Podcast appearances and mentions of Ian Campbell

For those who haven't heard the announcement I posted, songs from this point on will sometimes be split among multiple episodes, so this is the second part of a two-episode look at the song “Who Knows Where The Time Goes?” by Fairport Convention, and the intertwining careers of Joe Boyd, Sandy Denny, and Richard Thompson. Click the full post to read liner notes, links to more information, and a transcript of the episode. Patreon backers also have a forty-one-minute bonus episode available, on Judy Collins’ version of this song. Tilt Araiza has assisted invaluably by editing, and will hopefully be doing so from now on. Check out Tilt's irregular podcasts at http://www.podnose.com/jaffa-cakes-for-proust and http://sitcomclub.com/ Erratum For about an hour this was uploaded with the wrong Elton John clip in place of “Saturday Sun”. This has now been fixed. Resources Because of the increasing problems with Mixcloud’s restrictions, I have decided to start sharing streaming playlists of the songs used in episodes instead of Mixcloud ones. This Tunemymusic link will let you listen to the playlist I created on your streaming platform of choice — however please note that not all the songs excerpted are currently available on streaming. The songs missing from the Tidal version are “Shanten Bells” by the Ian Campbell Folk Group, “Tom’s Gone to Hilo” by A.L. Lloyd, two by Paul McNeill and Linda Peters, three by Elton John & Linda Peters, “What Will I Do With Tomorrow” by Sandy Denny and “You Never Know” by Charlie Drake, but the other fifty-nine are there. Other songs may be missing from other services. The main books I used on Fairport Convention as a whole were Patrick Humphries' Meet On The Ledge, Clinton Heylin's What We Did Instead of Holidays, and Kevan Furbank's Fairport Convention on Track. Rob Young's Electric Eden is the most important book on the British folk-rock movement. Information on Richard Thompson comes from Patrick Humphries' Richard Thompson: Strange Affair and Thompson's own autobiography Beeswing.  Information on Sandy Denny comes from Clinton Heylin's No More Sad Refrains and Mick Houghton's I've Always Kept a Unicorn. I also used Joe Boyd's autobiography White Bicycles and Chris Blackwell's The Islander.  And this three-CD set is the best introduction to Fairport's music currently in print. Transcript Before we begin, this episode contains reference to alcohol and cocaine abuse and medical neglect leading to death. It also starts with some discussion of the fatal car accident that ended last episode. There’s also some mention of child neglect and spousal violence. If that’s likely to upset you, you might want to skip this episode or read the transcript. One of the inspirations for this podcast when I started it back in 2018 was a project by Richard Thompson, which appears (like many things in Thompson’s life) to have started out of sheer bloody-mindedness. In 1999 Playboy magazine asked various people to list their “songs of the Millennium”, and most of them, understanding the brief, chose a handful of songs from the latter half of the twentieth century. But Thompson determined that he was going to list his favourite songs *of the millennium*. He didn’t quite manage that, but he did cover seven hundred and forty years, and when Playboy chose not to publish it, he decided to turn it into a touring show, in which he covered all his favourite songs from “Sumer Is Icumen In” from 1260: [Excerpt: Richard Thompson, “Sumer is Icumen In”] Through numerous traditional folk songs, union songs like “Blackleg Miner”, pieces by early-modern composers, Victorian and Edwardian music hall songs, and songs by the Beatles, the Ink Spots, the Kinks, and the Who, all the way to “Oops! I Did It Again”: [Excerpt: Richard Thompson, “Oops! I Did it Again”] And to finish the show, and to show how all this music actually ties together, he would play what he described as a “medieval tune from Brittany”, “Marry, Ageyn Hic Hev Donne Yt”: [Excerpt: Richard Thompson, “Marry, Ageyn Hic Hev Donne Yt”] We have said many times in this podcast that there is no first anything, but there’s a reason that Liege and Lief, Fairport Convention’s third album of 1969, and the album other than Unhalfbricking on which their reputation largely rests, was advertised with the slogan “The first (literally) British folk rock album ever”. Folk-rock, as the term had come to be known, and as it is still usually used today, had very little to do with traditional folk music. Rather, the records of bands like The Byrds or Simon and Garfunkel were essentially taking the sounds of British beat groups of the early sixties, particularly the Searchers, and applying those sounds to material by contemporary singer-songwriters. People like Paul Simon and Bob Dylan had come up through folk clubs, and their songs were called folk music because of that, but they weren’t what folk music had meant up to that point — songs that had been collected after being handed down through the folk process, changed by each individual singer, with no single identifiable author. They were authored songs by very idiosyncratic writers. But over their last few albums, Fairport Convention had done one or two tracks per album that weren’t like that, that were instead recordings of traditional folk songs, but arranged with rock instrumentation. They were not necessarily the first band to try traditional folk music with electric instruments — around the same time that Fairport started experimenting with the idea, so did an Irish band named Sweeney’s Men, who brought in a young electric guitarist named Henry McCullough briefly. But they do seem to have been the first to have fully embraced the idea. They had done so to an extent with “A Sailor’s Life” on Unhalfbricking, but now they were going to go much further: [Excerpt: Fairport Convention, “Matty Groves” (from about 4:30)] There had been some doubt as to whether Fairport Convention would even continue to exist — by the time Unhalfbricking, their second album of the year, was released, they had been through the terrible car accident that had killed Martin Lamble, the band’s drummer, and Jeannie Franklyn, Richard Thompson’s girlfriend. Most of the rest of the band had been seriously injured, and they had made a conscious decision not to discuss the future of the band until they were all out of hospital. Ashley Hutchings was hospitalised the longest, and Simon Nicol, Richard Thompson, and Sandy Denny, the other three surviving members of the band, flew over to LA with their producer and manager, Joe Boyd, to recuperate there and get to know the American music scene. When they came back, the group all met up in the flat belonging to Denny’s boyfriend Trevor Lucas, and decided that they were going to continue the band. They made a few decisions then — they needed a new drummer, and as well as a drummer they wanted to get in Dave Swarbrick. Swarbrick had played violin on several tracks on Unhalfbricking as a session player, and they had all been thrilled to work with him. Swarbrick was one of the most experienced musicians on the British folk circuit. He had started out in the fifties playing guitar with Beryl Marriott’s Ceilidh Band before switching to fiddle, and in 1963, long before Fairport had formed, he had already appeared on TV with the Ian Campbell Folk Group, led by Ian Campbell, the father of Ali and Robin Campbell, later of UB40: [Excerpt: The Ian Campbell Folk Group, “Shanten Bells (medley on Hullaballoo!)”] He’d sung with Ewan MacColl and A.L. Lloyd: [Excerpt: A.L. Lloyd, “Tom’s Gone to Hilo” ] And he’d formed his hugely successful duo with Martin Carthy, releasing records like “Byker Hill” which are often considered among the best British folk music of all time: [Excerpt: Martin Carthy and Dave Swarbrick, “Byker Hill”] By the time Fairport had invited him to play on Unhalfbricking, Swarbrick had already performed on twenty albums as a core band member, plus dozens more EPs, singles, and odd tracks on compilations. They had no reason to think they could actually get him to join their band. But they had three advantages. The first was that Swarbrick was sick of the traditional folk scene at the time, saying later “I didn’t like seven-eighths of the people involved in it, and it was extremely opportune to leave. I was suddenly presented with the possibilities of exploring the dramatic content of the songs to the full.” The second was that he was hugely excited to be playing with Richard Thompson, who was one of the most innovative guitarists of his generation, and Martin Carthy remembers him raving about Thompson after their initial sessions. (Carthy himself was and is no slouch on the guitar of course, and there was even talk of getting him to join the band at this point, though they decided against it — much to the relief of rhythm guitarist Simon Nicol, who is a perfectly fine player himself but didn’t want to be outclassed by *two* of the best guitarists in Britain at the same time). And the third was that Joe Boyd told him that Fairport were doing so well — they had a single just about to hit the charts with “Si Tu Dois Partir” — that he would only have to play a dozen gigs with Fairport in order to retire. As it turned out, Swarbrick would play with the group for a decade, and would never retire — I saw him on his last tour in 2015, only eight months before he died. The drummer the group picked was also a far more experienced musician than any of the rest, though in a very different genre. Dave Mattacks had no knowledge at all of the kind of music they played, having previously been a player in dance bands. When asked by Hutchings if he wanted to join the band, Mattacks’ response was “I don’t know anything about the music. I don’t understand it… I can’t tell one tune from another, they all sound the same… but if you want me to join the group, fine, because I really like it. I’m enjoying myself musically.” Mattacks brought a new level of professionalism to the band, thanks to his different background. Nicol said of him later “He was dilligent, clean, used to taking three white shirts to a gig… The application he could bring to his playing was amazing. With us, you only played well when you were feeling well.” This distinction applied to his playing as well. Nicol would later describe the difference between Mattacks’ drumming and Lamble’s by saying “Martin’s strength was as an imaginative drummer. DM came in with a strongly developed sense of rhythm, through keeping a big band of drunken saxophone players in order. A great time-keeper.” With this new line-up and a new sense of purpose, the group did as many of their contemporaries were doing and “got their heads together in the country”. Joe Boyd rented the group a mansion, Farley House, in Farley Chamberlayne, Hampshire, and they stayed there together for three months. At the start, the group seem to have thought that they were going to make another record like Unhalfbricking, with some originals, some songs by American songwriters, and a few traditional songs. Even after their stay in Farley Chamberlayne, in fact, they recorded a few of the American songs they’d rehearsed at the start of the process, Richard Farina’s “Quiet Joys of Brotherhood” and Bob Dylan and Roger McGuinn’s “Ballad of Easy Rider”: [Excerpt: Fairport Convention, “Ballad of Easy Rider”] Indeed, the whole idea of “getting our heads together in the country” (as the cliche quickly became in the late sixties as half of the bands in Britain went through much the same kind of process as Fairport were doing — but usually for reasons more to do with drug burnout or trend following than recovering from serious life-changing trauma) seems to have been inspired by Bob Dylan and the Band getting together in Big Pink. But very quickly they decided to follow the lead of Ashley Hutchings, who had had something of a Damascene conversion to the cause of traditional English folk music. They were listening mostly to Music From Big Pink by the Band, and to the first album by Sweeney’s Men: [Excerpt: Sweeney’s Men, “The Handsome Cabin Boy”] And they decided that they were going to make something that was as English as those records were North American and Irish (though in the event there were also a few Scottish songs included on the record). Hutchings in particular was becoming something of a scholar of traditional music, regularly visiting Cecil Sharp House and having long conversations with A.L. Lloyd, discovering versions of different traditional songs he’d never encountered before. This was both amusing and bemusing Sandy Denny, who had joined a rock group in part to get away from traditional music; but she was comfortable singing the material, and knew a lot of it and could make a lot of suggestions herself. Swarbrick obviously knew the repertoire intimately, and Nicol was amenable, while Mattacks was utterly clueless about the folk tradition at this point but knew this was the music he wanted to make. Thompson knew very little about traditional music, and of all the band members except Denny he was the one who has shown the least interest in the genre in his subsequent career — but as we heard at the beginning, showing the least interest in the genre is a relative thing, and while Thompson was not hugely familiar with the genre, he *was* able to work with it, and was also more than capable of writing songs that fit in with the genre. Of the eleven songs on the album, which was titled Liege and Lief (which means, roughly, Lord and Loyalty), there were no cover versions of singer-songwriters. Eight were traditional songs, and three were originals, all written in the style of traditional songs. The album opened with “Come All Ye”, an introduction written by Denny and Hutchings (the only time the two would ever write together): [Excerpt: Fairport Convention, “Come All Ye”] The other two originals were songs where Thompson had written new lyrics to traditional melodies. On “Crazy Man Michael”, Swarbrick had said to Thompson that the tune to which he had set his new words was weaker than the lyrics, to which Thompson had replied that if Swarbrick felt that way he should feel free to write a new melody. He did, and it became the first of the small number of Thompson/Swarbrick collaborations: [Excerpt: Fairport Convention, “Crazy Man Michael”] Thompson and Swarbrick would become a brief songwriting team, but as much as anything else it was down to proximity — the two respected each other as musicians, but never got on very well. In 1981 Swarbrick would say “Richard and I never got on in the early days of FC… we thought we did, but we never did. We composed some bloody good songs together, but it was purely on a basis of “you write that and I’ll write this, and we’ll put it together.” But we never sat down and had real good chats.” The third original on the album, and by far the most affecting, is another song where Thompson put lyrics to a traditional tune. In this case he thought he was putting the lyrics to the tune of “Willie O'Winsbury”, but he was basing it on a recording by Sweeney’s Men. The problem was that Sweeney’s Men had accidentally sung the lyrics of “Willie O'Winsbury'” to the tune of a totally different song, “Fause Foodrage”: [Excerpt: Sweeney’s Men, “Willie O’Winsbury”] Thompson took that melody, and set to it lyrics about loss and separation. Thompson has never been one to discuss the meanings of his lyrics in any great detail, and in the case of this one has said “I really don't know what it means. This song came out of a dream, and I pretty much wrote it as I dreamt it (it was the sixties), and didn't spend very long analyzing it. So interpret as you wish – or replace with your own lines.” But in the context of the traffic accident that had killed his tailor girlfriend and a bandmate, and injured most of his other bandmates, the lyrics about lonely travellers, the winding road, bruised and beaten sons, saying goodbye, and never cutting cloth, seem fairly self-explanatory: [Excerpt: Fairport Convention, “Farewell, Farewell”] The rest of the album, though, was taken up by traditional tunes. There was a long medley of four different fiddle reels; a version of “Reynardine” (a song about a seductive man — or is he a fox? Or perhaps both — which had been recorded by Swarbrick and Carthy on their most recent album); a 19th century song about a deserter saved from the firing squad by Prince Albert; and a long take on “Tam Lin”, one of the most famous pieces in the Scottish folk music canon, a song that has been adapted in different ways by everyone from the experimental noise band Current 93 to the dub poet Benjamin Zephaniah to the comics writer Grant Morrison: [Excerpt: Fairport Convention, “Tam Lin”] And “Matty Groves”, a song about a man killing his cheating wife and her lover, which actually has a surprisingly similar story to that of “1921” from another great concept album from that year, the Who’s Tommy. “Matty Groves” became an excuse for long solos and shows of instrumental virtuosity: [Excerpt: Fairport Convention, “Matty Groves”] The album was recorded in September 1969, after their return from their break in the country and a triumphal performance at the Royal Festival Hall, headlining over fellow Witchseason artists John and Beverly Martyn and Nick Drake. It became a classic of the traditional folk genre — arguably *the* classic of the traditional folk genre. In 2007 BBC Radio 2’s Folk Music Awards gave it an award for most influential folk album of all time, and while such things are hard to measure, I doubt there’s anyone with even the most cursory knowledge of British folk and folk-rock music who would not at least consider that a reasonable claim. But once again, by the time the album came out in November, the band had changed lineups yet again. There was a fundamental split in the band – on one side were Sandy Denny and Richard Thompson, whose stance was, roughly, that Liege and Lief was a great experiment and a fun thing to do once, but really the band had two first-rate songwriters in themselves, and that they should be concentrating on their own new material, not doing these old songs, good as they were. They wanted to take the form of the traditional songs and use that form for new material — they wanted to make British folk-rock, but with the emphasis on the rock side of things. Hutchings, on the other hand, was equally sure that he wanted to make traditional music and go further down the rabbit hole of antiquity. With the zeal of the convert he had gone in a couple of years from being the leader of a band who were labelled “the British Jefferson Airplane” to becoming a serious scholar of traditional folk music. Denny was tired of touring, as well — she wanted to spend more time at home with Trevor Lucas, who was sleeping with other women when she was away and making her insecure. When the time came for the group to go on a tour of Denmark, Denny decided she couldn’t make it, and Hutchings was jubilant — he decided he was going to get A.L. Lloyd into the band in her place and become a *real* folk group. Then Denny reconsidered, and Hutchings was crushed. He realised that while he had always been the leader, he wasn’t going to be able to lead the band any further in the traditionalist direction, and quit the group — but not before he was delegated by the other band members to fire Denny. Until the publication of Richard Thompson’s autobiography in 2022, every book on the group or its members said that Denny quit the band again, which was presumably a polite fiction that the band agreed, but according to Thompson “Before we flew home, we decided to fire Sandy. I don't remember who asked her to leave – it was probably Ashley, who usually did the dirty work. She was reportedly shocked that we would take that step. She may have been fragile beneath the confident facade, but she still knew her worth.” Thompson goes on to explain that the reasons for kicking her out were that “I suppose we felt that in her mind she had already left” and that “We were probably suffering from post-traumatic stress disorder, though there wasn't a name for it back then.” They had considered inviting Trevor Lucas to join the band to make Denny more comfortable, but came to the (probably correct) conclusion that while he was someone they got on well with personally, he would be another big ego in a band that already had several, and that being around Denny and Lucas’ volatile relationship would, in Thompson’s phrasing, “have not always given one a feeling of peace and stability.” Hutchings originally decided he was going to join Sweeney’s