Podcasts about mqls

Good Friction vs Bad Friction in B2B Marketing: Stop Wasting Buyer EffortToo many teams removed every barrier and called it “buyer-first.” The result? Leaky funnels, vanity MQLs, and zero commercial insight. In this episode, we show how to use good friction to earn trust, capture context, and actually help buyers make better decisions (without annoying them).We (George Coudounaris & Kevin Chen) break down where friction belongs in your buyer journey, when gating makes sense, and how to turn forms, events, and content into useful market intel. We also dig into progressive profiling and cataloguing so Sales get timing, permission, and real-world context they can act on.We'll show standout moments like: why you should stop gating case studies, how to design “good friction” for community signups and workshops, and a simple green-yellow-red scoring method to fix bad friction fast.Tune in and learn:+ The difference between good vs bad friction (and how to spot each)+ When to gate (community, events, newsletters) and when not to (case studies)+ How to use progressive profiling to “catalogue” vendors, renewal dates, and permission to follow upIf you're a small B2B team, this episode is a must-watch. You'll walk away with a friction map you can fix this week, a scoring system to prioritise changes, and a smarter way to feed Sales with timing-based insights.-----------------------------------------------------

How can B2B marketers succeed when every deal involves 11 or more stakeholders?This special Hard Corps Marketing Show takeover episode features an episode from the Connect To Market podcast, hosted by Casey Cheshire. In this conversation, Casey sits down with Adam Needles, CEO and Co-Founder of ANNUITAS, Inc., to unpack the game-changing concept of Buyer Unit Demand (BUD). Adam challenges the outdated reliance on MQLs and ABM and introduces a new framework for engaging the full buying unit, with multiple stakeholders who have diverse roles and needs throughout the journey.He shares how marketers can design conversation tracks that align with real-world buying dynamics and explains why buyer-led orchestration, not sales-led tactics, is the key to driving meaningful engagement and revenue. Adam also discusses the organizational shifts and mindset changes required to fully adopt this buyer-first approach.In this episode, we cover:Why MQLs and ABM fall short in complex B2B buying environmentsHow to map conversation tracks around stakeholder needs and behaviorThe importance of aligning marketing, sales, and automation tools to the buyer journeyWhy focus beats scale when prioritizing content and engagement strategies

We're joined by guest Niall Sullivan to discuss why MQLs (at least the traditional way of defining MQLs) suck and how to shift to more demand gen and buyer-friendly marketing practices. We chat about: • Moving away from gating content and focusing on educating buyers• Measuring marketing's impact through pipeline and revenue metrics instead of MQLs• Showing more product details and UI to help buyers understand the value• Creating content that serves prospects, not just internal team needs• Setting proper expectations when making big marketing strategy shiftsNiall drinks a traditional British ale

Ashley Lewin has audited 30+ companies in her career and seen the same pattern: marketing teams stuck chasing MQLs while revenue stalls. In this episode, Carolyn and Trevor dig into Ashley's perspective on why MQLs keep organizations trapped in short-term thinking, and how she's applying those lessons now as Head of Marketing at Aligned.We talk through what it takes to stand up a marketing function from scratch at a hybrid PLG + sales-assisted company, why implementing HubSpot's Lead object was a foundational bet, and how “fail fast” disqualification changed the way BDRs and sales managers manage their pipeline. Ashley also shares her playbook for winning executive buy-in: showing CEOs a predictable growth equation that replaces lead volume with qualified pipeline and product activation.What You'll Learn:Why 30+ audits taught Ashley that MQLs create waste, not growth.How to split the funnel: PLG activations vs. sales-assisted pipeline.The power of clean infrastructure: standing up a true lead object in HubSpot.Why “fail fast” leads to better conversion, stronger feedback loops, and less waste.How to navigate culture change so sales isn't afraid to close lost.Why exec scorecards (not dashboards) determine whether change sticks.If your growth plan still relies on lead math, you're running on outdated assumptions. Ashley shows how to build a system that actually scales revenue, not just reporting.

If your outbound is optimised for meetings, not conversations, you're burning cash and trust.We sit down with Joey Gilkey (CEO, Titan X) and Adem Manderovic (Closed Circuit Selling, CRO School) to rebuild B2B outbound so it actually drives revenue. We unpack why the SDR-AE factory failed, how to get 25% connect rates, and how to use first-party signals to guide timing, ads, and follow up.Joey shows why he pays SDRs to create completed conversations and rigorous disposition buckets. Adem explains cataloguing and channel validation so marketing stops guessing and starts planning around real timing. We dig into audience activation using opt-in texts and VSLs, and why “buyer intent” data isn't the shortcut you think it is.Tune in and learn:+ A practical B2B outbound strategy built on conversations and 6 disposition buckets+ Why the SDR-AE model and Predictable Revenue broke outbound (and what replaces it)+ Why pipeline coverage and meeting quotas mislead teams, and what to measure insteadThis is a must-watch if you're a B2B revenue leader. Stop chasing low-value meetings and start engineering high-value conversations that inform ads, timing, and deals.-----------------------------------------------------

If your board asks “Why is pipeline down?” and your opportunity dashboards only say marketing-sourced vs. SDR-sourced (AKA the four-funnel model), you're stuck with surface-level data and left guessing at fixes instead of diagnosing the problem. The real story lives between engagement and opportunity, the unmeasured factory floor where prospecting happens (or dies). In this episode, Carolyn and Amber show how to rip the lid off that black box, swap vanity volume for "causal" metrics, and find the repeatable patterns that actually manufacture pipeline.Expect blunt takes, practical questions to bring to RevOps tomorrow, and real outcomes from teams who've made the shift (e.g., win rates jumping from ~13% to ~24% and easier budget approvals once the black box is illuminated).What You'll Learn:[02:20] Why “source” reporting hides the truth (and fuels misalignment)[08:00] The Pipeline Black Box: measuring the in-between (triggers → first meeting → opp)[15:00] Pattern-spotting: sequences that create pipeline vs. waste[17:30] Visual walkthrough: opening the black box[20:55] Prospecting as its own lifecycle: timing, activity load, DQs, velocity[26:10] From more leads to more lift (conversion, speed, win rate 13%→24%)[36:00] Turning visibility into stronger board stories & budget wins[38:25] 3 questions to expose your black box this weekWho This Episode ForCROs, CMOs, Demand leaders, and RevOps owners ready to graduate from MQLs/last-touch to a factory-style measurement system.

Whatagraph has evolved from a bootstrap marketing reporting tool to a comprehensive marketing intelligence platform processing data from 12+ sources for marketing teams globally. With over $10 million in funding and a decade of iteration, the Lithuania-based company recently launched "Whatagraph 3.0"—a fundamental shift from pure sales-led to hybrid PLG motion. In this episode of Category Visionaries, Justas Malinauskas shares the technical and strategic decisions behind their transformation from agency tool to enterprise marketing intelligence platform, including their multi-agentic AI implementation and the SEO strategy that generates 500+ MQLs monthly. Topics Discussed: Technical architecture evolution from reporting automation to full-stack marketing intelligence Strategic pivot from sales-led to hybrid PLG/sales-led motion triggered by mission misalignment Advanced SEO methodology using competitor pain point analysis and search behavior reverse engineering AI implementation using multi-agentic systems rather than simple LLM integration Lithuania's bootstrap-first ecosystem and knowledge-sharing networks among unicorn companies Go-to-market evolution across three distinct phases over 10 years GTM Lessons For B2B Founders: Engineer time-to-value as your primary PLG enabler, not feature breadth: Whatagraph achieved 5-minute time-to-value from data connection to dashboard generation—versus the industry standard of hours—by rebuilding their onboarding around AI-powered automation rather than manual drag-and-drop configuration. Justas notes this wasn't just UI optimization but fundamental product architecture changes: "It's basically a lot of knowledge from our last 10 years...we're able to build it like really multi-agentic platform which helps to build those things in steps, not just like drop something randomly." For PLG success, optimize your technical stack for immediate value delivery, not comprehensive feature exposure. Weaponize competitor technical limitations through content strategy: Rather than competing on generic "best marketing tool" keywords, Whatagraph dominated by creating authoritative content around specific competitor pain points. Their "Looker Studio being slow" content strategy captured high-volume searches from frustrated users by actually helping solve the problem while positioning their technical advantages. Justas explains: "The biggest problem was it's actually very slow...when we have everything in house we can make things like very quick and speedy compared to there." Target technical pain points your architecture inherently solves rather than fighting brand-to-brand keyword battles. Align your ICP strategy with your actual technical capabilities, not market perception: Whatagraph's shift to hybrid PLG wasn't market-driven but mission-driven. Justas realized their technical product could serve smaller organizations, but their sales-led approach artificially excluded them: "We were not empowering in the first place people, everyone to make those data driven decisions fast...we were not allowing everyone into the product even if our product was allowing to." Audit whether your go-to-market motion matches your product's actual technical capabilities and addressable market, not just your current revenue optimization. Build SEO moats through search behavior psychology, not keyword tools: Whatagraph's SEO dominance came from Justas thinking like customers in problem-solving mode rather than using standard keyword research. He reverse-engineered the complete buyer journey: "People go through a very much regular process...they search for a problem...find a blog post...find a product...competition...pricing...reviews...then actually buy the product." They attempted to own multiple touchpoints in this journey through strategic content placement across different domains. Map your customer's actual research psychology, not just search volumes. Implement freemium with full core functionality, not feature limitations: Whatagraph's new freemium tier includes their complete AI-powered report generation ("Whatagraph IQ") with only data source limitations, not feature restrictions. This approach lets small users experience the full product value while creating natural upgrade triggers as they grow. Justas notes: "All the core functionality...you're able to talk with your data within AI capabilities and ask questions about your data as you would pay a couple of thousands a month." Design freemium around usage scaling, not capability restrictions, to demonstrate full product value.   //   Sponsors: Front Lines — We help B2B tech companies launch, manage, and grow podcasts that drive demand, awareness, and thought leadership. www.FrontLines.io The Global Talent Co. — We help tech startups find, vet, hire, pay, and retain amazing marketing talent that costs 50-70% less than the US & Europe.  www.GlobalTalent.co   //   Don't Miss: New Podcast Series — How I Hire Senior GTM leaders share the tactical hiring frameworks they use to build winning revenue teams. Hosted by Andy Mowat, who scaled 4 unicorns from $10M to $100M+ ARR and launched Whispered to help executives find their next role. Subscribe here: https://open.spotify.com/show/53yCHlPfLSMFimtv0riPyM   

In this episode of GTM Live, Carolyn joins the Growth Activated Podcast as a guest to unpack one of the biggest blind spots in GTM today: what actually happens before an opportunity is created.99% of GTM teams still can't see this stage clearly. It's the “grey area” where SDRs and BDRs are grinding—sending emails, making calls, chasing signals, running sequences—all in the hope of booking a meeting that turns into pipeline.The problem? None of this activity is tracked in a clear, causal way. Leaders only see pipeline “sources” (marketing, sales, SDR), which hides the bigger story. Pipeline isn't a source—it's a chain reaction. A trigger sparks sales work, a series of events unfolds, and only some of those reliably convert to opportunities. Most of it? Invisible. That's why pipeline creation still feels like guesswork.Carolyn explains why source-based reporting and last-touch attribution keep teams stuck, and how to instrument the pre-opportunity “factory floor” with simple metrics that expose what's really working. Key Topics in this Episode:[00:10] Carolyn's journey: 4x Head of Marketing → CEO of Passetto[07:30] The Pipeline Black Box: why pre-opp activity is invisible[09:20] Using triggers to understand what really starts sales work[14:00] Inside the factory: connect rate, time-to-meeting, qual rate, DQs[22:40] Client insight: MQLs drain resources[27:50] KPIs to rethink: drop department-source, own pipeline as a system[30:45] For marketing leaders: accountability over defense[41:55] Annual planning: fight inertia, build visibility first[44:50] Where to find Carolyn & learn more about Passetto—This episode is powered by ⁠Passetto⁠, a GTM advisory and instrumentation software company with a solution that eliminates the Pipeline Black Box™, the critical data hidden inside every GTM engine where leaders are flying blind when it matters most.

