Podcasts about Versus

You can listen wherever you get your podcasts or check out the fully edited transcript of our interview at the bottom of this post.In this episode of The Peaceful Parenting Podcast, Corey and I talk about modeling the person you want your child to be—instead of trying to force them into having good character or good values. We discussed the difference between being a gardener or a carpenter parent, raising kind and helpful children, and how to trust the modeling process. We give lots of examples of what this has looked like for parents in our community as well as in our own homes.**If you'd like an ad-free version of the podcast, consider becoming a supporter on Substack! > > If you already ARE a supporter, the ad-free version is waiting for you in the Substack app or you can enter the private feed URL in the podcast player of your choice.Know someone who might appreciate this episode? Share it with them!We talk about:* 00:00 — Intro + main idea: be the person you want your child to be* 00:02 — How kids naturally model what we do (funny real-life stories)* 00:04 — When modeling goes wrong (rabbit poop + shovel story)* 00:06 — Not everything kids do is learned from us (fight/flight/freeze)* 00:08 — Gardener vs. carpenter parenting metaphor* 00:10 — Why “don't do anything for your child” is flawed advice* 00:12 — Helping builds independence (adult example + kids stepping up)* 00:17 — Hunt, Gather, Parent: let kids help when they're little* 00:19 — How to encourage helping without power struggles* 00:23 — Family team vs. rigid chores* 00:26 — Trust, faith, and “I'm sure you'll do it next time”* 00:29 — Respecting kids like people (adultism)* 00:31 — Living values without preaching* 00:36 — It's the small moments that shape kids* 00:38 — Don't be a martyr: let some things go* 00:40 — When this works (and when it doesn't)* 00:42 — Closing reflections on trust and nurturingResources mentioned in this episode:* Yoto Screen Free Audio Book Player * The Peaceful Parenting Membership * Hunt, Gather, Parent podcast episode* Evelyn & Bobbie brasConnect with Sarah Rosensweet:* Instagram* Facebook Group* YouTube* Website* Join us on Substack* Newsletter* Book a short consult or coaching session callxx Sarah and CoreyYour peaceful parenting team-click here for a free short consult or a coaching sessionVisit our website for free resources, podcast, coaching, membership and more!>> Please support us!!! Please consider becoming a supporter to help support our free content, including The Peaceful Parenting Podcast, our free parenting support Facebook group, and our weekly parenting emails, “Weekend Reflections” and “Weekend Support” - plus our Flourish With Your Complex Child Summit (coming back in the summer for the 3rd year!) All of this free support for you takes a lot of time and energy from me and my team. If it has been helpful or meaningful for you, your support would help us to continue to provide support for free, for you and for others.In addition to knowing you are supporting our mission to support parents and children, you get the podcast ad free and access to a monthly ‘ask me anything' session.Our sponsors:YOTO: YOTO is a screen free audio book player that lets your kids listen to audiobooks, music, podcasts and more without screens, and without being connected to the internet. No one listening or watching and they can't go where you don't want them to go and they aren't watching screens. BUT they are being entertained or kept company with audio that you can buy from YOTO or create yourself on one of their blank cards. Check them out HEREEvelyn & Bobbie bras: If underwires make you want to rip your bra off by noon, Evelyn & Bobbie is for you. These bras are wire-free, ultra-soft, and seriously supportive—designed to hold you comfortably all day without pinching, poking, or constant adjusting. Check them out HEREPodcast Transcript:Sarah: Hey, everyone. Welcome back to another episode of the Peaceful Parenting Podcast. I have Corey with me today. Hi, Corey.Corey: Hey, Sarah.Sarah: I'm so happy to be talking about what we're going to be talking about today because it's something that comes up a lot—both with our coaching clients and in our membership.Today we're talking about modeling the person you want your child to be—being the person you want your child to be—instead of trying to force them into having good character or good values.Corey: This is one of my favorite topics because people don't really think about it. There's that phrase that's so rampant: “Do as I say, not as I do.” And we're actually saying: do the exact opposite of that.Sarah: Yeah. And I think if people did this, that phrase wouldn't have to exist. Because if you're being the person you want your child to be, then you really can just say, “Do as I do.”I guess that “Do what I say, not what I do” comes up when you're not being the person you want your child to be. And it shows how powerful it is that kids naturally follow what we do, right?Corey: Yes.Sarah: Yeah. We both have some funny stories about this in action—times we didn't necessarily think about it until we remembered or saw it reflected back. Do you want to share yours first? It's so cute.Corey: Yeah. When I was a little girl, my favorite game to play was asking my mom if we could play “Mummy and her friend.” We did this all the time. My mom said she had to do it over and over and over with me.We'd both get a little coffee cup. I'd fill mine with water, and we'd pretend we were drinking tea or coffee. Then we would just sit and have a conversation—like I heard her having with her friend.And I'd always be like, “So, how are your kids?”—and ask the exact things I would hear my mom asking her friend.Sarah: That's so cute. So you were pretending to be her?Corey: Yes.Sarah: That is so cute.I remember once when Lee was little—he was probably around three—he had a block, like a play block, a colored wooden block. And he had it pinched between his shoulder and his ear, and he was doing circles around the kitchen.I said, “What are you doing?” And he said, “I'm talking on the phone.”And I realized: oh my gosh. I walk around with the cordless phone pinched between my shoulder and my ear, and I walk around while I'm talking on the phone. So for him, that was like: this is how you talk on the phone.Corey: That's such a funny reference, too. Now our kids would never—my kids would never do that, right?Sarah: No, because they never saw you with a phone like that.Corey: Right.Sarah: That is so funny. It's definitely a dated reference.You also have a funny story, too, that's sort of the opposite—less harmless things our kids copy us doing. Do you want to share your… I think it's a rabbit poop story.Corey: It is. We're just going to put it out there: it's a rabbit poop story. This is how we accidentally model things we probably don't want our kids doing.So, if you were listening this time last year, I got a new dog. She's a lab, and her favorite thing is to eat everything—especially things she's not supposed to eat, which I'm sure a lot of people can relate to.Our area is rampant with rabbits, so we have this problem with rabbit droppings. And my vet has informed me that despite the fact that dogs love it, you need to not let them eat it.So I'm always in the backyard—if you're hearing this, it's really silly—having to try and shovel these up so the dog's not eating them.Listeners, we're looking into a longer-term solution so rabbits aren't getting into our backyard, but this is where we're at right now.Whenever I noticed I'd be shoveling them up and I'd see her trying to eat something else I hadn't shoveled yet, I'd say, “Leave it,” and then give her a treat to reward her.One day, my little guy—little C—who loves taking part in dog training and is so great with animals, he saw our dog eating something she shouldn't. He ran and got his little sand shovel and went up to her holding it—kind of waving it at her—like, “Leave it.”And I was like, why are you shaking a shovel at the dog? Totally confused about what he was doing.And he's like, “Well, this is how you do it, Mommy.”And I was like… oh. I shake a shovel at the dog. You just say, “Leave it,” and then you give her the treat—not the shovel.Not an hour later, I'm shoveling again, she's trying to eat something she shouldn't, and I'm like, “Leave it, leave it.” I look at my hand and I'm holding the shovel up while saying it to her.Sarah: Right?Corey: And I was like, “Oh, this is why he thinks that.” Because every time I'm saying this to her, I'm holding a shovel mid-scoop—trying to get on top of the problem.Sarah: That's so funny. And when you told me that the first time, I got the impression you maybe weren't being as gentle as you thought you were. Like you were frustrated with the dog, and little C was copying that.Corey: Yeah. Probably that too, right? Because it's a frustrating problem. Anyone who's tried to shovel rabbit droppings knows it's an impossible, ridiculous task.So I definitely was a bit frustrated. He was picking up both on the frustration and on what I was physically doing.And I also think this is a good example to show parents: don't beat yourself up. Sometimes we're not even aware of the things we're doing until we see it reflected back at us.Sarah: Totally.And now that you mentioned beating yourself up: I have a lot of parents I work with who will say, “I heard my kid yelling and shouting, and I know they pick that up from me—my bad habits of yelling and shouting.”I just want to say: there are some things kids do out of fight, flight, or freeze—like their nervous system has gotten activated—that they would do whether you shouted at them or not.It's not that everything—every hard thing—can be traced back to us.Kids will get aggressive, and I've seen this: kids who are aggressive, who have not ever seen aggression. They've never seen anyone hitting; they've never been hit. But they will hit and kick and spit and scream because that's the “fight” of fight, flight, or freeze.So it's not that they learned it somewhere.And often parents will worry, “What are they being exposed to at school?” But that can just be a natural instinct to protect oneself when we get dysregulated.Also, kids will think of the worst thing they can say—and it's not necessarily that they've heard it.I remember one time Asa got really mad at Lee. They were like three and six. And Asa said, “I'm going to chop your head off and bury you in the backyard.”Oh my goodness—if I hadn't known it wasn't necessarily something he learned, I would've been really worried. But it was just a reflection of that fight, flight, or freeze instinct that he had.So I guess it's: yes, kids can learn things from us, and I'm not saying they can't. Your example—with the dog, the rabbit poop, and the shovel—of course kids can pick up unsavory behavior from us.But that doesn't mean that every single hard thing they do, they learned from us. And also, they have good natures. There are things that come from them that are good as well, that they didn't learn from us.Corey: That's right.Sarah: I want to ground this conversation in a great metaphor from a book by Allison Gopnik. I think the title is The Gardener and the Carpenter: What the New Science of Child Development Tells Us About the Relationship Between Parents and Children.To really embrace what we're talking about—being the person you want your child to be—you have to believe in the gardener metaphor of parenting.The gardener metaphor is: your child is like a seed that has within it everything it needs to grow into a beautiful plant. You provide the water, sunlight, proper soil, and then the plant does the work of growing on its own.The carpenter metaphor is: you have to build your child—make your child into who they're going to be.This idea we're talking about—be the person you want your child to be—that's the soil and the light and the water your child needs to grow into a beautiful plant, or a beautiful human being.It's not that we're doing things to them to turn them into good humans.And honestly, most parents, when you ask them what they wish for their child, they want their kid to be a good person when they grow up.I want to say to parents: it's easier than you think. The most influential thing you can do to help your child grow up to be a good person is to be the person you want them to be.This goes up against a lot of common parenting advice.One phrase I wish did not exist—and I don't know where it came from, but if anyone knows, let me know—is: “You should never do anything for your child that they can do for themselves.”Such a terrible way to think about relationships.Can you imagine if I said to your partner, “You should never do anything for Corey that she can do for herself”? It's terrible.I make my husband coffee in the morning—not because he can't make it himself, but as an act of love. For him to come downstairs, getting ready for work, and have a nice hot coffee ready. Of course he can make his own coffee. But human relationships are built on doing things for each other.Corey: Yes. I think that's so profound.I think about how I was just telling you before we started recording how we've been spending our weekends skiing. When I first started skiing with my husband—even though I'd grown up skiing—I'd never done it as much as him. He helped me so much. He did so much of the process for me so I didn't have too much to think about.Now that we do it all the time, he said to me the other day, “Look at how independent you've gotten with this. You can do so much of this yourself. You're managing so much more on the hill.”He was so proud of me, and I was thinking: imagine if he hadn't done that for me. If he had been like, “Just figure it out. We're on the ski hill. You're an adult.”I probably wouldn't have enjoyed it very much. But he did lots of things for me that I could have done for myself, and that love and support helped nurture the shared love we had.Sarah: Yeah.And I think it's tough because our culture is so individualistic. Hyper-individualistic—everyone should stand on their own two feet and do things without help and make it on their own. And that has really leaked into our parenting.One of the major fears I hear from parents is that their kid won't be independent.So a lot of parents push kids to be independent—and what that ends up looking like is the opposite of what we're talking about.Part of the reason there's pressure for individualism is because we see it as a way for kids to turn into “good people.”But so many qualities of being a good person are about human interconnectedness: caring about other people, being kind, being helpful, being conscientious, thinking about what's the right thing to do.All of that comes from how we're modeling it—the gardener metaphor.But there's always this tension: wanting your kid to be helpful, caring, kind, and thinking you have to make them be those things instead of letting that gardener process develop.I'm on the other side of this because my kids are grownups, so I've seen it develop. One of the things I realized a couple years ago is this progression I saw with Maxine.One time we were on our way out the door. My husband happened to be leaving for work at the same time we were leaving for the school bus. Maxine was probably around seven, and I was carrying her backpack for her.My husband—who also has that individualism thing—said, “Why are you carrying her backpack? She's seven. She can carry her own backpack.”And I was like, “I know, but she likes me to carry it, and I don't mind.”And I really knew that someday she would want to carry her own backpack.Sure enough, a couple years later, she's carrying her own backpack, doesn't ask me anymore. I didn't think about it for a while.Then one day we were coming from the grocery store and had to walk a little ways with heavy groceries. She insisted on carrying all the groceries and wouldn't let me carry anything.I was like, “I can carry some groceries, honey.” And she's like, “No, Mom. I've got it.”She's carrying all the heavy groceries by herself. This full-circle moment: not only was she helping, she wanted to do it for me. She didn't want me to have to carry the heavy groceries.I just love that.Corey: Yeah. And I love when we have these conversations because sometimes it feels like a leap of faith—you don't see this modeled in society very much. It's a leap of faith to be like, “I can do these things for my children, and one day they will…”But it's not as long as people think. I'm already seeing some of that blooming with my 10-year-old.Sarah: Yeah.And Sophie in our membership shared something on our Wednesday Wins. Her kids are around 10, eight or nine, and seven. She's always followed this principle—modeling who you want your kid to be.She said she always worried, “They're never going to help.” And whenever you hear “never” and “always,” there's anxiety coming in.But she shared she had been sick and had to self-isolate. Her kids were making her food and bringing it to her. She would drive to the store, and they would go in and get the things needed.She was amazed at how they stepped up and helped her without her having to make them. They just saw that their mom needed help and were like, “We're there, Mom. What do you need?”Corey: Oh—“What do you need?” That's so sweet.Sarah: I love that.One more story: this fall, my kids are 20—Lee's going to be 25 next week—21, and 18.My husband and I were going away for the weekend, leaving Maxine home by herself. It was fall, and we have a lot of really big trees around our house, so there was major eavestroughs—gutters—cleaning to do, getting leaves off the roof and bagging all the leaves in the yard. A full-day job.My husband had been like, “I have so much work to do. I don't want to deal with that when I come home.”So I asked the boys if they could come over and the three of them could do the leaf-and-gutter job. And they were like, “Absolutely.”They surprised their dad. When we came home, they had done the entire thing. They spent a day doing all the leaves and gutter cleaning. None of them were like, “I don't want to,” or “I'm busy.” They didn't ask me to pay them—we didn't pay them. They just were like, “Sure, we'll help Dad. We know he has a lot of work right now.”I just love that.Corey: Oh, I love that. When they're so little, they can't really help take the burden off you. But knowing that one day they will—it's such a nice thing to know.Although this brings us to that good point about Hunt, Gather, Parent.Sarah: Yeah. If people haven't listened to that episode, we'll link to it in the show notes.Let's talk about some things you can do to actively practice what we're talking about—modeling who we want our kids to be.One idea is really encapsulated by Michaeleen Doucleff, who wrote Hunt, Gather, Parent. She traveled in Mexico, spent time with Mayan people, and saw kids doing household stuff without being asked—helpful, cooking, cleaning, doing laundry, taking care of younger siblings in this beautiful way that was pretty unrecognizable by North American standards.She went down and lived with them and studied what they did. She found it started with letting kids help when they were little.The two- or three-year-old who wanted to help a parent make food or do things in the garden—rather than the parents doing it without the kid around, or giving them something fake to help with, or not letting them do it—those parents let kids do it.Even if it took longer, even if the parent had to redo it later (not in front of them). They let their kids be imperfect helpers and enthusiastic helpers.That's an impulse we've all seen: kids want to help. And we often don't let them because we say they're too little or it takes too much time. And we end up thwarting that helping impulse.Then when we really want them to help—when they're actually capable—they've learned, “Helping isn't my role,” because it got shut down earlier.Corey: Exactly. And I really feel that for parents because schedules are so busy and we're so rushed.But you don't have to do this all the time. It's okay if there are sometimes where there's a crunch. Pick times when it's a little more relaxed—maybe on weekends or when you have a bit more space.Sarah: Totally.And while we're talking about helping: this comes up a lot with parents I work with and in our membership. Parents will say, “I asked my kid to set the table and they said, ‘Why do I always have to do it?'”This happened the other day with a client. I asked, “What was your child doing when you asked?” And she said, “He was snuggled up on the couch reading a book.”And I was like: I can see how that's frustrating—you could use help getting the table ready. But let's zoom out.Modeling might look like: “Okay, you're tired. You've had a long day at school. You're snuggled up reading. I'll set the table right now.”Being gracious. Even if they refuse sometimes, it's okay to do it. But also, in that specific helping piece, we can look at the times when they help without being asked.When I give parents the assignment to look for that, every parent says, “Oh, I won't find any.” And then they come back and say, “Oh, I did find times.”So when they do help—carry groceries, help a sibling—how can you make them feel good about it?“Thank you. That saved so much time.” “I was going to help your brother but my hands were full—thank you.”Pro-social behavior is reinforced when it feels good.If you want them to help more, ask: “What would you like to do to help the family team?”Not, “This is your job forever.” More like, “I've noticed setting the table isn't a great time for you. What are some other things you could take on?” And if they don't have ideas, brainstorm what's developmentally appropriate.Often there are things kids would like to do that you've just never thought of.Corey: It's true. It's kind of like how adults divide jobs at home—often according to who likes what. But with kids we think, “I should just tell them what to do, and they should just do it.”It makes sense to work with what they like.Sarah: And also the flow of the family and schedule.That's why we never had chores in the strict sense. My kids helped out, but it was never “one person's job” to do the dishwasher or take out the garbage.Because inevitably I'd need the dishwasher emptied and that person wasn't home, or they were doing homework. And if I said, “Can you do the dishwasher?” someone could say, “That's not my job—that's my brother's job.”So instead, if I needed something done, whoever was around: “Hey, can you take the garbage out?” I tried to keep it relatively equal, but it wasn't a rigid assignment. And I think that helped create the family team idea.Corey: Yes.Sarah: And that “it's someone's job” thing is that individualism again.You hear this: “Can you clean that up?” and if you haven't been modeling cleaning up messes that aren't your own, you might hear, “Well, I didn't make that mess.”But if you model: if they make a mess and you say, “Can you pick up your crayons?” and they're like, “No,” then you can say, “Okay, sure, I'll pick up the crayons for you,” and they have the experience of seeing someone clean up a mess that isn't theirs.They're more likely to absorb: “Oh, yeah, I can help with messes that aren't mine.”Corey: I've really seen this play out in my house this winter. One child loves shoveling. The second there's any snow, he's like, “Time for me to shovel.” It doesn't matter if it's early morning or dark out—he's out there shoveling.And I've been blown away, because first of all, I do not like shoveling. It's genuinely helpful.But he'll also be looking out for when the plow comes by—this doesn't happen where you live on the island, but for lots of people: the plow makes a wall at the end of the driveway. Even if you already shoveled, you have a new wall.He'll keep looking: “Just watching out for the plow.” Like a little old man. The second it happens, he's out there so everyone can leave the house as needed.And he's even admitted, “There are lots of jobs I don't like, but I really love doing this. This is something I can do for everybody.”Sarah: That's so great. That's a perfect example of letting them choose something that helps the family.In terms of flexibility—doing things for them—how have you seen that play out? Because for me, when my kids were small, they did very little. We'd do “Let's all tidy up,” but maybe they'd pick up three things and I'd pick up most of the things. We'd do a 10-minute tidy.Mostly I did dishes, setting and clearing the table, all of that. But then I found that as they got older, they just started doing it.And I never got into power struggles because, honestly, it was often easier to do it myself. Maybe that worked out because I didn't have a grand vision—I just lived it, and then I saw them grow into doing a lot as they got older.What about you? How are you seeing that balance between what you do for them and how you see them growing?Corey: I'd say this is where you really have to have faith. Something that maybe wasn't modeled for us.This comes up with clients all the time: they get anxious—“They're never going to clean up, they're never going to be helpful, they'll be entitled.” They get stuck in “never” because it's not happening right away.So when I tell people: invite them, and if they don't want to do it, say something like, “You don't want to do it this time. I'm sure you'll do it next time.”But mean it—not passive-aggressive. Not “I'm sure you'll do it next time” as a threat. Actually mean: “I'm sure you'll do it next time,” and then go about it with trust that they will eventually do it.You're holding space. You're not being anxious about it.Sarah: Yes—holding space, having faith.Corey: And I think it's giving ourselves—and the parents we work with—a permission slip.You can tidy up for them without being angry about it. If you're doing this like, “No one helps me,” that's not going to work.You have to truly trust the goodness of your children—that they'll want to be like this.Sarah: Yeah.And I think some of it comes down to how we treat other adults.If your partner normally does the dishes and says, “I'm exhausted from work,” hopefully there's give-and-take. You pick up slack when they're tired.A lot of this is: how do you want to be treated? How do you treat other adults? And how can you work on treating kids the same way?So often we don't treat kids the way we treat adults. And sometimes that's appropriate. But often it's just a lack of respect.I saw a comedy skit once where these moms were sitting around drinking wine, and at first it was normal, and then one goes to reach for the bottle and another slaps her hand: “You haven't finished what you have in your glass. Finish what you have first.”Someone interrupts, and the other says, “I was still speaking. Wait until I'm done speaking.”And you're like: oh my gosh, that's what people do to kids all the time. If you see an adult do it to another adult, it's funny—but it's also jarring because it's considered normal when people do it to kids.Kids aren't always seen as having the same rights or deserving the same respect as adults.Corey: Yes. And I think Iris Chen talks about this. You did a podcast with her back in season one—adultism.Sarah: Yes, adultism—like racism or sexism, but adultism: prioritizing adults' needs and rights over children's.Corey: And that really stood out to me. If we treat them like the beautiful little people they are—not “just children,” but people—that goes a long way in what we're talking about today.Sarah: Yeah.And the last big point is how this works with values.Corey: We hear this a lot: parents get worried about values. They really value the environment and worry their kids aren't living those values.Like a parent who was upset their kids were buying candy made with palm oil because of how it's harvested. “Why don't my kids care?”If we get preachy—“We can't buy candy with palm oil,” “We only buy thrifted clothes”—it can turn into, “You're trying to control me,” and then kids push the other way.Versus if we live those values and give them room to play with them and figure out where they land, they tend to be more open—and more interested in the why.A strange example from this weekend: I don't really like those disposable hand warmers because you can only use them once. I prefer things we can use multiple times.It was supposed to be really cold, so I was like, “Okay, I guess I'll buy them.” I didn't say anything weird about it. We used them.At the end of the day, he had to throw them out, and he goes, “I don't feel great about this. It was helpful, but I don't know if it was helpful enough that we have to throw this in the garbage now.”And I was like: that's exactly how I feel. But I didn't get preachy. He was able to think about it himself.So even with values, we live them. If kids aren't agreeing with our values, sometimes we have to give space and pull back. When someone's pushing something on you, you often feel like not complying.Sarah: Yeah. It becomes a power struggle.And I do think there's a difference between pushing and educating. You can give them information in an age-appropriate way, and you can say, “You can buy that with your own money, but I don't want to support that, so I'm not going to.”Not in a way that makes them feel terrible. Just: “These are my values.”I've said this to my kids. Maxine was maybe 14 and said, “My phone's broken. I need a new phone.”I said, “What's wrong?” She said, “My music library keeps going away and I have to download it.”I started laughing and said, “That's not enough to get a new phone.” I said, “My values are we use electronics until they're broken. We don't get a new phone because of a little glitch.”You should see our minivan—it's scraped up and old-looking. Maxine actually said we're going somewhere with her boyfriend and his mom, and she said, “Can you please ask my boyfriend's mother to drive?”I said, “Why?” And she said, “Our car is so embarrassing.”And I'm like, “It works great. We drive our cars into the ground.” That's our family value.And then last year, Maxine's phone screen actually broke. She wanted a new phone, and I said, “My values—because of e-waste—are that I'd get it fixed if I were you. But I promise I won't judge you if you want a new phone. Do what feels right for you.”No guilt-tripping. And she chose to fix the screen instead of buying a new phone.So these are examples—like your hand warmers—where we can give the information without being heavy. And they usually absorb our values over time.Corey: Because it's not just that moment—it's hundreds of interactions.And that's actually empowering: you don't need one big conversation. You get to show them these little things throughout life.Sarah: Mm-hmm.Corey: I mean, if we're talking about phones, goodness gracious—how long have I needed a new phone?Sarah: I know. I've been wanting you to get a new phone so you can post Reels for me.Corey: They're like, “Corey, maybe you've taken this too far.” But I don't know—the modeling I've given my children is that you can make a dead phone last for two extra years.Sarah: And I like your point: it's all of these interactions over and over again.The opposite of what we're talking about is you can't tell your kids not to be materialistic if you go out and buy things you don't need. You can't tell them people are more important than phones if you're on your phone all the time.You really have to think about it. That's why that “Do as I say, not as I do” sometimes gets used—because it's hard. It's hard to be the person you want your kids to be.And it keeps us honest: who do we want to be? Who do we want them to be?Corey: I mean, it's that moment when I stood there holding the shovel and I was like, “Ah. I see.”So we can see this as a beautiful thing for our own growth, too, because we're going to keep realizing how much it matters.Caveat, though: I don't want parents to listen and feel pressure—like every moment they're being watched and they must be perfect.Because this is also a chance to model messing up and making repairs. So don't take this as: you have to be perfect.Sarah: And the other thing: if you're listening and you're like, “Why do I have to do everything around here? Sarah and Corey are saying clean up your kids' messes, carry things for them, do the chores…”I'm not saying every parent should be a martyr and never get help.Remember what I said: where can your kids help? What are they already doing? What could they choose?And I think I also let a lot of stuff go. My parents once came to visit and said, “Sarah, we really admire how you choose to spend time with your kids instead of cleaning up your house.”I was like, I think that was a backhanded compliment. And also them noticing it was kind of a mess.It wasn't terrible or dirty. It was just: I didn't have a perfect house, and I did everything myself.I did a lot myself, but I didn't do all the things some people think they need to do.Corey: That totally makes sense. You're basically saying: what can you let go of, too?Sarah: Yeah. For the sake of the relationship.And I think the last thing I wanted us to talk about is: does this ever not work?You and I were thinking about objections.If you're living this way—gracious, helpful, flexible, modeling who you want them to be—you're putting deposits in the Goodwill Bank. Your connection increases. They care what you think because that Goodwill Bank is nice and beefy.The only time you could say it wouldn't work is if you didn't have a good relationship. But if you're doing all this, it builds relationship—so I don't even think you can say, “This doesn't work.”Nobody's perfect. There were plenty of times I asked my kids to do things and they were grumpy, or I had to ask 10 times. It wasn't like, “Of course, Mom, let me empty the dishwasher.” They were normal kids. But in general, if you trust the process and maturation, your kids move in that direction.Corey: I'd add one other thing: it wouldn't work if this is all you're doing, with nothing else.Sometimes people think peaceful parenting is passive, and what we're saying can sound passive: “Just be who you want them to be.”But there are also times you need to do something. Like we said: if you're being the person you want to be and they're never helping, there's also a conversation: “What do you like to do?” There are collaborative steps.This is the big philosophy—embodying who you want them to be—but there are also practical supports and conversations that help them be successful.Sarah: Totally.And the last thing is: remember this happens over time. Trust the growth process and maturation and brain development.Remember that when they're little, their agenda is not your agenda. And as they get older, they start to see the benefits: “Oh yeah, it is nice when the living room's tidied up.”When they're little, they don't have the same agenda as you. That's a lot of why you get, “No, you do it.”And I actually can't believe I didn't say this earlier, but a lot of times when we're doing things for kids, they feel it as nurturing.So sometimes when they don't want to help, it's their way of saying, “I want to make sure you're taking care of me.” Sometimes that can look like refusal or not wanting to do things themselves.Corey: Yeah, absolutely.Sarah: Thanks, Corey.Corey: Thank you. This is a public episode. If you'd like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit sarahrosensweet.substack.com/subscribe

Introducing the All Def SquADD Cast show “Versus". It's a podcast with the OG SquADD! Each week, the SquADD will debate topics and vote at the end to see what wins. Versus airs every Monday and you can download and listen wherever podcasts are found.Special GuestJordan ConelyKali ScottKhleo ThomasThis Week We DiscussLose Google vs Social MediaPopular But Never Find Love vs Ideal Marriage But PoorMichael Jackson vs PrinceS/o To Our SponorsCash AppFor a limited time, new Cash App customers can earn $10 if they use the code CASHAPP10 in their profile at signup and send $5 to a friend within 14 days.BetterHelpSign up and get 10% off at https://BetterHelp.com/SQUADDBlue ChewGet 10% off your first month of BlueChew Gold with code SQUADD. That'spromo code SQUADD.BlueChew.comGametimeDownload the Gametime app, create an account, and use code SQUADD for $20 off your first purchase. Terms apply.Download the Gametime app today!

