Podcasts about patrick no

You want to come to, don't you? I'm not really sure I do… WAKE UP! WAKE UP! I am up, you blind bat! I'm rather more of a goat. I thought it you were a horse! –And to that, I say “Ney” Great . Listen. If you can get all of the Golden Girls and all of the beatles lined up in a row, I'll give you a bucket. What's in the bucket. Nothing, that's the fun of it. hm. Sir Paul McCartney? Uh, I guess. Sir Paul McCartney, you must never die. –I feel like i've heard this somewhere before… Perhaps somewhere before; But here, now. Very well, then. On you go. You know–you look familiar. No, I don't. Are you sure we don't know eachother? I'm not sure of anything, really–and neither should you be. Words to remember, my dear friend. __ So you've been knighted. I'd think it so. but the ceremony were in the morning. ___ Notes Dump II: All those who seek to controll me Will therefore be controlled by me therefore Those who seek to contain me Shall therefore be contained by me Amen JOHN SLATTERY wtf characters is this. idk , it just says “John Slattery” The fuck, man. She doesn't listen. She'll listen to me You think so I know so. Forget it. If she doesn't obey me– She's not going to obey anybody– Especially you; Whoever it is you think you are. Whatever, asshole. That's right; I'm an asshole. So that's Captain Asshole To you, motherfucker! [There's a Surf Club in Brooklyn] Mister Cellophane {The Printing Press} - pop Up Club Toot it and boot it “The telepathic deadmau5” Whatever that is Ooh shit, here we go again with this motherfucker [The 4th Dimensional Jimmy Fallon's telepathy becomes extremely keenly developed, with the more time he spends intentionally looking into the eye of the many cameras used to film the shows h appears on, exponentially increasing over the expanse of his career–as he soon finds out, his peers have also developed this seemingly unique ability, however, each person who has gained this ability has also developed an individual; intrinsic and respectively specific skill within his or herself which allows each person who possess this telepathy to limit/inhibit this at his or her own will or desire Whatever. JIMMY FALLON YOU RAT MOTHERFUCKER. I'm not a rat! I'm a weasel! AH! YEAH? YEAH, FORREAL. WELL, FUCK YOU, YOU WEASEL MOTHERFUCKER. FOR WHAT. i'M GONNA KILL YOU. That's readily apparent–BUT WHY? [The mobster lunges for Jimmy] AHH. I NEED CONTEXT. [He lunges for Jimmy again] AHH CONTINUITY. CONTINUTIY. Oh damn. So he really can shapeshift into. Just about –Just about anything. Fuck you. [The syndicate crime organization which Patrick has become involved with has become mistrustful and uncertain of his straightforward and clean-cut demeanor; He is forcibly injected with a combination of heroin and cocaine to ensure that he is trustworthy to continue within the organization, and his reputation is put into jeopardy as his occasional recreational use curtails into a habit, which he hides, as his new promotion to Head of Programming, in addition to his continuing role as the host of a primetime late night talk show are both put at stake. Patrick , a young and eager writer and performer, begins his career as a remarkably clean-cut and good-hearted young man, with an almost heroic sensibility of naivety, besides his impressively professional tolerance for high volumes of alcohol, and primarily hidden vice for cigarettes.] What is that. (mockingly) Heh. “what's that?” [Patrick shrugs, and grimaces, as if to say “whatever, then”] It's just some ye-yo. (uninterested) Oh. [He suddenly becomes slightly more hostile, as if provoked by Patrick's nonchalance] You down for some ye? Hah, i'm straight. (squinting) You sure? Yeah. Come on! Don't be so stiff. (defensively) I'm not “stiff” I'm just– (insisting, drawing closer Try it. (not backing down, but stern) I'm good. [The two are face-to-face, the room becomes quiet.] Try it. Nah. [His eyes widen; he appears offended.] I insist. [Patrick silently declines, attempting to stand up.] CONT'D Seriously? You know what– [The tension has risen; Patrick inwardly understands there's no escape; He swallows nervously, he is trapped, and surrounded by the crew of gangsters.] Sit. [He pushes Patrick down, holding his arms to his sides.] -___- We'll get back to that later. Damn shit show is intense. I know I haven't even found the real deep stuff yet. Yikes. I hope you weren't intending for Fallon to play this! Oh please! I don't even think he's capable of palating a show like this. That's an insult. No, it isn't. The man's a genius; but, a comic genius. You remember when Sandler did all that serious shit? What serious shit? Exactly. DOC BROWN THis is some serious shit. Not yet, Emmmmit. What do you mean, “not yet”? I haven't much time left, you know. Whatever! You're going to live forever! (Amen) I'm ma stressin Flexin my God complex ‘n / complexion I'm on Lex and, I'm not lost I'm just walkin in the wrong direction, To throw ‘em all off, N keep them steady guessin! your deviation from the media signifies your obedience of this law. What law. Wait. Where'd you go. [ILLUMINATi] HELLO? They tried to curse her name, But had forgot that it was Their ow; Therefore they cursed themselves, Set her free, and sent her home– The curse was meant to kill, so she'd always be alone– instead , she rose above the world, to sit upon the thrown HEr name became an honor, to which it was bestowed, the crown she wore upon her head, To show the curse had broken. –C'cxell Soleïl Azul Monroe Esha's Life Begins to Change drastically and rapidly, once the blood oath is set– PATRICK Oh, by the way, I've published your book. ESHA I'm Sorry– PATRICK (interjecting) –don't apologize… ESHA CON'T –you w-what? PATRICK This– [Esha gasps in shock.] ESHA How did you– PATRICK The artwork is beautiful– ESHA Patrick–! PATRICK It's your design, of course. ESHA How did you– PATRICK How did I what? ESHA …This was on canvas! PATRICK Was. Now it's the cover of your book. ESHA “My book…” _______ [As the workplace tension rises between Patrick and Esha and a strong romance begins to bloom, however unrequited between them, Patrick begins to return Esha's rejections with practical jokes, which sometimes backfire quite tragically, to Patrick's guilt and shame.] Patrick spits int Esha's Mango Lassi as she completes a task across the room , unseen) (he does this playfully, however and not out of spite, as since their fated intertwining within the blood oath, the two have shared such intimacies that this is only a ‘minor' contamination; they are, after all, bound by blood.) Esha sits back at her desk unwittingly, stirs her Mango lassi with the straw, and takes a sip of the refreshing drink.] ESHA Mm. [Patrick smiles maniically] LILLITH enters, walking past ESHA's desk and glancing at her, stopping short of greeting her, distracted by her refreshment.] LILLITH Ooh! That looks good. Can I try some? ESHA Sure! [Patrick's eyes widen, but he attempts not to react; LILLITH takes a sip.] LILLITH Ooh, that is good. [she takes another sip} [PATRICK keeps his hands in his pockets, biting his tongue, hiding that he is inwardly horrified; he rubs his eyes.] LILLITH yum . Grandma. You've got to try this. VIVIAN, passing by gestures to ESHA, who shrugs nonchalantly and nods a “go ahead” [PATRICK might explode; but he hides it well; VIVIAN Takes a sip.] VIVIAN That is delicious. LILLITH I know, right? VIVIAN Thank you, Esha. LILLITH Yeah, thanks. [Vivian and Lillith walk away; Esha gestures warmly and stirs the drink again, taking another sip before putting it down, looking at Patrick unassumingly, however, somewhat knowingly.] [PATRICK'S nostrils flare, he keeps his hands in his pockets and grimaces] [beat] “Jigsaw” [Patric finishes Esha' Puzzle, then frames it, as a romantic gesture. However, this very explicitly angers her, and she charges him; This is the first time he, or we as the audience has ever seen Esha in a fit of rage, or breaking her usually dry and collected composure. She enters his office, infuriated She smashes the framed puzzle across his desk; the puzzle and glass shatter, scattering impressively in an explosion of glass, wood shards, and puzzle pieces. PATRICK Good morning! ESHA You FINISHED MY PUZZLE. PATRICK –I thought you'd like that ESHA –YOU– [She begins throwing things off of Patrick's desk; starting with an awards trophy which appears to be an Oscar, then launching his bobble heads and finally, hulk smashing the cappuccino machine. PATRICK WOAH! ESHA –I WAS WORKING ON THE END FOR MONTHS. [She continues to destroy his office.] PATRICK HEY–wait, really? ESHA YES. PATRICK …It was so simple… [He has never witnessed this side of Esha before, and despite the destruction is quite amused. He snickers.] ESHA THIS IS FUNNY TO YOU? [Patrick sips his drink.] PATRICK I guess you could say i'm “puzzled” ESHA AGH [HULK SMASHES CAPPUCCINO MACHINE, as it is the last thing on his desk.] PATRICK OK?! [ESHA more satisfied/calmly pours out the remainder of his coffee; Now he's at the very least kind of upset. He sighs; She exits calmly.] VIVIAN peeks into the office as she passes ESHA exiting the doorway; a small crowd has gathered to gawk, but for the most part it's ‘business as usual', with most of the team assuming PATRICK has simply been up to his tendencies; In fact, he has, however, His relationship with ESHA has become quite complex, as due to his marriage and family, ESHA's continual rejection of his romantic sentiments, despite their explicit interminglings has left him befuddled, and consistently strategizing a way to earn her trust, as she seems an impenetrable wall, and hides a certain mysterious darkness. lol , Eli Scruggs, Man. Man, I wish. I love this scene though. LATER Eshareturns to her new home (an incredible modified loft in midtown, with a cast iron spiral staircase, stained windows, exposed brick, and exotic wood floors; Oh yeah, cause that one part where VICTOR You burned down her house? PATRCICK I bought it, first. And Insured it. VICTOR Woah. PATRICK Well, it was already insured. Lol damn this dude is a boss. Yeap. Fallon couldn't handle this. Nope. So who plays Esha? Idk. Some pretty light skinned girl. How light skinned. Light skinned enough to be an ingenue. Is she the ingenue? Almost. Kind of. Wtf. right . [Everything at first looks normal, until she reaches the downstairs bathroom/washroom door to find it closed (which is unusual She nervously looks abround, then notices under the door, one single puzzle piece – she opens the door; an avalanche of puzzle pieces falls to her feet; the entire room is filled floor to ceiling with puzzle pieces. EARLIER: Patrick sits in the rafters/air conditioning vent with a shop vacuum (in reverse) full of puzzle pieces, (a vacuum he has ‘borrowed' from the studio from the prop room of a show in which contestants are put into a translucent box to attempt to grab money as it flies into the air) He fills her entire washroom with the pieces of a giant jigsaw puzzle Esha, who neither appears to be angry or otherwise, hauls the pieces out in large garbage bags, , then carrying them into the master loft, a two-level space in which the lower level houses her art studio, where she finds a giant frame hanging from the roof on suspension chains; The camera pans outward with ESHA center, within this giant frame, creating in itself a picturesque vision, herself a painted picture, as she sorts through the pieces atop her bed Now I have your eyes, And you have mine We are we n The mind of The Eye This bond surpass Any test of time I am I now sign it. Uhhh.. Oh, th taste of tears To be bound by blood The cure of the oath The blessing of both Oneess [Patrick's children are somewhat all like him in some way; Effectively, they are hilarious? PATRICK This one does tricks. See! Hazel! Hazel is so effin cute. I know huh. She's like Sally Draper + Sally Draper ++ Goddamn. Yeah. Cute. Woah. Right. Anyway. HAZEL Huh. PATRICK Do a backflip. HAZEL Ok, daddy. [HAZEL attempts a backflip, but fails.] PATRICK. Fuck. [Face down, waves her arm as if to signal “i'm alright”, but clearly is inured.] PATRICK (taking a drink) Call the paramedic, HAZEL I'm okay, though! [She lifts her head up and appears shaken, however smiling–her eyes welted and nose running.] I'm okay. PATRICK No, bab, don't– HAZEL (cracking her neck) I'm okay. PATRICK Don't–your neck… HAZEL (walking it off, sighing) I'm okay, daddy. PATRICK Maybe just the chiropractor. Oh, My God Is it Esha n this scene? I can't remember if it's Esha or the nanny. Did he not fuck the therapist? I mean, that's later. Is it? I guess. Continuity. Whatever. We are as one The Mind of the Eye The Divinity of One. JOHN SLATTERY as THE MAYOR OF Which place idk Lol this dude is forreal always a politician. He looks like a politician. Look. MAYOR OF NY I think we may have found something of yours… [INT. JFK AIRPORT. NEW YORK CITY, NEW YORK, DAY.] MAYOR OF LA Where? MAYOR OF NEW YORK The airport. MAYOR OF LA Which airport. MAYOR OF NEW YORK JFK MAYOR OF LA I need you to ground that plane. MAYOR OF NEW YORK How? MAYOR OF LA By Any Means Nessesary. Lol that's it. Yup. Then it just ends. I fucking guess. I guess! Lol She is beautiful Eyes of oceans Eyes of oceans Eyes of oceans Dear God, Bring us together so that we shall prosper- in spirit, in body, in mind, and soul, as one, as we are Love, The Divine We are not alike, we are the same Please God bring me to life so that I ma meet the father of m future children, so that I might overcome poverty, find success, and great happiness, so that I can complete my journey of creating a family, to give birth to and raise more children, in a new and happy hope and marriage. Amen. As the sun draws upon my window at this hour, I call upon the dawning of a new eero of love, light and happiness, for all that I am and all who enter my presence, look upon me, know my artforms, or take part in my honor, the many plentiful endeavors and endowments of the great and holy divine, God almighty Amen C'cxell Soleïl Azul Monroe I thank you and humbly ask for you Great and Divine, Honorable protection, my dear lord, so that I might only know love, happiness, success, and great praise. Okay, so i did very briefly shapeshift into Steve Bucemi last night. Are you certain? I– [THE MAN IN THE MIRROR is STEVE BUCEMI] …whatever. I'm going back to bed. I'd highly recommend that. You can't forget a face like that. On that note, I think i'm into crustpunks. You want. I–oh yeah. Yes? Yes, please. GODDAMMIT. What. It's this stupid game. I can't get out of this effin trap. Oh. “oh” Have you tried, like– Tried like, what? I've tried everything. Just hit ‘escape' What? That's not gonna work. Have you tried it? No, that's stupid. You said you tried everything. Yeah, but that's–0 Just try it. GET UP, DILLON FRANCIS. GodDAMMIT. He's out cold. I'm not! i'm getting up. Jesus Christ, dawg. How are yout this much of a fuckin wook. I'm not “wook” You ARE wook. Jesus. Jesus is here. How are you more of a wook than Jimmy Fallon? That dude is like ancient. I'm not wook. You are wook. meanwhile WEEKEND UPDATE returns with a not-safe-for-work-or-TV Special. Oh no. Is that why SHH. SHUT UP. OH, YEAH, iT'S ON MOTHAFUCKA Dude. you can't wear suits to a rave like that. CAN uhm , CAN. Wtf man. Apparently, all the late night guys are like in competition with eachother. DUH. Even the dudes that are on the same network. DUH. Christ, kid, you are sloooooooooowwww. ….-_- which Seth are you again? The important one. Whatever. Just get Jon Stewart the fuck out of here before *michielf* Fucking christ. So wait, this is This is everybody. Can you explain to me why I blacked out on top of my kitchen table this morning? I can't actually explain that, no. SETH MEYERS (sipping coffee) Well, I can. UGH. AIGH. OHOKAY. UNCLE. UNCLE!!! AAAAAAHHHHAAAAA. Damn, you know it's gotta be close to th end if we've over here got [JIMMY FALLON at a RAVE ] Oh no. That can't be right. No, i can't do that . No one will recognize Chill, it's fan-fiction So you're a fan, then. No. But i'm sure you have them, somewhere. Aha. Ha. JIMMY FALLON'S #1 Fan Besides his– LET'S SHUT THE FUCK UP ABOUT THAT, FOR NOW, OKAY. I will never, literally ever let you live that down. Shut up, clever. SHut your face. IT wa the aliens, okay! Aliens. BEFORE: [Aliens] Who, what, him? {Jimmy Fallon} JUICE. OKay. Wtf, what the everliving fuck is that? Captain Hook REmix of Psychic Experence Breaks down reaeeeeal hard at around 4:30 What the fuck do they want with Fallon?! I don't know Is that him Yep. Delicious. Oh shit. The purple people eaters are back. WHAT. WHY. CAuse their lunch got away. WE LIKE HIM. Ah. Alright. I CAN'T DO THAT. What do you mean, “you can't do that” I can't do any of that! I'm on ice cream. Oh shit, he's on ice cream. MAYA RUDOLPH. DId someone say OH —------, THEY'RE BACK ICE CREAM?! Sorry, i didn't do this on purpos– COSMIC AVENGER –but I did. Fuck. Someone go fuckin get that guy before he ROCK KESHA! KESHA! KITE. Hey, look–I am so–so sorry about this… Whatever. It's not my fault. It was like this “Jimmy Fallon” was following me everywhere. WHAT. You thought i made that up?! THAT ACTUALLY HAPPENED. DUH. WTF. It's you again. IT's me again. Where is What. Where's what. Where's Wolf? Somewhere, I'm sure. Don't worry, yo. I'm sure it's not the real Jimmy Fallon; They're jus using him to implant my brain waves with leftist doctrine. Did you say ‘doctorate'? And also, sapiosexuality. “The Seven Souls of Sai The Saige” Sai and Psy The Saige are two halves of one; Counterparts, opposites, in fact— I don't want to do this anymore… I could feel the bags form under my eyes, the bath was run and I was due to release at least one episode today, but was rather being persuade to hard release, as I had intended; multi-part episodes recorded before I had fallen into silence, after another attack–a spiritual attack, which had left me in a raging bout of suicide and uncertainty–uncertainty, that is, as to whether the human race could be reclaimed from evil at all–as no one seemed to care for spirit or justice more than I, and however true it might have seemed, I was probably wrong, and for whatever reason, just trapped amongst these animals for whatever reason–perhaps to convey this message, that love would triumph over hate; but how could i preach such things now feeling another–it was as if I had been beaten or raped with no way at all to retaliate on my attacker, and still threatened by this force, some motorist who tore up and down my block at all hours, ripping me from the delicate rest I so craved and needed, as if it were the force which had destroyed all mankind itself, a reminder I should so when I wish, leave the world. There were no words left, only music, and no reason to speak, would the words fall upon deaf ears. Mankind as a whole had rotted to its core. Even days later, stil my chest ached, and my breathing shallow–the pain having torn through my heart not once now, but twice–I knew it was an intentional attack, whoever by, protected by evil itself. “How White Supremacy and Privalege are Ruining The Entertainment Industry” An article i'll never write because of terrorists By Whoever, just kill me. {Enter The Multiverse} [The Festival Project.™] COPYRIGHT © THE FESTIVAL PROJECT 2019-2024 | THE COMPLEX COLLECTIVE. © ALL RIGHTS RESERVED. © -Ū.

You want to come to, don't you? I'm not really sure I do… WAKE UP! WAKE UP! I am up, you blind bat! I'm rather more of a goat. I thought it you were a horse! –And to that, I say “Ney” Great . Listen. If you can get all of the Golden Girls and all of the beatles lined up in a row, I'll give you a bucket. What's in the bucket. Nothing, that's the fun of it. hm. Sir Paul McCartney? Uh, I guess. Sir Paul McCartney, you must never die. –I feel like i've heard this somewhere before… Perhaps somewhere before; But here, now. Very well, then. On you go. You know–you look familiar. No, I don't. Are you sure we don't know eachother? I'm not sure of anything, really–and neither should you be. Words to remember, my dear friend. __ So you've been knighted. I'd think it so. but the ceremony were in the morning. ___ Notes Dump II: All those who seek to controll me Will therefore be controlled by me therefore Those who seek to contain me Shall therefore be contained by me Amen JOHN SLATTERY wtf characters is this. idk , it just says “John Slattery” The fuck, man. She doesn't listen. She'll listen to me You think so I know so. Forget it. If she doesn't obey me– She's not going to obey anybody– Especially you; Whoever it is you think you are. Whatever, asshole. That's right; I'm an asshole. So that's Captain Asshole To you, motherfucker! [There's a Surf Club in Brooklyn] Mister Cellophane {The Printing Press} - pop Up Club Toot it and boot it “The telepathic deadmau5” Whatever that is Ooh shit, here we go again with this motherfucker [The 4th Dimensional Jimmy Fallon's telepathy becomes extremely keenly developed, with the more time he spends intentionally looking into the eye of the many cameras used to film the shows h appears on, exponentially increasing over the expanse of his career–as he soon finds out, his peers have also developed this seemingly unique ability, however, each person who has gained this ability has also developed an individual; intrinsic and respectively specific skill within his or herself which allows each person who possess this telepathy to limit/inhibit this at his or her own will or desire Whatever. JIMMY FALLON YOU RAT MOTHERFUCKER. I'm not a rat! I'm a weasel! AH! YEAH? YEAH, FORREAL. WELL, FUCK YOU, YOU WEASEL MOTHERFUCKER. FOR WHAT. i'M GONNA KILL YOU. That's readily apparent–BUT WHY? [The mobster lunges for Jimmy] AHH. I NEED CONTEXT. [He lunges for Jimmy again] AHH CONTINUITY. CONTINUTIY. Oh damn. So he really can shapeshift into. Just about –Just about anything. Fuck you. [The syndicate crime organization which Patrick has become involved with has become mistrustful and uncertain of his straightforward and clean-cut demeanor; He is forcibly injected with a combination of heroin and cocaine to ensure that he is trustworthy to continue within the organization, and his reputation is put into jeopardy as his occasional recreational use curtails into a habit, which he hides, as his new promotion to Head of Programming, in addition to his continuing role as the host of a primetime late night talk show are both put at stake. Patrick , a young and eager writer and performer, begins his career as a remarkably clean-cut and good-hearted young man, with an almost heroic sensibility of naivety, besides his impressively professional tolerance for high volumes of alcohol, and primarily hidden vice for cigarettes.] What is that. (mockingly) Heh. “what's that?” [Patrick shrugs, and grimaces, as if to say “whatever, then”] It's just some ye-yo. (uninterested) Oh. [He suddenly becomes slightly more hostile, as if provoked by Patrick's nonchalance] You down for some ye? Hah, i'm straight. (squinting) You sure? Yeah. Come on! Don't be so stiff. (defensively) I'm not “stiff” I'm just– (insisting, drawing closer Try it. (not backing down, but stern) I'm good. [The two are face-to-face, the room becomes quiet.] Try it. Nah. [His eyes widen; he appears offended.] I insist. [Patrick silently declines, attempting to stand up.] CONT'D Seriously? You know what– [The tension has risen; Patrick inwardly understands there's no escape; He swallows nervously, he is trapped, and surrounded by the crew of gangsters.] Sit. [He pushes Patrick down, holding his arms to his sides.] -___- We'll get back to that later. Damn shit show is intense. I know I haven't even found the real deep stuff yet. Yikes. I hope you weren't intending for Fallon to play this! Oh please! I don't even think he's capable of palating a show like this. That's an insult. No, it isn't. The man's a genius; but, a comic genius. You remember when Sandler did all that serious shit? What serious shit? Exactly. DOC BROWN THis is some serious shit. Not yet, Emmmmit. What do you mean, “not yet”? I haven't much time left, you know. Whatever! You're going to live forever! (Amen) I'm ma stressin Flexin my God complex ‘n / complexion I'm on Lex and, I'm not lost I'm just walkin in the wrong direction, To throw ‘em all off, N keep them steady guessin! your deviation from the media signifies your obedience of this law. What law. Wait. Where'd you go. [ILLUMINATi] HELLO? They tried to curse her name, But had forgot that it was Their ow; Therefore they cursed themselves, Set her free, and sent her home– The curse was meant to kill, so she'd always be alone– instead , she rose above the world, to sit upon the thrown HEr name became an honor, to which it was bestowed, the crown she wore upon her head, To show the curse had broken. –C'cxell Soleïl Azul Monroe Esha's Life Begins to Change drastically and rapidly, once the blood oath is set– PATRICK Oh, by the way, I've published your book. ESHA I'm Sorry– PATRICK (interjecting) –don't apologize… ESHA CON'T –you w-what? PATRICK This– [Esha gasps in shock.] ESHA How did you– PATRICK The artwork is beautiful– ESHA Patrick–! PATRICK It's your design, of course. ESHA How did you– PATRICK How did I what? ESHA …This was on canvas! PATRICK Was. Now it's the cover of your book. ESHA “My book…” _______ [As the workplace tension rises between Patrick and Esha and a strong romance begins to bloom, however unrequited between them, Patrick begins to return Esha's rejections with practical jokes, which sometimes backfire quite tragically, to Patrick's guilt and shame.] Patrick spits int Esha's Mango Lassi as she completes a task across the room , unseen) (he does this playfully, however and not out of spite, as since their fated intertwining within the blood oath, the two have shared such intimacies that this is only a ‘minor' contamination; they are, after all, bound by blood.) Esha sits back at her desk unwittingly, stirs her Mango lassi with the straw, and takes a sip of the refreshing drink.] ESHA Mm. [Patrick smiles maniically] LILLITH enters, walking past ESHA's desk and glancing at her, stopping short of greeting her, distracted by her refreshment.] LILLITH Ooh! That looks good. Can I try some? ESHA Sure! [Patrick's eyes widen, but he attempts not to react; LILLITH takes a sip.] LILLITH Ooh, that is good. [she takes another sip} [PATRICK keeps his hands in his pockets, biting his tongue, hiding that he is inwardly horrified; he rubs his eyes.] LILLITH yum . Grandma. You've got to try this. VIVIAN, passing by gestures to ESHA, who shrugs nonchalantly and nods a “go ahead” [PATRICK might explode; but he hides it well; VIVIAN Takes a sip.] VIVIAN That is delicious. LILLITH I know, right? VIVIAN Thank you, Esha. LILLITH Yeah, thanks. [Vivian and Lillith walk away; Esha gestures warmly and stirs the drink again, taking another sip before putting it down, looking at Patrick unassumingly, however, somewhat knowingly.] [PATRICK'S nostrils flare, he keeps his hands in his pockets and grimaces] [beat] “Jigsaw” [Patric finishes Esha' Puzzle, then frames it, as a romantic gesture. However, this very explicitly angers her, and she charges him; This is the first time he, or we as the audience has ever seen Esha in a fit of rage, or breaking her usually dry and collected composure. She enters his office, infuriated She smashes the framed puzzle across his desk; the puzzle and glass shatter, scattering impressively in an explosion of glass, wood shards, and puzzle pieces. PATRICK Good morning! ESHA You FINISHED MY PUZZLE. PATRICK –I thought you'd like that ESHA –YOU– [She begins throwing things off of Patrick's desk; starting with an awards trophy which appears to be an Oscar, then launching his bobble heads and finally, hulk smashing the cappuccino machine. PATRICK WOAH! ESHA –I WAS WORKING ON THE END FOR MONTHS. [She continues to destroy his office.] PATRICK HEY–wait, really? ESHA YES. PATRICK …It was so simple… [He has never witnessed this side of Esha before, and despite the destruction is quite amused. He snickers.] ESHA THIS IS FUNNY TO YOU? [Patrick sips his drink.] PATRICK I guess you could say i'm “puzzled” ESHA AGH [HULK SMASHES CAPPUCCINO MACHINE, as it is the last thing on his desk.] PATRICK OK?! [ESHA more satisfied/calmly pours out the remainder of his coffee; Now he's at the very least kind of upset. He sighs; She exits calmly.] VIVIAN peeks into the office as she passes ESHA exiting the doorway; a small crowd has gathered to gawk, but for the most part it's ‘business as usual', with most of the team assuming PATRICK has simply been up to his tendencies; In fact, he has, however, His relationship with ESHA has become quite complex, as due to his marriage and family, ESHA's continual rejection of his romantic sentiments, despite their explicit interminglings has left him befuddled, and consistently strategizing a way to earn her trust, as she seems an impenetrable wall, and hides a certain mysterious darkness. lol , Eli Scruggs, Man. Man, I wish. I love this scene though. LATER Eshareturns to her new home (an incredible modified loft in midtown, with a cast iron spiral staircase, stained windows, exposed brick, and exotic wood floors; Oh yeah, cause that one part where VICTOR You burned down her house? PATRCICK I bought it, first. And Insured it. VICTOR Woah. PATRICK Well, it was already insured. Lol damn this dude is a boss. Yeap. Fallon couldn't handle this. Nope. So who plays Esha? Idk. Some pretty light skinned girl. How light skinned. Light skinned enough to be an ingenue. Is she the ingenue? Almost. Kind of. Wtf. right . [Everything at first looks normal, until she reaches the downstairs bathroom/washroom door to find it closed (which is unusual She nervously looks abround, then notices under the door, one single puzzle piece – she opens the door; an avalanche of puzzle pieces falls to her feet; the entire room is filled floor to ceiling with puzzle pieces. EARLIER: Patrick sits in the rafters/air conditioning vent with a shop vacuum (in reverse) full of puzzle pieces, (a vacuum he has ‘borrowed' from the studio from the prop room of a show in which contestants are put into a translucent box to attempt to grab money as it flies into the air) He fills her entire washroom with the pieces of a giant jigsaw puzzle Esha, who neither appears to be angry or otherwise, hauls the pieces out in large garbage bags, , then carrying them into the master loft, a two-level space in which the lower level houses her art studio, where she finds a giant frame hanging from the roof on suspension chains; The camera pans outward with ESHA center, within this giant frame, creating in itself a picturesque vision, herself a painted picture, as she sorts through the pieces atop her bed Now I have your eyes, And you have mine We are we n The mind of The Eye This bond surpass Any test of time I am I now sign it. Uhhh.. Oh, th taste of tears To be bound by blood The cure of the oath The blessing of both Oneess [Patrick's children are somewhat all like him in some way; Effectively, they are hilarious? PATRICK This one does tricks. See! Hazel! Hazel is so effin cute. I know huh. She's like Sally Draper + Sally Draper ++ Goddamn. Yeah. Cute. Woah. Right. Anyway. HAZEL Huh. PATRICK Do a backflip. HAZEL Ok, daddy. [HAZEL attempts a backflip, but fails.] PATRICK. Fuck. [Face down, waves her arm as if to signal “i'm alright”, but clearly is inured.] PATRICK (taking a drink) Call the paramedic, HAZEL I'm okay, though! [She lifts her head up and appears shaken, however smiling–her eyes welted and nose running.] I'm okay. PATRICK No, bab, don't– HAZEL (cracking her neck) I'm okay. PATRICK Don't–your neck… HAZEL (walking it off, sighing) I'm okay, daddy. PATRICK Maybe just the chiropractor. Oh, My God Is it Esha n this scene? I can't remember if it's Esha or the nanny. Did he not fuck the therapist? I mean, that's later. Is it? I guess. Continuity. Whatever. We are as one The Mind of the Eye The Divinity of One. JOHN SLATTERY as THE MAYOR OF Which place idk Lol this dude is forreal always a politician. He looks like a politician. Look. MAYOR OF NY I think we may have found something of yours… [INT. JFK AIRPORT. NEW YORK CITY, NEW YORK, DAY.] MAYOR OF LA Where? MAYOR OF NEW YORK The airport. MAYOR OF LA Which airport. MAYOR OF NEW YORK JFK MAYOR OF LA I need you to ground that plane. MAYOR OF NEW YORK How? MAYOR OF LA By Any Means Nessesary. Lol that's it. Yup. Then it just ends. I fucking guess. I guess! Lol She is beautiful Eyes of oceans Eyes of oceans Eyes of oceans Dear God, Bring us together so that we shall prosper- in spirit, in body, in mind, and soul, as one, as we are Love, The Divine We are not alike, we are the same Please God bring me to life so that I ma meet the father of m future children, so that I might overcome poverty, find success, and great happiness, so that I can complete my journey of creating a family, to give birth to and raise more children, in a new and happy hope and marriage. Amen. As the sun draws upon my window at this hour, I call upon the dawning of a new eero of love, light and happiness, for all that I am and all who enter my presence, look upon me, know my artforms, or take part in my honor, the many plentiful endeavors and endowments of the great and holy divine, God almighty Amen C'cxell Soleïl Azul Monroe I thank you and humbly ask for you Great and Divine, Honorable protection, my dear lord, so that I might only know love, happiness, success, and great praise. Okay, so i did very briefly shapeshift into Steve Bucemi last night. Are you certain? I– [THE MAN IN THE MIRROR is STEVE BUCEMI] …whatever. I'm going back to bed. I'd highly recommend that. You can't forget a face like that. On that note, I think i'm into crustpunks. You want. I–oh yeah. Yes? Yes, please. GODDAMMIT. What. It's this stupid game. I can't get out of this effin trap. Oh. “oh” Have you tried, like– Tried like, what? I've tried everything. Just hit ‘escape' What? That's not gonna work. Have you tried it? No, that's stupid. You said you tried everything. Yeah, but that's–0 Just try it. GET UP, DILLON FRANCIS. GodDAMMIT. He's out cold. I'm not! i'm getting up. Jesus Christ, dawg. How are yout this much of a fuckin wook. I'm not “wook” You ARE wook. Jesus. Jesus is here. How are you more of a wook than Jimmy Fallon? That dude is like ancient. I'm not wook. You are wook. meanwhile WEEKEND UPDATE returns with a not-safe-for-work-or-TV Special. Oh no. Is that why SHH. SHUT UP. OH, YEAH, iT'S ON MOTHAFUCKA Dude. you can't wear suits to a rave like that. CAN uhm , CAN. Wtf man. Apparently, all the late night guys are like in competition with eachother. DUH. Even the dudes that are on the same network. DUH. Christ, kid, you are sloooooooooowwww. ….-_- which Seth are you again? The important one. Whatever. Just get Jon Stewart the fuck out of here before *michielf* Fucking christ. So wait, this is This is everybody. Can you explain to me why I blacked out on top of my kitchen table this morning? I can't actually explain that, no. SETH MEYERS (sipping coffee) Well, I can. UGH. AIGH. OHOKAY. UNCLE. UNCLE!!! AAAAAAHHHHAAAAA. Damn, you know it's gotta be close to th end if we've over here got [JIMMY FALLON at a RAVE ] Oh no. That can't be right. No, i can't do that . No one will recognize Chill, it's fan-fiction So you're a fan, then. No. But i'm sure you have them, somewhere. Aha. Ha. JIMMY FALLON'S #1 Fan Besides his– LET'S SHUT THE FUCK UP ABOUT THAT, FOR NOW, OKAY. I will never, literally ever let you live that down. Shut up, clever. SHut your face. IT wa the aliens, okay! Aliens. BEFORE: [Aliens] Who, what, him? {Jimmy Fallon} JUICE. OKay. Wtf, what the everliving fuck is that? Captain Hook REmix of Psychic Experence Breaks down reaeeeeal hard at around 4:30 What the fuck do they want with Fallon?! I don't know Is that him Yep. Delicious. Oh shit. The purple people eaters are back. WHAT. WHY. CAuse their lunch got away. WE LIKE HIM. Ah. Alright. I CAN'T DO THAT. What do you mean, “you can't do that” I can't do any of that! I'm on ice cream. Oh shit, he's on ice cream. MAYA RUDOLPH. DId someone say OH —------, THEY'RE BACK ICE CREAM?! Sorry, i didn't do this on purpos– COSMIC AVENGER –but I did. Fuck. Someone go fuckin get that guy before he ROCK KESHA! KESHA! KITE. Hey, look–I am so–so sorry about this… Whatever. It's not my fault. It was like this “Jimmy Fallon” was following me everywhere. WHAT. You thought i made that up?! THAT ACTUALLY HAPPENED. DUH. WTF. It's you again. IT's me again. Where is What. Where's what. Where's Wolf? Somewhere, I'm sure. Don't worry, yo. I'm sure it's not the real Jimmy Fallon; They're jus using him to implant my brain waves with leftist doctrine. Did you say ‘doctorate'? And also, sapiosexuality. “The Seven Souls of Sai The Saige” Sai and Psy The Saige are two halves of one; Counterparts, opposites, in fact— I don't want to do this anymore… I could feel the bags form under my eyes, the bath was run and I was due to release at least one episode today, but was rather being persuade to hard release, as I had intended; multi-part episodes recorded before I had fallen into silence, after another attack–a spiritual attack, which had left me in a raging bout of suicide and uncertainty–uncertainty, that is, as to whether the human race could be reclaimed from evil at all–as no one seemed to care for spirit or justice more than I, and however true it might have seemed, I was probably wrong, and for whatever reason, just trapped amongst these animals for whatever reason–perhaps to convey this message, that love would triumph over hate; but how could i preach such things now feeling another–it was as if I had been beaten or raped with no way at all to retaliate on my attacker, and still threatened by this force, some motorist who tore up and down my block at all hours, ripping me from the delicate rest I so craved and needed, as if it were the force which had destroyed all mankind itself, a reminder I should so when I wish, leave the world. There were no words left, only music, and no reason to speak, would the words fall upon deaf ears. Mankind as a whole had rotted to its core. Even days later, stil my chest ached, and my breathing shallow–the pain having torn through my heart not once now, but twice–I knew it was an intentional attack, whoever by, protected by evil itself. “How White Supremacy and Privalege are Ruining The Entertainment Industry” An article i'll never write because of terrorists By Whoever, just kill me. {Enter The Multiverse} [The Festival Project.™] COPYRIGHT © THE FESTIVAL PROJECT 2019-2024 | THE COMPLEX COLLECTIVE. © ALL RIGHTS RESERVED. © -Ū.

