challenges in clinical trial recruitment, including strategies for identifying additional participants, engaging and empowering individuals, and refining protocol criteria. The playbook provides insights on how to rescue trials when misalignment occurs, aiming to help brands in the biopharma industry tell compelling stories, build trust, and drive demand.Penumbra has decided to exit the virtual reality business, resulting in the layoff of 71 employees, as the company shifts its focus back to its core thrombectomy business. Qiagen and AstraZeneca have expanded their companion diagnostic partnership beyond cancer, allowing specialty care providers to perform genotyping during routine clinical examinations. Illumina has received FDA approval for a companion diagnostic cancer test that can identify patients eligible for treatment with specific medications targeting genetic features. Johns Hopkins, CareFirst, and Techstars have launched a healthcare AI accelerator program to support up to 12 startups working on AI tools. Medical sales teams are increasingly investing in training and skills development to adopt a more human-centered approach to sales.Biopharmaceutical company BioMarin has announced its second round of layoffs this year, with 225 employees globally being let go. This comes after changes to the company's C-suite last week and a previous round of 170 job cuts in May. In other news, Novartis is expanding its Sirna therapy Leqvio after successful Phase III study results, while Merck has ended two late-stage studies of Keytruda due to disappointing data. Regeneron is suing Sandoz in federal court to block a biosimilar of its drug Eylea. The pharma industry continues to see changes and challenges, with companies making strategic decisions based on clinical trial results and market conditions.Cognition Therapeutics, a small biotech company, recently announced positive results from a mid-stage Alzheimer's study. However, despite the promising results, the company's share price plummeted, puzzling many. The conflicting narratives surrounding the study highlight the significance of presenting scientific results in a way that reassures investors about the risks involved. The success of clinical trials is crucial for small biotechs in the competitive field of Alzheimer's research. Investor support is essential for advancing treatments for Alzheimer's, as progress cannot be made without adequate funding.The Health and Human Services (HHS) plans to appeal a lawsuit decision regarding online tracking technology. The Northwell-Nuvance merger has been approved by state attorneys general with certain conditions, while McLaren Health Care has restored its network after a ransomware attack. The shortage of mental health providers is being addressed with digital tools, and efforts to combat burnout in healthcare are ongoing.Neurocrine's mixed schizophrenia data disappoint Wall Street despite "positive" results, leading to a 20% slide in shares. The FDA rejection of the first MDMA therapy signals challenges in the psychedelic drug field. Bayer partners with RNA drugmaker Nextrna Therapeutics to develop new cancer therapies. A study suggests that covering Wegovy for heart risk could cost Medicare tens of billions each year.Pfizer has partnered with Flagship's Quotient to utilize genetics in targeting heart and kidney diseases. Moderna is facing tough competition as it tries to determine its next move in the biopharmaceutical industry. Neurocrine Biosciences saw a drop in shares despite meeting the primary endpoint in a mid-stage schizophrenia trial.Lykos Therapeutics faced a setback when the FDA rejected its MDMA therapy for PTSD and laun

