Podcasts about Rugger

Buy a round! Become a Patron! Links SNL Pilot (YouTube) Ep. 191 – Preying on Compassion and Fear – In which the hosts discussed Sinéad O'Connor Sinead O'Connor - War (SNL 1992) (YouTube) The Gorge Apple TV+ Audience Q&A – SNL50 (YouTube) Burlesque (IMDB) Netflix is a Joke Fest Inside SNL's Iconic Studio 8H (w/ Heidi Gardner, Chloe Fineman & Ego Nwodim) | Set Tour | AD (YouTube) Rugger's Up and Under to close after more than 30 years in Kalamazoo (WWMT) It is with heavy hearts that we announce the closure of Rugger's Up and Under. After much consideration, we have made the difficult decision to permanently close our doors on March 15, 2025. We will be operating as usual until our closing date, and we encourage you to stop by for any last visits, or simply to say goodbye. During Elon's press conference in the oval office his son had some choice words for Donald Trump (YouTube) Dramatic video shows plane crashing and flipping over in Toronto (YouTube) Art Garfunkel is 5'9" (Celeb Heights) Paul Simon Talks About Hearing Loss in His Left Ear: ‘I Can't Hear My Voice' If Instruments Are Too Loud (People) Chris Farley Interviews Paul McCartney (YouTube) Paul McCartney adds 2nd NYC concert after playing sold-out surprise show (CBS News) Digital Short: Anxiety – SNL50 (YouTube) Lawrence Welk – SNL50 (“Robert Goulet thing”) (YouTube) Black Jeopardy – SNL50 – Eddie as Tracy (YouTube) Scared Straight – SNL50 (YouTube) Tiger Woods has his ‘most embarrassing moment' by not knowing the yardage in a TGL match (AP News) ‘That was embarrassing': Tiger breaks down hilarious gaffe at TGL (ESPN) Buy a round! Become a Patron!

On this episode of US Rugby Happy Hour Podcast is LIVE, newly signed Seattle Seawolves' wing and center, Malacchi Estrada joins Bill and Fitzy to talk about returning to the game of 15s with Seattle, and his days as a 7s player. Is he done with 7s? Is he shooting for a spot in the 2027 Rugby World Cup? Would Malacchi eat meat just for a spot on the World Cup team? We talk about all of that and more! US Rugby Happy Hour LIVE is also brought to you by QuickTap, the only sports video and analytics platform designed specifically for rugby. Visit getquicktap.com and use the offer code HAPPYHOUR when signing up for a free trial, which will get you 10% off your annual subscription AND QuickTap will sweeten the deal by tracking your first match for you.  QuickTap - the most powerful way to beat your opponents before ever setting foot on the pitch  Follow @eaglesoverseas and @rugbymorning on Twitter, Instagram and Facebook for the latest in USA Rugby and MLR news. Bill Baker, an Emmy award winning editor and producer, has curated Eagles Overseas Rugby since 1996, providing updates and news stories about USA Eagles plying their trade around the world.  http://www.eaglesoverseas.com eaglesoverseas@comcast.net John Fitzpatrick is the brain behind Rugby Morning, serving rugby news everyday via email newsletters to rugby fans around the world. John@rugbymorning.com http://www.rugbymorning.com Show Links: Eagles Overseas Rugby Morning QuickTap Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

A trans man encounters a monster in the woods and discovers a unique alternative to HRT.Today's story is “The Application of Lycanthropy as a Novel Treatment for Gender Dysphoria” by Chase Anderson, a speculative fiction writer, spreadsheet wrangler, and internet bird. This story can be found in the forthcoming “Dudes Rock,” anthology available soon from Prismatica Press, and you can find more of the author's stories on his website, chase.xyz.Read by B. P. Rugger, the ineffable Moo Moon.thevoice.dog | Apple podcasts | Spotify | Google PodcastsIf you have a story you think would be a good fit, you can check out the requirements, fill out the submission template and get in touch with us.https://thevoice.dog/episode/the-application-of-lycanthropy-as-a-novel-treatment-for-gender-dysphoria-by-chase-anderson

[18+] Derrick joins rugby and becomes a hooker to lose weight. But when his two massive props teach him to lift, they plan to bulk him up.Today's story is “Front Roe” by B. P. Rugger. For more of their writing, puns, and other cringe-worthy antics, you can follow them on both Blue Sky and Mastodon at woof.group as DammitMooMoon.Read by the author.thevoice.dog | Apple podcasts | Spotify | Google PodcastsIf you have a story you think would be a good fit, you can check out the requirements, fill out the submission template and get in touch with us.https://thevoice.dog/episode/18-front-roe-by-b-p-rugger

There are tales of monsters on such nights as tonight, but what happens when you are the monster, that there is something clawing away at the inside, something you know is wrong, but you cannot ever confront it?Tonight's story is “Eat Your Heart, Your Feelings, or Both,” by Leuna, who works as an essayist, and is writing surreal short fiction at FurAffinity.Read by B. P. Rugger, the ineffable Moo Moon, and by Yuugen, wolf of Wanderlust.thevoice.dog | Apple podcasts | Spotify | Google PodcastsIf you have a story you think would be a good fit, you can check out the requirements, fill out the submission template and get in touch with us.https://thevoice.dog/episode/eat-your-heart-your-feelings-or-both-by-leuna

Content warning: discussion of needles, piercings and discussions that touch on fatalities and abuse. We go into an element of edge play where Rugger joins us to talk about using body mods in play and power dynamics. Thanks to our Goodboy Patrons: Liam Jim Thiktool Dom J. Splemb Orsetto AspiringDom Brian R. Kelly B. Nicholas B. Abc1c2 Mark G. Daniel M. James E. Absolution Gareth Ergo Juha N. Off Knotty Texan paul f. Patrick M. Bullpup Nick B. Buster Deco V.

High summer. A young werewolf, who is of course a metaphor as well as a person, is finally ready to find the place he belongs.Today's story is the second and final part of “There's a Place in the Great Pack For You” by Rob MacWolf, who thinks he's found his. You can find more of his work in anthologies from the Furry Historical Fiction Society, and you can find previous stories on this theme right here on the Voice of Dog.Special thanks to those who provided advice and consultation in the writing of this story: B. P. Rugger, George Squares, J.S. Hawthorne, Mirapunk, Sahoni, Starringer, Tonya Song, and Khaki of course.Read by the author.thevoice.dog | Apple podcasts | Spotify | Google PodcastsIf you have a story you think would be a good fit, you can check out the requirements, fill out the submission template and get in touch with us on Twitter.

High summer. A young werewolf feels, with all the desperation of youth, that he's waited his whole life to find the place he belongs.Today's story is the first of two parts of “There's a Place in the Great Pack For You” by Rob MacWolf, who if he believes in anything, he believes in this. You can find more of his work in anthologies from the Furry Historical Fiction Society, and you can find previous stories on this theme right here on the Voice of Dog.Special thanks to those who provided advice and consultation in the writing of this story: B. P. Rugger, George Squares, J.S. Hawthorne, Mirapunk, Sahoni, Starringer, Tonya Song, and Khaki of course.Read by the author.thevoice.dog | Apple podcasts | Spotify | Google PodcastsIf you have a story you think would be a good fit, you can check out the requirements, fill out the submission template and get in touch with us on Twitter.

Today we present a poem by Madison Scott-Clary, whose graphomania occasionally gets the best of her. Today's poem is from her collection Eigengrau. Her writing is available at makyo.ink, where you can find stories, poems, and books to purchase or read for free online.Read by B.P. Rugger, the ineffable Moo-Moon.thevoice.dog | Apple podcasts | Spotify | Google PodcastsIf you have a story you think would be a good fit, you can check out the requirements, fill out the submission template and get in touch with us on Twitter.

I'm delighted to announce the route for this year's Great Rugger Run. West to East through a rugby heartland and with some hugely personal reasons for choosing this location.   Come and join me? It's all happening in August this year!   LINKS The Great Rugger Run website The Great Rugger Run on Twitter @RuggerRun The Great Rugger Run on Instagram @thegreatruggerrun The Great Rugger Run on Facebook @thegreatruggerrun   PATREON Join The Amateur Rugby Podcast Patreon community for some extra amateur rugby goodness!   PODCAST KIT Everything I use to create, edit and produce this podcast can be found on my Creating a Podcast (https://www.amateurrugbypodcast.com/creating-a-podcast/) page.   SUPPORT If you would like to support the podcast in some way then there are plenty of options for you on my Support the Podcast (https://www.amateurrugbypodcast.com/support/) page.

This episode was an interesting one. CMDR07 comes on to discuss a recent situation where he exposes a serial rugger in the CNFT space. This rugger has taken advantage of two CNFT projects already and is still involved in another project currently. We hope to shine some light on this situation and help people understand the process of how things went down. Hopefully everyone understands and we can help save anymore projects from falling victim to this individual. Rugger Exposed Tweet: https://twitter.com/LurkersCNFT/status/1640069750985461760?s=20 Rugger responded with Google doc and CMDR responded in this tweet quoting the Doc:https://twitter.com/LurkersCNFT/status/1640561605242130433?s=20Check out @LurkersCNFT on twitter and on Discord Enjoy the episode and as always We love you all!last thing. !fukdubby

Bizzy, Pride, and Rugger talk about an assortment of topics!

Raised in Boston, Devin Ibañez was drawn to Ruby given its encouraging, inclusive and counterculture vibe compared to American football.  His accomplishments include a gold medal for Team USA at the 2017 World Maccabiah Games in Israel, winning a 2018 D1 National Championship and moving abroad to play at the highest level.  However, the more he success he found, the greater the struggle to be open about who he really was. A life-threatening injury changed his mindset on his relationship with rugby, the loss of a beloved pet opened his heart to the reality of isolation and the love of his partner all inspired him to become the first openly gay Major League Rugby player. As a Global Ambassador for International Gay Rugby (IGR), Devin hopes to inspire the next generation of LGBTQ+ athletes and make sport an inclusive space for them. @thatgayrugger, @usmlr

Bizzy, Pride, and Rugger breakdown some of their thoughts on the streak route and more

Join the Kernels as they discuss Scott Derrickson's  2022 horror: 'The Black Phone'.Chatting about courageous kids, menacing masks, and a lack of minor murders - The Kernels share their likes, dislikes, ratings & even treat you to both an original song, AND a unique game where they create a movie trailer. Enjoy you spicy spaceships!  Thanks for popping by. We hope you enjoy The Podcorn Kernel Podcast. Please get in touch with any praise, criticism, feedback or advice.Compliments will be greeted with kindness. Criticism will be catered to with carnage. Contact us at : thepodcornkernels@gmail.com or find us on us on the following social platforms:Instagram: thepodcornkernelsThreads: thepodcornkernelsTwitter: @podcornkernelsWebsite: thepodcornkernels.co.ukTikTok: @thepodcornkernels

Bizzy and Pride kick off their new podcast called Mic'd Up with their first guess, Rugger!

This episode you meet Jannell MacAulay, Class of 98, and hear about her upbringing, academy life (2 year as a Pink Panther!), academic and flying career on active duty with additional roles as special operations consultant and international diplomat. Upon retirement from the USAF she successfully transitioned into her successful career as speaker and professional instructor in "Ancient Warrior" mindfulness. On a personal note, since I am a long time season ticket holder and original 12, we discuss her role with the Seattle Seahawks and how she helps them prepare mentally for each day. She is quite an impressive graduate and also a mom of two. I now you will enjoy hearing her story.

Today's story is “A Pride at Pride” by https://twitter.com/2dwilddog?lang=en (Darius Davis), a black queer african wild dog author, who uses writing as a way to prime readers to experience new perspectives.You can follow him on twitter @2DWildDog and his Sofurry page at https://2dstories.sofurry.com/ ((2dstories)) for future writing projects. Going to Pride can be overwhelming for a first timer. But for Sami, this young lion has his own pride to show him the ropes. With his trans friends, Alondra and Wyatt, acting as the young lion's tour guide, Sami gains access to a new world which emphasizes sex positivity, queer liberation, and a strong since of community. Question is, will Sami definitively discover something new about himself? Or will doubt take control and diminish his potential for self-growth? Read by B.P. Rugger, the ineffable Moo Moon. thevoice.dog | https://www.thevoice.dog/apple (Apple podcasts) | https://www.thevoice.dog/spotify (Spotify) | https://www.thevoice.dog/google (Google Podcasts) If you have a story you think would be a good fit, you can https://www.sofurry.com/view/1669084 (check out the requirements), fill out the https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1z81u5O2i8PWSfEpzaVhHeTjrp1kKP7TX?usp=sharing (submission template) and get in touch with us on https://twitter.com/voiceofdogpod (Twitter).

Episode 33 of the Pre Mornin' Show! --- This episode is sponsored by · Anchor: The easiest way to make a podcast. https://anchor.fm/app Support this podcast: https://anchor.fm/premorninshow/support

Today's story is “The Pirate's Curse” by http://madisonkeller.net (Ian Madison Keller), who published the anthology https://bit.ly/35wHVVR (Shark Week), and the furry writing book https://bit.ly/3IIia3c (Furry Fiction is Everywhere), as well as the https://bit.ly/3g0WSkU (Dragonsbane Saga) novels, and you can find more of his work at http://madisonkeller.net (http://madisonkeller.net). Today's story will be read for you by B. P. Rugger, the Ineffable Moo Moon. thevoice.dog | https://www.thevoice.dog/apple (Apple podcasts) | https://www.thevoice.dog/spotify (Spotify) | https://www.thevoice.dog/google (Google Podcasts) If you have a story you think would be a good fit, you can https://www.sofurry.com/view/1669084 (check out the requirements), fill out the https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1z81u5O2i8PWSfEpzaVhHeTjrp1kKP7TX?usp=sharing (submission template) and get in touch with us on https://twitter.com/voiceofdogpod (Twitter).

Yared Belay is a coach at Ironworks Performance and former Rugger at Colorado State... The boys talk about training, what brought Yared to Ironworks, and what animal they would fight every day..

Today's story is “The Session” by Khaki, a faithful fireside companion you may have heard of, who went by Alex Vance back then, when his muzzle wasn't so grey.  This story was originally submitted to the Erotic Furry Writing group in 2005, where a young, bright-eyed Khaki would meet many writers and make many friends, and then go on to create the furry anthologies FANG and ROAR, the furry publishing imprint Bad Dog Books, the furry fiction archive FurRag.com and two redesigns of SoFurry, and a certain furry podcast you may have heard of. Because that's how we start. We're readers, and fighters, and lovers, and writers — we're makers, and the best things we can make are “friends”. Today's story is read for you by Khaki, your faithful fireside companion, Rob Macwolf, werewolf hitchhiker, Kergiby, a full-time panther, Ta'kom Ironhoof, the equine charmer, B. P. Rugger, the ineffable Moo Moon, Killick, the dungeon master dog, Nenekiri Bookwyrm, the bespectacled dragon, Crimson Ruari, the mountain smith, Madison Scott-Clary, whose tail is behind her, Dirt, from Twitter dot com, Carrizo, your coyote in the court, Dralen, the dapper dragonfox, and Tempo, a fluffy dog in a cowboy hat. thevoice.dog | https://www.thevoice.dog/apple (Apple podcasts) | https://www.thevoice.dog/spotify (Spotify) | https://www.thevoice.dog/google (Google Podcasts) If you have a story you think would be a good fit, you can https://www.sofurry.com/view/1669084 (check out the requirements), fill out the https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1z81u5O2i8PWSfEpzaVhHeTjrp1kKP7TX?usp=sharing (submission template) and get in touch with us on https://twitter.com/voiceofdogpod (Twitter).

[18+] Erian must delve into dark, primal magic in service of They Who Asks for Advice Then Complains About It. Today's story is “Satan, Dearie” by B. P. Rugger. This story first appeared in the Dancing with Devils anthology. If you like their writing, their first novel, https://books2read.com/u/3yayYp (The Quantity of Desire), has just been released and the audiobook version is narrated by the incredible Khaki. Read for you by https://twitter.com/khakidoggy (Khaki), your faithful fireside companion. thevoice.dog | https://www.thevoice.dog/apple (Apple podcasts) | https://www.thevoice.dog/spotify (Spotify) | https://www.thevoice.dog/google (Google Podcasts) If you have a story you think would be a good fit, you can https://www.sofurry.com/view/1669084 (check out the requirements), fill out the https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1z81u5O2i8PWSfEpzaVhHeTjrp1kKP7TX?usp=sharing (submission template) and get in touch with us on https://twitter.com/voiceofdogpod (Twitter).

Ivey and the Boilers get a bit of revenge, as they cool down Rugger

[18+] Two husbands invite a love triangle, a dominatrix and a fetish pup for a kinky Christmas dinner. Banned from the Hallmark channel.  Today's story is “A Very Fucking Christmas” by https://twitter.com/PascalFarful (Pascal Farful), who is a writer, musician, fursuiter and photographer. Most of his writing is currently unpublished, though can be found on his FurAffinity and SoFurry pages. Today's story is read for you by B. P. Rugger, the ineffable Moo Moon.

