People I (Mostly) Admire

Palliative physician B.J. Miller asks: Is there a better way to think about dying? And can death be beautiful? SOURCES:B.J. Miller, palliative-care physician and President at Mettle Health. RESOURCES:A Beginner's Guide to the End: Practical Advice for Living Life and Facing Death, by Shoshana Berger and B.J. Miller and (2019).“After A Freak Accident, A Doctor Finds Insight Into ‘Living Life And Facing Death,'” by Fresh Air (W.Y.P.R., 2019).“Dying In A Hospital Means More Procedures, Tests And Costs,” by Alison Kodjak (W.Y.P.R., 2016).“The Final Year: Visualizing End Of Life,” by Arcadia (2016).“What Really Matters at the End of Life,” by B.J. Miller (TED, 2015).“The Flexner Report ― 100 Years Later,” by Thomas P. Duffy (Yale Journal of Biology and Medicine, 2011).“My Near Death Panel Experience,” by Earl Blumenauer (The New York Times, 2009).The Center for Dying and Living. EXTRAS:“Max Tegmark on Why Superhuman Artificial Intelligence Won't be Our Slave (Part 2),” by People I (Mostly) Admire (2021).“Max Tegmark on Why Treating Humanity Like a Child Will Save Us All,” by People I (Mostly) Admire (2021).“Amanda & Lily Levitt Share What It's Like to be Steve's Daughters,” by People I (Mostly) Admire (2021).“Edward Glaeser Explains Why Some Cities Thrive While Others Fade Away,” by People I (Mostly) Admire (2021).“Sendhil Mullainathan Explains How to Generate an Idea a Minute (Part 2),” by People I (Mostly) Admire (2021).“Sendhil Mullainathan Thinks Messing Around Is the Best Use of Your Time,” by People I (Mostly) Admire (2021).“How Does Facing Death Change Your Life?” by No Stupid Questions (2021).“How to Be Better at Death,” by Freakonomics Radio (2021).

Historian Tom Holland narrowly escaped a career writing vampire novels to become the co-host of the wildly popular podcast The Rest Is History. At Steve's request, he compares President Trump and Julius Caesar and explains why the culture wars are arguments about Christian theology. SOURCES:Tom Holland, historian and host of The Rest is History. RESOURCES:Dominion: How the Christian Revolution Remade the World, by Tom Holland (2019).Rubicon, by Tom Holland (2005). EXTRAS:Unforgiving Places: The Unexpected Origins of American Gun Violence, by Jens Ludwig (2025)."A Solution to America's Gun Problem," by People I (Mostly) Admire (2025)."Richard Dawkins on God, Genes, and Murderous Baby Cuckoos," by People I (Mostly) Admire (2024).

John Green returns to the show to talk about tuberculosis — a disease that kills more than a million people a year. Steve has an idea for a new way to get treatment to those in need. SOURCES: John Green, best-selling author and YouTube creator. RESOURCES: Everything Is Tuberculosis: The History and Persistence of Our Deadliest Infection, by John Green (2025)."The Deadliest Infectious Disease Isn't a Science Problem. It's a Money Problem," by John Green (The Washington Post, 2024)."The Deadliest Infectious Disease of All Time," by John Green (Crash Course, 2024)."Barely Contained Rage: An Open Letter to Johnson & Johnson," by John Green (Vlogbrothers, 2023)."Designing Advance Market Commitments for New Vaccines," by Michael Kremer, Jonathan D. Levin, and Christopher M. Snyder (NBER, 2020)."Are CEOs Rewarded for Luck? The Ones Without Principals Are," by Marianne Bertrand and Sendhil Mullainathan (The Quarterly Journal of Economics, 2001)."A Further Communication on a Remedy for Tuberculosis," by Robert Koch (The Indian Medical Gazette, 1891). EXTRAS: "His Brilliant Videos Get Millions of Views. Why Don't They Make Money?" by People I (Mostly) Admire (2025)."Sendhil Mullainathan Thinks Messing Around Is the Best Use of Your Time (Update)," by People I (Mostly) Admire (2024)."John Green's Reluctant Rocket Ship Ride (Update)" by People I (Mostly) Admire (2024)."Rajiv Shah Never Wastes a Crisis," by People I (Mostly) Admire (2024)."'There's So Many Problems — Which Ones Can I Make a Difference On?'" by People I (Mostly) Admire (2022).The Anthropocene Reviewed: Essays on a Human-Centered Planet, by John Green (2021).The Anthropocene Reviewed (podcast).Nerdfighteria.TBFighters.

Abraham Verghese is a physician and a best-selling author — in that order, he says. He explains the difference between curing and healing, and tells Steve why doctors should spend more time with patients and less with electronic health records. SOURCES:Abraham Verghese, professor of medicine at Stanford University and best-selling novelist. RESOURCES:The Covenant of Water, by Abraham Verghese (2023).“Abraham Verghese's Sweeping New Fable of Family and Medicine,” by Andrew Solomon (The New York Times, 2023).“Watch Oprah's Emotional Conversation with Abraham Verghese, Author of the 101st Oprah's Book Club Pick” (Oprah Daily, 2023).“How Indian Teachers Have Shaped Ethiopia's Education System,” by Mariam Jafri (The Quint, 2023).“How Tech Can Turn Doctors Into Clerical Workers,” by Abraham Verghese (The New York Times Magazine, 2018).Cutting for Stone, by Abraham Verghese (2009).“Culture Shock — Patient as Icon, Icon as Patient,” by Abraham Verghese (The New England Journal of Medicine, 2008).“The Cowpath to America,” by Abraham Verghese (The New Yorker, 1997).My Own Country: A Doctor's Story, by Abraham Verghese (1994).“Urbs in Rure: Human Immunodeficiency Virus Infection in Rural Tennessee,” by Abraham Verghese, Steven L. Berk, and Felix Sarubbi (The Journal of Infectious Diseases, 1989). EXTRAS:“Are You Suffering From Burnout?” by No Stupid Questions (2023).“Would You Rather See a Computer or a Doctor?” by Freakonomics, M.D. (2022).“How Do You Cure a Compassion Crisis?” by Freakonomics Radio (2020).The Citadel, by A. J. Cronin (1937).Uncle Tom's Cabin, by Harriet Beecher Stowe (1852).

Jens Ludwig has an idea for how to fix America's gun violence problem — and it starts by rejecting conventional wisdom from both sides of the political aisle.  SOURCES:Jens Ludwig, professor of economics at the University of Chicago and director of the University of Chicago Crime Lab. RESOURCES:Unforgiving Places: The Unexpected Origins of American Gun Violence, by Jens Ludwig (2025)."Scope Challenges to Social Impact," by Monica Bhatt, Jonathan Guryan, Jens Ludwig, and Anuj Shah (National Bureau of Economic Research, 2021)."Citywide cluster randomized trial to restore blighted vacant land and its effects on violence, crime, and fear," by Charles Branas, Eugenia South, Michelle Kondo, Bernadette Hohl, Philippe Bourgois, Douglas Wiebe, and John MacDonald (Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences, 2018)."Thinking, Fast and Slow? Some Field Experiments to Reduce Crime and Dropout in Chicago," by Sara Heller, Anuj Shah, Jonathan Guryan, Jens Ludwig, Sendhil Mullainathan, and Harold Pollack (Quarterly Journal of Economics, 2016).Thinking, Fast and Slow, by Daniel Kahneman (2013)."Homicide and Suicide Rates Associated With Implementation of the Brady Handgun Violence Prevention Act," by Jens Ludwig and Philip Cook (Journal of the American Medical Association, 2000).The Death and Life of Great American Cities, by Jane Jacobs (1992).The University of Chicago Crime Lab."Becoming a Man" (University of Chicago Crime Lab). EXTRAS:"Do the Police Have a Management Problem?" by Freakonomics Radio (2023)."From prison to Ph.D, this activist fights for peace in Chicago," by Kenya Downs (PBS News, 2016).