Pradeep is a brilliant geneticist and Director of Preventive Cardiology, holds the Paul & Phyllis Fireman Endowed Chair in Vascular Medicine at Mass General Hospital and on faculty at Harvard Medical School and the Broad Institute. His prolific research has been illuminating for the field of improving our approach to reduce the risk of heart disease. That's especially important because heart disease is the global (and US) #1 killer and is on the increase. We didn't get into lifestyle factors here since there was so much ground to cover on new tests. drugs, and strategies.A video snippet of our conversation on ApoB. Full videos of all Ground Truths podcasts can be seen on YouTube here. The audios are also available on Apple and Spotify.Transcript with links to key publications and audioEric Topol (00:06):Well, welcome to Ground Truths. I'm Eric Topol and with me is Pradeep Natarajan from Harvard. He's Director of Preventative Cardiology at the Mass General Brigham Health System and he has been lighting it up on the field of cardiovascular. We're going to get to lots of different parts of that story and so, Pradeep welcome.Pradeep Natarajan (00:31):Thanks Eric, really delighted and honored to be with you and have this discussion.Eric Topol (00:36):Well, for years I've been admiring your work and it's just accelerating and so there's so many things to get to. I thought maybe what we'd start off with is you recently wrote a New England Journal piece about two trials, two different drugs that could change the landscape of cardiovascular prevention in the future. I mean, that's one of the themes we're going to get to today is all these different markers and drugs that will change cardiology as we know it now. So maybe you could just give us a skinny on that New England Journal piece.Two New Lipid Targets With RNA DrugsPradeep Natarajan (01:16):Yeah, yeah, so these two agents, the trials were published at the same time. These phase two clinical trials for plozasiran, which is an siRNA against APOC3 and zodasiran, which is an siRNA against ANGPTL3. The reason why we have medicines against those targets are based on human genetics observations, that individuals with loss of function mutations and either of those genes have reduced lipids. For APOC3, it's reduced triglycerides for ANGPTL3 reduced LDL cholesterol and reduced triglycerides and also individuals that have those loss of function mutations also have lower risk for coronary artery disease. Now that's a very similar parallel to PCSK9. We have successful medicines that treat that target because people have found that carriers of loss of function mutations in PCSK9 lead to lower LDL cholesterol and lower coronary artery disease.(02:11):Now that suggests that therapeutic manipulation without significant side effects from the agents themselves for APOC3 and ANGPTL3 would be anticipated to also lower coronary artery disease risk potentially in complementary pathways to PCSK9. The interesting thing with those observations is that they all came from rare loss of function mutations that are enriched in populations of individuals. However, at least for PCSK9, has been demonstrated to have efficacy in large groups of individuals across different communities. So the theme of that piece was really just the need to study diverse populations because those insights are not always predictable about which communities are going to have those loss of function mutations and when you find them, they often have profound insights across much larger groups of individuals.Eric Topol (03:02):Well, there's a lot there that we can unpack a bit of it. One of them is the use of small interfering RNAs (siRNA) as drugs. We saw in the field of PCSK9, as you mentioned. First there were monoclonal antibodies directed against this target and then more recently, there's inclisiran which isn't an RNA play if you will, where you only have to take it twice a year and supposedly it's less expensive and I'm still having trouble in my practice getting patients covered on their insurance even though it's cheaper and much more convenient. But nonetheless, now we're seeing these RNA drugs and maybe you could comment about that part and then also the surprise that perhaps is unexplained is the glucose elevation.Pradeep Natarajan (03:53):Yeah, so for medicines and targets that have been discovered through human genetics, those I think are attractive for genetic-based therapies and longer interval dosing for the therapies, which is what siRNAs allow you to do because the individuals that have these perturbations, basically the naturally occurring loss of function mutations, they have these lifelong, so basically have had a one-time therapy and have lived, and so far, at least for these targets, have not had untoward side effects or untoward phenotypic consequences and only reduce lipids and reduce coronary artery disease. And so, instead of taking a pill daily, if we have conviction that that long amount of suppression may be beneficial, then longer interval dosing and not worrying about the pill burden is very attractive specifically for those specific therapeutics. And as you know, people continue to innovate on further prolonging as it relates to PCSK9.(04:57):Separately, some folks are also developing pills because many people do feel that there's still a market and comfort for daily pills. Now interestingly for the siRNA for zodasiran at the highest dose, actually for both of them at the highest doses, but particularly for zodasiran, there was an increase in insulin resistance parameters actually as it relates to hyperglycemia and less so as it relates to insulin resistance, that is not predicted based on the human genetics. Individuals with loss of function mutations do not have increased risks in hyperglycemia or type 2 diabetes, so that isolates it related to that specific platform or that specific technology. Now inclisiran, as you'd mentioned, Eric is out there. That's an siRNA against PCSK9 that's made by a different manufacturer. So far, the clinical trials have not shown hyperglycemia or type 2 diabetes as it relates inclisiran, so it may be related to the specific siRNAs that are used for those targets. That does merit further consideration. Now, the doses that the manufacturers do plan to use in the phase three clinical trials are at lower doses where there was not an increase in hyperglycemia, but that does merit further investigation to really understand why that's the case. Is that an expected generalized effect for siRNAs? Is it related to siRNAs for this specific target or is it just related to the platform used for these two agents which are made by the same manufacturer?Eric Topol (06:27):Right, and I think the fact that it's a mystery is intriguing at the least, and it may not come up at the doses that are used in the trials, but the fact that it did crop up at high doses is unexpected. Now that is part of a much bigger story is that up until now our armamentarium has been statins and ezetimibe to treat lipids, but it's rapidly expanding Lp(a), which for decades as a cardiologist we had nothing to offer. There may even be drugs to be able to lower people who are at high risk with high Lp(a). Maybe you could discuss that.What About Lp(a)?Pradeep Natarajan (07:13):Yeah, I mean, Eric, as you know, Lp(a) has been described as a cardiovascular disease risk factors for quite so many years and there are assays to detect lipoprotein(a) elevation and have been in widespread clinical practice increasing widespread clinical practice, but we don't yet have approved therapies. However, there is an abundance of literature preclinical data that suggests that it likely is a causal factor, meaning that if you lower lipoprotein(a) when elevated, you would reduce the risk related to lipoprotein(a). And a lot of this comes from similar human genetic studies. The major challenge of just relating a biomarker to an outcome is there are many different reasons why a biomarker might be elevated, and so if you detect a signal that correlates a biomarker, a concentration to a clinical outcome, it could be related to that biomarker, but it could be to the other reasons that the biomarker is elevated and sometimes it relates to the outcome itself.(08:10):Now human genetics is very attractive because if you find alleles that strongly relate to that exposure, you can test those alleles themselves with the clinical outcome. Now the allele assignment is established at birth. No other factor is going to change that assignment after conception, and so that provides a robust, strong causal test for that potential exposure in clinical outcome. Now, lipoprotein(a) is unique in that it is highly heritable and so there are lots of different alleles that relate to lipoprotein(a) and so in a well powered analysis can actually test the lipoprotein(a) SNPs with the clinical outcomes and similar to how there is a biomarker association with incident myocardial infarction and incident stroke, the SNPs related to lipoprotein(a) show the same. That is among the evidence that strongly supports that this might be causal. Now, fast forward to many years later, we have at least three phase three randomized clinical trials testing agents that have been shown to be very potent at lowering lipoprotein(a) that in the coming years we will know if that hypothesis is true. Importantly, we will have to understand what are the potential side effects of these medicines. There are antisense oligonucleotides and siRNAs that are primarily in investigation. Again, this is an example where there's a strong genetic observation, and so these genetic based longer interval dosing therapies may be attractive, but side effects will be a key thing as well too. Those things hard to anticipate really can anticipate based on the human genetics for off target effects, for example.(09:52):It's clearly a risk signal and hopefully in the near future we're going to have specific therapies.Eric Topol (09:57):Yeah, you did a great job of explaining Mendelian randomization and the fact the power of genetics, which we're going to get into deeper shortly, but the other point is that do you expect now that there's these multiple drugs that lower Lp(a) efficiently, would that be enough to get approval or will it have to be trials to demonstrate improved cardiovascular outcomes?Pradeep Natarajan (10:24):There is a great regulatory path at FDA for approval just for LDL cholesterol lowering and inclisiran is on the market and the phase three outcomes data has not yet been reported because there is a wide appreciation that LDL cholesterol lowering is a pretty good surrogate for cardiovascular disease risk lowering. The label will be restricted to LDL cholesterol lowering and then if demonstrated to have clinical outcomes, the label could be expanded. For other biomarkers including lipoprotein(a), even though we have strong conviction that it is likely a causal factor there hasn't met the bar yet to get approval just based on lipoprotein(a) lowering, and so we would need to see the outcomes effects and then we would also need to understand side effects. There is a body of literature of side effects for other therapies that have targeted using antisense oligonucleotides. We talked about potential side effects from some siRNA platforms and sometimes those effects could overtake potential benefits, so that really needs to be assessed and there is a literature and other examples.(11:31):The other thing I do want to note related to lipoprotein(a) is that the human genetics are modeled based on lifelong perturbations, really hard to understand what the effects are, how great of an effect there might be in different contexts, particularly when introduced in middle age. There's a lot of discussion about how high lipoprotein(a) should be to deliver these therapies because the conventional teaching is that one in five individuals has high lipoprotein(a), and that's basically greater than 75 nanomoles per liter. However, some studies some human genetic studies to say if you want to get an effect that is similar to the LDL cholesterol lowering medicines on the market, you need to start with actually higher lipoprotein(a) because you need larger amounts of lipoprotein(a) lowering. Those are studies and approaches that haven't been well validated. We don't know if that's a valid approach because that's modeling based on this sort of lifelong effect. So I'm very curious to see what the overall effect will be because to get approval, I think you need to demonstrate safety and efficacy, but most importantly, these manufacturers and we as clinicians are trying to find viable therapies in the market that it won't be hard for us to get approval because hopefully the clinical trial will have said this is the context where it works. It works really well and it works really well on top of the existing therapies, so there are multiple hurdles to actually getting it directly to our patients.How Low Do You Go with LDL Cholesterol?Eric Topol (13:02):Yeah, no question about that. I'm glad you've emphasized that. Just as you've emphasized the incredible lessons from the genetics of people that have helped guide this renaissance to better drugs to prevent cardiovascular disease. LDL, which is perhaps the most impressive surrogate in medicine, a lab test that you already touched on, one of the biggest questions is how low do you go? That is Eugene Braunwald, who we all know and love. They're in Boston. The last time I got together with him, he was getting his LDL down to close to zero with various tactics that might be extreme. But before we leave these markers, you're running preventive cardiology at man's greatest hospital. Could you tell us what is your recipe for how aggressive do you go with LDL?Pradeep Natarajan (14:04):Yeah, so when I talk to patients where we're newly getting lipid lowering therapies on, especially because many people don't have a readout of abnormal LDL cholesterol when we're prescribing these medicines, it's just giving them a sense of what we think an optimal LDL cholesterol might be. And a lot of this is based on just empirical observations. So one, the average LDL cholesterol in the modern human is about 100 to 110 mg/dL. However, if you look at contemporary hunter gatherers and non-human primates, their average LDL is about 40 to 50 and newborn babies have an LDL cholesterol of about 30. And the reason why people keep making LDL cholesterol lowering medicines because as you stack on therapies, cardiovascular disease events continue to reduce including down to these very low LDL cholesterol values. So the population mean for LDL cholesterol is high and everybody likely has hypercholesterolemia, and that's because over the last 10,000 years how we live our lives is so dramatically different and there has not been substantial evolution over that time to change many of these features related to metabolism.(15:16):And so, to achieve those really low LDL cholesterol values in today's society is almost impossible without pharmacotherapies. You could say, okay, maybe everybody should be on pharmacotherapies, and I think if you did that, you probably would reduce a lot of events. You'll also be treating a lot of individuals who likely would not get events. Cardiovascular disease is the leading killer, but there are many things that people suffer from and most of the times it still is not cardiovascular disease. So our practice is still rooted in better identifying the individuals who are at risk for cardiovascular disease. And so, far we target our therapies primarily in those who have already developed cardiovascular disease. Maybe we'll talk about better identifying those at risk, but for those individuals it makes lots of sense to get it as low as possible. And the field has continued to move to lower targets.(16:07):One, because we've all recognized, at least based on these empirical observations that lower is better. But now increasingly we have a lot of therapies to actually get there, and my hope is that with more and more options and the market forces that influence that the cost perspective will make sense as we continue to develop more. As an aside, related aside is if you look at the last cholesterol guidelines, this is 2018 in the US this is the first time PCSK9 inhibitors were introduced in the guidelines and all throughout that there was discussions of cost. There are a lot of concerns from the field that PCSK9 inhibitors would bankrupt the system because so many people were on statins. And you look at the prior one that was in 2013 and cost was mentioned once it's just the cost effectiveness of statins. So I think the field has that overall concern.(17:01):However, over time we've gotten comfortable with lower targets, there are more medicines and I think some of this competition hopefully will drive down some of the costs, but also the overall appreciation of the science related to LDL. So long-winded way of saying this is kind of the things that we discussed just to give reassurance that we can go to low LDL cholesterol values and that it's safe and then we think also very effective. Nobody knows what the lower limit is, whether zero is appropriate or not. We know that glucose can get too low. We know that blood pressure can be too low. We don't know yet that limit for LDL cholesterol. I mean increasingly with these trials we'll see it going down really low and then we'll better appreciate and understand, so we'll see 40 is probably the right range.Eric Topol (17:49):40, you said? Yeah, okay, I'll buy that. Of course, the other thing that we do know is that if you push to the highest dose statins to get there, you might in some people start to see the hyperglycemia issue, which is still not fully understood and whether that is, I mean it's not desirable, but whether or not it is an issue, I guess it's still out there dangling. Now the other thing that since we're on LDL, we covered Lp(a), PCSK9, the siRNA, is ApoB. Do you measure ApoB in all your patients? Should that be the norm?Measuring ApoBPradeep Natarajan (18:32):Yeah, so ApoB is another blood test. In the standard lipid panel, you get four things. What's measured is cholesterol and triglycerides, they're the lipids insoluble in blood to get to the different tissues that get packaged in lipoprotein molecules which will have the cholesterol, triglycerides and some other lipids and proteins. And so, they all have different names as you know, right? Low density lipoprotein, high density lipoprotein and some others. But also in the lipid panel you get the HDL cholesterol, the amount of cholesterol in an HDL particle, and then most labs will calculate LDL cholesterol and LDL cholesterol has a nice relationship with cardiovascular disease. You lower it with statins and others. Lower risk for cardiovascular disease, turns out a unifying feature of all of these atherogenic lipoproteins, all these lipoproteins that are measured and unmeasured that relate to cardiovascular disease, including lipoprotein(a), they all have an additional protein called ApoB. And ApoB, at least as it relates to LDL is a pretty good surrogate of the number of LDL particles.(19:37):Turns out that that is a bit better at the population level at predicting cardiovascular disease beyond LDL cholesterol itself. And where it can be particularly helpful is that there are some patients out there that have an unexpected ratio between ApoB and LDL. In general, the ratio between LDL cholesterol and ApoB is about 1.1 and most people will have that rough ratio. I verify that that is the expected, and then if that is the expected, then really there is no role to follow ApoB. However, primarily the patients that have features related to insulin resistance have obesity. They may often have adequate looking LDL cholesterols, but their ApoB is higher. They have more circulating LDL particles relative to the total amount of LDL cholesterol, so smaller particles themselves. However, the total number of particles may actually be too high for them.(20:34):And so, even if the LDL cholesterol is at target, if the ApoB is higher, then you need to reduce. So usually the times that I just kind of verify that I'm at appropriate target is I check the LDL cholesterol, if that looks good, verify with the ApoB because of this ratio, the ApoB target should be about 10% lower. So if we're aiming for about 40, that's like 36, so relatively similar, and if it's there, I'm good. If it's not and it's higher, then obviously increase the LDL cholesterol lowering medicines because lower the ApoB and then follow the ApoB with the lipids going forward. The European Society of Cardiology has more emphasis on measuring ApoB, that is not as strong in the US guidelines, but there are many folks in the field, preventive cardiologists and others that are advocating for the increasing use of ApoB because I think there are many folks that are not getting to the appropriate targets because we are not measuring ApoB.Why Aren't We Measuring and Treating Inflammation?Eric Topol (21:37):Yeah, I think you reviewed it so well. The problem here is it could be part of the standard lipid panel, it would make this easy, but what you've done is a prudent way of selecting out people who it becomes more important to measure and moderate subsequently. Now this gets us to the fact that we're lipid centric and we don't pay homage to inflammation. So I wrote a recent Substack on the big miss on inflammation, and here you get into things like the monoclonal antibody to interleukin-6, the trial that CANTOS that showed significant reduction in cardiovascular events and fatal cancers by the way. And then you get into these colchicine trials two pretty good size randomized trials, and here the entry was coronary disease with a high C-reactive protein. Now somehow or other we abandon measuring CRP or other inflammatory markers, and both of us have had patients who have low LDLs but have heart attacks or significant coronary disease. So why don't we embrace inflammation? Why don't we measure it? Why don't we have better markers? Why is this just sitting there where we could do so much better? Even agents that are basically cost pennies like colchicine at low doses, not having to use a proprietary version could be helpful. What are your thoughts about us upgrading our prevention with inflammation markers?Pradeep Natarajan (23:22):Yeah, I mean, Eric, there is an urgent need to address these other pathways. I say urgent need because heart disease has the dubious distinction of being the leading killer in the US and then over the last 20 years, the leading killer in the world as it takes over non-communicable diseases. And really since the early 1900s, there has been a focus on developing pharmacotherapies and approaches to address the traditional modifiable cardiovascular disease risk factors. That has done tremendous good, but still the curves are largely flattening out. But in the US and in many parts of the world, the deaths attributable to cardiovascular disease are starting to tick up, and that means there are many additional pathways, many of them that we have well recognized including inflammation. More recently, Lp(a) that are likely important for cardiovascular disease, for inflammation, as you have highlighted, has been validated in randomized controlled trials.(24:18):Really the key trial that has been more most specific is one on Canakinumab in the CANTOS trial IL-1β monoclonal antibody secondary prevention, so cardiovascular disease plus high C-reactive protein, about a 15% reduction in cardiovascular disease and also improvement in cancer related outcomes. Major issues, a couple of issues. One was increased risk for severe infections, and the other one is almost pragmatic or practical is that that medicine was on the market at a very high price point for rare autoinflammatory conditions. It still is. And so, to have for a broader indication like cardiovascular disease prevention would not make sense at that price point. And the manufacturer tried to go to the FDA and focus on the group that only had C-reactive protein lowering, but that's obviously like a backwards endpoint. How would you know that before you release the medicine? So that never made it to a broader indication.(25:14):However, that stuck a flag in the broader validation of that specific pathway in cardiovascular disease. That pathway has direct relevance to C-reactive protein. C-reactive protein is kind of a readout of that pathway that starts from the NLRP3 inflammasome, which then activates IL-1β and IL-6. C-reactive protein we think is just a non causal readout, but is a reliable test of many of these features and that's debatable. There may be other things like measuring IL-6, for example. So given that there is actually substantial ongoing drug development in that pathway, there are a handful of companies with NLRP3 inflammasome inhibitors, but small molecules that you can take as pills. There is a monoclonal antibody against IL-6 that's in development ziltivekimab that's directed at patients with chronic kidney disease who have lots of cardiovascular disease events despite addressing modifiable risk factors where inflammatory markers are through the roof.(26:16):But then you would also highlighted one anti-inflammatory that's out there that's pennies on the dollar, that's colchicine. Colchicine is believed to influence cardiovascular disease by inhibiting NLRP3, I say believed to. It does a lot of things. It is an old medicine, but empirically has been shown in at least two randomized controlled trials patients with coronary artery disease, actually they didn't measure C-reactive protein in the inclusion for these, but in those populations we did reduce major adverse cardiovascular disease events. The one thing that does give me pause with colchicine is that there is this odd signal for increased non-cardiovascular death. Nobody understands if that's real, if that's a fluke. The FDA just approved last year low dose colchicine, colchicine at 0.5 milligrams for secondary prevention given the overwhelming efficacy. Hasn't yet made it into prevention guidelines, but I think that's one part that does give me a little bit pause. I do really think about it particularly for patients who have had recurrent events. The people who market the medicine and do research do remind us that C-reactive protein was not required in the inclusion, but nobody has done that secondary assessment to see if measuring C-reactive protein would be helpful in identifying the beneficial patients. But I think there still could be more work done on better identifying who would benefit from colchicine because it's an available and cheap medicine. But I'm excited that there is a lot of development in this inflammation area.Eric Topol (27:48):Yeah, well, the development sounds great. It's probably some years away. Do you use colchicine in your practice?Pradeep Natarajan (27:56):I do. Again, for those folks who have had recurrent events, even though C-reactive protein isn't there, it does make me feel like I'm treating inflammation. If C-reactive protein is elevated and then I use it for those patients, if it's not elevated, it's a much harder sell from my standpoint, from the patient standpoint. At the lower dose for colchicine, people generally are okay as far as side effects. The manufacturer has it at 0.5 milligrams, which is technically not pennies on the dollar. That's not generic. The 0.6 milligrams is generic and they claim that there is less side effects at the 0.5 milligrams. So technically 0.6 milligrams is off label. So it is what it is.CHIP and Defining High Risk People for CV DiseaseEric Topol (28:40):It's a lot more practical, that's for sure. Now, before I leave that, I just want to mention when I reviewed the IL-1β trial, you mentioned the CANTOS trial and also the colchicine data. The numbers of absolute increases for infection with the antibody or the cancers with the colchicine are really small. So I mean the benefit was overriding, but I certainly agree with your concern that there's some things we don't understand there that need to be probed more. Now, one of the other themes, well before one other marker that before we get to polygenic risk scores, which is center stage here, defining high risk people. We've talked a lot about the conventional things and some of the newer ways, but you've been one of the leaders of study of clonal hematopoiesis of indeterminate potential known as CHIP. CHIP, not the chips set in your computer, but CHIP. And basically this is stem cell mutations that increase in people as we age and become exceptionally common with different mutations that account in these clones. So maybe you can tell us about CHIP and what I don't understand is that it has tremendous correlation association with cardiovascular outcomes adverse as well as other system outcomes, and we don't measure it and we could measure it. So please take us through what the hell is wrong there.Pradeep Natarajan (30:14):Yeah, I mean this is really exciting. I mean I'm a little bit biased, but this is observations that have been made only really over the last decade, but accelerating research. And this has been enabled by advances in genomic technologies. So about 10 years or plus ago, really getting into the early days of population-based next generation sequencing, primarily whole exome sequencing. And most of the DNA that we collect to do these population-based analyses come from the blood, red blood cells are anucleate, so they're coming from white blood cells. And so, at that time, primarily interrogating what is the germline genetic basis for coronary artery disease and early onset myocardial infarction. At the same time, colleagues at the Broad Institute were noticing that there are many additional features that you can get from the blood-based DNA that was being processed by the whole exome data. And there were actually three different groups that converged on that all in Boston that converged on the same observation that many well-established cancer causing mutations.