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With Constantine Hatzivassiliou—Partner, Certuity Golf taught Constantine Hatzivassiliou how to perform under pressure. Building a nearly $5B multi-family office taught him that the best advisors become the first call when life, not just the markets, gets complicated. In Summary Many advisors spend years mastering investments, but for affluent families, portfolio management is often just the starting point. Jason Diamond welcomes Constantine Hatzivassiliou, Partner at Certuity, to discuss how his journey from aspiring professional golfer to leader of a nearly $5B multi-family office shaped his approach to client service. Their conversation explores why trust is earned long before a crisis, how family office services evolve naturally from client needs, and why the advisor's role increasingly resembles that of a quarterback coordinating every aspect of a family's financial life. The discussion also examines organic growth, referrals, fiduciary advice, private equity's impact on the RIA landscape, and the qualities that allow advisors to become indispensable over decades—not just market cycles. The Storyline Many advisors spend years perfecting investment management. But as clients become more successful, the job changes. The questions become bigger than portfolio construction. A business is being sold. A family dynamic shifts. A tax issue emerges. An estate plan needs updating. Suddenly, the advisor isn't simply managing assets—they're coordinating decisions, relationships, and emotions. For Constantine, that broader role was shaped long before he entered wealth management. As an aspiring professional golfer, he learned lessons about discipline, preparation, and performing under pressure that continue to influence how he serves clients today. Jason and Constantine explore how Certuity grew from approximately $210 million in assets to nearly $5B, not through acquisitions but through referrals and a service model built on becoming indispensable to the families they advise. Constantine explains why he believes the best advisors function more like quarterbacks than portfolio managers, orchestrating the many moving pieces that come with significant wealth. The conversation also examines the evolution of the multi-family office model, the role of fiduciary advice, the impact of private equity on the advisory landscape, and why experience, judgment, and trust remain the qualities clients value most. Ultimately, this episode is about what it takes to become the first call when life – not just the markets – becomes complicated. Topics Covered Lessons from professional golf that translate to wealth management Building Certuity from $210mm to nearly $5B in assets What distinguishes a multi-family office from a traditional RIA Why referrals fuel long-term organic growth Becoming the “first call” for affluent families Fiduciary advice and the evolution of the advisory profession Family office services beyond investment management Private equity and M&A in the RIA space Developing the next generation of advisors Trust, relationships, and lifetime client service > Download a transcript of this episode… Listen and Learn Highlights for Advisors How did professional golf prepare Constantine for advising wealthy families? (3:45) Constantine explains why competing under pressure taught him discipline, emotional control, and process—qualities that now guide every client relationship. How did Certuity grow from $210 million to nearly $5 billion? (8:00) He shares why nearly all of the firm's growth has come organically through client referrals rather than acquisitions or aggressive recruiting. What separates a multi-family office from a traditional advisory firm? (11:45) The conversation explores how expanding into trust, estate, tax, and family office services became a response to client needs—not a business strategy. Why should advisors think of themselves as quarterbacks? (20:00) Constantine recounts a client business sale that fell apart at the closing table and explains why advisors often become the person holding everything together. How does Certuity view private equity and acquisitions? (36:20) Jason and Constantine discuss when outside capital can make sense—and why Certuity has chosen a different path centered on client alignment. Why do wisdom and experience still matter in an AI-driven world? (29:30) Despite advances in technology, Constantine argues that judgment, trust, and perspective remain the qualities affluent families value most. Key Takeaways High-net-worth clients increasingly value coordination, judgment, and perspective over investment selection alone. Family office services often evolve naturally as advisors respond to increasingly complex client needs. Sustainable organic growth is rooted in trust, which explains why referrals account for the overwhelming majority of Certuity's new business. Golf and wealth management share the same disciplines: preparation, emotional control, patience, and executing under pressure. The most valuable advisors become trusted partners during life's defining moments—not simply portfolio managers. Technology continues to reshape wealth management, but experience and wisdom remain difficult to replicate. Building a lasting advisory business requires investing in culture, succession, and the next generation of talent. https://youtu.be/m72Hq6bMTo4 Quotable Moments “The best advisors aren't simply managing portfolios. They're the first person clients call when life gets complicated.” “A bad shot in golf is the equivalent of a bad day in the market. You can't let one dictate everything that comes next.” “More often than not, we're not just financial advisors—we're financial therapists.” “Growth gets the headlines. Trust is what makes it possible.” FAQs What is a multi-family office? A multi-family office delivers integrated services beyond investment management, often coordinating tax, estate planning, philanthropy, business planning, and other complex financial matters for affluent families. Why has Certuity grown primarily through referrals? Constantine attributes the firm's growth to deep client relationships, a collaborative service model, and becoming the trusted advisor clients recommend to others. How does golf relate to wealth management? Golf reinforces discipline, emotional control, preparation, and performing under pressure—all qualities Constantine believes are essential for effective advisors. What is Constantine's perspective on private equity in wealth management? While he understands why many firms pursue private equity, he believes every strategic decision should ultimately be measured against what best serves clients. What qualities distinguish exceptional advisors today? According to Constantine, exceptional advisors become trusted coordinators of a client's financial life—bringing together specialists, solving problems, and providing perspective during life's most important moments. A multi-family office delivers integrated services beyond investment management, often coordinating tax, estate planning, philanthropy, business planning, and other complex financial matters for affluent families. Constantine attributes the firm's growth to deep client relationships, a collaborative service model, and becoming the trusted advisor clients recommend to others. Golf reinforces discipline, emotional control, preparation, and performing under pressure—all qualities Constantine believes are essential for effective advisors. While he understands why many firms pursue private equity, he believes every strategic decision should ultimately be measured against what best serves clients. According to Constantine, exceptional advisors become trusted coordinators of a client's financial life—bringing together specialists, solving problems, and providing perspective during life's most important moments. Related Resources Emotional Intelligence: The “Untouchable” Differentiator in an AI World Intentional Growth: How Top Advisors Build Businesses That Last The 10 Characteristics of the Most Successful Teams Constantine HatzivassiliouPartner  Constantine Hatzivassiliou is a Partner at Certuity, a nationally recognized multi-family office serving affluent families, entrepreneurs, executives, foundations, and endowments. He advises clients on the complex financial, tax, estate, and business planning decisions that accompany significant wealth, helping families coordinate all aspects of their financial lives through a comprehensive family office approach. Drawing on more than two decades of experience, Constantine works closely with successful business owners, corporate executives, and multi-generational families to simplify financial complexity and align investment management, tax planning, estate planning, philanthropy, and family governance strategies. As a Certified Exit Planning Advisor (CEPA®), he frequently assists entrepreneurs in preparing for liquidity events, business transitions, and the long-term stewardship of family wealth. His clients often view him as a trusted advisor and strategic sounding board, helping them navigate important financial decisions with the perspective of both a family office professional and a coach. Prior to joining Certuity, Constantine held advisory and banking positions with The Bank of New York Mellon, Bernstein Global Wealth Management, and Pacific Mercantile Bank. Before entering the financial services industry, he was a Golf Professional and member of the PGA of America, experiences that continue to shape his disciplined, competitive, and relationship-focused approach to advising clients. Outside of his professional responsibilities, Constantine is passionate about mentoring young athletes and strengthening the communities in which he lives and works. He serves as a Board Member of Coerfontaine Football Club (CFC), a premier youth soccer organization focused on developing young athletes and helping them pursue collegiate and professional opportunities while fostering leadership, discipline, and character. He also serves as Chair of the Safety and Security Committee for Parkland, where he works alongside community leadership to enhance resident safety, security, and quality of life. In addition, Constantine is a Founding Board Member of The Boardroom, a private membership organization focused on fostering meaningful relationships among business leaders, entrepreneurs, and professionals through networking, education, and philanthropy. Born in Greece, Constantine spent his childhood in Montreal before relocating to South Florida. He attended the University of Florida before earning a Bachelor of Arts in Economics from Florida Atlantic University, where he graduated with honors. He holds the Certified Exit Planning Advisor (CEPA®) designation. A lifelong student of the game, Constantine remains active in golf and is a member of Muirfield Village Golf Club, founded by his longtime  hero and mentor, Jack Nicklaus, as well as Parkland Golf & Country Club. Constantine resides in Parkland, Florida, with his wife, Stephanie, and their two children, Nicholas and Olivia. NOTE: The views and opinions expressed by the guests on this podcast are their own and do not necessarily reflect the views and opinions of Diamond Consultants. Neither Diamond Consultants nor the guests on this podcast are compensated in any way for their participation. Episode Transcript Lessons from the Links: From Golf Pro to $5B Family Office Partner A conversation with Jason Diamond and Constantine Hatzivassiliou, Partner at Certuity. Jason Diamond: Welcome to the latest episode of our podcast series for financial advisors. Today’s episode is Lessons from the Links: From Golf Pro to $5B Family Office Partner. It’s a conversation with Constantine Hatzivassiliou, partner at Certuity. I’m Jason Diamond and this is the Diamond Podcast for Financial Advisors. Mindy Diamond: At Diamond Consultants, we help elite advisors identify the right environment for their businesses to thrive whether that’s at a wirehouse, boutique or independent firm. With nearly three decades of experience, we’ve guided thousands of advisors and represented more than a quarter of a trillion dollars in assets transitioned and, each year, one in four advisors managing $1 billion or more who change firms are our clients. Our process is education-driven and based on building relationships starting as your strategic partner well before you’re even thinking of a move. To schedule a confidential conversation, call us at (908) 879-1002. Wondering why advisors change firms and where they’re headed? Are transition deals going up or down? Those very questions and more inspired us to create our annual advisor transition report, it’s the award-winning data-driven resource designed for advisors that connects the dots between the motivations around movement and the firm’s appetite for top talent. Arm yourself with the knowledge you need to make smart decisions, download your copy at diamond-consultants.com/transitionreport. Jason Diamond: Golf is a way of exposing who you really are, there are no teammates to blame, no clock to run out and no hiding from a bad decision. Every shot demands discipline, patience and the ability to stay focused when the pressure is highest, my guest today knows that firsthand. Before becoming a partner at Certuity, a multifamily office approaching five billion in assets, Constantine Hatzivassiliou was pursuing a career as a professional golfer. An injury ultimately redirected his path towards wealth management but many of the lessons he learned on the course still shaped the way he serves clients today. Certuity has grown from roughly 210 million in assets to nearly five billion, that’s impressive on its own but the more interesting story is how they’ve done it. The firm has grown largely through referrals built around a multifamily office model and focused on becoming far more than an investment advisor to the families it serves. In Constantine’s view, the best advisors aren’t simply managing portfolios, they’re the first person clients call when a business is being sold, a family issue becomes complicated or a major decision carries consequences well beyond the balance sheet. Constantine and I discuss the lessons golf teaches about handling pressure then we dive into the evolution from the traditional wealth management world to the multifamily office model, why referrals drive nearly all of Certuity’s growth, how he thinks about private equity’s influence on the advisory business and what it takes to become the first call for the wealthy families they serve and perhaps, most importantly, why the same qualities that help someone succeed on a golf course may be surprisingly relevant to building trust over a lifetime. It’s a great conversation so let’s dive in. Constantine, thank you so much for joining, thrilled to have you here. Constantine Hatzivassiliou: Thank you for having me, excited to be here. Jason Diamond: Yeah, absolutely. So, you had an unconventional path to wealth management, you started as a professional golfer, I think that’s a first for us on this show, before ultimately transitioning into this world. Can you tell us a little bit about the journey and what brought you here? Constantine Hatzivassiliou: Yeah, I never thought I’d be here, my parents were certainly shocked that I got here path wise. Growing up, immigrants from Greece, you settle into Florida the traditional way where you either go down the diner route or the gas station route in mechanics which my father was the latter and school and education was never priority, it was always about supporting the family needs. So, next thing you know, sports are a critical part of any good household, that’s how I was raised and I played everything but golf. I grew up on a golf course because my parents believed that a location of a property was critical to long-term financial success. We lived on a golf course, it was in our backyard, we’d stare at it and we’d use it to play football or baseball or anything but actual golf. And my freshman year at the University of Florida, I started dating a girl on the golf team and she got me hooked to the point where, after four years of hitting balls with the women’s and men’s golf team at the University of Florida for six hours a day, we finished school and realized I’m actually pretty good at the game and, while I have a finance and economics background and degree, let’s try and pursue this for a living and I was blessed. I had a sponsor who helped me succeed at golf on a small scale, it was a humbling experience to say the least. I was competing and playing with Sean O’Hair, Ken Duke, guys who made it out on tour for a very long time, we had the same sponsor so we functioned as a team, it was a collegiate team effectively trying to make it out on tour. And, unfortunately, my second year of competing, I blew out my back doing heavy deadlifts which set me aside for 18 months. While I was recovering, my primary sponsor was in financial services and says, “Hey, you have a background in this, it’s killing you not being able to be on the golf course, why don’t you come work for me while you’re rehabbing so that, when you get back to playing golf, it’s easier for you to talk about our business as a sponsor to try and develop business to throw it to the financial services side?” And Jason, the reality is, after 18 months working there, I fell in love with it. I made way more money working in that environment than I ever would’ve made playing golf because, again, I came to the game late. I was decent but I was nowhere near the caliber of players that are succeeding now out on tour. So, I pivoted after having met my wife and decided to settle down into the wealth management space and, what is it now, 26 years later, going strong. So, it’s been a fun transition from golf into wealth management to say the least. Jason Diamond: Probably my favorite background … I watch a lot of golf, I should caveat that, probably my favorite origin story we’ve had, I’ll give you the Wanamaker trophy or whatever you get, first place. Let’s talk about the business now, so Certuity. For our audience who may not be familiar, tell us a little bit about the firm, what types of clients do you serve and any context you can provide on size as well. We’ll talk about how your firm got there but just give us where we are today to start with. Constantine Hatzivassiliou: So, goal by the end of the year is to have $5 billion in AUM, we’re just shy of that now. We currently service 428 families across the country. So, we’re boutiquey and nimble, we’re based in South Florida, we have offices in New York, San Fran and LA. I’m fortunate to be one of four partners at the firm supporting the growth and the direction of the company and it’s a fun endeavor in the sense that, when we first started, I was employee number four 16 years ago and, with 210 million in AUM at the time to grow it to where we are today, to learn all the things that we have over the years, the curve balls that were thrown at us because all of us came from massive institutional wealth management firms. So, we transitioned from the Bernsteins of the world, the BNY Mellons of the world into an RIA in the South Florida market, there was absolutely an entrepreneurial learning curve involved. Jason Diamond: I bet. And on follow-up question, 16 years ago, did you have a book of business, client business and do you still maintain a book of business today? Constantine Hatzivassiliou: I do. The four of us at the firm share in all of the clients, we work together. Being in the Southeast, I’m responsible for, let’s call it, the Southeast demographics of the US which is a large portion of Certuity’s book. I have a partner in Tennessee, I have a partner in LA and San Francisco and we divide and conquer across the country. But, yes, we came over with a small book, we’ve all grown it organically since then. So, we’ve been very effective in how we’ve grown. Jason Diamond: Just from adding new client money? Constantine Hatzivassiliou: Strictly through new clients referred to us by existing clients. Jason Diamond: Wow. I want to talk more about the growth because that’s remarkable. But before I do, can we double click on the service model? So, I would say the most typical we hear, I think more of our guests typically come from the wirehouse world where it’s I have my book, you have your book. What does your service model look like? So, is it truly, if it’s working well from the end client perspective, you should be interchangeable with your partners and it’s a true team approach? Constantine Hatzivassiliou: How we engage our clients, the theory should be I can get hit by a bus tomorrow and outside of the client not being able to speak to me directly, they will not have a hiccup in any way, shape or form. And when we’re dealing with families across multiple generations, the way we’ve built our platform, that continuity is critical in the engagement process for the clients hiring us to help them through all of the challenges that they face. Jason Diamond: What’s your sweet spot in terms of client size? Constantine Hatzivassiliou: Our average client size today has just shy of eight million AUM with us. We have some clients who have $1 million certainly but they’re strategic in that their friends, their family, they could be centers of influence who help send business our way because they value what it is that we do and there’s a strategic partnership because we might need them for their trust and estate services or their accounting work and they have clients who have a need and we’re on the short list of people they refer to. Jason Diamond: That they trust. Yeah, makes sense. So, I’ve seen this in the news and also even on your own internal materials, I’ve seen you described as both a modern multifamily office, you’ll also obviously hear the term RIA as well. Does that distinction matter at all? And maybe my second part of that question would be what is the distinction between that space, whatever you call it, and the more traditional firm world from a client service perspective? You mentioned that all of your partners from that world. Constantine Hatzivassiliou: I started in this industry truly at an institutional level at Bernstein in New York and, for anyone who knows Bernstein, they really do brainwash you on the fiduciary model and the values affiliated with that philosophy has translated through my career at BNY Mellon which has a very similar feel as Bernstein. And then, when we came here, we instilled that same core value principle of fiduciary responsibility for our clients so we are very different than a traditional wirehouse or brokerage house, it is why we’ve grown so successfully. I would never, one, work for an institution that did bide by those standards and, secondarily, I wished Congress and Senate would turn around and actually implement a mandatory fiduciary liability for all financial advisors because, far too often, we see prospective clients or families get taken advantage of because the individual sitting across from them giving them financial advice is not necessarily aligned with their goals and objectives. Jason Diamond: So, I take it you are fee only. Constantine Hatzivassiliou: We are fee only. Jason Diamond: Yeah. I don’t want to lose the thread on the first part of my question. Do you think there is a distinction between a multifamily office and an RIA? I don’t want to lead you here but to me it implies a different level or different caliber of service model that probably includes more of the ancillary trust and estate and CPA type stuff that higher network clients need but curious what your thoughts are. Constantine Hatzivassiliou: Our first seven years at the firm, we were strictly an RIA, we functioned as an advisory service provider to our clients. What attracted me and my partners to Certuity was the nimbleness of the firm. So, for instance, at BNY Mellon, we often deemed a change necessary as moving an aircraft carrier across the world but it was an impossible task to accomplish. But when you’re small and nimble and clients come to you with a need and you’re in the service, ultimately, first and foremost, it made sense for us to start building out family office services for our clients because they had a need and we found it as a way to centralize everything because, far too often, when the communication standards break down between all the individual parts, one, it’s more expensive for the clients and, two, the process isn’t efficient, things get missed. So, we tried, largely due to our growth, to bring everything in house and our clients appreciate that for it. Jason Diamond: So, this is not a chicken and egg situation, this is very much we had large clients, we were attracting large clients and, in order to service them optimally, here’s what we felt we needed to build. Is that fair? Constantine Hatzivassiliou: 100%. Jason Diamond: Let’s shift gears, I need to go deeper on the professional golf thread a little bit. I promise I won’t make the whole interview about your golf background. I’m curious if you feel like that experience or that, I don’t know, upbringing or, I guess, background laid any foundation for the way you engage with clients today or the way you operate as a business leader today. Constantine Hatzivassiliou: So, there’s a couple parts to that. The golf side, certainly, just from an engaging client perspective, 90% of our clients are golfers. Jason Diamond: It’s very true. Constantine Hatzivassiliou: Right. It just helps because of our background and certainly with some of the clients and partners that we have at the firm, golf is a critical thread in what we do. However, when it comes to golf, what I learned playing golf at a high level directly translates to how we manage money for clients and I’ll express it this way. There’s generally two types of golfers, there’s the artist, the Sergios of the world who don’t fundamentally function off of specific points in their swing or a very structured platform, they see something, their mind becomes creative and they execute on it. I was never that way, I am a numbers person, I think everything analytically, I break everything down to the minute, everything is strategized and organized, I was taught to practice that way by Coach Alexander at the University of Florida and that foundational element seemed easy, it worked. If you practice properly, you’ve succeeded. Under pressure, all those hours and hours of repetition translated to success more often than not. In our industry, it’s process-driven, it has to be unemotional. A bad shot in golf is the equivalent of a bad day in the market, you can’t let one bad day in the market influence everything you do for the next year. Same way on the golf course playing in a tournament, you can’t allow one golf shot to affect the rest of the round. We kid with our clients oftentimes that, while we are fundamentally their financial advisor, more often than not, we’re their financial therapist. We have to control their emotions and make sure they’re not making an irrational decision. For instance, a couple days ago we were out with a client the day that Iran shot down one of the US military helicopters and we’re sitting down at lunch and, all of a sudden, his phone starts blowing up because he’s getting all these Google alerts to the market heading in the wrong direction and he had to go do a life insurance test later on that afternoon. So, all week, he had prepped and he was calm and he was relaxed, he was really excited, he’s, “My wife is setting me up with a new insurance policy and I know it’s for her benefit but all my numbers look good, I’m going to ace this and my premiums will be really low because of it,” it was a $25 million policy. And as he’s looking at his phone and he sees the market collapsing in his mind, his blood pressure rose to no end, you could see that his anxiety level went through the roof and, had I not been there with him at the time to hold his hand through that process, his afternoon would’ve been shot. I would’ve got a phone call saying, “What are we doing to prevent 2% loss in my portfolio,” because that’s how he thinks and, in that moment, I was the therapist to talk him off a ledge. It’s so hard for individuals to manage the stress of the markets, that golfer mentality of, okay, just breathe, relax, let’s see what’s going on, let’s make an educated, confirmed decision, let’s circle back with our caddy if we’re on tour and competing and make a unified decision for the long-term success of the goal that we’re trying to achieve. And what we do every day is the same thing with our clients. Jason Diamond: It’s an incredibly thoughtful answer, I expected a version of the latter part of your answer. I appreciate that you added the part about just most clients like golf, enjoy talking about golf, enjoy playing golf and it’s an effective business development tool, there’s no question. Constantine Hatzivassiliou: So, I have two kids, a 12-year-old and an eight-year-old, my son who’s 12 who’s an exceptional soccer player and wants to, aspires to play professionally one day has now fallen in love with golf which I’m ecstatic about. I think golf and tennis, from a business development perspective- Jason Diamond: Yeah, lifelong sports. Constantine Hatzivassiliou: And I look at it now and my mentor when I started in the business was absolutely right. The fact that I could get a CEO of a Fortune 100 company to want to actively spend four hours with me where we could dive into the weeds about their personal life, their financial situation, their business, you could never get that time otherwise. I urge everyone who’s coming out of college or is going into college who wants to aspire to be in any type of sales related role, golf is a great venue to make long-term relationships. Jason Diamond: And importantly, tennis is not as good on the knees long-term or the back long-term. So, you stick to golf, you get a little more longevity out of it. Constantine Hatzivassiliou: It does help, yes. You’re right. Jason Diamond: My thought always goes to people call it the 15th club in golf, just this mental element of the game and to me it’s the clear moment in golf that always comes to mind for me is the 72nd hole. I don’t know if you just watched the US Women’s Open but Nelly Korda standing over a two-foot putt that I really thought she missed, is there an equivalent of that moment? Are you ever able to recreate that pressure in your current role or is that something that you miss? Constantine Hatzivassiliou: Jason, we have those moments weekly, countless stories. Here’s where I love my job. I’ve transitioned from being the guy behind the screen who is just trading accounts, that’s where we all start and you have to have that foundational perspective of what’s involved in trading an account on a daily basis. Not that we ever picked stocks to an extensive level, we were generally managing ETFs, mutual funds and strategies but I’ll give you an example. So, just last week, we had a family and this is where the family office side comes in more so than the financial advisory services come in. We had spent four months in helping a family sell their business, it was a life altering moment, the dad started the business, the dad had been independently successful, net worth of well into eight figures, was happy and content, brought his son into the business, son was brilliant, saw an opportunity within the business and grew the business by 4,000%. Jason Diamond: Literally? Constantine Hatzivassiliou: Yup. All because of this, the son saw a different direction and pivoted the business and grew it out and here he is, getting ready to have their first child and he gets approached by a firm to acquire his business. They’re ecstatic, the number was perfect, I thought it was overvalued, I was telling them that there’s no way they could turn it down because the number was too significant. Had they gone to the market, they would probably never achieve that level of return. And literally, the day of closing, as we’re expecting the wire to come through, the deal gets pulled. So, here you have the father who’s crushed because he was trying to provide something for his son, the son who’s just devastated because he now was preparing for the second stage of his life and you go through at that stage the classic stages of grief, it’s the cycle that goes through it. I was holding their hand through the three-month process up to there, every day, hourly calls, strategizing, building everything out, organizing the accounting team, organizing the attorneys, getting it all to work out. And here I am, father and son, unbelievably stressed, you have the wives in the background who can’t quite comprehend what’s going on, you have employees beneath them who are now confused as to there was a transition getting ready to take place and the only person who can step in under that critical moment to bring everybody back together was me. So, here I am thinking, 20 years ago, I’ll just pick stocks and bonds for individuals but now I’m in the middle of deal flow trying to help a family solve the issues that arise. So, those are hugely critical- Jason Diamond: Yeah, that’s right. Constantine Hatzivassiliou: …moments where, because our clients are our friends and family, we care for them like they’re our own, you become emotionally attached. And the same pressure that I felt when I won my first mini tour event after college, when I had to get up and down from the impossible bunker shot and I hit it to six feet and I made the crucial put to win my first $23,000 check which I thought was unbelievable, they gave you those big old-fashioned- Jason Diamond: The Happy Gilmore checks. Constantine Hatzivassiliou: Exactly, right? It was the greatest day at that time. The stress of being in that bunker trying to hit that shot is the same stress I felt having two phones ringing, one the father, one the son where we have to keep that situation separate. So, you’re diving into unbelievably stressful situations and the best part is, when we get it all solved and literally yesterday we solved the entire dynamic of the business, I get a text from the son saying that this was the most incredible rollercoaster experience he’s ever experienced, that he’s incredibly grateful for all that I did and our team did for him and that, for the rest of his life, we will always be the first person he calls to solve any of his problems. So, for us, that’s the recreation of that stressful moment and then the victory on the back end. Twenty-five years ago, I got the big Happy Gilmore check. Yesterday, I got that text which I’ve printed out and framed and have it in my office as a constant memory of why it is we do what we do. Jason Diamond: And I would bet that’s more impactful than the $23,000. It’s an incredible story and I’ll tell you why, you said it but it’s as far away from stocks and bonds as you could possibly get. But I think, most advisors, a story like that resonates much more. It leads into my next question. You intentionally choose to service a high net worth segment of the market and I would assume that number’s probably creeping up, not down over time in terms of who you service. My thought is that’s a very competitive segment of the market as well. Is this how you differentiate is just you make it about those types of human examples or is there more to it? Constantine Hatzivassiliou: I’m envious of the advisor who could walk into a room of 200 people and they become the central focal point of the room where they can walk up to every single person and fearlessly ask them incredibly personal information, I’m not wired that way. For me, I’m very much the individual that I will find the one person that I have common ground with, I will deepen that relationship and I will add value and, because of the value that I create, I become a critical component of that individual’s success. And that’s how we’ve grown our business holistically at the firm largely buy that extra layer of service. We’re a commodity business. Being in South Florida, the clubs that I belong to, 10 to 15% of the members feel like they’re financial advisors. You could throw a rock anywhere and find a financial advisor so how do I differentiate myself? The only way I can truly differentiate myself and my firm is the level of service we provide, to go that extra step. To where, when we’re calling a client, they know I’m calling them to support their needs not because I’m seeking something for any ulterior motive. Jason Diamond: But you don’t mention financial planning or investment management or asset custody. Is that because I assume just that’s table stakes? Of course we do that but … Okay, yeah. Makes sense. Constantine Hatzivassiliou: That’s the easy part, right? That’s foundationally … And to your earlier point, you were asking the RIA model. One of the biggest challenges that we had down here in South Florida was the RIA model is new. If you were in the northeast, RIAs are very common, out west, incredibly common. Down here in South Florida, I just finished dealing with Bernie Madoff. Jason Diamond: You were fighting the good education fight a little bit. Constantine Hatzivassiliou: At Bernstein, 108 of our clients had assets with Bernie Madoff. Jason Diamond: Yeah. Constantine Hatzivassiliou: So, when you leave, one of our biggest growing curves as an RIA in South Florida was, when you leave the power of BNY Mellon or Bernstein and you’re some random little shop called Certuity, no one knows who you are. So, there was a big part of our education in the business was learning how to educate clients and prospective clients on the value of the RIA model and the fiduciary model in particular. Jason Diamond: Could you give me the 30-second answer to that if somebody says who are you, your prospect? I’ll tell you why I ask. Forget just Bernstein’s and BNYs of the world, a Morgan Stanley advisor or Merrill advisor has the exact same fear. I’m leaving Merrill to go launch Jason Diamond Wealth Management, my client’s going to say, “Well, who is that?” So, give me the quick pitch. Constantine Hatzivassiliou: Your typical broker, let’s say, you’re not really hiring JP Morgan, you’re not really hiring Wells Fargo, you’re not hiring Goldman Sachs, you’re hiring the advisor who works for that institution. Now, yes, that advisor has the Rolodex of data and information available at the firm level but, ultimately, you’re entrusting that individual to make your decisions for you. The broker who leaves the brokerage model to open up their own brick and mortar operation has to then decide are they continuing down the wirehouse brokerage model where they’re transactional in nature, the economics behind that, far more profitable. The revenue streams affiliated with a brokerage house drastically blows us out of the water. But then you have to also look at yourself in the mirror so how are you running your book of business, how are you running your practice. So, to answer your 30-second question, the RIA model, in my opinion, is truly the only way any family of wealth should proceed with an advisory firm because you want an individual who is aligned in your goals and objectives. Our clients know that I’m their chief financial officer, I work for them. They task us with building out a financial strategy that is customized to their individual needs and they never have to worry do I have an ulterior motive as to why I’m presenting an option in that strategy. And, because of that, the fiduciary model, I think, is critical for our success as a firm and, again, as I mentioned earlier, I wish it’s something that was industry well and not the vast minority. Jason Diamond: Yeah. No, that’s a great answer. So, do you think then that, as time has gone on, this has gotten easier? I assume the answer is yes either because more clients are aware of your brand and/or more aware of the space as a whole. Constantine Hatzivassiliou: The first thing that helped the most was some gray hair. When I started at Bernstein, I attempted to solicit new clients very much the same way I do today. But when I was 26 years old and I’m sitting in front of a family worth and the dad was in the 70s and he lived his life and I’m younger than his kids, he would look at me and say, “What do you really know? What experience do you have?” So, doing this now for as long as I have, the number one thing that has helped me the most in growth is just wisdom and time. Without that, yes, you can be a rockstar stock picker. We have so many kids coming out of college today with the advent of AI and technology that have algorithms that could run unbelievable portfolios and there is a segment of the market who wants to hire and engage those individuals but, generally speaking, the families that we service, that is 10th or 12th on the list of importance. Jason Diamond: No, I think that’s spot on. I think most high net worth clients counterintuitively agree with that, that alpha, for lack of a better term, is really not the name of the game or not in the top five reasons why you would engage with a financial advisor. Constantine Hatzivassiliou: Agreed. The biggest thing that we’ve been doing to educate clients especially in today’s environment, I had a call yesterday with an individual, a client who lives in New Jersey who works out of New York for a hedge fund, he knows our space incredibly well. He’s one of those kids, 28 years old, brilliant, as smart as you’ll ever be but his tax bracket is atrocious. He is paying so much of his W-2 income in taxes and building out a strategy that can reduce his tax liability by several hundred thousand dollars a year far exceeds any alpha I can generate by picking a top decile performer. Jason Diamond: What was the strategy? Move to Florida? I’m just kidding. Don’t answer that. Constantine Hatzivassiliou: We offered that but, unfortunately, he has to be physically in the office in New York City but yes. Jason Diamond: I think that will resonate, by the way, your gray hair comment. I appreciate the humility and the modesty in that because, the reality is, one of the questions I was going to ask you about was next-gen talent cultivation. In my opinion, this is a hard game for younger folks for that reason. People sit across from other people with a lot of money and they say, “Why am I going to entrust you with my life’s work when you just don’t have that degree of experience?” I was asking more even about your firm success and your firm story, have you felt like that’s caught on more? Do you have more brand awareness, if you will, now when you go to a prospect meeting or do you think you’re still constantly fighting that education fight? Constantine Hatzivassiliou: So, first part, brands, it’s improved in our immediate network. In our little bubble of the world, yes, it’s known. Let’s call it, in South Florida the influential attorneys, the accountants, the divorce attorneys know who we are because, having been down here long enough, we’ve had opportunities to work together. Our network of friends, certainly, the word spreads. But in the grand scheme of things, we are so small in the South Florida landscape or the LA landscape or the New York landscape so any incremental gain that we pick up is meaningful. And then, as it relates to young talent, our success is completely, long-term, derived by the young talent that we bring in to nurture them to help them grow. I look at our success, two of our critical mentors and board members of our firm are in their 80s, their children and grandchildren, nepotism aside, whether it was interning while in college or coming to work for us after school, they’re our best employees. And our goal as a firm, just like how I was offered the opportunity to become a partner and own a piece of the business, our goal long term will be to transition the business to this younger generation that we’re developing. I look at, again, those two board members who are in their 80s, the advice they’ve given me is don’t ever stop working, you have to be doing something. And I turn to them and say, “I don’t work every day.” I put in 20 hour days, well, not quite 20, 18 hour days but it’s never work because, what I do every day, I don’t deem it work, I love what I do, I don’t ever see myself stopping. Because they’ll tell me all of their friends that have stopped working or sold their business, invariably, the men die within six months because boredom and we always joke around that you’ll continue to work forever. So, I would hope that one day I transition into that advisory board member role where I step aside day-to-day activity where I’m now a mentor to our younger generation that we’re promoting into partners because we’ve made promises to our clients that we will forever be their family office. So, we have to, as part of our growth model, have those transitions in place because we’re servicing many families that have 85-year-old clients and two-year-old clients and we’re tasked with the two-year-olds as well as the 85-year-old. Jason Diamond: I also feel like there’s a little bit of younger generations I think have been reluctant to some degree to get it, you can disagree with this, to get into this space because there’s a more appeal to things like investment banking and sales and trading to some degree. The other problem obviously you alluded to is asset gathering. Your model speaks so clearly to success because you don’t say I own the client, that’s my relationship. To me, you plant the seeds of being able to handle succession much better than somebody who does the mine is mine and yours is yours approach. Is that fair? Constantine Hatzivassiliou: That’s completely accurate. And I think there’s two types of people that serve in the financial advisory space. You have the individual who is analytics driven, who likes being behind the bank of monitors trading account and there’s a critical part of our firm and our success is driven by the team in the office that aren’t necessarily client facing that do all the heavy lifting every day because they’re really doing the heavy work. Myself, my partners, the select few, while talented and able to do that, realize the value that we present is quarterbacking the relationship and helping understand all the components. We kid around that we’ve all stayed at a Holiday Inn Express last night, we’ve become experts in tax, we’ve become experts at trust and estate planning, we’ve become experts at divorce, we’ve become experts at the medical field. It’s shocking how it’s 2:00 in the morning and you get a phone call, panic attack by a client saying they need a doctor for X, Y and Z, can you connect me. So, the younger generation, yes, the sexy space is investment banking and that is really hard work. I could not do what my friends at Goldman do who are at these private mid-market funds, that’s just not me. I’ve been fortunate that I stumbled into an avenue in financial services that I think perfectly fits my personality and my want and desire to help others because that’s what we’re driven by and we try and hire people with that same mindset. The hardest thing as an RIA especially in South Florida is finding and retaining talent that is like-minded and that could function well within our family. Jason Diamond: If you build a firm predicated on culture and client service, I understand, certainly, the importance of that. I want to shift gears, I don’t want to lose this thought. You mentioned organic growth, it’s incredible. You have not mentioned inorganic growth at all and maybe because you haven’t had to but give me your thoughts on M&A, private equity in this space, do you have plans to sell the business, take on a capital partner, buy other RIAs? Constantine Hatzivassiliou: Yeah. So, I understand why private equity in the last 10 years has come into the market. For years, they bought up insurance practices, that recurring revenue, sticky assets, it makes sense. Personally, I’m not a fan of them being in our markets, I think they’re motivated at the end of the day by AUM growth, revenue growth and the second transaction which, for most of our clients, would not make sense because, again, that then questions why it is that we’re motivated to do something. Am I taking extra risk in the portfolio because I want to grow the AUM because I’m looking to sell in a year? Am I bringing in a strategy that has a higher fee? For us, it doesn’t work. In the brokerage model, it makes perfect sense. Now, there are some RIAs who leave the wirehouses, open up an RIA shop, do really well for their clients but don’t have the long-term aspirations of making the institution a legacy to where they’re passing it off. I hope my kids one day want to come work for dad and follow in his steps, that’d be amazing. Just like our younger generation working at the firm, our goal is we’ve already targeted the three or four guys that will be partner one day and we’ll transition the business over to them. But it’s okay if there’s an RIA out there who doesn’t have that transition product or isn’t motivated by that and is looking at it as a vehicle that I’ve built a really good successful book of business and I want to now retire and spend time with my family and kids and travel, et cetera, and that’s where PE steps in and offers an attractive number and the person makes their move. So, I can’t fault the individual for wanting that and I’m not saying that they’re not doing well by their clients, it’s just, for us, I’m not a fan of it because, again, I’m first critically and always focused on what’s best for the client. Jason Diamond: Fair. And I largely agree with some of what you said around private equity in this space but private equity enables … Obviously, it’s capital so which enables acquisitions which is why a lot of firms take on private equity. So, what about the idea of potentially buying businesses to start up inorganic growth? Constantine Hatzivassiliou: We have gone down the road of acquiring other institutions potentially. The challenge is, because we manage money so uniquely and our approach is so different, I’m not going to bring on an institution or bring in a new partner to the firm or a new book of business that we’ve acquired if the methodology and the life of that book doesn’t mirror ours. So, yes, there is opportunities to grow through acquisition, it’s not something that we are leaning on heavily. However, for the right institution that’s available that is aligned with our thinking, whose clients would value and appreciate how we do things or, if that institution is doing something truly unique that we would want to bolt onto our platform, all day long because, again, for the benefit of the client, it makes sense. So, yes, there are opportunities for that. Too often we find that, when a book is available for acquisition, the highest bidder tends to win out and we don’t have the deep enough pockets to write a multiple that we don’t deem to be, let’s call it, market neutral. Jason Diamond: Yeah, market prudent. I understand the premise and I think that’s fair. I also think you have the luxury, because of your organic growth, you can be super, super picky about inorganic and I love how you bring it all back to the lens of the client. Can this improve the client experience in some way? And, if so, yes, we’ll take a look. I got time for one more question, I can’t believe time has flown. You’ve had a remarkable journey, professional golf now partner at a $4 billion plus on the way to $5 billion RIA multifamily office. What are you most proud of when you reflect on your career journey? Constantine Hatzivassiliou: What am I most proud of? To see what Rich, myself and Mark and Jayson built over these years from where we were sitting in a small conference room, struggling to figure out how do we find a way to hire a trust and estate attorney to help with that component, which CPAs do we bring on board in-house because clients have a need. So, the entrepreneurial spirit involved in growing the business, the late nights, the struggles, the banter back and forth, to put so much blood, sweat and tears into this and now to look at all that we’ve accomplished, being in four separate states with offices, having so many wonderful employees that have come to us from all over the world, Germany, from China, from Tokyo, bringing people in to the US and building out something that, when we leave at the end of the day, are incredibly proud of. My father’s no longer with us, for 50 years, I always strived to make him proud because he never told me that he was proud of me, he was the classic Greek old-fashioned dad. I think he looks down on his now for everything that we’ve built and would say that he’s proud of us so, for me, that’s the best. Jason Diamond: Yeah. That’s an incredible place to end. Thank you for sharing that, it’s a touching place to end and I appreciate you being open. Thank you. This has been one of my favorite episodes, your journey, your humility, your honesty, your transparency, it’s no wonder you’ve built a business you’ve built. So, thanks for joining us, Constantine. I look forward to having you back on to talk about the next chapter. Constantine Hatzivassiliou: Thank you. Next time we’ll do it from the golf course. Jason Diamond: Oh, absolutely. Mindy Diamond: As a financial advisor, you hold yourself to the highest standards of integrity, honesty and credibility. You are successful because you take your professional responsibility seriously and are dedicated to your clients. But are you living your best business life? Are your goals aligned with your firms or could a better option exist? Should I Stay or Should I Go? Is a book written with you in mind? It’s a self-guided journey that walks you through the key steps that we take with our advisor clients. This strategic thought process and roadmap to professional self-discovery is designed to help you ask the right questions and think critically and objectively whether you’re considering change or not. Learn how to get your copy at diamond-consultants.com/thebook.   Lessons from the Links: From Golf Pro to $5B Family Office Partner A conversation with Jason Diamond and Constantine Hatzivassiliou, Partner at Certuity. Jason Diamond: Welcome to the latest episode of our podcast series for financial advisors. Today’s episode is Lessons from the Links: From Golf Pro to $5B Family Office Partner. It’s a conversation with Constantine Hatzivassiliou, partner at Certuity. I’m Jason Diamond and this is the Diamond Podcast for Financial Advisors. Mindy Diamond: At Diamond Consultants, we help elite advisors identify the right environment for their businesses to thrive whether that’s at a wirehouse, boutique or independent firm. With nearly three decades of experience, we’ve guided thousands of advisors and represented more than a quarter of a trillion dollars in assets transitioned and, each year, one in four advisors managing $1 billion or more who change firms are our clients. Our process is education-driven and based on building relationships starting as your strategic partner well before you’re even thinking of a move. To schedule a confidential conversation, call us at (908) 879-1002. Wondering why advisors change firms and where they’re headed? Are transition deals going up or down? Those very questions and more inspired us to create our annual advisor transition report, it’s the award-winning data-driven resource designed for advisors that connects the dots between the motivations around movement and the firm’s appetite for top talent. Arm yourself with the knowledge you need to make smart decisions, download your copy at diamond-consultants.com/transitionreport. Jason Diamond: Golf is a way of exposing who you really are, there are no teammates to blame, no clock to run out and no hiding from a bad decision. Every shot demands discipline, patience and the ability to stay focused when the pressure is highest, my guest today knows that firsthand. Before becoming a partner at Certuity, a multifamily office approaching five billion in assets, Constantine Hatzivassiliou was pursuing a career as a professional golfer. An injury ultimately redirected his path towards wealth management but many of the lessons he learned on the course still shaped the way he serves clients today. Certuity has grown from roughly 210 million in assets to nearly five billion, that’s impressive on its own but the more interesting story is how they’ve done it. The firm has grown largely through referrals built around a multifamily office model and focused on becoming far more than an investment advisor to the families it serves. In Constantine’s view, the best advisors aren’t simply managing portfolios, they’re the first person clients call when a business is being sold, a family issue becomes complicated or a major decision carries consequences well beyond the balance sheet. Constantine and I discuss the lessons golf teaches about handling pressure then we dive into the evolution from the traditional wealth management world to the multifamily office model, why referrals drive nearly all of Certuity’s growth, how he thinks about private equity’s influence on the advisory business and what it takes to become the first call for the wealthy families they serve and perhaps, most importantly, why the same qualities that help someone succeed on a golf course may be surprisingly relevant to building trust over a lifetime. It’s a great conversation so let’s dive in. Constantine, thank you so much for joining, thrilled to have you here. Constantine Hatzivassiliou: Thank you for having me, excited to be here. Jason Diamond: Yeah, absolutely. So, you had an unconventional path to wealth management, you started as a professional golfer, I think that’s a first for us on this show, before ultimately transitioning into this world. Can you tell us a little bit about the journey and what brought you here? Constantine Hatzivassiliou: Yeah, I never thought I’d be here, my parents were certainly shocked that I got here path wise. Growing up, immigrants from Greece, you settle into Florida the traditional way where you either go down the diner route or the gas station route in mechanics which my father was the latter and school and education was never priority, it was always about supporting the family needs. So, next thing you know, sports are a critical part of any good household, that’s how I was raised and I played everything but golf. I grew up on a golf course because my parents believed that a location of a property was critical to long-term financial success. We lived on a golf course, it was in our backyard, we’d stare at it and we’d use it to play football or baseball or anything but actual golf. And my freshman year at the University of Florida, I started dating a girl on the golf team and she got me hooked to the point where, after four years of hitting balls with the women’s and men’s golf team at the University of Florida for six hours a day, we finished school and realized I’m actually pretty good at the game and, while I have a finance and economics background and degree, let’s try and pursue this for a living and I was blessed. I had a sponsor who helped me succeed at golf on a small scale, it was a humbling experience to say the least. I was competing and playing with Sean O’Hair, Ken Duke, guys who made it out on tour for a very long time, we had the same sponsor so we functioned as a team, it was a collegiate team effectively trying to make it out on tour. And, unfortunately, my second year of competing, I blew out my back doing heavy deadlifts which set me aside for 18 months. While I was recovering, my primary sponsor was in financial services and says, “Hey, you have a background in this, it’s killing you not being able to be on the golf course, why don’t you come work for me while you’re rehabbing so that, when you get back to playing golf, it’s easier for you to talk about our business as a sponsor to try and develop business to throw it to the financial services side?” And Jason, the reality is, after 18 months working there, I fell in love with it. I made way more money working in that environment than I ever would’ve made playing golf because, again, I came to the game late. I was decent but I was nowhere near the caliber of players that are succeeding now out on tour. So, I pivoted after having met my wife and decided to settle down into the wealth management space and, what is it now, 26 years later, going strong. So, it’s been a fun transition from golf into wealth management to say the least. Jason Diamond: Probably my favorite background … I watch a lot of golf, I should caveat that, probably my favorite origin story we’ve had, I’ll give you the Wanamaker trophy or whatever you get, first place. Let’s talk about the business now, so Certuity. For our audience who may not be familiar, tell us a little bit about the firm, what types of clients do you serve and any context you can provide on size as well. We’ll talk about how your firm got there but just give us where we are today to start with. Constantine Hatzivassiliou: So, goal by the end of the year is to have $5 billion in AUM, we’re just shy of that now. We currently service 428 families across the country. So, we’re boutiquey and nimble, we’re based in South Florida, we have offices in New York, San Fran and LA. I’m fortunate to be one of four partners at the firm supporting the growth and the direction of the company and it’s a fun endeavor in the sense that, when we first started, I was employee number four 16 years ago and, with 210 million in AUM at the time to grow it to where we are today, to learn all the things that we have over the years, the curve balls that were thrown at us because all of us came from massive institutional wealth management firms. So, we transitioned from the Bernsteins of the world, the BNY Mellons of the world into an RIA in the South Florida market, there was absolutely an entrepreneurial learning curve involved. Jason Diamond: I bet. And on follow-up question, 16 years ago, did you have a book of business, client business and do you still maintain a book of business today? Constantine Hatzivassiliou: I do. The four of us at the firm share in all of the clients, we work together. Being in the Southeast, I’m responsible for, let’s call it, the Southeast demographics of the US which is a large portion of Certuity’s book. I have a partner in Tennessee, I have a partner in LA and San Francisco and we divide and conquer across the country. But, yes, we came over with a small book, we’ve all grown it organically since then. So, we’ve been very effective in how we’ve grown. Jason Diamond: Just from adding new client money? Constantine Hatzivassiliou: Strictly through new clients referred to us by existing clients. Jason Diamond: Wow. I