Ellen Wiebe is a physician who helps seriously ill patients end their lives in Canada, where assisted suicide is legal. Is death a human right? SOURCES: Ellen Wiebe, clinical professor of medicine at the University of British Columbia. RESOURCES: "The Last Decision by the World's Leading Thinker on Decisions," by Jason Zweig (The Wall Street Journal, 2025)."Most Americans Favor Legal Euthanasia," by Rachael Yi (Gallup, 2024).Canadian Association of MAID Assessors and Providers."Medical Assistance in Dying: Overview," (Government of Canada). EXTRAS: "Can Robots Get a Grip?" by People I (Mostly) Admire (2025)."Remembering Daniel Kahneman," by People I (Mostly) Admire (2024)."Does Death Have to Be a Death Sentence?" by People I (Mostly) Admire (2021).Thinking, Fast and Slow, by Daniel Kahneman (2011).

He has been a lawyer, an instructor at the F.B.I. Academy, the owner of a frozen-yogurt chain, and a winner of the TV show Survivor. Today, Kwon works at Google, but things haven't always come easily for him. Steve Levitt talks to Kwon about his debilitating childhood anxieties, his compulsion to choose the hardest path in life, and how Kwon used game theory to stage a victory on Survivor. SOURCES:Yul Kwon, vice president of product management at Google. RESOURCES:Teacher Application for ASU Prep Tempe. EXTRAS:"Are Our Tools Becoming Part of Us?" by People I (Mostly) Admire (2024)."Yul Kwon: 'Hey, Do You Have Any Bright Ideas?' (Part 2)," by People I (Mostly) Admire (2021)."Robert Axelrod on Why Being Nice, Forgiving, and Provokable are the Best Strategies for Life," by People I (Mostly) Admire (2021).

Ken Goldberg is at the forefront of robotics — which means he tries to teach machines to do things humans find trivial. SOURCES:Ken Goldberg, professor of industrial engineering and operations research at U.C. Berkeley. RESOURCES:"The Bitter Lesson," by Rich Sutton (UT Austin, 2019).R.U.R. (Rossum's Universal Robots): A Fantastic Melodrama in Three Acts and an Epilogue, by Karel Capek (2019)."The Robot in the Cloud: A Conversation With Ken Goldberg," by Quentin Hardy (New York Times, 2014).Mind Children: The Future of Robot and Human Intelligence, by Hans Moravec (1990)."Stochastic Plans for Robotic Manipulation," by Ken Goldberg (Carnegie Mellon University, 1990)."The Two Cultures And The Scientific Revolution," by C. P. Snow (Cambridge University Press, 1959).Dex-NetAncient Wisdom for a Future Ecology: Trees, Time, and Technology.Ambi Robotics."The Telegarden." EXTRAS:"Feeling Sound and Hearing Color," by People I (Mostly) Admire (2024)."Are Our Tools Becoming Part of Us?" by People I (Mostly) Admire (2024).“My God, This Is a Transformative Power,” by People I (Mostly) Admire (2023)."Drawing from Life (and Death)" by People I (Mostly) Admire (2023)."Aicha Evans Wants You to Take Your Eyes Off the Road," by People I (Mostly) Admire (2021).

Suzanne O'Sullivan is a neurologist who sees many patients with psychosomatic disorders. Their symptoms may be psychological in origin, but their pain is real and physical — and the way we practice medicine, she argues, is making those and other health problems worse. SOURCES:Suzanne O'Sullivan, neurologist and author of The Age of Diagnosis How Our Obsession with Medical Labels Is Making Us Sicker. RESOURCES:The Age of Diagnosis: How Our Obsession with Medical Labels Is Making Us Sicker, by Suzanne O'Sullivan (2025)."Associations of Depression, Anxiety, Worry, Perceived Stress, and Loneliness Prior to Infection With Risk of Post-COVID-19 Conditions," by Siwen Wang, Luwei Quan, Jorge Chavarro, Natalie Slopen, Laura Kubzansky, Karestan Koenen, Jae Hee Kang, Marc G. Weisskopf, Westyn Branch-Elliman, and Andrea Roberts (JAMA Psychiatry, 2022)."How beliefs about coronavirus disease (COVID) influence COVID-like symptoms? – A longitudinal study." by Liron Rozenkrantz, Tobias Kube, Michael H Bernstein, and John D.E. Gabrieli (Health Psychology, 2022)."Risk factors for worsening of somatic symptom burden in a prospective cohort during the COVID-19 pandemic," by Petra Engelmann, Bernd Löwe, Thomas Theo Brehm, Angelika Weigel, Felix Ullrich, Marylyn Addo, Julian Schulze Zur Wiesch, Ansgar Lohse, and Anne Toussaint (Frontier Psychology, 2022).The Sleeping Beauties: And Other Stories of Mystery Illness, by Suzanne O'Sullivan (2021).Brainstorm: Detective Stories from the World of Neurology, by Suzanne O'Sullivan (2018)."The Trauma of Facing Deportation," by Rachel Aviv (The New Yorker, 2017).It's All in Your Head: True Stories of Imaginary Illness, by Suzanne O'Sullivan (2015).The Body Keeps the Score: Brain, Mind, and Body in the Healing of Trauma, by Bessel van der Kolk (2014)."Explaining the Rise in Youth Suicide," by David Cutler, Edward Glaeser,and Karen Norberg (National Bureau of Economic Research, 2001). EXTRAS:Counted Out, documentary (2024)."Bringing Data to Life," by People I (Mostly) Admire (2023)."Adding Ten Healthy Years to Your Life," by People I (Mostly) Admire (2023)."America's Math Curriculum Doesn't Add Up," by Freakonomics Radio (2019).Race to Nowhere, documentary (2010).Data Science for Everyone.

Reginald Dwayne Betts spent more than eight years in prison. Today he's a Yale Law graduate, a MacArthur Fellow, and a poet. His nonprofit works to build libraries in prisons so that more incarcerated people can find hope. SOURCES:Reginald Dwayne Betts, founder and director of Freedom Reads, award-winning poet, and lawyer. RESOURCES:Doggerel: Poems, by Reginald Dwayne Betts (2025).“The Poet Writing on Prison Underwear,” by Adam Iscoe (The New Yorker, 2023).The Voltage Effect, by John List (2022).“If We Truly Believe in Redemption and Second Chances, Parole Should Be Celebrated,” by Reginald Dwayne Betts (The Washington Post, 2021).Insurrections, by Rion Scott (2016).The Secret History of Wonder Woman, by Jill Lepore (2014).Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance: An Inquiry into Values, by Robert M. Pirsig (1974).The Black Poets, by Dudley Randall (1971).“For Freckle-Faced Gerald,” by Etheridge Knight (Poems from Prison, 1968).Felon: An America Washi Tale, by Reginald Dwayne Betts.Freedom Reads. EXTRAS:“Can a Moonshot Approach to Mental Health Work?” by People I (Mostly) Admire (2023).“Can Data Keep People Out of Prison?” by People I (Mostly) Admire (2023).“The Price of Doing Business with John List,” by People I (Mostly) Admire (2022).“Why Do Most Ideas Fail to Scale?” by Freakonomics Radio (2022).

