Podcasts about Chinese Exclusion Act

A weekly magazine-style radio show featuring the voices and stories of Asians and Pacific Islanders from all corners of our community. The show is produced by a collective of media makers, deejays, and activists. Tonight's show is June 19th. We are all connected. We are talking with Asian and Asian American Children's book authors. PowerLeeGirls host Miko Lee talks with Chi Thai and Livia Blackburne about the power of storytelling, maternal heritage, generational trauma, and much more. Title:  We Are All Connected Show Transcripts Opening: [00:00:00] Apex Express Asian Pacific expression. Community and cultural coverage, music and calendar, new visions and voices, coming to you with an Asian Pacific Islander point of view. It's time to get on board the Apex Express.   Ayame Keane-Lee: [00:01:17] Welcome to Apex Express. Tonight's show is June 19th. We are all connected. We are talking with Asian and Asian American Children's book authors. PowerLeeGirls host Miko Lee talks with Chi Thai and Livia Blackburne about the power of storytelling, maternal heritage, generational trauma, and much more. First, we want to start by wishing everyone a happy Juneteenth, Juneteenth commemorates, an end to slavery and the emancipation of Black Americans after the Civil War. In 1865, 2 years after the Emancipation Proclamation, enslaved people in Galveston, Texas finally learned of their freedom. Juneteenth marks the day the last enslaved people learned of their freedom. Though outright slavery became illegal, the systematic oppression of African Americans continues to this day. We see that show up in almost every aspect of American culture, from the high rate of infant mortality to the over punishing of Black children in schools, to police brutality, to incarceration. We must continue to recognize the importance of championing Black lives and lifting up Black voices. We are all connected. June 19th is also an important day in Asian American history. In 1982 in Detroit, Vincent Chin was at a bar celebrating his bachelor party prior to his wedding the next day. Ronald Ebens, a white auto worker, and his stepson Michael Nitz taunted Vincent with racial epithets. They thought he was Japanese and were angry about the Japanese rise in the auto industry. When Vincent left the bar later, the two men attacked and killed Vincent with a baseball bat. He was 27 years old. Ronald Ebens never did time for this murder. Ronald Ebens is 85 years old now. Ebens not only skirted prosecution, he has used bankruptcy and homesteading laws in Nevada to avoid a wrongful death civil suit settlement. Ordered by the court in 1987 to pay $1.5 million to Chin's family, the Chin estate has received nothing. Lily Chin, Vincent's mom could have stayed silent about the racist attack on her son. Instead she spoke out. She took a courageous stance to highlight this most painful moment in her life. In doing so, she helped ignite a new generation of Asian American activists working for civil rights and social justice. We find ourselves in a new wave of activism as our communities band together to work against the injustices of the current regime. And what does this have to do with children's books? It is all connected. We highlight children's books by Asian and Asian American authors because we want our next generation of children to know and appreciate their own heritage. We want them to proudly represent who they are so that they can work in solidarity with other peoples. Our struggle is interwoven. As Grace Lee Boggs said, “History is a story not only of the past, but of the future.” Thank you for joining us on apex express. Enjoy the show.   Miko Lee: [00:04:24] First off. Let's take a listen to one of Byron Au Young's compositions called “Know Your Rights” This is part of the trilogy of the Activist Songbook. This multi-lingual rap, give steps to know what to do when ICE officers come to your door.    MUSIC   That was “Know Your Rights” performed by Jason Chu with lyrics by Aaron Jeffries and composed by Byron Au Yong Welcome, Chi Thai to Apex Express.    Chi Thai: [00:07:13] Hello. I'm really happy to be joining you, Miko.  Miko Lee: [00:07:16] I'm really happy to meet you and learn about you as an artist, as a filmmaker, as a children's book author. And I wanna first start with a personal question, which is, who are your people and what legacy do you carry with you? Chi Thai: [00:07:30] Ooh, what a great question. You know what? I love being asked stuff that hasn't been asked kind of before. I mean, there's a kinda really kinda natural answer to that, which is, you know, family are my people. Of course. 100%. And certainly, you know, the reason why I'm talking to you today, you know, in regard to the, to the book, you know, it's about my family's journey. But I found, and I don't know if this is. Somewhat to do with, you know, being a child of two cultures and you know, being a child of the diaspora that you really have to kind of find your own family too. 'cause I suppose I grew up feeling, I didn't quite relate to maybe my parents in a way that, you know, you normally would if you weren't part of the diaspora. And I felt estranged from my birth country and I didn't really feel like British either a lot of the time. So in terms of like, who are my people? I've gathered those people as I've kind of grown up and it's, it's a kind of strange feeling too. I feel like it's taken me a really long to grow up and to figure out who I am. And I suppose that's why, you know, the people that I have a really, a lot of people that have come, kinda later in my life, I actually have no friends in my childhood as an example of that. I've had to kind of find these people as I've grown up, but it's taken me a long time to grow up because growing up in the UK there wasn't any literature to read about what it was like to be Asian. And British, to be a refugee and things like that. So it just took me longer and I then, as a result, it just took me longer to find my tribe. but I have it now, but it's still work in progress. That was a very convoluted answer. I'm very sorry Miko.    Miko Lee: [00:09:15] No, it wasn't. No worries. It's fine. And what legacy do you carry with you?   Chi Thai: [00:09:19] Kind of an extension to that answer, I think when you're an artist, practicing your voice, figuring out your voice, can take a while. And I think I've only really started maybe the last like five to 10 years at the most really figured out what I want my legacy to be. The things I wanna talk about are really about s tories from the diaspora, certainly, and about community and healing. These are the things I think that are really important to me, especially when we talk about maybe coming from struggle. I don't feel it's enough to be an artist today and just talk about struggle. I want to talk about justice as well. And justice really is about healing, you know?    Miko Lee: [00:10:00] Oh, that's beautiful. Can you talk a little bit more about that healing and what that means to you and how that shows up in your work?    Chi Thai: [00:10:07] A couple years ago, no, not even that long ago, I produced a, a feature film. This is probably the best example for it, but I produced a feature film called Raging Grace, which we called it Horror with a small H and it. Basically took the story of what it was like to be, undocumented Filipina in the uk who was also a mother. And I think if that film had been made 10 years ago, it would just shown how hard her life was, and unrelentingly. So, and I think the reason why Raising Grace is so special is it goes beyond the trauma, it takes us to a place of justice, of being able to speak out for someone who has felt invisible, to be visible for someone who's not. Had a voice, to have a voice and to begin that kind of healing process of sticking up for herself, making a change transforming herself from maybe the good immigrant to the bad immigrant and things like that. I think that's a really great example and I think I read a really wonderful thing. It might have been in a Guardian article where we, so a lot of my work is around, inclusion representation of like diasporic stories. And I think when you have, when you exist in the poverty of like representation, I. the solution to that is plentitude. I think that Viet Thanh Nguyen probably said that, so I don't wanna take credit for it. He comes up with so many wonderful things, and that's a wonderful thing to be able to move from poverty, like to plentitude and that be the solution, is kinda really wonderful. So I enjoy being really prolific. I enjoy supporting artists to be able to do their work. So as a community, we can also be prolific and I wanna support, narratives that. Take us beyond a place of struggle and trauma to a place of like healing and justice and so forth.    Miko Lee: [00:11:57] Your work crosses so many genres. You were just mentioning how that film was kind of a horror film and, and then you've done these kind of dreamy animation pieces and then now this children's book. Do you select the genre and the format and the medium, or does it select you?   Chi Thai: [00:12:16] Oh, I think the story chooses it. I like 100% believe that. I just actually was thinking about this 'cause I was doing an interview on something else, people, often ask about the creative process and I, can only speak for my own. But usually when I get an idea for a story, the general shape of it comes almost like really well formed. There's a sense of a lready kinda what genre it'll be. There's a sense of the character, there's a sense of the journey and all these things. I felt the same about, writing The Endless Sea I knew it would be from the voice of a child. This probably sounds like my creative process is terrible, but it was just. This is how it was going to be. That kind of part was writing itself, or at least I feel that it'd been writing itself like that in my subconscious for many, many years before it kind of surfacing and writing. Like the writing bit is just the tip of the iceberg at the end of the day. there wasn't like a kind of decision about that. the story in that sense was quite intact. So I often feel like the story is demanding something about kind genre and for, for Raging Grace 'cause I've talked about this a lot, not just in listen to me, but other things. But we always said like if you are an an undocumented person, every breath you take is taken in a hostile environment. It's so natural for it to be a horror. So there's not a sense that you kinda decide that it's like that is the very reality of someone who's going, you know, that's their lived experience. And if you're going to represent that truthfully, it will be through the prism of horror. And I suppose that's how I think about genre. the story is kind of telling you what it needs to tell its emotional truth. and I felt that way, with The Endless Sea same thing with the Raging Grace, with Lullaby. And I think you talked about The Promise, I suppose I, with The Promise, which is an adaptation I had less choice about that because that was a book and it was a adapted into an animation. I've heard Nicola, who's the author of the book, talk about that and she talks about like the story coming to her in a dream and tiptoeing down her arm coming onto the page, she like describes it really beautifully. so maybe our processes are the same. It feels that way. there's not long deliberations. I mean, that's not to say the writing process isn't difficult. It is. But that, I've never found the, [genre] the difficulty or the bit that's required a lot of, I don't know soul searching with it.    Miko Lee: [00:14:28] So with that being said, how did Endless Sea your latest children's book? How did that tiptoe into your imagination?    Chi Thai: [00:14:36] This is a strange one because this is probably the closest thing to like, almost autobiographical work. What I can say is like, it's the true story o f how I and my family, which would've been at the time my mom and dad, my older sister, me, how we fled Vietnam after the fall of an Saigon. we actually left quite late we left in 1979 w hen things were tr were getting truly, truly, truly, quite terrible. And, this was very much a last resort. I think my parents would try to make things work, but realized that they couldn't. This journey that we took on these, boats that were made badly, made poorly, that many of which sank has become almost like the genesis story of our family. It's like it's a big, it has a long shadow, right? Ever since you know I, it is like the first story that I can remember. It's one of the few stories my mom would tell me again and again when we, when they see their old friends, it's something they talk about. So it's something that has happened to it to us, but it's such a big thing that it's just, echoed In my life growing up, as I've you know, got older and older, and the wonderful thing about having a story kinda live with you eventually it's in your blood and in your bones, but also if it's a thing that's kinda shared with you again and again, you actually build up this, there's something about the repetition of it, and then every time you hear it told from an uncle or a family friend or from your mom, a new little detail is embroidered that someone adds. So I've kinda lived with this story for 40 plus years and I've been collecting all these little things about it all this time and all that time it was, I think, kind of just writing itself, you know? You know, it was doing all that work before I actually put like pen to paper. Um, yeah.    Miko Lee: [00:16:31] Was there a catalyst or something that made you actually put the pen to paper?   Chi Thai: [00:16:36] That's really interesting. You know, I probably don't mind it is probably something really banal like. I think I probably wrote it during Covid and I had more time. Um, I think there are probably be some bigger forces in place. And you know what, I can tell you what it is actually if I'm, I'm forcing myself to think and examine a bit closer so when this is totally true. So I remember hearing the news about Viet Thanh Nguyen win winning the Pulitzer for The Sympathizer. And it made such a mark on me and I kind of felt, wow, someone from our community has achieved this incredible thing. And I thought, why? Why now? Like, and I was like, well, you know what? It's probably taken our community certain amount of time to come of age, to develop not just the abilities to write, to create, to make art, but also to have possibly the relationships or networks in place to be able to then make the art and get it out into the world. And I kind of felt when he was able to do that and came of age, I kind of felt there was going to be like other people from the kind of diasporic Vietnamese community that would also start to flourish. And that made me feel really good. About probably being a bit older than the average kind of artist, like making their, kinda like their pieces and everything and saying, you know what? My time can be now. It's okay. And I just find it just really inspiring that, you know our community was kind of growing, growing up, coming of age and being able to do these, these things And I kind of felt like it had given me the permission, I suppose the, the confidence to go, “Oh this story that I've been carrying my whole life, which I don't really see a version of out there I can write that and now I can write it and I'm the right person to write it.” And I had just done The Promise so I had a relationship with Walker. I was like, I have a, you know, a relationship with the publisher. I feel my writing is matured. Like I can do this. And so it was like a culmination and, you know, convergence of those things. And, but I do remember having that thought thinking, “This is a good time to be alive in our community 'cause we're actually able to make our art and get it out there now.” I, I felt it was like a real watershed moment really.   Miko Lee: [00:19:11] What made you decide to do it in this format as a Little Kid's Children's Illustrated book? We were talking earlier about how to, to me, this is the first more realistic version of a boat people experience in a very little kid's voice. What made you decide to do it in this style?    Chi Thai: [00:19:33] So interesting. At the same time, I was writing The Endless Sea. I was writing also the script for a short film, which is called Lullaby, which is takes an incident that happened on my boat but expresses it as a film, as a little kinda horror kinda drama, but a kid cannot watch that. It's like too terrifying. Um, and I wrote, you know, The Endless Sea at the same time. And again, I can't, it's really hard for me to articulate. I just knew it was gonna be a kid's book, like, and I knew it'd be written from the voice of a kid, and I didn't actually, can I say I didn't even ascribe a particular kind of value to that. It wasn't until I had started conversations with the publisher they're like, you know, we see like there's a really high, like this is really great that it's written in the voice of the kid. It somehow gives it something else. Something more is something kind of special. I didn't set out to like, overthink, like what was the most effective way to tell this story? I, I think I just told the story as honestly as I could, you know, with the words that I felt that, you know, I had in me to de, you know, to describe it. In the most authentic way to, to me. And like I say, at the same time, I knew, like I knew that was a kid's book. There was another part of that I wanted to express that was really important to me and that was survivor's guilt. But that I felt was like, that was a horror, so that was really not gonna be suitable for kids. So I was definitely thinking about lots of things to do with the same subject of the same time, but they were definitely being expressed in different ways. And again, Lullaby came to me very kind of quickly, almost fully formed. And I knew, you know, it would be a ghost story. I knew it would be the story of a mother and things like that. And I often maybe, you know, I should, I, I should interrogate more, but I kinda, I take these kinda. These ideas, which are quite well shaped and, and then I just like lean into them more and more and more. But they, the way they arrive it, I've kinda, I, I can see a lot of what is already about to unfold.   Miko Lee: [00:21:43] And do you still dream about that experience of being on the boat as a kid?    Chi Thai: [00:21:52] It's, it's a really difficult thing to explain because you know that that happened now so long ago, and I've probably heard the story thousands of times. I've watched all the terrible Hollywood movies, I've seen all the news clippings, I've watched all the archive. I've listened to, you know, people talk, and I have my own memories and I look at photographs and I have memories of looking at photographs. I feel like, you know, my memory is really unreliable, but what it is instead is it's this, this kind of, kind of tapestry of, you know, of the story of memories, of, you know, images as I grow up of hearing the story, like all coming together. One of the things I did when I wrote, I wrote The Endless Sea, is I then went back to my mom and I did a recorded interview with her 'cause I was really worried about how unreliable my memory might be. And I interviewed her and I asked a lot of questions and I said, and I, it was like, you know, in the way I would've just like listened to the story quite passively before this time I interviewed her and I asked a lot of questions about details and all sorts of things. 'cause I really wanted to be able to represent things, you know, as factually as I could. And that was kinda one of my kinda kind of fact checking kinda exercises I did 'cause I was, I was much quite worried about how unreliable my memory was about it all. And you know, what is, what is a memory of a memory of memory, like, you know, especially when it comes to thinking about that time on the boat and the feelings I had. Yeah. So, you know,    Miko Lee: [00:23:34] and you were so young also to    Chi Thai: [00:23:37] Totally 100%. And sometimes, I don't know, you know, is it a memory of a memory? Is it a dream of a dream?   Miko Lee: [00:23:44] Mm-hmm.    Chi Thai: [00:23:44] Or just some, yeah.   Miko Lee: [00:23:46] Was there anything that your mom said that surprised you?    Chi Thai: [00:23:50] Yeah. Um, she didn't realize how bad it was gonna be and she was like, “God, if it, I'd known how terrifying it was I dunno if I, we could have done it.” I think there's a certain amount of naivety involved and I suppose that surprised me. You know? 'cause we know already now how bad it was. Um, so things like that surprised me.    Miko Lee: [00:24:15] and your mom, the dedication of the book is to your mom. What does she think when she first read it?    Chi Thai: [00:24:22] I've got a funny story. My parents, you know, they, we left, they were in their early twenties and I think it was, you know, the escape was hard for them, but settling in new country was really hard for them. That's. That's been kind of their struggle. They had to work so hard, so many hours to kind of, you know, give us a great life. And, I think a lot of that meant they weren't people that could go out, enjoy, enjoy movies, look at art, read lots of literature and things like that. They're very, very simple, very working class. Simple life or working class kinda life. Very much all about, uh, the work. Um, and I remember when I had a, the publisher had made like a mockup of the book and I gave it to my mum to read 'cause I wanted her to be happy about it too, and she's probably been my toughest critic. I think everything I've done, she hasn't really liked, to be honest. Um, and when I gave her the mockup to read. She went, “Yeah,” but she said it in such a way I knew what she meant was Yeah, that's right. You know, that's the truth. That's the, you know, the book isn't the testimony, but it felt like she was saying yeah. It was like the simple kind of approval. It wasn't like a lot    Miko Lee: [00:25:50] That is the most Asian mom's approval ever.    Chi Thai: [00:25:54] It's so funny, like people say to me, oh Chi, it's such a beautiful book. Oh, the writing so lit, like lyrical. It's stripped back, it's elegant. Like, you know, Viet Thanh Nguyen , like God bless his like consults, gave me a comment to put in the book, said these wonderful things, and my mom goes, “yeah.”. You know, it made me laugh at the time, but I knew what it meant. And I also was old enough, I was mature enough, you know, God, if she'd given me that, if I'd been 20 written that I might have cried and my heart might have broken. Right. But I, I knew I had, I've so much compassion, you know, for my parents. Mm-hmm. And people like my parents, what they've been through and, you know, but    Miko Lee: [00:26:38] That was incredibly high praise for her.    Chi Thai: [00:26:40] It was, I couldn't have asked more.   Miko Lee: [00:26:47] Oh, I totally get that. I think that's such an Asian thing. That is so funny.    Chi Thai: [00:26:53] It is, it is. I didn't feel bad. I, I remember showing her Lullaby, um, and she didn't like it at all.    Miko Lee: [00:27:02] What did she say? What is her not like voice? What did she say to that?    Chi Thai: [00:27:05] Oh, she. Well, firstly, she, well, the, the film is almost silent because basically it tells a story. It's inspired by a mother that was on our boat who lost her baby on the border crossing, and I was very much ever, for as long as I knew about this woman's story, I was like, I was very much haunted by it, and I was haunted by, you know, the fact that that's how she felt and her guilt. Over losing her baby on this journey. And I knew, I knew I wanted to tell her story. 'cause one of the things I feel very strongly about is when you are on the losing side. So I'm from South Vietnam, like that's not the, you know, that's not the story that's told, the story is told of who triumphs at the end of the day. And I was just like all those people that we lost at sea, this mother, her baby. The stories kind of aren't told. So I kind of felt really strongly that this was somehow a very creative way to put down like a, an historical record like this happened. And actually I found out after making the film that five babies were lost in our boat, not just one.   Miko Lee: [00:28:24] Wow. So what did she say, your mom say?   Chi Thai: [00:28:28] Yes. So I made this film, which was for the most part, a silent film. This is a woman that's shut down. She barely speaks anymore. She is living with the guilt ever. You know, when she was on the boat before her baby died, she sang a lullaby, and ever since then, she hasn't been able to speak again. And then we find out that she has been haunted by the ghost of her child that she lost. And then a bit too, you know, to kind of free herself from that. She, she actually sings, you know, the, the film culminates in her singing the Luby one last time. S saying Goodbye finally being able to move beyond her Gild and I Griffin, saying goodbye and hoping she's able to, you know, progress. So I made a film about that was largely silence except for this lullaby, and my mum watched it. She went, next time you make a film, you know you need more words. I was just like, oh, I think my heart probably did crumple off a bit a bit at that point.    Miko Lee: [00:29:30] Aw.    Chi Thai: [00:29:31] You know? Um, but yeah. But yeah, it's okay. It's okay because you know what? My mom doesn't get to see stuff like that very often. So sometimes she doesn't have the wider, and this is why, I mean, like, the life that she's had, you know, hasn't been one where she's been able to surround herself with, oh, I'm so lucky. You know, my life has been so different, but it's been different. Different because of, you know what she's, what she's done for us, so it's okay. I can take it on the chin when she says my film doesn't have enough dialogue in it.    Miko Lee: [00:30:04] I love that. For you, have you had conversations with your mom about your life as an artist, and what are her thoughts on that?   Chi Thai: [00:30:16] Well say. So I, so my mom, I don't really like, you know, she's probably not that into it. I'll be honest about being an artist. I can understand why she wants you to have a good life. And I would say for the most part, being an artist is, is a, is a tough life because it's hard to make, you know, the, the pennies work, right?   Miko Lee: [00:30:44] She wants stability for you, right?    Chi Thai: [00:30:45] Yeah, exactly. But she's made a peace with it. And basically what happened, I think all the best story is gonna be about my mom, right? Is that she basically, I, I, um, I have a partner, we've been together for 15 years. Um, he's a really nice guy and he has a reliable job and we have two kids together and i,    Miko Lee: [00:31:08] So that makes it okay.   Chi Thai: [00:31:10] So yeah, this is what I was saying. So she said to me like. It doesn't really matter what you do now. 'cause she, you are already peaked. You're somebody's wife. We're not married. But she told everyone in Vietnam we were married 'cause she couldn't cope with this not being like having kids out of wedlock. In her head. She's rewritten that we are married. Right. She's like, you are married, you're somebody's wife and you mother, it doesn't get better than that. So if you are an artist or if you're a filmmaker, whatever, it doesn't matter. 'cause nothing can be better than that. Right. So she's accepted on the basis that I've already fulfilled, kind of my promise.   Miko Lee: [00:31:46] Wow. Interesting.    Chi Thai: [00:31:50] And she means that in the nicest possible way.    Miko Lee: [00:31:52] Yeah.    Chi Thai: [00:31:52] That she feels like you have a home, you have stability, you have someone who loves you, you know, you have a, a purpose in life, but really her value, you know, the way, I think, the way she measures my value is like, that's how she looks at it. The, the art is something else.    Miko Lee: [00:32:10] Well, I really appreciate you sharing your art with us in the world and your various, um, genres and styles. And I'm wondering how our audience can find out more about your work. Clearly we'll put links to where people can buy the book and let's see, but how do they find out more about your films?   Chi Thai: [00:32:28] Um, so that like, because it is the 50th anniversary of the end of the Vietnam War in 2025. Actually the very anniversary of that is the tomorrow, the 30th, April, right? Um, you can watch Lullaby on Altar, which is a YouTube channel. Um, and I can give you the link for it. Rating Grace is on Paramount Plus if you want to, if you've got Paramount Plus, but you can also buy it from all the usual kind of places too. Um, and you know, and we'll see us from all great book stockists, I imagine in, in the us.   Miko Lee: [00:33:07] Thank you so much. Um, I'd love to get, I'd love for you to send me the link so I could put 'em in the show notes. I really appreciate chatting with you today. Um, is there anything else you'd like to share?    Chi Thai: [00:33:19] Um, no, I think, I think that's good. Your, your questions are so good. Mika, I'm already like, kinda like processing them all. Uh, yes.    Miko Lee: [00:33:30] Well, it was a delight to chat with you and to learn more about your artistic vision, and my wishes are that you continue to grow and feel blessed no matter what your mama says, because deep down, she's still proud of you. Even if she doesn't say it out loud.    Chi Thai: [00:33:47] I believe it. I totally believe it.    Miko Lee: [00:33:50] Yay. Thank you so much for spending time with us on Apex Express.Next up, listen to stay, go from dark heart, a concert narrative by singer and songwriter Golda Sargento.   MUSIC   That was the voice of Golda Sargento from the new Filipino futurism punk rock sci-fi dark heart. Welcome, Livia Blackburne Children's book, author of Nainai's Mountain. Welcome to Apex Express.    Livia Blackburne: [00:38:56] Thank you so much for having me.    Miko Lee: [00:38:58] I wanna start with a personal question, which is, who are your people and what legacy do you carry with you?    Livia Blackburne: [00:39:05] I am Chinese American, and so I carry the stories of my grandparents who fled China to Taiwan, fled that war. And I also carry the stories of my parents and myself who immigrated. To America, and I am, I grew up in New Mexico, so I have fond memories of green chili and new Mexican food. I went to college, Harvard and MIT on the east coast. So I've got a bit of that kind of ivory tower. And now I'm in LA and, you know, my people are, my family and my community, the writing community here. So I, I'm a big mix. Yes.    Miko Lee: [00:39:44] What legacy do you carry with you?    Livia Blackburne: [00:39:47] I mentioned a bit of my grandparents and my parents. What they went through in the war in China, and then my parents and me coming here. the experience of being here in two worlds, coming from Taiwan having that cultural background and also, growing up in the United States. The culture I've been surrounded with here as well.    Miko Lee: [00:40:06] Thank you so much for sharing. Can you tell us about your new illustrated children's book? Nainai's Mountain. What inspired this work?    Livia Blackburne: [00:40:14] The story of this book actually started with another book that is coming out in a couple years that actually I can't share too much about. My grandparents fled the war in China and then my. Parents grew up in Taiwan and I wanted to preserve that family story. My parents are getting older. So I started doing oral interviews with my parents about their childhood, what it was like, growing up. I wouldn't say they weren't refugees in Taiwan. It's a very complicated political situation, but they were transplants to Taiwan, and what it was like growing up there, their daily life. What kind of things they did when they were a child, their pastimes, I wanted to preserve their stories and I got a lot of great material., A lot of that is going into a novel that I'm currently working on. But also as I worked on it, there were so many great details that I thought would be really good in a picture book as well. Also, I'm a mother now. I have an 8-year-old daughter, and she is half Caucasian, half Asian. She has never gone to Taiwan before and I. As I'm writing this, I'm thinking, it would be really great to, I do want to share Taiwan and, my own childhood, home with her at some point. And so I start imagining what would it be like to bring her back to Taiwan and show her everything. And that became the seed for Nainai's Mountain, which is a. Story of a girl visiting Taiwan for the first time with her grandmother. And her grandmother shows her around and tells her stories about her childhood, and the girl through her grandmother's eyes, sees Taiwan, you know, for the beautiful place that it is.    Miko Lee: [00:41:56] You also wrote the book I Dream of Popo. How are these companions to each other and also for audiences that might not speak Chinese. One is a grandmother on the mother's side, and the other is the grandmother on the father's side. Can you talk about how I dream of Popo is linked to Nainai's Mountain?   Livia Blackburne: [00:42:15] Thank you for pointing that out. Yes. So Popo is maternal grandmother, and Nainai is a paternal grandmother. And that is a fantastic question. So I dream of popo is kind of my story. So it's about a little girl who moves from Taiwan , to the United States and it's about her relationship with her grandmother who stays in Taiwan. And it talks about, how a close relationship, navigating long geographical distances about the language barrier that comes up. And that was very much me, Nainai's Mountain. It's kind of like Popo in reverse, you know, it's now it's someone going back to Taiwan and kind of getting in touch with those roots. That, as I mentioned, that's inspired by my daughter. And you'll see in Nainai's Mountain, I specified that the child should be, half Asian, half Caucasian. Because, I wanted more of that representation in the children's literature.    Miko Lee: [00:43:07] Thank you. I, I wonder if you could talk a little bit about the artistic style. So you are the author, but you had different illustrators for both of the books and the style is really different. The in, when I look at Nainai's Mountain, which I'm holding here, it's sort of collage and really vibrant colors. Where I Dream of Popo has a different, more. I'm almost realistic, kind of look to it. And I'm wondering what your process was like in collaborating with illustrators.    Livia Blackburne: [00:43:37] That's one of the best things about being a picture book author, is that you get to collaborate with so many illustrators and they all have such different styles, such different visions. Most of the time it's the publisher who chooses the illustrator, although they. Consult me usually. My editor for I Dream of Popo picked Julia Kuo. And she sent me samples and I loved it. And, it was great. I'm friends with Julia now and that book did really well. It was very well known, especially in kind of Taiwanese American, Asian American circles. And so when I did, Nainai's mountain, that was with a different publishing house and my editor. He very consciously said, you know, because it's also a book about Taiwan and a grandmother. We don't want to get it confused with I dream of Popo. So, we made a conscious decision to pick an artist with a very different style and Joey Chou is fantastic. He's very well known for his Disney art. You can see his art in a lot of the hotels and cruise ships. And, he, very bright, vibrant, and I, he's also from Taiwan. I think he did a fantastic job.   Miko Lee: [00:44:41] And have the artistic work ever surprised you as being really different from your imagination while you were writing?    Livia Blackburne: [00:44:48] That's a great question. I don't think they've ever surprised me. By being different. They surprised me in the specifics that they've chosen. For example, I dream of Popo. Julia, spent a lot of time in Taiwan and she put in these great, Taiwan details that, you know, if you're from Taiwan, you would know for sure. There's like a specific brand of rice cooker called the rice cooker, and she has one there and like the giant bag of rice in the corner, and the calendar on the wall.   Miko Lee: [00:45:16] Even the specificities of the food and the trays and everything is quite lovely.    Livia Blackburne: [00:45:20] Yeah, yeah. You know, every time I read that, I look at that spread, I get hungry. So surprise there. And, with Joey, I, I love how he does the different, there's kind of flashback pictures and there's, pictures now and. The thing about him, his color, I just love the color that he put in from the greens, of Taiwan to kind of the bright fluorescent lights, neon lights of Taipei, and then there's kind of the slight sepia tones of the past and he just, you know, brings it so to life so well.   Miko Lee: [00:45:49] I didn't know he was a Disney animator, but it totally makes sense because it feels very layered. It does feel animated in a way and kind of alive. So I appreciate that.   Livia Blackburne: [00:45:59] I'm not sure. If he's an animator. He does a lot of art for the theme parks and like products and the cruise ships and stuff. I'm not sure.    Miko Lee: [00:46:07] Oh, interesting.   Livia Blackburne: [00:46:07] He does like movies and  stuff.    Miko Lee: [00:46:08] Interesting. It looks like animation though. Your book.    Livia Blackburne: [00:46:13] It does look very, yeah. Lively. Mm-hmm.    Miko Lee: [00:46:16] That I'm looking forward to that series. That would be so cute. The grandmother series as a whole little mini series traveling to different places. can you tell us about your new book, Dreams to Ashes? Has that been released yet?   Livia Blackburne: [00:46:29] Dreams to Ashes? That has been released that, released about a month before Nainai's Mountain. Yeah, that one's quite a bit different. So that one is a nonfiction book and it's a picture book, and it's about the Los Angeles massacre of 1871. Whenever people, I tell people about that, they're like, wait, you wrote a picture book about a massacre? Which is slightly counterintuitive. So I never knew about the Los Angeles massacre growing up. And, and, given that I am a Chinese person in Los Angeles, that is kind of weird. Basically, it was a race massacre that occurred. One of the biggest mass lynchings in history, uh, where there was a between two rival Chinese organizations and a white bystander was killed. And because of that, , a mob formed and they rounded the Chinese population up basically. And. Blame them for that death. In the end, 18 Chinese men were killed and only one of them were involved in the original gunfight. It was a horrible tragedy. And unfortunately, as often happened with these kind of historical tragedies in our country, nobody was really punished for it. A few men were indicted and convicted, but their convictions were overturned and it just kind of disappeared into history. And it really struck me that, you know, nobody knew about this. I wanted to kind of bring this to light and unfortunately when I was writing it, it was also, during the Covid pandemic and, I was seeing a lot of anti-Asian rhetoric, anti-Asian hate crimes were going up. And I saw so many parallels between what happened. Back then, because, you know, Chinese people specifically were being vilified , they were being called immoral, stealing people's jobs. And you can see in the years before the massacre the newspapers were saying horrible things and, you know, the hate was just becoming very strong and all that exploded one night into an unspeakable tragedy. Unfortunately as an author, you want your work to be relevant, but sometimes you don't want your work to be relevant in this way. Right. Nowadays I'm seeing so much rhetoric again against immigrants and not of many ethnicities. And in some ways I'm sad. That, this is happening now. And I also hope that this book will contribute to the conversation and show how the danger of racism and xenophobia and hate and what, what can happen because of that.   Miko Lee: [00:48:55] So this occurred in the late 1800s, right? Was it before the Chinese Exclusion Act?    Livia Blackburne: [00:49:03] Yes, it was before the Chinese Exclusion Act. So you'd hope that people kinda learn from these things. And it was just kind of one of the, one of the horrible things that happened on the way to the Chinese Exclusion Act and Chinese immigrants being excluded basically Chinese laborers at least.   Miko Lee: [00:49:23] Oh wow. Okay. I'm looking this up now. And 1882 we know was the Chinese Exclusion Act and this incident actually happened in 1871. Yes. A decade beforehand, Helen Zia always talks about these moments that are missing. MIH missing in history and this is clearly another one of, another time of just wiping out a population.I'm wondering if you could speak a little bit more about how Children's Books can make a difference in the world that we're currently living in, where our government is banning books and you know that there's a narratives that they want to align with a certain kind of conservative ideology. Can you talk about the power of being a Children's Book author in this time that we're living in right now? . I'm really thinking about dreams to Ashes and even I dream of Popo and even Nainai's Mountain, which you would think, oh, they're, you, they're visiting their grandparent, their grandmothers, that would not be controversial. But now when even words like inclusion and diversity are threatened and books are being banned, I'm just wondering if you could. Share a little bit more about your superpower as a children's book author?    Livia Blackburne: [00:50:31] Yeah, that's a fantastic question. We live in a time right now, there's, a lot of hate, a lot of intolerance, a lot of fear of different people groups. And a lot of that I think is because people are unfamiliar with people unlike themselves. They see. People who are different, look differently, act differently, speak differently, and it scares them. And I think the best way to get around that is to actually get to know people of other backgrounds, to see them as human. And I think that's where children's books come in. ‘Cause we don't, children are not born. With this hate of the other. They learn it. But, if they grow up being familiar with people of different backgrounds seeing their stories seeing them as, normal human beings, which, should be obvious, but sometimes it's hard, for adults to realize. Then, I'm hoping, as a children's book author that it will lead to a more empathetic world. And perhaps that's why the government sometimes in certain groups are wanting to, censor this and control the flow of children's books because, children are the most their minds are still open. They're still able to learn.    Miko Lee: [00:51:48] And Livia, tell us what you're working on next.   Livia Blackburne: [00:51:53] So right now I am. Working on a historical middle grade. We haven't quite announced it yet, so I can't say the title or too many details, but it is based on my family history of my parents and grandparents who moved from China to Taiwan after the civil War.   Miko Lee: [00:52:12] Please check out our website, kpfa.org. To find out more about our show tonight. We thank all of you listeners out there. Keep resisting, keep organizing, keep creating and sharing your visions with the world because your voices are important. Apex Express is created by Miko Lee, Jalena Keane-Lee, Preti Mangala-Shekar, Swati Rayasam, Aisa Villarosa, Estella Owoimaha-Church, Gabriel Tanglao, Cheryl Truong and Ayame Keane-Lee.   The post APEX Express – 6.19.25 We Are All Connected appeared first on KPFA.