I give my instant reaction to Serena's draw, my experience at the Wimbledon draw ceremony and how I landed at a Holiday Inn Express at the Valencia airport. What a day! Enjoy Serena's comeback - it's happening! For more from us, follow along on Instagram, TikTok and Twitter. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Contributing writer Fritz Godard heads to Starkville to undertake a three-day apprenticeship in Space Hulk: Death Angel, the classic and brutal Warhammer 40,000 co-op card game. We played it — and classic Golden Era hip hop CDs on his boombox — for three days straight.I flipped the mic on and off with little regard to best recording practices as we stuffed our faces, guzzled beer, invented impossible sponsorship plans, and watched as Fritz went from a guy who couldn't tell which direction his Blood Angels were facing to a guy who can do gunslinger tricks with a Storm Bolter.Day One (1:14)Fritz rolls up in the driveway. I heat up a Lou Malnati's pizza, we crack some beers and review Fritz's journey of discovery in board gaming — and where I think that journey leads next.Interlude: “I Got it Bad Y'all” by King Tee feat. Tha Alkaholiks (10:36)Day Two (12:44)Lured out of bed via text the following morning with the promise of good company and complimentary powdered eggs, I head over to the Holiday Inn Express to meet Fritz for Day Two's action.Interlude: “Free Mumia” by KRS-One feat. Channel Live (19:13)Day Three (20:53)Fritz has already checked out of his room, but he's waiting in the lobby for me to come back with the game because he wants one more go at it before his long drive. Is he ready to seize victory?Interlude: “Nutin' ta Lose” by Dred Scott (25:57)Coda (27:44)Fritz made it back to Denver under adverse circumstances. We review the cost of victory and our intentions to become permanent residents of the Holiday Inn Express.Music• Main Theme and Bumpers: “Wash Y'ass,” D.O. the Fabulous Drifter and Dow Jones, Five Points Plan• Game of the Week Background: “Suit & Tie,” Sky Gienger via UppbeatLicense code: 0UY4C9TRFTVO4W0ETracks of the Week• “Got it Bad Y'all,” King Tee feat. Tha Alkaholiks, ©️1993 Capitol Records LLC• “Free Mumia,” KRS-One feat. Channel Live, ©️2004 X-Ray Records• “Nutin' Ta Lose” Dred Scott, ©️Vinyl Digital GmbH#SpaceHulkDeathAngel #Warhammer40K #BoardGames #TabletopGaming #CooperativeGames #OldSchoolHipHop #PodcastLife #BreakupGamingSocietyJoin Breakup Gaming Society episode sponsor Doghouse Reilly in being clever bastards and wearing clever things.