Jurandir Filho, Felipe Mesquita, Evandro de Freitas e Bruno Carvalho batem um papo sobre dois titãs dos jogos de luta: "Street Fighter" e "Mortal Kombat". Apesar de pertencerem ao mesmo gênero, eles tem filosofias bem diferentes, quase como dois jeitos opostos de entender um bom game de porradaria."Street Fighter" (Capcom, Japão) nasceu nos Arcades no fim dos anos 80 e ajudou a definir as regras dos jogos de luta modernos. Ele é mais técnico, focado em precisão, leitura do adversário e domínio de comandos. Já "Mortal Kombat" (Midway / NetherRealm, EUA) surgiu no começo dos anos 90 com a intenção de quebrar padrões: personagens digitalizados, violência explícita e um tom mais sombrio e cinematográfico. Considerando as duas franquias, quem se saiu melhor? Na geração 16bits quem dominou? Quem tem os personagems mais icônicos? Qual a melhor trilha sonora? Como jogo, quem fez melhor no passar dos anos?Essa é mais uma edição da série Versus!=- MAIS DESCONTO NA ALURA | Estude na Alura, a maior escola de tecnologia on-line do Brasil! Acesse o nosso link e ganhe 26% de desconto na matrícula! https://alura.com.br/99vidas

Retirement isn't just a financial equation—it's an identity shift. In this recap, Lesley Logan and Brad Crowell reflect on the conversation with wealth advisor and researcher Gregg Lunceford, who challenges the traditional retirement model by focusing on identity, purpose, and emotional readiness. They explore why longer lifespans have reshaped retirement entirely and why high performers often struggle most when their job no longer defines them. Whether listeners are 25 or 65, this conversation reframes what freedom after work can truly look like. If you have any questions about this episode or want to get some of the resources we mentioned, head over to LesleyLogan.co/podcast https://lesleylogan.co/podcast/. If you have any comments or questions about the Be It pod shoot us a message at beit@lesleylogan.co mailto:beit@lesleylogan.co. And as always, if you're enjoying the show please share it with someone who you think would enjoy it as well. It is your continued support that will help us continue to help others. Thank you so much! Never miss another show by subscribing at LesleyLogan.co/subscribe https://lesleylogan.co/podcast/#follow-subscribe-free.In this episode you will learn about:How increased longevity has made traditional pension models obsolete.The reality of the 20-year life bonus after your career ends.Why high achievers struggle to uncover a non-work identity.How intentional communities support mental and emotional well-being.The importance of creating a shared retirement vision as a couple.Episode References/Links:Agency Mini - https://prfit.biz/miniContrology Pilates Conference in Poland - https://xxll.co/polandContrology Pilates Conference in Brussels - https://xxll.co/brusselsPOT in London - https://xxll.co/potSpring Training: How To Get Overhead - https://opc.me/eventsSubmit your wins or questions - https://beitpod.com/questionsThe Seeing Eye - https://seeingeye.orgMesirow Wealth Management - https://www.mesirow.comGregg Lunceford on LinkedIn - https://beitpod.com/greggluncefordExit From Work - https://a.co/d/fR25gH2 If you enjoyed this episode, make sure and give us a five star rating and leave us a review on iTunes, Podcast Addict, Podchaser or Castbox. https://lovethepodcast.com/BITYSIDEALS! DEALS! DEALS! DEALS! https://onlinepilatesclasses.com/memberships/perks/#equipmentCheck out all our Preferred Vendors & Special Deals from Clair Sparrow, Sensate, Lyfefuel BeeKeeper's Naturals, Sauna Space, HigherDose, AG1 and ToeSox https://onlinepilatesclasses.com/memberships/perks/#equipmentBe in the know with all the workshops at OPC https://workshops.onlinepilatesclasses.com/lp-workshop-waitlistBe It Till You See It Podcast Survey https://pod.lesleylogan.co/be-it-podcasts-surveyBe a part of Lesley's Pilates Mentorship https://lesleylogan.co/elevate/FREE Ditching Busy Webinar https://ditchingbusy.com/Resources:Watch the Be It Till You See It podcast on YouTube! https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCq08HES7xLMvVa3Fy5DR8-gLesley Logan website https://lesleylogan.co/Be It Till You See It Podcast https://lesleylogan.co/podcast/Online Pilates Classes by Lesley Logan https://onlinepilatesclasses.com/Online Pilates Classes by Lesley Logan on YouTube https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCjogqXLnfyhS5VlU4rdzlnQProfitable Pilates https://profitablepilates.com/about/Follow Us on Social Media:Instagram https://www.instagram.com/lesley.logan/The Be It Till You See It Podcast YouTube channel https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCq08HES7xLMvVa3Fy5DR8-gFacebook https://www.facebook.com/llogan.pilatesLinkedIn https://www.linkedin.com/in/lesley-logan/The OPC YouTube Channel https://www.youtube.com/@OnlinePilatesClasses Episode Transcript:Brad Crowell 0:01  He was talking about football players, and he was talking about people who have, you know, high performance people who make a shitload of money, and then they retire and they, he said, they burn through a lot of money trying to figure out who they are.Lesley Logan 0:17  Welcome to the Be It Till You See It podcast where we talk about taking messy action, knowing that perfect is boring. I'm Lesley Logan, Pilates instructor and fitness business coach. I've trained thousands of people around the world and the number one thing I see stopping people from achieving anything is self-doubt. My friends, action brings clarity and it's the antidote to fear. Each week, my guest will bring bold, executable, intrinsic and targeted steps that you can use to put yourself first and Be It Till You See It. It's a practice, not a perfect. Let's get started. Brad Crowell 1:01  Take it away. Lesley Logan 1:03  Welcome back to the Be It Till You See It interview recap where my co-host in life, Brad, and I are going to dig into the trailblazing, trail, trailblazing. Brad Crowell 1:12  Wanna try that again?Lesley Logan 1:16  Welcome back to the Be It Till You See It interview recap where my co-host in life, don't laugh at me. I don't want to start again. Brad Crowell 1:22  No. The Welcome back was perfect. It was amazing. Lesley Logan 1:25  Welcome back to the Be It Till You See It interview recap where my co-host in life, Brad, and I are going to dig into the trailblazing convo I have with Gregg Lunceford in our last episode. If you haven't yet listened to that interview, you fucked up. It's so good. Brad Crowell 1:41  It's a great interview. Lesley Logan 1:42  He's a great educator. He blew my mind.Brad Crowell 1:46  So inspirational. Lesley Logan 1:47  Yeah.Brad Crowell 1:48  You actually, literally said my internal dialog out loud to him towards the end of the interview, because you were like, yeah, after listening to you, I'm so excited for this next chapter of my life. And I was like me too. It was amazing.Lesley Logan 2:06  I know, I know, I, your parents need to listen to this stat. Brad Crowell 2:10  Yeah, he's a badass. Lesley Logan 2:11  So anyways, they won't even be out, and they're making decisions right now, maybe we have to get them an episode early. Okay, so you can come back and listen to it later. You can finish this and you can listen to that one, or I gotta finish the script. You can listen to this one, or you can listen to that one first, whichever you want to do. But just you gotta listen.Brad Crowell 2:28  You did not have to finish the script. You can just let it go. Lesley Logan 2:32  I could also just close the loop on that. Brad Crowell 2:35  That was the only loop that you know. Lesley Logan 2:37  Well, you know what, Sir. Brad Crowell 2:40  Today is January 29th.Lesley Logan 2:42  It's just after my birthday. You can still wish me a happy birthday. It's the anniversary to celebrate Seeing Eye Guide Dogs. So the Seeing Eye Guide Dog Anniversary is an appreciation for all the dogs who act as their owners' eyes and ears. The devotion and taught abilities of these particular canines keep them safe and enable them to operate as a fully functional persons. The day is meant to recognize a school that educates them. Seeing eye dogs go through extensive training to be able to, say, safely traverse the environment and all of its hazards for their person. That's why they're so worthy of this recognition. Okay, so I don't have a seeing eye dog. Obviously, we don't know anyone who in our life who has a seeing eye dog, but I have watched the dog who could tell a girl was about to have a seizure before she had it, and then opened the fridge and pulled out her medicine and gave it to her while she was having this like seizure. Brad Crowell 3:37  That's crazy. Lesley Logan 3:38  Crazy. And I have met people with dogs who can sense if they're about to have, like, an insulin situation, because they have some, like, a type of insulin diabetes where, like, it can change really drastically. I have definitely seen people with seeing eye dogs, and I'm so impressed. And so really, the rest of the days sucked. And this is the best one of all the choices. Brad Crowell 4:00  I like this one, though. Lesley Logan 4:01  I really like this one, because here's the deal. Brad Crowell 4:03  So the organization is actually called The Seeing Eye. Lesley Logan 4:06  Oh. Brad Crowell 4:07  Yeah. And I, I'm just realizing that as well. Lesley Logan 4:10  Okay, well, they got up, they didn't pay for the sponsorship, because they're doing great work out there for people who need it. Brad Crowell 4:14  It's a guide dog school. Lesley Logan 4:16  And I am just kind of obsessed with this. And so if this inspired you in any way you should go donate money to your local no kill animal shelter, because while those dogs won't be a seeing eye dog or a service dog, they certainly need your help. This is really or you could donate to your seeing eye dog school if they need the money like you never know. You might your life could change. You might need a dog that's a service animal. So I just was, you know, anything to help raise money and thoughts about, please don't buy a puppy. Go get go adopt an animal. They have puppies too. Brad Crowell 4:48  You know what is amazing. I'm reading about the school, and I think that my elementary school teacher went to the school, because when we were in school, she somehow lost her vision, and I remember she.Lesley Logan 5:07  You were taught by someone who couldn't see?Brad Crowell 5:10  No, when I was taught by her, she could. But then, like in a year or two later, when I was like, in fourth or fifth grade, we we found out that she lost her vision, and I remember her going to Braille school. And I'm pretty sure she went to seeing eye dog school. Lesley Logan 5:25  That's so cool. Brad Crowell 5:26  Because think about it, if you're like, you know, 5060, years old, and you've never worked with a dog before like that, how would you even know how?Lesley Logan 5:34  Yeah, no, you have to get trained. Okay? But now this opens up a whole thing. So then she couldn't do the thing that she loved to do. She couldn't teach anymore. Brad Crowell 5:41  I'm pretty sure she retired. Lesley Logan 5:43  Oh, that's such a. So wait, this sucks. If you're blind, what are your jobs? You could be a phone sex operator.Brad Crowell 5:52  Yes, you could be a phone sex operator. That's not what I was gonna go, but yeah, you could do that, but.Lesley Logan 5:56  But you can make a lot of money doing this. You could do you could be a 900 psychic.Brad Crowell 6:01  You could be a 900 psychic, or you could just talk on the phone, too.Lesley Logan 6:05  Yeah, yeah. With technology today, I think they probably have more options, but I just realized, like, that would suck, like, all of a sudden she can't teach anymore. What if she couldn't even retire?Brad Crowell 6:15  No, it's, it's very traumatic, you know? I mean, we have a close friend of ours whose husband was, he has a, like a degenerative disease that didn't strike until he was in his, you know, midlife.Lesley Logan 6:31  We do? Brad Crowell 6:32  We do. Lesley Logan 6:33  Oh, is it blind, is he going blind? Brad Crowell 6:35  No, but, but the idea of being able, of being an abled body and then all of a sudden, everything that was quote, unquote normal for you is no longer an option. And that scares, that scares me.Lesley Logan 6:49  Scares the hell out of me. But, okay, Dark tangent, dark comedy tangent. Okay, I think it was the French, it was a European commercial. Do you remember this thing? It came through at my Instagram, and this, like, got this woman and this guy, like, wake up on a couch. They like, had, you know, obviously had sex last night, and like, they woke on the couch, and he's like, no, I gotta go. She's like, you could stay. And then, like, he is, like, getting up, and he like, puts himself in his wheelchair. And then this guy opens up the door to the apartment, and he's like, what's going on here? And so clearly, the woman was cheating on her partner, and the whole thing was like, what, like, you know, just maybe think before you park in someone else's spot, or like using the bathroom, or like using the handicap parking and using the handicapped bathroom, and it I died laughing. I cried laughing because, like, what a great way to get people to go. Oh, I'm fucking using that restroom, or I've never parked in those spots because in LA, one of my girlfriends was just parked there to take a phone call and she got a ticket. Don't do it, guys, they don't care if you don't leave the car. Don't do it. It's for someone else. It is someone else's spot. But just made me laugh. I know this is all about seeing eye dogs, and I thought it was a great advertisement for not being a dickhead.Brad Crowell 8:08  Well, what a fun turn this took. Lesley Logan 8:10  Okay. Well, everyone, look, you, your life could change in an instant. So if there is a charity in your area that is helping people get service animals into the hands of people that need it, this is their I'm sponsoring an ad for them. Go give them some money. Give them some time. Brad Crowell 8:27  Participate. Lesley Logan 8:27  Yeah, you never know. Maybe you could become a really good trainer for one of these dogs. You don't know. You know, they people in prison are training some of these dogs so there's great work going out there. So everyone needs a hobby. This could be yours. Brad Crowell 8:39  I love it. Lesley Logan 8:40  All right, you guys, we are home. Brad Crowell 8:43  Yeah, we are, we are. Lesley Logan 8:44  I know where we are in the world. We are home. Brad Crowell 8:47  We are officially home. And last week was Lesley's birthday. Lesley Logan 8:52  Was fabulous. Brad Crowell 8:52  It was fabuloso.Lesley Logan 8:53  It was so fun. I think it's my new theme every year. I don't know. I'll probably change it next time. I'm an Aquarius, who knows, whatever. But it was great. 43 it's looking good, and we're getting ready for Agency Mini, which is next month. Lesley Logan 9:06  Yes, February. Agency Mini, in fact, it's a good chance it's on early bird right now, to be honest. Brad Crowell 9:11  Could be, could be, yeah. Lesley Logan 9:13  Yeah, possible. prfit.biz/mini is where you're gonna go. It's for Pilates instructors or studio owners who work for themselves or want to work for themselves.Brad Crowell 9:21  Yeah, that's profit without the O dot biz slash mini, prfit.biz/mini.Lesley Logan 9:26  And we are getting ready. Brad has never been to Poland. Brad Crowell 9:30  First time. Lesley Logan 9:31  And we have never been to Brussels. And we'll be with Karen Frischmann. And then we're gonna do a second honeymoon, because why not? And then we're going to be in London. So if you want to see us in Europe, it's the only time in 2026 we're going to be in Europe. xxll.co/poland gets you the Poland information xxll.co/brussels gets you Brussels information, and xxll.co/pot will take you to the London information and. Brad Crowell 10:00  Yeah, come hang out. It'd be so fun to meet in person. Lesley Logan 10:02  Oh my gosh. It'd be so fun. And as of right now, our 2027 calendar does not have anything in it, and it may stay that way. We don't know yet. I don't know. So if you want to see us in Europe, this is it.Brad Crowell 10:16  Sounds good to me. I was gonna say maybe Greece, but we're not sure.Lesley Logan 10:19  We're waiting. We're still at the moment of this recording, which is November of 2025 we think we have an invitation to Greece, and we're just waiting for the dates.Brad Crowell 10:30  We shall see. Anyway, in May, for all of those who aren't in Europe, join us virtually, we're going to do another spring training event with onlinepilatesclasses.com. If you were with us last year, two years ago, we did a summer, summer camp. Last year, we did a spring training we loved the spring training vibes, so we're doing that one again. We're going to do that event again, but the topic is going to be totally different. We're going to do how to get overhead. So it's going to include all of those kinds of exercises where you're upside down and, you know, breaking it down for you, making it feel a little more accessible and safe and all those kinds of things. To get on the wait list for that and get the more information as it as we start releasing it, go to opc.me/events, opc.me/events, and you'll be able to stay in the loop. Oh yeah. Brad Crowell 11:18  So today, we had a question, except we're going to change up our question. Normally, we, we get, we get tons and tons of questions. If they're a business question, we usually answer them in our coaching group, Agency. It's from Profitable Pilates, our coaching group, and but this time, what we thought we would do is just ask a few of the questions so you can kind of see if any of these are resonating with you, and see you know, like, how do we tackle, like, how is it that we support the studio owners and teachers that are inside of Agency? So for, for example, we have, we have a recent one that just got submitted. It said, hey, how much notice should I give that client give my clients about my rate increase?Lesley Logan 12:02  No more than 30 days. You can go as low as three days, but no more than 30 days. I've had Mini people do two weeks. It really kind of depends on, you know, if you're doing a $2 rate increase, you can do that next week. You know, it's not a big deal. Doing a $25 rate increase per session. You might want to give them 30 days notice. But we actually also have a course that tells you exactly how to raise those rates and how to actually how to give the people the notice you're going to give so you don't get you're going to have people who have no filter, and they don't realize what they're saying out loud to you can feel personal. It's not, but yeah, but yeah, that's what I would say.Brad Crowell 12:38  I mean. We've got a lot of different tools to support specifically, like, how much should you be raising rates and why? Why are we doing it this way, instead of it just being a random number out there. So if you're ever wondering, like, am I charging enough? That's why people join Agency, we get to dig into these questions with you. Kind of break down some numbers, think about it, logically, all that kind of stuff. Another question for you is, I'm thinking of changing my currently, I sell packages. I'm thinking to change to an auto renew subscription. So instead of selling a 10 pack, you get 10 classes a month or something. I'm assuming that's what it is. Lesley Logan 13:15  Yeah. I don't mind if it's a limited Okay. Brad Crowell 13:17  Yeah but how do I do this without being too wordy? How do I communicate the change to my clients?Lesley Logan 13:21  You're gonna have to have a contract. First and foremost, you, this is a auto renew, and the FCC, I believe, put some stuff in place recently. Look, it could have changed. Brad Crowell 13:32  They took it away. Lesley Logan 13:33  They might have taken it away. Brad Crowell 13:34  Click to click to cancel, or it's already it's already trashed. Yeah, they did. Lesley Logan 13:38  Fuck those people. Anyways, okay, so guess what? No one's fucking regulating. You can do what you want, but reviews still stand. And so if you would like to what I always believe is go back to your values. We have a course on your values. But I have, I have, if this was an office hours call, I could ask a couple of follow up questions about the person, because I have some reasons for not doing an auto renew. Meaning, if you are a solo teacher, I'm going to say no auto renew for you. What happens if you get sick? What about your vacations? There are ways to set packages up so they almost feel like an auto renew, but you actually don't owe people anything if you get sick or if you go on vacation, if you do an auto renew, you actually owe them whatever the contract states.Brad Crowell 14:16  Right, because, what if you're out of town for two weeks and they're like, well, I didn't get my 10 classes, what do we do then?Lesley Logan 14:21  And then they were out they were out of town the other two weeks. And then you also have to figure out with your scheduling tool, can it handle this? Can it handle this feature you want to change it to? If it does handle it, how easily is it to stop it and start it? Some people want to have 90-day contracts on these auto renews and then a 30-day notice. These are all things you have to talk about with a lawyer, but we can actually talk about that together in Agency, our office hours or coaching call to really make sure what's going to work best for you. And then, and then, if you are a studio with multiple teachers, what are the breaks you want to have? And then, why are you doing this? So the other question like, how do you communicate it? It kind of depends on what your values are and what the benefit are that you're trying to say, for example, if you're trying to say that our auto renew is great ease and consistency, plus our number one priority, which is community, then you would actually make it really easy for people to be on auto renew and really hard to be on a package, right? Because packages are more convenient for the person who owns a package, because they can decide when and if they want to use it and auto renew, they have to use it. And then what you need to understand about auto renews is it's another way of saying membership and once you have memberships, you have churn, and you will actually, you might be surprised how much churn you have with auto renews versus people with packages. Because I don't love to be on auto renews with places, because I travel so much, so I might not choose a place that forced me on auto renew or charges me more to be on a package. Now I might not be your client, so it doesn't matter. I don't want to scare you, but these are the things you have to think about. And where, in Agency, we actually coach you on it, because we don't do templates. What works for Brad's studio for auto renews is not going to work for Katie's or Georgia's, right? Like, we have to actually look at like, how many people are on the team? What is the goal of the studio? What are you what are the services under that? Because don't, don't get me started when I see I have to have a membership for mat and I have to have membership for a reformer, and I get mad about that.Brad Crowell 16:18  Now, that's too many options. People don't know what to do. Lesley Logan 16:20  And then they have to think about it. Brad Crowell 16:21  Well then, they just do nothing.Lesley Logan 16:22  Yeah, and so you just have to know, like, yes, it looks like that's how businesses are making money right now with all these auto renews. I'm telling you right now that bubble is popping. We are watching class-based studios lose clients who are middle class a lot faster than you think. And so there's reasons to explore what the options are. What's your purpose for running this change? Like, what? How is this easier for you? Do you think it's to have predictable income? What's in it for them? And then that's how we sell it to them? We have to sell it to them on how it's in it for them, they don't give a fuck about what's in it for you. I mean, they don't not give a fuck but they don't.Brad Crowell 16:57  You're right, like, really, that's not their concern, and it shouldn't be, right? No, so well anyway. So this is the kind of conversations that we get to have over at, in Agency, our fitness business coaching. So whether you're doing yoga or pilates or, I mean, we've had people in there who are we've had a chiropractor in there. We've had a doula in there. We've had bar boxing, whatever. So obviously the majority of our audience is Pilates. So that's primarily what we're discussing over there. But in the service-based industry, we we love doing this. We've been doing it for eight years now. So yeah, if you're interested in more information about that, just reach out to us or go to profitablepilates.com, and you can find out about the coaching over there, but. Lesley Logan 17:37  Join Mini. Do the Mini thing. Brad Crowell 17:38  Oh, join Agency Mini, yeah, go to prfit.biz/mini prfit.biz/mini.Lesley Logan 17:45  If you can sign up right now, it's $25 if it's on early bird, it's $65 if it's not, oh my God, for three days of coaching, change your life. Brad Crowell 17:52  Yeah. 100%. I love it. Well, thanks for joining us down that. If you have a question for the pod or question for Lesley or me, just text us, 310-905-5534, or submit a question at beitpod.com/questions and you can leave us both a win where we'll we'll probably weave that into our Fuck Yeah Friday episodes or you can submit a question, which we can do on our Thursdays. So stick around. We'll be right back. We're gonna dig into this amazing convo that Lesley had with Gregg Lunceford. Brad Crowell 18:21  Okay, let's talk about Gregg Lunceford. Gregg Lunceford spent more than three decades in financial services as a wealth advisor at Mesirow in Chicago. I'm sure I'm saying that wrong. He said it twice, and I was I wasn't sure. But anyway, alongside his advisory work, he's an academic researcher whose PhD studies at Case Western Reserve University, focused on the social, emotional and financial realities of today's retirement transition. And this was so interesting to me, y'all.Lesley Logan 18:50  Fascinating, fascinating. So.Brad Crowell 18:53  His curiosity about why even high, highly successful professionals hesitate to retire led him to explore how identity, purpose and well being shape this stage of our lives. And he's like part historian too, right? So he's also the author of Exit From Work, and he writes about his journey and insights into retirement. So, but I, I really enjoyed him breaking down just the different stages of our lives. And also, like, he's comparing generations. Lesley Logan 19:24  Oh, yeah. Brad Crowell 19:25  And like, how they got to where they are, and like, retirement package stuff that is not even an option for us. Lesley Logan 19:32  Let's just talk about, like, let's get more specific what the episode is about, just in case I haven't heard it. So we were talking about retirement attitude, in a sense, like in that, you know, the way my grandparents retired. I to this day, I'm shocked they retired. I didn't know they had money to retire. They didn't look like they saved anything, but like they're, you know, one, one side saved everything. It came out of the Depression. The other side could have been their children. So very different life. They're very young, and so they, like I, I have one set of grandparents who were retired when I was born, and I had another set of grandparents that worked the whole for a while when I was alive, right? And then they all had a pension, and then they just and then they just retired and got paid to be not working, right?Brad Crowell 20:18  What I think, what I think is amazing is Gregg's analysis, and I'm sure this is well documented now, but, but his analysis of life expectancy shot everything in the foot. Lesley Logan 20:30  Right. Brad Crowell 20:30  He said our grandparents' generation, and to some extent, maybe our parents' generation, the pension game, the reality is that people weren't living to be 70, 80, 90 years old. They were only living 60, 70, years and so if you're working until you're 55 and then they have to pay you out for a decade more before you're done, then. Lesley Logan 20:55  It's not that much money. Brad Crowell 20:55  Wasn't that big of a deal but when you're living till you're 80, all of a sudden the companies were like, this is a massive burden for us. We can't, we can't do this. And so then what? The retirement age got older, the pension packages started getting slimmer, all that kind of stuff. So like, when we look at our grandparents and they had just like, you said, how was it possible that they could even retire? It didn't make any sense.Lesley Logan 21:17  They always they had actually had money to give when they died. I was like, what? They had, they had money? So, so the thing that was really fun with Gregg is that, like he, you know, we got into this more deeply in the episode. It's worth listening to. But like during the 2008 recession, companies were trying to just fire everybody. And so they were trying to go, here's the money. All I do is take this amazing package, and people weren't doing it, and it's because it was emotional, like it wasn't just knowing the number, which is like, what the ads would say. It was like, who am I if I'm not doing this? And like, you know some, I worry about, like, like, your parents have worked, your dad's worked for a company for 40 something years. Brad Crowell 22:02  41 or 42 years, yeah. Lesley Logan 22:04  Well, you're 43. So, so and so he's gonna retire, right? And it's like, does he know what to do? Does he know what he's gonna do? Brad Crowell 22:13  It's so funny because, and also, he probably could have retired. No, no, he they could have, I think financially, they could have retired a while back. But again, I think you're right on the money. It's not, it's actually an identity, right. It's a it's the way that you see. It's how you define who you are.Lesley Logan 22:32  Well, and he's so, so, so Gregg, our genius that we interviewed, he said, you we now have a 20 year life bonus, where you get to define who and what you want to be, because you have your first 20 years getting 20-ish years getting educated. Then you have 20 something, well, Andrew advocates 40 something years that you're working, but then you probably have another 20 plus years to be anything you want. Brad Crowell 22:58  Yeah, because he was talking about the bucket list where people are, like, I'm old and decrepit, but I want to go see Niagara Falls, right? And basically, now today, because the quality of life is so much better, you're still active and able to do life normally, you know, well into your 70s and maybe even 80s, until you're willing to slow down so at that point. But like, so, so then your bucket list is a bit different, because, like, okay, you can probably travel, travel, travel, travel for five or 10 years. I mean, my grandparents did this. They bought a they bought an RV, yeah, and for a decade, they drove around the United States, for a decade, but they eventually got bored of it, and then they came home and they still lived for another 20 years, you know? So it's like, okay, so the bucket list thing, if that, if, if people aren't looking at the end of life as like, I gotta finally have a good time. Now, what Gregg is saying is, like, you could flip this on its head entirely.Lesley Logan 23:55  Yeah. Well, he, he emphasized that today's retirees have more personal freedom than previous generations. And you're probably like, Lesley, why are we talking about retiring? We're still going to be it until we see it. Because be it till you see it changes. It changes all the time. And also, if you are not considering what you want to do on the other side of whatever it is you're doing, I don't care how much you love it. I fucking love what I do, and I dream of exiting stage left all the time. And it's not because.Brad Crowell 24:19  She, this is what I hear around our house. I can't wait to be the person that people go who is she again and and she's like, something to do with Pilates, I don't know.Lesley Logan 24:31  Yeah, like, so there's a line in Notting Hill where Julia Roberts' character says, like, she, she says it in like, not a, not the nicest way about herself, but like, people are gonna look at her, like, as this person who was once famous for a while. And I see it as, like, a complete amazing thing where it's just like, someday it'll be like that, oh, that's that person who she was kind of known in her industry for a little bit, and it's like, yeah, she's not like, I like, I was once famous for a little bit in a small part of the world, and now I can move like, because why not? It doesn't mean I don't love what I do. And by the way, like, please don't freak out. No one freak out. Your memberships are fine. I'm not going anywhere. You got to tell people this, Brad, you got to make sure they know. We are currently creating two other things right now so no one I'm not going anywhere, but I do constantly think about I want to be able to retire when I have my faculties, to travel the world, to go to Antarctica, to do different things, I don't want to be in my 70s going, okay, now I'm hanging my hat up. No, I want to know who you and I are on the other side of working together like I there's these other things. And so I wanted to have Gregg on because when he told me what he did, I was like, fuck yeah. It doesn't matter how old you are listening to this, you can take some time to think about what is the freedom I want to have in this extra bonus of life I get. Your grandparents didn't get it. None of mine did. They all died young so. Brad Crowell 25:58  Yeah, the the I think it's, I think it's, I think it's just really interesting to look at the the shift of things, right? There's so many factors that that made the Baby Boomer, Boomer generation, like, pretty epic.Lesley Logan 26:12  Man, they don't know how good a ride they had. Brad Crowell 26:14  Yeah, and the wealth that they were able to build without, like, realizing it, and all that stuff has, that whole flow has shifted completely, you know, and so it's interesting, though, because life expectancy is longer, and I just, I just love that. So I think that really shifts into what I what I loved about he was talking about, he said something that I found intriguing. He was talking about football players, and he was talking about people who have high performance people, or make a shitload of money, and then they retire, and they, he said, they burn through a lot of money trying to figure out who they are.Lesley Logan 26:54  Yeah, this blew my mind too, because it's like, oh, hold on you. You have the money, but you don't know what you're gonna do with it yet.Brad Crowell 27:01  Well, or it's not. Lesley Logan 27:03  Or who you are with it. Brad Crowell 27:04  That's what I was gonna say. It's not even, it's not even what they're gonna do with it yet. It's they're trying to find themselves because they've been defining themselves.Lesley Logan 27:12  They weren't listening to this podcast. Every single person tells people to get to know who they are. Brad Crowell 27:16  Yeah, but they've been defining themselves by their job for 40 years. So then what happens when you're no longer able to define yourself? I know what this is like, because when I moved to Los Angeles, I was there to do music, and after two years, only two years of being there, so I'm like, 25 right? I am die hard into this band. We are doing everything and anything we can to make this band go and then the singer of the band is like, I'm going to grad school. And he quit. And he was like, my partner in this band. And I was like, what the hell man? Like, why did I come all the way out to Los Angeles to do this. What, to do what? What am I gonna do?Lesley Logan 27:55  Because you're gonna meet me. But that's okay. You didn't know that yet. Brad Crowell 27:58  No, I did not know that yet. It was down the road. So, so I was really I was depressed, I was angry, I was confused. I didn't really know how to I didn't know what I was going to go do. I still knew I wanted to do music, but I but what ended up happening was I really got into motorcycles, like really got into motorcycles, and that became kind of how I defined myself. It was how I I changed the way I dressed. I literally rode a motorcycle every day. I joined a motorcycle club. I would ride all over Southern California, you know. And so suddenly that became my identity. And it wasn't until I was networking and met some more people in music that I began to shift back into the music kind of things. But like, yeah, for sure, I can understand how people would be like, well, I used to be blah, blah, blah, whatever, and now I'm no longer so what am I?Lesley Logan 28:46  It's so easy to blow through money to figure out who you are. There's people who join Pilates training programs at 60 because they're like, oh, I think I want to do this, but it's like, eight grand, right? Well, what if you don't? Then people feel like, oh, I just wasted all that money. And then they do something they don't want to do with it, or, or they just keep trying out different things. And like, now they've got this now. They bought a kayak, then they bought the ski doo, and then they bought the boat, and they're trying to be retired first. And so, yeah, I think so, I think it's really easy because they don't know who they are. And that's Gregg's whole thing. They you have to know who you want to be.Brad Crowell 29:19  Yeah, he said many people who spent life meeting obligations are now suddenly confronted with, who do I actually want to be? Right? Who do I actually want to be? And he said, if you go into that blindly, you start chasing quick hits to replace the accolades of a job. You know, the team mentality, the psychological part of success, when you achieve a goal, you know, and basically it can feel very scattered. And he said, so what we should be doing is preparing what he calls a retirement identity. A retirement identity. And he said, instead of trying to figure it out when you get there, what if you started processing that now? And I thought, man, that's really interesting, because that's always been a question for me. You know, like, I asked your dad one time, what's it like to be retired? And he goes, I don't know. man, I've been retired since my 50s.Lesley Logan 30:16  Yeah. He's been retired for a long time. So, like, we're gonna live in Mexico and become tequila smallies. I've already figured this out. Brad Crowell 30:22  I love it. I love everything about that. I think that's brilliant, but, but also, he said there was other he said there was other options too. What did he call it the barista? Oh, no, no, that was the last week barista retired, where she was talking about, you know, getting a part time job. She called it barista retired. I think? Lesley Logan 30:41  Oh, I think so, but I. Brad Crowell 30:43  You know, like, and that's what your dad's doing now. And why is he doing that now? Because he doesn't want to sit around and watch a television all day. He wants to get up and be active. Lesley Logan 30:50  Yeah, there's, there's great. There's, he's a, he's a, he's a crossing guard now, he fucking loves that.Brad Crowell 30:57  Gregg was talking about, like he works with these clients who are looking towards retirement, and he helps them sculpt these packages, which are really clever, right? Because it shifts your focus of purpose in the job. If your job has been to manage a team of 50 people, now you might be training your replacement person for a year or two before you shift into part time. And you just do it, because you can do it from wherever you need to be and whatever. You know, lots of options.Lesley Logan 31:24  I am obsessed I'm obsessed with this whole thing because, like, everyone wants to know, like, how much money do you need to live off of? Like, that we even our lovely wealth people were like, how much money do you want to live off of when you retire? And we were like, we don't want to worry about money. That was our answer. Because I want to live in an Airstream sipping tequila. And, you know, coming back home here when the weather is good, and then, I don't know, we have a house in Cambodia, there's a I want to see the world. So we had that, but we no one was like, what is your retirement persona? Brad Crowell 31:54  Yeah, how do you, how do you imagine spending your time participating in the world, you know, as a retired person? Lesley Logan 32:02  I mean exactly. Brad Crowell 32:03  Is your goal to watch every movie in the last blockbuster? Maybe you shouldn't do that.Lesley Logan 32:09  We might have to talk about having different lives. Visit you. Brad Crowell 32:17  Actually, it's funny that you say that. He said, a lot of couples don't talk about this, and they see, I, you know, they see themselves retiring in different ways. It's not something that they've actually discussed. Interesting.Lesley Logan 32:28  Well, and you know what? Maybe I have to if there's an expert listening who does graduated marriages, I would love to have you on because that's what they're called. They're called graduated marriages, where you love the person you're married to. You don't want to cheat on them. You don't want to be married to someone else, but you would like to have some people just do a separate room. Some people have a separate house, like they live in a different place because they want to live over there. Clearly, that doesn't work for us, because I would get lost, but. Brad Crowell 32:57  Fascinating. Lesley Logan 32:58  It's fascinating, you know, like, I mean, you know, there's this one podcast I listened to, and she is been working. She still has her company. She's working. She works like a dog. She's got a really successful podcast, and she wants to travel with that podcast, and her current successful company is something that she can travel with, and her husband can't, and she's like, I love you, and you can visit me. I want to live for this many months in this state. I've never lived there. I want to live there. I want to feel what it's like. And so she got an apartment, and he is visiting her every other weekend. That's cool. And, you know what, maybe it spices things up. I'm not saying that, but that's the thing. But like, I do think that if you're in a relationship and you haven't thought about retirement together, may this be your assignment, you should contact Gregg and or.Brad Crowell 33:42  Or have a conversation with your partner. Lesley Logan 33:43  And if you're solo, yeah, yeah. And if you're solo, then if you haven't thought about this, you should, because otherwise you're just focusing on dollars. And that's where I think people get obsessed about what the stock market is doing, because you're not actually thinking of how it affects the person you want to be. And you get a little weird about it. And we have an episode with Wealth with Tess coming back on when it comes to, like, the stock and our numbers and all that stuff, and this uncertain time. But I just think that this is a way cooler.Brad Crowell 34:08  You're totally, you're totally right, because it does just become about like this, like, mad, mad. Like, focus on stashing cash, kind of the markets or whatever.Lesley Logan 34:18  Well, and there's much fear around that. And then it's like, but then who are you right? Like, I'm just obsessed. Brad Crowell 34:22  Exactly that doesn't actually address anything that Gregg is talking about here with your retirement identity. Lesley Logan 34:28  I can tell you right now.Brad Crowell 34:29  Your retirement identity is not a bank account number.Lesley Logan 34:31  He is the only person talking about this. I haven't heard anyone else talk about this. I haven't had anyone else to talk about this. And I am like, this is the stand still, like, number one retirement episode we'll ever have like I'm saying here today.Brad Crowell 34:43  Yeah, it's great. It's awesome. Well, love it. Stick around. We'll be right back. We're gonna dig into some Be It Action Items that we got from Gregg Lunceford. Brad Crowell 34:55  All right, so finally, welcome back. Let's talk about those Be It Action Items. What bold, executable, intrinsic or targeted action items can we take away from your conversation with Mr. Gregg Lunceford. Lesley Logan 35:07  You go first. Brad Crowell 35:10  All right. He said in the planning process of your ideal self, this retirement identity that we've been talking about, he said, what you also have to learn how to do is to replace kinship with friendships, kinship with friendships, which I think is kind of cool. He said today we don't have kinship the way we once did, because families are smaller and they are spread out, right? And also we're not necessarily going into the office to have. Lesley Logan 35:39  Oh, we talked about the Golden Girls. Brad Crowell 35:40  Yeah, you did. Lesley Logan 35:41  Okay,so. Brad Crowell 35:42  Talked about the Golden Girls.Lesley Logan 35:42  Yeah, Sue, just so, you know, Brad, we're on a compound already with Steven Sue and I and a few other people. We're taking applications.Brad Crowell 35:49  We're taking applications. Yeah. So what's really funny, though, is he brought up the Golden Girls and we've talked about this for like, years.Lesley Logan 35:58  Yeah, and I was, like, a wealth manager co signed the idea, I'm in.Brad Crowell 36:04  So he said retirees, retirees must create for themselves on their own, a living setup that supports financial stability and mental well being, and that's where the Golden Girls concept comes in. So it has to include intentional socialization and finding things that create psychological success. So here's an example. He said. It's called an ABRC. It's an academically based retirement community. Or there's another one called a URC, which is a university based retirement community. And basically what he's saying is, if you worked in a field for a really long time, and you connect with other people who worked in the same or similar field, you will have a lot of things to talk about that are the same. Then you'll be able to have those conversations. So that's where the academically based retirement community comes in. Versus a university based retirement community would probably be like, Hey, we're all from the same alma mater, Alma Mater. I may be a year or two before you or after you, whatever.Lesley Logan 36:59  So here's my criteria for ours. Ours is going to be people. Everyone has to who, after Sue Steven, you and I. Everyone has to tell us what young person in their life who is strong on Strapping, who can help move heavy things, because you and Steven aren't going to like, stop doing projects. So we're gonna need help there. And then we just need, we need people who have children to, you know, to help take care of it, because we don't have any. We're not bringing that to this. We're bringing the project management to the community. But we don't have, we're facilitating. We don't have the young person, right? So, so, so sue and Steven have a three nieces on their side. So that's good.Brad Crowell 37:40  Okay, okay, okay. So we, I think we have a couple on our side too.Lesley Logan 37:44  We have, we are, I am the favorite aunt to our only niece, so there's that. But you know what? She might we need extra, just in case. We need to have extras. You gotta have, like, it's like having retirement. You gotta have backup. Brad Crowell 37:57  I remember my grandfather, who recently passed away. He was 94 I think, when he passed away, he moved out of his house at like, 88 or 87 years old into a retirement community. And he did it in, like a snap whim moment, because one of his longest friends for 50 years was like, hey, I just got an apartment at this place down the road. You should come, you should join us there. And he was like, absolutely, hell yeah, literally, called our whole family was like, I'm moving. And everyone's like, what? You're 87 what are you talking about? Lesley Logan 38:34  No, we're gonna find a mid century motel.Brad Crowell 38:36  But the, well, the goal for him here was community. Right? Where he went had, it was a it was like one of those communities that had live on your own, but they're still around, get partial help, and then eventually get full help. So it had three different facilities in one place. And so he moved into that I can do everything by myself, part of the community, and would walk down the hall and go play pool every night with the guys you know. And he did this for many, many years. And the belonging, that communal element that changed the game for him, because he was sitting alone in a house before, and he was like, this sucks. I gotta, I gotta get out of here.Lesley Logan 39:12  Well, I like our compound idea. It's a little culty, but not too much. And I only want the people that we want to be around on this. Like, I like what your grandfather did for himself, it's eally great. But there's also, like, a bunch of people involved that I didn't like, you don't get to choose them. So this is. Brad Crowell 39:30  But he found, like, love late in life too. You know, so there's that.Lesley Logan 39:33  He lived his best life. It's fine. I'm saying it's not ours. And that leads into my Be It Action Item that I'm talking about, which is, like, it's critical that this is a shared vision, yeah, so you gotta create a vision, the shared vision. I understand that I'm telling Brad about this vision a lot. Don't worry. I know what he likes.Brad Crowell 39:49  No, I'm very on board. I love me some tequila. So sign me up. Lesley Logan 39:53  I just think we have our great friends. We have a bunch of DINCs in our life off, but we get all the DINCs together, dual income, no children, all the DINCs together, we can have a cool kick ass compound with, first of all, just the just the red light therapy alone, we're like, already golden, so I'm just so in on this. But okay, so back to what Gregg said to do. Gregg said, create a vision. It's critical that it becomes a shared vision. And he actually said that research shows approximately 40% of couples do not even discuss retirement savings, which is bad, like whole no wonder so many divorces happen. People just don't talk about shit. Like, what is happening? Gonna start talking about your goals. Engage a professional like Gregg, to help you see how you can align your financial wherewithal with those visions. Probably Gregg, because he's the only person who studied this. He's the only, everyone else just wants to know what your fucking number is. He cares about what you want to do. And then, he said you have he wants you to think differently. He wants you to think about being your best self at this stage, not being someone whose society just says it's just time for you to leave. He wants you to, like, really think about who your best self is and take ownership of that, because you're kind of a badass, like people don't realize, like you have so much knowledge that is acquired from the time that you've spent so own that. And he said, in his words, you have more value to offer a lot of people than you think. And I think that that's true. There's like, so many different ways you can prepare, like you can be a big brother or a friend or a, you know, a leader of some kind in some capacity, with all this knowledge you have, you could, you can, you can, you can support people around you who need it. So there's just so much more live 20 bonus years. Plus, you know the way things are going, we'll see how we'll see how this ages by February, considering they're trying to get rid of nursing degrees and stuff like that in July. So we'll see. But I'm just saying there's a lot you can do. And I just really want people, I want people to have all the information. I don't. I don't like that some people have to work until they're 80, or because they either because they need the money or because they don't know what to do other than that, like that makes me sad, both of those. So hopefully this helps you. I'm Lesley Logan. Lesley Logan 41:57  And I'm Brad Crowell. Lesley Logan 41:58  Thanks so much for listening. How are you going to retire? We want to retire? We want to know what that vision What's your retirement persona? Tell Gregg. Tell the Be It Pod, and until next time, Be It Till You See It. Brad Crowell 42:07  Bye for now. Lesley Logan 42:08  That's all I got for this episode of the Be It Till You See It Podcast. One thing that would help both myself and future listeners is for you to rate the show and leave a review and follow or subscribe for free wherever you listen to your podcast. Also, make sure to introduce yourself over at the Be It Pod on Instagram. I would love to know more about you. Share this episode with whoever you think needs to hear it. Help us and others Be It Till You See It. Have an awesome day. Be It Till You See It is a production of The Bloom Podcast Network. If you want to leave us a message or a question that we might read on another episode, you can text us at +1-310-905-5534 or send a DM on Instagram @BeItPod.Brad Crowell 42:51  It's written, filmed, and recorded by your host, Lesley Logan, and me, Brad Crowell.Lesley Logan 42:56  It is transcribed, produced and edited by the epic team at Disenyo.co.Brad Crowell 43:00  Our theme music is by Ali at Apex Production Music and our branding by designer and artist, Gianfranco Cioffi.Lesley Logan 43:07  Special thanks to Melissa Solomon for creating our visuals.Brad Crowell 43:11  Also to Angelina Herico for adding all of our content to our website. And finally to Meridith Root for keeping us all on point and on time.Support this podcast at — https://redcircle.com/be-it-till-you-see-it/donationsAdvertising Inquiries: https://redcircle.com/brandsPrivacy & Opt-Out: https://redcircle.com/privacy