We jumping out the window with this one

Join the discussion on Facebook! - and connect with Dr. Buchman!TranscriptJonathan VanHorn:Welcome to the Tooth and Coin Podcast where we talk about your adventure of being a dental practice owner. In these episodes, we're going to be talking about problems that you will likely face as a practice owner as well as give an idea about actionable solutions that you can take so that you can get past this problem in your practice. Some of these concepts are really big ones, some of them are very specific. But we hope that these episodes help you along with your journey.Jonathan VanHorn:Now, a very important piece for you to understand is that this is not paid financial advice. This is not paid tax or legal advice. We are not your financial advisors. We are not your CPAs. This is two CPAs talking about informational and educational content to help you along with your journey. It's a very important piece for you to understand.Jonathan VanHorn:Another thing that you need to know is that if you enjoy today's content, join us on the Facebook group. So we've got a Facebook group that is active with dentists that is going to have content talking about what we're talking about today to continue the discussion. Agree with us? Don't agree with us? Have a story to tell? Have something to share? Join us in the Facebook group. If you go to Facebook and you search for Tooth and Coin Podcast, click on it to join it and be able to join us there.Jonathan VanHorn:Finally, if you need some more help, we're developing a list of resources that are going to be centering in around our topics of discussion to be able to help you a little bit more than what the content is doing. So if you'd like access to that whenever it becomes ready, all you have to do is text the word toothandcoin, T-O-O-T-H-A-N-D-C-O-I-N to 33444. Again, that's toothandcoin, all one word, no spaces, to 33444. Reply with your email address and we'll email you instructions on how to get into the Facebook group as well as add you to the list to be able to send you those resources when they're available, and if they're available, we'll go ahead and send them to you as well.Jonathan VanHorn:So onto today's episode. I hope you enjoy.Jonathan VanHorn:Hello, ambitious dentists. Today, I have with us a very, very special guest in addition to my partner in crime, Mr. Joseph Rugger. So today, we are doing something a little bit different, a little bit more fun, that I think you guys are going to enjoy. We are talking with someone who we've been lucky enough to be able to see their entire dental practice journey so far. This person is Dr. Wes Buchman. So Dr. Wes, thank you for coming on today.Wes Buchman:Thanks, guys. Thanks for having me.Jonathan VanHorn:Yeah. So for people that are listening that aren't familiar with dentists in Arkansas, Dr. Wes Buchman has acquired an office. We were lucky enough to be part of that process. We've been able to see all of the success that he's had with that process. So Joseph and I were talking about some really fun ideas for episodes and Joseph thought this would be a good episode for us. So Joseph, why don't you take it away and just talk about what it is you're thinking that people will be able to get out of this conversation?Joseph Rugger:All right. Thanks, Jonathan. Really, really excited to bring you a new episode on the Tooth and Coin Podcast. We're really excited to talk to one of our good friends of Tooth and Coin. This is Dr. Wes Buchman, who is a practicing dentist, solo office in Central Arkansas. So I'm really, really excited to get a chance to come pick Dr. Wes's brain, learn a little bit more about his decision-making process, and all of the things that went into the first couple of years of practice ownership. So we're really, really looking forward to the conversation. Wes, thanks so much for joining us. We're happy to have you on the podcast.Wes Buchman:Yeah. I'm happy to be here.Joseph Rugger:Wes, why don't you walk us through maybe the decision? So you worked as an associate at another practice and there's quite a bit that goes into the decision to start your own business and to go out on your own and hang your own shingle on all those things. As you look back on the last couple of years and on the decision to make the leap into practice ownership, maybe walk us through some of the bigger things that you were thinking, some things that were big turning points for you and walk us through how you made that decision.Wes Buchman:Yeah. First, I was fortunate enough to get out of dental school and have a very good associateship with a successful practice. It couldn't have, at least financially, been a better scenario. It wasn't like I was scraping by or anything like that. So then it really turned into what do I want to be doing for the long-term? My personality is more of I want to do things my way, for better or worse I guess you could say. So I just knew that I wanted to be able to make decisions on my future and not really have somebody be able a) to fire me if they just felt like it or I knew there was a reason people are buying practices and owning practices, and there had to be financial reward there as well. But ultimately, I wanted to be in power of my own destiny instead of at the whim of an owner that wasn't as involved or as concerned with my future as I was.Joseph Rugger:Well, Dr. Wes, I wanted to also ask about the decision to acquire a practice. So as we have folks that are probably listening to this podcast, there are going to be some that are interested in doing a de novo or a scratch start, right? Or they may be interested in doing an acquisition. So I'd be curious on your thoughts on what led you to go down the road of acquisition versus scratch start. Maybe walk us through that decision-making process.Wes Buchman:First of all, doing a scratch start still scares the bejesus out of me. I don't know. People that do that are just on another level, man. Most respect to them for just having so much confidence that they can just bring people in out of thin air. I mean, that scared me so much that I'd rather have a bigger loan and patient flow. So that really wasn't ever a desire for me to do a scratch start. But honestly, when you get out, you don't really know what you want as far as what a practice looks like unless you just have a person... you are a person that has really great vision.Wes Buchman:So for me, it was learning. Listened to plenty of Jonathan's podcasts. I listened to Shared Practices's podcasts. I read as many articles and books and stuff as I could get my hands on to really form an educated opinion on what a good practice was and was not. Then started asking around. I knew that Central Arkansas and really Little Rock was where I was going to practice, so that narrowed it down. Some people will move or look out in the country. That really just wasn't something that I was looking for. So then it was sitting there waiting and going and looking at practices. I probably looked at five or six before I landed on the one I'm in now.Wes Buchman:Just, with all the stuff that you learn before of how many patients do they have, does it seem like it's struggling, is it... looking at their practice numbers, seeing do they have the latest and greatest equipment or is it old, all of these different factors that you guys helped me on and then the knowledge that I had gained from literally just learning and reading everything that I could. You start to figure out what kind of practice you really want, and that's going to be different for everybody. For me, it was important to have a bigger of a practice because I always wanted to have two doctors, me and one other one, or more, but me and one other one in the practice. So I was really looking for bigger practices from the get-go if I could do it. So yeah. Those are probably what made me start going in that direction to come to this practice.Joseph Rugger:All right. That's great. Thanks for that. I want to ask about something that we get a question on on the CPA side regularly. So the question is, hey, there's this piece of equipment that's coming up. My rep is in town, said that I can expense all of it for tax purposes. Should I buy it with cash? Should I use debt to finance it? Can you maybe walk us through, as you're looking... I'm not talking about changing the style of gloves that you wear. Just when you look at some of the bigger purchases and the bigger decisions that you make as a practice owner, certainly on the CPA side, we can always guide you on the tax ramifications and all of those different pieces, but maybe walk us through as a new business owner maybe how you approached some of those bigger decisions and how you made those decisions. If you could maybe walk us through that decision-making process?Wes Buchman:Man, in my opinion, owning a practice is just so many little decisions. It's not one big massive decision, after deciding to buy the practice, of course. So owning the practice is all these little decisions. So for me, it was more of an abstract thing of realizing that I had to question each decision that was made and to seek out as many answers as possible. So just that general statement there has gotten me through a lot of when something would come up or looking at how something was done in the practice, of saying, "Is this the right way to do it? How do we get to the right way to do it?"Wes Buchman:If I don't know, I start asking people. Luckily, our dental community overall is really nice and helpful and understanding. I mean, especially the younger guys that were closer to your age. I have three or four or five fellow dentists that I especially called a lot in the beginning to ask them, "How do you do this? How is this done?" And just try to seek out as many answers as possible. Because at the end of the day, you guys are there to help and then your guys that you know are willing to help. It just makes everything a lot easier if you're willing to seek out some answers.Wes Buchman:The other thing I was glad I really knew was, another kind of abstract thing, of just knowing I was willing to put the work in. I wasn't scared to do it. That's a really big thing I think all practice owners have to realize is there are just people that are not willing or built to take on that type of responsibility and that's fine. If you don't want to do it, then don't do it. But everybody talks about owning a practice, but at the end of the day, if that's not your style, you're going to be miserable doing this thing. We are up here a lot more and taking care of a lot of different stuff. So as far as things that I'm really glad I knew, it's more general knowledge of personality and being willing to go the extra mile to make it right. Because clinically, it splinters in a lot of different stuff of how you want to run your practice, which would be different for everybody.Jonathan VanHorn:Can you give us an example of something specific that you have... maybe you even dealt with it today or in the last month, that you're like, "I didn't really think about me having to do this back when I was thinking of buying a business"?Wes Buchman:Oh, man. The silliest thing would be when I bought the practice... The practice I had before, the staff did basically everything. I was an associate. I was an employee. I walked in, when to work, and left. As the owner, everything falls on you. The silliest thing would be that I have to deal with after I get off with you guys is there is a trap that catches all the stone and stuff, and after it gets full, it gets pretty stinky. I got to go dump that thing out. It's going to be heavy and smelly and miserable for about 30 minutes while I do that. So that's probably the silliest thing.Jonathan VanHorn:Hey, we are pulling the curtain all the way back on this podcast.Joseph Rugger:That's funny.Wes Buchman:Yeah, unless you just got a staff that does everything for you. My staff does so much, don't get me wrong. But that's one of them that the doc before me did himself and so I have acquired that fun task every little bit of time.Joseph Rugger:I want to switch gears a little bit and talk to you about some knowledge pieces. So as you look back over the last couple years of practice ownership, I'd be interested to know what are some things that you knew and you were prepared for, some things that you were really glad that you had spent the time and learned about and you knew about? What are some things that you thought you knew on the front end that you're really, really glad you spent some time learning about?Wes Buchman:Oh, man. Where do you begin? I mean, if you could just generalize it, it'd just be people. If you hadn't been around long enough, you haven't met enough people. So dealing with staff, especially in the beginning, it's going to stress you out because you don't know them that well and you're trying to and there's a lot of personality. Luckily, I didn't have really any turnover at the beginning. Some people retired because they were at retiring age, but I didn't really lose anybody for that nature, so that was awesome. But just figuring people out and dealing with the most random staff requests that put you on the spot. You don't really know what the right answer is in the moment. You got to think about it.Wes Buchman:Or dealing with patients. There are a lot of interesting people out there that you don't really know how to handle at the first. You get your groove with them and hopefully you just don't make them mad at the offset or make them think you're weird. But after you get to know them, you know how to handle them. But man, people by far because you're just... you got to learn how to handle people or they're not going to like coming to your office.Jonathan VanHorn:Talking about people, one of the things that I find really interesting, or at least, I think is interesting, I don't know if everybody else does, I'm assuming other people do, but one of the things that is almost never talked about is whenever a doctor buys a dental practice from another doctor and then they have to go and meet their team for the first time. What was that like, meeting your new team?Jonathan VanHorn:So we've had clients who are like, "You literally cannot even send..." Make sure we're doing this. We don't send anything in the mail because it's going to be the day that I buy it is going to be the day that I walk in. They're going to meet me the day I become the owner, not a day before that, not a day... At no other time are they allowed to hear my name because the doctor wants us to be ultra top CIA secret. Then we have people that are just like, "Yeah, I've been talking about this to this guy for the last two years. I know everybody that's there and they're all my best friends and they know I'm going to be taking over eventually." So what was that dynamic like for you? Then what was it like going and meeting the staff afterwards? Because again, sometimes that's a part of the decision-making process for people. Do I actually like the people? Do I like the employees that are going to be here? Do I really want to buy that? So what was your experience with that piece of it?Wes Buchman:Well, my situation was unique in the fact that I had been a patient at this dental office before, so not many people have that opportunity. So I have known... It was a two doctor practice. They ran them separately. I was the patient of one of them and so I bought both and merged together. Right? So I didn't really know the other staff at all. I really only knew the doctor and kind of one of the assistants because I hadn't been back here since I'd been away at school for a decade. So I knew him already and had a great relationship and they had been at a retiring age for quite some time. So not as much as your second part of your example, but still, they had flirted with the idea of retiring for a long time and so the staff knew something was going to happen at some point. So mentally, it wasn't a surprise to them in that way.Wes Buchman:But we did it kind of down the middle as far as your two examples go because we did send out a letter. The two doctors each wrote a letter to their patients and I wrote a letter that had my picture, all professional photo with my wife and Henry on it, and sent that out with that letter. So that was beneficial overall because it got to give people a chance to see me before they saw me. Some people, I've heard advise against that because you're going to lose patients. You can make an argument for anything.Wes Buchman:So after they announced it to the staff and then right after, it was either the day after or the Monday after, I had lunch with the staff and with those doctors there. So I catered the lunch and just basically gave them my resume beforehand and said, "Let's hang out and we'll run through questions," and did it that way. So I actually had two or three meetings before I really ever started to make sure all questions were answered and everybody was comfortable and I got a feel for if they had any issues or special things going on with them or stuff like that.Joseph Rugger:Talk to us about maybe some of the things that you wish you would have known going into practice ownership that you just had to find out the hard way. Maybe walk us through some of those things that you figured out.Wes Buchman:Oh, man. It's been a couple years. I wish I would have written them down because they did really throw me for a loop because it was just the most random stuff. I just bought the practice. I don't have my office manual in place yet, everything locked down. So it was just...Wes Buchman:One was a lady that was nearing retirement age and she had family stuff that would take her out of the office. So she just asked a very blunt... She's a super sweet lady, but she asked me just a very blunt question of am I going to allow her to take off whenever she wants. It was like, I guess? I don't know. I mean, there's vacation days. I don't really know what you're asking.Wes Buchman:Or there was a lot of questions about what are you going to change? What are you going to keep the same? That's a little bit easier to answer, of stuff that I offer that the other docs didn't and go through that. Most of the stuff, I tried to keep the same as much as possible in the beginning just to make the transition easier. But really, a lot of the questions were specific about certain patients. Because we have a really fun patient base, but there are a lot of quirky people here, which makes it fun honestly. But our patients have been in this practice for a long time. A lot of these patients have been here for 30 years, which is amazing. Because my doc has practiced in this location since '84.Wes Buchman:So a lot of them, the questions were so random, of, well, we got a guy, let's call him Jerry, we got a guy, Jerry. He doesn't like when you do this, that, or the other. So what are you going to do about it? And you're like, "I don't know, man. We'll figure it out." But it's just the most random, specific questions that you... There was no answer for it in my opinion. But we got through it.Wes Buchman:The hardest parts were the meetings after and going through when I did start to change stuff and making sure the staff was onboard with that and comfortable with the changes and answering their concerns and things like that.Jonathan VanHorn:Give us some examples of that. Like what were some of the changes that you felt like you needed to make after you took over the practice?Wes Buchman:This practice, you could just say it was older in general. New equipment hadn't really been bought in quite some time. Still paper charts. The pano machine was still film. That pretty much sums it up to a lot of younger docs. So I knew the way that I practice, and Joseph can attest to our many conversations, I like technology and I like things to be efficient and run smoothly and look good as well. Right? So I knew I-Jonathan VanHorn:The reason you chose that was CPAs, right? Because we love [crosstalk 00:22:49]-Wes Buchman:Exactly, exactly. I look for the best looking dental CPAs.Jonathan VanHorn:Third best in the state of Arkansas right here. yeah.Wes Buchman:So I had learned through all the stuff that I read and my prep on owning a practice was try to start with stuff that will have the highest ROI with the least patient impact or disturbance you could say. I kind of took that to heart, so we changed the phone systems, because we were still sending out postcards in the mail to remind you of your appointments or your need to schedule, and that costs surprisingly a lot of money if you have a lot of patients and we're a two doctor practice. So I was like, "Why don't we just change the phones, do text messages, and save a bunch of money on postage?" Which we did and it was awesome.Wes Buchman:So we moved to Weave. That improved the internet and the phones as well. Because I remember calling right before I started and it sounded like it was raining on the phone. I was like, "What is that sound on this phone?" They were like, "Oh, yeah. It does that every little while and we can't hear the patient, so we just ask them to call back." I was like, "That is unacceptable. This is the silliest thing." So we changed the phones, got Weave.Wes Buchman:We got a new pano machine and I knew I wanted to do endo and end up placing implants, so we got a CPCT machine. Before I bought it, we started looking and these guys with the film pano hadn't really been taking any panos. So buying a CPCT machine that does panos and getting back on a regular schedule doing those with the patients, I mean, it was a no-brainer at that point that the machine would pay for itself in a short amount of time. So those were the first two big ones.Wes Buchman:Then we moved to change the practice management software. We were using SoftDent before and I feel like I was using Windows '94. So we moved to Denticon because, honestly, it was between a few of them and I had used Denticon at my previous job and the office manager that I was stealing from another office, she uses Denticon as well. So it was just a natural fit and so we kind of ran with that. So getting rid of the paper charts, just modernizing the office in general were big ones. So the practice management software was the biggest hurdle because these people have been