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Joel Salatin—farmer, author, and foreword writer for Ginny Yurich's new book—joins us for his fifth episode, and it's a powerhouse. This conversation is a front-row seat to what happens when you raise kids in real life instead of a classroom. Joel walks us through the radical decision he and his wife made in the 1980s to homeschool, back when it was still illegal in parts of the country and deeply misunderstood. With no research, no co-ops, and no roadmap, they said yes anyway—because they couldn't say yes to the public system, and they couldn't afford private school. The outcome? Two thriving, confident, competent adult children and a family legacy that changed generations. We talk about why the simple things—folding laundry, planting a garden, making muffins—build real competence and self-worth in a world that's often more virtual than visceral. Joel's stories are riveting: from a son who couldn't read at ten to one who now runs the family business with confidence and purpose. If you've ever questioned your decision to homeschool (or are considering it), this conversation will remind you: you don't need to know how it all turns out to know that you're doing something that matters. ** Get your copy of Homeschooling, You're Doing it Right Just by Doing it here Learn more about Joel and all he has to offer here Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Title: SNL Hall of Fame: Celebrating the Life and Laughs of John BelushiIntroduction:Join us as we take an unforgettable journey through the life and career of legendary comedian John Belushi. With our insightful guest, Justin Renwick, we explore Belushi's early beginnings, his rise to fame with Second City and the National Lampoon, and his undeniable charisma that made him one of the most iconic comedians of all time.Chapters:- (0:00:08) SNL Hall of Fame Podcast: Introduction and overview of the episode, including John Belushi's early beginnings and his rise to fame.- (0:12:44) John Belushi's Career and Charisma: Exploring Belushi's journey to Second City, his success with the National Lampoon, and his charismatic stage presence.- (0:17:12) The Brilliance of John Belushi: Examining Belushi's confidence, his ability to immerse himself in characters, and his incredible comedic timing.- (0:24:37) Belushi's Impact on SNL and Comedy: Reflecting on Belushi's unforgettable performances, including his iconic Samurai character and the chemistry he shared with fellow castmates.- (0:34:24) Remembering John Belushi's SNL Sketches: Diving into Belushi's memorable sketches, his impersonations, and the impact of his comedic skills.- (0:46:42) John Belushi's Legacy: Discussing Belushi's influence on future comedians and whether he is the greatest SNL actor of all time.Keywords:- John Belushi- SNL- Second City- National Lampoon- Comedy- Chevy Chase- Samurai character- Animal HouseTranscript0:00:08 - AnnouncerIt's the SNL Hall of Fame podcast with your host, jamie Dube, chief Librarian Thomas Senna, and featuring Matt Bardille And now Curator of the Hall, jamie Dube. 0:00:42 - jDAll right, thank you so much, doug Denats. It's JD here, and welcome to the SNL Hall of Fame podcast. It's a weekly affair where each episode, we take a deep dive into the career of a former cast member, host, musical guest or writer and add them to the ballot for your consideration. Once the nominees have all been announced, we turn to you, the listener, to vote for the most deserving and help determine who will be enshrined for perpetuity inside these hallowed halls. You won in and I can let you in, but not until you wipe your goddamn feet. That's right. Wipe your feet at the door, you filthy animal. How are you doing today? I am, i'm actually really great. Thanks for asking. We've got a barn burner of a show today. It is Justin Renwick joining Thomas Senna in conversation about the very intriguing John Belushi. This should be a good one. I can tell you that the conversations I've had on Reddit, this is probably the most anticipated episode of the season, based on feedback that I've been getting about who we haven't seen nominated in the hall. Now, in case you're curious the way things work, we work together with a committee and choose who will be nominated each year from a pool based on the parameters that have been outlined by the SNL Hall of Fame. Once those selections are made, we sort of piece them together and produce a podcast and we make that show and we put them out every week and you get to listen And that's great. But the real key here is the voting, and the voting is coming up real soon. In fact, next week we are nominating Amy Poehler on the show and then Tuesday, the 23rd of May, voting will begin and it will run through to June 17th. So you will have from May 23rd to June 17th to cast your votes, to cast 15 votes, 15 votes up to 15 votes, i should say, for the SNL Hall of Fame. It's exciting. After Amy Poehler we'll do a few roundtables and then we'll do the reveal, and the reveal is quite exciting. I'm really curious to see if any of our legacy holdovers make it this year. There's Dave Grohl is really close. Lonely Island is super close and Lonely Island should be on. It should have been, you know, a first ballot Hall of Famer as far as I'm concerned, but I don't control the vote. So there's that If you're looking to register to vote, what you want to do is you want to go to SNLHofcom and click on the voting tab and click register to vote. You can do that right there and you will get a ballot on the 23rd emailed to you and Bob's, your uncle, from there. So there's that. Let's go over and talk to our friend Matt in his minutiae minute corner and learn a little bit more about Mr John Belushi. Oh, matthew, hey, hi, jimmy, how are you doing? 0:04:21 - MattI'm great. How about you, matt? I'm good. Thanks, i'm good. Really excited to talk about one of the classic cast members here today, john Belushi, the one and only five. Five foot eight, born January 24th 1949. He credit his grandmother, his Albanian grandmother, for getting him into show business. She didn't understand English, so she would have him act things out for her which made her laugh, and thus a career was born. He actually had very humble beginnings in the start of his career, which was as a youth instructor at a theater camp, the Shawnee Summer Theater of Green County. But from there he went on to become a member of the West Compass Trio, second city in the National Lampoon Lemmings. Prior to joining SNL, he attended the Southern Illinois University in Carbondale, which is where he actually got the college shirt, as seen in Animal House. There's a gift shop there in an area known as the Strip, which is still operating today if you wanted to go and get one for yourself. So while living in New York, he was next door neighbor to SNL fixture Elliot Gould, who we've talked about in the past. He is a huge nerd, or he was a huge nerd. He was a fan of many things, from Lucille Ball, whose entire career he committed to memory And this is something that actually seems to come up a bit. He had a razor sharp memory. He was also a Star Trek fan and with Kirk in particular, to the point Shatner said he preferred Belushi's take on Kirk And he was a big Marvel fan. On one visit to their offices in New York He could summarize any specific issue. Just by looking at the cover. He could people say, well, that's this one. He's like oh, this is the issue where Spider-Man is fighting the Green Goblin and so on and so dies, which must have made him really happy when he and the not ready for primetime players were featured in a Spider-Man comic And he ends up having stolen the Silver Samurai sword and used it in the sketch, so that my wife got that for me, actually that issue. It was shockingly inexpensive for a double memorabilia whammy, but she got that for me from our anniversary last year. That's very cool. Now he was well known for being very judgmental. One of the ways he would evaluate people is by borrowing $20 and seeing how they reacted, so you know if they're kind of a jerk about it. You knew, oh, they were a jerk, but he just gauged how they behaved, that's a good trick. Yeah, yeah, it was an interesting one. I have to remember that Now he was a heavy metal fan, which I did not realize. But when he met Dan Ackroyd, having performed together, dan tried to entice him onto the SNL cast At a Speak Easy, because of course, with those two is at a Speak Easy. Dan put on a blues album which stirred a fascination in John that became career defining, because he had never listened to blues before that meeting and then went on to create the Blues Brothers together. Now he was such a huge star. There were a bunch of roles that he was supposed to be a part of in films. Peter Venkman was originally written for him. He was replaced by James Woods in Once Upon a Time in America on his passing and was to appear in an adaptation of Fear and Loathing in Las Vegas with Ackroyd. Many more projects, but one of the more interesting, given it kind of ties back to his time on SNL. Harold Ramis was guest hosting an episode of Siskel and Ebert and discussed how it was John's dream to play Ludwig von Beethoven in a film, which is a weird one, but given he played him on the show, i guess that could have been a technically SNL spin-off. Now, sorry, go ahead. So he had the nickname of America's guest, as he had a habit of knocking on strangers' doors, entering their homes and eating things from their refrigerator and then crashing out on their couch. This never resulted in any problems because he was so well known, but speaks to how different the 70s were from today. Now he required an income of between $500,000 and a million dollars a year to maintain his lifestyle and his entourage. Now, while he would often make use of strangers' generosity, he himself was also very generous, lending large sums of money to friends and family Towards the end of his life. His manager pushed him to start collecting on these debts, but John refused. Now he is buried in Martha's Vineyard, where his epitaph reads he made us laugh and now he can make us think, but his grave was so popular with visitors, they moved his casket to an unmarked grave in a quiet corner of the cemetery, after which his fans posted a new epitaph based on his catchphrase. He could have given us a lot more laughs, but no, that is John Belushi. 0:10:21 - jDThat's great. Take it away, Thomas. 0:10:48 - ThomasAlright, Justin Renwick is joining me today. Thank you so much for joining me here on the SNL Hall of Fame. 0:10:54 - JustinIt's my pleasure. Thank you for having me. 0:10:56 - ThomasYeah, so this one is a big one to me. This is probably to a lot of people The legendary John Belushi will be talking about. So he was on SNL 1975 to 1980, part of the original cast. He seemed to be made for sketch comedy and had a lot of reps before he started at Saturday Night Live. So you talk about his path to SNL and his prior work in sketch comedy. 0:11:23 - JustinSo we could go way back to high school, which is where he caught the acting bug. He was a very accomplished athlete. He was a football player, he was a drummer, he was in a band that actually released a single believe it or not And to show what a small world Chicago and the greater Chicago area is, because he grew up. He was born in Chicago but he grew up in Wheaton, illinois. He knew Dick Lesucci, who was somebody he would also work with at Second City, and Dick Lesucci went on to SCTV as a writer, which I think he formed an alliance with Joe Flaherty at some point, which is how that came about, but we're getting a little bit off topic. So yeah, john, when he was in high school, did drama and his drama teacher noticed something. He's like there's something special about this kid And if anyone's read the book Wired this is where I know this story from. Apparently, this teacher took him to. If I'm remembering correctly, he took him to. I know it was Indiana, but I don't know if he went and auditioned somewhere else, but basically he got into summer stock in Indiana a year before most people were eligible when he was 17. Like that's how preternaturally talented he was And they did a whole series of plays there That went very well. He enrolled in when he graduated from high school, enrolled at the University of Wisconsin And I was doing drama there, but left after a year and then wound up going to the College of DuPage in West Chicago. Somewhere along that period he went to see Second City and had an epiphany, just realized this is what I was put on earth to do and formed the West Compass Players, which was a reference to the pre-Second City Compass Players, with his friends Tino Insana and Steve Bachecas who people that watch John Belushi on Saturday Night Live will be very familiar with that name because he brought it up a lot in his vits. So the three of them were able to audition en masse for Second City And I think it was Bernie Salons that auditioned them And he saw John's potential right away, saw something in Tino Insana. Well, i think Tino was put in the touring company or asked to take some more classes, but he wound up joining as well. But yeah, john went into Second City. I believe he went right into the main stage cast, which at the time had Brian Doyle, murray, harold Ramis, joe Flaherty, so he was punching well above his weight. I don't know if that's the right term to use, because that sounds more like he was not very good, but was somehow anyway he did very well, but he was young at the time. 0:13:51 - ThomasSo, like you know, being able to be in that company at his age says a lot about it. I think, it's fair to say, at that time punching up above his weight. 0:14:00 - JustinYeah, you're right. Yeah, he wouldn't have been around 22. Joe Flaherty was. I think he was in his late 20s at that point. He was a good 10 years older than the STTV cast, but anyway, that obviously went very well. He made a real reputation for himself there And through that got involved with the national ampoon, so much so that he moved to New York after he'd been in the Lemmings review with Chevy Chase and Christopher Gast, which is one of my favorite comedy albums of all time National Ampoon's Lemmings, which was a takeoff on Woodstock and was where he did Joe Cocker among. he also played the, the MC. But then, yeah, through that world of national ampoon and then writing, producing and performing for the radio hour, that's what brought him to the attention of Lauren Michaels through Chevy Chase and Michael O'Donoghue when they were putting Saturday Night Live together. 0:14:47 - ThomasEven at the National Ampoon's radio hour. that's where he came across with Bill Murray, gilda Radner, some of his future SNL cohorts, just a who's who working on that show at the time. Richard Belzer was even part of that. So it was just a really, really talented cast And, would you say I know a lot of them had their gifts and talents, but there was something magnetic about Belushi that even stood out amongst that type of talent. 0:15:14 - JustinBelushi has that thing like. The charisma is just unbelievable. But he has that mischievous glint. Jimmy Fallon has it as well. Many other people do where you're even if you know not only his stage presence. Right Just the minute John Belushi walked on to stage, eyes were drawn to him. John Candy had the same thing. Anyone that's tall I mean, john Belushi wasn't tall, but anyone that has a big presence and can exude that kind of charisma right away stills focused. But he always wanted to see what he was going to do next. Same thing with Jimmy Fallon When he was fucking around in a sketch and messing up. You wanted to know, oh, you know what's. He got up his sleeve What's going to happen next? And that was very much John Belushi too. This electric performer is the word that comes to mind. 0:15:53 - ThomasThat's why a lot of us watch live sketch and SNL in particular is because there's I mean there's that element of you don't know it's going to be a live show, you don't know what's going to happen. There's almost that danger involved in. Belushi really did personify. He did bring that energy to the show. Yeah. 0:16:11 - JustinAnd he has like Kate McKinnon is the same Melissa McCarthy just fearless performers that you can throw anything at them And they'll. You know, like even something as simple. I'm sure the tomato was cut beforehand, but like the samurai deli, when he throws the tomato up in the air and chops it with no-transcript, there's a million ways that can go wrong on a live TV show. But I don't think it bothered him at all, he just knew. 0:16:35 - ThomasSo he, like I said, he started with. You know he was an original cast member at SNL. They started in 1975. Where did you become familiar with Belushi's work and kind of what stood out to you? 0:16:46 - JustinNot to get too deep into the archives, but my introduction to Saturday Night Live was a friend's Mr Bill t-shirt in 1979. I'm like what's Mr Bill? Oh it's this thing that's on Saturday Night Live. It's really funny. Oh, it's this show, it's on Saturday nights, it's live, ha ha. Anyway, i asked my mom about it. She knew she was a big Second City fan so she'd been watching Saturday Night Live since day one And yeah, they let me stay up and Mr Bill was the gateway. But then in between the sketches I'm trying to think the first thing that really stood out with me, stood out for me with John Belushi, was probably I'm going to say the Bs, because this was 1979. So they were still back then. The reruns weren't just shows from the current season, they were showing shows from the first season on. So I got to sort of catch up over that season. That's probably the first thing that stood out. But it's just, it's that confidence. He was so confident. It's really magnetic, like it really draws you in. I mean, to be a performer on Saturday Night Live you have to have a certain degree of confidence. But there's different levels. Like if you look at somebody like Dan Ackroyd, who was incredibly talented, really funny and just able to like rattle off details. You know, at a moment's notice there's a difference between sort of him and Belushi, which I think is why they complimented each other so well. Dan Ackroyd is more of a technical actor, whereas to me anyway, john Belushi is a little more instinctive. 0:18:06 - ThomasYeah, what stood out to me a lot, when you know rewatching a lot of his sketches and everything, was just how he would dissolve into a character And then he just gave off this. Really, the audience knew that they were in good hands with him up there because he exuded just like you know, i'm supposed to be here, i'm doing Don Corleone impression and I'm the one who's supposed to be doing this and I'm good enough. And he did have that confidence, definitely, and his relationship with some of his castmates, from what I've read, really played into that, especially his relationship with Chevy Chase. 0:18:42 - Speaker 1Yeah, And how he viewed. 0:18:43 - ThomasChevy Chase, getting attention early on. 0:18:46 - JustinIt's funny that they weren't. you know, they didn't get along very well, even in the lampoon days, And when Chevy was still smart enough and got over his own ego, it was him and Michael O'Donoghue that suggested him. I think I mentioned that before to Lauren. But yeah, that of course, when Chevy took off in the first few episodes of Saturday Night Live, yeah, John Belushi was not happy about it. 0:19:07 - ThomasNo, i think maybe John looked at Chevy is getting you know, maybe I don't know if it's cheap laughs, but he's certainly got a lot of mileage off falling prat falls. And I think what Belushi felt that he did was maybe more elevated than what Chevy did. So I think each Belushi thought, from what I've read, belushi thought that he was supposed he was the star of the of the cast. Yeah, not Absolutely. 0:19:30 - JustinChevy Chase is. That's a whole lot of problems to unpack that that guy has, but let's just suffice it to say I he is, is incredible at what he does. You know what I mean? Like to you were saying the falling, the falling down, like the mimicking people behind their back, just the, the sort of boyish humor and the looks. The looks helped as well, the dimple chin and the sort of he had a glint in his eye as well. But yeah, he's miles away And I'm pretty sure Chevy Chase will be the first one to tell you that in the acting realm from John Belushi. 0:20:02 - ThomasWhen Chevy Chase played Gerald Ford, he didn't sink into Gerald Ford. That was Chevy Chase just calling himself Gerald. 0:20:09 - JustinFord, which made it even funnier for some reason. 0:20:12 - ThomasYeah, it definitely worked for sure, but then, if you know, belushi played a character, belushi just really transformed into that character And I think that that was a lot of acting chops, like you mentioned. 0:20:25 - JustinI think the other amazing thing about Belushi and another reason, a big reason that would put him in the the Hall of Fame is not only could he, he's an incredible mimic, He has a great comic timing, like Jackie Gleason is one of his heroes, and it really shows. And, yeah, he can sink into a character and become somebody else, But at the same time you put him on update as himself and it's unbelievable, Like he's still amazing Just playing. You know, as a comedian's play slightly heightened versions of themselves. He was comfortable playing himself as well as playing other characters which we're going to. We'll use the same analogy. Dan Ackroyd was more comfortable sinking into characters. You saw his season on Weekend Update with Jane Curtin. He never looked very comfortable playing himself. 0:21:09 - ThomasBelushi on those update pieces. It was incredible He would. He would start off, just, you know, even kill. I think that was the most Belushi, the most human, for lack of a better term that I would see Belushi on the show. But then he would go from zero to a hundred and like two seconds The whole. The luck of the Irish rant, the famous one that he had on Weekend. 0:21:29 - Speaker 3Update. 0:21:30 - ThomasAnd you know it starts off level headed. 0:21:33 - Speaker 8Well, it's that time again. St Patrick's Day has come and gone, and well, the sons of Ireland are basking in the globe. You know, when I think of Ireland I think of a lot of colorful Irish expressions like top of the morning to you, kiss the Blarney stone. May the road rise to meet you. May you be in heaven. An hour before the devil knows you're dead, i'd like to smash you in the face with my shillelie Danny boy begora. Whale of the banshee. Whiskey for the leprechauns, whiskey for the leprechauns. But the expression I think most people identify with the Irish is, of course, the luck of the Irish. 0:22:09 - ThomasAnd Beluce, he's just kind of this nice guy just saying what he has to say and then he just, he just is like a bull in a china shop. 0:22:15 - Speaker 9I said bye man. I said hey man. I never even seen $5,000 in my life. So don't ask me for it Now watch, ask your mother which is a dumb thing for me to say, because his mother just died. Now I got, right now I got this drunken Irish junkie who wants to kill me because of what I said about his mother being in terminal dreamland. You know, one thing would just get me out One thing They love their mothers, boy. Oh, they love their mothers. It's Mama Diff and Mama Dan. Oh, my Irish mother. I really must be heaven because my mother comes up there. Ah, ah, ah. 0:23:01 - ThomasHe would do like a, like an army, roll off the desk and then you would never see him after that, until the next sketch. Yeah, yeah. 0:23:10 - JustinAnd again that's on. That's on live TV again. There's so many ways that could go wrong. 0:23:14 - ThomasJust don't no fear no fear, yeah, totally fearless, i think. I think that's such a great way to put it. An element of Belushi that I love too was that he reminded me of like a Charlie Chaplin or a Buster Keaton in a lot of ways, and one of the examples, one of, yeah, just a very expressive face and he didn't have to have any lines necessarily to convey something to do really great sketch work. And one of the things that really pops out to me, his most famous character, the samurai, is like the perfect example. John reminded me of Charlie Chaplin or Buster Keaton. Like I said, in those sketches It just really was striking, just like the physical ability of him to convey something. 0:23:56 - Speaker 3All I know is that the third quarter net of Kentucky Mines was up 6.2%. 0:24:00 - Speaker 1Look at this graph. 0:24:02 - Speaker 3Look, it went right up here And what happened September, October, November into the well-known toilet. 0:24:09 - Speaker 9I love her over there. 0:24:10 - Speaker 10Who's here? Who? Who Did Who Who? I don't know what you mean, but I need security. 0:24:23 - Speaker 9That's the point. 0:24:23 - JustinI'm sure you're aware of this, and other listeners maybe as well that that was based on Toshiro Mifuni, his character in Yojimbo, and they called his name with samurai futaba And that was his audition piece for Saturday Night Live. The Samurai Pool Hustler I don't know if it was his, probably his wife and it remembers was saying that yeah right, he was in the apartment messing around with that character for a while with a bathrobe and he'd grab the dowel from the like the clothes rod, from the closet, use it as a sword And, if I'm not mistaken in the audition he used that obviously as a pool cue. 0:24:55 - ThomasWell, i could see why he got the job then. I mean, that's such a Got the gig. yeah, i think I underestimated how much I enjoyed the Samurai until I took a deep dive into Belushi over the last few weeks And I could see why it was held in such high regard. I mean those facial expressions, the interplay he had, mostly with Buck Henry but with a few other hosts. it was just incredible to watch. I couldn't take my eyes off of Belushi during those sketches. 0:25:23 - JustinI just read today. apparently it was Buck Henry who turned it into a recurring character because he first played the Samurai with Richard Pryor. Apparently, when Buck Henry came in, it was his request to be in a sketch with the Samurai, And it went so well that every time Buck came back they would bust out another Samurai sketch with Buck playing the same character. 0:25:42 - ThomasThey had such good chemistry. I think, belushi, he had good chemistry with some of the other, the hosts that did the Samurai with him. Oh, samurai Hotel, that's what it was. It was the Samurai Hotel, okay. 0:25:54 - JustinYo. 0:25:54 - ThomasMama-san. Yes, he and Richard Pryor. Yeah, that was awesome. Another example that I had just about Belushi being a great silent actor like just he didn't have to speak one word was he and Gilda had this sketch where they met in the laundromat and they share a washer at the laundromat and they begin to flirt, and that was just all the no dialogue. They share a cigarette at the end They share a cigarette at Belushi's pouring champagne. At one point That was just such great comedic acting without having to say one word. 0:26:26 - JustinI don't have any proof of this, but that kind of strikes me as what's known as a trunk piece. I would imagine and again, i could be very wrong. I would imagine either Gilda or John may have brought that from Second City, so there was a few of those in the first season. like there's a Dan Aykroyd Gilda Radner sketch where Dan Aykroyd plays a mechanic and he's putting his daughter to bed and she wants to hear a story and he's tired and wants her to go to bed, so he just makes up a story that involves all these car parts or whatever. That was definitely something that two of them had done in Toronto. But yeah, i'm getting a little ahead of myself here. It's speculation. 0:27:00 - ThomasYeah, no, that definitely makes sense. I think when they were doing Second City stuff and it's a lot like SNL in that they have to come up with idea after idea after idea, And a lot of it tends to be slice of life kind of things, Like you find the funny bits in these seemingly ordinary slice of life kind of things. So in this example they were at the laundromat and they want to both use the same washer, the work. Can we go from there? That does strike me as an idea that they would have used at Second. 0:27:26 - JustinCity. It feels very much like, yeah, it feels a lot like a Second City or a Groundling sketch. I mean they still do that today Not, i doubt, as often. but I know Melissa McCarthy the first time she hosted when they did the Focus Group on the Hidden Valley Ranch. I didn't know it at the time. I only learned this about a year ago that that was a sketch she was doing every night at the Groundlings that she'd written. So shout out to Melissa. 0:27:47 - ThomasThis isn't about Melissa. Yeah, she finds it. She finds it, though I think there's a lot of Belushi spirit in Melissa as a performer. 0:27:55 - JustinOh, 100%, yeah, definitely She's also fearless and she's also a really good actor. Yeah, And that's John. like John Belushi's secret sauce is what a great actor he was. Being funny is one thing, but being a good actor is like 70, 80% of it. 0:28:10 - ThomasHe was an animal house and he wasn't the lead. I think hindsight tells people that Belushi was the lead in that film but he wasn't. 0:28:18 - JustinOh yeah, But he totally commanded attention in that movie, even the first scene when he's holding the beer and he pisses on Thomas Hulse's leg. It's like I want to know what this guy's doing next. I know the food scene in Animal House where he's stealing all the stuff out of the cafeteria. John Landis has said he was off camera like guiding him and saying, like I want you to be Cookie Monster, basically. 0:28:43 - ThomasWhen you're watching that movie. You got excited when Belushi would get on the screen. I mean when the hippie guy was kind of playing the guitar on the stairwell and Belushi just takes the guitar Poor Steve Ambition, Yeah. He takes the guitar and smashes it against the wall And then he just kind of looks at him and goes, sorry, And then walks away. 0:29:03 - JustinI mean, He doesn't even say it like, it's not even snide, it's like sorry, it's like it's this thing I had to do. It's not personal, yeah. 0:29:12 - ThomasYeah, nothing against you, It was just I had to do this. Yeah, yeah. So people I think, looking back at Animal House, think that that was a Belushi vehicle And it kind of wasn't. I mean, it was very much an ensemble but there were definitely leads that weren't Belushi in the movie, but that just speaks to the presence that he had about him. 0:29:29 - JustinWell, to speak again to the Chevy, John Dilemma, let's call it. You probably know they wanted Chevy Chase to play Eric Stratton, which was Tim, Tim, what's his last name? Anyway, the guy that played Eric Stratton, it was Otter and, yeah, Otter was the character's nickname, I think. Anyway, that was supposed to be Chevy And he didn't want to be second fiddle to John Belushi again, even though technically, yeah, he would have been. I guess you'd say he was the lead and they wanted Dan Ackroyd as D-Day, but Dan apparently was not ready. He felt he wasn't ready to make movies yet, which is weird because he'd made them in Canada. 0:30:04 - Thomasbut be that as it may, Yeah, that would have been such a perfect role for Ackroyd too. He would have just slid right in. 0:30:11 - JustinWell, the guy that I can't remember the actor's name, but the guy that played D-Day did a great job, bruce, yeah. 0:30:15 - ThomasBruce McGill. Yeah, he was really good in that. Belushi set a template too for we were talking about. I see a lot of him in Melissa McCarthy. I see a lot of him, of course, the comparison when Chris Farley got on the show that comparison was just out there for the taking and Chris Farley idolized John Belushi as well. He wanted to be Belushi We'll get to this but unfortunately he was like Belushi in a lot of ways good and bad, but Belushi, yeah, but Belushi, just he definitely set a template for a lot of performers as far as how they performed and as far as also what SNL was looking for in cast members going forward. I think a lot of times they were trying to find a Belushi sort of role when they were trying to feel a cast going forward. 0:31:00 - JustinWell, there's a through line with John Belushi and a lot of the other similar actors. I mean Bill Murray sort of has that kamikaze kind of go for it, fearless attitude as well. John Candy and Bill Murray and John Candy are also both incredible actors, and even Chris Farley, the through line. There is a guy named Del Close who was in the Compass Players. I think he was in the St Louis. There was an offshoot in St Louis And then eventually everything morphed into Second City And Del also worked with Second City for quite some time And then years later, when often started in Provolympic with so Sharna Halpern, they all received the tutelage of Del Close And I think he helped. I mean, stuff is there, but I think he helped bring that out in them as well. 0:31:44 - ThomasYeah, for sure, del Close, like a lot of people look at him as the godfather of improv, especially he worked with so many great improv and sketch actors. So a lot of these conversations point back to Del Close in a lot of ways, for sure. And I think you know, when they hired Farley, of course everybody said you know, they found their Belushi When the Horatio Sands started on the show. I think people made a lot of those comparisons And even Bobby Moynihan they said, oh, that's the Belushi or Farley archetype. So that's just, you know, john Belushi setting a template and just an example for the show, as far as what works on the show and what Lorne was trying to find. So what are some other characters or sketches or performances on SNL that you think our listeners should familiarize themselves with when discussing Belushi? 0:32:37 - JustinSo, getting back to the bees, i mean the bees weren't a great sketch, they were just stupid. But it was just funny seeing everybody dressed up in bees costumes. But the good thing that I think that came out of the bees was King Bee, john Belushi and Dan Ackroyd is a. You know, it was kind of a proto-Bloose brothers. They're dressed up in the bees costumes. They got the shades on Dan's playing the harmonica. They're playing with the Howard Shore band It was a Saturday Night Live band at the time And they do Slim Harpo's King Bee, and you know, john in the middle starts doing cartwheels and all kinds of other acrobatics And then it ends with him doing that when your man is doomed, when you're about to do Getting crazier and crazier and then getting up and falling off the stool. 0:33:30 - Speaker 10Want you to be my queen. 0:33:35 - Speaker 8We are together, we can make honey baby, but we'll never see. Okay, let's buzz a while. 0:33:54 - JustinYes, that's the place to start. I think there's there's other sketches that are that are worth mentioning, where he would try to show off his acting, you know, in the early days of Saturday Night Live and even further along, but they don't really do them anymore. There were always these little almost one-act plays, you know. Some of them were dramatic, didn't even have any any comedy in them, and John seemed to be featured in a lot of those. He was. There's one he did on the Sissy's basic show, which I think was in the third season. That's worth watching when that didn't work, that didn't help you find your manly powers. 0:34:24 - Speaker 9I started thinking about dead people and And if dead people secretly watched to see if you go to their funeral, you looking at certain parts of my body and You thinking the word dead. 0:34:38 - Speaker 8Well, no wonder. If you're wondering why there is no wonder, well, there is no wonder. You know I have been with if you know what I mean a semi-professional singer. I've had adult relations with a semi-professional singer, not to mention many others. Only mention the one that proves to a man who has been to Houston and left behind a satisfied semi-professional. 0:35:11 - JustinHe goes toe-to-toe with with Sissy and they both come out looking very good. 0:35:15 - ThomasYou get the sense that John, you know, relished being able to play opposite those great actors. I'm reminded of the dueling Brando's one that he did with Peter Boyle, where they traded Brando impressions. 0:35:30 - SketchI could have been a contender, could have been somebody instead of a bum, which is what I am. Let's face it, charlie. 0:35:40 - SketchI got him a son of the callion governor. 0:35:46 - ThomasAnd you can tell Belushi was probably just having such a good time trading those with Peter Boyle, peter. 0:35:51 - JustinBoyle, another second city, chicago, alum, yeah they're probably super comfortable working with each other and there's that, and Joe Cocker, of course, and especially the Joe Cocker he did to Joe Cocker. 0:36:04 - ThomasThat's right. Yeah, one of the first kind of celebrities who gets impersonated walk-ons In SNL. Yeah, that that kind of became a thing a lot in the 90s. Yeah, that Joe Cocker was great. He did that really early too. You said that he had auditioned with it. He did that first in the third episode of season one, yeah, the Rob Reiner episode. 0:36:24 - JustinAnd there's another thing I was just gonna bring up That's also from the Rob Reiner episode when they They're dressed up as the bees and Rob has to tell them the bee sketch has been cut. 0:36:32 - SketchI'm sorry if you think we're ruining your show, mr Reiner, but See, you don't understand. We didn't ask the Beebees, you see, you, you've got Norman Lear and a first-rate riding staff, but this is all they came up with for us. 0:37:01 - SketchDo you think we like this? 0:37:04 - SketchNo, no, mr Reiner, but we don't have any choice. 0:37:15 - JustinThat's one of the first time he did one of those. I don't. I don't think there was a but, no, in it, but there could have been. That was leading, you know, laying the groundwork for those care, for those bits that he would do where he'd become increasingly frustrated with somebody. I could have gone out and done this, but Yeah, oh my gosh. 0:37:34 - ThomasAnd there's also in season three, The Olympia Cafe. I think that's another one that one of his famous ones from SNL that we should probably hit it was him. Bill Murray Played a great role in that. What do you remember what watching him in the Olympia Cafe sketches? 0:37:51 - JustinI love the history of those sketches. I think it was not. Novello had come in as a writer in season three and he brought that idea because he and John were both Familiar with the, the tavern in Chicago that was based on I think it was the Billy Goat Tavern. That's basically what happened. You know, cheeseburger, cheeseburger, no, no, fries, chips, no, coke, pepsi, all that kind of stuff, and John could also draw on his Background because his father was a restaurant owner, so I'm sure a lot of it came from that as well. But even the, the decision to make the owner Greek, and he appeared in a season two sketch as That character on one of those Jane Curtin talk shows. Even before they did those sketches and, yeah, i know in the history of the family they were Albanian and apparently in you know, chicago in the 40s or 50s That was still considered too ethnic, so they would often poses Greek to avoid, to avoid trouble. Yeah, i didn't know that. Guess that's where that comes from. Yeah, yeah, the only sketches were very, very ambitious, like to have a working grill and that you've ever been a studio 8h like it's? it's not huge, no no, it's not. 0:38:56 - ThomasYeah, rewatching those because I was fortunate enough to be able to, in the spring of 2022, go see SNL in person for the first time, and so it's kind of you? 0:39:05 - Justindid you dress for the or the or the? 0:39:07 - ThomasWe saw a dress rehearsal, getting a perspective of actually how small that studio is and then going back to watch sketches and, like you said, with the Olympia cafe, for example, they've put a working grill, they had, you know, it seems like elaborate for how small that studio is for sure. And John, in those sketches He seemed to me like he was the run, the one who was anchoring the sketch and kind of running things and taking it. Oh for sure, you're to there, you know, and he would interact with maybe Jane Curtin as an annoyed customer or Bill Murray is the sheepish Worker, but it was John sketch that he was just controlling. 0:39:43 - ThomasI'm sure he's playing a version of his father there. 0:39:46 - JustinOh yeah, Absolutely you can tell that's, that's just effortless. 0:40:11 - ThomasAnother sketch that it's a pre-tape. That's just lived in my brain since I was a kid. Inside that sort of showed Belushi's more kind of human relatable side was the little chocolate donuts. 0:40:30 - SketchA lot of miles training for that day and I'm down a lot of donuts. It tastes good and they've got the sugar I need to get me going in the morning. That's why a little chocolate don'ts have been on my training table since I was a kid. 0:40:48 - SketchLittle chocolate donuts, the donuts of champions. 0:40:55 - ThomasAnd that was more so because I don't feel as a viewer and this is a compliment to Belushi because, like I said, he would sink into his characters but I never felt totally like I knew who he was as a human being in a lot of ways Contrast that with Chris Farley, whose human nature just oozed out, but with little chocolate donuts. That was one of the times where I kind of saw relatability in Belushi. 0:41:20 - JustinYeah, i think my first was I think it's during the first season. They would do bits sometimes, i guess, maybe to fill time, like they'd have Gilda Radner do her You know what Gilda ate segment. Or just say, you know, hey, ma'am, you can go to bed. I'm not in the show this week, but there was one where John Belushi came out and tried to sell a bunch of his old records. Yes yes, but it was just him playing himself honestly with, i'm sure, albums that he owned, yeah, and that's yeah. I kind of got a better sense of him from that. 0:41:48 - ThomasRe-watching a lot of his stuff. I love getting those, those moments here and there of like, oh, i think that's Belushi, i think, yeah, i think that's hit, who he really is kind of coming through. But he was think he was Consciously, didn't. You know? I think he liked to play characters rather than I'm gonna play a version of myself, which is a testament to him. My gosh, like we said, he was so, so great at that. So unfortunately, after SNL he didn't have much time. He had two movies that came out after SNL that he starred in. It was continental divide and neighbors. I don't know if you've ever seen either of those. 0:42:23 - JustinI've seen neighbors. I've never seen continental divide. I've always wanted to but just haven't got around to it. But I only recently saw, even to go back, old boyfriends from 1978 where he plays Basically a more spiffed-up version of of Jake blues. He's just this guy that works for the local. I think it's the local flower shop that tell you Shire, who's the lead was. You know, she knew him back in high school, yeah, and he's got this band that he fronts at nights. But anyway, it's a shame that Him and Don Avello's movie noble rot didn't get made. 0:42:54 - ThomasDo you know what? what was the premise behind the movie with the that Don Avello was working on with him? 0:42:59 - Justinnoble rot It had something to do with. It wasn't abscam, but it was something like that. It was a, not a Ponzi scheme, but something along those lines. Reading a fuller outline of the of the premise, it sounded like it was gonna be a really good movie. But I think the film company was forcing John to be in the national ampoune's joy of sex. But she didn't want to do and they said well, if you don't do this, you don't get to make noble rot. But unfortunately none of it came to pass anyway, sadly. Cuz cuz of a speedball. 0:43:30 - ThomasSo yeah, march 5th 1982 he unfortunately passed away only 33 years old, gosh, i mean that I'm yeah. That must have sent shockwaves through the comedy world and through Hollywood in general. 0:43:43 - JustinI can't imagine. And even the people like the people that were there that day, like Robert De Niro was there, robin Williams was there. Robin Williams credits it with helping him stop taking cocaine, so at least something good came out of it But yeah, you can only imagine. And also the guilt like somebody like Lauren Michaels. How would you feel? See, i should have intervened, i should have helped. I'm just using his and him as an example. I'm not trying to put any guilt on him or anything, but yeah, like, not only is it a warning sign, maybe you should Curb your lifestyle a little bit, but also you should also try to help people that are, that are in trouble. But in the 70s, 70s and 80s, you know, people didn't really do that, we didn't have the equipment. It even happened to. You know, ten years later, with Kurt Cobain, nobody knew to just put the brakes on and say just stop for a while, go away, get your head together. See somebody talk about your feelings, whatever. 0:44:36 - ThomasBut yeah, it was just go, go, go And it was so prevalent around that time too. There's always stories about how SNL in the late 70s, there was a lot of cocaine, everything like that. So it must have been hard to tell somebody like Belushi that they have a problem, when he could just look and say, well, i've done this with you. Like, who are you to tell me? 0:44:57 - Justinthat I have a problem. It's a little different from the same bowl here, buddy. Yeah, so it must have been hard to intervene with somebody back then when it was just so prevalent. Nobody wants to be the parent right. 0:45:09 - ThomasYeah, yeah, exactly. And you know what's interesting to me? He was going to be in Ghostbusters And that was so unfortunate that we didn't get to see him in that form in Ghostbusters. But the monster Slimer, I believe, was modeled after Belushi. I don't know if that's apocryphal. 0:45:27 - JustinNow that you say that it sure looks like him. 0:45:30 - ThomasYeah. I think I believe that I've read that they kind of modeled Slimer after Belushi, And when you look at Slimer you can maybe see a nod to Belushi. What kind of career do you think that Belushi could have had had he? 0:45:44 - Justinkept clean. I think it would have been very similar to Bill Murray's. Oh, yeah, i think he would have continued doing comedy, obviously Like who's not going to hire him to be in a comedy. But even with Continental Divide, which is sort of a again, i haven't seen it, but from what I know it's sort of a comedy drama almost. You know what I mean. It's not balls to the wall, animal house or Blues Brothers with jokes and explosions and gags and everything. But yeah, i could see him doing a lot more dramatic roles And then maybe being like what happened with Bill Murray being taken on by somebody like Sophia Coppola who would bring him in every time because she knows he can deliver. 0:46:19 - ThomasOr somebody like Wes Anderson. Maybe there could have been a cool partnership with someone like Wes Anderson, like, yeah, belushi was that talented He could have. I think I could have seen him in more dramatic roles like Lost in Translation or something like that, like Murray got to do for sure. That's definitely not a stretch. So what is your final case if you had to sum it up, for John Belushi to be inducted into the SNL Hall of Fame. 0:46:42 - JustinTotal commitment. Larger than life persona, hugely talented actor, The first major star to emerge from the show post Chevy. Natural charisma, being a member of the first cast ever, I think, puts him above a lot of people, setting a template for many to follow, Best example being Chris Farley that we've discussed. But unfortunately, some of those habits also bled in The ability to upstage others with his mere presence on stage, the eyebrow cocking the one eyebrow. It's amazing what he could do with that. Unbelievable comic timing, preter natural talent, given that at the age of 16 or 17, a drama teacher at a high school was like there's something here That's very rare. Being a great actor and having it serve comedy, which doesn't happen, is a hard thing to do And it's more than half. The battle really is being a good actor, as we mentioned earlier, And I'd say a lot of people have come close to his level, like we said earlier Kate McKinnon on another area of the spectrum, Somebody like Dan Ackroyd, But I don't think anyone's reached that height yet. I think he is the greatest Saturday Night Live actor of all time. 0:48:06 - jDSo there's that. I want to thank Justin Renwick, i want to thank Thomas Senna, i want to thank Matt Ardill. I want to thank you for listening, but before we go any further, i want to listen to a sketch. I want to listen to something that Belushi did that seals the deal, that makes me feel that he is a legit, absolute Hall of Famer. I think that Justin's comment that he's the greatest SNL actor of all time is a bold statement. A bold statement There have been a lot. One who joined just three years after Belushi left is Eddie Murphy, and I don't know how you get bigger than Eddie Murphy. So is Belushi a Hall of Famer? Yeah, i think so. Is he a first ballot Hall of Famer? Likely, like, very likely. Is he the greatest of all time? I don't know, maybe that's another podcast for another time, but let's listen to this sketch now and get a better sense of what Mr Belushi brought to the table. 0:49:28 - SketchI guess this is my style. Well, they all thought I'd be the first to go. I was one of those live fast, die young and leave a good looking corpse type, you know. Well, i guess they were wrong. There they are, all my friends. This is a not ready for prime time cemetery. Come on up. Well, here's Gilda Radner. She had her own show on Canadian television for years and years the Gilda Radner show. At least now I can see her on reruns. Here's a button. God bless her. Here's what Lorraine is, they say. She murdered her DJ husband and moved to the valley in California and had a pecan farm. She was this big when she died Jane Curtin. She married a stockbroker, had two children, moved upstate New York. She died of complications during cosmetic surgery. Here's Eric Morris. Eric went to the show and worked in the black theater for years And he died of an overdose of heroin. Here's Bill Murray. He lived the longest, 38 years. He was happy when he died, though He just grown his mustache back, probably still growing. Here's Chevy Chase. He died when that was first movie with Goldie Haan. Over here is Danny Ackroyd. I guess he loved his Harley too much. It clocked him at 175 miles an hour before the crash. It was a blur. I had to be called in to identify his body. I recognized him by his web toes. Well. Saturday Night Show was the best experience of my life. Now they're all gone. I miss every one of them. Why me? Why did I live so long? They're all dead. I'll tell you why Because I'm a dancer. 0:53:10 - jDThat was Don't Look Back in Anger, directed by Tom Schiller. You didn't get to see it, but it features an old John Belushi. If you're listening to this podcast, you're a big enough fan of SNL that you've seen the sketch, but if you haven't check it out, it's worth watching as well. It works on an audio level but it certainly is worth watching to see Belushi's chops as he is dressed up as an old man. It's very eerie. It's a great place to see that old man come Here. He is lamenting his deceased co-workers and reminiscing that it was the best time of his life. We never got to experience that old man Belushi and get to hear that from his lips. Schiller created a premonition. In a sense It's a wonderful piece of art. You can check it out for sure. That, my friends, is what I have for you this week. Make sure to register to vote. S and l h o f dot com. Click on the voting tab, click register to vote and you'll be in. Voting begins the 23rd of May, wraps up the 17th of June And on the 19th of June we will induct the class of season three. So on your way out, if you do me a favor, as you're walking past the weekend update exhibit turn out the lights, because the s and l hall of fame is now closed. 0:54:56 - AnnouncerThanks for listening to the s and l hall of fame podcast. Make sure to rate, review, share and subscribe to the show. Wherever you get your podcasts, follow us on social media at s and l h o f. This is Doug Denance saying. This is Doug Denance saying see you next week. Support this podcast at — https://redcircle.com/snlhof/donationsAdvertising Inquiries: https://redcircle.com/brandsPrivacy & Opt-Out: https://redcircle.com/privacy

