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On today's episode Dave discusses England's win over Denmark, then it's Discord Thursday! So Dave answers a variety of questions, from Jeff Bezos at Arsenal - team of the Euro semi-finals. Support this show http://supporter.acast.com/the-epl-index-podcast. See acast.com/privacy for privacy and opt-out information.

So much fun during this one, be sure to connect with David over at https://www.davidsandercott.com/ Insta: david_sandercott Brandon Handley 0:00 4321 Hey there spiritual dope I'm on today with David Sandercott a big thanks goes out they were just talking he, he and I were on together probably was about a month ago David and something in the ether chewed up. It's like, you know my dog ate my homework type of thing happened. And so Dave is back here again for a second round. I really appreciate coming back. So Dave is the author of 21 day meditation journey connect with spirit every day in a new way, a life and business coach and speaker, David is also excited to announce it he is now working with small businesses and large corporations. In 1998, David decided to be the shortest high fashion model ever. He also decided that he was going to meditate himself there. In 2001. David was the shortest male model ever to appear in Vogue magazine and the six page spread shot by Helmut Newton alongside supermodel Kate Dillon. Ever since David has been inspired to help others to achieve their dreams, David, thanks for being on today. How are you? Hey, thanks. David Sandercott 1:04 Happy to be your brand. You got the longer older bio there from the website? Is that right? Yeah, Brandon Handley 1:11 I did. I mean, I thought that was actually pretty short one I was I was happy. I was like, wow, you know, you don't have your whole life story there. Thank you. David Sandercott 1:17 Hey, good. I like I like short BIOS, Brandon Handley 1:20 is a good one. I enjoyed it. I enjoyed it. So well, you know, we start us off with the idea. Let's see if you remember everything that we did last time because it was perfect. The we start us off with the whole idea that source speaks through us for like just kind of this moment and purpose. And right now, you know, sources speaking through you to an audience member, and only the way that it can through you What does that message to that audience member today? David Sandercott 1:50 Wow, that's a great question. Brandon was gonna close my eyes and connect a little bit just to make sure I get it right. You know, I think that message is, you know, above anything is to believe in yourself, to love yourself. And to know that if you have the inspiration in your heart, if you have that reoccurring thought of this thing that you want to do, or that pool to do something, that you have everything you need within you to do that thing. And if you're using the excuse of I don't have the money, I promise you that's not what's stopping you from doing it. You know, you're most people think of capital is money. You know, Facebook, Steve Jobs, apple, they didn't have millions and millions of dollars to start, they started with the capital in their mind, which was an idea. And it's just like, just like them your idea is your true capital. Does that make sense? Does that sound like something they want to hear? I Brandon Handley 2:52 love I love it, man. Absolutely, absolutely. I think I think you know, you're being pulled to do it. And I think that that's something How can somebody recognize that they're being pulled to do it? And it's not just ego telling them that that's the thing? David Sandercott 3:04 Yeah, that's a great question. You know, that's part of the art of life of you know, how to be human is learning how to be a happy human is learning to decipher between that voice that speaks to you that, you know, let's say Bugs Bunny, right, Bugs Bunny used to have the angel pop up and like the devil on one side. And so you have to learn to differentiate between those. And what I can most to tell you is that fear is the is the devil. And, and when it feels good, and your heart opens, you know that that's God, that's the angel. You know, I don't think I can give you some sort of linear way to tell you how to decipher those voices. You have to do it through practice, through learning to love yourself and trust yourself and through meditation and contemplation. But usually it feels good and doesn't involve fear. And then what was the second part of the question? I don't remember I was so that's alright. It was a great question. But how do you decipher? And then the one thing you said that you're being led, you know, how do you know that you're being led? And it's, it's simple. So two things, like one exercise I did is I wrote down 10 goals every day for a year. And it was like, what those what goals of those were left at the end of the year. Those were the ones that were really important. They kept the ones that kept coming up over and over and over again. And again, it's like that in your heart and in your mind, what keeps coming up. What do you keep thinking about wanting to do what inspires you when you think about doing it? And that's, that's the poll that I'm speaking of, and, and to some degree, it's also easy it because it's not that there's not challenges or obstacles, but it's some it's easy, it's easy when it's right. It's easy. Brandon Handley 4:51 So being invoke was right and easy for you. Let's talk about that. David Sandercott 4:57 Yeah, you know, someone interviewed me for that reason. Recently are, you know, we're talking about manifestation, the art of manifestation. She's like, and I bet you that you had some some struggles or some challenges, you know, leading up to getting in vogue. I was like, No, it was so easy and effortless, you know, it was part of it. I think that I was I was so young, that I hadn't had much, you know, adversity in my life maybe. And I just decided to do something. And I decided to meditate. And I decided to visualize, I decided to read affirmations and I decided I was gonna do this thing. And it Honest to God was the most easy and effortless thing I've ever done in my life, I think because it was right, it was divine, it was it was to show me that you really can do anything you put your mind to, if you believe in yourself, and stick with it. Brandon Handley 5:50 You've got a lot of, you know, a lot of good stuff in there, right? I think that everybody feels like it's supposed to be a challenge, right? If it's worth it, it's gonna take work. If it's worth it, you're gonna have to put in the work and it's gonna be hard. And you know, you got to put in, like, you got to grind it out, and this other stuff. But when you do it in that manner, then you know, it's kind of like what you put out, there's what you get back. That's exactly what it's going to take, it's gonna take a grind, and it's gonna be hard and all this other stuff. But it sounds to me like what you did was you said, but here, here's another piece of this, too, that that I think we don't hear a bunch of and like the law of attraction world. If you don't know how to do it, and you just start doing it, then it the patches kind of opens up for you. Is that kind of how it went for you? David Sandercott 6:40 Absolutely. Because that's where I want to say action is the key to success. Now, there's all kinds of action involved, right? There is there absolutely was and yes, that is how it started. All I knew I needed to have pretty pictures of myself. You know, I knew I needed that. So that was that was the first step. I knew I needed to be in great shape. But that's what I loved doing anyway. So there was a lot of work in the gym. But you know what, I? There's nothing I would rather do in my life than that. And then yeah, there was x and you just had to talk to agents. You know, I mentioned I went to New York, and this guy is just Oh, looking. Cute. Haha, you want a bottle? And you that didn't faze me. I was just like, you know, oh, yeah, I'm gonna be a model. Brandon Handley 7:34 So when you're saying that to it when you said action, right, and I forget what I was watching. I was like another, you know, law of attraction, spin off, or the secret spin off for a bunch of people that were in there. And one guy's like, by the way, the word action is at the end of attraction, right? is in attraction. And I thought that that was pretty cool. But what you're also talking about too, and I'm hearing you say is like, you kind of had clarity and purpose and an intention. And you got behind it, you believed in yourself and you just aligned to it. Right? You did. And thank you for the recommendation, right? The dorthea brand, you know, um, you know, acted as if it actually as if it was impossible to fail. David Sandercott 8:21 That's right. That's right. It was it was Yeah, it's such a great book. And so anyways, I mentioned thinking Grow Rich before I read the book thinking grow rich. It told me I could do anything I wanted to do if I believed in myself made a decision to do it and I meditated. So those were the three things I did exactly what you said I made a decision and I think that is where so many people falter that's where so many people that the decision they make is not to make a decision or decision they make is to make an excuse on why they can't make the decision when it was I made a clear cut decision that was gonna be the world's shortest high fashion model. And now I Honest to God could probably get into the Guinness Book of World Records with with everything that I had for doing that you know, that didn't necessarily mean to me though get in the world Guinness Book of World Records You know, that's not it was just get something that only a six foot two you know, Blue Steel type model could do you know, and and that was it that's filled it but I made the decision to do it. So I had to succeed. And then I believed in myself and I followed up with action. So there's the non action action of the daily meditation and the daily visualization was was equally and probably more important than the other daily actions of going to castings meeting people, you know, always be doing something right. And not doing something for the sake of doing something like modeling jobs, photo shoots, you know, etc, etc. Brandon Handley 10:00 Sure, I think there's a lot of sounds to me what you're talking about is there's a lot of people that do these actions from this busy stuff. But there's no there's nothing behind it, right? There's no there's no intent, there's no alignment. There's like, Alright, well, I'm supposed to do these things, this thing, this thing, this thing and this thing. But if it's not aligned to an intention, or purpose or direction, or like this grand vision, I mean, we can call, we call what you had a vision of what you thought was possible for yourself. Right? Like, yeah, I think that I think another thing too, is that people are afraid to have a vision people are afraid to be visionary, because they think it needs to be something greater than it is right? You can, you can have many visions you can write, you can have these visions that these practice visions, we'll call them. Right. But you know, I think what you're talking about, too, is the idea of making a decision. Did you pull that out of thinking grow rich? And sub question, Are you a Bob Proctor fan? David Sandercott 10:59 I did pull it out of thinking Grow Rich, those were the three biggest takeaways make a decision, believe in yourself and meditate that that was the key in all my life that decision making has been key was a huge like Bob. Proctor was really inspiring to me like 15 years ago, I don't really I mean, walked around thinking Grow Rich, and you know, so he, I haven't really been cued into them for a long time. Brandon Handley 11:26 Now, fair enough. And the reason I bring that up, because he brings up the word decision, and the root of the word is like this David Sandercott 11:32 huge array cut off from thinking grow rich. So once I make the decision, there's no other option, you know, you have to pick yourself off from all other options. Brandon Handley 11:46 Well, look, I'm super impressed that you got that out of thinking Grow Rich, like even immediately, because it's a tough read. And if you're trying to read that on your own, without some kind of, I don't know, I want to say guidance, because it's a tough one to read. Like I certainly. And for me, I never I never pulled meditate out of there. Where did you pull that out? I'm like, I'm like, where'd you pull the rabbit out of the hat, bro. David Sandercott 12:08 You know, it's I read it sometimes. And I'm like, and it is in there. And I am convinced that the older of the edition of the book you can get, the better they've taken stuff out over the years. There's this beautiful poem in there. That's not in the original unabridged version anymore. I don't know why. And maybe I'm making it up. But it was just as loud and clear to me in that book was you've got to meditate if you want to be successful. That's just what I saw. And I remember asking Mr. Van Asch, who was sort of like a mentor of mine, and I said, Do you meditate? And he's like, Well, no, but I drive home silently. for like an hour, I do this drive. And that's sort of like my meditate. So he knew what I was talking about, when we're talking about the book, you know? And so I don't know, but I got it out of there. And it is in there. He does say the word meditate, you know, Brandon Handley 13:01 no doubt, I believe you, man, I believe you. 100%. And then you threw out a couple of words earlier there when we're talking about easy and effortless, right? The the idea of more meditation, but you talked about like, you know, kind of divine intervention, right? Like, when do you feel like you really flipped the spirituality switch for yourself? David Sandercott 13:26 Yeah, that's a great question. So I've honestly the effortless way. I said, I'm teaching June 19 is the effortless way. June 19. I'm having a prosper event. But anyways, so again, I the spiritual switch turned on for me. And when I was, Well, honestly, when I was in my teenage, or even preteen years, I remember thinking about wanting to find my higher self like that being my driving force I really wanted, I knew there was something more. And then when I read Think and Grow Rich at that time, that was it, man. I was, I mean, less than a year late after that, I moved to LA. I was meditating an hour a day I was visualizing, but it's, I mean, it was just as soon as I got sober from like, a four year you know, run of being drunk. 22 I just, I was immediately called the Spirit. And that doesn't mean I didn't like break up with it during certain times, or like, neglect it and forget about it. And to some degree, it's if I had a regret that would be there, Brett I had in my life. When my all of my good friends started moving out to LA, I sort of shifted back kind of into the role that I played more with them instead of just sticking to the celibate, spiritual, and just I was a machine I mean, I was I. Yeah, it happened very early on, and then again, in 2011 Brandon Handley 15:00 So I think that I think that it's interesting that you kind of found it you recalled toward such a young agent, I don't I don't think that I think that somewhere around 20 we get called to that, right? It's and it's kind of like, you know, a window of an opportunity, right? And we either heat it then where we don't, right? For those of us that don't, myself included, you kind of go about life in this default mode, right? And you just, you're like, Alright, well, let me go do all these other things everybody else is doing because that's what looks like I should be doing. And then to me again, and just just based off of personal experience, but the other window of opportunity kind of opens up round, you know, when you get close to 40. Right? There's like it still here. Still here, if you want to hang out, bro. Right? Like, I mean, and, and, and spiritualities like that. It's like I listen, I'm hope you had a good time. It's time to get serious again, right? Remember me like? word Have you been man? It's been crazy. So I think it's really cool that you know, you kind of took hold of it. And you talked about the breakups. And the other piece that you're talking about is when your friends show up. It's interesting, right? When you go home, you're like, well, this is who I was when I left. And so people are still expecting me to be that way. And that's probably what it was when your friends come out to visit you like, you're like, Oh, this is the Dave they know. Right. Let me like, let me remind you revert back to something that's acceptable for the people that you know that that kind of what happened? David Sandercott 16:25 Yeah, I just say it was unconscious, you know, to a to a large degree. But looking back now, yeah, I would say what I really want to express is the way not to fall in that trap is to really have a great deal of love and respect for yourself and recognize how what you're doing is working. Now, it was a lot of fun to fall back into that role, because my friends were all kind of like rich or had more money than me and at a beach house and hermoza. And I've seen we had I still I never drink or you know, but I still have a lot of fun with them. But they were all getting master's degrees and establishing careers. And I fell back into the guy who was just along for the ride, you know, not realizing that they're eventually going to get kids and not be able to take care of me get married have kids Unknown Speaker 17:19 out? Yeah, Brandon Handley 17:22 I get it, I get it. But what's interesting, though, too, is that it doesn't sound like you succumb to their way of living though either by feeling like it. Maybe you did. And like David Sandercott 17:35 No, I didn't. I mean, I gave him stuff for Well, a lot of a lot. Not really. But I mean, I'm definitely the guy that people talk to you they don't want to drink so much. Brandon Handley 17:45 I mean, not even just the drinking but like the the you know, the workforce, right, going back into the workforce, getting the education and doing you know, kind of doing that what's the social socially expected norm? Yeah, that's what your friend said, right? They finished school, got degrees, got married, have kids and fell into fell in line. David Sandercott 18:06 They absolutely did it. And it worked for them to the degree they're happy. I'll say this this is coming up for me is like sometimes I give teachers or education a bad rap. But I had a fifth grade teacher named miss a miss Afro carrion, she was, she was great. The rumor was that during lunch, she smelled doobies in her like 1970s docks, and in the in the dots in the corner of the parking lot. But anyways, at the beginning of class, every single day, we recited the road less traveled by Robert Frost. And I have no doubt that that completely impacted me in such a profound way. Because everything I've ever done in my life, was the road less traveled was taken the road less traveled. Brandon Handley 18:49 That's awesome. You know, I'm in agreement with you there, right, like, definitely, probably not as kind as I could be to the education system, but they're certainly the teachers that had a profound impact are the ones that you remember David Sandercott 19:04 that as MIT right, Mr. Ben, he just retired and I made him a video, you know, someone in and I just let him know that you inspired me to start reading angry reading changed my life, you know, I'm not the stuff they gave you in school. Brandon Handley 19:23 What do you what do you think the impact of doing something like that is reaching out to a past teacher? Did he reply to you? What, what are your thoughts there? David Sandercott 19:30 Well, it was sent in like a group thing, like someone put it together. And I don't know, but I know he saw it. And so I had a rubber band ball that was like this big and he took it away from me. And I had went back like five or six years later, and he still had it. And then I asked someone to ask so at his retirement, he still had the rubber band ball that I gave him. So I know he remembered me. And so I'm sure that he was grateful for that message, you know, is great. You know, I was happy to do it because teachers get, you know, they get pooped on a lot to Brandon Handley 20:04 it. And it's the same, um, you know, somewhere, and but, you know, to the idea that some of their for a job and some of their really impact lives and it sounds like you had a few that were there to really impact your life. Yeah, that's right. And, and I think, you know, I'm gonna segue that into kind of what you're doing right? You know, you're you're right now you're teaching some of these practices and principles that you've been able to find success with in your life. One of those is, I think that you initially kind of did a lot of work in the space by helping others to get their first You know, one grand five grand, and now you're working to help them get their first 10 grand, and in their, in their own respective faces. Let's talk a bit about that. What's your, what's your about in that space? David Sandercott 20:49 Yeah. So after I read, Think and Grow Rich for that first time, it was like, I knew that this is what I wanted to do, I didn't know there was a thing called a coach back then, you know, but I knew that that's what I want to do, and mentor people and, and I did it as a wrestling coach. And I had, I had athletes come back to me a decade later, say, you know, that thing that you said, or, or, you know, I read thinking Grow Rich, and it really made a big difference in my life, you know, so I got to start doing it back then. And then I was a fitness trainer, because really, that's something that I was really passionate about sharing. And, and then around mid 2000s 2007 2008, I got into direct sales, which was like building a sales team. And then, you know, network marketing, like you buy something, essentially, and then you teach other people, then you get someone else to buy it and teach them to sell it is essentially how that goes. And that was really where coaching started. And two big things happen there, I helped several people are in their first $1,000 as an entrepreneur, which was extremely rewarding, and maybe even more impactful. It was, I went to New Zealand, essentially, for a long weekend to bungee jump, because it was on my list of things to do, and to see a speaker. And you know, I was gone for five or six days, I came back with $5,000 more in my bank account than when I left, because the sale went through because you know, there was leverage in this business and the system I was in. And so it was like I was on vacation, and I made $5,000. And it was like, That's it, I'm hooked for the rest of my life. No matter what I have to work, it's just something they pay the bills until I figure this all out. You know, I was an entrepreneur for life after that. And so that's where I started. And then again, it took that that business eventually one of the partners joined Scientology, and unfortunately, that whole business went away. And I found myself depressed. I broke my foot in five places I gained 40 pounds. I didn't I didn't have the business identity. I didn't have the bodybuilder identity. I was lost. I literally just wanted to end my life fetal position for weeks. Brandon Handley 22:56 Yeah, let's pause on that for a second. Let's pause on the idea that getting caught up in our identity being what it is that we do. David Sandercott 23:06 Yeah. Well, that's a big mistake. I encourage nobody, I always say at the beginning of my medication classes, you are not your job, you are not your socio economic standings. You are not what you do for a living. Brandon Handley 23:18 So I mean, I guess you're sitting on the couch or in a fetal position, and you've lost your kind of sense of identity is what it sounds like. How did you how did you recover from that? David Sandercott 23:27 Yeah. Well, so I did two things. You know, I got on my knees I surrendered my life to God, I asked for guidance. And I listened and and that was my all means the number one thing and that's that that's what guided me, right. That's what pulled me. The second thing is equal importance that I stopped being a victim, I stopped blaming the outside world, you know, that was part about it is that I had so many opportunities in my life to be in such a better position than I was. And instead of taking responsibility for it, I was blaming it blaming society and blaming other people. I was like, if you notice, one of the biggest trophies in the world right now is who's the biggest victim? I assure you that that is not the game you want to play for happiness and success. You know, it was it was taking responsibility for my all of my, you know, mess ups and life situation current circumstances. Brandon Handley 24:25 Yeah, I mean, that's huge, right? When you can kind of recognize and I'm just kind of taking a leap here. But you can kind of recognize that all of your success or failure is coming from within, and it has nothing to do with what's outside of you. And when you do that, there's so much ownership, right? There's so much empowerment that comes from that because now you can be like, Oh, yeah, that was me. It wasn't me over here too. And, you know, these failures were me. But some of these successes, right? So you know, everything you know, is both both sides of the coin. Um, that's that's fantastic. So You know, we don't have a whole lot of time here, unfortunately but what you know you've got a course coming up right? What is the course called? What are you going to be teaching? What's it called? David Sandercott 25:10 Yet would you 19th is its prosper but prosper prosper virtual event I'll be teaching prosperity consciousness, helping spiritual entrepreneurs, coaches healer to create the mindset, the prosperity consciousness to have their first $10,000 month the first 10k month. Brandon Handley 25:28 Nice. Nice. And we'll share the link to that but the link is what again? David Sandercott 25:38 Ah. I actually bought a URL just for it. But it's like David Sandler comm forward slash brought I Brandon Handley 25:45 think, yeah, well, yeah, David Sandercott 25:47 that's right. You can if you go to david Sandler, God calm That's right. It's right there. Brandon Handley 25:51 Yeah, Paul's Frodo calm? I'll be sure to share that out. Right. And then, you know, this I told you before, this is kinda like a spiritual speed dating court like, right? And and the deal is, is like, there's 30 minutes, right? That's all we've got this, you know, somebody's gonna come on, and they're gonna decide whether or not they spiritual want to date David J. Sandra. So it's not a lot of time. And so one of the questions I'll ask is, is this one of our speed dating questions be? What does? What does it mean to live in the present moment? bachelor number one? Yeah. What David Sandercott 26:24 does it mean to live in the present moment? Well, it means that if you're living in the present moment, you're going to be happy, fulfilled, and at peace, you're going to be okay, with the way everything is, no matter what you're going to be living your life consciously. And that's what we're here to do is to evolve our consciousness and the best way to evolve your consciousness is to be more conscious. And if you're living in the moment, you're being conscious, Brandon Handley 26:53 elaborate on what you mean by conscious. David Sandercott 26:56 Well, being conscious of your consciousness, there's, there's that which can observe yourself think. And there's the brain that can think there's a subject and an object. So keep your attention on that part of yourself that can observe yourself thinking, and really go one step more and observe the observer observing. It's all a play of consciousness, we is all a field of consciousness and and we are that consciousness. So it's, it's coming to know yourself. It's being conscious of the consciousness, and of as yourself as the consciousness. Brandon Handley 27:35 Dave took us on a level guys like this to another level. there's a there's a great feeling when you become the observer to absolutely yeah, David Sandercott 27:45 I always go like this. You say, I want to go like, this is where you want to live life from like three feet three feet back, you know, above yourself. Brandon Handley 27:52 Yeah. Yeah. Well, dude, thank you so much. Again, David, for popping on, always enjoyed the conversation, you both of them. And we'll be sure to share this out. Is there anything that maybe we didn't touch on that you want to share out with the audience today? David Sandercott 28:07 One quick thing, the last question you asked me, I remember the first time we did got me a little bit and it was like, What do you wish for the world? And it was like, you know, Unknown Speaker 28:15 I didn't like my answer. I David Sandercott 28:16 thought about it a little bit and what I would world is the exact same thing that I wished for me, you know, happiness, peace, prosperity and abundance in all areas of your life. Brandon Handley 28:27 Yeah, yeah. No, that's, that's, that's great. That's funny. You remember the question? And I think that this is the part where some people get a little confused in the love thy neighbor as thyself kind of thing. Right? This has gotten me I look at it in the very same way, you know, so what you wish upon your neighbor is really what you're wishing upon yourself. And just in the same token, you just said, hey, what I wish on the world, what I wish upon myself, and when you do that, we look at the universe is kind of this force multiplier. What we put out comes back to us, I mean, right, so yeah, great answer. Thanks. Thanks for thanks for thanks for sharing that. And I definitely appreciate you being on. Yeah, I David Sandercott 29:09 love it. Thanks for having me, Brandon. Transcribed by https://otter.ai

