Podcast appearances and mentions of David Chase

The conversation comes full circle. In the final chapter of this Sports Cards Live discussion, Jeremy Lee, David Chase, Joe Poirot, and Josh Adams reflect on the broader implications of the reconstructed T206 Honus Wagner and what it may mean for the future of sports card collecting. The panel discusses whether restoration will become more accepted, how collectors should think about exceptions, where personal collecting philosophies differ from hobby standards, and why context matters when evaluating altered or restored cards. The episode also includes a fun conversation about LeBron James, player legacies, and whether changing teams affects a superstar's long-term collectibility. In this episode: Has the hobby reached a tipping point on restoration? Can collectors make exceptions for iconic cards? Personal collecting rules vs. hobby standards Does intent matter when a card is altered? Could the FrankenWagner change collecting forever? LeBron James, team loyalty, and hobby legacy Final thoughts from the panel Looking ahead to The National Thank you for listening to Sports Cards Live. If you enjoyed this episode, please help us grow the hobby by supporting the show:

Has the hobby crossed a line, or opened the door to something entirely new? The debate over the reconstructed T206 Honus Wagner continues as Jeremy Lee, David Chase, Josh Adams, and Joe Poirot explore the bigger implications of the now-famous "FrankenWagner." Could this become the template for future restorations? Did CGC make the right call? What should the card actually be called? And perhaps the biggest question of all: if you had the money, would you buy it? The conversation expands well beyond one card and examines what this means for grading companies, restoration standards, collector confidence, and the future of vintage sports cards. In this episode: Did CGC make the right decision? Is the FrankenWagner changing the hobby? What should the label actually say? Would you buy this card over an authentic Wagner? Could this become the new standard for restoration? The cheapest path to owning a T206 Wagner? Where should grading companies draw the line? The panel debates the future of restoration Whether you're fascinated by restoration, passionate about vintage cards, or simply curious where the hobby is headed, this is a discussion you won't want to miss. Please support the show!

The conversation about the reconstructed T206 Honus Wagner takes an unexpected turn. What begins as a debate over one controversial card quickly becomes a broader discussion about grading company transparency, authentication standards, and whether collectors are receiving enough information to make informed buying decisions. Jeremy Lee is joined by David Chase, Joe Poirot, and Josh Adams as they debate whether the famous "FrankenWagner" should really be considered authentic, restored, rebuilt, or something entirely different. More importantly, they ask whether grading companies owe collectors far more transparency than they're currently providing. In this episode: The FrankenWagner debate continues Should grading companies disclose more information? Why "Authentic" may not be enough QR codes, restoration reports, and collector transparency Are grading companies following their own standards? Restoration vs. reconstruction Can collectors truly trust the label? The future of grading and authentication This conversation goes beyond one famous card and explores what collectors should reasonably expect from the companies entrusted to authenticate the hobby's most valuable collectibles. Please support the show!

Cindy Pearlman Gaber, senior writer for the New York Times and entertainment columnist for the Las Vegas Review-Journal, joins Bob Sirott to talk about a new project from “The Sopranos” director David Chase, Mindy Kaling’s upcoming visit to Chicago, and Jennifer Garner’s favorite summer dessert. She also shares details about a Michael Douglas memoir, a […]

The hobby's biggest controversy just got even bigger. Jeremy Lee opens the episode with David Chase, discussing National budgeting, the summer auction season, Michael Jordan's renewed partnership with Upper Deck, and the latest hobby headlines before welcoming investigative journalist Darren Rovell for an in-depth conversation about one of the most controversial stories in recent hobby history. Together they unpack the former Collectible fractional assets now being sold through Heritage Auctions, the legal authority behind the sales, the ethical questions surrounding the proceeds, what this means for former investors, and why the story is far from over. In this episode: Heritage's controversial fractional asset auctions Who really owns these collectibles? Can former investors recover their money? Legal rights vs. ethical responsibility Why another major auction house reportedly passed Michael Jordan's new Upper Deck Legacy Partner agreement National buying strategies and managing the hobby budget Whether you're a collector, investor, dealer, or simply passionate about the hobby, this is one conversation you won't want to miss. Please support the show!

The conversation doesn't end when the auction begins. Jeremy Lee, David Chase, Joe Poirot, Josh Adams, and Robert Rothenberg wrap up this episode with a discussion about one of the hobby's most talked-about developing stories: the controversy surrounding assets formerly held by Collectible and their appearance in an upcoming Heritage Auctions sale. The panel explores the responsibilities of auction houses, the challenges surrounding ownership and collector confidence, and why transparency matters as the hobby navigates increasingly complex situations. The discussion also revisits restored cards, whether grading companies should encapsulate them with full disclosure, and how collectors should approach cards that have been repaired or conserved. The episode closes with a preview of next week's Sports Cards Live, where Jeremy will continue investigating the Collectible situation with guests who have firsthand knowledge of the story. If you enjoy the episode, please subscribe, leave a rating and review on your favorite podcast platform, and share it with a fellow collector. It really helps more collectors discover the show. Watch Sports Cards Live on YouTube for the full video experience, and follow Jeremy Lee on Fanatics Collect for exclusive live shows, including The Hunt and weekly auction watch parties. Fanatics Collect referral link:https://fanaticscollect.onelink.me/xx0N/iyiniif4 Thank you for listening, and remember... Sports cards is a lifestyle. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

What is a sports card really worth? Jeremy Lee is joined by David Chase, Robert Rothenberg, Joe Poirot, and Leighton Sheldon for a wide-ranging discussion that begins with PSA's grading guarantee and quickly expands into some of the hobby's biggest unanswered questions. How should collectors interpret comparable sales when buyers and sellers often pay vastly different amounts after premiums, taxes, shipping, and fees? Is "missing out" on a grail card actually a bigger force than fear of missing out? Could future technology eventually detect card restoration that today's grading companies miss? And if that happens, what does it mean for the hobby? The panel also explores collecting philosophy, scarcity, the pursuit of grail cards, and whether collectors would choose more money or more time if it meant enjoying the hobby differently. If you enjoy the episode, please subscribe, leave a rating and review on your favorite podcast platform, and share it with a fellow collector. It really helps more collectors discover the show. Watch Sports Cards Live on YouTube for the full video experience, and follow Jeremy Lee on Fanatics Collect for exclusive live shows, including The Hunt and weekly auction watch parties. Fanatics Collect referral link:https://fanaticscollect.onelink.me/xx0N/iyiniif4 Thank you for listening, and remember... Sports cards is a lifestyle. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Is the hobby quietly changing its mind about card restoration? Jeremy Lee, David Chase, and special guest Robert Rothenberg continue one of the most important conversations in today's hobby by examining real-world examples of restored vintage cards, including dramatic before-and-after transformations that have collectors questioning where conservation ends and alteration begins. The discussion explores surprising reactions from experienced collectors and dealers, whether restoration is becoming widely accepted, why grading companies may struggle to detect certain treatments, and what all of this means for buyers trying to build trustworthy collections. If the hobby's standards are evolving, what does that mean for the future of grading, collecting, and confidence in the marketplace? If you enjoy the episode, please subscribe, leave a rating and review on your favorite podcast platform, and share it with a fellow collector. It really helps more collectors discover the show. Watch Sports Cards Live on YouTube for the full video experience, and follow Jeremy Lee on Fanatics Collect for exclusive live shows, including The Hunt and weekly auction watch parties. Fanatics Collect referral link:https://fanaticscollect.onelink.me/xx0N/iyiniif4 Thank you for listening, and remember... Sports cards is a lifestyle. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

The hobby's biggest ethical debate may just be getting started. Jeremy Lee and David Chase dive into one of the most polarizing topics in sports cards today: restoration, conservation, cleaning, and where the line should actually be drawn. Is removing scrapbook residue acceptable? Does soaking a card fundamentally alter it? Is restoration becoming normalized, and if so, what does that mean for grading, authenticity, and collector trust? The discussion explores whether today's hobby is shifting toward accepting card conservation, how disclosure factors into the equation, whether PSA and other grading companies can realistically detect every restored card, and why this conversation could shape the future of vintage collecting. Whether you're a vintage purist, modern collector, dealer, or grader, this is a conversation every collector should hear. If you enjoy the episode, please subscribe, leave a rating and review on your favorite podcast platform, and share it with a fellow collector. It really helps more collectors discover the show. Watch Sports Cards Live on YouTube for the full video experience, and follow Jeremy Lee on Fanatics Collect for exclusive live shows, including The Hunt and weekly auction watch parties. Fanatics Collect referral link:https://fanaticscollect.onelink.me/xx0N/iyiniif4 Thank you for listening, and remember... Sports cards is a lifestyle. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Can sports card grading evolve without completely reinventing the hobby? Jeremy Lee and David Chase continue their conversation with Chad Hawk, founder of GCC and former executive at Certified Collectibles Group, exploring whether the industry needs an entirely new approach to condition assessment. The discussion dives into the limits of traditional grading, the promise and challenges of AI, why TAG has struggled to gain widespread acceptance in sports cards despite its consistency, and how GCC hopes to create a lower-cost solution that helps collectors, dealers, and grading companies alike. Chad explains why GCC intentionally avoids assigning fixed numerical grades, instead focusing on condition ranges that keep the emphasis on the card rather than the label. The panel also answers tough questions from the live audience about authentication, guarantees, resale value, and whether collectors will embrace a different model. If you enjoy conversations about where the hobby is headed, subscribe and join us every week for honest, thoughtful discussions with hobby leaders and innovators. Watch Sports Cards Live every Saturday night, The Hangover every Wednesday, The Hunt on Fanatics Collect, Vintage Spotlight, and our Weekly & Premier Auction Ending Watch Parties. Join Fanatics Collect to watch exclusive Collect Originals content, enter giveaways, and follow Sports Cards Live:https://fanaticscollect.onelink.me/xx0N/iyiniif4 Take the Hobby Spectrum assessment to discover what type of collector you are:https://thehobbyspectrum.com Grab your copy of Pops & Comps:https://www.amazon.com/POPS-COMPS-Insights-Psychology-Numbers/dp/1069808903 If you enjoyed the discussion, please subscribe, like the video, and leave a comment. We'd love to hear your thoughts: Does the hobby need a new approach to grading, or should today's grading companies simply improve what already exists? Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

