Gospel Tangents Podcast

Come along on this journey to Beaver Island, where James Strang was crowned King! We'll learn more about this early Mormon prophet. You don't want to miss this! https://youtu.be/MPrutzK6ljQ Don't miss our other conversations about Strangism: https://gospeltangents.com/denominations/strangites/ Copyright © 2025 Gospel Tangents All Rights Reserved Except for book reviews, no content may be reproduced without written permission. I'm taking you on a journey to Beaver Island, Michigan, a place central to the intriguing story of James Strang and his followers. James Strang: From Convert to Contender The tale begins with James Strang, a relatively recent convert to Mormonism, having joined the church just a few months before Joseph Smith sent him on a mission to Wisconsin. After Joseph Smith was killed on June 27, 1844, James Strang made two significant claims to succeed Smith: Angelic Ordination: Strang claimed that the angel Moroni appeared to him and ordained him to be the next prophet1. Letter of Appointment: He also presented a letter, purportedly from Joseph Smith, dated June 18, with a postmark from Nauvoo, Illinois, on June 19. The authenticity of this "letter of appointment" has been a major point of contention. Brigham Young immediately deemed it a forgery. A peculiar postmark (due to a piece of lint in the Nauvoo stamp) was used at the Nauvoo post office. Young followers claimed this was evidence of a forgery. However, when it was shown to be on other letters, Strang used as proof of authenticity. Michael Quinn, a historian, believed the letter was a fraud or forgery. Quinn noted that the signature was written in block letters and Joseph Smith's signature did not match his usual signature, although he acknowledged Joseph often used scribes. Quinn speculated that Strang might have taken a genuine letter from Nauvoo and written on it himself, with the postmark appearing to be genuine. The letter itself was vague, not explicitly naming Strang as the new church president, but rather seeming to put him in charge of the church in Wisconsin, a role Strang might have "inflated". Despite the controversy, Strang attracted some notable converts, including Joseph Smith's brother, William Smith, as well as John Page, Martin Harris, and William Marks, with several members of the Smith family initially encouraging him. Kingdom on Beaver Island Strang eventually received a revelation to move his community from Wisconsin to Beaver Island, Michigan before 1850. On Beaver Island, James Strang, much like Joseph Smith with the Council of 50, was ordained a king. This ambition, where Mormons attempted to take over the government, often led to conflict with surrounding communities. Tragedy and Scattering The Strangite community on Beaver Island ultimately faced a tragic end. In 1856, James Strang was assassinated on the dock by former Strangites. These individuals are referred to as "pseudos" or "pseudo-Mormons" by Strangites, distinguishing them from the LDS term "apostates". Strang was shot. Though not killed immediately, he succumbed to his wounds about three weeks later. Following his assassination, the US Navy, which was patrolling Lake Michigan for pirates, scattered all the people on Beaver Island. They were dropped off in various ports, often penniless and without food or money, a "terrible tragedy" that led to the scattering of Strangites. Today, while the largest congregation is believed to be in Burlington, Wisconsin (which James Strang called Voree), smaller groups exist in New Mexico, Colorado, and potentially West Virginia. Planning Your Visit to Beaver Island For those intrigued by this unique historical site, Beaver Island is accessible by ferry or plane. Travel from Grand Rapids: My journey started at Gerald R. Ford Airport in Grand Rapids, Michigan. From there, it's about a three-hour drive to Charlevoix, Michigan, the departure point for the ferry or small plane.

Recently, I had the fascinating opportunity to delve into the beliefs practices, and Strangite priesthood views with Gary Weber of the Strangite Church, a lesser-known branch of Mormonism. This discussion sheds light on many intriguing aspects of their faith, highlighting both commonalities and distinct differences from the more widely known LDS (Latter-day Saint) Church. https://youtu.be/GvLjkF8kqms Understanding Strangite Priesthood: A Core Difference One of the most significant distinctions discussed was the Strangite understanding of the priesthood and its associated "keys." While the Melchizedek priesthood holds specific keys related to office, it does not encompass all keys. According to Gary Weber, the Melchizedek priesthood cannot evolve to ordain a prophet. Instead, they believe a prophet can only be ordained by an angel, as was the case for Moses, Joseph Smith, and James J. Strang. The fundamental principle here is that "the lesser cannot ordain the greater". This leads to a critical differentiation of priesthood keys: Keys of Mysteries and Revelations: These keys are associated only with the prophet-lawgiver and can only be held by one person at a time. Gary Weber states that James J. Strang could not have been ordained by angels while Joseph Smith was alive but was ordained the moment Joseph Smith died. Keys of the Kingdom: These keys can be possessed by many people, as seen with the twelve apostles who were given these keys to spread the gospel to nations. They can also confer these keys to others, with hundreds potentially holding them. Gary noted that many members of the LDS Church often don't understand this distinction between the two types of keys. Sacrament Practices: Purity and Purpose The Strangite Church observes the sacrament once a month, rather than weekly like the LDS Church. Their reasoning is that frequent observance could make it "mundane" and cause it to "lose its specialness and sacredness". The elements used for the sacrament also have specific requirements: Juice: Any edible fresh fruit juice is acceptable, as stated in their book of law under the Eucharist. Examples include orange juice, which was used when Gary grew up in Artesia, or fresh processed grape juice from their vineyard. If no juice is available, water can be used, emphasizing the focus on one's "eye singleness to God" and the purpose of remembering Christ's blood. Typically Strangites use some sort of fresh juice (not store-bought) for the sacrament. This assures the juice has not been adulterated. Bread: Must be made of any grain, prepared by the members themselves, not store-bought. This is to ensure its purity and prevent it from being "adulterated". Other Doctrines and Practices: Baptism: They baptize at age eight, aligning with the LDS Church, based on the Doctrine and Covenants and a belief that children at this age have scientifically reached a maturity level to understand right from wrong. Baptism can occur in a church font or natural bodies of water like the White River, depending on personal preference. Priesthood Recognition: The Strangite Church does not recognize the priesthood of other churches, including the LDS priesthood, as they trace their priesthood lineage back through Joseph Smith and James J. Strang. Communion: They practice a closed communion, meaning it is only served to those who have been baptized, taken upon Christ's name, and are deemed worthy, as stated in the Book of Mormon by Jesus to the Nephites. Missionary Work: Unlike the door-to-door approach of many LDS missionaries, Strangites engage in a more limited form of proselytization. They will travel to baptize individuals with whom they've corresponded and who show genuine interest, sometimes over many months. Interestingly, Gary expressed that the wider recognition of the "Mormon" name, largely due to the LDS Church's efforts, has made it easier for Strangites to teach Mormonism,

Welcome to an exploration of one of the most distinctive branches of Mormonism: the Strangite Church. We will discuss Strangite women's role in priesthood. While many are familiar with the larger Latter-day Saint movements, the Strangites offer a fascinating glimpse into different interpretations and practices rooted in early Restorationism. Based primarily in Burlington, Wisconsin, the Strangite Church has a rich history, unique theological perspectives, and surprising elements that set it apart. https://youtu.be/61quRH-_glI Resilient Community/Promised Refuge According to the revelations of James J. Strang, Voree was prophesied to be a refuge for the people, where "the Gentiles would treat you with kindness". Remarkably, the Strangites in Voree have never experienced the persecution that other Mormon settlements faced in places like Palmyra, Kirtland, Independence, or Nauvoo. This consistent respect and kind treatment from the wider community is seen by Strangites as a powerful sign that James A. Strang's revelations were true. Furthermore, families living there have prospered, owning homes and achieving financial stability, which they believe is a testament to the blessings promised for obedience to God. The congregation has seen periods of challenge and renewal. A spiritual movement led others to move to Voree, and gradually the church began to build up again. While the primary congregation is in Burlington, members also reside in various states, including Texas, Colorado, New Mexico, Florida, Michigan, and Minnesota, often attending services via Zoom. Women in the Aaronic Priesthood Perhaps one of the most surprising and progressive aspects of the Strangite Church is its stance on women and the priesthood. Unlike many other Restorationist faiths, the Strangite Church ordains women to the Aaronic priesthood, specifically to the office of teacher. They believe that Emma Smith herself was the first teacher. These women teachers play an active and vital role in church services. They are permitted to lead meetings, often doing so in pairs, each taking half of the Sabbath service. While women hold the office of teacher, they are not ordained as deaconesses; deacons are exclusively boys. Priesthood ordination in the Strangite Church is not tied to age or seen as a "rite of passage.” Instead, individuals are called when a priesthood member receives inspiration that a particular person is ready and begins to excel. The Strangite priesthood structure includes: Melchizedek Priesthood: Elders and High Priests. Aaronic Priesthood: Priests, Teachers (including women), and Deacons. There are no Seventies currently, and they believe a prophet is needed to structure other offices. The leadership of the church has continued through a series of appointments. Lorenzo Hickey ordained Wingfield Watson as the head of the church and a high priest, who then served until his passing around 1920. Following Watson, subsequent presiding high priests have been appointed by their predecessors. Currently, David Flanders serves as the presiding high priest, a role of duty and responsibility to manage affairs, but not one that grants him higher authority than other high priests. Saturday Worship and the Nature of Christ A distinct practice of the Strangite Church is their worship on Saturday, the Sabbath day. This is based on their belief that God sanctified the seventh day during creation. They contend that the Catholic Church changed the Sabbath to Sunday to honor the sun god and appease pagans, aiming to unite Christians and pagans into a single universal church. Their theological views also extend to the nature of Christ. The Strangite Church believes that Jesus was 100% mortal, and that Joseph was his biological father. This belief is critical to their understanding of Christ's lineage, as Joseph was of the tribe of Judah, which connects Jesus directly to the covenant line of Abraham and King David through the ma...

Gary Weber, a member of the Strangite Church, shared unique insights into their doctrines, including polygamy, baptism for the dead, and their distinctive interpretation of the "stick of Judah" prophecy. https://youtu.be/_e1Zm605gtE   0:00 Distinctive Stance on Polygamy  The Strangite Church believes that polygamy is an eternal principle and can be acceptable to God if commanded by Him, primarily "to build up seed unto [His] name," not for lustful purposes. This aligns with the Book of Jacob in the Book of Mormon, which states one should have only one wife "unless I command you otherwise.” Historical figures like Abraham are cited as examples of righteous men who practiced it when commanded.  Regarding their founder, James Strang, initially, he was against polygamy. However, he later embraced it, reportedly through inspiration from God on Beaver Island, allowing it as part of the "Book of the Law of the Lord.” It's notable that its practice was limited, with perhaps only five families out of thousands practicing it due to financial constraints and the crucial requirement that the wife must not object.  Currently, the Strangite Church does not practice polygamy. This is primarily because they believe in keeping the laws of the land, and polygamy is against the law. They hold that God would not put people in a position to break the law and go to jail. Gary Weber noted that Joseph Smith also said, "We believe in keeping the laws of the land.” Furthermore, they believe that only a prophet can "usher in a dispensation for polygamy.” Interestingly, Gary mentioned that Joseph Smith allegedly cut off a Mr. Brown from the church for practicing and teaching polygamy three months before his death, suggesting an inconsistency in Joseph Smith's own stated position if he himself practiced it.  5:17 Baptism for the Dead  Another unique doctrine discussed is baptism for the dead, which the Strangites believe requires a prophet to "usher in a dispensation" and obtain "the keys from Elijah.” They assert that both Joseph Smith and James A. Strang received these keys and therefore practiced it. The "Book of the Law of the Lord" includes a section on the doctrine of baptism for the dead, which is described as identical to the information Joseph Smith put out in the 1835 edition of the Doctrine and Covenants.  A significant difference between the Strangite practice and that of the Utah Mormons (The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints) is that the Strangites believe that the sex of the person does not matter; a woman could be baptized for her deceased father if he hadn't been baptized. In contrast, the Utah church generally practices that women baptize for women and men for men.  However, the Strangite Church does not currently practice baptism for the dead. The reason, similar to polygamy, is the absence of a living prophet on the earth.  8:39 Waiting for the Prophet of the "Stick of Judah"  The Strangite Church has a distinct eschatological belief tied to a prophecy in Genesis 49, where Jacob blesses his 12 sons. When speaking of Judah, it states, "the lawgiver shall not depart between the feet of Judah.” They interpret this to mean that after Joseph Smith, who they consider the prophet of the "stick of Ephraim," there was to be a prophet from the tribe of Judah who would "bring forth the book of the law.”  This next prophet is expected to remain in the house of Judah, from the tribe of King David, and will take the gospel to the house of Israel. The Strangite Church is currently waiting for this prophet to come forth, as they believe there was meant to be an "indirect period of time" after James Strang, before the "house of Israel's dispensation to the Jews" began.  13:29 James Strang's Life & Beaver Island Community  James Strang lived in the Voree/Burlington area, Wisconsin, from about 1842 until approximately 1849 or 1850. He then moved his community to Beaver Island around 1850,

