Podcast appearances and mentions of George Land

264. Simple Ideas for Incorporating Art with Children and Teens with Courtney Sanford   Colossians 3:23 NLT "Work willingly at whatever you do, as though you were working for the Lord rather than for people."   **Transcription Below**   Questions and Topics We Discuss: Can you give us an overview of the seven major forms of art and give an example of ways our children can engage with each? What are the best art supplies to have on hand? As our children grow, why is this helpful in the teen years to have a healthy way to express ourselves and our ideas?   Courtney Sanford is a dedicated wife, and mother who triumphantly homeschooled her three children. With one pursuing a career in orthodontics, another just finishing a master's degree while working in higher education, and the youngest studying computer science at Regent University, Courtney's commitment to their education has yielded remarkable success.   Passionate about nurturing creativity and self-expression, she guides students through captivating art classes, exploring the intersection of imagination and skill. With her background as a graphic designer and experience in studio art, Courtney embarked on a new adventure as an art teacher.    As a multitasking mom, author, artist, teacher, and adventurer, Courtney embodies the spirit of embracing life's opportunities and fostering a love for learning and artistic expression.   Beyond her love for education, Courtney has an insatiable wanderlust. She finds joy in traversing the globe, hosting art retreats, and volunteering at Spiritual Twist Productions: both painting sets, and serving on the board of directors. When time permits, Courtney indulges in spring snow skiing, hiking in exotic locations, and leisurely walks with her dog, Zoey.   Delightful Art Co. was born out of a time when life gave Courtney a handful of lemons, and she creatively transformed those lemons into refreshing lemonade. The Covid shutdown rather forcefully prompted a major shift from in-person art classes to online classes.    Courtney's Website   Thank You to Our Sponsor: WinShape Marriage   Other Episodes Mentioned: 202 Simple Ways to Connect with Our Kids And Enjoy Breaks with Beth Rosenbleeth (Days with Grey) 223 Journey and Learnings as Former Second Lady of the United States with Karen Pence   Continue the conversation with us on Facebook, Instagram or our website.   Gospel Scripture: (all NIV)   Romans 3:23 “for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God,”   Romans 3:24 “and are justified freely by his grace through the redemption that came by Christ Jesus.”   Romans 3:25 (a) “God presented him as a sacrifice of atonement, through faith in his blood.”    Hebrews 9:22 (b) “without the shedding of blood there is no forgiveness.”    Romans 5:8 “But God demonstrates his own love for us in this: While we were still sinners, Christ died for us.”    Romans 5:11 “Not only is this so, but we also rejoice in God through our Lord Jesus Christ, through whom we have now received reconciliation.”    John 3:16 “For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.”   Romans 10:9 “That if you confess with your mouth, “Jesus is Lord,” and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.”    Luke 15:10 says “In the same way, I tell you, there is rejoicing in the presence of the angels of God over one sinner who repents.”   Romans 8:1 “Therefore, there is now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus”   Ephesians 1:13–14 “And you also were included in Christ when you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation. Having believed, you were marked in him with a seal, the promised Holy Spirit, who is a deposit guaranteeing our inheritance until the redemption of those who are God's possession- to the praise of his glory.”   Ephesians 1:15–23 “For this reason, ever since I heard about your faith in the Lord Jesus and your love for all the saints, I have not stopped giving thanks for you, remembering you in my prayers. I keep asking that the God of our Lord Jesus Christ, the glorious Father, may give you the spirit of wisdom and revelation, so that you may know him better. I pray also that the eyes of your heart may be enlightened in order that you may know the hope to which he has called you, the riches of his glorious inheritance in the saints, and his incomparably great power for us who believe. That power is like the working of his mighty strength, which he exerted in Christ when he raised him from the dead and seated him at his right hand in the heavenly realms, far above all rule and authority, power and dominion, and every title that can be given, not only in the present age but also in the one to come. And God placed all things under his feet and appointed him to be head over everything for the church, which is his body, the fullness of him who fills everything in every way.”   Ephesians 2:8–10 “For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith – and this not from yourselves, it is the gift of God – not by works, so that no one can boast. For we are God‘s workmanship, created in Christ Jesus to do good works, which God prepared in advance for us to do.“   Ephesians 2:13 “But now in Christ Jesus you who once were far away have been brought near through the blood of Christ.“   Philippians 1:6 “being confident of this, that he who began a good work in you will carry it on to completion until the day of Christ Jesus.”   *Transcription*    Music: (0:00 – 0:09)   Laura Dugger: (0:10 - 1:36) Welcome to The Savvy Sauce, where we have practical chats for intentional living. I'm your host, Laura Dugger, and I'm so glad you're here.   I am thrilled to introduce you to our sponsor, WinShape Marriage.   Their weekend retreats will strengthen your marriage, and you will enjoy this gorgeous setting, delicious food, and quality time with your spouse. To find out more, visit them online at winshapemarriage.org. That's W-I-N-S-H-A-P-E marriage.org. Thanks for your sponsorship.   Courtney Sanford is my guest today, and she's an amazing artist and teacher and author, and I'm just so excited to share this conversation. If you're like me and you're ready for summer and your rhythm changes with your kids, she's going to share some super practical tips for incorporating art and beauty into our homes.   And I think that you're going to conclude this conversation by knowing where to begin and understanding why it matters. Here's our chat.    Welcome to The Savvy Sauce, Courtney.   Courtney Sanford: Thanks for having me.    Laura Dugger: I'm so excited to hear more about your story, so will you share what has led you into the work that you get to do today?   Courtney Sanford: (1:37 - 4:20) I sure do like to share that story. I didn't start off as a homeschooler. I didn't imagine that that would be where my life went, but I was always a creative person.   I was a graphic designer, and I worked in the Performing Arts Center, and I got to do lots of fun design for shows. Then along came kids. I actually enjoyed dropping them off at school and going to Target, and I was okay with that.   We didn't do public school because the school near me didn't look safe, and we had lived near Columbine High School and thought it was just a beautiful, beautiful school. And when we left Colorado, we thought, oh, isn't it sad that our kids won't go to school there? And then just about a month later, the whole Columbine shooting happened, and so we were kind of traumatized by all of that.   And then when I saw the school that my precious five-year-old would go to, it didn't look safe, and so we sent them to a private school. So here we are spending a lot of money, having high expectations, and the kids were doing all worksheets all the time, and they started to dread going to school, and they didn't love learning, and the excitement of learning just kind of drained out of them. And so we looked into other options and decided that homeschooling would be the way to go, and I found the classical model and just loved the way that sounded, and we tried it, and it worked, and the little lights just came back on in their eyes, and they started to love learning again.   And I just found my people, and I just learned everything I could about homeschooling, and I just poured myself into it wholeheartedly as unto the Lord. And had a great time, and I just loved my time with my kids, and I felt like it was successful, and I encouraged other people to do it, but I wasn't really sure that it worked until they got into college and they turned out to be successful, thriving humans, and we're really proud of them. One will be a doctor in about a month.   He's about to graduate. He has a wife and a little girl, and then my second one has her MBA, and she works for a Christian college where she leads trips, and she's getting ready to take a group to Paris and London, and so she kind of ministers to students through that, and then my youngest is still in school staying to be a software developer. So now I can confidently say it was worth all the energy that I put into it.   It was hard work, probably the hardest thing I've ever done, but so worth it.   Laura Dugger: (4:21 - 4:40) That's incredible, and I love hearing the success story where your children are now, but you really also inspired them with beauty and art in their learning and growing up time, and I'm curious, are there any personal lessons that the Lord has taught you through art?   Courtney Sanford: (4:41 - 6:32) Oh, goodness. Yeah, I think my desire was to make learning interactive because I saw what they were doing in the private school, which was sit in a chair all day and do your worksheets, and it was just worksheet after worksheet after worksheet and then a quiz, and then you get graded, and so I was thinking if I'm going to pull them out, I've got to do better than that, and so that was my standard, and I was going to beat that standard every day, and so I pulled in art because that's what I knew, so if we were learning about an animal, we would draw the animal. If we were learning about a continent, we would draw the continent until we could draw it from memory, and I really learned with them. I did not have a great elementary education or even high school education, so I would learn this stuff, and then I would think of creative ways to get them involved with it, so a lot of times it was drawing.   It could be painting. It could be making things out of clay. We used to make things out of Rice Krispie Treats, and then they could take it to their co-op group.   Well, it was a classical conversations group, but they do presentations, and so we made a Mayan temple out of Rice Krispie Treats, and we would make volcanoes, and then they could take it to their friends and share it with them and tell them about it, so anything I could do that would get us out of the chair using our hands and using our senses and think, you know, how can I incorporate all five senses, and that just made learning so much more fun for them and for me, and so a lot of it was art. Some of it was science.   Anytime I could incorporate a sense of play into what they were learning, I could see that they would learn so much more.   Laura Dugger: (6:32 - 6:55) I love that, trying to incorporate all five senses, especially. That gets some ideas coming, but can you even back it up, and because you're an artist, will you give us an overview of the seven major forms of art, and can you give us examples as parents for ways that we can engage our children with each of those?   Courtney Sanford: (6:56 - 10:58) Oh, sure. Let me think. All right, so drawing, of course, you can draw what you see, so when I teach students to draw, I do a progression, so we'll draw from line art, and you can find line art anywhere.   It might be in a children's book, so using the library was key for me, so I'd get a laundry basket, and I would go to the library with an index card of what we'd be studying, and I would grab all kinds of books related to that, so when you come home, you get out a kid's book. If you see a good line drawing, say you're studying a lizard, if you see a good line drawing, draw from that. They could even trace it to start with, so you draw from the line drawing, then once they get really confident with that, you go to drawing from photos, and then you go to drawing from real life, so maybe you have a fish tank.   Maybe there's a fish in the fish tank, and you could draw from that or draw things in your yard, so that is how I break down drawing for them, and it could be years. You could draw from line art for years before you go to drawing from photos, and then to drawing from real life, and drawing's great for learning to memorize things. For painting, painting's just fun, and so I like to go to the kitchen table every afternoon and paint what you see, so you start off with the younger kids.   You could start with color and markers and fill in the areas, and then you can teach them how to shade using painting. Sculpture is also fun with kids. I like air-dry clay, and I like Sculpey clay.   I like to get a one-pound block of Sculpey clay and teach them the basic forms, like roll out a snake, do your hands together. Those of you who are listening, you can't see my hands, but I am making a sphere with imaginary clay. These are really good for developing their fine motor skills, too.   We also make the letters out of roll-out snakes and form your letters. That will really help if they're reversing letters. It takes a while to build the whole alphabet, so maybe you do three or four letters a day.   You work on it a couple times a week. It might take a month to make the whole alphabet, but that can be one goal, to get them working in three dimensions. We usually do additive sculpture, like adding on, and you can use found objects to make sculptures.   One time, my son took apart a pen. I rearranged the pieces into a human shape, and it was lovely. Getting them thinking in three dimensions is related to sculpture.   Carving, I don't like to do until they're old enough to be safe with a knife, but once they are, especially the boys love to go outside in the yard and get a log. They spend a lot of time carving spoons. Just a simple shape they can hold in their mind and then carve it is a good activity.   It keeps their little hands busy, too, if you want to read aloud to them and you don't mind a little mess in the house, they can carve. You can also carve out of a bar of soap as well. For that, that's a subtractive sculpture technique.   Let's see. That's the three main ones, drawing, painting, sculpture. I know film is one.   Film, I don't really incorporate much into my homeschool, except we will occasionally watch a movie about history. That has gotten me into trouble a few times because some of those movies that I think are going to be historic turn out to have racy scenes in them, and I'll have to jump up and get in front of the TV or cough really loud. But there are some good films that you can watch together as a family.   That's about as far as I went with film.   Laura Dugger: (10:59 - 11:19) I would, if you don't mind me interrupting there, too. I feel like that's one that our girls have actually begun to develop on their own, where our eldest daughter once wanted a video camera, so she got the old-school video camera. They're making their own movies, and I've seen that as a form of creative, artistic play.   Courtney Sanford: (11:20 - 11:49) Oh, that's fabulous. Yes, so when my kids were little, we didn't even have phones or video cameras on the phones, so that wasn't an option. When we first started homeschooling, our TV died, and so we did not even have a TV for years.   We just decided not to replace it, which forced us into audiobooks and reading aloud and then just playing outside instead and reading books. So that was a blessing.   Laura Dugger: (11:49 - 12:03) I love that because that's one of the other forms. That was new to me, that literature is an art form. Sorry, I sidetracked you because we still have literature, architecture, theater, and music.   Courtney Sanford: (12:04 - 14:20) Yeah, I think the best thing that we did for our kids, of course, I love teaching them to write using Andrew Pudewa's method with IEW. It's kind of imitative writing, so you learn to imitate good writers. But also, my husband read aloud to the kids every single night.   That was his time with him. He gave me a break, and he would read for hours. He loved it.   The kids loved it. And he would choose classics or funny things, you know, science fiction. Probably not the books that I would choose.   I would choose classics and things related to what we were studying, but he chose what he wanted to read. So I would read aloud in the afternoons, and we would do audiobooks like Story of the World and all the Jim Weiss readings. And then he would read aloud at night.   And just whatever he wanted to choose, he would read aloud. And I think hearing good language produces good speakers and good writers. So he gets about 50 percent of the credit for the success of the kids, I think, for just reading aloud every night.   It was such a great thing to do for the kids. And then the last one, architecture. I do incorporate architecture when I'm teaching about a culture.   So, if we're doing art history or history, we'll look at the buildings. So, of course, you do that with ancient Egypt. You look at the pyramids.   When you're talking Old Testament times, you look at the tents. And then as I go through art history with the high schoolers, I'll point out more and more like neoclassical, of course, comes from the ancient Greeks, but it's come to symbolize power and authority. And that's why we see it in government buildings.   So, my degree is graphic design, but it was in the School of Architecture. So, I had a lot of history of architecture and I appreciate it. And so I'm always pointing that out to my kids.   And I do that in my class, in my art history class. I always incorporate the architecture just as a part of understanding a culture.   Laura Dugger: (14:21 - 14:29) I love that. And was there anything specific that you did with your kids for encouraging music or also theater?   Courtney Sanford: (14:30 - 15:29) Oh, yeah. One thing I wish I had done more of was kinder music. I don't know why we didn't do that much kinder music, but now I'm learning more about it.   I wish I had done more of that. And I did put them in piano lessons. One wanted to do violin.   So, they had a few years of learning the basics of music, and then they really got into theater. We have a great Christian youth theater nearby. And so that was a really good experience.   In their Christian youth theater, they would sing praise and worship songs before and during and after a play. They would be praying for the audience and singing worship songs in addition to the singing on the stage. And that whole experience was really good for them.   Even my quietest kid got a big role in a play one time, and he had to memorize a lot of lines and sing in front of people. It's just such a great experience for them.   Laura Dugger: (15:30 - 15:57) I would think so. Even if they don't choose something that we would consider a very artistic career, I can see why all of this is still beneficial. That leads me to another question for you.   Regardless of the way that all of us parents listening are choosing to educate our children, why is it still beneficial for all of us to incorporate art into our homes and into our parenting?   Courtney Sanford: (15:58 - 21:59) That's a great question. So, the first line of the Bible says God created. So, the first thing we learn about God is that he was creative.   He created everything. And then just a few lines later, it says then he created man in his own image. So that tells me that we were created to be creative, to create.   Now, he doesn't let us create stuff out of nothing like him, which is probably for our own good. That would be a mess. But we can create things out of what he created.   And there is a study done by George Land. And there's a video on YouTube of George Land giving a talk about this creativity study that he did. And he created a test for NASA to help them find creative engineers when they were trying to get to the moon.   And they used it to study creativity in children. And they tested five-year-olds. So, they found a group of 1,600 five-year-olds who were in school.   And when they tested them at five years old, 98% of them tested as creative geniuses. So, their plan was to go every five years and test them again just to see what was going on. So, they went back after five years.   The kids are now 10. And it dropped down to like 27%. They went back another five years when the kids were 15, and it was down to about 17%.   And then they were so depressed, they stopped testing them because they could see they began as very creative. So, we're created creative. And a lot of moms will say, yes, I can see that in my children.   But something happens. And this was all in school. Something happened during school that taught them to not be creative.   So, the school teaches the kids to be obedient, to sit still, and to get the same outcome from every kid. Right? There's an expected answer on every test.   And you're to try to get the answer that the teacher wants. That's not creative. So, the first thing to do to preserve their creativity is don't send them to school.   That's the safest bet. And then when you do homeschool them, which I think is the best environment for them, don't do what they do in school. To bring them home and to go to all this trouble just to do the same thing that they're doing in school is not worth the trouble.   So, you've got to not do what they're doing in school. And so, for me, that meant don't do worksheets, make the content interactive. So, I did rely on curriculum, but I didn't rely on the curriculum to be the teacher.   So, I get the content from the curriculum, and then I make it interactive using artistic, creative skills so that they can be creative. And I don't teach it out of them. So, if you have young kids, that's good news.   They're already creative. You just have to don't teach it out of them. If your kids are older and maybe they've been in school, then you might have to like undo some of that training and set up some experiences where you ask them or even like in my classes, I'll set up a challenge.   And I expect everyone's to be different because everybody's going to do it a little bit more creatively in their way. And so, at the end of class, instead of like calling out the answers to see if everybody got the same thing, they're holding up what they did and telling me what they were thinking. And everybody's is different.   And then I really praise the ones who did something different. Maybe they changed the colors. Maybe they put glasses on Mona Lisa.   You know, maybe they gave her a cat to hold. So, I reward thinking outside the box. Now to to pour in beauty, and I think I might have heard this from Charlotte Mason, beauty in, beauty out.   So, you've got to load them with beauty. Now, I think that we were naturally drawn to beauty and people will argue with me about this. They'll say, well, beauty is in the eye of the beholder.   But I betcha I could find something that's beautiful and do a survey. And I betcha I could get 100% of people to say, yes, that's beautiful. And I could find something else, maybe a Hindu goddess sculpture.   And I could find something that 100% people would say that is not beautiful. And so, I think that ingrained in some of us because we're created by God, I think we have a sense of appreciating beauty. I do think that it gets taught out of a lot of people.   So, with my kids, I show them a lot of beauty. And this can be as simple as get a coffee table book from the secondhand bookstore on art and put it on your coffee table. Get books from the library and have lots of beautiful things to look at.   And so, when I now when I was teaching my own kids, this is kind of a fly by the seat of my pants. Make it up as I go. Now that they've left home and I can think about it, I'm putting together books that are a little bit more thoughtful.   So, in my books, you will see I've chosen a piece of art that is beautiful and I will pair it with the lesson. And then I'll give you an art activity. So, for example, in Into the Woods, you'll see I've chosen a beautiful piece of art and I paired it with a poem, which is another piece of beauty.   Yes. And then I'll give you an art lesson so that they can get creative with it as well. So, it is this hard to pull it together.   So that's why I'm making books to help parents. So, you have something beautiful and something to do with it. And so, that's how I pour in beauty to give a beauty in beauty out.   Laura Dugger: (21:59 - 22:36) I love that so much. And just even holding this resource, it is so beautiful. There's so much to it.   When it arrived, our daughters were delighted to go through it and to dive in and get to learn. But I'm just thinking many listeners are fellow homeschool parents and also many are not. But I don't want them to be discouraged because I'm even thinking of your courses or if they do intentional art in the evenings or on weekends or summer break and winter break.   There are still ways for all of us to incorporate this.   Courtney Sanford: (22:36 - 24:28) Yes, for sure. Yeah. Even so, my mom, I was public school.   And of course, the word hadn't been invented back then, but my mom appreciates art and poetry and she would always have art books on the coffee table. And I would just stop and, you know, in my free time, flip through the pages. And those images stuck with me my whole life.   She had one that had a Monet on the cover of the Field of Red Poppies. And that was just ingrained in my mind as a piece of beauty. So just something as simple as putting it out on your coffee table.   She also took us to museums whenever we traveled. And she didn't make a big lesson out of it, but I was exposed to beautiful buildings. You know, most museums are in beautiful buildings.   You see the beautiful architecture. And I was exposed to a lot of art that way. So, that was that totally goes with which with summer vacations and your vacations to, you know, make an effort to see a gallery or an art museum when you're traveling.   That makes a big difference. It'll make an impression on them. And of course, the books you could do in the summer.   We have summer classes and we have an art retreat that might not line up with school because it's in May. But the books you could for sure add on. Hopefully someday we'll have evening classes so that you could go to school.   We've got some this coming year that will start at four o'clock. So, hopefully some kids can go to school and come home and join an art class. So, we're working on getting it out as we as I get teachers willing to.   Most of my teachers are homeschool moms, too. And by the end of the day, they're tired. So, I've got a few.   I've got a young lady who's just graduating and she's going to do some late afternoon ones for us next year. So pretty excited about that.   Laura Dugger: (24:28 - 25:04) I love that. And then even thinking of the beauty and beauty out stepping outdoors. There's so much beauty in God's creation and so much change depending on where you live throughout the seasons.   But I love how you also brought up the library, because anytime I'm trying to learn something new, that's my first go to is put books on hold at the library. And so, if we're wanting to know what to add to our library cart just to get us started into this, can you share books that you recommend, both yours and others that you think would be good additions?   Courtney Sanford: (25:05 - 26:19) Oh, that's a good question. Yes, there are. I love to think about the biographies of artists.   And if so, if you're studying ancient history, you could look up a biography on Giotto. And they're still tell the stories in such a nice, kid friendly way. Like there's the story of Giotto.   He was actually watching the sheep. And while he was out in the fields, he would draw on the sides of rocks like big rocks. But you get another rock and you would draw on the sides of rocks.   And another artist was walking through one day and he saw these drawings on the rocks. He was like, wow, you're really talented. Come with me.   I'll make you an apprentice. And those stories are just they're fun to read together and hear those kinds of stories. And of course, the Usborne books of art are beautiful and they often have projects for the kids to do.   I can't think of any specific ones, but I do love a short paperback on the particular artists. And so, I kind of line those up along with the period in history that we're studying.   Laura Dugger: (26:20 - 26:32) That's great. And even you're making me think of picture book biographies on artists. We've always enjoyed those as well.   Obviously, the illustrations are fantastic, too, but the storylines are so interesting.   Courtney Sanford: (26:33 - 27:23) Yes. So, I just grab whatever they have. I had a big laundry basket.   And and I know card and I just grab whatever I could find and sometimes let the kids choose. And sometimes I would choose. If you're going with geography, you can find beautiful photos of the different areas.   See the landscapes or the sunsets. And that can through photography. And you can really get to know a place through beautiful photographs.   I like that part, too. And then that might inspire a pastel drawing of a landscape. Maybe it's a beautiful sunset you could recreate with pastels.   So, photography books are really inspirational, too.   Laura Dugger: (27:23 - 28:10) It's a great idea. And circling back, you had mentioned Andrew Pudewa earlier in our conversation. And I remember learning from him that with writing, the worst way we can teach our children is to say just free write, just write something down or here's a prompt to finish this sentence because better writing comes through imitating.   And so, you've even mentioned tracing is a great way to start. That's not cheating in art if you're not stealing credit from them. But if you're just practicing and tracing, this is a way to imitate.   And so, I'm wondering, do you have any other cautions for ways that may be the wrong way to introduce our kids to art?   