Podcast appearances and mentions of sarah cottrell

If you feel like all you do is complain about your job, you're not alone. Many lawyers reach a point where they're exhausted, not just by their work, but by how much they talk about how miserable it makes them.In this episode of The Former Lawyer Podcast, Sarah Cottrell addresses what happens when you reach that breaking point. She explains why you don't have to wait until you can leave your job to start making a change, and how taking small steps now can set you up for the future, whether you're leaving in a few months or a few years.See show notes at formerlawyer.com/262

Many lawyers contemplating leaving the profession assume the process is complicated. The reality? It's actually very simple. But that doesn't mean it's easy. In this episode of The Former Lawyer Podcast, Sarah Cottrell breaks down the difference between something being simple but difficult versus complicated but easy, and how this applies to leaving the law. The truth is, figuring out what's next isn't complex, but doing the work to make a change is hard. That's why she created The Former Lawyer Collab because even though the steps are clear, having support and guidance can make all the difference. See show notes at formerlawyer.com/260

Sarah Cottrell talks with Amisha DeYoung-Dominguez, a former lawyer who transitioned into public service, on this episode of The Former Lawyer Podcast.Amisha, now a congressional staffer, shares her winding journey through law school, legal aid, and government work—ultimately realizing that practicing law wasn't the right fit. Her story highlights the struggle many lawyers face, the pressure to stay in the profession despite clear signs it isn't working. Through The Former Lawyer Collab, Amisha found the clarity and support she needed to make the leap into a fulfilling new career.See show notes at formerlawyer.com/258

Many former lawyers who stepped away from their careers to be stay-at-home parents eventually find themselves wondering how to re-enter the workforce—without going back to practicing law. On this episode of The Former Lawyer Podcast, host Sarah Cottrell addresses this exact challenge, breaking down the key steps for making the transition while avoiding the pressure to return to legal practice.See show notes at formerlawyer.com/257

In this episode of The Former Lawyer Podcast, Sarah Cottrell gets real about why so many Millennials feel stuck in the pursuit of success. As an elder Millennial herself, she unpacks the pressures lawyers face to maintain a certain lifestyle or salary—pressures that often come from family expectations, societal norms, and internalized beliefs about what success “should” look like.Sarah shares personal insights, client stories, and some hard questions to help you rethink whether the life you're chasing actually aligns with your values. She also dives into how therapy can play a game-changing role in breaking free from the “success trap” and building a life that works for you.If you've ever found yourself feeling trapped by career expectations or the idea that you're supposed to suffer to succeed, this episode is for you. You don't have to settle for burnout—there's a way forward.See show notes at formerlawyer.com/256

This episode includes an important content warning for discussions of narcissism, narcissistic abuse, self-harm, and suicidality. This week on The Former Lawyer Podcast, Sarah Cottrell welcomes back her client Kelcey Baker for a powerful conversation about the distressingly common experience among lawyers of wishing for a minor injury—like being hit by a bus—just to get a break from work. Kelcey and Sarah dive deep into the toxic environments in the legal profession that normalize extreme stress and emotional distress while discouraging vulnerability and self-care. They explore the systemic issues in law firms that create these harmful dynamics and why addressing the environment, not the individual, is critical.If you've ever felt trapped in an environment where taking a real break feels impossible, this conversation will resonate deeply and offer hope. Tune in to hear more about why these feelings arise, how they can be addressed, and the importance of prioritizing your well-being.See show notes at formerlawyer.com/236

In this episode of The Former Lawyer Podcast, host Sarah Cottrell talks with David Sazant, a former litigator who transitioned from practicing law to becoming a therapist. David shares how he recognized that his legal career was not in line with his personal values and explains the process he went through to make the leap into mental health. For those considering a career outside of the legal profession, especially in therapy, David's story offers valuable insights and inspiration.Throughout their conversation, David discusses the challenges he faced as a lawyer, the sense of unfulfillment that led him to leave litigation, and the importance of living in alignment with one's values. This episode provides an honest look at what it takes to make a significant career shift, making it a must-listen for any lawyer feeling stuck and seeking a new path.See show notes at formerlawyer.com/246

In this episode of The Former Lawyer Podcast, host Sarah Cottrell shares a conversation with Annie Little about disclosing ADHD and other neurodivergent or mental health conditions in the workplace, specifically within Biglaw. As October is ADHD Awareness Month, Sarah highlights the challenges lawyers face when considering disclosure and the systemic issues in law firms that often fail to provide adequate support. Tune in for an insightful discussion about the complexities of navigating legal careers with ADHD and the importance of creating supportive work environments.See show notes at formerlawyer.com/207

In this episode of The Former Lawyer Podcast, Sarah Cottrell tackles a topic that has been coming up in many of her conversations with clients: the overwhelming feeling that you just don't want to work anymore. If you've ever felt like you hate working and can't imagine enjoying any job, especially after working in a toxic legal environment, this episode is for you. Sarah discusses how burnout, particularly in lawyers, can make you feel like you're broken, but she's here to tell you—you're not. She explains why these feelings are common and how recovery is possible.Drawing on her experiences working with lawyers in her Collab program, Sarah highlights the importance of giving yourself time and space to recover from burnout.See show notes at formerlawyer.com/243If you are looking for support between the self-paced nature of the Collab and working with Sara one-on-one, then what you are looking for is the guided track.The Guided Track is a live eight weeks small group intensive for lawyers who want to jumpstart their search for an alternative career, starting on October 4th, and running through November 22nd.Enroll at formerlawyer.com/guidedtrack

  Are you working at a toxic job?  But you're afraid to leave?  In this episode with Sarah Cottrell, founder of Former Lawyer, we do a deep dive into: - How to pay off your student loans after leaving your job. - How you can work on building your dream career while working your full time job. - How narcissism is built into workplaces. - The strategies you can use to leave a toxic work environment. Connect with Sarah at www.formerlawyer.com. Connect with Samorn at www.linkedin.com/in/samornselim. Get a copy of Samorn's book, “Belonging: Self Love Lessons From A Workaholic Depressed Insomniac Lawyer” at https://tinyurl.com/swpc578c. Get weekly career tips by signing up for our newsletter at www.careerunicorns.com.

In this episode of The Former Lawyer Podcast, Sarah Cottrell talks with Victoria Collier, founder of Quid Pro Quo Law, about the process of preparing a law firm for sale. Victoria shares her own journey, from building her practice to successfully selling it, and offers critical insights into the steps lawyers can take to make their firms scalable and attractive to buyers. From establishing processes and delegating tasks to cleaning up financials, Victoria breaks down the key factors that make a law firm a valuable asset.Whether you're a law firm owner thinking about your long-term exit strategy or simply curious about what goes into selling a legal practice, this episode is packed with actionable advice. Learn how to position your firm for sale, maximize its value, and set yourself up for a successful transition beyond the law.See show notes at formerlawyer.com/242If you are looking for support between the self-paced nature of the Collab and working with Sara one-on-one, then what you are looking for is the guided track.The Guided Track is a live eight weeks small group intensive for lawyers who want to jumpstart their search for an alternative career, starting on October 4th, and running through November 22nd.Enroll at formerlawyer.com/guidedtrack

In this episode of our series "Life After Law", from the Smart Lawyers Position to Transition podcast, host Victoria Collier sits down with Sarah Cottrell, founder of Former Lawyer LLC and host of the Former Lawyer podcast. Sarah shares her journey from practicing law to helping other lawyers transition out of the legal profession. They discuss the common struggles lawyers face, the importance of aligning career choices with personal values, and practical steps for those considering a career change. This insightful conversation provides valuable perspectives for any lawyer feeling unfulfilled in their current role. Key Takeaways:1.⁠ ⁠Discover the common reasons why many lawyers feel unfulfilled and consider leaving the legal profession. 2.⁠ ⁠Learn about the importance of aligning your career with your personal values and strengths. 3.⁠ ⁠Gain insights into practical steps for exploring alternative career paths and finding a better fit.   Learn More About Our Guest Sarah Cottrell is the founder of Former Lawyer LLC and the host of The Former Lawyer Podcast. She practiced law for 10 years, and now she helps unhappy lawyers ditch their soul-sucking jobs. Sarah specializes in helping lawyers identify alternative careers so that they can leave the law. She is a Certified Career Management Coach and a member of the International Coaching Federation. Connect With Sarah  https://instagram.com/formerlawyer https://www.linkedin.com/in/sarahjcottrell/ https://www.linkedin.com/company/former-lawyer/   We want to hear from you! You can leave us a rating and review in Apple Podcasts. Click here and then scroll down the page to the rating and review section. You can also leave us a rating in Spotify by clicking here. Connect with Victoria Collier https://quidproquolaw.com/ Private Facebook Group https://www.facebook.com/groups/1284225722042602 LinkedIn https://www.linkedin.com/company/victoria-collier-coaching/        

Sarah Cottrell, founder of the Former Lawyer Podcast, discusses the challenges and identity struggles that lawyers often face, the misconceptions surrounding the legal profession, and the importance of exploring alternative career paths. Sarah shares her journey from practicing law to becoming an entrepreneur and offers valuable insights for lawyers seeking fulfillment outside traditional legal practice. Tune in to gain insights into the nuances of being a lawyer and the importance of setting boundaries.What You Can Do With a Law DegreeAccording to Sarah, there are various options for individuals with a law degree beyond practicing law. She emphasizes different ways to help and advocate for people, and being a lawyer is just one avenue. Sarah encourages individuals to explore their motivations and values when assisting others, as numerous career paths can align with those goals. She also highlights the importance of understanding that being a lawyer is not the only way to make a meaningful impact and that there are many fulfilling options outside the legal profession."There are all different sorts of options and practicing law is one of them. But there are lots of other things you can do as a law student, or as a young lawyer. It might be the exact opposite," emphasizes Sarah Cottrell, on this episode of You Are a Lawyer.Sarah shares that a law degree opens up many possibilities and that individuals should not limit themselves to traditional legal roles. It encourages law students and lawyers to think outside the box and consider alternative career paths that align with their interests, values, and strengths.LISTEN TO LEARN Some of the myths of big law Why therapy is essential for self-discovery How to transition from lawyer to entrepreneur WE ALSO DISCUSS The narrow ideas of achievement and career paths Alternative career choices for lawyers How law school can sometimes limit self-expression Join the FREE mailing list!Get behind-the-scenes content from You Are A Lawyer. 1) Visit www.youarealawyer.com2) Add your email address to the Subscribe pop-up box OR3) Enter your email address on the right side of the screen4) Get emails from me (I won't fill your inbox with junk)!Interact with You Are A LawyerKyla Denanyoh hosts the You Are A Lawyer podcast. Follow the podcast:YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@youarealawyerWebsite: https://www.youarealawyer.com

In this episode of The Former Lawyer Podcast, Sarah Cottrell and Annie Little engaged in a candid conversation about ADHD and its prevalence among lawyers. They dive into an intriguing question that came in on social media after a previous ADHD conversation: Does being a lawyer give you ADHD?   The podcast revealed some compelling insights about ADHD in the legal profession and debunked misconceptions. If you're a lawyer contemplating a career change, this blog post is for you. We'll break down the essential points from the podcast and explore the real challenges lawyers with ADHD face, shedding light on why they may be considering leaving the law. See show notes at formerlawyer.com/206    

Livia Sara is an eating disorder survivor, mental health coach, autism advocate and author from the Netherlands. Diagnosed autistic at 20, she now helps other neurodivergent people recover from disordered eating through learning to embrace their unique traits.  She takes a holistic approach to health and healing, supporting each individual on their own journey to recovery and living life to their fullest potential.  She shares autism and eating disorder related content on her popular YouTube and Instagram accounts, hosts her own podcast, the Liv Label Free podcast, and is publishing three books in 2023 - one of which is coming out next month. I was lucky enough to get a sneak preview before we recorded this episode. In our conversation we talk about: ➡ Her experiences of developing an eating disorder as a preteen ➡ How autistic traits can be mistaken for eating disorder ‘behaviours', and how this can make treatment and recovery harder ➡ Labels, stigma and diet culture, and why discovering she was autistic has helped her in her recovery ➡ The work she does now, her book, and  how she has been able to use her experiences to help others    CONTENT WARNING This episode contains discussion of disordered eating and eating disorders from the start.  Squarepeg is a podcast in which neurodivergent women, and trans and nonbinary people, explore navigating a neurotypical world and share their insights, challenges and successes. I hope that these conversations will be inspiring and thought provoking, open you up to new ways of thinking about being neurodivergent, and help you feel more connected to a worldwide community of people with similar experiences. I'm Amy Richards, and after being diagnosed autistic at the age of 37 I'm now on a mission to learn more about different perspectives and issues around being a neurodivergent adult in a world that feels like it doesn't quite fit.   EPISODE LINKS: Website: https://www.livlabelfree.com  Podcast: Liv Label Free https://www.livlabelfree.com/podcasts/liv-label-free  YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/c/livlabelfree  Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/livlabelfree/  Information on eating disorders and autism from the National Autistic Society: https://www.autism.org.uk/advice-and-guidance/topics/mental-health/eating-disorders    If you'd like to connect or get in touch with Squarepeg, you can find me on: Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/squarepeg.community/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/squarepegautism  Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/squarepegautism/  Or on my website: https://squarepeg.community/    THANK YOU TO MY PATRONS! A HUGE thank you to my amazing patrons, who support my work on the podcast: Abi Hunter, Adam Klager, Amy Adler, Amy-Beth Mellor, Amy Sullivan, Anika Lacerte, Annette, Becky Beasley, Ben Davies, Carly Melling, Caroline, Cat Preston, Catrin Green, Cindy Bailey, Clare Forrest, Clare Holmes, Corinne Cariad, Dana Bradley, Danielle Warby, Dennis McNulty, Elizabeth Williams, Erica Kenworthy, Erin Pineapple, Ewan McNeill, Felicia Libo, Fiona Connor, Galina, Gwyneth, Hannah Breslin, Heather Peake, Hegatronix, Jackie Allen, JF, Jayne Hutchinson, Jeff Goldman, Jen Bartlett, Jo, Julie, Katarzyna Tomaszewska, Kate and Kathryn, Kate Faust, Katharine Richards, Katherine Lynch, Kenneth Knowles, Laura, Laurencia Saenz Benavides, Lea Li, Leo Ricketts, Lilli Simmons, Linda Brown, Liz, LQ, Lyb, Mandy Allen, Marjory Webber, Martine, Melissa Shaw, Meredith L. Freyre, MN, Paul Harris, Pete Burke, Rebecca, Rebecca Biegel, Rebecca Kemp, Sadie Slater, Sarah Cottrell, Sarah Jeffery, Sarah Ivinson, Sarah Swanton, Shauna Schramke, Suzanna Chen, Suzanne, Talia's Nature, Tammie Fabien, Tamsen Staniford, Tegan Bailey, Tessa Valyou, Tree Hall, Vic Wiener, Vicki Temple, Victoria Chang, Victoria Routledge, Wendy Walker, Zephyrine Craster and Zoe Lee. If you're enjoying the Squarepeg podcast and would like to help me carry on making new episodes, you can become a member of the Squarepeg community on Patreon from £3 per month: https://www.patreon.com/squarepegpodcast 

Gem Kennedy is a Coach and podcaster from Essex in the UK. They are non-binary and queer, and self identified as autistic and ADHD last year, at 35.  They are a Transformational Coach, facilitator and advocate, supporting neurodivergent and queer folk, present a podcast called Queers & Co., and are also co-parent to two home educated autistic children.  They are passionate about body liberation, queering things, spirituality, children's rights and playing the ukulele! We covered a lot in this conversation! But a few of the things we talk about are: ➡ Gem's early experiences of anxiety and school refusal  ➡ Gender expectations and connecting with gender ➡ Masking and unmasking – when and where to unmask, situations they avoid and thinking about where to spend our energy, and how to be social and actually enjoy it! ➡ Balancing life, work and homeschooling, and meeting needs in a neurodivergent household ➡ Queering things and seeking out counter-cultural wisdom   CONTENT WARNING Before we begin, I need to let you know that there a couple of brief mentions of disordered eating in this conversation, but the topic isn't explored in any detail.   Squarepeg is a podcast in which neurodivergent women, and trans and nonbinary people, explore navigating a neurotypical world and share their insights, challenges and successes. I hope that these conversations will be inspiring and thought provoking, open you up to new ways of thinking about being neurodivergent, and help you feel more connected to a worldwide community of people with similar experiences. I'm Amy Richards, and after being diagnosed autistic at the age of 37 I'm now on a mission to learn more about different perspectives and issues around being a neurodivergent adult in a world that feels like it doesn't quite fit.   EPISODE LINKS: Gem's website: www.gemkennedy.com  Their Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/thegemkennedy/  Queers & Co podcast: https://www.gemkennedy.com/podcast   If you'd like to connect or get in touch with Squarepeg, you can find me on: Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/squarepeg.community/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/squarepegautism  Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/squarepegautism/  Or on my website: https://squarepeg.community/    THANK YOU TO MY PATRONS! A HUGE thank you to my amazing patrons, who support my work on the podcast: Abi Hunter, Adam Klager, Amy Adler, Amy-Beth Mellor, Amy Sullivan, Anika Lacerte, Annette, Becky Beasley, Ben Davies, Caroline, Cat Preston, Catrin Green, Cindy Bailey, Clare Forrest, Clare Holmes, Corinne Cariad, Dana Bradley, Danielle Warby, Dennis McNulty, Elizabeth Williams, Erica Kenworthy, Erin Pineapple, Ewan McNeill, Felicia Libo, Fiona Connor, Galina, Gwyneth, Hannah Breslin, Heather Peake, Hegatronix, Jackie Allen, JF, Jayne Hutchinson, Jeff Goldman, Jen Bartlett, Julie, Katarzyna Tomaszewska, Kate and Kathryn, Kate Faust, Katharine Richards, Katherine Lynch, Kenneth Knowles, Laura, Laurencia Saenz Benavides, Lea Li, Leo Ricketts, Lilli Simmons, Linda Brown, Liz, LQ, Lyb, Mandy Allen, Marjory Webber, Martine, Melissa Shaw, Meredith L. Freyre, MN, Paul Harris, Pete Burke, Rebecca, Rebecca Biegel, Rebecca Kemp, Sadie Slater, Sarah Cottrell, Sarah Jeffery, Sarah Ivinson, Sarah Swanton, Shauna Schramke, Suzanna Chen, Suzanne, Talia's Nature, Tammie Fabien, Tamsen Staniford, Tegan Bailey, Tessa Valyou, Tree Hall, Vic Wiener, Vicki Temple, Victoria Chang, Victoria Routledge, Wendy Walker, Zephyrine Craster and Zoe Lee. If you're enjoying the Squarepeg podcast and would like to help me carry on making new episodes, you can become a member of the Squarepeg community on Patreon from £3 per month: https://www.patreon.com/squarepegpodcast

Kirstie Pickles is an equine vet, academic, mum and mental health advocate from Derbyshire in the UK. Now 49, she was diagnosed autistic at 47, following her daughter's diagnosis. She is passionate about sharing her story and raising the awareness of neurodiversity to allow for better self-advocacy and reduce the stigma associated with autism, and is currently researching autism within her profession, and is involved in an autism awareness training programme for medical professionals as an expert by experience.  In our conversation we talk about: ➡ Her lifelong special interest and determination to become a vet, and her experience of thriving at school and university – but finding the transition from academia to the workplace difficult, and struggling to cope as a newly qualified vet ➡ How her diagnosis has helped her get accommodations at work ➡ The findings of her research into autistic vets, including ‘shocking' statistics around their mental health and wellbeing ➡ How the research – that has relevance to all autistics who work or want to work – can be applied to better support autistic professionals and employees ➡ How she's now advocating for herself and other autistic adults   CONTENT WARNING During this conversation there's a very brief mention of statistics around suicide.   Squarepeg is a podcast in which neurodivergent women, and trans and nonbinary people, explore navigating a neurotypical world and share their insights, challenges and successes. I hope that these conversations will be inspiring and thought provoking, open you up to new ways of thinking about being neurodivergent, and help you feel more connected to a worldwide community of people with similar experiences. I'm Amy Richards, and after being diagnosed autistic at the age of 37 I'm now on a mission to learn more about different perspectives and issues around being a neurodivergent adult in a world that feels like it doesn't quite fit.   EPISODE LINKS: Kirstie's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/kirstie-pickles-01ab6b150   If you'd like to connect or get in touch with Squarepeg, you can find me on: Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/squarepeg.community/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/squarepegautism  Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/squarepegautism/  Or on my website: https://squarepeg.community/    THANK YOU TO MY PATRONS! A HUGE thank you to my amazing patrons, who support my work on the podcast: Abi Hunter, Adam Klager, Amy Adler, Amy-Beth Mellor, Anika Lacerte, Annette, Becky Beasley, Ben Davies, Caroline, Cat Preston, Catrin Green, Cindy Bailey, Clare Forrest, Clare Holmes, Corinne Cariad, Dana Bradley, Danielle Warby, Dennis McNulty, Elizabeth Williams, Erica Kenworthy, Erin Pineapple, Ewan McNeill, Felicia Libo, Fiona Connor, Galina, Gwyneth, Hannah Breslin, Heather Peake, Hegatronix, Jackie Allen, JF, Jayne Hutchinson, Jeff Goldman, Jen Bartlett, Julie, Katarzyna Tomaszewska, Kate and Kathryn, Kate Faust, Katharine Richards, Katherine Lynch, Kenneth Knowles, Laura, Laurencia Saenz Benavides, Lea Li, Leo Ricketts, Lilli Simmons, Linda Brown, Liz, LQ, Lyb, Mandy Allen, Marjory Webber, Martine, Melissa Shaw, Meredith L. Freyre, MN, Paul Harris, Pete Burke, Rebecca, Rebecca Biegel, Rebecca Kemp, Sadie Slater, Sarah Cottrell, Sarah Jeffery, Sarah Ivinson, Sarah Swanton, Shauna Schramke, Suzanna Chen, Suzanne, Talia's Nature, Tammie Fabien, Tamsen Staniford, Tegan Bailey, Tessa Valyou, Tree Hall, Vic Wiener, Vicki Temple, Victoria Chang, Victoria Routledge, Wendy Walker, Zephyrine Craster and Zoe Lee. If you're enjoying the Squarepeg podcast and would like to help me carry on making new episodes, you can become a member of the Squarepeg community on Patreon from £3 per month: https://www.patreon.com/squarepegpodcast 