PSA has paused several of its most popular submission tiers, and the ripple effects are being felt across the hobby. Jeremy Lee and David Chase welcome Chad Hawk, founder of GCC and former executive with over two decades of experience at Certified Collectibles Group (CCG), to discuss what this moment means for collectors, dealers, grading companies, and the future of authentication. The conversation explores the challenges of scaling a grading company while maintaining consistency, whether grading mistakes are inevitable, how acceptable error rates should be measured, and whether artificial intelligence can eventually remove subjectivity from the grading process. They also examine a controversial PSA 10 that appeared to have significant damage, discussing what likely happened, why public perception matters, and whether grading companies should also be selling cards through their own marketplaces. If you enjoy thoughtful conversations about grading, authentication, and the future of the hobby, subscribe and join us every week. Watch Sports Cards Live every Saturday night, The Hangover every Wednesday, The Hunt on Fanatics Collect, Vintage Spotlight, and our Weekly & Premier Auction Ending Watch Parties. Join Fanatics Collect using my affiliate link below to watch exclusive Collect Originals content, enter giveaways, and follow Sports Cards Live:https://fanaticscollect.onelink.me/xx0N/iyiniif4 Take the Hobby Spectrum assessment to discover what type of collector you are:https://thehobbyspectrum.com Grab your copy of Pops & Comps:https://www.amazon.com/POPS-COMPS-Insights-Psychology-Numbers/dp/1069808903 Subscribe, like, comment, and let us know: What level of grading error is acceptable, if any? Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Can you really tell someone else how they should enjoy the hobby? This episode begins with a conversation that goes far beyond sports cards. Jeremy Lee and David Chase react to viewer feedback from last week's show and explore one of collecting's biggest philosophical questions: should collectors be concerned with how other people spend their money? The discussion covers funding purchases by selling cards, whether "true collectors" even exist, financial responsibility in the hobby, and why so many opinions may simply be projections of our own collecting experiences. Jeremy also shares details about his upcoming interview with one of the hobby's most recognizable breakers, Joe Hollywood, and discusses why he wanted the conversation to happen before the audience weighed in. If you enjoy thoughtful hobby conversations that go beyond prices and hype, be sure to subscribe and join us every week. Watch Sports Cards Live every Saturday night, The Hangover every Wednesday, The Hunt on Fanatics Collect, Vintage Spotlight, and our Weekly & Premier Auction Ending Watch Parties. Join Fanatics Collect using my affiliate link below to watch exclusive Collect Originals content, enter giveaways, and follow Sports Cards Live: https://fanaticscollect.onelink.me/xx0N/iyiniif4 Take the Hobby Spectrum assessment to discover what type of collector you are:https://thehobbyspectrum.com Grab your copy of Pops & Comps:https://www.amazon.com/POPS-COMPS-Insights-Psychology-Numbers/dp/1069808903 Subscribe, like, comment, and share your thoughts below. We'd love to hear where you stand on these hobby debates. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

The final segment of this special Sports Cards Live discussion brings the art collector versus investor debate to its conclusion as the panel explores what gives cards meaning beyond their price tags. Chris McGill, Joe Poirot, David Novak, Joshua Adams, and Jeremy Lee dive into the emotional, historical, and personal factors that shape collecting decisions and why some cards become far more significant than their market value suggests. Topics include: • Collecting as art versus collecting as investment• Why context matters when evaluating cards• Understanding a card's place within hobby history• Researching players, sets, and card significance• Emotional attachment and collecting satisfaction• Ownership as part of the reward• One-of-one cards and exclusivity• Illiquidity, rarity, and collector psychology• Whether a grail card reduces the desire for accumulation• The role of knowledge, storytelling, and hobby education The episode wraps with reflections on collecting, community, and what truly drives hobby passion, along with final thoughts from first-time Sports Cards Live guest David Novak. Featuring Jeremy Lee, Chris McGill, Joe Poirot, Joshua Adams, David Novak, and a special appearance by David Chase. Sports Cards Live is proudly supported by Just Collect, Auction Wire, Mint Ink, Front Row Card Show, Mr. Minty, Kronozio, Collector Investor Auctions, Upper Deck, Sport Card Expo, Card Ladder, COMC, and Inferno Red Technology. Links & Resources • The Hobby Spectrum: https://thehobbyspectrum.com• Pops & Comps on Amazon• Fanatics Collect Affiliate Link • Share this episode with a fellow collector Sports cards is a lifestyle. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

The discussion takes a philosophical turn as Chris McGill introduces a framework comparing sports card collectors to both stock market investors and art collectors. Inspired by visits to the Chicago Art Institute and the Milwaukee Art Museum, Chris explores how collectors assign meaning, value, and significance to the items they pursue. The result is one of the most thought-provoking conversations of the evening. Topics include: • Buying cards like an investor versus buying cards like an art collector• Personal significance versus financial significance• Why some cards become lifelong companions• Identity, self-expression, and collecting• The role of nostalgia, symbolism, and memory• Liquidity, opportunity cost, and investment thinking• Why specific copies matter more than many collectors realize• Eye appeal, provenance, uniqueness, and story• The emotional side of collecting• How major acquisitions reshape a collection The panel examines the motivations behind collecting and asks a fundamental question: are we building portfolios, curating collections, or doing a little bit of both? Featuring Jeremy Lee, Chris McGill, David Novak, Joshua Adams, Joe Poirot, and David Chase. Links & Resources • The Hobby Spectrum: https://thehobbyspectrum.com• Pops & Comps on Amazon• Fanatics Collect Affiliate Link • Share this episode with a fellow collector Sports cards is a lifestyle. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

The conversation gets deeper as David Novak joins Jeremy Lee and David Chase for a spirited discussion about sports cards as investments, generational attitudes toward risk, and whether collectors should view cardboard as part of a broader financial strategy. David shares his perspective on why some millennials are more willing to take calculated risks with their investment portfolios, sparking an engaging debate on retirement accounts, diversification, risk tolerance, and the role sports cards can play alongside traditional investments. Topics include: • Are sports cards legitimate investments?• Millennials and risk-taking behavior• Using hobby knowledge as an investment advantage• 401(k)s, retirement planning, and alternative assets• Why some collectors prefer blue-chip cards over prospecting• Vintage versus ultra-modern investing• The dangers of chasing hype• Mahomes, Ohtani, Trout, Judge, LeBron, Crosby, and long-term collectability• Bubbles within the hobby market• Why experience and time horizon matter Jeremy, David Novak, and David Chase bring different perspectives to one of the hobby's most debated topics: whether sports cards belong in an investment portfolio and, if so, how. Links & Resources • The Hobby Spectrum: https://thehobbyspectrum.com • Pops & Comps on Amazon • Fanatics Collect Affiliate Link • Share this episode with a fellow collector Sports cards is a lifestyle. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Jeremy Lee and David Chase discuss a record-setting Wayne Gretzky and Gordie Howe card sale, the psychology of collecting grail cards, and the prices collectors would demand for pieces they never intended to sell. The conversation then shifts as Diamond Card Collector joins the show to revisit the Tom Brady card deal that stunned the hobby. Steve shares how the opportunity first came together, the trust that had been established beforehand, and why this particular card was impossible for him to ignore. The story is just getting started. Sports cards is a lifestyle. Follow Jeremy on Instagram:@jlee_sportscardslive@jlee_cards Subscribe to Sports Cards Live on YouTube. Take the Hobby Spectrum assessment:thehobbyspectrum.com Buy Pops & Comps: Insights, Truths and Psychology Behind the Numbers that Drive the Sports Card Market on Amazon. Listen to Sports Cards Live on Apple Podcasts and Spotify. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Topics covered include: Learning to write everywhere, Lee Sung Jin's after death theory, the Bardo, David's screenplay with Micheal Imperioli, Buddhism, the process of selecting iconic needle drops, bonding over created universes, comparing writers to golfers, Pavlov's dog, realizing The Sopranos was funny, favorite (and least favorite) lines in their shows, selecting Finneas for the wall-to-wall score of Beef season 2, the fifth character of fate, using John Carpenter as temp score, finding inspiration in the rock and roll of Mean Streets, rewatching old episodes, and David's current passion project. (edited) 

The discussion sparked by the Jackie Robinson patch card purchase evolves into a much larger conversation about money, risk, and the purpose of collecting. Are sports cards investments? Should collectors think about future value when making purchases? Is there ever a situation where going into debt for a card makes sense? Jeremy, David Chase, Chris McGill, and Joshua Adams explore the differences between collecting for enjoyment, collecting for financial gain, and the increasingly blurred line between the two. The result is one of the most spirited philosophical debates of the night. Sports cards is a lifestyle. Follow Jeremy on Instagram: @jlee_sportscardslive @jlee_cards Subscribe to Sports Cards Live on YouTube. Take the Hobby Spectrum assessment: thehobbyspectrum.com Get Jeremy's book: Pops & Comps: Insights, Truths and Psychology Behind the Numbers that Drive the Sports Card Market Available on Amazon. Listen, subscribe, and leave a review wherever you get your podcasts. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

The Jackie Robinson story continues, but the discussion takes an unexpected turn. Jeremy Lee, David Chase, Joe Poirot, and Josh Adams explore one of the most uncomfortable questions in the hobby: where is the line between collecting and gambling? Using the now-famous Jackie Robinson patch card purchase as the backdrop, the panel debates risk, conviction, financial responsibility, debt, marriage, hobby passion, and whether collectors sometimes justify decisions they know they shouldn't make. The conversation also explores card valuation, one-of-one psychology, memorabilia cards, grading, market dynamics, and the challenges of separating emotional attachment from financial reality. Whether you agree with the buyer or not, this discussion touches on something almost every collector has experienced. A card you simply couldn't stop thinking about.

A collector sees the card of his dreams and makes a decision that many hobbyists will understand... and many others will question. Jeremy Lee, David Chase, Joe Poirot, and Josh Adams react to the story of a teacher who stretched far beyond his financial comfort zone to acquire a one-of-one Jackie Robinson game-used patch card he believes is a once-in-a-lifetime opportunity. The discussion quickly evolves into a deeper conversation about passion, collecting, financial responsibility, marriage, regret, and the lengths collectors will go to own cards they truly love. Was this an irresponsible purchase? Or was it exactly the kind of conviction that defines great collecting? This episode explores the emotional side of the hobby and asks a question every collector eventually faces: what is your grail really worth to you?