Drop us a note about the podcast. You can quote John 14 all day, but the words get real when life turns confusing and painful. We start with Jesus' promise that we can ask for anything in his name, then slow down and ask what most people skip: are we praying for our will or God's will? I talk through why “not my will, but thy will be done” is not a throwaway line, but the only way prayer stays rooted in trust instead of entitlement.From there, we move into Titus 2 and the gritty, everyday side of sound doctrine: self-control, respect, reverence, integrity, and speech that holds up under pressure. I wrestle with a conviction my pastor says often, that one of the biggest problems for the church is the church, because hypocrisy doesn't just hurt our own souls, it teaches our kids the wrong lesson and gives outsiders a reason to scoff. Then we go to John 13 where Jesus makes it plain: love for one another is supposed to prove we're his disciples, starting in our own homes.We also read from Psalm 119 and Proverbs 15 on teachability, correction, and growing in understanding, then shift into the moral argument I make about illegal and mass immigration after discussing real crimes and victims. To end on courage and duty, I share the Medal of Honor story of Navy SEAL Edward C. Byers Jr., and close with a brief heritage reflection on Woodrow Wilson taking the oath on Psalm 46 and what that says about America's foundations as a Christian republic. If you're looking for a Christian podcast that ties Scripture, discipleship, and national life together, listen, subscribe, share it with someone who needs it, and leave a review so more people can find the show.#AmericanPatriot#WoodrowWilson#ChristianNationSupport the showThe American Soul Podcasthttps://www.buzzsprout.com/1791934/subscribeCountryside Book Serieshttps://www.amazon.com/Countryside-Book-J-T-Cope-IV-ebook/dp/B00MPIXOB2 

Our friend Kevin Morby returns to How Long Gone. His critically acclaimed new record, Little Wide Open, is out now. We spoke with Kevin from his hotel room in Phoenix about life on the road in the desert, crushing his sleep score at the Holiday Inn Express, the game of “Odds,” getting sweaty on TikTok, just playing Kimmel and getting autotune put on his voice without being told, proposing a modern-day Traveling Wilburys with Morby as Dylan, which older bands make new fans and which don't, his Pitchfork score starts with an eight, we update the famous people in Kansas City list, and a temp check on whether he's reading the reviews. instagram.com/kevinmorby twitter.com/donetodeath twitter.com/themjeans howlonggone.com Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

In this installment of TPS Reports the Squares discuss eating crickets, Summer House gossip, butter mushroom whiskey, worshipping the Holiday Inn Express, Mexican wrestling, huge unibrows, doing more livestreams & vegan marshmallows. Outro song: "Side 2 Side" by Grieves feat. Above Average Smoochie Gang Playlist Term's Album of the Week Playlist Please send questions, stories & whatever else to tpsreportspodcast@gmail.com and feel free to leave us a voicemail at 708-797-3079. The Palmer Squares on Facebook, Twitter, YouTube, Patreon & more Shop for Official TPS Merchandise

Investigators followed Rex Heuermann for months through Manhattan before a discarded pizza crust gave them everything. That abandoned sample — recovered legally from public garbage — produced a DNA match to a male hair found wrapped in burlap around Megan Waterman's remains on Ocean Parkway. One connection. That match generated the warrants for Heuermann's home, his devices, and the digital trove prosecutors say reveals the most meticulously documented serial killing case investigators have encountered.Megan was 22, a mother from Scarborough, Maine, who called her three-year-old daughter every day without exception. When those calls stopped in June 2010, her family filed a missing persons report within two days. Surveillance footage from a Holiday Inn Express in Hauppauge shows her walking out the door at 1:15 a.m. She was found six months later alongside the rest of the Gilgo Four.Heuermann stood in a Suffolk County courtroom and pleaded guilty to seven murders — Melissa Barthelemy, Maureen Brainard-Barnes, Amber Lynn Costello, Sandra Costilla, Valerie Mack, Jessica Taylor, and Megan Waterman — spanning seventeen years from 1993 to 2010. He admitted to intentionally causing the death of an eighth victim, Karen Vergata, whose case was folded into the plea agreement. Prosecutors allege every killing occurred when Heuermann's wife and children were out of state, and that his devices contained checklists, methodology notes, and instructions for destroying evidence.His defense attorney framed the plea as "relief." The FBI cooperation agreement — requiring Heuermann to sit for behavioral analysis interviews — is built directly into the deal. Retired FBI behavioral expert Robin Dreeke and defense attorney Eric Faddis break down what the documented methodology reveals, what the defense traded in the plea, and why the courtroom moment matters far less than what investigators found on those devices.Join Our SubStack For AD-FREE ADVANCE EPISODES & EXTRAS!: https://hiddenkillers.substack.com/Want to comment and watch this podcast as a video? Check out our YouTube Channel. https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC8-vxmbhTxxG10sO1izODJg?sub_confirmation=1Instagram https://www.instagram.com/hiddenkillerspod/Facebook https://www.facebook.com/hiddenkillerspod/Tik-Tok https://www.tiktok.com/@hiddenkillerspodX Twitter https://x.com/TrueCrimePodThis publication contains commentary and opinion based on publicly available information. All individuals are presumed innocent until proven guilty in a court of law. Nothing published here should be taken as a statement of fact, health or legal advice.#RexHeuermann #GilgoBeach #MeganWaterman #GuiltyPlea #DNAEvidence #GilgoFour #LISK #TrueCrime #HiddenKillers #BehavioralAnalysis

He ate pizza on a Manhattan sidewalk and threw the crust in a public trash can. Investigators were watching. That discarded crust — legally recovered as an abandonment sample — carried DNA that matched a male hair found in the burlap wrapping around Megan Waterman's body on Ocean Parkway. Months of surveillance, one piece of garbage, and the entire Gilgo Beach case broke open.Megan was 22. A mother from Scarborough, Maine, who called her three-year-old daughter every single day. When those daily calls stopped in June 2010, her family reported her missing within two days. Surveillance footage from the Holiday Inn Express in Hauppauge captured her walking out the door at 1:15 a.m. to meet a client. She was found six months later alongside Melissa Barthelemy, Maureen Brainard-Barnes, and Amber Lynn Costello — the Gilgo Four.Rex Heuermann stood in a Suffolk County courtroom and pleaded guilty to murdering all seven women he was charged with killing — Barthelemy, Brainard-Barnes, Costello, Sandra Costilla, Valerie Mack, Jessica Taylor, and Waterman. He also admitted to intentionally causing the death of Karen Vergata, an eighth victim. He confirmed all eight were killed by strangulation. Prosecutors allege his electronic devices held checklists, methodology notes, and instructions for destroying evidence — a digital blueprint stored in a home he shared with his family. Every killing allegedly took place when his wife and children were away.His attorney described the plea as "relief." The deal requires Heuermann to cooperate with the FBI's Behavioral Analysis Unit. This week's coverage walks through Megan's life before she became a case file, the DNA chain that made the prosecution's case, the mechanics of the plea deal, and expert analysis from Robin Dreeke and Eric Faddis on what the behavioral evidence tells us about who Heuermann actually is.Join Our SubStack For AD-FREE ADVANCE EPISODES & EXTRAS!: https://hiddenkillers.substack.com/Want to comment and watch this podcast as a video? Check out our YouTube Channel. https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC8-vxmbhTxxG10sO1izODJg?sub_confirmation=1Instagram https://www.instagram.com/hiddenkillerspod/Facebook https://www.facebook.com/hiddenkillerspod/Tik-Tok https://www.tiktok.com/@hiddenkillerspodX Twitter https://x.com/TrueCrimePodThis publication contains commentary and opinion based on publicly available information. All individuals are presumed innocent until proven guilty in a court of law. Nothing published here should be taken as a statement of fact, health or legal advice.#RexHeuermann #GilgoBeach #MeganWaterman #GuiltyPlea #GilgoFour #LISK #DNAEvidence #BehavioralAnalysis #HiddenKillers #SerialKiller

A pizza crust. That's what cracked the Gilgo Beach case. Investigators tailing Rex Heuermann watched him eat pizza near his Manhattan office and recovered the discarded crust — legally obtained because he'd tossed it in public. The DNA on that crust matched a male hair found in the burlap around Megan Waterman's remains. And that single match opened the door to warrants, searches, and everything the prosecution is built on.Episode 6 of "The Seven." Megan was 22, from Scarborough, Maine. A mother who called her three-year-old daughter every day without fail. When the calls stopped in June 2010, her family reported her missing within two days. Surveillance footage shows Megan leaving a Holiday Inn Express at 1:15 a.m. to meet a client. She was found six months later on Ocean Parkway, wrapped in burlap, alongside the rest of the Gilgo Four.Prosecutors allege every murder Heuermann is charged with occurred when his family was out of state — and that his internet search history included images of the victims' families. Megan's life, the pizza-crust breakthrough, and the evidence prosecutors built from that single DNA match — all covered here.Join Our SubStack For AD-FREE ADVANCE EPISODES & EXTRAS!: https://hiddenkillers.substack.com/Want to comment and watch this podcast as a video? Check out our YouTube Channel. https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC8-vxmbhTxxG10sO1izODJg?sub_confirmation=1Instagram https://www.instagram.com/hiddenkillerspod/Facebook https://www.facebook.com/hiddenkillerspod/Tik-Tok https://www.tiktok.com/@hiddenkillerspodX Twitter https://x.com/TrueCrimePodThis publication contains commentary and opinion based on publicly available information. All individuals are presumed innocent until proven guilty in a court of law. Nothing published here should be taken as a statement of fact, health or legal advice.#MeganWaterman #RexHeuermann #GilgoBeach #GilgoFour #LISK #TrueCrime #PizzaCrustDNA #TrueCrimeToday #ColdCase #TheSeven

Megan Waterman was 22 years old, from Maine, a mother to a three-year-old daughter she called every single day without exception. When those calls stopped in June 2010, her family didn't wait. They reported her missing within two days. The last image of Megan alive is surveillance footage from a Holiday Inn Express on Long Island — walking out the door at 1:15 in the morning to meet a client.Episode 6 of "The Seven." This is the episode built around the pizza-crust DNA — the investigative breakthrough that cracked the entire case. Investigators followed Heuermann, recovered a discarded pizza crust, matched the DNA to a male hair found in the burlap wrapped around Megan's remains. That single match gave them warrants for his house, his devices, and the evidence that built the prosecution's case across all the charges.Prosecutors allege every murder occurred when Heuermann's wife and children were out of state. His search history allegedly included images of the victims and their families. Megan's daughter is a teenager now, growing up in Maine surrounded by family that has spent more than a decade fighting for answers. Megan's story, the DNA evidence, and the full prosecution case — all covered here.Join Our SubStack For AD-FREE ADVANCE EPISODES & EXTRAS!: https://hiddenkillers.substack.com/Want to comment and watch this podcast as a video? Check out our YouTube Channel. https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC8-vxmbhTxxG10sO1izODJg?sub_confirmation=1Instagram https://www.instagram.com/hiddenkillerspod/Facebook https://www.facebook.com/hiddenkillerspod/Tik-Tok https://www.tiktok.com/@hiddenkillerspodX Twitter https://x.com/TrueCrimePodThis publication contains commentary and opinion based on publicly available information. All individuals are presumed innocent until proven guilty in a court of law. Nothing published here should be taken as a statement of fact, health or legal advice.#MeganWaterman #RexHeuermann #GilgoBeach #GilgoFour #LISK #HiddenKillers #TheSeven #TrueCrime #PizzaCrustDNA #GilgoBeachKiller

The pizza crust changed everything. Investigators had Heuermann under surveillance for months before they collected the abandoned DNA sample that cracked the case. He discarded a pizza crust near his Manhattan office. The DNA on it matched a male hair found in the burlap wrapping around Megan Waterman's remains. That match gave prosecutors warrants for his house in Massapequa Park, where they seized more than 350 electronic devices, the planning document, and evidence connecting Heuermann to multiple victims.Episode 6 of "The Seven." Megan was 22, from Maine, a devoted mother who called her three-year-old daughter every single day. When the calls stopped on June 6, 2010, her family knew immediately. The Holiday Inn Express surveillance footage — the last known image of Megan alive — shows her walking out at 1:15 a.m. She was found six months later in burlap on Ocean Parkway.Prosecutors allege Heuermann's family was out of state during every murder he's charged with. His search history allegedly included images of the victims and their families — their sisters, their children. The DNA breakthrough, Megan's story, and every piece of evidence that flowed from a discarded pizza crust — all covered here.Join Our SubStack For AD-FREE ADVANCE EPISODES & EXTRAS!: https://hiddenkillers.substack.com/Want to comment and watch this podcast as a video? Check out our YouTube Channel. https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC8-vxmbhTxxG10sO1izODJg?sub_confirmation=1Instagram https://www.instagram.com/hiddenkillerspod/Facebook https://www.facebook.com/hiddenkillerspod/Tik-Tok https://www.tiktok.com/@hiddenkillerspodX Twitter https://x.com/TrueCrimePodThis publication contains commentary and opinion based on publicly available information. All individuals are presumed innocent until proven guilty in a court of law. Nothing published here should be taken as a statement of fact, health or legal advice.#MeganWaterman #RexHeuermann #GilgoBeach #GilgoFour #LISK #PizzaCrustDNA #DNAEvidence #TheSeven #TrueCrime #GilgoBeachKiller

Come with us to swim with the most adorable manatees in Crystal River, Florida with Explorida. In this episode we share what we learned in the experience including the best time to visit, what to expect, and expert tips from our unforgettable eco tour experience.If you're staying overnight in Crystal River, here are a few places to consider: Paddletail Waterfront Lodge, Holiday Inn Express, or Hampton Inn. You can also check out a full list of hotels in Crystal River for more options.Get a good flight deal to Tampa, FL from Thrifty Traveler Premium (use code TSP to get $20 off!)—---------------------------------------Shop: Trip Itineraries ⁠& ⁠Amazon Storefront ⁠Connect: ⁠YouTube⁠, ⁠TikTok⁠, and ⁠Instagram⁠⁠ ⁠and contact us at travelsquadpodcast@gmail.com to submit a question of the week or inquire about guest interviews and advertising. Submit a question of the week or inquire about guest interviews and advertising.Contains affiliate links, thanks for supporting Travel Squad Podcast!