Courtney Sanford: (28:11 - 30:50) I agree that. Yeah, you can get writer's block. What I find funny is that some people are so afraid to imitate artists.   But if I were teaching piano, I would teach your kid how to play something by Bach in which he would learn what Bach did. And nobody would say I'm stealing from Bach. You know, and you learn to play Beethoven by playing Beethoven and you you learn to reproduce those pieces of music.   I do the same thing in art. We look at what the masters did and we'll copy it in order to learn what they knew. And that way we build.   We're like standing on the shoulders of giants. So, we don't want every kid to have to start with inventing the wheel themselves. We'd never get very far.   We want to learn what the masters knew and then build on that. So, I do a lot of imitation. And then as the students ready, I let them know you are free to change this or to experiment with it.   So just last week we were drawing and painting red poppies and learning about Georgia O'Keeffe. And so, I said we can do an imitation of her poppy. And I'll show you step by step how to reproduce her poppy.   And in doing that, we're going to cause us to look more closely at it and study her blends. Like she would blend from yellow to orange to red in every petal. And we can study that technique.   And then as we do it and we practice it, we look more closely at hers and it kind of becomes a part of us. And then we'll find another flower and we'll use that same technique on a flower that we choose. Or maybe it's a flower we make up and we take that technique and we can apply it.   And it's a much better way to learn than trying to learn it yourself without looking at what the masters did. So, I think that I think I pulled a lot of that from Andrew Pudewa. The idea of I'm going to assist you until you say I got this.   I can do it from here. So, I do assist until they get it. And then I always say whenever you're ready, as soon as you're ready, change it and make it your own or do your own thing.   And because turning them loose too soon can break their confidence. So, you want to build them up until they can confidently experiment on their own.   Laura Dugger: (30:51 - 32:34) Let's take a quick break to hear a message from our sponsor. I'm so excited to share today's sponsor, WinShape Marriage, with you. WinShape Marriage is a fantastic ministry that helps couples prepare, strengthen, and if needed, even save their marriage.   WinShape Marriage is grounded on the belief that the strongest marriages are the ones that are nurtured, even if it seems like things are going smoothly. That way they'll be stronger if they do hit a bump along their marital journey. Through their weekend retreats, WinShape Marriage invites couples to enjoy time away to simply focus on each other.   These weekend retreats are hosted within the beautiful refuge of WinShape Retreat, perched in the mountains of Rome, Georgia, which is just a short drive from Atlanta, Birmingham, and Chattanooga. While you and your spouse are there, you'll be well-fed, well-nurtured, and well-cared for. During your time away in this beautiful place, you and your spouse will learn from expert speakers and explore topics related to intimacy, overcoming challenges, improving communication, and so much more.   I've stayed on site at WinShape before, and I can attest to their generosity, food, and content. You will be so grateful you went. To find an experience that's right for you and your spouse, head to their website, WinShapeMarriage.org.  That's W-I-N-S-H-A-P-E Marriage.org. Thanks for your sponsorship.    Well, and as parents, once we're past the resistance to maybe invest some of our time or our money or allow the mess into our home, but if we push past through that and we're ready to get started, I'd love to go over some practical tips.   So, Courtney, first, just what are some great art supplies to have on hand?   Courtney Sanford: (32:36 - 37:13) A number two pencil and some Crayola markers you probably already have. Those are great tools. I like to have my kids work in an art journal, and you can get these real inexpensive at Michael's.   It'll say on the cover, mixed media art Journal, and they come in different sizes. I kind of like the big ones, and that will allow you to use paint, pencil, and marker or anything you want. If it says sketchbook, it's not going to hold up to paint very well.   So that's why I get the mixed media paper. So, I start with the art journal, and then I like to make that journal be their book on a subject. So right now, I'm doing ancient history with some kids, and so they are making their own book about ancient history.   So, every week we'll do a drawing or a painting or watercolor on a lesson in ancient history. And so, each piece is not a masterpiece to hang on the wall. Each piece is a part of the story in their book.   That takes all the pressure off. So, they don't see this as, I don't know if this is going to be good enough to hang on the wall. That's not even a question.   It's a part of the story in your book. They can also take some notes. They can show their grandparents and review the topic by presenting it to their grandparents and showing off their book.   And then you can collect their books and put them on a shelf. It's not all over the house making you crazy. And then you can see from year to year how their skills have improved.   So, I kind of like every year I like pick a topic to be the subject of our art journal. So, I call it arts integrated learning. So, I'm pairing an academic subject with art for that year.   So, it could be poetry. It could be history. It could be science.   Whatever you pick. That's what you'll add to your art journal with.   Pencils. I like blending tools too. There are some people call them stompies.   For those of you who are watching. Here's one. It's just rolled up newspaper, but you can buy these at Michael's.   They're really cheap. But it takes a drawing to the next level. You can just blend things out and shade things really lovely.   Mark Kistler does some videos and teaches you how to. He'll go shade, shade, shade. And so that's a good way to start.   And it really elevates a drawing and it gives them a lot of confidence. And then of course the good eraser. The book drawing with children is a really good one for our parents to read and then teach from in that book.   They suggest you have them draw with markers so that they don't spend an hour erasing. If you have someone who's a perfectionist, they will make one mark and spend 20 minutes erasing it. And so, if you go right to drawing with markers, that's gonna teach them to make a good mark first and then keep going and not spend half an hour erasing.   When I get to age nine or 10, I like to use acrylic paints, but I only buy four colors of paint and then I make them mix all the other colors. So, we use yellow, magenta, blue, and white. Those are like the colors in your printer.   Cyan, magenta, and yellow are the ones in your printer. And those colors can make all the other colors. Now your printer has black, but I don't give kids black.   Instead of black, they could make purple or brown or dark color. So, you know, you teach them how to mix the colors that they want. They'll learn to mix it because they want green or they want purple, or they want brown.   And then they develop a sense of color theory, and you don't even have to teach it. They'll figure it out because they want those colors. If they find, if, if you don't feel confident in that, you can buy craft colors of the specific colors, especially brown.   That's a hard one to mix. But I do like the coverage of acrylic paints. I like watercolors too.   That's a little bit easier to get into. You just take it slow and practice a lot. So that's really all you need.   It's pretty simple.   Laura Dugger: (37:14 - 37:27) Well, and I'm wondering too, even with the acrylic paint at that age, once they're older, that one, I'm assuming can stain. So are there any tips that you have for containing the mess?   Courtney Sanford: (37:28 - 38:32) Yes, I get, and they're a little bit hard to find. So go to Amazon and find a, a tablecloth that is plastic on one side and felt on the other side. I forget what you call it, but there'll be like picnic tables, tablecloths.   And the plastic ones are going to drive you crazy because they're too thin. So, if it's flannel backed, it's a little bit thicker. So I get a white one at the beginning of the year.   And that comes out anytime we do clay or paint, and it goes over the kitchen table and I don't worry about cleaning it. You just let it dry, fold it up. And I put mine in the China cabinet right there by the table.   And then anytime we do something messy, that tablecloth comes out and, and then just fold the mess back up in it. And it works, it works really great to, and then you might, if you're, if you're a neat freak, maybe plan on buying one at the beginning of every school year so that you get clean slates. And then the paint that gets onto the tablecloth is actually lovely and it'll be pretty next time you get it out.   Laura Dugger: (38:33 - 39:11) Oh, I love that. That's a genius tip. I appreciate that for coming indoors because in the summer, I guess we could take it outside depending on where we live.   But then what about any hacks for finding the time to do this? And I guess I'm thinking back to a previous episode with Beth Rosenbleeth. She's the one who started Days with Grey and she would talk about different art prompts that she would set out for her children in the morning for a variety of ages.   But were there any things that kind of required minimal time from you, but had maximum return for your kids?   Courtney Sanford: (39:11 - 41:06) Yeah, that's a good point. I had, I wouldn't say I had a strict schedule, but I had a pattern to my days. And the time after lunch was a good time to do messy things in the kitchen because we were in the kitchen anyway.   And as I could clean up lunch and start dinner, I could be in the kitchen with them and they could be creative at the kitchen table with minimum involvement from me. One of my best afternoons was we had the microscopes out to do something specific and I left it out as I was cooking chili. And as I cut up each ingredient, I would cut a thin slice for them to look at under the microscope.   And so they were looking at a bell pepper and a red pepper and celery and tomato. And they were so, they so enjoyed that and I was able to cook dinner at the same time, which was fabulous. And that turned, it was probably like a 15-minute science lesson into like four hours of discovering things under the microscope.   So that element of play and you can do that with your art supplies too. Like I'll demonstrate a technique and then leave it out. I'll turn my attention to cooking dinner while they see what else they can do with it.   And, um, you know, I'll give them a few tips. Like, um, if you mix these three colors together, you're going to make brown and then turn your back and let them discover it for themselves. So, um, I'm a big crock pot person.   And so after lunch would be the time I need to clean up lunch and put something in the crock pot. So that would be a good time for me to get them started on art or science and, um, and then turn my back and let them have that, um, that discovery time without me hovering or telling them what to do or something.   Laura Dugger: (41:06 - 41:22) Oh, that's a great rhythm. I love these ideas. And then I kind of want to go in chunks of age.   So, thinking of little kids, how would you define the difference between a piece of art and a craft?   Courtney Sanford: (41:23 - 43:41) Yeah, a craft is going to be something where the focus is on following directions and that's important. They need to learn how to follow directions. And so we would do, especially around the holidays, I might do a craft and we all follow directions.   Um, a piece of art is going to be where they're, they all come out different. They're allowed to play and express themselves. Um, for me personally, if I'm doing a craft when I'm done, I think, oh, I could make 50 of these and sell them.   If it's an art, when I'm done with a piece of art, like one of these paintings behind me, when I'm done with that, I'm thinking I could never do that again. That took so much out of me. I'm exhausted.   A little piece of my soul is in that that's art. That's the difference. Um, so I don't sell my paintings because there's a little piece of my soul in, um, my husband makes fun of me for that.   He's like, you could just sell your paintings. They're like, what? They're, they're like my babies.   I can't, I can't part with them. It took so much out of me to create them. Um, but a craft, yeah, I'll just give away things that are, that I just followed directions for, um, in terms of kids, younger kids will enjoy crafts, but getting to high school, they recognize it as slave labor and they don't want to do that.   They are in what the classical education people call the, the, um, poetic stage, you know, they want to express themselves and they want to be unique. I think this is why they get tattoos. The tattoo is a way of saying this is who I am.   This is what it means to me. I'm unique. Um, so I think if we don't teach them to express themselves in art, they're going to get tattoos.   So that might encourage moms to, to give them the skills so that they can express themselves. You know, they need to be able to write poetry or write songs or paint a painting or do a drawing. There's that need inside of us to do that that God put in us.   And if they don't have an outlet, then they're going to find something like tattoos or something that we don't want them to be doing. Yeah. I mean, some of my kids are tattooed.   It's not bad.   Laura Dugger: (43:42 - 44:25) Well, and you've kind of answered a follow-up question I had because we talked about little kids, but I'm thinking of teens. So going back, my background is in marriage and family therapy, and we would encourage everyone that journaling is a free form of therapy. But I think of art as the same way.   And there's even studies that show when you're engaged in something artistic, the critical side of your brain goes offline. So you can't think negative thoughts while you're creating something new, but with teens, there's that added benefit of getting to express themselves. So is there anything else with art that you see as basically free therapy for adolescents?   Courtney Sanford: (44:26 - 46:54) Oh, sure. I do see it a lot. I experienced it because I started my business because of the shutdown and because I was teaching in person and then I had to switch to online teaching.   And so, the group that I had moved online and I figured out how to do it and got a little bit better at it. And then that summer I offered a class for adults. These were directors and I was in classical conversations at the time.   And so a whole bunch of teachers are expected to teach Western cultural history without a lot of background. And so some of the moms asked me if I would do my art class for them. And so I had about a group of like 50 adults and we would get on for an hour and a half every day.   And this was at the height of the shutdown when turning on the news, just stresses you out. Going to the grocery store was stressful because people were in masks or they weren't in masks or, you know, we didn't know anything. It was such a stressful time, but that hour and a half that we had together, we, our focus was on discovering a piece of art.   So, we were looking at beautiful things and then we were creating something and that changed our focus from what was going on in the world. And we would just relax, and we'd enjoy it. Having the live class kept our focus on it.   And when I don't have a live class in front of me, I'll be like, oh, I should put the laundry in or I should start dinner and I get distracted. But with that, you know, with other people on zoom, it keeps me focused. And so, we'd have this wonderful hour and a half vacation from the world.   And after it was over, I would just have this sense of peace. And then I'd come down and be like, oh yeah, that's still going on. And it was, it was so good for our mental health.   And, and I get, I hear moms tell me that the hour and a half once a week they spend with me doing art has been such a blessing. Like one student lost her father a year ago and this is helping her. She said she's finally coming out of her depression and she's finding a way to express herself and find beauty again.   And it's, it's been transformative for some students. So, it is a blessing. And I didn't, I didn't read that somewhere.   That's just from my experience. So, I'm a big believer in that.   Laura Dugger: (46:54 - 47:51) I can see why I think you're bringing up two points. I don't want to miss both with art therapy and then also art in community. So art and community first, I think for all of us at any age, what can we do as this is airing probably when everybody's getting out for summertime, how can we gather others alongside of us for whether it's our kids or us as peers to get to engage in these activities together.   And so, I want to follow up with you on that, but also before I lose my thought, I also want to link back to Karen Pence's episode. She had started art therapy for veterans, I believe, and just incredible. The healing that is possible through this.   So, do you have any thoughts Courtney on ways that we can this summer gather together community at different ages and do something artistic?   Courtney Sanford: (47:51 - 52:15) That is a good question. So, we have, I have found the online classes are the easiest for people to get to. And it's I get people ask if we can do it in person, but honestly it's hard to get people out or they're busy.   They're doing things in summer. So, we do offer a class online in the summer that's live. We have recorded classes that you could do alone or get a few people together and, do them together.   I have some sampler packs too. So, some of them are just three lessons. You could get some friends together and find, maybe you could find three, three times during the summer to do.   I have like a Vango sampler pack and a couple of short ones that you could just pay for the video and do with your friends or maybe a mother daughter event. Maybe you do the self-paced class with your daughter. And I've had some seniors, like seniors in high school, do a mother daughter class together and just say, this is such a good time for us to spend a little bit of time together, a little bonus time before they go off to college.   During the school year, we have, I have a watercolor artist friends. She lives near me and she's a professional watercolor artist and she does the class called Bible journaling. And that is a beautiful combination of a devotion and a watercolor time together.   Those are hour and a half classes too. And they meet once a week. And we sometimes we'll have grandmas, we'll have high school students, we'll have mother daughter pairs do it together.   And they actually have a little prayer time, a little study of scripture. And then then Kate teaches them step-by-step how to do a beautiful watercolor and incorporate some hand lettering in it. So that's just a beautiful fun time together.   So I highly recommend her class during the school year. If, if a mom could get away, or if you have a high school daughter to do it together, that is a great experience. And then I have a short version of art history that you could do with friends or your high school daughter.   It's called paint your way through marvelous to behold, which is just 12 lessons that goes through. And that's a variety of drawing and painting. If you wanted to do something like that.   So, lots of things, or you can check out the books. And if you feel confident following step-by-step instructions in a book, you could use the book or a combination of videos and books. If you're feeling kind of like you could lead a art group, you could get the cell page video, watch the video and then do, you know, exactly what I said, do that live with a group.   And if you have any art experience doing that, you could get, probably get, I would like invite all the homeschool moms in your co-op group to get together. And I do some, sometimes I'll go to do a mom's group, do a watercolor or I love to do the milkmaid with moms because the milkmaid is this beautiful painting from the Dutch masters of a woman cooking. She's just pouring milk.   I think she's making bread pudding and it's just so beautiful. It's like, what I think I look like homeschooling. I'm wearing like a long gold gown and those suns coming in and everything's perfect.   I'm like, this is the ideal. This is what I think homeschooling is going to look like. And then I kind of use that painting as a launch pad for painting Delft tiles from the period.   And so sometimes I'll, I'll do that with some homeschool moms because I like to encourage homeschool moms. I know it's hard. And I had some mentors when I was homeschooling that I really appreciated.   So, I'm always happy to, to be the support and be able to say it's worth it. Keep going. I know you're driving a crappy car, but it will be worth it.   And so, the sacrifices you make now totally pay off. And you know, before I know it, my son is going to be homeschooling his daughter. She's seven months now, but it's going to fly by, you know, she'll be four before you know it.   And I'll be teaching her how to paint. I suppose.   Laura Dugger: (52:16 - 53:13) When was the first time you listened to an episode of The Savvy Sauce? How did you hear about our podcast? Did a friend share it with you?   Will you be willing to be that friend now and text five other friends or post on your socials, anything about The Savvy Sauce that you love? If you share your favorite episodes, that is how we continue to expand our reach and get the good news of Jesus Christ in more ears across the world. So, we need your help.   Another way to help us grow is to leave a five-star review on Apple podcasts. Each of these suggestions will cost you less than a minute, but it will be a great benefit to us. Thank you so much for being willing to be generous with your time and share. We appreciate you.    I don't want to miss what website to direct everyone to. If they want to sign up for one of these classes, where's the best place to follow up?   Courtney Sanford: (53:14 - 54:27) Go to delightfulartco.com and on that page, you'll see live classes, self-paced classes, summer retreats. I've done adult retreats before. I'd be open to doing it again if people want to.   So, I have, I would call it private retreats. So, if you want to get a group of women together, maybe somebody has a beach house, I'll come and do the art. It could be a one day, two day, or three-day event.   So that's an option. And we have self-paced classes. So, lots of things to look at.   I have a lot of sample classes on the website too. If you want to drop in and see what they're like. I think there's a how to paint Monet's water lilies is on the site.   You can watch that and see what it's like. Some people are afraid to try an online art class, but we all loved Bob Ross, and we watched him. So, if you can imagine saying, Bob, stop, could you do that again?   That's what my classes are like, and I'll be happy to stop and show you again. And then you can hold up your work at the end and I can give you some feedback. So, I'm like the new Bob Ross.   Laura Dugger: (54:27 - 54:46) There you go. That's wonderful. Thank you for sharing that.   And Courtney, I just have a couple more questions for you. If let's turn it back to parenting. If we want to get started today and we just want next step to get started.   What is an art prompt that we can still try today?   Courtney Sanford: (54:47 - 57:26) I would look at what you're, what, what are you teaching your kids? So, if you're teaching them, maybe you have a library book on the coffee table that you're studying biology. Pull out one thing from that and draw what you see and reproduce that.   Just one drawing a week. And before you know it, you'll have a whole biology book. So, I like to instead of saying parents, you have to add on another course.   You have to add art to everything else you're doing. Slide it into what you're already doing and it will enhance what they remember about that. And it's not like a whole other subject.   So just use art as a tool to help them remember what you want them to learn anyway. So, anything you want them to teach, if you have a photo or a drawing, have them trace it or draw it. I actually another good way to start is if you have little kids and Bible story time, let them draw what you're reading about.   My son loved to do stick figures. So, I have the whole Bible told in stick figures from when I'm from my youngest kid. And it is fabulous, especially like Sodom and Gomorrah.   And, you know, there's a lot of violent stuff. Boys love that stuff. So, he illustrated a lot of the Old Testament because I read it every morning, and he would just draw what he heard me.   I think I was using the Children's Illustrated Bible. So, he had some things to look at. That's another great way to get started.   Just let them look at the story and draw in their own art journal. So, there's so many fun ways you can use it in every subject. I had a mom tell me she read me an email.   She said, my daughter is just blooming in your classes. I wish every subject could be taught with an art journal and a paint palette. And I replied, we're working on it.   We're we've got we've got Latin and art, science and art, literature and art. There's just so many ways to find inspiration and what you're already studying and find the beauty in that subject. So, in our site, our art and biology course, students do a beautiful watercolor of the DNA strand.   And they draw the cell in watercolor. And it's just beautiful. And it helps them remember it and practices their art skills.   So, it's like a two for one. Think of it as a two for one. Take art and put it in another subject.   Laura Dugger: (57:26 - 57:46) I love win wins. That sounds amazing. And Courtney, I just have one final question for you today.   We are called The Savvy Sauce because savvy is synonymous with practical knowledge or insight. And so is my final question for you today. What is your savvy sauce?   Courtney Sanford: (57:47 - 58:15) The beauty, in beauty out, has been kind of my savvy sauce and also as unto the Lord. So, whatever I do, I do as unto the Lord. If I'm homeschooling, I'm teaching biology.   I'm going to do as unto the Lord. I'm not going to hand out a worksheet. I'm going to make it.   I'm going to make it a great experience. So, I would have to say whatever you do, do it wholeheartedly as unto the Lord and not for men.   Laura Dugger: (58:16 - 58:36) What a great place to end. Courtney, you are so inspiring. You've given us great ideas and kind of confidence to get to put this into practice.   Even if we're not artists like you, we're all created in God's image and therefore can be creative. So, thank you for your time and wisdom today. Thank you so much for being my guest.   Courtney Sanford: (58:37 - 58:40) You are sure welcome. I had a great time. It's good to talk to you.   Laura Dugger: (58:41 - 1:02:25) You as well. One more thing before you go. Have you heard the term gospel before?   It simply means good news. And I want to share the best news with you. But it starts with the bad news.   Every single one of us were born sinners, but Christ desires to rescue us from our sin, which is something we cannot do for ourselves. This means there is absolutely no chance we can make it to heaven on our own. So, for you and for me, it means we deserve death, and we can never pay back the sacrifice we owe to be saved.   We need a savior. But God loved us so much, he made a way for his only son to willingly die in our place as the perfect substitute. This gives us hope of life forever in right relationship with him.   That is good news. Jesus lived the perfect life we could never live and died in our place for our sin. This was God's plan to make a way to reconcile with us so that God can look at us and see Jesus.   We can be covered and justified through the work Jesus finished if we choose to receive what He has done for us. Romans 10:9 says, “That if you confess with your mouth Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.” So, would you pray with me now?   Heavenly Father, thank you for sending Jesus to take our place. I pray someone today right now is touched and chooses to turn their life over to you. Will you clearly guide them and help them take their next step in faith to declare you as Lord of their life?   We trust you to work and change lives now for eternity. In Jesus' name we pray. Amen.   If you prayed that prayer, you are declaring him for me, so me for him. You get the opportunity to live your life for him. And at this podcast, we're called The Savvy Sauce for a reason.   We want to give you practical tools to implement the knowledge you have learned. So, you ready to get started? First, tell someone.   Say it out loud. Get a Bible. The first day I made this decision, my parents took me to Barnes & Noble and let me choose my own Bible.   I selected the Quest NIV Bible, and I love it. You can start by reading the book of John. Also, get connected locally, which just means tell someone who's a part of a church in your community that you made a decision to follow Christ.   I'm assuming they will be thrilled to talk with you about further steps, such as going to church and getting connected to other believers to encourage you. We want to celebrate with you too, so feel free to leave a comment for us here if you did make a decision to follow Christ. We also have show notes included where you can read scripture that describes this process.   And finally, be encouraged. Luke 15:10 says, “In the same way I tell you, there is rejoicing in the presence of the angels of God over one sinner who repents.” The heavens are praising with you for your decision today.   And if you've already received this good news, I pray you have someone to share it with. You are loved and I look forward to meeting you here next time.