SCOTUS: CHINESE EXCLUSION ACT 1882.  RICHARD EPSTEIN, CIVITAS. 1920 DC

PREVIEW: COLLEAGUE RICHARD EPSTEIN COMMENTS ON THE CHINESE EXCLUSION ACT OF 1882 AND THE CURRENT TRUMP ADMINISTRATION ORDER TO CHINESE NATIONALS IN THE US ON VISAS. MORE LATER. 1857

What does it mean to truly belong in America?  Michael Luo, executive editor at The New Yorker and author of Strangers in the Land, joins Redeeming Babel's director of content, DT Slouffman, to explore the Asian American experience—from the legacy of the Chinese Exclusion Act to the rise in anti-Asian hate during the COVID-19 pandemic. Drawing from personal stories and a viral moment that sparked national conversation, Luo confronts the “perpetual foreigner” stereotype and envisions a more inclusive vision of American identity. DT and Michael unpack how race, immigration, and belonging continue to shape all of our lives. Send written questions or voice memos for “Ask Curtis” episodes to: askcurtis@redeemingbabel.org Send Campfire Stories to: info@redeemingbabel.org   Resources mentioned in this episode: Michael Luo's An Open Letter to the Woman Who Told My Family to Go Back to China Kirkus Reviews: A Vast History Began With One Sidewalk Encounter  Chinese Exclusion Act, 1882 The Burlingame-Seward Treaty, 1868 Immigration and Nationality Act, 1965 Pew Research: Asian American discrimination in the COVID-19 pandemic Pew Research: A third of Asian Americans changed daily routine due to threats   More From Michael Luo: Michael Luo's Strangers in the Land: Exclusion, Belonging, and the Epic Story of the Chinese in America  Michael Luo's latest articles at The New Yorker Follow Michael Luo on Instagram Follow Michael Luo on X (formerly Twitter)   Follow Us: Good Faith on Instagram Good Faith on X (formerly Twitter) Good Faith on Facebook   Sign up: Redeeming Babel Newsletter