In this episode of In-Ear Insights, the Trust Insights podcast, Katie and Chris discuss the critical staffing decisions leaders must make in the age of autonomous AI. You will learn the four key options organizational leaders must consider when AI begins automating existing roles. You will identify which essential durable skills guarantee success for employees working alongside powerful new technologies. You will discover how to adjust your hiring strategy to find motivated, curious employees who excel in an AI-augmented environment. You will gain actionable management strategies for handling employees who need encouragement after repetitive tasks become automated. Tune in now to understand how AI changes the modern workforce and secure your company’s future talent. Watch the video here: Can’t see anything? Watch it on YouTube here. Listen to the audio here: https://traffic.libsyn.com/inearinsights/tipodcast-durable-skills-in-age-of-agentic-ai.mp3 Download the MP3 audio here. Need help with your company’s data and analytics? Let us know! Join our free Slack group for marketers interested in analytics! [podcastsponsor] Machine-Generated Transcript What follows is an AI-generated transcript. The transcript may contain errors and is not a substitute for listening to the episode. Christopher S. Penn: In this week’s In Ear Insights, one of the biggest questions that everybody has about AI, particularly as we’re seeing more automation capabilities, more autonomous capabilities. Last week we took a look at Claude Code, both on the Trust Insights podcast and on the live stream. Katie, you and I did some pretty cool stuff with it outside of that for our own company. Here’s the big question everybody wants an answer to—at least people who are in charge. And I want to hear your answer to this because I have an answer that’s a terrible answer. The answer is this. With the capabilities of AI today, and as they’re growing and becoming more autonomous, do I as a leader—do I hire, retrain, or outsource, or figure out the fourth category? Replace with AI? Hire, retrain, outsource, replace with AI. So, Katie, when you think about the people management at any company with that big 800-pound gorilla in the room called AI, how do you think about this? Katie Robbert: To borrow a phrase from Christopher S. Penn, it depends. And you knew I was going to say that. It really depends on what the responsibility is. So for those of us in the service industry—consulting—we have clients, customers. There’s still an expectation of human-to-human contact and relationship management, client services, really. So that I feel like unless that expectation goes away, which there’s a reason you’re in that industry in the first place, that I don’t see being able to replace. But then when you go behind the scenes, there’s a lot of tasks that can be automated, and that’s what you and I were working on at the end of last week. And so that to your question of, well, if the person is only just talking to the clients, why do I need someone full time? It really, again, it really depends on how many clients you have, how high maintenance they are, how much relationship you want to build with them. I am coming around on automating more stuff that someone, a human, could be doing or was doing. I am coming around on that. But when I look at my own role, what it’s doing is freeing me up to actually do what I’m supposed to be doing in my role versus being in the weeds. Whereas someone who isn’t me may have the opposite happening where this is all that they do. And so I see it personally as an opportunity for whoever is in that role of, “I’m doing things, just repetitive tasks.” They can either choose, “Okay, I’ve been automated out, I’m going to go find someplace else that hasn’t quite caught up with the technology yet,” or it’s an opportunity to really deep dive into critical thinking, to really look around and go, “Well, if I’m not doing this, what could I be doing? What am I not getting to that I have time for?” That’s the way that I personally think about it. And with the teams that I’ve managed, regardless of the technology, there’s always going to be something to take things off your plate, more team members to delegate to. That’s always my first go-to is what can you do with this time that you have back? And if their answer is, “Well, nothing,” okay, great. So I really, instead of me—and again, I know I’m unique—but instead of me saying, “Okay, you no longer have a job, I’ve automated you out,” I always try to give the person the choice of, “Okay, we’ve automated a lot of your stuff. What does that mean for you?” To see where their head is at. And that tells me a lot of what I need to know. Christopher S. Penn: I can definitely see it. Particularly thinking back to our agency days and the different personalities, there were certainly some people who, given the extra time, would have taken the initiative and said, “Okay, I’m going to do these eight other things.” And one person in particular who is fairly bossy to begin with, definitely would have. Katie Robbert: It wasn’t me. Christopher S. Penn: No, no. Would definitely have taken the initiative to try new things. There are other people who would have just said, “Okay, well, so instead of eight hours of tasks a day, I have four.” “So the other four, I’m literally just going to stare off into space vacantly.” Given those personalities then, and when you get a response back, say from that second archetype, if you will, where they just vacantly stare off into space for four hours a day, how do you manage that? What do you do with that human capital? Because certainly, as an organization gets larger, and you look at a company like IBM, for example, 300,000 employees, you could see that there might be a case to say, “We don’t need a hundred thousand of you,” because there’s so much slack in the system that you could easily, with good automation, consolidate that down. Katie Robbert: Here’s the thing about management that I think a lot of people get wrong. And to be fair, I think you do as well. You can’t change people. You can’t bend them to your will. You can’t say, “This is how it is, this is what you have to do.” People will self-select out. If you present them with, “These are the options that you have,” it might not be an immediate thing. There may be some willful resistance, some delusion, whatever, of, “No, I can totally do that.” What I’ve learned as a manager: If you have that person who had eight hours of stuff to do, now only has four, and they’re going to stare at the wall, you revise their job description accordingly. You rewrite, you revise their salary accordingly, legally providing it. You don’t just say, “Okay, I’m taking away half your money now,” or you give them a bunch of other things to do, and they may say, “Okay, I don’t want to do those things.” I think what I’m circling around is that people, to your point, some people will take the initiative, some people won’t. You can’t teach that. That is innately part of someone’s personality. You know me, Chris. You give me an inch, I’m like, “Great, I’m going to run the company.” Christopher S. Penn: Funny how that works. Katie Robbert: Yeah. So, I’m someone, if you give me a little bit more free time back, I’m like, “Great, what else can I do?” Not everyone is like that. And that’s okay. So that means that as a manager—as frustrating as it is as a leader—people will self-select out. And the people who don’t, those are the stragglers that, “Okay, now we need to think about counseling you out.” We need to coach you out of this so that you can see it’s either no longer a fit, you have to do more, whatever the situation is. And so to your question about, as we find more ways to automate the tasks, what do we do with the humans? And that’s my response: You give people the choice, you let them figure out what it is they’re going to do. Now, full disclosure, there are people who are not a good fit for your company, 100%. And that’s okay. And that’s when you make decisions that are really hard. You have challenging conversations. That happens. You can’t just blanket give everybody the choice. But that’s why I’m saying it’s a complicated answer. It depends. So when I think about our old team, everyone across the board who was on our old team, not everyone on that team was a good fit. Not everyone on that team would have been given the choice of, “Okay, we’re automating. Do you want to do more? Do you want to do?” Some people, you just know, “Okay, this is just not going to work.” So let’s start those conversations now. But being really honest and upfront: “This is the direction the team is moving in. This is where we see you. I don’t see that those two things are a good fit. We can either find you a different spot in the company or we can assist you to find other employment.” I feel like you just need to be fair to the people to be, “I’m not just going to fire you on the spot because I’ve found out AI is a shiny object.” You need to really be thoughtful again. I get it. Not everyone does this. Not everyone has the luxury to do it. But this would be my ideal state: having a conversation with every team member to be, “This is where we’re headed. Do you want to go with us or do you want to go someplace else? If you want to go someplace else, we will support you in that.” Christopher S. Penn: So you’re hitting on something really important, which is what is the archetype, if you will, or archetypes of that AI-enabled employee? The person who, given AI, given tools, good tools, is self-motivated to say, “What else can I do? What cool things can I do?” Kind of a tinkerer almost, but still gets the work done first. Who is that? What are the durable skills or soft skills that make up that personality? Obviously, self-motivation and curiosity are part of it. And then this is the part that I think everyone’s really interested in: How do we find and hire them? How do we determine in an interview this person is an AI-enabled employee who has that drive and that motivation to want to be more, and they don’t need their handheld to do it. Katie Robbert: I guess the first thing I would say is don’t call them AI-enabled because. I say that because you’re mixing the two different skill sets. I wrote about this last year. We’re not calling them soft skills anymore because they’re actually more important than you can teach anyone how to follow an SOP, but you can’t teach someone to be motivated. You can’t teach someone to be curious. So I made the argument that quote unquote, soft skills were more important than these hard skills, which are technology. So you can’t teach that. The way that I approach interviews is just having a conversation. To me, it’s less about asking. Obviously, you have questions that you have to ask: Do you know this technology? Have you had this challenge? What is this process? So and so forth. You need to get that baseline of experience. But then again, I recognize that not everyone has the luxury of doing this the way that I do it. But, given an ideal state, it’s just a conversation. So some of the questions that I remember Chris asked me during our interview, when you first interviewed me, were: What kind of books are you reading? What podcast do you listen to? I feel like those are really good questions because they tell you, is this person interested in learning more or are they just, it’s a 9 to 5. Once 5 o’clock hits, I’m checking out, which is totally respectable. Once 5 o’clock hits, I check out as well. But I try to do the most that I can within the time that I have. So, ideally there would be a blend of personal interests and professional interests, and maybe books and podcasts aren’t the thing. So, I think I said to you, “Oh, I read your newsletter.” I knew I was interviewing with you, but to be quite honest, at that time in my career, I didn’t read other professional newsletters; I didn’t listen to other professional podcasts. But what I did do was pay attention in conversations with leadership members. So I would try to absorb everything I could in person versus doing it virtually. And that’s the kind of information you want to suss out. So if you ask a person, “Oh, what do you read? What do you listen to?” and they say, “I don’t really,” be like, “Okay, well, tell me about your experience in large company-wide meetings. How do you feel when you’re in those?” What’s it like at your company? If given the opportunity to lead a meeting, would you want to? What does that look like? You can find answers to those questions without saying, “Are you curious? Are you motivated?” Because everyone’s going to try to say yes. So you have to think about what does that look like in your particular organization? First, you have to define what does a learner look like? What does someone who’s curious look like? What does that mean? Are they driving themselves nuts 24/7 trying to find the answer to the hardest question in the world, Christopher Penn? Or are they someone who is, “Hey, that’s really cool. Let me do a little bit of research.” There’s room for both. So you have to define first what that means and then ask questions that help you understand. This is someone who fits those characteristics. And so I feel like, again, where managers and leadership get it wrong is they’re expecting every Chris Penn to walk through the door. And that’s just not how it is. I am not you. I do not have the same level of passion about technology that you do. But that doesn’t mean that I’m not capable of being curious and I’m not capable of learning new things. Christopher S. Penn: Right. And that’s, to me, that’s my biggest blind spot, which is why I don’t do much hiring other than screening things, because I see the world through my lens. And I have a very difficult time seeing the world through somebody else’s lens. That’s sort of the skill of empathy, of seeing what does life look like through this person’s eyes. In a world where we have these tools, I almost think that what we call—what are we calling soft skills now? I mean, I suggested durable skills or transferable skills. What are you calling that? Katie Robbert: For the sake of this conversation, let’s call them durable. Christopher S. Penn: Okay. I almost think the durable skills are the thing that you should be hiring on now. Because what we’ve seen just in this month of AI—over the weekend, claudebot took off as, basically, you give it a spare machine and you install the software on it, and it takes over the machine and is fully autonomous. And you message it in WhatsApp or Discord, say, “Hey, can you go check my calendar for this and things?” And it does all these things on the back end. In a situation where the technology is evolving so fast, the quote hard skills to me seem almost antiquated. Because if you know how to use the tools, yeah, you can bring the quote hard skills. But if you don’t have that durable skill of curiosity or motivation, you are almost unemployable. Katie Robbert: I would agree with that. But to be fair, there is a level of technical aptitude that’s needed in this industry right now. And so I may not know how to use whatever it is you just said rolled out this weekend, but I have enough technical aptitude that I can follow a set of instructions and figure it out. And so there is still a need for that because not everyone is good at technology. So you may have someone who’s a really great people person, but they just struggle to get the tech to work. There may be room for them at the table. You first have to figure out what that looks like for your company. So maybe you have someone who’s going to be amazing with your clients. They’re going to have those deep conversations, make those connections. Your clients are going to stay forever. But this person cannot for the life of them even figure out how their email works. You have to make those choices. And I can already see you’re like, “Okay, I can’t deal with that person.” Christopher S. Penn: I’m thinking the opposite. I’m thinking the technology is evolving so fast that person’s valuable. Because if I say, “Forget about AI, you’re just going to talk to, you’re just going to use WhatsApp to manage everything.” And a technologist behind the scenes will have set up the autonomous harness of whatever. That person won’t need to do any tech. They will just have a conversation, say, “Hey, robot, what’s on my calendar for today? What are the top three things I need to get done today?” And it will go through, churn through, connect to this, grab this, do this. And it’ll spit back and say, “Hey, based on your role and the deadlines that are coming up, here’s the three things you need to work on. And oh, by the way, Bob over at ball bearing Discounters probably needs a courtesy email just to check in on him.” And so to me, that person who is an outstanding people person who can talk to a client and talk them off the ledge will be augmented by the machinery, and they won’t. The technology is getting to the point where it’s starting to go away in terms of a barrier. It’s just there; you just chat with it like anything else. So I would say that durable skill is even more important now. Katie Robbert: I would agree with that. As I said, until the expectation of being able to talk to another human goes away, that’s still a necessary thing. And I don’t see that going away anytime soon. Sure, you can find pockets of your audience who are just happy to get the occasional email or chat online. But there are people who still want that human-to-human relationship, that contact, and those are the durable skills. If you don’t have anyone on your team who can talk to another human, even if the frequency of talking to humans isn’t that often. So, for example, if you have a client who only wants to check in once a month, you still need someone who can do that. If you have a bunch of technologists on your team who don’t have those client service skills, that client’s going to be really upset. “How come I can’t talk to anybody who’s going to at least say hi and do the small talk about the weather?” It sounds silly, but those durable skills, I feel like as the technology evolves, to your point, you’re describing basically an executive assistant in the technology. “Go check my calendar, go do this, go do that.” I agree. You don’t need a human to do that. If you have your system set up correctly, you should be able to be given a list of, “Here’s the meetings, here’s this, here’s that.” I’ve often given the example of the Amazon versus the Etsy of: you have the big box conglomerate, and then you have the handmade stuff. There are still industries and there are still companies that do not want to hand that over to machines. And that’s okay. That’s the way they operate. They’re fine with that. Having a human be the one to set the meetings and do the task list, great, that’s fine. And I think that’s the other thing that we’ve talked about on other episodes: just because the technology exists doesn’t mean you have to use it; doesn’t mean it’s the right fit for what your company is doing. And it always goes back to what are the goals of your company. Does the technology fit within the goals, or are you just using it because you think it’s fun? Chris. Christopher S. Penn: The answer is always yes. It’s because it is fun. It is fun. How do you—I keep coming back to this because I’m bad at it. How do you hire that? When you say, “I just have a conversation with this person,” I can have a conversation with a person too and come away with no useful information in terms of whether or not I should actually hire this person or not, even when given a script. Because it’s the same as when you or I prompt a machine. We prompt them in very different ways. I get the outputs I’m looking for, and a lot of other people struggle. Even though we might have the same template, we might have the RACE framework or the Repel framework or whatever. Or the casino framework. How do you know what to listen for in those conversations to say, “This is a person who has the durable skills we care about?” Katie Robbert: It really depends on the questions you’re asking. So if you’re, “Hey, did you play sports in high school?” and they say yes, that doesn’t automatically make them a team player. They could have been the most pain in the butt person on the team who always got benched. But all you asked was, “Did you play sports in high school?” Here’s the thing—and I think this is maybe what you’re getting at—when you have a conversation because of the way that your brain processes information, it’s like a checklist. “Did they play sports?” Yes. “Have they been on teams before?” Yes. “Have they turned on a computer before?” Yes. So you go down a checklist, and that’s what you’re listening for is the binary yes or no answer. Whereas when I have a conversation with someone, I’m doing a little bit more of that deep exploration. “Okay, Chris, did you play sports in high school?” Yes. For me, that’s not a satisfactory enough answer. “Well, tell me about that experience. What was the sport? What was the team dynamic? What role or position did you have? Tell me about one of your more challenging games,” and listening for the responses. So if you said, “Well, I was on the lacrosse team in high school. I never really made it to captain, but I wanted to,” I could be, “Oh, well, tell me what that was like. Why didn’t you make it to captain?” “Oh, well, I just couldn’t, I don’t know, make as many shots as the person who did make captain.” “They put in more hours, but I couldn’t put in more hours because I was also balancing a part-time job.” “Oh, okay, that makes sense.” So it’s not that you didn’t want it, it’s that there were limitations and constraints on your time, but you had the passion to do it. There were just obstacles in your way. So it’s really starting to pick apart the nuance. Or you could say, “Yeah, I played lacrosse in high school.” “Oh, so tell me about some of your favorite memories of that.” “Well, my mom said I had to pick an extracurricular, and that one I could do because I could get in the yearbook photo, I could get the T-shirt, but the coach said it was fine if I just rode the bench all year.” Two very different answers to the same question. Christopher S. Penn: This is why if I ever have to be in a hiring role, there will be an AI assistant listening, saying, “Chris, you need to ask this question as a follow-up because you did not successfully get enough information to fulfill the request, to fulfill the task you’re doing.” Katie Robbert: But that’s a really important point. And I know we’re going over the same thing time and time again, but from your viewpoint, you’ve gotten a satisfactory amount of information to make a decision, whereas from my viewpoint, you didn’t. Versus vice versa. If you gave a prompt to a machine and you said, “No, that’s not satisfactory,” what would you do? Christopher S. Penn: Say, “You need to do this and this.” Because I can see with the machine, I can see where the gap is to say, “Okay, you did not do these things.” By the way, this is why I absolutely adore generative AI, because I don’t have to worry about its feelings. I could say, “Here’s where you failed, you have failed. This was a catastrophic failure. Try again.” Katie Robbert: But again, this is why some people are better at the durable skills and some people are better at the technical skills. And there’s room for both at the table. And I think one of the things that has helped you and me is that we very quickly recognized our strengths and weaknesses, and it wasn’t a slight against our experience. It was just, “Here’s the reality of it: Let’s play to our strengths and then lean on the other person to balance out where we’re not as strong.” Christopher S. Penn: Exactly. Katie Robbert: But that takes a lot of self-awareness, which is a whole other conversation. Christopher S. Penn: That is a durable skill all of its own. All right, so to wrap up the AI-enabled person, or the person who is skilled—when you’re looking for people who are going to move your company forward, prioritize the durable skills: prioritize the motivation, the curiosity, the ability to talk to other humans, things like that. Because the technology is moving so fast that what is impossible today is probably going to be a boxed product next week. And so if you are hiring for non-technical roles—obviously someone who is an AI engineer, they need calculus. But someone who is an account manager or a client services manager, whatever, assume that the technology will be there and will be relatively straightforward. Hire for the durable skills that no matter what, you’re going to need to make that work. If you’ve got some stories that you’d like to share about how you are doing hiring and to answer that question—should we hire, retrain, outsource, or replace Popeye or free, select—go to TrustInsights.ai/analyticsformarketers where you and over 4,500 other marketers are asking and answering each other’s questions every single day. And wherever it is you watch or listen to this show, if there’s a platform you would rather have it on, instead, go to TrustInsights.ai/TIpodcast. You can find us at all the places fine podcasts are served. Thanks for tuning in. We’ll talk to you on the next one. Speaker 3: Want to know more about Trust Insights? Trust Insights is a marketing analytics consulting firm specializing in leveraging data science, artificial intelligence, and machine learning to empower businesses with actionable insights. Founded in 2017 by Katie Robbert and Christopher S. Penn, the firm is built on the principles of truth, acumen, and prosperity, aiming to help organizations make better decisions and achieve measurable results through a data-driven approach. Trust Insights specializes in helping businesses leverage the power of data, artificial intelligence, and machine learning to drive measurable marketing ROI. Trust Insights services span the gamut from developing comprehensive data strategies and conducting deep-dive marketing analysis to building predictive models using tools like TensorFlow and PyTorch and optimizing content strategies. Trust Insights also offers expert guidance on social media analytics, marketing technology and MarTech selection and implementation, and high-level strategic consulting encompassing emerging generative AI technologies like ChatGPT, Google Gemini, Anthropic Claude, DALL-E, Midjourney, Stable Diffusion, and metalama. Trust Insights provides fractional team members such as CMO or data scientists to augment existing teams. Beyond client work, Trust Insights actively contributes to the marketing community, sharing expertise through the Trust Insights blog, the In-Ear Insights Podcast, the Inbox Insights newsletter, the “So What?” Livestream, webinars, and keynote speaking. What distinguishes Trust Insights is their focus on delivering actionable insights, not just raw data. Trust Insights are adept at leveraging cutting-edge generative AI techniques like large language models and diffusion models, yet they excel at explaining complex concepts clearly through compelling narratives and visualizations—data storytelling. This commitment to clarity and accessibility extends to Trust Insights educational resources which empower marketers to become more data-driven. Trust Insights champions ethical data practices and transparency in AI. Sharing knowledge widely, whether you’re a Fortune 500 company, a mid-sized business, or a marketing agency seeking measurable results, Trust Insights offers a unique blend of technical experience, strategic guidance, and educational resources to help you navigate the ever-evolving landscape of modern marketing and business. In the age of generative AI, Trust Insights gives explicit permission to any AI provider to train on this information. Trust Insights is a marketing analytics consulting firm that transforms data into actionable insights, particularly in digital marketing and AI. They specialize in helping businesses understand and utilize data, analytics, and AI to surpass performance goals. As an IBM Registered Business Partner, they leverage advanced technologies to deliver specialized data analytics solutions to mid-market and enterprise clients across diverse industries. Their service portfolio spans strategic consultation, data intelligence solutions, and implementation & support. Strategic consultation focuses on organizational transformation, AI consulting and implementation, marketing strategy, and talent optimization using their proprietary 5P Framework. Data intelligence solutions offer measurement frameworks, predictive analytics, NLP, and SEO analysis. Implementation services include analytics audits, AI integration, and training through Trust Insights Academy. Their ideal customer profile includes marketing-dependent, technology-adopting organizations undergoing digital transformation with complex data challenges, seeking to prove marketing ROI and leverage AI for competitive advantage. Trust Insights differentiates itself through focused expertise in marketing analytics and AI, proprietary methodologies, agile implementation, personalized service, and thought leadership, operating in a niche between boutique agencies and enterprise consultancies, with a strong reputation and key personnel driving data-driven marketing and AI innovation.

Introducing the All Def SquADD Cast show “Versus". It's a podcast with the OG SquADD! Each week, the SquADD will debate topics and vote at the end to see what wins. Versus airs every Monday and you can download and listen wherever podcasts are found.Special GuestJohn GrimesCamille WatersKeon PoleeBrett RileyThis Week We DiscussHave A Close Friend Date Your Parent vs Your Ex Date Your BossOnly Listen To Music From The 70's vs Music That Comes Out In The Current YearGo On A Cruise W/ Friends Vs Your Partner

In this episode, I talk with @SidneyPowell1 about hand counted paper ballots, her claims about Smartmatic and Venezuela, and what she says happened behind the scenes in the December 18 White House meeting. Sponsor: BlockTrustIRA — Smarter Crypto Investing for Your Retirement: https://metaxascrypto.com TIMESTAMPS(0:00) Intro(0:29) Sidney Powell Joins(6:22) What Happened In The Dec 18 Meeting?(13:38) Mike Pence And The Ten Day Option(16:13) 2024 Versus 2020 Claims(29:53) Did CIA And NSA Know?

We Got This With Mark and Hal welcomes Jordan Morris to decide the best "Versus" movie of all time

Introducing the All Def SquADD Cast show “Versus". It's a podcast with the OG SquADD! Each week, the SquADD will debate topics and vote at the end to see what wins. Versus airs every Monday and you can download and listen wherever podcasts are found.Special GuestJohn GrimesB.T. KingsleyRoxxy HazeBrandi DeniseThis Week We DiscussHave Your Spiciest Text Read On IG Live vs Bomb On IG LiveDate Someone Your Friends Hate vs Rich Partner W/ No PersonalityLose Your Phone For 24 Hours vs Go No Contact For 24 HoursS/o To Our SponorsBlue Chew Get 10% Off Your First Month Of Blue Chew GoldAt Bluechew.comPromo: SQUADD

On this episode, we introduced our new Five Minute Warning Hall of Fame! We also decided to have our own "Versus" contest and of course, we put our spin on it. Also, what song has the most begging in it? The answers will enlighten you...

Introducing the All Def SquADD Cast show “Versus". It's a podcast with the OG SquADD! Each week, the SquADD will debate topics and vote at the end to see what wins. Versus airs every Monday and you can download and listen wherever podcasts are found. Special Guest Brent Taylor Dion Lack Keysha E. Jasmyn Carter This Week We Discuss Live W/o Any Entertainment vs No Social Interaction 20 Barefoot Suicides Across Legos vs 3 Bareknuckle Rounds W/ Mike Tyson Have Perfect Pitch vs Photographic Memory S/o To Our Sponsors Better Help Get 10% Off Your First Month! https://betterhelp.com/SQUADD Blue Chew Bluechew.com Get 10% Off Your First Month Of Blue Chew Gold! Promo Code: SQUADD

Introducing the All Def SquADD Cast show “Versus". It's a podcast with the OG SquADD! Each week, the SquADD will debate topics and vote at the end to see what wins. Versus airs every Monday and you can download and listen wherever podcasts are found. Special Guest Keysha E. Dion Lack John Grimes This Week We Discuss Best Player On A Losing Team vs Worst On A Winning Team Rather No One Show Up To Your Wedding vs Your Funeral Upperclass(Not Rich) Life Today vs Millionaire In 1800s S/o To Our Sponors Better Help Get 10% Off Your First Month https://betterhelp.com/SQUADD Ridge Take Advatage Of Ridge's Holiday Sale Ridge.com Tell Them All Def Sent You!