In this episode of ADK Talks, we explore the connection between the quality of the water in Lake George and the preservation of its surrounding land. Our guest, Sarah Hoffman from the Lake George Land Conservancy (LGLC), will shed light on the ripple effect of land conservation on this iconic lake, the Queen of American Lakes.Sarah joins us to explain how keeping land wild keeps water clean, why your favorite swimming spot depends on smart preservation, and how LGLC works behind the scenes to protect the lake you love, from its mountaintop views to its crystal-clear depths. If you've ever marveled at the clarity of Lake George and thought, “Wow, this place is magical,”—well, it's not magic. It's science, strategy, and a lot of passion.Whether you're a paddler, hiker, lakeside lounger, or full-on eco-nerd, this episode connects the dots between conservation and sustainability—and shows how you, as an individual, can be a significant part of the solution.

D-Lo & KC talk Paul George and are joined by Jason Jones from The Athletic later on. 

**Seizing Accidental Moments** Fatherhood is an expedition without a clear map, each phase of our children's lives an uncharted territory waiting to be explored. On today's Dads with Daughters podcast we welcomed Gregg Behr to discuss wonder and parenting. Behr, the executive director of the Grable Foundation and a father of two, reflects on the journey that began with trepidation upon learning he was going to be a father to a daughter. Amid fears and dreams, he emphasized his role in ensuring his daughters have 'outrageous confidence' in themselves. This emotional connection to fatherhood resonates with many dads, who similarly navigate gender biases and aspire to protect their daughters from the doubts the world may cast. But Behr offers a perspective shift: difficulties in parenting are universal. Yet, as a 'girl dad,' he feels a unique joy and asserts there's no hard part to being a father to daughters when the heart focuses on the small, joyous discoveries they bring into life.  **The Power of Intentionality** Life's unpredictability can thrust accidental moments of connection to the forefront of our fatherly experiences, as Behr discovered during prolonged periods of single parenting. These unexpected times can surprisingly foster deep bonds and familiarize us with the nuanced layers of our children's personalities. Dr. Lewis reiterated the importance of embracing these accidental, seemingly mundane moments. These slices of daily life hold the potential for lasting significance in both the parent and child's heart. **Infusing Wonder into Every Day** Shifting gears, the episode delved into Behr's co-authored book 'When You Wonder, You're Learning,' inspired by none other than Fred Rogers of 'Mister Rogers' Neighborhood.' Embracing Rogers' vision, Behr shared insights into being a deliberate learner and listener, and the ways in which he integrated these values into fatherhood and philanthropy work. He emphasized the importance of wonder and curiosity, traits often lost as we transition into adulthood. Yet, in mirroring behaviors of joy and wonder for our children, we counter the inevitable dimming of creativity that life tends to impose. **Beyond the Podcast: Living Lessons** The dialogue on 'Dads with Daughters' extended beyond theory, as Behr recounted applying Fred Rogers' wisdom to difficult discussions with his daughters. Whether addressing complex questions about safety and race or fostering daily habits rooted in amazement, Behr embraced the opportunity to wonder and wander through life's maze with his daughters by his side. Dr. Lewis and Behr's exchange serves as a potent reminder: fatherhood, while fraught with challenges, is a terrain ripe with accidental marvels and intentional teachings. The episode epitomizes the podcast's mission to aid dads in nurturing strong, independent women and the reciprocal growth that fatherhood engenders. As we pull away from the microphone and the echoes of Behr's stories and insights fade, we are left with the enduring notion that to be a dad with daughters is to be an architect of wonder, festooning the foundation of fatherhood with loving, intentional moments crafted from the everyday tapestry of life. 'Dads with Daughters' offers a community where such architectural feats are not only recognized but celebrated, as we all strive to be the best dads we can be, helping our daughters ascend into their own era of wonder. TRANSCRIPT Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:05]: Welcome to dads with daughters. In this show, we spotlight dads, resources, and more to help you be the best dad you can be. Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:16]: Welcome back to dads with daughters where we bring you guests to be active participants in your daughters' lives, raising them to be strong, independent women. Really excited to have you back again this week. As always, we come every week and we have great conversations and I love being able to walk beside you as you are figuring this thing out called fatherhood. Every day is a journey, and every phase of life that your kids are in is a journey. And I'm just glad to be able to have these conversations and be able to be a part of it with you. Fatherhood can feel alone at times, but it doesn't have to be. And it is so important to be able to connect with other dads, to be able to create community, to be able to learn and be open to learn about things that may help you to be a better dad. And that's why every week I love being able to bring you different guests, people that have gone before you that are doing this alongside you as well, that have their own daughters and are learning along the way to be able to help you, to be able to give you some perspective, some insights, some things that might help you as you move forward in your own fatherhood journey. Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:01:28]: This week, we've got another great guest with us. Greg Baer is with us. And Greg is the executive director of the Grable Foundation, but he's also a father of 2 daughters. And we're gonna be talking about his own journey as a father, but we're also gonna be talking about the a journey that he had in not only writing a book, but really bringing a new perspective into his own fatherhood journey, which was that looking at the concept of wonder. And we're gonna talk about that. So we'll get to that in just a few moments. But the first and foremost, I am just really excited to have Greg here. Greg, thanks so much for being here today. Gregg Behr [00:02:05]: Chris, I am absolutely honored to be here, and I love how you described figuring it out because I feel like I'm gonna be figuring out fatherhood right in front of you right now. I Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:02:15]: think you're giving yourself too little credit because I think you're doing some good things, and we're gonna talk about those things. But first and foremost, one of the things that I love doing is turning the clock back in time. And you've got 2 daughters, so I wanna go back. I wanna go back to that first moment that you found out that you were going to be a father to a daughter. What was going through your head? Gregg Behr [00:02:32]: I was scared. I think probably like a lot of dads. It's not that I necessarily wanted a boy. We were hopeful for kids. We were hopeful for a healthy child. And when we learned it's a girl, I remember thinking, I don't know anything about girls. I wasn't raised in a family with sisters. Oh my gosh. Gregg Behr [00:02:50]: What am I going to do? And so there was joy about we're pregnant, joy about, the pregnancy going well and worry about what do I need to know? What do I need to learn? I knew enough at the time to know my number one job in their lives is to make sure that they just have outrageous confidence about themselves and what they can do in the world. And that so that that compass has always stayed with me from the very beginning before the moment they entered this world. Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:03:20]: Now I I've heard that before from other dads, from pretty much every father that I talked to, that fear comes with not only fatherhood, but being a father to a daughter. And I guess first and foremost, as you think about that fear, what was your biggest fear in raising a daughter? Gregg Behr [00:03:36]: Yeah. Chris, I think it was just it was that I didn't know what I didn't know. I think I fast forwarded all the way from 0 to puberty and I'd like to think that I noticed enough about the world to know that there's gender bias and things might be a little bit harder for a girl than it is for a boy. And so I immediately had that, like, I wanna be a bear dad who is, like, really protective of her daughter because she's gonna be amazing, and I want her to have all sorts of possibilities in this world, and I'm gonna fight off all of the gremlins who are going to poison her with doubt or get in her way because she's gonna be every bit of what she wants to be as a boy could be. Like, they seem like silly things to say out loud, but, like, these were thoughts in my head at the time. Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:04:18]: And I think that that goes through a lot of dad's heads. And as you move along, between those different phases in your kids' lives. You learn a little bit more, not only about yourself, but about your daughters. You learn that the differences may not be as different, even though they are. I mean, there there's definite differences there. What would you say has been the hardest part for you in being a father to daughters? Gregg Behr [00:04:40]: There's no hard part. There's honestly, there's just joy. Like the hard part hearkens back to something you said a moment ago. It's just hard being a parent. It's hard being a dad. I can't imagine living in this world without being a girl dad because I'm now the dad of 2 girls. And I will say Chris, we lost a child in between our 2 girls. And so I remember thinking when we had a healthy pregnancy and we were knew we were gonna have a second child, I was actually begging at that point. Gregg Behr [00:05:06]: I'm like, I want a girl. Right? Like, I fell in love with my first little girl, and I knew I'd fall in love with my second little girl. And I guess at the time, we had friends who had babies and young kids, and I was like, boys are crazy. What is wrong with that species over there? And I really wanted a girl. Like, I feel so lucky to have 2 healthy girls. I would have been happy with 10 girls. These young women now they're ages 10 12. They are strong and confident and powerful and fun. Gregg Behr [00:05:35]: They have good hearts, smart brains. Like, I love being around them. I guess I don't know at this point what it would be like to be the dad of a boy, but I feel so blessed to have these 2 girls. And it's just the hard part is just trying to be a good parent every day in the mundane little things in their lives, because it's those mundane things that I know add up to the big things. Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:05:54]: Now with 2 kids, you have to find that balance to be able to create those unique relationships with each of them because each child is unique. Many times when you have more than one child, the personalities are very different. So talk to me about how you've been able to cultivate, how you've been able to work to develop those unique relationships with both your daughters. Gregg Behr [00:06:17]: Chris, I think in some ways, I've I've tried to be deliberate and intentional about this, and in some ways, I've been accidental. So let me explain. So in terms of being deliberate and intentional, even though I'm a workaholic and I probably don't give enough attention to my family, my personal life, my kids, the way that I should, I do try and be deliberate about the time that I spend with them during the time, you know, when I'm able to be home, when they get home from after school, they get home at different hours, their bed routines, and spending some time with them before they go to bed. And also because we have 2, my wife and I are often going in different directions because, So I try and be really deliberate about the time that we have cars together or on the sidelines or in a gym or whatever it might be. And just I try and be really mindful about being alongside them, not as a friend, but as a parent. The accidental part is this. So during these past 2 years, my wife's father, my father-in-law fell he became quite ill and ultimately passed. And I mentioned this to say that he lives a long distance away, half a world away. Gregg Behr [00:07:28]: And so what was thrust upon us as a family was that my wife was gone for long intervals at a time over a 2 year period. And there were, there were many months. I mean, we're talking more than 6, 7, 8 months that it was just me, single working dad with my 2 girls. And I don't wish this on anyone. It's hard. Honestly, Chris, I have no idea how single parents get by in this world having had a small window into that. And I will say this time when there was just the 3 of us, our relationship is so fundamentally different than it was previous to that. And there's a closeness and I really got to know both girls really well because I, you know, I had to spend time whether I wanted to or not. Gregg Behr [00:08:05]: Right? Like, I had to spend time with them in all sorts of household activities, in their school and extracurricular activities, just in their lives in general, in the little chat, you know, mini breaks and things we try to take, in the vacations, or even just walking in the neighborhood. And it's this accidental time that I'm unexpectedly grateful for. Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:08:24]: Accidental time. I love that concept because I think that many times in the small moments when you come home from work and your child asks you to come in or they want to just they ask you to sit down and do something with them. Those can be accidental moments. Those can be those moments that become very important to the child and to you. And as they get older, it's not always easy to find that time, or that they want to spend the time. But it's important to take advantage of that time when they give it to you. Gregg Behr [00:09:00]: Chris, I just wanna celebrate what you just said. Right? Because one one of the things I learned during this period is exactly what we described. Now that we're lucky enough to be back together as a family, it's still noticing those moments, those mundane moments where accidental things might happen or when one of my daughters comes to me and says, hey, daddy. Can you take a break? Or can you play this game with me? And and I'm now much better, although I could always be better. I'm much better about noticing those moments and taking advantage of them. Because I I know that quip that people say all the time that the days are long, the years are short, but until you experience that, you don't really understand that. And so when one of my kids comes to me or if there's a moment, I try and be much more intentional than I was previously about spending that time with them. Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:09:43]: It is so important to find that time and to have that special time because as you said, the the years are short. I've come to find that and they go by really fast, especially as your child gets older, they get involved in more things in the years just fly by. And people tell you that, especially when you have young kids and you're like, that's not the case. You know, it's gonna be a heck of a long time until they're 18, a heck of a long time until they're in college. And I got all the time in the world. And then in a blink of an eye, it is over and things change again. So you have to be present in the moment in that regard, because it is fleeting. Even though it may seem long, if you have young children now, it does go by fast. Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:10:28]: And you definitely have to take advantage of that. Now, I know that every father has moments that are memorable, especially moments individually with your children, where you've been able to create those special memories, the special experiences, what have been the most memorable experiences that you've been able to have thus far as a father with your daughters? Gregg Behr [00:10:50]: There are some moments with my girls that we've repeated because they're Monday moments that we've made special. In the fall, it's often the case. I love college football. College football could be on the TV which we can see from the kitchen and my girls and I love making homemade pizzas from scratch or when the snow comes and maybe every time the snow comes now pouring maple syrup on fresh snow and eating that and celebrating that, or just holidays. Like we make big deals in my family of birthdays and holidays like Christmas and New Year's and Valentine's Day and St. Patrick's Day. It's all of those little daily life things. And it's also true that some of our more special times together are when we're unburdened by work or the errands we have to run because we've gone away. Gregg Behr [00:11:36]: You know, we've gotten away for a weekend or we've been able lucky enough, privileged enough to schedule a trip. And even though, Chris, I'm I'm the sort of person that makes lists and I'm pretty deliberate and intentional about my work, When I travel, I like to go trucking. Right? Like, where is this road gonna take us? Or, I just read about this farmer's market in this part of Montreal. Let's go see what it's like. Right? A lot of unplanned time and I feel like those moments of unplanned time end up yielding the most special opportunities. Like, oh, remember we had that cheese or, like, remember we stumbled upon that zipline and we went ziplining over these beautiful mountains. Right? Like, it's those, I feel like, Chris, those most special moments are, you know, maybe it's the deliberate trucking or the deliberate exploration without a road map or a a plan for where we're gonna walk to that day, but it's those moments that I think as a family, we treasure the most. Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:12:29]: The moments that you just talked about and the things that you're reflecting on make me really think about the fact that you are an author of a book called when you wonder you're learning. And in your book, you really dive deep into the concept of wonder, and really bring some of the lessons that mister Rogers brought out into the world in my formative years and the formative years of some of you as well. And I guess first and foremost, as we delve into this, I'm really interested in the concept of this book and the concept of wonder. But I'm also interested in the origin story of this because, I mean, mister Rogers definitely had a strong impact on people of a certain age, we'll say, of people that grew up with his teachings. Some others are just still are were introduced to him after the fact, through reruns and things like that. But what made you and your colleague, Ryan Radetzky, decide that you wanted to delve deeper into what mister Rogers was teaching and how any of us could capture wonder and put it into practice, whether it be a teacher in a classroom, or a father in his own home? Gregg Behr [00:13:47]: Thank you for that question, Chris, or us, what you need to know about me and my coauthor Ryan is that we're kids of Western Pennsylvania. I'm podcasting to you right now from Pittsburgh, which is significant because it's from Pittsburgh that Fred Rogers recorded mister Rogers' neighborhood for nearly 40 years at WQED, America's first public television station. And Fred Rogers himself is a native of Western Pennsylvania. So I mentioned that to say there's something in the water around here. Even though mister Rogers is an American icon, also a Canadian icon, he felt like he was ours. Right? And we had the experience of living in his midst, and and I had the privilege of of knowing him and subsequently his wife. And you mentioned earlier that I work at the Grable Foundation. I work in education philanthropy. Gregg Behr [00:14:33]: And so for a couple of decades now, I've I've been the luckiest kid in Pittsburgh who gets to figure out how to support amazing teachers and librarians and museum exhibit designers in places like schools and libraries and museums trying to make learning experiences better for kids and their parents, families, and caregivers. Great support for the learning landscape all around Western Pennsylvania. And you could imagine in the course of that work, we we, you know, we're trying to make sure we're doing our jobs well. So we're reading a lot about what makes for great learning experiences. And it was about 7 years ago that Ryan and I are reading these articles and peer reviewed pieces that come from the University of Pittsburgh and Carnegie Mellon right in our own yard or the University of Michigan, MIT, Stanford and beyond. And these wickedly smart learning scientists were writing papers that increasingly read to me and Ryan as if they were scripts from mister Rogers' Neighborhood. And as you say, there are generations of Americans, including the 2 of us and you, who grew up watching mister Rogers. And we started to think, you know, is there another story to tell about mister Rogers? He's come back to our popular culture in movies like Morgan Neville's amazing documentary and and the Tom Hanks biopic. Gregg Behr [00:15:46]: But is there a story to tell about Fred who's not just that loving character that we remember in all of those television visits, but also Fred the learning scientist who was incredibly deliberate and intentional about his work and maybe a learning scientist who left us some blueprints about the things that we need to be doing today in our own homes or our schools and in our communities and neighborhoods. And Chris, it turns out after years of research and a lot of time studying the work of Fred Rogers, meeting with his colleagues, going to the archives, there in fact was a book to be written. And so we wrote, When You Wonder, You're Learning Mr. Rogers Enduring Lessons for Raising Creative, Curious, Caring Kids. And in that book, we talk about the tools for learning and the ways in which Fred Rogers in the neighborhood cultivated curiosity, protected our creativity, found ways to support deep deep listening and loving speech. All I could go on with a a number of tools that we learned about his work that we could translate with practical, accessible, doable examples of things that people are doing today in our schools, museums, libraries, and neighborhoods to really live out what we describe as the Fred method that combines that learning science that we know today about how learning works, coupled with what today we call whole child. It wasn't used during Fred's time, but that sense that every single kid and honestly, every adult goes through the continuous learning that's social, emotional, cognitive, physical, and beyond. Right? And so learning science plus whole chart equals the FRED method. Gregg Behr [00:17:15]: And there's also a job and personal hazard to co authoring a book like this because then you start to wrestle in your own life. Like, am I doing this? Am I doing it well enough? And that's where we find ourselves today. Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:17:26]: So talk to me about that wrestling and what you, after all these years of exploring and delving deeper into what Fred was trying to teach that what you personally learned for yourself that you could incorporate into your own fatherhood that you either were doing or weren't doing? And how did you have to make adjustments? Gregg Behr [00:17:50]: What Fred did so well is he did lots and lots of little things. So we've used the word mundane a number of times in this conversation, and it's the mundane moments in life that matter. And I also speak to a big moment too. But it's the mundane moments maybe as I'm having a conversation about, you know, a new hard topic. Like, maybe my daughter's in middle school reading dystopian novels and, like, how do you begin to explain that concept? And I remember well that Fred, when he was trying to take kids to a place of mystery, he didn't start by taking us, for example, all the way to the crayon factory. Like, here's how crayons are made, kids. Now he started with his easel in his living room, a safe, comfortable place for us, showed us a crayon, something with which we were all familiar, started drawing and creating art, and talked a lot about that crayon, you know, and then use that simple thing that was so familiar to us to then take us off to the place of mystery about, for example, how crayons are made. And so I find myself, for example, in conversations with my kids today, wondering, like, okay, where do I start with a place that they can begin before trying to explain, like, here's how elevators run or whatever, like, whatever the subject matter might be that, you know, because kids ask thousands of questions, which is another thing. Gregg Behr [00:19:09]: Right? Like, I've learned to be quiet and to listen to their questions and encourage all sorts of questions and not be quick to say, like, hey, Alexa. What's the answer to this? Right? Like, even though sometimes that has to happen. I try and, you know, mister Rogers did, like, convey a sense like, Catherine, I don't I don't know what the answer that to that is, but, you know, later together, let's let's figure out if we can understand why the willow tree is blooming before every other tree in our yard. Right? Like, whatever it is because as you know, kids ask all sorts of questions. It also goes back to that sensibility that I described of of trucking, of exploring. You know, having times on Saturdays or Sundays when we tend to have the freest time in our lives to say like, what are we gonna try right now? Or, like, what if we put these three things together? Or, you know, mommy's making fried rice all the time and she's grabbing things from the refrigerator. What if we grab 3 things from our refrigerator, like the TV show Chopped and like, how could we put them together? So Chris, it's all sorts of little things, but if I may, may I share a big example too? This happened to me a couple years ago. Our book had just been released and it was a Friday night in March. Gregg Behr [00:20:17]: I was exhausted. I wanted to do nothing more than just lie on my sofa and watch NCAA March Madness basketball games. Right? Like there were 5 games on at the same time. Teams, I some of whom I'd never heard of before, like, oh, this is gonna be great. I'm gonna watch these amazing basketball games. And I'm sitting there watching these games and my daughter is resting with her head on the the side of the sofa. And she turns to me, Chris, and says, daddy, am I gonna be shot? Which for me, it was like, what? What did you just say? And sadly, there are a number of probably a lot of dads in this country who've heard that question before and the lots of others who've never heard it. And I hope they never ever hear that question. Gregg Behr [00:20:58]: And what I realized at that moment was that the news of the day of the week had gotten into my household and my kids are of mixed race. My wife is Asian American. And that week, a number of Asian Americans had been massacred in Atlanta. And somehow the news of that had gotten into our household even though maybe naively naively so, I try and protect my kids from, you know, all sorts of bad news in the world. I realized in that moment, Chris, it was like Fred Rogers lessons came rushing to me. 1st of all, I have to acknowledge this question. I can't obviously can't ignore it, but even though I wanted to ignore it and watch Cleveland say or whomever playing. Right? Like, I need to acknowledge this question, notice it, convey to my daughter that she's safe. Gregg Behr [00:21:41]: Like you're physically safe right here in this moment. You're emotionally safe that I, a carrying a dot in your life and right by your side. Honestly, I don't have the answers to this, but later right now and later in the coming days weeks, you know, we'll wonder together. We'll talk about this. We'll listen to each other. We'll talk about why this is on your mind. What's burdening you? Because as Fred said, anything that's mentionable is manageable. And there were so many lessons from our book, which is a book ultimately about creating those joyful, wondrous learning experiences in big and small ways for the kids in our lives, no matter what our role is, whether it's a parent or classroom teacher librarian or otherwise. Gregg Behr [00:22:19]: But in that moment as a dad watching back college basketball, like all of those lessons came home in a really powerful and profound way that obviously has become a core memory for me. Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:22:29]: It's definitely a powerful moment, a powerful moment between you and your kids. And one thing that comes to mind when I think about what you just said was that for a lot of people, wonder disappears. And there's a point in their life when something some kind of a switch is flipped. And you go from this childhood wonder of looking at the world, questioning things, and looking at things with different, we'll say different glasses to an acceptance of the world as it is. And maybe not questioning or wondering as much. So as you were going through this for yourself, and learning more about what Fred had put into the world, and you're writing this and putting something new out into the world to try to challenge people to flip that switch back on, What did you find that could help people to rekindle that wonder within their lives, that could rekindle and flip that switch for themselves a little bit easier than it might be for their kids so that they can then channel that wonder back into themselves, but also encourage that wonder to stay flipped on for their kids as well. Gregg Behr [00:23:49]: That's one of our biggest tasks as grown ups in kids' lives. And as you note, it does seem apparent that we lose that sense of creativity and the wonder and and forget the joys of something that maybe brought us lots of joy and we maybe used to spend lots of time doing. Right? Fred Rogers said, the best teacher in the world is the one who loves what he or she does and loves it right in front of you. Now couple that with learning science research. And one of the many studies that Ryan and I cite is some work by George Land, actually from the previous century. And in his research, he documented Chris exactly what you described because he had used this test for NASA, our space agency, and identified that so many 5 year olds, it was 98% of 5 year olds who took this test developed for NASA scored so well that they qualified as creative geniuses. Right? And and to your point, like, you can think about little kids and they they come up with the genius solutions to all sorts of things in their life. So, like, they wonder and they're creating and they're like, what happens if I do this? And what George Landon and his team did was that they tested that same group of 5 year olds every 5 years through adulthood. Gregg Behr [00:24:56]: And 98% at 5 years old by adulthood, that percentage had dropped to 2%. Now importantly, what George land and his team concluded was not that our creativity just naturally fades, but actually that we as, you know, teenagers and then as adults learn all sorts of noncreative behaviors. You know, we learn to suppress those things or to take in other people's judgment. We learned that sense of perspective taking and empathy building. And what's Fred Rogers' solution to this? It's to model behavior. And it's why when you go back as an adult and look at what he did on that program, you could see Fred in his living room and he could be, you know, putting together popsicle sticks or cutting with felt. And he made it clear at that moment that it was bringing him great joy. And it wasn't just Fred. Gregg Behr [00:25:44]: Right? It was Yo Yo Ma and Julia Child and all of those folks we got to meet, the celebrities really that we met in the program. And Fred wasn't celebrating their gold medals or their major accomplishments. He was celebrating the joy of Yo Yo Yo Ma playing the cello or Julie Child cutting up ingredients. And it was also the the guests I mean, it was also the characters on the show. Right? Handyman Negri was not just the hand man. He was the neighborhood guitarist. Officer Clemens was not just policing the neighborhood. He was an opera singer. Gregg Behr [00:26:12]: Right? Fred was making it clear that people have joy and that they we don't need to give up the things that bring us joy and creativity as we age. And so it's a reminder to us, as Fred said, if we want to be the best teacher in the world, that we have to love what we're doing right in front of our kids. It's why a teacher who loves beekeeping and brings beekeeping into her math class can light up a classroom around math because she's brought beekeeping something she loves into that classroom. It's like me jumping on my skateboard in my neighborhood and not realizing that all the kids are watching and having joy as an adult going down my cul de sac and surviving. And unbeknownst to me, loving what I was doing at that moment and sparking an interest in those kids. We as grown ups need to be really intentional and deliberate as we do things as much as possible demonstrate that the joy that it's bringing us. So there's good reason to pick up that guitar or pull out those knitting instruments or or to do the things that bring us joy or to try new things, but whatever we're doing, to be clear that it's bringing us joy. That's how we counter that sense of losing creativity and wonder. Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:27:21]: So how do you define joy? And how do you define wonder? And I can see concentric circles that there's an overlap, but how do you define them? Gregg Behr [00:27:31]: Yeah. Joy isn't just happiness. Joy is that internal sense of awe about experiencing something, witnessing something, doing something and in that sense of awe, I think is a a deep connection to wondering because in that moment you start to look around and you start to notice. Right? Like, noticing is really important because in that wondering, you start to then ask questions or provoke ideas in yourself or in others. And so to me, that sense of awe is in many ways a through line between joy and wonder. Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:28:05]: Now you've put this book out in the world. It's been out for a while now. And you've been traveling, you've been talking about it, you're taking what you've been learning and trying to help others to incorporate this. What's been the response from your own kids to what you wrote, but also the change that they may have seen in you based on what you learned and are putting into place now? Gregg Behr [00:28:31]: That is such a great question, Chris. And I thought you were gonna ask me about how the audience reacts. Right? Because it's so fun to talk about something, some person like Fred Rogers to whom there's such an emotional connection. And Ryan and I have been able to identify from others in the world all sorts of examples of FRED method like approaches. But to turn that question to myself, I know one of the things that my kids have seen because I've taken them to I've taken them to events. It could be book signings. It could be a talk I was giving either locally or another city. Like we've created little adventures about this. Gregg Behr [00:29:04]: And they've seen in me and my coauthor, Ryan, the joy that we have talking about this book. So there's no doubt that they've seen the joy of producing something in the world that matters to others in ways little and big. And maybe because of that, I don't know. I've seen my kids doing more writing, doing more reading, doing a bit more presentations and playful things that they did as younger kids, as preteens. Now, I hope they see in me the joy that I've had and the hard work, right? Like it's not like there's hard work and joy too. Right? The hard work and the commitment that I've had to something and then to find ways to share in ways that are helpful to others. I'm so hopeful they've they've noticed that. I think that they have. Gregg Behr [00:29:50]: I wish they were here right now to tell you, Chris, what they've noticed and what they haven't, but that's what I hope they've noticed. Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:29:56]: It's always a great way to be able to, later tonight, say, let's talk about this. Let's explore. Gregg Behr [00:30:01]: What do you wonder about when you wonder about daddy's book about wonder? Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:30:05]: Very that's very meta. That's very meta. Now we always finish our interviews with what I like to call our fatherhood 5 where I ask you 5 more questions that to delve deeper into you as a dad. You ready? Gregg Behr [00:30:16]: I hope so. Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:30:17]: In one word, what is fatherhood? Gregg Behr [00:30:19]: Patience. Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:30:20]: When was the time that you finally felt like you succeeded at being a father to a daughter? Gregg Behr [00:30:24]: In the quiet of putting them to bed at night and knowing that they were rested, well fed, and that there was some joy and laughter and goodness to their day. Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:30:36]: Now, if I was to talk to your kids, how would they describe you as a dad? Gregg Behr [00:30:40]: Silly, sometimes loud, hardworking, occasionally demanding. Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:30:44]: In 10 years from now, what do you want them to say? Gregg Behr [00:30:46]: I love you. Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:30:47]: Now who inspires you to be a better dad? Gregg Behr [00:30:49]: Oh, Chris, as I start to tear up over here, I can't help but think of my own dad. My dad's a big guy. He's an amazing dad, big guy, big papa bear, played football, and he wears his emotions on his sleeve. And I feel like ever since I became a dad, I wear my emotions on my sleeve in the same way. And I I've gotten really comfortable with that. And if I can be half as bit as my dad was a dad to me and my brother, to my own girls, then I will have done a really excellent job for them. Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:31:22]: Now you've given a lot of piece of advice today. And as you think about all dads that are out there, what's one piece of advice you'd want to leave with all of them? Gregg Behr [00:31:32]: I tell my girls every day to use their good heart and their smart brain. And I suppose time will tell, but I hope that just the repeated conveyance to them, like that sharing with them, the encouraging of them to use their good heart, to use their smart brain, and to know that they're beautiful will prove to be sticky in the human beings that they become. Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:31:52]: Well, Greg, I just wanna say thank you. Thank you for being here for doing what you're doing to inspire wonder in kids, in adults, and challenging parents to encourage wonder within their kids as they grow up and flipping that switch back on to bring wonder back into our lives. If people wanna find out more about you, where should they go? Gregg Behr [00:32:15]: They would find our book at when you wonder.org. And happily, you can ideally find it at your local bookstore, also at Amazon, Barnes and Noble. And I'm also on X and LinkedIn, Greg Bear. Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:32:27]: Again, Greg, thank you so much for being here today, and I wish you all the best. Gregg Behr [00:32:31]: Chris, thank you so much. What a complete joy and honor to be with you, and thanks for letting me figure some of this out right in front of you. Thank you. Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:32:38]: The Fatherhood Insider is the essential resource for any dad that wants to be the best dad that he can be. We know that no child comes with an instruction manual and most dads are figuring it out as they go along, and the fatherhood insider is full of resources and information that will up your game on fatherhood. Through our extensive course library, interactive forum, step by step roadmaps, and more. You will engage and learn with experts, but more importantly, dads like you. So check it out at fathering together dot org. If you are a father of a daughter and have not yet joined the dads with daughters Facebook community, there's a link in the notes today. Dads with daughters is a program of fathering together. We look forward to having you back for another great guest next week, all geared to helping you raise strong empowered daughters and be the best dad that you can be. Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:33:30]: We're all in the same boat, And it's full of tiny screaming passengers. We spend the time. We give the lessons. We make the meals. We buy them presents presents and bring your a game. Because those kids are growing fast. The time goes by just like a dynamite blast, calling astronauts and firemen, carpenters, and musclemen. Get out and be the world to them. Be the Best dad that you can be.