A weekly magazine-style radio show featuring the voices and stories of Asians and Pacific Islanders from all corners of our community. The show is produced by a collective of media makers, deejays, and activists. Happy Asian American & Pacific Islander Heritage Month! Even though the Trump Administration has eliminated recognizing cultural heritage months, we are still celebrating diversity and inclusion here at APEX Express and KPFA. We believe in lifting up people's voices and tonight on APEX Express the Powerleegirls are focusing on “Asian American Children's book authors”. Powerleegirl hosts Miko Lee and daughter Jalena Keane-Lee speak with: Michele Wong McSween, Gloria Huang, and Andrea Wang   AAPINH Month Children's Books part 1 transcript Opening: [00:00:00] Apex Express Asian Pacific expression. Community and cultural coverage, music and calendar, new visions and voices, coming to you with an Asian Pacific Islander point of view. It's time to get on board the Apex Express.   Ayame Keane-Lee: [00:00:49] Happy Asian American and Pacific Islander Heritage Month. Even though the Trump administration has eliminated recognizing cultural heritage months, we are still celebrating diversity and inclusion. Here at Apex Express and KPFA, we believe in lifting up people's voices. And tonight on Apex Express, the PowerLeeGirls are focusing on Asian American Children's book authors. PowerLeeGirl hosts Miko Lee and daughter Jalena Keane-Lee. Speak with Michele Wong McSween, Gloria Huang and Andrea Wang. Thanks for joining us tonight on Apex Express. Enjoy the show.   Miko Lee: [00:01:21] Welcome, Michele Wong McSween to Apex Express.    Michele Wong McSween: [00:01:26] Thank you, Miko. It's nice to be here.    Miko Lee: [00:01:28] I'm really happy to talk with you about your whole children's series, Gordon & Li Li, which is absolutely adorable. I wanna start very first with a personal question that I ask all of my guests, which is, who are your people and what legacy do you carry with you?   Michele Wong McSween: [00:01:45] I would say my people are really my family starting with, my great, great grandparents who came here down to my grandparents, my parents, and onto my children because, to me family is. The reason why I created Gordon & Li Li in the first place, it was really to bridge that connection for my children. I didn't grow up feeling that connected with my culture because as a fourth generation Chinese American, I was really in the belief that I'm American. Why do I need to know anything about my culture? Why do I need to speak Chinese? I never learned. As a sidebar to that, I never learned to speak Chinese and it didn't really hit me until I had my own kids that I was really doing a disservice to not only my kids, but to myself. my people are my family. I do this for my kids. I do this to almost apologize to my parents for being so, Disrespectful to my amazing culture and I do it for the families who really want to connect and bridge that gap for their own children and for themselves.    Miko Lee: [00:02:53] And what legacy do you carry with you?    Michele Wong McSween: [00:02:55] Again, my family. My, great grandparents. Really. Started our family's legacy with the hard work and the prejudices and all the things that they endured so that we could have a better life. And I've always felt that it is my responsibility to teach my own kids about the sacrifices that were made and not to make them feel guilty, but to just make them appreciate that we are here. Because of the the blood, sweat, and tears that their ancestors did for them. And so we are, eternally grateful for that. I think it's important for us to continue that legacy of always doing our best, being kind and doing what we can do to further the experience of not just our family, but the people in our community that we connect with and to the greater world.    Miko Lee: [00:03:43] when you were growing up, were your parents speaking with you in Chinese and did you hear about your great grandparents and their legacy? Was that part of your upbringing?    Michele Wong McSween: [00:03:52] I heard about my great grandparents in the stories that my mom told us, but to be quite honest, I wasn't receptive to really digging deep in my cultural understanding of. my great-grandfather and what he went through. I know mom, I know he came over in 19 whatever. I know he brought over all these young sons from his village, but I really didn't fully take it in and. No, I didn't hear Chinese spoken in the house much. The only time my parents spoke it was to each other so that we didn't know what they were talking about. They had like this secret code, language. My experience with my language was not, That positive. we did attempt to go to Chinese school only to be teased by all the other kids because we didn't speak it. It didn't end up well. my mom ended up pulling us out and so no, we were really not connected all that much to the language.   Miko Lee: [00:04:48] I can really relate to what you're saying. As a fifth generation Chinese American, and my parents their ancestors came from different provinces, so their dialects were so different that they even spoke to each other in English. 'cause they couldn't understand each other in Chinese. So it happens so often. Yeah. Yeah. And so I really relate to that. I'm wondering if there was an epiphany in your life or a time where you thought, oh, I. I wish I knew more of those stories about my ancestors or was there some catalyst for you that changed?   Michele Wong McSween: [00:05:17] All of this really kind of happened when I moved to New York. I, you know, raised in Sacramento, went to college in the Bay Area, lived in San Francisco for a while with a job, and then I eventually moved to New York. And it wasn't until I came to New York and I met Asians or Chinese Americans like me that actually spoke Chinese and they knew about cool stuff to do in Chinatown. It really opened my eyes to this new cool world of the Chinese culture because I really experienced Chinatown for the first time when I moved to New York. And it was just so incredible to see all these people, living together in this community. And they all looked the same. But here's the thing, they all spoke Chinese, or the majority of them spoke Chinese. So when I went to Chinatown and they would look at me and speak to me in Chinese and I would give them this blank stare. They would just look at me like, oh my gosh, she doesn't even speak her own language. And it kind of made me feel bad. And this was really the first time that it dawned on me that, oh wow, I, I kind of feel like something's missing. And then it really hit me when I had my kids, because they're half Chinese and I thought, oh my gosh, wait a minute, if I'm their last connection to the Chinese culture and I don't speak the language. They have no chance of learning anything about their language they couldn't go that deep into their culture if I didn't learn about it. So that really sparked this whole, Gordon & Li Li journey of learning and discovering language and culture for my kids.    Miko Lee: [00:06:51] Share more about that. How, what happened actually, what was the inspiration for creating the Children's book series?    Michele Wong McSween: [00:06:58] It was really my children, I really felt that it was my responsibility to teach them about their culture and language and, if I didn't know the language, then I better learn it. So I enrolled all of us in different Mandarin courses. They had this, I found this really cute kids' Mandarin class. I went to adult Mandarin classes and I chose Mandarin because that was the approved official language in China. I am from Taishan, My parents spoke Taishanese, but I thought, well, if Mandarin's the official language, I should choose that one probably so that my kids will have at least a better chance at maybe some better jobs in the future or connecting with, the billion people that speak it. I thought Mandarin would be the way to go. When I started going to these classes and I just realized, wow, this is really hard, not just to learn the language, but to learn Mandarin Chinese, because we're not just talking about learning how to say the four different tones. We're talking about reading these characters that if you look at a Chinese character, you have absolutely no idea what it sounds like if you're, if you're learning Spanish or French or German, you can see the letters and kind of sound it out a little bit. But with Chinese characters. No chance. So I found it extremely difficult and I realized, wow, I really need to support my kids more because if I am going to be the one that's going to be bridging this connection for them, I need to learn more and I need to find some more resources to help us. when we would have bedtime story time, that whole routine. That was always the favorite time of my kids to be really, quiet and they would really absorb what I was saying, or we would talk about our days or just talk about funny things and I realized, wow, these books that they love and we have to read over and over and over again. this is the way that they're going to get the information. And I started searching high and low for these books. back in 2006, they didn't exist. and so I realized if they didn't exist and I really wanted them for my kids, then I needed to create them. That's the impetus, is there was nothing out there and I really wanted it so badly that I had to create it myself.   Miko Lee: [00:09:09] Oh, I love that. And I understand you started out self-publishing. Can you talk a little bit about that journey?    Michele Wong McSween: [00:09:15] I'm glad I didn't know what I know today because it was really hard. luckily I had, A friend who used to work for a toy company, it was all through connections. there was nothing really on Google about it. there was no Amazon print on demand. There were none of these companies that provide these services like today. So I just kept asking questions. Hey, do you know a toy manufacturer in China that maybe prints books? Do you know a company that could help me? get my books to the states. Do you know an illustrator that can help me illustrate my books? Because I had gone to fashion design school, but I had not learned to illustrate characters or things in a book. So asking questions and not being afraid to ask the questions was really how I was able to do it because, Without the help of friends and family, I wouldn't have been able to do this. I had all my friends look at my books, show them to their kids. I had my kids look at them, and I kind of just figured it out as I went along. Ultimately when I did publish my first book, I had so much support from my kids' schools. To read the books there, I had support from a local play space for kids that we would go to. I really leaned on my community to help me, get the books out there, or actually it was just one at the time. Two years later I self-published two more books. So I had three in total. no one tells you that when you self-publish a book, the easy part is actually creating it. The hard part is what comes after that, which is the pr, the marketing, the pounding, the pavement, knocking on the doors to ask people to buy your books, and that was really hard for me. I would just take my books in a bag and I would explain my story to people and I would show them my books. sometimes they would say, okay, I'll take one of each, or Okay, we'll try it out. and slowly but surely they would reorder from me. I just slowly, slowly built up, a whole Roster of bookstores and I kept doing events in New York.    I started doing events in Los Angeles and San Francisco, and through that I gained some following, some fans and people would tell their friends about me. they would give them to their nieces they would give them to their cousin's kids, or, things like that. I knew that I had to do it because my ultimate goal was to have Scholastic be my publisher. That was my ultimate goal. Because they are the publisher that I grew up with, that I love that I connected with, that I was so excited to get their book club, little flyer. I would check off every book that I wanted. And my mom never said no. She always let me get every single book I wanted. I realize now that that's what really Created the love of books for me is just having access to them and, going to the libraries and seeing all these books on the bookshelves and being able to take them out and read them on the spot. And then if I loved them enough, I would check them out and take them home and read them over and over. So it was really, my experience, having that love for books that I thought, oh gosh, it would be a dream. To have Scholastic become my publisher. So after 10 long years of events and community outreach and selling to these bookstores, I finally thought, okay, I've sold, about 17,000, 18,000 books. Maybe, maybe now I can take my series to them. I also had created an app. Maybe I can take this to them and show them what I've done. Maybe they'll be interested in acquiring me. And I got an appointment with the editor and I pitched my books on my app and within a couple of days they offered to acquire my books, which was my dream come true. So anyway, that was a very long story for how self-publishing really is and how ultimately it really helped my dream come true.    Miko Lee: [00:13:08] Now your books are on this Scholastic book, fair Circuit, right?    Michele Wong McSween: [00:13:13] Yes, they are. Well, it's actually just one book. They took the three books, which were everyday Words. Count in Mandarin and learn animals in Mandarin. They took all three books and they put them in one big compilation book, which is called My First Mandarin Words with Gordon & Li Li. So it's a bigger book. It's a bigger board book. Still very, very sturdy and it's a great, starter book for any family because it has those three first themes that were the first themes that I taught my own boys, and I think. It just, it's very natural for kids to want to learn how to count. animals were, and my kids were animal lovers, so I knew that that's what would keep them interested in learning Mandarin because they actually loved the topic. So, yes, my first mandarin words with Gordon & Li Li does live on Scholastics big roster.   Miko Lee: [00:14:01] Fun. Your dream come true. I love it. Yeah. Thanks. And you were speaking earlier about your background in fashion design. Has there been any impact of your fashion design background on your voice as a children's book author?   Michele Wong McSween: [00:14:14] I don't know if my background as a fashion designer has had any impact on my voice. I think it's had an impact on how I imagined my books and how I color my books and how I designed them because of working with, you know, color palettes and, and putting together collections I can visually see and, can anticipate. Because I have that background, I can kind of anticipate what a customer might want. And also, you know, speaking with people at my events and seeing what kids gravitate to, that also helps. But I think there's so much more to being an author than just writing the books. You know, when I go to my events, I have a table display, I have setups, I have props, I have, I actually now have a, a small. Capsule of merchandise because I missed designing clothes. So I have a teeny collection of, you know, sweaters, hoodies, onesies, a tote bag, and plushies   Miko Lee: [00:15:04] they're super cute by the way.    Michele Wong McSween: [00:15:06] Oh, thank you. So, you know, fashion has come in in different ways and I think having that background has really helped. kind of become who they are    Miko Lee: [00:15:17] Can you tell us about the latest book in the series, which is Gordon and Li Li All About Me. Can you tell a little bit about your latest?   Michele Wong McSween: [00:15:25] Gordon & Li Li All About Me is really, it's, to me, it's. I think my most fun interactive book because it really gets kids and parents up and out of their chairs, out of their seats and moving around. And you know, as a parent, I always would think about the kind of books that my kids would gravitate towards. What would they want to read and what as a parent would I want to read with my kids? Because really reading is all about connection with your kids. That's what I loved about books is it gave me a way to connect with my kids. And so a book about body parts to me is just a really fun way to be animated and get up and move around and you can tickle and, and squeeze and shake it around and dance around. And, you know, having three boys, my house was just like a big energy ball. So I knew that this book would be a really fun one for families and I have two nieces and a nephew, and I now, they're my new target market testers, and they just loved it. They had so much fun pointing to their body parts and the book ends with head, shoulders, knees, and toes in English and in Mandarin. And so of course. Every kid knows head, shoulders, knees, and toes in English. So we sing that. We get up, we point to our pottered parts, we shake it around, we dance around. And then the fun part is teaching them head, shoulders, knees, and toes in Mandarin because they're already familiar with the song. It's not scary to learn something in Mandarin. It just kind of naturally happens. And so I think the All About Me book is just a really fun way to connect with kids. I've actually launched it at a couple of events already and the response to the book has been overwhelming. I was at the Brooklyn Children's Museum and even the president of the museum came and did the head shoulders. Knees and toes, songs with us. It was so much fun. Everybody was dancing around and having a great time. So I'm just really, really excited for people to pick up this book and really learn about the body. It's, you know, body positivity, it's body awareness, and it's just a great way to connect with your kids.   Miko Lee: [00:17:31] So fun. I, I saw that you're recently at the Asian American Book Con. Can you talk a little bit about that experience?    Michele Wong McSween: [00:17:38] Oh, that was great. That was the first of its kind and. I led the entire author segment of it. I would say individual authors. There were, there were, publishing companies that brought in their own authors, but I was responsible for bringing in the independent authors. And so I think we had about eight of us. There were Indian, Korean, Chinese, Taiwanese, and we all came together for this one really special day of celebrating our voices and lifting each other up. And there was so much energy and so much positivity in that event, and I. Actually was just thinking about reaching out to the organizers last year and seeing if we could maybe do, part two? So, I'm glad you brought that up. It was a really positive experience.    Miko Lee: [00:18:27] So we're celebrating the end of Asian American Pacific Islander Native Hawaiian month. Can you tell us why this month is important to you?    Michele Wong McSween: [00:18:36] When you have something designated and set aside as, this is the month that we're going to be celebrating Asian American Native Hawaiian Pacific Islander heritage all month long, I think it kind of perks up. People's ears and they think, oh wow, this is a great opportunity for me to see what's happening in my community. I think it just brings the awareness to. The broader community and ultimately the world. And I think when we learn about each other and each other's cultures, it brings us closer together and makes us realize that we're really not that different from each other. And I think when there are so many events happening now it peaks the interest of people in the neighborhood that might otherwise not know about it and it can, really bring us closer together as a community.   Miko Lee: [00:19:27] Michelle Wong McSween, thank you so much for joining me on Apex Express. It's great to hear more about you and about your latest book Gordon & Li Li and the entire series. Thank you so much.    Michele Wong McSween: [00:19:39] Thank you, Miko   Jalena Keane-Lee: [00:19:40] Thank you all so much for joining us. I'm here with Gloria l Huang, author of Kaya of the Ocean. Thank you so much for joining us, Gloria.    Gloria Huang: [00:19:48] Oh, thanks so much for having me here.    Jalena Keane-Lee: [00:19:50] So first off, one question that we're asking all of our guests on our show tonight is, who are your people? However you identify, you know, your community, your ancestors, and what legacy do you carry with you?    Gloria Huang: [00:20:01] Oh, that's such a good question. So I am my heritage is Chinese. My parents were born in China and then grew up in Taiwan. And I myself was actually born in Canada. But then moved the states pretty young and and American Canadian dual citizen and now, but I, my heritage plays a lot into my. Kind of my worldview. It really shaped, how I grew up and how I saw things. And so it features very prominently in my writing and in my stories as you could probably tell from Kaya the ocean.    Jalena Keane-Lee: [00:20:34] Yes. And I love the book so much. It was such a    Gloria Huang: [00:20:37] thank you,    Jalena Keane-Lee: [00:20:38] amazing read. And I'm also half Chinese and love the ocean. Just love the beach so much and have always felt such a connection with the water. I don't wanna give away too much things about the book, but I was wondering if you could talk about your inspiration for writing it and a little bit about, setting and everything.   Gloria Huang: [00:20:56] Of course. So the inspiration for the book actually started I came up with the idea when the world was first emerging from the pandemic and I was seeing a lot of people obviously experiencing a lot of anxiety, but a lot of children very close to me in my life. And they were experiencing it for the first time, which was can be so difficult. I remember when it happened to me and there's just this tendency to. Worry that there's something wrong with you or that you've done something and you feel so alone. And so I remember standing by the ocean one night actually and thinking that I'd really love to write a book about a girl who is struggling with. The anxiety just to be able to send a message to all these kids that there's nothing wrong with them. They're not alone and really all parts of who they are. Even the parts they might not love so much are important parts of these amazing, beautiful, complicated people. They are. So that was the inspiration for that part of the story, the setting. I was very inspired. As you mentioned, the ocean is a huge inspiration to me. It actually comes into my mind, a lot of my stories and someone pointed that out once and I was like, you're right, it does. And I think part of it is that I love the ocean. I love the beach. I love being there, but I'm also so in awe of this powerful thing that, you know, where we know so little about it. It is. There's so much mystery to it. It can look so beautiful on the surface and be so dangerous underneath. I love it as a metaphor. I love it as a part of nature. So I think that was a huge part of why I wanted to incorporate that, especially because I think it also plays well into the metaphor for how some people experience anxiety and you can be calm on the surface, but so much is happening underneath.    Jalena Keane-Lee: [00:22:29] Absolutely. Yeah. Those interplay with each other and are metaphors for each other in such a beautiful way, mirror the experience. Yeah. I wanted to talk a little bit more about anxiety and particular, as a young Asian American girl the cultural specificity of having anxiety as a young Asian American woman.    Gloria Huang: [00:22:46] Yes I definitely think it's no coincidence. I think that anxiety often goes hand in hand with perfectionism and pressure and I, many people feel that kind of pressure, but certainly a young Asian girl especially with immigrant parents, will feel specific kind of pressure. And so I was really trying to portray that, Somebody once said to me, they were like, oh, I really like how Kaya on the surface seems so put together. She's, got really good grades. She works really hard at school. She's close to her parents, but there's all this going on underneath. And I actually think that's not unusual in terms of that experience for Asian American children of immigrants, and especially if you're female I was really trying to. Tease that out. And then in addition I think there's a tendency, and this might exist in other cultures as well, but in Asian culture, at least in my family history there's a tendency not to really want to talk about mental health. There was a, there's a joke in my family that my parents thought anything could be solved with good sleep and good nutrition, like anytime you had any problem. And I think that there is a, there's a. resistance to feeling like your child can be struggling in a way you can't help them. So I, really wanted to touch on that, part of the cultural pressures at play in kaya's life.    Jalena Keane-Lee: [00:23:59] And you did so beautifully and it was very relatable, as a anxious Asian girly. And also just, the discussion of big feelings and somehow, having inklings that you may be more powerful than you even realize, but the kind of like emotions that come with that too.    Gloria Huang: [00:24:15] Yes. I think that's a huge part of it is that like when you experience these huge feelings they feel powerful, know, in a negative way. But what I was really trying to get at was, there is also power in accepting these parts of yourself and realizing that They can make up this powerful being that you are, even if you might not love them in that moment.    Jalena Keane-Lee: [00:24:34] Yeah. I felt very seen by the book and I, couldn't help but wonder wow, what would it have been like if I had read this when I was, 13 or 12 or kind of Closer to the age of the characters in the book.   Gloria Huang: [00:24:45] Thank you so much for saying that it actually means a lot because a lot of my motivation when I do write these books is to write for people who are either of that age or, wish they had a book like that at that age, which is also how I feel a lot about books nowadays and oh, I, I'm so glad that exists. I wish that had been around when I was that age.    Jalena Keane-Lee: [00:25:03] Yes. Were there any books that really set an example for you that either you read, maybe when you were, in the young adult. Age range or that you've read now as an adult where you're like, okay, this is definitely the audience that I wanna be writing for.   Gloria Huang: [00:25:17] Definitely. I actually love this question 'cause I'm a big reader and so I love talking about books . When I was a kid, middle grade books were my gateway into my love of reading. So I still remember a lot of my favorite books, but I would say a recent book, it's actually maybe not that recent now, it's maybe a couple years old, but a book that really. Had an effect on the middle grade book was when you trap a tiger by Tae Keller and it explores. The kind of Korean experience, but also through the prism of kind of understanding generational grief. And it was just so beautifully done and really made an impact on me. So that was one recently that I thought was really powerful. And, I was like, this is an important book. This is definitely a book I would've loved as a child. When I was younger and I was reading books, there were three books that meant a lot to me. One was called the true confessions of Charlotte Doyle, and it was like a swashbuckling adventure story starring a girl, which was, at that time not very common. And it was, it meant, it was so earth shattering to me to be able to see a female character in that role. So that was great. There's a book called. Homecoming by Cynthia Voigt. And it's an adventure story and it also stars. The main character is a very strong female character and Tuck everlasting, which I just think is a beautiful book. It's also female characters. Now I'm saying it out loud. They are all female main characters. And all about, existentialism and adventure and things that, it was important for me to see. Female characters exploring. But I did also wanna say that when I was reading middle grade books, some of my favorite books included a series called, babysitters Club, which I think that they've redone now as a graphic novel. And that was actually really important, not necessarily for the stories, but because there's a character named Claudia Kishi who. Was a Japanese American character and she absolutely shattered the minds of, I think all kids that age were Asian descent and female in reading these books because there just wasn't a character like her before that, she was so cool and artistic but she had immigrant parents and she had a sister who was very good at math and they didn't get along and she loved junk food and she was. So incredibly nuanced and it was just not something that we saw back then. So that really inspired me, I think, to want to add to the diversity of voices. And thankfully there are many more diverse voices now than when I was reading.    Jalena Keane-Lee: [00:27:30] I love that. And I also feel like books that you read at that age, they stay with you forever.   Gloria Huang: [00:27:35] They really do.    Jalena Keane-Lee: [00:27:35] And they shape so much of like your worldview and your friendships. And I'm curious, 'cause I know the book was released this year in January. Mm-hmm. So what has it been like for you on your book tour and what's been some other responses that you've heard? I.    Gloria Huang: [00:27:48] It's been really great. It was so exciting to do the book launch and then just the amount of support from the writing community from, my, my kind of network, my agents and my publisher and editor. And also just readers. It's been really great. But one thing I think I wasn't expecting to love quite so much, not because I was expecting to not love it. I just said, it occurred to me that I would feel this way is getting feedback from, child readers is amazing because, I think as writers we love feedback no matter what. And if it's positive feedback, that's even better. But having a child reach out and as some of my friends will send a video of their. Children reacting to the book or they'll, their, let their child type out a text messages and just to hear how the book hits with them and to hear their excitement or to hear that they were moved or to have them want to know what happens next. It meant so much to me because it was, they're the target audience and to have them feel seen in that way was just, it's just the ultimate kind of powerful feeling.    Jalena Keane-Lee: [00:28:51] That is so sweet. Oh my gosh. I can only imagine. And so you're talking about the young readers. Yes. But I'm also curious if you have any advice or thoughts for young writers who might be wanting to share and get similar stories out to the world?   Gloria Huang: [00:29:05] Yeah I definitely do. And one of the. Experiences I've had that's been great is I've been doing, some school visits and I go and I talk about the book, but I actually talk about the writing process. And when I do that, I really talk to the kids. As if they're writers. The one of the first questions I ask is, hold up your hand. If you love writing or you think you want me, you might wanna be a writer someday. And a lot of hands go up and I tell them like, what the publishing process is, what are, the different genre options, what you might wanna consider, how you come up with an idea, how you sit down and write it, how you reach out to an agent. And I am surprised at how. Intensely, they're hanging onto every word and they're insightful questions after it. It shows me that a lot of them are really thinking about this. I think for one of the school visits, I remember someone held up her hand and she said what is the youngest age I. Someone has been able to be published. And I thought that was great. Because they're so inspired and you can tell that, that they're thinking for the first time this is a possibility. I have all kinds of advice during the school visits, the main piece of advice is really. Just that it can be a tough industry. writing is a very isolated process usually. There's a lot of kind of obstacles and there's a lot of gatekeeping. And so I tell 'em that the most important thing they can do is just keep pushing through and not to let any, setbacks stop them, because the ultimate goal is to reach even just one person.    Jalena Keane-Lee: [00:30:24] Absolutely. And what kind of advice do you give around learning how to hone your own voice and also having discipline when it comes to an artistic practice?   Gloria Huang: [00:30:33] Yeah, I think that's such a great question. And I was gonna say this piece of advice is probably more for I. Older writers, but adult writers, I guess I should say. The one thing that I've really been thinking about having published a middle grade book is the very specific and unique experience of writing for middle grade audiences. I think a lot of my friends who write for older audience groups, young adults, adults, They have their own challenges, but one of the things that is different is when they're writing, they are writing for the same target audience. That's also the decision makers. So generally, adults and young adults are picking their own books, and they're speaking to someone who will. Ultimately be the ones to pick up the books where when you're writing for middle grade audiences they're not usually the decision makers. at bookstores, they may or may not be in charge of which book they buy, in. Schools, usually it's a librarian or a teacher. So in some ways you're writing for one audience, but you're also writing a subject matter that you're hoping the decision makers will decide is worthy to put in front of your ultimate readers. So that's one challenge. And then the other challenge is I think middle grade audiences are so. fascinating because they're going through this amazingly unusual time in their lives, whether it's eventful and there's new experiences and that can be exciting, but also scary. So there's a lot to mind in terms of topics, but they are also a mixture of being very sophisticated readers who are on the cusp of being teens. And so there's a healthy dose of, skepticism, but they're still young enough that they. Believe in magic, at least in the literary world. So you, there's a lot of room to play with that. But they also. They sound different. They speak differently than adults. So it's important to get the dialogue, for me I, turn to children in my life, including my own, just to do a check to make sure that the dialogue sounds authentic and something that, people, that kids would say. So a lot of thoughts there, but I think, I've been thinking a lot about middle grade and writing for middle grade, and what a unique experience it is.   Jalena Keane-Lee: [00:32:26] Yeah, that's such a good point about the decision maker and having the multiple audiences, and I'm sure sometimes the decision makers are reading the books too, right? Or reading it with their kids or what have you. For your personal writing practice, are there any upcoming projects that you can share with us? And how do you stay inspired for what I imagine is like the long haul of writing something.    Gloria Huang: [00:32:45] I'm happiest when I have like several projects in the pipeline. So as soon as I am done a book or it's, outta my hands, it's with my agents or my editors. I'm looking to write another book. And I think sometimes I probably overwhelm my amazing book before agents. 'cause I'm like, I'm ready to start another story. And they're like, we're still looking at the book you just sent us. But I, that's very much how. I am happiest. I would definitely say that everybody finds their own rhythm. I'm in some writers groups and some people are incredibly fast drafters and just need multiple projects at a time. And some people are like, no, I need to work on one project and I need to have it to perfection and I'm gonna work on it for a year or two. And I think whatever works for the individual artist, I think is the best kind of process for them. But yes, for me it's very much about having multiple projects. I think I'm most inspired when I have different projects going at the same time. finding your own rhythm, I think is my advice.    Jalena Keane-Lee: [00:33:40] kaya of the ocean has, strong themes and storylines about, myths, mythology, Chinese mythology, and goddesses. I'm curious if you wanna talk any more about that and then also if that shows up in any of the other projects you're working on    Gloria Huang: [00:33:54] Yes, the Chinese mythological water goddess that features. Pretty prominently in Kaya of the Ocean is Matsu. And I find her to be such a fascinating character. She is a real goddess who's worshiped still in Asia. I think. Fishermen often will, pray to her for safe passage when they go out on the water. And my father told me about her when I was younger he told me like the side stories and I thought that was really interesting. But it was only when I started thinking about this book that I thought, I'd love to, I'd love to incorporate her. I hadn't heard about her too much in, in the fictional world, even though I knew she was still like a revered goddess. But I thought it was so cool that she was this strong. I. Strong female figure in a space that didn't always have that, hundreds of years ago. And so I dove into her story a little bit and found out, the story is that she was once a human child who loved to read and then she was afraid of swimming in water until she was older and then she drowned, saving, trying to save some relatives and it was interesting 'cause I'd already started plotting out Kaya and writing Kaya. And so much of her story wove easily into what I had already come up with. Like there, I think she has two sidekicks that were one time enemies that she, made into her friends and I'd already had Kaya written with two friends, Naomi and Ana. So I, there was just so much that I felt was kismet. And it was really fun to be able to weave that story together and fictionalize it. But I think it was also meaningful for me to be able to do that because. When I was younger, I loved reading Greek mythology. the stories are beautiful and they've been redone in beautiful ways, but it definitely was an area where I didn't necessarily see myself reflected. As part of my goal to add to the diversity of voices, I really wanted to feature Chinese mythology and bring those stories in so that. Kids can either see themselves reflected in those stories and or understand a new kind of set of mythology and learn about a new culture.   Jalena Keane-Lee: [00:35:46] Yes. I'm so glad you put it that way because it is, it's such a privilege to have access to, our own I. Cultural stories and knowledge through these, like fun and modern interpretations. Definitely. So I'm so glad that this can provide that.    Gloria Huang: [00:36:00] Oh, thank you. I did realize I didn't answer your other question, which is does it feature my other works? Which so I have sold another middle grade novel and I'm, it's not announced yet. I'm hoping to announce it soon. And I have some other. Books. I'm working on a young adult novel so far. They have not featured Chinese mythology, but I do definitely have a type that my most of my books tend to be contemporary settings, but with elements of speculative. Fantasy, just like the light touch of that and sometimes a little bit of historical elements as well. So they, they definitely all have that similar motif, but so far chi of the ocean is the only one to feature a Chinese mythological goddess.   Jalena Keane-Lee: [00:36:43] Thank you so much for sharing that. I love that. And I really love the relationship that Kaya had with her two friends and just and then also like the cousin that comes and just capturing like the banter amongst, amongst the girls.    Gloria Huang: [00:36:56] Thank you so much. that was really important to me, I think because at the stage that Kaia is in her life the loves of her life really are her two friends, Naomi and Ana, and they feature very prominently in how she learns to cope with her anxiety and her symptoms of anxiety. And so I really, I think that I really wanted to center her their friendship as much as possible. So I'm I'm glad that you saw it that way too.    Jalena Keane-Lee: [00:37:19] Yeah. And I feel like, I mean, it truly is the most important relationship. And so it's nice when works of fiction and yeah, works of fiction, can reflect that in such a beautiful way. I know you mentioned that you have daughters or have children?    Gloria Huang: [00:37:32] I do, yes. I have a son and a daughter. And my daughter actually was quite involved because when I first started writing Kaya, I think she was exactly of the age that she would be the target reader group. And so she actually helped Beta read it. She provided a lot of feedback. She became like a cheerleader. She was definitely involved in the process and I think that was really exciting for her. my son became of the reading age once it came out, so he reads it and he's a big fan too,   Jalena Keane-Lee: [00:38:00] that's so sweet. I love that your daughter was part of the editing process too. That's amazing.    Gloria Huang: [00:38:04] Yeah. Yeah. She loves writing and always says she wants to be a writer herself, so it was really special that she got to be part of this and see it up close.    Jalena Keane-Lee: [00:38:13] Oh wow. Do you think you would do any collaborative projects with her in the future?   Gloria Huang: [00:38:16] It's so funny that you say that. She always suggests that. And then sometimes they'll actually start a Google doc and they'll say, let's write a story together. And we all have, of course, very different writing styles. And then at some point they both actually usually just start reading what I'm writing. And at that point I'm like, this is not collaborative. You have to write as well. So we've had a couple of false starts, but that's always a joke that we're gonna do that together.    Jalena Keane-Lee: [00:38:39] that's so sweet. What else is upcoming for you? I know this is, Asian American and native Hawaiian Pacific Islander month right now, and the episode will come out towards the end of May. So if there's anything else coming up from you for this month or for June or the summer. Yeah. We'd love to hear what you have going on.    Gloria Huang: [00:38:57] Oh, yeah. Today actually Kaya's audio book was released people can listen to it. It was narrated by this amazing, narrator, Cindy K. And so anywhere you find audio books is available. And that was really cool. I've listened to a little bit of it and you, when you write, you hear the words in your head one way, and then it's amazing to hear like another artist do their take on it. So that's really cool. I will be at the Bay Area book Festival at the end of the month of May. There. Doing like different panels and I'll be on a panel. it's about Fantastical Worlds. I'm really excited about that. hopefully we'll be able to announce this other book soon. As you, you may know publishing is a very long lead time it will be a while before it's released, but I think the hope is to release it during, a API month as well just not this year. And working on a young adult novel that hopefully we can go on submission with at some point. But it's an exciting time for sure.    Jalena Keane-Lee: [00:39:51] Wow, that does sound so exciting. I can't wait to hear about your new projects and to continue to read the work that you put out into the world. Is there anything else that you'd like to discuss or talk about?   Gloria Huang: [00:40:01] I think just to say a thank you to you for, having me on here and reading Kaya of the Ocean and really anyone who's been interested in joining Kaya and her friends on their journey. It's just, it's so amazing, I think, to create these characters that become real to you, and then have them become real to other people. I don't have the words to describe how meaningful it is to me, but thank you.    Jalena Keane-Lee: [00:40:24] Thank you for letting us join into the world of Kaya for a little bit 'cause it was very fun and healing and all of the amazing things. And thanks so much for joining us today on Apex Express.    Gloria Huang: [00:40:36] For sure. Thanks so much.   Miko Lee: [00:40:38] Welcome, Andrea Wang, award-winning children's book author to Apex Express.    Andrea Wang: [00:40:43] Thank you, Miko. I'm so happy to be here.    Miko Lee: [00:40:46] Happy to have you. I'd love to start first with a personal question, which is, who are your people and what legacy do you carry with you?   Andrea Wang: [00:40:57] My people are from China. My mother's family belonged to an ethnic minority, called the Haka or the Kaja people, and she and her siblings were. A military family, and we're each born in a different province. And when the Chinese Civil War ended in 1949, they went to Taiwan where she grew up and immigrated to the United States in 1965 or 1966. My father's family are from Guangdong Province, and so I'm Cantonese on that side, although I don't speak any Cantonese. And he went to Hong Kong after the Chinese Civil War. So I am the daughter of Chinese immigrants, second generation Chinese American.    Miko Lee: [00:42:01] And what legacy do you carry with you?   Andrea Wang:[00:42:03]  I carry the legacy of their stories, both the ones that I know and the ones that I don't know yet.    Miko Lee: [00:42:12] Ooh. It sounds like there's lots of juicy things for you still to discover. That is fun.    Andrea Wang: [00:42:16] Yes.    Miko Lee: [00:42:17] Today we're talking about your new book, watercress, can you share what the audience, what the book is about, and then what is your inspiration for this book?    Andrea Wang: [00:42:25] So the book is about a Chinese American girl who is growing up in rural Ohio and her parents spot watercress growing in a ditch by the side of the road, and they immediately pull over and make her enter older brother, get out of the car and get down into the ditch with them and collect this. Vegetable, but to her it's a weed. And so when they serve it to her and her family at dinner, she really is unhappy about this and. For her, picking food out of a ditch has a really different meaning than it does to her parents who survived a lot of hardship in China. And it's not until her mom tells her a story about her childhood growing up in China and spoiler alert, loses a sibling to the famine that the girl begins to understand and better appreciate her parents, her culture, and her heritage.   Miko Lee: [00:43:29] And the inspiration for this book.    Andrea Wang: [00:43:32] So the inspiration is largely my own life. this is a semi autobiographical story. The memory of picking watercress by the side of the road was just something that I couldn't forget, I don't know why this memory continued to haunt me into adulthood. And then after my mom passed away, I started writing down, memories and stories of being with my family in order to maintain a connection to her. When I wrote this, at first it was a personal essay and it just wasn't working. I would put it away and I would occasionally take it out and I would put it away and take it out and work on it again. And it wasn't until I decided to pursue writing for young people that I completely changed the manuscript from a personal essay into a picture book. But at that point it still wasn't working. It was in third person and it wasn't very personal It took me several more years to figure out the heart of the story for me. So it was largely based on my own memories and my mother's childhood stories that she shared with me.   Miko Lee: [00:44:39] Can you share more about the power of memory and the artistic process? 'cause you've written many books and in different genres as well, but can you talk a little bit more about memory and its impact on your work?   Andrea Wang: [00:44:52] Yeah, that's a great question. I tend to write primarily for myself. And to figure out how I felt about certain experiences, how they've changed me, to try and process things I feel like I remember a lot about my childhood. parts of it are very vivid and I like to go back to those. Moments that have stuck with me all these years and explore what it means to me. Like I'm just very curious about why I remember certain things watercress was largely my way of processing my childhood feelings of shame about my family and my culture. I have leaned into that and am still writing stories about identity and the struggle to find our identity. Memory has a lot to do with it. I put myself in every single book.    Miko Lee: [00:45:45] Ooh, that's so interesting. And you're talking a little bit about shame and overcoming that. I'm wondering if you could speak more on, if you feel like memories hold the power to heal.    Andrea Wang: [00:45:56] I firmly believe that memories hold the power to heal. I think that writing watercress and talking about these feelings has really helped me, , heal from, that sort of trauma of not feeling like I belonged as a kid and also that I may have been. Not the nicest kid to my parents, not the most filial, right? And so writing this story was, as I say in the author's note, sort of an apology and a love letter to my parents. So it's been very healing and healing to hear about from all the. People who have read the book and had it resonate with them, the things that they regretted in their lives and hoped to, heal as well.    Miko Lee: [00:46:42] Oh, have you heard that story a lot from adult readers?   Andrea Wang: [00:46:46] I have. They will often tell me about the things that their parents did that embarrassed them. A lot of foraging stories, but also stories about, relatives and ancestors who were sharecroppers or indigenous peoples. And it's just been fascinating how many people connect to the story on different levels. There is that theme of poverty. I think recognizing. That's not often talked about in children's books, I think makes people feel very seen.   Miko Lee: [00:47:14] Yeah. That feeling of shame is really showcased by the illustrator Jason Chin. I mean your young you character kind of has a grumpy look on their face. And it was just so fun. Even in the book notes, Jason Chin, the illustrator, writes about how he combined both the western and eastern style of art, but also his similar cross-cultural background. I'm wondering when you very first saw the artwork and this was kind of young you did anything surprise you by it?    Andrea Wang: [00:47:42] I mean, it's amazing, gorgeous artwork and I was really struck by how he dealt with the flashbacks because when I sold this manuscript, I. Had no idea how an illustrator would deal with how interior it is and, , and how they would tackle those flashbacks. And there's one spread where on the left hand side of the page, it shows the main character's current time and then it morphs across the gutter of the book into. The moms past and her childhood memories in China, and it was just exquisite is really the only way to describe it. It was, it's just brilliant, and amazing. We don't, as picture book authors typically get to work with our illustrators. We often do not have contact with them through the making of a picture book. But in this case. Our editors said since it was such a personal story for me, that he, , felt that Jason and I should collaborate. And so I provided photos, family photos, photos of Ohio, lots of different, , source materials to Jason and would talk to him about the feelings that young me in the book went through. And so the fact that, he was able to take all of that and put it on the page, it was just. Spectacular.    Miko Lee: [00:49:01] Oh, that's so fun. I also understand that you love mythical creatures as you I, and one of your children's books is the Nian Monster, which I love. I'm wondering what is your favorite mythical creature and why?   Andrea Wang: [00:49:15] I. Have been sort of fascinated with the qilin, the, or they call it the Chinese unicorn. Right. Although it looks very different from what we think of a, a European unicorn looks like. Yes. And I think it's because they're supposed to be this really benevolent, creature and Have all sorts of powers and I would love to do more research about the qilin and, you know, incorporate that into a book someday.   Miko Lee: [00:49:42] Ooh, fun. Next book. I love it. you have so many books and I'm really curious about your upcoming book Worthy about Joseph Pierce. I love these as Helen Zia talks about these. MIH moments that are missing in history. And Joseph Pierce was the highest ranking Chinese American man who fought in the Civil War. Some people might recognize this picture of this Chinese American guy in a kind of civil war, uniform. Can you tell us one, when is the book being released and a little bit more about it?    Andrea Wang: [00:50:11] Sure. The book is being released on September 9th, 2025, and it is. A picture book, which we typically think of as for younger readers, but it is 64 pages. So you know, it's an all ages picture book. I think my editor and I would like to say, and it is the story of a Chinese boy born in the, First half of the 18 hundreds in China in Guangdong province, and was sold by his father to an American ship captain named Amos Peck. the reasons for that are, lost to time, right? He left no primary sources behind, there was so much going on in China at the time. Famine war, you know, all of these, Difficult things that his father probably sold him in order to keep the rest of the family alive and as well as give him the opportunity to have a better life. And he did end up in Connecticut. He was raised with the captain's, siblings and sent to school and treated almost like a member of the family except for the fact that he was. Clearly Chinese and there were very few Chinese people in, Connecticut at that time. he joined the Union Army when he came of age and was able to leverage his service into gaining citizenship, which really people of color, weren't really able to do successfully back then. And so. He gained a citizenship. He married, he had a family. He was able to own property and accomplish all these amazing things. Sort of right before the Chinese exclusion Act was, enacted. So he was a very brave guy.    Miko Lee: [00:51:45] It's a wild story and you sent me on a little bit of a rabbit hole, which is fun. Just, looking at Ruth Ann, McCune's. historical piece that there were 10 different Chinese American men in the Civil War, but he was exceptional because he rose to such high ranks. And I just think it's so interesting that, in the 1880 census, he registered as Chinese. But then after the Chinese Exclusion Act in 1882, he listed his race as Japanese in the 1890 census. but he was racialized as white so that he could buy property and everything. Yeah. Can you just talk a little bit about that, like talk about code switching? He like literally changed his race,    Andrea Wang: [00:52:26] right. And people at that time could not tell the difference. Similar to now, people often can't tell different Asian, ethnicities apart. Right. I found actual newspaper articles where Joseph Pierce was interviewed about the battles, that the United States was having with Japan or the battles that Japan was having. He was asked his opinion on what the Japanese government was doing because he told these reporters he was Japanese and that was really the only clue that I had that he, Was code switching that after the Chinese exclusion Act was passed, he felt like he needed to protect himself and his family and he must have cut off his cue because otherwise, you know, that would've identified him immediately as Chinese. So that went into the book. I think it's a powerful moment, right, where he's doing what he has to do to survive and ensure his protection and his family's safety,   Miko Lee: [00:53:25] You have a, a really interesting background. Just having No really, I mean, having done all these different things and I, you know, I think you have a science background too, right? Can you talk about the times that we're living in right now, the political times that we're living in, where our government is banning books that don't align with certain conservative ideologies, where right now certain words are forbodden suddenly. And can you talk a little bit about how that impacts you as a children's book author?    Andrea Wang: [00:53:59] it is very disheartening and discouraging that the current climate is against, people who look like me or other people of color. And as a children's book author, we are experiencing a huge decrease in the number of teachers and librarians who are asking us to come and visit schools, to talk to students, which is horrible because. These young people are the ones who need to learn from books, right? Knowledge is power. And if we are not keeping them informed, then we are doing them a disservice. I think the attacks on our freedom to read are really unjust. and. personally as an author of color, I understand that books like Worthy may end up on some of these banned book lists because it does talk about racism. but these are the stories that we need now, and I'm going to continue writing these stories about the Hidden History, And to talk about these difficult subjects that I think kids understand on some level. but if they're not reading about it in books, then it's hard to spark a conversation with, educators or adults about it. So I think these books that I'm writing, that many of my friends and other children's book authors are writing are providing that. Sort of gateway to talk about, the topics that are so important right now.    Miko Lee: [00:55:29] Thank you so much for sharing, and thank you so much for being on Apex Express today. We appreciate your voice and the work that you're putting out there in the world. Is there anything else you'd like to say?   Andrea Wang: [00:55:39] you know, there's so much to say, I think just to. Stand up for what we all believe in and to, I encourage people to stand up for their intellectual freedom and that of their children.   Miko Lee: [00:55:56] Thank you, Andrea Wang. I appreciate hearing from you and hearing your voice and seeing your work out there in the world.    Andrea Wang: [00:56:03] Thank you so much, Miko. It was a pleasure.   Miko Lee: [00:56:05] Please check out our website, kpfa.org. To find out more about our show tonight. We thank all of you listeners out there. Keep resisting, keep organizing, keep creating and sharing your visions with the world because your voices are important. Apex Express is created by Miko Lee, Jalena Keane-Lee, Preti Mangala-Shekar, Swati Rayasam, Aisa Villarosa, Estella Owoimaha-Church, Gabriel Tanglao, Cheryl Truong and Ayame Keane-Lee.   The post APEX Express – 5.29.25 AAPI Children's Books appeared first on KPFA.

In 1889, the U.S. Supreme Court upheld the now infamous Chinese Exclusion Act, which prohibited Chinese laborers from entering the country. Writing for the majority, Justice Stephen J. Field characterized Chinese migrants as “strangers in the land.” New Yorker editor Michael Luo says that label persists today, even as more than 22 million people of Asian descent now reside in the U.S. In a new history book, Luo tells the stories of 19th and 20th century Chinese migrants and analyzes the long tail of contemporary anti-Asian racism and violence while championing those who fought against it. We listen back. Guests: Michael Luo, executive editor, The New Yorker; author, “Strangers in the Land: Exclusion, Belonging, and the Epic Story of the Chinese in America” Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

In this riveting episode of the Cross Examiner podcast, our host returns with renewed vigor to tackle the pressing issues of today, drawing parallels between the past and present. With a focus on the classic film Blazing Saddles, we explore the historical context of racism in America, particularly against Chinese immigrants during the late 1800s. As we dissect the rise of Christian nationalism and the misinformation fueling it, our host emphasizes the importance of education and critical thinking in combating ignorance. Join us for a thought-provoking journey that connects history to contemporary issues and advocates for a more informed society.Chapters:(00:00) Cross Examiner is the Internet's courtroom in the case of rationality versus religion(00:40) Cross Examiner is alarmed by the rise of Christian nationalism(01:31) Rachel Maddow: Blazing Saddles is one of the smartest films on racism(09:20) To hold people's attentions. Especially since the rise of Trumpism in America(10:44) The story of Chinese immigrants in America begins in the 1800s(16:44) Grant Wasinsky: Congress made Chinese exclusion permanent in 1902(21:19) What did the Chinese Americans do in response to this?(24:25) Wong Kim Ark was born in San Francisco in 1870(29:54) The Supreme Court hears oral arguments today over the immigration executive order(36:24) A federal judge can issue a nationwide injunction on immigration cases(40:16) This case is going to affect 14 different executive orders(47:07) There will be a liberal executive who uses the same tactics that Trump taught(49:20) Cross examiner podcast returns with first episode since presidential electionBlazing Saddleshttps://www.imdb.com/title/tt0071230/Chinese Exclusion Acthttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chinese_Exclusion_ActWong Kim Arkhttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wong_Kim_ArkAtheist Community of Austinhttps://www.atheist-community.org/American Civil Liberties Unionhttps://www.aclu.org/Freedom From Religion Foundationhttps://ffrf.org/

In 1889, the U.S. Supreme Court upheld the now infamous Chinese Exclusion Act, which prohibited Chinese laborers from entering the country. Writing for the majority, Justice Stephen J. Field characterized Chinese migrants as “strangers in the land.” New Yorker editor Michael Luo says that label persists today, even as more than 22 million people of Asian descent now reside in the U.S. In a new book, Luo tells the stories of 19th and 20th century Chinese migrants and analyzes the long tail of contemporary anti-Asian racism and violence while championing those who fought against it. His new history is “Strangers in the Land: Exclusion, Belonging, and the Epic Story of the Chinese in America.” Guests: Michael Luo, executive editor, The New Yorker; author, “Strangers in the Land: Exclusion, Belonging, and the Epic Story of the Chinese in America” Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Send us a textIn this interview with author Susan Tate Ankeny, we talk about her biography of Chinese American WWII Women Air Force Service Pilot, Hazel Ying Lee, American Flygirl, the Aviatrix Book Club discussion book for May 2025. Buy the book: https://literaryaviatrix.com/book/american-flygirl/Children's Books about Hazel: https://literaryaviatrix.com/book/the-fearless-flights-of-hazel-ying-lee/https://literaryaviatrix.com/book/skyward-the-story-of-female-pilots-in-wwii/The Blurb: One of WWII's most uniquely hidden figures, Hazel Ying Lee was the first Asian American woman to earn a pilot's license, join the WASPs, and fly for the United States military amid widespread anti-Asian sentiment and policies.Her singular story of patriotism, barrier breaking, and fearless sacrifice is told for the first time in full for readers of The Women with Silver Wings by Katherine Sharp Landdeck, A Woman of No Importance by Sonia Purnell, The Last Boat Out of Shanghai by Helen Zia, Facing the Mountain by Daniel James Brown and all Asian American, women's and WWII history books.In 1932, Hazel Ying Lee, a nineteen-year-old American daughter of Chinese immigrants, sat in on a friend's flight lesson. It changed her life. In less than a year, a girl with a wicked sense of humor, a newfound love of flying, and a tough can-do attitude earned her pilot's license and headed for China to help against invading Japanese forces. In time, Hazel would become the first Asian American to fly with the Women Airforce Service Pilots. As thrilling as it may have been, it wasn't easy.In America, Hazel felt the oppression and discrimination of the Chinese Exclusion Act. In China's field of male-dominated aviation she was dismissed for being a woman, and for being an American. But in service to her country, Hazel refused to be limited by gender, race, and impossible dreams. Frustrated but undeterred she forged ahead, married Clifford Louie, a devoted and unconventional husband who cheered his wife on, and gave her all for the cause achieving more in her short remarkable life than even she imagined possible.American Flygirl is the untold account of a spirited fighter and an indomitable hidden figure in American history. She broke every common belief about women. She challenged every social restriction to endure and to succDid you know you can support your local independent bookshop and me by shopping through my Bookshop.org affiliate links on my website? If a book is available on Bookshop.org, you'll find a link to it on the book page. By shopping through the Literary Aviatrix website a small portion of the sale goes to support the content you love, at no additional cost to you. https://literaryaviatrix.com/shop-all-books/Thanks so much for listening! Stay up to date on book releases, author events, and Aviatrix Book Club discussion dates with the Literary Aviatrix Newsletter. Visit the Literary Aviatrix website to find over 600 books featuring women in aviation in all genres for all ages. Become a Literary Aviatrix Patron and help amplify the voices of women in aviation. Follow me on social media, join the book club, and find all of the things on the Literary Aviatrix linkt.ree. Blue skies, happy reading, and happy listening!-Liz Booker