Chemist Jack Szostak wants to understand how the first life forms came into being on Earth. He and Steve discuss the danger of "mirror bacteria," the origin of biology in poisonous chemicals, and the possibility that life might exist on other planets too.  SOURCES:Jack Szostak, Nobel laureate and professor of chemistry at The University of Chicago. RESOURCES:Is Earth Exceptional?: The Quest for Cosmic Life, by Mario Livio and Jack Szostak (2024)"Q&A: How ‘Mirror Bacteria' Could Take a Devastating Toll on Humanity," by Isabella Backman (Yale School of Medicine, 2024)."The virtual circular genome model for primordial RNA replication," by Jack Szostak, Lijun Zhou, and Dian Ding (RNA, 2021)."Protocells and RNA Self-Replication," by Gerald Joyce and Jack Szostak (Cold Spring Harbor Perspectives in Biology, 2018)."The Narrow Road to the Deep Past: In Search of the Chemistry of the Origin of Life," by Jack Szostak (Angewandte Chemie International Edition, 2017)."Jack Szostak on 'Life in the Lab' (And Autocatalytic Sets)" by Suzan Mazur (Huffington Post, 2014)."Jack W. Szostak Interview" (The Nobel Prize, 2009)."The Miller-Urey Experiment" (National Center for Science Education)."From Old Vials, New Hints on Origin of Life," by Kenny Chang (New York Times, 2008). EXTRAS:What Is It Like to Be an Addict?: Understanding Substance Abuse, by Owen Flanagan (2025)"UPDATE: What It's Like to Be Steve Levitt's Daughters," by People I (Mostly) Admire (2024)."We Can Play God Now," by Freakonomics Radio (2022).

Owen Flanagan's newest book details his 20-year dependence on alcohol and pills — and outlines his research on what addiction can tell us about the nature of consciousness. SOURCES:Owen Flanagan, philosopher, neurobiologist, and professor emeritus at Duke University. RESOURCES:What Is It Like to Be an Addict?: Understanding Substance Abuse, by Owen Flanagan (2025).Consciousness Reconsidered, by Owen Flanagan (1993).Against Happiness, by Owen Flanagan, Joseph E. LeDoux, Bobby Bingle, Daniel M. Haybron, Batja Mesquita, Michele Moody-Adams, Songyao Ren, Anna Sun, and Yolonda Y. Wilson. (2023).The Bodhisattva's Brain: Buddhism Naturalized, by Owen Flanagan (2013).The Really Hard Problem: Meaning in a Material World, by Owen Flanagan (2009).Big Book, by Alcoholics Anonymous."Impact of the DSM-IV to DSM-5 Changes on the National Survey on Drug Use and Health," by Cristie Glasheen, Kathryn Batts, Rhonda Karg, Jonaki Bose, Sarra Hedden, and Kathryn Piscopo (Substance Abuse and Mental Health Services Administration, 2016). EXTRAS:"Professor Carl Hart Argues All Drugs Should Be Legal — Can He Convince Steve?" by People I (Mostly) Admire (2021).Drug Use for Grown-Ups: Chasing Liberty in the Land of Fear, by Carl Hart (2021).

The primatologist discusses the thrill of observing chimpanzees in the wild, the value of challenging orthodoxy, and why dying is her next great adventure. SOURCES:Dr. Jane Goodall, GBE, founder of the Jane Goodall Institute and U.N. Messenger of Peace. RESOURCES:The Book of Hope: A Survival Guide for Trying Times, by Jane Goodall, Douglas Abrams, and Gail Hudson (2021).Jane, by Brett Morgen (2017).“Remembering My Mentor: Robert Hinde,” by Jane Goodall (2017).The Soul of an Octopus: A Surprising Exploration into the Wonder of Consciousness, by Sy Montgomery (2015).Dr. Spock On Parenting: Sensible, Reassuring Advice for Today's Parent, by by Benjamin Spock, M.D. (2001).The Mentality of Apes, by Wolfgang Kohler (1976).“Miss Goodall and the Wild Chimpanzees,” (1965). EXTRAS:Roots and Shoots.Jane Goodall Hopecast.The Jane Goodall Institute.Grameen Foundation.“A Cross Between Sherlock Holmes and Indiana Jones,” by People I (Mostly) Admire (2022).“‘No One Can Resist a Jolly, Happy Pig,'” by People I (Mostly) Admire (2022).

Hank Green is an internet phenomenon and a master communicator, with a plan to reform higher education. He and Steve talk about the video blog that launched Hank's career, the economics of the internet, and how a cancer diagnosis prompted him to become a stand-up comedian. SOURCES:Hank Green, founder of Complexly and science communicator RESOURCES:ComplexlyCrashCourse YouTube ChannelSciShow YouTube ChannelVlogbrothers YouTube ChannelThe Show with Ze FrankStudy Hall"An Absolutely Remarkable Thing," by Hank Green (2018)"A Beautifully Foolish Endeavor," by Hank Green (2020)"So, I've got cancer," by Vlogbrothers (2023)"My Cancer Press Tier List," by Vlogbrothers (2023)"Between Two Kingdoms: A Memoir of a Life Interrupted" by Suleika Jaouad (2021)"The Impact of Legalized Abortion on Crime," by John Donohue III and Steve Levitt (The Quarterly Journal of Economics, 2001)"Hoodwinked?" by Stephen Dubner and Steve Levitt (New York Times, 2006)"An Ancient Roman Shipwreck May Explain the Universe," by SciShow (2024) EXTRAS:"John Green's Reluctant Rocket Ship Ride," by People I (Mostly) Admire (2022)"Suleika Jaouad's Survival Mechanisms," by People I (Mostly) Admire (2024)

Jonathan Levin is an academic economist who now runs one of the most influential universities in the world. He tells Steve how he saved Comcast a billion dollars, why he turned down Steve's unusual pitch to come to the University of Chicago, and why being a nice guy makes him a better college president. SOURCE:Jonathan Levin, president of Stanford University.   RESOURCES:"Income Segregation and Intergenerational Mobility Across Colleges in the United States," by Raj Chetty, John N Friedman, Emmanuel Saez, Nicholas Turner, and Danny Yagan (The Quarterly Journal of Economics, 2020)."Jonathan Levin: The Most Recent John Bates Clark Medal Winner," by Steve Levitt (Freakonomics Blog, 2011)."Winning Play in Spectrum Auctions," by Jeremy Bulow, Jonathan Levin, and Paul Milgrom (NBER Working Paper, 2009)."Information and Competition in U.S. Forest Service Timber Auctions," by Susan Athey and Jonathan Levin (Journal of Political Economy, 2001). EXTRAS:Vintage Pokémon card pack Instagram video, by Tyler Thrasher (2025)."Higher Education Is Broken. Can It Be Fixed?" by People I (Mostly) Admire (2023)."How Much Are the Right Friends Worth?" by People I (Mostly) Admire (2022).

Sarah Hart investigates the mathematical structures underlying musical compositions and literature. Using examples from Monteverdi to Lewis Carroll, Sarah explains to Steve how math affects how we hear music and understand stories.    SOURCE:Sarah Hart, professor emerita of mathematics at the University of London. RESOURCES:Once Upon a Prime: The Wondrous Connections Between Mathematics and Literature, by Sarah Hart (2023)."Ahab's Arithmetic: The Mathematics of Moby-Dick," by Sarah B. Hart (Journal of Humanistic Mathematics, 2021)."Online Lecture: The Mathematics of Musical Composition," by Sarah Hart (Gresham College, 2020).Black Mirror: Bandersnatch, film (2018).The Luminaries: A Novel, by Eleanor Catton (2013).Not Quite What I Was Planning: Six-Word Memoirs by Writers Famous and Obscure, edited by Rachel Fershleiser and Larry Smith (2008).Les Revenentes, by Georges Perec (1972).A Void, by Georges Perec (1969).Cent Mille Milliards de Poèmes, by Raymond Queneau (1961).Through the Looking-Glass, and What Alice Found There, by Lewis Carroll (1871).Alice's Adventures in Wonderland, by Lewis Carroll (1865).OuLiPo. EXTRAS:"The Joy of Math With Sarah Hart," by People I (Mostly) Admire (2023)."Mathematician Sarah Hart on Why Numbers are Music to Our Ears," by People I (Mostly) Admire (2021).