(31:19):So mutations that are observed in cancers that have been described to drive the cancers themselves were being observed in these large population-based data sets that we were all generating to understand the relationship between loss of function mutations in cardiovascular disease. That's basically the intention of those data sets for being generated for other things. Strong correlation with age, but it was very common among individuals greater than 70; 10% of them would have these mutations and is very common because blood cancer is extremely, it's still pretty rare in the population. So to say 10% of people had cancer causing driver mutations but didn't have cancer, was much higher than anyone would've otherwise expected. In 2014, there were basically three main papers that described that, and they also observed that there is a greater risk of death. You'd say, okay, this is a precancerous lesion, so they're probably dying of cancer.(32:17):But as I said, the absolute incidence rate for blood cancer is really low and there's a relative increase for about tenfold, but pretty small as it relates to what could be related to death. And in one of the studies we did some exploratory analysis that suggested maybe it's actually the most common cause of death and that was cardiovascular disease. And so, a few years later we published a study that really in depth really looked at a bunch of different data sets that were ascertained to really understand the relationship between these mutations, these cancer causing mutations in cardiovascular disease, so observed it in enrichment and older individuals that had these mutations, CHIP mutations, younger individuals who had early onset MI as well too, and then also look prospectively and showed that it related to incident coronary artery disease. Now the major challenge for this kind of analysis as it relates to the germline genetic analysis is prevalence changes over time.(33:15):There are many things that could influence the presence of clonal hematopoiesis. Age is a key enriching factor and age is the best predictor for cardiovascular disease. So really important. So then we modeled it in mice. It was actually a parallel effort at Boston University (BU) that was doing the same thing really based on the 2014 studies. And so, at the same time we also observed when you modeled this in mice, you basically perturb introduce loss of function mutations in the bone marrow for these mice to recapitulate these driver mutations and those mice also have a greater burden of atherosclerosis. And Eric, you highlighted inflammation because basically the phenotype of these cells are hyper inflamed cells. Interestingly, C-reactive protein is only modestly elevated. So C-reactive protein is not fully capturing this, but many of the cytokines IL-1β, IL-6, they're all upregulated in mice and in humans when measured as well.(34:11):Now there've been a few key studies that have been really exciting about using anti-inflammatories in this pathway to address CHIP associated cardiovascular disease. So one that effort that I said in BU because they saw these cytokines increased, we already know that these cytokines have relationship with atherosclerosis. So they gave an NLRP3 inflammasome inhibitor to the mice and they showed that the mice with or without CHIP had a reduction in atherosclerosis, but there was a substantial delta among the mice that are modeled as having CHIP. Now, the investigators in CANTOS, the manufacturers, they actually went back and they survey where they had DNA in the CANTOS trial. They measured CHIP and particularly TET2 CHIP, which is the one that has the strongest signal for atherosclerosis. As I said, overall about 15% reduction in the primary outcome in CANTOS. Among the individuals who had TET2 CHIP, it was a 64% reduction in event.(35:08):I mean you don't see those in atherosclerosis related trials. Now this has the caveat of it being secondary post hoc exploratory, the two levels of evidence. And so, then we took a Mendelian randomization approach. Serendipitously, just so happens there is a coding mutation in the IL-6 receptor, a missense mutation that in 2012 was described that if you had this mutation, about 40% of people have it, you have a 5%, but statistically significant reduction in coronary artery disease. So we very simply said, if the pathway of this NLRP3 inflammasome, which includes IL-6, if you have decreased signaling in that pathway, might you have an even greater benefit from having that mutation if you had CHIP versus those who didn't have CHIP. So we looked in the UK Biobank, those who didn't have CHIP 5% reduction, who had that IL-6 receptor mutation, and then those who did have CHIP, if they had that mutation, it was about a 60% reduction in cardiovascular disease.(36:12):Again, three different lines of evidence that really show that this pathway has relevance in the general population, but the people who actually might benefit the most are those with CHIP. And I think as we get more and more data sets, we find that not all of the CHIP mutations are the same as it relates to cardiovascular disease risk. It does hone in on these key subsets like TET2 and JAK2, but this is pretty cool as a preventive cardiologist, new potential modifiable risk factor, but now it's almost like an oncologic paradigm that is being applied to coronary artery disease where we have specific driver mutations and then we're tailoring our therapies to those specific biological drivers for coronary artery disease. Hopefully, I did that justice. There's a lot there.Why Don't We Measure CHIP?Eric Topol (36:57):Well, actually, it's phenomenal how you've explained that, but I do want to review for our listeners or readers that prior to this point in our conversation, we were talking about germline mutations, the ones you're born with. With CHIP, we're talking about acquired somatic mutations, and these are our blood stem cells. And what is befuddling to me is that with all the data that you and others, you especially have been publishing and how easy it would be to measure this. I mean, we've seen that you can get it from sequencing no less other means. Why we don't measure this? I mean, why are we turning a blind eye to CHIP? I just don't get it. And we keep calling it of indeterminate potential, not indeterminate. It's definite potential.Pradeep Natarajan (37:51):Yeah, no, I think these are just overly cautious terms from the scientists. Lots of people have CHIP, a lot of people don't have clinical outcomes. And so, I think from the lens of a practicing hematologists that provide some reassurance on the spectrum for acquired mutation all the way over to leukemia, that is where it comes from. I don't love the acronym as well because every subfield in biomedicine has its own CHIP, so there's obviously lots of confusion there. CH or clinical hematopoiesis is often what I go, but I think continuing to be specific on these mutations. Now the question is why measure? Why aren't we measuring it? So there are some clinical assays out there. Now when patients get evaluated for cytopenias [low cell counts], there are next generation sequencing tests that look for these mutations in the process for evaluation. Now, technically by definition, CHIP means the presence of these driver mutations that have expanded because it's detectable by these assays, not a one-off cell because it can only be detected if it's in a number of cells.(38:55):So there has been some expansion, but there are no CBC abnormalities. Now, if there's a CBC abnormality and you see a CHIP mutation that's technically considered CCUS or clonal cytopenia of unknown significance, sometimes what is detected is myelodysplastic syndrome. In those scenarios still there is a cardiovascular disease signal, and so many of our patients who are seen in the cancer center who are being evaluated for these CBC abnormalities will be detected to have these mutations. They will have undergone some risk stratification to see what the malignancy potential is. Still pretty low for many of those individuals. And so, the major driver of health outcomes for this finding may be cardiovascular. So those patients then get referred to our program. Dana-Farber also has a similar program, and then my colleague Peter Libby at the Brigham often sees those patients as well. Now for prospective screening, so far, an insurance basically is who's going to pay for it.(39:51):So an insurance provider is not deemed that appropriate yet. You do need the prospective clinical trials because the medicines that we're talking about may have side effects as well too. And what is the yield? What is the diagnostic yield? Will there actually be a large effect estimate? But there has been more and more innovation, at least on the assay and the cost part of the assay because these initial studies, we've been using whole exome sequencing, which is continuing to come down, but is not a widely routine clinical test yet. And also because as you highlighted, these are acquired mutations. A single test is not necessarily one and done. This may be something that does require surveillance for particular high risk individuals. And we've described some risk factors for the prevalence of CHIP. So surveillance may be required, but because there are about 10 genes that are primarily implicated in CHIP, that can substantially decrease the cost of it. The cost for DNA extraction is going down, and so there are research tests that are kind of in the $10 to $20 range right now for CHIP. And if flipped over to the clinical side will also be reasonably low cost. And so, for the paradigm for clinical implementation, that cost part is necessary.Eric Topol (41:10):I don't know the $10 or $20 ones. Are there any I could order on patients that I'm worried about?Pradeep Natarajan (41:17):Not yet clinical. However, there is a company that makes the reagents for at least the cores that are developing this. They are commercializing that test so that many other cores, research cores can develop it. I think it's in short order that clinical labs will adopt it as well too.Eric Topol (41:36):That's great.Pradeep Natarajan (41:37):I will keep you apprised.What About Polygenic Risk Scores?Eric Topol (41:39):I think that's really good news because like I said, we're so darn lipid centric and we have to start to respect the body of data, the knowledge that you and others have built about CHIP. Now speaking of another one that drives me nuts is polygenic risk score (PRS) for about a decade, I've been saying we have coronary disease for most people is a polygenic trait. It's not just a familial hypercholesterolemia. And we progressively have gotten better and better of the hundreds of single variants that collectively without a parental history will be and independently predict who is at double, triple or whatever risk of getting heart disease, whereby you could then guide your statins at higher aggressive or pick a statin, use one or even go beyond that as we've been talking about. But we don't use that in practice, which is just incredible because it's can be done cheap.(42:45):You can get it through whether it's 23andMe or now many other entities. We have an app, MyGeneRank where we can process that Scripss does for free. And only recently, Mass General was the first to implement that in your patient population, and I'm sure you were a driver of that. What is the reluctance about using this as an orthogonal, if you will, separate way to assess a person's risk for heart disease? And we know validated very solidly about being aggressive about lipid lowering when you know this person's in the highest 5% polygenic risk score. Are we just deadheads in this field or what?Pradeep Natarajan (43:30):Yeah, I mean Eric, as you know, lots of inertia in medicine, but this one I think has a potential to make a large impact. Like CHIP mutations, I said news is about 10% in individuals greater than 70. The prospect here is to identify the risk much earlier in life because I think there is a very good argument that we're undertreating high risk individuals early on because we don't know how to identify them. As you highlighted, Dr. Braunwald about LDL cholesterol. The other part of that paradigm is LDL cholesterol lowering and the duration. And as we said, everybody would benefit from really low LDL cholesterol, but again, you might overtreat that if you just give that to everybody. But if you can better identify the folks very early in life, there is a low cost, low risk therapy, at least related to statins that you could have a profound benefit from the ones who have a greater conviction will have future risk for cardiovascular disease.(44:21):You highlighted the family history, and the family history has given the field of clues that genetics play a role. But as the genome-wide association studies have gotten larger, the polygenic risk scores have gotten better. We know that family history is imperfect. There are many reasons why a family member who is at risk may or may not have developed cardiovascular disease. A polygenic risk score will give a single number that will estimate the contribution of genetics to cardiovascular disease. And the thing that is really fascinating to me, which is I think some of a clinical implementation challenge is that the alleles for an individual are fixed. The genotyping is very cheap. That continues to be extremely cheap to do this test. But the weights and the interpretation of what the effects should be for each of the SNPs are continually being refined over time.(45:18):And so, given the exact same SNPs in the population, the ability to better predict cardiovascular diseases getting better. And so, you have things that get reported in the literature, but literally three years later that gets outdated and those hypotheses need to be reassessed. Today, I'll say we have a great relative to other things, but we have a great polygenic risk score was just reported last year that if you compare it to familial hypercholesterolemia, which has a diagnostic yield of about 1 in 300 individuals, but readily detectable by severe hypercholesterolemia that has about threefold risk for cardiovascular disease. By polygenic risk score, you can find 1 in 5 individuals with that same risk. Obviously you go higher than that, it'll be even higher risk related to that. And that is noble information very early in life. And most people develop risk factors later in life. It is happening earlier, but generally not in the 30s, 40s where there's an opportunity to make a substantial impact on the curve related to cardiovascular disease.(46:25):But there is a lot of momentum there. Lots of interest from NIH and others. The major challenge is though the US healthcare system is really not well set up to prevention, as you know, we practice healthcare after patient's developed disease and prevent the complications related to progression. The stakeholder incentives beyond the patient themselves are less well aligned. We've talked a lot here today about payers, but we don't have a single payer healthcare system. And patients at different times of their lives will have different insurers. They'll start early in life with their parents, their first employer, they'll move on to the next job and then ultimately Medicare. There's no entity beyond yourself that really cares about your longevity basically from the beginning and your overall wellness. That tension has been a major challenge in just driving the incentives and the push towards polygenic risk scores. But there are some innovative approaches like MassMutual Life Insurance actually did a pilot on polygenic risk scoring.(47:33):They're in the business of better understanding longevity. They get that this is important data. Major challenges, there are federal protections against non-discrimination in the workplace, health insurance, not necessarily life insurance. So I think that there are lots of things that have to be worked out. Everybody recognizes that this is important, but we really have to have all the incentives aligned for this to happen at a system-wide level in the US. So there's actually lots of investment in countries that have more nationalized healthcare systems, lots of development in clinical trials in the UK, for example. So it's possible that we in the US will not be the lead in that kind of evidence generation, but maybe we'll get there.The GLP-1 DrugsEric Topol (48:16):Yeah, it's frustrating though, Pradeep, because this has been incubating for some time and now we have multi ancestry, polygenic risk scores, particularly for heart disease and we're not using it, and it's not in my view, in the patient's best interest just because of these obstacles that you're mentioning, particularly here in the US. Well, the other thing I want to just get at with you today is the drugs that we were using for diabetes now blossoming for lots of other indications, particularly the glucagon-like peptide 1 (GLP-1) drugs. This has come onto the scene in recent years, not just obviously for obesity, but it's anti-inflammatory effects as we're learning, mediated not just through the brain but also T cells and having extraordinary impact in heart disease for people with obesity and also with those who have heart failure, about half of heart failure for preserved ejection fraction. So recently you and your colleagues recently published a paper with this signal of optic neuropathy. It was almost seven eightfold increase in a population. First, I wanted to get your sense about GLP-1. We're also going to get into the SGLT2 for a moment as well, but how do you use GLP-1? What's your prognosis for this drug class going forward?Pradeep Natarajan (49:55):As it relates to the paper, I can't claim credit as one of my former students who is now Mass Eye and Ear resident who participated, but we can talk about that. There's obviously some challenges for mining real world data, but this was related to anecdotes that they were observing at Mass Eye and Ear and then studied and observed an enrichment. In general though, I feel like every week I'm reading a new clinical trial about a new clinical outcome benefit as it relates to GLP-1 receptor agonists. This is kind of one thing that stands out that could be interrogated in these other clinical trials. So I would have that caveat before being cautious about ocular complications. But the data has been overwhelmingly beneficial, I think, because at minimum, obesity and inflammation are relayed to myriad of consequences, and I'm really excited that we have therapies that can address obesity that are safe.(50:52):There's a legacy of unsafe medicines for obesity, especially related to cardiovascular disease. So the fact that we have medicines that are safe and effective for lowering weight that also have real strong effects on clinical outcomes is tremendous. We in cardiology are increasingly using a range of diabetes medicines, including GLP-1 receptor agonists and SGLT2 inhibitors. I think that is also the secular changes of what influences cardiovascular disease over time. I talked about over the last 10 years or so with this increase in deaths attributable to cardiovascular disease. If you look at the influences of traditional clinical risk factors today, many of them have decreased in importance because when abnormal, we recognize them, in general we modify them when recognized. And so, many of the things that are unaddressed, especially the features related to insulin resistance, obesity, they start rising in importance. And so, there is a dramatic potential for these kinds of therapies in reducing the residual risks that we see related to cardiovascular disease. So I'm enthusiastic and excited. I think a lot more biology that needs to be understood of how much of this is being influenced specifically through this pathway versus a very effective weight loss medicine. But also interesting to see the insights on how the effect centrally on appetite suppression has profound influences on weight loss as well too. And hopefully that will lead to more innovations in weight management.The SGLT-2 DrugsEric Topol (52:25):And likewise, perhaps not getting near as much play, but when it came on the cardiovascular scene that an anti-diabetic drug SGLT2 was improving survival, that was big, and we still don't know why. I mean, there's some ideas that it might be a senolytic drug unknowingly, but this has become a big part of practice of cardiology in patients with diabetes or with preserved ejection fraction heart failure. Is that a fair summary for that drug?Pradeep Natarajan (53:00):Yeah, I totally agree. I mean, as there has been increased recognition for heart failure preserved ejection fraction, it has been almost disheartening over the last several years that we have not had very specific effective therapies to treat that condition. Now, it is a tremendous boon that we do have medicines interestingly focused on metabolism that are very helpful in that condition for heart failure with preserved ejection fraction. But there is still much more to be understood as far as that condition. I mean, the major challenge with heart failure, as you know, especially with heart failure preserved ejection fraction, it likely is a mix of a wide variety of different etiologies. So in parallel with developing effective therapies that get at some aspect is really understanding what are the individual drivers and then targeting those specific individual drivers. That requires a lot of unbiased discovery work and further profiling to be done. So lot more innovation, but relative to heart failure itself, it is not had widespread recognition as heart failure reduced ejection fraction. So much more to innovate on, for sure.Eric Topol (54:07):Right, right. Yeah, I am stunned by the recent progress in cardiovascular medicine. You have been center stage with a lot of it, and we've had a chance to review so much. And speaking of genetics, I wanted to just get a little insight because I recently came across the fact that your mother here at the City of Hope in Southern California is another famous researcher. And is that, I don't know what chromosome that is on regarding parental transmission of leading research. Maybe you can tell me about that.Pradeep Natarajan (54:41):Yeah, I mean, I guess it is a heritable trait when a parent has one profession that there is a higher likelihood that the offspring will have something similar. So both of my parents are PhDs, nonphysicians. There is a diabetes department at the City of Hope, so she's the chair of that department. So very active. We do overlap in some circles because she does investigate both vascular complications and renal complications. And then sometimes will ask my advice on some visualization. But she herself has just had a science translational medicine paper, for example, just a couple of months ago. So it's fun to talk about these things. To be honest, because my parents are researchers, I was not totally sure that I would be a researcher and kind of wanted to do something different in medicine. But many of my early observations and just how common cardiovascular disease is around me and in my community and wanting to do something useful is what got me specifically into cardiology.(55:45):But obviously there are numerous outstanding, important questions. And as I went through my career, really focused on more basic investigations of atherosclerosis and lipids. What got me excited sort of after my clinical training was the ability to ask many of these questions now in human populations with many new biological data sets, at least first centered on genetics. And the capabilities continue to expand, so now I teach first year Harvard medical students in their genetics curriculum. And when I talk to them just about my career arc, I do remind them they're all doing millions of things and they're exploring lots of things, but when they get to my shoes, the capabilities will be tremendously different. And so, I really advise them to take the different experiences, mainly in an exercise for asking questions, thoughtfully addressing questions, connecting it back to important clinical problems. And then once they start to understand that with a few different approaches, then they'll totally take off with what the opportunities are down the road.Eric Topol (56:51):No, it's great. I mean, how lucky somebody could be in the first year of med school with you as their teacher and model. Wow. Pradeep, we've really gone deep on this and it's been fun. I mean, if there's one person I'm going to talk to you about cardiovascular risk factors and the things that we've been into today, you would be the one. So thank you for taking the time and running through a lot of material here today, and all your work with great interest.Pradeep Natarajan (57:24):Thanks, Eric. I really appreciate it. It's tremendous honor. I'm a big fan, so I would be glad to talk about any of these things and more anytime.***************Thanks for listening, reading or watching!The Ground Truths newsletters and podcasts are all free, open-access, without ads.Please share this post/podcast with your friends and network if you found it informative!Voluntary paid subscriptions all go to support Scripps Research. Many thanks for that—they greatly helped fund our summer internship programs for 2023 and 2024.Thanks to my producer Jessica Nguyen and Sinjun Balabanoff for audio and video support at Scripps Research.Note: you can select preferences to receive emails about newsletters, podcasts, or all I don't want to bother you with an email for content that you're not interested in. Get full access to Ground Truths at erictopol.substack.com/subscribe