It's always fun to talk to someone from the Strangite Church, officially known as the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints (Strangite) Based in Burlington, Wisconsin, this branch of the Latter-day Saint movement offers a distinctive perspective on the succession of Joseph Smith and the ongoing divine restoration. https://youtu.be/RUL8rF0hb4U Strangite Genesis in Voree The current headquarters of the Strangite Church is Burlington, Wisconsin. Interestingly, the area holds historical significance with multiple names. It was originally called Foxville. While today it's known as Burlington, a specific area on the west side of town where the Mormon settlement was located was called Voree by the early Strangites, a name associated with the significant "Voree record". James J. Strang led his followers to this location, believing God had instructed them to move from Nauvoo. James Strang was dispatched to the Burlington area by Joseph Smith, having been baptized and made an elder by Smith himself. Strang wrote back to Joseph Smith, suggesting Voree would be a "wonderful place for a gathering" due to its rich resources like fish, fresh water, great farmland, and good soil near the Great Lakes. Initially, Joseph Smith was hesitant, but after discussion with Hyrum Smith and a subsequent spiritual revelation, he concluded that Voree was indeed a good place for the Saints. James J. Strang: Joseph Smith's Chosen Successor? The Strangite Church believes that James J. Strang was divinely appointed as Joseph Smith's successor. This belief is rooted in two pivotal events: The Letter of Appointment: Joseph Smith penned a letter to James A. Strang, officially appointing him as his successor. This original letter is now preserved at Yale University in the Beineke Library, with copies available for members. The Angelic Ordination: On the very day Joseph Smith was assassinated, June 27, 1844, angels appeared to James J. Strang and ordained him a prophet. These were believed to be the same angels who ordained Joseph Smith – Peter, James, and John. Strang was aware of Joseph's death through this angelic visitation even before news arrived from Nauvoo. Furthermore, it's believed that Jesus also anointed Strang as the King of Israel for the gentile dispensation, an ordination attributed to his lineage from the royal line of King David. Sacred Texts and Prophetic Interpretations The Strangite Church embraces a unique canon of scripture beyond what is common in other Latter-day Saint traditions: The Voree Plates: These ancient plates were revealed to James Strang through a vision from the angel Moroni, known as the Hill of Promise. Strang gathered leading citizens to witness their excavation from beneath a tree, about four feet down, where roots had grown around them. The plates, housed in an earthen case, crumbled upon exposure to air due to their age. Witnesses, including a newspaper reporter from Kenosha, confirmed the ancient nature of the record and that the site had been undisturbed. Strang translated them using the Urim and Thummim given to him by the angel Moroni, much like Joseph Smith used the Urim and Thummim to translate the Book of Mormon. The Voree Plates provide a brief history of a people who were "no more" and, most notably, contained a pictorial drawing depicting the true structure of the priesthood, including the prophet lawgiver, two viceroys, twelve apostles, high priests, and seventies. These plates were translated around 1844. The Book of the Law: This significant text is believed to be the "stick of Judah" spoken of in Ezekiel 37. According to Strangite belief, Joseph Smith translated the Book of Mormon (the stick of Ephraim), but was instructed not to touch the sealed record, which was the Book of the Law, meant for a future prophet. James J. Strang, being of the tribe of Judah with Jewish ancestry, translated the Book of the Law after receiving the plates of Laban from the angel Moroni.

This is a re-broadcast of my 2023 interview with Lynne Whitesides. She passed away from pneumonia/leukemia on July 7, 2025. We miss her. Lynne Whitesides was the first person punished in the September Six. She shares her story of why she wasn't excommunicated, who was involved, and where she is on her spiritual journey. Check out our conversation... https://youtu.be/thV_CGqy3jY Copyright © 2025 Gospel Tangents All Rights Reserved Except for book reviews, no content may be reproduced without written permission. First to Get Punished Interview GT  00:34  Welcome to Gospel Tangents. I'm so excited to have one of the original members of the September Six. Could you go ahead and tell us who you are and where we are? Lynne  00:45  I am Lynne Whitesides, and I was the first of the September Six. GT  00:49  Okay. Lynne  00:50  We are at the Utah Valley University in Provo. GT  00:56  Right, Orem, actually. Lynne  00:57  Are we in Provo? We're in Orem. GT  01:00  Well, very good. I've been doing this podcast for eight years now. And this is our first time talking. You're hard to track down. Lynne  01:11  I don't know. I'm glad to be here. GT  01:14  Well, thanks. Well, as we look back on this, can you talk about the events? I don't know how far back it goes. Does it go back to the 80s? Or was it just really concentrated in the early 90s, that led you into trouble with Church authorities? Lynne  01:30  Well, I can go back a little farther, even in my own [story.] But I don't know that we want to go there. I'll start with from when I moved from Chicago to Salt Lake City. And when I did that, my friend, Lorie Stromberg; do you know Lorie? GT  01:48  A little bit. We're Facebook friends. Lynne  01:50  Lorie said, "Why don't you volunteer for Sunstone?" And I had three little kids and my husband was doing his residency and he had gotten his residency here in Salt Lake. And I so I went down, and I volunteered to just be one of the people who helps at Sunstone. And at the end of that symposium, so that was '84, or something like that. GT  02:12  Okay. Lynne  02:13  Then, I think Marti Bradley had a talk with Elbert Peck and said, "We think Lynne should be the new chair of the symposium." So, they invited me to be the chair of the symposium for the next year, which I did. I mean, I did it for four years. So whatever the four years were. GT  02:30  So, you were the leader of Sunstone? Lynne  02:31  I was the chair of the symposium. Elbert was the editor and Daniel Rector was the publisher. And then there are [others.] At the time, her name was Marti Esplin and now her name is Marti Ashby now. She was an editor. There was a really cool crew that worked there, Connie Disney. GT  02:49  So, this is after Peggy Fletcher's Stack. Lynne  02:51  Yes, just right after when Elbert took over. And it was so much fun working with Elbert and Daniel. Because I had no idea how to pull a Symposium together. But Elbert, in particular, was so gracious and helpful and just kind of showed me the ropes. And by the time I was done [with] four years, I could run a symposium, so it was great. GT  03:16  Well, it sounds like Sunstone and correct me if I'm wrong. It seems like it used to be a magazine. And it seems like Peggy was trying to get people to write for the magazine. And she started the symposium and now the symposium is the whole thing. Lynne  03:31  Yeah. GT  03:31  There's not that many people that read the magazine anymore. Lynne  03:33  I don't even know. I don't follow the magazine anymore at all. I haven't been to the symposium for years, since 10 years after, and then this year. Because I have been invited to speak. But, those four years were really kind of heady because Peggy, that's what she was trying to do. And we were getting a lot of professors from BYU and the University of Utah, but also just all kinds of really interesting people.

Join us on a fascinating journey to Voree/Burlington, Wisconsin, to explore the unique history and beliefs of a Latter-day Saint group often referred to as the Strangites. This isn't the commonly known LDS Church; rather, it's a distinct branch founded by James Strang. He started a rival Mormon Church in Voree/Burlington, Wisconsin back in 1844 and the church still exists! We'll tour around the Trust Farm and see historic sites, including the Hill of Promise & the home where James Strang died. Gary Weber is a Strangite. He's our tour guide and we'll discuss their church and theology. You don't want to miss this conversation... https://youtu.be/vlL_OQ69CEo Copyright © 2025 Gospel Tangents All Rights Reserved Except for book reviews, no content may be reproduced without written permission. Genesis of Strangism The Strangite Church, formally known as the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints (Strangite), was founded in 1844. James Strang, who had been sent on a mission to Wisconsin by Joseph Smith, claimed that an angel ordained him on June 27, 1844, the very day Joseph Smith died. This divine ordination, he asserted, made him the rightful successor to the church's leadership. Trip to Voree/Burlington The journey to this lesser-known Latter-day Saint community in Wisconsin involved a mix of trains, planes, and automobiles. Landing in Milwaukee, the trip continued towards Burlington, Wisconsin, where the Church is located. The group believes they are the original Mormon Church and refer to themselves as Mormons. The area around Burlington, known as Voree is the setting for much of Strangite history, especially concerning the "Voree record". The weather in Burlington on June 12th was surprisingly mild for summer, with a high of just 63 and low around 56 degrees Fahrenheit, a notable difference from Utah's typical June temperatures. Current Church Building and Surroundings The current Strangite church building, located on Spring Valley Road near what's called "Mormon Road," is smaller than I expected. According to Bill Shepard, a long-time resident & member, this building was constructed around 1965-1967 and marks the first time the Strangites have had a dedicated church building, as they were previously scattered. The lawn around the chapel is nicely manicured, and visitors are always welcome. Inside, or in their collections, the Strangites possess a wealth of historical documents, including 26 volumes of the Journal of Discourses, Times and Seasons, and Millennial Star. They also have Strang Manuscripts, which are copies of letters, and a publication called The Northern Islander, which was published at Beaver Island. Notably, the Strangites do use the Doctrine and Covenants. Sacred Hill of Promise One of the most significant sites for Strangites is the Hill of Promise. This is where James Strang is believed to have found his "Voree plates. The discovery was found under a small tree on the hill, under which Strang claimed a buried record lay. He gathered respected men from the town to witness the excavation, ensuring no prior disturbance of the soil. An angel reportedly appeared to Strang, revealing the record's location. Upon opening the stone casing, the ancient record crumbled due to exposure to air, a common occurrence with ancient artifacts according to Weber. Strang translated this record using the Urim and Thummim, which he said he received from the angel Moroni. The "Voree record" was a short account of a people named "Raja Ramor" who lived in the area and, similar to the Nephites on the Hill Cumorah, were largely destroyed in a great war. The record also depicted the priesthood structure, aligning precisely with the priesthood under Joseph Smith and James Strang, including prophet, viceroy, twelve apostles, and seventies. Beyond its historical significance, the Hill of Promise holds prophetic importance: James Strang's revelations indicate that Daniel from the Bible will someday app...

I've visited some temples recently! "Gospel Tangents" recently hosted a surprise live session, a "late night unannounced edition," much to the delight of its "night owl" viewers. I shared a whirlwind of Temples, Travels, updates, upcoming content, and even some breaking news from various Restorationist traditions. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jw_a2PA5jAU Temples, Travels, & Timely Insights! I've been traveling extensively, leading to a "boatload of pictures" and a significant backlog of videos waiting to be edited. Despite the busy schedule, i'm eager to share my experiences: Community of Christ World Conference in Independence: Rick attended and captured his reactions to Stassi Cramm being ordained the new prophet. While there, he met a man from New Zealand (a "Kiwi") and expressed hope for interviews with people from the Temple Lot Church, including Tom from a fundamentalist group and potentially Stassi Cramm herself. Mormon History Association (MHA): This event also proved fruitful, including tours of LDS churches, such as an old one in Ogden and Joseph Soderberg's church where President Hinckley reportedly gained his testimony. Exploring the Strangites in Wisconsin: This trip was a major highlight. I stayed with Bill Shepard, a former guest, and toured various Strangite sites with Gary Weber and David Boice. ◦ A key stop was the Hill of Promise, which the Strangites consider akin to the Hill Cumorah. It's believed to be where James J. Strang found the Voree record, a "short record of the people of Raja Ramor." This record described a people similar to those in the Book of Mormon, with a priesthood structure mirroring Joseph and James's. The Hill of Promise also holds future significance, as Strangite revelations state that Daniel from the Bible will appear there to announce Christ's approaching second coming. ◦ I also visited the site of the unbuilt Strangite temple in Burlington, which was planned to be "quite significant" in size. ◦ Rick also drove by James Strang's house in Burlington, where Strang died three weeks after his assassination on the dock of Lake Michiga. ◦ A fascinating piece of news is that David Boice is moving to Utah at the end of July. Rick plans to visit Beaver Island (Strangite Island) in July or August, noting that while Gary Weber says there's "not a lot to see," one can rent a golf cart for getting around. He also mentioned Vicki Speek is working on a census of the island. ◦ For those unfamiliar, James J. Strang claimed an angelic ordination on the day Joseph Smith died (June 27, 1844). He translated the Voree plates and later the "plates of Laban" (published as the Book of the Law of the Lord). He settled in Burlington, then moved to Beaver Island, where he was crowned king and even served in the Michigan legislature. His efforts to stop Gentiles from selling liquor to Native Americans reportedly led to his assassination with the help of the U.S. Navy. Upcoming Trip to Calgary and Cardston, Alberta: Rick is flying to Calgary for his son's wedding. He plans to make a video about the Cardston Alberta Temple, which was the first international temple for the LDS Church. Some compare it to the Mesa Temple and notes its "pioneer feel" like the Manti Temple. The Cardston Temple's murals are darker, possibly due to varnish, and hopes for a refurbishment once a new temple opens in Lethbridge. Book Giveaways and Exciting New Releases The live session included a book giveaway for "Joseph Fielding Smith a Mormon Theologian," won by Mark Francis. Looking ahead, the channel is celebrating the release of John Turner's new book, "Joseph Smith The Rise and Fall of an American Prophet," which launched in June on Amazon. (The contest is over now.) Rick gave away an autographed copy of this book. Potentially "Breaking News" from the Temple Lot Church I discovered some surprising news regarding the Temple Lot Church: they are "going to quit selling the Book of Commandme...

