Podcast appearances and mentions of jackson brown

คอลัมน์ “สดแต่เช้า”ปีที่5 (ตอนที่43) จงมีใจกระตือรือร้นด้วยพระวิญญาณ! “ อย่าอ่อนระอา จงมีจิตใจกระตือรือร้นด้วยพระวิญญาณ จงปรนนิบัติองค์พระผู้เป็นเจ้า”‭‭ ~โรม‬ ‭12‬:‭11‬ ‭THSV11‬‬ “Don't hesitate to be enthusiastic —be on fire in the Spirit as you serve the Lord!”‭‭ ~Romans‬ ‭12‬:‭11‬ ‭CEB‬‬ ในการติดตามพระเจ้าหรือในการรับใช้พระเยซูคริสต์ เรามักจะต้องเผชิญกับการต่อต้านและการโจมตีของมารซาตาน และโลกอยู่ตลอดเวลาและไม่ว่าเราจะตั้งใจหรือเจตนาดีสักเพียงใด แต่เราก็อาจผิดพลาดหรือล้มเหลวได้อยู่เสมอเราจึงอาจเกิดอาการท้อใจได้ในบางครั้งหรือบ่อยครั้ง อาจารย์เปาโล ตระหนักดี ในเรื่องนี้ จึงได้เตือนสติและหนุนใจบรรดาผู้เชื่อทั้งหลาย1.ให้คงรักษาความร้อนรนในจิตวิญญาณของตนไว้ และ2.ให้ตระหนักอยู่ตลอดเวลาว่าพวกเรากำลังรับใช้พระเจ้าอยู่ไม่ใช่รับใช้มนุษย์ ซึ่งผู้ที่ตัดสินสุดท้ายไม่ใช่มนุษย์แต่คือพระเจ้า สิ่งที่เราควรทำก็คือ เราต้องรับใช้ด้วยใจที่ enthusiastic(กระตือรือร้น) คำว่า“enthusiastic “ (กระตือรือร้น) หมายความว่า “มี หรือ แสดงความพึงพอใจ ความสนใจ หรือการรับรองอย่างแรงกล้าและร้อนรน“ (having or showing intense and eager enjoyment, interest, or approval.) แล้วเราจะรับใช้ด้วยความกระตือรือร้นแบบไหน? ใช่ครับ เราต้องปรนนิบัติรับใช้อย่าง“กระตือรือร้นด้วยพระวิญญาณ“ ซึ่งแปลตรงตัวได้ว่า“ร้อนรนในวิญญาณ”ไม่ว่าจะเป็น1.ความร้อนรนในจิตวิญญาณของเราเอง หรือ2.ความร้อนรนที่พระวิญญาณบริสุทธิ์ประทานมาให้ เราที่ศรัทธาในพระเจ้าจะให้ความสำคัญ ต่อการรับใช้หรือปรนนิบัติพระเจ้าแต่สิ่งที่สำคัญควบคู่ไปกับการรับใช้ก็คือท่าทีหรือทัศนคติต่อการรับใช้ที่กระทำอยู่ อาจารย์เปาโลได้กล่าวถึงท่าทีในการรับใช้ที่คริสตชนพึงมีในขณะที่รับใช้พระเจ้าไว้ว่า1.เราต้องรับใช้แบบไม่อ่อนระอา คือ ไม่ลังเล ไม่เกียจคร้าน2.เราต้องรับใช้แบบกระตือรือร้น คือ ขยันขันแข็ง 3.เราต้องรับใช้แบบร้อนรน(เหมือนน้ำที่กำลังเดือด) 1).ด้วยจิตวิญญาณตัวของเรา หรือ 2).ด้วยพระวิญญาณบริสุทธิ์ นั่นคือ ไม่ว่า ชีวิต หรือ สถานการณ์ที่เราเผชิญอยู่จะดูยากลำบาก ย่ำแย่มากสักเพียงใดไม่ว่า ปรปักษ์หรือคนรอบข้างจะโจมตีหรือวิพากษ์วิจารณ์เราในเชิงลบมากแค่ไหน ก็ขอให้เรายังคงมองโลกในแง่บวกด้วยความเชื่อ และยืนหยัดรับใช้ต่อไปอย่างกระตือรือร้น เหมือนคำกล่าวที่ว่า “ จงปกป้องความกระตือรือร้นของคุณจากคำกล่าวลบของคนอื่น“ (Protect your enthusiasm from the negativity of others.) ~H. Jackson Brown, Jr.นั่นคือ เราต้องไม่ปล่อยให้ความกระตือรือร้น หรือ ความร้อนรนของเราเยือกเย็นลงเพราะปากของผู้ใด! พี่น้องที่รัก คุณเห็นด้วยหรือไม่ว่า ”เคล็ดลับแท้แห่งความสำเร็จ ก็คือความกระตือรือร้น!“ (The real secret of success is enthusiasm.) ~Walter Chrysle ถ้าเป็นจริงตามนั้น ก็ต้องถามว่าวันนี้ คุณกำลังรับใช้พระเจ้าด้วยความกระตือรือร้นอย่างที่กล่าวมาแล้วหรือไม่?หากว่า คุณกำลังเยือกเย็น หรือเฉื่อยชาลงในการรับใช้ คุณควรจะทำอะไรและอย่างไรเพื่อคุณจะกลับมากระตือรือร้นในการปรนนิบัติรับใช้อย่างเต็มศักยภาพได้อีกครั้ง? ท้ายนี้ ขอย้ำอีกครั้งด้วยคำเตือน ของอาจารย์เปาโลที่ว่า“อย่าขาดความกระตือรือร้น แต่จงรักษาความร้อนรนฝ่ายจิตวิญญาณของท่านไว้ และรับใช้องค์พระผู้เป็นเจ้า”‭‭ ~โรม‬ ‭12‬:‭11‬ ‭TNCV‬‬ …อาเมนไหมครับ?~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ธงชัย ประดับชนานุรัตน์13พฤษภาคม2025 (ตอน43 ของปีที่5)#YoutubeCJCONNECT #ThongChaibsc#คริสตจักรแห่งความรัก #Churchoflove #ShareTheLoveForward #ChurchOfJoy #คริสตจักรแห่งความสุข #NimitmaiChristianChurch #คริสตจักรนิมิตใหม่ #ฮักกัยประเทศไทย #อัลฟ่า #หนึ่งล้านความดี#Spotifyสดแต่เช้า

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Dan and Jared bully their classmate Jackson, unaware of Jackson's latent supernatural gifts.PLEASE LIKE/RATE/REVIEW!Find us on Threads: @danconcesssions @jaredconcessions

Josh's Guests: Chris Slade - drummer For Tom Jones, Manfred Mann Earth Band, AC/DC, Asia, The Firm (Part 2) Tom Rush - folk singer His 1968 Album Circle Game included songs by Joni Mitchell, Jackson Brown, James Taylor before any of these major talents had recorded an album (Part 3) Melanie - Billboards Female Artist Of The Year 1972 Played at Woodstock, wrote the hit song Lay Down (Candles In The Rain), topped the charts with Brand New Key, fasted at Bernard Jensens ranch. (Part 1) find us at: www.HeresToYourHealthWithJoshuaLane.com  

Natalya Kay is a fiddler in the Irish tradition and a key member of Celtic super group Gaelic Storm. She and I met in the spring of 2020 when she moved into the house next door to mine in East Nashville. I think the first time we jammed was at a party in my front yard. I remember thinking two things about that encounter. One was, Man this girl can really play! The other was, being shocked to hear her say she had no interest in any kind of career as a professional musician. That seems like a long time ago now. This year she played countless festivals with Gaelic Storm, stadium shows with the Zac Brown Band, and a few weeks ago she was at the Hollywood Bowl sharing the stage with Harrison Ford, Jackson Brown and Brandi Carlile. Afterward, she got props from none other than Sir Paul McCartney.Natalya's meteoric rise has been the result not of an unrelenting determination, but her genuine talent and as she describes here, a consistent decision to walk through whatever door that opened, despite the chorus of self-doubt ringing in her ears. In the course of this lively conversation we come back to the theme of insecurity - a part of every artist's experience - and of resisting the temptation to let it win. Natalya laughingly describes the moment when she got the call from Gaelic Storm, the gig that ultimately changed her life. She tried to talk them out of the audition, saying she wasn't a good fit, she didn't have any experience.They insisted, she acquiesced. Now she's on the road traveling the world. The Morse Code is a reader-supported publication! To support the podcast, writing, and music, consider becoming a free or paid subscriber.As a quiet homeschooled girl from rural Maine, she describes the irony of feeling absolutely at home on stage with GS, how she feels like it's the most natural thing in the world, being up there in front of all those people, fiddling away.Speaking of, I ask her about a few of the approaches specific to the tradition of Irish fiddling, the rolls for one. She demonstrates how she does it, right there at the table. It will be interesting to anyone who loves or even has a passing attraction to Irish music. Natalya breaks down the technique and shows how it affects the play of the overall tune. I loved seeing that. No player am I in the Irish way, but I do have something of a background in bluegrass and old-time music, and there's enough of a language shared that I felt I might back Natalya on her performance of Cliffs of Moher, a popular Irish jig which, being in 6/8 time, requires a completely different approach than the 4/4 of its American cousin. I did my best to stay out of the way and let Natalya's playing shine, a performance that alone was worth the listen.I hope you enjoy this conversation with a truly fresh voice in Irish Music.Find Natalya:Website Instagram Get full access to The Morse Code at korby.substack.com/subscribe

The fellahs bring Jackson back to take a look at our insides now that they're on the outside. Please follow/rate/review!Find Jared on Threads @jaredconcessionsDM Dan on X @DanConcedes

Dan and Jared invite Jackson back to serve up their initial thoughts on Luca Guadagnino's complex tennis love triangle. Please follow and rate!

QUOTES FOR REFLECTION “Love is when the other person's happiness is more important than your own.”~H. Jackson Brown, Jr. (1940-2021), inspirational author “The happiness you feel is in direct proportion with the love you give.”~Oprah Winfrey, talk show host and media mogul “Happiness is only real when shared.”~Jon Krakauer, writer and mountaineer “We are not those who pay homage to stones, that are without sensation; but of the only God, who is before all and over all, and, moreover, we are worshippers of His Christ, who is truly God the Word existing before all time.”~Melito, Bishop of Sardis (written c. 169-170) in his “Apology to Marcus Aurelius” “Jesus is the Word, the Image, the Expression and Exegesis of God.”~Hans Urs von Balthasar (1905-1988), Swiss theologian “To receive God's grace, the main thing you need is need—the main thing you need is nothing. But not many people have it.”~John Gerstner (1914-1996), theologian and professor of church history Question 8: Is there more than one God? Answer: There is only one, the living and true God.Question 9. How many persons are in the one God? Answer: Three persons are in the one God: the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit. Although they are differentiated by their own individual, personal qualities, these three are one true, eternal God, the same in substance and equal in power and glory.~Westminster Larger Catechism (1647) “In space, astronauts experience the misery of having no reference point, no force that draws them to the center. Where there is no ‘moral gravity'…there is spiritual weightlessness. We float on feelings that will carry us where we were never meant to go; we bubble with emotional experiences that we often take for spiritual ones; and we are puffed up with pride. Instead of seriousness, there is foolishness. Instead of gravity, flippancy. Sentimentality takes the place of theology. Our reference point…is merely ourselves. We cannot possibly tell which end is up.”~Elisabeth Elliot (1926-2015), missionary and authorSERMON PASSAGEGalatians 6:1, 6, 13-15, 19-26 (ESV)Galatians 5 1 For freedom Christ has set us free; stand firm therefore, and do not submit again to a yoke of slavery…. 6 For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision nor uncircumcision counts for anything, but only faith working through love…. 13 For you were called to freedom, brothers. Only do not use your freedom as an opportunity for the flesh, but through love serve one another. 14 For the whole law is fulfilled in one word: “You shall love your neighbor as yourself.” 15 But if you bite and devour one another, watch out that you are not consumed by one another…. 19 Now the works of the flesh are evident: sexual immorality, impurity, sensuality, 20 idolatry, sorcery, enmity, strife, jealousy, fits of anger, rivalries, dissensions, divisions, 21 envy, drunkenness, orgies, and things like these. I warn you, as I warned you before, that those who do such things will not inherit the kingdom of God. 22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, 23 gentleness, self-control; against such things there is no law. 24 And those who belong to Christ Jesus have crucified the flesh with its passions and desires. 25 If we live by the Spirit, let us also keep in step with the Spirit. 26 Let us not become conceited, provoking one another, envying one another. Ephesians 4 1 I therefore, a prisoner for the Lord, urge you to walk in a manner worthy of the calling to which you have been called, 2 with all humility and gentleness, with patience, bearing with one another in love,

Hi, Change Makers, Welcome back! I've had times in my work where I've questioned alignment with my environment, and even sometimes, with my projects. These are the types of situations can lead to misalignment burnout. How do you ensure that the value you provide is reflected not just in the impact you make, but also in the numbers that guide your business or your work?  I want you to have clarity in your building and growing and that's why you're getting part 2 of an episode with my friend, Michelle Y. Jackson Brown Impact Innovators - Impact Driven Strategies for Change-Maker Brands.  Tune in as Michelle shares what it means to show up authentically, navigate change, and 7 Ways to Integrate Your Personal Brand in Your Work.  Make sure you have your journal to capture these tips.   Michelle Y. Jackson Brown. A devoted wife, mother, entrepreneur, and an associate real estate broker in Virginia, Michelle embodies the essence of living a faith-driven life.    Resources:  Year End Power Moves and Breaking Free www.feliciafordandco.com/resources Connect with Michelle Jackson Brown - https://www.facebook.com/Mz.MJB  www.tiktok.com/@justmjb    

Hi, Change Makers, I've had times in my work where I've questioned alignment with my environment, and even sometimes, with my projects. These are the types of situations can lead to misalignment burnout. How do you ensure that the value you provide is reflected not just in the impact you make, but also in the numbers that guide your business or your work?  I want you to have clarity in your building and growing and that's why I invited my friend, Michelle Y. Jackson Brown to join us today in our first episode of Impact Innovators - Impact Driven Strategies for Change-Maker Brands.  Tune in as I share a bit of my experience with misalignment burnout and dig in with Michelle for part one of what it's like to bring alignment with your purpose and profit as a Change Maker.  Make sure you have your journal to capture these tips.   Michelle Y. Jackson Brown. A devoted wife, mother, entrepreneur, and an associate real estate broker in Virginia, Michelle embodies the essence of living a faith-driven life.    Resources:  Year End Power Moves and Breaking Free www.feliciafordandco.com/resources Connect with Michelle Jackson Brown - https://www.facebook.com/Mz.MJB  Read the blog: www.feliciafordandco.com/blog Free Magazine: Strategic Edge Power Moves for Businesses + Nonprofits: https://bit.ly/StrategicEdgeHolidayGuide      

It's a purging of hard feelings on the ride this week as Dan lays down a whole show of angry songs. Helen MckCookerybook (yep), Elton John, Pink Floyd, John Mellencamp, Jackson Brown, Charlie Parr, The Gear Daddies, Queen and Van-the-angriest-man-man-I-know Morrison all included.

Jackson Brown joins Jared and Dan again to discuss the criminally under-exposed film Strange Days! In here we talk about lost films in the age of streaming abundance, 90s era feelings about the end of history, and Ralph Fiennes' miraculously sexy shirts. Please give us a follow and a rating! Find us online: Jared: @JaredConcessions on Threads Dan: @DanConcedes on Twitter

Here in Episode 152 of the No Name Music Cast, it is Joy's turn to pick the topic, and she chooses to talk about all the great music she has enjoyed in 2023!Looking back at her Spotify & YouTube stats, she covers artists such as Rick James, Rod Stewart and Jackson Brown.We also cover Paul Gilbert, The Wobble and the music sensation which is CVS!https://www.facebook.com/NoNameMusicCast/

Let the names tell the story – With Waddy Wachtel, Danny Kortchmar, Leland Sklar and drummer, producer, and writer  Russ Kunkel created and played music history. Historic albums by Carole King, Jackson Brown, James Taylor, Warren Zevon, Bob Dylan, Joni Mitchell, Linda Ronstadt, David Crosby, Graham Nash, Steven Stills,  Neil Young, Kate and Anna McGarrigle, Jimmy Buffet, JJ Cale, Ringo, Lyle Lovett, George Harrison, Dolly, Linda and Emmylou  The Trio album, Stevie Nicks, Don Henley, Bob Seger, Bonnie Raitt, Tracey Chapman, Joe Walsh, BB King, Steve Winwood. On and On and ON. Now, along with seasoned guitarist and vocalist Steve Postell,  they've established the opportunity to be their band. The Immediate Family. Their new album Skin in the Game arrives Feb 16. Skin in the Game references the fact that they aren't sidemen here. It's not a play-and-walk-away kind of thing. They're taking the music they wrote and played,  out on the road for themselves. No one else. For the rest of the story, check out the documentary The Immediate Family. Screening now. The annual Critics Choice Awards take place in LA Sunday at 7 PM Eastern. Hosted by Chelsea Handler. Ive gathered four opinionated critics (are there any other kind) We met on Zoom and went at it. Discussing the film year 2023 and who's going to win what… Shawn Edwards  Kansas City Hillary Atkin LA Teri Hart Toronto Bonnie Laufer Toronto   It's a wild ride friends..come  along.  

SUMMARY:Songwriters Hall of Famer JD Souther joins Scott and Paul for an in-depth interview to kick off the New Year! PART ONE:Paul and Scott welcome two very special guests (ages 8 and 5) to help set the tone for the new year. Plus they reveal the clever message a listener sent in to win the Stax Christmas LP from the last episode. PART TWO:Our in-depth conversation with JD SoutherABOUT JD SOUTHER:JD Souther is perhaps best known for writing or co-writing ten songs recorded by the Eagles, including “Victim of Love,” “The Sad Café,” “How Long,” and the #1 hits “Best of My Love,” “New Kid in Town,” and “Heartache Tonight.” Another ten of his songs were recorded by Linda Ronstadt, among them “Faithless Love,” “Prisoner in Disguise,” and “Simple Man, Simple Dream.” The list of other artists who have drawn from the JD Souther songbook includes Bonnie Raitt, Rod Stewart, Conway Twitty, Glen Campbell, George Strait, Trisha Yearwood, Tom Jones, Roy Orbison, Raul Malo, Michael Buble, India.Arie, and Crosby, Stills & Nash. Additionally, JD co-wrote three songs with Don Henley on his End of the Innoncence album, including “Heart of the Matter,” and found success with the Dixie Chicks' cover of his “I'll Take Care of You.” As an artist, JD launched his career with the group Longbranch / Pennywhistle, which he founded with future Eagle Glenn Frey. Soon after, he co-founded the Souther-Hillman-Furay Band with Chris Hillman of The Byrds and the Flying Burrito Brothers, and Richie Furay of Buffalo Springfield and Poco. In total, JD has released seven solo studio albums between 1972 and 2015, and landed two Top 10 hits as a recording artist with “You're Only Lonely” and the James Taylor duet “Her Town Too.” Souther was inducted into the Songwriters Hall of Fame in 2013. 