In this episode, we take a look at the question Can AI Be Used to Automate the Mundane? Grant Hey, everybody, welcome to another episode of ClickAI Radio. So welcome, I am excited to bring into the show today someone that it's taken me several times trying to get to this, busy busy guy. This is Evan Ryan. Evan, I hope I said your name right, right. Because I've said some people's names wrong. It's not Yvonne right or not right on? Is it Evan Ryan? Right? Evan It is Evan Ryan. Yeah, you got it in the right order. Most of the time, it's in the opposite order to flip it around. Grant Right. Um, founders CEO, King, of Teammate AI, right. Evan I just tried to go by founder. Okay. Grant Awesome. All right. Tell us a bit about yourself, Evan, what's brought you to this point. And anyway, thanks for joining the show. All right. Let me stop talking. Go ahead. Evan Well, Grant, thanks for having me. We were talking before we started recording, I just hit it off from the first second, at least in my opinion, I'm having a wonderful time. So really with me, I didn't really notice this. But throughout my entire childhood, I really had zero tolerance for boring stuff. I was somebody who just really likes doing fun things. And I like doing things that are that are entertaining, that are challenging, that are fascinating, that are motivating. But I don't like doing things that are boring. And I will basically do anything that I can to avoid doing boring stuff. And of course, now Hindsight is 2020. But that's sort of how I view a lot of my childhood. Well, in 2016, I went to a conference where they had this guy by the name of Jeremy Howard. And at the time, or a year or two prior, he was the number one ranked AI researcher in the world. He was talking about all this stuff that you could do with AI. And he, he mentioned that he had this company that could correctly diagnose cancer from MRIs and CT scans. Cool better than a team of board certified doctors. Oh, this isn't 2016. Yeah, so I was just about to graduate from college. I was thinking that oh my gosh, like, this is just the coolest thing I've ever heard. I basically went into AI the next day. Did you really? Wow. Yeah, it was it was really sort of powerful and transformative. Over the next couple of years of sort of iterating around well, what what do I really want to do inside of AI? You know, how do I want to define AI? First of all, there's sort of no definition that everybody can agree upon. I really found that, you know, I hate doing boring stuff. I bet a lot of other people hate doing boring stuff, too. Yeah, yeah. So and so now we all know the pattern there for sure. Yeah. Yeah. And what I've found is really interesting is, you know, one of the biggest conversation topics around AI right now is will AI take all of our jobs? Grant Oh, my goodness. Yeah. I hear that so many times. Yes. Evan I mean, there are like so many ways to answer that with the answer, in my opinion, being No. But what I found is really exciting is when I bring people into the creative process about how can they automate the mundane, the boring, repeatable on their days, they're so excited, like the first time in a while that they felt like, wow, the future is so much bigger than my past. So for the last several years, we've been automating, we've been automating tasks and automating processes for small and medium sized businesses. Grant So let me back up. So you hear this guy speak. You're like AI is the place to go. Your passion is let me take boring out of life. So you're leveraging AI to do that to remove the boring. I remember my dad is really what got me into the, into the technology industry. He was in it if you can believe it, right? So he was like one of the early early pioneers in some of this stuff. And he I remember him using the phrase Boolean shift a lot. He would always talk like, oh, technology is a Boolean shift. And I'm like, What are you talking about? What's a Boolean shift, you know? But this is kind of a Boolean shift with AI something, it's going to totally replace us. But in fact, I think it's a shift to the right, where it starts to automate more and more capabilities. It does require us to re retool. But that's good. Because every big shift, you know, throughout our whole economic history, right, as a country, and as innovation continues to grow, we have to keep shifting to the right terms of the skill sets that are important and critical. So I don't see it as, as this big day AI is gonna come take over, and we're all gonna sit around and become people like on E. What is it Wally, that movie Wally? Right, where they sit around doing nothing? Right, I don't think is that, but I do think it is a shift in terms of the capabilities that will bring and therefore we'll get skilled up in other areas. What are your thoughts on that? Evan Well, I have a question first before, before I answer that, do you have a memory of when you were a child, where you first saw technology, do something and you're like, holy, holy smokes. Grant I do it was that this will highlight the age difference between you and I, it was my, my dad worked in this. So there used to be a competitor to IBM. They're called Control Data Corp, and my dad worked for them. He'd worked on some of the big mainframe systems. And I remember one time, he took me into one of their big mainframe centers, right, and we walk into this room and the fans are running. And the big computers are, and the disk, you know, the tape drive is going, you know, like, just like you see on the old movies, right? And the big disk drives worrying. And my dad sits down and starts coding some things on it. And the computer starts interacting with me saying my name and helped me, you know, asking me questions. And I remember leaning up to and going, this is what I'm gonna do. I don't know everything that just happened there. But I want to be a part of this. So yes, that that was my technology origin story. Yeah. Evan Yeah. For me. So outside of seeing this, like this was years ago, when I was like a small child. I remember my best friend was sending out invitations to a fourth of July, a fourth of July party in the United States. And, and he mailmerge at like age eight, e mail merge, like 500 contacts. Oh, that's everything that is just insane. Like, as incredible as mail merging. And AJ at AJ. Also, like, what is this thing? mailmerge? Oh, my gosh. Yeah, it's so fun to like, kind of think about, you know, there's this like, one time where at some point, you're like, I wonder what else it can do? This is just the beginning. Yeah. But to answer your question, you know, will we will we all end up just kind of like sitting around or being artists all day? I don't think so. The example that I use is, you know, right now you and I are talking over zoom. It took me three clicks in order to get into our zoom meeting. Right? And so what if I went, what if we went back to the 1950s. And we said that in 70 years, you're going to be able to talk to virtually anybody in the world, you'll be able to see their face, the audio quality will be crystal clear. And I'll cost you essentially nothing. But all 1.5 million telephone switchboard, switchboard operators will lose their jobs. Grant Yeah, yeah, it's it's true. Yeah, that Yeah, right. Yeah, no, people like, like, There's no way. Evan Right, and, and so there's always been this sort of technological destruction that has taken place. Even back when we humans created the waterwheel. And now you didn't have as many people moving water to generate power generate electricity, or when we created ladders, and, you know, there are all sorts of different pieces of technology that we've had, over the last several 1000 years that have changed the way that we worked. This is just another one, I think it's a bigger shift than then some of the other ones. But, you know, the printing press did the same thing. There are all sorts of people that were just writing books, they were writing the Bible over and over and over and over again. Well, they lost their job pretty darn fast. Yet we have more people on the planet than ever before, and more people are employed than ever. Grant To do this. I remember one of the startups that I was involved with earlier in my career in Silicon Valley, we're trying to solve the problem of we want to be able to allow software engineers and designers to design systems remotely over the Internet, right. And so in order to do that, we have some some design tools, but we got to make that accessible and you need to be able to manipulate it remotely. Right. This is before there's a lot of big fat network pipes. You know, you know, everyone's got high bandwidth, right. So we were trying to figure out how to get this to work. We ended up getting it to work, but the cost was prohibitive. Right Just so dang grim. So when I think about the progress of technology, it's lots of trying over and over again until you get to this point where enough of the complexity can be abstracted away so that ultimately the end user sees this simplicity enough to say it's adoptable for both ease of use as well as cost perspective. I think we're right there. They I, I think we're doing similar thing, right to go through the same round, which is, can I take some techniques that are advanced that have some value, but you don't have to have massive data science background in order to get the benefits from that, and I see that shift taking place where more and more of it can then become accessible to others? As the cost drops dramatically? Evan I've seen similar things, I I couldn't agree more. You know, I think AI is sort of one of those things that for a decade or two was promised but under delivered, no, yeah. And now it's so it's like it's coming in with a vengeance. And the tools that are being made are super intuitive. The use cases that are being documented, and copied and repeated are ones that affect a lot of people. And I think people are really opening their minds to the idea that they don't have to do things the same way that they always have, just because that's how it's always been done. So I think it's kind of a combination of a huge mindset shift. But also just the tools are flat out better than they've ever been before. And they're finally usable to the point where you can automate things and you can create API's with button clicks instead of with raw code. Grant Yeah, yeah. Which is, which is fascinating. I think it's bringing an order of magnitude capability, and will continue to do that, to the kinds of problems that we can solve it. And it's just, I think, at the crux of it right in others is you look to the future, if you can continue to provide this time to this kind of computational power. And add that in the future to things like quantum, when we start blending both of those, I think the kinds of problems we can solve becomes quite large. But let me pull it back to tell me about the problems you're specifically solving with teammate AI. So So you got into this space, you're looking to go solve some problems with AI, you want to make things simple, what are you making simple? Evan You know, we really love to help entrepreneurial companies, and primarily companies where the executive team really wants to grow, they really would love to grow, they'd love to grow five or 10x, and the next decade or two decades, or even shorter, but they can't bear the idea of doing it while radically increasing their payroll. Right. And the most common complaint that we hear is not you know, I have the wrong team or my team doesn't do great work. It's that my team is underutilized because they have too much stuff on their plate. And so what we really try to automate the problems that we try to solve, are really helping these team members helping these employees identify what are the things that you do in a day that you hate the most, let's not automate the stuff that you love, let's automate the stuff that you hate. And then we'll figure out together how we can automate this so that you never have to deal with it again. And so we do that with with companies, basically, across every industry. The the question, the second question that I get the most often is, what industries does AI work in? And my answer is always well, you know, AI is a little like electricity, like, sure there's the electric company. But every every company was benefited. And every industry was benefited by electricity. And it's kind of a similar thing. Yeah, you know, there's sort of no gift that you can give people that's more valuable than their time, in my opinion. Grant What would be some use cases that you're applying it to? Is it? Is it things like bookkeeping, is it, you know, mundane, you know, administrative tasks? Or is it in other areas that you're applying AI? Evan So every company is a little different? I mean, of course, there's like bookkeeping and accounts receivable, and how can we send invoices out of our ERP smoother or submit website forms for invoicing smoother. But there's also a lot of reporting, sort of data collection, data crunching and then putting that into a human readable format. That way, people aren't in charge of trying to figure out what the data says. Instead, the computer tells you what the most important things are to look for. We use AI to write newspaper articles, write and publish newspaper articles for media outlets across the country. Regardless of your feelings of the media, it costs too much money in order to be able to write an article especially for info journalism, like what happened in the local sporting events. So we're doing that all across the country and all across the world, all the way to multi day processes where maybe We're using machine vision to look at images and see, well, are there any defects in the products that we're working with right now? If there are defects, what are the defects and let's report back to the supplier, let's report it back to whoever's responsible in order to be able to get that quality control, like up to speed and up to where we needed to be. So we do the boring in the mundane like accounts receivable, we also do the really sexy and complex machine vision. And we're reporting back with here. Here's the percentage of products that you shipped us, for example, that that were manufactured properly or are up to spec. Grant That's quite a, that's quite a wide range of use cases. That's, that's amazing. Are you building your machine vision work off of the Open CV material or your you did this all by hand? Evan We use Fast AI's library, which Fast AI was the not for profit that was founded by Jeremy Howard. So basically, Jeremy was telling me in this conference, you know, here's all the great things that you can do about AI, by the way, I have a free and open course. And we found that their library is just absolutely unbelievable. So we'll try as hard as we can to be able to, to be able to build it from scratch. And the reason for that we originally did not try to do that we originally tried to use a lot of the open source. Yeah. But the reason was really interesting. It was that, especially when, when the process that we were automating wasn't related to customer acquisition, lead generation. Yeah, what was happening a lot of times was our was our clients who would get this new capability called this AI that saving, you know, hours or days per week in some cases, and they'd say something to the effect of, you know, everybody else in our industry faces the same problem. Could we license this to everybody else in our industry? Wow. Well, now they had this old legacy business, that they flipped into a software as a service business. And we realized really fast that we that we had to be able to make sure that our solution scaled to more than just one user. Mm hmm. Grant Amazing. So what's been some of the outcomes, you've noticed now that you've been out doing this across a range of companies, what, what's been the impact to them? Evan What's most exciting for me is that all companies are unique, yet all companies are the same. So they all have product delivery, they all have accounting, and bookkeeping, they all have sales and customer acquisition, they all have customer service. And so they all have these sort of functions, that interplay really nicely together. But largely, they're the same. The real differentiator, among a lot of companies is things like their supply chain, their product and their product delivery. So being able to help a wide swath of companies get clarity surrounding, you know, AI isn't just for Silicon Valley. It's not just for Tesla, and Mehta and Apple and Google, right. That's been really exciting. I think that there's a real market shift going on among employees, I think employees really have a smaller and smaller tolerance for doing stuff that's boring and doesn't move the ball forward. And companies are really incentivized right now, to outsource a lot of the work to AI in order to be able to retain their best talent. And so that's been one of the really, really interesting things. I think that's come out of the last six months. Grant Now, I guess I could imagine it would be something like removing them in the mundane so that you can tap into their creative, right, I think that's really sort of what you're after, right? It's try to exploit opportunities to get more creativity from your people. I would imagine in today's market, too, with a lot of attrition taking place and the challenges with hiring, that this also can be beneficial. It's is it part of a play to help people stay in their jobs where you could take some of the mundane out of it, and therefore allow them to do more creative and enjoyable things in their work? Evan It absolutely is. That's actually one of the biggest reasons why a lot of companies decide to work with us right now is because they know that they if it can create a work experience, that's five times better than what it is right now. That key employee might not go looking for an extra $10,000 A year or an extra 20 grand, or for new opportunities just because it doesn't feel like a right fit anymore. And so we're seeing that all the time. We're also seeing on the flip side of it, a lot of companies that are having problems hiring, or they're having problems retaining employees, just overall, maybe they have a 3040 50% attrition rate on new hires in any particular role. They're starting to ask the question, Well, I wonder why. Like, maybe it's us. That's the problem. And it's not them. That's the problem. And so all of those tasks that used to be hired, are now being automated instead. That way they can hire for those more creative and fascinating and motivating roles. I mean, I don't know anybody I don't know anybody who wakes up on a Monday morning looking forward to doing the same stuff they've done for the last five years. Grant Yeah, if they do well, yeah, that's another conversation. But sounds like you use a range of things from RPA to some custom built AI work, you guys have developed is your sort of toolset is that, right? Evan Yeah, whatever it takes to get the job done. A lot of times customers will have specifications. But, you know, Microsoft Power automates a really powerful tool. And there's a lot that you can do with 1000 lines of Python code, right, and with a great AWS or Azure suite. And so we do use, we have a handy and a really kind of wide tool belt. But what we find is that we're using the same tool sort of over and over again, which is really handy, I think, overall, and it makes it so that the tools are getting better over time. Grant They are Yeah, they're definitely getting better. Okay, so for our audience, what would be a call to action for them? If they were wanting to learn more about you and your organization and what you're doing? Evan Yeah, so I think the biggest thing would be head to automation secrets that teammate ai.com, there, you can get a free copy of my new book, AI is your teammate. And really what it does is it kind of helps distill down what are the mindsets necessary in order to be able to use AI in your world, whether you're a business owner and entrepreneur and executive or an employee? And how can you make it happen? You know, there's a lot of sort of how to guides for how do you make automation happen, but I've tend to find that they're all either way too high level, like, AI can only be used for chatbots on your website, or cybersecurity, or they're literally showing you lines of code. And so how can you make it happen, no matter what your level of technical capabilities are? So I would head there, no matter what, get a teammate, or you can get it on Amazon or Barnes and Noble or anywhere where you find books. Grant Oh, that's cool. So when you think about a bell curve in terms of the amount of time that someone would commit to working with a group like yourself, what does that look like, you know, the bell curve is or the efforts or the projects you do with them? Is it a two week four week, eight week? What does that look like? Evan I you know, for for relatively small automations. If you're if you're using a tool, like Zapier, for example, that would be two to four weeks. So very, very short, you could wake up this month, you have a lot of stuff on your plate that you hate. And by next quarter, you could have saved 510 20 hours a week, depending on what your job description looks like, all the way to six months to a year depending on if you have a if you have a really complicated sort of project that you need to automate. Grant Gotcha. Gotcha. Very cool. Okay. What questions do you have for me, you said you wanted to ask me some questions before we started? Evan I do want to ask you, yeah, what do you see? You know, so you do it a different type of like a eyes and really what we specialize in? We don't try to do a lot of the predictive the predictive modeling. Yeah. What are you seeing in the marketplace? On the predictive side? Grant Yeah. So on the predictive side, I'm definitely working in that space. Not so much in the CV area, but more in terms of predictive analytics itself. So you know, taking things like oh, how can I? How can I address stockout? problems, right, my supply chain? Or, oh, what can I do to increase sales? That is probably the number one use case that I see. Right, which is, hey, we're just trying to grow the business? And what are the conditions that are driving the best sales situation? Or how can I take costs out of my business? So efficiency plays? That's probably the second sort of style of problems that organizations need to solve. And similar to what you're describing, in all cases, it's Can I do it with the same amount or fewer resources? Right, I can't be adding more resources to this. In most cases, there's this FOMO aspect, which is there's this fear of the unknown, what is it that the AI can see that I can't write, because lots of times our brains are wired to see only just a few factors or variables. And then once we get too many dimensions out, our brain sort of gives out AI really exploits that well. And so casting as wide a net as possible, that makes sense for that business outcome. You're trying to target where it sells or whatever, and letting the AI help you to see all of those all those far reaching variables and pulling that in and saying actually, it's, it's the combination of these other factors as well means that this is when your sales take place. If it's this salesperson, during this time of the month to this particular market. You know, when the weather is clear in San Diego, whatever it might be, right? Those conditions tend to drive higher sales, whatever the situation, it's that watching business owners have that aha moment to go. Oh, okay. And that's, that's real satisfying, because then they go in and start tweaking their business, right, just enough to say, hey, it was worth the effort to discover them. One more thing, while I'm monologuing on this, there's that part. And then there's the other part, which is I find that AI, it can bring so many predictive insights, that it cripples the organization, right? It comes back and says, here's all the drivers, and here's all the factors, but it gives you, you know, 20 of them, and you're like, oh, okay, what am I gonna do with 20? Right? How do I figure and so that's the other key part of what we do, which is, we then say, oh, let's prioritize these into a series of incremental steps that moves the organization one step at a time. Otherwise, people get changed fatigue, right, it's too much to keep trying to, you know, do it all at once. So we take the insights that are predictive, go after those that have the highest probability as it relates to the business outcome, and then just go do one or two of those, and then rebuild, because contacts, you know, business shit, and business drift occurs, data drift occurs. And so you then refactor the the model again and gives you fresh insights. So how's that for a long answer? That's what I'm saying? Evan Well, that's actually you kind of touched on one of the follow ups that I wanted to ask, which is, we spend a lot of our time with the end users with the end employees, it sounds to me like you spend a lot of your time with the C suite. Is that correct? Grant We do, but it depends on the organization. And who's been tasked, in many cases, will we start with a C suite. And I'll tell you why. One of the challenges, I believe, with a lot of the AI platforms today is is the over over focus on model accuracy, right getting a 90% accurate, now, don't get me wrong, the model has got to be, you know, really accurate, but when it's done outside of the context of your business operations, then it means I could end up producing an AI model that's so efficient, that my business is not actually able to deal with or handle it may be bringing me too many deals, such that it actually increases the cost of goods sold, that it actually ends up hurting my business. And so it really needs this combination of a sufficient, efficient model connected to what are my business costs, my operations, my you know, the the amount of resources I have available, and that's why it needs to go a step at a time, right, you just keep going one step at a time to improve or grow it. So sometimes it's with the data, people. But if you do it outside of the context of those business questions, then it tends not to be as effective on the ROI. Evan That's a that's one of the things I was gonna ask, are you seeing that there are sometimes negative consequences where the AI is so good? Yeah, you know, that people either you have a change management problem where people's preconceived notions of why things happened was actually incorrect. And now you have to retrain, or something like that, where, you know, the like what you said, the cost of goods rises so much, because it's so efficient at acquiring new customers or getting more sales, that that the business wasn't ready to scale to that level? Do you see that that happens more often than not? Or is that a sort of a corner case? Grant I don't know, I don't think it's corner case. It's, it's a fair, fair amount of the cases, though, enough to be a worry, right, that if I don't take change management into consideration, as I roll out AI, then then my probabilities of success dropped dramatically that just because I have the insights from Ai, in my opinion, is only 70% of the way there, then you got to get that, you know, last mile and and the last mile is the successful rollout and adoption of this, and sometimes it's a cultural thing you're running into, people are worried, oh, I'm gonna lose my job. Others are like, Oh, this is gonna change my job. And then others are, well, we embrace it. But now we run into a money problem. And the money problem is that our business operations can't handle this adjustment. Or maybe the AI got it wrong, and the business can't handle that adjustment either. Right? Doesn't mean that it's always right. And so in either case, it can have that financial impact. And if we're not, if we're not taming the AI enough in the context of business operations, then it ends up creating a problem. So there's several hurdles after you get just those those predictive insights. Evan Yeah, one of the things that's interesting about hearing hearing your world which your world is just is so radically different than mine, I mean, with us, we have a pretty set, you know, this set of criteria. We're going to automate this process Is this process we've mapped out exactly what the steps are in the process, and then we build a computer to do it. with you what I think is interesting is, I hear all the time, that this concept of what we want to use data to make better decisions. Oh, yeah. And, like, there, I always think, you know, there's part of that that's true. But there's also part of it, that's like, you are thinking that the human should be making a decision right now. Grant I like to view this more as augmented intelligence. I know we say AI. But I think a should be augmented. It's really the state of where the practice is, I think in AI, to say that we're going to give all decision making rights over to some AI model and just blindly trust that I think that's naive in today's AI. Now, you know, they're getting better and better. But I work a lot of organizations where the majority, the AI model is early. And so it's growing, the need for a lot more cognitive support from the humans, to ensure that this thing is naturally moving in a way that is reliable, and truly predictable. And otherwise, I think you could just hand it off and say, I give all all decisioning rights over to the AI, I think that's foolish, you have the ability and need the ability, even after you've deployed an AI model to come back and vote on the impact of that insight. And that's important, because we want to continue to refine the training and retraining of the AI. Hey, what you just shared with me that predictive insight actually didn't pan out, that guidance really needs to come back into the models. Evan Yeah, I think, you know, the AI at the end of the day, like the algorithms, they make a prediction and they make a recommendation, but they never, they never make a decision. Now, humans either a prediction or recommendation, the human needs to make a decision. So the AI can provide all sorts of information, and it can provide recommendations. But But yeah, I don't it's not ready yet to to just understand how the world works and understand where you're going, what your objectives are, and then just say, this is right. It's not it's not quite otherwise. I know. I know, a lot of senior managers who are going to have really bad days. AI can do that. So what are some of your what are some of your sweet spots? What are the things that were the projects where you know, you know, that you can hit it out of the park? Grant Yeah, it's, like I said, it's in medium sized organizations typically trying to solve, you know, a revenue sales problem, right? That's definitely a sweet spot and supply chain areas, right? That's where they're looking to say, Hey, I'm trying to make sure I can, can keep inventory coming in at the right pace or the right rate, which is a serious problem now. But you know, we've also seen it in even in the current talent management shortages that's going on, which is, can I use it to help me understand the probabilities of, you know, certain groups or individuals who are candidates for leaving early right, and the cost and impact to an organization when that happens? Those are the types of use cases where typically we get involved. Those are, those are great questions, for sure. Okay. All right. This has been awesome. Yeah, you haven't. Thank you. Evan This has been great Grant. Grant Yeah, thanks for your questions. Any final statement before we wrap up about Teammate AI? Evan You can grab AI as your teammate on Amazon or at automationsecretsteamai.com. But mostly, I just hope that everybody has a future that's far, far bigger than their past, and far better than their past. Thanks for having me, Grant. Really appreciate this one. Grant Thank you for your time, everybody. Thanks for joining another episode of clique AI radio. And until next time, get some Teammate AI. Thank you for joining Grant on ClickAI Radio. Don't forget to subscribe and leave feedback. And remember to download your free ebook, visit ClickAIRadio.com now.

In this episode, we take a look at the question Can AI Be Used to Automate the Mundane? Grant Hey, everybody, welcome to another episode of ClickAI Radio. So welcome, I am excited to bring into the show today someone that it's taken me several times trying to get to this, busy busy guy. This is Evan Ryan. Evan, I hope I said your name right, right. Because I've said some people's names wrong. It's not Yvonne right or not right on? Is it Evan Ryan? Right? Evan It is Evan Ryan. Yeah, you got it in the right order. Most of the time, it's in the opposite order to flip it around. Grant Right. Um, founders CEO, King, of Teammate AI, right. Evan I just tried to go by founder. Okay. Grant Awesome. All right. Tell us a bit about yourself, Evan, what's brought you to this point. And anyway, thanks for joining the show. All right. Let me stop talking. Go ahead. Evan Well, Grant, thanks for having me. We were talking before we started recording, I just hit it off from the first second, at least in my opinion, I'm having a wonderful time. So really with me, I didn't really notice this. But throughout my entire childhood, I really had zero tolerance for boring stuff. I was somebody who just really likes doing fun things. And I like doing things that are that are entertaining, that are challenging, that are fascinating, that are motivating. But I don't like doing things that are boring. And I will basically do anything that I can to avoid doing boring stuff. And of course, now Hindsight is 2020. But that's sort of how I view a lot of my childhood. Well, in 2016, I went to a conference where they had this guy by the name of Jeremy Howard. And at the time, or a year or two prior, he was the number one ranked AI researcher in the world. He was talking about all this stuff that you could do with AI. And he, he mentioned that he had this company that could correctly diagnose cancer from MRIs and CT scans. Cool better than a team of board certified doctors. Oh, this isn't 2016. Yeah, so I was just about to graduate from college. I was thinking that oh my gosh, like, this is just the coolest thing I've ever heard. I basically went into AI the next day. Did you really? Wow. Yeah, it was it was really sort of powerful and transformative. Over the next couple of years of sort of iterating around well, what what do I really want to do inside of AI? You know, how do I want to define AI? First of all, there's sort of no definition that everybody can agree upon. I really found that, you know, I hate doing boring stuff. I bet a lot of other people hate doing boring stuff, too. Yeah, yeah. So and so now we all know the pattern there for sure. Yeah. Yeah. And what I've found is really interesting is, you know, one of the biggest conversation topics around AI right now is will AI take all of our jobs? Grant Oh, my goodness. Yeah. I hear that so many times. Yes. Evan I mean, there are like so many ways to answer that with the answer, in my opinion, being No. But what I found is really exciting is when I bring people into the creative process about how can they automate the mundane, the boring, repeatable on their days, they're so excited, like the first time in a while that they felt like, wow, the future is so much bigger than my past. So for the last several years, we've been automating, we've been automating tasks and automating processes for small and medium sized businesses. Grant So let me back up. So you hear this guy speak. You're like AI is the place to go. Your passion is let me take boring out of life. So you're leveraging AI to do that to remove the boring. I remember my dad is really what got me into the, into the technology industry. He was in it if you can believe it, right? So he was like one of the early early pioneers in some of this stuff. And he I remember him using the phrase Boolean shift a lot. He would always talk like, oh, technology is a Boolean shift. And I'm like, What are you talking about? What's a Boolean shift, you know? But this is kind of a Boolean shift with AI something, it's going to totally replace us. But in fact, I think it's a shift to the right, where it starts to automate more and more capabilities. It does require us to re retool. But that's good. Because every big shift, you know, throughout our whole economic history, right, as a country, and as innovation continues to grow, we have to keep shifting to the right terms of the skill sets that are important and critical. So I don't see it as, as this big day AI is gonna come take over, and we're all gonna sit around and become people like on E. What is it Wally, that movie Wally? Right, where they sit around doing nothing? Right, I don't think is that, but I do think it is a shift in terms of the capabilities that will bring and therefore we'll get skilled up in other areas. What are your thoughts on that? Evan Well, I have a question first before, before I answer that, do you have a memory of when you were a child, where you first saw technology, do something and you're like, holy, holy smokes. Grant I do it was that this will highlight the age difference between you and I, it was my, my dad worked in this. So there used to be a competitor to IBM. They're called Control Data Corp, and my dad worked for them. He'd worked on some of the big mainframe systems. And I remember one time, he took me into one of their big mainframe centers, right, and we walk into this room and the fans are running. And the big computers are, and the disk, you know, the tape drive is going, you know, like, just like you see on the old movies, right? And the big disk drives worrying. And my dad sits down and starts coding some things on it. And the computer starts interacting with me saying my name and helped me, you know, asking me questions. And I remember leaning up to and going, this is what I'm gonna do. I don't know everything that just happened there. But I want to be a part of this. So yes, that that was my technology origin story. Yeah. Evan Yeah. For me. So outside of seeing this, like this was years ago, when I was like a small child. I remember my best friend was sending out invitations to a fourth of July, a fourth of July party in the United States. And, and he mailmerge at like age eight, e mail merge, like 500 contacts. Oh, that's everything that is just insane. Like, as incredible as mail merging. And AJ at AJ. Also, like, what is this thing? mailmerge? Oh, my gosh. Yeah, it's so fun to like, kind of think about, you know, there's this like, one time where at some point, you're like, I wonder what else it can do? This is just the beginning. Yeah. But to answer your question, you know, will we will we all end up just kind of like sitting around or being artists all day? I don't think so. The example that I use is, you know, right now you and I are talking over zoom. It took me three clicks in order to get into our zoom meeting. Right? And so what if I went, what if we went back to the 1950s. And we said that in 70 years, you're going to be able to talk to virtually anybody in the world, you'll be able to see their face, the audio quality will be crystal clear. And I'll cost you essentially nothing. But all 1.5 million telephone switchboard, switchboard operators will lose their jobs. Grant Yeah, yeah, it's it's true. Yeah, that Yeah, right. Yeah, no, people like, like, There's no way. Evan Right, and, and so there's always been this sort of technological destruction that has taken place. Even back when we humans created the waterwheel. And now you didn't have as many people moving water to generate power generate electricity, or when we created ladders, and, you know, there are all sorts of different pieces of technology that we've had, over the last several 1000 years that have changed the way that we worked. This is just another one, I think it's a bigger shift than then some of the other ones. But, you know, the printing press did the same thing. There are all sorts of people that were just writing books, they were writing the Bible over and over and over and over again. Well, they lost their job pretty darn fast. Yet we have more people on the planet than ever before, and more people are employed than ever. Grant To do this. I remember one of the startups that I was involved with earlier in my career in Silicon Valley, we're trying to solve the problem of we want to be able to allow software engineers and designers to design systems remotely over the Internet, right. And so in order to do that, we have some some design tools, but we got to make that accessible and you need to be able to manipulate it remotely. Right. This is before there's a lot of big fat network pipes. You know, you know, everyone's got high bandwidth, right. So we were trying to figure out how to get this to work. We ended up getting it to work, but the cost was prohibitive. Right Just so dang grim. So when I think about the progress of technology, it's lots of trying over and over again until you get to this point where enough of the complexity can be abstracted away so that ultimately the end user sees this simplicity enough to say it's adoptable for both ease of use as well as cost perspective. I think we're right there. They I, I think we're doing similar thing, right to go through the same round, which is, can I take some techniques that are advanced that have some value, but you don't have to have massive data science background in order to get the benefits from that, and I see that shift taking place where more and more of it can then become accessible to others? As the cost drops dramatically? Evan I've seen similar things, I I couldn't agree more. You know, I think AI is sort of one of those things that for a decade or two was promised but under delivered, no, yeah. And now it's so it's like it's coming in with a vengeance. And the tools that are being made are super intuitive. The use cases that are being documented, and copied and repeated are ones that affect a lot of people. And I think people are really opening their minds to the idea that they don't have to do things the same way that they always have, just because that's how it's always been done. So I think it's kind of a combination of a huge mindset shift. But also just the tools are flat out better than they've ever been before. And they're finally usable to the point where you can automate things and you can create API's with button clicks instead of with raw code. Grant Yeah, yeah. Which is, which is fascinating. I think it's bringing an order of magnitude capability, and will continue to do that, to the kinds of problems that we can solve it. And it's just, I think, at the crux of it right in others is you look to the future, if you can continue to provide this time to this kind of computational power. And add that in the future to things like quantum, when we start blending both of those, I think the kinds of problems we can solve becomes quite large. But let me pull it back to tell me about the problems you're specifically solving with teammate AI. So So you got into this space, you're looking to go solve some problems with AI, you want to make things simple, what are you making simple? Evan You know, we really love to help entrepreneurial companies, and primarily companies where the executive team really wants to grow, they really would love to grow, they'd love to grow five or 10x, and the next decade or two decades, or even shorter, but they can't bear the idea of doing it while radically increasing their payroll. Right. And the most common complaint that we hear is not you know, I have the wrong team or my team doesn't do great work. It's that my team is underutilized because they have too much stuff on their plate. And so what we really try to automate the problems that we try to solve, are really helping these team members helping these employees identify what are the things that you do in a day that you hate the most, let's not automate the stuff that you love, let's automate the stuff that you hate. And then we'll figure out together how we can automate this so that you never have to deal with it again. And so we do that with with companies, basically, across every industry. The the question, the second question that I get the most often is, what industries does AI work in? And my answer is always well, you know, AI is a little like electricity, like, sure there's the electric company. But every every company was benefited. And every industry was benefited by electricity. And it's kind of a similar thing. Yeah, you know, there's sort of no gift that you can give people that's more valuable than their time, in my opinion. Grant What would be some use cases that you're applying it to? Is it? Is it things like bookkeeping, is it, you know, mundane, you know, administrative tasks? Or is it in other areas that you're applying AI? Evan So every company is a little different? I mean, of course, there's like bookkeeping and accounts receivable, and how can we send invoices out of our ERP smoother or submit website forms for invoicing smoother. But there's also a lot of reporting, sort of data collection, data crunching and then putting that into a human readable format. That way, people aren't in charge of trying to figure out what the data says. Instead, the computer tells you what the most important things are to look for. We use AI to write newspaper articles, write and publish newspaper articles for media outlets across the country. Regardless of your feelings of the media, it costs too much money in order to be able to write an article especially for info journalism, like what happened in the local sporting events. So we're doing that all across the country and all across the world, all the way to multi day processes where maybe We're using machine vision to look at images and see, well, are there any defects in the products that we're working with right now? If there are defects, what are the defects and let's report back to the supplier, let's report it back to whoever's responsible in order to be able to get that quality control, like up to speed and up to where we needed to be. So we do the boring in the mundane like accounts receivable, we also do the really sexy and complex machine vision. And we're reporting back with here. Here's the percentage of products that you shipped us, for example, that that were manufactured properly or are up to spec. Grant That's quite a, that's quite a wide range of use cases. That's, that's amazing. Are you building your machine vision work off of the Open CV material or your you did this all by hand? Evan We use Fast AI's library, which Fast AI was the not for profit that was founded by Jeremy Howard. So basically, Jeremy was telling me in this conference, you know, here's all the great things that you can do about AI, by the way, I have a free and open course. And we found that their library is just absolutely unbelievable. So we'll try as hard as we can to be able to, to be able to build it from scratch. And the reason for that we originally did not try to do that we originally tried to use a lot of the open source. Yeah. But the reason was really interesting. It was that, especially when, when the process that we were automating wasn't related to customer acquisition, lead generation. Yeah, what was happening a lot of times was our was our clients who would get this new capability called this AI that saving, you know, hours or days per week in some cases, and they'd say something to the effect of, you know, everybody else in our industry faces the same problem. Could we license this to everybody else in our industry? Wow. Well, now they had this old legacy business, that they flipped into a software as a service business. And we realized really fast that we that we had to be able to make sure that our solution scaled to more than just one user. Mm hmm. Grant Amazing. So what's been some of the outcomes, you've noticed now that you've been out doing this across a range of companies, what, what's been the impact to them? Evan What's most exciting for me is that all companies are unique, yet all companies are the same. So they all have product delivery, they all have accounting, and bookkeeping, they all have sales and customer acquisition, they all have customer service. And so they all have these sort of functions, that interplay really nicely together. But largely, they're the same. The real differentiator, among a lot of companies is things like their supply chain, their product and their product delivery. So being able to help a wide swath of companies get clarity surrounding, you know, AI isn't just for Silicon Valley. It's not just for Tesla, and Mehta and Apple and Google, right. That's been really exciting. I think that there's a real market shift going on among employees, I think employees really have a smaller and smaller tolerance for doing stuff that's boring and doesn't move the ball forward. And companies are really incentivized right now, to outsource a lot of the work to AI in order to be able to retain their best talent. And so that's been one of the really, really interesting things. I think that's come out of the last six months. Grant Now, I guess I could imagine it would be something like removing them in the mundane so that you can tap into their creative, right, I think that's really sort of what you're after, right? It's try to exploit opportunities to get more creativity from your people. I would imagine in today's market, too, with a lot of attrition taking place and the challenges with hiring, that this also can be beneficial. It's is it part of a play to help people stay in their jobs where you could take some of the mundane out of it, and therefore allow them to do more creative and enjoyable things in their work? Evan It absolutely is. That's actually one of the biggest reasons why a lot of companies decide to work with us right now is because they know that they if it can create a work experience, that's five times better than what it is right now. That key employee might not go looking for an extra $10,000 A year or an extra 20 grand, or for new opportunities just because it doesn't feel like a right fit anymore. And so we're seeing that all the time. We're also seeing on the flip side of it, a lot of companies that are having problems hiring, or they're having problems retaining employees, just overall, maybe they have a 3040 50% attrition rate on new hires in any particular role. They're starting to ask the question, Well, I wonder why. Like, maybe it's us. That's the problem. And it's not them. That's the problem. And so all of those tasks that used to be hired, are now being automated instead. That way they can hire for those more creative and fascinating and motivating roles. I mean, I don't know anybody I don't know anybody who wakes up on a Monday morning looking forward to doing the same stuff they've done for the last five years. Grant Yeah, if they do well, yeah, that's another conversation. But sounds like you use a range of things from RPA to some custom built AI work, you guys have developed is your sort of toolset is that, right? Evan Yeah, whatever it takes to get the job done. A lot of times customers will have specifications. But, you know, Microsoft Power automates a really powerful tool. And there's a lot that you can do with 1000 lines of Python code, right, and with a great AWS or Azure suite. And so we do use, we have a handy and a really kind of wide tool belt. But what we find is that we're using the same tool sort of over and over again, which is really handy, I think, overall, and it makes it so that the tools are getting better over time. Grant They are Yeah, they're definitely getting better. Okay, so for our audience, what would be a call to action for them? If they were wanting to learn more about you and your organization and what you're doing? Evan Yeah, so I think the biggest thing would be head to automation secrets that teammate ai.com, there, you can get a free copy of my new book, AI is your teammate. And really what it does is it kind of helps distill down what are the mindsets necessary in order to be able to use AI in your world, whether you're a business owner and entrepreneur and executive or an employee? And how can you make it happen? You know, there's a lot of sort of how to guides for how do you make automation happen, but I've tend to find that they're all either way too high level, like, AI can only be used for chatbots on your website, or cybersecurity, or they're literally showing you lines of code. And so how can you make it happen, no matter what your level of technical capabilities are? So I would head there, no matter what, get a teammate, or you can get it on Amazon or Barnes and Noble or anywhere where you find books. Grant Oh, that's cool. So when you think about a bell curve in terms of the amount of time that someone would commit to working with a group like yourself, what does that look like, you know, the bell curve is or the efforts or the projects you do with them? Is it a two week four week, eight week? What does that look like? Evan I you know, for for relatively small automations. If you're if you're using a tool, like Zapier, for example, that would be two to four weeks. So very, very short, you could wake up this month, you have a lot of stuff on your plate that you hate. And by next quarter, you could have saved 510 20 hours a week, depending on what your job description looks like, all the way to six months to a year depending on if you have a if you have a really complicated sort of project that you need to automate. Grant Gotcha. Gotcha. Very cool. Okay. What questions do you have for me, you said you wanted to ask me some questions before we started? Evan I do want to ask you, yeah, what do you see? You know, so you do it a different type of like a eyes and really what we specialize in? We don't try to do a lot of the predictive the predictive modeling. Yeah. What are you seeing in the marketplace? On the predictive side? Grant Yeah. So on the predictive side, I'm definitely working in that space. Not so much in the CV area, but more in terms of predictive analytics itself. So you know, taking things like oh, how can I? How can I address stockout? problems, right, my supply chain? Or, oh, what can I do to increase sales? That is probably the number one use case that I see. Right, which is, hey, we're just trying to grow the business? And what are the conditions that are driving the best sales situation? Or how can I take costs out of my business? So efficiency plays? That's probably the second sort of style of problems that organizations need to solve. And similar to what you're describing, in all cases, it's Can I do it with the same amount or fewer resources? Right, I can't be adding more resources to this. In most cases, there's this FOMO aspect, which is there's this fear of the unknown, what is it that the AI can see that I can't write, because lots of times our brains are wired to see only just a few factors or variables. And then once we get too many dimensions out, our brain sort of gives out AI really exploits that well. And so casting as wide a net as possible, that makes sense for that business outcome. You're trying to target where it sells or whatever, and letting the AI help you to see all of those all those far reaching variables and pulling that in and saying actually, it's, it's the combination of these other factors as well means that this is when your sales take place. If it's this salesperson, during this time of the month to this particular market. You know, when the weather is clear in San Diego, whatever it might be, right? Those conditions tend to drive higher sales, whatever the situation, it's that watching business owners have that aha moment to go. Oh, okay. And that's, that's real satisfying, because then they go in and start tweaking their business, right, just enough to say, hey, it was worth the effort to discover them. One more thing, while I'm monologuing on this, there's that part. And then there's the other part, which is I find that AI, it can bring so many predictive insights, that it cripples the organization, right? It comes back and says, here's all the drivers, and here's all the factors, but it gives you, you know, 20 of them, and you're like, oh, okay, what am I gonna do with 20? Right? How do I figure and so that's the other key part of what we do, which is, we then say, oh, let's prioritize these into a series of incremental steps that moves the organization one step at a time. Otherwise, people get changed fatigue, right, it's too much to keep trying to, you know, do it all at once. So we take the insights that are predictive, go after those that have the highest probability as it relates to the business outcome, and then just go do one or two of those, and then rebuild, because contacts, you know, business shit, and business drift occurs, data drift occurs. And so you then refactor the the model again and gives you fresh insights. So how's that for a long answer? That's what I'm saying? Evan Well, that's actually you kind of touched on one of the follow ups that I wanted to ask, which is, we spend a lot of our time with the end users with the end employees, it sounds to me like you spend a lot of your time with the C suite. Is that correct? Grant We do, but it depends on the organization. And who's been tasked, in many cases, will we start with a C suite. And I'll tell you why. One of the challenges, I believe, with a lot of the AI platforms today is is the over over focus on model accuracy, right getting a 90% accurate, now, don't get me wrong, the model has got to be, you know, really accurate, but when it's done outside of the context of your business operations, then it means I could end up producing an AI model that's so efficient, that my business is not actually able to deal with or handle it may be bringing me too many deals, such that it actually increases the cost of goods sold, that it actually ends up hurting my business. And so it really needs this combination of a sufficient, efficient model connected to what are my business costs, my operations, my you know, the the amount of resources I have available, and that's why it needs to go a step at a time, right, you just keep going one step at a time to improve or grow it. So sometimes it's with the data, people. But if you do it outside of the context of those business questions, then it tends not to be as effective on the ROI. Evan That's a that's one of the things I was gonna ask, are you seeing that there are sometimes negative consequences where the AI is so good? Yeah, you know, that people either you have a change management problem where people's preconceived notions of why things happened was actually incorrect. And now you have to retrain, or something like that, where, you know, the like what you said, the cost of goods rises so much, because it's so efficient at acquiring new customers or getting more sales, that that the business wasn't ready to scale to that level? Do you see that that happens more often than not? Or is that a sort of a corner case? Grant I don't know, I don't think it's corner case. It's, it's a fair, fair amount of the cases, though, enough to be a worry, right, that if I don't take change management into consideration, as I roll out AI, then then my probabilities of success dropped dramatically that just because I have the insights from Ai, in my opinion, is only 70% of the way there, then you got to get that, you know, last mile and and the last mile is the successful rollout and adoption of this, and sometimes it's a cultural thing you're running into, people are worried, oh, I'm gonna lose my job. Others are like, Oh, this is gonna change my job. And then others are, well, we embrace it. But now we run into a money problem. And the money problem is that our business operations can't handle this adjustment. Or maybe the AI got it wrong, and the business can't handle that adjustment either. Right? Doesn't mean that it's always right. And so in either case, it can have that financial impact. And if we're not, if we're not taming the AI enough in the context of business operations, then it ends up creating a problem. So there's several hurdles after you get just those those predictive insights. Evan Yeah, one of the things that's interesting about hearing hearing your world which your world is just is so radically different than mine, I mean, with us, we have a pretty set, you know, this set of criteria. We're going to automate this process Is this process we've mapped out exactly what the steps are in the process, and then we build a computer to do it. with you what I think is interesting is, I hear all the time, that this concept of what we want to use data to make better decisions. Oh, yeah. And, like, there, I always think, you know, there's part of that that's true. But there's also part of it, that's like, you are thinking that the human should be making a decision right now. Grant I like to view this more as augmented intelligence. I know we say AI. But I think a should be augmented. It's really the state of where the practice is, I think in AI, to say that we're going to give all decision making rights over to some AI model and just blindly trust that I think that's naive in today's AI. Now, you know, they're getting better and better. But I work a lot of organizations where the majority, the AI model is early. And so it's growing, the need for a lot more cognitive support from the humans, to ensure that this thing is naturally moving in a way that is reliable, and truly predictable. And otherwise, I think you could just hand it off and say, I give all all decisioning rights over to the AI, I think that's foolish, you have the ability and need the ability, even after you've deployed an AI model to come back and vote on the impact of that insight. And that's important, because we want to continue to refine the training and retraining of the AI. Hey, what you just shared with me that predictive insight actually didn't pan out, that guidance really needs to come back into the models. Evan Yeah, I think, you know, the AI at the end of the day, like the algorithms, they make a prediction and they make a recommendation, but they never, they never make a decision. Now, humans either a prediction or recommendation, the human needs to make a decision. So the AI can provide all sorts of information, and it can provide recommendations. But But yeah, I don't it's not ready yet to to just understand how the world works and understand where you're going, what your objectives are, and then just say, this is right. It's not it's not quite otherwise. I know. I know, a lot of senior managers who are going to have really bad days. AI can do that. So what are some of your what are some of your sweet spots? What are the things that were the projects where you know, you know, that you can hit it out of the park? Grant Yeah, it's, like I said, it's in medium sized organizations typically trying to solve, you know, a revenue sales problem, right? That's definitely a sweet spot and supply chain areas, right? That's where they're looking to say, Hey, I'm trying to make sure I can, can keep inventory coming in at the right pace or the right rate, which is a serious problem now. But you know, we've also seen it in even in the current talent management shortages that's going on, which is, can I use it to help me understand the probabilities of, you know, certain groups or individuals who are candidates for leaving early right, and the cost and impact to an organization when that happens? Those are the types of use cases where typically we get involved. Those are, those are great questions, for sure. Okay. All right. This has been awesome. Yeah, you haven't. Thank you. Evan This has been great Grant. Grant Yeah, thanks for your questions. Any final statement before we wrap up about Teammate AI? Evan You can grab AI as your teammate on Amazon or at automationsecretsteamai.com. But mostly, I just hope that everybody has a future that's far, far bigger than their past, and far better than their past. Thanks for having me, Grant. Really appreciate this one. Grant Thank you for your time, everybody. Thanks for joining another episode of clique AI radio. And until next time, get some Teammate AI. Thank you for joining Grant on ClickAI Radio. Don't forget to subscribe and leave feedback. And remember to download your free ebook, visit ClickAIRadio.com now.

Apostle Miracle Pettenger encourages believers to surrender to the authority of the Righteous Judge and not yield to the spirit of jealousy or comparison. For all He does is absolutely RIGHT & JUST!