Matt Harris told me that only 30% of his research went into his book "2nd Class Saints" due to space restrictions. What was left out? We'll find out and also get a preview of his upcoming biography of Hugh B Brown. Check out our conversation... https://youtu.be/fQBhV5kMdZ4 Don't miss our other conversations with Matt: https://gospeltangents.com/people/matt-harris/ Copyright © 2025 Gospel Tangents All Rights Reserved Except for book reviews, no content may be reproduced without written permission.   What Was Left Out? GT  00:30  I think I've only asked you 1/20 of what I wanted to ask. I need to let you go, but the last question that I want to hit you on, I remember we had a conversation one time, and you said that when you write a book, you only put in about 30% of your research. Usually it's because of page limitations and that sort of a thing. Can you share a story or two of the 70% that's not in this book? Matt  01:07  Yeah. GT  01:09  I mean, I guess the Brown stuff, that's for your new book. But what are some things that due to space restrictions you just couldn't get in? Matt  01:21  Well, just a quick thought, the Brown stuff is in there, his activism and speaking to the press and getting Monroe Fleming ordained or trying to get him ordained, that's all in there in great detail. But the later stuff in the 1970s... GT  01:34  Daddy, the recording, I don't think that was in there. Matt  01:38  No, no, no. That will be in my Brown biography. And in full disclosure, I found some of this stuff after, later. GT  01:53  A book is never finished. Right? Matt  01:58  Oh, my goodness. Well, there are other details that I'll include about Brown and the ban, in particular, because it's so pivotal to his story, as is polygamy, weirdly enough. And also, the other story I'll just start with a teaser, is that Brown was told that he would be an apostle at the age of 15, if he lived righteous enough. He wasn't called in the Quorum of the Twelve until he was 78 years of age. GT  02:19 Wow. Matt  02:20 That is a problem, especially if you've been told... GT  02:24. We could have gotten rid of the ban sooner. Right? If he was only 20... Matt  02:29. The teaser I'll give you is it wasn't the ban that kept him out. It was something else. He was accused of doing something he did not do. GT  02:36  Did Newell Bringhurst share that story, or maybe you did. Was it with alcohol? Matt  02:43  Newell wouldn't have known this. Well, Newell knows it only for me. This is all new stuff that nobody knows about. And I've shared it with a few people. GT  02:47  Was it with the alcohol commission or something? Matt  02:52  Yeah. Some other time, I'll tell you more about the details of that. It's a fascinating thing. He was accused of taking bribes that he didn't take. But perception can be reality. GT  03:02. It doesn't matter when it's politics. Matt  03:04  That's right. GT  03:04. Accusation is good enough. Matt  03:05  That's right, and especially when people's income is at stake. So there's a lot of things I didn't talk about in this book. I couldn't because of space constraints, but some of it was--I'll give you a couple of examples. One deals with the activism. I talk a lot about the Church Education System and the BYU religion faculty and CES/Institute people, those who teach the young men and women of the Church, college age. I was shocked at the level of pushback from people who are paid to teach religion to the college-aged kids, how much they opposed the ban. GT  03:51 Oh wow. Matt  03:52 And you definitely get that in this book. You see it. I mean, I name some names, just the more high profile people like Lowell Bennion. But because of the length of the book, and they wanted to keep the price down, the press and all of that, I had to cut out a lot of details on that. GT  04:10. Can we get a sequel? Matt  04:14. And so I name names.

We're discussing polygamy in John Turner's Joseph Smith Biography and giving away a book! https://youtube.com/live/09QmyE6WweU Don't miss our other conversations with John: https://gospeltangents.com/people/john-turner/ Copyright © 2025 Gospel Tangents All Rights Reserved Except for book reviews, no content may be reproduced without written permission   Welcome, everyone, to Gospel Tangents Live! Sunday, we were live, giving away a copy of John Turner's acclaimed biography, "The Rise and Fall of an American Prophet." I just wrapped up an amazing interview with Turner. He is a super fun guy. It was certainly an engaging discussion, even touching on unexpected controversies like the gold plates. I'll have a specific focus on the often-debated topic of polygamy. I'll be tackling this subject for an upcoming presentation at Sunstone (University of Utah, Aug 1st) and the John Whitmer Historical Association (Independence, September 20th). Let's break down some of the key points discussed, looking at both the "problematic" and "overwhelming" evidence surrounding Joseph Smith's polygamy. Problematic Polygamy: Unflattering Episodes and Skeptical Points There are several challenging aspects of Joseph Smith's polygamy, as presented in Turner's book: Questioned Revelations: Turner raises questions about the 1831 revelations regarding polygamy to Native Americans. This is partly based on the reaction of Ezra Booth, an early church critic, who, according to Turner, would have made a "bigger deal about polygamy" if such a revelation had been widely known and accepted at the time. Obscurity of Activities: Joseph Smith took "great pains to obscure his polygamy activities," which Turner notes makes it difficult to ascertain the full scope and nature of these practices. Polygamy skeptics often don't acknowledge this challenge. Limited Sexual Relations: Turner believes that sexual relations with plural spouses were limited. I'm working on a probability model to explore how often Joseph and another wife besides Emma should have gotten pregnant. Joseph and Emma had nine children (eight pregnancies), proving Joseph's fertility. Skeptics often jump to extremes, either no sex or sex "every night," with "never a happy medium". Denouncing Adultery: Joseph Smith publicly denounced adulteryon pages 276-277 of Turner's book, a point skeptics often over emphasize. The Nancy Rigdon Incident: This incident, leading to the infamous "Happiness Letter," is discussed on pages 277, 286, and 287. Nancy Rigdon rejected Joseph's marriage proposal in April 1842. John C. Bennett later published the "Happiness Letter". Turner considers Sidney Rigdon's denial that Joseph wrotethe letter (as opposed to denying the allegationsthat Joseph propositioned Nancy) a "weak response," especially since Joseph typically used scribes to write almost everything. The Sarah Pratt and John C. Bennett Incident: Also on pages 286-287, this involves Sarah Pratt (married to Orson Hyde) and John C. Bennett. When Orson Hyde discovered a potential relationship between Sarah and Joseph, he wrote a suicide note. In a subsequent meeting, Orson Pratt (Sarah's husband) reportedly opposed Joseph Smith in a subsequent meeting due to the issue with Sarah Pratt, a well-documented story according to Turner and most historians. Brigham Young's Polygamy Rejection: Brigham Young's plural marriage proposal to Martha Brotherton was rejected, as noted on page 289. This isn't a flattering portrayal of polygamy. These "problematic" cases often involve both pro-polygamy (like Brigham Young) and anti-polygamy (like John C. Bennett or Sarah Pratt) sources. Their agreement on key events "is pretty strong evidence that something happened". Overwhelming Evidence: "Prodigious" Polygamy Points Despite the problematic aspects, John Turner consider "overwhelming evidence" for Joseph Smith's involvement in polygamy: Early Sealings:

Joseph Smith's arrest for treason in having the Nauvoo Expositor destroyed led to his death. He didn't use habeas corpus to get out of this jam, and it cost him his life. Dr John Turner shares his reactions to Joseph's life. Check out our conversation... https://youtu.be/pcN0sdqR0ws Don't miss our other conversations with John: https://gospeltangents.com/people/john-turner/ Copyright © 2025 Gospel Tangents All Rights Reserved Except for book reviews, no content may be reproduced without written permission. Recklessness, Revelation, and the Power of Habeas Corpus Joseph Smith, a towering figure in American religious history, saw his life come to a dramatic and tragic end in June 1844. As discussed in this conversation with John Turner, author of "Joseph Smith: The Rise and Fall of an American Prophet," the events leading up to his death reveal a complex interplay of political tension, legal maneuverings, and personal choices. A Provocative Path to Disaster The final six months of Joseph Smith's life were marked by increasingly provocative and reckless actions. He engaged in unnecessary fights, denouncing and antagonizing men from the stand during meetings, almost as if "inviting opposition.” His rhetoric and one-on-one conversations with dissenters were "incautious.” While he was under an “incredible amount of stress" due to fears of enemies and potential execution, this stress often led him to respond in unconstructive ways. A key event was the destruction of the Nauvoo Expositor newspaper in May 1844. This act made him vulnerable to his enemies. While some historians like Michael Quinn have suggested the Council of Fifty minutes and negotiations with foreign nations were a bigger concern than polygamy charges in the Expositor, Joseph and his allies used "salty language" for various objections to the paper, including theological innovations, accumulation of political power, and polygamy. It wasn't a single issue, and despite opponents like William Law finding it difficult to break with Joseph, his incendiary behavior prevented reconciliation. Fateful Return to Nauvoo When Governor Thomas Ford of Illinois sent a posse to arrest Joseph Smith in June 1844, Joseph initially fled across the Mississippi River, contemplating leaving Nauvoo and reuniting with his wife, Emma, elsewhere. He had a history of evading arrest. However, he ultimately chose to return to Nauvoo and go to Carthage to face charges related to the Nauvoo Expositor's destruction. Later sources sometimes blame individuals, like Emma, for convincing him to return, not wanting him to abandon her and the family. However, a contemporary letter from Vilate Kimble states that Joseph "sought the will of the Lord and God told him to return.” This indicates Joseph believed his decision to return was a revelation. The Power and Peril of Habeas Corpus Joseph Smith's experience with legal challenges, particularly his use of habeas corpus, is a significant aspect of his later life. Habeas corpus is a legal mechanism that gives an arrested individual an opportunity for a hearing on the legality of their arrest at the earliest stage of the process. Early, Legitimate Use:Joseph used habeas corpuseffectively to avoid arrest on Missouri charges. For example, when attempts were made to extradite him to Missouri starting around 1841 or 1842, he requested and was granted a writ of habeas corpus from a state judge. Stephen Douglas reportedly heard one such case and freed Joseph, ruling the arrest warrant invalid. This demonstrates how the power was "supposed to work.” Nauvoo's Enhanced Powers:In 1842, the Nauvoo City Council began passing statutes that significantly enhanced its ability to issue writs of habeas corpus, aiming to protect Joseph Smith and other residents from arrest on anycharge – whether internal Nauvoo law, state law, or more serious offenses. Nauvoo's own municipal court, over which Joseph, as mayor, could preside,

We're diving into Nauvoo polygamy & Joseph Smith's many wives. How often did he have sexual relations with his wives? Was it less frequent than many think? John Turner attempts to answer. Check out our conversation... https://youtu.be/1S-ZRA7kFcQ Don't miss our other conversations with John: https://gospeltangents.com/people/john-turner/ Copyright © 2025 Gospel Tangents All Rights Reserved Except for book reviews, no content may be reproduced without written permission Insights into Joseph Smith's Controversial Practice The Nauvoo period (1839-1844) in the history of the Latter-day Saints is a fascinating and often controversial chapter, particularly concerning the practice of plural marriage, or polygamy, by Joseph Smith. Historian John Turner, author of the acclaimed biography "Joseph Smith: The Rise and Fall of American Prophet," sheds light on this complex topic. Nauvoo: A New Beginning and an Acceleration of Vision Following Joseph Smith's escape from jail in Missouri, the Latter-day Saints established a new community in Nauvoo, Illinois. The choice of Nauvoo was largely due to an individual named Isaac Galland, a land speculator who had extensive land holdings on both sides of the Mississippi River in Nauvoo and Iowa. Galland was in contact with church leaders even while Joseph was imprisoned, making the possibility of purchasing these lands an early consideration. Upon arriving in Quincy, Illinois, Joseph Smith quickly pursued these land purchases, and Saints began to gather rapidly on both sides of the Mississippi. Despite facing opposition and being advised by opponents to spread out, Joseph Smith characteristically doubled or tripled down on his vision rather than backing down from setbacks. This resolve led to the quick establishment of Nauvoo, a community that by 1844 rivaled Chicago as the largest city in Illinois. Far from an interruption, Nauvoo represented an "acceleration of Joseph's vision" in the years after 1839. The Astonishing Pace of Plural Marriages It is in this rapidly growing and centralizing community that Joseph Smith's plural marriage practice truly took off. John Turner noted that the pace of Joseph's marriages was "astonishing," with him reportedly taking a dozen wives in 1842 alone. While "monogamy affirmers" or "polygamy skeptics" contend that these events did not occur, most scholars, including John Turner and Larry Foster, agree that the evidence for Joseph Smith's practice of polygamy is "overwhelming". The Evidence: What Do We Know? While it is difficult to precisely date exact timelines or get directly inside Joseph Smith's mind to understand his intentions, there is substantial evidence regarding his polygamous activities. Joseph Smith took pains to keep his plural marriages quiet. However, information comes from: Contemporary Accounts:The William Clayton Journalis described as a "fantastic and extensive contemporary account" that is considered reliable, aligning with other early 1840s sources. Journals kept by Willard Richards and Brigham Young also provide corroborating information. Affidavits and Testimony:Numerous affidavits about Joseph's plural marriages exist, including very late sources like the Temple Lot testimonyfrom a number of his wives and other individuals. Even though the church had a particular purpose in affirming Joseph's polygamy in this legal conflict, testimonies from women like Emily Dow Partridge were "not flattering for Joseph Smith," making it unlikely the church fabricated them. According to Turner, it's an "open and shut case" that Joseph Smith practiced polygamy. Theological Motivations: Getting "All That You Can" Joseph Smith himself did not explicitly articulate a singular reason for the exact number of women he married. However, contextually, and based on what other early Latter-day Saints said about plural marriage during these years, it appears that Joseph connected "the size of an individual's family on earth ...

The origins of polygamy are murky. Was there an 1831 revelation on the topic? What was the nature of the Fanny Alger relationship? We'll also discuss Zion's Camp, and Joseph Smith's dog, Old Major, who caused some issues with the troops. How did Liberty Jail affect Joseph Smith & the Church? John Turner tackles these questions. Check out our conversation... https://youtu.be/v9171F-vXok Don't miss our other conversations with John: https://gospeltangents.com/people/john-turner/ Copyright © 2025 Gospel Tangents All Rights Reserved Except for book reviews, no content may be reproduced without written permission Peering into Joseph Smith's Story We recently had the privilege of delving into the life of Joseph Smith with John Turner, author of the compelling biography, Joseph Smith: The Rise and Fall of an American Prophet. The conversation unpacked some of the most intriguing and lesser-known episodes from Smith's early life, providing valuable context and challenging common narratives. Nuances of the Fanny Alger Controversy One of the topics we explored was the Fanny Alger controversy. While historical sources on this episode are often late or secondhand, making it difficult to write about with confidence, John Turner found persuasive arguments that date Fanny Alger's relationship with Joseph Smith to shortly before she left Kirtland in August or September of 1836. Interestingly, there's been discussion about whether this was an "adoptive sealing." However, John said it's considered unlikely to have been an adoptive sealing because Joseph Smith had not yet fully articulated or developed his understanding of sealing at that time. Oliver Cowdery, a key figure in the early church, certainly didn't view it as such, remaining "very angry about it in early 1838.” Instead, it is most likely to have been "some sort of intimate relationship" that was disturbing to both Oliver Cowdery and Emma Smith. He said It is also considered unlikely to have been a plural marriage. It's worth noting that while sexual impropriety allegations were common against new religious movements, the Fanny Alger controversy, though a "live issue within the church for several years," did not particularly resonate with the church's external critics at the time in the context of plural marriage or polygamy. In fact, the Church's 1835 Declaration on Marriage emphasized monogamy as the standard. Zion's Camp and the Tale of "Old Major" Moving to 1834, we discussed Zion's Camp, Joseph Smith's march to Missouri. While often seen as a significant event for its larger purposes, it also had its lighter — and more human — moments. One such detail involves "Old Major," Joseph Smith's dog. During the challenging and conflict-ridden trip, Old Major didn't get along with another church member, Sylvester Smith (no relation to Joseph). The dog's barking at night and potential attempts to bite Sylvester led to Sylvester speaking "rude things about Joseph Smith's dog" and even wanting to shoot it. In a moment highlighting the "juvenile" but understandable "temper flared" nature of the trip, Joseph Smith reportedly threatened to shoot Sylvester Smith in response. This anecdote underscores that the participants of Zion's Camp were "not all of one heart in mind.” Sylvester Smith later published a confession for opposing Joseph rudely, even managing to say the note was made "under duress.” From a broader perspective, while the spiritual purpose of Zion's Camp — the redemption of Zion — ultimately failed, it was ironically a "very positive thing for many of those who were participants.” Despite Zion not being redeemed and the march stopping short of engaging enemies or reclaiming property, the majority of marchers found their faith strengthened. This was partly because, by accepting the call, they were "further entering into Joseph's story," experiencing "divine promises and chastening and failures" alongside him.