Text us your thoughts on the episode or the show!In this episode of OpsCast, hosted by Michael Hartmann and powered by MarketingOps.com, we're joined by Ellie Cary, Senior Demand Generation Manager at StarTree. Ellie shares her experience navigating marketing performance challenges, including what happens when teams hit MQL goals but still face cuts, and why ROI visibility has become critical for MOps leaders.Ellie discusses the limitations of attribution and reporting, how over-engineered models can create complexity, and what it takes to simplify processes while improving impact. She also shares insights on customer marketing, retention, and how MOps professionals can make their work more visible and strategic across the organization.In this episode, you'll learn:How to connect marketing performance to business outcomesThe risks of overcomplicated attribution and how to simplify itThe importance of foundational marketing processes for measurable ROIStrategies for MOps teams to communicate effectively with non-technical stakeholdersThis episode is ideal for marketing operations, demand generation, and growth professionals looking to strengthen their impact and visibility in the organization. Tune in for Ellie's actionable guidance on making MOps work matter.Episode Brought to You By MO Pros The #1 Community for Marketing Operations Professionals Join us at MOps-Apalooza: https://mopsapalooza.com/Save 10% with code opscast10Support the show

This episode of the OnBase Podcast delivers a masterclass in building modern go-to-market strategies with ABM at their heart. Host Paul Gibson talks with Robert Norum about why a focused, account-based approach is no longer optional for B2B organizations—it's essential. Robert breaks down the journey from traditional, volume-based marketing to a sophisticated, tiered ABM model that aligns the entire organization.The conversation uncovers the most common challenges businesses face when adopting ABM, from securing leadership buy-in to managing expectations and moving beyond outdated MQL metrics. Robert provides a clear roadmap for success, emphasizing that ABM is not just a marketing tactic but a company-wide directive that unites sales, marketing, and customer success into a single, powerful growth engine.Listen to the full episode to gain the confidence and clarity needed to make ABM your primary GTM strategy.Key TakeawaysABM is the Go-to-Market StrategyFor enterprise organizations, ABM should be the central GTM strategy, not just another marketing program.Focus is EverythingAn account-based approach forces you to concentrate your budget, resources, and people on the accounts that truly matter..Alignment is Non-NegotiableSuccess depends on creating a "SWAT team" across sales, marketing, and customer success, all working toward shared account goals.Pilots Can Be a TrapTreating ABM as a short-term pilot is a recipe for failure; it requires long-term investment and commitment from the top down.Measure What MattersMove beyond MQLs and vanity metrics. Focus on moving the dial within target accounts, expanding your footprint, and creating real pipeline opportunities..Quotes"ABM is the glue that has the potential to really connect organizations and break down silos across different teams"Best Moments (04:37) – The Evolution of ABM: Robert discusses how ABM grew from a one-to-one approach for large enterprises to a scalable, multi-tiered strategy.(09:05) – The Case for Focus: Why concentrating on high-value accounts is the most critical decision a B2B business can make today.(20:12) – The Biggest ABM Challenge: The most common mistake companies make is diving in without defining what ABM means for their organization and getting leadership buy-in.(24:17) – The End of Silos: How an account-based approach fosters an equal partnership between sales and marketing.(30:50) – Winning Over Leadership: Strategies for building a compelling business case for ABM and getting the C-suite excited.(42:40) – The Role of AI: How AI will accelerate ABM, but human intelligence remains essential to brief, interpret, and quality-check the output.Resource RecommendationsBooks:Account-Based Marketing: The Definitive Handbook for B2B Marketers by Bev Burgess.Shout-OutsJon Miller - MarTech entrepreneur,Co-founder at Marketo and EngagioMarta George - Head of EMEA AMB Programmes, Ping Identity.Lianne O'Connor - Global Field & ABM Marketing Director, Fluke Corporation.Andy Johnson - Founder and Director of Client Strategy, HUT 3.Charlotte Graham-Cumming - CEO, Ice Blue Sky Corporation.About the GuestRobert Norum is a B2B Marketer with over 30 years experience. He has worked in magazine publishing, IT distribution, marketing agencies and for the last 20 years as an independent marketing consultant. During this time he has worked on brand, demandgen, channel, ecommerce and sales enablement. For the last 10 years he had specialised in ABM working with a number of leading agencies and directly for wide cross-section of global brands. Since 2017, he has delivered the ABM Essentials training course for B2B Marketing training over 750 marketing professionals in the process. Robert has also been the ABM and Demand Strategy Expert on Propolis since its launch.Connect with Robert.

Most GTM teamstoday are missing targets because they're simply measuring the wrong things. In this episode, Carolyn and Amber unpack why attribution is a mirage (it only shows the lucky 2% that become opportunities) and why the MQL hamster wheel keeps smart teams stuck optimizing a tiny slice of reality. We dig into the pre-pipeline “factory floor,” show how to expose the messy middle, and explain why “more volume” isn't a strategy—it's a cash leak.You'll hear concrete ways to replace vanity conversion stats with a causal view of attempts → connects → meetings → opps → DQs (with reasons), what to do about pipeline shock when you tighten scoring, and why pipeline needs a single owner (hint: not “marketing-sourced”). We also talk about modular change vs. big-bang transformations, and where attribution actually belongs (as seasoning, not the main ingredient), dig into where attribution actually belongs in GTM measurement (spoiler: it's seasoning, not the protein), and explain why modular change beats waiting for a full-scale transformation.What You'll Learn:Attribution ≠ answers: It validates the 2-5% that convert and hides the waste in the 98%.Kill the MQL hamster wheel: Measure the journey, not just MQL→SQL%.Instrument the factory floor: Person-level steps that predict pipeline (and the drop-offs to fix).Volume lies: “Do more dials” is a 2012 play—engineer repeatable patterns instead.Pipeline shock is healthy: Fewer junk opps → higher win rate and better CAC.One owner for pipeline: Align Sales + Marketing on quality pipeline, not credit.When to use attribution: After you fix data hygiene and pre-pipeline tracking.If your dashboards keep telling you to “get more leads” or “add more dials,” you're staring at the pipeline mirage. Break free from the hamster wheel, shine a light on the messy middle, and finally see what's really driving, or draining, your revenue.This episode is powered by Passetto, a GTM advisory and software company with a solution that eliminates the Pipeline Black Box™, the critical data hidden inside every GTM engine where leaders are flying blind when it matters most.

Most B2B revenue engines stall out. In this episode, we break down why — and how to build one that actually scales.Paul Perrett (CEO, Firmable) joins us with Adem Manderovic (Closed Circuit Selling, CRO School) to map ARR model, the 10-line economic engine, and why cataloguing and ecosystem activation beat brute-force outbound.We unpack how to work backwards from revenue goals, align Sales, Marketing and CS around market validations, and build compounding demand with brand and partners.Tune in and learn:+ The 10-line economic model behind a scalable B2B revenue engine+ How to replace MQLs with market validations and fix SDR incentives+ Ecosystem activation plays that compound trust and pipelineIf you're a B2B marketer in a small team, this is a must-watch. It's practical, numbers-first, and shows how to turn brand, SDRs, inbound, and partners into one working B2B revenue engine.-----------------------------------------------------

Scrappy ABM, hosted by Mason Cosby, welcomes bestselling author Leslie Venetz, who wrote Profit Generating Pipeline. Together they break down what it really means to find and grow your most profitable customers.Leslie challenges the mindset of chasing “cheapest” or “biggest” customers, showing why renewal, upsell, and long-term partnerships define true profitability. Drawing on her background in service-based and SaaS sales, she explains why sales and marketing teams must shift from quick wins to sustainable relationships.This conversation covers how to fix the marketing-to-sales handoff, why MQLs often miss the mark, and what it takes to operationalize personalization at scale. With practical strategies on ICP clarity, segmentation, and industry-specific campaigns, Leslie and Mason reveal how to move from spray-and-pray tactics to revenue strategies that actually work.

When small-market teams face off against deep-pocketed competitors, winning means rewriting the rules of the game. That's exactly what happened in Moneyball, where the Oakland A's turned to unconventional metrics and overlooked talent to outsmart the league's biggest spenders. In this episode, we explore the marketing lessons behind it with special guest Scott Greenwald, CMO at Linedata.Together, we dive into how B2B marketers can rethink the metrics that matter, compete asymmetrically against larger rivals, align teams around bold strategies, and tell stories that stick, all while staying credible, prepared, and ready to adapt.About our guest, Scott GreenwaldAt Linedata, Scott's tenure as Chief Marketing Officer has been marked by the successful leadership of a dynamic, multi-lingual team and the creation of transformative digital marketing strategies. Our efforts have resulted in a staggering 600% year-over-year increase in web traffic, contributing significantly to a 20% generation of the sales pipeline.Scott's role extends to overseeing the marketing budget and launching a new CRM and Marketing Automation tool, which has streamlined Linedata's pipeline review process and accelerated the sales cycle. With a focus on driving market visibility and thought leadership, Scott's strategic campaigns across key global markets have empowered Linedata to cement its presence in the competitive financial services industry.What B2B Companies Can Learn From Moneyball:Focus on the outcomes that matter.  In Moneyball, the point wasn't to sign the flashiest “five-tool” players; it was to score runs. The same is true in marketing. Scott says, “In the end, it's how many of the MQLs turn into opportunities or new business? And that's what we focus on.” Metrics that look good in a report mean nothing if they don't turn into real pipeline and closed deals. In B2B, your scoreboard isn't impressions or clicks, it's revenue.Credibility over volume in content. AI makes it easy to crank out more content than ever before, but more isn't always better. “If we suddenly increased our, our, our output fivefold, we, we would lose that credibility,” Scott says. His team uses AI to adapt and reformat high-quality core pieces, not flood the market with fluff. Your audience notices when your content is consistent, credible, and worth their time—and they notice just as fast when it's not.Compete asymmetrically. The A's couldn't outspend the Yankees or Red Sox, so they had to outthink them. That meant challenging every “sacred cow” in baseball and finding value others overlooked. Scott explains, “You can't come in here and say, I'm going to transform this marketing organization into what I had before… you have to assess the talent pool [and] review the best way of spending the marketing budgets you have.” In marketing, the same rule applies: when you can't match your competitors' budget, you win by rewriting the playbook.Quote“It is our responsibility as storytellers of not just giving the business what they want, but also giving the audience what they need to hear.”Time Stamps[00:55] Meet Scott Greenwal, CMO at Linedata[01:04] Why Moneyball?[06:45] Behind the Scenes of Moneyball[10:00] B2B Marketing Lessons from Moneyball[31:51] The Importance of Storytelling[37:18] The Role of Communication in Change Management[41:02] The Evolution of Marketing Automation[45:30] Balancing Content Quality and Quantity[47:00 Final Thoughts & TakeawaysLinksConnect with Scott on LinkedInLearn more about LinedataAbout Remarkable!Remarkable! is created by the team at Caspian Studios, the premier B2B Podcast-as-a-Service company. Caspian creates both nonfiction and fiction series for B2B companies. If you want a fiction series check out our new offering - The Business Thriller - Hollywood style storytelling for B2B. Learn more at CaspianStudios.com. In today's episode, you heard from Ian Faison (CEO of Caspian Studios) and Meredith Gooderham (Head of Production). Remarkable was produced this week by Jess Avellino, mixed by Scott Goodrich, and our theme song is “Solomon” by FALAK. Create something remarkable. Rise above the noise.

Text us your thoughts on the episode or the show!In this episode of Ops Cast by MarketingOps.com (powered by The MO Pros), hosts Michael Hartmann, Mike Rizzo, and Naomi Liu delve into one of the most discussed shifts in B2B marketing and revenue operations: the evolving roles of Marketing Qualified Leads (MQLs) and Marketing Qualified Accounts (MQAs).In this episode, you'll learn:Why the traditional MQL model may be falling short and where MQAs step in.How to realign marketing and sales around shared intent signals.Common pitfalls when transitioning from MQLs to MQAs (and how to avoid them).Practical advice on shifting measurement frameworks to reflect real buyer behavior.To unpack this timely topic, they're joined by two accomplished leaders in RevOps and marketing strategy:Andrea Frazier, Senior Revenue Operations Technical Consultant, is known for her expertise in building scalable systems and aligning sales, marketing, and data. What makes her presence special on this podcast is that she will be a part of the Mopsapalooza as a speaker.Jessica Fewless, VP of Marketing and Partnerships, has deep experience in ABM, demand gen, and full-funnel program strategy.Together, they challenge long-standing definitions of buying intent and discuss how teams can evolve from lead-focused metrics to account-based signals that drive more aligned, strategic growth.Tune in now, because whether you're in Marketing Ops, RevOps, or Demand Gen, this episode offers an expert-led perspective on what it means to qualify, measure, and act on intent in today's B2B environment.Check out our complete toolkit for helping you move from MQLs to MQAs!Episode Brought to You By MO Pros The #1 Community for Marketing Operations Professionals Visit UTM.io and tell them the Ops Cast team sent you. Join us at MOps-Apalooza: https://mopsapalooza.com/Save 10% with code opscast10Support the show

ABM is a trust engine, but building it right takes patience, sponsorship, and more groundwork than most expect. In this live episode of Scrappy ABM, host Mason Cosby sits down with Ryan Gunn and Amanda “Chuck” Palmarchuk for a full retrospective on an ambitious ABM program launched in late 2020.Together, they revisit a program that started with $0 pipeline after six months and ultimately influenced $7M within 18 months. They unpack what worked — executive sponsorship, a sharply defined target account list, and tightly documented operations — and where they'd hit rewind: overinvesting in tech, misaligned expectations, and the pain of forcing MQLs into a sales pipeline.Whether you're building ABM from scratch, stuck in the middle, or scaling with momentum, this conversation reveals both the early signals that matter and the long-game reality required to see real impact.

In this episode, we're joined by Sander van Gelderen, CMO at Effectory, an employee listening solution platform helping organizations measure and improve engagement, enablement, and productivity at scale, serving 700+ recurring customers across the Benelux, DACH, and now the Nordics. We spoke with Sander about how Effectory transformed from a project-based consultancy into a recurring revenue SaaS business and how his team is reshaping their go-to-market motion through Account-Based Experience (ABX). The goal? Closing the gap between marketing and sales, reducing waste, and targeting only the accounts truly in-market. Here are some of the key questions we address: What is ABX and how does it differ from ABM in practice? How do you unify marketing and sales targeting to remove friction? What were the warning signs that the traditional MQL model wasn't working? How do you implement ABX without losing velocity or your team's trust? What process and tech changes are required to make ABX work? How should marketing compensation evolve in an ABX world? What are the real trade-offs and pitfalls no one talks about?

Are MQLs really dead, or just evolving?In this episode of The Hard Corps Marketing Show, I sat down with Melissa McCready, Founder and CEO of Navigate Consulting Group. With decades of experience in marketing automation, customer success, and growth operations, Melissa is a recognized thought leader and award-winning expert in her field.Melissa unpacks the evolving role of MQLs and why they're far from obsolete. She explains how engagement scores and persona alignment still make them vital to marketing strategies when used correctly. We also explore the rise of growth operations as a strategic business function, the need for detailed AI implementation, and how leaders can stay ahead by embracing trends like generative engine optimization (GEO).In this episode, we cover:Why MQLs still matter, and how they're evolving, not disappearingWhat it means to train AI like a new team member using SOPs and expert inputWhy growth operations is broader than revenue ops and demands a seat at the tableHow early adoption of GEO can give you a competitive edgeWhy mentorship, community, and giving back elevate your career and credibilityIf you're ready to rethink traditional marketing operations and strategically prepare for an AI-powered future, this episode is full of actionable insights you won't want to miss!