Things are continuing to flourish in Queenstown. The mid-scale ‘Holiday Inn Express & Suites', which boasts 277 rooms in the City Centre, is being refurbished to become ‘voco Queenstown' – part of IHG's premium portfolio. The move targets high-end tourism, with the hotel running at around 90% occupancy for nine months of the year. Hotel Council Aotearoa Strategic Director James Doolan told Mike Hosking that it's normal to think about renovating and repositioning every seven to ten years, but upgrading to the next level is an encouraging sign. He says central government's increased investment in event attraction and destination marketing has allowed private businesses to invest in their assets. LISTEN ABOVE See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Special Patreon Release: Better Together with Jon and Jolene Rocke   "What therefore God hath joined together, let not man put asunder." Mark 10:9 (KJV)   *Transcription Below*   Questions and Topics We Discuss: What are you so thankful you did in every season of marriage, from newlyweds to empty nesters that you see the pay off now in the present? How has grace and forgiveness benefited your relationship? What advice do you have for all of us married couples as we seek to grow as one, rather than grow parallel or even grow apart from one another?   Jon and Jolene Rocke are my local friends and my guests for today. They work side by side at Peoria Rescue ministries, and they have so many lovely gifts of leadership and hospitality and teaching, but the topic we are going to focus on today is marriage. From the first time we met, Mark and I adored them and appreciated their sweet bond with one another, and I'm so thrilled to introduce you to them today. Here's our chat:   Jon and Jolene both grew up in Christian homes and accepted Jesus as their Savior and Lord at the age of 15.  Jon is from Morton and Jolene from Elgin, IL. They met on a bus ride to a Youth Gathering in Minnesota.  They sat together and talked the whole way home about life, the Bible and God.  Jon played his guitar and sang John Denver songs and their match was made with “Sunshine on my Shoulders”.   They married at the age of 18 and had their first child, Janelle, at 19.  They left for Grace college in Winona Lake, Indiana with an 18 month old toddler in tow and had another baby girl born while in college named Jaime.  At graduation in 1984, they were accepted to Trinity Seminary to follow Jon's desire to be a Professor of Theology, but became pregnant with their son, Jordan, which changed every plan and sent them back home to build up their finances.   They came back to Morton and worked in the Family Business and felt called to stay.  They raised their 3 children in Morton working in the business until God loosened their tent pegs and called them to Peoria Rescue Ministries in 2017. Jon is the Executive Director and Jolene is the Ministry Ambassador.  They are thankful to be working side-by-side in this new season of their marriage.   Jon and Jolene will celebrate their 44th wedding anniversary and have 3 married children and have 10 grandchildren. Their son Jordan and his wife Jessica live in Sandpoint, Idaho with their 3 Kids.  Their daughter Janelle and husband Ryan live in Kennesaw, Georgia with their 3 children.  And their daughter Jaime and her husband Jonathan live here in Morton with their 4 children.   Related Episodes from The Savvy Sauce: 5 Love Languages with Dr. Gary Chapman Traveling with Your Family with Katie Mueller   At The Savvy Sauce, we will only recommend resources we believe in! We also want you to be aware: We are a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for us to earn fees by linking to Amazon.com and affiliated sites.   Five Love Languages The 5 Love Languages of Teenagers A Teen's Guide to the 5 Love Languages   Thank You to Our Sponsors: Chick-fil-A East Peoria and The Savvy Sauce Charities (and donate online here)   Connect with The Savvy Sauce on Facebook, Instagram or Our Website.   Please help us out by sharing this episode with a friend, leaving a 5-star rating and review, and subscribing to this podcast!   Gospel Scripture: (all NIV) Romans 3:23 “for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God,”   Romans 3:24 “and are justified freely by his grace through the redemption that came by Christ Jesus.”   Romans 3:25 (a) “God presented him as a sacrifice of atonement, through faith in his blood.”   Hebrews 9:22 (b) “without the shedding of blood there is no forgiveness.”   Romans 5:8 “But God demonstrates his own love for us in this: While we were still sinners, Christ died for us.”   Romans 5:11 “Not only is this so, but we also rejoice in God through our Lord Jesus Christ, through whom we have now received reconciliation.”   John 3:16 “For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.”   Romans 10:9 “That if you confess with your mouth, “Jesus is Lord,” and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.”   Luke 15:10 says “In the same way, I tell you, there is rejoicing in the presence of the angels of God over one sinner who repents.”   Romans 8:1 “Therefore, there is now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus”   Ephesians 1:13–14 “And you also were included in Christ when you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation. Having believed, you were marked in him with a seal, the promised Holy Spirit, who is a deposit guaranteeing our inheritance until the redemption of those who are God's possession- to the praise of his glory.”   Ephesians 1:15–23 “For this reason, ever since I heard about your faith in the Lord Jesus and your love for all the saints, I have not stopped giving thanks for you, remembering you in my prayers. I keep asking that the God of our Lord Jesus Christ, the glorious Father, may give you the spirit of wisdom and revelation, so that you may know him better. I pray also that the eyes of your heart may be enlightened in order that you may know the hope to which he has called you, the riches of his glorious inheritance in the saints, and his incomparably great power for us who believe. That power is like the working of his mighty strength, which he exerted in Christ when he raised him from the dead and seated him at his right hand in the heavenly realms, far above all rule and authority, power and dominion, and every title that can be given, not only in the present age but also in the one to come. And God placed all things under his feet and appointed him to be head over everything for the church, which is his body, the fullness of him who fills everything in every way.”   Ephesians 2:8–10 “For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith – and this not from yourselves, it is the gift of God – not by works, so that no one can boast. For we are God‘s workmanship, created in Christ Jesus to do good works, which God prepared in advance for us to do.“   Ephesians 2:13 “But now in Christ Jesus you who once were far away have been brought near through the blood of Christ.“   Philippians 1:6 “being confident of this, that he who began a good work in you will carry it on to completion until the day of Christ Jesus.”   *Transcription*   Music: (0:00 – 0:09)   Laura Dugger: (0:10 - 2:05) Welcome to The Savvy Sauce, where we have practical chats for intentional living. I'm your host, Laura Dugger, and I'm so glad you're here. I want to say a huge thank you to today's sponsors for this episode, Chick-fil-A East Peoria and Savvy Sauce Charities.   Are you interested in a free college education for you or someone you know? Stay tuned for details coming later in this episode from today's sponsor, Chick-fil-A East Peoria. You can also visit their website today at https://www.chick-fil-a.com/locations/il/east-peoria.   If you've been with us long, you know this podcast is only one piece of our nonprofit, which is the Savvy Sauce Charities. Don't miss out on our other resources. We have questions and content to inspire you to have your own practical chats for intentional living.   And I also hope you don't miss out on the opportunity to financially support us through your tax-deductible donations. All this information can be found on our recently updated website, thesavvysauce.com.   Jon and Jolene Rocke are my local friends and my guests for today. They work side by side at Peoria Rescue Ministries, and they have so many lovely gifts of leadership and hospitality and teaching. But the topic we're going to focus on today is marriage. From the first time we met, Mark and I adored them so much and really appreciated their sweet bond with one another. And I'm so thrilled to get to introduce you to them today.   Here's our chat. Welcome to The Savvy Sauce, Jon and Jolene.   Jon Rocke: (2:05 - 2:06) We're so happy to be here, Laura. Thanks so much for having us.   Laura Dugger: (2:07 - 2:43) Well, it's truly my pleasure. And will the two of you just start by giving us a little background on how you came to know Christ as your personal Lord and Savior?   Jolene Rocke: (2:07 - 2:43) Yeah, I grew up in the Chicago area in a suburb and in a Christian home. So, I was very thankful to know about God. And I came to know Him as my personal Savior at 15. And so, then I really had a complete change. And from then on, I have just followed Him as close as I can. So very thankful for Jesus.   Jon Rocke: (2:44 - 2:59) Yeah, and I was actually 15 as well. Became overwhelmed with my sin at 15 and knew that I did not know Christ. And so, since then, a very imperfect following, but glad to be part of the family.   Laura Dugger: (3:00 - 3:15) Well, and that's awesome that both of you were 15 and never knew that piece of your story. But I'm assuming you were living in different places. So then how did the two of you meet and fall in love?   Jolene Rocke: (3:15 - 4:40) That is such a funny story. Because I, along with a friend of mine from Elgin, jumped on a Morton bus going to Morris, Minnesota. And they picked us up in Rockford. And we got on the bus, went to the same youth gathering for our church denomination. And on the way home from that weekend, we sat on the bus the whole way home and talked.   And Jon had what was so interesting to me, a study Bible. And I had never seen a study Bible in my life. And so, he showed me what an open Bible was with notes at the bottom. And because I came to Christ at 15 and started Bible study on my own with just a spiral notebook, a pen, and my Bible, I was fascinated by this Bible.   And I heard from Morton girls that he carried his Bible everywhere. So, he was kind of different than the rest of the guys. And I told them that's the kind of guy I was looking for. And then to top it all off, he had a guitar. And he sang John Denver songs to me. So, Sunshine on My Shoulders, I think, really made me happy.   Laura Dugger: (4:40 - 4:45) Just knowing your family music is such a big part of worship. Yeah. That's part of what wooed you, too.   Jon Rocke: (4:40 - 5:35) Yeah. Part of the crazy story is that it's a long trip. It's like a 12-hour trip. And so, we left Morton at like 5 in the morning. And so, I'm sleeping on the floor. And we picked these girls up. And I wake up, and I'm like, “Oh, an angel just got on the bus.” That's what I thought. And she was like, she didn't really have anything to do with me the whole weekend till the way home.   But we have a lot of fun with that story. And so that was the beginning. I think I sent flowers the next day. And we began, actually, a very long-distance, over-the-phone relationship, getting to know each other. And we actually went through, I think, the Book of Romans together over the course of, I guess, a year. And then got married. And we were pretty young.   Jolene Rocke: (5:36 - 6:47) Yeah. We met when Jon was just 16. And then two weeks after his 18th birthday, we got married. And I'm a year older. So, it was very young. But we are so thankful because we're going to celebrate 44 years of marriage here.   So, God knit us together, I think, through the fact that we were both really pursuing the Lord individually. And then we were so happy to find somebody like that. I thought I was headed to be a missionary in Africa at the time I met him. And he was, like, searching, too. But both all out pursuit of Christ. And so, I think that's what knit our hearts together. And it didn't hurt that he sent flowers the next day.   Laura Dugger: (6:47 - 7:15) It was a wise move. But I love it because the two of you have really grown up together. Totally. You've been meeting as teens. When you reflect back, what are you so thankful that you did in every season of marriage, from newlyweds to now empty nesters, that you're getting to see the payoff now in the present?   Jon Rocke: (6:49 - 8:10) Yeah, I think sometimes you are intentional. And we've tried to be intentional. But I think sometimes God brings circumstances into your life that sort of force something. So not only were we young when we got married, but nine months after we got married, yeah, we had Janelle, our oldest daughter.   And so, we had to realize we still needed time together. And we had a little baby. It began, I think, an intentional course for us to carve out time. So, you know, we put our kids to bed early. It was a big deal for us as parents that we had our time after they went to bed because we didn't get a whole lot of time.   And other little silly things, the kids didn't get to sit in between us at church. That was the rule. You can sit on either side of mom and dad, but you can't sit in between us. And so that was just, you know, again, a little thing that we did. And some things we had to learn. I'm more of a night person. Jolene's more of a morning person. Part of that, we had to learn at one point, you know, let's make sure we prioritize going to bed together. Just so, again, we had that time. So, there's been all sorts of different steps along the way that we've tried to prioritize each other.   Jolene Rocke: (8:10 - 9:01) So the two words that come to my mind with regard to that are compromise. You're two different people, and you're suddenly thrust together into a home situation. Well, that took compromise on both of our parts. So that's kind of sacrifice, too. That means he doesn't get to stay up until midnight if we want to go to bed together, and I'm going to have to push myself to stay up later just so that we can make a common bedtime.   So, compromise, and then I think the other major thing to me would be communication, because we didn't have a relationship before marriage where we were in the same town and could see each other all the time or go on dates. We didn't have that. So, we had letter writing. This is 43 years ago. So, we had letter writing daily.   Jon Rocke: (9:02 - 9:04) Some of us were daily. He was daily.   Jolene Rocke: (9:05 - 9:11) I wasn't quite as good at letter writing every day, but I was in college by now.   Jon Rocke: (9:11 - 9:13) You were still in high school. Now we know.   Jolene Rocke: (9:14 - 10:15) But I think the communication factor, that actually helped us because, yes, I realize face-to-face dating is a great thing, but to not be able to do that and have nothing but be able to write your day out, what happened during your day, you're learning to tell the other person what happened in your day, how you felt about that, what your dreams, your goals are. So, it started, to me and us, I think a great foundation of communication.   Laura Dugger: (10:15 - 10:30) And is it Song of Songs, I believe, 5:16, where part of it says, “This is my lover, this is my friend,” and that's what I'm hearing, is that you were really deepening your friendship in those early years and that from witnessing your lives, it seems that has only continued.   Jolene Rocke: (10:30 - 10:35) Yeah, exactly. We are so thankful. It's a very different story than most people, but we're so thankful.   Jon Rocke: (10:16 - 10:39) I think also, for us, it was Genesis 2 in the sense that you need to leave everything else and cleave together. We were young. It's hard to believe. When we look back, we think about our kids and our grandkids and would we want that for them, and yet I don't think we'd trade it for the world.   Laura Dugger: (10:40 - 10:52) I love that. And what encouragement do you have for others then who are also wanting to build a foundation of remaining connected and intimate in all the aspects of their own marriage?   Jon Rocke: (10:53 - 12:07) That's one of those things about being intentional. Matthew 19:6, where Christ repeats that adage from Genesis 2, that God created them male and female, they need to leave mother and father and cleave together, but then he adds this, “and no one should tear that apart.” And we often think about that, I think, as other people tearing that apart, and that's true.   But the same goes, we can tear ourselves apart if we're not going to make sure everything else, all other distractions, because they're going to continually come, right? And again, we had kids so early that I think we knew we had to carve that time out, because if we wouldn't have, I'm not sure how that would have worked. We would have been so consumed early. But career, we've just known that we've had to say, if we don't make sure that we're the priority, it's so easy to get lost in all the other things of life that are not bad. Kids are not bad, they're great. And your careers and your work, that's all good. But it can be the enemy of great in a marriage.   Jolene Rocke: (12:07 - 12:32) Yeah, we talked about the fact that this is how we started all those years ago. But a pursuit of God individually actually enhances a pursuit of God together. I'm still in the Word individually. Jon's still in the Word individually. But we also then read and pray together every night. So just this pursuit of God.   Jon Rocke: (12:32 - 13:06) But that wasn't something we did from day one either. I mean, that was a learned scenario where one time we were just kind of convicted of the fact that together we're not taking time to pray and read together. And so, then we just made that part of routine at night. So then again, that made us say we're going to go to bed together. Because if we didn't, then we didn't have that time. That opportunity to pray together and read together has just become a connection point that we wouldn't want to trade.   Laura Dugger: (13:07 - 13:55) I think that's encouraging in so many ways because you've grown into this. And I think for anyone just starting out, it's so helpful to see you didn't let excuses get in the way. It reminds me of a supervisor in college who said, “If you want something done, give it to a busy person.” And I think in a unique way with you two being launched into parenthood nine months after you were married, you didn't have the luxury of being frivolous with your time. And you chose intentionality. And it seems like God really has blessed that and honored it.   Jolene Rocke: (13:55 - 14:05) Yeah and continued it to this day. You're very right. We continue to be busy. And that's still the struggle to combat that with intentional time together. So definitely.   Jon Rocke: (13:55 - 14:31) You talk about seasons in our lives. So, I had to have a hip replacement. So, from like 23 till I had that at 50, I couldn't take long walks. But now we get to walk together, which is a huge privilege. And so, I always think about it. I'm not into exercise to exercise, but I'm into being together. And exercise is a thing we can do together. The other thing we did in our, I guess it was on our 25th. We got a tandem bike. And we love doing our tandem bike.   Jolene Rocke: (14:31 - 16:21) But he wanted a tandem bike right when we got married. And I kept saying, no, I didn't really want to sit on the back and have no control. And not be able to see when I thought I should break or when I wanted to turn.   So, this is something that I often encourage women that are moving into the emptiness season of life. I was driving to church alone. And the Lord really impressed on me that the extreme lavish amount of love that as a homemaker I gave to my children who were now gone, I needed to transfer that to my husband.   I've always loved Jon first and best. But I needed to take even the time commitment. What could I do to show Jon I loved him lavishly the way I tried to my children? So that was a time thing for me. And it was like get a tandem bike. So, I was willing then to get the tandem and sit in the back. And you really do; you're called the stoker. You really do work in the back. You don't just sit there. You work. But I no longer had the control of that. And I am learning to see butterflies land on corn stalks. And I actually love our tandem bike. But God had to grow me. And that was part of my several gifts to him in emptiness period that has helped us keep a strong marriage, I think.   Laura Dugger: (16:21 - 16:30) And isn't that interesting how there's a gift in it for you? Like you offer this sacrifice and yet he's teaching you new things.   Jon Rocke: (16:21 - 16:22) I love it, yeah.   Laura Dugger: (16:23 - 16:45) What would you two say is the biggest personality difference that you've recognized in your own marriage?   Jolene Rocke: (16:45 - 17:22) We just had a personality test yesterday. We have an executive team leadership at Peoria Rescue Ministries, and we had to do personality tests again. And that always is quite glaring to see how different we are. So, we're on two ends of the spectrum. But we can encourage any marriage that that can work and actually maybe be in your favor as long as you work hard at it. So, it just takes work and communication to say, you're very logical thinking, I'm very emotional, so how do we come together then in situations where I'm flustered and he's calm because he at times looks as if you don't care.   Jon Rocke: (17:22 - 17:53) Right, yeah, it can be that. You're highly relational. I'm definitely more process. And I think you're going to learn quickly, especially if you have kids, that all your kids are going to have different personalities. That's the weirdest thing, right? They all grew up in the same home and they're all just completely different. And so being able to help them understand kind of a little bit who they are and how that works has been a good thing that we're not the same.   Jolene Rocke: (17:53 - 20:01) God didn't make one good and one bad. He made all of us different, all in His image, to His glory. We all bring value to the family, and we both bring value to one another as helpmates because I'm able to sharpen Jon in areas that are blind spots for him. He's able to totally sharpen me and calm me in blind spots that are mine. So, I think in a marriage, it's just actually, it's been helpful. Differences are good.   Laura Dugger: (20:01 - 20:25) Oh, I love that. Differences are good. It sounds like God sanctified even your views of that. And so, getting really practical, when was a time when your differences were working against each other or caused conflict? And then how, through maturing and more time together, how do you celebrate and even lean into and appreciate those differences?   Jolene Rocke: (20:25 - 21:00) Well, one thing for sure is we had what we call our valley, where we learned that Psalm 23 wasn't just a funeral psalm, but it's a life psalm, and it's a way of life psalm. So, at that time, I had three family members pass away, and Jon had his family business go down. So, we watched our personalities within that in handling loss and grief. So, here's the optimist really down, and here's realist trying to be cheerleader and be up.   And so actually God did it, and we know without a doubt that God can work beyond personalities and bring you to a point where you can actually support one another well. But there again, it's got to be intentional. It's got to be me saying, we need to sit down now and have a meeting, talk about how you're feeling, whether you want to talk about feelings or not, because I need to know where you're at so that I can help you best.   Jon Rocke: (20:01 - 21:20) Yeah, and on a practical level during that time, I found myself not communicating some of what I thought was either scary or just the long drag of it. And so that was a potential way for us to disconnect because all of this is swirling from at least our livelihood standpoint, swirling in my head, and I'm not going to want to share that. And yet we realized we had to, but then those are not always easy things because Jolene, like most ladies, likes security as an important thing, right? Of just knowing what's going to happen.   In the end, it did make us really, again, Joe mentioned Psalm 23, and if he is our shepherd, what else could we want? We both had to end up clinging to that because our security was gone. Part of our sense of who we were, and particularly me in a family business for three generations, was gone. And so, we certainly had to make sure that our tendencies, like in communication, those kinds of things, we had to work through those during that time.   Laura Dugger: (21:21 - 21:30) Thank you for sharing that. I think that's very relatable to hear about the ups and the downs. And so, do you have any specific stories of a time when you were both in your strengths, and even though they were very different, they worked well together?   Jolene Rocke: (21:30 - 23:12) Yeah, I think that it's the learning what your strengths are that you may not know that God gives you at the time, and that's his grace. So, at the time, for all those years previous to the valley, Jon was the one that pushed me to communicate, and shutting down was not an option, which is what I wanted to do. So, I'd rather just not talk about it and go to bed. And he would push, push, push me to keep communicating, and that we would work through everything before the sun went down, as the Bible says.   Well, in the valley, it was Jon that was shutting down. And suddenly, you know, I had to be the one to push communication. So, this is something I heard on a sermon. A personality is not an excuse for sin. So that just means that I can't say, well, I'm not comfortable in conflict, so I'm not going to communicate and I'm going to shut down. No, you need to push yourself, ask the Lord for help, and go as his helpmate and say, you have to talk about it, you have to tell me, how are you doing? How are you feeling? So, I feel like it's just, it was such a beautiful valley when we look back now.   Laura Dugger: (23:12 - 23:25) Another previous guest had said she noticed when she was in the valley, that's when you're closest to the living water.   Jon Rocke: (23:13 - 24:41) Oh, absolutely. For sure. That's how creeks run, through valleys. Yeah. And I think our parenting, it was helpful for us to have both sides of our personality in parenting because I think we could address situations with our kids from different viewpoints and different ways to think about things, and those were helpful things as well.   But we also, during all sorts of the periods of time in our marriage, we had some little things that just reminded us. We had little words. So one was, you know, “we need to swim back.” So, you can often find yourself, because of a season of time or a season with your kids or whatever on the different islands, and we would just say, we got to swim back. And so that was one of our things that we did. And then we also had a, if we went too long, we just realized we weren't intentional about our intimacy of any kind. It was just basically, “Hey, you didn't kiss me today.” And we used to make that, “No, you didn't kiss me today.” And it was just a thing we tried to do to make sure that we had these little things that just kept us reminded. And so, they were really, they were kind of practical, just little code words for us that made a difference and got our minds back to where it needed to be.   Jolene Rocke: (24:41 - 24:50) Yeah, and in the busyness, that's easy to remember those little swing thoughts.   Laura Dugger: (24:50 - 30:17) Swim back. And now a brief message from our sponsor.   Did you know you can go to college tuition free just by being a team member at Chick-fil-A East Peoria? Yes, you heard that right. Free college education. All Chick-fil-A East Peoria team members in good standing are immediately eligible for a free college education through Point University. Point University is a fully accredited private Christian college located in West Point, Georgia. 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We ask that you also will share by sharing financially, sharing the Savvy Sauce podcast episodes, and sharing a five-star rating and review. You can also share any of our social media posts on Instagram or Facebook. We are grateful for all of it and we just love partnering together with you.   Now, back to the show. What encouragement do you have for healthy communication and healthy conflict resolution in marriage?   Jon Rocke: (30:19 - 31:31) God's grace. It's going to have to take time. You have to find that time together. So, I think it's all about prioritizing that time. I don't necessarily like conflict, but I know in our marriage you can't avoid it. And so, we just had to work through it right away. And so, I would say don't let time simmer conflict because that usually never makes it better.   Certainly, there's a sense of if there's something that's really emotional and maybe you need some space. My problem is I often don't give Jolene that space and that's hard on her, it really is, and sometimes not fair. But in the same vein, for me it felt like I didn't care if I just said, “Well, go ahead and be angry or be whatever or be upset about this or just let's not deal with it.” And she was gracious in pressing in and doing that. But I think don't let time go, just deal with it.   Jolene Rocke: (31:32 - 33:26) And two, the encouragement I think of is that Jon and I tell each other everything, every little thing. And we are very aware of couples that don't. And when Jon was holding back for me in that valley time, I really noticed it and I felt pretty alone. So, if you're always telling each other everything, there should be no secrets. So that just means there might be conflict then. If you're going to tell each other everything, then there might be conflict and you need to be prepared for that.   But that's better than me not saying anything. I sometimes say it's like a teapot, you're simmering or you're spouting. What's the perfect in the middle balance? It's really important to not simmer because you will spout eventually and then that's a harder conflict than if you just kept talking, kept telling every little thing. And so, we do tell each other every little thing.   Laura Dugger: (33:26 - 33:40) Well, and to go with that metaphor, if you have a release valve where that hot air can escape, it sounds like your communication has been that where you can get the water temperature back to a healthy place in the relationship.   Jolene Rocke: (33:40 - 33:55) Yeah, yes. And that takes work. So, I mean, honestly, what encouragement? Don't give up. Just keep going because it's worth it.   Laura Dugger: (33:55 - 34:10) Well, and I'm thinking back. Okay, so you had three kids. They're somewhat close together and you were young. So those years when all of your children were in the home, even elementary school age, that timeframe, what did that look like for communication? How did you still make sure you connected every day?   Jon Rocke: (33:26 - 34:31) Well, then throw in, we went to college after we had kids, which was actually, again, just God's grace and gift to us that we were able to leave town, leave the family business for a while, didn't think we were going to be involved in family business, went out to Indiana, went to school, and we didn't have anybody else but ourselves. And so that, again, was just his gift to us as young. We went in 1980, so that was two years after we were married. So, we already had Janelle at that point, and then Jamie came along soon after. And so, I had school but had to work to support. Jolene had to work and she was mom to two little ones. And so, again, I think it was just those times of making sure that we said nothing else can get in the way of us. Again, another phrase that we just had was, you know, we can get through anything together and nothing apart.   Jolene Rocke: (34:32 - 35:21) And that's not a flippant statement for us. That means we're trying and we're going to find the intentional time, put them to bed early, and make sure on weekends we're connecting well. And that meant sometimes driving with our kids. We'd go on drives. But that's Jon and I being able to talk. And then if they're goofing off in the back seat, it's okay. It's just fine because we actually are having talk time. Drive time has always been great communication time for us.   Laura Dugger: (35:21 - 35:35) That's really helpful, I think, for parents in any season. And you're talking about God's grace. So how has grace, and even forgiveness, benefited your relationship?   Jolene Rocke: (35:35 - 35:40) It's everything to our relationship.   Jon Rocke: (35:22 - 37:12) It's the only thing in everything. The parable of the unjust steward in Matthew 18 and just this idea that if you catch the enormity of your sin, then you can forgive others. And so that has been, I think, an important part of what we do because I love that whole story. Peter is asking that question, “How many times do I have to forgive somebody?” And if you think about a marriage context, well, that's a great question because my guess is it's going to be thousands upon thousands of times for whatever little or big things they are. And he's kind of like loading up. I feel that he's getting ready to say, “I've already forgiven this person six times. So, is it seven? And then after that, there's no more?” And the whole point of that is, oh, you really want to keep numbers, Peter? Here's the numbers. You've been forgiven zillions. And so, what's the little trifle amount that you're not going to forgive? And so, I'm thankful that Jolene is gracious because she's had to forgive me and continues to. We're still learning in a new season of life where now we get to work together, which to me is a really great joy. But it's also a different reality where we have a lot of work talk. Well, that's great. And we love that. But that can't dominate everything either. And so that's another one of those things that we have to figure out how to carve out our time away from work. Even though we enjoy working together and it's really fun, it's a new thing. That can't get in the way of us either.   Jolene Rocke: (37:13 - 40:14) There's got to be grace on both parts that now as I look at him as a boss also. And my husband, you know, I need to give a lot of grace to realize he's working within a momentum around a team and a leadership. But then as he comes home, and I'm very fully aware now of what a hat change that means for a man. That means that he's taking off his hat now and becoming my husband at home. And so, it's grace on both sides as he sees me working even under him or with him as a team. But it's a lot of grace and forgiveness over the years because in the early years as you're raising children, there might be unmet expectations is something I wrote down because I feel like as I think back to this pursuer of God and who I married and I remember those early years thinking, well, wow, he's not leading in devotions in the family. And I'm kind of struggling to find, I need to, as the mom then, pick that up and make sure we're doing with the children some family devotions. Well, that can create controversy. It can be that I would be upset, but I needed to forgive him for the fact that he didn't mean to do that and abdicate that responsibility. He just didn't know. And so, there's so much about being graceful as a wife to say, okay, I understand. That wasn't maybe how you were raised, or you didn't see that modeled in the home. But this is what I would desire for our family. And so, you just keep working and you keep forgiving because we've been forgiven so much, as Jon said. So, we know that. And I think the other key thing then with forgiveness becomes no record keeping, just as love is in 1 Corinthians 13. It doesn't keep the record of wrongs. I don't need to sit around with my time and in my brain and think about how much I've forgiven Jon. I need to think about the fact that God's forgiven so much in me, and he has to forgive me all the time. So, you're on this equal footing with forgiveness rather than trying to harbor a record of wrongs.   Laura Dugger: (40:14 - 40:40) Well, and I think you bring up examples for how it works in our families as well with children. And so, it's clear you two have such a solid marriage and you also have a thriving relationship with your adult children and your grandchildren and all their families. So, I think you just have a lot that you could teach us about raising a family as well. What are you so thankful that you did when your kids were living at home that you're now getting to see the payoff as they're adults?   Jon Rocke: (40:16 - 41:43) We literally grew up with our kids. So sorry for our kids that they had to, you know, grow up with their mom and dad. But that's been a lot of fun too because we did a lot of play. Again, these are just little things for us, these little words. So, as the kids were young, we used to, something that bothered them is I would tell them pretty plainly that I love mom most. And so, kids will always try to drive a wedge between mom and dad. That's just part of the fallen nature of kids. And so, we really communicated early. Our kids will tell you that was a hard lesson for them to learn that they didn't quite understand at that age, right? But they've really come to appreciate that in their own marriages. And then the other thing that we said was we choose you second. So, they knew we choose each other first because you're going to be gone someday and mom's not. And so, but we will always choose you second. So, friends were not a higher priority or social or hobby or anything. You know, the kids were always knew they were second. And so our kids are scattered all across, although we have Jamie and Jonathan here, one family here in Morton that we love to live life with. The others are gone, but I think we're still close in a lot of ways from that.   Jolene Rocke: (41:45 - 45:27) Yeah, I think we're a close family because we have stuck together through not just the ups, but the downs, but we're fun loving. Jon and I like games. We like to do stuff, and we like to go places. We prioritized vacation when they were little so that we were all together in an intentional environment that was away from home. And so, we were together, they enjoyed going to Florida every year and it was always what we called just happenstances that were so adverse. It wasn't your ideal. And so, we did not have ideal things happen on any trip, actually, that we go on. So, what we decided to call them is adventures. So, we intentionally took adverse situations, whether that's a flat tire, going to Florida with all the kids and it's the middle of the night and we're all sitting at a gas station on the curb waiting for the next tire to get fixed. It's just, we just always called them adventures and I'm not sorry for that. That's something our kids are passing on to their kids when things happen. Our son in particular, Jordan, his family seems to have a lot of adventures, like Jon and I have had. And that's what they call them to their children. So, I'm not sorry for the word adventure. Jon taught me a saying that he used to say, you love your children, even if you don't like them or you will lose them. And that was really important in the teenage years. When one of our children was struggling in junior high, I knew even if I didn't like the way this one was acting, I needed to just keep loving them as scripture says, right? Not if they're perfect, but all the time. And so, we didn't lose her through that time, I think because there was so much intentional loving beyond the liking. The other thing that I would just mention with that to encourage any, any mom or dad, I picked up the book, The Five Love Languages by Gary Chapman and had this daughter read it with me so that we can learn, how do we love each other? Well, through this time when it feels like we don't really like each other that well. So, well, wow. I had no idea. It was physical touch for you. And I, I thought it was the acts of service. And you would notice that I picked up your room because I knew you had a hard day in a test at school. Well, there was never any knowledge or awareness that I did that for her. But whenever I put my arms around her and gave her a giant hug and wouldn't let her go until she melted in my arms, I realized, yes, that's what she, that's how I can love her best.   Laura Dugger: (45:27 - 45:50) That is awesome to hear that story. It is helpful to have actionable things that we can replicate. And so, I am going to link in the show notes to a few of our episodes that may be beneficial. If people want to take that concept a step further, Dr. Gary Chapman has been a previous guest. I'll link to those. And then also Katie Mueller talked about traveling with your family and the lessons that the Lord teaches his children about traveling in the Bible and how that applies to us. That's great. So, if you're willing, will you share anything more about the honeymoon? I'm so curious now.   Jon Rocke: (45:27 - 46:35) We will. I feel like we're taking too much time here.   Jolene Rocke: (46:35 - 46:36) I don't know, but well, we knew that this was setting the tone for marriage as far as adventures.   Jon Rocke: (46:36 - 46:37) But well, the very first off we, we got on a plane. So, we got married on a Sunday and we were flying out down to Florida on Sunday night. We got to Atlanta where we were supposed to connect to another plane. We were supposed to go to Fort Myers, Florida and there had been a storm and, and they were rushing to get us on the right flights or to get us to the next flight. And they put us on the wrong plane. You know, this was back in the day where that could happen. Couldn't happen today, but put us on the wrong plane. We ended up in Melbourne, Florida at midnight last flight of the night. You know, we're newlyweds. We're supposed to be, you know, on our honeymoon. They put us up at a Holiday Inn Express with the crew and said, you know, we'll get you out a flight. You have to be up at 4 a.m. And so, you know, I was, our first night was not necessarily what you would, you know, call the most romantic night that we could have. And then do you want to tell the second story of our honeymoon?   Jolene Rocke: (46:36 - 46:37) The canoe trip.   Jon Rocke: (46:37 - 46:37) Yeah.   Jolene Rocke: (46:37 - 47:28) The canoe trip is, I have such bad allergies to many things. And so, Jon knew that because we tried to go horseback riding and I thought I'd be okay because it was outdoors, but the dander on the horse made me just blow up into a big ball on my face. And so, he realized how much I have a problem with allergies, but we decided to go canoeing in a very narrow mangrove swamp. That was really depleted in, in its depth that day. And so, we were canoeing along, but we, we got into the side of the mangrove trees and out came a Hornets, Hornets out of this giant nest and stung me all over my back.   Jon Rocke: (47:28 - 47:50) And so Jon went into, I'm like thinking that my six day, you know, marriage is over. My wife, who's so allergic, we're half hour out on our journey and I'm, she's like going to die on the spot. Cause I figured if she's so allergic to animals, then this many, you know, bee stings or wasp stings, she's, you know, she's dead.   Jolene Rocke: (47:52 - 48:12) So he jumps, jumps out. Yeah. First, the truth is he took my top off and started taking mud from the bottom of the creek and, just plasters me with mud on my back. And then he jumps out of the canoe and starts running the, the canoe. Cause it was pretty shallow.   Jon Rocke: (48:12 - 48:31) I decided it was going to be quicker to get her back in time. I figured I had about 30 minutes, you know, to, to try to get her to some medical attention. And so, yeah, so I'm running the canoe back instead of paddling it. Cause I knew I could get faster. Well, then I cut my foot on a shoal and we're a mess.   Jolene Rocke: (48:31 - 48:37) I mean, he had it. What? Like six-inch stitches. So, we ended up in the ER here.   Jon Rocke: (48:37 - 48:38) Yeah.   Jolene Rocke: (48:38 - 48:52) Both of us with me, with stings, Jon, with a cut. And, and that was just the start of the honeymoon that we called a giant adventure adventure since it wasn't great.   Jon Rocke: (48:52 - 48:55) It's been a 44-year adventure.   Laura Dugger: (48:55 - 49:15) You did start with quite the adventure. I love that. And I think the husbands' listening will appreciate, of course you took their top off first.   Jon Rocke: (49:03 - 49:04) That's right.   Jolene Rocke: (49:05 - 49:07) It was a little embarrassing.   Jon Rocke: (49:08 - 49:10) It was a good thing. Nobody else.   Jolene Rocke: (49:10 - 49:15) Nobody else.   Laura Dugger: (49:15 - 49:25) Sorry. I had to tease on that part, but through various seasons, how did you prioritize one another above your kids, your career and your own families of origin?   Jon Rocke: (49:25 - 50:35) We just knew we had to have time. So, a couple of things. I mean, we had a fortunate built in mechanism too, to take trips together. So, within our family business, we had conferences and such that we had to attend. And so, we made that a priority that we were going to do those together. I wasn't going to just go by myself. And so, a couple of times a year, and now that we're working together, it can feel like life blurs between everything. So, while we're at home, we're still talking about work and we're still dealing with ministry. And the other thing is with our kids away, a lot of our trip time is spent with our kids. So, we have to make that, that's gotta be a priority, but we realized we still need just our time away. and when we got, we went down to Florida and we just said, okay, no work talk for these five days, you know, no work talk. And it was pretty fun because most of the time Jolene broke that rule. And I would say, wait a minute, no work talk.   Jolene Rocke: (50:36 - 50:36) It's true.   Jon Rocke: (50:37 - 51:09) It's very true. But those, so trips were a big thing for us, and they don't have to be a big deal trip, but a weekend away to break the routine. You know, the example of that was, that's why God created festivals and holidays were to break routine and to have a stop in our everyday lives. And so, he knew we needed that to reconnect with him. Well, we know we need that in our marriages is to break the routine.   Jolene Rocke: (51:10 - 52:17) Very intentionally. Jon was wise enough to know we needed that as even as young as he was. Can you imagine the volumes of love that that spoke to me, that he wanted me to go with him on the trips. So that meant so much to me. And it still does today because he always wants me to go with him. And then I, I just have over the years, like when the kids were at home, that was days of rest for me when he was in meetings. But as I started growing too, as a person and not needing as much rest, I also would go into all the meetings because I liked the learning. But even as we went through college, like I just was always a part of the learning. And, and I liked that, but Jon included me. That said a lot to me.   Laura Dugger: (52:18 - 52:25) And I love your companionship, how you prioritize that. What advice do you have for all of us married couples as we seek to grow as one rather than start to grow parallel or even worse, start to grow apart from one another?   Jon Rocke: (52:18 - 52:47) Yeah, I think find things to do together. That's part of how even the biking, the tandem thing came about. Cause if we went out on bikes on our individual bikes, then I'm like, I'm wanting to run ahead. Well, you know, and then, and she's like, you know, you're not getting very much exercise or whatever the case may be. But then on a tandem, we could accomplish everything together. And so, finding some of those things.   Jolene Rocke: (52:47 - 54:56) So there's seasons of time when you're raising your children, like that, Jon was biking by himself and with some other men in a fast pace for extreme exercise. And I was doing my thing. And so, I'm not saying that hobbies apart from one another are negative, but for us, they've been mostly together. And so that just means that even there was a period that yes, Jon would go out golfing, not in excess, but when our kids were around and little, I think I was communicating even in that, that you don't just go off golfing every Saturday and leave your wife with the kids on a Saturday because you now that's your day off work. No, it's, we never get a day off work. So, you need to kick in at home too. So, there was this balance, I think is a really good word for how do you, how do you do like even individual hobbies and exercise even, but then mostly we're always trying to figure out how we can do things together. So, taking a back seat, literally on a tandem bike and knowing that that was going to help our marriage to be together. I also said recently now in a decade ago, I will learn how to golf. And so that, that just meant, again, I have no, no interest that much in golfing. I thought I loved riding the car around and being outside, but now it's like, yes, I will learn to golf if that means that that's another hobby and a sport and an activity that we can do together. So, we started a Friday night golf time, just Jon and I, it's a date night of golf and Dairy Queen supper. We call it Dairy Queen supper because we just don't eat supper, but we eat Dairy Queen after we go. So there again, there's just like, what are, what can we do together? And we're still doing date nights because it's just, we actually are really good friends still.   Jon Rocke: (54:57 - 55:51) Well, I think like I say, every season has been different for us. There was a time where kids were intense and Joe was a phenomenal mom and, was totally engaged in that. And you're in your career phase too. And so, all those things are competing. Well, then we've come back in the last five years and now we work together. So that's a different whole different dynamic. And so that's why we needed, you know, yeah, we need a golf and Dairy Queen night because we just need to get away from the intensity of our work relationship, you know, and take that break on our tandems. We usually ride for breakfast. So, most things have to do with food. It's not about exercise. It's about how to eat. So that's kind of just part of what we do.   Laura Dugger: (55:51 - 56:19) I love it though. That's an interest for all people. It's something that we have to do multiple times a day. Well, what do you want to leave us with? Whether it's a challenge or scripture, it can be anything, but how would you like to wind down our time together today?   Jolene Rocke: (56:19 - 56:30) I'm going to just say to encourage everyone. Our marriage has taken compromise and it's taken communication and it pays off in the end.   Jon Rocke: (56:19 - 57:11) You know, Ephesians 5 is really an important understanding that it's submitting to each other. The idea of wives submit to your husband, you're not catching the whole picture of that. If that's what your focus is, because it's husband loves you, love your wives as Christ loved the church. And so, and it starts the whole section off with submit to one another. And so, we have to be just intentional and committed. One of my favorite sayings is from Augustine, who says, when he was in prayer one time says to God, “Command what you will, but give what you command.” And so, when I think about our marriage, that's what grace is all about. Yes, it takes intentionality and commitment, but that only comes by his grace.   Jolene Rocke: (57:11 - 57:55) And one other thing that I thought of is that we always taught our kids to remember whose they are. And that just means that if you do that within a marriage too, and you're remembering that you're the Lord's, you're made in his image, then you relate and you will love the other one better. Even as you know your identity in Christ first, you will love your mate better.   Laura Dugger: (57:55 - 58:05) Amen. And you too may know we're called The Savvy Sauce because savvy is synonymous with practical knowledge. And so, as my final question for both of you today, what is your savvy sauce?   Jon Rocke: (57:56 - 58:07) You know, I just say submission is a good thing. It's not associated that way, but in a marriage it's such a good thing.   Jolene Rocke: (58:08 - 59:13) So that's both submitting to each other, not just the wife being clamped down. But our savvy sauce would be that sacrifice and submission are good things. They're not bad words. So, in our experience, a savvy sauce for our 44-year-old marriage is that sacrifice and submission have been very good things on both of our parts.   Laura Dugger: (59:13 - 59:20) Well, you clearly live this out, and you've been great role models to Mark and to me and our family. You love one another with such an intensity, and you love your Lord that way, and you love your children that way in your community. And I just see the way that He's had this ripple out from being intentional in the most key important parts of life, and that He's really blessed you in that, but He's also blessed all of us around you. So, thank you for sharing your journey with us. Thank you so much for being my guest.   Jolene Rocke: (59:20 - 59:22) It's been so great to be here with you. Thanks for asking, Laura.   Jon Rocke: (59:13 - 59:27) Yeah, it's been a privilege for us just to take the time to reflect again and realize the challenges, but really just celebrate what God has done through His grace in us and our marriage. So, thanks.   Laura Dugger: (59:27 - 1:03:10) One more thing before you go, have you heard the term gospel before? It simply means good news. And I want to share the best news with you, but it starts with the bad news.   Every single one of us were born sinners, but Christ desires to rescue us from our sin, which is something we cannot do for ourselves. This means there's absolutely no chance we can make it to heaven on our own. So, for you and for me, it means we deserve death, and we can never pay back the sacrifice we owe to be saved.   We need a savior, but God loved us so much. He made a way for his only son to willingly die in our place as the perfect substitute. This gives us hope of life forever in right relationship with him.   That is good news. Jesus lived the perfect life. We could never live and died in our place for our sin.   This was God's plan to make a way to reconcile with us so that God can look at us and see Jesus. We can be covered and justified through the work Jesus finished. If we choose to receive what he has done for us, Romans 10:9 says, “that if you confess with your mouth, Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.”   So, you pray with me now. Heavenly father, thank you for sending Jesus to take our place. I pray someone today right now is touched and chooses to turn their life over to you.   Will you clearly guide them and help them take their next step in faith to declare you as Lord of their life? We trust you to work and change lives now for eternity. In Jesus name we pray.   Amen. If you prayed that prayer, you are declaring him for me. So, me for him, you get the opportunity to live your life for him.   And at this podcast, we're called The Savvy Sauce for a reason. We want to give you practical tools to implement the knowledge you have learned. So, you're ready to get started.   First, tell someone, say it out loud, get a Bible. The first day I made this decision, my parents took me to Barnes and Noble and let me choose my own Bible. I selected the Quest NIV Bible and I love it.   You can start by reading the book of John. Also get connected locally, which just means tell someone who's a part of a church in your community that you made a decision to follow Christ. I'm assuming they will be thrilled to talk with you about further steps such as going to church and getting connected to other believers to encourage you.   We want to celebrate with you too. So, feel free to leave a comment for us here. If you did make a decision to follow Christ, we also have show notes included where you can read scripture that describes this process.   And finally, be encouraged. Luke 15:10 says, “in the same way, I tell you, there is rejoicing in the presence of the angels of God over one sinner who repents.” The heavens are praising with you for your decision today.   And if you've already received this good news, I pray you have someone to share it with. You are loved and I look forward to meeting you here next time.