using paper charts for 30 years, 30-plus years. So that was very difficult to get everybody comfortable and efficient at using modern practice management software.Jonathan VanHorn:Yeah. I find that that usually is a very disruptive change internally for dental practices, but looking back on it, most people are like, "Yeah, that was a necessity. We had to do that at some point-"Wes Buchman:For sure.Jonathan VanHorn:... and think it's a good thing at the end of the day. So that's fantastic. So frame this too, we didn't do this at the beginning, probably to start the conversation off, about how long ago was it that you bought this practice?Wes Buchman:Yeah. We bought it... I started November 4th, my birthday, in 2019. So it was a great birthday to begin. We had worked on it for, I think about, what, five or six months before?Jonathan VanHorn:It was-Wes Buchman:Maybe shorter?Jonathan VanHorn:It was a pretty decent timeframe. I mean, we've had people that will call me and they'll be like, "Yeah, I need someone to help me buy a dental practice," and I'll be like, "Well, when are you trying to close by?" They're like, "Well, today is the 12th. By the 16th?" I'm like, "Well, expectations are not going to be met if you're trying to get [crosstalk 00:27:07]-"Wes Buchman:Yeah. No, but you are... It was longer because I had to wait six months at my previous job. So it was longer than six months.Jonathan VanHorn:Yeah, we had a lot of time to think about it. So in terms of, just framing it of the listeners too, all these changes that have happened, again, this is a two doctor dental practice you bought and now you're the sole owner of a two doctor dental practice. Giving some vagueness to it, just to tell people the success that you've had in this dental practice, I would say you're seeing right now, from when you took over, again, using a wide range here, somewhere between a 30% and 70% growth over that two year period? Because we're not even at two years yet, but about a two year period?Wes Buchman:Right. Yeah, we're definitely tracking to be in that range of increasing in revenue with keeping the staff, adding just one staff since I came on. So we've been able to really get going. That's honestly, these older guys are great dentists. They just haven't had to work as hard as a younger guy does. So we're a little bit hungrier. We want to move a little bit more and work a little bit harder. But we've just made some changes like that and just how we schedule, which has helped with the Denticon being out software, and bringing in our office manager that's just a rockstar. That has helped fuel that growth for sure. So we're on track to be quite a bit bigger than when we started, so we've been really happy with it.Jonathan VanHorn:Well, and I'll just say this, and we mentioned this before the podcast started, I wanted to use wide numbers because we don't want everyone knowing all of what's going on with you. But there are some influencers that are out there that will say they'll have, oh, these giant numbers of growth and giant... like 100% growth year over year and all these other things. We have this unique perspective where we're accountants, we're CPAs, we know a lot of... We just, we can see behind the curtains for some people sometimes. Those numbers aren't always what they seem.Jonathan VanHorn:I hear this from a lot of people actually that are people that are in the industry, that are on the consulting side, and things like that, and I hear people that are listeners that are talking about influencers that are saying, "Oh..." They said they did this, but it was really only this. To the listeners out there, this was not a small practice that was just all of a sudden that grew this amount. This was a significant amount of growth.Jonathan VanHorn:So for you, Dr. Wes, if you were to start this all over again, what would it be that you would look for in a practice? Assuming you didn't buy this one, knowing what you know now, what would it be that you'd be searching for in a practice to buy? It's kind of an odd question because you already... you own this one. But just pretend like you don't own it anymore and you're not allowed to buy this practice again. Given that you've had such success with the practice you've gotten, what would you look for in the new practice?Wes Buchman:Yeah. Man, so every practice for every dentist is going to look different. I know a guy down in Louisiana that bought a smaller practice, but he was almost fee-for-service and so he's kept it really small and has been very successful in that way, so might look different. But for me, if I had to do it again and not this one, looking for bigger of a practice, the better. Because the margins are better. Your room for error is better. You know what I mean? So if you buy a practice that's only grossing 400K, well, the margin's a little bit thinner for error of you being successful and not successful if you buy a 800,000 or a $1,000,000 practice.Wes Buchman:Honestly, one of my thoughts was, "Well, this is a two doctor practice." In ways, one guy ran it pretty tight, so it was kind of a 1.5 doctor practice, you could say. I was like, "At the end of the day, if 20% of the patients leave," because that's what some articles will say, "maybe it'll just shrink and I'll have a great one doctor practice." I had some room to run there. But for me, the bigger, the bigger. The bigger you can muster and get that loan for a bigger practice, it's just going to be better.Wes Buchman:Then not going for a practice with all the newest stuff because they're going to make you pay for it. This practice being older, I got to pick and choose on my own time of what I wanted. So if somebody is the CEREC guru that does all this late and great stuff, I mean, can you match that when you're one to five years out? Probably not. So bigger practice, older equipment that's functional, the better because then you can pick and choose what you want.Wes Buchman:Then probably the last one is see how long their staff has been there. If you have a smaller practice and all the staff is constantly turned over, you're probably not buying a very healthy practice in a lot of ways. This practice was fortunate that people have been here for... The oldest hygienist has been here since like '87 I think and she's still here working for me. I have added one or two people, but most of these people have been here over a decade or more. That just goes to show that people are happy here. Patients have been here for a long time. So just things like that you look for. Because at the end of the day, if a piece of equipment's terrible, you can replace it. It doesn't have to be the newest thing. It can be used. But the more patients, the better. You got to understand your people and what you're doing. You're not going to know everything about them, but you can gather enough information to know if this seems like a happy place or an unhappy place.Jonathan VanHorn:Yeah. So in terms of finding that practice, and this is a bit of a chicken and egg question, so sometimes it can be a bit complicated to answer, but what would you rather have? I mean, because you mentioned the bigger, the better. What would you rather have be bigger, revenue or patient count? So when I'm saying that, let's say that you've got a practice you're buying that's $1,000,000 to buy the practice and it's got 2,500 patients and then you've got another practice that's for sale that's $1,000,000 and it's got, say, 1,100 patients. Of those two, which one would you rather have? Would you probably be, knowing nothing else, be more interested in?Wes Buchman:If both had 1,000,000 in revenue, but one had 2,500 and one had 1,100?Jonathan VanHorn:Mm-hmm (affirmative). Active patients.Wes Buchman:First, I wouldn't believe them because I would double check their hygiene numbers. You taught me that. But, man, what a good question. Because you can make arguments for either one. I probably-Jonathan VanHorn:Because those are the two practices we see come in all the time.Wes Buchman:My gut would say the one with 2,500 because the one that has 1,100, he has probably squeezed every penny he can out of those patients and when you buy it, there's not going to be anything left.Jonathan VanHorn:Yeah. So when I'm talking to people about the practices that I see have the most amount of success, it is that... It's more patient count than it is revenue really.Wes Buchman:Right.Jonathan VanHorn:So whenever someone's looking for a large practice, I always say, "If they've got a lot of patients, there is a lot of opportunity usually just inside of that because of the fact that..." And I'm not saying there's anything wrong with someone who's asking $1,000,000 for a practice that has 2,500 patients, but there is a lot of... With 2,500 patients, a lot of people can do a lot more in revenue than that. Especially a lot of the younger doctors.Jonathan VanHorn:Now, really, when I say that we see this come in a lot of the time, that practice actually doesn't come in... Those two practices don't come in that often. Really what comes in more often is more like $700,000 for each practice and one of those has like 2,000 patients and one of them has like 800. But that's a bit more common of what usually comes into the office. Those $700,000 ones that have the 2,000 patients or whatever it is, those are the ones that, not every time, but historically seem to be they see the growth that you've had in similar amounts because it's just you add new services, you do a newer style of treatment planning than a lot of what the older docs seem to do, and it just seems to grow so much faster.Wes Buchman:Yeah. You bring up a very good point that you have to say to anybody wanting to buy a practice, one of the things I did miss was look for a practice that you can add skills, add services. I mean, that's the quickest and arguably least expensive way to grow your practice immediately, right? If you have a crown and bridge guy, he may have done all the crowns, but he's not doing any of the endo or any of the harder oral surgery or implants, Invisalign. If you can get your training in those things as early as possible, you're going to be so much better off in the long run. You're going to get tired of doing quadrants of composite fill-ins for an hour when you could place an implant for less than an hour and make a significantly more amount of money.Jonathan VanHorn:Oh, yeah. Another question for this is let's assume you go out and you did find another practice that's got, let's say it's that $1,000,000 practice, 2,500 patients and it looks fairly similar to the day that you start... A lot of things go the same way that we just talked about in terms of what you went through buying the practice, meeting, the staff, getting the patients turned over, adding services, things like that. Day one of being the new owner of this new hypothetical pretend practice, what would you do that you've already done today, but do faster? Does that make sense? What learning curves have you overcame by being an owner for a couple of years that you would have implemented faster if you knew how to do it?Wes Buchman:Are we saying clinically or just managing the practice or what do you mean?Jonathan VanHorn:Anything, anything, anything. Whatever you think would have the most impact on getting that practice up and running, and either it be for your quality of life or it be for revenue or it be for income, whatever, patient care. Whatever.Wes Buchman:Yeah. When I first started day one, I tried to meet everybody and I would not have done that again. That's the first little thing. Literally day one, I was trying to meet everybody, every patient in the office, and that was just unsustainable. So we quickly went away from that. I struggle with when to make changes in the offices, like the practice management software or buying stuff or how we did things in treatment plans. You can make arguments either way and if you read enough on this dental space about that, you'll figure that out. But for me, I would have changed more earlier and just... Because the first year of owning a practice is pretty terrible in a lot of ways. You're up here all the time, you're stressed out about everything. I'm more of a just get it over with kind of guy, so I probably would have just changed more in general and hopefully coasted earlier after that. Does that answer your question?Jonathan VanHorn:It does.Wes Buchman:Okay.Jonathan VanHorn:So now I'm going to throw a wrinkle on it though.Wes Buchman:Okay.Jonathan VanHorn:So even though you didn't know what you didn't know and assuming other people that buy a practice for the first time aren't going to have experienced these things, do you think that would have been good advice for you to tell yourself whenever you started? Do you know what I mean? Like would you have screwed it up if you hadn't experienced the change in a slower process? Would you tell the guy next door that's going to be buying a practice, "Hey, start changing the stuff earlier"? Because the common thread if you ask anybody, they're all like, "Give it six months. Give it six months. Don't change anything. Then after six months, then start changing things." I think that's pry the safest advice for most people, especially if they're a first time practice owner. But I would think even if you're a second time practice owner, that probably should be fine to go ahead and start changing the stuff, right?Wes Buchman:I would think so. I think part of that six month buffer is just get your bearings, right? You got a lot going on. But now that I'm on the other side of it, I don't remember that anymore. It's kind of like having your kids. You kind of don't remember all the sleepless nights as vividly as when they first happened. I guess I would still tell them to do it quickly just because in a way, what are you waiting on? I mean, if your staff's onboard... If you're already having staff struggles or you're dealing with some bigger issues, of course, use some judgement and wait. But if things are going well, and this isn't going to turn the practice upside down, like if you're going to just fire half your staff or something, I mean, if you're just making changes, just do it. You're not going to really regret it because you're going to deal with it now or you're going to deal with it later.Wes Buchman:At the end of the day, you want to run your practice the way that you want to run it. You don't want to feel like you're cooking in somebody else's kitchen the whole time. That was a thing for me, was get this thing how I want it so I feel like it's mine and not like I'm borrowing it from the last guy.Jonathan VanHorn:Yeah. I love that answer. I think that's really good advice for everybody that's listening. Is there any other advice that you can think of that you wish you would have known before this whole process started?Wes Buchman:Oh, man. We should have a much longer podcast because we can keep going on this stuff, man.Jonathan VanHorn:I know, right?Wes Buchman:Advice? If you think that you are ready to buy a practice and you find what you think is a good one, and Tooth and Coin will help you do that, that's not an official plug, but it is a plug, do it. You're going to be stressed, fine. But it is, in my opinion, totally worth it to own the practice if that's your desire. Just do it. Make it your own. You'll be happier if you do. Seek out as much help as you possibly can. At the end of the day, I can ask you guys as many questions as I can, I did it a lot at the beginning, and you guys helped. I asked a lot of friends that were dentists that owned practices what they do.Wes Buchman:I went on the message boards and filtered out all the crazy stuff, but tried to find answers there. Because at the end of the day, you don't know that much about business, especially as dentists because we take, what, one hour or so of business classes in dental school. So just don't be afraid to ask questions. Anybody listening, I will be happy to talk to them and run them through more specifics of what we're doing or what we had and answer questions because there's a lot of decisions that are all small that have to be made. Like when do I buy this big thing? When do I buy these small things? What kind of vendors deals are there? How do I compete with the buying power of corporate dentistry? There is a lot of BS that you have to filter through, but the more questions, the better, man, because most of the time, people want you to be successful. So just ask as many questions as you can.Jonathan VanHorn:I love it. So you mentioned a few earlier, but what are some resources for people that are trying to figure this out? You mentioned my old podcast, Start Your Dental Practice, you mentioned Shared Practices, which we're really big fans of those guys. What are some other resources you found helpful? Like any books or any specific forums or anything like that?Wes Buchman:Well, I think the Shared podcasts were going to be the second biggest one. Because they were just so comprehensive. I mean, that podcast was going on forever. So reading all of that, or excuse me, listening to all of that, they hit on so many different topics that you feel like you have a decent idea of what's going on. They're not trying to sell you anything in the podcast at least, so, I mean, it's really beneficial. I'd say if you want to own a practice, that's one of the ones that you should be doing.Wes Buchman:As far as books go, I wish I had a better memory, but I don't have any books on hand. It's been two years. I try to read a lot of books, but I tend to read half of it-Jonathan VanHorn:I see.Wes Buchman:... and put it on the nightstand and then forget about it.Jonathan VanHorn:Me too. Once I started having kids, I stopped being able to actually read books. I don't read books. It's been-Wes Buchman:Oh, yeah. I mean, two pages in and you're asleep.Jonathan VanHorn:I know, right?Wes Buchman:Then internet stuff, Dentaltown is a crazy world if you get into it, but if you read enough, you can start to filter out a lot of the craziness. Then Dental Economics is a really, a great magazine and internet space. Those would probably be the big ones. Then you can find anything on YouTube.Jonathan VanHorn:Do you remember any posters on Dentaltown? Specifically that you saw they had a post, you were like, "I'm going to read this one."Wes Buchman:Oh, man. I need to get back on there and see.Jonathan VanHorn:I haven't been on there in a while either. I should pry be on there more.Wes Buchman:I probably just... I don't want to say any names because I'm probably remembering the crazy ones. I don't want to throw them under the bus.Jonathan VanHorn:Yeah, that's what I would do too, is I'd probably be like, "Which is the one that you like?" And I'd name one off and it'd be the person who like, well, we just found out they went to the looney bin for some reason.Wes Buchman:Yeah, yeah. Right?Jonathan VanHorn:Like mix the name up. Okay, cool.Wes Buchman:Yeah, let's not throw anyone under the bus by accident.Jonathan VanHorn:Sounds good. So Shared Practices is a must. There's Start Your Own Dental Practice, which was the podcast that I had. It's got like 125 hours of content out there. I think that Shared Practices is a little bit more focused on the acquisition process and things like that. So there's definitely episodes of Start Your Dental Practice and I'm sure that people [inaudible 00:47:47] be good. This podcast, the Tooth and Coin Podcast-Wes Buchman:When I-Jonathan VanHorn:... has a lot of business information on it as well. So Dentaltown forums, reaching out to Dr. Wes and your fellow dentists, and yeah. So it seems like a pretty good recap of information places to go whenever you're getting ready for this process, right?Wes Buchman:Yeah. When I get home, I'll see if I have any of those books and I can put it in the podcast notes too, okay? I just can't remember their names.Jonathan VanHorn:Absolutely. Yeah, we'll do that. Cool. Dr. Wes, thanks so much for joining us today. For anyone out there that's listening, if you want to... We'll leave a way for you to be contacted in the show notes of the podcast so that you don't have to put out your information all the way there. Again, thank you so much for being so generous with your time and your knowledge and your experience on this. It's been a pleasure getting to talk to you. We may have you back for another episode to dive a little bit deeper into some of the questions. If anyone has questions that they would have liked to had been talked about on this podcast for Dr. Wes, feel free to let us know and maybe on episode number two, we'll be able to do that. So again, thanks Tooth and Coin listeners, thanks Dr. Wes, and we will see you guys next time. Bye.Wes Buchman:Thank you.Jonathan VanHorn:That's it for today, guys. I hope you enjoyed this episode of the Tooth and Coin Podcast. If you are going to be a practice owner or a new practice owner and you're interested in CPA services, head on over to toothandcoin.com where you can check out more about our CPA services. We help out around 250 offices around the country and would love to be able to have the discussion about how we can help your new practice. We do specialize in new practice owners, so people that are about to be the owner of a practice they're acquiring, about to be a owner of a practice they are starting up, or have become an owner in the past five years. That is our specialty. We'd love to be able to talk to you about how we could help you and your services with your tax and accounting services.Jonathan VanHorn:If you enjoyed today's episode, again, go to the Facebook group. Talk to us about what we've talked about. Join in on the discussion. Let's create an environment where we can talk about some of these things so that we can all help each other get through these things together so that this adventure of business ownership is more fun, more productive, and better in the long-term.Jonathan VanHorn:Lastly, if you want access to those resources that we are currently building, just text the word toothandcoin to 33444. That's toothandcoin, no spaces, T-O-O-T-H-A-N-D-C-O-I-N, to 33444. Reply with your email address. We'll send you instructions to the Facebook group. We'll send you the resources when they're available. We will see you next week.