Daniel and Drew dive into the world of tabletop gaming storage, Chinese genealogy, bullet time, and more! - Check out Drew's article, Paper Families, Paper Trails: Genealogy and the Chinese Exclusion Act here: https://www.slcl.org/sites/default/files/2025-04/pastports-052025.pdf Support the launch of Daniel's wuxia TTRPG Wandering Blades here: https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/tonyatplusoneexp/wandering-blades Strangers in the Land by Michael Luo: https://www.penguinrandomhouse.com/books/704981/strangers-in-the-land-by-michael-luo/ //SPONSOR  Asians Represent! is proudly sponsored by Hero Forge! Hero Forge offers fully customizable tabletop miniatures with dozens of fantasy species and thousands of parts to choose from, all within your browser. Visit ⁠HeroForge.com⁠ to start designing your custom miniature today and check back often: new content is added every week. //FOLLOW  Website | aznsrepresent.com  Twitter | @aznsrepresent  Twitch | @aznsrep  Follow Daniel @danielhkwan and Drew @DrewQuon on Twitter!  //CONTACT  If you have questions about this episode's themes, suggestions, or anything else related to Asians Represent, get in touch with us at ⁠aznsrepresent.com⁠  //MUSIC Honey Bee by Kevin MacLeod is licensed under a Creative Commons Attribution 4.0 license. ⁠https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/4.0/

Strangers in the Land by Michael Luo is a gripping history of Chinese immigrants in America, from the nineteenth century to modern times. Michael joins us to talk about researching archives, the Chinese Exclusion Act, writing narrative nonfiction, working as a journalist and more with host Miwa Messer. This episode of Poured Over was hosted by Miwa Messer and mixed by Harry Liang.                     New episodes land Tuesdays and Thursdays (with occasional Saturdays) here and on your favorite podcast app. Featured Books (Episode): Strangers in the Land by Michael Luo The Cycles of American History by Arthur M. Schlesinger, Jr Say Nothing by Patrick Radden Keefe The Wager by David Grann The Warmth of Other Suns by Isabel Wilkerson A Fever in the Heartland by Timothy Egan

This Day in Legal History:  Wong Kim Ark becomes Wong Kim ArkOn March 28, 1898, the U.S. Supreme Court issued a landmark decision in United States v. Wong Kim Ark, affirming that a child born in the United States to Chinese immigrant parents was a U.S. citizen by virtue of the Fourteenth Amendment. Wong Kim Ark was born in San Francisco in 1873 to Chinese nationals who were legally residing in the U.S. but ineligible for naturalization due to prevailing immigration laws. After a visit to China in 1895, he was denied re-entry on the grounds of the Chinese Exclusion Act, which severely restricted immigration from China and barred Chinese nationals from becoming citizens.The Court rejected the government's argument that children of Chinese immigrants were not subject to U.S. jurisdiction and thus not entitled to birthright citizenship. In a 6–2 decision, the Court held that the Fourteenth Amendment guaranteed citizenship to nearly all individuals born on U.S. soil, regardless of the nationality or immigration status of their parents. This decision established a major precedent for interpreting the Citizenship Clause of the Fourteenth Amendment and reinforced the principle of jus soli, or right of the soil.The ruling came during a period of intense anti-Chinese sentiment, when the Chinese Exclusion Act of 1882 and its extensions aimed to restrict Chinese immigration and civil rights. Wong Kim Ark was a significant rebuke to efforts that sought to limit the constitutional rights of U.S.-born children of immigrants, and it laid the foundation for future interpretations of birthright citizenship.The Senate's vote to repeal the Consumer Financial Protection Bureau's $5 cap on overdraft fees is a clear signal: protecting bank profits matters more to Senate Republicans than shielding consumers from predatory financial practices. With a 52-48 vote, Republicans—joined by only one Democrat—moved to dismantle a regulation designed to curb exploitative overdraft charges that routinely hit working-class Americans the hardest.This isn't a technical policy disagreement—it's a choice to side with an industry that routinely charges Americans up to $35 for covering small shortfalls, even when the overdrafted amount is often less than the fee itself. The CFPB's rule was narrow, targeting only large banks and credit unions with more than $10 billion in assets, and still allowed higher fees if justified by actual costs. It was a modest, evidence-based consumer protection measure.The financial industry's immediate lawsuit and the GOP's use of the Congressional Review Act to kill the rule reveal the coordinated effort to preserve a lucrative revenue stream. The overdraft fee fight is just one piece of a broader Republican strategy to roll back protections the CFPB has implemented—protections meant to hold powerful financial institutions accountable.No one should mistake this vote as anything other than what it is: an effort by Senate Republicans to keep consumers on the hook, ensuring that banks and credit unions can continue bleeding them dry in the name of "choice" and "flexibility"—buzzwords that conveniently mask an enduring deference to corporate power. They'll couch these kinds of moves in language of fairness–pretending they ensure lower-income consumers are given access to these financial instruments. A moment's reflection, however, makes it clear that even under their best dressed reasoning they're looking to enable banks to charge exorbitant fees to account holders in precarity. Senate Votes to Repeal CFPB's $5 Cap on Bank Overdraft Fees (1)Yesterday, President Donald Trump issued an executive order against the prominent law firm WilmerHale, following its connections to Robert Mueller, the former special counsel who led the investigation into Russian interference in the 2016 election. The order directs federal agencies to cancel contracts with WilmerHale's clients, revoke lawyers' security clearances, and restrict access to U.S. government buildings. This is part of a broader strategy targeting law firms with ties to Mueller's investigation, including Perkins Coie, Paul Weiss, and Jenner & Block.Trump criticized Mueller's investigation as an example of government overreach, labeling it as politically motivated. In addition to its ties to Mueller, Trump also accused WilmerHale of discriminatory practices in its diversity programs, echoing similar claims against other law firms earlier this month. The firm, which has a long-standing history of handling high-profile cases, responded by labeling the order unlawful and vowed to seek appropriate remedies.WilmerHale, a major player in litigation with over 1,100 lawyers, represents a variety of high-profile clients, including Gilead, Comcast, and Meta Platforms. The firm has also been involved in cases challenging actions taken by the Trump administration, fueling further tensions. Notably, Trump also targeted other firms for their involvement in the Russia investigation and opposition research, but some, like Paul Weiss, have managed to have orders rescinded by agreeing to specific terms, including providing legal services aligned with Trump's agenda.Trump Hits WilmerHale With Executive Order Over Mueller Ties (2)Trump targets another law firm, citing ties to Robert Mueller | ReutersA federal judge has temporarily blocked the Trump administration from enforcing a Labor Department rule that would force grant recipients to abandon their diversity, equity, and inclusion (DEI) programs. The decision, issued by U.S. District Judge Matthew Kennelly in Chicago, halts a two-week enforcement window of a January executive order that required organizations receiving federal funds to certify they don't operate any DEI initiatives—even those unrelated to their grants.The case was brought by Chicago Women in Trades (CWIT), a nonprofit that trains women for skilled labor jobs and receives federal funding. The judge sided with CWIT's argument that the DEI restriction violates First Amendment protections, noting that such a rule could pressure grantees into self-censorship. Kennelly also blocked the Labor Department from terminating CWIT's funding under Trump's directive to eliminate “equity-related grants,” though this protection applies only to CWIT and not nationwide.Kennelly's order represents a legal pushback against Trump's broader effort to dismantle DEI initiatives across government agencies and contractors. While a federal appeals court recently upheld a temporary ban on DEI programs in federal agencies and contracting businesses, this ruling suggests courts may scrutinize how far the administration can go in policing DEI-related activity outside direct federal oversight.The ruling underscores an emerging legal battleground over free speech, anti-discrimination law, and the limits of executive authority in regulating DEI efforts.Judge blocks Trump's Labor Department from requiring grant recipients to abandon DEI | ReutersA federal judge has ordered the Trump administration to preserve Signal messages exchanged by top officials regarding planned military strikes in Yemen. The messages, inadvertently shared with a journalist from The Atlantic, revealed internal discussions involving Defense Secretary Pete Hegseth and CIA Director John Ratcliffe about timing and targets of attacks against the Houthi militant group. U.S. District Judge James Boasberg's ruling mandates that all Signal messages sent between March 11 and March 15 be retained by the agencies involved.The order came in response to a lawsuit filed by American Oversight, a government watchdog group, which argued that the use of auto-deleting messaging apps like Signal violated federal record-keeping laws. The lawsuit doesn't focus on the national security aspects of the disclosure but rather on the legal obligation of government agencies to preserve official communications.The controversy deepened after Attorney General Pam Bondi publicly criticized Boasberg, accusing him of political bias and claiming he was attempting to obstruct Trump's agenda. Trump himself has previously called for Boasberg's impeachment after the judge blocked a deportation policy targeting Venezuelan migrants—an action later upheld by an appeals court.The White House has not commented on the matter, but the episode has sparked scrutiny over the administration's handling of sensitive military planning and whether efforts to bypass official communication channels undermine transparency and accountability.Judge orders Trump administration to preserve Yemen attack plan messages | ReutersThis week's closing theme is by Sergei Rachmaninoff.This week's closing theme is one of the most beloved and instantly recognizable moments in all of classical music: Variation XVIII from Rhapsody on a Theme of Paganini, Op. 43 by Sergei Rachmaninoff, in a solo piano arrangement by Schultz. Rachmaninoff composed the Rhapsody in 1934 during his later years in exile from Russia, blending his romantic sensibilities with virtuoso brilliance. The work is a set of 24 variations on the 24th Caprice by Niccolò Paganini, itself a legendary theme known for dazzling technical demands.While most of the piece is fiery and rhythmic, the 18th variation stands apart—lyrical, sweeping, and emotionally expansive. In fact, it's a musical inversion of Paganini's theme, reimagined as a lush romantic melody that seems to rise straight out of the piano's depths. Rachmaninoff himself admitted it was his favorite part of the piece, and it's easy to understand why: it's tender, grand, and full of longing.This solo arrangement by Schultz pares down the orchestral drama but keeps all the expressive power, letting the piano sing with full-hearted warmth. The variation has since transcended its classical origins, appearing in films, commercials, and pop culture, yet it never loses its emotional punch. It's the kind of music that doesn't need explanation—it just resonates.Rachmaninoff, ever the late Romantic in a century veering toward modernism, poured his soul into his music. This variation, placed deep in a virtuosic whirlwind, emerges like a moment of clarity—an unguarded confession in a storm. Let it carry you out this week. This is a public episode. If you'd like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit www.minimumcomp.com/subscribe