Maisie Soetantyo is the founder of a nonprofit with a mission to improve employment prospects for autistic jobseekers and aspiring business owners. Now an openly autistic advocate and inclusivity trainer, she has been working with neurodivergent people since her undergraduate studies in 1991, but it would be many years before some of her clients started suggesting that she might be autistic, too. A former Applied Behavioural Analysis (ABA) practitioner, she moved away from ABA after realising that supporting her client's authenticity as autistic individuals should be the goal. She set up Autism Career Pathways in San Francisco, USA in 2019, and now works to foster a meaningful understanding and acceptance of an autism diagnosis as a unique pathway to self advocacy and a fulfilling life.  In our conversation we talk about: ➡ Her experiences growing up with learning difficulties and processing disorders in a neurodivergent family ➡ Her thoughts on autism and employment, and how our special interests and even our stims can hold the key to what we should be doing with our lives. ➡ Her experiences as an ABA practitioner, how her thinking has evolved, and the work she now does to support autistic people. Squarepeg is a podcast in which neurodivergent women, and trans and nonbinary people, explore navigating a neurotypical world and share their insights, challenges and successes. I hope that these conversations will be inspiring and thought provoking, open you up to new ways of thinking about being neurodivergent, and help you feel more connected to a worldwide community of people with similar experiences. I'm Amy Richards, and after being diagnosed autistic at the age of 37 I'm now on a mission to learn more about different perspectives and issues around being a neurodivergent adult in a world that feels like it doesn't quite fit.   EPISODE LINKS: Maisie's Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/maisiesoetantyo/  Autism Career Pathways website: https://autismcareerpathways.org/  Her LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/maisie-soetantyo/   If you'd like to connect or get in touch with Squarepeg, you can find me on: Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/squarepeg.community/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/squarepegautism  Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/squarepegautism/  Or on my website: https://squarepeg.community/    THANK YOU TO MY PATRONS! A HUGE thank you to my amazing patrons, who support my work on the podcast: Abi Hunter, Adam Klager, Amy Adler, Amy-Beth Mellor, Anika Lacerte, Annette, Becky Beasley, Ben Davies, Caroline, Cat Preston, Catrin Green, Cindy Bailey, Clare Forrest, Clare Holmes, Corinne Cariad, Dana Bradley, Danielle Warby, Dennis McNulty, Elizabeth Williams, Erica Kenworthy, Erin Pineapple, Ewan McNeill, Fiona Connor, Galina, Gwyneth, Hannah Breslin, Heather Peake, Hegatronix, Jackie Allen, JF, Jayne Hutchinson, Jeff Goldman, Jen Bartlett, Julie, Katarzyna Tomaszewska, Kate and Kathryn, Kate Faust, Katharine Richards, Katherine Lynch, Kenneth Knowles, Laura, Laurencia Saenz Benavides, Lea Li, Leo Ricketts, Lilli Simmons, Linda Brown, Liz, LQ, Lyb, Mandy Allen, Marjory Webber, Martine, Melissa Shaw, Meredith L. Freyre, MN, Paul Harris, Pete Burke, Rebecca, Rebecca Biegel, Rebecca Kemp, Sadie Slater, Sarah Cottrell, Sarah Jeffery, Sarah Ivinson, Sarah Swanton, Shauna Schramke, Suzanna Chen, Suzanne, Talia's Nature, Tammie Fabien, Tamsen Staniford, Tegan Bailey, Tessa Valyou, Tree Hall, Vic Wiener, Vicki Temple, Victoria Chang, Victoria Routledge, Zephyrine Craster and Zoe Lee. If you're enjoying the Squarepeg podcast and would like to help me carry on making new episodes, you can become a member of the Squarepeg community on Patreon from £3 per month: https://www.patreon.com/squarepegpodcast 

Laura Richmond is a writer and researcher from Southampton in the UK. Now 35, she was diagnosed autistic last year. She had an extremely difficult road to diagnosis. Social and emotional struggles in childhood led to her being in and out of the psychiatric system for 15 years, misdiagnosed and spending time in various psychiatric hospitals.  The turning point came when her son was born: after a traumatic birth she developed PTSD and spent time in a psychiatric mother and baby unit. Her positive experience there, so unlike her previous time in hospital, led her to begin writing about her experiences and unravelling her own history, eventually leading to her autism diagnosis and a book about her experiences that will be published very soon. Laura and I covered so many different things in this conversation! Although some of the topics we discuss are not easy, I believe it's so important that these stories are told.  Some of the things we talk about are: ➡ Why she was initially cautious about getting an autism diagnosis ➡ Her mental health challenges, self harm, and her time in psychiatric services ➡ Hyperlexia, sensory issues and the double empathy problem ➡ Her journey of self discovery through writing her memoir and tapping into autistic joy   CONTENT WARNING: Please be aware that there is discussion of self harm, mental health difficulties, the psychiatric system and birth trauma from the start and at various points throughout this episode, so if you don't wish to hear about these topics, you may want to skip this one.   Squarepeg is a podcast in which neurodivergent women, and trans and nonbinary people, explore navigating a neurotypical world and share their insights, challenges and successes. I hope that these conversations will be inspiring and thought provoking, open you up to new ways of thinking about being neurodivergent, and help you feel more connected to a worldwide community of people with similar experiences. I'm Amy Richards, and after being diagnosed autistic at the age of 37 I'm now on a mission to learn more about different perspectives and issues around being a neurodivergent adult in a world that feels like it doesn't quite fit.   EPISODE LINKS: Laura's Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/cooksferryqueen/  Her Twitter - https://twitter.com/cooksferryqueen  Her Linktree - https://linktr.ee/cooksferryqueen  Pre-order/buy her book - https://unbound.com/books/all-my-worldly-joy/ Information on autism and self harm from the National Autistic Society: https://www.autism.org.uk/advice-and-guidance/topics/mental-health/self-harm    If you'd like to connect or get in touch with Squarepeg, you can find me on: Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/squarepeg.community/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/squarepegautism  Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/squarepegautism/  Or on my website: https://squarepeg.community/    THANK YOU TO MY PATRONS! A HUGE thank you to my amazing patrons, who support my work on the podcast: Abi Hunter, Adam Klager, Amy Adler, Amy-Beth Mellor, Anika Lacerte, Annette, Becky Beasley, Ben Davies, Caroline, Cat Preston, Catrin Green, Cindy Bailey, Clare Forrest, Clare Holmes, Corinne Cariad, Dana Bradley, Danielle Warby, Dennis McNulty, Elizabeth Williams, Erica Kenworthy, Erin Pineapple, Ewan McNeill, Fiona Connor, Galina, Gwyneth, Hannah Breslin, Heather Peake, Hegatronix, Jackie Allen, JF, Jayne Hutchinson, Jeff Goldman, Jen Bartlett, Julie, Katarzyna Tomaszewska, Kate and Kathryn, Kate Faust, Katharine Richards, Katherine Lynch, Kenneth Knowles, Laura, Laurencia Saenz Benavides, Lea Li, Leo Ricketts, Lilli Simmons, Linda Brown, Liz, LQ, Lyb, Mandy Allen, Marjory Webber, Martine, Melissa Shaw, Meredith L. Freyre, MN, Paul Harris, Pete Burke, Rebecca, Rebecca Biegel, Rebecca Kemp, Sadie Slater, Sarah Cottrell, Sarah Jeffery, Sarah Ivinson, Sarah Swanton, Shauna Schramke, Suzanna Chen, Suzanne, Talia's Nature, Tammie Fabien, Tamsen Staniford, Tegan Bailey, Tessa Valyou, Tree Hall, Vic Wiener, Vicki Temple, Victoria Chang, Victoria Routledge, Zephyrine Craster and Zoe Lee. If you're enjoying the Squarepeg podcast and would like to help me carry on making new episodes, you can become a member of the Squarepeg community on Patreon from £3 per month: https://www.patreon.com/squarepegpodcast

Rosie Smith is the owner of a non-profit radical bookshop in Canton in Cardiff, just a couple of miles from where I live.  Now 32, she grew up just outside Cardiff with her mum and sister. Leaving school at 16 due to anxiety, eating disorders and mental health issues, she found her people in music, joining bands and doing various different jobs until she decided to open the bookshop in 2019, after quitting her 27th job. Rosie's wonderful shop, Shelf Life, works with independent publishers to stock a range of fiction and nonfiction books centering neurodiversity, disability and mental health, anti-racism, anti-capitalism, LGBT+, feminism and gender. It's a little beacon of hope and diversity on the corner of Cowbridge Road East. Rosie was diagnosed autistic in March last year, and says that diagnosis has helped put her lifelong anxiety, panic attacks and depression into a new perspective, and and building relationships with autistic people has been life-affirming. We talk about: ➡ Some of the challenges Rosie experienced growing up and trying to find her place in the world. ➡ Navigating the challenges of employment as an undiagnosed autistic employee ➡ Her wonderfully serendipitous path to owning her own bookshop - and the pros and cons of being an autistic business owner ➡ The joys of finding community, knowing herself better, and finding a sense of purpose Squarepeg is a podcast in which neurodivergent women, and trans and nonbinary people, explore navigating a neurotypical world and share their insights, challenges and successes. I hope that these conversations will be inspiring and thought provoking, open you up to new ways of thinking about being neurodivergent, and help you feel more connected to a worldwide community of people with similar experiences. I'm Amy Richards, and after being diagnosed autistic at the age of 37 I'm now on a mission to learn more about different perspectives and issues around being a neurodivergent adult in a world that feels like it doesn't quite fit.   EPISODE LINKS: https://twitter.com/shelflifecdf  https://www.instagram.com/shelflifecdf/   If you'd like to connect or get in touch with Squarepeg, you can find me on: Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/squarepeg.community/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/squarepegautism  Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/squarepegautism/  Or on my website: https://squarepeg.community/    THANK YOU TO MY PATRONS! A HUGE thank you to my amazing patrons, who support my work on the podcast: Abi Hunter, Adam Klager, Amy Adler, Amy-Beth Mellor, Anika Lacerte, Annette, Becky Beasley, Ben Davies, Caroline, Cat Preston, Catrin Green, Cindy Bailey, Clare Forrest, Clare Holmes, Corinne Cariad, Dana Bradley, Danielle Warby, Dennis McNulty, Elizabeth Williams, Erica Kenworthy, Erin Pineapple, Ewan McNeill, Fiona Connor, Galina, Gwyneth, Hannah Breslin, Jackie Allen, JF, Jayne Hutchinson, Jeff Goldman, Jen Bartlett, Julie, Katarzyna Tomaszewska, Kate and Kathryn, Kate Faust, Katharine Richards, Katherine Lynch, Kenneth Knowles, Laura, Laurencia Saenz Benavides, Lea Li, Leo Ricketts, Lilli Simmons, Linda Brown, Liz, LQ, Lyb, Mandy Allen, Marjory Webber, Martine, Melissa Shaw, Meredith L. Freyre, MN, Paul Harris, Pete Burke, Rebecca Biegel, Rebecca Kemp, Sadie Slater, Sarah Cottrell, Sarah Jeffery, Sarah Ivinson, Sarah Swanton, Shauna Schramke, Suzanna Chen, Suzanne, Talia's Nature, Tammie Fabien, Tamsen Staniford, Tegan Bailey, Tessa Valyou, Tree Hall, Vic Wiener, Vicki Temple, Victoria Chang, Victoria Routledge, Zephyrine Craster and Zoe Lee. If you're enjoying the Squarepeg podcast and would like to help me carry on making new episodes, you can become a member of the Squarepeg community on Patreon from £3 per month: https://www.patreon.com/squarepegpodcast   

Kay Louise Aldred is a writer, facilitator, teacher, mentor, and resource creator from North Yorkshire in the UK. Now 49, she was diagnosed autistic quite recently, last November. A former teacher, just like me she suffered burnout, left her career and became self employed before discovering her autism. Now she and her husband are co-authoring a book, Embodied Education: Creating Safe Space for Learning, Facilitating and Sharing, which will be available late autumn 2023. She has worked with children and adults in educational, retreat and wellness settings throughout her career, has taught 11-18 year old neurodiverse students and has parented neurodivergent children of her own. She is an advocate for safe, nervous-system-friendly structures in education, learning and sharing spaces and is passionate about increasing awareness of the gifts of neurodivergence. In our conversation we talk about: ➡ Being undiagnosed autistic teachers ➡ Learning to advocate for herself with her family ➡ Her experience of burnout and recovery, and tools for self-regulation  ➡ What autism-informed education looks like ➡ Her thoughts and ideas about autism and trauma, religion and spirituality and masking CONTENT WARNING: towards the end of our conversation Kay talks briefly about a sexual assault. She doesn't go into detail, but if this is something you'd rather not hear about, you should skip from 50:39 to 52:53. Squarepeg is a podcast in which neurodivergent women, and trans and nonbinary people, explore navigating a neurotypical world and share their insights, challenges and successes. I hope that these conversations will be inspiring and thought provoking, open you up to new ways of thinking about being neurodivergent, and help you feel more connected to a worldwide community of people with similar experiences. I'm Amy Richards, and after being diagnosed autistic at the age of 37 I'm now on a mission to learn more about different perspectives and issues around being a neurodivergent adult in a world that feels like it doesn't quite fit.   EPISODE LINKS: Kay's website: https://kaylouisealdred.com  Her book: https://www.thegirlgod.com/embodied_education.php Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/kaylouisealdred/  Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/kaylouisealdred  Twitter: https://twitter.com/kaylouisealdred  LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/kay-louise-aldred-ma-pgce-87542716b/   If you'd like to connect or get in touch with Squarepeg, you can find me on: Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/squarepeg.community/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/squarepegautism  Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/squarepegautism/  Or on my website: https://squarepeg.community/    THANK YOU TO MY PATRONS! A HUGE thank you to my amazing patrons, who support my work on the podcast: Abi Hunter, Adam Klager, Amy Adler, Amy-Beth Mellor, Anika Lacerte, Annette, Becky Beasley, Ben Davies, Caroline, Cat Preston, Catrin Green, Cindy Bailey, Clare Forrest, Clare Holmes, Corinne Cariad, Dana Bradley, Danielle Warby, Dennis McNulty, Elizabeth Williams, Erica Kenworthy, Erin Pineapple, Ewan McNeill, Fiona Connor, Galina, Gwyneth, Hannah Breslin, Jackie Allen, JF, Jayne Hutchinson, Jeff Goldman, Jen Bartlett, Julie, Katarzyna Tomaszewska, Kate and Kathryn, Kate Faust, Katharine Richards, Katherine Lynch, Kenneth Knowles, Laura, Laurencia Saenz Benavides, Lea Li, Leo Ricketts, Lilli Simmons, Linda Brown, Liz, LQ, Lyb, Mandy Allen, Marjory Webber, Martine, Melissa Shaw, Meredith L. Freyre, MN, Paul Harris, Pete Burke, Rebecca Biegel, Rebecca Kemp, Sadie Slater, Sarah Cottrell, Sarah Jeffery, Sarah Ivinson, Sarah Swanton, Shauna Schramke, Suzanna Chen, Suzanne, Talia's Nature, Tammie Fabien, Tamsen Staniford, Tegan Bailey, Tessa Valyou, Tree Hall, Vic Wiener, Vicki Temple, Victoria Chang, Victoria Routledge, Zephyrine Craster and Zoe Lee. If you're enjoying the Squarepeg podcast and would like to help me carry on making new episodes, you can become a member of the Squarepeg community on Patreon from £3 per month: https://www.patreon.com/squarepegpodcast 

Rosie Weldon is a Senior Financial Analyst and author whose memoir, ‘My Autistic Fight Song', tells the story of how she fought to get her accountancy degree and find her place in the world of work, despite her struggles with mental and physical health and the challenges that come with being autistic. Now 31, she was diagnosed aged 25. Since graduating from Chester University - where she received some incredibly supportive accommodations - she became an account, finding her first job with Bank of America. But she found herself having to make the decision to leave after developing a neurological disorder due to the demands of a role that wasn't able to meet her autistic needs.  Rosie now lives in Dorset, where she works full time from home as a Senior Financial Analyst, and shares her life online to help raise awareness of daily autistic life.  She says that she “wants to raise awareness of the daily struggles we face as autistic people, but also our ability to thrive in an environment that is suited to us, when support is in place, because a lot of young autistic people think life's doors are closed to them, and they aren't.” In our conversation we talk about: ➡ Her difficulties at school and university ➡ The accommodations that helped her achieve her degree and find work she loves ➡ Her challenges being out and about in the world and dealing with change ➡ Why working from home has been a game-changer for her ➡ How employers can best support autistic employees Squarepeg is a podcast in which neurodivergent women, and trans and nonbinary people, explore navigating a neurotypical world and share their insights, challenges and successes. I hope that these conversations will be inspiring and thought provoking, open you up to new ways of thinking about being neurodivergent, and help you feel more connected to a worldwide community of people with similar experiences. I'm Amy Richards, and after being diagnosed autistic at the age of 37 I'm now on a mission to learn more about different perspectives and issues around being a neurodivergent adult in a world that feels like it doesn't quite fit.   EPISODE LINKS: Rosie's website: www.rosieweldon.com  Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/rosieweldonsautisticlife/ Facebook: www.facebook.com/rosieweldon118   Twitter: www.twitter.com/rosieweldon118   LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/rosie-weldon-5b728ab5/   If you'd like to connect or get in touch with Squarepeg, you can find me on: Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/squarepeg.community/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/squarepegautism  Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/squarepegautism/  Or on my website: https://squarepeg.community/    THANK YOU TO MY PATRONS! A HUGE thank you to my amazing patrons, who support my work on the podcast: Abi Hunter, Adam Klager, Amy Adler, Amy-Beth Mellor, Anika Lacerte, Annette, Becky Beasley, Ben Davies, Caroline, Cat Preston, Catrin Green, Cindy Bailey, Clare Forrest, Clare Holmes, Corinne Cariad, Dana Bradley, Danielle Warby, Dawn Trevellion, Dennis McNulty, Elizabeth Williams, Erica Kenworthy, Erin Pineapple, Fiona Connor, Galina, Gwyneth, Hannah Breslin, Jackie Allen, JF, Jayne Hutchinson, Jeff Goldman, Jen Bartlett, Julie, Katarzyna Tomaszewska, Kate and Kathryn, Kate Faust, Katharine Richards, Katherine Lynch, Kenneth Knowles, Laura, Laurencia Saenz Benavides, Lea Li, Leo Ricketts, Lilli Simmons, Linda Brown, Liz, LQ, Lyb, Mandy Allen, Marjory Webber, Martine, Melissa Shaw, Meredith L. Freyre, MN, Paul Harris, Pete Burke, Rebecca Biegel, Rebecca Kemp, Sarah Cottrell, Sarah Jeffery, Sarah Ivinson, Sarah Swanton, Suzanna Chen, Suzanne, Talia's Nature, Tammie Fabien, Tamsen Staniford, Tegan Bailey, Tessa Valyou, Tree Hall, Vic Wiener, Vicki Temple, Victoria Chang, Victoria Routledge, Zephyrine Craster and Zoe Lee. If you're enjoying the Squarepeg podcast and would like to help me carry on making new episodes, you can become a member of the Squarepeg community on Patreon from £3 per month: https://www.patreon.com/squarepegpodcast 

Martine van Bijlert is a writer and researcher from the Netherlands. Now 52, she grew up in Iran and worked in places like Kabul, Grozny and Tehran as an aid worker, diplomat and researcher. She now divides her time between her own creative projects and her work for the Afghanistan Analysts Network, a Kabul-based think tank she founded with friends.  She is self-identified autistic and ADHD, and says she feels like she has always been surrounded by neurodivergent people, as a child, during her studies and in her work abroad, and perhaps because of that she thought things were easier for her than for other people, not harder - which is probably one of the reasons it took her a while to unearth her own neurodivergence. We talk about: ➡ Finding life more difficult as she's got older ➡ Realising that most of her family were probably neurodivergent, including her Bible-smuggling grandfather ➡ Being drawn to foreign countries after spending her early childhood in Iran ➡ How her neurodivergent objectivity, pragmatism and cool-headed logic helped her in dangerous situations ➡ Her experience of burnout after setting up and running an organisation in Kabul - and its links to neurodivergent idealism and how we can lose our internal compass as a result Squarepeg is a podcast in which neurodivergent women, and trans and nonbinary people, explore navigating a neurotypical world and share their insights, challenges and successes. I hope that these conversations will be inspiring and thought provoking, open you up to new ways of thinking about being neurodivergent, and help you feel more connected to a worldwide community of people with similar experiences. I'm Amy Richards, and after being diagnosed autistic at the age of 37 I'm now on a mission to learn more about different perspectives and issues around being a neurodivergent adult in a world that feels like it doesn't quite fit.   EPISODE LINKS: Martine's website: www.martinevanbijlert.com  Her (beautiful!) Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/mvbijlert/  AAN website: www.afghanistan-analysts.org   If you'd like to connect or get in touch with Squarepeg, you can find me on: Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/squarepeg.community/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/squarepegautism  Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/squarepegautism/  Or on my website: https://squarepeg.community/    THANK YOU TO MY PATRONS! A HUGE thank you to my amazing patrons, who support my work on the podcast: Abi Hunter, Adam Klager, Amy Adler, Amy-Beth Mellor, Anika Lacerte, Annette, Becky Beasley, Ben Davies, Caroline, Cat Preston, Catrin Green, Cindy Bailey, Clare Forrest, Clare Holmes, Corinne Cariad, Dana Bradley, Danielle Warby, Dawn Trevellion, Dennis McNulty, Elizabeth Williams, Erica Kenworthy, Erin Pineapple, Fiona Connor, Galina, Gwyneth, Hannah Breslin, Jackie Allen, JF, Jayne Hutchinson, Jeff Goldman, Jen Bartlett, Julie, Katarzyna Tomaszewska, Kate and Kathryn, Kate Faust, Katharine Richards, Katherine Lynch, Kenneth Knowles, Laura, Laurencia Saenz Benavides, Lea Li, Leo Ricketts, Lilli Simmons, Linda Brown, Liz, LQ, Lyb, Mandy Allen, Marjory Webber, Martine, Melissa Shaw, Meredith L. Freyre, MN, Paul Harris, Pete Burke, Rebecca Biegel, Rebecca Kemp, Sarah Cottrell, Sarah Jeffery, Sarah Ivinson, Sarah Swanton, Suzanna Chen, Suzanne, Talia's Nature, Tammie Fabien, Tamsen Staniford, Tegan Bailey, Tessa Valyou, Tree Hall, Vic Wiener, Vicki Temple, Victoria Chang, Victoria Routledge, Zephyrine Craster and Zoe Lee. If you're enjoying the Squarepeg podcast and would like to help me carry on making new episodes, you can become a member of the Squarepeg community on Patreon from £3 per month: https://www.patreon.com/squarepegpodcast

Naomi Clarke is a freelance writer, community mentor, fundraiser and Human Design reader.  She self diagnosed as autistic around two years ago, but due to inequality in the medical system has so far not been able to get a formal diagnosis.  She describes herself as an autistic, queer, mixed race person with two children (one of her sons was diagnosed autistic 5 years ago). She wears a lot of hats in her life; she writes for work and for personal interest, and is passionate about building lives outside of the system of mainstream schooling. Until very recently she was running a self directed learning community for home educated young people in London. She loves crafts like sewing, crochet, and knitting, and her current main special interests are Human Design and kink and BDSM.  She says that she is still finding her autistic identity and overcoming some internalised ableism, which is often made much worse by struggling to see Black and POC autistic people in spaces of influence.  In our conversation we talk about: ➡ Finding community as an intersectional autistic person ➡ The issue of safety for unmasked autistic Black and people of colour ➡ The challenges of making self-directed learning communities accessible for neurodivergent children and facilitators ➡ How Human Design has helped her understand herself and other people better ➡ Why the kink and BDSM community can be a safe space for autistic people to explore their sexuality Squarepeg is a podcast in which neurodivergent women, and trans and nonbinary people, explore navigating a neurotypical world and share their insights, challenges and successes. I hope that these conversations will be inspiring and thought provoking, open you up to new ways of thinking about being neurodivergent, and help you feel more connected to a worldwide community of people with similar experiences. I'm Amy Richards, and after being diagnosed autistic at the age of 37 I'm now on a mission to learn more about different perspectives and issues around being a neurodivergent adult in a world that feels like it doesn't quite fit.   EPISODE LINKS: Naomi's Instagram: www.instagram.com/_naomi.clarke_   If you'd like to connect or get in touch with Squarepeg, you can find me on: Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/squarepeg.community/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/squarepegautism  Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/squarepegautism/  Or on my website: https://squarepeg.community/    THANK YOU TO MY PATRONS! A HUGE thank you to my amazing patrons, who support my work on the podcast: Abi Hunter, Adam Klager, Amy Adler, Amy-Beth Mellor, Anika Lacerte, Annette, Becky Beasley, Ben Davies, Caroline, Cat Preston, Catrin Green, Cindy Bailey, Clare Forrest, Clare Holmes, Corinne Cariad, Dana Bradley, Danielle Warby, Dawn Trevellion, Dennis McNulty, Elizabeth Williams, Erica Kenworthy, Erin Pineapple, Fiona Connor, Galina, Gwyneth, Hannah Breslin, Jackie Allen, JF, Jayne Hutchinson, Jeff Goldman, Jen Bartlett, Julie, Katarzyna Tomaszewska, Kate and Kathryn, Kate Faust, Katharine Richards, Katherine Lynch, Kenneth Knowles, Laura, Laurencia Saenz Benavides, Lea Li, Leo Ricketts, Lilli Simmons, Linda Brown, Liz, LQ, Lyb, Mandy Allen, Marjory Webber, Martine, Melissa Shaw, Meredith L. Freyre, MN, Paul Harris, Pete Burke, Rebecca Biegel, Rebecca Kemp, Sarah Cottrell, Sarah Jeffery, Sarah Ivinson, Sarah Swanton, Suzanna Chen, Suzanne, Tammie Fabien, Tamsen Staniford, Tegan Bailey, Tessa Valyou, Tree Hall, Vic Wiener, Vicki Temple, Victoria Chang, Victoria Routledge, Zephyrine Craster and Zoe Lee. If you're enjoying the Squarepeg podcast and would like to help me carry on making new episodes, you can become a member of the Squarepeg community on Patreon from £3 per month: https://www.patreon.com/squarepegpodcast 