The roundtable interview with Matt and Caleb Maddix and a small group of people who are trying to change the world. Enjoy part two of this special 4 part episode series. Hit me up on IG! @russellbrunson Text Me! 208-231-3797 Join my newsletter at marketingsecrets.com ---Transcript--- Russell Brunson: What's up everybody, this is Russell Brunson. Welcome back to the Marketing Seekers Podcast. So I have got to ask you, what did you think about episode number one of the World Changers Roundtable? Hopefully, you loved it. There were so many things covered in that 42 minutes. Anyway, we are moving on to the next part of this interview. As you know, this is going to be broken down into four parts because they kept me there, handcuffed to a table, until 3:00 AM. I'm just joking. They didn't really. But, the question was so intriguing, we were having so much fun, we just kept going and going until finally I was like, "I have to fly out in three hours. I need to get back to my hotel." But now we're going to go dive into the second part. This next episode is probably another 30 to 40, 45 minutes or so as well. So these are some things we'll be covering in this one, which is really fun. We talk about, number one, why my business partner, Todd Dickerson, is so amazing, and hopefully give you ideas about if you're pursuing opportunities and trying to land your dream job or partnership or whatever. Number two, we talked about personality profiling, how we actually are hiring here at ClickFunnels. We talked about where my love for learning came from. We talked about transition for me, going from an athlete to a business person and a marketer. We talked about some of the lessons I learned from Lindsey Stirling, things I was not expecting to hear from her that totally changed everything for me. We talked about people who intrigue me, my interest in health and bio hacking. We talked about is there anything that happens inside of this business that gets me as excited as what I felt in wrestling. We talked about what thing is close, but nothing actually has ever hit it. We talked about the first Two Comma Club Awards. We talked about how to upgrade your identity as you grow. We talked about the fact that you have to cycle and fail and rebuild in your businesses. We talked about the launch of ClickFunnels and how it wasn't just the fact that I was a genius, because I wasn't. There are so many things. Talking about the grace of God and how it tied into the launch of ClickFunnels. We talked about some of my early products, like Zip Brander and Forum Fortunes. We talked about my Christmas Grinch sale, which was the very first big sale, big launch I ever did, to my little tiny list that made enough money to cover Christmas for my wife and I when we were first getting started. We talked about becoming worthy. We talked about list building, how it's better than buying ads, and a whole bunch of other things. It's amazing, this could be 40 courses all wrapped into one super podcast episode. So if you liked the last episode, I think you're going to love this one as well. And I've got two more after this, coming back, going deeper into this conversation with the Roundtable of World Changers. So, that said, we're going to cue the theme song. When we come back, we'll dive right into the second section here of the interview. Matt Maddix: Dave and Todd, I mean, just wow. Those dudes are like... But what about those guys? Russell: So here's Todd's story. So the real long story short, I bought some software, it was coding Ruby on Rails, didn't know that. Bought this company with the last... I didn't have the money. So I borrowed money, bought this company, coded on some platform we didn't know, and I was like, "Screw it," right? And I tried to hire people to fix it, nobody could fix this platform until finally I was leaving the office one day. I literally emailed the people saying, "Turn off the servers." We lost all of our money to this company. They shut it down. And I'm walking out of the office and I had this impression of like, "There could be someone on your email list who knows Ruby on Rails." I was like, "That's weird. I had a bunch of internet marketing nerds. There's no one that's like, 'Ruby on Rails...'" Anyway. It was starting with the impression from God, I stopped, turned back around, set the computer to open back up, sent an email to my list. "If you know Ruby on Rails, I'm looking for a partner. I bought a software company and it's not working. Please send me a message." Send. Matt: And that's all you said? Russell: Yeah. And lo and behold, three years earlier, Todd bought some random thing from me, happened to be on my email list. He built the website three or four years earlier that was making six figures a year on autopilot. Hadn't worked in four years. Just hanging out relaxing with his wife and his daughter. And an email comes in and it says, "If you know Ruby on Rails, I'm looking for a partner." He's like, "I know Ruby on Rails. I can be Russell's partner." Emails me back. And at first I see him and his beautiful wife and I'm like, "There's no way he's a programmer. There's no way." That was literally my thought. But he was the only person that responded back so I was like, "Okay, well, here's the login to the site. Fix it. I don't know what to do. I'm not a coder." I went to bed, woke up the next morning. He's like, "Cool, I fixed the site. Plus I found this, this, and this. And I changed this. And I moved these things,", and all of this stuff. He's like, "It's working now. Do you have anything else you want to do together?" I'm like, "Huh." And so I give him another project, another project. And for an entire year Todd and I worked together, and never once did he ever ask me for money, ever. Matt: Wow. Russell: Not a penny. And I remember he started finding Boise to work on a project together ... Matt: You're telling me he worked for you for an entire year? Russell: For free. More than a year. Caleb Maddix: Why was that? Russell: I don't know. I found out later. He'd gone to Robert Kiyosaki at this event and he said, "Find someone who's doing what you want to do and work for them for free." So he told me that years later. I didn't know that. Matt: Todd, if you're watching dude. I love you man. You're legit. Russell: And so he kept coming and he started coming to Boise and we started becoming friends. The smartest developer I've ever met. Literally the smartest person I've ever met. I'll go that far. Just genius. And he'd come out to Boise and we'd work on projects and ideas. We tried to launch a couple of things. None of them really worked. And we were just trying stuff. He was just always there, always serving, always doing stuff. And one day were in Boise and I was looking over his shoulder cause we're looking at stuff and I saw his email. And there's all these emails from some recruiting site or something. I was like, "What's that?" He's like, "Oh, it's people recruiting me for a Ruby job." And I was like, "Do you get a lot of those?" And he's like, "I get three or for a day." I'm like, "Really? Are they good offers?" He's like, "I don't know. Let's check it out." He opened it up and the first one was like $400,000 a year starting salary. I'm like, "What?" The next one is $350,000. The next was 5 ... Insane things. I'm like, "Why don't you do that?" He's like, "I don't want to work for them. I want to be your partner man." I'm like, "What?" And then I all of a sudden had this realization that I hadn't paid him in a year. We didn't have much money at the time, we're still at the backside of a business failure when we met. I'm like, "I can pay you maybe $50,000 a year. Can I pay you that?" He's like, "Whatever." So I told our little bookkeeper, "Pay Todd $50,000 a year." And they're like, "Okay." So he did that and next year we're paying $50,000 a year. We're doing stuff and we have more things. Started to get a little success here and there. Making more money. Back in Boise again. And I'm like, "Can I pay you some more?" And he's like, "Whatever." Matt: So he wasn't ever just asking? Russell: Never in his life has he asked me for money. Ever. So we bumped it up to $100,000 a year because that's what we got, the year before that, after a year or two working together. And then, it was crazy, the day Leadpages got the first round of funding for $5,000,000, the same day Todd was flying to Boise. And he gets the email. It's east coast so he's two hours ahead. He's awake and on the plane, he sees the email, forwards it to me, and then jumps in the plane. He's flying for four hours. I wake up. I see the email and I was like, "Leadpages? Got 5 ..." I was like, we built landing page software in the past. I was perplexed and angry. And then Todd lands. And Todd, he's a little guy, he comes into the office all angry. He's like, "Leadpages got 5 million!" He's like, "I can build Leadpages tonight. Do you want to build lead pages?" I'm like, "Yeah. Let's compete with Leadpages." He's like, "All right." Matt: No way. Dude. I love this. Russell: This is like angry Todd. I love angry Todd. I like all Todds, but angry Todd is the best Todd. Matt: Is it? Okay. Russell: He's just pissed because he's like, "I can build this tonight. Everything thing they got we can have done tonight." So we're getting all ready. What should we call it and everything. And then he's like, "Wait, we're building this. You want to add anything else to it?" And I was like, "Oh. Yeah. What if it did this? And what if it did this?" And we spent a week in front of a white board saying, "What if it did?", and we mapped out ClickFunnels. Matt: So you're talking about a week where you guys just locked in and you were just having fun. Just doodling and whatever. Russell: Yeah. He's like, "Oh, I can do that. We can do that." We're brainstorming all sorts of stuff so we map the whole thing out. Matt: Did you know at that moment you were onto something big? At that moment right there, when you guys were like ... Or was it just still like ... Russell: All lot of people have tried something like that. I tried before other people tried. No one had done it. So I was kind of skeptical but Todd's like, "I can do this. This is easy." I'm like, "Okay because I tried it ..." He's like, "No dude, I can do it. This is easy." So I was, excuse me, optimistically hopeful because he's a genius but I was also nervous. But anyways, we map it out and then we bought Clickpros.com. I wanted to call it ClickFusion because I own ClickFusion, but we'd had three failed businesses called ClickFusion. All of them failed and Todd was like, "No. It's bad karma. We can't." I'm like, "But the logo is so cool dude." Matt: I love it. You love the logo. Russell: And he's like, "No, we can't." He's like, "It's got a jinx on it or something. We can't do that. You have to come up with a different name." I was like, "But ClickFusion is the coolest name ever." So we're trying things. Click everything and then ClickFunnels. We're like, "Ah." That was the thing. We're so excited Matt: Who first said it? Do you remember? The words ClickFunnels. Caleb: It's almost like God saying, "Let there be light." Russell: I would assume it was me but I'm not positive. I'll have to ask Todd on that one. Caleb: Well, when you said it, was it instant? Like fire? Russell: It was insane, it was available. Matt: Oh, you know that feeling, right? Checking domains. You're like… chills. Russell: How has no one thought of this before? And so we got it and I remember I was driving him to the airport at the end of the week to take him back home. And we got to the airport. Boise airport, It's a small airport. So we pull up to the thing to get out and you can tell he's probably nervous waiting. And before we get out of the car he's like, "I really want to do this man. I'm excited." I'm like, "Me too. Me too." He's like, "I don't want to do this like your employee though. I want to do it as your partner." And in that moment, I was just like all the fear of ... I'd tried partners in the past. It hadn't worked. All this stuff and all the everything. And it was just this weird thing of just all the emotions were hitting me as he sat in the car, about to get out the car. I have 15, 20 seconds before he's going to to go. I was just thinking about him. I was like, he's never asked me for money. He's never done anything. He's served. He's given everything. I was just looking at him. I was like, "All right let's do it." He's like, "Cool." And he got out of the car and he's gone. Matt: Wait a minute. So at that moment? Is was that quick? Russell: That was it. Matt: It was a gut feeling that you just knew. That he was ... Russell: It was him. Yeah. And I was literally... I said this on stage at Funnel hacking live, outside of marrying my wife, it was the greatest decision I ever made. Matt: Yeah. I remember you saying that with tears. Russell: Yeah. Matt: Why though? I'm curious because it's not just ClickFunnels. Russell: He's amazing. If you look at our personality profiles, it's fascinating. We have the same personality profiles. The Myers-Briggs. Except for one letter's different. Where I'm a feeler he's a thinker. And it's been magical as a partnership because we both have so much respect for each other that we don't try to fight each other. And it's very much like if I wanted to do something, I'm like, "This is what I want to do. This what I'm feeling. What do you think?" And he'll come back and be like, "Well, I think this." And so I come up from feeling instead of thinking and it's really cool. So sometimes his thinking will trump my feeling. And I'm like, "You're actually right. Let's not do that." Or vice versa. Where he's like, "I'm thinking this." And I'm like, "I don't know why but I feel this." And he'll be like, "Okay." He respects that. We just have such mutual respect that we've never been in a fight. We've never argued. We've never had problems. It's been amazing. Matt: Wow. Russell: And he's similar to like we talk about with Dan. He went back home after us white boarding that, sat in his basement for five or six months and built ClickFunnels by himself. Caleb: Really just by himself? Russell: 100% by himself. Caleb: No other team. No other dev? Russell: It was just him. And the right before we launched, we brought in another partner, Dylan, who built the front-end editor and did a lot of the UI. And so then it was those two as we got closer and closer to the launch. And then for the next year it was just those two that did everything. And then after a year, we started bringing in other developers. But it was 100% Todd. Matt: Wow. Russell: He's amazing. In all aspects. You know you have friends you think they know everything about everything. That's like Todd except he actually knows everything about everything. You ask him anything and he's just like ... I don't know how he does it. And I'll always fact check him, like, "Oh my gosh. He's right again." He's brilliant. It's amazing. Matt: So for those of us who have partners or are maybe going into partnership, what's your best advice? And what do you feel like he does right that other partners don't do? Russell: I think the hardest thing with partners is typically we want to partner with someone who is just like us. We did a podcast most recently. Dean, Tony and I, right? We've done two partnerships. Both partnerships made it through the launch and they stopped. Made it through the launch and stopped. The podcast was like, "Why?" I love Dean. I love Tony. They're amazing. The problem is that me and Dean had the exact same skill set. Matt: Oh. Russell: And so the problem is that both of us are right. We both understand it right, but we do it differently. And so it's like You have two people, and so typically you want to partner with those people who are like you. You're like, "Oh, we think the same. We should be partners." But that's not necessarily the right thing because then you've got two alphas with the same skillset, and someone has to win and someone has to lose. And it's hard. Whereas me and Todd, we have different skill sets. There is never a winner or a loser. We can both win because different skill sets, both the same mission. It's really easy. So I think the biggest thing is you're trying to find the yin yang. You're not trying to find someone who thinks like you or acts like you. In fact, this is true in most hiring processes as well. I used to have people like, "Send me a video if you want this job." Right? So I get these videos, and the people that I wanted to hire were the people like me. I'm like, "This person's awesome. They think like me. They're a genius. They're amazing." You'll hire them, and within a week I'm like, "I hate this person." It's horrible. So we started shifting the way we do our hiring based on personality profiling instead. DISC profile drives most of my own personal hiring so I know that I'm a high D, high I, high S. No C at all. Right? And so the people I need to hire around me are high S, high C. The problem is the people I who I watched their videos and I'm pumped, they're high D, high I. So I'm like, "Yeah. These people are awesome. They're charismatic. I'm going to love them. They're drivers, they're awesome. Worst employees ever. Matt: Right. Russell: Right? So when people send us this profile, first I find the right profile and then from there I do interviews. Because if I interview ahead of time I get sold by the people who sell and then they're horrible employees. And so I make sure they're high S high C, because I know that if I talk to high S high C, I'm going to be kind of bummed out. Like, "Oh, I don't know if this is the kind of person that I'm going to jive with." But they're the best people to surround myself with because I'm such a high D high S. I'm a creator. I'm throwing things up in the air and I need people who are S and C, who are faithful finishers, who are going to take the things, capture them, and make sure that it's amazing. Matt: Do you feel like businesses and entrepreneurs are making a mistake by not having their employees and their team take these tests? Russell: 100%. I have a new company we're launching all about personality profiling because I'm such a big believer in it. Matt: Really? Tell me why. Top three reasons. Russell: It's in all things in life. If you're going to be a partner. If you're going to date someone. Understanding who they are is such a big part of it. Right? Because we think everyone sees the world the same way we see it and it is not true at all. The way you see it, the way we all see is so different and so if we don't understand that at a deep level, then I get upset by what you do and at what everyone's doing because it's like, "Don't you see what I see?" And the reality is no they don't. So if you start understanding people better ... In fact, the software can be called Understand About Me. It's a place you go and you take all the personality profiling and it gives you a page that can show somebody this is me. So in five seconds I can understand you perfectly they're like, "Oh, now I know how to work with you." Because I understand what you are, what your beliefs are, what your values, all the things I need to know about you, I can find it really quickly. Where normally you're going to go years with somebody before you understand them. I can look at a thing and get pretty dang close in a minute. Matt: Wow. Russell: Now I know hot interact with you and spend time with you and work with you. Things like that. Caleb: Question. Where does your love to learn come from? Because one of the things I noticed from being around you, it's always like yeah, so I had this moment where I geeked on this and I geeked out on this. It was health and suppliments, and marketing and personality types. There's all these different things you geek out on. Have you always been that way? Is it like you geek out on marketing, you saw the rewards from it, and you're like, "Wow, what if this goes into other areas?" Where does that come from? Russell: Yeah, I didn't always have my life. In fact, I had a fascinating conversation with Tom Bilyeu about this, because when I was growing up in high school I always thought I was a dumb kid. I thought I was an athlete, so I focused there. I thought I was an athlete, so I was a wrestler, that was my identity, that was where I focused at. I thought I was dumb. Because of that, straight C student high school and college, my cumulative GPA graduating from college was 2.3. Straight C's and one B maybe somewhere in there, right? Because I was a dumb kid. When I got done I ended my wrestling career, so I stopped being an athlete, and I was like, "Oh crap." I started to learn this business stuff and I don't like to read. I'm a dumb kid. What do I do? It was fascinating. Tom told me, because I had this epiphany, I'm not actually dumb. He's like, "Actually, the reality is you probably really were dumb. But then you changed, right?" So for me it was like I shifted. It was fascinating. Do you remember the Funnel Hacking Live where we had Lindsay Stirling perform? One of my favorite parts of that, she did a whole performance. If you guys don't know, Lindsay does violin dancing stuff, and afterwards I had a Q and A with her afterwards. I had this question I was so pumped to ask. I was waiting for her just to like, the question is, she was on America's Got Talent, and I think she took 7th place. When she got kicked off, Pierce Bronson or whatever said, "You've got no talent. You're no good." Whatever, right? So I was like, do you remember that time when he said that? What I thought she was going to say was, "Yeah, I proved him wrong. Yeah." I was like, "What did you feel after that?" She's like, "Yeah, I got home and I realized he was right. I wasn't very good. So I went back and I started practicing and I started working harder and eventually I became good enough." It was like, oh my gosh. I got chills when I was saying it again. Matt: Yeah. Russell: I remember when Tom said it to me, he was like, "You probably were dumb." I was like, "I was." Because I wasn't reading things. So with marketing that was the first thing for some reason that caught my attention, that got me excited, right? And then if you look at my DISC profile, ROI is my highest value. I have to see ROI in something or I don't want to do it. So when I saw an ROI on this reading, I was like, "Oh my gosh. I read a book, I got one little sentence, changed a color, made more money. Oh my gosh." That is where it started, 100%. I started learning that and I started getting obsessed with those things. As this business grew for me I started being more, I always joke that crazy people got attracted to me, right? The best health people, the best fitness people, the best in every market kind of came into our world somehow. So I started getting to meet all these people. When you're around someone who's the best in the world at the thing, and they start talking about the thing, you can't help but be like, "Oh my gosh, this is amazing." Right? You zone in on that. So whenever I meet someone that's amazing and I have a chance to talk to them like this I just geek out. Like when I met your dad the first time with you guys. That's when I bought your parenting course and everything. I was just like, I saw you and I saw him and I was like, "I want that." So I started going down that rabbit hole, right? I met Anthony DiClementi, I was like, "I love this guy. I have respect for him, I love him." Every time he talks about anything, he fascinates me, when he talks about something it fascinates me. I have to look down those things, right? When people fascinate me, the things that fascinate them start fascinating me and that's when I kind of go down those rabbit holes. This person is so intriguing and fascinating. What makes them that way? What are they doing. It's interesting. I'm not a good question asker. You guys are so good at question askers. I've never been good at asking questions, but I'm really good at watching what people do and then seeing it and trying to go down the rabbit hole. What are they doing, why are they doing it, that kind of thing. Caleb: He's a true master in it. You can just tell. What are some things you want to take the time to geek out on? I'm sure you see something and you're like I want to get on that but it's not a priority, I've got to do this. What are some things, if I had a week or two? Russell: Just free time with nothing else involved? Caleb: What's the next thing you're going to geek out on? Russell: Oh. I would say every probably three years I get re-excited about SEO, for some reason. I start going down that path again, because I love it. There's times in my business when that was the focused. It's not now at all, but I went through a couple ... Brian Dean's a real cool SEO guy, couple guys… I started dabbing my toe in again and I'm like, I just want to get back into it so bad. Right now SEO is actually our number 11 lead source as of today in ClickFunnels, which is amazing. So we handed SEO the first four or five years, now we're focused on it again. It's doing really well for us. I want to go deep there because I like that. Anyway, I haven't had a chance to do that. Any of the health stuff really, really fascinates me. Matt: Why? I'm curious. Why are you drawn to that so much? The health stuff. Russell: Because I've seen with myself ... My history is I got in wrestling, at the PAC 10 tournament was my last actual wrestling match. My wife was giving herself fertility shots in the stomach during PAC 10 so the next month se was pregnant. So I got done wrestling, got done competing, got done running, got done lifting. All my athletic career ended, and then my wife got pregnant. She's eating for three kids, and I'm pumped because I don't have to work out right now, she's hungry, I'm hungry, we're eating. We just kept eating and eating. So over the next seven to eight months my wife gained like 60 pounds, I gained like 60 pounds. We were doing it together so who cared, it was amazing. Then one day she has two babies and she loses like 45 pounds and I'm like, oh crap. I'm stuck here. Where did you go? This for me? Matt: Yeah. Russell: Thank you. Then at that time the business was starting and I was stressed out trying to figure it out and I didn't get healthy again. I just was in that state of being 65 pounds heavier for years. But I didn't know the difference, I didn't know that I felt differently, because I'd never been in a spot where I spent eight hours sitting behind a computer, so I didn't know what good felt like or bad felt like. I knew if I tried to wrestle I'd puke, so I was like I don't feel like I'm an athlete. I just felt normal, I thought. Eight years in I was like, I don't know, I looked at myself in the mirror and I was like, "Oh, what happened to you?" You know what I mean? I'm sure hopefully everybody's had a chance. I was like, huh. It was hard because in my head I knew how to work out, I knew how to train, I knew these things. Finally I was like, "I need to get a trainer." So I got a trainer for the first time. I'd never really done that before. Started going, and got me from I don't even know, 27, 28% body fat down to 12% in a matter of seven or eight months. I looked better, I felt better, but what's crazy is I could work twice as hard and twice as long. I wasn't tired. I was like, "I can keep going. My brain's on fire. This is amazing." Matt: Wow. Just from the ... Russell: I had no idea until I lost all the weight. All of a sudden it was just like, I can do so much more. I think, when I first met Anthony DiClementi the first time I was like, this is my problem right now. I am at work all day slaying dragons, doing all these things, I have this energy. I get home at night and my two little twin boys are there, and my little daughter, and I'm spent and I have no energy. How do I still be a present dad and how do I have these things? The next tier was the bio hacking stuff. How do you do these things? How do you increase energy? There's so many ways to do that, from light therapy to supplements to sleeping to sound to breath, all these crazy things that seem stupid. The first time Anthony's like, "We're going to do breath work." I'm like, "We're going to breathe? That's your bio hack? We're going to breathe together?" He's like, "Yeah, it's going to be amazing." I'm like super annoyed. What's the ROI on this, I've got to get back to work. So he sat me down in our gym. You've been in our wrestling room. He sat me down and he's like, "You have to sit because if you're standing you'll hit your head and you'll die." I'm like, what are you talking about? He sits me down and we do these breathing exercises where he's yelling at us and screaming. All this stuff is happening. If anyone's ever done deep breath work it's nuts. We're doing this thing where we're supposed to do this heavy, heavy breath work until he's like, what's going to happen is the world is going to ... Has anybody done jiu-jitsu here? Been tapped out before? Matt: Yeah. Russell: So you get choked out. What will happen, the carotid artery gets choked and the world starts shrinking like this. If you take pressure off it, it comes back to life. If you don't, it goes darker and darker until it disappears and you're gone, right? If you've never been choked out, that's what happens. It's a really fun experience. But you have the minute when you see it shrinking around you and then it's gone, right? He told me that's what's going to happen. You're going to breathe so much that the world around you is going to start shrinking. If you don't stop you're going to pass out. So we go all the way to where it starts shrinking, stops, and then when you hit that point you let me know and then you hold your breath for as long as you can. He's like, "How long can you hold your breath for?" I'm like, "Maybe a minute." He's like, "You'll do it for at least five." I was like, there's no way. So he says sit down, we're doing this breath thing, we're going like crazy and sure enough the walls start doing weird stuff. I feel like I'm on drugs. I'm sweating like crazy. We keep doing it. He's yelling at me. All of a sudden the world starts closing around me, I'm like, "What is happening?" And then he stops and is like, "Hold your breath." He starts the clock. I'm sitting here holding my breath forever, looking around. We had three or four of us guys all doing it at the same time. I'm freaking out. And then it starts getting quieter, things are slowing down, we're sitting there and then he's like let some of the pressure out but don't breathe in. Let pressure out, pressure out, pressure out, keep doing that, and it gets done and the stop clock is over five minutes. I'm just like, I just held my breath for five minutes. Matt: And you didn't even know it. Russell: Insane. And then the rest of the day we were on fire. It was just like, whoa. Right? We brought a cryo-sauna at our house and we go freeze in the cryo-sauna and the rest of the day you just feel ... That's the thing I love now, these little weird things. Light therapy, breathing, weird things that just seem stupid. You do it and you can go longer, you can think better, you can do stuff. All those things just get me so excited. Anthony's fun because he randomly will just ship me weird stuff in the mail. Just the weirdest things. It makes my wife so mad. It just shows up. There's a big old box. She's like, what's this from? I'm like, I'm hoping it's from Anthony, it's going to be amazing. Just weird things. Tons of stuff. I love that kind of stuff because the ROI on it is crazy. They're always these weird things. I have this headband someone sent me. You put this headband on, you put an app on and you start working and it just makes you not tired, makes you focused. These weird things. How does this work? I don't know. And they're like oh, it works because the waves over here sync your brain and change your brain waves and the creative state and all these things. I mean, I don't know how it works but I just wrote two chapters. Caleb: Do you do breath work every day? Russell: No, because it's so intense. If I had a coach who could walk me through it. I have a recording of Anthony doing it and I almost dread it because I know how hard it is. By the time you're done you're sweating. Caleb: I've got to get that recording. Russell: I'll get it to you. By the time you're sweating, you're like what just happened? I just breathed for five minutes. It's weird. Anyway, I would love to understand it on a deeper level but I don't understand a lot of the things now. Some of them I've gone deep on, but a lot of them I do without knowing why. I hate it because my wife will be like, "What's this do?" And I'm like, I don't know. Matt: Just love it. Russell: One of my buddies, Preston Eli, he wrote this blog post, he called it the Warriornaire Workout. In there he explains part of his morning workout. He's like, why do I do it? He's like, because Tony Robins does, and I obey all giants who fly helicopters and have stage presence. That quote goes to my head all the time. People ask me, why do you do that? I'm like, because I obey all giants who fly helicopters and have stage presence, that's it. I'm like, I don't know the reason why, Tony says so, therefore I will do it. I would like to understand it at a deeper level so I have a better response than I obey all giants with helicopters and stage presence. But that's a pretty good reason. Anyway. Matt: Real quick, does anybody else want to throw in a question for Russell? Anybody else here live with us? Caleb: Let me ask one more real fast. Because I want to. I want to ask this. We were just having sushi, I was asking you, what are some of the favorite periods of your life? One of them you said was wrestling, which I found funny because by far one of my favorite periods is baseball, which people wouldn't expect because obviously I've been on stage and all this other stuff and that should take the cake. But those moments when you're just on the field, you're in the zone, there's nothing better. Where, with what you get to do now, whether it's being live on a webinar or being on stage or whatever it is, where do you get the same feeling of wrestling? Do you know what I mean? You know, the feeling in your chest? Russell: Today while we were in line at the grocery store I talked to your dad about this. I said that the best feelings I ever had in my life were from wrestling. The feeling of winning a hard match that I wasn't supposed to win and getting your hand raised, I never felt something like that, that felt as good as that, ever. I've been searching in business to find that, and I've never found it. Speaker 3: Do you feel like sports is like business in any sense? Matt: Good question. Russell: For sure, yeah. There's a lot, for sure. What I was going to say is the closest I've ever gotten to feeling that is when you serve at an event and you see a table rush and you see not only people where they get the a-ha, but enough of an a-ha where it gets them to get up and to move. That's the closest I've ever felt to that. It's not as good, but it's the closest I've ever felt to that. Which is why I love doing the big things. I get a glimpse of that. Caleb: How close? Scale of one to 10. Wrestling's a 10. Where does that rank? Russell: If wrestling's a 10, I'd say it's about an eight. In fact it's interesting because when I first started in business I was racing for that, trying to find it, trying to find it, trying to find it. It took me years before I was like ... Matt: Is it disappointing? Russell: For sure, yeah. We launch today and make a million dollars and it's like, huh. That sucked. What else have we got. Give me something else. Matt: Exactly. Russell: The money goal is always what I thought was going to be the thing, and those always were just like, huh. In fact, literally one of the main reasons I did the Two Comma Club Awards, for me I need, maybe it's just from a decade of my life someone grabbing my hand and raising it. I was like, entrepreneurs need that. No one raises our hands. Two Comma Club Awards, for me, is me lifting their hands like you did it. I needed that, they need that. That's one of the main reasons I did that, because that's the equivalent of that. Anyway. Matt: How many millionaires have you created? Russell: This year we passed 1,000 people that won the two comma club award. We're over 120. Matt: How does it feel to say that? To say it? You know how sometimes it's like so many people that have passion or goals or huge dreams and visions, rarely do they really celebrate what's happening on the journey. Do you find yourself ever getting where your vision is so big and your passion is so deep that even saying things like there's 1,000 millionaires. Dude, that's huge. Man, 1,000 people that are millionaires because of you. Russell: I think the first time I really got that, probably the most impactful time, was the very first Funnel Hacking live that we gave away Two Comma Club Awards. It was the third Funnel Hacking live. It was a couple of months before that we had the idea of a Two Comma Club and an award, talking about that. I legitimately didn't know. I wonder if anyone in ClickFunnels has actually made a million dollars. I don't even know. So Dave went back and the database guys went through everything and I remember he came back and was like, there's 79 people right now that made a million dollars. I was just like, are you serious? Matt: Was it a boost of confidence? What did it do for you? Russell: It was one of those things, looking back on me doing these events where two people showed up and nobody showed up, hardly anybody, where I was so excited about this? I was like, how come nobody cares? To now it was like, this is actually, I've talked about this long enough people are believing it and now they're doing it. You start seeing it, and there's the fruits of it. In my mind I was like a million bucks, even then, ClickFunnel was new, I was like a million dollars is hard. Most of my friends I knew were like made somewhere near a million dollars. There were people who have been in this business for a long time. A million bucks is a big deal. That was most people's goal still. The fact that 79 people had done it, that was just weird to me. I think that was the biggest one, the realization that just like, oh my gosh. It's not just a theory and I think it works, it's working. It's working at a scale that was unfathomable to me at the time. 79 people. To go to 200 and then 500 and then 1,000 is crazy. Matt: What was your question, buddy? Speaker 4: You're talking about how at each level of success you hit, some of your mentors hit that ceiling, right? Because of the posturing, right? So ultimately I feel like when you get to a new level of success it requires you to upgrade your identity, your self image. What have you found is the number one routine, what's your process for upgrading the identity, upgrading your self image? Because I think that's so important because it can either hold you back and have you self sabotage and not take action and go after what you want, or it's going to be the thing that keeps you at that level and continues to propel you forward. What's kept you ... Russell: That's good. It's weaved through everything, right? The one that's the most obvious external, especially in our world, because you see marketers, most people when they first start selling whatever it is they're selling they're bragging about themselves. Here's my ad, here's my name. It's all about them, that's the first tier of it. And then the second tier, when they start having the realization, I feel like is when they stop talking about themselves and start talking about the people they've helped. Speaker 4: Mm. Russell: You see externally. You don't hear me talking about how much money I make. I'm not like, oh, check out what I got. I talk about all the other people. It's like, that's next year, is that. And then for me the third tier now, which has been really cool, is talking about Lady Boss, right? The success story isn't Kailin, it's Kailin's customers, right? So it's like that next tier. What you're talking about is like the external version of that. There's a lot of internal things that you've got to deal with, but you'll notice it shifting in people when you look at just their messaging and what they're saying. From the way they podcast, they video, they market, their ads and everything, it's the shift of it's not about me, it's about them. It's not even about them, that's the external version of it. Internally I think it's really, it's what we talked about, I can't remember why, but we brought up yesterday or today I had this really successful guy I met one time who the first time we met he was like tell me your story. So I was telling him the wrestle posturing story about how great I was. He was like, no. Tell me about the time you failed. So I was like, well, I'm in the middle of one right now. So I told him let me tell you. I told this whole thing. I remember afterwards I was so embarrassed. He's going to think I'm an idiot. You know, that fear? He was like, good, you cycled. I was like, what? He was like, I will not work with entrepreneurs who haven't cycled at least once. Because if they haven't then they still believe their own bio, right? I think that's the biggest thing, the internal version is that. The first time around, before you cycle, you think it's all you. I know for me it was. I remember doing this the first time, I'm like, I am a genius. I'm the smartest guy in the world. And then when it collapsed I was like, oh, there's a lot of things outside my control. This is not me. There is a team, there's God, there's all these other things that are making this possible. There's a scripture, I can't remember where it's at, it's the Bible, Book of Mormon, but it says you can either be humble or God will humble ... Ah, I'm misquoting it by far. But it's like God will humble people. You can be humble or he will humble you. So it's like, looking at that, I'm like round two I'm going to be a humble person because I don't want to be humbled again, right? Matt: I still feel it. Russell: This is not me. I understand, I look around now and it's 100% like there's no way I would be where I am right now if Dan Usher didn't make videos the way he does. There's no way I'd be here right now if Todd Dickerson could not code software the way he does. There's no way, all these things are so many people. Matt: You're so right. Russell: Then there's so many success stories that inside of it there's just so many people. And then there's the grace of God. I just look at the timeline of when ClickFunnels came into the market. I've now got funnels for a decade, nobody cared. Then all these things were happening, we started having the idea for ClickFunnels, started building it, we're creating it, and then literally we go to traffic and conversion, Todd's halfway done building ClickFunnels, and Ryan Deiss stands on stage in the biggest event at the time and he spends the entire four days talking about funnels. Talking about how funnels are the greatest thing. Everybody's like, what's a funnel? They're all taking notes. Me and Todd are like, does he know we're building? He's talking about funnels. He's talking about funnels like crazy. And then the next day everyone gets home from traffic and conversion and everybody that day, the next day 8,000 funnel consultants pop up. Everybody's a funnel consultant. Everyone is on Facebook talking about funnel consultants and teaching funnels and all this stuff. We're like, oh my gosh. Todd, get this software done, everybody's talking about funnels right now. So he's coding like crazy, all this stuff is coming around, all of a sudden everyone's like, millions of funnel consultants, everyone's doing it, and all of a sudden we're like, hey, we created this thing called ClickFunnels, here it is. All of a sudden all of the consultants and all the people and everyone came and we were the only platform. I look at that, as smart as I think I am, there is so much grace and timing. If I'd launched a year earlier, a year later, it would not have hit the way it did. 100% it was the timing of all these things that have to happen. If it wasn't for that ... I can act like I'm smart, I'm a genius, but man, there's so much divinity that came into all the things. There's no way it could happen without that. Anyway, just understanding those things. Matt: What did you learn when you were cycling? Russell: So many lessons. Russell, you are not that good looking. Or cool. Or anything. Matt: It's basically not about you, right? Yeah, I feel that. So what was hardest? What were the tough lessons? Caleb: How many times did you cycle? Russell: Two big ones for sure. Matt: Really? Do you mind sharing? Russell: Yeah, the first time was after I was trying to figure this thing out. I remember one of my buddies was like, you're making money online? I'm like, yeah. He's like, that's cool. I'm like, do you want a job? He's like, what? I'm like, you're the first person I know who's interested. I'll pay you to come hang out with me. He's like, all right. So I hired my friend. He's like, I have some friends too. I'm like, okay. So I start hiring all these people because I want someone to talk to. Anyway, it was really bad. I ended up having a whole bunch of employees nobody knew how to do anything. I didn't know how to train anybody. I was hiding in the room trying to make money to pay payroll while they're standing outside like, do you want us to do anything? I'm like, don't talk to me, I've got to make money to pay your payroll. They're like, we can help. I'm like, I don't have time to explain anything to you. It was horrible. I built it up to the point where it was just like, I was launching a new thing as fast as we could just to pay payroll. As an entrepreneur, you kill something you get to eat, right? It's like the greatest thing in the world. Employees, they want to get paid every two weeks whether they killed anything or not. I did not realize that until they were like we need money and I'm like, but we haven't made any money. They're like you have to pay me. I'm like, what? I'm so confused. Like, okay. Anyway, it had grown and we didn't have a model, sustainable. Speaker 3: You just launched stuff to see if it works? Russell: Yeah. When I was by myself it was like, I had an idea today, let's try it. You launch it, it makes some money, sweet. And then it was like, I made 20, 30 grand. It was my wife and I, so it was like, that lasts nine months. You know? Caleb: What did you sell? Obviously I know the potato gun backstory. You said I talked about funnels for like a decade before that. What were you selling during that decade leading up to ClickFunnels? I know it's an inordinate amount of stuff. Is there anything not even close to funnels, like something ... Russell: Yeah. The very first, pre-potato guns, my very first big idea was ... Back then what everyone was doing, you know who Yanik Silver is. Yanik would write a book and then he would sell the resale rights to the books. Someone else would buy it and they could sell it. I remember I got online, I saw these books, I bought a book from Yanik and I'm like, I can sell this. I bought a book from somebody else. I was buying all these eBooks I could sell. But then inside the books they would have links back to all their sites. I'd sell the book and I was like, I made 10 bucks selling the book. And then inside the book Yanik is selling his thousand dollar course and seminars and things. They make all this money. I'm like, I got 10 bucks. He made like $1,000 off of me selling his book. I remember being mad. I was like I wish there was a way I could brand this ebook so that before somebody opens it and sees his ad they'd see my ad. That was the first idea I ever had, ever. So my first product was called Zip Brander, it was this little thing that would take an ebook and it would brand it. You open it up and it popped up an ad. You see the ad and you click a button and it would take you inside the ebook. It was my first thing. We launched that and I sold 20 or 30 copies of it. But that was the first money I ever made, it was amazing. I had a customer list, I was like this is amazing. And then the way I was selling those, I was going to forums. This is pre-Facebook, so all you little kids, before Facebook, before MySpace, before Friendster, we used to go to these things called forums. They were these things where people would talk all day. So we'd go to these forums. One of the rules in the forums is you could comment all you wanted but you could have a signature file. At the end you could have like, Russel Brunson, check out my new software Zip Brander. I'd go to these forums and I would just spend eight hours a day answering questions and asking questions and everything. People see my ad on every little thing. My footer was on everything. That's how I was selling Zip Brander initially. I was in 50 forums posting like crazy but I couldn't keep up with it. I was like, man, if I could create a software that would manage this whole thing, that would be amazing. So my second product is called Forum Fortunes. It was this little software that would manage your posting on every single forum. You post and you could see if someone responded back on Forum 49 it would pop up and you're like, oh, you can go find it and go back and comment and keep the discussion. I made it for myself and then we started selling that. We sold more of those because I now had a little customer base here and went bigger. After that it was the next. It was always what's the next thing. That's kind of how it started back in the days, little tools and things like that. Speaker 3: How do you know when you're shooting all these bullets, how do you know when you shoot a cannonball? Matt: Good question. Russell: The thing about it initially, I had been married, I was making zero dollars a year as a wrestler, so for me to make $600 in a month, that was a cannonball. That was insane. I thought I was the coolest kid in the world. $600 was insane. So I did four or five little things. I remember it was Christmastime and I remember my wife wanted to buy a couch and it was a $2,000 couch. I was just like, oh, I can't afford that. I don't have a job. I'm getting sick to my stomach. I had this idea, what if I do a sell and just sell a whole bunch of crap that we had. I had a bunch of eBooks I bought rights to, a couple of things I had created, so we made this Grinch sale. I remember I wrote the copy, it was like, it was the Grinch Before Christmas or something. It had a picture of the Grinch and his heart growing three sizes, I don't know. I wrote this copy. My wife and I had been married a year, she really wants a couch, I can't afford a couch, so if you guys buy this, if I sell 32 of these things, I can buy her a couch and put it under the Christmas tree. It will be amazing. Caleb: You said that in the copy? Russell: In the copy, yeah. It was the reason why. I still have the page, I can show it to you. I know exactly where it's at, I can show it to you. So I had the whole page and then only an email list of like a couple hundred people at the time. I still had an affiliate program, so at the top it had an affiliate link. So I sent an email to my list and went to bed that night. Someone on my list was a guy named Carl Galletti, I haven't heard about Carl in a long time. He was a big famous copy writer at the time. Carl went and saw the thing, bought it, and started affiliating. So he joined the affiliate program, he was like this is awesome. He took that email, sent it to his entire list of this huge thing. So I go to bed. I wake up the next morning, we're at $10,000 in sales. Matt: How much before you went to bed? Russell: Oh, like $30, $40 or something. I was like, what just happened. Did I rob someone? I didn't know what happened. I looked at my email and there's all these people who were like, hey, I bought two of them, I hope you can get your wife that couch. Oh, I sent it to my friend. All these people. Because Carl promoted it, all these other people who follow Carl saw it. Carl is like it's converting like crazy. Tons of people are buying it. I'm freaking out. I'm going to wrestling practice trying to answer customer support. I'm late for practice, I ran into wrestling practice, I get back out I'm like, "Oh my gosh, I made like $600 in sales." I'm freaking out. Anyway, the whole thing goes through and over that, I think it was a seven day sale or something like that, we made $35,000. Which is more money than I'd seen in all my lifetime combined times 100, right? I paid probably 10 grand in affiliates. We made, I don't know, $25,000 that we got to keep. I was like, "Oh my gosh." I told Colette, and Colette's like, my wife. I love her. She doesn't understand the business part of things at all. I was like, "We made $25,000." She was like, "Is it illegal?" First thing. "Are you going to go to jail? Is it illegal?" I'm like, "No, I don't think so. I'm pretty sure." The first thing I did is I went and bought the couch for her, for Christmas. We got it back, I got a picture of her, sent it out to the list saying thank you so much, you got the Christmas gift, the couch. They all celebrated together, all the people. I was like oh my gosh, this is the greatest game of all time. This is so much fun. I was like, what's the next idea, what's the next thing. It was like that, these little things. After that one was done now I had way more customers, all these people that had bought my product knew who I was now so the next thing was easier so it incrementally kept growing and getting bigger. Somewhere along the line I launched the potato gun thing. Upsales of things. We didn't call them funnels back then. We called them sales flows or sales processes. Talk about your sales flow, what's your sales flow. Caleb: Sales flow. Russell: I remember Dylan Jones was our partner at ClickFunnels. Before Todd we tried to build something like ClickFunnels, we called it Click.com.com, which is a horrible name. But Dylan's, I still have all the UI images, and in there we had a whole section for sales flows and all these things. It's like, this was the first ClickFunnels. Because Dylan was on the UI eventually on ClickFunnels anyway, but we literally designed something like this five or six years earlier. Just crazy. Matt: Do you think that all those little failures and all the trying and that kind of energy is what brought you here today? Russell: For sure. It's the key. I wish I could grab everybody because everybody's like, okay, I'm waiting for my ClickFunnels, or I'm waiting for my thing. They're waiting and they're waiting and they're waiting. I was like, the reason why I got this thing was because I didn't wait. If someone were to give me ClickFunnels initially it would have been bankrupt in 15 minutes, right? You have to become worthy of the thing eventually. You don't become worthy by waiting, you become worthy by trying. And trying and trying and trying. Eventually, if you keep doing that, over time, then God's like, all right, he's going to do it. He's built 150 funnels, now I'll give him the idea. Matt: Wow, that's powerful. Speaker 3: How much more did you feel that all your other friends are in the same game? Matt: I hope you guys take there's more that's caught than Todd. That's some gold in what he just shared right there, what you were just sharing. But go ahead. What was the question? Speaker 3: I was just saying how much more would you fail if all your other friends were playing the same game? Russell: All my friends were like why are you launching more stuff? Why do you keep doing things? They do like one product launch a year. They got so annoyed. They were like, dude, stop doing stuff. I'm like, why would I stop doing this? This is so much fun. It was just confusing to me. Why don't you guys do more? Everyone, they make money they'd just be done. Caleb: Why would you keep doing more? Was it genuinely like one funnel away? Like this next funnel's the one. Were you just like you sold yourself on it, this is it, so you keep going? Or did you just really enjoy it? Russell: Well each one I thought was. Each one, every time I was so surprised, like this is amazing. That was the one. The next one's bigger. Oh my gosh, that was even better, who knew? And then I just kept going from there, you know what I mean? So I wasn't waiting for ClickFunnels or anything like that. I was just enjoying the journey every time. It was so exciting. Eventually it was like, oh crap, who knew that that was going to do what it did. Caleb: Was it all emails? Was there any ads or was there anything to scale the traffic? Russell: First 10 years was 100% emails, partnerships. There wasn't ads back then. I mean, there was Google ads, but the first initial Google slap happened about the time I was getting started. Prior to that a lot of guys I knew built their email list off of Google ads and then the slap happened. A lot of them had lists. I started getting to know those guys, going to events, meeting them, so that's how it started initially was tons of that. And then there was this big gap for years where paid ads weren't a thing. Some people did banner ads, but it wasn't consistent. It wasn't like it is nowadays. It was harder. You worked harder and all the stuff wasn't there. Mostly we focused on ... If you didn't have an email list, you weren't playing the game. It's like, who's got lists, how can you build lists, what can you do? Matt: You still think that's true to a degree? Russell: 100%. That's why the traffic seekers book was so important for me to write, I feel like, because most of the people in the game today have been blessed with Zuckerberg's simple Facebook ads that make the game easy. Matt: Wow. Russell: They've never focused on building lists. I was like, you guys, just so you know, Zuckerberg is going to screw us all. It's going to happen. Matt: Yeah. Caleb: It will happen. Russell: It's like, if you don't have a list you're all screwed. I've been through this for 18 years now, I've been through five or six cycles. I've seen people who made millions of dollars who now are not online. The people who have waded the storm the whole time are all the list builders. They're the ones who survived. Everyone else who's good at ads, they come and they go and they come and they go.

Hello and welcome to the bottom-up skills podcast. I'm Mike Parsons the CEO of Qualitance and we are coming to the fourth installment. Of our Revolut series here on the bottom-up skills podcast. And it is all about the brand Revolut. It's about how they promote and what is happening exactly in 2021.So what's really fascinating is rivulets. Success in marketing really begins with the product itself. So together we're going to break that down and then they do great stuff throughout the journey. And it's really, uh, an invitation to participate in the Revolut experience. That's what all the customers receive.It really does feel like a, uh, an invitation. So let's see what's next for the brand. And [00:01:00] let's see if they can conquer the good old us of a. So, as I said, it starts with product. When you think about marketing, when you think about this brand Revolut, it all begins in the product itself, and they have had this huge focus on transparency and speed.And that's why customers love it. They get the basics right now. It is very hard. To kind of market your way out of the bad product, but if you have a good product, you'll be amazed at the share-ability the advocacy and the referral that you can get and Revolut have worked that out. So they definitely have this, um, Science, which is straddling both product and marketing thinking.And what they do is every time you have an experience in app, they are using emails, real-time notifications and a whole assortment of [00:02:00] triggers to not only. Confirm what you've just done. So you know exactly your balance, the state of your transfer, but they're also triggering you to come back into the experience.I mean, sometimes they're even offering you like, uh, games to play. I mean, whatever it takes, they're getting you in out and back into the product regularly and beyond just the digital app. When you go to the card. Particularly the metal card. It's beautiful. But when you go, even beyond that, the unboxing moment in the analog world is even a shareable moment too.And I think this is the first cluster of ideas, great product. They've got some really good behavioral loops inside of the product and anything that is adjacent to the core digital product. They've really thought about cards, the packaging as being shareable moments. [00:03:00] And I would only challenge you to go, go back in life 10 years ago, and then, and still for many, the receipt of banking cards is a non event.And Revolut simply challenged this idea and said, let's make it a shareable moment too, because it comes with status and delight and all those good things. What do we do? We get on the old Instagram, get on the Facebook, we share it. And that of course starts the marketing process. Now there's another thing that they've done brilliantly, which is they've created a lot of shared features in the product.Think there volts split the bill, some of the travel experiences. These are. By default shared experiences. So what happens is you are not only inviting your friends that have the product into the Revolut experience, then naturally you're inviting those that are not customers to come. And [00:04:00] eventually they become customers too.So once you're in and this is this big, um, sort of. Community experience that they drive for is they really involve the customer in many ways that traditional banks would not have even thought of. For example, you can participate in the naming of a feature. You can actually go to their offices and go to one of these things.They call a rev rally. You can hear what they're doing. You can actually meet the people behind the company. Now, when was the last time you saw a traditional legacy bank behaving like that? Even better, they actually published their roadmap. So it's quite agile. So they've got like their, their agile roadmap and it's a Trello board.You can go and view it, comment on it and make suggestions. And throughout your journey as a customer, you can participate in what they call their rev academy. So they are [00:05:00] delighting their customers, entertaining their customers. They're educating their customers. They're saying, come on, help us build this together.And that's all off the back of a, of a great product. That's ruthlessly quick and transparent. They do this on the back of their great, a metal card on the back of their great packaging. So you can start to see how things compound and we'll talk in a little bit about, um, the kind of network effects that they enjoy.The other interesting thing is the really recent news just in April. Is it, they launched a particular, uh, metal card with Anthony Joshua famous, uh, world champion heavyweight boxer. So this is a real step into big boy marketing. This is what you'd expect from global brands. This is what you would expect, maybe from some larger traditional banks.So we'll return to that later in the show, but I want to get to this last. [00:06:00] Notion of how they do their marketing. They are definitely marketing throughout the funnel, because if you think of the top of the funnel is awareness at the bottom of the funnel is referral. And all of those steps in between, they are really optimizing conversion and particularly spending very few paid media dollars to get the job done.That's what you can do when you have a great product. That's what you can do when your product by design puts the marketing inside. So customers go get more customers for you. So, if you look at one of their successful, um, starts, they actually said in the UK that they spent zero paid media dollars to get their first 1.5 million customers.I mean, this has got to have anyone in the marketing world drooling and it's because they invite you into the product. And it's because that product is in fact great. That gives them the permission to do this. Now, if you were to use some more formal thinking around this, this [00:07:00] is what we call their viral coefficient.This means how many customers does your existing customer recruit on your behalf? Now, many customers, um, Would think, man, I won't do this, but what Revolut does is it incentivizes you? So if you want to get a metal card, you can actually get a year for free. If you get five of your friends to sign up, it's a great example of how they incentivize that.So if you look right now from 2017 to today, we're looking at a company that has generated 15 million customers. And that's a lot. And if you think about how little they pay for paid media, in fact, they've definitely had some times where growth hasn't been that quick. Like if you look from 2017 through to 2019, it's not particularly quick, but after a little bit of a plateau in 2019, things really took [00:08:00] off, then COVID hit and they had a few flat months, but actually this is really interesting.As per sort of mid to late, uh, 20, 20 things got going and actually coming into 2021, here we are in May, 2021. And their growth is accelerating too. I think it might be the fastest growth they've ever experienced. Naturally big part of that is the fact that they are expanding globally, but this is, um, But they commonly refer to as their viral loops.This is how they do it. I use all of these, uh, tactics that I mentioned from the top of the funnel to the bottom of the funnel and it compounds. And I think you're going to find that net net, this could be a global company that can say their viral coefficient is one for one, every customer, they win brings a [00:09:00] new customer.What a fascinating. Study what I mean so much to learn from this approach. Remember it starts with product, but however, there's still work to do, um, this Anthony Joshua Revolut X card, uh, they launched that, uh, well over a month ago now. And you know, I'm looking here at the YouTube channel, it's got 14,000 views, their formal announcement clip.That same clip has 5,000 views on Instagram. So. I'm thinking those numbers don't look so crash hot and I'm not seeing much conversation about it. So it tells you getting into some of this traditional branding, um, influencer celebrity partnership. Doesn't look like the biggest success for them. So, Hey, look, work to do, but when you've got a great product and you've got marketing baked in, you can afford some time to learn how to get your branding, [00:10:00] right.So Dave, you've got it. We've broken down the very heart of how Revolut has built a brand, how they are building and marketing a global financial services, super app. That's what they're all about. It starts with that great product. Then inviting the customer to participate the entire journey through, and then you can get some pretty amazing viral coefficients going.Now, if you want to learn how to build a great product is one place. You can go bottom-up dot AI, and there you're going to learn everything. You need to build a great product to build a great credit team, to learn about design thinking and agile, all of those things. Bottom-up dot IO. And there you'll find.Every think you could dream of all right. That's it for the bottom-up skills podcast. That's a wrap. [00:11:00]

It's the playoffs baby! So Dave has to talk about the Knicks losing to Trae Young. Jon wasn't there at this part so he's lucky he missed it. Then the hoopers are joined by Jake Fischer to talk about his book, Built to Lose, and tell stories about meeting Sam Hinkie. Jon joins as well so that's when it gets good. We play Guess the Avi with Jake involving Pacer fans. Then we talk about the Matrix and an update on the Mail Sack Bandit.  Follow us on the Gram--https://www.instagram.com/thesuperhoopers/Like us on facebook:www.facebook.com/TheSuperHoopers/Rate us on iTunes:itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/super…d1053263719?mt=2Cop some Washed brand gear:www.teepublic.com/user/thesuperhoopers

In this episode, Dave and Jamison answer these questions: Questions This question came with a delightful ASCII-art diagram that I will now dictate as follows: “pipe space space space space” JK TLDR: I want to move up the ranks but I’m not sure what might await me… except meetings. What should I expect? And how do I get there? Too Small, Want MOAR! I work in a big enterprise as a Tech Lead in an ““agile team””. So day-to-day I focus on getting our team to build the current feature we’re meant to be building (eg by helping other devs, attending meetings, and sometimes writing code). The next step for my career would be what we call an “Engineering Lead” but I’m having a hard time figuring out what that role actually is and our “EL” is so slammed with meetings I’m afraid to take any of their time to ask… SO - Dave & Jamison, can you enlighten me? What might the goals and life be of someone at that level and how would someone who still codes every day(ish) start figuring out what to do to get there? P.S. It’s taken me about 4 years but I’ve finally managed to listen to every single SSE episode! (I have a kid, binging podcasts isn’t possible for me). P.P.S. In an interview recently I was asked ““What’s the most valuable piece of advice you were ever given?”” to which I replied ““To negotiate for better benefits in job interviews, got it from a podcast called ‘Soft Skills Engineering’””. The interviewer thought that was cool, subscribed to your podcast during the interview then REFUSED TO NEGOTIATE ON ANYTHING! >:( Living in a small town my options as a software engineer have been limited to working for one company straight out of uni for 7 years. Wanting to develop in my career, and knowing you have advised others in the past to move on from their first job out of uni. What is your opinion of seeking out and switching jobs into remote work? Will this provide the same development value found in a traditional job switch, especially after the impact COVID has had on the way companies see remote work.

