Podcasts about Greco

Selon l'Unicef, près de 400 millions d'enfants de moins de 5 ans subissent régulièrement des violences, qu'elles soient psychologiques ou physiques, dans le monde. Cela représente 6 enfants sur 10 sur cette tranche d'âge. Ces violences peuvent avoir des conséquences graves pour la santé, puisque cela peut aller jusqu'à une perte d'espérance de vie de 20 ans. (Rediffusion) Au-delà du traumatisme psychologique, quelles peuvent être les répercussions sur la santé d'un enfant victime de violences ? Ces situations appellent-elles une offre de soins spécifiques ?  Pr Céline Greco, cheffe du Centre d'évaluation et de traitement de la douleur de l'hôpital Necker-enfants malades, responsable d'une équipe de recherche sur la douleur de l'enfant à l'Institut Imagine. Fondatrice de l'association IM'PACTES et du 1ᵉʳ Centre d'Appui à l'Enfance en France  Retrouvez l'émission en entier ici : Créer des structures de soins adaptées aux enfants victimes de violences En France, une commission d'enquête parlementaire vient de publier au mois d'avril un rapport qui pointe les graves manquements, « la maltraitance institutionnelle & la faillite morale collective » des politiques publiques de protection de l'enfance, ces dispositifs censés protéger près de 400 000 enfants, dont la moitié sont placés en dehors de leur famille.  Face à ce constat accablant, comment améliorer le quotidien et la santé des enfants maltraités ou confiés par un tiers, sur décision de justice.  Une structure inédite va ouvrir à Paris, afin d'améliorer la prise en charge de ces enfants : le Centre d'Appui à l'Enfance, porté par l'association IM'PACTES.

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What Is/Are the Significance and Implications of His Coming? OR From "So What" to "What Now?" John 1:14-18