Ebonie Allard is an award-winning International Master Coach, an author, and an artist. Now in her early 40s, she was mostly raised in the UK, but before she was seven years old she had lived in a house truck, on a commune, in France, New Zealand, Ireland, and England. She now lives in Spain. She says that she has never had a 'proper job' - she's been self-employed, a freelancer, a business owner and an entrepreneur all her life. Ebonie was diagnosed autistic fairly recently, but has always drawn neurodivergent people to her, and her work helps other neurodivergent, creative and spiritual humans to self actualise and enjoy their physical experience. I enjoyed this conversation so much - Ebonie is such a calming presence and brings a wonderful mix of wisdom and down-to-earthness. In our conversation we talk about: ➡ Reframing our past lives and selves ➡ Replacing unhealthy coping mechanisms with healthier ones ➡ Learning to embrace our demons, process emotions and regulate our nervous systems ➡ Removing stigma around meltdowns, stimming and other natural autistic things Squarepeg is a podcast in which neurodivergent women, and trans and nonbinary people, explore navigating a neurotypical world and share their insights, challenges and successes. I hope that these conversations will be inspiring and thought provoking, open you up to new ways of thinking about being neurodivergent, and help you feel more connected to a worldwide community of people with similar experiences. I'm Amy Richards, and after being diagnosed autistic at the age of 37 I'm now on a mission to learn more about different perspectives and issues around being a neurodivergent adult in a world that feels like it doesn't quite fit.   EPISODE LINKS: Ebonie's course, Misfit to Maven: the Fundamentals https://www.ebonieallard.com/the-fundamentals Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/eboniealchemy/ This Sacrosanct Life podcast: https://www.ebonieallard.com/podcasts/this-sacrosanct-life  Adulting with Ebonie podcast: https://open.spotify.com/show/5BW278BdWdxI4dTuBpc1BY Her book, Misfit to Maven (that we reference in this episode): https://www.ebonieallard.com/misfit-to-maven-book  Her book ‘The Manual of Me®️': https://www.ebonieallard.com/the-manual-of-me   If you'd like to connect or get in touch with Squarepeg, you can find me on: Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/squarepeg.community/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/squarepegautism  Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/squarepegautism/  Or on my website: https://squarepeg.community/    THANK YOU TO MY PATRONS! A HUGE thank you to my amazing patrons, who support my work on the podcast: Abi Hunter, Adam Klager, Amy Adler, Amy-Beth Mellor, Anika Lacerte, Annette, Becky Beasley, Ben Davies, Caroline, Cat Preston, Catrin Green, Cindy Bailey, Clare Forrest, Clare Holmes, Corinne Cariad, Dana Bradley, Danielle Warby, Dawn Trevellion, Dennis McNulty, Elizabeth Williams, Erica Kenworthy, Fiona Connor, Galina, Gwyneth, Hannah Breslin, Jackie Allen, JF, Jayne Hutchinson, Jeff Goldman, Jen Bartlett, Julie, Katarzyna Tomaszewska, Kate and Kathryn, Kate Faust, Katharine Richards, Katherine Lynch, Kenneth Knowles, Laura, Laurencia Saenz Benavides, Lea Li, Leo Ricketts, Lilli Simmons, Linda Brown, Liz, LQ, Lyb, Mandy Allen, Marjory Webber, Martine, Melissa Shaw, Meredith L. Freyre, MN, Paul Harris, Pete Burke, Rebecca Biegel, Rebecca Kemp, Sarah Cottrell, Sarah Jeffery, Sarah Ivinson, Sarah Swanton, Suzanna Chen, Suzanne, Tammie Fabien, Tamsen Staniford, Tegan Bailey, Tessa Valyou, Tree Hall, Vic Wiener, Vicki Temple, Victoria Chang, Victoria Routledge, Zephyrine Craster and Zoe Lee. If you're enjoying the Squarepeg podcast and would like to help me carry on making new episodes, you can become a member of the Squarepeg community on Patreon from £3 per month: https://www.patreon.com/squarepegpodcast 

Karawynn Long is an American writer and proofreader living in Mexico. Now 52, she had what she describes as her ‘Autism epiphany' just over three years ago, a few months before her fiftieth birthday. She is self identified as autistic, partly due to formal assessments not being available in the Mexican system, and difficult and expensive to obtain in the American one. Karawynn moved to Mexico almost 10 years ago for economic reasons, and unlike many autistic people who find living in other cultures freeing and less fraught with social expectations, she has found many aspects of life there a challenge as an autistic person. She writes short fiction, including writing a nonspeaking autistic character in a short story that will be published this year in a leading fiction magazine, and is currently working on a novel I had such a lovely time chatting with Karawynn Long (so much so that this episode is a tiny bit longer than usual, as I lost track of time!). I'm delighted to share our conversation with you. We talk about: ➡ Her experience of living in Mexico ➡ Her evolving relationship with her stepdaughter, who is also late identified autistic ➡ Undoing internalised ableism, and her relationship with stimming since it was suppressed in her as a child Squarepeg is a podcast in which neurodivergent women, and trans and nonbinary people, explore navigating a neurotypical world and share their insights, challenges and successes. I hope that these conversations will be inspiring and thought provoking, open you up to new ways of thinking about being neurodivergent, and help you feel more connected to a worldwide community of people with similar experiences. I'm Amy Richards, and after being diagnosed autistic at the age of 37 I'm now on a mission to learn more about different perspectives and issues around being a neurodivergent adult in a world that feels like it doesn't quite fit.   EPISODE LINKS: Karawynn's website: https://karawynnlong.com/  Mastodon: https://mastodon.social/@karawynn@wandering.shop  Medium: https://medium.com/re-cognition  Substack: https://karawynn.substack.com/ Diary of a Young Naturalist: https://www.amazon.co.uk/Diary-Young-Naturalist-Dara-McAnulty/dp/1908213795  The Reason I Jump: https://www.amazon.co.uk/Reason-Jump-voice-silence-autism/dp/1444776770    If you'd like to connect or get in touch with Squarepeg, you can find me on: Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/squarepeg.community/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/squarepegautism  Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/squarepegautism/  Or on my website: https://squarepeg.community/    THANK YOU TO MY PATRONS! A HUGE thank you to my amazing patrons, who support my work on the podcast: Abi Hunter, Adam Klager, Amy Adler, Amy-Beth Mellor, Anika Lacerte, Annette, Ben Davies, Caroline, Cat Preston, Catrin Green, Cindy Bailey, Clare Forrest, Clare Holmes, Corinne Cariad, Danielle Warby, Dawn Trevellion, Dennis McNulty, Elizabeth Williams, Erica Kenworthy, Fiona Connor, Galina, Gwyneth, Hannah Breslin, Jackie Allen, JF, Jayne Hutchinson, Jeff Goldman, Jen Bartlett, Julie, Katarzyna Tomaszewska, Kate and Kathryn, Kate Faust, Katharine Richards, Katherine Lynch, Kenneth Knowles, Laura, Laurencia Saenz Benavides, Lea Li, Leo Ricketts, Lilli Simmons, Linda Brown, Liz, LQ, Lyb, Mandy Allen, Marjory Webber, Martine, Melissa Shaw, Meredith L. Freyre, MN, Paul Harris, Pete Burke, Rebecca Biegel, Rebecca Kemp, Sarah Cottrell, Sarah Jeffery, Sarah Ivinson, Sarah Swanton, Suzanna Chen, Suzanne, Tammie Fabien, Tamsen Staniford, Tegan Bailey, Tessa Valyou, Tree Hall, Vic Wiener, Vicki Temple, Victoria Chang, Victoria Routledge, Zephyrine Craster and Zoe Lee. If you're enjoying the Squarepeg podcast and would like to help me carry on making new episodes, you can become a member of the Squarepeg community on Patreon from £3 per month: https://www.patreon.com/squarepegpodcast   

Mandy Williams is a Volunteer Coordinator with Scottish Women's Autism and a competitive athlete. Originally from Manchester in the UK, she now lives in Stirling in Scotland. She was diagnosed autistic two years ago, aged 45. She is passionate about exercise, and her enthusiasm for this special interest shines out. She has achieved a bronze medal in mountain running, and recently qualified for the World Championship Hyrox event, a global fitness race. I'm delighted to share my conversation with. I loved this conversation so much - Mandy has such good energy and she was a joy to chat with.  We cover so much in this conversation, but some of the highlights are: ➡ Her journey from working in retail to finding a better fit with an autism organisation, where she's surrounded by autistic people and is fully seen and supported ➡ How she experiences the sensory, self-regulatory and mental health benefits of exercise ➡ Navigating the social aspect of competitive fitness, and coping at big events ➡ Making sport and fitness more accessible for autistic people   EPISODE LINKS: Mandy's Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/n_d_athlete/ Find about more about Hyrox racing: https://hyrox.com/    Allie Mason's Squarepeg episode on sport: https://squarepeg.community/69-s6-ep2-finding-the-right-adventure-autism-resilience-sport-and-support/  Gilly McKeown's Squarepeg episode on sport: https://squarepeg.community/59-s5-ep4-getting-an-autism-diagnosis-while-doing-a-phd-in-autism-and-parenting-an-autistic-child/   Squarepeg is a podcast in which neurodivergent women, and trans and nonbinary people, explore navigating a neurotypical world and share their insights, challenges and successes. I hope that these conversations will be inspiring and thought provoking, open you up to new ways of thinking about being neurodivergent, and help you feel more connected to a worldwide community of people with similar experiences. I'm Amy Richards, and after being diagnosed autistic at the age of 37 I'm now on a mission to learn more about different perspectives and issues around being a neurodivergent adult in a world that feels like it doesn't quite fit. If you'd like to connect or get in touch with Squarepeg, you can find me on: Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/squarepeg.community/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/squarepegautism  Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/squarepegautism/  Or on my website: https://squarepeg.community/    THANK YOU TO MY PATRONS! A HUGE thank you to my amazing patrons, who support my work on the podcast: Abi Hunter, Adam Klager, Amy Adler, Amy-Beth Mellor, Anika Lacerte, Annette, Ben Davies, Caroline, Cat Preston, Catrin Green, Cindy Bailey, Clare Forrest, Clare Holmes, Danielle Warby, Dawn Trevellion, Elizabeth Williams, Erica Kenworthy, Fiona Connor, Galina, Gwyneth, Hannah Breslin, Jackie Allen, JF, Jayne Hutchinson, Jeff Goldman, Jen Bartlett, Julie, Katarzyna Tomaszewska, Kate and Kathryn, Kate Faust, Katharine Richards, Katherine Lynch, Kenneth Knowles, Laura, Laurencia Saenz Benavides, Lea Li, Leo Ricketts, Lilli Simmons, Linda Brown, Liz, LQ, Lyb, Mandy Allen, Marjory Webber, Martine, Melissa Shaw, Meredith L. Freyre, MN, Paul Harris, Pete Burke, Rebecca Biegel, Rebecca Kemp, Sarah Cottrell, Sarah Jeffery, Sarah Ivinson, Sarah Swanton, Stephanie Murray, Suzanna Chen, Suzanne, Tammie Fabien, Tegan Bailey, Tessa Valyou, Tree Hall, Vic Wiener, Vicki Temple, Victoria Chang, Victoria Routledge, Zephyrine Craster and Zoe Lee.   If you're enjoying the Squarepeg podcast and would like to help me carry on making new episodes, you can become a member of the Squarepeg community on Patreon from £3 per month: https://www.patreon.com/squarepegpodcast 

This episode features Marquel Stuedemann, who joined the Former Lawyer Collaborative in the Fall 2021 cohort of Guided Track.  Marquel discusses her experiences before and after joining The Collaborative. In this episode, you will see what being in The Collaborative looks like and how the support can help you leave the law by identifying an alternative career that is a great fit for you.  If you would love to have the same experience as Marquel Stuedemann, you can join the next Guided Track cohort that starts in February. The Guided Track is a ten-week support program that gives you access to all the resources in The Collaborative, including weekly support calls with five other lawyers that get into the program. You also get a 30-minute one-on-one call with Sarah Cottrell, which you can use during the ten weeks.  Now, let's get into the conversation with Marquel.

Today's episode picks up from the last bit of Sarah's discussion with Sarah Rutledge Fischer.   In the first half of the conversation, Sarah talked about her journey through the legal track and into a Biglaw firm. She also spoke about seeking therapy and being pregnant while practicing law.  In the final part of this conversation, you'll read about her journey out of the law and into the art world. You'll also learn a bit about the concept of “following your passion” and how Sarah (Cottrell) helps lawyers to leave the law.  See show notes at formerlawyer.com/039

Sarah Cottrell shares guidance on how to leave the law (if you're into that kind of thing)... Follow Sarah's Podcast: https://formerlawyer.com/category/podcast/ Connect with Mike: mike@lawyerforward.com Thanks for listening!

Fern Brady is a comedian and writer born and raised in Bathgate in Scotland. Now in her 30s, she lives in London with her partner.  Fern was a guest on the podcast back in the spring of 2021, soon after she was diagnosed autistic. Since then, she taken a deep dive into learning more about autism, toured her standup show Autistic Bikini Queen, been a contestant on Channel 4's TaskMaster… and written a book, Strong Female Character, which comes out in February 2023.  I was lucky enough to get a proof copy to read before the interview. I loved this book! Written in Fern's characteristic down-to-earth and straightforward style, it manages to cover some really quite dark chapters in her life with a lightness of touch and humour that make it effortlessly readable and entertaining, while still exploring important issues around being an autistic woman in our society. It was great to catch up with Fern and find out how things have changed since she was first diagnosed. It feels like we talked about everything in this conversation - but some of the highlights are: ➡ Trying to break the burnout cycle ➡ Her struggle with meltdowns - and how she's worked to manage and reduce them ➡ Being female and autistic: sensory issues, hormones, sex, sexuality and fitting into accepted gender expectations ➡ Alexithymia and how underlying, unprocessed emotions can manifest physically ➡ How it felt to unmask in a very visible way on Taskmaster Squarepeg is a podcast in which neurodivergent women, and trans and nonbinary people, explore navigating a neurotypical world and share their insights, challenges and successes. I hope that these conversations will be inspiring and thought provoking, open you up to new ways of thinking about being neurodivergent, and help you feel more connected to a worldwide community of people with similar experiences. I'm Amy Richards, and after being diagnosed autistic at the age of 37 I'm now on a mission to learn more about different perspectives and issues around being a neurodivergent adult in a world that feels like it doesn't quite fit.   EPISODE LINKS: Fern's Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/fernfrombathgate/  Twitter: https://twitter.com/FernBrady  Tour dates and mailing list: https://fernbradycomedian.com/    Preorder Strong Female Character (out 16 Feb 2023):  Amazon: https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/1914240448/ref=cm_sw_r_tw_dp_D5S44JY3RRRVP7N0F7W4  Waterstones: https://www.waterstones.com/book/strong-female-character/fern-brady/9781914240447  Blackwell's (delivers to USA): https://blackwells.co.uk/bookshop/product/Strong-Female-Character-by-Fern-Brady/9781914240447    Fern's previous SquarePeg episode: https://squarepeg.community/32-s3-ep1-fern-brady-autistic-meltdowns-understanding-emotions-and-being-the-black-sheep/    Fern mentioned the excellent book, Unmasking Autism by Dr Devon Price: https://www.amazon.co.uk/Unmasking-Autism-Incredible-Hidden-Neurodiversity/dp/1800960549/   Fern mentioned Alexis Quinn's book: https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/41164820-unbroken  Alexis was on SquarePeg earlier in this season: https://squarepeg.community/86-s7-ep6-narrative-therapy-reflections-on-an-autistic-experience-of-mental-health-inpatient-services/    If you'd like to connect or get in touch with Squarepeg, you can find me on: Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/squarepeg.community/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/squarepegautism  Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/squarepegautism/  Or on my website: https://squarepeg.community/    THANK YOU TO MY PATRONS! A HUGE thank you to my amazing patrons, who support my work on the podcast: Abi Hunter, Abigail J Moore, Adam Klager, Amy Adler, Amy-Beth Mellor, Anika Lacerte, Annette, Ben Davies, Caroline, Cat Preston, Catrin Green, Cindy Bailey, Clare Holmes, Corinne Cariad, Danielle Warby, Dawn Trevellion, Elizabeth Vezina, Elizabeth Williams, Galina, Gwyneth, Hannah Breslin, Jackie Allen, JF, Jayne Hutchinson, Jeff Goldman, Jen Bartlett, JE, Katarzyna Tomaszewska, Kate and Kathryn, Kate Faust, Katharine Richards, Katherine Lynch, Kenneth Knowles, Laurencia Saenz Benavides, Lea Li, Leo Ricketts, Lilli Simmons, Lyb, Mandy Allen, Meredith L. Freyre, MN, Pete Burke, Rebecca Biegel, Rebecca Kemp, Sarah Cottrell, Sarah Jeffery, Sarah Ivinson, Sarah Swanton, Sioned Wynn, Stephanie Murray, Suzanna Chen, Suzanne, Tammie Fabien, Tegan Bailey, Tessa Valyou, Tree Hall, Una Walkenhorst, Vic Wiener, Vicki Temple, Victoria Chang, Victoria Routledge, Wendy Walker, Zephyrine Craster and Zoe Lee. If you're enjoying the Squarepeg podcast and would like to help me carry on making new episodes, you can become a member of the Squarepeg community on Patreon from £3 per month: https://www.patreon.com/squarepegpodcast 

Angela Lauria is a CEO and author from Washington DC, USA. Now 49, she was diagnosed autistic 10 years ago, and initially underwent a form of the controversial ABA therapy in an effort to ‘fix' the things about her that she had always felt were wrong. One burnout, some autism-positive therapy and ten years of processing later, she was able to fully accept and embrace her own autistic identity, and wider autistic culture.  Realising she didn't fit into traditional workplaces, Angela started her own publishing company, providing consulting, editing, design, and book launch marketing for authors who have a message and want to make an impact.  She has also recently started a podcast called The Autistic Culture Podcast. In our conversation we talk about: ➡ How she went from trying to fix herself with ABA and CBT therapies to celebrating her autism ➡ Burnout, meltdowns, stimming and friendship difficulties ➡ How misinterpreting situations and others' expectations, and finding it hard to read the room at school and in the workplace has impacted her CONTENT WARNING: Angela and I talk about self harm during this episode, so if you don't want to hear about this topic, you might want to give this one a miss.   Squarepeg is a podcast in which neurodivergent women, and trans and nonbinary people, explore navigating a neurotypical world and share their insights, challenges and successes. I hope that these conversations will be inspiring and thought provoking, open you up to new ways of thinking about being neurodivergent, and help you feel more connected to a worldwide community of people with similar experiences. I'm Amy Richards, and after being diagnosed autistic at the age of 37 I'm now on a mission to learn more about different perspectives and issues around being a neurodivergent adult in a world that feels like it doesn't quite fit.   EPISODE LINKS: Company website: https://www.differencepress.com/  The podcast: https://autisticculture.substack.com/    If you'd like to connect or get in touch with Squarepeg, you can find me on: Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/squarepeg.community/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/squarepegautism  Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/squarepegautism/  Or on my website: https://squarepeg.community/    THANK YOU TO MY PATRONS! A HUGE thank you to my amazing patrons, who support my work on the podcast: Abi Hunter, Abigail J Moore, Adam Klager, Amy Adler, Amy-Beth Mellor, Anika Lacerte, Annette, Ben Davies, Caroline, Cat Preston, Catrin Green, Cindy Bailey, Clare Holmes, Corinne Cariad, Danielle Warby, Dawn Trevellion, Elizabeth Vezina, Elizabeth Williams, Galina, Gwyneth, Hannah Breslin, Jackie Allen, JF, Jayne Hutchinson, Jeff Goldman, Jen Bartlett, JE, Katarzyna Tomaszewska, Kate and Kathryn, Kate Faust, Katharine Richards, Katherine Lynch, Kenneth Knowles, Lea Li, Leo Ricketts, Lilli Simmons, Lyb, Mandy Allen, Meredith L. Freyre, MN, Pete Burke, Rebecca Biegel, Rebecca Kemp, Sarah Cottrell, Sarah Jeffery, Sarah Ivinson, Sarah Swanton, Sioned Wynn, Stephanie Murray, Suzanna Chen, Suzanne, Tammie Fabien, Tegan Bailey, Tessa Valyou, Tree Hall, Una Walkenhorst, Vic Wiener, Vicki Temple, Victoria Chang, Victoria Routledge, Wendy Walker, Zephyrine Craster and Zoe Lee. If you're enjoying the Squarepeg podcast and would like to help me carry on making new episodes, you can become a member of the Squarepeg community on Patreon from £3 per month: https://www.patreon.com/squarepegpodcast 