Today we are talking with Researchers at the University of Michigan Institute for Social Research who have received a grant to study Black History Month Programming in Public Libraries. This three year project is the first national study to assess the content, scope, and factors influencing Black History Month offerings at public libraries in the United States. Our guests are Dr. Grace Jackson-Brown, Ph.D., M.L.S. Professor, Library Science, Research & Instructional Services Unit; Chairperson, Springfield African American Read-In, Duane G. Meyer Library, Missouri State University and Dr. Deborah Robinson MBA (Concentration: International Organizations) The University of Geneva, Geneva, Switzerland; Ph.D. Social Psychology The University of Michigan, Ann Arbor, Michigan.

On this week's edition of All Over The Planet, Dylan looks at his year in review with his Spotify wrap up results and artists like Wooze, Haruomi Hosono, and The Tragically Hip, while Edgar plays classics like Jackson Brown, U2, and Buddy Holly. All Over The Planet is a music/trivia hybrid show that is recorded/airs on WRHC 106.7 and 93.5 WRHC Radio Harbor Country, who you can support at https://www.radioharborcountry.org/ . All rights reserved to the artists, All Over The Planet does not claim ownership of any of the music performed or talked about on our program, as we work with a community radio license. 

Jared, Dan and Jackson experiment with legal drugs and try to keep the conversation coherent while discussing the mental castration that is corporate servitude! Dan: @DanConcedes on X Jared: @JaredConcessions on Threads Please give us a follow and a rating!

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*He is perhaps the biggest name in Russian rock music, famous as the leader of the band Aquarium throughout his homeland and 'Outer Russia' (as the huge and growing number of Russian emigres are called), but he is now listed as a “foreign agent” - basically an anti-patriot, a traitor, for criticising Russia's war *Aquarium were pioneers of the clandestine homegrown rock scene that was born in early '70s USSR before emerging from the underground to become the pied pipers of perestroika, selling millions of albums (but usually getting paid nothing). *After a long and illustrous career, Boris Grebenshikov now lives in London and in response to the conflict has put together an extraordinary compilation aiming to help children in Ukraine - and for the friends and fans he has had to leave behind.   *The album features a star-studded ensemble including Dave Stewart of The Eurythmics, Jethro Tull, Marianne Faithful, Marc Almond, The Waterboys, Jackson Brown, Crowded House and many others.  *We talk of the USSR in the 60s, cultural censorship,the power of music, the KGB arresting your friends, being back on the outside yet again - and we hear selections from the 'Heal the Sky' album.   Thanks to Alex Kan for making this happen.   *For more details and to support the project: Heal The Sky *Let us know where you are at (a few questions about you) *Get Our Bulletin   #counterculture #music #ussr #soho #aquarium #ukraine #russia #war #borisgrebenshikov #perestroika #coldwar #russinemeigre #russianrock  

Jason Crosby on Playing with Jackson Brown, Jenny Lewis, and adapting as a side man more: https://jasoncrosby.com/ @allthatjampod on IG, FB, and Twitter - www.allthatjampod.com - Subscribe - leave a review - tell a friend. All That Jam is brought to you by Executive Producers Amanda Cadran and Kevin Hogan. Produced and edited by Amanda Cadran and Kevin Hogan. Mixed and Mastered by Kevin Hogan. Original Music by Aaron Gaul. Art by Amanda Cadran. 

"I live by investing 86,400 seconds per day to obtain the highest ROI possible on fulfillment and mindfulness. My purpose in this life is to make a difference in other people's lives". Claude Brousseau, PGA Master Professional and Director of Player Development at The Wailea Golf Academy joins host Colin Weston for an inspirational 40 minutes of conversation. ______________________________________________ We want to thank our sponsor partner Golf Genius Software for helping support The ModGolf Podcast https://files.fireside.fm/file/fireside-uploads/images/1/1ea879c1-a4a2-4e10-bea4-e5d8368a3c7a/17rvuXOv.jpg (https://www.golfgenius.com) Golf Genius powers tournament management at over 10,000 private clubs, public courses, resorts, golf associations, and tours in over 60 countries. So if you're a golf professional or course operator who wants to save time, deliver exceptional golfer experiences, and generate more revenue, check them out online at golfgenius.com (https://www.golfgenius.com). ______________________________________________ https://files.fireside.fm/file/fireside-uploads/images/1/1ea879c1-a4a2-4e10-bea4-e5d8368a3c7a/5FrlggTU.jpg "I can accomplish goals by avoiding negative thoughts. When things are not going well in golf or life, take the time to look at yourself in the mirror and say okay, you are the CEO of your life. You need to assume those responsibilities with the decision, and there is a price to be outside of your comfort zone, but that's where you realize your potential." "I was able to go to the Dunhill tournaments and walk on both St. Andrews and Carnoustie the same day. So you can see why I'm so grateful and full of appreciation." Click on the image below to watch our extended conversation with Claude on our Youtube Channel (https://youtu.be/dljddK5MV9c)! https://files.fireside.fm/file/fireside-uploads/images/1/1ea879c1-a4a2-4e10-bea4-e5d8368a3c7a/lYnnqHDh.jpg (https://youtu.be/dljddK5MV9c) Episode Chapters [02:30] Claude shares his first golf experience and the person who invited him to put a club in his hands. [04:30] Claude discusses his days growing up in a small rural town in Quebec Canada and "First Life" as an ICU nurse in Florida. [06:40] We learn about Claude's golf mini tour experience in Florida and how that lead to the start of his teaching career. [09:45] How Claude ended up in Maui and the supportive people who helped shape his approach to teaching. [14:30] The lessons learned and experience acquired as a nurse that Claude applies to teaching his diverse group of students. [16:50] Colin asked Claude to elaborate on his approach to spending the 86,400 seconds that each day gifts us. [19:30] We learn about a "Day in The Life" of Claude Brousseau. [27:00] Claude talks about the influence that mentors such as business tycoon Anthony von Mandl have on his outlook on life. [30:00] "Learn to listen, as opportunity sometimes knocks very softly"... Jackson Brown [22:15] Claude's teaching philosophy and approach to golf learning, training and improvement. [36:30] We learn what a personal teaching experience with Claude would look like. To learn more about the impact Claude has made in 25+ years of teaching, check out the "Claude 4 Best Golf website (https://claude4bestgolf.com). https://files.fireside.fm/file/fireside-uploads/images/1/1ea879c1-a4a2-4e10-bea4-e5d8368a3c7a/DojEGg42.png (https://claude4bestgolf.com) You can also connect with Claude on his bio page (https://modgolf.fireside.fm/guests/claude-brousseau). ______________________________________________ If you love golf, we have exclusive deals on golf gear and services that we use and support! We launched The ModGolf Pro Shop (https://www.modgolfpodcast.com/) to offer you - our ModGolfers - 10-20% OFF exclusive discounts using promo code MODGOLF. We have curated a diverse selection of awesome brands like KINONA, deWiz Golf, ODIN Golf, Back2Basics Golf, Deuce and Project72Golf to help you play better and look great while doing it. CLICK TO SHOP AND SAVE (https://www.modgolfpodcast.com/). https://files.fireside.fm/file/fireside-uploads/images/1/1ea879c1-a4a2-4e10-bea4-e5d8368a3c7a/f3_ptfRp.jpg (https://www.modgolfpodcast.com/)

La grandeza inspira envidia. La envidia engendra rencor y el rencor produce mentiras. Debes saberlo para que no te pille por sorpresa y te afecte. Decía el cantautor estadounidense Jackson Brown, que la envidia es el homenaje que la mediocridad le rinde al talento. Si eres un referente si destacas y te va bien, las cosas te van a sacudir. No te lo tomes como algo personal, aunque casi siempre los ataques son personales. Es el precio que tienes que pagar por hacer bien tu trabajo. A las personas no les gusta que les recuerden sus carencias. Que dejen en evidencia sus limitaciones, casi siempre por falta de arrojo y pereza. Así que la mejor manera de disimular su realidad es hablar mal de los demás. Nunca entres en el juego. Es lo que más les molesta.Síguenos en Instagram: https://instagram.com/ladosisdiariaelpodcast Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

From Chasing Leads And Tailing Cheaters, This Artist Returned To His Musical Roots#donovanplant #newmusic #ep #davidbowie #thecars #jacksonbrowne  Former San Francisco private detective Donovan Plant spent nearly two decades chasing leads and tailing cheaters before returning to his musical roots in 2011. Since then, he has released two solo records, and now with the band he formed in 2018, DONOVAN PLANT & THE LEAFS are set to release their new 3-song EP NIGHT FEEL GOOD on June 23, 2023! Donovan Plant blends rock, country, and pop with lyrics inspired by the city. Citing influences such as David Bowie, The Cars, and Jackson Brown, Donovan's keen ear for hooks and melody is on full display with NIGHT FEEL GOOD, recorded inside the world-famous Hyde Street Studios at Dreamrack Studios by producer and engineer Trent Berry.Purchase/Stream: https://lnk.to/NightFeelGoodWebsite: https://www.donovanplantmusic.com/Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/donovanplant/Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/DonPlant/Bandsintown: https://www.bandsintown.com/a/1910965https://BreadandRoses.orgThanks for tuning in, please be sure to click that subscribe button and give this a thumbs up!!Email: thevibesbroadcast@gmail.comInstagram: https://www.instagram.com/listen_to_the_vibes_/Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/thevibesbroadcastnetworkLinktree: https://linktr.ee/the_vibes_broadcastTikTok: https://vm.tiktok.com/ZMeuTVRv2/Twitter: https://twitter.com/TheVibesBrdcstTruth: https://truthsocial.com/@KoyoteFor all our social media and other links, go to: Linktree: https://linktr.ee/the_vibes_broadcastPlease subscribe, like, and share!

For our twentieth episode, author Angela Jackson-Brown, the keynote speaker for the Carnegie Center's upcoming Books in Progress conference, discusses the importance of writing every day. "That doesn't mean sit down every day and write for three hours," she says. "But it does mean every day pick a time and write for 15 minutes. And then if you have another 15, write for another 15 minutes. But make the commitment that every day you're going to show up to the page. Because if you don't show up, the stories don't get told."Angela's writing prompt will help you get to know your characters before you sit down to write.About Angela Jackson-BrownAngela Jackson-Brown is an award-winning writer, poet and playwright who is an Associate Professor in the creative writing program at Indiana University in Bloomington. She also teaches in the graduate program at the Naslund-Mann Graduate School of Writing at Spalding University in Louisville, KY. She is the author of Drinking From a Bitter Cup, House Repairs, When Stars Rain Down and The Light Always Breaks. In October of 2023, Angela's next novel, Homeward, a follow-up to When Stars Rain Down, will be published by Harper Muse.

Aloha and welcome to the sobriety rocks podcast, I'm your host, Kirk Waterman. Today we talk about Finding Your Resting PlaceH. Jackson Brown, Jr. said, “Hope is not a resting place but a starting point - a cactus, not a cushion.”Yesterday's A.A. Daily Reflections talked about “A Resting Place”. When I was a kid, there was so much chaos, confusion, and anxiety in our home, that it was not the ‘resting place', that many of my peers' homes were. Luckily, I participated in so many activities, that I was able to find my ‘safe haven” in many places. From athletics, to academics, music, art, student government, social settings, and a wide variety of outdoor activities, I was able to escape, even if only temporarily.When the older kids in my neighborhood finally gave me alcohol and marijuana for the first time, it took away my fear almost immediately, and quickly became my go to source to escape. For years after that, alcohol and drugs provided me a temporary resting place, during even the most turbulent times.Then, one day, no matter what I did, I couldn't escape the agony and disappointment of my life, and the rooms of recovery opened before me. At first, I found a temporary resting place from the pain and misery I had been experiencing.But, once I got a taste of the immense relief other people were experiencing, I fully committed to recovery. Sure enough, as soon as I did, I began experiencing the same reprieve and found my safe haven.Throughout my years in recovery, the universe has continued to place immense challenges before me. Through them all, I've stayed in the middle of recovery, been completely taken care of, and had a safe resting place wherever I go. So, no matter what challenges you may be going through, no matter who may be causing them, or how bad they may be, know that there's relief and a resting place for you, right here in the rooms of recovery. Today we close with a brief guided meditation to help bring us more confidence. So please get comfortable, close your eyes, take a few slow, deep breaths, and join me.Find Treatment Centers Find Recovery Meetings Listen to Recovery Speakers Download Recovery Literature Access Free Recovery Resources Visit RecoveryHQ.com Visit Sober Surgeries Follow us: Instagram, Twitter, YouTube, Facebook Contact Us For Help Today!

Here in Episode 115 of the No Name Music Cast, it is Joy's turn to pick the topic and she chooses to talk about the music of Laurel Canyon!This area of Los Angeles has a rich music history with many famous residents over the years.We cover Mama Cass, Joni Mitchell and Jackson Brown to name only a few of the artists that have lived in that area of California.We also cover personal guitar picks, The Troubadour Club, Shania Twain and Spotify!https://www.facebook.com/NoNameMusicCast/

"Opportunity dances with those who are already on the dance floor!" ~ H. Jackson Brown

On this episode, we take a look at another listener's pick: Warren Zevon's eponymous second album. Produced by Jackson Browne and featuring  a who's who of the mid-70's “California Sound” (including members of the Eagles, J.D Souther, David Lindley, and Jackson Browne), the album is full of wry wit and dark humor. His lyrics may cover familiar ground, but he imbibes the subject with a self-depreciated sense of self awareness that strips a way much of the clichéd romance found in so many other artists work. And its all delivered in Zevon's unmistakable voice. This album includes some of his most iconic songs, such as "Hasten Down the Wind," "Poor, Poor Pitiful Me," and the often covered "Mohammed's Radio. " And finally, after almost 20 years after his passing, Zevon is in the running for induction into the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame. We here at This Is Vinyl Tap think it's long overdue. 

Steve chats with Grace M. Jackson-Brown, author of Promoting African American Writers, about her path to librarianship, her involvement with the African American Read-In program, why libraries should include programs promoting African American writers, teaching critical thinking skills through reading, and how writing the book was beneficial for her. Read the transcript! Grace M. Jackson-Brown is … Continue reading 236: Promoting African American Writers by Grace M. Jackson-Brown

Nashville-based country artist Charlie Berry takes you on an inside journey from addiction to recovery, as well as discusses the importance of self-love, being a morning person and more. From inspirations of Jackson Brown, Jimmy World and Blink 182, to stories of his own personal struggles and learnings, you'll gain a unique insight into Charlie's approach to music, life, and the power of connection. Tune in to his stories, songs and his incredible journey from rock bottom to a place of strength and self-love. You can find Charlie here: www.charlieberrymusic.com YouTube video of conversation: https://youtu.be/iIQUNzju0OA Check out the new website for the podcast and a place you can find the services I will be offering. I'm working on adding a services page to the site. There I will offer Podcast Production, Audio Book Narration, Voiceover, Video/Audio Editing, Episode Copy/Show Notes, Podcast Consulting, Mentoring, and Public Speaking. If you have a story that you think should be told. If you have been at the bottom and had nowhere to go but up. I want to hear your story. You can sign up right on my website either by signing up or you can leave me a voice message directly from my site. www.seandustin.com #NowhereToGoButUp, #AddictionRecovery, #RockBottom, #Connection, #Recovery, #Compassion, #addiction #countrymusic #nashville #podcast --- Send in a voice message: https://anchor.fm/no-where-to-go-but-up/message

Rita Wilson's film appearances include 'Sleepless in Seattle', 'That Thing You Do!' 'Runaway Bride' and 'It's Complicated'. She has produced a whole bunch of movies, including the smash hit 'My Big Fat Greek Wedding', 'The Mama Mia' movies and the new film “A man called Otto" starring her husband, Tom Hanks. Rita co-wrote the theme song for the movie, 'Til You're Home' the with David Hodges and co-sang it with Sebastian Yatra. She's also performed on Broadway and has appeared in a slew of great tv shows including 'The Good Wife' and 'Girls'. As a singer/songwriter, she has released five albums, most recently 'Now and Forever' an album of duets with a group of amazing artists, including Jackson Brown, Smokey Robinson Josh Groban and Willie Nelson.

Shepherds quake at the sight -- Christ the Savior is born.  Christ the Savior is born!  Merry Christmas to you all!  Today on Windy City Irish Radio we celebrate Christmas Day with music fro The Outside Track, The Makem and Spain Brothers, The Elders, Schythian, We Banjo 3, The Drowsy Lads, Colm Gavin with Charlie McGattigan, Goats Don't Shave, The Irish Rovers, The Chieftains & Jackson Brown, The Coronas and Scythian.  Join Mike and Tim for a Christmas Day celebration live streaming on globalirishradio.com or 750AM WNDZ.  

In this episode, I am joined by Steve Nider formerly of Silverfish Audio, which went on to become Sound Image, one of the largest sound companies in the world. After my last episode with Greg Price, I shared a photo he sent me, of a Pablo Cruiz show in 1978 with Silverfish Audio. The console at the time was a custom-built Ashly, with features like 4 band parametric EQ on every output, LED metering, and adjustable crossovers built into the desk. These features on a console were unheard of at the time. Ashly made very few consoles before realizing the economics of it were not great, so they shifted focus to dedicated outboard gear only. Silverfish Audio was one of the few companies to have these consoles. Based in Rochester, NY Nider was in the right place at the right time and kind of "fell into the business" at a young age. SivlerFish Audio also located in Rochester started in 1971 and moved to San Diego in 1978, during that time they had 3 touring systems for artists like Jimmy Buffet, Bonnie Raitt, Pablo Cruise, Jackson Brown, and more. Jump in now and hear Steve's journey in and out of the touring world along with some fun stories along the way.Check out www.howwegotloud.com for more details and other episodes Please check out and support The Roadie Clinic, Their mission is simple. "We exist to empower & heal roadies and their families by providing resources & services tailored to the struggles of the touring lifestyle."