In this episode of Executive Conversations, Maeva Cifuentes speaks with Dan Chapman, VP of sales and marketing at DocNow. Dan tells the story of walking into a startup that was generating one or two MQLs a month, then building a 90-day lead-gen engine that lit up the entire pipeline. He explains how owning both sales and marketing forces a single-funnel mindset, why every project must prove its revenue impact fast, and how he justifies brand spend by showing that one closed deal covers the cost. Dan shares his “north star” spreadsheet of thirty ranked experiments, describes hiring creatives who can tie design to bookings, and details how constant calls with reps eliminate silos. He also digs into measuring success with CAC efficiency, balancing short-term pipeline with long-term credibility, and adapting to buyers who either want total handholding or zero contact. The conversation is a blueprint for making marketing accountable without killing creativity.  

In this short segment of the Revenue Builders Podcast, we revisit the discussion with Shopify's CRO Bobby Morrison. We dive into the transformational "pod structure" they've adopted to align cross-functional teams more closely with customer outcomes. Drawing on lessons from his tenure at Microsoft, Morrison explains how Shopify's industry-specific pods streamline collaboration across sales, solution engineers, marketing, and customer success—leading to improved speed, accountability, and customer satisfaction. He also reveals how aligning incentives within these pods reduces internal friction and creates scalable, enterprise-grade execution. This episode is packed with strategic insight for CROs, sales leaders, and go-to-market operators aiming to drive operational efficiency and growth.KEY TAKEAWAYS[00:00:28] Shopify's shift to 16 industry-specific pods was designed to bring cross-functional teams closer to the customer.[00:01:00] Each pod includes sales, solution engineering, launch engineers, and partners all aligned around a single outcome.[00:02:00] At Microsoft, the team spent 70% of their time on internal orchestration, highlighting the inefficiency of siloed roles.[00:03:00] Shopify's pod structure includes defined primary and secondary roles with centralized responsibility and incentives.[00:03:49] All roles in a pod are measured against the same customer cohort, improving continuity and reducing disruption.[00:04:12] Morrison explains how aligning marketing with outcomes (not just MQLs) is helping Shopify eliminate interdepartmental friction.[00:05:00] Shopify is close to assigning at-risk compensation to marketing teams based on segment performance—creating real ownership.[00:05:49] The pod model drives faster decisions, stronger accountability, and less tug-of-war between siloed departments.QUOTES[00:01:00] "All aligned around a single outcome, which is helping our customers win."[00:02:39] "A sales rep could have as many as 87 different people they're working with internally to hit their objective."[00:03:49] "Now the pods are incentivized off of the same customer cohort."[00:04:59] "We're very close to assigning at-risk targets to our marketing team."[00:05:49] "Less tug-of-war that happens between siloed parts of the organization that have different KPIs."Listen to the full conversation through the link below.https://revenue-builders.simplecast.com/episodes/ai-driven-sales-innovation-with-bobby-morrisonEnjoying the podcast? Sign up to receive new episodes straight to your inbox:https://hubs.li/Q02R10xN0Check out John McMahon's book here:Amazon Link: https://a.co/d/1K7DDC4Check out Force Management's Ascender platform here: https://my.ascender.co/Ascender/

Laura Erdem, Sales Leader - Americas of Dreamdata, shares how sales and marketing teams can work together more effectively by focusing on shared business goals rather than forced alignment. Laura highlights the role of revenue attribution in helping marketers understand which activities are driving real impact, while acknowledging the complexity of measuring modern buyer journeys. She also discusses the value of correlation over time when it comes to linking marketing activities to revenue, and why simplifying processes and working closely with RevOps teams can help marketers feel more confident about their contributions to growth.Key Takeaways:(01:22) Sales and marketing alignment is about mutual respect, not friendship.(05:05) Creativity thrives when teams have time and space to experiment.(09:19) Marketing teams should collaborate with RevOps to understand impact.(13:10) MQLs need to connect to SQLs and revenue, not just impressions.(15:11) Attribution is often indirect; correlation over time is key.(18:03) Good data enables marketers to take accountability for revenue.(22:00) Using LinkedIn intentionally supports both sales and marketing goals.(24:46) Startup principles help enterprises achieve faster growth.(27:48) Transformation teams test ideas before full-scale execution.Resources Mentioned:Dreamdata websitehttps://dreamdata.io/Insightful Links:https://www.pecan.ai/blog/attribution-marketing-machine-learning/https://www.linkedin.com/pulse/communicating-marketings-impact-revenue-elevating-role-isaac-asendele/https://martech.org/new-attribution-challenge-understanding-marketing-sales-work-together/Thanks for listening to the “Marketing Leadership” podcast, brought to you by Listen Network. If you enjoyed this episode, leave a review to help get the word out about the show. And be sure to subscribe so you never miss another insightful conversation. We appreciate the enthusiasm and support from our community. Currently, we are not accepting new guest interview requests as we focus on our existing lineup. We will announce when we reopen for new submissions. In the meantime, feel free to explore our past episodes and stay tuned for updates on future opportunities.#PodcastMarketing #PerformanceMarketing #BrandMarketing #MarketingStrategy #MarketingIntelligence #GTM #B2BMarketing #D2CMarketing #PodcastAds

Why MQLs Are Broken (And What to Measure Instead)B2B marketers are under pressure to generate pipeline. But the truth is, most of us are stuck operating inside a broken GTM system that was never built for how buyers actually buy.In this episode, we're joined by Steve Patti — 7x CMO, 3x sales leader, and creator of the Brand Demand Expand framework — alongside Adem Manderovic, co-founder of CRO School and architect of Closed Circuit Selling.Together, we unpack why the MQL became marketing's biggest mistake, how misaligned incentives broke sales and marketing, and how to rebuild your go-to-market so it's actually commercially viable.Steve shares real stories — including how he used account intelligence to guide $200M in CapEx — and outlines the system he used to align sales, marketing, and product around real buyer needs.Tune in and learn:+ Why MQLs are based on “fantasy intent” — and what to track instead+ How to replace lead gen with real account intelligence+ What sales, marketing, and CS need to align on to win deals (and renew them)If you're a B2B marketer frustrated with misaligned GTM motions, noisy Martech promises, and the pressure to deliver pipeline from people not ready to buy — this episode is a must-watch.-----------------------------------------------------

Joelle Kaufman has been both a CRO and a CMO—and she's here to tell you: if sales and marketing aren't on the same page, you're leaving revenue on the table.  In this Huddles Quick Take, Joelle outlines the three most common mistakes CMOs make when trying to align with sales—and how to avoid them. From pipeline goals to budget tension to attribution battles, Joelle shares how CMOs can build better partnerships that actually drive revenue.  What You'll Learn:  3 alignment mistakes that keep marketing and sales at odds  Why obsessing over MQLs sends the wrong signal  How shared pipeline goals help unify teams  The real problem with attribution finger-pointing    For the rest of the conversation with Joelle, visit our YouTube channel (CMO Huddles Hub) or click here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=64XHb_E7UT4.  Get more insights like these by joining our free Starter program at cmohuddles.com.   For full show notes and transcripts, visit https://renegademarketing.com/podcasts/ To learn more about CMO Huddles, visit https://cmohuddles.com/

Welcome to Executive Conversations, where we dig into the gritty realities of leading modern marketing teams. In this episode, Maeva Cifuentes sits down with Janet Jaiswal, chief marketing officer at Blueshift and long-time marketing advisor. Janet unpacks why her team now owns 90 percent of pipeline, how she killed the vanity of MQLs in favour of BANT-qualified “stage 1” leads, and what it really takes to align marketing, sales and CS around the same revenue target. She explains the hidden CRM and training work that comes with that shift, the dangers of chasing efficiency before effectiveness, and why AI-powered search is rewriting the SEO rulebook. Janet also shares practical steps for surfacing in LLM results—from tweaking robots.txt to publishing Q&A-style content—and reveals how Blueshift is already closing deals that start with ChatGPT queries.

We sat down with sales legend Leslie Venetz and CRO School co-founder Adem Manderovic to untangle why outbound is still stuck in 2011—and how modern SDRs and BDRs can fix it fast.Outbound targets have never been tougher, yet teams keep blasting buyers with the same tired sequences. In this no-fluff chat, we unpack a buyer-first framework that swaps brute-force tactics for trust-led outreach and market validation.Tune in and learn:+ The “earn the right” test Leslie uses before every email or call+ How to rebuild SDR metrics around market validations - fast+ Why AI tools like Clay help only when you start with real buyer insightThis episode is a must-watch if you're serious about building a profit-generating pipeline without burning trust (or your team).-----------------------------------------------------

Tired of being seen as sales support? David Heyworth reveals how marketing leaders can break free from the order-taking trap and own the entire go-to-market motion. From building sales discovery teams that report to marketing to creating personalised experiences that win enterprise deals, David shares battle-tested strategies for transforming marketing from a cost centre into a revenue-driving growth engine. Learn why talking revenue (not leads) changes everything, how to build true sales partnerships, and the account-based selling approach that boosted conversions from 7% to 52%. Key Takeaways Stop talking leads, start talking revenue - Frame your impact as "$1M in pipeline opportunities" not "100 MQLs generated"Own the sales discovery process - Build SDR teams that report to marketing for full funnel controlBe in the room where it happens - Get marketing into weekly sales meetings as strategic partners, not vendorsAccount-based selling beats ABM - Focus on "us" outcomes, not just marketing campaignsListen with intention - Use "two ears, one mouth" to gather sales intelligence and customer insightsProve your model first - Start with sales champions, show results, then scale across the organisationCustomer intimacy is your B2B superpower - Direct customer engagement beats digital analytics every timeAI is your wingman, not your replacement - Use it to scale content creation and personalisation efforts Memorable Moments The "crickets" story: How poor event execution taught valuable lessons about sales alignmentThe Defence Coin case study: Creating meaningful, personalised experiences that cement relationshipsThe 7% to 52% conversion breakthrough: How rapid response transformed lead quality Who Should Listen: Marketing leaders frustrated with being seen as support functions, CMOs looking to drive revenue ownership, and anyone struggling with sales-marketing alignment in complex B2B environments. Subscribe to the xG Weekly Newsletter for weekly insights on B2B growth across APAC: https://xgrowth.com.au/newsletter

Key Links:Park & Battery: https://parkandbattery.comPark & Battery LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/parkandbatteryBBN | Agency X: www.bbn-international.com/agencyxThis episode Ed Davis rewinds the reel on Cannes Lions to ask whether the festival is finally judging B2B work on its own creative terms. His guide is Michael Ruby, fresh from the Croisette after Park & Battery's Roto-Rooter campaign became one of only a handful of pure-play B2B entries to make the Creative B2B shortlist.The vibe in CannesRuby describes a “whirlwind” first visit: endless content, dizzying networking and—crucially—a palpable momentum for business-to-business brands. With B2B entries up to 415 this year, he believes the new compliance checks have helped weed out thinly veiled B2C work and sharpen the category's focus on genuine business impact.Evolving judging criteriaBoth host and guest agree the jury is learning to look beyond clever execution to lasting impact. Ruby notes that the best-in-class entries marry creativity with commercial proof: not just impressions and clicks, but measurable shifts in buying intent or brand preference. Yet very few campaigns—his own included—are “culturally sticky” enough to be remembered in five years, a challenge he throws down to the industry.Behind the Roto-Rooter short-listerTurning America's best-known plumber into an emotional storyteller started with one insight: nearly half of small businesses never reopen after a major flood. From there Park & Battery pushed a long-trusted client to embrace talking toilets, wry humour and a budget-friendly regional media plan. Stakeholders bought in instantly—as long as every line stayed technically accurate for professional plumbers. Data, emotion and AIThe pair dissect the uneasy dance between performance metrics and brand building. Gartner still says 60 % of martech sits idle; Cannes jurors can hardly be expected to decode MQLs and SQLs, so agencies must translate data into clearly meaningful outcomes. On AI, Ruby sees a gulf between public bravado and private anxiety: smart teams are automating the menial to free humans for concept craft, while audiences begin to recoil at low-grade “AI slop”.Campaigns that raised the barBeyond his own work, Ruby highlights AXA's “Three Words” domestic-abuse clause, Spotify/FCB's “Song for Every CMO” (with just 14 hyper-targeted impressions) and Vaseline's TikTok verification series as benchmarks that blend purpose, precision and share-worthy storytelling.Advice for would-be Lion-tamers“Stop sitting on the side-lines.” B2B specialists have the craft, but must invest time and a modest budget in world-class case films. If Park & Battery can do it four years in, anyone can. The only real barrier is deciding to enter.