You want to come to, don't you? I'm not really sure I do… WAKE UP! WAKE UP! I am up, you blind bat! I'm rather more of a goat. I thought it you were a horse! –And to that, I say “Ney” Great . Listen. If you can get all of the Golden Girls and all of the beatles lined up in a row, I'll give you a bucket. What's in the bucket. Nothing, that's the fun of it. hm. Sir Paul McCartney? Uh, I guess. Sir Paul McCartney, you must never die. –I feel like i've heard this somewhere before… Perhaps somewhere before; But here, now. Very well, then. On you go. You know–you look familiar. No, I don't. Are you sure we don't know eachother? I'm not sure of anything, really–and neither should you be. Words to remember, my dear friend. __ So you've been knighted. I'd think it so. but the ceremony were in the morning. ___ Notes Dump II: All those who seek to controll me Will therefore be controlled by me therefore Those who seek to contain me Shall therefore be contained by me Amen JOHN SLATTERY wtf characters is this. idk , it just says “John Slattery” The fuck, man. She doesn't listen. She'll listen to me You think so I know so. Forget it. If she doesn't obey me– She's not going to obey anybody– Especially you; Whoever it is you think you are. Whatever, asshole. That's right; I'm an asshole. So that's Captain Asshole To you, motherfucker! [There's a Surf Club in Brooklyn] Mister Cellophane {The Printing Press} - pop Up Club Toot it and boot it “The telepathic deadmau5” Whatever that is Ooh shit, here we go again with this motherfucker [The 4th Dimensional Jimmy Fallon's telepathy becomes extremely keenly developed, with the more time he spends intentionally looking into the eye of the many cameras used to film the shows h appears on, exponentially increasing over the expanse of his career–as he soon finds out, his peers have also developed this seemingly unique ability, however, each person who has gained this ability has also developed an individual; intrinsic and respectively specific skill within his or herself which allows each person who possess this telepathy to limit/inhibit this at his or her own will or desire Whatever. JIMMY FALLON YOU RAT MOTHERFUCKER. I'm not a rat! I'm a weasel! AH! YEAH? YEAH, FORREAL. WELL, FUCK YOU, YOU WEASEL MOTHERFUCKER. FOR WHAT. i'M GONNA KILL YOU. That's readily apparent–BUT WHY? [The mobster lunges for Jimmy] AHH. I NEED CONTEXT. [He lunges for Jimmy again] AHH CONTINUITY. CONTINUTIY. Oh damn. So he really can shapeshift into. Just about –Just about anything. Fuck you. [The syndicate crime organization which Patrick has become involved with has become mistrustful and uncertain of his straightforward and clean-cut demeanor; He is forcibly injected with a combination of heroin and cocaine to ensure that he is trustworthy to continue within the organization, and his reputation is put into jeopardy as his occasional recreational use curtails into a habit, which he hides, as his new promotion to Head of Programming, in addition to his continuing role as the host of a primetime late night talk show are both put at stake. Patrick , a young and eager writer and performer, begins his career as a remarkably clean-cut and good-hearted young man, with an almost heroic sensibility of naivety, besides his impressively professional tolerance for high volumes of alcohol, and primarily hidden vice for cigarettes.] What is that. (mockingly) Heh. “what's that?” [Patrick shrugs, and grimaces, as if to say “whatever, then”] It's just some ye-yo. (uninterested) Oh. [He suddenly becomes slightly more hostile, as if provoked by Patrick's nonchalance] You down for some ye? Hah, i'm straight. (squinting) You sure? Yeah. Come on! Don't be so stiff. (defensively) I'm not “stiff” I'm just– (insisting, drawing closer Try it. (not backing down, but stern) I'm good. [The two are face-to-face, the room becomes quiet.] Try it. Nah. [His eyes widen; he appears offended.] I insist. [Patrick silently declines, attempting to stand up.] CONT'D Seriously? You know what– [The tension has risen; Patrick inwardly understands there's no escape; He swallows nervously, he is trapped, and surrounded by the crew of gangsters.] Sit. [He pushes Patrick down, holding his arms to his sides.] -___- We'll get back to that later. Damn shit show is intense. I know I haven't even found the real deep stuff yet. Yikes. I hope you weren't intending for Fallon to play this! Oh please! I don't even think he's capable of palating a show like this. That's an insult. No, it isn't. The man's a genius; but, a comic genius. You remember when Sandler did all that serious shit? What serious shit? Exactly. DOC BROWN THis is some serious shit. Not yet, Emmmmit. What do you mean, “not yet”? I haven't much time left, you know. Whatever! You're going to live forever! (Amen) I'm ma stressin Flexin my God complex ‘n / complexion I'm on Lex and, I'm not lost I'm just walkin in the wrong direction, To throw ‘em all off, N keep them steady guessin! your deviation from the media signifies your obedience of this law. What law. Wait. Where'd you go. [ILLUMINATi] HELLO? They tried to curse her name, But had forgot that it was Their ow; Therefore they cursed themselves, Set her free, and sent her home– The curse was meant to kill, so she'd always be alone– instead , she rose above the world, to sit upon the thrown HEr name became an honor, to which it was bestowed, the crown she wore upon her head, To show the curse had broken. –C'cxell Soleïl Azul Monroe Esha's Life Begins to Change drastically and rapidly, once the blood oath is set– PATRICK Oh, by the way, I've published your book. ESHA I'm Sorry– PATRICK (interjecting) –don't apologize… ESHA CON'T –you w-what? PATRICK This– [Esha gasps in shock.] ESHA How did you– PATRICK The artwork is beautiful– ESHA Patrick–! PATRICK It's your design, of course. ESHA How did you– PATRICK How did I what? ESHA …This was on canvas! PATRICK Was. Now it's the cover of your book. ESHA “My book…” _______ [As the workplace tension rises between Patrick and Esha and a strong romance begins to bloom, however unrequited between them, Patrick begins to return Esha's rejections with practical jokes, which sometimes backfire quite tragically, to Patrick's guilt and shame.] Patrick spits int Esha's Mango Lassi as she completes a task across the room , unseen) (he does this playfully, however and not out of spite, as since their fated intertwining within the blood oath, the two have shared such intimacies that this is only a ‘minor' contamination; they are, after all, bound by blood.) Esha sits back at her desk unwittingly, stirs her Mango lassi with the straw, and takes a sip of the refreshing drink.] ESHA Mm. [Patrick smiles maniically] LILLITH enters, walking past ESHA's desk and glancing at her, stopping short of greeting her, distracted by her refreshment.] LILLITH Ooh! That looks good. Can I try some? ESHA Sure! [Patrick's eyes widen, but he attempts not to react; LILLITH takes a sip.] LILLITH Ooh, that is good. [she takes another sip} [PATRICK keeps his hands in his pockets, biting his tongue, hiding that he is inwardly horrified; he rubs his eyes.] LILLITH yum . Grandma. You've got to try this. VIVIAN, passing by gestures to ESHA, who shrugs nonchalantly and nods a “go ahead” [PATRICK might explode; but he hides it well; VIVIAN Takes a sip.] VIVIAN That is delicious. LILLITH I know, right? VIVIAN Thank you, Esha. LILLITH Yeah, thanks. [Vivian and Lillith walk away; Esha gestures warmly and stirs the drink again, taking another sip before putting it down, looking at Patrick unassumingly, however, somewhat knowingly.] [PATRICK'S nostrils flare, he keeps his hands in his pockets and grimaces] [beat] “Jigsaw” [Patric finishes Esha' Puzzle, then frames it, as a romantic gesture. However, this very explicitly angers her, and she charges him; This is the first time he, or we as the audience has ever seen Esha in a fit of rage, or breaking her usually dry and collected composure. She enters his office, infuriated She smashes the framed puzzle across his desk; the puzzle and glass shatter, scattering impressively in an explosion of glass, wood shards, and puzzle pieces. PATRICK Good morning! ESHA You FINISHED MY PUZZLE. PATRICK –I thought you'd like that ESHA –YOU– [She begins throwing things off of Patrick's desk; starting with an awards trophy which appears to be an Oscar, then launching his bobble heads and finally, hulk smashing the cappuccino machine. PATRICK WOAH! ESHA –I WAS WORKING ON THE END FOR MONTHS. [She continues to destroy his office.] PATRICK HEY–wait, really? ESHA YES. PATRICK …It was so simple… [He has never witnessed this side of Esha before, and despite the destruction is quite amused. He snickers.] ESHA THIS IS FUNNY TO YOU? [Patrick sips his drink.] PATRICK I guess you could say i'm “puzzled” ESHA AGH [HULK SMASHES CAPPUCCINO MACHINE, as it is the last thing on his desk.] PATRICK OK?! [ESHA more satisfied/calmly pours out the remainder of his coffee; Now he's at the very least kind of upset. He sighs; She exits calmly.] VIVIAN peeks into the office as she passes ESHA exiting the doorway; a small crowd has gathered to gawk, but for the most part it's ‘business as usual', with most of the team assuming PATRICK has simply been up to his tendencies; In fact, he has, however, His relationship with ESHA has become quite complex, as due to his marriage and family, ESHA's continual rejection of his romantic sentiments, despite their explicit interminglings has left him befuddled, and consistently strategizing a way to earn her trust, as she seems an impenetrable wall, and hides a certain mysterious darkness. lol , Eli Scruggs, Man. Man, I wish. I love this scene though. LATER Eshareturns to her new home (an incredible modified loft in midtown, with a cast iron spiral staircase, stained windows, exposed brick, and exotic wood floors; Oh yeah, cause that one part where VICTOR You burned down her house? PATRCICK I bought it, first. And Insured it. VICTOR Woah. PATRICK Well, it was already insured. Lol damn this dude is a boss. Yeap. Fallon couldn't handle this. Nope. So who plays Esha? Idk. Some pretty light skinned girl. How light skinned. Light skinned enough to be an ingenue. Is she the ingenue? Almost. Kind of. Wtf. right . [Everything at first looks normal, until she reaches the downstairs bathroom/washroom door to find it closed (which is unusual She nervously looks abround, then notices under the door, one single puzzle piece – she opens the door; an avalanche of puzzle pieces falls to her feet; the entire room is filled floor to ceiling with puzzle pieces. EARLIER: Patrick sits in the rafters/air conditioning vent with a shop vacuum (in reverse) full of puzzle pieces, (a vacuum he has ‘borrowed' from the studio from the prop room of a show in which contestants are put into a translucent box to attempt to grab money as it flies into the air) He fills her entire washroom with the pieces of a giant jigsaw puzzle Esha, who neither appears to be angry or otherwise, hauls the pieces out in large garbage bags, , then carrying them into the master loft, a two-level space in which the lower level houses her art studio, where she finds a giant frame hanging from the roof on suspension chains; The camera pans outward with ESHA center, within this giant frame, creating in itself a picturesque vision, herself a painted picture, as she sorts through the pieces atop her bed Now I have your eyes, And you have mine We are we n The mind of The Eye This bond surpass Any test of time I am I now sign it. Uhhh.. Oh, th taste of tears To be bound by blood The cure of the oath The blessing of both Oneess [Patrick's children are somewhat all like him in some way; Effectively, they are hilarious? PATRICK This one does tricks. See! Hazel! Hazel is so effin cute. I know huh. She's like Sally Draper + Sally Draper ++ Goddamn. Yeah. Cute. Woah. Right. Anyway. HAZEL Huh. PATRICK Do a backflip. HAZEL Ok, daddy. [HAZEL attempts a backflip, but fails.] PATRICK. Fuck. [Face down, waves her arm as if to signal “i'm alright”, but clearly is inured.] PATRICK (taking a drink) Call the paramedic, HAZEL I'm okay, though! [She lifts her head up and appears shaken, however smiling–her eyes welted and nose running.] I'm okay. PATRICK No, bab, don't– HAZEL (cracking her neck) I'm okay. PATRICK Don't–your neck… HAZEL (walking it off, sighing) I'm okay, daddy. PATRICK Maybe just the chiropractor. Oh, My God Is it Esha n this scene? I can't remember if it's Esha or the nanny. Did he not fuck the therapist? I mean, that's later. Is it? I guess. Continuity. Whatever. We are as one The Mind of the Eye The Divinity of One. JOHN SLATTERY as THE MAYOR OF Which place idk Lol this dude is forreal always a politician. He looks like a politician. Look. MAYOR OF NY I think we may have found something of yours… [INT. JFK AIRPORT. NEW YORK CITY, NEW YORK, DAY.] MAYOR OF LA Where? MAYOR OF NEW YORK The airport. MAYOR OF LA Which airport. MAYOR OF NEW YORK JFK MAYOR OF LA I need you to ground that plane. MAYOR OF NEW YORK How? MAYOR OF LA By Any Means Nessesary. Lol that's it. Yup. Then it just ends. I fucking guess. I guess! Lol She is beautiful Eyes of oceans Eyes of oceans Eyes of oceans Dear God, Bring us together so that we shall prosper- in spirit, in body, in mind, and soul, as one, as we are Love, The Divine We are not alike, we are the same Please God bring me to life so that I ma meet the father of m future children, so that I might overcome poverty, find success, and great happiness, so that I can complete my journey of creating a family, to give birth to and raise more children, in a new and happy hope and marriage. Amen. As the sun draws upon my window at this hour, I call upon the dawning of a new eero of love, light and happiness, for all that I am and all who enter my presence, look upon me, know my artforms, or take part in my honor, the many plentiful endeavors and endowments of the great and holy divine, God almighty Amen C'cxell Soleïl Azul Monroe I thank you and humbly ask for you Great and Divine, Honorable protection, my dear lord, so that I might only know love, happiness, success, and great praise. Okay, so i did very briefly shapeshift into Steve Bucemi last night. Are you certain? I– [THE MAN IN THE MIRROR is STEVE BUCEMI] …whatever. I'm going back to bed. I'd highly recommend that. You can't forget a face like that. On that note, I think i'm into crustpunks. You want. I–oh yeah. Yes? Yes, please. GODDAMMIT. What. It's this stupid game. I can't get out of this effin trap. Oh. “oh” Have you tried, like– Tried like, what? I've tried everything. Just hit ‘escape' What? That's not gonna work. Have you tried it? No, that's stupid. You said you tried everything. Yeah, but that's–0 Just try it. GET UP, DILLON FRANCIS. GodDAMMIT. He's out cold. I'm not! i'm getting up. Jesus Christ, dawg. How are yout this much of a fuckin wook. I'm not “wook” You ARE wook. Jesus. Jesus is here. How are you more of a wook than Jimmy Fallon? That dude is like ancient. I'm not wook. You are wook. meanwhile WEEKEND UPDATE returns with a not-safe-for-work-or-TV Special. Oh no. Is that why SHH. SHUT UP. OH, YEAH, iT'S ON MOTHAFUCKA Dude. you can't wear suits to a rave like that. CAN uhm , CAN. Wtf man. Apparently, all the late night guys are like in competition with eachother. DUH. Even the dudes that are on the same network. DUH. Christ, kid, you are sloooooooooowwww. ….-_- which Seth are you again? The important one. Whatever. Just get Jon Stewart the fuck out of here before *michielf* Fucking christ. So wait, this is This is everybody. Can you explain to me why I blacked out on top of my kitchen table this morning? I can't actually explain that, no. SETH MEYERS (sipping coffee) Well, I can. UGH. AIGH. OHOKAY. UNCLE. UNCLE!!! AAAAAAHHHHAAAAA. Damn, you know it's gotta be close to th end if we've over here got [JIMMY FALLON at a RAVE ] Oh no. That can't be right. No, i can't do that . No one will recognize Chill, it's fan-fiction So you're a fan, then. No. But i'm sure you have them, somewhere. Aha. Ha. JIMMY FALLON'S #1 Fan Besides his– LET'S SHUT THE FUCK UP ABOUT THAT, FOR NOW, OKAY. I will never, literally ever let you live that down. Shut up, clever. SHut your face. IT wa the aliens, okay! Aliens. BEFORE: [Aliens] Who, what, him? {Jimmy Fallon} JUICE. OKay. Wtf, what the everliving fuck is that? Captain Hook REmix of Psychic Experence Breaks down reaeeeeal hard at around 4:30 What the fuck do they want with Fallon?! I don't know Is that him Yep. Delicious. Oh shit. The purple people eaters are back. WHAT. WHY. CAuse their lunch got away. WE LIKE HIM. Ah. Alright. I CAN'T DO THAT. What do you mean, “you can't do that” I can't do any of that! I'm on ice cream. Oh shit, he's on ice cream. MAYA RUDOLPH. DId someone say OH —------, THEY'RE BACK ICE CREAM?! Sorry, i didn't do this on purpos– COSMIC AVENGER –but I did. Fuck. Someone go fuckin get that guy before he ROCK KESHA! KESHA! KITE. Hey, look–I am so–so sorry about this… Whatever. It's not my fault. It was like this “Jimmy Fallon” was following me everywhere. WHAT. You thought i made that up?! THAT ACTUALLY HAPPENED. DUH. WTF. It's you again. IT's me again. Where is What. Where's what. Where's Wolf? Somewhere, I'm sure. Don't worry, yo. I'm sure it's not the real Jimmy Fallon; They're jus using him to implant my brain waves with leftist doctrine. Did you say ‘doctorate'? And also, sapiosexuality. “The Seven Souls of Sai The Saige” Sai and Psy The Saige are two halves of one; Counterparts, opposites, in fact— I don't want to do this anymore… I could feel the bags form under my eyes, the bath was run and I was due to release at least one episode today, but was rather being persuade to hard release, as I had intended; multi-part episodes recorded before I had fallen into silence, after another attack–a spiritual attack, which had left me in a raging bout of suicide and uncertainty–uncertainty, that is, as to whether the human race could be reclaimed from evil at all–as no one seemed to care for spirit or justice more than I, and however true it might have seemed, I was probably wrong, and for whatever reason, just trapped amongst these animals for whatever reason–perhaps to convey this message, that love would triumph over hate; but how could i preach such things now feeling another–it was as if I had been beaten or raped with no way at all to retaliate on my attacker, and still threatened by this force, some motorist who tore up and down my block at all hours, ripping me from the delicate rest I so craved and needed, as if it were the force which had destroyed all mankind itself, a reminder I should so when I wish, leave the world. There were no words left, only music, and no reason to speak, would the words fall upon deaf ears. Mankind as a whole had rotted to its core. Even days later, stil my chest ached, and my breathing shallow–the pain having torn through my heart not once now, but twice–I knew it was an intentional attack, whoever by, protected by evil itself. “How White Supremacy and Privalege are Ruining The Entertainment Industry” An article i'll never write because of terrorists By Whoever, just kill me. {Enter The Multiverse} [The Festival Project.™] COPYRIGHT © THE FESTIVAL PROJECT 2019-2024 | THE COMPLEX COLLECTIVE. © ALL RIGHTS RESERVED. © -Ū.

You want to come to, don't you? I'm not really sure I do… WAKE UP! WAKE UP! I am up, you blind bat! I'm rather more of a goat. I thought it you were a horse! –And to that, I say “Ney” Great . Listen. If you can get all of the Golden Girls and all of the beatles lined up in a row, I'll give you a bucket. What's in the bucket. Nothing, that's the fun of it. hm. Sir Paul McCartney? Uh, I guess. Sir Paul McCartney, you must never die. –I feel like i've heard this somewhere before… Perhaps somewhere before; But here, now. Very well, then. On you go. You know–you look familiar. No, I don't. Are you sure we don't know eachother? I'm not sure of anything, really–and neither should you be. Words to remember, my dear friend. __ So you've been knighted. I'd think it so. but the ceremony were in the morning. ___ Notes Dump II: All those who seek to controll me Will therefore be controlled by me therefore Those who seek to contain me Shall therefore be contained by me Amen JOHN SLATTERY wtf characters is this. idk , it just says “John Slattery” The fuck, man. She doesn't listen. She'll listen to me You think so I know so. Forget it. If she doesn't obey me– She's not going to obey anybody– Especially you; Whoever it is you think you are. Whatever, asshole. That's right; I'm an asshole. So that's Captain Asshole To you, motherfucker! [There's a Surf Club in Brooklyn] Mister Cellophane {The Printing Press} - pop Up Club Toot it and boot it “The telepathic deadmau5” Whatever that is Ooh shit, here we go again with this motherfucker [The 4th Dimensional Jimmy Fallon's telepathy becomes extremely keenly developed, with the more time he spends intentionally looking into the eye of the many cameras used to film the shows h appears on, exponentially increasing over the expanse of his career–as he soon finds out, his peers have also developed this seemingly unique ability, however, each person who has gained this ability has also developed an individual; intrinsic and respectively specific skill within his or herself which allows each person who possess this telepathy to limit/inhibit this at his or her own will or desire Whatever. JIMMY FALLON YOU RAT MOTHERFUCKER. I'm not a rat! I'm a weasel! AH! YEAH? YEAH, FORREAL. WELL, FUCK YOU, YOU WEASEL MOTHERFUCKER. FOR WHAT. i'M GONNA KILL YOU. That's readily apparent–BUT WHY? [The mobster lunges for Jimmy] AHH. I NEED CONTEXT. [He lunges for Jimmy again] AHH CONTINUITY. CONTINUTIY. Oh damn. So he really can shapeshift into. Just about –Just about anything. Fuck you. [The syndicate crime organization which Patrick has become involved with has become mistrustful and uncertain of his straightforward and clean-cut demeanor; He is forcibly injected with a combination of heroin and cocaine to ensure that he is trustworthy to continue within the organization, and his reputation is put into jeopardy as his occasional recreational use curtails into a habit, which he hides, as his new promotion to Head of Programming, in addition to his continuing role as the host of a primetime late night talk show are both put at stake. Patrick , a young and eager writer and performer, begins his career as a remarkably clean-cut and good-hearted young man, with an almost heroic sensibility of naivety, besides his impressively professional tolerance for high volumes of alcohol, and primarily hidden vice for cigarettes.] What is that. (mockingly) Heh. “what's that?” [Patrick shrugs, and grimaces, as if to say “whatever, then”] It's just some ye-yo. (uninterested) Oh. [He suddenly becomes slightly more hostile, as if provoked by Patrick's nonchalance] You down for some ye? Hah, i'm straight. (squinting) You sure? Yeah. Come on! Don't be so stiff. (defensively) I'm not “stiff” I'm just– (insisting, drawing closer Try it. (not backing down, but stern) I'm good. [The two are face-to-face, the room becomes quiet.] Try it. Nah. [His eyes widen; he appears offended.] I insist. [Patrick silently declines, attempting to stand up.] CONT'D Seriously? You know what– [The tension has risen; Patrick inwardly understands there's no escape; He swallows nervously, he is trapped, and surrounded by the crew of gangsters.] Sit. [He pushes Patrick down, holding his arms to his sides.] -___- We'll get back to that later. Damn shit show is intense. I know I haven't even found the real deep stuff yet. Yikes. I hope you weren't intending for Fallon to play this! Oh please! I don't even think he's capable of palating a show like this. That's an insult. No, it isn't. The man's a genius; but, a comic genius. You remember when Sandler did all that serious shit? What serious shit? Exactly. DOC BROWN THis is some serious shit. Not yet, Emmmmit. What do you mean, “not yet”? I haven't much time left, you know. Whatever! You're going to live forever! (Amen) I'm ma stressin Flexin my God complex ‘n / complexion I'm on Lex and, I'm not lost I'm just walkin in the wrong direction, To throw ‘em all off, N keep them steady guessin! your deviation from the media signifies your obedience of this law. What law. Wait. Where'd you go. [ILLUMINATi] HELLO? They tried to curse her name, But had forgot that it was Their ow; Therefore they cursed themselves, Set her free, and sent her home– The curse was meant to kill, so she'd always be alone– instead , she rose above the world, to sit upon the thrown HEr name became an honor, to which it was bestowed, the crown she wore upon her head, To show the curse had broken. –C'cxell Soleïl Azul Monroe Esha's Life Begins to Change drastically and rapidly, once the blood oath is set– PATRICK Oh, by the way, I've published your book. ESHA I'm Sorry– PATRICK (interjecting) –don't apologize… ESHA CON'T –you w-what? PATRICK This– [Esha gasps in shock.] ESHA How did you– PATRICK The artwork is beautiful– ESHA Patrick–! PATRICK It's your design, of course. ESHA How did you– PATRICK How did I what? ESHA …This was on canvas! PATRICK Was. Now it's the cover of your book. ESHA “My book…” _______ [As the workplace tension rises between Patrick and Esha and a strong romance begins to bloom, however unrequited between them, Patrick begins to return Esha's rejections with practical jokes, which sometimes backfire quite tragically, to Patrick's guilt and shame.] Patrick spits int Esha's Mango Lassi as she completes a task across the room , unseen) (he does this playfully, however and not out of spite, as since their fated intertwining within the blood oath, the two have shared such intimacies that this is only a ‘minor' contamination; they are, after all, bound by blood.) Esha sits back at her desk unwittingly, stirs her Mango lassi with the straw, and takes a sip of the refreshing drink.] ESHA Mm. [Patrick smiles maniically] LILLITH enters, walking past ESHA's desk and glancing at her, stopping short of greeting her, distracted by her refreshment.] LILLITH Ooh! That looks good. Can I try some? ESHA Sure! [Patrick's eyes widen, but he attempts not to react; LILLITH takes a sip.] LILLITH Ooh, that is good. [she takes another sip} [PATRICK keeps his hands in his pockets, biting his tongue, hiding that he is inwardly horrified; he rubs his eyes.] LILLITH yum . Grandma. You've got to try this. VIVIAN, passing by gestures to ESHA, who shrugs nonchalantly and nods a “go ahead” [PATRICK might explode; but he hides it well; VIVIAN Takes a sip.] VIVIAN That is delicious. LILLITH I know, right? VIVIAN Thank you, Esha. LILLITH Yeah, thanks. [Vivian and Lillith walk away; Esha gestures warmly and stirs the drink again, taking another sip before putting it down, looking at Patrick unassumingly, however, somewhat knowingly.] [PATRICK'S nostrils flare, he keeps his hands in his pockets and grimaces] [beat] “Jigsaw” [Patric finishes Esha' Puzzle, then frames it, as a romantic gesture. However, this very explicitly angers her, and she charges him; This is the first time he, or we as the audience has ever seen Esha in a fit of rage, or breaking her usually dry and collected composure. She enters his office, infuriated She smashes the framed puzzle across his desk; the puzzle and glass shatter, scattering impressively in an explosion of glass, wood shards, and puzzle pieces. PATRICK Good morning! ESHA You FINISHED MY PUZZLE. PATRICK –I thought you'd like that ESHA –YOU– [She begins throwing things off of Patrick's desk; starting with an awards trophy which appears to be an Oscar, then launching his bobble heads and finally, hulk smashing the cappuccino machine. PATRICK WOAH! ESHA –I WAS WORKING ON THE END FOR MONTHS. [She continues to destroy his office.] PATRICK HEY–wait, really? ESHA YES. PATRICK …It was so simple… [He has never witnessed this side of Esha before, and despite the destruction is quite amused. He snickers.] ESHA THIS IS FUNNY TO YOU? [Patrick sips his drink.] PATRICK I guess you could say i'm “puzzled” ESHA AGH [HULK SMASHES CAPPUCCINO MACHINE, as it is the last thing on his desk.] PATRICK OK?! [ESHA more satisfied/calmly pours out the remainder of his coffee; Now he's at the very least kind of upset. He sighs; She exits calmly.] VIVIAN peeks into the office as she passes ESHA exiting the doorway; a small crowd has gathered to gawk, but for the most part it's ‘business as usual', with most of the team assuming PATRICK has simply been up to his tendencies; In fact, he has, however, His relationship with ESHA has become quite complex, as due to his marriage and family, ESHA's continual rejection of his romantic sentiments, despite their explicit interminglings has left him befuddled, and consistently strategizing a way to earn her trust, as she seems an impenetrable wall, and hides a certain mysterious darkness. lol , Eli Scruggs, Man. Man, I wish. I love this scene though. LATER Eshareturns to her new home (an incredible modified loft in midtown, with a cast iron spiral staircase, stained windows, exposed brick, and exotic wood floors; Oh yeah, cause that one part where VICTOR You burned down her house? PATRCICK I bought it, first. And Insured it. VICTOR Woah. PATRICK Well, it was already insured. Lol damn this dude is a boss. Yeap. Fallon couldn't handle this. Nope. So who plays Esha? Idk. Some pretty light skinned girl. How light skinned. Light skinned enough to be an ingenue. Is she the ingenue? Almost. Kind of. Wtf. right . [Everything at first looks normal, until she reaches the downstairs bathroom/washroom door to find it closed (which is unusual She nervously looks abround, then notices under the door, one single puzzle piece – she opens the door; an avalanche of puzzle pieces falls to her feet; the entire room is filled floor to ceiling with puzzle pieces. EARLIER: Patrick sits in the rafters/air conditioning vent with a shop vacuum (in reverse) full of puzzle pieces, (a vacuum he has ‘borrowed' from the studio from the prop room of a show in which contestants are put into a translucent box to attempt to grab money as it flies into the air) He fills her entire washroom with the pieces of a giant jigsaw puzzle Esha, who neither appears to be angry or otherwise, hauls the pieces out in large garbage bags, , then carrying them into the master loft, a two-level space in which the lower level houses her art studio, where she finds a giant frame hanging from the roof on suspension chains; The camera pans outward with ESHA center, within this giant frame, creating in itself a picturesque vision, herself a painted picture, as she sorts through the pieces atop her bed Now I have your eyes, And you have mine We are we n The mind of The Eye This bond surpass Any test of time I am I now sign it. Uhhh.. Oh, th taste of tears To be bound by blood The cure of the oath The blessing of both Oneess [Patrick's children are somewhat all like him in some way; Effectively, they are hilarious? PATRICK This one does tricks. See! Hazel! Hazel is so effin cute. I know huh. She's like Sally Draper + Sally Draper ++ Goddamn. Yeah. Cute. Woah. Right. Anyway. HAZEL Huh. PATRICK Do a backflip. HAZEL Ok, daddy. [HAZEL attempts a backflip, but fails.] PATRICK. Fuck. [Face down, waves her arm as if to signal “i'm alright”, but clearly is inured.] PATRICK (taking a drink) Call the paramedic, HAZEL I'm okay, though! [She lifts her head up and appears shaken, however smiling–her eyes welted and nose running.] I'm okay. PATRICK No, bab, don't– HAZEL (cracking her neck) I'm okay. PATRICK Don't–your neck… HAZEL (walking it off, sighing) I'm okay, daddy. PATRICK Maybe just the chiropractor. Oh, My God Is it Esha n this scene? I can't remember if it's Esha or the nanny. Did he not fuck the therapist? I mean, that's later. Is it? I guess. Continuity. Whatever. We are as one The Mind of the Eye The Divinity of One. JOHN SLATTERY as THE MAYOR OF Which place idk Lol this dude is forreal always a politician. He looks like a politician. Look. MAYOR OF NY I think we may have found something of yours… [INT. JFK AIRPORT. NEW YORK CITY, NEW YORK, DAY.] MAYOR OF LA Where? MAYOR OF NEW YORK The airport. MAYOR OF LA Which airport. MAYOR OF NEW YORK JFK MAYOR OF LA I need you to ground that plane. MAYOR OF NEW YORK How? MAYOR OF LA By Any Means Nessesary. Lol that's it. Yup. Then it just ends. I fucking guess. I guess! Lol She is beautiful Eyes of oceans Eyes of oceans Eyes of oceans Dear God, Bring us together so that we shall prosper- in spirit, in body, in mind, and soul, as one, as we are Love, The Divine We are not alike, we are the same Please God bring me to life so that I ma meet the father of m future children, so that I might overcome poverty, find success, and great happiness, so that I can complete my journey of creating a family, to give birth to and raise more children, in a new and happy hope and marriage. Amen. As the sun draws upon my window at this hour, I call upon the dawning of a new eero of love, light and happiness, for all that I am and all who enter my presence, look upon me, know my artforms, or take part in my honor, the many plentiful endeavors and endowments of the great and holy divine, God almighty Amen C'cxell Soleïl Azul Monroe I thank you and humbly ask for you Great and Divine, Honorable protection, my dear lord, so that I might only know love, happiness, success, and great praise. Okay, so i did very briefly shapeshift into Steve Bucemi last night. Are you certain? I– [THE MAN IN THE MIRROR is STEVE BUCEMI] …whatever. I'm going back to bed. I'd highly recommend that. You can't forget a face like that. On that note, I think i'm into crustpunks. You want. I–oh yeah. Yes? Yes, please. GODDAMMIT. What. It's this stupid game. I can't get out of this effin trap. Oh. “oh” Have you tried, like– Tried like, what? I've tried everything. Just hit ‘escape' What? That's not gonna work. Have you tried it? No, that's stupid. You said you tried everything. Yeah, but that's–0 Just try it. GET UP, DILLON FRANCIS. GodDAMMIT. He's out cold. I'm not! i'm getting up. Jesus Christ, dawg. How are yout this much of a fuckin wook. I'm not “wook” You ARE wook. Jesus. Jesus is here. How are you more of a wook than Jimmy Fallon? That dude is like ancient. I'm not wook. You are wook. meanwhile WEEKEND UPDATE returns with a not-safe-for-work-or-TV Special. Oh no. Is that why SHH. SHUT UP. OH, YEAH, iT'S ON MOTHAFUCKA Dude. you can't wear suits to a rave like that. CAN uhm , CAN. Wtf man. Apparently, all the late night guys are like in competition with eachother. DUH. Even the dudes that are on the same network. DUH. Christ, kid, you are sloooooooooowwww. ….-_- which Seth are you again? The important one. Whatever. Just get Jon Stewart the fuck out of here before *michielf* Fucking christ. So wait, this is This is everybody. Can you explain to me why I blacked out on top of my kitchen table this morning? I can't actually explain that, no. SETH MEYERS (sipping coffee) Well, I can. UGH. AIGH. OHOKAY. UNCLE. UNCLE!!! AAAAAAHHHHAAAAA. Damn, you know it's gotta be close to th end if we've over here got [JIMMY FALLON at a RAVE ] Oh no. That can't be right. No, i can't do that . No one will recognize Chill, it's fan-fiction So you're a fan, then. No. But i'm sure you have them, somewhere. Aha. Ha. JIMMY FALLON'S #1 Fan Besides his– LET'S SHUT THE FUCK UP ABOUT THAT, FOR NOW, OKAY. I will never, literally ever let you live that down. Shut up, clever. SHut your face. IT wa the aliens, okay! Aliens. BEFORE: [Aliens] Who, what, him? {Jimmy Fallon} JUICE. OKay. Wtf, what the everliving fuck is that? Captain Hook REmix of Psychic Experence Breaks down reaeeeeal hard at around 4:30 What the fuck do they want with Fallon?! I don't know Is that him Yep. Delicious. Oh shit. The purple people eaters are back. WHAT. WHY. CAuse their lunch got away. WE LIKE HIM. Ah. Alright. I CAN'T DO THAT. What do you mean, “you can't do that” I can't do any of that! I'm on ice cream. Oh shit, he's on ice cream. MAYA RUDOLPH. DId someone say OH —------, THEY'RE BACK ICE CREAM?! Sorry, i didn't do this on purpos– COSMIC AVENGER –but I did. Fuck. Someone go fuckin get that guy before he ROCK KESHA! KESHA! KITE. Hey, look–I am so–so sorry about this… Whatever. It's not my fault. It was like this “Jimmy Fallon” was following me everywhere. WHAT. You thought i made that up?! THAT ACTUALLY HAPPENED. DUH. WTF. It's you again. IT's me again. Where is What. Where's what. Where's Wolf? Somewhere, I'm sure. Don't worry, yo. I'm sure it's not the real Jimmy Fallon; They're jus using him to implant my brain waves with leftist doctrine. Did you say ‘doctorate'? And also, sapiosexuality. “The Seven Souls of Sai The Saige” Sai and Psy The Saige are two halves of one; Counterparts, opposites, in fact— I don't want to do this anymore… I could feel the bags form under my eyes, the bath was run and I was due to release at least one episode today, but was rather being persuade to hard release, as I had intended; multi-part episodes recorded before I had fallen into silence, after another attack–a spiritual attack, which had left me in a raging bout of suicide and uncertainty–uncertainty, that is, as to whether the human race could be reclaimed from evil at all–as no one seemed to care for spirit or justice more than I, and however true it might have seemed, I was probably wrong, and for whatever reason, just trapped amongst these animals for whatever reason–perhaps to convey this message, that love would triumph over hate; but how could i preach such things now feeling another–it was as if I had been beaten or raped with no way at all to retaliate on my attacker, and still threatened by this force, some motorist who tore up and down my block at all hours, ripping me from the delicate rest I so craved and needed, as if it were the force which had destroyed all mankind itself, a reminder I should so when I wish, leave the world. There were no words left, only music, and no reason to speak, would the words fall upon deaf ears. Mankind as a whole had rotted to its core. Even days later, stil my chest ached, and my breathing shallow–the pain having torn through my heart not once now, but twice–I knew it was an intentional attack, whoever by, protected by evil itself. “How White Supremacy and Privalege are Ruining The Entertainment Industry” An article i'll never write because of terrorists By Whoever, just kill me. {Enter The Multiverse} [The Festival Project.™] COPYRIGHT © THE FESTIVAL PROJECT 2019-2024 | THE COMPLEX COLLECTIVE. © ALL RIGHTS RESERVED. © -Ū.

Giro Gre-Nal #467 - a lesão de Alan Patrick no Inter e o zagueiro que está de saída do Grêmio by Rádio Gaúcha

In Episode 35 des The Natural Gem Podcasts laden wir dich herzlich ein, gemeinsam mit Patrick-Noël Herold-Gregor, dem COO von The Natural Gem, und unserem Gastgeber Emanuel Stadler, in die Welt des Habsburg Fine Arts (HFA) GEM-Tokens einzutauchen. Diese besondere Episode widmet sich der Faszination und dem Investitionspotenzial dieses einzigartigen Tokens, der durch ein Portfolio im Wert von 5 Millionen Euro in hochwertigen Edelsteinen und Juwelen gedeckt ist.   Hol dir deine GEM-Token noch heute: habsburgfinearts.com   In dieser Episode werden wir folgende wichtige Fragen behandeln: Was macht den GEM-Token in der Welt der Kryptoinvestitionen so besonders? Wie kombiniert der GEM-Token die Anziehungskraft von Edelsteinen mit der Flexibilität einer digitalen Anlage? Warum sollten Investoren den GEM-Token in Erwägung ziehen? Welche Rolle spielt die physische GEM-Wallet bei der Sicherung Ihrer Tokens? Wie steigt der Wert des Tokens durch Expertenbewertung und renommierte gemmologische Labore? Warum ist die Herkunft und Transparenz des Tokens entscheidend für seinen Wert? Wie nutzt der GEM-Token die einzigartigen Eigenschaften von Edelsteinen für langfristiges Wachstum? Und vieles mehr! Für weitere Informationen und um auf dem Laufenden zu bleiben, können Sie uns wie folgt erreichen:   Kontakt: podcast@thenaturalgem.com Patrick-Noël Herold-Gregor | LinkedIn Emanuel Stadler, MA | LinkedIn TNG Website & Online Shop   Referenzierte Episoden/Ressourcen: Investieren in Edelsteine | Amazon Die Krönung: Mit Herta und Sandor Habsburg-Lothringen.       Abboniere unseren Podcast und hinterlasse uns eine gute Bewertung! Spotify | Apple Podcasts | Podbean

In Folge 34 des The Natural Gem Podcasts sprechen Patrick-Noël Herold-Gregor, COO von The Natural Gem, und unser Host Emanuel Stadler über die Faszination und das Investmentpotential von Farbdiamanten, die faszinierenden und oft unerwarteten Variationen des klassischen, klaren Diamanten, der in der Schmuck- und Investmentwelt für viel Aufsehen sorgt.   In Folge 34 beantworten wir Fragen wie: Was macht Farbdiamanten so besonders im Vergleich zu farblosen Diamanten? Gibt es einen "Fluch" um den Hope Diamant, und wie hat dieser die Geschichte beeinflusst? Was ist die Geschichte des geheimnisvollen Florentiners und wo könnte er heute sein? Was zeichnet den Dresden Grün aus, und wie hat er so viele Jahrhunderte überstanden? Eignen sich Farbdiamanten wie diese als Investment? Welche Position könnten Farbdiamanten in einem Investment-Portfolio einnehmen? Wie entstehen die verschiedenen Farben bei Farbdiamanten? Warum ist die Herkunft bei Farbdiamanten wichtig für ihren Wert? Wie beeinflussen Verunreinigungen und die chemische Zusammensetzung die Farbe von Diamanten? und vieles mehr...!       Kontakt: podcast@thenaturalgem.com Patrick-Noël Herold-Gregor | LinkedIn Emanuel Stadler, MA | LinkedIn TNG Website & Online Shop   Referenzierte Episoden/Ressourcen: Investieren in Edelsteine | Amazon Der Diamant - Teil 1 | TNG Podcast Der Diamant - Teil 2 | TNG Podcast Portfolio Design | TNG Podcast Synthetische Edelsteine | TNG Podcast     Abboniere unseren Podcast und hinterlasse uns eine gute Bewertung! Spotify | Apple Podcasts | Podbean  

Nos enteramos que a Patrick no le gustaba que lo encasillaran como emo, ¿ustedes que piensan?

In Folge 32 des The Natural Gem Podcasts tauchen wir mit Patrick-Noël Herold-Gregor, CEO von The Natural Gem und Ferdinand Schwarzer, Sales Manager, tief in die Schätze der Singapore International Jewelry Expo ein. Unser Host Emanuel Stadler führt uns durch die glänzenden Hallen der Messe und teilt exklusive Einblicke in die Welt der Edelsteine und Schmuckindustrie. Die Messe ist bekannt für die beeindruckende Auswahl an Edelsteinen und Schmuckstücken aus aller Welt, und ist ein Hotspot für Händler, Sammler und Liebhaber. Die Erfahrungen, die wir auf der Messe gesammelt haben, und die Trends, die wir beobachtet haben, geben uns Aufschluss über die aktuellen und zukünftigen Entwicklungen in der Branche. In Folge 32 gehen wir auf Themen ein wie: Welche Highlights gab es auf der Singapore International Jewelry Expo? Welche neuen Trends haben wir in der Edelstein- und Schmuckindustrie entdeckt? Welche Bedeutung hat die Messe für unser Geschäft und für die Branche insgesamt? Wie hat Singapur als Gastgeberstadt die Messe beeinflusst und geprägt? Welche Erkenntnisse konnten wir von der Messe mitnehmen und wie werden sie unser Geschäft beeinflussen Und vieles mehr...       Kontakt: podcast@thenaturalgem.com Patrick-Noël Herold-Gregor | LinkedIn Ferdinand Schwarzer | LinkedIn Emanuel Stadler, MA | LinkedIn TNG Website & Online Shop   Referenzierte Episoden/Ressourcen: Hot Shot Edelsteine Part 1 | TNG Podcast Investieren in Edelsteine | Amazon   Der Habsburg Gemstone Token DER WELTWEIT ERSTE ZU 100% MIT EDELSTEINEN GEDECKTE TOKEN www.habsburgfinearts.com       Abboniere unseren Podcast und hinterlasse uns eine gute Bewertung! Spotify | Apple Podcasts | Podbean  

In der Sonderfolge 26 sprechen Ferdinand Schwarzer, Patrick-Noël Herold Gregor und Emanuel Stadler über die Krönung von King Charles III.   In Folge 26 beantworten wir Fragen wie: Wie läuft die Krönung ab? Welcher Schatz kommt in der Krönung vor? Wie kann man die St. Edwards Krone mit der Krone des Heiligen Römischen Reiches vergleichen? Welche Kontroversen gibt es rund um die Kronjuwelen? Welche Rolle spielt der Cullinan Diamant in der Krönung? Welchen Wert haben die drei verwendeten Kronen? Was hat es mit den Reichsapfel und dem Zepter auf sich? ... und vieles mehr?   Kontakt: podcast@thenaturalgem.com Patrick-Noël Herold-Gregor | LinkedIn Ferdinand Schwarzer | LinkedIn Emanuel Stadler, MA | LinkedIn TNG Website & Online Shop   Referenzierte Episoden/Ressourcen: Der Rubin, König der Edelsteine | TNG Podcast Audiobuch (Teaster) | TNG Podcast Investieren in Edelsteine | Amazon   Abboniere unseren Podcast und hinterlasse uns eine gute Bewertung! Spotify | Apple Podcasts | Podbean

In Folge 24 des The Natural Gem Podcasts sprechen Mag. Patrick-Noël Herold-Gregor seines Zeichens COO bei The Natural Gem, und unser Host Emanuel Stadler erneut über den Diamanten, den wohl bekanntesten und verbreiteten Edelstein.   In Folge 24 beantworten wir Fragen wie: Was genau sind die 4C? Wie beeinflussen die 4C meine Kaufentscheidung? Welcher Stein eignet sich als Investment, welche als Schmuckstein? Wie werden Synthtische Dimanten den Markt beeinflussen? Welche berühmten Diamanten gibt es? Was ist Fluoreszenz im Diamanten? und vieles mehr...! Kontakt: podcast@thenaturalgem.com Patrick-Noël Herold-Gregor | LinkedIn Emanuel Stadler, MA | LinkedIn TNG Website & Online Shop   Referenzierte Episoden/Ressourcen: Investieren in Edelsteine | Amazon Portfolio Design | TNG Podcast Synthetische Edelsteine | TNG Podcast Inflation und Krisenzeiten | TNG Podcast Investment Strategie | TNG Podcast   Abboniere unseren Podcast und hinterlasse uns eine gute Bewertung! Spotify | Apple Podcasts | Podbean      

In Folge 23 des The Natural Gem Podcasts sprechen Mag. Patrick-Noël Herold-Gregor seines Zeichens COO bei The Natural Gem, und unser Host Emanuel Stadler über den Diamanten, den wohl bekanntesten und verbreiteten Edelstein.   In Folge 23 beantworten wir Fragen wie: Was sind Diamanten? Was zeichnet sie aus? Sind Diamanten ein gutes Investment? Wieso können Diamanten als einzer Edelstein volatil sein? Welche Rolle füllen Diamanten in einem Investment-Portfolio? Was sind die 4 C bei einem Diamanten? Muss ein Verlobungsring zwingend einen Diamanten haben? und vieles mehr...! Kontakt: podcast@thenaturalgem.com Patrick-Noël Herold-Gregor | LinkedIn Emanuel Stadler, MA | LinkedIn TNG Website & Online Shop   Referenzierte Episoden/Ressourcen: Investieren in Edelsteine | Amazon Portfolio Design | TNG Podcast Synthetische Edelsteine | TNG Podcast Inflation und Krisenzeiten | TNG Podcast Investment Strategie | TNG Podcast   Abboniere unseren Podcast und hinterlasse uns eine gute Bewertung! Spotify | Apple Podcasts | Podbean      

Os repórteres do ge Bruno Ravazzolli e Tomás Hammes e o repórter da RBS TV Eduardo Deconto falam sobre a entrada de Alan Patrick na equipe e as qualidades que o meia coloca para o time. Além disso, o trio pincela sobre a perda de espaço de Taison e David, conta bastidores da entrevista exclusiva do ge com Mauricio e até do que o Colorado precisa para a próxima temporada. Clica e dá o play no ge Inter!

In Folge 8 des The Natural Gem Podcasts sprechen Mag. Patrick-Noël Herold-Gregor, MBA - Managing Partner von The Natural Gem, und unser Host Emanuel Stadler über Investment Portfolios und Diversifizierungsmöglichkeiten. Vom Nukleus eines Erstinvestments bis über Blumensträuße, in dieser Folge werden Fragen beantwortet wie: Mit welchem Stein fange ich mein Portfolio an? Wie kann man ein Portfolio nachhaltig aufbauen? Haben Diamanten ihren Platz in einem Investment Portfolio? Gibt es auch Steine, die Erwartungen übertreffen können? Welchen Platz hat Liquidität in einem Portfolio? Welche Steine fliegen noch unter dem Radar? ... und viele weitere spannende Themen!   Kontakt: podcast@thenaturalgem.com Mag. Patrick-Noël Herold-Gregor, MBA | LinkedIn Emanuel Stadler, MA | LinkedIn TNG Website   Referenzierte Episoden/Ressourcen: Investment Strategien und Vorgehen | TNG Podcast Investieren in Edelsteine | Amazon SSEF | Website Gübelin | Website Rapaport | Website    

In der vierten Folge von The Natural Gem Podcast spricht Patrick-Noël Herold-Gregor, Managing Partner bei The Natural Gem über typische Investment Strategien rund um Alternative Realinvestments.   Er vergleicht und zeigt die Unterschiede zwischen Edelsteinen und Gold, und nimmt auch Bezug auf andere Investments wie Uhren, Whiskey, Oldtimer und mehr. Vom ersten Stein der ihn in den Bann gezogen hat, ein einfacher Rauchquarz - über seinen jetzigen Liebling den Blausaphir - Patrick gibt uns einen tiefen Einblick über seinen Werdegang Parallel zum Edelstein.   Wie entwickelt sich der Edelstein Markt? Wie passt ein Alternatives Realinvestment wie Edelsteine in ein klassisches Investitionsportfolio? Wie kann man verschiedene alternative Investments vergleichen? Welche Vorteile und Nachteile bieten die einzelnen Investments? und vieles mehr...   Diese Episode ist natürlich nur der Auftakt mit Patrick - in Zukunft gehen wir noch näher auf Themen wie Design eines Portfolios, Hot-Shot Steine und mehr ein...     Sie erreichen uns und unsere Gäste unter:   Patrick-Noël Herold-Gregor | LinkedIn Emanuel Stadler | LinkedIn The Natural Gem | Website podcast@thenaturalgem.com  

This is part 2 of our 2-part coverage. For episode 1, please see last week's episode!Can a building be evil? (Gillian: “NO, IT'S JUST A BUILDING!”). Can web sleuths solve a truly bizarre death? (Patrick: “NO! GET OFF FACEBOOK AND GO. OUT. SIDE.). And what exactly is a hotel general manager's job? (Patrick and Gillian: (“UNCLEAR!”)  Welcome to the Cecil Hotel—a once grand hotel which rotted from the inside and became a place where “dreams go to die” and “serial killers let their hair down.”Elisa Lam knew none of that, of course, when she checked in on  January 28, 2013. She went missing a few days later. And two weeks after that, out of desperation to find her, the LAPD released the now infamous “elevator video” of her which set the internet ablaze. Join us and the investigators and internet…sleuths?...as we all try to put together the pieces of her disappearance and death. And I promise, we land on an answer as to what happened to her.LOOKING FOR MORE TCO? On our Patreon feed, you'll find over 200 FULL BONUS episodes to BINGE RIGHT NOW! Including our episode-by-episode coverage of "Night Stalker" "The Jinx," "Making A Murderer," "The Staircase," "I'll Be Gone in the Dark," "A Wilderness of Error" "The Vow"  "Tiger King" "Don't F**K With Cats," "The Menendez Murders," "The Murder of Laci Peterson," "Casey Anthony: American Murder Mystery," "Serial," "Lorena," "The Disappearance of Madeleine McCann," "OJ: Made in America" and so many more! JOIN HERE!