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Today I speak with Annie Scranton. Annie is President & Founder of Pace PR. She has 8+ years experience as a TV producer at major networks including CNN, Fox News, CNBC, MSNBC & ABC, where she booked guest appearances for popular shows like Good Morning America. For the past decade, Annie has been leveraging this experience and expertise to grow her own agency, Pace PR, where she focuses on getting her clients regular TV and media coverage to build their brands. Personal LinkedIn | Personal Twitter | Company Twitter | Company Facebook | Company Instagram This podcast series is hosted by Patricia Kathleen and Wilde Agency Media. This series is a platform for women, female-identified, & non-binary individuals to share their professional stories and personal narrative as it relates to their story. This podcast is designed to hold a space for all individuals to learn from their counterparts regardless of age, status, or industry.   TRANSCRIPTION *Please note this is an automated transcription, please excuse any typos or errors   [00:00:00] In this episode, I had the opportunity to speak with founder and president of Pace PR, Annie Scranton. Key points addressed were Annie's tenure in major news network industries and how this launched and propelled her now decade old PR firm. We also spoke about the importance of relationship maintenance and client education throughout the shifting landscape of the global climate. Stay tuned for my talk with Annie Scranton.    [00:00:31] Hi, my name is Patricia Kathleen, and this podcast series contains interviews I conduct with women. Female identified and non binary individuals regarding their professional stories and personal narrative. This podcast is designed to hold a space for all individuals to learn from their counterparts regardless of age status for industry. We aim to contribute to the evolving global dialog surrounding underrepresented figures in all industries across the USA and abroad. If you're enjoying this podcast, be sure to check out our subsequent series that dove deep into specific areas such as Vegan life, fasting and roundtable topics. They can be found via our Web site. Patricia Kathleen dot COM, where you can also join our newsletter. You can also subscribe to all of our series on iTunes, Spotify, Stitcher, PodBean and YouTube. Thanks for listening. Now let's start the conversation.    [00:01:28] Hi, everyone, and welcome back. I'm your host, Patricia. And today I'm excited to be sitting down with Annie Scranton. She's the founder and president of Paice P r.    [00:01:36] You can find it online at W W W Dot Pace Public Relations dot com. Welcome annie.    [00:01:42] Thank you. Thanks for having me. Definitely. I'm excited to climb in to what you're doing. Your company has a lot of unique characteristics that I can't wait to unpack with you and for everyone listening.    [00:01:53] I will read a brief bio on annie to give you a preview. However, prior to that, here's a roadmap for today's podcast that you can follow along in its trajectory. We'll first look at Annie's academic and professional background and history to kind of garner a sense of her platform. And then we'll turn our efforts towards unpacking Pace PR and some of its logistics. The Who, What, when, where, why of founder ship the growth since then. And then we'll look at unpacking the ethos and the full philosophy behind the endeavor of the company. And then we'll look towards Miach Industries and other areas that pays PR might be servicing. Then we'll look at goals that Annie and Pace PR separately or together have for the next one to three years. Those are changing rapidly in today's landscape. We'll wrap everything up with advice that you may have for those of you who are looking to work with her, get involved on some of her levels or emulate some of her success. As promised, a brief bio. Any Scranton is president and founder of Pace PR. She has eight plus years experience as a TV producer at major networks including CNN, Fox News, CNBC, MSNBC and ABC, where she booked guest appearances for popular shows like Good Morning America for the past decade. And he has been leveraging this experience and expertize to grow her own agency, Pace PR, where she focuses on getting her clients regular TV and media coverage to build their brands. So any I love that because it's very succinct. It feels very much so. Like you indeed own a PR firm. It's like the exact tincture of the axiomatic truth of your bio is like right there. But before we get into space PR, which I have a litany of questions for, I want to ask you to describe for us what you find to be the pertinent points about your academic and professional history that led you to the development of Paice PR.    [00:03:48] Well, I started undergrad when I went to Smith College. And so I studied English there as this small liberal arts school. There wasn't a journalism or a PR major which they do offer at a lot of universities now. But back then, I don't think it was as prevalent and it wouldn't have been an option anyway because it was a liberal arts school. So I think that really just started the foundation for me with critical thinking, my writing skills and communication. When I was there my senior year, I was the editor in chief of the SOFYAN, the college newspaper. So that kind of got my first taste of sort of, you know, the journalism world. And along the way, when I was in college, I had different internships at Condé Nast and I w ABC in New York. So I pretty much knew from early on I wanted to be in the media, I should say, even before that, when I was a little girl, my parents and I would always watch Katie Couric every morning on the Today Show. And, you know, I was like, I want to be her.    [00:04:55] I want to I want to work on the Today Show.    [00:04:58] So when I left Smith, it took me five separate interviews for five different jobs.    [00:05:06] But I finally got my first job at MSNBC as a production assistant. So that was sort of my launchpad for working in TV news. And then from there, as you read in the bio. I you know, I bopped around to a lot of different networks. I did that for eight years. And then I started my firm at the age of 30. We just celebrated our 10 year anniversary in business.    [00:05:34] I just turned 40 in quarantine, which was interesting. And and then along the way, about two years ago, I finished my masters at NYU. And there I did get my masters in PR, which everyone was like, why did you get your Masters NPR? You run a successful agency. But I did it with the intention in mind of hopefully in the next chapter of my career teaching and actually being able to go to the professorial route and to let people know more about PR or what I do.    [00:06:13] Absolutely. And I think some of the best professors in academia, I come from a long line of stuffy academics and, you know, I returned to it is an incredible retirement plan and my favorite professors were returning from the field.    [00:06:27] You know, we're coming back in from from abroad, if you will. So I think that's an awesome plan. And it's weird that anyone would ever ask you, like, why go back to school? Like, why aren't you my dad?    [00:06:38] To learn to think just to hang out.    [00:06:41] Yeah, it's. Well, as you were saying before, it's such a privilege to be able to learn, you know, and to get that education. So, yeah, absolutely.    [00:06:53] So looking at unpacking it a little bit further, let's get into some of the logistics for all of our little founder, entrepreneurial audience members listening. Let's start off with. It sounds like it was founded around 2010.    [00:07:05] And did you have co-founders? Did you take funding? Was it bootstrapped? How did all of it begin?    [00:07:11] No co-founders. Just me from from then until now, I'm 100 percent owner. No funding. Good.    [00:07:19] The good thing about PR is that it's a service industry, so you don't really need a lot of startup capital. I worked for the first year from my studio apartment where all I needed was my laptop, my phone and Wi-Fi.    [00:07:33] And that was that was. That was my startup. Those were my costs. So. And yeah. And then over the years. No, we haven't had to go to funding router or anything like that.    [00:07:46] So. Yeah. OK. And here's here's where here's the rub.    [00:07:49] So while you don't have funding, Pyar requires a lot of cachet. Right. And this is where the growth of PR firms is always astonishing to me because it's about relationships. It's built into the title is Plenty People Forget. But what you're providing your clients is only as so far as your relationships extend. Otherwise, you're cold calling people to get them more PR. You know, there's this duality that you have. I'm wondering, do you feel like your work with with all of your networks before helped establish your PR, or was that something you independently did after you launched Paice PR as we know it at Cisco?    [00:08:26] No, I mean it absolutely 100 percent. If I hadn't spent those first eight years working at all of so many different networks and building so many relationships with producers and bookers and journalists who many of whom are my friends, you know. And then there would have been zero chance that I would have been as successful. As we are today, because you're absolutely right. You know, as a former producer, I would get in one single day, hundreds of pitch e-mails, hundreds of e-mails from people. Put me on your show. I have something to talk about. Book me. And I deleted ninety nine of 100 every single day because if I didn't know the person, you know, it's just it's too much. There's just too much to keep up with. You can't get your work done. So having relationships is absolutely. I think it's a critical part for any business to be successful because you're only as good as your reputation, you know, and the people who will kind of go to bat for you. But NPR, it's it's even more critical, obviously, because of the, you know, the nature of being facing an external fee saying. But, you know, especially for a broadcast television, which is a big part of what my firm does. It's a very challenging you to get yourself booked on a TV news show if you don't really have an in with the right people.    [00:09:50] Yeah, absolutely. And I think that it appears as such, especially if you if you Google these things, you know, it's not getting published on Huff Post. It's a different beast unto itself is still remains, I think, kind of the unknown and misdefined.    [00:10:03] I think it's due to those old school relationships, which are very similar in Hollywood as well. I'm wondering the growth from the time, you know, you have these early relationships that definitely impacted, I'm assuming, the success for the first year. But did you have a spike at some point over the past decade of growth that you significantly remember? And if so, what do you think it was attributable to?    [00:10:30] There was a period of rapid growth. Yes, there were. It was probably about four or five years into my business where we went from four employees to like twelve employees and about maybe a year, year and a half. So it was just big. Get a big job then. And doubling our revenue. You know, in a three years doubling doubling our revenue. And what was it attributed to? I think it was just I think like in in the early days, you know, it was just me. So it's a little slower to kind of keep it moving and me or to keep it growing, I should say. And I'm a very risk averse person. So it took me a while to hire my first employee. And then it took me even longer to hire my second employee. And kind of so on until I got to there was four of us. And then I. I don't know. Something just clicked where I said to myself that if we were really going to continue to grow, I had to have faith in myself that the new business was going to keep coming and that the clients were going to say and that, you know, I had to just believe that the trajectory was going to keep going because there was no way with the current staff that we could keep up with with the workload.    [00:11:57] So I'm wondering, you you just mentioned that you have, you know, kind of a niche in obviously television, you know, representation and things like that.    [00:12:08] Does that kind of form what profile of client or industry that you work best with over 10 years? You must have at least ranged a small gamut. But do you have a niche that you prefer to pull your clients from?    [00:12:25] Yes and no. I mean, if we're talking cable news, then the best types of clients for me to have are print journalists and political pundits and lawyers. You know, people with past government, you know, or national security expertize so. Or, of course, I'm wealth managers and different financial experts for like the CNBC is and Bloomberg's of the world. So that's a very, like, linear, you know, sort of path. But our firm represents all different types of clients from lifestyle brands and products, you know, all the way to a you know, wealth managers managing a billion assets under management. So it's a very two tech startups, you know, so it's a very wide ranging base of clients. And, you know, it's I I think what makes us really good at what we do is it's a lot easier to get a wealth manager on CNBC or a political pundit on Fox News, but it's a lot harder to get, you know, a tech startup CEO or, you know, somebody with a rising product or brand, a prominent TV placement. And I think that that's that is an area where we excel. It could take a little more time, you know, to achieve. But that's where I think, you know, our connections and relationships with the different producers. But also just really, you know, feeling as though we are an extension of the media. And, you know, with that, watching all the shows, understanding what kind of content they want. You know, I just I say this all the time is just like you want to be on a certain show. You have to, like, watch the show and know what kind of stuff they do every day. So you run and present yourself with the, you know, in the right manner.    [00:14:14] Well, and into that same vein. I'm curious if you.    [00:14:16] I always feel like PR specialists educate their clients a great deal when they're doing a good job, you know, and they're they're kind of honing and refining the client's knowledge of what pieces of them need to be put in, which areas of the market to get the best price possible. But in what you just mentioned, I also wonder, knowing this show and seeing, you know, a natural progression that happens, you ever pitch networks on why they should kind of, you know, there are naturally heading somewhere. Is there an education to the other outlet as well, the news sources?    [00:14:52] Has that ever been or do you just try and fit the holes that they're developing? Well, it's easier to just sort of plug and play with what they're doing. But at the same time, we've certainly pitched ideas for like a recurring segment, you know, a once a week or something like that type of idea. And and we've we've certainly also pitched counterintuitive ideas, but we obviously make that connection, you know, at it to make it seem relevant for their audience. But, you know. Yeah, like if we. Having a good idea is is proper, is having the relationships is the most important part, but having a good ideas is very, very close second. So if you have a good idea and it's kind of interesting and they haven't done it yet. Yeah. Like, we've definitely had success with that in the past.    [00:15:44] Yeah. And that that being said, I kind of want to get into over the past decade that it's been around actually.    [00:15:53] You know, there's been this this behemoth called social media that turned marketing, PR branding, everything kind of inside out twice over again. And it allowed people to become creative in ways that weren't creative. It turned a lot of old ideas on its head and it actually allowed some, I think, of the pillars of non change, you know, to rise within our media structure.    [00:16:17] I'm wondering, can you speak to what was the biggest change regarding social media that you shifted or used creatively in regards to the process of pace PR? Where did you implement strategies that were interesting? Was it just the advent of all of them?    [00:16:35] Well, I mean, yes. I mean, when social media happened, I mean, it was you know, obviously it became sort of life life changing. You know, and kind of all consuming. Four for me. One of the best parts has been able to follow journalists and producers and show hosts on Twitter or Instagram or whatever, because it gives you a really personal look into who they are and what their interests are. And so that's such a critical component, because if you see that an anchor at MSNBC was just tweeting about some story and what their point of view is, and you represent a client who can speak exactly to that same sentiment or has the complete opposite sentiment, then that's a very that's a great in you know, to present that to the producer that you're going that you're reaching out to to make the case for, you know, well, the anchor feels this way. You know, she should really interview my client who will, you know, kind of go one on one with her about, you know, about the topic. So that's definitely been been one of the major ones. But for me as a business owner and being active on LinkedIn has been absolutely the number one besides a CEO, which is exactly social media, but sort of related has been the number one way that we've grown our business in terms of just cold outreach, you know, from percent perspective clients, because I'm very active and I post a lot. And so we've gotten a lot of inbound leads from that.    [00:18:18] So that was leading into my next question, which is new business development.    [00:18:22] Do you feel like it's what percentage of it do you think is is from your own marketing and PR efforts on behalf of yourself or happy good business clients referrals?    [00:18:35] 10 percent. What I do on my own 90 percent referrals and being a beautiful life. That's fantastic. It's yassa. Knock wood. That that it always stays that way. But. I mean, you know, we work hard. We we we pretty much always get results for our clients. You know, when you were talking about, like educating the clients, that's also, I think, like one of the reasons why even if we have an account that doesn't go exactly as well as we had hoped prior before I sent any client, I, I just try to be as honest and forthright and explain the process as as much as I can, because many clients, some have a good understanding of the media, but some have like no idea, you know, what goes into it and what to expect. And then what it's going to do for their business. You know, a lot of people may hear PR and they say we need PR because we're going to get, you know, so many new customers, you know, after we hire this PR agency. And you might. And we hope so. And and maybe but it's also the way that we look at it. It's really about getting these great placements in really well respected publications or TV shows or podcasts. So that way, your brand, your CEO, your company can have an elevated level of credibility, you know, and legitimacy among any others in in the field. So, yeah, you know, I think I think that's why, you know, but I. But I will say that. But being active on social media and making an an investment in FCO has absolutely paid off in terms of getting inbound inquiries.    [00:20:16] Yeah. What happened to a CEO? Everyone stop talking about her. Everyone is used to the buzz word, you know, for about five minutes, five years ago, social media took it away. I'm wondering when you mention the different clients that you work with.    [00:20:33] You know, you spend a lot of industries really quickly. And I'm curious, there's always a tenants of commonality, you know, that you run into. And and I like that unifying factor. I try to talk a lot about unifying factors because diversification is easy. And I'm wondering, over the past, while we don't have to go back 10 years, but we can. What are like the top three misperceptions or issues that most of your clients have regarding PR or what they should or should not be doing when they come to meet with you?    [00:21:08] I think a lot of people think that when they hire a PR firm or a publicist, it's it's they're going to very quickly be on the Today show or be featured in The New York Times or, you know, whatever insert dream media outlet is and end it. And they don't understand that. How I see PR and hiring a firm is that if you try to do your own PR, there's like maybe a one one to five percent chance that you're going to be successful. But like you're you're probably not going to see the level of success, you know, but hiring a PR firm, it's not only about pitching and using the right connections and relationships that we have, but it's also like taking a look at how you present your brand and the messaging that you're using and the the sort of a holistic approach of your of your company and saying, you know, I think that if we go and promote this one singular area of your firm, we're not going to have this success as opposed to us, you know, building it out in a way that's a little more attractive and also not even just attractive to producers. But I find a lot of times when clients come to me because we work with a lot of startups and smaller to midsize companies. It's really hard for them to actually describe what they do, you know, succinctly and in a way that's going to get someone interested, you know, because it's like no one really cares. Like everyone's so busy. There's a pandemic. Like, it's just, you know, there's there's so much noise. And so even though you think what you do is the most important thing ever, and maybe it is like me as a person listening, I want to know what's in it for me, you know, and what am I going to get out of it. And so, you know, the misconception is that, you know, a lot of clients think that we're gonna be able to get in an article in Forbes that's going to be just all about their company. And so we have to explain, no, that's advertising or that's sponsored content. You know, that's not editorial earned media. And so educating them that it's it's also just as valuable to have placements and interviews where you are seen as a thought leader in your industry and maybe you're talking about different trends in this space or, you know, you're weighing in on a current news cycle news story that's related to your field. And and also, can you provide me with happy customers, with people that you've worked with and you've helped them in their business because, you know, any any self respecting journalist is going to say, well, that company sounds great, but can you actually prove it to me? Can you put me in touch with somebody that they've worked with in that they've helped? And, you know, so without all of that sort of understanding and those factors. It's it's pretty much impossible. You know, it's, again, the PR that you're looking for. And so, you know, I said that in like 60 seconds, but it takes a long time to kind of get that in in a person's brain, you know, to really just make them understand everything that goes into it.    [00:24:25] Yeah.    [00:24:25] And with what you just explained, a core tenet of what you, you know, impart or educate your clients with has just ultimately changed due to what you just said. You know, you see, we're all in the middle of a pandemic. And I immediately think of when I think of PR is how many of your clients you need to go back in and say you need to embrace this dialog, you know, to alienate people by not speaking about it. I don't know of one commercial that I've seen and I try very hard not to see them. So I've only seen a few. And they've all incorporated the dialog of some type of of nod or acknowledgment or how it's playing into their customers. And I imagine is it is it like that for you or you? Are you going through and helping your clients are advising them to revamp and include this dialog of the Kovin 19 pandemic?    [00:25:13] Of course. I mean, for literally every single one. I mean, even if there's not a tie in or even if they don't need to address it, you know, like one of our clients is a direct to consumer 24 karat gold jewelry company. There is no there's no, you know, tie in really to the IRS. But we did advise them that when they were getting ready to send out there their newsletter with their latest collection, that it would be beneficial for them to address the pandemic even in just a very short way to their customers and say, we're thinking of you, we're here for you. If, you know, if if you know, just to kind of acknowledge it. Because if you don't, then I think that's where the reputational issue can come into play. But for every single one of our clients. Who stayed on as a client because we definitely lost some clients when this all hit. Like in the travel or luxury or real estate space. But for all of our other clients. You know, yeah. Their businesses changed as much as mine did where it became about that and about how how can we do we have a way to add value to the conversation? Meaning can we help? Is there a way that we can offer assistance in some way, whether that's financial expertize or in remote learning or in psychology or whatever? You know? And, you know, there is not. Then you have to just continue to find the journalists and the media who are not covering the pandemic. And just really be extra super careful that they are still writing about their previous topic and not incorporating the new news cycle.    [00:27:00] Yeah, absolutely. I want to turn now. I do a quick pivot into some of the demographics, and I'm not sure if this is dated because my research comes strictly from your Web site.    [00:27:11] But I got on and it looks like you have a crew of female or female identified individuals working for you. Nary a male or male identified face to be found. And I'm wondering if that statistic is true and if you can speak to whether or not I have to believe that that was a conscious thought at very least. And I was wondering if you can kind of open up that story.    [00:27:33] Sure. So it's so it it it wasn't it wasn't a conscious decision when I first started out. I actually had two different male employees on and they were great like but it was just when it was two people, me and them, you know, so. But then really what happened was once we started growing and then it became, you know, two female employees, three, four and so on and so forth. It just felt like it was a comfortable dynamic in the office. And also PR is a very heavily female dominated field. So, you know, the 80 percent of the resumes I was getting were women, you know, and not and not men. And then and then it just honestly, like, I kind of got to the point where it felt like it might be like weird if we were in, like, one office with nine women and one and one guy. But but now it's become something that's, you know, not not that is more serious and more intentional because now we are a female led company. And, you know, I'm I'm open to hiring men. I mean, I want great talent and great employees. But I think it's I think it's powerful. And I think it's it's been really inspiring to work with other working moms, to work with, you know, other really impressive women and to be in it in a situation where we actually are all, I believe, supportive of one another. And there's just kind of like that understanding, you know, woman to woman.    [00:29:16] Yeah, there's a camaraderie for sure. There's plenty of sociologists that have made their pitches on nothing else. So absolutely.    [00:29:23] I'm wondering, do you have you certified with any of the women and minority certification firms?    [00:29:31] And not only that for you, that question to you, but do you advise any of your clients to go and get certified with? I mean, a few are the WNBA or the WB e WB and see like all of these female and minority certification processes. Do you think it's a good source of PR? A lot of the processes are very lengthy and can be expensive, but there are a lot of companies now, particularly on the West Coast where I am, that are directly hunting these these companies out in order to make an impact.    [00:30:04] So I, I, I actually really pains me to say that I'm not part of any of these organizations because it's Dom and I should be and I have started the W MBT application like five times, and it is very lengthy. And you need a lot a lot of documents that go back a long way. And it's it's just been nothing but lack of time or interns who can help me to do it. So. So no, but it is on my list. It is on my to do list, although it's been there for a long time. I have to say admit. But yes, we do actually bring up those types of organizations to our relevant clients. And it's a common question that clients are asking us because they want to see and are a why from what we're doing and from the media heads that we're getting to them. But a lot of times, by being able to share a media clip in different organizations like that, that's a really impactful way than to build up your client base and to get new Kofman new customers.    [00:31:14] Absolutely. Yeah. And it's it's a new shift. And it's it's always interesting to see. I know that a lot of the companies that I've spoken to, the founders that are involved in them, take it really seriously.    [00:31:25] It's it's one of their greeting cards. You know, it's it's right there on the landing page. It's right there on the business card. And I think it's it used to be seen as kind of a fraternity status, kind of this, like nobody cares unless you've been in it. And then and now it's actually being sought out. I've hung out with a lot of venture capitalists and angel investors, probably too many over the past year. And. But it is this especially female which are largely underrepresented. And it's a part of fulfilling that economics and that environment of female founders turning into female investors in the lifecycle continuing. And there's a lot of talk about these certifications being necessary and important so that, you know, women investors, minority investors can turn around and do and fund firms that are doing it. You know, there's not a shortage of people to invest in. I've seen in the states as much as, you know, finding the right people that represent what you want.    [00:32:19] Now, you're right. And like, I'm going to as soon as we end this, I'm going to like e-mail myself a reminder that I need to actually do this and like, it has to get done. Yeah, you're going to everybody do it.    [00:32:29] You're like, that woman gave me homework. I cannot stand her. Yeah. Fantastic. Well, I think it's interesting and I appreciate your candor on that subject. I'm wondering, everyone's dialog has changed.    [00:32:40] I know that your workload increased with the pandemic, with your clients and things of that nature, even with losing some of them, having everyone had to go back and kind of rebound their message and consider what their message even was anymore.    [00:32:52] How you personally with pace PR, how has your dialog changed, if at all, considering the pandemic? And what do you see your goals for the next one to three years being?    [00:33:07] Well, you know, I think the dialog has become it hasn't changed, but it has become more even more intentional or even more pointed where, you know, we're we're trying to to make an impact and we're trying to work with clients and put out messaging that is going to be helpful and useful. And and and even if it's a a brand or a product or something that isn't directly related to, you know, these big global issues, making sure that we that we do it even more thoughtfully and even more carefully. And and so that way, we're we're always being proud of the work that we're putting forth for our clients and leading them in the best possible direction for their reputation as possible for me in terms of how what my goals have, my goals have changed. I don't I don't know. To be honest with you, because we're still sort of in the middle of all of this. But, you know, I have had to clear both sides of the spectrum of, like, you know, wanting to get back to work so bad full time and wanting to keep growing the business and go, go, go. You know, as far as we can go. And then on the other hand, you know, I'm I'm home now with my daughter, who's almost two. And it's been really nice, you know, on some days, not all days, but on some days it's been really nice. And so I'm not sure I think I think, like, you know, for me, as as a working mom trying to find that balance is, you know, who can who can find the balance like it's impossible, you know, ta ta ta perfected. Even though I always strive to perfected. But I think now. I don't know, I think I think I'm I think that things are shifting for me a little bit. So we'll have to have to see.    [00:35:04] Yeah. Well, and therein is the gift. Right? Just even the reflection and the privilege of being well enough to reflect and things of that nature.    [00:35:13] I'm wondering. So this is my favorite part of this podcast. Series is known for it.    [00:35:17] And so you'll have to indulge some of the joy, venality of the question. I am wondering if you were, you know, walking up within a safe social distance of someone tomorrow and they said, hey, listen, Annie, I need to ask you a couple of questions. I know you through so and so. You're in the PR game. You probably know everyone in Manhattan. So they walk up to you and they say, listen, it's a young female female identified, non binary individual, anyone other than like a standard white male. And they said, listen, I am I'm getting ready to launch into my own PR firm. I've had this great, you know, buffer of almost a decade in news and media and stuff like that. And I'm just looking to hit the ground running. What are the top three pieces of advice you would give the individual knowing what you know now?    [00:36:05] Make sure you have a safety net, a financial safety net, if at all possible, lay the groundwork while you are still gainfully employed. And don't undervalue yourself. You know, I think that getting to a point where I'm really proud of and comfortable with the rates that clients pay for our services has has has taken many years. And so, you know, I think it's maybe even more true for women out there. I don't know.    [00:36:40] Yeah, I hear that a lot. And I've spoken to over 200 over the past two years. And one of the top five things I hear from women who are in much more advanced and seasoned positions as a founder such as yourself.    [00:36:54] The number one thing they say is that life got a lot easier when they charged more and were available less, you know. And that's not some weird, twisted, dynamic of psychology. I think it was that they were saying that they just underwhelmed themselves. I had a lot of stories about people saying the first year and they were like on call 24/7 with their clients. People could text them at 3:00 in the morning. They would respond, Oh, yeah.    [00:37:17] Like, sometimes I would be on my computer like literally 16 hours a day. You know, I mean, little breaks here and there. I mean, is crazy. I mean, I was blessed because I loved it and I still love it. So it didn't feel like so much work. But I do actually think there's a little bit of psychology there because you're if you're not available 24/7, that means that you're respecting yourself and that you're setting boundaries for yourself and making family or whatever else a priority. And I think once you start to carry yourself in and live with that intention, other people pick up on it. And, you know, that's when things get a little easier in some ways. All right. So I have guys.    [00:37:59] So I've got a safety net. Lay the groundwork while you still got your day job, if possible. And don't under underestimate or undervalue yourself.    [00:38:09] That's awesome. Those are fantastic. We're out of time today, Andy, but I want to say thank you. I know you're busy. I've got a little one.    [00:38:15] You've got a massive company and you're sitting in New York, which is, you know, it's it's own hot pocket of issues, as we all have. But I just want to say thank you for your candor and your story and all of your information. I appreciate it. I know my audience does as well.    [00:38:29] Thank you. Thank you for having me.    [00:38:31] Absolutely. And for everyone listening, we've been speaking with Andy Scranton. She's the founder and president of Paice PR. You can find it online at W W W Dot Pace public relations dot com.    [00:38:43] And until we speak again next time. Remember to stay in love with the world and always bet on yourself.

For All Abilities – The Podcast Episode Eighteen  - Stephanie Robertson   In this episode, I interview Stephanie Robertson. We discuss the challenge of her diagnosis of OCD as a very young child and how she has navigated school and work with the diagnosis. To connect with Stephanie, please go follow her on LinkedIn (Stephanie Robertson).  Please subscribe to For All Abilities – The Podcast! Please follow me on Instagram @forallabilities, LinkedIn (Betsy Furler) and on Facebook (For All Abilities). Go to our website www.forallabilities.com for information on our software that enables employers to support their employees with ADHD, Dyslexia, Learning Differences and Autism. Thanks for listening!  Betsy     Thanks for listening to For All Abilities today!    Share the podcast with your friends, they’ll thank you for it!   Get our newsletter and stay up to date! The newsletter link is on our website www.forallabilities.com   Follow me   Twitter: @betsyfurler   Instagram: @forallabilities   Facebook: @forallabilites   LinkedIn: @BetsyFurler   Website: www.forallabilities.com                 Betsy Furler  0:05   Welcome to for all abilities, the podcasts. This is your host, Betsy Furler. The aim of this podcast is to highlight the amazing things people with ADHD, dyslexia, learning differences and autism are doing to improve our world. Have a listen to for all abilities, the podcast, and please subscribe on whatever podcast app you're listening to us on.   Stephanie Robertson  0:34   Hey, Stephanie, welcome to the for all abilities podcast. Thank you so much for joining me today.   Hi.   So I'm gonna have you introduce yourself to my audience. And just tell us a little tell us your full name and a little bit about yourself?   Sure, my name is Stephanie Robertson. I am 36 years old. I'm a native officer. And I, which we like to say around here is pretty rare. I work for Dell Technologies. I'm in channel sales. So I do business to business through third party value added resources, and it's a little complex, definitely a little stressful. We like to call it the Dell personality. But it's been really good for me and I'm interested to see where you know where it's gonna go in my life.   Awesome. Well, we connected because we were in the same sorority in college, but a few years apart, we will Domini and so we connected because of that. And we were in the best already Kappa Gamma Chi and Austin college. And so we I was I had posted that I'm watching this podcast for all abilities and you had volunteered to be a guest I'm super excited, because you have been diagnosed with obsessive compulsive disorder, OCD. And yeah, I am so excited to hear about how that's affected you throughout your life. So why don't we first start with childhood? And I know you were, you had to have been successful at some point in school because our college is pretty hard to get into. So anyway, so tell me what you were like as a child and kind of how the diagnosis came about and, and how your OCD affected you when you were in school.   Yeah, so I think the earliest thing that I really remember related to like OCD and just kind of like finding out about it. My grandparents lived abroad. And so they were living in the south of France, and I was about three or four years old. Maybe just Before my fourth birthday, when my grandmother passed away suddenly, and my parents, there was a big push at the time to be very honest with your children. And so my parents, in the interest of being very honest with their children answered all of my questions about death. very honest. And so, you know, when I, when I would ask things like, well, will we all die? Will you die? Will she die? Will I die? Then the answer to that was yes. And they would say things like, but not for a long time. And I think that that's really shaped a lot of my own parenting, for obvious reasons, but part of it was because when I was four years old, I couldn't tell time. And so a long time for me was 30 minutes in the way that I measured. That was a Flintstone.   I was like,   yeah, yeah.   And so for me, you know, one or two episodes of Flintstones or two to Flintstones was a long time. So that was kind of one of the first times that I really then it came to my parents notice that maybe I thought a little differently or that maybe I had, you know, issues working through other stuff differently than other kids did. And so that started kind of coming out a little bit more after she passed and the funeral and my other grandmother moved in with us for some time and she had a lot of issues around food she was big into like macrobiotics and all of the healthy stuff way before it was cool, if you know what I mean. Yeah. And so like, we weren't allowed to shop on the inside of the grocery store. We could only buy things right in the wall, like the outside walls. We had no sugar cereals in the house because those are poison and all that and you know, my little young brain was just soaking all of that up. And so what was healthy to others became really very unhealthy to me and So my parents called the school and they said, you know, she eating at school because she's not eating at home. And of course, that's a red flag and this, this was in 1989. So OCD wasn't really a thing in 1989 like, not even like a social circle, okay. Oh, you know, people are like, Oh, my, my OCD is kicking up, which is a different topic to me now. But like that wasn't even a thing then people didn't add was saying that. And so to my school, it just panicked them. And so of course they call Child Protective Services. Wow. Because they were like, Why? Why doesn't your daughter want to eat at home? Oh, she thinks he's being poisoned. Cool. Why does your daughter think that that you're poisoning her? So like an active services, came into our lives and interviewed our entire family and me and followed us around for weeks before they realized that no, my parents were not actually doing anything neglectful or abusive. That really what I needed was therapy and about what was going on in my head and, you know, kind of set the stage for how does your child think differently? And luckily, they did that I got a counselor, a play counselor, and I think this all went on from about the ages from five to seven, trying to figure out what was going on. And it   took me years to identify, oh, how about your parents are still scarred by that whole CPS? Oh.   My mom still tells the story and just talks about, you know, just talks about like, being in the therapists office and, you know, the big test today or the big interview day when when CPS came to interview me, and that when they walked back into the office, I guess I'd hidden like, I'd played hide or seek or something so I was little over and my mom didn't see me in the office and she just about lost it like she thought the baby okay. What Yeah, I have to bust through? Ah ha, oh my goodness. Yeah. So we still talk about that. But um, that was kind of the diagnosis and like the recognition and like I said it took, it took a couple of years to identify it and to figure out what do you do with that?   Right and sounds like you were a really, really bright child too, which probably made it all worse because you were able to find more information and remember that information and, and yeah, then you're a little brain was just taking that information and doing all sorts of things.   Yes, I was reading voraciously from an early age. I mean, by seven years old, I was reading Little Women by Louisa May Alcott. Uh huh. And, you know, I mean, like I said, my grandparents lived abroad. So I had a concept of the world and know that it's more than just driving distance from a young guy. So, so I did, I just took in all kinds of information all the time and tried to find places for it. And it didn't always work out. Because at that age again, you don't, you may have a concept of the world but it's not. It's not the concept of the world, right? Where you're trying to filter it in and make a structure.   It was so interesting to me when I had so as you know, my 21 year old son is medically come very medically complex. And he's also super, super bright. And I it was so interesting when he was little how he would make sense of things in the world. Because he was so bright and he knew so much for his age, like he had so many he's always had so much knowledge, but he didn't have all the knowledge, right. So he would, he would move things around in such interesting ways. Like I remember in I think in first grade, he said, Oh, so and so is sick, she's been home. She hasn't been In school for three days, and then he said, I wonder what hospital she's in? And I was like, oh, oh, you think if you're sick, you're in the hospital because that's what his life that's what's his reality. Right. I was like, No, baby. Most people don't have to go to a hospital. Other than that, that, you know. Anyway, yeah, it's so interesting how young children process information and then layers of other issues and your own unique brain structure makes it even more interesting. So how did you do? Were you a good student? Were you over overly over over thinker and all of that kind of type of student? I'm   definitely definitely an over thinker. You know, I think one of the things that I it took me a long time to place and to figure out what the OCD is that it makes you very much an all or nothing kind A person. And so in elementary and middle school and you know, the early years of high school, it meant All right, all right, A's or the world is ending. All homework is turned in, or the world is ending, I think I was in fourth grade. And I went to the nurse's office and I was just sick, I was ready to throw up. It was horrible, because I couldn't find my reading books. And I knew that I had put them in my Cubby, but couldn't find them. And I guess somebody had moved them or something from one desk to another. And so I just, I was so anxious about getting in trouble and not in you know, being the bad kid that didn't add them. And, you know, what would happen? I don't even know what would have happened in my head. Right, you know, and that was just, you didn't have to have a consequence in my head. It was just that there could be a consequence. Right. And, you know, I mean, I made myself sick enough to go to the nurse and I didn't have a fever. So finally, they sent me Back to the classroom after I had, you know, wasted enough time that wasn't reading time anymore. Hmm. And hopefully I would not get busted for not having these books. And then when I got back to the classroom, my teacher was like, oh, Stephanie, your books were on this desk. So we went ahead and put them in your cubby for you. I'm glad you're feeling better. Wow, that was it. So much of my school life was like that it was if you're going to win, first place, you participate. If you're going to do this, then then you can compete then you can do these things. So many nights, late nights up. many weeks and weeks and weeks of studying and things like that. And if there was going to be a win, or something like I've done, I would be in it. And then if at some point, I were to realize that that wasn't going to happen, then it was just out completely out of the money. Yes, absolutely. 100% and I learned I learned how to stop competing and things to avoid Like thinking shopping and be interested in some of the things to avoid that disappointment.   Wow. So that must have been really impactful on what classes you chose and what extracurriculars you chose?   Unknown Speaker  12:18   Oh gosh, yes.   Stephanie Robertson  12:20   You know, I volunteer for the OSU Humane Society when I was 13 years old. And I was the youngest volunteer that they had ever allowed. And I loved it. I got to volunteer in the clinic with the veterinarians and do like medical things. When it was great. And I was like, I'm going to be a vet, and it's gonna be fabulous. And then my freshman year of high school, I failed algebra. And my sophomore year of high school, I had to retake algebra, and I still barely passed it. And then I heard that algebra to follow that. If you wanted to be a veterinarian that you had to take, Chem, and biology and all of these things that have to do with science and math, and I had failed it one time. So obviously, I was not good at math. And I obviously could not go into the sciences and definitely could not be a veterinarian. Wow. And it totally changed the way that I looked at school all of a sudden it was now you're gonna look at the arts and now you're gonna look at the soft sciences and part of the part of the girls can't do that part of the you can't write up part of that this is just not how your brain thinks. And I turned it off for years. And it was like a mental block just can't do that. And so, you know, I mean, in college, I think my degree is not I think it's in I know it's in political science and psychology   that the audience that don't know, we went to Stephen and I both went to a liberal arts college and I was a psychology sociology major with a minor in religion. And I only took statistics I was the only math I took in college and I don't think I took any science.   I took sat three times and eat on our professor finally looked at me and he was like, you need this to graduate, right? And I was like, Yeah, I do. He graded one question on my final. And he looked at me like, how did you get this answer? And I was like, I, I didn't know how to do that one. So I made it up. And this is how I did it. He was like, Yeah, I don't know how you got the right answer. But it's right. So   yay.   Yeah, I just I couldn't science. I couldn't math and I couldn't science for years and years and years all the way through college. And it probably didn't, probably didn't overcome that mental block towards math and finances and science and any of that until maybe five or six years ago.   So that   Unknown Speaker  14:45   2030s   Stephanie Robertson  14:46   now you're working for a tech company,   computer company, so you're aware. I mean, even if your job isn't sciency mathy techie, every one around you is science a mathy type Do people tell us how you got there?   Well, you know, I, when I graduated from Austin college, I wanted to go out and change the world. And you know, I think that's one of the wonderful things about that school is it really encouraged us to encourage us to think big. And it was really hard to think big, and get paid very little. My first few years out of college and I worked in nonprofit and I did all of these things. And at one point, and I worked for a wonderful company called amantha, pet, maybe low cost spay neuter, and and preventive care for cats and dogs. And it was a really wonderful experience but it also I kind of reached a point where I'd I'd plateaued like I wasn't going to move forward without more or deeper experience or more education or just just something more i'd reached kind of as far as I could get at that stage and I didn't want to stay at that stage for another you know, three to five years getting paid, think at the time it was like $14 an hour. And I couldn't afford a new car. And I, you know, my car was breaking down, I lived as close as I could, to the area where we served, which was southeast Austin, where there are bars on most of the windows. I lived as close as I could do that without having bars on my windows. And you know, I got married, and we were looking at a family and all of a sudden, I was like, I can't, I can't pay back my student loans on this. I can't read the family on this. I can't do all of these things. So I need to make a change, whether it's go get more school or go get different experience or whatever the case is, I need to make a change. And right. My husband was very techie. Interestingly enough, he also worked for Dell at the time, but he's very computer techie engineering. He and my brother in law kept saying, Jeff, you need to come to Dell, you need to come to Dell. And so one day we were out to lunch, he is trying to convince Jeff Do you need to come to go and I just looked it up. Like why don't you don't want me back, I can learn how to sell computer will be fine. And literally like they basically had to teach me how to turn it on. And Wow, what's what's in the guts of it and you're going to have these conversations with people about their, their, you know, cloud strategy and servers and their storage and on prem or off Prem or, or hyper converged and all these things that I was like, I don't even know what that is. I can tell you the difference between a laptop and a desktop and after that you pretty much got me and Ernie, listen to music while you're smart, you'll learn and so I was five months pregnant with our second. I was paying still paying for insurance at the time because neither of our jobs provided it. And I went as a contracting agent temp to perm to Dell. And I was like, I've got five months to get myself a permanent job and I'm telling you I applied myself like I never have and I learned That I can learn science and I can learn technology and I can learn numbers and I can do it in a crunch. So, you know, it kind of just, it took that it took that like gut punch moment like, you know, you don't have a choice to fail here. You don't have that luxury of not trying and you don't have the luxury of not winning. You have to do it. Right. Right.   Wow, that was a bill, that was a big change for you. And how do you how do you think your CD affected you both negatively and positively in that change? Because that's a that was obviously a major change in your career and the trajectory of your life in general.   Yeah, definitely. You know, Dell is it's a really interesting place. I never thought that I would find myself in corporate America. Prior to Dell, I never worked anywhere that had more than 50 employees at my location. Even with my large companies, most of them didn't have more than 50 employees, people And going in there the first time, it was so overwhelming, I just went into building two of the seven in Round Rock, which is one of, you know, the three bases in Texas and horses global company. And so I just walked in there and I was like, Oh my god, this is just this building alone to the city. And it was so overwhelming. But they're also really, really, really inclusive. And they give you the resources that you need, they give you you know, the benefits and the time. And when you talk to your managers, they care to learn about you and what helps drive you. And so I found it to be just a really welcoming and inclusive place. And I learned how to use those weird quirks about myself as strengths. So I took Strengths Finder, for the first time while I was at amantha patent, I took it again, while I've been at Bethel and kind of looked at what are some of the consistent strengths and you know, music all kinds of self You know, understanding tests and evaluations and stuff. But one of one of my strengths is achiever. And I guess that basically, I'm really good at picking goals. And then it's followed by the other strength of strategy. So I'm really good at picking goals and problem solving how I'm going to get there. And then making a list and checking it off one at a time. And I kind of finally just let that OCD piece of me take over in that sense, where it was like, Okay, this is a place where it's actually healthy, to let my brain think the way that it thinks. Yeah. And so let yourself be goal oriented. Let yourself be task oriented. Let yourself figure out when is it right to be attacked versus a big, you know, overhead strategy and and play with it and let your brain figure out what it needs to do. And that, weirdly enough has worked. For me in sales and at Dell.   What it sounds like that now what you're doing is perfectly so suited to how your brain works?   Unknown Speaker  21:03   Yes. And kind of   Stephanie Robertson  21:07   make sure difference of the way your brain works differently into a strength for that job.   Definitely, definitely. I will say one of the challenges about a job, you know, like mine, in sales, you know, entails you're partially commission, or many people are all commissioned, right? And so if you want to make money, it's there for the making, but you're going to work for it, you know, and so, right. Dell is known you you work hard and you play hard, but you definitely work hard and you're never really 100% off. That's, that's in that that's just a millennial thing or a Gen Z thing or as we're going forward, people want more mobility and flexibility in the way that they work. And, I mean, that's one of the things that I sell. So I understand it very innately. People want to work when they want to work and Where they want to work and so whenever really off your brains always somewhere ticking in the background towards work. And I realized that that that same piece of OCD that made me really good at this job is also kind of a double edged sword. I can't be completely disconnected In fact, the only time that I have ever been completely and totally disconnected from work since I started was on the cruise this spring.   Unknown Speaker  22:26   Well, I was gonna   Stephanie Robertson  22:29   Yeah, I didn't I didn't get to go on the our sorties cruise I was gonna go and I was signed up and then my son was too sick and I just because you are totally cut off. I was like, I can't be cut off right now. But I will have to say I did go on a cruise a few years prior to that with my kids. And it was I was in a panic for the first 36 hours because of the lack of connectivity. And then I was like, Huh, hold on. I can Do this. Oh, let me grab this book. That's a printed book. Yeah.   I can read.   Or I could just send him out to nothing. And it was It is I, I think cruises are the best thing for people who cannot stop because you are kind of forced.   Yes, yeah. Yes. I was so nervous about it. I love my kids here. It's the first time I've ever been not in connection with them. They're, they're four and five. Now they were three and four when we went on a cruise. And, you know, I just had to believe Okay, my parents are with them. My husband obviously is with them. Oh, I'm just going to have to have to believe that okay. And I'm going to have to believe that my accounts are okay at work and people can take care of them. And I mean, I was probably a wreck and you were a wreck for three days. I think I was a wreck for about 30 to 40 minutes. Like while we were going out of port and then all of a sudden I was like, Okay, well here's my tie, and   I get mad at me out.   I just finally had to let go. I was like, okay, nothing. We're out of Port now like I right, right after was my travel buddy. And she kept picking up my passport and picking up all these things like while we were trying to get on the boat into the gear, Matt, like you need to just stop and once we were finally out of Port, I was like, Alright, we're out of port. I there's no plan to get me back. There's no car to get me back, right? No, that's not me.   Yeah, I'm in the middle of the golf now. So this is how it is.   Unknown Speaker  24:30   Yes, exactly.   Stephanie Robertson  24:33   Well, that's what it does. Do you have you ever disclosed the fact that you have OCD to an employer, whether it's Dell or any other employer? Yeah. Okay. And then they have did they do any accommodations for you? Or is it just kind of like they know that so if there's any, anything that happens, and you kind of already have that does that conversation open   Um, I've talked like, I mean, they all kind of know about me, I'm largely an open book when it comes to things and I try to do a little bit of education around OCD with people particularly because it is such a no just a saying, Oh, my OCD is acting up or, you know, whatever people like to say, particularly in stressful environments, but I don't really need any, like, work accommodations for it from her heart, like you know, so and I work halfway from home, so two days a week. So yeah, you know, they I kind of let them know what's going on like that, that I have it. If I'm having like a particularly stressful time period where it's really flaring up, then I don't have a flare up is the right term, but when it's really bad, then I kind of let them know ahead. It's mostly around stress and, and they've been pretty good about like, okay, you need, you need a mental health day or you just need a break. day you just need a day off and I'll take, I'll take a day of vacation or a day of PVA we call it personal business PBA and it's, it's time that I can just go so you know, a lot of people use their PBA for for, you know, doctor's appointments and stuff like that. And, and I do with my kids, but I also use it for what I call just a mental day, like when the stress is just getting to me and I just have to go. I'll do that vacation time or PDA time, and my boss is usually pretty good about it, because that's the kind of stuff that doesn't I don't really know what's coming. And they'll just write   right and he just kind of at that point need a break.   Yeah. Plus my first boss at Dell, so the best thing ever, that any employer could say to somebody like me, when I was really stressing out about it, of course, I was pregnant and what's going to happen when I go on maternity leave and I just got, you know, got officially hired on and all this stuff. And he just looked at me in he, he I think I had to go to the hospital for a check or something and he just He's like, we sell computers, and they're not going anywhere. It'll be here when you get back. And I was like, wow, that kind of grace is amazing.   Right, right. I mean, that's one thing I have to say about having my son who has been so medically fragile since he was born.   Unknown Speaker  27:19   And   Stephanie Robertson  27:20   we kind of like, have developed this understanding of if like, everyone's going to live. It's really not that big of an emergency. And, and yeah, I don't have OCD. Or I have really I'm kind of like the, I'm not. I'm the person that I think people think fits in the norm box, but I'm really not normal. But people see, like, if you just looked at me on the paper, and but I am, but you know, you I would still let myself get stressed and think I was in control of stuff that I wasn't in control of. And then through his illness, I really became I'm aware of the fact that really a lot of things that we stress out over really can wane and really aren't that important. It's like it's not really an emergency. And, you know, if everyone's alive, it's not really an emergency. Yeah. So, but it's hard to have that perspective. And our coding does not encourage that perspective.   I agree. And I have a bob's like, Man, that's,   that's amazing.   It was it was really great. And, you know, pregnancy is one of the things that really kind of makes that OCD much more prevalent in demand hormones and everything else going on. And yeah, I didn't know that was my first that was a really interesting postpartum period.   Yeah. And I just having a baby. I mean, it's, it's, you know, it's so much responsibility. So much steps that we have to do right. Or you think you   have to do definitely right I, I've always been very open about my mental state with my husband. And of course my family knows because I grew up with it. But you know, I mean, after I had john our oldest, I mean, I thought I had it down like I was like, Oh yeah, I'm wheeling and dealing This is great like I had, this is the chair where we feed him and rock him at night. This is where we paid him. This is where we do everything. And it was all within like, one large bedroom and I had like a sink in the in that bathroom like it was a master upstairs in the little little townhouse, and little townhouse. And I had organized for I didn't have to go downstairs for anything. Like I had everything right there where I could just reach it and I was like, Man, I'm really knocking this out of the park until my mom and my sister like, came and got me and they're like you have to leave your house. Here I gotta I have everything. Like I have everything right here. This is how you should set it up. I am doing well. They're like Stephanie, you're not leaving your house.   She's maybe you don't have it all together as   you know that's what I was like Okay, wow so I really thought that I had this OCD thing down when it came to school or down when it came to work and etc and parenting is what really just knocked it absolutely out of the park through it to pieces had no idea how to pick myself back up together. And you know, I mean, my husband has has a DD diagnosed as well. And there was a few worrying things. Let me tell you. She can't pick up a thought to save his life. And I can't function with the sock in the middle of the room.   Right? Oh, yeah, it's hard.   It's a little wild. But we finally with kids that kind of helps us learn about each other and off and we regularly say in our home, like you just have to, you have to give me grace. Mm hmm. You have to give me the grace to deal with this. Give me the grace to understand about this and for him also. To recognize kind of triggers or points when his add is going to be an issue. And I'll try to just kind of put down things that I need in order to weather the storm. And he started to recognize the same in me like he knows when things are just going to get really like, gridlocked in my head. And this is how things have to be. And so we finally started to get to that point, you know, six and a half years in with two kids that are four and five years old. Ah yeah, and two crazy jobs, but we've we've finally started to get there and and every time that we start to feel like wow, we really have it all together then, you know, like, a curveball and you have to figure it out. But I do think that one of the neat things is about having Jeff with a DD and his diagnosis and then mine is that we are We each have kind of a unique perspective to respect and appreciate each other's strengths and to be more compassionate and understanding with each other. about each weaknesses,   you also probably know more about yourselves than most people know about themselves. You know, because a lot of people have spent that time to really figure out what are my strengths? What are my weaknesses or my you know, and and to be able to know that about yourself and then to the able to communicate it with, you know, with and to someone else. I think that is that's gonna be amazing for your marriage over the year. So what my husband and I have been married for almost 25 years. Well, our anniversary like in a week. And, in fact, I think that's exactly in a week. And I know that our having Henry and all of his struggles made us have to communicate, like you can't go through things like that and not communicate and, and, and being able to be, you know, really communicative, and you know, his, you know, one of my big things is Don't, don't minimize my struggle. My emotion because of your struggle or your emotion, you know, like, like, we can have our own emotions at the same time that that's okay. And yeah, and be able to communicate that and literally say, you know, I know you're stressed, but that doesn't minimize my stress.   And exactly,   that's been actually hard for me because I'm a fixer, and I want to fix every buddy and everything. And so, you know, I would I, especially in the beginning of our marriage, and when Henry was really little, I would just try to make everything smooth for everyone else. Like, even if it meant me not showing emotion, but that's not good for a relationship. What do you know what you're describing that talking back and forth? I think that's what really that's what really helps. And I think that I think, is a as as I think that is a good thing about having a diagnosis of some sort is that it does provide more insight into how you, you will work in the world. And move around around the world.   Definitely, we probably our first four years of marriage, we just kind of duke it out. Like, yeah, thought about those things. We didn't know how to talk about it yet. And, you know, for me with OCD, it's like I said, I'm an all or nothing person. And it's, you know, all winning or if you're going to fail, you just walk away. And so when things broke, then my answer to it was walk away from get over it. Right? Just get over it. And you don't you don't get to mire in mire yourself into depression about it or anything like that. Because then you're never going to get out of there. Yeah, yeah. And I've had to work really hard on learning how to accept that there are feelings and then I'm allowed to feel them. And, you know, that was one of the things that we had a very hard time with, because he's very fighter flight. He is he's gonna fly every time. He does not fight. he avoids it. And I'm like, you get back here and you get over it. did not go well, those arguments, right? And we actually we went to marriage counseling and we thought that they were going to talk about our marriage and like, Well, no, you need to respect each other and you need to do all this. But really actually what they did focus on was they focused on our on our diagnoses, and they're like, you guys, pretty much what they said guys know about yourself, do you know how you function with yourselves and you have to learn how you function with each other, and you have to communicate about yourself to the other person. And that's where we got the concept of, you know, you have to give me grace right now.   Yeah, that's great. That's great. I think that's going to serve you well. And your children too. Do you want to add anything else to the anything else you want to tell the audience or   are you anything you know, I mean,   I always want to say something incredibly profound. I don't always have anything incredibly profound. But you know, I think one of the biggest things just in relation to to my own just weird mental way of Thinking with OCD and everything else is that you know, it's not what people think it is. It's not, you know, oh, I have to have all I mean, I do have to have all my clothes organized in a certain way, but that's not gonna make it or break it thing. The biggest thing about OCD that is so debilitating and so difficult is that feeling of unworthiness and that feeling that you can't trust your gut, that you don't have a gut because everything's always wrong. So you can't trust yourself and you have to create this entire other rational being. And you know, that there is a way for there is a way to function and you can, you can function well and you can even find those things that work for you about it. And talk about Yes, and that when people talk about like oh, my OCD is flaring up or Oh, you know, this is gonna drive OCD people crazy and it's at Facebook with the images were like one line is slightly off right? You know, just to remember that, that that's not what you deal with and not to let it be minimized like that. Because I feel like that just, it tells you mentally, like, really, you can't get over a simple BuzzFeed list, like get over yourself. Mm hmm. You should just be able to push on. And that's not what it is and to not let yourself into let the way that you can get minimized into that because it really is so much more. And if you can figure out if you can give it the weight and the gravity that it has, then you can figure out how to be successful over and beyond it.   Awesome. That is great advice. Ds people want to come up, communicate or reach out to you. How should they find you?   I am on LinkedIn. And I am Stephanie Robertson. I work at Dell.   Awesome. And I will put that in the show notes. Everyone has the information.   Awesome. So thank you so much for letting me be a part of this.   Thank you so much. This was wonderful. I really am Appreciate it.   Thank you. I had a great time chatting with you.   Betsy Furler  38:06   Thanks so much for listening to the for all abilities podcast. This is Betsy Furler, your host and I really appreciate your time listening to the podcast. And please subscribe on any podcast app that you're listening to us on. If you'd like to know more about what we do and our software that helps employer support their employees with ADHD, dyslexia, learning differences and autism, please go to www dot for all abilities comm You can also follow us on Instagram. And you can follow me on LinkedIn at Betsy Furler. And Frank, you are LR Have a great day and we will see you soon.

Watch your language! That's what Stacey is trying to tell herself this week. When you're a parent of a child with a chronic condition, it's hard not to say things like "our diabetes" and "our CGM graph." But it's not "ours" exactly, so how do we better talk about this? Check out Stacey's new book: The World's Worst Diabetes Mom! Stacey also shares her frustration as she finds herself falling into the trap of perfect numbers and trends. While her and Benny's experience with Control IQ has been wonderful so far, it's also bringing back some of that perfection trap she thought she'd left behind. Join the Diabetes Connections Facebook Group! Sign up for our newsletter here ----- Use this link to get one free download and one free month of Audible, available to Diabetes Connections listeners! ----- Get the App and listen to Diabetes Connections wherever you go! Click here for iPhone      Click here for Android Episode Transcription  Stacey Simms  0:00 This episode of Diabetes Connections is brought to you by the World's Worst Diabetes Mom: Real Life Stories of Parenting a Child With Type 1 Diabetes.  Available as a paperback eBook and audiobook. Learn more at Amazon or diabetes dash connections.com.   Announcer  0:15 This is diabetes connections with Stacey Sims.   Stacey Simms  0:26 Welcome to another week of the show. I am so glad to have you here! This is one of our minisodes the shorter episodes that have become sort of the editorial page. If you look at the podcast as a newscast, as I often do. That's my background. I'm a broadcaster local radio and television for many, many years before I started the podcast. So the Tuesday episodes which runs longer and usually have an interview with a newsmaker. That's the news. And then these episodes have kind of become the editorial. And this week, instead of the headline stop doing this or think about before you do that, which I've been Doing a lot lately. I'm going to talk about why I think what I'm doing is wrong. And maybe you could help me with that. I know I'm not alone. But I'm going to tell you straight up here. I don't really have the answer for what I'm going to talk about today. And this is really about parents. But I'm hoping that if you're an adult with type one, you will listen to this as well. Maybe it'll sound familiar to you, maybe your experience can help us. So this is all about my struggle, to, in a nutshell, stop thinking about it as my diabetes. It's not I know this in my brain. My son has type one diabetes, he was diagnosed right before he was two. We have been living with this for 13 years. And sure, my family is affected by diabetes. My family has to deal with diabetes, but my son HAS diabetes. And I'm kind of exaggerating, but you'll get a better idea in a minute why I'm saying it in such strong terms, because I know this is not helpful. So I'm going to tell you a story. This story happened in December, a couple of weeks before we got control IQ, the new hybrid closed loop system from Tandem. It does tie in, I'm going to tell you about our experience with control IQ, and then how it relates to all of this. If you've seen me talk or you read the book, you know that I'm really fighting against this pressure for perfection. And I think and it makes me laugh that a lot of people like I was just in Raleigh this past weekend talking to parents about this. A lot of people think that I now have this down pat that I know, that I that I am perfect at not being perfect. And I think what's really funny is, it never ends, right. There's no finish line to parenting, where you're like, Whoa, great job. I'm, I'm all set. right good for me. I did it. I mean, there are big milestones, like college and when your kid moves out permanently, but I really don't think that there's a point at which we can say, that's it. So we're all trying to improve. And I think this story will highlight really just What a dingaling I can be sometimes, because this stuff isn't easy, right? And we're always trying to improve. So let me tell you the story, and then you tell me how to improve. Alright, so this happened, as I said, in early December, so almost two months ago now, Benny was right in range before bed. He was hovering right around 125. And for the last few weeks before this, he'd been dropping about 15 to 20 points overnight. That was it. Right? Just a little drop and then steady. So that was a fine number to just leave alone. But he texted me because this is how we communicate in my house, even if we're in different rooms. Right across the hall. He texted me a few minutes before I was gonna go in and turn out his light. And he texted me I feel really low. In my head looking at the dexcom I said, You're not low. You're 125 I don't want to treat that. You're going to mess up our great trend. And you're just going to go high. You're going to mess up our great numbers. I didn't say that out loud. I went into his room and this is what I said. I said, “Really? Because Dexcom says 125. You feel low?” And he said, “I feel like I'm dropping. See now I'm 117.” Even without the Dexcom number moving down a smidge. I knew my hesitation was selfish and misguided. Alright, it was dumb. He's not foolproof, but Benny knows his body. He has been living with diabetes for 13 years. And he felt low. And in my head, I'm like, “Stacey, come on. These are his numbers.” Did you hear me earlier when I said, you're gonna mess up our great numbers? I mean, I, it hurts me to admit that. But it's his number. It's not mine. It's not ours. So I said, “Okay, I trust you. Let me grab you a drink. Do you think you need more than that?” “Nope, just a juice box should be fine.” Benny sleeps with an apple juice bottle by his bed. But it's it's a full like 25 or 30 carbs and he didn't need that much. So I grabbed Little can of pineapple juice, and I poured about 12 to 15 carbs, like a juice box, basically, over ice in a highball glass, because sometimes it's just gotta be fun. And in my head, I was kind of feeling guilty, even though I hadn't shared with him. I'm trying to make up for that by the splashy cocktail. So he loved that. And he drank the juice and he went right to bed. Now, I assumed I was going to hear that Dexcom high alarm pretty soon. I mean, I went to bed, but I just figured out right, I guess I just gave him 15 carbs he didn't need but instead, I woke up at 5:50am like I do every day. It showed that he had stayed between 100 and 130 all night long. He had been feeling low, he did need that juice. While I am thankful that I didn't go into his room and say, “don't mess up our numbers” I didn't say what I was thinking out loud. It bothers me that I thought it at all. I mean, after all this time I do trust Benny with diabetes. I do respect his decisions. And I know that even though he is from perfect, right? He really is safe and happy. So why do I still have those thoughts at all? It's not about the good health outcomes. I mean, that's the first thing we think of as parents, right? We want our kids to be happy and healthy. And I would be lying if I said, Well, it was out of health concern. It was because I wanted to make sure that he felt good, and could sleep well and have a great day at school the next day. That's what I'm supposed to say. But it was about the straight-line graph. It was about wanting, I don't post them, but it was about wanting to not mess up the pattern we were on. I mean, what, would I really rather my son feel crummy and ignore what he has to say to me, showing him I don't trust him. I don't respect him to see that kind of graph. Ah, so how do we get past that? Not only am I not answering that right now, I'm going to tell you another example of how it's now getting worse. And this is because of control IQ. First, let me say I love this system. tandem is not a sponsor of the podcast. They're not telling me what to say. Not that they ever did. But man, this is an incredible piece of software for us. I am so excited. We've had it as I'm taping the podcast, we've had it for about 10-11 days now. And in the last seven days, Benny's blood sugar has been in range 70% of the time at minimum, I think only for two days. For the most part, he's been in range with less work a lot less work. I don't think in the last seven days he has bolused for a correction, it's only been for food. Now the first couple of days we did have to do a lot of adjusting. And this is very typical. If you are on any kind of hybrid closed loop system and this is includes the DIY systems is my understanding the people I've talked to, you realize right away that most of your pump settings that have worked pretty well for you all this time are wrong. It's just that we are manually compensating for defaults. We're paying attention like we're supposed to, we're checking that Dexcom, we're poking the fingers a million times a day, right? We're really manually using the pump to get the most out of it. And not letting it run on its own. Because it's dumb, right? It's not a smart pump. Most of these pumps, most of the programs that we've had until recently, they're just a dumb brick that gives you insulin when you tell it to. And when you switch over to the automated systems, you really have to trust and you really have to adjust. Because not only is the insulin duration all for most of us, but your basals are off, your sensitivity factors. I mean, I'm not going to go into too much detail here of all of the changes we had to make. But you do have to take your time with this. In fact, as I'm telling you this, we are still at the very beginning of making the changes here, even with those great outcomes we're seeing. I haven't changed anything in about five days. I've talked to Benny's endo, and we're going to wait another week probably just to kind of let it play out and see what really needs to adjust cuz it gets harder, right? The more in range you are, the less you want to tweak, but I know we can make it even better. But in a nutshell, we had some incredible lows like sustained under 50 lows that we hadn't seen and of course we overtreated for those. And then we had the perfect storm over a weekend of a birthday party that was an overnight party, huge dinner that he completely forgot to bolus for and then tried to make up for half an hour later at a bent canula. So that was high, high, high high for hours and hours and hours, which you know, of course, messed up my control IQ graph. And I am not kidding. Yeah, I know he was high. I know that he said he felt fine, but you know, he didn't feel great. I know that while Yes, his health is my number one concern in my little brain. I'm thinking, well, I want to show our control IQ graph and how great it looks. And I want to be like all those other people I'm seeing with their great results right away and isn't this supposed to be amazing and I want better results. And that's what I was mad about. You know, I feel like a dummy admitting to this. But I know I'm not alone, because I am seeing a lot of my mom friends. And a lot of people I don't know, on Facebook, who are not necessarily saying it as plainly as I am, but who are definitely struggling. And sure we're struggling with the actual numbers. But I think we're also struggling with the expectations and we're struggling with our kids are old enough to do a lot of this themselves. So we're struggling now. With How do I and I'm doing this to Benny? How do I not helicopter, right? How do I not say to him five or six or seven times a day? Did you bolus? What did you do? What's going on? What do you think? How about this? Did you check? I mean, we don't talk about diabetes all that much in a day to day basis. But with control IQ and wanting to know what's going on with it, and wanting to be able to tweak it and make the adjustments. You have to talk about it. And we're out of practice. So I said to Benny, a couple of days in Look, you're just going to have to be patient with me, you understand why? If I'm driving you crazy, you have to tell me. And if you just want to give me the pump and walk away, so I can see what you did, that's fine too. But we have to find a way that I can see what's going on without driving you bananas, and that you can feel good that I'm still trusting you, I still respect you, I still think that your decisions about your body are ultimately the most important. But I need to help you with control IQ. Because at 15, and everybody may be different. But my kid is not old enough to really go through this and troubleshoot. And he's not interested. I mean, he didn't even really want to watch the training. He wants me to tell him about it. And that's fine for us, because we've talked about it now and I feel a little bit better about it. But and I'll share another embarrassing thing. I just said that, you know, the last seven days, boy, he's been in range to 80% of the time. Well, today he's kind of struggling as I'm recording this. I'm not exactly sure what's going on. But he got to school and he went over 200 He probably ate some thing, right? I mean, it's not it. You don't have to be a genius to figure this out. And then he went back down. And in my head, I'm like, should I text him? No. Should I find out? What's going? No, you should leave them alone, Stacey, which I did. But I'm also thinking, Oh, I really hope that we're in range. But in my head, I'm thinking, Oh, I really hope we're in range more, because I don't want that 80%. It's messed up. I mean, come on. Oh, this stuff is not easy. I think acknowledging that It's troublesome to think this way, is important. I think acknowledging that I'm still going to think this way, is important. I'm trying to work it through and change it. Thank you for being my therapy on the show this week. Maybe I'm yours as well. If you have similar thoughts. I'm not really sure how to get past it, other than to acknowledge it and talk it out and laugh at it a little bit. Do you have a better idea? Do you have a way that all of us who are thinking about these lines And graphs as ours, and I'm not talking about younger kids, it's so different when your kid is two, or four or seven, or even nine. But once they're in middle school, you know, this transition, to independence, their own care for them to think about it, to take ownership of it, to know that you trust and respect to them. Even if you're questioning, I trust and respect my husband doesn't mean I don't ask him questions, right? It's a difficult transition. But it's such an important one, because soon enough, he's going to be in college and independent, and he's going to be out on his own independent, if I'm lucky. So I do think it's worth discussing, even if it's a little embarrassing. And I was at a JDRF conference this past week that I mentioned in Raleigh, and I brought this up, I was with three adults with type one. And I mentioned I was going to call myself out on the podcast this week because of my graph thinking about it as my numbers. And their reactions were really interesting. They didn't tell me I was a terrible person. They didn't tell me I was a helicopter mom. They just said yeah, it's Gotta be tough. It's got to be hard. But it's really important to know those are not your number. It's not your diabetes. I think something else that's important to keep in mind is, this is so new, right? These closed loop systems are so new, there really isn't even a good instruction manual for how to know what your pumps settings should be adjusted to 10 history, the great job with the training, I think endocrinology practices are doing a great job with helping people but let's face it, most of us are getting advice on how to adjust this stuff from Facebook, which is not the best place ever, because I'm seeing a lot of people had a lot of highs, we had a lot of lows, the advice there is not going to be comparable, right? So I'm going to give myself some grace. I'm going to give myself some patience. And I'm going to hope that I get better at this, that I continue to see the humor in this that hopefully Benny continues to see some of the humor in this and that I can continue to watch my language. I don't mean keep it PG. I mean to watch my language so that I am not saying my, when it comes to graphs, or diabetes, or more importantly, maybe most importantly, about how Benny feels, right? Isn't that the most important thing? I can see that number, but it's really about how he feels, how he wants to react at 15 years old, it is well, to the time to let him do that. So I hope I can continue to work toward those goals. Well, now you know why I am the world's worst diabetes mom. I really hope that if you get a chance to check the book out, you let me know what you think about that as well. It is available as an audio copy and you can get that for free. There's lots of opportunities there. I will link up all this stuff on the episode homepage. There's also a transcript of every episode beginning this year, and that's very popular now. So I'm hoping to go back soon and transcribe more of the episodes. We have almost 300 of them now. Holy cow back next week with our full Interview episodes. In fact, next week more McCarthy is back, ask the de moms is back. And we're gonna be talking about a variety of things, answering your questions, including talking about driving, because Benny just got his promise. And yeah, we're trying to figure all of that out as well. Oh my gosh, this stuff never stops. So I will see you back here for that on Tuesday. And in the meantime, be kind to yourself.   Benny  16:27 Diabetes Connections is a production of Stacey Simms media. All rights reserved. All rounds avenged.   Transcribed by https://otter.ai