What does John Turner believe about the Golden Plates? Were they made of tin as Dan Vogel asserts? What about the First Vision controversy? Does John think Joseph was a pious fraud? Did Joseph take advantage of Martin Harris? John answers these and other question. Check out our conversation... Copyright © 2025 Gospel Tangents All Rights Reserved Except for book reviews, no content may be reproduced without written permission What Did Joseph Smith Really Have in that Box? Historian John Turner, author of Joseph Smith, The Rise and Fall of an American Prophet, delves into the enduring mystery surrounding Joseph Smith's golden plates and the origins of the Book of Mormon. His insights offer a nuanced perspective, moving beyond simple pronouncements to a historian's critical examination. The Golden Plates: A Historian's Best Judgment When it comes to the golden plates, Turner makes a clear distinction between visionary experiences and material objects. While he acknowledges that understanding Joseph Smith's visions is difficult as a historian, dealing with a physical claim like the golden plates is different. Turner's "best judgment" as a historian is that Joseph Smith did not have actual golden plates. However, he strongly believes Joseph did engage in a "certain amount of subterfuge". Joseph clearly possessed some sort of physical object which he would place in a box, heft around, and at times cover with a linen cloth. Others, including Emma Smith, witnessed an object that seemed like "thin sheets of metal under a linen cloth," suggesting some form of metallic object. For Turner, the simplest explanation for a young man claiming to have a valuable object he can't show to anyone else is that he doesn't have it. This conclusion is also reinforced by his reading of the Book of Mormon as a 19th-century text, rather than an ancient record. If it's a 19th-century text, golden plates aren't necessary, making it "more likely" that the text "flows out of Joseph's literary imagination". Turner emphasizes that this critical examination is not meant to be disrespectful to faithful Latter-day Saints, but rather a serious approach to studying the tradition. The Search for Alternatives: Not Enough Evidence The question of what Joseph might have had in the box has led to various theories: Dan Vogelhas suggested the object might have been made of tin. Sonia Hazard, another scholar, theorizes that Joseph could have encountered printing plates, which served as an inspiration for the project and could have been the object in the box. However, Turner states that there is not enough evidence to support any of these alternative theories. While these are "suggestive possibilities," he concludes, "we can't know. So, I think we have to leave it as a bit of a mystery". He also clarifies that for him, the "absence of evidence for any alternative explanation is [not] evidence for the faithful account". Audacity Over Deception: The Book of Mormon Project Despite his view on the golden plates, Turner doesn't primarily see Joseph Smith as a "fraud," "deceiver," or "impostor". While he acknowledges an "element of deception that gets it off the ground," his main takeaway from the Book of Mormon project is its utter improbability and audacity. Turner describes it as a "hairbrained scheme" that Joseph "pulls off". He points out that it was "utterly unlikely" for a 21-year-old Joseph Smith, without formal education, to embark on such a project and publish a 600-page book. This remarkable literary success, while not a bestseller at the time, certainly had "serious legs". Turner sees this as "an act of audacity" rather than primarily an "act of deception," crediting Joseph Smith with this incredible literary production. Assessing Joseph's Sincerity The question of Joseph Smith's sincerity is complex. Turner generally tries to avoid weighing in on Joseph's sincerity at any given moment,

Fawn Brodie, Richard Bushman, and Dan Vogel have the 3 most popular biographies on Joseph Smith prior to John Turner's latest. Which is best? John will answer that and we'll discuss the First Vision anachronisms. Check out our conversation... https://youtu.be/BOTVrDQJGbc Don't miss our other conversations with John: https://gospeltangents.com/people/john-turner/ Copyright © 2025 Gospel Tangents All Rights Reserved Except for book reviews, no content may be reproduced without written permission Landscape of Joseph Smith Biographies John Turner is author of "Joseph Smith: The Rise and Fall of an American Prophet. Dr. Turner's book enters a field rich with extensive scholarship. He notes that the main biographies over the years include Fawn Brodie's "No Man Knows My History," Richard Bushman's "Rough Stone Rolling," and works by Dan Vogel,[1] Richard Van Wagoner,[2] and Martha Bradley.[3] Fawn Brodie's "No Man Knows My History": Published in 1945, Brodie's work is recognized for her "fantastic writing"and remarkable achievement given her limited access to sources available today. While now "out of date,"it was incredibly popular, with Richard Bushman himself acknowledging its enduring "perch" as a favorite among readers, perhaps due to Brodie's skills as an English major and great writer. She was technically Mormon but very critical of Joseph Smith. Richard Bushman's "Rough Stone Rolling": Dr. Turner expresses "enormous admiration"for Richard Bushman as a person and scholar. Bushman's biography "expertly contextualizes Joseph's life in the culture of the early 19th century United States"and benefits from tremendous access to sources, though notably, it predates the availability of the Joseph Smith Papers. Over the last two decades, "Rough Stone Rolling" has become the "go-to biography for any scholar or seriously interested party in Joseph Smith.” Bushman's work was seen as a more "faithful perspective" in contrast to Brodie's critical stance. Dan Vogel's Contributions: Dr. Turner highlights Dan Vogel as a "really diligent researcher"whose "Early Mormon Documents collection"[4] was an "essential resource for historians"before the Joseph Smith Papers. Vogel's works, including "Joseph Smith, The Making of a Prophet" and "Charisma Under Pressure," mark him as "one of the more significant historians of Mormonism" in this generation. While his books may not have achieved the wide readership of Brodie's or Bushman's, their scholarly value is undeniable. Dr. Turner clarifies that he didn't write his biography because existing ones were "inadequate" or "stink.” Instead, he aimed to write a "different one" that might be "better or does justice to different parts of Joseph's personality.” His approach involved immersing himself in the sources, particularly the Joseph Smith Papers volumes and website, and reading the latest scholarship, rather than directly positioning his work against others. He trusted there would be "room for my perspective from my position.” Unpacking Joseph Smith's Early Life When discussing Joseph Smith's early life, Dr. Turner notes a significant challenge: "we know very little" about the period before 1829. Scarcity of Sources: Most of what is known comes from a small number of sources, or at least only a few that detail events. Lucy Mack Smith's Biography: While a "great source,"Lucy Mack Smith's dictated biography from 1844 (decades after many events) is often the "only source we have to go on,"which presents a "little troublesome" limitation. Joseph Smith's Own Accounts: Joseph himself did not discuss his childhood in any great depth in his histories, only occasionally alluding to it in sermons. Conflicting Recollections: Early accounts of Joseph from Palmyra were often "filed up and divergent," coming from individuals who "were not too impressed with Joseph Smith and his family.” No Prefigured Greatness: Dr. Turner emphasizes that "there was nothing that pr...

How did a non-Mormon who teaches in Virginia get interested in Mormon History? John Turner has written the newest biography of Joseph Smith. He is a professor of History at George Mason University and has written not only the pre-eminent biography of Brigham Young, but has a new biography called "Joseph Smith: The Rise & Fall of an American Prophet." We'll discuss both of these amazing biographies and why he chooses to write about these important Mormon figures. Check out our conversation... Don't miss our other conversations with John: https://gospeltangents.com/people/john-turner/ Copyright © 2025 Gospel Tangents All Rights Reserved Except for book reviews, no content may be reproduced without written permission https://youtu.be/szj5SYdO0wA Dive Deep into Joseph Smith and Brigham Young with Historian John Turner! Are you a fan of Mormon history, science, and theology? Then you won't want to miss the latest interview on Gospel Tangents, featuring renowned East Coast scholar Dr. John Turner. Rick sat down with Dr. Turner to discuss his brand-new book, "Joseph Smith: The Rise and Fall of an American Prophet," which is set to release on Amazon on June 17th. Meet the Historian: Dr. John Turner Dr. John Turner is a professor at George Mason University in Northern Virginia. Turner's academic journey is quite interesting: He completed his undergraduate degree in History and German at Middlebury College in Vermont. He then pursued his PhD in US History at the University of Notre Dame. Interestingly, he took a detour during his PhD to earn a Master of Divinity at Louisville Presbyterian Theological Seminary, an experience he found helpful for writing about religious experience and doctrine with more information and sensitivity. Turner's interest in Latter-day Saint history was sparked by meeting "extremely winsome and engaging personalities" like Patrick Mason and Matt Grow while at Notre Dame. He also realized that the Latter-day Saint story was a bit of local history for him, having grown up near Palmyra, New York, "where it all began." Although his dissertation focused on American evangelicalism, he sought to learn new things for his second project and found the Joseph Smith and Brigham Young eras "so fascinating.” Non-Mormon Scholar's Perspective on Mormon History Dr. Turner has authored multiple books on Mormonism, including "Brigham Young: Pioneer Prophet" and "The Mormon Jesus," in addition to his new Joseph Smith biography. As a non-Mormon (he identifies as Trinitarian), Turner notes a key difference in his approach: he can express his conclusions and share his findings without worrying about "an ecclesiastical reaction" or "getting excommunicated," which might be a concern for Latter-day Saint scholars. He is "pretty single-minded" when working on a book, focusing on one project at a time. Inspiration Behind the Joseph Smith Biography Turner found it "a really good time to take on a Jo Smith biography"11. His primary motivations for writing about Joseph Smith, especially after his Brigham Young book, were twofold12: Engaging Foundational Questions: Writing about Brigham Young allowed him to largely "take for granted" core beliefs and events, but with Joseph Smith, it was an "opportunity and a challenge to return to that... foundational time period" and "engage some hard questions". These include questions about golden plates, divine messages, and Joseph's motivations for plural marriage. Joseph Smith as a Biographical Subject: Turner describes Joseph Smith as a "great biographical subject" – a "mirthful, colorful man" who is "energetic and dynamic." His public life, spanning essentially 15 years, was "packed" with events, demanding a "fast-paced story". Turner also lavishes praise on the Joseph Smith Papers project, calling it "fantastic" and an "enormously useful" resource that provided a "huge head start" due to its accurate transcriptions, images,

What do Land Deeds in Nauvoo have to do with D&C 132? It turns out there is a controversy where an argument is made for and against 132 being legit vs forgery. Mary Ann Clements weighs in on the controversy. Check out our conversation with Mary Ann about her chapter in Secret Covenants... Sign up to our free newsletter!  https://gospeltangents.com/newsletter https://youtu.be/s2zWvjVzQbA Don't miss our other conversations with Mary Ann: https://gospeltangents.com/people/mary-ann-clements/ Copyright © 2025 Gospel Tangents All Rights Reserved Except for book reviews, no content may be reproduced without written permission How Nauvoo Land Deeds Shed Light on Mormon Polygamy Debates At the heart of some of current polygamy discussions lies the authenticity of historical documents, particularly the William Clayton Journal. Recent research delving into Nauvoo land deeds offers fascinating insights, not only into Joseph Smith's financial dealings but also into the controversy surrounding early polygamy. Mary Ann Clemens, one of the authors in "Secret Covenants: New Insights into Mormon Polygamy," highlights how land deeds have become a focal point for both proving and disproving claims about Joseph Smith's early practice of polygamy. The William Clayton Journal: Forgery or Validation? One of the central debates in skeptical circles concerns whether the William Clayton Journal is a forgery. Mary Ann Clemens disagrees with this argument. Her reasoning, and the focus of her recent research, involves the detailed examination of Nauvoo land deeds, specifically those made on July 12, 1843, to Emma Smith. Don Bradley's Argument for Validation: According to Don Bradley, the July 12, 1843 deeds to Emma Smith serve as an element that confirms or validates the William Clayton diaries. This date is significant because it's the day the polygamy revelation (Section 132) was written. The traditional narrative suggests that Hyrum Smith attempted to convince Emma of polygamy that day, but Emma vehemently denied it. As a result of this conversation, a decision was made to deed Emma all the unencumbered lots in Nauvoo. William Clayton's journal, a couple of days later, corroborates this, mentioning the drawing up of the deed and giving Emma the lots. The deeds were initially recorded in the Nauvoo Register book in 1843 by William Clayton himself, which some skeptics distrust due to his involvement. However, in July 1844, just after Joseph Smith's death, these deeds were also recorded in the Hancock County deed records, providing an independent record that, from Bradley's perspective, confirms the story in Clayton's journal. The Skeptic's Counter-Argument: Michelle Stone's Research Despite the evidence, some see these same deeds as disproving William Clayton's journal. Michelle Stone's research unearthed a fascinating detail: A July 12, 1843 draft deed to Hyrum Smith: Stone discovered a deed, dated July 12, 1843, that was fully written out but never signed or completed. This draft was intended for Joseph Smith's brother, Hyrum, and listed many of the same properties that were later deeded to Emma. Stone argues that because there's no explanation for why Hyrum was receiving these properties, it couldn't have been related to polygamy. She questions why the Joseph Smith Papers project labeled this a "draft." Why "Draft"? And the True Story Behind the Deeds Mary Ann Clemens provides clarification, agreeing with the "draft" designation for several reasons: The draft deed to Hyrum had Hyrum's name scratched out and Emma's name written in on the back.. It was never signed or recorded anywhere. Another draft deed to Emma, also dated July 12, was found. This one listed an extra lot not on county records and didn't finish the boilerplate language. These drafts are critical. While people like Michelle Stone argue they represent distinct transactions or prove deception,

Many scholars have made the claim that the polygamy revelation in D&C 132 is really 4 different revelations mashed into one. Does David Hocking agree? We will discuss that revelation, along with the revelation that says Lehi landed in Chile. David is a Heartlander. Does he agree? We'll discuss his book, "Revelations of Joseph Smith." Check out our conversation... https://youtu.be/HR2NovCIj7E Don't miss our other conversations with David Hocking: http://gospeltangents.com/people/david-hocking Copyright © 2025 Gospel Tangents All Rights Reserved Except for book reviews, no content may be reproduced without written permission.   Copyright © 2025 Gospel Tangents All Rights Reserved Except for book reviews, no content may be reproduced without written permission.