Men, but that group were falling apart, and their first rehearsal with Hutchings would also be their last as a group, with only Hutchings and guitarist and mandolin player Terry Woods left in the band. They added Woods’ wife Gay, and another couple, Tim Hart and Maddy Prior, and formed a group called Steeleye Span, a name given them by Martin Carthy. That group, like Fairport, went to “get their heads together in the country” for three months and recorded an album of electric versions of traditional songs, Hark the Village Wait, on which Mattacks and another drummer, Gerry Conway, guested as Steeleye Span didn’t at the time have their own drummer: [Excerpt: Steeleye Span, “Blackleg Miner”] Steeleye Span would go on to have a moderately successful chart career in the seventies, but by that time most of the original lineup, including Hutchings, had left — Hutchings stayed with them for a few albums, then went on to form the first of a series of bands, all called the Albion Band or variations on that name, which continue to this day. And this is something that needs to be pointed out at this point — it is impossible to follow every single individual in this narrative as they move between bands. There is enough material in the history of the British folk-rock scene that someone could do a 500 Songs-style podcast just on that, and every time someone left Fairport, or Steeleye Span, or the Albion Band, or Matthews’ Southern Comfort, or any of the other bands we have mentioned or will mention, they would go off and form another band which would then fission, and some of its members would often join one of those other bands. There was a point in the mid-1970s where the Albion Band had two original members of Fairport Convention while Fairport Convention had none. So just in order to keep the narrative anything like wieldy, I’m going to keep the narrative concentrated on the two figures from Fairport — Sandy Denny and Richard Thompson — whose work outside the group has had the most influence on the wider world of rock music more broadly, and only deal with the other members when, as they often did, their careers intersected with those two. That doesn’t mean the other members are not themselves hugely important musicians, just that their importance has been primarily to the folk side of the folk-rock genre, and so somewhat outside the scope of this podcast. While Hutchings decided to form a band that would allow him to go deeper and deeper into traditional folk music, Sandy Denny’s next venture was rather different. For a long time she had been writing far more songs than she had ever played for her bandmates, like “Nothing More”, a song that many have suggested is about Thompson: [Excerpt: Fotheringay, “Nothing More”] When Joe Boyd heard that Denny was leaving Fairport Convention, he was at first elated. Fairport’s records were being distributed by A&M in the US at that point, but Island Records was in the process of opening up a new US subsidiary which would then release all future Fairport product — *but*, as far as A&M were concerned, Sandy Denny *was* Fairport Convention. They were only interested in her. Boyd, on the other hand, loved Denny’s work intensely, but from his point of view *Richard Thompson* was Fairport Convention. If he could get Denny signed directly to A&M as a solo artist before Island started its US operations, Witchseason could get a huge advance on her first solo record, while Fairport could continue making records for Island — he’d have two lucrative acts, on different labels. Boyd went over and spoke to A&M and got an agreement in principle that they would give Denny a forty-thousand-dollar advance on her first solo album — twice what they were paying for Fairport albums. The problem was that Denny didn’t want to be a solo act. She wanted to be the lead singer of a band. She gave many reasons for this — the one she gave to many journalists was that she had seen a Judy Collins show and been impressed, but noticed that Collins’ band were definitely a “backing group”, and as she put it “But that's all they were – a backing group. I suddenly thought, If you're playing together on a stage you might as well be TOGETHER.” Most other people in her life, though, say that the main reason for her wanting to be in a band was her desire to be with her boyfriend, Trevor Lucas. Partly this was due to a genuine desire to spend more time with someone with whom she was very much in love, partly it was a fear that he would cheat on her if she was away from him for long periods of time, and part of it seems to have been Lucas’ dislike of being *too* overshadowed by his talented girlfriend — he didn’t mind acknowledging that she was a major talent, but he wanted to be thought of as at least a minor one. So instead of going solo, Denny formed Fotheringay, named after the song she had written for Fairport. This new band consisted at first of Denny on vocals and occasional piano, Lucas on vocals and rhythm guitar, and Lucas’ old Eclection bandmate Gerry Conway on drums. For a lead guitarist, they asked Richard Thompson who the best guitarist in Britain was, and he told them Albert Lee. Lee in turn brought in bass player Pat Donaldson, but this lineup of the band barely survived a fortnight. Lee *was* arguably the best guitarist in Britain, certainly a reasonable candidate if you could ever have a singular best (as indeed was Thompson himself), but he was the best *country* guitarist in Britain, and his style simply didn’t fit with Fotheringay’s folk-influenced songs. He was replaced by American guitarist Jerry Donahue, who was not anything like as proficient as Lee, but who was still very good, and fit the band’s style much better. The new group rehearsed together for a few weeks, did a quick tour, and then went into the recording studio to record their debut, self-titled, album. Joe Boyd produced the album, but admitted himself that he only paid attention to those songs he considered worthwhile — the album contained one song by Lucas, “The Ballad of Ned Kelly”, and two cover versions of American singer-songwriter material with Lucas singing lead. But everyone knew that the songs that actually *mattered* were Sandy Denny’s, and Boyd was far more interested in them, particularly the songs “The Sea” and “The Pond and the Stream”: [Excerpt: Fotheringay, “The Pond and the Stream”] Fotheringay almost immediately hit financial problems, though. While other Witchseason acts were used to touring on the cheap, all packed together in the back of a Transit van with inexpensive equipment, Trevor Lucas had ambitions of being a rock star and wanted to put together a touring production to match, with expensive transport and equipment, including a speaker system that got nicknamed “Stonehenge” — but at the same time, Denny was unhappy being on the road, and didn’t play many gigs. As well as the band itself, the Fotheringay album also featured backing vocals from a couple of other people, including Denny’s friend Linda Peters. Peters was another singer from the folk clubs, and a good one, though less well-known than Denny — at this point she had only released a couple of singles, and those singles seemed to have been as much as anything else released as a novelty. The first of those, a version of Dylan’s “You Ain’t Goin’ Nowhere” had been released as by “Paul McNeill and Linda Peters”: [Excerpt: Paul McNeill and Linda Peters, “You Ain’t Goin’ Nowhere”] But their second single, a version of John D. Loudermilk’s “You’re Taking My Bag”, was released on the tiny Page One label, owned by Larry Page, and was released under the name “Paul and Linda”, clearly with the intent of confusing particularly gullible members of the record-buying public into thinking this was the McCartneys: [Excerpt: Paul and Linda, “You’re Taking My Bag”] Peters was though more financially successful than almost anyone else in this story, as she was making a great deal of money as a session singer. She actually did another session involving most of Fotheringay around this time. Witchseason had a number of excellent songwriters on its roster, and had had some success getting covers by people like Judy Collins, but Joe Boyd thought that they might possibly do better at getting cover versions if they were performed in less idiosyncratic arrangements. Donahue, Donaldson, and Conway went into the studio to record backing tracks, and vocals were added by Peters and another session singer, who according to some sources also provided piano. They cut songs by Mike Heron of the Incredible String Band: [Excerpt: Linda Peters, “You Get Brighter”] Ed Carter, formerly of The New Nadir but by this time firmly ensconced in the Beach Boys’ touring band where he would remain for the next quarter-century: [Excerpt: Linda Peters, “I Don’t Mind”] John and Beverly Martyn, and Nick Drake: [Excerpt: Elton John, “Saturday Sun”] There are different lineups of musicians credited for those sessions in different sources, but I tend to believe that it’s mostly Fotheringay for the simple reason that Donahue says it was him, Donaldson and Conway who talked Lucas and Denny into the mistake that destroyed Fotheringay because of these sessions. Fotheringay were in financial trouble already, spending far more money than they were bringing in, but their album made the top twenty and they were getting respect both from critics and from the public — in September, Sandy Denny was voted best British female singer by the readers of Melody Maker in their annual poll, which led to shocked headlines in the tabloids about how this “unknown” could have beaten such big names as Dusty Springfield and Cilla Black. Only a couple of weeks after that, they were due to headline at the Albert Hall. It should have been a triumph. But Donahue, Donaldson, and Conway had asked that singing pianist to be their support act. As Donahue said later “That was a terrible miscast. It was our fault. He asked if [he] could do it. Actually Pat, Gerry and I had to talk Sandy and Trevor into [it]… We'd done these demos and the way he was playing – he was a wonderful piano player – he was sensitive enough. We knew very little about his stage-show. We thought he'd be a really good opener for us.” Unfortunately, Elton John was rather *too* good. As Donahue continued “we had no idea what he had in mind, that he was going to do the most incredible rock & roll show ever. He pretty much blew us off the stage before we even got on the stage.” To make matters worse, Fotheringay’s set, which was mostly comprised of new material, was underrehearsed and sloppy, and from that point on no matter what they did people were counting the hours until the band split up. They struggled along for a while though, and started working on a second record, with Boyd again producing, though as Boyd later said “I probably shouldn't have been producing the record. My lack of respect for the group was clear, and couldn't have helped the atmosphere. We'd put out a record that had sold disappointingly, A&M was unhappy. Sandy's tracks on the first record are among the best things she ever did – the rest of it, who cares? And the artwork, Trevor's sister, was terrible. It would have been one thing if I'd been unhappy with it and it sold, and the group was working all the time, making money, but that wasn't the case … I knew what Sandy was capable of, and it was very upsetting to me.” The record would not be released for thirty-eight years: [Excerpt: Fotheringay, “Wild Mountain Thyme”] Witchseason was going badly into debt. Given all the fissioning of bands that we’ve already been talking about, Boyd had been stretched thin — he produced sixteen albums in 1970, and almost all of them lost money for the company. And he was getting more and more disillusioned with the people he was producing. He loved Beverly Martyn’s work, but had little time for her abusive husband John, who was dominating her recording and life more and more and would soon become a solo artist while making her stay at home (and stealing her ideas without giving her songwriting credit). The Incredible String Band were great, but they had recently converted to Scientology, which Boyd found annoying, and while he was working with all sorts of exciting artists like Vashti Bunyan and Nico, he was finding himself less and less important to the artists he mentored. Fairport Convention were a good example of this. After Denny and Hutchings had left the group, they’d decided to carry on as an electric folk group, performing an equal mix of originals by the Swarbrick and Thompson songwriting team and arrangements of traditional songs. The group were now far enough away from the “British Jefferson Airplane” label that they decided they didn’t need a female vocalist — and more realistically, while they’d been able to replace Judy Dyble, nobody was going to replace Sandy Denny. Though it’s rather surprising when one considers Thompson’s subsequent career that nobody seems to have thought of bringing in Denny’s friend Linda Peters, who was dating Joe Boyd at the time (as Denny had been before she met Lucas) as Denny’s replacement. Instead, they decided that Swarbrick and Thompson were going to share the vocals between them. They did, though, need a bass player to replace Hutchings. Swarbrick wanted to bring in Dave Pegg, with whom he had played in the Ian Campbell Folk Group, but the other band members initially thought the idea was a bad one. At the time, while they respected Swarbrick as a musician, they didn’t think he fully understood rock and roll yet, and they thought the idea of getting in a folkie who had played double bass rather than an electric rock bassist ridiculous. But they auditioned him to mollify Swarbrick, and found that he was exactly what they needed. As Joe Boyd later said “All those bass lines were great, Ashley invented them all, but he never could play them that well. He thought of them, but he was technically not a terrific bass player. He was a very inventive, melodic, bass player, but not a very powerful one technically. But having had the part explained to him once, Pegg was playing it better than Ashley had ever played it… In some rock bands, I think, ultimately, the bands that sound great, you can generally trace it to the bass player… it was at that point they became a great band, when they had Pegg.” The new lineup of Fairport decided to move in together, and found a former pub called the Angel, into which all the band members moved, along with their partners and children (Thompson was the only one who was single at this point) and their roadies. The group lived together quite happily, and one gets the impression that this was the period when they were most comfortable with each other, even though by this point they were a disparate group with disparate tastes, in music as in everything else. Several people have said that the only music all the band members could agree they liked at this point was the first two albums by The Band. With the departure of Hutchings from the band, Swarbrick and Thompson, as the strongest personalities and soloists, became in effect the joint leaders of the group, and they became collaborators as songwriters, trying to write new songs that were inspired by traditional music. Thompson described the process as “let’s take one line of this reel and slow it down and move it up a minor third and see what that does to it; let’s take one line of this ballad and make a whole song out of it. Chopping up the tradition to find new things to do… like a collage.” Generally speaking, Swarbrick and Thompson would sit by the fire and Swarbrick would play a melody he’d been working on, the two would work on it for a while, and Thompson would then go away and write the lyrics. This is how the two came up with songs like the nine-minute “Sloth”, a highlight of the next album, Full House, and one that would remain in Fairport’s live set for much of their career: [Excerpt: Fairport Convention, “Sloth”] “Sloth” was titled that way because Thompson and Swarbrick were working on two tunes, a slow one and a fast one, and they jokingly named them “Sloth” and “Fasth”, but the latter got renamed to “Walk Awhile”, while “Sloth” kept its working title. But by this point, Boyd and Thompson were having a lot of conflict in the studio. Boyd was never the most technical of producers — he was one of those producers whose job is to gently guide the artists in the studio and create a space for the music to flourish, rather than the Joe Meek type with an intimate technical knowledge of the studio — and as the artists he was working with gained confidence in their own work they felt they had less and less need of him. During the making of the Full House album, Thompson and Boyd, according to Boyd, clashed on everything — every time Boyd thought Thompson had done a good solo, Thompson would say to erase it and let him have another go, while every time Boyd thought Thompson could do better, Thompson would say that was the take to keep. One of their biggest clashes was over Thompson’s song “Poor Will and the Jolly Hangman”, which was originally intended for release on the album, and is included in current reissues of it: [Excerpt: Fairport Convention, “Poor Will and the Jolly Hangman”] Thompson had written that song inspired by what he thought was the unjust treatment of Alex Bramham, the driver in Fairport’s fatal car crash, by the courts — Bramham had been given a prison sentence of a few months for dangerous driving, while the group members thought he had not been at fault. Boyd thought it was one of the best things recorded for the album, but Thompson wasn’t happy with his vocal — there was one note at the top of the melody that he couldn’t quite hit — and insisted it be kept off the record, even though that meant it would be a shorter album than normal. He did this at such a late stage that early copies of the album actually had the title printed on the sleeve, but then blacked out. He now says in his autobiography “I could have persevered, double-tracked the voice, warmed up for longer – anything. It was a good track, and the record was lacking without it. When the album was re-released, the track was restored with a more confident vocal, and it has stayed there ever since.” During the sessions for Full House the group also recorded one non-album single, Thompson and Swarbrick’s “Now Be Thankful”: [Excerpt, Fairport Convention, “Now Be Thankful”] The B-side to that was a medley of two traditional tunes plus a Swarbrick original, but was given the deliberately ridiculous title “Sir B. McKenzie’s Daughter’s Lament For The 77th Mounted Lancers Retreat From The Straits Of Loch Knombe, In The Year Of Our Lord 1727, On The Occasion Of The Announcement Of Her Marriage To The Laird Of Kinleakie”: [Excerpt: Fairport Convention, “Sir B. McKenzie’s Daughter’s Lament For The 77th Mounted Lancers Retreat From The Straits Of Loch Knombe, In The Year Of Our Lord 1727, On The Occasion Of The Announcement Of Her Marriage To The Laird Of Kinleakie”] The B. McKenzie in the title was a reference to the comic-strip character Barry McKenzie, a stereotype drunk Australian created for Private Eye magazine by the comedian Barry Humphries (later to become better known for his Dame Edna Everage character) but the title was chosen for one reason only — to get into the Guinness Book of Records for the song with the longest title. Which they did, though they were later displaced by the industrial band Test Dept, and their song “Long Live British Democracy Which Flourishes and Is Constantly Perfected Under the Immaculate Guidance of the Great, Honourable, Generous and Correct Margaret Hilda Thatcher. She Is the Blue Sky in the Hearts of All Nations. Our People Pay Homage and Bow in Deep Respect and Gratitude to Her. The Milk of Human Kindness”. Full House got excellent reviews in the music press, with Rolling Stone saying “The music shows that England has finally gotten her own equivalent to The Band… By calling Fairport an English equivalent of the Band, I meant that they have soaked up enough of the tradition of their countryfolk that it begins to show all over, while they maintain their roots in rock.” Off the back of this, the group went on their first US tour, culminating in a series of shows at the Troubadour in LA, on the same bill as Rick Nelson, which were recorded and later released as a live album: [Excerpt: Fairport Convention, “Sloth (live)”] The Troubadour was one of the hippest venues at the time, and over their residency there the group got seen by many celebrities, some of whom joined them on stage. The first was Linda Ronstadt, who initially demurred, saying she