In the last two episodes, I discussed the Higher Mind Training, which is a unique personal growth program that is being prepared for release by the Better Angels Publishing Company. I also mentioned that for the past six months I have been teaching some of its basic understandings and techniques to the counselors and residents of the James A. Casey House in Wilkes-Barre, PA, which is an innovative halfway house where about fifty men live, recovering from the effects of severe alcohol and substance abuse.           This effort has been kind of an experiment because although I have been speaking about and teaching the fundamentals of the training for many years, I have never exposed it to a population of this kind and had no idea what to expect. The results have been deeply inspiring. It's been obvious that these guys have never heard anything about their greater inner potential before. Neither well-educated nor well-funded, most of them have been beaten down by the external world for most of their existence. They've been told that they are losers, that they've basically ruined their lives and that the road ahead of them is a dangerous, thorny, uphill climb, with a high probability that they'll fail in their efforts to recover.   Suddenly, they're being given new information - that they were born geniuses and that they still have the genius potential inside of them. And most importantly, that they're not their minds, Even though it may be filled with anger, fear and thousands of other forms of negativity, their finite mind with its vicious inner critic is not who they are. It's just one part of a much larger intelligence that they have. And they don't have to buy into the miserable story that it's telling them all day long. They can let it go and move on, because there's a bright road ahead of them if they choose to choose it.   We also show them a few simple inner exercises and even though they may get only a brief introduction to inner freedom, it's clearly a liberating experience for them and it's been an incredible phenomenon to watch. After one exercise, a resident smiled at me in disbelief and said, “I have never felt anything like this before in my life.” During these months, as I began to prepare for the return of the podcast schedule, I decided to make some of the key points of the training available to all our podcast subscribers. There is still quite a lot of work to be done prior to the program's release and I wanted to make this information available to you now. You may find it to be quite helpful and there's no reason for you to have to wait. Now although a lot of what I am going to present to you may seem basic at first, just take it in. I have found that most people have never had a clear introduction to these inner fundamentals and having a clear understanding of them can be critical to our long-term happiness. Afterall, they pertain to the achievement of our highest human potential, which will enhance every area of our lives.  So, let's begin with a somewhat tricky problem that can be a real barrier to the growth of our inner awareness and that is – on a certain level, we're know-it-alls. We think we already know everything. Now I'm only talking about a relatively small part of our mind, but it has a pretty loud voice. And there is a companion trait that comes along with being a know-it-all  and that is - we like to be right.  Actually, we love to be right, but we make far too much out of it. And it's not just an annoying trait, it can be downright dangerous. When it gets out of hand, wars can start with terrible catastrophes following. Sometimes you have to wonder: why are we so proud about being right, anyway? Being right isn't such a big accomplishment. Even a stopped clock is right twice a day. This particular part of our mind isn't really such a big deal. It's bark is much worse than its bite, but if we want to grow, we really do need to grow beyond it. It reminds me of a story from the old days, and I mean the thousands of years old days, when a student approached a master and asked to be taught knowledge of the inner self. “Let's have some tea first,” the master said. He then poured the student a cup of tea. When the cup was full, he stopped for a few seconds and said, “Here, let me give you a little more.”  The master then poured more tea on top of the filled cup and the tea ran onto the saucer. The master kept pouring more tea onto the cup and it ran onto the table. He kept pouring and it ran over the table onto the ground. He kept pouring for a few more moments, then he looked at the would-be student. “You see, all the tea that was poured into your filled cup just ran off and ended up on the ground. It was a complete waste and never did you or anybody else any good. Is that right?” he asked, and the student nodded. “You see, you have to empty your cup before you can fill it.” So typical of Ancient Wisdom - an extremely simple statement with an extremely profound meaning.   By the way, this know-it-all, love-to-be-right trait isn't bound to only individuals. Every culture throughout history seems to think that it's completely advanced. Even the most appalling barbaric ones thought they were great. So, both as individuals and as societies we remain proud of our so-called knowledge. And this always leads me to one of my favorite quotes, which comes from Thomas Edison, who is still considered to be one of the greatest inventors of all times. He is credited with over a thousand patented inventions including the light bulb, the phonograph, the motion picture, and the telegraph. Pretty impressive! Probably one of the smartest humans ever! Well, here's his view about the state of our knowledge. “We don't know one millionth of one percent about anything,” he said. Hearing that phrase and knowing that it comes from him always makes me humble. And when it comes to inner growth, humility is one of the most reliable allies we have.   With that, let's quickly recall that famous study that was commissioned by NASA in which Dr. George Land found that 98% of us begin life as creative geniuses and remain that way though the age of five. Then it progressively diminishes until by our early twenties, only two percent of us are in the genius category. But according to Dr. Land, this remarkable level of intelligence remains within us and can be recovered relatively quickly. Personally, the thought that there are advanced levels of consciousness within our intelligence that we have not yet discovered has always intrigued me and through research I have found that this concept has been expressed in every culture and religion throughout human history. I have mentioned in a previous episode that one of my favorite ideas about this is the inner state called Satchitanand, as expressed in Vedantic philosophy. The term can be broken down into three components: Sat, which is truth. Chit, which is consciousness and Anand, which is bliss. The ancient teaching is that although we may not be aware of it, there is a profound state within us which is connected to eternal truth, unending happiness, and immortal contentment. Together, they represent the ultimate reality or supreme principle, which exists both within and without. George Harrison expressed the concept in his classic song, “Within You Without You.” Personally, I fell in love with the idea when I first heard the song on the Sergeant Pepper album. I was in college at the time, it was the late sixties and chaos had become the societal norm. Things were falling apart as quickly as they were coming together, but as George put it, “When you see beyond yourself you may find that peace of mind is waiting there.” Now, with the idea that there is a pristine state of peace, consciousness and bliss within our awareness, along with Dr. Land's conclusion that we are in a genius state of consciousness from birth through age five, I started thinking about our early years, especially before the age of three. It seemed to me that if a toddler is not hungry, tired or in need of being changed, and nothing external is bothering them, they seem to exist in a most amazing state of being. They're creative, expressive and completely aware. And they're incredibly happy. Indeed, according to current research the average toddler laughs about 300 times a day. Of course, we can blow right by that number but stop and think about it.  That's a lot of laughter. So, what are they laughing about? They don't have much of an understanding about anything in the so-caller real world, so they're not laughing at a good joke or because they just found out they unexpectedly came into a ton of money. No. The fact is they're not laughing at anything at all. They don't need a reason to be happy. They just exist in a state of consciousness that is inherently joyful. And a countless number of masters and teachers over thousands of years, have told us that this state of consciousness is within us now. In that regard, I'm reminded of a poem called “Samadhi” that was written by the great teacher Paramhansa Yogananda. Samadhi is a term that refers to the highest meditative state where the individual achieves union with the Divine. He wrote it after he first experienced it as a yogi and this is the ending - “Spotless is my mental sky. Below, ahead, and high above - Eternity and I, one united ray. I, a tiny bubble of laughter, have become the Sea of Mirth Itself.”  Can you imagine that? Living in a state of inner consciousness where you have transcended the bonds of earth life and merged with the Divine. And what about that term - the Sea of Mirth itself? The dictionary defines “mirth” as abundant gladness expressed by laughter. I don't know about you, but with all the ideas about God and heaven that I've been taught throughout my whole life, and believe me, that's a lot of ideas – I never came across the idea of God being abundantly happy and expressing it with laughter. The big guy they taught me about seemed to be pretty pissed most of the time and was always ready to smite somebody. Well, so much for concepts. But also, to appreciate the incredible state of being that we have within us, we don't have to go looking for some arcane, yogic, meditative state. It's much simpler than that. We can just look within our own heart, which is already filled with what Lincoln called “the better angels of our nature.” There are hundreds of average, everyday traits that we have within our awareness that are miraculous in their own way. Love, gratitude, kindness, generosity, integrity, and compassion are just a few. So, if we start out life in this incredible state of consciousness and it is all within us right now, a most obvious question comes up: What happened to us? And more importantly, what can happen for us? Well, we've covered a lot of ground here and as you might guess, this will be the topic of the next episode. As always, keep your eyes, mind and heart open and let's get together in the next one…

In the last episode, I offered a brief introduction to The Higher Mind Training, which is the next project that will be released by the Better Angels Publishing Company. I mentioned the remarkable fact that modern neuroscience is in the process of verifying the basis of the higher understandings that have been expressed by Ancient Wisdom for tens of thousands of years. Now, we don't have the time to go into the specific scientific details of what happens to our brain and nervous system when our inner awareness evolves into its higher levels. Just suffice it so say that the physiological proof of its positive effects on us is irrefutable.            I also presented the work of Dr. George Land and the study he produced for NASA that indicated that an astounding 98% of us were born geniuses and remained that way through the age of five. And by the time we reach adulthood, only about 2% of us are still in that genius category. But amazingly, that level of intelligence hasn't left our consciousness. It's still there and we can definitely reconnect with it. And finally, I began the episode with the statement that the Higher Mind Training presents the average, everyday person with practical understandings and techniques they can use to expand their awareness and take them into our larger sphere of human intelligence. It is specifically designed to be simple to understand and easy to put into practice. So, with this in mind, let me give you a brief update about some powerful events that have taken place with the Higher Mind Training during this past spring and summer. About six months ago, I was invited to teach some of its basic principles to the counselors who serve in a half-way house in Wilkes-Barre, PA as well as the residents who live there. The results of this initial phase of implementation have been truly encouraging.           The name of the establishment is the James A. Casey House and it has been in operation for over twenty years. Its population is about fifty men, all of whom are recovering alcoholics and/or drug addicts.  And these guys are all veterans of some truly hard times. Many have just been released from incarceration, several have recently been subject to severe overdoses, and many were homeless before the Casey House took them in.           You could say that a lot of them are living on the very bottom rung of society's ladder, with very little education and even less wherewithal to survive the school of hard knocks that they find themselves involuntarily enrolled in. For me, although I have been speaking about and teaching the ideas and methods involved with the Higher Mind Training for many years, I had never tried to apply it to a population of this kind and had no idea what to expect. As I began to train the counselors, I also held six training sessions directly with the residents so I could gain first-hand knowledge of their reactions. It was far more powerful than I had anticipated. Not only did they understand the material, but many had uplifting, liberating experiences practicing it. The results with the counselors, who continue to learn about the training and practice it have been equally impressive as well. And even though we are still in the early stages of implementation at the Casey House, the results have been truly encouraging.   One of the key fundamentals of the training is that most of us live in a state of Self-Sabotage and this is clearly at the root of most of the problems of the residents of the Casey House. The basic description of the state of Self-Sabotage is quite simple. We keep getting in our own way of making progress in our lives.  If it becomes bad enough, we become our own worst enemy. To one degree or another, this happens to almost all of us. No matter who we are or what we may have accomplished in life, we all have certain dissatisfactions that we are trying to transcend, higher goals of some form that we would like to achieve. And we each have only one truly powerful enemy who is fighting us every step of the way. And that is – our own self! And the reason for this is also quite simple. Basically, we are at war with ourselves. In his introduction to the NASA study, as Dr. Land put it, our neurons are constantly fighting with each other. And again, this goes on with most of us, no matter who we are, how successful we may be, how much money we have, etc., etc. So where does this constant inner battle come from and how can we resolve it? Believe it or not, it all comes down to a case of mistaken identity. Let's use the lens of the Higher Mind Training to take a quick look at it. To get started, let's go back to the very beginning, which for us means, let's go back about 300,000 years ago to when our species first began to appear on earth. In that regard, there are a couple of things to consider. First, since the beginning of life on planet earth, an estimated five to fifty billion species have evolved here. And incredibly, approximately 99 percent of them have become extinct. They came, stayed a while, and then for one reason or another, they vanished. Gone for good.   So, the obvious question then comes up – how did we survive? Why haven't we become extinct? The fact that we didn't defies all logic. Given our relatively puny bodies with our lowly position on the food chain, natural selection should have wiped us out thousands of years ago. After all, we're not the biggest. We're not the strongest. We're far from the fastest. Compared to sea creatures, we're pathetic swimmers and we can't fly at all. And when it comes to reproduction, our babies are born helpless, it takes them years to get to where they can survive on their own and compared to most other species, our overall offspring statistics are terribly weak.             So, under the laws of survival of the fittest, we should have been long gone by now. And indeed, we would have been just another unknown creature that came and went, except for this one small feature that was bestowed upon us by nature. We were born with this incredibly powerful brain. And although we're clearly outmatched on every other level, this one small organ, with its endless creativity, has given us an overwhelming advantage against the competition.           At first glance, it doesn't appear to be much. About the size of an average cantaloupe, it's less than 100 cubic inches and weighs only about three pounds. And yet, of all the biological evolutions that have manifested on earth since the appearance of the microbe, with its 100 billion neurons seamlessly wired for endless creativity, it's in a class all by itself. Indeed, the human brain is the single greatest masterpiece ever created by nature. And we each have one of our own.           With just its ability to invent tools, starting with primitive flint rock knives, it altered the survival equation, and soon we were at the very top of the food chain. And it did much more than that. With its boundless innovation, we didn't just survive, we became the dominant creature on earth, radically transforming the entire planet.            And it truly is a most extraordinary tool. It is estimated that it would take the most advanced computer in the world about 45 hours to do what your brain does in just one second. So, your mind is absolutely incredible, and you could never grasp how much intelligence you have within you at this very moment.           So given all of this, where does this horribly destructive state of Self-Sabotage come from? Well, the truth is, it's not all that hard to understand. The first concept to grasp is that we all have something in our intelligence which the Higher Mind Training calls our “Neural Template.”            Our brain has about 86 billion neurons that fire together constantly, and as the saying goes, neurons that fire together, wire together. They create about a hundred trillion neural pathways, which form a neural grid. This vast neural grid is called our neural template. It is an incredibly complex device and it's filled with everything that makes us who we are in the world, all of our concepts, emotions, thoughts and feelings, likes and dislikes, hope and memories, and on and on. We end up filtering everything that happens to us through this vast neural network, and that filtering shapes our entire life experience.  We've each been basically living our lives through this neural filter since age five. Now it's important to remember that according to Dr. Land's study for NASA, 98% of us were born geniuses and remained in that category through the age of five, which is when our creative intelligence began a significant and steady decline. So, what happened?   For most of us, we become more and more over-identified with our neural template, which is also called our ordinary mind. Due to an almost unending barrage of external stimuli, we lose the understanding that this grid that we have created is just a tool that we use to navigate our way through life, and we start believing that this neural template, this ordinary mind that can be overwhelmingly filled with negativity - this is actually who we are. And this extreme over-identification with this very small part of our overall intelligence becomes this case of mistaken identity. And this mistaken identity is the root cause of most of our mental and psychological pain.  Now, we don't have this over-identification with anything else that we own. I don't care how much you might love your car or your cell phone. You never get confused into thinking that they're actually a part of you.  But by mid-childhood, we've become so bonded to this neural template we've created, that we've lost touch with our actual identity and we no longer know who we really are. And the inner civil war, the war between the states of consciousness rages on. So, as I mentioned in the last episode, this is just the tip of the iceberg, but it's also a great place to bring this episode to an end. There's a lot more coming, so  as always, keep your eyes, mind and heart open and let's get together in the next one.   