We'll discuss changes in revelations for the Doctrine & Covenants and JST.  Joseph Smith got a revelation to get a Canadian copyright for the Book of Mormon. It didn't succeed. Is this a failed revelation? David Hocking weighs in on that uncanonized revelation in his new book "The Revelations of Joseph Smith." Check out our conversation.. https://youtu.be/5WdAr21wooI Don't miss our other conversations with David Hocking: http://gospeltangents.com/people/david-hocking Copyright © 2025 Gospel Tangents All Rights Reserved Except for book reviews, no content may be reproduced without written permission. 0:00 Book of Mormon Canadian Copyright 12:45 Changes in Revelations 16:47 JST Bible What You'll Find in "The Revelations of Joseph Smith" Hocking's primary focus in this book is on Joseph Smith's personal revelations and history, as published by the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints between 1902 and 1912, chosen specifically because it is in the public domain. He intentionally does not include revelations attributed to later church leaders like Brigham Young or Joseph F. Smith, nor does he include the official declarations (OD 1 & 2) or the section about the martyrdom, as these were not Joseph Smith's revelations. Key features and inclusions in the book: Uncanonized Revelations: The book features revelations that are not part of the standard Doctrine and Covenants. A notable example is the revelation concerning the Canadian copyright for the Book of Mormon, which, although controversial because the attempt to secure the copyright was unsuccessful, is included as it is part of Joseph Smith's history. Color-Coded Text for Voices: To enhance understanding, Hocking uses a unique color-coding system for different voices: ◦ Red text signifies direct speech from God (Heavenly Father, Holy Spirit, or Jesus Christ). For instance, the Canadian copyright revelation is shown in red, indicating it's the voice of Heavenly Father. ◦ Blue text is used for words spoken by angels.Blue text also indicates quoted scripture, such as sections where the Lord quotes Isaiah, helping readers identify the source of the text. Multiple First Vision Accounts: The book compiles various versions of Joseph Smith's First Vision accounts, including the 1832, 1835, and the 1842 Wentworth letter version, offering a comprehensive view of these foundational spiritual experiences. Patriarchal Blessings: Hocking includes patriarchal blessings given to Joseph Smith and Emma Smith. This includes Joseph Sr.'s blessing to his son, Joseph Jr., where Joseph of Egypt is quoted, highlighted in blue to denote quoted scripture and structured poetically for readability. Emma Smith's patriarchal blessing is also included, rendered in red text, indicating it as a revelation from the Lord's voice. Oliver Cowdery's Revelation to Joseph: A particularly moving inclusion is a blessing given by Oliver Cowdery to Joseph Smith, which Oliver received as a revelation. The Book of Mormon Printing Miracle: Hocking delves into the intricate process and efforts required to publish the Book of Mormon, detailing the "mechanism" and "lot of work that went into it.” Correlation between Joseph Smith and Enoch: The book explores the connections and correlations between Joseph Smith's experiences and the biblical figure of Enoch. The Joseph Smith Translation (JST) of the Bible Hocking has also published a book on the Joseph Smith Translation (JST), also known as the Inspired Version of the Bible. Joseph Smith viewed this work as a direct commandment from God, a "branch of his calling," to make "updates or corrections" to the Old and New Testaments. Key aspects of Hocking's JST book: Revelation-Driven Process: The JST process began with revelations like the Vision of Moses (a prologue to Genesis) and the Prophecy of Enoch, which significantly expand on what's found in traditional Old Testament.

We'll discuss the revelations from 1834-1838 including the uncanonized Zelph Revelation. In 1834, Joseph Smith changed the name of the church from Church of Christ to Church of the Latter Day Saints. Check out our conversation... https://youtu.be/ogCyg94XghM Copyright © 2025 Gospel Tangents All Rights Reserved Except for book reviews, no content may be reproduced without written permission Uncanonized Zelph Revelation One particularly intriguing inclusion in Hocking's book, treated as a revelation although not canonized by the LDS Church today, is the account of Zelph. This account originates from Joseph Smith's history and details an experience while roving over the plains of the Nephites during Zion's Camp. Joseph Smith described discovering a skeleton. Through a vision or revelation, he understood that the person was "a white Lamanite, a large thick set man, and a man of God" named Zelph. Zelph was identified as "a warrior and a chieftain under the great prophet Onandagus who named from the eastern sea." The eastern sea is likened to Lake Ontario. The account describes Zelph's injuries, including a broken side caused by a stone from a sling and death from an arrow found among his ribs during a battle. Hocking notes that B.H. Roberts, in a book written before his involvement with History of the Church, also discussed Zion's Camp passing mysterious earth mounds, which Roberts suggested were related to the Nephites, Lamanites, or people of Jared. Hocking sees Joseph Smith's account of finding Zelph as a way of demonstrating a physical witness of the Book of Mormon peoples. Joseph Smith, having provided the spiritual testimony through the translated book, was now offering a physical witness for those on the journey. Those who went on Zion's Camp reportedly stayed faithful, potentially due to this physical witness. While the story of Zelph might seem "fantastical" to some, and perhaps for this reason it hasn't been canonized by the modern LDS church, Hocking includes it because Joseph Smith presented it as a revelation where the heavens were opened and the Almighty gave him understanding. Later Revelations and Profound Connections Moving into the later period (1838-1843), which includes the Nauvoo temple era, Hocking's book covers 20 revelations. He also includes statements from Joseph Smith that he treats "as if they're revelations because they're statements." One powerful example is found in what is now Section 128 of the Doctrine and Covenants. While in hiding, Joseph Smith wrote a letter to the church about baptisms for the dead. Within this letter, he includes what Hocking calls a "poetical utterance," similar to passages in Nephi or Lehi. Joseph Smith speaks of glad tidings from Cumorah and Moroni, the voices of Peter, James, and John on the banks of the Mississippi, the voice of the Heavenly Father, and significantly, the voices of Michael the archangel, Gabriel, Raphael, and "diverse angels from Michael or Adam down to the present time." These angels are described as declaring their dispensations, rights, honors, keys, majesty, glory, and priesthood power. Hocking found this section particularly striking after studying the Book of Enoch, which features conversations with Michael, Gabriel, and Raphael. He posits that Joseph Smith is a "new Enoch," drawing parallels between their lives. Furthermore, Hocking discovered profound correlations between Joseph Smith's translation work and other ancient texts. He highlights the Joseph Smith Translation of Genesis 18, where three men who visit Abraham are identified as "angels which were holy men and they were sent after the order of God," in contrast to the King James Version which simply calls them "three men". Comparing this to the Book of Jasher (published 10 years after Joseph Smith's revelation), Hocking found a passage stating, "and the Lord appeared unto him at the plain and sent three of his ministering angels." Delving deeper,

David Hocking has put together several Annotated Scriptures. We'll discuss his latest book, which is sort of an Annotated Doctrine & Covenants. It is called "The Revelations of Joseph Smith." We'll also discuss his previous books, and dive into revelations on the coming forth of the Book of Mormon & the Church of Christ. Check out our conversation... https://youtu.be/JjvC2RZtJrM Copyright © 2025 Gospel Tangents All Rights Reserved Except for book reviews, no content may be reproduced without written permission David Hocking, described as a "scripture publisher" and editor, who is known for reformatting traditional scriptural texts to help readers engage with them more smoothly. By taking the existing text and applying specific elements and styles, Hocking aims to guide the reader and provide additional context and research. His books are often described as a "studied" version of the scripture. Hocking's process involves doing research on words or phrases that appeal to him, highlighting them in a gold color, and then providing additional information in a golden shaded box at the bottom of the page. His journey in scripture publishing began in the '90s when he started reformatting the Book of Mormon for his own use. This eventually led to the Annotated Edition of the Book of Mormon, which incorporated research, including information from the Heartland perspective. This book has been quite successful, with close to 40,000 copies sold and is available through Deseret Book. Following the Book of Mormon, Hocking worked on the Book of Jasher. He clarified that "Jasher" is a title, "Sephur Hayasher," meaning "the book of the upright," and the proper spelling should be Yashar. Interestingly, he notes that there are excerpts of the Book of Jasher in the Book of Mormon, brought over on the plates of brass. This led to a brief discussion on the language of the Book of Mormon, suggesting that Nephi likely learned Demotic Egyptian, a condensed, script-like form, in addition to Hebrew, and that "reformed Egyptian" might refer to a reformed Demotic Egyptian. He also touched on the difference between the Anthon Transcript (described by Martin Harris) and the Caracters Document in John Whitmer's handwriting (which the Church has recently acquired). He noted that handwriting analysis, specifically looking at the cursive "D" with a flourish common in German script, can help identify scribes like John Whitmer in early documents, including sections of the Book of Mormon original manuscript and the Revelation books. He also offered a perspective on the two sets of witnesses (three spiritual, eight physical) and the possibility they saw different sets of plates (the plates in the stone box vs. plates in a repository, potentially the small plates used to replace the lost Book of Lehi pages)10. Other books Hocking has edited include the Book of Isaiah, undertaken as part of the "11th commandment" to diligently search Isaiah. He sent a copy to Dr. Avraham Gileadi, a prominent LDS Isaiah scholar, who liked it. (Incidentally, the host mentioned NT Wright would be speaking on Isaiah in Houston, Texas). Hocking also worked on the Joseph Smith Translation (JST) of the New Testament. For this, he put Joseph Smith's contributions in brackets, using the 1867 first edition text. He mentioned that the Church itself is likely to release a fully done version of the JST in the coming years. He has a new version of his JST New Testament coming out soon as a red-letter edition. He noted that while red-letter Bibles (where the words of Christ are in red) are common elsewhere, they are less familiar in Utah. Another critical project was the Book of Enoch, which he believes explains why Enoch is an important figure and why the Lord referred to him in Moses 6 & 7 and D&C 107. He suggests that Joseph Smith himself became a modern-day Enoch, teaching and building a city of righteousness/Zion. Hocking's latest book,

History was made Sunday night in Independence, Missouri. The Community of Christ gathered for the election and ordination of the 1st female prophet president in Community of Christ. It was a a momentous occasion. The focus of the event was Stassi Cramm, who was anticipated to take on this significant leadership role, following Steven Veazey's retirement. She will be the 1st female prophet-president of Community of Christ, and just the 2nd female leader of a Restoration Church since Pauline Hancock. https://youtu.be/PFtd6ysXpNs Copyright © 2025 Gospel Tangents All Rights Reserved Except for book reviews, no content may be reproduced without written permission I was surprised that they formally dissolved the First Presidency, before the nomination process moved forward. (That seemed like an LDS thing to do to counter Sidney Rigdon's claim to the presidency.) Following that procedure, the conference was turned over to the president of the Council of Twelve, Mareva Arnaud Tchong (a French-speaking Tahitian woman) who led the conference through the succession process. In one of the Saturday sessions, Stassi Cramm formally accepted her nomination. Leading up to the vote, which was scheduled for 2:00 PM Central time, discussions were held in quorum caucus meetings. While it was acknowledged that there might be some opposition or abstentions, there was strong anticipation of support for Stassi Cramm, with reports of full support from the evangelists quorum and no opposition reported in the high priests quorum, though some abstentions occurred. It was speculated that the vote could be a slam dunk, indicating overwhelming support. I would estimate that 95+% of the delegates voted in favor of Stassi's ordination. There were a few who voted in opposition. 1st Female Prophet-President The anticipation culminated in the official proceedings. On June 1st, 2025, Stassi Cramm was officially sustained during the 2 pm session, and ordained prophet president of the Community of Christ during a 7 pm session. This moment was described as an “amazing service” that was “spirit-filled.” This ordination marks a truly historic milestone for the Community of Christ, as Stassi Cramm becomes the first female prophet president for the church. It should be noted that Stassi is not the first female to lead a restoration group. Pauline Hancock is noted as the first female leader in the restoration movement. Stassi Cramm holds this specific title for the Community of Christ. Following the ordination, a rousing anthem was sung by the congregation, “A Spirit of God Like a Fire is Burning,” with special emphasis of “We'll sing, and we'll SHOUT with the armies of heaven.” It was quite a moment. The theme of the week was is “to have hope,” and Stassi Cramm's leadership is seen as potentially sparking that hope further, encouraging members not to give up on the church or its doctrines. Stassi comes in at a tough financial time in the church, which sold off the Kirtland Temple and significant Nauvoo properties. She will have a tough time righting the financial ship as tithe payers age and younger members haven't been stepping up to support the church. The conference will continue through the rest of the week as delegates vote 6 new apostles (to replace retiring or apostles moving onto other callings) and several resolutions dealing with copyrighted works, the Holy Land, stewardship of church properties, reviewing bylaws, climate emergency, confiscation of monies in AIP accounts, sale of church properties, bicentennial D&C/Book of Mormon, and reducing gun violence. Delegates will vote to amend, affirm or oppose these resolutions this coming week. At any rate, the week started off with a celebration of Stassi Cramm's ordination as new prophet president. What are your thoughts on the news? Copyright © 2025 Gospel Tangents All Rights Reserved Except for book reviews, no content may be reproduced without written permission