The Rabbi & The Good Friar take a look at the most common side effect of the COVID-19 Vaccine, which Rod has gotten, but Dave has not. The shot, not the side effect. Meanwhile, in an attempt to offend pretty much everybody, the guys talk about a woman in Colorado, who happens to be an affirmed and ordained minister (just like the guys!) who has a... well... a different approach to getting peoples attention that is outside the norm generally accepted for preachers. Is she wrong? Of course not! That's what "affirming" means! It's the 123rd Birthday of the US Navy's Submarine Force. So Dave is happy... ish...

The Rabbi & The Good Friar take a look at the most common side effect of the COVID-19 Vaccine, which Rod has gotten, but Dave has not. The shot, not the side effect. Meanwhile, in an attempt to offend pretty much everybody, the guys talk about a woman in Colorado, who happens to be an affirmed and ordained minister (just like the guys!) who has a... well... a different approach to getting peoples attention that is outside the norm generally accepted for preachers. Is she wrong? Of course not! That's what "affirming" means! It's the 121st-ish Birthday of the US Navy's Submarine Force. So Dave is happy... ish...

On today's episode it's Twitter Thursday! So Dave is answering a variety of questions, from picking his England squad - the underperformance of Liverpool players - best transfers of all time, and much more. Support this show http://supporter.acast.com/the-epl-index-podcast. See acast.com/privacy for privacy and opt-out information.

Next on the list to reopen? Restaurants. So Dave and Dujanovic check in with a local restaurant owner, David Gonzalez from Restaurant Morelia. Gonzalez found success with improvising take-out methods in 2020. Now, he's trying to flip things back to normal. We'll also speak with Malva Sine with The Utah Restaurant Association who'll go over the fine print of what this new moderate transmission level means for restaurants. See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Jill Harding Whenever I share those stories, people like you look so, so optimistic and you're so bubbly on life with what you've been through. And I said because at the end of the day, my kiddos fortunate, they have taught me a lot about life in ways that I don't know if we didn't go through those experiences, one, I could have taught them as a parent. And secondly, I learned a lot by their endurance, resilience and what they all went through.   INTRO   Sometimes in life, one disruptive life event falls fast on the heels of another.  This can be hard in your personal life…but it can feel especially devastating when the pain affects your children.  And that is what we are going to be talking about today.  My guest is Jill Harding.  She is many things, which I will tell you more about in a second, but she has parented two children through some really hard stuff.  Her oldest child, Grant, was diagnosed with leukemia and her middle child, Berkley, had a life-threatening bout of E.coli.  You will get a behind the scenes look at the challenges and even joy along the journey and learn how to be a better manager, coworker, or friend to people living through similar situations.  Jill lives with her husband and three children in small-town Indiana, in Morgantown.  She has known her husband since the mid-90s and they always said that they would never live in Morgantown or own minivan or live in a log cabin.  But things change.      Jill Harding We live in a little town which we love and adore Morgantown. But I laugh when people ask that question because my husband and I have known each other since the late 90s and we always said no log cabin, no minivan and no Morgantown. And guess what?   Jill Harding We have a minivan and we live in Morgantown and we pass a log cabin to get to our house every day just on the irony of those early and that we don't even think of at our place like it's perfect.   Liesel Mertes All of the cup holders, the door is right, minivan, they're great.   Jill Harding And I love it. You go out and you're grabbing food on the go and they ask you if you need a cup holder. I'm like, Are you kidding me? I got a million in here.   Jill is a marketer, a high school basketball coach, an entrepreneur, and a small business owner.  She is raising three children with her husband.  And when it snows, Jill and her family love to ski and would do it all day, every day if she had the chance.    Liesel Mertes When you and I realize at this stage of life, it can be a precious commodity, especially with COVID. But when you have time to yourself, do you have any hobbies or like ways that you really like to fill your discretionary time?   Jill Harding And we do and I actually my husband and I, we like to just chill out and we have a pretty heavily wooded area that we live in. So we just like to take hikes. And and I like to do them by myself or my husband or even the kiddos. But I really feel like that just rejuvenates all of us.   Jill is also an avid reader; she loves books on leadership and entrepreneurship, but she also makes time for other genres.    Jill Harding And then I also my son is a huge, huge, avid reader, breaking school records, even with his reading accounts while he was in elementary. So he and I kind of share books, too, with his love for reading. In The Land of Stories is a new book series that we started getting into. So reading is another obsession of ours.   Liesel Mertes Ada, my eldest, loves Land of Stories and I know what that is like. It's its own kind of distinct pleasure.   Liesel Mertes I also love to read but a track with one's children. And so Ada and I are just reading together right now.   Liesel Mertes Oh, it's it's a keeper of the Lost Cities, which is a fantasy sort of romp into the land of elves, ogres, et cetera, et cetera, that it's like they're big like 350 page books and there's like eight in the series.   Liesel Mertes So I was reading far too much heavy non-fiction and I took a divergence over the last month and a half. And now just reading elves now at see that.   Jill Harding But I fact that you can talk about it like my sons always like where are you at in the book? And, you know, I asked him the same thing and it's cool to kind of chit chat back and forth on where we're at and live that dream happy together for sure.   Liesel Mertes Well, and I also resonate with I, I feel like I say often that our family is everybody's at their best when we're like outside in the woods.   Liesel Mertes Sometimes it can be a battle to get there with fussing, but it's always so I don't have any gloves or, you know, what have you. What an amazing. But once we get out there, it's so amazing.   Jill Harding We're fortunate to we have a little creek that runs in the bottom of our woods. And just to sit there, I mean, obviously right now it's kind of cold and frozen, but it's still cool just to watch it because, you know, natural beauty for sure.   Liesel Mertes There's something about the just the movement of water and what it brings also, which is its own goodness.   Liesel Mertes Well, you know, children and life with children. That's some of what brings us to this conversation. And I know that you have familiarity with the good people and staff at Riley Hospital, much like I do within my own story.   Liesel Mertes What brought you to Riley when you were pregnant with your second child?   Jill Harding So basically our journey with our son, Grant, he I was telling you before he actually was diagnosed with leukemia at the age of two and a half, and originally our pediatrician was, you know, just running bloodwork, doing this on the other.   Jill Harding And at one point, I guess that that motherly instinct just kicked in and like, no, this isn't good enough. I feel like I know my son. Yes, Grant was our first child, but I feel like I know that this son well enough to know something's just not right.   Jill Harding So I push back to the pediatrician probably more aggressively than they were expecting and just said we get a fine results today because I can't see my son in suffering any longer and they won't ask him,   Liesel Mertes What were you in, what sorts of symptoms was he manifesting?   Jill Harding Yeah, so it was shortly after Christmas and he would not even he got a train table. And if anyone's been around toddlers, two year old toddlers, once they start walking, they don't stop. They run in the raster and they're crazier than ever. And he got to a point where he got a train table for Christmas and he wouldn't even stand up to play at the train table at a little over two. And I was like, someone just doesn't make sense.   Grant continued to languish.  He got strep throat.  There were misdiagnoses by the team of pediatricians.  No meaningful answers.  Which was when the doctors send Grant to Riley Children’s Hospital in the state capitol, Indianapolis.  This was mid-January in 2013.  Grant was put on the 7th floor for infectious disease.    Jill Harding They said we're going to not let you guys leave until we figure out what it is. And we were OK with that because as you mentioned, I was pregnant with our second child.   Jill Harding So we're like, OK, we're going to figure this out because. Obviously, our son means the world to us, and so we stayed there for a couple of days. This was the twenty second, twenty fifth they finally figured out what was going on. And we were so fortunate at the time because the chief of basically the leukemia society are basically our doctor.   Jill Harding He was actually the one that was there doing rounds that day that was diagnosed, which is really mind blowing if you think about it, because Dr. Thallon was actually there and he's the chief and he was one doing rounds.   Jill Harding And he's the one that came in such a compassionate, humble doctor. I mean, more so than I think I've ever been around in my entire life. But he just came in, let us have our moments. He did a spinal tap right in the room with us just to confirm that we were dealing with leukemia, because then once you determine it's leukemia, there's various different types of leukemia that you can have.   Jill Harding And in this case, Grant had what they call HLL, which is if you're going to have the leukemia at two and a half, it was best that he had the HLL as opposed to the AML. So we were fortunate there in that regards. You see a silver lining. It was hard at the time, of course, but once we found that out, then we basically, you know, had a moment. They moved us to the fifth floor and treatment started.   Jill Harding And it was, again, pretty amazing that we had the chief there within the hospital setting that new leukemia very well and was able to walk us through the steps and such a truly compassionate individual. And he had grandchildren himself. So he had kids, my and David's age, which was nice because he knew how to talk to us and help cope with the situation.   Liesel Mertes Well, and as I hear you say in those parts of the story, I feel like it's helpful just to to color around the edges, because there are a couple of things that are going on, right. Like you're seven months pregnant. Also, you guys are not from Indianapolis, but you're in Indianapolis, you know, doing tests at Riley. Are you guys staying at the Ronald McDonald House? Are you in a nearby hotel? Because there's this painful thing that happens with your young child that they're suddenly in the hospital and you're having to recalibrate life to be able to be present. What was that stress like for you guys?   Jill Harding Yeah, that's actually a great question, because we are so fortunate to have family and friends that just basically helped us, people that just came out the woodworks really just to really help be a support system. We actually have a daycare and we our youngest still goes to that daycare today that we have a daycare where they just were showered us with love and ways to support us, to help us with our other just home and just things at home that we need to help with.   Jill Harding And my parents and David's parents both live close by to so grandparents, two sets of grandparents living close by. But thankfully, it's about a forty five minute drive for us. We basically, again, being very pregnant, it was uncomfortable, I'll forget that.   Jill Harding But it still was worth every moment to stay there with great Dave and I. Basically, I was considered basically I was a freelancer at the time and so I had my own business. So flexibility and that I mean, if I had a computer, I could pretty much do my work anywhere.   Jill Harding So that was nice. And then David worked for Indiana Farm Bureau insurance and they were extremely flexible with him working remote. So Dave and I kind of know how to work remote before our even what we're going to do current day is we were able to basically just be there.   Jill Harding We had our computers and thankfully I was still pregnant with our middle child. So it was just Dave and myself and Grant. So we basically just lived in that hospital. They kept us just in the actual in his floor on the fifth floor.   Jill Harding We didn't have to access the Ronald McDonald House other than like sometimes we would go just to get a break from the hospital room itself, take turns and so forth, and utilize the services that they do provide, like meals and so forth that they do provide through that service. And we also have since then paid it back a little, too, just because we know the importance of families who are driving in much more than what we are.   Liesel Mertes Yeah, I remember as as we have gotten care at Riley, just even sitting close by to a Check-In desk and, you know, like, where are you coming from today?   Liesel Mertes And people being like Louisville, all of which is a regional hub of people coming from all over.   Jill Harding Yeah. And we were actually I mean. Forty five minutes. It was it's not a big deal to us, honestly, because we were so fortunate that we had in the care and we would drive farther if we had to. But we're used to driving a half hour really pretty much anywhere. So ready for that we do so.   Liesel Mertes And it was so treatment begins for leukemia. How long was he in the hospital? And then when you coming back for continued treatment beyond that initial hospitalization time?   Jill Harding Yeah. So leukemia is one of those. The cure rate is high. Last I knew when we were looking at the numbers, it's ninety four percent. But the same token, it's a pretty long process.   Grant was placed into a trial program where he would come in for chemotherapy treatments over a course of three years.    Jill Harding So Grant was diagnosed at the age of two and a half. So January of 2013, he was diagnosed. So basically from that January 2013, he basically had three and a half years that we were in and out of Riley during that course of time, and we still actually go to Riley.   Jill Harding We're coming up on so through to have your process pretty aggressive. Aggressive in regards to the chemotherapy. I don't know if you've ever been around anyone that's had it, but to see a young child,   Jill Harding we would laugh because we can laugh about it now because I was very pregnant, right, with my Berkely, my middle child, and I was always hungry.   Jill Harding And then Grant had to be on steroids for 30 days. So he was always really hungry. So we're eating at ungodly hours like 2:00 a.m. He wants chili all of a sudden. But the challenging thing would be on chemotherapy. It kills the good and bad cells. So his body, basically his ANC, which is your ability to fight off infection, was oftentimes next to zero or zero. And so he couldn't need stuff that was leftovers from the night before that we put in refrigerator.   Jill Harding He couldn't eat stuff out in restaurants because it is speck of germ that he could potentially good could cause him to get really sick and can't afford to get sick because his body would have a hard time hearing being sick on top of what he was going through. So I would be out and I tell that story because it makes me laugh now so I could think I was pregnant. I said I would be making chili like two a.m. in the morning and I had to make it from scratch because he could eat with food.   Liesel Mertes Was it was that was that your reality for the duration of the three and a half years of needing to have a certain level of hyper vigilance?   Jill Harding Yes, it definitely was. And I think that we got told and I kudos to our support system and my husband, too, that they were really surprised, the social worker that we dealt with and then obviously his nurses and doctors, that we weren't more hospitalized with Grant, that he was had the fewest hospitalizations with what he was going through because of just our diligence and just awareness when someone we had so many people that wanted to bring us groceries, for instance, and when they would bring us groceries, David and I would be wiping them down with bleach wipes before we even brought it up in the house.   Jill Harding I mean, we were. To a degree, we got such a pretty Cold War, you did, we did, and we always laughed, too, because it was cold, right? It was about this time of year when we were in the thick of it and we laughed because we have we have a big picture window in our dining room. And so we would have all the blinds open and people would come visit Grant through the actual and talk back and forth with walkie talkies to the glass on one side outside.   Jill Harding We'd be on the inside and they so speak to some people would bring over toys and they would bring double the toys again. We'd walk them down with bleach, Grant play with the ones inside and they would be playing the same ones outside. So it was kind of cool. Just some of those things, like you said, we we did just out of we had to get super creative because obviously this is a child. We don't want to take away his childhood.   Jill Harding We have good memories. But this is challenging to go through for him and for us to see him go through it. And I think the beginning to his once we had Berkeley, it was nice because obviously, you know, given the new baby from getting sick was a little easier, too, because she was always in the house with us doing the routine we have with grandma.   Liesel Mertes So you really think as a child, as a baby baby, anyway, I not just the just the innovative kindness of people, you know, coming over with with double the toys and playing, you know, some time has passed as you go back and think about that time I'm struck that you're doing so many things like you're a business person, you are mothering an infant, you're managing the elevated health risks of a child with leukemia.   Liesel Mertes What were some of the what did like a dark day look like for you? What did your feelings of overwhelm like? When would they come up with they catch you off guard?   Jill Harding Yeah, because, again, Grant was our first child, right, so we didn't know, we still don't know where does parenting right. You just kind of learn as you go along. This is the knack of being a parent. But I think the moment when it was challenging the most is, you know, having Berkeley, having a brand new baby, baby infant, trying to nurse her and do all the right things that, you know, the pressures of just raising a child and then making sure that I give her the attention needed, even though she's she still has needs and attention that she needs.   Jill Harding Right. From a mother and father, but not letting that distract from even our care from Grant. I feel like sometimes it was kind of that emotional head game that we played because we know Grant needs extra special attention. We had to make sure we got medicines a certain time. We had doctors appointments on a regular basis, balancing those elements that we know him well, but yet not neglecting or not giving the attention that Berkely needed as a young baby.   Jill Harding I think those things then obviously sleep deprived from it all.   MUSICAL TRANSITION Back to Jill’s story in a moment, because there is still so much more ahead.  But I want to take a moment to thank our sponsor, Handle with Care Consulting.  We know that this year is full of all kinds of stress, and it is hard to know if you are giving your people what they need to survive, stabilize, and thrive in this constantly changing environment.  In all of the confusion, empathy is the skill that your leaders and your team need to build a thriving culture.  And Handle with Care Consulting can help.  With keynotes, workshops, and executive coaching options, we give you the tools to put empathy to work.   MUSICAL TRANSITION   Liesel Mertes I know within my own story, there's our daughter Mercy died and then it was.   Liesel Mertes Maybe three years later for where we got the news that our son, Moses, had a really profound heart condition, that he was going to need lots of open heart surgeries, all that to say going through one hard thing with your children is not a guarantee that you won't go through other hard things later on down the path. I know that that has congruence with your own story. What happened with E. coli and your family?   Jill Harding When you hit the nail on the head, it's hard and I'm sorry you had to go through that, too, but I know in the end it all happens in places that much stronger when you come out on the other side, whatever that result may be. But so Berkely birthdays is our we call our spitfire. She's always been she's a lot like personality wise. And I tell her sorry a the time like me. So but this same time I think I know it helped her just that.   Jill Harding That sassiness, that determination, that that drive she has even at a young age, so I remember vividly because my husband actually went back to nursing school through everything we've been through with Grandma. And he actually became a nurse roughly three years ago. Just everything that we've been through with our son every time he go to hospital because we were there a lot, as you probably could imagine. My husband is just like, I need to be here. I need to be helping people.   Jill Harding And so my husband, kudos to him getting a nursing degree while having three kids at the time. And now he works at the medical ICU in downtown Indy at University Hospital. Kudos to you as well. To partner.   Jill Harding Oh, yeah. I was the bad guy, so supercooled to see him do that, but with that hope man. So he was working at the hospital. It was crazy because it was Sunday and I was not any Sunday. It was the Indy 500. The biggest tackler in the world was happening on this Sunday in May.   Jill Harding And I, I just tell these details because you got to kind of laugh about it, because if you don't laugh about it, then you cry about it and you don't.   Jill Harding But my son, I was so I was home with three kids by myself, right, and Berkley was five when all this happened and my son comes running into I think I was in the kitchen and he said, Mom, I was like, yes, he's like Berkley just pooped.   Jill Harding I'm like, OK, good for like, did you wash your hands? Right. And he's like, no, you don't understand. I'm like, what are you trying to tell me? Then he goes, There's blood in.   Jill Harding And I think I'm like, no, there's probably not blood in his pocket or something. Right. So I'd let it just go. And I just played it off like that because I was like, you know, Grea does not know that there's blood in there because it would have been the same.   Jill Harding He would have been a, Berkeley's by just being kids. Right. Right.   Jill Harding So I just kind of blew it off and she pooped again. And it's like, Mom, no, I'm not kidding. She's got poop in her blood, our blood in her poop. I'm like, are you sure? So me as a mom, like, OK, I'm going to humor them and go look. And I did. And I was just like, well, Grant, thanks for telling me. And this is the eight a little boy telling me this.   Jill Harding Right. And I was like, thank you, buddy, for telling me. He's like, what does it mean? I'm like, I don't know. So I'm basically trying to get a hold of my husband again. I told you, he is a nurse. So very tough to get a hold of him, especially in a medical ICU.   Jill is finally able to get a hold of David, who is working his shift.  Thankfully, a coworker offers to cover his shift so he can rush to Riley to meet Jill.  Jill’s brother came over to be with Grant.  And they arrive, back at Riley, which is familiar but surreal.   Jill Harding We actually went to the E.R. and they immediately didn't mess around. They did bloodwork, urine samples, stool samples, everything you can imagine to run tests on her little body. And they they couldn't figure out what was going on. So lo and behold, they it was so deja vu. They put us on the seventh floor infectious disease floor again.   Jill Harding And still, we have no idea what's going on other than we know there's blood in her stool   Liesel Mertes And are you finding yourself, like, completely emotionally flooded right now, like, oh, I did like some some people kind of like detach almost from the situation. Some people are right in it. Like what's going on for you as a mom?   Jill Harding As a mom, I was Dave and I were like we were so distraught because we have a good friend who's an E.R. doc. And as a dissertation, she actually did a full report. And like leukemia and how leukemia, is it hereditary? If you have multiple children, siblings, would they get it? And so we're like just went through this and there's no way. So we're thinking maybe it's leukemia again because of what we were experiencing. Right.   Jill Harding Similar types of experiences. So, I mean, we were just like almost so surreal that I was it wasn't really even overwhelming. It was just like. OK, we got this we've been here before, we got this we're going to be OK. What a good place. Let's just keep asking the right questions. David the nurse now so he knows more questions to ask. At the time I was back at Cook Medical, so I was in the medical device realm.   Jill Harding So I knew there's products to help from a device perspective. So we just need more questions to ask in this scenario than what we did before, because we obviously have been through life a little bit different than what we were expecting.   Jill Harding So anyways, fast forward, we talk to the doctors. They finally said we don't know what's going on. Too much test. They kept us another night like they did with grea type thing. And they finally figured out, OK, she's dealing with E. coli.   Jill Harding So E. coli, there is a 50 percent chance at her age and being female that she can get something called at us, which is hemolytic uremic syndrome. And in layman's terms, that basically means her renals can go into renal failure. Renals are what feed your kidneys, basically. It started making sense because her urine output started going down, so she had no urine for at least 24 hours at this point and she was drinking.   Jill Harding So we know she's got the fluids coming in, but the fluids aren't going out. And her stomach was getting real distended where it just stuck out, you know, just looked at her. She's a really petite, small little lady. So we knew something just wasn't right. And then they finally figured out that,   Jill Harding OK, she's got E. coli. The strain of E. coli she has could potentially cause her to have HUS. So they monitor, monitor and unfortunately, unfortunately, see how you will. They put us on the fifth floor again.   Jill Harding So we're like, wait a second. The floor is leukemia. We know that floor all too well. We've lived for so many days and hours and they're like, well, we put you on that floor because that's also our transplant floor and it's also our floor that we do dialysis if we need to do dialysis.   Jill Harding And then at this point, two more challenges, because we have two children back home. We have an older and a younger siblings of Berkeley at home. I mean, I know they're in good care, but still I mean, they're scared because I don't know what's going on. They got a lot of questions. And if my brother does, too, because he wants to be able to give them answers when they become available.   So there's well, and I'm free.   Liesel Mertes But that sense of like the limited resources of yourself as a parent to like you physically can't be in two places at once. Yeah, definitely.   Jill Harding And I know, Grant, I mean, obviously, with what he's been through, his heart is pure gold. And, you know, he's cutting my warrior of the three kids. And so he just wanted to be there with us. And it's hard to understand that we got to be here. We'll be there when we can together. Just give us some time.   Berkley is retaining fluid, getting puffier and puffier so the doctors decide to start hemodialysis.    Jill Harding But hemodialysis is basically where they take out. And it's phenomenally crazy to me. If you just think about what I'm about to tell you, the machine is huge. It's about the size of it, like a refrigerator. Basically, the machines are big and they take 10 percent of your blood out and cycle it, filter it through this machine.   Liesel Mertes Wow.   Jill Harding And so they filter it through the machine. So 10 percent of your blood at any given moment in time is in this machine being filtered and then cycled back into your system. So while the things that we learned along the way, she had to have ended up having six different hemodialysis treatments and it just I mean, it was exhausting for her to go through that and.   Liesel Mertes I just want to ask you about, like I can imagine that scene, you're like these are these are not easy procedures.   Liesel Mertes You know, they're involving needles, they're involving discomfort. They're involving multiple checks by nurses. Was there a sense of, like, overwhelm or powerlessness, like just as you're watching your child go through unnecessary pain?   Jill Harding Well, I will say it probably helps in our scenario, David, one being a nurse and then me having a background in medical devices because we knew that these there's great products that the companies that we worked for offered. And then obviously David knew more what was going on than I did.   Jill Harding So he was able to kind of walk me through it. But there's still something we hit the nail on the head to be said about seeing your own child. Right. It's not to dismiss it if it's someone else lying there or if it's even me right there. But to see your own physical child and someone feeling helpless in regards to pain, I will say with Berkely in particular and Grant to adjust their personalities are really different.   Jill Harding Berkley was pretty much she would tell the nurses what to do and she was not messing around. She even during her painful moments, she has grit. We called her tough as nails because she just has this, I don't know, something embedded in her personality that she's a fighter.   Jill Harding She uses a lot of humor to get her through tough times right now at the nurses, she would ask them for things that she knew she can have, like Skittles. But just to keep them on their toes, they'd be like, wait a sec.   Jill Harding You can't have that.   Liesel Mertes A sense of agency. Yep.   Jill Harding And again, she's a little petite, five year old little girl. She's real small. I think she weighed maybe thirty eight pounds at the most during all this. And so she would be on they would weigh her before and after each treatment. And sometimes she lost five, six pounds and hemodialysis treatment because of the fluid that her body was keeping.   Jill Harding Well but during all this she actually got C. diff too. I'm not sure you're familiar with this, but yeah. See that during it all.   Liesel Mertes As you think about those times in the hospital for those who are listening who have not had to be with a child long term in the hospital. What are some things that you wish people knew about what that reality is like?   Jill Harding Hmmm, that's a really tough question. I think that. It gives you a lot of humility, I mean, regards to humble, because David and I have always been very independent individuals, we don't really ask for help.   Jill Harding We just kind of just make it happen because we're strong willed individuals and we'll just find a way.   Jill Harding But I think I know from our experience personally that it's OK. People want to genuinely help others. I mean, that's just human nature. And I think once we put our pride aside and our guard down, it helped us as parents to really do what we needed to do.   Jill Harding And it took away from the challenges of us not being 100 percent present for at the time, Grant. And then that time later, Berkeley.   Jill Harding So I think with those scenarios and in and of itself, it's just. Be compassionate. Ask for help, but if someone doesn't immediately want your help, it's OK because they've got to do it in their own way, right. Because everything is unique to that family, that circumstance, that situation.   Liesel Mertes Yeah, I talked in my trainings that it's not about you as the person who is offering help, like almost never. Is it about, like, judgment on your relationship.   Liesel Mertes It's just even stuff like is messy and so often help. And if the person says, yes, be willing to follow through and if they say no, they don't take it personally yet.   Jill Harding And exactly, because I think what we're going through right now in our world. Right. I mean, like in our situation, we never been through that. And many of our friends have never been to that. Right. So you just got to go with what your instincts. And we rely heavily on our faith because we are people of faith. But at the same token, you know, we never been through that. So, you know, maybe grace to those folks and like you said, get to meet them where they're at because at the same time, we didn't know what we needed or didn't need.   Right.   Liesel Mertes Yeah, that's another thing I say that that the let me know how I can help. Question isn't as helpful as you would think.   Liesel Mertes It would be like finding clean underwear.   Liesel Mertes But I don't know what were some of the best ways that people helped your family?   Jill Harding I think it's just the, um. Just to know that we had the support, right, just a phone call, just even if it's just listen to me cry or David cry or just listen to us in silence, if you will. I think just knowing we had people behind the scenes, I also know that I have since he's passed on. So it hurts my heart to even say this.   Jill Harding But my best buddy and Andrea, we've been best buddies since third grade. Her father wanted to help so bad he's retired. So he had the abilities and means to help them. At the same token, like he would bring us groceries, like unexpectedly. And he kept on like what we liked at Kroger and he would just randomly draw stuff off because he knew he'd done it before. So he kept he was so sweet. He kept a list of our favorite bars or snacks or what have you.   Jill Harding And we just make sure he kept us knocked up that and it's just simple because it wasn't anything like, you know, they put him out too much. It was just kind. Bars are David's favorite potato chips, what have you. Just simple things. But it's still so just like what people are thinking about us.   Jill Harding So just randomly dropping those off our   Liesel Mertes And what beautiful intention also, like, you take time and ask what you liked. And then he wanted to remember it and he didn't have to. It sounds like hassle. You do this, you just realize like these are staples they're always going to enjoy receiving. I'm just going to bring them. I love that.   Jill Harding I was really cool. And and I think that.   Jill Harding Just the the window time we call it window time, where I would actually sit on his window and look out and play with folks, I think just being mindful, even though people have to be guarded in those scenarios that we were in and have to be more inside in their own space and not exposed to other germs outside of their home, just putting that like being creative, I think how we communicated and still played, but yet did it through a different means.   Liesel Mertes Well, I'm thinking about I mean, there's support of you, right, as the parent. There's also the support of your child who has had their world turned upside down. And I imagine it felt meaningful to receive support.   Jill Harding Well and the cool thing about the window, time was allowed to play, like with his his papi. We call David's dad Papi, with his papi outside the window while Grant was inside the window, but allowed David to kick our feet up for a minute and let that Grant was entertained and happy. And we did that for a little while, too, when she came home because she was still her ability to fight off. Infection was still pretty low at some point, too.   Jill Harding So we did the same thing with her as well. But I think just showing folks that you're you've got that support system, whether you tap into it. Again, like you said, you get to meet those individuals where they're at and let them. Like you said, I don't know what I need right now, I just need right. I just need like I don't have one iota of extra creative energy right now.   Liesel Mertes OK, so on the other side, was there anything you don't have to name names, but was there anything that you were on the receiving end of that you would say this is this is just not helpful? Don't do these things.   Jill Harding I think so, yes. The constant like. What's around I'm looking for the constant sharing of, like, knickknack little things like that, either we can only have so much in the hospital and I say this because people just don't know, like birthday was on the transplant floor.   Jill Harding So she couldn't have anything in life. So people would try to send her flowers. Well, she never got to enjoy those because she wasn't able to have those in her room because the thing was soil on it, for instance, anything like breathing, she can I could plants. You can actually have those in her room. So. Yeah, and people didn't know that.   Jill Harding But I think I almost wonder if sometimes that that's the staff at the hospital too.   Jill Harding But I think it's just maybe doing a little bit of homework before you do that kind gesture, because I hated that for the individuals that sent her stuff like that because. You know, that they spent now. Now, great, we said make sure it gets to a nurse's station or it gets to someplace where someone can enjoy it but still going to enjoy it.   Jill Harding And then she saw it from the window and she's like, oh, good. Then we had to talk her off a cliff for a little bit because she thought that she could have was in her room. Right. And I think just if someone says, I don't know what I need right now, don't cry, because they will come and you'll know, but don't force it. Let it be.   Liesel Mertes Yeah, that's a great point.   Liesel Mertes Jill, is there anything that you would like to add that I didn't ask you in our time together?   Jill Harding Um, yeah, I think so.   Jill Harding I think just when we go throughout our days, just know regardless big or small or whatever it is, we all have a story and we just got to be mindful we're all human. Right. And there's no like rulebook on how to be the best human ever. Technically speaking. Right.   Jill Harding So just have compassion for other people and just be realistic in that everyone's got a story. Everyone's weathering something, whether it's big or small, and just realize that, you know, words do hurt more than people realize.   Jill Harding And I think also, too, like back to my kiddos specifically both Grant and Berkeley, they've been Tindley because she's been through all this with us as well. With regards to Berkeley, just let those moments happen. Do the best you can to weather through those moments that make sure you come out on the other end as strong as you can by what you've learned through that moment. And what I mean by that is like   Jill Harding Grant and Berkeley both, like I think that they have learned some things and their characters have been shaped in ways that I feel like would have been really tough for David and I to have instilled in them if they didn't go through the experiences they went through.   Jill Harding Right now, both of them have scars from their great how to put a catheter in Berkeley, had some catheters in her jugular area. So they both have scars. And I tell them all the time and they tell me now to because I've told them so many times. But those are like, that's part of you and that's OK. That's what makes you grant unique. That's what makes you unique. Like everybody else as well. We all have something that's unique to us, kind of like a snowflake in that regard dry.   Jill Harding We're all unique in our own way and don't be ashamed of that. In fact, be proud of that, because those scars have shown that you're still here with us today.   MUSICAL TRANSITION   Here are three key takeaways from my conversation with Jill… There are many restrictions for an individual living with cancer.Hearing all of the challenges with just eating (the concerns about leftovers, the need to clean food etc) gave me a deeper appreciation of how tenuous life and infection can be.  With that in mind, learning a little more before giving gifts (like flowers) is important. Consider what creative engagement with a child who is immuno-compromised (or battling COVID) looks like.I loved the story of play dates through a window with walkie talkies (plus there was the added benefit of giving parents a chance to rest). Remember that “Tell me how I can help” oftentimes is an unhelpful question to people who are already living through something hard.Many times, people don’t know in the moment what they need and they might feel tentative following up with a request afterwards.  Instead, know what you can offer (perhaps a grocery drop-off, a Door Dash certificate, or doing some yard work) and extend a specific offer of help.   OUTRO

On today's episode it's Twitter Thursday! So Dave is answering a wide-range of questions from the Mount Rushmore of football managers, teams advancing in the CL, to finding replacements/backups for Premier League stars. Support this show http://supporter.acast.com/the-epl-index-podcast. See acast.com/privacy for privacy and opt-out information.