  A weekly magazine-style radio show featuring the voices and stories of Asians and Pacific Islanders from all corners of our community. The show is produced by a collective of media makers, deejays, and activists. Grace Lee Boggs said, “History is not the past. It is the stories we tell about the past. How we tell these stories – triumphantly or self-critically, metaphysically or dialectally – has a lot to do with whether we cut short or advance our evolution as human beings.” In our current chaotic time, it feels like we are intentionally ignoring history. Our lack of awareness feels like a de-evolution, as our education department is gutting, books are banned, and so many American institutions are at risk, it feels as though a critical analysis of history is being ignored.  On Tonight's APEX Express, Host Miko Lee focuses on Wong Kim Ark and the importance of Birthright Citizenship. She speaks with historian David Lei, Reverend Deb Lee and lawyer/educator Annie Lee and activist Nick Gee. Discussed by Our Guests: What You Can Do To Protect Birthright Citizenship Our history is tied to the legacy of Wong Kim Ark and birthright citizenship, and it will take ongoing advocacy to protect this fundamental right. Here are four ways you can stay involved in the work ahead: Invite a friend to attend an event as part of Chinese for Affirmative Action's weeklong series commemorating Wong Kim Ark. Take action and oppose Trump's executive order banning birthright citizenship. Learn about Wong Kim Ark and Trump's executive order to end birthright citizenship. Sign up to join Stop AAPI Hate's Many Roots, One Home campaign to fight back against Trump's anti-immigrant agenda.   How you can get engaged to protect immigrants: https://www.im4humanintegrity.org/ https://www.bayresistance.org/ Bay Area Immigration: 24 Hour Hotlines San Francisco 415-200-1548 Alameda County 510-241-4011 Santa Clara County 408-290-1144 Marin County 415-991-4545 San Mateo County 203-666-4472   Know Your Rights (in various Asian languages) Thank you to our guests and Chinese for Affirmative Action for the clip from Wong Kim Ark's great grandson Norman Wong   Show Transcript: Wong Kim Ark Opening: [00:00:00] Apex Express Asian Pacific expression. Community and cultural coverage, music and calendar, new visions and voices, coming to you with an Asian Pacific Islander point of view. It's time to get on board the Apex Express.   Miko Lee: [00:00:35] Grace Lee Boggs said history is not the past. It is the stories we tell about the past, how we tell these stories. Triumphantly or self critically metaphysically or dialectically, has a lot to do with whether we cut short or advance our evolution as human beings. I. Well, in our current chaotic times, it feels like we are intentionally ignoring history. Our lack of awareness feels like a de-evolution. As our education department is gutted and books are banned, and so many of our American institutions are at risks, it feels as though a critical analysis of history is just being intentionally ignored. So welcome to Apex Express. I'm your host, Miko Lee, and tonight we're gonna delve back into a moment of history that is very much relevant in our contemporary world. Tonight's show is about long Kim Ark. There's a famous black and white photo of a Chinese American man. His hair is pulled back with a large forehead on display, wide open eyes with eyebrows slightly raised, looking at the camera with an air of confidence and innocence. He is wearing a simple mandarin collared shirt, one frog button straining at his neck, and then two more near his right shoulder. The date stamp is November 15th, 1894. His name is Wong Kim Ark. Tonight we hear more about his story, why it is important, what birthright citizenship means, and what you could do to get involved. So stay tuned. Welcome, David Lei, former social worker, community activist, lifelong San Franciscan, and amazing community storyteller. Welcome to Apex Express.    David Lei: [00:02:21] Thank you, Miko.    Miko Lee: [00:02:23] Can you first start with a personal question and tell me who are your people and what legacy do you carry with you?    David Lei: [00:02:31] I'm now on the board of Chinese Historical Society of America. Chinese American History is pretty important to me for my identity and the story of Chinese in America is American history, and that's where I'm at now.   Miko Lee: [00:02:50] And what legacy do you carry with you from your ancestors?    David Lei: [00:02:56] To pass on the wisdom they pass to me to future descendants. But I'm here in America, so I know after a few generations, my descendants won't look like me. Most likely they won't speak Chinese. They're going to be Americans. So. The lessons and values and wisdoms, my ancestors passed to me, I'm passing to America.   Miko Lee: [00:03:30] we are talking on this episode about Wong Kim Ark and as a community storyteller, I wonder if you can take me back to that time, take me back to Wong Kim Ark growing up in San Francisco, Chinatown, what was happening in San Francisco, Chinatown at that time    David Lei: [00:03:48] Okay, this is the end of the 19th century and we have the Exclusion Act in 1882 where Chinese were excluded from coming to America with few exceptions like merchants, diplomats, and scholars. So if you're Chinese and you're a laborer you just can't come. And there were concerns about. Going, even if you were here, there's a process for your return, the documents you will need. But even that was iffy. But for Chinese in general, there was birthright citizenship. So if you were born here, you have citizenship and that because of the 14th amendment. So many Chinese thought birthright citizenship was important 'cause you can vote, you have more rights, less chance that you will be deported. So the Chinese, born in America, right at 1895, formed a Chinese American Citizens Alliance. The concept of being a American citizen was in everybody's mind in Chinatown at that time. The Chinese been fighting for this birthright citizenship ever since the Exclusion Act. Before Wong Kim Ark, there was Look Tin Sing in the matter regarding Look Tin Sing was a CA federal Court of Appeal case. Look Tin Sing was born in Mendocino, so he's American born. He assumed he was a citizen. His parents sent him back to China before the Exclusion Act, and when he came back after the Exclusion Act, of course he didn't have the paperwork that were required , but he was born here. So to prove that he was a citizen. He had to have a lawyer and had to have white witness, and it went to the federal Court of Appeal, ninth Circuit, and the Chinese sixth company. The City Hall for Chinatown knew this was important for all Chinese, so gave him a lawyer, Thomas Den, and he won the case. Then in 1888, this happened again with a guy named Hong Yin Ming. He was held and he had to go to the Federal Court of Appeal to win again, then Wong Kim Ark 1895. He was stopped and. This time, the Chinese six company, which is a city hall for Chinatown they really went all out. They hired two of the best lawyers money could buy. The former deputy Attorney General for the United States, one of which was the co-founder of the American Bar Association. So these were very expensive, influential lawyers. And because Wong Kim Ark was a young man under 25, he was a cook, so he was poor, but the community backed him. And went to the Supreme Court and won because it was a Supreme Court case. It took precedent over the two prior cases that only went to the Court of Appeal.    Now you might think, here's a guy who has a Supreme Court case that says he's an American citizen. Well, a few years later in 1901, Wong Kim Ark went to Mexico to Juarez. When he came back to El Paso the immigration stopped him at El Paso and says, no you are just a cook. you're not allowed to come in because we have the 1882 Exclusion Act. Wong Kim Ark Says, I have a Supreme Court case saying I'm a US citizen, and the El Paso newspaper also had an article that very week saying they're holding a US citizen who has a Supreme Court case in his favor saying that he is a US citizen. However, immigration still held him for four months in El Paso. I think just to hassle. To make it difficult. Then by 1910, Wong Kim Ark had a few sons in China that he wants to bring to the us so he arranged for his first son to come to America in 1910. His first son was held at Angel Island. Interrogated did not pass, so they deported his firstborn son. So he says, wow, this is my real son, and he can't even get in. So this is dealing with immigration and the US laws and the racist laws is unending. Just because you win the Supreme Court case, that doesn't mean you're safe as we are seeing now. So it takes the community, takes a lot of effort. It takes money to hire the best lawyers. It takes strategizing. It takes someone to go to jail, habeas corpus case oftentimes to test the laws. And even when you win, it's not forever. It's constantly challenged. So I think that's the message in the community. Chinese community had push back on this and have pushed for Birthright citizenship from the very beginning of the Exclusion Act.    Miko Lee: [00:09:48] Thank you so much for that. David. Can we go back a little bit and explain for our audience what the Six Companies meant to Chinatown?    David Lei: [00:09:57] From the very beginning, there were a lot of laws racist laws that were anti-Chinese, and the Chinese always felt they needed representation. Many of the Chinese did not speak English, did not understand the laws, so they formed the Chinese Six Companies. Officially known as the Chinese Consolidated Benevolent Association. most Chinese come from just the six districts from Guangdong Province. They're like counties. However, in China, each counties most likely will have their own dialect. Unintelligible to the county next to them. They will have their own food ways, their own temples. almost like separate countries. So there were six major counties where the Chinese in America came from. So each county sent representatives to this central organization called the Chinese six companies, and they represented the Chinese in America initially in all of America. Then later on, different states set up their own Chinese Consolidated Benevolent Association, so they would tax their own membership or get their own membership to pay fees. They had in-house lawyers to negotiate with city government, state government, federal government, and they would raise the money. They were the GoFundMe of their days. Almost every month they were hiring lawyers to protect some Chinese, somewhere in America against unfair unjust laws. The Chinese six company was very important to the Chinese in America, and they were the first to really push back on the Chinese exclusion Act between 1882 and 1905. 105,000 Chinese in America after the exclusion Act sued a federal government more than 10,000 times. This is about 10% of the Chinese population in America, sued the federal government. I'm not including state government, counties nor municipalities. This is just the federal government. About 10% of the Chinese here sued and almost 30 of these went to the Federal Supreme Court, and it was the sixth company that organized many of these winning for all Americans and not just the Chinese right. To a public education. Even if you are an immigrant tape versus Hurley in 1885. Then we have the Yick Wo versus Hopkins case that gave equal protection under law for everyone. Now, the 14th Amendment does have this clause equal protection under law, but everybody thought that meant you had to write a law that was equal for everybody. But in the case of Yick Wo versus Hopkins, it was also important that the law is executed and administered equally for everyone. That's the first time where it was made very clear that equal protection under law also means the administration and the execution of the law. So that is the core of American Civil Rights and the Chinese won this case for all Americans. Of course, Wong Kim Ark.    The concept of political asylum, public law 29 was a Chinese case passed by Congress in 1921, and then we have Miranda Act. If you look into the Miranda Act, it was based on a Chinese case, 1924 Ziang Sun Wan versus the US two Chinese were accused of murder in Washington DC They were tortured, denied sleep. Denied food, denied attorneys, so they confessed. But when it came to trial. They said we didn't do it, we confessed 'cause we were tortured and they won in the Supreme Court, but it was a Washington DC case only applicable to federal jurisdictions. So when Miranda came up, the Supreme Court said, well, we decided this in 1924, but now we'll just make it applicable to state, county and municipality. And then of course, as recently as 1974 Chinese for affirmative action helped bring the Lao versus Nichols case. Where now is required to have bilingual education for immigrant students, if there are enough of them to form a class where they can be taught math, science, history in their original language. These and many more. The Chinese brought and won these cases for all Americans, but few people know this and we just don't talk about it.    Miko Lee: [00:15:35] David, thank you so much for dropping all this knowledge on us. I did not know that the Miranda rights comes from Asian Americans. That's powerful. Yes. And so many other cases. I'm wondering, you said that Chinese Americans and the six companies sued, did you say 10,000 times?    David Lei: [00:15:53] We have 10,000 individual cases. In many of these cases, the Chinese six company helped provide a lawyer or a vice.    Miko Lee: [00:16:03] And where did that come from? Where did that impetus, how did utilizing the legal system become so imbued in their organizing process?   David Lei: [00:16:14] Well, because it worked even with the exclusion act, during the exclusion period most Chinese. Got a lawyer to represent them, got in something like 80%. In many of the years, 80% of the Chinese that hire a lawyer to help them with the immigration process were omitted. So the Chinese knew the courts acted differently from politics. The Chinese did not have a vote. So had no power in the executive branch nor the legislative branch. But they knew if they hire good lawyers, they have power in the court. So regardless of whether their fellow Americans like them or not legally the Chinese had certain rights, and they made sure they received those rights. By organizing, hiring the best lawyers, and this was a strategy. suing slowed down after 1905 because the Chinese lost a important case called Ju Toy versus the us. The Supreme Court decided that since the Chinese sue so much, their courts of appeal were tied up with all these cases. So the Supreme Court says from now on, the Supreme Court will give up his rights to oversight on the executive branch when it comes to immigration because the Chinese sue too much. And that's why today the executive branch. Has so much power when it comes to immigration, cause the court gave up the oversight rights in this ju toy versus the US in 1905. So if we go to the history of the law a lot of the legal policies we live in today, were. Pushback and push for by the Chinese, because the Chinese were the first group that were excluded denied these rights. but the Chinese were very organized one of the most organized group and push back. And that's why we have all these laws that the Chinese won.    Miko Lee: [00:18:30] And in your deep knowledge of all this history of these many cases, what do you think about what is happening right now with all the conversations around birthright citizenship? Can you put that into a historical perspective?    David Lei: [00:18:44] So being an American. We always have to be on the guard for our rights. Who would've thought Roe v. Wade would be overturned? So all these things can be challenged. America's attitude change. Civil disobedience, the Chinese are actually, we have on record the largest number of people practicing civil disobedience over a long period of time. In 1892, when the Exclusion Act, Chinese Exclusion Act had to be renewed, they added this. New requirement that every Chinese must carry a certificate of residency with their photo on it. Well, this is like a internal passport. No one had to have this internal passport, but they made the Chinese do it. So the Chinese six company. Says, no, this is not right. Only dogs need to carry a license around to identify. Itself and only criminals needs to register with a state. And we Chinese are not dogs and we're not criminals, so we're not going to do it 'cause no one else needs to do it. So the six company told all the Chinese 105,000 Chinese not to register. 97% refuse to register. In the meantime, the six companies sued the federal government again. Saying the Federal Go government cannot do this. The Chinese lost this case in the Supreme Court and everybody then had to register, but they didn't register until two years later, 1894. So they held. Held out for two years.   Miko Lee: [00:20:31] How many people was that?    David Lei: [00:20:32] About a hundred thousand. 97% of the 105,000 Chinese refused to do this. So if you look at these certificate of residencies that the Chinese were forced to carry. They were supposed to register in 1892. Almost all of them are 1894. Some of them in fact many of them are May, 1894, the last second that you can register before they start deporting you. So the Chinese. Also practiced civil disobedience and the largest incidents, a hundred thousand people for two years.    Miko Lee: [00:21:15] How did they communicate with each other about that?   David Lei: [00:21:18] The Chinese were very well connected through the six companies, their district association, their surname association oftentimes because of. The racism segregation, the Chinese were forced to live in Chinatowns or relied on their own network. To support each other. So there, there's a lot of letter writing and a lot of institutions, and they kept in touch.That network was very powerful. In fact, the network to interpret a law for everybody interpret uh, any rules of business, and. Just how to conduct themselves in America. They have a lot of institutions doing that. We still have them in the 24 square blocks we call Chinatown. We have almost 300 organizations helping the immigrants. Chinese there with language, with how to do your taxes tutoring for their kids. Advice on schools paying their bills and so on. We have surnames associations, we have district associations, we have gills, we have fraternal organizations, and we certainly have a lot of nonprofits. So it's very, very supportive community. And that's always been the case.    Miko Lee: [00:22:42] I'm wondering what you feel like we can learn from those organizers today. A hundred thousand for civil disobedience. And we're often portrayed as the model minority people just follow along. That's a lot of people during that time. And what do you think we can learn today from those folks that organize for civil disobedience and the Chinese Exclusion Act?    David Lei: [00:23:03] It takes a community. One person can't do it. You have to organize. You have to contribute. You have to hire the best lawyers, the very best. In fact, with the Yik Wo versus Hopkins case, the equal protection under law, the Chinese immediately raised 20,000 equivalent to half a million. It takes collective action. It takes money. You just have to support this to keep our rights.    Miko Lee: [00:23:29] And lastly, what would you like our audience to understand about Wong Kim Ark?    David Lei: [00:23:35] Well, Wong Kim Ark, he was just an average person, a working person that the immigration department made life miserable for him. Is very difficult to be an immigrant anytime, but today is even worse. We have to have some empathy. He was the test case, but there were so many others. I mentioned Look Tin Sing, whose adult name is Look Tin Eli. We know a lot about Look Tin Eli and then this other Hong Yin Ming in 1888 before Wong Kim Ark and so generations of generations of immigrants. Have had a hard time with our immigration department. It's just not a friendly thing we do here. And you know, we're all descendants of immigrants unless you're a Native American. Like I mentioned Look Tin Sing, who was the first case that I could find. For birthright citizenship. His mother was Native American, but Native American didn't even get to be citizens until 1924. You know, that's kind of really strange. But that was the case.    Miko Lee: [00:24:50] That's very absurd in our world.    David Lei: [00:24:52] Yes, Chinatown is where it is today because of Look Tin Sing, his adult name, Look Tin Eli. He saved Chinatown after the earthquake. He's the one that organized all the business people to rebuild Chinatown like a fantasy Chinese land Epcot center with all the pagoda roofs, and he's the one that saved Chinatown. Without him and his Native American mother, we would've been moved to Hunter's Point after the earthquake. He later on became president of the China Bank and also president of the China Mayo Steamship Line. So he was an important figure in Chinese American history, but he had to deal with immigration.   Miko Lee: [00:25:39] David Lei, thank you so much for sharing your wisdom with us. I appreciate hearing this story and folks can find out when you are part of a panel discussion for Wong Kim Ark week, right?    David Lei: [00:25:50] Yes.    Miko Lee: [00:25:51] Great. We will be able to see you there. Thank you so much for being on Apex Express. Annie Lee, managing director of Policy at Chinese for affirmative action. Welcome to Apex Express.    Annie Lee: [00:26:01] Thank you so much for having me Miko.    Miko Lee: [00:26:02] I wanna just start with this, a personal question, which is, who are your people and what legacy do you carry with you?    Annie Lee: [00:26:10] I am the daughter of monolingual working class Chinese immigrants. And so I would say my people hail from Southern China and were able to come to the United States where I was born and was allowed to thrive and call this place home. I do this work at Chinese for Affirmative Action on their behalf and for other folks like them.    Miko Lee: [00:26:31] Thanks Annie, Today we're recording on March 17th, and I'm noting this because as we know, things are changing so quickly in this chaotic administration. By the time this airs on Thursday, things might change. So today's March 17th. Can you as both an educator and a lawyer, give me a little bit of update on where birthright citizenship, where does it stand legally right now?    Annie Lee: [00:26:55] As an educator and a lawyer, I wanna situate us in where birthright citizenship lives in the law, which is in the 14th Amendment. So the 14th Amendment has a birthright citizenship clause, which is very clear, and it states that people who were born in the United States, in subject to the laws thereof are United States citizens. The reason. This clause was explicitly added into the 14th Amendment, was because of chattel slavery in the United States and how this country did not recognize the citizenship of enslaved African Americans for generations. And so after the Civil War and the Union winning that war and the ends of slavery . We had to make African Americans citizens, they had to be full citizens in the eye of the law. And that is why we have the 14th Amendment. And that clause of the 14th Amendment was later litigated all the way to the Supreme Court by Wong Kim Ark, who was born in San Francisco, like me, two Chinese immigrant parents. When he left the United States, he went to China to visit his family. He tried to come back. They wouldn't let him in. and he said, I am a citizen because I was born in the United States and this clause in your 14th amendment, our 14th amendment says that I'm a citizen. It went all the way to Supreme Court and the Supreme Court agreed with Wong Kim Ark. Does not matter your parents' citizenship status. Everyone born in the United States is a US citizen, except for a very, very narrow set of exceptions for the kids of foreign diplomats that really is not worth getting into. Everyone is born. Everyone who's born in the United States is a citizen. Okay? So then you all know from Trump's executive order on day one of his second presidency that he is attempting to upends this very consistent piece of law, and he is using these fringe, outlandish legal arguments that we have never heard before and has never merited any discussion because it is just. Facially incorrect based on the law and all of the interpretation of the 14th amendment after that amendment was ratified. So he is using that to try to upend birthright citizenship. There have been a number of lawsuits. Over 10 lawsuits from impacted parties, from states and there have been three federal judges in Maryland, Washington State, and New Hampshire, who have issued nationwide injunctions to stop the executive order from taking effect. That means that despite what Trump says in his executive order. The birthright citizenship clause remains as it is. So any child born today in the United States is still a citizen. The problem we have is that despite what three judges now issuing a nationwide injunction, the Trump's government has now sought assistance from the Supreme Court to consider his request to lift the nationwide pause on his executive order. So the justices, have requested filings from parties by early April, to determine whether or not a nationwide injunction is appropriate. This is extraordinary. This is not the way litigation works in the United States. Usually you let the cases proceed. In the normal process, which goes from a district court to an appeals court, and then eventually to the Supreme Court if it gets appealed all the way up to the Supreme Court. This is very different from the normal course of action and I think very troubling.    Miko Lee: [00:30:36] So can you talk a little bit about that? I know we constantly say in this administration it's unprecedented, but talk about how there's three different states that have actually filed this injunction. , how typical is that for then it or it to then go to the Supreme Court?    Annie Lee: [00:30:53] Just to clarify, it's not three different states. It's judges in three different states. In fact, more than many, many states, 18 more than 18 states. There have been two lawsuits related, brought by states one that California was a part of that had multiple states over 18 states as well as San Francisco and District of Columbia. Then there was another lawsuit brought by another set of states. and so many states are opposed to this, for different reasons. I find their complaints to be very, very compelling. Before I get into the fact that multiple judges have ruled against the Trump administration, I did want to explain that the reason states care about this is because birthright citizenship is not an immigration issue. Birthright citizenship is just a fundamental issue of impacting everyone, and I really want people to understand this. If you are white and born in the United States, you are a birthright citizen. If you are black and born in the United States, you are a birthright citizen. It is a fallacy to believe that birthright citizenship only impacts immigrants. That is not true. I am a mother and I gave birth to my second child last year, so I've been through this process. Every person who gives birth in the United States. You go to the hospital primarily, they talk to you after your child is born about how to get a social security card for your child. All you have to do is have your child's birth certificate. That is how every state in this country processes citizenship and how the federal government processes citizenship. It is through a birth certificate, and that is all you need. So you go to your health department in your city, you get the birth certificate, you tell, then you get your social security card. That is how everyone does it. If you change this process, it will impact every state in this country and it will be very, very cumbersome. Which is why all of these states, attorneys general, are up in arms about changing birthright citizenship. It is just the way we function. That again applies to re regardless of your parents' immigration status. This is an issue that impacts every single American. Now, to your question as to what does it mean if multiple judges in different states, in different federal district courts have all ruled against. Donald Trump, I think it really means that the law is clear. You have judges who ha are Reagan appointees saying that the birthright citizenship clause of the 14th amendment is crystal clear. It has, it is clear in terms of the text. If you are a textualist and you read exactly what the text says, if you believe in the context of, The 14th Amendment. If you look at the judicial history and just how this clause has been interpreted since ratification, like everything is consistent, this is not an area of law that has any gray area. And you see that because different judges in different district courts in Maryland, in Washington, in New Hampshire all have cited against Donald Trump.    Miko Lee: [00:33:54] So what is the intention of going to the Supreme Court?    Annie Lee: [00:33:59] I mean, he is trying to forum shop. He's trying to get a court that he believes will favor his interpretation and that is why the right has spent the last half century stacking federal courts. And that is why Mitch McConnell did not let Barack Obama replace Antonin Scalia. The composition of the Supreme Court is. So, so important, and you can see it at times like this.    Miko Lee: [00:34:28] But so many of the conservatives always talk about being constitutionalists, like really standing for the Constitution. So how do those things line up?   Annie Lee: [00:34:38] Oh, Miko, that's a great question. Indeed, yes, if they were the textualist that they say they are, this is a pretty clear case, but, Law is not as cut and dry as people think it is. It is obviously motivated by politics and that means law is subject to interpretation.   Miko Lee: [00:34:59] Annie, thank you so much for this breakdown. Are there any things that you would ask? Are people that are listening to this, how can they get involved? What can they do?    Annie Lee: [00:35:09] I would recommend folks check out StopAAPIHate. We are having monthly town halls as well as weekly videos to help break down what is happening. There's so much news and misinformation out there but we are trying to explain everything to everyone because these anti-immigration. Policies that are coming out be, this is anti-Asian hate and people should know that. You can also check out resources through Chinese for affirmative action. Our website has local resources for those of you who are in the Bay Area, including the rapid response lines for bay Area counties if you need any services, if you. See ICE. , if you want to know where their ICE is in any particular location, please call your rapid response line and ask them for that verifiable information. Thank you.    Miko Lee: [00:36:00] Thank you so much, Annie Lee for joining us today on Apex.    Ayame Keane-Lee: [00:36:04] You are listening to 94.1 KPFA and 89.3 KPFB in Berkeley, 88.1 KFCF in Fresno, 97.5 K248BR in Santa Cruz, 94.3 K232FZ in Monterey, and online worldwide at kpfa.org.   Miko Lee: [00:36:23] Welcome, Nicholas Gee from Chinese for affirmative action. Welcome to Apex Express.    Nicholas Gee: [00:36:29] Thanks so much, Miko. Glad to be here.    Miko Lee: [00:36:31] I'm so glad that you could join us on the fly. I wanted to first just start by asking you a personal question, which is for you to tell me who you are,, who are your people and what legacy do you carry with you.   Nicholas Gee: [00:36:46] I'll start off by saying Miko, thanks so much for having me. My name is Nicholas Gee and I am a third and or fourth generation Chinese American, born and raised in Houston, Texas. And for me, what that means is, is that my great-great-grandparents and great-grandparents migrated from Southern China, fleeing war and famine and looking for opportunity in the middle of the early, like 19 hundreds. And they wanted to start an opportunity here for future generations like me. My people are my family who migrated here over a hundred years ago. who were settling to start a new life. My people are also the people that I advocate with, the Language Access network of San Francisco, the Immigrant Parent Voting Collaborative, my colleagues at Chinese for affirmative action and stop AAPI hate. I think about my people as the people that I'm advocating with on the ground day to day asking and demanding for change.   Miko Lee: [00:37:41] Thank you. And what legacy do you carry with you?    Nicholas Gee: [00:37:45] I carry the legacy of my elders, particularly my grandparents who immigrated here in around the 1940s or so. And when I think about their legacy, I think a lot about the legacy of immigration, what it means to be here, what it means to belong, and the fight for advocacy and the work that I do today.    Miko Lee: [00:38:05] Thanks so much, Nick, and we're here doing this show all about Wong Kim Ark, and I know Chinese for affirmative action has planned this whole week-long celebration to bring up as we're talking about legacy, the legacy of Wong Kim Ark. Can you talk about how this one week celebration came to be and what folks can expect?    Nicholas Gee: [00:38:26] Yeah. As folks may know we are in the midst of many executive orders that have been in place and one of them being the executive order to end birthright citizenship. And Wong Kim Ark was actually born and raised in San Francisco's Chinatown, particularly on seven. 51 Sacramento Street. In the heart of the community and local partners here in this city, we're really trying to figure out how do we advocate and protect birthright citizenship? How do we bring momentum to tell the story of Wong Kim Ark in a moment when birthright citizenship is, in the process of being removed And so we really wanted to create some momentum around the storytelling, around the legacy of Wong Kim Ark, but also the legal implications and what it means for us to advocate and protect for birthright citizenship. And so I joined a couple of our local partners and particularly our team at Chinese for affirmative action to develop and create the first ever Wong Kim Ark Week. Officially known as born in the USA and the Fight for Citizenship, a week long series of events, specifically to honor the 127th anniversary of the Landmark Supreme Court case, US versus Wong Kim Ark, which affirmed birthright citizenship for all in the United States.    Miko Lee: [00:39:44] What will happen during this week-long celebration?   Nicholas Gee: [00:39:48] We have several scheduled events to raise awareness, mobilize the community, and really to stand up for the rights of all immigrants and their families. One is an incredible book Talk in conversation with author and activist Bianca Boutte. Louie, who recently authored a book called Unassimilable. And she tells a personal narrative and provides a sharp analysis for us to think about race and belonging and solidarity in America, particularly through an Asian American lens. This event is hosted by the Chinese Historical Society of America. Following. We have a live in-person community symposium on Wong Kim Ark legacy and the struggle for citizenship. There'll be a powerful community conversation with legal advocates, storytellers, movement builders, to have a dynamic conversation on the impact of birthright citizenship. Who is Wong Kim Ark? What is his enduring legacy and how people can join us for the ongoing struggle for justice? And you know, we actually have a special guest, Norman Wong, who is the great grandson of Wong Kim Ark. He'll be joining us for this special event. We have a couple of more events. One is a Chinatown History and Art Tour hosted by Chinese Culture Center, this is a small group experience where community members can explore Chinatown's vibrant history, art, and activism, and particularly we'll learn about the legacy of Wong Kim Ark and then lastly, we have a in-person press conference that's happening on Friday, which is we're gonna conclude the whole week of, Wong Kim Ark with a birthright, citizenship resolution and a Wong Kim Ark dedication. And so we'll be celebrating his enduring impact on Birthright citizenship and really these ongoing efforts to protect, our fundamental right. and the San Francisco Public Library is actually hosting an Asian American and Pacific Islander book display at the North Beach campus and they'll be highlighting various books and authors and titles inspired by themes of migration, community, and resilience. So those are our scheduled, events We're welcoming folks to join and folks can register, and check out more information at casf.org/WongKimArk    Miko Lee: [00:42:04] Thanks so much and we will post a link to that in our show notes. I'm wondering how many of those are in Chinese as well as English?    Nicholas Gee: [00:42:13] That is a fantastic question, Miko. We currently have the community symposium on Wong Kim Ark legacy in the struggle for citizenship. This event will have live interpretation in both Mandarin and Cantonese.    Miko Lee: [00:42:46] What would you like folks to walk away with? An understanding of what.    Nicholas Gee: [00:42:30] We really want people to continue to learn about the legacy of birthright citizenship and to become an advocate with us. We also have some information on our website, around what you can do to protect birthright citizenship. As an advocate, we are always thinking about how do we get people involved, to think about civic engagement intentional education and to tie that back to our advocacy. And so we have a couple of ways that we're inviting people to take action with us. One is to invite a friend to consider attending one of our events. If you're based here in the San Francisco Bay area or if you're online, join us for the book Talk with Bianca. , two, we're inviting folks to take action and oppose the executive order to ban birthright citizenship. Chinese for affirmative action has. A call to action where we can actually send a letter to petition , to oppose this executive order to send a message directly to our congressman or woman. and lastly, you know, we're asking people to learn about Wong Kim Ark as a whole, and to learn about the impacts of birthright citizenship. My hope is that folks walk away with more of an understanding of what does it mean here to be an advocate? What does it mean to take action across the community and really to communicate this is what resilience will look like in our community    Miko Lee: [00:43:44] Nick Gee, thank you so much for joining me on Apex Express. It was great to hear how people can get involved in the Wong Kim Ark week and learn more about actions and how they can get involved. We appreciate the work you're doing.    Nicholas Gee: [00:43:56] Thanks so much Miko, and I'm excited to launch this.   Miko Lee: [00:43:58] Welcome, Reverend Deb Lee, executive Director of Interfaith Movement for Human Integrity and part of the Network on Religion and justice. Thank you so much for coming on Apex Express.    Rev. Deb Lee: [00:44:09] Great to be here. Miko.    Miko Lee: [00:44:11] I would love you just personally to tell me who are your people and what legacy do you carry with you?   Rev. Deb Lee: [00:44:17] Wow. Well, my people are people in the Chinese diaspora. My family's been in diaspora for seven generations, from southern China to southeast to Asia. and then eventually to the United States. What I carry with me is just a huge sense of resistance and this idea of like, we can survive anywhere and we take our love and our family and our ancestor we gotta carry it with us. We don't always have land or a place to put it down into the ground, and so we carry those things with us. , that sense of resistance and resilience.    Miko Lee: [00:44:56] Thank you so much. I relate to that so much as a fifth generation Chinese American. To me, it's really that sense of resilience is so deep and powerful, and I'm wondering as a person from the faith community, if you could share about the relevance of Wong Kim Ark and Birthright citizenship.   Rev. Deb Lee: [00:45:12] Yeah, Wong Kim Ark is critical because he was somebody who really fought back against racist laws and really asserted his right to be part of this country, his right to have the Constitution apply to him too. I'm just so grateful for him and so many of the other Chinese Americans who fought back legally and resisted against in that huge wave of period of Chinese exclusion to create some of the really important immigration laws that we have today. I wouldn't be a citizen without birthright citizenship myself. Wong Kim Ark really established that every person who is born on this soil has a right to constitutional protection, has a right to be a citizen. And in fact, the Constitution in the 14th Amendment also applies to let equal treatment for everyone here, everyone who is here. You don't even have to be a citizen for the constitutional rights. And the Fourth Amendment, the fifth Amendment, the first amendment to apply to you. And those things are so under attack right now. It's so important to establish the equality. Of every person and the right for people here in this country to have safety and belonging, that everyone here deserves safety and belonging.    Miko Lee: [00:46:24] Thank you so much for lifting up that activist history. as, a person who was raised in a theological setting at a seminary, I was really raised around this ethos of love as an active tool and a way of fighting for civil rights, fighting for things that we believe in. And I'm wondering if you could talk about how you see that playing out in today. And especially as you know, this Trump regime has had such incredible impacts on immigrants and on so much of our activist history. I'm wondering if you have thoughts on that?    Rev. Deb Lee: [00:47:00] Well, so much of the civil rights history in this country, you know, going back to like the activism of Chinese Americans to establish some of those civil rights. You know, it goes back to this idea of like, who is fully human, who can be fully human, whose humanity will be fully recognized? And so I think that's what's connects back to my faith and connects back to faith values of the sacredness of every person, the full humanity, the full participation, the dignity. And so I think, Wong Kim Ark and the other, like Chinese American activists, they were fighting for like, you know, we don't wanna just be, we're gonna just gonna be laborers. We're not just going to be people who you can, Bring in and kick out whenever you want, but like, we want to be fully human and in this context of this nation state, that means being fully citizens.And so I think that that struggle and that striving to say we want that full humanity to be recognized, that is a fundamental kind of belief for many faith traditions, which, you know, speak to the radical equality of all people and the radical dignity of all people, that can't be taken away, but that has to really be recognized. What's under attack right now is. So much dehumanization, stigmatization of people, you know, based on race, based on class, based on gender, based on what country people were born in, what papers they carry, you know, if they ever had contact, prior contact with the law, like all these things. You know, are immediately being used to disregard someone's humanity. And so I think those of us who come from a faith tradition or who just share that kind of sense of, value and, deep humanism in other people, that's where we have to root ourselves in this time in history and really being, you know, we are going to defend one another's humanity and dignity, at all costs.   Miko Lee: [00:48:55] Thank you for that. I'm wondering if there are other lessons that we can learn from Wong Kim Ark, I mean, the time when he fought back against, this was so early in 1894, as you mentioned, the Chinese exclusion acts and I'm wondering if there are other lessons that we can learn from him in, in our time when we are seeing so many of our rights being eroded.   Rev. Deb Lee: [00:49:17] I think that there's so many ways, that we think about how did people organize then like, you know, it's challenging to organize now, but if you can imagine organizing then, and I'm thinking, you know, when Chinese people were required to carry identification papers and you know, on mass they refused to do that and they. Practice, like a form of civil disobedience. And I think we're at this time now, like the Trump administration's telling anybody here who's unauthorized to come forward and to register well, I think people need to think twice about that. And people are, there are many other things that they're trying to impose on the immigrant community and I think one like lesson is like, how do people survive through a period of exclusion and we are today in a period of exclusion. That really goes back to the mid 1980s, when there was, last, a significant immigration reform that created a pathway to citizenship. Only for about 3 million people. But after that, since that time in the mid 1980s, there has been no other pathways to citizenship, no other forms of amnesty, no other ways for people to fix their status.So in fact, we are already in another 40 year period of exclusion again. And so one of those lessons is how do people survive this period? Like right, and left. They're taking away all the laws and protections that we had in our immigration system. They were very narrow already. Now even those are being eliminated and any form of compassion or discretion or leniency or understanding has been removed. So I think people are in a period of. Survival. How do we survive and get through? And a lot of the work that we're doing on sanctuary right now we have a sanctuary people campaign, a sanctuary congregations campaign is how do we walk alongside immigrants to whom there is no path. There is no right way. there is no opening right now. But walk with them and help support them because right now they're trying to squeeze people so badly that they will self deport. And leave on their own. This is part of a process of mass expulsion but if people really believe that they want to stay and be here, how do we help support people to get through this period of exclusion until there will be another opening? And I believe there will be like our, our history kind of spirals in and out, and sometimes there are these openings and that's something I take from the faith communities. If you look at Chinese American history in this country, the role that faith communities played in walking with the immigrant community and in supporting them, and there's many stories that help people get through that period of exclusion as well.   Miko Lee: [00:51:52] Deb, I'm wondering what you would say to folks. I'm hearing from so many people [say] I can't read the news. It's too overwhelming. I don't wanna get involved. I just have to take care of myself. And so I'm just waiting. And even James Carville, the political opponent, say we gotta play dead for a few years. What are your thoughts on this?    Rev. Deb Lee: [00:52:11] Well, we can't play totally dead. I wish the Democrats wouldn't be playing dead, but I think that a person of faith, we have to stay present we don't really have the option to check out and we actually have to be in tune with the suffering. I think it would be irresponsible for us to. You know, turn a blind eye to the suffering. And I wanna encourage people that actually opportunities to walk with people who are being impacted and suffering can actually be deeply, fulfilling and can help give hope and give meaning. And there are people who are looking for solidarity right now. We are getting a lot of calls every week for someone who just wants them, wants someone to go to their court or go to the ice, check-in with them, and literally just like walk three blocks down there with them and wait for them. To make sure they come out. And if they don't come out to call the rapid response hotline, it doesn't take much. But it's a huge act like this is actually what some of the immigrant communities are asking for, who are millions of people who are under surveillance right now and have to report in. So those small acts of kindness can be deeply rewarding in this. Sea of overwhelming cruelty. And I think we have an obligation to find something that we can do. , find a way, find a person, find someone that we can connect to support and be in solidarity with and think about people in our past. Who have accompanied us or accompanied our people and our people's journey. And when those acts of kindness and those acts of neighbors and acts of friendship have meant so much I know like my family, they still tell those stories of like, this one person, you know, in Ohio who welcome them and said hello. We don't even know their names. Those acts can be etched in people's hearts and souls. And right now people need us.    Miko Lee: [00:53:59] Oh, I love that. I've talked with many survivors of the Japanese American concentration camps, and so many of them talk about the people of conscience, meaning the people that were able to step up and help support them during, before and after that time. Lastly, I'm wondering, you're naming some really specific ways that people can get engaged, and I know you're deeply involved in the sanctuary movement. Can you provide us with ways that people can find out more? More ways to get involved in some of the work that you are doing.    Rev. Deb Lee: [00:54:29] I'll put a plug in for our website. It's www dot I am number four, human integrity.org. So it's, iam4humanintegrity.org. We work with families that are impacted facing deportation, looking for all kinds of ways to get the community to rally around folks and support and we work with faith communities who are thinking about how to become sanctuary congregations and how to be an important resource in your local community. The other organizations, I would say sign up for Bay Resistance. They're organizing a lot of volunteers that we call on all the time we're working with. We're, you know, working with many organizations, the Bay Area, to make sure that a new ice detention facility does not get built. They are looking at the potential site of Dublin. We've worked really hard the last decade to get all the detention centers out of Northern California. We don't want them to open up a new one here.   Miko Lee: [00:55:27] Deb Lee, thank you so much for joining us on Apex Express and folks can actually see Deb on Tuesday night in Wong Kim Ark Week as one of the speakers. Thank you so much for joining us.    Rev. Deb Lee: [00:55:38] Thank you, Miko.    Miko Lee: [00:55:39] Thank you so much for joining us on Apex Express. We're gonna close this episode with words from Norman Wong, the great grandson of Wong Kim Ark.   Norman Wong: [00:55:49] So let's fight back. Threats to birthright citizenship will only divide us, and right now we need to come together to continue the impact of my great grandfather's. This is my family's legacy, and now it's part of yours too. Thank you    Miko Lee: [00:56:11] Please check out our website, kpfa.org to find out more about our show tonight. We think all of you listeners out there. Keep resisting, keep organizing, keep creating and sharing your visions with the world because your voices are important. Apex Express is created by Miko Lee, Jalena Keane-Lee, Preti Mangala-Shekar, Swati Rayasam, Aisa Villarosa, Estella Owoimaha-Church, Gabriel Tanglao, Cheryl Truong and Ayame Keane-Lee.    The post APEX Express – 3.20.25- Wong Kim Ark appeared first on KPFA.

Send us a textMike Eng is a distinguished public servant whose career spans decades of advocacy, legal expertise, and leadership across various sectors. His work has profoundly impacted his community and the state of California, where he has championed causes ranging from civil rights to education, water access, and housing.Mike began his public service career as a City Commissioner, where he stood up against censorship when the city dissolved the library board of trustees, of which he was president, over the inclusion of foreign language books. His fight for library independence led to his involvement in a nationally recognized court case that protected the autonomy of libraries across the U.S. He also spearheaded a successful local fundraising campaign that qualified the city for a state grant, resulting in an $18 million library expansion.A volunteer lawyer, Mike is known for creating the Emmy-winning “How to Become a U.S. Citizen” video, which has helped countless immigrants navigate the citizenship process. His work as a City Mayor further showcased his commitment to unity, notably through the creation of the Harmony Essay Contest, which brought together long-term residents and new immigrants.Mike's influence as a State Assemblyman gained him international recognition for authoring California's “Human Right to Water” legislation, aimed at providing clean drinking water to disadvantaged communities. He also authored the “Homeowner's Bill of Rights,” which protected middle-class families from predatory banking practices during the housing crisis.A staunch advocate for immigrant rights, Mike established California's “Day of Inclusion,” which recognized the end of the Chinese Exclusion Act and honored the contributions of immigrants and minorities. As a Community College Trustee, he fought for accessible education by helping thousands of students gain healthcare under the Affordable Care Act and addressing homelessness among students by advocating for affordable on-campus housing.In 2019, Mike was appointed to the California Unemployment Insurance Appeals Board, where he helps ensure that laws related to unemployment, disability, taxes, and workplace fairness are enforced justly. A passionate public speaker, he frequently lectures on U.S. and California laws, especially those that have historically legitimized racial discrimination in education, immigration, and legal systems.A graduate of UCLA Law School, Mike is the son of a World War II veteran, the brother of a Pastor, and the husband of a member of the U.S. House of Representatives. His dedication to justice, equality, and public service has left a lasting legacy in both his local community and the state of California.___________________Music CreditsIntroEuphoria in the San Gabriel Valley, Yone OGStingerScarlet Fire (Sting), Otis McDonald, YouTube Audio LibraryOutroEuphoria in the San Gabriel Valley, Yone OG__________________My SGV Podcast:Website: www.mysgv.netNewsletter: Beyond the MicPatreon: MySGV Podcastinfo@sgvmasterkey.com

In 1931, Hazel Ying Lee, a nineteen-year-old American daughter of Chinese immigrants, sat in on a friend's flight lesson. It changed her life. In less than a year, a girl with a wicked sense of humor, a newfound love of flying, and a tough can-do attitude earned her pilot's license and headed for China to help against invading Japanese forces. In time, Hazel would become the first Asian American to fly with the Women Airforce Service Pilots. As thrilling as it may have been, it wasn't easy. In America, Hazel felt the oppression and discrimination of the Chinese Exclusion Act. In China's field of male-dominated aviation she was dismissed for being a woman, and for being an American. But in service to her country, Hazel refused to be limited by gender, race, and impossible dreams. Frustrated but undeterred she forged ahead, married Clifford Louie, a devoted and unconventional husband who cheered his wife on, and gave her all for the cause achieving more in her short remarkable life than even she imagined possible. American Flygirl (Citadel Press, 2024) is the untold account of a spirited fighter and an indomitable hidden figure in American history. She broke every common belief about women. She challenged every social restriction to endure and to succeed. And against seemingly insurmountable obstacles, Hazel Ying Lee reached for the skies and made her mark as a universal and unsung hero whose time has come. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices Support our show by becoming a premium member! https://newbooksnetwork.supportingcast.fm/new-books-network

In 1931, Hazel Ying Lee, a nineteen-year-old American daughter of Chinese immigrants, sat in on a friend's flight lesson. It changed her life. In less than a year, a girl with a wicked sense of humor, a newfound love of flying, and a tough can-do attitude earned her pilot's license and headed for China to help against invading Japanese forces. In time, Hazel would become the first Asian American to fly with the Women Airforce Service Pilots. As thrilling as it may have been, it wasn't easy. In America, Hazel felt the oppression and discrimination of the Chinese Exclusion Act. In China's field of male-dominated aviation she was dismissed for being a woman, and for being an American. But in service to her country, Hazel refused to be limited by gender, race, and impossible dreams. Frustrated but undeterred she forged ahead, married Clifford Louie, a devoted and unconventional husband who cheered his wife on, and gave her all for the cause achieving more in her short remarkable life than even she imagined possible. American Flygirl (Citadel Press, 2024) is the untold account of a spirited fighter and an indomitable hidden figure in American history. She broke every common belief about women. She challenged every social restriction to endure and to succeed. And against seemingly insurmountable obstacles, Hazel Ying Lee reached for the skies and made her mark as a universal and unsung hero whose time has come. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices Support our show by becoming a premium member! https://newbooksnetwork.supportingcast.fm/history

In 1931, Hazel Ying Lee, a nineteen-year-old American daughter of Chinese immigrants, sat in on a friend's flight lesson. It changed her life. In less than a year, a girl with a wicked sense of humor, a newfound love of flying, and a tough can-do attitude earned her pilot's license and headed for China to help against invading Japanese forces. In time, Hazel would become the first Asian American to fly with the Women Airforce Service Pilots. As thrilling as it may have been, it wasn't easy. In America, Hazel felt the oppression and discrimination of the Chinese Exclusion Act. In China's field of male-dominated aviation she was dismissed for being a woman, and for being an American. But in service to her country, Hazel refused to be limited by gender, race, and impossible dreams. Frustrated but undeterred she forged ahead, married Clifford Louie, a devoted and unconventional husband who cheered his wife on, and gave her all for the cause achieving more in her short remarkable life than even she imagined possible. American Flygirl (Citadel Press, 2024) is the untold account of a spirited fighter and an indomitable hidden figure in American history. She broke every common belief about women. She challenged every social restriction to endure and to succeed. And against seemingly insurmountable obstacles, Hazel Ying Lee reached for the skies and made her mark as a universal and unsung hero whose time has come. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices Support our show by becoming a premium member! https://newbooksnetwork.supportingcast.fm/asian-american-studies