In this gripping episode of Gangland Wire, host Gary Jenkins sits down with Robert “Bob” Cooley, the Chicago lawyer whose extraordinary journey took him from deep inside the Outfit's criminal operations to becoming one of the federal government's most valuable witnesses against organized crime. Cooley pulls back the curtain on the hidden machinery of Chicago's underworld, describing how corruption, bribery, and violence shaped the Chicago Outfit's power in the 1970s and beyond. As a lawyer, gambler, and trusted insider, Cooley saw firsthand how mob influence tilted the scales of justice—often in open daylight. Inside the “Chicago Method” of Courtroom Corruption Cooley explains the notorious system of judicial bribery he once helped facilitate—what he calls the “Chicago Method.” He walks listeners through: How defense attorneys worked directly with Outfit associates to buy favorable rulings. The process of approaching and bribing judges. Why weak forensic standards of the era made witness discrediting the key mob strategy. His personal involvement in the infamous Harry Aleman murder case, where clear guilt was erased by corruption. Life in the Outfit: Gambling, Debt, and Mob Justice Cooley recounts his early days gambling with Chicago Outfit associates, including Marco D'Amico, Jackie Cerrone, and John DeFranzo. Notable stories include: The violent implications of unpaid gambling debts in mob circles. Tense interactions with bookmaker Hal Smith and the chaotic fallout of a bounced check involving mobster Eddie Corrado. How D'Amico often stepped in—sometimes with intimidation—to shield Cooley from harm. These stories reflect the daily volatility of life inside the Outfit, where money, fear, and loyalty intersect constantly. Bob Cooley has a great book titled When Corruption Was King where he goes into even greater detail and has many more stories from his life inside the Chicago Mob. Hit me up on Venmo for a cup of coffee or a shot and a beer @ganglandwire Click here to “buy me a cup of coffee” Subscribe to the website for weekly notifications about updates and other Mob information. To go to the store or make a donation or rent Ballot Theft: Burglary, Murder, Coverup, click here To rent ‘Brothers against Brothers’ or ‘Gangland Wire,’ the documentaries click here.  To purchase one of my books, click here. 0:06 Introduction to Bob Cooley 1:32 Life as an Outfit Gambler 2:00 My Relationship with Marco D’Amico 10:40 The Story of Hal Smith 11:05 A Dangerous Encounter 20:21 Meeting Sally D 22:23 A Contract on My Life 22:37 The Harry Alleman Case 34:47 Inside the Courtroom 51:08 The Verdict 52:26 Warning the Judge 53:49 The Case Against the Policewoman 58:36 Navigating the Legal Maze 1:08:14 The Outcome and Its Consequences 1:11:39 The Decision to Flip 1:24:38 A Father’s Influence 1:33:57 The Corruption Revealed 1:50:12 Political Connections 2:02:07 The Setup for Robbery 2:20:29 Consequences of Loyalty transcript [0:00] Hey, guys, my guest today is a former Chicago outfit associate named Robert Bob Cooley. He has a book out there titled When Corruption Was King. I highly recommend you get it if you want to look inside the Chicago outfit of the 1970s. Now, Bob’s going to tell us about his life as an outfit gambler, lawyer, and I use payoff to judges to get many, many not guilty verdicts. Now, I always call this the Chicago method. This happened for, I know, for Harry Ailman, a case we’re going to talk about, Tony Spolatro got one of these not-guilties. Now, the outfit member associate who is blessed to get this fix put in for him may be charged with a crime, even up to murder. And he gets a lawyer, a connected lawyer, and they’ll demand a bench trial. That means that only a judge makes the decision. A lawyer, like my guest, who worked with a political fixer named Pat Marcy. [0:53] They’ll work together and they’ll get a friendly judge assigned to that case and then they’ll bribe the judge. And all that judge needs is some kind of alibi witnesses and any kind of information to discredit any prosecution witnesses. Now, this is back in the olden days before you had all this DNA and all that kind of thing. So physical evidence was not really a part of it. Mainly, it was from witnesses. And they just have to discredit any prosecution witness. Then the judge can say, well, state hadn’t really proven their case beyond a reasonable doubt and issue a not guilty verdict and walk away. Now, our guest, Bob Cooley, is going to take us inside this world. [1:29] And it’s a world of beatings, murders, bribes, and other kinds of plots. He was a member of the Elmwood Park crew. He was a big gambler. He was a big loan shark. And he worked for a guy named Marco D’Amico, who was their gambling boss and loan shark in that crew. Among other bosses in this powerful crew were Jackie Cerrone, who will go on and become the underboss and eventually the boss for a short [1:55] period of time. and John no-nose DeFranzo, who will also go on to become the boss eventually. What was your relationship with Marco D’Amico? I talked about when I first came into the 18th district, when I came into work there, and they put me back in uniform, the first person I met was Rick Borelli. Rick Borelli, he was Marco’s cousin. [2:23] When I started gambling right away with Rick, within a couple of days, I’m being his face, and I’m calling and making bets. There was a restaurant across the street where every Wednesday and sometimes a couple days a week, I would meet with Ricky. And one of the first people he brought in there was Marco. Was Marco. And Marco would usually be with a person or two. And I thought they were just bookmakers. [2:55] And I started being friendly with him, meeting him there. Then I started having card games Up in my apartment And, Because now I’m making, in the very beginning, I’m making first $100 extra a week. And within a couple of weeks, I’m making $500, $600 extra a week. And within about a month, I’m making $1,000, sometimes more than that. So now I’m having card games, relatively big card games, because I’ve got a bankroll. I’ve got probably about $5,000, $6,000, which seemed like a lot of money to me. Initially uh and after a while that was a daily that was a daily deal but uh so we we started having card games up there and then we started socializing we started now he’d be at these nightclubs all the time when when i’d go to make my payoffs he was part of the main group there he was one of the call he was right he was right under jack right under at that time originally Jackie Cerrone, and then he was right under Johnny DeFranco. [4:07] But he was… And we became real good friends. We would double date and we spent a lot of time together. And we had these big card games. And that’s when I realized how powerful these people were. Because after one of the card games, there was somebody that was brought in, a guy named Corrado. I’m pretty sure his name was I can’t think of his first name, but Corrado was this person that somebody brought into the game. And after we finished playing cards, and I won all the time. I mean, I was a real good card player, and I wouldn’t drink. I’d supply liquor and food and everything, but I wouldn’t drink. And as the others drank, they were the same as at my office. After we finish up, this guy says, you want to play some? We can play maybe some gin. just human being. And he was there with another friend of his who just sat there and watched. So we played, not gin, but blackjack. We played and passed cards back and forth when you win. Then you’re the dealer and back and forth. And I lost, I think I lost about $4,000 or $13,000 to him. [5:26] I lost the cash that I had. I had cash about $5,000 or $6,000. And I gave him a check for the rest. You know, but everything I was doing was wrong, you know. Yeah, one of those nights. It’s in there. And it’s funny because you asked about Marco. [5:47] And I thought, you know, oh, well, and whatever. And I gave him a check. I said, no, it’s a good check. And it was. It was for my office. It was an office check that I gave him. And that next morning, I’m meeting with Ricky and with Marco at this restaurant across from the station before I go in and to work. And I said, son of a B. I said, you know, they had a bad night first ever. Marco wasn’t at that game, at that particular game. And what happened? I said, I blew about 12,000. Okay, but you? Wow. And I said, yeah, I said, one of the guys at the game played some, I played some blackjack with somebody. What was his name? Eddie, Eddie Corrado. Eddie Corrado. He said, that mother, he said, stop payment on the check. He said, stop payment on the check. He said, because it wasn’t nine o’clock. It was only like, you know, seven, you know, seven 30 or whatever. He said, and when he gets ahold of you, arrange to have him come to your house. Tell him you’ll have the money for him at your house. So that’s what I, that’s what I do. So I stopped payment on it probably about five after nine. I get a call from, from Mr. Corrado. You mother fucker. [7:17] I said, no, no. I said, there wasn’t enough money in the account. I said, I’m sorry. I said, all right, then I’ll be over. I said, no, no, no. I said, I’m in court right now. I said, I’m in court. I said, I’m going to be tied up all day. I’ll meet you at my place. I’ll meet you back there. Well, I’ll be there. You better have that. I want cash and you better have it. Okay. Oh, I’m sorry. I’m sorry. I’m at home. Marco comes in. And he was there with Tony and Tony was there and Ricky was there. And Ricky was there. And they come over a little ahead of time and he comes in. I live on the 27th floor. The doorbell rings. Up he comes with some big mustache. [8:00] I open the door. You better have the fucking money and whatever. And I try to look nervous. I try to look real nervous. and when you walk into my apartment you walk in and you see the kitchen right in front of you and to the left to the left you’ve got an area away and you’ve got the the kitchen wall blocking what’s behind it over there and these three guys are standing marco and you are standing right there alongside of it and and when he walks in behind me, He sees Marco and all but shit in his pants. When he sees Marco, he goes, and Marco, you motherfucker. And, you know, oh, I’m sorry. I’m sorry. I didn’t know he was with you. He says, how much money you got me right now? And, you know, he says, pull your pockets out. He had about, he had about three or 4,000 with him. [9:02] And he says, you give him that. He says, you, he says, you, and he says, you give him that right now. And you apologize to him. Oh, and he says, he says, and I may give you a number. I want you to call. He says, we can put you to work. Apparently this guy had done the same thing to them a few years before and got the beating of his life somebody brought him into one of their card games, did he have a technique a cheating technique or had some marked cards no it was a card mechanic he could play games with cards they call him a mechanic and, in fact the guy was great at it because he had his own plane and everything else. But again, he had moved from Chicago and had just come back in the area. And they mounted. And so anyhow, he leaves. And he leaves then, and Marco took the money. Marco took the money. Marco took the money. Typical Bob guy, man. [10:19] And I says, what about the cash I lost to him? He says, well, you lost that. He says, you lost that. That’s when I realized how powerful. That’s when I realized how powerful that [10:35] he was part of the mob, not only a part of it, but one of the operational. Yeah, important part of it. That brings to mind another unbelievable situation that occurred. [10:49] The, uh, this is probably the, we’ll know the year by when it happened. There was a bookmaker named Hal Smith. Oh yeah. I remember that name. He got, tell us about Hal Smith. [11:05] Well, Hal Smith was a, he was a big guy too. A real, a real big guy. I met him on Rush street. He knew I was a gambler. He knew that I was a big gambler and I started gambling with him. Thank you. And I was with him probably for about maybe five or six months. And I’d win with him. I’d lose with him. And he would take big places. He would take $5,000 a game for me. And as they say, so the numbers were big. At the end of the week, we were sometimes $60,000, $70,000. [11:42] They were big numbers back and forth. And he was always good for the money. I was always good for the money. And one particular week, it was about $30,000. And I was waiting for money. Somebody else was supposed to give me even more than that. And the person put me off. And it was a good friend of mine. And I knew the money would be there. But a lot of times, these guys are going to collect it at a certain time. And then they’re expecting to give it to somebody else. Well, he was short. So I said, look, I don’t have it right now, but I’ll have it tomorrow, I said, because I’m meeting somebody. Well, okay, it better be there. [12:31] And look, it’ll be there, okay? Not a problem. So the next day, the person I’m supposed to get it from says, I’ll have it in a couple of hours. I don’t have it right now, but I’ll have it by late this afternoon. And I’m in my office when Hale Smith calls me and I said, I’ll have it a little bit later. And he slams the phone bell. I’m downstairs in Counselor’s Row. In fact, I’m meeting with Butchie and Harry. We’re in a booth talking about something. They had just sent me some business or whatever, but I’m talking about something. And George, the owner of the restaurant, comes over and he says, somebody is asking who you are and they want to talk to you. And they point out this guy. It was a guy I had seen before, because a lot of times at two in the morning, I would go down on West Street, and they had entertainment upstairs. And there was this big English guy. He was an English guy, as you could tell by his accent, a real loud guy. And when I walk up to talk to him, and he’s talking loud enough so people can hear him, and he says, you better have that. I’m here for it. You better have that. You better have that money. [13:51] Bob Hellsmith sent me, you get the money and you better have that money or there’s going to be a problem or whatever. And I said, well, the money will be there, but people can hear what this guy, this guy talking that shit. And he leaves. And he leaves. He’s going to call me back. And he leaves. I said, I’m busy right now. I says, give me a call back when I’m in the office and I’ll meet with you. So Butch, he goes, what was that all about? And I said, you know, it’s somebody I owe some money to. Well, who is he? Who is he with? I said, Harold Smith. And he said, who’s Harold Smith? You don’t pay him anything. He said, you don’t pay him anything. And he calls, when he calls back, he says, you will arrange to meet him. And I said, you know, I said, well, where? [14:44] And they knew where I lived. They’d been to my place at that time. I’m living in Newberry Plaza and they said, there’s a, there’s a Walgreens drugstore in Chicago Avenue. Tell him you’ll meet him there at Walgreens, and we’ll take it. And he says, and we’ll take it from there. When he does call me, I said, look, I said, I’ll meet you tomorrow morning for sure at Walgreens. I’ll have the cash. I said, I’ll have the cash, and I’ll have all of it. I said, but, you know, I’m tied up on some things. I said, I’ll go to my own bank when I’m finished here and whatever, and I’ll see you tomorrow morning for sure at 9 o’clock tomorrow morning. Okay. I sit down with them and they just said, I said, they said, go there and go meet them. And we’ll take care of it. The Walgreens is a store right in the corner of Michigan Avenue and Chicago Avenue, south side of the street. And it’s all windows. Huge windows here. Huge windows here. And a bus stop, a bus stop over here. When I get there, I park in the bus stop and I’m looking to my right and here he is sitting in a booth by himself, right by the window. And I look around and I don’t see anybody. I mean, with a lot of people, I don’t see Butchie. [16:06] Uh or red or anybody around but i i go in there anyhow and uh sit down and i uh sit down in the booth across from him and he’s eating breakfast he’s got some food in front of him and uh the girl comes by right away the girl comes by and i says you know just get me a coke and and he says have you got the money and i said yes and why i got i got a lot i got a lot of money in my pocket but not the, whatever it was he wanted, not the 27 or 28,000. There’s nobody there. And, uh, so we’re talking for no more than about two or three minutes. They had a telephone on the counter. I hear the phone ring and the waitress, the waitress is on the phone. And then she comes walking over and she says, it’s a call for you. And, and when I go get in the phone, I woke up and there’s a phone booth there. And here’s Butchie in the phone booth. And he’s there with a couple of other people. I hang the phone up. I walk over and I had my appointment booked. And I walk over and I just pick up the book. And as I’m walking out there, walking in, we pass each other. And so now when I get in my car and he’s looking at me in my car and right next to him is Butchie. And across from him was a red old male and Fat Herbie. [17:34] Herbie Blitzstein? Herbie Blitzstein? No, it wasn’t Herbie. This is another one. That’s one thing of Herbie. We called Herbie Fat. It was Fat Herbie. And the third guy is like sitting facing him. This is like, that weighs about 300 pounds. Oh, Sarno. Make Mike Sarno. Mike Sarno. That was it. And that’s, that’s, that’s who it was. You know, and I, I drive off, go to my office and go about my business. I get a call later that day from, uh, Hale Smith. Where’s my money? Where’s my money? I said, I gave it to your guy. You what? I gave it to him. I met him at nine o’clock this morning and I gave him the money. You did. And I said, yeah. Um, okay. And he hangs, and he hangs up. I don’t hear anything for a while. I never saw him again. I saw Hale a couple of times because he was always in one of the other restaurants. I lived in Newberry right across from there, but he never talked to me. I never talked to him, never said anything. It was about maybe it had to be a good couple of months later, When I read about Hale, Hale’s no longer with us. [18:52] That’s obviously how they found out about him. I never saw the other guy again. I’m hoping they didn’t kill him, but I’m assuming that’s what probably happened to him. In a public place like that, they probably just scared him off. He probably said, you know, I’m way over my head. I’m out of here. [19:15] They didn’t kill him in the public place he wouldn’t have been in the newspapers my little thought is like with the three guys they took him for a ride, I don’t know they just told him to leave town and he realized what it was and he did Hal didn’t get a chance to leave town Hal had other problems if I remember right I’d have to look it back up but he had other problems with the outfit what I found out later what they had done, was they had gotten one of their guys connected with him to find out who his customers were. In other words, one of the other people that he didn’t realize, that Hale didn’t realize was with them, they got him connected with them where he’s the one who’s doing his collecting and finding out who the customers were because they wanted to get all his customers as well as his money. It turns out he was He was a huge bookmaker for years. That’s what happened to him. And they just took his book. Yeah, I remember something about that story because I killed him in his house, I believe. Yeah, Sally D. [20:22] Sally D, yeah. Sally D was one. When I first met Sally D, he was with Marco’s Fruit, too. [20:30] He owned a pizza place up on the north side, north shore, and I broke him. I was betting with him and beating him week after week. And one of the last times I played with him, he couldn’t come up with the money. It took him an extra couple of weeks to get the cash to pay me. But we were real close friends with him. He’s a bizarre character because he was a totally low level at that time. Yeah. When he then connected up with the Cicero crew, with Rocky and Felice, with Rocky and those people, he became a boss with them. It turns out it was after they killed Al Smith. He was part of all that. That’s Salih De Laurentiis. He’s supposed to be a boss. He moved on up after the Family Secrets trial. He didn’t go down with that, I believe, and he kind of moved on up after that. I don’t know what happened to him. What was so funny about that, when he would come into the club, Marco’s club, Bobby Abinati. [21:42] Who was strictly a very low-level player, although we indicted him with the Gambia star. He’s the one who set up the robbery. Would that have been great if that would have gone through? He’s the one who set up that robbery in Wisconsin. He’d be making fun of Salihide all the time. [22:03] When Salihide would come in, he would make fun of him and joke about him and talk about what a loser he was. This is when he’s a boss of that crew. I mean, just a strange, I mean, nobody talked to bosses like that, especially when, when you’re, when you’re what they call Bobby, you know, what was Marco’s nickname for Bobby Knucklehead? [22:23] That was his nickname, Knucklehead. Pat Marcy, uh, contacted me about, you know, handling me in the only own case. [22:32] I couldn’t have been happier because that was a short time after they put a contract on me. So now i realized if they’re going to be making money you know they finally stopped because for good six seven months when i when i came back to chicago uh i was checking under my car every day in case there was a bomb i moved i moved from uh from a place that i own in the suburbs into an apartment complex so i wouldn’t be living on the first floor yeah it’d be impossible to somebody to break into my, you know, took them thrashing into my place. I changed my whole life around in that sense. [23:10] And when I drove everywhere I went, you know, I would go on the highway and then jump over. I would do all, I wanted to make absolutes. Even though nobody came around, I wasn’t taking any chances for a long period of time. And that was too when it cost me a fortune because that’s when I stopped dealing with the bookmakers because I wasn’t going to be in a position where I had to go meet somebody at any time to collect my money and whatever. [23:39] So what had happened, though, was somebody came to see me. And when I was practicing, there’s a lot of things I wouldn’t do. I set my own rules. I would not get involved. After the Harry Alleman case, I never got involved anymore myself fixing certain cases. But even prior to that, I wouldn’t fix certain cases. I wouldn’t get involved in certain cases, especially involving the police, because my father was such a terrific policeman, and I felt I was too in a lot of sentences. I loved the police. I disliked some of the crooked cops that I knew, but on the surface, I’d be friendly with them, etc. Harry Ailman was a prolific hitman for the Elmwood Park crew. He killed a teamster who wouldn’t help set up trucks for the outfit, a guy named Billy Logan. He was just a regular guy. He’s going to take us right into the meeting with the judge. He’ll take us into a counselor’s row restaurant where these cases were fixed. Now, Bob will give us a seat right at Pat Marcy’s table. Now, Pat Marcy was the first ward fixture, and he’s going to take us into the hallway with Pat Marcy where they made the payoffs. [24:57] Now, Bob, can you take us inside the famous Harry Aileman murder case? I know you fixed it. And tell us, you know, and I know there was a human toll that this took on that corrupt judge, Frank Wilson. Okay. The Harry Aileman case was, it was not long after I became partners with Johnny DeArco. I get a call from, I’m in Counselor’s Row at the restaurant. Whenever I was in there now, my spot was the first ward table. Nobody was allowed to sit there day or night. That was reserved for first ward connected people and only the top group of people. [25:40] I’m sitting there at the table and Johnny DeArco Sr. Tells me, you know, Pat wants to talk to you. About something. And I said, you know, sure. Not long afterwards, Pat comes downstairs. We go out. We go out in the hall because we never talk at the table. And he tells me, have you got somebody that can handle the Harry Alleman case? I had seen in the news, he was front page news. He was one of the main mob hitmen. He was partners with Butchie Petrucelli. But it was common knowledge that he was a hitman. He looked like one. He dressed like one. He acted like one. And whatever. And he was one. In fact, he was the one that used to go to New York. And I know he also went to Arizona to do some hits and whatever. He traveled around the country. I said to Pat, they thought the case was a mob hit on a team street. a teamster. I assumed that it was just that. It was people doing what they do. But I said to Pat, I said, well, get me the file. Get me the file. Let me see what the case looks like. Because I would never put a judge in a bad spot. That was my nature. [27:06] When I had cases, a lot of these judges were personal friends of mine. What I would do, if I wanted to have a case, if I wanted to fix a case to save all the time of having to go to a damn long trial, I would make sure that it was a case that was winnable, easily winnable. When I got the file, when I got the file from Pat, he got me the file the next day. The next morning, when he came in, he gave me the file. I looked at the file. It was a throw-out case. When I say throw-out case, absolutely a nothing case. [27:46] The records in the file showed that a car drove up down the street. Suddenly somebody with a shotgun blasted a guy named Billy Logan in front of his house and drove away. They were contacted by a neighbor, this guy, Bobby Lowe. Was it Bobby Lowe? Yeah, I’m pretty sure Bobby Lowe. Who indicated that he opened the door and let his dog run out. And when he looked, he saw somebody. He saw a car, and he gave a description of the car. And he saw somebody pull up, and he saw him shoot with a shotgun. And then he saw the person get out of the car and shoot him with a .45, and shoot him with a .45. And then the car sped away. That was pretty much the case. Some other people heard some noise, looked out, and saw a car driving away. A period of time after that, it had to be about a year or so after that, somebody was arrested driving to Pennsylvania to kill somebody. There was a guy who stopped. [29:16] Louie Almeida was his name. Louie Almeida was stopped in his car. He was on the way to Pennsylvania. And in front of his car, he had shotguns. And he winds up, when he gets arrested, he winds up telling the authorities that he can tell them about a mob murder back in Chicago and winds up cooperating with them. He indicates what happened. He indicated that, you know, he was asked to, you know, or he got involved in it. He got the car and whatever. They did this. They did that. And he pulled up alongside Billy and wound up shooting the victim as he came out of the house. [30:09] Now, I look at some other reports in there, some reports that were made out, new reports. They talk about the Louis Almeida. They talk about the witness that gave the first statement. and they said that they found, or he’s giving us a new statement now where he says he’s walking his dog. He hears a shotgun. His dog runs towards the car where the shooting was coming from. He saw Harry get out of the car and walk over and shoot him, walk over and shoot the victim, and he was looking at him, And then he jumped in the bushes and the car drove away. A complete new story. Yeah. A complete new story. And. I looked at the reports, and this is an easy winner. And so I told Pat, you know, I’ll take it. You know, I’m sure I can handle it. I said, I’m sure I can handle it, but, you know, I’ll let you know. [31:21] That’s when I contacted, I met my restaurant, Greco’s, and I had Frank Wilson there a lot. Well, I called Frank Wilson, invited him and his wife to come to the restaurant. I had done that many times before. When he gets there, I tell him, I have the case. You know, I told him I was contacted on this case, I said. And I said, it’s an easy winner, I said. And I explained to him what it was. I told him, you know, it’s the driver of the car who’s doing this to help himself. And this other guy, Bobby Lowe, that gave a complete new story from the original story that he gave. And I indicated, you know, can you handle the case? And he tells me, I can’t handle the case, he said, because I was SOJ’d. In Chicago, Illinois, they have a rule that makes it easy for people to fool around because for no reason at all you can ask to have a judge moved off the case. And you can name a second judge that you don’t want to handle the case. [32:34] Frank Wilson’s reputation was as such that the lawyer that turned out to be a judge later on, Tom Maloney, who had the case, named him in the SOJ. It was assigned to somebody else, and he indicated he wanted any other judge except Frank Wilson. Frank Wilson on the case. And this was Harry Aileman’s lawyer. Yeah. Okay. And who Tom Maloney, who then ends up being the judge years later. But yeah. Well, because we knew he was going to be a judge. Yeah. We knew ahead of time. I knew at that time. That’s what makes the story so unbelievably interesting. Yeah. Anyhow, he says, I can’t do it because… In Chicago, in Chicago, it’s supposed to keep it honest. I love this. To keep it honest. Yeah. To keep it honest, each judge is supposed to be picked by computer. [33:33] Same thing they’re doing to this day. Trump wondered why the same judge kept getting all his cases. Because they’re doing the same thing we did, some of us could do in Chicago. He was the chief judge in the area. he said to me, I don’t think I can get the case. I don’t think I can’t get the case. I said, I’ll get the case to you. I said, I’ll get, because I already, I, in fact, through Pat Marcy, anytime I wanted a case to go anywhere, I would contact Pat and I’d give him a thousand dollars and he would get me any judge I wanted. Uh, I said, well, I think I can. I said, I said, And I gave him $1,000. [34:16] I said, here, this is yours. And if I can’t get the case to you, you keep it. If I can’t get, I never said to him, will you fix it? Will you this or that? I mean, he understood what it was. I didn’t know how he would react to it. When I asked him, would you handle it? Were the words I used. I had never fixed anything with him before. [34:43] In case he was, you know, he would want to report it to somebody. I wasn’t worried because Frank had a reputation as being a big drinker. After I got the Harry Elliman file, Pat tells me, I’m going to have somebody come and talk to you. Who comes? And we meet in the first ward office, and then we go downstairs