Episode 16 - Three Stooges, Unleashed This week we are back to our old shenanigans, but with a small twist. We are joined in the studio for our first three-way show by none other than Brian the Black Heart from Episode 7. "Look, it's the old man from scene 24!" So Dave, Brian White and myself proceed down a twisted road of nonsense and too much alcohol for a full 101 minutes. Once we get talking it can be a bit hard to stop. So please, enjoy the hi-jinx and thank you again for all of your support. This is like therapy for us, and the Good Lord knows we can sure use it. Stay safe. Visit our new https://www.didtheyreallyjustsaythat.com/ (website) to access all of our episodes and read up on the cast and crew of the show! Click the mic in the bottom right corner of the screen of the https://www.didtheyreallyjustsaythat.com/ (website) and leave us a voice message! Tell us why you would like to be a guest on the show! You can now also find us on https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCzsGcIuWckFFKZwhTTY9Aow (YouTube!) Support the show and buy us a cup of coffee by going to https://www.buymeacoffee.com/saythat (buy me a cup of coffee) and make a one-time donation to help us keep the show running! Check us out on Go Live Vegas Internet radio at 8 pm CST tonight! Here is a link to download the app! The new show will also be live everywhere you find podcasts! Episode 16 “Three Stooges, Unleashed”. Download the "Go Live Vegas", Radio free App! Available for phones & tablets from the http://apple.co/2BoLbAn (Apple App) store AND https://bit.ly/32JpJRz (Google Play Store) enjoy! You can also become a https://www.patreon.com/didtheyreallyjustsaythat (patron) of the show and earn rewards like shout outs, early access to episodes, and even become a call-in guest on the show.  Please check out our additional Podcast "Legacy Comics: A History" A Podcast about the rise and fall of one of the most progressive comic shops of our time, You can find it on our https://www.legacycomicshistory.com/ (website) and everywhere you find great podcasts. Music Credits: Backbay Lounge by Kevin MacLeod Link: https://filmmusic.io/song/3408-backbay-lounge License: https://filmmusic.io/standard-license This podcast uses the following third-party services for analysis: Chartable - https://chartable.com/privacy Support this podcast

So, we've all heard about biohacking our bodies to improve longevity and brain function. But what does it mean to biohack our business AI? It unlocks the secrets to improved business longevity and business brain function. Hi everybody this is Grant, welcome to another episode of ClickAI Radio. Okay, a few days ago, I lost my voice. Hopefully it's coming back. I'm leaning into my microphone. All right. So I wanted to talk a little bit about biohacking. What the heck does that mean as it relates to our businesses? So a couple years ago, I was reviewing a blog. It was something by Dave Asprey, those of you that watch or listen to him, view him, many of you him as a father of biohacking. Anyway, there there were two big buckets where biohacking was being applied, right. One was longevity. And the other was improved brain function. So if you're thinking about, Hey, I'm trying to improve my personal health, right, I'm looking at how can I improve? You know, the or I should say, increase the probabilities that I'll live longer. And then of course, another way of biohacking is to say, I want to think better, right? I want to use my brain better. Right now. In reality, I think we want both of those qualities in our businesses, right? So we want our business to thrive with longevity. And we want our business brain functions, of course, to operate at the right level, like Grant, what's a business brain function? Well, I think it's the ability for the business to operate and grow intelligently. I use that word intentionally, because there are some kinds of growth that are not that intelligent. In fact, it's actually bad for the business. Now, I'm going to assert that our businesses are like living entities. Well, okay. You remember in one of the old Mission Impossible Tom Cruise movies, I think he makes this statement one time where he's talking and he says, Hey, he says, the traffic on our road, like on a freeway, he, I think he said, is like a living organism. Someone taps on their brake and I ripples through the whole system. Obviously, that's a bit of a joke. But there's an analogy here, right? Because our businesses have moving and interrelated parts. So let's let's turn back here to Dave Asprey. So he outlined seven, seven elements here for biohacking our bodies. Now, what I'm going to do is I'm going to do an analogy here, of those seven elements, but I'm going to apply it to our businesses. With AI. We're going to hack our businesses with AI by using Dave's seven elements. All right, you're ready. All right, getting your seat lean forward. Okay. Here's the first one. The first principle the Dave points out is gut punch your posture. All right? When I think about gut punching my posture, what the heck does that mean, in my business? Well, typically, if I'm going to change my posture, it means in business sense, I'm going to change the positioning of my business structure. Right. So this often means that I'm changing roles and responsibilities or operations, obviously, the way things are structured, and how things are sitting or moving. So in an AI sense, a real common theme when evaluating AI insights on our business, is the realization that we need to make adjustments to the way the business operates. Now this can feel like a gut punch as this affects people's positions and jobs and what they're used to doing. So it turns out this first biohack gut punch your posture applies to AI in business, because we're going to be making changes to the business structure. All right, you're ready. Number two, eat nutrition. All right, that makes sense. How does that apply to business? Well, we're talking about intake here, right? What is it that we intake in our business, and while there's several things, one of those is clients, and bringing in good clients that are that are right fit for the business purpose. Actually critical. Now we want to use AI as a way to understand the patterns of best customer behavior. In other words, we want to do those, we want to know those that we serve the best. And we want to optimize towards that. Now not doing this brings pain to your business and your body. It's like eating a steady diet of Twinkies. That's not good, right? So you may get the initial Sugar Rush of the business deal closing by bringing in that bad client. But afterwards, you're going to experience nausea, headaches, stomach pains, fat gain and muscle loss. Did I miss anything? Well, I had that experience one time, it was in one of my startup companies, we desperately wanted to go do this business. And it was a one off it was different than what we were actually always doing. But we thought, Oh, this would be cool to have, you know, this big name associated with our company. So we kept pursuing it. And we signed this million dollar deal. No, no, no doubt million dollar deal. I felt like King of the Mountain man, I was having the Twinkie Sugar Rush. I was like, whoo, next thing I know, off the next nine months were hellish. It was painful. Yeah. Yeah, not the right thing to do for our business. Okay, so we use AI to understand those best fit customer patterns and to see them clearly and optimized, lean into those right? Eat nutrition for our business, right? Bring in the right kinds of clients. Okay, let's move on to number three. So get in touch with nature. So Dave says, hey, go get in touch with nature. I'm all for that. I'm a mountain guy. I love the mountains. Alright. So get in touch with nature for our businesses. What this is really saying is, I want to build connections with things that are outside of my four virtual walls, whether they're physical or virtual. Right, getting in touch with nature is leaving our places where we typically are. And getting back to first principles. So getting outside of our four virtual walls, it's interacting with other sources. Like I saw recently, Elan musk says, How do you say that five times fast? musk says I don't know I'm not on Elan musk does open AI API. It's actually really cool, right? And someone is built a this cool app on it called AI channels. All right. Here's the cool part about it. The idea is, is that you reach outside of your typical surroundings and you're looking for insights from the world around you. Right now this is viewing AI. It's this is important because you want to view AI as augmented intelligence, right? You want to use it to open the door to viewing the world differently and getting additional insights. Peck I even think Gutenberg, when he designed the press, the printing press, he pulled insights from multiple industries together to create that. So when we get in touch with nature, we go to first principles, but we also look outside of our typical surroundings for other insights around us. All right, number four, number four, here we go. expose yourself to sunlight. Alright, so this can literally mean exposing yourself, as well as your business leaders to insights, right, the sun brings light and insights. This is critical. Now, not long ago, I was working with a team where some AI and analytics insights were made available to senior leaders of a company However, they did everything they could to avoid, dismiss and hide the findings because it put a bad light on some of their previous actions and business decisions. And so you know, if you're going to expose your business to the quote unquote, Ai, sunlight, it requires some vulnerability on your part on each of our parts. So this is a critical piece of biohacking our businesses, right, exposing the things we may not have done well, and being willing to make adjustments. All right, to move towards the truth, that's much more important. All right, let's move on to number four, my number five number six, otherwise counting the number every go it's achieve a state of consciousness. Now, sometimes, you know from a biohacking perspective, this means breathing. Alright, fact let me take a breath. There we go. All right, I took a breath. Alright. So taking pause as a business. Now that's a critical part of any business, right? In fact, I've seen change fatigue overwhelm multiple organizations, right, we get really excited about Oh, I'm gonna go make these changes, right. I'm gonna pivot my business to the future. All of that is great. I watched another company recently use AI and data analytics to make changes to their internal business operations. And they did it on a regular basis. And it was awesome. They were really methodical about it did a great job. And so this had some initial positive benefits. But that's kind of turned addictive, right? So the company continued to push new change after new change, you know, leveraging the insights, that's all good. But over time, the employees started to experience change fatigue. And so AI must be used with care when doing this, right, we have to gauge the right way to do this, how fast to do this. So achieve a state of consciousness in our business makes a lot of sense. All right. And then the last one that I mentioned here is, again, this is from Dave Asprey, his last show gratitude? Well, I'm all for that. I think that's really huge. In fact, every day in my personal journals, I try to write down things of gratitude. How did what were the great blessings that I saw in my life for the life of my family, the day before. And so I pause and reflect on that. So that's early in the morning when I'm trying to get my mojo on. But that's, that's a great way to start the day. So show gratitude. As a business, I found it helpful to give back as you know, to worthy causes. In fact, my son, Steve just did that recently, he identified some charities with his business to give into really awesome. Now, a critical goal of AI should be to improve not only the efficiencies of the business, but really we I think we have a broader responsibility to improve the well being of the customers we're serving and of the employees that we're bringing into our companies. Now. The goal, of course, is to bring a higher quality of life. Right. And I think that's a critical element to the ethical and healthy use of AI. This open ai.com site says, Hey, I'm reading the quote here. They're like discovering and enacting the path to safe artificial general intelligence. Yeah. Okay. That makes sense. All right. All right. It's a balance in all of this now, the activities for biohacking our bodies, I think, you know, in order to improve longevity and approve brain functions, I think they're admirable, and some care and caution has to be you know, has to be used when applying that some people get way out there. But I would also say in a similar manner, biohacking our businesses with AI requires the same need for exploration and balance. So with that, I'd say let's go explore. Hey everyone, thanks for joining and until next time, let's get started biohacking your business with AI. Thank you for joining Grant on ClickAI Radio. Don't forget to subscribe and leave feedback. And remember to download your FREE eBook, visit ClickAIRadio.com now.

So, we've all heard about biohacking our bodies to improve longevity and brain function. But what does it mean to biohack our business AI? It unlocks the secrets to improved business longevity and business brain function. Hi everybody this is Grant, welcome to another episode of ClickAI Radio. Okay, a few days ago, I lost my voice. Hopefully it's coming back. I'm leaning into my microphone. All right. So I wanted to talk a little bit about biohacking. What the heck does that mean as it relates to our businesses? So a couple years ago, I was reviewing a blog. It was something by Dave Asprey, those of you that watch or listen to him, view him, many of you him as a father of biohacking. Anyway, there there were two big buckets where biohacking was being applied, right. One was longevity. And the other was improved brain function. So if you're thinking about, Hey, I'm trying to improve my personal health, right, I'm looking at how can I improve? You know, the or I should say, increase the probabilities that I'll live longer. And then of course, another way of biohacking is to say, I want to think better, right? I want to use my brain better. Right now. In reality, I think we want both of those qualities in our businesses, right? So we want our business to thrive with longevity. And we want our business brain functions, of course, to operate at the right level, like Grant, what's a business brain function? Well, I think it's the ability for the business to operate and grow intelligently. I use that word intentionally, because there are some kinds of growth that are not that intelligent. In fact, it's actually bad for the business. Now, I'm going to assert that our businesses are like living entities. Well, okay. You remember in one of the old Mission Impossible Tom Cruise movies, I think he makes this statement one time where he's talking and he says, Hey, he says, the traffic on our road, like on a freeway, he, I think he said, is like a living organism. Someone taps on their brake and I ripples through the whole system. Obviously, that's a bit of a joke. But there's an analogy here, right? Because our businesses have moving and interrelated parts. So let's let's turn back here to Dave Asprey. So he outlined seven, seven elements here for biohacking our bodies. Now, what I'm going to do is I'm going to do an analogy here, of those seven elements, but I'm going to apply it to our businesses. With AI. We're going to hack our businesses with AI by using Dave's seven elements. All right, you're ready. All right, getting your seat lean forward. Okay. Here's the first one. The first principle the Dave points out is gut punch your posture. All right? When I think about gut punching my posture, what the heck does that mean, in my business? Well, typically, if I'm going to change my posture, it means in business sense, I'm going to change the positioning of my business structure. Right. So this often means that I'm changing roles and responsibilities or operations, obviously, the way things are structured, and how things are sitting or moving. So in an AI sense, a real common theme when evaluating AI insights on our business, is the realization that we need to make adjustments to the way the business operates. Now this can feel like a gut punch as this affects people's positions and jobs and what they're used to doing. So it turns out this first biohack gut punch your posture applies to AI in business, because we're going to be making changes to the business structure. All right, you're ready. Number two, eat nutrition. All right, that makes sense. How does that apply to business? Well, we're talking about intake here, right? What is it that we intake in our business, and while there's several things, one of those is clients, and bringing in good clients that are that are right fit for the business purpose. Actually critical. Now we want to use AI as a way to understand the patterns of best customer behavior. In other words, we want to do those, we want to know those that we serve the best. And we want to optimize towards that. Now not doing this brings pain to your business and your body. It's like eating a steady diet of Twinkies. That's not good, right? So you may get the initial Sugar Rush of the business deal closing by bringing in that bad client. But afterwards, you're going to experience nausea, headaches, stomach pains, fat gain and muscle loss. Did I miss anything? Well, I had that experience one time, it was in one of my startup companies, we desperately wanted to go do this business. And it was a one off it was different than what we were actually always doing. But we thought, Oh, this would be cool to have, you know, this big name associated with our company. So we kept pursuing it. And we signed this million dollar deal. No, no, no doubt million dollar deal. I felt like King of the Mountain man, I was having the Twinkie Sugar Rush. I was like, whoo, next thing I know, off the next nine months were hellish. It was painful. Yeah. Yeah, not the right thing to do for our business. Okay, so we use AI to understand those best fit customer patterns and to see them clearly and optimized, lean into those right? Eat nutrition for our business, right? Bring in the right kinds of clients. Okay, let's move on to number three. So get in touch with nature. So Dave says, hey, go get in touch with nature. I'm all for that. I'm a mountain guy. I love the mountains. Alright. So get in touch with nature for our businesses. What this is really saying is, I want to build connections with things that are outside of my four virtual walls, whether they're physical or virtual. Right, getting in touch with nature is leaving our places where we typically are. And getting back to first principles. So getting outside of our four virtual walls, it's interacting with other sources. Like I saw recently, Elan musk says, How do you say that five times fast? musk says I don't know I'm not on Elan musk does open AI API. It's actually really cool, right? And someone is built a this cool app on it called AI channels. All right. Here's the cool part about it. The idea is, is that you reach outside of your typical surroundings and you're looking for insights from the world around you. Right now this is viewing AI. It's this is important because you want to view AI as augmented intelligence, right? You want to use it to open the door to viewing the world differently and getting additional insights. Peck I even think Gutenberg, when he designed the press, the printing press, he pulled insights from multiple industries together to create that. So when we get in touch with nature, we go to first principles, but we also look outside of our typical surroundings for other insights around us. All right, number four, number four, here we go. expose yourself to sunlight. Alright, so this can literally mean exposing yourself, as well as your business leaders to insights, right, the sun brings light and insights. This is critical. Now, not long ago, I was working with a team where some AI and analytics insights were made available to senior leaders of a company However, they did everything they could to avoid, dismiss and hide the findings because it put a bad light on some of their previous actions and business decisions. And so you know, if you're going to expose your business to the quote unquote, Ai, sunlight, it requires some vulnerability on your part on each of our parts. So this is a critical piece of biohacking our businesses, right, exposing the things we may not have done well, and being willing to make adjustments. All right, to move towards the truth, that's much more important. All right, let's move on to number four, my number five number six, otherwise counting the number every go it's achieve a state of consciousness. Now, sometimes, you know from a biohacking perspective, this means breathing. Alright, fact let me take a breath. There we go. All right, I took a breath. Alright. So taking pause as a business. Now that's a critical part of any business, right? In fact, I've seen change fatigue overwhelm multiple organizations, right, we get really excited about Oh, I'm gonna go make these changes, right. I'm gonna pivot my business to the future. All of that is great. I watched another company recently use AI and data analytics to make changes to their internal business operations. And they did it on a regular basis. And it was awesome. They were really methodical about it did a great job. And so this had some initial positive benefits. But that's kind of turned addictive, right? So the company continued to push new change after new change, you know, leveraging the insights, that's all good. But over time, the employees started to experience change fatigue. And so AI must be used with care when doing this, right, we have to gauge the right way to do this, how fast to do this. So achieve a state of consciousness in our business makes a lot of sense. All right. And then the last one that I mentioned here is, again, this is from Dave Asprey, his last show gratitude? Well, I'm all for that. I think that's really huge. In fact, every day in my personal journals, I try to write down things of gratitude. How did what were the great blessings that I saw in my life for the life of my family, the day before. And so I pause and reflect on that. So that's early in the morning when I'm trying to get my mojo on. But that's, that's a great way to start the day. So show gratitude. As a business, I found it helpful to give back as you know, to worthy causes. In fact, my son, Steve just did that recently, he identified some charities with his business to give into really awesome. Now, a critical goal of AI should be to improve not only the efficiencies of the business, but really we I think we have a broader responsibility to improve the well being of the customers we're serving and of the employees that we're bringing into our companies. Now. The goal, of course, is to bring a higher quality of life. Right. And I think that's a critical element to the ethical and healthy use of AI. This open ai.com site says, Hey, I'm reading the quote here. They're like discovering and enacting the path to safe artificial general intelligence. Yeah. Okay. That makes sense. All right. All right. It's a balance in all of this now, the activities for biohacking our bodies, I think, you know, in order to improve longevity and approve brain functions, I think they're admirable, and some care and caution has to be you know, has to be used when applying that some people get way out there. But I would also say in a similar manner, biohacking our businesses with AI requires the same need for exploration and balance. So with that, I'd say let's go explore. Hey everyone, thanks for joining and until next time, let's get started biohacking your business with AI. Thank you for joining Grant on ClickAI Radio. Don't forget to subscribe and leave feedback. And remember to download your FREE eBook, visit ClickAIRadio.com now.

Cloudy Title Drama (LA 1421) Transcript: Steven Butala: Steve and Jill here. Jill DeWit: Hello. Steven Butala: Welcome to the Land Academy Show, entertaining land investment talk. I'm Steven Jack Butala. Jill DeWit: And I'm Jill DeWit, broadcasting from sunny Southern Arizona. Steven Butala: Today Jill and I talk about cloudy title drama. Jill DeWit: What the heck? All right. This, like yesterday's topic, came from our staff. Steven Butala: From our customer service staff. Jill DeWit: Our customers, actually. Because this comes up a lot. And I want to say, to quote you, Jack, "Everyone, everyone, everyone." There's things to get worked up about and things not to get worked up about, and this is not a thing to get worked up about, and a lot of people do. So that's the whole point here, it's like, "Oh my gosh, how do I uncover this?" It manifests into this big problem and it doesn't have to be that big of a problem. So we're going to talk a minute about the drama. Are you a drama person? Because that could be part of the problem there, number one, but we'll tackle that. Steven Butala: Oh, that was right in my whole talk today. Jill DeWit: What other drama is in your life? Steven Butala: The cloud on the title is not really the problem. Jill DeWit: That's not the problem, exactly. It's the problem right now, but it's not the problem. Number two, we're going to talk to you about, okay, what's really important here? And then number three, I have solutions for you. Steven Butala: Before we get into it, let's take a ... I was going to start down the path of defining a chain of title, but we'll do it in a minute. Before we get into it, let's take a question posted by one of our members on the landinvestors.com online community. It's free, and additionally, if you're a member, join us on Discord as a Land Academy member. Jill DeWit: For a lot of more exciting chat. All right, Dave wrote, "Two times now I've downloaded a bunch of what was supposed to be vacant land data from DataTree only to find out that 25 to 35% of records are actually the owners' residence and are not in fact vacant. What the heck am I doing wrong? This is super frustrating. Anyone else having this problem, or better yet, know what I need to do to avoid this? Steven Butala: Sure, I'm happy to help. 25 to 35% of a data download that you end up not using the data is not that bad. If you would download 10,000 records and you end up using eight or 7,500 of them, you're going to scrub that stuff out because ... And there's, that I know of, no way to really avoid it. In this case specifically, if you're getting data records that are residences with vertical construction on it, it's happening because ... And this is all in education. So Dave, I hope you remember. I'm not sure if you are, but if you go through all the education, Land Academy 1.0 and 2.0, it's in all in there about how to do this. And again, that's what Discord is for. And I think I actually pulled this question off of Discord. Anyway, there's two or three or four or five ways to make sure you don't get property that have vertical structures on it and that's through ... Every single property should have two types of assessments so that the assessor can tell the treasurer how much taxes, real estate taxes, to charge every year. The land value and the vertical value, or the improvement value is what it's called. If the improvement value is zero, then you know it's a piece of land. The problem is that not every ... There's no universal way to book data from assessor to assess her. You can imagine, an assessor in Arkansas that hasn't yet computerized their operation in 2021 versus an assessor in let's say Silicon Valley where computers were actually created. There's going to be a pretty substantial difference between how they contribute that data. So the answer is to be redundant. There's vertical assessment percentages that need to be zero. There's vertical or improvement assessed values that ...

In this first of the "Spread Hope" series, Dave Belfield talks about God's promises which bring hope to us. Despite God's promises being yes and amen, sometimes things can appear hopeless for us - and we question God. So Dave reminds us that "hope deferred" is not hope denied - because God never lies. The hope we carry is about having a future, despite not having all the answers. After all, hope is all about confident assurance.

This is mostly a replay of a segment from Ep 75. But, since most Podcast apps only have our episodes from 135 to current, this will likely be new to most. Way back in 2017, just before The Last Jedi was to be released, Dave and Jay used to assign each other Movie Homework assignments. Jay assigned a few movies to Dave that he absolutely hated and vice versa. But Dave had enough when Jay very much hated Evil Dead 2; Dead by Dawn (one of Dave's favorites). So as punishment Dave made Jay watch the Star Wars Holiday Special (Follow this link to watch it if you haven't seen it already). Flash forward to Christmas 2020 and it has been a long time since Dave and Jay have gotten to do a Movie Cocktail. So Dave whipped up a brand new, Star Wars themed, Life Day cocktail called 'Life Day Wookie Chocolate' for you to enjoy and get a little extra merry this year. Here are the ingredients. -2oz Vodka -1/2oz Kahlua -1/2oz Ameretto -1 Packet of Hot Chocolate Mix -2 Cups Milk -1/4 Cup Hazelnut Creamer -Garnish w/ Marshmallows, Ground Cinnamon. and top with a Cinnamon Stick. -Please make sure to heat your milk and creamer....I hope i don't need to remind you of that when you make HOT chocolate. Merry Christmas to all of you who listen and support us. We can't thank you enough. CHEERS! Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Our EcomCrew family is growing year after year, and we’ve been welcoming new members since we first launched. However, despite the unique individuals who join the community, we’ve been noticing some questions that are constantly recurring be it in our exclusive Facebook group, in the emails, or during our monthly webinars. So Dave and I decided to pool together the top 5 questions that our Premium members are asking and answer them on this podcast. You might be having the same queries yourself, so this is a great episode for you to finally get the answers! Timestamps: The silver lining of the pandemic for me - 4:50 Question 1: Should your blog content be on a standalone domain or should you have it on your e-commerce website? - 9:25 The advantages of having a standalone blog - 10:51 Question 2: When should you group your products together? - 13:37 How eliminating some of my products helped my conversion rates - 15:52 The effect of launching a variation of a successful product - 20:20 Question 3: When should you open a second Amazon account? - 21:40 The advantages and disadvantages of making a separate Amazon account for different brands - 24:10 Question 4: What type of URLs do you use when sending traffic to Amazon? - 29:48 Question 5: When should you stop optimizing your Amazon listings and work on another product? - 36:20 What I did when our competitors started copying our listings - 39:00 Our plans for EcomCrew in 2021 - 42:20 Aside from these five questions, a lot more are being answered within our EcomCrew Premium community. If you want to be a part of the team for free and join us on our exclusive webinars, you can tell us what your favorite Amazon software is so you can get the chance to win an EcomCrew annual subscription! If you’re already a member, we’ll extend your membership for another year. All you need to do is answer four quick questions, and you can be the lucky winner. We hope you enjoyed this episode, and if you did, don’t forget to leave us a review on iTunes. It helps this podcast a lot, and we’d really appreciate it if you do. Until the next episode! Happy selling!