Déa Neile-Hopton is a basketmaker and artist. She is of mixed Jamaican and English heritage and grew up in the 1970s and 80s in York, England. Now 47, she lives in Whitland in Wales, with her partner and three neurodivergent children. She is self diagnosed autistic and was diagnosed ADHD in 2021. She has a passion for arts and crafts, and for teaching circus skills, but has struggled to find a place in the world of work, finding job seeking and workplaces traumatic and experiencing repeated breakdowns, depression and lack of confidence around work, leading to her surviving on disability benefits. She is now trying to figure out how to approach work in a way that supports her better, focusing on creating and making, and developing her basket making business. Earlier this year she was selected to take part in a BBC TV show about crafters starting businesses. In our conversation we talk about: ➡ Growing up Black and autistic in a dysfunctional neurodivergent family ➡ Her experience as a teen at boarding school  ➡ Finding it hard to recognise autistic traits in herself ➡ Burnouts, breakdowns, anxiety and her struggles around employment  ➡ Raising autistic kids and being their advocate Squarepeg is a podcast in which neurodivergent women, and trans and nonbinary people, explore navigating a neurotypical world and share their insights, challenges and successes. I hope that these conversations will be inspiring and thought provoking, open you up to new ways of thinking about being neurodivergent, and help you feel more connected to a worldwide community of people with similar experiences. I'm Amy Richards, and after being diagnosed autistic at the age of 37 I'm now on a mission to learn more about different perspectives and issues around being a neurodivergent adult in a world that feels like it doesn't quite fit.   EPISODE LINKS: Déa's website: http://styxandstone.co.uk Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/dea.styx_and_stone.willow/ Facebook business page: https://www.facebook.com/styxandstone.willow  Personal facebook page: https://www.facebook.com/dea.neilehopton   If you'd like to connect or get in touch with Squarepeg, you can find me on: Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/squarepeg.community/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/squarepegautism  Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/squarepegautism/  Or on my website: https://squarepeg.community/    THANK YOU TO MY PATRONS! A HUGE thank you to my amazing patrons, who support my work on the podcast: Abi Hunter, Abigail J Moore, Amy Adler, Amy-Beth Mellor, Anika Lacerte, Annette, Ben Davies, Caroline, Cat Preston, Catrin Green, Cindy Bailey, Clare Holmes, Corinne Cariad, Danielle Warby, Dawn Trevellion, Elizabeth Vezina, Elizabeth Williams, Galina, Gwyneth, Jackie Allen, Jeff Goldman, Jen Bartlett, Kate and Kathryn, Kate Faust, Katharine Richards, Katherine Lynch, Kenneth Knowles, Lea Li, Leo Ricketts, Lilli Simmons, Lyb, Mandy Allen, MN, Pete Burke, Rebecca Biegel, Rebecca Kemp, Sarah Cottrell, Sarah Jeffery, Sarah Ivinson, Sarah Swanton, Sioned Wynn, Stephanie Murray, Suzanna Chen, Suzanne, Tammie Fabien, Tegan Bailey, Tessa Valyou, Tree Hall, Una Walkenhorst, Vic Wiener, Vicki Temple, Victoria Chang, Victoria Routledge, Wendy Walker, Zephyrine Craster and Zoe Lee. If you're enjoying the Squarepeg podcast and would like to help me carry on making new episodes, you can become a member of the Squarepeg community on Patreon from £3 per month: https://www.patreon.com/squarepegpodcast 

Kelly McCartney is a music journalist from Rhode Island, USA. She is 52 and self-diagnosed as autistic in April of 2022. She has turned a life-long special interest in music into an incredibly varied, 30-year career in almost every area of the music industry, including interning at Entertainment Tonight, working as personal assistant to various well known musicians, project managing independent artists, and hosting music podcasts and radio shows, including Record Bin Radio on Apple Music. In 2018, she co-founded the Rainey Day Fund, which provides assistance to BIPOC, LGBTQ+, disabled and other marginalised artists who add to the rich fabric of roots music. She is currently exploring a tangle of identities, being queer, genderqueer and autistic, and deep in discovery about which of her life-long quirks are actually autism. In our conversation we talk about: ➡ Trying to untangle her overlapping identities ➡ The challenges of romantic relationships, confrontation and sensory overload ➡ Alexithymia ➡ How she's built her career out of her special interest, and adapted how she works to meet her autistic needs   Squarepeg is a podcast in which neurodivergent women, and trans and nonbinary people, explore navigating a neurotypical world and share their insights, challenges and successes. I hope that these conversations will be inspiring and thought provoking, open you up to new ways of thinking about being neurodivergent, and help you feel more connected to a worldwide community of people with similar experiences. I'm Amy Richards, and after being diagnosed autistic at the age of 37 I'm now on a mission to learn more about different perspectives and issues around being a neurodivergent adult in a world that feels like it doesn't quite fit. EPISODE LINKS: Kelly's radio show: http://apple.co/recordbinradio    Her website: https://www.kellymccartney.com   Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/kellymccartneyx/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/kellymccartneyx  Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/kellymccartneyx  If you'd like to connect or get in touch with Squarepeg, you can find me on: Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/squarepeg.community/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/squarepegautism  Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/squarepegautism/  Or on my website: https://squarepeg.community/    THANK YOU TO MY PATRONS! A HUGE thank you to my amazing patrons, who support my work on the podcast: Abi Hunter, Abigail J Moore, Amy Adler, Amy-Beth Mellor, Anika Lacerte, Annette, Ben Davies, Caroline, Cat Preston, Catrin Green, Cindy Bailey, Clare Holmes, Corinne Cariad, Danielle Warby, Dawn Trevellion, Elizabeth Vezina, Elizabeth Williams, Felicia Libo, Galina, Gwyneth, Jackie Allen, Jeff Goldman, Jen Bartlett, Kate and Kathryn, Kate Faust, Katharine Richards, Katherine Lynch, Kenneth Knowles, Laura Battley, Lea Li, Leo Ricketts, Lilli Simmons, Lyb, Mandy Allen, MN, Pete Burke, Rebecca Kemp, Sarah Cottrell, Sarah Jeffery, Sarah Ivinson, Sarah Swanton, Sioned Wynn, Stephanie Murray, Suzanna Chen, Suzanne, Tammie Fabien, Tegan Bailey, Tessa Valyou, Tree Hall, Una Walkenhorst, Vic Wiener, Vicki Temple, Victoria Chang, Victoria Routledge, Wendy Walker, Zephyrine Craster and Zoe Lee. If you're enjoying the Squarepeg podcast and would like to help me carry on making new episodes, you can become a member of the Squarepeg community on Patreon from £3 per month: https://www.patreon.com/squarepegpodcast   

Audrey Mitchell is a counsellor with a private practise in Idaho, USA. She was diagnosed autistic in 2020, around the same time as her teenage daughter, and the last two years have been a time of processing and learning to accept herself as she is, and unmask in both her personal and professional lives. I first interviewed her two years ago, for the very first season of SquarePeg. Since that interview was recorded she has finished writing her first, soon-to-be-published memoir, Polishing Marbles, a book intended, in her words, for ‘all the generations of women who ever asked, “What am I doing here and why does everything hurt so much?”' The book has been decades in the writing; she started writing it, she says, after she kept finding that telling people anecdotes about her life often ‘resulted in looks of shock and concern, followed with the cautious suggestion that I should perhaps consider writing a book about it.' It was lovely to catch up and so interesting to get another snapshot in time of someone's journey from diagnosis. In our conversation we talk about: ➡ Processing her diagnosis as a counsellor, and recognising her autistic clients ➡ Unmasking at home, in relationships and as a business owner - and her ever-evolving relationship with her autistic teen ➡ Uncovering the impact of undiagnosed autism across generations of her family ➡ Returning to her book and discovering it was always a book about an autistic woman Squarepeg is a podcast in which neurodivergent women, and trans and nonbinary people, explore navigating a neurotypical world and share their insights, challenges and successes. I hope that these conversations will be inspiring and thought provoking, open you up to new ways of thinking about being neurodivergent, and help you feel more connected to a worldwide community of people with similar experiences. I'm Amy Richards, and after being diagnosed autistic at the age of 37 I'm now on a mission to learn more about different perspectives and issues around being a neurodivergent adult in a world that feels like it doesn't quite fit.   EPISODE LINKS: Audrey's Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/audreypolishesmarbles/ Her book: https://www.polishingmarbles.com/  Her therapy practice: https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/therapists/audreys-peace-of-mind-counseling-services-boise-id/331803  Her previous Squarepeg episode: https://squarepeg.community/9-s1-ep9-female-presentation-autistic-counsellors-and-dealing-with-depression/  Her bonus episode: https://squarepeg.community/25-audrey-mitchell-meeting-my-needs-with-family-and-friends-dating-again-and-advocating-for-my-daughter/  If you'd like to connect or get in touch with Squarepeg, you can find me on: Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/squarepeg.community/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/squarepegautism  Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/squarepegautism/  Or on my website: https://squarepeg.community/    THANK YOU TO MY PATRONS! A HUGE thank you to my amazing patrons, who support my work on the podcast: Abi Hunter, Abigail J Moore, Amy Adler, Amy-Beth Mellor, Anika Lacerte, Annette, Ben Davies, Caroline, Cat Preston, Catrin Green, Cindy Bailey, Clare Holmes, Corinne Cariad, Danielle Warby, Dawn Trevellion, Elizabeth Vezina, Elizabeth Williams, Felicia Libo, Galina, Gwyneth, Jackie Allen, Jeff Goldman, Jen Bartlett, Kate and Kathryn, Kate Faust, Katharine Richards, Katherine Lynch, Kenneth Knowles, Laura Battley, Lea Li, Leo Ricketts, Lilli Simmons, Lyb, Mandy Allen, MN, Pete Burke, Rebecca Kemp, Sarah Cottrell, Sarah Jeffery, Sarah Ivinson, Sarah Swanton, Sioned Wynn, Stephanie Murray, Suzanna Chen, Suzanne, Tammie Fabien, Tessa Valyou, Tree Hall, Una Walkenhorst, Vic Wiener, Vicki Temple, Victoria Chang, Victoria Routledge, Wendy Walker, Zephyrine Craster and Zoe Lee. If you're enjoying the Squarepeg podcast and would like to help me carry on making new episodes, you can become a member of the Squarepeg community on Patreon from £3 per month: https://www.patreon.com/squarepegpodcast   

Jacqui O'Riordan is an Advanced Nurse Practitioner from Harrogate, North Yorkshire in the UK. She has worked as a mental health nurse for almost 20 years, including working in a secure unit with chronically ill patients. She has worked in crisis assessment with Accident and Emergency and the Police since 2008.  Now 49, Jacqui was diagnosed as autistic and ADHD a year ago, and her two children are also autistic. Since learning more about autism, she has begun to question the lack of proper training in neurodiversity that mental health professionals in the UK are currently given. She wants to see a push for better training and the inclusion of autistic staff in planning and delivering training. To this end, she recently set up a working group of autistic staff who work in her NHS organisation, including a Consultant Psychiatrist, social workers, nurses and admin staff, to explore this further. In our conversation we talk about: ➡ How she and her children came to realise they were all autistic ➡ The positives and the challenges of living as a newly diagnosed family unit ➡ How her work as a psychiatric nurse has been impacted and informed by her deepening understanding of autism, and addressing the lack of knowledge and awareness in the profession Squarepeg is a podcast in which neurodivergent women, and trans and nonbinary people, explore navigating a neurotypical world and share their insights, challenges and successes. I hope that these conversations will be inspiring and thought provoking, open you up to new ways of thinking about being neurodivergent, and help you feel more connected to a worldwide community of people with similar experiences. I'm Amy Richards, and after being diagnosed autistic at the age of 37 I'm now on a mission to learn more about different perspectives and issues around being a neurodivergent adult in a world that feels like it doesn't quite fit. EPISODE LINKS: The autistic student nurse Jacqui mentions at the end (who has since qualified): https://www.authenticallyemily.uk/ National Autistic Society information and signposts on autism and mental health: https://www.autism.org.uk/advice-and-guidance/topics/mental-health Mentalhealth.org information and signposts on autism and mental health: https://www.mentalhealth.org.uk/explore-mental-health/a-z-topics/autism-and-mental-health    If you'd like to connect or get in touch with Squarepeg, you can find me on: Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/squarepeg.community/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/squarepegautism  Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/squarepegautism/  Or on my website: https://squarepeg.community/  THANK YOU TO MY PATRONS! A HUGE thank you to my amazing patrons, who support my work on the podcast: Abi Hunter, Abigail J Moore, Amy Adler, Amy-Beth Mellor, Anika Lacerte, Annette, Ben Davies, Caroline, Cat Preston, Catrin Green, Cindy Bailey, Clare Holmes, Corinne Cariad, Danielle Warby, Dawn Trevellion, Elizabeth Vezina, Elizabeth Williams, Felicia Libo, Galina, Gwyneth, Jackie Allen, Jeff Goldman, Jen Bartlett, Kate and Kathryn, Kate Faust, Katharine Richards, Katherine Lynch, Kenneth Knowles, Laura Battley, Lea Li, Leo Ricketts, Lilli Simmons, Lyb, Mandy Allen, MN, Pete Burke, Rebecca Kemp, Sarah Cottrell, Sarah Jeffery, Sarah Ivinson, Sarah Swanton, Sioned Wynn, Stephanie Murray, Suzanna Chen, Suzanne, Tammie Fabien, Tessa Valyou, Tree Hall, Una Walkenhorst, Vicki Temple, Victoria Chang, Victoria Routledge, Wendy Walker, Zephyrine Craster and Zoe Lee. If you're enjoying the Squarepeg podcast and would like to help me carry on making new episodes, you can become a member of the Squarepeg community on Patreon from £3 per month: https://www.patreon.com/squarepegpodcast   

Alexis Quinn is a mother, author, educator and former teacher who spent three and a half years in inpatient services following a mental health breakdown in her mid twenties. 14 months into this period, aged 27, she was diagnosed autistic by chance, when an Autism Psychiatric Specialist happened to witness one of her meltdowns.  I first discovered Alexis on Twitter, and I was compelled to read her first devastating but incredible first book, Unbroken, which tells the story of her breakdown, her years trapped in the mental health system, and her courageous break for freedom. Now 38, she lives in Kent in the UK. Since 2021 she has been Manager of the Restraint Reduction Network, a registered charity which aims to reduce reliance on restrictive practices across education, health, social care, youth justice services, mental health, autism, learning disability and dementia services across the UK and beyond. In a video made for the RRN Alexis speaks of the importance of creating “cultures that see people as assets, not problems, where genuine relationships are built on mutual trust and respect and people's rights, their families and their humanity are front and centre.”  In our conversation we talk about: ➡ Alex's experiences as an autistic mental health inpatient, both before and after her autism diagnosis ➡ The problems she sees in the UK's mental health system, and the dehumanisation, pathologising and othering of autistic people, and the disproportionate effect on women ➡ The healing process of writing her story ➡ Her work with the Restraint Reduction Network ➡ Navigating pregnancy, birth and parenting as an autistic mother CONTENT WARNING: Before we begin, please be aware that this episode includes discussion of bereavement, and descriptions of traumatic treatment of inpatients in mental health settings. So if you don't want to hear about these topics, you might want to give this episode a miss. Squarepeg is a podcast in which neurodivergent women, and trans and nonbinary people, explore navigating a neurotypical world and share their insights, challenges and successes. I hope that these conversations will be inspiring and thought provoking, open you up to new ways of thinking about being neurodivergent, and help you feel more connected to a worldwide community of people with similar experiences. I'm Amy Richards, and after being diagnosed autistic at the age of 37 I'm now on a mission to learn more about different perspectives and issues around being a neurodivergent adult in a world that feels like it doesn't quite fit. EPISODE LINKS: Unbroken: https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/41164820-unbroken Twitter: https://twitter.com/AQuinnUnbroken  Olaseni Lewis: https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2017/feb/07/man-died-olaseni-lewis-police-restraint-gentle-giant  Oliver McGowan mandatory training: https://www.autism.org.uk/what-we-do/news/oliver-mcgowan-mandatory-training  If you'd like to connect or get in touch with Squarepeg, you can find me on: Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/squarepeg.community/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/squarepegautism  Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/squarepegautism/  Or on my website: https://squarepeg.community/  THANK YOU TO MY PATRONS! A HUGE thank you to my amazing patrons, who support my work on the podcast: Abi Hunter, Abigail J Moore, Amy Adler, Amy-Beth Mellor, Anika Lacerte, Annette, Ben Davies, Benita Borchard-Thierbach, Caroline, Cat Preston, Catrin Green, Cindy Bailey, Clare Holmes, Corinne Cariad, Danielle Warby, Dawn Trevellion, Elizabeth Vezina, Elizabeth Williams, Felicia Libo, Galina, Gwyneth, Jackie Allen, Jeff Goldman, Jen Bartlett, Kate Faust, Katharine Richards, Katherine Lynch, Kenneth Knowles, Laura Battley, Lea Li, Leo Ricketts, Lilli Simmons, Lyb, Mandy Allen, MN, Pete Burke, Rebecca Kemp, Sarah Cottrell, Sarah Jeffery, Sarah Ivinson, Sarah Swanton, Sioned Wynn, Stephanie Murray, Suzanna Chen, Suzanne, Tammie Fabien, Tessa Valyou, Tree Hall, Una Walkenhorst, Vicki Temple, Victoria Routledge, Zephyrine Craster and Zoe Lee. If you're enjoying the Squarepeg podcast and would like to help me carry on making new episodes, you can become a member of the Squarepeg community on Patreon from £3 per month: https://www.patreon.com/squarepegpodcast   

Sanna Östergren is a writer and literary translator from Sweden. She lives in the countryside with her husband and their two-year-old son, where she also runs a small independent publishing company.  She realised she was autistic about a year ago, when the overwhelm of new motherhood started turning her life-long shutdowns into meltdowns, and she was diagnosed in April this year, aged 32. When we recorded this episode she was on a break from work, to allow her to focus on parenting, gardening and preparing for the imminent birth of her second child.  In our conversation we talk about: ➡ The sensory and self regulatory overwhelm of becoming a parent  ➡ Shutdowns, meltdowns, burnouts and boundary setting ➡ Overcoming her fear of childbirth ➡ Depression, social anxiety, and seeking therapy ➡ How being self employed has made her life easier Squarepeg is a podcast in which neurodivergent women, and trans and nonbinary people, explore navigating a neurotypical world and share their insights, challenges and successes. I hope that these conversations will be inspiring and thought provoking, open you up to new ways of thinking about being neurodivergent, and help you feel more connected to a worldwide community of people with similar experiences. I'm Amy Richards, and after being diagnosed autistic at the age of 37 I'm now on a mission to learn more about different perspectives and issues around being a neurodivergent adult in a world that feels like it doesn't quite fit.   EPISODE LINKS: Katherine May's Wintering: https://katherine-may.co.uk/ If you'd like to connect or get in touch with Squarepeg, you can find me on: Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/squarepeg.community/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/squarepegautism  Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/squarepegautism/  Or on my website: https://squarepeg.community/    THANK YOU TO MY PATRONS! A HUGE thank you to my amazing patrons, who support my work on the podcast: Abi Hunter, Abigail J Moore, Amy Adler, Amy-Beth Mellor, Anika Lacerte, Annette, Ben Davies, Benita Borchard-Thierbach, Caroline, Cat Preston, Catrin Green, Cindy Bailey, Clare Holmes, Corinne Cariad, Danielle Warby, Dawn Trevellion, Elizabeth Vezina, Elizabeth Williams, Felicia Libo, Galina, Gwyneth, Jackie Allen, Jeff Goldman, Jen Bartlett, Kate Faust, Katharine Richards, Katherine Lynch, Kenneth Knowles, Laura Battley, Lea Li, Leo Ricketts, Lilli Simmons, Lyb, Mandy Allen, MN, Pete Burke, Rebecca Kemp, Sarah Cottrell, Sarah Jeffery, Sarah Ivinson, Sarah Swanton, Sioned Wynn, Stephanie Murray, Suzanna Chen, Suzanne, Tessa Valyou, Tree Hall, Una Walkenhorst, Vicki Temple, Victoria Routledge and Zephyrine Craster. If you're enjoying the Squarepeg podcast and would like to help me carry on making new episodes, you can become a member of the Squarepeg community on Patreon from £3 per month: https://www.patreon.com/squarepegpodcast 

Janet Murray is a content strategist who lives near London in the UK. She was recently diagnosed autistic, after first getting a diagnosis of ADHD in 2020. A former journalist and PR coach, Janet has written for many national publications, is the host of the Courageous Content podcast and founder of the Courageous Content Live Event  - an annual content marketing event for creative businesses/brands - and is also a keynote speaker who has spoken on big stages all over the world.  She says that she has a strong desire for order and routine, but is also one of the most disorganised people on the planet, and puts her unlikely success down to creating easy-to-follow systems and processes to help her stay productive. In this episode Janet really goes into the everyday experience of being autistic, as we talk about: ➡ Feeling disconnected from peers and experiencing bullying as a child and an adult ➡ How her rule following and direct communication have caused her difficulties in her interactions with others ➡ Being emotional and highly sensitive, yet often being interpreted as rude, overly serious and cold. ➡ The challenges of navigating female friendships as a neurodivergent woman Squarepeg is a podcast in which neurodivergent women, and trans and nonbinary people, explore navigating a neurotypical world and share their insights, challenges and successes. I hope that these conversations will be inspiring and thought provoking, open you up to new ways of thinking about being neurodivergent, and help you feel more connected to a worldwide community of people with similar experiences. I'm Amy Richards, and after being diagnosed autistic at the age of 37 I'm now on a mission to learn more about different perspectives and issues around being a neurodivergent adult in a world that feels like it doesn't quite fit.   EPISODE LINKS: Website: https://www.janetmurray.co.uk  Podcast: https://courageous-content.captivate.fm/ Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/janmurrayuk/ Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/janetmurrayofficial TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@janmurrayuk Twitter: https://twitter.com/jan_murray  Linkedin: https://www.linkedin.com/in/janet-murray74/ https://janetmurray.co.uk/how-i-discovered-im-autistic-and-have-adhd/ https://janetmurray.co.uk/how-i-discovered-i-had-adhd-and-why-its-my-superpower-as-an-entrepreneur/   If you'd like to connect or get in touch with Squarepeg, you can find me on: Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/squarepeg.community/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/squarepegautism  Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/squarepegautism/  Or on my website: https://squarepeg.community/    THANK YOU TO MY PATRONS! A HUGE thank you to my amazing patrons, who support my work on the podcast: Abi Hunter, Abigail J Moore, Amy Adler, Amy-Beth Mellor, Anika Lacerte, Annette, Ben Davies, Benita Borchard-Thierbach, Caroline, Cat Preston, Catrin Green, Cindy Bailey, Clare Holmes, Corinne Cariad, Danielle Warby, Dawn Trevellion, Elizabeth Vezina, Elizabeth Williams, Felicia Libo, Galina, Gwyneth, Jackie Allen, Jeff Goldman, Jen Bartlett, Kate Faust, Katharine Richards, Katherine Lynch, Kenneth Knowles, Laura Battley, Lea Li, Leo Ricketts, Lilli Simmons, Lyb, Mandy Allen, MN, Pete Burke, Rebecca Kemp, Sarah Cottrell, Sarah Jeffery, Sarah Ivinson, Sarah Swanton, Sioned Wynn, Stephanie Murray, Suzanna Chen, Suzanne, Tessa Valyou, Tree Hall, Una Walkenhorst, Vicki Temple, Victoria Routledge and Zephyrine Craster. If you're enjoying the Squarepeg podcast and would like to help me carry on making new episodes, you can become a member of the Squarepeg community on Patreon from £3 per month: https://www.patreon.com/squarepegpodcast