We started off this season talking about how limited broadband access can impact student performance and the overall well-being of a community. Today we are going from worry to a celebration and talking about the people who make a positive impact on students in rural communities through the public health system.  This Rural Mission is a podcast brought to you by Michigan State University College of Human Medicine. The podcast is produced with funds from the Herbert H. and Grace A. Dow Foundation and the Michigan State University College of Human Medicine Family Medicine Department. Welcome to season two, I'm your host, Julia Terhune, and I hope you enjoy this episode. Education levels in rural communities is something to talk about. While rural communities lead the nation in number of individuals who have a high school diploma, according to the USDA, the number of people living and working with any additional education drops right off. In 2016, only 19% of all rural adults had anything more than an associate's degree as compared to 33% of all urban adults. When we look at county data, rural America leads the way in number of counties where more than 20% of the working population does not have a high school diploma. The prospects for higher education in rural America is bleak and it's low educational attainment seems to perpetuate the issues of rural poverty and the vitality of these communities, but there are success stories. If we drive North to beautiful Charlevoix County, we will get to a five square mile town called Boyne city. Boyne city is home to around 3,750 people, most of whom are over the age of 40. The average family in this area makes about $31,000 a year, which is more than $20,000 less than the mean income for the state, allowing for the average poverty rate in the county to sit around 12.5%. Like the rest of rural America, the majority of citizens have no more than a few college courses. Meaning that 60% of the population of Boyne City has nothing more than a high school diploma. For all those listening who are interested in medical access in rural Michigan, the health resource and service administration or HERSA has designated Charlevoix County as a health professional shortage area for primary care, dental care, and mental health care. In 2018, Boyne City High School saw some amazing students graduate. In fact, around 115 stellar graduates came out of points city, if we're going to be straight about it. We are going to talk to three of these amazing students, but I want to quickly set the stage. Boyne City High School graduates are coming from a rural school in a county that has some big social factors to overcome. 38% of all the students at Boyne City High School receive free or reduced lunch, and around 18% of the population that lives on less than $35,000 per year are families with children. Furthermore, I took the Liberty of plotting how far a student would have to travel to get to the nearest four year university from Boyne and I posted that map on our Facebook page, but I'll give the bag away. The closest four year institution to Boyne City is Lake Superior State University, which is over 90 miles away and across a five mile bridge. Therefore, options for a close to home education don't really exist for young adults looking to get something more than a high school diploma. But I told you there were success stories for this episode and there are. It's just that the students that have found their way to higher ed had more work to do than you would've expected. So let's introduce our leading ladies, shall we? Katie is going to Northern Michigan University. Katie is the daughter of Joe McCue who you heard earlier this season and is the oldest of a big family. She's staying in the state, but remember NMU is over 150 miles from Boyne. Maddie is going to Brown. Yes, Brown, and is going to tell you a lot about her trail to an Ivy League education and Anna, well, Anna is going to Stanford, you know the number two university in the world. So what is different for them? Anna, Katie, and Maddie graduated from a class of around a hundred to 115 people and when I asked them about how many were going on to university, they had this to tell me. University, university? Maybe 40? 50? Yeah. Probably 40. Yeah, because a lot are going to [crosstalk 00:05:04]. Community college. Yeah. Okay, and is that pretty standard for your area? That's pretty good actually. Yeah, our grade I think had- very ambitious. Ambitious, very academically inclined grade at least compared to others and the three ahead. Or even the three behind. Just looking forward. Most of our students put academics before a lot of other things, which was kind of uncommon. So was there a lot of competition then in your grade academically? Yes. Yeah. Yeah. Everybody was applying for the same scholarships. It's like, "I don't know if I want my friends to read my scholarship letters because they're applying for the same ones." It was hard. If you look at the top 10% of our grade- Of level four. Yeah, it's super impressive the number of people who- The top 10 had above [inaudible 00:00:05:58]. Yeah. Okay. So what is different? Why is your class different than the three ahead and the three below? I have a little bit of theory. Okay. So in fifth and sixth grade the math classes were accelerated or there were some accelerated math classes, which was a newer thing in the middle school and they [crosstalk 00:06:21]. They took a whole chunk of us and just pushed us forward. IT pushed us up and then the chunk right behind us ended up meeting at the same place in eighth grade where we were all in an accelerated class and that was 30 students, and those 30 students continued to be the top 30 in the grade all the way through high school because they've been pushing our grade. There are lots of educators who care and care a lot about encouraging and promoting student success, but the concentrated effort that these Boyne City graduates experienced is a positive benefit of being part of a rural school. A rural school where they had the ability to identify and focus on those 30 high achievers. This concentration didn't just stop with that top 30. It had an impact on all the other students as well. Yeah and [crosstalk 00:07:12]. But it grows everybody else up because now the standards- Yes, now there's more competition. ... Were being good or academically good for lack of a better term is so much higher than everybody else raises. Yeah. There's something else about the accelerated English classes too with that. The same 30 people are in that. Because there was so much of a demand. Then it just kind of ... Everybody had to be working a lot harder to be considered the standard. So are there any other theories that you guys have [inaudible 00:07:41]? we were really close and we just so it was all this really positivity. We were are really positive grade and we all had these great outlooks on the future and every chance that we got that we could improve on those AP classes or advanced classes everybody took it, because we'd all just saw this opportunity to do better. And it almost became a social thing in the sense of if you're in honors English now you get to be with all the fun people in the honors English. So now our honors English class is 30 kids big and it's fun. Or AP World or calculus or physics. You get to be with your friends. Yes. So 98 people, that's easy to do, right? If 30 people can easily have an effect on 98 people. So if you guys were at a bigger school, do you think he would have had that same effect or do you think that that would've been the status quo? I don't think we would've. I think we would have just been that one class full of nerds. Yeah, because [crosstalk 00:08:44]. You have all the opportunities. It's open everybody normally. And so it's just kind of like, "Oh, it's still part of the thing." You don't as involved because it's just your educational process. There's nothing different. You don't have to fight. For those advanced classes. For us, we had two AP courses offered taught by teachers and so if there was an AP course everybody's is like, "Oh my gosh, there's something new. We all need to take this." It's really cool where it's like my cousin goes to a bigger school and it's like, "Oh, we have five to 10 AP courses offered and it's no big deal." You take it if you want to take it [inaudible 00:09:24] show your college [inaudible 00:09:26] college SAT scores and all of your grades throughout your previous classes and your grade point average. We didn't even have a [inaudible 00:09:35]. You have to get teacher recommendations to get into these advanced courses because everybody wants to do it. There's a benefit to that fight that Katie and Anna spoke about. It can prepare you for what comes next. We talk about the plight and vulnerabilities of rural areas on this podcast often, but we also need to highlight the resilience, the tenacity that living with limited resources can provide. Catherine Ellison was from my small town. She is one of those brave souls we speak about who goes away, gets tons of experience in education and comes right back to the community. She is currently the elected school board president for [inaudible 00:10:16] Public Schools and I asked her about the barriers, both perceived and real that rural public school graduates face. Well, talking about your perceived in reality. I think it's perceived through a disadvantage. It's a smaller school. Maybe they don't have as many offerings as a big school. You have the same teachers for years and you see the same people in the hallways but in a lot of ways, especially with today's these kids where everybody's on their phone, on the computer, you on the tablets, there isn't that social interaction. Small districts can be great. I mean, you're still going to learn how to read and write and do math, all those basic things. But you're also going to learn people skills? You know everybody you're going to school with, you're going to have a conversation with them, not just on the internet. Right? So there is for that focus. I mean, and teachers care about you because they know you. I mean, you might have the same kid two or three years if you're, you know, teach different subjects in high school or something, right? So you get to know those kids. So I think that's the real advantage is, is the customer service, if you will. Teachers know their kids. Administrators know the kids. It's a small district so a lot of times you'll see a kid ... If you were elementary school teacher you had then so I think you care about those kids as a result because they're not just another random face in the crowd. Did you feel you had any advantages? I mean I think some of the advantages were certainly that, and I was a shy person, but I could talk to people. I wasn't afraid to talk to a teacher because one, I had known everybody in my class since kindergarten, it's the same people. So it was no big deal to get up in front of those people and say something or ask a teacher a question because you knew everyone. So in college, I think that even though I clearly didn't know everybody in my class there I was like, "Well, we got to go talk to the teacher. We've got to ask them the question, we've got to ask the professor a question. This wasn't such a big deal." Which can be the advantage because then once I became a professor I knew if a student makes the effort to come talk to you out of a hundred kids you might get two, I'm probably going to look on them a little bit more favorably when it comes to grading time. Just because they tried, right? They made the effort. A lot of kids don't. I think that is really an advantage, right? To kind of learn that, not be afraid of those people in front of the classroom. So what barriers do you guys perceive you had to getting higher education being in a rural school? I didn't know about a lot of things going in freshman year. Just like the courses you can take, all the places that you could apply. It was kind of like a cookie cutter path because it's such a small school they can't offer all of these advanced classes. So when you go to a big school you can just pick between all of these AP courses. For us, even freshman year we knew we were going to take AP world at some point and AP calculus at some point and that just in between you got to pick your electives. I think also, I mean not to hate on our school. Clearly we had a great academic experience at our school, but in a place that small the measure of success for a school is everybody graduating. That's what they want. They want to push kids through. They want everybody to graduate, which is a good goal. You do want kids to graduate. That's important and for everybody to have a high school diploma, but because of that when it's set up it's set up with the goal of everybody graduating. The goal is not, "We want all of these kids to go to crazy academic institutions." Or anything like that and so when you're setting up your school system for that middle of the road section of your class, then sometimes the top portion has never pushed hard enough. Right from day one it was never, "How are we going to get you into college? How are you going to do this? How are we going to do that?" It was just, "Okay, these are the classes you have to take to graduate." And I mean, granted, nothing against our school. We had great counselors, academic advisors, but it was hard where we only have two AP courses. I felt that the staff definitely helped me and it was a personalized learning experience, but sometimes I felt like, "Why can't you help me more?" I feel so bad because our counselor's the nicest lady ever. She's so nice. She was so sweet to us, but I remember standing in a hallway with her and her saying, "I don't think we're going to have room to put you in this college level government class." And me, because it's saved for the people who are trying to do the early college through the community college and me literally looking at her and being like, "I will bring my own chair and sit in the back every day." Now how's that for overcoming barriers? Another perceived barrier that we have to deal with in rural communities comes in the form of diversity. So where it's not diverse culturally, it's very diverse in the sense of living situations or incomes. It's not everybody who lives a life similar to me, it's here. I feel like people live so many different ... If I went to a big school I would find my niche group and I would hang out with probably people who are similar to me and have similar beliefs than me. Here I sit at my lunch table and every person around that table has a different living situation, different to political view and stuff and we just fight it. It's so fun because it's interesting if they can learn from them and stuff. So even though culturally we're all very similar, I think that sometimes you lose that view that's important with income and everything. I'm sitting here and in my community, I'm a pretty average run of the mill normal living situation, normal everything but from their perspective I'm being recruited by the minority and low income and I'm like, "Huh, that just feels kind of odd that if I go outside of my community I'm in such a different place than they are as compared to all the people I know." And that's just kind of a weird identity thing. I never thought that I will be putting low income as something that my identity as they're trying to recruit me and I'm like, "This feels weird. This feels weird. And you're comparing yourself to ... Yeah, and I have to compare myself to a whole different group of people, different groups of students. In Boyne City it's a normal place, but anywhere else where you have to go you're ... The whole environment just makes you reconsider. I've never felt bad about myself in Boyne and I still don't feel bad about myself going up there because it's I love Boyne, I always have this to come back to, but it's just weird. I mean from the rural standpoint, I feel like the same as you. I'm going out and we're competing against students who have been taking prep classes all four years. I went out last summer for a camp at Brown and all the girls in my dorm, I told them that I worked during the school year and they were just amazed. They're like, "How do you have time with that? Don't you take prep stuff after school?" And I'm like, "No. Then how are you here?" And I'm like, "Ooh, okay. I wonder ..." This is a story I always tell and I'm not like a redneck by any means in any way, but I went out there and I had six girls with me, totally different backgrounds. One was from London, Shanghai, Sudan, all of these places. And we were all just hanging out and talking about TV or something. And I went ... We had a 12 pack of water wrapped in plastic and it took out a Swiss army knife, a little tiny Swiss army knife and cut it open, and they all went silent. They were like, "What is that?" And I'm like, "This isn't a Swiss army knife." And they were like, "Why do you have a knife?" And they were horrified. And I'm like, "I'm cutting open water. The blade is like- It's a tool. It's a tool. It has tweezers. What are you talking about? They were wary of me. They're like, "Why do you have a knife?" And I'm like, "Because I do. Because I have to cut things. Why are you ..." It was just so weird. Just like, "I'm going to go out there and be such a redneck." [crosstalk 00:18:42]. You will always be the girl who had a knife. That's right. They were so afraid of me. So what things are you very prepared for from your rural school experience? Actively seeking out help. That is going to be huge because I mean I was taking these classes and I was the only sophomore high school student in the class full of college students and I'm like, "Oh, this is horrifying and scary. I'm so out of my element." I know the second I go off to school I'm going be like, "This is horrifying and scary. I'm out of my element." Well, I've done it before. So it'll kind of give you the little prep, a little boost like, "Oh, well maybe if to do some extra research. Find the professor who knows what they're talking about and talk to them after hours." Because we can text some of our teachers. Yeah, that's definitely helped me. Just being able to know how to build a relationship with my teachers and be able to know how to ask for help and get help and stuff because everybody I've talked to is like, "The first year I was just stubborn. Didn't get help from my professors and that caused me to fail classes and I was just going in expecting my professors are going to know my name. I'm going to have their cell phone number, any problems I have they need to help me." Bake them cookies. Yeah. I was going to be best friends with my professor because that's just how it's been at Boyne. We'd go camping with some of my teachers at the end of the year and ... And also the concept of personalized learning. Like getting to know, I know all of my teachers so well at this point. And then yes. So my senior year, I don't really have many options to take advanced courses, but because of that it's like, "Oh, I know for example, like Mr. Pantone really well, he understands my learning process." So I did an independent study with him where I could dive so much deeper into something outside of the normal curriculum bubble, but still advanced me for college in the future and just being able to, I don't know, have a personalized learning schedule and have teachers and staff that were invested in that. If you said, "I wanted to do this." Yeah, there were definitely some hiccups, but they were willing to help you. It wasn't just ... You knew them so much better. And I remember at graduation I looked at all of my teachers and I started crying because I was so, so grateful for what they had prepared me for and how they'd gotten me to this point. I think I couldn't have imagined anything better. Being a rural student means that the hill success might not be as tall, but it's very steep. You need people around you to help you along the way. Being a rural teacher means that you don't have quite as many students to work with, but the amount of effort you have to put in because of your limited resources makes up for that lack of numbers. One of those quality over quantity teachers is Mr. Pantone. Anna has already mentioned him, but all three ladies mentioned him over, and over, and over again throughout the course of my interview. Mr. Pantone's job at Boyne was tough and it's only gotten harder as the political and social climate in rural America has changed, but when I asked him why he does what he does, he had this to tell me. What I love about it is what I consider to be results. I think kids come out of my classroom with an appreciation for the importance of thinking for themselves, for problem solving, for questioning everything. Instead of a long list of classrooms rules I have one rule and number one rule is I'm allowed to ask you to think. But it is an energizing profession and it is different every single day. When you're dealing with over a hundred different students on a daily basis, there's a ton of stories and ton of personalities and all the rest of it. But most importantly, every day you can walk out of here and say you accomplished something and I don't think a lot of jobs are like that. I can look up the numbers, but we're well over 50% free and reduced lunch here and that's shocking in a community that half or more of the families need assistance just to feed their kids. It's, again, sometimes pretty evident and that brings with had all kinds of different issues. Right? Just on a day to day basis. When I taught in the alternative school, first in Bel Air and then in Charlevoix I brought food to cook every day, because after about a week of being there these kids weren't eating. They didn't have any food. I had three kids in my Bel Air school that lived in a trailer, abandoned trailer on State Park Land that they had left, you know, they were 15, 16 years old and they weren't welcome in their homes or whatever. Didn't have one. So they got together and they found this trailer and they were living in it. So every day for several years, I cooked breakfast. Every morning I'd pick up a dozen eggs and some bacon or whatever, pancakes. We had different things and started our school day just cooking and eating and what was called breakfast table and we'd just sit and talk, but I didn't see how they could get through a day without some food so I always keep food here. You broke down a huge barrier with that. If you feed people, it means the great unifier. Yeah. I hadn't thought of it in that way, but in retrospect I'm sure that that was a big part of it. For me, it was a simple matter. These kids aren't going to be able to get through the day, you know? But what would you talk about at breakfast table? Oh, lot of stuff that we shouldn't. Stuff that they were doing and I would always just in a mad judgmental way try to get them to talk about how they were living their lives and they would use it as like, "Let's see if we can shock Mr. P." That kind of stuff but for me it was an opportunity for them to listen to themselves and to listen to some of the challenges that their friends brought with them. So there was this common sense that I refused to normalize and in a sense that I would say, "That can't be you. That can't be you. That somehow that can't end up being you." I don't even remember the question you asked me about breakfast table, but you're making me think about things I haven't thought about in a while, you know? I'm doing my job then. Okay, good. I'm allowed to ask you think. Yeah, no. My wife said, "What are you going to talk about?" I said, "I don't have the least idea." She just wants to say about rural education and this is part of it. The meth, it's part of it. The prison population is part of it. The mixed and multiple families, combinations of five or six blends of kids living under the same roof with sometimes with neither of their biological parents. You know? That a woman and a man had a child and then the husband was taken away or whatever and so the mother remarries and then she takes off and the kid stays with the dad and his new wife because the mom's gone. You have these incredible combinations of families and they're families, but the standard two parents stable two jobs, that's the exception. Mr. Pantone has had so many things come his way over the course of his teaching career. Many of the hardest parts of his job circulate around an under-resourced, undereducated community that has a hard time accepting outside ideas and innovations. It makes the job of a progressive, empathetic, hardworking, and caring individual like Mr. Pantone harder than you'd expect. So I asked him why, why does he keep doing what he's doing? So my report card comes the day the seniors graduate and they're all allowed to sit and write a letter to a teacher, and this was this year's letters to me. Making me think and treating all of your students as adults. This is why they want to thank me. Your classes have prepared me for my future and I can't imagine where I'd be without you making me question my thoughts and motives. I know that I didn't participate a lot in class, but I was always interested. You're an awesome teacher. Don't let anyone hold you back. This is my report card. My last thank you had to go to you. You're the first teacher I've ever had to treat us like students ... Treat us less like students and more like people. You will never understand how much I appreciated that. You showed us real issues, real problems, real things that no other teachers were brave enough to show us. Your classes shaped me into a person I am proud to be. This is my report card and this is why I come back. Because if I don't do this, who's doing it? These kids deserve a chance to do this, to think and to question stuff and I don't mind saying that I am willing to take the heat so that they can have that. This letter this girl wrote me, woman wrote me the other day was like, and she's [inaudible 00:29:41] really strong, strict Christian, very anti-abortion, lots of things that if it would come up to me and her having a discussion, we would disagree about. All she could do is praise me for tolerating opinions, for defending her right to express herself, for not letting kids ridicule her for her Christianity. All this stuff. This is me. I'm the stupid, crazy Liberal, you know? And we could have answered this question a long time ago. Why do I do this? Because it's important to these kids and they matter and they should matter to this community. There's one last bit of information I need to express to you before we go, and it's logistical in nature. So let's let the school district expert let you in on it. Well, I mean, I think the biggest issue with schools everywhere, including rural America is funding. And from the political end of things, I mean that's where the money comes from right? From the state and it comes with the kids but when you're a small school, I mean you recruit the hell of it to try to get kids to come to your district, but the dollars follow the kids. So unless you can get kids in, you don't have money. Well, then you end up cutting teacher positions or you cut programs like art music to try to make ends meet, and the state is currently very sort of back and forth. Governor Snyder said, "Hey, I want to give all this money back to schools and increase that per pupil amount for this upcoming school year." Which is great, except it means we're pretty much just back to where we were 15 years ago before things got cut. So it looks like this great increase but in reality it's just back to where it was. I'm highlighting what Dr. Ellison said because it gets to the heart of helping rural people thrive, other people. To be funded, school districts need students. To keep students, schools need strong, excited teachers to help them learn. People like Mr. Pontoni. People like Mr. Pontoni need people to support him in his work and it then goes back to students. He needs students to have a job. It's the great Mandela. In rural communities there is tremendous need, but there's also tremendous opportunity. There are barriers to overcome, but by overcoming these obstacles, students can create for themselves a skill set that will set them up for life. The takeaway is this, empowered people have to come back to these rural areas and empower the next generation. Set an example for how to hurdle over those barriers and make a difference in the lives of the people that live there. If a few teachers can make big of an impact on 30 high achieving students and those 30 high achieving students can pull the average of 94 students way, way up, and if one teacher can encourage and empower a few students enough to set them on the path towards the top universities in the world, imagine what you can do. Thank you so much for listening to our podcast. As always, we need to thank Dr. Wendling for empowering medical students to going on and pursue a career in rural medicine. I also want to thank Anna, Katie, Maddie, Dr. Catherine Ellison, and Mr. Pontoni for taking the time this summer to speak to me. I hope that this podcast helped you realize what's needed to help bring up the status quo of all rural communities and that you feel empowered to make rural your mission.

Day: 011 Date: Saturday, Jan. 11, 2020 Note from Aimee J.:  Don’t Stop!! And if you stopped, try again. You can do this. Topic: Be Persistent Action: No time to stop now. Keep pushing and making strides towards the projects, goals, work you are doing. When the going gets tough that’s when we need to dig even deeper to keep chasing. Tough can be anything from being tired to facing a challenge or an obstacle. Don’t stop now. Be persistent! Affirmations: You are Awesome. You are Loved. You are Needed. And most importantly, YOU ARE ENOUGH. Resources & Links: Your Personal Hype Man ; Alexa Skill: Your Personal Hype Man ; Your Personal Hype Man on iTunes Let’s Connect: Leave a Voicemail ; E-mail Aimee J. ; Aimee on Instagram ; Aimee on Facebook ; Aimee on Twitter ; Aimee on YouTube ; Aimee on LinkedIn ; Aimee on TikTok ; Aimee on Snapchat ; Aimee on Pinterest ; Transcript: Hey fam, it's your girl, Aimee J., Your personal hype man and friend here today to check on how you're doing. What's going on? It's Saturday, January 11, 2020 another day. Another day, officially double digits, right? Cause we got past the 10th, announced the 11th double digits of the January double digits of the year, double digits of the decade. Um, how's that whole new year? New me thing and going right. How's that? I'm not, I'm not a big fan of the new year. New me. Cause there's nothing wrong with who you were. There's nothing wrong with who you were. You don't have to be a new me. Right? Just keep on working with who you are. That's the whole point of this podcast. That's the whole point of me being your friend and your hype man is remind you there is nothing wrong with who you are. So I'm not a big fan of the whole new year, new me. Let's just talk about you take out the new me. How are you doing? How are the things you wanted to get accomplished this year coming along. So there's two ways to look at Saturday and Sunday. I'm not talking to those of you who are already working on a day jobs or night jobs or whatever the case you guys are busy as is. But for those of you who work through the week work week, the typical work week, and usually have a Saturday and Sunday off, there are two ways to look at the weekend. The weekend could be a, your time to relax, well deserved, earned. You got it. You, you own that. Or it's a chance for you to catch up on the things you need to get done. It's time for you to, it's extra time to get work done on your dreams, right? So here's where typically happens. It's 21 days to make a habit, research shows, and around this halfway point, people start sliding. We start sliding. So I want to check in, I want to check in, think of it as Saturday support on Saturday support. We're checking in how, how's it going? Right? You guys wrote down, hopefully your goals for the year and hopefully they weren't just, uh, goals that you tend to write every year and then, you know, forget about or, or lose or just kind of falls by the wayside. But hopefully they were goals that were more of an emotional kinds, like instead of lose weight, get healthy, right? What's the reason behind the goal you choose? So let's look, let's reevaluate what you've written down. Look at what you've done so far, and if you've stopped, if you've faltered, if you've skidded or slid off and you've kind of missed something, now is the time to regroup. It's never too late. It's never too late. So get back on the horse, get back in the car, keep driving, keep going. Keep pushing. Be persistent, right? Being persistent is to keep on pushing even that extra mile. And right now because you're tired because you're feeling like skidding or stopping or, or giving up, that's when it's most important to be persistent. And you can do it. You absolutely can do it. I have no doubt. I have no doubt. And if you have doubts yourself, come see me, reach out to me. Let's talk about that because you can do it. Every single one of my listeners, every single one of you who support me, I support you and I'm telling you, I know you can do it. I got, I got a thing for this. You could ask my friends. I got a thing for this. You can do it, but here's the thing, because I'm your personal hype man. I'm always going to believe in you, but I can't believe for you. You guys have to believe. You have to dig down deep. I can't do that work for you. You guys have to be the ones to dig deep and do the work and this is your chance. Get back on that horse. Keep going. Whatever it is. If your goal is to be healthy, not lose weight, be healthy, let's get it straight. Then you know, go for a five minute walk. If you, for whatever reason you can't walk, go for a swim, go for a bike ride, right? Do some sit-ups, do some pushups, find a trainer, go see your doctor. There are steps to be taken. You don't have to just quit because you hit a wall. If you hit a wall, you get back, you're in, you're down on the ground. It's time to get back up and see what you can do. Show the world, show yourself, show everybody what you can do. Because once you let yourself loose, amazing things are going to happen. No doubt, no doubt. So guys, I want you to be persistent. Keep at whatever your goals are, right? I'm not concerned with, I want you to reach your goals. Don't, let's not get it twisted. I want you to reach your goals. But the most important part of setting goals is the journey. And it's the journey and commitment you put in and the work you do by being persistent, that's going to get you there, right? So when you're tired and you're, you're exhausted, you know, I just can't. I can't do it. You come home at the end of the day, your tired, exhausted. You can't do it. I need you to do it. Dig down deep here, my voice cheering you on because you can do it. You can do it. By the time you get through it, you're going to look back like, man, you're going to be proud of yourself. Absolutely. You're going to be proud of yourself. So dig deep and keep going. All right? Don't stop. You've got to keep chasing whatever it is. So that's what I mean by being persistent. So today, whether you are relaxing and you've earned it and you want to do that, that's fine. But if you can take the chance to keep working on something for yourself. Now let's be clear. There's a time and place for rest. We all need it, especially those who are chasing dreams. We need to recover. We need to recuperate. That's how we operate best. But if you can afford a half hour, an hour to chase your dreams, do one little thing towards it. Do that. Be persistent. All right? And as always, guys remember, you are awesome. You are loved, you are needed. And most importantly, I can never stress this enough. You are enough as you are. Period. Okay? So until next time, tomorrow when we check in again, don't...remember, Don't stop. Keep chasing.

Business isn't always going to be smooth-sailing -- a fact that is known by every successful entrepreneur. In this podcast, Nate Woodbury shares with us several helpful tips that can help you save a failing business. Stay tuned! How do you stop a failing business? All right, I've got a successful business, but I've had many fails. And my first eight years -- eight and a half years -- have been a financial rollercoaster. And I switched directions and so I've had many failures along the way. So, how do you stop that, and how do you actually achieve success? Because I fill in there now, I can share some of my secrets with you. So, when you know your business isn't succeeding or isn't succeeding like you want it to, you've got to be objective and separate yourself emotionally from it. Okay, you've got to be objective and just look at it logically and find out what is going wrong. Because in order for you to fix it, you've got to know what's going wrong. I mean, maybe you need a second pair of eyes to come and look at your business and help you figure out what is going wrong. The next thing I want to recommend is to create systems. And if you haven't read or listened to the book, "The E-Myth Revisited" by Michael Gerber-- So, the E-myth Revisited. Man, that is a must-read, and that has a good chance of saving your business from failure. Systems mean that instead of me wearing all the hats and just being an employee and being self-employed wearing all the different jobs in my company, that I systematize my business. That I create a system and hire somebody to run that system or create a program to run that system or hire this person. And so, I'm systematizing my business. This allows me to work on my business continually making improvements and making it better and ensure that it will succeed and grow and be profitable instead of just working in my business --being a slave to it. Another way to look at this is if you're working as the technician instead of as the owner. All right? I mean, think about McDonald's. Like, a McDonald's is a very successful business franchise. Do you ever see the owner? I mean the owner of that location? No. You see the high school students. You see the manager, perhaps? They're the employees that are hired to run that system. And so that's one reason that you might be feeling is if you are the dishwasher, if you are the cook, you're working as the technician, not as the owner. Okay, this is one that I have struggled with. And I've made improvements in and want to continue improving. And that's that I try and sell what I want instead of what my customers are asking for. Because in some cases, I feel like I know better. I know what they need, so I sell them what they need. Okay? I've learned that they know what they want. And they're not going to buy what they don't want. So, I need to sell what they want and if I can also provide them what they need. And you can do that through education, right? So, if you sell them what they want and educate them on what they need, for so long, I did struggle because I only would-- I was only willing to sell them what they needed, but they didn't know that they needed it, right? Okay, another piece of advice, and it's kind of hard because we live in a world with lots of shiny objects. I would focus on one thing at a time. Just focus on one step at a time. So, you've got this big idea. You've got this big launch campaign and all these things that you want to set up. This big sales funnel, these websites, the marketing videos that YouTube channels social media. Wow! Right? Just focus on one thing at a time. And focus on the most important thing like what's going to bring in revenue today? Is this Facebook campaign cool? Is it going to be great long term? But is it going to bring me revenue right now? I've got to focus on bringing in revenue right now before I can go there. Does that make sense? Maybe let me say it this way. Just don't over complicate things. And we can make our businesses way too complicated. If we just take a step back and simplify. Okay, this is advice that I wish I would have given myself. And I knew better but I got a business loan. I had already been in business. But I got a business loan so that I could invest in marketing. And I thought that marketing was going to help me scale. It didn't work. I didn't have proper sales funnels in place so that all that marketing money just was wasted. Yeah, that was-- that was a lesson learned. Don't go into debt. Don't go into debt for your business. It's so easy to start a company and be an entrepreneur and create a very successful, profitable business with zero money in the beginning. Okay. And I guess I had another point here talking about shiny objects. I wrote, "Filter shiny objects that don't really lead to direct results." There's a lot of shiny objects out there. Different programs, different campaigns, different tools, different gadgets that are awesome. Like I still don't own a drone. I wanted a drone ever since they became popular. But I don't know how I'm going to use a drone to actually make revenue for my business. I could get it and write it off because we do so much filming. And I have all these desires of getting a drone. Maybe I can justify it. But the moral of this story is, just filter the shiny objects that don't lead to direct revenue if you want to save your company. Alright. How consistent are your sales? If you don't have consistent sales, then your great risk of failure. You've got to have revenue coming in. You've got to always have new clients coming in, or you're at risk of failure. Okay, that's an all stage. Is that a place to me that a place to the beginner. So, look at consistency. Be honest with yourself about how consistent your new customers are coming in. Okay, this next one was one that I am very good at. I really have tenacity at making a mistake and picking myself up and learning from it and moving on. So, I feel like I've got a lot of entrepreneurial wisdom, a lot of business wisdom. Because I make a lot of mistakes and I learned from it. So, that's the biggest tip right there if you want to reverse your business from failure and move it towards success. Be open with yourself about mistakes. What mistakes have you made, and what can you learn from each one of them? You know, don't just be hard on yourself and judgmental of yourself. You didn't do it on purpose. What can you learn from every mistake? I want to work this one because it sounds cliche. Like, solve problems. Find a problem that you can solve. But I want to contrast that instead of just creating a product, right? Instead of just creating a service, "Ooh! I can create websites for people." Yeah, people want websites, right? I'll create websites. I'll be a web designer. Well, I want to recommend that you create websites that do something specific that fill a need, fill a void. I look at it in terms of results. When I had a web design company -- right -- we designed over 500 websites. And my clients were happy. They had a pretty brochure that they could show their family and friends. And yet, I knew that their website wasn't getting traffic and they weren't making sales. That's discouraging to me. It's totally discouraging, and that's why I don't have a web design company anymore. There's a longer story than that. But I love results, and I recommend that you create a product or service that you can get them predictable outcomes and results. Okay. Here's one that I've learned through experience. And I'm going to call it to know your value and prove it. All right, I knew the value of my YouTube service, but I didn't have a track record. I didn't have a portfolio in large scale like I was trying to sell. So, I decided to prove it. And it took me 2 or 3 years without making any money. Then I proved it. Then I had a track record, and people would come to me I didn't have to pursue them they would come to me saying, "Hey, do for me what you did for them." So know your value and prove it. Just even if you have to give away your services, give away your product for free, invest in yourself, invest in your portfolio. Prove it. This one would be a hard one for me just the way that I'm wired. But maybe this will work for you. Get a job to remove the financial stress. Maybe, okay? See how that resonates with you? Just think about what would it be like. I mean, yeah, you're going to have less time to work on your company. But if the stress was gone, if the urgency was gone because your bills were paid, would you be able to turn your company around? Here's another cliche one. Okay, set goals and know your why. Why are you in it? You know, so when you get smacked down, you get punched across the face or something and hit some big obstacle or setback or some failure. When you know why, it's easier to get back up. And if you're setting goals and you're making progress towards them. If you don't have goals, then you don't know where you're going. And you don't know if you're making progress. So, you've got to set goals and have a foundational why beneath them. Okay. And lastly, you know, if you're trying to avoid your business from failing, maybe it is time for this business to fail and just to go and start a different one. Now, you know what doesn't work, go start one that will work. Take all this knowledge and go start fresh. I'm not saying that's the right answer. But maybe it is. You would know better than me. Now, with that foundation, the next video that you should watch is what I would do if I were starting a business from scratch. I share all my secrets on how I created my business that I absolutely love and what I would do if I were creating it from scratch again to save me from making mistakes. So, go watch that video next.

Amazon is working diligently to make its Alexa platform even more useful and wow they have really made some great improvements. For more tech tips, news, and updates visit - CraigPeterson.com --- Related Articles: Alexa, Now A Truly Useful Smart Assistant --- Automated Machine-Generated Transcript: Craig 0:08 Hey Craig Peterson here on WGAN and online at Craig Peterson dot com. I'm wasn't sure if I was clear about this. But the main reason I started talking about my password special report in the last segment was that you should change your password right away if you're using any of the Zynga products, but most particularly if you use Words with Friends, because so much data was apparently stolen, and it's a bad thing. Okay, so again, the password special report you can get at Craig Peterson comm slash subscribe, slash subscribe. Alright, so let's get down to this. This is kind of cool. We of course had Apple's big announcements last month, and they announced that brand new, very cool iPhone 11. Now, I would not bother upgrading to it. But man, does it have professional photography features, and you probably aren't aware of this. But the latest beta of iOS 13. That isn't out yet. iOS 13 is out obviously, right? You probably have it, I certainly have it. So iOS 13 is out there. So here's the trick. We were talking about the iOS 13 stuff. They have some new features in this beta, using the iPhone 11th camera, some features that cameras had that were not released yet. So pay attention to that, I think it's going to be kind of cool. So let's talk about 12 new Alexa features to up your Amazon Echo game because Amazon had their big event, which they do. And it is kind of a fall event. It's a couple of weeks after Apple's event. And Amazon as usual, announced a whole bunch of new echo products. Now the Amazon Echo is really kind of owning the industry right now. And a lot of people know what as Alexa. And I have a number of these devices. And I really do like them. But they've got the echo auto, the Echo, the gen three Echo Dot and the echo sub as well as a whole bunch of new hardware. Now I we have the Amazon Echo, I think it's the first generation might be the second and it's got the screen on it, we use it to talk to one of our grandkids who lives out of state so she can call us we can call her. In fact, you can use it to make phone calls as well. But they have a new one called Alexa guard. And this is a feature that makes your Echo listen for window breaks or activated alarms. And if it's triggered, it sends you there's alert and let some listen to a snippet of the sound. I think that is really cool. fact I'm going to try and see what happens if I turn that on. That's something that could run locally on the machine, I'm sure doesn't really have to send it up to the cloud until it's going to send you the little tidbit. So along with a hardware announcements last week, the big question people are asking is what is up next when it comes to Alexa? So Alexa, tell me what you heard. And why did you do that? If you use the Amazon Alexa much, you know, sometimes it doesn't understand what you're saying. And so you have to ask it, tell me what you heard. Now you can, because it'll, it'll play back what it heard. And that actually helps you quite a bit to understand what is going on. Right? So she'll go ahead and share what she heard you say sometimes it it seems like a small addition, but it's going really add a whole bunch of clarity for you. Another one that's going to be very helpful is why did you do that. And that's going to have Alexa, explain why it performed any action at all. So if all of a sudden the music starts to play, you know, or somebody on the radio says Alexa like I have been, and then wakes it up. And then it starts to listen, and then it tries to run a command. You can ask it you can say why did you do that? And she'll tell you, which I think is absolutely fantastic. Now they've got a new feature that is really going to help you this is an auto delete. A lot of us have been worried about the voice recordings that she keeps. And you can tell Alexa now to delete voice recordings every three or 18 months. And you can also tell her to delete what you just said or delete everything that you have said. So it that makes it really easy. So just say bye, delete what I just said, or delete everything I've said today. And you have to go into the Alexa app in order to turn on these wider ranging deletion of recordings. Now remember, she's not listening all of the balance sheet, she's not transmitting everything that she hears all of the time up to the cloud, she's not recording that she's listening for her way cord, of course, you can change it, you can have her wake on the word computer. I think there's another one as well. And so some people do that I you know, I go back and forth on that. But I like the idea that all of those 32nd recordings that she has made when she woke up can be deleted. And that that's a very good thing. Now it's got this whole neural text thing now, and Alexa has echo has Amazon Echo has some really great text to speech technology. I've always been amazed. I use it to even Fang find out spelling for things. So you just ask her, how do you spell this, and she'll spell it for you. And she's she's created that right. But she also understands other languages. So you can tell her to translate French, Spanish, Hindi, and other languages now. And this, this text to speech features been improved. So it's considered to be more emotive and expressive. And it sounds better. I don't know if you've noticed or not. And beginning a little later this year, Amazon's going to be rolling out some celebrity voices for Alexa. And this is kind of cool. They're going to be based on limited recordings with a celebrity. So unlike the basic voice that it comes with, where they spend a lot of time recording just about every word that Alexa might need to say. They just basing it on a few limited ones. Now think about what we've talked about. And I've talked with Ken and Matt about a lot of that has to do with these, these deep fakes. So they're going to basically be using deep fake technology. They've got Samuel Jackson, he's the first one that's going to be released, I think that might be actually kind of funny. The guy is hilarious, sometimes. But they're going to be releasing those that'll be the first celebrity voice. And we're going to see how it works. I call it neural text to speech. It's got frustration detection now, which I think is a huge, huge win. We've seen frustration detection and some of these voice systems where you call into a company, and it talks to you and says, describe your problem until you describe your problem. And so those have been detecting frustration stress in the voice. And sometimes they'll just if you're yelling headed, it'll go ahead and transfer you to a real operator. In this case, what's going to happen if if the Alexa sense is some frustration in your voice. It's going to apologize and attempt to clarify what it is you really want and recover and learn from that. Which is ultimately going to be really good again, that's kind of a machine learning thing. They're also helping you with cooking now I've noticed that on the echo because it it has on its display. Learn how to boil water. Well. Okay, well, not that bad. Pretty darn close. Right? How do they even had one how to make toast? Are you kidding me? Right? Just some crazy things. I knew something was in the works, knew something was cooking our well it turns out, they're going to be able to help us as cook meals via a Food Network collaboration. And customers are going to be able to access recipes, take cooking classes on the echo devices and you can buy these at Amazon. And it's going to come with commands like Alexa, show cooking classes from Bobby Flay, or Alexa, how many chicken thighs Was I supposed to use Alexa, save that recipe. I use Alexa also for my shopping list at the grocery store. It's got some other things too smart screen software development kit, Alexa communications for kids. It has free time, Wi Fi control hunches. This is a new feature that they're finally releasing here until the Alexa guard upgrades as well. Well when we get back our last last section for today's segment, we talked a little bit about Apple Maps a father identity theft, and a vengeful IT admin. We were going to start with that one. So stick around. You're listening to Craig Peterson on WGAN and online at Craig peterson.com. Stick around because we'll be right back with lots more great information. Transcribed by https://otter.ai  --- More stories and tech updates at: www.craigpeterson.com Don't miss an episode from Craig. Subscribe and give us a rating: www.craigpeterson.com/itunes Follow me on Twitter for the latest in tech at: www.twitter.com/craigpeterson For questions, call or text: 855-385-5553

Today is the start of a multiple part series on social security. We'll be discussing topics such as the state of the fund and reforms that are aimed to help the program and more, so tune in and catch up on social security.Helpful Information:PFG Website: https://www.pfgprivatewealth.com/Contact: 813-286-7776Email: info@pfgprivatewealth.com----more----Transcript of today's show:Mark: Hey gang, welcome into another edition of retirement planning redefined with the boys from PFG Private Wealth Financial Advisors, John and Nick, once again here on the program with me as we talk about investing, finance and retirement. Always go to the website and check them out at pfgprivatewealth.com that is pfgprivatewealth.com. While you're there, subscribe to the podcast. Give us a like and check us out and all that good stuff. Subscribe to it for past episodes as well as future episodes. And of course anytime you hear anything, you've got a question or concern, give them a call before you take any action. 813-286-7776 is the number to call. If you hear a useful nugget of information and you want to learn more, again, reach out to them at (813)-286-7776. Guys, I hope you're doing well this week. Nick, what's going on man?Nick: Yeah, we're doing well. Staying busy for sure. Today what we wanted to do is kick off a multi session on social security.Mark: Okay. Cool.Nick: And we just want to let everybody know. We know that some of the people that'll be listening to this will have become familiar with us through either the more comprehensive classes that we put on around town or via a financial wellness workshop. And social security has been one of the hot topics for a long time and it continues to be as it is more in the news with the different pressures and some of the funding issues and those sorts of things. And then obviously with everybody, so many people and so many baby boomers getting closer to retirement, although we will be getting into it fairly comprehensively in this session, we just wanted to make sure that everybody knew that if they were interested in having us come in, whether it's some sort of association or an employer based kind of program, we like to do the lunch and learns or some sort of financial wellness workshop.Nick: And we've got about a 50 minute session that we'll do on social security. And from the feedback that we've gotten, it's been one of the most positively embraced sessions that we've done. So we just want to let people know that if they wanted a more comprehensive overview on this or they thought it might be beneficial for their employer or fellow employees or coworkers, that that's something that's available.Mark: Awesome. Yeah. When we get into that we'll have this multi-part series on the podcast regarding social security. And again, as Nick mentioned, if you want to talk with them, (813)-286-7776, (813)-286-7776.Mark: John, how are you man? You doing all right?John: I'm doing great. How are you doing?Mark: I'm doing very well. Thank you for asking. And you know, Nick got us all set up there for the conversation. So what do you say we dive into it? How does it work? I mean, what's the crux of the whole social security situation here we're looking at?Nick: Most people are obviously familiar with the fact that they are eligible for social security and they pay into the system, but not a lot of people are familiar with how it all works and ties together. We always like to start off in explaining people how the program is funded. A lot of people have seen on their pay stub where it might say FICA and they're not really quite sure what that is. But out of that 7.62 that comes out of your paycheck for those FICA tax is 6.2% of that is for social security. And one of the things that we have found over the years is that many people are not familiar with the fact that the employer also pays in 6.2%. Some people have this idea that the program is fully funded by the government and really it's fully funded by them and their employer.Nick: Letting them know that about 12.5% of their income each year is going into the program towards them is something that is important for them to understand. And for some of the higher income earners, they may have noticed at a certain point of the year that their paycheck gets a little bit bigger. And usually that's because payroll tax is capped, so people no longer pay in on earnings over ... In 2019 on earnings over $132,900. And as we talk a little bit about some of the things that'll change over time with the program, one of the things that's in the news the most is that cap and removing that cap so that it's similar to Medicare where people will pay on, no matter what their earnings are, they will continue to pay into the system.John: That cap's actually been going up aggressively. You know, I think a few years ago it was $112 Nick, and I think now they've jumped it up to one $132.Nick: Yeah, yeah. They've definitely been indexing it up faster than inflation, that's for sure.Mark: Yeah. And depending on what happens in the elections coming up next year, you know, depending on who gets in, there's conversations that that 6.2 could be raised as well. So if you're still working, so that could go up substantially as well.Mark: How much can somebody expect guys? I imagine that's a big question that always comes up is, what are we looking at? I know you can get your estimates, obviously, from the website. They don't even send those little papers out anymore I don't think. They used to send them out every year, then it went to every five years. I'm not sure if they even still do that.John: They do occasionally, and I'm not sure the exact how often, but I know that from our classes we're starting to have guests say, yeah they're getting the statements. But it's based off of your earnings record. And one thing that's important to understand, it's actually your highest 35 years. So a lot of people when I first started working, I think the first year I was 18 I made like $12,000.Mark: That's pretty good for 18.John: You're [crosstalk 00:05:20]. Yeah, exactly. Your highest earning years are really later in life, once you hit your 50s and 60s. So that's important to understand if someone's thinking about retiring early to make sure that they look on the statement and see, Hey, what years do I have that are significant in here? Because if I stop working my last seven years, you know the benefit that I'm seeing on my statement's actually going to be less.John: Because when you get your statement, what it shows if you continue to work up until that age, not if you stopped. So that's important. Another thing we tell our clients and anyone that comes to our classes is to make sure that you look at it, see if there's any zeros in there. Because if you do have zeros in your highest 35 that will actually bring down your benefit and that's something you may want to consider maybe working a couple of extra years to make sure that you maximize your social security retirement benefit as best you can.John: And you're right, you can go on social security.gov and pull up your statement. They'll ask you a lot of funny questions. What was the color of your first car? Most likely most people get locked out unfortunately, but it's good to go check it out if you haven't done that in awhile.Nick: Yeah. Another thing to just make sure that people know from the standpoint of those highest 35 years is that's in relation to the cap. And so you know that cap that we mentioned earlier, that $132,900, it's in relation to that. Just because there may have been a period of time, we've seen it in some circumstances, where maybe somebody took some time off to stay home with the kids and then they're returning to work and before they took time off they were making a higher income. And although, from a pure dollar standpoint they may be making more dollars now as in relation to the cap, that may not necessarily be the case.Nick: That highest 35 earning years is in relation to that cap. And with how social security date change the mailing out of the [inaudible 00:07:04] and that sort of thing, we absolutely recommend that people, although it can be a little bit of a pain from the process, to really get logged into the site, make sure they understand how to access that statement, make sure they understand how to read that statement. Especially from the standpoint of people that we have that are self employed. We have them double check their statements to make sure that their income is being correctly recorded because they may be paying in their self employment tax, which is essentially payroll tax. Making sure that that's recorded properly so they're going to get the benefits that they're entitled to down the road.Mark: Yeah. Now guys, I've heard through the years that if you see those zeros on there like John mentioned that that's not really on the social security to fix that. That falls back on you in trying to follow up possibly with past and employers. Like if you know you earned something in a given year and you're seeing a zero, is that still how it is? Is that the way that it goes? Do you need to talk with the social security office about that or do you need to track down that past employer?John: You do need to reach out to them and Nick's, I believe, grandfather did that and Nick can share that story.Mark: Oh, all right.Nick: And this was years ago, so I don't know any details on it, but my grandfather was from Cuba and so he had a natural distrust for the government. And when he was a professor at the University of Rochester and when he went to retire and file for social security, he did not agree with the amount. And due to his non-trusting nature, he happened to have every pay stub that he ever had in the basement. And so he was able to figure that out. Luckily now we have things that are more electronic and we do have people try to keep some sort of record and haven't had anybody recently deal with that in any sort of deeper way.Mark: That's good.Nick: But usually a tax return will help. And tax returns are one of the things that we have people ... We've got a portal for clients and we have them upload those tax returns so that they can be a really good resource down the road in case there's any issues.Mark: Well that's cool. Yeah. I mean I'm 48 and I think about myself and I think God, if I had to go back and figure out who I worked for when I was 20 and what they owed me or whatever, or what I paid in, I don't know where I'd start. So that was awesome that your grandfather actually kept all that stuff. Because I know that for a lot of people that would be definitely a challenge. But that's just something I thought about and I wanted to bring that up and get your guys' opinion on that.Mark: So if you're talking about things that are really important to people, obviously a big question for boomers, and I'm sure you get this at the wellness events that you do and just in general is the constant question of the health of the fund. Is it going to be around?John: Yeah, that is a 100% the main question we get at the workshops and also when we're doing planning for clients. But as it states today there's actually a surplus and the fund is actually growing. There's roughly $2.9 trillion in it and when you say trillion it doesn't really in reality mean much, we have no idea what that actually equates to.Mark: It sounds like a lot.John: [crosstalk 00:09:56] Surplus, it is a lot. But the surplus is about $3 billion a year between money that's coming into it through the payroll taxes and also the interest earned on the balance. Just to kind of give some people some numbers because they're always asking. In 2023, 2024 that surplus actually will stop. So it's actually going to be going into a deficit and then in 2034 the fund's basically exhausted and then it's just going to be paid through basically money coming in through payroll taxes and then the money's going to come out. An then in 2034 when that happens, based on the numbers, the estimates, is looking like there's going to be a 21% reduction of benefits. So you're going to get 79% of the benefit owed to you. And again, that's if no changes happen, which we'll we're going to go into shortly. Nick will start it up where we're talking about some of the reforms that already have been happening and that will continue to happen.Nick: And we do tend to ... Some of these will probably be repeated throughout the series about social security. And earlier I mentioned the increase in max earnings, removing that cap. That's probably one of the lowest hanging fruit from the standpoint of people getting on board with making higher income earners continue to pay into the system. Right now, the earliest retirement age that somebody can collect benefits from is 62. So that's an age, especially with the longevity of people's lives and people just living longer overall, that 62 will probably start to increase. I'm sure people will be grandfathered in at a certain age or certain, your worth and before it will be grandfathered in, but-Mark: It seems like that's a really-Nick: John and I suspect that our-Mark: Yeah, that seems like the easiest one too for a lot of things. Right? Just push it back for people under a certain age, like 50 and under or something, just push it back.Nick: Yeah. And social security ... The trickiest thing and probably one of the biggest reasons that not much has been done with it is because, frankly politicians are worried about not getting voted back into office, so-Mark: Yeah, it's a political poker chip for sure.Nick: They [inaudible 00:11:53] can down the road and try not to tick people off at least to a certain extent. So raising that initial retirement age from 62 probably upwards of ... They'll probably ease it in, but I wouldn't be surprised if John and I, our initial retirement age is closer to 65 or higher.Nick: They've talked about doing means testing from the standpoint of if people have a certain amount of income on that they wouldn't collect their social security. I think that one will probably be a little bit more difficult because usually that's income focused and honestly there's a lot of ways around that.Nick: But another thing would be that cost of living adjustment, and that's been tinkered with a little bit really over the last decade as inflation stayed low for a little while and interest rates were really low. But that could be something that they adjust. But realistically what we think will be the easiest things to do will be to take up on the payroll tax, potentially have employers put in a slightly larger percentage than the actual employee. It's something that they can do. Increasing that cap or the earning cap or removing the cap in general, and bumping back that initial retirement age, are all things that we think will be a big deal.Nick: The other thing could be the, really the increases, the percentage increases that social security provides for people that defer taking their benefits. So if they wait, any year after full retirement age, there's an 8% increase. And so that's something that'll probably drop as well.Nick: The good news is that this is pretty actuarial and really all you have to do is math to figure it out. It's just going to take people being willing, people being the government, being willing to make the changes.John: Yeah. And they've already, in 2015 they actually closed some of the loopholes which we've been seeing a lot of in planning some strategies that people were using are going away, which helped the program out. They're already doing some things. And the big thing that ... One of the things Nick talked about was the cost of living adjustments. To me that's one of the ones we need to keep an eye on because when we're doing planning, it really helps out the plan when you have some type of guaranteed income that actually goes up with inflation.John: Historically, social security has gone up about 2.6%. It's been low over the last five or six years due to inflation, but that's actually a pretty nice benefit when you look at what you start with at let's say 66 and what you end up with that age 85. It's a big amount. When you look over that 20 year period.Nick: Probably the one people want to fight for the most to maintain from the standpoint of anybody that's likes to be active or have a vested interest in the topic, that cost of living adjustment's really, really important for them.Mark: Absolutely. Well, let's take that point and segue into an offer for you guys. If you're listening and you want a free maximization strategy and the social security guide to anyone who emails in, just email john@pfgprivatewealth.com that's john@pfgprivatewealth.com. Again to get that free maximization strategy and social security guide here on the program.Mark: And I that's going to do it for us this week on the podcast guys. Really good information to start this week, talking about social security here on the show. We're going to continue on, as Nick mentioned earlier on, and do a multi-part series on this next time here on the program. We're going to talk about integrating social security into your retirement plan, making that part of the plan and some things to look for and think about in regards to that.Mark: You've been listening to retirement planning redefined with John and Nick financial advisors at PFG Private Wealth. Again, that's PFG Private Wealth and that you can find them online at pfgprivatewealth.com and subscribe to the podcast while you're there. Don't forget to email John if you'd like to get that social security maximization or give him a call at (813)-286-7776. If you've got some questions about your own social security, get on the horn with them. Come in for a consultation and a conversation. (813)-286-7776. This has been retirement planning redefined for John and Nick. I'm Mark and we'll see you next time.