The PSA discussion continues, but this time the focus shifts from grading delays to a much bigger question: How did we get here? Jeremy Lee, David Chase, Joe Poirot, and Josh Adams debate whether PSA's dominance is a company problem, a hobby problem, or some combination of both. Along the way, the conversation explores competition, grading alternatives, market behavior, collector psychology, and why so many hobbyists continue to support systems they openly criticize. The discussion also touches on Beckett's future, TAG's role in the market, grading company competition, and whether collectors should rethink how much power they give third-party grading altogether. Expect strong opinions, disagreement, and plenty of hobby philosophy. Follow Sports Cards Live for new episodes every week featuring collectors, dealers, investors, hobby leaders, and industry insiders. Join The Hobby Spectrum: www.thehobbyspectrum.com Buy Jeremy's book, Pops & Comps: Insights, Truths and Psychology Behind the Numbers that Drive the Sports Card Market. Available on Amazon. Follow Jeremy on Instagram: @jlee_sportscardslive @jlee_cards Listen on Apple Podcasts and Spotify: Sports Cards Live Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

PSA's decision to pause several grading service levels continues to send shockwaves through the hobby. But is PSA really the problem? Jeremy Lee, David Chase, and Leighton Sheldon explore the impact of PSA's latest move on collectors, dealers, auction companies, and the broader marketplace. The discussion quickly evolves into a larger debate about dependency, entitlement, business risk, and whether the hobby has become too reliant on a single company. Who is affected the most? What happens next? And is this really PSA's fault at all? Expect strong opinions, uncomfortable questions, and a conversation that challenges some commonly held assumptions about grading and the modern hobby. Follow Sports Cards Live for new episodes every week featuring collectors, dealers, investors, hobby leaders, and industry insiders. Join The Hobby Spectrum: www.thehobbyspectrum.com Buy Jeremy's book, Pops & Comps: Insights, Truths and Psychology Behind the Numbers that Drive the Sports Card Market. Available on Amazon. Follow Jeremy on Instagram: @jlee_sportscardslive @jlee_cards Listen on Apple Podcasts and Spotify: Sports Cards Live Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Could ticket collecting be where sports cards were years ago? Jeremy Lee, David Chase, and Howard Citron dive deep into one of the hobby's most fascinating and fastest-growing categories. From debut tickets and historic moments to full tickets versus stubs, the conversation explores why more collectors are turning their attention toward pieces of history that were never meant to survive. Along the way, the discussion touches on rarity, grading, collecting versus investing, and whether some of the most important tickets in sports history remain dramatically underappreciated. Plus, Howard shares one of the most significant Wayne Gretzky tickets ever discovered and explains why ticket collectors are so passionate about preserving moments rather than simply collecting cardboard. If you've ever wondered what makes a ticket collectible, this episode is for you. Follow Sports Cards Live for new episodes every week featuring collectors, dealers, investors, hobby leaders, and industry insiders. Join The Hobby Spectrum:www.thehobbyspectrum.com Buy Jeremy's book, Pops & Comps:Insights, Truths and Psychology Behind the Numbers that Drive the Sports Card Market. Available on Amazon. Follow Jeremy on Instagram: @jlee_sportscardslive @jlee_cards Listen on Apple Podcasts and Spotify: Sports Cards Live Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

A freshly graded PSA card sparks a bigger question: how many altered cards are already sitting inside holders throughout the hobby? Jeremy Lee and David Chase react to a fascinating discovery involving a 1959 Topps Mickey Mantle and discuss what it means for collectors, grading companies, confidence in the hobby, and the growing debate around card restoration and alteration. Then Howard Citron joins the show to introduce the world of ticket collecting. From iconic moments and historic events to the emotional connection collectors have with ticket stubs, the conversation explores why more hobbyists are beginning to view tickets as an exciting category of their own. This episode covers grading, authenticity, hobby trust, collecting history, and why some collectors are looking beyond cards altogether. Listen and decide for yourself: where should the hobby draw the line? Follow Sports Cards Live for new episodes every week featuring collectors, dealers, investors, hobby leaders, and industry insiders. Join The Hobby Spectrum:www.thehobbyspectrum.com Buy Jeremy's book, Pops & Comps:Insights, Truths and Psychology Behind the Numbers that Drive the Sports Card Market.Available on Amazon. Follow Jeremy on Instagram:@jlee_sportscardslive@jlee_cards Listen on Apple Podcasts and Spotify:Sports Cards Live Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Jeremy Lee, Joe Poirot, David Chase, Chris McGill, and Josh Adams close out Sports Cards Live with a deep conversation about the modern sports card market, the Fanatics Collect Premiere auction, autograph culture, and whether modern collecting is becoming too concentrated around a handful of superstar athletes. The panel breaks down the dominance of players like Shohei Ohtani, Michael Jordan, LeBron James, Wembanyama, Steph Curry, Tom Brady, and Kobe Bryant in major auctions, while exploring whether modern cards are beginning to feel repetitive compared to vintage and 1990s collecting. Topics include:• Reactions to the Fanatics Premiere auction results• The LeBron James Superfractor auto sale• Why Shohei cards seem to dominate modern auctions• Risk versus stability in current player collecting• The evolution of athlete autographs over time• Why certain players become hobby focal points• Modern card saturation and collector fatigue• Vintage versus modern collecting psychology• Why some collectors prefer retired players and legends The episode also includes discussion about The Hangover on Sports Card Clubhouse, upcoming 90s Auctions, the Hobby Spectrum, and the evolving identity of today's collector market. Subscribe to Sports Cards Live on YouTube for weekly hobby conversations, market discussion, and collector psychology. Take the Hobby Spectrum Assessment and discover your collector archetype:HobbySpectrum.com Get your copy of Pops and Comps on Amazon. Comment below:Do modern card auctions feel exciting to you right now, or are too few players dominating the hobby? Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Jeremy Lee, Joe Poirot, Chris McGill, Josh Adams, David Chase, and Chris HOJ continue the conversation with a wide-ranging episode covering collector psychology, hidden grails, hobby hype cycles, and the emotional side of chasing cards. The panel discusses what happens when collectors finally identify a true grail card, why some targets are kept secret, and how social media, hype, and market attention can dramatically affect collecting behavior. The conversation also explores the emotional push and pull between passion, greed, scarcity, nostalgia, and fear of missing out. Topics include:• The thrill of identifying a new grail card• Why collectors sometimes hide their targets• Reactions to rising card values and market hype• Vintage versus modern collector psychology• FOMO and hindsight in the hobby• The emotional attachment collectors develop to cards• Why some collectors regret not buying more• The difference between collecting for love versus momentum The episode also features discussion around The Hangover on the Sports Card Clubhouse network, pirate cards, hobby identity, and the evolving ways collectors connect through shared passions and niche interests. Subscribe to Sports Cards Live on YouTube for weekly hobby conversations, market discussion, and collector psychology. Take the Hobby Spectrum Assessment and discover your collector archetype:HobbySpectrum.com Get your copy of Pops and Comps on Amazon. Comment below:Have you ever identified a grail card and intentionally kept it secret from the hobby? Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Jeremy Lee is joined by Jace, Joe Poirot, Chris McGill, Josh Adams, and David Chase for a deep conversation about one of the hobby's most interesting modern dilemmas: should collectors publicly share their want lists and collecting targets? The panel explores the balance between community and competition in today's social media-driven hobby, including the risks and rewards of broadcasting what you collect. The conversation moves through hobby identity, networking, scarcity, collector psychology, and how relationships inside the hobby can help or hurt your ability to land rare cards. Topics include:• The pros and cons of sharing your want list publicly• Building a collector identity online• How social media changes the hunt for cards• Networking versus competition in the hobby• Why some collectors stay private• Collecting rare cards strategically• The emotional side of the chase• The evolution of collecting tastes over time The episode also features thoughtful discussion around hobby culture, authenticity, privacy, and the value of community within collecting. Subscribe to Sports Cards Live on YouTube for weekly hobby conversations, market discussion, and collector psychology. Take the Hobby Spectrum Assessment and discover your collector archetype:HobbySpectrum.com Get your copy of Pops and Comps on Amazon. Comment below:Do you publicly share your want list, or do you keep your targets private? Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Jeremy Lee and David Chase welcome featured guest Jace (@aceofgrades28) to Sports Cards Live for a thoughtful conversation about what it's like finding your way as a younger collector in today's hobby. The discussion explores hobby evolution, mistakes, flipping, prospecting, building a personal collection, and the challenge of narrowing your focus when there are endless cards and sets competing for your attention. Jace shares his collecting journey from Pokémon and early sports cards to navigating modern collecting as a Hybrid Hobbyist on the Hobby Spectrum. The conversation also dives into:• Ranking and prioritizing your want list• Rare cards versus budget limitations• The pressure of chasing ultra modern cards• Why the hunt matters as much as ownership• Learning from hobby mistakes• Taking breaks and avoiding burnout• Living sets, flight collecting, and evolving tastes• Collecting with meaning instead of hype An honest and relatable hobby conversation for collectors at every stage of the journey. Subscribe to Sports Cards Live on YouTube for weekly hobby conversations, market discussion, and collector psychology. Take the Hobby Spectrum Assessment and discover your collector archetype:HobbySpectrum.com Get your copy of Pops and Comps on Amazon. Comment below:How do YOU prioritize your want list when there are too many cards you want? Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Jeremy Lee and David Chase kick off Episode 313 of Sports Cards Live with stories from the Front Row Card Show in Pasadena, reflections on The Sandlot, and discussion around the launch of The Hangover on the Sports Card Clubhouse network. The conversation moves through vintage cards, show culture, eye appeal, grading, and the growing tension between collectors and the grading companies that shape so much of the modern hobby. Jeremy also shares a viewer-submitted PSA inconsistency story involving a Nolan Ryan rookie card that sparks a larger discussion about grading reliability, authentication, and hobby trust. Plus:• Front Row Card Show atmosphere and dealer reactions• Why collectors bring cards to Jeremy for review• The rise of raw cards at shows• Thoughts on grading delays and resubmissions• The value of eye appeal beyond the label• Early reactions to The Hangover Subscribe to Sports Cards Live on YouTube for weekly hobby conversations, market discussion, and collector psychology. Take the Hobby Spectrum Assessment and discover your collector archetype: HobbySpectrum.com Get your copy of Pops and Comps on Amazon. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Jeremy, Chris McGill, Joe Poirot, David Chase, and Josh Adams explore: Whether GOAT collecting truly reduces hobby risk Why not all GOAT cards are created equal The difference between hobby relevance and on-court greatness Why Kobe Bryant currently commands enormous hobby attention How consensus shapes hobby demand Whether collectors independently arrive at “GOAT” conclusions or inherit them socially Why cultural influence matters as much as statistics and accolades The conversation becomes increasingly philosophical as Chris McGill breaks down: Groupthink and social consensus in collecting Why iconic cards command premiums How collectors identify hidden value before the broader hobby catches on The concept of “iconic traits without the iconic premium” Why some collectors intentionally search for overlooked cards with elite characteristics Jeremy also reflects on eye appeal, low-grade high-I-appeal cards, contrarian collecting, and the importance of applying hobby concepts to your own lane rather than simply copying others. Later in the episode: Josh Adams discusses owning over 100 copies of the 1990 Leaf Frank Thomas rookie The panel talks about eccentric personal collections and hobby identity Jeremy shares his binder collection of hobby creator cards and custom collectibles Jeremy officially closes the episode by discussing the launch of the new Sports Cards Live Hangover series with the Sports Card Clubhouse crew A fittingly thoughtful and entertaining close to one of the most philosophical Sports Cards Live episodes to date.