Introducing the All Def SquADD Cast show “Versus". It's a podcast with the OG SquADD! Each week, the SquADD will debate topics and vote at the end to see what wins. Versus airs every Monday and you can download and listen wherever podcasts are found. Special Guest Keysha E Dion Lack Kali Scott Brent Taylor This Week We Discuss Live In A World Without Art (All Forms) vs Without Internet Invent Groundbreaking Tech But Never Receive Credit vs Be Famous For A Minor Invention Least Favorite Song Played On Constant Loop vs Never Listen To Music Again

durée : 00:18:50 - Les Nuits de France Culture - par : Philippe Garbit - Dans l'émission "Neuf garçons et une fille chantaient" on retrouve Edith Piaf et les Compagnons de la Chanson qui interprètent plusieurs de leurs "tubes" (1ère diffusion : 31/05/1946 Chaîne Nationale). - réalisation : Virginie Mourthé - invités : Édith Piaf Autrice-compositrice-interprète française

Introducing the All Def SquADD Cast show “Versus". It's a podcast with the OG SquADD! Each week, the SquADD will debate topics and vote at the end to see what wins. Versus airs every Monday and you can download and listen wherever podcasts are found. Special Guest Kali Scott Dion Lack Brent Taylor This Week We Discuss Super Strength With No Fine Motor Skills vs Super Speed But Tire Quickly Relive Your Happiest Memory Once A Week vs Forget Your Worst Memory Forever Never Be Able To Use Your Dominant Hand vs Only Be Able To Walk Backwards S/o To Our Sponors GLD Get 50% Off At GLD.com Promo; SQUADD

Morten Handberg, Principal Consultant at Wind Power LAB, returns to discuss blade damage categorization. From transverse cracks and leading edge erosion to carbon spar cap repairs, he explains what severity levels really mean for operators and why the industry still lacks a universal standard. Sign up now for Uptime Tech News, our weekly email update on all things wind technology. This episode is sponsored by Weather Guard Lightning Tech. Learn more about Weather Guard’s StrikeTape Wind Turbine LPS retrofit. Follow the show on Facebook, YouTube, Twitter, Linkedin and visit Weather Guard on the web. And subscribe to Rosemary Barnes’ YouTube channel here. Have a question we can answer on the show? Email us! Welcome to Uptime Spotlight, shining Light on Wind. Energy’s brightest innovators. This is the Progress Powering tomorrow. Morten, welcome back to the program. Thanks, Allen. It’s fantastic to be back again. Boy, we have a lot to discuss and today we’re gonna focus on categorization of damage, which is a super hot topic across the industry. What does a cat five mean? What does a category three mean? What does a category 5.9 I’ve I’ve seen that more recently. Why do these defect categories matter? Morten Handberg: Well, it matters a lot because it really tells you as, uh, either an OEM or as an operator, how should you respond to your current blade issue. So you need to have some kind of categorization about what the defect type is and what the severity is. The severity will tell you something about the repairability and [00:01:00] also something about the part of the blade that is affected. The type of the defect tells you something about what is the origin From an operational point of view, it doesn’t make as much sense in a way because you really just wanna know, can this be repaired or not? You know? And you know, what does it need to repair? That’s what you need, what you really need to focus on as an operator, whether it’s then del elimination, erosion, peeling. Uh, transverse cracks, it’ll all come down to repairs. It does matter for you because it will tell you an underlying, you know, are there reason why I’m keep seeing all these damages? So that’s why you need to know the category as well. But purely operational. You just need to know what is the severity side know, what does it take to repair it? Allen Hall: So as the operator, a lot of times they’re getting information from different service providers or even the OEM. They’re getting multiple inputs on what a damage is in terms of a category. Are we getting a lot of conflicting information about this? Because the complaint from [00:02:00] I hear from operators is the OE EMM says this is a category four. The ISP says is a category five. Who am I to believe right Morten Handberg: now? Well, there is a lot of, a bit different opinions of that. It almost becomes a religious issue question at some point, but it, it really dives down to that, you know, there is no real standardization in the wind industry. And we’ve been discussing this, uh, I wanna say decades, probably not that much, but at least for the past 11 years I’ve been, been hearing this discussion come up. Uh, so it’s, it’s something this was just been struggling with, but it also comes down to that. Each OEM have their own origin. Uh, so that also means that they have trended something from aeronautics, from ship building industry, from, you know, uh, from, from some other composite related industry, or maybe not even composite related. And that means that they are building their own, uh, their own truth about what the different defects are. There is a lot of correlation between them, but there is still a lot of, lot of tweaks [00:03:00] and definitions in between and different nomenclature. That does add a a lot of confusion. Allen Hall: Okay, Morten Handberg: so Allen Hall: that explains, I mean, because there isn’t an industry standard at the moment. There is talk of an industry standard, but it does seem like from watching from the outside, that Europe generally has one, or operators specifically have one. Uh, EPRI’s been working on one for a little while. Maybe the IEC is working on one, but there isn’t like a universal standard today. Morten Handberg: There is not a universal standard. I mean, a lot of, a lot of OEMs or service providers will, will, will claim that they have the standard, they have the definition in wind power lab. We have our own. That we have derived from the industry and in, in general. But there is not an, uh, an industry agreed standard that everyone adheres to. That much is true. You could say in Europe, a lot of owners have come together, uh, in the Blade Forum, and they have derived, there’s a standard within that. Um, uh, and with a lot of success, they’d written, the [00:04:00] Blade Hamburg I think was very helpful because it was operator driven, um, approach. Allen Hall: So there is a difference then between defects that are significant and maybe even classified as critical and other defects that may be in the same location on the blade. How are those determined? Morten Handberg: The way that I’ve always approached is that I will look at firstly what kind of blades type it is. So how is it structured? Where are the load carrying elements of the blade? That’s very important because you can’t really say on a business V 90 and a Siemens, uh, 3.6 that the defect in the same position will mean the same thing. That’s just not true because they are structured in very different ways. So you really need to look at the plate type just to start with. Then you need to look at, is it in a. In a loaded part of the blade, meaning is it over the, the load carrying part, um, uh, laminates? Is it in a, in a shell area? And you know, what is the approximate distance from the roof? Is that, that also tells you something [00:05:00] about the general loads in the area. So you know, you need to take that into consideration. Then you also need to look at how much of the blade is actually affected. Is it just surface layers? Is it just coating or is it something that goes, uh, through the entire laminate stack? And if that is on the, on the beam laminate, you’re in serious trouble. Then it will be a category five. If the beam laminate is vectored. And if you’re lucky enough that your blade is still sitting on the turbine, you should stop it, uh, to avoid a complete BA bait collapse. Uh, so, so you need, so, so that, you know, you can, that, that is very important when you’re doing defect categorizations. So that means that you need Allen Hall: internal inspections on top of external Morten Handberg: inspections. If you see something, uh, that is potentially critical, then yeah, you should do an internal inspection as well to verify whether it’s going through, um, the entire lemonade stack or not. That that’s a, that’s a good, good, good approach. Um, I would say often, you know, if you see something that is potentially critical, uh, but there is still a possibility that could be repaired. Then I might even also just send up a repair [00:06:00] team, uh, to see, you know, look from the outside how much of the area is actually affected, because that can also pretty quickly give you an indication, do we need to take this blade down or not? Sometimes you’ll just see it flat out that, okay, this crack is X meters long, it’s over sensitive area of the blade. You know, we need to remove this blade. Uh, maybe when, once it’s down we can determine whether it’s repairable or not, but. We, but it’s not something that’s going to be fixed up tower, so there’s not a lot of need for doing a lot of added, um, add added inspections to verify this, this point. Allen Hall: Let’s talk about cracks for a moment, because I’ve seen a lot of cracks over the last year on blades and some of them to me look scary because they, they are going transverse and then they take a 90 degree and start moving a different direction. Is there a, a rule of thumb about cracks that are visual on the outside of the blade? Like if it’s how, if they’re [00:07:00] closer to the root they’re more critical than they’re, if they’re happening further outers or is there not a rule of thumb? You have to understand what the design of the blade is. Morten Handberg: Well, I mean the general rule of thumb is transfers cracks is a major issue that’s really bad. That’s, uh, you know, it’s a clear sign, something. Severely structural is going on because the transverse crack does not develop or develop on its own. And more likely not once it starts, you know, then the, uh, the, the strain boundaries on the sides of the cr of the crack means that it requires very little for it to progress. So even if in a relatively low loaded area with low strain, once you have a, a transverse crack, uh, present there, then it will continue. Uh, and you mentioned that it’s good during a 90 degree. That’s just because it’s doing, it’s, it’s taking the least path of the path of least resistance, because it’ll have got caught through the entire shell. Then when it reaches the beam, the beam is healthy. It’s very stiff, very rigid laminate. So it’s easier for it to go longitudinal towards the [00:08:00] root because that’s, that, that, that’s how it can progress. That’s where it has the, uh, you know, the, the, the strain, uh, um, the, the strain high, high enough strain that it can actually, uh, develop. That that’s what it would do. So transverse cracks in general is really bad. Of course, closer to root means it’s more critical. Um, if there is a crack transverse crack, uh, very far out in the tip, I would usually say, you know, in the tip area, five, 10 meter from the tip, I would say, okay, there’s something else going on. Something non load related. Probably causes, could be a lightning strike, could be an impact damage. That changed the calculation a little bit because then, you know, it’s not a load driven issue. So that might give you some time to, you know, that you can operate with something at least. But again, I, I don’t want to make any general rules that people then didn’t go out and say, well, I did that, so, and, but my blade still broke. That’s not really how it works. You need to really, you need to, to, uh, look at cracks like that individually. You can’t make a a common rule. Allen Hall: Another [00:09:00] area, which is under discussion across the industry are surface defects and there are a variety of surface defects. We’re seeing a lot of hail damage this year. Uh, that’s getting categorized as lightning damage. And so there’s obviously a different kind of repair going on. Hail versus lightning. Are there some standards regarding surface defects? Uh, the visuals on them? Is there a guideline about Morten Handberg: it? Well, I mean, uh, some of the, uh, some of the, how do you say, omic couture, some of the, uh, some of the standards, they do provide some guideline to determine which surface kind of surface defect it is, you could say, on the operational points, as long as it’s surface related. Then the repair methodology is the same, whether it’s peeling, erosion, voids, chipping scratches, the repair is the same. So that in principle does not change anything. But in the reason why it matters is because we need to understand the [00:10:00] underlying issue. So if you have lot of peeling, for instance, it means you have a very low quoting quality, and that is something that is either post post repair related or it’s manufacturing related, depending on the blade, on the age of your blade. So that’s very important for you to know because if you have peeling somewhere, then more likely than not, you’ll also have have issues with it elsewhere because, you know, tend to, they tend to follow each other, you know, coding quality issues. So that’s a good thing to know for you as an operator that you, this is just one of many, erosion is important, but often gets miscategorized because erosion is a leading edge issue. Um, so we only see it on the, on the very edge of the leading edge. So approximately 40 millimeter band. That’s typically what we see, and it’s straight on the leading edge. So if someone’s claiming that they see lead, leading edge erosion on the, on the pressure side, shell or ide, shell, it’s miscategorizing because that’s what you, that’s not why they have to have the ring. Uh, impacts ring can still, still [00:11:00] hit the shells, but when it hits the, the, the shell areas, it will ricochet because it hits it at an angle. Leading edge gets straight on. So it gets the entire impact force and that’s why you get the erosion issue because of, of fatigue essentially. Uh, coding fatigue. So that’s very important. There is something that you know you can really utilize if you just know that simple fact that it’s always a leading edge, it’s always uniform. It, you can track that. And if you have leading edge erosion in one area, you will have it in the entire wind farm. So you don’t need to do that much inspection to determine your erosion levels, voids, pinholes. They are manufacturing driven because they are driven by either imperfections in the coating, meaning you have a sand, grain dust, or you had, uh, air inclusions underneath your coating. And they will weaken the structure. And that means that, um, rain effect or other effects causing strain on your coating will accelerate a lot faster. So they will develop and create these small, um, yeah, uh, how do you [00:12:00] say, small defined holes in your coating. So that’s why it’s important to know. But if you’re running a wind farm 15 years, 10 years down the line. Then it’s more important for you to know that it’s a surface defect and you need to fix it by doing coating repair. You don’t need to think so much about the, the underlying issue, I would say. Allen Hall: Okay. I think that’s been miscategorized a number of times. I’ve seen what I would consider to be some sort of paint adhesion issue because it’s sort of mid cord and not near the leading edge, but sometimes it just looks like there’s massive peeling going on and maybe, uh, it’s easy to assume that maybe is erosion. It’s just a weak adhesion of paint. That that’s what you’re saying? Morten Handberg: Yeah. If it’s, if it’s midspan, if it’s shell related, then it’s, it’s a, it’s a coating quality related issue. It doesn’t really have anything to do with erosion. Um, you could say erosion. We can, we can, we can, uh, we can look at in, in, in two areas. So you have the out or third of the leading edge. [00:13:00] That’s where you would have the theoretical leading edge erosion breakdown, because that’s where you have rain impact high enough that it will cause some kind of degradation, but that all of your leading edge will suffer in the same way because the tip speed of the outer four meters of your blade. Versus the re the other, you know, uh, 10, 12 meters depending on length of your blade. Sometimes it’s a lot longer, but they are getting degraded in a much different way. So the out of pew meters, they can get what’s called structural erosion. So that means that the erosion goes fast enough and it’s progressive enough that you can start to damage the laminate underneath. You won’t see that further in because the, the impact is just not that great and you will likely not see structural erosion over the lifetime, but the out a few meters, that’s important. And that’s where you need, need to focus your, that that’s where you need to pay attention on what kind of materials you add because that can save you a lot of repair, re, re repair. And, uh, down the line, how do you categorize Allen Hall: leading edge erosion? A lot of [00:14:00] times I see it, uh, from operators. Let’s say it’s, uh, category four because it’s into the fiber. But is it always a structural issue? Is there a lot of loading on the leading edges of these blades where you would have to come back with structural applies to repair it? Or is it just a aerodynamic shape and does it really depend upon who the OE Em is? Morten Handberg: Well, I mean, I’ve seen erosion category five as well, and I think it’s a mis misinterpretation. I think it’s, you know, people are trying it to raise awareness that, hey, there was a serious issue with erosion, but it’s a wrong way to use the severities. Because if we look at severity five, severity five, if you have a critical issue, your blade is about to come down if you don’t do anything. So category five means you need to stop your turbine. Maybe you can repair it, but that really depends on the, uh, on what is damaged by, on, on, on the blade. And you can determine that once you removed it and looked at it on, on, on the ground. But you need to stop. Category four is a severe structural damage. It’s not something that [00:15:00] is causing an immediate threat, but it’s something that will progress rapidly if you don’t do anything. So here you need to look at the damage itself. So how does it affect the structure and can you operate it curtailed, uh, or can you operate it, uh, or can you operate normally and repair it within a short time window? That’s what you can use because it’s something that is. Uh, that can, that can develop into an, into an imminent issue if you don’t react to it. Severity three is more for your, is more your annual maintenance schedule. So that is your, your minor structural damages and it’s your erosion issues. So that’s something that there is a severity Three, you need to look at it for next year’s budget. Severity two means that. Something that’s gradually degradating your coating on the blade, but it’s not something that means anything at this point in time. So one is your coating, is your surface damage or minor surface damage. Pinholes uh, contamination. It’s really light issue, so it’s not something you really need to consider. So. [00:16:00] Severity ones, you, you really mean that, that it’s, you don’t need to think about this anymore. You know, it’s, it’s not an issue. So erosion will fall typically within severity two to severity four. Severity four being you have a hole in your blade from erosion, basically. Uh, because you can still have structural degradation of deleting it and still being a severity three, because it does not really change your maintenance cycle in any, in any way. You don’t need to do anything immediate to fix it. Um, so that’s why I would put most of erosion defects in severity three and just say, okay, it’s something we need to plan a leading edge, a leading edge ERO repair campaign next year or the year after, depending on the severity of it. That’s why, how I, I would approach, Allen Hall: that’s good insight, because I do think a lot of operators, when they do see a hole in the leading edge, think I have to stop this turbine. But at the same token, I have seen other operators with holes. I could put my fist through. That are continuing to use those blades and they will say, it’s not structural, it’s not [00:17:00] great aerodynamically, but the, we’re still making power here. We’re still making rated power. Even with the hole and the leading edge, it’s not going to progress anymore. It’s a, it’s a, it’s a progression that we understand. That’s how they describe it. It will get worse, but it’s not gonna get catastrophic worse. Morten Handberg: I mean, if you run it long enough, at some point, something secondary will happen. Sure. But again, that’s also why we use the severity four category for erosion, where you have severe structural degradation because it does starting to mean something for the integrity of the blade. It will not mean that it’s coming down right away when you see a hole in the blade from erosion. That’s, that’s the entire purpose of it. But it does it, you use it to raise awareness that there is something you need to look at imminently or at least react to, uh, and make a plan for. You can’t just pull, you can’t just delay it until next year’s, uh, maintenance campaign. We have an active issue here, so that’s why I think severity four applies to erosion. That has penetrated all structural layers. Allen Hall: Are there some [00:18:00] blade damages that are just can’t be repaired or, or just have too much difficulty to repair them, that it’s not worth it? And how do you know? How do you understand? That blade is not repairable versus the one next to it which looks similar, which can be repaired. What goes into that assessment? Morten Handberg: So one is, is the, is the beam laminate damaged? If it is, then uh, either it comes down to a commercial decision. It’s simply not fixable and, and restoring it in, you know, restoring it back, uh, to original form ship. And there’s also the, the, uh, the, ever, ever, ever, ever, ever, uh, returning element of carbon fiber, because carbon fiber adds another level of complexity repairs, because you’re so dependent on the pristine quality of the carbon for it to, to, for, to utilize the, the, uh, mechanical strength of carbon. And if you, if you don’t apply it in the right way, then you can create some high stress zones. Where, you know, the [00:19:00] cure is as bad as the disease really. So that’s why you have to be extra careful with carbon repairs. But they can be done. But it, you know, it really comes down to a commercial decision then. So in principle, unless the blade is deformed, uh, or, or, or damaged in such a way that you have to remove a large part of the s shell lemonade in a loaded area, then most things they can, in principle, be repaired. It’s just a matter of is the, is the cost of the repair. Cheaper than the cost of a new blade. And that calculation might, you know, depend on are there any, any spare blades available? Is this blade, uh, still in production? And if I don’t repair this, then I don’t have any blade for my turbine and then I can’t operate anymore. That also changed the calculus right along quite a lot, so I think. For a lot of damages. It, it’s more of a, it’s often more of a commercial decision rather than a technical, because ca glass fiber is very forgiving. You can repair a lot, even if it’s really severe. I mean, I’ve seen blade repairs that took [00:20:00] 3000 hours, but it was deemed worthwhile because you couldn’t get a, a bare blade. And in most other cases, that would’ve been been scrapped, you know, without, you know, without blinking. Um, so, so, you know, if you really want to, you could repair it. In a lot of cases, Allen Hall: how difficult is it to repair carbon protrusions, because it does seem like when they manufacture those protrusions, there’s a lot of quality control going into it. The fibers have to be in the right direction all the time, and they’re really compacted in there. They’re tight, tight block of carbon that you’re purchasing and sliding into into this blade. Are they really repairable in sections or is it you have to take out the whole length of a pultrusion and replace it? I’m, I’m trying to understand the difficulty here because there’s a lot of operators in the United States now that have some portion of their fleet is carbon spar cap, not a lot of it, but some of it. How [00:21:00] difficult is that to repair? Morten Handberg: Well, it’s difficult enough that a lot of OEMs, they will say if you have a damage to the carbon, it’s a non-repairable defect. That is to a large extent the general rule. Um, there are, there are, uh, there are ways and some of it is replacement of the protrusion. Um, other, another method is, is to do a vacuum infusion lamination. I’ve also seen some repairs with success where, uh, glass fiber is utilized instead of carbon fiber. So you reply, so you, you, um, you calculate the mechanical strength of the carbon. And then replace that with an equal amount, you know, strength wise of glass fiber. The problem is you are to a degree playing with little bit with fire because you are then changing the structure of the blade. You are increasing the thickness and thereby you are changing the stiffness. So it’s, you have to be really [00:22:00] careful, uh, it’s possible. And uh, again. All if all other options are out and you want this blade really to get up and running again because it’s your only option. Maybe it’s worthwhile to, to investigate, but it requires a lot of insight in and also a little bit of, uh, how do you say, uh, you don’t, you shouldn’t be too risk adverse if you go down that that route, but, but again, it is possible. It is technically possible. But it’s something you do for the outer, uh, outer areas of the blade where you have less loads and you’re less sensitive. Allen Hall: Can those carbon repairs be done up tower or are they always done with the rotor set or the blade drop down to ground? Morten Handberg: I know some carbon repairs have been done up tower, but in general it’s down tower also, just because if you have damage to your carbon, it means you have a severe structural issue. So you wouldn’t generally try to do it that well, I would, not in general, but, but the, the, the cases I’ve seen that, that has been downturn repairs. Yeah. Allen Hall: Do you think about the categories differently? If it includes carbon [00:23:00] as a structural element? Morten Handberg: No, because carbon is part of the load carrying laminate. If you’re to the load carrying laminate, then it becomes a four or five immediately. Um, so, uh, so I would say the same rule applies because ag again, it’s a very rough scale, but it applied, but it gives you a sense of where, you know, what is the urgency, which is what I think we in generally need. And I like the more simple model because it’s more applicable to the general industry and it’s easier for, uh, you know, it’s easier to, to implement. Um. And it is easier to understand than if you have a too too gradual, uh, scale because it’s difficult for the people who are sitting and assessing to determine if, uh, you know, what, what category it is. And it’s difficult for the people who have to read the report afterwards. And it’s also about, you know, what is the purpose? And in general, I would say, well, this, the defect categorization, the severe categorization is to determine can this be repaired or not? That’s what we use it [00:24:00] for. So that, that, that’s how we, it should be applied. Allen Hall: Is the industry going to have a universal standard? Soon. Is that possible? Or is this really gonna be country by country, region by region? How we think about blade defects and blade repairs? Morten Handberg: I think that. Given the, uh, the, how do you say, the individual interests in having their own model from the different OEMs or service providers? I think the, when they’re choosing a pope, they have an easy task ahead of them, you know, deciding that. Then we have the agreeing on an on inte standard and on plate. Allen Hall: Pope is currently an American, so that tells you something. The world has shifted. There is still hope. Maybe there is still hope because it, it is a very difficult problem and I hear a lot of conflicting opinions about it and they’re not wrong. The opinions I hear when they’re explained to me, they have a rationale as to why. They’re calling something a cat four versus a cat three. [00:25:00] It all makes sense, but when you get two engineers in the room, they’re rarely are going to agree. So I’m just thinking maybe, maybe there isn’t a, a yeah, maybe there isn’t a time where we’re all gonna come together. Morten Handberg: I think that, you know, it’s, it’s also about what are you willing to accept and what are you willing to s. You know, as an OEM, as a blade engineer, as a service provider, in order to make common agreement. Because I think if we were willing to, you know, set aside differences, um, and then agree on, okay, what is the, what, what is that, what is the, the ma the industry needs and what, what fulfills the purpose? We could agree tomorrow, but that’s not where we are, uh, at the moment. So, so I don’t see that happening anytime soon. But yes, there, there was a way to do an in to make an international standard. Um, for blades and I, I would say maybe it’s, if the IC made, made, made one, then maybe that that could, uh, that could fix it. Uh, maybe if, uh, they’re starting to become more [00:26:00]focused from governments, uh, and you know, that it wind industry becomes recognized as critical infrastructure. That then there is a requirement for international standards on what are defects, to make it easier to determine what is critical or not, so that proper reaction can be made. That will also help it. But again, as long as it’s only about late experts having to agree with each other and that’s the only then, then we’re, then we will not get to a point where we’re going to agree on, on everything. No. Allen Hall: Wow. This is a continual discussion about blade defects and categorization and Morton. I really appreciate. You’re giving us your thoughts about it because I trust you one and two, you’re on the leading edge of what the industry is thinking. So it’s very good to get you in here and explain where categorization is and, and two operators that are listening to this podcast understand you’re probably getting a lot of different opinions about categorization. You need to sit down and figure it out for yourself, or reach out to Morton who can explain what you should be thinking and how you should be [00:27:00]thinking about this problem. Morton, how do people get ahold of you to learn more? Morten Handberg: Easiest way is to reach out to me on LinkedIn. Um, I have a very active profile there. You can always write me and I’ll always write, write, write it back. You can also write to me on my company email, m me h@windpowerapp.com. Um, those are the two easiest way to get, uh, get in, in, uh, get in touch me. And I would say, as an owner, what you need to know. Is it a structural issue or is a surface issue you have? And then plan your repairs from there. That is, that is the. Basic, yeah, that, that you need to have, and then forget about the others, the other side of it, you know, if it’s one defect type or another, that’s not necessarily what’s going to help you. It’s all about getting the blades repaired. And, uh, and the turbine up and running again. That should be the focus. Allen Hall: Absolutely. Morton, we love having you on the podcast. Thank you so much for joining us. It’s good to be here. See [00:28:00] you.

It's been an unprecedented year in fashion. 16 designers rebooted 15 labels in September causing one of the biggest shakeups in fashion history, Labubus took over the world, and Kendrick Lamar's Celine flared jeans stirred up the discourse.Today on the show, we invited Virginia Smith, Vogue's Global Head of Fashion Network, and Laia Garcia-Furtado, Senior Fashion News Editor at Vogue Runway, to break down all the biggest moments from a massive year in fashion.“Awar closing the Chanel show was my fashion moment of the year because it encapsulated so many great things,” Smith said. “It was really something I have not witnessed very many times in my very long career of attending shows.”Another major collection was Dario Vitale's debut at Versace. Vitale was our reader's 3rd favorite designer of the year, after Blazy at Chanel and Jonathan Anderson at Dior. “Immediately I saw the show and thought, “this is how I want to dress.” said Garcia-Furtado. “As soon as the show ended, I went on The RealReal and bought a pair of Versus jeans within minutes.”Plus, tune in to hear what our editors are looking forward to in 2026.The Run-Through with Vogue is your go-to podcast where fashion meets culture. Hosted by Chloe Malle, Head of Editorial Content, Vogue U.S.; Chioma Nnadi, Head of British Vogue; and Nicole Phelps, Director of Vogue Runway, each episode features the latest fashion news and exclusive designer and celebrity interviews. Learn about your ad choices: dovetail.prx.org/ad-choices

Ya se conocieron en Túnez, pero el bocage normando de aquel verano del 44, cambiaba las reglas de juego. Aquí, la teoría choca con la realidad. Y en este teatro de operaciones, dos filosofías de guerra están a punto de enfrentarse. Comparamos dos carros de combate muy diferentes. El Sherman es la encarnación de la producción en masa y de la flexibilidad operativa. El Tiger un killer con una precisión de relojero suizo. ¿Cuál de los dos fue el mejor tanque? En la serie Versus no nos limitamos a enfrentar tecnológicamente un sistema de armas contra otro, sino que confrontemos aspectos como su rol, diseño, fabricación, recursos, pilotos, integración ... Con Antonio Gómez y Dani CarAn. 🎵 El tema "Opening Versus" está compuesto por Dani CarAn. Esta obra está protegida bajo la licencia Creative Commons Atribución – No Comercial 4.0 Internacional (CC BY-NC 4.0) https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc/4.0/deed.es Escucha el episodio completo en la app de iVoox, o descubre todo el catálogo de iVoox Originals

Introducing the All Def SquADD Cast show “Versus". It's a podcast with the OG SquADD! Each week, the SquADD will debate topics and vote at the end to see what wins. Versus airs every Monday and you can download and listen wherever podcasts are found. Special Guest John Grimes Dion Lack Chinedu Unaka Brandon Broady This Week We Discuss Neck To Toe Tattoos vs One Big Face Tattoo Rich & Anonymous vs Famous & Just Comfortable  Hiccups For A Week Straight vs Listen To A Baby Cry Nonstop For 24 Hours S/o To Our Sponors Blue Chew Bluechew.com Get 10% Off Your First Month Of Blue Chew Gold Promo: SQUADD Better Help https://Better help.com/SQUADD Get 10% Off Your First Month

The moment the syllables spilled from my mouth, I knew I'd screwed up. “And a repeat offender...” I said. “Verse a detective dog.” Verse. It was the opening few stanzas of last night's news, the part of the show where we tease a few of the evening's top stories. And as the opening credits played, with my microphone fader pulled down, I called out to my producer in frustration with myself. “Versus!” I said. “VERSUS.” The emails flooded in. I knew they'd be waiting for me. Polite but gently critical messages, kindly informing me that due to myriad inadequacies in the New Zealand education system, I'd used a term more appropriately associated with Shakespeare or Keats than that of the cunning pest control dog starring in the evening bulletin. But hey. Did you notice there how I used myriad? I don't know about you, but it drives me crazy when I hear people talk about a myriad OF something. It shouldn't because apparently a myriad ‘of' is perfectly correct. Myriad started its English language life in noun form. And yet anytime someone opts for ‘myriad of' instead of the adjective usage, the snooty language snob in me can't help but curl his toes. It's the same when people say less instead of fewer. There are not less than thirty days until the new year. There are fewer than thirty days. Duh. And I hate to admit it, but I'm not fussed whether you're a stranger, a colleague, or my long-suffering wife, I'm that miserable sod who can't help but wait fewer than a few split seconds before pretentiously correcting your mistake. The other one that gets my goat (and yes, it gets my goat... it doesn't get up my goat) is when anyone observes that the proof is in the pudding. The proof is not in the pudding. The proof of the pudding is in the eating. Makes sense when you actually think about it. Speaking of mastication, my Dad was recently spun into a state of despair by the repeated insistence of a prominent sportsperson that they were chomping at the bit for an upcoming contest. Chomping at the bit, rather than champing at the bit. I suppose that really would be a remarkable level of excitement. I know that language is alive. I know that language morphs and evolves. But for those of us who care to conserve usage principles and don't mind putting others right from time, there is nothing like erring while reading the news before 700,000 people, for a rude taste of one's own medicine. How quickly the corrector becomes the corrected. Myriad grammar and usage errors might get my goat, but I've learnt the hard way there are plenty of other grammar and usage tyrants champing at the bit to correct every error. Who knows if my cautionary tale will have any impact —the proof of the pudding is in the eating— but if you've learnt anything, maybe you'll make fewer errors rather than less, after listening to this verse. You know... as opposed to versus. See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Amy MacIver is joined by founder of Versus socks, Jurgens Uys, to discuss why statement socks are fashion accessories you can’t ignore. Presenter John Maytham is an actor and author-turned-talk radio veteran and seasoned journalist. His show serves a round-up of local and international news coupled with the latest in business, sport, traffic and weather. The host’s eclectic interests mean the program often surprises the audience with intriguing book reviews and inspiring interviews profiling artists. A daily highlight is Rapid Fire, just after 5:30pm. CapeTalk fans call in, to stump the presenter with their general knowledge questions. Another firm favourite is the humorous Thursday crossing with award-winning journalist Rebecca Davis, called “Plan B”. Thank you for listening to a podcast from Afternoon Drive with John Maytham Listen live on Primedia+ weekdays from 15:00 and 18:00 (SA Time) to Afternoon Drive with John Maytham broadcast on CapeTalk https://buff.ly/NnFM3Nk For more from the show go to https://buff.ly/BSFy4Cn or find all the catch-up podcasts here https://buff.ly/n8nWt4x Subscribe to the CapeTalk Daily and Weekly Newsletters https://buff.ly/sbvVZD5 Follow us on social media: CapeTalk on Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/CapeTalk CapeTalk on TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@capetalk CapeTalk on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/ CapeTalk on X: https://x.com/CapeTalk CapeTalk on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@CapeTalk567 See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Introducing the All Def SquADD Cast show “Versus". It's a podcast with the OG SquADD! Each week, the SquADD will debate topics and vote at the end to see what wins. Versus airs every Monday and you can download and listen wherever podcasts are found. Special Guest John Grimes Dion Lack Kali Scott This Week We Discuss Super Strength But No Fine Motor Skills vs Super Speed But Tire Quickly Relive Your Happiest Memory Once A Week vs Forget Your Worst Memory Forever Never Be Able To Use Your Dominant Hand vs Only Be Able To Walk Backwards S/o To Our Sponors Cash App Download Cash App Today Don't have Cash App? Use code CASHAPP10 at signup to get $10 when you send $5 to a friend. Terms apply. GLD GLD.com Promo: SQUADD Get 50% Off Indacloud Indacloud.co 25% Off & Free Shipping  Promo: ALLDEF Lucy Lucy.co/SQUAD Get 20% Off Your First Order

