Category Visionaries

Sparrow automates employee leave management—a compliance nightmare that consumes thousands of HR hours annually at companies with distributed workforces. With $64 million in total funding through their recent Series B, Sparrow has achieved 14x revenue growth between their Series A and Series B by solving what became an "insurmountable problem" as states, counties, and cities each passed conflicting paid leave regulations over the past decade. In this episode of BUILDERS, Deborah Hanus shares how she scaled from $1.2 million in her first year while running everything part-time by discovering that the path to enterprise adoption wasn't solving employee frustration—it was quantifying the hidden costs of compliance risk, payroll errors, and retention that director-level HR leaders were desperately trying to contain. Topics Discussed: The regulatory explosion that made leave management unsolvable in-house: overlapping federal, state, county, and city requirements across distributed teams How Sparrow pivoted from a $50-per-leave consumer product to enterprise software after discovering director-level buyers saw a fundamentally different problem than employees Why Sparrow's biggest competitor is internal management rather than other vendors, and how this shaped their entire go-to-market strategy The 4-10x ROI framework: how preventing paperwork errors that cost customers $1 million+ justifies $100K platform investments Scaling from founder-led sales with zero sales background through systematic hiring processes—including reaching out to 100+ candidates for their first sales hire Customer qualification strategy: vetting prospects not just for current pain, but for alignment with the product roadmap 2-3 years forward   GTM Lessons For B2B Founders: Map pain perception across org levels to find economic buyers: Employees experienced leave management as "taking me a lot of time"—roughly 20 hours of taxes-level complicated paperwork. Director-level HR leaders, CFOs, and employment lawyers saw something entirely different: retention problems from employees leaving after bad leave experiences, litigation risk from compliance gaps across jurisdictions, thousands spent on employment lawyers for each leave event, and payroll calculation errors when state programs cover partial wages. Deborah's initial consumer product hypothesis failed because employees would only pay TurboTax pricing (~$50), requiring massive volume. The enterprise motion succeeded because strategic buyers owned the full cost stack. Map how pain manifests at each organizational level, then build your ICP around whoever owns the aggregate business impact rather than the tactical workflow friction. Build ROI models around error prevention, not efficiency gains: Sparrow doesn't sell time savings—they sell payroll accuracy. Their typical customer sees 4-10x financial ROI because the platform prevents mistakes that cost significantly more than the subscription. When paperwork is filed incorrectly, employees miss 60-70% of pay for 12-20 weeks, and with 70% of Americans living paycheck-to-paycheck, employers often make up the difference to prevent attrition. A $100K Sparrow investment typically saves $1M+ in payroll corrections alone, before counting the thousands in hours HR spends with employment lawyers for each leave event. Calculate the true cost of the status quo—including error correction, compliance penalties, and retention impact—not just the labor hours your product eliminates. Design qualification frameworks for roadmap fit, not just current pain: Deborah emphasizes that "everyone has this problem, but not everyone is going to be a fit for the product today and where it's going to be two years from now." Sparrow deliberately vets whether prospects will be excited about their product evolution 3-4 years forward, not just whether they have leave management pain today. This drives retention and customer advocacy as capabilities expand. Build qualification criteria that assess prospect-product alignment across the entire customer lifecycle—including future module adoption, integration depth, and use case expansion—rather than optimizing only for closing deals on current functionality. Treat hiring as systematic sourcing, not urgent gap-filling: Despite being in "back-to-back calls all day" unable to "send order forms fast enough," Deborah took time to reach out to approximately 100 candidates to make their first sales hire. She emphasizes defining what each role should accomplish 5-10 years out, then building sourcing strategies to achieve 50% confidence in that long-term outcome. This intentional approach—coupled with her value of "scaling intentionally"—enabled efficient growth without typical scaling chaos. Resist the startup default of "just hire someone fast." Instead, invest upfront in role definition (including the 5-year trajectory), source systematically rather than opportunistically, and accept lower short-term velocity for higher long-term scaling efficiency. Recognize emotional volatility as statistical artifact, not signal: Deborah reframes the classic startup "highs and lows" through