America Out Loud PULSE with Dr. Peter McCullough and Malcolm – What is this business about injecting siRNA to destroy the covid mRNA? Can you give us a list of studies that show that children who have had no shots are turning out to be the healthiest? Is everyone vaccinated at risk of these fibrous clots and myocarditis? Is blood clotting still an issue with these later variants? What about detoxing with Spike Support afterward?

America Out Loud PULSE with Dr. Peter McCullough and Malcolm – What is this business about injecting siRNA to destroy the covid mRNA? Can you give us a list of studies that show that children who have had no shots are turning out to be the healthiest? Is everyone vaccinated at risk of these fibrous clots and myocarditis? Is blood clotting still an issue with these later variants? What about detoxing with Spike Support afterward?

In this podcast, Thomas Czech, Distinguished Professor at the University of Colorado, Boulder, with a lineage of remarkable contributions on RNA, ribozyme, and telomeres, discuss why RNA is so incredibly versatile.Video snippet from our conversation. Full videos of all Ground Truths podcasts can be seen on YouTube here. The audios are also available on Apple and Spotify.Transcript with links to the audio and external linksEric Topol (00:07):Well, hello, this is Eric Topol from Ground Truths, and it's really a delight for me to welcome Tom Cech who just wrote a book, the Catalyst, and who is a Nobel laureate for his work in RNA. And is at the University of Colorado Boulder as an extraordinary chemist and welcome Tom.Tom Cech (00:32):Eric, I'm really pleased to be here.The RNA GuyEric Topol (00:35):Well, I just thoroughly enjoyed your book, and I wanted to start out, if I could, with a quote, which gets us right off the story here, and let me just get to it here. You say, “the DNA guy would need to become an RNA guy. Though I didn't realize it at the time, jumping ship would turn out to be the most momentous decision in my life.” Can you elaborate a bit on that?Tom Cech (01:09):As a graduate student at Berkeley, I was studying DNA and chromosomes. I thought that DNA was king and really somewhat belittled the people in the lab next door who were working on RNA, I thought it was real sort of second fiddle material. Of course, when RNA is acting just as a message, which is an important function, a critical function in all life on earth, but still, it's a function that's subservient to DNA. It's just copying the message that's already written in the playbook of DNA. But little did I know that the wonders of RNA were going to excite me and really the whole world in unimaginable ways.Eric Topol (02:00):Well, they sure have, and you've lit up the world well before you had your Nobel Prize in 1989 was Sid Altman with ribozyme. And I think one of the things that struck me, which are so compelling in the book as I think people might know, it's divided in two sections. The first is much more on the biology, and the second is much more on the applications and how it's changing the world. We'll get into it particularly in medicine, but the interesting differentiation from DNA, which is the one trick pony, as you said, all it does is store stuff. And then the incredible versatility of RNA as you discovered as a catalyst, that challenging dogma, that proteins are supposed to be the only enzymes. And here you found RNA was one, but also so much more with respect to genome editing and what we're going to get into here. So I thought what we might get into is the fact that you kind of went into the scum of the pond with this organism, which by the way, you make a great case for the importance of basic science towards the end of the book. But can you tell us about how you, and then of course, many others got into the Tetrahymena thermophila, which I don't know that much about that organism.Tom Cech (03:34):Yeah, it's related to Tetrahymena is related to paramecium, which is probably more commonly known because it's an even larger single celled animal. And therefore, in an inexpensive grade school microscope, kids can look through and see these ciliated protozoa swimming around on a glass slide. But I first learned about them when I was a postdoc at MIT and I would drive down to Joe Gall's lab at Yale University where Liz Blackburn was a postdoc at the time, and they were all studying Tetrahymena. It has the remarkable feature that it has 10,000 identical copies of a particular gene and for a higher organism, one that has its DNA in the nucleus and does its protein synthesis in the cytoplasm. Typically, each gene's present in two copies, one from mom, one from dad. And if you're a biochemist, which I am having lots of stuff is a real advantage. So 10,000 copies of a particular gene pumping out RNA copies all the time was a huge experimental advantage. And that's what I started working on when I started my own lab at Boulder.Eric Topol (04:59):Well, and that's where, I guess the title of the book, the Catalyst ultimately, that grew into your discovery, right?Tom Cech (05:08):Well, at one level, yes, but I also think that the catalyst in a more general conversational sense means just facilitating life in this case. So RNA does much more than just serve as a biocatalyst or a message, and we'll get into that with genome editing and with telomerase as well.The Big Bang and 11 Nobel Prizes on RNA since 2000Eric Topol (05:32):Yes, and I should note that as you did early in the book, that there's been an 11 Nobel prize awardees since 2000 for RNA work. And in fact, we just had Venki who I know you know very well as our last podcast. And prior to that, Kati Karikó, Jennifer Doudna who worked in your lab, and the long list of people working RNA in the younger crowd like David Liu and Fyodor Urnov and just so many others, we need to have an RNA series because it's just exploding. And that one makes me take you back for a moment to 2007. And when I was reading the book, it came back to me about the Economist cover. You may recall almost exactly 17 years ago. It was called the Biology's Big Bang – Unravelling the secrets of RNA. And in that, there was a notable quote from that article. Let me just get to that. And it says, “it is probably no exaggeration to say that biology is now undergoing its neutron moment.”(06:52):This is 17 years ago. “For more than half a century the fundamental story of living things has been a tale of the interplay between genes, in the form of DNA, and proteins, which is genes encode and which do the donkey work of keeping living organisms living. The past couple of years, 17 years ago, however, has seen the rise and rise of a third type of molecule, called RNA.” Okay, so that was 2007. It's pretty extraordinary. And now of course we're talking about the century of biology. So can you kind of put these last 17 years in perspective and where we're headed?Tom Cech (07:34):Well, Eric, of course, this didn't all happen in one moment. It wasn't just one big bang. And the scientific community has been really entranced with the wonders of RNA since the 1960s when everyone was trying to figure out how messenger RNA stored the genetic code. But the general public has been really kept in the dark about this, I think. And as scientists, were partially to blame for not reaching out and sharing what we have found with them in a way that's more understandable. The DNA, the general public's very comfortable with, it's the stuff of our heredity. We know about genetic diseases, about tracing our ancestry, about solving crimes with DNA evidence. We even say things like it's in my DNA to mean that it's really fundamental to us. But I think that RNA has been sort of kept in the closet, and now with the mRNA vaccines against Covid-19, at least everyone's heard of RNA. And I think that that sort of allowed me to put my foot in the door and say, hey, if you were curious about the mRNA vaccines, I have some more stories for you that you might be really interested in.RNA vs RNAEric Topol (09:02):Yeah, well, we'll get to that. Maybe we should get to that now because it is so striking the RNA versus RNA chapter in your book, and basically the story of how this RNA virus SARS-CoV-2 led to a pandemic and it was fought largely through the first at scale mRNA nanoparticle vaccine package. Now, that takes us back to some seminal work of being able to find, giving an mRNA to a person without inciting massive amount of inflammation and the substitution of pseudouridine or uridine in order to do that. Does that really get rid of all the inflammation? Because obviously, as you know, there's been some negativism about mRNA vaccines for that and also for the potential of not having as much immune cell long term activation. Maybe you could speak to that.Tom Cech (10:03):Sure. So the discovery by Kati Karikó and Drew Weissman of the pseudouridine substitution certainly went a long way towards damping down the immune response, the inflammatory response that one naturally gets with an RNA injection. And the reason for that is that our bodies are tuned to be on the lookout for foreign RNA because so many viruses don't even mess with DNA at all. They just have a genome made of RNA. And so, RNA replicating itself is a danger sign. It means that our immune system should be on the lookout for this. And so, in the case of the vaccination, it's really very useful to dampen this down. A lot of people thought that this might make the mRNA vaccines strange or foreign or sort of a drug rather than a natural substance. But in fact, modified nucleotides, nucleotides being the building blocks of RNA, so these modified building blocks such as pseudoU, are in fact found in natural RNAs more in some than in others. And there are about 200 modified versions of the RNA building blocks found in cells. So it's really not an unusual modification or something that's all that foreign, but it was very useful for the vaccines. Now your other question Eric had to do with the, what was your other question, Eric?Eric Topol (11:51):No, when you use mRNA, which is such an extraordinary way to get the spike protein in a controlled way, exposed without the virus to people, and it saved millions of lives throughout the pandemic. But the other question is compared to other vaccine constructs, there's a question of does it give us long term protective immunity, particularly with T cells, both CD8 cytotoxic, maybe also CD4, as I know immunology is not your main area of interest, but that's been a rub that's been put out there, that it isn't just a weaning of immunity from the virus, but also perhaps that the vaccines themselves are not as good for that purpose. Any thoughts on that?Tom Cech (12:43):Well, so my main thought on that is that this is a property of the virus more than of the vaccine. And respiratory viruses are notoriously hard to get long-term immunity. I mean, look at the flu virus. We have to have annual flu shots. If this were like measles, which is a very different kind of virus, one flu shot would protect you against at least that strain of flu for the rest of your life. So I think the bad rap here is not the vaccine's fault nearly as much as it's the nature of respiratory viruses.RNA And Aging Eric Topol (13:27):No, that's extremely helpful. Now, let me switch to an area that's really fascinating, and you've worked quite a bit on the telomerase story because this is, as you know, being pursued quite a bit, has thought, not just because telomeres might indicate something about biologic aging, but maybe they could help us get to an anti-aging remedy or whatever you want to call it. I'm not sure if you call it a treatment, but tell us about this important enzyme, the role of the RNA building telomeres. And maybe you could also connect that with what a lot of people might not be familiar with, at least from years ago when they learned about it, the Hayflick limit.Tom Cech (14:22):Yes. Well, Liz Blackburn and Carol Greider got the Nobel Prize for the discovery of telomerase along with Jack Szostak who did important initial work on that system. And what it does is, is it uses an RNA as a template to extend the ends of human chromosomes, and this allows the cell to keep dividing without end. It gives the cell immortality. Now, when I say immortality, people get very excited, but I'm talking about immortality at the cellular level, not for the whole organism. And in the absence of a mechanism to build out the ends of our chromosomes, the telomeres being the end of the chromosome are incompletely replicated with each cell division. And so, they shrink over time, and when they get critically short, they signal the cell to stop dividing. This is what is called the Hayflick limit, first discovered by Leonard Hayflick in Philadelphia.(15:43):And he, through his careful observations on cells, growing human cells growing in Petri dishes, saw that they could divide about 50 times and then they wouldn't die. They would just enter a state called senescence. They would change shape, they would change their metabolism, but they would importantly quit dividing. And so, we now see this as a useful feature of human biology that this protects us from getting cancer because one of the hallmarks of cancer is immortality of the tumor cells. And so, if you're wishing for your telomeres to be long and your cells to keep dividing, you have to a little bit be careful what you wish for because this is one foot in the door for cancer formation.Eric Topol (16:45):Yeah, I mean, the point is that it seems like the body and the cell is smart to put these cells into the senescent state so they can't divide anymore. And one of the points you made in the book that I think is worth noting is that 90% of cancers have the telomerase, how do you say it?Tom Cech (17:07):Telomerase.Eric Topol (17:08):Yeah, reactivate.Tom Cech (17:09):Right.Eric Topol (17:10):That's not a good sign.Tom Cech (17:12):Right. And there are efforts to try to target telomerase enzyme for therapeutic purposes, although again, it's tricky because we do have stem cells in our bodies, which are the exception to the Hayflick limit rule. They do still have telomerase, they still have to keep dividing, maybe not as rapidly as a cancer cell, but they still keep dividing. And this is critical for the replenishment of certain worn out tissues in our such as skin cells, such as many of our blood cells, which may live only 30 days before they poop out. That's a scientific term for needing to be replenished, right?Eric Topol (18:07):Yeah. Well, that gets me to the everybody's, now I got the buzz about anti-aging, and whether it's senolytics to get rid of these senescent cells or whether it's to rejuvenate the stem cells that are exhausted or work on telomeres, all of these seem to connect with a potential or higher risk of cancer. I wonder what your thoughts are as we go forward using these various biologic constructs to be able to influence the whole organism, the whole human body aging process.Tom Cech (18:47):Yes. My view, and others may disagree is that aging is not an affliction. It's not a disease. It's not something that we should try to cure, but what we should work on is having a healthy life into our senior years. And perhaps you and I are two examples of people who are at that stage of our life. And what we would really like is to achieve, is to be able to be active and useful to society and to our families for a long period of time. So using the information about telomerase, for example, to help our stem cells stay healthy until we are, until we're ready to cash it in. And for that matter on the other side of the coin, to try to inhibit the telomerase in cancer because cancer, as we all know, is a disease of aging, right? There are young people who get cancer, but if you look at the statistics, it's really heavily weighted towards people who've been around a long time because mutations accumulate and other damage to cells that would normally protect against cancer accumulates. And so, we have to target both the degradation of our stem cells, but also the occurrence of cancer, particularly in the more senior population. And knowing more about RNA is really helpful in that regard.RNA DrugsEric Topol (20:29):Yeah. Well, one of the things that comes across throughout the book is versatility of RNA. In fact, you only I think, mentioned somewhere around 12 or 14 of these different RNAs that have a million different shapes, and there's so many other names of different types of RNAs. It's really quite extraordinary. But one of the big classes of RNAs has really hit it. In fact, this week there are two new interfering RNAs that are having extraordinary effects reported in the New England Journal on all the lipids, abnormal triglycerides and LDL cholesterol, APOC3. And can you talk to us about this interfering the small interfering RNAs and how they become, you've mentioned in the book over 400 RNAs are in the clinic now.Tom Cech (21:21):Yeah, so the 400 of course is beyond just the siRNAs, but these, again, a wonderful story about how fundamental science done just to understand how nature works without any particular expectation of a medical spinoff, often can have the most phenomenal and transformative effects on medicine. And this is one of those examples. It came from a roundworm, which is about the size of an eyelash, which a scientist named Sydney Brenner in England had suggested would be a great experimental organism because the entire animal has only about a thousand cells, and it's transparent so we can look at, see where the cells are, we can watch the worm develop. And what Andy Fire and Craig Mello found in this experimental worm was that double-stranded RNA, you think about DNA is being double-stranded and RNA as being single stranded. But in this case, it was an unusual case where the RNA was forming a double helix, and these little pieces of double helical RNA could turn off the expression of genes in the worm.