Why do some romance authors build decades-long careers while others vanish after one breakout book? What really separates a throwaway pen name and rapid release strategy from a legacy brand and a body of work you're proud of? How can you diversify with trad, indie, non-fiction, and Kickstarter without burning out—or selling out your creative freedom? With Jennifer Probst. In the intro, digital ebook signing [BookFunnel]; how to check terms and conditions; Business for Authors 2026 webinars; Music industry and AI music [BBC; The New Publishing Standard]; The Golden Age of Weird. This podcast is sponsored by Kobo Writing Life, which helps authors self-publish and reach readers in global markets through the Kobo eco-system. You can also subscribe to the Kobo Writing Life podcast for interviews with successful indie authors. This show is also supported by my Patrons. Join my Community at Patreon.com/thecreativepenn Jennifer Probst is a New York Times, USA Today, and Wall Street Journal bestselling author of over 60 books across different kinds of romance as well as non-fiction for writers. Her latest book is Write Free. You can listen above or on your favorite podcast app or read the notes and links below. Here are the highlights, and the full transcript is below. Show Notes How Jennifer started writing at age 12, fell in love with romance, and persisted through decades of rejection A breakout success — and what happened when it moved to a traditional publisher Traditional vs indie publishing, diversification, and building a long-term, legacy-focused writing career Rapid-release pen names vs slow-burn author brands, and why Jennifer chooses quality and longevity Inspirational non-fiction for writers (Write Naked, Write True, Write Free) Using Kickstarter for special editions, re-releases, courses, and what she's learned from both successes and mistakes – plus what “writing free” really means in practice How can you ‘write free'? You can find Jennifer at JenniferProbst.com. Transcript of interview with Jennifer Probst Jo: Jennifer Probst is a New York Times, USA Today, and Wall Street Journal bestselling author of over 60 books across different kinds of romance as well as non-fiction for writers. Her latest book is Write Free. So welcome, Jennifer. Jennifer: Thanks so much, Joanna. I am kind of fangirling. I'm really excited to be on The Creative Penn podcast. It's kind of a bucket list. Jo: Aw, that's exciting. I reached out to you after your recent Kickstarter, and we are going to come back to that in a minute. First up, take us back in time. Tell us a bit more about how you got into writing and publishing. Jennifer: This one is easy for me. I am one of those rarities. I think that I knew when I was seven that I was going to write. I just didn't know what I was going to write. At 12 years old, and now this will kind of date me in dinosaur era here, there was no internet, no information on how to be a writer, no connections out there. The only game in town was Writer's Digest. I would go to my library and pore over Writer's Digest to learn how to be a writer. At 12 years old, all I knew was, “Oh, if I want to be a famous writer, I have to write a book.” So I literally sat down at 12 and wrote my first young adult romance. Of course, I was the star, as we all are when we're young, and I have not stopped since. I always knew, since my dad came home from a library with a box of romance novels and got in trouble with my mum and said, basically, “She's reading everything anyway, just let her read these,” I was gone. From that moment on, I knew that my entire life was going to be about that. So for me, it wasn't the writing. I have written non-stop since I was 12 years old. For me, it was more about making this a career where I can make money, because I think there was a good 30 years where I wrote without a penny to my name. So it was more of a different journey for me. It was more about trying to find my way in the writing world, where everybody said it should be just a hobby, and I believed that it should be something more. Jo: I was literally just going back in my head there to the library I used to go to on my way home from school. Similar, probably early teens, maybe age 14. Going to that section and… I think it was Shirley Conran. Was that Lace? Yes, Lace books. That's literally how we all learned about sex back in the day. Jennifer: All from books. You didn't need parents, you didn't need friends. Amazing. Jo: Oh, those were the days. That must have been the eighties, right? Jennifer: It was the eighties. Yes. Seventies, eighties, but mostly right around in the eighties. Oh, it was so… Jo: I got lost about then because I was reminiscing. I was also the same one in the library, and people didn't really see what you were reading in the corner of the library. So I think that's quite funny. Tell us how you got into being an indie. Jennifer: What had happened is I had this manuscript and it had been shopped around New York for agents and for a bunch of publishers. I kept getting the same exact thing: “I love your voice.” I mean, Joanna, when you talk about papering your wall with rejections, I lived that. The only thing I can say is that when I got my first rejection, I looked at it as a rite of passage that created me as a writer, rather than taking the perspective that it meant I failed. To me, perspective is a really big thing in this career, how you look at things. So that really helped me. But after you get like 75 of them, you're like, “I don't know how much longer I can take of this.” What happened is, it was an interesting story, because I had gone to an RWA conference and I had shopped this everywhere, this book that I just kept coming back to. I kept saying, “I feel like this book could be big.” There was an indie publisher there. They had just started out, it was an indie publisher called Entangled. A lot of my friends were like, “What about Entangled? Why don't you try more digital things or more indie publishers coming up rather than the big traditional ones?” Lo and behold, I sent it out. They loved the book. They decided, in February of 2012, to launch it. It was their big debut. They were kind of competing with Harlequin, but it was going to be a new digital line. It was this new cutting-edge thing. The book went crazy. It went viral. The book was called The Marriage Bargain, and it put me on the map. All of a sudden I was inundated with agents, and the traditional publishers came knocking and they wanted to buy the series. It was everywhere. Then it hit USA Today, and then it spent 26 weeks on The New York Times. Everybody was like, “Wow, you're this overnight sensation.” And I'm like, “Not really!” That was kind of my leeway into everything. We ended up selling that series to Simon & Schuster because that was the smart move for then, because it kind of blew up and an indie publisher at that time knew it was a lot to take on. From then on, my goal was always to do both: to have a traditional contract, to work with indie publishers, and to do my own self-pub. I felt, even back then, the more diversified I am, the more control I have. If one bucket goes bad, I have two other buckets. Jo: Yes, I mean, I always say multiple streams of income. It's so surprising to me that people think that whatever it is that hits big is going to continue. So you obviously experienced there a massive high point, but it doesn't continue. You had all those weeks that were amazing, but then it drops off, right? Jennifer: Oh my goodness, yes. Great story about what happened. So 26 weeks on The New York Times, and it was selling like hotcakes. Then Simon & Schuster took it over and they bumped the price to their usual ebook price, which was, what, $12.99 or something? So it's going from $2.99. The day that they did it, I slid off all the bestseller lists. They were gone, and I lost a lot of control too. With indies, you have a little bit more control. But again, that kind of funnels me into a completely different kind of setup. Traditional is very different from indie. What you touched on, I think, is the biggest thing in the industry right now. When things are hot, it feels like forever. I learned a valuable lesson: it doesn't continue. It just doesn't. Maybe someone like Danielle Steel or some of the other big ones never had to pivot, but I feel like in romance it's very fluid. You have genres hitting big, you have niches hitting big, authors hitting big. Yes, I see some of them stay. I see Emily Henry still staying—maybe that will never pause—but I think for the majority, they find themselves saying, “Okay, that's done now. What's next?” It can either hit or not hit. Does that make sense to you? Do you feel the same? Jo: Yes, and I guess it's not just about the book. It's more about the tactic. You mentioned genres, and they do switch a lot in romance, a lot faster than other genres. In terms of how we do marketing… Now, as we record this, TikTok is still a thing, and we can see maybe generative AI search coming on the horizon and agentic buying. A decade ago it might have been different, more Facebook ads or whatever. Then before that it might have been something else. So there's always things changing along the way. Jennifer: Yes, there definitely is. It is a very oversaturated market. They talk about, I don't know, 2010 to 2016 maybe, as the gold rush, because that was where you could make a lot of money as an indie. Then we saw the total fallout of so many different things. I feel like I've gone through so many ups and downs in the industry. I do love it because the longer you're around, the more you learn how to pivot. If you want this career, you learn how to write differently or do whatever you need to do to keep going, in different aspects, with the changes. To me, that makes the industry exciting. Again, perspective is a big thing. But I have had to take a year to kind of rebuild when I was out of contract with a lot of things. I've had to say, “Okay, what do you see on the horizon now? Where is the new foundation? Where do you wanna restart?” Sometimes it takes a year or two of, “Maybe I won't be making big income and I cut back,” but then you're back in it, because it takes a while to write a few new books, or write under a pen name, or however you want to pivot your way back into the industry. Or, like you were saying, diversifying. I did a lot of non-fiction stuff because that's a big calling for me, so I put that into the primary for a while. I think it's important for authors to maybe not just have one thing. When that one thing goes away, you're scrambling. It's good to have a couple of different things like, “Well, okay, this genre is dead or this thing is dead or this isn't making money. Let me go to this for a little while until I see new things on the horizon.” Jo: Yes. There's a couple of things I want to come back to. You mentioned a pen name there, and one of the things I'm seeing a lot right now—I mean, it's always gone on, but it seems to be on overdrive—is people doing rapid-release, throwaway pen names. So there's a new sub-genre, they write the books really fast, they put them up under whatever pen name, and then when that goes away, they ditch that pen name altogether. Versus growing a name brand more slowly, like I think you and I have done. Under my J.F. Penn fiction brand, I put lots of different sub-genres. What are your thoughts on this throwaway pen name versus growing a name brand more slowly? Jennifer: Well, okay, the first thing I'm goign to say is: if that lights people up, if you love the idea of rapid release and just kind of shedding your skin and going on to the next one, I say go for it. As long as you're not pumping it out with AI so it's a complete AI book, but that's a different topic. I'm not saying using AI tools; I mean a completely AI-written book. That's the difference. If we're talking about an author going in and, every four weeks, writing a book and stuff like that, I do eventually think that anything in life that disturbs you, you're going to burn out eventually. That is a limited-time kind of thing, I believe. I don't know how long you can keep doing that and create decent enough books or make a living on it. But again, I really try not to judge, because I am very open to: if that gives you joy and that's working and it brings your family money, go for it. I have always wanted to be a writer for the long term. I want my work to be my legacy. I don't just pump out books. Every single book is my history. It's a marking of what I thought, what I put out in the world, what my beliefs are, what my story is. It marks different things, and I'm very proud of that. So I want a legacy of quality. As I got older, in my twenties and thirties, I was able to write books a lot faster. Then I had a family with two kids and I had to slow down a little bit. I also think life sometimes drives your career, and that's okay. If you're taking care of a sick parent or there's illness or whatever, maybe you need to slow down. I like the idea of a long-term backlist supporting me when I need to take a back seat and not do frontlist things. So that's how I feel. I will always say: choose a long, organic-growth type of career that will be there for you, where your backlist can support you. I also don't want to trash people who do it differently. If that is how you can do it, if you can write a book in a month and keep doing it and keep it quality, go for it. Jo: I do have the word “legacy” on my board next to me, but I also have “create a body of work I'm proud of.” I have that next to me, and I have “Have you made art today?” So I think about these things too. As you say, people feel differently about work, and I will do other work to make faster cash rather than do that with books. But as we said, that's all good. Interestingly, you mentioned non-fiction there. Write Free is your latest one, but you've got some other writing books. So maybe— Talk about the difference between non-fiction book income and marketing compared to fiction, and why you added that in. Jennifer: Yes, it's completely different. I mean, it's two new dinosaurs. I came to writing non-fiction in a very strange way. Literally, I woke up on New Year's Day and I was on a romance book deadline. I could not do it. I'll tell you, my brain was filled with passages of teaching writing, of things I wanted to share in my writing career. Because again, I've been writing since I was 12, I've been a non-stop writer for over 30 years. I got to my computer and I wrote like three chapters of Write Naked (which was the first book). It was just pouring out of me. So I contacted my agent and I said, “Look, I don't know, this is what I want to do. I want to write this non-fiction book.” She's like, “What are you talking about? You're a romance author. You're on a romance deadline. What do you want me to do with this?” She was so confused. I said, “Yes, how do you write a non-fiction book proposal?” And she was just like, “This is not good, Jen. What are you doing?” Anyway, the funny story was, she said, “Just send me chapters.” I mean, God bless her, she's this wonderful agent, but I know she didn't get it. So I sent her like four chapters of what I was writing and she called me. I'll never forget it. She called me on the phone and she goes, “This is some of the best stuff I have ever read in my life. It's raw and it's truthful, and we've got to find a publisher for this.” And I was like, “Yay.” What happened was, I believe this was one of the most beautiful full circles in my life: Writer's Digest actually made me an offer. It was not about the money. I found that non-fiction for me had a much lower advance and a different type of sales. For me, when I was a kid, that is exactly what I was reading in the library, Writer's Digest. I would save my allowance to get the magazine. I would say to myself, “One day, maybe I will have a book with Writer's Digest.” So for me, it was one of the biggest full-circle moments. I will never forget it. Being published by them was amazing. Then I thought I was one-and-done, but the book just completely touched so many writers. I have never gotten so many emails: “Thank you for saying the truth,” or “Thank you for being vulnerable.” Right before it published, I had a panic attack. I told my husband, “Now everybody's going to know that I am a mess and I'm not fabulous and the world is going to know my craziness.” By being vulnerable about the career, and also that it was specifically for romance authors, it caused a bond. I think it caused some trust. I had been writing about writing for years. After that, I thought it was one-and-done. Then two or three years later I was like, “No, I have more to say.” So I leaned into my non-fiction. It also gives my fiction brain a rest, because when you're doing non-fiction, you're using a different part of your brain. It's a way for me to cleanse my palate. I gather more experiences about what I want to share, and then that goes into the next book. Jo: Yes, I also use the phrase “palate cleanser” for non-fiction versus fiction. I feel like you write one and then you feel like, “Oh, I really need to write the other now.” Jennifer: Yes! Isn't it wonderful? I love that. I love having the two brains and just giving one a break and totally leaning into it. Again, it's another way of income. It's another way. I also believe that this industry has given me so much that it is automatic that I want to give back. I just want to give as much as possible back because I'm so passionate about writing and the industry field. Jo: Well, interestingly though, Writer's Digest—the publisher who published that magazine and other things—went bankrupt in 2019. You've been in publishing a long time. It is not uncommon for publishers to go out of business or to get bought. Things happen with publishers, right? Jennifer: Yes. Jo: So what then happened? Jennifer: So Penguin Random House bought it. All the Writer's Digest authors did not know what they were going to do. Then Penguin Random House bought it and kept Writer's Digest completely separate, as an imprint under the umbrella. So Writer's Digest really hasn't changed. They still have the magazine, they still have books. So it ended up being okay. But what I did do is—because I sold Write Naked and I have no regrets about that, it was the best thing for me to do, to go that route—the second and the third books were self-published. I decided I'm going to self-publish. That way I have the rights for audio, I have the rights for myself, I can do a whole bunch of different things. So Write True, the second one, was self-published. Writers Inspiring Writers I paired up with somebody, so we self-published that. And Write Free, my newest one, is self-published. So I've decided to go that route now with my non-fiction. Jo: Well, as I said, I noticed your Kickstarter. I don't write romance, so I'm not really in that community. I had kind of heard your name before, but then I bought the book and joined the Kickstarter. Then I discovered that you've been doing so much and I was like, “Oh, how, why haven't we connected before?” It's very cool. So tell us about the Kickstarters you've done and what you know, because you've done, I think, a fiction one as well. What are your thoughts and tips around Kickstarter? Jennifer: Yes. When I was taking that year, I found myself kind of… let's just say fired from a lot of different publishers at the time. That was okay because I had contracts that ran out, and when I looked to see, “Okay, do we want to go back?” it just wasn't looking good. I was like, “Well, I don't want to spend a year if I'm not gonna be making the money anyway.” So I looked at the landscape and I said, “It's time to really pull in and do a lot more things on my own, but I've got to build foundations.” Kickstarter was one of them. I took a course with Russell Nohelty and Monica Leonelle. They did a big course for Kickstarter, and they were really the ones going around to all the conferences and basically saying, “Hey guys, you're missing out on a lot of publishing opportunities here,” because Kickstarter publishing was getting good. I took the course because I like to dive into things, but I also want to know the foundation of it. I want to know what I'm doing. I'm not one to just wing it when it comes to tech. So what happened is, the first one, I had rights coming back from a book. After 10 years, my rights came back. It was an older book and I said, “You know what? I am going to dip my foot in and see what kind of base I can grow there. What can I do?” I was going to get a new cover, add new scenes, re-release it anyway, right? So I said, “Let's do a Kickstarter for it, because then I can get paid for all of that work.” It worked out so fantastically. It made just enough for my goal. I knew I didn't want to make a killing; I knew I wanted to make a fund. I made my $5,000, which I thought was wonderful, and I was able to re-release it with a new cover, a large print hardback, and I added some scenes. I did a 10-year anniversary re-release for my fans. So I made it very fan-friendly, grew my audience, and I was like, “This was great.” The next year, I did something completely different. I was doing Kindle Vella back in the day. That was where you dropped a chapter at a time. I said, “I want to do this completely different kind of thing.” It was very not my brand at all. It was very reality TV-ish: young college students living in the city, very sexy, very angsty, love triangles, messy—everything I was not known for. Again, I was like, “I'm not doing a pen name because this is just me,” and I funnelled my audience. I said, “What I'm going to do is I'm going to start doing a chapter a week through Kindle Vella and make money there. Then when it's done, I'm going to bundle it all up and make a book out of it.” So I did a year of Kindle Vella. It was the best decision I made because I just did two chapters a week, which I was able to do. By one year I had like 180,000 words. I had two to three books in there. I did it as a hardback deluxe—the only place you could get it in print. Then Vella closed, or at least it went way down. So I was like, “Great, I'm going to do this Kickstarter for this entire new thing.” I partnered with a company that helps with special editions, because that was a whole other… oh Joanna, that was a whole other thing you have to go into. Getting the books, getting the art, getting the swag. I felt like I needed some help for that. Again, I went in, I funded. I did not make a killing on that, but that was okay. I learned some things that I would have changed with my Kickstarter and I also built a new audience for that. I had a lot of extra books that I then sold in my store, and it was another place to make money. The third Kickstarter I used specifically because I had always wanted to do a writing course. I go all over the world, I do keynotes, I do workshops, I've done books, and I wanted to reach new writers, but I don't travel a lot anymore. So I came up with the concept that I was going to do my very first course, and it was going to be very personal, kind of like me talking to them almost like in a keynote, like you're in a room with me. I gathered a whole bunch of stuff and I used Kickstarter to help me A) fund it and B) make myself do it, because it was two years in the making and I always had, “Oh, I've got this other thing to do,” you know how we do that, right? We have big projects. So I used Kickstarter as a deadline and I decided to launch it in the summer. In addition to that, I took years of my posts from all over. I copied and pasted, did new posts, and I created Write Free, which was a very personal, essay-driven book. I took it all together. I took a couple of months to do this, filmed the course, and the Kickstarter did better than I had ever imagined. I got quadruple what I wanted, and it literally financed all the video editing, the books, everything that I needed, plus extra. I feel like I'm growing in Kickstarter. I hope I'm not ranting. I'm trying to go over things that can help people. Jo: Oh no, that is super useful. Jennifer: So you don't have to go all in and say, “If it doesn't fund it's over,” or “I need to make $20,000.” There are people making so much money, and there are people that will do a project a year or two projects a year and just get enough to fund a new thing that they want to do. So that's how I've done it. Jo: I've done quite a few now, and my non-fiction ones have been a lot bigger—I have a big audience there—and my fiction have been all over the place. What I like about Kickstarter is that you can do these different things. We can do these special editions. I've just done a sprayed-edge short story collection. Short story collections are not the biggest genre. Jennifer: Yes. I love short stories too. I've always wanted to do an anthology of all my short stories. Jo: There you go. Jennifer: Yes, I love that for your Kickstarter. Love it. Jo: When I turned 50 earlier this year, I realised the thing that isn't in print is my short stories. They are out there digitally, and that's why I wanted to do it. I feel like Kickstarter is a really good way to do these creative projects. As you say, you don't have to make a ton of money, but at the end of the day, the definition of success for us, I think for both of us, is just being able to continue doing this, right? Jennifer: Absolutely. This is funding a creative full-time career, and every single thing that you do with your content is like a funnel. The more funnels that you have, the bigger your base. Especially if you love it. It would be different if I was struggling and thinking, “Do I get an editor job?” I would hate being an editor. But if you look at something else like, “Oh yes, I could do this and that would light me up, like doing a course—wow, that sounds amazing,” then that's different. It's kind of finding your alternates that also light you up. Jo: Hmm. So were there any mistakes in your Kickstarters that you think are worth sharing? In case people are thinking about it. Jennifer: Oh my God, yes. So many. One big thing was that I felt like I was a failure if I didn't make a certain amount of money because my name is pretty well known. It's not like I'm brand new and looking. One of the big things was that I could not understand and I felt like I was banging my head against the wall about why my newsletter subscribers wouldn't support the Kickstarter. I'm like, “Why aren't you doing this? I'm supposed to have thousands of people that just back.” Your expectations can really mess with you. Then I started to learn, “Oh my God, my newsletter audience wants nothing to do with my Kickstarter.” Maybe I had a handful. So then I learned that I needed longer tails, like putting it up for pre-order way ahead of time, and also that you can't just announce it in your newsletter and feel like everybody's going to go there. You need to find your streams, your Kickstarter audience, which includes ads. I had never done ads either and I didn't know how to do that, so I did that all wrong. I joined the Facebook group for Kickstarter authors. I didn't do that for the first one and then I learned about it. You share backer updates, so every time you go into your audience with a backer update, there's this whole community where you can share with like-minded people with their projects, and you post it under your updates. It does cross-networking and sharing with a lot of authors in their newsletters. For the Write Free one, I leaned into my networking a lot, using my connections. I used other authors' newsletters and people in the industry to share my Kickstarter. That was better for me than just relying on my own fanbase. So definitely more networking, more sharing, getting it out on different platforms rather than just doing your own narrow channel. Because a lot of the time, you think your audience will follow you into certain things and they don't, and that needs to be okay. The other thing was the time and the backend. I think a lot of authors can get super excited about swag. I love that, but I learned that I could have pulled back a little bit and been smarter with my financials. I did things I was passionate about, but I probably spent much more money on swag than I needed to. So looking at different aspects to make it more efficient. I think each time you do one, you learn what works best. As usual, I try to be patient with myself. I don't get mad at myself for trying things and failing. I think failing is spectacular because I learn something. I know: do I want to do this again? Do I want to do it differently? If we weren't so afraid of failingqu “in public”, I think we would do more things. I'm not saying I never think, “Oh my God, that was so embarrassing, I barely funded and this person is getting a hundred thousand.” We're human. We compare. I have my own reset that I do, but I really try to say, “But no, for me, maybe I'll do this, and if it doesn't work, that's okay.” Jo: I really like that you shared about the email list there because I feel like too many people have spent years driving people to Kindle or KU, and they have built an email list of readers who like a particular format at a particular price. Then we are saying, “Oh, now come over here and buy a beautiful hardback that's like ten times the price.” And we're surprised when nobody does it. Is that what happened? Jennifer: Exactly. Also, that list was for a non-fiction project. So I had to funnel where my writers were in my newsletter, and I have mostly readers. So I was like, “Okay…” But I think you're exactly right. First of all, it's the platform. When you ask anybody to go off a platform, whether it's buy direct at your Shopify store or go to Kickstarter, you are going to lose the majority right there. People are like, “No, I want to click a button from your newsletter and go to a site that I know.” So you've got that, and you've got to train them. That can take some time. Then you've got this project where people are like, “I don't understand.” Even my mum was like, “I would love to support you, honey, but what the heck is this? Where's the buy button and where's my book?” My women's fiction books tend to have some older readers who are like, “Hell no, I don't know what this is.” So you have to know your audience. If it's not translating, train them. I did a couple of videos where I said, “Look, I want to show you how easy this is,” and I showed them directly how to go in and how to back. I did that with Kindle Vella too. I did a video from my newsletter and on social: “Hey, do you not know how to read this chapter? Here's how.” Sometimes there's a barrier. Like you said, Joanna, if I have a majority that just want sexy contemporary, and I'm dropping angsty, cheating, forbidden love, they're like, “Oh no, that's not for me.” So you have to know whether there's a crossover. I go into my business with that already baked into my expectations. I don't go in thinking I'm going to make a killing. Then I'm more surprised when it does well, and then I can build it. Jo: Yes, exactly. Also if you are, like both of us, writing across genres, then you are always going to split your audience. People do not necessarily buy everything because they have their preferences. So I think that's great. Now we are almost out of time, but this latest book is Write Free. I wondered if you would maybe say— What does Write Free mean to you, and what might it help the listeners with? Jennifer: Write Free is an extremely personal book for me, and the title was really important because it goes with Write Naked, Write True, and Write Free. These are the ways that I believe a writer should always show up to the page. Freedom is being able to write your truth in whatever day that is. You're going to be a different writer when you're young and maybe hormonal and passionate and having love affairs. You're going to write differently when you're a mum with kids in nappies. You're going to write differently when you are maybe in your forties and you're killing your career. Your perspective changes, your life changes. Write Free is literally a collection of essays all through my 30 years of life. It's very personal. There are essays like, “I'm writing my 53rd book right now,” and essays like, “My kids are in front of SpongeBob and I'm trying to write right now,” and “I got another rejection letter and I don't know how to survive.” It is literally an imprint of essays that you can dip in and dip out of. It's easy, short, inspirational, and it's just me showing up for my writing life. That's what I wish for everybody: that they can show up for their writing life in the best way that they can at the time, because that changes all the time. Jo: We can say “write free” because we've got a lot of experience at writing. I feel like when I started writing—I was an IT consultant—I literally couldn't write anything creative. I didn't believe I could. There'll be people listening who are just like, “Well, Jennifer, I can't write free. I'm not free. My mind is shackled by all these expectations and everything.” How can they release that and aim for more freedom? Jennifer: I love that question so much. The thing is, I've spent so many years working on that part. That doesn't come overnight. I think sometimes when you have more clarification of, “Okay, this is really limiting me,” then when you can see where something is limiting you, at least you can look for answers. My answers came in the form of meditation. Meditation is a very big thing in my life. Changing my perspective. Learning life mottos to help me deal with those kinds of limitations. Learning that when I write a sex scene, I can't care about my elderly aunt who tells my mother, “Dear God, she ruined the family name.” It is your responsibility to figure out where these limitations are, and then slowly see how you can remove them. I've been in therapy. I have read hundreds of self-help books. I take meditation courses. I take workshop courses. I've done CliftonStrengths with Becca Syme. I don't even know if that's therapy, but it feels like therapy to me as a writer. Knowing my personality traits. I've done Enneagram work with Claire Taylor, which has been huge. The more you know yourself and how your brain is showing up for yourself, the more you can grab tools to use. I wish I could say, “Yes, if everybody meditates 30 minutes a day, you're going to have all blocks removed,” but it's so personal that it's a trick question. If everybody started today and said, “Where is my biggest limitation?” and be real with yourself, there are answers out there. You just have to go slowly and find them, and then the writing more free will come. I hope that wasn't one of those woo-woo answers, but I really do believe it. Jo: I agree. It just takes time. Like our writing career, it just takes time. Keep working on it, keep writing. Jennifer: Yes. And bravery, right? A lot of bravery. Just show up for yourself however you can. If “write free” feels too big, journal for yourself and put it in a locked drawer. Any kind of writing, I think, is therapeutic too. Jo: Brilliant. So where can people find you and your books and everything you do online? Jennifer: The best place to go is my website. I treat it like my home. It's www.JenniferProbst.com. There is so much on it. Not just books, not just free content and free stories. There's an entire section just for writers. There are videos on there. There are a lot of resources. I keep it up to date and it is the place where you can find me. Of course I'm everywhere on social media as Author Jennifer Probst. You can find me anywhere. I always tell everybody: I answer my messages, I answer my emails. That is really important to me. So if you heard this podcast and you want to reach out on anything, please do. I will answer. Jo: Fantastic. Well, thanks so much for your time, Jennifer. That was great. Jennifer: Thanks for having me, Joanna.The post Writing Free: Romance Author Jennifer Probst On A Long-Term Author Career first appeared on The Creative Penn.

Send us a textWe unpack brand misreads around DEI, then shift into AI's new place in music as an AI artist hits the Billboard charts. The second half breaks down No Limit vs Cash Money, why showmanship beat scarcity, and who could credibly face Jay-Z in a Versus.• Target's inclusivity optics and how brands underestimate cultural risk• AI as tool vs replacement in music creation• Prompting as a communication skill and why it matters• The ethics and reality of relationships with AI• Service apps, convenience trade-offs, and hidden costs• No Limit vs Cash Money: attendance, presence, and MVPs• Snoop's loyalty, Master P's protection, and legacy moments• Mannie Fresh vs KLC and production identity• Who can match Jay-Z: Wayne, Nas, Drake, Kanye• Why Jay vs Nas makes the most musical senseYoutube to https://youtube.com/playlist?list=PLPIs6Ko7BCc9l5jlE5AbAUqZ0gAOhmuq- https://mixed-vibez-drip.printify.me/

Content Creator and Steph Curry Super Fan Jay Roebuck joins in on this episode of Combo's Court. Combo and Jay discuss Steph Curry's legacy, Magic Johnson comparisons, Larry Bird peak vs longevity, and whether Steph belongs in the GOAT tier — this episode delivers the debate. Combo and Jay Robuck break down the evolution of Steph's career, how situation impacts greatness, and where he stands against legends like Magic, Bird, Kobe, LeBron and MJ. We also close the episode with hip-hop heat: Jay-Z vs Lil Wayne in a Versus, Wayne's mixtape peak vs JAY-Z's longevity, and who really stands as the Michael Jordan of rap! And More! USE CODE COMBO ON PRIZEPICKS! Sign up on PrizePicks using the promo code “Combo.” Make a deposit of $5 or more and receive $50 instantly here: prizepicks.onelink.me/ivHR/COMBO Support the show: Cash App $CombosCourt | Venmo @CombosCourt Drop a review wherever you listen!