a data science lens: with sparse early data, founders overfit to individual signals. One person saying "your product is stupid" triggers existential doubt; one saying "everyone should use it" creates irrational exuberance. As companies scale and data accumulates, the noise averages out—70% neutral-to-good outcomes with 30% fires becomes manageable rather than anxiety-inducing. She found scaling "much easier than that first year" because "you can sort of plot out your trend line and you can see where you're going." Build systems to accumulate data points faster (more customer conversations, more experiments, more leading indicators), recognize that early-stage emotional swings reflect sample size rather than reality, and make decisions based on trend lines rather than individual data points. // Sponsors: Front Lines — We help B2B tech companies launch, manage, and grow podcasts that drive demand, awareness, and thought leadership. www.FrontLines.io The Global Talent Co. — We help tech startups find, vet, hire, pay, and retain amazing marketing talent that costs 50-70% less than the US & Europe. www.GlobalTalent.co // Don't Miss: New Podcast Series — How I Hire Senior GTM leaders share the tactical hiring frameworks they use to build winning revenue teams. Hosted by Andy Mowat, who scaled 4 unicorns from $10M to $100M+ ARR and launched Whispered to help executives find their next role. Subscribe here: https://open.spotify.com/show/53yCHlPfLSMFimtv0riPyM

Alex is an AI recruiter that autonomously handles phone screens, video interviews, and candidate communications at scale for enterprise talent teams and staffing firms. The company rebranded from Apriora after acquiring alex.com for over half a million dollars—a brand investment that immediately increased word-of-mouth referrals and inbound pipeline. In this episode of BUILDERS, we sat down with Aaron Wang, Co-Founder & CEO of Alex, to discuss achieving seven figures in revenue through founder-led sales in staffing, their "respectful zagging" approach to standing out in a crowded AI agent market, and building toward network effects that could fundamentally reshape talent matching. Topics Discussed Justifying a $500K+ domain acquisition to co-founders and investors Building candidate experience that drives engagement rather than rejection Design decisions around AI avatars versus voice-only interactions Differentiation strategy in marketing: zagging without rage baiting Hiring framework based on incentive understanding and first-principles thinking Market segmentation between staffing firms and corporate TA teams Long-term platform vision leveraging cross-company recruiting data GTM Lessons For B2B Founders Quantify intangible asset ROI through pipeline metrics, not brand sentiment: Aaron defended the $500K+ alex.com purchase by tracking "huge increase in word of mouth and inbound, which is obviously directly measurable." The previous name Apriora created friction in sharing and referrals. With enterprise contract sizes, removing pronunciation and memorability barriers has concrete pipeline impact. The domain also functions as a balance sheet asset. Founders should evaluate premium domains against customer acquisition cost and deal velocity, not abstract brand value. Extract vertical-specific insights before horizontal expansion: Alex reached seven figures in staffing revenue exclusively through founder-led sales before entering corporate TA. Aaron noted they had "a few key insights into what made staffing particularly relevant as a market." This concentrated approach allowed them to refine product-market fit and build referenceable customers in one segment. Only after achieving clear traction did they expand strategically to corporate TA. Founders should resist premature market expansion—depth in one vertical provides the learnings needed for successful adjacency moves. Structure interviews to surface first-principles thinking across functions: Aaron described having A-player marketers conduct first rounds, then A-player engineers conduct second rounds for the same candidate. This cross-functional approach tests whether candidates can operate from first principles rather than just applying domain playbooks. The key insight: "A players want to work with A players and A players can identify A players. A B player can't identify an A player." Founders should design interview loops that reveal foundational reasoning ability, not just functional competence. Hire for incentive mapping ability over category experience: Exceptional marketers understand "what is incentivizing someone to share or post or like" and how to create mindshare. Aaron emphasized this matters more than HR tech background, citing Vinod Khosla's gene pool engineering concept. You need domain expertise somewhere in the company, but hiring everyone for it dilutes your ability to think differently. Founders should prioritize candidates who demonstrate deep understanding of human incentives and can identify non-obvious differentiation opportunities. Align brand aesthetic with product philosophy to reinforce positioning: Alex deliberately avoided human