Welcome back to the Stop Making Yourself Miserable Podcast and I certainly hope that you had a wonderful summer. As you may recall, in the last episodes before the hiatus certain key chapters from my memoir, Wilt, Ike & Me, were presented along with the subtext behind them as I delved into some of the deeper meanings of the story for me. The response from many of you has been quite gratifying and I want to express my sincere thanks to all.           Now, as we return to our regular podcast schedule, I want to start presenting some information about my next project, the Higher Mind Training (HMT). To begin, let me give you a little bit of background about it.           You probably remember that for my entire adult life, I have been a writer, researcher, speaker and most importantly, practitioner in the field of personal growth. I've been seriously involved in it since it first began to emerge in popular American culture in the late 1960s. Along those lines, about three years ago I began to construct an educational program which I called, the Higher Mind Training.           Simply put, over the years, I have found that everybody wants to grow internally. Everyone wants to live a happier, more fulfilled life. And true personal growth, the evolution of our inner awareness, holds the key. But it seems that we each have our own individual roadblocks and currently there is so much confusing information out there. On top of that, our lives have become so busy, that the task of finding an approach that really works for us has become truly daunting. So most people don't even consider it.   To address this need, my basic idea is to take the very best understandings and methods that I have used over my decades of research and personal experience and put them into a basic format that is simple for the everyday person to understand and easy to put into practice. Nothing special is required – just average intelligence and the simple desire to grow into a better human being. Now, I have mentioned the basic concept of this training in some previous episodes, but in broad strokes, you can look at it as information that is drawn from sources as diverse as Ancient Wisdom, all the way up through modern neuroscience. And it turns out that modern neuroscience is actually validating the key fundamentals of Ancient Wisdom, which is a remarkable phenomenon which I have found to be extremely powerful.           Let's take a quick look at it. So to begin, what is Ancient Wisdom? When you consider it, the answer is pretty astounding because throughout every culture in the world since the beginning of civilization, certain deeper understandings have emerged about fulfilling our purpose for living and realizing our highest human potential. And it boils down to just a few key points. These are - as human beings, we have a greater potential than we currently understand. There is a higher state of consciousness that is available to one each of us and it can be realized through self-discovery. This will lead us to fulfilling our greater potential and the vast treasures that await us in this new state of consciousness are truly immeasurable. That's an extremely basic introduction to it.            Now the format of storytelling has been largely the norm. And although the customs, cultures and languages have been vastly different throughout the ages, this basic message remains the same. Along with the caution that although we can spend our entire lives searching for happiness and satisfaction in the outside world, what we are really looking for is actually within us.           There's also one other idea to consider - on the deepest, intuitive level, we all know this. And because of this intuitive understanding, at the very root of human consciousness is the built-in compulsion to grow towards it. If we don't grow on an inner level, our life becomes an inner prison where we are trapped by our own limitations.           Now, this may seem overly simplistic, but just because something is simple, that doesn't mean it isn't true. Quite often it's the other way around. The simplest things can be the truest.           So, that's a very quick outline of the make-up of Ancient Wisdom and the question becomes, what do these thousands of years of wisdom have to do with modern neuroscience?  Well, that's exactly what I wanted to know when I first became aware of the unlikely relationship between the two about fifteen-years ago. And although as I researched it, I found it to be quite startling at the time, in retrospect it makes perfect sense.           To put it in a nutshell, modern neuroscience has begun to scientifically verify the beneficial effects that are produced on us by the understandings and practices of Ancient Wisdom. Before the current modern era, we knew that practices like prayer, contemplation, and meditation seemed to produce exalted feelings that expanded our awareness. Now we know why, at least on a physiological level.           And all this really hit me, because as I've mentioned many times before, I've been exposed to many different forms of higher understandings throughout my adult life. But I've always been a pragmatist about it.  Maybe a bit on the creative side, but a pragmatist nonetheless. Of course,  I'm a big fan of wisdom, but I like the practical kind and I'm probably not alone in that. I think we all feel more secure with our feet on the ground. Along these lines, two old practical sayings come to mind. The first one is attributed to Zen and it says this, “Before Enlightenment, chopping wood and carrying water. After Enlightenment, chopping wood and carrying water.” Depending upon your perspective, I guess the meaning is self-explanatory. For me it says that no matter what may happen with your inner consciousness, the laws of three-dimensional life remain the same. The view may be different but the task remains the same. So pay attention. Another similar saying I've always like is, “Feet on the ground. Head in heaven.” There are many traditions which carry similar sayings, but the message is simple. Just because you may become an enlightened soul, you still need to know your zip code. So this fact - that the basic underlying ideas behind Ancient Wisdom continue to be verified by advanced neuroscience - served a great role in inspiring me to develop the Higher Mind Training. And there was another element that provided further inspiration to me when, about ten years ago, I happened to watch a TED talk by Dr. George Land.            You may be aware that NASA once commissioned a study on creative genius to be applied to its work force. They were facing several serious issues and because they had a large base of top-level professionals in their work force, they wanted to see if they had any creative geniuses in their employ that they could tap into to help solve some of these critical problems.           They commissioned Dr. Land to devise and conduct the test. An astute scientist, he was one of the pioneers in the study of creative intelligence in modern America and was the founder of an internationally renowned research institute. His key principles are still used by over four hundred organizations throughout the United States.           The test he devised was extremely successful for NASA and he decided to extend it into the general public. He began by applying it to register the creativity of 1,600 children ranging in ages from three-to-five years old who were enrolled in a Head Start program. He re-tested the same children at 10 years of age, and again at 15 years of age. The results were astounding.           98% of the five-year-olds proved to be in the genius category. When he tested ten-year-olds, the percentage had dropped to 30%. At age fifteen, only 12% tested genius and by adulthood, in tests administered to 280,000 adults, only 2% were functioning on the genius level.           Dr. Land then concluded that from birth through the age of five, an astounding 98% of us were geniuses. Then, one way or another, society seems to program the genius out of us. According to him, this mass reduction in our overall intelligence began when large factories first emerged in society. We had to build factories to create workers to fill the factories and creativity was certainly not welcomed there. He said these “worker creator factories” were called “schools.”           But then Dr. Land threw another remarkable idea into the mix. According to him, we all still have that creative genius inside of us right now. It's still there. It didn't leave us, we left it. And according to him, we can each recover it. And not only that, we can recover it fairly quickly. It all has to do with learning how to use our imagination.           So, to sum things up, with my decades of positive experience in the study and practice of personal growth, and with the fact that modern neuroscience is proving the benefits of it beyond question, along with the findings of Dr. Land, that  we were all born creative geniuses and that we can still recover our higher level of intelligence, you have the basis of my efforts in developing the Higher Mind Training over the past few years.           As you can imagine, this is just the tip of the iceberg to the story, but it's a perfect place to end this episode. As always, keep your eyes, mind and heart open. And let's get together in the next one. 

Are some people just born creative, or is creativity something that can be learned?  In this episode, we talk about the concept of natural creativity and how to tap into our full creative potential. We discuss the impact of limiting beliefs on our creativity and how to overcome them, including a 4-step process outlined by Tony Robbins. We also explore the importance of surrounding ourselves with supportive people and joining creative communities, and the idea that creativity is a muscle that requires practice. Some highlights: The George Land creativity test and its implications The impact of limiting beliefs on creativity Strategies for overcoming limiting beliefs and tapping into our full creative potential Enjoy!

If any figure of the Gilded Age has major relevance on the lives of the working class today - especially those that cannot or struggle to buy a home - it is Henry George. The best-selling author and single tax advocate offered Americans and the world a big idea that could change the way governments tax its people.Essential Reading:Christopher William England, Land and Liberty: Henry George and the Crafting of Modern Liberalism (2023).Recommended Reading:Henry George, Progress and Poverty (1879).Edward T. O'Donnell, Henry George and the Crisis of Inequality: Progress and Poverty in the Gilded Age (2015).Phillip J. Bryson, The Economics of Henry George: History's Rehabilitation of America's Greatest Early Economist (2011).Mary M. Cleveland, "The Economics of Henry George: A Review Essay," The American Journal of Economics and Sociology 71, no. 2 (April 2012): 498-511. Ramesh Chandra, "Allyn Young on Henry George and the Single Tax," Review of Political Economy 34, no. 4 (December 2022): 766-88. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

You learn something new everyday. From caretakers, to teachers, to life in general, we accumulate lessons along the way. But is the school system as we know it allowing children to explore and reach their full potential? According to a study conducted by professor George Land, there is a 60% decline in creativity from age five to ten. During this episode of Soul BBQ we dish our thoughts regarding the education system and being life long learners. We share our individual education trajectories, the value of the school system, opportunities for growth, contributions to limiting beliefs, and put our heads together to reimagine a more fulfilling, effective institution.Let's talk about it! --------------------------------------------------------------Mentionable Content (aka Suggested Resources):Steven's Tech Talk - "Into the World of A.I. Art"https://youtu.be/BX01AguNVkoTedEx Video - George Land “The failure of success”https://youtu.be/ZfKMq-rYtncThrowback YouTube Sketch ft. Kelsey ( "Confidence is KEY.")https://youtu.be/Q3dlKQL8iA8Connect with Us on Social Media: Kelsey's Instagram: (@theevolvingaries)Steven's Instagram: (@eclectic_steve)

In response to A LOT of questions from concerned parents, this podcast series will delve into both the purpose and the results produced by America's public school system. In this third episode, we discuss some of the other influential figures who used the public school system to promote the designed destruction of children's minds._____RESOURCES:CLICK HERE for Daniel Hagadorn's, Un-American Education.CLICK HERE for John Taylor Gatto's, The Underground History of American Education.CLICK HERE for Dr. George Land's TEDx Talk, “The Failure of Success.”And if you haven't already, CLICK HERE to download your FREE eBook, Building an Emotionally Healthy Home as our gift to you. Thank you for subscribing. Share this episode.

EP. 136 In response to A LOT of questions from concerned parents, this podcast series will delve into both the purpose and the results produced by America's public school system. In this third episode, we are discussing some of the other influential figures who used the public school system to promote the designed destruction of children's minds. _____ CLICK HERE for PK4L's Substack page, 360 Parenting. CLICK HERE for Daniel Hagadorn's, Un-American Education. CLICK HERE for John Taylor Gatto's, The Underground History of American Education. CLICK HERE for Dr. George Land's TEDx Talk, "The Failure of Success." And if you haven't already, CLICK HERE to download your FREE eBook, Building an Emotionally Healthy Home as our gift to you.

In episode 5, John and Kevin discuss creativity as a process rather than an outcome. Every creative person produces finished work from time to time. For each creative work, however, there is a process of continuous learning and improvement that goes into it. They discuss the importance of a growth mindset and being open to viewing each work as a step along the way of a much longer journey.The guys also talk about studies done in the 1960s that show we are all born creative and we can recapture that creativity at any point in our lives.ResourcesMuch of the material for this episode was drawn from an article by James Clear: Creativity is a Process, Not an Event. Check it out on Jame's Clear's site. Jame Clear and the hosts also discuss a landmark study done by George Land and Beth Jarman in 1968. Click here for an article and TED Talk on this study.The Funniest Joke in the World (you'll know why we sent you here)Kevin brought Wired to Create: Unraveling the Mysteries of the Creative Mind by Scott Barry Kaufman and Carolyn Gregoire. If you want to understand what being creative does to our brains and bodies, this is a great resource.John introduced the book Steal Like an Artist: 10 Things Nobody Told You About Being Creative by Austin Kleon.Kleon's book discusses many of the same subjects as the hosts do in the podcast but puts a great deal of emphasis on learning from, and emulating, your influences as a way to help find your own voice. In turn, Kleon discusses the value of learning from the influences that inspired your creative heroes. This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit timeisrightpodcast.substack.com

In 1968 George Land developed an assessment to identify the best and brightest for NASA's moon shot mission. It became known as the Genius Test. Land was curious about how pre-schoolers might score. 1600 preschoolers took the test, and ninety-eight percent tested as geniuses. He tracked these kids and had them retake the test. By age fifteen, only twelve percent tested as geniuses. By age thirty, it dropped to two percent. MindSHIFT has developed a process to rediscover, rekindle, and master our lost genius factor. Through this session, you will learn how to identify your Genius Factor and the simple process to master your Genius Potential.

Creativity, Comedy and Keeping Your Job from the Robots The robots are coming. The robots are coming. Everyone is aware that Artificial Intelligence is playing a bigger part of our lives every day. In fact, how do you know that I'm not a robot speaking to your right now??? You don't do you?? Initially the numbers are staggering in terms of the number of jobs that could be replaced by AI over the next 15 years. According to studies at Oxford University and the World Economic Forum -up to 50 percent! So how do you protect YOUR job? Well, that's where clowns like me come in. That's right, everybody laughed at the clowns in the classroom (no really, I killed every recess) but there is something to be said about creativity and how we slowly lose it over time. In the 1960's and 70's, an American psychologist by the name of George Land tested the creativity of 1600 children. He discovered that 98 percent of five-year-olds displayed genius levels of creativity. When he retested those same children five years later, only one third of the children displayed genius levels of creativity. By the time the children were fifteen years old, the percentage had dropped to twelve percent. Now here's the good news. We can get our creativity back! We can stimulate our creativity by learning an instrument, taking a drawing class or hey (shameless plug) learning how to write stand-up comedy with Judy Croon and her #1 bestseller Stand Up in Ten Steps https://judycroon.com/books/stand-up-in-10-steps/ Humour is a GREAT tool to keep your content and customers from drifting off in a world where the average attention span is now 8 seconds. That's right, according to researchers at Microsoft, since the mobile internet was introduced, the average attention span has dropped from 12 to 8 seconds. We need all of our creative tools on board! The other good news is that AI is really good at doing routine tasks and pursuing specific goals that we program it to do. However, humans excel at making connections and forming new ideas from previously learned material whether those ideas are related or not. This is known as as divergent thinking. Penicillin, x-rays, electricity, radioactivity and America were all ‘accidentally' discovered by people who were looking for something else! Luckily, they were all able to circle back and find the connection. For example, In 1901 French physicist Henri Becquerel left a piece of radium in his vest pocket. When he noticed that he had burnt by it, he made the connection between radioactivity and medicine. He developed the first steps towards radiotherapy which is still being used to treat cancer. In 1492, Christopher Columbus 'accidentally' discovered America when he left Spain looking for a direct route between Europe and Asia. The point is yes, AI is here to stay. We can benefit from all of its fantastic capabilities but it's the wonderful combination of creative humans with AI that makes our future look that much brighter – and hopefully, a little funnier too. Until next time, laugh long and prosper. If you like to catch up on all of our Laugh Long and Prosper episodes, check me out Judy Croon On Spotify and/OR Soundcloud or you can go to my website www.JudyCroon.com Judy Croon is Canada's Keynote Humorist, Tedx motivational speaker, comedian and stand-up coach at Second City. She has worked with many celebrities including; John Cleese, Jon Stewart, and Joan Rivers. Her specials have appeared on NBC, CBS, CTV and The Comedy Network. She is a co-author of ‘From the Stage to the Page: Life Lessons from Four Funny Ladies!” Judy draws from her standup performance and coaching experience to entertain, inform and inspire in her dynamic keynote entitled, ‘Relieving Work Related Stress with Humour'. Judy is the creator/host of ‘Laughlines' and ‘Stand Up For The Girls' which have both helped raise over $650,000 for breast cancer research.

Hey, have you subscribed to the bookmark newsletter? A fortnightly email with book reviews and ideas of what you should be reading next. Click here to subscribe.   About the book Want to be more creative? Not sure of where to start? You're not alone. We all have a dysfunctional relationship with creativity. We love it, value it and want more of it but just can't seem to find the time or resources to give to it. And despite desperate calls for more innovative thinking, the systems and processes that hold most businesses together don't allow or enable anything like it. This book is for anyone who feels like they have more to give but struggles to get it out. Packed full of powerful, practical and poetic tools, this inspiring and infectious read will help you cut through the barriers that prevent creativity at work while giving you the clarity and confidence to unleash your wild, untamed self-expression into every pocket of your personal and professional life. Source: https://www.mykeldixon.com/store   About the author Mykel Dixon is an award-winning speaker, author, musician and recognised authority of Creativity, Culture and the Human Future of Work. He helps leaders and teams rediscover their natural appetite and aptitude for Creativity with extraordinary success. Through the design and delivery of explosive keynote presentations, immersive team-building activities and transformative talent development programs, Mykel leads a new-wave of entrepreneurial savants showing forward-thinking companies how to reinvent for relevance in a 21st-Century Renaissance. Source: https://www.mykeldixon.com/ Also check out https://www.everydaycreatives.com/   Big idea #1 — Creative, everyday  “The future of work will be written by those with the courage to think, feel, and act more creative every day.” There is a lot in the book that says about how and why we need to access courage in order to access creativity, even in times of uncertainty or discomfort. We don't need to go into all the reasons why creativity is so important. The writing is on the wall that our more socially, politically, and technically complex world requires a lot more creativity in order to solve the big problems that we are facing and will continue to face. We know that the future of AI and robotics rests on the marriage of human creativity and emotion, with the efficiency and power of technology. Therefore we need to inject creativity into our daily lives; from our emails to our CVs, to how we connect with people, even the shoes we wear, and not just into the big stuff. We can't access creativity for the big stuff and the big problems if we're not practicing creativity on a regular basis. Plus it makes life and work a lot more fun as well. This book is all about harnessing those tiny ways and those little things that we can do every single day in order to be more creative; to access our creativity and expand our creative minds. Like every book about creativity, it's so important not to conflate creativity with artistic talent or artistic skill. Those are two completely different things. Big idea #2 — Reclaim your creative identity In the book Mykel says “No one was born boring. No one had dreams of being a buzzkill. It happens slowly, subtly, insidiously”. You've probably heard people say that creativity is a skill and that it can be learned, but it's really more bout relearning. In a famous study led by George Land, 1,600 five-year-olds were tested for their creativity skills; their creative capacity and their ability to access that creative capacity. At just five years old, 98% of those 1,600 children scored as creative geniuses. Five years later, he tested the same children, at 10 years old only 30% were creative geniuses. He tested them again at 15, by then it was just 12%. Most depressingly, by the time these children were 30 years old, just 2% of them showed the same creative genius potential that 98% of them had done 25 years earlier. It goes to show that creativity is bashed out of us slowly but surely throughout our lives. We are taught that creativity and thinking differently is dangerous, that it will make us misunderstood, or isolated, or poor (or all three) and that it's safer not to be creative. Mykel says that all the post-it note activities in the world that you might do in your team or in a workshop, won't help if fundamentally, you believe that you're not creative, and you don't reclaim the creativity that you, and all of us, were clearly born with. Mykel breaks it down into six creative identities; The never was creative The used to be creative The kind of sorta creative The love to be creative The natural born creative, and The everyday creative. He says the big difference is courage, the everyday creative is not born with more creativity than anyone else. They're not innately more creative, but they have practiced and make it a conscious, courageous effort to bring creativity into how they're living and how they're working. This doesn't mean doing anything wild, it just means being intentional. Those identities are not fixed. Just because you may currently identify as ‘used to be creative', doesn't mean that you can't move from that. Something worth reflecting on that and thinking about how you move from one level of creative identity to another. Big idea #3 — Make it your own Mykel gives plenty of space and prompts in the book to create your own creativity manifesto and your value proposition; the what, the, how, and the why to set the scene and set your mindset around what creativity means to you? Why is it that you want to access it? What would the benefits be and what is the value or the benefit to you and the others around you. It's then up to you to create the principles that make your own version of creativity, because by its very nature, it will look and feel different to everyone. So some examples in the book… wearing a more colorful outfit or some crazy socks or shoes (a safe place to start with everyday creativity) using bright stationary to create some different connections and thinking in your brain (when you pick up your bright pink notebook or your bright orange notebook, you might then think, oh yeah, this is where I write my ideas or come up with great questions) going off script (Mykel used to work in a call center and he was always getting told off for going ‘off script', but he also was the most successful in the call centre, showing that the output of creativity was celebrated, but the practice of creativity was very much admonished and he got told off a lot for going off script) asking more questions saying yes to different things switching your browser / looking beyond the default settings (one study suggested that people who go beyond the default settings on their computers and use a different browser than the default have a touch of extra creativity in them, because they're not just going with what they're given) Mykel centre aligns his emails as a way of bucking convention and making people stop and notice making work work for you, maybe mixing up your meetings reading something different, going somewhere different, or meeting someone different, to give yourself exposure to different ideas. There's just a few examples of some ideas of everyday creativity in the book, there's obviously a million others that you can come up with to make it your own. I like to think of these as cheeky little nods to yourself and to others around your way of expressing creativity, which builds up over time. And then before long, you'll be asking different questions without even having to think about it. And when the moment appears that really matters, you'll be ready to think in a more creative way, as you've worked to become the creative you were born to be.   Let's connect! LinkedIn Instagram See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

In this episode, we're joined by Lars Doucet. Lars created the video game Defenders Quest. Lars joins us to talk about Henry George, whose work he reviewed in the ACX Book Review contest (which he won!). Lars blogs at https://www.fortressofdoors.com/ More links:  Schalkenbach Foundation https://schalkenbach.org Henry George School of Social Science https://www.hgsss.org  IAAO International Association of Assessing Officers https://www.iaao.org Farouk Al-Kasim https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Farouk_Al-Kasim Digital real estate article https://www.gamedeveloper.com/business/digital-real-estate-and-the-digital-housing-crisis

In 1992, NASA had Dr. George Land and Dr. Beth Jarman develop a test designed to identify the capacity for divergent thinking. Their findings were remarkable (https://twentyonetoys.com/blogs/teaching-21st-century-skills/creative-genius-divergent-thinking). At the age of five, 98% of kids tested as geniuses. By adulthood, it dropped to less than 2%. Why this drop? Sir Ken Robinson's TED Talk helps explain that (https://youtu.be/iG9CE55wbtY) and showcase that the answer is creativity. Imagination is the key to genius in all disciplines of life. Which begs the question why do so many of us lose our creativity? It all boils down to fear, sadly. Fear of failure. Fear of looking stupid. Fear of being judged. Fear of wasting time, etc. So how do we overcome this? Is it possible to overcome even? I say yes! Much like my ideas about talent being a process, not a skill (https://philsvitek.com/talent-is-not-a-skill-its-a-process/), so too is creativity. You can practice and relearn creativity. Susan Roberts has some good guiding wisdom for this (https://player.fm/series/unleash-your-inner-creative-with-lauren-lograsso/best-of-unleash-overcome-negativity-bias-w-susan-robertson). These ideas are the basis for this episode and the notions I unpack to help you reach your genius. We all have it within us. After listening, kindly feel free to ask questions or offer opinions of your own, whether down in the comment section or by hitting me up on social media @PhilSvitek. Also, it'd mean the world to me if you checked out my latest film's crowdfunding page over at https://igg.me/at/philsvitekfilm. Lastly, for more free resources from your 360 creative coach, check out my website at http://philsvitek.com. RESOURCES/LINKS: -Autumn Into Fall - Bogota Film Crowdfund: https://igg.me/at/philsvitekfilm -Coach or Consultant Services: https://philsvitek.com/lets-work-together/ -Podcast Services: http://philsvitek.com/podcastservices -Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/philsvitek -Merchandise: https://shop.spreadshirt.com/phil-svitek---360-creative-coach/ -Instagram: http://instagram.com/philsvitek -Facebook: http://facebook.com/philippsvitek -Twitter: http://twitter.com/philsvitek -Master Mental Fortitude Book: http://mastermentalfortitude.com -Idyll Film: http://philsvitek.com/idyll -Elan, Elan Book: http://philsvitek.com/elan-elan -In Search of Sunrise Film: http://philsvitek.com/in-search-of-sunrise

Joining me in this episode is Ryan Rydzewski, the co-author of When You Wonder, You're Learning: Mister Rogers' Enduring Lessons for Raising Creative, Curious, Caring Kids. He’s here to dig deeper and teach us more about two benefits of first times and new experiences: Curiosity and Creativity. Ryan starts out by sharing with us what inspired him and his co-author Gregg Behr to write the book. Then we dig deeper into the world of Mister Rogers. One of the first takeaways on curiosity that might surprise people is that Mr. Roger’s didn’t expect children to be curious about something they knew nothing about. Ryan explains why there needs to be some familiarity first and what else is required to plant the seed of curiosity. Familiarity and mystery are required to ignite curiosity but that’s not all. Mr. Roger’s knew what was required so he took deliberate efforts to create a safe environment for children to escape to. Ryan shares with us how he did that. We also talk about the “Bouncing Raisins” experiment and the 1968 study by Dr. George Land. Creativity can’t be imposed but it can be encouraged. Scientists have found that imaginative kids are more likely to have imaginative parents – people who consider themselves adventurous and open-minded. We discussed throughout the interview how what Mister Rogers taught (can still teach us) is far from being only for children. When You Wonder, You're Learning is an excellent book to read and learn from whether or not you're a parent or educator.