Sarah Stein Greenberg runs Stanford's d.school, which teaches design as a mode of problem solving. She and Steve talk about what makes her field different from other academic disciplines, how to approach hard problems, and why brainstorms are so annoying. SOURCE:Sarah Stein Greenberg, executive director of the Hasso Plattner Institute of Design at Stanford University. RESOURCES:Creative Acts for Curious People: How to Think, Create, and Lead in Unconventional Ways, by Sarah Stein Greenberg (2021).Noora Health.Civilla.Substantial.Rare.Sarah Stein Greenberg wildlife photography. EXTRAS:"Feeling Sound and Hearing Color," by People I (Mostly) Admire (2024)."Why Are Boys and Men in Trouble?" by People I (Mostly) Admire (2024)."What's Impacting American Workers?" by People I (Mostly) Admire (2024)."Richard Dawkins on God, Genes, and Murderous Baby Cuckoos," by People I (Mostly) Admire (2024)."The World's Most Controversial Ornithologist," by People I (Mostly) Admire (2024)."How PETA Made Radical Ideas Mainstream," by People I (Mostly) Admire (2024)."Pay Attention! (Your Body Will Thank You)," by People I (Mostly) Admire (2024)."How to Have Great Conversations," by People I (Mostly) Admire (2024)."Suleika Jaouad's Survival Mechanisms," by People I (Mostly) Admire (2024)."Daron Acemoglu on Economics, Politics, and Power," by People I (Mostly) Admire (2024)."Nobel Laureate Claudia Goldin on 'Greedy Work' and the Wage Gap," by People I (Mostly) Admire (2023)."A Rockstar Chemist and Her Cancer-Attacking 'Lawn Mower,'" by People I (Mostly) Admire (2022)."Daniel Kahneman on Why Our Judgment is Flawed — and What to Do About It," by People I (Mostly) Admire (2021)."Why Is Richard Thaler Such a ****ing Optimist?" by People I (Mostly) Admire (2021).

In her book, Rumbles, medical historian Elsa Richardson explores the history of the human gut. She talks with Steve about dubious medical practices, gruesome tales of survival, and the things that medieval doctors may have gotten right. SOURCE:Elsa Richardson, medical historian at the University of Strathclyde. RESOURCES:Rumbles: A Curious History of the Gut: The Secret Story of the Body's Most Fascinating Organ, by Elsa Richardson (2024).Michael Levitt retirement speech (2024)."Was There Really a Hawthorne Effect at the Hawthorne Plant? An Analysis of the Original Illumination Experiments," by Steven D. Levitt and John A. List (NBER Working Paper, 2009)."Floating Stools — Flatus versus Fat," by Michael D. Levitt and William C. Duane (The New England Journal of Medicine, 1972)."Factors Influencing Pulmonary Methane Excretion in Man," by John H. Bond, Rolf R. Engel, and Michael D. Levitt (Journal of Experimental Medicine, 1971).The Expression of the Emotions in Man and Animals, by Charles Darwin (1872).The Levitt Lab Founding School Leader, job listing.The Levitt Lab, information page. EXTRAS:"An Update on the Khan World School," by People I (Mostly) Admire (2023).“Is This the Future of High School?” by People I (Mostly) Admire (2022).“Sal Khan: ‘If It Works for 15 Cousins, It Could Work for a Billion People,'” by People I (Mostly) Admire (2021)."The Power of Poop," by Freakonomics Radio (2011).

How psychologist Dan Gilbert went from high school dropout to Harvard professor, found the secret of joy, and inspired Steve Levitt's divorce. SOURCE:Daniel Gilbert, professor of psychology at Harvard University. RESOURCES:"What the Data Says (and Doesn't Say) About Crime in the United States," by John Gramlich (Pew Research Center, 2020).Enlightenment Now: The Case for Reason, Science, Humanism, and Progress, by Stephen Pinker (2018)."Mistakenly Seeking Solitude," by Nicholas Epley and Juliana Schroeder (Journal of Experimental Psychology, 2014)."Just Think: The Challenges of the Disengaged Mind," by Timothy D. Wilson, David A. Reinhard, Erin C. Westgate, Daniel T. Gilbert, Nicole Ellerbeck, Cheryl Hahn, Casey L. Brown, and Adi Shaked (Science, 2013)."The End of History Illusion," by Jordi Quoidbach, Daniel T. Gilbert, and Timothy D. Wilson (Science, 2013).Happy Money: The Science of Smarter Spending, by Elizabeth Dunn (2013)."If Money Doesn't Make You Happy Then You Probably Aren't Spending It Right," by Elizabeth W. Dunn, Daniel T. Gilbert, and Timothy D. Wilson (Journal of Consumer Psychology, 2011).This Emotional Life, by Daniel Gilbert (2010).Stumbling on Happiness, by Dan Gilbert (2006)."Affective Forecasting," by Timothy D. Wilson and Daniel T. Gilbert (Advances in Experimental Social Psychology, 2003). EXTRAS:"Drawing from Life (and Death)," by People I (Mostly) Admire (2023)."Who Gives the Worst Advice?" by People I (Mostly) Admire (2021)."Sendhil Mullainathan Thinks Messing Around Is the Best Use of Your Time," by People I (Mostly) Admire (2021)."Am I Boring You?" by Freakonomics Radio (2015).

Moon Duchin is a math professor at Cornell University whose theoretical work has practical applications for voting and democracy. Why is striving for fair elections so difficult?  SOURCE:Moon Duchin, professor of mathematics at Cornell University. RESOURCES:"Gerrymandering: The Origin Story," by Neely Tucker (Timeless: Stories from the Library of Congress, 2024)."Redistricting for Proportionality," by Gabe Schoenbach and Moon Duchin (The Forum, 2023)."The Atlas Of Redistricting," by Aaron Bycoffe, Ella Koeze, David Wasserman, and Julia Wolfe (FiveThirtyEight, 2018)."In a Comically Drawn Pennsylvania District, the Voters Are Not Amused," by Trip Gabriel (The New York Times, 2018). EXTRAS:"Why Are Boys and Men in Trouble?" by People I (Mostly) Admire (2024)."Is This the Future of High School?" by People I (Mostly) Admire (2022).

The director of the Hayden Planetarium is one of the best science communicators of our time. He and Steve talk about his role in reclassifying Pluto, bad teachers, and why economics isn't a science. SOURCE:Neil deGrasse Tyson, director of the Hayden Planetarium. RESOURCES:Starry Messenger: Cosmic Perspectives on Civilization, by Neil deGrasse Tyson (2022).“The Universe and Beyond, with Stephen Hawking,” by Neil deGrasse Tyson (StarTalk, 2018).The Pluto Files: The Rise and Fall of America's Favorite Planet, by Neil deGrasse Tyson (2009)."Pluto's Not a Planet? Only in New York," by Kenneth Chang (The New York Times, 2001).The Sky Is Not the Limit: Adventures of an Urban Astrophysicist, by Neil deGrasse Tyson (2000).Merlin's Tour of the Universe, by Neil deGrasse Tyson (1989). EXTRAS:"Richard Dawkins on God, Genes, and Murderous Baby Cuckoos," by People I (Mostly) Admire (2024).

He's the chief creative officer of Pixar, and the Academy Award-winning director of Soul, Inside Out, Up, and Monsters, Inc. Pete Docter and Steve talk about Pixar's scrappy beginnings, why wrong turns are essential, and the movie moment that changed Steve's life. SOURCE:Pete Docter, chief creative officer of Pixar. RESOURCES:"‘Inside Out 2' Becomes the Highest-Grossing Animated Film of All Time Globally," (The Walt Disney Company, 2024).Soul, film (2020).The Red Turtle, film (2016).Inside Out, film (2015).Up, film (2009).Monsters, Inc., film (2001).Toy Story, film (1995).Paper Moon, film (1973). EXTRA:"Walt Hickey Wants to Track Your Eyeballs," by People I (Mostly) Admire (2024).