In this solo episode, Dan shares an evolved perspective on outbound strategies for boutique agency owners. Reflecting on lessons from the "Right Words to the Right People" workshop and client campaigns since, this episode offers a practical, human-centered approach to outbound that respects your time and builds real pipeline—without sacrificing trust or burning bridges.⏱️ Time-Stamped Breakdown00:00 – Why outbound often fails for boutique agencies02:20 – Why small wins in copy drive big results04:39 – The unique control and feedback loop outbound provides06:57 – Why most agency outbound tactics are broken from the jump09:21 – Enter the "trust recession" and how to sell like a human, not a marketer11:39 – How to define ideal client profiles (ICPs) the right way14:01 – The six key ingredients of effective outbound copy14:10 – Tribe-based kinship15:12 – Deep understanding and insider language16:21 – Show, don't tell authority cues18:38 – Timeliness and aligning with the calendar21:01 – Pattern interrupts that keep it horizontal, not hokey22:32 – De-risking the ask and giving people an easy yes23:20 – How to scale relevance without fake personalization25:43 – Outbound channels: why simpler may be smarter28:04 – Systems thinking: time blocking, trust, and the ops question30:21 – The real definition of “sales work” (hint: it's not just calls)32:43 – Supporting your new business person (or yourself) to succeed

From GTM Live:This week on GTM Live, Carolyn sits down with Megan Bowen, CEO of Refine Labs, to unpack why so many B2B companies are pouring budget into paid media, and still missing revenue targets.They break down what's really going wrong: not too much paid media, but too much spend on a strategy that doesn't convert. Pipeline is down. Revenue is down. And yet, the response is often to spend more, not better.You'll hear why performance marketing often fails to deliver real outcomes, how misaligned KPIs drive bad decisions, and what separates newer, agile companies from legacy players still running outdated GTM playbooks.Megan shares insights from working with dozens of growth-stage companies and how leadership mindset, speed of iteration, and willingness to challenge old assumptions can make or break your demand strategy.If you've been trying to defend paid spend, or wondering why results are flat despite doing “all the right things”, this episode is for you.Key topics in this episode:Why paid media often fails to convert to pipeline or revenueThe difference between new-school and old-school GTM teamsWhy optimizing for MQLs leads to the wrong outcomesHow to rethink measurement for real demand captureWhat high-performing growth teams do differentlyThis episode is powered by ⁠⁠Passetto⁠⁠. We help high-growth and equity-backed companies turn GTM data into better decisions, faster. We unify your GTM and financial data, identify your growth levers, and help you scale. Part SaaS, part advisory. Visit ⁠⁠⁠passetto.com⁠⁠.

This week on GTM Live, Carolyn unpacks one of the most deeply ingrained—but damaging—habits in B2B go-to-market: measuring success based on which department sourced the deal.While many marketing leaders know this approach doesn't reflect reality, changing it is hard, especially in legacy orgs with outdated attribution models, internal inertia, and leadership that still demands simple answers to complex questions.In this solo episode, Carolyn breaks down the real problem: measuring performance by team creates siloed decision-making, warped incentives, and misses what actually moves buyers through the funnel.You'll hear why the future of GTM performance measurement is about mapping buyer behavior across an interconnected journey, not slicing credit by department. And she shares the exact 5-part framework Passetto uses to help teams ditch "department-sourced" for something far more accurate and impactful.If you've ever struggled to prove Marketing's full impact, or if your exec team is still obsessed with MQLs and last-touch attribution, this episode will hit home.Key topics in this episode:Why “department source” attribution is outdated and misleadingThe real structure of a modern buyer journeyHow this model leads to misaligned KPIs and credit battlesWhy most GTM teams lack the data architecture to measure what mattersA new framework to measure engagement, prospecting, and sales as one integrated systemThis episode is powered by ⁠⁠Passetto⁠⁠. We help high-growth and equity-backed B2B SaaS companies turn GTM data into better decisions, faster. We unify your GTM and financial data, identify your growth levers, and help you scale. Part SaaS, part advisory. Visit ⁠⁠passetto.com⁠.

This week on GTM Live, Carolyn sits down with Megan Bowen, CEO of Refine Labs, to unpack why so many B2B companies are pouring budget into paid media, and still missing revenue targets.They break down what's really going wrong: not too much paid media, but too much spend on a strategy that doesn't convert. Pipeline is down. Revenue is down. And yet, the response is often to spend more, not better.You'll hear why performance marketing often fails to deliver real outcomes, how misaligned KPIs drive bad decisions, and what separates newer, agile companies from legacy players still running outdated GTM playbooks.Megan shares insights from working with dozens of growth-stage companies and how leadership mindset, speed of iteration, and willingness to challenge old assumptions can make or break your demand strategy.If you've been trying to defend paid spend, or wondering why results are flat despite doing “all the right things”, this episode is for you.Key topics in this episode:Why paid media often fails to convert to pipeline or revenueThe difference between new-school and old-school GTM teamsWhy optimizing for MQLs leads to the wrong outcomesHow to rethink measurement for real demand captureWhat high-performing growth teams do differentlyThis episode is powered by ⁠⁠Passetto⁠⁠. We help high-growth and equity-backed companies turn GTM data into better decisions, faster. We unify your GTM and financial data, identify your growth levers, and help you scale. Part SaaS, part advisory. Visit ⁠⁠passetto.com⁠.

Think LinkedIn is the place to reach technical buyers?Auvik CMO Susanne Rodriguez breaks down how her team built an insanely effective Reddit and Facebook strategy — yes, Facebook — to reach IT pros who dodge sales emails like it's their job (because it is).We're talking memes that convert, subreddits that slap, and how to avoid getting flamed by Reddit mods who smell B2B fluff from a mile away. You'll also hear how Auvik got dragged for a meme, owned it publicly, and came out stronger — a.k.a. how to market like a human.If you've ever uttered the words “we need more MQLs” while ignoring your company's meme game… this one's for you.

Are We Forgetting the Humans in B2B Marketing?In this episode of The Hard Corps Marketing Show, I sat down with Daniel Incandela, Consultant, Advisor, and Fractional Marketing Officer for several fast-growing companies. With a background in anthropology and a career built on the power of storytelling, Daniel offers a refreshing take on branding, creativity, and human connection in B2B marketing.Daniel challenges the obsession with performance metrics and argues that B2B brands must return to what truly moves people: stories, emotion, and authenticity. From crafting messaging frameworks to using AI to amplify impact, he shares how marketers can stay ahead without losing their humanity.In this episode, we cover:Why B2B marketers need to take branding seriously and break the “brand doesn't matter” mythThe messaging house framework Daniel uses to align teams and anchor a brand's narrativeHow B2C creativity can inspire B2B marketing strategiesThe danger of relying too heavily on sterile metrics like MQLs and SQLsHow thoughtful gift-giving and storytelling build better customer relationshipsIf you're looking to build a brand that's not just data-driven but human-centered, this episode is packed with ideas to elevate your strategy and inspire your team.

Refine Labs' General Manager Judy Sheriff is on today to walk through how and why you should implement Refine Labs' modern, tangible success metrics for your marketing team. Judy Sheriff shares her career story, starting with her entry into marketing in 2010, highlighting experiences with companies relying heavily on traditional metrics such as MQLs, and her eventual discovery of modern demand generation strategies. The conversation moves then into the critical juncture when she realized the necessity for change and her subsequent contributions at Refine Labs in guiding companies toward a comprehensive understanding of influence over direct tracking. Essential SEO keywords such as "B2B SaaS," "marketing measurement framework," and "demand generation" are explored throughout the episode.The episode also spotlights the impact of tools and strategies that have helped Judy develop successful frameworks in marketing. With Evan, they discuss the importance of simplifying dashboards and streamlining data processes for accurate measurement. Judy emphasizes the significance of aligning with sales and finance to drive effective change and discusses the potential over-reliance on AI in marketing. Episode topics: #marketing, #leadgen, #demandgeneration, #sales, #B2BSaaS, #digitalmarketing #measurement #metrics______Subscribe to Stacking Growth on Spotify and YouTubeLearn More About Refine LabsSign Up For Our NewsletterConnect with the guest:Judy SheriffConnect with the hosts:Evan HughesSteph Crugnola

"We need to stop forcing marketing metrics on the business MQLs, click-through rates, web traffic and start speaking the language of pipeline, bookings, and revenue. When marketers align their reporting with what the executive team actually cares about, they stop defending their existence and start leading the growth conversation.” Leslie Alore, SVP of Marketing at Flexera Marketing Impact Unlocked: Prove, Scale, and Strengthen Revenue Contribution. A practical framework for aligning marketing metrics with the outcomes your executive team actually cares about. In this episode of Revenue Boost, Kerry Curran sits down with Leslie Alore, SVP of Marketing at Flexera, to unpack one of the most urgent challenges facing B2B marketing leaders today: proving marketing's value in terms that drive boardroom decisions. Too many teams are stuck reporting MQLs while the C-suite wants pipeline, bookings, and revenue. Leslie shares how to shift from tactical metrics to strategic impact with a marketing contribution model that reframes the role of marketing as a core revenue engine not just a lead factory. You'll walk away with actionable strategies to: Align marketing language with executive priorities Measure contribution across pipeline creation, acceleration, and bookings Navigate complex sales cycles and partner motions with smarter tracking Earn trust by demonstrating marketing's real influence on growth Whether you're a CMO, VP, or revenue-minded marketer, this episode gives you the tools to elevate your seat at the table and scale marketing's business impact without fighting for credit.

Podcast Summary: The Community Code — Building Brand Loyalty Beyond the TransactionIn this episode, Sacha Awwa dives deep with Michael Puhala, Chief Community Evangelist at Khoros, a trailblazer in the digital community space. With over a decade at the forefront of online community innovation, Michael has helped some of the world's top brands—like Microsoft, Spotify, and Sephora—build thriving ecosystems that drive retention, loyalty, and long-term customer engagement.From the early days of gamer forums to the rise of AI-assisted support and ideation hubs, Michael unpacks how brands can turn passive customers into active participants. This episode is essential for marketers, CX leaders, and product teams who want to build customer relationships that last.Key Topics Discussed:1. The Evolution of Community StrategyWhy digital communities predate social media—and how they still matter moreFrom support channels to data goldmines: how community became strategicHow post-COVID dynamics revived the role of community in brand building2. Community as a Retention EngineWhy Sephora community members spend 2.5x more than non-membersThe difference between customer-to-brand and customer-to-customer engagementUsing forums and ideation to support loyalty, CSAT, and product development3. From Forums to FlywheelsHow brands like Zoom and Southwest scale support through communityThe power of community-driven SEO: 180-day payoff, long-term valueSuper users as volunteers, evangelists, and customer service amplifiers4. B2B vs. B2C CommunitiesThe surprising overlap between Spotify and ShopifyWhy use cases like support, ideation, and lifestyle education apply across sectorsCommunity KPIs: lifetime value, churn reduction, CSAT, and content generation5. Community & AI: A New FrontierWhy AI needs community more than the reverse—for nowSummarization, prioritization, and churn prediction: AI's real role in communitiesHow generative AI will transform federated search and product-embedded support6. Avoiding the Community PitfallsWhy “build it and they will come” doesn't workThe death of MQLs and the rise of behavior-based engagementWhy community is a long-tail investment, not a short-term marketing fixKey Takeaways for Founders & Marketing Leaders:Treat community like a listening channel—not a marketing oneThe first 90 days of a new community initiative are critical—don't wing itDon't treat community like a campaign; it's a flywheel, not a funnelCommunity members are your highest-value customers—invest accordinglySurround yourself with experienced community leaders from day oneFollow Michael Puhala's Work:

"If done right, AI will actually make us more human. It handles the busy work and surfaces real-time insights—so GTM teams can focus on what really drives revenue: building relationships, solving real problems, and creating long-term customer value." That's a quote from Roderick Jefferson and a sneak peek at today's episode.Hi there, I'm Kerry Curran—Revenue Growth Consultant, Industry Analyst, and host of Revenue Boost, A Marketing Podcast. In every episode, I sit down with top experts to bring you actionable strategies that deliver real results. So if you're serious about business growth, find us in your favorite podcast directory, hit subscribe, and start outpacing your competition today.In this episode, titled AI + EQ + GTM: The New Growth Equation for B2B Leaders, I sit down with keynote speaker, author, and enablement powerhouse Roderick Jefferson to unpack the modern formula for revenue growth: AI + EQ + GTM.We explore why traditional sales enablement isn't enough in today's landscape—and how real go-to-market success requires alignment across marketing, sales, and customer success, powered by emotional intelligence and smart technology integration.Whether you're a CRO, CMO, or GTM leader looking to scale smarter, this episode is packed with real-world insights and actionable strategies to align your teams and drive sustainable growth.Stick around until the end, where Roderick shares expert tips for building your own AI-powered revenue engine.If you're serious about long-term growth, it's time to get serious about AI, EQ, and GTM. Let's go.Kerry Curran, RBMA (00:01)Welcome, Roderick. Please introduce yourself and share your background and expertise.Roderick Jefferson (00:06)Hey, Kerry. First of all, thanks so much for having me on. I'm really excited—I've been looking forward to this one all day. So thanks again. I'm Roderick Jefferson, CEO of Roderick Jefferson & Associates. We're a fractional enablement company, and we focus on helping small to mid-sized businesses—typically in the $10M to $100M range—that need help with onboarding, ongoing education, and coaching.I'm also a keynote speaker and an author. I actually started my career in sales at AT&T years ago. I was a BDR, did well, got promoted to AE, made President's Club a couple of times. Then I was offered a sales leadership role—and I turned it down. I know they thought I was crazy, but there were two reasons: first, I realized I loved the process of selling more than just closing big deals. And second, oddly enough, I wasn't coin-operated. I did it because I loved it—it gave me a chance to interact with people and have conversations like this one.Kerry Curran, RBMA (01:16)I love that—and I love your background. As Roderick mentioned, he does a lot of keynote speaking, and that's actually where I met him. He was a keynote speaker at B2BMX West in Scottsdale last month. I also have one of your books here that I've been diving into. I can't believe how fast this year is flying—it's already the first day of spring!Roderick Jefferson (01:33)Thank you so much. Wow, that was just last month? It feels like last week. Where is the time going?Kerry Curran, RBMA (01:45)I appreciate your experience for so many reasons. One is that—like we talked about before the show—my dad was in sales at AT&T for over 20 years. It paid for my entire education. So we were comparing notes on that era of innovation and what we learned back then.Roderick Jefferson (02:02)Thank you, AT&T!Kerry Curran, RBMA (02:13)So much of what you talked about on stage and wrote about in your book is near and dear to my heart. My background is in building integrated marketing-to-sales infrastructure and strengthening it to drive revenue growth. I'm excited to hear more about what you're seeing and hearing. You talk to so many brands and marketers—what's hot right now? What's the buzz? What do we need to know?Roderick Jefferson (02:44)A couple of things. The obvious one is AI—but I'll add something: it's not just AI, it's AI plus EQ plus IQ. Without that combination, you won't be successful.The other big theme is the same old problem we've always had: Why is there such a disconnect between sales and marketing? As an enablement guy, it pains me. I spent 30 years in corporate trying to figure that out. I think we're getting closer to alignment—thank you, AI, for finally stepping in and being smarter than all of us! But we've still got a long way to go.Part of the issue is we're still making decisions in silos. That's why I've become a champion of moving away from just "sales enablement."Yes, I know I wrote the book on sales enablement—but I don't think that's the focus anymore. In hindsight, “sales enablement” is too myopic. It's really about go-to-market. How do we bring HR, marketing, product marketing, engineering, sales, and enablement all to the same table to talk about the entire buyer's journey?Instead of focusing on our internal sales process and trying to shoehorn prospects into it, we should be asking: How do they buy? Who buys? Are there buying committees? How many people are involved? And yes, ICP matters—but that's just the tip of the iceberg. It goes much deeper.Kerry Curran, RBMA (04:44)Yes, absolutely. And going back to why you loved your early sales roles—it was about helping people. That's how I've always approached marketing too: what are their business challenges, and what can I offer to solve them? In your keynote, you said, “I want sales to stop selling and start helping.” But that's not possible without partnering with marketing to learn and message around the outcomes we drive and the pain points we solve.Roderick Jefferson (05:22)Exactly. Let's unpack that. First, about helping vs. selling—that's why we have spam filters now. Nobody wants to be sold to. That's also why people avoid car lots—because you know what's coming: they'll talk at you, try to upsell you, and push you into something you don't need or want. Then you have buyer's remorse.Now apply that to corporate and entrepreneurship. If you're doing all the talking in sales, something's wrong. Too many people ask questions just to move the deal forward instead of being genuinely inquisitive.Let's take it further. If marketing is working in a silo—building messaging and positioning—and they don't bring in sales, then guess what? Sales won't use it. Newsflash, right? And second, it's only going to reflect marketing's perspective. But if you bring both teams together and say, “Hey, what are the top three to five things you're hearing from prospects over and over?”—then you can work collaboratively and cohesively to solve those.The third piece is: let's stop trying to manufacture pain. Not every prospect is in pain. Sometimes the goal is to increase efficiency or productivity. If there is pain, you get to play doctor for a moment. And by that, I mean: do they need an Advil, a Vicodin, a Percocet, or an extraction? Do you need to stop the bleeding right now? You only figure that out by getting sales, marketing, product, and even HR at the same table.Kerry Curran, RBMA (07:34)Yes, absolutely. I love the analogy of different levels of pain solutions because you're right—sometimes it's not pain, it's about helping the customer be more efficient, reduce costs, or drive revenue. I've used the doctor analogy before too: you assess the situation and then customize the solution based on where it “hurts” the most. One of the ongoing challenges, though, is that sales and marketing still aren't fully aligned. Why do you think that's been such a persistent issue, and where do you see it heading?Roderick Jefferson (08:14)Because sales speaks French and marketing speaks German. They're close enough that they can kind of understand each other—like ordering a beer or finding a bathroom—but not enough for a meaningful conversation.The core issue is that they're not talking—they're presenting to each other. They're pitching ideas instead of having a dialogue. Marketing says, “Here's what the pitch should look like,” and sales replies, “When's the last time you actually talked to a customer?”They also get stuck in “I think” and “I feel,” and I always tell both groups—those are the two things you cannot say in a joint meeting. No one cares what you think or feel. Instead, say: “Here's what I've seen work,” or “Here's what I've heard from prospects and customers.” That way, the conversation is rooted in data and real-world insight, not opinion or emotion.You might say, “Hey, when we get to slide six in the deck, things get fuzzy and deals stall.” That's something marketing can fix. Or you go to product and say, “I've talked to 10 prospects, and eight of them asked for this feature. Can we move it up in the roadmap?”Or go back to sales and say, “Only 28% of the team is hitting quota because they're struggling with discovery and objection handling.” So enablement and marketing can partner to create role plays, messaging guides, or accreditations. It sounds utopian, but I've actually done this six times over 30 years—it is possible.It's not because I'm the smartest guy in the room—it's because when sales and marketing align around shared definitions and shared goals, real change happens. Go back to MQLs and SQLs. One team says, “We gave you all these leads,” and the other says, “Yeah, but they all sucked.” Then you realize: you haven't even agreed on what a lead is.As a fractional enablement leader, that's the first question I ask: “Can you both define what an MQL and SQL mean to you?” Nine times out of ten, they realize they aren't aligned at all. That's where real progress starts.Once you fix communication, the next phase is collaboration. And what comes out of collaboration is the big one: accountability. That's the word nobody likes—but it's what gets results. You're holding each other to timelines, deliverables, and follow-through.The final phase is orchestration. That's what enablement really does—we connect communication, collaboration, and accountability across the entire go-to-market team so everyone has a voice and a vote.Kerry Curran, RBMA (13:16)You're so smart, and you bring up so many great points—especially around MQLs, SQLs, and the lack of collaboration. There's no unified North Star. Marketing may be focused on MQLs, but those criteria don't always match what moves an MQL to an SQL.There's also no feedback loop. I've seen teams where sales and marketing didn't even talk to each other—but they still complained about each other! I was brought in to help, and I said, “You're adults. It's time to talk to one another.” And you'd think that would be obvious.What I love is that we're starting to see the outdated framework of MQLs as a KPI begin to fade. As you said, it's about identifying a shared goal that everyone can be accountable to. We need to all be paddling in the same direction.Roderick Jefferson (14:16)Exactly. I wouldn't say we're all rowing yet, but we've definitely got our hands in the water, and we're starting to go in the same direction. You can see that North Star flickering out there.And I give big kudos to AI for helping with that. In some ways, it reminds me of social media. Would you agree that social media initially made us less social?Kerry Curran, RBMA (14:27)Yes, totally agree. We can see the North Star.Roderick Jefferson (14:57)Now I'm going to flip that idea on its head: if done right, I believe AI will actually make us more human—and drive more meaningful conversations. I know that sounds crazy, but I have six ways AI can help us do that.First, let's go back to streamlining lead scoring. If we use AI to prioritize leads based on their likelihood to convert, sales can focus efforts on the most promising opportunities. Once we align on those criteria, volume and quality both improve. With confidence comes competence—and vice versa.Second is automating task management. Whether it's data entry, appointment scheduling, or follow-up emails, those repetitive tasks eat up sales time. Less than 30% of a rep's time is spent actually selling. If we offload that admin work, reps can focus on high-value activities—like building relationships, doing discovery, and closing deals.Kerry Curran, RBMA (15:59)Yes! And pre-call planning. Having the time to prepare properly makes a huge difference.Roderick Jefferson (16:19)Exactly. Third is real-time analytics. If marketing and ops can provide sales reps with real-time insights—like funnel data, deal velocity, or content performance—we can start making decisions based on data, not assumptions or feelings.The fourth area is personalized sales coaching. I talk to a lot of leaders, and I'll make a bold statement: most sales leaders don't know how to coach. They either use outdated methods or try to “peanut butter” their advice across the team.But what if we could use AI to analyze calls, emails, and meetings—then provide coaching based on each rep's strengths and weaknesses? Sales leaders could shift from managing to leading.Kerry Curran, RBMA (17:55)Yes, I love that. It would completely elevate team performance.Roderick Jefferson (18:11)Exactly. Fifth is increasing efficiency in the sales process. AI can create proposals, contracts, and other documents, which frees up time for reps to focus on helping—not chasing paperwork. And by streamlining the process, we can qualify faster and avoid wasting time on poor-fit deals.Kerry Curran, RBMA (18:58)Right, and they can focus on the deals that are actually likely to move forward.Roderick Jefferson (19:09)Exactly. And sixth—and most overlooked—is customer success. That's often left out of GTM conversations, but it's critical. We can use AI-powered chatbots and virtual assistants to handle basic inquiries. That frees up CSMs to focus on more strategic tasks like renewals, cross-sell, and upsell.Let's be honest—most CSMs were trained for renewals, not selling. But cross-sell and upsell aren't really selling—they're reselling to warm, happy customers. The better trained and equipped CSMs are, the better your customer retention and growth.Because let's face it—we've all seen it: 90 days before renewal, suddenly a CSM becomes your best friend. Where were they for the last two years? If we get ahead of that and connect all the dots—sales, marketing, CS, and product—guess who wins?The prospect.The customer.The company—because revenue goes up.The employee—because bonuses happen, spiffs get paid, and KPIs are hit.But most importantly, we build customers for life. And that has to start from the very beginning, not just when the CSM steps in at the end.Kerry Curran, RBMA (20:47)Yes, this is so smart. I love that you brought customer success into the conversation. One of the things I love about go-to-market strategy is that it includes lifetime value—upsell and renewal are a critical part of the revenue journey.In my past roles, I've seen teams say, “Well, that's just client services—they don't know how to sell.” But to your point, if we coach them, equip them, and make them comfortable, it can go a long way.Roderick Jefferson (21:34)Absolutely. They become the lifeblood of your business. Yes, you need net-new revenue, but if sales builds this big, beautiful house on the front end and then customers just walk out the back door—what's the point?And I won't even get into the stats—you know them—about how much more expensive it is to acquire a new customer versus retaining one. The key is being human and actually helping.Kerry Curran, RBMA (21:46)Exactly. I love that. It leads perfectly into my next question—because one of the core components of your strategy and presentation was the importance of EQ, or emotional intelligence. Can you talk about why that's so critical?Roderick Jefferson (22:19)Yeah. It really comes down to this: AI can provide content—tons of it, endlessly. It can give you all the data and information in the world. But it still requires a human to provide context. For now, at least. I'm not saying it'll be that way forever, but for now, context is everything.I love analogies, so I'll give you one: it's like making gumbo. You sprinkle in some seasoning here, some spice there. In this case, AI provides the content. Then the human provides the interpretation—context. That's understanding how to use that generated content to reach the right person or company, at the right time, with the right message, in the right tone.What you get is a balanced, powerful approach: IQ + EQ + AI. That's what leads to truly optimal outcomes—if you do it right.Kerry Curran, RBMA (23:19)Yes! I love that. And I love every stage of your process, Roderick—it's so valuable. I know your clients are lucky to work with you.For people listening and thinking, “Yes, I need this,” how do they get started? What's the baseline readiness? How do they begin integrating sales and marketing more effectively—and leveraging AI?Roderick Jefferson (23:34)Thank you so much for that. It really starts with a conversation. Reach out—LinkedIn, social media, my website. And from there, we talk. We get to the core questions: Where are you today? Where have you been? Where are you trying to go? And most importantly: What does success look like?And not just, “What does success look like?” but, “Who is success for?”Then we move into an assessment. I want to talk to every part of the go-to-market team. Because not only do we have French and German—we've also got Dutch, Spanish, and every other language. My job is to become the translator—not just of language, but of dialects and context.“This is what they said, but here's what they meant. And this is what they meant, but here's what they actually need.”Then we dig into what's really going on. Most clients have a sense of what's “broken.” I'm not just looking for the broken parts—I'm looking at what you've already tried. What worked? What didn't? Why or why not?I basically become a persistent four-year-old asking, “Why? But why? But why?” And yes, it gets frustrating—but it's the only way to build a unified GTM team with a shared North Star.Kerry Curran, RBMA (25:32)Yes, I love that. And just to add—sometimes something didn't work not because it was a bad strategy, but because it was evaluated with the wrong KPI or misunderstood entirely.Like a top-of-funnel strategy did work—but the team expected it to generate leads that same month. It takes time. So much of this comes down to digging into the root of the issue, and I love your approach.Roderick Jefferson (26:10)Exactly. And it's also about understanding that every GTM function has different KPIs.If I'm talking to sales, I'm asking about average deal size, quota attainment, deal velocity, win rate, pipeline generation. If I'm talking to sales engineering, they care about number of demos per deal, wins and losses, and number of POCs. Customer success? They care about adoption, churn, CSAT, NPS, lifetime value.My job is to set the North Star and speak in their language—not in “enablement-ese.” Sometimes that means speaking in sales terms, sometimes marketing terms. And I always say, “Assume I know nothing about your job. Spell out your acronyms. Define your terms.”Because over 30 years, I've learned: the same acronym can mean 12 different things at 12 different companies.The goal is to get away from confusion and start finding commonality. When you break down the silos and the masks, you realize we're all working toward the same thing: new, long-term, happy customers for life.Kerry Curran, RBMA (27:55)Yes—thank you, Roderick. I love this. So, how can people find you?Roderick Jefferson (28:00)Funny—I always say if you can't find me on social media, you're not trying to find me.You can reach me at roderickjefferson.com, and you can find my book, Sales Enablement 3.0: The Blueprint to Sales Enablement Excellence and the upcoming Sales 3.0 companion workbook there as well.I'm on LinkedIn as Roderick Jefferson, Instagram and Threads at @roderick_j_associates, YouTube at Roderick Jefferson, and on BlueSky as @voiceofrod.Kerry Curran, RBMA (28:33)Excellent. I'll make sure to include all of that in the show notes—I'm sure this episode will have your phone ringing!Thank you so much, Roderick. I really appreciate you taking the time to join us. This was valuable for me, and I'm sure for the audience as well.Roderick Jefferson (28:40)Ring-a-ling—bring it on! Let's dance. Thank you again. This was an absolute honor, and I'm glad we got the chance to reconnect, Kerry.Kerry Curran, RBMA (28:59)For sure. Thank you—you too.Roderick Jefferson (29:01)Take care, all.Thanks for tuning in. If you're struggling with flat or slowing revenue growth, you're not alone. That's why Revenue Boost: A Marketing Podcast brings you expert insights, actionable strategies, and real-world success stories to help you scale faster.If you're serious about growth, search for us in your favorite podcast directory. Hit follow or subscribe, and leave a five-star rating—it helps us keep the game-changing content coming.New episodes drop regularly. Don't let your revenue growth strategy fall behind. We'll see you soon!