Today’s episode takes a look at AOEU’s newest graduate course, Innovation Through Design. Abby Schukei returns to the show to discuss the development of new course with Tim. Listen as they cover a variety of topics, including how AOEU develops their courses, the importance of creativity in everything that we do, and the difference between creativity and innovation. Resources and Links Follow Abby on Twitter and Instagram Take a look at Innovation Through Design See all of AOEU's Graduate Courses Read about George Land's Creativity Test

"Sustainability, human well-being, and the future of education" by Justin Cook (2019) (https://bit.ly/39ZAsyD) “Teachers are steeped in education systems; from the age of 4 or 5, they have been immersed in an educational context. They are perhaps the only profession whose compulsory, secondary, and tertiary education environments are the same in which they work professionally. This fact fundamentally challenges the profession's ability to step out of a subjective way of seeing. As George Orwell said, ‘To see what is in front of one's nose needs a constant struggle' (Orwell et al. 2000, p. 125). This is true for many: because so much of our lives are spent inside schools, education is a relentlessly subjective construct that struggles against the weight of common experience to be seen objectively” (p. 3). References: Michael Polanyi and tacit knowledge (http://bit.ly/34ZZXN3) "Free School Teaching: Free School Teaching: A Journey Into Radical Progressive Education" by Kristan Accles Morrison (2007) (https://bit.ly/39X33EW) "Free to Learn: Why Unleashing the Instinct to Play Will Make Our Children Happier, More Self-Reliant, and Better Students for Life" by Peter Gray (2015) (https://bit.ly/3qGXRuI) "Grow or Die: The Unifying Principle of Transformation" by George Land (1997) (https://amzn.to/2JO8StA) Michael Lipset of PassTell Stories (http://www.michaellipset.com/) Connect: Twitter (twitter.com/mjcraw) Website (mjcraw.com) Music from Digi G'Alessio CC BY-NC-ND 3.0 (https://bit.ly/2IyV71i)

Is it good to be curious these days?  If so, how can we use questions to improve our lives? Watch the video version of Michael Angelo Caruso's interview with author and speaker, Dr. Diane Hamilton at https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YjmX61icfls.   Diane is a business behavioral specialist and has a PhD in business leadership. She's an expert in emotional intelligence (EQ), intelligence quotient (IQ) and curiosity quotient (CQ). She's the author of "Cracking the Curiosity Code," a book on how to be curious and she created the Curiosity Index to help people cultivate curiosity as a characteristic. The "Thinkers50" has recognized Dr. Hamilton as an expert on the topic of curiosity. Diane has written a book titled "Cracking the Curiosity Code" and has created an assessment called the Curiosity Code Index, which helps evaluate your curiosity quotient and develop it further. She's also made the coveted "Thinkers 50" an internationally recognized list of important thought leaders. Dr. Hamilton says there are four things businesses can do to create a culture of curiosity: minimize Fear in the workplace, push back against Assumptions, balancing Technology and Environment (FATE):1) Minimize FEAR in the Workplace 2) Push Back Against ASSUMPTIONS 3) Balancing TECHNOLOGY 4) ENVIRONMENT Being curious is a personal asset for people because asking questions helps us become more empathetic, solve problems, deliver customer service and think on our feet. Dr. Hamilton cites the work of the following experts: - Dr. George Land's work on creativity with NASA - Dr. Tony Alessandra's work with personality assessment - Amy Edmondson's TED talk on how curiosity can be used - Dr. Ken Robinson's TED talk Being curious is a practical way to avoid going with assumptions, which can damage relationships and cost companies market share. Learn more about Diane and her nationally syndicated podcast (she interviewed Michael recently) at DrDianeHamilton dot com. _ _ _ Listen to Michael's "Talk to Me" podcast to hear more of his interview with interesting people. Subscribe to this YouTube channel to be notified of Michael’s new videos. More on Michael at his website. Join his "Present Like a Pro Group" on Facebook for ongoing speaking tips. Michael Angelo Caruso teaches presentation skills that will help you command the room, get noticed and advance your career. If you’re a leader or salesperson, Michael will help you become a better presenter for the rest of your life. The most important business skill for leaders and salespeople is the ability to effectively communicate with groups of people. Look into leadership and sales training so you can keep teams interested, motivated and successful. Use Michael to pump up your next conference or industry event. He’s one of the top keynote speakers in America. Choose from his menu of popular keynote topics.  Set up a free consult with Michael so you can crush your presentations and improve sales. More on Michael at MichaelAngeloCaruso dot com. Listen to Michael’s popular podcast on Podbean, iTunes and other platforms. Watch (and subscribe to) Michael’s YouTube channel at https://www.youtube.com/michaelangelocaruso to learn how he can help your sales team.  Just click that silver bell on the YT video page to be notified of the new videos.          

Nel 1968 George Land e Beth Jarman realizzarono un test per misurare la creatività degli ingegneri aerospaziali della NASA. Lo stesso test fu condotto poi su 1600 bambini dell'età di 5 anni. I risultati aprirono le porte a diverse domande: Da cosa nasce la creatività? Come possiamo (dis)impararla? In che modo possiamo allenarla? -------- Per avere accesso a risorse e approfondimenti esclusivi sugli argomenti affrontati nel podcast, puoi iscriverti al mio canale telegram da qui --> https://t.me/renatojoy