Morse code transcription: vvv vvv Two starkly opposed Americas laid bare by deadly ICE shooting Bowen Trump risks pushing world back to age of empires Cat Burns celebrates start of new life after breast reduction surgery Renee Nicole Good Who was the woman killed by ICE in Minneapolis Homeless men with valid booking refused entry to Holiday Inn Express Government to water down business rate rise for pubs Weight loss jabs affecting Greggs, boss says Storm Goretti brings 99mph winds and snow as 65,000 properties lose power Fourteen clifftop homes in Hemsby face imminent collapse Abandoned baby Elsa to be adopted and regularly see two siblings, court orders

Dozens of sex toys wash up on beach in Scotland at the amusement of locals. Twitch streamer livestreams her birth to over 30,000 viewers. Wake up and smell the breakfast coming from your alarm clock at the Holiday Inn Express. // Weird AF News is the only daily weird news podcast in the world. Weird news 5 days/week and on Friday it's only Floridaman. SUPPORT by joining the Weird AF News Patreon http://patreon.com/weirdafnews - OR buy Jonesy a coffee at http://buymeacoffee.com/funnyjones Buy MERCH: https://weirdafnews.merchmake.com/ - Check out the official website https://WeirdAFnews.com and FOLLOW host Jonesy at http://instagram.com/funnyjones - wants Jonesy to come perform standup comedy in your city? Fill out the form: https://docs.google.com/forms/d/e/1FAIpQLSfvYbm8Wgz3Oc2KSDg0-C6EtSlx369bvi7xdUpx_7UNGA_fIw/viewform

The Holiday Inn Express recently unveiled a new morning alarm system that's designed to be more pleasant than a blaring clock. The Holiday Inn Express Breakfast Alarm Clock is designed to wake guests up with the smell of bacon, coffee or muffins. BloggerAtLarge's Megan Singleton got the chance to try it out to find out if this technology's worth the hype. LISTEN ABOVESee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Democrats crying over the Trump Sombrero Memes. Do you get sleep? Are you the funny one at work? Kimmel on Colbert. Why we hate late night TV. Holiday Inn Express experimenting with scent-based alarm clocks. Craig's next door neighbor smokes weed in the car. AOC and Bernie talking about the shutdown. Jake Tapper confronting Hakeem Jeffries about funding healthcare for illegal aliens. JD Vance dunks on Dems for supporting illegal alien healthcare. Young liberals think you can do communism right. Tanning bed and Nickelodeon bowling pin for sale. Hawk Tua girl back in the news. Man steals tow truck that was about to repossess his car. Indy Man Arrested 99 Times reportedly w/o Prison Time. Indy Prosecutor already Downgraded Charge to Aggravated Battery. Celebrity health hacks. FL Man arrested for driving 124 mph in his Camry. He needed to go to the bathroom and didn't make it. Dems being trolled by the Sombrero Meme. NY Yankee thanking Jesus Christ for all of his gifts. Actors threatened by AI actors.See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Democrats crying over the Trump Sombrero Memes. Do you get sleep? Are you the funny one at work? Kimmel on Colbert. Why we hate late night TV. Holiday Inn Express experimenting with scent-based alarm clocks. Craig's next door neighbor smokes weed in the car. See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

We have a raccoon problem.  Podcasters are the new version of shock-jocks. I honor comedy legend, Bert Kreischer, by doing the show shirtless. Holiday Inn Express adds scent-based alarm clocks to rooms for Australia, New Zealand, Singapore, Thailand, and Japan. Taco Bell Cantina is opening two locations in Denver, on of which is at DIA. Ryanair flight from Milan to London was diverted to France after two passengers began acting strangely. One person started eating his passport, while the other attempted to flush theirs down the toilet. Cowboy DeHuff explains why the Denver Broncos will beat the Philadelphia Eagles in Philly. And my pick for the World Series. Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

We have a raccoon problem.  Podcasters are the new version of shock-jocks. I honor comedy legend, Bert Kreischer, by doing the show shirtless. Holiday Inn Express adds scent-based alarm clocks to rooms for Australia, New Zealand, Singapore, Thailand, and Japan. Taco Bell Cantina is opening two locations in Denver, on of which is at DIA. Ryanair flight from Milan to London was diverted to France after two passengers began acting strangely. One person started eating his passport, while the other attempted to flush theirs down the toilet. Cowboy DeHuff explains why the Denver Broncos will beat the Philadelphia Eagles in Philly. And my pick for the World Series. Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

We have a raccoon problem.  Podcasters are the new version of shock-jocks. I honor comedy legend, Bert Kreischer, by doing the show shirtless. Holiday Inn Express adds scent-based alarm clocks to rooms for Australia, New Zealand, Singapore, Thailand, and Japan. Taco Bell Cantina is opening two locations in Denver, on of which is at DIA. Ryanair flight from Milan to London was diverted to France after two passengers began acting strangely. One person started eating his passport, while the other attempted to flush theirs down the toilet. Cowboy DeHuff explains why the Denver Broncos will beat the Philadelphia Eagles in Philly. And my pick for the World Series. Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Wake up and smell the bacon. Holiday Inn Express by IHG is launching a world-first hotel experience with a scent-based alarm clock in an effort to improve guests’ sleep and mornings!See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Another fun show in the books, and we started things off across the pond where Holiday Inn Express is rolling out some new alarm clock technology. Some guy in New York got his car repo'd and went to drastic measures to prevent it from happening! We found a woman who hatched an ingenious plan to catch her husband cheating. We also spread fumpkins awareness, and read a listener email about the age-old problem of a child who wants their first smart phone! See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

We're sharing 10 amazing places you have to visit in Arizona! Arizona has impressive landscapes that allow you to immerse yourself in nature. It's a gorgeous state with healing and incredibly special energy.Download our ⁠Arizona national parks road trip itinerary⁠ and our ⁠Grand Canyon/Page road trip itinerary⁠ to see many of these places in one trip.Here are 10 places we love and recommendations we have on each:Sedona: Episode: ⁠Weekend Hiking Trip in Sedona⁠Where to Stay in Sedona: ⁠Southwest Inn at Sedona⁠, ⁠Matterhorn Inn⁠, or ⁠Los Abrigados Resort and Spa⁠Saguaro National Park Episode: ⁠Saguaro to Petried Forest Road Trip⁠Where to Stay in Near Saguaro: ⁠Adobe Rose Inn B&B⁠, ⁠Courtyard by Marriott Tucson⁠, or ⁠Lodge on the Desert⁠⁠Arizona National Parks Itinerary ⁠Petrified Forest National ParkEpisode: ⁠Saguaro to Petried Forest Road Trip⁠Where to Stay near Petrified Forest: ⁠Holiday Inn Express⁠, ⁠Best Western Paint Pony Lodge⁠, or ⁠Days Inn by Wyndham⁠⁠Arizona National Parks Itinerary ⁠Lake HavasuWhere to Stay in Lake Havasu: ⁠WorldMark Havasu Dunes⁠, ⁠Sway Hotel⁠, or ⁠Holiday Inn Express & Suites Lake Havasu⁠ScottsdaleWhere to Stay in Scottsdale: ⁠Orange Tree Resort⁠, ⁠DoubleTree by Hilton Paradise Valley Resort Scottsdale⁠, or ⁠Scottsdale Camelback Resort⁠Grand Canyon National Park Episode: ⁠Day in Grand Canyon⁠Where to Stay near the Grand Canyon: ⁠Thunderbird Lodge (inside the park)⁠, ⁠Bright Angel Lodge (inside the park)⁠, ⁠The Grand Hotel at the Grand Canyon⁠, or ⁠Red Feather Lodge⁠Monument ValleyWhere to Stay in Monument Valley: ⁠Goulding's Lodge⁠ or ⁠The View Hotel⁠Page Episode: ⁠American Southwest Road Trip⁠Where to Stay in Page: ⁠Best Western View of Lake Powell⁠, ⁠La Quinta Inn & Suites by Wyndham Page at Lake Powell⁠, or ⁠Hyatt Place Page Lake Powell⁠Bullhead CityWhere to Stay in Bullhead City: ⁠Holiday Inn Express & Suites⁠, Havasupai Falls Episode: ⁠4 Days Backpacking Havasupai Falls⁠Where to stay before your hike into Havasupai: ⁠Hualapai Lodge⁠ or ⁠Grand Canyon Caverns Inn⁠In this episode we mentioned ice cleat crampons, ⁠⁠these are the ones we recommend⁠⁠.-------------------------------------------Shop:⁠ Trip Itineraries ⁠⁠&⁠ ⁠Amazon Storefront ⁠⁠Connect:⁠ ⁠YouTube⁠⁠,⁠ ⁠TikTok⁠⁠, and⁠ ⁠Instagram⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠⁠and contact us at travelsquadpodcast@gmail.com to submit a question of the week or inquire about guest interviews and advertising. Submit a question of the week or inquire about guest interviews and advertising.

This Week: Literally Dozens of Podcasts, Going Full Alpha, Keto Fantasies, The Incredible Edible Egg Lobby, Milk, Justin's First Celebrity Crush, Cursive, Geographical Ignorance, Pacifist Cowboys, The Moss on the Tree, Pale Rider, Sooners, Minnesota, The Gateway Arch, Hot Springs, Juicy Lucy, The Caves of St. Paul, Attempts to Stay at a Holiday Inn Express, Sharing the Joy That is Okra. Get on the Patreon Train: https://patreon.com/Sushijackknife?utm_medium=unknown&utm_source=join_link&utm_campaign=creatorshare_creator&utm_content=copyLinkBandcamp Store: https://sushijackknife.bandcamp.com/Email: sushijackknife@gmail.com

In this week's Travel Flashback Episode, we're taking you on an epic road trip through the Dakotas! In this episode we detail our 6-day road trip that takes you through both North and South Dakota as we explore new cities, state parks, national parks, and unique roadside attractions including:Mount Rushmore National MemorialCuster State Park Jewel Cave National MonumentWind Cave Tour National ParkBadlands National ParkTheodore Roosevelt National ParkCrazy Horse MemorialWall Drug Spearfish Scenic BywayWe even talk about add ons like Carhenge and Toadstools Geological Park If you want to take this exact trip, you can download our 6 day ⁠Dakotas Itinerary⁠. The Dakotas itinerary gives travel tips, restaurant and hotel recommendations, links to every activity we booked, packing list, and a day by day itinerary for you to follow. If you are looking for activities & experiences in the area, check out our recommended ⁠Viator list⁠. We've listed hotel recommendations for this trip below: ⁠Bavarian Inn⁠ and ⁠Holiday Inn Express⁠ are both good choices for stays in Custer Stay at the ⁠Best Western⁠ or ⁠Cambria Hotel in Rapid City⁠Choose to stay at ⁠AmericInn by Wyndham⁠ in Medora or the ⁠Bowman Lodge & Convention Center⁠ in Bowman when visiting Theodore Roosevelt National Park Find a great flight deal to the Dakotas by signing up for⁠ Thrifty Traveler Premium⁠ and watching the daily flight deals (points & cash) that are emailed directly to you! Use our promo code TS10 to get $10 off your first year subscription- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -Shop:⁠ Trip Itineraries ⁠⁠&⁠ ⁠Amazon Storefront ⁠⁠Connect:⁠ ⁠YouTube⁠⁠,⁠ ⁠TikTok⁠⁠, and⁠ ⁠Instagram⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠⁠and contact us at travelsquadpodcast@gmail.com to submit a question of the week or inquire about guest interviews and advertising. Submit a question of the week or inquire about guest interviews and advertising.