(22:54):And that seemed remarkable and powerful. But as often happens in biology, at least for those of us who believe in evolution, what goes for the worm goes for the human as well. So a number of scientists quickly found that the same process was going on in the human body as a natural way of regulating the expression of our genes, which means how much of a particular gene product is actually going to be made in a particular cell. But not only was it a natural process, but you could introduce chemically synthesized double helical RNAs. There are only 23 base pairs, 23 units of RNA long, so they're pretty easy to chemically synthesize. And that once these are introduced into a human, the machinery that's already there grabs hold of them and can be used to turn off the expression of a disease causing RNA or the gene makes a messenger RNA, and then this double-stranded RNA can suppress its action. So this has become the main company that is known for doing this is Alnylam in Boston, Cambridge. And they have made quite a few successful products based on this technology.Eric Topol (24:33):Oh, absolutely. Not just for amyloidosis, but as I mentioned these, they even have a drug that's being tested now, as you know that you could take once or twice a year to manage your blood pressure. Wouldn't that be something instead of a pill every day? And then of course, all these others that are not just from Alnylam, but other companies I wasn't even familiar with for managing lipids, which is taking us well beyond statins and these, so-called PCSK9 monoclonal antibodies, so it's really blossoming. Now, the other group of RNA drugs are antisense drugs, and it seemed like they took forever to warm up, and then finally they hit. And can you distinguish the antisense versus the siRNA therapeutics?Tom Cech (25:21):Yes, in a real general sense, there's some similarity as well as some differences, but the antisense, what are called oligonucleotides, whoa, that's a big word, but oligo just means a few, right? And nucleotides is just the building blocks of nucleic acid. So you have a string of a few of these. And again, it's the power of RNA that it is so good at specifically base pairing only with matching sequences. So if you want to match with a G in a target messenger RNA, you put a C in the antisense because G pairs with C, if you want to put an A, if want to match with an A, you put a U in the antisense because A and U form a base pair U is the RNA equivalent of T and DNA, but they have the same coding capacity. So any school kid can write out on a notepad or on their laptop what the sequence would have to be of an antisense RNA to specifically pair with a particular mRNA.(26:43):And this has been, there's a company in your neck of the woods in the San Diego area. It started out with the name Isis that turned out to be the wrong Egyptian God to name your company after, so they're now known as Ionis. Hopefully that name will be around for a while. But they've been very successful in modifying these antisense RNAs or nucleic acids so that they are stable in the body long enough so that they can pair with and thereby inhibit the expression of particular target RNAs. So it has both similarities and differences from the siRNAs, but the common denominator is RNA is great stuff.RNA and Genome EditingEric Topol (27:39):Well, you have taken that to in catalyst, the catalyst, you've proven that without a doubt and you and so many other extraordinary scientists over the years, cumulatively. Now, another way to interfere with genes is editing. And of course, you have a whole chapter devoted to not just well CRISPR, but the whole genome editing field. And by the way, I should note that I forgot because I had read the Codebreaker and we recently spoke Jennifer Doudna and I, that she was in your lab as a postdoc and you made some wonderful comments about her. I don't know if you want to reflect about having Jennifer, did you know that she was going to do some great things in her career?Tom Cech (28:24):Oh, there was no question about it, Eric. She had been a star graduate student at Harvard, had published a series of breathtaking papers in magazines such as Science and Nature already as a graduate student. She won a Markey fellowship to come to Colorado. She chose a very ambitious project trying to determine the molecular structures of folded RNA molecules. We only had one example at the time, and that was the transfer RNA, which is involved in protein synthesis. And here she was trying these catalytic RNAs, which we had discovered, which were much larger than tRNA and was making great progress, which she finished off as an assistant professor at Yale. So what the general public may not know was that in scientific, in the scientific realm, she was already highly appreciated and much awarded before she even heard anything about CRISPR.Eric Topol (29:38):Right. No, it was a great line you have describing her, “she had an uncanny talent for designing just the right experiment to test any hypothesis, and she possessed more energy and drive than any scientist I'd ever met.” That's pretty powerful. Now getting into CRISPR, the one thing, it's amazing in just a decade to see basically the discovery of this natural system to then be approved by FDA for sickle cell disease and beta thalassemia. However, the way it exists today, it's very primitive. It's not actually fixing the gene that's responsible, it's doing a workaround plan. It's got double strand breaks in the DNA. And obviously there's better ways of editing, which are going to obviously involve RNA epigenetic editing, if you will as well. What is your sense about the future of genome editing?Tom Cech (30:36):Yeah, absolutely, Eric. It is primitive right now. These initial therapies are way too expensive as well to make them broadly applicable to the entire, even in a relatively wealthy country like the United States, we need to drive the cost down. We need to get them to work, we need to get the process of introducing them into the CRISPR machinery into the human body to be less tedious and less time consuming. But you've got to start somewhere. And considering that the Charpentier and Doudna Nobel Prize winning discovery was in 2012, which is only a dozen years ago, this is remarkable progress. More typically, it takes 30 years from a basic science discovery to get a medical product with about a 1% chance of it ever happening. And so, this is clearly a robust RNA driven machine. And so, I think the future is bright. We can talk about that some more, but I don't want to leave RNA out of this conversation, Eric. So what's cool about CRISPR is its incredible specificity. Think of the human genome as a million pages of text file on your computer, a million page PDF, and now CRISPR can find one sentence out of that million pages that matches, and that's because it's using RNA, again, the power of RNA to form AU and GC base pairs to locate just one site in our whole DNA, sit down there and direct this Cas9 enzyme to cut the DNA at that site and start the repair process that actually does the gene editing.Eric Topol (32:41):Yeah, it's pretty remarkable. And the fact that it can be so precise and it's going to get even more precise over time in terms of the repair efforts that are needed to get it back to an ideal state. Now, the other thing I wanted to get into with you a bit is on the ribosome, because that applies to antibiotics and as you call it, the mothership. And I love this metaphor that you had about the ribosome, and in the book, “the ribosome is your turntable, the mRNA is the vinyl LP record, and the protein is the music you hear when you lower the needle.” Tell us more about the ribosome and the role of antibiotics.Tom Cech (33:35):So do you think today's young people will understand that metaphor?Eric Topol (33:40):Oh, they probably will. They're making a comeback. These records are making a comeback.Tom Cech (33:44):Okay. Yes, so this is a good analogy in that the ribosome is so versatile it's able to play any music that you feed at the right messenger RNA to make the music being the protein. So you can have in the human body, we have tens of thousands of different messenger RNAs. Each one threads through the same ribosome and spills out the production of whatever protein matches that mRNA. And so that's pretty remarkable. And what Harry Noller at UC Santa Cruz and later the crystallographers Venki Ramakrishnan, Tom Steitz, Ada Yonath proved really through their studies was that this is an RNA machine. It was hard to figure that out because the ribosome has three RNAs and it has dozens of proteins as well. So for a long time people thought it must be one of those proteins that was the heart and soul of the record player, so to speak.RNA and Antibiotics(34:57):And it turned out that it was the RNA. And so, when therefore these scientists, including Venki who you just talked to, looked at where these antibiotics docked on the ribosome, they found that they were blocking the key functional parts of the RNA. So it was really, the antibiotics knew what they were doing long before we knew what they were doing. They were talking to and obstructing the action of the ribosomal RNA. Why is this a good thing for us? Because bacterial ribosomes are just enough different from human ribosomes that there are drugs that will dock to the bacterial ribosomal RNA, throw a monkey wrench into the machine, prevent it from working, but the human ribosomes go on pretty much unfazed.Eric Topol (36:00):Yeah, no, the backbone of our antibiotics relies on this. So I think people need to understand about the two subunits, the large and the small and this mothership, and you illuminate that so really well in the book. That also brings me to phage bacteria phage, and we haven't seen that really enter the clinic in a significant way, but there seems to be a great opportunity. What's your view about that?Tom Cech (36:30):This is an idea that goes way back because since bacteria have their own viruses which do not infect human cells, why not repurpose those into little therapeutic entities that could kill, for example, what would we want to kill? Well, maybe tuberculosis has been very resistant to drugs, right? There are drug resistant strains of TB, yes, of TB, tuberculosis, and especially in immunocompromised individuals, this bug runs rampant. And so, I don't know the status of that. It's been challenging, and this is the way that biomedicine works, is that for every 10 good ideas, and I would say phage therapy for bacterial disease is a good idea. For every 10 such ideas, one of them ends up being practical. And the other nine, maybe somebody else will come along and find a way to make it work, but it hasn't been a big breakthrough yet.RNA, Aptamers and ProteinsEric Topol (37:54):Yeah, no, it's really interesting. And we'll see. It may still be in store. What about aptamers? Tell us a little bit more about those, because they have been getting used a lot in sorting out the important plasma proteins as therapies. What are aptamers and what do you see as the future in that regard?Tom Cech (38:17):Right. Well, in fact, aptamers are a big deal in Boulder because Larry Gold in town was one of the discoverers has a company making aptamers to recognize proteins. Jack Szostak now at University of Chicago has played a big role. And also at your own institution, Jerry Joyce, your president is a big aptamer guy. And you can evolution, normally we think about it as happening out in the environment, but it turns out you can also make it work in the laboratory. You can make it work much faster in the laboratory because you can set up test tube experiments where molecules are being challenged to perform a particular task, like for example, binding to a protein to inactivate it. And if you make a large community of RNA molecules randomly, 99.999% of them aren't going to know how to do this. What are the odds? Very low.(39:30):But just by luck, there will be an occasional molecule of RNA that folds up into a shape that actually fits into the proteins active sighting throws a monkey wrench into the works. Okay, so now that's one in a billion. How are you going to find that guy? Well, this is where the polymerase chain reaction, the same one we use for the COVID-19 tests for infection comes into play. Because if you can now isolate this needle in a haystack and use PCR to amplify it and make a whole handful of it, now you've got a whole handful of molecules which are much better at binding this protein than the starting molecule. And now you can go through this cycle several times to enrich for these, maybe mutagen it a little bit more to give it a little more diversity. We all know diversity is good, so you put a little more diversity into the population and now you find some guy that's really good at recognizing some disease causing protein. So this is the, so-called aptamer story, and they have been used therapeutically with some success, but diagnostically certainly they are extremely useful. And it's another area where we've had success and the future could hold even more success.Eric Topol (41:06):I think what you're bringing up is so important because the ability to screen that tens of thousands of plasma proteins in a person and coming up with as Tony Wyss-Coray did with the organ clocks, and this is using the SomaLogic technology, and so much is going on now to get us not just the polygenic risk scores, but also these proteomic scores to compliment that at our orthogonal, if you will, to understand risk of people for diseases so we can prevent them, which is fulfilling a dream we've never actually achieved so far.Tom Cech (41:44):Eric, just for full disclosure, I'm on the scientific advisory board of SomaLogic in Boulder. I should disclose that.Eric Topol (41:50):Well, that was smart. They needed to have you, so thank you for mentioning that. Now, before I wrap up, well, another area that is a favorite of mine is citizen science. And you mentioned in the book a project because the million shapes of RNA and how it can fold with all hairpin terms turns and double stranded and whatever you name it, that there was this project eteRNA that was using citizen scientists to characterize and understand folding of RNA. Can you tell us about that?RNA Folding and Citizen ScienceTom Cech (42:27):So my friend Rhiju Das, who's a professor at Stanford University, sort of adopted what had been done with protein folding by one of his former mentors, David Baker in Seattle, and had repurposed this for RNA folding. So the idea is to come up with a goal, a target for the community. Can you design an RNA that will fold up to look like a four pointed cross or a five pointed star? And it turned out that, so they made it into a contest and they had tens of thousands of people playing these games and coming up with some remarkable solutions. But then they got a little bit more practical, said, okay, that was fun, but can we have the community design something like a mRNA for the SARS-CoV-2 spike protein to make maybe a more stable vaccine? And quite remarkably, the community of many of whom are just gamers who really don't know much about what RNA does, were able to find some solutions. They weren't enormous breakthroughs, but they got a several fold, several hundred percent increase in stability of the RNA by making it fold more tightly. So I just find it to be a fascinating approach to science. Somebody of my generation would never think of this, but I think for today's generation, it's great when citizens can become involved in research at that level.Eric Topol (44:19):Oh, I think it's extraordinary. And of course, there are other projects folded and others that have exemplified this ability for people with no background in science to contribute in a meaningful way, and they really enjoy, it's like solving a puzzle. The last point is kind of the beginning, the origin of life, and you make a pretty strong case, Tom, that it was RNA. You don't say it definitively, but maybe you can say it here.RNA and the Origin of LifeTom Cech (44:50):Well, Eric, the origin of life happening almost 4 billion years ago on our primitive planet is sort of a historical question. I mean, if you really want to know what happened then, well, we don't have any video surveillance of those moments. So scientists hate to ever say never, but it's hard to sort of believe how we would ever know for sure. So what Leslie Orgel at the Salk Institute next to you taught me when I was a starting assistant professor is even though we'll never know for sure, if we can recapitulate in the laboratory plausible events that could have happened, and if they make sense chemically and biologically, then that's pretty satisfying, even if we can never be absolutely sure. That's what a number of scientists have done in this field is to show that RNA is sort of a, that all the chemistry sort of points to RNA as being something that could have been made under prebiotic conditions and could have folded up into a way that could solve the greatest of all chicken and egg problems, which came first, the informational molecule to pass down to the next generation or the active molecule that could copy that information.(46:32):So now that we know that RNA has both of those abilities, maybe at the beginning there was just this RNA world RNA copying itself, and then proteins came along later, and then DNA probably much more recently as a useful but a little bit boring of genetic information, right?Eric Topol (46:59):Yeah. Well, that goes back to that cover of the Economist 17 years ago, the Big Bang, and you got me convinced that this is a pretty strong story and candidate. Now what a fun chance to discuss all this with you in an extraordinary book, Tom. Did I miss anything that you want to bring up?Tom Cech (47:21):Eric, I just wanted to say that I not only appreciate our conversation, but I also appreciate all you are doing to bring science to the non-scientist public. I think people like me who have taught a lot of freshmen in chemistry, general chemistry, sort of think that that's the level that we need to aim at. But I think that those kids have had science in high school year after year. We need to aim at the parents of those college freshmen who are intelligent, who are intellectually curious, but have not had science courses in a long time. And so, I'm really joining with you in trying to avoid jargon as much as possible. Use simple language, use analogies and metaphors, and try to share the excitement of what we're doing in the laboratory with the populace.Eric Topol (48:25):Well, you sure did that it was palpable. And I thought about it when I read the book about how lucky it would be to be a freshman at the University of Boulder and be having you as the professor. My goodness. Well, thank you so much. This has been so much fun, Tom, and I hope everybody's going to get out there and read the Catalyst to get all the things that we didn't even get a chance to dive into. But this has been great and look forward to future interactions with you.Tom Cech (48:53):Take care, Eric.*********************Thanks for listening or reading this edition of Ground Truths.Please share this podcast with your friends and network. That tells me you found it informative and makes the effort in doing these worthwhile.All Ground Truths newsletters and podcast are free. Voluntary paid subscriptions all go to support Scripps Research. Many thanks for that—they greatly helped fund our summer internship programs for 2023 and 2024.Thanks to my producer Jessica Nguyen and Sinjun Balabanoff for audio and video support at Scripps Research.Note: you can select preferences to receive emails about newsletters, podcasts, or all I don't want to bother you with an email for content that you're not interested in. Get full access to Ground Truths at erictopol.substack.com/subscribe