Do you ever pay much attention to your feet? Our feet are our first point of contact with the ground, and we walk around on them all day. But most people just wear shoes and call it a day. And if you’re a runner, then all the more reason to maintain good foot health! So how do we take care of our feet? Dave Liow, an exercise physiologist and holistic movement coach, joins me in this episode to discuss feet and how to optimise foot health. We talk about some common foot conditions, and he also shares advice on selecting the right shoes and improving foot mechanics. For runners and everyone else, don’t miss this episode and learn how you can achieve good foot health!   Get Customised Guidance for Your Genetic Make-Up For our epigenetics health program all about optimising your fitness, lifestyle, nutrition and mind performance to your particular genes, go to  https://www.lisatamati.com/page/epigenetics-and-health-coaching/. You can also join their free live webinar on epigenetics.   Online Coaching for Runners Go to www.runninghotcoaching.com for our online run training coaching.   Consult with Me If you would like to work with me one to one on anything from your mindset, to head injuries, to biohacking your health, to optimal performance or executive coaching, please book a consultation here: https://shop.lisatamati.com/collections/consultations   Order My Books My latest book Relentless chronicles the inspiring journey about how my mother and I defied the odds after an aneurysm left my mum Isobel with massive brain damage at age 74. The medical professionals told me there was absolutely no hope of any quality of life again, but I used every mindset tool, years of research and incredible tenacity to prove them wrong and bring my mother back to full health within 3 years. Get your copy here: http://relentlessbook.lisatamati.com/ For my other two best-selling books Running Hot and Running to Extremes chronicling my ultrarunning adventures and expeditions all around the world, go to https://shop.lisatamati.com/collections/books.   My Jewellery Collection For my gorgeous and inspiring sports jewellery collection ‘Fierce’, go to https://shop.lisatamati.com/collections/lisa-tamati-bespoke-jewellery-collection.   Here are three reasons why you should listen to the full episode: Find out how to take better care of your feet. Discover the benefits of going barefoot. Learn how to select the right shoe for you.   Resources Holistic Movement Coach on YouTube The HMC Footy Show, foot exercises on YouTube How to start looking after your feet on YouTube Exercises for bunions on YouTube Holistic Movement Coach website   Episode Highlights [03:29] Why Feet? When he started looking at movement, Dave noticed that the feet were one of the areas trainers had no idea about. People have 28 bones in the feet and 55 articulations from below the knee. Over a third of the bones here are in the feet, which tells us how important they are. It’s an area largely being neglected by movement experts and professionals. [05:45] What Shoes Do to Our Feet So much space in the brain is devoted to our feet and hands, and if you walk around with sensory deprivation chambers on them, you’ll lose that space. The bottom of the foot (plantar fascia) is extremely precarious, full of reflectors that send information to your brain about how you’re moving and interacting with the ground. By wearing shoes, we break that link. [09:56] Improving Foot Mechanics and Foot Health Keep your feet out of shoes as much as possible. Whenever Dave has the chance to go barefoot, he does. By going barefoot, you are giving as much information to your feet as you possibly can. Shoes provide a lot of support for your feet. Not wearing shoes will improve your feet’s strength. A healthy foot is a mobile foot. If you can’t do a lot with your toes, it shows you need to do some conditioning on your feet to make them smarter and stronger. Plantar fasciitis is one of the most common foot problems runners encounter. Listen to the full episode to learn more about some of the most common foot conditions! [17:21] Bunions and How They Affect Your Foot Health The exact cause of bunions is up for debate, but there is certainly a genetic and environmental component to it. A bunion is when your big toe starts to go in and some calcification forms around the joint. Bunions cause compressions in the foot, leading to problems in the nerves between the bones of your foot. There should be adequate space between your toes, allowing your foot to move and breathe. This also applies to your footwear—your shoe should have a wide toe box to give your toes enough space. You can do foot exercises for bunions to prevent the need for surgical treatment. [24:10] How to Deal with Plantar Fasciitis Typically, people who have plantar fascia issues will feel the bottom of their foot locked up, especially in the morning. Increasing your running distance too quickly and incorrect foot mechanics are common causes of plantar fasciitis. Icing the foot takes some of the pain away. Applying light pressure on the affected area can hydrate the tissues and make them healthier. Adding the right kind of load to it will help line up the fibres and make it strong again. Movement issues can disappear if you keep your body balanced. [29:55] On Running Shoes Dave and Lisa talk about a shoe that reportedly takes 4% of your running time. More track records are broken lately due to the improvement in the technology used to create running shoes. These new shoes are all about sports and performance, not health. There are different types of shoes for different purposes. Being barefoot all time can also cause issues because what goes on your skin can absorb what goes on it. [37:11] The Truth about High Heels When you add an incline to your heel, it lifts you and pushes you forward, breaking your kinetic chain. To avoid falling on their faces, people who wear high heels adjust by pushing their posture forward and arching the lower back more. When you’re in high heels, you’re effectively pointing your toes. This shortens the calf muscles, which can end up reducing the motion in your ankle, pulling you into pronation, and collapsing the arch. Wearing high heels often can change the way your muscles work. [44:21] Supplementation for the Cartilage and Joints Dave reads up on what he thinks is useful and what’s not, and he uses it on an individual basis. A decent multivitamin is a good place to start. Dave is a fan of probiotics and fish oil. However, if you’re sensitive to histamine, do your research first before taking probiotics. He also recommends working fermented food like kimchi and sauerkraut into your diet if it suits you. [51:08] Dave’s Take on Orthotics Dave thinks if you have a foot without a structural issue or a neurological deficit, you can do without orthotics. Orthotics provide support and are often prescribed to block motion. Foot mechanics change when you have your foot on the ground versus in the air. A lot of the mechanics that are put into orthotics aren’t done in a closed chain, which changes the whole way the foot works. If you think you may need an orthotic, consult first with someone who knows how they work and can give you proper advice. Dave takes a holistic approach when it comes to foot health [1:00:06] Dave’s Experience with Reflexology There are different types of reflexology, but it’s often associated with feet. The idea is your body is represented in smaller areas of your body that you can access. Dave has tried reflexology on himself, and it worked well. He particularly had some good results with the sinus points around the toes, which help to clear the sinuses. He finds it relaxing, because looking after your feet is looking after your whole body—it’s all connected. [1:02:52] How to Select the Right Shoe Be careful of the marketing of shoe science. In reality, it isn’t the shoe that makes the difference. Pick a neutral shoe that feels good. Research shows the more comfortable your shoe is, the more efficient you are. Get the lightest and the most minimalist shoe that you are happy with.   7 Powerful Quotes from This Episode ‘I’m constantly dumbfounded by how little care people have taken on their feet’. ‘The foot and the ankle are a huge player in my model and certainly one that I think having a very big impact on how people move well’. ‘Shoe choice doesn’t start and finish when you’re done running—it’s throughout the day’. ‘Be careful where you expose your feet to because it will go in you and then we'll take it into your health. There's time and place for everything’. ‘It’s not about speed and power… It’s keeping everything as best as you can in optimal performance and stopping things before they fall down the cliff and being in that preventative space’. ‘If you think you can get everything out of your diet, even if you’re eating organic, you probably can’t… So certainly, some supplementation is useful’. ‘It’s not the shoe that does the running; it’s the person that does the running. Technique and conditioning and looking after yourself and your health has much more effect than a shoe ever will’.   About Dave Liow Having mentored many coaches and trainers in New Zealand and Australia, Dave Liow is following his passion for sport and health and love for teaching. As a health professional, exercise physiologist and the founder of the Holistic Movement Coach Programme, he is constantly striving to find ways to be healthier and move better. You may connect with Dave on LinkedIn or Facebook. You can also visit his website or watch his YouTube videos to learn how to take better care of your feet.   Enjoy the Podcast? If you did, be sure to subscribe and share it with your friends! Post a review and share it! If you enjoyed tuning in, then leave us a review. You can also share this with your family and friends so they can know how to achieve good foot health. Have any questions? You can contact me through email (support@lisatamati.com) or find me on Facebook, Twitter, Instagram and YouTube. For more episode updates, visit my website. You may also tune in on Apple Podcasts. To pushing the limits, Lisa   Full Transcript of the Podcast! Welcome to Pushing The Limits, the show that helps you reach your full potential with your host, Lisa Tamati, brought to you by lisatamati.com. Lisa Tamati: Hi everyone, and welcome back to Pushing The Limits this week. So I have two guests. Dave Liow this time. Now Dave is a repeat offender on the show, and I love having him to guest. He is one of my great mentors. And I hope you're gonna get a lot out of today's session.  Today, it's all about feet or so. This is one for the runners out there for sure. But also for just optimizing your foot health and also the whole kinetic chain, your feet where you connect with the ground obviously, and it affects your whole body. So we go to a deep dive into looking after yourself in regards to your feet. For the runners out there, it's all about playing for charters and bunions and picking the right running shoes. But there's also a whole lot of need for people to just have—want to know about good foot health.  Before we head over to the show, Christmas is coming. So if you want to grab one of my books, or one of my jewellery pieces, I’ll love that. You can head over to lisatamati.com. All the things are on there. And we're gonna be having a little break over the Christmas period. Maybe one, maybe two weeks from the show. I'm not quite sure at the stage, depending on the team's requirements over that period. So I hope you do have a good time of the Christmas. If you're listening to this afterwards, I hope the New Year's starting off really well for you. Before I go over to the show, just a reminder, I do have a couple of places left. We're nearly full on our one-on-one consultations, health optimization coaching. If you have a problem that you'd like to get help with, whether it's a high performance, whether you're a top athlete and wanting to get to the next level, whether you're wanting to work on your mindset, or maybe you've got a really complicated health challenge that you're just not getting any answers for, or you're having trouble sifting through all of the information and getting the right stuff—then please reach out to me, lisa@lisatamati.com. Right. Now over to the show with Dave Liow from the Holistic Movement Coach.  Lisa Tamati: Well, hi everyone. Welcome back. Today I have the amazing, the incredible, awesomest, Dave Liow on the show. Dave, welcome back, repeat offender.  Dave Liow: Hi Lisa. Lisa: I'm super stoked to have you today. Dave Liow: For the podcast you mean, right? Lisa: You’re a repeat offender for the podcast. Coming back to give us more. Not an offender in any other way.  Dave is an expert that I've had on before and he's definitely one of my mentors. And he's been to—Neil, my business partner for many years. And he is a mentor to many of the coaches and top trainers in New Zealand and Australia. So that's Dave's background. And you've got a background in physiology, don’t you Dave? Dave: Yes.  Lisa: You have a company called the Holistic Movement Coach. And will you—we're going to talk today about feet. People are like, ‘Wow, that's really interesting topic to talk about’. But it is. It's really, really exciting. Last time we had you on the show, we talked about the science of life, and that was one of the most popular episodes. So I'm really…  Dave: Great! Lisa: …happy to have you back on and to share some more of your absolute amazing wisdom. So today we've picked feet. What are we gonna to talk about, Dave? What are we going to share about feet and what you need to be aware of? Dave: Well feet’s one of those interesting ones. So from—as a movement professional, which is really my background. Though, being a holistic movement coach, if you just look at movement, you're gonna come unstuck pretty soon. So when I started looking at movement though, one of the things that I noticed that was one of the areas that were neglected were feet.  So we're seeing or looking at people's lumbar spines all the time and come to wideness not losing link from the top of the head. But a lot of trainers and movement professionals weren't even looking at people's feet. They had no idea what was going on, underneath those shoes of theirs. So for those of you who might think about maybe the back, whatever. Imagine if someone was wearing a big potato sack over their whole body, and you couldn't see where the spine was at trying to train them. So trying to work with someone and get them to move well without looking at their feet is to me just crazy.  Lisa: Yes, nonsensical. Dave: Yeah. And we've got 28 bones in the feet. So 28 bones, and we've got 55 articulations from below the knee. Lisa: Wow. Dave: So over a third of the bones are in the feet there. So that tells you about just how important that area is there. We have a look at the muscles that run down below the knee too. We've got 50 muscles. So added it, 276 ortho muscles, I think that's about right muscles. We have 50 below the knee so that shows you just how important there is. And it's an area that I think has been largely neglected by moving professionals. Lisa: Yes, it makes the total amount of sense. And we are on them all day, and we just shove them in a pair of shoes. And sometimes those shoes, you know, like ladies' high-heeled shoes, and tight shoes, and badly shaped shoes and don't do a lot barefoot—going out barefoot. Let’s start there, let’s start like—what does shoes do? When we put a pair of shoes on our feet? What sort of things are we taking away from our brain? Like, I always liken it to going around with a pair of gloves on my hands all day. I'm not going to be able to paint a picture and initiate anything, am I? Because I've just taken away all my proprioception and my ability to coordinate those fine motor controls with my hands. So we get that sort of analogy but actually, we do that to our feet all the time. Dave: And that's a wonderful analogy, Lisa. And so the representation in your brain of your body is called homunculus. So your brain has representations of all your different body parts. And some body parts are represented very, very—have a very large representation in the brain because they may have a lot of sensation and require a lot of fine movement.  So there's a huge representation in your brain of your face because if you look at the number of expressions you can do, and the articulations you can do with your tongue, your lips—there's a lot of area in the brain devoted to the face. Same with the hands as well. So you look at the fine movements you can do in your hands, isn't it? And how pink your hands are say compared to your elbow. It's incredible how much space in the brain is devoted to the hand.  Now one other is the feet. The feet have a massive representation in the brain as well. But with that, though, we know the brain is plastic. It can evolve and it will adapt to whatever environment you're putting it into. If you're walking around with that, the gloves on your hand, or in this case as one of my mentors Phillip Beach would say, ‘With sensory deprivation chambers on your feet’… Lisa: Wow. Dave: ‘…you will lose that representation in your brain’. And the bottom of the feet is extremely propiocept. Isn’t it? So many on that plantar fascia, that part of the foot there, is full of receptors which send information up to your brain. Giving you information about where you are, how you're interacting with the ground, and how you're moving. And without that, and by breaking that link there, there's a price to pay. Lisa: Yes, yes. And we just willy nilly wear shoes from the day we're born, pretty much. And if we're lucky in childhood, we might have run around bare feet a little bit. But most of us have got his feet and shoes all day. So you're saying that the—what did you call it? the munculus? Dave: Homunculus. Lisa: Humunculus? Dave: Homunculus.  Lisa: I never heard one before. I did, like, hear the representations. Like I don't know where I picked this up, some podcasts, some ways, something. If you have two fingers that you tape together for say a month. Dave: Yes. Lisa: When you untape them, you are unable to move them separately because the brain has wired them as being one unit. Another example of this is where people—they lose a limb. The brain still has the representation of that limb, even though the limbs are gone and they feel the pain of that limb. And this is like, the brain is like, ‘Hey, why? Where's my arm gone? Where's my leg gone’? or whatever.  And we're doing this to much lesser degree but when we don't need our toes and our things wiggle and wobble and do the proprioception. Okay, and we can improve our performance. Now, as runners are listening to us, let's talk about a little bit why this is important for runners to be able to sense the grounds and have good proprioception. So what are some of the advantages of having good—taking good care of our feet and maybe going bare feet a little bit. Dave: Oh, massive. One of my buddies, one of the things he has around feet—he has a lot of background in horse training. And he says, ‘No foot, no horse’. If you have a horse which damaged his hoof, then that's pretty much the end of that horse. They can't do a lot. And for you being an ultra-runner, Lisa, I'm sure you understand when your foot goes wrong.  Lisa: Oh, yes. I'm in trouble.  Dave: Yes, you are, you're in a lot of trouble. So I'm constantly dumbfounded by how little care people have take on their feet. I work on my feet every day without fail.  Lisa: Wow.  Dave: I'm certainly not an ultra-runner. I'm not the same class as you guys. But the amount of care that I take on one of my major movement teachers… I know this time when I lift… Lisa: So okay, what are some of the things that you would do to improve your foot mechanics and your proprioception and stuff? I mean, obviously, it's a little bit difficult with our podcasts and we can't show. I’ve got some video but… Dave: So there's that saying, ‘use it or lose it’. If your foot’s in a sensory deprivation chamber, you're gonna lose it pretty quick. So I like my foot to be out of things as much as possible, though... Lisa: Like right now? Dave: Yes. Quite a surprise, no shoe. Yes, I don't really wear shoes much. I wear [10:14 unintelligible] more than other shoes. If I'm running off-road, I'll certainly—and on concrete—I’ll wear some shoes. And we'll kind of talk about the shoe design a bit later on. But whenever I can go barefoot, I will. So if I can give as much information to my feet as possible—that's going to keep them smart, but also gonna keep them strong because shoes add support. That's what they are.  Lisa: Yes. Dave: You will not believe how much support shoes add. And you'll notice when you take them away, if you try and run barefoot, if you've been wearing sickly shoes with a lot of stability that added in there. So by going barefoot a fair amount of time, you get a very strong foot as well. So that doesn't come down to running shoes. And I guess we'll talk about running shoes in a bit.  But if you're wearing running shoes all day, even when you're not running, well, you're adding support there 24/7. I understand that some people might want more support when you're running, when you've got high forces going through your feet, but walking around and running shoes all day or highly-supportive shoes. You're basically walking around with. Lisa: Crutches. Yes, and making yourself lazy. You're making yourself lazy. Yes. Dave: Yes, right. So you're certainly going barefoot as much as possible. Now I do a lot of work at night to make sure that my foot’s mobile. A healthy foot is a mobile foot. So one of the things that they’ll often say is ‘the foot is not a hoof’. A hoof is rock solid and hits the ground and off the coast. So look at what you can do with your hand. Okay, you should do an awful lot with your toes as well and get them moving. So if you've lost the ability to do that, it really shows that you need to do some conditioning work on your feet and get them smarter and stronger.  Lisa: And if you don't, this is where some problems come up. If you can wiggle your toes and all that sort of stuff, you can prevent issues like yes—let's look at a couple of a common running problems that people get. Things like plantar fasciitis is a biggie, or even going up the leg a little bit. Like shin splints, and the problems in the calf, in the Achilles. Are these coming from the feet at all? Dave: Well, they’re coming from running. And there's some sort of mechanics going on there. But think of the foot, that's your first contact with the ground. When that goes wrong, everything in the chain will [12:37 unintelligible]. And if we think about something like a marathon, you've got 30 to 50,000 impact on the ground. That's a lot of race. So something's going wrong. This repetition over and over and over again. That's gonna end up breaking you.  And we're talking about forces, which you can't—two to five times your body weight depending how you're running. Now that’s a hell of force, a hell of a repetition. If something's not working right there, you will pay the price. Will you pay that price? Well, it depends.  But if we look at running injuries, straight off the top. Probably 15% of those will be at the knee. So the knee is normally the one that pays the price. But you know, I often say this in my lectures. Knee’s a dump. I knew that they kind of extracted and they've been—they have a little bit of rotation. But you see that one too much. And they have a little bit of sideways motion, but you don’t want too much of that either. So the knees are dump. So it's not only the knees fault that the knee gets some problems. It's normally the foot and ankle, or it's normally the hip, that's normally where I'll go.  And if you're a runner and you're getting knee pain, I'd be looking at either the foot and ankle. After the foot and ankle I will be looking at their hips straight away. There's something going wrong in those areas there. So about 50% of people will get knee pain more common in females than males by a long shot. Now, we look at kind of around, kind of Achilles as well. That's another area that can get a fair bit of problems as well. That's probably around… Lisa: That's mum, as usual. Ringing in the middle of the podcast. Dave: Calling mum. So around 10% of people get Achilles issues. That's another really common one and that's more a male thing. So that's the case, the 40 plus male is that actually the shoe. But then you'll get your IT band and touch that, which is probably around like 5% of the injuries. [14:32 unintelligible] can be in the foot or your tibia as well. And that's probably around 5% too.  So those are the main injuries. You'll see that getting running back, but knees if I was gonna go after one injury in running, knees are normally the one that pay the price. And there's certainly a big relationship between the foot and the knee. Ginormous. Lisa:  Right. So it's not always go up. Mechanics of the knees is the actual problem is down, or above, or below.  Dave: Yes. Almost always. Unless you've had an impact at the knee? Yes, you can treat the knee and always look at knee because if people come and see you for a knee injury, if you start playing the beat straight away, they'll go, ‘Well, hang on’.  Lisa: ‘What's this going on’? But it does make sense that the kinetic chain and the linking together and trying to find out where the original problem was coming from. Not just where—because like Neil's always said to me, ‘You know, like, if you've got a problem with your ankle, it can affect your shoulder’. And I’m like, ‘How does that work’? You know? Dave: Absolutely. Yes. Where it goes, nobody knows. Lisa: And how do you trace it back? How do you trace up a back problem to the ankle? Or the piriformis? Dave: If you know what it should look like and it doesn't look like what it should look like, well, what happens if you change and make it look more like it should? How does that change things? And that's normally in a nutshell the approach that I'll take. I guess that’s where you need to have a reasonable reference library of saying that, nothing more than my fair share of runners. And I'm sure you have too. I mean, if you feel someone running down the street, now you go, ‘That's not a very experienced runner’, or ‘Oh, boy, that's very experienced runner’. Well, you know that because you've seen so many runners.  So having that, I guess, experience in that database to draw from, and then understand the mechanics, and really add into it what you got. And I know what you gotta do in your Running Hot business. Well, you understand your body and you understand running technique, you can put that together and solve some wonderful problems.  Lisa: Yes, absolutely. But it is like a bit of a counterintuitive thing. I had a guy like, ‘Oh my piriformis’. Like Neil said to me the other day when he saw me, ‘Oh my God. Your bunions are getting really out of control. We got to do something about that’. And I'm like, ‘Oh, is it’? Sometimes you don't notice the things because you're just seeing them every day. You know? So let's talk about—let’s say some specific type of things that we are looking at. So let's look at bunions for that. What are bunions? And what effect can they have on the mechanics of your feet and up the body? Dave: Yes. So bunions—the quarter bunions is up for debate. There is certainly a genetic component to it. So either your mum probably has bunions. I guess. Lisa: Yes. Yes. Yes, you're right on money.  Dave: But that there’s also a big environmental part to it as well. So bunions, when your big toe starts to go in, then you'll end up with normally some calcification around that, well, that first joint—the joint in the big toe—that's probably a better way of saying it, around there as well.  What that does too is compresses the foot. The big toe goes sideways compared to it goes to the next [18:02 unintelligible], that compresses the foot, as well. So we get a lot of compression in that foot. They cause a number of problems. In between those bones in your foot. You've got a lot of nerves that run through there. So when those toes get compressed together, those nerves can get very irritated. Next, become very, very painful.  So and probably just as a little sideline here, if you were to pop your hands just in front of you there—if you're driving a car, listen to this, it's probably not such a good idea. But try this later on, you just put your hand down and look at your hand. So notice the space between your fingers there, that you put your foot down and have a look at your foot, you should also see space between your toes as well. Spacing’s really important to allow that room for the foot to move, to breathe. And also to get those space for all those straps in your foot to go. Lisa: And that’s with you naturally just having the foot there and not trying to spread them but just... Dave: Just naturally you should see space between your toes.  Lisa: Oh, wow. Dave: That you see a nice wide foot there. I love it. I love a good wide foot. Yes, so compression in those toes. And that can be a footwear choice thing too. So if you have shoes, and we've talked about toe box, that's the front part of a shoe. So we go out the toe box, this area through here. So the step front pair of shoes give a wide toe box in a shoe design that lets the foot spread out versus one that narrow and pushes the toes together. Lisa: Gosh. I should know about that. Yes. A lot of the shows that I get, I get sponsored by some brand or whatever. And then like I couldn't wear them.  Dave: Yes, the kiwi foot. Yes, and also this is a column that does this as well.  Lisa: Yes.  Dave: And with me, I've got a nice wide foot. I will not wish you for the narrow toe. It caused me nothing but problems. So footwear choice can be one of the things they also drive a bunion.  Now the other part too is that, when you've got that big toe and that big toes moving sideways, rather than going through the foot, you will often go inside the foot and fall into it. You get more pronation than what you normally have. So we lose the arch of the foot because the way the foot’s designed to move is your desire to move through and move through the big toe.  So, when we talk about the cycle of walking and running, we even have a phase of that called toe off. Because that's a really important part with a big toe pushes off. So if your big toe is going sideways, it's going to be—when you can't go through the toe, we’ll have to go around the toe. And that will cause a lot of wear and tear that can, after a while, that will start to break that foot down.  Now that may require you to drink, unless you do some exercises. In Sydney, we have some real bunion experts and my team, some of my guys love working with bunions. And you can certainly bring that foot back if you have surgery to repair bunions. So if you don't do the work, well the same thing is going to happen again. You just go straight across and they'll end up having to cut your foot open. Lisa: Yes, yes. Dave: My mum had bunions. But I gave her a little exercise program, and I'm pretty sure that's on my—that may be on my YouTube channel.  Lisa: Okay, we might get the link off here.  Dave: And yes, if not, I'll put it on there. And yes, she had some exercise to do for bunions. Her bunions pain disappeared and my mum's in her 70s. So you can certainly reverse that and have her feet are straighter. I’ve had some people come back from their podiatrist and I go to say, ‘What the hell have you been doing? What have you been doing? Keep doing it. Because your toes are straightening, and your foot in better condition’. Lisa: So you can sometimes avoid surgery. Wow, that's pretty amazing. That's pretty amazing. Dave: Well, and even if you have surgery, if you don't do the follow up, you're gonna end up having it again. It’s a huge amount of work with a huge amount of things you can do to help out your bunions. Lisa: Okay, that's really good because I have—got a very neglected bunion. I've always like, ‘Oh, it’s not causing me major troubles yet’. You know? Now I'm thinking, ‘Shoot. I need to address it’, because it's getting, like, Neil noticed that last time I was with him, it's getting worse. And I'm, ‘Oh, this is it? I thought it was the same old, same old’. Neil exclaimed no. And I've got troubles with piriformis. And I'm like, ‘I've been looking at piriformis trying in working on that’. And that could be, could be, could be, might not be, could be a knock on the feet there. Dave: So thinking about how that could relay. If you've got that bunion here, and your foot’s falling into pronation and it’ll take the knee with it, and it will take that whole hip and will rotate in and everything will rotate in there. What stops it? Well piriformis can stop that. So if piriformis is having to make up for a foot function issue there, well, that's worth working.  If you release piriformis, and get that guy—well, now you've got nothing holding your foot together. So where's that guy next to the public often deal on the spine? That's probably where we're going next. And then it could be somewhere else too, or it could travel to the knee. Lisa: Yes.  Dave: So, you know, we talked before about finding the source. Fixing the foot would be a really useful one. And if you're still on your feet, a fair amount, which knowing who you are, you certainly want that contact with the ground. Lisa: Yes. Yes. Yes. Dave: Sort it out. Lisa: Like paying attention to the little changes that are happening in your body because sometimes you think, ‘Oh, no, you know, it's all the same’. And then you don't see changes in your own body when you don't, when you see yourself every day, or your loved ones. Or sometimes you just like got your own little blind spots. Okay, so if we can dig that video out, we'll put that in the show notes for sure.  Let's talk about plantar fasciitis because this is a major problem. One of the most common running problems, especially the people who have up the distance very quickly or done some things here, what is plantar fasciitis and what can we do to deal with it one? Dave: So the left part of fascia is a layer of fat or connective tissue that goes right along the bottom of the foot. And as I mentioned before, that has a lot of receptors on it. So it's very rich in receptors, though can get extremely painful. And typically people who have plantar fascia issues will get out of bed and they'll try to put their foot down, and take a snack, or walk, and start walking, and the whole bottom their foot will be locked up. It'll take a while for that to loosen up so they can use that foot.  More often, you'll get that around the front of the heel, so none of them pointed the heel back in towards the centre of the foot. And sometimes that'll run up in bands as well. Now, the change in volume too quickly is your number one culprit which you mentioned. And that centre area. But certainly some foot mechanics can also have an issue there as well. So the plantar fascia is—in your foot, you've got well, definition you got 50 muscles that run below their knee—all could help control that foot. Your plantar fascia is there, it winds up, and plucky when you bend your big toe. It helps wind up that panic factor to help make the foot rigid to make it to leave so you can push off it.  That's one of the—there’s sort of two main functions of a foot. The first one is to allow the foot to splat is my technical term. Hits the ground and conforms to the surface that it goes to, number one function. Second one is it becomes a rigid lever so you can repel off it. Well, that's pretty much what a foot does. If you have kind of with a narrow down.  So we've got an issue there with that timing between backing and becoming a rigid lever. And the plantar fascia is wearing it somewhere there. Now there's—we can look at the plantar fascia, and you can try and treat the plantar fascia. But there's a lot of layers of muscles and a lot of timing that happened before that plantar fascia that’s been beaten up. So there's something gone wrong with the timing of how you're going from flat to rigid lever that's causing that.  And particularly if you overload into that. So if you've increased your volume too much, that's often the last well, kilometre, or 1000 footsteps that broke the camel's back. So I want to look at what's happening with the ankle and the foot, and I'm always interested in the big toe when it comes to plantar fascia. Lisa: Right, so that's your big lever. Point, really big toes when you push off and you get that elasticity sort of wound up. Dave: Massively important part that big toes. The amount of bones you have in that big toe, and for those of you with bunions, or pinchy injuries in that big toe joint as well. That's a really important one to get looked at. That can have a massive effect on everything up the chain.  Lisa: Wow. Yes. And what can you do about it? Are there some exercises that you recommend? Like, you might have fascia release, you make your ball rolling, that type of thing for the actual plantar fasciitis itself, the stretching and icing, and all that jazz? Dave: Icing can be nice, and that takes some of the pain away because it’s very painful. Having some light pressure in those areas too can help hydrate the tissues and get them healthier again. Because during—if you have some sore spots in their plantar fascia, often they won't have the hydration and the movement, because it's still layers and layers of tissue. Now, if you can get those moving better and hydrated, that will heal better.  Adding some load to it can be useful too, you just need to be careful where you are in their injury spectrum. But it actually does require some loading because the loading will help actually line up the fibres and get that strong again. But it needs to be the right type of loading starting slowly and building up. That sort of mechanics. In big toe, you'd be wanting to have a look at and also what's happening with the ankle. Check that you've got enough dorsiflexion to get into more. How much can you bring your ankle? If you've got a restriction on the ankle and a restricted big toe, your plantar fascia—well, everything in the foot but the plantar fascia, may end up wearing that one. Lisa: Yes, yes. And there's a couple of tricks to do with the dorsiflexion that I can link to another video there that Neil's done. Where you can push that—I’ve forgotten it—talus bone. Where you pushing it back into—because sometimes there’s some sort of a line. Yes, this one,  this one. Trying to find the words. Dave: Restoring their ankle dorsiflexion will be critical. I think that the foot and ankle, I'll look at three main zones in the body. In terms of my model for looking at movement. If you get the torso moving really well, that's very important for rotation. If you're running, you get the pelvis and hips moving really well, that would be my second zone. And the third zone would be the foot and ankle. So if you can get those three zones working well, normally I take 85% of the movement issues will just disappear. Right? And so the foot and ankle are a huge player in my model, and certainly one that I see having a very big impact on how people move well or done don’t move well. Lisa: Yes. Now, that's really good. So the torso, the pelvis, and the feet. So working on those areas in trying to get things balanced.  Dave: Yes, well, the big thing on that that's where I missed them.  Lisa: And those are the three areas—the key areas—and obviously it's the score a lot of work Dave but yes. It's everything from drills and exercises and it's what we do, what you do.  Let's look at now, for runners, talking about running shoes, and buying running shoes, and picking a shoe that's good for you and what you're doing. You were showing me some running shoes before and for people on the podcast, you can't see, but says Kipchoge ones, what do you call them? What are those shoes? Dave: So these are Nike's Zoom Fly shoes. So for those of you who are listening to this, rather than watching it, so this is the shoe that Kipchoge wore to get his sub-2-hour marathon. And they have fibre placement, which have an awful lot of recoil. And also, it is over four centimeters of foam here, but the foam has incredible amount of recoil.  Lisa: Wow.  Dave: So the theory is these will take 4% of your running time.  Lisa: Wow, that’s messed up.  Dave: There’s actually a spreadsheet, which I got hold up to. We can actually look at your running times and calculate how much of a difference it would make to your running performance. And yes, I mean, who wouldn't pay for 4%?  Lisa: Yes. Dave: Mostly runners, my straight line runners, will compete in these. And you'd be a magnet to, if you want to run fast on straight lines. These are extremely high and extremely unstable. If you wouldn’t run on trail with these, no way.  Lisa: Like the HokaOnes, you know, like really deep into the thing that a big sole...  Dave: No, these are high. And they're incredible amount of recoil. They do push you very much, your forefoot style. So what I’ve noticed for days, I totally didn't want to like these. Lisa: Cause you want more people to go bare feet. Dave: I ran in them last week. This is ridiculous.  Lisa: Ridiculously good.  Dave: The speed and ease is something else. And certainly most of my runners who run straight liner, competing in these and certainly in the meantime and now, unless athletes have sponsors, those are the shoes they are picking up. And why wouldn't you if you can—I mean getting 4% improvement in performance is there's something else, even with training. If you can get that by paying for it, why wouldn't you? Lisa: So basically, it's elasticity that they're using. It’s the spring, it's the coil, it's the ability to bounce you off the ground, it's like being on a trampoline. So you're gonna get more force.  Dave: Right.  Lisa: Taking your foot. Dave: Well, yes. The energy is returned a lot more efficiently. So you'll notice that there's a whole host of track records been broken lately, and then closed the marathon. And yes, the technology had a big part in playing it. I think that the next Olympics, the shoe feature extremely heavy. And a lot of a lot of other manufacturers are using this technology now. And they have a lot stricter with the technology they can use in those events now. So there's the level playing field.  Lisa: If you want to level the playing field, it's a thing—if we start having an unlevel playing field, and that's where it becomes a bit problematic.  Dave: And they're recouping broken now. And there'll be more broken with this sort of new technology coming through. Lisa: And from a foot health perspective, are they okay, in that respect, or you just didn't want to like them?  Dave: No, it's not about—it’s sports. Sports is not about health. Lisa: Performance is not about health. No Dave: No. Lisa: It should be but it depends… It’s not always the case. Dave: That's the point, though. I mean, if you wear these around all throughout the day, why would you do that? And having four centimeters of foam between you and the ground can  be put to sleep. So look, I would—if I'm wanting to do a fast run and I don't really do much of that anymore—but if I was doing a faster training run with them, with a buddy of mine who runs pretty quick, I would definitely wear these.  I'm walking all day barefoot. I'm doing full exercises throughout my day. I'm waking up my feet all the time to look after my feet in-between. So you know, this foot choice, shoe choice doesn't stand finished when you're running. It's throughout the day. And that way, you'll choose a different type of shoe. If I was wearing a shoe during the day, my normal shoe would be something that's very minimal, which allows my foot to feel the ground and do things, if I need to wear footwear. Lisa: Yes. And sometimes you don't, you know?  Dave: Yes. And I think that's an important thing too. We've always—there's always extremes. Yes. So I'll see the odd person is taken to the extreme, and they'll go barefoot all the time. And I think you need to be careful of that too. So from a health point of view, yes. So where I live, you wouldn't run—I have run some trails barefoot but there are sharp rocks around there. But also we have snakes there which is a bit of a problem. So I've done the odd barefoot run, but it makes you pretty nervous. The other part too, is what goes on your skin, goes in you. Lisa: Yes, me too. You talked about that on—what was it on? Something you were talking about the other day. You were talking the skin and your feet.  When your lectures that I was learning from you, right? And you were saying how your daughter was barefoot, which was great, but you went to get some picture with the car.  Dave: Yes.  Lisa: And she wanted to run across the full court bare feet and you said, ‘No, put your shoes on’. Dave: Yes. Gotta have shoes. If you go into public toilets, or you're going on a forecourt of a petrol station, if you're walking barefoot on those, those chemicals are getting into your thing.  Lisa: Yes. So also, if you're walking barefoot too, and certainly in Asia and I have an Asian background, you bringing into your house when you go in there too. So be careful where you expose your feet to, because it will go in you, and then we'll take it into your house. Lisa: Yes. Dave: So yes, there's time and place for everything. Lisa: Yes, yes, that's so true. And this is where some other minimalist shoes come in. So and like, social etiquette and stuff, you don't—you can't go to the gym without some sort of footwear on. Most places will tell you off. Well, gym maybe. Dave: My gym, we actually have a gym shoes off policy, right? If we want people to move well, we need all the sensors working well. So we want as much information from those shoes from those feet as possible. So people understand where they are on the ground. Then we have covered where people put their shoes in.  And now not everyone is trying to barefoot. And we have some people who have some structural foot issues who do require some footwear, as well tend to move well. So, if you drop a dumbbell on your foot, having a shoe isn't really going to help you. But as one of my main etiquette contains the meat. Lisa: And most gyms prescribe that you have to have shoes on when you go to them. They do. And these social situations, you can't go to the opera with bare feet. It's not cool. And that brings me to ladies in high heels. What are we doing to our bodies when we wear… Dave: Oh boy. Lisa: …lovely, elegant? We look very elegant in high heels. What the hell are we doing to ourselves? Dave: Okay, so yes, you mentioned that word kinetic chain before. And the idea there is when you change one part, it will change something else with. That's what a kinetic chain does. Okay, a closed kinetic chain. So when you add an incline to your heel, and lift yourself up there, that pushes you forward. So if you have a stiletto on or something very high, you’ll fall on your face unless you adjusted. So where will you adjust? You'll normally do that by pushing your pose forward, by arching your lower back more. So often, the problem that you'll see with high heels will be it changes up the chain.  As well as that when you're in high heels, you're effectively pointing your toes. So if you're in a flat shoe, you'd have been in your ankles. In a high heel, your toes are pointed more. So what that does is that will shorten the calf muscles. And that’s why, if you look at a woman in high heels, she has more definition in the calves because those calf muscles are shortened up. But if you're wearing high heels an awful lot there, what that will do is shorten up that calf, it may make it harder for you to bend that ankle again, which will cause you some different issues, and for those of you who are a bit more technical minded too, peroneus longus, okay, will be one of the muscles which is a part of the action which will be shortened. The peroneus longus comes around a riff underneath the foot and a wrench into the base of that big toe. So it pulls you down into pronation so it collapses the arch. So if you've been wearing high heels an awful lot, that peroneus longus can shorten, which can end up reducing your amount of bend in your ankle and also will pull you into more pronation. Apparently, the good thing that allows you to splat, but remember we also want to make the foot rigid after that so it can repel often.  But if you end up mucking around with muscles, and changing the way they work, and certainly by placing a high heel, and you're certainly going to do that, that will do that. And it will change the way the peroneus longus works and wears out the muscles, which will change that timing, that intricate timing that we need to have in the foot. Lisa: Wow. And so ladies, keep your high heels for special occasions and not everyday use if you can. And I mean I—working with mum and she was in the bed for a long time, bedridden. Drop foot, you know, same thing basically. But just on a horizontal because she couldn't stand so she couldn't get that dorsiflexion happening, and then I was not aware of it at the time that this was a problem when it was happening, and I caught it quite late. And then we had to have her in a boot to try and straighten that out and now she's got a rigid ankle pretty much. So she's got no dorsiflexion, therefore she can't roll over the front of your foot and off nicely. So her whole gait is more flat footed. And these things knock on very early. And then it happens quite quickly that you start to get dropped foot.  Even if you think about life, wake up in the morning and that first time the foot hits the floor, and you've got like, ‘Oh yes, stuff. Stuff on the calf muscles feeling scuffles within the Achilles. And this is a—getting onto the Achilles toe’. If you're getting that initial stiffness when you get up in the morning, there's something brewing and maybe start to look at it. Achilles is a good—that's a good indicator that so step in the morning. How are you feeling? If you're bouncing out of bed and you can get out of bed and run down the hallway and you find you've got nothing, then you probably, not too bad. Dave: I think that's a great point here. You should wake up feeling reasonably good. I mean it’s not a margarine commercial. You shouldn't jump out of bed, ‘Hey. Hello world’. That's probably the only thing you'd be happy about if you're eating that stuff. But that's a whole other conversation.  I had a professional athlete who I was working with, and we were talking one morning and was actually helping, deciding—standing up, deciding we were gonna go with him. And he said, ‘Yes. So how things young is young? What’s your story? I didn't have a car stand up. And then I go, ‘Sharon district’. About 40 minutes later, I'm ready to move. That's normal, right? ‘No, no, that's not normal. Your body normal is not being in pain and struggling to move. That's not normal..  Lisa: Oh but it's age, Dave. That's the next thing, he’ll tell you. It’s just normal aging. Dave: So now I think too, you know. Let’s you've got a—sorry for those of you who are in different hemispheres. But a classic car in the southern hemisphere was a Ford Cortina. Now imagine you've got a 1984 Cortina in your garage, and it's chrome. It's beautiful. And you've looked after it wonderfully. That car drives fantastically in your own town, you think this is the best car ever. But if you take a 1980 Ford Cortina, and you don't maintain it, and you just drive it hard, you won't have it here today.  Lisa: Yes.  Dave: Okay. So if you've got a classic car, it can run really well. But you need to put some extra care and maintenance into it.  Lisa: Absolutely. Dave: That's all it is. So, but you can have a young—you can have a new sports car. You can trash it's probably gonna be a little bit better. But yes, so the older you are, the more keen you’re taking care of your classic car. Lisa: We fit into the classic category now.  Dave: That's another spin on that too. You know, ages is one thing.  But I kind of look at these young athletes, I think you're—you can you can keep up with me. You haven't got the experience I've got. Play that card. It's not there's not just physical is a lot more that goes on to it. And take a look at the outer world. And know that certainly, the more of a mental game that's required, the better it suits your experience.  Lisa: Yes, in Roman times, like, it's not about speed and power after a 100k, it sort of starts to come down to… Dave: Yes. Lisa: So yes, it is. It's an attitude for life. There's a number of rounds on the clock, but it's keeping everything as best as you can in optimal performance and stopping things before they fall down the cliff, and being in that preventative space. And that's what we're both all about. And that's why you’re taking good care of your joints, and your muscles, and your hydration, and all of those exercises is really, really key. Let's talk a little bit now around, what's your take, I'd like to hear just on general and for joints and cartilage and stuff? Things like sulfur, MSM, conjugated salt, and so Glucosamine, that sort of supplementation for cartilage and joints you know anything about this? If it’s a cool thing or not? Dave: It's really cool at one of my key areas. Look, supplements are strange one. And certainly my take on that really changed over the last few years. And now if you think you can get everything out of your diet, even if you're eating organic, you probably can't. So there's certainly some supplementation useful. I'm very big on getting an evidence base on that though.  So there's this push where we've almost seen our science as lying now. We need to be able to do our supplementation, to what you want to choose. But what I found now is basically you become a victim to marketing now. So there's a fine line between the two. So I read up on what I think is useful, and what's not, and I use it on an individual basis. But I'd like to cover the basics first, and often think that we're thinking they're tasting things like curcumin. Another problem with curcumin by the way, as well some other some other supplements here when you're not even looking at the basics. So do the big rocks first. Lisa: Yes, I'm big on those pretty you know those ABCD. Selenium, zinc, magnesium-type base. Not sexy, but very essential for genetic functions. Yes. Dave: A decent multivitamin is probably a bloody good place to start, and then you can start fine tuning from there. Sure. I take a few other things, as well. I'm a big fan of a decent probiotic, and veering those probiotics around. I think that's really important. And I use that as a food source as a supplement. I do like my fish oils. I think there is a part to play in that.  Lisa: Yes. Those are wild. Dave: Wild, wild, wild small fish is the way you want to go and watch out for the processing on those as well, they can get... Lisa: Very very important to get the right fish source, you get right fish source ,and you'll be doing the opposite to what you need to kick the company out especially... In our next conversation. I know we're getting a bit off topic but probiotics, I've done quite a lot of study around the probiotics, and some of the problems of probiotics, and has domains, and causing inflammation and allergic reactions. Have you found any one in particular that you'd say, ‘Yes, that one's been really good for a lot of people’. This got a good clinical base to it? Dave: Yes. There's a few brands that I tend to like. These… Lisa: Deep in here without any proof on that question, but I was interested for myself because I'm looking at our probiotics. Dave: Syntol is a brand I quite like. Syntol, S-Y-N-T-O-L iis a brand that I've used for probably the last decade. That's an industrial strength one which works really well. Also Bio-Heal is another one, which I think is a pretty decent one. And the reason I like those brands is that they don't need refrigeration. And the Syntol is more spore one so it can be a bit bitter as well. Lisa: Yes. Because it's got to get through the digestive, the stomach, the action, into the lower. And I know like the science in this area is still a very much an evolving space. And a lot of this, I have had a couple of clients been on probiotics that you get out of off the shelf or supermarket type thing. They ended up with histamine reactions and things like that because they do have often—so if you're sensitive to histamine and you might want to check it out a little bit more, and just be toe in the water and find out. So it's a little bit hard to know because I think the jury's still out in some regards. But I think but the spore based ones… Dave: Yes, there seems to be built in there. I feel like most fermented foods, they won't suit everyone, for sure. They served me really well. So I make my own kimchi. I make my kombucha. I make my own sauerkraut. Do some water kefir as well. I often use a little bit of fermented foods to help my gut work. And every culture and everywhere in the world has some form of fermented food. And we realize as developing communities that we need to look after our gut health needs, and we didn't have refrigeration was probably the other thing as well. Then those are very health giving. And it still exists in most cultures today, and it's certainly something that I'd recommend if it suits you to work into your diet. Lisa: Yes, and that is where I know—working with the PH-316 epigenetics programme that we do that there are certain biotypes. And one of them that can miss to watch the amount of fermented foods because it can again—cause histamine problems in inflammation in the body—so that is a bit of a bit more a personal genetic thing too, as rather than across the board.  But to be fair, I think that's everything needs to be personalized nowadays. And we've got a lot I wouldn't say we've got an all sass but there is a lot of science around what type of thing for what person and which genes, for which foods, and I don't think it's by any means perfect yet. The science behind it, but we can get a bit of an idea on some of these things. So just because it's healthy for Dave doesn't necessarily mean it's going to be healthy for Lisa, you know? So a little bit of experiment, and I'm a big experimenter, versus showing one of my athletes into my pantry. And it looks more like a cumulus isn't well supplement shop rather than a...  And I don't take on things all the time but I'm always experimenting on my own body, and trying to optimize, and to see what sort of things are having which effect and then trying to take note of it, and keep track of it, and trying to work out. A little bit hard when you keep chucking 100 variations at things. It's not exactly a clinical study where you do one variation. But… Dave: Eating is one.  Lisa: Eating is one. Yes, exactly. And keeping testing. But back to the whole foot scenario talking that—I mean, you and I can end up in bloody all sorts of areas. What's your take on orthotics? I wanted to ask that again. Jury's out of my mind on orthotics and I'm not sure. Dave: That’s a real polarizing one. I'm gonna make myself unpopular with some people here, but here's my take on it. I'm not—I'm not a [51:17 unintelligible]. If you have a foot that hasn't got a structural issue, or a neurological deficit, you can work without orthotics. Okay, so orthotics add support, and they will normally block motion. Okay, that's what they're pretty much designed to do.  So normally, when they describe orthotics, they'll look at, ‘Okay, there's too much motion. We will block that motion so that the foot can do its thing’. You block motion, some way though. What we know is that motion will be taken up somewhere else. And in that closed chain, where that motion goes will often have problems.  So let's have a look, if you've got a foot that doesn't dorsiflex well, so the ankle doesn't bend well. Now what will happen is the only way you can bend their ankle now is to roll inside or to over pronate. That's the only way you can go there. But rather than go through the foot, you go around the foot now. So what may happen is, if you have no thoughts to stop that pronation, go, ‘What's happened now’? Okay? Now you can't pronate the foot, you can't work at the ankle, what's going to go next? You may end up taking up a knee. But now you'll end up with a knee issue, when you may come in with a foot issue. You may end up with a knee issue, or it may end up going into the hip or the lumbar spine, or as far as into the neck, which is a common thing or even to the head.  I've seen from people who've had a foot issue and they get hit out when they start hitting the pavement because it goes right through the chain. And that's it ends up tearing them up. So when you enter [52:53 unintelligible], if you've got a painful foot, it can be very useful temporarily to change what's going on, or a structure or neurological deficit. Otherwise, think of a crutch.  Okay, if I break my leg, ‘Oh, I want to break around my knee without smashing my knee to smithereens. I want to break around my knee and I want to wear crutches to start with’.  Now, oh boy that feels so good having extra support in there. And I've restricted that range around my knee because it's too painful to move. But 10 years later, I wouldn't want to be still be wearing that same brace on my knee with a crutch. And I wouldn't want to go in there each year and get that brace changed a little bit and realtered. So I look at some of your thoughts that come into me and I look at that foot and I look at your foot and I go, ‘I have no idea’. I kind of—foot mechanics is tricky stuff. But I've put a fair bit of work into it. Like I understand how feet generally work, I think. I look at that foot and I look at that person, and I think, ‘I can’t see what’s that relating to at all’. I don’t know what you’re seeing, but that's not what I see.  And there’s a few things around some of the theory of orthotics which are a little bit tricky around foot mechanics change when you have your foot on the ground versus when you—whether your foot in the air.  Lisa: Of course.  Dave: A lot of the mechanics that are put into orthotics aren't done in a closed chain, which changes the whole way the foot works. Though, there is some stuff there. I've had piles of orthotics thrown away over the year. I have products come into me and I go, ‘What?’ And I'll test them. It'll take people with them, without them, and they'll go better without them. I had some people that do need them though, because they had some neurological issues for their head structural foot issues, where their foot is broken beyond repair, where it does need some help.  And making good orthotics, definitely—for those of you who maybe have a diabetic foot or have had some issues around there. Some of the orthotics I've seen that have come and have been worked about and are amazing, though there is some there are some amazing work on orthotics. And that's probably my outtake on this one. So finding someone who's very good at that, and looking after a foot in trouble is a real skill. Lisa: It is. I've got a friend, Lisa Whiteman, who owns a China podiatry clinics, right, throughout New Zealand, and their stuff is next level. But the science and technology that they have in order to get the right things for that. So if you're thinking of doing it, make sure you go to somebody who really knows this stuff, and not just any sort of orthotic. And test it, and try it, and see whether you're getting something through up the train, fix that. And question with the immediate, long term—I've never had any benefit out of an orthotic. And I've only got, again, one anecdotal in me.  But we're not—like dealing with someone like my mum with a neurological problem, and limited dorsiflexion. I am considering the next opportunity I get to take down to Wellington to go and see my friend and go into her clinic and get her an assist, that might be, for example, a situation where something like that could be called for, because she's lost that motion and the ankle, so we haven't got it to work with. Dave: So we do have problems from the bottom up. So the foot can cause a problem going up, but also it can probably be going

Amazing story from a Miracle on the Hudson survivor. Hear his incredible story with your #70secondCEO Carl Gould. Read full transcript: Hi everyone, Carl Gould here with your #70secondCEO. Just a little over one minute investment every day for a lifetime of results. So one of our friends is Dave Sanderson who was the civilian hero on the Miracle on the Hudson. He was the civilian who stayed on the plane and helped others get off as matter of fact once everybody was off the plane and everybody was on the wing and then eventually in the life raft. And they found that the life raft was full and could not take one other person. Well, the only person who wasn't in the life raft at that time on that side of the boat was Dave he was half in the plane half out the plane and you know what they said to him. They said let go of the boat push it away from the plane and he's like, well, yeah, but that would leave me in a sinking plane surrounded by jet fuel. In 35-degree water and so he did he push the boat away from the plane to help others and then he had to swim through jet fuel to get to the boat. He couldn't they couldn't come get him because he was too close, right? So Dave in his studies since then has talked about the need to be resourceful, right? These are just some of the attributes that we use, you know, in order to come through a crisis. Like and follow this podcast so you can learn more. My name is Carl Gould and this has been your #70secondCEO.