“The best preparation for tomorrow is doing your best today.” -H. Jackson Brown, Jr. How can you prepare in advance for the distractions and disruptions that will inevitably confront you while building your writing habit? Join the author conversation in Ink Authors: https://www.facebook.com/groups/inkauthors/ Learn more about YDWH and catch up on old episodes: www.yourdailywritinghabit.com Learn more about me, “Christine Ink,” and how I support authors: https://christine-ink.com/ 5 Things To Know Before Hiring a Book Coach: https://christine-ink.com/book-coaching-2/

Interviewing Co-author- Michelle Jackson BrownMy Sister Helped Me Heal Vol. 4Host: Chavon Anettewww.chavonanette.com

 Plus, we'll hear from a Tiny Victories listener whose story about a bowtie brought tears to the studio.Things You Should Stop Worrying About This WeekLH UsingMacKenzie Scott shaming Jeff Bezos to give more of his money away too Giant Crypto crashZuck's empty MetaverseThis episode is sponsored by…Microdose GummiesMicrodose Gummies deliver perfect, entry-level doses of THC that help you feel just the right amount of good. To get free shipping & 30% off your first order, go to Microdose.com, and use code TINY Do YOU have a tiny victory to share? Call the Tiny Victories Hotline: (323) 285-1675We want folks to share their tiny victories on our hotline because, frankly, we'll assume we're just talking into the void every week and nothing matters. Prove us wrong. Did you finally do that thing you were putting off? Tiny victory! Reconnect with someone you haven't been in touch with for ages? Victory! We only ask that you try to keep messages to under a minute so we're able to play it on the show.If you prefer, you can record a tiny victory on your phone and then email us the audio. Email: TinyVictories@maximumfun.orgHOW TO @ USTwitter@GetTinyPod@LAGurwitch@ImLauraHouse@Swish (producer Laura Swisher)Instagram@GetTinyPod