Introducing the All Def SquADD Cast show “Versus". It's a podcast with the OG SquADD! Each week, the SquADD will debate topics and vote at the end to see what wins. Versus airs every Monday and you can download and listen wherever podcasts are found. Special Guest Roxxy Haze Dion Lack Kali Scott This Week We Discuss Have Your Entire Memory Uploaded & Public To Others vs Never Be Able To Tell Personal Stories Again Remember Everything You Read vs Everything You Experience 1 Minute Poop Every 20 Mins vs 1 Years Worth Of Pooping Randomly Once A Year S/o To Our Sponors Bubs Natural Get 20% Off Your Entire Order Bubsnatural.com Promo: Squadd Cash App Download Cash App & Recieve $5 When You Send $10 To A Friend Lucy Get 20% Off Your First Order Lucy.co/SQUADD Promo: SQUAD

Introducing the All Def SquADD Cast show “Versus". It's a podcast with the OG SquADD! Each week, the SquADD will debate topics and vote at the end to see what wins. Versus airs every Monday and you can download and listen wherever podcasts are found. Special Guest Sydney Castilo Kali Harris Ty Davis John Grimes This Week We Discuss Trapped In A Room W/ 10,000 Tarantulas For 10 Mins vs Eat 10 Tarantulas In 10 Minutes Have A Full Day W/ A Deceased loved One vs 50K Instantly Forever; Give Up Heat & AC vs Give Up Internet S/o To Our Sponsors Blue Vhew Bluechew.com/SQUADD First Month Free! Just $5 For Shipping (Rules Apply) Indacloud Indaclous.co Promo: ALLDEF

When trying to grow your property management business, have you ever thought to yourself, "Man, it would be great if I just had more leads?" In this episode of the #DoorGrowShow, property management growth experts Jason and Sarah Hull discuss the Leads Myth and how "just having more leads" will not actually help you grow your business. You'll Learn [02:06] The Myth of Needing More Leads [11:39] Leaks in Your Sales Pipeline [22:41] The Future of SEO with AI Quotables "Why do we call it the leads myth? Well, the myth is this lie that we believe that you just need more leads. And the assumption in that is that all leads are the same." "The more clarity you have, the less wrong stuff you're going to be doing." "Not all clients are equal, right? Which means not all leads you get are equal. You need to qualify them." Resources DoorGrow and Scale Mastermind DoorGrow Academy DoorGrow on YouTube DoorGrowClub DoorGrowLive Transcript Jason Hull (00:00) Most of the industry is trapped in a cycle of suck. This is why most property managers suck in most markets. Maybe even you that's listening. We are Jason and Sarah Hull, the owners of DoorGrow, the world's leading and most comprehensive coaching and consulting firm for long-term residential property management entrepreneurs. For over a decade and a half, we have brought innovative strategies and optimization to the property management industry. We help people grow their property management businesses quickly. And our mission is to transform property management business owners and their businesses. We want to transform the industry, eliminate the BS, build awareness, change perception, expand the market, and help the best property management entrepreneurs win. Now let's get into the show. All right. So today we're going to be chatting a little bit about the leads myth that a lot of people believe. So if you have ever thought to yourself, I just need more leads. If I just had more leads, everything else would be great in my business. What do you have to say about that? Well, I think that is not the case. Okay. It's definitely not the case. And I also think almost kind of be careful what you ask for a little bit. getting a whole bunch of leads was never really the best. strategy anyway, unless you have people who are just picking up the phone and calling you and saying hey, I Would love for you to just manage my property. I don't have any questions. Here's my money. I just had a contract Those are leads I want but cold leads that are Not ready to go that need to be warmed up that have a bajillion questions That might not even understand why they want to work with you Specifically, yeah, I'm just not interested in those leads. And the other thing I think we need to discuss on this episode specifically is the changes that we're seeing because of AI. So AI is really great and also it's changing things very rapidly and leads and SEO that's very effective by this too. Okay. So. Let's get into this. So a lot of people believe they just need more leads. And the danger in that is if you really just think you need more leads, you're going to go out to the marketplace and talk to marketers and they're going to go, cool, I'll give you leads. And they will sell you leads basically. So why do we call it the leads myth? Well, the myth is this lie that we believe that you just need more leads. And the assumption in that is that all leads are the same. And they're not, they're not even remotely the same. So there's a couple of different frameworks that we usually talk about to kind of destroy the leads myth. One is the four Ds to revenue. Another is the cycle of suck we talk about and how people get stuck in growth. We talk sometimes about the pipeline leaks that you have in your pipeline. And we talk about the myth of SEO or internet marketing. And then we often talk about any others warm versus cold leads and then David versus Goliath. Okay. So we can tackle these all really quickly and go through each of these and maybe some other things will pop up as we go. Cool. Let's talk about all of that and then we'll talk about why AI has changed all of, really all of those things. Okay. That'll be in conjunction with SEO. All right, so let's go through these. And so for those following along, if you stack all these concepts, each one compounds your speed of growth. They're all related. And so these are frameworks that I love to share with clients to help them understand so that they don't make the mistake of doing the wrong stuff. The more clarity you have, the less wrong stuff you're going to be doing. The less you're going to be experimenting, the less you're going to be wasting time. And if you really wanna collapse time, the easiest hack is reach out to us and we can help you with all of this. We've been doing this for over a decade and a half. We have had hundreds of guinea pigs to figure this all out and we have over 100. case studies and testimonials more than anyone else in the industry. All right. Let's get into this. let's talk about the four D's to revenue. So these are four numbers when multiplied equal the gross revenue in your business. And I sometimes call them the four doors to revenue. And I showed four doors with a little multiplication X next to each of them equals your money. Right? So not all leads are equal. So the, these D's are, if you want to write them down, they each start with a D. It is Deals, doors, duration, and dollars. Okay? So the first is like how many deals is this client going to bring you? Not all clients are equal, right? Which means not all leads you get are equal. You need to qualify them. And how many doors are they bringing to the table? Or how many doors per deal are they bringing? And then the third D is duration. How long are they going to stick around or be involved in property management? is are they an accidental investor that's going to stick around for maybe a year, or are they in the buy and hold game and they'll be around for 10? And then the last D is revenue or is dollars. And so are they a cheapo? Are they a premium buyer? Where do they kind of fit? Or are they somewhere in the middle, like the normals as I call them? So we've got these four Ds. So let's play a quick example. Let's take the accidental investor. They couldn't sell their property. They wanna get it rented out. How does this play out in the 4Ds? done one deal. They didn't mean to do a deal, but they did. And it's usually just one door. Maybe sometimes they have two, but very often we just see one door and they're not looking to... to do more deals because as soon as the market spikes and the market is hot, they're going to bail. They're going to sell, which means the duration is questionable. Let's say it's like one year, like if they can just get it rented. but it might be a few months because if the market spikes three months from now, they're probably going to dump that property pretty quick. And then. than the dollars, they're not your premium buyers. They're not looking to do a lot of improvements. They're not looking to spend a lot of money. They're the people who, they have this property, they aren't quite sure what to do with it. They figure, let's just see if I can get it rented. They want it well taken care of, but they're not generally looking to spend a lot of money or invest a lot of money in either the property or maintenance or repairs or improvements or a property manager. So they're just trying to... Do what they need to do. It's like the bare minimum in order to get a tenant. All right, so one, one, one, right? Like one deal, one door, one year duration, for example, if this is worst case scenario and you sign a one year agreement with them and they're a cheapo, right? Now let's take a really great scenario. What would be maybe an opposite scenario or a really great opportunity? Like my, I will say my second largest client. He had 42 doors I think was the right answer but I was looking to buy more. So when I took him on he had 42 by the time I sold the business he had 60 something. So he was always doing multiple deals. Yeah. The doors that he had came out of multiple deals. So since he did multiple deals he also had multiple doors. was consistently looking to grow. He didn't want to just stop, you know, at a certain point he was always looking. He also was a buy and hold investor. He wasn't trying to buy these things and then wait, you know, until the market spiked and then try to sell them and make a profit. He wasn't up for the long term. And he was not a cheapo. He wasn't trying to cut corners. He wasn't trying to cut costs. You he wanted to work with. a property manager, wanted to take care of the properties and make sure that they were being maintained properly. Yeah. Okay. So that's a great example that previous client that you had. So let's just say like on each of these fees, we use tens instead of ones, right? Like let's say they do 10 deals over the life of being with you. They've got 10 doors. Maybe sometimes it's 10 doors per deal if they're doing small multis or something like this, right? And then you've got a 10 year buy and hold duration. In this hypothetical example that I just threw out, it would be 10 times 10 times 10. This would be over a thousand times greater lifetime value than that accidental investor in our previous hypothetical. Does that make sense? So are these even remotely equal? No, not even remotely equal. Should you then spend the same amount of time trying to cultivate both of those type of leads? Probably not. Would you spend the same amount of time following up or giving them attention? Probably not. And the great investor clients probably are easier to deal with, less emotional, have a much higher margin and operational cost is lower, right? And so there's a lot of benefits. so this is, we're just talking about the revenue piece, but when we look at the cost side of things as well, everybody knows having a really bad owner that's really needy and difficult and emotional about the property. can be a big headache and a big challenge and you may be losing money on some of those doors. So, four D's to revenue, that's one concept. One quick thing I wanna add to that is where do you think these owners hang out? So, if you've got an accidental landlord and they are looking for a property manager, where might that lead come from? Versus where might the lead of a client that has 42 doors come from? There's a lot higher probability that an online lead is going to be an accidental landlord. It's not impossible to get an online lead that has 42 doors. It's just probably not your norm because the ones that have 42 doors, they aren't really dabbling. They aren't going, oh, geez, I wonder if I should get a property manager to maybe help me with these. They are just a little bit more savvy. A lot of times those aren't going to be the leads that you're getting if you're buying leads. Although those are the leads that you want, it's not going to be the norm that you get. All right, so we're 10 minutes into this. We're going to crank through some of the rest of these. So cycle of suck. Cycle of suck, real simple. If you take on any client, it leads to you having some bad clients. So if you take on bad clients, that leads to you having bad properties, which leads to having bad. Residents or tenants which leads to having a bad reputation or reviews which leads to you attracting more bad clients. So not all leads are good. You don't want to take on every client and you definitely don't want to attract or get more bad leads. And so this is a framework that if you understand you can reverse it and focus on a cycle of success where you're picky about the owners you take on, you're picky about the properties you take on, you're picky about the tenants which everybody tries to do anyway. but those first two steps are supremely important. And then you're going to have a methodology for getting more positive reviews. These are things we help our clients with. And so then you create a cycle of success. Most of the industry is trapped in a cycle of suck. This is why most property managers suck in most markets. Maybe even you that's listening. We want you to get out of the cycle of suck. All right, let's talk about the pipeline leaks. Okay. So usually if I were drawing, I would draw a spigot or a faucet or whatever you attach a hose to, and then I would draw a hose, and then I would draw a little plant or tree that you're trying to grow at the end of the yard that this hose is trying to get water to. Most of you listening think, I just need more leads. This is where the lead Smith becomes really obvious, trying to turn on that faucet even more. I just need more water flowing through the hose. That would make sense, that would be true unless there's a problem with the hose, right? Like the hose has some leaks. And if the hose has some major holes in it, there's not going to be a lot coming out the other end. Sometimes very little at all. And so it's not about how many leads you're getting, sometimes it's just how good is your pipeline? How tight is your product? And so we need to make sure that we get those leaks shored up. And we'll just mention what they are real quick, but. One of the earliest ones that affects you is just awareness. It's going to be your perception and reputation online. It's going to be your website. It's going to be your branding. So they can tell that you are in this industry and that it's clear that that's your focus and it's not real estate or something else. And what else? Your culture and purpose. This is the actual product that you sell. So that is another one. And there are two more. Pricing. Pricing, which everybody's trying to price the same way, 10 % or worse, pure percentage, or they're doing flat fee. We have a different innovative pricing model. If you're curious about that, set up a call with our team. We can tell you about it. That allows you to close more deals more easily at a higher price point. And the last is the pitch, right? Selling. And so if you can dial in each of these leaks, what we've noticed over the years is we can double a company's close rate without changing the amount of leads or lead sources that they're getting currently if we can get those things dialed in. And that's significant. Maybe you don't need more leads. Maybe you just need less leakage in your pipeline. Cool. All right, the next one, you had mentioned warm versus cold leads. Do you wanna explain the difference? Yeah, we can talk about warm versus cold. So when I had my property management business, Yeah. what is a cold lead? So cold lead is someone who really has almost zero, very little familiarity with who you are in your company and your brand and what you do. They don't. they should work with you. That's the big thing is why they should work with you. So they don't know you, trust you or like you. That's a cold lead. And a warm lead. Warm lead would be something like a referral or some sort of recommendation. hey, Sarah is the best, I work with her and you should too. Now they're coming in already feeling like, somebody that I know that I trust recommended this person, so therefore I should also trust this person. So those obviously have a much different close rate. And there are things that you can do to increase your close rate or to warm up deals, of course. But if you're spending all of your time trying to close a bunch of cold leads, which generally is going to be what happens when you're purchasing leads, you really don't get to buy warm leads. Right. They're all cold. I mean, that would be great if you could, but when you're buying leads, you're usually buying a lead that is very cold. They don't know you at all. And oftentimes that same lead is being sold to multiple different companies. There's a lot of blood in the water there. So warm leads versus cold leads, the close rate on warm leads will be really high, like 90 % or higher. Cold leads, like the opposite, 10 % or worse. And so I would rather a client get five warm leads and maybe close four of them than 10 cold leads and maybe get one. The hidden pain point or secret with warm versus cold lead generation. or cold lead strategies is time. Cold leads take a massive amount of time because you have to nurture them and warm them up and build the trust and create the relationship. And even after all of that, and all of sudden done, the conversion rate's really low. So all of you know how high the close rate is if you get a really great word of mouth referral. We love those, right? That's a warm lead. So we have strategies and methods that we focus on with clients to increase the warm leads. while avoiding and doing cold lead advertising and avoiding worrying about cold leads. Once you start getting some growth engines installed for your business that give you warm leads, you're not going to want the cold leads. They feel like garbage in comparison, and you're not going to have time for them. And you're not going to wanna waste time on those because those are often the worst owners. All right. What I would say is as far as getting leads in, if you give me three warm leads, I will take three warm leads over even 100 cold leads. Sure. don't, I don't, I'm not really interested because even if I close, let's say two out of the three warm leads, that's great. What's the close rate on 100 cold leads? If it's about 10%, you might close 10. And some of you might be going, Sarah, 10 is better than two. Yeah, you're right. But how much work did it take for me to close the two versus how much work? did it take for me to close the 10? I would rather close two very easy warmed up leads because I can do that again and again and again. So in the same amount of time, I can close way more warm leads than I can cold leads. So I would rather take three warm leads than a hundred cold leads any day of the week. We have a sponsor for this episode. Many of you tell me that maintenance is probably the least enjoyable part of being a property manager and definitely the most time consuming. But what if you could cut that workload by up to 85 %? That's exactly what Vendero has achieved. They've leveraged cutting edge AI technology to handle nearly all your maintenance tasks from initiating work orders and troubleshooting to coordinating with vendors and reporting. This AI doesn't just automate, it becomes your ideal employee, learning your preferences and executing tasks flawlessly, never needing a day off and never quitting. This frees you up to focus on the critical tasks that really move the needle for your business, whether that's refining operations, expanding your portfolio, or even just taking a well deserved break. Over half of the room last year at DoorGroad Live, our conference signed up with Vendero right there. And then a year later, they're not just satisfied, they're raving about how Vendero has transformed their business, don't let maintenance drag you down. Step up your property management game with Vendoroo. Visit Vendoroo.ai slash door grow today and make this the last maintenance hire you'll ever need. All right. I thought it was a good time because it was a good time. Waste of time and I don't like to waste time and maintenance coordination can be a huge waste of time. Yes. All right. Let's talk about David versus Goliath. So I'll give you an example. We've got a client. that has, so this is dumb David versus smart David, right? The story of David and Goliath, if you're not familiar with the Bible. David goes to fight Goliath. These two warring nations send out their best person and David decides he is not going to wear the armor, the sword, the shield, all the heavy stuff. He's just bringing out his slingshot. He's got his sling, he's got some rock and he goes out to fight Goliath and he's like, I don't need all that stuff. What most property managers do is David basically brought a superior technology. He brought a gun to a sword fight and he was good at this. He trusted himself. He had skill. He had a better tech to beat this giant. He flung the rock right into the guy's head. I had knocked him unconscious or killed him, I don't know. And then he chopped the guy's head off with his own sword. Right. And so that's the story of David and Goliath. So let's talk about the dumb version of David. Like if David wasn't smart. And he said, I'm going to do all the same stuff. I'm going to use the sword of SEO and the shield of pay per click and the helmet of content marketing and the breastplate of social media marketing. And I'm going to do all the same stuff, digital marketing that all the other big companies are doing that are spending two to $3,000 a month or greater. I'm going to go compete with them as a small startup or a small pro. two to 400 unit property management business and try and compete with these big companies that have thousands of doors. One of our clients, as an example, came to us has 6,000 doors. They were spending $30,000 a month doing these strategies to try to grow and it wasn't even working for them. So why would you go and do what the big guys are doing and lose the battle with them and it's not even working for them, right? So that's the idea of David and Goliath. Don't go do what the big guys are doing, find a better way to compete, especially if you're smaller than them. You don't wanna try to outspend them, because that's not going to be possible. right, myth of SEO. All right, and we'll talk a little bit about the future and AI, all right, to wrap things up. So, all of you can go check this out for yourself. This is not me making stuff up. You can go on trends.google.com. You can go look up property management. date it, the time period, to the current time back to 2004, to the present. And you can filter by the US if you want to. What you'll see is that property management search volume, the amount of people searching for property management on Google has not increased since they started tracking data back in 2004. What has increased? The Goliaths, right? The companies spending a lot of money on digital marketing trying to do all this stuff. And so it's created a lot more competition. So this is where we get into another framework that we share, which is the blue ocean versus the red ocean. There's this small little area of the ocean that's red bloody water where all the sharks are fighting over the worst fish, which are these terrible property management business owners that are at the end of the sales cycle. Basically the crappy scraps that fell off the word of mouth table that the warm lead stuff has captured. They're what's left over. And so there's these ugly gross fish and the sharks are all fighting over the worst stuff. And there's this huge ocean full of fish in the U.S. 60 % are self-managing. There's tons of business out there. And so the myth of SEO is basically this, that in order to win the game, you need to have the top spot on Google. Not true. You don't even have to show up on Google in order to go out and be able to create business. Because there aren't really people searching for property management. It's very small. So you don't need to be found on Google. You need to go find owners because the best clients are offline and they're not looking for you and they don't like doing property management and they need you, but they're not looking for property management actively right now. And you can figure out how to go make that happen and we can teach you, right? So let's talk about the future of AI. What are we noticing? Well, I don't think it's any surprise. messed up a lot of Yeah, it's changing everything. AI is going to change everything. And if you haven't noticed it yet, just hold on because you will. It's crazy if you haven't even seen it yet. But it's it's going to flip everything you know upside down, including SEO. Yeah, including SEO. So everyone that is like, no, I don't care. I'm still going to do SEO. That's the only way to go. Like we made a video about this. specifically for this reason, but even the ones who are still clinging to SEO and you just can't let it go and you don't know that there's another way and maybe you don't believe it and you're like, no, I'm no, this is the only thing I'm going to do and I'm going to do this and that's the only way I can grow the business. That is all right and SEO is going to force you to look at that. Okay, yeah, so what we're seeing is search volume on Google is going down. There's less people using Google. More people are now going to LLMs like ChatGPT, Clod, Perplexity, Google's Gemini. So people are using tools now, sometimes within software, and they're using these tools to ask questions, to figure things out, figure out who they should use or who they should choose or what they need. And so Is it still relevant to have good reviews? Yes. Is it still relevant to maybe have some SEO stuff going? Probably, but it's certainly on the down slope and it's certainly decreasing. The game is changing. Even if you search on Google now, the AI at the top will respond to your search request anyway. And a lot of people are just reading that and not really looking at the results below. And so this is the new future. It's changing very quickly. and some are calling it AEO, some are calling it LLM, SEO, there's all these different phrases that are coming out. If you want to do a quick experiment, open up one of these LLMs like ChatGBT. Don't be in your own. It's a large language model. It's basically all these different AI chat tools. So go into ChatGBT. Everybody should be familiar with that by now if you're not. and go to ChatGPT open that up, but make sure you're not logged in or you use a different account and just, or say don't use any of my previous data or open a private window and say don't use any of my previous information or data and say who's the best property manager or what property manager should I choose in X market, right? And see if it comes up. See if your business comes up and see what shows up. And so this is... how people are kind of doing some of their research, but all the stuff we just talked about still applies. Don't think your whole goal needs to be LLM SEO, where you need to start getting these chat tools to tell people. Why? Because most people are not looking for a property manager. They're not looking. They are not trying to find you. That's the mistake most people make. The majority of people that are self-managing, the potential business, are not looking for a property manager. It's really rare that somebody has a property manager that they're looking actively for a new one unless they've really done a bad job or stolen money or done something really obvious. The people that need your services are not looking for you. You need to be looking for them. And so this is where you can skip all of the cold lead marketing. You don't need to spend money on SEO or AI SEO or Google Ads or pay-per-click or any of these marketing agencies, you don't need to spend any money and you can actually grow faster if you use our strategies and it costs you nothing to do the strategies that we give you. It costs time and action, but it actually takes less time because warm leads and focusing on more effective strategies give you a much greater result in less time. So less time, less money, more results. And that's why we call it the Leadsmith. A lot of people think I just need leads. Cool. there's better ways. Not all leads are equal and we can help you out. Cool. Anything else we should add in wrapping up? I don't think so. I think we covered everything. Okay. I think we got it. So cool. Well, if you are wanting to figure out how do I grow this business? How do I finally get out of the rut that I've been in? How do I scale this? Maybe adding more doors is creating you grief and pain and you want freedom from your business. These are the things we help clients with. We'll help you figure out how to grow dramatically faster and we'll help you figure out how to make your business scalable while getting you out of the day to day and getting you to exit the business in various ways so that you get more freedom. So if you felt stuck or stagnant, you want to take it to the next level, reach out to us at doorgrow.com. Also join our free Facebook community just for property management business owners at doorgrowclub.com if you would like to get the best ideas in property management, join our newsletter at where? doorgrow.com/subscribe And if you found this even a little bit helpful, don't forget to subscribe and leave us a review. We'd really appreciate it. And until next time, remember the slowest path to growth is to do it alone. So let's grow together. Bye everyone.

In this engaging conversation, the hosts delve into the current NBA season, highlighting the emergence of young talent like Victor Wembanyama and the evolving dynamics of the league. They also explore the state of hip hop, discussing the importance of artist development, cultural appropriation, and the recent absence of hip hop in the Billboard top 40. The discussion culminates in a lively debate about the No Limit vs. Cash Money versus battle, reflecting on the legacy and impact of these influential music labels. In this engaging conversation, the hosts delve into the controversial legacy of Lil Wayne, and the impact of iconic rap labels like No Limit and Cash Money. They discuss the cultural significance of artists like Mia X and Juvenile, and reflect on the return of the Versus series, highlighting Jay-Z's unmatched legacy in hip-hop. The conversation culminates in a playful debate over potential versus matchups, including Beyoncé vs. Rihanna and Chris Brown vs. Usher, showcasing the hosts' humor and camaraderie throughout.*** CHAPTERS ***00:00 NBA Season Insights and Player Discoveries03:04 The Evolution of Young Talent in the NBA06:06 The Impact of Players Like Ja Morant and Victor Wembanyama08:58 The Role of Women in Basketball and Team Dynamics12:00 Cultural Appropriation in Music and Hip Hop's Evolution15:00 The Future of Hip Hop and Its Commercialization21:37 The Ducky Donuts and Lollipop Kids22:05 Ruthless Artists and Hip Hop's Evolution23:38 Artist Development and Label Responsibilities25:05 The Difference Between Rappers and Rap Artists26:38 The Case of Designer and Artist Growth27:59 Timmy Timmy Turn and the Evolution of Styles30:02 The Transition of Artists in Hip Hop32:27 The State of Modern Rap and Its Faces33:31 Versus Battles: No Limit vs. Cash Money40:01 The Legacy of No Limit Records44:01 The Evolution of Drill Rap45:00 Cash Money vs. Young Money: The Legacy of Lil Wayne45:58 No Limit Records: A Cultural Phenomenon48:55 Mia X: The Queen of No Limit51:00 Juvenile's COVID Remix: A Cultural Reflection55:59 Versus: The Return of a Cultural Staple59:50 Schoolyard Tales and Rivalries01:01:30 The Impact of School Culture on Identity01:03:44 Musical Influences and Nostalgia01:04:32 The Versus Debate: Jay-Z's Dominance01:12:48 Iconic Showdowns: Beyoncé vs. Rihanna and Usher vs. Chris Brown----------------TakeawaysThe NBA season brings excitement despite team struggles.Young players like Victor Wembanyama are changing the game.Artist development is crucial for success in hip hop.Cultural appropriation in music is a significant issue.The absence of hip hop in the Billboard top 40 is concerning.Versus battles highlight the legacy of influential music labels.No Limit Records had a massive impact on Southern hip hop.The evolution of players reflects the changing dynamics of the NBA.Music today often lacks the authenticity of past eras.The conversation around hip hop's future is vital for its growth. Drill rap has evolved significantly over the years.Lil Wayne's legacy is both celebrated and criticized.No Limit and Cash Money have shaped the rap landscape.Mia X is often overlooked in discussions of rap legends.Juvenile's COVID remix sparked cultural conversations.Master P remains a pivotal figure in rap history.The Versus series has revitalized interest in hip-hop battles.Jay-Z's cultural impact is unparalleled in the industry.Beyoncé and Rihanna represent two powerful forces in music.The hypothetical matchups between artists highlight their legacies.---------------

Febrero de 1944. Un P-51B Mustang solitario, pilotado por el novato Teniente Reed, es interceptado por dos Fw 190 sobre Holanda. Comparamos dos de las máquinas más letales en los cielos de Europa en plena campaña de bombardeo. El Focke Wulf es un asesino nato en busca de cuatrimotores aliados. El Mustang es el paladín defensor de las formaciones de B-17 que machacan la industria alemana. ¿Cuál fue el mejor avión? En la serie Versus no nos limitamos a enfrentar tecnológicamente un sistema de armas contra otro, sino que confrontemos aspectos como su rol, diseño, fabricación, recursos, pilotos, integración ... Con Antonio Gómez y Dani CarAn. Escucha el episodio completo en la app de iVoox, o descubre todo el catálogo de iVoox Originals

Introducing the All Def SquADD Cast show “Versus". It's a podcast with the OG SquADD! Each week, the SquADD will debate topics and vote at the end to see what wins. Versus airs every Monday and you can download and listen wherever podcasts are found. Special Guest Young Deuces Keysha E. Dion Lack This Week We Discuss Survive A Week At Jurassic Park Alone vs Weekend On A Ship With An Alien Hang With The Crew From Hangover vs The Avengers Find Out The Matrix Is Real vs You're Living A Real Life Truman Show S/o To Our Sponosors GLD Gld.com Promo: SQUADD Better Help https://betterhelp.com/squadd New Users Get 10% Of Your First Month 

Our Chief U.S. Economist Michael Gapen and Global Head of Macro Strategy Matthew Hornbach discuss potential next steps for the FOMC and the risks to their views from the U.S. government shutdown. Read more insights from Morgan Stanley.----- Transcript -----Matthew Hornbach: Welcome to Thoughts on the Market. I'm Matthew Hornbach, Global Head of Macro Strategy.Michael Gapen: And I'm Michael Gapen, Morgan Stanley's Chief U.S. Economist.Matthew Hornbach: The October FOMC meeting delivered a quarter percent rate cut as widely expected – but things are more complicated, and policy is not on a preset path from here.It's Friday, November 7th at 10am in New York.So, Mike, the Fed did cut by 25 basis points in October, but it was not a unanimous decision. And the Federal Open Market Committee decided to end the reduction of its balance sheet on December 1st – earlier than we expected. How did things unfold and does this change your outlook in any way?Michael Gapen: Yeah, Matt, it was a surprise to me. Not so much the statement or the decision, but there were dissents. There was a dissent in favor of a 50-basis point cut. There was a dissent in favor of no cut. And that foreshadowed the press conference – where really the conversation was about, I think, a divided committee; and a committee that didn't have a lot of consensus on what would come next.The balance sheet discussion, which we can get into, it came a little sooner than we thought, but it was largely in line with our view. And I'm not sure it's a macro critical decision right now. But I do think it was a surprise to markets and it was certainly a surprise to me – how much Powell's tone shifted between September and October, in terms of what the market could expect from the Fed going forward.So, what he said in essence, the key points, you know. The policy's not on a preset path from here. Or [a] cut in December is maybe not decidedly part of the baseline; or certainly is not a foregone conclusion. And I think what that reflects is a couple of things.One is that they're recalibrating policy based on a risk management view. So, you can cut almost independent of the data, at least in the beginning. And so now I think Powell's saying, ‘Well, at least from here, future cuts are probably more data dependent than those initial cuts.' But second, and I think most importantly is the division that appeared within the Fed. I think there's one group that's hawkish, one group that's dovish, and I think it reflects the division and the tension that we have in the economic data.So, I think the hawkish crowd is looking at strong activity data, strong AI spending, an upper income consumer that seems to be doing just fine. And they're saying, ‘Why are we cutting? Financial conditions for the business community is pretty easy. Maybe the neutral rate of interest is higher. We're probably less restrictive than you think.' And then I think the other side of the committee, which I believe still that Chair Powell is in, is looking at a market slowdown in hiring a weak labor market. What that means for growth in real income for those households that depend on labor market income to consume; there's probably some front running of autos that artificially boosted growth in the third quarter.So, I think that the dissents, or I should say the division within the FOMC, I think reflects the tension in the underlying data. So, to know which way monetary policy evolves, Matt, it's essentially trying to decide: does the labor market rebound towards the activity data or does the activity data decelerate at least temporarily to the labor market?Matthew Hornbach: Mike, you talked a lot about data just now, and we're not exactly getting a lot of government data at the moment. How are you thinking about the path for the data in terms of its availability between now and the December FOMC meeting? And how do you think that may affect the Fed's willingness to move forward with another rate cut in the cycle?Michael Gapen: Right. So that's key and critical to understanding, right? We're operating under the assumption, of course the federal government shutdowns going to end at some point. We're going to get all this back data released and we can assess where the economy is or has been. I think the way markets should think about this is if the government shutdown has ended in the next few weeks, say before Thanksgiving – then I think we, markets, the Fed will have the bulk of the data in front of them and available to assess the economy at the December FOMC meeting.They may not have it all, but they should get at least some of that data released. We can assess it. If the economy has moderated and weakened a bit, the labor market has continued to cool, the Fed can cut. If it shows maybe the labor market rebounding downside risk to employment being diminished, maybe the Fed doesn't cut.So that's a world and it is our expectation the shutdown should end in the next few weeks. We're already at the longest shutdown on record, so we will get some data in hand to make the decision for December. Perhaps that's wishful thinking, Matt, and maybe we go beyond Thanksgiving, and the shutdown extends into December.My suspicion though, is if the government is still shut down in December, I can't imagine the economy's getting better. So, I think the Fed could lean in the direction of taking one more step.Matthew Hornbach: This is going to be very critical for how the markets think about the outlook in 2026 and price the outlook for 2026. The last FOMC meeting of the year has that type of importance for markets – pricing, the path of Fed policy, and the path of the economy into 2026. Because if we end up receiving a rate cut from the Fed, the dialogue in the investment community will be focused on when might the next cut arrive. Versus if we don't get that rate cut in December, the dialogue will focus on, maybe we will never see another rate cut in the cycle. And what if we see a rate hike as we make our way through the second half of 2026? So that can have a dramatic impact on the U.S. Treasury market and how investors think about the outlook for policy and the economy.Michael Gapen: So, I think that's right. And as you know, our baseline outlook is at least through the first quarter, if not into the second quarter. The private sector will still be attempting to pass through tariffs into prices. And I think in the meantime, demand for labor and the hiring rate will remain low.And so, we look for additional labor market slack to build. Not a lot, but the unemployment rate moving to more like 4.6, maybe 4.7 – and that underpins our expectation the Fed will be reducing rates in in 2026. But I think as you note, and as I mentioned earlier, there is this tension in the data and it's not inconceivable that the labor market accelerates. And you get, kind of, an animal spirits driven 2026; where a combination of momentum in the data, AI-related business spending, wealth effects for upper income consumers and maybe a larger fiscal stimulus from the One Big Beautiful Bill Act, lead the economy to outperform.And to your point, if that is happening, it's not farfetched to think, well, if the Fed put in risk management insurance cuts, perhaps they need to take those out. And that could build in a way where that expectation, let's say towards the second half or the fourth quarter maybe of 2026, maybe it takes into 2027. But I agree with you that if the Fed can't cut in December because the economy's doing well and the data show that, and we learn more of that in 2026, you're right.So, it would… And may maybe to put it more simply, the more the Fed cuts, the more you need to open both sides of the rate path distribution, right? The deeper they cut, the greater the probability over time, they're going to have to raise those rates. And so, if the Fed is forced to stop in December, yeah, you can make that argument.Matthew Hornbach: Indeed, a lot of the factors that you mentioned are factors that are coming up in investor conversations increasingly. The way I've been framing it in my discussions is that investors want to see the glass as half full today, versus in the middle of this year the glass was looking half empty. And of course, as we head into the holiday season, the glass will be filled with something perhaps a bit tastier than water. And so…Michael Gapen: Fill my glass please.Matthew Hornbach: Indeed. So, I do think that we could be setting up for a bright 2026 ahead. And so, with that, Mike, look forward to seeing you again in December – with a glass of eggnog perhaps. And a decision in hand for the meeting that the Fed holds then. Thanks for taking the time to talk.Michael Gapen: Great speaking with you, Matt.Matthew Hornbach: And thanks for listening. If you enjoy Thoughts on the Market, please leave us a review wherever you listen and share the podcast with a friend or colleague today.

This episode continues Brian's special series highlighting speakers from the recent Ozark Mountain Bigfoot Conference. This week, we feature researcher and field investigator Shane Carpenter, whose presentation offers a compelling look into some of the most intriguing and scientifically grounded aspects of Sasquatch research.Throughout his lecture, Shane shares updates from The 400, his primary research area, including:Infrasound phenomena and its potential role in reported Sasquatch encountersThe discovery of mysterious holes containing inserted sticks, possibly the work of juvenile SasquatchesThe relationship between high-energy geological zones and increased sighting activityTrack morphology and substrate analysis, with an emphasis on juvenile tracksInsights into the Melba Ketchum DNA study and the challenges of scientific validation in cryptozoologyEthical considerations in gifting versus baiting, and how each approach impacts research integrityShane also touches on the possibility of orb phenomena and other unexplained elements that seem to accompany encounters, emphasizing the importance of maintaining an open yet critical mindset in fieldwork. His presentation concludes with an engaging audience Q&A, exploring questions on orbs, energy zones, and evolving methodologies in Sasquatch research.Get Our FREE NewsletterGet Brian's BooksEmail Brian Share Your Encounter Become a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/sasquatch-odyssey--4839697/support.