FAM: This is a two-part series. Episode 2 is available right now and ad-free for 1 week only on our Patreon at all levels. Part 2 will be our regular episode next week!Can a building be evil? (Gillian: “NO, IT'S JUST A BUILDING!”). Can web sleuths solve a truly bizarre death? (Patrick: “NO! GET OFF FACEBOOK AND GO. OUT. SIDE.). And what exactly is a hotel general manager's job? (Patrick and Gillian: (“UNCLEAR!”)  Welcome to the Cecil Hotel—a once grand hotel which rotted from the inside and became a place where “dreams go to die” and “serial killers let their hair down.” Elisa Lam knew none of that, of course, when she checked in on  January 28, 2013. She went missing a few days later. And two weeks after that, out of desperation to find her, the LAPD released the now infamous “elevator video” of her which set the internet ablaze. Join us and the investigators and internet…sleuths?...as we all try to put together the pieces of her disappearance and death. And I promise, we land on an answer as to what happened to her. LOOKING FOR MORE TCO? On our Patreon feed, you'll find over 200 FULL BONUS episodes to BINGE RIGHT NOW! Including our episode-by-episode coverage of "Night Stalker" "The Jinx," "Making A Murderer," "The Staircase," "I'll Be Gone in the Dark," "A Wilderness of Error" "The Vow"  "Tiger King" "Don't F**K With Cats," "The Menendez Murders," "The Murder of Laci Peterson," "Casey Anthony: American Murder Mystery," "Serial," "Lorena," "The Disappearance of Madeleine McCann," "OJ: Made in America" and so many more! JOIN HERE!

About Patrick McFadinPatrick McFadin is the VP of Developer Relations at DataStax, where he leads a team devoted to making users of Apache Cassandra successful. He has also worked as Chief Evangelist for Apache Cassandra and consultant for DataStax, where he helped build some of the largest and exciting deployments in production. Previous to DataStax, he was Chief Architect at Hobsons and an Oracle DBA/Developer for over 15 years.Twitter: @PatrickMcFadinLinkedIn: Patrick McFadin DataStax website: datastax.comK8ssandra: k8ssandra.ioStargate: stargate.ioDataStax Astra: Cassandra-as-a-ServiceWatch this episode on YouTube: https://youtu.be/-BcIL3VlrjEThis episode sponsored by CBT Nuggets and Fauna.TranscriptJeremy: Hi everyone, I'm Jeremy Daly and this is Serverless Chats. Today I'm chatting with Patrick McFadin. Hey Patrick, thanks for joining me.Patrick: Hi Jeremy. How are you doing today?Jeremy: I am doing really well. So you are the VP of Developer Relations at DataStax, so I'd love it if you could tell the listeners a little bit about yourself and what DataStax is all about.Patrick: Sure. Well, I mean mostly I'm just a nerd with a cool job. I get to talk about technology a lot and work with technology. So DataStax, we're a company that was founded around Apache Cassandra, just supporting and making it awesome. And that's really where I came to the company. I've been working with Apache Cassandra for about 10 years now. I've been a part of the project as a contributor.But yeah, I mean mostly data infrastructure has been my life for most of my career. I did this in the dotcom era, back when it was really crazy when we had dozens of users. And when that washed out, I'm like, oh, then real scale started and during that period of time I worked a lot in just trying to scale infrastructure. It seems like that's been what I've been doing for like 30 years it seems like, 20 years, 20 years, I'm not that old. Yeah. But yeah, right now, I spend a lot of my time just working with developers on what's next in Kubernetes and I'm part of CNCF now, so yeah. I just can't to seem to stay in one place.Jeremy: Well, so I'm super interested in the work that DataStax is doing because I have had the pleasure/misfortune of managing a Cassandra ring for a start-up that I was at. And it was a very painful process, but once it was set up and it was running, it wasn't too, too bad. I mean, we always had some issues here and there, but this idea of taking a really good database, because Cassandra's great, it's an excellent data store, but managing it is a nightmare and finding people who can manage it is sort of a nightmare, and all that kind of stuff. And so this idea of taking these services and DataStax isn't the only one to do this, but to take these open-source services and turn them into these hosted solutions is pretty fantastic. So can you tell me a little bit more, though? What this shift is about? This moving away from hosting your own databases to using databases as a service?Patrick: Yeah. Well, you touched on something important. You want to take that power, I mean Cassandra was a database that was built in the scale world. It was built to solve a problem, but it was also built by engineers who really loved distributed computing, like myself, and it's funny you say like, "Oh, once I got it running, it was great," well, that's kind of the experience with most distributed databases, is it's hard to reason around having, "Oh, I have 100 mouths to feed now. And if one of them goes nuts, then I have to figure it out."But it's the power, that power, it's like stealing fire from the gods, right? It's like, "Oh, we could take the technology that Netflix and Apple and Facebook use and use it in our own stuff." But you got to pay the price, the gods demand their payment. And that's something that we've been really trying to tackle at DataStax for a couple of years now, actually three, which is how ... Because the era of running your own database is coming to an end. You should not run your own database. And my philosophy as a technologist is that proper, really important technology like your data layer should just fade into the background and it's just something you use, it's not something you have to reason through very much.There's lots of technology that's like that today. How many times have you ... When was the last time you managed your own memory in your code?Jeremy: Right. Right. Good point. I know.Patrick: Thank god, huh?Jeremy: Exactly.Patrick: Whew.Jeremy: But I think that you make a really good point, because you do have these larger companies like Facebook or whatever that are using these technologies and you mentioned data layers, which I don't think I've worked for a single company, I don't think I actually ... I founded a start-up one time and we built a data layer as well, because it's like, the complexity of understanding the transaction models and the routing, especially if you're doing things like sharding and all kinds of crazy stuff like that, hiding that complexity from your developers so that they can just say, "I need to get this piece of information," or, "I need to set this piece of information," is really powerful.But then you get stuck with these data layers that are bespoke and they're generally fragile and things like that, so how is that you can take data as a service and maybe get rid of some of that, I don't know, some of that liability I guess?Patrick: Yeah. It's funny because you were talking about sharding and things like that. These are things that we force on developers to reason through, and it's just cognitive load. I have an app to get out, and I have some business desire to get this application online, the last thing I need to worry about is my sharding algorithm. Jeremy, friends don't let friends shard.Jeremy: Right. That's right. That's a good point.Patrick: But yeah, I mean I think we actually have all the parts that we need and it's just about, this is closer than you think. Look at where we've already started going, and that is with APIs, using REST. Now GraphQL, which I think is deserving its hotness, is starting to bring together some things that are really important for this kind of world we want to live in. GraphQL is uni-fettering data and collecting and actual queries, it's a QL, and why they call it Graph, I have no idea. But it gives you this ability to have this more abstract layer.I think GraphQL will, here's a prediction is that it's going to be like the SQL of working with data services on the internet and for cloud-native applications. And so what does that mean? Well, that means I just have to know, well, I need some data and I don't really care what's underneath it. I don't care if I have this field indexed or anything like that. And that's pretty exciting to me because then we're writing apps at that point.Jeremy: Right. Yeah. And actually, that's one of the things I really like about GraphQL too is just this idea that it's almost like a universal data access layer in a sense because it does, you still have to know it, you have to know what you're requesting if you're an end developer, but it makes it easier to request the things that you need and have those mutations set and have some of those other things standardized across the company, but in a common format because isn't that another problem? Where it's like, I'm working with company A and I move to company B maybe and now company B is using a different technology and a different bespoke data layer and some of these other things.So, I think data as a service for one, maybe with GraphQL in front of it is a great way to have this alignment across companies, or I guess, just makes it easier for developers to switch and start developing right away when they move into a new company.Patrick: Yeah, and this is a concept I've been trying to push pretty hard and it's driven by some conversations I've had with some friends that they're engineering leaders and they have this common desire. We want to have a zero day dev, which is the first day that someone starts, they should be producing production code. And I don't think that's crazy talk, we can do this, but there's a lot of things that are in front of it. And the database is one of them. I think that's one of the first things you do when you show up at company X is like, "Okay, what database are you using? What flavor of SQL or GRPC or CQL, Cassandra query language? What's the data model? Quick, where's that big diagram on the wall with my ERD? I got to go look at that for a while."Jeremy: How poorly did you structure your Git repositories? Yeah.Patrick: Yeah, exactly. It's like all these things. And no, I would love to see a world where the most troublesome part of your first day is figuring out where the coffee and the bathroom are, and then the rest of it is just total, "Hey, I can do this. This is what I get paid to do."Jeremy: Right. Yeah. So that idea of zero day developer, I love that idea and I know other companies are trying to do that, but what enables that? Is it getting the idea of having to understand something bespoke? Is it getting that off of the table? Or not having to deal with the low-level database aspect of things? I mean because APIs, I had this conversation with Rob Sutter, actually, a couple weeks ago. And we were talking about the API economy and how everything is moving towards APIs. And even data, it was around data as well.So, is that the interface, you think, of the future that just says, "Look, trying to interface directly with a database or trying to work with some other layer of abstraction just doesn't make sense, let's just go straight from code right to the data, with a very simple API interface?"Patrick: Yeah, I think so. And it's this idea of data services because if you think of if you're doing React, or something like a front-end code, I don't want to have a driver. Drivers are a total impediment. It's like, driver hell can be difficult at large organizations, getting the matching right. Oh, we're using this database so you have to use this driver. And if you don't, you are now rejected at the gate. So it's using HTTP protocols, but it's also things like when you're using React or Angular, View, whatever you're using on the front-end, you have direct access.But most times what you're needing is just a collection or an object. And so just do a get, "I need this thing right now. I'm doing a pick list. I need your collection." I don't need a complicated setup and spend the first three days figuring out which driver I'm using and make sure my Gradle file is just perfect. Yeah. So, I think that's it.Jeremy: Yeah. No, I'd be curious how you feel about ORMs, or O-R-Ms, certainly for relational databases, I know a lot of people love them. I can't stand them. I think it adds a layer of abstraction and just more complexity where I just want access to the database. I want to write the query myself, and as soon as you start adding in all this extra stuff on top of it to try to make it easier, I don't know, it just seems to mess it up for me.Patrick: All right. So yeah, I think we have an accord. I am really not a fan of ORMs at all. And I mean this goes back to Hibernate. Everyone's like, "Oh, Hibernate's going to be the end of databases." No, it's not. Oh yeah, it was the end of the database at the other side because it would create these ridiculous queries. It's like, why is every query a full table scan?Jeremy: Exactly.Patrick: Because that's the way Hibernate wanted it. Yeah. I actually banned Hibernate at one company I was working at. I was Chief Architect there and I just said, "Don't ever put Hibernate in our production." Because I had more meetings about what it was doing wrong than what it was doing right.Jeremy: Right. Right. Yeah. No, that's sounds, yeah.Patrick: Is that a long answer? Like, no.Jeremy: No, I've had the same experience where certain ORMs you're just like, no. Certain things, you can't do this because it's going to one, I think it locks you in in a sense, I mean there's all kind of lock-in in the cloud, and if you're using a data service or an API or you're using something native in AWS, or IBM Cloud, you're still going to be locked in in some way, but I do feel like whenever you start going down that path of building custom things, or forcing developers to get really low level, that just builds up all kinds of tech debt, right? That you eventually are going to have to work down.Patrick: Well, it's organizational inertia. When you start getting into this, when you start using annotations in Hibernate where you're just cutting through all the layers and now you're way down in the weeds, try to move that. There's a couple of companies that I've worked with now that are looking at the true reality of portability in their data stores. Like, "Oh, we want to move from one to a different, from a key value to a document without developers knowing." Well, how do you get to that point?Jeremy: Right. Yeah.Patrick: And it's just, that's not giving access to those things, first of all, but this is that tech debt that's going to get in your way. We're really good, technologists, we're really good at just wracking up the charges on our tech debt credit card, especially whenever we're trying to get things out the door quickly. And I think that's actually one of the problems that we all face. I mean, I don't think I've ever talked to a developer who was ahead of schedule and didn't have somebody breathing down their neck.Jeremy: Very true.Patrick: You take shortcuts. You're like, "We've got to shift this code this week. Skip the annotations and go straight into the database and get the data you need." Or something. You start making trade-offs real fast.Jeremy: What can we hard code that will just get us past.Patrick: Yeah. Is it green? Shift it. Yeah.Jeremy: Yeah, no, I totally, totally agree. All right. So let's talk a little bit more about, I guess, skillsets and things like that. Because there are so many different databases out there. Cassandra is just one and if you're a developer working just at the driver level, I guess, with something like Cassandra, it's not horrible to work with. It's relatively easy once a lot of these things are set up for you.Same is true of MongoBD, or I mean, DynamoDB, or any of these other ones where the interface to it isn't overly difficult, but there's always some sort of something you want to build on top of it to make it a little bit easier. But I'm just curious, in terms of learning these different things and switching between organizations and so forth, there is a cognitive load going from saying, "I'm working on Cassandra," to going to saying, "I'm working on DynamoDB," or something like that. There's going to be a shift in understanding of how the data can be brought back, what the limitations are, just a whole bunch of things that you kind of have to think about. And that's not even including managing the actual thing. That's a whole other thing.So, hiring people, I guess, or hiring developers, how much do we want developers to know? Are you on board with me where it's like, I mean I like understanding how Cassandra works and I like understanding how DynamoDB works, and I like knowing the limits, but I also don't want to think about them when I'm writing code.Patrick: Yeah. Well, it's interesting because Cassandra, one of the things I really loved about Cassandra initially was just how it works. As a computer scientist, I was like, "This is really neat." I mean, my degree field is in distributed computing, so of course, I'm going to nerd out.Jeremy: There you go.Patrick: But that doesn't mean that it doesn't have mass appeal because it's doing the thing that people want. And I think that's going to be the challenge of any properly built service layer. I think I've mentioned to you before we started this, I work on a project called Stargate. And Stargate is a project that is meant to build a data layer on top of databases. And right now it's with Cassandra. And it's abstracting away some of the harder to understand or reason things.For instance, with distributed computing, we're trying to reduce the reliance on coordination. There is a great article about this by Pat Helland about how coordination is the last really expensive thing that we have in development. Memory, CPU, super cheap. I can rent that all day long. Coordination is really, really hard, and I don't expect a new programmer to understand, to reason through coordination problems. "Oh, yeah, the just in time race conditions," and things like that.And I think that's where distributed computing, it's super powerful, but then whenever people see what eventual consistency are, they freak out and they're like, "I just want my SQL Lite on my laptop. It's very safe." But that's not going to get you there. That's not a global database, it's not going to be able to take you to a billion users. Come on, don't cut ...Jeremy: Maybe you don't need to be.Patrick: ... your apps short Jeremy. You're going to have a billion users.Jeremy: You should strive for it, at least, is how I feel about it. So that's, I guess, the point I was trying to get to is that if the developers are the ones that you don't want learning some of this stuff, and there's ways to abstract it away again, going like we talked about data as a service and APIs and so forth. And I think that's where I would love to see things shifting. And as you said earlier, that's probably where things are going.But if you did want to run your own database cluster, and you wanted to do this on your own, I mean you have to hire people that know how to do this stuff. And the more I see the market heating up for this type of person, there is very, very few specialists out there that are probably available. So how would you even hire somebody to run your Cassandra ring? They probably all work at DataStax.Patrick: No, not all of them. There's a few that work at Target and FedEx, Apple, the biggest Cassandra users in the world. Huawei. We just found out lately that Huawei now has the biggest cluster on the planet. Yeah. They just showed up at ApacheCon and said, "Oh yeah, hold my beer." But I mean, you're right, it's a specialized skillset and one of the things we're doing at DataStax, we feel, yeah, you should just rent that. And so we have Astra, which is our database as a service.It's fully compatible with open-source Cassandra. If you don't like it, you can just take it over and use open-source. But we agree and we actually can run Cassandra cheaper than you can, and it's just because we can do it at scale. And right now Astra, the way we run it is truly serverless, you only pay for what you need, and that's something that we're bringing to the open-source side of Cassandra as well, but we're getting Cassandra closer to Kubernetes internally.So if you don't want to think about Kubernetes, if you don't want to think about all that stuff, you can just rent it from us, or you could just go use it in open-source, either way. But you're right. I mean, it should not be a 2020s skillset is, "Get better at running Cassandra." I think those days should be, leave it to, if you want to go work at DataStax and run Cassandra, great, we're hiring right now, you will love it. You don't have to. Yeah.Jeremy: So the idea of it being open-source, so again, I'm not a huge fan of this idea of vendor lock-in. I think if you want to run on AWS Lambda, yeah, most of what you can do can only run on AWS Lambda, but changing the compute, switching that over to Azure or switching that over to GCP or something like that, the compute itself is probably not that hard to move, right? I think especially depending on what you're doing, setting up an entire Kubernetes cluster just to run a few functions is probably not worth it. I mean, obviously, if you've got a much bigger implementation, that's a little different.But with data, data is just locked in. No matter where you go, it is very hard to move a lot of data. So even with the open-source flair that you have there, do you still see a worry about lock in from a data side?Patrick: Yeah. And it's becoming more of a concern with larger companies too, because options, #options. There was a pretty famous story a few years ago where the CEO of Target said, "I am not paying Amazon any more money," and they just picked up shop and moved from AWS to Google Cloud. And the CEO made a technical decision. It was like everybody downstream had to deal with that. And I think that luckily Target's a huge Cassandra shop and they were just like, "Okay, we'll just move it over there."But the thing is that you're right, I mean, and I love talking about this because back when cloud was first starting and I was talking about it and thinking about it, just what do the clouds promise you? Oh, you get commodity scale of CPU and network and storage. And that's what they want to sell you because that what they're building. Those big buildings in north Virginia, they are full of compute network and storage, but the thing they know they need to hook you in and the way that they're hooking you in, there's some services that are really handy, they're great, but really the hook is the data.Once you get into the database, the bespoke database for the cloud, one of the features of that database is it will not connect to any other database outside of that cloud, and they know that. I mean, and this is why I really strongly am starting to advocate this idea of this move towards data on Kubernetes is a way where open-source gets to take back the cloud. Because now we're deploying these virtual data centers and using open-source technology to create this portability. So we can use the compute network and storage, a Google, Amazon, Azure, OnPrem wherever, doesn't matter.But you need to think of like, "All right. How is that going to work?" And that's why we're like, "If you rent your Cassandra from DataStax with Astra, you can also use the open-source Cassandra as well." And if we aren't keeping you happy, you should feel totally fine with moving it to an open-source workload. And we're good with that. One way or the other, we would love for you to use a database that works for you.Jeremy: Right. And so this Stargate project that you're working on, is that the one that allows you to basically route to multiple databases?Patrick: That's the dream. Right now it just does Cassandra, but there's been some really interesting ... There's some folks coming out of the woodwork that really want to bring their database technology to Stargate. And that's what I'm encouraged by. It's an open-source project, Stargate.io, and you can contribute any of the connectors for underlying data store, but if we're using GraphQL, if you're using GRPC, if you're using REST, the underlying data store is really somewhat irrelevant in that case. You're just doing gets and puts, or gets and sets. Gets and puts, yeah, that's right. Gets, sets, puts, it's a lot of words.Jeremy: Whatever words. Yeah. Exactly.Patrick: That's what I love about standard, Jeremy, there's so many to pick from.Jeremy: Right, because there are ... Exactly, which standard do you choose? Yeah. So, because that's an interesting thing for me too, is just this idea of, I mean, it would be great to live in a perfect little cloud where you could say like, "Oh, well AWS has all the services I need. And I can just keep all my stuff there, whatever." But best of breed services, or again, the cost of hosting something in AWS maybe if you're hosting a Cassandra cluster there, versus maybe hosting it in GCP or maybe hosting it with you, you said you could host it cheaper than those could, or that we could host it ourselves.And so I do think that there is ... and again, we've had this conversation about multi-cloud and things like that where it's not about agnostic, it's not about being cloud agnostic, it's about using the best of breed for any service that you want to use. And APIs seem to be the way to get you there. So I love this idea of the Stargate project because it just seems like that's the way where it could be that standard across all these different clouds and onto all these different databases, well I mean, right now Cassandra, but eventually these other ones. I don't know, that seems like a pretty powerful project to me.Patrick: Well, the time has come. It's cloud native ... I work a lot with CNCF and cloud-native data is a kind of emerging topic. It's so emerging that I'm actually in the middle of writing a book, an O'Reilly book on it. So, yeah. Surprise. I just dropped it. This just in.Yeah, because I can see that this is going to be the future, but when we build cloud-native, cloud applications, cloud-native applications, we want scale, we want elasticity, and we want self-healing. Those are the three cloud-native things that we want. And that doesn't give us a whole lot ... So if I want to crank out a quick REACT app, that's what I'm going to use. And Netlify's a great example, or Vercel, they're creating this abstraction layer. But Netlify and Vercel are both working, they've been partnering with us on the Stargate project, because they're seeing like, "Okay, we want to have that very light touch, developers just come in and use it," in building cloud-native applications.And whenever you're building your application, you're just paying for what you use. And I think that's really key, not spinning up a bunch of infrastructure that you get a monthly bill for. And that bill can be expensive.Jeremy: It seems crazy. Doesn't it seem crazy nowadays? Actually provisioning an EC2 instance and paying for it to run even if it does nothing. That seems crazy to me.Patrick: There are start-ups around the idea of finding the instance that's running that's causing you money that you're not using.Jeremy: Which is crazy, isn't it? It's crazy. All right. So let's go a little bit more into standards, because you mentioned standards. So there are standards now for a lot of things, and again, GraphQL being a great example, I think. But also from a database perspective, looking at things like TSQL and developers come into an organization and they're familiar with MySQL, or they're familiar with PostgreSQL, whatever it is. Or maybe they're familiar with Cassandra or something like that, but I think most people, at least from what I've seen, have been very, very comfortable with the TSQL approach to getting data. So, how do you bring developers in and start teaching them or getting them to understand more of that NoSQL feel?Patrick: I think it's already happened, it's just the translation hasn't happened in a lot of minds. When you go to build an application, you're designing your application around the workflows your application's going to have. You're always thinking about like, "I click on this. I go there." I mean, this is where we wireframe out the application. At that point, your database is now involved and I don't think a lot of folks know that.It's like, at every point you need to put data or get data. And I think this is where we've taught could be anybody building applications, which makes it really difficult to be like, "No, no, no, start with your data domain first and build out all those models. And then you write your application to go against those models." And I'll tell you, I've been involved in a few of these application boot camps, like JavaScript boot camps and things, they don't go into data modeling. It's just not a part of it.Jeremy: Really?Patrick: And I think this is that thing where we have to acknowledge like, "Yeah, we don't really need that anymore as much, because we're just building applications." If I build a React app, and I have a form and I'm managing the authentication and I click a button and then I get a profile information, I just described every database interaction that I need and the objects that I need. And I'm going to put my user profile at some point, I'm going to click my ID and get that profile back as an object. Those are the interactions that I need. At no point did I say, "And then I'm going to write select from where." No, I just need to get that data.Jeremy: And I love thinking about data as objects anyways. It makes more sense, rather than rows of spreadsheets essentially that you join together, describing an object even if it's got nested data, like a document form or things like that, I think makes a ton of sense. But is SQL, is it still relevant do you think? I mean, in the world we're moving into? Should I be teaching my daughters how to write TSQL? Or would I be wasting my time?Patrick: Yeah. Well, yes and no. Depends on what your kid's doing. I think that SQL will go to where it originally started and where it will eventually end, which is in data engineering and data science. And I mean, I still use SQL every once in a while, Bigtable, that sort of thing, for exploring my data. I mean for an analytics career or reporting data and things like that, SQL is very expressive. I don't see any reason to change that. But this is a guy who's been writing SQL for a million years.But I mean, that world is still really moving. I mean, like a Presto and Snowflake and all these, Redshift, they all use Bigtable, they all use SQL to express the reporting capabilities. But ... And I think this is how you and I got sucked into this is like, well that was the database that we had, so we started using reporting languages to build applications. And how'd that work out?Jeremy: Yeah. Well, it certainly didn't scale very well, I can tell you that, going back to sharding, because that is always something that was very hard to do. So I guess, I get the point that essentially if you're going to be in the data sciences and you actually need to analyze that data and maybe you do need to do joins, or maybe you need to work with big data in a way, that's a specialized aspect of it and I think people could dabble in that if they were just regular developers and they didn't want to go too deep.But it sounds like the bigger, or the end goal here, maybe altruistic, is to just give people access to data. So even if they don't know SQL or they don't know something complex, just make it so that whatever data is there that anybody, with whatever level is, they can consume it.Patrick: Yeah. And move fast with the thing that you're building. Actually, I use a Facebook term, but Facebook does do this. Internally there's a system called Occhio that provides gets and puts for your data, but it abstracts things like geographics and things like that. But the companies that are trying to move quickly, they understood this a long time ago. If you have to reason through, "Am I doing a full table scan? Is that an efficient interjoin?" If you have to reason through that, you're not moving fast anymore.Jeremy: Right. Right. All right. Cool. All right, so let's talk about Astra a little bit more and this whole idea of, because Astra is the serverless version, the hosted version, the serverless version of Cassandra, right? Through DataStax?Patrick: Right. And ...Jeremy: Did I get that right?Patrick: You got it right. And so it gives you full access. You could do Port 9042 if you still want to use a driver, but it gives you access via GraphQL, REST, and there's also a document API. So if you just want to persist your JavaScript API or JavaScript and then pull it back out your JSON, it does full documents. So it emulates what a MongoDB or DocumenDB does. But the important thing, and this is the somewhat revolutionary side of this, and again, this is something that we're looking to put into open-source, is the serverless nature of it.You only pay for what you use. And when you want to create a Cassandra database, we don't even call it a Cassandra database on the Astra panel anymore. We just create a database. You give it a name. You click. And it's ready. And it will scale infinitely. As long as we can find some compute and network for you to use somewhere, it'll just keep scaling and that's kind of that true portion of serverless that we're really trying to make happen. And for me, that's exciting because finally, all that power that I feel like I've been hoarding for a long time is now available for so many more people.And then if you do a million writes per second for 10 minutes and then you turn it off, you only pay for that little short amount of time. And it scales back. You're not paying a persistent charge forever.Jeremy: I'm just curious from a technical implementation, because I'm thinking about PTSD or nightmares back of my days running Cassandra, and so I'm just trying to think how this works. Is it a shared tenancy model? Or is there a way to do single tenancy if you wanted that as a service?Patrick: Under the covers, yes, it is multi-tenant, but the way that we are created ... so we had to do some really interesting engineering inside. So my RCO's going to kill me if I talk about this, but hey, you know what, Jeremy? We're friends, we can do this. He's like, "Don't talk about the underlying architecture." I'm talking about the underlying architecture. The thing that we did was we took Cassandra and we decomposed it into microservices mostly. That's probably, it's still Cassandra, it's just how we run it makes it way more amenable to doing multi-tenant and scale in that fashion where the queries are separated from the storage and things that are running in the background, like if you're familiar with Cassandra because it's a log structure storage, you ask to do compactions and things like that, all that's just kind of on the side. It doesn't impact your query.But it gives us the ability to, if you create a database and all of a sudden you just hammer it with a million writes per second, there's enough infrastructure in total to cover it. And then we'll spin up more in the back to cover everything else. And then whenever you're done, we retract it back. That's how we keep our costs down. But then the storage side is separated and away from the compute side, and the storage side can scale its own way as well.And so whenever you need to store a petabyte of Cassandra data, you're just storing, you're just charged for the petabyte of storage on disk, not the thousandth of a cluster that you just created. Yeah.Jeremy: No. I love that. Thank you for explaining that though, because that is, every time I talk to somebody who's building a database or running some complex thing for a database, there's always magic. Somebody has to build some magic to make it actually work the way everyone hopes it would work. And so if anybody is listening to this and is like, "Ah, I'm just getting ready to spin up our own Cassandra ring," just think about these things because these are the really hard problems that are great to have a team of people working on that can solve this specific problem for you and abstract all of that crap away.Patrick: Yeah. Well, I mean it goes back to the Dynamo paper, and how distributed databases work, but it requires that they have a certain baseline. And they're all working together in some way. And Cassandra is a share-nothing architecture. I mean you don't have a leader note or anything like that. But like I said, because that data is spread out, you could have these little intermittent problems that you don't want to have to think about. Just leave that to somebody else. Somebody else has got a Grafana dashboard that's freaking out. Let them deal with it. But you can route around those problems really easily.Jeremy: Yeah. No, that's amazing. All right. So a couple more technical questions, because I'm always curious how some of these things work. So if somebody signs up and they set up this database and they want to connect to it, you mentioned you could use the driver, you mentioned you can use GraphQL or the REST API, or the Document API. What's the authentication method look like for that?Patrick: Yeah. So, it's a pretty standard thing with tokens. You create your access tokens, so when you create the database, you define the way that you access it with the token, and then whenever you connect to it, if you're using JavaScript, there's a couple of collection libraries that just have that as one of the environment variables.And so it's pretty standard for connecting the cloud databases now where you have your authentication token. And you can revoke that token at any time. So for instance, if you mistakenly commit that into your Git ...Jeremy: Say GitHub. We've never done that before.Patrick: No judging. You can revoke it immediately. But it also gives you our back, the controls over it's a read or write or admin, if you need to create new tables and that sort of thing. You can give that level of access to whatever that token is. So, very simple model, but then at that point, you're just interacting through a REST call or using any of the HTTP protocols or SQL protocol.Jeremy: And now, can you create multiple tokens with different levels of permission or is it all just token gives you full access?Patrick: No, it's multiple levels of protection and actually that's probably the best way to do it, for instance, if your CI/CD system, has the ability to, it should be able to create databases and tear them down, right? That would be a good use for that, but if you have, for instance, a very basic application, you just want it to be able to read and write. You don't want to change any of the underlying data structures.Jeremy: Right. Right.Patrick: That's a good layer of control, and so you can have all these layers going on one single database. But you can even have read-only access too, for ... I think that's something that's becoming more and more common now that there's reporting systems that are on the side.Jeremy: Right. Right. Good.Patrick: No, you can only read from the database.Jeremy: And what about data backups or exporting data or anything like that?Patrick: Yeah, we have a pretty rudimentary backup now, and we will probably, we're working on some more sophisticated versions of it. Data backup in Cassandra is pretty simple because it's all based on snapshots because if you know Cassandra the database, the data you write is immutable and that's a great way to start when you come to backup data. But yeah, we have a rudimentary backup system now where you have to, if you need to restore your data, you need to put in a ticket to have it restored at a certain point.I don't personally like that as much. I like the self-service model, and that's what we're working towards. And with more granularity, because with snapshots you can do things like snapshot, this is one of the things that we're working on, is doing like a snapshot of your production database and restoring it into a QA cluster. So, works for my house, oh, try it again. Yeah.Jeremy: That's awesome. No, so this is amazing. And I love this idea of just taking that pain of managing a database away from you. I love the idea of just make it simple to access the data. Don't create these complex things where people have to build more, and if people want to build a data access layer, the data access layer should maybe just be enforcing a model or something like that, and not having to figure out if you're on this shard, we route you to this particular port, or whatever. All that stuff is just insane, so yeah, I mean maybe go back to kind of the idea of this whole episode here, which is just, stop using databases. Start using these data services because they're so much easier to use. I mean, I'm sure there's concerns for some people, especially when you get to larger companies and you have all the compliance and things like that. I'm sure Astra and DataStax has all the compliance things and things like that. But yeah, just any final words, advice to people who might still be thinking databases are a good idea?Patrick: Well, I have an old 6502 on a breadboard, which I love to play with. It doesn't make it relevant. I'm sorry. That was a little catty, wasn't it?Jeremy: A little bit, but point well taken. I totally get what you're saying.Patrick: I mean, I think that it's, what do we do with the next generation? And this is one of the things, this will be the thought that I leave us with is, it's incumbent on a generation of engineers and programmers to make the next generation's job easier, right? We should always make it easier. So this is our chance. If you're currently working with database technology, this is your chance to not put that pain on the next generation, the people that will go past where you are. And so, this is how we move forward as a group.Jeremy: Yeah. Love it. Okay. Well Patrick, thank you so much for sharing all this and telling us about DataStax and Astra. So if people want to find out more about you or they want to find out more about Astra and DataStax, how do they do that?Patrick: All right. Well, plenty of ways at www.datastax.com and astra.datastax.com if you just want the good stuff. Cut the marketing, go to the good stuff, astra.datastax.com. You can find me on LinkedIn, Patrick McFadin. And I'm everywhere. If you want to connect with me on LinkedIn or on Twitter, I love connecting with folks and finding out what you're working on, so please feel free. I get more messages now on LinkedIn than anything, and it's great.Jeremy: Yeah. It's been picking up a lot. I know. It's kind of crazy. Linked in has really picked up. It's ...Patrick: I'm good with it. Yeah.Jeremy: Yeah. It's ...Patrick: I'm really good with it.Jeremy: It's a little bit better format maybe. So you also have, we mentioned the Stargate project, so that's just Stargate.io. We didn't talk about the K8ssandra project. Is that how you say that?Patrick: Yeah, the K8ssandra project.Jeremy: K8ssandra? Is that how you say it?Patrick: K8ssandra. Isn't that a cute name?Jeremy: It's K-8-S-S-A-N-D-R-A.io.Patrick: Right.Jeremy: What's that again? That's the idea of moving Cassandra onto Kubernetes, right?Patrick: Yeah. It's not Cassandra on Kubernetes, it's Cassandra in Kubernetes.Jeremy: In Kubernetes. Oh.Patrick: So it's like in concert and working with how Kubernetes works. Yes. So it's using Cassandra as your default data store for Kubernetes. It's a very, actually it's another one of the projects that's just taking off. KubeCon was last week from where we're recording now, or two weeks ago, and it was just a huge hit because again, it's like, "Kubernetes makes my infrastructure to run easier, and Cassandra is hard, put those together. Hey, I like this idea."Jeremy: Awesome.Patrick: So, yeah.Jeremy: Cool. All right. Well, if anybody wants to find out about that stuff, I will put all of these links in the show notes. Thanks again, Patrick. Really appreciate it.Patrick: Great. Thanks, Jeremy.