Lane Kawaoka – Owner of over 2600 rental units, Leader of the Hui Deal Pipeline Club, which has acquired over $155 million of real estate by syndicating over $15 million of private equity since 2016, and Host the Simple Passive Cash Flow podcast, talks to Neil Henderson and Brittany Henderson, the hosts of The Road to Family Freedom podcast. Lane discusses working with turn-key operators, investing in mobile homes, and diversifying with syndications. Read Full Transcript (#) Neil Henderson [0:06] Greetings, friends and families. I’m Neil. And I’m Brittany, you’re listening to the road to family freedom podcast. Our guest this week owns over 2600 rental units and as the leader of the deal pipeline Club, which has acquired over 150 $5 million of real estate by syndicating over $15 million of private equity since 2016. He’s also the host of and he’s also the host of the simple passive cash flow podcast, land Co. Coco, welcome to the road to family freedom. Hey, thanks for having me. Absolutely. So you, you began your investing career in Seattle? Correct when you had a full time job as an engineer? Right. Right. And you were sort of an accidental landlord. You bought your first property as just as your primary residence? Correct. Lane Kawaoka [0:58] Right. So I did not have to take that leap of faith that a lot of people do getting started. Yeah, fell into Neil Henderson [1:03] it. And then you and then you got into buying turnkey properties, correct? Lane Kawaoka [1:09] That’s correct. Okay, started. It started with a couple primary residence or more primary marketplaces and then 1031 for a bunch of turkeys. Gotcha. Brittany Henderson [1:20] Um, can you tell us a little bit about that first property that you bought? Lane Kawaoka [1:25] Yeah, so it’s a my primary residence, it was a class rental in a great area just north of Seattle $350,000 purchase price, which was a lot back then in 2009. It rented for 2200 a month. More p It was 1600. Neil Henderson [1:44] So that was definitely not the definitely not the 1% rule. Lane Kawaoka [1:48] Right. But, I mean, I thought it cash flow, you know? Yeah, a little bit. I know back then. Neil Henderson [1:53] Yeah. And you did you live in that you lived in it first. Lane Kawaoka [2:00] I lived in in for about a year, and then caught up an old landlord and said, Hey, I want to rent this out. Because I just, you know, I think I don’t know how old I was, like, early 20 something year old and kind of living the single life and I was like, let’s crank this out. Let’s make some money. Yeah. Neil Henderson [2:19] What, um, where did you? Did you come in with a 20%? down payment? Or are we able to do like a since you were owner occupied? Did you do like a 3%? down? Lane Kawaoka [2:31] Yeah, I came in with a 20% down payment. So you know, at the time, I was making, like, 80 grand at a college? Yeah. Probably saving a big chunk of that 30 grand starting out every year. But then when I started to read it out. That was really my secret sauce. Right? Just being able to see a lot of money. Putting it all through investments 20% down payments along the way. Neil Henderson [2:53] Gotcha. And where did you live? Once you started reading it out? Where did you live? What was your primary residence then? Lane Kawaoka [3:00] I lived on the company dime. They, it was 100% travel job. So Oh, wow. Just move around from hotel to hotel, on the job. And on the weekends when I wasn’t working, I would kind of work. I mean, there was always work to be done. So just kind of stay in hotels, or no few. I would say like probably five or six times they probably had to get a hotel for myself. Because there was no work to be done. You know? Yeah, yeah. But yeah, and you know, with all the money saved, it was it was kind of worth it. Brittany Henderson [3:37] Yeah. What kinds of lessons did you learn from...

Do you want to accelerate your leadership development?  It starts with gaining self-awareness and leveraging a coaching relationship that adds value and magnifies your results. My guest, Dr. Ellen B. Van Oosten will share critical elements that you need to have in your coaching engagements to amplify your impact and growth.  She will also share the data and science that demonstrates the ROI of coaching as part of your Leadership Development Strategy.  Learn how move across the continuum of telling to inspiring as a leader through coaching. Podcast Transcript: Hi, this is Jill Windelspecht. Welcome back to another episode of Brain Hacks 4 leadership. I'm really excited about today's episode. (jillwindel@talentspecialists.net) I'd love to welcome my guest Ellen B. Van Oosten, PhD, an Associate Professor of Organizational Behavior and Faculty Director of Executive Education at the Weatherhead School of Management, Case Western Reserve University.  Dr. Van Oosten is also Director of the Coaching Research Lab. Her research interests include coaching, leadership development, emotional intelligence, and positive relationships at work.   Directs the Coaching Research Lab, which she co-founded in 2014 with Professors Richard Boyatzis and Melvin Smith Co-Author of Helping People Change: Coaching with Compassion for Lifelong Learning and Growth (available through Harvard Business Review Press in September 2019) 24 years experience as an executive coach Well, Ellen, thank you so much for spending time with us today. Really looking forward to your topic. It's something that's near and dear to my heart, so why don't you introduce the topic. Sure. Thanks so much, Jill. I really am delighted to be with you and your listeners today. The topic that I thought might be of interest to a lot of individuals and organizations is coaching for leadership development and I know you've done a lot of work around that, so tell us what is some of the science that you've applied? Sure. We've known each other for a lot of years and even going back to the early days when we were doing some work together. A lot of my experience over the past 25 years has been in helping organizations develop their leadership talent and that space has been one that I've not only spent time with organizations designing and delivering programs, but served as the bridge to pull together different faculty and instructors to create customized leadership development experiences. Most recently in the last seven years, I've added to that some focus in the space of research and that's what I'm excited to share with you and your listeners. Some of what we're understanding and learning in terms of how coaching can really help. That's great. What I love about what you're doing with yourself and your partners is not just saying coaching works, but measuring it in a very systematic way to demonstrate the benefit. Yeah. That's something we feel really passionate about and are very committed to do at the Weatherhead School of Management. One of the activities that helps us organize ourselves around that and make it a priority is called the Coaching Research Lab. It is a collaborative between industry practitioners and faculty at the Weatherhead School and Organization Behavior and so through the Coaching Research Lab we conduct a number of different studies - including one that I'd be happy to share with you that supports or is interesting to our overall topic of coaching for leadership development. So this study that I'd like to share with you, it started a number of years ago where we had an opportunity to conduct a leadership development program for a financial services firm in the Midwest and this particular organization was interested to break down some silos between various areas of the business and were challenging their senior leaders, the top 300 or so leaders in the organization to collaborate in new and different ways. The way they thought to go about it was to equip the leaders with some new knowledge and some new skills. And through that experience worked with us at the University to design a leadership development program. And as part of it, we included 360 feedback and coaching. So that's the backdrop. So the study looked at two things, primarily does emotional and social intelligence of leaders have any bearing on desired outcomes, and those desired outcomes at the organization level were job performance, which is kind of the gold standard. Very difficult to get that data. But if you can do it, it's really compelling. And then also we looked at some more subjective outcomes including work, engagement, career satisfaction. And then also the extent to which the leader could create a personal vision. So here's what we found through this study. Emotional and social intelligence had a positive direct effect on job performance and also we found that when you add a coaching relationship to the mix, it has an amplification effect on other outcomes including work, engagement and career satisfaction as well as personal vision. So let me unpack those a little bit more. A lot of organizations always want to look at the return on investment for leadership development and that is especially true when we consider what a lot of folks in organizations consider to be soft skills such as emotional and social intelligence. It's just really hard to measure it in a lot of cases. In this program, individuals received 360 feedback on their emotional and social intelligence and the organization was able to provide me access to annual job performance ratings. Those sets of data along with surveys that the individual leaders answered allowed me to triangulate the data so that we could look at the interrelationships between emotional and social intelligence and those competencies and outcomes such as job performance and others. The fact that we're able to show through our analysis that definitely emotional and social competencies led to increased job performance was really important for this particular organization and I think a lot of organizations, but then also what was interesting is when you added a coaching relationship that the individual perceived to be high quality to the mix. It had this incredible effect of amplifying what the leader reported around working engagement, career satisfaction and personal vision. So that's really compelling when you think about the decisions and investments that organizations make to develop their leaders and it was definitely something that this particular organization found very gratifying and helpful to their leadership development. That's great. You said it wasn't just the self awareness around their own emotional and social competency, it was the coaching on top of that, when they saw the coaching is adding value, that amplified their job performance and engagement. Did you find anything specific around the coaching relationship? One or two things that when they were present people saw it as a more beneficial to them. The main thing is that a coaching relationship is really important and has a lot of benefits to the individual and to the organization. So that is really kind of one of the big takeaways from this particular study and the implications of that extend at a number of different levels. For individuals working with a coach that's important to know that the relationship and the connection that they have together in the work that they do together is as important and often a big catalyst for their particular work. So taking some time to think about and maybe get to know your coach to make sure you're working with somebody who for you is a good fit and somebody feel really comfortable with is important. Another would be for professional coaches, but also for internal managers who are seeking to develop their own coaching capabilities, so they can develop their individuals and teams in the organization in expanded ways. This really points to the importance of developing a relationship and being able to have relational skills. And then for organizations who have coaching, either provided through internal coaches or who are hiring external coaches to understand the importance of coaching relationships in the mix. Yeah, that's an important piece. I agree. As a coach myself, I often have chemistry meetings first just to make sure that I'm a good fit for them. They're a good fit for me. And I think that's a really important piece because coaching is really personal, but the outcomes can really be tremendous. Yes, exactly. Yes. And I know, right? Yeah. So Ellen, how have you applied this to yourself? So for me, I'm, since I've been in this space of leadership development work for almost 25 years now, it's really personal and it's personal in a couple of ways, it is validating to the work that so many of us are doing with organizations that we see so many intangible incredible outcomes. Right? Just like you said, so many amazing benefits are often part of the experience and it's hard to measure it. So we see it, we know it, we can speak to stories and stories are definitely powerful. But when an organization needs to commit a couple hundred thousand dollars for a leadership development program, or even just five or $10,000 for coaching for a leader or whatever, the amount that becomes a business decision. And so being able to provide some evidence about the benefits and the value to the organization, but also to the individuals is something that I feel really excited by. And then for me as a coach, as I also been coaching and still do a lot of executive coaching, it's a great reminder for me of the importance of establishing a good open relationship with the people that I'm working with. So being able to come to that fully present, fully able to engage in an effective way as a coach is something that is important to me and what I take away from it. Yeah, that's powerful. So Ellen, what are other ways that leaders can apply this themselves or their team and organization so they can get this benefit? Well, I think if we stepped back from this particular study and just think about coaching overall, I think such a great reminder of how valuable coaching can be. And so, you know, if we think about what that even means, coaching is basically, or the way I think about it and the way we do it at the Weatherhead School is partnering with another individual or a group or a team to help them discover and achieve whatever their ideal self is. And so we do a lot of work with people and individuals, helping them to imagine what they really want to do and who they really want to be in the future. And the future we've pushed pretty far out and then work backwards from that and fill in the blanks around how one can take some step to move towards that. Not in a transactional way, but more in a transformational way. So for me, it's really a knowing and having some more collective understanding around what's really happening in coaching. What's the potential that's there? And you need to be able to then consider what some of the benefits, real time financial benefits could be for organizations. Yeah, I love that. And thank you for defining coaching and the coaching approach that you're using as well. And so just to level set so people understand, what is the typical length that you've seen is needed from a coaching relationship to make an impact. So I know it's not one or two sessions, that's just the tip of the iceberg, but what have you seen that is a minimum expectation for people to expect to get some real results from us? That's a great question, Jill. And at this point we don't really know from the science or from studies. I can offer some experience though and I would say it's somewhere between four and six meetings or sessions. They don't have to be in person meetings, but in sessions where you're interacting with the individual or the coachee. It seems to be that the sweet spot somewhere around there and the longer you can work together, often the more change you're able to affect or to see at a minimum we would suggest three sessions so you can get pretty far in three but you know, and in all fairness or to be fully transparent around that, what you can get to is laying a good solid foundation. And then the individual does a lot of the work around implementing the plans on their own. If you're able to have a coaching engagement that has four or five, six or more session, then the coaches able to walk side by side with the individual or again the group of teams and help them as an accountability partner to be able to implement a lot of the steps. So really goes back to what the overall objective is for the coaching engagement from the beginning. But in general, a good rule of thumb I'd say would be somewhere around four to six sessions. And how long is a session? Again, I can speak from just experience. We don't have good data or science on that yet, but at least an hour seems to work at the beginning of getting to know a client and working with them. We find that 75 to 90 minute sessions are not uncommon. So we often plan for about 75 minutes and allow 90 minutes for the first two sessions or more. And then as you move into having a plan established and the coachee is kind of working their plan towards their desired change, sometimes your sessions could be shorter, more around an hour or so. There's also something that , I know a lot of coaches embed within coaching engagements, sometimes it's referred to as spot coaching or intermittent coaching. What that refers to is when our clients and coaches are able to connect with us as coaches at a moment's notice, so as needs arise or you know they're going into an important meeting, they might benefit from talking to their coach. So those types of coaching conversations range, that could be as short as 15-20 minutes and it's very discreet. It could be 30 minutes, 45 minutes. But in terms of scheduled, planned deliberate coaching sessions, I'd say on average is at least an hour. Yeah, that makes sense. So the spot coaching is in between the sessions to just keep the momentum, maybe help with something they're experiencing right there that they know they're working on. What other examples have you seen, and maybe you go to the book that's coming out, "Helping people change, coaching with compassion for lifelong learning and growth". What's one or two things that you learned and doing the work around this book that you could share with us? Sure. Jill, thank you so much for allowing me to share a little bit about the book that we have that's coming out soon because we've been working on that for a long time and it's been really an exciting and um, just rewarding project to work with my coauthors, Richard Boyatzis and Melvin Smith around them. There's so many nuggets of, of information for me that it's hard to pick one or two. There's a couple of stories that really stand out for me in a couple of times that have been reaffirmed for me so I can share a couple of those. One of the stories that is in the book is a coaching client that I had the chance to work with years ago, and he was a senior leader in a large multinational US corporation and he was CFO at the time and had received some 360 feedback as part of a leadership development program that surprised him. He thought he was doing pretty well and had pretty good relationships with his seven direct reports, who they themselves were senior leaders as well. However, the feedback he received from his direct reports and others indicated that they really didn't feel like he was approachable, that he knew them, that they had good relationships with him or vice versa, and ultimately that he was listening to them. So this was really a shock to him. And I find that sometimes working with leaders and executives where in the absence of feedback, they think everything is fine until they have a chance to learn a little bit more about how people are experiencing interactions with them. And so working with this individual, we started to break down that feedback and that was an interesting process in and of itself of just self awareness for him. And so we unpacked it and what he decided to work on was pretty discreet and it was how to become a better listener because what was happening on a daily, weekly basis was that he operated with an assumption that he didn't want to micromanage. He had very talented people on his team, so he wanted to get out of their way, which he translated to be not interacting with them really at all. And when they did come to him, it was usually around a specific problem that they wanted to either update him on or just bounce off of him. So the nature of the discussions and conversations the senior leader in the C-Suite was having with other senior leaders that reported to him were these short, 20-30 minute transactional conversations, he really didn't know anything about them. He trusted, they were running their particular business issues, their business competently and they were, but at the end of the day they weren't feeling connected to him. And as a result they were less engaged. What we set out to do together was to really unpack a typical day or week for him and to have him consider different ways to engage with his direct report, which really meant getting out from behind his desk and being able to concentrate on listening to what individuals had to say, which means he had to learn how to ask questions and learn the art of developmental conversation and even just the art of a conversation period. But one that engaged the other individual and demonstrated he cared and demonstrated that he was listening. So we worked on that for a number of months, very discrete steps, and through that process and him really working on being a different kind of leader, he was able to create a different type of relationship with the people who reported to him. A positive one, one where 18 months later when he took it another 360 degree feedback, he received much more positive and much different input from his direct reports. So that's one story that is just a great reminder for me of how simple some of these steps are, but how crucial they are for us to be able to engage with one another in meaningful, authentic, and caring ways. I love that example because in working with a lot of executives myself as well, I know that they may avoid trying to be that micro-manager so much that they're removing themselves too much. And you said that these are senior leaders he's working with, they knew how to do their job, but they wanted to feel connected. Yes. Yeah, to them. Yeah. It's very mindful. A lot of managers and certainly leaders and executives, this is absolutely true. We have jobs to do, tasks that have to get done, but those tasks get done through people and the higher up one goes in the organizational hierarchy - there's more people that we need to work through. And so the approaches and the styles that we use to engage people then becomes even more crucial for our ability to be effective in that. And it becomes much more about inspiring others, motivating others, and less about telling. So the transition from task to relationship requires us to move from telling to inspiring and that those are continuums for people. They're not absolute states, but I find a lot working with Directors on up to those in the C-Suite that some people have never really thought about that continuum. It might still be managing others in a way that is just not resonant or effective for the individuals as well as the span of control that they have. Yeah. The continuum you pointed out from Telling to Inspiring. Yes. Jill another take away from the experience of writing the book that I would share. That's top of mind for me is the importance of renewal for all of us. Renewal for all of us as coaches, renewal for all us as leaders renewal for all of us in all of the roles that we serve in our work and in our life. And so we know more and more from the neuroscience that's being conducted at our University and elsewhere about the role of stress and the importance of renewal. And part of it is that as human beings, stress is inevitable. It's just that stress, that chronic and stress, that extreme, which is often associated with increasing levels of responsibility in organizations and elsewhere is something that we need to be aware of and be able to not so much manage, but be able to address. And so one of the important ways to address the inevitable stresses in our lives is to be intentional about renewal. And so that starts with being aware of how we respond to stress and what some of the sources are. It also requires us then to make it a priority to be intentional about renewal. Now, the good news is there's lots of different ways for us to do that. And for any given person, what might be renewing for one individual, you know, could look different and often is for another. So we get to customize that, be authentic to ourselves, which is really important. And also just a lot of fun. For some people it might be meditation. For others it might be exercise. For others it's prayer. For others it's walks in nature and usually it's not just one of these things. It's a combination. And so we're learning so much more about how different resources like meditation for instance, really can help us stay centered and help us with that renewal. There's also renewal for longer periods of time that we need, such as like taking a vacation and taking a vacation where we're actually able to disconnect. Not a vacation where you bring your computer and you're on your computer the entire time. That's just virtual work that's not really renewing. So how much time, I don't know if you've, you've measured this, you can say we haven't measured it yet or you could tell me what your greatest guesses, how much renewal time the leaders need. Is that, are you talking take a week off a day? Is it, can you renew in a half an hour? Well, there's different timeframes for renewal right, so in any given day, if you think of 24 hours, one way to just make sure we're staying healthy is to look at how many hours we're dedicating to good quality sleep. There's a lot of studies that are emerging have been in our continuing to emerge about the importance of sleep. We are a sleep deprived nation and it starting at younger and younger ages. I certainly see that with my high schooler and the kind of stress and the hours that a lot of high schoolers are keeping and then that continues often through college. We see that in the students on campus. The issue is that for many individuals as they move into their thirties forties fifties we are in a sleep crisis or sleep deficits are very real. So it's not uncommon for people to get five hours of sleep or less a night. Yet we need a minimum of seven hours of sleep to function minimum. And so in any given day, starting there and really working on getting better quality, sleep is a good place to begin. Meditation throughout the day is important. So being able to take 10 or 15 even 20 minutes throughout the day where you can pause and use meditation and Meditative techniques to be able to center yourself. So it's really about managing the mind on a daily, weekly basis. However, longer periods of time are needed for true deeper renewal. There's no science we're aware of currently that says, you know, it should be 8.5 days or anything like that, but here's what we know. Taking a weekend allows you to break set from the hecticness. So if you take a weekend away, maybe you can, you know, catch up on your sleep and just relax for a day or so, but you're not really away. If you take a week, it takes most people a couple of days to wind down from just the stress of getting out of town. I'm making sure the dog got to the Kennel, making sure that they mail is stopped, to making sure that the bills were paid, making sure that you know the water tank is turned off in the house or whatever the list is for each person. By the time you actually get to a point where you're really just connecting, that's assuming you don't bring your computer or you're not on your phone. Answering emails is often two or three days in. If you only have a week, you have a couple of days before, then the same thing's happening on the other end and you're starting to crank things back up. You've got to figure out how to make sure your travel plans are in good shape and you're going to be packing up to leave and head home and so you really want to only get a limited amount of renewal. Ideally, a lot of our friends around the world who are able to take two, three, four weeks off and often have that as part of the norms in their organizations or countries have figured this out a long time ago, that really two weeks or more allows us to truly renew. And yet for a lot of people, I know that sounds like that's unrealistic or out of reach, but that's one of my dreams. To be able to affect that for people or to give them permission to be able to take it. Yeah, I need to, yeah, yeah, yeah. It's so important. Yeah. Yeah. The timing is right. It's so crucial on so many levels and it's just so reinvigorating if you're able to do it. I know for a lot of your listeners having something practical that they can do to even get started around this is helpful. So I wanted to offer an exercise. That's a great way to begin. It's in our book as well. We call it mind, body, spirit, heart as shorthand. I can walk you through it briefly here. If you just draw four circles, and in those four circles, have them be connecting and write the words, mind, body, Spirit, and heart. In each one of those four circles, and ask yourself, what are you doing currently that supports the health of your mind, body, your spirit, and your heart? And then take those four circles, draw them again and ask yourself the question, what would you ideally like to be doing that would support your renewal in each one of those areas? So you're examining what you're doing now and then you're dreaming and imagining in a perfect world, you know, what would you love to do? And that exercise help you to take some personal inventory and also be able to then consider where might you begin to incorporate more intentional renewal into your life. I love that. That's a great exercise, a great place to just get started, Mind, Body, Spirit, and Heart. What are you doing today? And then what you would like to do. Then obviously next step would be what do you want to put in action that you want to do but aren't doing today? Absolutely. In fact, there is another story is a powerful one that is in our book and it's one of my favorite ones and it's the story of a gentleman named Bob Schaffer and Bob went through that exercise that I just shared with you and your listeners in a leadership development program. And for him it was just a moment where he thought to himself, I'm not the kind of person that I really want to be in terms of my physical health. And he had formerly been really active in college, played college football, and his wife, who he met in college, was also quite athletic. Due to work and the pressures of raising kids and traveling for work and just life, he had not been very committed to a regular program of physical exercise for a lot of years and found himself, as he talks about, it a hundred pounds overweight. And through this exercise, he made a commitment in that moment that he really needed to change and wanted to change. It's really the wanting, Jill. That's the key that he wants to change. Nobody was telling him he had to lose a hundred pounds because we know that doesn't work. This is where inspiring versus telling comes into play. Right. So it was important for him and he talks about his dream, which is be able to walk his three daughters down the aisle so it'd be healthy enough and to be around for that. He also talked about another element of his dream, which is to run a race with his wife because she was a runner and he would take the girls to see their mom run, but he was always on the sidelines with his kids. And so part of what he wanted to do is to run a race with his wife. And so he walked out of that leadership development program and this exercise and called one of his buddies who had been seeing a personal trainer for years and said, I need the name of your trainer. And he called the trainer that day, told them the story that I'm telling you, and the guy said, I'll work with you, but I only have like 5:30 AM that's left as a possible slot and he said, I'll take it. So the next morning he began a journey of meeting with this personal trainer five days a week at 5:30 in the morning. And I fast forward the story over several months. He began to just transform his life physically and as a result, many other things began to be transformed for him personally. He ended up losing 96 of the 100 pounds. His trainers said I think you're, based on body mass, I think this is your equivalent of a hundred pounds. And he had galvanized this energy in the organization and his department and everywhere, because his transformation was so visible, he was in a senior leadership role. And so he became a role model for others and gave them permission to go out for a walk at lunch or to work out, even if it meant they didn't get there until 8:30 in the morning versus being in their seats at eight, even though that company official hours were 8:30 but in some organizations, it's important to be there and to be seen even earlier. So he gave them permission to go workout and take care of themselves just by his own actions. And then he just talks about many other things that happened for him, including being able to run the race with his wife that he had dreamed about. And to this day he heads up as a chairman for one of the local race organizations because it's near and dear to his heart. So, you know, on so many levels, this exercise for him created the initial spark and inspiration. And so we know it's powerful as it was for Bob. I love that story. So that's a real simple thing while, just because it sounds, just because it's simple doesn't mean it's easy to implement, but something that anyone listening right now could really take the time, draw those circles, mind, body, spirit and heart, and really do the work of thinking about where they are today and where they really want and need to be, and then take action for that towards that. I love it. Yeah. And then bringing it back to one of our topics, if you're able to do that with a coach, whether that's somebody you're working with through a workshop, professional coach, or a leadership coach, that's even better because again, somebody else will be there as a partner to help you think things through maybe a little more deeply or maybe a little more differently. But for those of us who maybe don't have a coach or aren't working with one currently, seeking a peer coach is equally as helpful and important. So maybe that's there's somebody who you share a desire to be more effective or to develop your capabilities at work. And so maybe it's something you do together and you could help one another in that way. Or maybe you do this with somebody in your family, maybe it's a spouse or significant other, or maybe even it's a child or maybe it's somebody in your extended family. So that's how we can adopt coaching and use coaching relationships and to be coaches for others outside of even just formal executive coaching roles. So I think the opportunities are endless and this is just one way that we can help each other be even more centered. And, and I'd like to think of it as even kind of returning us to ourselves a bit so that we can be grounded and authentic and be able to be the best version of ourselves. So part of the gift in coaching is whether we're peer coaches or we're working with executive coaches, or we are coaches ourselves in a professional sense, is that we have the opportunity through the conversations that we hold in the experiences we have together to help one another return to the best of who we are. And from that place is where we can lead authentically. We can be in relationships that are meaningful and where compassion for one another becomes what really holds us together. I love it. Well thank you so much and I can't wait to read the book, Helping People Change, Coaching with Compassion for Lifelong Learning and Growth, and I look forward to having you back as well to share a little bit more of some of the details and your experiences as you build your coaching lab and continue to work with executives and focusing on improving performance and engagement. Is there else you'd like to close with today? Well at first I want to, thank you so much Jill for the honor of being invited to be on your podcast series, so I've thoroughly enjoyed it, but also just really fun since I've known you for so many years in some of our previous roles. So I just am inspired by you and what you're doing here today. So thank you so much. Yes, I I'd like to close with something that for me, I tried to keep front and center as a coach, but also just as I walked through my day interacting with a lot of different people, and it's something that I learned from a short article that was in the Houston Business Journal years ago. It was back in 2007 and the reporter had shared a story. It was written about Andrew Carnegie, although some people mention it, it's about perhaps another Carnegie, but the essence of the story is that he was interviewed because he had 43 millionaires working for him at the time, and he was asked how is it that the people that worked for him were paid so much money? And he said, the way that people are developed is the same way that gold is mined. You go into the mine looking for gold. You don't go into the mine looking for dirt yet you need to move a lot of dirt to find the gold. And the takeaway from me is that there's gold in every single one of us. So there's gold in our kids. There's gold in our direct reports. There's gold in our managers. There's gold in our coaches, and our role is really to help one another, discover the gold and discover the gifts within, and to kind of polish them up for the world to see. So that's something that I'll like to just close with something that I just, like I said, I tried to remember on a daily basis, but it's inspiring for me. I've got a ways to go to be able to put it into effect. But yeah, it centers me anyway. I love that. I love that story. We have to go through a lot of dirt to get to that gold. Just remind yourselves of that. Yes. The journey will be worth it. Yes, no doubt. That's right. There's riches at the end, right? Yes, there is. There is. Do the work. Do the work. All right. Thank you so much. I really appreciate your time and look forward to having you back. I'd love that. Thanks so much, Jill, all the best. Thank you. Well, thank you everyone for listening into today's podcast, brain hacks for leadership and I hope that you were able to take a few nuggets away, some things that you can put in place right away. I love the exercise that Ellen shared with us. So there's a very simple thing that you could put in place right away. Draw your four circles. In those four circles, you write the words, Mind, Body, Spirit, and Heart. And in each one of those circles, ask yourself, what are you doing currently that supports the health of your mind, your body, your spirit, and your heart? Then take those four circles, draw them again, and ask yourself, what would you really like to be doing that would support your renewal in each of those areas? Examine where the gap is and start putting an action in place that's going to make a difference for you. And most importantly, everyone around you. And she also talked about the importance of coaching as part of a leadership development strategy. It magnifies the impact on overall performance and engagement inside an organization. So if you're looking at getting started with improving your leadership or the leadership of your team or your organization, feel free to reach out to me@ Jillwindel@talentspecialists.net. I love coaching executives and leaders at all levels inside the organization. And I know as Ellen said, that everyone has gold inside. Sometimes we have to dig through that dirt to get to the gold, but everyone has value. Everyone has potential, and a coach can exponentially help you reach your potential. Thank you. And I hope you have a wonderful day.

On this episode of the Healthy, Wealthy and Smart Podcast, I welcome Dolores Hirschmann. Dolores is a STRATEGIST & COACH. She helps clients clarify their “idea worth sharing”, design their communication strategies, and implement business growth systems. In this episode, we discuss: - THE IDEA OF YOU: A Framework for Clarity of Self - Clarity of life purpose - Clarity of who you are as a leader - Clarity around how to set goals and set yourself up to achieve those goals - Her work as a TEDx organizer and how you can get on that stage - And so much more!   Resources:   Dolores’ LinkedIn Dolores’ Facebook Dolores’ Twitter Dolores’ Instagram Dolores’ YouTube: Website: http://mastersinclarity.com/media/   Free Gift "Stand Out the TED Way: Be Seen & Grow Your Business" eBook Download https://doloreshirschmann.simplero.com/bc   ApexNetwork Physical Therapy   For more information about Dolores:   Dolores is a STRATEGIST & COACH. She helps clients clarify their “idea worth sharing”, design their communication strategies, and implement business growth systems. Her clients become speakers and authors and take their message to larger audiences like TEDx and beyond. She works through group coaching, workshops, one on one coaching, as well as public speaking. Dolores is a writer, TEDx Organizer, and participant in TED conferences. She is a CTI certified and ICF accredited coach and has a business degree from the Universidad de San Andres, Argentina. Originally from Buenos Aires, Dolores speaks fluent Spanish, English, and French and lives in Dartmouth, MA with her husband and four children.   Read the full transcript below:   Karen:                          00:00                Yeah. Hi Delores, welcome to the podcast. I'm happy to have you on. Dolores:                       00:05                I am so excited to be chatting with you today. Karen:                          00:08                And now in your bio, like I read, you're a tedx organizer. You help support speakers on the TEDX stage. So can you elaborate a little bit more about that? Cause I know a lot of my listeners would love to one day be on a ted or a tedx stage. Dolores:                       00:23                Yes, absolutely. I mean at the core of my work is my passion for ideas and because of that I, I I pursued as a volunteer. I pursued the TEDX platform. If you wand as a tedx organizer and in doing so I really connected with something that I love to do, which is help people clarify. And I know we're going to talk a little bit about this today, but you know, clarity comes in two ways. First is an internal clarity and then annex I communications clarity. When you bring yourself out into the world, which is what speakers do day in and day out, right? They bring out their messages. And so what I do with speakers today in my work, I held them in both guide, find the message Clive, find the overall communication strategy so that they can actually engage their audiences and kind of moved on. Dolores:                       01:16                You love their other movement or their, their impact. Right. And so that's on the, on the strategy side. But on the tactical side along the speakers just are not getting out there often enough simply because they just don't have time to pitch and to put themselves out there. And being in front of organizers and event planners. So with, in my company, in the agency side of my company, we actually have two services. One is where we actually research and pitch of peoples we have for them to speak in virtual and live events. And another one specifically signed four stages that are a little bit more harder to get in. It could be a telex, it could be, you know, some of the newer stages are coming up that are more inspirational or more kind of the idea based stages versus more the pitching stages. Um, and so what we'll do is we'll help the speaker life other core idea, clarify the positioning so that they can send out in the selection process and then help them with the research and the application process until they get selected. And that's something that I, you know, we do it for very specific clients whose message is ready for that kind of platform. Karen:                          02:32                Okay. So let's talk about getting this clarity around ourselves as a speaker because you had mentioned that a couple times, you know, getting clarity on who you are on your idea and, and even on where you want your idea to be, right? Because not every stage is right for every person. So let's talk about that clarity. Let's first talk about how to get clear on yourself. Dolores:                       02:58                Yes. So one of the things I am involved into, and I haven't, I realized that all my life, whether I was aware of it or not, I have been kind of this puzzle maker. Right? You know, what once as we started evolving and developing ourselves and becoming more self aware, I mean, especially when I did my coaching training, um, a lot of my internal introspection was about what is it that I bring to this world? Like we all have unique brilliances who all have that thing that we do well. Um, and for me that is that p being a puzzle maker. But to make a puzzle, you first have to have puzzle pieces. What I mean by that is we are always kind of lumping all of ourselves together in a tight box. And so when we're in that place is very difficult for us to really get to know ourselves because we are kind of mishmash with what has happened today. Dolores:                       04:02                The pain we had 50 years ago, um, and what we think we want to do, right? It's all kind of all mixed. And in order to make a puzzle, again, you need to pull out the puzzle pieces. So one of the things that I consistently do is create frameworks to break things apart so that we can build them back together. And so this framework, I, there's a friend where I designed called the idea of view and all it is really ease, deconstructing the different parts of who we are and the different kind of what I call layers of clarity that we can access so that when we actually pull them apart and look at it layer by layer, we can have a much more comprehensive picture of who we are. And in doing so, we can better assess where we're going. Does that make any sense? Karen:                          04:52                It does. It does. And would you mind giving us a, an example of maybe an exercise within this idea of you like a deconstruction exercise? Dolores:                       05:04                Yeah. And so let me just run you through the layers first. Okay. Uh, and then we'll hop into one or two exercises here that will help you better understand what I mean. So in the idea of you, and you know, I, I can send you some images later. It's, it's all about mmm. Getting Cody from the inside out so that at the core we begin with terrifying the you and, and, and he's, I say the idea of you because I believe that each one of us was born in purpose and for a purpose that we're kind of a seat of a, of a something, right? And so at the core of this exploration is what is your life purpose? Now this is a really big question and the question that has been around for many years, but I'll buy that today. It's kind of very heavy in, in making the decisions of our career paths and where we want to go, right? Dolores:                       06:00                And so I posted not as exactly the word we're going to do, but simply the who we are at our core, independent what we do. And so one way to do this is to think of yourself as a metaphor. Now you do this exercise. Please don't go and knock on your neighbor's door and let them know what metaphor you are because they're going to look at you like you're crazy. But when I did this exercise myself, I came up with my own personal life purpose statement, which is going to sound grandiose and he should sound round you dos because it's a lifelong purpose, right? And for me is I am the light that brings clarity. Clarity is at the core of who I am, independent of any activity or job that I'm holding. You see the difference. It's something that I can help a being. Dolores:                       06:56                I am attracted to like that lump of puzzle pieces because I like sorting them out and making a new picture. That's what I am in all aspects of my life. I've been like the cloudy maker for family situations, for job situations, for ideas, for for four speakers talks. I always bring that element right? So we begin with that and then we go and transition into identify what are our values and when I talk about values, I talk about what are the top things in your life that when you don't have them or you're not honoring them in your life, you just feel off. For example, I am, I have a big value on adventure. And when I was doing this work for myself at the time I was a young, youngish mother of four children. And you can say that having four children is an adventure in itself, but when you're in it, diaper in diaper a how day in, day out, it doesn't feel like an adventure. Dolores:                       08:01                It really starts looking like a very big routine after routine. Like it just doesn't feel exciting. And I, and I met some people might or might not agree with me, but that was my experience. And so when I recognize that adventure was a very big part of who I am and that not honoring my sense of adventure was kind of bringing me down, just that knowledge made me ask myself, okay, what can I do to fulfill that need of adventure? And you know, here's the thing Karen, is that tell us a shifts and changes can be very subtle. They don't need to be like moved to Africa. You know, it just do. Okay. Then I will just make time every week and maybe an hour a week to learn something new or to meet someone new or to explore a new place, even if it's just a new supermarket where I'll do food shopping. Dolores:                       08:54                Right? But, um, but it's just understanding what is it that is then that makes you tick and making sure that those values are being honored in your life. Then we go to understand your unique brilliance. What is it that you would excel, add in a natural way that you are, that you love doing. You never get tired of doing it and that, um, and then you always bring value. And what happens is again, when we are not connected with who we are, we sometimes unconsciously move away from that. That comes easy. Sometimes it's, I believe that work must be hard. So I might as well put that grit to it and we, and we discard maybe opportunities that might come our way that our land with our unique buildings because it feels too easy. So therefore I'm probably not regulated. Right? Right. And then, and then we explore another ring of clarity, another layer of clarity. Dolores:                       09:59                Quiches and this might be a great exercise for, for me to pause for a minute, but it's a ring of clarity of how do we define your life's work. Now, if you remember when I talked about life purpose, I talked about purpose of your sole purpose of who you are. Who doesn't mean that he defines the work that you do? A lot of people are trying to like calm, packed your job with your life purpose. And you know, there's a, there's a, there's another step in between and that is a step of your life's work. And why is it important? Because you have to translate your life purpose into as something that the world needs. Because, because even nobody needs your life purpose as it states in its true form. Um, then you might be both frustrated entrepreneur if you launch yourself into, like for example, when I first started, I just wanted to bring clarity to everybody and he was like, I wasn't getting anywhere, right? Dolores:                       11:05                Was, it was a very broad, esoteric value proposition that everybody liked it. I mean, I remember people saying, I really like you. I like when you say I put your ride. I just not sure how I can benefit from you. Um, and that's really great feedback to get right because it's like you're casting the net a bit too wide, way too wide. And I, and I see this a lot in the newly, you know, new business owners, entrepreneurs, we're following their passion. And again, it's not about that they're wrong, it's about they just need one more step. And this step is the lives we're defining your life's work. And here's a little exercise that we can share with your audience. And it's redundant. You have a venn diagram and you have four circles. What is your life purpose? Right? Just in that way of stating it broadly and grandiose, you know that people will look at you funny to share it in the subway. Dolores:                       12:03                And then the other circle there would be what people will pay for Nike nearly researching what will people, what do people pay for people pay for photographers, for weddings be both paid for accountants. People fave for a strategy for business growth. Like those are real things that other people are salad. Then another circle in this, in this damn, I'm would be, what are you trained to do? Like what are, what is your academic background and your past job experience, bathroom. Why? Because you don't want to just hop on a wagon and say, I'm going to do this because I love doing it, but no real credibility or kind of credentials. Karen:                          12:51                Exactly. It'd be like me saying, you know, I'm really good with numbers, so I'm going to be an accountant to be a physical therapist. Yeah. No one's gonna pay me for that. They'll think I'm crazy. Exactly. Exactly. Because you know, it's, there's something to be said about Dolores:                       13:07                some credentials. Um, um, and so, so really make a list of whether you were wrong and choosing your career path, our certifications you received. I would challenge that and look at what they can still bring you to life right now. Like, even if you're a doctor and you don't want to be a doctor anymore, that doctoral degree will go a long way to validating what you know and then putting into some, some other kind of surveys. Right. Absolutely. And then the last one is, so we have life purpose, what people will pay for what you have experience, job or, or academic. Um, and the last one is what does the world need? Or what does the world need more off? So when you do those four kind of circles and maybe do a little less in the middle, what you then looking at is what are the common denominators? Dolores:                       14:07                Where do all these four circles come together? So for me, you know, clarity is what my brain, right? And people pay for business strategy. People go for communication strategy. People pay for, uh, you know, maybe speaking people who pay for growing their business. My academic background, which at the time I was in school, I was kind of resenting it because I wasn't excited about it. Every day. I remember my mom would say, okay, you don't like what you're doing. Do you have any other ID? And I would say no. Then she would say, then finish what you started. Best Advice I ever got. Um, like stay on. I get that degree. Even if you have to like, you know, put a little bit of effort to it. Just get that done. So going to business school, I have to say 20 years later going to business school was the best decision I made at 18, even if I did 11, because he gave me the tools to narrow down my business and to be our business strategist. And so, so that's where my academic and what does the world need more off the world needs more ideas that can have a positive impact in the world. And the truth is, in my work and masters in clarity, we stand behind those ideas, typically in the hands of service entrepreneurs who have new methodologies, new perspective, new angles or new ways to helping their market or the world. Dolores:                       15:40                And that's that. Um, so as far as you know, that exercise is, is really helping you narrow down of how to you become off service in this world with your life purpose in a way that can be financially, not just financially sustainable, but can I might say financially abundant. Karen:                          16:03                Right. And there's nothing wrong with that. Dolores:                       16:05                How old is all right with that? Because the more abundant you are, the more you can do the work you're called to do, the more the world's will benefit. Karen:                          16:15                Absolutely. And I really love the, that sort of venn diagram of those categories. So I'm going to just repeat them and I want you to let me know if I got them right. So, um, what is your life's purpose then? That's a big grandiose statement that's supposed to be grandiose. Uh, what will someone pay you for? What does the world need more of and essentially what are your credentials? That right. I think that four parts. Exactly. Okay, great. Great. Great. Yeah. And, and I think if, if you can really sit with those questions, cause I don't think it's something that's not answered in five minutes, right. Syntheses questions. And how do you, and, and, and I dunno if there's a straightforward answer to this, but how do you know what your life purpose is? Because you know, sometimes when people hear that they're like, whatever. Dolores:                       17:14                Yeah. So here's a couple of ways to do it. MMM. You can sync off and moment in your life where you felt completely, um, completely valued and completely, um, like you were, you were at critical element of a situation where we're maybe without you playing whatever role you were playing, maybe outcome would have been very different or not positive in one way or another. That's one way to ask yourselves and start asking, you know, some days is, is asking you as a, what roles have I played most of my life? What do people know me for? What do people say about me? Um, and I, and I did that exercise and I asked my, the people in my life, my food, my mother and my friends. And, um, and you know, a lot of people would say things like, well, I would always call for you to you is I was needing to make a decision. I was the go to person for decision makers. Um, it's funny, I'm actually posting a blog on, on that, on this particular topic this week, um, because I'm helping my daughter made college decision right now. Um, so it's just really going inside and also go into your inner circle asking how do I bring value? What, what is it that the role that I play that I'm somehow always falling into that role in any kind of social or professional environment. Karen:                          18:59                Yeah, that's great. And I think that'll give the listeners a little bit something more to think about when they're trying to kind of discover what their life purpose is because I know I find that to be a bit difficult as well and I'm sure I'm not alone in that. Dolores:                       19:15                Yeah. Yeah. It's, it's, it's, it's one of the things that can always include us. Um, but my experience is that it did for many years until I came up with that, with that metaphor that I'm the lie the breeze clarity and sometimes I want to challenge people because we try to make this life purpose statement very complex or very sophisticated and symptoms is so simple that we rejected for its simplicity. Karen:                          19:52                That's true cause because we think it needs to be so over the top. Amazing. When in fact some simple as smart, right? Dolores:                       20:01                Yeah. Yeah. And any, maybe it's simple bod grandiose and so are our cultural belief system that who are we to believe that we can be that good comes into play and also mucks things up. Karen:                          20:17                Yeah. That self doubt and lack of self compassion for, uh, for ourselves can kind of derail us every time. Right? Dolores:                       20:27                Absolutely. And I think, you know, I mean this is just my perspective and I, if I might share it, I think that I really believed that each one of us in the world, not just me, all of us are here in person for a purpose. We were a gift and that that grandiose side is actually bigger than us. Um, we're just here. I, I believe to do a job that we're called to do within a universe that is much bigger than us. So to reject our brilliance is a, it's a, it's to reject that gift of who we are. Karen:                          21:08                Yeah. I love that. Thank you for saying that. And now let's say we kind of have this clarity of life purpose. We have more clarity around who we are as a leader. What do we do then? What's the next step? How do we then Dolores:                       21:26                goals? Yeah, so there's a couple more layers that, um, that will take your right there. So then the next layer would be clarifying how you interact with the world. And for that you have a lot of online assessments. There's one that is free that I love is basic, but it works. It's called 16 personalities. Got Home. It's based on Myers Briggs. You have finder and Colby and um, uh, an agreement like this, a lot of assessments out there, but those are really great and those are fun. And you learn more about how the world perceives you because that's important as well. And then, and then, and then we put all this to work. How would we do to work? Two more steps or internal one is we, and maybe I, I'm happy to do this for you and maybe the lessons will love this is um, identify and bring forth your internal leader and that is the highest voice. Dolores:                       22:26                We have voices in our head just for all of you are there. Yes, I do have voices in my head and there's nothing wrong with me. And we typically have most of the judgmental whiny voice that says that we're not enough. That's usually the loudest, but when we tap into our internal leader or captain that voice, then we can start kind of all of those not so happy or positive voices. So tapping no leader is an great um, resource because it will be that voice of reason that says to me, the Lord is slow down. Think about what you're going to say. Like you got this, uh, yes, it's hard, but you know, keep them going. That kind of positive reinforcement. And then the other part of this kind of clarity is understanding again in the same line, what is that conversation in your head and how many times a day you're going into victim mode, things are happening to you versus I got this, this is hard, but this is happening for me. Dolores:                       23:34                Right? And, and so that, that kind of wraps up the clary layers and the mindset layers. And then I think this is what you were alluding. It's like, okay, now what we do, right, right. Was parts one is the exercise of goal setting. How do we set goals that are honoring our values, our purpose, our internal leader? And from a positive mindset or victory mindset perspective. So how do we set goals from that? And our goal setting is not mixed science is they have to be smart, specific, measurable, attainable, um, timely. Um, and uh, and they have to be a stretch from where you are. But nod, I want to lose a hundred pounds in a month, right? Setting yourself up for failure. And so the goals are the big kind of gps as well. We're going lag. You can have a goal for each part of your life or only the parts of your life that need attention right now and is a great exercise with that. Dolores:                       24:44                It's called a wheel of life. A lot of, uh, you can probably find that online is it breaks your life into different kind of sections like a pie. And he helps you really assess from one to 10, one being this is not working really well, 10 being I'm rocking aid and from one to 10 and tried to understand which part of the life is not doing so well and so that he can focus on that. And then at the end of the day, Karen, all this is wonderful, but that transformation and our true selves as leaders only comes to shine in the details of every day. And that's why I talk about habits all success. So at the end of the day, how we wake up in the morning, how we brush our teeth, how we get dressed, how we make our bed. And yes, making your bed is part of [inaudible] leadership and what we eat, how we greet the post man, how we say hi to our coworkers. Those are the tiny details of our day that honestly make our big life. Okay. Karen:                          25:56                And you, you, you're about that. The making the bed thing all the time. And I started doing that a couple of years ago and I remember someone asked, why, why do you make your bed? I'm like, cause then I feel like I start out my day with a little wind. Dolores:                       26:10                Yes. I actually, one day I may have, I've always made my bed. I was raised that way and it was actually bothered me not to, I think at some point I was, you know, this, this balance. And at some point I was so, so kind of one, I was wound, wound very tied when the kids were little. And I remember having a coach who said, I challenge you not to make any bad this week. So I actually had to not make that because it was becoming a burden to me. But years later, my sister, teen 16 Karen:                          26:44                year old, oldest son, um, started making his bed and I hadn't said a word and I noticed it and he said, yes ma'am, I read this book and he gave me the book. And it's a book that I recommend always. He had read this book called the power of habit from child. I don't know if you've read it and I, it's, for me, it's an amazing book and everywhere. And that book taught my 16 year old back then to make us better. Oh, how wonderful. Charles Duhigg would be so proud. Dolores:                       27:15                I was going to say, maybe I should send a note that he accomplish almost impossible. Karen:                          27:20                I ain't got it. He had a teenage boy to make it better. Exactly. Yeah. That's amazing. Yeah. And then how, so, you know, you work with your clients and they've gone through all of these steps and then how do you, how do they then say or decide kind of where did it go from there? Right. So let's say someone's already a leader and they want to do a Ted talk. Somebody wants to do a Tedx talk. Right. Which are probably a lot of people listening to this podcast. So they go through all this. They have a good clarity of self, an idea of self, what's the Prac, what do you do, how do you do that? Dolores:                       28:06                So is a good question. So actually if someone comes straight, like let's say I didn't have work with me and they come to me just to do a talk, I will go through the process even though it might feel not linear. That is good to do with my talk because especially in the life purpose because with a talk like a Tedx talk on the of the talk is an idea that can have a positive impact in the world and that is right in the line of what we were just talking about. Your life purpose and your life's work. And so what I do is I bring that conversation APP and say, okay, this is your life purpose. Great. Your idea is kind of the cousin of your life purpose because it is an actionable version of your life progress. For example, for me, if I were to do a talk, it would be about how cloudy frameworks can help entrepreneurs realize their impact. Dolores:                       29:10                So my life purpose is clarity, but for the idea is the concept of clarity for frameworks as a tool for the purpose of serve as entrepreneurs realizing their impact. I'm just kind of very specific. So what we do is we tap into who the speaker is, what is it that they've always known about themselves, what is it that they've always longed to do or accomplish in this world? And then we explore about on the work they do, because here's the thing, can everybody comes to me and says, I want to give a talk. And I say, okay, what's, what's your core idea? What do you want to share? And they go on and say, well, let me tell you about my work. And it's on and off for like 30 minutes. Right? And and when you're pitching to any stage, but specifically at Tedx stage, the organize who will ask you one question and he's like, can you tell me your idea in one short sentence? And most people can. So that's why the life purpose, um, and a framework that I teach for, for stating your core idea come together to create this one line idea statements that then the top will be based on. Karen:                          30:22                Got It. Thank you for that. Cause I think that's a big point of clarity, if you will, for people who might be thinking about pitching themselves to do a big talk somewhere that you should be really be able to state the purpose of your talk, like you said in one sentence, succinctly and but with the punch, right? Dolores:                       30:46                Yeah. Yeah. But here's the thing is not, you know, they get caught up in this sexiness of it. Yeah. And they lose the practicality of it. So it depends the market. If you are looking to stand out in your market so that people will hire you, I would say lose a sexy gained the clarity. If you're looking to send out in an application to be speaking, then the stress, the, the to stress, the takeaway with the audience will get and the uniqueness of your process. Karen:                          31:27                Great. So it really depends who you're talking to him. Sure, sure. Because in the end, especially if you're talking about a Tedx talk, it's all about what, like you said, it's all about the audience, not about you, not you. Dolores:                       31:40                No, no, and I actually have had, you know, I love the work of the Tedx or the speaking if you want. What I love about it is that Dolores:                       31:53                people come to get that Karen, right? Like that kind of thing that they want the tedx stage or whatever stage and what they gads when they do this work of clarity is they get a Vishen so much bigger than they had before. I had a client what a multi multimillion dollars coaching program, a company, very successful is 16 years in business. And she did the work to get on that stage. And because of that work, she completely rebranded her company after 16 years, change the name because she realized that what the core idea of her work and the essence of our work was so much bigger than the brandy she of created for her company. And she was, she was kind of, she was feeling that the company was a little stale because she had reached the boundary, the box she had made for herself. Karen:                          32:52                Yeah. Oh my gosh. That has me thinking so much. It really does. And I think, you know, often times people get caught up in themselves instead of in the idea. And I think that can derail you. Dolores:                       33:09                It is, it is kind of a process then without knowing you'll fall in love again with your work. Awesome. Karen:                          33:18                Well, that just sounds amazing and I think you gave such great tips and, and really kind of got into the work that you do with, with uh, entrepreneurs and, and possible speakers and a executives. So thank you for sharing all of that with us. Is there anything that we missed or things that you want the listeners to really take away? Dolores:                       33:43                Um, I think that whatever you are doing, whatever situation you are in your life right now, just checking and understand where you stand. Don't make decisions from what other people say unless you also include your higher voice in the conversation. Karen:                          34:08                Excellent. I love that advice. And then I have one last question and it is again, another piece of advice and it's the question I asked everyone and that is knowing where you are now and your life in your career, what advice would you give to that? You know, fresh face Gal right out of college? Dolores:                       34:26                Well I, I, I would say to her, stay in this state of wonder. Trust your gut and yourself and it's okay. Life is not linear. Karen:                          34:41                Awesome. And where can people find you if they want more info or if they have any questions, Dolores:                       34:49                they can come to masters in clarity.com and right on the main home page you'll have a big orange button that says free resources and you can find different resources that you can download for free and start getting the clarity unique. Karen:                          35:07                Awesome. And then just so the listeners know, we'll have all of these links will be up on our website at podcast out healthy, wealthy, smart.com and that Dolores also has a free gift. Stand up the Ted way, be seen and grow your business ebook downloads. So we will also have that on the podcast page under this episode as well. So thank you for that and thank you for coming on today. This was great. Dolores:                       35:34                Thank you so much for having me. I had a lot of fun Karen:                          35:37                and everyone who's out there listening, thanks so much. Have a great couple of days and stay healthy, wealthy, and smart.   Thanks for listening and subscribing to the podcast! Make sure to connect with me on twitter, instagram  and facebook to stay updated on all of the latest!  Show your support for the show by leaving a rating and review on iTunes!  