Today's story is “The Hand of God” by Madison Scott-Clary, who is an ill omen at the best of times. She is the author of six books, with her latest, A Wildness of the Heart, coming out November first. You can find out more at wildness.makyo.ink and you can find more of her writing at makyo.ink Whatever else life is, it is a mystery. Though it is with us every day, we know not where it came from, how it begins, what it, in and of itself, is. And like any mystery, to witness it is to be changed. Submitted for your approval: The Hand of God, tonight on… the Ghost of Dog.thevoice.dog | https://www.thevoice.dog/apple (Apple podcasts) | https://www.thevoice.dog/spotify (Spotify) | https://www.thevoice.dog/google (Google Podcasts) If you have a story you think would be a good fit, you can https://www.sofurry.com/view/1669084 (check out the requirements), fill out the https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1z81u5O2i8PWSfEpzaVhHeTjrp1kKP7TX?usp=sharing (submission template) and get in touch with Khaki on Twitter or https://t.me/khakidoggy (Telegram)!

Join the discussion on Facebook!TranscriptJonathan VanHorn:Welcome to the tooth and coin podcast, where we talk about your adventure of being a dental practice owner. In these episodes, we're going to be talking about problems that you will likely face as a practice owner, as well as give an idea about actionable solutions that you can take so that you can get past this problem in your practice. Some of these concepts are really big ones. Some of them are very specific, but we hope that these episodes help you along with your journey. Now, a very important piece for you to understand is that this is not paid financial advice. This is not paid tax or legal advice. We are not your financial advisors. We are not your CPAs. This is two CPAs talking about informational and educational content to help you along with your journey. It's a very important piece for you to understand.Jonathan VanHorn:Another thing that you need to know is if you enjoy today's content, join us on the Facebook group. So we've got a Facebook group that is active with dentists that is going to have content talking about what we're talking about today, to continue the discussion. Agree with us. Don't agree with us, have a story to tell, have something to share. Join us in the Facebook group. If you go to Facebook and you search for tooth in coin podcast, click on it to join it and be able to join us there. Finally, if you need some more help, we're developing a list of resources that are going to be centering it around our topics of discussion, to be able to help you a little bit more than what the content is doing. So if you'd like access to that, whenever it becomes ready, all you have to do is text the word tooth and coin T O O T H a N D C O I N 2 3 3 4 4 4. Again, that's tooth and coin all one word, no spaces, 2 3, 3, 4, 4, 4, reply with your email address. And we'll email you instructions on how to get into the Facebook group, as well as agita list, to be able to send you those resources when they're available. And if they're available, we'll go ahead and send them to you as well. So onto today's episode, hope you enjoy it.Joseph Rugger:Hello, ambitious dentists and welcome to another episode of the tooth and coin podcast. I am Joseph Rugger. One of your hosts joined by my good friend and colleague and confidant, Mr. Jonathan van horn. How to guys, we are excited to bring you another episode of the tooth and coin podcast. One of the things we try to do is we try to kind of reach through our own mailbag and think about what are some of the things that are top of mind for our clients. And we get a chance to kind of share some of that wisdom and knowledge and expertise with you guys. So I want to want to delve in today to a topic that is not something that I am a subject matter expert. And I, I don't know if Jonathan would call himself a subject matter expert. So Jonathan, as, as I look at the way you've marketed our business, we're going to talk about marketing and advertising today and get a chance to kind of scratch the surface of that big, huge, huge topic that's out in dentistry. But when you had a chance to talk a little bit about that, and as I look at the way, you've kind of marketed our business here at tooth and coin and just learning, learning every time I get a chance to get on the call with you about the things that our clients are doing, that are successful in the advertising and marketing world, just wanted to have you pick your brain on some of that stuff that day. So as that sound for, for an episode,Jonathan VanHorn:I'm looking forward to the conversation, I will say, just, you know, and this is important that we have this out there. This is not a dental specific marketing discussion. I will talk a lot about my experiences anecdotally working with, you know, two, 300 dentists and, you know, talking to thousands of dentists over the past, you know, five to 10 years about different topics, including marketing. So I am not like you said, I am not a subject matter expert when it comes to marketing to dental practices or for dental practices and trying to stir up patients. But I have had a lot of conversations and this, this is more kind of reaching into the, so the, to the, to the textbook versions of marketing from my book, business education and experience and ma, and combining that with that anecdotal, those anecdotal conversations, I've had over many different conversations with dentists over the last, you know, five to 10 years in people building their practices and things like that. So I want to make sure that we get that out there, that we're not pretending that we're, you know, marketing URIs or anything like that. We are not. And if you think that a couple of CPAs, our, our marketing areas, then we got some Oceanside land to celly Irene, Arizona. So, so anyway, so yeah, so I love talking about this kind of stuff. Cause it's, you know, there's a lot, a lot, a lot of people have new questions about advertising in general and things like that. And it's a, it's a really interesting discussion.Joseph Rugger:Sure. Well, one of the things that we've got on our monthly deliverable that we get to our clients, we have a four questions report that we have. And one of the things that we put on every single four questions report is what percentage of your business are you spending on what we call growth expenses? And that really comes in kind of three main, big categories. One is advertising slash marketing. One is consulting and one's continuing education, you know, in our message to our clients is, you know, as we get a chance to look at that, the more that you're spending on these growth expenses, the faster the practice should be growing. So I'll be interested to kind of dig into that a little bit and kind of get some of your thoughts, I guess, kind of first and foremost, Jonathan, I guess we probably needed to tackle the why, or like, what's the, what's the purpose? Like why do we care about marketing? You know, and maybe, maybe getting a chance to kind of drill in and, you know, just some questions that our audience can kind of ask themselves when it comes to advertising and marketing, like, like what's the purpose of what it is that we're doing. So maybe just kind of speak to maybe some, some different, different places that we can go when we talk about the purpose of the marketing.Jonathan VanHorn:Yeah. Like on a high level marketing is effectively just trying to, to create awareness around your, whatever it is you're doing. So whether it be about your dental practice or, you know, some type of new service that you're offering or, or something of the, of the source, you know, marketing is, is, is creating awareness. And it's doing that in a way that can be received by the masses. And then, you know, I guess you could also make an argument that marketing is also attempting to get a certain group of people to do a certain thing that you're trying to spur or something you're trying to have someone receive your message. And so in marketing, there's the three M's or I'm sure there may be more, this is just how we've, you know, a couple of CPAs have dumbed it down and that's a, there there's the message, the market and the medium, we're sure the three, again, it's the PRI you know, dozens of other things that are included in this, but this is just a, like a textbook example of some of the ways to dumb down marketing, but you know, the purpose of all of the, of the message of when you're doing marketing is to try and have someone act and do something that usually means in create, which is usually spurred to create an interaction between that person and whatever it is you're doing.Jonathan VanHorn:So in this example, to be a dental practice, to try and call the dental practice or interact with the dental practice in some way is typically what a mark w typically the purpose of marketing and the dental practice.Joseph Rugger:So as we look at the, kind of the different things, like why would a dental practice want to do marketing and advertising? Like, you know, as we, as we maybe kind of, kind of siphoned through the stuff that you've seen, that's worked and not worked, you know, I think there's kind of the old adage that says, if you don't know what you're looking for, you don't have a target to shoot at you'll, you'll hit it every time you don't hit nothing every single time. So maybe talk about some of the, the different pieces that might make sense for our audience to kind of think through when they're thinking about, well, why are we advertise?Jonathan VanHorn:Yeah, that's a really important question for every, every person to consider whenever they're considering doing marketing in the first place, the simple answer is that they want new patients, the, or to grow their dental practice, I guess, is an even simpler answer. They want to grow the dental practice, which usually means they're trying to grow revenue, which usually means that they're trying to make more money. That's usually the reason they're trying to do it, whether it be making more money in the short term, through income or in the long-term and through building equity into a better, bigger, better practice, that can be more valuable to people down the road for some type of an exit inside of the business marketing is kind of the, the, the energy that the spend on marketing sometimes can be considered to be the energy that's fueling that growth, which surprisingly it's not always the case, but you know, that is that's in general, the reason why people try to do marketing, you know, the, the really important thing for the people for everyone to consider is, you know, you know, you're going to be doing marketing.Jonathan VanHorn:Why is that? If you've already made the decision, you're going to start marketing for whatever reason and why, why is it now to me, you know, and this is anecdotal, but the reason people typically market or start marketing, or one of the big errors people make in marketing is by just casting that really wide net, like, I just want to grow my practice. And like, so I'm just gonna start marketing because I've been told that's what I'm supposed to do. And that, that does typically see, or that does seem to be inefficient. It seems to have a lot of cost involved and not create a lot of return on the spend of that advertising spend. So, you know, whenever there people are considering advertising, they have to meet, try and be as specific as possible of what you're trying to accomplish with that marketing campaign.Jonathan VanHorn:Now, if you think about it, if you're a startup dental practice, or if you are a, say a, you know, an established multi-doctor office, you know, you should be thinking of marketing in very different ways. And people always seem surprised by this, but some of the fastest growing dental practices that are more established spent almost nothing on marketing. It's one of these things that, you know, just because you're spending the money, it doesn't mean that you're being efficient and actually growing in ways it can be done in other ways. So, so, yeah, so consider very carefully why you're doing the marketing some big categories, and then just examples of, of different, you know, campaigns of what people are trying to do in marketing is, you know, we're trying to gain new patients. Okay. Well, what type of new patients are you trying to gain? Are you trying to get any patients or are you trying to just, you know, grow your patient count because you've got all this excess capacity and your business of like, you know, I've got, well, I've got nine operatories and I've got two doctors working and I've got, you know, three hygienists that are going, but, you know, we've got, so we've got room for another, you know, I dunno, 800 more patients.Jonathan VanHorn:So I need 800 more patients so that this practice can be operating at the capacity. It should be in order for, to be able to make the percentages that I need, if that's the case. Okay. Well, what type of patients, you know, what type of new patients who, when I say type, I'm not saying like, you know, well, it's, you know, it's this, this or this, I'm saying, what's the demographic of the type of patients you're trying to attract your business, that fits your culture, that fits your niche area, that fits the things that you're trying to do. Another specific examples, you know, trying to market for specific cases, let's say that you're already an established office and you've got, you know, you're a one doctor office and you're pretty, you know, pretty booked most of the time, but you're starting to add something like implants to your practice as a new service line, and you want to attract to implant patients.Jonathan VanHorn:Well, that could be something you could create an actual campaign around after maybe you've exhausted your current patient pool to make sure that your patients are educated, that this new service exists and things like that. So, yeah. So that's a bit longer of an answer, which, you know, obviously I tend to do, but, but that, that those are the things that you need to consider whenever you're going to be taking on marketing. Some people today may actually not know, not actually know this, but marketing actually used to in a lot of states, I used to be illegal for Dennis to do it just because it wasn't considered to be perhaps professional, but eventually, you know, you know, logical minds prevail that, Hey, if, you know, if you're, if you're doing this, you need to be able to tell patients that are out there, that you're doing this. So the best way to do that is through marketing.Joseph Rugger:Got it. So we've got this really simple, this really simple concept of the three M's the market, the message and the medium. So can you maybe just go through a couple of examples of just kinda walk us through just at a very simple high level, maybe a couple of examples. So you mentioned implants, right? So maybe talk through, you know, if somebody came to us and said, Hey, I'm thinking about doing some marketing for implants. So maybe like walk us through the market, the message and the medium, just to kind of simplify things down and just get our audience thinking about, you know, what may make the most sense for them.Jonathan VanHorn:Yeah. So, you know, the first thing I would say is talk to a marketing person. I'm not a marketing person, but what I, the in terms of the, in M and M for the market might be something just as an example, maybe you're in Northeast Arkansas and, you know, you're, you're trying to start implants and something like that. And your you're looking at your market, you know, you have to think about what, what type of people, you know, usually we want to get implants in terms of, you know, I know there's wide Ray of wide varying reasons of people are getting an implant, but, you know, maybe it's, you know, it's for cosmetic reasons, maybe they don't want to have just the, you know, the tooth be pulled or something like that. And so sort of thinking about who it is you want to attract to your practice and you always have to kind of weigh like, who is it that I want to attract versus, you know, do I just want to try it to literally everybody too, that might want an implant.Jonathan VanHorn:And there's probably some mathematical like numbers out there that could help quantify that in a way. But I would think that probably the most marketing people would say, you just want to really get the message out there to the people that might need it and then try and pull them back in. So that would be, that would be the market. The message would be, you know, how you would craft whatever story you're trying to tell and that marketing message to get that person to create that interaction, that, that reaction. So they're were, they're either aware, number one, they're aware of your practice offering the service. And number two has that creates that interaction has a call to action for you to actually do something inside to where, or when I say you, I mean, the, the, the receiver of the message to actually do something, to call into the office, and then hopefully, you know, create that interaction that turns into an appointment, which hopefully turns into a case.Jonathan VanHorn:And then the medium is how you're casting. You know, that message now today's day and age. There's a lot of different ways to do it. You know, you can do it from a, he knew a postcard you can do through a mailer, you'd have a magazine ad. You could be doing presentations, you could be on social media, you could be doing Facebook ads. You could be in Facebook groups, you could be a thousand different places. And mediums nowadays advertising is like the is very, very, very ingrained into our life. Nowadays, 20 years ago, we would receive something like seven or eight marketing messages a day. And like now it's like a thousand or something insane like that. Like we just, and so it's really hard to actually see some of these things come in and sometimes it looks like it really caused ya. It's, I'm sure there's a lot less than a thousand, but it's, it's a lot. So, so going to say those, those are the three ends and again, have a marketing person talk to you about these things. Don't talk to me about these things, because I'm not, I'm not going to know everything about what you guys are going through, but that's, that's that in general, and like on a, on a educational level is, is, is something that conceptualize,Joseph Rugger:Well, you were talking about the message. And, and back in the back in the days that actually used to run a big, big healthcare business, they talked about that in marketing and advertising in, in crafting your message in healthcare, you don't sell the drill, you don't sell the drill bit. You sell the hole. In other words, we're not selling the big, fancy new machine that we just bought, or the big attachment that goes on the new fancy machine we're selling the result. Right? So if we, if we think about the dentistry world and how that applies, you know, we're not selling, you know, the newest, latest, and greatest technology we're selling, how you feel about yourself and what your smile looks like. We're, we're selling results and, you know, smile open mouth again for the first time in years, because you're proud of your smile.Joseph Rugger:Like those are the why's behind the message. So however it is that you're going to craft your message. I would just encourage you to think in terms of, we don't want to sell the drill. We don't sell the drill bit. We want to sell the whole, we want to sell the result. What is it that, what is it that we're able to do? You know? So what are, what are some things that have kind of stood out to you, Jonathan, as you've probably seen tons and tons of different dental marketing stuff. So like you, and I both know, like we go out to Google and we search for a dentist in prosper, Texas, and all of a sudden we're going to have all kinds of stuff, start popping up all over our stuff. I go do a search for Henry Schein. And now all of a sudden, my Google is now inundated with all kinds of dental equipment and dental supplies and that kind of thing. What are some things that maybe have stood out to you? Just kind of from a marketing and advertising standpoint?Jonathan VanHorn:Yeah, I mean, so the, the thing that has stood out to me that I think is the most surprising to people. Is that just because it works in prosper, Texas doesn't mean it works in little rock Arkansas or in, you know, Olympia, Washington. It just because, just because, you know, it works from one place doesn't mean it's going to work somewhere else. And the story I tell people about this one is I had a long time ago, there was a guy who did a startup and escapes me where he was from, but he was sitting in a startup and he was talking about how he was going to make a hundred dollars, 120 new patients a month. I was like, man, this guy's killing it. Like, he's just crushing it with the new patient numbers. And because like an average for a startup is somewhere between 30 and 50, that's pretty average for a startup of new patient flow.Jonathan VanHorn:And this guy was just destroying it. And he said an awesome, so happy for him. I asked him in a very plainly, what is your dream for marketing? It's like, the only thing I'm doing for marketing is this postcard only thing I send it out to all these people. And like, I mean, tons of new patients and like that. And I was like, man, that's amazing those I do you mind that? And again, since we're virtual, we've, we've, you know, we had a lot of crazy ideas over the years and our firm to try and provide extra value to our people. Like if you, do you mind, if I share this postcard, I'll find just, you know, like hide your, your contact information and your pictures and stuff like that that are on here. And just like share this for some other people that are doing startups that are not in geographic areas that you're in so that they can have some similar success to you.Jonathan VanHorn:And like, yeah, sure know, great. I was like super excited. I was like, Hey man, I'm going to share these people. This postcard that gets like a hundred, 150 new patients a month or whatever, it's gonna be like super high value. We had all these thoughts of like, maybe we should, you know, create this big marketing vault and our company or our bike and have marketing staff. And we could create all these formulas and like have this, this extra value, like to add as an additional service for our CPA firm. And I share that, that postcard with a few people, and I had followed up with a few of them seeing how, how it had done like three different geographic locations and like, pretty much all of them were like, yeah, I didn't get a single patient out of it. Oh my goodness. I was a slide or, you know, well, if I shared it with four people and you know, two of them did it, one of them got like nothing out of it.Jonathan VanHorn:The other one was like, yeah, maybe, you know, five patients and it basically paid for itself, which is okay. And so, you know what, that was that what the big, you know, moment of that was like, okay, so this can be a, a huge success in some areas and be completely, you know, inefficient in other areas. So a big lesson, one thought is that, you know, it, it really depends on where, who you're marketing to and how you're marketing. And everybody is different. Like one of the, probably one of the most complicated things to do in this world is to try and have someone else try and subliminally, subliminally, have someone else do something, or it makes someone else do something like that. That's a very hard thing to do. I mean, there are multi-billion dollar brands out there that spend billions of dollars doing that, trying to do this now, trying to get you to drink.Jonathan VanHorn:Whenever you sit down at a restaurant to order a Coke, instead of a Pepsi or to order, you know, to drink a monster energy drink, instead of a Gatorade, there are so many different things that by, you know, an affliction shirt instead of a button up or a polo or an Underarmour. I mean, there are so many things, things out there that try and do that, and it's really hard to do well. And the reason is, is because everyone's unique. Like we're all different. What ha what, what pulls us together? You know, what ma pulls us to do? Something is very personal in nature. And so like, I, that you're not going to get me to do something the same way. You're going to get someone else to do something in different areas of the country. That just, it just varies. The medium matters. If I had to guess why it didn't work for those other people.Jonathan VanHorn:And it wasn't because of the, the, the, the message was any different or because it just didn't resonate with that area that, that the town that they were in, it was probably just that the people that they were being marketed to in that area were wasn't really successful. That medium is one that is more likely to work. Whereas in the other areas, the country that was tried out were just areas where mailers just didn't work very well. That, that that's to me is the, and that that's very frustrating for a lot of people to think of because us as rational individuals, usually one like say, okay, everything fits into a box. We can create this statistical model to where, you know, we can find the most efficient way of doing something every time, the end of the day. It's not like that. You've got to test and test and test and test and test to what you said about, you know, selling the whole yeah.Jonathan VanHorn:You know, whenever you're trying to get someone in and you're not trying to sell them because of the fact that you're usually, you're not trying to sell them like, oh, you know, I'm, I, I, I am very good at doing crowns. So I'm going to try and sell you a crown. Now, you're usually trying to say, you know, Hey, we're gonna be able to help you not have pain, or we're going to try to help you sleep better at night, or you're going to feel better about your smile afterwards. You're selling a result, not a, you know, not, not the way that you do it. So that's the kind of my, my story about, you know, some, a surprising thing about, you know, the, the, the three M's of every situation is different. And the only real way that you're going to be able to know what to do next is by trying something, and then having fail, assuming that you are trying to grow your business and practice.Joseph Rugger:Yeah. Yeah. So interesting about the medium. So I remember the first time that I learned about Yelp. I don't remember when it was 10 years ago. Let's just say it was that I first learned about Yelp is probably longer than that. And a buddy of mine, we were, I was hanging out with him and he was in the bay area in California. And he's like, yeah, there's this review system it's called Yelp. It'll help us find the best place to eat with the best food. It's like, you can even set up separated by this. And, and I get out to California and the bay area, and we're hanging out and I'm like looking at these Yelp reviews. And these restaurants would have like 200 Yelp reviews. And I'm like, man, what a great tool that must be awesome. I bet that's driving new business. And then I returned home to Northeast Arkansas to check out the Yelp reviews.Joseph Rugger:And there was like no Yelp reviews on anything. So if those restaurants would have spent all of this time and energy on something that wasn't helpful, the medium's not right. Maybe Northeast Arkansas would have responded well to a postcard in the mail versus a Yelp review. If you're in the bay area, very tech savvy place, right. Silicon Valley's right next door. That's probably going to be a lot, lot more, you know, I think that, I think that I've heard a lot of practices having some success with making sure that they've got good Google reviews. I don't know about you Jonathan, but whenever I go out and look at something and buy something, one of the things I'm trying to just take a quick peek at is, is any kind of online review that can kind of give me, give me an indication of what I'm, what I'm working with and what I'm looking at, you know?Joseph Rugger:And, and like, even if it's like, I'm going to buy something on Amazon, like a product on Amazon, first thing I'm going to do is I'm going to know that they've probably had a couple of buddies that went out and wrote them five star reviews. So I'm also going to know that there's going to be some crazy people that are out there that are never happy that have written some one-star reviews. I don't know why maybe it's like that train wreck thing, but I'm like, like geared towards going and reading the one-star reviews first to see if I can actually find any legitimate, any legitimate, real complaints about the product or the business or the location versus, you know, being able to tell these are crazy folks that are out there. So what are some of the, what would you say are some of the more successful mediums? I mean, do you find that a lot of practices are successful, you know, trying to encourage their patients to do Google reviews? I don't know if even Yelp is still a thing, is Yelp even still a thing, does that even even apply to the dental world, you just have it in the bay area. What are some things that you've seen in that, in that whole, that whole area be successful?Jonathan VanHorn:Yeah. So I mean, it, again, it really depends, like if you're in an area that is, has a lot of, you know, people in there, you know, from their young families, like from Tony, from the age of Tony to the age of probably 50 ish then, or if you're an area that has people that are mostly up from 40 to 75 or something like that, like what's successful in one area is going to be very different than another. And just because of their age, that doesn't mean that it's, you know, a slam dunk. It just means that there's a higher probability that something might be, you know, be better in that medium than the other one. So, you know, the amount that, how tech savvy it is, cause you gave an example at Northeast Arkansas with Yelp and like, nobody really cared about Yelp in Northeast Arkansas because it didn't have any saturation.Jonathan VanHorn:No one really used that technology, but that was, you know, probably 15 years ago at this part. Right. I would assume like somewhere in that, and nowadays, you know, there probably is some type of a reviews. I do that with restaurants. Like I will look at reviews on restaurants and usually it's like Google reviews or, you know, like TripAdvisor, if we're traveling out of town, I go to TripAdvisor and look at reviews for things like that. So for me, like if you're marketing in that way, that is a good way of getting me. Now, if you have like a Google ad, I'm actually a person that's a little bit more turned away by Google ads than I am someone who like actually likes to look like that that gives priority to Google ads. Because I think, well, it's someone who's spending a lot of money on this.Jonathan VanHorn:Maybe it's, you know, maybe the reason they're having to spend the money is because, you know, because the product doesn't speak for themselves. Right. So that's why I usually go and look at the reviews and things like that. So in terms of what's successful, everything's successful. Everything is how it works. The only thing that I would probably say it doesn't really work or seem to work anymore is yellow pages, which I think, again, I don't know if those are a thing, but they used to come in and drop one off by our office door. I guess they finally stopped doing that and probably went straight to the recycle bin. Didn't it? Yeah. So, but that, that's a good question because it leads us into another thing is, you know, is, you know, we have, when I came on and started doing this, you know, even seven, eight years ago, we would see, you know, a thousand, 2000, $3,000 a month for yellow page ads.Jonathan VanHorn:And we'd go in and say, Hey, how many people are finding us through yellow pages and black nun? I was like, well, how many, what was the last time you looked to the yellow pages? I don't know what years at 2021, I guess 1996, maybe 97. You know, so sorry. If anybody out there is like, there's some, I know there's one person out there is like, oh, I love the elevators. Where are you guys giving him so much crap? Well, in and out of the elevators are on your phone. I mean, I think Yelp is Yelp. Yelp is the elevators, right? Like I'm about the same company. Yelp stands for is yellow pages like that. I was assuming that, but anyway, so you know, it, it just depends on things. And whenever, whenever you're doing this, you gotta have a way you need to have some type of, of a tracking mechanism to see if what you're doing is working to, because those people that were to spend that money on the L pages, you know, I, I challenged a few of them to just say, Hey, just cut it off for a year or six months.Jonathan VanHorn:And like, if you start seeing new patients drop, then dude pick it back up. Maybe like if it's worth it. And if you know, then, you know, Hey, it is what it is. I would say universally though, in terms of marketing, I think every dental practice will find success in an internal internal referral system, having your PA doing a really good job for your patients and then having them go out and, you know, talk about your practice is a really good way of growing a business. I don't think, I think that works in every market. I don't think the only market that won't work in is the markets where you're not actually giving doing it that good of a job out. I would probably make an argument that is where that wouldn't work, because you, you would have people that are going out and spreading negative messages about you.Jonathan VanHorn:Now, I'm not saying that every, every person who patient that comes in has the correct perception of what type of service they received. Not saying that. I'm just saying that you got to hit, you know, the majority of them to do a good job and hopefully promote that, that, you know, that, that, that snowball effect in our practice now, obviously for like a startup practice, that's very hard to do because you know, maybe one in 50 patients is going to actually refer you to somebody. Your job is just to hope that hopefully I've provided enough value to that patient to have them become a referral for you.Joseph Rugger:Good stuff, good stuff. Well, Jonathan, I always get a chance. I always love to get a chance to pick your brain and talk a little bit about all the different business stuff that you've gotten a chance to see out in the dental space. And hopefully you guys have found this helpful, don't forget your three M's of marketing. Since we're going to have a quiz, a pop quiz, you got to make sure you've got your market. Right. You've got to have your message, right. You've gotta have your medium, right. So those are our textbook three M's anything else to add as we kind of wrap this thing up?Jonathan VanHorn:Yeah. The only other real point that probably is important for people to under, to, to, for me to circle back on is make sure that you understand why you're going to be doing the marketing. We've seen so many practices succeed and do so well. And when you go and look at those growth expenses, it's like 0.2% of the revenues going to marketing nothing almost. And then we'll have other practices that are spending 10 to 15% of the revenue trying to drive growth. And it just doesn't seem to be, you know, didn't seem to be doing the job. Like if you just cut away at that 10 to 15%, you would just be, you you'd just be making more money and then could hopefully go and spend that in, in, in more efficient and more efficient manner inside of your business or grow it better, whether it be through, you know, training your staff or training yourself, or, you know, just providing a better patient experience.Jonathan VanHorn:There's a lot of things that, that money could have been used for now. I do believe advertising works. I believe that, you know, a strong marketing campaign is, is incredibly valuable. And, but I just believe that you need to have ways to track that internally. So where you can, you know, be, give a fair analysis to your advertising, spend every six months to see if w what you're spending the money on is working for you. And again, don't just rest on your laurels that, you know, Hey, I'm using this company that someone else used and it worked for them just because it worked for them. Doesn't mean it will work for you. You still have to go in and do the, do the work, or have somebody in your team that does the work to be able to analyze if that was correctly. And it gets a really quick disclaimer there, you know, your CPA doesn't typically do that. We don't, we don't do that for our clients. That'd be something that if you wanna have a conversation with us about that, we could give you some ideas of, Hey, here's, here's the way the math behind this and how you'd contract this too. But that's not like a service that a, a CPA firm typically does for, for dental practices. So, yeah. So that's, that's the, that's the last point I have on that.Joseph Rugger:All right. Well, thank you guys again for joining us. It's always a pleasure to have you, and we'll talk againJonathan VanHorn:Soon, I guessJonathan VanHorn:That's it for today, guys. I hope you enjoyed this episode of the tooth and coin podcast. If you are going to be a practice owner or a new practice owner, and you're interested in CTA services head on over to tooth end coin.com, you can check out more about our CPA services. We help out around 250 offices around the country would love to be able to have the discussion about how we could help your new practice. We do specialize in new practice owners. So people that have are, are about to be an owner of a practice they're requiring about to be an owner of a practice. They are starting up or has become an owner in the past five years. That is our specialty. We'd love to be able to talk to you about how we could help you in your services with your tax and accounting services.Jonathan VanHorn:And if you enjoy today's episode again, go to the Facebook group. Talk to us about what we've talked about, join in on the discussion, and let's create an environment where we can talk about some of these things so that we can all help each other, get through these things together so that this adventure of business ownership is more fun, more productive, and better in the longterm. Lastly, if you want access to those resources that we're going to, that we are currently building, just text the word tooth in coin 2, 3, 3, 4, 4, 4 that's tooth and coin, no spaces. T O O T H a N D C O I N 2 3 3 4 4 4. Apply with your email address. We'll send you sending instructions in the Facebook group. We'll send you the resources when they're available, and we will see you next week. 