This week, Julie Bogart is back to talk all about changing our minds in parenting and homeschooling.  Fall 2022 Season Sponsors   We are so grateful to our Fall 2022 Season Sponsors. Use the links below for their special offerings:   Blossom & Root and use code HSUnrefined15 for 15% off your purchase   Outschool and use code Unrefined for $20 off your first class    Night Zookeeper for a 7-day, risk-free trial, as well as 50% off an annual subscription  LTWs    Maren: Good Inside by Dr Becky Kennedy   Angela: Calm Aid   Connect with us!  Visit our website  Sign up for our newsletter and get our Top 100 Inclusive Book List We are listener supported! Support us on Patreon Follow us on Facebook, Instagram, Twitter and see video episodes now on Youtube Angela on Instagram: @unrefinedangela | Maren on Instagram: @unrefinedmaren and @alwayslearningwithmaren  Email us any questions or feedback at homeschoolunrefined@gmail.com   Complete Episode Transcript   [00:00:00] Angela: hi, we are Maren and Angela of Homeschool, Unrefined. Over the past 25 years, we've been friends, teachers, homeschool parents and podcasters. Together with our master's degrees and 20 years combined homeschooling. We are here to rethink homeschooling, learning, and education with an inclusive and authentic lens. [00:00:29] Maren: At Homeschool, Unrefined, we prioritize things like giving yourself credit, building strong connections, respectful parenting, interest led playing and learning, learning differences, mental health, self care, and listening to an EL elevating LGBTQ plus and bipo voices.  [00:00:48] Angela: We are here to encourage and support you. [00:00:50] Whether you are a new homeschooler, a veteran, you love curriculum, you're an unschooler. Whether all your kids are at home or all your kids are at school or somewhere in [00:01:00] between. Wherever you are in your journey, we're the voice in your head telling you, you're doing great, and so are your kids.  [00:01:07] Maren: This is episode 1 98, Changing Our Minds with Julie Bogart. [00:01:14] We had such a good conversation and we're so excited to share this with you, and then we are going to end like we always do with our l t Ws Loving this week.  [00:01:26] Angela: Before we get going, we did wanna let you know about our Patreon classes. We are starting a new series. on Thursday and it's our what We don't do series. Mm-hmm. , if you have been around a while, you probably have listened to one of our, What we don't do messages, we're turning them into a class and we're gonna talk about what we don't do as a, in a class format. [00:01:48] And that is gonna be Thur this Thursday at one o'clock central time. And if you are interested in that, you can join us on, on Patreon for our super squad. That's the $10 level. We [00:02:00] will have links in the show notes for you there, but we'd love to see you if you can't come live. You can get it recorded and video and audio. [00:02:07] We will be putting those out and then, The day or two after that.  [00:02:11] Maren: Absolutely. And you know, we are passionate  [00:02:13] Angela: about what we don't do. we are and spreading one of our favorite things. . It's important. It is. Mar and I both love new and innovative ways to make reading and writing fun. That's why we hope you've tried Night Zookeeper. [00:02:28] Is your child a reluctant writer? Do they struggle with. If the answer to either of these questions is yes, the Night Zookeeper may just be what you've been looking for. Night Zookeeper is an online learning program for children, ages six to 12 years old that uses a gamified and creative approach to help keep kids engaged and focused on developing awesome reading and writing skills, all while having fun at the same time. [00:02:51] Some of the features we love include the educational games, the personalized feedback on writing from Real tutors, the Super Safe Community pages where [00:03:00] children can work with each other and learn together. If night Zookeeper sounds like the perfect learning program for your child, you can try it for free by clicking on the link in the show notes. [00:03:09] When you register, you'll get a seven day risk free trial, as well as a huge 50% off annual subscription. That's a great deal if you ask. When it comes  [00:03:20] Maren: time to decide on whether or not to use a curriculum, we think you should check out Blossom and Root. Blossom and Root is a nature focused secular homeschool curriculum focusing, focusing on creativity, science, nature. [00:03:35] Literature and the arts. Blossom and Root has been gently encouraging in supporting homeschool families around the globe since 2016. Blossom and Root currently offers curricula for pre-K through fifth grade with new levels being added in the future. Additionally, a three volume inclusive US history curriculum told from a variety of viewpoints is [00:04:00] currently in development as of August, 2022. [00:04:03] Volume one is available for purchase and volume two is available on presale. All profits from this history curriculum. A River of voices will be used to support storytellers and artists from historically excluded communities. You can find samples, scope, and sequences and information about each of their levels online at www.blossomandroute.com. [00:04:29] You can also find them on, I.  [00:04:31] Angela: At Blossom and Root,  [00:04:33] Maren: Blossom and Root has created a special discount for our listeners. Use the code Hs. Unrefined 15 at checkout for 15% off your  [00:04:43] Angela: purchase. Over the years, our kids have taken many out school courses that they have loved. Have you given out school a try? We know that kids who love to learn don't just prepare for the future. [00:04:56] They create it. That's why Out School has [00:05:00] reimagined online learning to empower kids and teens to expand their creativity, wonder and knowledge. Empathetic, passionate teachers encourage learners ages three to 18 to explore their in. Connect with diverse peers from around the world and take an active role in leading their learning out. [00:05:16] School has created a world filled with endless possibilities for every schooling journey. Explore over 140,000 fun and flexible live online classes to find the right fit for your family. And join us as we set learning free. Sign up today at Out schooler.me/homeschool unrefined. And get up to $20 off your first class when you enroll with a code Unre.  [00:05:42] Maren: All right. We are so excited to introduce you. [00:05:46] If you don't know Julie Bogart Bogart yet, here she is. Julie Bogart is the creator and owner of Brave Writer, the online writing and language arts program for kids and teens. She's written two books, The [00:06:00] Brave Learner and Most Recently Raising Critical Thinkers, Julie Holy Supports Homeschool Parents Through Her Social Media Channels. [00:06:08] Her podcast, her books and her community. We have always absolutely loved talking to Julie and we're just so glad that she is back. Enjoy this conversation. [00:06:20] Thank you so much, Julie, for joining us again on our podcast. We've had you on a few times and we love having you every single  [00:06:27] Julie: time. Well, the feeling is mutual. Mar, I love being here.  [00:06:31] Maren: Thank you so much. Okay. So I really wanna talk about your book that actually came out quite a while ago, but you and I have both been so busy that we haven. [00:06:41] Able to make time to talk about it, but I'm so excited to talk about your book Raising Critical Thinkers. And we talked a little bit about it maybe on your podcast last time. Yes, yes, Yep. But I just, this was before, I think we read your book though. You were still writing it and we've now since read it and love it. [00:06:59] And I'm just [00:07:00] wondering what made you wanna write this book right  [00:07:03] Julie: now? Specif. Yeah, that's such a fun question for me to answer because you have to go all the way back to the 1990s to answer this question. Mm, okay. Yeah. It really started with the dawn of the internet . So in like 19 95, 96, when the worldwide web was crawling out into the space, homeschool parents in particular were. [00:07:25] We're like the first people to barge through those doors. We were so isolated. Yeah. , there were about 800, right? There were about 800 Absolutely. Thousand families who homeschooled back then in the United States today there's 3.2 million, so that's, That's amazing. A sizeable growth. And we did not have a means. [00:07:41] Of connecting except in local communities. Mm-hmm. . And so you can imagine the numbers were small. You know, you might, in your community have five or 10 people you know who homeschooled. Right. Some people had no one. So we all hopped online. Yep. In these couple of major sort of homeschool watering holes. [00:07:58] And to be fair to [00:08:00] the movement, the truth of the movement at that point is that it was. Yeah, we were white. Yep. Mostly conservative. Politically and religiously. Yep. And heterosexual and married. Right. So that was the demographic, like 98%, 99%. So I imagined we would get on these discussion boards and we would really like each other. [00:08:21] You know, I, I had been to park days. People are friendly, you know, occasionally they mention your child misbehaved, but nobody's getting into big fights about politics at a park day. Sure. And yet I get on these discussion boards and while there's plenty of friendliness, plenty of good advice. Mm-hmm. , there was also a shocking willingness. [00:08:43] Mm-hmm. to really go to battle. Mm-hmm. over things like oxy Clean, whether or not to breastfeed, Oh no. Whether or not you should potty train your child by age two. And that's the tip of the iceberg. When we got, When we got near [00:09:00] religious discussion, like doctrinal issues or theology, the gloves came off. [00:09:05] Wow. People  [00:09:06] Maren: get really brave, don't they, on  [00:09:07] Julie: those sites? Oh my gosh. And this is before we knew about trolls, so I jokingly say homeschoolers and bena trolling. We used to call it flaming, but it was really just a lot of fighting. And so here's the question that sort of grew inside me at that. . Why does everyone think they're right? [00:09:26] Mm. And why do they assume that all they have to do is state their belief and everyone will agree with it. So there was very little curiosity. It wasn't like, Wow, you're a five point Calvinist. I'm only a three point. I wonder why that is. . No, that is not what happened. It would be things like, you know, Julie, I just think you're wrong here. [00:09:46] The actual true theology is X. Mm-hmm. . And so for me, at the time when I was expecting sort of this homogeneous. Kumbaya experience. It was not that. And in fact, I was [00:10:00] so intrigued by this problem. I started my own discussion board. We called it at the time the Trap Door Society. And the reason it had that name Yeah. [00:10:10] Was that I felt like all these women were performing roles on a stage, you know, parent, wife, educator, spiritual or non-spiritual person, whatever you were. And we had no way of. To nurture the individual person that we were. So I wanted a trap door so we could go beneath the stage and like try on different costumes. [00:10:33] Imagine other points of view, read books that were for our pleasure, not for our children. That's amazing. Yeah. And it was, it was amazing. It was. So that was the.  [00:10:44] Maren: You created that safety. That's that's what it sounds like to me when you're talking about that trap door. That's a place of safety where you can try things on without getting completely reprimanded. [00:10:57] Well,  [00:10:57] Julie: that was the goal. Yeah. It did [00:11:00] not go that way. Oh,  [00:11:01] Maren: okay.  [00:11:01] Julie: So I started this community. Mm-hmm. . There was a lot of love. Mm-hmm. . Mm-hmm. . And there were some, I mean, phenomenal discussions that were life changing for me. I will say that right out of the gate, my parenting, my home education, my outlook on the world was shaped profoundly by that community. [00:11:17] But there was also some battles that literally took me out, like days of crying obsessing over responding, trying to craft the perfect words so no one would be mad and still, Oh, I feel that lacking anger. Early days of the internet. Mm-hmm. the early two thousands. And so that persistent experience of why does everyone think they're right? [00:11:43] Right. Stayed with me. And it got me curious about how we form our thoughts. Why we think, how we do, what we believe about other people who think differently. And I, I just got on this serious mission. I've been studying, thinking for over 20 years. I've been so [00:12:00] fascinated by it. I even went to grad school to try. [00:12:02] Understand how we all think so differently. So yeah, that's really what led me to it. So ironically, it came out during the Covid period, , which is a, an important time to think critically. Oh my gosh. It's almost like, you know, we hit the Zer of trolling and flaming and everything else.  [00:12:22] Maren: And it continues. And it continues. [00:12:24] Like for sure we need to, we need this skill. So what is your definition of critical thinking? Why do you think, Well, I mean, we already talked about why we think it's important, but if you have any other thoughts about that, but just what is it to you? What  [00:12:37] Julie: does it look like? Yeah. Critical thinking for me starts in an unusual place. [00:12:41] Like if you go into the education world and they talk about critical thinking, it's always about analyzing something over. , like a piece of literature, a scientific discovery, a mathematical problem. Yes. But I think critical thinking starts closer to home. [00:13:00] It's self-awareness. It's the capacity to notice your own bias as it kicks into gear, right? [00:13:06] To pay attention to what triggers you to be curious, for instance, about why you think you're right. Yes. And it's doing all that before we extend a similar. Attitude, I guess I would say. Yep. To someone else. So if I know that I have these inherent triggers, biases and proclivities, right? That's also true of the person I'm chatting with. [00:13:30] Mm-hmm. , the cuter. And my job is to at least get to a place of understanding how the jigsaw puzzle of their experiences, education, thoughts, socioeconomics, and identity created safety right for them through this. Because that's what our beliefs are. They are a safety protective shield that keeps who I am free of anyone harming me. [00:13:58] Maren: It sounds to me like you're [00:14:00] talking about self-awareness as being one huge key. Totally of critical thinking it is. And then being aware that this other person is also has this other set of aware, you know, self awareness and maybe not, may not be as aware about those is of those things. And then, oh, it's just the, a higher level thinking here. [00:14:21] You know, I just think when you get in those situations and the. The ability to understand yourself, understand this other person and how you work together, and how it, how it's okay that they're thinking differently and it's okay that I'm thinking differently and we can work together in this way. I mean, it's just. [00:14:38] This is what's so needed in our world today. Can you imagine if E the most powerful people in the world, can't even do this, Julie? No. No. Can you train them ?  [00:14:52] Julie: Well, the problem, the problem I really think comes down to the fact that. There are dangerous [00:15:00] thoughts. Mm-hmm. thought worlds that exist, but the criteria for danger varies community by community. [00:15:06] Mm-hmm. , person by person. So a lot of times when I've done these interviews, people have said, So you're really focused on critical thinking, leading to empathy. And my rejoinder is actually, no, this book isn't about empathy. You may gain some empathy. Sure. Come to a place where you look at your child, for instance, and have more insight into why they hold a view, and it creates a feeling of warmth or compassion towards your child. [00:15:31] Mm-hmm. . Mm-hmm. . But mostly it's about understanding because for instance, we love true crime, right? We're all listening to podcasts. We all do movies, and we are doing it because we are fascinated to understand. Why a person imagines that the best solution to a problem in their life is murder. We're not and and we want to understand it. [00:15:56] That's why we watch. Right. We don't just judge it. We're like, [00:16:00] Well, what factors led that person to thinking, I will have a more beautiful life if I off this other person. What we end up feeling at the end is horror, not empathy. Right. Right. It actually engages our deep morality. We. Wow, these factors are problematic. [00:16:19] This person saw the world in a way that is so different than mine. And then it leads us to ask what I think is a very important question, What is it about that person's perspective that we haven't accounted for? Mm-hmm. in the public square. Yep. So if we think about someone like, you know, just to go for the extreme Hitler and go for it. [00:16:40] Yep. Right. What we have, were an entire population. Of German Christian, middle class churchgoing people. Mm-hmm. becoming persuaded that the solution to their economic crisis was genocide. Yeah. And the question we [00:17:00] have to ask ourself is how did that happen? How did that happen? Yep. Because they were persuaded. [00:17:08] There was a structure and a belief system that they were able to inc. That made them think they were on the moral high ground. And so for me, critical thinking is all of that. It's not just empathy, it's accounting for those factors that may possibly lead us into very immoral and scary thought worlds. [00:17:31] But we do it from a place of. Actual desire for a better world. Right. We're not doing it because we're inherently evil. We're doing it because we think life will be better for us and our people.  [00:17:43] Maren: Right, Right, right. And that's why we need to think critically about our history. That's right. So that we can change it. [00:17:50] does not repeat itself. True. Yep. So true. One of our favorite chapters in your book is probably the last chapter, The Courage to Change Your [00:18:00] Mind. We love this idea. We talk about it a lot as parents. So just sitting with that for a minute, changing your mind. Why do you think that changing your mind is important? [00:18:10] Julie: Well, first of all, the capacity to change your mind shows a certain agility in your own ability to process information. So psychological research shows that psychological flexibility is a key component to a healthy ego. Mm-hmm. and healthy relationships. So if we are hardened or rigid, we actually start to eliminate the capacity to relate to a variety of people, right? [00:18:39] Then what we do is we start shrinking the group until we're in a very small corner of the world, well defended against all the attackers. We become victims, right? Of our own ideology. Mm-hmm. . So the courage to change your mind says, I'm actually related to all of humanity. There isn't [00:19:00] the in group, in the out group. [00:19:01] I'm here to hear experiences, data, research, information that is not like the kind I have and understand how it's shaped these people that I am connected to simply by being a human being. I don't think we think that way very often, but one thing I have not, Is that parents are the most likely to change their spiritual, political, social value beliefs when a child. [00:19:32] Tax them. So you have a child? Oh yes. That's me. Example. Right? Totally, totally. All that story, because I think it's so powerful. Well, there are,  [00:19:40] Maren: there are actually, I mean, there's a lot of things I can't even share right now until my kids are grow, grown up. Yes. Until they've given me permission. But I mean, definitely politically, spiritually so many things. [00:19:51] I actually, I wrote down a few things, things that I've changed my mind on as a parent recently, probably hair color. Tattoos [00:20:00] piercings. Not that I'm letting my kids pierce their or get tattoos, but , like, I've changed my mind on it because just talking about it ha has created this big rift and I'm like, I, Why am I so against the, I mean, why am I so I against this? [00:20:18] I do not know. I honestly don't know anymore . So I had to rethink that. Food choices, TV and movie choices, clothing. What body parts can be shown and not shown. You know, these are things and ultimately school choice. Yes, school education choices. Because, you know, if it were up to me, we'd probably, you know, be doing something very different school-wise right now. [00:20:41] And I'm listening to my kids and they're telling me what they need and I'm like, Wait a second. I you. For a while I was like, No kids, we're doing school this way. This is what I see as the best way . And they're like, Mom, listen to us. We're telling you what we need right now. And I'm, and I had to really [00:21:00] go inside myself and evaluate like, why am I, why are my ideals the boss of. [00:21:08] Their education right now, it's their lives ultimately. And I can, That's right. Yeah. So I can make, Obviously I wanna make safe and good, you know, good choices for them. But there are lots of safe and good choices. I  [00:21:22] Julie: think so. No, that is so beautifully expressed. Mm-hmm. . Because part of what happens is we've already lived through those ages. [00:21:31] We were teenagers and young adults. We have regrets, choices we made that we think, Wow, that was a bad decision. Or I wish my mother had stopped me from doing X. Right. And so we come in with this perspective that somehow we can protect our children from right. Regret, mistakes, getting in car accidents, whatever it is. [00:21:49] Mm-hmm. . And yet it is those very experiences that formed and shaped us into the adults we are today. Right. And when we don't give our children the [00:22:00] agency over their choices to some extent, obviously you have some, some room there, but to some extent, Then they feel the need to react that much harder. Yes. [00:22:11] Because they are testing, not you, but the world outside of your home to find out, am I qualified to be admitted as an adult? Yes. And if they don't have the opportunity to make some of those calls and fail. They will not discover what resources they need. I, I did a podcast interview recently with a mom who was raised in the obedience model as a child. [00:22:36] Mm-hmm. . Mm-hmm. . And she told me she got to young adulthood and thought, But how can I know if I'm making a good decision, where's the authority that's gonna tell me I'm doing the thing? Yep. And so our kids need the, the right. I remember Johanna, she had red. She decided to die purple and the culture, not me. [00:22:57] I was like, That's fine. Yeah. Yeah. , the culture told her, [00:23:00] if you're a redhead, you're not allowed to dye your hair because your hair is too beautiful. You're not allowed to get rid of red hair. Yeah. Yeah. And I remember supporting her and saying, You know, it's your hair. Pick a color. So she went in to get it dye, and even the hair stylist was like, Are you sure? [00:23:18] Yeah. And so the hair stylist refused to bleach the hair. She's like, We'll just put purple on top of it. And it came out black. Okay. No. So she didn't end up with her purple hair. She had red hair and black hair, and then she decided to go full goth to support the black hair, you know, early two thousands, [00:23:36] And I look back on that and I think what an interesting moment for her. Yeah. To assert a desire and have the whole culture oppose her and to keep fighting for it anyway. Like this is what we want. How will they build their self confide? If they never have a chance to encounter opposition, to stand up for what they want, [00:24:00] to find out if it matches what their hopes and dreams were. [00:24:03] They need some of those chances, don't they?  [00:24:05] Maren: They absolutely do, and I think our traditional educational system is teaching our kids to obey, yes, meet the standards, do the thing, and perform and not really think critically about themselves. They, it might be thinking critically. One small topic here, one small topic here, but it's not this all-encompassing critical thinker that, that we're raising, you know, in our education system. [00:24:32] And it's, it's tough because then they go to co, they go to college and, and you know, they might not. Go find the resources they need to do well in college because they haven't been taught to be proactive about those things or to figure out what they need or even to find their passion to find the thing they love to do in the world because they've just learned to go through the hoops. [00:24:53] Go through the hoops, do it, get a job, make  [00:24:56] Julie: money, , a hundred percent. In fact, when I taught at Xavier [00:25:00] University, one of the most glar. and obvious lacks in the incoming freshman was a sense of agency about their own thoughts. Mm, mm-hmm. . So they came in having been trained to write essays and how to even do research online or use the, you know, the library correctly. [00:25:18] Mm-hmm. . Mm-hmm. . But they were always trying to find out, but what did I really wanna hear from them? Yeah. What was the angle I hope they would take? And so we. All kinds of writing activities and writing on the board and small group sharing because my goal, Was to hear something genuine from each student. [00:25:35] I needed to hear how did this idea land for you? And if the idea hasn't landed for you yet, I don't wanna hear from you. Like, don't just turn in an essay. Yes. And so part of the training in high school, especially if you've got homeschoolers in this audience, but even in regular high school mm-hmm. . To give agency to a child's voice, and one of the few ways they can feel [00:26:00] they have a voice is opposing your voice. [00:26:03] So even though you think to yourself, This is a dangerous idea, , I want you to step back and think how cool that they felt that they could take the risk to tell me this crazy idea that I would never want them to believe. Because what they're saying to you is, I'm entertaining. The thought world that counters the moral center of this family. [00:26:27] Maren: Yes. I love that. And actually, that's one of the things I was just gonna ask you about, Julie, because I just watched one of your. Instagram reels about encouraging parents to argue with their kids. [00:26:36] So this, I think this is a great example of  [00:26:40] Julie: encouraging critical thinking. Oh, it totally is. And I wanna give credit to one of my staff members because this morning I was having this meeting with Ramona and Ramona said, Julie, one of my kids is in your brave writer movie class on dystopian movies, and she. [00:26:56] The dystopian genre . And I told her, [00:27:00] Take that class cuz it's gonna have your best writing. Yeah. And so she's in there just hating these movies. They're watching them as a family and having huge arguments about them. And I was like, That totally reminds me of when my kids' dad and my kids argued about Nacho Libre for two long, Oh my gosh. [00:27:18] In the middle of summer, on our back deck after a barbecue, just dissecting the characterizations, arguing over whether or not this was a good movie. And so I think we sometimes forget that kids, they love that idea of being an. They love the feeling of being able to take an adult model of something and then shred it. [00:27:38] My son, Jake, totally, as a great example, he today, just to give kind of context, he's a human rights lawyer who works for the in Central Africa Republic.  [00:27:47] Maren: Wow. So you need to be a critical thinker for, for that job.  [00:27:49] Julie: Oh heavens yes. Went to Columbia Law School. Right. So he, he knows how to think, but I remember in junior or in, when he was a junior in high school, he watched this one movie, Some of [00:28:00] your, your listeners could even look it up. [00:28:01] It's called Zeitgeist. It was a thing in the mid two thousands. Okay. It's basically a massive critique of capitalism and it really does promote sort of a communist worldview and you know, eradicating the monetary system, et cetera. And I remember he came to my ex-husband when we were married, my husband and I at the time, And he's like, Mom, this is how the world needs to be. [00:28:23] But we watched it and his dad was saying to me, Oh no, Jacob's gonna end up in this horrible ti world of weird conspiracy theorists with the Illuminati, you know? Oh, totally. And I said, You know what, Actually, John, this is amazing. Not only is he watching it, he's telling us he's watching it, and he is critiquing the system that feels. [00:28:47] Air, like water. Like he didn't know this was a system Yeah. To critique until he heard there was a critique. Like you can criticize money. What, what a thought. Right. He had never known Right. [00:29:00] To do that. Yeah. And so we just leaned in. We just asked more questions, watched the movie, agreed with what we could raise questions about what seemed inconsistent, but we didn't like attack it. [00:29:10] It was more like, Is that working anywhere in the world? You know, like ask kinds of questions. And he evolved through it. He didn't stay there. Of course, yes. It was like a starting place for critique.  [00:29:22] Maren: I think we have to remember that our kids aren't, aren't going to stay in their thoughts for the rest of their lives. [00:29:28] They are, their, their brains continue to develop and it's really the practice of critical thinking. It's the practice of learning. It's the, the, the practice of curiosity and synthesizing and having conversations and growing. That's what they take. To the next level of their lives. A thousand percent. Yeah. [00:29:49] They don't take this one topic and just, you know, think this is life  [00:29:55] Julie: for the rest of their lives. Well, it's easy to do that experiment with yourself. Yes. How [00:30:00] many of your really hard one positions that you took at age 15 or 18 are still identical with how you think about the world today?  [00:30:09] Maren: I'm so glad they're. [00:30:10] No,  [00:30:11] Julie: No no. And in fact, how many I, I ask this in conferences all the time. So if I have a room of a hundred people, I say, How many of you hold the same exact beliefs as your parents in the areas of sex, politics, education, parenting, and food and exercise? And out of a hundred people, only 10 raise their hand. [00:30:31] Wow. So what you need to know is that same ratio is gonna be true in your family. There might be one kid who. Agrees or aligns with you generally, but there are gonna be a whole bunch who don't, and that doesn't mean you can't have a relationship with them. And it doesn't mean they've abandoned their morals. [00:30:49] It means they're thinking deeply.  [00:30:52] Maren: That is so, so, so true. And I I just think what a skill. What a skill to learn and to not have to be [00:31:00] perfect at when you're 15 or 18 or even probably 21 . I mean, this is gonna take a while. This is not a perfection. This is not something that's gonna get perfected. [00:31:09] Early on and it, it, it might not ever, I mean, this is, yeah, this is a process. I was just thinking today, you know, I , you know, made a few mistakes. I'm 46, so,  [00:31:19] Julie: Yeah. I mean, yeah, I'm, I'm 60. I, I've changed my mind countless times and if, and you will continue to, will continue to, and also you can't anticipate what will become an. [00:31:32] So none of us knew what a pandemic was. None of us knew how to respond to a pandemic. We were all jumping into our communities to tell us, these people are trustworthy. These people are not. This information's reliable, this information is not. Yeah. And we were using our blind loyalty to community to guide us because none of us has the expertise to evaluate. [00:31:57] Pandemics epidemics, vaccines, [00:32:00] public health economics, that are the result of this, you know, guidelines for how you run a company. All of that was suddenly up for grabs. Yeah. And when that happens, we stop thinking critically. We actually jump in with both feet to our safest communities. And what I've had to train myself to do, and this is something I write about in the book, Is notice that, Yes. [00:32:25] So when I'm scrolling through Facebook and some high school person I haven't talked to in 35 years, post an article and I think, Oh my gosh, that is the dumbest article I've ever seen. When I feel that smugness come up, yes, I know. I'm not critically thinking, Yeah, I am self protecting in that moment, critical thinking at that moment is, Oh, this is from someone I don't typically trust. [00:32:48] This is a person I haven't thought about in 30 years. Right. I don't really know what she's like anymore. She thought this was worth posting on Facebook. That's interesting. Mm-hmm. . I wonder what that says about her. I wonder if I've ever read this [00:33:00] article with this writer through the lens of this other person. [00:33:03] What, what might there be to learn? In reading it. Now, to be honest, I can't do that a lot. I, it takes so much energy to do that. But to keep myself honest, I try to do it fairly regularly. I try to give myself access to viewpoints that make me cringe. Mm-hmm. and I don't do it to deconstruct them. Yes, I do it to understand them. [00:33:29] Maren: That is so good. And it's also alternatively, when we, I think read, read articles or listen to something that is from somebody we normally do agree with. Like we, I think we also also have to think critically like, Yep, do I agree with this? Or what part of it is, Do I do I think is, you know, real or you know, is there part, are there parts I. [00:33:49] Push back on a little bit or something. So I think it's so good to do both. Absolutely.  [00:33:54] Julie: Great point, Miller. Yeah.  [00:33:56] Maren: Yeah. Okay. So I wanna go back to some of your work, Julie, because I [00:34:00] know Ev, everything you've always put out there, you've always encouraged us to make it our own. And I think you've, from the beginning, have encouraged us all to think critically. [00:34:09] You've inspired. Us all to do poetry, tea, time, , and I'm not kidding you. I have my oldest reads poetry by herself now all the time, and I, I attribute it all to poetry, tea time. I really do. So that you so much, but I know that you also encourage everyone to make. Their own special thing. So what is, What do you think is the key to those magical learning moments like poetry, tea time, or something else that we  [00:34:41] Julie: have come up with? [00:34:43] I think when we're talking about learning, what we're actually talking about is a meaningful connection or relationship. To what is being learned. And so just to deconstruct poetry tee time for a moment. Yeah. I knew that adults hated poetry , [00:35:00] and for some reason my whole life I've loved it. I think because I'm innately a writer, and so any manipulation of language has been interesting to me. [00:35:08] My mother also gave me a a rummy card game that was all. So when I was young, I knew all the names of poets, which then later made me wanna read their poems. My father, my grandfather, gave me a poetry book that was a, I'll read to you if you read to me book. So I would share it with my brother or a friend who came over, or my mother, and we'd read poems to each other cuz of the nature of this book. [00:35:30] Awesome. So my early childhood was really warm towards poetry and then song lyrics became my obsession. Bruce Springsteen, Jackson Brown, Tom Petty, they all write such great storytelling and such great lyrics. So as I was raising kids, I was disturbed to discover that adults didn't like poetry. Oh. And I was so afraid that would happen to my children. [00:35:53] And I was on this email list back in the day in the nineties, and somebody shared that she was teaching geography to [00:36:00] her kids, but they didn't like geography. So she started making tea and cookies for when they studied geography. Yes. And suddenly they all liked geography. And I was. Well, I can do that. [00:36:11] We, I drink tea every day. Exactly. And so I created this whole British tea time and added poetry to it. And so I think really what we're saying is when something seems opaque or difficult, we want to tie it to something that automatically creates a sense of warmth and pleasure and openness. So I wish someone had done that for me with. [00:36:34] That that did not happen with Math , but with my kids, because it never happened to me with math. Mm-hmm. , I put so much more energy into manipulatives and games and cards and dices. That's so great. Yes. And even though my kids would all say, and they will say this openly, that math was not my strong suit. [00:36:54] What is ironic is all five of them have been very [00:37:00] successful in math and they, they came out, two of them are programmers and three of them did calculus and I mean, that's amazing. You did that. Good job, Julia. I take credit, it doesn't matter what they think. No, but honestly, the early years to me are what were the foundation for that. [00:37:18] And then I hired tutors and they did take some math at school. But my point is, I think what you're asking. How do we create the meaningful sense of connection that makes me warm and open this something that feels intimidating. And for me, that would be a great criteria for creating magic in learning. [00:37:37] Maren: That sounds amazing. I mean, I, I could think about that in every scenario. Like, what is gonna cause this to be a warm. Cozy or warm and safe  [00:37:48] Julie: environment. Yes, and and stimulating enough to be interested, right? So, right. You might make tea and cookies to go with math, but if your child's already resistant or sees no purpose in it, they'll eat the [00:38:00] cookies, drink the tea, and still hate math. [00:38:02] Part of what made poetry special is that poetry's easy. You just read it out loud and everybody finds pleasure. But for something that's more of a struggle, I think part of what we wanna do is admit that it's going to be challenging. Provide a lot of support, create as many real life connections as possible, and then do it in small doses so that we don't create a toxic relationship where we're dreading and it feels tiring and I don't wanna do it. [00:38:31] Maren: I love that. Yep. So, so, so true. Okay, so another thing that we, both Angela and I both love about your book. So many other things that you've created is just the activities, but this specific, this book specifically just has so many practical ideas. And a whole book can be intimidating, honestly. Yes. [00:38:50] Sometimes, you know, but if, if you sprinkled out in, you know, throughout the book so many activities that if we. Just pick a few of those activities. I [00:39:00] mean, it would, it could change our home school and I just love that you did that. Did you, did you know you wanted to share practical activities Yes. And ideas when you wrote the  [00:39:10] Julie: book? [00:39:10] Because I just feel that way about everything. Right? Like, I just feel like. We spend so much time reading nonfiction books for information and ideas, but the practical implementation is where transformation occurs. Yeah, Yeah. And for me, a lot of these practices are things that sort of, I stumbled on with my own kids because I was obsessed with thinking. [00:39:32] Yes, I was obsessed with it. So, you know, in that very first chapter where I'm talking about viewpoint and says who, and you know, are we hearing the fairy tale from the Wolf's point of view or the narrator's point of view, or the protagonist point of view? Yes. The reason that I am obsessed with that is that that is the foundation of all critical thinking. [00:39:52] Whose viewpoint Yes. Am I listening to? And what is the criteria by which they create that viewpoint? Mm-hmm. . So we can start that [00:40:00] at age. Totally. Yeah, of course. We would watch these Disney movies and we would analyze the characters to death. Why do we love Ursula? Even though she's the bad character? What is it about her that's compelling? [00:40:13] Why is she more interesting than the good characters? And why would Disney do that? Right? And then you just get into this conversation. What is her sob story? Do we believe it? Does she have some justification for being this angry? Ooh, that's so great. These are great questions. And honestly, they sort of forecast what they'll be encountering in college when they're analyzing. [00:40:35] Absolutely. Lenin versus you know Decart. .  [00:40:39] Maren: I was just gonna say, because it's really easy at five and. To any age, but especially at five or younger where there's this dichotomy, like you said, bad and good things aren't bad and good, and it's, it's really easy to push that thought through, you know, And it's, that can be very scary. [00:40:59] And to [00:41:00] understand that the bad. The bad guys or bad people in movies may have some underlying things going on. What a great discussion and deep thinking for a five year  [00:41:13] Julie: old that Yeah, and you know, they're, they can do that. They're dealing with siblings. Right. How much bullying happens in a family? [00:41:19] Just an absolute ton. Mm-hmm. . Yep. And so if we are only ever treating people in binaries as bad and good, we can easily harden our own families into the good kids, the not good kids. We start scapegoating a child for being disruptive or picking at each other or being loud, and we start treating that child differently because we see them not through a. [00:41:42] Prism of factors, but only through this lens of obedient or cooperative or, you know, creating pleasure for the adult at ease. Right. Versus the child who's taxing and hard. Right? Totally. Yes. And so that's another reason we do this. We want siblings in particular to see a [00:42:00] 360 degree picture of this child. [00:42:02] They have to share a table with, watch a movie, with share a computer, with go on vacations with Right  [00:42:09] Maren: or parents too. Their view of their. Good parent, bad parent, right? Yeah. And it's easy to just say that  [00:42:14] Julie: you're the bad parent.  [00:42:16] Maren: Yeah. You make me do these things. And there's a lot around that too, that they can, they can think criti critically about, which is awesome. [00:42:23] So if there's one thing parents could implement today right now in regards to raising a critical thinker. What do  [00:42:30] Julie: you think that would be? Oh, I love this question. So I'm gonna give you a little story by way of example. This is a practice that you can try. So a lot of people think critical thinking is like opinions about social issues and politics, but that that is just one feature. [00:42:46] Critical thinking is literally every decision you make all day. Mm-hmm. . Mm-hmm. , Which, you know, which way is the fastest to get downtown without traffic is a critical thinking decision. Absolutely. What to eat for. Do I dessert? First, critical [00:43:00] thinking decisions. What we want to do is invite our children to make more of those judgment calls using their own research and data, rather than usurping that role for them. [00:43:13] So I'll give you a a very clear example. Imagine you have an eight year old, it's time for dinner. Mm-hmm. , you say to that child, Hey honey, it's time to wash your hands. It's time for. And this child who has cooperated with this, you know, command for a year sure. Suddenly says, Yeah, I'm not going to, I don't want to [00:43:30] Most parents have one of two ways they respond. There's the authoritarian model which says you have to cuz I said so, right? Mm-hmm. . So you don't really, you could even give a reason, but mostly you're just like, Dude, I'm the mom. You're not. Go wash your hands. The second way is what I call the manipulative obedience model. [00:43:49] What most periods today call cooperation. And what they do instead of requiring obedience is they manipulate it. So what they say is, Oh honey, you must wash your hands. [00:44:00] They're these things called germs and they live on your fingers. And when you touch the food and then eat it, it will go in your body and make you sick. [00:44:06] This is what science tell tells us. Therefore, you must wash your hands right now. In that second model are very proud of that model. Yes. , they're always like, Oh, I would never ask them to do something. I don't explain , but basically what they're doing is they're giving a bunch of information the child doesn't care about. [00:44:25] Nope. And then requiring the child to accept that as better information then the personal experience they're having right now, which is, I don't wanna wash my hands. Exactly. So what I recommend is this. You can't do this every day. Some days you gotta throw 'em in a car seat without an argument and strap 'em in and go. [00:44:41] Mm. But once in a while, go down the rabbit hole. So when your child says, I don't wanna wash my hands, you say, Oh, well that's interesting. Tell me more about that. Why? Why don't you wanna wash your hands? I don't know. I just don't wanna, Is it the temperature of the water? Let me get a thermometer. [00:45:00] Let's measure the temperature, see which temperature is most comfortable for you. [00:45:03] Ooh, I love that. So you start doing that and the child's like, I still hate it. Oh, okay. So it's not the temperature. Is it the wetness? Yeah. I hate how it feels on my hands. Should we try hand sanitizer or it dries faster? Oh no, that's sticky. Well, that's interesting. So here's where I am. I have this belief about germs, but you don't like washing your hands. [00:45:26] I wonder if there's any other information out there about germs and hands. Mm-hmm. . So you do a little research together online, show 'em, and maybe you discover that heat kills germs. And so you say to your child, How would you feel about not washing your hands? And we just blow dry them with a hot blow dryer, , and the child's like that sounds good. [00:45:43] And so you do that or the child still doesn't want to because here's what might be underlying it, your belief in germ. Is actually not a belief. It's propaganda. You've accepted and here's how I know. Didn't your child just eat Cheerios off the [00:46:00] floor without washing their hands? Right? Didn't you at Target watch the baby, spit out the pacifier? [00:46:05] It landed on the floor of Target, you picked it up, sucked the germs off , and then put that pacifier in your baby's mouth. Do you actually believe in germs or you just doing the parental propaganda program where you pass on information, right? Designed to coerce my child. So what I recommend at that point, Either one of these accommodations. [00:46:27] Okay? We're gonna measure the temperature you like it at, You know, 72. We're always gonna wait till it's that temperature or hand sanitizer, or the blow dryer. Or maybe you just roll the dice. You say, You know what? You're right. I don't even know if I believe my own rhetoric. Should we find out if you get sick? [00:46:44] Are you willing for that to be a possible outcome of this? Let's try it for a week. See what happens. Sure. And then see what happens. Right? Right. Give your child meaningful opportunities to collect data, to ask better questions, [00:47:00] to evaluate their experience. To roll the dice and see what the outcome of their hypothesis is. [00:47:07] Now at the start of covid, could you have done this? No. Right, Because we were terrified and we had information our kids didn't have. So at that point, going online, showing them the germs, explaining how people are in the hospital, giving them a meaningful understanding of why you have this level of fear is a great idea, right? [00:47:26] But on the day to day, That's really not what's animating you. Right? And so I think that's where we have to do a better job of interrogating our own positions and our kids give us a chance to do that.  [00:47:38] Maren: Right. And we have to be also, I think careful about imposing our own expectations on their critical thinking. [00:47:46] That's right. Because a five year old may not, even after all that information and all the testing and all the, everything you've done, they might. Yeah. I still don't wanna wash my hands . Right? Because they're not ready for that critical thinking at in that [00:48:00] moment. That's right at for that thing. And that's just where they're at. [00:48:02] You can't force their brain to develop anymore than where they're at right  [00:48:06] Julie: now. No. And that's where, like Dr. Becky Gooden side, Dr. Becky was, is so right on. I'm reading that book right now. Oh, oh, so good. So good. So when. , ask a child to cooperate with your better judgment. Mm-hmm. , you are spending capital in that relationship. [00:48:26] Maren: You are spending capital. Absolutely.  [00:48:28] Julie: And so that's why we want to make some of these demands fewer, you know, we want minimal demands. Yes. And then we want to explore when we can. A child's opposition because maybe it's just that the child was really engaged in a movie and dinner happened and they don't wanna take the time to wash their hands. [00:48:47] Exactly. And dinner delayed. Can we pause the movie? There could be factors here that have nothing to do with critical thinking about hand washing and just convenience that you are tempted to  [00:48:59] Maren: overlook. [00:49:00] Absolutely. And it it, like you said, it also requires us to do our own critical thinking. That's right. [00:49:05] On washing hands or. Eating at 6:00 PM Why does that have to happen, ? That's right. You know there's so many things we can think critically of, and we can be an example of critical thinking. And while our kids might not be like, Oh, mom, you're such a great critical thinker today, , I'm going to follow your example. [00:49:27] The, the consistent, critical thinking every day is going to pay. Them, You know, witnessing that every day and seeing how you are transforming and learning from your own critical thinking. You, our kids can't really help but do that because  [00:49:46] Julie: that's their example. In fact, I have a great story about this. [00:49:51] My son, Jacob, that I mentioned before, when he was in high school, he got very interested in this one social issue that was on the ballot. I'm not gonna name which one it [00:50:00] was just to keep everyone neutral. Mm-hmm. . And so he came to me and he is like, Mom, I can't vote yet, but I did all this research and I wanted to tell you why I think you should vote pro. [00:50:09] So he went through almost a PowerPoint level presentation. He had data and research in his computer was open. Yeah, it was really ad. He was like 16 and it was really good. And at the end I was like, Jake, that makes a lot of sense. I totally get where you're coming from. Thank you for sharing all that with me. [00:50:26] He says, So are you gonna vote pro? I said, No, I'm still voting Con. Yeah. And his eyes squirted tears. And he said, Mom, I count on you to be logical . And I said, Wow. Well, I appreciate you saying that, and I don't wanna discount what you just shared with me, but you, what you shared with me didn't account for all of my concerns. [00:50:51] It accounted for a lot of concerns you have. It didn't account for mine. But don't worry about that because this is my. And I don't have to agree [00:51:00] with you to appreciate the strength of your argument. And I think over time your side's gonna win. But I haven't personally been persuaded yet. Yep. And it was a very difficult moment for him. [00:51:12] Fast forward, you know, he's 30 and I'm older, and interestingly enough, We have just the best conversations. He ended up being the research validator for this book. I let him look. Wow. I paid him to do it. He went through and made sure that my arguments were actually built from solid foundations of evidence and, you know, make sure I wasn't quoting some spurious researcher who mm-hmm. [00:51:38] who happened to find their way onto a webpage I didn't vet. And so just to show. He saw me as a logical person, first of all. Mm-hmm. . Mm-hmm. , which I think is a beautiful credit. Secondly, we had to learn to live with the tension of disagreement, even when we were both being logical. Yep. And then third, we've built a relationship over time that makes it possible for both of us to [00:52:00] respect our capacity to do research and find answers. [00:52:03] And I think if there's anything I would want for parents, that's what it is. It's not agreement, it's not a. It's this dialogical respect for each person's capacity to show up with their own viewpoint while respecting the other person.  [00:52:20] Maren: It's beautifully said. Julie. Thank you so much, and I think that's a perfect place to stop for today, even though I could talk to you for another hour as usual. [00:52:29] But I just appreciate your insight and your encouragement that, you know, we've always, I've always relied on your encouragement through my whole parenting and homeschool journey, so I just thank you  [00:52:41] Julie: so much. Well, you do a great job both on this podcast and with your family, and so I. That you are continuing to put out such good information to your people as you  [00:52:52] Maren: as well. [00:52:52] All right. Take care.  [00:52:54] Julie: Thank you. Bye.  [00:52:56] Angela: All right. Let's move on to our lt [00:53:00] Ws. Yes. Marron. What are you loving this week? Okay. I am  [00:53:03] Maren: loving a book that I actually happen to talk with Julie about Very Oh, very shortly. I mean, we just like, I think Julie just kind of mentioned it in our conversation. You may have. I picked up on it, but I'm actually reading it right now. [00:53:18] And so it was fun to hear Julie mention it. And it's called Good Inside A Guide to Becoming the Parent You want to Be. And it's by Becky Kennedy, Dr. Becky . And it is just a  [00:53:32] Angela: great it is  [00:53:34] Maren: confirming. All of the, all of the healthy things we want to do in our parenting. [00:53:42] And I wanna say homeschooling too. Yeah. I think this is a great book for homeschoolers. It's just a great book. So I just, I, I can't say enough good things about Dr. Becky. She's my new favorite. . Yeah. I feel like she says things first. I was gonna say Angela, she says things that we. [00:54:00] Yeah, I was first gonna say maybe better. [00:54:03] Mm-hmm. , But actually I'm giving ourselves credit, Angela, and I'm gonna just gonna say, she says it in it with a twist, you know, that's, Yeah. On with her specialty, you know, as a doctor for, And I think we have this twist as a specialty, you know, as parents and educators and you know, we  [00:54:17] Angela: have, but we're, we're really share, We  [00:54:20] Maren: really share so much of the same message. [00:54:22] Yes.  [00:54:23] Angela: And so Good. I'm loving. Yeah. You know, people need to hear things in different ways and from different people and I, so I fully support like different people, books and podcast and whatever. Yeah. But she I have not read her book, but I do want to mm-hmm. because what I've really liked about her is you know, she doesn't profess to. [00:54:45] Always do it right, . Exactly. Yep. And she describes that in the book too for sure. Yes. Like she's just coming from a place of like, Look, I'm in the trenches with you too. Like, I get it. Yeah. Things are triggering, things are hard. And [00:55:00] so she's really Supportive in that way. It feels like it feels reachable. [00:55:04] It feels attainable. Yes.  [00:55:06] Maren: And it is good to hear from, you know, a, a, a doctor, a psychologist, you know, who really understands the brain and how it just very intricately.  [00:55:16] Angela: Yes. And so it is, it's, it's science  [00:55:18] Maren: that this is really good parenting and, and it's effective and it's just healthy. Mm-hmm. , it's just healthy for. [00:55:26] Physically, mentally, emotionally,  [00:55:27] Angela: it's all healthy. . Yeah. And her premises, it's called Good Inside because Good inside. Yeah. Because we are all good inside. Yep. Kids too. We're all like wanting to do our Yes. Do good and do our best, so. Yep. Yeah, so I love that. I love that. Yes. Thank you for  [00:55:42] Maren: sharing that. [00:55:43] Yes, of course. I'm, I'm excited for you to read it. I know you will,  [00:55:46] Angela: and it'll be fun. I'll probably listen, Are you listening? I'm listening. Yeah. Yeah. Does she read? Yes. Okay. Yeah, that'll be what I'll do. All right, Angela, what do you loving this week? I am loving something that I think I may have talked to you about in private, [00:56:00] but now I would like the whole world to know about it. [00:56:01] Yes. It's called Calm aid. Oh, yes. And this is a natural supplement for anxiety, overwhelming stress. And you can get it on Amazon and you can get it cheaply. So we have subscribed and saved to it. . That is  [00:56:16] Maren: amazing. You know, it's a, you know, it's a winner. You know, we need it. Subscribe and saved . Yes.  [00:56:21] Angela: And the reason why I like it is because I was. [00:56:25] You know I've been on medication for anxiety and depression. Some of my kids have been on things at different times. Mm-hmm. . Mm-hmm. for different things. And so we have a psychiatrist that we talk to. Yeah. And the psychiatrist was telling me that this calm aid is over the counter, right? Mm-hmm. [00:56:42] it's an over the counter thing, but. In many countries, like European countries, she said it's their first line of defense. For something like anxiety or depression before you, they try other medications. Wow. And so this is just their first go [00:57:00] to. It's real. It's a real, It really works. Yeah. All it is is lavender. [00:57:04] It's lavender. It's a lavender pill. That's all that's in. It is lavender. It's concentrated. It's concentrated. Right. Small capsule that is easy to swallow. Okay. That's what I would need. Yep. Right. So it's in a small, easy to swallow capsule. It's just lavender so you can feel good knowing mm-hmm. , that that's all you're taking. [00:57:22] Yeah. But it really does help. Like I have been taking it every morning. And on the days that I take it, I can tell that I feel much calmer, much less stressed. On the package it says you should take it twice a day. So I think if you were you know, really wanting to be more serious, you could take it twice a day if you were unsure about trying medication. [00:57:42] This could be a good place to start. If you were unsure for one of your kids, this could, this could be a good place to start for one of them too. I just think we more people need to know about it because I had, I had never heard about it until the psychiatrist recommended it, and I just think like, and it gets all these great reviews, so I just think, why [00:58:00] don't, maybe more people already knew about it and I just didn't. [00:58:02] Yeah, right. But. It has really been helpful for me and some of my kids. I was gonna say maybe  [00:58:08] Maren: it's everybody in Europe who's, who's given it all those high stars. I mean, that's, that's amazing.  [00:58:13] Angela: Yeah. So, Well, I'm  [00:58:16] Maren: so glad that you, have you found something for, you know, for Totally. There's so many of, I mean, there are so many of us I think that who could use. [00:58:23] Something like that without a prescription would be  [00:58:25] Angela: great. Mm-hmm. so great. So thank you. And it's just, it's a first, It's, I know it's hard to try medication if you haven't. It is before, it's a hard first step. And so like this, this is something you could try before that if you Yeah,  [00:58:37] Maren: yeah. Mm-hmm. . Mm-hmm. .  [00:58:39] We wanna thank our three sponsors, Blossom and Root Out School and Night Zookeeper. Be sure to check out their links in our  [00:58:49] Angela: show. This podcast is created and hosted by Angela Se and Marrin Gors. [00:58:55] We are listeners supported to get extra content and the Back to School Summit free with your [00:59:00] membership. Go to patreon.com/homeschool on refined. Subscribe to our newsletter and get our free top 100 inclusive booklist@homeschoolonfi.com slash newsletter. You can find Marron on Instagram at unrefined marron and at Always Learning with Marron, and you can find Angela. [00:59:18] Unrefined. Angela