Hey, guys. Welcome back to the Real Estate Marketing Minute. Thanks for joining us today. Your task for this coming week is going to be a technical task, so we're going to kind of hit on building up some more of your technical knowledge. What we're going to have you do this week is create a financial terms sheet ... Okay? ... and basically just list the term and then put a little definition of it out there. Okay? It'd be like assets, equity, debt-to-income ratio, stuff like that, all these things that are kind of discussed when you're talking about getting a loan or a mortgage in order to purchase a home. Right? Just make this list of these terms, put it on a blog post, and then send it out as an email and put it out on your social channels, as well, promote your blog post on the social channels. Right?

Where are you stuck? What’s holding you back? We have all these reasons why we can’t do the things we can’t do what we want. But what’s really holding us back is fear. The number one thing that stops us is our fear. Now any time you're feeling stuck you can ask yourself What am I afraid of? And you can keep asking yourself this question. And when I ask clients this questions it usually boils down to fear of failure and if we fail that we won’t be loved... I hear… I’m afraid of failing or being rejected (Which in some form is failing).. so we’re going to lump rejection into a form of failure… And we’re afraid if we fail ….that it means were not good enough…and if we’re not good enough…we won’t be loved. Fundamentally this is the thing that we all are afraid of. Every single human being has fear and experiences fear often. But how you manage it is what makes the difference in the results you create. Its what separates those who are being bold — taking action — and intentionally designing their life… from those who are living by default… making all types of decisions and choices from a place of what if it doesn’t work out…what if i fail. So, if you're wondering why am I not doing that thing that I want to do… I know what I want to do but I”m not doing it… I know i want a new job but i’m not applying.. i know i want to be in a relationship but i’m not putting myself out there… i know i want my own business but i’m not starting it… i know i want these amazing clients but i’m not promoting myself…   If you want to know why your not doing something — why your stuck — it’s because there is some conscious or subconscious fear — …looking stupid..not being perfect…not getting the love or the approval we desire. When I've asked clients what does it mean if you fail? There might be some type of loss…loss in money, loss in identity, loss in relationship… But most of the time… if we simplify it — it means something didn’t work out the way we want it to.. or expected it to or imagined it would. Let me say that again.. something didn’t work out the way you wanted it to or expected it to or imagined it. DOES THAT MEAN YOU FAILED? ABSOLUTELY NOT. And this is where most people stop, quit or give up. They try something — it doesn’t work out… and they say they failed… and they quit! AH. Failure could be trying and it not working out or failure could be not trying right. So let's just try to do stuff and if it doesn't work out you know if it doesn't work out right away like try again and try again the first time you walked you didn't stand up and just start walking. You fell down you stood up again fell down you stood up again. Right. This is part of the process right of. You expect it. Expect some failure. Expect some rejection. And don't give it any meaning about you that there's something wrong with you or that you're not good enough.   We're just we're just kind of self-loathing and creating this storyline of how limited we are — we we’re not…  if something doesn't work how does it mean that there was something wrong or we're not enough. Right? Just follow the logic. We really need to investigate how or mind are working - and just see… how we are holding ourselves back.. instead of growing into embracing imperfections, stumbling along the way, and becoming more resilient, more confident, more interesting, more brave, and courageous. Take those steps — send that email, make that phone call… in fact… i want to invite you to expect failure… don’t be so afraid of it… make friend with it… we have become so sensitive… you can handle if someone says NO to you…believe me.. you can handle it… LEARN If you are learning… you are WINNING. See how that lands if you say “I failed”  versus “this didn't work out.” It's a lot more gentle. And within that space of something not working out we can expand on that and ask what didn't work out? what can we do differently next time? and then we can then we can really access the learning opportunity. Right. But if we use these really big overgeneralized words of failure or rejection. And when we use these really harsh words like I'm a failure or we begin to strengthen this idea or belief about ourselves that we’re not good enough and we actually want to go in a different direction we actually want to want to start to cultivate an understanding that we already are enough. We want to strengthen our potential of possibility …and what’s possible for us… to consciously create and design a life we love! 

  Click above to listen in iTunes... I've come to know and be increasingly amazed by Dana. His knowledge and skillset never ending and very impressive. Dive into this episode with notes to learn how he's using the Dream 100... What's going on everyone, this is Steve Larsen, and you're listening to Sales Funnel Radio. I've spent the last four years learning from the most brilliant marketers today. And now I've left my nine to five to take the plunge and build my million dollar business. The real question is how will I do it without VC funding or debt, completely from scratch? This podcast is here to give you the answer. Join me and follow along as I learn, apply, and share marketing strategies to grow my online business using only today's best internet sales funnels. My name is Steve Larsen, and welcome to Sales Funnel Radio. How's it going everyone, I am super excited for today. I have a very special guest on. Please go stop whatever else you're doing. Again this is another one. Take a piece of paper out, write down notes, write down inspiring things that come to you. This is the kind of episode that not just has the ability to teach you a lot, but have a direct impact on the thickness of your wallet. I'm very excited for our guest today. I have known him for quite some time. I'm always extremely impressed with everything that he does. I want to welcome to the show, Dana Derricks. How you doing man? Dana Derricks: What's up man? Hey, thanks for having me. And for anybody that's listening, if you're in your car, pull over, put your hazards on. Just stop what you're doing. Tell your dog to go away. Your about to get hit with some gold here. Steve Larsen: This is awesome stuff. Thanks for being on. Anyway, I've been just been super impressed with you. I think honestly the first time we met though was we were redoing the homepage of ClickFunnels and Russel's like ... I remember I came in one day and Russel was like ... He was like, "Hey man. Dude I got Dana Derricks man. He's going to come on over and he's going to help us rewrite the entire, all the copy for ClickFunnels' homepage." And I was like, "Cool. Wait, who's this?" "He's the goat farmer." I was like, "Wait there's a guy ... There's a goat farmer who's an internet marketer?" He's like, "Yeah yeah yeah yeah." And then you came out and you showed up, and you had overalls and like, sweet straw farmer hats. And I was like, "This guys is the man." And like ever since then I've just been diving into your stuff. I'm super impressed with what you do. Dana Derricks: Dude, thanks man. I'm glad I have one fan. Steve Larsen: Whatever. Dana Derricks: No, that was so much fun and don't forget what ... By the end of that trip, what did you end up wearing home? Steve Larsen: Oh yeah. Oh yeah. So he came in one day, just so everyone on the show ... He came in one day, it was one of the last days, and he had a full chicken suit costume for me. What was ... You gave Dave a massive bear. Russell had ... He was the gorilla right? Dana Derricks: Yeah. Russell was a gorilla, Dave was a bear, you were the chicken. Steve Larsen: That's right. And I thought that it'd be funny to ride that on my motorcycle home. So I did. And we'll put that - Dana Derricks: And... Steve Larsen: In the show notes. Dana Derricks: Yeah. Please. And can we put the picture? Can we dig up the picture too? Steve Larsen: Yeah. I'll go find the picture. I'm just writing that down. Dana Derricks: Oh man. So good. Steve Larsen: Chicken. Dana Derricks: Such a good sport everybody. Steve Larsen, everybody. Steve Larsen: Oh thanks man. Appreciate it. Well hey, just so ... If you guys don't know, if you're not aware, Dana Derricks is one of the, I would say foremost experts on this whole concept that I feel like is extremely kind of gray, cloudy. A lot of people don't understand it, but it's this whole thing around the Dream 100 and how to actually implement it.   And I mean you literally wrote a book on it right? And when did that come out? Dana Derricks: When did the book come out? Steve Larsen: Yeah yeah. Dana Derricks: I think it's been out for about eight months. So probably about towards the end of last, of 2017. Steve Larsen: Okay cool. Now before, before you were doing Dream 100 ... So I mean, first of all, how did you become an advocate of Dream 100? How did you start doing it yourself? Was it ... I mean, I know the story, but for everyone else who's listening, like how does a goat farmer who's also a copywriter, who's also an internet marketer overall product creator, go directly into Dream 100 stuff as well? Could you give us a little backstory there? Dana Derricks: I know. Everybody at this point is probably thinking, "Stephen, what is wrong with you? Where did you find this guy?" Steve Larsen: "Who is this guy?" Dana Derricks: Yeah. "What's happening?" So yeah. So I guess a little bit of a backstory that got me into the Dream 100 was I'm the type of guy that's going to try everything, and then figure out what works and what doesn't. And when I figure out something doesn't work, I just keep moving. Like, so I always say like honestly, there's two things about me that work well. Like, number one I'm too dumb to overthink things so I don't get paralyzed by that. And then number two, for every ten things I try, one of them works and I'm thrilled. Like I'm so grateful for the other nine that didn't work so that I could get those out of the way to find the one that did. Right? So like for me, like I look at like major league baseball right? The best in the world, on the planet, go up to the plate and they end up getting a base hit or you know a single, double, triple home run only three out of ten times. Right? Like nobody goes over four out of ten. So what's happening the other seven out of ten times? They're striking out. They're hitting the ball and getting it caught. Like bad stuff's happening almost over two thirds of the time. Yet like, us in business we go and try one thing, we step up to the plate and we expect to hit a home run, and then when we don't we're like devastated and never want to step up to the plate again. So for me, I was not ... I wish I could share this amazing story of how I fell in love with the Dream 100, and it was this love story. But reality is dude, I tried everything. So back in the days of Google SEO, like, Google AdWords, and then YouTube, and then Facebook, and then like all these things I tried and tried and tried, and it just like, it sucked and I failed. I kept failing, and failing, and then I realized, "Wait a minute." I was already doing the Dream 100 before I even knew what it was, and that was the only thing that ever worked for me. So that's why I got obsessed, doubled down, wrote a book about it, and all that other good stuff. Steve Larsen: I mean, how did you first find out about it though? Was it straight from Chet Holmes course, from Russel's stuff, from ... Where'd you learn about it? Dana Derricks: Yes. So I actually first figured it out through Russell. I think he had something ... One of his things was like the lost chapter on the Dream 100, and he just kind of described what it was, and then he was talking about Chet and I was like, "Oh man. I have sifted through many stacks of hay looking for this needle, and I finally found it." And then I grabbed Chet's trainings and it was like game over from there... Steve Larsen: So what ended up happening. I mean you read this thing, and you go start implementing. Like what did you do first? Because there's a lot of ... I feel like there's just a ton of misconceptions. Everyone thinks it has to be this package, or it has to be this ... I don't know. I think we all over complicate it a bit. Like what did you end up go doing? Dana Derricks: Totally. So well, the first that I think everybody thinks when they first learn about the Dream 100 is, "Oh my gosh, I've already kind of been doing that. Right? I didn't realize it." So for me, the big epiphany immediately was, "Holy crap." So for those that don't know my story, I grew up in a town of, I kid you not, 512 people. Steve Larsen: Oh no way. Dana Derricks: Yeah. My graduating class was 30 and we had a big class. Steve Larsen: Wow. Cool. Dana Derricks: Yeah. So my life growing up, because we didn't have a movie theater, we didn't have a grocery store in town. We had nothing. We had a bunch of cows and not even a goat. Like what the heck? Right? So football was our life, and I love football so much that I didn't want to stop playing after high school. I wanted to play in college. And nobody from my school, or area for that matter, played in college or did anything after high school. Like it was just, like we're too small. Nobody knows about it. Like it's not for real. So I'm like, "Screw that." So none of my coaches ever played college football. They don't know how to help with recruiting and all this. So I'm like, "Screw that. I'm going to do it myself then." And basically what I did is I created these ... Well first I started with ... I printed out a list of 40 schools that I potentially wanted to play football for. And then I made a packet for each school, like literally a box, and in it had like the highlight tape, a letter of recommendation from a coach, a personalized letter addressed to the coach that I was sending it to, all this stuff right. And I mailed all 40. And I was like, "All right, sweet. Let's see what happens." Two weeks goes by nothing. I'm like, "Wow that was a waste of time." Third week, I get called to the principal's office which for me is not a good thing. Like, "Oh man. What did I do?" I go in there and there's a football coach in there, and I'm like, "Whoa." He's like, "Are you Dana," and I'm like, "Yeah. Who are you?" He's like, "I'm Coach so and so." And he's like, "I'm here to recruit you." And I'm like, "What? You're here to recruit me? You came all the way to my town?" He's like, "Yeah," and then day or two goes by and then I get called back in and suddenly there's two coaches in there from two different schools at the same time. And I'm like, "Oh my gosh." And I remember like ... Yeah. Like my principal pulled me aside and he's like, "Dana when is this going to stop. It's really disruptive." I'm like, "I'm sorry Mr.C, it's like a broken fire hose. I can't do anything." So long story short, because of the Dream 100, I didn't even realize what it was at the time, I ended up getting a pretty major football scholarship, and I'm the only person in the history of my school that's ever gotten any sort of athletic scholarship, and it's 100% thanks to the Dream 100. So that's like the first emotion you go through I think when you learn about the Dream 100 is like, "Oh my gosh. Why didn't I know about this sooner? I was already doing it." You know? And then it turns into, "How do I now leverage the crap out of this in what I'm doing today here and now?" Right? So what I did, just really quick, was I wrote out a list of my Dream 100 right then and there and I remember, I'll never forget, Russell was at the top of my list and I looked at it ... This was not that long ago either. This was only a couple years ago. I looked at it, I'm like, "There's no way that I could ever get that guy to ever pay attention to me or do anything with me." Right? And I erased it. I literally erased it, and then I was like, "Oh maybe." Right? "YOLO." So I put it back up on the side of the list, like with an asterisk. And I'm like, "Eh. Maybe." Right? And then fast forward like couple years, and then I go up, get to meet you and hang out with Russell, and speak at a Funnel Hacking Live, and all this other crazy stuff, and it's all 100% thanks to the Dream 100. Steve Larsen: So for everyone else also, before we started this Dana is an amazing copywriter. He's amazing and Dream 100, and between those two topics I asked him, I was like, "Which one do you want to talk about?" And he said, "Which one do you want to talk about?" I said, "Which one gets you the most frustrated and mad?" And he immediately said, "Dream 100." Why is that? Before we dive into some how you actually put this together, how come the Dream 100 gets you most ticked off compared to copywriting which is also very important? Dana Derricks: I love this question. So for me it's because I feel like it's sort of a tragedy that most ... Every single business isn't ... Like first of all that everybody just doesn't know about it, number one. And then every single business or entrepreneur isn't using it. Like to me that is such a tragedy. And for some reason, like I still don't know why. For some reason when people think of traffic and getting people into their funnels or eyeballs on their offers, or whatever, they instantly think, "Oh Facebook ads. I need Facebook ads." And for some reason, like that apparently is the only traffic source in the world. Right? Like, it's just this crazy misconception and the reality is is the Dream 100 is a much ... How do I want to say it? It's a much more sustainable approach because it will never go away. It worked 50 years ago, it works now, it'll work 50 years from now. And it also ... It's free. I mean it's targeted eyeballs on your stuff for free. And it's all about ... It's really not that difficult. It's just building relationships with people. So that ... I guess that fires me up is like why everybody thinks they need to have Facebook ads or whatever else when they could be using the Dream 100 instead. Steve Larsen: Yeah, I feel like maybe that is part of the issue though is like, most internet marketers now are ... We're just spoiled. I mean before Facebook days, I mean how did everyone get the traffic that they needed. It's exactly what you're talking about right now and I feel like that's ... Not that Facebook's a bad thing, but I don't know how to drive ads. Like I don't want to go learn that stuff. I feel like Dream 100 is so much more long term sustainable, higher leverage sources of eyeballs than going and ... Anyway. And learning that stuff. So you mentioned real fast, you said, "Okay. I went and I ..." It's funny because Russell was number one on mine also, and I was like, "Eh, we'll see. I don't know." How did you make your list? I feel like that's the ... Do you feel like that's the reason people actually never do this? Like one of the choke points? Or how do you actually put it together? Dana Derricks: I think that's a big one. And that's probably the most common question I'm asked when I'm talking about it. Yeah. It's like, "Who was my Dream 100? Who was it?" And I'm like, "Well ..." So finally I came up with a very simplistic equation I can give you and your listeners if you want it. Steve Larsen: Yeah. I'd love that. Dana Derricks: So basically it starts ... It doesn't start with your Dream 100, it starts with you and then your customer avatar. So it's literally this simple. Who is your customer avatar? And that to me is a function of who do you want, as well as who do you not want? So it's who you want, minus who you don't want, equals your customer avatar. Right? And then so I've got my customer avatar, because if you don't have that then the Dream 100 is a very complex, difficult thing because you don't know. Right? So all right. The next question is, where are your customer avatar? Like where do they hang out? Right? Is it certain Facebook groups? Is it associations they're in? Is it ... Are they buying the same book? Are they all subscribed to the same software? Do they listen to the same podcast? Like if you can figure out who your avatar is, figuring out where they are is not that hard, and then wherever they are, whoever owns and controls the group that they're in, the groups I should say, or the audiences, that right there is your Dream 100. Steve Larsen: Interesting. So you go from your customer avatar meaning who you want and don't want, and then you go from where they are, and then who already has them. Dana Derricks: Exactly. Boom. Done. Steve Larsen: Who has them. I'm just taking notes. Dana Derricks: Sure. Steve Larsen: Who has them. Okay, so then from that point, like ... So I'm just ... From when I've launched a lot of stuff and I've got Dream 100 stuff all over my office right now. What ... Huge believer. Huge believer. So I'm excited I get to - Dana Derricks: Yeah man... Steve Larsen: I feel like ... I mean I like to sit down and start creating somewhat of a campaign for each one of these people with a blend of personalization, but also my ability to do it kind of en masse. You know what I mean? To each one of these people. I don't know if that makes sense. But what do you do next to actually get a hold of them? Are you going one by one for each of them? Are you doing something mass that kind of blankets all 100? Dana Derricks: Great questions. So I actually, gosh this is just a little bit off topic but it helps to kind of illustrate this. So how build my system around what's working is I do everything the hardest, longest way possible and then that becomes my system. So for example, if I launch a new offer for something, like if I have a ... If I come out with a new $2000 book right? I will find the person who is absolutely unqualified to buy it, who might want it, but who's totally ... Like for example, maybe they're totally broke. Right? And I will literally go through and answer every single question for them, and have 1500 back and forths if I have to, to then have basically, after the point of first contact to the point where they actually buy the thing, which is like a humongously long duration of time and effort. That is my system. Right? So that is now my system because very single objection basically has already been taken care of, and those are now all scripts that I can use for the next person. So I do the basically ... That's how I look at everything. So for my Dream 100, like let's say I have a target. And I'll use more of a short term target. So like a smaller kind of, more accessible one. Because Russell, that's a long term play. Right? But like a smaller one that you could start the conversation with already is like ... You definitely have the elements of personalization, so figuring out ... And this all comes obviously from ... So for those of you that are Dream 100'ing Stephen, you're in the right place because listening to his podcast is a great way to get his attention and get to know him, and the second secret sauce I'll tell you is, buy all of his stuff. Okay? So there's a correlation usually between how much access you get to someone, and how much money you've spent with them. So - Steve Larsen: That is fascinating actually. Dana Derricks: Right? Steve Larsen: Man. You say too much good stuff man. You got to slow down. I can't write that fast. Dana Derricks: Yeah. So for me it's like, I'll just pick ... So when you're starting out, it's really critically important to just pick one that isn't years down the road, so don't go after Tony Robbins on your first one. But also don't go after somebody that is already in your network that you could get a yes from without even having to go through all the hoops of all the other stuff right? And then just figure out what it is that can just showcase to them that you care about what they say, and you listen, and you consume their stuff, and you buy their stuff. Right? So I've had people ... I learned this myself, they're like, "Well are you ..." I wanted to partner with software companies before and they asked, "Well are you a subscriber of the software?" And I'm like, "Good question." Right? Like, "I should probably get an account and get to know it really well before I should expect them to want to do anything with me." Right? So that's the beginning. If you're not already doing that, then it's going to be really really difficult. But once you are, then ... Because it's like you're part of the community right? And - Steve Larsen: It's funny that ... There's a few times I've tried to reach out, or someone reached out to me, and they're like, "How do I learn this?" I'm like, "You serious? I have a course on this." They're like ... You know there's been times when ... Anyway. I don't know how else to say yes, amen, ahh, little hallelujah, lights coming down. What he's saying right now, please visualize bright shiny objects and things in the sky because that is so gold. Dana Derricks: That's funny man. But yeah, like if you think about it, makes total sense too. Like, if you're already ... And the other ... To take that a step further, is if you can contribute value to their community, right? So like for me with Russell, I have intentionally ... I don't ... I love helping people, but like I'm not getting paid and I'll go into the ClickFunnels community, the Facebook group or whatever, and I just go help people. I'm not there, I don't have an agenda. I don't have ... I'm not selling them. I'm just going in there and helping. So if they have a question to something that I know the answer to, I'll spend five, ten minutes helping them. Steve Larsen: Which you're so good at man. I've seen you pop around all over the place doing that. Like I watch you do that all the time. You're such a ... Ah, it's awesome. Okay cool. Yeah. Dana Derricks: Thanks man. Well hey, see I'm glad somebody notices. Steve Larsen: I do man. Yeah I turn back around I'm like, "Man this group doesn't even ... It's not even active anymore. Or this." I'm like, "Man, Dana wrote a long incredible response to that. This is cool. He spent a lot of time on this." Dana Derricks: So yeah. Because if you think about it, who's the perfect person for a guy like Russell to put on stage at his live event? Somebody that the community already knows, likes, and trusts. Right? Somebody that has invested in him and what he's building. And then, not only like monetarily. Yeah I gave him a lot of money to get into his inner circle, right? But also like, I spend quite a bit of time, and energy, and effort on helping his people for free. I don't ask for anything in return you know? So it's like ... That's a deadly combination for anybody to ... How can you say no? Right? Steve Larsen: Right. Oh interesting. Dana Derricks: So if somebody's saying no to you, ask yourself those three things. Am I already buying their stuff and consuming their stuff, and in the community? Am I contributing to the community? And have I ... What was the last one? Oh. I think, have I given them a lot of money? Steve Larsen: Yeah. Yeah. That's awesome. Okay okay. So once ... Let's say ... Let's say ... Right. Because there was some point when Russell's like, "Wow. I'm now aware of Dana," and you realize that he is. How do you move forward? I feel like that's one of the other major questions kind of from the community that happens. They'll be like, "What do I say to him next?" You know, "When do I drop, 'Hey we need stuff?'" What's the steps forward after you've gotten their attention? Dana Derricks: This is like the second most frequently asked question is like, "I don't know what to say to him" or "I just feel like ..." Whatever. And I'll share quick like ... So Lady Boss, Brandon and Kaelin Poulin, amazing human beings, I work with them. They're in my intensive I call it. It's kind of like a course mastermind blend. And they build a $10 million company off of paid ads. And I'm just thinking to myself, "Holy crap. If I could make $10 off paid ads I'd be thrilled," right? And they're like, "We should probably try this Dream 100 thing." And I'm like, "Yeah you probably should. Good idea." So three days before Funnel Hacking Live, Brandon the action taker he is, he enrolled in my course and then he's like, "You know what? I got a guy I think I'm going to put in this spot." So because they're a big company, they can just by having a full-time affiliate partnership management person. Right? So he ends up being Brandon's brother, and his name's Jeff. He's awesome. And Jeff asked me three days before the event this exact question right? Because Kaelin was going to be on stage, which is an amazing opportunity for people to know Lady Boss, and I'm sure there are people in the sea of the 3000 plus that they could potentially work with somehow right? Or they know somebody that they could. So Jeff's like, "Dana," he's like, "I'm really new to this. What do I say to people?" And I'm like, "Jeff, this is the only thing you have to make sure you say. Everything else just be yourself, but this is what you have to say. Before you end any conversation, just ask the question, 'How can we help each other?'" That's it. If you can just get that question out there, they may not have the answer immediately, but at least it gets their mind going, and number one it like tells them what your agenda is. It's not, "Hey can you do Lady Boss?" No. It's like, "Hey. We want to help each other," and that's kind of how it was for me as well with Russell is I got on his radar, and then you know it's like, "How can I help you with what you're doing? How can I help ClickFunnels?" Right? And then that's how it came to, "Hey. You could probably help me by coming out here and knocking this copy for the homepage." Right? So a really long winded way of saying like, if you can just always have that question in your mind, "How can we help each other," then it just takes care of the rest. Steve Larsen: You know, it's interesting, with that approach, which I absolutely love because it comes from a place of friendship, and adding value, I mean you think about Dream 100 ... I mean, doing that 100 times, I mean it's easy to see how ... You easily could have a full-time position with somebody just doing that alone. Managing those relationships, working on the next pieces. Is there ever ... What's the point in the relationship after you've been adding value, because I'm sure it's different for everybody. We're all different, but is there a time where ... Because some of them probably come up and go, "Hey. Let me promote your stuff." But then there's probably other times you have to come back out and say, "Oh my gosh, he's not getting it, or maybe I do have to be a little more forward." Like how do you approach somebody and say that without sounding ... After you've given value, they know you're there, they know you're there to help, you've clearly developed a relationship. What's the way that you approach them and say, "Promote my stuff?" Dana Derricks: Love it. So I basically relate it to marriage. So me personally I would never get down on a knee if I didn't know the gal was going to say yes. I just don't want to be the next YouTube marriage proposal fail video. Right? Steve Larsen: Which are great to watch. Dana Derricks: Oh yeah. As a viewer. Yeah. So I look at it the same way as like ... Like I ask myself, "Have I built up enough goodwill with this person," whether that's buying their stuff, consuming their stuff, being in their community, contributing to their community, or whatever. Contributing directly to them. "Have I done enough of that for them to say yes to what I'm going to ask?" And if the answer isn't a clear yes, I just keep giving value. And usually for me, it's get to the point where people will ask me, "How can I help you?" Like all the time. That's one of the most common asked questions I have is from people just when I see them at events and stuff, and it's like, "How can we help you?" And then I'm like, "Hm. Well let me think about that for a second..." And then it's just the perfect ... So that's the thing is like, can you confidently say yes you've built enough goodwill up for them to say yes. And then number two, if not just continue to give them more value somehow. Steve Larsen: That makes total sense. Okay okay. So we've gone through ... Okay. Gone through how you make the list, psychology of ... I love your approach by the way. That is just pure gold. Choose the hardest way possible because that becomes a system. That way all the objections popup and you can address those in scripts. Things like that. Just brilliant. How to actually ... What do you do with the Dream 100 next? How can we help each other? On to promoting. Okay. You are notoriously known in the inner circle, in pretty much everywhere who's ever come in contact with you, for your incredible packages that you do send. Dana Derricks: Oh man. Steve Larsen: Could you talk a little bit about the way that you do that? I know that Dream 100 itself is not packages, but obviously that is a strategy and a method. Could you tell us a little bit about what it is that you're sending out and what you're working through as you go through each person? Because I've heard some pretty amazing stuff get sent around from you. Dana Derricks: Oh man. Well do I have your address? I'll have to get it. So yeah. Russell talks about ... Because somebody asked him this once, and he had a great response. He said that he likes to theme things. And I didn't even realize that I was doing it, but he mentioned me as well. But he does superheroes. You know. So that kind of takes some of the question out of what you should be sending is if you can latch onto a theme. So for me, obviously goats. So I've got ... Let's see if I have one. Oh I must have sent it out. Oh no I have one. Hold on, wait for it. Steve Larsen: Is that the screaming goat thing? Dana Derricks: That's the screaming goat. Steve Larsen: Nice. Dana Derricks: Oh I got to get you one man. Oh my gosh. That's the best way to crush any awkward silence ever right there. Steve Larsen: Just play that. Dana Derricks: Yeah. So my stuff is really goat related. And then the other thing that I look at is ... And the other thing, if you're creative you don't have to spend a lot of money. I know that's a concern for people, and at the end of the day though this stuff is so valuable, as soon as you get one, yes everything's paid for. So I keep that in the back of my mind. That keeps me going. But as far as like making it stand out and be cool, because I get stuff ... People send me stuff and I hope ... I don't care if they're listening or not. Steve Larsen: It's a lesson. It's a lesson. We're all good. Dana Derricks: Yeah. Like I love you guys. Keep sending me stuff. There is a difference though between something that somebody personally put together in a box, and somebody that just sends me a gift from Amazon with like a gift card, or the typed out thing from Amazon. Like both are cool, and you doing just the Amazon thing is better than 99% of people. But like there's something to be said about that hand touch and stuff. So for me like, I guess my creativity comes out because one of the things I sent to everybody in the inner circle that kind of got everybody kind of, I don't know, in a frenzy was - Steve Larsen: Yeah.. Dana Derricks: Yeah. Was a wizard stick. So long story short, my dad lives in Texas, I'm in Wisconsin and I like to send to his Christmas gifts. So a couple years ago I bought this weird like weed puller thing where it's like you don't have to bend over to pull weeds out. It's like ... You know what I'm talking about? Steve Larsen: Yeah yeah. Totally. Dana Derricks: And I open it up from Amazon or whatever, and then I forgot. Threw the box away and then I was like, "Oh man. It's like 4:50 PM on a Friday. I need to get this out to my dad." So I went to the post office and I'm like, "Do you have a box that this would maybe fit in?" And they're like, "No not at all." And I'm like, "Oh crap." But he's like, the post master was like, "But we could send it like that." I'm like, "What?" He's like, "Yeah." Like picture basically like a shovel. Essentially a shovel. He's like, "We could send it just like that." I'm like, "Wait what? You don't have to put in a box?" He's like, "No." So basically, picture the shovel. They just printed off the label, and then like stuck it to the handle of the shovel, and then the shovel got sent in the mail just like that. Like no box. And so I'm like, "Huh. You don't have to put things in boxes. That's amazing." So I sent out these wizard staffs or whatever, and I zip tied a wizard hat on top, and didn't put it in a box, and all these sticks essentially showed up at people's mailboxes and it was just this big crazy viral thing. And stuff like that that's just way more memorable and exciting when stuff like that shows up than just a box from Amazon. You know? Steve Larsen: Yeah. Yeah yeah yeah. Let's say ... Okay. So I've identified my Dream 100, I've contributed some things to the community, I really want to do things to grab their attention, what are some of the ... I mean, how much money are you spending on each one of these packages? You mentioned it could be cheap, and sometimes that's better, but how much money per package do you expect, or ... I guess that's the question. How much money do you expect to be spending on each one of them? Dana Derricks: If I can keep it under ... So depends on the target too. I segment my Dream 100 with A, B, and C. Steve Larsen: Oh really? Dana Derricks: Yeah. A is being like the top, B is being like middle, and then C is being like quick wins. Reason for that is because another things that people ask is like, "Well how high should I shoot?" And if you have all like, Russell, Gary V., Grant Cardone's on your list, like it's not that it won't happen, it's just that's not going to happen any time soon. You know? So I learned an expensive lesson from my football scholarship. And that was I ended up playing in a division two school, which they still give great football scholarships, and mine was a huge one, but wasn't a D one school because I listened to the doubt in my head that I was never good enough to play D one so I didn't even print off any D one schools. I really regret that to this day. So I just had B's on the list. And so if I'm looking at ... Typically for a B campaign, or even some C's, if I can keep my packages between $20 and $40 a piece, I'm pretty happy with that. But again, there come ... It comes with like, pretty relentless followup. Because if you just sent the box to somebody, good luck. But you got to do more than that. You know? Steve Larsen: Right. Right right. Followup process. What does your followup process typically look like? Dana Derricks: Oh man. So - Steve Larsen: Because you're a beast at this man. I'm pumped to hear this. Dana Derricks: It's very extensive. So ... Oh man. Do you want the whole ... Not like the whole thing, but do you want to know the extent I go? Steve Larsen: Yeah, totally. I do. Because I feel like what people do is, let's say I go put the package together, I go to the mailbox, I drop the thing off. Boom. I've now done Dream 100. You know? That's kind of it, and people kind of like rinse their hands. "Yes, I get my success cookie for the day." But it's really not over... Dana Derricks: No. It's just beginning. Steve Larsen: You're brilliant at this part. I'm so pumped. Dana Derricks: Thanks man. So that's like ... If you're running a marathon, that's the gun that just started the marathon. But you can go home with your marathon number on, and you've dressed up, and congrats you participated, but you didn't finish. Right? So for me it's like, I'll send them ... For me really the lumpy mail is permission to follow up with them. That's all it is. Because if I send somebody a gift card, or I don't care, wizard stick in the mail, like I have the right to follow up with you now. Right? I've spent money, invested time and money into you, now you don't have to work with me, or say yes to what I'm asking, but you do have to reply. Like that's the decent thing to do. So I will then send them an email followup, and it's never like, "Hey did you get my email?" Like have you ever had somebody message you 17 times on 17 platforms saying, "Did you see my email?" Steve Larsen: Yeah. "I called you. I called you. I called you. I called you." You're like, "Oh my. I know. I saw it, okay?" Dana Derricks: Dude. Yeah. Like we saw it. Like - Steve Larsen: It drives me nuts. Dana Derricks: Right. But if it's like, "Hey did you see the package I sent?" That's a different ball game. That's like, "Whoa you spent money on me, and you took the time and energy to cut through and go to me in the mail." Right? So I'm always like, "Hey did you get the box yet that I sent," or whatever. And I'm not like ... I'm never annoying about it because like, I'll look at the tracking and make sure the thing was delivered before I'm like, "Hey did you get the box?" And they're like, "No, what box?" Right? It's like ... So that ... So it's basically multi-channel followup. It's really ... It's extensive. So it'll go from emails and Facebook messages and whatever they are on, and then if I get no response from them, and I know that they're potentially seeing my messages and I've gone to the extent of like, two, three, four weeks of followups, next is a dodge ball in the mail. Steve Larsen: Wait you send them an actual dodge ball in the mail? Dana Derricks: Oh yeah. Oh yeah. Steve Larsen: So you're calling them out? Dana Derricks: Oh yeah. If I have their address, they're so screwed man. Steve Larsen: I didn't know you do that. That's funny man. Dana Derricks: Oh yeah. Well that's because you've replied to me. Steve Larsen: Oh that's funny. Dana Derricks: So dodge ball. Rubber snakes work really well. It's literally ... And it's always ... Here's a thing. It's always got to be around humor though, and sarcastic, otherwise it's just ... It wouldn't work. So like the dodge ball's like, "Come on man. You're dodging me." And they know I'm not going to stop at this point. And the rubber snake, I think it's just to hilarious to think of the thought of them opening a box to see a snake inside. Like, it's just so funny. So I've never had to go past the snake, but the next one ... This is kind of naughty, but I will, I am prepared to send a certified with like a W9 inside that basically says, "All right man, have it your way. If you don't want to reply, then I guess you can pay the taxes on all this stuff I sent you." It's all a big joke, but that's the extent. Like people don't see ... They think you ... Like you said, they just send something and then all these good things happen and it's not. You have to really work. Steve Larsen: You have to really keep going on them. Dana Derricks: Yeah. And just be ... But being like ... Not badgering them though either. Steve Larsen: There's a line. Dana Derricks: Value. Yeah. For sure. Steve Larsen: Okay, so someone ... Is the package ... I've heard you say this before, but just for everyone listening. Is the package the first thing you send to them? Dana Derricks: No. So what I've found is ... I'm not sure the number, like the percentage. I'd say it's close to half. Probably close to half the Dream 100 deals I've made, I've never had to send anything in the mail. Steve Larsen: Wow. Dana Derricks: Yeah. So that's more of like, it's in the tool belt, it's like a special kind of like drill. Right? You can use it when you need to, but you don't have to use it. So for me it's like more so cutting through the noise, and then giving me permission to continue to followup. Steve Larsen: Interesting. Okay. You just turn up the heat when you get to packages. Dana Derricks: For sure. And then also though, it's also about nurturing too. So I send my existing affiliate Dream 100 people, like my number one affiliate last year, I sent him ... I think I probably told you this before, but I sent him a big screen TV and surround sound just out of the blue. Right? Just to keep him happy and yeah. So that's when it comes back in is really just spoiling people and giving them gifts and all that good stuff. Steve Larsen: So ... Okay. So I mean you've given a lot of ways to actually pull this off, to get attention. As far as like pulling off a JV with them, and them ... Could you go through some of the practices that you have when someone says yes. Like, "Yeah I'm super super excited to dropout." You know, my people [ Dana. I've heard a lot of people that go by ... I don't know. They'll pull like a URL up. There's a whole lot of like small little isms and little practices that are out there. Do you mind going through just a few of those? Dana Derricks: Yeah, sure. So is this ... What's the goal? To get them to promote? Steve Larsen: Yeah. I guess as far as like they've said yes. As far as pulling off the JV with them. What are some of the things that you do to make that go smoothly? Dana Derricks: Sure. Great question. So the number one hurdle that you'll have to get through first is getting them to actually do it. Because all these people will tell you yes because they don't want to disappoint you or whatever. But few will actually follow through and do the promotion. Steve Larsen: Interesting. Dana Derricks: Yeah. And Russell talked about this too. He said ... I don't know if he's faxed me this or where I heard it but, he said for every hundred people you target, you'll probably only end up with maybe about six that actually do the promotion with you. And of those six probably only about three will actually be worth all that time and energy. Steve Larsen: Totally believe that. Dana Derricks: Yeah. Right? So I break it down like this for ... And my students do it this way. So it's like, first things first. Once we're to the point where we think we can ask, we do. And then when they say yes, we're always selling the thing that sells the thing. So it's not like ... It's getting the calendar. Getting it penciled in on the calendar. That is like the next win we need. That's what we're trying to sell. If we can get that dang spot locked up, I can remember there were ... I was on the phone with the CEO of very well known company in our space, and he's just like, "Yeah we're booked through whatever." And I'm just like, "Dude. You know what? That's totally cool. Let's just do October. Right? How's that? Like, October clean for you?" He's like, "Yeah, yeah okay." And then I'm like, "All right cool. How about the 12th?" And then just getting it on there because if they're going to be like, "Oh I want to look at my schedule, I have to view calendar, I'll have to get back to you," or whatever. But more friction right? Steve Larsen: Sidestep. Yeah. Dana Derricks: Yeah. So I found too like where it was ... Excuse the sirens this is a big deal for a town of 1000. Steve Larsen: You're good. No worries. Dana Derricks: So like, also I've been surprised too where like I had it penciled in, I'm thinking, "Yeah they just told me that so I would keep them happy, or keep me happy." And then they actually did do it on that date and time. So it was like, "Wow, this is awesome." So that's the first big thing. And then making sure that you take everything off their plate. Because the minute they thing that they're going to have to lift a finger for this, they don't want to do it. Right? So from beginning to end, we do every single thing. We will create all the swipe files for them to send out. We'll create all the affiliate ... I call them co-branded funnels. So if we're pushing a webinar for example, it'll be a co-branded webinar funnel. We'll offer to host a webinar if they are cool with that. And then we deliver everything to them about like two weeks in advance just so that everything's done. And then we followup and make sure. That's what's really cool about having an affiliate manager is that they kind of take care of all that, but like we'll make sure that every step of the way is covered so they don't - Steve Larsen: That's fascinating. Oh man that's super ... Okay wow. That's crazy cool. And what do you when you ... Because I mean, I'm sure it happens right? You go out and you're getting ... I mean I've had those people ...I've had this happen also. Like you go out and someone says yes. You get the few yes's. Six say yes, three actually do it. What do you do with those other three? Dana Derricks: Good question. So - Steve Larsen: Is that when you send them the W9? Dana Derricks: So if they've said yes but you just haven't got it scheduled yet, right? So I would try, just throw it way out in the future, and if you still don't then there's something there they want to do something with you, but apparently the way that it presented was ... That might not be what they're actually going to be comfortable doing. So I would like at trying to down sell it somehow. So if it was originally, "We're going to do a, you know, a joint venture webinar together," maybe starting out with a Facebook live might be better right? Something that's a little bit easier them to not have to fully commit to, or even just like doing an email to their list or something like that. Because even that's going to be better than nothing, and if you look at ... That's another thing that we ... Is pretty cool. So if you can do something successful with them, even if it's something small, you can go back to them and do something big. So you know, look at Russell with Grant Cardone. He went to 10X last year, and basically wasn't given ... He got on stage, and he was allowed to pitch kind of, but he wasn't allowed to do half of what he asked to do. Steve Larsen: Right. The true Russell style. Dana Derricks: Exactly right. Grant's like, "We're going to do it my way." He's like, "Okay, fine." And Russell did it Grant's way, got some wins out of it, but then look what happened the next year. Russell go to to go there and call the shots. He said, "I want this. I need that." Grant and his team said, "Okay. Whatever. You proved yourself last time." And then boom. Closes $3 million in an hour and a half. Right? But he would have never been able to do that had it not been the year before doing it Grant's way, doing it smaller, doing it in a way that Grant was more comfortable with. Steve Larsen: That's cool. That's cool. Okay. I know I'm just pounding you man. I got one more question for you. Scenario is, right, you go off, you've done the successful ones with the three, you're obviously continuing to work and warm up the leads for the other 97 as you go through. With the ones that you have done it with though, what's kind of your play as you move forward? Are you hitting them again for the next promo? Are you ... I guess post successful campaign, what kind of actions do you take with that person? Dana Derricks: Yeah. So for me, especially like once you've figured out who's good, for me it's like how can we integrate? So I just want to turn and take it to the next level. So for me personally, like let's say that I'm JVing with somebody from my course, and we do a webinar together, kill it. We do five, six figures together, whatever. I want to work with that person. I don't want to just do once a year, once a quarter. I want like full on, how can we work together. So I always offer ... What I've been doing a lot is I'll create a bonus module for whatever their thing is, if they've got a course. I'll come in there and basically teach a bonus module, or I will throw in my book in their value stack, or whatever just so that I can get not just access to their audience, on the one off promotions, but for every single buyer that comes into their world, they see me and the affiliate doesn't have to do a thing. Right? And it comes back to value. Like this module I make, it's not like a pitch necessarily. There might be call to action. There is a call to action of course, but this is value, value, value and it's always enhancing the thing that they already sold. That's kind of the secret there. So I look at integration after a successful one. Steve Larsen: Oh man, that's interesting. That's so cool. Man you have just like, just divulged. I have a full page of notes. Just given so much. I just appreciate that like crazy. I mean right, there's only a few people that ever really even written about this topic. The Chet Holmes. Amazing Chet Holmes, Russell himself, and you. That's it man. Like those are the options. I know you have a book that has come out and is amazing. You have a lot of people ... I have a lot people who'd come and ... The book's incredible. And I'm very very excited for it. Where can people go get the book? How do they find out more about you and follow you? Dana Derricks: Yeah. For sure. For anybody that's kind of vibing with this, and you're like, "Oh man, that sounds a lot better than running Facebook ads or running after the next shiny object," Stephen and I are totally Dream 100 junkies, and I'd love for you guys to do the same. So it's called The Dream 100 Book. Actually had the foreword written by Russell. It's pretty cool. I think Stephen's read it. Steve Larsen: Woo-hoo. Yeah. Dana Derricks: There is a caveat. Actually listen to Stephen's advice. So one of things you have really made famous Stephen is the concept of sell it before you make it. Right? Which I love by the way. I actually did that. Stephen said to do that - Steve Larsen: No way. Dana Derricks: Yeah dude. So I sold a copy of The Dream 100 Book, my first copy, for $2000 before I wrote one page of it. Steve Larsen: No way. I didn't know that. Dana Derricks: Yeah dude. Because Russell says writing a book is similar to giving childbirth. Which is...None of us know, but it's probably true. And so there was no better incentive to write a book than to have somebody on the hook for two grand that's waiting for it. Right? So anyway, that's the caveat. It is $2000. However, because Stephen was so gracious to put on a chicken suit and drive around on a motorcycle in Boise, Idaho - Steve Larsen: I secretly just loved it. I was excited. Dana Derricks: Yeah. I mean if he didn't like it, he was putting on a good show. So for you guys listening, if you're vibing with this, I'm actually going to let you guys get a copy of it for free. Steve Larsen: Holy crap. Dana Derricks: I don't do this really for money that much anymore, so I'm cool with that as long as you guys don't share this with the rest of the world. [inaudible 00:48:48] The mad buyers that paid two grand for it. So the link is going to be ListentoStephen.com. ListentoStephen.com. Steve Larsen: That's cool man. Appreciate that. It's S-T-E-P-H-E-N. Yeah? Dana Derricks: Correct. The good spelling. Steve Larsen: Yeah, the good spelling. The biblical way. No but seriously, just echo what Dana's saying here like I ... Funnel's nothing without traffic. And especially as an entrepreneur and those of you guys who were listening. I know you guys are go getters. This podcast is getting a significant amount of downloads daily now and I thank you all for listening, but what I want you to know ... And that's the way that I think about it too. Russell thinks about it, Dana thinks about it. Like all these top guys, they're not out looking usually for like this little tiny trick insight of a platform. Right? A Facebook trick. A Twitter trick. They're not looking ... That's not how they do it. Instead, they outsource that piece of it, because we all know it's still important, and they go focus 100% of the time on developing these kinds of relationships. So anyway, I'm super excited. That was very very generous of you give that Dana. So it's ListentoStephen.com. Dana Derricks: Totally. And you all should listen to Stephen. Keep listening to him. Steve Larsen: I appreciate that. Well thanks for being on the show man, and where can everyone go to follow you as well? Dana Derricks: So being the farmer I am, I don't think I'm on instant grams. I'm over on Facebook, or DanaDerricks.com, or just keep listening to Stephen, and every once in a while I'll probably pop up. Steve Larsen: Absolutely. All right. Hey, thanks so much for being on the show. And everyone go to ListentoStephen.com and get the free copy of ... It's literally called Dream 100. Was two grand, for this audience it's free. Dana Derricks: Go get it. Steve Larsen: Boom. Just try to tell me you didn't like that. Hey whoever controls content controls the game. Want to interview or get interviewed yourself? Grab a time now at SteveJLarsen.com.