Editor's Summary by Christopher W. Seymour, MD, MSc, Associate Editor of JAMA, the Journal of the American Medical Association, for the May 14, 2024, issue.

Transcript Eric Topol (00:06):Well, hello, this is Eric Topol with Ground Truths and I am absolutely thrilled to welcome Daphne Koller, the founder and CEO of insitro, and a person who I've been wanting to meet for some time. Finally, we converged so welcome, Daphne.Daphne Koller (00:21):Thank you Eric. And it's a pleasure to finally meet you as well.Eric Topol (00:24):Yeah, I mean you have been rocking everybody over the years with elected to the National Academy of Engineering and Science and right at the interface of life science and computer science and in my view, there's hardly anyone I can imagine who's doing so much at that interface. I wanted to first start with your meeting in Davos last month because I kind of figured we start broad AI rather than starting to get into what you're doing these days. And you had a really interesting panel [←transcript] with Yann LeCun, Andrew Ng and Kai-Fu Lee and others, and I wanted to get your impression about that and also kind of the general sense. I mean AI is just moving it at speed, that is just crazy stuff. What were your thoughts about that panel just last month, where are we?Video link for the WEF PanelDaphne Koller (01:25):I think we've been living on an exponential curve for multiple decades and the thing about exponential curves is they are very misleading things. In the early stages people basically take the line between whatever we were last year, and this year and they interpolate linearly, and they say, God, things are moving so slowly. Then as the exponential curve starts to pick up, it becomes more and more evident that things are moving faster, but it's still people interpolate linearly and it's only when things really hit that inflection point that people realize that even with the linear interpolation where we'll be next year is just mind blowing. And if you realize that you're on that exponential curve where we will be next year is just totally unanticipatable. I think what we started to discuss in that panel was, are we in fact on an exponential curve? What are the rate limiting factors that may or may not enable that curve to continue specifically availability of data and what it would take to make that curve available in areas outside of the speech, whatever natural language, large language models that exist today and go far beyond that, which is what you would need to have these be applicable to areas such as biology and medicine.Daphne Koller (02:47):And so that was kind of the message to my mind from the panel.Eric Topol (02:53):And there was some differences in opinion, of course Yann can be a little strong and I think it was good to see that you're challenging on some things and how there is this “world view” of AI and how, I guess where we go from here. As you mentioned in the area of life science, there already had been before large language models hit stride, so much progress particularly in imaging cells, subcellular, I mean rare cells, I mean just stuff that was just without any labeling, without fluorescein, just amazing stuff. And then now it's gone into another level. So as we get into that, just before I do that, I want to ask you about this convergence story. Jensen Huang, I'm sure you heard his quote about biology as the opportunity to be engineering, not science. I'm sure if I understand, not science, but what about this convergence? Because it is quite extraordinary to see two fields coming together moving at such high velocity."Biology has the opportunity to be engineering not science. When something becomes engineering not science it becomes...exponentially improving, it can compound on the benefits of previous years." -Jensen Huang, NVIDIA.Daphne Koller (04:08):So, a quote that I will replace Jensen's or will propose a replacement for Jensen's quote, which is one that many people have articulated, is that math is to physics as machine learning is to biology. It is a mathematical foundation that allows you to take something that up until that point had been kind of mysterious and fuzzy and almost magical and create a formal foundation for it. Now physics, especially Newtonian physics, is simple enough that math is the right foundation to capture what goes on in a lot of physics. Biology as an evolved natural system is so complex that you can't articulate a mathematical model for that de novo. You need to actually let the data speak and then let machine learning find the patterns in those data and really help us create a predictability, if you will, for biological systems that you can start to ask what if questions, what would happen if we perturb the system in this way?The ConvergenceDaphne Koller (05:17):How would it react? We're nowhere close to being able to answer those questions reliably today, but as you feed a machine learning system more and more data, hopefully it'll become capable of making those predictions. And in order to do that, and this is where it comes to this convergence of these two disciplines, the fodder, the foundation for all of machine learning is having enough data to feed the beast. The miracle of the convergence that we're seeing is that over the last 10, 15 years, maybe 20 years in biology, we've been on a similar, albeit somewhat slower exponential curve of data generation in biology where we are turning it into a quantitative discipline from something that is entirely observational qualitative, which is where it started, to something that becomes much more quantitative and broad based in how we measure biology. And so those measurements, the tools that life scientists and bioengineers have developed that allow us to measure biological systems is what produces that fodder, that energy that you can then feed into the machine learning models so that they can start making predictions.Eric Topol (06:32):Yeah, well I think the number of layers of data no less what's in these layers is quite extraordinary. So some years ago when all the single cell sequencing was started, I said, well, that's kind of academic interest and now the field of spatial omics has exploded. And I wonder how you see the feeding the beast here. It's at every level. It's not just the cell level subcellular and single cell nuclei sequencing single cell epigenomics, and then you go all the way to these other layers of data. I know you plug into the human patient side as well as it could be images, it could be past slides, it could be the outcomes and treatments and on and on and on. I mean, so when you think about multimodal AI, has anybody really done that yet?Daphne Koller (07:30):I think that there are certainly beginnings of multimodal AI and we have started to see some of the benefits of the convergence of say, imaging and omics. And I will give an example from some of the work that we've recently distributed on a preprint server work that we did at insitro, which took imaging data from standard histopathology slides, H&E slides and aligned them with simple bulk RNA-Seq taken from those same tumor samples. And what we find is that by training models that translate from one to the other, specifically from the imaging to the omics, you're able to, for a fairly large fraction of genes, make very accurate predictions of gene expression levels by looking at the histopath images alone. And in fact, because many of the predictions are made at the tile level, not at the entire slide level, even though the omics was captured in bulk, you're able to spatially resolve the signal and get kind of like a pseudo spatial biology just by making predictions from the H&E image into these omic modalities.Multimodal A.I. and Life ScienceDaphne Koller (08:44):So there are I think beginnings of multimodality, but in order to get to multimodality, you really need to train on at least some data where the two modalities are simultaneously. And so at this point, I think the rate limiting factor is more a matter of data acquisition for training the models. It is for building the models themselves. And so that's where I think things like spatial biology, which I think like you are very excited about, are one of the places where we can really start to capture these paired modalities and get to some of those multimodal capabilities.Eric Topol (09:23):Yeah, I wanted to ask you because I mean spatial temporal is so perfect. It is two modes, and you have as the preprint you refer to and you see things like electronic health records in genomics, electronic health records in medical images. The most we've done is getting two modes of data together. And the question is as this data starts to really accrue, do we need new models to work with it or do you actually foresee that that is not a limiting step?Daphne Koller (09:57):So I think currently data availability is the most significant rate limiting step. The nice thing about modern day machine learning is that it really is structured as a set of building blocks that you can start to put together in different ways for different situations. And so, do we have the exact right models available to us today for these multimodal systems? Probably not, but do we have the right building blocks that if we creatively put them together from what has already been deployed in other settings? Probably, yes. So of course there's still a model exploration to be done and a lot of creativity in how these building blocks should be put together, but I think we have the tools available to solve these problems. What we really need is first I think a really significant data acquisition effort. And the other thing that we need, which is also something that has been a priority for us at insitro, is the right mix of people to be put together so that you can, because what happens is if you take a bunch of even extremely talented and sophisticated machine learning scientists and say, solve a biological problem, here's a dataset, they don't know what questions to ask and oftentimes end up asking questions that might be kind of interesting from machine learning perspective, but don't really answer fundamental biology questions.Daphne Koller (11:16):And conversely, you can take biologists and say, hey, what would you have machine learning do? And they will tell you, well, in our work we do A to B to C to D, and B to C is kind of painful, like counting nuclei is really painful, so can we have the machine do that for us? And it's kind of like that. Yeah, but that's boring. So what you get if you put them in a room together and actually get to the point where they communicate with each other effectively, is that not only do you get better solutions, you get better problems. I think that's really the crux of making progress here besides data is the culture and the people.A.I. and Drug DiscoveryEric Topol (11:54):Well, I'm sure you've assembled that at insitro knowing you, and I mean people tend to forget it's about the people, it's not about the models or even the data when you have all that. Now you've been onto drug discovery paths, there's at least 20 drugs that are AI driven that are in the clinic in phase one or two at some point. Obviously these are not only ones that you've been working on, but do you see this whole field now going into high gear because of this? Or is that the fact that there's all these AI companies partnering with big pharma? Is it a lot of nice agreements that are drawn up with multimillion dollar milestones or is this real?Daphne Koller (12:47):So there's a number of different layers to your question. First of all, let me start by saying that I find the notion of AI driven drugs to be a bit of a weird concept because over time most drugs will have some element of AI in them. I mean, even some of the earlier work used data science in many cases. So where do you draw the boundary? I mean, we're not going to be in a world anytime soon where AI starts out with, oh, I need to work on ALS and at the end there is a clinical trial design ready to be submitted to the FDA without anything, any human intervention in the middle. So, it's always going to be an interplay between a machine and a human with over time more and more capabilities I think being taken on by the machine, but I think inevitably a partnership for a long time to come.Daphne Koller (13:41):But coming to the second part of your question, is this real? Every big pharma has gotten to the point today that they realize they need some of that AI thing that's going around. The level of sophistication of how they incorporate that and their willingness to make some of the hard decisions of, well, if we're going to be doing this with AI, it means we shouldn't be doing it the old way anymore and we need to make a big dramatic internal shift that I think depends very much on the specific company. And some companies have more willingness to take those very big steps than others, so will some companies be able to make the adjustment? Probably. Will all of them? Probably not. I would say however, that in this new world there is also room for companies to emerge that are, if you will, AI native.Daphne Koller (14:39):And we've seen that in every technological revolution that the native companies that were born in the new age move faster, incorporate the technology much more deeply into every aspect of their work, and they end up being dominant players if not the dominant player in that new world. And you could look at the internet revolution and think back to Google did not emerge from the yellow pages. Netflix did not emerge from blockbuster, Amazon did not emerge from Walmart so some of those incumbents did make the adjustment and are still around, some did not and are no longer around. And I think the same thing will happen with drug discovery and development where there will be a new crop of leading companies to I think maybe together with some of the incumbents that we're able to make the adjustment.Eric Topol (15:36):Yeah, I think your point there is essential, and another part of this story is that a lot of people don't realize there's so many nodes of ways that AI can facilitate this whole process. I mean from the elemental data mining that identified Baricitinib for Covid and now being used even for many other indications, repurposing that to how to simulate for clinical trials and everything in between. Now, what seems like because of your incredible knack and this convergence, I mean your middle name is like convergence really, you are working at the level of really in my view, this unique aspect of bringing cells and all the other layers of data together to amp things up. Is that a fair assessment of where insitro in your efforts are directed?Three BucketsDaphne Koller (16:38):So first of all, maybe it's useful to kind of create the high level map and the simplest version I've heard is where you divide the process into three major buckets. One is what you think of as biology discovery, which is the discovery of new therapeutic hypotheses. Basically, if you modulate this target in this group of humans, you will end up affecting this clinical outcome. That's the first third. The middle third is, okay, well now we need to turn that hypothesis into an actual molecule that does that. So basically generating molecules. And then finally there's the enablement and acceleration of the clinical development process, which is the final third. Most companies in the AI space have really focused in on that middle third because it is well-defined, you know when you've succeeded if someone gives you a target and what's called a target product profile (TPP) at the end of whatever, two, three years, whether you've been able to create a molecule that achieves the appropriate properties of selectivity and solubility and all those other things. The first third is where a lot of the mistakes currently happen in drug discovery and development. Most drugs that go into the clinic don't fail because we didn't have the right molecule. I mean that happens, but it's not the most common failure mode. The most common failure mode is that the target was just a wrong target for this disease in this patient population.Daphne Koller (18:09):So the real focus of us, the core of who we are as a company is on that early third of let's make sure we're going after the right clinical hypotheses. Now with that, obviously we need to make molecules and some of those molecules we make in-house, and obviously we use machine learning to do that as well. And then the last third is we discover that if you have the right therapeutic hypothesis, which includes which is the right patient population, that can also accelerate and enable your clinical trials, so we end up doing some of that as well. But the core of what we believe is the failure mode of drug discovery and what it's going to take to move it to the next level is the articulation of therapeutic hypotheses that actually translate into clinical outcome. And so in order to do that, we've put together, to your point about convergence, two very distinct types of data.Daphne Koller (19:04):One is data that we print in our own internal data factory where we have this incredible set of capabilities that uses stem cells and CRISPR and microscopy and single cell measurements and spatial biology and all that to generate massive amounts of in-house data. And then because ultimately you care not about curing cells, you care about curing people, you also need to bring in the clinical data. And again, here also we look at multiple high content data modalities, imaging and omics, and of course human genetics, which is one of the few sources of ground truth for causality that is available in medicine and really bring all those different data modalities across these two different scales together to come up with what we believe are truly high quality therapeutic hypotheses that we then advance into the clinic.AlphaFold2, the ExemplarEric Topol (19:56):Yeah, no, I think that's an extraordinary approach. It's a bold, ambitious one, but at least it is getting to the root of what is needed. One of the things you mentioned of course, is the coming up with molecules, and I wanted to get your comments about the AlphaFold2 world and the ability to not just design proteins now of course that are not extant proteins, but it isn't just proteins, it could be antibodies, it could be peptides and small molecules. How much does that contribute to your perspective?Daphne Koller (20:37):So first of all, let me say that I consider the AlphaFold story across its incarnations to be one of the best examples of the hypothesis that we set out trying to achieve or trying to prove, which is if you feed a machine learning model enough data, it will learn to do amazing things. And the space of protein folding is one of those areas where there has been enough data in biology that is the sequence to structure mapping is something that over the years, because it's so consistent across different cells, across different species even, we have a lot of data of sequence to structure, which is what enabled AlphaFold to be successful. Now since then, of course, they've taken it to a whole new level. I think what we are currently able to do with protein-based therapeutics is entirely sort of a consequence of that line of development. Whether that same line of development is also going to unlock other therapeutic modalities such as small molecules where the amount of data is unfortunately much less abundant and often locked away in the bowels of big pharma companies that are not eager to share.Daphne Koller (21:57):I think that question remains. I have not yet seen that same level of performance in de novo design of small molecule therapeutics because of the data availability limitations. Now people have a lot of creative ideas about that. We use DNA encoded libraries as a way of generating data at scale for small molecules. Others have used other approaches including active learning and pre-training and all sorts of approaches like that. We're still waiting, I think for a truly convincing demonstration that you can get to that same level of de novo design in small molecules as you can in protein therapeutics. Now as to how that affects us, I'm so excited about this development because our focus, as I mentioned, is the discovery of novel therapeutic hypotheses. You then need to turn those therapeutic hypotheses into actual molecules that do the work. We know we're not going to be the expert in every single therapeutic modality from small molecules to macro cycles, to the proteins to mRNA, siRNA, there's so many of those that you need to have therapeutic modality experts in each of those modalities that can then as you discover a target that you want to modulate, you can basically go and ask what is the right partner to help turn this into an actual therapeutic intervention?Daphne Koller (23:28):And we've already had some conversations with some modality partners as we like to call them that help us take some of our hypotheses and turn it into molecules. They often are very hungry for new targets because they oftentimes kind of like, okay, here's the three or four or whatever, five low hanging fruits that our technology uniquely unlocks. But then once you get past those well validated targets like, okay, what's next? Am I just going to go read a bunch of papers and hope for the best? And so oftentimes they're looking for new hypotheses and we're looking for partners to make molecules. It's a great partnership.Can We Slow the Aging Process?Eric Topol (24:07):Oh yeah, no question about that. Now, we've seen in recent times some leaps in drugs that were worked on for decades, like the GLP-1s for obesity, which are having effects potentially well beyond obesity didn't require any AI, but just slogging away at it for decades. And you previously were at Calico, which is trying to deal with aging. Do you think that we're going to see drug interventions that are going to slow the aging process because of this unique time of this exponential point we are in where we're a computer and science and digital biology come together?Daphne Koller (24:52):So I think the GLP-1s are an incredible achievement. And I would point out, I know you said and incorrectly that it didn't use any AI, but they did actually use an understanding of human genetics. And I think human genetics and the genotype phenotype statistical associations that they revealed is in some ways the biological precursor to AI it is a way of leveraging very large amounts of data, admittedly using simpler statistical tools, but still to discover in a data-driven way, novel therapeutic hypothesis. So I consider the work that we do to be a progeny of the kind of work that statistical geneticists have done. And of course a lot of heavy lifting needed to be done after that in order to make a drug that actually worked and kudos to the leaders in that space. In terms of the modulation of aging, I mean aging is a process of decline over time, and the rate of that decline is definitely something that is modifiable.Daphne Koller (26:07):And we all know that external factors such as lifestyle, diet, exercise, even exposure to sun or smoking, accelerates the aging process. And you could easily imagine, as we've seen in the GLP-1s that a therapeutic intervention can change that trajectory. So will we be able to using therapeutic interventions, increase health span so that we live healthy longer? I think the answer to that is undoubtedly, yes. And we've seen that consistently with therapeutic interventions, not even just the GLP-1s, but going backwards, I mean even statins and earlier things. Will we be able to increase the maximum life span so that people habitually live past 120, 150? I don't know. I don't know that anybody knows the answer to that question. I personally would be quite happy with increasing my health span so that at the age of 80, I'm still able to actively go hiking and scuba diving at 90 and 100 and that would be a pretty good place to start.Eric Topol (27:25):Well, I'm with you on that, but I just want to ask though, because the drugs we have today that are highly effective, I mean statins is a good example. They work at a particular level of the body. They don't have across the board modulation of effect. And I guess what I was asking is, do you foresee we will have some way to do that across all systems? I mean, that is getting to, now that we have so many different ways to intervene on the process, is there a way that you envision in the future that we'll be able to here, I'm not talking about in expanding lifespan, I'm talking about promoting health, whether it's the immune system or whether it's through mitochondria and mTOR, caloric, I mean all these different things you think that's conceivable or is that just, I mean companies like Calico and others have been chasing this. What do you think?Daphne Koller (28:30):Again, I think it's a thing that is hard to predict. I mean, we know that different organ systems age at different rates, and is there a single bio even in a single individual, and it's been well established that you can test brain age versus muscle health versus cardiovascular, and they can be quite different in the same individual, so is there a single hub? No, that governs all forms of aging. I don't know if that's true. I think it's oftentimes different. We know protein folding has an effect, you know DNA damage has an effect. That's why our skin ages because it's exposed to sun. Is there going to be a single switch that reverts it all back? Certainly some companies are pursuing that single bullet approach. I personally would probably say that based on the biology that I've seen, there's at least as much potential in trying to find ways to slow the decline in a way that specific to say as we discussed the immune system or correcting protein, misfolding dysfunction or things like that. And I'm not dismissing there is a single magic switch, but let's just say I think we should be exploring multiple alternatives.Eric Topol (29:58):Yeah, no, I like your reasoning. I think it's actually like everything else you said here. It makes a lot of sense. The logic is hard to argue with. Well, I think what you're doing there at insitro is remarkable and it seems to be quite distinct from other strategies, and that's not at all surprising knowing your background and your aspiration.Daphne Koller (30:27):Never like to follow the crowd. It's boring.Eric Topol (30:30):Right, and I do know you left an aging directed company effort at Calico to do what you're doing. So that must have been an opening for you that you saw was much more diverse perhaps, or maybe I'm mistaken that Calico is not really age specific in its goals.Daphne Koller (30:49):So what inspired me to go found insitro was the realization that we are making medicines today in a way that is not that different from the way in which we were making medicines 20 or 30 years ago in terms of the process by which we go from a, here's what I want to work on to here's a drug is a very much an artisanal one-off each one of them is a snowflake. There is very little commonality and sharing of insights and infrastructure across those efforts except in relatively limited tool-based ways. And I wanted to change that. I wanted to take the tools of engineering and data and machine learning and build a very different approach of going from a problem definition to a therapeutic intervention. And it didn't make sense to build that within a company that's focused on any single biology, not just aging because it is such a broad-based foundation.Daphne Koller (31:58):And I will tell you that I think we are on the path to building the thing that I set out to build. And as one example of that, I will use the work that we've recently done in metabolic disease where based on the foundations that we've built using both the clinical machine learning work and the cellular machine learning work, we were able to go from a problem articulation of this is the indication that we want to work on to a proof of concept in a translatable animal model in one year. That is pretty unusual. Admittedly, this is with an SiRNA tool compound. Nice thing about things that are liver directed is that it's not that difficult of a path to go from an SiRNA tool compound to an actual SiRNA drug. And so hopefully that's a fairly linear journey from there even, which is great.Daphne Koller (32:51):But the fact that we were able to go from problem articulation to a proof of concept in a translatable animal model in one year, that is unusual. And we're starting to see that now across our other therapeutic areas. It takes a long time to build a platform because you're basically building a foundation. It's like, okay, where's the fruit of all of that? I mean, you're building and building and building and nothing comes out for a while because you're building so much of the infrastructure. But once you've built it, you turn the crank and stuff starts to come out, you turn the crank again, and it works faster and better than the previous time. And so the essence of what we've built and what has turned into the tagline for the company is what we call pipeline through platform, which is we're building a pipeline of therapeutic interventions that comes off of a platform. And that's rare in biopharma, the only platform companies that really have emerged by and larger therapeutic modality platforms, things like Moderna and Alnylam, which have gotten really good at a particular modality and that's awesome. We're building a discovery platform and that is a fairly unusual thing.Eric Topol (34:02):Right. Well, I have no doubt you'll be discovering a lot of important things. That one sounds like it could be a big impact on NASH.Daphne Koller (34:14):Yeah, we hope so.Eric Topol (34:14):A big unmet need that's not going to be fixed by what we have today. So Daphne, it's really a joy to talk with you and palpable enthusiasm for where the field is going as one of its real leaders and we'll be cheering for you. I hope we'll reconnect in the times ahead to get another progress report because you're definitely rocking it there and you've got a lot of great ideas for how to change the life science medical world of the future.Daphne Koller (34:48):Thank you so much. It's a pleasure to meet you, and it's a long and difficult journey, but I think we're on the right path, so looking forward to seeing that all that pan out.Eric Topol (34:58):You made a compelling case in a short visit, so thank you.Daphne Koller (35:02):Thank you so much.Thanks for your subscription and listening/reading these posts.All content on Ground Truths—newsletter analyses and podcasts—is free.Voluntary paid subscriptions all go to support Scripps Research. Get full access to Ground Truths at erictopol.substack.com/subscribe