Brands are facing fierce competition in this ever-evolving ecommerce landscape. More often than not, shoppers do a general product search on Google or Amazon, where hundreds, if not thousands, of brands fight for the sale. It’s a hard arena to win in, and every company is trying to find shortcuts and strategies to give them an edge.You’ve probably seen some of those strategies — for example, the products with a bunch of random SEO words jammed into the title so that the item appears higher in search. There are plenty more wacky Amazon tricks of the trade that brands have tried. Goal Zero is one of those brands trying to figure out the secret sauce but approaching it in a much different manner. Patrick Keller, Head of Marketing and Ecommerce at Goal Zero, may have finally solved the mystery — but the answer is not what you might be expecting.On this episode of Up Next in Commerce, Patrick tells us that there are a few key strategies to unlocking more conversions on Amazon, and how they view authenticity and increasing brand awareness.TLDR: it takes great messaging, some big bets, and a lot of long-term thinking. Oh, and some pretty cool products, too. Hear all the details on this episode! Main Takeaways:Always Be Iterating: Producing marketing material is not a cut-and-dry process. Define your target market, set KPIs, and establish a timeline, then create a system that lends itself to AB testing and iteration. Don’t be afraid to create assets and then break them into pieces to test in different ways. You’ll learn more about your customers and the market in general that way, which you can then expand on when you embark on larger campaigns.Dream Big: Taking bigger advertising risks with a long tail is often a good way to get more bang for your buck. By investing in large-scale projects with a cinematic quality, you have more of a chance to use that content for much longer and build brand awareness with a larger audience that might miss a one-off campaign.Consider This: Figuring out a way to bypass the consideration phase on Amazon is one of the big challenges facing brands today. Because of the amount of options Amazon shoppers are presented with, companies that might have converted easily on their own site are losing out on Amazon. Whether through influencers or targeted campaigns, building brand awareness and loyalty is one of the methods brands are using to start bypassing that consideration phase and actually convert more.For an in-depth look at this episode, check out the full transcript below. Quotes have been edited for clarity and length.---Up Next in Commerce is brought to you by Salesforce Commerce Cloud. Respond quickly to changing customer needs with flexible Ecommerce connected to marketing, sales, and service. Deliver intelligent commerce experiences your customers can trust, across every channel. Together, we’re ready for what’s next in commerce. Learn more at salesforce.com/commerce---Transcript:Stephanie:Hi, everyone, and welcome back to Up Next in Commerce. I'm your host, Stephanie Postles, CEO over here at Mission.org. Today on the show we have Patrick Keller, Head of marketing and ecommerce at Goal Zero. Patrick, welcome to the show.Patrick:Hey, thanks for having me. It's fantastic to be here.Stephanie:I'm excited to have you on. I think I needed Goal Zero back in the snowstorm in Austin. So I'm in Austin, I forgot to tell you that. But we did not have power. We were struggling over here, and I did not have any products that I apparently needed. Now I went to Goal Zero's website, and I realized, this is all I needed. I just didn't know about it.Patrick:That's it. That's it.Stephanie:I'd love to start there. What is Goal Zero?Patrick:Yeah, exactly. Goal Zero makes portable power. It ranges from small portable power to use to back up your phone all the way to really massive energy storage that you can use to run key segments of your home for days. We play in that portable power. It's all battery based, so it's clean, renewable and really easy to use. That's it in a nutshell.Stephanie:Yeah. It also looks nice. I mean, I saw in some of the product pictures it's on your counter. You have this huge battery power portable battery station. I'm like, "Okay, I would have that around because it's not a big, huge thing like other energy sources," at least like backup generators and whatnot that I know my parents used to suggest that I get back in the day.Patrick:Yeah, no. It's new technology, but exactly right. I mean, I think that's one of our differentiators, and our industrial design is something we're proud of and we spent a lot of time working on.Stephanie:Yeah. That's great. Before we dive more into Goal Zero, I was hoping we could walk through your background a bit. Because I've seen you have had an interesting ecommerce journey, and I'd love to hear where you started and where you've been.Patrick:Oh, man. I hope we don't take up the whole interview with my background because it wasn't a straight shot, that's for sure. I left college with a marketing degree and became a fly fishing guide and then followed my passions to a company called Orvis based out of Vermont, where my first role was really analyzing the performance of catalogs. Now, do we give pants more square inches? Do we give shirts less? This product needs to be more heavily promoted. This was back in 2005, 2006, when ecom was still in its infancy. It was a lot of educational resource. Yeah, we should have a website, but we don't really know exactly what to do with it.Patrick:My next role really was, well geez, you're doing a good job of building the overall conversion rate on our catalogs. Can you do that with our website? So we started building out the early days of web merchandising. Can we promote products and boost and bury and use common metrics like sales per page view to actually drive a significant improvement in website conversion? Honestly, it was a huge success. That was big.Patrick:That led to eventually me taking a side step into catalog, and I managed the Orvis catalog business for a few years as well as their email. That was really good at understanding customer segmentation, how to go through and parse lists, how to find demographic overlays and psychographic overlays and just really use customer data to make sure your catalog was mailed to the right people and the right message was delivered. That set me up really well for a foray into digital advertising. How can we make sure that our digital ads are as focused as our catalog ads? Ran the digital advertising for Orvis for a few years.Patrick:Then I'm from Utah originally, and I wanted to move back out West to the Wasatch. So I took a job with Sundance catalog. Same thing, grew their whole ecom business and then eventually Goal Zero approached me after about four years at Sundance and said, "You want to come work for this scrappy startup down in Utah?" I said, "Yeah, let's give it a shot." It was absolutely awesome. It's been just a rollercoaster of a ride, and Goal Zero has in the last five years, has 4Xed their revenue, so really explosive growth and really fun.Stephanie:That's really fun. What does your best day in the office look like at Goal Zero? What are you doing these days versus when you first joined this scrappy startup?Patrick:Yeah. Well, I mean we're a lot bigger, so we have more resources and we're doing a lot of different techniques that we're just... We couldn't even imagine these types of techniques four years ago, mass media, television, some of those things that we're stepping into. A good day at Goal Zero we still like to be outside, like to be active people. So a couple of us will go and do a backcountry ski in the morning, come down to the office, have some meetings, talk strategy, talk about how we're going to deliver messages, who we're going to target, what's the best way to convey a message about this somewhat nascent product and category. And then finish it off with maybe a beer after work and call it a day.Stephanie:Man, this is the life. I need to come over and join you guys for-Patrick:It's not bad. I'm telling you, we have a lot of fun.Stephanie:... banging beers.Patrick:Yeah. We have a lot of fun.Stephanie:That's awesome. How does it differ? I mean you're at Orvis. I mean, I think they've been around for like 150 years or something.Patrick:Exactly right.Stephanie:Okay. You're selling a fun, leisurely fly fishing type products and all that, then moving to a utility product where you feel like you don't really need it until you need it, like my Austin experience. Did you have to shift your mindset to selling a product like that?Patrick:You know what that hardest part is, is everyone knows what a fly rod is. Everyone knows what a pair of khaki pants is. There's no explanation. You start at a certain just understanding and then you talk about benefits. With a portable power station, very few people in the US know what a portable power station is, so you actually have to start a step back and say, "Let me introduce you to something you have never heard about, and then let me convince you why you need this anywhere from $400 to $5,000 thing in your home."Patrick:It's a much longer burn and really, it's a lot more complicated in how we educate customers. It doesn't start with oh, do I buy an Apple iPhone or a Google Pixel? It's just not that simple. You have to say, "Hey, let me make you aware of this thing and that this thing exists and then walk you down the funnel for just a long consideration?" A few people will buy who have done research offline or through other various means will buy the day they come to the site. Most of them, it's a 90-plus day transaction.Stephanie:Wow.Patrick:We'll see a slow burn for 90 days and then a lot of conversions.Stephanie:What are you doing in those 90 days to bring them down the funnel? What do those tactics look like behind the scenes? Because I'm even thinking of me, me trying to explain the product at the very beginning. I'm like, I don't even know what you would call it and how do you even explain this, because it's just not something that I'm even used to buying and talking about. So I'd be interested to hear, what does that look like behind the scenes for you?Patrick:Yeah. We break it into two parts. There is the before you've come to the website, and that could be PR. That could be trade shows. That could be television, radio, podcasts, a variety of ways where we're just trying to say, "Here's something that could be really beneficial to you and your family and just all the things you like to do. Come to goalzero.com.Patrick:Once they've come to goalzero.com, then we can open up a whole host of opportunities of how do we get educational messaging? How do we do differentiation between us and our competitors? How do we do differentiation between us and gas generators? We'll spend a lot of time reviewing our website saying, "I'm not sure this is the best way to talk about home energy storage. Let's change that up." We'll put you through and try to get you to sign up for emails. We'll do a bend and browse. We'll do a marketing display. We'll try to find you on Amazon. We'll try to find you in retail stores and say, "Hey, if you want to actually see this thing in person, check out our retail finder."Patrick:We use a company called Locally, which actually does an inventory feed to us so that we know now what do they carry at Goal Zero in a blanket statement, but we know that this product specifically is in stock at this store at this time. So we can drive customers to go see it in person and give them a chance to touch, feel, pick it up, explore it a little bit before they transact.Stephanie:Yeah. That's really interesting. In talking about top of funnel, you're saying you guys are trying everything, like TV, mass media, podcasts. What are you exploring there and how do you view things like TV versus podcasting, which everyone is seeming to try and lean into that now? What are you guys seeing on that front?Patrick:Yeah. It's funny, we're definitely stepping our toes into it. We're not doing anything full scale national wise yet. I think the first one we're doing is probably a national podcast. Last year in 2020 we did a lot of TV commercials. We said, "Let's start with something that seems to have a high level of success, so there was two areas. Number one is California with the power shutdowns, right? Any time the winds get over 20 miles an hour, Northern California shuts the grid down to prevent fires.Stephanie:Oh, I know. I lived through that.Patrick:Yeah, exactly.Stephanie:I moved to Austin, and then a snowstorm hit. I'm like, "What the heck?"Patrick:Exactly right, right? We said, "Geez, if it's going to work, it's going to work in California first. Let's try that." So we did a really kind of cool TV commercial. We spent a lot of time walking customers through the versatility and just showcasing this product and saying, "Come to... " Then we hit them up with immediately social media messaging. We had a custom landing page where they could come to and just really say, "Chances are, you've never heard of this. Let me just explain and walk you through all the benefits this product provides."Patrick:We got them to sign up for emails. We were able to hit them with display. Then we mirrored some of that over on Amazon as well saying, "What we're doing at goalzero.com, should people choose to shop on Amazon because it's easy and convenient, let's make sure that a lot of that content is transferred over there as well." We also did the Gulf Coast, so Houston all the way down the Miami. We targeted a lot of TV ads there as well. It was a record year for storms, for things like tropical storms and hurricanes, and so we wanted to make sure that this is the people who are highly aware of power outages. Their power was out for a good portion of weeks on end in some cases for a good portion of the summer.Patrick:We targeted those two areas, and we had very specific metrics all the way through. Some of it was how much traffic are we going to drive to the website? Based on that traffic, what does the conversion rate and the AOV need to be in order for us to hit our sales goals? We worked closely with other agencies to say, "As we're planning this out, do you think we can drive this much traffic? What are the reasons or what do we need to do differently? What is the call to action?" Then we did a lot of AB testing.Patrick:We would have the full 30 second commercial, and then we'd cut that down into 10 and 15 second shorts that we can do a lot of YouTube and digital advertising with. We'd have five different variations that we could just go through and say, "This one seems to be driving the most traffic to the site. This one seems to have a higher conversion rate. Let's blend these two together and target those."Patrick:Long story, I think that it was a really cool experience. We learned a ton and I think the results were promising enough that we're excited to continue to push into broader audiences and more and more mainstream.Stephanie:Yeah. That's a really cool test. How did you think about attribution from TV, whereas YouTube, very easy running your 15 second clips on there, but did you have a certain CTA on the ads on TV to be able to go somewhere, or how did you think about tracking that? And what did that ROI look like versus just something anyone could get into, like a YouTube or yeah, direct advertising?Patrick:Yeah. We did a lot of it in just comparison saying, "Here's the geographic DMAs these things are running in. How does that compare to areas where it's not running? Do we see a lift over time?" And then just measure that. I'll give you an example. We took a look and said, "During the time these ads were running, what was the daily average traffic to goalzero.com from California?" Right? We said, "Oh, we saw a 300% increase." What was it on non-target DMAs? Oh, it was flat. We're down five. We can get some just basic looks at saying, yeah, it appears to have driven high levels of traffic.Patrick:From there, we went through and said, "How many of those people came specifically to our landing page that we had set up," which used power landing page. That was a good indicator of whether they were just randomly coming or were specifically coming because of this. In the case of the Gulf Coast campaign, it was nice because even within a specific state, there were some DMAs that got it and some that didn't. California was all of California. You had to make a few more assumptions about yeah, this appears to have really increased traffic over the control group.Patrick:But with the Gulf Coast we could say, "Well, geez. We hit Houston, but we didn't hit Austin. What are the differences between there?" We hit Houston but not San Antonio. So we could go through these specific DMAs and see lifts. It was a rudimentary kind of AB test that we learned a lot from.Stephanie:Yeah. That's great. What was your favorite campaign that you guys ran? Because I could see some really fun, creative ways to sell Goal Zero. So what kinds of things did you guys experiment with, or any fun campaigns that you're like, this is a good one?Patrick:No. I came from a highly analytical background, so when I took over the creative team, I was always like, "Well, we got to put numbers behind it, and we need to... " And that learning to embrace my creative side has been really cool. We ran a campaign for our 10-year anniversary called Ode to the Road where we went on a two-week road trip and stopped at all these cool places and produced a lot of really cool content. It was this traveling video blog, and we could follow along as you went. It was so much fun. I mean, you have to watch it.Patrick:It's just really cool people, really engaging content, and just again, it goes back to showing the versatility of what we can do and what our products could power. It's things like we set up Dometic fridges full of cold beer and ice cream in the middle of the Pacific Crest Trail. So people would be coming out of the desert after these long, arduous miles and they'd say, "Do you want ice cream? Do you want a cold beer?" It was like, "Oh my God, trail angels!" It was just fun, cool stuff. We had a massive outdoor dinner on the coast in Santa Barbara, and the entire thing, the grills, everything was powered by Goal Zero. Yeah, it's creative, cool, engaging content. It's a lot of fun.Stephanie:Wow. Yeah, that sounds really cool. I mean, that also just makes me think branded content, and it could be full on series, Netflix series is the way of the future. I mean we've heard from so many guests that organic and natural is definitely the way to sell nowadays, but also having your product integrated in a way that doesn't feel salesy. To me, branded content like that seems like the way of the future. Have you guys thought about exploring that even more? I mean, which also goes back to the whole companies turning into media companies and thinking that way now going forward. How are you thinking about that for the next couple years?Patrick:Yeah. Well, I think a lot of it is we're listening closely to the voice of the customer, right? One of the things I really like about Goal Zero and I really like about my job is it's just, there's surprises around every corner. Right? You'll hear these stories about, "Hey, I used Goal Zero to power this obscure, weird thing," that you just never even thought of. Suddenly, you hear that there's a ton of people doing this and you can start building campaigns and start building content around that.Patrick:One of the things we like to do is we'll run periodically a how do you Yeti. Yetis are portable power stations, it's been called. You get these great stories back of people being like, "You know what? I use it to power my insulin pump when I'm outside. Normally, it's prohibited. I can't be more than a couple of hours away from an outlet because I need the power for my insulin pump working. Now I can go backpacking."Patrick:We had a story on that Ode to the Road. A man was powering his prosthetic limb with some of our products to hike the Pacific Crest Trail. So I think you're right. I think there is a ton of stories that we look at and say, "How can we tell a story that aligns with our core values, that aligns with us as a brand, and then softly references some of our products in the background?"Patrick:It's mostly a question of is it authentic and is it engaging? And is it engaging to a mass of people? If we can answer those questions and then we can say, it has a loose tie to a specific product or to a group of Goal Zero products, then yeah, we're looking at producing higher quality content, more cinematic style content that we can then use on TV, we can use in a variety of ways. Then at a larger scale, we always partner with cinematic expeditions. So a lot of our ambassadors will go out and say, "We're climbing Everest. We need to power all of our RED cameras and power our drones and power all of the backup storage." Our stuff does that, and so we'll sponsor that movie or that Nat Geo episode or whatever.Stephanie:Yeah. I mean, I think that's also just much longer term thinking than quick hit campaigns and always having to think about adjusting ad units every single day and ad fatigue. I feel like sponsoring or creating content like that will have longer ROIs and could be relevant if you have them shot in an evergreen way for years to come, which I think is why it's such an exciting angle to be thinking that way.Patrick:I think for us, what we always look at is brand and category awareness. It's one of those things going back to what we discussed earlier, which is nobody knows what a portable power station is. It is a really long burn to get somebody to understand it, identify that they need it, and then pull the trigger on a very expensive item. We do, we go back and just realize that part of that brand building, part of that awareness is just, it's critical. We have a product that when people get it and they're like, "I need this," yeah, it clicks. But we have to continually get that word out there through really engaging, authentic content.Stephanie:Yep. Did you have to make any quick pivots when the pandemic hit? Because I could see in person, like you're mentioning, touching it, being able to pick it up, see how light or not light it is would be an important part of the sales process. Did you have to pivot to a different strategy when people could not as easily go in stores and maybe even now are still reluctant to go out and see it in person?Patrick:We saw a massive shift to online, for sure. Our partners were selling predominantly online. Our goalzero.com and Amazon increased dramatically. I think the biggest shift we had to make was just the unexpected surge in business. We didn't plan for 100% growth as a result of COVID, so our inventory was an issue. Kudos to our supply chain team. They were pulling in orders and doing whatever we could to actually get enough inventory to support it, and even then, we still ran out for periods of time, long periods of time.Patrick:I think that was probably the biggest thing we faced was it wasn't a lack of interest or people weren't willing to buy online. It was yeah, they easily transitioned and then we just managing inventory, managing expectations, how do we alert people that we're back in stock? Those are all things that we had to deal with as well as just managing growth internally as an organization.Stephanie:Yep. Did you have to change anything substantially around your inventory management and the logistics and the backend that now are completely different than what they were maybe a year ago?Patrick:Yeah. I think that we set up an allocation meeting between all the departments and just said, "Here's how we're going to look at this and make sure that we're trying to service all of our wholesale partners, make sure we're servicing our utility partners, make sure that when people come to goalzero.com, they can use Locally to find product or hopefully be able to buy it there as well."Patrick:I wouldn't say that it was a massive shift in how we did things, but it was a lot more focused. We would have meetings twice a week with the executive team specifically on that topic of are we servicing our customers to the best of our possible ability? I think that was just the amount of time spent, it used to be a monthly meeting, and now it was two times a week. So really, more than anything it was just the focus was always on, when's our next shipment coming? When will it arrive? When can we start selling it? When can we get this out to our wholesale partner? I mean those were very common conversations.Stephanie:Yeah. That definitely seems hard, especially when you're growing as quickly as you all were, to try and scramble. But I also think that now customers seem to be okay with things, inventory, maybe not having something in stock as long as it says it's going to be in stock this date. And you can buy it now and I'll ship when it's ready. It just seems like that messaging maybe was missing before all this where it's like, if I have clear expectations and I know when I could get it, I'm fine if it's not in stock right now. But a lot of times you would just try and order something a year ago and it just wouldn't be there and you wouldn't know why. And is it coming back? It was just kind of like a black box.Patrick:Yeah. We stubbed our toe a bit on customer service side of things. So Goal Zero, we measure NPS religious. It's just something that we really hold near and dear. We have best-in-class NPS. The last few years we've averaged about 70, which is Costco, Apple, in essence, leading NPS levels. A big portion of that is our solution center. People can call in, ask questions. And just the inundation of calls, it was taking half an hour to answer the phone. So having to rapidly staff up as well as just implement new technology, the ability to have customers leave their number and we would call them back when they finally met their queue.Stephanie:And changing...Patrick:Changing the verbiage on the website saying, hey, our call center's completely swamped. Can we chat with you here? Can we answer you in an email? There was just a whole bunch of things that we had to implement very quickly and very effectively because just the unexpected volume that came through was a bit shocking.Stephanie:Yeah. I mean that's cool to think about how you guys pivoted, though, to just send customer service requests in different directions depending on where the resources were strapped at, which I think a lot of companies still need to do that or even just a simple, "Let me call you back," type thing, as long as you call back.Stephanie:Now that you're out of scramble mode, what are some of your favorite things that you're testing out right now? It can be around the website. It can be around logistics. What are you most excited about where I think this could have big results on conversions on reducing the 90-day sales funnel, but we're not sure yet?Patrick:Oh, totally. Yeah. I think there is endless opportunity. I think it's not a matter of opportunity, it's how we prioritize it. What is the biggest bang for the buck? We're actually in the process of re-platforming right now as we speak. Patrick:I think the thought process there is we have the ability to... We're currently in a lockstep environment, so we have to outsource all of our dev work. It's just, it's slow. I think we want to be a lot faster, a lot more nimble, and the ability to go through our funnel and make sure that we are converting at the best possible rate is a key strategy for 2021. Right now we have a group of executives, my ecom director, and some of my senior staff all focused on how do we explain our home energy storage, right? Because, it's complicated.Patrick:I think, Stephanie, you said, "I was in Austin. I could've used your stuff." But if you would've come to the site, you would've been like, "Geez, there is 40 things I can choose from here. What's the right one for me?"Stephanie:Yep.Patrick:The questions we get all the time are, "What will it power and for how long?" On a singular item, that's easy. Oh, this will charge your cellphone three times. This will run your full-size fridge for a week. But when you start putting in mixes, hey, I want to run my fridge. I want to run my kitchen lights. I want to run my ceiling fan. There's all these circuits you can wire in or hard wire into your home. Now you start complicating things and making a very complex process.Patrick:So we'll go through that process of saying, here's all the things that a conservative user can power for how long and this is the kit for you, all the way to hey, if you want to just live high on the hog with power usage and not conserve at all, yeah, here's the kit for you. There's various myriad of things in between. It's a complex, complicated conversation that is very easy in store. It is very easy at a trade show. It's really hard online, and so we spend a lot of time thinking about how to best say that.Stephanie:Yeah. I mean, it brings me back to my Google days trying to think about how to explain how much storage people need on phones or what that looks like and talking more technical terms of how much storage you need. No one knows you need this many gigabytes, this many. Who the heck knows?Patrick:Totally.Stephanie:Versus you could say, "This'll hold 20,000 pictures and all the podcasts you could ever download," or whatever you want. That's when you're like, "Oh, okay. I'll just choose that," or I don't need that much. And putting it in more layman's terms or just pictures, I can imagine you just being like, "Steph, you can power your whole house if it's under this square feet and you have this many appliances and you're good."Patrick:That's it.Stephanie:I'm like, "Okay, great." I just want to just know that and nothing too technical.Patrick:That is absolutely it. On the flip side, there is absolutely people who want to get crazy in the weeds. Some of our engineers, because we bring them into the conversation, they're like, "Oh, this is not enough data. I need to know exactly the watts and the amps and the voltages." They're dissecting everything. Then there's me, who shows up, to your point, I'm like, "Just tell me what to buy. I want it and we're good to go." So we have to find that balance of providing both customer types, both shoppers the experience they're looking for.Stephanie:Yep. You're just like, "Will this run my kegerator?"Patrick:That's it, yeah. After I get done skiing, will my beer be cold?Stephanie:Yeah. That's all I need. That's all I need in life. That's cool. Are there any other big things like that that you're also focusing on other than the messaging? Which I think a lot of brands struggle with that, especially as they approach something more technical or when they're trying to... We've heard a lot of them talk about the difference between selling your mission and selling your product. How do you think about that and all that, so it's definitely a theme that I've heard. But is there anything else that you guys are working on that you're excited about?Patrick:Yeah. We've got a couple big initiatives. I think the next one is looking at how we target potential customers and really getting deep into the not just demographic but psychographic conversation. Our current customers I think we have a really good understanding of. And our ability to target them, to message them, to find out how and where they're shopping, why they buy our products, I think we do a reasonably good job of.Patrick:People who are not in our current sphere but are absolutely looking for our product, we got to get better at saying, how do we speak to these people who may not be on social media? They may not be Amazon customers. How do we find them, engage with them, speak to them? That's a big push for us and something that we're spending a lot of time on. Some of the other things we're looking at is, again, expanding our mass media campaign, doubling down there, continuing to push TV, podcasts, radio, billboards, just getting on a broader level again all through this kind of brand awareness.Patrick:Then lastly, we're coming out with a new content series, to your point. Super high-end cinematographic-type shooting and camera work and really robust, engaging stories that we're excited to share with our customers.Stephanie:How do you think about selling on Amazon? Because to me, people who are on there, they get a much different experience versus going on your website, they can go through all the video series and really get in with your brand and go from start to finish in probably a better way than when you're on Amazon. And you're clicking around and browsing, and you've got competing products all around you. How do you approach those two different platforms?Patrick:Yeah. That's a recent discussion for us. Historically, Amazon is always an afterthought like, hey, we're just going to throw our things up there and people who want to shop on Amazon could shop on Amazon. If they want to buy from Goal Zero, that's where they're going to find the rich content. That's where they're going to find all the great stories and the great videos. We're going to send them to retail stores where they've got experts. So Amazon was like, yeah, we'll put it up there. And for the people who want to just type in Goal Zero, buy our product, we're there.Patrick:We went and did a sizing exercise, and we said, "What is the size of the power station market on Amazon?" It's grown tremendously, significantly. We said, "Well, we got to start playing here meaningfully." So this year, specifically, we're doing a lot of work around top of funnel. Can we look at attracting customers and making them aware who are starting their shopping process on Amazon? Normally, what we're saying is, "Start it via TV, PR, trade shows, goalzero.com, and then eventually come and transact on Amazon."Patrick:We're saying, "We want to actually find people who their very first search for backup power or home resiliency is on Amazon." Attracting those people and then working them down the funnel, I think that we're a premium product. Amazon is a marketplace that really stresses on lower cost value products. So what we've seen is we're really good at driving the traffic and we're really good at converting the traffic. Where we get stuck is in that middle phase, consideration phase, where people are like, "Well, geez. There's 25 different power stations I can look at." And we convert some of them, but some of them get spun off into competitors.Patrick:I think one of the things we're looking at is saying, how do we actually take that middle consideration phase and almost eliminate it? Can we bring people back from Amazon to goalzero.com, where they learn without all the noise of the marketplace, the myriad of ads, and have them really get the full Goal Zero experience, see our differentiators, see why we as a brand have succeeded, and then bring them back to Amazon to convert.Patrick:I think that in conversations with Amazon and just around, I think that's one of the things that premium brands struggle with across the board is geez, we're really good. Our content's good enough to capture them. Then people who see the premium differentiators are going to buy. It's that consideration phase where just you lose a lot in the shuffle. That's our focus is make them Goal Zero diehards before they actually are ready to convert on Amazon.Stephanie:Yep. It does seem like Amazon's also changing when it comes to customer expectations of going there and being ready to buy more expensive products. I mean, I do think back in the day, like you said, you would just go there and just be like, "I just want the cheapest commodity type good. It's probably on Amazon." And now I mean Amazon's selling high-end furniture and live plants that are really expensive.Patrick:Totally.Stephanie:It seems like they're shifting their customers. They're adapting to their needs and being ready to sell higher end things, which to your point, is maybe a great place to start when it comes to getting the people right where they start searching in there and then targeting them afterwards to get them to convert in either place maybe, as long as they just don't lose sight of why they were looking for, potentially, your product to begin with.Patrick:Yeah, no. I agree. I think Amazon is making a concerted effort to not always be the budget brand or the value brand. I think that from my own personal experience and just talking to consumers, sometimes you get burned on Amazon. You'll go and you'll buy a product because it's the cheapest, and it's a knockoff or it doesn't work, or there's no instructions, or there's no customer services. It's just a poor experience.Patrick:I think Amazon is recognizing that and saying, let's make sure that it's not only price that's driving the flywheel, that service and that credibility and that it's going to be right the first time is there. Because they're super focused on customer service, and these bad experiences are bad for them and bad for the other brands on the marketplace. Yeah, we've had that engagement and that conversation with Amazon, and they seem like they're willing to help us as a premium brand reach our goals.Stephanie:Yep. Yeah. I think when talking about credibility, to me user-generated content is a big part of that, of being able to go on Amazon or on your website or social, literally wherever you are, seeing someone who looks like yourself maybe or reminds you of your situation. And being able to see them having that product is exactly what is needed, especially for a product that's maybe harder to sell, that's more technical.Stephanie:If I saw someone like me, single mom, three kids, living her best life, but then needs something like that, I'm like, "If it's good enough for her, it's good enough for me." I think that's the way of... Amazon, I think, is trying to head in that direction, but I still think needs more help when it comes to encouraging people to continue to post their organic photos in a way that's going to help your brand sell.Patrick:Yeah, no. I agree. We've just started dabbling into driving traffic to Amazon with influencers, right? Normally, we drive them to goalzero.com, again, going back to the fact that we just have a much better experience on goalzero.com than we do on Amazon. But if we can take people who have big followings of trusting people that say, hey, this is why I use Goal Zero, this is how I use Goal Zero. There's videos, there's content. It's real.Patrick:They're actually using it and then we drive the transaction to Amazon. That seemed to be a good way to bypass that consideration phase, like get them adapted in saying, yep, I'm absolutely buying Goal Zero because it reflects my core values, because it aligns with who I am as an individual, absolutely.Stephanie:Yep. Have you seen higher conversions or did you do any split testing between having an influencer drive to your site versus to Amazon? And did you just see higher conversions on Amazon, I guess, because that's a platform that everyone recognizes, you trust the shipping on there? Is that what you saw, or did you see something different?Patrick:No. The campaign is actually just starting, and so the early read is yes, we are seeing that we can effectively drive consumers at a less expensive rate to Amazon. They're going to convert at a higher level than what we've seen in the past. We're not doing an A/B test per se, but if our conversion was X percent, it's now gone up by three or four or five points.Stephanie:Yep. Yeah, okay. Very cool. Then how do you think about interacting with your customer if they came from Amazon versus if they came from your website and they are much more knowledgeable already about your brand and your mission? Do you approach those customers in different ways?Patrick:Yeah. That's a good question. I think that we definitely approach customers in an educational standpoint, meaning if you know exactly what you want, you're a lifelong Goal Zero fan, we're not going to talk to you and force you through this funnel of education and learning about the brand and all our differentiators. We're going to fast track you right to the buy box. But absolutely, we've increased the number of videos. We've increased a lot of our A-plus content, and we're actually going through and just really talking about our differentiators.Patrick:I think one of the things that we got caught up in was trying to play the Amazon game, right? As premium brand, we'd be like, "Well, let's keyword stuff our titles, and let's try to figure out how we're going to drive thousands of reviews," and all these things that you just felt you had to do on Amazon. We took a step back and said, "All of the stuff we do for goalzero.com is going to absolutely work on Amazon. We just have to do it the same way. We have to be ourselves and be authentic to our brand."Patrick:We stopped talking about keyword stuffing and started talking about hey, we're designed in the USA. Our offices are in Salt Lake City. We give back 5% of our profits to humanitarian efforts. Come check out our social impact and what we stand for as good citizens and stewards. We started talking about who we are, why we're premium, what we are and what makes us different from the rest of the competition, specifically on these budget brands on Amazon. And we're starting to see improvements to...Patrick:I think more than anything, I think just we're getting back to doing what we know how to do, which is really good marketing and just applying that really good marketing to Amazon versus trying to be like, "Let's say it completely different and be this whole and weird alter ego on Amazon," and just getting back to our roots. I think I'm proud and I'm happy of where we're heading.Stephanie:Yeah. That's a really good reminder, too. Yeah, get back to your roots and not get caught up in the frenzy of the platform. I mean yeah, I'm thinking about the certain listings on Amazon with the titles of so many keywords, and you're like, "Wait, is this the newest iPhone cover or not? I don't need to see every single iPhone that's ever existed since 2000." Yeah.Patrick:Totally.Stephanie:A good reminder for anyone, large or small companies, to stay grounded and focused on what your goals are and not get caught up in the platform.Patrick:Yeah. And it's easy. You're like, "It's Amazon." It's going to make or break you. What we found is Amazon, fortunately for us, Amazon has always been a small channel for us. It's never been a primary channel. Our wholesale, our utility, our goalzero.com are all significantly larger. The ability to come back to center on that is easier than if you are an Amazon brand and 90% of your revenue is flowing through there. I can imagine it's a very different conversation, but my recommendation is absolutely, stay true to your brand and do the things that got you there in the first place.Stephanie:Yeah, I love that. All right, let's shift over to the lightning round. The lightning round is brought to you by Salesforce Commerce Cloud. This is where I ask a question and you have a minute or less to answer. Are you read, Patrick?Patrick:I hope so.Stephanie:All right. What's the nicest thing anyone's ever done for you?Patrick:The nicest thing anyone ever did to me was early in my career I got a bit of advice that has helped me throughout my entire journey. It was the CEO at Orvis, and he said to me, "Success is easy when people want you to succeed." I've built my entire career around that saying, how do I add value to myself, to the organization, to everyone around me in a way that makes a lot of people's lives easier, makes people lives better? If I can do that, then yeah, success just comes naturally. That bit of advice has stuck with me for 20 years, and I still, I think about it daily.Stephanie:Okay, that's a good one. I like that answer. I'm going to start thinking about that too in my daily walks of life. No, that's great. What's one thing that you believe around ecommerce that many wouldn't agree with you on? It can be a trend. It can be something you're bullish on right now. Maybe you get pushback from your current CEO.Patrick:Yeah. Yeah, no. I don't know if a lot of people disagree with me, but I think there's a tendency to have a hard time differentiating between common practices and best practices. For me, a common practice is something that everybody does and it's just easy to say, "Oh, we should do that too. We should absolutely have an email signup box when the popup the second you come to the homepage." I hate those comments. I always say, "No, let's test it, make sure it's right for us." Sometimes they are and sometimes they're not. I think that making it a best practice means it has to be for you and your business and your company and the ability to differentiate is really critical to success.Patrick:Secondly, I would say there is no magic bullet. Success in ecommerce is a ton of elbow grease. It's a constant hustle and just always working a little bit harder and a little bit better. Because there's no technology, there's no new platform, there's no new nothing that's just going to solve all your financial troubles. It's elbow grease.Stephanie:Yep. Yeah, that's great. If you were to have a podcast, what would it be about and who would your first guest be?Patrick:If I were to have a podcast, it'd probably be something outdoors, skiing, fishing, whitewater rafting. Let's see. Yeah, I think my very first guest would probably be Steve Rinella, and we would talk about hunting. I think we would go and talk about the nuances of it. Not the harvesting of animals per se, but the higher level just headiness of it, like how you be able to get out there and become a true conservationist, to truly explore nature in a way that's just so much more intimate than going for a hike with your dog. It's a really cool experience, and I would love to just pick his thought on it because he aligns with me.Stephanie:That's great. I know nothing about hunting or any of that, so I would for sure listen to that episode. What's up next on your Netflix queue?Patrick:Oh, geez. I'm probably way late to the game, but we've been watching two shows. I think the first one is Outlander. It's like this woman travels through time in Scotland and it's a cool story. Then the other one is just more comic relief because it reminds me of my big Irish family. It's called Derry Girls.Stephanie:Okay. I have not checked out that one yet. That's great. All right. Then the last one, what one thing will have the biggest impact on ecommerce in the next year?Patrick:In the next year or long term? I think-Stephanie:In a year.Patrick:In the next year. In the next year, I think just the shift... The aftereffects of COVID are continually forcing customers who were brick and mortar to jump into the ecommerce space. I think that's going to drive competition. It's going to drive awareness. It's going to elevate the whole ecommerce world. I think that it's going to be a big push, and I think that we're going to see people realizing that you have to be on ecommerce. You can no longer be solely a brick and mortar. Now, you can do both, but I think that's going to be the biggest thing we see in 2021 is just the continued rapid growth of ecommerce as a whole.Stephanie:Great. Patrick, thanks so much for hopping on the show with me and spilling all your secrets. It's been really fun. Where can people find out more about you and Goal Zero?Patrick:Yeah. Go to goalzero.com. I have a bio on my management page, and you can also find me on LinkedIn. Yeah, I think that's the best way. Thank you for having me. This has been fantastic, and I really enjoyed the chat. Hopefully, we can, post-COVID, go skiing and have a beer.Stephanie:I hope so. I would be so down for that. I need that in my life right now. Thanks so much.Patrick:All right, thank you.

Tobie Bureau-Huot de Rouge et Patrick Noël de Énergie vous partagent et font découvrir leurs mythes et légendes à connaître en Estrie. On parle notamment du Cercle de Pierres de Stanstead, êtes-vous prêt?

After a little break the Mouth Breathers are back and OH BOY do they have some funny stories to share! In this episode we talk about our month long break, proper undone zipper etiquette, European accents in film, absurd sandwich shops and being stoned in front of animals. OF COURSE there is so much more than that so come on and give us a listen! We are back baby and it feels great! POD-ON Y'all!! 

Tobie Bureau-Huot de Rouge et Patrick Noël de Énergie vous partagent leurs coups de cœur café, boulangerie et resto déjeuner en Estrie, ils vous mettront l'eau à la bouche!