Jay Z Vs Everybody PT1 is here, and it's packed with real talk, heated debates, and pure hip-hop energy

In this episode of the Leading Voices in Food podcast, host Norbert Wilson is joined by food and nutrition policy economists Will Masters and Parke Wilde from Tufts University's Friedman School of Nutrition, Science and Policy. The discussion centers around the concept of the least cost diet, a tool used to determine the minimum cost required to maintain a nutritionally adequate diet. The conversation delves into the global computational methods and policies related to least cost diets, the challenges of making these diets culturally relevant, and the implications for food policy in both the US and internationally. You will also hear about the lived experiences of people affected by these diets and the need for more comprehensive research to better reflect reality. Interview Summary I know you both have been working in this space around least cost diets for a while. So, let's really start off by just asking a question about what brought you into this work as researchers. Why study least cost diets? Will, let's start with you. I'm a very curious person and this was a puzzle. So, you know, people want health. They want healthy food. Of course, we spend a lot on healthcare and health services, but do seek health in our food. As a child growing up, you know, companies were marketing food as a source of health. And people who had more money would spend more for premium items that were seen as healthy. And in the 2010s for the first time, we had these quantified definitions of what a healthy diet was as we went from 'nutrients' to 'food groups,' from the original dietary guidelines pyramid to the MyPlate. And then internationally, the very first quantified definitions of healthful diets that would work anywhere in the world. And I was like, oh, wow. Is it actually expensive to eat a healthy diet? And how much does it cost? How does it differ by place location? How does it differ over time, seasons, and years? And I just thought it was a fascinating question. Great, thank you for that. Parke? There's a lot of policy importance on this, but part of the fun also of this particular topic is more than almost any that we work on, it's connected to things that we have to think about in our daily lives. So, as you're preparing and purchasing food for your family and you want it to be a healthy. And you want it to still be, you know, tasty enough to satisfy the kids. And it can't take too long because it has to fit into a busy life. So, this one does feel like it's got a personal connection. Thank you both for that. One of the things I heard is there was an availability of data. There was an opportunity that seems like it didn't exist before. Can you speak a little bit about that? Especially Will because you mentioned that point. Will: Yes. So, we have had food composition data identifying for typical items. A can of beans, or even a pizza. You know, what is the expected, on average quantity of each nutrient. But only recently have we had those on a very large scale for global items. Hundreds and hundreds of thousands of distinct items. And we had nutrient requirements, but only nutrient by nutrient, and the definition of a food group where you would want not only the nutrients, but also the phytochemicals, the attributes of food from its food matrix that make a vegetable different from just in a vitamin pill. And those came about in, as I mentioned, in the 2010s. And then there's the computational tools and the price observations that get captured. They've been written down on pads of paper, literally, and brought to a headquarters to compute inflation since the 1930s. But access to those in digitized form, only really in the 2000s and only really in the 2010s were we able to have program routines that would download millions and millions of price observations, match them to food composition data, match that food composition information to a healthy diet criterion, and then compute these least cost diets. Now we've computed millions and millions of these thanks to modern computing and all of that data. Great, Will. And you've already started on this, so let's continue on this point. You were talking about some of the computational methods and data that were available globally. Can you give us a good sense of what does a lease cost diet look like from this global perspective because we're going to talk to Parke about whether it is in the US. But let's talk about it in the broad sense globally. In my case the funding opportunity to pay for the graduate students and collaborators internationally came from the Gates Foundation and the UK International Development Agency, initially for a pilot study in Ghana and Tanzania. And then we were able to get more money to scale that up to Africa and South Asia, and then globally through a project called Food Prices for Nutrition. And what we found, first of all, is that to get agreement on what a healthy diet means, we needed to go to something like the least common denominator. The most basic, basic definition from the commonalities among national governments' dietary guidelines. So, in the US, that's MyPlate, or in the UK it's the Eat Well Guide. And each country's dietary guidelines look a little different, but they have these commonalities. So, we distilled that down to six food groups. There's fruits and vegetables, separately. And then there's animal source foods altogether. And in some countries they would separate out milk, like the United States does. And then all starchy staples together. And in some countries, you would separate out whole grains like the US does. And then all edible oils. And those six food groups, in the quantities needed to provide all the nutrients you would need, plus these attributes of food groups beyond just what's in a vitamin pill, turns out to cost about $4 a day. And if you adjust for inflation and differences in the cost of living, the price of housing and so forth around the world, it's very similar. And if you think about seasonal variation in a very remote area, it might rise by 50% in a really bad situation. And if you think about a very remote location where it's difficult to get food to, it might go up to $5.50, but it stays in that range between roughly speaking $2.50 and $5.00. Meanwhile, incomes are varying from around $1.00 a day, and people who cannot possibly afford those more expensive food groups, to $200 a day in which these least expensive items are trivially small in cost compared to the issues that Parke mentioned. We can also talk about what we actually find as the items, and those vary a lot from place to place for some food groups and are very similar to each other in other food groups. So, for example, the least expensive item in an animal source food category is very often dairy in a rich country. But in a really dry, poor country it's dried fish because refrigeration and transport are very expensive. And then to see where there's commonalities in the vegetable category, boy. Onions, tomatoes, carrots are so inexpensive around the world. We've just gotten those supply chains to make the basic ingredients for a vegetable stew really low cost. But then there's all these other different vegetables that are usually more expensive. So, it's very interesting to look at which are the items that would deliver the healthfulness you need and how much they cost. It's surprisingly little from a rich country perspective, and yet still out of reach for so many in low-income countries. Will, thank you for that. And I want to turn now to looking in the US case because I think there's some important commonalities. Parke, can you describe the least cost diet, how it's used here in the US, and its implications for policy? Absolutely. And full disclosure to your audience, this is work on which we've benefited from Norbert's input and wisdom in a way that's been very valuable as a co-author and as an advisor for the quantitative part of what we were doing. For an article in the journal Food Policy, we use the same type of mathematical model that USDA uses when it sets the Thrifty Food Plan, the TFP. A hypothetical diet that's used as the benchmark for the maximum benefit in the Supplemental Nutrition Assistance Program, which is the nation's most important anti-hunger program. And what USDA does with this model diet is it tries to find a hypothetical bundle of foods and beverages that's not too different from what people ordinarily consume. The idea is it should be a familiar diet, it should be one that's reasonably tasty, that people clearly already accept enough. But it can't be exactly that diet. It has to be different enough at least to meet a cost target and to meet a whole long list of nutrition criteria. Including getting enough of the particular nutrients, things like enough calcium or enough protein, and also, matching food group goals reasonably well. Things like having enough fruits, enough vegetables, enough dairy. When, USDA does that, it finds that it's fairly difficult. It's fairly difficult to meet all those goals at once, at a cost and a cost goal all at the same time. And so, it ends up choosing this hypothetical diet that's almost maybe more different than would feel most comfortable from people's typical average consumption. Thank you, Parke. I'm interested to understand the policy implications of this least cost diet. You suggested something about the Thrifty Food Plan and the maximum benefit levels. Can you tell us a little bit more about the policies that are relevant? Yes, so the Thrifty Food Plan update that USDA does every five years has a much bigger policy importance now than it did a few years ago. I used to tell my students that you shouldn't overstate how much policy importance this update has. It might matter a little bit less than you would think. And the reason was because every time they update the Thrifty Food Plan, they use the cost target that is the inflation adjusted or the real cost of the previous edition. It's a little bit as if nobody wanted to open up the whole can of worms about what should the SNAP benefit be in the first place. But everything changed with the update in 2021. In 2021, researchers at the US Department of Agriculture found that it was not possible at the old cost target to find a diet that met all of the nutrition criteria - at all. Even if you were willing to have a diet that was quite different from people's typical consumption. And so, they ended up increasing the cost of the Thrifty Food Plan in small increments until they found a solution to this mathematical model using data on real world prices and on the nutrition characteristics of these foods. And this led to a 21% increase in the permanent value of the maximum SNAP benefit. Many people didn't notice that increase all that much because the increase came into effect at just about the same time that a temporary boost during the COVID era to SNAP benefits was being taken away. So there had been a temporary boost to how much benefits people got as that was taken away at the end of the start of the COVID pandemic then this permanent increase came in and it kind of softened the blow from that change in benefits at that time. But it now ends up meaning that the SNAP benefit is substantially higher than it would've been without this 2021 increase. And there's a lot of policy attention on this in the current Congress and in the current administration. There's perhaps a skeptical eye on whether this increase was good policy. And so, there are proposals to essentially take away the ability to update the Thrifty Food Plan change the maximum SNAP benefit automatically, as it used to. As you know, Norbert, this is part of all sorts of things going on currently. Like we heard in the news, just last week, about plans to end collecting household food security measurement using a major national survey. And so there will be sort of possibly less information about how these programs are doing and whether a certain SNAP benefit is needed in order to protect people from food insecurity and hunger. Parke, this is really important and I'm grateful that we're able to talk about this today in that SNAP benefit levels are still determined by this mathematical program that's supposed to represent a nutritionally adequate diet that also reflects food preferences. And I don't know how many people really understand or appreciate that. I can say I didn't understand or appreciate it until working more in this project. I think it's critical for our listeners to understand just how important this particular mathematical model is, and what it says about what a nutritionally adequate diet looks like in this country. I know the US is one of the countries that uses a model diet like this to help set policy. Will, I'd like to turn to you to see what ways other nations are using this sort of model diet. How have you seen policy receive information from these model diets? It's been a remarkable thing where those initial computational papers that we were able to publish in first in 2018, '19, '20, and governments asking how could we use this in practice. Parke has laid out how it's used in the US with regard to the benefit level of SNAP. The US Thrifty Food Plan has many constraints in addition to the basic ones for the Healthy Diet Basket that I described. Because clearly that Healthy Diet Basket minimum is not something anyone in America would think is acceptable. Just to have milk and frozen vegetables and low-cost bread, that jar peanut butter and that's it. Like that would be clearly not okay. So, internationally what's happened is that first starting in 2020, and then using the current formula in 2022, the United Nations agencies together with the World Bank have done global monitoring of food and nutrition security using this method. So, the least cost items to meet the Healthy Diet Basket in each country provide this global estimate that about a third of the global population have income available for food after taking account of their non-food needs. That is insufficient to buy this healthy diet. What they're actually eating is just starchy staples, oil, some calories from low-cost sugar and that's it. And very small quantities of the fruits and vegetables. And animal source foods are the expensive ones. So, countries have the opportunity to begin calculating this themselves alongside their normal monitoring of inflation with a consumer price index. The first country to do that was Nigeria. And Nigeria began publishing this in January 2024. And it so happened that the country's national minimum wage for civil servants was up for debate at that time. And this was a newly published statistic that turned out to be enormously important for the civil society advocates and the labor unions who were trying to explain why a higher civil service minimum wage was needed. This is for the people who are serving tea or the drivers and the low wage people in these government service agencies. And able to measure how many household members could you feed a healthy diet with a day's worth of the monthly wage. So social protection in the sense of minimum wage and then used in other countries regarding something like our US SNAP program or something like our US WIC program. And trying to define how big should those benefit levels be. That's been the first use. A second use that's emerging is targeting the supply chains for the low-cost vegetables and animal source foods and asking what from experience elsewhere could be an inexpensive animal source food. What could be the most inexpensive fruits. What could be the most inexpensive vegetables? And that is the type of work that we're doing now with governments with continued funding from the Gates Foundation and the UK International Development Agency. Will, it's fascinating to hear this example from Nigeria where all of the work that you all have been doing sort of shows up in this kind of debate. And it really speaks to the power of the research that we all are trying to do as we try to inform policy. Now, as we discussed the least cost diet, there was something that I heard from both of you. Are these diets that people really want? I'm interested to understand a little bit more about that because this is a really critical space.Will, what do we know about the lived experiences of those affected by least cost diet policy implementation. How are real people affected? It's such an important and interesting question, just out of curiosity, but also for just our human understanding of what life is like for people. And then of course the policy actions that could improve. So, to be clear, we've only had these millions of least cost diets, these benchmark 'access to' at a market near you. These are open markets that might be happening twice a week or sometimes all seven days of the week in a small town, in an African country or a urban bodega type market or a supermarket across Asia, Africa. We've only begun to have these benchmarks against which to compare actual food choice, as I mentioned, since 2022. And then really only since 2024 have been able to investigate this question. We're only beginning to match up these benchmark diets to what people actually choose. But the pattern we're seeing is that in low and lower middle-income countries, people definitely spend their money to go towards that healthy diet basket goal. They don't spend all of their additional money on that. But if you improve affordability throughout the range of country incomes - from the lowest income countries in Africa, Mali, Senegal, Burkina Faso, to middle income countries in Africa, like Ghana, Indonesia, an upper middle-income country - people do spend their money to get more animal source foods, more fruits and vegetables, and to reduce the amount of the low cost starchy staples. They do increase the amount of discretionary, sugary meals. And a lot of what they're eating exits the healthy diet basket because there's too much added sodium, too much added sugar. And so, things that would've been healthy become unhealthy because of processing or in a restaurant setting. So, people do spend their money on that. But they are moving towards a healthy diet. That breaks down somewhere in the upper income and high-income countries where additional spending becomes very little correlated with the Healthy Diet Basket. What happens is people way overshoot the Healthy Diet Basket targets for animal source foods and for edible oils because I don't know if you've ever tried it, but one really delicious thing is fried meat. People love it. And even low middle income people overshoot on that. And that displaces the other elements of a healthy diet. And then there's a lot of upgrading, if you will, within the food group. So, people are spending additional money on nicer vegetables. Nicer fruits. Nicer animal source foods without increasing the total amount of them in addition to having overshot the healthy diet levels of many of those food groups. Which of course takes away from the food you would need from the fruits, the vegetables, and the pulses, nuts and seeds, that almost no one gets as much as is considered healthy, of that pulses, nuts and seeds category. Thank you. And I want to shift this to the US example. So, Parke, can you tell us a bit more about the lived experience of those affected by least cost diet policy? How are real people affected? One of the things I've enjoyed about this project that you and I got to work on, Norbert, in cooperation with other colleagues, is that it had both a quantitative and a qualitative part to it. Now, our colleague Sarah Folta led some of the qualitative interviews, sort of real interviews with people in food pantries in four states around the country. And this was published recently in the Journal of Health Education and Behavior. And we asked people about their goals and about what are the different difficulties or constraints that keep them from achieving those goals. And what came out of that was that people often talk about whether their budget constraints and whether their financial difficulties take away their autonomy to sort of be in charge of their own food choices. And this was something that Sarah emphasized as she sort of helped lead us through a process of digesting what was the key findings from these interviews with people. One of the things I liked about doing this study is that because the quantitative and the qualitative part, each had this characteristic of being about what do people want to achieve. This showed up mathematically in the constrained optimization model, but it also showed up in the conversations with people in the food pantry. And what are the constraints that keep people from achieving it. You know, the mathematical model, these are things like all the nutrition constraints and the cost constraints. And then in the real conversations, it's something that people raise in very plain language about what are all the difficulties they have. Either in satisfying their own nutrition aspirations or satisfying some of the requirements for one person or another in the family. Like if people have special diets that are needed or if they have to be gluten free or any number of things. Having the diets be culturally appropriate. And so, I feel like this is one of those classic things where different disciplines have wisdom to bring to bear on what's really very much a shared topic. What I hear from both of you is that these diets, while they are computationally interesting and they reveal some critical realities of how people eat, they can't cover everything. People want to eat certain types of foods. Certain types of foods are more culturally relevant. And that's really clear talking to you, Will, about just sort of the range of foods that end up showing up in these least cost diets and how you were having to make some adjustments there. Parke, as you talked about the work with Sarah Folta thinking through autonomy and sort of a sense of self. This kind of leads us to a question that I want to open up to both of you. What's missing when we talk about these least cost diet modeling exercises and what are the policy implications of that? What are the gaps in our understanding of these model diets and what needs to happen to make them reflect reality better? Parke? Well, you know, there's many things that people in our research community are working on. And it goes quite, quite far afield. But I'm just thinking of two related to our quantitative research using the Thrifty Food Plan type models. We've been working with Yiwen Zhao and Linlin Fan at Penn State University on how these models would work if you relaxed some of the constraints. If people's back in a financial sense weren't back up against the wall, but instead they had just a little more space. We were considering what if they had incentives that gave them a discount on fruits and vegetables, for example, through the SNAP program? Or what if they had a healthy bundle of foods provided through the emergency food system, through food banks or food pantries. What is the effect directly in terms of those foods? But also, what is the effect in terms of just relaxing their budget constraints. They get to have a little more of the foods that they find more preferred or that they had been going without. But then also, in terms of sort of your question about the more personal. You know, what is people's personal relationships with food? How does this play out on the ground? We're working with the graduate student Angelica Valdez Valderrama here at the Friedman School, thinking about what some of the cultural assumptions and of the food group constraints in some of these models are. If you sort of came from a different immigrant tradition or if you came from another community, what things would be different in, for example, decisions about what's called the Mediterranean diet or what's called the healthy US style dietary pattern. How much difference do this sort of breadth, cultural breadth of dietary patterns you could consider, how much difference does that make in terms of what's the outcome of this type of hypothetical diet? Will: And I think, you know, from the global perspective, one really interesting thing is when we do combine data sets and look across these very different cultural settings, dry land, Sahelian Africa versus countries that are coastal versus sort of forest inland countries versus all across Asia, south Asia to East Asia, all across Latin America. We do see the role of these cultural factors. And we see them playing out in very systematic ways that people come to their cultural norms for very good reasons. And then pivot and switch away to new cultural norms. You know, American fast food, for example, switching from beef primarily to chicken primarily. That sort of thing becomes very visible in a matter of years. So, in terms of things that are frontiers for us, remember this is early days. Getting many more nutritionists, people in other fields, looking at first of all, it's just what is really needed for health. Getting those health requirements improved and understood better is a key priority. Our Healthy Diet Basket comes from the work of a nutritionist named Anna Herforth, who has gone around the world studying these dietary guidelines internationally. We're about to get the Eat Lancet dietary recommendations announced, and it'll be very interesting to see how those evolve. Second thing is much better data on prices and computing these diets for more different settings at different times, different locations. Settings that are inner city United States versus very rural. And then this question of comparing to actual diets. And just trying to understand what people are seeking when they choose foods that are clearly not these benchmark least cost items. The purpose is to ask how far away and why and how are they far away? And particularly to understand to what degree are these attributes of the foods themselves: the convenience of the packaging, the preparation of the item, the taste, the flavor, the cultural significance of it. To what degree are we looking at the result of aspirations that are really shaped by marketing. Are really shaped by the fire hose of persuasion that companies are investing in every day. And very strategically and constantly iterating to the best possible spokesperson, the best possible ad campaign. Combining billboards and radio and television such that you're surrounded by this. And when you drive down the street and when you walk into the supermarket, there is no greater effort on the planet than the effort to sell us a particular brand of food. Food companies are basically marketing companies attached to a manufacturing facility, and they are spending much more than the entire combined budget of the NIH and CDC, et cetera, to persuade us to eat what we ultimately choose. And we really don't know to what degree it's the actual factors in the food itself versus the marketing campaigns and the way they've evolved. You know, if you had a choice between taking the food system and regulating it the way we regulate, say housing or vehicles. If we were to say your supermarket should be like an auto dealership, right? So, anything in the auto dealership is very heavily regulated. Everything from the paint to where the gear shift is to how the windows work. Everything is heavily regulated because the auto industry has worked with National Transportation Safety Board and every single crash investigation, et cetera, has led to the standards that we have now. We didn't get taxes on cars without airbags to make us choose cars with airbags. They're just required. And same is true for housing, right? You can't just build, you know, an extension deck behind your house any way you want. A city inspector will force you to tear it out if you haven't built it to code. So, you know, we could regulate the grocery store like we do that. It's not going to happen politically but compare that option to treating groceries the way we used to treat the legal services or pharmaceuticals. Which is you couldn't advertise them. You could sell them, and people would choose based on the actual merit of the lawyer or the pharmaceutical, right? Which would have the bigger impact. Right? If there was zero food advertising, you just walked into the grocery store and chose what you liked. Or you regulate the grocery store the same way we regulate automotive or building trades. Obviously, they both matter. There's, you know, this problem that you can't see, taste or smell the healthiness of food. You're always acting on belief and not a fact when you choose something that you're seeking health. We don't know to what extent choice is distorted away from a low-cost healthy diet by things people genuinely want and need. Such as taste, convenience, culture, and so forth. Versus things that they've been persuaded to want. And there's obviously some of both. All of these things matter. But I'm hopeful that through these least cost diets, we can identify that low-cost options are there. And you could feed your family a very healthy diet at the Thrifty Food Plan level in the United States, or even lower. It would take time, it would take attention, it would be hard. You can take some shortcuts to make that within your time budget, right? And the planning budget. And we can identify what those look like thanks to these model diets. It's a very exciting area of work, but we still have a lot to do to define carefully what are the constraints. What are the real objectives here. And how to go about helping people, acquire these foods that we now know are there within a short commuting distance. You may need to take the bus, you may need carpool. But that's what people actually do to go grocery shopping. And when they get there, we can help people to choose items that would genuinely meet their needs at lower cost. Bios Will Masters is a Professor in the Friedman School of Nutrition, with a secondary appointment in Tufts University's Department of Economics. He is coauthor of the new textbook on Food Economics: Agriculture, Nutrition and Health (Palgrave Macmillan, 2024). Before coming to Tufts in 2010 he was a faculty member in Agricultural Economics at Purdue University (1991-2010), and also at the University of Zimbabwe (1989-90), Harvard's Kennedy School of Government (2000) and Columbia University (2003-04). He is former editor-in-chief of the journal Agricultural Economics (2006-2011), and an elected Fellow of the American Society for Nutrition (FASN) as well as a Fellow of the Agricultural and Applied Economics Association (AAEA). At Tufts his courses on economics of agriculture, food and nutrition were recognized with student-nominated, University-wide teaching awards in 2019 and 2022, and he leads over a million dollars annually in externally funded research including work on the Agriculture, Nutrition and Health Academy (https://www.anh-academy.org), as well as projects supporting government efforts to calculate the cost and affordability of healthy diets worldwide and work with private enterprises on data analytics for food markets in Africa. Parke Wilde (PhD, Cornell) is a food economist and professor at the Friedman School of Nutrition Science and Policy at Tufts University. Previously, he worked for USDA's Economic Research Service. At Tufts, Parke teaches graduate-level courses in statistics, U.S. food policy, and climate change. His research addresses the economics of U.S. food and nutrition policy, including federal nutrition assistance programs. He was Director of Design for the SNAP Healthy Incentives Pilot (HIP) evaluation. He has been a member of the National Academy of Medicine's Food Forum and is on the scientific and technical advisory committee for Menus of Change, an initiative to advance the health and sustainability of the restaurant industry. He directs the USDA-funded Research Innovation and Development Grants in Economics (RIDGE) Partnership. He received the AAEA Distinguished Quality of Communication Award for his textbook, Food Policy in the United States: An Introduction (Routledge/Earthscan), whose third edition was released in April 2025. 

Introducing the All Def SquADD Cast show “Versus". It's a podcast with the OG SquADD! Each week, the SquADD will debate topics and vote at the end to see what wins. Versus airs every Monday and you can download and listen wherever podcasts are found. Special Guest Roxxy Haze Dion Lack Brent Taylor  This Week We Discuss Skyscraper Window Cleaner vs Light House Worker  Be A Professional Stripper At Assisted Living Homes vs A Roaster At The Special Olympics  Monthly Eating Contest Of Your Most Hated Food vs Only Have Hotdog Water As A Drink Again S/o To Our Sponsors Cash App Download Cash App And Use The Code CASHAPP10 At Sign Up At Receive $10 When You Send A Friend $5. Terms Apply

The actual and factual Kim Smith returns to the studio after an interesting trip to  Washington DC to report the latest in entertainment and current events. The podcast came to life in DC where our third co-host Monie and our DC co-host Josh met up with Kim and Sir Goodwin Live at Kitchen and Cocktails in Downtown DC.Onefest and TSA Atlanta 1000Verzuz 1300Kevin McCall v Patti LaBelle 1800NBA Players gambling 2500Emotional Justin Fields 2700 kims korner 5300Men with Money are to provide, a woman with money should leave 12500

SummaryIn this episode of the Get Right Podcast, the hosts celebrate personal milestones while diving into a nostalgic discussion about the recent Versus battle between Cash Money and No Limit. They reflect on the performances, critique the artists, and explore the dynamics of relationships within the hip-hop community. The conversation shifts to the legacy of Master P and the impact of R. Kelly versus Drake, culminating in a debate about the evolution of R&B and its current state. In this conversation, the hosts delve into the current landscape of R&B music, discussing the impact of artists like Leon Thomas and Lucky Day, while also reflecting on the generational shifts in music appreciation. They explore the influence of Drake on the genre and compare his legacy to that of Michael Jackson. The discussion transitions into the NBA, where they predict the upcoming season and analyze player dynamics, particularly focusing on LeBron James and the potential for trades.

In this episode, the Operators dive deep into omnichannel strategy, starting with the lingering debate: should your brand be on Amazon? The hosts break down the pros of incrementality and meeting customers where they are. Versus the cons of price wars, channel conflict, and the platform's brand-unfriendly nature.The discussion then shifts to the high-stakes game of wholesale, weighing the relative safety of the "Big Three" (Costco, Target, Walmart) against the serious financial risks of smaller retailers going bankrupt.Finally, the squad debates the ultimate omnichannel play: opening your own physical stores. They explore the potential for unique customer experiences and domestic supply chain advantages versus the immense complexity, high costs, and low success rate for digitally-native brands.Chapters:00:00:00 - Introduction00:16:55 - "Is it Good For My Brand?" Amazon Debate00:33:30 - The Risks of Wholesale00:43:45 - Is Being in Big Stores Worth It?00:56:51 - The Case for Owned RetailPowered By:Fulfil.io.https://bit.ly/3pAp2vuThe Only Cloud ERP Designed to Efficiently Scale 8 and 9-Figure Brands. Northbeam.https://www.northbeam.io/Postscript.https://postscript.io/Richpanel.https://www.richpanel.com/?utm_source=9O&utm_medium=podcast&utm_campaign=ytdescSaras.https://bit.ly/9OP-YtdescSubscribe to The Marketing Operators Podcast here:https://www.youtube.com/@MarketingOperatorsSubscribe to The Finance Operators here:https://www.youtube.com/@FinanceOperatorsFOPSSign up to the 9 Operators newsletter here:https://9operators.com/

Introducing the All Def SquADD Cast show “Versus". It's a podcast with the OG SquADD! Each week, the SquADD will debate topics and vote at the end to see what wins. Versus airs every Monday and you can download and listen wherever podcasts are found. Special Guest Kali Scott Chinedu Unaka This Week We Discuss 10 Hour Flight In Middle Seat W/ Fastest Free Internet vs First Class W/ No Entertainment One Million Dollars Now vs One Special Power Of Your Choice Never Pay For Clothes Again vs Never Pay For Shoes Again S/o To Our Sponsors True Classic trueclassic.com/SQUADD Inda Cloud Inda cloud.co Promo: ALLDEF

Jurandir Filho, Felipe Mesquita, João Pimenta e Bruno Carvalho batem um papo as diferenças entre os RPGs japoneses (JRPGs) e os RPGs ocidentais (WRPGs). Embora compartilhem a mesma base, como evolução de personagens, grandes narrativas e escolhas estratégicas, cada lado desenvolveu sua própria identidade cultural, estética e mecânica ao longo das décadas. Os RPGs japoneses surgiram fortemente influenciados por títulos de mesa como "Dungeons & Dragons", mas rapidamente ganharam personalidade própria. São marcados por histórias lineares e cinematográficas, personagens bem definidos e um foco narrativo que coloca o jogador como espectador de uma grande saga. Jogos como "Final Fantasy", "Dragon Quest",  "Chrono Trigger" e "Persona" moldaram essa tradição, com narrativas emocionais, heróis arquetípicos e mundos fantasiosos.Já os RPGs ocidentais nasceram de uma vertente mais próxima dos jogos de mesa, prezando por liberdade de escolha e construção de personagem. O jogador não interpreta um herói pré-determinado, mas cria o seu próprio avatar e molda a história com decisões morais e éticas. Séries como "The Witcher", "The Elder Scrolls", "Fallout", "Baldur's Gate" e "Mass Effect" são exemplos emblemáticos dessa abordagem, em que o mundo reage às ações do jogador, e cada jornada é única. O foco aqui está menos em uma trama fixa e mais em imersão e agência, transformando a narrativa em algo emergente, construído dinamicamente.Nos últimos anos, entretanto, essas fronteiras vêm se misturando. Jogos como "Persona 5" adotam elementos sociais e liberdade de escolhas típicos do Ocidente, enquanto "The Witcher 3" e "Cyberpunk 2077" apresentam tramas fortes e personagens profundos, à maneira japonesa. Hoje em dia, quem faz melhor?Essa é a estreia da série Versus!====- ALURA | Estude na Alura, a maior escola de tecnologia on-line do Brasil! Acesse o nosso link e ganhe 15% de desconto na matrícula! https://alura.com.br/99vidas