The CEO's Strategic Growth Edge: A Go-To-Market System That Scales“You don't need more leads—you need clarity. Clarity on where your business can grow the most, the fastest, and at the highest margin. That's what a real go-to-market system delivers. It's not about volume anymore—it's about alignment, focus, and making sure every team—marketing, sales, and customer success—is executing toward the same outcome. That's how CEOs scale with confidence.” That's a quote from Sangram Vajre, and a sneak peek at today's episode.Welcome to Revenue Boost: A Marketing Podcast. I'm your host, Kerry Curran—revenue growth expert, industry analyst, and relentless advocate for turning marketing into a revenue engine. Each episode, we bring you the strategies, insights, and conversations that help drive your revenue growth. So search for Revenue Boost in your favorite podcast directory and hit subscribe to stay ahead of the game.In The CEO's Strategic Growth Edge: A Go-to-Market System That Scales, I'm joined by bestselling author and GTM expert Sangram Vajre to discuss why go-to-market isn't a marketing tactic—it's a CEO-level growth system. In this episode, you'll learn the three phases every business must navigate to scale, why alignment beats activity in every growth stage, how CEOs can drive clarity, trust, and margin-focused decisions across teams, and why AI is only a threat if you're still riding the demand-gen horse.If you're a growth-minded CEO or exec, this episode gives you the roadmap and the mindset to scale faster, smarter, and stronger. Be sure to listen through to the end, where Sangram shares three key tips—his ultimate advice for any leader ready to level up their go-to-market strategy. Let's go!Kerry Curran, RBMA (00:00.77)So welcome, Sangram. Please introduce yourself and share a bit about your background and expertise.Sangram Vajre (00:06.992)Well, at the highest level, I feel like I've had the opportunity to be in the B2B space for the last two decades and have had a front-row seat to categories that have shaped how we think about go-to-market. I ran marketing at Pardot. We were acquired by ExactTarget and then Salesforce—that was a $2.7 billion acquisition. It was a huge shift in mindset, going from a $10 million company to a $10 billion one, and I learned a lot.I became a student of go-to-market, if you will. That was in the marketing automation space. Then I launched a company called Terminus, which has been acquired twice now. Along the way, I've written three books. The one we're going to talk a lot about is MOVE, which became a Wall Street Journal bestseller. That book has created a lot of opportunities and work for us.I walked into writing this book, Kerry, thinking I knew go-to-market because I had two $100M+ exits. But I walked out of the process a student of go-to-market because I learned so much. Writing it forced me to talk to folks like Brian Halligan, the CEO of HubSpot, and partners at VC firms who have seen 200 exits—not just the three I've experienced.It really expanded my vision. Now I lead a company called Go-To-Market Partners. We're a research and advisory firm focused on helping companies understand who owns go-to-market and how to run it at a transformational level. Our clients are primarily CEOs and executive teams. That's our focus.Kerry Curran, RBMA (01:46.094)Excellent. Well, I'm very excited to dive in. I first saw you speak at Inbound last fall, and what really resonated with me was the shift from just an ABM program to a company-wide GTM program—one that includes everything from problem-market fit all the way to customer success, loyalty, and retention. Really making GTM the core of revenue growth.So I'd love for you to dive in and share that framework and background.Sangram Vajre (02:23.224)Yeah. And by the way, for people who've never attended Inbound—you should. I've spoken there for eight years straight and always try to bring new ideas. Each year, they keep giving me more opportunities—from main stage to workshops. I think you attended the 90-minute workshop, right? Hopefully it wasn't boring!Kerry Curran, RBMA (02:48.61)Yeah, it was excellent. I love this stuff, so I was taking lots of notes.Sangram Vajre (02:52.814)That was fun. The whole idea was: how can you build your entire go-to-market strategy on a single slide? Now, people might think, “There's no way—you need way more detail.” But it's not about making it complete; it's about making it clear.So everyone can be aligned. For example, in the operating system we've developed, we write research about it every Monday in a newsletter called GTM Monday, read by 175,000 people. The eight pillars are based on the most important questions. And Kerry, I don't know if you'll agree, but I think I've done a disservice for two decades by asking the wrong question.Like, I used to ask, “Where can we grow?”—which sounds smart but is actually foolish. The better question is, “Where can we grow the most, the fastest, the best, at the highest margin?” That's the true business perspective. So the operating system is built around these eight essential questions.If every executive team can align on these—not with certainty, but with clarity—then they can gain a clear understanding of what they're doing, where they're going, who their ICP is, what bets they're making, and which motions to pursue. I've done this over a thousand times with executive teams, helping them build their entire go-to-market strategy on a single slide. And it's like a lightbulb moment for them: “Okay, now I know what bets we're making and how my team is aligned.” It's a beautiful thing.Kerry Curran, RBMA (04:50.988)Yeah, because that's one of the hardest challenges across business strategy and growth: where to invest, where to lean in. So bring us through the questions and framework.Sangram Vajre (05:01.688)Yeah. So the first one is “Where can you grow the most?” The second one is really about what we call the Market Investment Map. I'll give you maybe three or four so people can get an idea. The Market Investment Map is especially useful for companies with more than one product or more than one segment. This is the least used but most valuable framework companies should be using.You might remember from the Inbound talk—I used HubSpot as an example since I was speaking at Inbound. It's interesting because at my last company, Terminus, we acquired five companies in eight years. So we had to learn this process. The Market Investment Map is about matching your best segments to the best products to create the highest-margin offering.If your entire business focuses only on pipeline and revenue—which sounds right—you're actually focused on the wrong things. You may have seen people post on LinkedIn saying, “I generated $10 million in pipeline,” and then a month later, they're laid off. Why? Because that pipeline didn't matter. It might have been general pipeline, but if you looked at pipeline within your ICP—the customers your company really needs to close, retain, and expand—it might have only been half a million. That's not enough to sustain growth or justify your role.So, understanding the business is critical. It's not just about understanding marketing skills like demand gen, content, or design. Those are table stakes. You need to understand the business of marketing—how the financials work, how to drive revenue, and how to say, “Yeah, we generated $10 million in pipeline, but only half a million was within ICP, so it won't convert or drive the margin we need.” That level of EQ and IQ is what leaders need today.Our go-to-market operating system goes deep into areas like this.Kerry Curran, RBMA (07:31.022)And I love the alignment with the ICP. I'm sure you'll get deeper into that. I also know you talk about getting rid of MQLs because the real focus should be on getting closer to the ICP—on who's actually going to drive revenue.Sangram Vajre (07:45.892)Yeah. John Miller, a good friend who co-founded Marketo, has been writing about this too. I was the CMO of Pardot. Then we both built ABM companies—I built Terminus; he built Engagio, which is now part of Demandbase. We've been evangelizing the idea of efficient marketing machines for the last two decades.We're coming full circle now. That approach made sense in the “growth at all costs” era. But in this “efficient growth” era, everything can be measured. The dark funnel is real. AI can now accelerate your team's output and throughput. So we have to go back to first principles—what do your customers really want?I was in a discussion yesterday with executives and middle managers, and the topic of AI came up. Some were worried it would take their jobs. And I said, “Yes, it absolutely will—and it should.” I gave the example I wrote about recently: imagine you were the best horseman, with saddles, barns, and a generational business built around horses. Then Henry Ford comes along with four wheels. You just lost your job—not because you were bad, but because you got infatuated with the horse, not with your customer's need to get from point A to point B.Horses did that—it was better than walking. But then came cars, trains, airplanes. Business evolves. If you focus on your customers' needs—better, faster, cheaper—you'll always be excited about innovation rather than afraid of it. So yes, AI will replace anyone who stays on their horse. If you're riding the demand gen horse or relying only on content creation, a lot is going to change. Get off the horse, refocus on customer needs, and figure out how to move your business forward.Kerry Curran, RBMA (10:21.708)Yeah. So talk a bit about honing in on the ICP. I know in one of the sessions you asked, “Who's your target audience?” And of course, there was one guy in the front row who said, “Everyone,” and we all laughed. But I still hear that all the time. Talk about how important it is, to your point, to know your customer and get obsessed with what they need.Sangram Vajre (10:45.56)Yeah. So the first pillar of the go-to-market operating system is called TRM, or Total Relevant Market. We introduced that in the book MOVE for the first time. It's a departure from TAM—Total Addressable Market—which is what that guy in the front row was referring to during that session. It was epic, and I think he was a sales leader, so it was even funnier in a room full of marketers.But it's true—and real. He was being honest, and I appreciated that. The reality is, we've all been conditioned to focus on more and more—bigger and bigger markets. That makes sense if you have unlimited funds and can raise money. It makes sense if the market is huge and you're just trying to get in and have more people doing outbound.As a matter of fact, a few weeks ago, we did a session where someone said something profound that I'll never forget. He said, “The whole SDR function is a feature bug in the VC model.” That was fascinating—because the whole SDR model was built to get as many leads as possible, assign 22-year-olds to make cold calls, and push them to AEs.We built this because it worked on a spreadsheet. If we generate 1,000 leads, we need 50 callers to convert them. It's math. But nobody really tried to improve it because we had the money. Now we're in a different world. We have clients doing $10–15 million in revenue with five-person teams automating so much.People don't read as many automated emails. My phone filters out robocalls, so I never pick up unless it's someone I know. Non-personalized emails go into a folder I never open. Yet people keep sending thousands of them, thinking it works.For example, I send our GTM Monday newsletter via Substack. It's free for readers, and it's free for me to send—even to 175,000 people. Meanwhile, marketers spend thousands every time they email their list using legacy tools. Why? Because these people haven't opted in to be part of the journey the way Substack subscribers have.The market has changed. Buying big marketing automation tools for $100,000 is going to change drastically. Fractional leaders and agencies will thrive because what CEOs really need is people like you—and frameworks like a go-to-market operating system—to guide them. You and I have the gray hair and battle scars to prove it. What matters now is using a modern framework, implementing it, and measuring outcomes differently.Kerry Curran, RBMA (14:08.11)Yeah, you bring up such a valid point. In so many of my conversations, I see the same thing. It's been a sales-led growth strategy for years. Investments went to sales—more BDRs, more cold emails, more tech stack partners.Even as I was starting my consultancy, I'd talk to partners or prospects who'd say, “Well, we just hired more salespeople. We want to see how that goes.” But to your point, without the foundational framework—without targeting the right audience—you're just spinning your wheels on volume.Sangram Vajre (15:06.318)Exactly. One area we emphasize in our go-to-market operating system is differentiation. Everyone's doing the same thing. Let me give you an example. Last week, I looked at a startup's email tool that reads your emails and drafts responses automatically. Super interesting. I use Superhuman for email.Two days later, Superhuman sent an email saying they'd launched the exact same feature. So this startup spent time and money building a feature, and Superhuman—already with a huge user base—replicated and launched it instantly. That startup is out of business.With AI, product development is lightning fast. So product is no longer your differentiator. Your differentiation now is how you tell your story, how quickly you grab attention, how well you build and maintain a community. That becomes your moat. Those first principles matter more than ever. Product is just table stakes now.Kerry Curran, RBMA (16:33.878)Right. And connecting that to your marketing strategy, your communication, your messaging—it also sets up your sales team to close faster. By the time a prospect talks to a rep, your marketing has already educated them on your differentiation. So talk more about the stages and what companies need to keep in mind when applying your go-to-market framework.Sangram Vajre (17:07.482)One of the things we mention in the book—and go really deep into in our operating system—is this 3P format: Problem-Market Fit, Product-Market Fit, and Platform-Market Fit. We believe these are the three core stages of a business. I experienced them firsthand at Pardot, Salesforce, and Terminus through multiple acquisitions.If you remember, I always talk about the “squiggly line,” because no company grows up and to the right in a straight line. If you look at daily, weekly, or monthly insights, there are dips—just like a stock market chart. So the squiggly line shows you can go from Problem to Product, but you'll experience a dip. That's normal and natural. Same thing when you go from Product to Platform—you hit a dip. Those dips are what we call the “valleys of death.”Some companies overcome those valleys and cross the chasm, and others don't. Why? Because at those points, they discover they can market and sell, but they can't deliver. Or maybe they can deliver, but they can't renew. Or maybe they can renew but not expand. Each gap becomes a value to fix in the system.And it's hard. I've gone from $5 million to $10 million to $15 million, all the way to $100 million in revenue—and every 5 to 10 million increment brings a new set of challenges. You think you've got it figured out, and then you don't—because everything else has to change with scale.I'll never forget one company I was on the board of—unfortunately, it didn't make it. The CEO was upset because they were doing $20 million in revenue but didn't get the valuation they wanted. Meanwhile, a competitor doing only $5 million in revenue in the same space got a $500 million valuation. Why? Because the $20M company was doing tons of customization—still stuck in Problem-Market Fit. The $5M company had reached Product-Market Fit and was far more efficient. Their operational costs were lower, and their NRR was over 120%.If you've read some of my research, you know I'm all in on NRR—Net Revenue Retention—as the #1 metric. If you get NRR above 120%, you'll double your revenue in 3.8 years without adding a single new customer. That's what executives should focus on.That's why we say the CEO owns go-to-market. All our research shows that if the CEO doesn't own it, you'll have a really hard time scaling.Kerry Curran, RBMA (20:23.992)That makes so much sense, because everything you're talking about—while it includes marketing functions—is really business strategy. It needs to be driven top-down. It has to be the North Star the whole company is paddling toward.I've been in organizations where that's not the case. And as you said, leadership has to have the knowledge and strategic awareness to navigate those pivots—those valleys of death. So talk about how hard it is to bring new frameworks into an organization and the change management that comes with that. As you evangelize the idea that the CEO owns GTM, what's resonating most with them?Sangram Vajre (21:26.456)Great question. First of all, CEOs who get it—they love it. The people who struggle most are actually CMOs and CROs because they feel like they should be the ones owning go-to-market. And while their input is critical, they can't own it entirely.In all our advisory work, Kerry, we mandate two things:The CEO must be in the room. We won't do an engagement without that. The executive team must be involved. We don't do one-on-one coaching—because transformation happens in teams.People often get it wrong. They think, “We need better ICP targeting, so that's marketing's job.” Or, “We need pipeline acceleration—let sales figure that out.” Or, “We have a retention issue—fire the CS team.” No. The problem isn't a department issue—it's a process and team issue.The CEO is the most incentivized person to bring clarity, alignment, and trust—the three pillars of our GTM operating system. They're the ones sitting in all the one-on-one meetings, burning out from the lack of alignment. The challenge is most CEOs don't know what it means to own GTM. It feels overwhelming.So we help them reframe that. Owning doesn't mean running GTM. It means orchestrating clarity, alignment, and trust. Every meeting they lead should advance one of those. That's the job. When the ICP is agreed upon, marketing should be excited to generate leads for it. Sales should be eager to follow up. CS should be relieved they're not getting misaligned customers. That's leadership. And there's no one more suited—or incentivized—to lead that than the CEO.Kerry Curran, RBMA (24:08.11)Absolutely. And the CFO plays a key role too—holding the purse strings, understanding where the investments should go.Sangram Vajre (24:20.622)Yes. In fact, in the book and in our research, we emphasize the importance of RevOps—especially once a company reaches Product-Market Fit and moves toward Platform-Market Fit.If you're operating across multiple products, segments, geographies, or using multiple GTM motions, the RevOps leader—who often reports to the CFO or CEO—becomes critical. I'd say they're the second most important person in the company from a strategy standpoint.Why? Because they're the only ones who can look at the whole picture and say, “We don't need to spend more on marketing; we need to fix the sales process.” A marketing leader won't say that. A sales leader won't say that. You need someone who can objectively assess where the real bottleneck is.Kerry Curran, RBMA (25:17.836)Yeah, that definitely makes so much sense. Are there other areas—maybe below the executive team—that help educate the company from a change management perspective to gain buy-in? Or is it really a company-wide change?Sangram Vajre (25:33.742)Yeah, you mentioned ABM earlier. Having written a few books on ABM and building Terminus, we've seen thousands of companies go through transformation. We now have over 70,000 students who've gone through our courses. I love getting feedback.What's interesting is that ABM has been great for aligning sales and marketing—but it hasn't transformed the company. Go-to-market is not a marketing or sales strategy. It's a business strategy. It has to bring in CS, product, finance—everyone.Where companies often fail is by looking at go-to-market too narrowly—like it's just a product launch or a sales campaign. That's way too myopic. Those companies burn a lot of cash.At the layer below the executive team, it gets harder because GTM is fundamentally a leadership-driven initiative. An SDR, AE, or director of marketing typically doesn't have the incentive—or business context—to drive GTM change. But they should get familiar with it.That's why we created the GTM Operating System certification. Hundreds of professionals have gone through it—including you! And now people are bringing those frameworks into leadership meetings.They'll say, “Hey, let's pull up the 15 GTM problems and see where we're stuck.” Or, “Let's revisit the 3 Ps—where are we today?” Or use one of the assessments. It's pretty cool to see it in action.Kerry Curran, RBMA (27:35.758)Yeah, and it's extremely valuable. I love that it's a tool that helps drive company-wide buy-in and educates the people responsible for the actions. So you've shared so many great frameworks and recommendations. For those listening, what's the first step to get started? What would you recommend to someone who's thinking, “Okay, I love all of this—I need to start shifting my organization”?Sangram Vajre (28:09.082)First, you have to really understand the definition of go-to-market. It's a transformational process—not a one-and-done. It's not something you define at an offsite and then forget. It's not owned by pirates. It's iterative. It happens every day.Second, the CEO has to be fully bought in. If they don't own it, GTM will run them. If you're a CEO and you feel overwhelmed, that's usually why—you're running go-to-market, not owning it.Third, business transformation happens in teams. If you try to build a GTM strategy in a silo—as a marketer, for example—it will fail. The best strategies never see the light of day because the team isn't behind them. In GTM, alignment matters more than being right.Kerry Curran, RBMA (29:27.982)Excellent. I love this so much. Thank you! How can people find you and learn more about the GTM Partners certification and your book?Sangram Vajre (29:37.476)You can go to gtmpartners.com to get the certification. Thousands of people are going through it, and we're constantly adding new content. We're about to launch Go-To-Market University to add even more courses.We also created the MOVE Book Companion, because we're actually selling more books now than when it first came out three years ago—which is crazy!Then there's GTM Monday, our research newsletter that 175,000 people read every week. Our goal is to keep building new frameworks and sharing what's possible. Things are changing so fast—AI, GTM tech, everything. But first principles still apply. That's why frameworks matter more than ever.You can't just ask ChatGPT to “give me a go-to-market strategy” and expect it to work. It might give you something beautifully written, but it won't help you make money. You need frameworks, team alignment, and process discipline.And I post about this every day on LinkedIn—so follow me there too!Kerry Curran, RBMA (30:54.988)Excellent. Well, thank you so much. This has been a great conversation, and I highly recommend the book and the certification to everyone. We'll include all the links in the show notes.Thank you, Sangram, for joining us today!Sangram Vajre (31:09.284)Kerry, you're a fantastic host. Thank you for having me.Kerry Curran, RBMA (31:11.854)Thank you very much.Thanks for tuning in to Revenue Boost: A Marketing Podcast. I hope today's conversation sparked some new ideas and challenged the way you think about how your organization approaches go-to-market and revenue growth strategy. If you're serious about turning marketing into a true revenue driver, this is just the beginning. We've got more insightful conversations, expert guests, and actionable strategies coming your way—so search for us in your favorite podcast directory and hit subscribe.And hey, if this episode brought you value, please share it with a colleague or leave a quick review. It helps more revenue-minded leaders like you find our show. Until next time, I'm Kerry Curran—helping you connect marketing to growth, one episode at a time. See you soon.