One of the deepest collector psychology discussions ever featured on Sports Cards Live. Jeremy, Chris McGill, Joe Poirot, David Chase, and Josh Adams continue unpacking the idea of “latent taste” and how collectors discover entirely new lanes over time. The panel explores: Why certain cards suddenly “click” years later How collectors evolve through exposure, research, and experience Whether discovering new collecting lanes is lateral movement or actual growth Why rabbit holes can permanently reshape collector identity The tension between focus and discovery Whether collectors ever truly “arrive” at a final form How collecting tastes mature over time Why some lanes stick while others fade away The conversation expands into philosophy, psychology, music, collecting behavior, and even the emotional architecture behind why collectors chase certain cards. Later in the episode, the panel pivots into another major hobby topic: Does collecting GOATs automatically equal safe collecting? They debate: Whether blue-chip GOAT cards truly protect collectors from risk If financially responsible collecting naturally gravitates toward legends The difference between collecting for enjoyment versus collecting for preservation of capital Why many collectors eventually pivot from prospects toward iconic players Whether “safe collecting” limits hobby excitement and discovery This episode blends hobby philosophy, collector psychology, financial thinking, and pure hobby passion in classic Sports Cards Live fashion.

The final conversation of Episode 311 turns into one of the most thoughtful hobby discussions Sports Cards Live has had in a long time. Chris McGill introduces a deceptively simple question: when is it okay for one collector to give another collector advice? That question opens the door to a deep conversation about hobby influence, responsibility, trust, collecting psychology, financial consequences, relationships, and how collectors actually learn over time. Jeremy, Joe Poirot, David Chase, and Josh Adams explore topics including: The difference between opinions and advice Why unsolicited advice can become dangerous Whether content creators bear responsibility for outcomes “Relationship liability” in the hobby Why some collectors hesitate to answer direct questions The risks of presenting opinions as facts How hobby trust is earned over years Financial advice versus collecting advice Whether mistakes are necessary for growth “Paying tuition” through hobby experience Learning through research versus jumping in immediately Why different collectors approach the hobby differently The tension between caution and opportunity The group also discusses: How collectors build confidence and knowledge Why some people prefer to learn by doing The importance of understanding a player or card “menu” The role of research, community, and experience Why collecting styles are deeply personal How hobby personalities shape collecting behavior Later in the episode: Jeremy previews a future Sports Cards Live episode focused on ticket collecting Discussion about the return of The Crossover Upcoming hobby shows, auctions, and National plans Final thoughts from the panel after another marathon Saturday night episode A reflective and surprisingly philosophical ending to one of the most unique Sports Cards Live episodes to date.

The final hour of Sports Cards Live turns into a wide-ranging hobby roundtable as Jeremy, Joe Poirot, Chris McGill, David Chase, and Josh Adams react to the ancient coin discussion and dive into some of the biggest hobby topics currently shaping the sports card industry. The panel explores whether sports card grading companies like PSA could eventually introduce official eye appeal designations similar to the coin world, and what that might mean for collectors, grading culture, and aftermarket sticker services. Then the conversation shifts into the massive FIFA licensing news involving Fanatics, Topps, and Panini. Topics include: The future of FIFA and World Cup cards Debut patch cards for soccer Why Lamine Yamal World Cup patches could become historic cards Whether Fanatics could eventually acquire Panini The future of Panini's iconic brands like Prizm, National Treasures, and Flawless Whether hobby IP can lose prestige over time Why collectors may eventually become nostalgic for the Panini era How sports history constantly renews demand for sports cards Why sports cards differ from coins, stamps, and other collectibles How active athletes continually reshape hobby relevance and GOAT debates The episode also features: Discussion about the return of The Crossover Why sports card collecting moves faster than almost any other collectible category The relationship between cards, history, pop culture, and legacy The possibility that Fanatics could eventually target hockey licensing Concerns about monopolies, hobby consolidation, and brand dilution A thoughtful and entertaining closing segment that blends hobby philosophy, market discussion, licensing battles, and collector psychology into one long-form conversation.

Jeremy and David Chase kick off Episode 311 of Sports Cards Live with a full recap of the Sport Card Expo, including athlete interviews, stage appearances, late-night hobby hangs, and Jeremy's biggest pickup showcase yet. From Jackie Robinson game-used memorabilia to Mario Lemieux patches, Patrick Roy autos, Barry Sanders relics, Tiger Woods inserts, and vintage basketball, Jeremy shares the cards that followed him home from Toronto and explains why memorabilia cards have become a major focus of his collecting journey. Then Leighton Sheldon joins the show to explain why he missed Expo after getting pulled into a massive vintage collection deal featuring a complete 1964 Topps Baseball set built pack-by-pack in real time during the 1960s. The conversation turns into a hilarious debate over whether Leighton got “worked” by the seller, hobby priorities, old-school collectors, and the realities of chasing collections. The episode also features: Jeremy's Expo behind-the-scenes stories Hanging out with James Beckett in Toronto The impossible 1990 Pro Set Stanley Cup hologram pull David Chase launching his new show with Midlife Greg Thoughts on memorabilia cards, patches, and eye appeal The rise of hockey content creators and community podcasts Why certain vintage relic cards still feel undervalued

As the marathon continues, the panel—David Chase, Joe Poirot, Chris McGill, and Josh Adams—shifts from theory into something more personal: how you actually define your collecting identity. The conversation introduces a powerful idea: your “lane statement.” How would you describe what you collect in one clear thought? Is it even possible when you collect across multiple lanes? Does defining it help you collect more intentionally? This ties directly into a noticeable shift in philosophy: Moving away from rookie card dependency Prioritizing eye appeal over technical grade Choosing cards based on connection, not checklist From there, the discussion takes a hard turn into one of the most controversial topics in the hobby: Is it ever okay to alter a card? And more specifically: What about hand-cut cards—can they be re-cut? If a card is already altered, does altering it further matter? Does intent change how we judge the action? Where does restoration end and manipulation begin? There's no clean answer—and that's the point. The group works through real scenarios, edge cases, and uncomfortable gray areas, exposing just how complicated this topic actually is when you strip away the easy “never do it” answer. This segment blends identity, evolution, and ethics into one of the most thought-provoking stretches of the entire show. Enjoy the show? Follow or subscribe on your podcast platform so you don't miss upcoming episodes. Pick up a copy of Pops & Comps on Amazon to better understand the supply and demand forces driving the sports card market. Take the Hobby Spectrum assessment at HobbySpectrum.com to discover your collector profile, join the directory, and connect with collectors who think and collect like you. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

The conversation continues to dig deeper as David Chase, Joe Poirot, Chris McGill, and Josh Adams take the idea of “taste” and push it to its limits. What starts as a simple definition quickly unravels into something much more complex: Is taste purely aesthetic… or does it include meaning, rarity, and intent? Can someone actually have “bad taste,” or is everything just subjective? Are we just saying “you have good taste” when someone likes what we like? The discussion introduces new layers: The difference between taste, style, and lane Whether being a “connoisseur” is about expertise… or perception How influence and exposure shape what we think is good There's also a more uncomfortable angle explored: Can two people buy the exact same card… and one be doing it “in good taste” and the other not? Is collecting purely for money a lack of taste? Or is that just another valid lane in the hobby? The panel also gets into real examples: Why some collectors admire off-the-radar cards more than iconic grails How discovery and originality can signal taste more than price The role of content creators in shaping what the hobby sees as desirable And one of the key takeaways that emerges: Taste isn't fixed. It evolves, it's influenced, and sometimes it's revealed only after you actually hold the card in your hands. This is one of the most philosophical segments of the entire show—and one that doesn't try to land on a final answer. Enjoy the show? Follow or subscribe on your podcast platform so you don't miss upcoming episodes. Pick up a copy of Pops & Comps on Amazon to better understand the supply and demand forces driving the sports card market. Take the Hobby Spectrum assessment at HobbySpectrum.com to discover your collector profile, join the directory, and connect with collectors who think and collect like you. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

The conversation movs into some unexpected territory as David Chase, Joe Poirot, Chris McGill, and Josh Adams explore the deeper and sometimes strange psychology behind collecting. It starts with a simple question that turns into something bigger: Would you collect cards of controversial or morally complex figures? That opens the door to discussions around: Separating history from behavior Why some collectors avoid certain players entirely How storytelling and mythology influence what we're drawn to Then comes one of the wildest hobby stories you'll hear: A one-of-one card dropped into a lake during a photo attempt. It sounds funny… until you realize it could happen to anyone. That leads into real talk about: Handling mistakes and damage in the hobby The emotional side of owning cards Why some moments stick with you more than the cards themselves From there, Chris introduces a deceptively simple question: What does “taste” actually mean in collecting? And that takes the conversation into a deeper layer: Is taste just liking what looks good to you? Is it about curation and how your collection comes together? Can someone collect without having taste at all? Or is taste just another way of saying identity? There's also a strong distinction made between: Your lane (what you collect) And your taste (how and why you collect it) Less about the cards themselves, and more about what they represent, how we relate to them, and what they say about us as collectors. Enjoy the show? Follow or subscribe on your podcast platform so you don't miss upcoming episodes. Pick up a copy of Pops & Comps on Amazon to better understand the supply and demand forces driving the sports card market. Take the Hobby Spectrum assessment at HobbySpectrum.com to discover your collector profile, join the directory, and connect with collectors who think and collect like you. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

The conversation rolls on with David Chase, Joe Poirot, Chris McGill, and Josh Adams as the discussion shifts into one of the hobby's most foundational debates. Is it 1948 Leaf… or 1949 Leaf? What starts as a technical question quickly turns into something much bigger: Does the actual release year even matter anymore? What really defines a “rookie card”? If the label changed tomorrow, would collectors actually change how they value the card? The group explores how hobby consensus forms, how it evolves, and whether certain cards are simply too iconic to ever be redefined—regardless of what new research might uncover. From there, the discussion ties back into a deeper theme that runs through this entire segment: meaning in collecting. Do you value what the hobby tells you is important? Or what you discover and connect with yourself? Is finding something on your own more rewarding than being told why it matters? There are also great side discussions around: Player vs card importance (why Jackie outweighs scarcity debates) Why some historically important players were left out of early sets The difference between collecting cards… and understanding them This is one of those segments that reminds you the hobby isn't just about what something is worth—it's about what it means to you, and how you got there. Enjoy the show? Follow or subscribe on your podcast platform so you don't miss upcoming episodes. Pick up a copy of Pops & Comps on Amazon to better understand the supply and demand forces driving the sports card market. Take the Hobby Spectrum assessment at HobbySpectrum.com to discover your collector profile, join the directory, and connect with collectors who think and collect like you. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