didn’t know any of their songs. On being told they knew all of hers, she joined in with a rendition of “Silver Threads and Golden Needles”. Thompson was later asked to join Ronstadt’s backing band, who would go on to become the Eagles, but he said later of this offer “I would have hated it. I’d have hated being on the road with four or five miserable Americans — they always seem miserable. And if you see them now, they still look miserable on stage — like they don’t want to be there and they don’t like each other.” The group were also joined on stage at the Troubadour on one memorable night by some former bandmates of Pegg’s. Before joining the Ian Campbell Folk Group, Pegg had played around the Birmingham beat scene, and had been in bands with John Bonham and Robert Plant, who turned up to the Troubadour with their Led Zeppelin bandmate Jimmy Page (reports differ on whether the fourth member of Zeppelin, John Paul Jones, also came along). They all got up on stage together and jammed on songs like “Hey Joe”, “Louie Louie”, and various old Elvis tunes. The show was recorded, and the tapes are apparently still in the possession of Joe Boyd, who has said he refuses to release them in case he is murdered by the ghost of Peter Grant. According to Thompson, that night ended in a three-way drinking contest between Pegg, Bonham, and Janis Joplin, and it’s testament to how strong the drinking culture is around Fairport and the British folk scene in general that Pegg outdrank both of them. According to Thompson, Bonham was found naked by a swimming pool two days later, having missed two gigs. For all their hard rock image, Led Zeppelin were admirers of a lot of the British folk and folk-rock scene, and a few months later Sandy Denny would become the only outside vocalist ever to appear on a Led Zeppelin record when she duetted with Plant on “The Battle of Evermore” on the group’s fourth album: [Excerpt: Led Zeppelin, “The Battle of Evermore”] Denny would never actually get paid for her appearance on one of the best-selling albums of all time. That was, incidentally, not the only session that Denny was involved in around this time — she also sang on the soundtrack to a soft porn film titled Swedish Fly Girls, whose soundtrack was produced by Manfred Mann: [Excerpt: Sandy Denny, “What Will I Do With Tomorrow?”] Shortly after Fairport’s trip to America, Joe Boyd decided he was giving up on Witchseason. The company was now losing money, and he was finding himself having to produce work for more and more acts as the various bands fissioned. The only ones he really cared about were Richard Thompson, who he was finding it more and more difficult to work with, Nick Drake, who wanted to do his next album with just an acoustic guitar anyway, Sandy Denny, who he felt was wasting her talents in Fotheringay, and Mike Heron of the Incredible String Band, who was more distant since his conversion to Scientology. Boyd did make some attempts to keep the company going. On a trip to Sweden, he negotiated an agreement with the manager and publisher of a Swedish band whose songs he’d found intriguing, the Hep Stars. Boyd was going to publish their songs in the UK, and in return that publisher, Stig Anderson, would get the rights to Witchseason’s catalogue in Scandinavia — a straight swap, with no money changing hands. But before Boyd could get round to signing the paperwork, he got a better offer from Mo Ostin of Warners — Ostin wanted Boyd to come over to LA and head up Warners’ new film music department. Boyd sold Witchseason to Island Records and moved to LA with his fiancee Linda Peters, spending the next few years working on music for films like Deliverance and A Clockwork Orange, as well as making his own documentary about Jimi Hendrix, and thus missed out on getting the UK publishing rights for ABBA, and all the income that would have brought him, for no money. And it was that decision that led to the breakup of Fotheringay. Just before Christmas 1970, Fotheringay were having a difficult session, recording the track “John the Gun”: [Excerpt: Fotheringay, “John the Gun”] Boyd got frustrated and kicked everyone out of the session, and went for a meal and several drinks with Denny. He kept insisting that she should dump the band and just go solo, and then something happened that the two of them would always describe differently. She asked him if he would continue to produce her records if she went solo, and he said he would. According to Boyd’s recollection of the events, he meant that he would fly back from California at some point to produce her records. According to Denny, he told her that if she went solo he would stay in Britain and not take the job in LA. This miscommunication was only discovered after Denny told the rest of Fotheringay after the Christmas break that she was splitting the band. Jerry Donahue has described that as the worst moment of his life, and Denny felt very guilty about breaking up a band with some of her closest friends in — and then when Boyd went over to the US anyway she felt a profound betrayal. Two days before Fotheringay’s final concert, in January 1971, Sandy Denny signed a solo deal with Island records, but her first solo album would not end up produced by Joe Boyd. Instead, The North Star Grassman and the Ravens was co-produced by Denny, John Wood — the engineer who had worked with Boyd on pretty much everything he’d produced, and Richard Thompson, who had just quit Fairport Convention, though he continued living with them at the Angel, at least until a truck crashed into the building in February 1971, destroying its entire front wall and forcing them to relocate. The songs chosen for The North Star Grassman and the Ravens reflected the kind of choices Denny would make on her future albums, and her eclectic taste in music. There was, of course, the obligatory Dylan cover, and the traditional folk ballad “Blackwaterside”, but there was also a cover version of Brenda Lee’s “Let’s Jump the Broomstick”: [Excerpt: Sandy Denny, “Let’s Jump the Broomstick”] Most of the album, though, was made up of originals about various people in Denny’s life, like “Next Time Around”, about her ex-boyfriend Jackson C Frank: [Excerpt: Sandy Denny, “Next Time Around”] The album made the top forty in the UK — Denny’s only solo album to do so — and led to her once again winning the “best female singer” award in Melody Maker’s readers’ poll that year — the male singer award was won by Rod Stewart. Both Stewart and Denny appeared the next year on the London Symphony Orchestra’s all-star version of The Who’s Tommy, which had originally been intended as a vehicle for Stewart before Roger Daltrey got involved. Stewart’s role was reduced to a single song, “Pinball Wizard”, while Denny sang on “It’s a Boy”: [Excerpt: Sandy Denny, “It’s a Boy”] While Fotheringay had split up, all the band members play on The North Star Grassman and the Ravens. Guitarists Donahue and Lucas only play on a couple of the tracks, with Richard Thompson playing most of the guitar on the record. But Fotheringay’s rhythm section of Pat Donaldson and Gerry Conway play on almost every track. Another musician on the album, Ian Whiteman, would possibly have a profound effect on the future direction of Richard Thompson’s career and life. Whiteman was the former keyboard player for the mod band The Action, having joined them just before they became the blues-rock band Mighty Baby. But Mighty Baby had split up when all of the band except the lead singer had converted to Islam. Richard Thompson was on his own spiritual journey at this point, and became a Sufi – the same branch of Islam as Whiteman – soon after the session, though Thompson has said that his conversion was independent of Whiteman’s. The two did become very close and work together a lot in the mid-seventies though. Thompson had supposedly left Fairport because he was writing material that wasn’t suited to the band, but he spent more than a year after quitting the group working on sessions rather than doing anything with his own material, and these sessions tended to involve the same core group of musicians. One of the more unusual was a folk-rock supergroup called The Bunch, put together by Trevor Lucas. Richard Branson had recently bought a recording studio, and wanted a band to test it out before opening it up for commercial customers, so with this free studio time Lucas decided to record a set of fifties rock and roll covers. He gathered together Thompson, Denny, Whiteman, Ashley Hutchings, Dave Mattacks, Pat Donaldson, Gerry Conway, pianist Tony Cox, the horn section that would later form the core of the Average White Band, and Linda Peters, who had now split up with Joe Boyd and returned to the UK, and who had started dating Thompson. They recorded an album of covers of songs by Jerry Lee Lewis, the Everly Brothers, Johnny Otis and others: [Excerpt: The Bunch, “Willie and the Hand Jive”] The early seventies was a hugely productive time for this group of musicians, as they all continued playing on each other’s projects. One notable album was No Roses by Shirley Collins, which featured Thompson, Mattacks, Whiteman, Simon Nicol, Lal and Mike Waterson, and Ashley Hutchings, who was at that point married to Collins, as well as some more unusual musicians like the free jazz saxophonist Lol Coxhill: [Excerpt: Shirley Collins and the Albion Country Band, “Claudy Banks”] Collins was at the time the most respected female singer in British traditional music, and already had a substantial career including a series of important records made with her sister Dolly, work with guitarists like Davey Graham, and time spent in the 1950s collecting folk songs in the Southern US with her then partner Alan Lomax – according to Collins she did much of the actual work, but Lomax only mentioned her in a single sentence in his book on this work. Some of the same group of musicians went on to work on an album of traditional Morris dancing tunes, titled Morris On, credited to “Ashley Hutchings, Richard Thompson, Dave Mattacks, John Kirkpatrick and Barry Dransfield”, with Collins singing lead on two tracks: [Excerpt: Ashley Hutchings, Richard Thompson, Dave Mattacks, John Kirkpatrick and Barry Dransfield with Shirley Collins, “The Willow Tree”] Thompson thought that that album was the best of the various side projects he was involved in at the time, comparing it favourably to Rock On, which he thought was rather slight, saying later “Conceptually, Fairport, Ashley and myself and Sandy were developing a more fragile style of music that nobody else was particularly interested in, a British Folk Rock idea that had a logical development to it, although we all presented it our own way. Morris On was rather more true to what we were doing. Rock On was rather a retro step. I'm not sure it was lasting enough as a record but Sandy did sing really well on the Buddy Holly songs.” Hutchings used the musicians on No Roses and Morris On as the basis for his band the Albion Band, which continues to this day. Simon Nicol and Dave Mattacks both quit Fairport to join the Albion Band, though Mattacks soon returned. Nicol would not return to Fairport for several years, though, and for a long period in the mid-seventies Fairport Convention had no original members. Unfortunately, while Collins was involved in the Albion Band early on, she and Hutchings ended up divorcing, and the stress from the divorce led to Collins developing spasmodic dysphonia, a stress-related illness which makes it impossible for the sufferer to sing. She did eventually regain her vocal ability, but between 1978 and 2016 she was unable to perform at all, and lost decades of her career. Richard Thompson occasionally performed with the Albion Band early on, but he was getting stretched a little thin with all these sessions. Linda Peters said later of him “When I came back from America, he was working in Sandy’s band, and doing sessions by the score. Always with Pat Donaldson and Dave Mattacks. Richard would turn up with his guitar, one day he went along to do a session with one of those folkie lady singers — and there were Pat and DM. They all cracked. Richard smashed his amp and said “Right! No more sessions!” In 1972 he got round to releasing his first solo album, Henry the Human Fly, which featured guest appearances by Linda Peters and Sandy Denny among others: [Excerpt: Richard Thompson, “The Angels Took My Racehorse Away”] Unfortunately, while that album has later become regarded as one of the classics of its genre, at the time it was absolutely slated by the music press. The review in Melody Maker, for example, read in part “Some of Richard Thompson’s ideas sound great – which is really the saving grace of this album, because most of the music doesn’t. The tragedy is that Thompson’s “British rock music” is such an unconvincing concoction… Even the songs that do integrate rock and traditional styles of electric guitar rhythms and accordion and fiddle decoration – and also include explicit, meaningful lyrics are marred by bottle-up vocals, uninspiring guitar phrases and a general lack of conviction in performance.” Henry the Human Fly was released in the US by Warners, who had a reciprocal licensing deal with Island (and for whom Joe Boyd was working at the time, which may have had something to do with that) but according to Thompson it became the lowest-selling record that Warners ever put out (though I’ve also seen that claim made about Van Dyke Parks’ Song Cycle, another album that has later been rediscovered). Thompson was hugely depressed by this reaction, and blamed his own singing. Happily, though, by this point he and Linda had become a couple — they would marry in 1972 — and they started playing folk clubs as a duo, or sometimes in a trio with Simon Nicol. Thompson was also playing with Sandy Denny’s backing band at this point, and played on every track on her second solo album, Sandy. This album was meant to be her big commercial breakthrough, with a glamorous cover photo by David Bailey, and with a more American sound, including steel guitar by Sneaky Pete Kleinow of the Flying Burrito Brothers (whose overdubs were supervised in LA by Joe Boyd): [Excerpt: Sandy Denny, “Tomorrow is a Long Time”] The album was given a big marketing push by Island, and “Listen, Listen” was made single of the week on the Radio 1 Breakfast show: [Excerpt: Sandy Denny, “Listen, Listen”] But it did even worse than the previous album, sending her into something of a depression. Linda Thompson (as the former Linda Peters now was) said of this period “After the Sandy album, it got her down that her popularity didn't suddenly increase in leaps and bounds, and that was the start of her really fretting about the way her career was going. Things only escalated after that. People like me or Martin Carthy or Norma Waterson would think, ‘What are you on about? This is folk music.'” After Sandy’s release, Denny realised she could no longer afford to tour with a band, and so went back to performing just acoustically or on piano. The only new music to be released by either of these ex-members of Fairport Convention in 1973 was, oddly, on an album by the band they were no longer members of. After Thompson had left Fairport, the group had managed to release two whole albums with the same lineup — Swarbrick, Nicol, Pegg, and Mattacks. But then Nicol and Mattacks had both quit the band to join the Albion Band with their former bandmate Ashley Hutchings, leading to a situation where the Albion Band had two original members of Fairport plus their longtime drummer while Fairport Convention itself had no original members and was down to just Swarbrick and Pegg. Needing to fulfil their contracts, they then recruited three former members of Fotheringay — Lucas on vocals and rhythm guitar, Donahue on lead guitar, and Conway on drums. Conway was only a session player at the time, and Mattacks soon returned to the band, but Lucas and Donahue became full-time members. This new lineup of Fairport Convention released two albums in 1973, widely regarded as the group’s most inconsistent records, and on the title track of the first, “Rosie”, Richard Thompson guested on guitar, with Sandy Denny and Linda Thompson on backing vocals: [Excerpt: Fairport Convention, “Rosie”] Neither Sandy Denny nor Richard Thompson released a record themselves in 1973, but in neither case was this through the artists’ choice. The record industry was changing in the early 1970s, as we’ll see in later episodes, and was less inclined to throw good money after bad in the pursuit of art. Island Records prided itself on being a home for great artists, but it was still a business, and needed to make money. We’ll talk about the OPEC oil crisis and its effect on the music industry much more when the podcast gets to 1973, but in brief, the production of oil by the US peaked in 1970 and started to decrease, leading to them importing more and more oil from the Middle East. As a result of this, oil prices rose slowly between 1971 and 1973, then very quickly towards the end of 1973 as a result of the Arab-Israeli conflict that year. As vinyl is made of oil, suddenly producing records became much more expensive, and in this period a lot of labels decided not to release already-completed albums, until what they hoped would be a brief period of shortages passed. Both Denny and Thompson recorded albums at this point that got put to one side by Island. In the case of Thompson, it was the first album by Richard and Linda as a duo, I Want to See the Bright Lights Tonight: [Excerpt: Richard and Linda Thompson, “I Want to See the Bright Lights Tonight”] Today, I Want to See the Bright Lights Tonight is widely regarded as one of the greatest albums of all time, and as one of the two masterpieces that bookended Richard and Linda’s career as a duo and their marriage. But when they recorded the album, full of Richard’s dark songs, it was the opposite of commercial. Even a song that’s more or less a boy-girl song, like “Has He Got a Friend for Me?” has lyrics like “He wouldn’t notice me passing by/I could be in the gutter, or dangling down from a tree” [Excerpt: Richard and Linda Thompson, “Has He got a Friend For Me?”] While something like “The Calvary Cross” is oblique and haunted, and seems to cast a pall over the entire album: [Excerpt: Richard and Linda Thompson, “The Calvary Cross”] The album itself had been cheap to make — it had been recorded in only a week, with Thompson bringing in musicians he knew well and had worked with a lot previously to cut the tracks as-live in only a handful of takes — but Island didn’t think it was worth releasing. The record stayed on the shelf for nearly a year after recording, until Island got a new head of A&R, Richard Williams. Williams said of the album’s release “Muff Winwood had been doing A&R, but he was more interested in production… I had a conversation with Muff as soon as I got there, and he said there are a few hangovers, some outstanding problems. And one of them was Richard Thompson. He said there’s this album we gave him the money to make — which was I Want to See the Bright Lights Tonight — and nobody’s very interested in it. Henry the Human Fly had been a bit of a commercial disappointment, and although Island was altruistic and independent and known for only recording good stuff, success was important… Either a record had to do well or somebody had to believe in it a lot. And it seemed as if neither of those things were true at that point of Richard.” Williams, though, was hugely impressed when he listened to the album. He compared Richard Thompson’s guitar playing to John Coltrane’s sax, and called Thompson “the folk poet of the rainy streets”, but also said “Linda brightened it, made it more commercial. and I thought that “Bright Lights” itself seemed a really commercial song.” The rest of the management at Island got caught up in Williams’ enthusiasm, and even decided to release the title track as a single: [Excerpt: Richard and Linda Thompson, “I Want to See the Bright Lights Tonight”] Neither single nor album charted — indeed it would not be until 1991 that Richard Thompson would make a record that made the top forty in the UK — but the album got enough critical respect that Richard and Linda released two albums the year after. The first of these, Hokey Pokey, is a much more upbeat record than their previous one — Richard Thompson has called it “quite a music-hall influenced record” and cited the influence of George Formby and Harry Lauder. For once, the claim of music hall influence is audible in the music. Usually when a British musician is claimed to have a music ha