avatars, choosing nature imagery and green color schemes to make AI feel "grounded" rather than "abstract." This extends their product belief that "bad AI is worse than no AI"—the brand needed to signal reliability and familiarity. Aaron explicitly contrasted this with rage baiting tactics: "not something we're interested in doing." Founders should ensure visual identity and messaging tactics authentically reflect product values rather than chasing engagement metrics that misalign with positioning. Map product roadmap by studying adjacent verticals with faster adoption curves: When discussing category, Aaron compared Alex to Harvey rather than interview intelligence tools. He noted HR tech "tends to lag others" in technology uptake, making legal AI a better predictive model. Just as Harvey expanded from document review to email automation to client portals, Alex views phone screening as "one important, but only one portion of what a recruiter does today." Founders in slower-adopting categories should analyze product evolution in faster-moving verticals to anticipate feature expansion and avoid getting boxed into point solution positioning. //   Sponsors: Front Lines — We help B2B tech companies launch, manage, and grow podcasts that drive demand, awareness, and thought leadership. www.FrontLines.io The Global Talent Co. — We help tech startups find, vet, hire, pay, and retain amazing marketing talent that costs 50-70% less than the US & Europe. www.GlobalTalent.co // Don't Miss: New Podcast Series — How I Hire Senior GTM leaders share the tactical hiring frameworks they use to build winning revenue teams. Hosted by Andy Mowat, who scaled 4 unicorns from $10M to $100M+ ARR and launched Whispered to help executives find their next role. Subscribe here: https://open.spotify.com/show/53yCHlPfLSMFimtv0riPyM

Sure built the technology infrastructure enabling the world's biggest consumer brands to embed complex insurance products directly into their core transactions—from auto purchases to home loans. In this episode of BUILDERS, Wayne Slavin shares how Sure pivoted from a consumer mobile app to B2B infrastructure after insurance executives kept pulling engineers into boardrooms to see the backend, why prospects who choose to build end up on Sure's "wall of shame" after their attempts fail, and the vertical integration strategy that could make legacy carriers obsolete within 20 years. Topics Discussed Sure's founding: turbulence on a Vegas flight led to a prototype that converted 15.91% from ad click to insurance purchase The accidental pivot to B2B infrastructure when insurance C-suites started calling people into boardrooms to see Sure's backend system How Sure became "chameleons" matching each partner's corner radius, modal behavior, and loader effects to avoid breaking product experiences The three failed paths that create Sure's best customers: DIY builds, direct carrier partnerships, and naive marketplace strategies Why buy-versus-build objections signal misaligned incentives—enterprise buyers trading career-safe "buy" budgets for execution-risk "build" projects The vertical integration roadmap: from collaborative carrier partnerships toward turnkey solutions backed by sovereign wealth funds AppleCare as the embedded insurance template: multi-decabillion dollar business now integrated into device selection, storage, color, and financing flows GTM Lessons For B2B Founders Run weekend demand tests before year-long regulatory builds: Wayne built a prototype over a long weekend and drove traffic through Google and Facebook ads to test first principles—do people want to buy insurance online, how soon before travel, how much coverage? The 15.91% conversion rate justified committing a full year to regulatory partnerships before bringing on a team. For founders in regulated spaces, creative demand validation derisks the compliance investment required before launch. Watch what gets pulled into the boardroom: Sure pitched their mobile app to insurance C-suites who responded with polite interest. Then executives started calling colleagues into meetings specifically to see Sure's backend operations system—the infrastructure they'd spent hundreds of millions trying to build. After three or four meetings with the same pattern, Wayne realized the backend was the product. Pay attention when prospects ignore your intended offering but get animated about something else entirely. Target solution-aware buyers who've already failed: Sure's most successful customers fall into three categories: those who tried building themselves and lost institutional knowledge when engineers left, those who partnered directly with carriers who took customers away and sold them competing products, or those who naively tried offering 50 insurance options when California markets now have two viable carriers. Wayne explicitly doesn't consider prospects choosing to build as their ICP—they lack awareness of execution risk and will waste Sure's time before returning years later. Treat build decisions as pipeline, not losses: A prospect from 2020 called yesterday after their DIY attempt resulted in three people