into the special room they had for conversations. It’s Mike Ficarro. He’s the head of the organized crime section. He’s the one who prosecutes all the criminals. He’s one of the many prosecutors in Chicago. That’s why there were over 1,000 mob murders and never a conviction from the time of Al Capone. Not a single conviction with over 1,000 mob murders because they controlled absolutely everything. He’s the boss. [35:35] I knew him. I didn’t like him. He had an attitude about him. You know, when I would see him at parties and when I’d see him at other places, and I’d walk by and say, hi, he just seemed coldish. [35:47] I found out later why. He was jealous of the relationship I had with all these people. [35:54] He says, I’ll help you any way I can, anything you need, whatever. So the prosecutors on the Harry Olliman case were our people. That’s who’s prosecuting the case anyhow. But they couldn’t get one of their judges apparently who would handle the case. So, but anyhow, uh, so, uh, when we, um, when we go, when we, when we go to trial, um. [36:25] Before to help me out, I told Pat, I’ll get somebody else to handle the case. I’ll have somebody else. I said, I won’t go in there. I won’t go in there because everybody knows I’m close to Frank, very close to Frank. I said, so I won’t go in there. I’ll get somebody. He says, no, no. He said, I’ll get somebody. And so he gets a guy named Frank Whalen, who I didn’t know at the time. He was a retired lawyer from Chicago. He was one of the mob lawyers. [37:00] He was one of the mob lawyers. And he lived in Florida. He lived in Miami. I think it was, no, Lauderdale. He lived in the Lauderdale area. He was practicing there. So I fly out. I fly out to meet him. I i do all the investigating in the case the i’m using an investigator that harry alleman got from me in fact he was the same investigator that got in trouble in in uh in in hollywood for what for a lot of stuff i can’t think of his name right now but he’s the one who got indicted in hollywood eventually for you know wiretapping people and whatever it was the same one. And he got me information on Bobby on this Bobby Lowe. He found out Bobby Lowe, Bobby Lowe was a drug addict. [37:59] When the FBI got a hold of him, Bobby Lowe was living out in the street because he had been fired from his first job. He had a job in some kind of an ice cream company where they made ice cream, and he got fired there for stealing. And then he had a job after that in a gas station, and he faked a robbery there. Apparently, what he did was he called the police and said he had been robbed. This is before they had cameras and all the rest of that stuff. He said he had been robbed. And somebody happened to have been in the gas station getting gas. It was a big place, apparently. [38:45] And when the police talked to him, he said, I didn’t see anything strange. He said, I saw the attendant walk out to the back about 10, 15 minutes ago. I saw him walk out to the back of the place and then come back in. And so they go out, and he had his car parked behind it, and they found the money that was supposed to have been stolen in the car. So not the best witness, in other words. Well, that’s an understatement, because that was why… That was why now he suddenly shows up, and they know all this. The FBI agents that obviously know all this, that’s their witness. That’s their case. To me, it’s an airtight, you know. Yeah. Anyhow, I developed the defense. I went back to see Frank a second time. I flew out to Florida a second time, gave him all this information. [39:48] I had talked to some other people to a number of people that were going to indicate that Harry played golf with them that day see how they remembered not golf but he was at a driving range with them with about five people they remember what they were three or four years three or four years before that what I also found out now, and I didn’t know and it changed my whole attitude on that this wasn’t a mob killing you, This guy that he killed was married to his, I think it was his cousin or some relation was married. I’m pretty sure it was to his cousin. She had told Harry, I got this from Butchie, Butchie Petrosselli, who had become a close friend of mine after I got involved with Harry’s case, his partner. And that was why he killed them, because apparently the sister, his sister-in-law, whatever she was, had told him, you know, when he was beating her up, she had said, well, my Harry Alameda won’t be happy about this. And he said, supposedly, he said, fuck that, Kenny. [41:02] And that’s why the shooting took place. Wow. This changed me. You know, I’m in the middle of it. There’s no getting out of it now. Yeah, they’ll turn it back. And by now, I’m running around all the time with Butch and Mary at night. I’m meeting them at dinner. They’re coming to one of my places where I have dinners all the time. You know, I’m becoming like close friends, close friends with both of them. Yeah. So anyhow, but anyhow, the lawyer that he got, Frank Whalen, who was supposed to be sharp, turned out like he was not in his, let’s just say he was not in his prime. [41:46] Charitable. And when he went in, you know, while the trial was going on, you know, while the trial was going on, I get a call from Frank. From Frank Wilson, because I told him, you don’t come back into the restaurant now. You don’t come back into the restaurant. I used his office as my office all the time, along with a bunch of other judges. I had a phone, but it cost about a dollar a minute to talk on my phone. I had to talk on my phone. So when I’d be at 26th Street in the courthouse, even though no lawyers are allowed back there in the chamber, so I’m back there sitting at his desk using the phone taking care of my own other business. I stopped going in there while the trial was going on. [42:35] So, anyhow, he calls me, and he wants to meet me at a restaurant over on Western Avenue. And, okay, he called me from one of the pay phones out there in front of the courthouse, and I go to meet him. What did he want? Was he complaining about the lawyer, Waylon? What was he complaining about, Waylon? and I was screwing it up. [42:59] When I meet him, I said, you know, he’s like, you know, he said, you know, we go into the bathroom and he and he said he’s all shooken up. He says, this is going to cost me my job. He said, he said, you know, they’re burying him. You’re burying him. You know, because I had given this information on the two witnesses. And he says, Frank Whalen, he said, isn’t doing a thing and cross-examining these people and whatever. [43:32] And he says, and he’s all upset. And I said, Frank, no, I’m shook up one of the few times in my life where it’s something I can’t handle. He had never told me, you know, I’ll fix the case, never. And I said to him, and I said, Frank, I said, if something goes wrong, I said, I’m sure they’re going to kill me, is what I said to him. Yeah. I said, if something goes wrong, I’m sure they’re going to kill me. And I left. I left the bathroom. Now, I have no idea what’s going on in his mind and whatever. Yeah. I see Pat the next day. And by something goes wrong in this case, you mean if he gets found guilty, that’d be what would go wrong and you would get killed. Is that that’s what you mean? Well, no question, because when I met, I didn’t go into that. I met with Harry Alleman. I get a call after I got involved in the case. A couple days later, I get a call from Markle. Meet me at one of the nightclubs where I was all the time at night with these people. [44:47] Above it, you’ve got a motel, a bunch of hotel rooms. I get a call from Markle. The reason everybody loved me and the mob, I never discussed what I was doing with anybody or any of the other dozens of mobsters I run with that I was involved in Harry’s case. Never said a word to anybody about any of this. That was my nature, and that’s why all these people love me. I never talked about one thing with anybody else or whatever. He says, I want to meet you. When I get over there, he says, let’s go upstairs. Somebody wants to talk to you. And we go upstairs, and there’s Harry Alleman. And Harry, how you doing? How are you? [45:27] And he says, listen, you’re sure about this? And I said, yeah. I said, I’m sure. And he said, well, if something goes wrong, you’re going to have a problem. Those were his words to me. You’re going to have a problem. And I said, you know, he says, because this judge, he says, this judge is a straight judge. And he said, Tom, you mean Tom Maloney. He says, and Tom wants to handle my case. And he tells me he’s going to be named a judge by the Supreme Court real soon. And he wants to handle and he wants to handle my case before he… Uh, you know, before he becomes a Supreme court, before he becomes a judge, I knew the moment he told me that I knew for sure that was the case because we control everything, including the Supreme court. I said, you know, I said, don’t, you know, don’t worry about it. I lied to him. And I said, uh, I said, yeah, the judge is going to, I said, yeah, he’s going to throw it out. He knows, I said, he knows what’ll happen if he doesn’t. That’s what I told Harry. I want to keep him happy. [46:34] I’m going to keep him happy probably for a few hours I’m a little nervous and then that’s all behind me like so many other problems I got in the middle of oh my god talking about walking a tightrope so now the lawyer came into Chicago he was in Chicago I met him when he came in he was staying at the Bismarck was at the Bismarck Hotel right around the corner from you know where Counselor’s Row was that’s where he was staying in the in the hotel right there by the first board office and there was a way to go in there without being seen and there was a, You go through another restaurant and you go through the alley and go up there. And I wouldn’t, I didn’t want to be seen walking into there because I know the FBI are probably, are probably watching and whatever. When he comes into town, they handle the case. So I go upstairs to see him. You know, I said, what the hell’s going on in court? He says, I’m going, it’s going great. It’s going great. I said, it’s going great. I just, you know, I just got a call last night. I had to go meet the judge. And he said, you’re not doing any cross-examining. Oh, I’m doing a great job. You know, I’m doing a great job. So after a few minutes of, I leave. Yeah. [47:52] That’s when I saw Pat Marcy, too. And I said, Pat, I said, the judge is upset about whatever’s going on. I said, maybe we should give him some more because I agreed to give him $10,000. And he said, you know, what a piece of work he is. You know, he said $10,000, and that’s all he’s going to get, not a nickel more or whatever. So now to say I’m nervous again is an ultra statement. The case, I walked over, and I wouldn’t go in the room, but I wanted to just be around that room for some reason. FBI agents all over the place. [48:30] FBI agents all over the place. And so now I’m at home and I’m packed. I’ve got my bags packed because if he finds it, I don’t know what he’s going to do. I’m worried he might find him guilty because of all that had happened. He, when the trial ended a given night, and the next day he was going to give the result. In fact, I didn’t go out and play that night. I was a little nervous, and I stayed home, and I packed up my bags. I packed up my bags, and about 9 o’clock, I got in the car, and I started driving. And by the time he gave the ruling, I was probably about 100, maybe 150 miles away. And I hear on the radio, you know, found him not guilty, found him not guilty. So I turn around. Hit the next exit, turn around and come back. I turn around. Northbound on I-55. [49:27] Probably a couple hours later, here I am parked in my parking spot. My parking spot was in front of my office, right across from City Hall. And I parked in the mayor’s spot when she wasn’t there. And drove probably to drive her crazy. But that was where I parked. That was my parking spot. We’d see my big car with the RJC license plates parked in the bus stop. And so here I am. I parked the car and I go in. I go in. [50:01] And I’m sure Pat told some people, probably not, but I’m sure they told all the mobsters, all the top mobsters, because these guys all wanted to meet me afterwards and get the restaurant. I go in to see them. We walked into the janitor’s closet. You walk out of Counselor’s Row. You go to the left. It goes into the 100 North Building. Now, you’ve got the elevators to the right. And behind that, you’ve got a closet where the janitors keep all their stuff. And you’ve got some stairs leading up to the, there was a, what do you call it? There was an office there where the commodities, big commodity exchange was right there. that there was a stairway leading up to where the offices were with some doors with bars and everything on it. And Pat is standing on those stairs, about two or three stairs. You know, I said, wow. I said, you know, everybody’s going nuts. And he goes, well, you know, you did a good job. And he gives me an envelope. He gives me an envelope. And, you know, I put the money in my pocket. [51:09] We said we had some more. We said a couple other words about, you know, this and that. And then I just go in there. I go back in the counselor’s. [51:21] Now, after the feds started getting indictments, did you try and warn the Aleman case judge, Frank Wilson? Why did you do that? And when I went to see Frank Wilson, I went to help him. I said, Frank, I said, look, I said, I was contacted by, I said, I was contacted by the, by the, by the FBI. They were investigating the Harry Aleman case. I said to him, I said, they, they feel the case was fixed. I said, when they come to see me, I said, you know, I said, I’m not going to talk to them. I said, I’m not going to talk to them. I’m going to take the fifth. And in your case, you can do the same thing. When they, if they come to talk to you, you just take the fifth amendment. If they give you immunity, I said, you know, then you, then you testify, but you tell them the truth. I said, don’t worry about me. Tell them the truth. This is how I talk to him. When I’m talking to him like that, it’s almost like he’s trying to run away from me. [52:27] We’re at a restaurant in a big complex. It was in one of those resorts in Arizona. He’s all but running away from me. I was trying to help him. What I said to him was, Frank, I said, the statute of limitations ran on all this. It’s been more than five years. There’s nothing they can do to you or to me, I said, because the statute ran. I said, so don’t lie to them. What the feds were concerned about, and I don’t know why, that he would deny ever fixing the case when it went through. I don’t know why they’re worried about that, but they were, and I didn’t want to see him get in trouble. [53:13] That’s why I went there to protect him. Hey, Bob, you were asked to represent an outfit associate or an outfit associate’s son who was accused of breaking the jaw of a Chicago policewoman. And you know, when a cop is injured in a fight with somebody, the cops follow that case. And I do not want to see any shenanigans going on. So, so tell us about how you walked that line. And I bet those cops were, were not happy with you in the end. Some people think this is a reason you flipped. Take us inside that case, will you? [53:45] And the reason I mentioned that it had a lot to do with what I eventually did. Now we’ll get back to what made me do what I was going to do. When I was practicing law now, and now I have been away from all this for years, I was out of town a lot because I’m representing the Chinese all around the country. I’m their main lawyer right now. [54:10] And I get a call from Lenny Colella. And he says, my son, he said, my son is in trouble. I want to come in and I want to talk to you about handling his case. This was a heater case, too. This was a front page case because he was charged with aggravated battery and attempted murder. Supposedly, he had beat up a policewoman and it was all over the place. He was a drug addict and whatever, supposedly he did all this. And when he came into the office with his dad, he was high. When I talked to him, he’s got his kid with him. And the kid is a smart aleck. As we’re talking, the kid, and I asked the kid, well, whatever. The kid was a smart aleck. And I just said to him, I said, Len, I can’t help you. I said, get him out of here. I want nothing to do with him. I said, I can’t help you. You didn’t take cases that were involved with cops anyhow, for the most part. No. I didn’t know what had happened in this case. I know what I saw in the paper. I didn’t know what the facts or anything were or whatever. I mean, if it turned out that if I felt when I talked to him that he had done it, whatever, I would not have taken the case anyhow. [55:26] I mean, I would not have. That’s why I say, too, that may be, too, why I was as quick and as rude as I was when he came in there and was acting and was a little bit high. I just wanted nothing to do with him, period. I said to his dad, his father said, you know, if I get him cleaned up, you know, I said, well, if you get him cleaned up, then we’ll talk again. I said, but I can’t help him, and I can’t help him. [55:54] And off he goes. the father re-contacted me about a week later. And he said, I had him in rehab and he straightened out and whatever. And he brought him back in and it was a new person. And when he told me the facts of the case, when he told me what happened, because he was a big, tough kid. He was a big, you know, he was a weightlifter, but he was a big, tough looking kid. [56:19] And it’s a little police woman. When he told me what happened, I believed him. Because I’ve been out in the street and whatever. And he says, you know, he told me what happened, that he had gotten stopped. He was out there talking to her. And when she said, you’re under arrest for DUI, he just walked. He says, I walked. I was going to get in my car and drive away. And she grabbed me and was pulling me or whatever. And I hear all these sirens coming. And within a few minutes, there’s all kinds of police. There’s about half a dozen police there. He says, and then they started jumping on me. He said, she was under me. He was all beaten up. He was all bloody and whatever. And she apparently had her jaw broken. And there’s no doubt in my mind when he’s telling me that, you know, when they were hit with his clubs or with this thing that they claimed he had without his fingerprints, it was a metal bar. Right, a slapper. A chunk of lead covered by leather. Everybody used to carry a slapper. How about you carry a slapper? They claimed, but there was no cloth on this. It was just the metal itself. Yeah, oh really? [57:45] Anyhow, that makes it interesting during the trial when they flat out lied. No, he had no blood. I got the hospital reports. They wouldn’t take him in the station because he was too badly beaten up. But anyhow, he also had two other charges. He had been involved in a fight in a bar. And he had been involved in another situation with the police. And he was charged with resisting arrest and battery on a policeman out in Cicero. So he had these three cases. So I gave the father a fee on handling, you know, the one, I was going to, I gave him a fee one case at a time. I said, you know, first thing we’ll do, I want to get rid of those other two cases. I’ll take them to juries, I said. [58:36] I’ll take them to juries because I wasn’t going to put them. I knew both the judges on those cases, but I wasn’t going to put them in a position on a case like that. I take the first case to trial. And I get him a not guilty. That was the fight in the bar. [58:54] That was out in one of the suburbs. That was out in, I’m not sure which suburb, in the northwest side. After we get that case over with, before that case, I get a call from Pat Marcy. Pat Marcy, I hadn’t seen him probably even for a couple months, but I hadn’t talked to him for quite a long period of time. And he says to me, you got a case that just came in. He said, we’re going to handle it. And I said, there’s no need, Pat. I said, I can win these cases. I said, there’s no need. I can win these cases. And he said, we’re going to handle this. The case is going to go to Judge Passarella, he said, and we’ll take care of it. I said, Pat, there’s no need to. I said, I can win these cases. I said, they’re all jury trials, but I know I can win them all. And he says, you do as you’re told. Pat had never talked to me like that before. [59:54] Powerful as he was and crazy as I am, And he never, you know, you never demand that I do anything or whatever. We had a different type relationship. And although I hadn’t broken away from them by now, it’s been years. I had broken away from them for about, you know, two, three years. And he says, you know, take the case to trial. I said, well, he’s got some other cases, too, and I’m going to take the one. And she says, I’ll take it to a jury, and I’ll win it. You’ll see how I win it. I take her to trial, and I get her not guilty. The second case was set for trial about a month after that. Not even, yeah, about a month or so after that. And during that time, a couple of times I’m in counselors, and Pat says, when are you going to take the case to trial? I said, well, Pat, you know, I won the one case. I got the other case on trial, and it was before Judge Stillo. He was a judge that we eventually indicted. [1:00:51] Stillo was very, very well connected to the first ward. He’s one of the old-time judges out in Maywood. And I told him, you know, when I came in there, he assumed I’d take it to trial and he’d throw it out. And I said, no, no, no, there’s no need to. I says, I’m going to take the jury on this one. Number one, I had stopped fixing things long before this. And, but he was, to make money, he was willing that he would have thrown the case out. It was a battery with a Cicero policeman. And I says, no, no, I’ll take it. I’ll take it to, you know, I’ll take the jury. I said, I don’t want to put you in that pursuit. Oh, don’t worry about me. I take that one to trial and I win that one too. Now Pat calls me, when the hell are you going to take the case to trial? And that’s the original case with the police woman. That’s the main one. The main one. Okay, go ahead. [1:01:44] When are you going to take it to trial? And I don’t want to take it to trial. In fact. I had talked to the prosecutor, and I said, look, I said, because he was charged with, he was charged with, you know, attempted murder and arrest. I said, if you’ll reduce it, the prosecutor was an idiot. He knew me, should have realized that, you know, that I never lose cases. Yeah. You know, but I want to work out something. He was a special prosecutor on it. He said, we’re not going to reduce it. We said, you know, if you want to work out a plea, we went five years, we went five to ten or whatever in the penitentiary. And I said, well, that’s not going to happen. I said, well, then we’ll just have to go to trial. So now, while I’m at Counselor’s Row, on one of my many occasions, because I was still having some card games over there at somebody else’s other lawyer’s office, because I had had big card games going on there for years. I’m sitting at the counselor’s row table, and Judge Passarella comes in. There’s just him and me there, and when he comes in, I say, Oh, you’re here to see Pat? [1:02:56] And he goes, Pat, who? No more conversation. Who the fuck? No more. The guy’s treating me like I’m some kind of a fool or whatever. And I developed an instant disliking to him. I had never seen him around that much or whatever before that. So now, after the second case, you’re going to go to, you know. So I talked to Lenny. When Lenny came in, Lenny came in with him when we were starting to get prepared for the case. And, oh, this is before this is before I talked to the prosecutor. And I said, Lenny, I said, I says, if I can get it reduced to a misdemeanor, to a misdemeanor. I said, you know, can we work with, you know, and work out a plea, let’s say, for maybe a month or two, you know, a month or two. Is that OK with you? Oh, sure. He says, oh, sure. [1:03:57] Now, this Lenny, this was the kid’s dad, your client’s dad. This is his dad. Now, explain who he was, who Lenny was. His dad was. What’s his last name? Yeah, Karela. Karela, okay. Lenny Karela, I’m pretty sure was his name. He owned a big bakery out there in Elmwood Park area. Okay. And he was friendly with all the mobsters. Okay, all right. I got you. For all I knew, he may have been a mobster himself, but I mean, he may have been because we had thousands of people that were connected. He was a connected guy. All right, go ahead. I’m sorry. And he said, oh, yeah, sure, no, not a problem because the papers are meant, they’re still, after a year, they’re still mentioning that case will be going to trial soon and every so often. [1:04:43] What I had also done, I tried to make contact with the policewoman, not with her, but I put the word out and I knew a lot of police and I got a hold of somebody that did know her. And I said, look, I said, no, the case is fixed if I want it. Yeah. But I don’t want it. Even though I know that, you know, that it’s all BS, you know, I said, look, I said, get a hold of her and get a hold of her lawyer and tell them if they want to file a lawsuit, you know, you know, we can, they can get themselves some money on it. Uh, you know, he’ll indicate, you know, he’ll, he’ll, he’ll indicate that, you know, he, he was guilty or whatever, but I wanted to get her some money. The word I get back is tell him that piece of shit, meaning me to drop dead, to drop dead. You know, we’re going to put this guy in prison and that’s where he should be too. When the case now, now when the case goes to trial. [1:05:48] The coppers lied like hell and talk about stupid. I’ve got the police reports there. When they took him into the police station, they wouldn’t take him. The station said take him to a hospital. He goes to the hospital and the reports, you know, bleeding here, bleeding there, and, you know, marks here, marks there. They beat the hell out of him. [1:06:10] You know, nobody touched him. You know, nobody touched him. Nobody touched him. Was he bleeding? No, no, he wasn’t. He wasn’t bleeding. Didn’t have any, you know, along with, you know, along with everything else. Flat out lied. How many policemen were there? There were two or three. There were about 10 by the time it’s over. But it’s an absolute throwout. Any fingerprints on that metal? Well, we had some fingerprints, but not his. And on and on it went. It’s a throwout case to start with. The courtroom now where the case was, was very interesting. You walk in there, and when you walk in there, there’s about 20 people that can sit. And then there’s, it’s the only courtroom in the building where you have a wall, a glass wall, all the way up, all the way up. Covering in the door, opens up and goes in there. You go in there. It’s a big courtroom. A bunch of benches now in there. You go to the left, and here’s the judge’s chambers. You come out of the chambers, and you walk up about four steps. And here the desk is on like a podium. And it’s not where all the others are, you know, where you look straight forward. It’s over on the side. It’s over, you know, to the left as you walk out of his chambers. [1:07:40] When the judge listens to the case he goes in there I’ll come up back with my ruling he comes out about 10 minutes later he walks up the steps, And now he turns off the microphone. Somebody turns off the microphone so the people in the back can’t hear anything. The ones inside there can, you know, can hear. The one back there can’t hear anything because it’s all enclosed. [1:08:11] That’s why they got the microphone back there. Somebody shut it off. He says, basically, I’m not guilty in a real strange voice. And all but runs off the all but run and don’t ask me why this is what he did all but runs off all but runs off into the into his chambers, you know he’s afraid all those cops out in the audience were going to come and charge the stand I guess and put a whack on him. [1:08:43] But think about it this is Chicago he’s with the bad guys but I’m just saying I don’t know why he did all that, but that’s what he did. And so now, as I come walking out with Mike, and they’re all in uniform, and most of them are in uniform, and then you’ve got the press and all kinds of cameras and whatever there. And as I come walking out along with him, some of these guys I know, and these jerk-offs are like calling me names and whatever. I go, I go see Pat. [1:09:23] And when I go back into Counselor’s Row now, he’s there at the table. And when I come in, it’s a repeat of the Harry Allerman thing. He walks out. He walks directly. And I’m following him, and he walks in. He goes back into the same janitor’s closet and stands on the same steps just above me, you know, talking to me. And I said to him I said this judge is going to have a problem, I said, he’s going to have a problem. I said, what if he says something? And he said to me, nobody would dare. He said, nobody would dare cooperate against us. They know what would happen. Or words to that effect. And don’t ask me why. So many other things had happened before this. But now I’m looking at him and I’m thinking, you know, somebody’s got to stop this craziness. All this stuff. I’m thinking that at the moment, but then I’m worried for some reason, I think he can read my mind. [1:10:34] Stupid as all of this seems, I’m afraid to think that anymore. I’m almost, you know, cause Pat’s such a powerful person and every sense I know, I know his power, but anyhow, so I leave. And like I say, 10, 15 minutes later, that’s all forgotten about. He paid me the rest of the money I was supposed to get from them. [1:10:56] Obviously, he wanted to do it because he was probably charging a lot of money. That’s why he didn’t want me to take things. He wanted to collect the money because while the case was going on too, he puts me in touch with the head of the probation department because he was able to help in some way. He knew some of the, you know, some of the, some of the policemen involved in the thing had been contacted too. Yeah. But they were contacted and they messed up by, you know, they messed up by lying about all that. Yeah. When there’s police reports saying, oh, no, but anyhow, that was that particular case. Tell us why you decided to flip. [1:11:38] These had been your friends. You knew you had explosive information. You knew as a lawyer, you knew what you had to say would send these people to prison for many, many years. if not life. It had to be hard. As other things happened, why did I commit the, Probably two or three other times things happened. But the most important thing was to think when my dad was dying, and I was very close to my dad. When my dad was dyi