The increase in demand for electric vehicles has extended to business transport, with Janus Electric relisting on the ASX today.See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Janus Electric managing director Ian Campbell talked with Proactive about the company's battery-electric truck conversion strategy and recent RTO success. Campbell explained how Janus Electric is leveraging a patented battery-swapping system to keep freight trucks on the road longer while cutting emissions and operational costs. "We take those diesel trucks that are existing... and we convert them from their existing diesel engines and their tanks," he said, adding that the technology offers operating savings of $0.20 per kilometre. He outlined that the company is targeting a 1% share of Australia's prime mover market — around 800 trucks — with 142 orders already in place. The company has also opened Australia's first EV truck factory on the Central Coast of New South Wales, with future dealership expansion plans across South Australia, Western Australia, Victoria, and even the US. Janus Electric is expecting AU$8.8 million from the RTO, which will fund inventory, battery infrastructure, and facility growth. The company earns both upfront conversion fees and ongoing subscription-based revenue. Campbell emphasised the strategic value of placing infrastructure along fixed freight routes to maximize battery station use. He also highlighted strong client backing and a compelling economic case for the electrification of freight. Janus is expected to complete its ASX listing this week. Visit Proactive's YouTube channel for more videos, and don't forget to like, subscribe, and turn on notifications for future content. #JanusElectric #EVTrucks #BatterySwap #ZeroEmissions #ElectricFreight #TruckConversion #CleanTransport #ASX #GreenLogistics #ElectricVehicles #CarbonFreeFreight #ProactiveInvestors