“I think AI is not the future. Human-led content is the future. Authentic stories are the future,” says Tim Rath, co-founder and CEO of YOYABAIn this episode of The Content Cocktail Hour, Tim Rath, co-founder and CEO of YOYABA, joins Jonathan to discuss the rise of revenue marketing—and why it's much more than a buzzword. From co-founding an agency with his dad to working with powerhouse brands like HubSpot and Personio, Tim shares what it really takes to scale smartly in today's B2B environment. He also explains why marketing teams need to think beyond MQLs and focus on what actually drives revenue, retention, and growth.In this episode, you'll learn:How revenue marketing shifts focus from lead gen to business outcomesThe importance of product-market fit and message-market fitThe underrated power of personal branding in a noisy AI-driven worldResources:Connect with Jonathan on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jonathan-gandolf/Explore AudiencePlus: https://audienceplus.comConnect with Tim on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/timrathofficial/ Explore YOYABA: https://www.yoyaba.com/ Timestamps:(00:00) Intro(03:52) The concept of revenue marketing(07:22) Aligning marketing and sales for success(12:20) The role of brand marketing(13:37) Keys to rapid business growth(17:01) Founding a business with family(18:32) Building a marketing career from scratch(19:58) AI is not the future

This episode features an interview with Bill Macaitis, Founder & CEO, SaaS CMO Pro, where he shares growth strategies for SaaS and AI companies. His past roles include CMO positions at Slack and Zendesk, and SVP of Marketing at Salesforce. Bill joins the podcast to discuss findings from a recent survey of over 300 B2B marketers that gives insights into marketing strategies and budgets. He shares what they learned about marketing versus sales budgets, the most common attribution model, and more. Key Takeaways:Companies that are growing the fastest, invest the most in marketing. While cause and effect of that correlation is unclear, it's an interesting finding. Pipeline generation was one of the most tracked metrics for CMOs, which is a nice move away from only looking at MQLs or leads. Unfortunately, awareness was rarely tracked, making it hard for marketing teams to invest in long-term initiatives. A lot of companies, 65 percent, continue to use first or last touch attribution models.  Quote:  So, what we learned is a lot of companies, I think especially in their earlier stages -  percent still use first- or last- touch.  It's kind of crazy. I'm still shocked by it.  I remember my time at Salesforce,  I was running the marketing ops team at that point, along with a couple other teams, and  I just did a deep dive into attribution. Like I really wanted to understand like, hey, how many touches are people having with us before they became a lead? And then how many touches before they became a customer? What we would see is people would have 10, 20, 30 interactions or touches with us before they became a lead, and then they'd have like another 20 or 30 before they became a customer. And just imagine giving all the credit to the very first or last thing. And by the way, it's one of the reasons Google got so big was because a very common last touch thing is they will search on your company name. Branded search, right? And it's like, oh, like the SEM guys are like, this is amazing, right? We need to spend more on Google because they're producing these massive deals. And it's like, well wait, what about all the stuff in the middle?Episode Timestamps: *(03:48) Marketing Strategies and Budgeting*(22:31) Attribution Models in Marketing*(26:44) Top Metrics for B2B SaaS and AI Companies*(31:06) Marketing's Role in Revenue and ExpansionSponsor:Pipeline Visionaries is brought to you by Qualified.com. Qualified helps you turn your website into a pipeline generation machine with PipelineAI. Engage and convert your most valuable website visitors with live chat, chatbots, meeting scheduling, intent data, and Piper, your AI SDR. Visit Qualified.com to learn more.Links:Connect with Ian on LinkedInConnect with Bill on LinkedInLearn more about SaaS CMO ProLearn more about Caspian Studios

Bethany Prettyman is the Senior Director of Marketing Operations at Huntress, a cybersecurity company specializing in managed detection and response solutions for small and mid-sized businesses. With a robust background in strategic operations, she leads initiatives that enhance marketing efficiency and drive growth. Bethany's leadership ensures that Huntress's marketing strategies effectively communicate the company's mission to protect underserved organizations from cyber threats. In this episode… The traditional B2B marketing funnel might be doing more harm than good. In an era of complex buyer journeys and intent-driven decisions, is it still realistic, or even useful, to imagine prospects moving through neat, linear stages? What if the funnel model we've relied on for decades is actually leading marketing ops teams astray? According to Bethany Prettyman, a seasoned expert in marketing operations and data-driven strategy, the funnel is no longer linear, it's a loop. She highlights how today's B2B buyers bounce between channels, revisit research, and often re-enter the journey post-purchase, making linear tracking obsolete. The result? Misaligned attribution models and missed opportunities to optimize real engagement. Bethany explains that the obsession with MQLs is outdated and that teams should instead prioritize intent and velocity, focusing on signals that indicate purchase readiness rather than arbitrary lead scores. This mindset shift not only improves conversion but also strengthens alignment with sales. In this episode of the Revenue Engine Podcast, host Alex Gluz speaks with Bethany Prettyman, Senior Director of Marketing Operations at Huntress, to discuss why the traditional B2B funnel is broken. They explore why loop-based models better reflect today's buyer behavior, how attribution should evolve, and the dangers of tech bloat in marketing stacks. Bethany also shares her agile approach to reporting and how to bridge gaps between sales, marketing, and finance.