David Eagleman is a Stanford neuroscientist, C.E.O., television host, and founder of the Possibilianism movement. He and Steve talk about how wrists can substitute for ears, why we dream, and what Fisher-Price magnets have to do with neuroscience. SOURCE:David Eagleman, professor of cognitive neuroscience at Stanford University and C.E.O. of Neosensory. RESOURCES:Livewired: The Inside Story of the Ever-Changing Brain, by David Eagleman (2020)."Why Do We Dream? A New Theory on How It Protects Our Brains," by David Eagleman and Don Vaughn (TIME, 2020)."Prevalence of Learned Grapheme-Color Pairings in a Large Online Sample of Synesthetes," by Nathan Witthoft, Jonathan Winawer, and David Eagleman (PLoS One, 2015).Sum: Forty Tales from the Afterlives, by David Eagleman (2009).The vOICe app.Neosensory. EXTRAS:"What's Impacting American Workers?" by People I (Mostly) Admire (2024)."This Is Your Brain on Podcasts," by Freakonomics Radio (2016).

Boys and men are trending downward in education, employment, and mental health. Richard Reeves, author of the book Of Boys and Men, has some solutions that don't come at the expense of women and girls. Steve pushes him to go further. SOURCE:Richard Reeves, senior fellow at the Brookings Institution, president of the American Institute for Boys and Men, and author. RESOURCES:Of Boys and Men: Why the Modern Male Is Struggling, Why It Matters, and What to Do About It, by Richard Reeves (2022)."The Crisis of Men and Boys," by David Brooks (The New York Times, 2022).Dream Hoarders: How the American Upper Middle Class Is Leaving Everyone Else in the Dust, Why That Is a Problem, and What to Do About It, by Richard Reeves (2017)."An Empirical Analysis of the Gender Gap in Mathematics," by Roland Fryer and Steven Levitt (American Economic Journal: Applied Economics, 2010).John Stuart Mill: Victorian Firebrand, by Richard Reeves (2007) EXTRA:"What Is the Future of College — and Does It Have Room for Men? (Update)," by Freakonomics Radio (2024).

Daron Acemoglu was just awarded the 2024 Nobel Prize in economics. Earlier this year, he and Steve talked about his groundbreaking research on what makes countries succeed or fail. SOURCES:Daron Acemoglu, professor of economics at the Massachusetts Institute of Technology. RESOURCES:The Sveriges Riksbank Prize in Economic Sciences in Memory of Alfred Nobel 2024.Power and Progress: Our Thousand-Year Struggle Over Technology and Prosperity, by Daron Acemoglu and Simon Johnson (2023)."Economists Pin More Blame on Tech for Rising Inequality," by Steve Lohr (The New York Times, 2022)."America's Slow-Motion Wage Crisis: Four Decades of Slow and Unequal Growth," by John Schmitt, Elise Gould, and Josh Bivens (Economic Policy Institute, 2018)."A Machine That Made Stockings Helped Kick Off the Industrial Revolution," by Sarah Laskow (Atlas Obscura, 2017)."The Long-Term Jobs Killer Is Not China. It's Automation," by Claire Cain Miller (The New York Times, 2016).Why Nations Fail: The Origins of Power, Prosperity, and Poverty, by Daron Acemoglu and James A. Robinson (2012)."The Colonial Origins of Comparative Development: An Empirical Investigation," by Daron Acemoglu, Simon Johnson, and James A. Robinson (American Economic Review, 2001)."Learning about Others' Actions and the Investment Accelerator," by Daron Acemoglu (The Economic Journal, 1993)."A Friedman Doctrine — The Social Responsibility of Business Is to Increase Its Profits," by Milton Friedman (The New York Times, 1970). EXTRAS:"What's Impacting American Workers?" by People I (Mostly) Admire (2024)."'My God, This Is a Transformative Power,'" by People I (Mostly) Admire (2023)."New Technologies Always Scare Us. Is A.I. Any Different?" by Freakonomics Radio (2023)."How to Prevent Another Great Depression," by Freakonomics Radio (2020)."Is Income Inequality Inevitable?" by Freakonomics Radio (2017).

David Autor took his first economics class at 29 years old. Now he's one of the central academics studying the labor market. The M.I.T. economist and Steve dissect the impact of technology on labor, spar on A.I., and discuss why economists can sometimes be oblivious. SOURCES:David Autor, professor of economics at the Massachusetts Institute of Technology. RESOURCES:"Does Automation Replace Experts or Augment Expertise? The Answer Is Yes," by David Autor (Joseph Schumpeter Lecture at the European Economic Association Annual Meeting, 2024).“Applying AI to Rebuild Middle Class Jobs,” by David Autor (NBER Working Paper, 2024).“New Frontiers: The Origins and Content of New Work, 1940–2018,” by David Autor, Caroline Chin, Anna Salomons, and Bryan Seegmiller (The Quarterly Journal of Economics, 2024).“Bottlenecks: Sectoral Imbalances and the US Productivity Slowdown,” by Daron Acemoglu, David Autor, and Christina Patterson (NBER Macroeconomics Annual, 2024)."Good News: There's a Labor Shortage," by David Autor (The New York Times, 2021)."David Autor, the Academic Voice of the American Worker," (The Economist, 2019).“Why Are There Still So Many Jobs? The History and Future of Workplace Automation,” by David Autor (The Journal of Economic Perspectives, 2015).“The Growth of Low-Skill Service Jobs and the Polarization of the US Labor Market,” by David Autor and David Dorn (The American Economic Review, 2013).“The China Syndrome: Local Labor Market Effects of Import Competition in the United States,” by David Autor, David Dorn, and Gordon H. Hanson (The American Economic Review, 2013). EXTRAS:"What Do People Do All Day?" by Freakonomics Radio (2024)."Daron Acemoglu on Economics, Politics, and Power," by People I (Mostly) Admire (2024)."You Make Me Feel Like a Natural Experiment," by People I (Mostly) Admire (2022)."In Search of the Real Adam Smith," series by Freakonomics Radio (2022)."Max Tegmark on Why Superhuman Artificial Intelligence Won't be Our Slave," by People I (Mostly) Admire (2021)."Automation," by Last Week Tonight With John Oliver (2019).

Kate Douglass is a world-class swimmer and data scientist who's used mathematical modeling to help make her stroke more efficient. She and Steve talk about why the Olympics were underwhelming, how she won gold, and why she won't be upset to say goodbye to the pool. SOURCE:Kate Douglass, Olympic swimmer and graduate student.RESOURCES:"Kate Douglass HOLDS OFF Tatjana Smith to win 200m breaststroke | Paris Olympics" (NBC Sports, 2024).“The Plane Partition Function Abides by Benford's Law,” by Katherine Douglass and Ken Ono (UPB Scientific Bulletin, Series A, 2024).“Swimming in Data,” by Katherine Douglass, Augustus Lamb, Jerry Lu, Ken Ono, and William Tenpas (The Mathematical Intelligencer, 2024)."Why Some Olympic Swimmers Think About Math in the Pool," by Jenny Vrentas (The New York Times, 2024). EXTRAS:"The Language of the Universe," by People I (Mostly) Admire (2024).

Ken Ono is a math prodigy whose skills have helped produce a Hollywood movie and made Olympic swimmers faster. The number theorist tells Steve why he sees mathematics as art — and about his unusual path to success, which came without a high school diploma. SOURCE:Ken Ono, professor of mathematics and STEM adviser to the provost at the University of Virginia. RESOURCES:"‘Digital Twins' Give Olympic Swimmers a Boost," by Katherine Douglass, Augustus Lamb, Jerry Lu, Ken Ono, and William Tenpas (Scientific American, 2024)."Swimming in Data," by Katherine Douglass, Augustus Lamb, Jerry Lu, Ken Ono, and William Tenpas (The Mathematical Intelligencer, 2024)."Integer Partitions Detect the Primes," by William Craig, Jan-Willem van Ittersum, and Ken Ono (PNAS, 2024).The Man Who Knew Infinity, film by Matt Brown (2015)."Proof of the Umbral Moonshine Conjecture," by John F. R. Duncan, Michael J. Griffin, and Ken Ono (Research in the Mathematical Sciences, 2015)."Ramanujan's Ternary Quadratic Form," by Ken Ono and K. Soundararajan (Inventiones Mathematicae, 1997). EXTRA:"Richard Dawkins on God, Genes, and Murderous Baby Cuckoos," by People I (Mostly) Admire (2024).