In 1931, Hazel Ying Lee, a nineteen-year-old American daughter of Chinese immigrants, sat in on a friend's flight lesson. It changed her life. In less than a year, a girl with a wicked sense of humor, a newfound love of flying, and a tough can-do attitude earned her pilot's license and headed for China to help against invading Japanese forces. In time, Hazel would become the first Asian American to fly with the Women Airforce Service Pilots. As thrilling as it may have been, it wasn't easy. In America, Hazel felt the oppression and discrimination of the Chinese Exclusion Act. In China's field of male-dominated aviation she was dismissed for being a woman, and for being an American. But in service to her country, Hazel refused to be limited by gender, race, and impossible dreams. Frustrated but undeterred she forged ahead, married Clifford Louie, a devoted and unconventional husband who cheered his wife on, and gave her all for the cause achieving more in her short remarkable life than even she imagined possible. American Flygirl (Citadel Press, 2024) is the untold account of a spirited fighter and an indomitable hidden figure in American history. She broke every common belief about women. She challenged every social restriction to endure and to succeed. And against seemingly insurmountable obstacles, Hazel Ying Lee reached for the skies and made her mark as a universal and unsung hero whose time has come. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices Support our show by becoming a premium member! https://newbooksnetwork.supportingcast.fm/military-history

In 1931, Hazel Ying Lee, a nineteen-year-old American daughter of Chinese immigrants, sat in on a friend's flight lesson. It changed her life. In less than a year, a girl with a wicked sense of humor, a newfound love of flying, and a tough can-do attitude earned her pilot's license and headed for China to help against invading Japanese forces. In time, Hazel would become the first Asian American to fly with the Women Airforce Service Pilots. As thrilling as it may have been, it wasn't easy. In America, Hazel felt the oppression and discrimination of the Chinese Exclusion Act. In China's field of male-dominated aviation she was dismissed for being a woman, and for being an American. But in service to her country, Hazel refused to be limited by gender, race, and impossible dreams. Frustrated but undeterred she forged ahead, married Clifford Louie, a devoted and unconventional husband who cheered his wife on, and gave her all for the cause achieving more in her short remarkable life than even she imagined possible. American Flygirl (Citadel Press, 2024) is the untold account of a spirited fighter and an indomitable hidden figure in American history. She broke every common belief about women. She challenged every social restriction to endure and to succeed. And against seemingly insurmountable obstacles, Hazel Ying Lee reached for the skies and made her mark as a universal and unsung hero whose time has come. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices Support our show by becoming a premium member! https://newbooksnetwork.supportingcast.fm/gender-studies

In 1931, Hazel Ying Lee, a nineteen-year-old American daughter of Chinese immigrants, sat in on a friend's flight lesson. It changed her life. In less than a year, a girl with a wicked sense of humor, a newfound love of flying, and a tough can-do attitude earned her pilot's license and headed for China to help against invading Japanese forces. In time, Hazel would become the first Asian American to fly with the Women Airforce Service Pilots. As thrilling as it may have been, it wasn't easy. In America, Hazel felt the oppression and discrimination of the Chinese Exclusion Act. In China's field of male-dominated aviation she was dismissed for being a woman, and for being an American. But in service to her country, Hazel refused to be limited by gender, race, and impossible dreams. Frustrated but undeterred she forged ahead, married Clifford Louie, a devoted and unconventional husband who cheered his wife on, and gave her all for the cause achieving more in her short remarkable life than even she imagined possible. American Flygirl (Citadel Press, 2024) is the untold account of a spirited fighter and an indomitable hidden figure in American history. She broke every common belief about women. She challenged every social restriction to endure and to succeed. And against seemingly insurmountable obstacles, Hazel Ying Lee reached for the skies and made her mark as a universal and unsung hero whose time has come. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices Support our show by becoming a premium member! https://newbooksnetwork.supportingcast.fm/biography

In 1931, Hazel Ying Lee, a nineteen-year-old American daughter of Chinese immigrants, sat in on a friend's flight lesson. It changed her life. In less than a year, a girl with a wicked sense of humor, a newfound love of flying, and a tough can-do attitude earned her pilot's license and headed for China to help against invading Japanese forces. In time, Hazel would become the first Asian American to fly with the Women Airforce Service Pilots. As thrilling as it may have been, it wasn't easy. In America, Hazel felt the oppression and discrimination of the Chinese Exclusion Act. In China's field of male-dominated aviation she was dismissed for being a woman, and for being an American. But in service to her country, Hazel refused to be limited by gender, race, and impossible dreams. Frustrated but undeterred she forged ahead, married Clifford Louie, a devoted and unconventional husband who cheered his wife on, and gave her all for the cause achieving more in her short remarkable life than even she imagined possible. American Flygirl (Citadel Press, 2024) is the untold account of a spirited fighter and an indomitable hidden figure in American history. She broke every common belief about women. She challenged every social restriction to endure and to succeed. And against seemingly insurmountable obstacles, Hazel Ying Lee reached for the skies and made her mark as a universal and unsung hero whose time has come. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices Support our show by becoming a premium member! https://newbooksnetwork.supportingcast.fm/chinese-studies

In 1931, Hazel Ying Lee, a nineteen-year-old American daughter of Chinese immigrants, sat in on a friend's flight lesson. It changed her life. In less than a year, a girl with a wicked sense of humor, a newfound love of flying, and a tough can-do attitude earned her pilot's license and headed for China to help against invading Japanese forces. In time, Hazel would become the first Asian American to fly with the Women Airforce Service Pilots. As thrilling as it may have been, it wasn't easy. In America, Hazel felt the oppression and discrimination of the Chinese Exclusion Act. In China's field of male-dominated aviation she was dismissed for being a woman, and for being an American. But in service to her country, Hazel refused to be limited by gender, race, and impossible dreams. Frustrated but undeterred she forged ahead, married Clifford Louie, a devoted and unconventional husband who cheered his wife on, and gave her all for the cause achieving more in her short remarkable life than even she imagined possible. American Flygirl (Citadel Press, 2024) is the untold account of a spirited fighter and an indomitable hidden figure in American history. She broke every common belief about women. She challenged every social restriction to endure and to succeed. And against seemingly insurmountable obstacles, Hazel Ying Lee reached for the skies and made her mark as a universal and unsung hero whose time has come. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

The 1898 supreme court case called United States vs. Wong Kim Ark had affected enforcement of the Chinese Exclusion Act, because the court found that people born in the U.S. to Chinese parents were U.S. citizens. Research: Graber, Mark A. "United States v. Wong Kim Ark." American Governance, edited by Stephen Schechter, et al., vol. 5, Macmillan Reference USA, 2016, pp. 228-230. Gale In Context: U.S. History, link.gale.com/apps/doc/CX3629100710/GPS?u=mlin_n_melpub&sid=bookmark-GPS&xid=73795502. Accessed 22 Jan. 2025. "United States v. Wong Kim Ark." Gale U.S. History Online Collection, Gale, 2024. Gale In Context: U.S. History, link.gale.com/apps/doc/EXXRWP999307394/GPS?u=mlin_n_melpub&sid=bookmark-GPS&xid=c225358c. Accessed 22 Jan. 2025. "United States v. Wong Kim Ark." Great American Court Cases, edited by Mark Mikula and L. Mpho Mabunda, vol. 3: Equal Protection and Family Law, Gale, 1999. Gale In Context: Opposing Viewpoints, link.gale.com/apps/doc/EJ2303200443/GPS?u=mlin_n_melpub&sid=bookmark-GPS&xid=01ef8726. Accessed 22 Jan. 2025. Zietlow, Rebecca E. "Fourteenth Amendment: Citizenship Clause." American Governance, edited by Stephen Schechter, et al., vol. 2, Macmillan Reference USA, 2016, pp. 248-251. Gale In Context: U.S. History, link.gale.com/apps/doc/CX3629100269/GPS?u=mlin_n_melpub&sid=bookmark-GPS&xid=5c43018e. Accessed 22 Jan. 2025. Rosenbloom, Rachel E. “Birthright Citizenship Has Been Challenged Before.” Time. 1/15/2025. https://time.com/7204970/birthright-citizenship-test-cases/ Bomboy, Scott. “Updated: The birthright citizenship question and the Constitution.” National Constitution Center. 1/21/2025. https://constitutioncenter.org/blog/revisiting-the-birthright-citizenship-question-and-the-constitution Cabrera-Lomelí, Carlos. “A 129-Year-Old San Francisco Lawsuit Could Stop Trump From Ending Birthright Citizenship.” KQED. 1/21/2025. https://www.kqed.org/news/12015449/a-129-year-old-san-francisco-lawsuit-could-stop-trump-from-ending-birthright-citizenship Abdelfatah, Rund et al. “By Accident of Birth.” Throughline. NPR. 6/9/2022. https://www.npr.org/2022/06/06/1103291268/by-accident-of-birth Dhillon, Hardeep. “How the Fight for Birthright Citizenship Shaped the History of Asian American Families.” Smithsonian. 3/27/2023. https://www.smithsonianmag.com/history/how-the-fight-for-birthright-citizenship-reshaped-asian-american-families-180981866/ Frost, Amanda. “Birthright Citizens and Paper Sons.” The American Scholar. 1/18/2021. https://theamericanscholar.org/birthright-citizens-and-paper-sons/ Moore, Robert. “He won a landmark citizenship case at the US Supreme Court. El Paso tried to deport him anyway.” El Paso Matters. 7/4/2022. https://elpasomatters.org/2022/07/04/wong-kim-ark-vs-united-states-history-immigration-supreme-court/ Frost, Amanda. “’By Accident of Birth’: The Battle over Birthright Citizenship After United States v. Wong Kim Ark.” Yale Journal of Law and the Humanities. https://openyls.law.yale.edu/handle/20.500.13051/7583 Berger, Bethany. “Birthright Citizenship on Trial: Elk v. Wilkins and United States v. Wong Kim Ark.” Articles and Papers. 378. 2016. https://opencommons.uconn.edu/law_papers/378 National Archives Catalog. “In the matter of Wong Kim Ark for a writ of habeas corpus.” https://catalog.archives.gov/id/296026 See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Watch/Listen to this and all episodes ad free by joining the ITBR Patreon and get a free trial for the ITBR Professor level!⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠patreon.com/ivorytowerboilerroom⁠⁠ ⁠⁠I'm so excited to welcome writer Curtis Chin on the podcast to discuss his memoir "Everything I Learned, I Learned in a Chinese Restaurant," which explores his upbringing in his family's Chinese restaurant in Detroit during the 1980s. He shares how the restaurant and his family's history in Michigan since the 1800s inspired him to write the memoir to pass on this story to the next generation. He then touches on the challenges Chinese immigrants faced during that time period, including anti-Asian violence and the Chinese Exclusion Act.Then, Curtis reflects on how his intersectional identity as an Asian American, working-class person, and closeted gay youth collided in formative experiences, such as an incident at the restaurant involving a drag queen customer. He shares how the writing process allowed him to revisit and process these complex identity issues.You can get your hands on Curtis' book and learn more about his writing here:www.curtisfromdetroit.comFollow Curtis on IG,@curtischin8Follow ITBR on IG,⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠@ivorytowerboilerroom⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ and TikTok,⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠@ivorytowerboilerroom⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Our Sponsors:To subscribe to The Gay and Lesbian Review visit ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠glreview.org⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠. Click Subscribe and enter promo code ITBR50 to receive 50% off any print or digital subscription. Follow them on IG,⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠@theglreview⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠.Head to Broadview Press, an independent academic publisher, for all your humanities related books. Use code ivorytower for 20% off your⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠broadviewpress.com ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠order. Follow them on IG,⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠@broadviewpress⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠.Follow That Ol' Gay Classic Cinema on IG,⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠@thatolgayclassiccinema⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Listen here:⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/that-ol-gay-classic-cinema/id1652125150⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Thanks to the ITBR team! Dr. Andrew Rimby (Host and Director), Mary DiPipi (Chief Contributor), and Christian Garcia (Editor)

This 2021 episode covers the Chinese Exclusion Act, the United States’ first major immigration law. As its name suggests it specifically targeted people from China, and it led to Supreme Court cases that set the stage for later restrictions.See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Wong Kim Ark was born in the U.S. and lived his whole life here. But when he returned from a trip to China in August of 1895, officials wouldn't let him leave his ship. Citing the Chinese Exclusion Act, which denied citizenship to Chinese immigrants, they told him he was not, in fact, a citizen of the United States.Today, the story of Wong Kim Ark, whose epic fight to be recognized as a citizen in his own country led to a Supreme Court decision affirming birthright citizenship for all. This episode originally ran as By Accident of Birth.Learn more about sponsor message choices: podcastchoices.com/adchoicesNPR Privacy Policy

On May 28, 1904, Chinese immigrants Moy Kee and Chin Fung hosted Chinese imperial royalty at their Indianapolis chop suey restaurant. Prince Pu Lun, the rumored heir to the Qing Dynasty's imperial throne, was so impressed by the luncheon that he elevated Moy to Mandarin of the Fifth Rank, a prestigious Chinese social status. But how did Moy Kee, an immigrant from the Guangdong Province, end up hosting Chinese royalty? How did he gain so much influence in Indianapolis during the height of Chinese exclusion and Sinophobia? The story is a fascinating one that raises an even deeper questions that the United States still wrestles with today: What does it mean to be an American citizen? And who gets to be a citizen and who doesn't? This new episode of Talking Hoosier History is voiced by Justin Clark, written by Kelsey Green, and produced by A.J. Chrapliwy. A transcript, show notes, and more information on this episode is available at the THH website: https://podcast.history.in.gov/.

Birthright citizenship is "an integral part of repudiating this nation's history of slavery," Ali Velshi explains. "To undermine [it], would be a return to some of our nation's darkest days." From slavery to the Chinese Exclusion Act of the nineteenth century, the 14th Amendment has been a remedy to our most discriminatory impulses. 

Ellen Chang-Richardson's breathtaking poetry collection, Blood/Belies, was released in spring 2024 by Wolsak & Wynn and was a third bestseller in nonfiction in Calgary, Alberta. Chang-Richardson writes of race, of injury and of belonging in stunning poems that fade in and out of the page. History swirls through this collection like a summer storm, as they bring their father's, and their own, stories to light, writing against the background of the institutional racism of Canada, the Chinese Exclusion Act, the head tax and more. From Taiwan in the early 1990s to Oakville in the late 1990s, Toronto in the 2010s, Cambodia in the mid-1970s and Ottawa in the 2020s, Blood Belies takes the reader through time, asking them what it means to look the way we do? To carry scars? To persevere? To hope? About Ellen Chang-Richardson: Ellen Chang-Richardson is an award-winning poet of Taiwanese and Chinese Cambodian descent whose multi-genre writing has appeared in Augur, The Ex-Puritan, The Fiddlehead, Grain, third coast magazine, Vallum Contemporary, Watch Your Head and more. Born in Toronto, Ontario, they were raised in Oakville, Ontario and São Paulo, Brazil, and spent their most formative years growing up in Shanghai, China. A third culture kid at heart, Ellen's writing is informed by their love of contemporary art, their concern with the climate crisis, and their experience moving through the world as they are. The co-founder of Riverbed Reading Series, an editor for Room and long con magazine, and a member of the poetry collective VII, Ellen is currently based in Ottawa, Canada, on the unceded territory of the Algonquin Nation. You can usually find them baking sourdough bread from their starter, Bubbles, or biking the riverside trails on their single-speed. About Hollay Ghadery: Hollay Ghadery is an Iranian-Canadian multi-genre writer living in Ontario on Anishinaabe land. She has her MFA in Creative Writing from the University of Guelph. Fuse, her memoir of mixed-race identity and mental health, was released by Guernica Editions in 2021 and won the 2023 Canadian Bookclub Award for Nonfiction/Memoir. Her collection of poetry, Rebellion Box was released by Radiant Press in 2023, and her collection of short fiction, Widow Fantasies, was released with Gordon Hill Press in fall 2024. Her debut novel, The Unraveling of Ou, is due out with Palimpsest Press in 2026, and her children's book, Being with the Birds, with Guernica Editions in 2027. Hollay is the host of the 105.5 FM Bookclub, as well as a co-host on HOWL on CIUT 89.5 FM. She is also a book publicist, the Regional Chair of the League of Canadian Poets and a co-chair of the League's BIPOC committee, as well as the Poet Laureate of Scugog Township. Learn more about Hollay at www.hollayghadery.com. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices Support our show by becoming a premium member! https://newbooksnetwork.supportingcast.fm/new-books-network

Ellen Chang-Richardson's breathtaking poetry collection, Blood/Belies, was released in spring 2024 by Wolsak & Wynn and was a third bestseller in nonfiction in Calgary, Alberta. Chang-Richardson writes of race, of injury and of belonging in stunning poems that fade in and out of the page. History swirls through this collection like a summer storm, as they bring their father's, and their own, stories to light, writing against the background of the institutional racism of Canada, the Chinese Exclusion Act, the head tax and more. From Taiwan in the early 1990s to Oakville in the late 1990s, Toronto in the 2010s, Cambodia in the mid-1970s and Ottawa in the 2020s, Blood Belies takes the reader through time, asking them what it means to look the way we do? To carry scars? To persevere? To hope? About Ellen Chang-Richardson: Ellen Chang-Richardson is an award-winning poet of Taiwanese and Chinese Cambodian descent whose multi-genre writing has appeared in Augur, The Ex-Puritan, The Fiddlehead, Grain, third coast magazine, Vallum Contemporary, Watch Your Head and more. Born in Toronto, Ontario, they were raised in Oakville, Ontario and São Paulo, Brazil, and spent their most formative years growing up in Shanghai, China. A third culture kid at heart, Ellen's writing is informed by their love of contemporary art, their concern with the climate crisis, and their experience moving through the world as they are. The co-founder of Riverbed Reading Series, an editor for Room and long con magazine, and a member of the poetry collective VII, Ellen is currently based in Ottawa, Canada, on the unceded territory of the Algonquin Nation. You can usually find them baking sourdough bread from their starter, Bubbles, or biking the riverside trails on their single-speed. About Hollay Ghadery: Hollay Ghadery is an Iranian-Canadian multi-genre writer living in Ontario on Anishinaabe land. She has her MFA in Creative Writing from the University of Guelph. Fuse, her memoir of mixed-race identity and mental health, was released by Guernica Editions in 2021 and won the 2023 Canadian Bookclub Award for Nonfiction/Memoir. Her collection of poetry, Rebellion Box was released by Radiant Press in 2023, and her collection of short fiction, Widow Fantasies, was released with Gordon Hill Press in fall 2024. Her debut novel, The Unraveling of Ou, is due out with Palimpsest Press in 2026, and her children's book, Being with the Birds, with Guernica Editions in 2027. Hollay is the host of the 105.5 FM Bookclub, as well as a co-host on HOWL on CIUT 89.5 FM. She is also a book publicist, the Regional Chair of the League of Canadian Poets and a co-chair of the League's BIPOC committee, as well as the Poet Laureate of Scugog Township. Learn more about Hollay at www.hollayghadery.com. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices Support our show by becoming a premium member! https://newbooksnetwork.supportingcast.fm/poetry