This episode features an interview with Jenny Force, VP of Global Demand Generation at Meltwater, a company with a suite of solutions that spans media, social, consumer, and sales intelligence. Jenny discusses her experience launching the company's first big summit, as well as the work they have done to automate their inbound process to maximize each MQL.Key Takeaways:Launching a new big initiative and then proving ROI to the executive team requires careful positioning and careful measurement against KPIs.Automating the process for inbound leads through tech removes manual human intervention and puts the sellers into positions where they can do their job at a more impactful level.Imbuing campaigns with humor, while a little scary, can cause a big lift in engagement.Quote: We've been really investing and not just spending more money to get more MQLs. It's making, not to sound cliche, but every MQL count. It's about automating the process. Here at Meltwater, we're a 20-year-old company, we're very sales-centric and there's a lot of energy that used to be put behind outbound. So, it was changing the narrative around inbound. Until we totally make this change as a business where everyone in the business is shouting to get an inbound lead and are super excited about it, it's how can I get every single lead responded to in under an hour without any delays? And it's been a bit of a journey to put the right tech in place to automate those processes that we can, take out that manual human intervention and then put the sellers into the business so they can actually sell. So, I've got some tech around instant meeting scheduling, self-serve demos, a conversational email that we've put in. And honestly, I feel like that has already had such an impact on our conversion rates. I wouldn't get rid of it.Episode Timestamps: *(06:03) The Trust Tree: Improving inbound efficiency and increasing deal velocity*(14:32) The Playbook: Launching a summit and investing in automation *(45:53) The Dust Up: Changing inbound KPIs to get a seat at the table *(49:30) Quick Hits: Jenny's quick hitsSponsor:Pipeline Visionaries is brought to you by Qualified.com. Qualified helps you turn your website into a pipeline generation machine with PipelineAI. Engage and convert your most valuable website visitors with live chat, chatbots, meeting scheduling, intent data, and Piper, your AI SDR. Visit Qualified.com to learn more.Links:Connect with Ian on LinkedInConnect with Jenny on LinkedInLearn more about MeltwaterLearn more about Caspian Studios

Most B2B teams still obsess over MQLs, discovery calls, and proposal stages—yet 90% of B2B buying happens during internal meetings, not sales calls.In this episode of Full-Funnel Live, Vlad and Andrei unpack

Send us a textIn this episode we interview Kelly Cheng, CMO at Goldcast, a video AI content platform and former marketer at Wistia.What you'll learn in this episode:Why mind share—not intent—is where great marketing startsHow video can build trust and amplify authentic brand presenceThe right way to repurpose video for maximum content reachWhy AI only works when it starts with human insightHow marketers can scale video creation without blowing their budgetTactics to thrive in the era of zero-click contentWhat measurement looks like when your goal is mind share—not just MQLs

In this episode of The Long Game Podcast, Alex Birkett interviews Alice Wyatt, a B2B fintech marketing leader with experience at Codat, Bloomreach, and Adyen. Alice shares how her personal journey of building community and maintaining sanity in a fast-paced city like New York connects with her marketing philosophy: agile, people-first, and impact-driven. The conversation explores person-based marketing (PBM), the limits of MQLs, aligning sales and marketing teams, and embracing adaptability in an AI-disrupted world. Alice also reflects on how her approach to building community mirrors how great marketing is done: with empathy, boldness, and a willingness to challenge the status quo.Key TakeawaysFrom ABM to PBM: Moving beyond account-based strategies to person-based marketing creates deeper personalization and stronger alignment with buying behavior.MQLs Are Outdated: Relying on MQLs limits alignment; marketing and sales need shared, outcome-driven goals instead.Adaptability Over Tactics: Successful marketers focus on business outcomes and adapt tactics as priorities shift—agility trumps specialization.AI Is Redefining Roles: AI is reshaping marketing roles, requiring teams to adopt tools while maintaining strategic thinking and creativity.Community as a Superpower: Whether in marketing or life, building and contributing to genuine communities creates long-term value.Hire for Resilience and Curiosity: Non-traditional backgrounds (e.g., comedy, hospitality) often produce standout BDRs with adaptability and EQ.Thought Leadership ≠ Press Releases: Modern thought leadership means leading with perspective, not parroting trends or relying on legacy PR tactics.Show LinksVisit Alice's Forbes Council for Marketing ExpertsConnect with Alice Wyatt on LinkedInConnect with Alex Birkett on LinkedIn and TwitterConnect with Omniscient Digital on LinkedIn or TwitterPast guests on The Long Game podcast include: Morgan Brown (Shopify), Ryan Law (Animalz), Dan Shure (Evolving SEO), Kaleigh Moore (freelancer), Eric Siu (Clickflow), Peep Laja (CXL), Chelsea Castle (Chili Piper), Tracey Wallace (Klaviyo), Tim Soulo (Ahrefs), Ryan McReady (Reforge), and many more.Some interviews you might enjoy and learn from:Actionable Tips and Secrets to SEO Strategy with Dan Shure (Evolving SEO)Building Competitive Marketing Content with Sam Chapman (Aprimo)How to Build the Right Data Workflow with Blake Burch (Shipyard)Data-Driven Thought Leadership with Alicia Johnston (Sprout Social)Purpose-Driven Leadership & Building a Content Team with Ty Magnin (UiPath)Also, check out our Kitchen Side series where we take you behind the scenes to see how the sausage is made at our agency:Blue Ocean vs Red Ocean SEOShould You Hire Writers or Subject Matter Experts?How Do Growth and Content Overlap?Connect with Omniscient Digital on social:Twitter: @beomniscientLinkedin: Be OmniscientListen to more episodes of The Long Game podcast here: https://beomniscient.com/podcast/

“Marketers are sociologists. We see the entire market. Sales are psychologists. They focus on one thing in front of them,” shares Nadia Davis, VP of Marketing at CaliberMindIn this episode of The Content Cocktail Hour, Nadia Davis, VP of Marketing at CaliberMind, unpacks the realities of ABM, revenue marketing, and why marketing leaders need to align with the language of the boardroom. Nadia shares how ABM has always existed—long before platforms tried to "productize" it—why MQLs aren't actually dead, and the biggest mistake companies make when implementing account-based strategies.She also explores the operational side of marketing, offering insights on why instrumentation and process matter just as much as creativity, and how marketers can set themselves up for success when stepping into new leadership roles.In this episode, you'll learn:Why ABM isn't as new as people think—and how to actually make it workHow to prove marketing's value in the boardroom and tie impact to revenueThe biggest tech trap ABM marketers fall into—and how to avoid itResources: Connect with Jonathan on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jonathan-gandolf/ Explore AudiencePlus: https://audienceplus.com Connect with Nadia on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/nadiadavis/ Explore CaliberMind: https://www.calibermind.comTimestamps:(00:00) Intro(01:33) Nadia's marketing journey and insights(03:56) The evolution and misconceptions of ABM(05:16) Defining ABM and its practical applications(08:21) Challenges and strategies in ABM implementation(15:28) Tracking success in ABM and marketing(20:35) Nadia's first 90 Days at CaliberMind(23:41) Why MQLs aren't dead

Mark Herring is a passionate marketing leader with strong technical roots and deep knowledge of how to market cloud and enterprise software to open-source developers and DevOps audiences. He is the Chief Marketing Officer at HiveMQ. In this episode, Mark shares his approach to cold outreach, explaining why leading with recognizable brands before introducing value creates engagement. He explores effective email strategies, emphasizing the power of short, curiosity-driven messages over long, detailed pitches. He also discusses pricing from the buyer's perspective, highlighting how perceived value—rather than just function—drives purchasing decisions.   Why you have to check out today's podcast: Learn proven strategies for grabbing attention in cold calls and emails, using brand credibility and psychological triggers like FOMO. Discover how to price based on what buyers truly value, rather than just cost or features, using real-life analogies. Get practical tips on structuring sales conversations to keep prospects engaged without sounding like a typical salesperson.   “Try and understand the value in the eyes of your buyer. I think far too many times as vendors, we think there's intrinsic value because it costs us much to produce or we think it looks like that. It's trying to understand from a buying perspective, what is the value you're providing.” - Mark Herring   Topics Covered: 01:29 - How his journey from development to product marketing led him to pricing 03:41 - How his early pricing research focused on how customers would use a product rather than explicitly asking about the problem it solved 04:59 -  To what is the short tenure of CMOs in B2B and consumer goods attributed to 06:25 - Explaining what a pipeline is and how pipeline generation involves value demonstration 10:38 - Comparing pipeline to running a marathon, emphasizing that while MQLs and SQLs are useful stepping stones, the ultimate goal is generating real sales opportunities 12:02 - Differentiating a pipeline from a SQL 14:18 - Demonstrating how a successful cold outreach combines multiple touchpoints 18:57 - How to make prospects more receptive in a cold call  21:13 - Why he uses big brand names as conversation openers in cold calls rather than starting with a value statement 22:27 - What an effective cold email should be 24:42 - Highlighting  the importance of A/B testing cold emails and continuously refining outreach strategies to improve open rates 25:55 - Mark's best pricing advice   Key Takeaways: “It's cold because you've never had the interaction, but usually they've interacted somewhere with you. It's like they might have seen you at an event, or they might have seen some of your outreach to you already and going, ‘Okay, I'll give this guy a bone.'” - Mark Herring “One of the sales guys was talking about this [cold calls] at the conference we were at together, and I just loved it. And he is like, ‘Don't over research, because there's never a good time to know everything.' Because you got to keep on dialing.” - Mark Herring “You can't stop doing it [cold outreach] because it's like getting dice and trying to get the six, the more you throw it, the better chance you're going to get to the six.” - Mark Herring “I lead [cold call] with brands, not with value. And when you do that type of thing, they're then shocked going, ‘Oh, he didn't do a sales pitch on me. He's asking me about these companies. Well, maybe it is something interesting.'” - Mark Herring   People/Resources Mentioned: FedX: https://www.fedex.com/en-us/home.html UPS: https://www.ups.com/us/en/home   Connect with Mark Herring: LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/herringmark/ Email: mark.herring@hivemq.com   Connect with Mark Stiving: LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/stiving/ Email: mark@impactpricing.com  

In this Kitchen Side episode of The Long Game Podcast, Alex, David, and Allie continue their in-person discussion in New York City, diving into marketing trends, proprietary data, and the role of differentiation in an AI-dominated landscape. They examine the shifting value of MQLs, how AI is automating SEO and marketing tasks, and why trust and credibility are the new forms of scarcity. The conversation also covers how companies can leverage original data, the intersection of brand and demand, and why marketers must rethink what truly adds value in the era of automation.Key TakeawaysThe Declining Value of MQLs: Traditional lead qualification models are losing effectiveness as buyer behavior evolves.AI and Automation in SEO: AI is automating repetitive SEO and marketing tasks, forcing companies to find new competitive advantages.Trust and Credibility as Scarcity: As automation floods the internet with content, trust and credibility are becoming key differentiators.Proprietary Data as a Competitive Edge: Unique data insights—both structured and unstructured—will be essential for creating valuable, non-generic content.The Future of Content in an AI World: The bar for content quality is rising, making originality and brand-driven storytelling more critical.Brand Affinity vs. Brand Awareness: Companies must focus on deeper brand affinity rather than just broad brand visibility to drive long-term success.Marketing's Role in Differentiation: Success will come from unique perspectives, creative execution, and human-driven insights rather than automated outputs.Show LinksConnect with David Khim on LinkedIn and TwitterConnect with Alex Birkett on LinkedIn and TwitterConnect with Allie Decker on LinkedIn and TwitterConnect with Omniscient Digital on LinkedIn or TwitterWhat is Kitchen Side?One big benefit of running an agency or working at one is you get to see the “kitchen side” of many different businesses; their revenue, their operations, their automations, and their culture.You understand how things look from the inside and how that differs from the outside.You understand how the sausage is made. As an agency ourselves, we're working both on growing our clients' businesses as well as our own. This podcast is one project, but we also blog, make videos, do sales, and have quite a robust portfolio of automations and hacks to run our business.We want to take you behind the curtain, to the kitchen side of our business, to witness our brainstorms, discussions, and internal dialogues behind the public works that we ship.Past guests on The Long Game podcast include: Morgan Brown (Shopify), Ryan Law (Animalz), Dan Shure (Evolving SEO), Kaleigh Moore (freelancer), Eric Siu (Clickflow), Peep Laja (CXL), Chelsea Castle (Chili Piper), Tracey Wallace (Klaviyo), Tim Soulo (Ahrefs), Ryan McReady (Reforge), and many more.Some interviews you might enjoy and learn from:Actionable Tips and Secrets to SEO Strategy with Dan Shure (Evolving SEO)Building Competitive Marketing Content with Sam Chapman (Aprimo)How to Build the Right Data Workflow with Blake Burch (Shipyard)Data-Driven Thought Leadership with Alicia Johnston (Sprout Social)Purpose-Driven Leadership & Building a Content Team with Ty Magnin (UiPath)Also, check out our Kitchen Side series where we take you behind the scenes to see how the sausage is made at our agency:Blue Ocean vs Red Ocean SEOShould You Hire Writers or Subject Matter Experts?How Do Growth and Content Overlap?Connect with Omniscient Digital on social:Twitter: @beomniscientLinkedin: Be OmniscientListen to more episodes of The Long Game podcast here: https://beomniscient.com/podcast/

This is the first GTM Live episode of 2025, and Chris shares his most recent GTM strategies to help you win. These lessons are especially crucial for companies who want to scale past $10 million ARR. Key topics from this episode: The 3 Pillars of GTM Success: GTM Strategy, GTM Optimization, and GTM Operations. Cost of Growth: Reframing GTM efficiency as "cost of growth" to measure true ROI and organizational health. AI and Copycat Products: How AI is accelerating product cloning and forcing companies to change how they differentiate. Challenges of PLG Integration: The pitfalls of mixing product-led and sales-led growth motions together in established companies. Smaller, Agile Teams: The shift towards AI-enabled, lean marketing and sales teams for efficiency and flexibility. Flawed Metrics: Why reliance on outdated KPIs like MQLs and traditional attribution models is a mistake. Siloed Departments: The need to remove organizational silos to create a Unified Revenue Factory. Future-Proofing Sales and Marketing: Strategies to align compensation, integrate data, and streamline processes for sustainable pipeline creation. – Thanks to our friends at Hatch for producing Revenue Vitals and all of Chris's short-form video and YouTube content. Hatch is a video-first content agency that creates short-form video content, video podcasts, original video series, and YouTube videos for B2B companies. Visit www.hatch.fm to learn more.

In this episode, Chris Walker talks with hosts Mikkel Kiærulf Plæhn and Toni Hohlbein about the GTM challenges B2B companies face. He shares common mistakes companies are making, how to better use data for decision-making, and predictions for what the future of GTM looks like. Key topics from this episode: Why unit economics at the top of the funnel are the root of most GTM inefficiencies The CEO's pivotal role in aligning the entire GTM function Why current data structures fail executives and how to fix them Predictions for 2025: Centralized decision-making, smaller teams, and AI-native organizations The pitfalls of relying on outdated KPIs like MQLs and demo requests Why traditional attribution models hinder strategic decision-making How AI will reshape GTM strategies and why data architecture is critical The shift from RevOps to a more streamlined approach to operations Chris's vision for post-sale functions: Aligning customer success with measurable outcomes Strategies for improving per-rep productivity and scaling efficiently – Thanks to our friends at Hatch for producing Revenue Vitals and all of Chris's short-form video and YouTube content. Hatch is a video-first content agency that creates short-form video content, video podcasts, original video series, and YouTube videos for B2B companies. Visit www.hatch.fm to learn more.