"Colpo Gobbo" con Dario Ghiringhelli con Ospiti: Cesare Mariconda, Vincenzo greco

"Colpo Gobbo" con Dario Ghiringhelli con Ospiti: Cesare Mariconda, Vincenzo greco

Tommaso Greco è l'autore di “Critica della ragione bellica” pubblicato da Laterza Editore. Tommaso Greco è professore ordinario di Filosofia del diritto all'Università di Pisa, dove dirige il Centro Interdipartimentale di Bioetica. Questo libro è una modesta difesa del pacifismo giuridico, così lo definisce l'autore, ovvero di quella forma di pacifismo che punta a valorizzare il ruolo del diritto e delle istituzioni. Ripensare le relazioni giuridiche tra gli stati può offrire le maggiori possibilità di azione in vista del ristabilimento e mantenimento della pace. Il pacifismo giuridico è un'alternativa reale e concreta, non c'è nulla di utopistico. L'idea da ribaltare, sostiene Tommaso Greco, è pensare che il diritto sia solo regolamentazione dell'uso della forza. Il diritto è relazione. E la proposta dell'autore è quella di cambiare prospettiva e di pensare la pace partendo dalla pace e non dalla guerra. La pace come principio dunque per costruirla e custodirla.

Estamos de regreso esta semana para analizar correctamente esta coronación española. El episodio nos lleva igual de ajoraos que a las reinas durante esta final donde lo tiene TODO. Le damos las gracias a todxs por escucharnos esta temporada. ¡Les queremos!YouTubehttps://www.youtube.com/@DragaMalaPodMala Patreonhttps://patreon.com/DragaMalaLinkTreehttps://linktr.ee/dragamalaBrock by Joséhttps://www.instagram.com/brockbyjose/https://www.tiktok.com/@brockbyjoseMala VoiceMailhttps://www.speakpipe.com/dragamalaBlue Skyhttps://bsky.app/profile/dragamalapod.bsky.socialInstagramDraga Mala

“La Juve del Lunedì” con Luigi Schiffo. Ospiti: Aldo De Girolamo, Vincenzo Greco.

“La Juve del Lunedì” con Luigi Schiffo. Ospiti: Aldo De Girolamo, Vincenzo Greco.

Who's Coming? John 1:1-5

Why is He Coming? John 1:9-13

In this powerful episode, Dr. Lotte sits down with professional intuitive, past-life rememberer, Numerologist, spiritual coach, and Host of The Higher Self Hotline, Zoey Greco—whose spiritual awakening began in infancy, surrounded by angels and memories of lifetimes before this one. Together they explore intuition, the language of the Clairs, angelic communication, past-life memory, and how numerology can help you understand your soul contract, personal year cycles, and divine timing. Whether you're just beginning to recognize your intuitive gifts, learning how the Clairs function within you, or already navigating a spiritual awakening, this conversation offers grounded wisdom, validation, and tools to deepen your connection with your Higher Self. If you've ever wondered: "Am I intuitive?" "How do I know if the signs I'm receiving are real?" or "What is my soul here to learn?" …this episode will help you recognize that intuition isn't rare — it's innate.   ✨ What We Explore in This Episode: ✦ Angel messages and soul memory ✦ The Clairs: clairvoyance, clairaudience, claircognizance, and clairsentience ✦ How to recognize your strongest intuitive channel ✦ Past life remembrance and soul identity ✦ Numerology: personal year cycles, energetic portals, and timing ✦ How trusting intuition accelerates clarity, alignment, and purpose ✦ How to strengthen your intuitive connection and inner knowing   This is a conversation for seekers, sensitives, healers, old souls, and anyone curious about the unseen dimensions guiding our lives.

Most founders don't realize how much their work is reshaping who they are. Until it's too late.In this episode of Founder Talk, Nick Greco, mental health expert, crisis intervention instructor, and founder of C3 Education & Research, breaks down what chronic stress really does to people who live in it day after day. Nick has trained thousands of officers across the U.S., taught suicide prevention globally, and even worked with other national police forces in different countries. Few people understand high-pressure psychology like he does and the crossover to entrepreneurship is undeniable. Nick explains why people in these high-stakes, high-pressure positions lose their identity, shut down emotionally, and drift from the people they care about. He shares why communication at home often collapses, why “I'm fine” usually isn't true, and how simple habits like taking 20–30 minutes to decompress can save marriages and families. We also dive into why men struggle to ask for help, why emotional isolation is so dangerous, and how founders can actually retain people instead of losing them to fatigue, resentment, or culture issues. Nick also unpacks the psychology behind overworking, financial stress, identity fusion (“I am my job”), and why so many founders unknowingly mirror the same patterns he sees in first responders.What You'll Learn✅ Why chronic stress leads to burnout, isolation, and identity loss✅ How emotional shutdown damages relationships and how to reverse it✅ Why “burnout” is usually a system problem, not a personal weakness✅ How to decompress and reset after high-pressure days✅ Why founders and first responders fall into the same psychological trapsIf you're a founder navigating nonstop pressure, this episode gives you the clarity, tools, and mindset to stay grounded, connected, and healthy without losing yourself to the work.Connect with Nicholas GrecoGuest LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/nicholas-greco-iv-m-s-bcets-catsm-faaets-ba78168/Guest Website: https://www.c3educationandresearch.com/If you are a B2B company that wants to build your own in-house content team instead of outsourcing your content to a marketing agency, we may be a fit for you! Everything you see in our podcast and content is a result of a scrappy, nimble, internal content team along with an AI-powered content systems and process. Check out pricing and services here: ⁠https://impaxs.com⁠Head to our website to stream every episode on your favorite platform, join the Founder Talk community, and submit questions for future guests–all in one place: https://foundertalkpodcast.com/Timecodes00:00 Introduction and Guest Background00:46 Founding C3 Education and Research02:43 Challenges and Rewards of Entrepreneurship04:58 Law Enforcement and Public Perception15:45 Mental Health and Officer Wellness17:00 Balancing Work and Personal Life28:09 Effective Communication in Relationships33:39 Financial Pitfalls of New Recruits35:01 The Importance of Financial Planning35:49 Materialism and Happiness36:50 Balancing Family and Work39:29 The Role of Passion in Business46:19 Stress and Burnout51:54 Mental Health and Suicide Awareness56:38 Global Training Experiences59:36 Training and Curriculum Design01:04:10 Conclusion and Contact Information

We're closing out the guest line-up with a heavy hitter. Our final guest of the season is Drew Greco of Greenstar Consulting, one of the top cannabis grow consultants in Las Vegas, and a familiar name if you've been following the Budeez journey. Drew joins us to talk about what it really takes to grow elite cannabis in the desert—dialing in genetics, navigating the Vegas market, and building consistent quality from the soil up.He didn't come empty-handed either—bringing five different strains, all grown by him and his team, which we break down as our Strains of the Day while sampling our way through the interview.It's part grower science, part Vegas cannabis history, and part classic Stoner Budeez session—ending the season the only way that makes sense: learning something real while getting a little higher along the way.

"Colpo Gobbo" con Dario Ghiringhelli e Luigi Schiffo. Ospiti: Roberto Grossi, Vincenzo Greco.

"Colpo Gobbo" con Dario Ghiringhelli e Luigi Schiffo. Ospiti: Roberto Grossi, Vincenzo Greco.

O uso de antibióticos no fim da vida é uma das decisões clínicas mais complexas dentro dos cuidados paliativos. Neste episódio do InfectoCast, William e Jordan recebem o médico paliativista Dr. Fernando Greco para uma conversa profunda sobre quando, como e porquê tratar infecções em pacientes em terminalidade. A discussão une evidência científica, ética, comunicação difícil e tomada de decisão compartilhada.Ao longo da conversa, exploramos o conceito de cuidados paliativos segundo a OMS, a visão multidimensional do paciente, as diferenças entre terminalidade, fase final da vida e processo ativo de morte, além de barreiras impostas por profissionais de saúde e o papel do vínculo com pacientes e famílias.Também analisamos riscos reais do uso de antibióticos nesse cenário, como toxicidade, sobrecarga hídrica, neurotoxicidade, delírio e seleção de bactérias multirresistentes, além do impacto epidemiológico e econômico. Discutimos casos reais, ciclos curtos de teste terapêutico, uso por hipodermóclise, definição de parâmetros de resposta e limites do benefício clínico.Um episódio essencial para quem atua em infectologia, clínica médica, cuidados paliativos, UTI, geriatria, oncologia e enfermagem, e para todos os profissionais que lidam com decisões críticas no fim da vida.Para aprofundar esse tema na prática e revisar condutas essenciais do dia a dia, você pode conhecer o curso S.O.S Antibióticos do InfectoCast, criado para oferecer segurança clínica, racionalidade terapêutica e tomada de decisão baseada em evidências.Conheça mais clicando aqui.