Join the discussion on Facebook!TranscriptJonathan VanHorn:Welcome to the tooth and coin podcast, where we talk about your adventure of being a dental practice owner. In these episodes, we're going to be talking about problems that you will likely face as a practice owner, as well as give an idea about actionable solutions that you can take so that you can get past this problem in your practice. Some of these concepts are really big ones. Some of them are very specific, but we hope that these episodes help you along with your journey. Now, a very important piece for you to understand is that this is not paid financial advice. This is not paid tax or legal advice. We are not your financial advisors. We are not your CPAs. This is two CPAs talking about informational and educational content to help you along with your journey. It's a very important piece for you to understand.Jonathan VanHorn:Another thing that you need to know is if you enjoy today's content, join us on the Facebook group. So we've got a Facebook group that is active with dentists that is going to have content talking about what we're talking about today, to continue the discussion. Agree with us. Don't agree with us, have a story to tell, have something to share. Join us in the Facebook group. If you go to Facebook and you search for tooth in coin podcast, click on it to join it and be able to join us there. Finally, if you need some more help, we're developing a list of resources that are going to be centering it around our topics of discussion, to be able to help you a little bit more than what the content is doing. So if you'd like access to that, whenever it becomes ready, all you have to do is text the word tooth and coin T O O T H a N D C O I N 2 3 3 4 4 4. Again, that's tooth and coin all one word, no spaces, 2 3, 3, 4, 4, 4, reply with your email address. And we'll email you instructions on how to get into the Facebook group, as well as agita list, to be able to send you those resources when they're available. And if they're available, we'll go ahead and send them to you as well. So onto today's episode, hope you enjoy it. Hello,Joseph Rugger:Ambitious Dennis. And welcome to another exciting episode of the tooth and coin podcast. I'm Joseph rugger joined always by my awesome co-host Jonathan van horn. Jonathan say hello to the folks at home.Jonathan VanHorn:Howdi Doodie, everybody,Joseph Rugger:Or in your car or wherever it is that you might be joining us. We appreciate you tuning in and listening to our show today, today, we thought we'd take a different route and talk a little bit about entrepreneurship and kind of the spirit of entrepreneurship. So if you're listening to this podcast, you likely are a dentist that is out and you've owned your practice. You may have owned it for six months or six years or 25 years. You may be thinking about starting a practice, but that tends to be one of those things. It's just such a daunting thought and a daunting task to, to, to kind of strike out here on your own and, and launch into this world entrepreneurship. So what we're going to do today, I'm going to talk to Jonathan who's, who's done this and get kind of some, some thoughts on his journey as an entrepreneur and everything that's in between. So Jonathan man, always a pleasure. I'm looking forward to hearing more of your story every time I feel like I know your story, something comes up and I'm like, I had no idea that was part of Jonathan's story.Jonathan VanHorn:Yeah. So, I mean, it's, it's interesting. It, it's fun to, to be in, to be an entrepreneur. It's going to be sometimes a little scary at times too. And yeah, I'm excited. This is a little bit of a turn of a different, different type of a conversation for me to have, because usually everything I talk about is just like dentistry, dentistry, dentistry, taxes, accounting taxes, accounting, business, business business. So, yeah, we're excited to talk about the,Joseph Rugger:Yeah, so Jonathan and I, Jonathan, you and I met each other randomly sit next to each other at a continuing education in little rock Arkansas, about 15 years ago. And you know, at that time I was working for a company as the CFO and you were in public accounting and we ended up knowing a whole bunch of the same people from Northeast Arkansas. You had gone to school in, in the, in Jonesborough where I lived at the time and we just hit it off and knew a whole bunch of the same people. And you were, you were in public accounting, you were working for another firm and, you know, we kinda hit it off and had fun and, you know, exchanged contact information and kind of kept up with each other for a while. I remember, I remember specifically sitting and having lunch with you a couple of different times in little rock. Cause we were talking about all of these entrepreneurial ideas that you had, and we were kind of talking through different books that you had read. And I think, I think one of them was, was it the toilet paper entrepreneur that you told me about? Or was it the a hundred? I was a a hundred dollars startup who, which one was the mattress company guy,Jonathan VanHorn:Which one was that there there's a a hundred dollars startup and then there's also the pumpkin plain or the two big ones I really enjoy.Joseph Rugger:Yeah. So, so anyway, so, you know, as, as somebody that, that for me, most of my career, most of my earnings, most of what I've done for a living has been working for somebody else. And there's not anything wrong with that. There's certainly as good and bad in every kind of relationship that you have that's out there. So I thought I'd, I thought I'd just kind of pick your brain and talk a little bit today about, you know, kind of your journey as an entrepreneur and kind of, you know, it's not something that you walked out of college and said, I'm going to go start my own CPA firm. You said, you know, let's go explore, let's do this. So maybe talk us early kind of early career when you were working for somebody else and kind of a W2 employee and kind of in the grind and learning stuff.Joseph Rugger:And, you know, maybe just kind of talk us through a little bit about that part of your journey and, and maybe kind of when you started getting excited, like, have you always been an entrepreneur, like, were you the five-year-old kid that had the lemonade stand, you know, that measures your costs and try to figure that out. Like, when we talk about the entrepreneurial spirit, you know, learning about you and your family, you guys kind have a bunch of entrepreneurs. So like, is this something that you're kind of born with? Is it like ingrained in you talk to us maybe about some of those early stage?Jonathan VanHorn:Yeah. So in terms of just me as a person and growing up, I was always, I was always really competitive. So I really enjoyed challenging myself and I always enjoyed trying to optimize things and, you know, I also enjoyed games. So like the, I was when I was a lot, you know, I'm not like that physically gifted in terms of athleticism or anything like that. But at the same time I have a competitiveness. So when I was younger, that tended to me being more like I enjoyed playing video games a lot. So I was big. I was big on video games that a lot, I, I couldn't wait to get home to play play games. Like in the, usually my, the reason I would optimize my day would be when I was in school, you know, early, early Jonathan was so that I could have more time to play video games.Jonathan VanHorn:And then when I was playing the video games, I was always trying to optimize everything inside of those games so that I could do things in the most, in the best manner. And that's, that's just how my brain always worked. And I really enjoyed doing it as I got older, I started, you know, started playing more sports. And again, I'm not that gifted from athletics department. I'm six foot two, so I'm moderately tall and that's about it. Wasn't very good stops. Wasn't I wasn't very fast, but I had a hall, a lot of heart and I tried really hard and the want to be better, always allowed, allowed me to, to move, move up in those ranks. So, so that, that wasn't me in general. Then I got into college. I was always really, you know, I also enjoyed math, was a big interest of mine.Jonathan VanHorn:I thought that I was going to become a math professor before I came into the CPA world. It was something that I always did really well in and, you know, enjoy doing. So I, I almost went down that path eventually changed to be a CPA because I I'll be honest with you. I heard you can make more money being a CPA. Then you could be a math professor. So I became a CPA and I got out into the rural world and then I'm out in the real world. And, you know, I'll be honest when I started working for a CPA firm for the first time. And I went out, went on my first audit. I was a little confused as to what w what we were doing, you know, you know, so an audit was a, and that's, you know, a lot of people start in the audit field in the CPA world.Jonathan VanHorn:And that's where I started to, I didn't make it very long at the place I started out at changed around a few different firms, but while I was working, I still kinda kept that mindset of being the best that I could be. So it didn't really matter where I was or what I was doing. I was always trying to be the best at it. I was always to, you know, prepare the best tax return, be the person who could best understand what was going on from a tax standpoint, be the person who could do all these other things. But, you know, growing up, I always had a job. Like I always had. I always, you know, since I was 15 years old at a job before that, I found ways to make money, you know, doing things around the neighborhood or whatever it was, but I was always working.Jonathan VanHorn:And so, and most of that was in, I worked in a video store throughout high school, something that's not even a thing anymore. I, I sold, sold flowers on, on the phone, through a telephone service for three years in college, you know, does it a whole budget out on the moon? I started a moving company when I was in college. So I started a moving company in college. Yeah. So were you the ones that did not college hunks hauling junk and I, that was probably a similar story of how that got started. I was a guy, I had a trailer and I had an SUV and I had a fraternity that I was in that always had people that needed money of, of, you know, big guys that could move furniture. And so I'd have these furniture stores are selling furniture to their customers and they didn't have a way to move it.Jonathan VanHorn:So they'd call me and I'd, I'd knew it for them. And I'd get a couple of people that would be able to go with me and I'd say, Hey, you know, you'll get this much. And for, you know, 30 minutes of where we'll go drive across town and get a mattress and take it to the other side of town and come back and you'll make 20 bucks. And in college, 20 bucks for an hour's worth of work is pretty good back in the early two thousands. So we did that and I always had a, like a customer service, you know, mind to it. Cause I always, I just very early on learned that that was a really important thing to, to have whenever you were, you know, providing services. And then I got into the public accounting realm and found out very quickly that, you know, a lot of the, the customer service, wasn't really an important piece of it.Jonathan VanHorn:Like it was more just like, what can you do for me and get it done so we can give this to the board and then the board can discuss it. And then, you know, we have crossed all of our T's and dotted all our I's. And then I went into smaller public accounting for, you know, for, for small business, rather than kind of like small to medium-sized businesses. And I really liked that a lot more because it was, you know, more customer service centric. You actually have to know your, your clients and you actually got to be able to help them. And so, yeah, so that's that, that was the part of me getting into it. And then very, you know, as I was traveling between these different firms, I was getting really frustrated with nothing against the firms I was working for. They were doing what they needed to do to do their business and to help their clients. But I could always just tell there was a little bit of a difference in what I wanted to do and what the typical industry norm was. I wanted to have just closer relationship I wanted, you know, to be able to ride more value effectively. And I knew that the value was there because I was working really hard on it. And I was trying to find the value where I could. So I kind of brought me up until the end of, you know, where I was working for somebody else.Joseph Rugger:Yeah. Well, there's that competitive streak again, right. Like we're doing it this way, but I think we can do it better, you know, and, and, and I'm sure that there probably are people that listen to our podcasts that are in situations that are, that run into roadblocks. Like, Hey, we're doing this a certain way, and this is the way we've always done it. This is Sally. Right. Same as last year is how we did it. Hurry up, get it done as fast as you can have as much realization as much profit, Hey, I've got this way to improve it. I mean, did you find yourself running against roadblocks that just really kind of killed that competitive spirit that you were talking about?Jonathan VanHorn:Yeah, there definitely was. And then it was there, it was in a bunch of different places. One was this time component, you know, whenever you work for a public accounting firm, you know, you're, you're, you're working a lot of hours. You're one firm I was working at, you know, I'd probably get there around seven in the morning and I'd leave around seven at night and work the weekends. And, you know, and that was in the busy season and the non-busy season, you know, you typically, you know, work up eight to five 30 sometimes, you know, seven 30 to five 30, something like that, just depending on the time of the year. Sometimes you'll work weekends too in the off season just to kind of keep up with everything. And the reason is because you're trying to get what are called billable hours, that you can bill your clients.Jonathan VanHorn:And so the, the, the practice can make money. That's just, that's just the model. That's how it works. And there was only so many hours in the day to be able to help people. And sometimes the value that you could provide to one client wouldn't be worth the billable hour, but it would still have value. So, and sometimes it was worth, the billable hour was worth it, but the client didn't see it. They didn't, they didn't get it. So to speak of why that was valuable. And so there was a, some, there were just some roadblocks in terms of how you could help people. So another example of that would be that, you know, there'd be maybe, maybe I could do something that could save somebody $2,000. Apparently my watch thought I was talking to it, but there, there were some points where I made, I could, I had saved somebody $2,000 a year in taxes with this strategy that could come up for them, but it would take me, you know, between research and implementation and, you know, talking to the client, you 10 hours to get that done.Jonathan VanHorn:Well, if I'm charging $200 an hour for my time, well, I just cost them in tack and fees to us what they're going to make back. But they, and they wouldn't see that, you know, well, you're gonna get to do this $2,000 every year, you know, going forward. And so it's worth a lot more money than that. And then at the same time, there'd be clients, you'd start to do the research for, and you get halfway through it and you realize this doesn't work for them because of ABCD rules when it comes to their industry or their situation, whatever it may be. And then another set, you do the research and it makes sense, but then you talk to the client and they didn't want to go forward with the steps to be able to make sure that that would happen. And so there was just a lot of roadblocks, but based on the nature of a service industry, that wouldn't allow us to do that in a typical CPA for a format. So whenever you're thinking about that terms of management, if you have employees that are trying to do all these extra things and spend all this extra time doing these other things that you can't bill for, are you going to encourage that typically? Are you typically going to discourage that? Okay,Joseph Rugger:No discourage at time is money, right? Cause we've already tried. We tried that once that's not worth it, quit spinning your wheels, stick to the script, here's the script, here's what you need to do.Jonathan VanHorn:Right. So, and that was, that was the, you know, that was the internal struggle, struggle that I was facing. I was like, you know, I can, I, I know I can do more for people. I know that as a business, we can do more for people and I want to do that. And so I've been to the, did it,Joseph Rugger:Yeah. Well talk, talk us through like, was there like always kind of this burning desire to do your own thing? Or did you just kind of get to the point where you were like, just kind of fed up about, you know, all the roadblocks you're running into and kind of this whole model of the billable hour had always been an itch for you or did you just kind of get to the breaking point?Jonathan VanHorn:So that's a really good question. My dad, whenever I was growing up had told me, you know, at one point, cause he shared the story before he was an entrepreneur. He owned his own furniture company. That's how I knew to do the furniture moving. Cause I've moved some furniture for my family and he told me, you know, very early on, you know, it's, it's really nice to own your own business, but it can be really hard because you can't really rely on anyone else, but yourself and you know, you've got it all, it all ends with you. Like you're ultimately responsible for all of it. And I can remember that, you know, hearing that, you know, 30 years ago and not really fully understanding it. And then when I got out into the, you know, the real world I was working for other people, I'll be honest with you.Jonathan VanHorn:I didn't know. I didn't know if I was going to do my own thing or not. Yeah. I kind of I'm, I'm very, I feel like I'm a pretty flexible guy. And so I can usually, you know, figure out the best situation. And I was just going to come with what, whatever came to me and the last position that I was in, I knew that wasn't going to be the position I'd ultimately be in just because of a bunch of different factors that were involved, but I didn't know where I was going to go from there. And so it wasn't like I was always, you know, from the beginning of finishing my master's will, okay, well it's time for me to do my 10 year plan to be able to start a business. Now it was, I'm going to figure this out as I go.Jonathan VanHorn:And if that opportunity arises, we'll go that way. And I'll be honest with you. It felt like it didn't really, no opportunities really came around that other than the ones that I, that I had. And it was very much a case similar to the dentist. I talked to you every day now, have they kind of just like, Hey, I can do this on my own. I don't, I want to have the ability to do my own type of, for Dennis his treatment plans for us, it's maybe it's tax plans or the way we handle our service engagements. And I, you know, I, I want to just do it on my own. I want to build my own thing. And I eventually had that opportunity and I took it.Joseph Rugger:That's cool. That's cool. Well, I mean, do you get a chance to talk to Dennis about taking the plunge? Like by the time somebody picks up the phone and calls us, have they made their mind up or do you find yourself like answering questions about kind of the, what ifs and helping them role play out and kind of being part of their, I guess homework or due diligence is like the official term. Right. But do you find yourself like coaching them through like as they're coming up with that or by the time they call us, they've already made up their mind.Jonathan VanHorn:You didn't know at the time the, the cognitive, the CPA they've made up their mind. There's not a whole lot. I can do to convince someone that it's the right choice, wrong choice for them individually. Jamie Amos, a friend of mine said something really, really smart. One time he says a lot of smart things. One thing that he said that was exceptionally smart or very pointed was the there's no, there's never a, like a best time to start your own business and all it comes down to, I'm sure I'm going to butcher this, but it all comes down to the cost of not owning your, a business as greater than having your own business. Like, you know, it costs you more to keep working for somebody else. And it does, you know, you could go do your own thing. Like the, the, your it's not worth it enough to you to keep doing what you're doing. And it may not be dollars and cents. It could be something else that's pushing you towards doing it, you know, going and doing your own thing too.Joseph Rugger:Yeah, that's awesome. Yeah.Jonathan VanHorn:That's when, you know, that's, when you know, you're ready is whenever, you know, you'd rather go out on your own and fail than to stay where you are and, you know, just kind of get by. Yeah,Joseph Rugger:For sure. I like that. I like that idea of the opportunity cost, right? Because you know, we've only got so many hours in a day. We've only got so many weeks on planet earth. So many years on planet earth, you know, is, are you costing yourself opportunity by, you know, sitting in grudge and through another day, you know, and you know, I would imagine that many of our clients will, we'll definitely be able to relate to your thoughts on, I wanted to do it better and I could see it doing it better. I was talking to a potential client the other day and I said, well, what made you start you to start your own practice? And they said, we see so much work that's out there. That's just not good work. And we know that we can do it better period. And I, I mean, I got here that come out in your kind of story about CPA land, you know, and, and we're not unique as a, as CPAs. You know, every, every industry has that. Every industry has the folks that are doing same as last year. And you know, we're doing our best to get by and maximize the profitability. I'm not mad at the CPA profession for any of that stuff, but we think we can do it better.Jonathan VanHorn:Yeah. I mean, it comes down to solving a problem. If you're willing to start any business, whether it be dentistry or a CPA firm, you've got to try and solve a problem. And the problem that I felt that was out there was that the traditional CPA business model, not what the CPA industry does, but the typicals typical average CPA model was not, was not the highest value that can be brought to a CPA client relationship. And the, the, the other problem was to me was that the, you know, in the dental space, that there was a lot of, of, of business owners that didn't, that needed more help than what the traditional model allowed CPM model allows. And so I said, why don't we, you know, why don't I start a business to do that? And that's what we did.Joseph Rugger:I was, I got a chance to visit with, with a business owner, not too terribly long ago. And I was trying to pick his brain on a bunch of stuff. And we were talking about, you know, the different ways that, that we compete or the way that we operate. I shared this with you guys the other day at our meeting, you know, number one is price, right? So like, we go out, we compete on price, Hey, here's how much, how much it's going to cost to do this. This is how much I charge for a crown here's how much, you know, x-rays and cleanings and exam costs. We compete on price. And if you compete on price, you're going to constantly be in just a no win scenario as a race to the bottom, right? Like everything's going to become more commoditized. Everything's, you know, w in any industry, it'll be more and more commoditized to, to, to compete on prices, kind of a losing scenario.Joseph Rugger:Number two is performance, right? I have a job that needs to be done, and that is that I need my teeth cleaned. I need, you know, I need to get this to pain, taken care of. I need a root canal. You know, I performed the job. Well, lots of folks that can perform that, right. If you were to say our performance as a CPA firm is completing tax returns to in tax game plans, like there are a lot of people that can do that and can perform the minute you don't perform. If that's all you're competing on, you're gonna lose that client. Oh, well, we got something wrong. Like number three is we have a tendency to work on work with people that we like. So number three is that they like us, right? We're nice people. We're easy to get along with. We returned the call.Joseph Rugger:And so kind of the three big things that we're competing on, right. It's price performance with. And they like us. We hope anyways. And the guy asked me, he looked me in the eye and he said, what's your number four. You said, number four is what it is that separates you from everybody else that was kinda taken aback. And I said, I don't know. I'll have to get back to you on that. I need to figure that out. I'd like to say was that I'm going to work harder than anybody else. It's. I'd like to say that it's, I'm smarter than everybody else. Those are probably things it's. A lot of other people would say, I'm going to give better service than anybody else. It's probably something else there, but it would say, so for those of you that are thinking about owning your own practice, starting your own practice, or if you're in the middle of practice ownership, if you're not competing on price, you're not competing on performance. You're not competing on because people like you, like, what's your number four. So I, I turned that over to you, Jonathan. I don't put you on the spot here, you know? W what would you say, you know, as a firm, like, what is, what is our number four, just to get people thinking about what their number four might be?Jonathan VanHorn:Yeah. So, I mean, when it comes down to price, quality and service, you know, for us, we always try to, we don't, we didn't want to be the lowest cost. So we don't the way I always explain it to people is that the lowest cost is always going to be like, oh, I can app like a software that just automatically just get renewed every month. And it's very low cost. And it just does one thing for you. And it just does that over and over and over again, the, the CPA we have, we do so many things as a CPA firm. We can't do that, but we can create systems and processes to make sure that that has done well, if that goes over to service. So, or to, to, to go to quality. So if you go to quality, there's like a pretty high threshold for any CPA firm in order to be able to deliver in quality.Jonathan VanHorn:Like you have to, you can't be at the bottom echelon or the bottom quintile of, of service offerings, or quality of service in a CPA firm. If you do that, then you're going to have so many headaches and issues as a firm that you're going to very quickly be out of business. So that, that service should almost always be very high. Our quality should always be very high. I mean, using quality of service interchangeably, but the quality always has to be very high. And that should be the standard for all CPA firms. I mean, that's the, that's what the CPA stands for effectively as quality and professionalism and standards and things like that. So then it comes to service. You know, it comes down to what we were talking about beforehand in terms of being able to, you know, the relationship and being able to do the things extra, that then over and above what typical firms can typically do.Jonathan VanHorn:So in terms of fourth, you know, for us individually, it comes down to, we are we're, you know, we're, we are remote from. So we're able to do things very quickly. We're digital, we're very efficiency, minded. We're able to turn things around many times. She'll email us a question that, that are an issue and it's taken care of, you know, almost immediately, whereas in like a typical CPA firm environment, you know, they've got to start the billable hour, which usually means it's, there's a line of projects in front of you because they've got us set up their billable hours. And so we have a lot of efficiency and as well as industry specific knowledge that we can deliver to our clients in a way. So circle this back to the original. First of all, the conversation about me individually is something that we're we're obsessive and our firm is the, is just being able to respond to clients very quickly, having very fast response times and being able to respond to situations very quickly, as well as being able to get big issues resolved quickly.Jonathan VanHorn:So a good example of that as like the, the, the HHS provide a really fun, we sent out an email this morning, or this earlier this week to all of our clients with a very in-depth email. Like here's what you need to know. Here's what you need to do. Here's what you need to understand. Here are the due dates. Here are the different ramifications of this. And by the way, that whole thing that is not tax or accounting related, but that's just that, that that's completely separate from what our field deals with, but it's something that we knew about that our clients needed to know. And so we were able to deliver that and, you know, I would, I would argue that's probably a part of the service. I don't really think you can have a fourth thing in addition to quality or service or price.Jonathan VanHorn:I think that I could probably make an argument. Everything goes into one of those categories, but in terms of like what the standard, you know, the standard look, as of whenever they try and make, do the pricing triangle or the triangle a lot, where do you want more? Do you want a better price? Or do you want better quality or you want better? Service are four thing almost if you will, is that we're kind of able to encapsulate all those things because of the fact that we are so efficiency minded, we have a very high quality of service. We're a very reasonable price point compared to the market. And at the same time, we deliver a really good customer service. At least, at least I believe so.Joseph Rugger:I do too. That's why I enjoy working with Morgan with our team. We got an awesome team. So you've been at this kind of on your own five, six years, any regrets, best decision ever, worst decision ever, you sleep better, you sleep worse. It's been a good decision for you. It kind of, you know, again, in that entrepreneurial spirit that we talked about earlier, what are, what are your thoughts looking back on this?Jonathan VanHorn:Thanks so far. So we started in 2013, so it's been about eight years now, but the, the worst case scenario was always the, I'm still a CPA and give it a year. It doesn't work. I'll go work for somebody else. Like no big deal. I know how to work hard and know how to work smart. I use a Le it's not like I'm going to go to the, to the college, to, to, and I'm going to use it, lose a year of eligibility. Like it's going to be fine. I'll still have experience. And some employers might actually like that experience. So it wasn't, it wasn't the worst case scenario and same thing with the dentist. Like if you go out there and you give your best shot and doesn't work out, yeah, you're going to have some debt, but at the end of the day, you're still going to be a dentist.Jonathan VanHorn:She'll still be a high income potential person. And that's one of the reasons banks love the Lindia is even if it doesn't work out, they're still going to have income potential in the future for me. Yeah. It's been, it's been really great. I love how many people were able to help. You know, we get, we created this really cool business that I feel like serves multiple sets of value to different people. So it breads a lot of value to our clients that at price points that are reasonable, we get a lot of really cool stories from our clients about how we've helped them in a bunch of different ways. They're really nice from an employee standpoint, if we have these really great employees that we've been able to give these, you know, positional career opportunities that they wouldn't have been able to have, if this business type didn't S it didn't didn't exist.Jonathan VanHorn:You know, I started a digital firm in 2013, and it's getting a little bit more popular now, but back then it was, I would get a lot of really weird looks that people be like, oh, so you're a digital firm. So you work off of your phone. Like, no, that's not really what it means. You know? And we've been able to get a lot of people this really big, this really large amount of work, flexibility that isn't allowed in other places. And so I felt we were able to turn a what the culture of a, of an industry that is typically very rigid and very billable hour dependent, and allow that our us to turn our business into a very flexible work-life culture that provides a lot of value to our employees, which then gets permeated and gets to the, goes back to the clients as well, because we have really smart people that work for us. We have really, really hard workers that work for us that are, that, you know, just enjoy it, enjoy that flexibility as well. So, yeah, best decision ever, other than marrying my wife and having my kids probably solvingJoseph Rugger:No that's fair enough. Well, it's something that you're proud of. You know, the, in those of you that are listening to this that have built a dental practice from a scratch start or from an acquisition, or, or if you're going to go out and build one and build something that you're going to be proud of, you know, I really appreciate you kind of open it up and giving us an idea of what, what life life is like inside of Jonathan van. Horn's head, as you kind of have created this thing. And I, I really like this competitive spirit that you talked about, which is like, I always want to do it better. I want to come up with a way of doing it better. So, man, it's been a pleasure getting a chance to chat with you a little bit. I hope this has been valuable to our listeners. Any other concluding thoughts, Jonathan?Jonathan VanHorn:Yeah. Just make sure that you're, if this is, if you feel like you're able to do it, you probably are. Try not to listen to too many voices out there saying that you can't. I know it's very cliche to be like, you know, oh, you know, big cheerleader. Yeah. If you, if you just believe really hard, you can do it. But the reality is is that if other people can do it, so can you, like, there's nothing, there's nothing that special about that other person, other than they had a risk profile. And there had that, allowed them to make the decision that they were willing to take that jump. And once you're willing to take that jump and no one can tell you when that is other than yourself, like don't, don't call me and say, Hey, I want to talk about maybe like, am I ready to be a practice owner?Jonathan VanHorn:Don't do that. Like, you're, I will never be able to tell you if you are not literally just listen to these words. You're the one who has to say when you're ready. No, you talked to your family and talk to your friends, things like that. Maybe they can convince you, you're talking to some random guy on the internet or some random CPA is not going to do that for you. So, so just be aware that you can do it. Other people have, you can too. And entrepreneurship is great. It's like one of the, I, you know, not to be, you know, political or, you know, you know, to, to, you know, American or ish or patriotic, but it's one of the most American things that you can do to like, that's like the that's one of the benefits of being in the us is the ability to go out there and do it yourself. So it's a really cool thing to be able to do. And we're, we're, we're lucky to be in a place where we can do it.Joseph Rugger:Absolutely. Well guys, thanks again for listening to us. We'll catch you next time. Bye guys. Bye.Jonathan VanHorn:That's it for today, guys. I hope you enjoyed this episode of the tooth and coin podcast. If you are going to be a practice owner or a new practice owner, and you're interested in CTA services, head on over to tooth and coin.com, you can check out more about our CPA services. We help out around 250 offices around the country. I'd love to be able to have the discussion about how we could help your new practice. We do specialize in new practice owners. So people that have are about to be an owner of a practice they're requiring about to be an owner of a practice. They are starting up or has become an owner in the past five years. That is our specialty. And we'd love to be able to talk to you about how we can help you in your services with your tax and accounting services.Jonathan VanHorn:And if you enjoy today's episode again, go to the Facebook group. Talk to us about what we've talked about, joining in on the discussion, and let's create an environment where we can talk about some of these things so that we can all help each other, get through these things together so that this adventure of business ownership is more fun, more productive, and better in the longterm. Lastly, if you want access to those resources that we're going to, that we are currently building, just text the word tooth in coin 2, 3, 3, 4, 4, 4 that's tooth and coin, no spaces. T O O T H a N D C O I N 2 3 3 4 4 4. Apply with your email address. We'll send you instructions on the Facebook group. We'll send you the resources when they're available and we will see you next week.