Thanks for finding our podcast! We are a family of 5 who does most of our travel using credit card points and miles and we share how we leverage credit card offers to earn a ton of points/miles so we can afford travel as a larger family.Follow us on Instagram @TravelPartyof5The towering sequoias of Mariposa Grove, the refreshing mist from Bridal Veil Falls, and the unexpected joy of watching our typically reserved 11-year-old exclaim "This is amazing!" – our family adventure to Yosemite National Park delivered all this and more.Our road trip strategy began with renting a hybrid minivan for the 2,000-mile journey, earning American Airlines miles while saving our personal vehicle from mountain roads and inevitable snack debris. After an overnight at the Holiday Inn Express in Oakhurst (booked with an IHG free night certificate), we kicked off our Yosemite exploration with the Valley Floor Tour – a perfect introduction that provided fascinating insights into the park's history and ecology, including how indigenous fire management practices were disrupted by European settlers.For families considering Yosemite with young children, we discovered some perfect trails: Lower Yosemite Falls offers an easy walk with spectacular views, while Bridal Veil Falls rewards visitors with cooling mist after a short hike. The more ambitious Mariposa Grove trail showcased magnificent giant sequoias but required multiple breaks to manage the heat and terrain with our little ones. One unexpected highlight? Encountering a rattlesnake – though we had hoped for bears and deer during our visit!Accommodation was a crucial part of our experience. Rush Creek Lodge, located just minutes from the west entrance (though still a 45-minute drive to the valley floor), proved worth every penny of its $538 nightly rate. The resort offered heated pools, zip lines, game rooms, nightly s'mores, and endless activities that kept our kids entertained from sunrise to sunset. Even without televisions in the rooms, we connected as a family through board games and outdoor adventures.Our biggest tips? Map your route carefully to minimize backtracking on winding mountain roads, prepare for motion sickness with Dramamine (administered a full hour before departure), and check multiple weather sources before packing – we brought cold-weather gear for forecasted 60-degree days but encountered 90-degree heat instead!Looking to create your own Yosemite memories? Follow us on Instagram @TravelParty5 for photos, videos, and more insights from our adventure. And tune in next week when we continue our journey with our Lake Tahoe experiences!

It's not every day that we go to a major pinball festival, and the Texas Pinball Festival is one of the biggest and best in the world. We compare TPF to the other pinball festivals plus impressions of Evil Dead, Whataburger, and the Holiday Inn Express....lawdamercy. Games Discussed: Spooky's Evil Dead Contact Us! --> pod@bashpinball.com Listen @ www.BashPinball.com Instagram, Youtube: @bashpinball Streaming on: twitch.tv/bashpinball Theme Song: Venus by Wren and Au Lune

Dylan Bringuel remembers the exact moment they got hired by the Holiday Inn Express in Jamestown, New York. It was late August 2022, and Bringuel—who uses they/them pronouns—had recently moved across the country and was struggling to find work. Bringuel is transgender and was upfront about their gender identity during the job interview. “ I was like, ‘Just so you're aware, I am transitioning from female to male,'” they remember saying. “And they said, ‘Okay, we respect that. We'll do our best to make sure you fit and you're comfortable here.'”That wasn't the case. Bringuel said that the first day on the job, the housekeeping manager called them an “it” and a “transformer” and said people like Bringuel are “what is wrong with society.”Bringuel reported the harassment to hotel management. Within a day, they were fired. In 2024, the federal Equal Employment Opportunity Commission stepped in to help Bringuel sue the hotel for workplace discrimination.But earlier this year, something unusual happened. The EEOC dropped Bringuel's case, not because their allegations lacked merit, but because of President Donald Trump's executive order on “radical gender ideology.” This week on Reveal, Mother Jones national politics reporter Abby Vesoulis walks through how the anti-DEI movement evolved from a niche legal fight to an all-out culture war—and what that means for the EEOC and the marginalized people it has historically protected. Support Reveal's journalism at Revealnews.org/donatenow Subscribe to our weekly newsletter to get the scoop on new episodes at Revealnews.org/weekly Connect with us onBluesky, Facebook and Instagram Learn about your ad choices: dovetail.prx.org/ad-choices

On today's episode of Have Kids They Said, hosts Rich and Nicole serve up a whirlwind of parenting chaos, personal confessions, and hilarious hot takes. From deep dives into the mental health of both moms and dads, to Nicole dropping a juicy secret, the duo covers everything from animal appendages to elite continental breakfasts at Holiday Inn Express. Rich vents about the bureaucratic madness of 5U All Stars while Nicole shares the mental overload that comes with raising kids in the heart of NYC. And yes, there's even a battle over Parker's clothes brewing between Nicole and Matt.The conversation spirals delightfully through gullible childhood moments, why teens today don't care about driver's licenses, Gen X grievances, and how getting a specialist doctor appointment feels harder than winning the lottery. Plus, Emmy gets one of Rich's classic pep talks, Nicole revisits her OBGYN adventures, and they both remind us why a follow-up message can make or break your hang. Tune in, laugh with (and at) them, and don't forget to subscribe for more real talk, relatable chaos, and parenting truths. Follow Have Kids They Said now for your weekly dose of laughs, rants, and real-life parenting drama. #ParentingPodcast #MentalHealthMatters #NYCParentLife #GenXParenting #MomLife #DadLife #FunnyPodcast #ParentingUnfiltered Have Kids, They Said... is a SiriusXM Network Podcast made by Nicole Ryan and Rich Davis.If you'd like to send us a message or ask a question email us at HKTSpod@gmail.comFollow on social media:Instagram @havekidstheysaidpodNicole @mashupnicoleRich @richdavisand @siriusxm

This week's episode is a little different—and a lot of fun. Jess, Pam, and Alex are joined by Traci for a special game of Would You Rather!? – Points Talk Edition. Traci challenges the squad with a lineup of delightfully diabolical travel questions designed to reveal where they really stand when it comes to their points and airline preferences, personal travel quirks, and loyalty trade-offs. From Business Class Woes to Economy Wins The episode kicks off with a tough one: would you rather have a lie-flat seat in business class next to an annoying stranger, or an entire economy row to yourself? At least one of the squad's answers will probably surprise you! Individual Perks vs. Points Value: Globalist or the Award Chart? Next, Traci challenges the group with Hyatt's ultimate tradeoff: would you rather have lifetime Globalist status or a guaranteed fixed award chart for 20 years? Is there dissent or do Alex, Jess, and Pam all come down on the same side on this one? Real-Life Dilemmas and Points Preferences From there, the questions get personal: Learn about Alex's secret grocery-store card confession. Would Jess rather stay at a Park Hyatt in a city she doesn't like (Venice) or a Holiday Inn Express in a city she loves (Tokyo)?  Would Alex rather have her beloved Southwest® Companion Pass or 600,000 Hyatt points?  Would Pam choose only domestic luxury travel or international budget travel if she could only choose one?  Tough Transfers & Redemption Realities The squad also weighs in on (and disagrees about) transferring highly valued points with or without bonuses. Nice Problems to Have They also daydream about future loyalty-program changes they'd love to see, like new Citi cards, United partnering with a second bank, and Capital One adding Alaska as a partner. (A girl can dream!)   The Great Collectibles Debate: Ducks or Houses? The episode ends on a light note, with the squad picking which flight souvenirs they'd rather have (rubber ducks or Delft houses) and which ones they'd be more likely to try to get permission to pinch.  This episode is full of laughs, strong opinions, and lots of travel daydreaming. Hit play now and see which “would you rather” choices you agree with—and which ones you totally wouldn't!

This week on Myopia Movies we learn why I only take bubble baths, we start our Alfred Hitchcock Month with Psycho! The reason I only stay at Holiday Inn Express. How will Psycho hold up? Host: Nic Panel: Alex, Matthew, Keiko   Directed by Alfred Hitchcock Starring: Anthony Perkins, Vera Miles, John Gavin, Martin Balsam, and Janet Leigh

We're talking holistic health and healing on this week's Sustainability Now! Your host, Justin Mog, is excited to reconnect with a dear old friend, Emily Kicklighter, who will share her story of radical remission - healing from stage 4 breast cancer without chemotherapy, radiation, or surgery! Her life-changing experience of healing led Emily to become a Health Coach, Speaker, and Writer, founding The Whole Elephant Coaching. Learn more at https://emilykicklighter.org or connect with her on Facebook at https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=61570497657706 Emily is offering numerous opportunities this year to learn more and build community through Radical Remissions Workshops in the Louisville area: Free Intro to Radical Remission Workshops @ the Louisville public libraries (no registration needed) 6-7PM @ The Louisville Free Public Library, includes 1 hr multimodal presentation of Radical Remission Content * Iroquois Branch, 601 West Woodlawn Ave, Feb 4th * Western Branch, 604 South Tenth St, Feb 6th * Main Branch, 301 York St, Feb 12th * Jeffersontown Branch, 10635 Watterson Trail, Feb 18th * Northeast Branch, 15 Bellevoir Circle, Feb 20th 5-Week, Weekly Series Radical Remission Workshop Intensive @ Valaterra  Includes: * 10 hours of the Radical Remission Multimodal Content presented by Emily (devised by Dr. Kelly Turner, author of Radical Remission and Radical Hope)  * 5 hour-long wellness offerings such as accessible yoga, meditation, sound bath, qi gong * 5 Farm-to-table dinners with both plant-based and keto options Thursdays, 4-8pm, March 6-April 3rd Wednesdays, 4-8pm, May 7-June 4th Thursdays, 4-8pm, Sept 4-Oct 2nd Mondays, 4-8pm, December 1-29th Radical Remission Weekend Workshop Intensive @ Valaterra Includes: * 10 hours of the Radical Remission MultimodalContent presented by Emily (devised by Dr. Kelly Turner, author of Radical Remission and Radical Hope)  * 3 hour-long wellness offerings such as accessible yoga, meditation, sound bath, qi gong * 6 Farm-to-table meals with both plant-based and keto options (dinner Fri & Sat, breakfast and lunch Sat & Sun) * Special Presentations from thought-leaders and healers in the cancer community * Discounted accommodations under Group Reservation Code: EG4 @ the Holiday Inn Express, La Grange * Shuttle from Holiday Inn Express, La Grange to/from Valaterra Friday @ 4pm-Sunday @ 3pm April 25-27th June 13-15th August 29-31st November 7-9th Learn more and register at https://www.emilykicklighter.org/radical-remission-workshops.html As always, our feature is followed by your community action calendar for the week, so get your calendars out and get ready to take action for sustainability NOW! Sustainability Now! is hosted by Dr. Justin Mog and airs on Forward Radio, 106.5fm, WFMP-LP Louisville, every Monday at 6pm and repeats Tuesdays at 12am and 10am. Find us at http://forwardradio.org The music in this podcast is courtesy of the local band Appalatin and is used by permission. Explore their delightful music at http://appalatin.com

The Best of Plans Went Awry for Saturday's Travel and Cruise Industry Podcast, January 18, 2025. We encountered several obstacles today on our travels from Southampton, UK to Winchester, UK. We are checked in to an accessible room in the "old" Holiday Inn Express in Winchester. We planned to spend one day in Winchester and the Cathedral, one day at Stonehenge, and one day in Salisbury with another cathedral. Let's see how the recovery from today goes, and my almost 3 hours in the bitter cold. CLICK here for video feed #saturdaytravelandcruiseindustrypodcast #travelandcruiseindustrynews #podcast #cruisenews #travelnews #cruise #travel #chilliescruises #chilliefalls #whill_us Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Dexter White returns for another weekly chat about all things Elon Musk, Immigration, and why culture matters more than efficiency.  Show Notes: Musk's New Year's Day Tweet about Keir Starmer

Topics discussed on today's show: Rodney at the Holiday Inn Express, TB Chicken Nugs, National Film Registry, Bluey Movie, Pig Kidney, Cannibals, Nissonda, Junk Fees, Walmart Cameras, Starbucks Workers, White House Guests, Birthdays, History Quiz, Christmas Traditions To Get Rid Of, New Traditions, 20 in 24, Holiday Office Parties, Good Deed Backfired, Are you on the Naughty List?, Deep Cut Face Off, and Apologies.

Kelli and Sarah discuss Season 5, Episode 6 of Below Deck Sailing Yacht. Topics include: Gary's regret, a hot tub question, charter ‘o dentists, Daisy scolding Gary, hungover Cloyce, caesar salad, Emma's alternate reality, a secret spilled, hot mics and an airport hotel breakfast. In Hot Tub Convo we discuss Danni and Glenn's WWHL appearance and Sarah's dock walk with Culver. Time to start coming out on the genoa - a new episode of Above Deck is out now!  Follow us on Instagram: @abovedeckpod  Get in touch: abovedeckpod@gmail.com  Get ya some Above Deck merch! https://shop.hurrdatmedia.com/collections/above-deck  Let our sponsor BetterHelp connect you to a therapist who can support you- all from the comfort of your own home. Visit https://betterhelp.com/AboveDeck and enjoy a special discount on your first month. Please subscribe on Apple Podcasts, Spotify or wherever you get your podcasts, and tell a friend! Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Watch The X22 Report On Video No videos found Click On Picture To See Larger PictureGermany is entering a depression, orders are down, it's starting to look like 2009. Berkshire Hathaway is piling into cash, why, the market is going up. Trump is going to turn the economy upside down, the [CB] is panicking because they know what is coming. The [DS] is now preparing their counter attack against the patriots. They needed to reset the election after 2020. They needed to show the public that the election system works and we have no problems. The [DS] is now making their first move to try to stop Trump, this will not work. Trump is creating an elite force for DC. They will bring the corrupt to their knees, checkmate.   (function(w,d,s,i){w.ldAdInit=w.ldAdInit||[];w.ldAdInit.push({slot:13499335648425062,size:[0, 0],id:"ld-7164-1323"});if(!d.getElementById(i)){var j=d.createElement(s),p=d.getElementsByTagName(s)[0];j.async=true;j.src="//cdn2.customads.co/_js/ajs.js";j.id=i;p.parentNode.insertBefore(j,p);}})(window,document,"script","ld-ajs"); Economy https://twitter.com/disclosetv/status/1855904340021571729 https://twitter.com/KobeissiLetter/status/1855685090400972965   faster pace than in the mid-2000's. Back then, this percentage reached 24.5% in Q2 2005 and remained elevated until 2008. Berkshire Hathaway also decided to HALT stock buybacks for the first time since 2018. Does Warren Buffett believe the market is too expensive? https://twitter.com/KobeissiLetter/status/1855719797612253198   shrunk by ~$500 and ~$100 billion, respectively. Overall, total foreign holdings as a share of outstanding federal debt have dropped from 35% to 24%, near the lowest level in 18 years. This is the consequence of rapidly rising public debt with the supply of Treasuries rising ~$15 trillion over the last decade. Foreign demand for Treasuries cannot keep up with skyrocketing US debt. https://twitter.com/DC_Draino/status/1855976535947137439   time you swipe Common sense is back Let's get people out of debt, eliminate hidden taxes, and make america wealthy again https://twitter.com/WallStreetSilv/status/1855834930447626453   Political/Rights https://twitter.com/kevinnbass/status/1855827870637019223 https://twitter.com/charliekirk11/status/1855710820220674337 https://twitter.com/Craptocracy/status/1855716513745190914 Annual Net Cost: The Federation for American Immigration Reform (FAIR) has estimated that illegal immigration costs American taxpayers approximately $150.7 billion annually. This figure was cited for 2022, suggesting that if this level of spending continued, the cost over the three years from 2022 to 2024 would be around over $450 billion.   https://twitter.com/WallStreetApes/status/1855819457761063083   migrants staying in Albany's Ramada and Holiday Inn Express to leave” “New York City is saying they'll be closing 10 sites outside of New York City” “City officials say they've housed more than 220 migrant families from upstate hotels since 2023. Now these individuals may soon need to navigate new policies too as president-elect Donald Trump has put mass deportation on his agenda.” Hotels will start opening back up to the American Public and no longer be used for illegals Immigration Lawyers Prepare to Battle Trump in Court Again Nearly eight years after the first challenges to his immigration policies, Donald Trump is returning to the White House promising a more aggressive crackdown. It was just days into his first term when President Trump issued an order banning the entry of people from several predominantly Muslim countries. An SOS went out to immigration lawyers across New York to head to Kennedy Airport, where arriving passengers were already being detained. By noon, hundreds of lawyers were interviewing relatives and friends of travelers who were being held, challenging their detention and drafting petitions f...