  A weekly magazine-style radio show featuring the voices and stories of Asians and Pacific Islanders from all corners of our community. The show is produced by a collective of media makers, deejays, and activists.   In this episode of APEX Express, host Cheryl shares Part 1 of a powerful intergenerational conversation featuring the OG organizers of Chinese for Affirmative Action (CAA) and young leaders from Hmong Innovating Politics (HIP). The discussion highlights the challenges and inspirations that drove CAA's founders to join the Asian American Movement of the '60s and '70s, offering valuable lessons for sustaining activism across generations. Important Links: Chinese for Affirmative Action: Website  |  Instagram Hmong Innovating Politics: Website  |  Instagram Transcript   Cheryl Truong: good evening and welcome to tonight's episode of apex express. I'm your host, Cheryl Truong and tonight is an AACRE night. Now you might be wondering what is AACRE. AACRE stands for the Asian Americans for civil rights and Equality network, which is made up of 11 grassroots, social justice groups. Together leverage the power of our network to focus on longterm movement, building and support for Asian-Americans committed to social justice. And speaking of AACRE groups. APEX express is proud to be a part of the AACRE network.  For tonight's show, I'm thrilled to share a really special and intimate recording from a panel discussion we hosted here at the AACRE network that bridges generations of organizing. This panel brought together the OGs– originals– who helped build chinese for Affirmative Action or CAA into the esteemed 50 year old civil rights organization it is today. Alongside young organizers from Hmong Innovating Politics, also known as HIP, who are paving the way for Hmong Americans in Sacramento and Fresno. Both hip and CAA are vital groups within the AACRE network. The purpose of this exchange. To spark an intergenerational dialogue between seasoned CAA leaders and current hip staff and exploring how their roles in the movement have evolved over time.  Together, they delve into the strategies they've employed to sustain their impact over decades of organizing. However, this is only part one of what is and was a much longer conversation. So for tonight's episode, we'll focus on getting to know some of the CAA OGs. You'll hear them introduce themselves. Share some of the hardships they faced as pivotal organizers during the Asian-American movement of the tumultuous sixties and seventies. And reflect on what catalyze them to get involved in the movement. Through the stories we hope to uncover lessons from the past that can guide us in sustaining and evolving the fight for justice today. So stay tuned. It's going to be an inspiring and reflective journey into the heart of activism.  So I'm pleased to introduce. The panel facilitator, Miko Lee who is AACRE's director of programs. And CAA OGs Germaine Wong Henry Der Laureen Chew Stephen Owyang and Yvonne Yim-Hung Lee  Miko: Yvonne,  what was a kind of chrysalis moment for you in terms of social justice? Yvonne Yim-Hung Lee: First of all, when I got the email, I didn't know what O. G. was, so I said “Oh Geezer!” That's how I interpret it. I said “Oh, I'm there!” This is going to be a really honest and frank family gathering so thank you inviting me and I'm really excited to be here with my, peers and colleagues and more importantly to really hear from you, your experience. I am a first generation immigrant. My parents were very well to do business people in Hong Kong. They decided to immigrate to this country with three young kids. My father when he was young, he was the richest boy in his village. Overnight, people came and forced his father to give up 98 acres of their 99 acre farm. So from being the richest boy in town, in his village, to have to go to Hong Kong to live with this uncle. My mom was from a rich family in China also. Her father was one of the few merchants who came to the U.S. after the Chinese Exclusion Act, he went to New York, opened up a pastry shop, but he found his goal. He won second prize of a New York lotto. So he decided to go back to China because even though he was a merchant, he experienced a lot of discrimination. He never talked about his experience in America. But my mom was a little princess. You know, we used to call her , and her friends, the little Paris Hilton of the group, because that's what they did. They went to school as ABC's, never had to work a day in their life. But one thing, She and my father, because they were both from richest families in different villages, they were supposed to be matched up. But by the time they were at marriage age, he was already a poor kid. But my mom told the father, said, a promise is a promise.. So she married this poor guy, moved to Hong Kong, and he did quite well for himself. So we were brought up, ” money is not what should drive you in your life. You can lose it in one day. The most important thing is to have a good heart, to make sure that everything in this world, you have to make a difference. Whether it's to your family, or to others. You cannot be angry, because someone else is going to make you angry. When we came, it was a really tough time for him. You know, we lived really well in Hong Kong. Coming here to live in Chinatown back in the 60s really wasn't that pleasant. But, we made do based on the three principles. We came here for freedom. We came here for knowledge. And knowledge doesn't mean just college. So we were lucky. We never were forced to study certain fields so that we can make money because for him, it was always experience to really, really take in the nourishment for yourself, but give out whatever you have to others. So based on the guidance and that's how, that's my North Star. That's what's driven me. So I went to Davis. Yay Davis and the Cows! They're still there. What really got me to community activism was when I was 16, I was in the hospital. And They put this, at the time I thought she was elderly, but thinking back she was probably in her 30s. But when she was 16, anyway over 20 is elderly. And she could not speak English. And they could not communicate with her. And half of the hospital staff was making fun of her. And that was in, 70? 1970? It wasn't that long ago. It was still in my our lifetime. So, I was young but I acted as her translator. It was very difficult because she has women issues. And I didn't know her. And her husband was standing there. And she had to tell me her most intimate thing. And all the room of doctors, nurses and everything– they were very dismissive of her because of the fact that she did not speak their language. So because of that I felt that that's wrong. Because prior to that, even when we were living in Chinatown, I still felt I was privileged. You know, we weren't poor. We were still doing well. But after seeing that experience, it really taught me that even though we came to America for freedom, freedom is only for those who could really stand for themselves. And there are some who, if they cannot, send someone else in to fight with them. Not for them, but with them. So that's how I started my career, and I jumped from place to place. I'm not the CAA member, but I'm the honorary member of CAA because I had the privilege of working with Henry. All the meetings that we had back in the 70s, 80s, and 90s and everything with Ted and Steve on redistricting, immigration reform, census, welfare reform, everything that we today take granted. We don't even think about it. Came from here. This room. Before this room, it was another room. It was a little less, little place. We, we moved up by, by moving here in the 90s. So, thank you so much for this privilege and I look forward to our conversation. Miko: Thank you, Yvonne. And I just, OG, just so you know, does not mean OG. Does anybody want to explain what OG means? Hmong Innovating Politics (HIP) Staff: Old Gangster   Miko: It's actually a hip hop terminology for gangster, but it actually means the original. Who's the original, the source of the knowledge, the source of the power. So it's, we use it with love and honor.  Yvonne Yim-Hung Lee: Intergenerational communication.  Miko: I'm sorry I did  Henry Derr: I have to say, I never liked the term O. G. when I first heard it. Because I thought it meant an old guy, Even though I'm old, I didn't want to admit that I was old. , one thing I have to say straight away is, you all are happy about this weather, I'm very unhappy about this weather, because I, even though I'm a native of San Francisco, Chinatown, at the age of seven, my family moved into Stockton. I went through all my schooling till I graduated from Franklin High School on the east side of Highway 99. Some of you may have, your high schools may have competed against Franklin High School. When we moved into Stockton for the longest time, We could never figure out why in the hell our father moved us into Stockton, because we were the only one or two Chinese family on the east side of Stockton right there on Main Street. And then over time, and actually very recently when I think about it, there was, he probably had a good reason for moving us into Stockton. Because my father was actually quite clever in terms of circumventing the discriminatory impact of the Chinese Exclusion Act. As some of you may know, a lot of Chinese men who came here to the United States after the Exclusion Act had to lie about who they were. They would claim that they were sons of U. S. citizens in order to enter the United States. Well, it turned out that my father and my mother on paper had 17 children. And in our family, there were really only just eight of us who were born from our parents and my oldest brother who was adopted. The rest were actually paper sons. So my father moved the family into Stockton because I remember very clearly when I was less than five years old, my mom said to us, children, don't say anything about the family when you go out the streets and I could never understand why don't say anything about that. Well, it turned out that. There were a lot of immigration agents prowling around Chinatown during the fifties, during the confession program. So, I think my father made the right choice to move the family into Stockton. And we always longed about coming back to San Francisco. But also looking back at it, it was actually a blessing in disguise. Because I actually grew up, as some of you may know, from Fresno, Sacramento, Visalia, Ceres, Modesto, then, not now. It was actually, I lived in a very diverse neighborhood. There were blacks, there were Mexicans and there were whites and the whites were not rich. They were like the rest of us. They were poor from Oklahoma. So probably the first social, I would consider this first social justice consciousness that I developed during the 19 50s and 60s when I was growing up. In addition to following what was going on and unfolding with the Black Civil Rights Movement in the South, was that Stockton Unified was impacted by school desegregation and there was busing. So there was a lot of talk that kids from our high school in Franklin were going to be bused to Stagg High School. And at that time, in the 50s and 60s, Stagg was all white, they were all wealthy, and we basically protested, said, we are not going to go, that we're not, we don't need those rich white folks. We're okay by ourselves. So that kind of built a consciousness in me. And I would say the other big social justice consciousness was really actually during college, when many of us protested against the war in Vietnam. We marched to the Oakland Army Induction Center in Oakland. We had a sleep in, in the old student union on the college campus. We didn't get arrested like the kids are being arrested today who are protesting the atrocities in Gaza. During my last year in college, There wasn't anything known as Asian American Studies, but there were enough black students who wanted black studies on the campus. So, we just joined in and helped protest that there was an absence of black studies on the college campus. After I graduated from college, I knew that I was going to go into Peace Corps because I was inspired by President Kennedy. And it didn't make, truth be told, it made no difference what college I was going to go to. I knew I was going to go into Peace Corps, and that's what I did, because the last year I was in college, they offered Swahili, and I said, oh, that's perfect, I'm going to enroll in Swahili, and I end up going to Kenya for two years. And after two years of service in Kenya, you know, it kind of made sense for me to say, you know, if I can go halfway around the world to do public service work, I can certainly come back to Chinatown and do community work. And that's how I end up coming back to San Francisco in 1970. And then, The rest is whatever I did.  Female speaker: The rest is history.  Female Speaker 2: The rest is documented history.  Miko: We'll get into that a little bit more. Steve, what about you? What was your first kind of experience of recognizing social justice?  Stephen Owyang: Okay, so, Both sides of my family came to the U. S. a long time ago in the 1870s from Southern China. And they were in San Francisco until the big earthquake in 1906, after which point most of the family went into the Sacramento Valley. So I was born in Sacramento. I was raised in, down the river in the Delta. I'm really excited to meet you because my father had a small business back then and we went up and down Highway 99 all the time. So, Stockton, Lodi, Modesto, Merced, Kingsburg, Fresno, Hanford, Ripon, Visalia. And my father's business was basically delivering stuff to little mom and pop grocery stores run by Chinese families, mainly from one little county in Guangdong province. There was no I 5 back then, just 99, and you know, in the summer, as you know, it gets really hot. So it was a treat for me to go along with my father because I always got free sodas at every store, so I would go out with him and you know after six or seven sodas It was like, it was a great day. My first glimmers about social justice were just growing up in the Delta and I'll give you three stories.  It's the town of Walnut Grove, and the town of Walnut Grove on Highway 160 is one of the few delta towns that are on both sides of the river. There's a bridge that connects it. And on one side of the river, it's middle class and upper middle class and wealthy white families. Our side of the river, you had the folks from the Dust Bowl days, as Henry mentioned, people from Oklahoma and Texas who came out during the Depression. You also had a small Chinatown, a small J Town, a small Filipino area, a small Mexican area. And that just reflected the social conditions of California agriculture, because each one of those communities at one time was the main source of farm workers. And in fact, my own family, because of the alien land laws, they were farmers, but they couldn't own farmland, right? And so they were sharecroppers. Just, you hear about sharecropping happening in the South, but it also happened in California. So when I was growing up, three things. On the rich side of town, the white side of town, there's a swimming pool that was only open to white families. It was a private pool. You could only go there if you were a member. You could only be a member if you were white. The only way I could go there is if a friend who's a white, from a white family, who's a member, takes you there as a guest. So that's number one. Number two. My best friend was from one of these landed white families, and we were, we were very close. We were good students in elementary school. And then one day in the seventh grade, he, he takes me aside and he says, You know, I can't hang out with you anymore because my mom says I need to have more white friends. So he just cut it off like that. And I, that's the, that's, that's the truth. That's just how it happened. I guess the other thing that affected me back then was I used to go to a little American Baptist church and we had, I guess visits to black churches. And I remember going up to Sacramento on one of these visits and one of the kids there did Martin Luther King's, I have a dream speech from memory. And, it's like amazing oration. And I thought, wow, there's something. going on here that you sort of opened up my eyes to the situation in this country.  So basically until high school, I was a country kid, you know, but then we moved out to San Francisco and it was a big culture shock, big shock. So I was in, I basically came out for high school and this was in the late 60s and I remember it was 1968 when Laureen was on strike for, uh, Ethnic Studies and the Third World Strike in SF State. My high school was literally a few blocks away. I was at Lowell High. And students from SF State were coming over and leafleting us. I started reading that stuff and that's when I really got interested in what was going on at State and later on when I was at Berkeley, you know, in Ethnic Studies. So I think my grounding came from Ethnic Studies, the anti war movement, and, you know, I would love to talk to you about the whole thing about the Vietnam War because, You know, I'm guessing maybe your parents or grandparents were involved in the secret war in Laos, a war that the U. S. wouldn't even acknowledge happened even though we were bombing Laos. So it was ethnic studies, the civil rights movement, and the anti war movement that got me involved. In Berkeley, I was involved in some of the ethnic studies stuff. Even though I'm a fourth generation Chinese American, it's always been very important to me to try to learn the language so I was in the Cantonese working group. So I helped put together the curriculum stuff that was going on in Asian American Studies. I think before Germaine was there, or maybe around the same time. Yeah, I've known these folks for literally 50 years. It's kind of scary. So, um, I was inspired by what was going on at CAA, what Laureen was doing at SF State. So I joined CAA. Biggest mistake of my life. Because I saw this little ad in East West newspaper, used to be this community newspaper, and there was literally a coupon that you would clip out. And I sent in the coupon with a 5 check. It's like the most expensive 5 I've spent in my whole life. And then I went to law school, and I was involved in the law caucus and a number of other things, but my first job out of law school was Right here at CAA. Well, not here, but up on Stockton Street. Henry was my boss. You know, I feel like I would have been less burned out had we done some of this stuff. But we didn't do any of this. I remember my first desk had literally a door on top of like cardboard boxes. That was our office back then. And in one form or another, I've been involved in CAA ever since. I've been in a couple of organizations. Other organizations, but CAA is the one that's closest to my heart, and I'll tell you why. One, I met my wife here. And number two, I feel like the great thing about CAA is it's never lost its real community roots. I feel like other organizations do great work, don't get me wrong, but I feel like CAA has always maintained a real close connection to the community, and that's why everybody. I wrote that 5 check and, and several others. So yeah, that's, that's my story.  Miko: Thanks, Steve. Laureen, what about you?  Laureen Chew: Wow, this is amazing. Listening to everybody else's story, really. I guess I'll start pretty much how, my family was. My grandfather came in 1870s. I think I found out when I went to the roots program, which is only like five years ago, that was an adventure. so my parent, my father and his whole family was born here and born during Chinese exclusion. And so obviously they lived in Chinatown and nowhere else to go, even though they, my father and especially his, younger siblings. They all spoke English. Interestingly, his first two sisters were born here too. They didn't speak a lick of English because they never went to school. So what was really interesting for me, so I was born and raised in Chinatown. Okay. I wasn't born in Chinese Hospital. I was born in Children's Hospital, which everybody thinks is odd. But that's another story. My mother is actually an immigrant. She's a first generation, but she didn't come until 1947. So what's interesting is that I'm always kind of stuck between generations, like one and a half. But having a very strong mother who spoke only Chinese and my father's side, who's mostly English speaking. But a lot of them, my cousins or whatever, they were a lot older. They did speak Chinese also. But what's really stark to me is because growing up in Chinatown, you go to school with basically majority Chinese kids, right? And so you live in this community that on the one hand is very nurturing, very safe. Very intimate in a lot of ways. All my cousins and whatever are here. I mean, to show you how large my father's side was, when my aunt, the oldest aunt had her 50th anniversary wedding anniversary, she married when she was 14 because otherwise women, people forget. I I'm probably the first generation of women that either had a choice to not get married and I was still able to eat because I made my own money. Okay, my mother's generation, no, all her friends, no, you know, so don't take that one for granted either as women. So what was interesting was the fact that because she is very strong in being Chinese and then my father's side are total assimilationists, mainly, which was really interesting because many of them who grew up during Chinese exclusion. It was horrific, but you would never, I never heard one story. His family must have had over 300 people because his sister had 13 kids. Okay, then they had all had kids, one at 10, one of her daughter in law. So it was like huge. Growing up in this area, I just never felt I was different than anyone else because you don't come in contact with anyone that's really different until I went to high school. My mother is the immigrant. She wanted to send me to a school that was not a public school that a lot of the Chinatown kids went to, which was Galileo, because she somehow felt that I would be the kind of kid that would go not the straight and narrow, but more towards the the More naughty kids, to put it mildly, she knew that. So what she did was that she sent me to a Catholic school, okay, because she, God knows, oh yeah, she went to school for two years in Hong Kong. She's another story, she didn't have any money, and so she was given to an aunt to be raised. So she married to get out of Hong Kong because At twenty, she told me the only thing she told me was at twenty seven, I was considered an old maid. And then my father, who was, didn't have, there weren't very many women here because of Chinese exclusion, and he had to marry Chinese, actually saw my mom, and my mom's a picture bride, so they didn't even know each other when they got married. But she took over. My mom is like the queen of the family and the decision maker. And my father made the money and she spent it however little she had. Okay. And going to Catholic school was one thing that she felt that would help me become a good girl, except that I had never been to a where there were white kids. And so this school Was not only Catholic, but it was also a school that was considered kind of the, the best girls, Catholic high school. It was at the end of Chinatown. And that's the only reason why she wanted me to go there because I didn't have to take the bus. I can walk home. It's, it's a French school called Notre Dame de Victoire. So I went there and I thought I would have a really good time, just like all, all the high school. My problem was, was that. I was different, but never to know that you're different until you're in high school. Because you know, you know how mean girls can be in high school. And then they're all, it's an all girls school and it's a small school. And so my mom told me very clearly, you know, it's $150 a year. We really don't have that money, but. You know, we'll scrape and do whatever we can to send you through that. I said, Oh, okay, cool. Right. Except I had no friends. I mean, I was one of three Chinese girls in the school and I never knew how different I was until I got there because I used to get home perms, you know, permanence. And all the other girls had money. They were at least middle class, if not richer, and they all went to beauty parlors. My mom cut my hair and gave me the home perms, and she was into saving money, like I said, so she always kept the perm on longer than you should have it. I swore one year it came out like I had an afro, and I was so embarrassed. I made her cut it just to make it look straighter, but it was horrible. I don't have a picture. No, first of all, pictures aren't that common back then, you know, it costs money to have film and a camera. You didn't even have a camera. Yeah. So anyway, plus another thing is that because I wasn't the smartest Chinese girl either. Okay, the other two Chinese girls did pretty well. They were smart, and they were good in sports. I was neither. And I looked like a dork. Then what would made it even worse was that my mother spoke no English. My father did, but he might as well be absent because he slept during the day and worked at night. So we have things called mother daughter fashion shows. Mother, daughter breakfast. And I saw the way those mothers were dressed and I saw the way everybody acted and my way of dealing with it was I had no mom. I never brought her to the school. Any mother, daughter thing, I didn't go to. You didn't have to. I mean, that made me even less part of the school. And it was very painful because I didn't understand why I would be treated that way. Just because I looked, but I spoke English, it didn't matter. I did look a little weird, you know, so to this, I think it influenced me a couple of ways. One, whenever I had money, clothes was going to be my big deal. It still is, you know, it's kind of psychological. And then secondly, then that was a time that I figured out like, how come I don't, I hate myself and my family versus versus hating those girls. Right. I mean, that's how I dealt with it. It was, I call it a form of self hatred and it's, it's done by schooling. It's done by not only schooling in terms of omission about who we were as a people here, but omission about racism. Omission about discrimination and just about our histories here. But I didn't have a label for it in high school. I just, I really thought there was something wrong with me and my family. And that's the greatest danger about racism, is this form of internalizing it and not having a vehicle to deal with it. And there was nothing in our schools that dealt with it, you know, and I think what I came out of there realizing was that. Oh, another thing, I had mixed messages about what was happening because Martin Luther King was already on TV, and I was trying to watch it, and then I was still in high school, and my mom would, and my cousins, American boys, don't watch the black people. They're troublemakers. You know, all they do is make trouble, you know, they don't, they should be like us. We don't complain, right? We don't make trouble. And that's how you succeed. You succeed, I think, in my, what I was raised with, with the older generation of American born who had to go through this horrific history, you know, one, you don't get a job in Chinatown. You should get a job outside of Chinatown because it means that you're working for white folks and working for white folks is better than working for your own. So self hatred doesn't just run in yourself. It kind of permeates how we feel. feel as, as a group of people, right? And so, my whole thing was that I was looking for answers as to why, why I felt the way I did. And not only that, I wasn't the only one. That's what was interesting. And I didn't realize that until I went to San Francisco state, you know, because I was told, my mom said, you want to go to college, you're going to have to You know, find your way up to court because she, you know, she spent that on my fabulous high school education, which I came up miserable and, and I would tell her I want to go to Galileo. I want to go there. She said, no, you're not going to go. I said, she goes, what is wrong with you? Because I started crying certain times and she would just say, well, you're going to school to learn, not to make friends, so forget about it. I'm giving you the best with best intentions. But then when I went to college, this one girl who grew up in South City, similar experience because South City was all white back then. So she said to me one day, she was, she's Chinese too. And she says, you know, there's a meeting there that's huge. The people are talking about all this stuff. We talk about how we were mistreated in high school and how people are blah, blah. There's a name for it. It's called racism. I was called what racism. Okay. She goes, you want to go? I said, well, who's there? She said, black people. But I said, Oh, my mom would kill me. I mean, I was really worried because my mom doesn't even know what I do at state. So I went. I think that time we had some pretty interesting people. One time there was Eldridge Cleaver, who was the head of the Black Panther Party. Um, there were people like Carlton Goodlett, who was from the Bayview Hunters Point, who had certain people from the mission. They were all kind of leaders of different communities. There was Yuri Wada, who was a Japanese American. He was very prominent in dealing with civil rights. Chinatown, I, George Woo, George Woo is an infamous person also. He was the spokesperson for gang kids in Chinatown. He was very, very, very alive and took over in terms of the whole thing about the youth problems in Chinatown. So he was not part of this group, but just hearing the stories of these other ethnic groups that were very similar, not the same, but this whole thing of like just being dissed for the way you look, the way you speak, and supposedly your values. And my whole thing is that, that thing opened my eyes to the extent that helped me to release a lot of my anger towards something I didn't know who to be angry at, right? So you have to, I felt that the San Francisco State Strike, I mean, I was all in and with a small group of Chinese that were there, including Mason, all these people. And we had to really open our eyes to working with other people that were not like us. And what was more interesting for me to see was that every single group said that if we're ever going to have classes on ethnic studies, a key part of those classes should be why we are getting an education. And why we're getting an education primarily is to serve our communities. So there is a real strong component to ethnic studies that was community based. And because of that, during my college years, I actually came back, I mean came back, I was still living in Chinatown, but I actually placed myself in the Chinatown that I knew nothing about, which is our issues, our problems. And during my time, it was mainly about youth problems. We had a gang problem. We had girls that were on drugs. We had immigrant kids that didn't speak any English and just thrown into schools nilly willy without anybody helping them. So I was lucky enough for three years or four years during college that I worked as a house parent for runaway girls. I worked trying to tutor immigrant kids, you know, and I was trying to become a teacher. So those formative years, in terms of just having my feet in different things really showed me that, you know what, I don't want next generations of people who kind of look like me to have to go through the struggle of hating myself. Because of things that are my home, that are based home base, you know, this country, this is what I feel that very strongly about the United States, that I think people are losing sight of, especially now that we're all in very ethnic silos. This country is very different in the sense of just the whole fact of different groups mixing, you know, you go to China or whatever it's still basically you. you're Chinese, even in my north, south, pink, whatever direction you are. It's still basically Chinese, but in this country you can come from different areas and different places of the world and still have a vision that ties you together. That should be a singular vision, which is a democracy at this point. And then also this very simple statement of justice. And equality for all. We sometimes forget about the all, if we're just kind of in our little silos. But I think that's the reason why, from state on, and reacquainting to my community, it was life changing. Whatever job I took after that, whether I was a teacher, a faculty, associate dean, chair of the department. My main focus was that I'm here for the students and the people, quote unquote, who are here with me that have this similar vision, that we all have a place here. And in order to, for us to really respect others, we have to respect ourselves. And that includes what we're raised with in terms of our values and also our history here. Miko: Thanks, Laureen. Germaine?  Germaine Wong: Oh. well, my experience is similar to many of yours and a little bit different. I grew up in Oakland, Chinatown, and Went to a school that was only three blocks from where I live. And the school was Mexicans, blacks, as well as Chinese. Although I would say maybe half the school, at least half the school was Chinese. And I didn't, I didn't speak any English until I went to school, so I had that experience too. And then, my father was always very upwardly mobile, wanted to live the white middle class life. And I didn't know it at the time, but, he managed to buy property in Castro Valley, Southeast of Oakland. At the time, they wouldn't sell to Chinese. So he got somebody at work to buy the property for him. And then sold it to my father. That's how we got to move there. So I started high school in Castro Valley. I was the only non white in the whole school. The janitors, the cafeteria workers, everybody was white. I was the only one in that school who was not white. But I'm a little bit more dense than all of you, so I was not aware of whatever racism there was. At that time Castro Valley was really white. And also very affluent. So most of my classmates. It's unlike in Oakland, Chinatown, these classmates, they were children of doctors and lawyers and engineers and dentists and most of the people in my high school, they, the kids either had horses or cars. At that time, Castro Valley was not the suburb it is today. Our neighbors, for example, our next door neighbors had chickens and goats So it was really different. So it was all so different from Oakland Chinatown. And then I finally experienced some racism the following year when a black family moved in and somebody really literally did burn a cross in their front lawn. Wow. Yeah. And she was in the same grade I was in, one of the daughters. And then another Chinese girl moved in. And I recognized her, but we were never friends in Oakland Chinatown. And that's where I first experienced reverse discrimination. Because I met the stereotype of an Asian student, right? So I did well in math and all the classes. Well, she was definitely a C student and the teachers treated her as if she was an F student. Teachers just expect us to excel in our classes. So that was my first, really, where it hit home for me. And then in the 50s, in Oakland, Chinatown, I experienced what Henry did during the confession program. So my mother was going through all these things. These are your aunts and uncles and these are not your aunts and uncles. And so if any white person comes and starts asking you about your family, just remember these people are not related to you because all of us had paper names. Like I'm not really a Wong. My family's really a Kwan. But in my situation, I had a great grandfather who was here legitimately. And then the next generation, when they went back, they decided we're never coming back to the United States. So they sold their papers. So then when the next generation decided to come back, they had to buy papers. So my family went through that situation. I had jobs where I lived in, during college, I, I had live in jobs, I lived with a family first when I was going to UC Berkeley, and then later on when I transferred over to San Francisco State, I worked for an older white woman, and so I, I got to see what upper white middle class families lived like, and then with this older woman that I lived in with here in San Francisco, what the rich people lived like, so that was kind a different world. And then somebody asked me to work at the Chinatown YWCA here. And I got to experience San Francisco Chinatown then. I was assigned to work in a pilot program where I worked with third grade Chinatown girls. One group were immigrant girls who lived in the SROs here. They literally are eight by eight rooms with a whole family lives in them. And the kitchen and the bathrooms are down the hall. So that was the first time I had ever seen people living like that, in such crowded digits. And the other group of girls I worked with, again, were middle class, upper middle class Chinese girls whose parents were doctors and dentists and like that. And the woman who was the executive director was a Korean American woman named Hannah Sir. And this was all when I went to college when President Kennedy was assassinated and then Lyndon Johnson became president. And so it was during this time that this Korean American woman said to me, you have to apply for this program because right now, President Lyndon Johnson only thought about blacks and Hispanics who needed help. And we really need to get Asian Americans in. So she convinced me to apply for program and some miracle happened and I got into the program. After I went to that summer training program, I came back here to San Francisco and I was assigned to work in the Bayview, Hunters Point, and Fillmore areas of San Francisco working with black gang kids. That was a new experience for me too. Then from there, then I went to grad school, then when I came back, I got assigned to working here in Chinatown, where I worked mainly with immigrant adults looking for jobs as well as the gang kids, both English speaking as well as Chinese speaking. And, from there, I met people like Ling Chi Wong and Eileen Dong. who were already working in Chinatown before I was. And that's when we got together and Ling Chi was actually the organizer, the lead person. And, we started CAA. So all of us had other jobs. We had full time jobs and so we were doing this kind of on the side. I think Ling Chi was the only one who didn't have a job. He was a graduate student. And I want to tell you, he was a graduate student in Middle Eastern ancient languages. That's what he was studying at UC Berkeley at the time. And, uh, but all the rest of us had full time jobs. We started CAA as a volunteer organization. We had no office, no staff, no money. And that's how we started. And eventually I first met Laureen, who really helped us out with one of our first major projects. Teaching English on television, remember? You and Helen, yes. You and Helen Chin really helped us out. Laureen Chew: Okay, nice to know.  Germaine Wong: And then I remember meeting, and then when Henry came to Chinatown and his Swahili was better than his Cantonese. Wow. Yes. Wow. Anyway, and I met all of these good people and CAA continued to grow. And there still is. Yep. Amazing, amazing story.  And that wraps up part one of this incredible intergenerational conversation. Between the OGs of Chinese for affirmative action. And the young organizers of mung innovating politics. Tonight. We got a glimpse into the powerful stories of CAS.  Of CA's founders.  Their hardships resilience and what drove them to commit their lives to the movement. Their reflections, remind us that the fight for justice is not just about the moments of triumph and the victories, but also about the struggles, the sacrifices. And perhaps most importantly, the. Vital importance of being grounded in our communities and our values. Be sure to join us next time for part two, where we'll dive into the dialogue between. Seasoned OJI leaders and today's. Today's youth Changemakers from Monday innovating politics. Together, they'll explore strategies, how strategies have shifted over the decades and how we can sustain our work for social justice in the longterm. As always thank you for tuning into apex express. For more about Chinese for affirmative action and mung innovating politics.  Please do check them out on their websites, which will be linked in the show notes. At apex express. At kpfa.org/apex express. Until next time. Apex express is produced by Miko Lee, Paige Chung, Jalena Keane-Lee, Preeti Mangala Shekar. Shekar, Anuj Vaidya, Kiki Rivera, Swati Rayasam, Nate Tan, Hien Nguyen, Nikki Chan, and Cheryl Truong  Cheryl Truong: Tonight's show was produced by me, cheryl. Thanks to the team at KPFA for all of their support. And thank you for listening!  The post APEX Express – December 19, 2024 – Bridging Generations appeared first on KPFA.

Set in 1977, Johnny Delivers (Guernica Editions, 2024) tells the absorbing story of 18-year-old Johnny Wong—the son of Chinese immigrants to Canada—who calls on the spirit of Bruce Lee to help him navigate the still relevant challenges of racism and how it permeates our interiority, our institutions, our relationships, and our livelihood. Toxic masculinity, homophobia, and the struggle for belonging. With the 100th Anniversary of the Enactment of the Chinese Exclusion Act in Canada barely behind us, the themes explored in this book are particularly salient. An exciting and heart-wrenching story combined with the distinctly Canadian setting and universal themes make this book a wonderful book to read. Wayne Ng was born in downtown Toronto to Chinese immigrants who fed him a steady diet of bitter melon and kung fu movies. Ng is a social worker who lives to write, travel, eat, and play, preferably all at the same time. He is an award-winning author and traveler who continues to push his boundaries from the Arctic to the Antarctic. He lives in Ottawa with his wife and goldfish. Ng is the author of The Family Code, shortlisted for the Guernica Prize; Letters From Johnny, winner of the Crime Writers of Canada Award for Best Crime Novella and a finalist for the Ottawa Book Award; Johnny Delivers; and Finding the Way: A Novel of Lao Tzu. Hollay Ghadery is an Iranian-Canadian multi-genre writer living in Ontario on Anishinaabe land. She has her MFA in Creative Writing from the University of Guelph. Fuse, her memoir of mixed-race identity and mental health, was released by Guernica Editions in 2021 and won the 2023 Canadian Bookclub Award for Nonfiction/Memoir. Her collection of poetry, Rebellion Box was released by Radiant Press in 2023, and her collection of short fiction, Widow Fantasies, was released with Gordon Hill Press in fall 2024. Her debut novel, The Unraveling of Ou, is due out with Palimpsest Press in 2026, and her children's book, Being with the Birds, with Guernica Editions in 2027. Hollay is the host of the 105.5 FM Bookclub, as well as a co-host on HOWL on CIUT 89.5 FM. She is also a book publicist, the Regional Chair of the League of Canadian Poets and a co-chair of the League's BIPOC committee, as well as the Poet Laureate of Scugog Township. Learn more about Hollay at www.hollayghadery.com. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices Support our show by becoming a premium member! https://newbooksnetwork.supportingcast.fm/new-books-network

Set in 1977, Johnny Delivers (Guernica Editions, 2024) tells the absorbing story of 18-year-old Johnny Wong—the son of Chinese immigrants to Canada—who calls on the spirit of Bruce Lee to help him navigate the still relevant challenges of racism and how it permeates our interiority, our institutions, our relationships, and our livelihood. Toxic masculinity, homophobia, and the struggle for belonging. With the 100th Anniversary of the Enactment of the Chinese Exclusion Act in Canada barely behind us, the themes explored in this book are particularly salient. An exciting and heart-wrenching story combined with the distinctly Canadian setting and universal themes make this book a wonderful book to read. Wayne Ng was born in downtown Toronto to Chinese immigrants who fed him a steady diet of bitter melon and kung fu movies. Ng is a social worker who lives to write, travel, eat, and play, preferably all at the same time. He is an award-winning author and traveler who continues to push his boundaries from the Arctic to the Antarctic. He lives in Ottawa with his wife and goldfish. Ng is the author of The Family Code, shortlisted for the Guernica Prize; Letters From Johnny, winner of the Crime Writers of Canada Award for Best Crime Novella and a finalist for the Ottawa Book Award; Johnny Delivers; and Finding the Way: A Novel of Lao Tzu. Hollay Ghadery is an Iranian-Canadian multi-genre writer living in Ontario on Anishinaabe land. She has her MFA in Creative Writing from the University of Guelph. Fuse, her memoir of mixed-race identity and mental health, was released by Guernica Editions in 2021 and won the 2023 Canadian Bookclub Award for Nonfiction/Memoir. Her collection of poetry, Rebellion Box was released by Radiant Press in 2023, and her collection of short fiction, Widow Fantasies, was released with Gordon Hill Press in fall 2024. Her debut novel, The Unraveling of Ou, is due out with Palimpsest Press in 2026, and her children's book, Being with the Birds, with Guernica Editions in 2027. Hollay is the host of the 105.5 FM Bookclub, as well as a co-host on HOWL on CIUT 89.5 FM. She is also a book publicist, the Regional Chair of the League of Canadian Poets and a co-chair of the League's BIPOC committee, as well as the Poet Laureate of Scugog Township. Learn more about Hollay at www.hollayghadery.com. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices Support our show by becoming a premium member! https://newbooksnetwork.supportingcast.fm/asian-american-studies

Set in 1977, Johnny Delivers (Guernica Editions, 2024) tells the absorbing story of 18-year-old Johnny Wong—the son of Chinese immigrants to Canada—who calls on the spirit of Bruce Lee to help him navigate the still relevant challenges of racism and how it permeates our interiority, our institutions, our relationships, and our livelihood. Toxic masculinity, homophobia, and the struggle for belonging. With the 100th Anniversary of the Enactment of the Chinese Exclusion Act in Canada barely behind us, the themes explored in this book are particularly salient. An exciting and heart-wrenching story combined with the distinctly Canadian setting and universal themes make this book a wonderful book to read. Wayne Ng was born in downtown Toronto to Chinese immigrants who fed him a steady diet of bitter melon and kung fu movies. Ng is a social worker who lives to write, travel, eat, and play, preferably all at the same time. He is an award-winning author and traveler who continues to push his boundaries from the Arctic to the Antarctic. He lives in Ottawa with his wife and goldfish. Ng is the author of The Family Code, shortlisted for the Guernica Prize; Letters From Johnny, winner of the Crime Writers of Canada Award for Best Crime Novella and a finalist for the Ottawa Book Award; Johnny Delivers; and Finding the Way: A Novel of Lao Tzu. Hollay Ghadery is an Iranian-Canadian multi-genre writer living in Ontario on Anishinaabe land. She has her MFA in Creative Writing from the University of Guelph. Fuse, her memoir of mixed-race identity and mental health, was released by Guernica Editions in 2021 and won the 2023 Canadian Bookclub Award for Nonfiction/Memoir. Her collection of poetry, Rebellion Box was released by Radiant Press in 2023, and her collection of short fiction, Widow Fantasies, was released with Gordon Hill Press in fall 2024. Her debut novel, The Unraveling of Ou, is due out with Palimpsest Press in 2026, and her children's book, Being with the Birds, with Guernica Editions in 2027. Hollay is the host of the 105.5 FM Bookclub, as well as a co-host on HOWL on CIUT 89.5 FM. She is also a book publicist, the Regional Chair of the League of Canadian Poets and a co-chair of the League's BIPOC committee, as well as the Poet Laureate of Scugog Township. Learn more about Hollay at www.hollayghadery.com. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices Support our show by becoming a premium member! https://newbooksnetwork.supportingcast.fm/literature

We're back from Thanksgiving. To start the show we ask listeners what they think about President Joe Biden's decision to pardon his son Hunter. GBH News Analyst Charlie Sennott discusses the fragile ceasefire between Israel and Lebanon and Ukrainian president Zelensky saying he that he would cede Ukrainian territory for an end to the violence.Amherst college professor Ilan Stavans talks about Trump's tariff conversation with Mexico President Sheinbaum and lessons from the Chinese Exclusion Act on mass deportation.Mayors Dominick Pangallo (Salem) & Cathleen DeSimone (Attleboro) discuss how drought conditions across the state have impacted their respective cities.Boston Globe business columnist Shirley Leung discusses the Shaws & Star Market merger and record spending on Black Friday and Cyber Monday. Then we open up the phone lines to ask listeners about online shopping. 