Satín Greco visita Cuerpos especiales para hablar de su victoria en la final de Drag Race España. Cuenta los entresijos del talent y explica por qué no participó en la primera edición. Satín. "Yo era de las pocas que renegaba del formato, no me llamaron ni para amenazarme". 

Fineqia International Inc (CSE:FNQ) senior associate Matteo Greco talked with Proactive's Stephen Gunnion about the key takeaways from the firm's November report on crypto exchange-traded products (ETPs), which tracked a 17% drop in crypto assets – closely aligned with a broader 16% market decline. Despite the downturn, Greco noted that outflows from ETPs were minimal, indicating growing maturity and long-term investor confidence in crypto-backed financial products. “This is a strong vehicle to get exposure to the asset class,” Greco said, emphasizing the resilience of the crypto ETP market. He highlighted that Bitcoin ETPs saw only $3 billion in outflows despite a 17.5% price drop, suggesting that investors in these products tend to have a longer investment horizon. Similarly, while Ethereum ETPs recorded their first monthly outflows after seven months of inflows, Greco said that, proportional to market cap, Ethereum has attracted relatively stronger demand than Bitcoin. Regarding altcoin ETPs, Greco pointed to a positive trend driven by recent US ETF approvals for assets like Solana and Dogecoin. He added that the broader range of products could signal the early signs of an "alt season." Looking ahead, Greco believes the launch of over 300 listed crypto ETPs indicates sustained institutional interest heading into 2026. For more expert insights like this, visit Proactive's YouTube channel. Don't forget to like this video, subscribe to the channel, and enable notifications for future content. #CryptoETPs #Fineqia #BitcoinETP #EthereumETP #Altcoins #CryptoInvesting #ETFs #InstitutionalCrypto #CryptoMarkets #ProactiveInvestors

Every day, I see people falling into disordered eating habits out of fear of eating and getting another kidney stone. I was thrilled to welcome Mia Greco, a fellow registered dietitian and expert in making healthy choices to the podcast! We chat everything from diagnosable eating disorders, the disordered eating spectrum and how to eat for health without going overboard. Mia Greco Website: Olive Branch Nutrition, Instagram & Facebook   Submit a question for Melanie to answer on the podcast! Connect with The Kidney Dietitian! Work with Us! |  Instagram | Facebook | Pinterest | Facebook Group | Newsletter www.thekidneydietitian.org FREE Webinar: The 3-Step Method to Prevent Kidney Stones All information in this podcast is meant for educational purposes only and should not be used in place of advice from a medical professional.  

Satín Greco, ganador de Drag Race España 2025, visita Cuerpos especiales para hablar de la gran final del concurso de Atresmedia. Jorge Yorya analiza la separación de Sonia y Selena y Eva Soriano saca sus cartas Disney para leer el futuro de una oyente. Además, este miércoles conocemos al segundo candidato del concurso Pueblos especiales y el duende Cuerpín aparece de debajo de la mesa para leer la cartilla a los presentadores.

Join Kurt & Ryley for the final episode of 2025! This special wrap-up celebrates an extraordinary year in Australian Paralympic sport and looks ahead to 2026.In this episode, we catch up with Dan Michel. After a challenging year, Dan reflects on his return to competition and what's ahead. Dan also shares his new 'Boccia 360' initiative designed to bring the sport to more people.

In this episode of VistaTalks, Host Simon Hodgkins sits down with Giulia Greco, founder of Giulia Greco Consulting and Globalization Consultant at Nimdzi Insights, to unpack the evolving landscape of international expansion, localization strategy, and the role of AI in shaping the future of global business. Drawing on her rich experience leading localization at Shopify and consulting for global clients, Giulia offers a refreshingly candid and insightful perspective on what it takes to succeed in going global today.Stay Open, Stay CuriousGiulia leaves listeners with a powerful piece of advice:"It's important to remain open and adaptable… Clinging to the past and the way things were is not a recipe for success."In a world where technology, culture, and work dynamics are constantly evolving, the most resilient professionals and companies will be those who stay curious, willing to learn, and open to experimentation.Giulia Greco offers more than just technical expertise in localization; she brings strategic vision, human insight, and refreshing candor to an increasingly complex and fast-moving field. Whether you're a startup looking to go global or a multinational navigating compliance and AI disruption, her message is clear: localization isn't just a support function. Done right, it's a driver of growth, connection, and long-term success.00:00 - Giulia Greco - VistaTalks Ep 18401:26 - From Burnout to Business: Why Giulia Started Consulting04:03 - Localization ≠ Translation: A Broader Globalization Mindset08:13 - Strategic Blind Spots in Global Expansion12:54 - Content as Product: Prioritization & Market Strategy17:09 - What Real Localization Success Looks Like18:43 - Bill 96 and Compliance as a Growth Opportunity30:21 - AI in Localization: Tools, Tradeoffs, and TransformationAbout VistaTalks: VistaTalks has an incredible lineup of guests from around the globe. We love to feature interesting discussions with interesting people from all around the world. Follow VistaTalks on Spotify for all the latest episodes, or subscribe to the show on Apple and Google podcasts. VistaTalks is available on many other podcast platforms. To learn more about VistaTalks, please visit https://www.vistatalks.com Social Media: X - https://x.com/vistatalks Facebook - https://www.facebook.com/VistaTalks Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/vistatalks LinkedIn - https://www.linkedin.com/company/vistatalks

In this conversation, I sit down with Dorothy Greco to explore misogyny not just as individual prejudice, but as a system that shapes our culture, our institutions, our churches, and even our closest relationships. Dorothy walks me through how misogyny shows up in medicine, economics, purity culture, pornography, and the daily lives of women, and why it remains so difficult to see and name. We talk about the ways entitlement and distorted power sustain this harm, and how the way of Jesus offers a radically different vision, one rooted in dignity, equality, and mutual flourishing. This episode invites all of us to look beneath the surface, recognize what's been hidden in plain sight, and imagine what healing and justice might require from us moving forward.Dorothy Littel Greco has worked as a photojournalist for more than forty years. She is the author of three books, including the recently released, For the Love of Women: Uprooting and Healing Misogyny in America. When Dorothy is not writing or making photos, she loves to bike, kayak, and share food with friends.Dorothy's Book:For the Love of WomenDorothy's Recommendation:This is HappinessConnect with Joshua: jjohnson@shiftingculturepodcast.comGo to www.shiftingculturepodcast.com to interact and donate. Every donation helps to produce more podcasts for you to enjoy.Follow on Facebook, Instagram, Twitter, Threads, Bluesky or YouTubeConsider Giving to the podcast and to the ministry that my wife and I do around the world. Just click on the support the show link belowFind the Presence Over Power collection at www.shiftingculturepodcast.com/store Get Your Sidekick Support the show

Suzanne E. Greco discussed “From Persecuted to Perpetrator: Healing the Church's Trauma Through Ancestral Ties” in this important new Gospel Study. Suzanne E. Greco, a GBV survivor, holds a Master's in Theology rom Harvard Divinity… The post Healing the Church's Trauma Through Ancestral Ties: Gospel Study with Suzanne E. Greco appeared first on Dialogue Journal.

Suzanne E. Greco discussed “From Persecuted to Perpetrator: Healing the Church's Trauma Through Ancestral Ties” in this important new Gospel Study. Suzanne E. Greco, a GBV survivor, holds a Master's in Theology rom Harvard Divinity… The post Healing the Church's Trauma Through Ancestral Ties: Gospel Study with Suzanne E. Greco appeared first on Dialogue Journal.

Send us a text2025 was a year of massive shifts and powerful transitions. But how can we just reflect, digest, and process it all so we can turn it all into fuel to be our baddest bitch selves as we go into 2026? In this episode of CosmicRX Radio, we sit down with Zoey Greco, beloved spiritual coach and podcaster, to reflect on 2025: from numerology to astrology, from the collective challenges to the personal breakthroughs, and more.Zoey Greco, also known as "The Merhipsy", is an intuitive empath and spiritual coach, whose work connects individuals to the divine guidance and unconditional love that awaits them in every moment from Universal energy. Through her podcast, her Intuition Activation Mentorship, and through her twice sold out Mystic Rebel Oracle and Crystal decks, Zoey helps others experience healing, discover community, and feel far less alone in their spiritual and personal journeys. She teaches others that we all have the power of intuition and can develop it with the use of many spiritual tools and modalities to manifest a life of endless possibilities.

In dieser Episode nehmen wir dich mit auf eine kulinarische Entdeckungstour durch Toledo. Nach einem entspannten Flug empfängt uns die nächtlich beleuchtete Stadt mit ihrem Zauber. Statt eines geplanten Hotelessens überrascht uns ein aufmerksamer Kellner mit frisch geschnittenem Serrano-Schinken und feinen Käsesorten – ein Vorgeschmack auf die kulinarischen Höhepunkte, die uns erwarten. Am nächsten Morgen starten wir mit einem Frühstück, das lokale Spezialitäten wie Pisto und eingemachte Tomaten zelebriert, bevor wir die Altstadt erkunden. Toledo zeigt sich als Schatzkammer voller Architektur, Geschichte und lebendiger Kultur: von der Synagoge Santa Maria La Blanca über das Museo del Greco bis hin zu zufälligen Begegnungen wie einer Hochzeit auf der Brücke San Martin. Natürlich darf auch der kulinarische Genuss nicht fehlen – Tapas in einem charmanten Restaurant, begleitet vom perfekten Hauswein, und die süße Krönung in Form von legendärem Marzipan aus der berühmten Patisserie. Bleib dran, denn unsere kulinarische Tour durch Spanien hat gerade erst begonnen – und die nächsten Entdeckungen versprechen noch größere Geschmackserlebnisse. Zu den genannten Adressen: Hotel Cigararral Sant Maria Hotel Abaceria Restaurante Lo Nuestro ************************************************ Abonniere jetzt den Podcast bei Spotifyund verpasse keine Folge mehr! Mehr findest du auch auf den Social-Media-Kanälen Facebook Youtube Instagram Feinschmeckertouren ************************************************

On today's menu:

Você já parou pra pensar quem traduz os livros que você lê e como esse trabalho molda a forma como entende o mundo? Neste episódio, Lívia Mendes e Lidia Torres irão nos conduzir em uma viagem no tempo para entendermos como os textos gregos e latinos chegam até nós. Vamos descobrir por que traduzir é sempre também interpretar, criar e disputar sentidos. Conversamos com Andrea Kouklanakis, professora permanente na Hunter College, Nova York, EUA, e Guilherme Gontijo Flores, professor da Universidade Federal do Paraná. Eles compartilharam suas trajetórias no estudo de línguas antigas, seus desafios e descobertas com o mundo da tradução e as questões políticas, históricas e estéticas que a prática e as teorias da tradução abarcam. Esse episódio faz parte do trabalho de divulgação científica que a Lívia Mendes desenvolve no Centro de Estudos Clássicos e Centro de Teoria da Filologia, vinculados ao Instituto de Estudos da Linguagem e ao Instituto de Estudos Avançados da Unicamp, financiado pelo projeto Mídia Ciência da FAPESP, a quem agradecemos pelo financiamento. O roteiro foi escrito por Lívia Mendes e a revisão é de Lidia Torres e Mayra Trinca. A edição é de Daniel Rangel. Se você gosta de literatura, história, tradução ou quer entender novas formas de aproximar o passado do presente, esse episódio é pra você. __________________________________________________________________ ROTEIRO [música, bg] Lívia: Quem traduziu o livro que você está lendo? Lívia: E se você tivesse que aprender todas as línguas dos clássicos que deseja ler? Aqueles livros escritos em russo, alemão ou qualquer outra língua diferente da sua? Lívia: E aqueles livros das literaturas que foram escritas em línguas que chamamos antigas, como o latim e o grego? Lidia: A verdade é que, na maioria das vezes, a gente não pensa muito sobre essas questões. Mas, no Brasil, boa parte dos livros que lemos, tanto literários quanto teóricos, não chegaria até a gente se não fossem os tradutores. Lidia: Essas obras, que fazem parte de todo um legado social, filosófico e cultural da nossa sociedade, só chegaram até nós por causa do trabalho cuidadoso de pesquisadores e tradutores dessas línguas, que estão tão distantes, mas ao mesmo tempo, tão próximas de nós. [música de transição] Lívia: Eu sou a Lívia Mendes. Lidia: E eu sou a Lidia Torres. Lívia: Você já conhece a gente aqui do Oxigênio e no episódio de hoje vamos explorar como traduzimos, interpretamos e recebemos textos da Antiguidade greco-romana. Lidia: E, também vamos pensar por que essas obras ainda hoje mobilizam debates políticos, culturais e estéticos. Lívia: Vem com a gente explorar o mundo da antiguidade greco-romana que segue tão presente na atualidade, especialmente por meio da tradução dos seus textos. [vinheta O2] Andrea [1:05-2:12]: Então, meu nome é Andrea Kouklanakis e, eu sou brasileira, nasci no Brasil e morei lá até 21 anos quando eu emigrei para cá. Lívia: O “cá” da Andrea é nos Estados Unidos, país que ela se mudou ainda em 1980, então faz um tempo que ela mora fora do Brasil. Mas mesmo antes de se mudar, ela já tinha uma experiência com o inglês. Andrea Kouklanakis: Quando eu vim pra cá, eu não tinha terminado faculdade ainda, eu tinha feito um ano e meio, quase dois anos na PUC de São Paulo. Ah, e mas chegou uma hora que não deu mais para arcar com a responsabilidade financeira de matrícula da PUC, de mensalidades, então eu passei um tempo trabalhando só, dei aulas de inglês numa dessas escolas assim de business, inglês pra business people e que foi até legal, porque eu era novinha, acho que eu tinha 18, 19 anos e é interessante que todo mundo era mais velho que eu, né? Os homens de negócios, as mulheres de negócio lá, mas foi uma experiência legal e que também, apesar de eu não poder estar na faculdade daquela época, é uma experiência que condiz muito com o meu trabalho com línguas desde pequena. Lívia: Essa que você ouviu é a nossa primeira entrevistada no episódio de hoje, a professora Andrea Kouklanakis. Como ela falou ali na apresentação, ela se mudou ainda jovem pros Estados Unidos. Lidia: E, como faz muito tempo que ela se comunica somente em inglês, em alguns momentos ela acaba esquecendo as palavras em português e substitui por uma palavra do inglês. Então, a conversa com a Andrea já é um início pra nossa experimentação linguística neste episódio. Andrea Kouklanakis: Eu sou professora associada da Hunter College, que faz parte da cidade universitária de Nova York, City University of New York. E eles têm vários campus e a minha home college é aqui na Hunter College, em Manhattan. Eh, eu sou agora professora permanente aqui. Lívia: A professora Andrea, que conversou com a gente por vídeo chamada lá de Nova Iorque, contou que já era interessada por línguas desde pequena. A mãe dela trabalhava na casa de uma professora de línguas, com quem ela fez as primeiras aulas. E ela aprendeu também algumas palavras da língua materna do seu pai, que é grego e mais tarde, estudou francês e russo na escola. Lidia: Mas, além de todas essas línguas, hoje ela trabalha com Latim e Grego.Como será que essas línguas antigas entraram na vida da Andrea? Andrea Kouklanakis: Então, quando eu comecei aqui na Hunter College, eu comecei a fazer latim porque, bom, quando você tem uma língua natal sua, você é isenta do requerimento de línguas, que todo mundo tem que ter um requerimento de língua estrangeira na faculdade aqui. Então, quando eu comecei aqui, eu fiquei sabendo, que eu não precisava da língua, porque eu tinha o português. Mas, eu falei: “É, mas eu peguei pensando a língua é o que eu quero, né?” Então, foi super assim por acaso, que eu tava olhando no catálogo de cursos oferecidos. Aí eu pensei: “Ah, Latim, OK. Why not?. Por que não, né? Uma língua antiga, OK. Lívia: A professora Andrea, relembrando essa escolha por cursar as disciplinas de Latim, quando chegou na Hunter College, percebeu que ela gostou bastante das aulas por um motivo afetivo e familiar com a maneira com que ela tinha aprendido a língua portuguesa aqui no Brasil, que era diferente da forma como seus colegas estadunidenses tinham aprendido o inglês, sem muita conexão com a gramática. Lidia: Ela gostava de estudar sintaxe, orações subordinadas e todas essas regras gramaticais, que são muito importantes pra quem quer estudar uma língua antiga e mais pra frente a gente vai entender bem o porquê. [som de ícone] Lívia: sintaxe, é a parte da gramática que estuda como as palavras se organizam dentro das frases pra formar sentidos. Ela explica quem é o sujeito, o que é o verbo, quais termos completam ou modificam outros, e assim por diante. [som de ícone]: Lívia: Oração subordinada é uma frase que depende de outra para ter sentido completo. Ela não “anda sozinha”: precisa da oração principal pra formar o significado total. [música de transição] Lidia: E, agora, você deve estar se perguntando, será que todo mundo que resolve estudar língua antiga faz escolhas parecidas com a da professora Andrea? Lidia: É isso que a gente perguntou pro nosso próximo entrevistado. Guilherme Gontijo: Eu sou atualmente professor de latim na UFPR, no Paraná, moro em Curitiba. Mas, eu fiz a minha graduação em letras português na UFES, na Federal do Espírito Santo. E lá quando eu tive que fazer as disciplinas obrigatórias de latim, eu tinha que escolher uma língua complementar, eu lembro que eu peguei italiano porque eu estudava francês fora da universidade e eu tinha que estudar o latim obrigatório. Estudei latim com Raimundo Carvalho. Lívia: Bom, parece que o Guilherme teve uma trajetória parecida com a da Andrea e gostar de estudar línguas é uma das premissas pra se tornar um estudioso de latim e de grego. Lidia: O professor Raimundo de Carvalho, que o Guilherme citou, foi professor de Latim da Federal do Espírito Santo. Desde a década de 80 ele escreve poesias e é um importante estudioso da língua latina. Ele quem traduziu a obra Bucólicas, do Vírgílio, um importante poeta romano, o autor da Eneida, que talvez você já deva ter ouvido falar. O professor Raimundo se aposentou recentemente, mas segue trabalhando na tradução de Metamorfoses, de outro poeta romano, o Ovídio. Lívia: O Guilherme contou o privilégio que foi ter tido a oportunidade de ser orientado de perto pelo professor Raimundo. Guilherme Gontijo: Eu lembro que eu era um aluno bastante correto, assim, eu achava muito interessante aprender latim, mas eu estudei latim pensando que ele teria algum uso linguístico pras pessoas que estudam literatura brasileira. E quando ele levou Catulo pra traduzir, eu lembro de ficar enlouquecido, assim, foi incrível e foi a primeira vez na minha vida que eu percebi que eu poderia traduzir um texto de poema como um poema. E isso foi insistivo pra mim, eu não tinha lido teoria nenhuma sobre tradução. Lívia: Um episódio sobre literatura antiga traz esses nomes diferentes, e a gente vai comentando e explicando. O Catulo, que o Guilherme citou, foi um poeta romano do século I a.C.. Ele é conhecido por escrever odes, que são poemas líricos que expressam admiração, elogio ou reflexão sobre alguém, algo ou uma ideia. A obra do Catulo é marcada pelos poemas que ele dedicou a Lésbia, figura central de muitos dos seus versos. Guilherme Gontijo: Eu fiz as duas disciplinas obrigatórias de latim, que é toda a minha formação oficial de latim, acaba aí. E passei a frequentar a casa do Raimundo Carvalho semanalmente, às vezes duas vezes por semana, passava a tarde inteira tendo aula de latim com ele, lendo poetas romanos ou prosa romana e estudava em casa e ele tirava minhas dúvidas. Então, graças à generosidade do Raimundo, eu me tornei latinista e eu não tinha ideia que eu, ainda por cima, teria ali um mestre, porque ele é poeta, é tradutor de poesia. Lidia: Essa conexão com a língua latina fez o Guilherme nunca mais abandonar a tradução. Ele disse que era uma forma natural de conseguir conciliar o seu interesse intelectual acadêmico e o lado criativo, já que desde o início da graduação ele já era um aspirante a poeta. Lívia: É importante a gente lembrar que o Guilherme tem uma vasta carreira como autor, poeta e tradutor e já vamos aproveitar pra deixar algumas dicas dos livros autorais e dos autores que ele traduziu. Lívia: Guilherme é autor dos poemas de carvão :: capim (2018), Todos os nomes que talvez tivéssemos (2020), Arcano 13 em parceria com Marcelo Ariel. Ele também escreveu o romance História de Joia (2019) e os livros de ensaios Algo infiel: corpo performance tradução (2017) em parceria com Rodrigo Gonçalves e A mulher ventriloquada: o limite da linguagem em Arquíloco (2018). Se aventurou pelo infanto-juvenil com os livros A Mancha (2020) e o Coestelário (2021), ambos em parceria com Daniel Kondo. E traduziu autores como Safo, Propércio, Catulo, Horácio, Rabelais e Whitman. Lidia: Os poetas Rabelais e Whitman são autores modernos, viveram nos séculos XVI e XIX, já os outros poetas são da antiguidade romana, aquele período aproximadamente entre o século IV a.C. e o século V d.C. Lívia: Então, o Guilherme traduz tanto textos de línguas modernas quanto de línguas antigas. E, a gente perguntou pra ele se existe alguma diferença no trabalho do tradutor quando vai traduzir um texto de uma língua moderna, que está mais próxima de nós no tempo, e quando vai traduzir do latim ou do grego, que são línguas mais distantes temporalmente. Lívia: O Guilherme falou que quando ele vai traduzir de uma língua moderna pra outra língua moderna existem duas possibilidades: traduzir diacronicamente, que é quando o tradutor escreve o texto na língua produzida como se fosse da época mesmo que ele foi escrito. E a outra possibilidade é traduzir deslocando o autor temporalmente, e fazendo a linguagem do texto conversar com a linguagem contemporânea. Lidia: Pode parecer um pouco confuso de início, mas ouve só o exemplo do Guilherme da experiência de tradução que ele teve com o Rimbaud, que é um autor francês. Guilherme Gontijo: Por exemplo, fui traduzir Rimbaud, o Rimbaud do século XIX. Quando eu vou traduzir, eu posso tentar traduzir pensando diacronicamente e aí eu vou tentar traduzir o Rimbaud pra ele parecer um poeta do século XIX em português. E aí eu vou dar essa sensação de espaço temporal pro leitor contemporâneo agora. É, o Guilherme de Almeida fez um experimento genial assim, traduzindo o poeta francês François Villon para uma espécie de pastiche de galego-português, botando a linha temporal de modo que é isso, Villon é difícil para um francês ler hoje, que a língua francesa já sofreu tanta alteração que muitas vezes eles leem numa espécie de edição bilíngue, francês antigo, francês moderno. A gente também tem um pouco essa dificuldade com o galego-português, que é a língua literária da Península ali pra gente, né? Ah, então essa é uma abordagem. Outra abordagem, eu acho que a gente faz com muito menos frequência, é tentar deslocar a relação da temporalidade, ou seja, traduzir Rimbaud, não para produzir um equivalente do Rimbaud, século XIX no Brasil, mas pra talvez criar o efeito que ele poderia criar nos seus contemporâneos imediatos. Lívia: Ou seja, a ideia aqui seria escrever um texto da maneira como se escreve hoje em dia, meio que transpondo a história no tempo. Lidia: Pra quem não conhece, fica aqui mais uma dica de leitura: o poeta francês Arthur Rimbaud, que o Guilherme citou, viveu entre 1854 e 1891 e escreveu quase toda sua obra ainda adolescente. Ele renovou a poesia moderna com imagens ousadas, experimentação formal e uma vida marcada pela rebeldia. Abandonou a literatura muito jovem e passou o resto da vida viajando e trabalhando na África. Lívia: Mas, e pra traduzir da língua antiga, será que esse dois caminhos também são possíveis? Guilherme Gontijo: Quando eu vou traduzir do latim, por exemplo, eu não tenho esse equivalente. Não existe o português equivalente de Propércio. O português equivalente de Propércio como língua literária é o próprio latim. Lívia: Ou seja, o que o Guilherme quis dizer é que não existe uma possibilidade de traduzir um texto latino como ele soava na antiguidade, porque o latim é a língua que originou as línguas modernas latinas, e a língua portuguesa é uma delas, junto com o espanhol, o francês e o italiano. Lidia: Mas, o que pode acontecer é uma classicização dos textos antigos e o Guilherme enfatizou que acontece muito nas traduções que a gente tem disponível do latim pro português. A classicização, nesses casos, é traduzir os textos da antiguidade com o português do século XVIII ou XIX, transformando esses textos em clássicos também pra nós. Guilherme Gontijo:Curiosamente, a gente, quando estuda os clássicos, a gente sempre fala: “Não, mas isso é moderno demais. Será que ele falaria assim?” Acho curioso, quando, na verdade, a gente vendo que os clássicos tão falando sobre literatura, eles parecem não ter esses pudores. Aliás, eles são bem menos arqueológicos ou museológicos do que nós. Eles derrubavam um templo e botavam outro templo em cima sem pensar duas vezes enquanto nós temos muito mais pudores. Então, a minha abordagem atual de traduzir os clássicos é muito tentar usar as possibilidades do português brasileiro, isso é muito marcado pra mim, uma das variedades do português brasileiro, que é a minha, né? De modo ativo. Lívia: Só pra dar um exemplo do que faz a língua soar clássica, seria o uso do pronome “tu” ao invés de “você”, ou, os pronomes oblíquos como “eu te disse” ou “eu te amo”, porque ninguém fala “eu lhe amo” no dia a dia. Lidia: E esse é justamente o ponto quando a gente fala de tradução do texto antigo. Eles não vão ter um equivalente, e a gente não tem como traduzir por algo da mesma época. Guilherme Gontijo: Então, a gente precisa fazer um exercício especulativo, experimental, pra imaginar os possíveis efeitos daqueles textos no seu mundo de partida, né? A gente nunca vai saber o sabor exato de um texto grego ou romano, porque por mais que a gente tenha dicionário e gramática, a gente não tem o afeto, aquele afeto minucioso da língua que a gente tem na nossa. Lívia: Essas questões de escolhas de tradução, que podem aproximar ou afastar a língua da qual vai se traduzir pra língua que será traduzida se aproximam das questões sociais e políticas que são intrínsecas à linguagem. [música de transição] Lidia: Assim como qualquer outro texto, os escritos em latim ou grego nunca serão neutros. Mesmo fazendo parte de um mundo tão distante da gente, eles reproduzem projetos políticos e identitários tanto da antiguidade quanto dos atuais. Andrea Kouklanakis: Eu acho que esse aspecto político e histórico dos estudos clássicos é interessante porque é uma coisa quando você tá fazendo faculdade, quando eu fiz pelo menos, a gente não tinha muita ideia, né? Você tava completamente sempre perdida no nível microscópico da gramática, né? De tentar a tradução, essas coisas, você tá só, completamente submersa nos seus livros, no seu trabalho de aula em aula, tentando sobreviver ao Cícero. Lívia: Como a Andrea explicou, os estudos que chamamos de filológicos, soam como uma ciência objetiva. Eles tentam achar a gênese de um texto correto, como uma origem e acabam transformando os estudos clássicos em um modelo de programa de império ou de colonização. Andrea Kouklanakis: Então, por exemplo, agora quando eu dou aula sobre o legado dos estudos clássicos na América Latina Agora eu sei disso, então com os meus alunos a gente lê vários textos primários, né, e secundários, que envolvem discurso de construção de nação, de construção de império, de construção do outro, que são tecidos com os discursos clássicos, né, que é essa constante volta a Atenas, a Roma, é, o prestígio dos estudos clássicos, né? Então, a minha pesquisa se desenvolveu nesse sentido de como que esses latino afro brasileiros, esses escritores de várias áreas, como que eles lidaram na evolução intelectual deles, na história intelectual deles, como que eles lidaram com um ramo de conhecimento que é o centro do prestígio. Eles mesmo incorporando a falta de prestígio completa. O próprio corpo deles significa ausência total de prestígio e como que eles então interagem com uma área que é o centro do prestígio, sabe? Lidia: Então, como você percebeu, a Andrea investiga como os escritores afro-latino-americanos negociaram essa tradição clássica, símbolo máximo de prestígio, com suas histórias incorporadas a um lugar sem prestígio, marcadas em seus corpos pelo tom de