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Kelly Brakenhoff is an author of six books and an ASL interpreter from Nebraska. She has served as an interpreter for deaf and hard of hearing persons now for over 30 years. You can tell how much she likes her chosen professions by listening to her as you get to do in this episode.   Kelly is especially excited by a series of books she has started involving Duke the Deaf Dog where she introduces readers to ASL, American Sign Language. She is working to help readers, especially children, better understand the deaf and hard of hearing community. On top of everything Kelly has done, she has used the crowdfunding program, Kickstarter, to help fund her newest book. It turns out that another famous author also used this program to fund their efforts. You get to hear all about it.   I very much hope you enjoy our episode this time and that you will give us a 5 rating. Thanks for listening.   About the Guest:   Kelly Brakenhoff is an author of six books and an ASL interpreter from Nebraska, US. She divides her writing energy between two series: cozy mysteries set on a college campus, and picture books featuring Duke the Deaf Dog.  Parents, kids, and teachers love the children's books because they teach American Sign Language using fun stories. And if you like a smart female sleuth, want to learn more about Deaf culture, or have ever lived in a place where livestock outnumber people, you'll enjoy the Cassandra Sato Mystery series.   Social media links:   kellybrakenhoff.com and follow her social media or blog by using this link: https://kellybrakenhoff.com/quicklinks/   About the Host: Michael Hingson is a New York Times best-selling author, international lecturer, and Chief Vision Officer for accessiBe. Michael, blind since birth, survived the 9/11 attacks with the help of his guide dog Roselle. This story is the subject of his best-selling book, Thunder Dog.   Michael gives over 100 presentations around the world each year speaking to influential groups such as Exxon Mobile, AT&T, Federal Express, Scripps College, Rutgers University, Children's Hospital, and the American Red Cross just to name a few. He is an Ambassador for the National Braille Literacy Campaign for the National Federation of the Blind and also serves as Ambassador for the American Humane Association's 2012 Hero Dog Awards.   https://michaelhingson.com https://www.facebook.com/michael.hingson.author.speaker/ https://twitter.com/mhingson https://www.youtube.com/user/mhingson https://www.linkedin.com/in/michaelhingson/   accessiBe Links https://accessibe.com/ https://www.youtube.com/c/accessiBe https://www.linkedin.com/company/accessibe/mycompany/ https://www.facebook.com/accessibe/       Thanks for listening! Thanks so much for listening to our podcast! If you enjoyed this episode and think that others could benefit from listening, please share it using the social media buttons on this page. Do you have some feedback or questions about this episode? Leave a comment in the section below!   Subscribe to the podcast If you would like to get automatic updates of new podcast episodes, you can subscribe to the podcast on Apple Podcasts or Stitcher. You can also subscribe in your favorite podcast app.   Leave us an Apple Podcasts review Ratings and reviews from our listeners are extremely valuable to us and greatly appreciated. They help our podcast rank higher on Apple Podcasts, which exposes our show to more awesome listeners like you. If you have a minute, please leave an honest review on Apple Podcasts.     Transcription Notes* Michael Hingson  00:00 Access Cast and accessiBe Initiative presents Unstoppable Mindset. The podcast where inclusion, diversity and the unexpected meet. Hi, I'm Michael Hingson, Chief Vision Officer for accessiBe and the author of the number one New York Times bestselling book, Thunder dog, the story of a blind man, his guide dog and the triumph of trust. Thanks for joining me on my podcast as we explore our own blinding fears of inclusion unacceptance and our resistance to change. We will discover the idea that no matter the situation, or the people we encounter, our own fears, and prejudices often are our strongest barriers to moving forward. The unstoppable mindset podcast is sponsored by accessiBe, that's a c c e s s i  capital B e. Visit www.accessibe.com to learn how you can make your website accessible for persons with disabilities. And to help make the internet fully inclusive by the year 2025. Glad you dropped by we're happy to meet you and to have you here with us.   Michael Hingson  01:21 Hi, and here we are once again with unstoppable mindset, the podcast where inclusion, diversity and the unexpected me. And the unexpected, as always, is the fun part of the podcast. We love to carry on different kinds of conversations with people learn about them. And you know what I'm going to say once again, for any of you listening out there, I'd love to have conversations with you. I'll bet you have stories that we should talk about. So definitely reach out. Michael hingson.com/podcast or Michaelhi@accessibie.com. And I'd love to chat with you. But for now, we have Kelly Brakenhoff, who is here with us. She is an author, and ASL interpreter, and a Kickstarter campaign runner par excellence. But does that elevate you are what Kelly Welcome to unstoppable mindset. How are you?   Kelly Brakenhoff  02:18 Hi, I'm great. Thank you for having me. today. I'm really excited to be talking to you.   Michael Hingson  02:24 Well, I'm really excited to have a chance to chat with you and learn all about you and and learn why you're unstoppable. When I started this podcast, because we think that everyone has a story to tell, we all have had challenges in our lives and, and we've overcome them. And it doesn't need to be a huge challenge. But still a challenge is a challenge. And when we overcome it, that's great. And when we recognize that we did something that we didn't think we can do, then I think we fall into this concept of being able to move toward a mindset of unstop ability. And so we started unstoppable mindset, and we have a lot of fun with it. Well, why don't we start with your story a little bit? Why don't you tell us about you kind of growing up or anything about that that you think we ought to know?   Kelly Brakenhoff  03:12 Well, sure. Um, yeah, I'm a fan of your, your mindset, your your podcast, I think this is just the coolest thing. So like I said, just super excited to be here today. Um, I've been an ASL interpreter for more than 30 years, and an author for just over three years. So although I'm a veteran interpreter, I'm still a baby author and publisher. I learned new things every day. So I guess you can teach an old dog new tricks. I guess. I've moved around. One thing that's interesting about me as I've moved around quite a bit. I grew up in Connecticut. I've lived in Nebraska, Boston, Hawaii, Seattle. And then now we've been in Nebraska for quite a while since Austin. Last Boston, Boston. Yes.   Michael Hingson  04:01 So can you say it pack your car and have a yard? Of course.   Kelly Brakenhoff  04:07 My uncle is from South Boston and so he married my aunt who's from upstate New York and listening to the to talk was so fun. I lived with them for a summer in college. And and I just had such is such a fun time, especially if they like had a little discussion or something you know, and they they get the voices raised and they'd start going in their accent they revert.   Michael Hingson  04:35 I lived in Winthrop, Massachusetts for three years and spent some time in the in the Boston area before then and back a little bit but I love the accent but I love Massachusetts. I love New England in general. And my wife and I have a story about Mr. Connecticut. We were going there for something and And I don't even remember what it was. And we were we were traveling the right way but we were traveling a lot further than we thought we needed to to get to Mystic So ever since I've been saying that one of the things about mystic is it moves around and doesn't stay in one place. So I'm sticking   Kelly Brakenhoff  05:17 to memory of mystic is going there on probably a sixth grade field trip. And you know afterwards, the field trip they take you through the gift shop and I bought a little pewter whale. Yeah, sure. I still have it somewhere in the bookcase somewhere in my house.   Michael Hingson  05:39 We stopped at a restaurant there. The second time we went to mystic and I'm still convinced it wasn't in the same place. It was the first time we went to a restaurant and sat right along the river and watch the drawbridge coming up, which was   Kelly Brakenhoff  05:55 that is really fun. Yeah,   Michael Hingson  05:57 definitely. Yeah. We love New England. And I hope that we get a chance to go back there. I have all sorts of stories about Boston. We went I went a lot over to Daniel hall into Quincy Market and ADA Durgan. Park. Have you ever eaten there?   Kelly Brakenhoff  06:13 I have it in there. Yes, I love Faneuil Hall.   Michael Hingson  06:16 I don't know whether Durgin Park is still open. I've heard it. I've heard that it is. But I'll have to tell you. Well, I'll tell you the story about Durgan Park. It's a Durgin Park, for those who don't know, is a restaurant that if it's still there, serves food family style, and they have tables along the side. That will seat for people. But you have to have four people, if you want to sit at one of those tables. If you have three, you sit at the long tables in the middle. If you have too long tables in the middle. They're very snotty about it. In fact, waitresses and waiters are hired to be snots. It's all an act, but they're supposed to be absolutely obnoxious. They're just what some people would say the typical clothes New England style of of being, if you will, but anyway, we go into the restaurant one night, and it was me and two other people and my guide dog Holland, who is a golden retriever with the most luscious eyes in the world. And the hostess said, you know, I'm just going to let you guys sit at one of the tables for four. So she seats us and the waitress comes over. And she says what are you people doing here? You can't sit at this table. And I said, well, the host has put it put us here. No, she didn't you just snuck in here. You can't sit at this table. And she yelled at us. And we said no. We got to sit be seated here because we have a guide dog under the table. No, you don't I don't believe that. You're not going to fool me with that. You can't sit here and she just went on. Then she goes away. And she comes back and she said you can't sit here I said, look under the table. Finally she looks. There's these eyes just staring back at her. And she just melts. And the next thing we know she goes away. One of the things about Durgin Park is that they serve a when they serve prime rib. It's a huge piece of prime rib that takes the whole plate. She comes back with this plate. She said somebody didn't eat much of their prime rib. Can I give it to the dog? And oh, it was great. But it's just fun memories of all over Boston. So I'm glad you had a chance to be there. Well, enough about me in that. So you've lived all over?   Kelly Brakenhoff  08:29 We have we've moved a lot and you haven't moved a lot recently. But when when I was younger, I moved quite a bit.   Michael Hingson  08:35 Yes. What caused you to be moving around. Um, we   Kelly Brakenhoff  08:39 grew up in Connecticut. And then in high school, my parents decided my mom's from Nebraska so and my dad's from upstate New York. So when I was in high school, we moved our family moved to Nebraska. And then when my husband and I first got married, he worked for a construction company who moved us to Hawaii for five years that works. That worked. That was a great honeymoon, We'd only been married six weeks. And so that was that was a five year honeymoon. That was awesome. Our first couple of kids were born there. And we decided that we after a year or so they really didn't get to see their grandparents very often. So he decided to move back to the mainland and we made a stop first in Seattle and then we came back to Nebraska. So we've been in here for quite a while but I really enjoyed getting to experience all the different cultures and all the different places and I also have a very soft spot in my heart for New England to   Michael Hingson  09:35 Well, it's great to live in various parts of the US shows what a wonderful and just incredible country we are with all sorts of different cultures that can really blend and meld together to form what we get to experience if we only keep the culture going as as really we are the melting pot and that just makes it so Great when we get to see that,   Kelly Brakenhoff  10:01 I totally agree i Yeah.   Michael Hingson  10:04 So how old are your kids now?   Kelly Brakenhoff  10:07 They are grown up. We have four kids, three boys and one girl. And so the oldest is 21 going to be 29. And our youngest just graduated from college last year. So he's 22 in Nebraska, and Nebraska. Huskers everybody's a Husker.   Michael Hingson  10:28 Go Huskers Go Big Red. Yep.   Kelly Brakenhoff  10:31 So um, but we have four grandkids too. So that's a lot of fun. And we're really lucky. They all live in town, so I get to see them quite a bit.   Michael Hingson  10:38 That works. So you see you fix it up. So you now have this this Braden half ghetto, if you will,   Kelly Brakenhoff  10:45 yes, my Twitter handle is actually in Brockville. Because one of my friends quite a while ago used to tease me that I was trying to create my own village. So we call it in Brock anvil.   Michael Hingson  10:59 There you go, that works. Nothing wrong with that. Well, so I know you're an author. And I know that you are an ASL interpreter, and so on, tell me how you got into being involved with ASL. And a little bit more about all that.   Kelly Brakenhoff  11:16 Sure. Um, I in high school, I volunteered at a camp for deaf kids. My parents wanted me to do something in the summer and stay out of trouble. So they kind of sent me to go volunteer. And at this camp. In the end, I didn't know any sign language. So I got a book. And I started trying to figure out a few signs before I first went to this camp. Of course, the first few weeks I was there, I had no idea what anyone was saying, because they were all using sign language. And I didn't know it. But by the end of the summer, I had learned quite a bit and I had made some really good friends. And I just kept learning during the school year, when they went when they were all gone. I kept taking classes and reading more books. And it actually turned out to be my, the language that I took when I was in college, it counted as my foreign language. And I just kept learning and hanging around with Deaf people. And eventually, my mentors in ASL, the deaf people that I was friends with, invited me to try interpreting for them. And I didn't, if I had known, I wasn't very good, but they were very kind. And they they asked me to interpret so I did and it just ended up kind of something I fell into. It wasn't something I intended to do. But it's become my whole life's work, and I really like it.   Michael Hingson  12:40 So is that kind of a full time job? Or are your vocation then?   Kelly Brakenhoff  12:43 Yeah, I would say it, it's my Well, it's hard to say what's my vocation because I also really love being an author, even though I haven't been published until recently. But I've been a writer my whole life in college, I actually majored in English. And I always wanted to be a writer, it just, I guess the interpreting thing just kind of was a very long detour. But I always wrote even when I was interpreting and so in raising my family and stuff, so once my kids started getting into high school and college, and I started looking around for something to fill some of my empty hours. That was when I really got serious about finishing my first book.   Michael Hingson  13:27 Well, from from an ASL standpoint, and interpreting it certainly is something that's, that's a little bit different. What have you learned about deafness and disabilities and so on from being involved in all of that,   Kelly Brakenhoff  13:41 oh, my goodness, we don't have enough there's not enough time in the day to talk about it's just changed my whole mindset, like, like, you've talked about that. I think it's just a way of looking at the world. Like a lot of people think that people who are deaf and hard of hearing, it's about your ears being broken, but it's really just a different way to move through life. So instead of a hearing world do like they have a visual world, so everything is visual. So it's like the opposite of what you experience now. So it's, it's just a way of moving through the world, you know that. And so instead of being like broken and something that needs to be fixed, it's just kind of a way of life. I guess. I just have a lot of respect. I've worked a lot in at the University of Nebraska. So I work with a lot of college students. And I've over the years done just Gosh, 20 Something different majors. I sit in on all the classes. I interpret what the teachers seen at the front of the class, and the discussions that the students do. And so I've gotten to learn a lot of things just by osmosis over the years and I have a really deep respect for the students because you know, their classmates sitting in the same room with them, they can listen to the lecture, write notes, you know, go online and do stuff all while this is all going on, whereas the deaf student has to sit there and watch me. If they want to take their own notes, they kind of have to look down and take their own notes, but then still keep an eye on me. And then if there's a PowerPoint, they're trying to watch that. And if there's a video, they're hoping that it has good captions, and so like, there's so many things going on, that it's amazing that they can get as much as they do out of the classes. And then of course, they have to study so much more afterwards, because a lot of times, they have to go back over the notes or back over the reading to see what they missed, because they were just, you know, a lot of their attention during the class is on me. So it's just given me a really healthy respect for how intelligent and how hard workers the students are. And I've just kind of seen that in all walks of life. I've interpreted for a lot of different situations, and different businesses and all kinds of things. And I just, I'm always in awe of how, how hard workers, the deaf students and just deaf adults in their job, or   Michael Hingson  16:13 how did the students then really get the job of notetaking done? Do they oftentimes have people who take notes for them? Or are they successful enough at taking notes themselves,   Kelly Brakenhoff  16:26 it really depends on the student and their preference. You know how some people don't mind having someone else take the notes, because then they can pay more attention to the interpreter and the PowerPoint and the teacher. But then other people maybe don't, you know, when you take notes, we could listen to the same speaker and your notes would be different than mine. And so some students don't really trust that another student is going to write down the same things that they would have written down if they were taking their own notes. So it really is a personal preference. But luckily, now, with the technology, I have a couple of students who, so they're deaf, and they use ASL and they use interpreters, but they also use cart, which is the captioning service. And so they'll have a laptop, or they also use like an otter, which is an app that the teacher wears a microphone and then it, it makes a transcript of everything that the teacher has said, and then they can save it. So I have a few students who even though they're, you know, pretty much dependent on the sign language for comprehension, they still use the transcript, because then they can go back later and like highlight the parts that they thought were important. And then it's kind of I think more in their control. Or if sometimes, like an English word has, you know, five different signs for it. And so if I do a sign, and they want to know what the exact English word was, they can look at the transcript and see oh, okay, that's the word that, you know, I need to remember or that's the word that I want to know. So I think it's great that they have all these tools. Because, gosh, back in the day, when I first started, none of that existed. And a lot of times, they would just have someone else take notes for them. And if that person wasn't a good note taker, they were kind of out of luck.   Michael Hingson  18:25 We use otter actually to do the transcribing of all of these podcasts. So that one unstoppable mindset is published. There's a written transcription as well. So we use otter to do that. And oftentimes, I will use otter to transcribe a meeting, or make it possible, make it possible for for people to come into the podcast, and listen and watch if you will in real time, which makes a lot of sense. So I found that otter works really well.   Kelly Brakenhoff  19:00 Yeah, I've tried several different apps and different services, because I have a thing to like you, I really want to make my website as accessible as possible, and my appearances as accessible as possible. So I get transcripts made of all the podcasts that I do whether the provider does or not. And so I've tried several different services, and I do agree that I think otter is a it produces a good product, and the price is good, too. So   Michael Hingson  19:33 I certainly right, you're right, the price is certainly right. But also, it does a good job and it's improving over time. Some people have said they're better systems than otter and I haven't really tried other services. And the people who help with the podcasts have looked at various things and we all end up settling on otter it really works well.   Kelly Brakenhoff  19:54 That's good to know. That's good to know, because a couple of years ago I tested several and I haven't read rechecked back into it. And the last six months, it's great. I think the one of the good benefits of the pandemic has been, how everyday people have realized that speech to text. And other, just things that we used to think of as being accessible for people with disabilities are now helpful for like everyone. And people have just come to realize that with all the Zoom meetings, and all of the the work from home solutions, so things that used to be just in the realm of special are now every day and they're all getting better, because we all demand that they get better. So the AI captions and everything are so much better than they were even just a few years ago.   Michael Hingson  20:47 Well, and then look at that you bring a very good point to light, which is that oftentimes, there are things that we use, that when other people start to use them first of all makes them much, much more affordable. But also, that will cause them to improve a lot more than otherwise they would have look at Dragon Naturally Speaking that started out as Dragon Dictate and did okay. And now Dragon is a lot better. I don't think that it transcribes as well as otter does in terms of plugging in punctuations, and so on. But I'm not surprised or wouldn't be surprised if that improves over time. But when you look at what otter does, it's pretty incredible.   Kelly Brakenhoff  21:31 It is it really is. And the What's incredible to me is the the short amount of time that it's gotten better. So I think that's great. But like you said, I think I guess it's sad to me that it takes it took a pandemic for enough people to use the tools that we've all been using for years to you know, demand a higher quality and a lower price. But I guess you know, if that's one good thing that comes out of all this, and that's great.   Michael Hingson  22:02 I think we tend to just get locked in to doing things one way and we, for whatever reason tend to be very slow at looking at other options. And you're right, the pandemic has made a significant difference and look at how many people are using zoom as opposed to pre pandemic, yet, Zoom has been there. The other thing that we've noticed along the way with Zoom is that they have deliberately and absolutely focused on accessibility and inclusion. So when a person who is blind encounters a problem with zoom in something is working right. There is a process to report that and we find that very quickly, it gets resolved, because they have a whole team working on issues to make sure that Zoom continues to be very inclusive.   Kelly Brakenhoff  22:55 Yes, I agree. Because I think when we first started with Zoom, the there was no, the only way you could have captions was hiring a person to do the captions. And then once they started making them automatic and everything that that was huge. That was that was huge. That's I'm glad to hear that they have a team doing it. And I agree, their improvements have have been amazing.   Michael Hingson  23:23 I don't want to put zoom on the spot, but have you compared otter with, if you compare it to otter with the zoom, automatic closed captioning,   Kelly Brakenhoff  23:31 um, I have, I guess if I just stop and think about it, I think they're pretty similar. What's actually kind of funny is when I will do a large meeting on Zoom, where I'm one of the interpreters. So I'm one of the little heads in the Brady Bunch group of people on Zoom. So I'll interpret for some of the deaf people in the meeting. And what I'll do sometimes is I'll turn on the captions because, you know, occasionally I might have a hard time hearing someone talking, or I might miss something or whatever. And so I can look at the captions and see if you know try to correct myself or, you know, check my accuracy. And yeah, so I have seen some pretty bad interpretations on our transcript on on Zoom and on otter, where things just don't come out. Right. It's, it's definitely for people who speak like standard slow American English once you have any kind of an accent or any kind of, if you speak too quickly, then the captions pretty much everywhere are a lot harder to understand. But they like I said, I still think they've gotten a lot better, which   Michael Hingson  24:48 I only asked that just out of curiosity because I know that the service is there to do automatic transcription or captioning. And I've never, never asked anyone exactly how well it does, except I've heard that it does a good job, but I've never compared it to like otter or something. And I bought otter for teens. And the reason I did that is so that it is now set up and integrated with Zoom. So it automatically starts when I opened a Zoom meeting. And what I do usually is unless there's a need to I will stop it. But it automatically starts when I come into a meeting that I that I initiate, and that's great, because then I don't even have to think about it. And it's a an effort of volition if I want to stop it.   Kelly Brakenhoff  25:42 Oh, yeah, that's great. I didn't realize you can set it up that way. That's awesome.   Michael Hingson  25:45 Yeah, the otter for teams. Home, I think, unless the price has changed, it was like $240 a year. And if you're a nonprofit, or whatever, it's half that. So it's not even a lot of money to do it, which is what's great.   Kelly Brakenhoff  26:00 That is That's awesome. Well, thank you. So the more users that use things, then the cheaper the price for everyone. And I think that's what we're seeing now with a lot of these tools.   Michael Hingson  26:12 It is ironic that we have to go through something like a pandemic to see things become more available, and for people to start to see that maybe some of the tools that say a person who is blind or low vision, or a person who is deaf or hard of hearing uses might very well be relevant for the rest of us. I'm still amazed that in driving with people using cell phones, we don't find more automatic use of the verbal technology voiceover for Apple and talkback on an Android, I'm surprised that we don't see more use of those verbal systems. In the driving experience, there's no reason not to do that, and do more to keep people's eyes on the road. Unfortunately, we're going the other way, we're getting more driving experiences with touchscreens, which means somebody's got to watch the screen, or look down and then quickly look back at the road. Why should that even have to happen today? Because we have such good voice technology. And we can also have good voice input technology to go along with it.   Kelly Brakenhoff  27:21 That's an excellent point. That's, that's so true. Yes, there's definitely you know, all the fancy touchscreens. But when I got my latest car, I had to sit in the driveway with the owner's manual for an hour just to figure out how to reprogram the clock. So you definitely don't want to be doing any of that while you're on the road. Well,   Michael Hingson  27:42 if you and I, I love Tesla's and I think that the technology is great, it is demonstrating the state of the art technology that's out there. But it's all controlled by a touchscreen, which means a blind passenger, I can't even do what a passenger would do to tune the radio or turn on a podcast or turn on whatever the services are available, much less anything else, because it's all touchscreen. And there's no reason for that today, we should be able to keep people's eyes more on the road. Even if you have the Tesla copilot function, which can take over a good part of the driving experience. It's not an autonomous vehicle software, but it can help with the driving experience. People should be keeping their eyes on the road not watching a touchscreen. And I'm still amazed that we're not seeing more people recognize the value of audio input and output.   Kelly Brakenhoff  28:36 I did not realize that I wrote in my first Tesla just a few months ago, and it was really neat, but I didn't I guess I just assumed that they had voice input things. I mean, wow, that's that's really shocking. as fancy as that whole system is that is very surprising. Well, let me let me rephrase that Ilan and say, hey,   Michael Hingson  28:59 well, let me rephrase it a little bit. There is availability of voice input for some things, but it's not an automatic process. So you have to invoke it, then you have to do something, I think to make it work every time you want to use it. What I'm saying is, it should be as much a part of the driving experience as anything else. And I'm saying it should be more part of the driving experience than using a touchscreen, it should be automatic. And we don't do that. We're too young to eyesight and we think that eyesight is the only game in town. Just like I'm sure that people who are deaf and hard of hearing would say that most people think that hearing is the only game in town. And in the in reality is neither is true. Exactly. I've said for years that I've said for years that people with disability, well, people who have eyesight, have their own disability and that is their light dependent. They can't do things without light Thomas Edison as the Americans with Disabilities Back would define it developed a reasonable accommodation for light dependent people when he created the light bulb. Let's get real, and I and I don't have the stitches. Lee it's true. You know, it's it's unfortunate that people are so locked into doing things one way that they're missing opportunities to make driving safer. But there you go.   Kelly Brakenhoff  30:22 I love that. I love that idea. I love that idea. I think that should be used to make that a thing as a political movement. I love that.   Michael Hingson  30:31 Yeah, well, we got to get Elon to go along with it.   Kelly Brakenhoff  30:34 Well, you know, he's kind of busy with Twitter right now. So maybe that all wrapped up, then he can he can focus his brain power on this?   Michael Hingson  30:43 Well, once he gets it set up, and if he's gonna do Twitter, then we'll start doing tweets. Oh, there you go. There you go. What a world we live in right now. So you said that you've done a lot of writing, you've been very much involved in writing, since college and so on. Why do you like writing so much?   Kelly Brakenhoff  31:07 Honestly, I don't know. I think it's just how I think how I process things. It's communication, talking to people talking to people like you. That's just kind of how I think it's just, just what I do is is who I am. That's a pretty simple answer.   Michael Hingson  31:26 We'll put Hey, it works. It works. So you said you just pretty recently got involved in starting to actually write books?   Kelly Brakenhoff  31:36 Yeah, I think it was 2014. I joined NaNoWriMo for the first time, which for people who haven't heard of that, it stands for National Novel Writing Month, and it's in November, where, gosh, by this day, by last year, I think it was around 750,000 people around the world, try to write 16 167 words a day for 30 days, and you come up with a 50,000 word manuscript by the end of the month. And that was signing up for that challenge was because I'm kind of competitive. So if I sign up for a challenge like that, I'm gonna do it. So that was like the thing that broke the barrier for me of just having ideas and just wanting to write and whatever and actually finishing a manuscript for the first time. That's what kind of gave me that push to actually do it.   Michael Hingson  32:33 So what did you publish your own books? Are they published through a publisher or what?   Kelly Brakenhoff  32:38 Yes, they are. They're self published, I tried for about a year to publish my firt, or to find an agent and all of that for my first one. And then at the same time, I was also checking into self publishing. And I don't know I think just a lot of factors kind of all converged. And I just decided at the end that self publishing was was the way to go. I'm kind of a control freak. And I like to, I like to have the my input into how to make you know, I hire my whole team. So I have an editor and a cover designer and and proofreaders and all of that stuff. And I get to decide what the finished product ends up to be. And it turns out that, yeah, I'm kind of bossy I guess.   Michael Hingson  33:23 You have a publicist who helps with the PR, and all that. I do.   Kelly Brakenhoff  33:27 I do. It's a it's called creative edge is the one that I use. And, and they've really, I've really enjoyed being part of that group.   Michael Hingson  33:37 I met Mickey a couple of months ago, actually, for the first time, he was introduced to me by someone else that we interviewed on the unstoppable mindset podcast. And she said, you know, he works with a lot of authors who might very well have interesting stories for you. And so that's how we met him. And we've actually started working with him as well. We're just getting started. But having written thunder dog, which was, and we're blessed by the fact that it was a number one New York Times bestseller, and then was published by Thomas Nelson part of HarperCollins. Now, but then we self published our second book, which was called running with Roselle, which was kind of more for youth, but more adults by it than then kids do. And it's the story of me growing up and Rozelle growing up. And then how we met after she became a guide dog in training, and she became my guide dog, and you know, kind of went from there, but I love writing, but I haven't done that much of it. We are starting to work on a third book, and that'll be a lot of fun. And we just got a book contract for that as well. So that's pretty exciting.   Kelly Brakenhoff  34:46 That's great. Congratulations. I didn't know that. That's awesome.   Michael Hingson  34:51 But But I'm curious. You've written I guess basically what two different kinds of books children's books and mysteries. How do you do mystery How do you come up with a plot? And how do you? Do you make it all come together? Because I think mystery writing has to be if you do it well, it has to be a real challenge to come up with a not only a plot, but create all of the scenes, do all the things that you need to do. And essentially, keep the solution hidden until the end of the book unless there's some value in presenting that earlier. And it's really how you get there.   Kelly Brakenhoff  35:30 Yeah, that's a funny question. Because I definitely write in extremes. I mean, I write 70,000, word mysteries, and then I write 500, word picture books for the children's books. So very different, very different approaches. But yeah, the mysteries and thrillers are kind of the things that I have always read my whole life. So I thought when I wanted to do that first NaNoWriMo challenge, I decided to kind of mash up all of my experiences. Like I said, I've lived in Hawaii and Nebraska, the East Coast, Seattle. So I kind of took all of those different elements working at a college and I put them all together into this murder mystery. And I got about two thirds of the way through and realized exactly what you said that writing a mystery is hard. It's actually one of I think, the most difficult genres to do because exactly for the reason you said, you want to make that mystery puzzle complicated enough that it can't be solved too early. Mystery readers are very smart people. And so it's very challenging coming up with enough suspects and clues to keep people guessing until the end. I guess I just love a challenge. I think it's it's fun, but it's also just what I love to read and write. So a read so it was kind of the most natural thing to write.   Michael Hingson  36:59 I think you just hit on it. Essentially. mysteries are puzzles and puzzles are as good as it gets. Who are your favorite mystery writers?   Kelly Brakenhoff  37:10 Oh, I have so many.   Michael Hingson  37:12 Yeah, me too. Yeah.   Kelly Brakenhoff  37:15 I think like my, you know, the ones I kind of grew up with was like Sue Grafton. So that letter A is for those Jana Ivanovic. There's Stephanie Plum Siri   Michael Hingson  37:27 plum. Hey, come on. We all love diesel, but that's another story.   Kelly Brakenhoff  37:30 Oh, yeah, diesel's awesome, too. Well, I'm sure being you live. You said you live in New Jersey, right? Oh, yes. Yeah. So you're very familiar with tenants. Definitely. Trenton definitely fun. And then I also just love like John Grisham and James Patterson and Michael Connelly. I mean, gosh, I just, that's all. I haven't really met very many mysteries that I didn't like.   Michael Hingson  37:54 Yeah. My my favorite still is Rex Stout with the neuro wolf series. Oh, yeah. Yeah, they I've never solved any of his books before the end. And I worked at it. I love Mary Higgins Clark. But I was able to basically figure out all of the, the mean people in that before the end of the book, still, they were fun to read   Kelly Brakenhoff  38:20 is fun, right? I mean, as long as it's a good story, even if guests are having an idea of did it by the end, as long as the character still keep you in it. And a lot of times this setting is kind of a character to then I don't mind, you know, reading to the end to confirm that I was right. I think what's funny since I became a writer, and I don't know, you can tell me if this is true for yourself. But since I became a writer, an author, I kind of ruined for reading, like I read a lot. But I read now to learn and to see what when I read a really good book, I love to pick it apart and and see why it's good. And not just the structure of it. But like if I if that paragraph was beautiful, I'll go back and read that paragraph several times and try to figure out what is so great about that paragraph, or when someone throws a twist or a turn in or I thought I knew who it was. And then at the end, I find out it was someone else. I just love that. That thrill of like, oh, you fooled me, you know, and I really like to think about all of that. But that means that a lot of times I'm not really enjoying the book. I'm like studying the book. And so I have found that if if I really get so sucked into a book that I am not doing that, that means that it's a really, really good book because if it took me out of my analysis into just enjoying it, then that's a me that's the mark of a very good book.   Michael Hingson  39:53 Sue Graf passed away from cancer did her last book ever get published? Because I don't think she finished it, did she?   Kelly Brakenhoff  39:59 It did not odds are one of those.   Michael Hingson  40:01 Zero Yeah,   Kelly Brakenhoff  40:03 yeah. The sad things. Is it never it's, it's not finished. I don't even know how far she got in it. But it wasn't finished enough to be published. Yeah,   Michael Hingson  40:12 yeah, I guess that's kind of what happened. But her mysteries were definitely some of the best. And we read them all. And some twice, which is always fun if I if I want to read a book a second time. And I don't have that many hours in the day that that's easy to do. But if I want to read a book a second time, then I know that there is something about it that I must have enjoyed. And we read here, a lot of books on audio, audible and other sources. The reason we do is that instead of watching TV, we pipe books through the house, my wife has learned to listen to audio. So we listen to books together. What I've been occasionally finding are editor mistakes where they said something and then later on referring back something, they say something different. Somebody messed up in editing it, and I don't see it often. But I do occasionally see it and I always find them. Which is a fun.   Kelly Brakenhoff  41:15 It is it's i It's funny, because, you know, even though my books are self published, I work really hard not to have those kinds of errors. Yeah, they go through an editor, at least one editor, numerous BETA readers, numerous proofreaders. And then, you know, six months after I published it all open it up, and I see a typo. And it's like, at first I used to get so frustrated at that. And then now I saw something one time on Facebook, it was like, cheers to you, you typo you made it through three rounds of editing, 10 proofreaders and you still made it you you go, you know,   Michael Hingson  41:58 I when I was in college, we used in freshman and sophomore physics, a series of books called the Berkeley physics series, because it came out of there. And I had a dorm mate, who looked in detail at every single book, looking for a mistake, because he said a lot of books, there are editing mistakes. And he said he finally found one in one of the Berkeley physics books, but he said it was so fun looking just to see any error. And he couldn't find them in the Berkeley physics series. It was just incredible that he spent that time. On the other hand, he was an excellent student. So I guess he learned from it as he was reading.   Kelly Brakenhoff  42:43 Have a niece who's a doctor and they actually some textbook company paid her. I don't know if she just got free books. Or if she actually got paid her last year of med school, they they paid her to go through the as she was going through the textbook to note down any errors that she found.   Michael Hingson  43:03 See, it's always good to to read as much as possible and proofread as much as possible. And you're right. There's nothing like a good editor to help.   Kelly Brakenhoff  43:12 Right, exactly, exactly.   Michael Hingson  43:14 So how hard was it to write your first mystery? Oh, must have a lot   Kelly Brakenhoff  43:22 of courage. And it was a lot of it was a lot of I think I must have gone through 10 or 15 jobs. It took me five years to finish it, it was ugly, there was a lot of tears. But you know, you just learned so much I kind of consider it like getting a master's degree. I just did it at home with my, my own process. But you know, I just had to learn a lot. You have to be humble, you have to be willing to accept criticism and advice from other people. But I feel like it taught me a lot. And of course, then the second book teaches you even more and the third and you know, each one you do, I think you just learn more, either about yourself or about writing. I'd love to read books about writing craft and how to do better. You know, I want every single book that I write to be better than the last. I think most authors are that way.   Michael Hingson  44:15 They get easier the more you write. That's a   Kelly Brakenhoff  44:18 funny question, because I'm right in the middle of writing my fourth mystery right now. And I've been stalled for quite a while. And what it's taught me is just about myself and my process and what I thought my process was versus what I'm finding. I thought I could speed it up, but it's actually making me slow down. So that means that I was not speeding it up correctly. If that makes sense.   Michael Hingson  44:46 Yeah. Well, and I don't know whether it becomes easier or not. I have been very blessed when we did thunder dog. I had someone to collaborate and help with it Susie Florrie And that happened because she actually found Me, because she was writing a book called Dawn tales, which was 17 stories about dogs who had stories. And she wanted to include Roselle in that. And she did. But as we discussed my story, she said, You should really write a book. And so we got started down that road. And I met her agent who became my agent, Chip McGregor on thunder dog. And we, we had a good time and collaborated well. And I think that there was a lot of value in that for me, because I know that I don't have the writing experience as such. But I know what's good when I read it. And I also know that I can add value. So we really had a very collaborative process of writing thunder dog, a lot of it is hers, and a lot of it is mine directly. And we blended the two which was great. Now with the third book that we're getting, which is getting ready to do, which is going to talk about fear and controlling fear and people learning that they can overcome fear and not let it blind them, if you will, to being able to make decisions. The working title is a guide dogs Guide to Being brave, and I'm doing that with a friend of Susie's Carrie, Carrie Wyatt can't. Because Suzy is in a Ph. D. program. Yeah, we love the title. We'll see what the publisher does. We've got a contract for it. We'll see what the publisher does with it over time. But so far everybody likes it. That was a carry creation, because I was going to call it blinded by fear, which was more accurate in some senses. But I think a guide dogs Guide to Being brave is a lot better title.   Kelly Brakenhoff  46:35 Yeah, it reminds me of that one. Is it the Art of Racing in the Rain? Yeah, yeah, it kind of reminds me of something like that, where it's it's a little off of what the theme of the book is, but it's still engaging, and it makes you want to know more about it.   Michael Hingson  46:54 It was a good book. And so   Kelly Brakenhoff  46:57 you said something that really resonated with me, you said, I know, it's good when I read it. And I think that's a big obstacle for beginning writers. And is that usually, if you're a writer, you're a reader first. And so I've read tons and tons of great books, and I know what great literature is, and I know what a great story is. And then when I write my first one, it's not very good. So you kind of have that, that huge gap between what you know is good and what you've produced. And so it's, it's, it's hard, you have to overcome that, that feeling of, of my stuff is really bad, you know, and then you have to work really hard to make it as good as, as you want it to be, you know, as good as it is to be able to actually share with the world, you know, to get up to that level of what your your bar is the bar that you've set. And so I think that's something that stands it's a barrier to a lot of people. And that's where I think a good editor comes. Yeah.   Michael Hingson  48:05 Yeah. Well look at John Grisham. You mentioned earlier the first book he wrote If I recall was a time to kill but it was the third one published the first one that he wrote, and it was published was the firm and then I'm trying to remember what the second one was. Was it the Pelican Brief the Pelican Brief right? And then A Time to Kill, which was the Jake Brigantes initiator, if you will. But if you look at all of them, you can see how the the books evolved over time in his writing style. So it's it is a natural progression. And I mentioned Rex Stout, a Nero Wolf, if you go back and read fair to Lance, which was his first book, and you compare it with especially much later writings, you can see changes, but you can see where everything is starting from and you get engaged in in fact, fair Lance was not the first mirror wolf book I read. by a longshot. It wasn't the first, but having gone back and read it. Even though everyone in the book all the characters developed a fair amount and since then, and his writing style improved. It was engaging. Mm hmm. Well, tell me about your mystery series,   Kelly Brakenhoff  49:26 sir. Um, it's about a college administrator named Cassandra Sato and she lives in Hawaii. She gives up her her life in Hawaii to move to Nebraska because she wants to accept her dream job at a tiny college called Morton college in the middle of nowhere in Nebraska. And she and her eventual goal is to become a college administrators or college president. So she thinks this is you know, the Path is gonna get her there. But of course, moving from Hawaii to Nebraska is a very, very large cultural, cultural shift. And so she encounters all kinds of problems, discrimination, barriers, everything. And a few months into her job, a student turns up dead on campus and see has to be part of the group of people who figures out what happened to the student and then find justice.   Michael Hingson  50:28 Yeah, come on. Cassandra really did. And she's been hiding a whole series. Yeah, that's   Kelly Brakenhoff  50:33 the end of the series. It was Cassandra.   Michael Hingson  50:35 That will come later on about the hundreds book, right. That's awesome. When Karen and my wife and I are talking about who did it in various books, we, we usually do things like that. We've been reading a lot of the JE NACHA as well, we read a chance to but the JD Robb books, the in depth series, have you read those. And so I read very many of those now, we we oftentimes will spin a story how Eve Dallas really did it. Or Roark did it and had just a lot of fun with it. But again, a great series of books is there's a lot of sex in those books, but they're still taking Ross. Yeah, they're great mysteries.   Kelly Brakenhoff  51:20 Yeah, a lot of times people like the ones that I write well, obviously, I have four kids and grandkids. And my kids would cringe if I if they had to read a sex scene that I wrote. So, you know, my kids were like, high school and college age when I started writing. So I decided all the sex in my books, there's gonna be behind closed doors, and yeah, nobody, nobody wants to have their mom. Yeah, no.   Michael Hingson  51:46 I've, I've talked to several authors who say that who, one who said I would never any more, I would never let my daughter or my wife, wife read the books, or I changed the sex so that they could read them. But the value of having them read them as they're great critics, and so it's worthwhile. But yeah, it is fun to to see how people react. But, you know, a mystery. Doesn't need to have all the violence thrown at you right out in the open, which is why puzzles are so great. At James Patterson tends to be a little bit more violent, but not nearly as violent as he could be. So we we've always enjoyed Of course, the Alex Cross series.   Kelly Brakenhoff  52:33 Yeah, it's there's such a huge variety in Yeah, the violence level and all that stuff. I myself, I have a pretty vivid imagination. I don't really need people to spell some of that stuff out for me. My mysteries are technically like cozy mysteries, which kind of means that there's no like blood on the page. There's no swearing, there's no sex. So like, even you know, high school kids can read them and, and that kind of thing. So I guess that's just, I just write what I like. So that's only because I like to read. So that's what I like to write.   Michael Hingson  53:12 Come on. That's only because Cassandra is trying to hide everything, but we know the truth.   Kelly Brakenhoff  53:18 That's right. She's really Voldemort.   Michael Hingson  53:21 Yeah, she's really Voldemort. Speaking of another good series of books   Kelly Brakenhoff  53:28 that's that's a whole different ballgame.   Michael Hingson  53:30 But but you know, looking at the Harry Potter books, again is another one where going from Book One through Book Seven, just how it evolved. And they're so fun.   Kelly Brakenhoff  53:42 They are they're definitely one of my I, I like all genres. So yeah, I loved Harry Potter Lord of the Rings, Narnia. I mean, you name it, it's I thought during the pandemic that I would just read all day every day but it turns out I actually have to do other stuff too.   Michael Hingson  53:59 So I hate it when that happens.   Kelly Brakenhoff  54:02 There is no laundry fairy I hate to be the person to tell you this but there is no laundry fairy,   Michael Hingson  54:07 I haven't found one either. And I get to do the clothes washing at our house which is fine. So for me, I love the brainless activities on Sunday. So there are three tasks that well for that I do on Sundays. It starts with doing the laundry or starting the laundry. Another is we I take the cat box out we use a litter called litter one it's not sand, it's all pine kernels. And you buy them and they come in a disposable box. So we just use in different new box every week. And it's about the same as using regular sand that you buy in the in the store. But at the end of the week, you just throw the whole box out and put a new one up and the cat is very demanding when it comes time to change the box. So that happens on Sunday. I take the trash out on Sunday. And then we have a little If we do get housecleaning help during the week, Karen's in wheelchairs, he has been in a chair her whole life. So it's kind of hard for us to do some of those things. So we do have a housekeeper that comes on Thursdays, in fact, and today's Thursday. So Jeanette is here, but we have a robot vacuum and I do the vacuuming again on Sunday with the robot in our bedroom, because that's also where Alamo my guide dog sleeps. So we get all those. So those are my four tasks on Sunday. And they're they're all pretty brainless in a sense. So I can read while they're going on, which is fun. And Karen is a quilter. So she's usually in sewing. And and she's reading the same thing I read. So it's a question right now, who finishes which JD Robb book first?   Kelly Brakenhoff  55:44 Yeah, that is definitely the the good thing about audiobooks is being able to multitask on some of those things that you don't have to pay so much attention to.   Michael Hingson  55:54 Tell me about your dupe the deaf dog ASL series.   Kelly Brakenhoff  55:58 Well, that is the second series that I started after I finished the mystery novels, I kind of had a moment where I realized that I, you know, I started my own publishing company. And I just had a thought, I mean, it's kind of cliche, it was actually a dream that just came to me of like, what I could do with this publishing company, if I just kind of unleashed it. And so I came up with the idea of, of this orange, English spaniel dog who is deaf and all of the people in his or all of his family can hear. And so it's just about different experiences that he has as the only person in a family of hearing people, and trying to get deaf and hard of hearing children to see themselves and their everyday life experiences on our pages of our books. But I also want kids who can hear to understand what it's like to hear differently. We just finished the third book, and I'm actually actually we just finished the fourth book, the third book just came out. But the fourth book is in production right now. And I had no idea when it started, what it was going to end up being but it's actually turned out to be more successful. And I would say even more fun than my mysteries, the mysteries are kind of like my thing that I enjoy. As far as, like you said, creating the puzzle and, and the challenge of it, but the Duke, the deaf dog ASL series, is kind of what I feel like I'm taking my 30 Whatever years of interpreting and hanging around with really cool Deaf people, and then like sharing that with the world.   Michael Hingson  57:49 So it's not a mystery series.   Kelly Brakenhoff  57:53 No, it is not. They are picture books. So they're only like less than 500 words. And each one is a different situation that do gets into so there's like a different message. And each one more than 90% of children who are born deaf or hard of hearing have parents that can hear I did a lot of research to before I started the books, and there's very few books for young children that have deaf and hard of hearing characters. Once you get into like high school age, or even beyond, there's more books that have deaf and hard of hearing characters. But at the kindergarten, first grade age, there's very few books. And you know, my kids had lots and lots of choices of books to read. So I feel like deaf kids did have lots and lots of choices, books that have characters like them in there. So each book has a different message like the first one was called nevermind. And the message is that everyone deserves to be included in conversations. I mean, how many times do we tell people nevermind when they ask us to repeat ourselves? Or maybe we have, like a older parent or spouse who doesn't hear well, or even like someone who's just a little bit slower to act, or to understand a lot of times we just get impatient and say forget it. I'll explain later. And this book like after I published that first book, I've had so many deaf people come up to me and tell me stories of times when they've been told nevermind. And they thanked me for sharing their stories because they want hearing people to understand how hurtful those words are and what it feels to be left out. So I have a pretty long list of situations I've seen throughout the years that I plan to incorporate into the books and I I'm only stopped by my amount of time and and money to hire illustrators at this point.   Michael Hingson  59:55 Back to mysteries. Of course there's the cat who series Lily and Jackson Brown and also Rita Mae Brown and sneaky pie Brown. But in thinking of the cat who books, why not have a Duke, the Duke, the deaf dog series, solving mysteries, and also deal with all the frustrations that Duke has of trying to get his humans to listen? And how he has to figure things out, not being in a hearing world himself.   Kelly Brakenhoff  1:00:27 Yeah, that's a good thought. I'm actually like I said, I have so many ideas that it's really limited by my time and money, but um, the picture books are more like so Duke's a dog. Right? It's more like he's like a pitbull, like, they stand on their hind legs. And they kind of like even his dad wears like a tie. So they kind of are like human, but they're dogs. But it's a nice way to be able to show diversity and like breeds of dogs and colors of dogs and abilities and body types and stuff without actually having like different children in there. So it's kind of like, like, I don't know, if you remember the Mercer Mayer series, little critter. That's kind of what I thought of, as I   Michael Hingson  1:01:13 was able to read them. Yeah,   Kelly Brakenhoff  1:01:15 that was like my, my model, I guess of who I thought of it's like, so Duke is more just like a character, a fictional character. But I do have a couple of other ideas for series for like middle grade age kids. And those would be mysteries, and those would use some characters. I have a couple of young characters in the Cassandra Sacco series. I did a Halloween short story last year called scavenger hunt. And that two of the main characters in there were 10 year old kids. And so I think I want to do a separate series with them and have those be mysteries because I agree, I think I can incorporate a lot of the things that I know about the Deaf community and Deaf culture and ASL into a mystery, and they get kind of fun that way. And   Michael Hingson  1:02:05 it's great that you're using this opportunity to teach people more about deaf and hard of hearing. And not only as a culture, but as just as much an included an inclusive part of society as everyone else. I am concerned when you're talking about do looking like a character and looking a little bit like people. I just don't want to see a new book coming out about do the deaf dog ASL series goes to Animal Farm just saying. But Duly noted. So So you you did one of your books. As a Kickstarter campaign?   Kelly Brakenhoff  1:02:43 We did. Um, the the most recent one that just published in January, I did my first Kickstarter campaign.   Michael Hingson  1:02:51 Now why did you do that? What brought Kickstarter into it.   Kelly Brakenhoff  1:02:54 I went to this conference last fall in Las Vegas, and I met some authors who publish their books first on Kickstarter, before they release them more widely and other stores. And listening to them made me realize that Kickstarter might be a good way for me to reach new readers. The nice thing about Kickstarter, which I think you said that you've supported a couple of campaigns, honestly, before I had gone to this conference, I did not think starter was something I needed to do, I hadn't really gone on there, I hadn't pledged sponsored anybody else's project. So I just kind of went into it blindly. But I realized that the cool thing about Kickstarter is you get to develop a direct relationship with people who want to buy your product. So in my case, it's a book, but I've gone on there. And since then, I've supported all kinds of different projects. I've done a board game, and a coloring book and a purse. And I mean, there's so many neat, creative ideas that people come up with and put them on Kickstarter, just to see. So then the the customers can come on and pledge money towards that product and say, Yes, I think that's a great idea. The world needs that. And I'm willing to plunk down my money to pre order that thing that you want to make. And so if enough of those people say that they'll pre order the product, then the project is successful, and it funds and then the person who listed the project goes ahead and makes it. So that's been really exciting. But you have this direct relationship where the creator is sending you messages and keeping you updated on the progress like, okay, you know, we're finished in publishing, you know, in the case of publishing, you say, Okay, we finished the illustration and we're waiting for them to be printed and then I actually personally boxed everything up and mailed them to the people with personal note and some extra stickers and everything. So I think I'd really enjoy that contact with people and that communication because it goes both ways, then people can actually respond to me. If I just sell stuff on Amazon or in the local bookstore, I don't really know who buys my, my books. And so the Kickstarter has been a really cool way to just kind of, I guess, learn more about what people want and what people like about them. And it's kind of a neat way to have this direct relationship. It made me I funded my first project successfully, we raised $2,500, which was enough money to buy some hardcover books. In the past, I haven't been able to afford doing those books, as a small publishers. So it's great to be able to order those books and get those into people's hands they came with, they're very well done on nice thick paper with really vivid color illustrations. And then there's photos on each page of different ASL signs. And the photos are really clear. So it was definitely worth I guess, the experience. So I'm actually going to be doing another one in July for the, for the next Duke book. But as a person, like you said, you you have a contract to do your next book. And so you get a lot of times authors will get paid in advance, this is kind of almost the same thing where I'm making this idea. And then I'm, like pre paying some of the costs that it cost to produce the book, like, you know, the illustrating, or the printing, or all the different things that are associated with making the book, it's like a way for me to almost get like an advance except this directly coming from the customers instead of from the publishing company.   Michael Hingso