Strange Street Fighter sound effects? Gay porn? Sheds? If this is what you look for in rugby podcasts, you've come to the right place. This week, Eddie discusses round 3 of the Gallagher prem, PLUS all that bollocks mentioned earlier. SHED!

It's Sam the beaver's first night living with her boyfriend, but he forgot to tell her it was game night. Trying to fit in, Sam tries coffee for the first time. Does she like it a little too much? Today's story is “Game Night” by https://madisonkeller.net/ (Ian Madison Keller), who has been writing since 2013, and whose newest book is https://www.goalpublications.com/store/p108/ritual-of-the-ancients-paperback.html (Ritual of the Ancients) by https://www.goalpublications.com/ (Fanged Fiction). You can find more of his stories on his https://madisonkeller.net/ (webpage), madisonkeller.net. Today's story will be read for you by B. P. Rugger, the ineffable Moo Moon.

Join the discussion on Facebook!TranscriptJonathan VanHorn:Hey everybody, Jonathan checking in here and just so you know, this is a two part episode. This is the second part of the episode. So if you've not listened to the first part yet, you want to go back and listen to it in the prior weeks. We should have it labeled on the episode title what part one is and part two is, so you should be able to see that in the title of the episode, what episode of episode it is. So thanks.Jonathan VanHorn:Welcome to the Tooth and Coin Podcast, where we talk about your adventure of being a dental practice owner. In these episodes, we're going to be talking about problems that you will likely face as a practice owner, as well as give an idea about actionable solutions that you can take so that you can get past this problem in your practice. Some of these concepts are really big ones. Some of them are very specific, but we hope that these episodes help you along with your journey. Now, a very important piece for you to understand is that this is not paid financial advice. This is not paid tax or legal advice. We are not your financial advisors. We are not your CPAs. This is two CPAs talking about informational and educational content to help you along with your journey. It's a very important piece for you to understand. Another thing that you need to know is if you enjoy today's content, join us on the Facebook group.Jonathan VanHorn:So we've got a Facebook group that is active with dentists that is going to have content talking about what we're talking about today, to continue the discussion. Agree with us, don't agree with us, have a story to tell, have something to share, join us in the Facebook group. If you go to Facebook and you search for Tooth and Coin Podcast, click on it to join it and be able to join us there. Finally, if you need some more help, we're developing a list of resources that are going to be centering around our topics of discussion, to be able to help you a little bit more than what the content is doing. So if you'd like access to that whenever it becomes ready, all you have to do is text the word toothandcoin, T-O-O-T-H-A-N-D-C-O-I-N to 33444.Jonathan VanHorn:Again, that's toothandcoin, all one word, no spaces, to 33444. Reply with your email address and we'll email you instructions on how to get into Facebook group, as well as add you to the list to be able to send you those resources when they're available. And if they're available, we'll go ahead and send them to you as well. So onto today's episode, I hope you enjoy it.Jonathan VanHorn:So let's say that you did all these things, and you can come in, and you can influence these numbers, you've done an amazing job. If you've been able to influence all the expenses and lower them by five to 10%, not five to 10% overall, but five to 10% of the 55%, which would mean that you've moved from 55 cents of every dollar down to maybe two and a half to five pennies extra that you're going to get out of every dollar. And I know of practice owners that spend tens of hours a month trying to do this and trying to reduce these expenses because they want to spend less, so they get to keep more of every dollar that comes in. But to me, that's missing the picture. That's missing the bigger picture because instead of trying to save that five to 10 cents, why not just over on the other side of that table, pour out 100 more pennies in which you could then move 55 cents of those over and keep the 45 cents.Jonathan VanHorn:You could find so many more dollars to dump on that table, if you just worked on increasing capacity, and doing a better job of having patients in, and generating more revenue. That is, in the dental industry, the way the math works, that's so much more of a higher value for the use of your time than going through and making sure every month that I know exactly how much I spent on every glove that came in this office, I know where every one of those nickels went to. The amount of time that, that will take you, and energy, and focus, and effort could be so much better spent on your office to do so much more. And so that's overall why I say budgeting sucks. It's a waste of time because you really only should have to manage your expenses once a year maybe.Jonathan VanHorn:I think that's a better term for it and I think those two terms get conflated inside of a lot of industries. Small business, you don't need to worry about budgeting. The way I explain this to some people is that, I've had clients that have had budgets in the past, and they're like, "Jonathan, we budgeted 10% of our revenue to go to labs and our labs got all the way up to 10% so fast that I told people that I didn't want to take any more big cases because I don't want to do more labs." And I said, "Look, that's completely defeating the purpose."Joseph Rugger:[crosstalk 00:04:52] What's the point?Jonathan VanHorn:That's not... I felt like the woman from that commercial that's like, "This isn't how this works. This is how none of this works." She's trying to explain to her friend how Facebook works and she's putting pictures up on the wall. The way I explain it is, if someone said, "Hey," let's say that an ortho case is worth $5,000 to your office, if someone said, "Hey, I will give you 1,000 ortho cases. That's like $5 million in ortho cases, but I'm going to charge you $3,000.00 per case," and assume there was no other expenses. That's 60% going to labs, that's way over your budget. Would you take that deal? Assuming everything else is the same.Joseph Rugger:Of course you would.Jonathan VanHorn:The obvious answer is probably going to be, "Yeah, I want $2 million," $2 million is fine, but it completely destroys your budget, so that's the reason that the math just doesn't work out in a lot of these smaller practices. Now, the argument is definitely made that when you get larger, when you get to maybe three, four, five, six, seven, eight, nine, $10 million a year in revenue that if you can save five to 10%, if you can say that five pennies per dollar coming in, in a $10 million office, that's $50,000.00 a year. That's pretty nice, right? Sorry, it's $500,000.00. Is that? Yeah, $500,000.00 a year. That's $500,000.00 a year. That's a lot of money. That's called economy of scales. The larger you get, the more value it brings. And so that's my big argument against budgeting. The last thing that I'll say that is a really important number to keep up with in terms of doing expense management is your credit card processing fees and your insurance reimbursements.Jonathan VanHorn:So credit card processing fees are, I was telling you, Joseph, before we got on the call, we had a client that they were spending something like $30,000.00 a year in credit card fees and they were paying about 3% as an effective rate. The effective rate most people can get to is about 2% and we've hooked them up with a great credit card vendor and they literally are saving $10,000.00 a year by just changing the phone number that, that credit card machine dialed to. And so that was an easy one, so that's why I'm saying you got to make sure that you're keeping up with your expenses and you do need to look at them, but the frequency doesn't have to be every month, every day, every hour, every minute. It can be in bigger pictures and just make sure that you're getting decent deals along the way. Yeah, that's kind of my philosophy and my thoughts on budgeting. What were some of the things that you're thinking about?Joseph Rugger:Well, I always go back to the cost benefit ratio, and as a business owner, is it worth your time, energy, and effort because you don't have an army of financial analysts and accountants inside of your practice to do this. Is it really the best use of your time to do that? And I think the things that you're talking about outside of budgeting, so budgeting, if we use the diminishing returns and then we flip that and say, "What are we going to get exponential returns?" So if we say the lifetime value of one patient is, pick a general number, right? $10,000.00, if we spend time to get an additional one patient, 10 patients, 20 patients, whatever it is, we're talking about exponential returns versus diminishing returns on those kinds of things.Joseph Rugger:And that's something, as we work with new practice owners, they're really, really concerned about get the P&L, and I'm like, "Doc, your top line is zero, I can hand you your expenses, but really where we need to do all of our energy and efforts is on this top line revenue, and get patients in the door, and that kind of thing." I mean, because that's where you're going to have the exponential returns.Jonathan VanHorn:Yeah. And like you said, a lot of it also depends on the goals of the practice. If you're okay with where you are in the world and you're like, "Yeah, we got enough revenue. My service mix is perfect. I never want to increase capacity. I never want to change the amount of crowns I'm doing for a patient. I never want to change, add services," or whatever it may be and you've never done this before, you should do it. Do it once and then if you want to do it every month, do it, but I would challenge you to say that you're probably going to be wasting your time majority of the time you're doing it, other than that first time. I mean, I've literally given a checklist of things that people could do today to optimize expenses and like 99% of you guys that are out there, I guarantee you that's going to be enough.Jonathan VanHorn:So anyway, that's my thoughts on budgeting and things like that. Now, I will say, budgeting is not the same thing as optimizing your cash. It's not the overall thing. It's not a substitute for understanding your cashflow because we've personally seen clients that have had positive results from having intention around and an understanding and monitoring of where their money is going to. And this is on bigger picture things, right? It's not specifically on, well, I got to make sure that I'm only spending 7% of my revenue on supplies this month or else I've done a bad thing. It's more about making sure that the cash flow is staying where it's supposed to be. Right? You work with a lot of clients on this and you do this in your CFO role, so explain a little bit more about that.Joseph Rugger:Well, I think going back to something that we talked about on that personal budgeting is about having intentionality. So the bulk of our clients are small businesses that are what they call flow-through entities, right? So basically all of the income from the practice flows through to their personal tax return and they're required to make estimated tax payments. So one of the things that I think makes a whole, whole lot of sense is to make sure that we're preparing for what we're going to have to pay out in income taxes. So one of the things that I've recommended time and time again to practice owners is, "Hey, let's just open a separate bank account and let's just start saving money for taxes. You're going to have quarterly taxes. They're going to be due at this point in time. We don't know exactly how much those are going to be. We're going to throw some estimates and some projections together and see what it's going to be, but would you rather have that money come out of your practice checking account or would you rather have already saved and been intentional about setting aside some money?"Joseph Rugger:And it may be something where you set aside $5,000.00 a month, or $10,000.00 a month, or check with your tax professional on how much the estimated tax payments are going to be, but setting money aside for income taxes that you're going to have to make at either the state level and the federal level, or just at the federal level, if you don't have state income tax, but saving for taxes, having some money that you set aside and you're intentional about putting that aside. I've got another client that really wants to do some capital expenditures he doesn't want to have any more debt to the practice. He doesn't want to take out notes. He'd rather just save up and pay cash.Joseph Rugger:I'm like, "Okay, well maybe we should open up a bank account and send a percentage of your revenue over to this and it'd be a capital expenditure account," and we start saving a few thousand dollars a month here and there, and all of a sudden we've got enough money set aside that he can pay cash for those things rather than having to finance. And then there's certainly your pros and cons to financing capital equipment and that kind of thing, but this specific client his kind of capacity on whether or not he wanted to use debt to do it, he just said, "I don't want to take out any more debt." So let's save for it, let's be intentional about it.Joseph Rugger:There's lots of different people that are out there that have written quite a bit on all the different ways to handle money inside of a business. Kind of one of the things that I continue to hear and will be a good concept to all of our listeners here is the idea of paying yourself first. So whether that's David Bach telling you to sign up for your company 401k and have money withheld, to the Mike Michalowicz's of the world that say take your profit first, or kind of the Dave Ramsey's that say have an envelope system and save specific amounts for specific things. Everybody in that whole world is like, so let's be intentional about it. So really what we're talking about is rather than it be like a budget, it's just about being intentional with your cashflow. Are you looking at how much cash, extra cash that your practice has produced this month?Joseph Rugger:Okay, we had an additional... Our cash went up in the bank, $10,000.00. Well, what are you going to do with it? You going to take a shareholder distribution? You going to pay off loans? You going to invest that money? Are you going to save up for something else? What are you going to do? So one of the things that we've done with some of our clients is having these cashflow budgeting conversations and I hate to use the word budget in it because that's really not what it is, it's really just a cash management system. It's a way to be intentional about as money comes into the practice, where does it go?Jonathan VanHorn:Yeah, and that's one of the things that is really, even myself, someone who's a CPA and works with financials, and dollars, and cents every day, being a business owner the numbers we just explained to people, the 45 cents of every dollar that comes in, some months that's 30 cents out of every dollar, some months that's 60 cents out of every dollar, some months... It's very, very, very, very rarely that it's every month is exactly 45 cents gets put into your coffers and then you get to do with whatever it is, do whatever you want with it. Sometimes these one time expenses do come up. So of the 45 cents that you set aside to the profit, you might need to allocate five cents of that to go into these rainy day funds, or maybe you've got some big goals in the future and you know that you're going to have to staff up soon or hire an associate soon and you need to get more cash available.Jonathan VanHorn:So maybe we just set aside another five cents for an additional capacity expanding fund, or maybe it's, "Hey, I know I'm going to have a bunch of taxes at the end of the year because I remember Tooth & Coin and them telling me that I'm going to owe. It's August and I think I'm going to owe $50,000.00 come tax time, maybe I should be setting aside some of this money to be able to get $50,000.00 saved up." Intentionality and having a plan for cashflow is very different than budgeting to me, and that's pretty much every CPA firm, if you go to a CPA firm or to a CPA and say, "Hey, can you help me budget?" They're going to do what we talked about in the first part of this conversation. They're going to be like, "Yeah, okay, let's do a forecast. Let's talk about how much revenue you did last year. Let's talk about your expenses last year and we're going to add 5% to this, and 3% to that, and 2% to this, and what are your growths are going to be?" And all these other things.Jonathan VanHorn:They're going to come up with this math formula to be able to keep up with things, but it's very different than what we're talking about now and being intentional with your cashflow. So like you said, profit first system, the pay yourself first, the automatic millionaire idea, the richest man in Babylon, there's tons of different budgeting things that you can do, or not budgeting things, but cashflow optimization and intentional ideas that came about in the past, but to me, it all starts with you have to understand that there's variability in what your income is going to be as a business owner and you have to do your best to understand that variability in terms of the cash that's leftover, which is again, this is a unique problem for a lot of businesses in dentistry, there's typically a good amount of cashflow left over, in a lot of businesses, there's almost no cashflow.Jonathan VanHorn:And in the dental world, when that fluctuates, sometimes it can fluctuate to big numbers. Like last year, we had people that got hundreds of thousands of dollars in government funds.Joseph Rugger:Sitting in the checking account. [crosstalk 00:16:25].Jonathan VanHorn:Exactly, just coming in and they're like, "Well, hey, it's here. I don't really know what to do with it now. Do I take it out? Do I use it? Do I save it? Do I invest it? Do I pay it to my employees? What do I do with it?" It's being intentional with the money, having a plan for it, and just so everyone knows, Joseph is the person who does this in our firm. He helps our clients do this, and come up with plans for this, and find ways to save the money better. And what are some of the lessons that you've learned when it comes to the dental field specifically about coming up with a plan and then following through with it?Joseph Rugger:I think a couple of things kind of resonate with me. One of the things that, I don't know that we talked extensively about it in our personal budgeting, but is lifestyle creep where as more money comes in, magically it just all of a sudden disappears because all of a sudden we've bought new stuff at the office or we've hired new people. So where we may have had free cashflow that was at a certain level before, all of a sudden it's starting to dwindle as far as how much free cashflow it is. And it's not lifestyle creep, I guess you could call it practice scope creep as you have bought nicer stuff and all of those kinds of things, and you are used to taking out that $10,000.00 distribution, or $20,000.00, or $5,000.00, or whatever it is, so you just kind of automatically take that out.Joseph Rugger:All of a sudden the practice has a couple of bad months in a row, and all of a sudden you're looking and you don't have enough cash to pay the bills, and you've got to scramble a little bit. So if you're not taking those variables... As you mentioned, there's just so much variability in this business, as you were making those different decisions, what's it based on? Gut feeling? Like, "Oh, well, if I've got 75k in the practice checking account, that's enough. I'm going to take anything out on top of that." Well, what if your credit card bill with American Express this month is $30,000.00 because you had some big cases, added some new equipment? All that stuff like that $75,000.00, if you have a $30,000.00 outstanding credit card bill, that's not the same as if you don't have an outstanding credit card bill that's coming due in a couple of days and you've got $75,000.00.Joseph Rugger:That's one thing that I've noticed is that kind of we get into some habits and the habits are based on something other than the actual cashflow of the business, whether that's the lifestyle creep, or whether that's the practice scope creep, or if that's just getting used to, oh, I just take out the same amount of money, because that's what I need to pull out of the practice each month. What if you have a month where you totally blow it out of the water and your collections are typically 80k and all of a sudden it's 150k? Do you still take the same amount out? Well, I would say, no. We need to figure out what's going on and have a plan for that. And again, intentionality continues to be kind of a theme that we talk about on our podcast here. We want you to be intentional about pulling money out. "Where did you get that number?" "Oh, I just made it up. I just had a gut feeling." Well, that's not a plan. That's not going to get you from where you're at to where you want to be. We want you to be intentional.Jonathan VanHorn:Yeah, and the other thing that comes up with that variability and the intentionality is that if you figure out three months later that you didn't have enough cash at the time, it's already too late most of the time. I mean, you're in trouble at that point. And so if we're thinking about those percentages we talked about and if you're out there, feel free to use that as your own set up. I'm going to dedicate 15 cents of every dollar to occupancy and other stuff, 25 cents out of every dollar to staff, 15 cents out of every dollar to the supplies and labs, and the other 45 cents of every dollar I'm going to have, let's say, five cents. Again, this is completely dependent on your situation, your goals, and what it is you're trying to do in your business.Jonathan VanHorn:But let's just say for discussion purposes, I'm putting 10 cents of the 45 cents of profit into some type of an investment fund that I'm going to use for the business and investing in the business. And then the other 35 cents, I'm going to pull out whether it be through salaries, wages, payroll taxes, my retirement plan, or distributions, or discretionary expenses that I have inside of the business that is being paid for on my behalf, whether it be travel, or continuing ed, or renting our home, for other reasons like that, that's what that money will be used for. What happens or I've seen happen is that, well, this month we had a pipe bust and we've got a $10,000.00 expense now, all of a sudden, that's going to go into this 10 to 15 cent thing, but there's not 10 or... That one thing costs more than that 10 or 15 cents that's leftover.Jonathan VanHorn:Well, most the time with the variability inside dentistry, a lot of people don't really think about that $10,000.00. Say it's $10,000.00, they pay the expense begrudgingly, little things like that come up throughout the month, every month, but a big thing like that comes up every once in a while and it kind of throws everything out of whack because well, all of a sudden that's a big percentage of this, and a big percentage of that, and it just doesn't work. So what is a way, Joseph, you help people with keeping up with this in an automatic fashion or in a more standardized process to where this type of information can be relayed faster?Joseph Rugger:Well, I think that you can always set percentages. So you mentioned percentages and there's lots of people out there that... I've seen a number of our clients that have opened up multiple bank accounts and that kind of thing. We've done that for a bunch of clients and that's been really successful like, "Okay, so out of every dollar that comes in the practice, we're going to set 10% aside and that's going to be your profit, and we're going to pull that money out of the business. It's going to be a distribution and you're going to live on the remaining 90%. You're going to operate your practice in that way." It's one of those things, it's difficult to make something like that automatic because it's going to be based on a percentage. So up months, down months, we're still using that same, let's just say for example, 10%, or maybe it's 15%, or maybe it's 5%.Joseph Rugger:If we say, "Let's have supplies and labs be its own account." Okay. Well, 15 cents out of every dollar or 15% is going to go to that supplies and labs account. And what that does is that allows you to do bank balance accounting, as simple as that is. So oftentimes what we figured out over the years is that people have a hard time just looking at a profit and loss, or looking at a balance sheet, or looking at a cashflow statement and marrying all that together and understanding. They may say, "Well, I show a profit on my P&L, but I'm out of cash." "Well, that's because you made $30,000.00 principle payment on your loan." "Oh, I didn't think about that. Oh yeah, now I remember that."Joseph Rugger:Or, "Hey, I've got all this extra cash in my account." "Well, that's because you took out an EIDL loan from SBA, so you got $50,000.00." It's all of these different things that come through, so being intentional, and setting percentages, and going along those lines, we found that to be really, really successful. We have some clients that kind of do that themselves and make those kind of things. We've got some that we help out with that process, and see what it looks like, and kind of help them manage that, and make cashflow decisions. And basically, as money comes in... What money comes in is what we need to be spending money on, not just some arbitrary number, not something that's not intentional. So I think it's been successful for the ones that we've helped. Just kind of really just add transparency, I think that's a word that I've heard several clients, "This really helps me understand kind of in a transparent way how my business is doing."Jonathan VanHorn:Yeah, helps you understand where those dollars are going. I mean, what better incentive do you have to look at your spending habits than to realize, hey, there's not enough money in here to pay for this thing? And in dentistry, I find that usually it's pretty easy and... Well, it's not easy to pay for things. The money is technically there in the bank account, but you don't know if that money is available for specifically that thing, or if you're robbing Peter to pay Paul to pay for that thing. And if you're intentional about your dollars, that should come out as a big red flag. So you mentioned like the envelope system as a method, is a lot of what it is, so envelope system, profit first system, they're all kind of the same, but what about frequency? How often do you recommend people be looking at this type of a thing?Joseph Rugger:Yeah, so I think that you've got to be looking at your monthly financials for sure. The folks that we're helping out with kind of this cashflow system, we're looking at it twice a month typically. I've got a couple of clients that want to make sure that we're allocating money appropriately for payroll costs, so we may look at that if they pay every other Friday, we may look at that every two weeks versus just twice a month. So it's basically like it's twice a month, except for the two months in the year that have three payroll Fridays, so we're looking at that. And then I think it's important to on a quarterly basis sit back and say, "Okay, how much cash has the business generated?"Joseph Rugger:Okay, well, we've got an excess balance of X. Okay, well, what are we going to do with that? Are we going to do one of the four things that we can do with money? Are we going to spend it? Are we going to give it? Are we going to save it? Or are we going to pay down debt with it? And having those conversations, I think, quarterly make a whole lot of sense and then kind of reviewing this stuff on a quarterly basis, I think makes a whole lot of sense. And on an annual basis, obviously everybody's going to be concerned about the annual basis because they've got taxes to pay and you kind of get stuck in this catch 22, where you want your business to look really good, but you don't want to pay very much in taxes, so looking at stuff on an annual basis.Joseph Rugger:I had a client that we'd helped out with this cashflow system and he said, "How am I doing?" And I said, "Well, how do you think you're doing?" He said, "Well, I think I'm doing well. I've been pulling X amount of salary in, and we're doing this system where we're taking the profits out of the business, and I'm distributing X amount of dollars." He said, "But I got my tax return the other day and it showed that we had a net operating loss." And I'm like, "Well, how's your cash balance been?" He's like, "Really good." I'm like, "Okay, well, there's a whole lot of complexities that go along with your tax situation that may not necessarily reflect how the cash flows throughout the business." And it may be one of things where we took some accelerated depreciation or something along those lines for some stuff that he had borrowed the money on to do some equipment, that kind of thing, but definitely monthly.Joseph Rugger:And then I think looking at stuff twice a month makes the most sense as well, quarterly for sure, and then annually, just to see how you're doing, look at your goals. What are your goals? Was your goal to do $1.2 million in collections this year? Was your goal to make $400,000.00 take home this year? What was your goal? And then how do we look? If we're looking at it quarterly, and your goal is to make $400,000.00 and you've made $20,000.00 in Q1, maybe we should reevaluate the goal. Maybe we should see what kept us from getting there.Jonathan VanHorn:Yeah, that makes a lot of sense, and this is what I do personally in our business, in Tooth and Coin, is every... I do it every week just because for me it's simple to do. I go in and I know we don't have as many different expense categories as a dental practice does, we have what I call operating expenses, and then we have staff, and then we have profit basically after that. And our operating expenses, I don't go far down talk about the rent for the office space, or for our computers that we buy for people, or all the software that we use, and all the money that we use. It's all a part of the same thing, I just lump it into one big percentage.Jonathan VanHorn:And then I take the staff percentage, which is another percentage. And then I take a percentage for profit and take a percentage for taxes. And every week I just put those in those bank accounts and then I move it from our operating accounts into an interest bearing accounts for the ones that I'm not going to touch for a while. And then if I need those numbers back, I just pull them back. And the power in that is, is if you are facing a payroll run and you don't have enough payroll in there, well, something's happened in terms of your goals. Something's happened in terms of what happened with the cashflow and that means you're forced to physically move that money, which means you're forced at that point to look at it. Did something go wrong? Did we miscalculate something? Are my hours for my employees off? Is my revenue too low? Is the reason the revenue is too low because we're not doing a good job of... Why is that?Jonathan VanHorn:Oh, we have a revenue problem. Oh, we need to be doing a better job of scheduling. And all of a sudden, you're starting to work on these things in your business that are going to start optimizing themselves because you're forced to look at them. And so I love that process and I love the way that it works inside of every business, not just dental practices and things like that. So budgeting sucks, cashflow optimizing is awesome, having a plan for intentionality, for where things go. There's a lot more things we could talk about in terms of this, such as who are the best candidates for this? When should you be doing this in terms of your practice's age? How do you factor in growth? How do you do all these other things? And those things are going to start getting very, very personal in nature and I'm afraid that we're going to miss too many of those people and create generalities where it's actually very specific.Jonathan VanHorn:There's a lot of specifics on who should and shouldn't be doing these different times of their lives, and things like that, and nuances, and things like that. So for those things, I would say that you probably need to reach out to someone like ourselves or someone else who helps with these types of things in order to be able to have this type of help, because we're getting into really big specifics of being specific to your situation. So outside of that, Joseph, is there anything else that you wanted to talk about in terms of these things or anything that we didn't mention about the pitfalls of budgeting, diminishing returns, and then the benefits and boons of doing cashflow optimization, and being intentional with your money?Joseph Rugger:Yeah, no, I think we hit most of them. I think we want you to be intentional with your money. I think that one of the things that I'm always constantly looking at is, am I trying to get a mosquito with a sledgehammer? And if you're going to go out and spend 30 hours a year on budgeting and your top line's $300,000.00, that's hitting a mosquito with a sledgehammer. So keep the cost benefit ratio in mind and certainly it's good to be intentional. It's good to pay attention, but make sure that you're focusing your time on things that are going to give you the most return.Jonathan VanHorn:So yeah, so if you have any other questions or anything like that, feel free to look us up in the Facebook group or make a comment. Talk to us about it. We're happy to talk about this. I think this is the most fun thing about helping small businesses is this kind of stuff. I wish that there was more time in the day to be able to do these types of things. This is not what you're typically going to get in a relationship with a CPA firm. This is not technically in the standard terms of engagement with the CPA firm, which you're normally going to be getting. So these are things that you're going to have to ask additional help for from 99.9% of CPA firms or even just consultants when it comes to this kind of stuff. So just want to put that out there because sometimes we have clients come in, they have an expectation that this is just a part of accounting. This is not an accounting function. It's so far removed from accounting. This is definitely more consulting in nature and it's very specialized.Jonathan VanHorn:So anyway, so thanks again for listening guys and girls, we will see you next time on the Tooth and Coin Podcast. Thanks for joining in. Make sure to subscribe, iTunes, do all those things, like it whenever you see it, and we will see you guys next time. Thanks, Joseph.Joseph Rugger:Bye guys.Jonathan VanHorn:Bye.Jonathan VanHorn:That's it for today, guys. I hope you enjoyed this episode of the Tooth and Coin Podcast. If you are going to be a practice owner or a new practice owner, and you're interested in CPA services, head on over to toothandcoin.com where you can check out more about our CPA services. We help out around 250 offices around the country. I would love to be able to have the discussion about how we could help your new practice. We do specialize in new practice owners, so people that are about to be an owner of a practice they're acquiring, about to be an owner of a practice they are starting up, or has become an owner in the past five years. That is our specialty and we'd love to be able to talk to you about how we could help you in your services with your tax and accounting services.Jonathan VanHorn:And if you enjoyed today's episode again, go to the Facebook group. Talk to us about what we've talked about, join in on the discussion, and let's create an environment where we can talk about some of these things so that we can all help each other get through these things together so that this adventure of business ownership is more fun, more productive, and better in the longterm. Lastly, if you want access to those resources that we are currently building, just text the word toothandcoin to 33444, that's toothandcoin, no spaces, T-O-O-T-H-A-N-D-C-O-I-N to 33444, apply with your email address. We'll send you the instructions on the Facebook group. We'll send you the resources when they're available, and we will see you next week.