Janelle Johnson is an Inclusion Strategist, therapist and researcher from North Carolina, USA. She is self diagnosed and her son is also autistic. She has recently taken a step back from practising as a therapist to focus on her research as a PhD student and graduate research assistant at North Carolina State University's College of Education. Her work explores development for students with invisible disabilities, the intersection of mental health and other marginalised identities, and systemic change in education.  In our conversation we talk about: ➡ Being socially awkward, solitary and living in her own head as a child ➡ Learning to unmask in her marriage ➡ Being an empath, and psychology as a special interest ➡ Her take on the word ‘neurodivergent' ➡ Her PhD research ➡ The burnout cycle, and her strategies for helping break it Squarepeg is a podcast in which neurodivergent women, and trans and nonbinary people, explore navigating a neurotypical world and share their insights, challenges and successes. I hope that these conversations will be inspiring and thought provoking, open you up to new ways of thinking about being neurodivergent, and help you feel more connected to a worldwide community of people with similar experiences. I'm Amy Richards, and after being diagnosed autistic at the age of 37 I'm now on a mission to learn more about different perspectives and issues around being a neurodivergent adult in a world that feels like it doesn't quite fit.   EPISODE LINKS: Janelle's company website: https://www.bridgesflc.com/  The website for her research: https://sites.google.com/ncsu.edu/facesprogram/home LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/thefamilyfanatic/  Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/thefamilyfanatic/    The Color of Autism: https://thecolorofautism.org/  Autism in Black podcast: https://www.autisminblack.org/podcast/    If you'd like to connect or get in touch with Squarepeg, you can find me on: Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/squarepeg.community/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/squarepegautism  Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/squarepegautism/  Or on my website: https://squarepeg.community/    THANK YOU TO MY PATRONS! A HUGE thank you to my amazing patrons, who support my work on the podcast: Abi Hunter, Abigail J Moore, Amy Adler, Amy-Beth Mellor, Annette, Ben Davies, Benita Borchard-Thierbach, Caroline, Cat Preston, Catrin Green, Cindy Bailey, Clare Holmes, Corinne Cariad, Danielle Warby, Dawn Trevellion, Emily, Elizabeth Vezina, Elizabeth Williams, Felicia Libo, Galina, Gwyneth, Jackie Allen, Jeff Goldman, Jen Bartlett, Kate Faust, Katharine Richards, Katherine Lynch, Kenneth Knowles, Laura Battley, Lea Li, Leo Ricketts, Lilli Simmons, Lyb, Mandy Allen, Pete Burke, Rebecca Kemp, Sarah Cottrell, Sarah Jeffery, Sarah Ivinson, Sarah Swanton, Sioned Wynn, Stephanie Murray, Suzanna Chen, Suzanne, Tessa Valyou, Tree Hall, Una Walkenhorst, Vicki Temple, Victoria Routledge and Zephyrine Craster. If you're enjoying the Squarepeg podcast and would like to help me carry on making new episodes, you can become a member of the Squarepeg community on Patreon from £3 per month: https://www.patreon.com/squarepegpodcast 

D.L. Mayfield is a freelance writer from Portland, USA. She has written for Christian publications in the US for over 10 years, and is the author of several books, the latest of which, Unruly Saint, explores the life and work of the late American journalist, social activist and anarchist Catholic Dorothy Day. D.L. herself grew up highly religious in an evangelical family in the US. Now in her late 30s, she is currently in the process of being assessed for autism, after she reached out to an autistic therapist in order to better parent her autistic child. In her words, what followed has been a ‘wild year' of self discovery. She is in the process of transitioning away from being, as she describes it, a hyper-religious person, deconstructing authoritarian religion and exploring the exploitation of neurodivergent people by some religious groups. Her Substack newsletter, God is My Special Interest, has attracted a wide community of people who are exploring neurodivergence and who also come from a faith background. In our conversation we talk about: ➡ The impact of growing up undiagnosed in the evangelical church in America ➡ Parenting an autistic PDA child, postpartum depression, and being an autistic mother in autism mom spaces ➡ Autistic experiences of lockdowns  ➡ The appeal of religion to autistic people, and the numbers of undiagnosed autistic women that can be found in Christian groups ➡ The deconstruction of her own religious identity alongside her emerging self identification as autistic Squarepeg is a podcast in which neurodivergent women, and trans and nonbinary people, explore navigating a neurotypical world and share their insights, challenges and successes. I hope that these conversations will be inspiring and thought provoking, open you up to new ways of thinking about being neurodivergent, and help you feel more connected to a worldwide community of people with similar experiences. I'm Amy Richards, and after being diagnosed autistic at the age of 37 I'm now on a mission to learn more about different perspectives and issues around being a neurodivergent adult in a world that feels like it doesn't quite fit.   EPISODE LINKS: D.L.'s website: http://www.dlmayfield.com/  Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/d_l_mayfield/  Twitter: https://twitter.com/d_l_mayfield  God Is My Special Interest Substack: https://dlmayfield.substack.com/  The Prophetic Imagination Station podcast: https://www.propheticimaginationstation.com/   If you'd like to connect or get in touch with Squarepeg, you can find me on: Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/squarepeg.community/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/squarepegautism  Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/squarepegautism/  Or on my website: https://squarepeg.community/    THANK YOU TO MY PATRONS! A HUGE thank you to my amazing patrons, who support my work on the podcast: Abi Hunter, Abigail J Moore, Amy Adler, Amy-Beth Mellor, Annette, Ben Davies, Benita Borchard-Thierbach, Caroline, Cat Preston, Catrin Green, Cindy Bailey, Corinne Cariad, Danielle Warby, Dawn Trevellion, Emily, Elizabeth Vezina, Elizabeth Williams, Felicia Libo, Galina, Gwyneth, Jackie Allen, Jeff Goldman, Jen Bartlett, Kate Faust, Katharine Richards, Katherine Lynch, Kenneth Knowles, Laura Battley, Lea Li, Leo Ricketts, Lilli Simmons, Lyb, Mandy Allen, Pete Burke, Rebecca Kemp, Sarah Cottrell, Sarah Jeffery, Sarah Ivinson, Sarah Swanton, Sioned Wynn, Stephanie Murray, Suzanna Chen, Suzanne, Tessa Valyou, Tree Hall, Una Walkenhorst, Vicki Temple, Victoria Routledge and Zephyrine Craster. If you're enjoying the Squarepeg podcast and would like to help me carry on making new episodes, you can become a member of the Squarepeg community on Patreon from £3 per month: https://www.patreon.com/squarepegpodcast 

My guest this week is Dr Kate Tomas, a Spiritual Mentor who lives in mid Wales in the UK. Kate developed powerful psychic abilities from an early age, and by 22 had built a thriving international practice as a witch, healer and psychic for individuals, multinational brands, governments and CEOs. She holds a Doctorate of Philosophy in Theology from the University of Oxford, and is a world expert in Mysticism and Catholic women mystics. In 2018 she started a program called The Spiritual Life Upgrade to give women and non-binary people access to the core teachings of her spiritual tradition. First diagnosed with the connective tissue disorder EDS, Kate was diagnosed autistic and ADHD in her late 30s, when, like so many of us, she found herself making sense of many aspects of her life. In our conversation, Kate and I talk about: ➡ How our concept of self can change with an autism diagnosis ➡ Masking, misophonia, texture issues, and re-watching the same TV shows ➡ Structural oppression and privilege and how these relate to neurodivergent people ➡ The joy of gradually unmasking with our partners  This episode of the SquarePeg podcast is sponsored by THRIVE, my live workshop series. In these workshops I invite late diagnosed autistic women and nonbinary people to come with me on a journey of self discovery around life, work, personal fulfilment, and figuring out what you want out of life, what you actually need as an autistic adult, and how to start creating the life you truly want. If you'd like me to let you know when the next live round of workshops is open for enrolment, go to squarepeg.community/thrive/. Squarepeg is a podcast in which neurodivergent women, and trans and nonbinary people, explore navigating a neurotypical world and share their insights, challenges and successes. I hope that these conversations will be inspiring and thought provoking, open you up to new ways of thinking about being neurodivergent, and help you feel more connected to a worldwide community of people with similar experiences. I'm Amy Richards, and after being diagnosed autistic at the age of 37 I'm now on a mission to learn more about different perspectives and issues around being a neurodivergent adult in a world that feels like it doesn't quite fit.   EPISODE LINKS: Kate's website: https://www.drkatetomas.com/ Her Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/katetomasphd/   If you'd like to connect or get in touch with Squarepeg, you can find me on: Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/squarepeg.community/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/squarepegautism  Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/squarepegautism/  Or on my website: https://squarepeg.community/    THANK YOU TO MY PATRONS! A HUGE thank you to my amazing patrons, who support my work on the podcast: Abi Hunter, Abigail J Moore, Amy Adler, Amy-Beth Mellor, Annette, Ben Davies, Benita Borchard-Thierbach, Caroline, Cat Preston, Catrin Green, Cindy Bailey, Corinne Cariad, Danielle Warby, Dawn Trevellion, Emily, Elizabeth Vezina, Elizabeth Williams, Galina, Gwyneth, Jackie Allen, Jeff Goldman, Jen Bartlett, Kate Faust, Katharine Richards, Katherine Lynch, Kenneth Knowles, Laura Battley, Lea Li, Leo Ricketts, Lilli Simmons, Lyb, Mandy Allen, Pete Burke, Rebecca Kemp, Sarah Cottrell, Sarah Jeffery, Sarah Ivinson, Sarah Swanton, Sioned Wynn, Suzanna Chen, Suzanne, Tessa Valyou, Tree Hall, Una Walkenhorst, Vicki Temple, Victoria Routledge and Zephyrine Craster. If you're enjoying the Squarepeg podcast and would like to help me carry on making new episodes, you can become a member of the Squarepeg community on Patreon from just £3 per month: https://www.patreon.com/squarepegpodcast 

Mary Adkins followed her dream of becoming an author after leaving the law. And she knew the law wasn't for her by the second day. Today she's joining Sarah Cottrell to share her story of leaving Biglaw to become an author and writing coach. There are so many lawyers out there with dreams of being a writer, but they don't know how or where to begin. If that's you, you'll want to stay tuned to learn how you can get help leaving the law and becoming an author too.  See show notes at formerlawyer.com/154

Today's guest is Sarah Cottrell, host of The Former Lawyer Podcast. She is a former lawyer herself, former client of mine, and happily a current friend and colleague. Today we'll talk about how she helps people get out of their soul-sucking lawyer gig, what happens afterward, and how that relates to the Body Grievers journey. There are more similarities than you might think. Sarah's experience in Body Grievers Club was life changing. She had been in therapy for 6 years attempting to recover from her eating disorder, but learning how to really process grief has helped her in every other aspect of life. Developing the self-compassion required to try new things and fail has been a game changer. Connect with Sarah at https://formerlawyer.com/ Check out my resources, course, and membership community “The Body Grievers Club” at https://bodyimagewithbri.com/ A Podcast Launch Bestie production

Aisha Edwards is a somatic trauma therapist, podcaster and writer from Vancouver, Washington, and was diagnosed autistic last year, aged 39. Somatic trauma therapy is a body-centred approach to treating post-traumatic stress disorder that rather than focusing only on thoughts or emotions associated with a traumatic event, expands to include the natural bodily responses. I'm delighted to bring you this special bonus episode of the Squarepeg Podcast. This was recorded as a collaboration with somatic trauma therapist Aisha Edwards, co-host of the Emergent Liberation Collective podcast. The Emergent Liberation Collective is a podcast about somatics and spirituality as instruments for personal healing and collective transformation. In my conversation with Aisha we talk about: ➡ The grief and validation of a late autism diagnosis ➡ Masking and unmasking ➡ Meltdowns ➡ Attracting our neurokin ➡ The impact of intergenerational autism I hope you'll enjoy our conversation as much as I did. If you're interested in somatic healing you might like to explore Aisha's Within From Without: Trauma Informed Soul Journeying Guide, a nine part guide for integrating those traumatised parts of the self that's full of trauma-informed education, spiritual practices, skills, tools and interventions. You can find the link to this in the show notes and on my website. And if you are one of my Patrons, you'll find a special free download waiting for you from Aisha - her Ritual for Self Compassion. Squarepeg is a podcast in which neurodivergent women, and trans and nonbinary people, explore navigating a neurotypical world and share their insights, challenges and successes. I hope that these conversations will be inspiring and thought provoking, open you up to new ways of thinking about being neurodivergent, and help you feel more connected to a worldwide community of people with similar experiences. I'm Amy Richards, and after being diagnosed autistic at the age of 37 I'm now on a mission to learn more about different perspectives and issues around being a neurodivergent adult in a world that feels like it doesn't quite fit.   EPISODE LINKS: Emergent Liberation Collective podcast: https://emergentliberationcollective.libsyn.com/website  Aisha's therapy website: https://www.fullflightwellness.com/  Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/emergentliberationcollective/  Within From Without: Trauma Informed Soul Journeying: https://fullflight.kartra.com/page/Vbk10    If you'd like to connect or get in touch with Squarepeg, you can find me on: Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/squarepeg.community/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/squarepegautism  Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/squarepegautism/  Or on my website: https://squarepeg.community/    THANK YOU TO MY PATRONS! A HUGE thank you to my amazing patrons, who support my work on the podcast: Abi Hunter, Abigail J Moore, Amy Adler, Amy-Beth Mellor, Annette, Ben Davies, Benita Borchard-Thierbach, Caroline, Cat Preston, Catrin Green, Cindy Bailey, Corinne Cariad, Danielle Warby, Dawn Trevellion, Emily, Elizabeth Williams, Gwyneth, Jackie Allen, Jeff Goldman, Jen Bartlett, Kate Faust, Katharine Richards, Katherine Lynch, Kenneth Knowles, Laura Battley, Lea Li, Leo Ricketts, Lilli Simmons, Lyb, Mandy Allen, Pete Burke, Rebecca Kemp, Sarah Cottrell, Sarah Jeffery, Sarah Ivinson, Sarah Swanton, Sioned Wynn, Suzanna Chen, Suzanne, Tree Hall, Una Walkenhorst, Vera Cady, Vicki Temple, Victoria Routledge and Zephyrine Craster. If you're enjoying the Squarepeg podcast and would like to help me carry on making new episodes, you can become a member of the Squarepeg community on Patreon from just £3 per month: https://www.patreon.com/squarepegpodcast 

Diane J Wright is an autistic advocate and the founder of Autastic, an online community that aims to help late diagnosed autistic adults, particularly those from minority communities, and is the only resource of its size founded by a woman of colour.  Now 51, she was diagnosed autistic at 42. Her career has been in the entertainment industry, and she now provides diversity, equity, inclusion, and accessibility consultation to film and television producers and writers, focusing on neurodivergence and communities of colour, drawing on her lived experience as an Afro-Caribbean, biracial, invisibly disabled Canadian-American. In our conversation we talk about: ➡ Picking apart the complexities of childhood trauma and autism ➡ Her work shaping how neurodivergent stories are told in film and TV ➡ The experiences and challenges of autistic people of colour, and why there aren't more Black autistic advocates ➡ The experiences and needs of older late diagnosed autistic people ➡ The role masking plays in success, and the importance of reframing what it means to  be successful. Squarepeg is a podcast in which neurodivergent women, and trans and nonbinary people, explore navigating a neurotypical world and share their insights, challenges and successes. I hope that these conversations will be inspiring and thought provoking, open you up to new ways of thinking about being neurodivergent, and help you feel more connected to a worldwide community of people with similar experiences. I'm Amy Richards, and after being diagnosed autistic at the age of 37 I'm now on a mission to learn more about different perspectives and issues around being a neurodivergent adult in a world that feels like it doesn't quite fit.   EPISODE LINKS: https://autastic.com  https://twitter.com/WeAreAutastic  https://instagram.com/WeAreAutastic https://facebook.com/WeAreAutastic  If you'd like to connect or get in touch with Squarepeg, you can find me on: Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/squarepeg.community/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/squarepegautism  Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/squarepegautism/  Or on my website: https://squarepeg.community/    THANK YOU TO MY PATRONS! A HUGE thank you to my amazing patrons, who support my work on the podcast: Abi Hunter, Amy Adler, Amy-Beth Mellor, Abigail J Moore, Ben Davies, Benita Borchard-Thierbach, Caroline, Cat Preston, Catrin Green, Cindy Bailey, Corinne Cariad, Danielle Warby, Dawn Trevellion, Emily, Elizabeth Williams, Gwyneth, Jackie Allen, Jeff Goldman, Jen Bartlett, Kate Faust, Katharine Richards, Katherine Lynch, Kenneth Knowles, Laura Battley, Lea Li, Leo Ricketts, Lilli Simmons, Lyb, Mandy Allen, Pete Burke, Rebecca Kemp, Sarah Cottrell, Sarah Jeffery, Sarah Ivinson, Sarah Swanton, Sioned Wynn, Suzanna Chen, Suzanne, Tree Hall, Una Walkenhorst, Vera Cady, Vicki Temple, Victoria Routledge and Zephyrine Craster. If you're enjoying the Squarepeg podcast and would like to help me carry on making new episodes, you can become a member of the Squarepeg community on Patreon from just £3 per month: https://www.patreon.com/squarepegpodcast 

Claire Gardener is a homeopath and primary school teacher in London in the UK. She is 45 and self diagnosed as autistic five years ago, after experiencing burnout in her teaching role.  A special interest in children's literature lead to her first career in book editing, which came to an end as a result of workplace bullying. Since her burnout, she has trained in homeopathy, and continues to work part time as a teacher. Her specialism as a homeopath is in working with other late-diagnosed autistic women and non-binary people to help them come to terms with their autism by exploring the impact that autistic trauma has on their nervous systems, and how they cope with and manage the effects of this day-to-day. In our conversation we talk about  ➡ The challenges of being an autistic teacher  ➡ Managing the social aspect of workplaces, and her experience of workplace bullying ➡ Trauma and how it manifests in autistic people ➡ How trauma, anxiety and the nervous system interplay in autistic minds and bodies    If you are a Patron you can find an extra recording of me and Claire in my Patreon! If you'd like to become a Patron, click here. Squarepeg is a podcast in which neurodivergent women, and trans and nonbinary people, explore navigating a neurotypical world and share their insights, challenges and successes. I hope that these conversations will be inspiring and thought provoking, open you up to new ways of thinking about being neurodivergent, and help you feel more connected to a worldwide community of people with similar experiences. I'm Amy Richards, and after being diagnosed autistic at the age of 37 I'm now on a mission to learn more about different perspectives and issues around being a neurodivergent adult in a world that feels like it doesn't quite fit.   EPISODE LINKS: Claire's website: https://www.clairegardenerhomeopathy.com  Her Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/claire_gardener_homeopathy/  Her Facebook page: https://www.facebook.com/greenwichhomeopathy/ If you'd like to connect or get in touch with Squarepeg, you can find me on: Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/squarepeg.community/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/squarepegautism  Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/squarepegautism/  Or on my website: https://squarepeg.community/    THANK YOU TO MY PATRONS! A HUGE thank you to my amazing patrons, who support my work on the podcast: Abi Hunter, Amy Adler, Amy-Beth Mellor, Abigail J Moore, Ben Davies, Benita Borchard-Thierbach, Caroline, Cat Preston, Catrin Green, Cindy Bailey, Corinne Cariad, Danielle Warby, Dawn Trevellion, Emily, Elizabeth Williams, Jackie Allen, Jeff Goldman, Kate Faust, Katharine Richards, Katherine Lynch, Kenneth Knowles, Lea Li, Leo Ricketts, Lilli Simmons, Lyb, Mandy Allen, Pete Burke, Rebecca Kemp, Sarah Cottrell, Sarah Jeffery, Sarah Ivinson, Sarah Swanton, Sioned Wynn, Suzanna Chen, Suzanne, Tree Hall, Una Walkenhorst, Vera Cady, Vicki Temple, Victoria Routledge and Zephyrine Craster. If you're enjoying the Squarepeg podcast and would like to help me carry on making new episodes, you can become a member of the Squarepeg community on Patreon from just £3 per month: https://www.patreon.com/squarepegpodcast 

Alma is an unemployed forager, food designer, artist, craftswoman and permaculture gardener from the Netherlands. She was diagnosed autistic in 2019 after self identifying the year before; she has also since been diagnosed with ADHD. When her then undiagnosed autistic and ADHD traits meant that she wasn't able to finish her degree, she was offered a management position at the student café she had worked at while at university, staying there until she suffered a burnout in 2016 and found herself unable to work. Her life since then has been about survival, and she wanted to come on the podcast to talk about the role of privilege and poverty in autistic lives. In our conversation we talk about: ➡ The impact of her upbringing, growing up in poverty with a neurodivergent parent ➡ The impact of her burnout ➡ Being both autistic and ADHD and how this effects her executive function ➡ The intersectionality of autism, privilege and poverty ‒ and survivorship bias ➡ Navigating a romantic relationship when you're both neurodivergent Squarepeg is a podcast in which neurodivergent women, and trans and nonbinary people, explore navigating a neurotypical world and share their insights, challenges and successes. I hope that these conversations will be inspiring and thought provoking, open you up to new ways of thinking about being neurodivergent, and help you feel more connected to a worldwide community of people with similar experiences. I'm Amy Richards, and after being diagnosed autistic at the age of 37 I'm now on a mission to learn more about different perspectives and issues around being a neurodivergent adult in a world that feels like it doesn't quite fit.   EPISODE LINKS: Alma's Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/_a.l.m.l.a_/ VOTE FOR SQUAREPEG IN THE BRITISH PODCAST AWARDS If you haven't voted in the British Podcast Awards yet, you can vote for me in the Listeners' Choice award. Voting closes on Sunday 17 July 2022. If you want to vote, click here and search for ‘Squarepeg' with no space to find the right show. If you'd like to connect or get in touch with Squarepeg, you can find me on: Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/squarepeg.community/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/squarepegautism  Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/squarepegautism/  Or on my website: https://squarepeg.community/    THANK YOU TO MY PATRONS! A HUGE thank you to my amazing patrons, who support my work on the podcast: Abi Hunter, Amy Adler, Amy-Beth Mellor, Abigail J Moore, Ben Davies, Benita Borchard-Thierbach, Caroline, Cat Preston, Catrin Green, Cindy Bailey, Corinne Cariad, Danielle Warby, Dawn Trevellion, Emily, Elizabeth Williams, Jackie Allen, Jeff Goldman, Kate Faust, Katharine Richards, Katherine Lynch, Kenneth Knowles, Lea Li, Leo Ricketts, Lilli Simmons, Lyb, Mandy Allen, Pete Burke, Rebecca Kemp, Sarah Cottrell, Sarah Jeffery, Sarah Swanton, Sioned Wynn, Suzanna Chen, Suzanne, Tree Hall, Una Walkenhorst, Vera Cady, Vicki Temple, Victoria Routledge and Zephyrine Craster. If you're enjoying the Squarepeg podcast and would like to help me carry on making new episodes, you can become a member of the Squarepeg community on Patreon from just £3 per month: https://www.patreon.com/squarepegpodcast 

If you're a regular listener, you know that I practiced law for ten years, and now, I help unhappy lawyers ditch their soul-sucking jobs. On this podcast, I share advice for aspiring former lawyers and interviews to help you through the process of leaving and finding a new career.  Today, I want to talk to you about why I didn't do career coaching for lawyers when I first started Former Lawyer and what got me started doing 1:1 coaching. I'll also talk about what it looks like to work with me and how you can get started. Are you ready? Let's get going! See show notes at formerlawyer.com/145