Joseph Fielding Smith is the architect of controversial LDS orthodoxy. He has some controversial writings about Blacks and Ezra Taft Benson. We'll also delve into his role with Lowell Bennion, a BYU professor who was fired. Was JFS responsible or was it someone else? Matthew Bowman answers. We'll also dive into his role in shaping orthodoxy in the 20th century. Check out our conversation... https://youtu.be/toqjRr1B8Eo Joseph Fielding Smith: Architect of Controversial LDS Orthodoxy Joseph Fielding Smith described as a "lightning rod" due to some views considered politically incorrect today, particularly regarding race. Dr. Matt Bowman, author of "Joseph Fielding Smith, a Mormon Theologian," sheds light on Smith's impact on the church. One of the most uncomfortable aspects of Smith's legacy is his writings about Black individuals, especially concerning the priesthood. In his work, The Way to Perfection, Smith explicitly stated his subscription to the theory that people of African descent were less righteous in the pre-existence. He used language suggesting they were "not entitled to be born white." Smith was a staunch "defender of the racial restrictions" in the Church and became a major exponent of the idea, which the source traces back to Orson Hyde, that Black people possessed souls less righteous in the pre-existence. This stance led to prominent public clashes, notably with church educator Lowell Bennion at a symposium in the early 1950s. Their argument over the ban contributed to Bennion's eventual dismissal by Ernest Wilkinson, who was president of BYU and commissioner of church education. Wilkinson viewed Bennion as too liberal on race and saw Smith as an ally in this regard. While Wilkinson was the person who carried out the dismissal, the collision with Fielding Smith helped instigate the decision. Disagreement with Benson Smith also had complex relationships, even with those seen as ideologically sympathetic. Despite being viewed as a fellow conservative, Smith had significant disagreements with Ezra Taft Benson. A letter from Smith exists in which he hoped Benson's "blood will be purified" upon his return from a mission in Europe in the 1960s. Smith was skeptical of the Church becoming heavily involved in American politics, viewing Benson's fascination with politics as distasteful and inappropriate for an apostle. He considered it "unseemly" and "disreputable." Smith also saw Benson as a conspiracy theorist, distinguishing standard conservative politics (like that of Dwight Eisenhower or David McKay) from conspiracy theory. Smith hoped Benson's time away would rid him of these inclinations, allowing him to return as an apostle rather than an aspiring amateur politician. This highlights that "real deep divides" can exist even within the conservative camp. Controversial LDS Orthodoxy Perhaps Smith's most enduring theological contribution was his role in developing the idea of orthodoxy within the Latter-day Saint tradition. Orthodoxy, an older Protestant concept particularly associated with John Calvin, posits that being a faithful member requires believing certain things and that incorrect beliefs can jeopardize salvation. This was not a central idea in the early Christian Church's first century. Smith, possibly influenced by Protestant fundamentalism, began insisting in the mid-20th century that belief is actually really important and that believing "the correct ideas" were crucial because incorrect beliefs could "ruin your salvation." He defended this notion vigorously. Historically, while early Christianity saw debates over ideas like the Trinity, and Roman Catholicism emphasized sacraments and art for teaching, the strong push for average members to understand and adhere to correct doctrine emerged from the Reformed Protestant tradition. Smith's emphasis on orthodoxy gained significant traction in the church. When he became President, many members of the Quorum of the Twelve were individuals he ...

Joseph Fielding Smith, a towering figure in the 20th-century Latter-day Saint landscape, is often remembered as a theologian and Church leader. But his long tenure as Church Historian also positioned him as a key interpreter of Mormon history, an area where his approach offers a fascinating case study in the relationship between faith, perspective, and the writing of the past. Our recent discussion drawing from the sources explored this complex legacy, highlighting Smith's contributions alongside critical insights into the nature of historical objectivity and bias. https://youtu.be/EyAoFsz9mn0 Church Historian When Joseph Fielding Smith became Church Historian, he faced the significant challenge of organizing sprawling, uncatalogued collections. He initiated processes that professionalized the church archives, particularly after World War II, by creating finding aids, dividing materials into collections, making lists, and microfilming documents. However, from the perspective of a professional academic historian, Smith's method of engaging with historical sources differed markedly. He treated certain documents, like the Bible and those produced by figures he considered revelators such as Joseph Smith Jr. and Joseph F. Smith, as entirely reliable and didn't subject them to critical interrogation. This lack of "suspicion of sources"—the practice of asking who wrote a document, when, and what biases they might have—is highlighted as a key distinction between Smith and professional academics. His influential book, Essentials in Church History, exemplifies this approach, treating "official LDS sources" uncritically, yet it became a foundational text shaping LDS understanding of their history for decades. This brings us to a core concept in academic historical study: the non-existence of "objective history." Writing academic history itself is considered a bias. The aim for professional historians is not to eliminate bias, which is seen as impossible, but rather to be acutely aware of bias—both in the sources they use and in their own perspectives—and to account for it in their work. This requires adhering to methods and principles developed over generations of scholarship. Mature scholarship involves being frank about one's own point of view and how it might influence interpretations. Trying to pretend one is objective is seen as a mistake. Richard Bushman is presented as an example of a scholar who openly discusses his background and how it might shape his work. RLDS Polygamy Skeptics The sources also reveal how bias can influence not just conclusions, but the very questions a historian thinks to ask—or doesn't ask. While "motivated reasoning" (steering sources to a predetermined conclusion) exists, it might be less common than bias manifesting in the kinds of questions that arise from a historian's background and positionality. The discussion used the example of Richard and Pamela Price's hypothesis regarding the influence of Cochranites on the Quorum of the Twelve and the practice of polygamy. While the Prices found evidence of contact between the groups, they reportedly don't account for the significant chronological gap between this contact and the public announcement of polygamy. This failure to ask about or explain this gap is suggested as stemming from their predisposition to believe the Quorum of the Twelve were the originators of polygamy. Most Influential Writer Joseph Fielding Smith was a prolific writer. Beyond Essentials in Church History, other notable works include The Way to Perfection, a narrative history of humanity from pre-existence to afterlife, where he explicitly stated his views on race. He also authored Man His Origin and Destiny (1954), which he considered his most important book, responding to higher criticism of the Bible and the theory of evolution. Perhaps his most widely read work during his lifetime was his "My Question" column in the Improvement Era church magazine,

Joseph Fielding Smith: evolution was not something he thought highly of. The son of Joseph F. Smith and grandson of Hyrum Smith, was a prominent figure in the history of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. As an apostle from 1910 and later Church President, he became known for his strong defense of traditional doctrines, often clashing with those who sought to reconcile faith with modern scientific and academic thought. https://youtu.be/8Kq1TVQBQtE Don't miss our other conversations about this book! https://gospeltangents.com/lds_people_historical/joseph-fielding-smith/ Joseph Fielding Smith Evolution One of the most famous conflicts involved the theory of evolution and the age of the Earth. Smith staunchly opposed the idea of an old earth, particularly the notion of human-like creatures or pre-Adamites living before Adam and Eve. His core objection wasn't simply to evolution itself, but to the idea that there could have been death before the Fall of Adam and Eve. Smith believed that death entered the world because of the Fall, and if death existed before then, it would undermine the necessity and efficacy of the Atonement of Jesus Christ. This principle of no death before the Fall was central to his arguments. This perspective led to direct clashes with contemporaries like James E. Talmage and John A. Widtsoe, who were generally more open to scientific ideas. The most notable dispute involved B.H. Roberts's book manuscript, The Truth, The Way, The Life, which attempted to reconcile a very old Earth and the possibility of pre-Adamites with the Genesis account. Roberts proposed that Adam and Eve were the first humans with souls, not necessarily the first biological humans. As a member of the church's publications committee, Smith absolutely rejected Roberts's ideas, protesting their publication to the Quorum of the Twelve and the First Presidency. While this conflict brewed behind the scenes, Smith publicly denounced the idea of an old Earth and pre-Adamites in a speech. In response, Talmage gave a talk endorsing the possibility of an older Earth, highlighting some public disagreement among church leaders. Ultimately, the First Presidency chose not to endorse either side and requested both men cease public conflict on the issue, preventing Roberts's book from being published at that time. Smith, however, outlived many of his contemporaries and later published his own book, Man His Origin and Destiny, which strongly attacked Darwinism and the higher criticism of the Bible. Family Trauma Smith's career as a defender of traditional beliefs was significantly shaped by his upbringing and early experiences. His father, Joseph F. Smith, was called to testify before Congress during the Reed Smoot hearings. During these hearings, the Reorganized Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints (RLDS), led by descendants of Joseph Smith Jr., saw an opportunity. Richard Evans, an RLDS apostle, issued broadsides accusing the LDS Church of corruption, denouncing Brigham Young for originating polygamy and blood atonement, and claiming the RLDS Church was the true successor to Joseph Smith. This became a "family feud.” Joseph F. Smith was infuriated and asked his son, Joseph Fielding Smith, to refute Richard Evans. This charge launched Joseph Fielding Smith into a career of research and writing, focusing on apologetics – the defense of religious beliefs. He published pamphlets refuting Evans, arguing that polygamy originated with Joseph Smith Jr., not Brigham Young. This pamphlet feud led to exchanges in newspaper op-ed pages and solidified Smith's path. He began working in the Church Historian's office during this time and soon became Church Historian, serving for decades until he became Church President in 1970. Fight with Academics His long tenure as Church Historian meant he had significant influence. Unlike contemporaries like Talmage, Widtsoe, Joseph Merrill, Adam Bennion, and B.H.

Dr. Matthew Bowman has just released a new biography on Joseph Fielding Smith. Bowman is the Howard W. Hunter Chair of Mormon Studies at Claremont Graduate University in Claremont, California. The Mormon Studies chair Bowman holds at Claremont Graduate University is the oldest in the country, having been established over 15 years ago. Bowman is the third person to hold the chair, following Richard Bushman and Patrick Mason. Patrick Mason left Claremont to take the chair at Utah State University. https://youtu.be/6VrK15TQVcY Don't miss our other episodes with Dr Matthew Bowman! https://gospeltangents.com/people/matthew-bowman/ Copyright © 2025 Gospel Tangents All Rights Reserved Except for book reviews, no content may be reproduced without written permission. Mormon Studies Other Mormon studies chairs exist at the Graduate Theological Union in Berkeley (held by Deidre J Green), and the University of Virginia. Although not directly affiliated with Claremont, the late Jan Shipps is credited with making the study of the Mormon tradition a legitimate academic pursuit for those outside the tradition, enabling universities like Claremont without historical ties to Mormonism to establish such a chair. Before the endowed chair, Anne Taves, a professor interested in Mormonism, taught American religious history at CGU, and Armand Mauss was involved in fundraising and occasionally taught classes. Introductions to Mormon Thought Bowman is also involved in the "Introductions to Mormon Thought" book series, which he co-edits with Joseph Spencer. Published by the University of Illinois, the series aims to stimulate the growth of Mormon intellectual history through accessible introductory volumes on important Mormon thinkers. The series broadly defines "Mormon thinkers" to include artists like CCA Christensen and Minerva Teichert, alongside more traditional intellectuals. The books are intended to be short, accessible, and explore how these individuals influenced how members of the Mormon tradition understood themselves. The series uses the term "Mormon" intentionally broadly to encompass all denominations and movements originating from Joseph Smith's work, including fundamentalist Mormons and figures from the Community of Christ. While initially planned for 10-15 books, the series is doing well and is expected to continue. Other volumes in the series cover figures such as Eugene England (by Christine Hagund), Vardis Fisher (by Mike Austin), Sonia Johnson (by Chris Talbot), Lowell Bennion (by George Handley), Hugh Nibley (by Joseph Spencer), and Richard Bushman (by JB Haws). A future volume is planned on Eliza R. Snow (by Deidre Green), and Bowman hopes for one on Sheri Dew. Joseph Fielding Smith Bowman chose to write his book in the series about Joseph Fielding Smith, though his initial interest was in Bruce R. McConkie. He agreed to write about Smith instead to secure another author's participation in the series. Bowman views Joseph Fielding Smith as Bruce R. McConkie's intellectual parent and considers him the most significant LDS theologian of the 20th century, leaving a deeper and more persistent mark than others like James E. Talmage. While McConkie was influential, Bowman sees him more as a systematizer of his father-in-law's ideas rather than being an original. Other significant 20th/21st-century Mormon thinkers mentioned include B.H. Roberts, Margarita Bautista, Sheri Dew, and Leverne Parmley.. A significant fact about Joseph Fielding Smith is that he was the grandson of Hyrum Smith and the son of Joseph F. Smith. Bowman emphasizes that being a "Smith" was incredibly important to Fielding Smith, shaping his sense of duty and responsibility to continue his family's work. His memories of his father and uncle's violent deaths and his father's need to hide from federal marshals profoundly influenced him, fostering a sense of defensiveness and a perception that the world was hostile and persecuted the family f...