Petula Clark knows a place (which might include a cellarful of noise), while the Yardbirds ask for your Love (although Eric doesn't want it, so runs away, the Ian Campbell folk group ask us if the times are actually changing, while we meet a new singer in a cloth cap that plays acoustic guitar and harmonica (and nom he's not Bob Dylan). Support this podcast at the $6/month level on patreon to get extra content! Create your podcast today! #madeonzencastr . If you are looking for Beatles summer fun, join our friends at the Magical Mystery Camp!

Join us and have a listen as we chat with Ian Campbell   Ian played for the club twice, was a coach twice.  Hear about working with his twin, Dick, playing against the Glasgow clubs, working with Jim Leisman and much much more!

Hilarity ensues as two of the biggest and best personalities in football take on the Buck's Bar Hot Wings Challenge - it's Dick Campbell vs his twin brother and assistant Manager, Ian Campbell!The management duo don't know what's hit them when the heat hits from the wings of fire. Expect brilliant reactions great patter, hilarious stories and even an unbelievable sing-song at the end! Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Hilarity ensues as two of the biggest and best personalities in football take on the Buck's Bar Hot Wings Challenge - it's Dick Campbell vs his twin brother and assistant Manager, Ian Campbell!The management duo don't know what's hit them when the heat hits from the wings of fire. Expect brilliant reactions great patter, hilarious stories and even an unbelievable sing-song at the end! Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

In this episode, I chat with Ian Campbell. You might remember Ian. He was the founder of RiTA, Australia's first real estate AI together with co-founder Dr Sarah Bell and the pair successfully exited the business after its sale to CoreLogic. After a bit of a break, Ian is now  founder of the venture studio Bright Young Things. And in this episode, Ian shares his passion for startups and his journey to creating a studio that focuses on early-stage venture development, from ideation to product-market fit. We discuss the importance of research and validation in the startup process, and how AI can be a valuable tool for gathering and analyzing market insights. We then delve into GoList, one of the studio's ventures, which aims to solve the lead conversion problem in real estate. Ian explains why lead generation is not the issue, but rather the industry's archaic methods of managing and converting those leads. He highlights the negative impact this has on brand reputation and service delivery, and how GoList aims to improve efficiency and customer experience.

We love a good field guide around these parts. The more unique, the better.  Phil Chaon and Iain Campbell have certainly done that with their new book, Habitats of North America; A Field Guide for Birders, Naturalists, and Ecologists. It's a spin-off of sorts, from their 2021 book Habitats of the World and is a deep and detailed look at some of the place that we love to bird and experience nature. They join us to talk about why birders should pay attention to habitats, but also why birds are the perfect proxy for learning about habitats.  Also, USAID is one of the most effective conservation agencies in the US government, and its loss would be tragic for birders, birders, and biodiversity.  Subscribe to the podcast at Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts and please leave a rating or a review if you are so inclined! We appreciate it!    

In this episode of Breaking Badness, Tricia Howard of Akamai joins Kali Fencl and Ian Campbell to dive deep into the intersection of gaming culture, mental health, and cybersecurity. Tricia shares her journey from theater arts to cybersecurity research, her love for gaming, and her experiences tackling emotional toxicity in digital spaces. The episode covers the concept of "mind patches," the role of community in digital wellness, and how gaming and workspaces mirror each other in their challenges with mental health and collaboration. Tune in to hear her thoughts on reducing stigma, creating safe digital spaces, and embracing vulnerability for a healthier cybersecurity community.

Don Bennett was rated by the future Bomber Command boss, Arthur Harris, as "the most efficient airman" he had ever known. In part two of our chat with Bennett's biographer, Ian Campbell, curator of the Bennett/Vial Archive at the Queensland Air Museum, we get into the incredible record-breaking flights Don flew in Mercury and his return to the RAF at the outbreak of war.Relentless Skies: Volume 1 - The Most Efficient Airman (1910-1942) by Ian Campbell is out now! Buy your copy from The Damcasters bookshop and support the pod (UK only): https://uk.bookshop.org/a/11015/9781923020641-----------------------------------------------------

Air Vice Marshall Don Bennett CB, CBE, DSO was a singular man. His story of leading the Path Finder Force in the Second World War has gone down in legend. But what led him to that command? Ian Campbell, curator of the Bennett/Vial Archive at the Queensland Air Museum, has published the first volume of his biography of Bennett, Relentless Skies, which is superb. Ian joins us to discuss Bennett's life and career as we look at the making of the man who would become one of the RAF's foremost commanders.Relentless Skies: Volume 1 - The Most Efficient Airman (1910-1942) by Ian Campbell is out now! Buy your copy from The Damcasters bookshop and support the pod (UK only): https://uk.bookshop.org/a/11015/9781923020641-----------------------------------------------------

Send us a textJoin EV Resource Podcast Host Zack Hurst in an enlightening conversation with Dr. Ian Campbell, CEO of Breathe Battery Technologies, as they explore the transformative role of software in the electric vehicle battery domain. Dr. Campbell shares insights into how advanced software not only enhances charging experiences for users but also extends the life of EV batteries and boosts their safety. Discover the cutting-edge innovations that are setting new standards in battery technology create a safer, more efficient future for EVs. Don't miss out on understanding the critical developments that are reshaping the landscape of electric vehicles.—————————————Get started with EV charging today:Oasis Charging: https://www.oasischarging.com—————————————Patreon Supporters:Director Tier - Rajeev Narayan, Andy CooperExecutive Producer Tier - Christopher Lawrence, Dave LaansmaProducer Tier - Eric Weber,  Tony StuntzIf you would like to support the EV Resource Podcast, Magazine, Newsletter, and YouTube Channel, head over to Patreon and consider a monthly contribution. https://www.patreon.com/EVResource—————————————Life on Record: https://www.lifeonrecord.com—————————————Instead of mandatory membership fees or paywalls, I use advertising and affiliate connections to keep The EV Resource Podcast and The EV Resource Magazine free for all of you. There are a number of discount codes and deals for you as well! Please consider supporting the sponsors who make EV Resource possible:https://www.ev-resource.com/dealsI also have on the webpage a small but growing collection of other products on Amazon that I recommend:https://www.ev-resource.com/ShopSupport the showConnect with EV Resource on Social Media!Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/evresource1Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/ev_resourceTwitter: https://www.twitter.com/EV_ResourceWebpage: https://www.ev-resource.comEmail: hello@ev-resource.com

Podcast guest 1110 is Ian Campbell who had ET involvement for most his life.  He has a background in Film and Television and in the summer months he spends his time filming the night sky with night vision cameras, while using various modalities to help promote peaceful contact. It wasn't until the summer of 2021 when something profound occurred that sparked his desire to seek community, and where he could begin an inquiry into his past encounters with craft and other high strangeness occurrences.  Ian experienced, he believes, an intervention that helped shift his perspective of past events from being traumatic to being of a benevolent nature.   In the summer months, Ian spends time on the remote Bay of Chaleur in north-eastern New Brunswick, filming the night sky with night vision cameras, while using various modalities to help promote peaceful contact. CONTACT: Email: jeff@jeffmarapodcast.com WEBSITE www.jeffmarapodcast.com SOCIALS: Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/jeffmarapodcast/ Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/jeffmarapodcast/ Twitter: https://www.twitter.com/jeffmaraP/ JeffMara does not endorse any of his guests' products or services. The opinions of the guests may or may not reflect the opinions of the host. --- Support this podcast: https://podcasters.spotify.com/pod/show/jeffrey-s-reynolds/support

Special guest dad Ian Campbell sits in for Mark for a wide ranging chat of fears, thrills, phones, and... fungus?

Conversation with Ian Campbell, the CEO of Nucleus Research, a recognized expert on ROI and TCO analysis of technology, and the author of The Value Sale: How to Prove ROI and Win More Deals.   Episode on Website

A creamery which has been producing Stilton since 1780 is due to close its doors with the loss of 60 jobs. Tuxford and Tebbutt in Melton Mowbray is owned by the farmer co-operative Arla, which has been trying to sell the creamery as a going concern. They've blamed the closure on what they say is a decline in the speciality cheese market. Dairy industry analyst Chris Walkland explains what's happened. There's been some debate about whether this wet spring has had an effect on the bee population. Ian Campbell is a spokesperson for the British Bee Keepers Association. He says this has been a challenging year for honey bees. A farmer who switched from intensive cereal production to wildflower meadows, and open access to walkers, says the farm is now just as profitable as when he was feeding people. Chris Skinner runs High Ash Farm just outside Norwich. He says even though he's not producing food, he feels he's still giving people a valuable benefit...and many visitors are happy to donate to support his wildlife work. Anna Hill joined him for a walk in the meadows. Scottish raspberries are famed for their flavour and quality...But disease, labour costs and supermarket prices mean the industry is taking a beating, with some growers pulling out or cutting production. Now the James Hutton Institute is developing varieties and growing techniques which can solve at least some of these problems. Richard Baynes has been to Invergowrie on Tayside to find out more.

Andy is back with another all-star panel of sales experts including, Andrew Sykes, CEO of Habits at Work and Adjunct Professor at Kellogg Executive Education, Ian Campbell, CEO of Nucleus Research, and Amy Hrehovcik, Director of Enablement at CROP. They critique the over-structured and impersonal approaches prevalent in both B2B sales. They explore how repetitive 'discovery' phases, erode customer trust and advocate for a more empathetic, genuine sales approach. Andy talks about his positive experiences in auto leasing and the potential for change in B2B sales perceptions by fostering better client relationships and ultimately improve sales outcomes.Take some time to listen to this terrific full episode on Apple or Spotify (and others)Host Andy Paul is the expert on modern B2B selling and the author of three best-selling, award-winning sales books, including his latest 'Sell Without Selling Out.' Visit andypaul.com to subscribe to his newsletter for even more strategies and tips to accelerate your win rate.