In episode three of the new podcast, Path to Well-Being in Law, co-hosts Chris Newbold and Bree Buchanan check in with lawyer well-being pioneer Patrick Krill.  Recognized globally as a leading authority on addiction, mental health, and well-being in the legal profession, Patrick is an attorney and a licensed, board-certified alcohol and drug counselor.  He serves as a trusted advisor to large law firms and corporate legal departments throughout North America and Europe, educating them about and helping them navigate addiction, mental health, and well-being issues on a daily basis. Patrick's groundbreaking work in the area of attorney behavioral health includes: initiating and serving as lead author of the first and only national study on the prevalence of attorney addiction and mental health problems, a joint undertaking of the American Bar Association Commission on Lawyer Assistance Programs and the Hazelden Betty Ford Foundation; creating the framework for the ABA Well-Being Pledge, an innovative campaign to improve the health and well-being of lawyers that was launched in September, 2018; partnering with American Lawyer Media to conduct the first-ever survey of AmLaw 200 firm leaders regarding their beliefs and attitudes related to addiction and mental health problems in the legal industry. Transcript:CHRIS NEWBOLD:                     Welcome to the Path to Lawyer Well-Being Podcast, where we talk to cool people doing awesome work in the lawyer well-being space. My name is Chris Newbold and I'm joined by my cohost, Bree Buchanan.BREE BUCHANAN:                     Hi, everybody.CHRIS:                    We are again, super excited about the opportunity to have one of the pioneers in the lawyer well-being space join us today as our guest, Patrick Krill. Patrick is somebody who really has been influential in his work on the science side to the lay the foundation for what has become a vibrant movement and a discussion in the legal profession about the current state of lawyer well-being. So let me kick it to Brie to introduce Patrick and get us going on our question.BREE:Thanks, Chris. Yeah, I think we really are so honored to have Patrick here today. I have a little disclosure. Patrick and I work together, he's my boss with Krill Strategies, but everything I say, none of this I'm saying to just flatter you, Patrick. All of it is absolutely true.PATRICK KRILL:                Oh, great.BREE:Absolutely, but some of the words that come to my mind. Chris has already tapped on it, pioneer. A pioneer in the research around substance abuse and mental health issues in the legal profession because it was Patrick's fabulous research that was published in 2016 that really kicked all of this off. We're going to talk about that research a little bit and also talk about what he's been doing since then, in regards to updating and expanding upon that research.He's also what I think of as a true thought leader and sometimes I tease him of being our guru around these issues in the legal profession because he spends all of his time reading, researching, talking to others. Really is, truly is a thought leader on this. He's authored over 70 articles, including [inaudible 00:02:13], CNN, been in the New York Times, the Wall Street Journal, and on NPR. So we really are very lucky to have Patrick today.So Patrick, thanks for being here.PATRICK:Thank you, Bree, and thank you, Chris. It's a pleasure to be with you both.BREE:So I'm going to start off with a question that we're really trying to ask everybody that comes on the podcast, for us to get an idea a little bit about the person themselves. So what brought you to the lawyer well-being movement? So what in your life really drives your passion for this work?PATRICK:Yeah, so it's a great question and I think to really answer that meaningfully, I have to go back to before my work in the lawyer well-being space, and to really talk a little bit about my career trajectory generally.I was an attorney, I was someone who went to law school, and then as I was getting ready to wrap up law school, made the decision to go for a further degree to get an LOM in international law. I approached the legal profession with a lot of enthusiasm and with a lot of plans about the type of law that I wanted to practice. Then what I was met with was a reality that was very discordant with what I had expected. I'm a first generation lawyer in my family, I didn't have a lot of experience with or exposure to what being a lawyer actually meant. So I had all these preconceptions.Then I got into the field and while it was fine, it was pretty clear to me right off the bat that once I got out of the academic, once I got out of the classroom setting and stopped studying about law and had to do the work, it really wasn't a good fit for me. I didn't particularly enjoy it. The idea of billing my time in six minute increments really was, I just couldn't do it. It was [crosstalk 00:04:11] water, in terms of my personality, but none the less, I did practice law for a number of years and I worked in a number of different roles. Started coming to the realization that this wasn't longterm sustainable for me. It didn't get my out of bed in the morning. Right?BREE:Right.PATRICK:           A question we always ask people is, what gets you out of bed in the morning? It wasn't being an attorney, despite my best intentions, really. I'm fascinated by the law and I still think about and read about the law all the time, but the mechanics of practicing law weren't for me.I also had my own experience overcoming addiction really early out of the gate. In the first couple of years of the legal profession, my practice I should say. So I had exposure to and experience with what it takes to overcome a behavioral health problem. That experience and that exposure to that world introduced me to this idea of counseling. So I knew what a mental health counselor was, I knew what an addiction counselor was.So when it came time for me to reevaluate and think, do I want to do this longterm? I knew that there was a field that seemed a little bit more interesting to me, it seemed a little bit more aligned with my personality and intrinsically who I am. So I went back to school to become an addiction counselor. That ultimately translated into my work with lawyers specifically. I became the director a treatment program for lawyers, judges, and law students at the Hazelden Betty Ford Foundation. So it's a long rambling answer but I think you have to understand the bigger picture view-BREE:Absolutely, yeah.PATRICK:... how I even got into the mental health space, let alone the lawyer specific mental health space.BREE:Right, well thanks for sharing that. I mean there typically is a personal story that brings us to this work. I think that what you just said, Patrick, about really not having the best vocational fit once you get into it and start seeing what it's like day to day. I hear that as a common refrain from lawyers who are really struggling. So yeah, thanks.Listen, I want to get you to share a little bit about the lawyer study that was done, now four years ago, that you did. I think you started while you were still director of the legal professionals program at Hazelden. That has proved to be the basis for really, the lawyer well-being movement. So I'm wondering, what do you think is the most important information that came out of that study now that you can look back over the past four years?PATRICK:It's hard to say. I have a hard time identifying one thing or even two things as being the most important takeaways from that study. I think the most important result, excuse me, result of that study has been its overall impact to the extent to which it raised awareness about the nature and the scope of the challenges we face. It provided much needed data to back what a lot of us who were working in the lawyer mental health space in a clinical or other capacity knew. We knew lawyers were unwell and were struggling disproportionately to other populations, but we didn't really have good data to back up our argument. So this study provided that and it really opened the door to a much needed and overdue conversation around mental health and well-being in the legal profession. So I think it was really more the impact than any one precise piece of the study.I will say, one of the things that surprised me the most was that it was younger lawyers who were the most depressed and struggling with or exhibiting the most signs of problem drinking. The drinking piece you can get, right?BREE:Mm-hmm (affirmative).PATRICK:Think about [crosstalk 00:08:11], people drink excessively, and it doesn't have as much of an impact on them. But we were surprised about the mental health piece as well. Simply because that wasn't the profile who was showing up in treatment programs or going to the Lawyers Assistance Program or who was getting disbarred because of their mental health or substance use problem. So we went into that research with a preconceived notion of who the most at-risk population was.CHRIS:                  Patrick, how much of that was, do you think, driven by the expectations gap between... it's the same type of expectations gap that you had, which was, this is what I thought the law was going to be like, this is what the law was actually like. How that's affecting, I think, the most recent generation of graduates coming out of law school.PATRICK:Yeah, it's such a great point, Chris. I think that's a profound problem. I think you have a lot of people coming out of law school and finding themselves adrift in a profession that doesn't potentially resonate with them. That it is more overwhelming than they had anticipated, assuming they're able to get a job. Right?CHRIS:                  Yeah.PATRICK:          Get a job that meets their needs and provides some opportunity, but then they get into it and they say, "Wow, this is not what I signed up for," or, and this is, I think, I'm putting the spotlight a little bit on the law school experience. It's not what they were prepared for. So there are these mismatched expectations and what that can result in, I think you're right. I mean, I think what you're getting at is, does that play into the high levels of distress among young lawyers? How could it not? I mean, how could it not? If I had done a survey 20 years ago when I was coming into the professional, I would've been scoring off the chart on all of those assessments.CHRIS:Yeah, I mean you can see a scenario where you go down a path you feel like you're too far down that path, that it's probably more rare for someone to make a pivot like you did to say, "This isn't for me, I'm going to go and pursue my studies in an area that then interconnects the behavioral health side with the law side." We know how much student debt and other factors play into the-PATRICK:                No doubt.CHRIS:[crosstalk 00:10:28] of... how do I get out of this? Then that spirals into a set of conditions that just generally move toward more unhealthy-ness for that particular community.PATRICK:Yup, I agree. I'm sure Bree has some thoughts about that as well with her background in vocational discernment. How do we bridge that gap? How do we make some progress there, because we need to. I don't know if it's modifying law school curricula or just more truth in advertising around what the legal profession is. I don't know.BREE:It makes me think about Larry Krieger's research, what makes lawyers happy. The idea of even thinking about, it's the extrinsic things, the power, the prestige, et cetera, that draws us to the practice of law but what we know now that what makes us happy are more internal factors of meaning. That's just not made known to people who are contemplating going to law school or people that are there. It's something you have to trip over and fall down to figure out. Yeah, yeah.CHRIS:Patrick, I think it's fair to say that the lawyer well-being movement likely doesn't get ignited without the study itself because we are ultimately an evidentiary based profession. We needed the data, I think, to ultimately launch the discussion. Talk to us about that notion of how important that was to kick start the national discussion. Obviously, followed by the report subsequent to that, but how important was to lay the foundation.PATRICK:           I think it was incredibly important. I think you're right, we wouldn't be where we are with this movement had we not had that predicate of the data, and had that not been something that caught the profession's attention.In addition to the data and the value of that itself, it was also a multi jurisdictional study. So we had 16, 17, 18 different bar associations from around the country participating in this survey. Participating in this research, recognizing the value. So you saw some seeds of the interest being planted there where you had all these [inaudible 00:12:52] stakeholders, but you also had... this goes back to my overarching strategy when I was conceptualizing this study, you had the ABA and Hazelden Betty Ford, two large stakeholders with a lot of credibility in their respective spheres, coming together to conduct this research. I think that was an important piece of the puzzle. This wasn't something that could just be ignored. You have all these bar associations from around the country participating, you have the ABA, you have Hazelden Betty Ford, putting their names behind this project. I think that allowed it to get the attention that it did, and to really open the door for this conversation.Something I'd be really interested in hearing both of your perspectives on is looking back on it. I have a sense that in a way we were almost pushing on an open door. What I mean by that is, there was an appetite to have this discussion. People knew that there was a problem but it was under the surface and there wasn't an easy way to bring this up or there weren't a lot of pathways into this conversation, but then once you got that ball rolling, people were basically acknowledging, yeah, we've got issues here. Finally, can we talk about this? At least that's my perspective looking back over the last five years.BREE:Yeah, and I think that societally outside of law, more and more people were talking about these issues. So law, a conservative industry, comes up last, but then you have younger people who are coming in and onboarding into the legal profession and there's just not the stigma around these issues about depression, anxiety, or even a substance abuse problem, that there used to be. So you're starting to get a shift, and I think once we got that data, it opened up the door which as you're saying was already open.Then the other thing that I found going around the country talking, inevitably, people who have been practicing law even for just a little bit, know someone who has taken his or her own life. Once that has crossed your path, it really shapes you. It's not something that you forget about. We always want to know, well, what could've been done differently? So I think that this is a manifestation of that too.PATRICK:Yeah, and at the risk of... I don't want to dominate the conversation but I do want to say something to both of you, share something with you that hasn't really received a lot of discussion because it wasn't published. With that study where we had 15,000 responses, there was the opportunity for people to submit comments at the end. There was basically like, do you have comments? We compiled all of those and I have binder of them sitting on my bookshelf. We weren't able to publish them, the format didn't lend itself to that but we had thousands and thousands of comments, overwhelmingly they reflected a theme of, this is a huge problem in the profession. We're glad you're conducting this research. Maybe that's where I began to develop this notion that people want to have this conversation, people recognize that people around them are not well. That people around them are struggling, and they feel like they're in a profession that's tone deaf to it. But overwhelmingly, that's what the comments reflected. People saying this is a big deal.BREE:Wow.PATRICK:This is a needed endeavor.BREE:Yeah, so I know that that research was so important but there were other questions that you wanted to ask. So could you tell us a little bit about the most current research you're involved in?PATRICK:Yeah, I'm actually really excited about this. Along with a colleague at the University of Minnesota Medical School, I designed a new survey that we administered to lawyers in California and the DC bar. So we partnered with the California Lawyers Association and the DC Bar to conduct new research, bi-coastal research. I had a couple of aims for this project. One, we did want it to be a random sample, so it would meet that gold standard for research. The 2016 study, while I feel very certain that those numbers were represented of what was happening in the profession, it wasn't a truly random sample. So it didn't meet that gold standard for data. So I did want to have a random sample, but I also wanted to explore the why. Not just prevalence, not how many lawyers are meeting criteria for depression or a substance abuse disorder, but why. To ask questions that could get at lawyer motivation, lawyer personality. Then look at those responses in relationship to their mental health.So we were originally supposed to launch that research project right around the time, and I mean what a year we're all in. So right around the time when the pandemic was hitting. The survey was supposed to go out, I think, the same week that California announced stay at home orders. So obviously the California Lawyers Association said, "We need to pause," and we agreed with that. What that gave us the opportunity to do was to revamp the survey and to modify some questions to actually measure the impact of COVID-19 and quarantines and all of that on lawyer mental health. It was ultimately disseminated, we finished data collection about a month ago and we're analyzing the data, getting ready to write up the manuscript.Basically what I can tell you, I can't talk about the data in any precise way at this point prior to publication, but what I can tell you is that the problems are real, there was nothing anomalous about that 2016 study. In some respects, they appear to be getting worse. Also, the impact of COVID-19 has been material. It's been real, I mean, people are feeling this as it relates to their mental health and their substance use. Beyond that though, we're going to have some really interesting insights to share about the why piece. Why are lawyers so likely to experience depression, for example.So I'm really excited about it, really grateful to the DC Bar and California Lawyers Association. They helped us get a big data set, we had really robust participation and a random sample. So it'll be useful, useful data for the profession.BREE:Do you have a sense of when it might be published?PATRICK:Yeah, well that's that million dollar question. Our goal is to have it submitted to a journal by the end of September. Then it's that sort of, out of your hands. It's journal's own publication schedule. Best case scenario it'll be published in December, but that could easily go into January of next year, February. I mean, just given all of the delays that everything seems to be experiencing and all the uncertainty, but we're moving pretty expeditiously. We're moving about as quickly as you can with a study of this size and nature.CHRIS:Patrick, how much do you think that the research side of well-being is important to the discussion, because we really don't have a lot of good... I mean we have research, we have some groundbreaking studies. We had yours, we had the law student one, we have your followup here, but it still seems like there's a lack of emphasis on the research side as we think about the well-being movement. I'd just love for your insights into, what's the next generation of research as you think on the horizon?PATRICK:Yeah, I think personally, research is a very important piece of the puzzle. That's not just because I'm involved in it, it's because you have to understand the dimensions of the challenges that you're trying to address. You can't just be spit balling about what's going on.We're also a profession that's trained weigh and evaluate evidence. Lawyers are prone to scrutinize things and want to know, is that backed by data? Is that science driven? So I think if you want to persuade people that there needs to be a change you have to back up your argument, in addition to people like us being able to understand the nature of the challenges. So I think it's vitally important.In terms of next generation or ongoing, I think further exploration of what causes the problems, which is probably going to be further exploration of the lawyer personality, beyond really important work like Krieger and Sheldon's work and other research that exists. We need to understand that a little bit better. I think we also really need to get at the disconnect that we started by talking about. That expectation gap or the mismatched expectations between what people think they're getting with a career in the law, and what they end up getting because that's got to be a big piece of the equation as to why many people find themselves, to put is charitably, less than satisfied.CHRIS:Yeah, and if we have a profession of folks who are less than satisfied, that doesn't bode well to the profession generally.PATRICK:No, right, exactly.CHRIS:Let's pivot real quickly before we take a break. I'd love to hear your perspective. Each one of us comes at this from a different angle, the well-being. Bree obviously originating from the lawyer assistance programming side. I spend a lot of time thinking about small firms and solo practitioners and preventing malpractice claims. A lot of your focus professionally has been on big law. More than anybody else, you probably have your finger on the pulse of how big law is adapting to the new emphasis on well-being. I'd just love to hear your perspectives one what you're seeing out there. Do you think big law is paying attention, because oftentimes I think big law, if they embrace it it has a trickle down effect to the totality of the profession. So I'd love to hear your perspective on big law and the interconnectedness to well-being.PATRICK:Yeah, so it's an important area of discussion. I think you're right that often, big law does have the ability to set the pace. They're almost like the pace card for the profession, who have an outsize influence on the profession despite the fact that they employ a minority of practicing lawyers.I would say if you compare where we were four years ago, big law has made a lot of progress. It started with this overdue recognition and acknowledgement that this is a real problem. We have an issue that we need to get our arms around. Five years ago, there was profound and widespread institutional denial of the scope of the problem. Maybe if it wasn't denied, it was simply a lack of awareness. You can characterize it however you want, but the reality is that these issues were not being dealt with in a deliberate way. They weren't even really being acknowledge, despite the fact that it tends to be a pressure cooker environment. It tends to be one of the most intense professional environments out there.Now what you have is widespread acknowledgement that these problems are real. Widespread acknowledgement that their competitors are taking steps to try and [inaudible 00:24:32] the problems or at least mitigate the problems. So there's momentum, there's real momentum that has developed.All of that said, there's a fundamental tension between the business model of big law, which again, tends to be really high expectations, a pressure cooker environment, a lot of billable requirements and other demands. There's a tension between that model and being able to take care of yourself the way that you might want to, and having any sense of balance in your life. So I think to try and resolve that tension is going to continue to necessitate incremental efforts that are sustained over time. It's not going to be an overnight fix. It's going to take a long time.That said, many firms are making a good faith effort. They're trying, they're trying to bridge that gap incrementally where they can. One of the problems with incremental progress, especially in an environment where so many people are not satisfied, is that it takes patience. So you have some people in those environments or some people, external to big law, commenting on big law saying, "This is all window dressing. All of these changes that they're making don't really get at the heart of the matter." But the reality is you have to start somewhere and you have to start taking steps. As long as those steps, like I said, are sustained and they continue to move in the right direction over time. I think the model can be adjusted to the point where people experience greater levels of personal well-being. To some degree, that's already happening.BREE:Yeah, and now that all three of us are being coauthors of a task force report, we can remember all the thought that went into how we make a good argument to the legal profession for this culture change. There was the financial, it's good for business. It relates to our ethical obligations. Then the humanitarian, it's the right thing to do. Which of those three do you think are motivating the firms and the people in the firms that you're dealing with? Are those [arguments 00:27:01] resonating?PATRICK:Honestly, maybe I just have the good fortune of working with some really amazing firms, but my experience has been, all three resonate. I mean, you tend to have really good people leading these organizations. It's not like they're unfeeling individuals but they have to operate within the bounds of their business model. All three points resonate.The one that is probably driving the progress the most is the financial but it's not necessarily financial the way I think that we were contemplating it in the task force where good mental health translates into less expenditure and better performance and all of that. It's financial in the sense of wanting to present a firm culture that attracts and retains the best lawyers. So it's almost a hybrid rationale, it's certain that if you boil that down, firms want to attract and retain the best talent so that they ultimately perform better financially. But it's not the precise calculation of how many specific dollars they're going to save by having fewer depressed lawyers. If that makes sense?BREE:Yeah, you bet.PATRICK:Does that make sense the way I'm explaining that?BREE:Yeah, and one thing that I hear that really resonates when I speak is the issue around the recruitment and retention. That's a big deal, and getting back to talking about those younger lawyers that we were talking about at the very beginning. They expect that they're going to work for somebody who has an interest in them personally, that cares about them as a human being. That's just what's out there and what they're dealing with, with the new folks. So yeah.CHRIS:Yeah, certainly feels like the talent acquisition side where these firms are competing for the best and brightest talent coming out of the law schools, that many of those students are coming in with a different mindset from a work life balance. That has the potential to be a real game changer, it probably has you more optimistic thinking ahead to the future, in terms of the generational change that will ultimately evolve in big law.PATRICK:      Yeah, absolutely. I do think that the younger generation of attorneys, assuming that their priorities aren't co-opted by the machines, if you will. Assuming that they maintain that level of desire to have a different work life experience. As long as they continue to prioritize well-being, then yes, I think that they can be a driver of real transformational change and sustained change in the profession. As long as they don't get co-opted or swept away by the current that exists. I don't see any evidence that they will, I'm just offering that as one potential caveat. Does the prevailing system ultimately prevail?CHRIS:Yeah, yeah. Well hey, let's take a quick break. Patrick, this has been a fascinating conversation. I love the again, your thought leadership in this space. Your experience, your ability to see the macro trends, I think is really critical as we think about the well-being movement on the horizon. Let's take a quick break and we'll come back.—Your law firm is worth protecting and so is your time. ALPS has the quickest online application for legal malpractice insurance out there. Apply, see rates, and buy coverage, all in about 20 minutes. Being a lawyer is hard, our new online app is easy. Apply now at applyonline.alpsnet.com.—BREE:So, Patrick, continuing along the line of what is happening in big law around this whole lawyer well-being movement. There is a pledge, it's the well-being pledge for legal employers. That is being conducted by the American Bar Association, specifically, the Commission on Lawyers Assistance Programs, but you really were the instigator of that. So can you talk a little bit about why you thought that was so important and how that project's going right now?PATRICK: Yeah, so I'd be happy to. I'm really, really gratified with how the pledge has turned out, especially given how it began. What I mean by that is, I first proposed the idea of a pledge campaign to ask legal lawyers to publicly state a commitment to various principles around well-being, back in, I want to say 2015 prior to the study. At the time I proposed that and had this idea, the profession was in a different place. This conversation wasn't really happening or resonating in the profession. So that idea gained no traction.So when I had the opportunity to present it again in 2018 under the [inaudible 00:32:24] of the ABA, Working Group to Advance Lawyer Well-Being, the group liked it and we ran with it and we launched it in September of 2018. Starting with 12 law firm, and those were basically firms that I or others in the working group had a relationship with. We approached them and said, "Would you like to put your name behind this campaign and help us generate momentum and interest to hopefully change the culture of the profession?" So we started with 12, I would say very courageous law firms. We're now up to close to 200 organizations.BREE:That's right.PATRICK: [crosstalk 00:33:00] pledge, which is really, really remarkable. We still have a lot of room to grow and a lot of stakeholders that we want to get on board, but it has already in my view, amounted to a vehicle for cultural change. That was the idea from the beginning. We need a vehicle for cultural change, something that provides concrete, tangible guidance about steps that organizations can take to reduce the impact and prevalence of mental health and substance abuse problems. I really couldn't be more pleased by how well it's going.I'll say it's simply signing a pledge and saying we're going to do X, Y, and Z, in it of itself is meaningless unless the organization follows through. It's not hard to imagine why some organizations may want to sign on just for PR reasons or peer pressure, whatever. But we just finished evaluating, we circulated commitment forms, recommitment forms, after organizations had been signatories for a year. We're just finishing evaluating all of those responses and the overwhelming majority of signatories are really taking meaningful steps. I mean-BREE:That's great news.PATRICK: [crosstalk 00:34:16] they're trying to live up to that commitment that they made.BREE:Yeah, wonderful. Can you talk just for a minute, because my thought is maybe some people who are listening who may be interested in getting involved in that pledge. So it's for legal employers, it's not just big law. Right?PATRICK: Yes, exactly. So we are-BREE:Bar associations?PATRICK: We have an overwhelming number of big law firms who have signed on but Bar associations, law school, corporate legal departments, sector legal employers. A large public defender's office, a state attorney's office, the Department of Justice. If anyone from the DOJ is listening, we want you to take the pledge. There are lots of other stakeholders that it would be great to get on board because this is about changing the culture of the profession, not the culture of big law firms.BREE:Right, right. So also, Chris, what do you think about the pledge as being someone who works in day to day in risk management for law firms? Do you see it as a helpful tool?CHRIS:Yeah, I think again, what we're trying to do is get the discussion going amongst partners in any size of a firm or in any type of a legal employer environment. So the more that those conversations are being had, I think that the more that you're seeing people see... I know from our perspective, we believe that happier, healthier lawyers ultimately lead to fewer claims. So the pledge, I think, has been really a catalyst for... What I would love to see is again, 200 signatories to become 1,000 signatories, to become 2,000 signatories because I think we continue to want to be able to see this filtered down if big law is the pace setter, how do we continue to see small law, solo practitioners, and others come into it? Then also, a geographic representation.I know one of my aspirations is to have pledge signers in every state in the country. So it is really a catalyst for the national discussion, the national movement, and people saying, "I'm in." We need people to say, "I'm in," because I think that that is going to be critical to the success of our ultimate goal, which is the culture shift.PATRICK: I think that's right. When we get to that point of having a really wide base of buy in and a wide base of participation, in for example, the pledge. I mean that's when you start to see this idea of well-being really associated with the idea of being a lawyer. It becomes part of the notion of what a career in the legal profession involves. Part of that role, ideally one day be a focus on taking care of yourself.CHRIS:Yeah, let's shift here quickly. I know again, we'd be remiss to not talk for a few minutes with you, Patrick, about the impacts of the pandemic. You referenced it a little bit in some of your current research. Just hear your thoughts on the effect of the pandemic on lawyers, to the legal community, substance abuse, mental health. We're seeing it amongst our [inaudible 00:37:35]. It's a tough time out there.BREE:Yeah.PATRICK: Yeah, it's an extraordinarily tough time, I think for anyone in society. Different people have been experiencing the events of 2020 differently. That's one thing that I think is important to recognize, that although we tend to say we're all in this together. That's true, but also really not true. We're in the same storm but we're not all on the same boat. That's really evident in some work environments, where you might have some people who this has amounted to a significant inconvenience for them. Maybe they're riding it out from their beach house or whatever. Then you have other people who are in a 700 square foot apartment and they've been traumatized by what's been going on over the course of the last four to five months. So that experience has not been universal.All of that said, I'm hearing on a daily basis at this point from people, from organization, from firms who are saying, "Our people are struggling." I've had four or five emails, today's a Wednesday, I've had four or five emails sent Monday on that point saying, "Can we talk? We need to talk to you about what's going on. Some of the trends we're seeing." So it's real and it's important to recognize, going back to the data that we were all discussing earlier, the legal profession was starting off on shakier ground, as it relates to our mental health and substance abuse risk. We already had higher levels of those problems. Now the pandemic has come along, and not only the pandemic. The stay at home orders, the economic uncertainty, the racial tension that's been [inaudible 00:39:25] the country. I mean, there's a lot happening in 2020 that has really pushed some people to the brink or in some cases unfortunately, over the brink.BREE:What are you telling these folks when they call? To the extent that you can share that. What is some general advice?PATRICK:            Well, almost always these conversations involve letting them know that what they're experiencing internally in their organization is not anomalous. So helping them understand the dimensions of what's happening throughout the country and around the world. Normalizing that experience, but also I think it's really important for organizations to be mindful of how they're communicating with their people around this and how they're trying to make accommodations and adjustments to culture and expectations where possible. If I were to call them several months ago, I think back in March, about this phenomenon essentially known as emotional dissonance, which is the disparity between how we feel inside and how we feel we have to present in order to conform with workplace expectations or other expectations of us. Right now for many people, that level of emotional dissonance is quite high because they are a mess inside and they're really struggling to hold it together or they're completely burnt out and they're completely frazzled, but they're a lawyer. There's a very real set expectation for how they present themselves and how they comport themselves.So I think it's important for organizations and employers to recognize that and to try to move the needle a little bit and show some flexibility around those expectations because the higher that level of emotional dissonance, the greater the risk of burn out, unwanted turnover, all sorts of problematic outcomes.CHRIS:Patrick, let's spend our last couple minutes talking about just your motivation. You are somebody again, first generation lawyer. In many respects, you're both nudging and blowing us, opening up new doors in a national discussion. I've called you at times the fire alarm puller, which means that you're shining the light on some of the problems of our profession, which I know that it's motivated by a desire to drive it in the right direction and to return it to a level of professional satisfaction that we can all be proud of and excited about.I'm just curious on, what's it like to be in your role, to be talking to lawyers about the challenges and also I know that you are amongst, in our community, one of the primary solution drivers. You're always thinking about, how do we move it forward? So as we think about this culture shift, I'd just love your perspective on both raising the alarm on one side, but yet putting the fire out and looking for a bluer sky, a better horizon in the future.PATRICK:          Yeah, well they're both, I think, equally important. I think the fire alarm has been raised at this point. That's a great question, Chris. Thank you, I should say, for asking that because I think it really gets it to equally important things. We needed to raise awareness, we needed to get this conversation going. I think on an ongoing basis we will need to keep that level of buy-in, and that level of awareness raised. So that's one of the reasons why I'm conducting new research. We can't rely on research from 2016 in perpetuity. We need current data to continually drive the conversation. But beyond that, it's only so much utility if you raise awareness, and then don't have any next steps outlined. Talk about, how do we get to a better place? It's a problem and it's a solution. Now we've identified the problem and we all have to be focused on developing good solutions.I love problem solving, not in the math sense, I'm terrible at math but just in a conceptual sense. It's always what I've enjoyed is trying to figure out problems and solutions. So that piece does really motivate me and I enjoy that. I like wrestling with concepts and theories and testing different propositions and figuring out what might work. So that's a really important piece.I've got to say, I appreciate you saying that I'm driving some efforts here, but this is a team effort. Both of you and all of our other wonderful colleagues on the national task force and other people around the profession who are contributing to this cause, we're all rowing in the same direction and contributing where we can to turn the ship. I don't know how many different lame metaphors I've used but it's certainly not just me. We really are doing this together. But I'm grateful, I experience a lot of gratitude for the opportunities that I've had in my life to allow me to be doing this work. Most days it's good to get out of bed and it's good to get up and do what I have to do that day.CHRIS:If the goal is the culture shift, I am curious on what your greatest fear is as we look ahead.PATRICK:  [inaudible 00:45:05] you stumped me, because I don't know what this says about my personality but I don't spend a lot of time thinking about that. I don't know that I have one.BREE:                   I know that with the task force when we first started our greatest fear is that nobody would pay attention or we'd write this report and it would sit on a bookshelf.CHRIS:Yeah.BREE:So that's not happening.CHRIS:That's not happening. My greatest fear is always, I've been around the legal profession for 20 years now and you see issues rise to the level of national discussion, and oftentimes then peter out. I think we collectively, I think we're both trying to build the infrastructure and the sustainability of the movement and the architecture of the movement so that it continues to be front and center, a front burner issue. I feel like we've done a pretty good job thus far but boy, once we let our guard down we could lose the momentum and we can lose momentum.PATRICK: Well, I couldn't agree more fully. I have no intention of letting that happen for my part. That would be fully antithetical to who I am at my core. So I'm going to keep pushing this as long and as hard as I can. Knowing that there are so many other people invested in this process, I think will probably overcome some of the what may have been long odds at the beginning, about whether you can really achieve a cultural change in the legal profession. I think we're getting there and we will ultimately get there.BREE:Patrick, you truly are making the profession a better one. So, thank you.PATRICK: Well, that's kind, Bree. Thank you.CHRIS:Yeah, it's been awesome. Again, we talk about awesome people doing great things. You are definitely in that camp and Patrick, we thank you so much for being on the podcast and being one of our first guests.PATRICK:                 That was great. Really good to chat with you both. I hope this podcast is just a tremendous success, as I'm sure it will be.CHRIS:Awesome. Well, everyone, be well out there. We'll be coming back with a podcast in a couple weeks. Thank you.BREE:Thanks, bye, everybody.

How does a guy who used to sell fighter jets move on to build an Ecommerce company that sells single-blade razors? It’s an interesting question with an even more interesting answer, and on this episode of Up Next in Commerce, Patrick Coddou tells the tale, and gives some insights into the world of Ecommerce along the way. Patrick is the founder and CEO of Supply, and even though the company has been in business since 2015, has seen 80% of its total profits have come in over just the last several months. So what’s Patrick’s secret? In today’s interview, Patrick dives into the nitty-gritty of what changed, including how he finally discovered exactly what profit margins he — and most companies — need to hit in order to achieve sustained success. Learn what that number is and more, on this episode.  Main Takeaways: Always Be Testing: To achieve the best user experience and optimize sales, you need to constantly test new ideas. Whether it’s pop-ups to showcase new items, implementing a legacy program, or experimenting with video, you learn something new every time you test. Plus, sometimes the failed tests are even more valuable than the successful ones.    It’s All About the Margins: Businesses live and die based on their gross margins. If you are not charging enough and/or pay too much to have your products made, you’re putting an unnecessary financial strain on your business that could break it. Riding the Ecommerce Waves: There is a ton of volatility in the Ecommerce industry. In order to achieve sustained success, companies need to be nimble and able to adapt to the changing tides. Keep overhead low, focus on your P&L and build processes that allow you to make quick shifts when needed. For an in-depth look at this episode, check out the full transcript below. Quotes have been edited for clarity and length. --- Up Next in Commerce is brought to you by Salesforce Commerce Cloud. Respond quickly to changing customer needs with flexible Ecommerce connected to marketing, sales, and service. Deliver intelligent commerce experiences your customers can trust, across every channel. Together, we’re ready for what’s next in commerce. Learn more at salesforce.com/commerce --- Transcript: Stephanie: Welcome to another episode of Up Next in Commerce. This is your host, Stephanie Postles and today on the show, we have the founder of Supply, Patrick Coddou. Patrick, welcome. Patrick: Thank you for having me. Stephanie: Yeah, we're excited to have you on. I was doing a little bit of LinkedIn stalking and your background... At first, when I stumbled on your LinkedIn, I'm like, "Is this the right guy?" I saw a background in selling fighter jets and I wanted to start there with you of kind of like a little bit of your background before you founded Supply. Patrick: Sure. So I spent my education as a mechanical engineering and before starting this company, I spent eight and a half years in the corporate world. I worked in the aerospace industry and in particular I worked on military aircraft. We make some fighter aircraft here in Fort Worth, Texas where I'm from. Stephanie: Very cool. And what does that look like behind the scenes of working on aircraft? I saw that you did, I think an $8 billion deal. So I want to hear a little bit more details around that. Patrick: Yes. I worked on it. It would be very, very arrogant of me to claim that I was responsible for that deal. Yeah. So in general, and I'm happy to go deeper if you want to, but in general, the US government works with foreign militaries to arm and equip them with certain pieces of equipment that we think that are necessary for them to have and to support interoperability between allies. So one of those aircraft was called the F-35. And I think the deal you're talking about was maybe the deal with South Korea we did probably five or six years ago where the US government sold, I don't remember how many, 60, 70 aircraft to South Korea. Patrick: So that was a really phenomenal experience getting to fly there and negotiate with our partners over in South Korea and spent a lot of time kind of immersing myself in their culture. Just a cool, cool thing to be a part of. So I learned a lot there, but at the same time was ready to get out when I left. Stephanie: Yeah. So let's hear a little bit about you're almost a decade at, I think Lockheed Martin and you're starting to get the entrepreneurial itch. So what was happening while you were there and what had you make the jump. Patrick: Yeah. So as outrageously cool as the subject matter was of what I worked on in my previous life, it was... As awesome as the subject was, it was as equally terrible to work in a corporate environment like that one for me personally. Not for everybody, but for me. And especially working with the US government. Just procedures and processes and just layers of bureaucracy. It just led to boredom and frankly anxiety and depression personally. Just wanting to be fulfilled in my work and not finding the ability to be so in what I was doing. Patrick: I tend to plan and think ahead a lot. When I visualize the future of my life there, it was like I could literally see myself sitting at the same desk like doing the same things that I had been doing for like the next 30 years of my life. For years, I wasn't raised as an entrepreneur. I don't really have that in my family. I didn't know the first thing about starting a business, but for years I was always thinking about kind of what is kind of my path out of this life and kind of into the next one. Patrick: I always had ideas and never really kind of jumped on them because I wasn't a risk taker, I was an engineer. Taking risk was the furthest thing from what I was used to. And I finally have this idea for a razor that I wanted to invent, and we can kind of get into that if we want to, but in general I've always kind of struggled with irritation and ingrown hairs with shaving since the first day I started shaving. I came across this old style of shaving, shaving with a single blade safety razor and just fell in love with it and decided I wanted to try to kind of make a modern version of this old razor that I found. Patrick: Then in addition to that just decided like this is kind of... It's kind of now or never to make the leap from this job to doing something on my own. So it was kind of a perfect storm of the idea came and the necessity came and the opportunity came at the same time and just decided to go for it. Stephanie: Yeah, that's awesome. I think a lot of people probably have those same feelings of getting stuck somewhere. I know I have in the past. There was a point in my previous life when I was working at Fannie Mae and I had the same kind of thing. I'm like, "Oh my gosh. Do I want to end up in a semi-government job or corporate job?" And even at Google, it's like, "Oh, things feel so great right now. Should I leave? I feel like I'll stay here for a long time because it's so comfy." So I think a lot of people have the same kind of feeling of now or never. I better jump before I get stuck here for the rest of my life. Patrick: And the further you go in those career paths like the harder it is to leave. What can an aerospace engineer that has worked as an aerospace engineer for 20 years do other than that after they've been there so long? Stephanie: Yeah. I had the same feeling. What year did you start Supply or did you start something before then or was Supply your first company? Patrick: Yes, Supply is my first kind of real company. Prior to starting Supply which we started in... The company started in January of 2015, but we launched publicly in August of 2015 with our first Kickstarter campaign. And prior to that, I started a website with one of my best buddies called razorpedia.com and that was like, I think, we started in 2012 or 2013. Long story short, it was a kind of razor review website that really was kind of a... Just kind of a stupid fun thing to do with a buddy on weekends where we wanted to kind of test razors and try to find the best razor on the market. Actually, the website ended up getting pretty popular and we ended up selling it later. But that's really where the razor kind of story began with shaving. Stephanie: Yeah. I mean, I read that the Razorpedia was like the number one google search result and it had like 1 million organic page views over 30 months. So it sounds like it was actually a pretty big deal. Patrick: Yeah, it was pretty successful. We were fortunate enough to like... We literally launched I think the same week that Harry's launched. Stephanie: Good timing. Patrick: Yeah. It was good timing and we wrote a blog like the same week about Harry's. We ended up like kind of being... If you searched razor reviews online or Harry's razor review, we were right at the top of the search results. So it was kind of dumb luck. So we started to kind of monetize it with ads. We didn't know what we were doing. We were making it up as we went. The best thing that came out of that was the realization that all these multi-blade razors that we tested were all... In my opinion, were all trash and just not good razors. It was that website that actually led me down the path to find this old style of shaving, which is this single blade style shave. Stephanie: It's really interesting how marketing can really train us like "Oh, the more blades the better, and this one has two. Oh, this one has three." You wouldn't even think like getting back to the roots of like you're talking about a single blade is maybe actually the best way of doing things. Patrick: Yeah. There's an old Onion article from like 2002 and I think the most blades in a razor was maybe three or four at that time, and the title of the article was Screw It, We're Doing Five Blades. So they actually foresaw the five blade razor. I think you can actually buy a seven blade razor today. Stephanie: Oh my gosh. So you have this idea of Supply. What did the early days look like? I mean you have this old-time razor where you're like, "Oh, this actually works really well." What was it like to actually start the company and find a way to create and manufacture this razor? Patrick: It was very challenging to say the least. So I had the good fortune of one of my friends. I wanted to just make the leap and just go cold turkey and go all in on the company and the idea from day one. I had the good fortune of having some friends in my life that I listened to that said, "Why don't you try to figure out how to make this product work before you just leave your paycheck behind?" That turned out to be really good advice because it took me about a year and a half if not two years to go from Kickstarter campaign, which was kind of the initial rough prototype to no kidding supply chain or product that I could actually sell at scale. Patrick: I have no background in consumer products at all, whatsoever. So a lot of that kind of two-ish years was just me making it up. I had no investors. I had no real network or people to rely on to help me figure out how to kind of make this product. So a lot of it was just kind of figuring it out as I went and making a lot of mistakes and fixing those mistakes when they happened. Stephanie: So how were you finding ways to... I mean, you get a really well-funded Kickstarter. What was the next steps after that? Did you go and start meeting with people who manufacture razors already and you're like, "Here's my new design idea?" Or since you're an engineer, were you actually like trying to make your own? Patrick: Yeah. No, I did not make my own. We've always done outsourced supply chain and production since day one. We're currently actually not working with any of our early manufacturing partners. We've got a really phenomenal network of manufacturers that we work with today. But in the early days, it was a lot of googling although that doesn't really get you too far when it comes to manufacturing. Patrick: And then just a lot of calling and cold outreach to anybody that I could get to pick up the phone. So I think I probably called somewhere around 50 or 60 different suppliers that I just found through Google or recommendation from somebody who would talk to me, but didn't want to do the work for me or something like that. I eventually settled on... And this is a very common practice in the consumer products space. I eventually settled on... I never really know what to call them, but kind of an outsourcing kind of middleman sort of company where they're a... This is what they do is they go find factories to make you your product. Stephanie: Oh, interesting. Patrick: Yeah, I found a guy local to me. I don't remember how I found him. I think he was on Upwork maybe and he managed the manufacturing of our first batch for me. Stephanie: Very cool. So what led you to change manufacturers? You said in the early days, you had one manufacturer two and then you don't use them now. What happened and what kind of lessons did you learn through switching manufacturers? Patrick: So we launched our campaign August of 2015. I promised delivery by March of 2015, and that was in my mind plenty... That was more than enough time. That was like I was being generous with that timeline. And the manufacturer knew that. They were on track with that. March came and went. No products. April came and went no products. May. And then June I finally... I'll never forget, he literally shows up on my doorstep with a big old dolly of... I think we had ordered maybe 2,000 razors or something like that and he drops him off inside my house. Then as he's walking out the door, he says, "Oh, by the way, there's a problem within." Patrick: I'm like, "Oh, now, you're going to tell me there's a problem." Anyways, it turned out there was an issue with the razor to where if it wasn't used properly, it actually wouldn't even really shave at all and you couldn't load a blade. Stephanie: Oh my gosh. Patrick: Yeah, just a little problem, which was just devastating because I had already spent all my money that I had raised, I think about $8,000 on that production batch. Essentially what we did over the next kind of two to three months is I set up a little shop in my garage to try to kind of adjust the razors to make them work and we did the best we could with that. We were very open with our backers and that's always like number one thing. I always tell young founders or operators is like when things go wrong trying to cover it up or not being honest about it with your customers is just going to make it worse. Patrick: You need to kind of be honest. We were telling our customers what's up like here's what happened, here's what we're trying to make right about it. Oh by the way, if you want to wait, we're going to start up a second batch with a new manufacturer, but it's just going to take some time. Patrick: Anyways, we ended up kind of salvaging some of that initial bash. We ended up having to scrap a lot of it, lost a lot of money on that first batch and then we started up a second production line and eventually made it right with our backers and delivered everything we promised, but it took... I think it was the following March before we finished delivering what we had promised. So it took a year longer than what we had told people it would take. The lesson for me is and has always been at the end of the day, all I have personally that's keeping my business alive is the relationships with the people that I work with. Patrick: Those relationships and that trust is everything. It's extremely difficult to, on the front end, determine if you can trust somebody. But I always highly leverage towards trust when I'm evaluating a new partner rather than capability, right? Because capability is just kind of table stakes for us to even have a conversation. Something is going to go wrong and what happens when it goes wrong is what makes all the difference. Patrick: So that first vendor, his true colors were showed when something went wrong. The vendors, I'm with now, things go wrong all the time, but what happens is they make it right. So that's kind of the biggest learning lesson for me and the biggest advice I can give people is going into business with people that you not only enjoy working with, but can trust to make things right when things go wrong because that's literally all you have. What's written on the contract doesn't even really matter when you're as small as me, right? Because I can't sue somebody. It's just... Anyway. Stephanie: Too much time, too much money to even try and do that to begin with. Patrick: Yeah, exactly. So it's all about relationships. Stephanie: Yeah, that's a really good point. So on your Twitter I think I saw that... I mean, you guys have been in business for a few years, but 80% of your lifetime profit has come in the last six months and I was wondering what's the catalyst behind that? Why are all the profits coming in now? Is it better marketing? What's behind the scenes to drive that profit now? Patrick: Two things, supply and demand. So on the supply side, I worked all last year. This is another kind of big learning point. I've gathered over the years. I worked all last year to significantly improve our gross margins or essentially how much our products cost to make versus what we sell them. The first four basically years of my company, I wasn't charging enough for my products and they were costing me too much to make. So 2019 was a big kind of cost cutting year for us. Patrick: Then in addition to that... So those cost cutting initiatives went into effect on November 1st. So that's the supply side and then the demand side is November 3rd we aired on Shark Tank. So that was the beginning of a big tidal wave of orders. So those two things coincided very nicely to bring us to a place to where we're significantly profitable in the way that we've never been before and that really changes a lot of things for us. Stephanie: That's awesome. So how did you go about figuring out what areas needed to have cost cut down? What does that process look like? Patrick: Yeah, for us, I mean it's less about... We've always had very low overhead. Started the business with my wife. We've barely ever paid ourselves much... We've had a very small team always. We worked out of our house for the first three years. So overhead has always been very low for us. I always, always, always urge young businesses and founders to keep overhead as low as possible. I think a lot of the reason you're seeing a lot of companies go out of business or have issues this year since COVID hit is they don't have the flexibility in their overhead to withstand volatility in the marketplace which is what's going on right now. Patrick: So that's always been low for us. It's always been a thing that I've held important. What it costs us to make our products versus what we charge for them, I had what I'd consider a friend/mentor get on a phone with me. He runs a very successful men's clothing business that's probably 10 times larger than mine. He shared with me, "If you're not charging at least 4X for your products what you make them for, you're never going to be able to scale in a meaningful way because customer acquisition costs are just too high to let you be able to scale with any less margin than that." And he's right. Stephanie: Did you take his advice exactly and do 4X of how much it costed you? Patrick: Yes, I did. Stephanie: Cool. And what was the price before for a razor and what did that jump to? Patrick: Without getting into the engineering side which is maybe a little boring, but we didn't really necessarily change the price of the razor. We have two versions. We have what we call an alloy version and a steel version. The steel version we increased the price probably about 20 to 30% and we introduced an alloy version which is a lot less expensive to manufacture and we actually kept and almost kind of lowered the price on that one because we were able to bring our production costs down so much. Stephanie: Got it. When you're lowering your production costs, I know you mentioned overhead is a big thing, but was there anything with your production costs or the materials that you also looked at decreasing the prices for? Patrick: No. I mean, we kind of kept the packaging the same. Another thing that you'll probably hear a lot of people, supply chain guys talk about is we're always trying to get like ahead of the curve when it comes to ordering because historically we've always had to rush shipments via air. Not all of our stuff, but a lot of our stuff is made overseas and air shipments cost anywhere from five to 10X more than ocean shipments. So that's always really painful when you got to spend 20 to 30 grand just to ship something versus two to three grand. Patrick: So getting better forecasting so that we can order far enough ahead of time to put something on the ocean instead of the air is another big thing we're doing. Otherwise, it's just like constant... I live in my profit and loss statement where I'm just counting every single penny that goes into my cost of goods sold whether it's the cost to ship to me, whether it's cost to ship to my customer, the fees I'm getting charged by my credit card companies, cost of my boxes. Patrick: I mean, it just requires relentless dedication to constantly being in the numbers to make sure that... It's just like... It's like entropy. All things tend towards chaos. Well, everything in your P&L tends towards higher costs if you don't stay on top of it because you're just going to spend more and more money. Stephanie: Yeah, I completely agree. I think a lot of founders oftentimes avoid looking at it because, one, it's kind of hard to read a P&L or a balance sheet or something like that if you haven't taken the time to figure out what all the line items mean. But then also like you said like a lot of things start adding up behind the scenes whether it's subscriptions or just stuff where you're like, "Whoa, I didn't realize my credit card fee is this." Maybe it's actually cheaper just to you know get a loan or do this and start thinking differently about how you're spending your money. Because a lot of those costs do add up especially in the early days. Patrick: They do, and software too. Stephanie: Oh, yeah. Software is a big one. And forecasting. I thought that's a really good point about forecasting in a way that you don't have to airship things. We actually haven't had someone on the show talk about air versus ocean, so I found that very interesting. Patrick: Yep. Stephanie: So the other thing I was wondering I would love to hear more about is your Shark Tank experience. We've had quite a few Shark Tankers on here and everyone's had a slightly different experience. I want to hear a little bit about what that looked like. Patrick: Awesome. I mean, it was a once-in-a-lifetime sort of deal. Never will forget it. We had a blast. I went on with my wife. We both pitched. We filmed in June of last year, so June of 2019 and then we aired in November of 2019. Just all the way through from the very... I applied three years in a row. It took me three years to get on the show and from the first day I applied the first time all the way through the last interaction I had with them after filming, it's just a really class act. Up and down, just phenomenal people. Patrick: I'm not talking necessarily about the sharks, although they're all great. You work with them for literally 30 minutes to an hour. You never see them again, but all the people behind the scenes are just a class act. Just the experience of standing in front of these people that you've watched for close to a decade, if not more than a decade on TV and actually talking to them and them talking back to you and saying your name. It's just like this very kind of out of body experience to where you kind of like in a sense like black out a little bit. Like don't even really remember what happened, at least personally. But we had an absolute blast. We ended up getting an offer from Robert and accepted his offer. We actually didn't end up closing that deal, but just had an absolute blast. Stephanie: Oh, and you said you didn't end up closing it?   Patrick: No, we did not. Stephanie: I think that's also interesting to know that not all the deals close and there's things that maybe happen afterwards that could impact that on both sides. Patrick: Yeah. About half of them don't close. Stephanie: Yeah. So what was it like after you went on the show? I'm sure you had a large increase in demand? Did you guys have any website issues or inventory issues or what did that look like? Patrick: Yeah, a huge increase in demand. I think in November, we did you know 4X our previous monthly record. So big increase in demand. It really strained our customer service. It strained our supply... Not our supply chain, our warehouse a bit although we had just onboarded with Shopify Fulfillment Network. They were doing a phenomenal job of keeping up with things. It was more of what was straining was getting stuff in stock from our vendors on time. Patrick: So we had some orders that took us like three to four weeks to ship and that made some customers pretty upset since they were Christmas presents. We did get everybody everything they needed before Christmas which was like my one thing that I wasn't going to sacrifice on. We ended up getting it done. But between November 3rd and Christmas, it was pretty painful, in a good way. But the response was pretty phenomenal. Stephanie: Yeah, that's great. And are you seeing continued demand from that or did you start leveraging other maybe customer acquisition strategies or marketing tactics to kind of build on that demand? Patrick: Yeah, so it really put a ton of wind in our sales. It's really helped us kind of upgrade a lot of our business kind of to the next level. But in terms of like sustained demand, no, you're not getting a ton of like post Shark tank people streaming it and coming to your website. Although, I'm sure that happens. What it has done for us is it's given us kind of a social proof of being on this national platform. Patrick: So we've used a lot of footage and assets from the airing in our advertising. So if you go to our website, you'll probably get retargeted with some Shark Tank style ads. And just in general, it's given us the ability to taking us from this quiet kind of nobody brand to... I won't call us a household name, because we're certainly not, but a lot more people recognize us like, "Oh yeah, I've seen that before." Patrick: So it helps with everything. I mean, it helps with not only the company but your partners and your vendors are now even more excited to work with you. Press finds you that hasn't found you in the past. We'll be in The Wall Street Journal this weekend. Stephanie: Oh, cool. Patrick: We are in GQ's best single blade razor of 2020. These things just kind of slowly snowball. It's been a really phenomenal experience. We're very grateful for it. Stephanie: Yeah, that's great. It's such a good reminder of how PR can work if it's done the right way because there's all these PR companies who always say that they can help you, but it depends and that's just a good reminder that it can work well if you get the right outlet and getting featured in like Wall Street Journal or places like that. Very beneficial. Stephanie: So what kind of digital channels are you finding the most success in right now when you're going about... You're talking about retargeting and different marketing tactics. What kind of channels are you finding success in? Patrick: Sure. I mean, no surprise Facebook, Instagram and Google in that order for volume. We've always wanted to test these other channels like Snapchat and Tik-Tok and whatever and we probably will sooner or later. But there are some other things we want to spend some more time on building before then. We do a little bit of affiliate. We do a tiny bit of influencer, and that's really kind of I think what we're going to start turning our eye to for maybe the next phase of our growth. But yeah, those are really the big channels for us. Stephanie: Yeah, cool. So when you were building up supply and you mentioned Harry's earlier. The razor market feels like it's been pretty popular for people to start companies in. You've got Dollar Shave Club, you've got Harry's. How did you think about that competition and making sure that you stood out among the other brands that were launching? Patrick: Yeah. So our value proposition is very much kind of anti-Harry's and anti-Dollar Shave Club. Then our positioning and our pricing is similarly the complete opposite. So they're clearly competitors of ours, but I don't really consider them necessarily direct competitors. What I do consider them is people that I can steal my customers from. So it's a single blade. I haven't really talked much about the product. It's a single blade. Stephanie: Yeah, let's hear about that. Patrick: Yeah. It's a premium single blade razor and the value propositions are there's a few. Number one, it's not a cheap product. It's a $75 handle, but the value prop is you invest a lot up front, but then you save tons of money over time. So our blades are 75 cents a piece and they last somewhere between eight to 10 shaves. So after you buy the handle, you're spending... If you're shaving every day, you're spending maybe 24 bucks on blades a year. Then you've got this handle that lasts forever. We actually guarantee it for life. Patrick: So you never have to buy the handle again. But then aside from that, the value prop is a single blade gives you just as close of a shave as a multi-blade razor. But for roughly 30% of guys, they experience like myself a really severe razor burn and or bumps typically on the neck or in the sensitive parts of the face. And a lot of that is caused by multi-blade razors. We don't have to go that deep into it, but the way they're designed is works for some guys in terms of giving you a close shave, but for guys like me who have sensitive skin, it actually does the opposite. It makes things worse for you. Patrick: Anyways, so going back to Harry's and Dollar Shave Club. So a lot of guys, they just use these razors and they just think like this is the way everybody shaves and they just have to deal with this issue and just deal with the razor burn or just not shave. So what we're telling them is no, it's not the case. You can actually shave and enjoy it and not have your face be a train wreck after you shave. Patrick: So we're slowly helping guys kind of wake up from this myth that multi-blades are better and that's like the only way to shave. If it doesn't work for you, then too bad. Just keep shaving and tearing up your face. Stephanie: Yeah. How are you going about that education process because I was going to say that it does seem like there's quite a bit of education required for that and just for like... I mean, you mentioned shaving eight to 10 times. I'm like, "Oh, I think a lot of people probably shave with the same blade for long time." I'm thinking about myself, I'm like, "Oh, man. I'm pretty bad at that." So how do you go about getting people to change their behavior? Patrick: Yeah. Honestly, it's tough. I mean, I'll give you an example. We present in our ads like why multi-blade razors are bad for your skin and we literally present it the same... We present the same data that Gillette presents. It's on their website. Multi-blade razors are literally designed to lift... The first blade tugs the hair out of the skin and like the second and third blade kind of cuts it below the surface of the skin. That's literally how Gillette has designed them to work. Patrick: People accuse of us of lying and making that up. And it's like, "No, just google it." You'll see it straight out of the horse's mouth. So the point is like it takes a lot of education. When they don't even believe that you're just saying what your competitor says, clearly they they need a lot of education. Patrick: So we do it through video. For example, if you buy the razor, you get four emails from me, the first four days after you buy it and each one is a short 60-second training video. It's not like this outrageously complex course of learning how to shave with our razor. It's 60-second videos. But guys, we've learned are very prone to throw instructions out so they don't read anything that we include with the product. Stephanie: You think they fancy videos like you call them, "Hey, come look at this." Patrick: Exactly. It continues to be a challenge, but in general video seems to work the best in terms of teaching guys how to do. And actually, we're starting up our YouTube channel next week to kind of help that process as well. Stephanie: That's really interesting. Another thing I read. I don't even know why I know anything about razors because I did read an article about the marketing behind them, how a lot of the traditional companies show the razor getting like water all over it and sitting in the shower and that actually degrades the blades and then you have to change it more frequently and that was like their whole plan. Do you think that's true or am I just reading conspiracy theories behind razor blades? Patrick: Yeah, I don't know exactly what you've read, but I mean it is true that water, what it does, I mean, if it sits on a blade it causes it to rust which degrades the edge. I mean, we tell our customers don't leave your razor in the shower in a damp environment. We tell our customers not to do that because that's very... That's true. Stephanie: Yeah. I mean, all these things I think most people probably are doing right now, I'm thinking of myself and our producers typing in there that how long she goes from changing her blades. So I think there's a lot of education to do in the market in general. How are you guys also thinking about new products because these are designed for men, but I'm like women definitely have a lot of the same issues. Are you thinking about launching new products geared towards women as well or are you just strictly focused on men's products? Patrick: The short term, we're focused on men's products. We do have women as customers. My wife and my co-founder is a user of our product. So we're more than happy to have the ladies buy from us. But what's really, really difficult or at least I've found is to position our product as both a men's and women's product at the same time. I don't know the best. I'm sure there's a good way to do it, but I don't know what it is because shaving your face and shaving your legs are too... They seem similar, but they're very, very different things. Patrick: I'd love to do like maybe different landing pages or product pages because the value props are basically different, right? So I don't know, man. Maybe I could use some advice for how to sell... Maybe the problem is I just don't know yet how to sell razors to women. Stephanie: It sounds like my team. We've got ideas and we'll team up with your wife and we can all figure it out together. Patrick: Yeah, yeah exactly. It is on the to-do list. It's just something we haven't been able to get to yet. Stephanie: Very cool. So tell me a little bit about how you developed your website like the experience... I mean, when you're selling something that kind of needs to be tried out or you need to hold like the handle to see like wow, this is a good quality like piece of steel here, how do you convey that to the customers who are coming on and how did you develop your website experience. Patrick: Yeah. It's tough, it's really tough. I don't think we've arrived by any stretch, but certainly, certainly made a lot of progress. We have a very, very talented development company. We work with agency called Fuel Made. Good friends, just good people and they do amazing work. So they handle just from the front end and the back end design. They're handling most of that for me. Patrick: Prior to that when we were smaller, I think it's a complete, complete waste of money to spend any money on complex web design. There are so many free or very cheap templates out there that work so well. I would encourage people to not spend any money on development and take any money you have and invest it all in creative and start with just phenomenal photography. Patrick: Find a very, very talented photographer and spend your money there if you're going to spend your money anywhere. So I have a very good friend of mine who is that person and he takes all of our photographs. And so we over index on beautiful photography. We're now at a point to where we can afford kind of an expensive agency to develop our site and otherwise, we do just tons of AB testing. Every month, we're testing something new or we're launching a new feature. Sometimes it works, sometimes it fails miserably. Each month is just an opportunity to get better. Stephanie: What kind of tests have you seen work versus fail because I think a lot of people may be thinking about trying out some of the same kind of features or tests that you're thinking about. So is there anything that comes to mind where you're like this really worked well with conversions or increase cart value versus this one did not work at all and it seems like it would have. Patrick: Yeah. I probably have more this didn't work than this does work. Stephanie: Let's hear it. I like those stories just as much. Patrick: Well, man, I'm really sad about this one. We just did one where once you add the razor to the cart, there's a pop-up that immediately shows up that says, "Hey, do you want to upgrade this to our starter set which is our second best seller aside from our razor?" We tested different variations of that pop-up. We tested it against no pop-up and there was like no clear winner after, I think it was two weeks and a very significant amount of traffic. No clear winner. Patrick: So we decided not to go with that pop-up. I launched a membership/loyalty program in April. The way I designed it was outrageously complex and I put a lot of development work and dollars into it, let it run for eight weeks and then I canned it. That was painful to do because it was just too complex. Stephanie: What made it complex? Because I've actually heard similar themes from a few other people who've been on the show who said that they thought that a loyalty program would work for them, but it ended up not working like they thought. So what do you think made it too complex or would you have done it differently or are you just like, "We're not trying that again?" Patrick: Yeah. Two things on the front end and on the back end. So on the back end, the code, it was completely custom designed from a code using scripts on Shopify and it just got really complicated. But on the front end, it was kind of confusing to the customer. So the program was essentially like it was kind of like buy a razor and get a free lifetime of blades offer which sounds like a really compelling offer, but there's always kind of... There's got to be a caveat to that statement. Patrick: So it was like you could get a shipment every quarter of blades, just pay for shipping or you could buy our premium membership, which was like 20 bucks a year and then get the blade shipped to you once a quarter, which is a great deal, but offering them those two options was really confusing and then just the way we made them sign up for it was confusing. Patrick: In general, we're going to try to launch another program in the future, but it will be far less complicated. If you can't explain it in a sentence or less and have people get it immediately, then you've set yourself up for failure. And that's what we did. I've explained the program to people and they'd be like, "Okay, wait. But if I buy this, what happens?" Stephanie: I need my Google spreadsheet out like which way will I save an extra dollar? Patrick: Yeah. So anyways, things that have worked. We actually launched international currency on our website because we do a pretty big chunk of business overseas and that actually increases conversion rates quite a bit for us. I'm blanking right now. We've had other wins, but I'm blanking on it right now. Stephanie: That's all right. If you think of any more, we can circle back because I actually think it's very interesting diving into some of these tests like this because I'm sure other founders are thinking about similar tests. Patrick: For sure. Stephanie: Very cool. So a couple general Ecommerce questions. Now, that you've been in the world for a while and kind of doing a bunch of tests and you launched your company, what kind of trends or patterns do you see coming down the pipe right now especially with everything with the pandemic. Are there any changes that you see coming in the future around Ecommerce? Patrick: I guess this is probably cliché, but the only thing I know is that I have no idea what's coming next. I think there's a ton of opportunity in the future and a ton of volatility in the future for Ecommerce. I'm very, very grateful, number one to be in the industry I'm in to continue to operate and be healthy and growing. I have friends in the restaurant business that cannot say that. Patrick: So I'm very bullish and grateful for the industry I'm in. I'm not planning on changing anytime soon, but at the same time, I think consumer behavior is going to continue to be like challenging to kind of forecast. People say this all the time on Twitter, but I just don't get the fact that our stock market is so high and our GDP is so low and so many people are out of business. Patrick: To me, it's like, okay, when is this... Part of me is waiting for the other shoe to drop and when is this all going to come crashing down and the other part of me is like eCommerce is 30% of retail now and like that's not showing any sign of stopping anytime soon. So I don't know if that's a direct answer, but in general what I'm doing is I'm doubling down. I'm building processes and teams for growth. Patrick: So we actually just left our long time marketing agency that I had a great relationship and love and really enjoyed working with and it was really difficult to leave them. But the main reason I left is like I'm convinced the brands that are super nimble and able to react and adapt really quickly are going to be the ones that survive and thrive in this environment, in this volatile environment. Patrick: So whether Facebook CPMs are up or down or what's going on, I think we're just going to be really flexible and part of what I'm doing to be flexible is building more internal teams to move quickly rather than just being a bit slower. Stephanie: Yeah. That's such a great point and I think a lot of other companies are probably starting to think about that too especially around like being able to move quickly and not having costs that are recurring for like the next three years that you can't get out of or long-term contracts and even around like not relying on just a single manufacturer and being able to kind of like move around if needed. So definitely being more nimble will probably be how a lot of companies are thinking about this going forward. Patrick: Yeah, and it's tough because at the same time you also, I think... We started the call off kind of like this, it's like you have to keep overhead low at the same time. So you've got these competing priorities to be able to move fast and have an internal team, but then also not have a bloated internal team that you just can't respond. Your overhead can't respond quick enough to any kind of unforeseen events. Stephanie: Yep. Completely agree. So is there anything that you wish I would have asked you that I did not bring up? Patrick: Let me see. I don't think so. No, nothing I can think of. Stephanie: Man, I'm just the best. All right. Cool. Then we can move on to a quick lightning round, if that sounds good. Patrick: That works for me. Stephanie: All right. So the lightning round brought to you by SalesForce Commerce Cloud. This is where I will ask you a question and you have a minute or less to answer. Are you ready, Patrick? Patrick: I am ready. Stephanie: Cool. So if you were to start a podcast, what would it be about and who would your first guest be? Patrick: Okay. I know the answer to this one. Stephanie: You're prepared. Patrick: This is no offense to you at all. Stephanie: All right. I'll try not to be offended. Patrick: I would start not like a one-on-one podcast, but like a round table debate style podcast with roughly three to five people. I want vigorous like vitriolic... I don't know if that's a word, but debate. I want people that are so ingrained in their opinion that they're willing to fight other people to the death about what they have to say. The topics would be all Ecommerce or retail related. Stephanie: Okay. Patrick: So anyways. Stephanie: I feel like I see that happening on Twitter right now though. Patrick: Yes, it's Twitter and podcast form. That's exactly what it is. Stephanie: Yeah. I see all these people getting very angry about stuff with certain Ecommerce or someone calls something like D2C and they're like, "That's not data saved." I'm like oh my gosh. Patrick: That's exactly what I'm talking about. Stephanie: That's funny. We at Mission have done roundtables before, but they're usually with like three CMOs and then one of us hosting it. So it does not get that heated. So I'd be very interested to see how your podcast goes. Patrick: Yeah, it would be a requirement for yelling to happen. Stephanie: That sounds great. What's up next on your reading list? Patrick: Let's see. I just downloaded been a book by Ben Horowitz. I don't remember the name of it but it's about building culture. Stephanie: Oh, yeah. What is that new one? Patrick: I don't remember. But it's all related to this kind of transition I'm going through right now is what I call a transition from founder to CEO and focusing less on doing things myself and focusing more about delegating and building a team that can accomplish things without me involved. So a huge, huge, huge part of that is culture and I have no clue how to build good culture. So I want to learn from the best. Stephanie: What You Do Is Who You Are? Patrick: Yes, that's it. Is that new or is that old? Stephanie: Yeah. That one is his newer book. I was listening to it on Audible and I like it because it ties in history along with building a culture, but it's like here's what happened a long time ago and why these themes are still relevant. So I'd recommend that one as well. Patrick: So you liked it? That's good. Stephanie: Yeah. I thought it was great. Patrick: Okay, good. Stephanie: What's up next on your Netflix queue? Patrick: I don't really watch a whole lot of Netflix. Stephanie: No? Nothing? Everyone always starts by saying that and they're like, "Oh, wait. I just did this. I just watched this whole series." Patrick: It's funny. Me and Jennifer will turn on Netflix to watch something new and we always default to just watching The Office. Stephanie: That's a good one. That's a good go to, to Keep you smiling. Patrick: I will say we did just start. We dug up an old DVD set of Seinfeld and now we're watching Seinfeld right now. Stephanie: Oh, nice. Pulling out the DVDs. That's awesome. Patrick: Yeah, the DVD. Blu-Ray though, yeah. Stephanie: Yeah, got to be. What app do you enjoy most on your phone? Patrick: What app? I use twitter probably too much. It's a good thing and a bad thing. A lot of the good things that have happened to me over the past year have been through connections on Twitter, but it can also be a time suck. Stephanie: Yes, I agree. All right. And then the last one, what is a favorite piece of tech that you use or a trying out that's making you or your team more efficient right now? Patrick: More efficient. Well, we're trying out a productivity app called ClickUp? Have you ever heard of it? Stephanie: I think I have. Tell me a little bit more about it. Patrick: It's kind of like a monday.com or an Asana. So like project management, task management. I've never found one I like or that works. We've tried doing it in Notion before, although I love Notion. So we're trying that in ClickUp. I don't know. We'll see. I like it so far. Stephanie: Cool. Yeah, we'll have to check that out. We use Basecamp for almost everything, but I'm open to other things. Patrick: Go ahead. Stephanie: Oh, go ahead. Patrick: I was just going to say, I don't know that I'm a huge fan of Basecamp. I could never get it to work for some reason. Stephanie: Yeah. It is a little high when it comes to like starting up and teaching the team and everyone learning from it, but it gets better. Patrick: Yeah. Stephanie: All right. Well, this has been such a fun interview, Patrick. Thank you for coming on the show. Where can people find out more about you and Supply? Patrick: You can find me on Twitter where I spend most of my time. My handle sounds like canoe. Because my last name sounds like canoe, it's Patrick Coddou. So you can find me there and that's really where I spend all my time. And then our website is supply.co. You can see our company and all of our products there. Stephanie: Awesome. Thanks so much and have a great day. Patrick: Thank you.  