Artist Wendy MacNaughton knows the difficulty of sitting in silence and the power of having fun. She explains to Steve the lessons she's gleaned from drawing hospice residents, working in Rwanda, and reporting from Guantanamo Bay. SOURCE:Wendy MacNaughton, artist and graphic journalist. RESOURCES:"What Happens if Two Complete Strangers Draw Each Other?" video by the National Gallery of Art (2024).How to Say Goodbye, by Wendy MacNaughton (2023)."How to Have Fun Again," by Wendy MacNaughton (The New York Times, 2022)."Inside America's War Court: Clothing and Culture at Guantánamo Bay," by Carol Rosenberg and Wendy MacNaughton (The New York Times, 2019)."Drawing the Guantánamo Bay War Court," by Wendy MacNaughton (The New York Times, 2019).Think Like a Freak, by Steve Levitt and Stephen Dubner (2014).DrawTogether.The Grown-Ups Table.Zen Caregiving Project.DrawTogether Strangers. EXTRAS:"Rick Rubin on How to Make Something Great," by People I (Mostly) Admire (2023)."Does Death Have to Be a Death Sentence?" by People I (Mostly) Admire (2022)."Sendhil Mullainathan Explains How to Generate an Idea a Minute (Part 2)," by People I (Mostly) Admire (2021)."Sendhil Mullainathan Thinks Messing Around Is the Best Use of Your Time," by People I (Mostly) Admire (2021).

Bestselling author James Nestor believes that we can improve our lives by changing the way we breathe. He's persuasive enough to get Steve taping his mouth shut at night. He explains how humans dive to depths of 300 feet without supplemental oxygen, and describes what it's like to be accepted into a pod of whales. SOURCES:James Nestor, author and journalist. RESOURCES:Breath: The New Science of a Lost Art, by James Nestor (2020).Deep: Freediving, Renegade Science, and What the Ocean Tells Us about Ourselves, by James Nestor (2014)."Open Your Mouth and You're Dead," by James Nestor (Outside Magazine, 2012)."The Brain on Sonar — How Blind People Find Their Way Around With Echoes," by Ed Yong (National Geographic, 2011)."How I Held My Breath for 17 Minutes," by David Blaine (TED Talk, 2009).Project CETI.datascience4everyone.org.

People for the Ethical Treatment of Animals founder Ingrid Newkirk has been badgering meat-eaters, fur-wearers, and circus-goers for more than 40 years. For a woman who's leaving her liver to the president of France in her will, she sounds quite sensible when she tells Steve what we can learn from animals, why she supports euthanasia, and who'll get her other organs.  SOURCE:Ingrid Newkirk, founding president of People for the Ethical Treatment of Animals. RESOURCES:"Paradoxical Gender Effects in Meat Consumption Across Cultures," by Christopher J. Hopwood, Jahn N. Zizer, Wiebke Bleidorn, et al. (Nature Scientific Reports, 2024)."PETA President Bequeaths Her Rump to a Reality Show," (PETA.org, 2023).Animalkind: Remarkable Discoveries about Animals and Revolutionary New Ways to Show Them Compassion, by Ingrid Newkirk (2020)."One Last U.S. Medical School Still Killed Animals to Teach Surgery. But No More," by Darryl Fears (The Washington Post, 2016)."The Naked and the Dead," by Katie Glass (The Times, 2013)."The Betrayal of 'No-Kill' Sheltering," by Ingrid Newkirk (PETA YouTube channel, 2013)."The Lab-Monkey Controversy That Launched the Animal-Rights Movement," by Caroline Fraser (The New Yorker, 1993). EXTRAS:"Suleika Jaouad's Survival Mechanisms," by People I (Mostly) Admire (2024)."Jane Goodall Changed the Way We See Animals. She's Not Done," by People I (Mostly) Admire (2022)."Peter Singer Isn't a Saint, But He's Better Than Steve Levitt," by People I (Mostly) Admire (2022)."Bruce Friedrich Thinks There's a Better Way to Eat Meat," by People I (Mostly) Admire (2021).Project Donor.

Revisiting Steve's 2021 conversation with the economist and MacArthur “genius” about how to make memories stickier, why change is undervalued, and how to find something new to say on the subject of scarcity. SOURCE:Sendhil Mullainathan, university professor of computation and behavioral science at the University of Chicago Booth School of Business. RESOURCES:"Fictional Money, Real Costs: Impacts of Financial Salience on Disadvantaged Students," by Claire Duquennois (American Economic Review, 2022)."Do Financial Concerns Make Workers Less Productive?" by Supreet Kaur, Sendhil Mullainathan, Suanna Oh, and Frank Schilbach (NBER Working Paper, 2022).Subtract: The Untapped Science of Less, by Leidy Klotz (2021)."Heads or Tails: The Impact of a Coin Toss on Major Life Decisions and Subsequent Happiness," by Steve Levitt (NBER Working Paper, 2016).Scarcity: Why Having Too Little Means So Much, by Sendhil Mullainathan and Eldar Shafir (2013)."The End of History Illusion," by Jordi Quoidbach, Daniel T. Gilbert, and Timothy D. Wilson (Science, 2013). EXTRAS:"Leidy Klotz on Why the Best Solutions Involve Less — Not More," by People I (Mostly) Admire (2021)."Sendhil Mullainathan Explains How to Generate an Idea a Minute," by People I (Mostly) Admire (2021).

Under his helm, the TED Conference went from a small industry gathering to a global phenomenon. Chris and Steve talk about how to build lasting institutions, how to make generosity go viral, and what Chris has learned about public speaking. SOURCE:Chris Anderson, head of TED. RESOURCES:Infectious Generosity: The Ultimate Idea Worth Spreading, by Chris Anderson (2024).TED Talks: The Official TED Guide to Public Speaking, by Chris Anderson (2016)."The Best Stats You've Ever Seen," by Hans Rosling (TED, 2006)."Do Schools Kill Creativity?" by Sir Ken Robinson (TED, 2006)."Close-Up Card Magic With a Twist," by Lennart Green (TED, 2005)."The Freakonomics of Crack Dealing," by Steve Levitt (TED, 2004).ZoeCoral.com. EXTRAS:"Giving It Away," by People I (Mostly) Admire (2022)."We Can Play God Now," by People I (Mostly) Admire (2022)."Self-Help for Data Nerds," by People I (Mostly) Admire (2022)."Steven Pinker: 'I Manage My Controversy Portfolio Carefully,'" by People I (Mostly) Admire (2020).

The former YouTube C.E.O. — and sixteenth Google employee — died on August 9, 2024. Steve talked with her in 2020 about her remarkable career, and how her background in economics shaped her work. SOURCES:Susan Wojcicki, former C.E.O. of YouTube. RESOURCES:"Susan Wojcicki, Former Chief of YouTube, Dies at 56," by John Yoon and Mike Isaac (The New York Times, 2024).

The author of the classic The Selfish Gene is still changing the way we think about evolution. SOURCE:Richard Dawkins, professor emeritus of the public understanding of science at Oxford University. RESOURCES:The Genetic Book of the Dead, by Richard Dawkins (2024).Flights of Fancy: Defying Gravity by Design and Evolution, by Richard Dawkins (2021)."About Three-in-Ten U.S. Adults Are Now Religiously Unaffiliated," by Gregory A. Smith (Pew Research Center, 2021).Cuckoo: Cheating by Nature, by Nick Davies (2015).The God Delusion, by Richard Dawkins (2006)."Why the Universe Seems So Strange," by Richard Dawkins (TED Global, 2005)."Surprising Stats About Child Carseats," by Steve Levitt (TED Global, 2005)."Genes and Memes," by John Maynard Smith (London Review of Books, 1982).The Extended Phenotype: The Long Reach of the Gene, by Richard Dawkins (1982).The Selfish Gene, by Richard Dawkins (1976)."Child Endowments and the Quantity and Quality of Children," by Gary Becker and Nigel Tomes (Journal of Political Economy, 1976)."Selective Pecking in the Domestic Chick," by Richard Dawkins (University of Oxford Ph.D. thesis, 1966). EXTRAS:"The World's Most Controversial Ornithologist," by People I (Mostly) Admire (2024)."Is Gynecology the Best Innovation Ever?" by People I (Mostly) Admire (2024).