Episode 449 - William Gee Wong - Sons of Chinatown, A Memoir Rooted in China and America - insights into the Chinese Exclusion ActAbout William Gee WongWilliam is a print journalist, author, and amateur historian. A native of Oakland, California's Chinatown, William received his B.A. at the University of California at Berkeley and M.S. at the Columbia University Graduate School of Journalism. His print journalism career was spent at The Wall Street Journal (1970-1979) and The Oakland Tribune (1979-1996). He also worked for The San Francisco Chronicle and the San Francisco News Call Bulletin, and has written for the San Francisco Examiner, East West: the Chinese American Journal, and Asian Week, among other publications. In the mid-1960s, William served in the Peace Corps in the Philippines. From 1995-1996, he was a regional commentator for The News Hour with Jim Lehrer on PBS. William is the author of Yellow Journalist: Dispatches from Asian AmericaSons of Chinatown: A Memoir Rooted in China and AmericaWilliam Gee Wong's father entered the U.S. legally as the “son of a native,” despite having partially false papers. Sons of Chinatown is Wong's evocative dual memoir of his and his father's parallel experiences in America.https://www.williamgeewong.com/Support the show___https://livingthenextchapter.com/podcast produced by: https://truemediasolutions.ca/Coffee Refills are always appreciated, refill Dave's cup here, and thanks!https://buymeacoffee.com/truemediaca

This Day in Legal History: Massachusetts Institutes Death Penalty for HeresyOn November 4, 1646, the Massachusetts General Court enacted a law that imposed the death penalty for heresy, requiring all members of the colony to affirm the Bible as the Word of God. This harsh mandate reflected the deeply religious nature of the Puritan colony, which viewed dissenting beliefs as a grave threat to its social and spiritual fabric. The law underscored the colony's commitment to a strict religious orthodoxy, where deviation from established doctrine was considered not just a sin but a serious civil offense. The Massachusetts Bay Colony was, at the time, a theocratic society in which religious and legal authorities were often intertwined, giving ministers and magistrates alike substantial power over both personal belief and public behavior.By criminalizing heresy with such severity, the General Court aimed to maintain religious uniformity and discourage the influx of non-conforming individuals or beliefs. This law was part of broader efforts to deter the spread of religious pluralism, especially from emerging groups like the Quakers, who would later challenge Puritan authority. The legislation also reveals the degree to which early American colonies experimented with extreme measures of social control, often in ways that would seem incompatible with later ideals of religious freedom. Though not widely enforced with executions, the law served as a powerful deterrent, shaping a culture of religious conformity and setting a precedent for laws that linked faith and governance. It highlights the tension in early colonial America between the desire for communal unity and the eventual American principles of individual religious liberty. This strict legal approach to heresy foreshadowed the eventual legal conflicts and philosophical shifts that would lead to religious freedom protections enshrined in the First Amendment.Ahead of the U.S. election, an intensifying legal dispute pits lawyers associated with former President Donald Trump against an advocacy group called the 65 Project, which seeks to hold attorneys accountable for pushing false election claims. Formed after Trump's 2020 election loss, the 65 Project has filed more than 80 ethics complaints against lawyers involved in Trump's legal efforts, aiming to deter future claims of election fraud. In response, Trump-aligned America First Legal (AFL) filed an ethics complaint against Michael Teter, the 65 Project's lead lawyer, accusing him of targeting attorneys simply for their client affiliations.The conflict underscores how lawyers are once again at the center of electoral controversies, with Trump suggesting he would contest any loss in the upcoming election. The 65 Project claims its goal is to prevent misuse of the legal system, while AFL counters that the group seeks to intimidate conservative lawyers. Meanwhile, the AFL has taken other legal actions, such as challenging voter registrations and election procedures in battleground states like Arizona and Pennsylvania. Although many of the 65 Project's complaints have led to disciplinary investigations, several cases have been dismissed, and some targeted attorneys remain active in election-related litigation for Trump allies. This legal clash highlights the growing stakes of election law as both sides brace for potential disputes over the upcoming presidential vote.Ahead of US election, lawyers fight over ethics breach accusations | ReutersA Pennsylvania judge is set to rule on whether to halt Elon Musk's $1 million-a-day giveaway to registered voters, just one day before the presidential election between Vice President Kamala Harris and former President Donald Trump. Musk, who has recently endorsed Trump, has been awarding daily $1 million prizes to randomly selected voters in battleground states, including Pennsylvania, as part of a campaign promoting free speech and gun rights. The initiative, backed by Musk's America PAC, has been criticized as potentially violating state consumer protection laws and possibly federal election laws, as it resembles an illegal lottery.Philadelphia District Attorney Lawrence Krasner filed a lawsuit against Musk and America PAC, arguing that the program is unlawfully influencing voters and alleging that the winners may not be chosen entirely at random, citing two winners with ties to pro-Trump events. Musk's team attempted to move the case to federal court, asserting that it raises free speech and election interference issues, but a judge ruled that it would proceed in state court. The legal debate around the giveaway centers on whether it constitutes paying people to register to vote, which would violate federal law. The Department of Justice has reportedly cautioned America PAC about the program's legality, but has not formally intervened.Judge weighs challenge to Elon Musk's $1 million voter giveaway | ReutersThe U.S. Supreme Court is set to hear cases from Meta's Facebook and Nvidia, as both companies seek to block federal securities fraud lawsuits that could impact the power of private litigants to hold corporations accountable. Facebook faces allegations of misleading investors about the Cambridge Analytica data breach, with plaintiffs claiming Facebook failed to disclose the breach's materialized risk and instead framed it as hypothetical. Meanwhile, Nvidia is contesting claims that it misled investors about the portion of its sales driven by the volatile cryptocurrency market, allegedly downplaying crypto's influence on revenue growth. The Supreme Court's recent rulings favoring limits on federal regulatory power could make the justices receptive to Facebook and Nvidia's arguments. These cases follow a trend in which the Court has reined in federal agencies, like the SEC, potentially leaving gaps in enforcement that private securities lawsuits might fill. Proponents argue that private securities litigation is essential to holding companies accountable, especially as regulatory agencies face resource constraints. Legal experts suggest that if the Court sides with Facebook and Nvidia, it could limit the scope of private lawsuits in securities fraud cases, thereby shifting more accountability from private plaintiffs back to under-resourced public agencies.Facebook, Nvidia ask US Supreme Court to spare them from securities fraud suits | ReutersA Pennsylvania judge ordered the Erie County Board of Elections to provide ballots to as many as 17,000 voters who did not receive their requested mail-in ballots ahead of the November 5 election. The order came after the Democratic Party filed a lawsuit claiming that the county's failure to send out up to 20,000 requested ballots had caused significant delays, potentially infringing on voters' rights. Erie County is considered a crucial area in Pennsylvania, a key swing state with 19 electoral votes, where the presidential race between Donald Trump and Kamala Harris remains extremely close.Judge David Ridge's ruling extended early voting in the county through November 4, allowing the election board to use overnight delivery services to expedite ballot distribution, especially for the 1,200 voters temporarily out of state. The court also addressed issues with duplicate ballots, allowing affected voters to cancel earlier submissions and cast new ballots if needed. The decision aims to rectify complications caused by a contractor's errors and ensure that eligible voters can participate.Judge orders Pennsylvania county to issue ballots for voters who did not receive them | ReutersAs you head to the polls tomorrow, I'm not here to tell you who to vote for. You have to decide that for yourself and, frankly, I can't imagine anyone would do much of anything on my say-so alone. Instead, I'd like to offer a few brief anecdotes from the past to think about. Immigration has been a central issue in this election cycle, with some arguing that immigrants pose a threat to our safety and economic stability. But before making up your mind, I'd encourage you to consider how these same debates have played out in history. Each time, we've faced similar fears and questions: Are immigrants helping or harming us? Are they a part of our communities or a threat to them? Let's take a look back at a few key moments when these questions came up and see if they offer any lessons for us today. In the full light of history, on which side would you like to imagine you would have come down on? What does that mean for your voting choice tomorrow?Chinese Exclusion Act (1882, United States) - Chinese immigrants were blamed for taking jobs from American workers, particularly on the West Coast, leading to the first federal law to restrict a specific immigrant group.Irish Immigrants and the Potato Famine (1840s, United States) - Irish immigrants fleeing famine were accused of increasing crime rates and straining public resources, leading to widespread anti-Irish sentiment and discrimination.Jewish Immigrants in Tsarist Russia (Late 1800s–Early 1900s) - Jewish communities were scapegoated for economic hardships and social unrest, culminating in violent pogroms and restrictive laws.Japanese Internment (World War II, United States) - Japanese-Americans were blamed for posing a national security threat, resulting in mass internment based on ethnicity, despite no evidence of disloyalty.Mexican Immigrants During the Great Depression (1930s, United States) - Mexican immigrants were accused of taking jobs from American citizens during economic hardship, leading to widespread deportations, including some American-born citizens.Indian Migrants in Uganda (1972) - Under Idi Amin, South Asian immigrants were blamed for controlling the economy at the expense of native Ugandans, resulting in the expulsion of 80,000 Indians and Pakistanis.German Immigrants in the United States (World War I) - German Americans were often targeted and accused of harboring pro-German sympathies, leading to discrimination and suppression of German culture.Italian Immigrants in the U.S. (Early 1900s) - Italians were often blamed for increased crime rates, particularly due to the association with organized crime, leading to discrimination and limited employment opportunities.Syrian and Lebanese Migrants in Latin America (20th Century) - In countries like Argentina and Brazil, Syrian and Lebanese immigrants were accused of taking jobs and resources, leading to restrictions and anti-Arab sentiment.These are just a few notable examples of past debates around immigration. As above and in conclusion, I challenge you to ask yourself where you'd like to imagine you would have come down in these debates – and vote accordingly.  This is a public episode. If you'd like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit www.minimumcomp.com/subscribe

In 1880, the Chinese were the biggest group of immigrants in the western U.S. But Sinophobic sentiments crystallized into racist policies and eventually the Chinese Exclusion Act of 1882. The rationale was that banning Chinese laborers would boost job opportunities for U.S.-born workers. Today, an economist explains how the Chinese exclusion laws affected the economies of western states and what it says about our current debate over immigration and jobs.Read the working paper co-authored by Nancy Qian.A digital scan of the photo album in the California Historical Society's collections is available here.For more on this period of history, check out At America's Gates: Chinese Immigration during the Exclusion Era, 1882-1943 by Erika Lee.Related episodes:What's missing in the immigration debate (Apple / Spotify) For sponsor-free episodes of The Indicator from Planet Money, subscribe to Planet Money+ via Apple Podcasts or at plus.npr.org. Music by Drop Electric. Find us: TikTok, Instagram, Facebook, Newsletter. Learn more about sponsor message choices: podcastchoices.com/adchoicesNPR Privacy Policy

Step into the historic Chicago Cafe in Woodland, California, a culinary landmark that could potentially be the oldest Chinese restaurant in the U.S. Anchored by the Fong family for over a century, their resilience echoes through the decades of the Chinese Exclusion Act and societal adversity. The cafe offers more than traditional Chinese food. It's a living chapter of Chinese-American history and a beacon of cultural endurance. Series: "UC Davis News" [Humanities] [Show ID: 40176]

Step into the historic Chicago Cafe in Woodland, California, a culinary landmark that could potentially be the oldest Chinese restaurant in the U.S. Anchored by the Fong family for over a century, their resilience echoes through the decades of the Chinese Exclusion Act and societal adversity. The cafe offers more than traditional Chinese food. It's a living chapter of Chinese-American history and a beacon of cultural endurance. Series: "UC Davis News" [Humanities] [Show ID: 40176]

Freedom and Equality: What Does it Mean to Be an American?The United States has long held a curious and ambivalent relationship with freedom. The American founding fathers learned much about freedom and equality from Native Americans, who lived in truly egalitarian societies, but later confined the original Americans to reservations. The founding ideals of the United States – liberty, equality, and natural rights, came largely from Native America. It was Chief Canasatego, the Onondaga chief of the great Iroquois (Haudenosaunee) Confederacy, who originally gave the colonists the idea to unite, beseeching them to “Be like the Haudenosaunee, to never fall out with one another,” to be stronger together than apart. Our national motto comes from the Latin E Pluribus Unum (“From the many, one”) but we have never fully lived in accord with that slogan.  The political nation began with a beautiful document, The Declaration of Independence, which declared “All men are created equal,” but the writer of that document, Thomas Jefferson, owned 600 slaves, and by then slavery had already been practiced in the New World for more than 150 years. The young nation had Dutch, English, French, Spanish, German and other influences, and was dependent upon immigration to survive and thrive. Eventually, the whole world started to come to America, including immigrants from Asia, fueled by the West Coast Gold Rush of the mid-19th century. Then, came the backlash from those already here.  In 1882, President Arthur signed the Chinese Exclusion Act into law, the first of many anti-Asian discrimination bills, followed by the Gentleman's Agreement of 1908, which limited Japanese immigration to the wives, children, and relatives of residents already living within the United States. It was not until 1952 that Japanese Americans could become US citizens, even as women and Native Americans achieved suffrage in 1920 and 1924, respectively.  The most egregious action ever taken by the US government against Japanese Americans occurred during WWII.  As many are aware, it was February of 1942 when Franklin Delano Roosevelt signed Executive Order 9066, followed by subsequent orders that enforced the removal of all Japanese Americans from the West Coast to “relocation camps”.  What is lesser known is that the Department of Justice initiated pickup of 'enemy aliens' of Japanese descent on December 7, 1941, for eventual confinement in 4 government prison sites in New Mexico.The full consequences and ramifications of this sordid chapter of American history are still not openly discussed in mainstream circles. In New Mexico and elsewhere, our guests today have been educating the general public about what occurred and its relevance to today's outreach toward liberty and justice for all. We will discuss all this and more, on this edition of Circle for Original Thinking entitled "Freedom and Equality: What Does it Mean to Be an American?"Nikki Nojima Louis (originally Shirley Sadayo Nojima) is a second-generation (Nisei) Japanese American and childhood survivor of Camp Minidoka, Idaho. Her fourth birthday was on December 7, 1941, the day her father was taken by the FBI in Seattle, Washington, and held in DOJ camps in Lordsburg and Santa Fe from 1942-46.  Nikki grew up in Chicago, performed as a teenage dancer, was active in multicultural theater in the 1980s and 1990s as a writer, performer, and producer of projects on peace-and-justice and women's themes. In 1985, she wrote her first oral history play, Breakingthe Silence, to benefit the civil liberties trial of Gordon Hirabayashi. It continues to be performed. As a theatre artist, Nikki has received commissions from many sources, including the Smithsonian Museum, Women's International League for Peace and Freedom; NW Asian American Theatre, and Seattle Group Theatre, where she served as education director of its National Multicultural Playwrights Festival.  In 2002, at age 65, Nikki entered a Ph.D. program at Florida State University. Graduating at age 70, she traveled west for a three-month residency at the Santa Fe Art Institute and a teaching job at the University of New Mexico. Since 2014, Nikki has created living history programs on the Japanese American experience for the New Mexico Japanese American Citizens League (JACL). Her readers theater group, JACL Players, often collaborate with project CLOE (Confinement in the Land of Enchantment), which includes a traveling exhibit and community forums on New Mexico's WWII Japanese American prison camps. Nikki has co-produced an award-winning documentary, Community in Conflict: The Santa Fe Internment Camp Marker, with Bay Area director Claudia Katayanagi. Victor Masaru Yamada is Current Director of Confinement in Land of Enchantment project, about Japanese Americans confined in internment camps in New Mexico during WWII. Became director of the project during Phase III, setting up traveling exhibits promoting awareness of the history. Involved in giving presentations to international, national, state & local organizations. (Phases I / II planning & installation of historic markers, preparation of outreach publication, and development of website).    His family has 19th century roots in Hiroshima, Japan – His maternal grandparents moved to Seattle area in 1906 and his father moved to Seattle in 1919.  His parents became US citizens in 1954. Before then, his parents and siblings (three brothers and a sister) moved from Washington to eastern Oregon as part of government's ‘voluntary evacuation' program March 1942. Later in 1942, several of his family members were moved to the Minidoka Internment Camp. One of my uncles joined Army 442nd Unit and fought in European campaigns.

Center on Terrorism, Extremism, and Counterterrorism's Beth Daviess and J.M. Berger discuss lawful extremism.  The papers that form the basis of this conversation: "Chinese Exclusion Act" and "Extremist Ideology and the Dred Scott Decision."

Anti-Asian hate incidents rose dramatically during COVID, likely fueled by prominent statements about the “Chinese virus.”  VIewed through the wider lens of history, this was just the latest in a long experience of Anti-Asian hate, including the murder of Vincent Chin, the Chinese Exclusion Act, and the internment of Japanese Americans during WWII.  For those who think that anti-Asian hate has receded as the COVID has “ended,” just two days prior to recording this episode a Filipino woman was pushed to her death on BART in San Francisco. These incidents are broadcast widely, particularly in Asian News outlets. Today we talk about the impact of anti-Asian hate on the health and well being of older adults with Russell Jeung, sociologist, Professor of Asian Studies at San Francisco State, and co-founder of Stop AAPI-Hate, Lingsheng Li, geriatrician/palliative care doc and T32 fellow at UCSF, and Jessica Eng, medical director of On Lok, a PACE, and Associate Professor in the UCSF Division of Geriatrics.  We discuss: What is considered a hate incident, how is it tracked, what do we know about changes over time The wider impact of Anti-Asian hate on older Asians, who are afraid to go out, leading to anxiety, social isolation, loneliness, decreased exercise, missed appointments and medications. Lingsheng (and I) recently published studies on this in JAMA Internal Medicine, and JAGS. Ongoing reports from patients about anti-Asian hate experiences  Should clinicians screen for Anti-Asian hate? Why? Why not? Proposing the clinicians ask a simple follow up question to the usual “do you feel safe at home?” question used to screen for domestic violence.  Add to this, “do you feel safe outside the home?” This question, while providing an opportunity to talk about direct and indirect experiences, can be asked of all patients, and opens the door to conversations about anti-semitism, islamophobia, or anti-Black racism. See also guides for how to confront and discuss anti-Asian hate in these articles in the NEJM and JGIM. And to balance the somber subject, Lingsheng requested the BTS song Dynamite, which was the group's first English language song, and was released at the height of the COVID pandemic.  I had fun trying to make a danceable version with electronic drums for the audio-only podcast.  Maybe we'll get some BTS followers to subscribe to GeriPal?!?   -@AlexSmithMD  

This Day in Legal History: Chinese Exclusion TreatyOn August 13, 1894, the U.S. Senate ratified the Chinese Exclusion Treaty, marking a significant moment in American immigration history. This treaty was an extension of the Chinese Exclusion Act of 1882, which was the first significant law restricting immigration into the United States. Under the treaty, China agreed to the exclusion of its laborers from entering the U.S., further cementing the racial and economic discrimination that Chinese immigrants faced. The treaty represented a formal diplomatic agreement between the two nations, wherein China conceded to the exclusion of its citizens in exchange for certain protections for Chinese already residing in America.The Chinese Exclusion Treaty was part of a broader movement in the late 19th century to limit the influx of immigrants, particularly those from Asia, who were seen as economic threats and culturally incompatible by many Americans. The ratification of this treaty reinforced and prolonged the discriminatory practices against Chinese immigrants, contributing to the legal and social marginalization of Chinese communities in the U.S. It wasn't until 1943, during World War II, that these exclusionary policies began to be dismantled, reflecting the deep-seated impact of the treaty and the exclusion laws on American legal and social landscapes.In a recent legal development, a federal judge in California dismissed a consumer lawsuit accusing Google of unlawfully dominating mobile search markets. U.S. District Judge Rita Lin ruled that the plaintiffs failed to provide sufficient evidence showing how Google's market dominance harmed consumers. The lawsuit, originally filed in 2022, alleged that Google conspired with Apple to make its search engine the default on iPhones, restricting competition.Although the case was dismissed, Judge Lin indicated that the plaintiffs might have another opportunity to amend their complaint. She referenced a separate ruling by U.S. District Judge Amit Mehta in Washington, D.C., which found Google had illegally monopolized the search engine market by paying billions to Apple and other companies for exclusive search engine agreements. This ruling could bolster the plaintiffs' chances if they can provide more concrete evidence of consumer harm in their amended complaint.Despite this setback for the consumers, their attorney, Joseph Alioto, expressed intentions to revise and refile the lawsuit by the court's September 9 deadline. Google has denied the allegations and plans to appeal the D.C. court's decision.Google wins dismissal of US consumer lawsuit over mobile search | ReutersJohnson & Johnson (J&J) and Avon Products Inc. are both embroiled in legal battles over the alleged harmful effects of talc in their products, leading to significant financial and legal repercussions. J&J recently made progress in its efforts to resolve thousands of lawsuits claiming that its talc-based baby powder caused cancer. Over 75% of the plaintiffs have reportedly supported J&J's $6.5 billion settlement plan, which aims to address these claims through a pre-packaged bankruptcy filing. This plan follows J&J's history of legal challenges, including a previous $5 billion payout over similar allegations. Despite this support, J&J still faces hurdles, as its attempts to secure bankruptcy protection have been twice denied in New Jersey courts.Similarly, Avon Products Inc., known for its iconic beauty brand, has filed for Chapter 11 bankruptcy in Delaware due to the mounting costs of defending against talc-related lawsuits. The company is dealing with 386 individual cases and has already spent $225 million on legal fees and settlements. Avon's financial struggles have led to its bankruptcy filing, as it seeks a permanent solution to the increasing number of lawsuits. The company plans to sell its assets, with Brazil-based Natura & Co. offering to purchase Avon for $125 million and write off $530 million in debt.Both companies' legal strategies highlight the significant impact of talc-related lawsuits on their operations, with J&J seeking a settlement through bankruptcy court and Avon attempting to resolve its liabilities through a similar process.Avon Products Files for Bankruptcy to Wrangle Talc LawsuitsJ&J Gets Plaintiff Backing for $6.5 Billion Baby Powder AccordIn July 2024, OSHA proposed a new rule aimed at enhancing workplace safety by addressing heat-related hazards, which are the leading cause of weather-related deaths in the U.S. The rule, if enacted, would impact businesses with employees exposed to high temperatures, both indoors and outdoors. Key aspects of the rule include requiring employers to implement a Heat Illness and Injury Prevention Plan (HIIPP), which would mandate rest breaks, access to shade, drinking water, heat acclimatization procedures, and ongoing heat monitoring.One notable provision is the requirement for employers to provide a paid 15-minute rest break every two hours on days when the heat index reaches 90°F or higher. This has raised questions about how such breaks would interact with the Fair Labor Standards Act, particularly regarding overtime calculations. Additionally, following the recent Supreme Court decision in Loper Bright Enterprises v. Raimondo, which limits agency authority, there may be legal challenges to OSHA's ability to enforce such mandates.The proposed rule has yet to be published in the Federal Register, but once it is, the public will have the opportunity to provide feedback before it is finalized. OSHA has encouraged public participation to ensure the final rule effectively protects workers while being feasible for employers.OSHA Proposes Rule to Regulate Work Heat-Related HazardsIn my column this week, I discuss how applying the marketplace facilitator model, which has improved state sales tax compliance, could similarly enhance federal excise tax collection. Federal excise taxes, particularly on sporting equipment like fishing rods and archery gear, often go uncollected, especially when these items are sold online by foreign merchants. The Government Accountability Office (GAO) recently reported that this lack of compliance has resulted in significant revenue loss, funds that are crucial for wildlife conservation efforts.Currently, the responsibility to remit these taxes falls on the consumer, a system that is both confusing and inefficient. To address this, I advocate for legislation that would require online marketplaces like Amazon and eBay to collect and remit these taxes on behalf of consumers. This approach would simplify the process, ensuring more consistent revenue collection and leveling the playing field for domestic sellers who are currently at a disadvantage.Additionally, I propose that the IRS develop a centralized tax calculator accessible to these marketplaces. This tool would automate tax calculations at the point of sale, further reducing administrative burdens and ensuring accurate tax collection. An accompanying information campaign could also educate consumers on their tax obligations and the positive impact of these funds on conservation efforts.To implement these changes effectively, the IRS should consider launching a pilot program, similar to its Direct File initiative, to test the feasibility of this system. This streamlined approach not only promises increased compliance but also ensures that vital conservation projects receive the funding they need to thrive.Streamline Excise Tax on Sporting Equipment to Help Conservation This is a public episode. If you'd like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit www.minimumcomp.com/subscribe

In this episode we take a deep dive into the Chinese Exclusion Act of 1882, which provides the backdrop for our 2024 summer production of Comedy of Errors in Sanborn Park. We then continue with an interview with Melissa Mei Jones, director of Comedy of Errors, on what her experience was as a first-time director, and more importantly, her experience directing an AAPI-centric production--historically and personally. Sources: Royalty Free Music from https://www.fesliyanstudios.com National Archives--archives.gov Office of the Historian--history.state.gov Library of Congress--loc.gov Bill of Rights Institute--The Chinese Exclusion Act--Stephanie Hinnershitz NPR--As Chinese Exclusion Act Turns 135, Experts Point to Parallels Today--Kat Chow Calisphere--Chinese Exclusion Act Exhibition Leland Stanford on Chinese Exclusion--1889 Tour of San Francisco's Chinatown --- Support this podcast: https://podcasters.spotify.com/pod/show/svshakes/support

Between 1919 and 1961, pioneering Chinese American actress Anna May Wong established an enduring legacy that encompassed cinema, theatre, radio, and American television. Born in Los Angeles, yet with her US citizenship scrutinised due to the Chinese Exclusion Act, Wong—a defiant misfit—innovated nuanced performances to subvert the racism and sexism that beset her life and career. In To Be an Actress: Labor and Performance in Anna May Wong's Cross-Media World (University of California Press, 2024), Dr. Yiman Wang marshals extraordinary archival research and a multifocal approach to illuminate a lifelong labour of performance, creating critical study of Wong's cross-media and transnational career. Viewing Wong as a performer and worker, not just a star, To Be an Actress adopts a feminist decolonial perspective to speculatively meet her as an interlocutor while inviting a reconsideration of racialized, gendered, and migratory labour as the bedrock of the entertainment industries. This interview was conducted by Dr. Miranda Melcher whose new book focuses on post-conflict military integration, understanding treaty negotiation and implementation in civil war contexts, with qualitative analysis of the Angolan and Mozambican civil wars. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices Support our show by becoming a premium member! https://newbooksnetwork.supportingcast.fm/new-books-network

Between 1919 and 1961, pioneering Chinese American actress Anna May Wong established an enduring legacy that encompassed cinema, theatre, radio, and American television. Born in Los Angeles, yet with her US citizenship scrutinised due to the Chinese Exclusion Act, Wong—a defiant misfit—innovated nuanced performances to subvert the racism and sexism that beset her life and career. In To Be an Actress: Labor and Performance in Anna May Wong's Cross-Media World (University of California Press, 2024), Dr. Yiman Wang marshals extraordinary archival research and a multifocal approach to illuminate a lifelong labour of performance, creating critical study of Wong's cross-media and transnational career. Viewing Wong as a performer and worker, not just a star, To Be an Actress adopts a feminist decolonial perspective to speculatively meet her as an interlocutor while inviting a reconsideration of racialized, gendered, and migratory labour as the bedrock of the entertainment industries. This interview was conducted by Dr. Miranda Melcher whose new book focuses on post-conflict military integration, understanding treaty negotiation and implementation in civil war contexts, with qualitative analysis of the Angolan and Mozambican civil wars. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices Support our show by becoming a premium member! https://newbooksnetwork.supportingcast.fm/asian-american-studies

Between 1919 and 1961, pioneering Chinese American actress Anna May Wong established an enduring legacy that encompassed cinema, theatre, radio, and American television. Born in Los Angeles, yet with her US citizenship scrutinised due to the Chinese Exclusion Act, Wong—a defiant misfit—innovated nuanced performances to subvert the racism and sexism that beset her life and career. In To Be an Actress: Labor and Performance in Anna May Wong's Cross-Media World (University of California Press, 2024), Dr. Yiman Wang marshals extraordinary archival research and a multifocal approach to illuminate a lifelong labour of performance, creating critical study of Wong's cross-media and transnational career. Viewing Wong as a performer and worker, not just a star, To Be an Actress adopts a feminist decolonial perspective to speculatively meet her as an interlocutor while inviting a reconsideration of racialized, gendered, and migratory labour as the bedrock of the entertainment industries. This interview was conducted by Dr. Miranda Melcher whose new book focuses on post-conflict military integration, understanding treaty negotiation and implementation in civil war contexts, with qualitative analysis of the Angolan and Mozambican civil wars. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices Support our show by becoming a premium member! https://newbooksnetwork.supportingcast.fm/film

It's May7th. This day in 1882, Congress passes the Chinese Exclusion Act, aimed at curbing Chinese immigration as fears about Asian immigrants threatening White American jobs is on the rise.Jody, NIki, and Kellie discuss how the American economy relied on Chinese labor at the same time that policy sought to exclude Chinese immigrants -- and how the decades after the Civil War applied new pressures on race-based legislation around the country.This Day In Esoteric Political History is a proud member of Radiotopia from PRX.Your support helps foster independent, artist-owned podcasts and award-winning stories.If you want to support the show directly, you can do so on our website: ThisDayPod.comGet in touch if you have any ideas for future topics, or just want to say hello. Follow us on social @thisdaypodOur team: Jacob Feldman, Researcher/Producer; Brittani Brown, Producer; Khawla Nakua, Transcripts; music by Teen Daze and Blue Dot Sessions; Audrey Mardavich is our Executive Producer at Radiotopia

On this day in 1913, the California Senate passed a law restricting the property ownership rights of Asian immigrants.See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.