Dylan and Connor are joined by Devin Ibañez (First Openly Gay Major League Rugby Player Pro). Pride month celebrations come to a close with our first professional athlete on the pod! Listen in as the twins and Devin discuss coming out stories, living in the U.K., Death Drop on the West End, RuPaul's Drag Race queens, sexy voices, Devin's love story with his partner Fergus, fighting for trans rights, P-Town, Handmaid's Tale, and being the first openly gay Major League rugby player. It was fighting for gay rights!Follow Devin on Twitter and InstagramCelebrate the #SummerOfDRAMA with limited edition merchandise! Follow DRAMA. on Twitter & InstagramFollow Connor MacDowell on Twitter & InstagramFollow Dylan MacDowell on Twitter & InstagramEdited by Connor MacDowellHERE is where you find official DRAMA. merch!SUBSCRIBE TO OUR PATREON HERE! Be the first to get our new merch, hear bonus episodes, and more!Please subscribe on Apple Podcasts, rate us 5 stars, and leave a kind review!

A wolf with a crush and an overactive imagination searches for the perfect scenario to ask out his cheetah classmate.  Today's story is “Daydreaming” by https://twitter.com/DirtCoyote (Dirt Coyote), who, when he isn't causing all sorts of trouble on Twitter, works on various writing projects including a novel, a novella, and short erotic furry fiction. Follow him at DirtCoyote on Twitter for future updates.  Today's story will be read for you by B. P. Rugger, the ineffable Moo Moon.

As you will know, Naya and Lo are both on the USA Rugby Sevens team and they have just returned from Dubai where they were training and playing in an Invitational Tournament. So they sat down together to talk about what it's like being on tour and to answer some cub questions. We hear about team selection, what players do if they don't make the squad, what they wear, how long they travel for, what game week involves importantly they share their most private thoughts about roommates. And if you follow these two on social media you will already have the inside scoop on their personal choices. Hosts: Naya Tapper & Ilona MaherFor more information, links and resources plus conversations from the world of women's sport including articles, blogs, videos and podcasts visit wispsports.com. WiSP Sports is the World's First and Only Podcast Network for Women's Sport with more than 60 hosts, 1300+ episodes across 50 shows and over 7 million downloads. WiSP Sports is on all major podcast players. Follow WiSP Sports on social media @WiSPsports. Contact us at info@wispsports.com.

I'd like to take a moment to reflect on this last year we've shared. One year ago the first story aired on The Voice of Dog. The reality of the pandemic had arrived in my country, and all over the world people were feeling isolated and uncertain and powerless. I started this podcast because I wanted to do something about it —anything, just to make something, anything, better for someone. Anyone.  I decided I wanted to tell people stories. Stories that would give them courage, or hope, and if nothing else, something to look forward to. Even if they didn't listen to the stories, I still wanted people to know that someone cared enough about them to have a new story for them to enjoy, every time they came back. The first was, appropriately, “Bad Dog!” by my friend Rob Baird. A story of unfairness, and powerlessness in the face of power — but also a story of defiance and of hope. Many other writers have contributed stories since then. There's a name for writers who've had stories on this podcast, you know. They're “Friends of the Fireplace” — in early stories I sometimes mentioned that, though I realized I never explained why, and fell out of the habit. 163 stories have appeared on The Voice Of Dog in the last year. 163, by 82 writers — well, 83 now, including me. Today's story is “Where Stories Are Told”, a riff on the traditional Irish masterpiece “The Humours of Whiskey”, by Khaki, your faithful fireside companion, and friends — and I'd like to take a moment to thank them: Rob Baird, for Games at Götterdämmerung, Bad Dog! Televassi, for BlueBucks, Counter-Culture Huskyteer, for The Lion of the Low Countries, The Zeroth Protocol, Once We Were Meerkats NightEyes DaySpring, for Glory of the Gods, Foxing for Pizza, The Tomb Guardian, Loving You is Wrong Altivo Overo, for Rabbit Food, How Menander Got His Name, A Close Port of Call, Beyond Mundane Horizons, Catch Me If You Can, Coyote's Voice, The Blue Eye of the Desert God, Harvest Home, All That Glitters, Gibbous Moon Waning Toledo the Horse, for Fuzzy Memory, Returning, Secret Domus Vocis, for Edge of the Universe, Somewhere in the White Void, Hades & Philos: Prelude, Bounty Hunter Uncle Frances Pauli, for Rats, The Lion Sleeps, Always Tomorrow Ryan Campbell, for 6 Unbelievable Facts About Unicorns That Will Completely Blow Your Mind, Eagle's Splendour Mary E. Lowd, for Katelynn and the Hummingbird, Marge the Barge, Shreddy and the Dancing Dragon, Summer Strawberries, Rapscallions, Shreddy and the Carnivorous Plant, Ecto Cafe, The Canoe Race, A Real Stand-Up Guy Daniel Lowd, for The Canoe Race, A Real Stand-Up Guy Kandrel, for The Pack, The Adventurers, Adrenaline High, Salute the Flag, To Find You Carrizo Kitfox, for The Rat's Gift Faolan, for Earning his Stripes Dark End, for The Aviatrix Bill Ricardi, for Unseelie Pie, The Fastest Blade Kyell Gold, for Cleaning Up, To Catch a Thief, Agent Friendzone B. P. Rugger, for Colour Me Terrified, Of His Flesh the Mystery Sing Slip-Wolf, for The Charitable Pact of a Soft Hearted Fool, Kypris' Kiss Field T. Mouse, for A Little Distraction Pascal Farful, for The Hadfield Robbery, The Sacred Cross, Nobody's Home Madison Scott-Clary, for Gigs, Disappearance, Milkshakes and Foxes, The Fool Ocean Tigrox, for Food, Feuds and Fake Flora Renee Carter Hall, for The Wishing Tree C.F. Becker, for A Day With the Skaraks Nenekiri Bookwyrm, for A Gentle Rustling of Leaves, Unpredictability Metassus, for The Library, At The Inn, Whitewash, Salted Beef, Crystal, Dear Sara, Snowed In Ben Goodridge, for Hot Dog SignificantOtter, for Lone Kergiby, for Giving Thanks, Home Again, A Number's Game Dwale, for The River in the Mist, Behesht Spottystuff, for The Conqueror, Nonna, Let Them Have Cake Faora Meridian, for Empty, Not So Above It All Alison Cybe, for Don't Forget your Comic Books!, Space Warrior Hitachi, I Never Wear Underwear Skunkbomb, for A Rock Among Millions, Broadstripe, Virginia Smells Like...

Wow, wow, wow, what a show I have for you! I am honoured to be joined by the incredible and truly inspirational athlete that is Mr Devin Ibañez. His story is such a roller coaster of emotions as he battles through his amazing career as a professional US rugby player whilst having to hide his true identity and sexuality. Join Devin and I as we discuss what it was like for him growing up and having to choose between being open and being successful until a life threatening injury gave Devin the opportunity to come out publicly and become the America’s first Out-Gay Pro Rugby Player.

Week 6 recap

Two ladies from Colorado Talking Rugby Opportunities: Our very own Colorado staff member Maria talks with Karen Fong Donoghue , one of our valued partners from Rugger's Edge in the US. Listen as they discuss the state of the women's and men's game, opportunities for young Australians and why working with a reputable company is critical to finding the right fit college. 

Mike from Chicago "Hey this is Mike from Chicago, an old rugger. You probably heard that the rich rugby folks in the US are trying to put together an investment group in order to position the US to bid of either the 2027 or 2031 Rugby World Cup. I got two questions...Isn't USA Rugby broke and in bankruptcy? Where would the World Cup final be held? Rugger out. Old Mike From Chicago" The investment group is called Rugby Growth Investments (RGI). In the words of San Diego Legion (and Utah Warriors) co-owner Ryan Patterson it will function as a "strategic capital partner" for MLR, USA Rugby and World Rugby in order to "fast-track community, commercial & high-performance system preparation for a RWC in North America in 2027 or 2031. This sounds like something that has been needed for a long time. Mike is right when he brings up the point that USA Rugby has just come through bankruptcy proceedings. It's hard to think that an organization can go from bankruptcy to hosting the third largest sporting event in the world (FIFA World Cup & Summer Olympics are the only bigger events in terms of total ticket sales and TV ratings), but stranger things have happened. Finance is an art, not a science. Part of the reason USA Rugby ended up filing for bankruptcy in 2020 isn't because of the pandemic, it's from years (if not decades) of financial mismanagement. If they are able to right the ship and show financial stability and growth in the years to come (not to mention securing a bid similar to the 2026 FIFA World Cup), then we could potentially see ourselves as hosts one day (let's hope so). Here's where RGI comes in. Having a "strategic capital partner" (it's fun to put vague, corporate-sounding terms in quotations) whose role is to try to boost the commercial aspect of the sport here in the US will be massively beneficial on all levels. Will we actually get our shit together to the point where we can win a bid to host a Rugby World Cup? We have to see how effective groups like RGI are at driving corporate sponsors to open up their wallets and back the sport. As far as which year would be most optimal, my vote is for 2031. Here's the list of world cup hosts... Australia has already put forth a strong bid for 2027. They have not hosted the tournament since 2003. When France hosts in 2023, it will have been 3 straight northern hemisphere countries in a row. Japan was probably the riskiest host so credit to World Rugby. But ... France will be a second time host in 2023 and England has also hosted 2. Note to Bill "Boomer" Beaumont and his sidekick henchman Bernard Laporte: "Us non-Europeans would like some non-European RWCs". So, the southern hemisphere is due to host in 2027... NZ hosted in 2011. Argentina withdrew their 2027 bid to support their southern hemisphere partners Rugby Australia. South Africa can't seem to put a new bid together after throwing everything into hosting in 2023 (France was selected, but let's be honest ... they threw down some serious cash to make that happen). So that leaves USA Rugby with the choice of bidding against Australia for 2027, or to go against the field for 2031. England is expected to bid for 2031 (I'm not surprised considering how power/money hungry the RFU is), but for fuck sake it would be their 3rd time hosting and 2nd time within a 16 year cycle. Are the English blind to the fact that the sport would probably grown faster if they didn't continually award themselves World Cups? Let's hope that the extra 4 years (2031 instead of 2027) allows groups like RGI and whoever the hell is running USA Rugby these days (the board has flipped more times that one can follow over the past few years) can use strategically placed working capital to fuel growth over the next few years.