Today Andy highlights an excellent discussion from the latest episode which of course includes a panel of incredible sales experts, including  Andrew Sykes, CEO of Habits at Work and Adjunct Professor at Kellogg Executive Education, Ian Campbell, CEO of Nucleus Research, and Amy Hrehovcik, Director of Enablement at CROP. They go back and forth about the misconceptions of salespeople creating urgency and instead, recommend genuinely focusing on understanding the customer's journey. They explore the importance of qualifying opportunities, the role of a champion in the sales process, and the disconnect between traditional sales methods and buyer behaviors, like the difference between sellers' linear approach and buyers' non-linear journey, and the psychological impact of having too many choices.Take some time to listen to this terrific full episode on Apple or Spotify (and others)Host Andy Paul is the expert on modern B2B selling and author of three best-selling, award-winning sales books, including his latest Sell Without Selling Out. Visit andypaul.com to subscribe to his newsletter for even more strategies and tips to accelerate your win rate.

This is an outstanding episode of the Win Rate Podcast, jam-packed with amazing insights and analysis from a very experienced and lively panel of sales experts. Andy is joined by Andrew Sykes, CEO of Habits at Work and Adjunct Professor at Kellogg Executive Education, Ian Campbell, CEO of Nucleus Research, and Amy Hrehovcik, Director of Enablement at CROP. They discuss building trust through the "responsible promises" method, giving precedent to the buyer's journey over the sales process, the pitfalls of asynchronous selling, and likening the discovery process to waterboarding prospects. They dig into the long-held myth that sellers can magically create urgency and concede that current sales processes are too rigid and don't cater to the individual needs of buyers.Host Andy Paul is the expert on modern B2B selling and author of three best-selling, award-winning sales books, including his latest Sell Without Selling Out. Visit andypaul.com to subscribe to his newsletter for even more strategies and tips to accelerate your win rate.

A new MP3 sermon from Mourne Free Presbyterian Church is now available on SermonAudio with the following details: Title: Esau's Sinful Contentment Speaker: Ian Campbell Broadcaster: Mourne Free Presbyterian Church Event: Sunday - PM Date: 6/16/2024 Bible: Genesis 33:9; Genesis 33:11 Length: 34 min.

In today's fiercely competitive market, understanding the core of value-driven sales can be transformative. This crucial concept was the centerpiece of our latest "Sales Talk for CEOs" episode, featuring expert Ian Campbell, CEO of Nucleus Research and author of "The Value Sale." In this discussion, we delve into how emphasizing value rather than just product features can revolutionize sales dynamics and lead to enduring customer relationships.Key Takeaways:Accelerating Sales Cycles with Value: Demonstrating the true value of products or services can significantly shorten the sales cycle and enhance customer satisfaction.Sustaining Post-Sale Value: Delivering ongoing value post-sale is crucial for ensuring customer loyalty and facilitating smooth renewals.Essential Value Articulation: It's vital for CEOs to train their teams to articulate value effectively, aligning closely with customer expectations.Action Steps for CEOs:Evaluate Sales Messaging: Refocus your sales conversations to emphasize value over product features.Commit to Training: Continuously train your sales team on recognizing and communicating value effectively.Adapt and Improve: Regularly assess how your team communicates value and adjust strategies as needed.Ian Campbell shared, "When value drives a deal, people shorten the sales cycle. They make better references." This emphasizes the importance of a value-centric approach in modern sales strategies.Alice Heiman underscored the significance of this strategy, stating, "When there's value, you have the momentum you need to keep a sale going and close it."For a deeper dive into how embedding value in your sales process can foster more engaged and loyal customers, be sure to watch the full episode of "Sales Talk for CEOs." This discussion is essential for CEOs looking to refine their sales strategy and cultivate teams that prioritize customer value at every interaction. Don't miss these expert insights — watch the full episode now!You are not going to want to miss this episode with expert Ian Campbell! For a comprehensive exploration of their insights, make sure to watch the entire episode.Chapters00:00 Introduction - Welcome to Sales Talk for CEOs and introduction to the value proposition topic with guest Ian Campbell of Nucleus Research.01:30 The Importance of Value - Exploring why value is essential in sales and how it can shorten sales cycles and foster long-term customer relationships.02:56 Focusing on Customer Value - The discussion shifts to a customer-centric approach and how value shapes their purchasing decisions.04:28 Renewals and References - Ian emphasizes the pivotal role of articulating value for subscription renewals and generating robust customer references.05:34 Beyond the Sale - Delving into how value sustains the customer journey beyond the initial sale, influencing retention and word-of-mouth marketing.06:23 Key Value Aspects - Ian breaks down the critical factors of value that resonate most strongly with customers, aiding in the sales process.07:23 Direct vs. Indirect Benefits - Understanding the difference between direct and indirect benefits and their impact on the value narrative.08:15 Crafting Marketing and Sales Messages - The conversion to align marketing and sales messaging with value-driven content to captivate the target audience.09:39 The Art of Value Language - Learning how to effectively communicate value propositions, translating into successful customer engagement.10:17 Selling Through Value - Ian explains the significance of selling through an individual to make an organization-wide impact.12:08 Assessing Sales Team Culture - A guide for CEOs to evaluate whether their teams are truly embracing value selling tactics.13:14 Training for Value Selling - Highlighting the necessity for CEOs to provide comprehensive training on value selling and relevant tools to their sales teams.18:23 Knowing Your Customer Value - Emphasizing the need for connecting product features to tangible customer value.19:08 Value Selling Methodology - Ian shares practical steps in the methodology of value selling, from early engagement to closing deals.21:16 The Elevator Pitch - The importance of equipping your sales team with a strong value-driven pitch for stakeholders like the CFO.About GuestIan Campbell is CEO of Nucleus Research, where he is responsible for the company's investigative research approach, product set, and overall corporate direction. A recognized expert on ROI and TCO analysis of technology, Campbell is a frequent speaker at industry and business events. He has been featured in the New York Times, the Wall Street Journal, the Economist, and the Financial Times.Social Links Ian Campbell LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/iancampbellnucleusresearch/Nucleus Research LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/nucleus-research/Check out Alice's website: https://aliceheiman.com/Connect with Alice on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/aliceheiman/

Episode 70 of the Mini Life Podcast brings back Ian Campbell from Cooper S Traveller to share the excitement about Jack and Bertie's Car Show Bonanza!

This week Kali Fencl, Tim Helming, and Ian Campbell discuss mercenary spyware attacks along with the US, Philippines, and Japan entering into a cyber intel sharing alliance.

Kali Fencl, Tim Helming, and Ian Campbell discuss spoofed domains and the American Girl brand along with @Proofpoint's findings regarding distribution of malware on YouTube.

Are you ready to unlock the secrets of proving ROI and winning more deals in the digital age? Join us as we dive deep with Ian Campbell, CEO of Nucleus Research and author of "The Value Sale: How to Prove ROI and Win More Deals." Ian spearheads the company's investigative research approach, product set, and overall corporate direction.Renowned for his expertise in technology ROI and TCO analysis, Ian is a sought-after speaker at both industry and business events. His insights have been featured in prestigious publications like the New York Times, the Wall Street Journal, and the Financial Times.Ian's influence also extends to academia, where he teaches an executive course at Babson College and is a guest lecturer at institutions such as Stanford University, MIT, and Harvard University.Join us as Ian shares his invaluable insights and expertise, providing actionable strategies to help businesses thrive in the digital age.Conquer Local is presented by Vendasta. We have proudly served 5.5+ million local businesses through 60,000+ channel partners, agencies, and enterprise-level organizations. Learn more about Vendasta, and we can help your organization or learn more about Vendasta's Affiliate Program and how our listeners (like yourself) make up to $10,000 off referrals.Are you an entrepreneur, salesperson, or marketer? Then, keep the learning going in the Conquer Local Academy.

Episode 183 of Breaking Badness is here! This week Kali Fencl, Ian Campbell, and Austin Northcutt do a deep dive on the AlphV/BlackCat ransomware gang.

“When you say ROI, do you mean return on investment or risk of inaction?” – Paul Gillin, I love this quote. Having been in sales for many decades, I know the importance of measuring ROI. However, many leaders try to measure ROI by managing their sales teams solely through numbers.  I believe using numbers as your only metric may be dangerous.  If we do not look at the behaviors that are driving those numbers, we may be missing a huge piece of improving ROI.    YouTube: https://youtu.be/w1057KlbhTY   About Ian Campbell: Ian is the author of Wall Street Journal Best Seller "The Value Sale" and Chief Executive Officer of Nucleus Research, where he is responsible for the company's investigative research approach and overall corporate direction.    He is a recognized expert on value selling and using return on investment (ROI) to assess the operational benefits of technology. Ian has written and presented extensively on various organizational topics and the importance of matching technology to business objectives.    As an expert on technology value, he has been quoted in major business publications including The New York Times, the Wall Street Journal, and the Economist.   How to Get in Touch With Ian Campbell:  Email:  ian@nucleusresearch.com Website:  https://www.thevaluesale.com/ Book Link: https://www.amazon.com/Value-Sale-Prove-More-Deals/dp/1544543301   Stalk me online! LinkTree: https://linktr.ee/conniewhitman Download Free Communication Style Assessment: https://whitmanassoc.com/csa/    Subscribe to the Changing the Sales Game Podcast on your favorite podcast streaming service or YouTube.  New episodes post every week - listen to Connie dive into new sales and business topics or problems you may have in your business.

Ian Campbell is CEO of Nucleus Research, where he is responsible for the company's investigative research approach, product set, and overall corporate direction. A recognized expert on ROI and TCO analysis of technology, Campbell is a frequent speaker at industry and business events. He has been featured in the New York Times, the Wall Street Journal, the Economist, and the Financial Times. Campbell teaches an executive course at Babson College in Massachusetts and is a frequent guest lecturer at Stanford University; the University of California, Berkeley; Massachusetts Institute of Technology; Harvard University; and Boston College. ---------------------------------------- This show is sponsored by Leopard Solutions Legal Intelligence Suite of products, Firmscape, and Leopard BI. Push ahead of the pack with the power of Leopard. For a free demo, visit this link: https://www.leopardsolutions.com/index.php/request-a-demo/ www.theplacementclub.com Links: https://www.amazon.com/Value-Sale-Prove-More-Deals-ebook/dp/B0C67GSKKD https://www.linkedin.com/in/iancampbellnucleusresearch/ Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Episode Summary:In this episode of The Friday Habit, hosts Mark Labriola and Benjamin Manley sit down with Ian Campbell, CEO of Nucleus Research. Ian shares his extensive experience and insights into the world of investigative research and how businesses can leverage the concept of Return on Investment (ROI) to enhance sales, improve services, and ultimately win more deals. Whether you're a small business owner, a freelancer, or a creative, this conversation is packed with valuable advice on how to prove ROI and focus your efforts to grow your business.Key Takeaways:The Importance of ROI: Ian emphasizes the significance of demonstrating the value of investments to potential clients. He discusses how understanding and presenting ROI can be a game-changer in sales and business development.Three Ways to Deliver Value: Ian breaks down the three core ways businesses can deliver value to their clients: increasing productivity, decreasing costs, or boosting profitability. He explains how aligning your services with these value propositions can significantly impact your sales approach.The Power of Focusing on Niches: The conversation highlights the importance of specialization and focusing on what you do best. Ian shares insights into how narrowing down services to meet specific market needs can lead to business growth and success.Actionable Strategies for Value Selling: Ian provides listeners with practical strategies to implement value selling in their business practices. From identifying customer needs to developing a value proposition and quantifying benefits, the discussion is a roadmap for anyone looking to enhance their sales approach.Leveraging Customer Success Stories: The importance of using customer success stories and references is discussed. Ian advises on how to effectively use testimonials to demonstrate value and credibility to potential clients.Action Item:Identify the top two or three ways your business delivers value to its clients. Focus on these aspects in your marketing and sales efforts to communicate the tangible benefits of working with your company.Resources Mentioned:The Value Sale (Book by Ian Campbell)Nucleus ResearchConnect with Ian Campbell:Website: Nucleus ResearchEmail: ian@nucleusresearch.comAbout The Friday Habit:The Friday Habit is the go-to podcast for business owners, freelancers, and creatives who want to transform their passion into a successful enterprise. Join Mark and Ben every week as they dive into the strategies and insights that can help you make every day feel like Friday.Subscribe & Review:Don't miss out on future episodes! Subscribe to The Friday Habit on Apple Podcasts and leave us a review. Your feedback helps us improve and reach more listeners like you.

Episode 179 of Breaking Badness is here! This week Kali Fencl, Kelly Molloy, and Ian Campbell discuss Cory Doctorow's recent blog post about his experience getting scammed along with the decade-long issue of email sent to .ml addresses rather than .mil ones.