In this explosive episode of "Connecting the Dots," I sit down with Professor Dan Kovalik to expose the harsh reality of free speech under attack in America. Dan shares his chilling story of being detained for hours at Miami Airport, interrogated simply for telling the truth on RT and other alternative news outlets. He's part of a disturbing trend—journalists in the U.S. being raided, arrested, and harassed for daring to speak out. Is free speech in America on life support? We dive into Noam Chomsky's theory of controlled debate, where public opinion is tightly managed, and how today's media manipulates what we're allowed to hear. From the prosecution of dissent to the silencing of pro-Palestine voices on college campuses, this conversation reveals the frightening erosion of our First Amendment rights. Don't miss this urgent wake-up call—are we witnessing the death of free speech in the land of the free?     Find me and the show on social media. Click the following links or search @DrWilmerLeon on X/Twitter, Instagram, Facebook, Patreon and YouTube!   Hey everyone, Dr. Wilmer here! If you've been enjoying my deep dives into the real stories behind the headlines and appreciate the balanced perspective I bring, I'd love your support on my Patreon channel. Your contribution helps me keep "Connecting the Dots" alive, revealing the truth behind the news. Join our community, and together, let's keep uncovering the hidden truths and making sense of the world. Thank you for being a part of this journey!   Wilmer Leon (00:00): The linguist, Noam Chomsky tells us the smart way to keep people passive and obedient is to strictly limit the spectrum of acceptable opinion, but allow very lively debate within that spectrum. Even encourage the more critical and dissident views that gives people the sense that there's free thinking going on. While all the time the presuppositions of the system are being reinforced by the limits put on the range of debate. That's Noam Chomsky. Let's talk about it. Stay tuned. Announcer (00:43): Connecting the dots with Dr. Wilmer Leon, where the analysis of politics, culture, and history converge. Wilmer Leon (00:51): Welcome to the Connecting the Dots podcast with Dr. Wilmer Leon, and I am Wilmer Leon is this what American mainstream media and those in Western established press are engaging in actually the violation of the First Amendment? Let's discuss this. Here's the point. We have a tendency to view current events as though they occur in a vacuum, failing to understand the broader historic context in which these events occur. During each episode of this podcast, my guests and I, we have probing, provocative, and in-depth discussions that connect the dots between these events and the broader historic context in which they occur. This enables you to better understand and analyze the events that impact the global village in which we live. On today's episode, the issue of force is very simple. The first amendment, freedom of speech, and the US government's attack on this inalienable right, and my guest is a US labor and human rights lawyer, writer, author, and activist. His latest book is entitled The Case for Palestine, why It Matters and Why You Should Care. He has been a peace activist throughout his life. He has been deeply involved in the movement for peace and social justice in Columbia, Venezuela, Nicaragua, and other countries in the global south. He's also taught international human rights law at the University of Pittsburgh School of Law since 2012. He is Professor Dan lik. Dan, welcome. Dan Kovalik (02:26): Thank you. Thanks for having me. Always a pleasure. Wilmer. Wilmer Leon (02:30): So there are a number of events. We're going to connect a number of dots here, but let's start with the First Amendment and it reads as follows, Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion or prohibiting the free exercise thereof or abridging the freedom of speech or of the press or the right of people to peaceably, to assemble and to petition the government for a redress of grievances. Dan, we take this as Americans, we take this for granted, but as the first amendment of the first 10, this one was very important and made number one for a reason why? Dan Kovalik (03:18): Well, because the founding fathers having come from England, where there was a king who was able to prescribe speech arbitrarily, wanted to protect the right of free spree speech, the right of religion. Of course, England had a state religion, the Anglican Church, and they wanted to make sure that Americans had the right to such things as speech and religion and freedom of the press. In England. Those things were not protected even to this day. By the way, great Britain does not have a written constitution and does not protect those types of rights in the way that the United States does. Wilmer Leon (04:05): And again, we've taken this right for granted for so many years, but we have found history shows us, particularly during times of war, when the United States feels that it is being threatened, the screws tighten on free speech, hence people get charged with sedition and other types of violations. When the government feels it's being threatened, when there is a perceived threat from outside the country, then the government will tend to tighten the screws restrict speech, and then once that threat is vanquished, then the prohibitions relax. Have you found history to prove that to be true? Dan Kovalik (04:57): Yes. I mean, one of the most famous examples, of course is during World War I, people like Eugene v Debs, great socialist from Terre Haute, Indiana. He was put in jail for publicly opposing World War I and famously his persecution and those of others like him was approved by the Supreme Court in a famous case by Oliver Wendell Holmes is one of the most celebrated jurors, and he created the clear and present danger rule. And what that says is that the First Amendment is not, as they often say, the US Constitution is not a suicide pact. He said that in cases of a clear and present danger, Congress in fact could (05:59): Limit speech. He gave the example famous example of you're not allowed to yell fire in a crowded theater, for example. And he compared incredibly advocating for peace during a time of war as tantamount to claiming there's a fire in a crowded theater. And that remains the law of the day. And so that law or that decision, which is now almost a hundred years old, I think sets the precedent that advocating for peace in the United States is somehow a clear and present danger. And so when we look to how speech is being regulated and limited today, what we often see it being regulated when people are clamoring for peace. Wilmer Leon (06:58): There's an interesting piece in consortium news entitled Free Speech in the Department of Political Justice, and it's written by former judge Andrew Napolitano, who was a superior court judge in New Jersey. And he writes in this piece, I don't want to spend a lot of time getting into the weeds of the First Amendment, but I think this is very germane to what we find ourselves dealing with. He writes, the framers of the Constitution, were debating this idea of free speech, and they concluded that expressive rights are natural to all persons no matter where they are born. And natural rights are, as Jefferson had written in the Declaration of Independence inalienable. That's why I refer to them as inalienable rights in the open stated differently. He writes, Madison and his colleagues gave us a constitution and a bill of rights that on their face recognized the prepo political existence of the freedom of speech and of the press in all persons and guaranteed that in Congress, by which they meant the government could not and would not abridge them until now. And he, in his piece, he's referencing some charges that the United States government has imposed against some Americans and some Russians, and it's not even a matter of challenging war as much as it is challenging the established government narrative. Your thoughts? Dan Kovalik (08:35): Yes. So again, this is very similar to laws and regulations that have come down before during World War I and also around the same time you had the pomades against socialists and union leaders. Of course you had the McCarthy period, which also really represented an abridgement of peace of speech and of course very, I think relevant to today because of course the McCarthy period, at least ostensibly involved the persecution of communists. Though of course a lot of people persecuted were not communists, though a lot of the people who were persecuted were communists. Most notably in my mind, the great Paul Robeson who went, he and I went to the same law school. By the way, it's a big reason I went to Columbia Law School is because Paul Robeson went there, one of my heroes. Wilmer Leon (09:31): He was a few years ahead of you though. Dan Kovalik (09:33): A few years, yeah, yeah. I know I look old, but I'm not quite old enough to cross paths with Mr. Robeson. But why is that important? Because of course that involved claims that the communists were somehow how stooges of the Soviet Union. And now of course you have people making allegations that those opposing US foreign policy are pawns of Russia and Vladimir Putin. Right. So it's the same old trope that we've been hearing for years and years, and we see this manifested in the last two weeks with the Justice Department announcing indictments against people associated with rt, formerly known as Russia Today News based in Moscow. You had Anthony Blinken statements over the weekend that RT should be considered an espionage organization that means a spy organization. And of course the implication being that those Americans that work with it are spies. And then you had Hillary Clinton chiming in, I believe yesterday, saying that people spreading propaganda, Russian propaganda should be civilly if not criminally prosecuted. And so again, welcome to McCarthyism 2.0. It's a very scary time for people who, I'll just say like me, I'll only speak for myself who want to advocate for peace, but also specifically advocate for peace with Russia who say Russia's not our enemy who go to Russia. I've been to Russia five times in the last two years. (11:26): I've been to the Donbas three times to Crimea once to the Kherson region of what was Ukraine once. And I have worked with RT proudly so, but I and others like me are now in the crosshairs of the US government. And they're not even hiding it. They're being very clear that we are enemy number one at this point. Wilmer Leon (11:51): And this is important for people to understand because as you just mentioned, they've indicted two Americans living in Russia who are Russian citizens. They work for rt. The Feds are accusing them of spreading propaganda. And what they are basically doing is they're challenging the narrative of the Biden administration. And unlike what transpired during World War I, as you talked about Eugene Debs, and also what happened during World War ii, right now, last I checked, the United States has not declared war on Russia. So we are not in a war footing or on a war footing right now. These are individuals that, and I am one who is challenging the narrative of the Biden administration as it relates to what's going on in Ukraine as it relates to what's going on with China over Taiwan, what's going on in Venezuela, what's going on in the Middle East. There are a number of areas where I believe, and I think I have historic and current evidence to support the position that the established stated narrative of the administration is flat out wrong. Dan Kovalik (13:18): Yes, absolutely. And again, Anthony Blinken was very specific about that. He said that rt, that its alleged propaganda has undermined the cause of the war in Ukraine. But as you say, while the US is defacto at war with Russia, it is not officially at war with Russia. It is not declared war on Russia. And as you know, the US rarely declares war anymore. Only Congress can declare war. And rarely does it do that. We usually go to war again, not officially unofficially with countries without declaring war. So we are not officially at war with Russia, which means that those who work with Russia or Russia related entities are not engaged in sedition of any kind. (14:12): But that is what is being claimed. Now, I mean, that is being specifically claimed that we are in fact involved in sedition. And by the way, I know people, Wilmer friends of mine that are fleeing the country. Oh, really? Oh yeah. A number of people and some to Russia, but some to other places, Canada, other places for fear, they're going to be prosecuted because of their work with rt. And no, it's very serious. I know several people, I won't name them. I think I can name one because he's already done it. So he is safe there. And that's Jackson Henkel. Wilmer Leon (14:55): Oh, okay. Dan Kovalik (14:57): But there's others in the process of doing that. Some people have urged me to do that. So we have a very serious situation, and I understand why people would make that choice, because really the government is signaling that they may go after us. So it makes some sense, Wilmer Leon (15:21): And we're going to get to that with you in just a few moments because there, there's another, there are a number of facets of this that if you look at these things individually, people may have a tendency to think, oh, well, this is just a one-off here, or a one-off there. But when you start connecting these dots, what you find out is the government is engaged in incredibly fascist behavior, and they are establishing policies. When Hillary Clinton, former Secretary of State, former First Lady comes on television and starts talking about people who are spewing propaganda need to be considered for facing criminal charges. What's the difference between her saying that here in the United States and some of the incredibly repressive policies that have been and are in place by some people that she and other members of the current administration label as dictators label as strong men label as fascists? Dan Kovalik (16:37): No, I mean, of course there's no difference. I mean, and think about it. The US has voice of America, which again, openly broadcast US viewpoints around the world and in particular in countries that the US is hostile towards. Radio Liberty is a similar one in Europe, but frankly, you don't even have to point to those because now frankly, most of the US media operates like those. They're nothing but mouthpieces For the US government, I would put NPR in that category, C-N-N, M-S-N-B-C, and of course the iron. And if those stations or those broadcasting systems are jammed in other countries or people associated with those entities are arrested or persecuted, of course the US is the first one to claim foul. Right? But of course, the other irony here is that M-S-NBC, which is the station that Hillary Clinton made her statements on, and Rachel Maddow, they have been propagandists themselves in terms of pushing these lies about Russian interference. They've been pushing these lies for eight years now. And Hillary Clinton herself was one of the main origins of that lie, which has been debunked, (18:02): Almost entirely and right. So they are pushing propaganda and they're pushing war propaganda again, specifically against Russia. They themselves are guilty of war propaganda, which is by the way, a war crime under international law. But so talk about calling the kettle black, or in fact, they're calling the China, the China plates black when they're the ones that are engaged in propaganda. Wilmer Leon (18:32): In fact, there's a, I'm trying to pull it up right now. There's an NBC story from a while ago from 2022 where they admitted to using propaganda to fool American people. And in fact, the author of the story is a journalist, Ken Delan, who by the way I believe had been dismissed from the LA Times because he was clearing stories through the CIA before the stories were being submitted to his editors at the LA Times. That's history. But there was a story back from 2022 where NBC admitted that they're involved in his propaganda war with Russia and that they will lie to the American people in order to get out in front of a story before the Russians can tell the story or to mislead the Russians. And so the United States government em, it does it to the American people itself Dan Kovalik (19:41): All the time. We know this happens all the time. Another classic case was Judith Miller at the New York Times, who was doing nothing but writing CIA propaganda at the behest of the CIA, which led it helped lead us to the war in Iraq. And in fact, the CIA credited her reporting for helping pave the way to the war with Iraq. And of course one of the big lies of the war, the weapons of mass destruction was a lie that she promoted and incredibly, she's landed on her feet. She was let go or forced to resign for the New York Times because that came out. But now she works for CNN. I mean these folks, it's really not a negative mark on their career if they do this sort of thing. John Stockwell just mentioned John Stockwell, I don't know if you remember him well, I do. But he was a CIA Bureau chief at Angola. He talked about how the CIA would write stories that they would've published in the press, and he gave one example. He said, we once wrote a story about Cuban troops who were fighting US backed forces in Angola, and who by the way helped liberate Southern Africa and South Africa, as you know, Wilmer. (21:06): He said they would claim Cuban troops had raped these women in Angola. Then they'd write a story saying the Cuban troops were killed. And then he said, incredibly, they'd write another story about the same Cuban troop unit somehow revived from the dead doing something else. And yet the press printed it without question. And this happens, and Hollywood's the same way. Hollywood is very much under the sway of the ca. If I can just give one example of that famous interesting example, if you've ever seen the movie, which I like quite a bit, meet the Parents, pretty funny movie. There's a scene in which Ben Stiller, the main character, goes into Robert De Niro's layer for the first time and discovers he's with the ccia. Originally, the script had it that he found he was with the CIA because there was a CIA torture manual de Niro's desk. Well, the CIA who reviewed the script and reviews many scripts in Hollywood, you can't do that. So they ended up just having photos of De Niro with Bin Laden and Clinton and different things. So a lot of what we watch on TV in the movies and reading the newspaper, a lot of that is clear through the ccia, if not utterly based on CIA misinformation that they feed to the press. Wilmer Leon (22:42): And let me connect these dots. I found the story and here's the headline. This is from NBC News in a Break with the Past. Now that's a lie. Us is using intel to fight an info war with Russia, even when the intel isn't rock solid. It doesn't have to be solid intelligence. One US official said it's more important to get out ahead of them, the Russians Putin specifically before they do something. So this is NBC admitting that they're using less than accurate intel in stories that they're telling to the American public. They're basically lying in order to further a narrative. And we can take this back to the Iraq War with the Office of Special Plans, which was set up in the Pentagon to take intel that hadn't been vetted and spin it into stories that would support the US narrative about why the United States needed the whole idea of weapons of mass destruction. And Dick Cheney's letter about yellow cake uranium coming from Niger, okay, why are we getting into these weeds? Because the United States government is attacking American citizens, independent journalists for telling the truth about stories that are challenging the standard narrative when the United States government admits itself, it's lying to you. And this is in violation of the First Amendment, professor Dan Kalik. Is that a good summation of the issue? Dan Kovalik (24:38): It's a very good summation. You often hear, for example, someone like myself will say, oh, there's neo-Nazis in Ukraine. Which by the way, before 2022, even a lot of the mainstream press reported on that, right? Wilmer Leon (24:55): I won't say even Barack Obama said, one of the reasons we don't want to send weapons to Ukraine is because we don't want to give weapons to the Nazis. Dan Kovalik (25:01): Yeah. Not only did Barack Obama talk about it, there was a law passed by Congress that I think Obama signed saying that the US could not fund neo-Nazis in Ukraine. Well, I don't think they passed the law just because theoretically there might be because they knew there were Nazis in Ukraine, and then in fact, that law was repealed because they later decided, oh, well, we need to support Nazis in Ukraine. Okay, so everyone admitted there's Nazis in Ukraine. Then once the special military operations of Russia began in February of 2022, all of the press all of a sudden pretended, oh, there's no Nazis there. Okay? So now after that, if someone like me who's actually been to the Don Bass, which was part of Ukraine, says, oh yeah, there's neo-Nazis in Ukraine. They're like, well, that's a Putin talking point. Well, the fact it's a Putin talking point doesn't mean it's untrue. If Putin says the world is round, it doesn't mean the world is flat. (26:00): But that's what's happening. That is really the claim leveled against people who are trying to give a more balanced picture of what's happening in Ukraine as they're being portrayed as somehow being controlled by the Kremlin, when in fact they're just saying what the truth is. Even though, yeah, it may happen to correspond with what the Kremlin is saying, which I will say, I find the Kremlin a lot more credible on many of these issues than the White House, but other people have to judge that. But again, the fact that my views may overlap with those of the Kremlin at times doesn't mean I'm under their sway. Wilmer Leon (26:47): And let me give the reference those who want to look this up for themselves. Again, the headline of the story is in a Break with the Past US, is using intel to fight an in full war with Russia, even when the intel isn't rock solid. And the story is from April 6th and 2022 written by Ken Delan and others. And again, it's important to remember that again, Ken Delan was dismissed from the LA Times for writing stories, for sending stories to the CIA, having the CIA edit the stories, not telling the editors at the LA times that this was being done. So again, this shows you the kind of work and the kind of propaganda that is being sold to you as news. Now, there's another element to this because as we talked about before, there are a number of facets of this, and that is, again, in Consortium News, pro-Palestine students and faculty Sue UC, Santa Cruz, the lawsuit seeks to vindicate the fundamental democratic and constitutional rights to free speech, free assembly and due process against overreach by university authorities. So basically what has happened, and this story came was last week, September 11th, 2024. So if you all remember back in the spring, there were a number of protests across college campuses all over this country in support of the Palestinian efforts, and they were protesting against the genocidal action of Israel against Palestinians at the United States is supporting. And a number of students were arrested, and some students that were arrested at UC, what did I say, UC, Santa Barbara or UC, Santa Cruz (28:52): In the spring have now still been put off campus in violation of campus regulation. So they are suing the University of Santa Cruz to have that overturned. And just Tuesday, the University of Maryland now finds that care, the Council of American Islamic Relations, Palestine Legal, they are suing University of Maryland for canceling. And this is who would ever think to do something this horrific Jewish and Palestinian student groups holding an interfaith vigil? Dan Valick, the country is going to hell in a hand basket. Dan Kovalik (29:44): Yeah, absolutely. It's outrageous. I mean, what we see is violations of the First Amendment in many different ways. Not only the violation of free speech, of freedom of assembly, but of course freedom of religion because of course, the interfaith vigil would be an expression of religion. I don't see how these actions by Santa Cruz, which by the way, is part of the University of California system, that's a public school system. It means they are subject to the First Amendment. I don't see how those actions can stand if they do stand, if the courts allow them to stand, then we have entered a brave new world, my friend. I mean a very dangerous world by any precedent of the court, at least recent precedent, they should be permitted to have these types of protest in vigils. And I hope they win in the courts. They should win. Wilmer Leon (30:42): In fact, I remember saying after September 11th, as we looked at the crackdown that the United States government was imposing upon American citizens, that when a country violates its own constitution in reaction to action taken by terrorists, the terrorists have won. Dan Kovalik (31:06): Yeah, well, that's absolutely true. And of course, what we saw after nine 11 was an abomination in terms of the rights, not just of US citizens, but of others that were curtailed. The people put in Guantanamo Bay without charge. It turned out most of them had done nothing. Some died in jail, some died of torture. (31:34): It was a huge mark on American democracy. I believe there's still people there. It has not been there. I think there's a couple survivors still hanging on. It's an amazing thing. And of course then you had Barack Obama who decided he could murder American citizens with drones abroad on his own authority. And he killed one man who was claimed to have been a terrorist again, that had never been proven, that he had not been, that had not proven in a court of law. And then incredibly, they murdered his son, his 16-year-old son. And in defense, one of the White House spokespeople said, well, he chose the wrong father. Wilmer Leon (32:25): Eric Holder came out and said when he was the Attorney General, that an American president can execute American citizens anywhere in the world without judicial review. Dan Kovalik (32:37): Yeah, incredible. An incredible thing. And it's bad enough, frankly, Wilmer, that the government has done these sorts of things. But the sad part also is there's been so little resistance to this, so little criticism. And that's what allows these things to continue and not only continue, but to escalate Wilmer Leon (32:59): Quickly going back to the campus issue. So we're told that there has to be this prohibition against protesting in support of the Palestinians because we have to be mindful of the sensitivities of Jewish students, and we can't have these Jewish American students feeling threatened and feeling unsafe on the college campuses amidst these peaceful protests, ignoring the fact that a lot of the protestors are the very Jewish students who the authorities claim their rights are being protected. I believe I submit to you attorney Kovalik, that that is merely a cover or a pretext for the protection of these interests of these students is a pretext, is a cover that is being used by the government to violate our First Amendment rights the same way the Israeli government claims it has to engage in genocide of Palestinians as it attacks Hamas. Dan Kovalik (34:22): No, exactly right. Because the other issue, I mean, of course you're right that many Jews are protesting for Palestinians, but also what about the Palestinians rights? There's Palestinian students on campus, there's Arab students. What about their rights? Right? Wilmer Leon (34:37): What about my rights? I'm neither Palestinian nor Jewish, and I have this problem, and I know I'm nuts, Dan. I got a problem with genocide. I admit it. I admit America. I admit it to the world. I got a problem with genocide. Dan Kovalik (34:52): It's an incredible thing. Wilmer, what we've all been taught since World War II is that the worst crime in the world is genocide, right? It is the high crime. It is the most abominable crime. And even one of the worst things you could say about someone is they're a genocide denier, right? Wilmer Leon (35:15): Oh, yeah. Heaven forbid. Dan Kovalik (35:16): And now all of a sudden when people are protesting against genocide, they're the bad guys. And yet it's an incredible thing that is happening. It's an amazing Rubicon we've crossed, and no one can really defend it. That's the problem. And that is why there's repression. The universities, including some of the best in the world like Columbia University, which may be the main offender on this, they can't defend their actions. They can't defend the genocide. They can't defend against those saying it's a genocide. So they've decided we just have to shut the speech down because we as an institution, we have no argument. We can't ideologically defend this. We can't ideologically defend the United States. And so we're just going to say, students, you can't talk, which goes against every notion that anyone has about what the university is supposed to be, a space of free speech and free debate. And Zionists should have a right to their views. They should have a right to peacefully protest. And those are against Zionism. And the genocide should also have that right. And that is so obvious and so clear, and the fact that the universities have decided to go the other way and only repress one kind of speech, and that is pro-Palestinian and not pro-Israel. It's abominable. It just shows the corruption of our institutions from the universities all the way to the White House. Wilmer Leon (36:55): And it also, I believe, shows the power of the military industrial complex, or what Ray McGovern called the Mickey Mat, in that once you start challenging the narrative via free speech, you now threaten the defense budget. You now start threatening the billions of dollars in weapons that are being wasted in Ukraine, that are being wasted in Gaza, that are being wasted as the United States is trying to foment a Middle East war. And heaven forbid those billion dollar contracts that are going to Lockheed Martin, that are going to Boeing, that are going to ge, Raytheon, heaven forbid, people start asking questions about why is so much money being wasted on genocide? Dan Kovalik (37:53): Yeah, no, exactly. That's correct. When we look around our cities, we look around this country, we see so many problems that need fixing, and people are saying, Hey, why aren't you fixing our problems instead of sending money abroad to these wars in Ukraine and Gaza? Those are very inconvenient people to the powers that be, and not just to the military industrial complex, but apparently we know that in the case of Columbia University, that they responded to calls by millionaires in New York City who asked them to repress the protest. So we know the ruling class is very much in the tank for Israel, very much in the tank for the genocide in Gaza, and that they are influencing these universities and how they respond to this. Wilmer Leon (38:45): And let's connect another dot. And that is the trial in Tampa, Florida that just wrapped up last week in the Uru, the African People Socialist Party, also known as the Uhuru movement or the Uhuru three. There was an incredibly confusing verdict that came down in that trial. It was alleged that the defendants were doing the bidding of the Russian government by sowing discord in America's political process by promoting political views that were contrary to those of the United States government and favorable to those of the Russian government. Now, I got to reiterate, they're not talking about overthrowing the government. They're not talking about attacking the government sowing discord, their own words in America's political process by promoting political views, not military political views that are contrary to those of the United States government. So well, go ahead, Dan. You want to say something? Dan Kovalik (40:00): Yeah. Well, that's exactly what the First Amendment is supposed to protect, are controversial views that go against the government. I mean, right? You don't need the First Amendment to protect speech that is pro-government, right? I mean, that's kind of obvious. If the First Amendment only protected pro-government speech, it wouldn't be much of a protection at all. As people say, you have to protect inconvenience speech and dissident speech. And so it's amazing that this prosecution went forward. Apparently, I guess they were convicted of conspiracy, but not some of the other charges. And by the way, let's say a couple things about it. First of all, I'm not sure they influenced anyone. I never heard of this organization to be totally honest, until this, right, until this indictment came down. And so number one, so they don't have much influence at all. Number two, I think this was over like 500 bucks in a donation they got for some Russian 500 bucks. Meanwhile, APAC is giving over a hundred million dollars in this election cycle to people's election campaigns. APAC owned Wilmer Leon (41:15): And Corey Bush Co Bush lost because of those efforts. And Jamal Bowman in New York lost because of those efforts. So not only is APAC donating and it's a hundred million by their admission in the New York Times, they were successful in their efforts. Dan Kovalik (41:36): They claim they were successful in every effort, every person, they backed one. And this has been true for years, of course, this type of influence. In fact, John F. Kennedy tried to make APAC liable under the Foreign Agent Registration Act, which is the act that the Arru group was prosecuted. And of course, Kennedy was not able to do so, and he was actually killed shortly after. You can draw your own conclusions. APAC has been this huge elephant in the living room, a huge influencer of American politics for many, many years. And yet, who's getting prosecuted for that? No one. No one. They go after these small fish Wilmer Leon (42:28): To make a big point. Dan Kovalik (42:29): Yeah, Wilmer Leon (42:30): Small fish to make a big point. And so this was an incredibly bizarre verdict because they weren't, as you mentioned, they weren't found guilty of failing to register as agents of the Russian government. They were convicted of conspiring to fail to register as agents of the government. Dan Kovalik (42:54): Incredible. It's absolutely incredible. Wilmer Leon (42:57): So the jury said that Chairman Omali Yeshitela and the other two defendants agreed to become unregistered agents of the Russian government, but didn't actually become agents of the Russian government. Dan Kovalik (43:15): They wanted to be agents, but Russian didn't care. They didn't want them to be agents, whatever. It's absolutely bizarre. And that we could talk about this all day. I mean, again, I'm a lawyer. I study criminal law, and that sort of, to get someone on that, that becomes just a thought crime. They literally did nothing they made, Wilmer Leon (43:35): Which by the way, isn't a crime, Dan Kovalik (43:36): Right? No, you're right. I mean, again, because that would be a First Amendment violation. We were not supposed to prosecute thoughts. And the idea is, oh, I wanted to do something. Well, that's not enough to convict someone. I mean, it's completely outrageous. And I think their case is on appeal, if I'm not mistaken. If it is, I really hope they win. I mean, God bless 'em. They really are the test case here for the rest of us. I mean, I think the government went after this small group that no one heard of because they figured no one would support them. They go after them first, make some bad precedent for the rest of us, then start going after the rest of us, which means it's a very important case. Wilmer Leon (44:22): And the prosecution, the government was unable to present hardly any witnesses. They had hardly any evidence because this was 95% fiction. It was just flat fiction. And I think what also the government didn't expect was the attention that this was going to bring. The courtroom was full of supporters for the Uhuru. They've been around since about 1972, and they've done incredible work in the communities that they work in. And so now final data point, as I understand it, you Dan Kalik we're coming back into this country last week. Dan Kovalik (45:14): Yeah, Friday. Last Friday, yeah. Wilmer Leon (45:16): I'll let you tell the story. Dan Kovalik (45:19): Yeah. So I was coming back from the anti-fascist Congress in Venezuela. Wilmer Leon (45:26): Yeah, Dan Kovalik (45:27): I believe, Wilmer Leon (45:28): Oh, wait a minute. See, I knew when I saw that white jacket, when I saw that white jacket Dan Kovalik (45:32): Knew something was bad. Yeah, they used to say they were premature. I guess that's what I'm, but anyway, I came back through Bolivia. And to be, make a long story short, I was held for four hours. I was interrogated where, what airport in Miami, which is not the airport, you really do want to come back through. But I was asked about my travels, about who I meet with, about my connections, my political beliefs. They Wilmer Leon (46:07): Asked you about your political beliefs. Dan Kovalik (46:09): Oh, yeah. Well, I mean, it was all about what countries do you like? What countries do you not like and do you feel most comfortable? What countries are you most afraid of? I said, honestly, the one I'm in right now because I get treated like this. And then Wilmer Leon (46:27): What was their reaction to that answer? Dan Kovalik (46:29): Well, they were a little defensive, but tried to continue with the conversation and then, well, even before, so before they got deeply into the questioning, they searched all my bags and took my cell phone and my computer. By the end of the evening, I did get my computer back, but my phone, I did not get back. And I just got it back this morning. So that would've been about three or four days they had it. And we know, I mean, you can Google this. There's a lot of stories about it. They have the right outside New York City. We can get into the exception outside of JFK and LaGuardia. They have the right everywhere else to take your phone and copy the whole thing, copy your computer, which I imagine they've done, which is an incredible privacy violation. As you can imagine. Most people have a heart attack if that happened to 'em. And it was clear, it was motivated by my trips to Russia, Venezuela, other countries. And in fact, I've been subject to secondary interrogation, which is what it's called at the border in the airports a number of times since I first started going to Russia about two years ago, I've been stopped. That was probably my fourth or fifth time being stopped. (48:02): I was told in Chicago when I was stopped some months ago, that I have a case number with the State Department that marked me for this type of interrogation. And other people like Danny Shaw, who's a friend of mine, a colleague of mine, he also was stopped Wilmer Leon (48:21): Friend of ours. Yeah, Dan Kovalik (48:23): Stopped for three hours. His phone was taken. I mean, he's Scott Ritter. Wilmer Leon (48:27): That was in Chicago. Dan Kovalik (48:28): Danny was stopped Wilmer Leon (48:29): In Chicago. Dan Kovalik (48:29): Chicago. Scott Ritter's house in New York was raided by the FBI. They took his phone and computer. So look, the hunt is on. There's no question about that. I do want to give one caveat, I mentioned this exception in New York City. There is a judge in New York, the federal court in New York who held in her court district, in her court jurisdiction, which covers JFK and LaGuardia. They cannot take your computer and phone without a search warrant. So people out there, Wilmer, if you're doing international travel, try to come back through JFK because Wilmer Leon (49:13): Thank you. I was just going to ask you about the warrant because this seems to be another violation. You're supposed to be secure in your person and your papers. Last I checked, and I'm not a lawyer. I did go to law school and I did stay at Holiday Inn Express. So there seemed to be a number of violations beyond the First Amendment when they start to detain you and they start to seize your property without warrants. Dan Kovalik (49:50): Yes. Well, the problem we have, Wilmer is outside the jurisdiction in New York, the courts have held that customs has the right to hold you even up to 72 hours, Wilmer without a lawyer interrogate you and to take your phone computer and copy it. They have held that until you get through the customs and immigration, Wilmer Leon (50:20): You're not officially in the country. Dan Kovalik (50:22): You're not in the United States of America. The Constitution does not apply to you. That's an incredible, incredible thing. Most Americans have no idea of it, and most Americans won't experience the repercussions of that. (50:36): But what that means, until you go through passport control and get your bag and go through those double doors and push on those double doors and go into the main terminal, they really have the power of God over you. And again, most people have no idea about that. And so what the government's decided to do is, okay, we're not going to even worry about getting a warrant. We won't even send the FBI to Dan Aleks home. We don't have to do that. We wait until he leaves the country. He comes back because he travels all the time, and we'll do things to him and take things from him. We could never do without a warrant and without an attorney being present if he's interrogated, et cetera. It's an incredible violation of our rights, as you say, Wilmer. But it is totally sanctioned, at least at this moment by the courts, except for that court in New York City. Wilmer Leon (51:33): So and where did they approach you? You're coming through the jet way. You're coming off, you're deplaning, you're coming through the jet way. So when you come out of the jet way to the terminal, what happened? Dan Kovalik (51:51): Well, so just as almost every time, so only one time this happened to me in Chicago recently. They were waiting for me off the plane. Right outside the plane. In theJet. (52:05): Yeah. The only time that happened, in fact, as we were descending, they announced in the plane is we were descending. Please have your passports ready when you exit the plane. They checked everyone's passports. When they got to me, they stopped checking because they had their guy and they took me to be interrogated. Now, there was only time that happened every other time, including this time in Miami. I get off the plane, I walk all that way. Usually it's a long walk all the way to passport control. I get in the line, I get up to the passport agent, she checks my passport, had a few questions, and I'm thinking maybe I'm going to be okay this time. And then she said, please stand over there. And I knew what that meant. Wilmer Leon (53:00): Did you say, go stand in the corner Dan Kovalik (53:02): And face the wall, basically. And she put a little orange slip over my passport and another guy comes out, he takes my passport and says, come with me. And I'm brought into another room with a bunch of other people, and I sat there for probably an hour. Other people were getting processed very quickly. After an hour, a customs officer came and said, please come with me with your baggage. And she said, now she begins, I'm sorry, Wilmer. She lied. Okay. She begins to make up this story. She says, you're subject to a random drug search from Bolivia because a lot of people are bringing in drugs. So we're going to check your bags and then I'm going to ask you a few questions. We'll let you go. And this is just a random, but she checks all my bags that she does, but she doesn't have a sniffer dog and she doesn't check my prescription pill bottles, which could have drugs in them. She didn't check my coffee I brought in, which could have drugs in them. Clearly this is theater. (54:08): And she says, as part of our search, we can take your phone and your computer. We're going to do that, but we're only going to search for issues related to drugs. Whether you told someone you have drugs or you swallow drugs. But then when she takes me to another room for interrogation, there's no questions about drugs. It's all about what countries do you visit? Do you meet with government officials? Do you know government officials? Do you know presidents of other countries? Again, what countries you feel comfortable in? What countries do you not feel comfortable in? (54:45): That sort of thing, which indicates that was the real reason for me being pulled over was my travels and political beliefs, not the drug stuff. That was just a lie, I think, to get me feeling comfortable enough to talk to them. So there you go. That's what happened. Again, it took me days to get my phone back again. You can read about it. The customs now copies thousands of phones a year. They put 'em on a database. All of that information is on the database for 15 years, and all 3000 customs officials have access to it. So some guy in whatever Oklahoma's board during his lunch can go eat his sandwich and look at my data. I mean, it's an amazing thing. Wilmer again, most Americans have no idea this is happening. Wilmer Leon (55:48): Wow. The land of the free and the home of the brave. So it's also important for people to understand this is happening during a democratic administration. Dan Kovalik (56:00): Yes. And especially because it's democratic. We know from the New York Times, an article about three weeks ago, talked about the FBI, investigating people for connections with Russia and rt, and they said specifically that this was ordered by President Joe Biden. So this is not an accident. This isn't just the bureaucracy doing what they do or the deep state. This has been ordered by a democratic president to happen. Wilmer Leon (56:30): And we also know that more whistleblowers were prosecuted during the Obama administration than any other administration in history. Dan Kovalik (56:40): Indeed, indeed. Wilmer Leon (56:44): Dan Kovalik, professor Dan Kovalik. Man, thank you so much for your time. I truly, truly appreciate. First of all, I'm very sorry that you as an American went through this. I'm even more aggrieved that you as a friend went through this. Thank you. But thank you for joining me today, Dan Kovalik (57:04): Wilmer. It's always a pleasure and you are a friend, and I admire you a lot, and I look forward to the next time we talk. Wilmer Leon (57:11): Well, man, appreciate it. And folks, thank you all so much for listening to the Connecting to Dots podcast with me, Dr. Wiler Leon. Stay tuned for new episodes every week. Also, please follow and subscribe. Leave a review, share the show, follow us on social media. You can see all the links below in the show description. And remember, this is where the analysis of politics, culture, and history converge, talk without analysis is just chatter. And we don't chatter here on connecting the dots. See you again next time. Until then, I'm Dr. Wilmer Leon. Have a great one. Peace. I'm out Announcer (57:51): Connecting the dots with Dr. Wilmer Leon, where the analysis of politics, culture, and history converge.    