  [Dans l’épisode précédent : Pecos a blanchi James auprès de Preston, ce dernier a donc ramené le cow-boy se reposer chez Mae. Reprenant  l’enquête, ils reviennent sur les liens qui unirent le shérif et le pasteur Jakob. Nirvelli a été bannie pour avoir protégé Preston et la femme de Jakob. Preston emmène alors un James délirant de fièvre et d’hallucinations à la rencontre de Nirvelli…] L’indienne prépare une décoction d’herbe pour soulager James de ses visions. Elle dont l’ombre plane non loin des scènes de crimes, qu’a-t-elle à révéler sur ce serial killer ?  Avec les voix d’Alison Wheeler (Mae), Louane Emera (Rosanna), Joël Zaffarano, voix française d'Hugh Jackman (James), Patrick Noérie, voix française de George Clooney (Preston), Bruno Choël, voix française de Johnny Depp (Pecos), Hervé Jolly, voix française de Clint Eastwood (Jakob) , Thierry Desroses, voix française de Samuel L. Jackson (le prisonnier), Gabriel Bismuth-Bienaimé (Chupp), et Ludmila Ruoso (Nirvelli). Musique : Herman Dune. Scénario : Vincent L'Anthoën, Clément Gournay et Elise Costa. Réalisé par Julien Aubert. Morts à l’Aveugle est une création originale TCM Cinéma produite par Bigger Than Fiction. Abonnez-vous à cette chaîne pour découvrir les prochains épisodes, tous les lundi. Vous pourrez aussi retrouver toute l’aventure de Morts A l’Aveugle, illustrée et animée, dans un western audio de 90 minutes sur cette vidéo Facebook Watch ! Soutenez Morts A l’Aveugle : laissez-nous une note et une critique en description ! 

[Dans l’épisode précédent : Fait prisonnier par Preston, James a annoncé aux Jakobites qu’un deuxième corps a été trouvé et qu’il a échoué à attraper Nirvelli, sa suspecte. La communauté doutant de plus en plus de la sincérité du cow-boy et les esprits se sont échauffés. De retour à Las Sangres, James réussit à s’échapper de cellule. Libre, il se précipita alors vers la Montagne Rouge. Assailli par ses pires démons intérieurs lors de son ascension, il rencontre Pecos. Le vieux sage lui livre la vérité sur Nirvelli, avant de tirer une flèche sur James.] James se réveille en sursaut aux côtés d’une Maé qui ne reconnaît plus l’homme qu’elle aime... Avec les voix d’Alison Wheeler (Mae), Louane Emera (Rosanna), Joël Zaffarano, voix française d'Hugh Jackman (James), Patrick Noérie, voix française de George Clooney (Preston), Bruno Choël, voix française de Johnny Depp (Pecos), Hervé Jolly, voix française de Clint Eastwood (Jakob) , Thierry Desroses, voix française de Samuel L. Jackson (le prisonnier), Gabriel Bismuth-Bienaimé (Chupp), et Ludmila Ruoso (Nirvelli). Musique : Herman Dune. Scénario : Vincent L'Anthoën, Clément Gournay et Elise Costa. Réalisé par Julien Aubert. Morts à l’Aveugle est une création originale TCM Cinéma produite par Bigger Than Fiction. Abonnez-vous à cette chaîne pour découvrir les prochains épisodes, tous les lundi. Vous pourrez aussi retrouver toute l’aventure de Morts A l’Aveugle, illustrée et animée, dans un western audio de 90 minutes sur cette vidéo Facebook Watch ! Soutenez Morts A l’Aveugle : laissez-nous une note et une critique en description ! 

[Dans l’épisode précédent : En s’arrêtant sur la tombe de sa femme et de sa fille, James a appris de Jakob que l’épouse du pasteur fut elle-même tuée et défigurée par les comanches. Jakob se méfiant du shérif Preston, il a intimé le secret à James. Ce dernier est parti à la recherche de Pecos, mais, près de la rivière, sa route a croisé celle de l’indienne Nirvelli. Profitant de l’intervention du shérif, elle s’enfuit. Mais une nouvelle victime, scarifiée et énucléée, est découverte sur les berges de la rivière. Preston apprend qu’une série de meurtres frappe sa juridiction.] James, menotté, est conduit derrière les barreaux par un shérif avide d’en apprendre plus…  Avec les voix d’Alison Wheeler (Mae), Louane Emera (Rosanna), Joël Zaffarano, voix française d'Hugh Jackman (James), Patrick Noérie, voix française de George Clooney (Preston), Bruno Choël, voix française de Johnny Depp (Pecos), Hervé Jolly, voix française de Clint Eastwood (Jakob) , Thierry Desroses, voix française de Samuel L. Jackson (le prisonnier), Gabriel Bismuth-Bienaimé (Chupp), et Ludmila Ruoso (Nirvelli). Musique : Herman Dune. Scénario : Vincent L'Anthoën, Clément Gournay et Elise Costa. Réalisé par Julien Aubert. Morts à l’Aveugle est une création originale TCM Cinéma produite par Bigger Than Fiction. Abonnez-vous à cette chaîne pour découvrir les prochains épisodes, tous les lundi. Vous pourrez aussi retrouver toute l’aventure de Morts A l’Aveugle, illustrée et animée, dans un western audio de 90 minutes sur cette vidéo Facebook Watch ! Soutenez Morts A l’Aveugle : laissez-nous une note et une critique en description !  

[Dans l’épisode précédent : Rosanna et son frère Chupp ont persuadé James de se lancer à la poursuite du tueur. Un type, qui trafique avec les natifs, lui a appris que l’indienne Nirvelli a été bannie par sa tribu… Le vieux sage comanche Pecos en saurait-il plus sur cette histoire ?] James et Jakob se rencontrent sur la tombe de leurs proches respectifs. Le pasteur demande à James de se méfier du shérif Preston, qui semble entretenir de bien étranges relations avec les indiens...   Avec les voix d’Alison Wheeler (Mae), Louane Emera (Rosanna), Joël Zaffarano, voix française d'Hugh Jackman (James), Patrick Noérie, voix française de George Clooney (Preston), Bruno Choël, voix française de Johnny Depp (Pecos), Hervé Jolly, voix française de Clint Eastwood (Jakob) , Thierry Desroses, voix française de Samuel L. Jackson (le prisonnier), Gabriel Bismuth-Bienaimé (Chupp), et Ludmila Ruoso (Nirvelli). Musique : Herman Dune. Scénario : Vincent L'Anthoën, Clément Gournay et Elise Costa. Réalisé par Julien Aubert. Morts à l’Aveugle est une création originale TCM Cinéma produite par Bigger Than Fiction. Abonnez-vous à cette chaîne pour découvrir les prochains épisodes, tous les lundi. Vous pourrez aussi retrouver toute l’aventure de Morts A l’Aveugle, illustrée et animée, dans un western audio de 90 minutes sur cette vidéo Facebook Watch !  Soutenez Morts A l’Aveugle : laissez-nous une note et une critique en description ! 

[Dans l’épisode précédent : Accompagné de Rosanna, la fille de Jakob, James a découvert au bord de la rivière le corps sans vie d'Abigaël, une adolescente Jakobite. Torturée, défigurée, ses yeux ont été arrachés. James a été pris d’une crise d’angoisse, alors que le cri d’une indienne résonnait sur les hauteurs…]  James et Rosanna se sont enfuis et retournent rapporter leur macabre découverte à la communauté, alors que Jakob est en plein sermon.    Avec les voix d’Alison Wheeler (Mae), Louane Emera (Rosanna), Joël Zaffarano, voix française d'Hugh Jackman (James), Patrick Noérie, voix française de George Clooney (Preston), Bruno Choël, voix française de Johnny Depp (Pecos), Hervé Jolly, voix française de Clint Eastwood (Jakob) , Thierry Desroses, voix française de Samuel L. Jackson (le prisonnier), Gabriel Bismuth-Bienaimé (Chupp), et Ludmila Ruoso (Nirvelli). Musique : Herman Dune. Scénario : Vincent L'Anthoën, Clément Gournay et Elise Costa. Réalisé par Julien Aubert. Morts à l’Aveugle est une création originale TCM Cinéma produite par Bigger Than Fiction. Abonnez-vous à cette chaîne pour découvrir les prochains épisodes, tous les lundi. Vous pourrez aussi retrouver toute l’aventure de Morts A l’Aveugle, illustrée et animée, dans un western audio de 90 minutes sur cette vidéo Facebook Watch !  Soutenez Morts A l’Aveugle : laissez-nous une note et une critique en description ! 

1856. Las Sangres, Nouveau-Mexique. Une petite communauté religieuse vit en dehors de la ville. Jakob, son charismatique pasteur, a recueilli James, un cowboy devenu sédentaire suite à un mystérieux drame lié aux Comanches. Ce dernier est depuis tenaillé par des hallucinations. Il trouve aussi du réconfort dans les bras de Mae, la serveuse du saloon, une femme fière et indépendante. Une nuit, James entend le cri de terreur d’une jeune femme. Accompagné de Rosanna, la fille du pasteur, il s’aventure du côté de la rivière… Avec les voix d’Alison Wheeler (Mae), Louane Emera (Rosanna), Joël Zaffarano, voix française d'Hugh Jackman (James), Patrick Noérie, voix française de George Clooney (Preston), Bruno Choël, voix française de Johnny Depp (Pecos), Hervé Jolly, voix française de Clint Eastwood (Jakob) , Thierry Desroses, voix française de Samuel L. Jackson (le prisonnier), Gabriel Bismuth-Bienaimé (Chupp), et Ludmila Ruoso (Nirvelli). Musique : Herman Dune. Scénario : Vincent L'Anthoën, Clément Gournay et Elise Costa. Réalisé par Julien Aubert. Morts à l’Aveugle est une création originale TCM Cinéma produite par Bigger Than Fiction. Abonnez-vous à cette chaîne pour découvrir les prochains épisodes, tous les lundi. Vous pourrez aussi retrouver toute l’aventure de Morts A l’Aveugle, illustrée et animée, dans un western audio de 90 minutes sur cette vidéo Facebook Watch !  Soutenez Morts A l’Aveugle : laissez-nous une note et une critique en description ! 

Abonnez-vous pour être notifié.e à la sortie de l’épisode 1 ! Morts à l’Aveugle est une série audio qui vous transporte en 1856 à Las Sangres, Nouveau-Mexique. A la croisée du thriller et du western, ce blockbuster audio est porté par les voix d’Alison Wheeler (Mae), Louane Emera (Rosanna), Joël Zaffarano, voix française d'Hugh Jackman (James), Patrick Noérie, voix française de George Clooney (Preston), Bruno Choël, voix française de Johnny Depp (Pecos), Hervé Jolly, voix française de Clint Eastwood (Jakob) , Thierry Desroses, voix française de Samuel L. Jackson (le prisonnier), Gabriel Bismuth-Bienaimé (Chupp), et Ludmila Ruoso (Nirvelli). Musique : Herman Dune. Scénario : Vincent L'Anthoën, Clément Gournay et Elise Costa. Réalisé par Julien Aubert. Morts à l’Aveugle est une création originale TCM Cinéma produite par Bigger Than Fiction. Abonnez-vous à cette chaîne pour découvrir les prochains épisodes, tous les lundi. Vous pourrez aussi retrouver toute l’aventure de Morts A l’Aveugle, illustrée et animée, dans un western audio de 90 minutes sur cette vidéo Facebook Watch !  Soutenez Morts A l’Aveugle : laissez-nous une note et une critique en description ! 

La Fédération des communautés francophones et acadienne (FCFA) du Canada et les Réseaux en immigration francophone (RIF) poursuivent, jusqu’au 3 octobre 2018, des sessions dans de nombreuses villes de l’Ouest canadien. En Saskatchewan, un projet pilote intitulé “Initiative des communautés accueillantes” a été présenté en début de semaine, Au Manitoba, une Étude sur les réfugiés d’expression française de Winnipeg et Saint-Boniface a été rendue publique il y a une dizaine de jours. Beaucoup de raison de parler des différentes formes d’immigration dans l’Ouest Ibrahima Diallo, professeur de microbiologie à l’Université de Saint-Boniface, Patrick Noël, professeur d’histoire à l’Université de Saint-Boniface, et Wilgis Agossa, responsable des communications pour l’Accueil francophone, créé en 2003.

On Party Politics this week, co-hosts Jay Aiyer and Brandon Rottinghaus are going to catch you up on the week’s political news: Texas: Texas health building invaded by mold, raising health concerns Austin State Hospital 127 sick Fetal burial remains trial ends Abbott tracker called out! Patrick: No plans to debate Collier/against Red Flag laws National:  Pompeo to testify about Trump summits/Trump v Iran Cohen Tapes/Carter Page FISA Maria Butina: Spy Trump considering revoking security clearances Farm Aid—This time it’s not Willie and Mellencamp—but Trump You can subscribe to the podcast on Apple Podcasts. Tweet us using or email partypoliticspod@houstonpublicmedia.org.  Party Politics is produced by Don Geraci, the audio engineer is and our digital editor is Giselle Bueno.