How can you showcase value and ROI effectively when talking about your business- with customers and with stakeholders across the business? In this episode, our host Melissa Howatson sits down with Ian Campbell, CEO of Nucleus Research, to explore the intricacies of finance collaboration in driving business success. Ian, a Wall Street Journal best-selling author celebrated for his expertise in “the value sale,” offers invaluable insights on integrating sales knowledge and ROI best practices throughout businesses. His approach prioritizes payback and customer satisfaction, providing a comprehensive framework for evaluating decisions and driving success across all facets of an organization.Join us as Melissa and Ian discuss:Leading sales conversations with value propositions and ROI calculationsEmpowering sales teams with finance insights to articulate the benefits of products or services effectivelyThe significance of collaboration between finance and sales in driving revenue growth and aligning sales strategies with financial objectivesImplementing finance collaboration principles across Marketing and Product development to optimize investments and maximize returns

How can you showcase value and ROI effectively when talking about your business- with customers and with stakeholders across the business? In this episode, our host Melissa Howatson sits down with Ian Campbell, CEO of Nucleus Research, to explore the intricacies of finance collaboration in driving business success. Ian, a Wall Street Journal best-selling author celebrated for his expertise in “the value sale,” offers invaluable insights on integrating sales knowledge and ROI best practices throughout businesses. His approach prioritizes payback and customer satisfaction, providing a comprehensive framework for evaluating decisions and driving success across all facets of an organization.Join us as Melissa and Ian discuss:Leading sales conversations with value propositions and ROI calculationsEmpowering sales teams with finance insights to articulate the benefits of products or services effectivelyThe significance of collaboration between finance and sales in driving revenue growth and aligning sales strategies with financial objectivesImplementing finance collaboration principles across Marketing and Product development to optimize investments and maximize returns

In this episode of the Sales Development Podcast, hosted by Tenbound, we dive into the transformative strategies behind successful sales and marketing in the technology sector. Our guest, Ian Campbell, CEO of Nucleus Research and an accomplished author, shares invaluable insights from his latest book, "The Value Sale." Campbell, with his unique blend of expertise as a foster parent for Huskies, a private pilot, and an adjunct professor, brings a fresh perspective on achieving tangible returns on investment (ROI) in sales. We explore the essence of value-driven sales, the impact of real-world case studies, and the importance of focusing on productivity, cost reduction, and profitability to fuel the go-to-market engine. Campbell's approach demystifies the complex world of ROI and offers practical advice for sales professionals seeking to enhance their effectiveness and drive revenue growth.This episode is a must-listen for anyone in the tech sales world looking to elevate their Sales strategies and achieve meaningful, value-based success.

Ian Campbell is a composer, pianist, teacher and partimenti expert and teacher.  Partimenti is one of the most efficient tools ever developed for teaching music creatively, but was discarded and has almost been lost. Ian first encountered partimenti studying in Paris, France with disciples of Nadia Boulanger and has been learning, practicing, and teaching partimenti for more than 10 years.  WHY didn't I know anything about this? I'm DELIGHTED to have had this conversation. I feel smarter already...   Visit Ian's website, Instagram, or Facebook, or sign up for his newsletter.    Thanks for joining me on Crushing Classical!  Theme music and audio editing by DreamVance. You can join my email list HERE, so you never miss an episode! I help people to lean into their creative careers and start or grow their income streams. I have three 1:1 coaching slots available this season. You can read more or hop onto a short discovery call from my website. I'm your host, Jennet Ingle. I love you all. Stay safe out there!    

Where does value fit in the sales funnel? How do you structure your value proposition? The value discussion is often the most difficult conversation for salespeople to have. They like to employ likability, authority, and trust. They can't always wrap their heads around value. But value and ROI are the single most important things that procurement looks at, so you need to be able to communicate value effectively. Ian Campbell will share how to do just that in this episode of Negotiations Ninja. Outline of This Episode [1:26] Learn more about Ian Campbell [2:13] How value fits in the sales funnel [5:39] How to structure value in your funnel  [7:24] Definitions of benefits, MPB, ROI etc.  [10:37] Translating benefit(s) to ROI [16:57] Ian's experience in the Ferrari Challenge series Connect with Ian Campbell The Value Sale: How to Prove ROI and Win More Deals Connect on LinkedIn Connect With Mark Follow Negotiations Ninja on Twitter: @NegotiationPod Connect with Mark on LinkedIn Follow Negotiations Ninja on LinkedIn Connect on Instagram: @NegotiationPod Subscribe to Negotiations Ninja

We're coming back with another iteration of our Book Club on the Breaking Badness podcast! Kali Fencl, Ian Campbell, and Daniel Schwalbe discuss their top cybersecurity book picks along with books outside the industry.

Episode 175 of Breaking Badness is here! This week Kali Fencl, Tim Helming, and Ian Campbell discuss bad actors using shell companies in Wyoming for global attacks along with BazarCall attacks leveraging Google Forms.

Ian Campbell is the Chief Executive Officer of Nucleus Research and author of Wall Street Journal Best Seller book "The Value Sale." He is a recognized expert on return on investment (ROI) and total cost of ownership (TCO) analysis and has written and presented extensively on a range of organizational topics and the importance of matching technology to business organizational objectives. He is a frequent speaker at industry and business events and teaches at Babson College and Florida International University.   Connect with Ian Websites - nucleusresearch.com , thevaluesale.com Linkedin - https://www.linkedin.com/in/iancampbellnucleusresearch/ Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/ianinsights/ Connect with David Public Website: www.davidihill.com Real Estate University: www.realestateuniversity.club  Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/davidihill/  LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/davidihill 20-Minute call: https://www.davidihill.com/strategycall   FACEBOOK COMMUNITY Please follow and join my Group- https://www.facebook.com/groups/ptmastery/  

In this captivating episode of The Inquisitor Podcast, join CEO of Nucleus Research, Ian Campbell, as he delves into the world of creating value and unlocking its true potential. From mastering the art of persuasion to maximising return on investment, Ian shares invaluable insights and techniques that will transform your approach to sales. Get ready to shift your perspective and discover what's truly possible! Key Points of Interest: Learn how to articulate the benefits and value of your offering to captivate your customers. Understand the different types of benefits and how to leverage them in your business case for accelerated success. Discover the secrets behind crafting a compelling value proposition that turns features into irresistible value. Uncover the blind spots that may be hindering your ability to create value and overcome them. Gain expert advice on handling the ROI conversation with finesse and avoiding common pitfalls. Listen to this episode to challenge your beliefs, expand your boundaries, and tap into the limitless potential of value creation. Prepare to be inspired and empowered to take your sales game to new heights. Powerful Questions to Shift Your Thinking: How can I use value to truly help my customers and accelerate my deals? Have I been overlooking the different types of benefits and their impact on my sales success? What changes can I make in my approach to turn features into a compelling value proposition? Am I aware of my blind spots when it comes to creating value, and how can I overcome them? How can I navigate the ROI conversation with confidence and unlock new opportunities? Listen to this thought-provoking episode now and experience a paradigm shift in your sales strategy. -- Get 30 minutes of my coaching free. Take my audit and I'll coach you. No charge. No pressure. https://mailchi.mp/laughs-last.com/satp Just honest insights to improve in 30 days. Want more? Ask about paid coaching. We'll go deep. I'm selective. I push for what matters, not distractions. Are you making sacrifices you don't want? Wrong reasons? What do you want from your career? What matters most? Is something missing? Let's discuss. Take the audit now. Book a free consult. Start the journey today. https://mailchi.mp/laughs-last.com/satp

Ian Campbell, security operations engineer at DomainTools, is someone who has truly carved a niche out for himself in his organization and in the cybersecurity landscape as a whole. His blogs for the DomainTools website have provided paths for neurodiverse cybersecurity professionals and allies who want to make their organizations more friendly to neurodiversity to undertake the small changes to work roles and company culture that can net huge improvements for folks with different types of cognition, patterns of learning, concentration challenges, and yes, nurturable strengths! I've said it plenty of times here and I'll say it again: cybersecurity is at its best when we're all together, solving problems and creating solutions with our own diverse approaches. 0:00 - Neurodiversity in cybersecurity 4:00 - How Ian Campbell got into cybersecurity 6:50 - Cybersecurity journey15:33 - What does a security operations engineer do?18:37 - Chokepoints of security operations engineer role20:22 - Supporting people with neurodiverse work and learning25:50 - What hinders neurodiverse workers in cybersecurity? 30:17 - Altering work culture for neurodiverse workers39:00 - Neurodivergent traits suited for cybersecurity 42:05 - Benefits of neurodiversity in cybersecurity 48:41 - Promoting communication for neurodiverse workers52:36 - Positive policies for neurodivergent workers58:20 - Learn more about DomainTools1:00:00 - Learn more about Ian Campbell1:00:23 - Outro – Get your FREE cybersecurity training resources: https://www.infosecinstitute.com/free– View Cyber Work Podcast transcripts and additional episodes: https://www.infosecinstitute.com/podcastAbout InfosecInfosec's mission is to put people at the center of cybersecurity. We help IT and security professionals advance their careers with skills development and certifications while empowering all employees with security awareness and phishing training to stay cyber-safe at work and home. More than 70% of the Fortune 500 have relied on Infosec Skills to develop their security talent, and more than 5 million learners worldwide are more cyber-resilient from Infosec IQ's security awareness training. Learn more at infosecinstitute.com.

How do you build value so you don't have to fight on price?  Only rookies fight on price.  We all know you get what you pay for – so why is everyone fighting on price when only 6 percent of our purchases are based on price? If they say it is too expensive – you have blown your presentation.  So, how do you create value or demonstrate the benefits of our product or service?  Here are a few ways to get started on your path to sell value, not price. Do you build the value or vomit the features of your product/service and hope they see the value?  Join me for this week's podcast on The Value Sale - How to Prove ROI and Win More Deals - Interview With Ian Campbell.  We will discover how to build the value and create an irresistible ROI.  This will make the purchase a no-brainer.     For more info about Ian visit his website here. PS Lifetime membership to Gold Influence University Save 65%     Why Do 3% Make 97% of The Money? Warning: Influence University is the most complete and comprehensive course I have ever released. This system is USUALLY reserved for my advanced coaching students. This online University will reveal cutting-edge influence techniques that will increase your income and enable you to persuade on command. Influence University is the difference between knowing what you want– and getting it, anytime, anyplace, from anybody.   Create unimaginable wealth, transform your career, and close more sales. Influence University is the first and only website to combine scientific research, persuasion software, training videos, downloadable audios, and proven exercises. More Info http://influenceuniversity.com/special   Buy Now https://www.paypal.com/cgi-bin/webscr?cmd=_s-xclick&hosted_button_id=ZTSLKM9ST8WHS  

In this episode, Nils welcomes guest Ian Campbell, author of "The Value Sale," to discuss selling value and quantifying ROI in sales. They explore the concept of value and benefits using the example of selling alligators and delve into different levels of benefits. Ian emphasizes the importance of grounding benefits in numbers, focusing on the top two benefits, and reframing the conversation to make it more relatable and impactful. They also discuss the value equation in leadership development and the significance of focusing on payback rather than ROI when selling a product or service. Tune in for more transformative discussions and redefine your approach to strategic selling today! Podcast highlights: 0:44 - The alligator story - Ian shares an absurd example of selling alligators and how the value of the opportunity can change perception. 3:42 - Different levels of benefits - Ian explains the concept of first-order, second-order, third-order, and fourth-order benefits and how they vary in credibility and variability. 11:00 - Avoiding the fourth-order benefit -  Ian advises against discussing fourth-order benefits as they can weaken the business case and recommends focusing on fewer, stronger benefits. 15:29 - Grounding benefits in quantifiable numbers - How does quantifying benefits in sales conversations help in upselling and building customer references? 18:44 - The significance of financial reasons for CFOs -  Ian highlights the importance of presenting financial reasons to CFOs when selling a SaaS product and how it helps in defending the decision and gaining internal support. 20:58 - Value equation for leadership development - How to approach and communicate the value of leadership development, even though it may be considered a third-order benefit? 27:15 - Using a range instead of a benchmark - Ian shares the benefits of using a range instead of a single benchmark number to avoid pushback and allow for individualized discussions about productivity increase. 31:17 - Payback period -  Ian discusses the significance of covering costs within a specific timeframe and the psychological impact it has on decision-making. 33:27 - Three real benefits for customers - Ian explains the three main benefits a customer can expect and how to determine which benefit is most relevant in a given situation. Connect with Ian at https://www.linkedin.com/in/iancampbellnucleusresearch/ Check out his book “The Value Sale” at https://www.thevaluesale.com/ Learn more about Nucleus Research at https://nucleusresearch.com/ This episode is brought to you by the Leadership MBA. The Leadership MBA is a 12-week comprehensive program that will give you all the practical tools you need to become a true leader and the CEO of your career. The product of nearly 2 decades of leadership coaching Managers, Directors, and VPs at companies like Apple and Oracle, the Leadership MBA will show you exactly how to crack the leadership code through a proven step-by-step process. Click here to download the Leadership MBA Program Guide

their products and services, which mainly stems from laying more benefits of the product than what the customer needs. As such, by simplifying the process and focusing on the most crucial part, you can generate a much more positive message, which is essential to success. Ian Campbell is the founder of Nucleus Research, a company that uses an ROI investigative approach to deliver research with unbiased and factual analysis, helping you to create a credible business ROI. He is also the best-selling author of The Value Sale, helping readers prove their ROI and close more deals. Today, Ian will talk about the return on investments, the total cost of ownership, leadership, and how to improve your overall business. Tune in to learn more! Resources Nucleus Research Site  Ian Campbell on Linkedin The Value Sale: How to Prove ROI and Win More Deals on Amazon