Steve Larsen: Hey, what's going on everyone? This is Steve Larsen, and you're listening to an epic episode of Secret MLM Hacks Radio. So here's the real mystery. How do real MLMers like us, who didn't cheat and only bug family members and friends, who want to grow a profitable home business, how do we recruit A players into our downlines and create extra incomes, yet still have plenty of time for the rest of our lives? That's the blaring question, and this podcast will give you the answer. My name is Steve Larsen and welcome to Secret MLM Hacks Radio. What's up guys? Hey I'm very excited for this episode today. I have a super cool little thing here for you. I've often told you guys before, in fact, I've told many of you this before. I've created a lot of info products now, in my life. I've seen a lot of offers. One of the things that I teach is offer creation, right? You know, with ClickFunnels, and I am one of the coaches for their new two comma club coaching program. It's a program that I helped launch about a year ago, a little over a year ago, and I was the only coach. I had 675 students, and I was the only coach. My job was to go through all of their offers with them. Help them create a very sexy and attractive offer based on the person they're trying to sell and get them out there making money for a lot of them, for the first time in their life. We had tons of awesome success stories from that. We had people make anywhere from their first thousand bucks to six million. Lots of stuff. I had a chance to ... Anyway, the only reason I'm bringing this up is, it makes me sound like I'm ... that makes me feel like I'm really egotistical. What I'm trying to say is, after going through so many of these people, and after I've had a whole bunch of people come into the Secret MLM Hacks program, after I've had another group of like six or 700 people come in to do it again, I'm coming up on a lot of people that I've done this with. I had the opportunity to do that again this morning for several hours with some students, kind of one on one with them, and go through and help figure out part of what it is they're actually selling. There's some things that I always run into people. This roadblocks that I always see people will run into. And doing that many times, it's hard not to notice the patterns, right? So I thought what I'd do for this episode is kind of show or share with you one of the patterns. It's so extremely simple, okay? It is so extremely simple, but it ends up being like their entire business plan. I don't know if you guys have ever created a business plan before in the sense that school usually has you go through it, like business school, right? We'd write these massive like 15-20 page business plans, and I don't know. There was still like no plan on how to actually ... Anyway, what I want to share with you today is, in my mind, one of the easiest ways to sidestep, having to go through this massive business plan writing. I think business plans, in the sense that they're taught, are usually pure garbage, right? Unless you need massive cash for like some VC funding, which I'm also very against, because in my mind, if you got something of worth, if you got something that's actually solving problems for people, like, you don't always need VC funding. I know that will cause some polarities, I say that, but that's okay. I actually am very against VC funding. Very few scenarios I can ever think of ever where someone should actually get it. Anyway, so, what I want to do is I want to walk through, just real quick, just a very simple process to figure out what your business actually is and what it's doing. So you're thinking about your MLM, right? You're thinking about your downline thing. There's several aspects to it, right? Number one, you are selling people into your opportunity itself. That's great. Absolutely love it. I've got some cool systems to do that for me. We just passed our 200th person applying to join my downline, someone I've never met before, right? That's amazing, okay? That's what I teach inside Secret MLM Hacks, if you guys have never heard of that yet or hadn't a chance to see it, go check it out. It's had a chance to bless a lot of lives. Actually, it's been really fun. Had a lot of cool success stories in there. It's been a lot of fun. The other avenue though, other business avenue that you've got is this area, where you're selling your MLM's actual product, right? I have a system for eventually getting people to both, but at the beginning, I only focus on one or the other. I'm only selling the product, or I'm only selling the opportunity. At the end, they promote each other, but not at the beginning. I lead with one or the other. Okay. Anyway, here's the framework. Here's the framework. This is how I do what I do, and this is the framework that I use for people to go through and get more clear on who it is that they're selling. You see, one of the things that I ran into early on inside this business is, a lot of guys know, I literally ... I wanted to be successful in MLM so bad that I walked down Main Street. I was so ... Guys, my pride was on the line. You might actually be the same, where you have a whole bunch of people who's been telling you, "Oh is this just another one of those things again?" and that hurt my pride. That made me feel like I was an idiot. That made me feel like I had nothing. You most likely have had something like that happened to you. I mean, I don't know anyone who's in business, who's actually successful, who's actually never had a naysayer. You know what I mean? We all have them. We all have them. I was feeling it hard. This was four, five years ago, something like that. I wanted this to be successful so bad that I literally was walking down Main Street pitching people. I would down and be like, "Hey," and my pitch was bad, and I didn't know what I was doing. I was fumbling through it, and I went through, and I was getting people like, "Come on. You should buy this. This is so cool." I didn't know what I was doing. I got some people who said, "Yes," and I had a ton of people who said, "No." I ended up recruiting a lot of people. What are the issues that I ran into, which you most likely have run into as well, is, I was like, "Oh my gosh. This is so cool. I worked my butt off. I was literally walking down Main Street. I recruited some businesses. I did recruit some friends and family. I did recruit some total strangers." It wasn't that many. This is the first time I'd ever done anything in MLM ever at that time. I really, really did not want to fail at this. I felt like I had failed at so many things before, which now, in hindsight, makes me realize that's what actually led to all the success, which has been so cool, but it's hard to see that when you're in the middle of it, right? And you most likely have been there as well. You might be right now. In fact, I was looking at some old pictures. I was looking at some old pictures of when my wife and I got married. We had hardly any money. It was three weeks into our marriage, and it was Christmastime. We had no money. We were so poor. Guys, I literally took a piece of like butcher paper and I thumbtacked it to our wall. It was totally empty in there because we had no money for furniture, and I literally took a Crayola crayon, and I drew a fireplace next to our tree that was like a foot tall. We put it on this little stand, so I was a little bit taller. Then we put like a present or two underneath from each other. These are like ... You know what I mean? This is the cherishing moments you remember at the beginning of marriage. We just had nothing. Anyway, we really had nothing, and I really, really wanted to make this work. I felt like I've been trying tons of stuff and nothing had been happening, nothing had been working. And externally, yes, that's the thing that I really, really wanted. Internally though, it was a pride issue like, "I can do this." You know, I really wanted to prove it. "I can do this. I can totally ... This is something that I can go do. Look at me like a provider. Look at me ... " You know what I mean? I'm sure that we've all had that kind of feeling before. It's something that really affected me, so I feel like I wasn't. Women get their identity primarily by the way they make a home, right? A lot of studies have shown that. Men get their identity in a sense of self-worth by with their occupation, right? And so, for a man to go through and say, "I can't provide," really detrimentally hurts their insides. And so, I was feeling that. So anyways, I'm walking around, and I was so stoked because that first month after walking down Main Street and doing all this stuff, unless you guys have been on the free Secret MLM Hacks training, secretmlmhacks.com, if you guys want to check it out. But if you guys have been on it, you've heard the story. And I was so excited. I got those first 13 people in, in that first month. I think it was like five weeks, but you know, whatever. So I had 13 people, right? I was so pumped. What's funny is nobody did anything, but that's not what my thought was. I was like, "Oh my gosh. It's going to be crazy. This is going to be so cool." If that person gets 13, that person gets 13, that person ... oh my gosh. The biggest problem we're going to have is, like, "What do we do with all this money? I'm going to go blow my nose in 20s now. Oh my gosh. What private island should I buy?" Right? And that was my mentality at the time. That's what I was thinking anyway. I was like shocked. I was appalled that no one did anything. I was like, "Do you not see? Can you not see? Can you not see the opportunity that we have in front of us?" It's like, "What's going on?" Okay. Fast-forward five years, fast-forward to now, where there are people applying I've never met before. In fact, a ton of them, by the hundreds now. I've got cool systems that are out there. It's the exact same thing I teach inside Secret MLM Hacks, exact same thing I teach for my personal downline. It's what I do, and it works incredibly well. What changed? This is what changed, and this is what I walk people through when I'm coaching them, okay? When I say this, do not dismiss it, because even if you've heard what I'm about to say, I guarantee you may not have heard it in a way that I have than I'm about to teach this, okay? Number one, you have got to figure out who your dream customer is, not who you could be selling to. That's one of the biggest problems we all run into as entrepreneurs. We see the solutions we offer. We see the value that we deliver out there, and we start saying phrases like, "Well that person could buy it, and this person could buy it." Let's say you're selling water machines. I had somebody who literally walk up to me once, and they were selling water machines. I was like, "Who do you sell to?" They were like, "Well everybody needs water, so I'm selling everybody." I was like, "That's the definition of nobody." I'm not talking about who could you sell to. I'm saying, "Who is your dream customer, the lay-down sale, the person that's so easy to sell to you barely have to open your mouth?" They're like, "Oh my gosh. Yes, I want that," and they pay premium price to do so. Right? That's who you want to sell to. That's who you want on your team. Okay. Identify the dream person, and you put them down, your dream client. You write them down, and you bring that person to life, and you sit down, and you start thinking, "You know what? I want a person who's already been done something in business before. I want to do something. I want the person in who's not afraid to talk to people, so I have to deal with that issue anymore. You know what? I want ... " Or rather, if you're recruiting, or let's say you're selling product. Let's say ... I don't know. Let's see you're selling ... Keto products are big right now, right? Let's say, "I want to go sell somebody who's already purchased supplements in the past, so I don't have to teach them the first time to take on something like a supplement. I want to get an individual who is ... " Does that make sense? Get that dream client down. Know who they are. That is step number one. Who is the dream customer, not who could you sell to. That's a different category, and usually, it causes a lot of angst, a lot of headaches, and they're freeloaders, and usually, they're terrible to work with. It's just the truth. Okay. I hope we all got all thick skin here, because ... Right? Just the truth. Somebody doesn't want your thing, you should not sell them. Do not sell people who have a need. You sell people who want it. People who have a want, so much better. Oh my gosh, that's a better client, customer. Okay, so, that's the first thing. Number one, who the heck are you selling to? The dream person. Number two, where do they hang out? Where can you reach them? Is there a group of them that all hang out together? Maybe they all hang out in the same Facebook group. Maybe they'll hang out in the same forum. Maybe they all listen to the same podcasts. Where are they? Right? Where are they? Where are they actively? I am not a huge person on Instagram, but I'm actually really getting into it now. Whenever I learn something, I drop little nuggets on there. If you guys want to follow me, totally would love that, and it's been a ton of fun. It's been a ton of fun to go through and build that up. But before, for quite some time, I was not actually on Instagram ever. People go to the same places to consume their information. So where is your dream customer hanging out? Maybe it's an existing business owner. Well where do all the successful existing business owners get their information from? Maybe they all subscribe to the same magazines. Maybe they all listen the same kinds of content. Maybe they all go to the same YouTube channels. Does that make sense? Where are they? Answer that question. Who is the dream customer? Not, who could you sell to? Who's the dream client? The one, just the one. It's funny. When you actually end up searching after the one, you actually get a few of the fringes. If you don't have it though, you don't get any you don't get fringes or the dream customer. Actually, you get headaches and projects. I got enough products in my life. I don't need a person as a project. Someone who's not figured out other things inside their life yet. Does that make sense? Does that make sense? So number one, who's your dream customer? Number two, where are they? Where do they consume their information? And number three, what could you say to them, or what could you give to them? Maybe it's a sample for the product. Maybe you have your own little ebook that you wrote that would serve them in their business. What's the bait? That's the question you're trying to ask. What bait do you have that will get them to come over to you? Notice what I said. What will get them to come over to you? Not, you go to them. What's so powerful about this is that when you reach out and you start dropping pieces, little pieces of bait that turns somebody towards you, what you're doing is, it means you don't have to go through heavy and hardcore sales tactics or techniques anymore, because they know. They're like, "Oh my gosh. Steve Larsen's dropping so much crap of amazing stuff on his podcast. That's amazing." That's exactly what I'm doing, everybody, right? I'm just peeling back curtains so you know. This podcast is a piece of bait, and it has brought incredible people to me, incredible people from my downline, amazing people inside my products, right? Both my personal ones and my MLM ones. Does that make sense? I hope this is making sense. What bait, what can I actually solve for them? What can I say to them? Whether it's a product or something that you're saying, or maybe your sample really is so good that when you hand it to somebody, it sells them. That rarely happens I found out though. Products don't make sales. A sales message makes sales. Anyway, different topic totally. Okay. So that's number three. Who is the dream customer? Number two, where are they? Number three, what bait can I use to get them to come to me? Right? So I can persuade them to come to me rather than me go convince them. That's the benefit of using that. What bait ... That might mean that you create something. I will tell you it's one of the highest leverage things you need to go create though, okay? Don't get scared by the fact that you might have to make something, because I answer that question. Then, number four, where are you trying to take them? Just one place, not two. This is usually why I only sell, first of all, a product and then eventually talk about the opportunity, or I'll sell the opportunity only and then eventually talk about the product. I never do both at the same time. Maybe that's just personal taste, but usually, the human brain can only handle one thing at once. And so, anyway, does that make sense though? Just that four-step process that will clean up a ton of stuff that you're doing in your business. It will help you identify who the best person is for your business. That's why I have so many amazing people. Because I've done this process so many times, I know exactly who I want in my downline. I know exactly where they are. I know exactly what bait gets them to come to me. I know where I'm taking them, right? I know where I'm taking them. I'm taking them to this beautiful place of automation and sweet funnel automation and marketing, using the internet. Then I hand off the same systems to them. That's crazy. It's like the first actual duplicatable thing I've ever found in my life. Does that make sense? Anyway, hopefully, that helps. That's my four steps to identifying. Frankly, it's the four steps to getting my dream customer, to getting a downline that I actually like. Does that make sense? Because I know that we've all created downlines. Most of us have probably got someone on downlines, and we're like, "I don't know if I like my customer," right? Just to be real with you, right? "I don't know if I like my customer today. I don't know if I like the people in my downline right now. I don't know if I like that I have to babysit everybody and put a cattle prod to their back to get him to do anything." So I said, "I'm not going to do that anymore," so I don't. I did that by upgrading and getting more specific on the dream person. Now, I get a few of others and that's fine, but now, there's another support system. The people that are inside my downline are rockstars. I'm not the only rockstar in there. Everyone's a rockstar. So when we get someone who might be struggling a little bit, there is a ton of support. Now, I'm not alone. This thing's actually duplicatable. Does that make sense? That's why I crafted this. That's why I did the whole ... That's why I left job to come do this, because I started seeing this putting all together, and I was doing it for these other people, and I was like, "Wait a second. I know I could do that." You can too. Anyway, hey guys, thanks so much. Hopefully, that was effective for you. And please write those down. Number one, who's my dream customer? Number two, write, where are they? Number three, what's the bait I can use to actually get them to come to me, so I don't go to them? And then, number four, write, where the heck am I going to take them? Do I want to lead them first to product? Am I going to lead them first to opportunity? Maybe it's my own third party info product that I create. And, you start putting those things together to figure out how to actually answer that question. That one little simple four question formula right there will drastically increase the quality of both your customer and your downline and will start solving problems for you. Problems that you didn't know were problems because of the quality of the individual and the state of the individual who's actually coming to you now. It has changed everything in my business, and I absolutely love it. I actually like MLM again. Does that make sense? For a long time ... I know I said too much, "Does that make sense? Does that make sense?" I should not say it so much. But for a long time, I didn't. I was like, "Blah. MLM. Serious? I really got to do this again?" Network marketing, direct selling, whatever you want to call it. I like MLM again, and it's because of the way that I treat this process. Guys, thanks so much. Appreciate it. If you hadn't a chance to check out secretmlmhacks.com, please go do so. Would love to have you on that free web class there. It'll teach you the three-step system I use to automate my recruiting. It's the three steps I used to auto I ought it's the three steps I used to auto recruit my downline, without my friends and family even knowing that I'm in MLM. Guys, thank you so much, and I'll talk to you later. Bye. Hey, thanks for listening. Please remember to rate and subscribe. Whether you just want more leads or automated MLM funnels, or if you just want to learn to get paid more for your product, head over to secretmlmhacks.com to join the next free training today.

Steve Larsen: What's going on everyone? This is Steve Larsen, and you're listening to Secret MLM Hacks Radio. So here's the real mystery. How do Real MLMers like us create and cheat and only bug family members and friends who want to grow a profitable home business? How do we recruit A players into our downlines and create extra incomes, yet still have plenty of time for the rest of our lives? That's the blaring question in this podcast. We'll give you the answer. My name is Steve Larsen and welcome to Secret MLM Hacks Radio. What's up guys? Hey, hopefully you're doing awesome. I know it's been a little while since I've published here. I've been at several events. I've spoken at several events. Been flying like crazy. It's been a lot of fun. What I wanted to do for this episode was, I wanted to drop in a recording of me coaching the people who were inside of the program that I sell called Secret MLM Hacks. And it's been a lot of fun coaching them. I realize that I've now brought almost 900 people through this process or similar process as well, and had a lot of success with it. I've been able to go through it and help create millionaires, many of them now, and it's been great. And so one of the things that I notice, there's always this point as people start to learn something new, that they will go through, it happens to pretty much everybody that I've ever seen and watch. And what they'll do is, they'll sit back and they will start to question the very process that they're going through. And what I wanted to do is, I wanted to drop in. It's kind of special, guys. It's unique. There's three things that I ask every single person that I am coaching to go through internally. And so the next, it's like 20, 30 minutes, something like that, but it's totally worth it I promise, for you to go through and see what those three things are that I drop out to my students to help them know what I expect from them as they move forward inside of my program. So if you're sitting on the fence or whatever, every Friday what I do is, I always want people to know that I am there for them to help them answer questions, to coach them along the path, to push them when they need pushing. I look at myself as a coach. I tell them I'm a coach. Now, one thing about a coach is that coaches don't always make things comfortable. The purpose of the coach is to cause progression. And sometimes progress requires a little bit of pain, or discomfort, or things that are new, things you never ... Anyway, this is me going through and setting kind of the premise as far as hey, here are the three things that I require. And what's kind of cool is, regardless if you're in my program or not, these are things that you can use inside your own downline that I think that you will be able to help set the bar so that you create people who are people of action. One of the things that is most dangerous is when you recruit a whole bunch of people, which I've totally done this before, and probably most of us have, but you recruit a whole bunch of people who are not expecting to run on their own. Right? How do you get someone past that? And so this what I tell my people. This is what tell not just the people in my group, but also people inside of my very downline to help set the bar and help people realize that, yes, I'll run, but I'll run with you, not for you. These are the three things that I have people go through and understand. Anyways, I'm going to cue this over here. You can even take notes if you'd like to. These three things though, drastically, drastically, I've always found increase the speed of success for the person who is either in my downline, or the person I'm coaching, whatever it may be. Anyways, hopefully you guys enjoy this. Thanks so much. Guys, I'm excited for today. I hope you're doing well and I am just thrilled to be part of this group. I'm so touched by the number of you guys that are just out there just killing it, just doing everything that you can to just run forward. One of the hardest things I have as a coach is, I've had a total of about 900 people, ish. Let me think. Yeah. It's almost 900 people, 900 people in the last year that I've coached through these kinds of processes and similar thing as you guys are going through right now. And the thing that gets heartbreaking for me is this whole idea that, you guys, no one's teaching what I'm teaching. You've got the material, in my mind, the best tools, in my mind. You've got the best stuff that's out there, your complete Blue Ocean Strategy. You've got all this stuff that's out there. And the thing that hangs people up, it's like, well. What is it then? It's actually the ability for the individual to believe that it can work, and that's it. That's it. The ability to believe that it actually can work. And yes, Stephen, I totally get it. And yes, I will marry the process. One of the things, every once in a while I get someone to reach out. They're like, "Are you telling me that I actually have to put a few things into this? I actually have to work on it?" I was like, "Well, yeah. It's a business. Of course you have to." But it's not completely turnkey all the way? It's like, no, it wouldn't be valuable then. Are you serious? Are you serious? I've turned key to everything that I can. You know what I mean? And it's hard for me to see that as a coach. So those of you guys who are, you're out there, you're hustling. You're trying to apply all the stuff that I'm teaching. You're going through and you're just going through the motions. You're just doing it. I thank you. It means a lot to me. It's heartbreaking for me to see that. I've been where you are. And two years ago, I was broke, guys. And I went through and I started putting all these pieces together and putting these ... And it's crazy. I ended up getting my first Two Comma Club award. What? That's crazy. Million dollars through a single funnel. Crazy. Changed my life. And I started coaching people on this process. And over the last year I've had over almost 900 people in, which is crazy, that I've had a chance to bring through at this, both personal coaching students, you guys, Russell's group, which is huge, another group of mine that I have that's big. And it's been just, it's so fun. But it also is an emotional roller coaster for the coach. And those of you guys who have an existing team and you're trying to get people to take action, you've been through that before and you know what I'm talking about. And so I'm very appreciative of you guys and just going forward and just doing it. There's been a ton of success stories already in this group alone, and it's not that old. It's pretty new still, actually. And I've had a lot of people reach out, and it's the classic excuses. Well, I don't know that I have time. It's like, "Are you serious? This can make you a million bucks. What's the worth to you?" It's not going to be done in a week? No. How long does it take for my four year old to grow into an adult? Years. Right? I want to shortcut that process for you by a ton if you just do what I tell you to do on it. But one thing I want you to know and understand and be a part of and realize is, I wish people would just stop questioning the process. The process works, but people get so caught up in questioning whether or not the process works that they're not actually doing the process. So sit back like, "Will that actually work?" Why don't you get there, try it, and find out. You know what I mean? It's so much better to do it that way and do it that model than it is to go the other way and start questioning every little thing. Something, doing something, is always better than sitting back and questioning. You just won't get anything done. At the very bare bolts of it, I have never seen anybody who actually is failing when they just have pig headed discipline running towards stuff. It may not even be the fact ... They might not even be running towards the right thing, but just the fact that they're running, they drastically increase their chances of actually being successful with something. Rather than sit back and go, "Oh, what about this? What about this? What about this?" So I'm so thankful because, especially those of you guys, typically it's those who get on these calls with me or will see them later that are the ones that are actually doing it, pushing forward. And not to be a jab at anybody, I hope that it's a teachable moment though. If you want to look back and think to yourself, "Am I actually teachable?" Right? A lot of what I teach you guys, I think it was model three, goes through and teaches you more about internal beliefs of your customer, or your prospective customers, of people you'd want to sell both on your product and your downline. And what I want you to do, what I invite you guys to do, is to take the time to sit back and think to yourself, "Self, what are my false beliefs about what Stephen's telling me?" And do the same thing to yourself as what I'm trying to teach you to do to your customers. Start asking yourself, "Am I believing him or am I?" Because I know it works. I was just at Funnel Hacking Live in Florida this last week. And it was so cool to sit back and watch 90 more people get their Two Comma Club award and sit back and go, "Wow. They were from my program. They were from my program. They were from my program. They were from my ... " Whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa. Holy crap. And it's cool to see that. I know the process works. The issue I run into is the person's individual belief. And funny enough, I have to treat you like I do a normal customer like you have to. Right? Just because you're in this program, it's not over for me. Just like when you get someone in your downline, it's not over for you. You've got to continue to look at them and go, "What is the belief? What's the belief that these people are struggling with as far as taking an action?" I an put a cattle prod to your back and get you to do something for a little while, but that's not sustainable. It's better for me to sit back and think, "What is the belief?" Behavior is driven by belief. So if I want to affect your behavior, I've got to [inaudible 00:09:10] your belief. What's the belief you have about this program's success, or my product's success, or my downline's ability to make you ... Does that make sense? And then I go, "Hey. Now that I know what the vehicle related beliefs are, now what are the actual internal beliefs?" Which, typically go towards things that are insecurities, meaning someone will go, "Oh, this looks like it could work for me, Stephen, but I'm not a coder. I don't know any ClickFunnel stuff." I'm not a coder either. Or, I'm not going to know what to say. I'm not going to know what to do. I'm not good face to face with people. I'm not either. That's why I freaking built a funnel for it. Right? Does that make sense? I constantly am looking at what you guys are doing. I'm constantly, and I'm watching. Just so you know, I'm watching and I'm seeing where you guys are and I'm seeing what you're doing and I'm watching. I'm trying to be reactionary to what it is he's doing in a way that we've been more successful with it. So I am going back and as far as the external, that's the next one. And people will blame their ability to be successful on things that are away from them. I can't be successful with this program, or I can't be successful with this downline, or with this product, whatever it is, whatever you're selling. I can't be successful because of this, and they blame it on that. They blame it on things away from them. Time, I don't have enough money. I don't have enough energy or resources. I work a nine to five. So did I, guys. That's how I bootstrapped the whole way. Okay. My ability to be successful, I can't do it because, boom, look at this. My spouse, they're not going to be supportive enough. Right? Those are the internal and then external things that people deal with, and so I'm watching. I'm watching you. Not in a creepy way, please understand. But I'm watching you. And I'm watching and I'm going, "Oh, gosh dang it. That's the thing right there. They're struggling with this, or they struggling with that." And the thing that just will wreck me on the inside is when I sit back and I watch people and I'm like, "You wouldn't be saying that. The reason you are saying that is because I sound like you're believing that in order to be successful, you have to have zeros and ones running through your veins." Not true. Or, you feel like you've got to have a ton of time. Well, yeah, but I'm going to short cut the five years I've taken to do this hopefully down to five weeks. You know what I mean? And shorten it down if you're just willing to feel ... So the thing that I have to ask you to do and I know that I'm preaching to the choir here because you guys are on here with me and you're typically the ones who are doing it, which I'm very excited for and just so appreciative. I can't tell you how much mental kudos that gives me to see you and watch you be like, "Oh, man. He's doing it. She's doing it. They're doing it. Yes, yes, yes, yes." Road block, sure. Right? Something unexpected, something hard, absolutely, totally going to happen. But to stop questioning the process and just marry the process and be willing to give yourself to the pieces of sacrifice it requires to be vulnerable, to sit back and go, "I don't know this. And the first time I start publishing, Stephen, I'm going to look like an idiot." Well, yeah, duh. I did too. And you go back and you're like, "Oh, my gosh." And you start backtracking, backtracking, backtracking, backpedal, backpedal, backpedal. And you've got to be able to know and marry the process as you go. I'm thankful for you guys like crazy, those of you guys that are doing it. It makes it worth it for me. At this point of where it am, it doesn't have anything to do with money. I want to be able to be building something that has direct impact and is able to go. If I can get you to do it, think of the dozens and maybe even hundreds, maybe even thousands of people it will affect as you teach your downlines this stuff. I know it works better. I know it does. I'm doing it. Right? You guys know it does. You're in it. And if I can get ... This is how we change an industry. And so I'm attacking it from several levels. I'm trying to help you guys, us, the little guy. I'm trying to help us get this done. And then I'm also starting to work through some possibilities of working through a few different MLMs from the corporate angle who are willing to accept this stuff, who are not trying to use it to crush the little guy. You know what I mean? I'm very careful. I do not want that to happen. So anyway, it means a lot to me, so if I can get you to believe that the process is the way and that you marry the process and set your own feelings aside and understand that there will be moments of embarrassment. You're going to be feelings you have no idea what to do. Sometimes you'll be like, "Oh, my gosh. Tech stuff, or not enough time in my life." There's never enough time in your life. That's all an excuse. Or this, or that, if you can get past that piece of it, holy crap guys, the world is your oyster because you're able to go through and actually make progress on these things without actually sitting back and going, "Is this actually going to work?" You're never going to find out if you just keep asking that. You know what I mean? So I'm thankful for you guys. And then the second thing I would encourage you to do is find somebody to teach quickly. Find someone to teach quickly the things that you are learning. It will solidify it in your head. It's the way I got through school was by ... Even random people, I would just teach random people the stuff I was learning from teachers that day. And it's what got me from completely failing and getting kicked out of college. True story. And going back, reapplying, getting back in and almost getting straight As the rest of college. And it was that piece right there. A few other things as well, obviously. Very religious, I certainly believe that God helps me with that. But one of the things I did on my part was to make sure that I was teaching people what I was learning, so please do that. And keep learning and teach what it is that you're learning. So I'm like, "Publish. Publish. Publish." That's what you're publishing. You're publishing the things that you're learning. Someone had asked me the other day, "Stephen, when do you think you'll run out of podcast content?" I'm like, "I never thought of that." Maybe at the very beginning when I started, but that is it. I brainstormed over 100 episode topics just like this last Monday, or Tuesday I mean. And 100, and someone was like, "When are you going to run out of stuff?" And I was like, "Wait a second. You believe that I know all this already." When I started publishing a year and a half ago, no. I was like, "Whoa. Okay. Thanks for saying that." Here's the big secret. Here's the big secret. You are learning with me and I publish as I go. And if you can get to that spot, start publishing what you are learning, it will change your life because it will solidify the message in your head. You're teaching what you're learning will solidify it. You're bringing people along with you and if you wait to be the guru on the mountain, nobody's going to follow you when you're this expert already. They're going to look at you and go, "I don't know if I can get where you are because look where you are." And since you haven't documented your journey down in the spot when you weren't up here, when you're down here and you're still kind of figuring it out. And you mess up and you've got the blunders. It's the reason why my first few episodes are not that good. But I leave them up there so that people understand, yeah, Stephen's gone through his own transformation. Right? So if you're like, "I'm brand new," you're in the perfect spot to start publishing, which is why ... What is it, model four that goes through that? Model four or five goes through and actually teaches you more about the actual publishing parts and why I do what I do. That's why that's in there, so that you can go through and do it, have the funnel and start actually implementing this stuff because you're in a prime position to start publishing as you're just one chapter ahead of everybody. And they'll see the transformation and your speed will increase. And it's not a linear curve. It's an exponential curve. And it'll take a while and you'll feel stupid for a little bit. And you'll blunder up and there'll be things that people will not be able to follow you on. And then suddenly one day you're just like, "Wait a second. Today I didn't take one step. I took five, but it felt like one. Huh." It's happening to me right now. I left my job three months ago and it's happening right now. And I can feel myself on this curve and it's been really weird, but it's been really cool. And since I published before I felt myself kind of like leveling up fast. That feels weird to say that. But since I was publishing beforehand, I have a lot of people reaching out going, "Stephen, it's so cool to see you out there just winning and doing it. Oh, my gosh. It's so cool. It's so refreshing to know that there's some guy out there who's actually pulling it off. It's not just all a whole bunch of smoke." And I'm like "Of course not. What are you talking about?" And so I was like, "Well, if I follow this guru or that guru, I don't know. Were they always like that?" There's no documentation of them being somebody down here. And so publishing is your safety net for this entire game, all of it. I know I've said that before, but it is. It's your safety net for the whole game. And if I can get you just to publish, oh my gosh, that's so much better. That's so much better because if you jack something up on some ... Whether or not we're using ClickFunnels, I don't care if you're using ClickFunnels or not. It'll speed up your progress a lot. It will. But if you don't want to and you don't have the cash for it, that's fine. Start asking yourself. How do I afford it? And get it eventually. My first funnels were on YouTube. Literally, they're just YouTube videos with links on the bottom. There you go. Until I could afford and asked myself the question. How can I afford ClickFunnels? And started developing little assets that paid for it. I just want you guys to do it and I'm excited for you to be part of this. Just marry the process. Be willing to go through some of the cuts and scrapes that are required for any individual as they start to move up, I should say. Increase their income. Increase their influence. Gain a following. For you to have a following by definition means you must be a leader. And that's what I wanted to do was to help you develop into that person. And if you can publish and you can start building these funnels and you start doing all this stuff and start learning, I know I dump a ton of stuff on you guys on that course. It's a lot. I know it's a lot. But I'm trying to overwhelm your brain in the right ways that cause growth, not scared-ness, like oh crap, I'm never going to make it. I hope it doesn't do that to you. But if I can cause overwhelm in the good ways and decrease the time. Guys, I have all of college I slept maybe four to five hours, maybe a lot of times three every night, all of college, learning this stuff. I would after, in the middle of my nine to five job, I would get to the office at 6:00 AM. I did this for such a long time. I'd get to the office at 6:00 AM and then I would go and I would be working on my own stuff until 9:00 AM for three hours. And then I would be on the clock for my employer, Russell. And then I would stop at about 6:00 PM. Hang out with our kids. At about 8:00, I would start again. And 8:00, I did this every day, every day. 8:00 PM, I would start again and I would go until another three hours, until about 11:00 PM. I'd go to sleep. I'd get back up at 5:00 and I'd do it all over again. And what I'm trying to do is, I'm trying to shortcut the time. You have to know some of this stuff. The only two tasks you need to know in this whole business, you've got to figure out how to innovate and how to market, which ultimately is exactly what the course teaches you. Everything else is a cost on the business. Don't worry about your logo. Stop worrying about what your colors are. It doesn't matter what your mantra is. How do you market? That's not what a mantra is. How do you market? Which is storytelling and belief shifting. And how do you innovate, offer creation? That's it. And then once you can understand those things, then I bring you into this whole thing called funnel building. If you want to you can take it to the big leagues in the ClickFunnels area. But before that, it's just fluff. It's all noise. Anyway, I want you to know where this path is. And if you can just stick to it and just do it, man, it's so rewarding. It's so rewarding to look back. I was telling one of my buddies the other day. For the first time in my life, and I'm about to turn 30 in like three weeks, yeah, about three weeks. For the first time in my life, I feel fulfilled. Isn't that interesting? I mean, professionally. Fascinating, isn't it? And it's affected all these other areas of my life. But it came with a crap ton of grinding. And so I'm trying to cut out the crap and the fluff and the noise and the junk that does not matter for you to actually get there. And if I can do that ... Just marry the process and don't spend time doing that. Make the sins of commission, not omission. Meaning, just act. Make mistakes of committing, committing, committing. Maybe you're in action. You're actually doing stuff. The status thing is when people sit back and their making the mistakes of omission, meaning they're just sitting back and they're just questioning. Well, I'm not going to start until I go beginning to end. That's garbage. You're not going to do anything. Total garbage. If that's your belief, please be coachable in this moment and let me tell you that is not a correct and accurate belief. That is not. You do not ever know beginning to end ever. If you wait to, you'll never see. You'll actually never do anything. If you instead sit back and you say, "Look. These are the three steps that I'm going to take right now." And in fact, I only care about step number one. And you put your foot out there and you take that step as perfectly as that step can be placed, boom, you take that step. Funny enough, after step number three usually, for me anyways, I can see a thing. It's pure black. I have no idea. I have no idea what I'm going to be doing on the 25th. You know what I mean? I don't know. But I know where the peak is and I'm just heading towards the direction of that peak. Is there a way for me to get to that peak with the most efficiency? Yeah. Totally. But I don't know that until I'm there. And hindsight's 20/20. I don't know that until I've gone through it. So if I can sit back and look back and go, "Oh, man. Next time I do this, I should do it that way." What I'm trying to do is, I'm trying to make it instead of a line up to that peak where it's like, all over the place, I'm trying to go through and help you know, look, the straight line is by doing this and then this and then this and then this. But don't worry about this, this, and this, until you do just step number one. And funny enough, a new step number three will appear when you place your foot down. Boom, new step number three. That wasn't there until I placed my first step. Interesting. What if I placed my next step? You don't learn anything else until all you're learning is, you're learning how to place the next step, the new step number one. Boom. Oh, sweet. What? A new step number three appeared. Right? And that's how it happens the whole way through. And the thing that will ... It rips me up on the inside, guys. I know I'm totally on a soap box right now. I'll get your questions in a moment here. The thing that rips me up on the inside, I'll be coaching these people. I just had a chance to speak in front of 3000 people last Friday. It was super fun. It was amazing. And the thing that eats me up on the inside is when I sit back and I watch people and they're like, "Stephen, that sounds really good. And I see what you're doing. I actually think it works, but there's these other areas over here. I just don't know how they work, so I can't get started." No. That's not how it happens. That's not how anything is built. That's not how any progress is made. This is enough for me to get motivational and passionate over. And yes, I'll shake my computer screen and I'll let you know that this is the way it works. It is as much of a faith game as it is anything else. Entrepreneurship is really the story of the relationship with you. And as you sit back and you're like, "Oh, man. This whole game, I've got to get good at this game. I've got to get good at this game." You'll find that half of it is having an idea of what to do next. The other half of it is being okay with the fact that you don't know what to do next. And so being okay with this ambiguity and you've got to sit back and go, "Here's the step I see that I can take." You take it. You don't sit back and try to figure out step two. You're not even there yet. Don't worry about it until you take that first step. Right? Don't worry about step number three until you've taken step number two. Don't even worry about it. And so I applaud you is all I'm saying. Develop that mentality of it. I got voted the nicest kid in high school, seriously, the nicest kid in high school out of 600 people who were graduating. It shocked the crap out of me. And the reason why is because I was not the nicest kid in high school. And not in my mind, I was not expecting that award at all. I was the shyest kid. That's why I was nice. I just wasn't saying anything. I was a little rage machine on the inside. And what I had to learn, especially in this game, is that it's all about being able to develop yourself and get over those barriers. So what I'm telling you is, I had to go and I had a serious fear of adults. I had a hard time talking to people. Doing this, oh my gosh, it would've killed me. Now it's like breathing. It's totally fine. But take it from a guy who had a really hard time getting over this kind of stuff. I've told you this in the course. I would take my computer and I would stand in front of a mirror and I would mute the audio and I would literally just physically mimic because I was buttoned up physically, emotionally, speaking, nothing. I had all this anxiety on the inside. And the way I broke myself from it was by being willing to be uncomfortable. And this whole game, like I said, it is about the relationship that you have with yourself. It's like the second story that's actually happening. And for those of you guys who've gone through the training piece where I talk about the heroes through journeys, that's what this is. We think that the main journey, which it is, the main journey we're going on is this whole thing. We're like, "Hey. I'm going to go and I'm going to try and make a million bucks. And I'm going to build a sweet downline, a sweet team." That's cool. That is the main journey. The real journey though, is the journey of transformation that's happening underneath. It's the internal transformation that happens that's going on, on the inside of you. And I'm trying to teach you to be cognizant of it. Because if I can teach you to look back, be introspective and go, "I don't know if this works." Or, I think one of my false beliefs is, I believe I don't have enough time. And you can self solve, oh man, your speed to success is so much faster. It's like, so much faster, because now you'll be in a spot where you can start self teaching and have a relationship with you where you can develop. You can change. You can grow. And you can look back at yourself and go, "Oh my gosh. I'm not performing in this area very well because I have a hard time with this, this, and this." And just acknowledging the fact that you know what those things are, it's self discovery. And be like, "Oh, man. The way I was raised taught me that, yeah, there's no such thing as anyone who's actually going to make it." You know what I mean? Whatever that is, whatever that is for you. And as soon as you become cognizant of it, you can do something about it. So I'm trying to teach you to be introspective. Look back on yourself and go, "Sweet. All right. These are the areas I'm struggling with. Tactically, this is what Stephen's telling me to do. Okay. But you know what, he doesn't know me personally. And this whole area here I'm struggling with. What am I going to do? What's the thing I'm going to do to help break me and move forward and develop in a spot where I can actually get to the spot and start moving forward on this?" I'm just going on. I'm going to town right now, huh? That's the thing that I try and get people to understand. That's what I'm trying to help people take on and have ownership of. Okay. Do not put the roles of personal development on others. It is not in a course. It is not in anywhere else. Those things can jumpstart you, but it's ultimately on yourself. And if you can learn to be introspective, self medicate in the correct ways where you can go forward and literally craft your own path, oh my gosh, this game gets so fun. It gets so fun. Are all the answers for you personally inside Secret MLM Hacks? Yes. For offer creation, for message creation, for funnel building, learning how to build and automate systems, things like that, yes. For you as an individual, no. There's no way anyone could ever do that besides you. And I believe, God, and your relationship there. But if you can look back and be like, "Oh my gosh." I had to realize. I remember the day I was ... I don't remember where, but I remember the realization, oh my gosh. I suck at talking to people. Isn't that interesting? And a lot of people walk up to me now and they're like, "There's no way, Stephen. Are you kidding me? You're so good at that piece, that part." Well, let's go here. Let me take you back. If you guys want to, go three years back on my YouTube videos and watch me try to do a periscope. This was back when periscopes were big. One of the funniest things you'll ever see. They're terrible. They're terrible. Right? But it's me publishing when I'm not really far down the path yet. And if you can do that, it's so cool, guys. It's so fun. And your ability to transform other people will also increase because they will be ... You'll take them with you, which will break a whole bunch of beliefs that they'll have if you come at them when you're already here. And if you're already here, that's fine. But you've got to get vulnerable, and not just with other people, with yourself. And that's how the whole things happens. That's how you speed this thing up. Anyway, I just talk like crazy. Hopefully that's helpful to you, though. I'm very passionate about this and entrepreneurship itself because if I can get you to be introspective, to stop questioning the process, to marry it in a way that says, "You know what, I don't care how long it takes." Those are the people who put their head down. They don't look at a timeline. They put their head down and they just work. And suddenly they look up one day and they're like, "Holy crap. Look where I am. Huh, I really like that. I'm going to put my head back down again. This is cool." That's exactly what happened to me. You're like, "Whoa. Okay. Sweet." And it happened one day when I was sitting there next to Russell. And I had been teaching a lot of stuff in his place when he couldn't get up on stage. That's crazy, by the way. I was able to do that because publishing, I was practicing. I was telling stories. I was re-breaking, rebuilding belief patterns. What I'm trying to help you guys understand is that I sat back and I remember what happened to me one day. And all of a sudden Russell turned to me and he goes, "Dude, you're better at teaching offer creation that I am now." I was like, "Bro, you're Russell Brunson. Are you sure you just know what you just said?" He's like, "I'm being serious, Stephen." I was like, "Whoa. How did that happen?" And I started looking around again and I was like, "I'm publishing like an animal. I'm looking around. I'm coaching. I'm being coached and I'm also coaching." That's very key. I'm teaching people what I'm learning. And nothing but even just a year, that was technically a year and a half has passed. What if everybody did that? And I started looking around and I was like, "I'm going to put my head back down and do this more." And it just increased my speed and it feeds on itself. And now there's nobody who's sitting back going, "Come on, Stephen. Do the next step." I wake up just smiling. And I'm like, "Let's go take on the day," because I've created my own testimonial of myself being able to do it. And I'm trying to get you there. It doesn't happen, I can't cause it for you. But I can get you in an environment and teach you the environment where it happens. And you will have to develop it on your own as you do this process. It's so freaking awesome when you get to this spot. It causes belief on a level that no one can teach you because it will come from inside. And you'll learn a better relationship with yourself. It's really exciting, anyway. Hey, thanks for listening. Please remember to rate and subscribe. Whether you just want more leads or automated MLM funnels, or if you just want to learn to get paid more for your product, head over to secretmlmhacks.com to join the next free training today.

Mr. Right Just a little sample of my magic.

What's going on everyone? This is Steve Larsen and you're listening to Secret MLM Hacks Radio. So here's the real mystery. How do real MLMers like us, who didn't cheat and only bug family members and friends, who wanna grow a profitable home business ... How do we recruit 'A' players into our down lines and create extra incomes, yet still have plenty of time for the rest of our lives? That's the blaring question and this podcast will give you the answer. My name is Steve Larsen and welcome to Secret MLM Hacks Radio. All right you guys. Hey, recently I was on stage for several days. And I was teaching. And everyone in the room had paid anywhere from 15 to 25 grand per seat to be in the room. And ... a lot of fun. It's a part of my job. I absolutely love it. It's probably one of my favorite aspects of my job and what I do. And I was on stage, and I was teaching and a lot of marketers in the room, almost all of 'em are marketers, and you know business owners, of course. And everyone was ... anyway it was really fun, having a good time. There was a lady though, who stood up and I think she'd be okay if I share this. She stood up and she started telling us this story and we were on a certain subject here. And she stood up and we were all kind of sharing and stuff. And she stood up, and she started telling this story of when she was pregnant. Now she is in kind of like the mommy weight loss industry. She helps women basically get the results that they want without ... I'm sorry, after being a bit ... you know, giving birth, without giving up their bodies. It's a huge, huge industry obviously. This is something that isn't talked about that much. And she's sitting there, and she's talking to us about an experience she had while she's on camera. The camera was up and running. She was teaching. And she was showing a particular ... she was showing some exercises. And at this time, she was trying to just be as vulnerable as she could. She was trying to just be 100 percent herself, no fluff, no strings attached. And she leaned over, and she had lifted up her shirt just a little bit to show her stomach. And she leaned over, and she ... you know, she was showing all the skin from the stretching, from being pregnant. There was all this skin there. Right? And she'd stand up straight, and there was like a six pack. Then she'd lean straight over again, and there'd be all this extra skin. And she's like ... "It's weird. These are things that women don't talk about at all when they're with pregnancy and such." And all of a sudden, while she's doing ... Now, think of that. First of all. Just right off the bat. Amazing courage to do that on camera. Right? Just to do that, when most people are out there so busy posturing, and most people are out there going crazy about all the things that they need to be doing to make it look like they're professional and stuff like that, she's lifting up ... you know, showing her labs and then leaning over and showing all the actual saggy skin and stretch marks from her pregnancy. Number one, crazy amazing props. Absolutely incredible. All right. Then, she stands back up and the abs come back. And she was talking about, "Hey these are things that most women don't ever talk about. It's not really something in the industry that much." And while she's doing it, she pees her pants. After women give birth, the pelvic floor isn't as strong anymore. It just ... it's really easy for women to do that. [inaudible 00:03:31] it's kind of weird that I'm talking about this, but there's a whole point behind it. Okay? And she kept the camera running. And instead of getting freaked out and running around, she had no control over it, she pointed it out. And she goes, "Women. This is exactly what I'm talking about. I wanna teach you how to reclaim the body after you have something ... you know, after you have child birth happen to you. You don't have to give up." And she posted the video. And the video got passed around like crazy. And she ... that event that she was at, that I was helping to run, that was only a couple months ago. And on a $37 product, she has made over one point, I think three million dollars, something like that. Over a million bucks on a $37 product. You think about it, that's over 40,000 customers that have to come through. Let's think about this. That's ridiculous, first of all. Now, typically I teach people how to sell more hi ticket things, and she did it on a $37 product. And she got out there and just did it and posted it. Number one, ridiculous mad props. I just ... I'm so ... oh my gosh. Like I'm so ... I feel so blessed to even, that she was in there and telling us this story. And it all revolves around what I call and we call "the attractive character" and this notion of vulnerability. The attractive character is something that is ... it's how we speak. It's how we interact with people. It's the stories we tell. It's our parables. It's the things we like, the things we don't like. Right? It's our ability to tell our own backstory and where we came from. Right? It's our voice. And what's funny is that when you think about, "Hey. Let's go get into business. Let's go get into MLM. Let's go get into this. Let's go get into that," whatever it is. The tendency is to jump out and start putting on a freaking tie, and go to the dry cleaner, and get my suit dry cleaned, and get starch put in there, and go look all postured, and try to make myself look like I'm better than I am, look like I'm farther than I am, look like I'm different than I am. And what sucks about that is you end up cutting out so many people, who may have otherwise followed you. Does that make sense? When we start to posture ourselves, and we try to act like we're something that we're not, we end up cutting out part of the market. I realized this early on, not just in MLM, in other industries as well. I was doing these different ... you know, I'm a funnel builder. I build internet sales funnels as a living, and put all the pages together, and all the automation, and all this stuff. You know that's ... and I love it. It's a lot of fun. But I remember I was putting these products out there, and I was doing this fun stuff. And it was awesome. And I was really enjoying it. But these people started coming back to me and saying, "Gosh Steven, I'm so happy that you can go do X and Y and Z, but I just can't." And I realized that I had been posturing myself too much. There was a site that I launched first, not first ... there was a site that I launched about a year and a half ago called Sales Funnel Broker, and it's still up right now. I have not had a chance to go back and change it. But it's with me wearing a shirt and a tie. And I was like hey ... anyone to give me some feedback on this, I just want to see if it's set. I gotta go switch it right now. I probably will after I do this episode. But it was me wearing a shirt and tie and ... I had a buddy reach out to me, really quickly, and he goes, "Dude. Site looks great. Love all the stuff you're doing. Love the value your giving out there." He said, "Just one piece of feedback though." He said, "You're not really a shirt and a tie guy." I was like, "Well, I like to wear 'em." He was like, "Yeah. But your personality, the way you market, the way you put yourself out there, your voice is not really shirt and tie crap. You're more of like just kind of tell it how it is a little bit." I was like, "You know, that's really interesting feedback." And I thought that's actually really valuable feedback. Thank you very much and I started going ... I started podcasting like crazy on a different show that I have. And I was out there, and I was doing all this stuff. And I realized, quickly, as I started finding my voice, that more people were resonating with me as I would talk about the things I like, as I would talk about things I didn't like, as I would talk about my failures, as I would talk about ... and anyway I could get vulnerable. The game for me became so much less about how to actually look like I'm being professional. I'm a good funnel builder, you know. And I know that the stuff that I do is world class, you know. And I know that. And that's okay to know that, and it's okay to know what you're good at and I know that I'm good at it. But when I come off in a way that is too ... what's the word? How we say, "starch in your shirt." When I come off looking too professional, and when I come off looking too like I'm trying to posture myself and looking up like ... you know what I'm saying? It actually pushes people away. And it's the same thing for your MLM businesses. Guys, I promise you if you want to have success in this faster, stop acting like you're a pro if you're not. Even if you are a pro, stop acting like ... people are not attracted to that, because I believe that I have to be on your level just to learn from you. If you start acting like you're all professional, and talking ... if you're not vulnerable with your people, if your attractive character is too high up, people don't think they're good enough to even get near you. Does that make sense? They start comparing themselves. And the question is no longer, hey that guy is awesome, or that woman is amazing, or ... they're not, that's not the question in their head. The question in their head is, "Oh my gosh. Do I even have a shot at looking like that? Do I even have a shot of going from I am to where Steve Larsen is. Or from where, whoever, Natalie Hobson is, or for whoever ..." You know what I mean? Wherever you guys are right now, even if you're killing it, even if you're doing ... I've got several messages coming back from you guys. It's been a lot of fun, learned more about who you guys are who are listening to this show, which I love. I've learned more about ... and there's a lot of you. It's a lot of fun. The show's blown up a lot faster than the other one did, which is a lot of fun. This is a huge need. I know it is in the industry. But I've been very careful to not position myself as someone, or somebody, or my brand as Mister Steve Larsen, Commodore Steve Larsen ... you know what I mean? Like some kind of like Commander Steve like ... no. My name's Steve Larsen. I'm from Littleton Colorado. I'm living in Boise Idaho, potato land right now because that's where my full time job is. And while I know that I could leave and be fine. I love my job, so I'm staying at it. And it's a lot of fun, and I really enjoy it, and I build internet sales funnels. And I know that I, you know, the work that I do, both MLM style and funnel building changes lives. And it's very motivating for me. And it's a lot of fun. And there's this sense of the walls drop as soon as you become real. And that's what Natalie Hobson had figured out. And she figured it out in ... I'm not kidding guys, it's only been a couple months. And on a very cheap product she made a crap ton of money. Right? It's because of her ability to be vulnerable that made her sharable. And if you're not talkable, if the brand isn't talkable. Let's think about it. So let's think about you and your MLM right now. You're literally the exact same as everybody else out of the box. Right? I've pounded that point like crazy in this podcast. MLM is broken as soon as you get it. Right? Same scripts, same everything, same products, you're literally competing with your upline. Okay? It's like a red, red, red, red, really freaking bloody red ocean. Does that make sense? And if it's that red and you don't do anything different, there's no reason [inaudible 00:11:17] gonna join you. So one of the easiest ways to start setting yourself apart, besides creating additional products and actually making new offer, and all that kind of stuff, is just to highlight your actual difference. There's a great book ... I cannot remember the title of it. I actually only read the back, which is a lot of you guys are gonna laugh about, but that's me being vulnerable. I only read the back of the book, but it hit me so hard, I've never gotten the line out of my head. And it said, "Stop highlighting your strengths. Don't focus on your strengths." It said, "You need to highlight your differences." How are you different than everybody else around you. If you start focusing on what you're different at, and you actually make that the loud piece rather than the strength ... someone's always gonna be stronger than you. Someone's always gonna be bigger, faster, better, you know whatever it is. But only you are you. And you've got differences. What makes you different than everybody else. Right? Now go highlight that. Be really, really, really vulnerable. Now the first time I ever shot videos, and I put 'em out there, they were freaking awful. The reason I don't go update them is because if I go out ... now, the content's amazing, actually the delivery's not that bad either. But I'm really boring in the videos. You know what I mean? I think so anyways. The content is incredible. And the things that I'm teaching are amazing. But like ... and every time someone watches the five video series, it's the MLM Masters Pack, if you guys go to SecretMLMHacksRadio.com there's a five day master pack. Anytime anyone watches that, they always ask to know more, or join the down line, or whatever it is. Then that's the reason I did that. I could go back and update it. I made those videos years ago. But the reason I don't is because I don't want to come off as like all ... too professional. You know? And it's fine if the stuff that you use, and the members areas, and all this stuff that ... the other products that I create, yeah, they're more professional looking. But man, all those front end videos, all the products and everything that's way out into more of the cold market, man, I do not make it look pro. And I do it on purpose. So, that's my invitation to you. I want you to ask the question to yourself right now, is there a place inside your MLM where you're acting too professional? Where you're acting like someone you're not? And if that's the case, I'm begging ya, I'm asking ya, for the good of the people who you could run into and help change their lives, stop acting professional like that. Start acting like you. Actually, it's funny, the same as in marriage. You know my wife and I have been married almost six years now. We've got two kids and a lot of fun. And I made the mistake, when we first got married, that I had to start losing parts of my identity. I had to actually become an adult, you know. Get my responsibilities in order. You know what I mean? That kind of thing. Or it was like, oh, there's no more fun for me. You know what I mean? It was almost like this mentality that I felt like I had to take on, because that's what society was telling me. The problem is that sucks. You become someone that you weren't. And you become someone that the other person didn't fall in love with. That was the other person, you, your real self. You know? It's the same thing with your customers. Especially if you've never done anything in business before ever, a lot of what happens is there's this persona that Hollywood puts out that all meetings are in suits, that you have to have meetings. I hate meetings. Meetings are dumb. Maybe I go to one, one hour meeting a week. That's it. Max. And I barely have anything to do in it, because ... and I run a big organization. I'm not at all ... I hate meetings. But I thought I had needed it, and I thought I needed my business card. And what's my logo? And all this garbage that has nothing to do with actual sales, or business, or making money. Right? It's all this posturing crap that ... the personas of Hollywood and all the stuff start to put into our heads. And it's the same thing ... and I realized, luckily, even in the marriage and everything. Didn't mean to relate it to that, and was not planning on that in this episode, but it's true. The more I remembered who I am internally, and spoke to those things more loudly, you guys, that's where a lot of the attractive character came from. That's where a lot of finding my voice came from. That's where a lot of confidence in what I'm trying to say in my messages ... that's where a lot of it came from. When I'm just more true to myself, and it's true for you in your MLM as well. Anyway, it's kind of a deep episode. My gosh. But hey, I hope that you guys enjoyed it. Go be vulnerable. Find places to be vulnerable. Stop worrying. You know, I would go get on Facebook Live and I would just start talking. Do it every day. And you do that every day ... if you publish every single day for a year, you will change your life before a year's even up. It's just the formula. It happens every time. Every time I tell someone to go publish or whatever ... it's happened many times now. A lot of my buddies, a lot of friends, a lot of people I've coached, a lot of my students ... they go out and they go start publishing, and the ones that are vulnerable have success very quickly, because they are being them. And it's sort of attracting like minded people. But if it's too professional and you're speaking like you're writing a freaking essay in college, no one cares about that. Talk like you're talking to a sibling. You know? Talk like you're talking to ... and do that to your MLM people, do that to your upline, your down line, just be a very loud version of you. And I promise, that's gonna pull a lot of the attractive character out and people are gonna start loving that. They'll like to be around you. Take off the dang suit if it's not you. Right? Stop doing that. I gotta go change that picture. I just still haven't ... it's been a really busy year. Anyway. Hey guys, hope this was helpful, a little bit of a rant there. But I just hope that it was something that you guys can really use and apply in your MLM right now, because that is ... it's one of the keys that I feel like most people focus on the product, which is good. You have to have the product, or the message, or the marketing and that's good. You have to have that as well. But there's this underlying piece when it comes to recurring buying, and brand building, and the ability to communicate your message, and your confidence, and the speed that you move will highly be dependent on you as a person, as the leader, as the attractive character and your vulnerability with that. Anyway. Hopefully, it's been helpful guys. I really appreciate all of you. Love the engagement back and forth. I've really enjoyed that a lot. And I'll chat with y'all later. Bye. Hey, thanks for listening. Please remember to subscribe and leave feedback. Would you like me to teach your own down line five simple MLM recruiting tips for free? If so, go download your free MLM Masters Pack by subscribing to this podcast at SecretMLMHacksRadio.com.