Kat: Okay. Oh. How do I do this? Wait for it. Patrick: Got to do it. Kat: Are you going [crosstalk 00:00:42] through the snow? Patrick: Yeah I'm going through the snow. I got it at like 60 degrees in here right now. It's 60 degrees in my house, I have no idea why. Kat: Is that cold? Patrick: To me it is, yes. Kat: Does that mean cold, I don't understand your language. Patrick: To me it is very cold. To me its subzero temperature, I'm absolutely freezing right now. I'm about to die of a cold or flu. Kat: Your dying? Patrick: Yup. I have not gone [crosstalk 00:01:11] Kat: It's a sad state. I'm going to ... Patrick: Hold on let me [crosstalk 00:01:18] Kat: I'm finding out what temperature that is. I'm Googling it so everybody understands what's happening. Patrick: Oh yeah, it doesn't translate. Doesn't translate in your language. Kat: Oh, it's 15 degrees. Hang on I've got to shut the door, there's window men right outside my door and it's super noisy. One second. Patrick: 15 degrees. Holy shit, what the fuck happened to my computer. So what's up everybody, hello, hello, welcome everybody. I'll go ahead and say that. Hello? Kat: What's up? Patrick: [inaudible 00:01:47] everybody's already said something. I don't know, my computer just took a shit. I've no idea. So did you say 15 degrees, your words? This is retarded. Hold on. I can't hear you. Kat: [inaudible 00:02:04] must be dying. Patrick: I can't, what the [crosstalk 00:02:06] Kat: Am I back? Am I back? Patrick: Yeah you're back. Oh, I forgot we're on my internet connection. Kat: Yeah I had ... No, it's because I put my earplugs in because my house cleaner is upstairs vacuuming. Patrick: Oh well how fancy, how fancy. Kat: I'm very fancy, you know that. Patrick: Very fancy with your extravagance earbuds. Kat: So I said that everybody should send you a love heart shower because you're surviving in only 15.555 degree Celsius right now, for the Australians. Now, if people are from Melbourne though, which is my hometown, they're going to be like, "Harden the fuck up, that's warm," but here where I live that's horrible. Horrible. Nobody should have to endure those sort of ... Patrick: Yeah, these are very horrible circumstances. [crosstalk 00:02:58] Kat: Nobody should have to endure those sort of subzero temperatures. Patrick: Nobody should be asked to endure these subzero temperatures, I'll tell you that. All right. Kat: All right. I might need some assistance. Can you help me out? Patrick: What do you got? Kat: Should I wear my hair like this? Should I wear my hair like that or behind? Or on one side? What's the best livestream hair? Patrick: I kind of like it behind. Kat: Out? Patrick: That looks good. Kat: Behind, all right. There you go everybody. Patrick: There you go. That looks good. Kat: We're going to talk about [crosstalk 00:03:37] Patrick: That's the queen Kat look. Kat: [crosstalk 00:03:39] Cleopatra. Patrick: She says, Angela said, [inaudible 00:03:43] I'm in Texas right now. Texas by way of Bali, very, very soon. In the next month, no, no, this month. This month, I'm going next week, next week. Kat: This week maybe. Maybe even tomorrow. Patrick: No I have to wait till the weekend. Kat: Oh well. Patrick: Have to wait till the weekend because [crosstalk 00:04:04] I have to move my stuff. Kat: Time and space is just, time is just an illusion anyway. The weekend could mean tomorrow. Could mean today. Could all be one day. That's extended into itself. Patrick: Time is an illusion [crosstalk 00:04:18] Kat: I think I'm going to take these out again now. I'm going to take these out again now because they're annoying me. Patrick: What is [inaudible 00:04:25] giving you a delay? I'm going to drop this in my [crosstalk 00:04:30] Kat: No, I just prefer no earbuds and the vacuuming stopped. But check it out, I'm sorry that I keep doing this to you Patrick, but I'm going to do it anyway. Are you ready? Patrick: I'm ready. Kat: I'm just eating my bacon and eggs with my Vegemite while in waiting for us to go live. Patrick: Oh my God. Oh my god. Kat: I was halfway through eating. Patrick: How are you destroying this fucking meal with that shit? That's an all American meal, and you're just going to destroy it with that. Destroy it, it's completely just- Kat: Look, pay attention. You want to put the Vegemite straight onto your eggs. Straight on. Patrick: What's that green thing? I don't want to put that Vegemite anywhere near my eggs. I don't want it anywhere near any of my food. Kat: That's avocado. Patrick: Oh that's an avocado? Kat: That's avocado. Patrick: I thought you all had green eggs and ham over there or something because I don't even know. Kat: You want to eat that with, look, pay attention. Patrick: I have no idea what you all have over there. Kat: You want to put a little bit of Vegemite on the avocado, eat it like that. I don't know why I get so much enjoyment from doing this to you. Patrick: [crosstalk 00:05:29] it's just crazy how different people's taste buds are. Kat: It's so good. Patrick: What you just did- Kat: It's just because- Patrick: What you just did was the equivalent of somebody spraying a cat turd on a fucking piece of toast and eating it to me, that's just what I just saw you do. Kat: I'd love to have some toast. [crosstalk 00:05:52] I'd love to have toast with avocado. You also- Patrick: What's up [crosstalk 00:05:57] on here. Feel like we're getting delayed [crosstalk 00:06:00] again, we're delayed. Kat: We're not delayed. The internet just doesn't know how to keep up with us, but really you should also always dip your bacon straight into the Vegemite. Pay attention. Look. Patrick: I'm not paying attention to that, it's fucking heresy. Kat: Because salt with bacon. The saltiness, it's like extra salt in it. It's great. Patrick: That's the most disgusting thing. Kat: So yesterday- Patrick: You're so beautiful and then you do such disgusting things to yourself. It's just weird. It's like [crosstalk 00:06:37] weird, it's like- Kat: It's part of my mystique. Patrick: Why did this very creative hot chick just do the nastiest thing. It's like watching a shizer video. Know what shizer is, [crosstalk 00:06:44] the German [crosstalk 00:06:45] Kat: I'm sorry, but thanks. No. No. But I appreciate the compliment. Patrick: No. Have no idea [crosstalk 00:06:51] Kat: But I can't help it, it's part of my mystique. Patrick: That's not mystique, that's not. Kat: But it's actually ... Do I need to know? Patrick: What'd you say? We've got a delay, we've got a delay. Kat: Do I need to know? No I was waiting for you, do I need to know or understand? Patrick: Well you're from Germany, so you should know. It's basically German scat porn basically. You know what scat porn is? Have you ever heard of it? Kat: I don't watch any German porn. Currently I don't watch German porn. I watch regular, all American or Australian porn. Patrick: Well I'm saying that you can know of it, you can know of it. There's different types you know, when you're scrolling through you're going to see some different categories. There's grandma, there's all sorts [crosstalk 00:07:38] of different types. Then there's German shizer, there's scat porn, you just happen to be scrolling by it, see it, sometimes. Kat: So basically what's happened here is we came on to do a recoded conversation about art and resistance and flow and we're talking about German porn? Patrick: Yes. Particularly the scat variety. You invited me on here. Kat: I just like to keep- Patrick: You fucking invited me on here. Kat: I think you said we need to record our conversation. You said I believe ... Thank you. You said I believe it's time to record our conversation again or something like that I believe it is. You messaged me yesterday and then you must have rudely just gone to bed straight after messaging me because I needed help, I was stuck in the resistance, I wrote back to you with a happy faced emoji. Then you must have gone to sleep so I just had to live in the resistance all by myself with nobody to kick my ass. Patrick: Yeah, I saw that, I was like man [crosstalk 00:08:38] Kat: And that's how I ended up with [crosstalk 00:08:39] Patrick: That was a weird thing to wake up to, I was like wow, you were in the, you, Kat of all people in the resistance? Now that's the part usually reserved for me. I'm the one that likes to play in the resistance. Kat: I know, it's mind blowing. The truth is maybe I just don't talk about it enough. It's like quicksand, it was dragging me into it. It was probably a Vegemite deficiency in my bloodstream. There was definitely a flow deficiency in my bloodstream. Patrick: It's all coming to a head you know. It's finally attacking your nervous system. Kat: The Vegemite? Or the flow? Patrick: Yes. Kat: So then okay, so this morning I went to Muay Thai and I was doing my rounds in the ring and I couldn't breathe properly. It's fucking annoying because I'm very fit, but my fitness just wasn't there. He's like, "What's going on?" And I said to him, my trainer, "I think I'm just not connected to my body properly yet." Like I haven't connected into my body yet because my mind's thinking about other stuff and we had already done maybe three or four rounds. I was going hard, but I was just like kind of breathing like that, but I wasn't feeling anxious about anything. So then it was just fucking annoying, but as soon as I, like we got to maybe 30 or 40 minutes into the session even, and then you feel that switch click and you connect to flow and you're just like holy shit, it's on and you're in that dance and that super flow. Kat: It's exactly like business. I was saying to my trainer this morning it's like, you're like, ugh, even I get this, I get it every fucking day. Like people maybe think I'm motivated because I do so much content. Well I'm driven by, I hate the fucking feeling of when I don't do my content. I just feel like shit if I don't do my art, but that doesn't mean that when I sit my ass in the chair that it's flowing. It's often exactly the same as at the start of that workout where the first 10 or 20 or 30 or even 40 minutes, you just feel like you're wading through quicksand. You don't feel connected properly and you're not breathing deeply and then you're thinking, this shit, what am I even writing. Even yesterday after I messaged you then I was like fuck you, apparently you're not going to message me back and save me, so I'm going to have to write something myself and figure it out. [crosstalk 00:11:07] Patrick: [inaudible 00:11:10] all the time. Kat: And I write something, I write a blog anyway, but it was so shit. I posted it anyhow on Facebook, it was just the lamest thing I've ever posted in the history of time. It's still there, everyone can see it from yesterday. Even my team are like, "What is this, is this a blog? Are we supposed to put this on the Instagram story? What is this actually, there's no photo, it's not long enough." No, they weren't really ... But my point is you just got to do that damned thing anyway. You don't wait for flow, you get into flow. Sometimes you've got to get in and it's like a tumultuous, whitewater river and you just got to get pounded under the water again and again and knocked back down. Then at some point it's like boom, I'm in the flow zone. Everyone just wants to be in the flow zone, but you don't get there without being willing to go through the quicksand a bit. Patrick: No, it's funny you mention this now and I glad we're on here talking about this because I actually had exactly what you're talking about happened today, but fortunately ... So, did you ever get back into, did you ever reach flow or did you just spend the whole day just not, you didn't get there? Or did you finally get there? Kat: Yesterday, you know what, I wrote the damn post anyway. I published a post, I put a sales call to action on the end because I fucking show up for my art, that's my commitment. I'm very consistent. I'm probably the most consistent person on the internet with content, I believe. And I'm personally doing all my content myself as well, it's not like you know some people put a tonne of content out there, but how much content are they actually doing. Patrick: Mm-hmm (affirmative). Kat: I think I'm like the most consistent person out there. So I posted the damn post anyway, I had to cut it short because I was meeting somebody and I knew that he was going to be there any minute. I was like all right, I didn't even have the time to get into my flowzone, I had like 12 minutes. I'm like fuck, I'll write something. I still wrote a damn blog, I still put a sales call to action on the end. I was like, this is bullshit, but, I don't know how many likes or comments are on it, but the people who commented and liked it, the people who commented were like, "This is exactly what I needed." And so it's about getting out of your own way, but then after that I went on a walk for like two hours. Had a good conversation and then came home and I still wasn't quite in that flowzone and I thought I could livestream last night and snap myself into it. But I didn't, resistance got me by the ass. I sat around for a bit, fucked around, pretending to do things on the computer and then I just went to bed. Kat: But, this morning, I don't know if you read my blog this morning. It was so good, it might be one the best posts I've written this year. It's called, "You're not a marketer you're an artist. A tortured one or not, and you'd better start fucking acting like it," or something like that. When I wrote that [crosstalk 00:13:55] blog ... Huh? Patrick: I saw it, I usually read your stuff at night on my time, nighttime you know. At the end of my day I'll read it. So you kind of catch me whenever I haven't read it yet. Kat: You're going to like that one. I'm so happy with that. You know when you write something or you do a livestream and you're just like oh, yeah, I fucking nailed it. Or, I didn't even know what I wrote, but I got what I want from it. I got that release and that connection to soul and then I went straight to training to Muay Thai then I was disconnected for 35 minutes. Then I got in the zone and holy shit, the last 15 or 20 minutes of my workout this morning, I have not brutalised myself like that in a while. It was so good, like I was nearly collapsing onto the floor. It's like that voice in your head that's like oh, are you going to die, are you going to die, you think you're going to fall down and die? You can't keep going? Are you dead yet? No, then keep fucking going bitch. I was just smack talking myself and I was so on the edge of being like I need timeout, I need to stop early. Kat: I just kept going and I kept thinking of, like I always remember Arnold Schwarzenegger saying that your body can go so much further than your mind. Like when you think that your body is done, whether it's in training, but also with the business. Your writing, your art, it's such a load of bullshit. I love nothing better than kicking my own ass and being like oh, you think you're hurting, you think this hurts? Keep fucking going. It's the most empowering feeling in the world. I literally collapsed onto the floor in the ring at the end of the session. Within a second though I had the biggest smile on my face already even though I was in agony. Kat: It's just, I don't know, I don't know how many people relate to that, but I love the pain, the purposeful pain. Otherwise, you just feel like you're not alive. So that resistance got me yesterday, but then today I eliminated it. Patrick: Well I know we were talking, the night before I believe, we were talking about how to say enjoy resistance. We were also talking about some of the things that were going on with your spot and where you were living at and things like that. We were talking about being where you were at and that you might have to create new challenges for yourself. You think this is maybe a product of that? Maybe your mind switched over to that, maybe you wanted some more resistance and you brought that to yourself? Kat: Maybe, that's a good point. Yeah, we had a phone call the other night that went for nearly three hours. At the end we were like fuck, we forgot to record our phone call again, so that we can sell it to everybody. It was so good. So now we- Patrick: It was good. Kat: No we're doing this for everyone. You can send [crosstalk 00:16:38] us a love heart [inaudible 00:16:40] huh? Patrick: Some love hearts to what? Kat: To thank us for being here and speaking. Patrick: Oh yeah, for sure. Check this out though, so we talked about that right and then so now that was happening, this resistance was happening. Now I've been like, the resistance is easing up on me. I've been going through fucking resistance because I'm a glutton for punishment. I don't know what do they call it, sadistic? No, it was masochist, what's the one where you like to get kicked in the balls? Kat: Isn't one of them like means you like to hurt other people and one means you like to hurt yourself? Masochist is you like self punishment I think. Patrick: Yeah, I think that's the one. Kat: And sadist is you like to hurt other people. Patrick: Yeah, yeah. Yeah, one of those two, the one where you get kicked in the balls. Obviously that's what I'm going through right now, I like to kick myself in the balls here. I've been going through that resistance, what we talked about on the phone. Maybe I want to, obviously yes, of course, why the fuck, how could it be any other way? How could it be any other way? Anything that you're going through, any resistance that you have in your life is because you want it to be there. Plain and simple. There's no other way around it, if you take responsibility for everything in your life as you should, as you should. If you believe in manifestation, if you believe it's all in your control. If you fucking believe in manifestation, [inaudible 00:18:03] you can alter your body by eating donuts or ramen noodle soups and still lose weight. If you believe that you have that [crosstalk 00:18:12] kind of control- Kat: Who said anything about donuts? Patrick: If you believe that you have that kind of control over the universe, then you better damn fucking well believe that you're making this shit up. That you're making up the resistance, you're creating the resistance. You're creating the despair, the feeling, the thoughts or the anguish. All that shit you want to, you fucking masochist you. You want the kick in the balls for some reason. Patrick: Okay, well I'm tired of the kick in the balls I guess. I must be done with it because today, so and then we're talking about now we're talking about my day. What's up Johnny? What's up Pistol Pete. Then we're talking about, now it's kind of easing up on me right. I woke up this morning and I saw your message, I'm like damn, I left her in the cooker last night. She's just, it's like I can't believe I saw this message of resistance here. I'm like, I was blown away by it you know, but I knew you were asleep, so obviously went about my day. Patrick: I started out my day just like you're talking about. I couldn't get into where I was trying to go. I was getting wrapped up and started right out the gate getting into shit that's not my art. Started getting into stuff pertaining to my other business, which I had put a cutoff date. We had just got done talking about that, saying fuck everything until noon or whatever, you know, until we get going. Right off the bat I start getting things happening though that were saying to me that some resistance was being overcome in the other business. So I was like huh, so I took the bait you know. I took the bait. Patrick: Not only that, last night I had found a blog post that I had written and I had never posted it. I got scared about it and I didn't post it. I was acting like a little bitch and I left it there. And so I discovered it and I was like fuck, I had already wrote a blog post that night. So, I had two blog posts and so I was happy about that, I'm like okay, I've got two. I'm going to drop those tomorrow. So I'm feeling good about that. I went to sleep and I woke up and immediately some things started happening at the other business, some resistance was overcoming the other business. I'm like fuck, okay, okay we're making some headway here so this is good. I jump right in this, it's like 8:00 in the morning, I jump right into that and start going to mess with my other business. Patrick: I get caught up with all that and next thing you know 12:00 comes around. I'm slugging, but I had been throughout the day doing tiny things because I'd been, I'm going to post content all day. Today, I'm just going to have a day where I post all content. You know on my Instagram, I'm going to post content throughout the day on my Facebook, I'm going to post whatever. I had just been starting to feel it again. Started to post things and they were getting a lot of engagement on them you know, just things that I would think, I'd post it and just small things you know, not real boring blog posts. Patrick: Then I drop my blog post on there, sprinkle that because I had that ace up my sleeve, so I drop the blog post, bam. I drop the other blog post, bam. Then it just started to come together, right. Then we rolled right into, right about 12:00 noon or so I took a little nap and then 1:00 PM and then the resistance just started to go down. All just starts to crumble right? Kat: Yeah. Patrick: Everything starts going right. I just start banging out all sorts of stuff. Me and Travis ended up doing, we just got done off of a livestream, which generated a lot of new people into our circle and to his audience. I'm jumping on here with you and now this is going, this is a great one right, so just like all the ones that we do. And so, it just started rolling, that's been my day. It just started rolling, and it started out just like you talked about though. It's very sluggish, but it took me till about 1:00 PM till it just started to roll really good, but I stuck with it. I stuck with it, I just kept on thinking I've posted, but it was like bite sized pieces of content that I kept dropping that led up to it. Kat: Yup. Exactly. Exactly and we talked about this when we were on the phone the other night that was like until 2:00 AM my time, that massive phone call. I said the same thing about when you're working out and it's like the first 10 or 20 minutes or however long, you just feel like fuck this shit. I don't really want to be here, I'm not feeling it. That was me this morning in the ring, I was like oh, fuck. Okay, yeah, I'm here, I'm doing what I need to be doing, but my mind was like why am I here. I'm not really vibing with this and I wish I didn't come today or whatever. You just fucking learn over the years, you figure it out finally when time is passing you by in your life and then you still didn't do the damn shit that you said you were going to do. At some point you just figure the shit out where you're like, oh fuck. Kat: I can remember, probably five years ago I can remember feeling like I think I was waiting, I thought there would be a point in my life where I would evolve to being a person whose always motivated and always ready, always has the inspired ideas and wants to do the damn thing. I remember one day it just kind of smacked me in the face like a wake-up call where I was like, oh shit, I just realised that for the rest of my life I will still battle resistance because it's part of the human condition. Particularly as an artist, resistance is inherent to being an artist, that's why I wrote this morning about the tortured soul. Probably your blog influenced my post this morning a little bit because you know, like I told you, when I got up in the morning before I journal I always read something. There's only like five people whose shit I'll read and I checked if you posted something new. I checked, you had posted something new so I read your blog and it was full-on. For me I found that full-on to read to hear the voices inside of your head. I was like holy shit that was so raw, it was like everybody should go read that blog. It's on your personal profile right? Patrick: Appreciate it. Kat: Go read it. But it was kind of painful to read, I found it kind of painful to read. Patrick: That's so funny you said that, [crosstalk 00:24:31] somebody messaged me, two people messaged me and they said the exact fucking same thing. They said, "I can't believe that shit. I did not know you wrote like that," and they said that it was painful. I said, "Well, what's painful about it?" It was like, "Well, it's painful to read." Two women you know, so I was wondering why is it painful for you to read it, you know what I mean? That's what I was wondering because I really was thinking about connecting with guys for it you know, more along the lines with the guys. Kat: Well, for me personally I found it painful to read because I care about you. I was like, that's like hearing somebody that you care about saying that shit about themselves, it's like fuck, it just felt painful for me for that reason. I don't know about what other people's reasons are, but also because I could relate to it. At first, I was thinking this so fucking full-on I can't believe you say that shit inside of your head, I found it shocking. Kat: Then I was like wait, why do I find it shocking, it's only shocking because you're writing it down because I've said all that same sort of shit to myself many times over as well. In my way, about my own stuff and if people heard the voices inside my head I'm sure they'd be shocked. Like you were taken aback even by me just simply saying that I'm in resistance, right? Now think about the shit that you put in that blog, it was extreme. Well I think that's why at first I was like, this is so full-on, like I felt shocked or upset about it just relevant to you personally, not in a general sense. Then I was like wait, no, it's just because this is a very raw, extreme thing for somebody to write down. I definitely have said so much to inside of my own head. Kat: Then I loved the way you finished the post like where basically you choose each day, every day you have those voices in your head and then you have the voice that's saying that you can and that you will. Then that is now what you do, you do your damn journaling, you do your content, you're showing up for your business and for your art. That's exactly the same as me and that's what I've always done and that's what I've done to get to this point. Now, for sure I don't have as much of those voices as I used to, it is less because I guess I've proven myself, to myself to whatever degree. Kat: But it's still here and that's what I think so many people don't understand about me. I'm not, or about anyone, about you as well, you do your livestreams every day, I do my content every day. People then go, oh no well I couldn't be like Patrick or I couldn't be like Kat. They're motivated, they're good on camera or whatever it is, but then go and read what you wrote about how you feel about yourself some of the time. Or if somebody could hear inside of my head and the smack talk that goes on in there. It's about realising that yeah, as you keep going and as time passes it will get easier, and I think you said this in your post, it gets easier because you learn how to deal with it. I feel like I learned how to dance with resistance and I can see it for the bullshit that it is, whereas maybe earlier on in my life I tended to believe it more. Kat: Now even if I feel like I'm believing it a little bit, I'll be like, yeah, no, I know exactly what's going on here. I do know what the answer is because fucking 20 years of training, of fitness training, has taught me how to get into flow and how to breakthrough resistance and discipline my ass and if you're not dead yet you keep going. Then many, many years in business as well has taught me the same thing, so I always know that the answer is too fucking bad, sit your ass down and do the damn thing. Sometimes it will feel fucking incredible, like today when I wrote my blog I was on the biggest high. I got in the car and I was just slamming my best tunes and then driving down to the fight gym. I was like, this is the best day ever, I'm so in the zone and that's an amazing feeling. Kat: I wish I could have that feeling every day, but yesterday felt like quicksand day. It doesn't matter right, like some days you'll feel superflow, some days you won't, so the fuck what. Either way you keep going, but for sure because I read your blog first and then normally I read a piece, I read if you write something or [inaudible 00:28:44] or whoever else I read, like such a small handful of people. Then I go into my journaling and then usually I write my blog after that. Today I read your blog first and then it really did impact me a lot, then I went straight into writing my blog, I didn't even do anything on [crosstalk 00:29:00] yet today, which is [crosstalk 00:29:01] Patrick: Damn, did my blog fuck your day up? Did my blog fuck your day up? Kat: No, no, it's the opposite because I had to write straight after that. Patrick: Oh, that's good. Kat: I went straight into writing that piece, but I was partly responding to you and partly I was thinking about one of my inner circle clients and partly it was for myself. Okay wait, we're going to need to start again because Brandon just jumped on and he asked that we start again. So where we started [crosstalk 00:29:26]- Patrick: I believe we started without him. Kat: Was with me dipping the bacon into the Vegemite. We got to start with the bacon and the Vegemite if we're starting from the top. Patrick: Can we please not? Kat: Anyway- Patrick: Brandon dammit, this was a bad day for that. Even though you're eating [crosstalk 00:29:39] Kat: Yeah, no, [crosstalk 00:29:40] read my blog later you'll see my blog was partly like it's speaking to you and like I was talking to you, but then I was talking to myself, but then I was talking to one of my clients and I told her that. It was just, I kind of love that because something you wrote definitely impacted what I created and what I created will be impacting other people. It's just amazing, it's the collective unconscious. Patrick: Well I saw your blog post and it jumped out at me. I was like this is something that I have to read, I just saw the title and I can't remember exactly what it said. I just saw it and I was like, I'm going to have to read that later on because I immediately saw it and I was feeling like, I don't know it was kind of geared towards me or something. The words weren't like that, but I just felt that, you know what I mean? Kat: Yeah, and I knew, usually I don't tell somebody if I write a blog that's skewed towards them because I know you're going to feel it anyway. It's not always, but often I'll be thinking of a particular person when I'm writing. It started off towards you and then it became about me. I thought it was going to be, I thought the post was going to be about honouring and respecting the artist, being like my soul recognises the artist in your soul, that sort of thing. Like the respect that I have for that and then it turned into kind of like a smack down post where I was kicking ass and I think that was at myself. Then at the end I was like fuck, this was not supposed to be about me. Then I brought it back around again and it just came out however it came out. Patrick: Oh see everything that I read, I'm like thinking, everything I read from you I'm thinking this is to me right. Kat: Everybody does, especially when I do, I don't know do you get this sometimes or have you had this happen, but if I do a post that's really quite brutal I'll tend to get like 20 people message me and they'll be like, "I know you were talking about me." And I'm like, "Well, if you think that I was, then maybe I was." Patrick: That could be the case, but I used to think that all the time when I worked for Ryan. I would always say and he'd said if you think, he said the same thing. If you think it is, it is. So, you're right, it's right, in the case if you think it is, it is, right. It's for you, it's for you if you are triggered by the wording. But I wrote mine like a while back and then I didn't feel anything about posting it. When I found it I was like, yes, I found it. I was like I'm going to post this now, no problem. I remember what you told me, it was like you should just not even think about it and just post it. So I posted it and it was apparently like real full-on, people said that. Patrick: I think that you do, like what I did was I was sitting there facing resistance big time whenever I started to write that. I was facing one of the biggest challenges of my life, which was making our first sale since we went out on our own, and it wasn't happening. It was taking like two weeks, I mean we were in this thing for like two weeks, damn near a month. I was sitting there, and I'm sure I had probably talked to you the night before, something like that. I was writing, I started to write the beginning of it you know, just to start thinking about what kind of shit you say to yourself whenever, or the kind of shit that people say to themselves whenever they're facing that. I really wanted to know, I started thinking about the things that I was thinking at the time. Patrick: Then I was like, well this is bullshit because this is right around when the shit broke and we made ourselves and everything started to work out for the better. That was when I was really, really getting into it and getting into manifesting and writing and controlling it you know. Right before it happened I just said, I'm just going to take all these things that are being said and I'm just going to go with it. As much as I can I'm just going to just get it all out there. Everything that I hear on the stream of thought, I'm going to just write it down as I go. Patrick: And so, I did, I just started fucking like turned on some music and I just started. Every one of the resistant thoughts that came through, I just typed as it was coming. I was like this is some fucking creative ass ways to talk shit to myself, you know, of this voice in my head that's talking this shit. Just so creative and the ways it says, the lies it says about you. I just put it down and it was just endless and relentless and didn't stop. I just had to stop it myself you know. It would have just kept going. Kat: It was relentless. That's how, like I was reading it, I was sitting down at the coffee shop. I was like how fucking long is this going for? It's just getting worse and worse, but that's why it was painful, I was like fuck me, I thought it would be finished now, it's still going? Then I was thinking, I hope there's going to be a reframe at the end of this and it's not just going to finish. And then there was. Patrick: The end. Your life is horrible. But I got it [crosstalk 00:35:01] it was like an experiment to just fucking just see if it would stop you know, but it wouldn't. I had to stop it myself which I guess you could say something about that. You have to stop that fucking voice yourself. It's not going to stop on its own. You have to stop it because [crosstalk 00:35:21] it's there if you want- Kat: You have to see it for what it is. Patrick: Yeah. Kat: You've got [crosstalk 00:35:25] to see it for what it is. Yeah, it's the devil. We were talking about this on the phone the other night. It's a seduction right? Patrick: Yes it is. Kat: Did you read Patrick's post Maria? It's like be prepared to be upset. If anyone reads that post, just be prepared to be upset, but it will be powerful for you. I think that we all think that we're the only ones who have those thoughts. It's natural to feel like if people knew the truth about me, or if people, like I should feel ashamed of myself or whatever. Everybody has those thoughts and then everyone looks at ... Yes, so Maria read your post, she's one of my inner circle clients, she said she was in tears. Exactly, I think for women in particular it's going to upset them. I thought it upset me because I had a personal interest, but I think it probably upsets everyone. Kat: It was very upsetting because it was so raw, but it's also incredibly healing. That's the sort of blog post that will heal people and probably healed you maybe when you wrote it or maybe by publishing it because it's so raw. That's the point I was trying to make in my blog this morning ... Where can you find this post, just click on, I'll get the link. I'm so helpful. I'll put the link here in the comments. Like I'm fucking up all my shit now. Kat: It's [crosstalk 00:36:45] like I wrote about this a little bit in my post that you've got to, to impact people, like yesterday I was talking to somebody new who I met about my business. I was explaining how I market, and he's an entrepreneurs as well with four amazing businesses, but a totally opposite sort of entrepreneur to me. We were talking about how the way that I show up on social media is the exact opposite of him. I put as much of myself out there as possible, and he's got as little of himself out there as possible. I was saying my system basically, my marketing is essentially I'll write these three thousand word blog posts every single day. The people who can get to the end of that and watch all my content are clearly, they're my soulmate clients or they wouldn't be sticking around that much. He was like- Patrick: I like that system. Kat: Holy shit, big long posts [inaudible 00:37:34] right, but he goes ... Oh yeah there's the blog. He goes, "Yeah, but that wouldn't work anymore would it," or something, or, "That's because you already built that up or something like that?" I'm was like, "No, no, it doesn't matter how crowded the internet is or how crowded Facebook is there is always going to be a space for the true artist to bear their soul." Like since the dawn of time, those of us who are storytellers, messengers and who actually reveal the raw shit inside of us, like what you wrote, was the painful, gritty, even ugly parts of the soul. It's almost like you don't want to look at it directly, it's like staring into the sun. It's too much, it's too intense, it feels too painful. Then at the same time it's magnetising and you can't look away. Kat: So somebody who can share a piece of their soul like that, like you do and like I do and like many people here do, really are very few people though in the total of the internet marketing world. That person doesn't fucking need to buy their followers like you livestreamed about yesterday and we talked about the other night. Or to worry about a fucking funnel or what's the best strategy or Facebook ads. Nothing wrong with doing your funnels and your whatever right, but it's the cherry on top. Anybody who can release a piece of their soul and is brave enough or willing to do that, will always have people that want to listen because it is a magnet. Kat: It's just mind blowing to me how so many amazing artists and messengers are out there wasting their lives thinking that the way to build a following or to make money is let me get my fucking funnel right or my strategy or my marketing for whatever bullshit. And let me have a pretty website on the internet and make sure that I have good head shots. Are you kidding me? Why don't you just strip yourself naked and show it to everybody? Your soul, right? That's all it takes. Patrick: Anybody [crosstalk 00:39:38] can have- Kat: Being willing to do that even in your own resistance. Patrick: And there's a lot of ego out there too. It's like everybody's got one of those, so how do you really separate yourself from everybody else. You know what I mean, everybody's got a marketing strategy, everybody's got a marketing plan. Everybody's got an ego, so how do you get that ... I get to talk to people today, I got to talk to somebody because of my blog post. One of my people, one of my people, as I call them true believers. He was going through some serious shit in his life, like some real, real horrifying shit that he told me about that I got to help him through, today. So to me to be able to help in such a way to change somebody's life, to save a life is, fuck, that's more important to me than the other shit. Patrick: The other shit's stupid and I wouldn't get that far with somebody if I didn't post something like I did, if I didn't say what I was really feeling I wouldn't get to say that. It wouldn't probably connect like that on that level with him. That to me is more rewarding than anything else I could be doing. Even if I have to take, for a while, you know it's going to be a while. I could go out here and make a marketing webinar and be very successful with it and make money off of it you know. I could do that. Kat: Successful. Patrick: Yeah, successful. Run traffic to it and do all ... I know how to do all that, I've done it. Or a book funnel or whatever you want to do. Whatever you want to do to make money. Give somebody an irresistible offer, tell them how to double or triple their income, whatever you want to do. That's fine, but understand that anybody can fucking do that. Anybody can do that. If you hold back, if you don't say what's on your mind, if you don't actually share a piece of yourself, then you're not really like an artist I don't think. You know? Then you're just giving people- Kat: You're not and you have to decide [crosstalk 00:41:46] if you want to be an artist first or a marketer first. Like, you're an amazing marketer, I know a lot about marketing as well. We can both do all that shit. I don't even think anybody can do it, it is still a skillset because plenty of people are trying to fucking do it and they're not doing anything, they're not getting anywhere with it. Kat: I did read a blog post one time by a mentor of mine from years back and she was like you got to choose, you're either an artist of an entrepreneur, who are you? I was like holy shit, she's right, I'm an artist first. I am an entrepreneur, I am a marketer, I where those hats and I've been an entrepreneur, like it's in my blood, I've been selling shit since I was three years old. But first and foremost I'm an artist. You've got to choose, you can't be in both camps. You can't be like, oh I'm an artist and I share from my soul and I do my soul purpose, but first let me build this pretty little funnel over here and then I'll be ready. It's bullshit. Kat: Nobody said you need that you needed the internet to get your message out there and to make money. Amazingly enough artist through the history of time have managed to have people fall in love with them without a Facebook page. I know it's mind blowing for everybody and you might need therapy [inaudible 00:42:57] and some sexual healing in order to come to terms with that, but you don't need any of that shit in order to get your message out there. What you do need is to be courageous enough to put the blinders on and just art, art, art, art, art because like we said, you have a true believer client as you call them, I call them my soulmate clients, who comes to you as a result of that post. That person is so connected to you now, there's instant trust, instant deep rapport, they become a longterm client who refer their friends and just be so in love with you and your message because they see themselves in you. Kat: Most people, you could do an automated webinar and get leads from that, like you said. You could become successful and I say successful like that because even if you were making great money doing that, which of course you could do and you know how to do. You would be, and we've talked about this many times, you would be miserable. You would be hating it, your soul would be dying because it wouldn't be doing your purpose work and you're essentially selling your soul to the wrong clients, the wrong people doing the shit that doesn't light you up. Kat: Whereas, when you go all in with your art yeah, like most people are going to be horrified at the idea of reading a daily two or three thousand word blog post or listening to a one hour livestream that you do. They're going to think that's crazy, who wants to listen to that. I've had people make fun of me so many times when I've had hater-ship online. Like, "Oh ha ha, who would read all that shit?" I'm like, "Well firstly I don't fucking care if anybody reads it because I'm writing it for me bitch, not for you. Secondly, clearly a few people are fricking reading it if you look at the business that I've created." Kat: So if somebody is going to read that or watch your webstream or read your post, then they come to you and talk to you, that person is a soulmate client for life. I'd rather 10 people like that than a 100,000 people that are fucking bored on Instagram or got off a webinar. Patrick: Well there going to fall off, those people are going to like, what people realise is how much of this bullshit that's out there that's the same. People don't show you their refunds, people don't show you their attrition rates. People are dropping off. They don't show you that shit. They don't show you that shit. All they'll show you is- Kat: Yeah, so true. So true and we talked about that the other night as well. Like my refund rate is like 0.000001%. I'll get like three refunds a year and two of them is because the person accidentally bought the same product twice. They're like shit, I didn't realise I already have it, can you refund me? Patrick: And I haven't had that one- Kat: That's not normal, what's the industry rate even? It's like- Patrick: It's crazy, it's like 30. Kat: 40 or 50% some of the time. Patrick: Yeah. Yeah, it's insane. Then people don't say that and then they don't say, they don't talk about you know, affiliates and things like that that they're doing. So numbers are fucking crazy you know what I mean? You can't even get into numbers there's so much bullshit out there. There's so much bullshit out there that you might as well just be truthful and honest and just put yourself out there. I get on here and I've got now these few people that come on, I mean anything that I do, they follow me around for whatever it is that I do. I did something with Travis today, which we did marketing and I dropped a link out there for our funnels and everything. I thought we're going to pull in these new prospects right and these clients for his side of things, you know his new audience and everybody who showed up was my people. They hopped on to see that we were talking marketing, they showed up, popped up. Kat: They watch you, or my people watch me instead of Netflix. My people say that all the time, they're like, "I can't believe what time it is and I'm still watching your content." That's all you want, but it's also like what we're saying here is your going to get a better result just following your art and making your marketing strategy should be your art. Then let's not forget also the selling of the soul side of it because even if it was true that you could make more money, which I do not believe, by following straight up internet marketing Stepford-preneurship you would be miserable, in sabotage, addicted to whatever shit that's not good instead of addicted to flow. And just not happy right? Kat: I did it that way, I built my business at first to where it was nearly at a million dollars a year because I did the fucking work and I did the marketing. I was right on the cusp of a million dollars a year in my business. This was in 2012, and I walked away. I shut the whole thing down, I walked away from all of it. I remember saying to my partner at the time, if this is the path to a million dollar business, I don't want it. I cannot do this anymore, I would rather go back to being a personal trainer. I said to him, "I'm going to give myself three months, give me three months. I'm going to prove that I can make money doing what I love, but fuck all that shit, I'm going all in doing what I want. If I don't do it in three months then I'll just go back to the gym and I'll be a trainer again because I know how to make a lot of money doing that." Kat: Well, I didn't do it in three months anyway, I ended up over $100,000 in debt and blew the whole thing up. Then eventually, eventually, I stayed though, I stuck to it and now look where I am because I've experienced what it's like to make good money by selling my soul. I mean, it's your life right, you want to be, this is like right now we're not really selling anything, but this is content. This is us filling ourselves up with our art and our craft. Even though we're not directly making an offer, how many people are becoming soulmate clients or true believer clients of each of us right now because of this content. Then we drop a link or we keep saying we're going to start recoding our personal phone calls and sell them. People are going to fucking buy that shit, like who wants to buy the recorded phone calls of when we talk to two or three hours- Patrick: I do. Kat: Because that shits gold, but sometimes we've got to keep it private. But, we'll figure it out. Patrick: Yeah, we got to keep some things private, a little bit, a little bit. Those are like extreme, super, super VIP shit. But Helen makes a good point, Helen's asking a good question here though, she says, "I get what you're saying," but she's surrounded by true artists putting themselves out there every day and never make any money, what would you say about that? Kat: Okay. Okay. Good, I'm so glad I asked this. Patrick: I like that one, yeah. Kat: I was ready to preach on this. I'm going to need a love heart shout-out first, send me the love hearts. Then I'll bring the [crosstalk 00:49:37] Kat show. Patrick: Can I do it to? [crosstalk 00:49:37] Kat: Can you do it too? Everybody shower me with the love heart. Oh there they come, thank you. Patrick: Shower. Kat: All right. I already answered these same questions to two or three clients earlier today when I was answering my client audios, so I'm prepared and I'm ready. Here's the thing right, money, money is just a decision and a choice right? Like yesterday I bought a new car, I'm also getting a new house and a few other things all at once. It is a big deal, I'm excited to get the car, I feel good about it. Yeah, there's some ego attached to it for sure because I feel like yeah, look at my badass car, but at the same time I don't need that in order to be happy or fulfilled right, I'm detached from it. When they didn't give me exactly what I wanted at the dealership I just left. I wasn't doing that as a strategy, I was like okay, I'm not attached, this is what I want, if you can't give it to me I'm leaving. I got in the car and drove away and of course, they called me eight minutes later and gave me what I wanted. Patrick: Sorry guys. Kat: Either way I [crosstalk 00:50:40] Patrick: I used to be one. Kat: But, yeah, you know how it works. I [inaudible 00:50:45] I'm leaving. And I literally was about to sign and then I just put the pen down, I'm like look I've got to go. I'm going to go see the house, I left. What I'm trying to say though is, I don't need the car, I'm not emotionally attached to the car in order to feel good enough, in order to feel worthy, in order to feel like I'm now complete and whole. The thing that fills you up and lights you up and gives you your sense of freedom and completeness and your happiness, your source of all things is being true to yourself and doing your art right? So then for the money, to me the car is the same sort of thing, whether it's a car, whether it's do I want to buy the fancy Voss water, whatever it is. It's just a decision, so I can choose the car or not choose the car, either way I'm whole and I'm complete, but am I going to choose the car, yeah it's fucking badass, it's a hot, sexy car. I'm going to choose the car because I like it and I can have it. Kat: Same as with money. Get out of the idea that there needs to be an emotional attachment around money, it's only money. Choose it or don't choose it, it's infinitely available. Like you can choose am I going to wear pants or a skirt today, it doesn't matter, why get emotionally attached to it, but it's always available. That's how I feel about money. One of the courses a I made in 2014 when I first figured this out for myself was called, "It's only money honey." I called the course, "It's only money honey," one of the best courses I've ever made, because it was like a slap in the face wake up call where I suddenly realised, fuck, I've been making it this really emotional thing. Like am I good enough for money, am I worthy for money. Imagine we did this right, like am I good enough for the Voss water, am I worthy of this, what are people going to think of me? Does this add to my value if I have this amazing water? Either just pick it up off the shelf or don't. It doesn't matter. Kat: And so that was like a breakthrough for me to go oh shit, money is just a decision, decide how much you want. Expect it the same way if you're in a restaurant and you put your order in, you know I'll have a steak and broccoli, you expect it, you assume it's going to turn up. You don't go into the kitchen and be like, am I good enough for this? Do you guys think I'm worthy of the steak, can I really have that? Is it being prepared and will I get it? You just order your fucking meal and then you sit down and you wait for it and you expect that it's going to show up. Then meanwhile you're in the now, being present with whoever you're with. Kat: Same with money, decide it. It's a decision. When you get out of the emotional attachment around money being a reflection of your worth or being something that's going to save you, then you'll realise that it's just something you decide. But you fret now, you think that money would make you more worthy or it's going to save you or it will fill you up or it will make you happy. Or you'll be, yeah, safer in some way or a better person in some way. Then you'll continue to keep it at arm's length because you're trying to validate yourself and you're trying to find your safety and security from something outside of you, which is not possible. Kat: The lesson is you need to decide ... Did I just get invited to go to a cruise? Somebody's just invited me to go on their birthday cruise and I don't even know this person. I'm just magnetic as fuck. Patrick: It's your most active follower it looks like. Kat: I don't even know who that is. Hi, [Taveda 00:54:01] I can't, I can't go. I've got something on, but thank you. Kat: So, yeah, it's about realising it's a decision. If artists are out there and they're broke, maybe they're buying into the broke artist story, but maybe, maybe, and probably, they're in some way basing their self-worth on their financial situation and/or thinking to themselves that if I just had that money, then I'd be safe. Then I'd be good enough, then I'd be a worthy or a valid person. It's the same as love. You'll never find love when you think oh that person is going to make me feel like then I'm good enough, then I'm worthy, then I'm attractive, then I'm whatever. Kat: You got to figure that shit out right, like otherwise you'll just continue to hold that deep connection at arm's bay. When you realise you've already got everything inside of you and of course you can choose the money because abundance is infinite. Or of course you can choose to receive love because it is available. Or of course you can choose to have the body you want or whatever and you don't need it, well like you can need it and not need it at the same time, we've talked about that. But either way, you already get your completeness inside of yourself. Kat: Does that make sense? Did I just ramble in 49 different directions at once? Patrick: Pretty much, but I'm feeling it, I'm catching it. So, you're saying then somebody who is a starving artist, they're buying into it, which that makes sense to me. There's a lot of things that people out here buy into because that's just what people say. You know, oh you're a starving artist. Oh, you're not going to make any money. That's what they say, but how much of this shit is rooted in fact, it's just something that somebody said. You know, there's a lot of shit like that that's out there, but you have to, you know, you can't cuss if you want to make money online. You know, there's a huge one right- Kat: Really? Fuck, that's rude. Patrick: Yeah, how rude. There's all these things that they say. You have to, what else do they say, you know, you already have to have made this much amount of money before you can make any money online. You can't help anybody unless you've hit this, unless you've achieved these goals. You know, you have to have a book. All sorts of crazy shit that's just not true, but people will buy into. There's so many limitations being sold to everybody out here and they're constantly buying into them. I see what you're saying about that, it makes sense because if they're thinking that I'm an artist and I'm not making money or that I'm just going to be an artist, I'm not making money that's fine because that's just what it is. Patrick: Yet, you're on here, I'm on here and we're doing it. There, you in the back. Kat: I have a question. My question is do you think that sometimes artists/entrepreneurs, that there's ego attached to being the starving artist? Like there's an element of look at me suffer? It's almost like a badge of honour that I'm the starving artist, do you think that sometimes people are toting themselves back to that? Patrick: I'm doing it. I'm doing it. You know you get in this thing where you're like, I mean I've seen people do this too, and I do this, I'm guilty. I like the story okay, I like the story. I could have, I mean I'm sure if I opened myself up for it more and just said that it's going to be super easy and that it's just going to happen and everything's going to come to me. I'm just going to go in the superflow and do what you said and just go all in on this thing and have it happen. It's just going to boom, the doors are wide open. Patrick: When I did my first programme I sold a bunch of my first programme right. For me that was a lot to sell as much as I did. That was not even fully half assing it, that was like 10% of what I could have really done, of me going all in because I'm running like two businesses right now. There's the story that if I just got away from this one thing, it would just go so much fucking easier and everything would just happen you know. Instead, I'm choosing to build the story and now I'm going to be able to have the little ego and look back on this thing and be like, I struggled so hard when is first started out and you can go track it. Patrick: I've got that in my head, that's programmed in my head from something I've learned from somebody else. You know that you got to step your way up. You work your way up if you want to get there, you can't just [inaudible 00:58:29] you got to work your way up. So, I feel [crosstalk 00:58:33] that same way, I get- Kat: It's so interesting because ... Patrick: Go ahead. Kat: No you go ahead. Patrick: No, my train of thought just ... Just took a shit. Kat: Well, here's the truth right. I am proud of myself, I have ego and pride, not, I don't mean I shouldn't have, but there is, for me there is ego attached to I know what I fucking went through to build this business. I do feel maybe a bit superior about the fact that I know full well that most people would not do what I did and that they will not choose to be tough enough. I like feeling like I'm the one who can get knocked down again and again and again and look at me bitches, I'm still getting back up again. It relates a lot to all my fitness stuff and like I always wanted to be the most badass hardcore chick in the gym and I would definitely get triggered if I saw another chick who was training harder than me. Then it would bring me up to speed right, I would then become friends with them. Then it would be like it's on. Kat: In business, I definitely have pride that comes from yeah, I did go through so much fucking shit and I just kept getting up and every time I felt like I was on the floor and I couldn't get up again, it was that thing of are you dead yet though? No, then keep going. I do like it, I get off on it. Patrick: There you go. Kat: You know, you said this earlier on in the call, you said to me what we had spoken about on the phone the other night, about how I said to you I've gotten a little bored because the truth is I had my, I think I told you this, I told my private clients. I'm sure I told you this on the phone, I had my biggest income month ever last month in May. I haven't even published it or anything, well I told my private clients about it and I did a livestream talking about the mindset of that. But it was my biggest income month ever and it was like I feel proud of it. I feel likes that's cool, but did I get a rush from it, did I get an adrenaline kick, no. To be honest, and I know what I'm going to say now is going to make a lot of people want to throw shit at me, if you're going to throw shit I like Guylian Seashell Chocolates or Chanel, you can throw Chanel. Patrick: Or Vegemite. Throw [crosstalk 01:00:52] poo. Kat: But, it's very [crosstalk 01:00:52]. I got that all sorted already. Patrick: Fling a little poo. Kat: I just, it's easy for me to make money online and I mean look, it doesn't mean I can't relate to and resonate with where people are at in their journey and their struggle. It hasn't been that long ago where was over 100K debt, struggling and that went on for a long time. I know how to break through that and that's how I support my clients, but it's not a rush for me to, like even if I do a launch that would make an insane amount of money, I would be like that's awesome, but also, I just expect it. I'm not doing to get an adrenaline rush from it in the same way that if I cook an amazing steak, and I do cook an amazing steak, I'm not going to be like oh my God, I can't believe it, this is the biggest rush ever. I mean of course it tastes fucking amazing, I know how to cook steak. Of course the launch made that much money, I know how to make money online. Kat: What we had spoken about and this relates to what I'm saying here is, well where do I get my rush from now. Where do I get my adrenaline from because I am that person. It wasn't just that I was proud of myself for getting up again and again every time I got knocked down, it's that I do get off on it. I enjoy it, I like being like, you know, put through, I like the pain. I like purposeful pain and I feel so alive. Like the training session which I spoke about, which I did this morning was the hardest I've gone. I had to ease back into it obviously with my training after my surgery, but so today was the hardest that I've gone since then. I was dying and then within a second of it being over, or anytime I felt more knocked around, I'm smiling at the same time. I'm like this is so fucking good, it's fucking amazing. I crave that, I want it. Patrick: And you desire it because at this stage in the game you know that all these rules are bullshit. The fact that you have to, I had only $30 in my account when I started out, to get customers, to get clients, to get your soulmate clients is bullshit. You would be able to attract them without that fucking story. You know? You don't need, that story doesn't [crosstalk 01:03:05] Kat: Totally. Patrick: I don't think it brings people, I don't [crosstalk 01:03:07]- Kat: Right. And I don't even tell my [crosstalk 01:03:09] yeah. Even I told you parts of my story like when we were on the phone the other night and you didn't even know some of it because I just don't talk about it that much. I have and I do if I get interviewed and stuff, but I don't use that for my marketing. I use my art for my marketing. I just use self-expression for my marketing. Like you said, I don't need the fucking story, but what I do need is, I need to feel lit up, alive. Maybe you're right that yesterday I created resistance to knock me around and make me feel shitty so that today I could then create the contrast and today I'm on fire. Kat: There's more to it than that, like I think, yeah, I do think sometimes for people who haven't broken through on money yet. Or if you've experienced this, if you're a person who can make a little money and then you're like, yeah I'm riding high. Then it just disappears again and you crash up and down, I know a lot of people do that. I did that for years, I would make quite a lot of money and then I'd be like, where is it? Why am I broke again? What's happening? I did that roller coaster for years. Kat: I finally cracked that quota, I figured it out and I teach my clients this all the time. Because I was addicted to the ego and the adrenaline of when your back's against the wall and you don't know if you're even going to be able to buy food that day or God forbid even coffee. Then you just, like a magician, you pull a rabbit out of a hat because you're forced to, you're so back against the wall and you're going to lose, then you just make magic. You're smashing through and you create and you save yourself, but actually w

Kat: Alright. We cannot begin yet. Okay, one second. Hmm, approve. Kat: I feel like I'm brand new to the internet when I do these sorts of things. Patrick: Hey! Kat: I feel like such a magician. Patrick: We can begin. Kat: To me it's like a greater accomplishment to successfully do a split screen broadcast then it is to launch some massive new programme. Patrick: It's pretty badass. Kat: Yeah, I was very scared about how that would work. I felt technologically challenged. Patrick: I'm trying to get used to it. But I ... Kat: Is somebody seriously sending angry faces? Patrick: Yeah. Probably Brandon. Kat: Brandon's angry that he's not on the live stream. Patrick: Yup. Sorry Brandon, not today. Not today. Kat: Not today. I've got to say that my lighting looks better than your lighting. Patrick: Not right now. I put in my room so I can get way better lighting. Actually I'm gonna do you even ... Kat: You're view is way better. Patrick: I'm gonna do even dirtier than this. Kat: Dirtier? We're going dirty already? Patrick: Real dirty style. There we go. Okay. Actually I'll get in that bed. Kat: Is that an accent? Whose got an accent? I don't have an accent, obviously. Everybody knows that. Patrick: No way. Kat: My accent is ... Patrick: It's purely for shits and gigs. Kat: One day, maybe when you've known me for a hundred years, you'll figure out that I'm not British. Patrick: British, Australian, it's the same thing. I'm sorry to let you know it. Kat: Oh, it's so not. Patrick: Alright, so I'm all set up now. So my lighting is good. Let's see where you told me about the ... To turn the lighting on. I can't really do it. That's one thing that's missing here, is that little button you showed me to brighten it up. You know, to brighten the ... Kat: You look bright. Patrick: Yeah, let me see if I can switch that on. Kat: You look like you've got a tanning line [inaudible 00:02:26] on your face. Patrick: That's good. 'Cause I definitely do not. But let me get some more. Put that down. Boom. Kat: Alright. Now we're gonna go into it. Patrick: I don't know how you want to start this off, but I'm ready. I am in the zone. Kat: Firstly I think we need to set the tone, and let people know that this will only be serious and professional content. No laughing emojis are allowed. Patrick: Hey let me share this. I wonder if I can share this with my group? Let's see if that works on this thing. Kat: Yup. Patrick: Okay, share to group. Awesome. Players club, there we go. Kat: Hey. Patrick: Boom, it's done. Kat: I just said no laughing emojis you guys. Don't send laughing emojis automatically when I say "no laughing emojis". That wasn't funny at all. It was completely non-funny. We've actually had a serious discussion about this live stream before. We went live, it's actually taken all day, neither of us have accomplished anything. Except discussing the fact that this live stream will be only serious and professional business. Patrick: Straight professional. Only professional business. Strictly business. Kat: Purely professional. Strictly business. People wanted me to introduce you again. How did every ... how did ... You gotta go ... Sorry can't do intros again. We did intros last week. You're gonna have to go to his profile, follow his profile. You'll very quickly figure it out. You'll either be deeply drawn in, or potentially shocked and appalled and you'll leave. Patrick: Gonna be horri ... Kat: Much the same as when people [inaudible 00:03:55] my profile. Patrick: You'll be horrified. Yeah I'm on a camp chair, Meg. Meg just asked me if I'm on a camp chair. This is a camp chair in my house. Kat: Yes. Patrick: That's a quick ... But that's a good segue right there. Why am I on this camp chair? I'll tell you why. You know, I'm just recently starting new, you can go check out my stuff. You see all the stuff that has been going wrong since I actually finished my offer, and put my offer out there. Right? Patrick: So, I had quit my job to go start doing all this crazy cool shit that Cat told me about. Convinced me to go be myself and just say whatever the fuck is on my mind. Just have ... Kat: I didn't convince anybody of anything. Patrick: You convinced me. She convinced me to do it, so I just quit my job. If this fails, I'm blaming it all on you Cat. I'm blaming it all on you. And uh ... Yes you. Kat: I did nothing. I just lead my damn life and then people do whatever they want in response to it. Patrick: What I heard was "Quit your job, Patrick, quit your job." So over and over again I'm hearing this, and I left. And so ... Kat: Question. Patrick: What's that? Kat: Can we block Ryan's [inaudible 00:05:07] from being on this live stream? Patrick: Yeah he's [inaudible 00:05:09]. Very, very mad. But I think he knows that you had some kind of part in this whole thing. So, of course. Patrick: But anyways, so I just jumped off cold turkey. Needless to say, I still had a shit tonne of bills, 'cause I live a pretty expensive lifestyle. And so, yeah I just said "Fuck it". I just had a couple of skills. Patrick: Now I do have a few skills. I do build marketing automation systems. I do build for people like Cat, coaches. You know I can take your shit and boost that shit up. You know what I mean? Get you some automation going, make you some money. But, that's a skill that I'm not really trying to use. Why? Because somebody else is trying to do this shit for myself. Patrick: the first time in my life, I'm making my own bed, I'm doing my own thing. I'm doing it for myself. What's on my mind is going to come out. Putting it out there, and just to bring this all back home. The fucking deal is, ever since I started doing this, every fucking thing I can possibly think of, that could possibly go wrong, is going wrong. Patrick: As a matter of fact I'm on a cell phone right now. Because my laptop screen, my mac screen burnt the fuck out. TV burnt out. I can't even, the list goes on and on. It's just. Kat: What? The TV burnt out now? Patrick: The TV burnt out, the laptop screen burnt out. First the laptop screen burnt out. On my mac that I bought, like probably two years ago, all of sudden that shit burnt out. On the day that I dropped my offer, mind. On the day that I finally, finally stayed up all night, and crafted this thing out and wrote it all up. Kat: Tried to go to bed halfway through. Patrick: Tried to go to bed halfway through. Not being able to. And staying up and finishing it. Then waking up early in the morning and even more finishing it. And then even halfway through the day, till one o'clock today, finally finishing it. Off of a MacBook, which had a burnt out screen. That I hooked up to a big ass TV, in the living room. Kat: Which looked amazing. Patrick: It looked pretty good. Yeah it looked amazing. I was gonna do what you told me. Which was present my offer. Instead of just writing it out, I was gonna present my offer on TV. It was gonna be all crazy, badass, a great idea. I thought it would have been fucking wonderful. Had it worked. Patrick: So, you know, TV burnt out. Brand new TV mind you. Don't buy Zenio. The MacBook burnt out, and now won't connect to that TV. I took it in here to the other TV. It won't connect to that one either. And every possible thing to prevent me from doing this, has been happening. Patrick: So now, I have a little phone, and a camp chair. Because I'm not gonna sit in there, I'm gonna sit right here and actually have something go right. I'm having a good backdrop, right? Patrick: I have a good backdrop, and just ... I don't know. This is going pretty well I think. Kat: It's going exactly as it's meant to. Are you reading the comments? Patrick: I am kind of, yeah. I was just talking. I get ADD so I can't really, I'm gonna have to go back. Kat: Well, everybody's like "Your whole life is blowing up". I think Katie said, this is pretty much ... You know this, this happens. I hear this every single time somebody actually full backs themselves. Kat: Yeah exactly what Kristin said. It's an "are you sure" from the Universe. Patrick: Yeah, it's double check on it right? I don't fucking know. I don't know, but it's crazy. It's like a poltergeist, or something is ... Kat: It actually means ... Do you know what it means? It means, like all that shit happens. The more that shit like that happens, the answer is you just gotta be like "bring it the fuck on then, I'm ready". And let it go faster. And then it's a level up after that. It's the breakdown, before the breakthrough. Patrick: Yeah. Kat: Like for sure, if shit starts blowing up it's means that I'm about to go to a super high next level. And I've seen it a million times with my clients, and friends. Patrick: It's gotta be right there. You know, that's the one thing too. I'm totally, so all in with it and every single day I get even more all in on it. And just finishing that up, and just putting it out there and seeing all shit happen. It just makes me want to go even more all in, you know? So I'm like, let's just keep seeing how far this goes. And maybe, maybe you know, six months down the road I'm gonna be fucking living in a shoe box somewhere. Maybe. Patrick: But then I still have faith, and I still know that there's going to be that sales that gonna come in there. Eventually. It's gonna come. Kat: I think it's about, like everything that you would lean on outside of yourself gets striped away, and you learn how to fully lean on yourself. Patrick: Yeah. Kat: Yeah, "Arrow is drawn back before being shot forward" says Stephen. Patrick: He's in my ... Kat: Exactly. Patrick: He's in my entrepreneur players club. What's up Stephen? I dropped the link back there. Kat: Yeah, you gotta put that link for the club in here. Patrick: I gotta be marketing myself now. You know what I mean? I gotta be doing this. Kat: It's exactly how it goes for everyone. It's like, it's the test. And it's the "are you sure", and it's when you start laughing at it and be like "okay, I see what's happening here. Surrender." Then it all just starts to wash over you. Kat: But it makes you stronger anyway. Like, you're already getting stronger through it everyday. Patrick: It's tough. Some crazy stuff happened today too, though. Like just goes beyond that. Just to let me kind of know I'm going on the right path. Like, you know Travis Plum, he's on here right now. He's all in. He says "all in". Kat: [inaudible 00:10:49] Patrick: Yeah T Plum was over here today, and he is just all in. We have another sales guy that's gonna be coming on. He's doing his thing, and he just kind of popped up. So it just kind of feels like there's support now, on that. It's cool to see there's some other shit going on. It doesn't totally feel like I'm out here by myself, even though shit's still fucking up. Patrick: Shit's still fucking up for them. They're in the same boat, but now there's us. We're pouring the water out of the boat. And we're motivating each other. And it's kind of difficult when you're just by yourself doing it, but you kind of get those thoughts. You know what I mean? Patrick: The thoughts ... I don't know if you know what I mean, but you get the thoughts that ... You probably haven't had these thoughts in a long time. Kat: I don't know. Yeah, well I still remember though. It doesn't seem like that long ago for me really, since I was in that place. It's not actually that many years ago. Kat: But you know what I think is really cool? Basically nobody would talk about it, like you're talking about it right now, while they're going through it. Everybody waits till afterwards. Like even I fully talk about it as transparently as what you're talking about it right now. Kat: Nobody does that. Everybody waits till later on, and they can tell story. Or they might tell a little bit of it. [inaudible 00:12:17] your just like, "There it all is." Patrick: Hey I thought about that too, but I'm like, you know what if I'm going down through it, if I'm going to go through it, I'm like, might as well fucking do it. Just do it. Patrick: I was thinking though, and this is something I want to talk about. 'Cause I had wrote like a pretty long post earlier today, to go in company with my thing. You know. And it's like talking about how, you know I'm just gonna fucking do it. And I'm just gonna drop the parachute out and just fucking, just go and do it. Patrick: Not only that, I'm gonna show you guys ... I'm gonna let you all in to see it, and you know. I promise you that I'll take everybody through this whole thing and you'll be there, and everything like that. And there's all sorts of different options that could happen for me. Patrick: In the next month, or two months that if I don't put up, if things don't happen then there's very low levels that I can go to. But I'm totally comfortable with that. I've been there before. Kat: Right. Patrick: Be fun if ... I didn't think about that, you're right. But I have seen a couple of people do this before though. I saw one sell his, I saw one guy with line sell all of his shit and just start from scratch, you know. But I don't know how far he made it. I haven't seen him or heard from him in a long time. Patrick: You have the Demio webinar kids that created their own webinar software, and they did the same thing, and haven't heard from them in a while. So typically it hasn't worked out well for people that have, maybe like ... I guess what I'm saying I'm doing here is like how to just ... And I have been talking about it and walking it through the process of being honest about it, and saying that shit's getting fucked up. Patrick: I just gave Ryan back my car. You know what I'm saying? Like he had, when I worked for him, I'd had a fucking badass Maserati and everything like that. He'd let me use like a company car or whatever and I'd pay him the note on it and everything like that. It was nice and made me feel good. But I just went and gave it back to him. You know, so no car. Patrick: So, but I don't really need too much, where I really need a car anyway. I got my mind on, you know, bally at in about two months when my lease is up here. So you know, shit's going down. It is what it is. Fuck though. Kat: It's the all in thing. Patrick: Yeah, what's more important to me is the end treasure that's there. That I know is there, and that is there. I mean honestly, I'd rather have some different shit anyways. Kat: Exactly. It's just exactly like that meme you made with the plane flying off the cliff. Like, most people wouldn't be willing to go through it. Kat: Like the crazy thing, I used to wonder what is the worst thing that could possibly happen if I would run out of money, and if things didn't turn around, and it got down to where I had like, eight, nine cents in the bank. Then I would always end up making a few dollars to just, kind of keep my head above water. But sometimes I couldn't buy food, or anything like that. And it was always like, just can you get through that one day? And sometimes it was like, I think I'm gonna be done after this day. Patrick: Yeah. Kat: But I remember, I thought "Okay but what's the absolute worse case outcome?" And for me, it was move back in with my mom and dad. And I'm like, alright well that's not actually like the worst fucking thing in the world. I'm sure I'll start acting like a bratty teenager after like three days, 'cause that's what happens when I stay with my parents. But it's not gonna kill me. Kat: So then, it was kind of like acknowledging that I'm not gonna ... Like you're subconscious mind, or your nervous system is screaming at you that you're gonna die. Patrick: Yeah. Kat: And so that's why most entrepreneurs flake out. Because they can't handle the emotional pressure, and they can't handle the nervous system pressure. Having this nervous system response that says you're about to get eaten by a lion and a tiger. Like that's a hormonal response. Kat: When really, it's like if I totally hit rock bottom it would mean living with my mom. And then I would just get pissed about that and then I would go sell some shit. And either way, I'm gonna make it. Right? Patrick: Yeah. Kat: So then kind of go, oh why am I letting that shit get to me then? Like, can I get through today? Yes. Do I believe that I'm ultimately gonna make it? Yes. So, keep fucking going. But most people? Kat: That's why we say one percent within the one percent. Like I know for a fact, like only 0.001 percent would put themselves through what I went through emotionally. Patrick: Yeah. Kat: Or what you're going through now. Patrick: True. Yeah, and then you get stuff and you get so attached to the stuff that you're, that people get scared. And they're so secure, and they get scared to let it go. You know, and in order to get back to the big picture or to get to that next level. Patrick: But I think about the same thing you think too. I've been thinking of like options too. What's the worst that could happen to me? I'd have to go back down, 'cause I'm from the trailer park. So I have to go back down, and live with my dad. Patrick: You know, I'd have to go live with my dad. Which I also think, what's something that I would do as a very high level, once I make it? Once I'm living this fucking life of my dreams. You know what I'm saying? Once I'm like able to go and do anything, and live anywhere, and travel the world like I want to. Which is exactly what I'm gonna do no matter what, in three months when my lease is up. Patrick: I'm really just here because my lease, I have to stay here till this lease is out. You know, then I'm gonna get. Who knows, my lease might be fucked up. Sorry Travis, but he's on the lease with me. Patrick: But me and him are kind of like going hard together. He's on the same journey. And he's just pretty much like "fuck it". He's got into this as well. Riding on him doing well as well. So it's all good, it's not like I'm totally alone on this thing. It's always good to have a friend, but I think like "What's the worst thing that could happen?" Patrick: Right? And then it's just something like, if I went down to my dad's and had to stay down there for like a month. This is something that I would most likely, my higher version of myself. My higher level self who's achieved this, this is something that he would probably do. Anyways. Patrick: Maybe I'm having a good time overseas, and stuff like that. And I'm kinda like, missing the states a little bit, I'm want to just come back and chill with him for like a month. You know? Just post up and just see him for a month. It's probably just something I would do. Patrick: You know? Kat: Yeah right. Patrick: It's just something you would fucking do. Kat: I mean all the fear, reactions, and emotions it's all based on real shit. Like when money's not coming in, that's a true and real thing. But if you put that aside and you come back to what you know is true inside of you, like you fucking know who you are and that you're going wherever you want to go. And anything that you've ever decided to do in your life and you actually meant it, you have already achieved. Kat: And even like, what I said on that video today. Like you've literally helped people make millions of dollars? Patrick: Yup. Kat: And it's just continually putting aside your own ... Like for those who don't know, 'cause you might see this if you go to Patrick's sales page anyway, but it was Patrick's, not idea, but he helped me get out my idea. And actually express it properly, to launch my inner circle. Kat: And my inner circle clients know this. But that's like my highest level thing. I actually said in that video, that it makes hundreds of thousands of dollars. And then when I awoke I was like, hold on. It's on track for a million dollars per year, from one stream of income. Kat: And that was something I'd been trying to bring to fruition, actually since 2013. And I've had a few iterations of it, which just weren't right. And then I got gun shy because I felt like, I just don't fully know how to ... Like I know the vision of what I want, but I couldn't actually get it out of me. And we were sitting on the couch one time and I just was like "Man this is ... I kind of want this, but I don't know." Kat: And he's like typing away doing his thing, and he's like "Oh well you should just ..." I don't know, I wish I could remember what he said. But, blah blah blah blah blah, something something something. And I just remember sitting there going, "How the ... What? Yes, that's exactly it." Kat: It was like you read my thought. Like that's ... You've got the skills is what I'm saying. Right? Like you've helped make or build a business that makes five million dollars a year. These are, like I'm not just sitting here trying to talk you up. Kat: But it's more like, when you feel like "Well what if the worst happened?" Or "What if this or that?" It's like, wait. Look how much I'm already helping people and can help people. It's a done fucking deal. And you'll go through whatever you've got to go through. If you go through some short term period, alright you get rid of all your stuff and it's just you and the camp chair left, you'll probably be happier anyway. Kat: You'll have the freedom you want to move around the world. And like, it doesn't matter. None of it fucking matters. Whatever's going on right now. Like a year from now, you're gonna look back and be like "It was all worth it". Patrick: Yeah. Kat: And it'll be so worth it, because then you can help the people you were meant to help, because you can actually understand it. Like I can understand all that my clients are going through, 'cause I actually went through it. And I was prepared to go through it. Same thing. Patrick: I'm trying to like, enjoy it right now. That's my big goal. You know? Kat: Right. Patrick: I want to enjoy it right now. I want to savour this, and hold onto the moment. And hold onto these moments that I'm here, and learn as much as I can while I'm in these moments. You know? Patrick: Learn as possibly, as much as I possibly can. Experience and feel, and remember as much as I possibly can from these moments. 'Cause once I cross over the line, and it breaks open for me and you know people start buying my stuff then, you know. My big thing is like, how am I gonna feel after that happens? Patrick: You know, I'm gonna feel great. I'm gonna feel great, but I'm also gonna be transforming, I'm gonna also have transformed into something else. You know, and it's gonna be just ... I don't know. I don't know how I'm gonna deal with that. Patrick: That's one of my deep thoughts right there for you, if you will. So. Kat: I don't think you change. I don't know, like I don't think I've changed. Like my surroundings have changed. I don't think I'm any different to who I was years ago. I think you remember. Kat: But also because you are actually talking about it openly now you'll just be able to watch your own video advice. Patrick: Say again? Kat: Because you're actually talking about it while you're going through it, you're documenting it. So you're not gonna forget because you're gonna have the videos. Kat: But I don't think you forget. I don't forget any of that stuff. I can remember all the feelings and the emotions of it. And sometimes I think maybe I take having money for granted, or like the kind of [inaudible 00:23:00]. Kat: Like that I never look at prices anymore. Sometimes maybe I take it for granted, but not really. Because I do still, very frequently have moments where I'm like "holy shit", like is this even real? Like how is this possible, it's really only been, you know, a small handful of years since it seems like an impossible dream. But then I always .. Patrick: You've been doing this fucking shit for like 20 years. Kat: 20 years, how old do you think I am? Patrick: No, I'm saying like you been doing this since you were like 10. Since you were like one year old. Kat: One year old? Actually it was three. But, thank you. Patrick: There you go. Yeah. Rounding up. Kat: But I was making money, but I was not holding onto the money. I was in debt, and you know. I was bottoming out. I sold my house that I owned. And that like, make like 30 grand profit on that, and that just disappeared. And then I sold my Audi, which was like my first nice car, an Audi '04. And I loved that car so much, and that money disappeared. And then I sold my little Chinese share portfolio, that I had from my 20s when I was trying to get serious about wealth, and then that money disappeared. Kat: And then I was even trying to sell shit on Ebay, but back then I didn't have like Channel purses to sell on Ebay. I had things that I was selling for five dollars. But it was really like, every little dollar counted. And then I would go and buy groceries, and I'd get like 30 dollars worth of groceries and I would go through the checkout. And I would never just like, check my bank account because I couldn't handle the fear. Kat: So I'd just go through the checkout, and basically pray that the card would go through. And sometimes it would, and sometimes it wouldn't. And you just keep going one day at a time, but even though you'd feel like "what if it never works, and what if I'm crazy?" And what if, all the stuff that you think, that everyone thinks. Kat: But then when you put all that emotion aside, you go back into your core and you go "but I do fucking know though." Patrick: Right. Kat: Like when I get out of the drama, I know. Like I just fucking know. It's not up for discussion. I will keep picking myself back up again, until I get there. And then ... Kat: Now I'm so fucking grateful for all that. And I do remember so much of it. I'm so fucking grateful that it's over. But I'm so fucking grateful I went through it. Because it made me so strong. Like I feel like, I have such high levels of resilience and tenacity and those are some of the most important characteristics for us. For entrepreneurs. Patrick: Absolutely. And you know I think ... Kat: It is what you said. Like embracing it now. Patrick: Well, you know, the think is too, is that I say all this stuff to you and then you just make me think too, that like I've already been here before. And I already overcame. And I'm already pretty much hacked this stuff, you know. Just by being able ... Just like I remember the first time that I actually sold something. Because whenever I first started working with Ryan, it was like he found me. Patrick: 'Cause I quit my job at the car dealership right? Went through a bad breakup, and it just made me realise, fucking life isn't for me to be putting all my happiness ... It isn't meant for me putting all my happiness into somebody else. That's kind of what kick started, and had me first say "fuck it all". You know? Patrick: And so I quit my job at the car dealership. I just walked in and it ... This was such a big moment in my life. That I didn't even like, have the questioning or anything like that about that. There was nothing that would've made me stay there. You know? Kat: Yeah. Patrick: This is like such a earth shattering thing to happen to me. I guess I was like, I guess I must been about 26 or 27. And it was just, I had put all my chips into this thing, you know? And thought I was getting engaged and this stuff, and like that you know? And then it came crashing down. Patrick: And I found out she was married to some dude in prison. Long story short. But it was, I just put so much stock into this thing you know? And then it just fucking like, came crashing down. And that was when I first saw the reality, kind of like shift. You know? Patrick: And I saw this for what it is. And once I started like picking back up the pieces of everything, I just realised like, it's not supposed to be like this. You know? It's not supposed to be, to where I give other things power and control of me. Patrick: For example, job, security, things like that. And I really just, really, really saw that. Like about a week or two afterwards, you know, after we had called everything off, and everything like that. And I just remember it clear as day. I was just like, immediately started selling all my shit off. And started to trim up. And I started to figure out ways to get out of there. Patrick: I mean I was not gonna stay there very long, but I eventually, it just... fuck it ...