HIGHLIGHTS FROM EPISODE 4:Janet Fitch talks about seeing a three-hour concert with Leonard Cohen; Joni Mitchell; what she'd ask Patti Smith, Björk, Neil Young, and Leonard Cohen if she could; creating an “I will survive” music playlist; Amy Winehouse; Janis Joplin; X; Nico; Jackson Brown.Janet and I talk about some of the major themes of her novel ‘Paint it Black'; grief and the aftermath of suicide; the significance of the title of her novel; the freedom that punk rock gives fans and musicians alike; why ‘Paint it Black' is a punk rock novel as opposed to a more generalized rock novel; how each of the three main characters in ‘Paint it Black' has their own distinct soundtrack; classical music and early 20th century Americana music; L.A. punk, especially The Germs and The Cramps; the deaths of John Lennon and Darby Crash; the changing punk scene in L.A. in the early ‘80s; how the Ingmar Bergman film ‘Persona' influenced the creation of Janet's novel; Janet's experience as a student filmmaker in the ‘80s; the 1913 poem “Trans-Siberian Prose and Little Jeanne from France”; the movie adaptation of ‘Paint it Black'.Pleasant Gehman talks about the beginning of the L.A. punk scene and her involvement in it. She mentions various bands and iconic L.A. punk rock venues, becoming friends with Darby Crash and Pat Smear of The Germs before they were in The Germs and dating Pat Smear, smoking pot with Tony Curtis, rooming with Belinda Carlisle and smoking pot with Screamin' Jay Hawkins at Disgraceland, hanging out with Joan Jett.To hear more from Pleasant about her involvement with some of the hottest punk bands in L.A. in the early ‘80s, including The Cramps, The Weirdos, Blondie, The Damned, X, and Black Flag, and how the scene began to deteriorate, listen to the outtake from this episode in the Rock is Lit Vault.Nicole Panter shares her memories of being friends with and managing The Germs; Darby Crash's childhood; why Germs shows were a trainwreck; Darby's abuse of alcohol and drugs; the making of The Germs' album, including Joan Jett's involvement; ‘The Decline of Western Civilization' documentary, in which Nicole and The Germs are featured; why Nicole stopped managing the band; Darby's fascination with Adam Ant; how Nicole heard about Darby's death; Nicole's dislike of the biopic about Darby and The Germs, ‘What We Do Is Secret', and The Germs reunion tour with the actor who played Darby in the film, Shane West; the legacy of The Germs. CLIPS OF MUSIC PLAYED IN THE EPISODE IN ORDER OF APPEARANCE:"Paint it Black" by the Rolling Stones"Land" by Patti SmithBrahms Piano Concerto No. 2 in B-flat major Op. 82, played by Yuja Wang with the Munich Philharmonic, conducted by Valery Gergiev, Dec 1, 2018“West End Blues” by Louis Armstrong“What We Do Is Secret” by The Germs“Human Fly” by The CrampsErich Wolfgang Korngold: ‘Kings Row', Main Title, music for the 1941 film“Our Way” by The Germs“Media Blitz” by The Germs“American Leather” by The GermsTwo short clips from the 1981 documentary 'The Decline of Western Civilization', directed by Penelope Spheeris,  featuring Darby Crash and The Germs appear in the episode. CONTACTS: Janet Fitch's websiteJanet Fitch Twitter, @JanetFitch323Janet Fitch Instagram, @janetfitch323Pleasant Gehman's websitePleasant Gehman Twitter, @PleasantGehman1Pleasant Gehman Instagram, @princessofhollywoodThe Devil's Music With Pleasant Gehman podcastBelle, Book, and Candle, Instagram, @belle_book_and_candleNicole Panter Instagram, @poseypChristy Alexander Hallberg's websiteChristy Alexander Hallberg Instagram, @christyhallbergChristy Alexander Hallberg Twitter, @ChristyHallbergChristy Alexander Hallberg YouTubeRock is Lit Vault