pele. Lívia: Esse exercício que a professora Andrea tem feito com seus alunos na Hunter College tem sido uma prática cada vez mais presente nos Estudos Clássicos da América Latina e aqui no Brasil. É um exercício de colocar um olhar crítico pro mundo antigo e não apenas como uma forma de simplesmente celebrar uma antiguidade hierarquicamente superior a nós e a nossa história. Lidia: Nesse ponto, é importante a gente pontuar que a professora Andrea fala de um lugar muito particular, porque ela é uma mulher negra, brasileira, atuando em uma universidade nos Estados Unidos e em uma área de estudos historicamente tradicional. Lívia: Ela relatou pra gente um pouco da sua experiência como uma das primeiras mulheres negras a se doutorar em Estudos Clássicos em Harvard. Andrea Kouklanakis: Eu também não queria deixar de dizer que, politicamente, o meu entendimento como classista foi mais ou menos imposto de fora pra mim, sobre mim como uma mulher de cor nos estudos clássicos, porque eu estava exatamente na década de final de 90, meio final de 90, quando eu comecei a fazer os estudos clássicos na Harvard e foi coincidentemente ali quando também saiu, acho que o segundo ou terceiro volume do Black Athena, do Bernal. E, infelizmente, então, coincidiu com eu estar lá, né? Fazendo o meu doutorado nessa época. E na época existiam esses chat rooms, você podia entrar no computador e é uma coisa estranha, as pessoas interagiam ali, né? O nível de antipatia e posso até dizer ódio mesmo que muitas pessoas expressavam pela ideia de que poderia existir uma conexão entre a Grécia e a África, sabe? A mera ideia. Era uma coisa tão forte sabe, eu não tinha a experiência ou a preparação psicológica de receber esse tipo de resposta que era com tantos ânimos, sabe? Lidia: Com esse relato, a professora Andrea revelou pra gente como o preconceito com a população negra é tão explícita nos Estados Unidos e como ela, mesmo tendo passado a infância e a adolescência no Brasil, sentiu mais os impactos disso por lá. Lívia: Mas, fora o preconceito racial, historicamente construído pelas nossas raízes de colonização e escravização da população negra, como estudiosa de Estudos Clássicos, foi nessa época que a Andrea percebeu que existia esse tipo de discussão e que ainda não estava sendo apresentada pra ela na faculdade. Andrea Kouklanakis: Depois que eu me formei, eu entrei em contato com a mulher que era diretora de admissão de alunos e ela confirmou pra mim que é eu acho que eu sou a primeira pessoa de cor a ter um doutorado da Harvard nos Estudos Clássicos. E eu acho que mesmo que eu não seja a primeira pessoa de cor fazendo doutorado lá, provavelmente eu sou a primeira mulher de cor. Lidia: Vamos destacar agora, alguns pontos significativos do relato da professora Andrea. [som de ícone] Lívia: O livro que ela citou é o Black Athena, do estudioso de história política Martin Bernal. A teoria criada pelo autor afirmava que a civilização clássica grega na realidade se originou de culturas da região do Crescente Fértil, Egito, Fenícia e Mesopotâmia, ao invés de ter surgido de forma completamente independente, como tradicionalmente é colocado pelos historiadores germânicos. [som de ícone] Lívia: Ao propor uma hipótese alternativa sobre as origens da Grécia antiga e da civilização clássica, o livro fomentou discussões relevantes nos estudos da área, gerando controvérsias científicas, ideológicas e raciais. [som de ícone] Lidia: Em contrapartida às concepções racistas vinda de pesquisadores, historiadores e classicistas conservadores, a professora Andrea citou também um aluno negro de Harvard, o historiador e classicista Frank Snowden Jr.. [som de ícone] Lívia: Entre seus diversos estudos sobre a relação de brancos e negros na antiguidade, está o livro Before Color Prejudice: The Ancient View of Black, em português, Antes do Preconceito Racial: A Visão Antiga dos Negros. Um aprofundamento de suas investigações sobre as relações entre africanos e as civilizações clássicas de Roma e da Grécia e demonstra que os antigos não discriminavam os negros por causa de sua cor. [som de ícone] Lidia: O livro lança luz pra um debate importantíssimo, que é a diferença de atitudes dos brancos em relação aos negros nas sociedades antigas e modernas, além de observar que muitas das representações artísticas desses povos se assemelham aos afro-americanos da atualidade. Andrea Kouklanakis: Mas, então é isso, então essa coisa política é uma coisa que foi imposta, mas a imposição foi até legal porque aí me levou a conhecer e descobrir e pesquisar essa área inteira, que agora é uma coisa que eu me dedico muito, que é olhar qual que é a implicação dos estudos clássicos na política, na raça, na história e continuando dando as minhas aulas e traduzindo, fazendo tradução, eu adoro tradução, então, esse aspecto do estudo clássico, eu sempre gostei. [música de transição] Lívia: O Guilherme também falou pra gente sobre essa questão política e histórica dos Estudos Clássicos, de que ficar olhando pro passado como objeto desvinculado, nos impede de poder articular essas discussões com a política do presente. Guilherme Gontijo: E acho que o resultado quando a gente faz isso é muitas vezes colocar os clássicos como defensores do status quo, que é o que o um certo império brasileiro fez no período de Dom Pedro, é o que Mussolini fez também. Quer dizer, vira propaganda de estado. Lidia: Mas, ao contrário, quando a gente usa os clássicos pra pensar as angústias do presente, a gente percebe que é uma área de estudos que pode ser super relevante e super viva pra qualquer conversa do presente. Lívia: E, na tradução e na recepção desses textos antigos, como será que essas questões aparecem? O Guilherme deu um exemplo pra gente, de uma tradução que ele fez do poeta romano Horácio. [som de ícone] Lidia: Horácio foi um poeta romano do século I a.C., famoso por escrever poesias nos formatos de Odes, Sátiras e Epístolas, e defendia a ideia do “justo meio” — evitar excessos e buscar a medida certa na vida. Guilherme Gontijo: Tô lembrando aqui de uma ode de Horácio, acho que esse exemplo vai ser bom. Em que ele termina o poema oferecendo um vai matar um cabrito pra uma fonte, vai oferendar um cabrito para uma fonte. E quando eu tava traduzindo, vários comentadores lembravam de como essa imagem chocou violentamente o século XIX na recepção. Os comentadores sempre assim: “Como assim, Horácio, um homem tão refinado vai fazer um ato tão brutal, tão irracional?” Quer dizer, isso diz muito mais sobre a recepção do XIX e do começo do XX, do que sobre Horácio. Porque, assim, é óbvio que Horácio sacrificaria um cabrito para uma fonte. E nisso, ele não está escapando em nada do resto da sua cultura. Agora, é curioso como, por exemplo, o nosso modelo estatal coloca a área de clássicas no centro, por exemplo, dos cursos de Letras, mas acha que práticas do Candomblé, que são análogas, por exemplo, você pode oferecer animais para divindades ou mesmo para águas, seriam práticas não não não racionais ou não razoáveis ou sujas ou qualquer coisa do tipo, como quiserem. Né? Então, eu acho que a gente pode e esse é o nosso lugar, talvez seja nossa missão mesmo. Lívia: Como o Guilherme explicou, nós no Brasil e na América Latina temos influência do Atlântico Negro, das línguas bantas, do candomblé, da umbanda e temos um aporte, tanto teórico quanto afetivo, pra pensar os clássicos, a partir dessas tradições tão próximas, que a própria tradição europeia tem que fazer um esforço gigantesco pra chegar perto, enquanto pra gente é natural. Lidia: E não podemos nos esquecer também da nossa convivência com várias etnias indígenas, que possuem comparações muito fortes entre essas culturas. Guilherme Gontijo: Eu diria, eu entendo muito melhor o sentido de um hino arcaico, grego, ouvindo uma cantiga de terreiro no Brasil, do que só comparando com literatura. Eu acho que é relevante para a área de clássicas, não é uma mera curiosidade, sabe? Então, eu tenho cada vez mais lido gregos e romanos à luz da antropologia moderna, contemporaneíssima, sabe? Eu acho que muitos frutos aparecem de modo mais exemplar ou mais óbvio quando a gente faz essa comparação, porque a gente aí tira de fato os clássicos do lugar de clássicos que lhes é dado. [música de transição] Lívia: Pra além dessas discussões teóricas e políticas, a tradução é também um ato estético e existem algumas formas de repensar a presença da poesia antiga no mundo contemporâneo a partir de uma estética aplicada na linguagem e nos modos de traduzir. Lidia: No caso do Guilherme, ele vem trabalhando há um tempo com a tradução como performance. Guilherme Gontijo: E aí eu pensei: “Não, eu poderia traduzir Horácio para cantar”. Eu vou aprender a cantar esses metros antigos e vou cantar a tradução na mesmíssima melodia. Quer dizer, ao invés de eu pensar em metro no sentido do papel, eu vou pensar em metro no sentido de uma vocalidade. E foi isso que eu fiz. Foi o meu o meu doutorado, isso acabou rendendo a tradução de Safo. Lívia: Além das traduções publicadas em livros e artigos, o Guilherme também coloca essas performances na rua com o grupo Pecora Loca, que desde 2015 se propõe a fazer performances de poemas antigos, medievais e, às vezes, modernos, como um modo de ação poética. Lidia: Inclusive a trilha sonora que você ouviu ali no início deste trecho é uma das performances realizada pelo grupo, nesse caso do poema da Ode 34 de Horácio, com tradução do próprio Guilherme e música de Guilherme Bernardes, que o grupo gentilmente nos passou. Guilherme Gontijo: Isso pra mim foi um aprendizado teórico também muito grande, porque você percebe que um poema vocal, ele demanda pra valorizar a sua ou valorar a sua qualidade, também a performance. Quer dizer, o poema não é só um texto no papel, mas ele depende de quem canta, como canta, qual instrumento canta. Lívia: O Guilherme explicou que no início eles usavam instrumentos antigos como tímpano, címbalo, lira e até uma espécie de aulos. Mas, como, na verdade, não temos informações precisas sobre como era a musicalidade antiga, eles resolveram afirmar o anacronismo e a forma síncrona de poesia e performance, e, atualmente, incorporaram instrumentos modernos ao grupo como a guitarra elétrica, o baixo elétrico, o teclado e a bateria. Guilherme Gontijo: Então, a gente tem feito isso e eu acho que tem um gesto político, porque é muito curioso que a gente vai tocar num bar e às vezes tem alguém desavisado e gosta de Anacreonte. Olha, caramba, adorei Anacreonte. É, é, e ela percebe que Anacreonte, ela ouviu a letra e a letra é basicamente: “Traga um vinho para mim que eu quero encher a cara”. Então ela percebe que poesia antiga não é algo elevado, para poucos eleitos capazes de depreender a profundidade do saber grego. Ó, Anacreonte é poema de farra. Lidia: A partir da performance as pessoas se sentem autorizadas a tomar posse dessa herança cultural e a se relacionar com ela. O que cria uma forma de divulgar e difundir os Estudos Clássicos a partir de uma relação íntima, que é a linguagem musical. Guilherme Gontijo: E a experiência mais forte que eu tive nisso, ela é do passado e foi com o Guilherme Bernardes. Lembro que dei uma aula e mostrei a melodia do Carpe Diem, do Horácio. Da Ode. E tava lá mostrando o poema, sendo bem técnico ali, como é que explica o metro, como é que põe uma melodia, etc, etc. E uns três dias depois ele me mandou uma gravação que ele fez no Garage Band, totalmente sintética. De uma versão só instrumental, quer dizer, o que ele mais curtiu foi a melodia. E a gente às vezes esquece disso, quer dizer, um aspecto da poesia arcaica ou da poesia oral antiga romana é que alguém poderia adorar a melodia e nem prestar tanta atenção na letra. E que continuariam dizendo: “É um grande poeta”. Eu senti uma glória quando eu pensei: “Caraca, um asclepiadeu maior tocou uma pessoa como melodia”. A pessoa nem se preocupou tanto que é o poema do Carpe Diem, mas a melodia do asclepiadeu maior. [som de ícone] Lívia: Só por curiosidade, “asclepiadeu maior” é um tipo de verso poético greco-latino composto por um espondeu, dois coriambos e um iambo. Você não precisa saber como funcionam esses versos na teoria. Essa forma poética foi criada pelo poeta lírico grego Asclepíades de Samos, que viveu no século III a.C., por isso o nome, o mais importante é que foi o verso utilizado por Horácio em muitas de suas odes. [música de transição] Lidia: Agora, já encaminhando para o final do nosso episódio, não podemos ir embora sem falar sobre o trabalho de recepção e tradução realizado pela professora Andrea, lá na Hunter College, nos EUA. Lívia: Além do seu projeto sobre a presença dos clássicos nas obras de escritores afro-latino-americanos, com foco especial no Brasil, de autores como Lima Barreto, Luís Gama, Juliano Moreira e Auta de Sousa. A professora também publicou o livro Reis Imperfeitos: Pretendentes na Odisseia, Poética da Culpa e Sátira Irlandesa, pela Harvard University Press, em 2023, e as suas pesquisas abarcam a poesia homérica, a poética comparada e as teorias da tradução. Lidia: A professora Andrea faz um exercício muito importante de tradução de autores negros brasileiros pro inglês, não somente das obras literárias, mas também de seus pensamentos teóricos, pra que esses pensamentos sejam conhecidos fora do Brasil e alcance um público maior. Lívia: E é muito interessante como a relação com os estudos da tradução pra professora Andrea também tocam em um lugar muito íntimo e pessoal, assim como foi pro Guilherme nas suas traduções em performances. Lidia: E ela contou pra gente um pouco dessa história. Andrea Kouklanakis: Antes de falar da língua, é eu vou falar que, quando eu vejo a biografia deles, especialmente quando eu passei bastante tempo com o Luiz Gama. O que eu achei incrível é o nível de familiaridade de entendimento que eu tive da vida corriqueira deles. Por exemplo, Cruz e Souza, né? A família dele morava no fundo lá da casa, né? Esse tipo de coisa assim. O Luiz Gama também quando ele fala do aluno lá que estava na casa quando ele foi escravizado por um tempo, quando ele era criança, o cara que escravizou ele tinha basicamente uma pensão pra estudantes, que estavam fazendo advocacia, essas coisas, então na casa tinham residentes e um deles ensinou ele a ler, a escrever. O que eu achei interessantíssimo é que eu estou há 100 anos separada desse povo, mas a dinâmica social foi completamente familiar pra mim, né? A minha mãe, como eu te falei, ela sempre foi empregada doméstica, ela já se aposentou há muito tempo, mas a vida dela toda inteira ela trabalhou como empregada doméstica. E pra mim foi muito interessante ver como que as coisas não tinham mudado muito entre a infância de alguém como Cruz e Souza e a minha infância, né? Obviamente ninguém me adotou, nada disso, mas eu passei muito tempo dentro da casa de família. que era gente que tinha muito interesse em ajudar a gente, em dar, como se diz, a scholarship, né? O lugar que a minha mãe trabalhou mais tempo assim, continuamente por 10 anos, foi, aliás, na casa do ex-reitor da USP, na década de 70 e 80, o Dr. Orlando Marques de Paiva. Lívia: Ao contar essa história tão íntima, a Andrea explicou como ela tenta passar essa coincidência de vivências, separada por cem anos ou mais no tempo, mas que, apesar de todo avanço na luta contra desigualdades raciais, ainda hoje refletem na sua memória e ainda são muito estáticas. Lidia: Essa memória reflete na linguagem, porque, como ela explicou, esses autores utilizam muitas palavras que a gente não usa mais, porque são palavras lá do século XVIII e XIX, mas o contexto chega pra ela de uma forma muito íntima e ainda viva, por ela ter vivenciado essas questões. Andrea Kouklanakis: Eu não sou poeta, mas eu tô dando uma de poeta, sabe? E quando eu percebo que tem algum estilo assim, a Auta de vez em quando tem um certo estilo assim, ambrósia, não sei do quê, sabe? Eu sei que ela está querendo dizer perfume, não sei o quê, eu não vou mudar, especialmente palavras, porque eu também estou vindo da minha perspectiva é de quem sabe grego e latim, eu também estou interessada em palavras que são em português, mas são gregas. Então, eu preservo, sabe? Lívia: Então, pra Andrea, no seu trabalho tradutório ela procura mesclar essas duas questões, a sua relação íntima com os textos e também a sua formação como classicista, que pensa a etimologia das palavras e convive com essa multiplicidade de línguas e culturas, caminhando entre o grego, o latim, o inglês e o português. [música de transição] [bg] Lidia: Ao ouvir nossos convidados de hoje, a Andrea Koclanakis e o Guilherme Gontijo Flores, percebemos que traduzir textos clássicos é muito mais do que passar palavras de uma língua pra outra. É atravessar disputas políticas, revisitar o passado com olhos do presente, reconstruir memórias coloniais e imaginar novos modos de convivência com as tradições antigas. Lívia: A tradução é pesquisa, criação, crítica e também pode ser transformação. Agradecemos aos entrevistados e a você que nos acompanhou até aqui! [música de transição] [créditos] Livia: O roteiro desse episódio foi escrito por mim, Lívia Mendes, que também fiz a locução junto com a Lidia Torres. Lidia: A revisão foi feita por mim, Lidia Torres e pela Mayra Trinca. Lidia: Esse episódio faz parte do trabalho de divulgação científica que a Lívia Mendes desenvolve no Centro de Estudos Clássicos e Centro de Teoria da Filologia, vinculados ao Instituto de Estudos da Linguagem e ao Instituto de Estudos Avançados da Unicamp, financiado pelo projeto Mídia Ciência da FAPESP, a quem agradecemos pelo financiamento. Lívia: Os trabalhos técnicos são de Daniel Rangel. A trilha sonora é de Kevin MacLeod e também gentilmente cedida pelo grupo Pecora Loca. A vinheta do Oxigênio foi produzida pelo Elias Mendez. Lidia: O Oxigênio conta com apoio da Secretaria Executiva de Comunicação da Unicamp. Você encontra a gente no site oxigenio.comciencia.br, no Instagram e no Facebook, basta procurar por Oxigênio Podcast. Lívia: Pra quem chegou até aqui, tomara que você tenha curtido passear pelo mundo da antiguidade greco-romana e entender um pouco de como os textos antigos chegam até nós pela recepção e tradução. Você pode deixar um comentário, na sua plataforma de áudio favorita, contando o que achou. A gente vai adorar te ver por lá! Até mais e nos encontramos no próximo episódio. [vinheta final]