Patrick Guest is an Australian children's author, Olympic physiotherapist, and father of three. He is most noted for his children's books That's What Wings Are For - dedicated to children with Duchenne Muscular Dystrophy, and their parents, and The Ricker Racker Club, written for his boys when their baby sister joined the family. Find out more about Patrick's work at PatrickGuest.com.au. What you'll learn: 1. What Patrick's first career was, and why he gave it up for writing.2. The true story that inspired Patrick to write That's What Wings Are For.3. How The Ricker Racker Club is being used to touch and inspire school children in Melbourne, Australia. 4. What success means to him. FULL TRANSCRIPT Elizabeth: Welcome to Writers’ Tête-à-tête with Elizabeth Harris, the show that connects authors, songwriters and poets with a global audience. So I can continue to bring you high-calibre guests, I invite you to go to iTunes, click Subscribe, leave a review, and share this podcast with your friends. I’m delighted to introduce children’s author Patrick Guest (PG) – father of three, Olympic physiotherapist, children’s author. Patrick Guest – born into an ever loving, ever growing family, 7 siblings, in the beachside suburb of Seaford, Melbourne, Australia. Patrick was blessed with all the things that make a childhood magical – plenty of family, friends and freedom to explore this wonderful world. An assortment of careers along the way – cobbler, elephant washer, failed accountant, anatomy demonstrator at Monash Uni, national team physio for Mozambique. Little wonder he’s been dubbed the Forrest Gump of Frankston. Adventures and stories seem to follow him around and now he’s writing them down. 5 books, (signed with a little hair) in the past 2 years, many more in the pipeline. Patrick Guest, welcome to Writers’ Tête-à-tête with Elizabeth Harris. Patrick: Great to be here, Elizabeth. Elizabeth: Great to have you here, Patrick, on this lovely sunny day in Melbourne, believe it or not, we’ve got the sun. Patrick, we recently discovered we attended the same secondary college.  Patrick: We did. Elizabeth: I had to smile when I read you initially became an accountant. Please tell my listeners about that transgression - and how you escaped. Patrick: Ah, the transgression. Let’s start with that. Look. Fear, insecurity, there was a recession kicking in. But really I think, as a 17-year-old, having to work out what subjects to choose, I didn’t know how to make that decision at 17. Elizabeth: So you did Economics … is that right? Patrick: Economics, Accounting, Legal Studies, Maths. I was really probably inspired at that time by my favourite TV show, Family Ties – Michael J. Fox. Elizabeth: Wasn’t he great? He’s great. Still. Patrick: At the time, I think back now – what a dork he was – it probably says a lot about what a dork I was and still am. I thought he was cool. Elizabeth: He was funny, and you’re funny. Patrick: He was cool, and I thought “Who do I want to be like?”, and I thought “Michael J. Fox”. I went down the corporate path, which was a terrible decision. I don’t regret it – I made some friends for life, and I realized early on that money doesn’t make you happy. Elizabeth: It’s such an important lesson at that age, isn’t it, cause many people learn that quite late, if at all. Patrick: Yeah, so that’s something that has stayed with me, and I’m really grateful. Elizabeth: Was there a pivotal moment when you realized “This accounting thing is just not me”? Was there an incident? Patrick: There was. Elizabeth: Can you share that, or is that private? Patrick: No, no, let’s share this. It’s all about sharing in this session. So I’m walking down Flinders St Station, and I’m walking down in my suit and tie, down the ramp… Elizabeth: How old were you at the time? Patrick: It would have been in my first year out of graduation, maybe 22 or something. 21, 22. Walking down the ramp, with cattle class, just walking down, we were all off to work. Against the flow, this lady came through the crowd and just gently put her hand on me and said, “Smile!” Elizabeth: (Laughter) I promise you it wasn’t me. Patrick: She just said “Smile” and I’m walking down – I must have looked so miserable. Elizabeth: Was she an angel or a real person? Patrick: I don’t know. But I hear where you’re coming from there, because from that moment – and I blame Banjo Patterson – and maybe my dad for putting me onto Banjo. Elizabeth: Why? It’s good to blame other people, isn’t it? Patrick: My favourite Australian poem would be The Great Clancy of the Great Overflow… Elizabeth: Oh wonderful. Patrick: …And where Banjo writes: And the hurrying people daunt me, and their pallid faces haunt me   As they shoulder one another in their rush and nervous haste, With their eager eyes and greedy, and their stunted forms and weedy,    For townsfolk have no time to grow, they have no time to waste.   So that poem was just ringing in my ears as I was off to the office sitting there, and from that moment I had come to the end of my fancy – I had a lot to change with Clancy. But I doubt he’d suit the office, Clancy of the Overflow. And for someone who had had that instilled in him, the spirit of adventure at a very young age, and parents – wonderful parents that had fostered that– and here I am in this shoebox, little partitioned office thing, and it just wasn’t for me. Elizabeth: Soul-destroying. Patrick: Soul-destroying. For some people it isn’t, and some of my best friends have continued along that path, and it’s a great path for them, but for me it wasn’t. Elizabeth: We need everybody, don’t we, the array of professions and tradespeople, everybody to do their bit. But you had much more important things in store, Patrick. Which brings me to – our school was really quite traditional in lots of ways, being a Catholic coed college, with all the gender bias that goes with that. And I remember going back to Economics, and I remember being one of the few girls in Chemistry and Economics, because it was always the boys who were going to be the accountants, and the girls were going to be teachers or nurses. And in fact I did go on to be a nurse, but I was very happy to do that. So to me in our school, there was a real gender bias. And you address this in your fantastic book, The Ricker Racker Club. Can you tell us more about this great book please? Patrick: The Ricker Racker Club is based on a real club, invented by real people: my two boys, Noah and Reuben. So Noah and Reuben were roughly 4 and 3 at the time when the Ricker Racker Club was formed. And there was one hard and fast rule: No Girls. (Laughter) There were a few other rules: do something incredibly brave, do something incredibly kind, but the real rock-solid rule was No Girls. And then what happened… Elizabeth: I’m sure that’s changed now. Patrick: …They had themselves a sister, little Gracie. Gracie was born, and really the story of The Ricker Racker Club is what happened next after Gracie. Now Gracie is perfectly named. She is pure grace, she is pure joy. She does have an intellectual disability, and her capacity for joy is extraordinary. And she would – as happens in the book – walk up to the wolf next door and give the wolf a big hug. Her courage, her kindness, her unique joy, won the boys over very quickly. They won us all over, and the story sprung from there. Really, it’s a celebration of the joys of being a kid, and the innocence of these rules. They’re not coming from a nasty place, these rules – just boys being boys. But then, just the power of kindness, if there’s one thing that runs through all my books, it’s the power of kindness… Elizabeth: Yes, definitely. Patrick: …to change hearts. So that’s how that happened. And really The Ricker Racker Club is about a father saying to his two sons, “Be good to your sister.” Elizabeth: And you do it so well, Patrick. Patrick: And so it’s done really well. Elizabeth: When did you know you wanted to be a writer? Patrick: From the moment I could write. So I started very young. I do remember a series, ‘Powerful Patrick’. And I must have been about 5 or 6. I was doing the pictures back then and I was stapling them together, making these little books. And I’m sure Mum and Dad delighted in them. But I’m not sure anyone else did. Elizabeth: Have you still got them? Patrick: I haven’t been able to find them. Elizabeth: Oh no. Patrick: I hope I can find them one day. Mum was always a little bit of a hoarder, so it’ll be somewhere in the house. They’re still in the same place I grew up in, so they’ll be somewhere in that house. So I’ve been a natural storyteller my whole life. The vehicle for that telling a story was just verbal stories and emails and love letters to Lisa my wife … I’ve always found a way to put things on paper. But certainly through the barren accounting years, then really trying to work out where my lane was that had been lying dormant, and then the birth of Noah – my first son, Noah – came a flood of stories and the desire to get these things down on paper. The rest is history. Elizabeth: What was it particularly about that event - the birth of Noah – that opened the floodgates, so to speak? Patrick: Well the birth itself…even before the birth I was starting to work on a book. But it’s, I think it’s just this natural, just as we have a desire to breathe, have food and water, a desire to be heard and understood, and then as a parent, it’s just this innate desire to share stories and to bond through stories. Elizabeth: Legacy. Patrick: Legacy. What my dad did was the same with me. My grandfather – I vividly remember my grandfather declaring over me that “You’re going to be an author one day.” Elizabeth: Oh wow. Did he write? Patrick: My grandfather, no. It was more my grandmother – she was a gifted storyteller. She kissed the Blarney Stone a few times, Ma, and... So it’s flowed through, that Blarney Stone – the kissing of the Blarney Stone gift has been passed through, through Grandmother to my dad. Elizabeth: We have a similar heritage then. Patrick There you go. And I can see it in my kids as well. Noah and Reuben, they love telling stories and they love hearing stories. So it’s been passed on for sure. Elizabeth: That’s fantastic. Can you advise all the aspiring writers out there how to get started, and more importantly, how to keep going? Patrick: How to get started… I can only speak, maybe quote Oscar Wilde: “Be yourself. Everyone else is taken.” So I can only speak from the authority of my own experience. I don’t have a technique or a tactic or a ritual that I go through. I pray. I pray, and one thing that I’ll say to people when asked this question – again I don’t want to get too preachy here – but if you want to get creative, it helps to get in touch with your Creator. That’s all I can say. That might be a bit controversial but for some ears, but that’s what works for me. I don’t get on my knees and say “God, give me another book!” Elizabeth: “Give me a bestseller or a …” Patrick: “Give me a bestseller!” What I actually do is I surrender my agenda. Elizabeth: So ego is left aside. Patrick: Ego is left aside, and any preconceived ideas are left aside. So I’m not sitting there going “Give me inspiration”. I’m giving myself out, and saying “Take away”. Elizabeth: Use me, as a conduit. Patrick: “Use me”, and if that’s to be the best barista in Mornington, or go back to my cobbling beginnings, or elephant-washing beginnings, so be it. So most of – no, really all of – my flashes of inspiration you could say… There’s that great poem by Rumi, Listening, where he says, “When that voice speaks, may I sell my tongue and buy a thousand ears.” So when I’m hearing that voice, that is always followed by a period of prayerfulness or meditation which just opens up that creativity. Sounds easy. I know when I hear that voice, and I sell my tongue, I know that there’s a double emotion. Joy, and dread. Because I know that I’m in for some hard work. Elizabeth: ‘Cause writing can be hard work, can’t it. And the discipline that’s required – and you know you may not particularly feel like writing that day – but you have to put one foot in front of the other and keep going. Patrick: Yes, so back to the question, which was “How do we keep going?” How do we start? For me, I don’t really start until I’ve heard the voice, I’ve heard that voice, I’ve heard that spark of inspiration. How do I keep going? I know that I won’t have peace until it’s done. So I’m listening to that voice but I also know that it’s a collaboration after that. So I’m seeking opportunities to get it on paper or get it onto the computer. And they are taken in the busyness of my life with 3 young kids and a fulltime job as a physio. I have to be creative just to find that time. So often it’s my wonderful patients – patient patients – lying on the physio plinth – and I’ll just seek an opportunity to say, “Now that you’ve got all those needles all over you, there’s no way to run out of here. Would you mind listening to my latest? What do you think of it?” Elizabeth: Do they come back for another appointment after that, Patrick? Patrick: Normally they do. I don’t think I’ve managed to scare anyone off yet. Elizabeth: I might need to book for a session. Do I have to have a needle? Patrick: Not always, but it does – has that influence on my clinical judgment. Might be, if I’m honest. But I call it ‘bibliotherapy’. That works well, so I’m looking for opportunity. Sometimes I’ll pull the car over and send myself a text message for a sentence. Or middle of the night, off to the computer, or scribbling in bed on a bit of paper. I don’t have a routine about how to get these things down. Elizabeth: 2 a.m. is a common time for me to receive a sentence too. Patrick: In the shower can be a good place – you can scratch it into the wall, into the mist, write it down, whatever it is. But I’m in the posture of seeking the opportunity to find that time to write that down once I’ve heard that voice. Elizabeth: Can we talk about your work – who you work with, the wonderful men and women that you care for? Can we talk about that? Patrick: Yes, so 2 days a week, I work at the medical centre at Victoria Barracks, which is a service based in Melbourne. They are wonderful, so when I first started working for the military, I had a bit of a chip on my shoulder about war and the work of the military. Elizabeth: In what way? Patrick: I’d been a bit of a hippie, a bit of a peace lover, a bit biased against the war machine, or whether it’s a valuable service that the Army and Navy and Air Force offer. And then you get to meet these people and hear their stories. Elizabeth: Amazing. Patrick: Amazing, the sacrifice made. I see the plague of PTSD is becoming more public or known as an extension of the epidemic of general mental health problems in the world. As a physio you get a front row seat really, and you get the rare – it’s a real privilege to offer probably two of the greatest needs of the human being: to be heard and understood, and to be touched. Elizabeth: Yes. Beautiful. Patrick: To be touched. There aren’t many mainstream medical professionals that offer both. So as a physio you’re in a really good place and space to offer that service and in that way to gather stories. So in that way it does feed into the other half of my career, which is becoming more than half really, the writing side of things, and the gathering of stories from the confessional plinth is part of that, and the sharing of stories is part of that. Elizabeth: They’re exceptionally lucky to have you. Patrick: Goes both ways. Elizabeth: You’ve had wonderful success with your book sales. What does success mean to you? Patrick: About three bucks fifty? (Laughter) So I remember when my amazing editor and publisher Margrete Lamond sat me down – we met face to face for the first time – she’s based in New South Wales – one of her first pieces of advice was “Don’t give up your day job!” Elizabeth: I’ve had the same advice before. Patrick: So in terms of success it’s been humbling and mind-blowing to think that That’s What Wings Are For – my first book – has cracked the magical 10,000 books sold in Australia within 6 months. Elizabeth: Wow. Congratulations. That’s wonderful. Patrick: So now we’re into our second year of sales. I’m not sure where we’re up to now, but has been picked up internationally and translated internationally to Chinese and Korean and several other languages. What does it mean to me? It means that – it gives me a voice, a chance to talk to your lovely self, and to visit schools. I love that side of being a writer. Most writers are more comfortable in a darkened room tapping away. To my surprise, I was a very reluctant public speaker but I absolutely love going out to the schools. On Wednesday, I had a full school assembly, hundreds of kids there, and the audience and ability to speak and share… Elizabeth: ‘Cause you make that fun, don’t you. We’re just going back to The Ricker Racker Club for a moment, and can we know how you make that fun for the kids? ‘Cause the parents listening there would be really interested – we know we’re there to do hard work but school can be fun as well. So how do you make it fun for them, Patrick? Patrick: Well, The Ricker Racker Club – I invite everyone to join this very exclusive club, The Ricker Racker Club, IF they pass the test. So I read the story, but along the way we pause and issue challenges to the members of the audience to come up on behalf of the whole school, see if they can pass this test. So we follow the story. And one of the characters is Max, and in the first week he sticks his head into the fox’s hole. So I make up a little fox’s hole, and find a willing kid to stick his head into this fox’s hole. The whole school are counting 20 seconds and I bring out this little stuffed fox. So the poor kid doesn’t know I’m tiptoeing up behind him and “Raaaahhh!” Elizabeth: (Laughter) Do you get a lot of screams? Patrick: We get a few of those, and then the villain of the book is this wolf next door, which is based on a great German Shepherd that lived next door to me, and I have the scar to prove, the moment the basketball flew over the fence. I rescued the basketball – and Chance (the dog’s name was Chance) – got me. And so the wolf next door – it would normally have a wolf suit – and it’s normally the PE teacher who dresses up as a wolf. Elizabeth: Would you go to our school? They’d love you. Patrick: I’d love to. Elizabeth: Ours is a service school, so you’ll like it. Ours is a service school, so we have a lot of service families that go to... Nice connection for you. Patrick: I’d love to come out. Absolutely. So the kids build up and up and at the end, “Who wants to join this club?” “Yeah!” “Who wants to learn the secret password?” “Yeah!” So I force it down a little and say, “Unfortunately you haven’t done quite enough yet.” Elizabeth: (Laughter) Oh my, the kids will go “Oh what?” Patrick: So it’s a case of “Do not put up your hand, do not raise your hand, unless you are extremely brave.” All the hands go up. “I mean it, I’m warning you now – extremely brave.” Elizabeth: What age group are we looking at, with the hands going up? Patrick: Prep, all the way to 6. Elizabeth: The whole school, wow. Patrick: At this point, some of the Grade 6s I can tell – folded their arms; it’s a bit babyish for them. So picture it: I do target them a bit at this point. So I’ll normally look for the guy who’s lost interest – the kid can be too cool for school here. And I’ll grab this fellow and bring him up. “So on behalf of the school, let’s talk about Courage. Courage comes in many forms. You’ve already demonstrated Courage by standing up in front of the whole school. But Courage comes in many forms. The courage to make a mistake when you know it’s going to get you in trouble. You’re scared of something. And then there’s taste buds. So we go back to Week 3, if you were listening, what did Zack do in Week 3?” And he’ll say “I’m sorry, I can’t remember.” Again in a loud voice, “What did Zack do in Week 3?” And you get the book out again: Zack drank a tomato sauce milkshake. At this point I’m standing behind him with milk, and then I bring out the tomato sauce. And what’s he do now? At this point he’s shaking his head ‘no’. And the school have already started the chant without encouragement: “Drink! Drink! Drink! Drink!” So I make this milkshake, this foaming tomato sauce milkshake… Elizabeth: Oh no. Patrick: And I pause again and say “Unfortunately my friend, Zack did that for one person. You’re doing it for 700 people right now. That’s not enough. So I look around – I shop for the largest Brussel sprout I can find. And I bring out this Brussel sprout, drop it into the tomato sauce milkshake, and present it to this fellow. Elizabeth: Poor kid. Patrick: The poor kid. Originally, I used this – it occurred to me that this is peer group pressure of the highest order. So I now use this as an opportunity for this poor unfortunate kid to – they’re saying no at this point – I really esteem that courage. I say “Look, you have done something extraordinarily brave. Everyone here at some point is going to face a baying crowd of people saying ‘Drink! Drink!’ or whatever. Elizabeth: That’s so clever, Patrick. Patrick: And to say no in the face of that, is true Courage. So I give him a round of applause and he sits down. “Now who wants to be a legend?” (Laughter) So someone else comes up. Or I’ll turn it into the “What would the kind person do now?” Or even better. “Maybe there’s a teacher in the audience…” Elizabeth: So what I’ll do is I’ll leave it there, because if the school listens to that one they won’t book you. I will leave them in suspense. When I first read That’s What Wings Are For, I was sitting in a coffee shop, with tears rolling down my cheeks. The other patrons respectfully averted their eyes. And you know you’ve found a great book when so much emotion is ... Can you please tell us about your inspiration for That’s What Wings Are For? Patrick: So That’s What Wings Are For … Maybe I can mention one of my favourite poems of all time, which is The Hound of Heaven. The Hound of Heaven, for those who don’t know, written more than a hundred years ago by a homeless opium addict in London, Francis Thompson. So he was asking the big question: how could a loving God allow such suffering in the world, and particularly in his own life? And the penny starts to drop about halfway through. He says maybe, just maybe, You allow us in Your love to burn and burn until we become charcoal, and You pick us up and You create Your masterpiece. So That’s What Wings Are For – I’m not calling it a masterpiece – it certainly came from a burning charcoal in process. And that process was the great sadness in my life. My son Noah has Duchenne Muscular Dystrophy, which is a devastating condition that involves the wasting of muscles. And the heart’s a muscle, and it’s a devastating disease. So in light of that I was asked to write a book about a certain blue dragon Bluey, who is the mascot for all the families affected by this devastating disease. So I was working on another book at the time, and I was asked to write this book. And I jumped at the chance, but I also knew there was a heavy responsibility writing that. So really you can look globally at that and look at the whole community impacted by that, but really it was a love letter from a father to a son. Elizabeth: Beautiful. Patrick: And that’s how it was written, and that is something I do say when I go out to the schools. You’ve heard Ricker Racker – it’s quite a boisterous, joyous occasion. When I go out to talk about That’s What Wings Are For, I basically start off in a fun way, and then I bring it back sharply and I say, I bring out Bluey, the actual mascot, a blue plush teddy, and I say “I actually met Bluey on the worst day of my life.” And to have a school go from being quite boisterous, and the teachers go “Shh! Shh! Shh!” to your pin drop in one sentence… Elizabeth: Wow, that’s powerful. Patrick: They get it. They get it. From the preppies all the way up to the Grade 6s, they get it, and there’s a real reverence suddenly about the book and why it was written. And then I explain what’s happened from there and we go from there. I still struggle to read it without crying, but they are tears of – what will I say - I heard this line yesterday – “what we sow with tears, we reap with shouts of joy”. And there’s something joyous – it’s bigger than me, this thing. It’s bigger than me. Elizabeth: What you’ve created is magnificent. Patrick: Thank you. Elizabeth: You’re welcome. You mentioned in an interview that 80% of That’s What Wings Are For was written over breakfast with your family, and then one sentence that brought tears to your eyes took you 3 months to write. Can you please share that sentence with my listeners and what it was that finally led you to discover the sentence that made you cry? Patrick: What it was was my incredible ego. I just – it went to my head. The idea of being a published author and all this went absolutely to my head. Elizabeth: Well you are only human after all. (Laughter) Patrick: Well, I’m sitting back there, I’m imagining red carpets, imagining walking up the stairs. It was shocking! And here I am, I’ve written a book for my sick kid, and my ego’s having a field day. At this point I hadn’t even had the manuscript finished… Elizabeth: You were strutting around… Patrick: It was appalling. I’m embarrassed about it, at the way I was carrying on in my head anyway. So we needed – Bluey needed a reason to be doing what he did ultimately, which is find a reason for his wings. And I was trying all these sentences about sending him off to Margrete, and very gently and respectfully she would be saying “That is rubbish.” (Laughter) Elizabeth: Thanks Margrete. She just knew there was more to you – she knows how deep you are. Patrick: She knew how to push the buttons and what’s right. And equally my wife Lisa as well. And more so my wife Lisa, she has a great ability to tell me when I’m writing something that’s rubbish - and good as well. Elizabeth: Good. Patrick: So the to-ing and fro-ing went on for months. And then I had this moment of “You complete goose! What are you doing?” And certainly at that moment I decided that every cent from this book would be given to charity, which it always should have been anyway, and I made that decision, and entered some prayer and reflection, and within really minutes of making that decision – within minutes – I was given this sentence. And I have to set the context of that time. And at the time we had a crudely termed … we called it a ‘year of adventure’ – you could call it a bucket list, and we were doing all sorts of things around the world. So the sentence – Bluey was coming back from the Royal Children’s Hospital. It was broadened to be a magical building filled with magical creatures with all sorts of ailments. So at that moment when Bluey looks out, and when I’m reading the story to the school, I’ll have people close their eyes and put their hands on their hearts, and feel. Elizabeth: Which I’m going to do now. Patrick: And if you keep feeling, you’ll feel something. You may not feel it straightaway, but if you keep trying, you’ll get there. You’ll feel something warm and fuzzy. And that feeling has a name; it has lots of names. Kindness, and hope, and love, and what happens – and at this moment, Bluey looks across, and I share this sentence: “Bluey saw the boy’s soft, floppy legs, and at that moment, something happened in Bluey’s heart. He stopped for that moment thinking so much about his own situation, and he looked inward. He looked out, and saw this boy sharing a similar path. That word ‘empathy’. That changed everything for Bluey; it helped him work out what his wings were for.” So we go on from there. Elizabeth: Beautiful. That compassion for another person. The author-illustrator relationship is such a pivotal one. Can you describe what is important to you in such a relationship? Patrick: Respect, and trust, and space. So ‘let there be space in your togetherness’. Certainly for the first two books – the first one, Daniella Germain, extraordinary talent. And then the same with Nathanial Eckstrom, rising superstar of the illustration world. So first book, I had no contact at all with Daniella until after all the illustrations were done. Had no input into the illustrations at all. So in terms of relationship, it’s one of trust. Slightly different with the second book – some feedback. Poor Nathanial, I saw his amazing illustrations, but – and it was amazing that he managed to draw my 3 kids without having seen a photo of them, quite accurately – except for Gracie wears glasses. And I just politely asked whether he might pop glasses on Poppy (Gracie is named Poppy in the book). So he went back and put glasses on. Then I had a look at that and thought, “No. Makes her look too old now. Can you take the glasses off?” So that was a bit of a diva moment for me, I suppose. But other than that it really is letting go and not being too precious and trusting in the selection of the illustrator – that’s up to the publisher – and I trust Margrete to make that decision, and she hasn’t failed me yet. I know how she is with me with the words, and she’s that way again with the illustrator. Elizabeth: What a wonderful person to find! Patrick: She is great, she’s fantastic. Elizabeth: What are you working on at the moment? Patrick: Well, the undercurrent to all the picture books that have been picked up in the last couple of years has been a novel for children called The Last Secret of Ernie Pigwinkle, and I’ve been working on the story for more than 10 years. And it comes and goes, and then another idea overrides that. But I keep coming back to The Last Secret of Ernie Pigwinkle. That is lying dormant again, but I know I will go back to that, so there’s always that in the background. That story is the story of an old man who loves to tell stories. And he has this great secret. Great secret, that he's burning with this secret, to share it with his grandson Arthur. Long story short, he gets invited to the World Storytelling Competition in Marrakesh, Morocco, up against the greats of storytelling. Professor Chinwag from China, Lord Blabbermouth from England. I won’t give too much away, but he makes it to the final and he tells this great secret, but the secret is revealed slowly as the story goes along. Elizabeth: Suspense right through… Patrick: Right through. It has been a lot of hard work, also joy, and I have a sense that one day it will happen. I’ve also recently finished another picture book manuscript that is very, very dear to my heart, called Tiny Dancer. Elizabeth: The Elton John song. Patrick: The Elton John song, so hopefully Sir Elton will approve, and that’s really dear to my heart, and I’m in an acquisitions meeting on that one. And we’re in the process of illustrating and that process does involve some word changes. My next release which will be next year, I thought that was going to be a book called The Second Sky. It sounds like – based on this week’s emails – it sounds like it will be called Rabby the Brave. Elizabeth: You’re just prolific – you’re pounding on aren’t you, one after the other. Patrick: Look, it’s been a blessed couple of years. There’s been a very rich vein of inspiration and creativity that’s happening at the moment. Really grateful. Elizabeth: We’re very, very pleased too, I must say. Can’t wait to read them. What do you like to do in your spare time to unwind from all this work you’re doing – the physio work with the military, your family, and all this wonderful writing you’re doing? What do you do to unwind? Patrick: I’m clinging to my childhood in terms of chasing a bouncy ball around. I still play basketball. There’s a competition going on in Victoria Barracks actually, so at the ripe old age of 45, I’m taking on the burly soldiers, I’m taking on the burly soldiers in this basketball competition. Elizabeth: Well you have to keep up on being brave. (Laughter) Patrick: I love it. I must say I’m shamelessly, every goal I score – there aren’t many of them – I’m celebrating them like they could be my last. So there’s the fist pump and the whooping after every goal I score. And would you believe I’m still sort of – don’t let Lisa know but I’m still playing football. Full contact. There’s a wonderful competition – Reclink, midweek, battlers’ competition. You may have heard of the Choir of Hard Knocks – Reclink was spawned from it and there’s a football league for battlers, whether it be homeless refugees or people battling addiction. So we’ve set up a team in Frankston, and I’ve been the … Elizabeth: You are brave. (Laughter) Patrick: Madness, absolute madness. And so I’ve been the physio, the chaplain, the halfback flank and the water boy, whatever goes on, whatever’s needed for that team. And there’s just something primal about playing Australian Rules football that I just can’t let go of. And if I ever get the chance, I’ll go out surfing as well. Elizabeth: Isn’t it great to tap into that raw energy and just let yourself go? Patrick: It is. With surfing, it’s one of the few pastimes or sports where you spend 95% of the time staring at the horizon. So you get a chance to unwind – then it goes from the serenity to scrambling for your life. It’s great. Elizabeth: It’s a bit of a metaphor, isn’t it? Patrick: It’s great. Yes, so those are the 3 main things. Elizabeth: Do you want to remain in the children’s book genre? Patrick: Absolutely. Maybe one day a book for grownups, but certainly at the moment I’m loving – when you write a picture book, you are writing for grownups – you’re writing for two generations. Elizabeth: It’s that connection, I think, with parent-child. It’s so special. And you both learn so much when you’re reading together. Patrick: Absolutely. And I’ve been trying to make the transition from picture books into early readers, and I’ve found that quite hard. I might have to leapfrog that and go into older early readers. Because to go from a picture book to an early reader is – you got to dumb it down. You really have to dumb it down. That’s a crude way of saying it, but you do. There are certain concepts you have to avoid, and using poetry or metaphors is a bit more tricky. So maybe that’s not for me, that niche. So certainly The Last Secret of Ernie Pigwinkle is for an older reader, an older young reader. And then the picture books as well. I might stick to those, to genres within the broader children’s book genre for now. We’ll see what happens after. Elizabeth: You’re so insightful. Because you haven’t actually studied Creative Writing or completed a formal uni degree in writing, and yet your knowledge is so vast. Is you’re your intuition at play again, do you think? Patrick: Not sure. I think it’s a blessing. Don’t want to use the word ‘gift’, but I think it’s nothing to be proud of if it’s a gift. Elizabeth: I really have to disagree, because so many people are given, receive gifts, it’s then what you do with that gift. And so many people do not do anything with what they’ve been blessed with. I do think you can claim that proudly and whoop, like on a footy field. (Laughter) Patrick: Maybe. I do love whooping when there’s a sense of victory, a sense of accomplishment – once you finish that manuscript, submit to send, and you know it’s off, and have such a beautiful relationship with Margrete. I should mention Alyson O’Brien, who is also with Little Hare – I’m increasingly involved with her. I know that they will read it and give it the full attention and get back to me quite quickly, so that agonizing wait has been reduced to, in some cases, a few hours now, which is great. Elizabeth: It’s cause you’re so clever, and they know it. Do you have a website or blog, Patrick, that my listeners can go to find out more about your wonderful work? Patrick: Yes, there’s a shiny new website, “Patrick Guest dot com dot au”. I know nothing about the technical side of websites, and a great friend of mine, Jeffrey County, has helped set that up, and it’s sparkling. Elizabeth: Aren’t tech people great? I’m not one of those. Patrick: Absolutely not. Absolutely not. There’s no way I could do that. So that’s up and running now, so there’s opportunity to email me and contact me through that. Happy to do that. Elizabeth: Patrick, this is a signature question that I ask all my guests. What do you wish for, for the world, and most importantly, for yourself? Patrick: That’s a big one. Look, the first thing that springs to mind is a cure for Duchenne Muscular Dystrophy. Elizabeth: I’m with you. Patrick: That would be the first thing. But if I thought more about it, more broadly… Maybe I could go back to Ernie Pigwinkle, The Last Secret of Ernie Pigwinkle. So I’ll give away a little bit, so we get to the end of the story. We’re at the World Storytelling Championships, so Ernie, this old man from Ballarat, has made the final and won, thanks to his grandson. So the secret starts off as “Do you know why dogs wag their tails?” We move on from there to “Why dogs and cats fight – the origins of war”. Then he finishes with a little song, a little poem he says to the world: It’s a war that’s continued to this very day. It’s a shame that Dog and Cat couldn’t think of a way To listen and learn and be understood, And love one another as all of us could. You don’t have to carry on like a dog or a cat. You’re not a baboon or as blind as a bat. There’s a heart in your chest and a brain in your head. So before you lose faith, hold on instead. Hold on to your faith in the goodness of others. Never give up on your sisters and brothers. You’ll see for yourself, as sure as the sun, That there’s something worth loving in everyone. He says that. Elizabeth: I need a box of tissues. [Laughter] Oh Patrick, my goodness, that’s so beautiful. Thank you for sharing that. Patrick: That’s the world premiere of The Last Secret of Ernie Pigwinkle and… Elizabeth: What a coup on Writers’ Tête-à-tête with Elizabeth Harris. Wow, Patrick! Superb. Patrick Guest, thank you so much for joining me on “Writers Tete-a-Tete with Elizabeth Harris”. We look forward to more of your stunning work. I totally agree with you: hugging is what wings are for. Thanks for tuning in everyone, and may your wishes come true. [END OF TRANSCRIPT]