Victoria Groce is the best trivia contestant on earth. The winner of the 2024 World Quizzing Championship explains the structure of a good question, why she knits during competitions, and how to memorize 160,000 flashcards. SOURCE:Victoria Groce, “The Queen” on the television game show The Chase. RESOURCES:The Chase, TV series (2013-2015, 2021-present).LearnedLeague.Anki. EXTRAS:"Ken Jennings on How a Midlife Crisis Led Him to Jeopardy! (Replay)," by People I (Mostly) Admire (2021)."Mayim Bialik on the Surprising Risks of Academia and Stability of Show Biz (Replay)," by People I (Mostly) Admire (2021).

Richard Prum says there's a lot that traditional evolutionary biology can't explain. He thinks a neglected hypothesis from Charles Darwin — and insights from contemporary queer theory — hold the answer. Plus: You won't believe what female ducks use for contraception.SOURCE:Richard Prum, professor of ornithology, ecology and evolutionary biology at Yale University. RESOURCES:"Stop Your Populist Grandstanding Over Wendy's ‘Surge Pricing'," by Catherine Rampell (The Washington Post, 2024)."Dynamic Pricing Tech May Brighten Retail Bottom Lines and Put Consumers in the Dark," by Kristin Schwab and Sofia Terenzio (Marketplace, 2024).Performance All the Way Down: Genes, Development, and Sexual Difference, by Richard Prum (2023).The Evolution of Beauty: How Darwin's Forgotten Theory of Mate Choice Shapes the Animal World — and Us, by Richard Prum (2017)."Duck Sex and the Patriarchy," by Richard Prum (The New Yorker, 2017)."Dinosaur Feathers Came before Birds and Flight," by Richard Prum and Alan Brush (Scientific American, 2014)."How Chickens Lost Their Penises (And Ducks Kept Theirs)," by Ed Yong (National Geographic, 2013)."Media Attacks Duck Genitalia Research," by Emma Goldberg (Yale Daily News, 2013)."Mate Choice and Sexual Selection: What Have We Learned Since Darwin?" by Adam G. Jones and Nicholas L. Ratterman (PNAS, 2009)."Development and Evolutionary Origin of Feathers," by Richard O. Prum (Journal of Experimental Zoology, 2002).The Blind Watchmaker: Why the Evidence of Evolution Reveals a Universe without Design, by Richard Dawkins (1986)."Display Behavior, Foraging Ecology, and Systematics of the Golden-Winged Manakin (Masius chrysopterus)," by Richard Prum and Ann Johnson (The Wilson Bulletin, 1987).The Selfish Gene, by Richard Dawkins (1976).The Descent of Man, and Selection in Relation to Sex, by Charles Darwin (1871). EXTRAS:"Is Gynecology the Best Innovation Ever?" by People I (Mostly) Admire (2024)."The Price of Doing Business with John List," by People I (Mostly) Admire (2022).

Thomas Hildebrandt is trying to bring the northern white rhinoceros back from the brink of extinction. The wildlife veterinarian tells Steve about the far-out techniques he employs, why we might see woolly mammoths in the future, and why he was frustrated the day the Berlin Wall came down. SOURCES:Thomas Hildebrandt, head of the department of reproduction management at the Leibniz Institute for Zoo and Wildlife Research and professor of wildlife reproduction medicine at the veterinary faculty of the Freie Universität Berlin. RESOURCES:"An Inside Look at the Embryo Transplant That May Help Save the Northern White Rhino," by Jeffrey Kluger (TIME, 2024)."Mud, Bugs, and Dung: How Rhinos Shape Their World," by Rinjan Shrestha (World Wildlife Fund, 2022)."The Last Two Northern White Rhinos On Earth," by Sam Anderson (The New York Times Magazine, 2021)."Embryos and Embryonic Stem Cells From the White Rhinoceros," by Thomas B. Hildebrandt, Robert Hermes, Cesare Galli, et al. (Nature Communications, 2018)."Loss of a Species – A Giant, Extinct," by Thomas Hildebrandt (TED, 2017).Colossal. EXTRAS:"Why Do We Still Teach People to Calculate?" by People I (Mostly) Admire (2024)."What's Stopping Us From Curing Rare Diseases?" by Freakonomics, M.D. (2023)."We Can Play God Now," by People I (Mostly) Admire (2022).

She is one of the best basketball players ever. She's won multiple championships, including five Olympic gold medals and four W.N.B.A. titles. She also helped negotiate a landmark contract for the league's players. Sue Bird tells Steve Levitt the untold truth about clutch players, her thoughts about the pay gap between male and female athletes, and what it means to be part of the first gay couple in ESPN The Magazine's Body Issue.   SOURCE:Sue Bird, former professional basketball player. RESOURCES:"‘We're Betting on Ourselves': Why WNBA's Landmark New Deal Is a Huge Win for Women's Professional Sports," by Percy Allen (The Seattle Times, 2020)."Sue Bird & Megan Rapinoe," (ESPN The Magazine Body Issue, 2018)."Missed Shots at the Free-Throw Line: Analyzing the Determinants of Choking Under Pressure," by Mattie Toma (Journal of Sports Economics, 2015). EXTRAS:"Marc Davis Can't Stop Watching Basketball — But He Doesn't Care Who Wins," by People I (Mostly) Admire (2021)."The Hidden Side of Sports," series by Freakonomics Radio (2018-19)."The True Story of the Gender Pay Gap," by Freakonomics Radio (2016).

Conrad Wolfram wants to transform the way we teach math — by taking advantage of computers. The Mathematica creator convinced the Estonian government to give his radical curriculum a try — so why is the rest of the world so resistant? SOURCE:Conrad Wolfram, strategic director and European cofounder/C.E.O. of Wolfram Research, and founder of computerbasedmath.org. RESOURCES:"In California, a Math Problem: Does Data Science = Algebra II?" by Amy Harmon (The New York Times, 2023).The Math(s) Fix: An Education Blueprint for the AI Age, by Conrad Wolfram (2020)."The Movement to Modernize Math Class," by Yoree Koh (The Wall Street Journal, 2020)."Math Rebels Invade Estonia With Computerized Education," by Klint Finley (Wired, 2013)."Do Left-Handed People Really Die Young?" by Hannah Barnes (BBC News, 2013)."Teaching Kids Real Math With Computers," by Conrad Wolfram (TED Talk, 2010). EXTRAS:"Bringing Data to Life," by People I (Mostly) Admire (2023)."Steven Strogatz Thinks You Don't Know What Math Is," by People I (Mostly) Admire (2023)."Mathematician Sarah Hart on Why Numbers are Music to Our Ears," by People I (Mostly) Admire (2021)."America's Math Curriculum Doesn't Add Up," by People I (Mostly) Admire (2021).