Nadia Dillon is a software engineer and entrepreneur from London in the UK. Diagnosed autistic at 27, after experiencing a burnout, she is now 30, and her brilliantly insightful - and beautiful - Instagram account about her post-diagnosis journey has grown to over 25K followers (you may know her by her Instagram handle, @autisticblackgirl). She started her Instagram as an outlet to express her frustrations with navigating a neurotypical world, and she is also keen to highlight the particular experiences of Black autistic people.  In our conversation we talk about: ➡ Burnout, sensory overload and eye contact ➡ Getting support and accommodations at work ➡ Masking and code switching, and deconstructing and rebuilding herself post-diagnosis ➡ Barriers to diagnosis for people of colour, and visibility of Black autistic people   VOTE FOR SQUAREPEG IN THE BRITISH PODCAST AWARDS If you haven't voted in the British Podcast Awards yet, there's still time! I've been nominated for a Rising Star award for Squarepeg – and you can vote for me in the Listeners' Choice award. Voting closes on Sunday 17 July. It would be amazing if Squarepeg could win something, as it will help spread the word and allow more people who could benefit from it to find the podcast. If you want to vote, click here and search for ‘Squarepeg' with no space to find the right show. Squarepeg is a podcast in which neurodivergent women, and trans and nonbinary people, explore navigating a neurotypical world and share their insights, challenges and successes. I hope that these conversations will be inspiring and thought provoking, open you up to new ways of thinking about being neurodivergent, and help you feel more connected to a worldwide community of people with similar experiences. I'm Amy Richards, and after being diagnosed autistic at the age of 37 I'm now on a mission to learn more about different perspectives and issues around being a neurodivergent adult in a world that feels like it doesn't quite fit.   EPISODE LINKS: Nadia's Instagram:  https://www.instagram.com/autisticblackgirl/ Vote for Squarepeg in the British Podcast Awards 2022: https://www.britishpodcastawards.com/vote (search for ‘Squarepeg' with no space!)   If you'd like to connect or get in touch with Squarepeg, you can find me on: Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/squarepeg.community/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/squarepegautism  Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/squarepegautism/  Or on my website: https://squarepeg.community/    THANK YOU TO MY PATRONS! A HUGE thank you to my amazing patrons, who support my work on the podcast: Abi Hunter, Amy Adler, Amy-Beth Mellor, Abigail J Moore, Ben Davies, Benita Borchard-Thierbach, Caroline, Cat Preston, Catrin Green, Cindy Bailey, Corinne Cariad, Danielle Warby, Dawn Trevellion, Emily, Elizabeth Williams, Jackie Allen, Jeff Goldman, Kate Faust, Katharine Richards, Katherine Lynch, Lea Li, Leo Ricketts, Lilli Simmons, Lyb, Mandy Allen, Pete Burke, Rebecca Kemp, Sarah Cottrell, Sarah Jeffery, Sarah Swanton, Sioned Wynn, Suzanna Chen, Suzanne, Tree Hall, Una Walkenhorst, Vera Cady, Vicki Temple, Victoria Routledge and Zephyrine Craster. If you're enjoying the Squarepeg podcast and would like to help me carry on making new episodes, you can become a member of the Squarepeg community on Patreon from just £3 per month: https://www.patreon.com/squarepegpodcast

Unhappy where you are? Or are you unhappy with being a lawyer? And how can you tell the difference? That's what we're getting into today with guest Sarah Cottrell, host of the Former Lawyer Podcast. *** Ready To Become A Happily Successful Lawyer? Book a call with Heather to find out how she can help here: https://www.lifeandlawpodcast.com/free-call/ *** For show notes and all other links go here: https://www.lifeandlawpodcast.com/podcast/not-sure-you-want-to-practice-law

Elizabeth Williams is an acupuncturist from South Carolina, USA. She is 43 and was diagnosed autistic just a few months ago, in February this year. Like me, she started out her career as a teacher, before switching to acupuncture, which she says is a much better fit for her. Since her career change she has been on a journey of self discovery, exploring everything she could find about personality theories and physical and mental health. But she says that it wasn't until she figured out she's autistic that all the pieces fell in to place.  In our conversation we talk about: ➡ Reframing childhood experiences ➡ Rejection Sensitive Dysphoria and masking, and its impact on relationships ➡ Choosing work that has the perfect sensory environment ➡ Advocating for our own health, autism and digestive and autoimmune issues, the gut-brain connection, and acupuncture and taking an holistic approach to our health. I HAVE NEWS!!I'm absolutely thrilled to announce that I've been nominated for a British Podcast Award for Squarepeg - in the Rising Star category. There's also a Listeners' Choice award, so if you're enjoying the podcast I'd love it if you could vote for me. It would be amazing if Squarepeg could win something, as it will help spread the word and allow more people who need it to find the podcast.  Squarepeg is a podcast in which neurodivergent women, and trans and nonbinary people, explore navigating a neurotypical world and share their insights, challenges and successes. I hope that these conversations will be inspiring and thought provoking, open you up to new ways of thinking about being neurodivergent, and help you feel more connected to a worldwide community of people with similar experiences. I'm Amy Richards, and after being diagnosed autistic at the age of 37 I'm now on a mission to learn more about different perspectives and issues around being a neurodivergent adult in a world that feels like it doesn't quite fit.   EPISODE LINKS: Elizabeth's website: https://www.drelizabethwilliams.com/  Her Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/drevwilliams/  Vote for Squarepeg in the British Podcast Awards 2022: https://www.britishpodcastawards.com/vote If you'd like to connect or get in touch with Squarepeg, you can find me on: Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/squarepeg.community/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/squarepegautism  Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/squarepegautism/  Or on my website: https://squarepeg.community/    THANK YOU TO MY PATRONS! A HUGE thank you to my amazing patrons, who support my work on the podcast: Abi Hunter, Amy Adler, Amy-Beth Mellor, Abigail J Moore, Ben Davies, Benita Borchard-Thierbach, Caroline, Cat Preston, Catrin Green, Cindy Bailey, Corinne Cariad, Danielle Warby, Dawn Trevellion, Elizabeth Williams, Elise, Jackie Allen, Jeff Goldman, Kate Faust, Katharine Richards, Katherine Lynch, Lea Li, Leo Ricketts, Lilli Simmons, Lyb, Mandy Allen, Pete Burke, Rebecca Kemp, Sarah Cottrell, Sarah Jeffery, Sarah Swanton, Sioned Wynn, Suzanna Chen, Suzanne, Tree Hall, Una Walkenhorst, Vera Cady, Vicki Temple, Victoria Routledge and Zephyrine Craster. If you're enjoying the Squarepeg podcast and would like to help me carry on making new episodes, you can become a member of the Squarepeg community on Patreon from just £3 per month: https://www.patreon.com/squarepegpodcast 

Solgunn is a life coach from Oslo in Norway. She is 45 and was diagnosed autistic very recently, in April, following her husband's diagnosis last year. She has spent most of her working life in IT, web design, project management and consultancy, but after an unusual adverse reaction to medical treatment, which she believes is linked to her autistic physiology, she found herself suffering from ME and unable to work. She now works part time as a coach, doing as much as her energy levels allow. In our conversation we talk about: ➡ The Norwegian autism assessment process, and Norwegian culture and autism ➡ Her experiences of masking and finding her more authentic self - and a supportive neurodivergent relationship ➡ The impact of her health problems, and the link between autism and physical reactions and symptoms, and how she's learned to manage her energy She also shares a beautiful childhood memory of autistic joy that I thought sums up the untranslatable autistic experience so well. Squarepeg is a podcast in which neurodivergent women, and trans and nonbinary people, explore navigating a neurotypical world and share their insights, challenges and successes. I hope that these conversations will be inspiring and thought provoking, open you up to new ways of thinking about being neurodivergent, and help you feel more connected to a worldwide community of people with similar experiences. I'm Amy Richards, and after being diagnosed autistic at the age of 37 I'm now on a mission to learn more about different perspectives and issues around being a neurodivergent adult in a world that feels like it doesn't quite fit.   EPISODE LINKS: Solgunn's website:  https://verdiklemma.com/  Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/verdiklemma/ https://www.instagram.com/menduserikkeautistiskut/  Information about the ADOS autism test: https://www.autism.org.uk/advice-and-guidance/topics/diagnosis/diagnostic-tools/all-audiences#H2_1  Study on Oxidative Stress and Immune System Dysfunction in Autism Spectrum Disorders: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7247582/    If you'd like to connect or get in touch with Squarepeg, you can find me on: Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/squarepeg.community/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/squarepegautism  Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/squarepegautism/  Or on my website: https://squarepeg.community/    THANK YOU TO MY PATRONS! A HUGE thank you to my amazing patrons, who support my work on the podcast: Abi Hunter, Amy Adler, Amy-Beth Mellor, Abigail J Moore, Ben Davies, Benita Borchard-Thierbach, Caroline, Cat Preston, Catrin Green, Cindy Bailey, Corinne Cariad, Danielle Warby, Dawn Trevellion, Elizabeth Williams, Elise, Jackie Allen, Jeff Goldman, Kate Faust, Katharine Richards, Katherine Lynch, Lea Li, Lilli Simmons, Lyb, Mandy Allen, Pete Burke, Rebecca Kemp, Sarah Cottrell, Sarah Jeffery, Sarah Swanton, Sioned Wynn, Suzanna Chen, Suzanne, Tree Hall, Una Walkenhorst, Vera Cady, Vicki Temple and Victoria Routledge. If you're enjoying the Squarepeg podcast and would like to help me carry on making new episodes, you can become a member of the Squarepeg community on Patreon from just £3 per month: https://www.patreon.com/squarepegpodcast 

Dr Vanissar Tarakali is a Somatic and Intuitive Trauma Coach from British Columbia in Canada. She was diagnosed in 2017, when she was in her mid 50s. She describes herself as ‘a queer autistic mystic misfit', and says she loves to work with people who embody contradictions of identity and community. She has a Ph.D. in Psychology, and she offers coaching to transform trauma and sustain social change, integrating somatics, energy medicine, bodywork, neurodivergent wisdom, social justice practice and restorative yoga to heal personal, ancestral and oppression trauma. In our conversation we talk about: ➡ Being diagnosed later in life, and finding herself finally able to understand and express her own story after diagnosis ➡ The links between autism, proprioception, health and somatic trauma  ➡ Her theories around autism, energy and spirituality Squarepeg is a podcast in which neurodivergent women, and trans and nonbinary people, explore navigating a neurotypical world and share their insights, challenges and successes. I hope that these conversations will be inspiring and thought provoking, open you up to new ways of thinking about being neurodivergent, and help you feel more connected to a worldwide community of people with similar experiences. I'm Amy Richards, and after being diagnosed autistic at the age of 37 I'm now on a mission to learn more about different perspectives and issues around being a neurodivergent adult in a world that feels like it doesn't quite fit.   EPISODE LINKS: www.vanissarsomatics.com   https://www.instagram.com/vanissartarakali/  https://www.facebook.com/tarakalieducation    If you'd like to connect or get in touch with Squarepeg, you can find me on: Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/squarepeg.community/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/squarepegautism  Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/squarepegautism/  Or on my website: https://squarepeg.community/    THANK YOU TO MY PATRONS! A HUGE thank you to my amazing patrons, who support my work on the podcast: Abi Hunter, Amy Adler, Amy-Beth Mellor, Abigail J Moore, Ben Davies, Benita Borchard-Thierbach, Caroline, Cat Preston, Catrin Green, Cindy Bailey, Corinne Cariad, Danielle Warby, Dawn Trevellion, Elizabeth Williams, Elise, Jackie Allen, Jeff Goldman, Kate Faust, Katharine Richards, Katherine Lynch, Lea Li, Lilli Simmons, Lyb, Mandy Allen, Pete Burke, Rebecca Kemp, Sarah Cottrell, Sarah Jeffery, Sarah Swanton, Sioned Wynn, Suzanna Chen, Suzanne, Tree Hall, Una Walkenhorst, Vera Cady, Vicki Temple and Victoria Routledge. If you're enjoying the Squarepeg podcast and would like to help me carry on making new episodes, you can become a member of the Squarepeg community on Patreon from just £3 per month: https://www.patreon.com/squarepegpodcast 

Heather Peak is an artist who lives near Hay on Wye in the UK. She came from a working class background, and was discouraged from making a career as an artist, but decided to go to art school in Brighton where she found a place she finally felt she fit. Now 48, she has established an art practice over the past two decades that combines art, architecture, theatre and social practice. She is co-director of Studio Morison along with  Ivan Morison, creating work that is focused on human spaces and the communities that occupy them, and the ideas of escape, play, shelter and refuge. Over the past 20 years she has exhibited across the UK, including at the Tate Modern, and in Europe, Australasia, North and South America and Asia.  She self identified as autistic seven years ago, and was formally diagnosed last year. Since her diagnosis she has come to understand her art through the lens of autistic thinking and pattern-spotting – and realised that many of the people who appreciate and relate to her art are neurodivergent, too. In our conversation we talk about: ➡ Re-writing and reframing her life and art post-diagnosis ➡ The push-pull between distraction and hyperfocus ➡ Autistic joy, and the healing power of nature and animals ➡ Making art that speaks to neurodivergent audiences, pattern spotting, and using art as a medium to interpret the world and connect with others Squarepeg is a podcast in which neurodivergent women, and trans and nonbinary people, explore navigating a neurotypical world and share their insights, challenges and successes. I hope that these conversations will be inspiring and thought provoking, open you up to new ways of thinking about being neurodivergent, and help you feel more connected to a worldwide community of people with similar experiences. I'm Amy Richards, and after being diagnosed autistic at the age of 37 I'm now on a mission to learn more about different perspectives and issues around being a neurodivergent adult in a world that feels like it doesn't quite fit.   EPISODE LINKS: Heather's website: https://peakmorison.org/  Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/smallbellsring/ https://www.instagram.com/morison_studio/  The Very Public Art of Heather Peak and Ivan Morison (book): https://www.amazon.co.uk/Love-Me-Leave-Alone-Heather/dp/1908970472  Floating library of short stories: www.smallbellsring.co.uk  If you'd like to connect or get in touch with Squarepeg, you can find me on: Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/squarepeg.community/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/squarepegautism  Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/squarepegautism/  Or on my website: https://squarepeg.community/    THANK YOU TO MY PATRONS! A HUGE thank you to my amazing patrons, who support my work on the podcast: Abi Hunter, Amy Adler, Amy-Beth Mellor, Abigail J Moore, Ben Davies, Benita Borchard-Thierbach, Caroline, Cat Preston, Catrin Green, Cindy Bailey, Corinne Cariad, Danielle Warby, Dawn Trevellion, Elizabeth Williams, Elise, Jackie Allen, Jeff Goldman, Kate Faust, Katharine Richards, Katherine Lynch, Lea Li, Lilli Simmons, Lyb, Mandy Allen, Pete Burke, Rebecca Kemp, Sarah Cottrell, Sarah Jeffery, Sarah Swanton, Sioned Wynn, Suzanna Chen, Suzanne, Tree Hall, Una Walkenhorst, Vera Cady, Vicki Temple and Victoria Routledge. If you're enjoying the Squarepeg podcast and would like to help me carry on making new episodes, you can become a member of the Squarepeg community on Patreon from just £3 per month: https://www.patreon.com/squarepegpodcast 

Aishah-Nyeta is an advocate for climate, race, and disability justice from Virginia in the USA. She says she grew up feeling ‘stupid' and different from her peers due to her dyscalculia and the social challenges of her undiagnosed autism.  Now 25, she was diagnosed autistic in 2020, when she began using her Instagram account to educate her friends and community – and the wider world – about autism and her particular experience as a Black autistic woman. She recently graduated with a BA in Climate Change and Society, and hopes to bring awareness and innovation to the environmental challenges and injustices of the world. She also serves as a Gen-Z advisor for the Climate Mental Health Network, an organisation that aims to address the mental health consequences of climate change. In our conversation we talk about: ➡ Growing up hyper aware of her difference ➡ Auditory processing disorder ➡ Her difficulties sharing her autism diagnosis with her family ➡ Disability discrimination at university ➡ The intersectionality of identities, and how we can all do more to understand them I hope you'll enjoy our conversation as much as I did. Skin picking is mentioned in this episode (the proper term for this, which neither of us could remember, is dermatillomania or excoriation disorder). If you'd like more information about this condition, visit this NHS page. Squarepeg is a podcast in which neurodivergent women, and trans and nonbinary people, explore navigating a neurotypical world and share their insights, challenges and successes. I hope that these conversations will be inspiring and thought provoking, open you up to new ways of thinking about being neurodivergent, and help you feel more connected to a worldwide community of people with similar experiences. I'm Amy Richards, and after being diagnosed autistic at the age of 37 I'm now on a mission to learn more about different perspectives and issues around being a neurodivergent adult in a world that feels like it doesn't quite fit.   EPISODE LINKS: Aishah's Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/aishah_nyeta/  YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/c/AishahNyeta Website: https://www.aishahnyeta.com/ If you'd like to connect or get in touch with Squarepeg, you can find me on: Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/squarepeg.community/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/squarepegautism  Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/squarepegautism/  Or on my website: https://squarepeg.community/    THANK YOU TO MY PATRONS! A HUGE thank you to my amazing patrons, who support my work on the podcast: Abi Hunter, Amy Adler, Amy-Beth Mellor, Abigail J Moore, Ben Davies, Benita Borchard-Thierbach, Caroline, Cat Preston, Catrin Green, Cindy Bailey, Corinne Cariad, Danielle Warby, Dawn Trevellion, Elizabeth Williams, Elise, Jackie Allen, Jeff Goldman, Kate Faust, Katharine Richards, Katherine Lynch, Lea Li, Lilli Simmons, Lyb, Mandy Allen, Pete Burke, Rebecca Kemp, Sarah Cottrell, Sarah Jeffery, Sarah Swanton, Sioned Wynn, Suzanna Chen, Suzanne, Tree Hall, Una Walkenhorst, Vera Cady, Vicki Temple and Victoria Routledge. If you're enjoying the Squarepeg podcast and would like to help me carry on making new episodes, you can become a member of the Squarepeg community on Patreon from just £3 per month: https://www.patreon.com/squarepegpodcast 

Allie Mason is a talent coordinator and author from Cheltenham in the UK. She has a keen interest in sports – especially solo sports – and her children's non-fiction debut, The Autistic Guide to Adventure, is due to be published in 2023. Allie is 25 and was diagnosed autistic in 2020, whilst studying for her MA. She is currently training to rollerskate the Berlin Marathon to raise money for the charity Ambitious About Autism. In our conversation Allie and I talked about: ➡ How we shared our autism diagnoses with friends and family ➡ Why autistic people often struggle with sport and physical activity ➡ How Allie went from an unsporty child to embracing physical adventure and challenge ➡ Ableism in sport ➡ Finding the right activities and the right supports for us as autistic people. I enjoyed this conversation so much, and how looking at autism through the lens of physical activity revealed so many interesting observations about us. I hope you'll enjoy it too. Squarepeg is a podcast in which neurodivergent women, and trans and nonbinary people, explore navigating a neurotypical world and share their insights, challenges and successes. I hope that these conversations will be inspiring and thought provoking, open you up to new ways of thinking about being neurodivergent, and help you feel more connected to a worldwide community of people with similar experiences. I'm Amy Richards, and after being diagnosed autistic at the age of 37 I'm now on a mission to learn more about different perspectives and issues around being a neurodivergent adult in a world that feels like it doesn't quite fit.   EPISODE LINKS: Allie's website: www.alliewrote.com Her Instagram: www.instagram.com/alliewrote   If you'd like to connect or get in touch with Squarepeg, you can find me on: Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/squarepeg.community/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/squarepegautism  Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/squarepegautism/  Or on my website: https://squarepeg.community/    THANK YOU TO MY PATRONS! A HUGE thank you to my amazing patrons, who support my work on the podcast: Abi Hunter, Amy Adler, Amy-Beth Mellor, Abigail J Moore, Ben Davies, Benita Borchard-Thierbach, Caroline, Cat Preston, Catrin Green, Cindy Bailey, Corinne Cariad, Danielle Warby, Dawn Trevellion, Elizabeth Williams, Elise, Jackie Allen, Jason White, Jeff Goldman, Kate Faust, Katharine Richards, Katherine Lynch, Lea Li, Lilli Simmons, Lyb, Mandy Allen, Pete Burke, Rebecca Kemp, Sarah Cottrell, Sarah Jeffery, Sarah Swanton, Sioned Wynn, Suzanna Chen, Suzanne, Tree Hall, Una Walkenhorst, Vera Cady, Vicki Temple and Victoria Routledge. If you're enjoying the Squarepeg podcast and would like to help me carry on making new episodes, you can become a member of the Squarepeg community on Patreon from just £3 per month: https://www.patreon.com/squarepegpodcast 

Amy Lee Lillard is co-host of a feminist book podcast, and also an author; her first book, Dig Me Out, a collection of short stories, was published in 2021.  Now 44, she lives in Des Moines, Iowa in the USA and was diagnosed autistic just last year. She wrote her book before she was aware of her autism, and found afterwards that she had essentially written a collection of autistic characters, without intending to. She says: “I write about the intersections of gender, sexuality and the patriarchy, and how it makes rage the only logical option. Once I understood myself to be autistic, I better understood this anger.” She is childfree and queer, and was the first person in her working class family to graduate college. In our conversation we talk about: ➡ Upbringing, social class, generational undiagnosed autism and their impact on how we see and experience difference and disability ➡ Autism and memory, dissociation and trauma ➡ How autism, sexuality and gender interplay ➡ Being childfree ➡ Shame and internalised judgement ➡ Writing for self expression and self understanding Squarepeg is a podcast in which neurodivergent women, and trans and nonbinary people, explore navigating a neurotypical world and share their insights, challenges and successes. I hope that these conversations will be inspiring and thought provoking, open you up to new ways of thinking about being neurodivergent, and help you feel more connected to a worldwide community of people with similar experiences. I'm Amy Richards, and after being diagnosed autistic at the age of 37 I'm now on a mission to learn more about different perspectives and issues around being a neurodivergent adult in a world that feels like it doesn't quite fit.   EPISODE LINKS: Amy's website - www.amyleelillard.com Her podcast: www.broadsandbooks.com  Her Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/amyleelillard/   If you'd like to connect or get in touch with Squarepeg, you can find me on: Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/squarepeg.community/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/squarepegautism  Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/squarepegautism/  Or on my website: https://squarepeg.community/    THANK YOU TO MY PATRONS! A HUGE thank you to my amazing patrons, who support my work on the podcast: Abi Hunter, Amy Adler, Amy-Beth Mellor, Abigail J Moore, Ben Davies, Benita Borchard-Thierbach, Caroline, Cat Preston, Catrin Green, Cindy Bailey, Corinne Cariad, Danielle Warby, Dawn Trevellion, Elizabeth Williams, Elise, Jackie Allen, Jason White, Jeff Goldman, Kate Faust, Katharine Richards, Katherine Lynch, Lea Li, Lilli Simmons, Lyb, Mandy Allen, Pete Burke, Rebecca Kemp, Sarah Cottrell, Sarah Jeffery, Sarah Swanton, Sioned Wynn, Suzanna Chen, Suzanne, Tree Hall, Una Walkenhorst, Vera Cady, Vicki Temple and Victoria Routledge. If you're enjoying the Squarepeg podcast and would like to help me carry on making new episodes, you can become a member of the Squarepeg community on Patreon from just £3 per month: https://www.patreon.com/squarepegpodcast 

Do you know what you're doing is not the right fit for you?  But you're afraid to leave?  Sarah Cottrell, founder of Former Lawyer, shares:     - How she paid off her student loans and left the practice of law. - How she had a dream to build her business for 8 years, and why she finally did it.   - How narcissism is built into workplaces, and how you can spot and leave a toxic work environment. Connect with Sarah at formerlawyer.com. 

I talk a lot on this show and in workshops and on other people's podcasts about the impact of podcasting on a business, but what does that look like for somebody who's not selling podcasts, who's quite frankly not even necessarily selling a business service?   That's why I wanted to bring on Sarah of The Former Lawyer Podcast today because Sarah does a really, really, really incredible job of supporting lawyers on her show.   Today, she's going to be talking about why she started her podcast and the results that podcast has had in her business over the last couple of years.   See the transcript at uncommonlymore.com/sarah-cottrell

This week's episode features Sarah Cottrell, AKA the "Former Lawyer". Sarah worked in Biglaw for a decade and found herself in the same position so many of us see ourselves in: hating our job and desiring more. Key Takeaways from this episode: Start somewhere. Let go of the fear of what others may think. You are always allowed to pave your own path.  