In our final conversation with Dr Margaret Toscano, we'll discuss the chapter in Sara Patterson's book, "The Sept 6 & the Struggle for the Soul of Mormonism." Margaret will discuss her and her husband Paul's reaction to Sara's descriptions of them in the book. Check out our conversation... https://youtu.be/LqxYh6QHY3E Don't miss our other conversations about the Sept Six: https://gospeltangents.com/mormon_history/sept-six/ Copyright © 2024 Gospel Tangents All Rights Reserved Beyond the Sept 6 More than two decades after the events known as the "Sept 6," Margaret Toscano offers a candid look back, reflecting on the pain of excommunication, the evolution of her personal beliefs, and how she and her husband, Paul Toscano, hope to be remembered beyond that defining moment. Margaret highlights what she feels Patterson's book misses about her and others' journeys since 2003. Toscano reveals that her 2003 interview, featured in the book, captured a time of significant pain. Being kicked out of one's church, even for someone who might not be a "Believer," is deeply painful, particularly when it's tied to one's heritage and family, a sentiment she notes is also true for others like David Wright. She is proud of her ability to navigate that pain and notes the documentation of it in the book is important. Contrary to advice she received to simply "walk away" from Mormonism to heal, Toscano felt compelled to stay engaged. She identifies as Mormon, distinguishing this from being LDS (a member of the LDS Church), and views it as her ethnicity and heritage. This identity is crucial to her, and she has continued to write, research, and discuss Mormon issues, currently working on a book about Heavenly Mother.. Over the past twenty years, Toscano's spiritual journey has evolved. While not a "true believing Mormon," she has reached a point where she can openly say she is a Believer on some level, a stance she felt ashamed of years ago. Her ideas of God are complex and not aligned with traditional Mormon views, but she believes in God, an afterlife, and the soul. She describes herself as a "skeptic believer," a person who doubts everything but has also had experiences that affirm her faith. Crucially, she feels able to claim her spirituality openly, something she couldn't do as easily two decades prior. She asserts that being a scholar and an intellectual is compatible with having faith. A major point of reflection for Toscano is the legacy she and Paul desire. They explicitly state they do not want the September Six to be the sole definition of who they were. Margaret doesn't want to be remembered "simply as a dissident," nor does Paul want to be remembered simply as one of the Sept 6. Toscano highlights that Paul's faith journey continued significantly after 2007, when the book reportedly leaves him having lost his faith. Paul has since "found his faith again," seeing himself as a Mormon Christian with a deep testimony of Jesus Christ, which informs his interpretation of the Book of Mormon and his extensive writing. Margaret is immensely proud of Paul's intellectual output, which includes some fifteen books—theology, memoir, novels, essays, and more. She wishes for him to be remembered primarily as a "man of Mormon letters," an important Mormon intellectual, and a brilliant writer. As for herself, Toscano hopes to be remembered as an important Mormon scholar and a beloved teacher at the University of Utah, emphasizing her continued work and care for the Mormon community. She underscores the importance of remembering and being remembered, noting her critique that the book overlooks the continued contributions and experiences of many involved in the 1993 events, including her own work and relationships since 2003. Toscano also touches on the changes she's observed in Mormon studies and at the Sunstone conference, where she was a frequent participant for decades..

I asked about Peggy Fletcher Stack's opinion. Central to Peggy's thirty-plus-year career is her unwavering commitment to journalistic ethics and objectivity. https://youtu.be/yFqxStPt0NA Remember, this is a secret episode. Sign up at gospeltangents.com/newsletter to get the link to the secret episode emailed to you. Don't miss our other conversations with Peggy: https://gospeltangents.com/people/peggy-fletcher-stack/ Copyright © 2025 Gospel Tangents All Rights Reserved Peggy Fletcher Stack's Opinion She is asked daily about her personal faith but maintains it is "not for public disclosure," stating she is a "person of faith" who respects others but keeps her own private. She firmly believes a credible journalist cannot be an opinion writer. She actively avoids expressing personal opinions on politics or religion in her reporting or on social media. While her choice of stories and sources reveals focus, she strives for neutrality in her own voice. This commitment means she receives criticism from all sides, even noting she gets "more hate mail than our sports reporters." She highlights the challenge that some readers and even sources don't grasp why journalists don't simply adopt a specific viewpoint or give the LDS Church the "last word." She explains her approach to sourcing often prioritizes current "stakeholders" within a faith community for present-day issues, while respecting former members' perspectives on their personal journeys but finding them less ideal sources for current church affairs. Dramatic Transformation in Journalism The conversation also underscores the dramatic transformation in journalism brought by the internet. Contrasting with her early freelance days in Kenya where in-person interviews and library research were essential, online resources now make research significantly easier. However, this ease has contributed to journalism becoming a 24/7 job, with constant demands and potentially less emphasis on crucial in-person reporting. Peggy cautions that younger reporters can sometimes mistake online "buzz" for broad public concern, stressing the importance of understanding what "average believers in the pew" are discussing. Peggy also touched on the dramatic transformation in journalism due to the internet, contrasting her early freelance days in Kenya with the 24/7 nature of reporting today. While online resources make research easier, the constant demand and decreased emphasis on in-person reporting present new challenges. Despite these challenges and the constant criticism, Peggy finds her job exciting, enjoying the process of analyzing and connecting the dots. She has no immediate plans to retire, suggesting the 2034 Olympics as a potential bookend for her career since her first story coincided with Salt Lake's losing the 1998 Olympic bid to Japan. Why Her Faith is Off-Limits Stepping back into the conversation with Peggy Fletcher Stack of the Salt Lake Tribune, the discussion moved beyond her career origins to highlight the core principle for Peggy is journalistic ethics and objectivity. She firmly believes a credible journalist cannot be an opinion writer. She gets asked daily about her own faith but maintains it's not for public disclosure, as her role is to report fairly on all faiths. She consciously avoids expressing her personal opinions on politics or religion in her reporting or on social media. While her choice of stories and sources reveals focus, she strives for neutrality in her own voice. She illustrated the challenge of this by describing how people, including some within the LDS Churc don't always understand why journalists don't simply adopt a specific viewpoint or give one source the "last word." This commitment to reporting on conflict, even when it's sensitive, means she receives criticism from all sides, sometimes even more hate mail than sports reporters. Do you agree with why Peggy Fletcher Stack's opinion is not for public consumption.

We discuss 2 important moments in Peggy Fletcher Stack's career: "We don't apologize," and "What about the women? Peggy Fletcher Stack is the senior religion reporter at the Salt Lake Tribune. The focus of the conversation turns to the persistent challenges within religious coverage and the dramatic evolution of the journalistic landscape itself. For Peggy, certain topics consistently emerge as central "pressure points" or "conflicts." Drawing on Apostle Boyd K. Packer's 1993 speech, she observes that issues surrounding feminists, gays, and intellectuals have dominated her reporting because, as she puts it, journalists cover "planes that crash," not "planes that land on time." https://youtu.be/KmaKAKKtyH4 Don't miss our other conversations with Peggy: https://gospeltangents.com/people/peggy-fletcher-stack/ Copyright © 2025 Gospel Tangents All Rights Reserved LGBTQ+ Issues She highlights the continued intensity of LGBTQ+ issues, noting they remain "very very hot." Her archive reveals nearly 700 articles containing the word "gay," underscoring its consistent prominence. While public protests on issues like ordination might have decreased since events like Kate Kelly's excommunication, Peggy firmly states that gender issues have "absolutely not died down," citing ongoing concerns among younger women and pushes on topics like allowing young women to pass the sacrament or women sitting on the stand. "We Don't Apologize" Moment Peggy Fletcher Stack recalls a meeting with Apostles Todd Christofferson and Dallen H. Oaks around the time the church was announcing a "compromise" on LGBTQ+ issues. She asked them, in the context of trying to promote civil discourse, if the church would ever apologize for the rhetoric of some members on this topic as a way to improve civility. Elder Oaks responded directly, "No. We never apologize." Peggy notes that this response to a specific question was later interpreted by some as being a statement of general church policy, which she clarified was not the case. She also mentions that Elder Oaks repeated a similar sentiment on a video podcast (Trib Talk no longer exists), stating that apology "isn't in the Bible," which caused a "huge flap" and led to people blaming her, the messenger. She said this illustrates how something said can come to be seen as policy. The "What About the Women?" Question Peggy describes a press conference in January or February 2018 with President Russell M. Nelson and Elder Oaks where reporters were limited to one question each. Peggy had prepared a question asking what would be done to increase diversity in leadership, specifically mentioning "women, people of color, and non-Americans." President Nelson's initial response was to focus on his personal connection to Peggy and her family, an "awkward moment" for her. After speaking about non-Americans, and feeling they were finishing their answer without addressing women, Peggy, despite the one-question limit, called out from her seat, "What about women?" President Nelson then spoke about loving women, highlighting his daughters and mothers. Peggy characterized this moment, which occurred on live KSL TV, as a "weird existential moment" balancing the personal and professional. Ironically, she felt it ended up being a "win-win" for her, as critics from different perspectives interpreted the interaction in ways that subtly improved her standing with them. Don't miss our other conversations with Peggy: https://gospeltangents.com/people/peggy-fletcher-stack/ Copyright © 2025 Gospel Tangents All Rights Reserved  

Peggy Fletcher Stack highlights her biggest interviews, significant moments, and enduring themes of her three decades covering religion. Peggy's career at the Salt Lake Tribune has intersected with pivotal historical events and figures. She covered sensitive issues like Catholic abuse and the aftermath of 9/11, immediately being assigned to interview Utah Muslims. She shared a moving story of a young Muslim boy named Osama who faced bullying after 9/11 but later reclaimed his name and faith. https://youtu.be/shlJFq8BV2s Biggest Interviews Covering the 2002 Winter Olympics in Salt Lake City brought another highlight: interviewing Archbishop Desmond Tutu about forgiveness, an encounter she described as a truly memorable moment despite the initial challenge of getting her story into print. She also had the unique opportunity to spend four days covering the Dalai Lama's visit, with press access to every event. Reporting on leadership transitions within the LDS Church also marked her career. She wrote President Ezra Taft Benson's obituary but never interviewed him as he wasn't publicly visible in his last years. She covered President Howard Hunter's trip to Nauvoo, noting his warmth and the public's desire for physical connection after Benson's absence. The advent of President Gordon B. Hinckley brought a shift; at his first press conference, he stood the entire time and took questions, a departure from past practice. Peggy recalled her own encounter, where President Hinckley showed familiarity with her and her family before she proceeded to ask numerous questions. Notably, she covered President Hinckley's historic 1998 trip to sub-Saharan Africa, the first time an LDS prophet had visited the region. Traveling separately from his group, she managed to secure an interview with him in Zimbabwe, where he famously commented on fighting adulation. This Africa trip stands out as a definitive highlight of her career. Reflecting on her coverage, Peggy connected her most frequent topics to Apostle Boyd K. Packer's 1993 speech identifying feminists, gays, and intellectuals as enemies of the church. She realized these areas – which she terms "pressure points" or "conflicts" – have been the focus of her reporting because journalists cover "planes that crash," not "planes that land on time." This includes covering the September Six excommunications (intellectuals)10, the ongoing evolution of women's issues and gender dynamics (feminism), and the persistently "hot" topic of LGBTQ issues. What about the Women? Peggy also recounted another one of her biggest interviews involving a memorable interaction with President Russell M. Nelson in 2018, where she asked about increasing diversity in church leadership. His initial, somewhat awkward, response focused on knowing her family. He finally answered about international leaders, but he didn't address female leadership, leading her to press him to address the specific question about women: She asked loudly, "What about the women?" She viewed this moment, captured on live TV, as a strange intersection of the personal and professional that ironically benefited her standing with critics from different perspectives. What are your thoughts about Peggy's coverage of the LDS Church specifically? Do you think she is biased one way or the other? Do you listen to Mormon land and/or subscribe to the Salt Lake Tribune? What are some of the biggest interviews we didn't mention? Don't miss our other conversations with Peggy: https://gospeltangents.com/people/peggy-fletcher-stack/ Copyright © 2025 Gospel Tangents All Rights Reserved  

It was fun to sit down with Peggy Fletcher Stack about her time at Sunstone and Mark Hofmann. Peggy Fletcher Stack is a senior religion reporter at the Salt Lake Tribune with over three decades of experience. Peggy, also a co-host of the Tribune's weekly "Mormon Land" podcast, discussed her extensive career, offering insights into her work, her background, and some of the pivotal moments she's covered. The conversation quickly delved into the origins of her career, her time at the Sunstone organization, and even her connection to a notorious historical event. https://youtu.be/jI3Y_aw9mek Don't miss our other conversations with Peggy: https://gospeltangents.com/people/peggy-fletcher-stack/ Copyright © 2025 Gospel Tangents All Rights Reserved Peggy's long tenure in religion reporting at the Tribune spans 34 years. Before joining the paper, she was involved with Sunstone magazine and was the originator of the Sunstone Symposium. Recounting its beginnings, Peggy explained that as young people working on the magazine, they needed material to publish. She conceived the idea of holding a symposium where people could present, providing content for the magazin. Despite skepticism from some who felt they were "just kids," the first symposium in the late 1970s or early 1980s was successful, leading it to become an annual event that has continued for over 40 years. Peggy noted that Sunstone often struggled financially but ultimately persevered. Peggy's early career included a period spent freelancing in Kenya. In 1985-1986, shortly after getting married, she and her husband used their wedding money to move to Kenya to do freelance writing and photography. They chose Kenya because it was English-speaking and stable at the time. While they hoped to sell stories, Peggy admitted they didn't sell many. She described it as more of an adventure that provided a reason to travel and learn. She recently returned to Kenya for a conference with the International Association of Religion Journalists (IARJ), a group she helped found in 2012 and now serves as executive director. Sunstone and Mark Hofmann One of the most compelling parts of the early discussion was Peggy's connection to Sunstone and Mark Hofmann bombings. Hofmann, known for forging historical documents related to Mormonism, had his "findings" discussed extensively at Sunstone. Peggy knew Mark Hofmann personally and conducted the only print interview he ever gave. Looking back at that interview, she realized he was lying throughout, something she didn't recognize at the time. Peggy described Hofmann as socially awkward, noting he wouldn't look her in the eye during the interview, which she initially attributed to social skill issues but now sees as a sign he was fabricating information. Remarkably, the Hofmann bombings happened on the same weekend as Peggy's wedding, October 12, 1985. One of the victims, Steve Christensen, was a close friend, a major Sunstone donor, and a columnist. After the bombings, Peggy received calls from national media and initially suspected a business connection. However, when Mark Hofmann himself was injured in a bombing the next day, it became clear the events were tied to the documents. Peggy and her husband were warned they might be in danger, even checking their wedding presents for bombs and staying away from their apartment. This personal connection means Peggy always knows how long it's been since the bombings by her wedding anniversary. Reflecting on that time, she acknowledged her lack of training as a journalist then and the difficulty of knowing Hofmann was lying. Even LDS Church leaders were fooled. Path to Salt Lake Tribune Peggy's path to the Salt Lake Tribune was somewhat unexpected. After her time in Kenya, she and her husband moved to New York City, where she worked various jobs, including editing at a medical ethics think tank, working for the United Methodist Church communications department,

Joseph Smith's bank went under back in 1837. Those banknotes he printed are now worth much more money! Brent Ashworth shares his Kirtland bank notes from the Kirtland Safety Society signed by Joseph Smith, Brigham Young, & Sidney Rigdon! He also shares Lorenzo Snow's prison diary, and we'll also play a Bing Crosby record from the 1930s on an early 1900s phonograph! Check out our conversation... Don't miss our other conversations with Brent: https://gospeltangents.com/people/brent-ashworth transcript to follow Copyright © 2025 Gospel Tangents All Rights Reserved Except for book reviews, no content may be reproduced without written permission   transcript to follow Copyright © 2025 Gospel Tangents All Rights Reserved Except for book reviews, no content may be reproduced without written permission.