In this episode, Ciro Greco (Co-founder & CEO, Bauplan) joins me to discuss why the future of data infrastructure must be "Code-First" and how this philosophy accidentally created the perfect environment for AI Agents.We explore why the "Modern Data Stack" isn't ready for autonomous agents and why a programmable lakehouse is the solution. Ciro explains that while we trust agents to write code (because we can roll it back), allowing them to write data requires strict safety rails. He breaks down how Bauplan uses "Git for Data" semantics - branching, isolation, and transactionality - to provide an air-gapped sandbox where agents can safely operate without corrupting production data. Welcome to the future of the lakehouse.Bauplan: https://www.bauplanlabs.com/

Host Mark Nelson sits down with 3D jewelry CAD designing expert Sara Greco in this For the Love of Jewelers podcast episode. With 23 years of experience in bench work, wax carving, and stone setting, Sara has hammered out her skills and refined her creative process. In their conversation, Sara and Mark discuss finding inspiration, her workflows, tools of the trade, and her ongoing collaboration with Rio Grande where she helps create luxury collections as part of Rio's custom casting services. The focus then shifts to how CAD software has changed the jewelry industry, blending traditional techniques with cutting-edge digital tools to achieve precision and artistry. __________________________________________________________Want to work with Sara? Find her services below:https://www.riogrande.com/custom-casting-services/https://www.instagram.com/saragrecojewelry/https://saragrecojewelry.com/__________________________________________________________Thanks to Durston for sponsoring this episodeFrom rolling mills to bench shears, Durston tools are engineered to last.  Save 20% with DURSTON20 now through November 30th, 2025. http://riogrande.com/brands/durston-rolling-mills/?Brand=Durston&tab=products

In this episode, Dr. Peggy Greco of Nemours Children's Health and Rachel Hamilton of NRC Health, discuss how their organizations use equity centered data, communication tools, and patient voice to close experience gaps and improve outcomes for children and families.This episide is sponsored by NRC Health.

Send us a textImmunizations are the number one patient care service offered by community pharmacy but they can also be leveraged as a key growth driver in your pharmacy.So how exactly can seasonal immunizations become a reliable growth engine? In this episode, Scotty Sykes, CPA, CFP® and Austin Murray sit down with Dr. Kyle Beyer, PharmD, Owner of North Shore Pharmacy and Greco De Valencia, VP of Pharmacy at Live Oak Bank to unpack how flu and other vaccines drive new business, deepen relationships, and open doors to higher-margin services.We cover:How vaccine programs (in-store and off-site) become a patient acquisition funnelThe practical steps to stand up a vaccine program by fallLeveraging point-of-care testing and collaborative practice to add cash-pay revenueSimple tech workflows for booking and intake that keep experiences smoothAnd moreMore About Our Guest: Dr. Kyle Beyer, PharmD, has been North Shore Pharmacy's owner since March of 2020. He earned his Doctor of Pharmacy degree from the University of Iowa in 2010, combining his love for chemistry and passion for helping others. After spending ten years working for larger pharmacy chains in the Milwaukee Area, it became clear to Kyle that there was an opportunity to serve the community better. This desire to provide superior care led him to pursue independent pharmacy ownership.Kyle is board certified in Ambulatory Care Pharmacy (BCACP) and has completed several certificate courses in Travel Health, Immunizations, Point of Care testing and Diabetic Care. He has taught and precepted students from several Colleges of Pharmacy and is an active participant in the Pharmacy Society of Wisconsin. Kyle has sat on several multidisciplinary committees related to improving access to vaccines in the Milwaukee Area.Kyle and his wife, Gretchen, live in the North Shore. They have two children, a dog, and they love to explore the local parks. Kyle enjoys cycling and going to Brewer's games.Connect with Dr. Kyle Beyer, PharmD and Greco De Valencia below:Kyle Beyer LinkedInNorth Shore Pharmacy WebsiteNorth Shore Pharmacy InstagramNorth Shore Pharmacy FacebookGreco's LinkedInLive Oak Bank WebsiteStay connected with us:FacebookTwitterLinkedInScotty Sykes – CPA, CFP® LinkedInMore Resources on these Topics:Podcast – Pioneering Solutions in Remote TerritoriesPodcast - The Fight for Fair Drug PricingPodcast - Relationships That Scale

Nieves Concostrina trae una tercera entrega sobre cómo se intentó salvar las obras del Museo del Prado durante los bombardeos de Madrid en octubre y noviembre de 1936.

It was my distinct honor to have a conversation about the life and legacy of Firefighter Dillon Rinaldo, a man whose impact continues to live on through the Dillon Rinaldo Foundation.Dillon tragically lost his life in the line of duty, but his spirit—his leadership, kindness, and the joy he brought to those around himThrough the foundation created in his honor, his name continues to serve a powerful purpose: supporting firefighters and their families in times of need. It's a testament to who Dillon was—someone who always put others first, both on and off the job.Hearing Scott Greco share memories of Dillon, and the heart behind the foundation's mission, was a reminder of what true brotherhood in this profession means. Dillon's legacy isn't just remembered—it's lived out through every act of service and support the foundation provides.The Dillon Rinaldo Foundation continues to grow, offering community support, charitable outreach, and training opportunities for firefighters across the nation—all dedicated to keeping Dillon's memory alive through service and giving back.If you'd like to learn more, follow, or contribute to the foundation and its mission to support firefighters and their families, please visit the Dillon Rinaldo Foundation online or on social media.Gone but never forgotten. His legacy continues to make a difference.Takeaways:​The foundation is dedicated to supporting firefighters' families in need.​Dillon Rinaldo was a beloved figure in the firefighting community.​The foundation was inspired by the brotherhood of firefighters.​Personal connections drive the mission of the foundation.​Community support is vital for the foundation's success.​Future events will include training opportunities for firefighters.​The foundation aims to keep Dillon's memory alive through charitable acts.​Cherished memories of Dillon highlight his character and leadership.​The foundation is open to helping firefighters nationwide.​Engagement with the community is a priority for the foundation.​Honoring a Hero: The Dillon Rinaldo Foundation​Brotherhood in Action: Supporting Firefighters​"He was genuinely a good dude."​"This is what brotherhood's about."​"Dillon made us proud every day."Sound Bites:00:00 Introduction to the Foundation01:21 The Legacy of Dillon Rinaldo07:38 The Tragic Incident and Its Impact12:51 The Foundation's Mission and Growth19:05 Future Plans for the Foundation24:02 Cherished Memories of Dillon 30:30 Connecting with the Community

Nieves Concostrina trae una tercera entrega sobre cómo se intentó salvar las obras del Museo del Prado durante los bombardeos de Madrid en octubre y noviembre de 1936.

Nieves Concostrina trae una tercera entrega sobre cómo se intentó salvar las obras del Museo del Prado durante los bombardeos de Madrid en octubre y noviembre de 1936.

What happens when success on paper doesn't feel like success in real life?In this episode of the WNY Entrepreneur Podcast, we sit down with Dan Greco, founder of Most Alive, to talk about the uncomfortable but powerful moment he walked away from a high-ranking corporate career to build something more meaningful.Dan shares how his personal turning point became the foundation for a business that now helps other high-performing entrepreneurs find clarity, fulfillment, and forward momentum. This isn't just a story about leaving a job—it's about breaking free from limiting stories, realigning your values, and learning how to lead with purpose.In this episode, you'll learn:✅ Why Dan walked away from a senior VP role at M&T Bank to launch Most Alive✅ The surprising reason high achievers often feel stuck or unfulfilled✅ How to recognize when frustration outweighs fulfillment—and what to do about it✅ The coaching framework he uses to help entrepreneurs turn chaos into clarity✅ Why “asking why” the right way can unlock deeper motivation and direction✅ How limiting beliefs—not lack of resources—hold most business owners back✅ What failure taught him about feedback, humility, and long-term growth

Nieves Concostrina relata cómo se intentó salvar las obras del Museo del Prado durante los bombardeos de Madrid en octubre y noviembre de 1936.

Nieves Concostrina relata cómo se intentó salvar las obras del Museo del Prado durante los bombardeos de Madrid en octubre y noviembre de 1936.

Nieves Concostrina relata cómo se intentó salvar las obras del Museo del Prado durante los bombardeos de Madrid en octubre y noviembre de 1936.

Nieves Concostrina nos trae un segundo episodio sobre cómo se intentó salvar las obras del Museo del Prado durante los bombardeos de Madrid en octubre y noviembre de 1936.

Nieves Concostrina nos trae un segundo episodio sobre cómo se intentó salvar las obras del Museo del Prado durante los bombardeos de Madrid en octubre y noviembre de 1936.

Hello!New episode of the podcast is out. This is part of a little bonus season I'll be occasionally releasing; in between the regular episodes of the podcast!Here we will be talking with Greek chefs abroad,-that's outside Greece- who cook, work and live in different places, and promote the Greek cuisine in their own way.What are their dreams? How's Greek food perceived outside Greece in their perspective countries, and do they feel as ambassadors for Greece and her gastronomy?What are the most embarrassing aspects of Greek food abroad? And how is the national cuisine in the places that they live? Who does what best?Today for the first episode of this series I' m chatting to chef Aino Mavrogiannaki; a Greek-Finnish chef who lives and works in Helsinki, but who's is from Crete as well, and grew in New York too!Let's find out!Love,ThomSupport the podcast on Ko-Fi and Patreon for ad-free episodes! https://ko-fi.com/thedeliciouslegacypodcasthttps://www.patreon.com/c/thedeliciouslegacySupport this show http://supporter.acast.com/the-delicious-legacy. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Fulfill the Christian call to pray for your enemies with these beautiful prayer cards from our sponsor Holy Heroes, now in a shareable 5-pack!: https://bit.ly/TheDeep_HolyHeroesIn this episode of The Deep, Erika responds to a recent viral article by Helen Andrews titled "The Great Feminization." Andrews claims that the increasing number of women holding positions in institutions has directly led to those institutions becoming "woke." But is Andrews missing the point? Is it true that women caused wokeism? Or is the real explanation something deeper?Timestamps:0:00 - Intro: “The Great Feminization”3:52 - The origins of “woke-ism” 7:35 - Is cancel culture unique to our moment?9:22 - What Andrew's theory is missing12:04 - Changing the demographics is not the simple fix14:34 - The solution: re-feminizationSourcesAhern, Erika J. “As Critical Race Theory Thrives, Author Takes on the ‘Woke Elite'.” National Catholic Register, August 9, 2021. https://www.ncregister.com/news/as-critical-race-theory-thrives-author-takes-on-the-woke-elite.Greco, Ivana. “Is Academic Cancel Culture Driven by Women?” The Home Front (Substack), 2024. https://thehomefront.substack.com/p/is-academic-cancel-culture-driven.Roy, Helen. “The Flourishing of the Female Soul.” Fairer Disputations, March 24, 2023. https://fairerdisputations.org/the-flourishing-of-the-female-soul/.“Letter to Women.” Pope John Paul II, June 29, 1995. In Vatican.va. https://www.vatican.va/content/john-paul-ii/en/letters/1995/documents/hf_jp-ii_let_29061995_women.html.Laverty, Rhys. “Lady Scrooges.” First Things, December 1, 2024. https://www.firstthings.com/lady-scrooges/.Subscribe to the LOOPcast on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@theLOOPcast

Send us a textEver been told you're complaining too much about how women are treated because "things are so much better now"? Yeah, me too. In this episode, I sit down with journalist and author Dorothy Greco to talk about her new book For the Love of Women, and we dig into why sexism is absolutely still alive and well—and how it's affecting all of us in ways we might not even realize. This conversation is going to help you connect the dots, give you language to talk about it, and remind you that no, you're not crazy.THANK YOU TO OUR SPONSOROrder Dorothy Greco's book For the Love of Women which just launched this week!TO SUPPORT US: Join our Patreon for as little as $5 a month to support our workAnd check out our Merch, or any of our courses!Give to the Good Fruit Faith Initiative of the Bosko FoundationJoin our email list!LINKS MENTIONED:Dorothy Greco's websiteDorothy's Substack: "What's Faith Got to Do With It" The song Not All Men by Morgan St. JeanSupport the showJoin Sheila at Bare Marriage.com!Check out her books: The Great Sex Rescue She Deserves Better The Marriage You Want and the Study Guide The Good Girl's Guide to Great Sex and The Good Guy's Guide to Great Sex And she has an Orgasm Course and a Libido course too!Check out all her courses, FREE resources, social media, books, and so much more at Sheila's LinkTree.

My friend Suzie Greco—a survivor of child sex abuse and domestic abuse, a Latter-day Saint, a Harvard Divinity School graduate (Master's in Theology), a doctrinal candidate, and an advocate in numerous organizations working to end abuse—joins us to share her powerful story and discuss her new book, The Stone Sphere. In this must-listen-to podcast, Suzie shares: The meaning behind the title and image on the front cover of the book. Untrained Ministry and Institutional Harm, including both positive and negative experiences with her Stake President, David F. Hollard—who gave Suzie permission to include his name and their experiences in the book. A Transformative Theology of Forgiveness—a much healthier framework for healing. Pathways to Healing, Redemption, and Spiritual Transcendence, the golden thread of the book. It's hard to overstate the power and importance of this conversation. Suzie is doing breakthrough, trailblazing work. I learned so much and was deeply moved. If you are a survivor of abuse—sexual, domestic, clergy, or otherwise—please listen. This episode will help you. (You are also welcome to reach out to Suzie directly; her email is in the show notes.) And if you are a local church leader, friend, family member, or really anyone else, please listen and share this podcast and Suzie's book. It will provide you with better tools to help and support others. I truly wish I had heard this podcast and read Suzie's book before my own church assignments—I would have been so much better equipped to help provide healing. Thank you, Suzie, for writing this book and for your vulnerability on the podcast. Your insights, courage, and work are helping so many. You are one of my new heroes. Links: Suzie's Website: https://www.thestonesphere.com/ Suzie's Email: S.E.Greco@sms.ed.ac.uk Book on Amazon: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0FD9FT8B1 Suzie's Facebook :https://www.facebook.com/suzgrec2 Dialogue Journal Article, "Confronting Men's Violence Against Women & Girls in the LDS Church": https://www.dialoguejournal.com/articles/confronting-mens-violence-against-women-and-girls-in-the-church-of-jesus-christ-of-latter-day-saints/