Welcome to Build brought to you by Pivotal Tracker! I’m your host, Poornima Vijayashanker.  Each Build episode consists of a series of conversations I have with innovators. Together we debunk myths and misconceptions related to building products, companies, and your career in tech. One misconception I fell prey to early on in my career was staying heads down and waiting for someone to acknowledge my accomplishments. The thought of tooting my own horn seemed too self-promotional. I was worried about what my teammates and boss would think. It wasn’t until I came across people who helped me find my voice and style that I realized the disservice I had been doing to my career. Through their guidance and support, I realized how beneficial mentors can be to your career. While there’s been a lot of talk already about the need for mentors, in today’s segment we’re going to take a slightly different angle and explore: Why many resist seeking mentorship What is a mentor versus a sponsor When is mentoring appropriate What to expect from a mentor Why is it good to have a mentor  In future segments, we’ll tackle how to effectively get a mentor, and how you can get started as a mentor! To help us out I’ve invited Karen Catlin who is an Advocate for Women in Tech, a leadership coach, and my co-author on our book: Present! A Techie’s Guide to Public Speaking. Transcript Poornima: One misconception I fell prey to early on in my career was staying heads down and not talking about my accomplishments. I felt like it was too self-promotional to toot my own horn, and I worried about what my colleagues and my boss will think. It wasn't until I came across people who helped me find my voice, and told me that it was OK to share the work that I was doing, that I became more comfortable. And it was through their guidance that I realized how valuable that mentorship can be to catapulting your career.                                               While there's been a lot of talk already around mentorship, we're gonna dive a little bit deeper. In this segment, we'll dive into why you might be resistant to getting a mentor, and in future segments we'll talk about how to effectively approach a mentor, and if you wanna be a mentor, how to go about getting started.                                               Welcome to *Build*, brought to you by Pivotal Tracker. I'm your host, Poornima Vijayashanker. In each episode of *Build*, I'm going to be talking to innovators in tech, and together we're gonna be debunking myths and misconceptions related to building products, companies, and your career in tech. And to help us out, I've invited Karen Catlin, who is an advocate for women in tech, a leadership coach, and my co-author on our book, *Present! A Techie's Guide to Public Speaking*. Thanks so much for joining me, Karen. Karen Catlin: Oh my gosh, it's my pleasure, Poornima, thanks for having me.  Poornima: Yeah. This is such an exciting episode for me, 'cause you and I have been working closely for a number of years. Now, for our audience out there, I wanna go back a little bit to your days as a VP at Adobe, and walk us through what you were working on there.  Karen Catlin: Sure, sure. So I joined Adobe through the acquisition of Macromedia, so I actually worked at those two companies for 17 years, so a big bulk of my career. And while I was the Vice President there, I ran the shared engineering services, which included things like product security, product globalization, our open source, our engineering productivity tools, accessibility work. All sorts of things that we hire deep experts in those areas, and then worked across the product teams to help them with their product releases.  Poornima: In addition to your role as VP at Adobe, you were also mentoring a lot of people. Walk us through why you decided to do this.  Karen Catlin: Sure. And I actually started mentoring people much earlier in my career. I remember at one point, at Macromedia, I was a program manager, and in fact I was the only program manager for the company at the time, and I worked on a very early version of Dreamweaver, which you may remember. And as other product teams started hiring program managers, I offered to help hire them and train them, and bring them up to speed. And because of that interaction, a lot of those program managers, by default, kind of started looking to me for ongoing mentorship about how to be successful in their role. So it started out really there. And then, certainly I just kept continuing to do that as I moved up with my career and into the VP level.  Poornima: That's great that you were doing a lot of corporate mentorship, but as I know it, you also had been mentoring outside of Adobe and other companies that you worked at. Talk to us about the kind of mentorship you did outside of the company.  Karen Catlin: Sure. So there are quite a few ways to get involved in, formal mentoring programs, I'll call it, and I do that through...for example, my alma mater, where I mentor a senior, an undergraduate, who's about to start her career, and I provide mentoring during her senior year, which is great. And I get matched with someone, and it's a nice way for me to give back to the university, as well as to learn about what a senior is going through right now in her life, and trying to figure out and navigate the career options and so forth.                                                 I also do more informal mentoring, which I like to call micro mentoring, and I do that through The Women's Club of Silicon Valley, where I've been a member of that for a number of years. I've been on their board, and I certainly love helping our members with anything that they might need some advice on, some help on. And I call it more informal because we're not matched, people just reach out to me if they have advice that they want to seek, they wanna get my experience that I've had on something. And they'll just reach out and say, "Can we get a cup of coffee, get together for lunch," something like that. So it's much more informal and kind of organic that way.  Why is it good to have a mentor  Poornima: So let's dive into kind of the bigger theme here, right? 'Cause I know a lot of people say that mentoring is important, but why is it even important? Like, why do we need to do this, why can't we just read books, or ask our boss, or ask our colleagues for help when we need it?  Karen Catlin: Yeah. So first of all, I think that I enjoy mentoring because I wanna pay it forward. I want to share my experience, and help other people who might be going through similar challenges, or similar choices that they need to make, to learn from my experience. And I hate reinventing the wheel, so if I can help other people not have to reinvent the wheel themselves, if they're going through the same type of situation that I'm going through, I'd love to—or, have gone through, excuse me—I would love to share my experience with them.                                                 And this whole notion of paying it forward is one reason I mentor, but it's really a two-way street. Every time I mentor someone, I learn something from them, too—it's just not me providing my advice, I learn from them. I might learn about, you know, good new books or podcasts I should be listening to. I might learn about new productivity tools that are just, you know, a new app to do something that I had never heard off. When I was a VP I also might hear about certain challenges that people are facing, that actually helped me be a better leader, because I got intel and insight into what was going on around the organization that I might not otherwise hear about.  When is mentoring appropriate  Poornima: Yup. And for the mentee side, what are the benefits for them?  Karen Catlin: Oh, sure. So the mentees, they get to have a sounding board. For example, if they are trying to decide something, get some advice, they get to hear someone else's perspective on that. They get to hear stories about a time that that mentor maybe went through something similar, and then they can learn from that. And they just might be able to take a step back from that day to day, I'm working, I'm getting stuff done, let me step back and think about what I should be doing with my career, these choices ahead of me, how I should think about a problem differently, or a situation differently. So, so many benefits to a mentee.  What is a mentor versus a sponsor  Poornima: I've also heard of this word, sponsor, and I'm sure some of our audience has as well, so walk us through what's the difference between a mentor versus a sponsor.  Karen Catlin: Sure. So they're very different, although they may sometimes be the same person. But let me break it down. A mentor is someone that you might meet with to get their advice, and they should share their stories, their life experiences, their perspective on things, so that you get that insight into what they, you know, how they think about things. By contrast, a sponsor is someone who is influential at your company, or in your industry segment, and they are going to be in situations, meetings, different situations where they will find out about opportunities that they might think of you as a good person to fill. So they will open doors for you that you might not even know exist, right? So that's what a sponsor does, they know you well enough to recommend you for opportunities, and to support you that way.  Poornima: Yeah, a little bit more directed, then.  Karen Catlin: Yes, exactly. But you might not even know you have a sponsor. They might just be doing this behind the scenes, and opportunities are coming your way and you're not even sure why they happen. So sometimes you don't even know you have a sponsor.  Why people are resistant to mentoring  Poornima: Nice. Now, not everyone wants a mentor, why do you think people are resistant to seeking one?  Karen Catlin: Yeah, so in my current role as an advocate for women who are working the tech industry, I have talked to hundreds of women about mentoring and the importance of mentors, and the two things I hear from many women—there's a theme. The first is, "Ooh, it's so awkward to go up to someone, or send a note, and say 'Hey, would you be my mentor?'" You know, that's awkward and a little intimidating, so they don't wanna do it for that reason. And then the second reason is that they think they're imposing on someone. Everyone's so busy in tech, right? Super busy, and so why would some important person wanna take any time out to help me, right? It's an imposition, and I don't wanna go there.  Poornima: Yeah. And what would you recommend to kind of getting over those hurdles, if that's what's holding you back?  Mentoring what to expect  Karen Catlin: Right, right. So I like to break it down with my coaching clients, as I encourage them to find mentors in their companies, I like to break it down in terms of, be very specific about your ask. For example, let's say your goal is to file your first patent. That's a really clear goal, and there are...then you can look at, who do I respect around the organization who's filed a patent, and send a simple note saying, "Hey, I'd love to file a patent and I would like to have lunch with you to find out about your experience with patent filing." You know, just really simple, concise, direct, this is what I would like to do.                                                  Sometimes it might be a longer term mentorship, so another example of an ask might be, "I'm very interested in growing my career to the director level. Would you mind meeting with me for three months, once a month, for half an hour or something. I'll bring the questions, you bring the advice." Right? Just be very specific about what you need. You don't even have to say mentoring, like, that feels awkward. Just say, this is my ask, can you help me?                                                  And you'll notice with both of those, whether it's a one-off or a longer term thing, I time boxed it, right? And I think this notion of time boxing is really critical when you reach out to a mentor. If I were to say to you, "Hey Poornima, would you mentor me?" You'd be like, "What's that mean?" Like, what does that even entail? What are they asking me to do? But if I can say, "Would you meet with me for half an hour, once a month for three months," you know exactly what you're getting into, and it's a whole lot easier for you to say "Yes," or maybe, "Not right now, I'm too busy," if that's the case, right?  How mentoring relationships evolve Poornima: Yeah. Or, let's do a couple meetings first, and then if it works out, there's chemistry, you like what I'm saying, then maybe we'll do a full three months, but let's not get—  Karen Catlin: Exactly. And by the way, at the end of that time box period, let's say that is a three-month, or a six-month engagement, if things are gelling and you still wanna be learning from that mentor, and the mentor wants to continue meeting with the mentee, you can continue it. You can renew it for another period of time, another six months, three months, whatever that is. Yeah.  Poornima: Thank you so much Karen, I think that's a great place to get started with mentoring. And for all of you out there, if there was a hurdle that Karen and I didn't cover in today's segment, let us know what that is in the comments below, and we'll be sure to answer it shortly.                                                  That's it for this segment. Subscribe to our YouTube channel to get the next segment, where we'll continue the conversation, and talk about how to get the most out of your mentorship. Ciao for now.                                                  This episode of *Build* is brought to you by our sponsor, Pivotal Tracker. -- Build is produced as a partnership between Femgineer ((http://femgineer.com/) and Pivotal Tracker (http://www.pivotaltracker.com/). San Francisco video production by StartMotionMEDIA (http://www.startmotionmedia.com/design/).   

Click above to listen in iTunes... And, Why My Professor Used To Spray Us In The Face… Hey my names Steve Larsen and this is Sales Funnel Radio. Welcome to Sales Funnel Radio, where you'll learn marketing strategies to grow your online business using today's best internet sales funnels. And now, here's your host, Steve Larsen. All right. So, last night...Yesterday was my wife's birthday, right? I don't know why I'm saying right, you probably didn't know that. But yesterday was my wife's birthday, and we went to...Well, okay, I'll tell you a little back story. A week or two ago, we're driving back from this family reunion, I did a podcast a little while ago about one of my ancestors graves that we visited over there. Anyway, so on our drive back, my wife was like, "Hey, like, growing up it was my family culture, we just never really did a lot, you know? As far as like, we went putt-putting the other day. That's really like the second or third time in my life." I was like, "What! Are you kidding?" She's like, "I've never done like, bumper cars, or go karts, or rock climbing, or any of that." I was like, "Are you joking me? This is amazing! We have a whole childhood to go catch up on. This is nuts." There's a lot more to that story, obviously. The whole point is that my wife and I are going around we're doing all like these little kid things that she never did growing up. It just wasn't her families culture to do that. Yesterday was her birthday, so last night we decided to go and she wanted to go to one of those huge trampoline places. You know, it's like one of those rooms where it's just full of trampolines. There's one here called Jump Time, there's one called I Jump I think over in Denver. Anyways, there's like a whole bunch of those places, right? So we've been going like place, to place, to place. This may not have a whole lot to do with Sales Funnels, but I think there's an important lesson here actually, and it actually does directly correlate, for me it has, on how fast I built Sales Funnels, and how good they look, so. Anyway, we're over there, we're jumping on the tramps, you know, it's a lot of fun. She and I are like...There's basketball hoops with the floor being a trampoline. We're like flying through the air, doing dunks and stuff. It was really fun. There's huge foam pits. We're doing all these flips, jumping into these huge foam pits. Anyways, it's a lot of fun. We had a lot of fun... What was killing me is...I'm 28, right? I know I look a little bit like a kid still, but obviously I'm not. But all these adults are standing on the side while all these young teenagers are with us jumping all over the place. I could see that some of them we're just like, "well, he's an adult, he shouldn't be doing that. I'm not going to jump on the trampoline because I'm an adult." Oh my gosh, just go barf. Play on the high way, like, do something. That's nuts. I can't believe that you would say something like that... The reason that that bothered me so much is because I had this teacher in college, this professor, he's actually one of the...I'm not trying to be mean to anyone else, but there's really only like 3 teachers, or professors or whatever, that had a huge impact on me. This guy was one of them... We were in a marketing class once, and the whole semester, all that they do is they take you, and they say, "Hey, this whole semester all you're gonna go do is make a business. It's not made for you. You need to go grow the whole thing, and try and be making lots of money by the end of the semester." I mean, huge learning opportunity, holy crap, cause we vote each other who's gonna be CEO. I will say that I was voted as that. What? Then we broke ourselves up into different groups and we went and we tackled an idea. We started making 2 or 3 grand a week, which isn't bad when you're restricted to only making the money on campus. You know? So we're pulling 2 or 3 grand a week, from the campus students... Anyways, there was a lesson that this guy gave us, this teacher. I remember one day, he sat down, and he could tell we were struggling with one...I can't even remember what it was, but the lesson is what I remember. We sat down and he had all these toys, like kid toys, all around the room. He had a few squirt bottles also. He said, "Okay, we're gonna have a brainstorming session, but the rule is, in order to actually contribute an idea, what you have to do is you have to pickup a toy and you have to be playing with." Whatever it is, you know, Silly Puddy, or LEGO's, or something. Whatever it is that you're going to be saying, the whole time you need to be playing with some toy in the room. Something that's typically for a kid, right? You're like, "what? What's this guy doing?" It was weird, but cool, what happened. He's like, "All right everyone, go grab a toy." We're like, "Okay." It was a little awkward at first, when you start grabbing these toys, we start playing with them. What was interesting was as we started playing with these toys, and we started doing little kid stuff. Our creativity shot through the roof. Right? Just exploded through the roof... We started coming up with he craziest ideas, and we started destroying all the other student businesses with these ideas. We went out and we'd execute them and they were fantastic. We tried to enter the Guinness Book of World Records for the largest...Anyways, we did a lot of fun stuff. But his whole point...I'll tell you my story though. As we would be brainstorming, as we'd be tossing ideas up on the board, I mean, we put 100's of ideas on this board, you know? We were trying to figure out different ways to market and be creative with stuff. Huge brainstorming sessions, you know? What was interesting though, was whenever somebody, like, poo-pooed of downed another persons idea, I don't know how else to say that. Whenever they talked bad about someones idea, or smirked, or said, you know like, "That's a stupid idea." You know what I mean? Made that kind of gesture. Everyone in the classroom grabbed squirt gun, and shot the other person int he face, and screamed, "Bad kitty." I don't get the bad kitty part. It was kind of funny though... The whole purpose was that when you're brainstorming, when you're doing things that cause you to...When you're coming up with ideas, being playful, causes more creativity. People who are boring, have a really hard time being creative, right? People who are so worried about following the rules, and I will follow the law, and I'm not jumping on the trampoline because I'm an adult. You know? That stupid. Don't ever do that... I mean, it really helps a lot. What's kind of funny is that right now I'm holding a golf ball. I just play with it, in my hands. I don't know. I like to golf. I'm not amazing at it, but I think it's fun. I feel like my boss has all these little nic-nacs on his desk. He and I just fidget with stuff, and it's kind of fun. I mean, I have a blow dart gun next to me desk. I'll just shoot stuff around the office while we're starting to come up with ideas, and things like that. That kind of creative atmosphere is very, very...It's like a catalyst... You know, if you look at like Google the way they do...Google's campus is like a playground. They have all sorts of random stuff there. It's not like they sit around in these cubicles and stuff. They've got like bean bags chairs all over the place. Same with like, if you've ever heard of the company Ideo. It's I-D-E-O. I think that's how you say it. Anyways, they're responsible for like, how the toothbrush looks today, and all these appliances and things that are...They're the ones that kind of innovated all that stuff. The way shopping carts are. Anyways, go look them up. They're really cool. They have a really awesome innovative process that they go through every time they're making an idea. It was funny because last night, I was looking at it, and I was like, "Ugh, these adults are just standing by the side watching their kids jump on trampolines." There's nothing that was stopping them. It wasn't expensive. Anyways, we were jumping around all over the place, and it's just fun. It's cool to see, you know, that creative fun streak, where the brain is just going nuts. There's a really good book called, Why Right Brain Thinkers Will Rule the World. It's a book that goes through that says...I wish I had it with me. It's a book that goes through and says, hey look, the basics of life are kind of taken care of, right? That's a very left brain thing. Where do I get food? How do I survive? I've got to mate. You know what I mean? It goes through the list, and it says look, here are all of the things that are human needs, and physically for you to stay alive there's a lot of processes built around those things now. You're not hunting for food all the time. Especially if you live in America, that's very true. We're so commercialized. We're not fitting for food. We have surplus of food in this country. Which probably goes without saying, so many obese people, you know? We have so much abundance, whatever it is, that we now crave things that have to do with creativity. Right? That's where the right brain comes in. That's where creativity comes in and we say, "Hey, how can I make this process better? How can I take the process of communication better?" Well, Steve Jobs understood that for sure. I'm holding my iPhone right now, right? I'm looking at my Apple computer right now, my MacBook. It's all about how can I make a process more smooth, and better, for fast, faster for somebody else. That's why right brain thinkers will rule the world in the future... Because all these other left brain activities are taken care of. Anyways, in the book, I can remember who it's by. I think it's Daniel Pink. I think that's how you say his name. Anyways, in the book it says that that...it started giving all these ways to become more creative. In there, I talks about play, and the importance of play. Even though it's something that you typically think of as an adult for kids, you know. You think, this is for child, these are for kid things. I'm not saying you gotta go practice, you know, playing with a Barbie doll and Ken doll. But I mean, if that's what gets you into it, sure. Even appropriate amounts of video games is good for the brain as far as problem solving and things like that, so. Ten minutes, 15 minutes, of some time of play, or game, or something like that is really, really, really good for you when you start getting into these creative moments. So anyways, I was just laughing yesterday because I could tell I was getting all these like weird looks by parents. Like, "What? This guys jumping in the foam pit? 190 lb dude, jumping into foam, next to all these little kids? Whose he think he is? Having fun. What a goober. By the beard of Zeus, he should get out." You know, like oh gosh, you guys are gonna die. You should just die. What do you doing in life if you're not enjoying it? I don't know. I have strong opinions about this, obviously, I'm making a podcast about it. Anyways, if you're to go through brainstorming sessions, number 1, don't bad mouth any idea that comes out from anyone. Often you'll see what happens in brainstorming sessions, or creativity sessions, or things you're trying make something; is that you'll have one kind of mainstream, logical idea, but then someone else with come out with this crazy, left-wing idea. You know? Just way, way out, and say, "What about this? What about this?" It's crazy. It's like, "Well, we should have emus in the commercial." You know, something nuts. What's funny is, when you blend the two ideas together and you put them up on the board, you actually get something that's actually prolific. Something that your competition is not thinking about doing. So, whenever you're in brainstorming sessions, don't down ideas that seem crazy, or dumb, or the ones that aren't complex enough, or things that won't take over, things that aren't gonna match the 401K. Ugh, I hate that. Just start putting out all these different ideas. Mainstream crazies. Mainstream crazies, and it'll start to blend together in this really cool space that most likely your competitors are not in. When I'm building Sales Funnels, this is where I'm going to tie it all in, all right, I promise there's a point to this. When I'm building Sales Funnels, I play. I think of it like playing. Especially when you use something like ClickFunnels, it's like playing a video game almost. It's super fun. I listen to awesome music. Whether it's, like, really intense rock, or dubstep. I just enjoy the moment whatever it is. I take my shoes off. I am always barefoot. I just have fun building. I put my sweet oversized headphones on that make me look like a DJ, that's kind of goofy, but I love it. I'm in my element... Because of that, creativity starts to flow, and I start to come with these cool things. I've made a lot of Sales Funnels, a lot, like 20 or 30 in the last year, custom ones. Anyways, right now you guys know that I'm creating real estate Sales Funnels, and it's going great. Almost done with the 3 core funnels that I'm using to help realtors sell more, and automate more. There's a lot of routine work in real estate. Anyways, the creativity aspect of it is very, very important. You have to have that. Or else you just stay mainstream, and there's nothing different with you, and literally the only thing you'll compete on is price, because you have nothing else that differentiates you. You have to find something else to make you prolific, or something else that makes you easier to use, or smarter, or some way to get ahead. Otherwise, like I said, you have to get beat out price. I've said this before, in other podcasts, but like, if you are competing only with a coupon, and you're saying, "Well we'll make ours 50% off." You're gonna die. That's the K-Mart way and they're going the way of all the earth. They're dying... Unless you pull it off like Kohls...Anyways, there's othere scenarios that work with that. There's just nothing else that differentiates you beside price, you're in a dangerous spot. So find some way to be prolific. The easiest way to do that is be creative. The easiest way to be creative is to be playful. The easiest way to be playful is to play... Anyways guys, I won't want to beat a dead horse on this, but man, go like play. Go do something that's fun. That your brain has fun. Okay, last little rant with this section, I promise. I'm trying not to make this podcast like a rant podcast, but at the same time, like some things just really piss off as an adult. I hate being an adult sometimes. I'm a little kid at heart forever... Okay, I took my kids over to this playground, right? We're over there, and as soon as I get there, I'm seeing the exact same thing over at the trampoline place, or whatever. All of these adults standing on the side with their arms folded. "Yes I am an adult, and I will watch my kids play. I don't do this because I'm an adult." I don't know where that whole things coming from that I'm saying right here. It's just, ugh, it ticks me off... I get on the freakin playground, with my kid. I get on the swings. I go down the slides. I do all of it. It teaches my kid how to play, right? Because of that, I feel like it helps my little girl be creative, you know? It teaches her how to play. It teaches them how to entertain themselves. It teaches how to be creative... They'll go and...My little girl has these markers and she'll go and draw all over on this whiteboard on our fridge. She gets so excited about it, so proud about it. She didn't really start that though until a little while ago, but anyways. I don't know if it's totally working, or if it's because of stuff I'm doing. I like to think that. Anyways, I don't want to be a Dad, or a guy, or a business person who is so uptight that I can't participate. You know what I mean? It's kind of funny. A little while ago I posted something on FaceBook, and I was like, "Hey, sorry I'm wearing a shirt and tie in this. Haha." Just kind of a joke. One of my buddies commented back and he goes, "Don't worry man. No one took you for a shirt and tie guy anyway." I was like, "Sweet. You guys all get it then." When you start to go play the right side of your brain fires all over the place, electrons go nuts... Your noggin loves it, because obviously you are, so. Anyways guys, have an awesome day. If you guys have any questions or anything, I do have the HeySteve Show. Which is just also on the same podcast. I just do them all on the same podcast; interviews, my own thoughts, and the "HeySteve!" Show. But if you've got questions and you want to ask any kind of question about your own Sales Funnel. The last question I think I answered was about Ecommerce, but if you go to salesfunnelbroker.com, up in the top click on podcast and right on the web page you can record a voicemail to me, and it will email that message over to me, and you can ask your question. I kind of vet the questions and its goes through for the ones that would be good for the show. If yours is one on the show I send you a "HeySteve!" t-shirt, and they look pretty cool. I did kind of like a crowd sourcing design and that's kind of the one they all came up with, and it looks really sweet, so. Anyways guys, I will talk to you later. Bye. Thanks for listening to Sales Funnel Radio. Please remember to subscribe and leave feedback. Have a question you want answered on the show? Get your free t-shirt when your question gets answered on the live "HeySteve!" Show. Visit salefunnelbroker.com now to submit your question.  

In part 1, investigator with the Howard Hughes Medical Institute Michael Eisen talks about his research, the field, and both experimental and computational biology. Eisen is Associate Professor of Genetics, Genomics, and Development in UC Berkeley's Dept. of Molecular Biology.TranscriptSpeaker 1: Spectrum's next Speaker 2: [inaudible]. Welcome to [inaudible] Speaker 1: section, the Science and technology show on k a l x Berkeley, a biweekly 30 minute program bringing you interviews [00:00:30] featuring bay area scientists and technologists as well as a calendar of local events and news. Speaker 3: Good afternoon. My name is Brad Swift. Thanks for tuning in. Today we are presenting part one of two interviews with Michael Eisen and associate professor of genetics, genomics and development in UC Berkeley's department of molecular biology. Iceland employs a combination of experimental and computational methods to the study of gene regulation [00:01:00] using the fruit fly Drosophila melanogaster as a model system. Isen and his colleagues have pioneered genomic approaches in modern molecular biology and our leaders in the emerging field of computational biology. In part one, Michael talks about how he got started in biology and how his research has evolved onto the interview. Michael Isen, welcome to spectrum. Thank you. My pleasure. Would you give us a narrative of how you initiated your research and how your research has [00:01:30] changed to what it is currently? Speaker 4: Okay. Actually, I grew up in a family of scientists. My parents were both biologists, so I always had an interest in biology. But as a kid, my talents were primarily in math and I was a heavy duty math geek and went to college expecting to be a mathematician and took this freshman calculus class and all the hardcore math geeks tuck. And I did fine. I did well in the class, but [00:02:00] there were several people in the class who were clearly a notch better than me in a way that I think you only can realize and you know, basketball and mathematics at the age of 18 that you're not destined to be the best. And I think math is a field where if you're not the best, it's just kind of boring. And so I stayed as a mathematician and math major in college, but I started increasingly taking a lot of biology classes and had more or less, you know, realized that biology was what really captured my, my attention and [00:02:30] my heart. Speaker 4: And so I went to graduate school but had the idea that I'm interested in biology, but I'm really good at math. So there must be some way of combining these two things. And so I entered a graduate program in biophysics, which is sort of a place where people who are interested in biology maybe haven't taken all the prereqs for a normal biology department but also have a quantitative background go cause. And so, you know, in the way that people sort of drifted into things, I drifted into working on protein structure and [00:03:00] did my phd studying the evolution of the proteins on the surface of flu viruses and using a combination of experimental work and I would hesitate to call it mathematics. It was really just sort of kind of physics and it's, it's a lot of data. You generate a lot of raw data, you generate a lot of data on the coordinates of individual protein molecules and things that they might bind to. Speaker 4: And so it was very natural to start using computers in that work. You know, my background was not in computer science. I programmed as a kid [00:03:30] because my grandfather bought me a computer and I taught myself how to program and I wrote programs to, you know, keep track of baseball statistics and other things like that. In College, I basically never programmed anything in the math department I was in. It was considered not math that you were touching a computer. And so I didn't really do anything with computers until I got to graduate school when you started seeing all this data coming down the pipe. But I wasn't particularly interested in structural biology and I discovered that through six years from graduate school that [00:04:00] although I liked doing it, it wasn't intellectually satisfying, was too small. You're working on one sugar bound to one protein in one virus and I was having trouble seeing how that would expand into something grand and whatever. Speaker 4: You know, the ambitions of, uh, of a graduate student wanting to do something big. And I got lucky in the way that often happens in that my advisor had a colleague he knew from an advisory board. He sat on and he was coming into town because his brother was getting some honorary degree [00:04:30] and I met him in his hotel room, Austin. And he had with him, uh, glass microscope slide onto which had been spotted down little pieces of DNA, each of which corresponded to one gene in the yeast genome. So it's about 6,000 genes in the yeast genome. And you could see them because there was still salt in the spots, but it was a very evocative little device. You could sort of hold it up in front of the sun and you could see the sun sort of glittering on all these little spots. Speaker 4: You could just see the grandness of [00:05:00] the device. Didn't know how people were using them. I didn't know what they would be used for. I didn't know what I would do with them, but I was sort of drawn in by the scale of it all. The idea that you could work on everything at once and you didn't have to choose to work on just one little thing and disappear into a little corner and study. Just that. And so my advisor said, oh, you really should go do this. They need someone who's, you know, understands biology, but can deal with the computational side of things. It's clear that this was going to generate a lot of data [00:05:30] and that, you know, he was right. I mean this was a field that really was in great need of people who understood the biology but could work well in the quantitative computational side of things. Speaker 4: So I packed up and moved to Stanford with a short stint as a minor league baseball announcer in between. Really it was just a very fortuitous time to have gotten into this new field. I mean, the field was really just beginning. So this was in 1996 the first genomes been sequenced, they were microbes, there's bacteria and yeast [00:06:00] and so forth. And we were just getting our first glimpse of the scale of the kind of problems that we were going to be facing in genomics. But what I loved about this device, which is a DNA microarray, it's the sort of became a very hot tool in biology for a number of years was that it wasn't just a computer, it wasn't just data in a computer. It actually you were doing to do experiments with this. I'm interested in biology cause I liked living things. I like doing experiments, I like seeing things and I didn't want to just disappear with someone else's data and [00:06:30] analyze it. Speaker 4: So I went to Stanford to work on these and it really was just this awesome time and we were generating huge amounts of data in the lab and not just me. There were, you know, dozens of people generating tons of different types of experiments and so forth. And we lacked any kind of framework for looking at that data constructively. You couldn't look at those experiments and figure out by looking line by line in an excel spreadsheet at what gene was expressed, at what level and what condition. It just wasn't [00:07:00] the way to do it. And so my main contribution to the field at the time was in bringing tools for organizing the information and presenting it visually and being able to interact with that kind of incredibly complicated data in a way that was intuitive for people who understood the biology and allowed them to go back and forth between the experiment in the computer and the data and really try to make sense of what was a huge amounts of data with huge amounts of information, but something nobody had really been trained to [00:07:30] look at. And so it was there that I really realized kind of the way I like to do science, which is this constant back and forth between experiments on the computer. In my mind and in what I try to teach people in my lab. There's no distinction between doing experiments on the bench or in the field or in a computer that they're just different ways of looking at biology. Speaker 3: This is spectrum line KALX Berkeley. Today, Michael [00:08:00] I's associate professor at UC Berkeley explains his research in developmental biology. Speaker 4: On the basis of that time at Stanford, I got a job at Berkeley and what I did when I started my lab at Berkeley was really tried to focus on one problem. I mean I had been working on a million different problems at Stanford where we had a huge group and a million different people working on, and I was sort of moving around from problem the problem and helping out people with their data or thinking of different experiments. And when I came to Berkeley, I really [00:08:30] wanted to focus on one problem. And the problem that had intrigued me from the beginning of working on the microarray stuff was figuring out how it is that an animal's genome, which is the same essentially in every cell in the body, how it instructs different cells to behave differently, to turn on different genes and to acquire different properties. And so partly because of the influence of people here at Berkeley who were working on fruit flies, I switched my research program to work on [inaudible] when I started my lab at Berkeley, the genome of that [00:09:00] had just been sequenced and I liked working with animals. Speaker 4: I like having something that moves around and you know, had some behaviors and so the lab started to work on flies and pretty much since then that's what we've worked on. That's sort of the story of how I got to where I am. So your research then is you're looking at flies over time? Yeah, I mean, I mean I see how the genes are expressed. I'd say we're looking at classified more as developmental biology in the sense that we're looking at how genes are expressed over time during the lifespan of a lie. To this day, [00:09:30] we can't look at a newly sequenced genome and say, oh well this is what the animal's going to look like. That is, I couldn't tell you except sort of by cheating and knowing, comparing it to other genomes. If I, you gave me a fly genome, I look at it, I wouldn't know it was a fly or a worm or a tree or it's just the way in which the organism acquires it. Speaker 4: Things that make them interesting, their form, their appearance, their function. We have just the tiniest scratch of understanding of how that works. And so it's, for me, the most [00:10:00] interesting problem in biology is how do you get in a complicated structure like an animal out of a single cell. And how is that encoded in a genome sequence? I mean it's a fascinating mystery that I thought, you know, when I first started doing this I thought we'd have solved that problem by now. Not Easily. You know, because we had all this new data, we had the genome sequences we could measure. And a lot of what my lab does is actually measure which genes come on when, during development and try to understand for individual genes where that's been encoded in the genome [00:10:30] and how that happens. And I just sort of figured, well, you know, the problem for all these years was not that the problem was that hard. Speaker 4: We just didn't have the right data to look at this problem. And now we can do these experiments. I can sequence the genome of a fly and in a day I can characterize which genes are turned on when during development. And I sort of naively thought, well, we'll just sort of put it into a computer and shake things up and be clever and we'll figure out how these things are related to each other. And I mean now it's laughable that I would've ever thought that, but it was a very, very complicated thing. It's a process that's [00:11:00] executed by very complicated molecular machines operating in a very complicated environment or the nucleus and it, you know, we really don't understand it very well. We've learned a lot, but it's not a problem. We really understand. And so what is it that you've accumulated in terms of knowledge in that regard? Speaker 4: What do you think you've learned? A small amount of this is coming from my lab, but this is a whole field of people looking at this. But that we know the basic way in which that information is encoded in the genome. [00:11:30] We know that there are tuneable switches that can turn genes on and off in different conditions. And we know basically what molecular processes are involved in doing that in the sense that we know that there are proteins that can bind DNA in a sequence specific manner. So they will stick only to pieces of DNA that contain a motif or a particular code that distinct for each of these factors. In flies, there's several hundred of these factors and for humans that are several thousand of these factors that bind DNA in a [00:12:00] sequence specific manner, and they basically translate the nucleotide sequence of the genome into a different kind of code, which is the code of proteins bound to DNA. Speaker 4: And we know from a million different experiments that it's the action of those proteins binding to DNA that triggers the differential expression of genes in different conditions. So if you have a particular proteins, these are called transcription factors. If you have one in a cell at high levels than the genes [00:12:30] that are responding to that factor will be turned on in that cell. And if there's another cell where that protein isn't present, the set of genes that responds to it won't be turned on. So we know that as a general statement, but working out exactly how those proteins function, what it is that they actually do to turn a gene on and off, how they interact with each other, what conditions are necessary for them to function. All of those things are, I wouldn't say we know nothing about it, but they're very, [00:13:00] very poorly understood. Speaker 4: A lot of this sort of simple ideas that people had of there being a kind of regulatory code that looked something like the protein code that we're, you know, amino acid code that people are familiar with, right, that there'll be a genetic code for gene regulation. The idea that that's true is long disappeared from our thinking in the sense that it's much more like a very, very complicated problem with hundreds of different proteins that all interact with each other in a dynamic way. Something bind recruits, something else. [00:13:30] The thing it recruits changes the coding on the DNA and essence to a different state and then that allows other proteins to come in and that somehow or another that we still really don't understand. You eventually reach a state where the gene is turned on or turned off depending on what these factors are doing and you know, while there's lots of models for how that might function, they're all still tentative and we're getting better. The techniques for doing these kinds of experiments get better all the time. We can take individual pieces of or Sophala embryo [00:14:00] and sequence all the RNA contains and get a really complete picture of what's turned on when the technology is improving to the point where we can do a lot of this by imaging cells as amazing things we can do, but still the next level of understanding the singularity in our understanding of transcriptional regulation is still before us. Speaker 3: Spectrum is on KALX, Berkley alternating Fridays today. Michael [inaudible], associate professor at UC Berkeley [00:14:30] is our guest. In the next section, Michael describes the challenges his research poses Speaker 4: and is the task then the hard work of science and documenting everything's, yeah. Mapping a little bit about just observing. I mean, I'm a big believer in observational science that what's limited us to this has been just our poor tools for looking at what's going on. I mean we still hard to visualize the activity of individual molecules within cells, although we're on the precipice [00:15:00] of being able to do that better. So yeah, it's looking and realizing when the paradigms we have for thinking about this thing are clearly just not sufficient. And I think the fields get trapped sometimes in a way of thinking about how their system works and they do experiments that are predicated on some particular idea. But you know, usually when you have an idea and you pursue it for quite a long time and it doesn't pan out, it's because the idea is wrong. Speaker 4: And not always, but I think the transcriptional regulation field has been slow to adapt [00:15:30] to new sort of models for thinking. Although that is changing, I think that there's a lot of activity now and thinking about the dynamics of DNA and proteins within the nucleus. You know, we tend to think about DNA as kind of a static thing that sits in the nucleus and it's a, it's sort of read out by proteins, but really much more accurate as to think of it as a living kind of warned me like thing in the nucleus that gets pulled around to different parts of the nucleus and where it is in the nucleus is one way in which you control what's turned on and off. And I think people are really [00:16:00] appreciating the importance of this sort of three-dimensional architecture of the nucleus as a key facet and controlling the activity that there's, the nucleus itself is not a homogeneous place. Speaker 4: There is active and inactive regions of the nucleus and it's really largely from imaging that we're learning how that's functioning and you know, we as the whole field and are there lots of collaborators and people who are doing work? Yeah, I mean I'd say oh yeah. I mean it's a, it's an active feeling. Pay Attention to [00:16:30] oh yeah. So it's an active, if not huge field and not just in flies. I mean, I think it's transcriptional regulations of big field and in particular in developmental biology where amongst scientists we're interested in how animals develop. It's long been clear that gene regulation is sort of sits at the center of understanding development and so people interested in developmental biology and have long been interested in transcriptional regulation and I think everybody's got their own take on it here. But yeah, it's a very active field with lots of people, including several other people at Berkeley who are doing really [00:17:00] fascinating stuff. Speaker 4: So it's not out in the wilderness. This is not the hinterlands of science, but it's um, it's a nice field to work in about appropriate size. Our annual meetings only have a thousand, a few thousand people. It's not like some of these fields with 25,000 people. I can realistically know all the people who are working on problems related to ours and I literally know them and I know what they're doing and we sort of exchange ideas. So I like it. It's, it's nice community of people. [00:17:30] Is the field driving a lot of tool development? Absolutely. I say, this is something I really try to encourage people in my lab and people I trained to think, which is when you have a problem, you should be thinking not what am I good at? What can I apply to this problem? What technique has out there that would work here? Speaker 4: But what do I need to do? What is the right way to solve this problem? And if someone else has figured out how to do it, great, do it. But if they haven't, then do it yourself. And I think that this applies sort of very specifically [00:18:00] to doing individual experiments, but also to this broader issue we were talking about before with this interplay between computation and experiment. I think too many people come into science graduate school or wherever, thinking, well, I'm an experimentalist or I'm a computational biologist or whatever. And then they ask a question and then the inevitably hit the point where the logical path and pursuing their question would take them across this self-imposed boundary. Either you're an experimentalist who generated data and you're not [00:18:30] able to get at it in the right way and therefore, you know what you really need to be doing is sitting at a computer and playing around with the data. Speaker 4: But if you view that as a boundary that you're not allowed to cross or you're incapable of crossing, you'll never solve it because it almost never works. You almost never can find somebody else no matter how talented they are. Who's as interested in the problem that you're working on as you are. And I think that's a general rule. Scientists should feel as uninhibited about pursuing new things even if they're bad at it. It's certainly been a mantra [00:19:00] I've always tried to convey to the people in my lab, which is, yeah, sure, you come in with a computer science background and you know you're a coder and you've never picked up a pipette or grown a fly. But that's why the first thing you should do in the lab is go grow flies and vice versa. For the people who come in perfectly good in the lab but unable to do stuff in the computer, the first thing you should do is start playing around with data on the computer and it doesn't always work and not everybody sort of successfully bridges that gap, but the best scientists in my mind are ones who don't [00:19:30] circumscribe what they're good at. Speaker 4: They have problems and they pursue them. When something like visualization, is that a bridge too far to try to embrace that kind of technology? I've always done that. I mean I almost every time I do an analysis in the computer, I reduce it to picture some way or another. You know, because of the human brain, no matter how fancy your analysis is, the human brain is just not good at assimilating information as numbers. What we're good at as thinkers is looking at patterns, [00:20:00] finding patterns and things, looking at looking at images, recognizing when patterns are interesting and important, and there's a crucial role for turning data into something the human brain can pull in. And that's always, for me, one of the most fun things is taking data that is just a string of numbers and figuring out how to present it to your brain in a way that makes some sense for it and the refinement of it so that it's believable. Speaker 4: Yeah, and so then you can do it over and over and over and get the same result. Yeah, and all, I mean it is one of the dangers [00:20:30] you deal with when you're working with, when you're relying on human pattern recognition is we're so good at it that we recognize patterns even when they don't exist. There's a lot of statistics that gets used in modern biology, but often people I think use it incorrectly and people think that statistics is going to tell them what things are important, what things they should be paying attention to. For me, we almost entirely used statistical thinking to tell us when we've fooled ourselves into thinking something's interesting, you know, with enough data and enough things going on, you're going [00:21:00] to find something that looks interesting there and having a check on that part of your brain that likes to find patterns and interesting things is also crucial. Speaker 4: You know, I think people understand that if you flip a coin three times, it's not that we are trying to land on heads, but they have much, much harder time thinking about what happens if you flip a coin a billion times. We're struggling with this in biology, this transformation from small data to big data, it taxes people's ability to think clearly about what kinds of phenomena are interesting and aren't interesting. [00:21:30] Big Data is sort of the promise land now for a lot of people. Yeah. I'm a big believer in data intrinsically. If you're interested in observing things and interested in understanding how they work, the more you can measure about them better. It's just that's not the end of the game. Right? Just simply measuring things that doesn't lead to insight. Going from observing something to understanding it. That's where the challenges and that's true. Whether you're looking at the movement of DNA in a nucleus or you're [00:22:00] looking at people by a target, right? Like the same. It's the same problem. Speaker 3: This concludes part one of our interview with Michael [inaudible]. On the next spectrum, Michael Eisen will explain the Public Library of science, which he [inaudible]. He will give his thoughts on genetically modified organisms and a strategy for labeling food. He discusses scientific outreach and research funding. Don't miss him now. Our calendar of science and technology [00:22:30] events happening locally over the next few weeks. Rick Karnofsky and Renee Rao present the calendar Speaker 5: tomorrow, February 9th from noon to one wild Oakland presents nature photography basics at lake merit. Meet in front of the Rotary Nature Center at 600 Bellevue Avenue at Perkins in Oakland. For this free event, learn to get more out of the camera you currently have and use it to capture beautiful photos of Oakland's jewel lake merit. [00:23:00] Bring your camera and you'll learn the basics of composition, camera settings, but photography and wildlife photography. Okay. Your instructor will be Dan. Tigger, a freelance photographer that publishes regularly in Bay Nature and other magazines. RSVP at Wild Oakland dot o r G. UC Berkeley Speaker 6: is holding its monthly blood drive. This February 12th you are eligible to no-name blood if you are in good health way, at least 110 pounds and are 17 years or older. You can [00:23:30] also check out the eligibility guidelines online for an initial self screening if you're not eligible or you prefer not to donate blood. There are other ways to support campus blood drives through volunteering, encouraging others and simply spreading the word. You can make an appointment online, but walk ins are also welcome. The blood drive will be on February 12th and the alumni house on the UC Berkeley campus will last from 12 to 6:00 PM you can make an appointment or find more information at the website. [00:24:00] Red Cross blood.org using the sponsor code you see be February 13th Dr. Bruce Ames, senior scientist at the Children's Hospital Oakland Research Institute will speak at a colloquium on the effects that an inadequate supply of vitamins and minerals has on aging. Speaker 6: Dr Ames posits that the metabolism responds to a moderate deficiency of an essential vitamin or mineral by concentrating on collecting the scarce proteins [00:24:30] to help short term survival and reproductive fitness, usually at the expense of proteins important for longterm health. This is known as triaged theory. Dr Ian Discuss ways in which the human metabolism has evolved to favor short term survival over longterm health. He will also present evidence that this metabolic trade-off accelerates aging associated diseases such as cancer, cognitive decline, and cardiovascular disease. The colloquium will be on February 13th from 12 [00:25:00] to 1:15 PM on the UC Berkeley campus in five one oh one Tolman hall February 16th the Monthly Science at Cau Lecture series will hold a talk focusing on the emerging field of synthetic biology, which applies engineering principles to biology to build sales with new capabilities. The Speaker, John Dabber is a mentor in the international genetically engineered machines competition or ai-jen and a UC Berkeley professor, [00:25:30] Dr Debra. We'll discuss the new technique created in J key's link's lab to make low cost drugs to treat malaria. He will also introduce student members of the UC Berkeley Igm team who will discuss their prize winning project. The free public event will be on February 16th from 11:00 AM to 12:00 PM will be held on the UC Berkeley campus in room one oh five of Stanley hall Speaker 5: on Tuesday the 19th how long now and Yearbook Buenos Center for the Arts Presents. Chris Anderson's talk [00:26:00] on the makers revolution. He describes the democratization of manufacturing and the implications that that has. Anderson himself left his job as editor of wired magazine to join a 22 year old from Tijuana and running a typical makers firm. Three d robotics, which builds is do it yourself. Drones, what based collaboration tools and small batch technology such as cheap 3d printers, three d scanners, laser cutters and assembly. Robots are transforming manufacturing. [00:26:30] Suddenly large scale manufacturers are competing, not just with each other on multi-year cycles are competing with swarms of tiny competitors who can go from invention to innovation to market dominance. In a weeks today, Anderson notes there are nearly a thousand maker spaces shared production facilities around the world and they're growing at an astounding rate. The talk is seven 30 to 9:00 PM at the Lam Research Theater at the Yerba Buena Center for the arts at 700 Howard Street in San Francisco. Speaker 5: [00:27:00] Tickets are $15 for more information, visit long now.org now to new stories presented by Renee and Rick. The Federal Communication Commission has released a proposal to create super wifi networks across the nation. This proposal created by FCC Chairman Julius Jenna Koski, is it global first, and if approved, could provide free access to the web in every metropolitan area and many rural areas. The powerful new service could even allow people [00:27:30] to make calls for mobile phones using only the Internet. A robust public policy debate has already sprung up around the proposal, which has drawn aggressive lobbying on both sides. Verizon wireless and at t, and t along with other telecommunications companies have launched a campaign to persuade lawmakers. The proposal is technically and financially unfeasible. Meanwhile, tech companies like Google and Microsoft have championed the ideas sparking innovation and widening access to an [00:28:00] increasingly important resource. We can add this to the growing list of public policy debate over our changing and complex relationship with the Internet. Speaker 5: A team at McMaster university as reported in the February 3rd issue of nature chemical biology that they have found the first demonstration of a secreted metabolite that can protect against toxic gold and cause gold. Biomineralization. That's right. Bacterium Delphia, [00:28:30] a seat of [inaudible] take solutions continuing dissolve the gold and creates gold particles. This helps protect the bacteria from absorbing harmful gold ions, but it also might be used to harvest gold. The researchers found genes that cause gold, precipitation, engineered bacteria that lack these jeans and observed that these bacteria had stunted growth and that there was no gold precipitation. They also extracted the chemical responsible [00:29:00] for the gold mineralization naming it delftibactin a, the molecule creates metallic gold within seconds in Ph neutral conditions at room temperature. Gold exists in extremely dilute quantities in many water sources and the bacteria or the metabolite might be used to extract gold from mine. Waste in the future. Speaker 3: [inaudible] the music her during the show is by Luciana, David [00:29:30] from his album foam and acoustic, released under a creative Commons license, 3.0 attribution. Thank you for listening to spectrum. If you have comments about show, please send Speaker 1: them to us. Our email address is spectrum dot k a l x@yahoo.com join us in two weeks at this same time. Speaker 2: [inaudible]. See acast.com/privacy for privacy and opt-out information.

It’s a comic book podcast what the hell can go wrong, right?…..RIGHT? Just listen as the crew of Giant-Sized Podcast get together once again at Blackcat Comics and dispense with everything that needed to be talked about ever in the history of comicdom +1. GSP THIS WEEK? Comics More Comics Funny Jokes! Gay Sex! Ok, […]