Newly discovered RNAs form a whole new category of the versatile biomolecule RNA.  These "new" RNAs are tiny relative to the RNAs already characterized.  Nicknamed, miRNA, siRNA and piwiRNA, they are involved in regulating a host of cellular functions and even pass on hereditary traits.

In this episode, Nancy Reau, MD, discusses new data on hepatitis B virus presented at AASLD 2023, including:Current therapiesStudies 108 and 110: Factors Linked With Lack of Virologic Suppression After 8 Yr of TAF or TDFKaiser Permanente Northern California: HCC or Death With TDF vs ETV for Chronic Hepatitis BEarly vs Late Postpartum Cessation of TDF Initiated for Prevention of Vertical HBV TransmissionInvestigational functional cure strategiesB-Together: Sequential Bepirovirsen and PegIFN Added to NA Therapy for Chronic HBV InfectionMARCH Part B: VIR-3434 ± VIR-2218 ± PegIFN Added to NA Therapy for Chronic HBV InfectionREEF-IT: JNJ-3989 + NA ± JNJ-6379 With PegIFN Add-on Consolidation in Patients With HBeAg-Positive CHBHBV003: VTP-300 + Nivolumab Added to NA Therapy for Chronic HBV InfectionCVP-NASVAC: Nasally Administered Therapeutic Vaccine for Chronic HBV InfectionPresenter:Nancy Reau, MDProfessor of MedicineRichard B. Capps Chair of HepatologyChief, Section of HepatologyAssociate Director, Solid Organ TransplantationRush University Medical Center Chicago, IllinoisLink to full program: https://bit.ly/47XJlU4

Ted speaks with Nik Sirna, owner of NVS Architects based in Montana. Nik recently relocated from Ohio to start his own architecture firm and has quickly built a customer base through his great work ethic and communication skills. Today Ted dives into the challenges of starting over, the importance of listening to the customer, and the ways technology is changing industry businesses. Listen in to hear how Nik is climbing the ladder of success and the mentality he uses to tackle problems as they arise.TOPICS DISCUSSED[1:15] How Nik and Ted met[4:10] How difficult is it to relocate your business and family?[9:05]  Is it hard to acclimate to a new style or design or craftsmanship?[11:35] Listening to the client[13:05] Architects can work anywhere[15:00] Designs based on location, Square footage is just a number[19:20] How tough was it to build up a firm with no clients? Getting your start.[25:45]What's the difference between school and real life practicing architecture?[28:55] 3D modeling vs. real life[33:35] Budget realities and hard decisions[39:38] Exciting Projects[42:12] The power of word of mouth and building relationships[45:50] The process of landing a big project[48:45]  Mentorship and working hard matters[51:20] You have to learn to figure things out, and don't take no for an answer[57:00] Wrap upCONNECT WITH GUESTNik SirnaWebsiteInstagramLinkedInKEY QUOTES FROM EPISODEWe've found our lane for sure. We're always evolving, but we've definitely, we definitely have our niche and we've got our aesthetic, which has been nice and it's, it's again, been welcomingSometimes some of the best projects are some of the smaller ones where you gotta be creative with space and you be articulate with some of the structural stuff and you can create some really dynamic stuff. So it doesn't all have to be these huge, the huge projects are great, but a lot of them, the ones that challenge us design wise, tend to be a little bit smaller and really make us think outside of the box a little bit from a plan standpoint and come up with some awesome solutions.I've been lucky enough to fall in line. I come from a big family of Italian entrepreneurs that they very successfully sold food, but more importantly, created an amazing culture and amazing business wrapped around people. I mean, they have staff that have been part of their team for 40 years because they believe in them, right? They set a path and their customer base, they love the family, they love the people, they love the experience, they love the communication. I've been able to take a lot of those key things.

In this episode, Nancy Reau, MD, discusses new data on hepatitis B virus presented at AASLD 2023, including:Current therapiesStudies 108 and 110: Factors Linked With Lack of Virologic Suppression After 8 Yr of TAF or TDFKaiser Permanente Northern California: HCC or Death With TDF vs ETV for Chronic Hepatitis BEarly vs Late Postpartum Cessation of TDF Initiated for Prevention of Vertical HBV TransmissionInvestigational functional cure strategiesB-Together: Sequential Bepirovirsen and PegIFN Added to NA Therapy for Chronic HBV InfectionMARCH Part B: VIR-3434 ± VIR-2218 ± PegIFN Added to NA Therapy for Chronic HBV InfectionREEF-IT: JNJ-3989 + NA ± JNJ-6379 With PegIFN Add-on Consolidation in Patients With HBeAg-Positive CHBHBV003: VTP-300 + Nivolumab Added to NA Therapy for Chronic HBV InfectionCVP-NASVAC: Nasally Administered Therapeutic Vaccine for Chronic HBV InfectionPresenter:Nancy Reau, MDProfessor of MedicineRichard B. Capps Chair of HepatologyChief, Section of HepatologyAssociate Director, Solid Organ TransplantationRush University Medical Center Chicago, IllinoisLink to full program: https://bit.ly/47XJlU4

On today's edition of THE SETH WILLIAMS SHOW, Seth and Chris talk about yesterday's election and the passing of Issue 1 and Issue 2. They debate if we are officially at the end times. Tony Musachio stops by from Sirna's in Bedford. Jon Drake offers some Dawg Pound Details about the drubbing they put on Arizona Cardinals. BECOME A VIP: https://classicmetalshow.locals.com GET A FREE RUMBLE ACCOUNT: https://rumble.com/register/classicmetalshow/ GET A FREE ODYSEE ACCOUNT: https://odysee.com/$/invite/@ClassicMetalShow:a Please SUBSCRIBE, click the notification bell, leave a comment or a like, and share this episode! **NOTE: Everything said here, and on every episode of all of our shows are 100% the opinions of the hosts. Nothing is stated as fact. Do your own research to see if their opinions are true or not.** Get all our episodes at www.chrisakin.net. Facebook: www.facebook.com/chrisakinpresents Instagram: www.instagram.com/chrisakinpresents Twitter: www.twitter.com/realchrisakin Youtube: https://www.youtube.com/@chrisakinpresents?sub_confirmation=1 --- Send in a voice message: https://podcasters.spotify.com/pod/show/cmspn/message

小核酸药物在当前医药行业中非常火热，但在递送技术的创新层面依然存在困境，已上市的小核酸药物仅能针对肝脏靶点。小核酸抗体偶联药物（Antibody-oligonucleotide conjugates，AOC）和小核酸多肽偶联药物（Peptide-oligonucleotide conjugates，POC）利用抗体或多肽将治疗性寡核苷酸递送至特定细胞或组织，将抗体/多肽的组织特异性优势，与小核酸的靶点特异性优势相结合，可一定程度上用于解决目前小核酸药物仅能通过脂质纳米颗粒（LNP）、N-乙酰半乳糖胺（GalNAc）递送系统靶向肝脏的问题。目前，小核酸的非肝靶向递送在国外已引起诸多公司的关注，神经肌肉器官的一些靶点已被披露，进展比较快的靶点如TfR1，美国药企Avidity Biosciences和Dyne Therapeutics正针对该靶点研发靶向肌肉的药物；Denali Therapeutics则尝试选取具备亲和力的肽作为载体，以实现跨血脑屏障的递送，治疗CNS中枢神经系统疾病。小核酸抗体/多肽偶联药物 (XOC) 的结构与XDC相似，主要由三部分构成：发挥组织靶向作用的载体，连接子（linker），作为payload的小核酸。区别在于，ADC通常以毒素小分子作为payload，而XOC采用的小核酸分子量通常在10kDa以上，分子量远超ADC；另外，小核酸在pH中性的情况下呈现负电，因此在和抗体的偶联工艺上可能会面临独特挑战。本期节目，我们会详细聊一聊小核酸药物发展现状，小核酸药物递送技术的发展迭代，小核酸偶连药物的发展，主要适应症，靶点选择上和传统的ADC逻辑上有什么区别，以及小核酸药物领域面临的难题和未来的发展方向。备注ADC: Antibody-drug conjugates AOC: Antibody-oligonucleotide conjugatesLNP: Lipid nanoparticlesASO: Antisense oligonucleotidesRISC: RNA-induced silencing complexRNAi: RNA interferenceMoA: Mode of action播客中提到的公开课：题目：浅谈小核酸药物早期研发-生物学评价体系 - 刘楠博士 | 钰沐菡 公益公开课链接：https://www.bilibili.com/video/BV1LL4y18789/?spm_id_from=333.999.0.0时间轴：00：01：25 小核酸药物目前有几款上市，目前的发展现状00：07：22 小核酸药物分类，作用机制和靶向递送00：16：01 抗体小核酸偶联药物(AOC)研发管线情况00：17：53 AOC的安全问题00：21：19 AOC肝外靶向和靶点选择的逻辑 00：31：03 小核酸药物递送和基因治疗领域核酸递送对比 小核酸药物一定需要精准递送吗00：41：31 siRNA药物类酶的作用机制00：46：22 小核酸药物脱靶的研究和抗脱靶修饰00：53：47 AOC一定需要高效的溶酶体释放吗，AOC需要裂解才能起效吗01：10：56 AOC药物的偶联技术01：14：29 小核酸药物筛选发现的现状(非常卷)01：24：27 小核酸药物领域未来的发展本期人物钰沐菡 ，「钰沐菡 」平台创始人，「Biotech Bar 」主播旺德福，「Biotech Bar 」联合策划人、常驻嘉宾乔晶博士，国内某top3老牌药企的高级研发人员，乔博士进入工业界后在ADC早研领域有5年的开发经验，专注于从靶点发现到临床候选化合物确定的这个阶段。刘楠博士，苏州时安生物技术有限公司联合创始人，刘博士在核酸治疗领域具有多年的学术积累和工业界研究经历，致力于小核酸创新技术平台和小核酸药物研发。关于「钰沐菡 」：积水为川，聚木成林，金玉汇智，茹古涵今。致力于生物医药领域的专业知识分享，方便更多从业者学习交流。你也可以在微信公众号和bilibili同名频道找到我们，那里有很多相关领域的课程资源。

L'intervento rarissimo a Catania su una ragazza con una sindrome

A new research paper was published in Aging (listed by MEDLINE/PubMed as "Aging (Albany NY)" and "Aging-US" by Web of Science) Volume 15, Issue 13, entitled, “Budding uninhibited by benzimidazoles-1 (BUB1) regulates EGFR signaling by reducing EGFR internalization.” EGFR signaling initiates upon ligand binding which leads to activation and internalization of the receptor-ligand complex. In this new study, researchers Shyam Nyati, Grant Young, Corey Speers, Mukesh K. Nyati, and Alnawaz Rehemtulla from the University of Michigan, Henry Ford Health System and Case Western Reserve University evaluated if BUB1 impacted EGFR signaling by regulating EGFR receptor internalization and activation. “We postulate that BUB1 helps in the formation and stabilization of EGFR dimers at the membrane and may regulate endocytosis of activated EGFR into either clathrin dependent (EEA1 coated) or independent (caveolin coated) vesicles thus impacting receptor recycling or degradation and subsequently signaling amplitude and duration [38, 39].” BUB1 was ablated genomically (siRNA) or biochemically (2OH-BNPP1) in cells. EGF ligand was used to initiate EGFR signaling while disuccinimidyl suberate (DSS) was used for cross linking cellular proteins. EGFR signaling was measured by western immunoblotting and receptor internalization was evaluated by fluorescent microscopy (pEGFR (pY1068) colocalization with early endosome marker EEA1). siRNA mediated BUB1 depletion led to an overall increase in total EGFR levels and more phospho-EGFR (Y845, Y1092, and Y1173) dimers while the amount of total EGFR (non-phospho) dimers remained unchanged. BUB1 inhibitor (BUB1i) decreased EGF mediated EGFR signaling including pEGFR Y845, pAKT S473 and pERK1/2 in a time dependent manner. Additionally, BUB1i also reduced EGF mediated pEGFR (Y845) dimers (asymmetric dimers) without affecting total EGFR dimers (symmetric dimers) indicating that dimerization of inactive EGFR is not affected by BUB1. Furthermore, BUB1i blocked EGF mediated EGFR degradation (increase in EGFR half-life) without impacting half-lives of HER2 or c-MET. BUB1i also reduced co-localization of pEGFR with EEA1 positive endosomes suggesting that BUB1 might modulate EGFR endocytosis. “Our data provide evidence that BUB1 protein and its kinase activity may regulate EGFR activation, endocytosis, degradation, and downstream signaling without affecting other members of the receptor tyrosine kinase family.” DOI - https://doi.org/10.18632/aging.204820 Corresponding authors - Shyam Nyati - snyati1@hfhs.org, and Alnawaz Rehemtulla - alnawaz@umich.edu Sign up for free Altmetric alerts about this article - https://aging.altmetric.com/details/email_updates?id=10.18632%2Faging.204820 Subscribe for free publication alerts from Aging - https://www.aging-us.com/subscribe-to-toc-alerts Keywords - aging, BUB1, EGFR, cancer, signaling, endocytosis About Aging-US Launched in 2009, Aging-US publishes papers of general interest and biological significance in all fields of aging research and age-related diseases, including cancer—and now, with a special focus on COVID-19 vulnerability as an age-dependent syndrome. Topics in Aging-US go beyond traditional gerontology, including, but not limited to, cellular and molecular biology, human age-related diseases, pathology in model organisms, signal transduction pathways (e.g., p53, sirtuins, and PI-3K/AKT/mTOR, among others), and approaches to modulating these signaling pathways. Please visit our website at https://www.Aging-US.com​​ and connect with us: SoundCloud - https://soundcloud.com/Aging-Us Facebook - https://www.facebook.com/AgingUS/ Twitter - https://twitter.com/AgingJrnl Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/agingjrnl/ YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/@AgingJournal LinkedIn - https://www.linkedin.com/company/aging/ Pinterest - https://www.pinterest.com/AgingUS/ Media Contact 18009220957 MEDIA@IMPACTJOURNALS.COM