HIGHLIGHTS FROM EPISODE 4: Janet Fitch talks about seeing a three-hour concert with Leonard Cohen; Joni Mitchell; what she'd ask Patti Smith, Björk, Neil Young, and Leonard Cohen if she could; creating an “I will survive” music playlist; Amy Winehouse; Janis Joplin; X; Nico; Jackson Brown. Janet and I talk about some of the major themes of her novel ‘Paint it Black'; grief and the aftermath of suicide; the significance of the title of her novel; the freedom that punk rock gives fans and musicians alike; why ‘Paint it Black' is a punk rock novel as opposed to a more generalized rock novel; how each of the three main characters in ‘Paint it Black' has their own distinct soundtrack; classical music and early 20th century Americana music; L.A. punk, especially The Germs and The Cramps; the deaths of John Lennon and Darby Crash; the changing punk scene in L.A. in the early ‘80s; how the Ingmar Bergman film ‘Persona' influenced the creation of Janet's novel; Janet's experience as a student filmmaker in the ‘80s; the 1913 poem “Trans-Siberian Prose and Little Jeanne from France”; the movie adaptation of ‘Paint it Black'. Pleasant Gehman talks about the beginning of the L.A. punk scene and her involvement in it. She mentions various bands and iconic L.A. punk rock venues, becoming friends with Darby Crash and Pat Smear of The Germs before they were in The Germs and dating Pat Smear, smoking pot with Tony Curtis, rooming with Belinda Carlisle and smoking pot with Screamin' Jay Hawkins at Disgraceland, hanging out with Joan Jett. To hear more from Pleasant about her involvement with some of the hottest punk bands in L.A. in the early ‘80s, including The Cramps, The Weirdos, Blondie, The Damned, X, and Black Flag, and how the scene began to deteriorate, listen to the outtake from this episode in the Rock is Lit Vault. Nicole Panter shares her memories of being friends with and managing The Germs; Darby Crash's childhood; why Germs shows were a trainwreck; Darby's abuse of alcohol and drugs; the making of The Germs' album, including Joan Jett's involvement; ‘The Decline of Western Civilization' documentary, in which Nicole and The Germs are featured; why Nicole stopped managing the band; Darby's fascination with Adam Ant; how Nicole heard about Darby's death; Nicole's dislike of the biopic about Darby and The Germs, ‘What We Do Is Secret', and The Germs reunion tour with the actor who played Darby in the film, Shane West; the legacy of The Germs.   CLIPS OF MUSIC PLAYED IN THE EPISODE IN ORDER OF APPEARANCE: "Paint it Black" by the Rolling Stones "Land" by Patti Smith Brahms Piano Concerto No. 2 in B-flat major Op. 82, played by Yuja Wang with the Munich Philharmonic, conducted by Valery Gergiev, Dec 1, 2018 “West End Blues” by Louis Armstrong “What We Do Is Secret” by The Germs “Human Fly” by The Cramps Erich Wolfgang Korngold: ‘Kings Row', Main Title, music for the 1941 film “Our Way” by The Germs “Media Blitz” by The Germs “American Leather” by The Germs Two short clips from the 1981 documentary 'The Decline of Western Civilization', directed by Penelope Spheeris, featuring Darby Crash and The Germs appear in the episode.   CONTACTS:  Janet Fitch's website Janet Fitch Twitter, @JanetFitch323 Janet Fitch Instagram, @janetfitch323 Pleasant Gehman's website Pleasant Gehman Twitter, @PleasantGehman1 Pleasant Gehman Instagram, @princessofhollywood The Devil's Music With Pleasant Gehman podcast Belle, Book, and Candle, Instagram, @belle_book_and_candle Nicole Panter Instagram, @poseyp Christy Alexander Hallberg's website Christy Alexander Hallberg Instagram, @christyhallberg Christy Alexander Hallberg Twitter, @ChristyHallberg Christy Alexander Hallberg YouTube Rock is Lit Vault Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