leaving the company with nobody understanding how their cobbled system works. Sure maintains a "wall of shame" tracking decision-makers who chose to build and no longer work at those companies. For infrastructure plays with 18-36 month sales cycles, maintain relationships with build-path prospects—they're future pipeline once reality hits. Product integration depth wins embedded deals: Sure's differentiation isn't database speed—it's becoming invisible within partners' products. Wayne describes matching exact corner radius, modal patterns, and loader effects so product teams don't fight the insurance insertion. This requires deep product expertise across partners' stacks. For embedded solutions, technical flexibility that respects existing UX decisions matters more than raw performance metrics. Sure enables complex insurance purchases without customers touching their keyboard—everything pre-filled from partner data. Map internal buyer incentives in enterprise deals: Wayne observed that enterprise buyers face perverse incentives: requesting more budget and resources for build projects looks good internally, but they're unknowingly trading stable "buy" expenditures for career-ending execution risk. Large companies will pay "a bajillion dollars to Salesforce" because it works and removes risk, not because anyone loves it. Help champions articulate how buying derisks their execution versus the alternative—it's not about your product superiority, it's about their job security. //   Sponsors: Front Lines — We help B2B tech companies launch, manage, and grow podcasts that drive demand, awareness, and thought leadership. www.FrontLines.io The Global Talent Co. — We help tech startups find, vet, hire, pay, and retain amazing marketing talent that costs 50-70% less than the US & Europe. www.GlobalTalent.co // Don't Miss: New Podcast Series — How I Hire Senior GTM leaders share the tactical hiring frameworks they use to build winning revenue teams. Hosted by Andy Mowat, who scaled 4 unicorns from $10M to $100M+ ARR and launched Whispered to help executives find their next role.   Subscribe here: https://open.spotify.com/show/53yCHlPfLSMFimtv0riPyM

Limelight is building the infrastructure layer for B2B creator marketing, processing payments and managing campaigns for companies spending six figures monthly on creator partnerships. With $2.1 million in funding from Signal to Noise Ratio, Ascend Ventures, Savion Ventures, and strategic angels including the head of AI at Amazon and the former Chief Product Officer at Lyft, Limelight powers creator programs for Clay, Webflow, ZoomInfo, and Bill.com. In this episode of BUILDERS, we sat down with David Walsh, Founder and CEO of Limelight, to learn how he validated the market by interviewing 100+ creators, why he deliberately chose not to build an agency despite customer demand, and how his platform tracks engagement data at scale to prove ROI for performance-focused buyers. Topics Discussed: The pivot from referral software to B2B creator infrastructure after 100+ creator interviews How creator attitudes shifted from refusing brand partnerships to actively monetizing Clay's playbook: building custom Clay tables for creators before asking them to post Why Limelight chose to power agencies rather than compete with them The data infrastructure required to justify $100K+ monthly creator budgets Tracking organic engagement, converting content to paid ads, and attributing pipeline The split between brand/social buyers and performance/demand gen buyers Launching social listening to challenge legacy social media management platforms GTM Lessons For B2B Founders: Validate with 100+ user interviews before pivoting: David didn't just chat with a handful of potential users—he conducted and recorded over 100 interviews with B2B creators, asking detailed questions about monetization interest, partnership preferences, and content strategies. He then repeated this process with marketing leaders. This level of research rigor before committing to a pivot is rare but critical when entering emerging categories. The depth of qualitative research gave him conviction to make a contrarian bet when most creators were still refusing brand partnerships. Build where network effects are structural, not hoped for: David specifically chose a creator marketplace after a previous marketplace failure because the unit economics included built-in virality. When Limelight pays a creator $10,000, that creator has tens of thousands of followers who see the transaction result (the sponsored content). Every payment notification becomes inbound interest. He understood that in consumer marketplaces you compete on supply quality, but in creator marketplaces the supply actively markets your platform. Founders should identify whether their marketplace has structural network effects in the transaction itself, not just theoretical ones. Target micro-creators with niche audiences over vanity metrics: The counterintuitive insight: creators with 10,000-25,000 followers often outperform those with 100,000+ in B2B because deal sizes are $25K-$50K, not $100 sunglasses. Smaller creators