In this episode, Stefan Zeuzem, MD, discusses new data on viral hepatitis presented at EASL 2023, including:Hepatitis B virusDurability of response with bepirovirsenHBsAg loss with siRNA VIR-2218 combined with either VIR-3434 (novel monoclonal antibody) or pegIFN-alfaHepatitis delta virus96-week follow-up of immediate vs delayed bulevirtideOff-treatment response for lonafarnib + ritonavir ± pegIFN-alfa Safety and efficacy outcomes with siRNA JNJ-3989 + nucleos(t)ide analogueHepatitis C virusCollaborative service at opiate substitution treatment clinic to improve linkage to care in IrelandNurse-led test-and-treat program to increase screening and diagnosis at female prisons in the United KingdomFIND-C study using machine learning to improve screening-to-diagnosis ratio using clinical factors and social determinants of healthPresenter:Stefan Zeuzem, MDProfessor of Medicine Chief, Department of Medicine JW Goethe University Hospital Frankfurt, GermanyLink to full program: https://bit.ly/3JQQj3J

Go online to PeerView.com/TNQ860 to view the activity, download slides and practice aids, and complete the post-test to earn credit. How much do you know about non-factor therapies in the prophylactic management of hemophilia? Test your knowledge and earn credit, as you get the latest evidence and expert guidance on integrating these therapies into individualized management plans for adult and pediatric patients with hemophilia. Upon completion of this activity, participants should be better able to: Discuss current unmet needs and barriers to optimal prophylaxis of hemophilia; Summarize the MOAs and latest safety/efficacy evidence supporting the use of novel and emerging antibody and siRNA therapies for the prophylaxis of HA and HB; Develop personalized prophylactic regimens with novel and emerging antibody and siRNA therapies, including in the context of clinical trials, for the management of HA and HB; and Manage practical aspects of care when using novel non-factor agents, including dosing/scheduling, patient education, adherence, monitoring, and adverse events.

Go online to PeerView.com/TNQ860 to view the activity, download slides and practice aids, and complete the post-test to earn credit. How much do you know about non-factor therapies in the prophylactic management of hemophilia? Test your knowledge and earn credit, as you get the latest evidence and expert guidance on integrating these therapies into individualized management plans for adult and pediatric patients with hemophilia. Upon completion of this activity, participants should be better able to: Discuss current unmet needs and barriers to optimal prophylaxis of hemophilia; Summarize the MOAs and latest safety/efficacy evidence supporting the use of novel and emerging antibody and siRNA therapies for the prophylaxis of HA and HB; Develop personalized prophylactic regimens with novel and emerging antibody and siRNA therapies, including in the context of clinical trials, for the management of HA and HB; and Manage practical aspects of care when using novel non-factor agents, including dosing/scheduling, patient education, adherence, monitoring, and adverse events.

Go online to PeerView.com/TNQ860 to view the activity, download slides and practice aids, and complete the post-test to earn credit. How much do you know about non-factor therapies in the prophylactic management of hemophilia? Test your knowledge and earn credit, as you get the latest evidence and expert guidance on integrating these therapies into individualized management plans for adult and pediatric patients with hemophilia. Upon completion of this activity, participants should be better able to: Discuss current unmet needs and barriers to optimal prophylaxis of hemophilia; Summarize the MOAs and latest safety/efficacy evidence supporting the use of novel and emerging antibody and siRNA therapies for the prophylaxis of HA and HB; Develop personalized prophylactic regimens with novel and emerging antibody and siRNA therapies, including in the context of clinical trials, for the management of HA and HB; and Manage practical aspects of care when using novel non-factor agents, including dosing/scheduling, patient education, adherence, monitoring, and adverse events.

Go online to PeerView.com/TNQ860 to view the activity, download slides and practice aids, and complete the post-test to earn credit. How much do you know about non-factor therapies in the prophylactic management of hemophilia? Test your knowledge and earn credit, as you get the latest evidence and expert guidance on integrating these therapies into individualized management plans for adult and pediatric patients with hemophilia. Upon completion of this activity, participants should be better able to: Discuss current unmet needs and barriers to optimal prophylaxis of hemophilia; Summarize the MOAs and latest safety/efficacy evidence supporting the use of novel and emerging antibody and siRNA therapies for the prophylaxis of HA and HB; Develop personalized prophylactic regimens with novel and emerging antibody and siRNA therapies, including in the context of clinical trials, for the management of HA and HB; and Manage practical aspects of care when using novel non-factor agents, including dosing/scheduling, patient education, adherence, monitoring, and adverse events.

Go online to PeerView.com/TNQ860 to view the activity, download slides and practice aids, and complete the post-test to earn credit. How much do you know about non-factor therapies in the prophylactic management of hemophilia? Test your knowledge and earn credit, as you get the latest evidence and expert guidance on integrating these therapies into individualized management plans for adult and pediatric patients with hemophilia. Upon completion of this activity, participants should be better able to: Discuss current unmet needs and barriers to optimal prophylaxis of hemophilia; Summarize the MOAs and latest safety/efficacy evidence supporting the use of novel and emerging antibody and siRNA therapies for the prophylaxis of HA and HB; Develop personalized prophylactic regimens with novel and emerging antibody and siRNA therapies, including in the context of clinical trials, for the management of HA and HB; and Manage practical aspects of care when using novel non-factor agents, including dosing/scheduling, patient education, adherence, monitoring, and adverse events.

In this podcast, James Cave (Editor-in-Chief) and David Phizackerley (Deputy Editor) talk about the May 2023 issue of DTB. They celebrate 60 years since DTB became independent from The Medical Letter and discuss what DTB stands for (https://dtb.bmj.com/content/61/5/66). They review a retrospective cohort study involving people taking oral anticoagulants that compared the risk of bleeding and embolic events in new users of NSAIDs with those not prescribed NSAIDs (https://dtb.bmj.com/content/61/5/67). They also talk about the main review article that explores the therapeutics of siRNA medicines (https://dtb.bmj.com/content/61/5/72). They begin by discussing the UK Government's recent Budget statement that the MHRA will introduce a new approval process for medicines that have been licensed elsewhere.

Genetic medicine is poised to unlock more value for patients and investors due to disruptive technologies like mRNA, siRNA and gene editing. With an estimated 27 genetic medicines already approved, RBC's biotechnology analyst Luca Issi explains how these technologies could be used next, and why companies able to combine the right choice of intervention with strong execution may stand to benefit most.

References Dr Guerra's lectures and spontaneous expectorations. Molecular Cancer 2020. volume 19, Article number: 39 --- Send in a voice message: https://podcasters.spotify.com/pod/show/dr-daniel-j-guerra/message Support this podcast: https://podcasters.spotify.com/pod/show/dr-daniel-j-guerra/support

A new research paper was published in Oncotarget's Volume 14 on March 21, 2023, entitled, “Attenuation of cancer proliferation by suppression of glypican-1 and its pleiotropic effects in neoplastic behavior.” Glypicans (GPC1-6) are associated with tumorigenic processes and their involvement in neoplastic behavior has been discussed in different cancer types. In this recent cancer-wide GPC expression study, researchers Fang Cheng, Victor Chérouvrier Hansson, Grigorios Georgolopoulos, and Katrin Mani from Lund University and Genevia Technologies used clinical cancer patient data in The Cancer Genome Atlas to reveal net upregulation of GPC1 and GPC2 in primary solid tumors. On the other hand, GPC3, GPC5 and GPC6 displayed lowered expression patterns compared to normal tissues. “[...] we identify and propose a mechanism where GPC1 interacts with extracellular matrix mediating signal transduction by mitogenic molecules involving TGF-β and p38 MAPK.” Focusing on GPC1, the researchers conducted survival analyses of the clinical cancer patient data that revealed a statistically significant correlation between high expression of GPC1 and poor prognosis in 10 particular cancer types: bladder urothelial carcinoma, brain lower grade glioma, liver hepatocellular carcinoma, colon adenocarcinoma, kidney renal clear cell carcinoma, lung adenocarcinoma, mesothelioma, ovarian serous cystadenocarcinoma, uterine corpus endometrial carcinoma, and uveal melanoma. In vitro studies targeting GPC1 expression by CRISPR/Cas9 or siRNA or treatment with an anti-GPC1 antibody resulted in attenuation of proliferation of cancer cells from bladder carcinoma, glioma and hepatocellular carcinoma patients (T24, U87 and HepG2 cells). Further, GPC1 overexpression exhibited a significant and negative correlation between GPC1 expression and proliferation of T24 cells. Their attempt to reveal the mechanism through which downregulation of GPC1 leads to attenuation of tumor growth using systematic Ingenuity Pathway Analysis indicated that suppression of GPC1 results in ECM-mediated inhibition of specific pro-cancer signaling pathways involving TGF-β and p38 MAPK. The team also identified differential expression and pleiotropic effects of GPCs in specific cancer types. This emphasizes their potential as novel diagnostic tools and prognostic factors, and open doors for future GPC targeted therapy. “It is plausible to measure circulating GPCs in serum, plasma or urine using a variety of methods including ELISA, urine cell sediments or exosome isolation [13, 24]. Further, detection and quantification of GPC1 by histopathological and immunohistochemical methods in tumor biopsies could be a new way to predict the biological outcome. The results of this investigation would also emphasize the potential of GPCs as novel tumor antigens, and open for GPC targeted immunotherapy. GPC targeted immunotherapy would be of high value, especially as we move into an era of precision and personalized cancer therapy.” DOI: https://doi.org/10.18632/oncotarget.28388 Correspondence to: Katrin Mani - katrin.mani@med.lu.se Keywords: Glypican-1, TCGA, bladder carcinoma, hepatocellular carcinoma, glioma About Oncotarget Oncotarget is a primarily oncology-focused, peer-reviewed, open access journal. Papers are published continuously within yearly volumes in their final and complete form, and then quickly released to Pubmed. On September 15, 2022, Oncotarget was accepted again for indexing by MEDLINE. Oncotarget is now indexed by Medline/PubMed and PMC/PubMed. To learn more about Oncotarget, visit https://www.oncotarget.com and connect with us: SoundCloud - https://soundcloud.com/oncotarget Facebook - https://www.facebook.com/Oncotarget/ Twitter - https://twitter.com/oncotarget Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/oncotargetjrnl/ YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/@OncotargetJournal LinkedIn - https://www.linkedin.com/company/oncotarget MEDIA@IMPACTJOURNALS.COM

Dr. Arthur Suckow is the Co-Founder and CEO of DTx Pharma, in search of an approach to administering sRNA therapeutics using a solution of fatty acids, which every cell in the body has a mechanism to take up. Leveraging those mechanisms, receptors, and transporters, the DTx concept is to trick the cells into bringing the sRNA molecules in so they can repress the expression of disease-causing genes. Arthur explains, "Well, the one that everyone is familiar with now because it's on the front page of the news almost every day are mRNA modalities where you put a gene essentially back into cells. The poster child for that is putting the spike protein in to generate a vaccine response. But that's not what we do. We actually inhibit the expression of disease-causing genes. When you have an extra copy or a mutant protein that mucks up cellular function, we try to inhibit the expression of those genes. And those are called sRNA or antisense therapeutics. We specifically focus on the flavor called siRNA as our kind of modality of choice." "The bigger challenge and the challenge that DTx is trying to take on is to enable this class of therapeutics beyond the liver to other tissues. We focus on the peripheral nervous system, muscle, brain, etc. Where they're most effective from a disease perspective is if you have expression of a gene or the expression of a mutation. We usually think dominant gain of function is kind of our bread and butter. So those kinds of lesions are where these are particularly effective." @DTxPharma #RNATherapeutics #mRNA #siRNA #sRNA #FattyAcidMolecules #DominantGainofFunction #RareDisease #CharcotMarieTooth #SanDiego dtxpharma.com Download the transcript here

Dr. Arthur Suckow is the Co-Founder and CEO of DTx Pharma, in search of an approach to administering sRNA therapeutics using a solution of fatty acids, which every cell in the body has a mechanism to take up. Leveraging those mechanisms, receptors, and transporters, the DTx concept is to trick the cells into bringing the sRNA molecules in so they can repress the expression of disease-causing genes. Arthur explains, "Well, the one that everyone is familiar with now because it's on the front page of the news almost every day are mRNA modalities where you put a gene essentially back into cells. The poster child for that is putting the spike protein in to generate a vaccine response. But that's not what we do. We actually inhibit the expression of disease-causing genes. When you have an extra copy or a mutant protein that mucks up cellular function, we try to inhibit the expression of those genes. And those are called sRNA or antisense therapeutics. We specifically focus on the flavor called siRNA as our kind of modality of choice." "The bigger challenge and the challenge that DTx is trying to take on is to enable this class of therapeutics beyond the liver to other tissues. We focus on the peripheral nervous system, muscle, brain, etc. Where they're most effective from a disease perspective is if you have expression of a gene or the expression of a mutation. We usually think dominant gain of function is kind of our bread and butter. So those kinds of lesions are where these are particularly effective." @DTxPharma #RNATherapeutics #mRNA #siRNA #sRNA #FattyAcidMolecules #DominantGainofFunction #RareDisease #CharcotMarieTooth #SanDiego dtxpharma.com Listen to the podcast here

Born into a family of painters, musicians, and designers for Hallmark, and growing up in the art-centric city of Kansas City, Missouri, creativity was an encompassing part of Kellie Sirna's childhood. After pinpointing her passion for interiors and spending a decade at Duncan Miller, Sirna set out on her own. Her multifaceted firm, Studio 11 Design, which has offices in Austin, Dallas, and New York works with some of the biggest names in the hospitality including IHG, Kimpton, and Omni. Rather than limiting herself to one area, Sirna has grown her firm from solely interiors to branding, and art development and procurement.

When her job didn't afford her the flexibility she needed, Kellie Sirna set out on her own and began a life of serial entrepreneurship. Running multiple businesses while also being a single parent has its challenges, but she is skilled in the art of the hustle. Now the owner of Studio 11 Design and its two sister companies, Kellie focuses on selecting clients that will be a good fit for her team. She takes an individual approach to each employee to ensure she's building successful partnerships. Listen in to hear Kellie's thoughts on creating the perfect dream team and how to embrace the unknown. How does Kellie keep faith in herself and her team? By making Zero Excuses and running towards the fire that scares you.

 My guest today is Kellie Sirna, co-founder of Studio 11 Design, which specializes in specialty hotel design.  Kellie has led global projects across boutique and renowned nameplates such as Caesars Entertainment, Hyatt, Starwood, Thompson Hotels, and many more and she oversaw the recent launch of two new side projects within Studio 11 Design, one about branding and the other, Lou Verne, which specializes in art installations.