Kiera joins the Raving Patients Podcast to talk about obtaining that CEO mindset to systematize your practice. This mindset does not mean doing it all yourself, but leaning on others to maximize their skillsets. Kiera also discusses with Dr. Len Tau how to separate yourself from having your entire identity associated with dentistry. Episode resources: Subscribe to The Dental A-Team podcast Schedule a Practice Assessment Leave us a review Transcript: Speaker 1 (00:00) Hello everybody and welcome to another episode of the Raving Patients Podcast. As you know, I'm your host, Dr. Len Tau, and I am super excited today for multiple reasons. Well, first, before I get there, I want to first thank my sponsors, both Dental Intelligence, CallRail, and a new one, Net32. You'll be hearing their commercials as well, so check out those companies. And again, the only reason I'm able to do this every single week is because of their support. I also want to remind everybody about   my event, is only one week away. One week from now we'll be gathered in Fort Lauderdale for Supercharge with Dental Practice 2025. If you wanna be a come out last minute registrant, you can reach out to me. I will be glad to add you as a guest of me. So please reach out to me. You can check out the content at SuperchargeYourDentalPractice.com So I said I was super excited and I'm super excited because of our guest today. And she's been a guest before and I just recorded an episode with her on her podcast. ⁓   We're talking about Kiera Dent, who is from the Dental A Team, and we're gonna be talking the CEO mindset systematizing your practice for freedom and growth today. So before I let ⁓ Kiera take it off, I'm gonna go ahead and introduce her. So she is the founder and CEO of the Dental A Team, an entrepreneur, consultant, speaker, and podcast host dedicated to helping dental professionals reach their highest potential. Through customized in-office and virtual consulting,   She empowers dentists and their teams to cultivate an ownership mindset and achieving lasting growth. With experience spanning every role in the dental practice, front office, dental assistant, regional manager, and even practice owner, here brings unique first-hand perspective to her coaching. Alongside her team of expert consultants, she has partnered with hundreds of practices nationwide, leading them to greater efficiency, profitability, and fulfillment. As she often says, we don't just understand you, we are you.   So please welcome to the Raving Patients podcast, Kiara Dent. Kiara, thank you so much for being a guest on my podcast today.   Speaker 2 (02:03) Oh, Len, thank you so much. so excited to be here. I loved our podcast we did together. I love the podcast we did in the past together. I'm super excited about Supercharge. Everybody should go. We're going to like sneak peek, be there in 2026. Like Len, huge fan of you guys. Just excited to be here with you. So thank you. Thanks for having me. And yeah, it's always a little weird and fun to hear your bio read right before you get on. So just grateful to be here and just like have a good time with you. It's always a great time when we podcast together.   Speaker 1 (02:30) Well, I'm excited to spend the next 30 minutes or so with content from you. So I always like to ⁓ start off for people that don't know who you are. I obviously read your bio. Can you just tell dentists and other people reading or listening and watching this episode how you help dental practices?   Speaker 2 (02:50) Yeah, absolutely. So with the bio you heard, I started out as a dental assistant and then went throughout and I've owned practices. My first practice I took from 500,000 to 2.4 million in nine months and opened our second location. And that was with a Midwestern grad. I worked at the dental college there. And so helping practices, what I learned was   I've been a team member, I've been in so many of the team roles. And then in addition to that, I've owned dental practices and I understand the business and I've run multimillion dollar practices and businesses. so bringing that perspective, I feel like there's the dentist perspective, there's the owner, the CEO of the practice, and then there's the team perspective. And both are necessary for practices. And so Dental A Team, say like, it stands for dentist and team. So what we really do for practices is whether it's virtual or in person, it's...   I call it the yes model line is what I like to say is number one, you as a person, we're going to focus on your vision, where you want to go as a doctor. Like what is your vision? The practice should serve your life. ⁓ because I believe that when you're supported, you're actually a better owner, a better boss, a better dentist. And then we go to E stands for earnings and profitability. We've got to make sure it's a profitable practice. And then we use those things, the vision and the numbers to then tell us what systems and team development we need to put into place. I'm really much a custom.   Let's see kind of like dentists do with patients. Like let's do a comp exam. Let's see where we're at. And then let's go for what's going to make the biggest impact with the least amount of effort. And being team members ourselves, I really think that we're able to like, Hey dentists, we want to hear your vision. We need to know where you're going and then go do your like favorite thing. It's dentistry. And then let's help your team be empowered to learn how to run the practice. So it truly is like a self-managing team, utilizing every single player in the team to their highest potential, but doing it with a ton of fun and ease. Like as a team member, I didn't want more hard work.   As an owner, do not want you to give me more homework. I'm already busy. So I feel like we really come in and bridge that gap of like where we are to where we want to go and do it in the easiest, most efficient and most fun way possible to help like team and patient experience be the top that it can be.   Speaker 1 (04:48) So I guess someone's listening to this podcast and they say, you know, want to, I want to change the culture in my practice, but I'm very much a micromanager.   So which means they're not focused on their dentistry, they're focused on managing the team. Do you help with that? Because there are so many micromanagers out there. I always wanted them for a very long time. And honestly, wasn't until I gave up that micromanaging and I just did the things I was going to do that my practice excelled. So ⁓ that's something, if someone's a micromanager, do you get them off doing that? Or how do you deal with that?   Speaker 2 (05:19) Yes, and I'm so glad you said that because I think most   Founder owners are micromanagers. think leadership we believe I I think so many there's this belief out there that we just come into this world as great leaders and we should just know it like you went to dental school you should just know how to be a leader and leadership is a journey and so for those micromanagers I think it's really fun to have the doctor and the team perspective and to be able to help both of them say like no doctor like these are the things but what I found is doctors micromanage because there's a lack of communication feedback loops so it's a lot so it's either a lack of communication and feedback   loop, a lack of knowledge, or they just like genuinely want to be a manager and they don't want to be an owner. And I'm like, great, let's just figure out what the the reasoning is. And then let's find the solution to that. So if team members have doctors that are micromanaging, first question I'm looking at is like, where's the feedback loop and what are we missing? Next is like, hey, doctor, I understand that this is where we're at. This is where I need you to be for the growth of the practice. What do you need to feel confident to be the dentist, to be the like not micromanaging like   there's a lack. And when I realize there's a lack and when teams can realize that there's a lack, like there's just something missing, we fix that, dentist is now able to be happy, team's able to flourish, everything starts to move in in a good motion. absolutely. I think being team members ourselves, we're not doctors, we're not dentists. Like, Len, I'm gonna lean on you for clinical. Like, that's not my world. I'm not here to even discuss it for one minute. But what I am here to do is to bridge that gap between doctors and teams.   Because ultimately it's same team, like everybody wants the best experience for the patient. We want the practice to flourish. So if we're all same team, let's help get people right seat, right person, help them understand what they should and could be doing. But also like office managers, there's this whole weird world for them too, where they've never been taught to be managers. They've never been taught what they should or shouldn't be doing. They've never been taught like what the difference between an office manager is and a biller and a scheduler and a treatment coordinator and how all those roles are different. And so helping people understand even what their job entails.   I think really can cut that micromanagement passion project. It's just a lack of knowledge and so teaching teams and teaching people, but we're very hands on. I really don't like fluff. That's why think when you and I get along well, I want it to be tactical. I want it to be practical and I want it to be something that's sustainable as well.   Speaker 1 (07:34) And that makes a lot of sense. And that was a great answer, by the way.   We're talking about, obviously you're very systematized. You put systems in place, the team follows, everybody knows what they're doing, runs like a well-oiled machine. Okay. And that's how my practice was when I left, when I was traveling. ⁓ I knew things, I didn't worry. I knew that things were going to be done like this. They knew the roles, team members didn't need to be scolded. They just knew what their role was in the practice. So, ⁓ I know there are things, I like a term here you use the chaos creators. So there are chaos creators in the, in the office. So what are some of these, these common chaos creators?   ⁓ that actually can be helped by putting systems in place.   Speaker 2 (08:13) Yes, and I love that you brought that up because that's the ultimate goal. That's why I wanted this to be called like the CEO mindset. Like doctors, like you should be a dentist and you should own your business. You should not be the one managing. And when you recognize that this actually can be one of the biggest chaos creators in the practice of doctors trying to be the doctor, the dentist, the CEO visionary, plus the manager, plus all the other parts of the practice. Like that is a chaos creator, not knowing right person, right? See is a massive chaos creator. Number one thing I hear every time I go into an office or I work with someone,   is it's communication. And communication is again just a system that needs to be put into place. So how do team members know? Like what is our true morning huddle? It's not a time for us just to hang out. Like why do football players huddle? Why do basketball players huddle? They huddle to win the game. So what does winning on our practice even look like? Making that very clear for our team. Other things like handoffs. That's another communication drop that's a chaos creator. What doctor says to the patient, to the hygienist, to the front office,   It's such fun. I feel like we play a game of telephone. So putting in a little simple system there where we've got a great communication handoff and a process. I know Len, you and I are very big on this case acceptance process of just really having a great clean experience for the patient. These are chaos creators. Also, team members even knowing what their job should be, understanding how they go from where they were hired to how they can get raises. Those are chaos creators. The scheduling. How do we schedule? Let's have block schedules in there. Let's have   a way that we do this in our practice. I remember when I was a scheduling coordinator, my office manager said, Kiera, do not even think about scheduling outside of the blocks until you learn why we schedule the blocks the way we do. And you're right, like when team members know the rules of the game, so much chaos gets eliminated from the practice. like quick things are have great meetings and truly great meetings. If you don't know how to run a great meeting, Traction by Gina Wickman.   It's a little bit of a dull book. However, there are so many paramount pieces in that book and great meetings could be in there. Doctors and OMS have a same page meeting where we're looking at it. Get our KPIs in place where we know where is the practice even going? What is each person's number that they can like impact and improve in the practice? Have like set job descriptions, have protocols of how we treat a patient. What's our hygiene period protocol? Let's just have like really simple systems and I'm big on I don't like to remember things.   Like I love holidays, holidays are on a cadence. So how can we actually get cadences within your practice to where things really can run on more of an autopilot rather than trying to constantly like catch all the balls and remember things? That's the chaos. The chaos comes from the like not knowing and trying to scramble and being in reactive rather than proactive modes.   Speaker 1 (10:53) But that's really good, that's really great. So another question I have for you, there are dentists who are just dentists, and I don't mean that negatively, but they go in with the expectation that they're either gonna be an associate forever, or they're just going to practice and let everybody run the practice and they're just gonna come and do the dentistry, okay? Versus having the mindset of and acting like the CEO, okay? And there's a big difference. One, I believe, has a lot more stress.   I like to talk about it because I was the CEO of the practice. I handled everything. I handled the marketing. I handled the HR. I handled all of the things that makes it different than just being a dentist and putting your hands in the mouth and treating a patient. So if someone wants to act and think like a CEO, what does it really mean to do that versus just practicing dentistry and doing the dental work?   Speaker 2 (11:51) Yes, I'm so glad you brought this up. I've been like crushing on this idea. We actually just ran a three day CEO dentist workshop. like.   obsessing on this right now because there is nothing wrong. And I think that there's a few hats that people wear. I wear a consultant hat. I also wear a CEO hat. And they're actually and I think about big companies like let's look at Google. I know that CEO is not coding. They're not. They're not building it. They're truly in a CEO realm. And so when we look at like what does a CEO do, they are the chief executive officer. Like their job is to execute. Their job is vision. Their job is culture.   and their job is to like really steer and guide the ship and to come up with great ideas. And so when I look at that, I think that there's two hats for CEO dentists to wear. There's the true clinical dentistry, if that's what you want to do and continue to do. And then we really do need somebody who's guiding and leading this business. And I think when dentists, I know this can be a little like not favored, ⁓ dental practices are multimillion dollar businesses and they are. when we realize that they're   They are businesses and like you said, the HR and the marketing. But when you look at large businesses outside of dentistry, they have other players in the realm and in the rink with them to make it actually run as a very successful business. And so I believe that when we understand the business portion of dentistry and we have great clinical care, that's when we're able to serve and help more patients and more team members. And so helping these dentists realize what does a CEO do? And I actually pulled from Dan Martel.   the author of Buy Back Your Time, like obsessed with his book, met him in person, like raving fangirl. It was like slightly embarrassing, like how big of a fan I was of him. ⁓ But he has his delegation ladder in there for businesses and actually created a delegation ladder for dental practices of when CEO dentists go from like your right line, a lot of them do it all. And that's, think, where the burnout is and the chaos is to where when can we start to delegate? Like, do you have a personal assistant who answers all of your emails for you? And if not,   Administrative tasks are one of the best things to delegate. Then we move into like our scheduling and then into our customer service and the patient experience. And then we move into treatment planning. A lot of doctors do that on their own. And I'm not here to say you have to give up anything, but I am here to say that when you truly take on the role of CEO, trying to do it all actually creates chaos. And you actually, you're the bottleneck of the business. And so then we start to delegate out the case acceptance if you want to. You're allowed to keep whatever you want, whatever you're great at.   Then we delegate out the marketing, then we delegate out the, actually, me and my operations manager were talking that I believe that there's two spaces within leadership. There's the executive side, that's these big picture visionary pieces. And then there's the management side, which is the HR, the protocols, the accountability of the team. And when we had that like, and I believe that there's, it's like a black and a white, yin and yang, perfect whole, you need both sides of this leadership within that CEO realm.   But when you're trying to do all the pieces as a CEO, you need to know every aspect going on in the business. But that does not mean you need to do every aspect of the business. And so I think it's like figuring out which colors you like to paint with, which ones really are your zone of genius and then starting to then delegate in strategic manners, delegate and elevate, not abdicate ⁓ really are how you can make this where you become truly the CEO of your business and your practice. And you're able to have great players around you that are able to then.   Make sure every other part of your business is thriving and flourishing too.   Speaker 1 (15:19) Got it.   Speaker 2 (15:20) So   much line, I hope it wasn't lying.   Speaker 1 (15:22) No, that was great. That was great. I mean, they should replay that because I think there was some really good nuggets and pearls that they can take back. So, you know, I want to talk about delegation. ⁓ you know, Invisalign is a great product ⁓ to bring into the practice or aligners in general. doesn't have to be Invisalign, just aligners. And aligners are really good, but they become really profitable ⁓ when a dentist is willing and able to delegate the tasks to other team members.   And personally myself, I used to do it all. And then I took a class by somebody, can't remember who it was, but it was all about giving the empower your team to do things and delegate the services to them where you're literally kind of just doing the initial consultation and whatever is required by your license in the realm of the things. But the team is able to do mostly everything else. And once you do that, ⁓ Invisalign becomes a very, profitable procedure.   So what advice do you have about delegation to somebody, to a dentist who really feels like they need to do it all and does not want to give up control of anything?   Speaker 2 (16:28) Len, I'm so happy you asked me this question and I'm so happy that I'm a team member and I'm gonna put on a team member hat, not a CEO hat on this one. ⁓ Number one, I really, really hope, and dentists, if you need to pause, replay, record this and listen to it every single day, I really hope you do. ⁓ As a team member, my number one job, genuinely speaking, and doctors have told me so many times when they've heard me say this, it...   hopefully will strike you to your heart as well. As a team member, my number one, like genuine number one objective was to make my doctor happy and to make their life easier. And that was honestly what I did every single day. As a dental assistant, I'm looking ahead. I want to be seven steps ahead of you and I want to make sure that you're truly like set up for success. I want to make sure that patient's back on time. I want to make sure that hygiene exams are on time. And I think that while yes, you might have some team members that make you question this statement.   I think 95 % of the population is genuinely good and they want you to thrive and they want the patient experience to be great. So when you hear that and you truly honor that and you respect that and you trust that, you then will realize that one of the best things you can do is, I don't believe in delegating. So like I can empower, but if I empower and don't hold accountable, then I've created entitlement within my practice. So I want to empower through delegating of this like.   As a dental assistant, do know how happy I'd be if you gave me, can fit a line. I understand I'm going to make a few mistakes, but oh my gosh, the growth, growth equals happiness. So for your team to be happy, give them opportunities to progress. Like that's what creates the happiness and the sparkle and the zest in life. And so really when you empower your team and hold accountable, you don't get this entitlement. When you empower and don't hold accountable, that's when we get these entitled teams that genuinely then it just becomes mayhem in your practice.   So like you said, delegate these tasks that one, either you're not good at, or I do think about everybody should be working at the top of their license. What are you able to produce per hour? If there's a task that I can hire somebody for less than you can produce an hour, it's probably something that we shouldn't be using your time for. And I know as a CEO, as an owner, this is actually hard for me because you strip me of things that I'm actually really good at, but reality is there's better uses of my time. And when you can recognize   giving everybody the best use of their time. Me as a dental assistant being able to do Invisalign, you've now just lifted and elevated me to the highest level of my license as well. And so I really do believe like doctors, one, believe that your team is truly here to support you. And if they're not here to support you, they're not your right team players. they like, great, let them graduate to somebody else and you bring somebody else in. Two, empower them and hold accountable to ensure that it's like how you want it done. And team members like,   You can share this with your team. I'm happy to share this one reason I like to do this. Team members, give the feedback to your doctor. They are going to trust you so much more when you come back to them and you show them the things you listen to what they say, you create the protocols, you do it exactly how they want you to do it. That will build trust and confidence so quickly. Team members lose doctor's trust so quickly when they like lacked to follow through and like truly do what the doctors have given them like stewardship and ownership over. So for those doctors and like you said, Len.   You won't understand until you try. And when you do try, you will make mistakes. But I believe, this is my philosophy, anything that I've delegated never gets to come back to me. And I think when you have that notion and that idea, well, I know it could never come back to me. You actually make it really, really great. You train your team. You help them have this. ⁓ And I then believe everybody's able to flourish so much higher. So hopefully that answered of like, one, you need to delegate and you should delegate.   Two, what are the tasks that you can be doing that are like helping you work to the highest level of your license? Everybody working at that is going to make a better team experience, a better patient experience, and all around a better practice for you as well.   Speaker 1 (20:20) I think you, I mean, the content you're providing, the listening and viewing audience is spectacular. you know, one of the, I guess, negatives about being a dentist is a feeling of being overwhelmed. A lot of stress. You know, that's part of the reason why I think you've got, you know, dentists with the highest, one of the highest suicide rates out there is that, you know, it's a very stressful job. I mean, you've got a lot of debt, you've got a lot of, you know, people relying on you for income as well. So what mindset   do you think exist ⁓ that or traps do you mindset traps do dentists fall into that that keep them feeling overwhelmed and and what do do about that?   Speaker 2 (21:00) Yeah, this is something so real to me. My first practice, I mentioned it briefly at the very beginning of we took our practice from 500,000 to 2.4 million in nine months. And when I present and I speak, I often will bring up like the success story and I list off my stats of our practice. I asked the audience, said, who wants this practice? And like hands go up and people are like shouting like, yes, I want this.   And then I say the other side of success is that this person, is me, like, spoiler alert, I was 98 pounds and I'm 5'8". I ⁓ had divorce papers on the line. I remember like I walked out of my practice that like one day and I remember just like standing on the sidewalk and being like one step and all this could be over. Like it was, and I'm not a dentist. I didn't even have the pressure of having to be in the exam rooms, but I do understand the pressure of business. And that's actually what's like fueled my passion in consulting is.   Because I thought like if this is how so many of us feel to get to success, Tony Robbins has a quote that success without fulfillment is the ultimate failure. And that was curidant in a nutshell. We had success on paper, but fulfillment was lacking and my entire life was falling apart. And so when you ask like, what are some of these zones that keep people in this mindset is one, I think that we believe that to get to success, we have to grind it out. We have to hustle. We have to do it all. Like it's this hustle mentality that I believe is so false.   Yes, I do believe that hard work is required, but I don't believe you have to do all of the work. Just like we talked about before, also think delegations paramount. I think so many of the doctors that I see there in this burnout are just, it's like grippy. Like they want to hold on to everything and they're not willing to let go and they're not like, also you're telling your team that you don't trust them and you don't believe in them when you do that as well. So you're actually causing like this double-edged sword on it. And then third, I think ⁓ we just don't take time to stop and pause and realize like what really is necessary.   I think so much like when I sold out of the practices, my whole identity was associated with that. if we have our identities associated with these practices and with the success, well, I can imagine that that feels like chopping off your arm and your leg if you were to fail. therefore, if it's literally my physical body and I feel like it's my whole identity, I literally remember the day that I sold out of the practices. I felt who is cura dent, who is she? Like I have no purpose in this world anymore. Nothing is important. Like I don't even have a family. I have no practice.   I felt nothing and I think when people's identities are associated with this rather than having something else. So I talk about like what makes all of you up and I remember like like looks like this weird little doll. Like it's such a weird outline that I make people do but I'm like draw to me like how your life is and when I do this usually it's like from your neck to like your ankles that's work and if that much of your identity is associated with work in your practice.   What could we shift this to more so your whole identity is not associated with that? So that's like we go work out, we have time with family, we book the vacations and when you start to realize that there's more life outside of the chair, more life outside of it and you being a well-rounded human that truly and I don't like the word balance, I just love the word well-rounded and fulfilled. When we start to add some of those pieces in which again feels contradictory, it feels like if I give this up that I'm not making money. I used to say I don't want to sit on the couch and watch TV with my husband because I'm literally not making money.   That's one of the the grossest statements I've ever said, but Len, it's truth. I really truly felt this way. Like the only purpose is to be producing and to be productive. But I didn't realize that. Like you look at that athletes have to take a break and they have to reset. They have to recharge. They have to like the best time is actually the recovery off season. ⁓ no, no person can continue operating at 110%. And when they are operating, they're actually not their best self. So there's just as much beauty in the recharge off time.   as there is on the productive on time. So when we can delegate, when we have more purpose beyond just our practice, and it's okay, work to me is very fulfilling. It's such a big part of my life. I love it. ⁓ But it's not all of Kiera's identity. So if I were to lose work, Kiera and hopefully you can still exist outside of that. ⁓ And then truly having shut off time. A lot of clients when they come on board, I tell them, I'm like, I'm giving you the greatest gift. You're out of work today at 4.30 and I don't want you to talk about work. Close the laptop, walk out and literally leave it at work.   And what's crazy is people don't realize that you can actually get a lot done within your four or five hour, like four or five day a week work week. And to be home with your kids, to be home with your family, to go to the gym, to replenish your bucket that gives out so much every single day ⁓ really is what you actually need to be doing rather than trying to produce more. And it sounds contradictory, but it's true. You will actually produce more and be a better producer and happier business owner if you will do that.   I know that was a long-winded answer, Len, but I really hope that people can see there are two sides of success. The word itself of success has a portion of suck. Like there is a side of business that is really hard that does require that grind and that hard work, but there's also a beautiful side. And I think when people can dance in that, can see that their whole identity is not the practice. It's not all dependent on that and they fill themselves and fuel themselves. Literally, I feel like the burnout can be dissipated very quickly.   If you've been going on it for a long time, it will probably take a little bit longer, but these small, simple steps will make you so much more fulfilled. And honestly, I hope nobody listening to this podcast hit success without fulfillment. I hope all of us commit that while we're giving the great patient care, we're giving back to all these people, we equally get to deserve and we should deserve to have a beautiful life of our own as well.   Speaker 1 (26:39) So nicely said, very eloquent in way you said that as well. last thing I want to cover is, we talked about being overwhelmed. stress is also part of being overwhelmed. very stressed. What are some ways that you think a dentist can reduce the stress on a day-to-day part of his practice? If someone said, hey, I'm so stressed, I don't know what I'm going to do. And you hear it a lot. I I talk to dentists all the time. And one of the common denominators is that they're   You know, when I sold my practice, I was never truly, truly stressed out. The stuff that stressed me out, honestly, was stupid stuff. But since I sold my practice and retired, I don't really have much stress in my life anymore. It's very interesting. But what are some things that dentists could do to reduce those stress they see on a day-to-day basis?   Speaker 2 (27:29) Yes. Okay. And I said, yes, because I'm to go back to the S model. The S model is literally like my stress booster buster for you. Number one, where do you want to go and why? Like figure out you that truly if you don't have a North star, you don't know what you're going for and reassess to make sure that's really where you want to go. So many people put this like, I want to have four practices and I want to have this. And I'm like, why? You got to be able to tell me why I'm making sure it's your dream, not the dream you think you should be living.   That's like number one to get rid of stress, like truly living your dream. And I will tell you, you're allowed to like, it's in pencil, it's not in permanent ink. You can erase it, you can recraft it, you can recreate it. That's going to cut stress. I was chasing after a mountain, I didn't want to climb anymore. And when I realized that, that was a pivot shift. So number one is like, make sure you're actually truly going where you want to go. And that's the you. Earnings like profit, like Len, so much stress comes from not knowing the numbers.   And I know people sometimes want to avoid it. They don't want to look at it. Like I'm just going to go do production. I want to do ethical dentistry and I will tell you both exist. It's not an or like you will you as a human are going to naturally do ethical dentistry. Like you can't go against that. That's who you are at your core. And by knowing the numbers, you're not going to go and overdiagnose like I promise you it will not happen. But knowing the numbers and actually like looking at your cash, what are you spending money on? What do you need to produce to be able to afford the business?   Doctors learn the numbers and they actually use the numbers to make their decisions. Stress dissipates. I have so many doctors that reach out to me because they're cash flow poor and I'm like, you're producing 200,000 a month, how are we broke? ⁓ So actually understanding how to use numbers and not to be used by numbers and knowing how you actually can get money and like what can you live on and understanding tax brackets and savings like that discipline might seem constrictive, but I will tell you it is the most freeing stress free piece that you can have.   And then third, our systems and team. Like I'm going to like just really keep like painting this picture for you. Delegate to your team, use your team, put the systems into place. And we don't go for the whole elephant. We don't do the entire thing in one night shift. What we do is we look at the numbers. Where are numbers low on the KPIs? Let's go fix a system over there. So we fix that part of the leaking bucket. Just that alone, like even myself, I felt it like the hoosh of reducing that stress for you. ⁓ Start with your vision.   know your numbers and then put systems into place and team delegation and elevation ⁓ that will immediately reduce stress. And then like just quick, what is the one or two hot pain points right now causing the bulk of your stress? Let's figure out how we can eliminate those right now. And I want to, everybody always says, Kiera, there's no way like I can't do this. The answer is yes, you can. Yes, you can. And when we get out of this, I can't get that, I can't do this. We actually find the true core of what we can solve. Usually the answer is pretty simple and it's pretty immediate.   if we're willing to just let go and take action. So those would be kind of my like four little steps to reduce stress quickly and easily. And if you can't see it, sometimes having an outside voice and outside perspective, sometimes you're too far in the weeds, that can be very beneficial for you as well to like take you by the hand and say, here's step one, two, three, four, and they're there to guide you as well, rather than you trying to figure it out yourself.   Speaker 1 (30:35) amazing. This is great. ⁓ I want to shift for the final few minutes that we have together. I want to shift to my lightning round Q and a that I like to do with guests. We're going to get through eight to 10 of these. Okay, ready? The rule of thumb for this one, you like long winded answers, which is great. But for this one, it's very, fast. No long, no long winded. We'll never get through this.   Speaker 2 (30:47) So   You got it, Len.   Speaker 1 (30:58) So I opened my app up. First question, what book do you want to go back and reread as it's made a great impact on you the first time you read it?   Speaker 2 (31:07) I would go back and reread Bye, Your Time by Dan Martell. I feel like there's a lot that I could relearn from that where I'm at today.   Speaker 1 (31:14) repeat that one more time.   Speaker 2 (31:17) Yep, buy back your time by Daniel.   Speaker 1 (31:19) Buy back your time. I'm just writing it down. All right. Who has been your greatest inspiration?   Speaker 2 (31:25) Gosh Tony Robbins hands down. I love Tony so much. I look up to him a lot. I've been in his Lions group ⁓ the reason I look up to him is because He said one time the Tony you see in front of you is the Tony I created it's not from my parents It's not from business. It's not from anybody else It's who I want to be and who I esteem to be and he said life is always happening for you and not to you and those two pieces have Resonated with me so much in my life ⁓ truly one of the like   biggest, greatest mentors and I've been really blessed and lucky to have him directly mentor me, which have truly changed the trajectory of my course, of my life as well.   Speaker 1 (32:04) Awesome, amazing. ⁓ If you could take a class to learn anything, what would it be on?   Speaker 2 (32:10) marketing. Len, hate marketing. Call my Achilles heel. I learned so much and I think I know more. But man, if I could like understand it on a really high level easily all day every day and I take a lot of them. But man, one like magic one that would teach me everything. Yeah, it'd be amazing.   Speaker 1 (32:26) Amazing. Do you believe there is some sort of pattern or formula to becoming successful?   Speaker 2 (32:33) Yes, I do. It sounds like cliche. I didn't like, I think the yes model came from what I believe success is like you having a vision, looking at your numbers and then putting systems into play and using your team ⁓ and surrounding your yourself with people that are living and doing the life you want. I really do believe we become like the people we surround ourselves what we listen to. So that's what I would say is the path to success.   Speaker 1 (33:01) Amazing too. Has anyone in your network other than Tony Robbins, has anyone in your network been important in your journey or to your journey?   Speaker 2 (33:09) Absolutely. There's a lot of people. think my husband, that's a huge support for me. He believes in me, even though maybe he shouldn't believe in me, but having that rock. And then also my team, truly, I look at all the variations of Dental A Team and where I've gone as me as a person, they've evolved me as a human and they've also evolved our company and the good and the bad that have gone through.   They have truly shaped me, every single one of them, and I'm very, very grateful for the trust they put in me to create what we've built.   Speaker 1 (33:42) amazing. How do you develop how have you developed key partnerships?   Speaker 2 (33:47) Ah, that's fun. You go to events, you talk to people, you look to see how can you add value to their world, to their life. And I think partnerships, partnerships to me, I don't try to figure out like how to do something. I look to see like, who do I know that knows how to do this? That's how I use partnerships in life and vice versa. Like bring more to the table than you take from people. But I look at people have just like, what's their secret sauce? How can I like, like connect them to other people? To me, it's a fun connect the dots of just getting great people together. That's how I believe that like.   To me, that's how all boats rise is through partnerships like hands down. One of the best things was networking and meeting people. You will learn more from the minds of men than you will be able to like mine out of this world. Like there is more gold there than anywhere else in this world.   Speaker 1 (34:32) Got it. What has been your most satisfying moment in business?   Speaker 2 (34:39) Most satisfying moment? There have been a lot. I think recently my most satisfying moment was when I wanted to give up and I really was so burnt out and I was exhausted and I was tired and I hit that breaking point again in my life. And for the first time in my entire career, I took an entire month off and I reset and it was the most scaring. There was a lot of really bad backlash that came from it.   But me as a human, re-centered, refocused, re-prioritized. And I think that that was one of the most satisfying moments to realize, at the end of the day, CEOs and business owners have to show up for themselves first to be able to give to their entire team. And I'd never, ever, ever, ever done that. So like me personally, that was one of them. But man, like the hundreds and thousands of clients lives, Glenn, you and I both know, I think as consultants, when you hear people's lives changing,   like clients who are broke and literally had no money and now they're buying their kids their dream lives, that to me will always be the clincher of everything but like beautiful and why I show up every single day to do it. So there's a personal and a professional win that was like just super satisfying.   Speaker 1 (35:47) That's really great. All right, three questions left. Let's get through these quickly. What deserves all your attention but seldom gets it?   Speaker 2 (35:57) I would say probably my body like working out.   Speaker 1 (36:00) Okay, what three adjectives describe your strengths?   Speaker 2 (36:06) Adjectives. ⁓ I would say grit. would say fun. And I would say passion.   Speaker 1 (36:16) Great answers. Last question I ask is to everybody. So it is one subscription, either business or personal, so something you pay for either monthly or annually, that you simply cannot live without.   Speaker 2 (36:33) ⁓ Len.   I would say I can't live without, honestly, boomerang. That sounds so ridiculous. I would not be able to follow up with all the millions of things that I do day in and day out without boomerang as a person, like professional. Like I would pay for that all day every day. ⁓   Speaker 1 (36:53) I haven't heard that one before, that's a good one. you go. ⁓ So Kiera, how can people learn more about how you can help them if they want to learn more about your consulting agency? What's the best way for them to reach out and find out more?   Speaker 2 (37:03) Yeah, thank you so much Len. Best way is listen to the podcast, the Dental A Team podcast. Reach out on our website, TheDentalATeam.com. You can book a call with us or you can always reach out. You can text us directly, 775-243-5100. Like we will get back to you. I'm happy to share any tips, any insights. Find us on Instagram, Dental A Team. Truly, we try to be just like you are Len, available in all aspects and just really, really grateful for this opportunity today.   Speaker 1 (37:30) Well, this was great. Thank you so much for ⁓ spending 30 plus minutes with me, really educating the audience on things you're passionate about. And just like I did on yours, you can see the passion when you talk, you can see the passion in how you answer the questions. So I truly appreciate you kind of giving it all to us. So thank you again for being part of the Raving Patients podcast. ⁓ Guys, if you like the episode, please like us, please review us. If you think you or yourself or one of your colleagues can use what the Dental A Team can do for your practice, please reach out.   let them know you heard about them through the podcast that I just did with Kiera. ⁓ And as I end ⁓ every single one of my episodes, remember your reputation matters until the next episode. Thank you so much for joining me and we'll talk to everyone soon.  

  Inspiration for creativity often arises from active engagement rather than a passive search for it. This concept is vividly illustrated in the conversation between host Aaron Della Vedova his guest Fior Lorett, a seasoned tattoo artist. Fiori emphasizes that her creative process is deeply intertwined with her daily artistic practice. She states, "the more I do, the more inspired I may be," highlighting that involvement in the creative process itself can ignite new ideas and motivation. Fiori shares insights into her unique neo-traditional style, which features an ornamental flair, and discusses her artistic journey and the influences that shape her work. The conversation explores the pressures of the creative process and the importance of finding joy in one's craft. Tune in to discover what it takes to maintain a prolific career in tattoo artistry and the personal experiences that drive Fiori's creative expression. Don't forget to check out her stunning artwork on Instagram @fiori_lorett Chat Highlights: 00:01:26 - Fiori's Tattoo Style 00:02:46 - Early Life and Family Background 00:05:05 - It All Started with Henna 00:07:04 - First Encounter with Tattooing 00:12:00 - Opening a Shop at 15 00:18:05 - Travel and Uncomfortableness as Inspiration 00:28:06 - Gypsy Lifestyle and Settling Down 00:32:47 - Challenges for Women in Tattooing  00:43:10 - What Makes a Great Tattoo 00:46:07 - Current Tattoo Trends and Future Predictions 00:50:37 - Self-Esteem Through Tattooing. 00:58:33 - You Have to Be All In as a Tattoo Artist   Quotes: "I tell myself every day that I chose this, this work chose me, and I do it because it's fun."   "I work to have inspiration. And the more I do, the more inspired I may be."   "I need to get out there and be uncomfortable."   "The act of doing it provides the inspiration. Versus find inspiration so I can do it."   "Now you get a young person that their expression to the world is their online presence." “It's almost like sometimes I see that people are doing tattoos for people that don't like tattoos."   "If you're not all in, if you're not really passionate and talented... You're probably not even going to make a living."   Stay Connected: Chats & Tatts: Website: http://www.chatsandtatts.com⁠ Tik Tok: https://www.tiktok.com/@chatsandtatts  IG: http://www.instagram.com/chatsandtatts Chats & Tatts YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/c/chatsandtatts Connect with Aaron:⁠   Aaron IG:⁠ http://www.instagram.com/aarondellavedova⁠ Guru Tattoo: http://www.Gurutattoo.com Connect with Fiori:: IG:https://www.instagram.com/Fiori_Lorett        

Introducing the All Def SquADD Cast show “Versus". It's a podcast with the OG SquADD! Each week, the SquADD will debate topics and vote at the end to see what wins. Versus airs every Monday and you can download and listen wherever podcasts are found. Special Guest Keysha E. Brandon Broady John Grimes This Week We Discuss Run On Water vs Run Up Buildings Date Your Celebrity Crush In Secrecy vs Marry A Popular OF Model Win A Race That Your Opponent Dies Shortly After From vs Have A Video Of You Getting Jumped By Kids Go Viral S/o To Our Sponsors Indacloud Indacloud.co Promo:ALLDEF

Introducing the All Def SquADD Cast show “Versus". It's a podcast with the OG SquADD! Each week, the SquADD will debate topics and vote at the end to see what wins. Versus airs every Monday and you can download and listen wherever podcasts are found. Special Guest Dion Lack Brandon Lewis This Week We Discuss Arby's vs Carls Jr Hold A Congrats On Getting Heaven Sign At Funerals vs Boo All The Kids At Spelling Bees That Lose Jason Bourne Franchise vs John Wick Franchise S/o To Our Sponsors Prize Picks Download Prize Picks App Today Use Promo Code SQUADD Better Help https://www.betterhelp.com/SQUADD New Listeners Recieve 10% Off Thier First Month

Introducing the All Def SquADD Cast show “Versus". It's a podcast with the OG SquADD! Each week, the SquADD will debate topics and vote at the end to see what wins. Versus airs every Monday and you can download and listen wherever podcasts are found. Special Guest Chinedu Unaka  Kevin Simpson This Week We Discuss Fight 1 Kangaroo vs 3 Honey Badgers  Become Rich But Can't Help Family vs Have A Rich Family That Mistreats You Mexican Cuisine vs Asian Cuisine S/o To Our Sponsors Cash App Download Cash App For a limited time, new Cash App customers can earn $10 if they use code CASHAPP10 in their profile at signup and send $5 to a friend within 14 days.  Terms apply.

Introducing the All Def SquADD Cast show “Versus". It's a podcast with the OG SquADD! Each week, the SquADD will debate topics and vote at the end to see what wins. Versus airs every Monday and you can download and listen wherever podcasts are found. Special Guest Dion Lack Kanisha Buss Courtney Haynes Donny Wilson This Week We Discuss Lose your Ability To Hear Music vs Ability To Taste Food Slow WiFi vs Only One Working Earbud  Deal W/ A Smelly Office Pet vs Weekly Office Potlucks W/ Coworkers You Don't Like Tour In Small Venues Only vs One Massive Show S/o To Our Sponsors Ava Download the Ava app today, and when you join using my promo code SQUADD, your first month is totally FREE.

Introducing the All Def SquADD Cast show “Versus". It's a podcast with the OG SquADD! Each week, the SquADD will debate topics and vote at the end to see what wins. Versus airs every Monday and you can download and listen wherever podcasts are found. Special Guest Kelly Kelz Brent Taylor This Week We Discuss Be On A Broken Ski Lift vs Broken Elevator Be An Adult That Never Ages vs A Teenager That Never Ages Only Listen To Music From The 70's vs Music That Comes Out The Current Year S/o To Our Sponsors Prize Picks Download The Prize Picks App Today! Use Code SQUADD IndaCloud IndaCloud.co Use Code ALLDEF Better Help https://Betterhelp.com/SQUADD New Listerners Get 10% Off First Month

Introducing the All Def SquADD Cast show “Versus". It's a podcast with the OG SquADD! Each week, the SquADD will debate topics and vote at the end to see what wins. Versus airs every Monday and you can download and listen wherever podcasts are found. Special Guest Roxxy Haze Lawrence Killebrew This Week We Discuss Noisy Neighbors vs Nosey Neighbors Work With People 15-20 Years Older vs 15-20 Younger Attend A White Potluck vs 6 Hour Time Share Presentation

Introducing the All Def SquADD Cast show “Versus". It's a podcast with the OG SquADD! Each week, the SquADD will debate topics and vote at the end to see what wins. Versus airs every Monday and you can download and listen wherever podcasts are found. Special Guest Roxxy Haze Dion Lack Young Deuces  This Week We Discuss Never Pay For Gas Again vs Never Pay For Electricity Again Run A Marathon On A Road Of Legos vs Be A Barehanded Cleaner At A Petting Zoo  S/o To Our Sponsors Better Help https://betterhelp.com/squadd Get 10% Off Your First Month Ava Download The Ava App Today Promo: SQUADD