If you're enjoying the show, we hope you'll take a minute to leave a review. It really helps us out! This week, we'll talk vegan sausage-broccoli mac and cheese and review Morningstar Farms Buffalo Wings.Halloween might be over, but it was still a week away when we recorded this episode. So Dave dives into the horror movie marathon here's been having. Send us your horror recs!More of what we mentioned this week:If someone could explain Saw to us, so we don't have to watch it and get too scared, that would be a bit help. talkintofupod@gmail.comBarilla Protein+ (not a sponsor) is the protein pasta that we all like.This is the basic vegan mac and cheese recipe we use. This week, we did Beyond Sausage in the air fryer at 400 for 12 minutes and added broccoli to the air fryer for the last two minutes. Tossed those with the cooked mac and cheese, topped with tater tots, and baked for 30 minutes. Here's the episode of Defunctland about EPCOT that we referenced. It's so good!We make the MorningStar Farms Buffalo Wings in the air fryer at 400 for 12 minutes.That quick ranch we mentioned is about a tablespoon of vegan mayo with a sprinkle of dried dill, garlic powder, and onion powder. It's shockingly good!Thank you so much for listening! We record these episodes for you, and we'd love to hear from you. Got a favorite vegan treat that you think we should cover on the podcast? Send your suggestions to talkintofupod@gmail.com!

Wow. Do I have a big name for you guys on the Millionaire Secrets podcast today… It’s Dave Asprey. Founder of the world-renowned Bulletproof Coffee and the biohacking movement. On today’s show, we get straight into what you might expect… Biohacking. More specifically, we talk about the importance of biohacking for peak performance among digital marketers and entrepreneurs in general. What is biohacking? In the words of Dave himself, Biohacking is the art and science of changing the environment around you and inside you, so you have more control over your own biology. In his mid-to-late twenties, Dave weighed 300lbs. Low energy and brain fog were significantly disturbing his ability to perform his role as an entrepreneur effectively. An hour and a half in the gym each day and a strict diet just wasn’t helping him drop the weight. Doctors didn’t believe him when he said he was eating right. It felt like no traditional methods of weight loss & healthy lifestyle could help him... So Dave took it upon himself to hack a new way of living that would improve his overall quality of life...and hopefully….longevity. Biohacking was born. Dave goes deeper... By biohacking your body, Dave believes that it allows you to connect on a deeper level with your clients and people in general. Narrowing it further, Dave uses the art and science of copywriting as an example of how, by clearing your body and mind of toxins… ...you are able to write and connect at a more emotional level with your customers. Listen to the Podcast below to enjoy the full interview with Dave Asprey: Check Out More of Dave’s Content Here

In this interview with Nathan, an ex-patriot who is doing real estate investing in Uganda and Azore where I remind him of calling me someday out of the blue with regards to an interview with Dave Pereira and he was amazed by me being allover doing stuff. So he reached out to Dave because he was sending him a referral which he still does when it comes up. He says that Dave used to be his former boss when he used to be in the Mortgage business. He says that he learned a lot from Dave and one thing he learned very specifically from him in regards to building a business was his yellow pad. So Dave had his yellow pad and he would do his little triangles but he tells me a little lesson he learned from him. He taught him a lot even though he was going through some weird stages in his life during that point. He saw Dave Pereira's interview with me and he knows that both of us have run into each other before in passing though being in the same circles in life at that time. He saw what I was doing because when he saw me interviewing Dave and he was amazed that I was in real estate training people in Fall River and that is the reason why he had to reach out. He narrates being in the real estate business for 15 years where he first enrolled in a program in Providence Rhode Island and he started his very business on the streets on Fall River, Somerset, Swansea, Seekonk even in Rhode Island over the years and that's where it all started. Nathan offers 3 pieces of advice to 20-year-old Nathan on how to become successful. 1) - Just do it. 2) - Invest Sooner 3) - Follow this model: Earn, Invest, Give, and Spend. To learn more check out the blog and podcasts at http://www.GualterAmarelo.com To register for our Saturday live webinar to start your wealth journey, visit http://www.gualteramarelo.com/Live To get in touch with Nathan, visit https://www.fearless-millionaire.com/ --- This episode is sponsored by · Anchor: The easiest way to make a podcast. https://anchor.fm/app Support this podcast: https://anchor.fm/alchemist-nation/support

In part three we finish up the story of Detroit: Become Human. Very spoilers ahoy moment! So Dave, Mike and Craig finish up their play by play of Detroit, nit pick here and there and give their final thoughts. If you STILL haven't played this the general concensus is you maybe shout, but maybe not. Helpful? Want to tell us what to play? Hit us up at on twitter (https://twitter.com/thebiteffect) or on the web (https://www.thebiteffect.com/suggest)

THE HOME FOR PROGRESSIVE POLITICS This Week’s Discussion:   President Trump takes his case for greatest all-time mass murderer of Americans to another level by admitting intent to Bob Woodward.  In another example of explosive yet completely unsurprising revelations about our President, Trump continues to show that he is his own--and our--worst enemy by admitting to the veteran journalist that he knew for months how bad COVID was while he was telling the American public otherwise.  Turns out this particular snake oil salesman knew he was selling toxic snake oil (injectable bleach, perhaps?) to the rubes who follow him.  He also reminds us why this President couldn't merit a security clearance.   The US west coast burns in record wildfires and unknown numbers of Americans perish.  So Dave admits that our accounting of the numbers of Americans murdered by Trump and the GOP will sell them short, since we don't have a formula for attributing to them the climate change-related deaths they have caused. Dave also looks at recent court decisions and talks about the vicious cycle now on display in Trump-GOP-world: the courts help the GOP steal elections, so the GOP can pack the courts with more apparatchiks who will help them steal more elections, and so on, until this country spirals to oblivion.  We also look at pro athletes who are proving themselves to be exemplary role models, and talk about choosing role models wisely, and briefly look at Facebook's decisions to ban new political ads the week before the election.        *Also available on Spotify, iTunes, and Stitcher...and now Audible!-Please SUBSCRIBE   THE HOME FOR PROGRESSIVE POLITICS Forward Nation Radio with Professor David Leventhal    If you love what you heard, Like Us and share on Facebook - Instagram - Twitter

Thomas W. Jones is the founder and senior partner of a venture capital investment firm, with a long career in corporate America. But when Dave Ross first heard of him, Jones was an armed revolutionary, staging an occupied protest with classmates at Cornell University to demand a black studies curriculum and the resignation of the university president. So Dave sits down with his fellow Cornell alum to reflect on racial progress in the years since, and discuss what Jones thinks of this new wave of young protesters raging against the system. See omnystudio.com/policies/listener for privacy information.

Discussion Episode:  Dave’s Double Features Indoor theaters are still closed, but that hasn’t stopped drive-ins from coming up with some slick double features of new and classic movies.  So Dave and I try our hand at building twin bills.  This … Read More →

This hole episode has spoilers in spades, be warned. So Dave, Mike and Craig return to the Dig, and keep digging! This episode we talk story, gripes, more mechanics and a wee dive in to the characters. Want to tell us what to play? Hit us up at on twitter (https://twitter.com/thebiteffect) or on the web (https://www.thebiteffect.com/suggest)

On Episode 155, Dave Woodward of ClickFunnels is in to talk about Traffic Secrets and the book of the same name. Dave is chief revenue officer and a partner at ClickFunnels, a company that promises that you are “just a few simple clicks away from a beautifully-designed website marketing funnel.” I wanted to get to the bottom of that--and get a view into the book the head of ClickFunnels, Russell Brunson, wrote recently--Traffic Secrets. So Dave and I chatted a while back. You’ll get a view into Dave’s background, how ClickFunnels grew to $100 million in less than five years, a little about direct response advertising, and what is happening with ClickFunnels. This was recorded before COVID-19 had started to take over the world, but it’s still brimming with great thinking.Links of InterestDave Woodward on LinkedInClickFunnelsThe Book: Traffic Secrets

EP126 (1 Samuel 23-24) Kyle is going bald. After Saul massacred the priests at Nob, David is gathering forces at Keliah. Saul attempts a to seige Keliah in order to trap David. David asks god what he should do and god tells him to flee because king Saul is on the way. So Dave runs... The post This Shit is B.A.N.A.N.A.S (1 Samuel 23-24) appeared first on Canada Comedy.

EP126 (1 Samuel 23-24) Kyle is going bald. After Saul massacred the priests at Nob, David is gathering forces at Keliah. Saul attempts a to seige Keliah in order to trap David. David asks god what he should do and god tells him to flee because king Saul is on the way. So Dave runs […] The post This Shit is B.A.N.A.N.A.S (1 Samuel 23-24) appeared first on Canada Comedy.

Hello and welcome to Conversations At The Table; a podcast where we continue the ongoing dialogue of what it means to build Christ-centered community through radical hospitality and an irrational commitment to the well-being of each other.  We’re continuing with our podcast series that has replaced our Sunday Morning gatherings temporarily. With the recent quarantine placed on us because of the coronavirus, we’re all having to readjust our lives and look into an uncertain future. And as a church, we’ve talked about how our dream is to be much more than a community centered on Sundays for one hour. So just as each of you have the opportunity to use this time to take a breath, slow down, and dream about what this new future could look like in your lives, as a church, we’re going to use this opportunity to live and love in a new way as Jesus leads us to do. So Dave is going to continue our look at the book of Exodus and then I’m going to sing a few songs and our hope is that you join in on the conversation and singing - at home, in your car, in the shower, or wherever you are -  and that it makes this time a little bit lighter for you. Let’s start the conversation!

Jay is away on a company outing, but we there was a few more things Dave wanted to fit in this week. So Dave's wife Lauren will sit in.  Dave shows his wife Parasite. They discuss the WWE reality TV show Miz & Mrs. Lauren also discusses the HULU series Shrill which she thinks more people should check out. This week we have additional news on Indiana Jones 5, with quotes from Harrison Ford. The 90's lives again on Disney + as Lauren and Dave break down The Mighty Ducks series in development and Rick Moranis' return to Shrunk, the Honey I Shrunk The Kids reboot in development. Finally Dave breaks down some hints and impressions on Matt Reeves' The Batman suit reveal.  Dave and Lauren review Sonic the Hedgehog movie and break down some fun easter eggs we found from the original video game.  This Episode is brought to you by Ball Wash. One of Dave's favorite products to use to avoid funky body odors. If you are enjoying the show please consider leaving us a 5 star review on the podcast app you are using. Find us on twitter and facebook to comment on the show and take part in our polls and listener questions. Get more SMB content for just $1 over on our Patreon. Thank you for listening CHEERS!

Welcome to episode 75 everyone and I have another different guest for you. Some of you have been waiting excitedly for this one too - so welcome on board Flight Instructor Dave Baranek (aka callsign "Bio"). So Dave was an officer in the USA Navy and not only flew (he's a radar intercept officer) in the f-14 Tomcat's but managed a squadron too! Not only that but Dave has ties to one of the most famous aeroplane films ever - Top Gun! Yes, he helped with instructing on the film and is credited too. Dave is a very friendly guy who is happy to share details of his career, which included shooting pictures whilst he was flying! It's another interesting guest who started life with film cameras like the Konica fs1 (+ft1) and talks to us how he coped with his work and still taking some lovely images. He tells us a little his talk in the navy and what he's done since too. So listen out for: how Dave's vision affected his path instructing at the top gun school Shooting through plexiglass Tripods + ejection seats Konica cameras Technicians vs Artists Navy photo labs Reconnaissance missions Film choices Dangers of photography & flying Importance of hard work I have to say Dave's life is very different to most, but he is still a humble man so hope you like this one. My favourite quote from this show was "connected a tripod to the ejector seat" - I nearly choked when he said this! RANDOM QUESTIONS Of course, Dave kindly answers our fun questions so find out why he would move Hong Kong and some very special Navy training tests. EXTRA CONTENT I would urge anyone listening to check my website initially for the extra content, as Dave has provided you all with some examples of his work. LINKS Website - www.topgunbio.com MENTIONED Dave talks about a couple of other famous aeroplane photographers. These are: George Hall - https://www.check-6.com/gallery/electronic/SR-71-Blackbird-by-George-Hall.php Niko Tokunaga - https://nps.nikonimaging.com/members/katsuhiko_tokunaga/ --- Send in a voice message: https://anchor.fm/photography-insights/message

Everybody, this is Dan Thompson with wise money tools. Thanks for joining us on this video. So in the past couple videos, we've been talking about the five elements to wealth. And today we're gonna talk about one of the other elements. Remember our formula, y=a(1+r)x. And each one of these things has it's own little element. That's part of it a is our cash, pay yourself first. One is our capital and debt equation. How much money can we grow? How much money have we saved? Our is the growth that can either be a plus or minus, depending on the safety and risks that we take. An "x" is the leverage or exponential growth that we get by using leverage. So in this video, we're gonna talk about 1. Okay, we're debt and capital fight against each other. I think we'll all agree that debt can be a wealth killer. I mean, it takes money that you could be saving, growing and compounding, and you're sending your capital or your cash or your money to someone else. The problem is, if all we do is concentrate on our debt, and never pay yourself first. They there's a little battle there because you could be missing out on years and years of compounding, while you're trying to get yourself out of debt. Now Dave Ramsey, he's kind of the Guru of getting out of debt. And for the most part, I would agree with him, but I call his particular formula of getting out of debt, the beans and rice formula. Because he's all about literally sacrificing every single dollar towards getting out of debt and living just as frugal as you possibly can. And again, getting out of debt is a good thing, but done wisely and in order. So Dave kind of reminds me of talking to some of those older guys. You know, the guys kind of like the early 1900s great, great, grandpa types. They remember the day when they didn't have electricity. They ate gruel once a day, they had to walk through four feet of snow to school and it was uphill both ways. You know, it's just life is so easy right now and they try to compare what it used to be back then. Well, Dave kind of reminds me of the guy who wants you to live like that. No enjoyment, no entertainment, you put all that on hold you don't go to the movies. You don't do anything fun. You're just getting out of debt, debt, debt till you own your home free and clear. And it kind of reminds me of the movie, Oliver, you know, little kid holding up his bowl. And he says, Please, sir, can I have some more? Please, Dave, may we go to the movies? That's kind of what it feels like to me. I mean, He wants you to forget about life, forget about fun, and you just pound and pound and pound and take it out of debt look and I get it. There are a lot of people who live paycheck to paycheck. And they do it because they're paying so much debt. And debt can be a looming obstacle over a lot of families heads. So we do watch out of debt. The problem is you could also miss out on years of growth and compounding, if every extra dime goes to someone else. Now, I don't know the exact balance for your situation. But you've got to strike a balance. You got to get out of debt for sure. But you also need your money to grow and compound so that you can start to build toward your wealth. As a rule of thumb, if you're getting a return that's greater than your debt interest. Then maybe paying off your debt is probably not the best move and you can do other ways you can go about other ways to do that. As an example, if the interest on your loan or your debt is let's say 8%. And you can only get 1% at the bank, yikes. Well, it's probably best for you to pay off that debt. One misnomer is when someone tells you that you're making 8% on your money. If you pay off a loan that has an 8% interest rate, say I get what they're saying, but it's really not true. It's a lie. You're still in the hole 8% you're just not making that 8% on the other side. So you're paying out 8% and you're losing 8% from your cash flow, because it went out. So by paying off your debt, if you have an opportunity to start actually saving at 8% but you're not making a percent on your money, then you're on a treadmill. What I'm trying to say is this, if you can only make 1% on your money in the bank, and your debts 8% is probably best to pay off the debt. Because your growth or your savings isn't even keeping up with the cost of debt. But if What if you could save your money say at 9%? Or maybe even better over time? What then would it be better to save that money and begin growing and compounding sooner or to pay off the 8% debt, then we have to consider both good and bad debt. Yeah, there is such thing as good debt. And it might be defined as borrowing to buy an appreciating asset, such as a home. Bad debt can be defined as buying a depreciating asset, such as maybe some clothes or even a car. However, as much as David like you to pay cash for your cars, and other major purchases, he never considers opportunity costs. It may actually cost you more to pay cash than to finance a car. What you need to understand is how money works, how to take advantage of that knowledge and the benefits of when and how to use debt. The problem is with fanatic debt reducers mentality, they're gonna miss out on the one thing that we all run out of every single one of us. We start to lose it every day and that is time. We also live in a very low interest rate environment, and saving your money in the bank just isn't gonna do it anymore. On the other hand, oftentimes debt costs are so low, that it's not hard to supersede that cost of money with the compounding of your money. Now, you may have heard of two types of interest. Basically, there's simple interest and there's compounding interest. And understanding the difference can be huge and help you make good financial decisions as well. Simple interest is how most debt is structure. Okay. Suppose I make an investment of $1,000 had a simple interest rate of 5% With simple interest, I'm gonna get that 5% every year until I get my investment back. So let's just say it's gonna be a five year investment. So I get $50 each year for five years, or a total of $250. It might look something like this. Here's my thousand dollars, 1st year I get $50, 2nd year $50, 3rd year $50, 4th year $50, 5th year $50. Okay, now using that same 5% but now let's use compounding interest instead of simple and let's see how that turns out. In year one, I get fade paid 5% which is $50. But then in year two, because now my account value is $1050 I get paid 5% on my thousand of course, but I also get 5% on the 50 I made last year. So I'm getting paid 5% on 1050. So it looks like this year one $1050, years two $1102.50, year three $1157.63, year four $1215.51, year five $1276.28. If I compound at 5%, I have $276.28 earn interest 76 more dollars than if it was simple interest. Well, you may be thinking, well 27 bucks isn't that big of a deal, right? But as you get into larger sums of money, and more time, this can be huge. Now, since dead is typically simple interest calculation, and many investments are compounded oftentimes. It's better to keep productive money growing and compounding, while paying simple interest and using smart deaths. Now, is this always the case? Absolutely not. First of all, I'm not really a big fan of debt to begin with. So we got to control that but going back to Einstein's quote. He talks about interests and he says he who understands it earns it. He who does not pays it. The question is, can you do both? The one thing that's rarely discussed when it comes to making purchases for cash, and what I've mentioned with Dave is that he always misses out on what's called opportunity costs. Suppose I have to buy a car. Now both Dave and I would agree that buying the least expensive car would be the best. However, Dave has a no excuses no qualms no alternative way you go and you pay cash for that car. But what they misses is that even paying cash has a cost. See, I can either borrow money and pay interest, or I can pay cash and lose interest. If I take cash out of a productive asset or for go putting money in a productive asset. So that I can purchase a car my money loses the opportunity to grow and compound literally forever. Once it's in a car, I've got a depreciating asset that's guaranteed to be worth less every day that I drive it. If my cash can be used to help grow my money at a greater rate than the simple interest I may be paying, it might be better off to finance the car and let my money continue to grow and compound. I use this simple example. Suppose you can lend your money or invest your money at 10%. And let's suppose that the cost of financing will be 4% doesn't make any sense at all to take your money from an investment earning 10%. So you can avoid paying 4%. So in this case, to take my money from the investment. I give up the opportunity for that money to earn money, which again is opportunity cost forever. Okay, So hopefully you get the idea that can be a killer, no doubt. However, there might be ways to use smart debt capital used wisely can benefit you for a lifetime. That leads me to the next video where we're gonna talk about compounding and growing your wealth. You don't want to miss it. In the meantime, just think about this. Think about the debt you have the amount you're paying out, and is there any way you can curtail that? Is there a time in your life where it might be smarter to be growing your money, then paint all your income out to someone else? That's really the balancing question that we have to make. And it's not sometimes really easy to figure out, but we can figure that out together. Well, don't miss the next video. Make sure you subscribe. If you have any questions you have any questions at wise money tools.com. I'll answer them just as quick as I can feel free to make comments below as well. And if you ever want to talk about your particular situation, just click on the time trade link, and a few minutes together, that's about it till next time, these are the five key elements to wealth. We're gonna be on to the compounding and growing next. So, take care.

2019 Pro motocross has come to an end, and with that comes 2020 supercoss! So Dave drakes myself and Brad Gebhardt sit down and shoot the breeze, make some jokes, and make some predictions for this years anticipated 2020 supercross season.

We know, Zen loves to talk about this "not knowing" stuff. And they sure seem to think they know a lot about it. But inspired by a koan that beautifully illustrates the idea, Dave got curious just how, when, and why this "Not Knowing" idea got stuck onto Zen. So Dave traces it all the way back to Buddha and what he said we could know, and then follows the bread crumbs up to the present day to see where Zen teachers got so confident about their own confusion. Along the way Dave tells some of his favorite stories from old Chan and even delves into his own history for some prime examples of what you think you know and what happens when you finally admit you don't. 

Pesto: The Modern Mother SauceBy Leslie Lennox Intro: Welcome to the Cookery by the Book podcast with Suzy Chase. She's just a home cook in New York City, sitting at her dining room table talking to cookbook authors.Leslie Lennox: Hi, I'm Leslie Lennox and my new cookbook is Pesto: The Modern Mother Sauce.Suzy Chase: Hope's Gardens is the award winning pesto company you founded. It all started when you and your husband Dave bought the home of your dreams in Atlanta and lo and behold, there was an iconic 1200 square foot, 1937 Lord and Burnham greenhouse on the property. What happened next?Leslie Lennox: We started working on several projects all at once. We were restoring the house. We were contemplating how we would approach the greenhouse and envisioning what we wanted in the backyard and garden. Although this was very exciting, the property, which was a little less than five acres, was very overwhelming for a city girl and a guy who had never gardened in his life. It was a little like Green Acres. So Dave has always approached things logically and I do so impulsively. So together we're a little bit of Ying and Yang. We agreed that we would live on the property for a year to understand what it actually needed and watch how the weather affected it. We also took a year or so to basically tame this property. The previous owners had grown old in the house and they were no longer able to take care of the home, the greenhouse, the gardens. So we set out to remove many of the large trees that looked like they would fall and do a great deal of damage to both our home and the greenhouse. The greenhouse had been painted blue. It had been turned into a storage shed. The roof was covered over with plywood and it was quite daunting. At the same time we had a young child at home and we were trying to take care of her and take care of this massive project.Suzy Chase: Talk about how you built your grassroots following the old-fashioned way.Leslie Lennox: Well, Suzy, yes, we definitely built Hope's Gardens the old-fashioned way. Our small family business came about organically. Dave and I had always enjoyed eating, cooking, and entertaining. So pesto was just a normal by-product of our daily lives. Dave gardened in his spare time and I cooked all the time. We were sharing our food with friends and they were encouraging us to sell our pesto. So I was immediately interested in doing that. Dave was not so much. At the same time I was working from home. I was making handmade greeting cards, while taking care of Hope. A friend of ours was organizing a new farmers market that was set to open in the spring of 2007 in our neighborhood. She was in charge of rounding out the mix of vendors and thought that my cards would fit in. I immediately said yes and Dave, Hope, and I set up a booth and started to sell cards. In addition to us, there was an egg vendor, a fresh pasta maker, one or two farmers from Alabama and north Georgia, and a jam maker. At the same time, less than three miles from this market in our garden, we had seven large beds overflowing with every kind of produce you could imagine. We had varieties of tomatoes. We had basil, cucumbers, many varieties of lettuce, eggplants, peppers, and you probably get the idea from that. I proposed to Dave, why don't we bring bags of our lettuce and herbs to the next market? He kind of thought that was a stupid idea, but the following week he agreed to go out and harvest the lettuce and herbs before we left early for the market. Within an hour or so, everything was sold. So this was no longer a dumb idea. And we did this for a few more weeks and then the light bulb moment came to try our pesto, and it was really exciting to see the reactions of people coming through the market. They knew next to nothing about us, but they loved our product, which was made from our homegrown Genovese basil. So we built on this week by week. Talking with customers to educate them on how we were growing our basil, how to use our product, providing recipes, and just all around good conversation. Many of these customers became good friends of ours. And what often happens at farmers markets is that retailers come through looking for the next great idea or product. We had the good fortune of having someone from Whole Foods come by, and at the same time these stores were searching for their local products. They invited Dave and I to to sell our pesto at their stores. So every Saturday we'd wrap up at the farmers market and we'd head back over to Whole Foods and we'd do another couple of hours demoing in their stores. We were having a blast doing this, but you know, it was really hard work. So we continued doing this for years.Suzy Chase: So we're all familiar with the classic Italian pesto. But you introduce readers to the new way to think about pesto. Describe your Modern Mother Sauce philosophy.Leslie Lennox: I incorporate pesto into everything. And when I was thinking of developing this cookbook, to me, pesto seemed much like the traditional mother sauces in that I was using them to build sauces, dishes, or an entire meal. The traditional mother sauces were used mostly by trained chefs in fancy restaurants. Pesto, on the other hand, was an easy to prepare homebase sauce and I see it as a staple, and it seemed natural to me to think of it in a modern way as a modern mother sauce. And a couple of years back, Somin Nosrat wrote a piece for the New York Times about modern mother sauces, and really out of that it became an accepted idea. So I knew that it was the right thing for me to do to move forward introducing pesto that way.Suzy Chase: In my opinion, classic mother sauces require quite a bit of proficiency and they're so inflexible. How is the modern mother sauce different?Leslie Lennox: Very true. Mother sauces are daunting. I have tried on several occasions and I've really never been very successful. To me, these sauces are very fussy, time consuming, and that's not really a fun way to prepare food. Pesto on the other hand, it's not very labor intensive and it's very forgiving. And that's fun. So that's the way I choose to go. The other point about traditional mother sauces is that they use a lot of butter, flour, and fat. And Pesto is primarily six ingredients, three of which I see as optional, but these ingredients are overwhelmingly good for you. They're fresh herbs, greens, garlic, extra virgin olive oil.Suzy Chase: Linton Hopkins, James Beard Award winner and chef owner of five Atlanta restaurants, wrote in the forward there is a need to be connected to who we are as people through kinship with soil, animals, and one another. All of which meet at the shared community table. Talk a little bit about your partnership with Linton.Leslie Lennox: Well, we met Linton and his wife Gina as they were one of the founders of the Peachtree Road Farmers Market where we got our start. They had recently opened their first restaurant in Atlanta, Restaurant Eugene, which was close by. They embrace eating local and seasonal food, and as a result they were securing all their produce from local farmers. The farmers market was created in part to offer additional outreach for these farmers to sell their products and for the community to eat the healthiest food possible. We would see Linton, Gina, and their two young children every Saturday morning at the farmers market. It became a ritual of theirs to stop by our booth to buy a couple of jars of Pesto, head home, and unpack all of their groceries and enjoy our pesto on some bread. Meanwhile their restaurant was doing really well and their food establishments started to multiply in Atlanta, so they offered us additional opportunities to sell our pesto, as well as other vendors from the market. Our products were sold in their gourmet retail store. It was on their menus in their restaurants, and then Linton started to curate menus for Delta Airlines International Premiere flights and he included our pesto every cycle.Suzy Chase: When you started producing Hope's Gardens Pesto, were you surprised to learn that so many people weren't familiar with pesto?Leslie Lennox: Yes I was. I had moved to Atlanta from New York, so pretty much I think everybody in New York was savvy to all of that. So no, most of the shoppers had not heard of the sauce before or if they had, they thought of pesto only on pasta. I set out to expand their knowledge of the product as well as my own because I was always learning as well.Suzy Chase: So since you grew up in New York, you grew up with pesto too?Leslie Lennox: I did. I did because I dined out an awful lot. That was my form of entertainment in New York and I enjoyed pesto at many restaurants. I also got interested in a couple of cookbooks that came out with a variety of pesto combinations such as the Silver Palate Cookbook. Martha Stewart always seem to include a pesto recipe. Ina Garten. And when Dave and I were moving into our new home, my parents gave Dave the Joy of Cooking as a birthday present and I really did love that cookbook and I still do. And I used the pesto recipe as a starting off point when we started to grow basil in our garden, and then I continued to tweak the recipe until it became my own.Suzy Chase: This cookbook is perfect for the home cook because it's more of a guideline than set rules. As home cooks, how should we approach pesto making and describe your outline?Leslie Lennox: In chapter one pesto basics, I've broken down pesto into six ingredient components. Plants, cheese or cheese substitutes, oil, nuts and seeds, garlic, and seasoning and acid. Of these six parts, I see three as being optional. I provide a large selection of ingredients for each component. I'm sure that there are more possibilities, but I think I've provided a pretty good start. There are many substitutions to provide options if someone is lactose intolerant, allergic to nuts, maybe they don't like garlic. So we should also take into account the seasons. Where you live, what is available at any particular time of year, and lastly, and maybe most importantly, is to avoid waste at any cost. This means if you purchase a bunch of carrots, or radishes, beets, or turnips at the green market, make pesto out of those greens. They have a lot of great vitamins. There are good things in it for you. I also created worksheets in the back of the book to capture your unique flavor combinations. There's nothing worse than creating a fabulous flavor and not knowing how you arrived there. These sheets let you hold onto your successes and also tweak those less than perfect combinations.Suzy Chase: Let's talk a minute about a couple of your unique combinations you created. First off, mint.Leslie Lennox: Well, mint pesto combines many of the things that make you think of springtime. Fresh mint, parsley, green peas, and a little fun fact is that basil and mint actually come from the same family. They both have square stems. So for the mint pesto, I love mint and lamb. It's kind of a classic combination. And in the cookbook I have a recipe, lamb kabobs over couscous, and it highlights the mint pesto.Suzy Chase: And then tell me about your lemon pesto.Leslie Lennox: Sure. I created this lemon pesto after we had started making many flavors and some of them required lemons. We were heavily invested in lemons, and as I've said before, I hate to waste. So I set out to create a flavor using the lemons. I acknowledge that this lemon flavor, lemon pesto is not for everyone. I tried creating it both with the skins and without the skins, and I decided in the end that I would go without it. It's potent, but if you love or even like lemons or citrus, it's a very interesting flavor. Now I think that just about anything works on a bruschetta. So in the cookbook I created a lemon bruschetta. I use lemon pesto, which I created with almonds, which have a nice creamy sort of neutralizing effect. And I also broil lemon slices. The garnish for this bruschetta is a drizzle of honey, so that's kind of a nice way to balance all of these flavors. The sweet and the savory acidic flavor.Suzy Chase: A vinaigrette is a dressing, but a dressing is not a vinaigrette. You also have a nice selection of vinaigrettes in the cookbook. Why did you choose to include a vinaigrette section?Leslie Lennox: Because one of my favorite things to do is to make salad and salads need to be dressed in a vinaigrette or dressing. And so a vinaigrette can be so many things. It can be a marinade, it can be added to an aioli or a mayo or whatever. And it just extends the use of pesto.Suzy Chase: There's such a wide array of recipe possibilities in this cookbook from eggs and toast to soups to beef, pork and lamb. One recipe that caught my eye is the gazpacho shooters with chilled pesto cubes. Can you describe this one?Leslie Lennox: Well this is a great recipe to make at the height of the summer when all the varieties of tomatoes are available at market. The addition of cilantro, lime, cucumbers, and peppers adds a wonderful coolness. And then also some heat which come from the jalapeños. As I recommend in the early part of the book that when you're making pesto and you have extra, put some in ice cube trays as you never know when you're going to need a hit a pesto in a stew, soup, or a sauce. So the gazpacho is ... it's perfect for these pesto cubes. It would be perfect as a starter or as a main meal on a very hot day. And today in New York it's going to be in the 90s so today would be a cool time to make it. I include a few tips with this recipe. First, make your prep simple by using a box vegetable dicer. All the ingredients will be the same size and that will result in beautiful presentation. And I also like to play around with recipes. I recipe flip. And I suggest, you can make it with tomatoes, you can make it with watermelon or cantaloupe as well. So that's kind of a fun thing and it creates more possibilities.Suzy Chase: On pages 81 and 82 you have an assortment of tea sandwiches. I made your recipe for open-faced smoked salmon pesto sandwiches. It's such a perfect summer treat. Talk a little bit about your pesto tea sandwiches.Leslie Lennox: Well they're perfect for any kind of little ... for a special event. I mean it could be a bridal shower, a baby shower, and it gives a nice assortment of ideas. You know, who doesn't like an egg salad with a little pesto on it. And one of my favorites from that is the tri-level sandwich. So you have very thin bread and you have different layers of different colored pestos and that's really, really pretty, and it's a little hit of pesto. Never hurt anybody.Suzy Chase: Now to my segment called My Last Meal. What would you have for your last supper?Leslie Lennox: Well, as I said, one of my favorite things to do is to eat vegetables and salads. So I would probably create or order an arugula, radicchio, and endive salad. I'd have homemade croutons, because I love bread. Crumpled goat cheese with a basil pesto vinaigrette, along with a glass of chilled white wine. That would be ideal.Suzy Chase: Where can we find you on the web and social media?Leslie Lennox: We have our website which is hopesgardenspesto.com and there's an S after Hope and S after garden. And we're also at Hope's Gardens Pesto on Instagram and Facebook.Suzy Chase: Thanks Leslie for teaching us how to go beyond basil and thanks so much for coming on Cookery by the Book podcast.Leslie Lennox: My pleasure. Thank you so much, Suzy.Outro: Follow Suzy Chase on Instagram at Cookery by the Book, and subscribe at cookerybythebook.com or in Apple podcasts. Thanks for listening to Cookery by the Book podcast. The only podcast devoted to cookbooks since 2015.