Greg Orme is an Award winning author and business keynote speaker and is our special guest on Episode 14. Find out why we should stop competing with AI but to instead start to differentiate ourselves. Explore the superpowers you'll need to future-proof your value in the workplace: Consciousness, Curiosity, Creativity and Collaboration. We talk about Greg's, “Dance Steps”. You can learn one-step and put them together in any order. You'll learn: How do you create a culture of creativity? Consciousness gives us the motivation and the time. Curiosity is the fuel for creativity. Why having an experimental approach is key! Follow us and explore our social media tribe from our Website: https://leadership-hacker.com Music: " Upbeat Party " by Scott Holmes courtesy of the Free Music Archive FMA Find out more about Greg and his work below: The Human Edge (Business Book of the Year 2020) Greg's website: https://gregorme.org Greg on Twitter Greg on LinkedIn Read the full transcript below:  ----more----    Introduction Steve Rush: Some call me Steve, dad, husband or friend. Others might call me boss, coach or mentor. Today you can call me The Leadership Hacker. Thanks for listening in. I really appreciate it. My job as the leadership hacker is to hack into the minds, experiences, habits and learning of great leaders, C-Suite executives, authors and development experts so that I can assist you developing your understanding and awareness of leadership. I am Steve Rush and I am your host today. I am the author of Leadership Cake. I am a transformation consultant and leadership coach. I cannot wait to start sharing all things leadership with you. On the show today is Greg Orme. He is the author of the business Book of the Year for 2020, The Human Edge. Before we get a chance to speak with Greg. It is The Leadership Hacker News.   The Leadership Hacker News Steve Rush: In the news today, we explore what age do we really start to develop entrepreneurial spirit. Our spirit can happen quite early but according to combined studies of the Duke University, the Kauffman Foundation, The Founder Institute and Northwestern; the average age of an entrepreneur is actually 40 years old when launching his or her first start up and the average age of leaders of high growth start-ups is 45. While Tech Media is ripe with stories, a successful 20 somethings founding their first billionaire empire, the truth is that 40 somethings are much more likely to start companies and succeed. Adeo Ressi founder of “The Founder Institute”, developed research that shows that older age is actually a better predictor of entrepreneurial success. The research in question is not small scale either. To get the data The Founder Institute tracked 3000 global applicants, examined in detail thousands of organizations, a thousand enrolled founders and track 350 of their graduates. So do we think the age really helps? According to Ressi, older individuals have generally completed more complex projects from buying houses, raising a family and in addition older people have developed greater vocational skills than the younger counterparts. We theorize that the combination of successful project completion skills with real world experience helps older entrepreneurs identify and address more realistic business outcomes and opportunities. This is borne out not only by research, which shows, amongst other things, that people over 55 are twice as likely to launch high growth start-ups than those under 35, but by scanning just a quick list of successful entrepreneurs: Ray Kroc was 52 when he shaped McDonald's into the multi-billion global organization that it is. Sam Walton was 44 when he started small little company called Wal-Mart. Lynda Weinman co-founded Lynda.com at 40 and subsequently sold that to Linkedin for $1.5 billion and not a “twentysomething” among them. The fact is innovation culture suggests that it is more trendy and more youth orientated and it is not as cool for older folk. This leadership mind-set can be limiting for all. It can frame older individuals by making them feel useless or expired once if fit certain age, and can also hold back younger people by making them feel that they haven't achieved or they have failed if they haven't found that their next big social media platform by the time they're 21. And of course, young people can become successful entrepreneurs for sure, but it's extremely misleading to believe that this is the norm so if you haven't hit your first million and you're in your 30s and 40s and 50s, there's still hope yet, and our next story shows that entrepreneurial leadership has gotten no age boundaries. The Utah Highway Patrol said, “a trooper conducting a traffic stop on a suspected impaired driver instead found a five-year-old driver seeking to purchase a Lamborghini”. The highway patrol said in a Twitter post that a trooper conducted a traffic stop in Webber County on what he thought was an impaired driver; but the driver of the vehicle turned out to be a five-year-old boy who had made off with his parents car. The boy who was pulled over at the 25th Street off-ramp of the southbound Interstate 15, told the trooper that he'd taken his parents car after getting into an argument with his mother, who told him she would not buy him a Lamborghini. He decided to take his entrepreneurial spirit to the next level and head off in her car in search of that Lamborghini. The child told the trooper that he did intend indeed driving to California to buy the luxury vehicle for himself and his mom would not get in his way. His only downfall was that he only had three dollars in his wallet. That has been The Leadership Hacker News. If you have any news, insights or information, please get in touch with us and share your stories.    Start of Interview Steve Rush: Our guest today sparks creativity and business innovation in a fast paced, changing world. Is the author of The Human Edge, which has just been awarded the Business Book of the Year for 2020, is Greg Orme, Greg, welcome to The Leadership Hacker Podcast. Greg Orme: Well, I am delighted to be here, Steve. Thanks for thanks for inviting me. Steve Rush: It is absolutely our pleasure, and congratulations, by the way, on winning the Business Book of the Year. Fantastic achievement. I am sure you have been delighted with that. Greg Orme: It has just been fantastic; really, game changing for the book and something I am really proud of, it's just been wonderful. Steve Rush: And so you should be, so before becoming an author, you started-off your career in the TV world, right? Greg Orme: Yes.  Steve Rush: Tell us a little bit about the journey to here. Greg Orme: Well, as a journo, I was a young journalist all the way back in the 1990s. My careers adviser at school advised me that it was not a good idea to go into journalism and of course, that is the only thing I wanted to do then. I clambered my way up from local newspapers, The Solihull Times to the Birmingham Evening Mail to the Nationals, down in London and then into television. Steve Rush: And how did the television bit come about? What did that give you in terms of foundations for what you do now? Greg Orme: Well, it is really funny, you know, because right now, obviously we're speaking when the world has gone virtual and so I'm doing a lot more webinars and sort of virtual presentations. And so the production of those really goes all the way back to producing television news because I was a young producer on London Tonight, which was the local television news there and then with ITN and ITV, and also along the way with the BBC. So, you know, taking stories, really boiling them down to what the nuggets are, then deciding what format to use and writing scripts around it. It's all the stuff that you do when you're presenting, you know, virtual webinars and that kind of thing, so I've come full circle. It is really quite strange. Steve Rush: So fantastic foundations given that when you were starting out your career, you probably had not realized the importance of calling upon them at a later date? Greg Orme: Well, you never do, do you? You never know where your skills will take you. Actually, as a facilitator of face-to-face workshops and, you know, I facilitated boards of directors as well in my work on organizational change. Straight with organizations and via organizations such as the London Business School and Ducsy and various others. I found that idea of what a journalist does, which is to learn, ask interesting questions and then summarize and kind of guide the conversation. Has helped me all the way through my career. So yes, it has become really pertinent now, but I've always relied on those journalistic skills, actually. Steve Rush: Communications are at the heart of everything we do, particularly when we are leading businesses, right? Greg Orme: Yes. I mean, it is really central. I mean, my work now is sort of sits astride organizational change, but it is really working with the leaders that drive that change and catalyse it. And if you think about what leadership is, Steve, leadership is effectively communication and influence, especially in non-hierarchical organizations, which they increasingly are. It is your ability to move people through your communication, so it is separate to management, which is establishing what is going on and making sure there is some kind of consistency. Being a leader is all about communication. So even though I have not been a communication consultant for many, many years. Really, leadership is at the heart of the work I do with organizations and the people that run them. Steve Rush: Right and given that you started out in journalism, you ended up in a leadership role and several leadership roles yourself and executive roles. How did that transition take place for you? Greg Orme: Well, that came about because I went back to London Business School. They asked me back after I had done my executive MBA. To go back to be the founding CEO for a thing called the Centre for Creative Business, and that was a joint venture between London Business School and the big art schools, the University Arts London, which I said number of different art schools and fashion houses. The idea was we were exporting kind of MBA thinking from London Business School to creative businesses because the British government wanted more tax revenues from our creative sector and we were part of that, so that's how it started in terms of that was an executive role running and growing that. And then after that came to an end after four years because we had four years of funding. I then was an interim CEO with a large recruiting and HR services business called Randstad and Randstad; they are sort of global businesses, and I was a CEO of one of their businesses in the UK, so, yes, I had some experience at the front line, which is invaluable when I am helping people in similar situations. Steve Rush: So during that time as CEO of a couple of businesses and getting into the world of creativity and innovation and new thinking. That was when you started your first book Spark, so how did that come about? Greg Orme: The Spark was…it goes back to that idea of the Centre for Creative Business, and so the question that was often been asked, which is what can creative businesses. If we were sort of exporting, MBA thinking to creative businesses and it struck me that there is an interesting reverse of that question. Reversing the polarity issue to ask what can creative businesses, the likes of advertisers and TV production companies and design houses and architects teach the rest of the world. In terms of how they maintain an atmosphere of creativity in their organisations? I always think if you write a business book, you should have a central question that you are trying to answer, and the question there was, you know, what can creative businesses teach the rest of the world? And so that's what the spark is. It's how do you create a culture of creativity? How do you have behaviours of leadership? Because in most of the research, that has gone into creativity in organisations and I mean all organisations, not just ones that call themselves creative. The sad thing is that creativity gets killed more often than its encouraged just by the rules and regulations of business, so it's something that you have to protect and nurture. Steve Rush: In my experience as a coach and leading businesses too; one of the biggest things I find about creativity is often when you are more extroverted and you are able to come and demonstrate and showcase creativity, it's more noticeable. But actually there is an inordinate amount of learning to be had from people who appear less obviously creative, but equally have the same level of thinking and creativity and creative flair, if you like. How do you go about enabling that in people who are maybe more introverted? Greg Orme: Yeah, absolutely. I am not sure. It is about introversion and extroversion for me. You know, looking at the research, I think introverted people can be just as creative as extroverted people. You probably just won't hear their ideas as readily. What is really interesting for me is that creativity is one of those words that's very exclusive. It is often thought of as for geniuses or for artistic people over a certain type of person, whereas the reality is we are all born creative. And then the culture of our schools, sadly, and also the culture of our businesses, kind of beat out of us. We realize that our creative thinking is not as welcome as we thought it might be. So there's a lot of really interesting research that shows that, you know, if you do creativity tests like the Torrance Test on kids that are five years old, something like 98 percent of them score very highly in their ability to apply divergent thinking, which is a foundational stone of creativity. By the time, we are fifteen that is gone down to 30 percent, and by the time we are in the workplace, it is down to twelve, five, two percent, and so it's our environment that knocks it out of us. In effect, I am on a mission with both my books really to try and help everybody to rediscover their creativity, not just the chosen few. Steve Rush: That is a really interesting statistics. It is almost we have unlearned how to be creative by the environment through school, education, work and forced parameters around our behaviour. Greg Orme: Yeah, well, unlearning is a really good word for it. In fact, George Land, who did the original study on this, who came up with these really rather depressing statistics. That was the conclusion of his report after 20 years of studying this cohort of American schoolchildren, that went into the American work environment was that if you are creative thinking is, you know, effectively unlearn it from your environment. Well, anything that can be unlearned can be relearned, so that is the silver lining from this, that actually you can rediscover your creativity as well as been a skill. It is an attitude. You know, you really can step back into your creativity enough, and that, as been a personal journey for me, and also, it's a personal mission for me to help other people do that because it's life changing. Steve Rush: And it is really reassuring for those people who are listening to this who maybe think I'm not as creative as I'd like to be. We've probably got all of those foundations somewhere tucked away at the back of our brain. We just need to pull them forward, right? Greg Orme: Absolutely. You know, I like to think of it as this. If creativity I was saying, is this exclusive word there. That, you know, one of those red velvet rope surrounds that say you can't come in. If you actually dig down to sub worlds that support it, like curiosity, questioning, learning, engaging, sparking two ideas together, talking to other people, we can all do these really simple things like questioning and learning. So if you can do that, our human brains are actually programmed to make connections to do what psychologists call general thinking, i.e. connecting things together. You can't help yourself. You just need to put the fuel and the energy into your brain and have the attitude listen for the ideas that come and don't dispel them. We can all do it. Steve Rush: That is excellent I love that. So moving on to your work now. So global keynote speaker, facilitated hundreds of sessions across the globe for different organizations, and in parallel to that, have written your award-winning book, The Human Edge. What was the inspiration for book number two from where you left off with Spark? Greg Orme: Yeah, well, you know, I was thinking it came sort of five and a half, six years later. And I'd done a lot of work with a lot of big organizations in automotive and banking and all sorts of different places, and had the benefit of traveling around the world and sort of being a fly on the wall in these offices, and so I started getting really interested in where is the workplace. The future going and what is the role of technology and disruption, particularly because I think we're in a very disrupted environment. Of course, is extremely disruptive. Now with COVID-19, but it was happening before that with artificial intelligence and data vacation and new generations coming into the workplace and new digital tribes online and obviously the environmental crisis that we're all battling with. So we're in a very unstable environment, so I started talking a lot about the technological angle of that, and I actually was making a keynote at London Business School. Had gone back for an alumni event and one of the executives, the lady came up to me after I'd finished my speech and said, that's all very well talking about how technology and machines are changing organizations. But what really occurs to me, you're going on about artificial intelligence and how it's going to change the world. Where does that leave me in terms of the skills that I need to survive and thrive in this in this world? And what about my daughters? You know, what should I be telling them to study and become? I thought it was a really interesting question and I didn't really have the answer, and that was about four years ago. From there, I started exploring what I thought were the answers to that question, that became The Human Edge, which is to me. How do you become more human in a world of machines and disruption in order to make the most of what you've got? So future proof your own career. Steve Rush: Got it and it is really interesting when I look at how the world has changed over the last 10 or 15 years. There is genuinely a threat or a perceived threat by many people around the world of robotics and AI and how that's impacting, and I think you call that the human challenge in your book, don't you?  Greg Orme: Yeah, absolutely. I mean, I think that has gone away a little bit now because I think we have all started to…I think it is still there, and that's where the debate was three or four years ago. It was human vs. machine, what is going to happen? And of course, actually in the same way, there's another trend. We have become a lot less trustful of our tech companies, our social media companies. We don't trust the ones on the West Coast, we've got Uber, which had a lot of scandals, and then we've got the Chinese unicorn and tech companies that are sort of veiled in secrecy. So generally, tech is not what it was, and also there is AI, which is, quote/unquote, taking our jobs. I think what I discovered in the book is for most people in the knowledge work industry; AI is not going to take your job, not anytime soon. What will happen is it will cheese slice away the algorithmic routine parts of your job, leaving you a space and this will happen over the next five to 10 years, leaving you a space in which to apply your own humanity. What differentiates you from machines? So that's an opportunity as well as a threat, and so that's what the book is about. It is taking that opportunity and really, really using you're what I call human superpowers. Steve Rush: And for me, it really is an opportunity but many people could be in that threat space because there is this. “If I let go of some of the routine tasks, I might be redundant” vs the mind-set that says no - It gives you more space for creativity and new ways of working. Greg Orme: Yeah, and, you know, just to be clear, and I am sad to say this, I don't relish in bringing this news. That there will be some job types that will go completely. I think, you know, if you are a long distance lorry driver and that's, of course, autonomous driving, but it is really a subset of AI. That will probably go some sometimes or a lot of those jobs will go. Not all of them, because obviously driving in the city centre is far more complex than driving down a motorway, so there will be some types of driving that will go. Effectively you can write down all the data and the decisions in any job type and then feed it into machine learning AI. It will probably get automated sometime in the next sort of five, six, seven years, but I think that's a small portion of jobs. Most jobs, as I say, will be cheese sliced and really what is left is what we do that machines can't, so, you know, we have a sense of humour. We have empathy; we can think generally. We can collaborate together. We can ask the next question rather than answering the last one, so that is curiosity, so this is why I came up with the idea of these 4 C of superpowers in the same way that I wanted to demystify creativity. I am hoping I can demystify all four of these C's and help people to develop them because they are skills that you can practice and get better at. Steve Rush: And the book The Human Edge is about how we use our creativity and our curiosity, and you call them superheroes in our digital economy and I really love that kind of principle, and during the reading of the book, you have bunches and bunches of hacks often you refer to them as dance steps, actually. Let's get into the 4 C, I think it would be really helpful to go through how the 4 C's of The Human Edge work together, so the first of the 4 C is consciousness and you say that's the gateway to the other 4 C. What is the reason that sits as the gateway? Greg Orme: Well, just to explain the structure of it, there are 4 C and under each of the 4 C, there are two what are called dance steps that you mentioned. I call them dance steps, because you can sort of just like a dance step. You can learn one-step and then kind of do them in any order. They are not really linear. I don't think creative thinking is a particularly linear thing. However, there is an order, which is why I have done it in the order I have of consciousness, curiosity, creativity, collaboration and the order is this. I think that is the order of kind of ideation or allowing yourself to be creative and under consciousness. I have the idea of finding work meaningful, and I also have the idea of focus. Being able to direct your attention and find islands of time in which you can devote to your own curiosity and creativity, so the reason that is first is if you don't have the motivation to step forward and be courageous enough to be creative, you won't do it. Because it is an effort and it also implies for failure. Creativity always has failure as a component of it, and the other part, the other dance step under consciousness is this idea of focus and that is really about organizing your day in order or an average day in order to find time to be curious and creative. And so just to summarize that, my favourite quote on this is. Creative Minds may think like artists, but they were like accountants. What I am getting out there is that you really need to concentrate and focus in order to find the time to do it. Otherwise, you end up just chasing your tail in a very distracted world in which we are in now.  Steve Rush: That is a great analogy and one I think can resonate with most people as they listening in. Curiosity is the next C and that runs through the other C, and a particular like the reference that you use around questions are the hallmark for leadership in our century. How did that come about?  Greg Orme: Yes, so if you consciousness effectively gives you the motivation and the time. Curiosity, I think is the fuel for creativity and I think of the 4 C, Steve, as you know, they are all equal apart from their not. Creativity, a bit like the British prime minister. They sometimes say the British prime minister is the first amongst equals, I think, of creativity as the first amongst the C because curiosity and consciousness allow you to be creative. Collaboration allows you to then take the ideas that come out of creativity and do something with them. So curiosity is really important for me because and the two dance steps are learning and questioning. Learning, because actually you need to keep pushing yourself forward and we know ideas come from when they when notions and concepts jump barriers between two different domains of knowledge, so you need to push yourself to learn outside of your specialisms and then what happens is you get these wonderful, serendipitous connections across boundaries in which ideas happen. So that is really, really important, I mean, you know we can all think of examples of that, so, for example. Ducal brings together the idea of academic citations with what was at the time this new-fangled thing called the World Wide Web, and that is what Google came from, so you need to learn…and the questioning helps you to challenge the world around you constantly, which again leads you to see it and frame it in different ways. Steve Rush: And when you talk about creativity as part of your forces, you state within the book that, you know, consciousness and curiosity gives you the framework or the set up success or they set up creativity. And what particularly struck me within that is that you talk about luck as being a skill, and I wondered if we think about skills are refined and they are practised and we get better at them or not as the case may be through practice. How do you practice at getting lucky? Greg Orme: Yeah. Well, I use that because it is a particularly provocative statement, isn't it? How do you practice being lucky? Well, I think the point is that a lot of people, if you ask them where do you have your ideas, they say, well, they sort of come to me, you know, I'm on a bike ride or I'm running or might be in the shower. And they see this as a lucky moment, this moment, this so-called aha moment, and I really find in my research about creativity. Is the aha moment even though it's got a great PR, you know, you could think of a hundred aha moments, the apple drop on someone's head or whatever it might be, what is much more important is the preparation that leads up to that. Aha moment. And that's what I mean about luck is a skill you can actually work on the things that will bring you aha moments, and what I do is put a lot of practical ideas in the book of what you can do to work on that. Steve Rush: Got it, so the whole consciousness of being creative replays back in there doesn't it. It is taken those unconscious thoughts and thinking, bringing them to the conscious. Greg Orme: Well, absolutely and one of the things I say is pay attention. Pay attention not only to the world around you. Look for the unexpected things that happen. A lot of the times we can spend our lives on autopilot. You know, we are driving the car. We are even not aware we were driving and we suddenly, 25 minutes later we are somewhere else. You know, it is about consciously from time to time paying attention to the world around you because that is where you get your ideas from and also listening to your own thoughts, being self-aware, because actually your subconscious brain often whispers to your ideas and sometimes you can miss them if your you're not paying attention. And there are 100 different other ways that creative people who make their living from coming up with ideas and in a way, I make my living from coming with ideas and putting them into books. Actually, they practice these habits every day to make sure they've got a store of new ideas coming. I mean, one of them is to literally waste nothing. When you read you look at a painting, have some way of collecting lots of things around you that you can go back to as a store of ideas. For example, I use Evernote. I don't if you use this online way, so whenever I'm reading something online, I can tag it. It goes into my Evernote store and it is just kind of like having a brainstorm with a former self when I go through the things I have read, so, you know, there are lots of different habits that creative people use to ensure that they get lucky more often than. Steve Rush: That is some really neat ideas and of course, they're lucky become the more successful you become.  Greg Orme: Yeah, absolutely. I mean, and, you know, as long as you keep practicing these habits, I mean, another one is to understand our brain does not just work on its own. It is part of a system within our body. So if you want to operate at peak performance and be creative, which is one of our higher functions, you have to make sure that you're fit, that you have time off, you have time to play. You get good sleep. Sleep is incredibly important than the research around sleep now and its connections with creativity is absolutely compelling, so in the book, if people come in there, they'll find something they can do every day that will just, you know, incrementally build up those curiosity and creativity muscles. Steve Rush: It is habit forming, isn't it? It's not one of those things you can just do in isolation. It has to be repeated and repeated and repeated so that you are laying down those neurological pathways to create those tactile foundations. Greg Orme: Yeah. I mean, fantastic. You have mentioned the brain there and neuroscience because, you know, as someone who has applied psychology in my work for many years, I am so excited now that we can actually have some hard science in there as well. No offense to psychologists, but neuroscientists can show you which part of the brain is lighting up, and what is really interesting to me in terms of creativity and exploration, curiosity. That releases a neuro transmitter called dopamine and dopamine is called the motivation molecule is something that makes you want to get up and go and the light side of dopamine is if you can release it, it makes you want to do something, which releases more dopamine, so as you were saying, Steve, it's a virtuous circle. If you can release this dopamine for me when you are exploring in your curious, you want to do more of it, and as you say, it just gets more and more and more and then you surround yourself with more creative people. You do more creative things and then it becomes not just a choice, it becomes a kind of a lifestyle. Steve Rush: Almost a factory that refuels itself on that journey, too. Greg Orme: Yeah, absolutely. I mean, if you just take one aspect of this, I was talking about how curiosity underpins creativity and I think people should stop aiming at creativity is like aiming at happiness. It is completely pointless. You know, what you have to do is aim at the things that take you there by a circuitous route. Curiosity is the best route. I think that is the motor way to get into creativity and what we know about the curiosity is. It is like a muscle, so if you use your curiosity, if you are asking questions, if you are surrounded by curious people, you will be more curious and if you don't, your muscles won't get bigger and stronger. They will waste away and so be really careful about the people you're hanging out with, the things you're reading, the things you're watching, the podcast you subscribe to. How are you getting your new knowledge? That is what is feeding this desire to find out more. Steve Rush: and in the spirit of curiosity, your last C is Collaboration. This is about building a network of human collaborators. Now, for most people listening to this they will be going yeah that is pretty obvious. Surround myself with a bunch of people who can help me, but what are the dance steps you've got here for collaboration? Greg Orme: Yeah, well, collaboration is the umbrella term for use it but I get quite specific with the two dance steps. So the first dance step is this idea of networking. Now it may be sound straightforward, but I find a lot of people don't attend to their network. They see networking, something kind of, you know, like recruiters do.  It is a little bit oily and, you know kind of business like that, really, it is about connecting to like-minded individuals and not just a small group of them. We all have so-called Dunbar's number, which is the amount of people in our sort of close network but really, it is about connecting to a much wider group because there is great research data to show if you have a wide, shallow network as well as some close colleagues. It is in that wide, shallow network of people away from you. That is where you will get your new ideas. In addition to that, you always have someone to take your new ideas too to get feedback, because honestly, most people's ideas are not very good. If you are going to have a large portfolio of ideas and by the way, that is the best way to be creative. Stop working on one idea. Work on quite a few. At the same time, then you want to try and improve them and the best way to improve them is to take them out to other people and get some honest feedback on it, so it's having this and developing and consciously, intentionally developing the network around you. That is incredibly important. Steve Rush: Getting data for your creative, curious ideas. Is incredibly important because we come with our own biases, don't we? So how do we make sure that is the right data that we've got? Greg Orme: All you can do, say for example, you know, when I'm writing my books, I have a group of twelve people or so who are really trusted colleagues who know the marketplace I'm writing for, who've written themselves, so I kind of just trust they... I don't take it as read. I don't take it is like, oh, I must change that because they said this, but I will really, really closely listen to them, so I think it's a matter of understanding who you're going to for what. In terms of getting feedback and then honouring their feedback and just kind of keeping in mind and choosing the stuff that you really need. Because, I think one of the most compelling kind of insights that I actually find in this book and I did not realize before is, we know that creative superstars have something like 80 percent of the really, really good ideas. You know, you've got to ask yourself in all sorts of domains in mathematics and cooking and art and filmmaking, whatever it may be, Why are these people having so many good ideas? And the reality is they're not. What they are having is more ideas, creative people just generally cottoned on that, if you have more ideas, you will then have more to choose from, I think the follow up to that is even more fascinating that even the most creative people have been proven. They don't even know which of their ideas will work in the real world. They have to try them out and get feedback on them, and the trying out is the second dance step I have in collaboration, which is the idea of having an experimental approach.  Steve Rush: What does that experimental approach entail? Greg Orme: Being experimental is the idea of saying taking an idea and saying, well, what is the shortest possible route of least investment in time and money and risk to find out if this works in the real world? It is trying things out, but in a much more structured and scientific way. It is actually a concept that is being well promoted and use from the West Coast in the tech industry, because, of course, you can release software with very little risk and see if it works. And so it's bringing that approach into your life and thinking it can be as simple as a behavioural change or a new idea. How can I just get some evidence of whether this works or not? So you set up a hypothesis, you try something that you some what happens and then you pivot and move again. Rather than saying, I love this idea, this is what is going to be the rest of my life investing all your gold and time and fortune into it and then 12 months later, finding out it was not a very good idea at all. It is about really doing things very rapidly. Steve Rush: The world is moving so quickly, isn't it? By the time we've kind of got our idea implemented, ready to go, we could be late. We could have missed the opportunity entirely. Greg Orme: Yeah, I mean, that is the other risk. I mean the first risk I was talking exactly. It was the wrong idea. More probably, it is the wrong version of the right idea or it could be that you missed your opportunity because you did not get the first draft in the marketplace. Although I have to say, Steve, I think, you know, if you think about the alternative, which is the more corporate way of doing things, which is say we've got a great idea, we can follow, the motion, we're going to put three million this and we're going to make it happen. And that's the sort of strategic approach that's actually probably faster in the long run but if you think about it, much, much more risky because you've kind of made the assumption something will work and you put a lot of money behind it. I personally, I prefer to not lose money on bad ideas so that is why I think experimentation might be slightly slower, because you are pivoting and moving and learning and pivoting and moving but it's actually is a better way of reaching a really good product or a really good outcome for an idea.  Steve Rush: I am with you. Now The Human Edge has won the Business Book of the Year for 2020. That is available for everybody to access download paperback, but what is next for you? Greg Orme: Well, obviously, kind of my life splits into speaking and writing effectively, so on the speaking in the session's front, you know, obviously, I'm now delivering lots of workshops, both online and off based on the insights in The Human Edge, and that's really exciting. So there is that a sort of kind of applying the knowledge that I have already got in terms of what is next in terms of writing, I don't know. I am looking all sorts of different things. I am very interested in communication, as you are saying, at the start of our discussion. You know, I was a journalist at one point. I have always used communication right at the heart of what I do, so I am kind of mulling ideas about how could I bring a new angle to communication and that is kind of interesting to me, but I'm really looking for questions, you know, coming back to the theme of ask better questions. I am always think, how can I ask a better question? And I'll know when I've got a good question I will start pursuing it with this experimental approach and see what comes from that. Steve Rush: Perfect opportunity for experiments then. Greg Orme: Exactly. Steve, I don't really trust the ideas I bring back off bike ride. I ride my bike around the lanes here in in Warwickshire and I get sort of high on endorphins about 45 minutes into the ride and have a load of ideas. Come back and I just think the best things ever and I always write them down and think I'll leave them for a couple of days, because when I come done off my endorphin high. I often find they are not very good at all, and so it is about not investing too early in your ideas and having enough of them and so I guess having enough questions is rather than getting obsessed by one straight away. But then following through and that is the writing process of when you have actually got the question. You have established, it is a good one, then you really need to focus. Steve Rush: We wish you best with what happens next. Greg, so this part of the show we have become familiar with me hacking into the minds of our guests. And I'd just like to get a sense from yours, if you're able to distil some of your dance steps, some of your experiences as a leader. What would be your top leadership hacks you could share with our listeners? Greg Orme: Wow that is a good question. The first one would be and I have already said it, but you know, I just re-emphasize it for people. I think it is the heart of good leadership; I think is really the cornerstone of good creativity as well. See if you can ask more and better questions every day. I think that is a great leadership technique because it not only sends a signal that you are curious in the world, it liberates other people to come into the conversation. It is a great way of really energizing a team, so I would say ask better questions. Secondly, I would say and I have become very interesting and I do write about it in The Human Edge a little bit and I become more interested even since the book has been published in; the science underpins humour and fun. I would say to leaders in organizations, that you should be bringing humour and fun into the dynamic of your team. Because it helps enormously with cutting through in terms of your communication. It supports creativity and of course, it supports cooperation. If you can make someone smile, they trust you and that is what is needed more in companies now than ever. And generally, I would echo that the thrust of The Human Edge and my third one is if you're a leader, don't forget to drop the mask every now and then. Share your authentic self. Show your humanity. Because I think, people need that from their leaders and obviously, you can't keep doing it. Leadership is to some extent a performance art but I think people want to see a theme of humanity and authenticity and what you are doing, so drop the mask, and bring your humanity to work. Steve Rush: I say great advice, thank you. Greg Orme: You are welcome. Steve Rush: Now to get inside and find out what your Hack to Attack is; and what that means is a period in your life or your work where something has not worked out as you had expected. Maybe it is screwed up. Maybe it has failed miserably. But as a result of the experience, we now use that in our life, and our work as something positive. What will be your Hack to Attack? Greg Orme: Steve, you know, I do a lot of public speaking and keynote speaking. Well in the early part of my career, I was asked to give a speech and it was a kind of a more relaxed, informal kind of after dinner type thing and so I thought, you know, I don't want to ruin my ability to be in the moment and kind of react to it. I won't over prepare. I won't kill the magic, as it were, and I went along to give my speech and of course, as soon as I stood up in front of a couple of hundred people. Your brain works in a very different when you are up there and I could not you know, I did not really have it there at my fingertips. And I kind of realized in that moment, since I've really researched how other people do it and I looked at it and I've realized the actual preparation does not put you in the straitjacket. Being absolutely prepared when you are doing presentations and public speaking. Actually, counterintuitive, it releases you to be in the moment because you've got a very solid structure and so you can only leave a plan if you have a plan in the first place. So I find now when I deliver speeches, I kind of know what I'm saying down to literally 20, 25 second segments. I don't have a script because nobody can remember a script for long periods of time but I really know what I'm going to say, and that allows me to kind of, you know, leave those series of bullet points, because I know it's very solid underneath. So, yeah, I prepare in a really rigorous way for what I'm doing and it really helps. Steve Rush: Super learning and preparation is foundation. So making sure that what you execute is executed in the way that you intend. Greg Orme: Absolutely, you know, as I said, it makes me laugh and people still say to me. I am going to do this presentation. I am going to wing it because I wanted to be really fresh and in my view or maybe just me, but, you know, in my view, that's the wrong way to go. You need to be really super prepared and actually people think you are making it up as you go along. You are so well prepared but it is the preparation that allows for that serendipitous moment to happen. Steve Rush: And then lastly, we would like to explore with you, Greg, is if you are able to do a bit of time travel, bump into the Greg at 21, what would be the best bit of advice that you would give Greg at that time? Greg Orme: So much, I would like to say to the 21 year old me. Sadly, Steve, a very, very long time ago now. I think I only started writing quite late, really sort of seven, eight years ago. I was not writing back then. I would say to that person, I am sure the 21 year old me would not have had the confidence to think that he would go on to write award winning business books. So I would just say write. Write right every day, don't worry about what it's going to become or what it is, but just make sure every day you get 500 words down on something. Because what I have really discovered. Now, I have written business books and other pieces and magazine articles and created products. Actually, you don't know what it is until you start, so you just got to get going in and end the mess is actually where you discover the good stuff. So I would say just do it, whatever your creative output is and for anybody out there, whether you're a writer or whatever else you do, just do it every day because you'll find your ideas in that mess. Steve Rush: Awesome advice. Thanks, Greg, so as folks are listening to this, they are probably thinking, I have heard a lot about The Human Edge. We know it's got awards. How do we get hold of a copy? Greg Orme: Well, you know. Oh, it is on Amazon. It is on…oh crikey. Every online bookseller there is.  It was not until recently in the WH Smith travel stores. I am not sure if it is still there. I have not been out of my house for quite some time but the best place to get it is online. If you put in The Human Edge by Greg Orme, you will find it on Amazon very, very quickly or somewhere else if you prefer to shop with someone else. And of course, if people want to become part of my network, I'm constant releasing videos and snippets and blogs all the time. I am very active on LinkedIn and you can find me at Greg Orme also to a certain extent at Twitter, and I think I am @gregoryorme on there, or you can go to my website, which is gregorme.org. Steve Rush: We will also make sure, Greg that we put details of how to access your book and all your social media sites in our show notes and on our website too, so as folks have listened to this, they can click and follow you straight away. Greg Orme: Fantastic. Well, it has just been a fantastic conversation with you. I really enjoyed it. Thank you so much for having me. Steve Rush: And thank you for being on The Leadership Hacker Podcast, Greg. It has been super and a massive congratulations from us and our team on your superb award. And good luck with whatever the future holds for you now. Greg Orme: Thank you, Steve and same to you, cheers.    Closing Steve Rush: I genuinely want to say heartfelt thanks for taking time out of your day to listen in too. We do this in the service of helping others, and spreading the word of leadership. Without you listening in, there would be no show. So please subscribe now if you have not done so already. Share this podcast with your communities, network, and help us develop a community and a tribe of leadership hackers. Finally, if you would like me to work with your senior team, your leadership community, keynote an event, or you would like to sponsor an episode. Please connect with us, by our social media. And you can do that by following and liking our pages on Twitter and Facebook our handler their @leadershiphacker. Instagram you can find us there @the_leadership_hacker and at YouTube, we are just Leadership Hacker, so that is me signing off. I am Steve Rush and I have been the leadership hacker.

Marielle Hare is a coach, workshop designer & facilitator and an artist. Marielle and I discuss her 30 Days Ecstatic Feast offerings, Creative Mojo (with a focus on PLAY) and her art series at The Flowjo, NASA creativity study by Dr. George Land and Beth Jarman, Emile Durkheim's Collective Effervescence and Quote by David Whtye Her websites & contact www.EcstaticFeast.com www.MarielleHare.com --- Send in a voice message: https://anchor.fm/rachel6014/message

A MORTE DA CRIATIVIDADE vídeo disponível dia 03/02 no canal LER É VERBO no YouTube. “Minhas plantas falsas morreram porque eu não fingi que as molhava” – Mitch Hedberg. Na década de 70, a NASA pediu ao Dr. George Land que desenvolvesse um teste da criatividade a fim de ajudar a agência espacial a avaliar e contratar os engenheiros e cientistas mais criativos. O teste foi um sucesso. E aí o Dr. Land pensou: E se eu usar essa avaliação em crianças? Qual será o resultado? Baixe gratuitamente a RODA DA CRIATIVIDADE: www.lereverbo.com/a-jornada-do-artista

George Land discusses Joshua Tree National Park, Eileen Kennedy-Moore teaches how to build up your kids, Chantelle Anderson gives tips for developing confidence, Leah Branstetter discusses women in rock, Chester Santos gives advice for improving memory, Fran Pitre explains how to follow your dreams when you're a parent.

Qu'est-ce que la créativité ? Etes-vous créatif ? Pouvez-vous le devenir ? Nous répondons à quelques unes de ces questions au fil de nos découvertes. Dans cet épisode vous serez surpris (nous l'espérons) par toutes les notions qui gravitent autour de la créativité. Vous apprendrez qu'au fil de l'âge nous sommes de moins en moins créatifs mais qu'il n'existe pas de fatalité et que l'on devient créatif plus qu'on ne l'apprend. Pour rappel, nous ne sommes pas des experts mais de simples curieux qui partageons ce qui nous a intéressé. Ainsi, si des éléments sont manquants ou erronés, n'hésitez pas à nous le faire savoir. Nous essaierons autant que possible de rectifier nos propos. Bonne écoute! Références: - R.E. Beaty et coll., « Robust Prediction of Individual Creative Ability from Brain Functional Connectivity », in Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences, janv. 2018 - Eric J. Johnson and Daniel Goldstein, Do Defaults Save Lives?, Science 302 (2003) 1338:1339 - George Land and Beth Jarman, Breaking Point and Beyond. San Francisco: HarperBusiness, 1993 - Placebo can enhance creativity - Liron Rozenkrantz, Avraham E. Mayo, Tomer Ilan, Yuval Hart, Lior Noy , Uri Alon (2017) - Dreaming (Vol. 3, No. 2)- Deidre Barrett, PhD (1993) - Organizational Behavior and Human Decision Processes (Vol. 82, No. 1) - Paul Paulus (2000) - Creativity Research Journal (Vol. 14, No. 3.4) - Janetta Mitchell McCoy (2002) - Creativity Research Journal (Vol. 16, No. 2.3) - Karen Gasper (2004)

Episode Notes [Background: Thelonious Monk - Don’t Blame Me]Welcome to episode four of Tenny’s Tunes. I am your host, Tenny!Now, I wanna spend some time taking you back to childhood. Our childhood. In cognitive psychology, we learned that crystallized intelligence, such as skills, knowledge and experience, increases with age while fluid intelligence, the ability to assess and solve problems in novel circumstances, decreases as we grow older. This leads some people to believe that the mind of a child is way more creative than that of an adult’s. In other words, we can become smarter and wiser, but never more creative than our younger selves. Scientific studies have produced persuasive evidence for this argument. A 1968 creativity test on 1,600 children conducted by George Land and Beth Jarman demonstrated a sharp drop in creativity score, from 98 percent at 5 years of age to 12 percent at 15 years old, all the way down to 2 percent around 31 years old. A gradual decrease in the capacity to think outside the box: seems like most of us undergrads don’t think about it too much. Several people I met throughout my life thus far have expressed interest in learning Chinese from me. In exchange, I would also practice speaking a few other languages with them, such as spanish and japanese. Amid our joy of learning new phrases and being complimented by one another, many of them still told me they would have been able to, say, learn a new language much faster, if they were a just a couple years younger. What if we could freeze aging and stay as a child forever? Just like that high school detective who turned back into a first-grader from the popular crime-solving series “Case Closed”? I am not sure how well received this cartoon was in the U.S., but for any kid who loved watching TV in China, Japan or Korea back in the 90s and 2000s, Protagonist Kudou Shinichi, aka Edogawa Conan, the high school detective who got turned into a first-grader by a mysterious crime organization, whose name was inspired by the creator of Sherlock Holmes, Sir Arthur Conan Doyle, represents a portion of our childhood. In elementary school, literally every child, good and bad at taking tests alike, would worship and pray to Conan for good luck before taking a test.The main theme of Case Closed, composed by Japanese film score producer Oono Katsuo, was and still is so popular in Japan and worldwide that even the Japanese military band performed the piece on several occasions. It is one of those melodies that gets stuck in your head after hearing it just once. A couple weeks ago, a friend of mine, a fervent fan of Case Closed just like I am, had requested me to make a piano rendition, so I did. Get ready, cue the music.(Play Recording)Although short, it’s one of those dramatic music with an epic intro that simply demands attention. If there is one thing I learned from doing these episodes of Tenny’s Tunes, it’s that music really just boils down to the chord progression that serves as the skeleton on which the melody builds. For this particular piece, the gradual downward chord progression supporting the catchy melody fits like bread and butter with the storyline. I can just picture Conan chasing down the culprit on his solar energy skateboard and amplified running shoes. Can you feel the energy being injected into you with every chord, every single note landing on your ear drums? If you enjoyed the main theme of Case Closed, be sure to check out some of the other works by Mr. Oono and perhaps the cartoon itself. You won’t regret it, trust me. :)Music produced by Oono Katsuo, performed on the piano by me. I am Tenny Tsang, and this is NBN Audio. Thank you so much for listening, and stay tuned to Tenny’s Tunes. Have a great winter! This podcast is powered by Pinecast.