Rugger nos contó todo sobre "Bella" y además habló sobre su próximo álbum. ¡Escuchanos en www.FmLike.com.ar! Seguinos en: www.Instagram.com/FmLike www.Facebook.com/FmLike971 https://vm.tiktok.com/TXmKuL/ www.Youtube.com/fmlike

Rugby athlete Grace McKenzie beams up to share the story of how she organized a petition to stop a proposed ban on transgender athletes by World Rugby. She shares the story of transition, activism, and of course fandom. Plus as a biologist, she explains why the nonsense term "biological male" should be abandoned. Dawn and Karleigh's interview is part of Rugby Week at Outsports, focusing on the fight for inclusion. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Chase, intending to drown his sorrows in alcohol, finds the drink is more psychoactive than he expected.  And then the monster appears. Today's story is “Colour Me Terrified” by friend-of-the-fireplace http://twitter.com/DammitMooMoon (B. P. Rugger), who has previously submitted “Of His Flesh the Mystery Sing” to The Voice of Dog.  Rugger lives in Ottawa, Canada with his kitten, Stephane, and his pups, Dagda and Kale.  Though he writes muggle fiction under his legal name, D.I. Harris, he feels most comfortable in the furry community, which he has been part of since 1995,  He is hard at work on his first novel, The Quantity of Desire. Read for you by https://twitter.com/khakidoggy (Khaki), your faithful fireside companion.

An inquiry into manners, philosophy, & the meaning of life that somehow ended up rated 18+. Yes, the author is just as confused as you are. Today's story is “Of His Flesh the Mystery Sing” by http://twitter.com/DammitMooMoon (B. P. Rugger). Rugger lives in Ottawa, Canada with his kitten, Stephane, and his pups, Dagda and Kale.  Though he writes muggle fiction under his legal name, D.I. Harris, he feels most at home in the furry community, which he has been part of since 1996. Yes, he is that old. Rugger began writing at 7, and keeps coming back to fiction.  He is hard at work on his first novel, The Quantity of Desire. Read for you by https://twitter.com/khakidoggy (Khaki), your faithful fireside companion.

After suffering a spinal cord injury while playing for the national championship on May 6, 2017, Cal rugby player Robert Paylor was told by doctors that he would never walk or use his hands again. In the three years since, he's begun doing both, is set to graduate from the Haas School of Business this semester, and has started to dabble in motivational speaking as well. To fill in the details on the remarkable progress he's made and the incredible perspective he's gained from the horrific setback he now calls “a gift” it's our honor to be joined today by Robert Paylor. For more on Robert's incredible journey, visit: https://www.robertpaylor.com/ For a free 90 day subscription visit: http://theathletic.com/free90days Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Joseph is back on the podcast from episode 44 to talk about his return to full-time public accounting, his latest trips around the globe, and how the culture and philosophy of his new job compliments his lifestyle!

This week 3AM talks about something they're passionate about. SPORTS! They may not look like it, but they were, are and will continue to be passionate athletes. Faruq shares his experiences as a Rugby Player. Head down to the comment section of the Instagram post for this episode to share your thoughts, comments and stories. https://www.instagram.com/p/B9IFtXWh6kd/ This episode is proudly sponsored by DrinkOut.Sg. You can follow them at https://www.instagram.com/drinkout.sg/ Follow and DM them or WhatsApp to 90661291 if you're looking for a pop-up drink stand to serve refreshing mocktails and beverages at your parties, social gatherings and even wedding functions!

Alex, James and Mike head to Flat Iron Square in South East London for another live version of the show in front of an audience of 500. They're joined by European Player of the Year for 2019, Saracens fullback Alex Goode, to talk missing out on England, mean tweets and Robbie Williams.Join the House of Rugby Facebook GroupWant to hear more great podcasts from JOE?Liquid Football with Kelly Cates, where real players share the best unheard stories from life in football TKO with Carl Frampton, bringing you unprecedented access and brutal honesty from inside the world of boxingSportspages - Dig into the stories behind some of the greatest sports books ever writtenBoys Don't Cry with Russell Kane, the show that gets men talking about the things men never talk aboutUnfiltered with James O'Brien, our critically-acclaimed and award-nominated interview seriesPioneers with John Amaechi - Meet the trailblazers behind Britain’s most exciting businesses

Joseph Rugger, a CPA that has been able to structure his work life to be 100% remote, joined us for this episode of Life In Accounting, a podcast production of Where Accountants Go. Getting Started We start this interview in the same manner as most, with the story of Joseph's early career.  Joseph started in public accounting, but only stayed for a few years.  As he states, the issue was “99% me, 1% public accounting.”  It just wasn't the right fit for him.  He was fortunate though in that a friend's family business needed an accountant, and through that connection he was able to make the move into industry. Predictable, Baby Steps After a few years with the prosthetics business, he decided to approach them about venturing into other interests while still ensuring his job got done.  It started with teaching a couple days at the local university, but then later moved into working remotely a couple days a week.  One of the keys to making the situation work for Joseph was that he outlined how he envisioned getting the job done with this employer, and did so in baby steps.  He did not attempt to go 100% remote all in one move.  It was a long and careful transition to get where he is today. Doing Payroll From The Grand Canyon As you'll hear in the story, Joseph basically does the same typical accounting tasks that we all would normally do from the office, but he does them from his laptop in remote parts of the world.  This may mean while on a mission trip, or from the bottom floor of the Grand Canyon.  Sometimes (usually) it takes some flexibility and advanced planning to get the internet connection he needs, but that is just part of the advanced preparation.  Other than that, the work is pretty similar to any other accounting role.  One interesting fact that Joseph points out though is that it's not 100% vacation like many people think it is.  When you are remote, you basically have to be plugged in all the time, so while you have location freedom, it's that much more important for you to be accessible.  It's something to think about if you decide to travel the world – that vital conference call could literally be in the middle of the night depending on your time zone.  Even such freedom has a few small trade-offs. This was a wonderful interview with Joseph, and I appreciate that he made the time for it.  When you are 100% remote, practically everything is done through advanced scheduling, so for him to make the time for this interview truly was a gift to our listeners. Other episodes you may enjoy:  Matt Malcolm, and John Garrett. To listen in on this interview, please click the player below:

Gay rugby, a missed flight and finding new confidence in performance. Simon Copland is a PhD candidate in Sociology at the Australian National University. He is a freelance writer who has been published in the Guardian, SBS Online Australia, BBC Online, and co-produces and presents the podcast Queers, not to be confused with the podcast you’re currently on, which you should all subscribe to. Simon is the co-editor of the online publishing site Green Agenda. Queerstories is an LGBTQI+ storytelling night programmed by Maeve Marsden, with regular events around Australia. For Queerstories event dates, visit www.maevemarsden.com, and follow Queerstories on Facebook. The Queerstories book is published by Hachette Australia, and can be purchased from your favourite independent bookseller or on Booktopia. To support Queerstories, become a patron at www.patreon.com/ladysingsitbetter And for gay stuff and insomnia rants follow me - Maeve Marsden - on Twitter and Instagram.  

Sports chat from weekend and previewing the upcoming weekend

Two Leinster fans invade the Bunnies' gym!

Ep. 19 On this episode of the POG-Cast, Soy is joined by Rugger for a lively conversation about Rocks & Ropes, fear, and the value of wearing a watch. There’s also a special guest for the joke of the ‘cast! The post Rugger appeared first on Gold Arrow Camp - California Summer Camp and Traditional Sleepaway Camps for Children.

This week we talk about how Flats helped AJ win, and a little bit about Rugger. See acast.com/privacy for privacy and opt-out information.

If someone were to ask where Joseph Rugger was right now, you’re best guess would be one of our glorious National Parks. He’s been to almost all of them, from Acadia in Maine to the White Sands in New Mexico –driving his Prius all over the country. He created a bucket list of places he’d like to visit all over the world and is quickly checking them off as he does his CFO work virtually. In this episode, we talked about how we get most of our enjoyment from non-work time, so talking about those things in the office only enhances our jobs. We also talked about how leaders should take the time to genuinely get to know their staff. Using forced programs as the only time to do so is not authentic and doesn’t develop any connections. A good rule Joseph uses is to double the question to statement ratio to open a dialogue and build those relationships. Joseph Rugger is the CFO of Jonesboro Prosthetic and Orthotic Laboratory and a Continuing Education Instructor with the AICPA. He was the 2011 Arkansas Outstanding Emerging CPA Award Winner and a member of the 2013 AICPA Leadership Academy. He graduated from Lyon College with a BS Accounting, BS Finance, and BA Economics while being an active member of the baseball team. He later received his Master’s of Professional Accounting from IUPUI.

Rugger Burke is a member of the Investment Committee and General Counsel at Satori Capital who pays close attention to not only his own purpose, but that of the companies he considers. In his Paper Napkin Wisdom, Rugger presents us … Continue reading → The post Pull the Future In – Rugger Burke (Principal and General Counsel at Satori Capital) appeared first on Paper Napkin Wisdom - Blog and Podcast For Entrepreneurs, Leaders, and Difference-Makers.

http://media.blubrry.com/that_gay/s3.amazonaws.com/thatgaypodcast/tgp-052016.mp3 OMG!  It’s the finale of RPDR!  In an especially star-studded episode, the boys are joined by social media maven Thomas Pardee, and screenwriter Michael Varrati (plus an assist from Kevin the Rugger as well!) to talk about the show and the impact of the show on gay culture.

When Busted wrote the song, That's What I Go To School For, we don't think they had the lady featured in today's show in mind. Joining our naughty teacher are an Aussie rugger boy, a dolphin, some twins, a mixed up son and... some pearls. Please continue to review us on iTunes by searching for IRL UK Podcast in your podcasting app, clicking 'Reviews' and choosing 'Write a Review'. It really helps spread the word and support our 'special' little podcast. Follow us on social networks to see all the nutso stuff we talk about on the show. Search for us on Facebook and find us @IRL_UK_Podcast Twitter and Instagram. LOVE YOU (in a creepy way) See acast.com/privacy for privacy and opt-out information.

GANT Rugger Fall/Winter 2016

This episode is brought to you by Destihl Brewery. The Voice and Beermansky are joined by Drunkle Andy and Aaron the Rugger for some beers from Toppling Goliath Brewing Co. Our Band of the Week is hip-hop collaboration Golden Rules. Highlights include IPA (Indigenous People of Africa), Dino Talk, Blake like-a da hip-hop, Sir Smokes-a-lot, Pompeii Nights, F You Blake, Reading Rainbow, When Doves Die, Dad jokes with Drunkle Andy, Rugby Talk, Sponsor Spotlight, Dustin meets Lou Ferrigno, Drinking Game fatalities, Goin to Beavertown, Holy Macaroni, Pamcakes, Questions with Aaron & Dustin, and Balls deep into craft beer. Beers enjoyed this week: Toppling Goliath's King Sue, Light Speed, Pompeii, Sosus, & X-Hops Gold, Destihl's Weissenheimer Hefeweizen, and Founder's Project PAM.

Leenie Quinn was born with a congenital amputation of her right hand. This forced her to learn how to adapt to all of life's daily activities, but it certainly hasn't held her back from accomplishing any of her goals.  She has been told countless times that she couldn't do something, but she uses this negativity as fuel to prove these people wrong.  Specifically, she talks about her experience in trying to become a nurse and running a marathon in the interview.   Below are some questions I ask Leenie in the interview: Do you remember the moment that you realized that you didn't have two hands? What sports did you play growing up? What were the the biggest obstacles growing up with one hand? School Sports Socially Emotionally How did you work around these obstacles? How do you feel having one hand has limited you?  How has having one hand helped you and given you an advantage? What questions do people ask about your hand that annoy you the most?  What sports did you play in high school? Sports Position Injuries that you sustained Share any memorable stories What sports did you play in college? Why did you decide to go into nursing? How did you get into CrossFit? What tips do you have for adapting to new activities or the same activities after an injury? What have been some of your lowest points? What have been some of your highest points? What are you most proud of? If you could go back and tell your Elementary School, High School and College self anything, what would you say for each? What what comes to mind when you hear the word: Disability? Handicap? Inspiration? Adaptive? When you are long gone 200 years from now, if you could write a letter to a kid who was born with one hand or had a different disability, what would you say? I am in the Washington, DC area this weekend volunteering as a Judge for the Working Wounded Games at CrossFit Lorton.   This is a CrossFit style competition that levels the playing field for severely wounded veterans and permanently injured civilians.  Leenie was set to compete in this competition, but her Rugby team made the playoffs and wouldn't have enough players if she didn't play.  There's always next year! To learn more about adaptive athletics check out Crossroads Adaptive Athletic Alliance. Download Episode 10 : iTunes | Stitcher

Leenie Quinn was born with a congenital amputation of her right hand. This forced her to learn how to adapt to all of life's daily activities, but it certainly hasn't held her back from accomplishing any of her goals.  She has been told countless times that she couldn't do something, but she uses this negativity as fuel to prove these people wrong.  Specifically, she talks about her experience in trying to become a nurse and running a marathon in the interview.   Below are some questions I ask Leenie in the interview: Do you remember the moment that you realized that you didn't have two hands? What sports did you play growing up? What were the the biggest obstacles growing up with one hand? School Sports Socially Emotionally How did you work around these obstacles? How do you feel having one hand has limited you?  How has having one hand helped you and given you an advantage? What questions do people ask about your hand that annoy you the most?  What sports did you play in high school? Sports Position Injuries that you sustained Share any memorable stories What sports did you play in college? Why did you decide to go into nursing? How did you get into CrossFit? What tips do you have for adapting to new activities or the same activities after an injury? What have been some of your lowest points? What have been some of your highest points? What are you most proud of? If you could go back and tell your Elementary School, High School and College self anything, what would you say for each? What what comes to mind when you hear the word: Disability? Handicap? Inspiration? Adaptive? When you are long gone 200 years from now, if you could write a letter to a kid who was born with one hand or had a different disability, what would you say? I am in the Washington, DC area this weekend volunteering as a Judge for the Working Wounded Games at CrossFit Lorton.   This is a CrossFit style competition that levels the playing field for severely wounded veterans and permanently injured civilians.  Leenie was set to compete in this competition, but her Rugby team made the playoffs and wouldn't have enough players if she didn't play.  There's always next year! To learn more about adaptive athletics check out Crossroads Adaptive Athletic Alliance. Download Episode 10 : iTunes | Stitcher

Rugger Burke The Power of 10, Rugger Burke (wisdom, inspirational, nonfiction, adult) The Power of 10 is a practice for engaging the voice of wisdom through inquiry and advocacy. Inquiry raises our awareness of what is through inviting us to examine our current state of being; advocacy prompts us to live into what is possible. Together, inquiry and advocacy evoke the voice of wisdom–the quiet, still voice inside us, the confluence of knowledge, experience, and insight flowing through all living beings that speaks through our bodies, hearts, and minds. As we learn to listen to it closely, the voice of wisdom reveals our true nature and purpose, calls on us to commit to something greater, and guides us toward being our best selves in every thought, word, and action. At its heart, The Power of 10 sensitizes us to our own, unique purpose, and helps us discover that spark of the divine at the core of our being. Put simply, it is a practice for engaging your voice of wisdom to become the greatest you–the you who is meant to be. We chatted with Rugger about how the book is structured to enable you to make progress each day, so that you are not overwhelmed, but that you see gradual progress, all the time! We also chatted about being deliberate vs. cautious, and how Rugger himself did not start down this path of intentional living until some life crises caused him to reevaluate where he was headed. To find out more about Rugger, please visit: The Power of 10 on Amazon We also have our weekly chat with Ellen Campbell from the Canadian Centre for Abuse Awareness, this week talking about their upcoming workshop men that wish to move past being physically and sexually abused, and Ellen shares a bit more about her story. https://soundcloud.com/rtds/sets/matters-of-the-mind Hear Rugger Burke and Ellen Campbell on “Matters Of The Mind” with Dr. Peter Sacco at 8p EST on Wednesday by clicking the Listen Live button at the top right of the page, but if you miss it, it will be on demand Thursday, right here, or find us on iTunes podcast at https://itunes.apple.com/ca/podcast/rtds-listen-up-talk/id910538503?mt=2 Rugger Burke at Tedx: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E6zqyV1wX0s #mentalhealth, #depression, #endstigma, #BellLetsTalk, #mentalillness, #mhcanada, #nokiddingmetoo, #nkm2, #addiction, #recovery, #ADD, #autism, #ASD, #kidsmentalhealth, #CCAA, #CMHO, #HubertCrouch, #EllenCampbell, #sexualabuse, #suicide, #bipolar, #schizophrenia, #ADHD, #MattersOfTheMind, #MentalHealthMatters, #author, #books, #religious, #fanaticism, #sharia, #law, #immigration, #libertyslostyear, #JeffLiberty, #RuggerBurke, #ThePowerOf10, #Amazon

Welcome to the first edition of Pink Rugby TV.  In this episode, we discuss Ewen McKenzie’s resignation from the Wallabies

Round 11 of the Shute Shute concludes on Saturday with the Norths v Easts clash at Woollahra. The Rugby community has reacted with great compassion since Norths player Seti Tafua suffered a serious injury. We cover the latest on fundraising efforts for Seti and the road ahead for his recovery. We also wrap up the other round 11 games and look forward to the competition split next week.

We're getting close to the split in the Shute Shield draw and Paul Cook tells us how it works. Clubrugby.com.au is also deeply saddened to hear the news of a serious injury sustained by Northern Suburbs’ player Seti Tafua on the weekend. Our best wishes are with him, his family and club. Match highlights courtesy www.clubrugbytv.com.au. Episode 069 is brought to you by Strike. Australia’s largest supplier of hands free Bluetooth car kits, mobile phone car cradles and reversing cameras. Check them out at www.strike.com.au.

Eastwood have flexed their muscles and the misery continues for Randwick. Join Djuro Sen and Paul Cook as we check out the progress of the competition after eight rounds. We also touch on the Sydney v Country match this weekend. Match highlights courtesy www.clubrugbytv.com.au.

Another brilliant round of Shute Shield action with Manly scraping home against Warringah to remain undefeated. Parramatta almost upset the premiers while Penrith continue woes.

Manly is the only unbeaten team after five rounds of the Shute Shield so the ladder is tight. What does this mean for Club Rugby? The panel discusses in detail. Mark Cashman finally pays his debt to Sean Maloney. We take a look at all the results and look at some match highlights courtesy of clubrugbytv.com.au. Episode 066 is brought to you by Strike. Australia’s largest supplier of hands free Bluetooth car kits, mobile phone car cradles and reversing cameras. Check them out at www.strike.com.au.

The competition is wide open after Easts pounded the premiers in round 4 - hear what the panel thinks and where is Mark Cashman???? We take a look at all the results and look at some match highlights courtesy of clubrugbytv.com.au. Episode 065 is brought to you by Strike. Australia's largest supplier of hands free Bluetooth car kits, mobile phone car cradles and reversing cameras. Check them out at www.strike.com.au.

Three rounds in and the might of Eastwood and Sydney University was on show. We take a look at all the results and look at some match highlights courtesy of clubrugbytv.com.au. We also find Sean Maloney albeit briefly. Episode 064 is brought to you by Strike. Australia's largest supplier of hands free Bluetooth car kits, mobile phone car cradles and reversing cameras.

We're two rounds in and the Shute Shield is looking good. Some upsets and tight results. Join the panel for a thorough review of Australia's premier club rugby competition. Episode 063 is brought to you by Strike. Australia’s largest supplier of hands free Bluetooth car kits, mobile phone car cradles and reversing cameras. Check them out at www.strike.com.au.

The human tank, Nemani Nadolo, is our special guest this week to talk about the on fire Marlins. He's been electric for Manly as the join front runners Southern Districts at the top of the table. So why is the big man unsigned for next season?