This episode titled, Why Women Are Leaving the Law with Former Lawyer Sarah Cottrell, is hosted by NAWL member, Caryn Boisen who is a partner with Larson King in St. Paul, Minnesota. Caryn is joined by Sarah Cottrell, founder of Former Lawyer LLC, host of The Former Lawyer Podcast, and a Career Coach & Lawyer Mental Health Advocate. Their conversation today focuses on the Great Resignation, why women are leaving the law, and what steps attorneys can take to prioritize their own mental health and better their careers.  

I am willing to bet that all lawyers have, at some point, gone through an internal crisis of whether they should really stay in the law. And many times, most times, we stay in the law because we don't know what else to do. We just feel like this is what we're supposed to do. It feels scary even thinking about making a change when you have all the things that people say you should have: a good income, a roof over your head, some prestige, perhaps. While your feelings take a backseat because that is also what you're supposed to do. That is why I am so excited to have Sarah Cottrell, former lawyer and founder of the the FormerLawyer.com, talks about how leaving the law may take courage but you don't have to do it alone. She really gets deep into what it really looks like to leave without leaving all those years of experience and reputation behind. Show notes: Visit Sarah's website here: https://www.formerlawyer.com/

You aren't your job, and you deserve to be treated like a human at your work, even if you're your own boss! Sarah Cottrell of Former Lawyer drops by to remind us of these important truths about late-stage capitalism. She also shares lessons she's learned from her long-running podcast, and Carly's got a super nifty dual screen tool for not-tool-time. Listen in and then do some self-care. Email us: freelancerwatercooler@gmail.com Sarah Cottrell, FormerLawyer: formerlawyer.com Equal Justice Initiative Just Mercy by Bryan Stevenson Ansley Fones: ansleyfones.com WordPress Crash Course: ansleyfones.com/webinar Carly Crawford: carlydoesbooks.com Caroline Fourmy: carolinefourmy.com WPEngine affiliate link: ansleyfones.com/wpengine Sidetrak Monitor

Today, you're going to hear from 4 other business owners who have also found that slowing down has helped them operationalize their values in their businesses. You'll hear from Sarah Cottrell, the founder of Former Lawyer, Gracy Obuchowicz, a self-care consultant for companies & organizations, Yvette Ramos-Volz, a glass artist & aromatherapist, and Jennie Morris, the founder of Vegology. Each one is finding ways to create the necessary space to check in with their core values before making decisions about their business—big or small. By slowing down, they make their values a core operational consideration, instead of merely good copy on a website. The post EP 360: Slowing Down To Make Sustainable Choices appeared first on What Works.

For those who may be new, Former Lawyer is run by me, Sarah Cottrell. Through my work with Former Lawyer, I help those that are trying to transition from a legal career and into something that's really meaningful for them. This is part two of the story of my journey transitioning from a legal career and into starting Former Lawyer, as interviewed by Jessica Medina. See Show notes at formerlawyer.com/101

I never really grew up cursing, although I had my moments in high school and college. I could never really string together a solid sequence of curse words to make it even sound effective. As fathers, we know that profanity is all around our children. In fact, you may even curse in your home. This could even be around your children or in private. What's your stance about profanity in the home? Is it restricted or its now a big deal? Listen to a perspective on profanity in the home. You may agree, have questions, or think I am completely off base. Listen. Share. Lend your thoughts. Enjoy. Credits: -- Should we f***king swear around our kids? Parenting experts weigh in by Arti Patel of Global News -- What Science Says About Parents Who Swear Around Their Kids, Can it really be as bad as we think it is? by Sarah Cottrell; 3/16/2019 -- Music interlude by Pete Rock, 'For The People' --- This episode is sponsored by · Anchor: The easiest way to make a podcast. https://anchor.fm/app Support this podcast: https://anchor.fm/nos4dads/support

Sarah Cottrell is my podcasting soul sister. She is a former big law litigation associate who, after 10 years of practice in various forms and paying off her law school loans, moved into the work she'd been wanting to do for years. She launched the Former Lawyer Podcast in August 2019 (within a week of this podcast's launch!) and now also runs the Former Lawyer Collaborative. In today's episode we discuss: Sarah and I geek out on our shared brain So many of us are under-educated on the realities of being a lawyer In applying to smaller firms, Sarah realized she didn't want those jobs either Sarah's anxiety disorder made her a great lawyer, in many ways, but also made the law a particularly bad fit  Sarah left big law and took a job making 1/6th what she made Eventually, Sarah went on to become an appellate court staff attorney This was the best legal job she could have had, so it made it extra clear she didn't want to practice at all Sarah and her husband had a long-term plan for her to leave the law completely, after paying off their loans Sarah explored her interests in the name of figuring out who she was, if not specifically for figuring out her next career Side hustles work for some people, not everyone Sarah left her job to start the podcast and business that had been in her head for years Sarah also runs the Former Lawyer Collaborative, a confidential community supporting lawyers moving into new careers Illegal Design Facebook Group: https://www.facebook.com/groups/illegaldesign Former Lawyer Website: https://www.formerlawyer.com/