SUMMARY:Our guest on this episode is John Hall, founder of the band Orleans and co-writer of the group's enduring hits "Dance with Me" and "Still the One." He chats with us about how Janis Joplin launched his songwriting career, co-writing Steve Wariner's #1 country hit "You Can Dream of Me," and how he ended up serving two terms as a US Congressman before returning to music.PART ONE:Paul and Scott chat about Orleans' legendary "naked" album cover, and band/artist names you're afraid to say out loud. If you've ever stressed about how to say Husker Du, Bon Iver, Chvrches, or Bjork, we've got you!  PART TWO:Our in-depth interview with John HallABOUT JOHN HALL:John Hall is a musician, songwriter, community activist, founder of the band Orleans, and former US Congressman. After forming the group Kangaroo, which shared house band duties with Bruce Springsteen's group The Castilles at Greenwich Village's legendary Café Wha, Hall worked extensively as a sideman. He toured and/or recorded as a guitarist with Seals & Crofts, Taj Mahal, Bonnie Raitt, Little Feat, Carly Simon, Jackson Brown, and others, but established himself as a songwriter when he and then-wife Johanna penned “Half Moon” on Janis Joplin's Pearl album. After John formed the group Orleans, he and Johanna continued to find success as songwriters with the band's hit singles “Dance with Me” and “Still the One.” The following decade, John became a chart-topping country writer when he co-wrote Steve Wariner's #1 single “You Can Dream of Me.” He's known for co-founding the organization Musicians United for Safe Energy with Jackson Brown, Bonnie Raitt, and Graham Nash. John helped organize the legendary 1979 No Nukes concerts at Madison Square Garden, and his song “Power” became the anthem for the event. In 2006, John was elected to the US House of Representatives, representing New York's 19th District. After serving two terms, he returned to making music. John's songs have been covered by Millie Jackson, Chaka Kahn, Ricky Skaggs, Taj Mahal, Jackson Browne, Linda Ronstadt, James Taylor, Levon Helm, Bobby McFerrin, Bonnie Raitt, Chet Atkins, New Grass Revival, Jose Feliciano, Bill Anderson, The Oak Ridge Boys, Patty Loveless, and more. His most recent solo album is called Reclaiming My Time. We spoke with him in June of 2021 when the album was brand new and when he was working on some Orleans projects that have since become available and can be found at johnhallmusic.com.        

When Duncan recorded Rae Leighs music video 'Find A Better Day' in 2020 Duncan talked about wanting to get back into recording and releasing his own music. Now in 2022 he has done just that with the help of his friends he released his first single 'Run' and has many more and an album to come. In this chat they go through some of the challenges Duncan overcame to get to this point. Duncan John Toombs (born on June 14th, 1977) is an Australian based singer-songwriter, musician and video director. Known widely for his incredible guitar work & creative film making, the release of Duncan's debut album - STEEL ON STEEL has the entire Australian country scene waiting in anticipation. It features 12 original songs about his life, his family and love. With inspiration grounded from his long-time love of Country Music, Duncan's songs are woven with tones ranging from Jackson Brown to Zac Brown. This album is a sure bet to exceed everyone's expectations. Connect with Duncan: Website Facebook Spotify YouTube Instagram

A new MP3 sermon from Alpha and Omega Ministries is now available on SermonAudio with the following details: Title: Roadtrip DL from Salt Lake City: Jackson-Brown and the Culture of Death Subtitle: The Dividing Line 2022 Speaker: Dr. James White Broadcaster: Alpha and Omega Ministries Event: Podcast Date: 4/8/2022 Length: 61 min.

Never dreamed in the early 1980s I would someday be doing a live -webcast- -of all things-- from Salt Lake City, but here we are- Discussed the Jackson-Brown issue in light of the Christian worldview and many other related issues. Also listened to Brandan Robertson twist John 11 into a homosexual-affirming pretzel.

Hey, Hey! In today's episode I'm sharing my thoughts on the confirmation hearings and how what Hon. Jackson Brown experienced correlates to Black Women in corporate America. Make sure to support the podcast by joining me on Patreon at www.patreon.com/browngirlselfcare to get bonus content!

As Biden's battle to confirm the first "Black Woman" to the Supreme Court rages on into day three of Ketanji Jackson-Brown's Senate Confirmation Hearings, Charlie unpacks the astounding level of obfuscation and ignorance coming from the so-called "highly qualified" and "brilliant" legal mind of Judge KJB. He walks through her stunning inability to define the term "woman" as well as her sickening defense of soft sentences for Child Pornographers. Through the course of it all, Charlie exposes the terrifying record of Biden's nominee and makes perfectly clear why she should never be anywhere near the levers of federal power, much less a lifetime appointment to the Supreme Court of the United States of America. Support the show: http://www.charliekirk.com/support See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.