Download Tom Hatsis is an intellectual, occultist, psychedelic user and advocate from Portland, Oregon. In the show, Joe and Tom talk about his new book about microdosing. Joe prepares listeners about the controversial topic, magick, which is highly discussed in the show. Witch craft, western shamanism, old religion and magick are all mentioned during the conversation. Tom is a coordinator for Sanctum Psychedelica, a psychedelic club in Portland. 3 Key Points: Tom’s book Microdosing Magic is a book of templates for people to fill in the blank according to what works for them Magic isn't the ‘hocus pocus’ witchy stuff that people always assume, it's actually mind hacking, reframing and neurogenesis, that every individual is born with the ability to tap into Magic is a great way to create containers to frame our psychedelic experiences Support the show Patreon Leave us a review on iTunes Share us with your friends – favorite podcast, etc Join our Facebook group - Psychedelics Today group – Find the others and create community. Navigating Psychedelics Show Notes About Tom Tom’s Book - Microdosing Magic: A Psychedelic Spellbook Tom thinks having a childlike wonder and being curious helped him write his book He has written 4 books, 3 have been in psychedelic topics Tom’s background - a part of the Roller derby background since 2005 His first book was called The Roller Derby: A Sensation that caused a Book, the Confessions of a Roller Derby Mascot. Then he got into psychedelic history and wrote The Witch’s Ointment, Psychedelic Mystery Traditions and his newest book, Microdosing Magic. Portland is a great place for the psychedelic renaissance Microdosing Magic Tom said we should be using psychedelics in a magical way Joe agrees saying when using psychedelics we should be flexible philosophically Joe mentions the Robert Anton Wilson reality tunnels We all have a B.S. (Belief System) and then reality tunnels are the marxist sunglasses and the capitalist sunglasses and feminist sunglasses, instead of having 40 glasses to see behind bias, we all have our own pair of shades Microdosing is a tool that helps people become childlike, more genius Magic Microdosing Magic is a book of templates for people to fill in the blank to what works with them Tom never tells people what to do with psychedelics, he is offering insight and techniques Using his own techniques, him and his partner are about to win a guinness world record “If microdosing is like a healthy diet and magic is like exercise, that's great. But what happens when you put healthy diet with exercise? You have something far more powerful than those two things could have been by themselves. That's how microdosing magic works.” Magic = mind hacking, re-framing and neurogenesis The Four Gifts Tom talks about ‘The Four Gifts’ in his book They make up the beginning of his personal magical system that he has cultivated over his lifetime Carl Sagan quote, “The cosmos are within us, we are a way for the universe to know itself” Tom agrees strongly with that saying, he thinks we are microdoses of that cosmic magic and from it, we've received 3 immaterial gifts, Intellect, Emotion and Will, however, due to our evolution in physical bodies, we've inherited a fourth gift, action The magical system is about aligning your intellect, emotion and will, so that when we take action, we are acting in pure magic Magic is super powerful, not something that happens at Disney World. It's a very real thing that every individual is born with the ability to tap into Orenda - the magic that you are born with Microdosing Magic is Tom’s small contribution to bettering the world Joe says there are so many people that practice subtle magic and don't even know it; in catholic religion, in yoga practice Tom has a friend who ‘doesn't believe in magic’, who is a hardcore material reductionist, who has a ‘lucky hat’ Tom - “This isn't for people with claws and fangs, magic is for anybody who recognizes their own power and wants to harness their power to make their lives and the world around them a better place” Neurogenesis, better firing, and re-framing happens in a person’s brain after consuming Psilocybin, Lions Mane and Reishi Tom says he was addicted to coffee, and after using Microdosing Magic, he hasn't needed a cup of coffee on 8 months because of his new neural pathways Joe jokes about overdosing on coffee for a few months on his coffee addiction Tom jokes back that he’d just drink it out of the pot Creative Genius Dr. George Land study - 98% of 5 year old scored in the creative genius category in the same test that 32 year-olds only scored 2% The modern education system robs us of our creative genius that we all had when we were kids, but at no fault to the teachers. The education system, buys these education models that just don't work Tom - “You have to use the internet wisely and not foolishly, to educate yourself and not de-educate yourself” The Book Tour Joe asks about the most interesting questions Tom has received on tour Most people ask about dose sizes and safety questions Tom explains that he gets nervous about certain questions because he isn't a medical professional or a therapist Tom “If you wouldn't take a psychedelic dose, don’t start microdosing” Microdosing Tom has been microdosing on and off for over 20 years “We didn't call it microdosing, we called it being broke, we could only afford 1/8th of acid, so we split it up. We felt way more energy, I started writing way more songs, I couldn't put my guitar down. It sparks that creativity” Joe says it's never been a better time for the psychedelic and microdosing renaissance Cannabis is now legal in 13 states FDA just approved mushrooms for PTSD in Canada MDMA is in phase 3 testing Tom says people in Silicon Valley, and believes people in Congress and DC are microdosing, they just can't talk about it He mentions a talk he just did in Salem, a very conservative place, and no one had any questions. And then after the talk, everybody came up to him privately and asked him their questions Tim Leary made a joke on Liberals not wanting to ‘risk face’ Joe comments on Tom’s book saying it was playful, inspiring, and not threatening like some magic can be Tom says we don't have villages for support anymore, we have community which has replaced that Sanctum Psychedelia’s main focus is community building Tom uses an example of people going to Peru, taking ayahuasca, and because they don't have that mystical framework, they come back to their regular lives and say “now what”? That's why integration and community are so important Tom says he’d love to see ayahuasca and ibogaine clinics with all the great results people have received from their heroine or cigarette addictions Tom’s favorite presentation ever was Mark Haden’s blueprint on the future of psychedelics psychotherapy Mark Haden's Presentation on Psycehdelics Mark Haden Psychedelic Reneissance Cannabis and the War on Drugs Tom likes to buy his cannabis directly from his farmer, he prefers to not have the government interfere He says Gene Simmons from KISS has been so anti cannabis and now all of a sudden is promoting cannabis Joe brings in the drug war issue, or the issue of people being put in jail for nonviolent crimes (cannabis) Tom brings in another issue, saying that if a person is charged for drugs at one point in time that later becomes legal, they aren't allowed freedom because of the fact that they did the crime during the time where it was illegal Racism and the war on drugs really bothers Tom Amanita and the True History of Christian Psychedelic History Predominant Paradigm - the ‘Holy Mushroom’ Tom says there aren't mushrooms in Christian art after doing the historical research Source He has debunked the Amanita Muscaria Santa Claus connection Psychedelic Santa Debate with John Rush The Mushroom in Christian Art: The Identity of Jesus in the Development of Christianity People say the Amanita Muscaria and Santa Claus outfit are the same colors, but Santa’s outfit comes from the American Flag Carl Ruck Dionysus in Thrace: Ancient Entheogenic Themes in the Mythology and Archeology of Northern Greece, Bulgaria and Turkey Psychedelic Christianity - a scholarly debate a scholarly debate pt. 2 Final Thoughts Tom - “Psychedelics are an excellent way to change your mind and yourself” Magic is a great way to create containers to frame difficult psychedelic experiences. It’s about putting new frames on your reality Links Tom's website Instagram Facebook Youtube Tom's Book Check out this FREE online course, "Introduction to Psychedelics" About Tom . Thomas Hatsis is an author, lecturer, and historian of witchcraft, magic, Western religions, contemporary psychedelia, entheogens, and medieval pharmacopeia. In his spare time he visits rare archives, slings elixirs, and coaches roller derby.

EP. 30 According to scientific research, attending public school is the best way to destroy the creative genius of children. If that sounds like clickbait, I would encourage you to continue listening to this episode and decide for yourself. Exploring the idea of creativity poses some rather interesting questions. Where does creativity come from? Are we born with it, or is it learned? And if it is learned, then how is it learned? If you haven’t already, click here to download your FREE eBook, Building an Emotionally Safe Home as our gift to you. P.S. You can click here to check out Dr. George Land's insightful TEDx Talk.

Jane Hanckel is a mother, author and co-founder of Inspired Education about how we as parents can foster our children's development to meet the immense challenges of our times. Jane quotes the World Economic Forum's (2016) findings that the qualities we need to nurture in our children are creativity, collaboration and emotional intelligence and that the current education system does not do that. Instead, there are things we as parents can do at home to keep these innate aspects of our humanity alive, through unstructured play, time in nature, nourishing food and family relationships. Jane also cites research that has found that our investment in time and energy in fostering these qualities sets our children's health up for life. Jane Hanckel, co-founder: www.inspirededucation.com.auPresenter: Sally CusackFirst aired on BayFM Byron Bay on 2 July 2018.Copyright: PBB Media, Sally Cusack 2018References:* Bruno Bettelheim "The Good Enough Parent"* Fewer Toys Study: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/29190457* Gonski Report (importance of tailoring education to individuals): https://www.education.gov.au/review-achieve-educational-excellence-australian-schools* NASA study by George Land and Beth Jarman about the impacts of education on our creativity: https://research-repository.griffith.edu.au/bitstream/handle/10072/7880/33187_1.pdf?sequenceOther references: * Nancy Carlsson-Paige "Taking Back Childhood"* Professor James Heckman on importance of support for children and their parents in the early years for lifelong health: https://heckmanequation.org/resource/research-summary-abecedarian-health/* Nature Play NSW, Qld and other Australian statesImage: Greg Rakozy on Unsplash.com

Jane Hanckel is a mother, author and co-founder of Inspired Education about how we as parents can foster our children's development to meet the immense challenges of our times. Jane quotes the World Economic Forum's (2016) findings that the qualities we need to nurture in our children are creativity, collaboration and emotional intelligence and that the current education system does not do that. Instead, there are things we as parents can do at home to keep these innate aspects of our humanity alive, through unstructured play, time in nature, nourishing food and family relationships. Jane also cites research that has found that our investment in time and energy in fostering these qualities sets our children's health up for life. Jane Hanckel, co-founder: www.inspirededucation.com.auPresenter: Sally CusackFirst aired on BayFM Byron Bay on 2 July 2018.Copyright: PBB Media, Sally Cusack 2018References:* Bruno Bettelheim "The Good Enough Parent"* Fewer Toys Study: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/29190457* Gonski Report (importance of tailoring education to individuals): https://www.education.gov.au/review-achieve-educational-excellence-australian-schools* NASA study by George Land and Beth Jarman about the impacts of education on our creativity: https://research-repository.griffith.edu.au/bitstream/handle/10072/7880/33187_1.pdf?sequenceOther references: * Nancy Carlsson-Paige "Taking Back Childhood"* Professor James Heckman on importance of support for children and their parents in the early years for lifelong health: https://heckmanequation.org/resource/research-summary-abecedarian-health/* Nature Play NSW, Qld and other Australian statesImage: Greg Rakozy on Unsplash.com

Today we talk about finding our inner five-year-old, nostalgic childhood movies, intentionally choosing to live a good life, and giving ourselves permission to imagine. Oh, and we also talk about a disabled fox. MENTIONS: * Red Nose Day - https://donate.rednoseday.org/ * Creative Compulsive Disorder & Remembering Zina Nicole Lahr - https://vimeo.com/80973511 * TEDx Talk about Imagination/Creativity with Dr. George Land - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZfKMq-rYtnc * Casey Neistat & Paul: Shark Video - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PcM5JCGsw3c&t=194s * Buried Treasure Story -https://www.goodnewsnetwork.org/couple-discovers-buried-treasure-worth-52000-in-their-backyard-and-returns-it-all-to-the-owners/ * 'The Heart of Man' movie - https://heartofmanmovie.com/ * 'The Orthodox Heretic' by Peter Rollins STAY CONNECTED: Email: chasingunicornspodcast@gmail.com Official Instagram: @HansowFamily Personal Instagram: @MorganHansow and @DaveHansow Website: www.ChasingUnicornsPodcast.Com Leave a Comment Below

Usually, when I write a blog post it is because I want to dig deeper into a topic and explore its merit. The post then becomes my way of explaining to myself, and to anyone who reads it, the underlying ideas and what my thoughts, experiences, and takeaways are on the topic. This post is different. Today I want to talk about one of the most important topics to me: the future of our children. But I’m not going to dive into this topic by myself. I’m not going to cover it in a huge four-part series like I recently wrote. Instead, I want to share excerpts and thoughts from one of the most thought-provoking articles I’ve ever read on the subject.  Maybe you are like me with four kids all young, all with a wide open possibility of what life is going to be like. Maybe you don’t have any kids, or maybe your kids are all grown, or maybe you have grandkids. In any case, if you are a teacher, leader, or learner it always comes back to our kids (at least it should always come back to what is best for kids). You can read the full article yourself (but it is extremely long at over 10,000 words) and I wanted to paraphrase and highlight some key takeaways from the article, mainly to make sure that we are thinking about and discussing this idea in our homes and in our schools. The question is, “Are we raising/preparing/teaching our students/children to be chefs or cooks?” Tim Urban explains the difference between a chef and a cook in his post for the blog >Wait But Why: The words “cook” and “chef” seem kind of like synonyms. And in the real world, they’re often used interchangeably. But in this post, when I say chef, I don’t mean any ordinary chef. I mean the trailblazing chef—the kind of chef who invents recipes. And for our purposes, everyone else who enters a kitchen—all those who follow recipes—is a cook. Everything you eat—every part of every cuisine we know so well—was at some point in the past created for the first time. Wheat, tomatoes, salt, and milk go back a long time, but at some point, someone said, “What if I take those ingredients and do this…and this…..and this……” and ended up with the world’s first pizza. That’s the work of a chef. Since then, god knows how many people have made a pizza. That’s the work of a cook. The chef reasons from first principles, and for the chef, the first principles are raw edible ingredients. Those are her puzzle pieces, her building blocks, and she works her way upwards from there, using her experience, her instincts, and her taste buds. The cook works off of some version of what’s already out there—a recipe of some kind, a meal she tried and liked, a dish she watched someone else make. What all of these cooks have in common is their starting point is something that already exists. Even the innovative cook is still making an iteration of a burger, a pizza, and a cake. At the very end of the spectrum, you have the chef. A chef might make good food or terrible food, but whatever she makes, it’s a result of her own reasoning process, from the selection of raw ingredients at the bottom to the finished dish at the top. A cook is then considered a follower. They can even be a creative follower, but they’ll never create from their own understanding, but instead always build on what others have done. They are often doing old things in new ways. Chefs, on the other hand, are experimenting and doing new things in new ways. They are building and experimenting and often failing. Are we encouraging students to experiment like a chef? Are we supporting them when their efforts turn into “terrible” food? Do we only praise students for cook-like efforts? Urban explains how, from a very young age, many of us have been rewarded for cook-like behaviors, while discouraged from digging deep like a chef might do: Everyone’s raised differently, but for most people I know, it went something like this: We were taught all kinds of things by our parents and teachers—what’s right and wrong, what’s safe and dangerous, the kind of person you should and shouldn’t be. But the idea was: I’m an adult so I know much more about this than you, it’s not up for debate, don’t argue, just obey. That’s when the cliché “Why?” game comes in (what ElonSpeak calls “the chained why”). A child’s instinct isn’t just to know what to do and not to do, she wants to understand the rules of her environment. And to understand something, you have to have a sense of how that thing was built. When parents and teachers tell a kid to do XYZ and to simply obey, it’s like installing a piece of already-designed software in the kid’s head. When kids ask Why? and then Why? and then Why?, they’re trying to deconstruct that software to see how it was built—to get down to the first principles underneath so they can weigh how much they should actually care about what the adults seem so insistent upon. The first few times a kid plays the Why game, parents think it’s cute. But many parents, and most teachers, soon come up with a way to cut the game off: Because I said so. “Because I said so” inserts a concrete floor into the child’s deconstruction effort below which no further Why’s may pass. It says, “You want first principles? There. There’s your floor. No more Why’s necessary. The problem with the “because I said so” game is that eventually our beliefs and interactions with the world are not rooted in what our parents say is true, but in what many other influencing people, institutions, and dogmas say is true. Urban illustrates this point masterfully (he’s also great at sketching): And this consistent game of “because I said so” leads many students to lose the creative chef side they once had. In fact, it’s been documented that this not only happens to some children, but to a huge population of kids as they grow up and become teenagers and adults. Couple that concept with what another favorite writer of mine, James Clear, explained recently on his blog: In the 1960s, a creative performance researcher named George Land conducted a study of 1,600 five-year-olds and 98 percent of the children scored in the “highly creative” range. Dr. Land re-tested each subject during five year increments. When the same children were 10-years-old, only 30 percent scored in the highly creative range. This number dropped to 12 percent by age 15 and just 2 percent by age 25. As the children grew into adults they effectively had the creativity trained out of them. In the words of Dr. Land, “non-creative behavior is learned.” It makes sense, right? Creative thinking is a close cousin of first principles reasoning. In both cases, the thinker needs to invent his own thought pathways. People think of creativity as a natural born talent, but it’s actually much more of a way of thinking—it’s the thinking version of painting onto a blank canvas. But to do that requires brain software that’s skilled and practiced at coming up with new things, and school trains us on the exact opposite concept—to follow the leader, single-file, and to get really good at taking tests. Instead of a blank canvas, school hands kids a coloring book and tells them to stay within the lines. Take a moment and think of your own life. Think of your own learning path. When did the term “learning” become synonymous with “school”? Why do students feel more stress centered around “learning” as the grow older? Why will students spend hours and hours of their own time learning how to create a virtual world in Minecraft, but feel discouraged when given time to learn in school? It’s been quite apparent to me over the past 10 years in public education as a teacher, administrator, and now parent—that most of us are saying the right things. We want students to be creative. We want students to do innovative work. We want authentic learning tasks and assessments. We want to challenge our students to be problem solvers. But, when most of us look at the practices in our own schools and our own homes, it looks much different than what we want. So, how do we get from here (wanting school and learning to look a certain way) to there (school and learning actually looking the way we want it to look)? I know I personally have to admit that I’ve often taken the easy route. It’s much easier to teach a class of cooks than it is a class of chefs.It’s much easier to raise cooks than it is to raise chefs. It’s much easier to tell my students and my own children that if they follow this magic formula (below) all will be ok: Listen. Do what you are told at all times. Get good grades. Get into a good college. Get a good job. Have a good life. The problem is that the magic formula doesn’t work anymore, and I’m not sure it ever did. I know many adults who have followed that exact path and can’t stand their job, and complain about their life. But, ultimately we have to ask ourselves the question as parents, teachers, and leaders–what is the purpose of all this schooling?  What is the purpose for almost 15,000 hours of instruction and learning time in a school setting from K-12? Do we want to continue producing students who believe their life will be set as a cook? Or who want to live life like as a chef… History is full of the stories of chefs creating revolutions of apparent ingenuity through simple first principles reasoning. Genghis Khan organizing a smattering of tribes that had been fragmented for centuries using a powers of ten system in order to build one grand tribe that could sweep the world. Henry Ford creating cars with the out-of-the-box manufacturing technique of assembly-line production in order to bring cars to the masses for the first time. Marie Curie using unconventional methods to pioneer the theory of radioactivity and topple the “atoms are indivisible” assumption on its head (she won a Nobel Prize in both physics and chemistry—two prizes reserved exclusively for chefs). Martin Luther King taking a nonviolent Thoreau approach to a situation normally addressed by riots. Larry Page and Sergey Brin ignoring the commonly-used methods of searching the internet in favor of what they saw as a more logical system that based page importance on the number of important sites that linked to it. The 1966 Beatles deciding to stop being the world’s best cooks, ditching the typical songwriting styles of early-60s bands, including their own, and become music chefs, creating a bunch of new types of songs from scratch that no one had heard before. Whatever the time, place, or industry, anytime something really big happens, there’s almost always an experimenting chef at the center of it—not being anything magical, just trusting their brain and working from scratch. Our world, like our cuisines, was created by these people—the rest of us are just along for the ride. That’s where I leave you today. I don’t have all the answers. Heck, I don’t even have a few of the answers. But I want us to start asking the right questions. I also want us to challenge ourselves, our colleagues, and our staff to discuss what type of students and what types of children we are trying to raise and teach. Thanks to Tim Urban and WaitButWhy.com for making me question whether or not my own children are heading towards the cook-life or the chef-life.  

"Your contribution is necessary. You are free to define what that contribution is in a way that is an actual reflection of you in a more fully self-expressed way." ~Nita Baum We arrive in this world with birthright gifts—then we spend the first half of our lives abandoning them or letting others disabuse us of them. As young people, we are surrounded by expectations that may have little to do with who we really are, expectations held by people who are not trying to discern our selfhood but to fit us into slots. In families, schools, workplaces, and religious communities, we are trained away from true self toward images of acceptability; under social pressures like racism and sexism our original shape is deformed beyond recognition; and we ourselves, driven by fear, too often betray true self to gain the approval of others. We are disabused of original giftedness in the first half of our lives. Then—if we are awake, aware, and able to admit our loss—we spend the second half trying to recover and reclaim the gift we once possessed. Sometimes you don’t know how great life truly can be until you are there. ~Parker Palmer This conversation on Giftedness with Nita Baum is one of the best podcast conversations I have had yet. We touch on the following themes: How your unique contribution is essential for you and for the rest of us How it may take time to figure it out The education system's impact on our giftedness A surprising landmark study on creative genius conducted by Beth Jarman and George Land using a test created by NASA Systemic issues—diversity/tolerance begins with our own self-acceptance—even our own weirdness and idiosyncrasies The role of elders Not holding fast to what you know because it’s going to change Your lens is valuable and each of us has the right to our own lens—we can all do that at the same time. A nod to artists and those who are marginalized including incarcerated--the need to find common ground And much more The series will continue for 3 more weeks! Look out for Special Episode 3 next week.

George Land, Senior Vice President Content and Marketing for NBA China is an "animal" when it comes to getting gritty. He believes in order to get what you want you have to work hard and do your homework. In this episode he says that when an opportunity presents itself the preparation will allow you to capture continued success during your journey in life.

Todd Cochrane talks with J. George Land, Executive Director of Nexia Connected Home Solutions. Nexia Connected Home Solutions is a software provider that works with selected products from a select number of different home automation manufacturers integrating everything into one voice-controlled software application. Nexia offers Z-Wave gateways. The Nexia Z-Wave bridge sells for $67.00 on Amazon … Continue reading Nexia at 2016 CES → The post Nexia at 2016 CES appeared first on Geek News Central.

Podcast 479: Natures Hidden Force with George Land by Greg Voisen

Lake George Land Conservancy Audio Tour