In today's episode, we help Sarah sell without being too salesy or spammy. FULL TRANSCRIPT Jocelyn Sams: Hey y'all, on today's podcast we help Sarah sell without being too salesy or spammy. Shane Sams: Welcome to the Flipped Lifestyle Podcast, where life always comes before work. We're your hosts, Shane and Jocelyn Sams. We're a real family that figured out how to make our entire living online, and now, we help other families do the same. Are you ready to flip your life? All right, let's get started. Shane Sams: What's going on everybody? Welcome back to the Flipped Lifestyle Podcast. It is so great to be with you today. Wherever you're listening to the show, thank you for listening. We're really excited to welcome another member of the Flip Your Life community onto the show, so that we can help them overcome fears, breakthrough obstacles and take action on the next steps in their online business. Our guest today is Flip Your Life community member, Sarah Cottrell. Sarah, welcome to the show. Sarah Cottrell: Hi, thanks so much for having me. Jocelyn Sams: Welcome Sarah, I'm actually sensing a little theme here in the podcast. If you listened a couple weeks ago, we had another attorney on, and Sarah of course is an attorney. Tell us a little bit about you, your background and your online business. Sarah Cottrell: Well, so I worked as a lawyer for the last decade. I graduated from law school in 2008, and last summer, after the last of our kids was born, I left my legal job to stay home with them. My path through being a lawyer was a pretty common story. This is true for a lot of lawyers, which is that I started practicing, and pretty early on realized it was not for me in the longterm. However, we had a lot of student loan debt, and I say we because my husband is also a lawyer. We actually met in law school and combined between the two of us, we had over $400,000. Jocelyn Sams: Ouch! Shane Sams: Oh my God. That is a lot of scary mountainous debt, especially when you're like, "I'm not going to use this degree anymore," right? Sarah Cottrell: Yeah. It's basically like you have a mortgage, except there's no asset associated with it other than your own blood, sweat and tears. Shane Sams: Wow, that's unbelievable. Are you still in debt? Sarah Cottrell: No, we paid off all of our debt last June, so June of 2018. Shane Sams: Well done, congratulations. Sarah Cottrell: Thank you. Shane Sams: I can't even imagine having that much debt coming out of college. Jocelyn Sams: What a weight lifted, oh my goodness. Sarah Cottrell: Yes. I was about two years in to practicing when I realized, "This is just not for me in the longterm." When you have over $400,000 in debt, you can't just chalk it all and leave. We had to make a plan to get out, and it had to be a longterm plan. You know a lot of personal finance guru types will say, "Do all these things and cut everything down, and then pay off your debt in like 5 months and then you'll be great." Well, when you have a mortgage size level of debt, you have to have a little bit of a longer term plan that is survivable for five or 10 years in my case. That's what we did. Sarah Cottrell: We made a plan and got out of debt, and that enabled us to be in a position where I was able to stay home with our kids. I also have started doing some writing on the side, which is something that I've always been interested in. With a full-time job and young kids, especially a job that was a lot of research and writing, not a lot of time for writing. Shane Sams: Well for one thing, what's crazy when you were telling your story I was like, "How was 2008 over 10 years ago?" I saw this thing on Facebook the other day, and it was like, people of a certain age you always think the 70s are 30 years ago. I do think that. I'm like, when was 1970? What, 30 years ago? When was 1980? What, 20 years ago? Really, 1980 was like almost 40 years ago and it doesn't seem like that in my brain. Sarah Cottrell: Oh yeah. Shane Sams: When you said, 2008, I was like, how was that 10 years ago for one thing. Then getting out of debt in that short amount, that actually is a short amount of time to me to get out of $400,000 in debt. That's crazy that you did that. That's one of the things that hang people up that we always find coming into the community, is like, "Well, you know I got this college degree. Then I was in this career, and I've got so much time invested in this career, that I just don't want to pivot." I'm like kudos for you for having the guts to say, "Yeah, I'm not going any further. Two years is enough, even though I've invested all of this, I'll figure out how to use this later in my life." Sarah Cottrell: Yeah. Well, and I think for lawyers in particular, you are trained to be extremely risk averse. What you're talking about the sunk costs fallacy that I have all this money and time invested into it, so I can't leave, that's a very strong, mental obstacle for many lawyers. Shane Sams: For sure. Sarah Cottrell: For us, I mean I'm two years in I'm thinking, "I don't want to be a lawyer forever," but I still worked as a lawyer for another eight years. Shane Sams: You had an end game in mind. Sarah Cottrell: Exactly. Shane Sams: That's institutionalized though in almost all businesses and industries. The day I resigned from my job, I slid the letter of resignation over to my principal and he looks at me and he goes, "Man, are you sure?" I'm like, "Oh yeah, I'm 100% positive." Then he goes, he's like, "But how long have you been teaching?" I was like, I said, "Nine years I'm going on my tenth year." He goes, "Nine years, and you're just going to throw all that away? You're just going to throw all that retirement away?" I looked at him and I was like, "Yeah, but there's 18 left before I can retire. I'm not just going to sit here for 18 more years." Sarah Cottrell: Exactly. Jocelyn Sams: Just because we put nine years in, I mean. Shane Sams: Yeah, I don't care how much time I've got put in it, I've got the rest of my life to live. Anybody listening out there, you know Jocelyn and I full degrees, masters degrees, all this education. Taught for almost a decade, we bailed, because we wanted to go a different direction. Sarah was a lawyer, she didn't want to be. $400,000 invested in her education, and decided to do something different. Jocelyn Sams: Well, and I'll tell you, I was looking yesterday because I have one pesky student loan left, and it doesn't have a large balance, but we have one left. Shane Sams: The reason is, I'll tell you why we keep that loan, this is so morbid. If you die, those go away. Sarah Cottrell: I feel you, yes. Shane Sams: We're like, we could pay it off early, or we could just use it as a reverse insurance policy if something ever happens. Totally morbid logic for why we still have the student loan. Jocelyn Sams: Well I was looking yesterday just to see how much was... Jocelyn Sams: Not that much left on it, but anyway, that loan is for an MBA that I never finished. To this day I am paying every month, it just comes out automatically whatever, I pay every month for a degree I didn't even get. You know what, it's part of my life experience. It's part of the reason that I am the person I am today. I don't have any regrets. I'm not sitting here every month going, "Oh you know I'm still paying for this degree that I don't even have." I don't even think about it. It's just part of my life, it's something I did. Jocelyn Sams: Somebody, is it Dave Ramsey that calls it the stupid tax? It's a stupid tax, we've paid a lot of stupid tax in our life. Shane Sams: We've paid a whole lot of stupid tax in our lives. It's all part of the story and it gets you to where you're supposed to be at. Sarah Cottrell: Exactly, yes. I mean to me, and this is part of why I created Former Lawyer, just because you put a lot of time and money into something, if it's not working for you, to say, "Well I'm just going to keep doing it for another one, two, three, maybe even four decades," is actually crazy. Especially because lawyers are so risk averse, it's very hard to get over that hurdle and say, "I'm going to spend the next five years getting myself out of this situation into a better situation, even though ultimately that's what's going to be better for you in the long run." Jocelyn Sams: Okay, so you mentioned just there in passing what it is that you're doing now. You left your job and you started a website. Tell us a little bit about that. Sarah Cottrell: The site is called formerlawyer.com, and the purpose or the overall purpose of Former Lawyer is to provide support and inspiration to unhappy lawyers, who want to make a career change. Right now what that looks like is, there's a blog. There's a podcast I'm actually starting to record episodes this week. What I'll be doing is, in each episode I'm going to be interviewing a lawyer, a former lawyer, someone who used to work as a lawyer and now works in some sort of other career. Sarah Cottrell: My goal is also to have some membership component, but that's the piece that I am still working on. The other pieces I have a little bit more clarity. Shane Sams: For one thing, that's an amazing domain name formerlawyer.com. That's a masterclass in naming your business, because it's helped everything about what it is. Like the Former Lawyer Podcast, the Former Lawyer blog, formerlawyer.com. It's just so tight and good and it's a two word domain. Jocelyn Sams: That two word .com, like that is almost impossible to come by. Shane Sams: That is an awesome domain name and a name for your business. It's when you say it out loud, I can envision it like a miserable lawyer is driving to court to represent some dude or a lady in a divorce, that he just doesn't even want to be in court that day. He's listening to your podcast, interviewing someone who broke out of the prison. He hears that, and she hears that, and it's like hope. I could totally do that. Shane Sams: You said something interesting in your intake form that you filled out before you were on the podcast. "I don't see myself as a guru that tells people, "Do this," and end up where I am. This is more of just a John Lee Dumas model where you're not claiming to be the guru. You're just interviewing people who have done this and giving people ideas, and pushing them out that way. Is that what I'm getting from that? I'm I hearing that correctly? Sarah Cottrell: Yes. Part of that is, every person's issues are so individualized. There are strengths, there are financial situation, whether they have a spouse or don't have a spouse or a significant other. There are just so many things that impact when you're making a plan for example to get out of debt, how long it will take. What it is that you actually want to do, and so there are some people out there who are former lawyers, who do specifically career coaching, where they're telling someone like, "Here's what you need to do. This is the job that you should be looking for," and those sorts of things. Sarah Cottrell: What I see as a need is, less so the, "Here let me tell you exactly what you specific person should be doing." More this idea of, it can feel really lonely. One, because you're like, "I'm I the only crazy person who doesn't actually want to be a lawyer? Is thinking about walking away from this thing that I put all this money and time into?" Also, it can feel like a lot of... My family and friends who are like, "What are you doing? You're throwing away this thing that they perceive as though great, because they don't necessarily understand all of the drawbacks of what it is to work as a lawyer. Shane Sams: For sure. Sarah Cottrell: Then also it's just the length of time. I mean, again, we're not necessarily talking about someone saying, "I want to get out," and they do three months and they're out. We're talking about sometimes two, three, four, five, 10 years. That's a long time to be doing something on your own without other people saying, "Hey, you're doing great, you're going to get out. Keep going." Shane Sams: Sure. I think that's really good, that's really, really good. It just fits the motif of the Former Lawyer. People will look at you like, what was the guy's name? What was Morgan Freeman's character's name? Gosh from Shawshank Redemption? Somebody go send me that on Facebook message. Oh Andy Dufresne. It's like you're Andy Dufresne, you got out. You got out of the prison, you're in Mexico on the beach. It's like whatever. You're the other side of where they want to be, like the story. We always say instant street cred, you did it once, you don't have to do it more than that, right? To be this expert that can actually present this story, and then show other stories of other people who've made it. That's awesome. Shane Sams: You've got a lot going on. You've got a lot of stuff that you've created, and you're already creating content. How many blog posts do you have on formerlawyer.com? Sarah Cottrell: I think that there are about, I want to say eight or nine currently. Shane Sams: Good. Sarah Cottrell: I have stuff scheduled to post three times a week. I'm currently only batching like for a week ahead. Shane Sams: This is still in the beginning of everything, right, it's all been created? Sarah Cottrell: Oh yeah, like June, it all launched in June. Shane Sams: When did you buy that domain name? Sarah Cottrell: Oh years ago. I mean before I even knew when I was going to be getting out of the law. Shane Sams: Give me an estimate of when you bought that. Sarah Cottrell: It was three to five years ago. Shane Sams: All of you people sitting on your old dusty domains that you bought five years ago, dust them off and get to work. You all get some blog posts going, it's time to start building that online business. Jocelyn Sams: Okay, so you started working on content. First of all three times a week is very ambitious, and I applaud you for trying to do it. I don't know that it's 100% necessary, like it might take some pressure off you for now just to schedule the post out for like once a week. Shane Sams: Yeah. I would not go... Sarah Cottrell: Okay, sorry. Shane Sams: Be prolific with your promotion, not necessarily your content in the beginning. We have three rules, like one, be consistent with your content, for us that's a weekly podcast. Could be more, could be less, but we're going to have a podcast. Two, be prolific with your promotion, that's like sharing and ads and things like that. Write one post and promote it for seven days, then write another post. Then relentlessly sell, like sell every day to your list. Sell everyday on your social media. Sell every time somebody asks you a question, because everybody's only one question away from giving you money. Shane Sams: Think of it that way like when you're thinking about being consistent and being prolific, especially in the beginning. Like Jocelyn said, you can burn yourself out really fast, and we don't want you to be formerblogger.com in about six weeks. Sarah Cottrell: I think one of the reasons that I have been so prolific with content since starting not that long ago, it goes back to one of the concerns that I have of, I want to feel like I'm providing value. It's this issue in my mind of, oh well I need to show that I have something to provide. Therefore, I think I've been focusing more on the content creation, because I don't want to feel like I'm selling nothing. Does that make sense? Shane Sams: It does for sure, and that's why we're going to talk about this here in a few minutes when we get to your business question. I don't hear a lot of talking about what you're selling, what the product is. I was reading a book this morning. I've got this book on leadership and it said, let me word this correctly. "Our society loves the sound of hammers." We love the sound of the hammer and the nail and the building of things, but nobody likes to make a plan. Shane Sams: That's the thing is, you can have a pile of wood, a box of nails and a truck load of hammers. You can throw the workers out there, and you can say, "Go start hammering," see what happens and nothing will happen. It'll just be a bunch of wood hammered together, but if someone walks in and goes, "Here's the blueprint, this is the finished product. This is what we're selling. We have six weeks to put it together, let's go." That's going to create something. It's not necessarily just, "I'm going to write a blog, I'm going to start a podcast. I'm going to have a Facebook page. I started an Instagram last night. I bought-" Jocelyn Sams: "Maybe something cool will happen." Shane Sams: "Maybe something cool will happen, I'll get some value out there and people will love me." Even if you became the most popular person on earth, you would still have nothing to show for it, because there would be no product, nothing for sale. We always recommend that people start with a product first mindset, and figure out at least the basics of what it's going to look like on the end. Then it will evolve into what your customers want as you talk to them and get them. Shane Sams: You're probably just swinging a lot of hammers right now, and that's why it feels like, you're trying to get busy instead of start building a business. Jocelyn Sams: I'm going to make a little bit of an assumption here based on some of the information that you put in your form and also what I'm hearing from you. I'm assuming that you do not really want to make a type of product that basically tells people their next steps, I'm I right in that? Shane Sams: Or like what their job is or something like that? Sarah Cottrell: Yes. What I envision is something more like this. Okay, membership community where you can come in and talk with other people who are in similar stages. I actually, I'm in a writing membership, and one of the things that they do is facilitate people, forming smaller affinity groups. Say, people who are in a certain city and are looking to get out of the law. Or people who want to leave and be a stay at home parent. People who, I don't know, are getting ready to quit their job in the next twelve months, whatever. Facilitating things like that. Sarah Cottrell: Then also in terms of the podcast content, there are some questions that I'm planning to ask our guests that might be a little bit more like things they don't necessarily want, just blasting out into the entire universe. That would be stuff that would be available within the membership to members only. Shane Sams: A private place to share their concerns, not with everybody around them kind of deal. Sarah Cottrell: Yes. Just the general, "I'm new and I'm trying to make a plan. What have you done people who might be in a similar situation?" The other thing is, many, many, many people who are lawyers and want to get out, have not thought about what else they want to do ever. Shane Sams: True. Sarah Cottrell: I know so many people who hit this point of, "I don't want to be doing this anymore," and they are just like, "I don't even know what's out there." Shane Sams: It's like a pro athlete that gets too old to pay, they don't know what's next. This is all they've ever done kind of deal. Sarah Cottrell: Yes, exactly. Shane Sams: Well let me jump in here really quick, because there's two things I'm hearing. I'm actually going to read this question you wrote in your form instead of let you do it, because I hear this is happening. Sarah Cottrell: Okay. Shane Sams: We have a question in our form that says, "What fears, mindset and obstacles are holding you back?" You say, "I don't want to be spammy, I don't want to be salesmany or seem like I'm trying to sell people something unrealistic." I hear a dramatic fear of commitment to your product, because you don't want to go sell something to somebody. I really feel like this might be like a major issue holding you back. When I'm looking through everything you've done, you've done everything but address. You've thought about the product or the membership, but it just sounds like with all of your questions and everything, like you're scared to sell these lawyers' something. Shane Sams: Is it because you feel it's like you're selling a dream to them, or you're selling hope to them? What is this fear of maybe even selling yourself a little bit, that you have that's keeping you from saying, "Hey, this is the product, I know people will join it. Let me write a sales page for this right now,"? What is that? This is a membership. Right now I don't hear a lot of content, so it's almost this could be opened next week if you really wanted to. Something's keeping you from doing that. Sarah Cottrell: Yes. I think the primary thing is, well they're two things. One is the more, I don't know, high level meta thing, which is that I feel like many lawyers were sold a certain line of what their life is going to be like. Then they got into the law, and that wasn't accurate for them. And, I do not want to. Well I know there's a lot of value in what I'm wanting to provide. I do not want people to feel like I'm saying, "Join this membership and everything in your life will magically become better. You will be just like me and you will be able to leave the law." Shane Sams: What you really don't want is, you were sold that lie, and you resent the lie that you were sold. You don't want to be resented by someone else the way you resent being a lawyer. Sarah Cottrell: Yes. I don't want to prey on people's desperation to get out of the law. Shane Sams: You're not. You're not doing that, that's not true. You're not doing that. Sarah Cottrell: That is accurate. Shane Sams: You're wanting to help people, so that's the truth. Now, you can't help that the fact is they are desperate. They are desperate for a career change, they are desperate to get out. They are desperately in debt and might need someone to show them how to handle that. It's not your fault that they're desperate, it's a fact that they're desperate. The truth is, you want to help them and show them that there is another way. The truth and the facts are not aligning with your actions here. They're not. Shane Sams: Now your feelings, one thing you said, you said the four letter word. In our house, whenever we start a sentence with, "I feel like," we go like, "Conversation stops right there, hold on. What do you mean you feel like? Is that real? Is it factual? Is that the truth?" Facts don't care about our feelings. This seems like the major mindset issue here that you're struggling with is, you feel and you've told yourself this story. You don't want the end of the story to be someone's mad at you, but that does not match the facts and the truth of the matter that your intentions are good. They are desperate and need help, and you can help them. Jocelyn Sams: This is something that goes through my mind at times also, just by the nature of what we do. There are a lot of people out there who are selling the dream. If you pay me $1,000, I will help you buy a Lamborghini. Shane Sams: For $997, all your dreams will come true, end of the webinar, here we go. Jocelyn Sams: There are a lot of people out there who are selling that kind of dream. A lot of people out there might look at what we do and say, "Well you know you're just doing the same thing." Our truth is that, we want to help people who feel like there is no other way and they need to do something different in their life. We're here honestly to help people. It's just something that you have to reconcile with yourself, just I'm here to help people. If other people want to perceive it another way, that's their problem. It's not my problem. Shane Sams: What's that counselor friend you've got that says, what does she always say Jocelyn it's... Jocelyn Sams: Heather Gray? Shane Sams: Yeah. What's Heather say, what's the story or the... Jocelyn Sams: It's like the stories that you tell yourself. One of the things that she says to do is to say, "Some people might say this. What I want you to know is something else." Shane Sams: Right, so you said, some people might say, "I'm just preying on the desperation of lawyers who want to quit their job." Jocelyn Sams: What I want you to know is that, I felt this way. Shane Sams: I really want to help you. Jocelyn Sams: The reason that I'm doing this is because I want to help other people in the same situation. Sarah Cottrell: Yes, 100%. Shane Sams: You've got to reconcile that today. We're recording this guys, it's the fourth of July. It's the fourth of July right now you all. Jocelyn Sams: It's a holiday. Shane Sams: It's a holiday, but we're working, we're helping Sarah. We're getting after here. Listen, it's the day of freedom, so set yourself free. Be free of all that nonsense, because it is not true. You honestly, this is heavy, you may be the only person that possibly can help them. If you don't help them, then nobody else is going to say this stuff, because 99.9% of people don't want to let their family down. They don't want to quit the job. You're a doctor, a lawyer, your successful right? Shane Sams: If they don't have a trailblazer to say, "I did it. I'm going to introduce you every week to somebody else who did it," they may never hear that story that inspires hope, that gives them a chance to change their life. That's what we do and that's what you're doing. You're just doing for a different segment of the population. Okay? Sarah Cottrell: Okay. Jocelyn Sams: All right Sarah, we're busting through the mindset issues. Now let's talk about how we are going to make some money. How can we help you with your offer? Sarah Cottrell: Basically, I'm trying to figure out how to prioritize content creation and what I'm creating, when to start selling the membership or product. How to do a beta launch if that's what I should be doing, and how to price it. Basically, all the questions. Jocelyn Sams: Okay. Shane Sams: Basically, you're like, "I'm making blogs, I don't know what else to do." Is that what you're saying? Jocelyn Sams: We're here until the fireworks tonight in other words. Okay. All right, so let's just break this down. I think that Shane and I have some different ideas. It's going to become interesting moving forward about what we think you should do. Ultimately it's about what you want to do. Take all this in and just think about it. Basically, right now we have nothing for sale right? Sarah Cottrell: That is correct. Jocelyn Sams: Okay. Shane Sams: You want to sell a support group for these attorneys basically? Sarah Cottrell: Yes. Shane Sams: It doesn't seem like you want to create anything, you just want to have them to have a place to go. Is that true? Sarah Cottrell: Yes. Shane Sams: Okay. I don't know. I think there's an asprin versus vitamin argument here a little bit, or like asprin or something we have to think about. One, I'm not sure how practical that is in my opinion, because to me it's like, it's a support group. You're alone, you want to talk to other lawyers who might want to quit their jobs, that's kind of a vitamin. There's a lot of serious headaches like, "Well how do I get out of $400,000 in debt? How do I re-identify myself as something else?" That's an asprin. Jocelyn Sams: "How do I talk to my family about why I'm doing this?" Shane Sams: Yeah, there's a lot of huge obstacles that you're going to have to solve for people like headaches. That you're going to have to provide them an asprin for, before you ever get to the vitamin. Usually the vitamin almost goes first, you know what I'm saying? The vitamins are free, the asprin cost money. If I've got a headache, I'm going to get up at midnight and run to Walmart to get some asprin, because I need to fix this headache, it hurts. If I wake up at midnight and I forgot to take my vitamin C, guess what, I'm not going to Walmart till tomorrow, it's not urgent. That's what we say when we say, is this an asprin or is this a vitamin? Shane Sams: Now I think at face value, it's a vitamin. It's like, is it really that urgent that I join this community? They might listen to your podcast, they might read your blog posts. Are they really going to go the next level if there's nothing in it to them to solve their actual practical problems that they have? Does that make sense? Sarah Cottrell: Yes. Shane Sams: What we've got to figure out are some different ways that we can highlight the headache and make this thing where they're willing to get up out of bed, go to the computer. Get out their wallet and order the bottle of asprin. Jocelyn Sams: Okay, but before we go there, I want to present a possible other solution. Usually we will fall on the side of creating your own product and selling it. That we like that, is because that is what we have always done. However, I do think that there are some other ways, especially with things that are like this vitaminy. Where you can make money and it's a little bit less work. I just want to throw this out there and then we can talk about which way is more appealing to you. Jocelyn Sams: Basically, what I hear Shane saying is, that what you could do is address some of the hard issues that are facing people who want to get out of this field. I think what he's trying to say is that, you could create some content that would help people with these big headaches, right? Shane Sams: In a way. I think that's the draw into the membership. I think the membership is good, but I almost think that the membership itself should be totally free. It should be almost like a thing that they could sign up for and start connecting with these other attorneys, with these other lawyers. Basically, it's your lead magnet, like the forum itself, the community itself, whatever it looks like, is something you could just let listeners in. If you've got a podcast, if you've got the thing at the end of it, you say, "Hey, come join the Former Lawyer community. This is a private community that we can let people in," and have that private support group ready to go. It can be like an opt-in. Shane Sams: I know a lot of places that use forums or a community driven approach to their lead magnets. It's a place where you can go hung out. There's no barrier to entry, low hanging fruit, all that stuff. Then I was thinking in the community on your email list, you could create content that just showed how you did it. One of the things you said that really stood out to me before was, "Hey, everybody else needs other places they can pivot, they can quit their job, they can go a different direction. For a lawyer, it's a longterm plan." Shane Sams: You're not selling a, "I'll get you out of your law debt and fix careers in six months." It's, "Yo! If you want the fast plan, go somewhere else. This is the longterm plan." Then inside of that you show them content that addresses this things. You have a course called how to tell your friends and family. You have a course called how to pay off your student loan debt without being a lawyer for the next 40 years of your life. That content then is what you sell almost like an advanced tier. These people are all lawyers who are dreaming, interacting together, but then the content is led by you, and it's the lawyers who are actually taking action. You're the 20%, you're the people that are actually taking action. You're going to do it, and then maybe you do Q and As each month. That was what I was thinking. Jocelyn Sams: Okay, so that's probably the way that we would do it just based on our history, and because creating content is fairly easy for us to do. Another way that popped into my head to do this, might be to... I was also on board with the free community, because in the age of social media, it's really easy to find groups of people who have something in common basically. I can go on to Facebook, I can go on to LinkedIn, I can look at these groups and find people who are probably similar to me. Jocelyn Sams: With you having the podcast, I think that's a really good vehicle for you to be able to do some other things. I think about one of the podcasts that I support. I've talked about several times on the podcast that I listen to a lot of true crime podcasts and other types of media. Anyway, one of the podcasts that I support is Crime Junky, which is one of the top 10 podcast in the world right now. The reason that I support them, it's not something that I really need. It's definitely a vitamin in my life, it's not an asprin. They will create extra content for their fan club, so I joined their fan club because I love their podcast so much and I want to hear more content. I think that could be an opportunity for you. Jocelyn Sams: I think also selling affiliate products might be an opportunity for you. If you don't want to go and create all these courses, create this amazing community for people to come to and either take on sponsorships for your show of things that might be of interest to people who are leaving the law profession. Or, you could also find courses that other people have created for these same things, and be an affiliate for them. Shane Sams: Yeah, or she could even sell like other biz op stuff. There's a lot of people out there selling how to start a business, like ClickFunnels they do a lot of stuff like that. How to come up with your idea, how to set up your sales pages. They have an affiliate program to get people to sign up for ClickFunnels. There's other places that teach real estate like Bigger Pockets. They have an affiliate program I think for their stuff, where it's like learn how to do real estate instead of be a lawyer. You could promote that stuff on your podcast. Jocelyn Sams: There's probably courses out there, how to get out of enormous amounts of student loan debt. You could be an affiliate for that type of program. Shane Sams: Let's build an audience. I would only pick stuff that was high ticketed back if that was true though, because you're going to need any affiliate sales to make a lot of money. You know what I'm saying? Every time it happens, because it'll be the normal. Jocelyn Sams: Yeah, so let's go through some of the benefits. The benefits of having your own stuff obviously is that you get all the profit, I mean minus cost of course. Also, it is under your control, nothing's going to change all that kind of stuff. The drawback's is that it's going to take time, it's going to take energy, it's going to take effort. With the affiliate stuff, it's just the opposite, like the benefits is that it's already completed for you. You just sell it, but the drawback is that... Shane Sams: You have to build a huge audience to make affiliates work. You've got to have a good lead capture, but that could work though because of the forums. Jocelyn Sams: You don't have complete control. There are some different things that you have to consider for each side. I just want to throw that out there, it's not something that we recommend for all people. I think in this case, it might possibly work. Shane Sams: Well there's a lot of lawyers that probably hate being a lawyer. How many lawyers are there? Can you build a big enough audience of lawyers who hate their jobs to build an affiliate thing? I don't know. How many lawyers are there in the country? I'm going to look that up. Sarah Cottrell: I would have to go back and look at the data. I mean I think every year, I don't want to say a wrong number, because I'm just not completely sure. Shane Sams: Don't worry, I'm looking it up on Google. Sarah Cottrell: We're talking like... Shane Sams: We have the sum of all human knowledge at our fingertips here. At this time... Sarah Cottrell: The magic of Google. Shane Sams: All right, there are 450,000 lawyers right now practicing in the United States. There are 34,000 new ones every year. Let's just assume that half of those hate their job. Sarah Cottrell: Accurate. Shane Sams: Yes, so you've probably got 200. You've got an audience size of somewhere between 200 and 300,000 people to go out there and put this out there to your podcast. Then it's just a matter of converting those, either end with affiliate sales or whatever. Jocelyn, couldn't she do the affiliate sales inside of the community, like instead of her creating this stuff? On the podcast say, "Hey, come join the Former Lawyer community if you want to learn how to leave the law profession." Then you could populate it with other people's stuff that already exists, if you don't want to sell your own thing. Jocelyn Sams: Or you can also sell sponsorships on your podcast, so that's another thing that the crime podcast that I listen to they do that. Shane Sams: You could reach out to someone who sells a biz opportunity, because I don't think you're going to be able to promote this. You've got to show them a path to get out of debt and get out of their job. If you don't do that, they're not just going to go hung out for a support group, they're not going to do that. You've got to have some kind of path. You just have to figure out how to populate that path with content. Either create it yourself, or you go out and you promote other people's stuff. Sarah Cottrell: That makes sense to me. The affiliate thing that is a little bit clearer to me. The other piece, Shane that you were talking about, if I were to do my own thing, are you're saying like creating courses that I would then promote to the members in the community? Shane Sams: Yes, you would basically do... This is probably more of a free membership course driven webinar model, no matter how you do it. You're freebie is the support group. I'm trying to think this through, and then you would have maybe like weekly webinars selling a different aspect of the journey. Whether it's promoting someone else's thing or yours or something like that. You're just telling your story, like how did you get out of debt? All you've got to do is say, "I will show you how I got out of debt, which enabled me to leave the legal profession." That's a webinar, you sell the course, and it's just your steps that you took. Your plan that you created and they're open to follow it or not. Your job is not to make them follow your plan, it's to give them an opportunity to follow your plan. Jocelyn Sams: Essentially if your community's free instead of advertising other people's stuff, you would advertise your own products if that makes sense. Actually you could do both. Sarah Cottrell: That's what I was just going to ask. Jocelyn Sams: Yeah, you can totally do both. Sarah Cottrell: There are certain things that I feel like I could create a course, and I feel confident that it would be helpful for people. There are other things that I think would be helpful for people that I'm just not the expert on that thing. Shane Sams: Like what? Name one. What are you an expert in, let's start there? Sarah Cottrell: Well, I guess I would say the things that I feel like I know something about are one, making a longterm plan to get out of debt. Shane Sams: Boom, that's the first product right there. Jocelyn Sams: I would say getting out of debt, I would say you're probably pretty good at that. Shane Sams: An expert, you did it, you paid up for it. It doesn't matter how long it took you, right? I love this. I love the alternative pitch there too of, it's not the get rich fast it's the, "Hey look, that's not true. Those people are wrong. This is the longterm plan, this is what I did." Bam, that's the product, right? Sarah Cottrell: Yes. Then like for example, I think I could talk to the people about how to start thinking about what you want to do, but in terms of specific career coaching. I want an individual person to hold my hand and help me figure out what to do. There are other people who do that, and I think do it well. I don't necessarily want to be doing that individual hand holding, but there are other people that I could refer people to, that would be helpful. Shane Sams: Okay, then this is all you have to do then. You're the bridge. That's how you get to view yourself. You build the community on your podcast. You give the Former Lawyer podcast, you give people hope by letting them hear testimonials and stories of you and other people who have actually left the legal professional and got to be debt free. You tell them, come join a bunch of other lawyers in a safe place where you can talk about not wanting to be a lawyer, it's free. Come join our free community. Shane Sams: You sell them one thing, the longterm plan to get out of debt. You can do that on a weekly webinar, where all of your members you invite them, they show up and you sell the product and the product can be $497. They're lawyers, it could be more if you wanted it to be. They've got disposable income, so you sell that. You have this nice generating, engine generating however many sales a week of thousands of dollars. At that point, and this is how all online businesses work, you sell them one thing, and then to make real money you sell the next thing. Shane Sams: Then you create a portfolio of affiliates, so you might promote twice a month. Maybe two times a month you sell them your get out of debt longterm plan. That's all you sell, and then you sell them and your other affiliates that maybe you go do a, what do you want to be? You go find someone. Maybe there's somebody that teaches people how to become writers, like you said you liked writing. Maybe there's a lot of lawyers that would like to become writers, so you have them come on for a guest webinar and sell their product. You get 40% of whatever's sold. You just find this portfolio of six to 12 good affiliates and over time that maybe you want to be in real estate , well have a real estate coach on. Sell their products and then you get half. Shane Sams: Your job is to be the bridge and the guide. Bridge them across the debt problem, and then introduce them to people that can help them find a new career. That's it. That's the whole business model, and all you have to do is podcast and drive the leads. Does that make sense? Sarah Cottrell: That makes sense. Jocelyn Sams: Okay, so we're feeling pretty good about that? Sarah Cottrell: I think so. Jocelyn Sams: Okay, awesome. Shane Sams: Yeah, it's a little overwhelming right now, but the good thing is you've got a lot of things in place. You really only have to just give the content out there and maybe create that one course. That way you could go ahead and say, "The community exists, there's a course inside." Within a month, if you would just create it, and then you can start looking for affiliates as you grow. Shane Sams: You know what's funny is, you're going to find affiliates, because these former attorneys are going to be selling something when they come on your podcast, I guarantee you. "What did you do?" "I bought 10 houses, some apartments, now I teach people how to do real estate." "Oh you do? Well how about you teach the Former Lawyers how to do real estate." That's where you're going to find all these affiliate programs from. Cool? Sarah Cottrell: That makes sense. I have one question about that, which is, should I start... Okay, so I have Restrict Content Pro on my site, I just haven't actually done anything with it. Shane Sams: What is that? I didn't hear that. Sarah Cottrell: Restrict Content Pro, it's a formatting software. Shane Sams: Membership forum basically yeah. Sarah Cottrell: Yeah, membership forum software. I have that already, should I be waiting to actually open the membership until I have created the course? Or should I be... Shane Sams: No, I think it's your main lead. Sarah Cottrell: Got it. Shane Sams: When you start recording those podcasts, episode one at the end should say, "Go to blank.com and sign up for a free account to the Former Lawyer membership site," whatever you call it. The Former Lawyer community and say like, "Even if you're still a lawyer, but you don't want to be, we want you in there. It's a safe place to talk." Make a pitch for it basically. Jocelyn Sams: Yeah, and every blog post you write, every piece of content should all be pointing there. Shane Sams: Then when you create this first product, that's going to be like your seed product, so you have your own thing, you can go ahead and create that. Then put that in there and sell it to those people, and then you can start finding these other affiliates to sell the other stuff too. Sarah Cottrell: I love that, because I feel like I want to help people, and that makes me feel like I'm helping people. Jocelyn Sams: Love it. Shane Sams: What if you just connected them and got them out of debt, then you tell them how to get a new job, that's amazing. You know what I'm saying, send them to us we'll be an affiliate, no I'm just kidding. Jocelyn Sams: All right Sarah, it has been so much fun talking to you today. I can't wait to see what happens next in your journey. Before we go, we always like to ask our guest, what is one thing that you plan to take action on based on what we talked about here today? Sarah Cottrell: I am going to put together an outline for the course that I'm going to create for the membership. Shane Sams: That is an awesome action step. Product first, get that done, give those podcasts recorded. Who knows, Sarah you might be selling those before we know it. It won't be salesy and it won't be bad, and it won't be desperate. It'll be awesome,, because you're going to free a lot of people from the bondage of a career they found themselves strapped in. Okay? Sarah Cottrell: I'm excited. Shane Sams: All right guys, that wraps up another great episode of the Flipped Lifestyle Podcast. Cannot wait to see what Sarah does with her online business, and we cannot wait to see what you do with your online business as well. Dust off that old domain, recharge that dream and get started. If you don't start, you can't finish and we would love to help you get started over at flippedlifestyle.com/flipyourlife. Shane Sams: You can check out all the information about the Flip Your Life community. We have all the content, community and coaching you need to finally get your online business done, take it to the next level and who knows, someday maybe even flip your life. Go to flippedlifestyle.com/flipyourlife. We would love to help you inside of our community, and who knows maybe someday you will be a guest right here on the Flipped Lifestyle Podcast. Shane Sams: Also, we would love to see you in Lexington, Kentucky this September 19th through the 21st for Flip Your Life LIVE. This is our conference, we are going to connect you with over 100 family focused entrepreneurs from around the world. Go through some amazing content, covering lots of sales strategies, traffic strategies and other things to grow your online business. That's happening this September. You can go to flippedlifestyle.com/live. There are only a few tickets left, and here is a huge announcement guys, we are not doing Flip Your Life LIVE conference in 2020. This is probably going to be your last opportunity. Your last chance to come to Lexington, to come and meet over 100 members of the Flip Your Life community. To come hang out with me and Jocelyn and take your business to the next level, live and in person. That's happening again September 19th through the 21st in Lexington, Kentucky. Shane Sams: Go to flippedlifestyle.com/live to see if any tickets are still available. There were only a few left when we recorded this promo, so you need to go there right now if you're planning on coming. Again, don't put it off, you can't wait till next year. It's not happening next year. It's probably not going to happen any point in the future. This is the last large Flip Your Life LIVE conference. We'd love to have you there in Lexington, Kentucky this September. Shane Sams: That's all the time we have for this week guys, but before we go, we would love to share a Bible verse with you. Jocelyn and I draw a lot of our inspiration in life and business from the Bible. Today we are super excited, because Sarah, our guest today, has a Bible verse she would like to share with you. Sarah Cottrell: One of my favorite Bible verses is Colossians 1:17 which says, "And he is before all things, and in Him all things hold together." I just love that verse, because it reminds me that ultimately my identity is in Christ, and I do the work, but He is the one who holds all things together and I can trust Him. Jocelyn Sams: Awesome reminder. I think that all of us need that reminder from from time to time. Shane Sams: All right guys, that is all the time we have for this week. Until next time, get out there, take action and do whatever it takes to flip your life. We'll see you again. Jocelyn Sams: Bye. Links and resources mentioned on today's show: Sarah's Website Flip Your Life LIVE 2019 Tickets & Registration Information Flip Your Life community Enjoy the podcast; we hope it inspires you to explore what's possible for your family! Join the Flip Your Life Community NOW for as little as $19 per month! https://flippedlifestyle.com/flipyourlife

In today's episode, we help Sarah sell without being too salesy or spammy. FULL TRANSCRIPT Jocelyn Sams: Hey y'all, on today's podcast we help Sarah sell without being too salesy or spammy. Shane Sams: Welcome to the Flipped Lifestyle Podcast, where life always comes before work. We're your hosts, Shane and Jocelyn Sams. We're a real family that figured out how to make our entire living online, and now, we help other families do the same. Are you ready to flip your life? All right, let's get started. Shane Sams: What's going on everybody? Welcome back to the Flipped Lifestyle Podcast. It is so great to be with you today. Wherever you're listening to the show, thank you for listening. We're really excited to welcome another member of the Flip Your Life community onto the show, so that we can help them overcome fears, breakthrough obstacles and take action on the next steps in their online business. Our guest today is Flip Your Life community member, Sarah Cottrell. Sarah, welcome to the show. Sarah Cottrell: Hi, thanks so much for having me. Jocelyn Sams: Welcome Sarah, I'm actually sensing a little theme here in the podcast. If you listened a couple weeks ago, we had another attorney on, and Sarah of course is an attorney. Tell us a little bit about you, your background and your online business. Sarah Cottrell: Well, so I worked as a lawyer for the last decade. I graduated from law school in 2008, and last summer, after the last of our kids was born, I left my legal job to stay home with them. My path through being a lawyer was a pretty common story. This is true for a lot of lawyers, which is that I started practicing, and pretty early on realized it was not for me in the longterm. However, we had a lot of student loan debt, and I say we because my husband is also a lawyer. We actually met in law school and combined between the two of us, we had over $400,000. Jocelyn Sams: Ouch! Shane Sams: Oh my God. That is a lot of scary mountainous debt, especially when you're like, "I'm not going to use this degree anymore," right? Sarah Cottrell: Yeah. It's basically like you have a mortgage, except there's no asset associated with it other than your own blood, sweat and tears. Shane Sams: Wow, that's unbelievable. Are you still in debt? Sarah Cottrell: No, we paid off all of our debt last June, so June of 2018. Shane Sams: Well done, congratulations. Sarah Cottrell: Thank you. Shane Sams: I can't even imagine having that much debt coming out of college. Jocelyn Sams: What a weight lifted, oh my goodness. Sarah Cottrell: Yes. I was about two years in to practicing when I realized, "This is just not for me in the longterm." When you have over $400,000 in debt, you can't just chalk it all and leave. We had to make a plan to get out, and it had to be a longterm plan. You know a lot of personal finance guru types will say, "Do all these things and cut everything down, and then pay off your debt in like 5 months and then you'll be great." Well, when you have a mortgage size level of debt, you have to have a little bit of a longer term plan that is survivable for five or 10 years in my case. That's what we did. Sarah Cottrell: We made a plan and got out of debt, and that enabled us to be in a position where I was able to stay home with our kids. I also have started doing some writing on the side, which is something that I've always been interested in. With a full-time job and young kids, especially a job that was a lot of research and writing, not a lot of time for writing. Shane Sams: Well for one thing, what's crazy when you were telling your story I was like, "How was 2008 over 10 years ago?" I saw this thing on Facebook the other day, and it was like, people of a certain age you always think the 70s are 30 years ago. I do think that. I'm like, when was 1970? What, 30 years ago? When was 1980? What, 20 years ago? Really, 1980 was like almost 40 years ago and it doesn't seem like that...

The holiday season is a time for celebration and family togetherness. It's supposed to bring us joy. But Christine Moll, chair and professor of counseling and human services at Canisius College and a mental health counselor, says that for many the holidays are a time of stress, loneliness, anxiety, and dysfunction. On Wednesday's AU, as we head into the holiday season, we'll ask you what you do to make the season joyful. And how do you de-stress during the holidays? We'll get advice from Christine Moll and Marriage and Family Therapist and Rage Against The Minivan blogger, Kristen Howerton. We'll also turn to writers Sarah Cottrell and Michael Levin for humorous takes on holiday stress.