How did Brent Ashworth get started in collecting Mormon memorabilia? He started at age 7! We'll discuss his first collections from the prophet Heber J Grant, his 1st edition Book of Mormon, and other documents he has related to Joseph Smith and early Church history! Check out our conversation... https://youtu.be/XZQ_2YRDYEQ Don't miss our other conversations with Brent: https://gospeltangents.com/people/brent-ashworth transcript to follow Copyright © 2025 Gospel Tangents All Rights Reserved Except for book reviews, no content may be reproduced without written permission   transcript to follow Copyright © 2025 Gospel Tangents All Rights Reserved Except for book reviews, no content may be reproduced without written permission.

Brent Ashworth has not only Church history artifacts, but Elvis memorabilia, a piece of the Spirit of St Louis, and a 1st Edition Book of Mormon used at School of the Prophets in Kirtland! Check out our conversation... https://youtu.be/2XAc8ut6BPQ Don't miss our other conversations with Brent: https://gospeltangents.com/people/brent-ashworth transcript to follow Copyright © 2025 Gospel Tangents All Rights Reserved Except for book reviews, no content may be reproduced without written permission   transcript to follow Copyright © 2025 Gospel Tangents All Rights Reserved Except for book reviews, no content may be reproduced without written permission.

Why is it called the Vinegar Bible? Brent Ashworth has a Bible from 1716, an ad from the Titanic, Ulysses Grant's desk, Heber Grant's chair, and much more! Check out his amazing museum! https://youtu.be/Xq1FzZNDTpE Don't miss our other conversations with Brent: https://gospeltangents.com/people/brent-ashworth transcript to follow Copyright © 2025 Gospel Tangents All Rights Reserved Except for book reviews, no content may be reproduced without written permission   transcript to follow Copyright © 2025 Gospel Tangents All Rights Reserved Except for book reviews, no content may be reproduced without written permission.

Brent Ashworth has one of the largest Americana & Mormon Memorabilia collections in Utah. He discusses artifacts ranging from the Civil War, Elvis, Pearl Harbor, Mark Hofmann forgeries, LDS prophets, Babe Ruth, and much, much more! We're giving a tour of his mini-museum! Check out our conversation.... https://youtu.be/B3XKyQnB1wQ Don't miss our other conversations with Brent: https://gospeltangents.com/people/brent-ashworth transcript to follow Copyright © 2025 Gospel Tangents All Rights Reserved Except for book reviews, no content may be reproduced without written permission   transcript to follow Copyright © 2025 Gospel Tangents All Rights Reserved Except for book reviews, no content may be reproduced without written permission.

In our final conversation we'll talk about some other Mormon Fundamentalism groups and how the race ban & Word of Wisdom are viewed. I'll also note that Cristina got married after this interview and moved to Canada! Her new last name is Gagliano. Check out our conversation... https://youtu.be/wBE1qyHDzAg Don't miss our other conversations with Cristina: https://gospeltangents.com/people/cristina-rosetti Several Mormon fundamentalist denominations are discussed: Apostolic United Brethren (AUB) FLDS (Fundamentalist Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints) Centennial Park group Nielsen/Naylor group Thompson group LeBaron groups Kingston group Righteous Branch Confederate Nations of Israel (led by Alex Joseph) The conversation explores the historical splits, leadership transitions, and theological differences between these groups, with a focus on polygamy, priesthood, and racial policies. Transcript to follow Copyright © 2025 Gospel Tangents All Rights Reserved Except for book reviews, no content may be reproduced without written permission transcript to follow Copyright © 2025 Gospel Tangents All Rights Reserved

We're going on another polygamy tangent trip! We'll discuss consecration with David Nielsen & I'll go to a polygamist church! Check out our conversation... https://youtu.be/iG4rRCSc2ww Don't miss our other conversations with David: https://gospeltangents.com/people/david-nielsen transcript to follow Copyright © 2025 Gospel Tangents All Rights Reserved Except for book reviews, no content may be reproduced without written permission   transcript to follow Copyright © 2025 Gospel Tangents All Rights Reserved Except for book reviews, no content may be reproduced without written permission.

I attended a polygamist Easter service and the Mesa Temple Easter Pageant this week. Check it out! https://youtu.be/kUdtO3PYEAo Don't miss our other conversations with David Nielsen: https://gospeltangents.com/people/david-nielsen transcript to follow Copyright © 2025 Gospel Tangents All Rights Reserved Except for book reviews, no content may be reproduced without written permission   transcript to follow Copyright © 2025 Gospel Tangents All Rights Reserved Except for book reviews, no content may be reproduced without written permission.    

Many fundamentalist Mormons do not allow for black members. Is Nielsen-Naylor the same? We'll discuss temple theology and discuss these weighty issues. Check out our conversation... https://youtu.be/VAgAilf0g00 Don't miss our other conversations with David: https://gospeltangents.com/people/david-nielsen transcript to follow Copyright © 2025 Gospel Tangents All Rights Reserved Except for book reviews, no content may be reproduced without written permission   transcript to follow Copyright © 2025 Gospel Tangents All Rights Reserved Except for book reviews, no content may be reproduced without written permission.

Here is a quick announcement about the upcoming Mormon Studies Conference in southern California on April 19, 2025. Dr Matthew Bowman is the dean of Mormon Studies at Claremont Graduate University and gives more details. If you're in southern California, I hope you'll check it out! https://youtu.be/p15cP_ZjzM0

The FLDS Split with Centennial Park and Nielsen-Naylor on the 1980s. Is there a mission to rescue FLDS & reclaim their Mormon cousins? David Nielsen weighs in. We'll also ask David what the thinks about Cristina Rosetti's book on Joseph Musser and discuss church services. Check out our conversation... https://youtu.be/MGWFxkq4CEM Don't miss our other conversations with David: https://gospeltangents.com/people/david-nielsen transcript to follow Copyright © 2025 Gospel Tangents All Rights Reserved Except for book reviews, no content may be reproduced without written permission   transcript to follow Copyright © 2025 Gospel Tangents All Rights Reserved Except for book reviews, no content may be reproduced without written permissio

Does Nielsen-Naylor believe in "1 true church" like the LDS Church does? I found David Nielsen's answer fascinating!. I was also surprised to learn women propose marriage to men! Check out our conversation... https://youtu.be/vWC8qGfnWxs   Don't miss our other conversations with David: https://gospeltangents.com/people/david-nielsen transcript to follow Copyright © 2025 Gospel Tangents All Rights Reserved Except for book reviews, no content may be reproduced without written permission   transcript to follow Copyright © 2025 Gospel Tangents All Rights Reserved Except for book reviews, no content may be reproduced without written permissio

Since Warren Jeffs took over the FLDS Church, there have been many FLDS splits. Centennial Park split off in 1984, and then Nielsen-Naylor split off in the 1990s. David Nielsen is part of the Nielsen-Naylor Group and we'll find more about FLDS through Nielsen-Naylor history. Check out our conversation... https://youtu.be/uyOkEsN_sUQ transcript to follow Copyright © 2025 Gospel Tangents All Rights Reserved Except for book reviews, no content may be reproduced without written permission   transcript to follow Copyright © 2025 Gospel Tangents All Rights Reserved Except for book reviews, no content may be reproduced without written permission

We're going on a Polygamy Tangent (Trip) to the Journal of Mormon Polygamy Conference Mar 21-22, 2025 at the University of Utah. I'll give my live reactions and even talk to a polygamy skeptic! Check it out! https://youtu.be/0guJSrqPbBU Don't miss our other conversations about polygamy skeptics: https://gospeltangents.com/lds_theology/polygamy-skeptics/ transcript to follow Copyright © 2025 Gospel Tangents All Rights Reserved Except for book reviews, no content may be reproduced without written permission   transcript to follow Copyright © 2025 Gospel Tangents All Rights Reserved Except for book reviews, no content may be reproduced without written permission

Here is a Journal of Mormon Polygamy Recap. I'll also give away a free book "To be a Friend of Christ," the biography of Marion D Hanks, written by his son Richard. Check out our conversation... https://youtube.com/live/S2d9JJrHCxM Don't miss our other conversations about polygamy skeptics: https://gospeltangents.com/lds_theology/polygamy-skeptics/ transcript to follow Copyright © 2025 Gospel Tangents All Rights Reserved Except for book reviews, no content may be reproduced without written permission   transcript to follow Copyright © 2025 Gospel Tangents All Rights Reserved Except for book reviews, no content may be reproduced without written permission

Marion D Hanks helped start early Morning Seminary for the LDS Church! His son Richard details Marion's calling of stake presidents, what Rich loved about his father, and the tough end of Marion's life as he dealt with dementia. Check out our conversation... https://youtu.be/Nl3KMlYwk_8 Don't miss our other conversations with Richard: https://gospeltangents.com/people/richard-hanks/ transcript to follow Copyright © 2025 Gospel Tangents All Rights Reserved Except for book reviews, no content may be reproduced without written permission   transcript to follow Copyright © 2025 Gospel Tangents All Rights Reserved Except for book reviews, no content may be reproduced without written permission

Pres David O. McKay blessed Marion Hanks to "speak your mind," even when opposed by other Church leaders. His son Richard details some of these events as Marion tangled with Bruce McConkie, Mark Peterson, Boyd Packer, & others. Check out our conversation... https://youtu.be/iFnC5JJLJds Don't miss our other conversations with Richard: https://gospeltangents.com/people/richard-hanks/ transcript to follow Copyright © 2025 Gospel Tangents All Rights Reserved Except for book reviews, no content may be reproduced without written permission   transcript to follow Copyright © 2025 Gospel Tangents All Rights Reserved Except for book reviews, no content may be reproduced without written permission

Following the 1978 revelation, the LDS Church rescinded the ban preventing blacks from receiving priesthood & temple ordinances. Marion D Hanks was against the ban. Dr Matt Harris utilized Hanks' journals to document how general authorities reacted to the new 1978 revelation. Rich Hanks details more about his father's resistance to the ban and his elation at overturning the ban. Check out our conversation... https://youtu.be/h6Wwz4e94WM Don't miss our other conversations with Richard: https://gospeltangents.com/people/richard-hanks/ transcript to follow Copyright © 2025 Gospel Tangents All Rights Reserved Except for book reviews, no content may be reproduced without written permission   transcript to follow Copyright © 2025 Gospel Tangents All Rights Reserved Except for book reviews, no content may be reproduced without written permission

In the 1950s & 60s, LDS missionaries in England were baptizing children after baseball games without their parents consent,known as baseball baptisms. Marion D Hanks was called by Pres David O McKay to stop the practice. Rich Hanks is the son of Marion and details Marion's approach to the situation. We'll discuss how Marion always put Christ first in decision making, and how he helped start service missions. Check out our conversation... https://youtu.be/tsJoc-tkSck Don't miss our other conversations with Richard: https://gospeltangents.com/people/richard-hanks/ transcript to follow Copyright © 2025 Gospel Tangents All Rights Reserved Except for book reviews, no content may be reproduced without written permission   transcript to follow Copyright © 2025 Gospel Tangents All Rights Reserved Except for book reviews, no content may be reproduced without written permission

Marion Hanks was one of the youngest modern-day GA (general authorities.) At just age 31, he was called to be one of the 7 presidents in the First Council of 70! His son Richard Hanks has written a biography called "To Be a Friend of Christ." We will learn more about Marion's life without a father growing up. Check out our conversation... https://youtu.be/SWCBWl0zS-w Don't miss our other conversations with Richard: https://gospeltangents.com/people/richard-hanks/ transcript to follow Copyright © 2025 Gospel Tangents All Rights Reserved Except for book reviews, no content may be reproduced without written permission   transcript to follow Copyright © 2025 Gospel Tangents All Rights Reserved Except for book reviews, no content may be reproduced without written permission