Ryan's off to Scotland this week, but Dave's back from New Zealand. So Dave and I enjoyed a casual conversation about travel . . . and other Summer topics. If you want business stuff, hang in til the end. In the meantime, we covered travel tips, bar-cades, video games, the Houston Space Center, and "Shows that are no longer with us." We a bit of a deep dive on the McDonald's Hamburger University. We wandered down memory lane to some of our favorite conferences over the years. And that led to a discussion of the SMB relationship with Microsoft over the years. Finally, we addressed a "real" technology topic: 4D printing. The site referenced is here: https://store.hp.com/app/tech-takes/4d-printing-already. :-)

Dave Woodward helped shape the entire affiliate program at ClickFunnels. He's a personal mentor, friend, and brother.   It's long overdue that I invite him to come on Sales Funnel Radio to share his wisdom...   I'm really pumped about this. Frankly, it's been in the planning for, like, seven months now…   I have wanted to get interview Dave Woodward  for a very, very long time.     If you guys don't know anything about him, he is one of the backbones of ClickFunnels...   … so you’re in for a treat.   I think it was October-ish 2018, just after the 30-Days Book went out. I was approached by ClickFunnels to write a chapter for a NEW book...   And, NEWS FLASH…   In case you’re slow to catch on ;-) this is me, announcing the release of the NEW Affiliate Bootcamp Book!   And of course, in true Steve Larsen fashion, I'm gonna over-deliver bonuses to the hilt, so you’ll wanna buy the book through my link…   THE NEW AFFILIATE BOOTCAMP BOOK   The book asks the question:   “How would you retire as a ClickFunnels affiliate in a hundred days?”   I spent pretty much all of my Christmas break writing my chapter.   ...it's NOT straight theory kinda stuff.   This is A LOT of the strategies I’ve used to crush it in affiliate contests.   So, I'm really excited about this.   For the 30-Days Book, I interviewed Russell…   For this one, I thought I would interview one of the backbones of Clickfunnels and the reason why:   Stuff gets done   There's an affiliate program that's run well.   The Dream 100 program is killin’ it.   ...and the name of that individual is Dave Woodward. He's a beast. He's the man...   Dave has become one of my favorite people on this planet, a mentor, a friend, a brother, and I look up to him like crazy.   I care dramatically what Dave Woodward thinks about me.   Maybe I shouldn't... I'm NOT supposed to say that, but it's true.   I really appreciate him, and everything he's done for me, and my family.   I am very, very excited, and completely, (in full transparency), extremely honored, to have our guest today.   This has been an interview I have been planning, and looking forward to, for a little over a year and a half now. I'm excited and to be completely honest, a little bit nervous.   I have tremendous respect for Dave Woodward. - tremendous respect.   If you guys don't know who Dave is, you should!   INTRODUCING DAVE WOODWARD   Dave is one of the cornerstones and keystones of all of ClickFunnels, and why it works…   ...please take that from a guy who sat across, and watched, and was very much a part of the intimate workings of what ClickFunnels is, and how it works.   Dave is one of the reasons why ClickFunnels is where it is.   He is one of the reasons why relationships are the way they are.   And,  in my honest opinion, the reason why Russell can even get his message out there…   I have a ton of respect for Dave and for what he does.   He has gone from a friend to an incredible mentor to me. I so appreciate and love him, and I'm very honored to interview him today.   Dave, thanks for being here.   DAVE: Well, I'm extremely honored, and I'm very nervous myself, so that makes two of us.   Thank you for allowing me to come on your show. I have such huge props for you, and I just admire all your work, and everything that you've done…   No one implements like you implement.   I love seeing it, you're such a role model to my kids, it's just fun, and I love seeing the impact that you're literally having across the entire world... so, it's an honor to be here. STEVE: Oh thank you very much, man. I'm glad to have ya.   Now a lot of people may not know….   Dave sits, literally across from his seat, he literally is looking into Russell's office - I mean he's like right there…   There's this tradition, (at least when I was there), it looked kinda like this…   So Dave and I, right, we're working, Melanie's there, we're getting our stuff done. Usually, there's some music going.   We're sitting around, and then all of a sudden Russell goes,”“UHHH!”   Which means…   “Get up and run to my desk.”   So Dave and I, would get up and run over to Russell's desk, and we'd basically watch the zeroes and ones God pour down wisdom into Russell's marketing brain…   https://media.giphy.com/media/3JSGn9bSDpzAFutb6W/giphy.gif ... and gold would just fall out. Dave and I, would both try to keep up, while at the same time validating, “Oh my gosh, that is a cool idea, better catch on to it...”   ... it's like really, really fun. One of the funnest environments. I miss it terribly.   Now, but a lot of people don’t know that you had a history with Russell and, pre-ClickFunnels. Right?   I mean, what were you doing before coming into ClickFunnels?   HOW DAVE MET RUSSELL   DAVE: I had my own marketing consulting agency for years.   In fact, I actually met Russell…   So, I come from the direct response marketing days…   Old Dan Kennedy, Bill Glazer, copywriting type of stuff... years and years and years ago.   And at the time I had a lot of clients who were in either the insurance, the health field, or else mortgages.   A lot of them were trying to figure out this whole online thing… (this is like 2007, 2008).   And it was that point where I thought, I gotta figure out this whole internet stuff. I've got too many clients who are wanting information about it.   I'd been on Russell's list, I'd been on other lists, and Russell was coming to do a seminar in affiliate marketing, not far from where I lived in Southern California…   So I thought, “Oh great, I'll just go, and go and listen there.”   I'm a huge believer of either working your way in, or buying your way in. And I've always preferred buying your way in, if it's at all available, it's faster. So it was Russell and Stu McLaren, and Russell got up and said:   "Hey, you know what? If you guys would like to take us out to lunch or dinner or anything, to just kinda pick our brains, go to the back and sign up."   I literally jumped out of my chair, ran to the back, and I signed up for EVERY breakfast, lunch, and dinner that Russell had.   I'm like, “The guy's either gonna hate me, or we're gonna become friends through this thing.”   I wanted to get to know him better, and so I literally signed up for EVERYTHING!   I'm sure when he first got it he was like, “Who in the world is this Dave Woodward guy? What have I gotten myself into?”   I can guarantee you, Russell would never do that now. You could never take him to lunch or dinner, but he was just getting started.   … and so we created a deep friendship.   I ended up setting up his 10th anniversary for Collette. They flew down to Southern California and went out to dinner, then flew to Catalina...   Russell is more than a friend, he's like a brother.   He's probably, in all honesty,  the closest friend I have aside from my wife.   There's nothing I wouldn't do for him.   Over the years, we've had the opportunity of doing a ton of different projects together, some in the real estate niche, some in the network marketing niche, some in the fitness niche.   Some made money, some lost money.   My very first product was with Russell - it was Legendary Marketers.   STEVE: No way.   DAVE: Yeah.   STEVE: Oh, I didn't know that was. Cool.   DAVE: And so, that was the very first product that I ever did...   Again it was one of those things where I saw, just his desire to help others grow, and, at whatever the cost. Just, just pour so much into people, and I was just drawn to him…   … and we've just literally become lifelong friends.   When we started ClickFunnels, I was still in Southern California. I was flying up here every other week, and Russell was like, “You just need to move up here..”   I'm like…   Dude, listen, we've been through a lot of things over the years, and NOT all of them have worked…   Before I uproot my family, I wanna actually make sure this whole ClickFunnels thing is actually gonna take off.   And then, as you can tell right now, it'll be three years this August.   So we moved up here after ClickFunnels was up and running for about a year and a half.   STEVE: I remember that. Only because it was like two months before, you flew in, that's when I moved my family up.   Russell was like, “You know Dave Woodward?” ...and I had just started seeing your majesty in the inner workings of ClickFunnels - all the stuff you're doing with Dream 100, the affiliate stuff…   … and Russell was like,  “He's gonna move on up,” and I was like, “No way, that's awesome.”   You moved up, and I kid you not…   We were already kind of naturally high energetic people, you, and I, and Russell, but the overall energy, it was like one plus one equals twelve when you came in!   I was like, “This is awesome,”...it's not a classic business office…   We were running around barefoot in t-shirts, shorts... music going all the time…   it's such a fun place to work and try to change the world also.   So, how did you end up doing stuff for Russell's people - the affiliate manager was your first role, right?   DAVE: Actually, no. I was in charge of all our business development. So one of the pieces of it was the affiliate plan.   STEVE: That's right, my bad.   DAVE: Yeah, so, what happened was, so …   My coming into ClickFunnels, (as far as, one of the things), we were at TNC, (we’ve just come back from TNC 10, so this must have been TNC, like five, or six), and it was ClickFunnels' first booth, at TNC, and they had put us in the far back corner…   I was like, “This just sucks. We can't do this. No one's gonna see us.”   Russell was actually speaking at TNC, and he was like, “Gosh, I just wish we had some way of getting attention to us, no one's gonna come to us…”   ...because it wasn't in the main ballroom…   He was like,  I wish we could just get some of those like showroom girls, you know, event girls, whatever it is.”   I'm like, “Dude, you're in my city. This is San Diego. I promise you, I will get you some girls.”   And sure enough, within about two hours, we had about five girls there, basically handing out t-shirts and directing people where to go...       And that's, I guess when Dillon and Todd were like, “We definitely need him more full-time than he is currently,” and that's how it started.   STEVE: Oh, man. Yeah, yeah. There have been multiple times where you've done stuff like that. Russell flies in, you fly in, you know.   Guys, Dave, Dave is the one that protects Russell emotionally when we travel as well. Multiple times, just protecting him.   Making sure, “Hey, we need to get somewhere,” or making sure Russell is where he needs to be, and protecting him from people who may be, respectfully, somewhat of a time suck.   There are just so many stories that are just popping into my head.   Oh my gosh…   You guys flew in once, and Russell didn't have any time to sell, or didn't get order forms, and you literally, in the lobby…   What's this story again? It's awesome.   DAVE: A friend of ours, basically in the health space, flew into Denver…   I love to sell, which is weird because for years I hated selling. It was like the worst thing in the world.   I would never, ever sell. I would never associate myself with selling...   … NEVER, dirty, bad!   But, I remember, we flew in, and I was sitting there talking to the promoter, and he basically said:   “Well, you know what, I thought we were gonna have more time. we ran over, we only really have about 25, 30 minutes, and you can't sell”   I'm like, “Dude, we flew all the way to Denver. We're not here NOT to sell.”   And he says, "No you really can't sell."   So I said, "Well, how much time do we have?" He said, "Well, you've only got 30 minutes."   I'm like, “Well we need at least 45.” He said, "Okay, 45 minutes."   I said, "If I just have a little tiny offer, would that be okay?" He said, "Yeah, but I don't want a full pitch." I'm like, “No problem.”   So I literally went into the little business center, and I created an order form on the computer they had there, (I'm sure it's so completely non-compliant)...   It was, honestly, just name, email, address, phone number, credit card - that's it.   It was printed off black and white and there was nothing fancy to it. I don't even know if they knew what they were buying.   But, just like Russell does, he was able to get up and he spoke... I could tell the promoter at the back was just getting antsy.   He's like, “You gotta hurry, you gotta hurry, gotta hurry.”   I'm like, “Russell let's just go a little bit faster.”   So, all of a sudden, he gets to the pitch.   He's like, “Listen, I don't have time to go through this, but you're gonna get this, this, this, this, and this…   ...and if you want, Dave's got some order forms, just take the order form and give them to us, and we'll process it.”   I literally had someone come back there and grab it out of my hand, write on it, and slap it down right in front of Russell on the stage.   Usually, we get table rushed at the back, but we had this massive podium rush. Everyone went to the front, and it was hilarious.   We out the room and we just laughed.   It's those types of moments, where I'm like, “No matter what it takes when you have an opportunity, we're gonna sell...”   And we sold, and it did very well.   STEVE: You guys knocked out the house, is what I heard. Just blew it out on a whim. I mean, come on! That's the kind of team that you guys are. It's just awesome.   Hey, so I wanted to ask a little bit about this Affiliate Book that's coming out - you have such unique eyes from where you are, and where you get to sit.   I know you get to work a lot with:   Biz Dev   Bringing in new Dream 100 people   All the affiliate stuff as well   … what is this New Affiliate Book, by the way?   DAVE: Oh, it is super, super cool… so this whole idea behind affiliate marketing ... First of all, for those of you who aren't familiar with affiliate marketing, it's probably the easiest way to get started online, because you don't have to have your own product.   You are literally promoting someone else's product.   And for us, they're promoting ClickFunnels.   We have a whole bunch of front end products because it's really hard to promote just a free trial -  one of those was 30days.com. Another one is OFA…   If you're not on OFA, my gosh, the One Funnel Away Challenge, Steven is just crushing it -  so you definitely need to be in that.   We had so much success with 30days.com - the idea behind that summit was, Russell went out to a lot of our Two Comma Club award-winning people, like Steven, and basically said:   “Hey, if you were to lose everything, and all you had was ClickFunnels, and your marketing know-how, what would you do in the next 30 days, to make money?”    ..and they put together a 540-page book, and it became a front-end for the One Funnel Away Challenge.   Well, as we were looking at that model, it became super, super successful, and we realized...   Steven actually helped build out Affiliate Bootcamp, which has been the primary product we've used to train our affiliates over the last year and a half, and we're at a point right now where we're trying to think…   If we were to update it, how would we do it best?   And we thought, instead of us doing it…   Why not reach out to the people who've been the most successful doing affiliate marketing inside of ClickFunnels, and have them tell their stories…   ... and use somewhat of the same premise as the 30 Day Book…   Not necessarily, if you lost everything and only had 30 days, but, “If you were to start over as an affiliate, what are the things that you would wanna do?”   What are the different things that would actually provide the greatest return in the shortest amount of time?   Because for a lot of affiliates, it's like, “Ah, I've got my own job, I don't have a whole bunch of time, ” and it was just fascinating.   Bailey Richert is the one who basically put it together for us, she went out, and interviewed 17 of our top affiliates…   I was literally talking to her today, and she goes, “You know, Dave, the 30days.com was really cool, but the real secret sauce was on the back end after you bought the product you got behind the scenes of their actual funnel…”   She said, "I don't know what it was with these affiliates? They literally gave every single thing on the front end."   So those people who actually get involved in our New Affiliate Launch, or Summit are going to get the very best of 17, (we may actually get to 20, but 17 right now), people who have literally been crushing it as an affiliate for ClickFunnels sharing EVERYTHING:   YouTube strategies   How to do an offer?   What is a bridge funnel?   How do you build a list?   How do you build a product that ties into your list to provide even greater value so that people fall in love with you, as well as the new product that you might be introducing them to?   So, the whole idea behind this is really to have a person create their own product/ business on the front-end without having to create all the products, (and everything else), on the back end...   … and NOT have to worry about the support.   So, I'm so excited about it...  because it’s literally going to be the BIGGEST game changer for us.   Currently, Steve, we have five people who have done over a million dollars in affiliate commission so far.   Five people who have hit the two comma club as an affiliate for ClickFunnels.   STEVE: Oh man.   DAVE: It's just insane.   You know, when we first started this thing, we came up with this idea of the dream car…   The idea behind it is, if you got a hundred people, we'd pay $500 for your lease or purchase of your dream car.   At 200 people, we'd pay $1,000.   I thought, “No one's ever gonna get to 200 people!”   ...and now we have people who have thousands of affiliates...   Thousands of ClickFunnels accounts because of it.   So the idea behind affiliate marketing:   It's the easiest way to get started online.   This new affiliate summit is literally gonna give you, truly, the step-by-step program from 17 of the top affiliates that we have.   They're gonna break down, NOT only just affiliate marketing, but how they actually get traffic, how do they actually build an offer, how they build a bridge page.   And you’ll actually see some of their actual bridge pages, as well.   We were sitting there trying to price this thing out, and I'm like, “You understand this is like a $500 product,” and Bailey's like, “Yeah, but summits only sell for like $47 to $67.”   And I'm like, “Oh my gosh, alright, we'll do it, whatever price.”   I don't know what price point we're gonna settle at  - somewhere between $47 and $97, I don't know...   But it's people like you, Stephen, who literally said, "Alright, let me show you exactly what it really takes. Let me go through and break it down step by step, how you actually can make tens of thousands of dollars a month, as an affiliate."   And I know we pay you a pretty hefty cheque, just in affiliate commission.   STEVE: Yeah, it's, uh ...   And what's funny everybody, is that it's kinda on the back-end of my business and it's just because of the strategy.   I gotta tell you, I loved writing the 30 Days chapter, but the affiliate chapter... oh my gosh, I took all of Christmas, like three or four days, to write that thing - it was beautiful.   DAVE: Well actually Bailey, (just between you and I), even though anyone who listens to this will now know it, Bailey actually said yours is the best one…   … honestly, because it was so detailed, Stephen.   The way you did it, she actually wants to lead with yours to set the stage for the other ones...   Because of the way you talked about:   Bridge Funnels   Offers   Bonuses   I mean, you were our top affiliate for 30days.com, and it was just crazy. And, I've seen you do that multiple times, even in our One Funnel Away Challenge.   And the crazy thing about the One Funnel Away Challenge was you came in dead last and didn't start until like three days left. It was crazy.   STEVE: That 10X Secrets thing...   DAVE: That's what it was.   And you were right in the middle of OfferMind, I think. Was that it?   STEVE: Yeah, yeah.   DAVE: And I was asking you to teach some of our speaker training, and you had no time. No time at all. And yet, to see you come in, and use this strategy that you now taught in that chapter, it was just brilliant to see.   The thing that I love most about the chapter that you wrote, is your chapter actually goes in through, literally, step by step…   It's how you teach -  you're so very methodical in teaching practical steps - literally, it's ‘paint by numbers.’ It's the easiest way you can do it…   I mean, step one, step two, step three.   And because you've been through it, you lived through it, and you started with nothing…   ...and NOW, you're one of our top affiliates!   It's just neat that you were so kind and so generous with spending as much time as you spent on that chapter.   It's probably going to be one of our leading chapters.   STEVE: Oh man, I appreciate that a lot.   Well,  what can somebody do ... What's a favorite way ... I mean, you have such a unique area that you get to see all these different affiliates…   If somebody’s new and doesn't have much of a following, what should they be doing if they want to become an affiliate?   DAVE: I think, it goes back to, probably your secret sauce, and that's publishing.   I think, honestly, and as much as people hate it, I think it’s one of the coolest things.   People wanna find someone they can connect to, so documenting your journey as an affiliate, is probably the best thing that you can do, because later you’re gonna be able to sell that journey.   And it may take a little bit of time, but if I was a brand new affiliate, just starting off, I would start publishing on a regular basis.   You could pick:   Dotcom Secrets   Expert Secrets   30 Days   ….I don't care which product you want.   I would literally go in, I would make it your own, I would teach what you learn, on a Facebook live, on an Instagram story, whatever it might be, and refer people to it:   “This is what I've learned.”   Because people love understanding the take a way that you got and seeing how that you're actually using that.   So, I think that's probably one of the things that I would look at.   Where MOST affiliates go wrong is, they think they're just gonna take the affiliate link and just promote it directly, and that's why I love your chapter… because you were so anti that.   You're like, “You can't do that! Let me show you what you can do.”   And I think, as an affiliate just getting started, just pick one thing…   And, again, as you mentioned before, just go all in on it. Study it. Make it your own.   And that way when you're teaching it, people are going, “Oh, that's how that works. Oh, okay, now I understand,” and then people can connect with that… and they'll love the journey as well.   STEVE: Oh man, that's awesome. Thank you so much for taking the time.   You know, I have such respect for you, and what you do, and just love your family -  my wife and I talk about you guys a lot.   We love your sons, they're all awesome and incredible - we just love your family and everything that you guys do.   And I really mean what I say,   I really believe that half the reason Russell can do what he does is that he’s got you in his corner, just fighting battles he didn't even know about.   You know what I mean?   Just going to bat, getting all the dirties away that are out there trying to take advantage, you know, stuff like that.   It's just this role that is like so, I don't even know, it's special. And it's fun to see it.   DAVE: Thank you.   STEVE: So I just, anyway. Any parting advice or words before we end up here?   DAVE: You know, for me, I think the one thing I would tell people is just don't give up.   I think the hardest part for affiliate marketing, or even for a lot of the online marketing is just, you have a dream out there, and you see it, and you want it so bad…   ... and yet things don't go exactly the way that you want.   You can joke around about this idea, being one funnel away, but you truly are…   You just don't know which funnel that's gonna be.   And so, I would just say:   If this is what you wanna do, don't let anything get in your way.   It's possible, things happen... it doesn't go as fast as you want, I'll let everyone understand, I'm totally transparent...   It never works as fast as you want   ,...but for those who stick it out, you get to this little corner and you literally hockey stick and life takes off for you.   I saw the same thing with you last year, where you got going and you’re putting forth all this effort, and all of a sudden you get to this little corner, and you literally hockey stick, and life just takes off for you.   And I think the problem is, most people aren't willing…   Again it's that, 99 yards does not a touchdown make…   You gotta be willing to go all the way   As long as you don't quit, and just realize that you're in that phase of learning…   There are two parts…    You have the:   Learning phase   Earning phase   Too often people wanna jump into the earning phase, without paying their dues in that learning phase.   If you'll spend the time in that learning phase, the money that will come later in life - it's just crazy. Astronomical.   STEVE: Oh, man. Well, thank you so much. You're a friend, a mentor, a brother, and just, I love and appreciate you. Thanks for being on.   Awesome episode, right?   Hey, bear with me for just a moment while I tell you about makeaffiliatesgreatagain.com.   Probably one of the most fragile phases of being an entrepreneur is that tender spot where you have just enough cash coming in to get excited, but expenses also increase a little while you take on new tools and new systems, new teams.   It can be heart pounding, and frankly, nerve-wracking.   Well, one of the ways I've kept ownership of my companies and NEVER picked up any debt or used any of our family finances to grow the business, was through affiliate marketing.   My first dollar online actually came from affiliate marketing, ONLY a few years ago.   So I often get asked the question:   “Steve, how can you have been bootstrapping this and scraping by so hard just a few years ago, but now have a business that makes millions in revenue?”   … that's a fair question.   So besides having kick butt products, when I've needed to get some extra cash for an expensive project, I have a very specific method of affiliate marketing that gets me paid to sell other people's products.   You wanna see how I do it? Just go to makeaffiliatesgreatagain.com.   ClickFunnels actually wants to know how I've been doing this as well…   So I just wrote a chapter in ClickFunnels new book called Affiliate Bootcamp... and if you wanna see my chapter, and be shown how I treat affiliate cash in my business, just go to makeaffiliatesgreatagain.com…   You'll get a bunch of other cool stuff from me - like, the actual Make Affiliates Great Again Funnel…   The one you're gonna see there - it’s pre-built - it’s awesome - and you can download it.   You also get my audio chapter on how I create affiliate offers. You get the actual video of me training my team on how to build Make Affiliates Great Again - it's crazy valuable.   Plus you also get several my other stage speeches.   How I launched my affiliate offers…   And you'll even get a discount ticket to OfferMind… + the Make Affiliates Great Again Mini-Course…   Is it okay if I over deliver???   If you want ALL that for free... plus other things, literally just sign up at makeaffiliatesgreatagain.com... and then, sign up for the New Affiliate Bootcamp through my affiliate link. Go figure.   My friends, get rich, give back.

GUEST BIO: Dave is a Software Developer who has been building web applications since using HTML tables for layout started to go out of style.  A background in classical design and computer systems technology has enabled him to roam between the worlds of design and development.  Dave hails from Ottawa, Canada where he works remotely for Test Double. EPISODE DESCRIPTION: Phil’s guest on today’s show is Dave Mosher.  He has a background in classic design and computer systems technology. Today, he works remotely for Test Double as a Software Developer. Dave has also held this position at Shopify and Pillar Technology. For several years, he ran his own consulting company DAVEMO. He specializes in producing high-performance front-end web architecture and is currently working on getting more deeply involved in coaching and mentoring. KEY TAKEAWAYS: (1.04) – So Dave, can I ask you to expand on that intro and tell us a little bit more about yourself? Dave started his IT career working as a designer. He started out just working with HTML and CSS. At first, he did a lot of desktop publishing work. But, he soon moved on to development, working with databases. (2.27) - How did you get into Test Double? When did that come about? Dave spent a few years working at a start-up in Saskatoon, Saskatchewan, doing Python app development on Google App Engine. During that time, he grew a lot and learned to wear lots of hats. That role ended and Dave found himself at a loose end. Around the same time, Kevin Baribeau, a fellow test dabbler, was also under-occupied. He got a job at a consultancy called Pillar Technology. So, Dave applied for a role there too and was hired as a remote consultant. During much of his time with Pillar Technology he worked directly with the guy who hired him, Justin Searls. He also came across Ted Kaufmann while working there. Within about two years, Justin and Ted left Pillar Technology and set up Test Double. Dave ended up working for them as a consultant and later as a full-time employee. It was Justin that helped him to learn TDD, how to write tests and introduced him to the realm of Agile software development. Dave says he learned more in the nine months he worked directly with Justin than he had in the previous five years. (4.53) – Can you please share a unique career tip with the I.T. career audience? Dave’s advice is not to chase technology if you are not happy in your current role. In all likeliness a shiny new piece of technology is not going to solve your problems. If you start chasing after shiny tech it usually ends in disappointment. Ultimately, technology is not really the source of the challenge you are looking for. Solving people’s problems is what brings job satisfaction. You don’t need to be using the latest technology to do that.  Phil asks if he is saying that you need to avoid the shiny penny syndrome. Dave confirms that is the case. Chasing after the latest tech is a trap that a lot of newcomers fall into. They tend to underestimate the human factors of software development. (7.09) – Can you tell us about your worst career moment? And what you learned from that experience. Before joining Double Test full time, Dave took a job with Shopify. He wanted to get away from using JavaScript and learn to use Ruby on Rails. Overall, it was a good move. He learned a lot while working there. But, it was also where his worst career moment took place. At the time, he was refactoring their asset pipeline. It was really slow, taking five minutes to run, so Dave re-tooled it. He did a good job and got the run time down to about 20 seconds. So, they rushed his enhancement out to production. That was a mistake, a big one. They ended up taking down the whole of Shopify for about 15 minutes. At the time, there were around 80,000 websites running on the platform, so it was a big deal. This incident taught Dave that if you are making a change to a big platform you need to be especially careful before proceeding. You have to slow things down a bit and vet everything in every possible environment. It is also important to keep your QA and production environments as closely aligned as possible. At the time, Shopify had not succeeded in doing that. Dave and the people he was working with had been lured into a false sense of security. When the enhancement test went green in the QA environment they, understandably, assumed it would work in production. Unfortunately, that is not what happened. (11.10) – What was your best career moment? For Dave, that was when he first started working for Double Test. At the time they were working on a contract for a very large firm. Like most large corporations, the work environment was incredibly restrictive and inflexible. They had lots of standards in place and hoops to jump through. It was impossible to work fast because Dave and his colleagues had virtually no autonomy. However, they did find a way around this. Working with one of the firm’s developers, who did a lot of API work, they were able to build a shim and their own tooling. This enabled them to work in isolation at the front end with the angular piece and JavaScript. That meant that they could work much faster. For everyone involved in coming up with this solution it was a great technical triumph. But, Dave took the most pleasure from the fact that they had been able to help the team lead they were working with to gain confidence and excel. They invested a lot of time and energy into coaching him and giving him personal encouragement. This included teaching him people skills, for example, how to avoid confrontations and not become defensive. By the end of their time together he was a completely different person. So much so that he actually said “you guys changed my life.” (13.50) – Can you tell us what excites you about the future of the IT industry and careers? The fact that the barrier to entry has been lowered significantly really excites Dave. Code boot camps are making the field of IT a lot more accessible. In particular those boot camps that have structured their courses so that you do not necessarily have to pay your tuition fees up front. Dave has also been involved in producing educational resources. He took what he was doing at work and replicated the processes via screencasts so that he could help and educate other people. It was wildly successful and Dave found that putting together the lessons helped to solidify his knowledge. So, the benefits were twofold. Both parties benefited. He has noticed that a lot more people are starting to do share their knowledge, recently, something he is very pleased to see. (17.10) – What drew you to a career in IT? Dave drifted into IT through design. But, to get involved in the back end he had to go back to school and complete a Computer Systems Technology diploma. It was the only way he could go from being a starving artist, so to speak, to making some real money. (17.36) – What is the best career advice you have ever received? That advice came from Justin. He was struggling to convince Dave that test-driven development was the way to go. Dave, like most developers, was used to starting with the code first, then thinking about tests. Justin knew, from experience, that he was right. But, when Dave did not listen he did not continue to badger him. Instead, he let him go his own way and discover the painful way that he was wrong and Justin was right. Test-driven development did work best. This experience taught Dave the value of allowing yourself the freedom to fail. He learned how to use his pain as a motivator. He still remembers how going down the wrong path feels, so stops and thinks more before choosing a course of action. Dave is also more inclined to listen to others than he was when he first started his career. (18.54) – If you were to begin your IT career again, right now, what would you do? Dave says that he would probably spend a lot more time working with relational databases. If you want to specialize, being a database admin, and understanding the nuts and bolts of PostgreSQL or Postgres is a great approach, right now. He would also get a better handle on data modeling. Developers have a tendency to start without the data. As a result, all too often, they end up painting themselves into a corner pretty quickly. (19.56) – What are you currently focusing on in your career? Right now, Dave wants to get more involved with mentoring. He wants to have more of an impact on people’s personal lives. Dave is currently figuring who the people in his community are so that he can make himself available to them and help others to level up. (20.39) – What is the number one non-technical skill that has helped you the most in your IT career? For Dave, that is his musical abilities. He plays piano, drums, bass, and guitar. Dave finds playing to be a good creative outlet and has noticed that there is a lot of crossover between musicality and IT. While playing music, you learn to pick up on patterns and how to improvise. This skill set is useful for IT professionals as well as musicians. Playing music with others sharpens your ability to spot where they are going and follow them or add to what they are doing. These skills are also useful in the workplace. (22.18) – Phil asks Dave to share a final piece of career advice with the audience. Dave’s parting piece of advice is - When you feel it's time to move on, reconsider. Usually, if you are at the end of your rope there will still be something you can do to reframe the engagement in a way that is positive. Adversity provides you with the chance to rise to the challenge and learn. So, when you are struggling, stop, think and see if you can solve the problem without necessarily changing companies. Only move on when you have considered things carefully and determined there is no way to fix the problem. BEST MOMENTS: (1.45) DAVE – "I was drawn to the web via the power of design." (3.05) DAVE – "Don't chase technology would be my number one career tip." (7.08) PHIL – "It's the right technology for the right solution as opposed to a specific technology." (10.45) DAVE – " Take a little bit more time than you think you need and try to vet all of the things that you're working on in every environment possible" (18.33) DAVE – "Allow yourself the freedom to fail." (22.23) DAVE – “When you feel like it's time to move on, reconsider.” CONTACT DAVE: Twitter: https://twitter.com/dmosher LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/dmosher/ Website: https://blog.davemo.com

Want to see my top take-aways from the recent mastermind that I was at, with some of the top thought leaders in the world? On today’s episode Russell talks about some of the things he learned during his recent trip to Puerto Rico for Brendon Burchard’s mastermind group. Here are some of the amazing things you should listen for in this episode: Why Russell almost didn’t go to the mastermind group, and how Collette convinced him that they should go. What some of the gold nuggets were that Russell picked up from people like, David Bach, Ethan Willis, and Rachel Hollis. And what mastermind group Russell recommends for you to be a part of for you to get the most success with your business. So listen here to find out what kind of awesome tidbits Russell picked up at the Puerto Rico Mastermind. ---Transcript--- What’s up everybody? This is Russell Brunson, welcome back to the Marketing Secrets podcast. This episode I want to bring you behind the scenes of some of the cool takeaways, nuggets and ideas I got at the most recent Puerto Rico Mastermind with Brendon Burchard and a whole bunch of other amazing people. Hey everyone, I hope you guys are doing awesome. I know I’ve been telling you guys for the last couple of episodes that I was going to tell you about this amazing trip we had to Puerto Rico and kind of pull you into some of the cool details behind the scenes of what happened. I wish I had everything recorded and I could just sell you guys access to the videos, because that would be amazing for me and for you and for everybody. But unfortunately there were no video cameras allowed. So all I had was my notebook and my thoughts, so that’s what you’re going to get today. I hope you guys are okay with that. Kind of the preface of what this event was, so if you’ve been listening to the podcast for a while I did this episode last summer, or last, I don’t even know when it was, it was probably 8 or 9 months ago about this secret illuminati mastermind meet up meeting that I had in Wyoming. We flew out and we took helicopters and all these amazing business owners were there. And it was run by Brendon Burchard and there was a whole bunch of, the list of people that were there was awesome. So I had a good time, learned a bunch of really cool things. And it was kind of almost more like a, I don’t know, I’m used to marketing meetings. I’m a hardcore marketing dude who just wants to know marketing and that’s all I care about. And then I’m around all these personal development people and they are all talking about other things and it turned into this event where we’re crying and changing our emotions and all sorts of crazy stuff that I’m not used to. But I really enjoyed it and had a great time. Anyway, now fast forward 8 months later and they were going to do a second meeting. And I wanted to go and then they were going to bring our spouses and stuff, which I thought would be really cool. But then literally the day the event starts is the same day we were getting home from our Disney Cruise with our kids and I’d already been away for like 10 days. And I was just like, I can’t do it. So I basically told Brendon, “Hey, we can’t go.” Then fast forward to Funnel Hacking Live, I don’t think Brendon got my email or my text or however I told him because he didn’t know about it. So backstage, I can’t remember if it was before or after his presentation, he’s like, “Dude, you’re coming to Puerto Rico right?” I’m like, “No.” and he’s like, “What? You’re not coming? It’s going to be amazing.” And starts naming off all the people and my beautiful wife, Collette was next me and one of the people that was at last year’s meeting was Dave Hollis and his wife is Rachel Hollis. And if you’ve read, or your spouse, I guess your wife or spouse or whatever has read Girl, Wash Your Face or Girl, Stop Apologizing, that’s written by Rachel Hollis. It was the number two bestselling book all of last year. The only person that beat her was Michelle Obama, so I think she cheated, but who knows. Anyway, the book’s awesome. I read it first, I had Collette read it, I had tons of people in my office read it. Men and women. And it’s an amazing book. And she’s blown up and just doing a bunch of stuff. Collette loves her, we listen to her podcast, we listen, her podcast is called the Rise podcast and her and Dave have a podcast together called Rise Together, which is a really great couples podcast. It’s just awesome. So over the last 7 or 8 months since the last event, we’ve really, not directly connected with them, but through their content and through what they do, I’ve had just an amazing time with that. So Dave said, or Brendon said, you know, he’s naming all the people, he said Dave. And Collette’s like, “Well, is Rachel coming.” And Brendon’s like, “Yeah, Rachel’s going to be there too.” And Collette looks at me, she’s like, “We’re going.” I’m like, “Oh great. How am I going to fit this into our busy schedules?” But we decided to go and I’m super grateful we did. We’re lucky, Brent and Amber Coppieters went on the Disney Cruise with us, their kids and our kids, and then we got back from the cruise, we just pulled into Miami or whatever and they jumped into a plane with our kids and flew them and their kids, like 9 kids, my kids and their kids, flew them home. And then Collette and I jumped into a plane and flew to Puerto Rico. And we got there a day early so we had a chance to go to the spa there, which was insane. So many cool stories. And then the next day the masterminding happened. We had a chance to hang out with everybody, get to know them all, just had a really good time. Anyway, I’m just going to kind of go through my notes here and pull out some of the cool things I got that I think you guys will benefit from. I may remember some of the people, some of these thoughts may be just completely disjointed, but I’m going to share them anyway. If you listen to my podcast, I’ll do whatever I want. And hopefully everyone will get some value, some gold out of one of the nuggets that I’m dropping behind. Alright, so with that said, I’m going to jump into my notes. So the one thing that Brendon had us do at the very beginning of the mastermind which is fascinating, he talked about a lot of times we set goals or to do’s of things we want to accomplish and he said, “Instead of thinking of things as to-do’s we need to start thinking of things like scenes.” He said, if you take a timeline and go backwards in time, what are the scenes that are most memorable of your life. So I started thinking, I remember when I won my state title as a junior in high school. That was just a scene in my life that I dreamt about, it was amazing, it happened and I can always go back. That was an amazing thing. My senior year, when I took second place high school nationals, I became an all American. That is a scene in my life. When I served a mission for my church, some experiences there are different scenes. And when I met my wife and I proposed to her and we got married and then when the twins were born, when we got pregnant with the twins after not being able to get pregnant for months and months. All these things are scenes in your life, right. When you look at a scene that’s like colorful and beautiful and you can feel it, you can experience it, it’s an emotional thing. So he said, make a timeline and in the back right all the scenes you remember in your life that were impactful that shifted your destiny. So I’m kind of writing those out. And then he said, “What I want to do for now, is write all these different, in the timeline, have all these ticks in the timeline. And then instead of having a goal, I want you to project a scene in the future.” And he said, for example instead of “I’m going to make a hundred million dollars this year.” It’s like, “When we hit our goals we’re going to go on this amazing…’ Project the scene and make it colorful and beautiful. And some of you are visualizing, and try to visualize and imagine the experiences and the celebrations you have with that thing. And what happens when you don’t just have a goal and you create these scenes in your mind of what it’s going to be like when you accomplish the goal, or the journey of the goal, whatever it means, then that thing draws a meaning to the goal. Instead of just being a goal, like why do you want to have a goal of getting into the Two Comma Club, I don’t know. The reason why someone in my world would want to get into the Two Comma Club is they were at Funnel Hacking Live, they saw people on stage and they visualized that next year they were going to be onstage getting that award. Holding it up and getting the picture taken with me, that kind of thing. They were projecting a scene of their goal, and that scene in their mind draws meaning to the goal, which is the thing that actually draws you to it. And the better you can describe this scene the better, the more real it becomes. So describing it to yourself or your spouse or on your podcast or whatever. But the power of that is really, really cool.  But what he had us do was make a timeline and back in time what are the scenes that happened, and then what were the meanings that I drew from those scenes? Then moving forward, what are the scenes that I want to experience? And then trying to visually experience those and see those, which was really, really cool. So that was something cool I learned from Brendon. Let’s see, I can’t remember who this one, oh, this was Craig Clemons who was one of the greatest, probably one of the greatest living copywriters right now. He’s amazing and he was talking about the different products in his product line. He’s got this huge media company that’s killing it, doing crazy numbers. And he said, “If you look at all the..” he published different doctors and their products and books and supplements and things like that and he says, “My goal in marketing is to rewrite the story that’s inside of people’s heads, right.” So the reason why people are struggling in any area of life, is there’s this story in their head. He says, “My job, through my copy and videos and product and everything is to rewrite the story in their head.” And as he said that I just wrote, I wrote down, “Rewrite the story.” And then I wrote next to it with a big starburst around it, “New opportunity” if you read the Expert Secrets book we talked about new opportunities. It’s all about that, right. If I had to get somebody to shift from the vehicle that they’re in right now to get them into the vehicle that I know is going to get them to their future, I’d figure out what are the false beliefs they have? What’s that story in their head? And then my job is, as a marketer and a story teller, is to rewrite that story. And you do that by writing a better story, crafting a story that they will then believe. And when you do that, then they will follow you. And I just thought it was kind of cool that he looked at what he does as a copywriter, he’s rewriting stories in people’s heads. I was like, “Yes, I get that. That’s what I do too. It’s so exciting.” Okay, alright I’m going to keep going through these notes here. Oh, one thing. So Tom and Lisa Billaboo, they are the founders initially of Quest Nutrition, which is Quest bars, which is one of my favorite companies out there. They ended up getting it valued at a billion dollars and then they sold their stuff, and then they started this thing called impact theory, which is an amazing podcast, youtube channel and a bunch of stuff. But it was funny because we were going on this hike, and everyone was doing it because we were supposed to, but no one really wanted to. We wanted to go back and we wanted to do mastermind and stuff, but we felt obligated to do it. And everyone was kind of sitting here, we were at the halfway point of like, “Do we keep going on or do we stop?” We were having some car issues and some people were getting sick, so we kind of pulled over. And he said something that was really powerful. He said, “I always ask my wife this. I say, “what are your selfish desires? Just tell me what are your selfish…do you want to do this? Do you not?’ and she says ‘My selfish desires I’d rather do blah blah blah.” He’s like, “Cool, I’d rather do that too.” And it was pretty cool. So he asked us all, “What’s your selfish desire? If you’re being selfish what’s your desire, what do you really want?” And then we all told it. So it was like, oh, we all wanted the same thing. So then we just did it. When most of the time we don’t tell people our selfish desires because we sound selfish and we hold it back and we don’t just use that as a tool. And because of that half the time we end up going on these long rants or long problems that become bigger and bigger and bigger because we don’t just communicate what we really, really want. And he said that’s a tool they use all the time when they’re both trying to decide something like, “I don’t know what to do. What do you want to do?” That kind of indecision, he stops and says, “What’s your selfish desire. If you could do anything, selfishly, what would it be.” And then boom, that’s how they are able to go and figure out that’s what they’re going to do. But it was just kind of a cool tool for me that I thought was awesome. Okay, gall I could spend days going through all this. I’m trying to find some of the really, really important things that I think will have the biggest impact for you guys here. Sorry, I just gotta make sure. Okay, one of them David Bach was there. If you know David Bach, he’s written like a billion books. They’re all like New York Times bestsellers like a million times over. And he’s got a new book coming out called the Latte Factor and I think it’s his first new book in a while. And he was asking questions on how to launch a book. And low and behold Mrs. Rachel Hollis jumped up, whose sold more books than anyone on planet earth last year and she’s like, “This is what I did.” And I’m like, ‘Oh” freakishly writing notes as fast as I could. And it was interesting, she started going through this. It made me so happy. Some of you guys know I’m writing the Traffic Secrets book right now, and in chapter two it’s called Dream 100. And she never said the word Dream 100, but what she explained was the Dream 100 concept to a T. She said, “What are the tribe that my women are already in? And we do tribe infiltration.” So she said, ‘What network marketing companies are they in? What Facebook groups? What Instagram channels? All these kind of things. What hashtags are they following.” And they find those people and say, “Who are the tribe owners that I’ve got to infiltrate? Who do I need to become friends with?” So she said, they basically went to instagram and anyone that had over 200,000 followers they would just DM them and be like, ‘Hey this is so and so, can we talk.” And it just started going crazy messaging anyone that had over 200,000 followers to build up their dream 100, their list of influencers, they’re tribe, the tribe leaders. Then they’re whole job is tribe infiltration. Anyway, I thought was so awesome. They pre-sold 200,000 copies of her new book, Girl, Stop Apologizing, before it went live, which is crazy. And then Lewis Howells jumped in and talked about how he sold his book. What he did is he went and found the 20 biggest podcasts, not the little ones, but big podcasts that moved the needle in book sales, and went and did in depth, really amazing interviews with those people on the books to get his book to become a New York Times Bestseller. So it wasn’t like, ‘I need 500 podcast interviews.” But what are the 20 most strategic, best podcasts I could be on that are going to drive a ton of book sales, which would be awesome. Alright, that was some cool stuff. So many good things here. Ethan Willis who is one of the partners at Growth.com, he talked about purpose management which was really, really cool. I’m not going to go too deep into that because, it was just like, “What’s process management? What’s your purpose management? What is your purpose? What’s the reason why you’re doing this thing and that thing?” really going deep and remembering your purpose. He said, “If I were to die in 3 years what would I have to do to get…right now it’s like, based on that, what should you do right now? Go and do those things.” So good, so many, I wish, he went on this 20 minute rift that was just, I wish I could record, that would have been amazing for everyone. A lot of these are just ideas I wrote down of like cool things we could do as we’re launching books and things like that. Yeah, I think I might be done with the stuff I’m going to share. Looking if there’s anything else really big that pops out. Okay, one thing. I hope she doesn’t mind that I’m sharing this. But Rachel Hollis’ big question was like, “Okay, we had all these goals and all these dreams and then we hit them all. Now what? Do we try to make more money? Do we just, are we okay with that? What’s okay?” I think that’s a question a lot of people, especially religious people, that we ask, “Is it okay that I’m doing this? Is it okay that I’m making more money? Should I be content? Should I….” You know what I mean? And a couple of things were really good that were said to her. One is that when you start looking at these things that are happening to you, the phrase I wrote down says, “It is not mine, I am a steward.” So I look at that like, this business, this money, it’s not mine, it’s God’s and I’m a steward of it. So if you look at it from that way, it’s like I’m a steward of it. I’ve been called to do these things, then you start looking at it differently. If I’m a steward of this money, or this platform, or this role, what does he want me to do? Does he want me to shut it down and shrink? No, that’s not what he would want. He would want you to magnify it right, bring your calling out and do the best you can and stuff like that. And then the second thing is like, am I going to run out of ideas? What’s going to happen? And it’s like, if you are the steward then, and it’s coming from God and if you are the steward, then he’s going to keep giving you light and knowledge because you’re the steward of this thing that you’re doing and you’re doing the right things, you’re moving forward. A couple of other phrases I wrote down, “It’s because of you, it’s through you.” So it wasn’t you that did, it’s not because I’m great that this thing happened through me. And I see that all the time in our community. So many good things. Mother Theresa said, “I am the pencil.” I’m not the one doing the work, I’m the instrument that’s writing the thing. Anyway, I think that’s the core part of the notes I was going to share. But I hope that gives you guys a couple of nuggets from my mastermind group. And if you’re not part of a mastermind, go and be part of one, plug into one. You should definitely join the Two Comma Club X one because that’s the best one. Or my inner circle, because that’s the next level which is even better. But as of right now, you can only sign up at Funnel Hacking Live. I think eventually we’re going to open them up to the mass public, but for right now it’s closed down. So do what you can to get into a new mastermind group. And I’d recommend getting the Two Comma Club X mastermind group, it’s an amazing program. In fact, we have our first event of the year with those guys coming up next week, which is exciting. Anyway, I’m going to go. I’ve got so many more things I want to share with you but the night is young. Actually, the night is not young, the night is late and I gotta go. So appreciate you guys all, thanks so much for everything and I will talk to you on the next episode.