The crew is back together as David Chase rejoins alongside Joe Poirot, Chris McGill, and Josh Adams for the final stretch of Part 3. This segment turns into a real, unfiltered hobby roundtable. We revisit the sticker debate from earlier in the show, but this time with opposing viewpoints in the room. Is it a useful signal of eye appeal… or just another way for companies to take a cut? The pushback is real, and the discussion gets honest quickly. From there, the conversation shifts into how the market actually works: Do collectors really pay premiums for better-looking cards? Are dealers setting comps… or chasing them? What's actually happening when dealers buy from each other and resell at higher prices? Is any of this new, or just more visible now? Then things take a turn into one of the most underrated parts of the hobby: research. Chris introduces a question that sparks stories from the group: What's something you only learned by doing your own research—and how did it change how you view a card? That leads to: Discoveries about vintage sets and production quirks Why certain cards carry more meaning after deeper digging The kind of knowledge that separates casual collectors from serious ones There's even a surprising nugget about the dating of the iconic 1948/49 Leaf set that opens up a whole new rabbit hole. This is one of those segments that feels like being at a table with experienced collectors just talking it out—no script, just real hobby perspective. Enjoy the show? Follow or subscribe on your podcast platform so you don't miss upcoming episodes. Pick up a copy of Pops & Comps on Amazon to better understand the supply and demand forces driving the sports card market. Take the Hobby Spectrum assessment at HobbySpectrum.com to discover your collector profile, join the directory, and connect with collectors who think and collect like you. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Leighton Sheldon joins the show live from the Strongsville card show to share the dealer perspective, including activity levels, market observations, and what he's seeing on the ground. Shortly after, David Chase jumps on from his hotel room to provide the attendee view, offering a well-rounded look at the show from both sides of the table. As the segment unfolds, several familiar voices from the hobby drop in, including Graig Miller (Midlife Cards), Tony Leebrick from Southern Collector, Mike Petty, and a rare appearance from Mookie Chilson. The result is an organic, free-flowing conversation filled with real-time reactions, show floor insights, and candid hobby discussion. Subscribe to the podcast and leave a rating or review if you enjoy the show. Get your copy of Pops & Comps on Amazon. Take the Hobby Spectrum assessment and join the directory at HobbySpectrum.com. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Chaz and AJ spoke with Dan Grimaldi this morning about his time on "The Sopranos" as Patsy Parisi. Dan shared about improvisations on set, the lunch no one wanted to have with David Chase, and the infamous ending scene. Photo courtesy: Dan Grimaldi

Guests abound once more this week as both Noah Wyle and Katherine LaNasa chat The Pitt with James (1:04:12-1:17:45), while Hughs Bonneville and Skinner recount their experiences making 2026 with Boyd (22:46-23:40). Meanwhile, we're back in Gilead this week for The Testaments on Disney+ (1:17:45), finding out is Simu Liu can hack it as a spy in The Copenhagen Test on Channel 4 (1:36:53), and reuniting with Hugh Bonneville once again as he does his level best to organise the world cup in 2026 on BBC1 (1:28:09). Plus, Kay interrogates our Easter viewing habits, James recounts a challenging interview with The Sopranos' David Chase and there's an inexplicable surprise poetry reading…Note: time stamps are approximate as the ads throw them out, so are only meant as a guide. If you want to avoid this and would like the podcast entirely ad-free (as well as 17 hours early, with a second weekly show and spoiler specials) then sign up to Pilot+!

The conversation continues as Chris from Missouri shares a powerful example of what it really means to collect on your own terms… choosing a card that looks right over one that grades higher, and keeping a significant amount of money in the process. That sparks a deeper discussion around eye appeal versus grade, and why more collectors are starting to question the weight we give to the number on the slab. Jeremy, along with David Chase and Joe Poirot, dig into the role of set collecting in today's hobby, including whether tools like the PSA Set Registry are actually driving it… or if collectors themselves are what keep it alive. The conversation also shifts into how collecting evolves over time: From sports fan to card collector From completion to intention From full sets to more focused approaches like flight collecting There's also a breakdown of what flight collecting really means, and how it offers a middle ground between chasing full sets and owning just a single example. This segment really gets into the philosophy of collecting… and what actually matters when you decide what stays in your collection.

Jeremy is joined by David Chase along with Orlando as the conversation shifts into a deeper question… Does your collection actually mean anything? This segment digs into the idea of collecting with purpose, and what it really looks like to build a collection that reflects who you are instead of just following trends, hype, or what everyone else is doing. It becomes a conversation about identity… turning your collection into something personal, intentional, and unique rather than just a group of cards that happen to sit in the same box. Along the way, the discussion explores: Why most collections lack a clear identity The difference between collecting and accumulating How to think about your collection as a personal museum The role of intention in shaping what you own This is where the bigger theme really takes shape… collecting in a way that tells your story.

Jeremy is joined by David Chase to start, before Orlando joins, and the conversation quickly gets into something every serious collector eventually faces… At what point do you stop holding onto cards you like… and start chasing the ones you truly love? That leads into a bold collection reset strategy, including the idea of upgrading by downgrading, and how moving down in grade can actually improve your collection while putting money back in your pocket. Jeremy also shares a handful of recent card show pickups, including cards that weren't even on the radar… but immediately felt right once seen in person. Along the way, the discussion touches on: Why some cards quietly outstay their welcome The difference between accumulation and intention Undervalued players hiding in plain sight A quick update on new Hobby Spectrum profile features This is where the episode starts building toward a bigger idea… making your collection a true reflection of who you are, not just what you've acquired.

Jeremy Lee is joined by David Chase, Jeremy “Texas Snowman” Donson, and Joe Poirot as the conversation takes a more philosophical turn before Chris McGill and Josh Adams join the panel. What starts as a continuation of the value discussion quickly evolves into a much deeper debate around how collectors should actually think about cards. Chris introduces a sharp perspective that flips the typical approach, arguing that value should be the result of understanding a card, not the starting point. That idea opens the door to a broader conversation about what it really means to be an advanced collector. Is it about budget, experience, or something else entirely? The group explores the importance of research, context, and understanding the full landscape of a player or set before making decisions, while also acknowledging that not every collector is at that stage. Along the way, concepts like “own appeal,” long-term holding, and the role of value as both a tool and a distraction are unpacked through multiple lenses. This is one of those segments where the hobby gets broken down at a higher level and forces you to reconsider how you approach collecting. Subscribe to Sports Cards Live on YouTube and your favorite podcast platform, and if you enjoy the content, please leave a rating and review. Pick up a copy of POPs & COMPs: Truths, Insights & Psychology into the Numbers that Drive the Sports Card Market on Amazon. Explore the Hobby Spectrum and discover your collector profile at sportscardslive.com. And as always, thank you for being part of the community. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Jeremy Lee continues with David Chase and Jeremy “Texas Snowman” Donson of Collector Investor Auctions as the conversation moves beyond surface-level takes and into how collectors actually behave in real situations. Reacting to audience comments, the group challenges the idea that collectors can fully separate enjoyment from value, especially when meaningful dollars are involved. Jeremy Donson shares personal collecting experiences that highlight how relationships, timing, and backstory can become part of the card itself, adding a layer of meaning that goes beyond comps. The discussion also touches on how collectors justify purchases, how memory and attachment play into decision-making, and how the line between emotional and financial value is often much blurrier than people admit. This segment brings the collector mindset into focus in a way that feels real, not theoretical. Subscribe to Sports Cards Live on YouTube and your favorite podcast platform, and if you enjoy the content, please leave a rating and review. Pick up a copy of POPs & COMPs: Truths, Insights & Psychology into the Numbers that Drive the Sports Card Market on Amazon. Explore the Hobby Spectrum and discover your collector profile at thehobbyspectrum.com. And as always, thank you for being part of the community. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Jeremy Lee is joined by David Chase to kick off the show, before welcoming Jeremy “Texas Snowman” Donson of Collector Investor Auctions. The episode begins with Jeremy sharing his experience traveling to New York City to broadcast live from the Fanatics Collect studio, offering a behind-the-scenes look at what it was like operating in a completely different environment and how the show evolved in that setting. The conversation then shifts into one of the hobby's more polarizing topics right now… value. Is talking about card value a problem? Why does it trigger some collectors? And where should the balance really be between passion and price? With perspectives from both collector and dealer lenses, the discussion explores how different mindsets shape the way we buy, hold, and think about our cards, while also touching on auction dynamics, buying behavior, and the role value plays across the spectrum. Subscribe to Sports Cards Live on YouTube and your favorite podcast platform, and if you enjoy the content, please leave a rating and review. Check out POPs & COMPs for deeper insights into the numbers and psychology driving the hobby. Explore your collecting identity with the Collector Investor Spectrum and see where you fall within the hobby. And as always, thank you for being part of the community. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