Ellen Langer is a psychologist at Harvard who studies the mind-body connection. She's published some of the most remarkable scientific findings Steve has ever encountered. Can we really improve our physical health by changing our mind? SOURCE:Ellen Langer, professor of psychology at Harvard University. RESOURCES:Brave New Words: How AI Will Revolutionize Education (and Why That's a Good Thing), by Sal Khan (2024)."F.D.A.'s Review of MDMA Cites Health Risks and Study Flaws," by Andrew Jacobs and Christina Jewett (The New York Times, 2024).The Mindful Body: Thinking Our Way to Chronic Health, by Ellen Langer (2023)."Physical Healing as a Function of Perceived Time," by Peter Aungle and Ellen Langer (Nature: Scientific Reports, 2023)."Aging as a Mindset: A Study Protocol to Rejuvenate Older Adults With a Counterclockwise Psychological Intervention," by Francesco Pagnini, Cesare Cavalera, Ellen Langer, et al. (BMJ Open, 2019).Counterclockwise: Mindful Health and the Power of Possibility, by Ellen Langer (2009)."Mind-Set Matters: Exercise and the Placebo Effect," by Alia Crum and Ellen Langer (2007)."The Effects of Choice and Enhanced Personal Responsibility for the Aged: A Field Experiment in an Institutional Setting," by Ellen Langer and Judith Rodin (Journal of Personality and Social Psychology, 1976). EXTRAS:"The Future of Therapy Is Psychedelic," by People I (Mostly) Admire (2023)."Extra: An Update on the Khan World School," by People I (Mostly) Admire (2023)."Is This the Future of High School?" by People I (Mostly) Admire (2022)."What It Takes to Know Everything," by People I (Mostly) Admire (2022)."Sal Khan: 'If It Works for 15 Cousins, It Could Work for a Billion People,'" by People I (Mostly) Admire (2021)."Greg Norman & Mark Broadie: Why Golf Beats an Orgasm and Why Data Beats Everything," by People I (Mostly) Admire (2021)."Caverly Morgan: 'I Am Not This Voice. I Am Not This Narrative,'" by People I (Mostly) Admire (2020)."Does 'As If' Thinking Really Work?" by No Stupid Questions (2020)."Havana Wild Weekend," S28.E7 of The Simpsons (2016). 

Author and YouTuber John Green thought his breakout bestseller wouldn't be a commercial success, wrote 40,000 words for one sentence, and brought Steve to tears. SOURCE:John Green, best-selling author and YouTube creator. RESOURCES:"The Deadliest Infectious Disease Isn't a Science Problem. It's a Money Problem," by John Green (The Washington Post, 2024).“Tuition Inflation Isn't as Bad as You Think,” by Felix Salmon (Axios, 2022).“Fast Facts: Expenditures,” by the National Center for Education Statistics (2022).“Trends in College Pricing and Student Aid 2021,” by the College Board (2021).“#37 John,” by Heavyweight (2021).The Anthropocene Reviewed: Essays on a Human-Centered Planet, by John Green (2021).“Scratch ‘n' Sniff Stickers and the Indianapolis 500,” by The Anthropocene Reviewed Podcast (2019).“How Joan of Arc Conquered Mark Twain,” by Ted Gioia (America: The Jesuit Review, 2018).Turtles All the Way Down, by John Green (2017).The Fault in Our Stars, film (2014).The Fault in Our Stars, by John Green (2012).Looking for Alaska, by John Green (2005).All the King's Men, by Robert Penn Warren and Noel Polk (1946).Harvey, film (1950).vlogbrothers, YouTube channel by John and Hank Green.Crash Course, YouTube channel by John and Hank Green. EXTRAS:“Peter Singer Isn't a Saint, But He's Better Than Steve Levitt,” by People I (Mostly) Admire (2022).“Freakonomics Radio Goes Back To School,” series by Freakonomics Radio (2022).

Suleika Jaouad was diagnosed with cancer at 22. She made her illness the subject of a New York Times column and a memoir, Between Two Kingdoms. She and Steve talk about what it means to live with a potentially fatal illness, how to talk to people who've gone through a tragedy, and ways to encourage medical donations. SOURCE:Suleika Jaouad, author. RESOURCES:"The Art of Survival," by Jennifer Senior (The Atlantic, 2024).American Symphony, film by Matthew Heineman (2023).Between Two Kingdoms: A Memoir of a Life Interrupted, by Suleika Jaouad (2021)."Max Ritvo, Poet Who Chronicled His Cancer Fight, Dies at 25," by John Schwartz (The New York Times, 2016).“Life, Interrupted,” column by Suleika Jaouad (The New York Times, 2012-2015).The Fault in Our Stars, by John Green (2012).Bright-sided: How Positive Thinking Is Undermining America, by Barbara Ehrenreich (2009).The Isolation Journals, newsletter by Suleika Jaouad. EXTRAS:"John Green's Reluctant Rocket Ship Ride," by People I (Mostly) Admire (2022)."Does Death Have to Be a Death Sentence?" by People I (Mostly) Admire (2022).

Caroline Paul is a thrill-seeker and writer who is on a quest to encourage women to get outside and embrace adventure as they age. She and Steve talk about fighting fires, walking on airplane wings, and finding awe in birdwatching. SOURCE:Caroline Paul, author and former firefighter. RESOURCES:Tough Broad: From Boogie Boarding to Wing Walking ― How Outdoor Adventure Improves Our Lives as We Age, by Caroline Paul (2024)."FAA Halts Sequim Wing-Walking Flights, Revokes Owner's Pilot License," by Dominic Gates (The Seattle Times, 2024)."How a Bit of Awe Can Improve Your Health," by Hope Reese (The New York Times, 2023).The Gutsy Girl: Escapades for Your Life of Epic Adventure, by Caroline Paul (2016)."Why Do We Teach Girls That It's Cute to Be Scared?" by Caroline Paul (The New York Times, 2016)."What if Age Is Nothing but a Mind-Set?" by Bruce Grierson (The New York Times Magazine, 2014).Lost Cat: A True Story of Love, Desperation, and GPS Technology, by Caroline Paul (2013)."The Cognitive Benefits of Interacting With Nature," by Marc G. Berman, John Jonides, and Stephen Kaplan (Psychological Science, 2008)."Longevity Increased by Positive Self-Perceptions of Aging," by Becca R. Levy, Martin D. Slade, Suzanne R. Kunkel, and Stanislav V. Kasl (Journal of Personality and Social Psychology, 2002).Fighting Fire, by Caroline Paul (1998). EXTRAS:"Is Fear Running Your Life?" by No Stupid Questions (2024)."Arnold Schwarzenegger Has Some Advice for You," by People I (Mostly) Admire (2024)."Should You Spend More Time in Nature?" by No Stupid Questions (2023)."Steven Pinker: 'I Manage My Controversy Portfolio Carefully,'" by People I (Mostly) Admire (2020).

Steve shows a different side of himself in very personal interviews with his two oldest daughters. Amanda talks about growing up with social anxiety and her decision not to go to college, while Lily speaks candidly about her battle with anorexia and the conversation she had with Steve that led her to seek treatment.  SOURCES:Lily Levitt, daughter of Steve Levitt.Amanda Levitt, daughter of Steve Levitt. RESOURCES:Can I Ask You a Question? by Amanda Levitt (2020)."Does “Early Education” Come Way Too Late?" Freakonomics Radio (2018).  EXTRAS:NEDA Crisis Support.

The economist Joseph Stiglitz has devoted his life to exposing the limits of markets. He tells Steve about winning an argument with fellow Nobel laureate Milton Friedman, why small governments don't lead to more freedom, and why he's not afraid to be an advocate. SOURCE:Joseph Stiglitz, professor at Columbia University and chief economist at the Roosevelt Institute. RESOURCES:The Road to Freedom: Economics and the Good Society, by Joseph Stiglitz (2024)."Equilibrium in Competitive Insurance Markets: An Essay on the Economics of Imperfect Information," by Michael Rothschild and Joseph Stiglitz (The Quarterly Journal of Economics, 2010)."Hirsh: The Missing Link on Obama's Economic Team," by Michael Hirsh (Newsweek, 2008).Globalization and Its Discontents, by Joseph Stiglitz (2002).Two Lucky People: Memoirs, by Milton Friedman and Rose Friedman (1998)."On Value Maximization and Alternative Objectives of the Firm," by Sanford Grossman and Joseph Stiglitz (The Journal of Finance, 1977). EXTRAS:"Remembering Daniel Kahneman," by People I (Mostly) Admire (2024)."Ninety-Eight Years of Economic Wisdom," by People I (Mostly) Admire (2023).