A doctor asks what he should do about a bad online review he received from a pissed off patient. It appears as thought the patient did not want radiographs and there ended up being a communication breakdown. After hearing the story, there were definitely some steps that Rich and Dave would have recommended that likely could have mitigated this bad situation. Then of course we do the call of the week. What happens when a potential new patient calls a dental office with a bad tooth to see if it better to have it saved with a root canal or extracted? Not too tough of a question, right? Let’s see how this was handled! If you have a question that you would like answered on our podcast, please send it in to podcast@madow.com. We will do our best to get yours answered! CLICK HERE TO DOWNLOAD TRANSCRIPT A Confrontation With A Patient Ends With A Bad Online Review Voice Recording: The Dental Practice Fixers Podcast is brought to you by the Madow Center for Dental Practice Success. To find out how we can help increase the success of your practice, check out madow.com or call us at 1-800-258-0060. [Music Playing] Dr. Richard Madow: What happens when a new patient comes in, it’s a little bit of a confrontation or disagreement with the dentist that winds up threatening to put a bad review on Yelp. We’re going to find out that exact situation today or Season 2, Episode 8 of the Dental Practice Fixers Podcast. Hey, I’m Dr. Richard Madow: here with my co-host Dr. David Madow. How is it going today Dave? Dr. David Madow: I’m Dr. David Madow. It feels great man. For once in a while we’re in – a lot of times it’s split screen, but I can touch him. We’re in the same room. Dr. Richard Madow: Mom he touched me. He started it. Dr. David Madow: We’re in the same room. Believe it. Dr. Richard Madow: I’m a little bit uncomfortable actually. We’re very close today. We’ll it is fun being back in the home studio today. Welcome everybody for Season 2, Episode 8. So we’ve got a fantastic listener question today about a really odd situation, but I think it’s the kind of thing that could absolutely happen to any of our listeners out there if it hasn’t yet. Dr. David Madow: I think we’re going to make a really great phone call at the end like we usually do. Our weekly phone call, this is going to be awesome today. Dr. Richard Madow: We don’t have a time. It’s going to be awesome. It’s amazing. Dr. David Madow: When we ask a question like this, it’s going to be awesome. I promise. Dr. Richard Madow: Yeah. Alright, so I can’t remember what’s been happening since our last episode of the Dental Practice Fixers but what do you say let’s get ready down to it. It’s a really interesting question from the listener and I know we’re going to have fun. Some great comments for us. So Dave why don’t you take it away. I think you got this on some kind of a messaging service. What’s App, I don’t know what it was. Dr. David Madow: One of our followers, subscribers, messaged us and then also he made it very clear and you’ll see why I withhold the name and so if you ever have a question, if you want something answered on our show and you want to keep it totally confidential, private message us and make sure you make it clear and we can probably tell to withhold your name. We’ll make it confidential. Dr. Richard Madow: I think there’s a better chance if it’s a really good question if somebody wants their name withheld. Dr. David Madow: I agree. Totally agree. Dr. Richard Madow: Well you know, I’ll tell you when they give their names, that might be fake names. Dr. David Madow: I will warn you though, this question is a little bit messy but I’ve got to read the whole thing because you’re going to see what happens in this – this is a crazy situation. Okay here we go. I’m going to read it slow though so please, well you have to hear every single word of this. It’s amazing. Dear Madow Brothers, I just had a new patient come in to my office.

This week Dave covers an article that he found that covers the 50 Greatest Soundtracks of All Time. This spawned from a conversation he had over the weekend in which multiple soundtracks were named. A few actually appeared on this list. So Dave posed the question, what soundtracks do you think should be counted as the greater of all time?   Warning: May contain a few explicit words

This week Dave covers an article that he found that covers the 50 Greatest Soundtracks of All Time. This spawned from a conversation he had over the weekend in which multiple soundtracks were named. A few actually appeared on this list. So Dave posed the question, what soundtracks do you think should be counted as the greater of all time? Warning: May contain a few explicit words

This week Dave covers an article that he found that covers the 50 Greatest Soundtracks of All Time. This spawned from a conversation he had over the weekend in which multiple soundtracks were named. A few actually appeared on this list. So Dave posed the question, what soundtracks do you think should be counted as the greater of all time?   Warning: May contain a few explicit words ]]>

(Editor's Notes: First off. Jay is missing this week. Literally, we do not know where he is. So Dave's wife Lauren fills in for him on their 2nd wedding anniversary. Secondly. This episode wound up being over two hours long. So you are hearing the "abridged" version (we cut out the news segment). You can hear that missing segment over on our Patreon. Or if you are a really big SMB fan, and are not yet a Patreon member, email me at supermoviebrospodcast@gmail.com and I'll be happy to send you the missing audio. Ok on with the show!)   INTRO -Lauren and Dave recount their weekend away at Baltimore's Inner Harbor. Lots of drinks, lots of fun. From people watching, to drinking at the new Guinness Open Gate Brewery, to sneaking onto a ship moored to a pier.  WHAT'RE WATCHING - Lauren takes another crack at Christopher Robin and offers an opinion counter to Jay's. - Dave re-listens to the podcast SERIAL to refresh himself on The Case of Adnan Syed docuseries airing on HBO. It's truly a fascinating case.  - Lauren and Dave both watch the animated, sci-fi, anthology series Love, Death & Robots on NETFLIX.  LISTENER QUESTION - This week's listener question is a little different. It comes in the form of a caption contest. Listeners commented on a picture of Dave being very forward with a seal statue at the Guinness Open Gate Brewery. The caption winner (chosen by Lauren) wins a download code for the movie of their choice. This week's winner is @NerdAdonis on twitter.  TRAILER PARK - Since Lauren is the guest. There has to be trailers she is interested, and well versed in. So they break down two trailers for upcoming Disney movies.  - The new, and according to Lauren, vastly improved Aladdin (2019) trailer. - And also. The first full trailer for Toy Story 4. Which is reportedly going to be the most emotional Toy Story yet.   WINE REVIEW - Brought to you by BLOWFISH. Use promo code SMBFish at check out to get your discount on the hangover cure.  - Indie Pod Spotlight on Dave and Lauren's good buds Justin and Krissy on So I Married a Movie Geek podcast.  - Lauren and Dave review two box wines from Black Box wines.  TOP 5 - Dave and Lauren countdown their personal favorite five couples in movie history. - Please reach out to us on Twitter @SuperMoviePod and let us know what your favorite movie couple is.  Thank you for listening. Cheers! Super Movie Bros. is part of the PODFIX Network of podcasts. Follow the link and check out all the great shows, including So I Married a Movie Geek, that are part of the network. You can also find some of our Movie Cocktail recipes there as well.  You can get more SMB content over on our Patreon. Follow the link, and for as little as $1 you can get additional episodes, and for a little more you can receive gifts and prizes, as well as control the show.  Our Trailer Park music is provided by Thomas Iannucci. We are incredibly indebted to him for providing us with that, he's a fan, our friend, an amazing recording artist, and all around great human being. So please check out his music on Spotify.   

This week, we present an original podcast episode, brought to you by Wunder Capital. This is the third part of our three-part series produced with Wunder.In this episode, we'll hear the story of Dave Riess, the co-founder and chief technology officer of Wunder.Well before co-founding Wunder, Dave found himself in a tricky spot. Even after building a successful career in software development, he was uninspired: “I'm working really hard solving these problems and fundamentally I'm helping big brands spend money more effectively on Facebook. And, nobody cares about that, including me.”So Dave created a framework for evaluating his career path. And it took him in an entirely new direction into solar.“The framework is quite simple. If I'm going to characterize myself by the work that I do, then why would I not work on the most important problem?”Dave eventually landed on energy, education and health care as the main problems to solve. “Energy, in my opinion, is the obvious winner of those three. You can have a fantastic education system and a fantastic health care system, but if you don't have a planet to live on it's not a very bright future.”So how did he establish the framework? And how did he make the decisions that ultimately led him to co-found Wunder? This week, we present an episode about first principles: we cover the value of the beginner's mind; 10x problem solving; and how to design a career, a product, and a startup team with intention.Listen to our other episodes produced with Wunder:Meet the Women Doing Hundreds of Millions of Dollars in Solar DealsHow a Solar Bromance Cracked the Code for Commercial SolarWunder Capital is the leading commercial solar financing company in the United States. Click here to find out how Wunder Capital can help you finance your next commercial solar project.

Find out what really happened this year, behind the scenes of the 10x growth con. On today’s episode Russell gives a summary of all the things that occurred day two of the 10x Growth Con Event. Here are some of the crazy things that happened: Hear what Garrett White had to say about Russell’s calling, that had everyone listening in tears. Find out how Russell was still able to give an amazing presentation despite an alarm blaring, and people doing the wave. And find out what prevented people from actually being able to buy Russell’s product at the end of the event. So listen here to see all that went wrong and right at the second day of 10x Growth Con. ---Transcript--- Hey everyone, this is Russell Brunson. Welcome back to the Marketing Secrets podcast. Yesterday I gave you guys behind the scenes of day number one of the 10x Growth Con, convention, event, what happened, how I did on sales, and hopefully you enjoyed kind of hearing behind the scenes of it. Now I’m going to take you guys to day number two because I had a chance to speak two days at this event. So I’m going to walk you guys behind the scenes of what happened there later on how my second presentation did, and share a bunch of other cool stuff with you as well. Alright, so I woke up day number two and once again I was nervous. So I woke up, got on my slides and start working on my slides and getting them fixed for this new presentation that I’ve never done before. I’m stressing out thinking, how in the world am I going to do this presentation? There’s an echo, nobody can hear me. And I did my best and got everything ready and then I headed over to the venue. When I got to the venue I saw Dave Woodward and Dave had been helping a ton. Dave is just amazing, an amazing human, one of the hardest workers you will ever meet and just someone who’s amazing at getting stuff done. So Grant and his team was pulling on Dave like, “What should we do? How do we fix this?” So they went and got pipe and drape and wrapped the whole upper concourse of the event, hoping to block sound. They opened up the top of the dome, because after Grant parachuted in they closed it, and it was super humid and hot inside. In fact, I was on stage just pouring sweat off my face because it was so humid. We had captured all the humidity. So they broke it back open, just like 10% open, just so some of the echo could get out. The changed the microphones, they removed some microphones, did a bunch of things to try to clean up the sound, and it was better. Still was not amazing, but it was better. So I got there and one of the things they said, “Russell, you can’t speak as fast as you do. When you speak this fast, everything bounces off the walls. If you’re going to do this presentation you have speak in sound bites. You say something it hits the wall and comes back, you say the next thing, it hits something and comes back. Everything’s got to be spoken in sound bites.” I was like, “Oh crap, I have a big, like a 200 slide presentation. I can’t do that in 90 minutes with that.” So I went in and deleted probably 50 slides to, in fact, some of my favorite parts. Someday I’m going to do this presentation and I want you guys to see it, because I literally do the presentation and in the presentation I show you what I did to do the presentation. It’s so cool. But I had to delete all that because it just wasn’t going to, I couldn’t get it all fitted in there, so I deleted a bunch of stuff. And then one of the big ideas I had for this presentation, I was going to bring other speakers onstage, people who have gone through our training, and let them go on stage and just tell their stories, which I was really excited for. So my second presentation was called 10x Secrets Mastery, and then it was how they could learn how to speak from stage. And I was really excited for this because at the last 10x I had 3.2 million, this one we had just done 2 million the day before. I was going to show them, “Look, how to make a million dollars, or 2 million. How to sell to the masses.” Like most of the people in the room were salesmen, I’m like, “Selling one on one is one thing, but selling one on many is a completely different skill set you have to learn and master, and I want to show you guys how to do this.” So we did when we created this presentation. So what happened, this is really cool. I think all of us were kind of feeling a little bummed out and sad from the day before because we hadn’t hit our goals. So we kind of licked our wounds and all the people who we were going to bring onstage, I had them meet me in the greenroom to kind of go over the presentation so I could show them what was going to happen and we could talk about it. So I brought them in and I showed them my presentation. Now a couple of the highlights of the presentation, I found footage of the very first time I ever spoke onstage, and it was so bad. So I showed them those clips. And I started walking through the presentation, and in the presentation I take two big jabs at Gary Vaynerchuk, which was really fun because Gary called me out on a podcast recently, so I thought, as long as I have the mic and I’m standing in front of 35,000 people, I should definitely make fun of Gary Vaynerchuk, so I did and it was amazing. It was cool because I talked about, there is two ways to become a speaker. Number one is to become famous and get paid to speak. I show how people like Tony Robbins, Schwartzenegger, Oprah, Bill Clinton, Ellen, Richard Branson, Cuban how much they charge for a keynote, which is like $200,000-ish or something. I was like, if you add all those up it’s 1.4 million to get all those guys to be your public speakers. But I was like, at 10x last year I sold 3.2 million, my take home was 1.6 million. So I was like, you can either become famous and make 200,000 grand, or learn how to sell from stage and make way more. And then I showed this picture of me and Gary Vaynerchuk sitting there and I said, “Look, there’s too paths and Gary chose a different one than me. Gary wants to become famous. Gary charges $105,000 for a speech.” And then I showed a slide where I was like, I made 3.2 million dollars in 90 minutes and then I went home to be with my kids and my family. And then I said, “Do you know how many keynotes Gary would have to give to be able to make what I did in 90 minutes. He’d have to give 22. That’s one a week, that’s 22 weeks.” And then I said, I showed a picture of him looking super tired. I said, “You could go and you could hustle and be tired if you want to become famous. Or you could just learn how to sell and make the same amount in one presentation.” And that was jab number one. And I made another jab later on, but it was fun. So for those who love Gary, sorry. But he talked trash about me, so I got my, I got the last word, which was amazing. People were laughing super hard, which was great. Anyway, then I went down and I showed them where they’re going to come in. So some of the people that were coming in to do parts of the presentation, the first one was Garrett J. White, he came in and he was going to talk about his results taking this framework. Then we had Brad Give and his partner Ryan Lee, who they’ve done, they basically used to sell financial services across a kitchen table, and then they took this methodology of selling to the masses and had a webinar pitch and they had 1200 people on a webinar last week, and now they actually just passed Two Comma Club X. They made over 10 million dollars on one of their funnels, which was amazing. Then I had Jaime Cross, who is using the same presentation to sell soap and her oils and things like that. And I had Stacy and Paul Martinos, Stacy came up and talked about how they’re using this to save marriages. Then I had, let’s see, who are the other people? I’m scrolling through here to make sure I don’t forget anybody. Then we had Natalie Hodson came up, she talked about going to the FHAT event and her experience. How she went to the FHAT event and four months later made over a million dollars selling her $37 ebook, which is amazing. Then I had Annie Grace talking about how she used this to help people quit drinking, and then she used it to make a bunch of money at her event. And then I had Myron Golden who was going to come up and do his magic, because he is one of the most amazing humans I have ever had a chance to meet in this world. And Myron, we were going to bring up and have him tell some of his stories and do what Myron does best, which is get the audience to buy. So we were all excited, and you know, I was still kind of nervous because of how bad it had been the day before. And it was funny because I kind of walked them all through the presentation, show them what worked, everyone’s excited and they started asking, “What’s the goal? How many am I gonna sell?” And I was like, “If we can get 100 I’ll be happy.” And Myron’s like, “100? We could do a thousand.” And everyone’s kind of all over the place, and it was pretty cool. And as we’re recording this, it was funny because Dan Usher, who runs the Clickfunnels studio up in Toronto and he’s an amazing videographer, he wanted to capture this thing by having Garrett kind of come and pretend like he was the coach. And it was supposed to be this joke thing. So Garret, they mic’d him up and then he came over and started doing this jokey thing for probably a minute, and then he just like, “Screw it.” I don’t think he said screw it. You know Garrett, he swears instead of that. But then he just like switched over into this, I feel like he was a coach in a locker room like coaching all of us through the callings we had, and how this was a platform we had to share these callings. And it was 5 or 6 minutes long, and by the time it was done I looked around at all the speakers and they were all crying. I feel bad because Annie was back there and her makeup was all smeared. And I looked at Garrett and as he’s telling this to me, directly to me, he’s got tears streaming down his face, and I’m sitting there and I start crying. And all of us are sitting here in this room, just bawling our eyes out, crying as Garrett’s talking about our missions and how they all tie together. Anyway, what’s cool is because we had put on the mic for this thing that we were trying to capture, we captured this whole amazing speech that was not planned, and brought me and so many people on my team to tears. So I actually wanted to share it with you. I got the recording of it, and I wanted to plug it in right here so you can hear what Garrett said, because I think it meant a lot to me and it meant a lot to those who are here. And hopefully it gives you guys kind of a glimpse of your business and my role in your businesses. You know when I was, over the last couple of years I’ve had times where I’m like, what am I doing this for? What’s the purpose, I help people grow businesses, why does that matter in the whole grand scheme of things? And it’s interesting because one of my mentors and friends, her name is Tara Williams, Tara told me, she said, “If you look at your mission, I really think it’s a couple fold. One is there’s people that have so much financial strain that they can’t do anything else, trying to figure out how to get out of financial strain and then you come in and give people the tools they need to free themselves from the captivity of debt or money, and when they free themselves of that, then they can look outward and start serving and helping other people.” And when she said that, I was like, “Oh my gosh, maybe that is my thing.” Because who cares if you guys make a million bucks, or ten million bucks. It doesn’t matter. What matters is if I can get the stress and the pressure of you having to make money off your back, then you can start looking outward and start serving other people. That’s why in our community I look at all these people. All the people who were on stage were all people who were, who had a vision, they had a message and they couldn’t get it out, so they came, somehow they bumped into us and what we’re doing and we were able to help facilitate and get them into a spot where they could take the pressures of money off their backs so they could focus on serving other people. And everyone who was speaking there had now served thousands and tens of thousands of people. Stacy and Paul Martino had saved over 10 thousand marriages. Annie Grace has helped thousands of people beat the chains of alcohol addiction, and on and on and on. So I think that’s why I was so emotional for it. So I’m going to actually plug in that clip right here so you can hear the speech that Garrett gave in the locker room. Garrett: Do you know why I’m here? I’m here because I believe in you, truly. I was already gone for 6 days. This is the longest I’ve been gone from my family in 5 years. I’m here because of you. You’re called to do what you do. I was not called to do what you do. Without you I can’t do what I was called to do. I’m not here for promotion, that’s great, it’ll be great for me, I’m here because I’m in your military force. I’m on your team, I’m in your unit, you’re the general. I run a unit, my men listen to what I say, in the way I’m called. I follow you because you’re called, like we stay here, I listen to your stories. Every single one of us have the same thing, I know the back story, I know what the story is. Yeah, the example is sell soap, but at the end of the day you’re sending a message to women. This shit is serious for me. When I shared with you earlier, the piece that they’re not getting today, and they haven’t gotten so far. They haven’t gotten the reason why I follow you. It’s this thing there. This thing that’s bigger than you and it’s bigger than me. Dude, I love you I respect the f*** out of you. Today I’ll go to war with you, but for something that you have seen long before I could see it. It’s not flowery speech for me to talk about how Clickfunnels did something for me, hey, what can I get from this? Without Clickfunnels, there is no movement of warrior. Without the frames, there is no conversion for men to learn to live and marriages and family f***ing die, in my world. People follow you because of who you are and what comes through you. The software is the weapon, the frame is the game, but you’re the reason. And I love the reluctant hero, I do. I love it. But there’s a piece in you too that’s ready to click. This is the piece that you got f***ing an army, just waiting for that little click of fire and it’s game f***ing over. There’s no one that will stand on this stage, that can harness the power, including me, that you have access to right now, because you built an army and you weaponized them. And you believe in God, and I believe in God. And I know that all of us here are doing something bigger than we actually understand. So out there was a circus yesterday, and it happened on purpose, and it set up what’s about to f***ing happen. From the beginning when you walk on to the beginning of when Martin and you finish it up, every single one of us has an important role to play, which is get into the state that’s required, so that when you start speaking the thing that comes through him comes through you. So that this is seen not as a Russell show, or a Garret show, or any of us, it is not even a CLickfunnels show. It is a movement of people who have been called to lead movements all centralized on one thing, which is waking people up. I see you, man. I’ve seen you for a long time and I know you see me, because in that we see the same thing. And when I get to spend time with you guys that I haven’t got to spend time with, I see the same thing in you guys. So all the frames to the side, the frames everybody knows, 35000 people doesn’t matter, that means that on the other side of a game we cannot see, there are numbers we cannot contemplate, that are currently standing and waiting for you simply to get out of the way and speak. And they’re sitting in the ears of everyone in their seats whispering, “This is the time.” So I’m here because I follow you. My wife’s life has changed because of you. It sounds funny that she was reading her book, but you were the only one that could have got into her. So I’m honored to be here, honored to support you and your calling. And I’m honored to meet all of you, and be here with you. And some of you I know better than others. And this was supposed to be a locker room speech of a different kind and be funny, and the truth is I don’t really know how to f***ing do that on queue. So anything funny I ever say, it’s not on purpose, it just f***ing happens. But this right here, this is why I’m here. And I needed what you had to be able to take this that I feel and take it to literally hundreds of thousands and soon millions. Thank you. Russell: Alright, and I don’t know about you, but again, in the room it had all of us crying. And I’m just so grateful for Garrett because it gave us, it kind of regrouped us and gave us the motivation like, “Okay, let’s get out there, we’re going to change all these people’s lives.” So we got done and then I had to hand the slides off to Jake on my team and Jake ran it to the audio and video guy, and I was like, “Okay, I can’t touch the slides again, here we go.” And so that’s what happened. Alright, so now fast forward 3 or 4 hours later. I was supposed to be the last speaker before the end of the day. And at the very, very end of the day they had some DJ or some Dougie Fresh, or I don’t know, something like that. He’s supposed to be doing some rap thing after me, but everything ran late. So everything was like an hour and a half beyond what we’re supposed to be. But they’re like, “The last thing is like this rapper, so just do your thing. This is how we’re making the big money.” And if you think about this, again from a choreographing of the event, this could have and should have been where this event made its money. It should have been the big payday, and everything should have been coordinated to that. But unfortunately, things happen. So I got back prepared to do my thing and a couple of things happened. Number one, right before I got onstage, and this makes no logical sense and it’s like the backwards choreography, but Grant was onstage and he told everyone, “Hey everyone, we’re going to do 2 for 1 t-shirts right now, but you gotta get them in the next hour, otherwise when they’re gone, they’re gone.” And literally 30% of the entire audience stands up and runs out, right when he’s announcing me. Runs out to go buy t-shirts. Like a $10 offer. It was like, you’re blocking a $25000 offer with a $10 offer. Everyone’s running out of the stadium to go buy t-shirts. Number two is every speaker has been announced from behind the stage, where the thing lifts up and you walk out and it’s this big thing. So I’m back behind stage, about to be announced that way, and then Grant messages his guy and says, “I don’t want Russell to be brought out from underneath the screen again, have him come out from the side of the curtain.” I was like, dude, you’re supposed to be positioning me to be doing the big sale, and then you diminish my positioning by having me come out from the side instead of under the…it’s just insane that he would do that. Anyway, whatever. So I lost the positioning, which hurts when you’re doing a $25,000 offer, then a fourth or a third of the audience was running out of the stadium to go buy $10 t-shirts, and then I was announced and came out. So that was interesting choreography. So I get out there and I start speaking and then an alarm goes off. Literally, there’s an alarm. Somebody set the alarm, and for the first 10 minutes of my speech there was an alarm blaring through the hallways of this whole thing, which is crazy. And then one section of the stadium, they decided to start doing the wave. So everyone’s up there doing the wave, and I hear them yelling and shouting, and I hear the alarm going off, and I’m up there like, “What in the world is happening. This is chaos, I don’t even know what to do. It’s crazy.” But I step onstage and start my presentation, and I start it slow. I say a line, boom deliver a line, wait for it to bounce back. Next line, deliver it, wait for it bounce back, deliver it…and I could feel it, there was something about this presentation that was different, it was magical, it was so good. So we’re delivering the thing and I bring my guests onstage and I have Garrett White come and do this thing and I have each person come and share their part, and it was just beautifully orchestrated. Everyone’s success stories and testimonials just weaved in perfectly, and it was like the perfect thing. Myron comes onstage, does his close, doing his thing and it’s just, it was magical. In fact, Myron leaned over to me at one point and he said, while one of the, I think it was Natalie, or Annie was giving their testimonial and he was just looking at the audience, and I looked and everyone was so engaged. And he’s like, “The worst case scenario you get a thousand people.” And I was like, “Oh my gosh. That’s 25 million dollars.” I’m freaking out. So we go through this thing and we finish the thing and then we’re going through the stack and the closing and we had one more close left and Grant’s team I guess was like, “The Dj’s supposed to be up right now.” And he goes to Dave and he’s like, “You have to get Russell off stage.” So Dave comes over and gives me this look like, you have to end this now. And I’m like, ugh. We had one more, the most important close of the entire thing we have left, it was Myron’s, the best one. And I have to go to Myron and I’m like, “We have to cut this off, we have to stop.” So we didn’t get to do the last close, which is like the most important close of the entire freaking thing, so we missed that one. I do the last call to action and I drive to everyone and said, “Okay, everyone on the floor, the people that paid like $10,000 to be here, there’s a sales table right here on the floor, go over here. It’s $25,000. There’s a sales table over here.” And when we got to the table people started jumping up and running. And upstairs told everyone to start running. And it was so perfectly executed. It ends, pull off stage, and I’m feeling on top of the world. I’m like, “Oh my gosh, the presentation was perfect. The delivery was perfect. People are running to the sides. Everything was amazing.” I go back to the green room, I’m kind of hanging out and relaxing. Oh and then, all the people who were onstage, they were over at the sales tables to go close sales, and I told them, “Look, all the people we met onstage today are over at the table, come over and talk to them, they’re going to tell you their stories. If you have any questions, how this will work for you.” So anyway, that’s what happens, people go to the things, I go back to the green room and kind of relax, waiting for the numbers, waiting for the numbers. And probably ten minutes later Garrett White comes in and he’s like, “Dude, you got screwed.” I’m like, “What do you mean?” He’s like, “They blocked off the sales tables. I was by the sales table and there’s all these people trying to get to me, and they completely blocked it off and they wouldn’t let us come back. I was trying to close sales and I couldn’t talk to a single person.” I’m like, “What?” Then the others came in and they’re like, “Yeah, we got kicked out.” And then Dave comes in later and he’s like, “The Fire Marshall closed off one of the sales tables because there were too many people supposedly on the floor. So the Fire Marshall closed off one, all the people running to the table, the Fire Marshall blocked them. And then the DJ, who was preparing for the thing, his team blocked off the other sales table.” So both sales tables on the floor, with all the 3000 people that paid $10 grand a piece to sit down there, the best buyers in the room, the two sales tables where people were supposed to get money completely blocked. They blocked the two sales tables. There’s no way for people to give the money. It was insane. So I’m like, “What in the world?” and then finally when everything kind of ends and we’re about to leave, Dave comes in and I’m like, “How did we do? How did we do?” I’m thinking like, if we bombed we would have done 100. Based on the presentation and the feeling of the audience, the people running and everything, I’m like, worst case scenario we did a hundred, which is 2.5 million, which is now will be at almost 5. I’m like, I guess we’re halfway to what our goal was. Dave comes up to me and he’s just pissed. So mad. He’s like, “I don’t even want to tell you, but I’ll tell you.” And I’m like, “What?” He’s like, “14” I’m like, “14?” He’s like, “Yep, they blocked both sales tables. We only got 14 people who randomly found us in other spots.” I’m like, “Are you kidding me. There’s no way.” And he’s like, “Yep, and now they’re kicking us out because there’s a rapper that’s going to rap, who will make them zero dollars at this event.” And it’s just like, oh my gosh. So that’s kind of how that one ended, which is just like, ahh, so frustrated. I feel like we executed everything on our side perfectly. So that night we took our team, all 40 of them who were killing themselves, we rented a yacht, and we went on this three hour yacht thing at night, had dinner with them, let them all dance and have fun and it was a good time. And then the next morning we woke up and all of our team went back and started closing deals. Our team closed another, they got 13 more people that they found in the hallways to sign up. So they ended up with, what’s that? 27 or so. I think we had 675 thousand dollars in sales from the 10x. So when all was said in done from the event, I think it was 2.7 million we ended, which again, is not bad. It’s great. But it’s just tough when you’re expecting 10 to make about 3. Anyway, so that was kind of how it all went. That next, that day we just kind of wrapped up the rest of the vacation because it was crazy. All of our affiliates from the 10x launch as well as the people who spoke onstage, we put them on, we were on these two yachts and we sent them to the Bahamas. So they went out that morning on this Mastermind Yacht and started masterminding while they were on the yacht. And then my wife and I had to go shopping for Funnel Hacking Live clothes, so we shopped til we dropped. And then we jumped in a private, in a sea plane, a private plane is a sea plane though. So it’s sitting in the water and it takes off from the water, and flies you over to the Bahamas. And we land in the Bahamas and we hung out all night that night masterminding with all those people, which was really cool, just amazing. So we masterminded with everybody, which is awesome. The next morning we woke up and jumped back on the yachts and went back to Miami. And that’s a whole other story in and of itself. We had, they smuggled somebody onto our yacht, who when we got close jumped off and swam off. They wouldn’t let us, a couple of us missed our flights because they wouldn’t let us off because of passport issues. It was just nuts. But somehow managed to be at the airport, my wife and I flew home and the whole trip ended. So that was the 10x experience. It was kind of funny as we were talking about it. Everything that could have gone wrong, literally went wrong on this trip. But at the same time we had such an amazing experience. Grant and his team, I love those guys, they work so hard. So many things are outside their control. The echoing, the different things. How do you get 35,000 people into a stadium? So many things like that, and they did an amazing job with the event. I think it was a smashing success for everybody. And while I was frustrated with some of the choreography of the event, that’s not their strong suit and it’s something that maybe next time we’ll work with them a little closer on. But anyone that can put 35,000 people in a room is amazing. I don’t even know how that’s possible, but somehow they did it. It was amazing. And the b-roll, the pictures. I’m sure you will see for the next year in every ad of mine you’ll see pictures and videos of all the amazingness, because we got to capture some cool stuff. So worst case scenario, we got the b-roll and it was a really great experience. So thankful for Grant and for Jared, for allowing us to come and partake in that and be part of it. And thank you for everyone who was there, even though a lot of you guys couldn’t hear me. I hope that you heard my message and the love that we have for all of you guys. We honestly want nothing more in this life than to change your lives. That’s why we’re here and why we’re doing this whole craziness, because I tell you what, I could have made 2.7 million dollars sitting at home not doing anything. But we wanted to come and have a chance to share our message, Clickfunnels with you and with everybody who was there. And also because it’s been interesting, you know this whole internet marketing thing that all of us are doing, is not mainstream yet. It’s funny because I feel like, when I got started doing this 15 years ago, it was like this weird thing and people thought that we were weird. And you know, one of the things I’ve been trying to do over the last 4 or 5 years is really make this a mainstream thing. Make funnels a mainstream thing. I want someday where people don’t talk about websites anymore, they talk about funnels. And I’m doing my best and I think this was such a huge platform for us to be able to share that with so many people. And I feel like for all you guys, whatever businesses you’re in, I’m trying to lead the way by making what I do mainstream and hopefully you guys will do the same thing with your businesses as well. So with that said, I’m going to wrap this up, my voice is almost gone. I’m going to get home, play with my kids. Thanks so much for listening everybody, and Funnel Hacking Live is now a week and a half away. I cannot wait to see a bunch of you guys there. I have 5 or 6 presentations I’m doing now to get ready for Funnel Hacking Live, it’s going to be amazing. And I feel like Funnel Hacking Live is our family, I’m so excited to go to that event and just feel at home with my people and people who get me and get us. And I’m excited to share that with all of you. With that said, I appreciate you all and I’ll talk to you all again soon. Bye everybody.