What makes a character so compelling that readers will forgive almost anything about the plot? How do you move beyond vague flaws and generic descriptions to create people who feel pulled from real life? In this solo episode, I share 15 actionable tips for writing deep characters, curated from past interviews on the podcast. In the intro, thoughts from London Book Fair [Instagram reel @jfpennauthor; Publishing Perspectives; Audible; Spotify]; Insights from a 7-figure author business [BookBub]. This show is supported by my Patrons. Join my Community and get articles, discounts, and extra audio and video tutorials on writing craft, author business, and AI tools, at Patreon.com/thecreativepenn This episode has been created from previous episodes of The Creative Penn Podcast, curated by Joanna Penn, as well as chapters from How to Write a Novel: From Idea to Book. Links to the individual episodes are included in the transcript below. In this episode: Master the ‘Believe, Care, Invest' trifecta, how to hook readers on the very first page Define the Dramatic Question: Who is your character when the chips are down? Absolute specificity. Why “she's controlling” isn't good enough Understand the Heroine's Journey, strength through connection, not solo action Use ‘Metaphor Families' to anchor dialogue and give every character a distinctive voice Find the Diagnostic Detail, the moments that prove a character is real Writing pain onto the page without writing memoir Write diverse characters as real people, not stereotypes or plot devices Give your protagonist a morally neutral ‘hero' status. Compelling beats likeable. Build vibrant side characters for series longevity and spin-off potential Use voice as a rhythmic tool Link character and plot until they're inseparable Why discovery writers can write out of order and still build deep character Find the sensory details that make characters live and breathe More help with how to write fiction here, or in my book, How to Write a Novel. Writing Characters: 15 Tips for Writing Deep Character in Your Fiction In today's episode, I'm sharing fifteen tips for writing deep characters, synthesised from some of the most insightful interviews on The Creative Penn Podcast over the past few years, combined with what I've learned across more than forty books of my own. I'll be referencing episodes with Matt Bird, Will Storr, Gail Carriger, Barbara Nickless, and Sarah Elisabeth Sawyer. I'll also draw on my own book, How to Write a Novel, which covers these fundamentals in detail. Whether you're writing your first novel or your fiftieth, whether you're a plotter or a discovery writer like me, these tips will help you create characters that readers believe in, care about, and invest in—and keep coming back for more. Let's get into it. 1. Master the ‘Believe, Care, Invest' Trifecta When I spoke with Matt Bird on episode 624, he laid out the three things you need to achieve on the very first page of your book or in the first ten minutes of a film. He calls it “Believe, Care, and Invest.” First, the reader must believe the character is a real person, somehow proving they are not a cardboard imitation of a human being, not just a generic type walking through a generic plot. Second, the reader must care about the character's circumstances. And third, the reader must invest in the character's ability to solve the story's central problem. Matt used The Hunger Games as his primary example, and it's brilliant. On the very first page, we believe Katniss's voice. Suzanne Collins writes in first person with a staccato rhythm—lots of periods, short declarative sentences—that immediately grounds us in a survivalist mentality. We care because Katniss is starving. She's protecting her little sister. And we invest because she is out there bow hunting, which Matt pointed out is one of the most badass things a character can do. She even kills a lynx two pages in and sells the pelt. We invest in her resourcefulness and grit before the plot has even begun. Matt was very clear that this has nothing to do with the character being “likable.” He said his subtitle, Writing a Hero Anyone Will Love, doesn't mean the character has to be a good person. He described “hero” as both gender-neutral and morally neutral. A hero can be totally evil or totally good. What matters is that we believe, care, and invest. He demonstrated this beautifully by breaking down the first ten minutes of WeCrashed, where the characters of Adam and Rebekah Neumann are absolutely not likable, but we are completely hooked. Adam steals his neighbour's Chinese food through a carefully orchestrated con involving an imaginary beer. It's not admirable behaviour, but the tradecraft involved, as Matt put it—using a term from spy movies—makes us invest in him. We see a character trying to solve the big problem of his life, which is that he's poor and wants to be rich, and we want to see if he can pull it off. Actionable step: Go to the first page of your current work in progress. Does it achieve all three? Does the reader believe this is a real person with a distinctive voice? Do they care about the character's circumstances? And do they invest in the character's ability to handle what's coming? If even one of those three is missing, that's your revision priority. 2. Define the Dramatic Question: Who Are They Really? Will Storr, author of The Science of Storytelling, came on episode 490 and gave one of the most powerful frameworks I've ever heard for character-driven fiction. He explained that the human brain evolved language primarily to swap social information—in other words, to gossip. We are wired to monitor other people, to ask the question: who is this person when the chips are down? That's what Will calls the Dramatic Question, and it's what he believes lies at the heart of all compelling storytelling. It's not a question about plot. It's a question about the character's soul. And every scene in your novel should force the character to answer it. His example of Lawrence of Arabia is unforgettable. The Dramatic Question for the entire film is: who are you, Lawrence? Are you ordinary or are you extraordinary? At the beginning, Lawrence is a cocky, rebellious young soldier who believes his rebelliousness makes him superior. Every iconic scene in that three-hour film tests that belief. Sometimes Lawrence acts as though he truly is extraordinary—leading the Arabs into battle, being hailed as a god—and sometimes the world strips him bare and he sees himself as ordinary. Because it's a tragedy, he never overcomes his flaw. He doubles down on his belief that he's extraordinary until he becomes monstrous, culminating in that iconic scene where he lifts a bloody dagger and sees his own reflection with horror. Will also used Jaws to demonstrate how this works in a pure action thriller. Brody's dramatic question is simple: are you going to be old Brody who is terrified of the water, or new Brody who can overcome that fear? Every scene where the shark appears is really asking that question. And the last moment of the film isn't the shark blowing up. It's Brody swimming back through the water, saying he used to be scared of the water and he can't imagine why. Actionable step: Write down the Dramatic Question for your protagonist in a single sentence. Is it “Are you ordinary or extraordinary?” or “Are you brave enough to love again?” or “Will you sacrifice your principles for survival?” If you can't answer this with specificity, your character might still be a sketch rather than a person. 3. Get rid of Vague Flaws, and use Absolute Specificity This was one of Will Storr's most important points. He said that vague thinking about characters is really the enemy. When he teaches workshops and asks writers to describe their character's flaw, most of them say something like “they're very controlling.” And Will's response is: that's not good enough. Everyone is controlling. How are they controlling? What's the specific mechanism? He gave the example of a profile he read of Theresa May during the UK's Brexit chaos. Someone who knew her said that Theresa May's problem was that she always thinks she's the only adult in every room she goes into. Will said that stopped him in his tracks because it's so precise. If you define a character with that level of specificity, you can take them and put them in any genre, any situation—a spaceship, a Victorian drawing room, a school playground—and you will know exactly how they're going to behave. The same applies to Arthur Miller's Willy Loman in Death of a Salesman, as Will described it: a man who believes absolutely in capitalistic success and the idea that when you die, you're going to be weighed on a scale, just as God weighs you for sin, but now you're weighed for success. That's not a vague flaw. That's a worldview you can drop into any story and watch it combust. Will made another counterintuitive point that I found really valuable: writers often think that piling on multiple traits will create a complex character, but the opposite is true. Starting with one highly specific flaw and running it through the demands of a relentless plot is what generates complexity. You end up with a far more nuanced, original character than if you'd started with a laundry list of vague attributes. Actionable step: Take your protagonist's flaw and pressure-test it. Is it specific enough that you could place this character in any situation and predict their behaviour? If you're stuck at “she's stubborn” or “he's insecure,” keep pushing. What kind of stubborn? What kind of insecure? Find the diagnostic sentence—the Theresa May level of precision. 4. Understand the Heroine's Journey: Strength Through Connection Gail Carriger came on episode 550 to discuss her nonfiction book, The Heroine's Journey, and it completely reframed how I think about some of my own fiction. Gail explained that the core difference between the Hero's Journey and the Heroine's Journey comes down to how strength and victory are defined. The Hero's Journey is about strength through solo action. The hero must be continually isolated to get stronger. He goes out of civilisation, faces strife alone, and achieves victory through physical prowess and self-actualisation. The Heroine's Journey is the opposite. The heroine achieves her goals by activating a network. She's a delegator, a general. She identifies where she can't do something alone, finds the people who can help, and portions out the work for mutual gain. Gail put it simply: the heroine is very good at asking for help, which our culture tends to devalue but which is actually a powerful form of strength. Crucially, Gail stressed that gender is irrelevant to which journey you're writing. Her go-to examples are striking: the recent Wonder Woman film is practically a beat-for-beat hero's journey—Gilgamesh on screen, as Gail described it. Meanwhile, Harry Potter, both the first book and the series as a whole, is a classic heroine's journey. Harry's power comes from his network—Dumbledore's Army, the Order of the Phoenix, his friendships with Ron and Hermione. He doesn't defeat Voldemort alone. He defeats Voldemort because of love and connection. This distinction has real practical consequences for writers. If you're writing a hero's journey and you hit writer's block, Gail said, the solution is usually to isolate your hero further and pile on more strife. But if you're writing a heroine's journey, the solution is probably to throw a new character into the scene—someone who has advice to offer or a skill the heroine lacks. The actual solutions to writer's block are different depending on which narrative you're writing. As I reflected on my own work, I realised that my ARKANE thriller protagonist, Morgan Sierra, follows a hero's journey—she's a solo operative, a lone wolf like Jack Reacher or James Bond. But my Mapwalker fantasy series follows a heroine's journey, with Sienna and her group of friends working together. I hadn't consciously chosen those paths; the stories led me there. But understanding the framework helps me write more intentionally now. Actionable step: Identify which journey your protagonist is on. Does your character gain strength by being alone (hero) or by building connections (heroine)? This will inform every plot decision you make, from how they face obstacles to how your story ends. 5. Use ‘Metaphor Families' to Anchor Dialogue and Voice One of the most practical techniques Matt Bird shared on episode 624 is the idea of assigning each character a “metaphor family”—a specific well of language that they draw from. This gives each character a distinctive voice that goes beyond accent or dialect. Matt explained how in The Wire, one of the most beloved TV shows of all time, every character has a different metaphor family. What struck him was that Omar, this iconic character, never utters a single curse word in the entire series. His metaphor family is pirate. He talks about parlays, uses language that feels like it belongs in Pirates of the Caribbean, and it creates this incredible ironic counterpoint against his urban setting. It tells us immediately that this is a character who sees himself in a tradition of people that doesn't match his immediate surroundings. Matt also referenced the UK version of The Office, where Gareth works at a paper company but aspires to the military. So all of his language is drawn from a military metaphor family. He doesn't talk about filing and photocopying; he talks about tactics and discipline and being on the front line. This tells us that the character has a life and dreams beyond the immediate scene—and it's the gap between aspiration and reality that makes him both funny and believable. He pointed out that a metaphor family sometimes comes from a character's background, but it's often more interesting when it comes from their aspirations. What does your character want to be? What world do they fantasise about inhabiting? That's where their language should come from. In Star Wars, Obi-Wan Kenobi is a spiritual hermit, but his metaphor family is military. He uses the language of generals and commanders, and that ironic counterpoint is part of what makes him feel so rich. Actionable step: Assign each of your main characters a metaphor family. It could be based on their job, their background, or—more interestingly—their secret aspirations. Then go through your dialogue and make sure each character is consistently drawing from that well of language. If two characters sound the same when you strip away the dialogue tags, this is the fix. 6. Find the Diagnostic Detail: The Diagonal Toast Avoid clichéd character tags—the random scar, the eye patch, the mysterious limp—unless they serve a deep narrative purpose. Matt Bird on episode 624 was very funny about this: he pointed out that Nick Fury, Odin, and eventually Thor all have eye patches in the Marvel Cinematic Universe. Eye patches are done, he said. You cannot do eye patches