"Identify that one big benefit, and you'll make it a lot easier to show the value you'll deliver. You'll also make it easier for your prospect to champion the decision." - Ian Campbell in today's Tip 1648 Do you identify that one big driver for the decision and help your prospect understand that one big benefit? Join the conversation at DailySales.Tips/1648 and learn more about Ian! Have feedback? Want to share a sales tip? Call or text the Sales Success Hotline: 512-777-1442 or Email: scott@top1.fm

Boost Your Sales with ROI and Payback: Ian Campbell's Expert Advice Does this sound familiar? You've been told to bombard your customers with a laundry list of product features and hope that it somehow convinces them to buy. But all you're left with is a frustrated audience and lackluster sales results. The pain of spending valuable time and effort crafting complex messages that fail to resonate is all too real. Isn't it time you learned a more effective approach to drive sales success? Our guest for this episode: Ian Campbell, the guest for this week's The Modern Selling Podcast, is the CEO of Nucleus Research, a leading research firm focused on helping organizations understand and articulate the value and return on investment (ROI) of technology. With over 20 years of experience in the tech industry, Ian brings a wealth of knowledge and expertise to the table. He is also the author of the book "The Value Sale," which provides sales professionals with a simple and effective process for building a business case and delivering a value message that resonates with buyers. Ian's insights and practical strategies make him a valuable resource for sales professionals looking to drive sales success through effective communication of value and ROI. He has a rich background in the tech industry. Starting as a software programmer, he later transitioned into research, where he found his passion for understanding the ROI from technology. As the founder and CEO of Nucleus Research, Ian and his team focus on helping vendors and end users articulate the value of technology through ROI studies. With a wealth of experience in teaching value and ROI at the college level, Ian recognized the need to simplify the process of building a business case for salespeople. His goal in writing a book was to provide sales professionals with a clear and straightforward approach to showcasing value and ROI to their customers. By breaking down the concept into easily understandable terms, Ian believes that salespeople can confidently communicate the benefits of their products, ultimately leading to increased sales success. The easier it is to build a business case, build an ROI case, the easier it's going to be for you to sell. - Ian Campbell Mastering Communication for Sales Success Understanding the art and science of communication is crucial for sales success. Strong communication skills allow sales professionals to articulate their value proposition clearly and persuasively, which is critical in convincing potential customers of the benefits of a product or service. Skilled communicators can effectively convey complex information, maintaining the interest of their audience, and promoting engaging and productive conversations that drive sales. Simplifying and Communicating Value Proposition A crucial skill for any sales professional is to effectively simplify and communicate the value proposition of their product or service. This involves distilling complex features and benefits into understandable and impactful messages. By focusing on the key benefits that resonate most with the customer, salespeople can create a compelling narrative that underscores the value of their offering and encourages the customer to make a purchase. In this episode, you will be able to: Master the art of communicating value and drive your sales success. Learn how to simplify your value proposition and effectively communicate the benefits to your customers. Discover the role of ROI and payback in sales and decision-making, and how to leverage it to close deals. Quantify the value you provide to your customers and demonstrate the impact of your product or service. Understand the importance of identifying your customer's needs and focusing on key benefits to drive sales success. The key moments in this episode are: 00:00:08 - Introduction. 00:01:36 - About Ian Campbell and Nucleus Research. 00:05:33 - The Value Sale Book. 00:06:51 - Easy Way to Determine Positive ROI. 00:09:56 - Leading with ROI. 00:13:51 - The Importance of ROI in Sales. 00:15:08 - Categorizing Benefits and ROI. 00:16:20 - The Value of Hours Saved. 00:17:43 - Simplifying ROI for Marketing Sequences. 00:19:07 - Challenges of ROI in Larger Opportunities. 00:26:11 - The Importance of Payback Period. 00:27:28 - Mitigating Risk with Payback Period. 00:28:00 - Leveraging Payback Period in Marketing. 00:29:38 - Using Payback Period to Improve Sales Messaging. 00:30:01 - Avoiding Common Mistakes in Building a Business Case. 00:39:02 - The Power of Simplifying Product Benefits. 00:39:38 - Connecting with Ian Campbell. 00:40:43 - Quota Performance and Sales Challenges. 00:42:29 - Research Collaboration Opportunity. 00:42:39 - Ian Campbell's Favorite Movie. Timestamped summary of this episode: 00:00:08 - Introduction, Mario Martinez Jr. introduces himself as the CEO and founder of Vengreso and the host of the Modern Selling podcast. He welcomes the audience and mentions that they will be discussing the value sale ROI in this episode. 00:01:36 - About Ian Campbell and Nucleus Research, Mario introduces Ian Campbell, the CEO of Nucleus Research and author of the book "The Value Sale." Ian shares his background in technology and explains that Nucleus Research focuses on helping vendors and end users understand the return on investment from technology. 00:05:33 - The Value Sale Book, Ian discusses his book "The Value Sale" and its purpose of providing salespeople with a process to build a business case and demonstrate value to customers. He emphasizes the importance of ROI in helping customers understand the potential return they will get from a product. 00:06:51 - Easy Way to Determine Positive ROI, Ian introduces the concept of breadth and repeatability as indicators of positive ROI. The more people use a product and the more often they use it, the greater the potential ROI. He advises salespeople to consider these factors when evaluating the potential value for a customer. 00:09:56 - Leading with ROI, Ian suggests that while ROI is an important metric, payback period is even more impactful. Salespeople should focus on how quickly a customer will cover their costs and the return they will receive over time. Payback period can be a more compelling metric when discussing financial 00:13:51 - The Importance of ROI in Sales, The conversation begins by discussing the significance of showcasing ROI to end users. The guest emphasizes the need to focus on increasing productivity and saving tangible resources, such as time. The value proposition should highlight the number of hours saved and the cost justification. 00:15:08 - Categorizing Benefits and ROI, The guest introduces the concept of categorizing benefits into direct, intended, productivity gain, and distant categories. While direct and intended categories are easy to calculate, distant benefits, like happier employees, have a lower impact on ROI. The key is to focus on the two big benefits that drive the deal. 00:16:20 - The Value of Hours Saved, The guest emphasizes the importance of focusing on the number of hours saved and how it justifies the cost. Even a few hours saved can make a significant impact. By calculating the worst-case scenario, it becomes evident that the value proposition for sales should revolve around the hours saved. 00:17:43 - Simplifying ROI for Marketing Sequences, The guest suggests a brilliant question to ask in marketing sequences: "How many hours do I really need to save you to justify the cost?" This simplifies the ROI discussion and helps in converting more people. He advises focusing on the two big benefits that drive the deal and not getting caught up in other smaller benefits. 00:19:07 - Challenges of ROI in Larger Opportunities, The guest acknowledges the difficulty of unpacking ROI in larger opportunities and more. 00:26:11 - The Importance of Payback Period, Understanding the payback period is crucial in making informed decisions about signing a contract. It helps determine if a project will cover its costs within a reasonable timeframe and if the return on investment is favorable. Shorter payback periods increase the likelihood of moving forward with a project. 00:27:28 - Mitigating Risk with Payback Period, A shorter payback period reduces the risk associated with a project. If the costs can be covered within a few months, even if the decision turns out to be a bad one, the project will have already generated positive value. Emphasizing a quick payback period can accelerate decision-making. 00:28:00 - Leveraging Payback Period in Marketing, Highlighting a quick payback period in marketing can be more impactful than focusing on a small daily cost. Demonstrating how quickly customers can cover their costs and start generating positive value is a stronger selling point. Real-life examples and customer testimonials can reinforce these claims. 00:29:38 - Using Payback Period to Improve Sales Messaging. Incorporating the idea of payback period into sales messaging can significantly enhance the effectiveness of the message. By framing benefits as numbers that contribute to covering costs and generating positive value, sales reps can appeal to prospects' desire for tangible returns. 00:30:01 - Avoiding Common Mistakes in Building a Business Case Sales reps often make the mistake of including too many benefits in their business case, diluting the impact of their message. 00:39:02 - The Power of Simplifying Product Benefits, Ian Campbell emphasizes the importance of focusing on the three key ways a product impacts customers, making it easier to articulate their value. He encourages salespeople to drop the mic and make sure the benefits drive to those big numbers. 00:39:38 - Connecting with Ian Campbell, Mario asks how listeners can connect with Ian Campbell, suggesting Twitter and LinkedIn. Ian recommends finding him on LinkedIn and reaching out to Nucleus Research for valuable resources and articles on topics like IRR. Personalized connection requests are encouraged. 00:40:43 - Quota Performance and Sales Challenges. Mario asks about the latest research on the percentage of sellers making quota. Ian shares that they are about to launch a survey to gather this data. He mentions that while revenues may be down, competition is up, and deals are extending rather than falling off. 00:42:29 - Research Collaboration Opportunity, Mario offers to connect Ian with their database of 100,000 sellers, business owners, and sales leaders if they need to poll for research. Ian expresses his appreciation and interest in collaborating for future research. 00:42:39 - Ian Campbell's Favorite Movie. Mario asks Ian about his all-time favorite movie. Ian chooses "Castle Black" as a classic old film with a cheesy charm and memorable one-liners. He considers it a movie that never gets tiresome and stands out among the rest. Leveraging ROI and Payback to Close Deals A key aspect of successful sales is the ability to convincingly demonstrate the Return on Investment (ROI) and payback period to potential customers. Showcasing the tangible benefits, savings, and productivity gains that will be achieved through the purchase in a simple and believable manner can expedite the decision-making process. By leading with a short payback period, sales professionals can alleviate risk concerns, making it easier for decision-makers to approve the purchase. The resources mentioned in this episode are: Visit the FlyMSG.io to download the free personal writing assistant and text expander application. Check out the Nucleus Research website to learn more about their services and how they can help you understand the ROI of technology. Purchase a copy of Ian Campbell's book, The Value Sale, to learn how to build a business case and deliver a message that will help close deals. Consider leading with the concept of payback rather than just ROI in your sales process to help customers understand how quickly they can cover their costs. Explore the various metrics and value propositions that can be used to start conversations with potential buyers. Connect with Mario Martinez Jr. on LinkedIn to stay updated on future episodes of the Modern Selling podcast.

"If your solution is used infrequently by only a few people, you may need to look for other benefits or consider discounting to push the deal forward." - Ian Campbell in today's Tip 1635 Is your product used frequently or infrequently? Join the conversation at DailySales.Tips/1635 and learn more about Ian! Have feedback? Want to share a sales tip? Call or text the Sales Success Hotline: 512-777-1442 or Email: scott@top1.fm

"Rather than lead with ROI, consider starting the discussion with payback, then turn to ROI." - Ian Campbell in today's Tip 1630 What's your thought about this? Join the conversation at DailySales.Tips/1630 and check out the links! Have feedback? Want to share a sales tip? Call or text the Sales Success Hotline: 512-777-1442 or Email: scott@top1.fm

This week Kali Fencl, Tim Helming, and Ian Campbell discuss the ransom attacks against MGM and Caesars Entertainment along with Cisco's acquisition of Splunk.

"If you keep the business case tight and focus your effort on the benefits that matter, you can create a credible business case that's easy to understand and drive to a close." - Ian Campbell in today's Tip 1625 How many benefits does your product deliver? Join the conversation at DailySales.Tips/1625 and learn more about Ian! Have feedback? Want to share a sales tip? Call or text the Sales Success Hotline: 512-777-1442 or Email: scott@top1.fm