Thanks for finding our podcast! We are a family of 5 who does most of our travel using points and miles and we share how we leverage credit card welcome offers to earn a ton of points/miles so we can afford travel as a larger familyFollow us on Instagram @TravelPartyof5Click here to apply for the Chase Sapphire Cards  - we use these points to book all our Hyatt hotels. And if you've already got one of the Chase Sapphire cards, you'll want to apply for these business cards, linked here. _____________________This episode is the first episode in a series all around visiting the great state of Arizona!!! First up - we explore everything you need to know when you visit Arizona, with a focus on where to stay in Scottsdale and where to stay in Phoenix and Tempe. Whether you're a first-time visitor or a seasoned traveler, we'll help you find the perfect place to stay while sharing tips on how to make the most of your trip using points and miles.We start by discussing why Arizona is a top travel destination, especially for those interested in experiencing the beauty of the desert landscape. From the best time of year to visit Arizona to how to handle the summer heat and cooler winter months, we break down the key points to consider before booking your trip. Whether you want to explore the outdoors or just relax by the pool, this episode will give you all the essential details for planning your visit to Arizona.Next, we dive into where to stay in Scottsdale, covering a range of hotels and resorts that cater to different travel styles. If you're using points, we highlight some excellent options for Hyatt, Marriott, Hilton, and IHG members. For those wondering where to stay in Scottsdale, we recommend the Hyatt House and Hyatt Place in Old Town for convenient access to shopping, dining, and nightlife. For a more luxurious experience, we suggest the Andaz Scottsdale and the Royal Palms, which offer unique, upscale settings perfect for couples or special occasions. If you're traveling with family, we also explore the soon-to-be Grand Hyatt Scottsdale, a fantastic choice for family-friendly accommodations.For Marriott points users, we discuss where to stay in Scottsdale, such as the JW Marriott Camelback Inn Resort & Spa and the Phoenician. Both properties offer luxury and comfort with beautiful views and top-notch service, making them ideal for romantic getaways or family vacations. If you're looking for where to stay in Scottsdale using IHG or Hilton points, we mention options like the Holiday Inn Express and the Hilton Garden Inn, both centrally located in Old Town Scottsdale. For a more extravagant stay, the Fairmont Princess is a top pick, especially during the holiday season when the property transforms into a winter wonderland perfect for families.Beyond Scottsdale, we also guide you through where to stay in Phoenix if your trip includes events, concerts, or sports games. We suggest properties like the Hyatt Regency Downtown Phoenix and the Kimpton Palomar, both of which are great choices if you're looking for where to stay in Phoenix and want to be close to Chase Field or Talking Stick Resort Arena. These hotels offer convenience for those wanting to stay near the heart of the action while enjoying top-tier amenities.So, if you're planning to visit Arizona, tune in to this episode for the full rundown on where to stay in Scottsdale, where to stay in Phoenix, and how to make your trip unforgettable. Whether you're traveling for relaxation, adventure, or a special event, we've got you covered with all the tips and tricks you need to make your Arizona trip a success!

I don't require luxury accommodations. I'm fine with economy hotels. I prefer not to be put up in the home of a family with small children. A Holiday Inn Express is fine; they serve a nice scrambled-egg breakfast buffet. A coffeemaker in the room would be nice and I'd prefer a shower whose Hot and Cold knobs are not directly under the showerhead so that one must stand naked while figuring out which knob is which, dreading the possibility of being scalded and having to call 911 and moaning in pain as EMTs haul me to their van, and I know that I will now become their anecdote (“You won't believe the call we got this morning …”) and they will google me and find out that I hosted “Pie Aroma in Microphone” and am in the Academy of Arts and Letters and yet I didn't know to Stand Outside The Shower While Turning On Water. I don't want to become a joke, okay? This is a public episode. If you'd like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit garrisonkeillor.substack.com/subscribe

H is for home. Since last year, for the first time in our lives, we have split our time between two homes, both starting with "H." Hurst, Texas, and Hot Springs Village, Arkansas. But last night we spent a night in another "H" home - Holiday Inn Express in Hurst, Texas. Yes, we had a good reason. When you're having knee surgery and your bedroom is upstairs...you improvise. That meant finding a local hotel for at least one night to avoid the staircase. Enter Holiday Inn Express at 820 Thousand Oaks Drive, Hurst, Texas - mere miles away. It all began when I was told I'd be on crutches at least for the first day following having my knee scoped. I hopped on one of those online find-a-hotel websites. How often do you search for a hotel in the city where you live? Me? Never. I was looking for location, reviews, and pricing. There were several hotels in the area where I was looking. All of them were close to the highway, which would be necessary because I had work the next day and wanted to be able to jump on the highway quickly. My wife chauffering me. I read a few reviews and settled on the Holiday Inn Express in Hurst, Texas. My surgery was in another DFW suburb, Southlake. But I wanted to be back in the Hurst area #TexasHome. Besides, it was mere seconds from the highway I needed for the following morning. The accommodations were ideal: king bed, mini frig, microwave, desk, sofa and coffee table, walk in shower (one of those kind without any door), and breakfast starting at 6:30 am. I booked it for one night, paying a few bucks extra for the right to cancel it and get a full refund - just in case my surgeon had to change my schedule (he didn't). Check in was 4 pm. Ok, no problem maybe I can check in early if necessary. I get all those usual pre-surgery calls you get. You answer a million questions and they confirm a schedule. Then days later they may change the schedule, pushing the surgery up or back. Mine was pushed up slightly. "Check in by 7:15 am," they said. Okay. I'm thinking check-in at the hotel is 4 pm. That's gonna be a problem because I'm likely going to be awake and checked out of the surgical center by 11 am. So I call the hotel directly. Let me introduce you to Susan Watts-Martinez, General Manager of the Holiday Inn Express in Hurst, Texas. She answered the phone patiently listening to my dilemma. She looked up my reservation, noticing I booked it through an online website. She confirmed I had booked a king room. "I'm happy to pay a little extra to check in early," I said. "No problem, I can take care of you, Mr. Cantrell," she assured me. This was a couple of weeks in advance of my surgery so she made notes in their system that I'd need a room ready to go before noon. Yes, I told her I was coming there following surgery in Southlake. "We'll take good care of you," said Susan. "Just call us that morning. I'll be here by 7:30 am. That way we'll make sure your room is ready." I thanked her and thought no more about it. Until we checked in. As I crutched my way into the lobby Susan came outside and said, "Randy?" "Yes, ma'am." "Enjoy your stay and we hope you have a speedy recovery," she said. I thanked her and went inside making my way to the first room on the first floor, just past the front desk and workout room. Convenient and a short amble down the hall. We enter the room and straight away I notice on the coffee table a bundle of homemade chocolate chip cookies and two bottles of water with the above note sitting nearby. Handwritten Note From Holiday Inn Express, Hurst, Texas "Look at this, "I said to my wife. We remarked how nice that was, then I noticed a large white gift bag with a black ribbon tying the handles together. "What's this?" I asked. I opened it and found a new 50" x 70" gray chenille throw. 50" x 70" gray chenille throw I immediately unpacked it and laid down on the bed on top of the covers noting how hard it would be to maneuver under t...

583. Part 1 of our most recent conversation with Ed Branley, also known as the NOLA History Guy. "The clanging of a streetcar's bell conjures images of a time when street railways were a normal part of life in the city. Historic Canal Street represents the common ground between old and new with buses driving alongside steel rails and electric wires that once guided streetcars. New Orleans was one of the first cities to embrace street railways, and the city's love affair with streetcars has never ceased. New Orleans: The Canal Streetcar Line showcases photographs, diagrams, and maps that detail the rail line from its origin and golden years, its decline and disappearance for almost 40 years, and its return to operation. From the French Quarter to the cemeteries, the Canal Line ran through the heart of the city and linked the Creole Faubourgs with the new neighborhoods that stretched to Lake Pontchartrain" (Hickory Stick Bookshop).     "A former High School History teacher turned computer consultant and trainer, Branley was born just north of Boston, MA, in 1958. His family moved to New Orleans when he was two, and he's called metro NOLA home ever since. Educated by the Brothers of the Sacred Heart at Brother Martin High School in Gentilly (Class of 1976), he also holds a B.A. in Secondary Education from the University of New Orleans (Class of 1980). Branley taught at Redeemer High School before opening his own computer consulting business. He continues to teach, primarily in the computer specialty of Storage Area Networking." An avid fan of streetcar and public bus transportation, Branley's first book New Orleans, the Canal Streetcar Line, won critical acclaim across the city (Amazon). Now available: Liberty in Louisiana: A Comedy. The oldest play about Louisiana, author James Workman wrote it as a celebration of the Louisiana Purchase. Now it is back in print for the first time in 220 years. Order your copy today! This week in Louisiana history. July 20 1661 Piere LeMoyne Iberville born This week in New Orleans history. July 21, 1967. The Green Bridge (the unofficial local name of the Paris Road Bridge) carrying Louisiana Highway 47 across the Mississippi River Gulf Outlet between St. Bernard Parish and New Orleans opened on July 21, 1967. The bridge replaced the Paris Road pontoon bridge. The name "the Green Bridge" came from it originally being painted green. About 1980 it was repainted brown, and more recently grey, but locals continued referring to it as "the green bridge". (Wiki) This week in Louisiana. 13th Annual Bayou BBQ Bash Event Dates: July 26th-27th, 2024 Presented by the Morgan City Marine Corps League The annual Bayou BBQ Bash is a BCA Sanctioned State Championship BBQ Competition held rain or shine in Morgan City, LA each July. Thursday, July 25, 2024 Meet the cooks and enjoy the unveiling of LA Shrimp & petroleum Festival Poster  Holiday Inn Express   5:30 p.m. – 8 p.m. Friday, July 26, 2024 BBQ Bash will be under the U.S. 90 Bridge in Morgan City.  There will be food vendors, arts, and crafts from 4 p.m. -9:30 p.m., and live music by Cliff Hillebran from 6 p.m. – 9 p.m. Saturday, July 27, 2024 There will be arts & crafts and food vendors at 10 a.m., DJ from 10 a.m. – 1 p.m., and live music by South 70 from 1 p.m. – 4 p.m. Come join and enjoy some food anytime. For more information, please contact Bill at (985) 384-3446 (985) 372-8880 email at wgoessl@hotmail.com. Postcards from Louisiana. Cajun Band on Royal Street. Listen on Apple Podcasts. Listen on audible. Listen on Spotify. Listen on TuneIn. Listen on iHeartRadio. The Louisiana Anthology Home Page. Like us on Facebook. 

Welcome to our new series, Icons & Experts. This exciting twice a month series is brought you by the Extended Stay Lodging Association and support from Dellisart Hospitality.  Please visit https://www.dellisart.com/ Every other week we'll highlight either a person who's had unmistakable impact on the hotel industry, or we'll learn from extended stay experts how to maximize opportunity and find success in the extended stay hotel category.  Our first episode features the incredible Mike Leven, an icon amongst icons in the hotel business. Leven has had significant impact on the hospitality industry from his early days  Dedicated business leader & visionary philanthropist with a rich 50-year career in the hospitality industry, notably including the successful launch of Holiday Inn Express, serving as President of Days Inn of America, leading the company through a reorganization that resulted in growth from a 225-unit regional chain to one of the largest brands in the world.  He also founded US Franchise Systems, Inc. (USFS), which franchises the Microtel Inns & Suites, Hawthorn Suites, and Best Inns and Best Suites hotel brands. Plus, he was instrumental in creating the Asian American Hotel Owners Association (AAHOA), served as President of Las Vegas Sands Corp. and has been involved in countless charitable efforts.  We hope you enjoy this series!

It's a weird one this week. Why? The Holiday Inn Express baby! It's a Detroit version of The Loftus Party Podcast with Michael Loftus! We'll begin with this: Happy green beer day, you sexy heathens! Did anyone have Mike Tyson recreating the plot of Rocky Balboa on their 2024 Bingo Card? Why is Congress so keen to ban TikTok and MORE? So, much comedy and news! And yeah, pretty stoked for the Talking Heads cover tune parody thing, too. My power grows!Want to show your support and get more, more, more? We've got you covered on Locals and Patreon! Join up! Start living!Support us on Locals https://locals.com/feed/21414/theloftuspartySupport us on Patreon https://www.patreon.com/theloftusparty/postsCome visit & sign up for our Newsletter theloftusparty.comAnd for all your sweet TLP merch, hit up the shop at https://the-loftus-party-store-2.creator-spring.com/Order the book Neither Stunning Nor Brave by Michael LoftusSubscribe to https://www.youtube.com/TheLoftusParty Follow us on Facebook https://www.facebook.com/theloftuspartyFollow us on X https://twitter.com/theloftusparty Follow us on Instagram https://www.instagram.com/theloftusparty/ Follow us on Rumble https://rumble.com/user/TheLoftusPartyFollow us on TikTok https://www.tiktok.com/@theloftuspartySubscribe to https://thatshowtonight.com/See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

Liz Crisafi took an unexpected route through the worlds of broadcasting, marketing, and advertising before she landed in hospitality as the Global Vice President of Integrated Marketing at InterContinental Hotels Group. But her passion for storytelling and people has been a constant driving force. After initially pursuing broadcast journalism in college and losing her Southern accent along the way, Liz realized the competitive field wasn't for her. So when a friend suggested she try marketing, mentioning the better pay and hours, she decided to pivot. As she says with a laugh, “Compared to broadcast, anything probably looked better at that point!” Her first marketing gig may not have been glamorous, selling agricultural chemicals. But Liz embraced the challenge to “make herbicides and pesticides interesting” with an ad campaign set in an OR trying to revive a giant dying potato. As Liz says, “It doesn't have to be boring, even if it's some random chem company or a B2B market.” Over the years, Liz learned to love marketing and honed her skills on iconic brands like Kodak. But it was the field of hospitality marketing that ultimately captured her heart when she joined IHG. As she puts it, “It's hospitality. I love travel. It was a great role for me and it's a great company. It checked all the boxes.” Now as IHG's Global VP of Integrated Marketing, she leads marketing efforts for the company's 19 brands and 6000 destinations worldwide. But she's quick to note, “Our best product is our people that walk in and out of those hotel doors every day.” Of course, marketing such a diverse portfolio of hotel brands poses unique challenges. As Liz explains, “You have to be relevant in the moment and make sure you're co-creating experiences, not just relying on past data.” From road warriors staying at a Holiday Inn Express to couples celebrating at a glamorous InterContinental, IHG aims to deliver personalized and meaningful stays. And while Liz loves the creativity of marketing, she's learned over the years not to take things too seriously either. “Take your work seriously, but don't take yourself too seriously,” she advises. “We're not curing cancer here, we're marketing.”

Whether you want to earn airline elite status from the comfort of your couch or switch alliances without starting from scratch, this week we talk about how you can score shortcuts to get the status you want. 00:00 Intro 02:28 Giant Mailbag 02:51 Greg-a-culpa 04:43 Nick-a-culpa: Air France actually does have an award chart https://viewfromthewing.com/air-france-introduces-new-award-chart-free-stopovers/ 07:09 T-Tip 11:53 Card Talk: Frontier Airlines World Mastercard https://frequentmiler.com/f9/ 22:00 Mattress Running the Numbers: SimplyMiles stack for Holiday Inn or Holiday Inn Express https://frequentmiler.com/simplymiles-spend-100-at-holiday-inn-or-holiday-inn-express-earn-930-aadvantage-miles-loyalty-points/ 29:04 Award Talk: AA enhancements 29:50 Apply systemwide upgrades online 30:24 Earn miles when paying for upgrades 31:20 Cancel basic economy and get something back for $99 32:13 Loyalty Point choice benefit 34:58 Main Events: Shortcuts to airline elite status 35:00 What is airline elite status? 38:36 Lots of shortcuts exist 39:36 Having credit cards to get perks 41:56 Earning elite status through credit card spend 47:11 Shopping for status 49:56 Status matches 50:47 American Airlines status match 54:44 Delta status match 56:05 United status match 58:18 Alaska status match 58:38 Turkish status match 01:05:58 Southwest A-list status match 01:08:47 Buying status 01:13:27 Other ways to get elite status 01:17:00 Air France: earn XPs without flying 01:18:29 Question of the Week: Is it safe to complete spending for stuff on 12/31? Music credit: Annie Yoder

Destiny Lenai Johnson, a 25-year-old woman from Miami, is facing serious felony charges, including attempted murder, after an incident involving her Tinder date. The shocking incident occurred outside a hotel in Kendall, Florida, leading to Johnson's arrest.    According to Miami-Dade County records reviewed by PEOPLE, Johnson was arrested on November 25 and charged with attempted murder, first-degree arson, and aggravated battery causing great bodily harm. Johnson pleaded not guilty to these charges, and she is currently being held without bail at the Miami-Dade County's Turner Guilford Knight Correctional Center.    The arrest report, as reported by local sources, including The Miami-Herald, local NBC6, and WSVN, provides a disturbing account of the incident. Johnson and her alleged victim had arranged to meet at a Holiday Inn Express & Suites hotel. However, things took a terrifying turn when Johnson, seemingly irate, approached her date's car carrying a one-gallon jug of liquid.    According to the arrest report, Johnson asked her date for money to repair her car but then began yelling, claiming that someone was after her. She allegedly proceeded to pour gasoline into the passenger side of her date's SUV and ignited it with a lighter. As a result, both Johnson and the victim caught fire.    Johnson reportedly fled the scene, while the victim sought help at the hotel's front desk. He was subsequently transported to a local hospital to receive treatment for burns, as detailed in the arrest report.    Following the incident, police reportedly found Johnson in a state of undress, discussing having blown up a car. She, too, was taken to a local hospital for treatment of her burns.    Miami-Dade court records indicate that Johnson's next court appearance is scheduled for December 18. At this time, a Miami-Dade public information officer has not responded to requests for comment on the case.    This disturbing case highlights the dangers of online dating and serves as a reminder to exercise caution when meeting individuals from dating apps. The investigation into the incident is ongoing, and further details may emerge as the legal proceedings continue. Want to listen to ALL of our podcasts AD-FREE? Subscribe through APPLE PODCASTS, and try it for three days free: https://tinyurl.com/ycw626tj Follow Our Other Cases: https://www.truecrimetodaypod.com The latest on Catching the Long Island Serial Killer, Awaiting Admission: BTK's Unconfessed Crimes, Delphi Murders: Inside the Crime, Chad & Lori Daybell, The Murder of Ana Walshe, Alex Murdaugh, Bryan Kohberger, Lucy Letby, Kouri Richins, Malevolent Mormon Mommys, Justice for Harmony Montgomery, The Murder of Stephen Smith, The Murder of Madeline Kingsbury, and much more! Listen at https://www.truecrimetodaypod.com

Destiny Lenai Johnson, a 25-year-old woman from Miami, is facing serious felony charges, including attempted murder, after an incident involving her Tinder date. The shocking incident occurred outside a hotel in Kendall, Florida, leading to Johnson's arrest.    According to Miami-Dade County records reviewed by PEOPLE, Johnson was arrested on November 25 and charged with attempted murder, first-degree arson, and aggravated battery causing great bodily harm. Johnson pleaded not guilty to these charges, and she is currently being held without bail at the Miami-Dade County's Turner Guilford Knight Correctional Center.    The arrest report, as reported by local sources, including The Miami-Herald, local NBC6, and WSVN, provides a disturbing account of the incident. Johnson and her alleged victim had arranged to meet at a Holiday Inn Express & Suites hotel. However, things took a terrifying turn when Johnson, seemingly irate, approached her date's car carrying a one-gallon jug of liquid.    According to the arrest report, Johnson asked her date for money to repair her car but then began yelling, claiming that someone was after her. She allegedly proceeded to pour gasoline into the passenger side of her date's SUV and ignited it with a lighter. As a result, both Johnson and the victim caught fire.    Johnson reportedly fled the scene, while the victim sought help at the hotel's front desk. He was subsequently transported to a local hospital to receive treatment for burns, as detailed in the arrest report.    Following the incident, police reportedly found Johnson in a state of undress, discussing having blown up a car. She, too, was taken to a local hospital for treatment of her burns.    Miami-Dade court records indicate that Johnson's next court appearance is scheduled for December 18. At this time, a Miami-Dade public information officer has not responded to requests for comment on the case.    This disturbing case highlights the dangers of online dating and serves as a reminder to exercise caution when meeting individuals from dating apps. The investigation into the incident is ongoing, and further details may emerge as the legal proceedings continue. Want to listen to ALL of our podcasts AD-FREE? Subscribe through APPLE PODCASTS, and try it for three days free: https://tinyurl.com/ycw626tj Follow Our Other Cases: https://www.truecrimetodaypod.com The latest on Catching the Long Island Serial Killer, Awaiting Admission: BTK's Unconfessed Crimes, Delphi Murders: Inside the Crime, Chad & Lori Daybell, The Murder of Ana Walshe, Alex Murdaugh, Bryan Kohberger, Lucy Letby, Kouri Richins, Malevolent Mormon Mommys, Justice for Harmony Montgomery, The Murder of Stephen Smith, The Murder of Madeline Kingsbury, and much more! Listen at https://www.truecrimetodaypod.com