anymore. Instead, look for what I'm calling the “diagonal toast” detail, after a scene Matt described from Captain Marvel. In the film, Captain Marvel is trying to determine whether Nick Fury is who he says he is. She asks him to prove he isn't a shapeshifting alien. Fury shares biographical details—his history, his mother—but then she pushes further and says, name one more thing you couldn't possibly have made up about yourself. And Fury says: if toast is cut diagonally, I can't eat it. Matt said that detail is gold for a writer because it feels pulled from a real life. You can pull it from your own life and gift it to your characters, and the reader can tell it's not manufactured. He gave another example from The Sopranos: Tony Soprano's mother won't answer the phone after dark. The show's creator, David Chase, confirmed on the DVD commentary that this came from his own mother, who genuinely would not answer the phone after dark and couldn't explain why. Matt's practical advice was to keep a journal. Write down the strange, specific things that people do or say. Mine your own life for those hyper-specific details. You just need one per book. In my own writing, I've used this approach. In my ARKANE thrillers, my character Morgan Sierra has always been Angelina Jolie in my mind—specifically Jolie in Lara Croft or Mr and Mrs Smith. And Blake Daniel in my crime thriller series was based on Jesse Williams from Grey's Anatomy. I paste pictures of actors into my Scrivener projects. It helps with visuals, but also with the sense of the character, their energy and physicality. But visual details only take you so far. It's the behavioural quirks—the diagonal toast moments—that make a character feel genuinely alive. That said, physical character tags can work brilliantly when they serve the story. As I discuss in How to Write a Novel, Robert Galbraith's Cormoran Strike is an amputee, and his pain and the physical challenges of his prosthesis are a key part of every story—it's not a cosmetic detail, it's woven into the action and the character's psychology. My character Blake Daniel always wears gloves to cover the scars on his hands, which provides an angle into his wounded past as well as a visual cue for the reader. And of course, Harry Potter's lightning-shaped scar isn't just a mark—it's a direct connection to his nemesis and the mythology of the entire series. The rule of thumb is: if the tag tells us something about the character's interior life or connects to the plot, it's earning its place. If it's just there to make the character visually distinctive, it's probably a crutch. Game of Thrones takes character tags further with the family houses, each with their own mottos and sigils. The Starks say “Winter is coming” and their sigil is a dire wolf. Those aren't just labels—they're worldview made visible. Actionable step: Start a “diagonal toast” notebook. Every time you notice something strange and specific about someone's behaviour—something that feels too real to be made up—write it down. Then gift it to a character who needs more texture. 7. Displace Your Own Trauma into the Work Barbara Nickless shared something deeply personal on episode 732 that fundamentally changed how I think about putting pain onto the page. While starting At First Light, the first book in her Dr. Evan Wilding series, she lost her son to epilepsy—something called SUDEP, Sudden Unexplained Death in Epilepsy. One day he was there, and the next day he was gone. Barbara said that writing helped her cope with the trauma, that doing a deep dive into Old English literature and the Viking Age for the book's research became a lifeline. But here's what's important: she didn't give Dr. Evan Wilding her exact trauma. Evan Wilding is four feet five inches, and Barbara described how he has to walk through a world that won't adjust to him. That's its own form of learning to cope when circumstances are beyond your control. She displaced her genuine grief into the character's different but parallel struggle. When I asked her about the difference between writing for therapy and writing for an audience, she drew on her experience teaching creative writing to veterans through a collaboration between the US Department of Defense and the National Endowment for the Arts. She said she's found that she can pour her heartache into her characters and process it through them, even when writing professionally, and that the genuine emotion is what touches readers. We've all been through our own losses and griefs, so seeing how a character copes can be deeply meaningful. I've always found that putting my own pain onto the page is the most direct way to connect with a reader's soul. My character Morgan Sierra's musings on religion and the supernatural are often my own. Her restlessness, her fascination with the darker edges of faith—those come from me. But her Krav Maga fighting skills and her ability to kill the bad guys are definitely her own. That gap between what's mine and what's hers is where the fiction lives. Barbara also said something on that episode that I wrote down and stuck on my wall. She said the act of producing itself is a balm to the soul. I've been thinking about that ever since. On my own wall, I have “Measure your life by what you create.” Different words, same truth. Actionable step: If you're carrying something heavy—grief, anger, fear, regret—consider how you might displace it into a character's different but emotionally parallel struggle. Don't copy your exact situation; transform it. The emotion will be genuine, and the reader will feel it. 8. Write Diverse Characters as Real People When I spoke with Sarah Elisabeth Sawyer on episode 673—Sarah is Choctaw and a historical fiction author honoured by the Smithsonian's National Museum of the American Indian—she offered a perspective that every fiction writer needs to hear. The key message was to move away from stereotypes. Don't write your American Indian character as the “Wise Guide” who exists solely to dispense mystic wisdom to the white protagonist. Don't limit diverse characters to historical settings, as though they only exist in the past. Place them in normal, contemporary roles. Your spaceship captain, your forensic scientist, your small-town baker—any of them can be American Indian, or Nigerian, or Japanese, and their heritage should be a lived-in part of their identity, not the sole reason they exist in the story. I write international thrillers and dark fantasy, and my fiction is populated with characters from all over the world. I have a multi-cultural family and I've lived in many places and travelled widely, so I've met, worked with, and had relationships with people from different cultures. I find story ideas through travel, and if I set my books in a certain place, then the story is naturally populated with the people who live there. As I discuss in my book, How to Write a Novel, the world is a diverse place, so your fiction needs to be populated with all kinds of people. If I only populated my fiction with characters like me, they would be boring novels. There are many dimensions of difference—race, nationality, sex, age, body type, ability, religion, gender, sexual orientation, socio-economic status, class, culture, education level—and even then, don't assume that similar types of people think the same way. Some authors worry they will make mistakes. We live in a time of outrage, and some authors have been criticised for writing outside their own experience. So is it too dangerous to try? Of course not. The media amplifies outliers, and most authors include diverse characters in every book without causing offence because they work hard to get it right. It's about awareness, research, and intent. Actionable step: Audit the cast of your current work in progress. Have you written a mono-cultural perspective for all of them? If so, consider who could bring a different background, perspective, or set of cultural specifics to the story. Not as a token addition, but as a real person with a real life. 9. Respect Tribal and Cultural Specificity Sarah Elisabeth Sawyer on episode 673 was emphatic about one thing: never treat diverse groups as monolithic. If you're writing a Native American character, you must research the specific nation. Choctaw is not Navajo, just as British is not French. Sarah described the distinct cultural markers of the Choctaw people—the diamond pattern you'll see on traditional shirts and dresses, which represents the diamondback rattlesnake. They have distinct dances and songs. She said that if she saw someone in traditional dress at a distance, she would know whether they were Choctaw based on what they were wearing. She encouraged writers who want to write specifically about a nation to get to know those people. Go to events, go to a powwow, learn about the individual culture. She noted that a big misconception is that American Indians exist only in the past—she stressed that they are still here, still living their cultures, and fiction should reflect that present reality. I took a similar approach when writing Destroyer of Worlds, which is set mostly in India. I read books about Hindu myth, watched documentaries about the sadhus, and had one of my Indian readers from Mumbai check my cultural references. For Risen Gods, set in New Zealand with a young Maori protagonist, I studied books about Maori mythology and fiction by Maori authors, and had a male Maori reader check for cultural issues. Research is simply an act of empathy. The practical takeaway is this: if you're going to include a character from a specific cultural background, do the work. Use specific cultural details rather than generic signifiers. Sarah talked about how even she fell into stereotypes when she was first writing, until her mother pointed them out. If someone from within a culture can fall into those traps, the rest of us certainly can. Do the research, try your best, ask for help, and apologise if you need to. Actionable step: If you're writing a character from a specific culture, identify three to five sensory or behavioural details that are particular to that culture—not the generic version, but the real, researched, lived-in version. Consider hiring a sensitivity reader from that community to check your work. 10. Give Your Protagonist a Morally Neutral ‘Hero' Status Matt Bird was clear about this on episode 624: the word “hero” simply means the protagonist, the person we follow through the story. It's a functional role, not a moral label. We don't have to like them. We don't even have to root for their goals in a moral sense. We just have to find them compelling enough to invest our attention in their problem-solving. Think of Succession, where every member of the Roy family is varying degrees of awful, and yet the show was utterly compelling. Or WeCrashed, where Adam Neumann is a narcissistic con artist, but we can't look away because he's trying to solve the enormous problem of building an empire from nothing, and the tradecraft he employs is fascinating. As I wrote in How to Write a Novel, readers must want to spend time with your characters. They don't have to be lovable or even likable—that will depend on your genre and story choices—but they have to be captivating enough that we want to spend time with them. A character who is trying to solve a massive problem will naturally draw investment from the audience, even if we wouldn't want to have tea with them. Will Storr extended this idea by pointing out that the audience will actually root for a character to solve their problem even if the audience doesn't actually want the character's goal to be achieved in the real world. We don't really want more billionaires, but we invested in Adam Neumann's rise because that was the problem the story posed, and our brains are wired to invest in problem-solving. This connects to something deeper: what does your character want, and why? As I explore in How to Write a Novel, desire operates on multiple levels. Take a character like Phil, who joins the military during wartime. On the surface, she wants to serve her country. But she also wants to escape her dead-end town and learn new skills. Deeper still, her father and grandfather served, and by joining up, she hopes to finally earn their respect. And perhaps deepest of all, her father died on a mission under mysterious circumstances, and she wants to find out what happened from the inside. That layering of motivation is what turns a flat character into a three-dimensional one. The audience doesn't need to be told all of this explicitly. It can emerge through action, dialogue, and the choices the character makes under pressure. But you, the writer, need to know it. You need to know what your character really wants deep down, because that desire—more than any external plot device—is what drives the story forward. And your antagonist needs the same depth. They also want something, often diametrically opposed to your protagonist, and they need a reason that makes sense to them. In my ARKANE thriller Tree of Life, my antagonist is the heiress of a Brazilian mining empire who wants to restore the Earth to its original state to atone for the destruction caused by her father's company. She's part of a radical ecological group who believe the only way to restore Nature is to end all human life. It's extreme, but in an era of climate change, it's a motivation readers can understand—even if they disagree with the solution. Actionable step: If you're struggling to make a morally grey character work, make sure their problem is big enough and their methods are specific and interesting enough that we invest in the how, even if we're ambivalent about the what. 11. Build Vibrant Side Characters Gail Carriger made a point on episode 550 that was equal parts craft advice and business strategy. In a Heroine's Journey model, side characters aren't just fodder to be killed off to motivate the hero. They form a network. And because you don't have to kill them—unlike in a hero's journey, where allies are often betrayed or removed so the hero can be further isolated—you can pick up those side characters and give them their own books. Gail said this creates a really voracious reader base. You write one series with vivid side characters, and then readers fall in love with those side characters and want their stories. So you write spin-offs. The romance genre does this brilliantly—think of the Bridgerton books, where each sibling gets their own novel. The side character in one book becomes the protagonist in the next. Barbara Nickless experienced this firsthand with her Dr. Evan Wilding series. She has River Wilding, Evan's adventurous brother, and Diana, the axe-throwing research assistant, and her editor has already expressed interest in a spin-off series with those characters. Barbara described creating characters she wants to spend time with, or characters who give her nightmares but also intrigue her. That's the dual test: are they interesting enough for you to write, and interesting enough for readers to demand more? As I wrote in How to Write a Novel, characters that span series can deepen the reader's relationship with them as you expand their backstory into new plots. Readers will remember the character more than the plot or the book title, and look forward to the next instalment because they want more time with those people. British crime author Angela Marsons described it as readers feeling like returning to her characters is like putting on a pair of old slippers. Actionable step: Look at your supporting cast. Is there a side character who is vivid enough to carry their own story? If not, what could you add—a specific hobby, a distinct voice, a compelling backstory—that would make readers want more of them? 12. Use Voice as a Rhythmic Tool Voice is one of the most important elements of novel writing, and Matt Bird helped me think about it in a technical, mechanical way that I found really useful. He pointed out that the ratio of periods to commas defines a character's internal reality. A staccato rhythm—lots of periods, short sentences—suggests a character who is certain, grounded, or perhaps survivalist and traumatised. Katniss in The Hunger Games has a period-heavy voice. She's in survival mode. She doesn't have time for complexity or qualification. A flowing, comma-heavy style suggests someone more academic, more nuanced, or possibly more scattered and manipulative. The character who qualifies everything, who adds sub-clauses and digressions, is a different kind of person from the character who speaks in declarations. This is something you can actually measure. Pull up a passage of your character's dialogue or internal monologue and count the periods versus the commas. If the rhythm doesn't match who the character is supposed to be, you've found a mismatch you can fix. Sentence length is the heartbeat of your character's persona. And voice extends beyond rhythm to the words themselves. As I discussed in the metaphor families tip, each character should draw from a distinctive well of language. But voice also encompasses their relationship to silence. Some characters talk around the thing they mean; others say it straight. Some are self-deprecating; others are blunt to the point of rudeness. All of these choices are character choices, not just style choices. I find it useful to read my dialogue aloud—and not just to check for naturalness, but to hear whether each character sounds distinct. If you could swap dialogue lines between two characters and nobody would notice, you have a voice problem. One practical test: cover the dialogue tags and see if you can tell who's speaking from the words alone. Actionable step: Choose a key passage from your protagonist's point of view and read it aloud. Does the rhythm match the character? A soldier under fire should not sound like a philosophy professor at a wine tasting. Adjust the ratio of periods to commas until the voice feels right. 13. Link Character and Plot Until They're Inseparable Will Storr made the case on episode 490 that the number one problem he sees in the writing he encounters—in workshops, in submissions, even in published books—is that the characters and the plots are unconnected. There's a story happening, and there are people in it, but the story isn't a product of who those people are. He said a story should be like life. In our lives, the plots are intimately connected to who we are as characters. The goals we pursue, the obstacles we face, the same problems that keep recurring—these are products of our personalities, our flaws, our specific ways of being in the world. His framework is that your plot should be designed specifically to plot against your character. You've got a character with a particular flaw; the plot exists to test that flaw over and over until the character either transforms or doubles down and explodes. Jaws is the perfect example. Brody is afraid of water. A shark shows up in the coastal town he's responsible for protecting. The entire plot is engineered to force him to confront the one thing he cannot face. Will pointed out that the whole plot of Jaws is structured around Brody's flaw. It begins with the shark arriving, the midpoint is when Brody finally gets the courage to go into the water, and the very final scene isn't the shark blowing up—it's Brody swimming back through the water. Even a film that's ninety-eight percent action is, at its core, structured around a character with a character flaw. This is the standard I aspire to in my own work, even in my action-heavy thrillers. The external plot should be a mirror of the internal struggle. When those two are aligned, the story becomes irresistible. Will also made an important point about series fiction, which is where most commercial authors live. I asked him how this works when your character can't be transformed at the end of every book because there has to be a next book. His answer was elegant: you don't cure them. Episodic TV characters like Fleabag or David Brent or Basil Fawlty never truly change—and the fact that they don't change is actually the source of the comedy. But every episode throws a new story event at them that tests and exposes their flaw. You just keep throwing story events at them again and again. That's a soap opera, a sitcom, and a book series. As I wrote in How to Write a Novel, character flaws are aspects of personality that affect the person so much that facing and overcoming them becomes central to the plot. In Jaws, the protagonist Brody is afraid of the water, but he has to overcome that flaw to destroy the killer shark and save the town. But remember, your characters should feel like real people, so never define them purely by their flaws. The character addicted to painkillers might also be a brilliant and successful female lawyer who gets up at four in the morning to work out at the gym, likes eighties music, and volunteers at the local dog shelter at weekends. Character wounds are different from flaws. They're formed from life experience and are part of your character's backstory—traumatic events that happened before the events of your novel but shape the character's reactions in the present. In my ARKANE thrillers, Morgan Sierra's husband Elian died in her arms during a military operation. This happened before the series begins, but her memories of it recur when she faces a firefight, and she struggles to find happiness again for fear of losing someone she loves once more. And then there's the perennial advice: show, don't tell. Most writers have heard this so many times that it's easy to nod and then promptly write scenes that tell rather than show. Basically, you need to reveal your character through action and dialogue, rather than explanation. In my thriller Day of the Vikings, Morgan Sierra fights a Neo-Viking in the halls of the British Museum and brings him down with Krav Maga. That fight scene isn't just about showing action. It opens up questions about her backstory, demonstrates character, and moves the plot forward. Telling would be something like: “Morgan was an expert in Krav Maga.” Showing is the reader discovering it through the scene itself. Actionable step: Look at the main plot events of your novel. For each major turning point, ask: does this scene specifically test my protagonist's flaw? If not, can you redesign the scene so that it does? The tighter the connection between character and plot, the more powerful the story. 14. The ‘Maestra' Approach: Write Out of Order If you're a discovery writer like me, you may feel like the deep character work I've been describing sounds more suited to plotters. But Barbara Nickless gave me a beautiful metaphor on episode 732 that reframes it entirely. Barbara described her evolving writing process as being like a maestra standing in front of an orchestra. Sometimes you bring in the horns—a certain theme—and sometimes you bring in the strings—a certain character—and sometimes you turn to the soloist. It's a more organic and jumping-around process than linear writing, and Barbara said she's only recently given herself permission to work this way. When I told her that I use Scrivener to write in scenes out of order and then drag and drop them into a structure later, she was genuinely intrigued. And this is how I've always worked. I'll see the story in my mind like a movie trailer—flashes of the big emotional scenes, the pivotal confrontations, the moments of revelation—and I write those first. I don't know how they hang together until quite late in the process. Then I'll move scenes around, print the whole thing out, and figure out the connective tissue. The point is that discovery writers can absolutely build deep characters. Sometimes writing the big emotional scenes first is how you discover who the character is before you fill in the rest. You don't need a twenty-page character worksheet or a 200-page outline like Jeffery Deaver. You need to be willing to follow the character into the unknown and trust that the structure will emerge. As Barbara said, she writes to know what she's thinking. That's the discovery writer's credo. And I would add: I write to know who my characters are. Actionable step: If you're stuck on your current chapter, skip it. Write the scene that's burning in your imagination, even if it's from the middle or the end. That scene might be the key to unlocking who your character really is. 15. Use Research to Help with Empathy Research shouldn't just be about factual accuracy—it's a tool for finding the sensory details that create empathy. Barbara Nickless described research as almost an excuse to explore things that fascinate her, and I feel exactly the same way. I would go so far as to say that writing is an excuse for me to explore the things that interest me. Barbara and I both travel for our stories. For her Dr. Evan Wilding books, she did deep research into Old English literature and the Viking Age. For my thriller End of Days, I transcribed hours of video from Appalachian snake-handling churches on YouTube to understand the worldview of the worshippers, because my antagonist was brought up in that tradition. I couldn't just make that up. I had to hear their language, feel their conviction, understand why they would hold venomous serpents as an act of faith. Barbara also mentioned getting to Israel and the West Bank for research, and I've been to both places too. Finding that one specific sensory detail—the smell of a particular location, the specific way an expert handles a tool, the sound of a particular kind of music—makes the character's life feel lived-in. It's the difference between a character who is described as living in a place and a character who inhabits it. As I wrote in How to Write a Novel, don't write what you know. Write what you want to learn about. I love research. It's part of why I'm an author in the first place. I take any excuse to dive into a world different from my own. Research using books, films, podcasts, and travel, and focus particularly on sources produced by people from the worldview you want to understand. Actionable step: For your next piece of character research, go beyond reading. Watch a documentary, visit a location, talk to someone who lives the experience. Find one sensory detail—a smell, a sound, a texture—that you couldn't have invented. That detail will make your character feel real. Bonus: Measure Your Life by What You Create In an age of AI and a tsunami of content, your ultimate brand protection is the quality of your human creation. Barbara Nickless said that the act of producing itself is a balm to the soul, and I believe that with every fibre of my being. Don't be afraid to take that step back, like I did with my deadlifting. Take the time to master these deeper craft skills. It might feel like you're slowing down or going backwards by not chasing the latest marketing trend, but it's the only way to step forward into a sustainable, high-quality career. Your characters are your signature. No AI can replicate the specificity of your lived experience, the emotional truth of your displaced trauma, or the sensory details you've gathered from a life of curiosity and travel. Those are yours. Pour them into your characters, and they will resonate for years to come. Actionable Takeaway: Identify the Dramatic Question for your current protagonist. Can you state it in a single sentence with the kind of specificity Will Storr described? Is it as clear as “Are you ordinary or extraordinary?” or “Are you the only adult in the room?” If you can't answer it with that kind of precision, your character might still be a sketch. Give them a diagonal toast moment today. Find the one hyper-specific detail that proves they are not an imitation of life. And then ask yourself: does your plot test your character's flaw in every major scene? If you can align those two things—a precisely defined character and a plot that exists to test them—you will have a story that readers cannot put down. References and Deep Dives The episodes I've referenced today are all available with full transcripts at TheCreativePenn.com: Episode 732 — Facing Fears, and Writing Unique Characters with Barbara Nickless Episode 673 — Writing Choctaw Characters and Diversity in Fiction with Sarah Elisabeth Sawyer Episode 624 — Writing Characters with Matt Bird Episode 550 — The Heroine's Journey with Gail Carriger Episode 490 — How Character Flaws Shape Story with Will Storr Books mentioned: The Secrets of Character: Writing a Hero Anyone Will Love by Matt Bird The Science of Storytelling by Will Storr The Heroine's Journey by Gail Carriger How to Write a Novel: From Idea to Book by Joanna Penn You can find all my books for authors at CreativePennBooks.com and my fiction and memoir at JFPennBooks.com Happy writing! How was this episode created? This episode was initiated created by NotebookLM based on YouTube videos of the episodes linked above from YouTube/TheCreativePenn, plus my text chapters on character from How to Write a Novel. NotebookLM created a blog post from the material and then I expanded it and fact checked it with Claude.ai 4.6 Opus, and then I used my voice clone at ElevenLabs to narrate it. The post Writing Characters: 15 Actionable Tips For Writing Deep Character first appeared on The Creative Penn.

From Tony, to Paulie, to Junior, the characters of The Sopranos are television legend. But just as iconic are the sets of the show. A new exhibit at the Museum of the Moving Image gathers the archives of Sopranos creator David Chase, as well as sketches and designs behind some of the show's principal sets, including Dr. Melfi's office, the Soprano home, the Bada Bing strip club, and Satriale's Pork Store. Barbara Miller, museum deputy director for curatorial affairs, discusses the exhibit, 'Stories and Set Designs for The Sopranos,' on view through May 31. Photograph by Courtesy of HBO