have higher engagement rates, unsaturated audiences, authentic expertise in specific domains, and haven't been "bought and sold for" yet. When brands face the choice between a 100K-follower creator at $2,000 per post with 200 likes versus a 25K-follower creator at $1,000 per post with 300 likes, they irrationally choose the larger following. Founders should educate buyers that in B2B, targeted influence within specific buyer committees matters more than reach. Build data infrastructure to win performance buyers, not just brand buyers: Limelight tracks every piece of content in real-time (not waiting weeks for creator screenshots), monitors all engagement and segments it by ICP fit, provides self-reported attribution from demo forms, tracks website traffic spikes correlated to posting schedules, and generates qualified lead lists from content engagement. This comprehensive data layer is what allows demand gen leaders to reallocate spend from paid channels. The market is splitting 50/50 between brand/social buyers and performance/demand gen buyers—the latter has larger budgets and treats creator spend like paid media that requires attribution. Founders entering new marketing channels should build attribution infrastructure from day one, not as an afterthought. Deliberately choose infrastructure over services even when customers ask for help: Despite customers like Webflow, ZoomInfo, and Bill.com spending $100K+ monthly and requesting more hands-on support, David chose to build product and enable agencies rather than hire account managers and become a service business. His reasoning: people have tried to replace agencies in recruiting for decades and failed because buyers want the human in the middle. The bigger opportunity is being the infrastructure that powers all agencies, not competing with them. This fork-in-the-road decision—hire CSMs and influencer marketing managers versus build more product—defines whether you're building a scalable platform or a services business disguised as SaaS. Use your first customer to custom-build product, then scale it: Clay became Limelight's first customer when the platform was early. David essentially custom-built features for Clay's creator program, learning their workflow for building Clay tables for creators, their onboarding process, and their approach to creative freedom. This deep partnership gave Limelight the product foundation to scale from managing 20 creators to 200+ for Clay within nine months, then apply those learnings to other customers. Rather than building in a vacuum, founders should find a sophisticated first customer willing to co-develop the product, even if it means initially building something custom. // Sponsors: Front Lines — We help B2B tech companies launch, manage, and grow podcasts that drive demand, awareness, and thought leadership. www.FrontLines.io The Global Talent Co. — We help tech startups find, vet, hire, pay, and retain amazing marketing talent that costs 50-70% less than the US & Europe. www.GlobalTalent.co // Don't Miss: New Podcast Series — How I Hire Senior GTM leaders share the tactical hiring frameworks they use to build winning revenue teams. Hosted by Andy Mowat, who scaled 4 unicorns from $10M to $100M+ ARR and launched Whispered to help executives find their next role. Subscribe here:  https://open.spotify.com/show/53yCHlPfLSMFimtv0riPyM

Jane Technologies built real-time inventory streaming technology that connects cannabis dispensary point-of-sale systems to online ordering platforms—solving a technical problem that hadn't been cracked before in the space. As a West Point graduate and Apache helicopter pilot who found cannabis instrumental in his transition from military service, Socrates co-founded Jane with his brother (a computer scientist) in 2014-2015, deliberately choosing the "pick and shovel" software play over plant-touching operations. Operating in a market where major VCs won't invest, credit card networks won't process payments, NASDAQ won't list your stock, and regulatory missteps can mean federal charges, Jane developed an extreme discipline around capital efficiency and risk management that offers tactical lessons for any founder building in constrained or emerging markets. Topics Discussed: Jane's technical innovation: streaming real-time physical inventory from store shelves to online platforms Regulatory timing: the Cole Memo, state-by-state legalization momentum, and using adjacent players as risk indicators Risk taxonomy: creating frameworks to convert market uncertainty into scored, calculable risk decisions Strategic positioning as infrastructure provider versus licensed operator to manage legal exposure Customer evolution: illicit market operators meeting institutional players in the middle, and what survives Capital structure constraints driving operational discipline: no traditional payment rails, no public markets, limited institutional capital Competitive moat building through regulatory complexity rather than despite it Jane's decision framework on legal gray areas and why "maybe" always means "no" GTM Lessons For B2B Founders: Use adjacent players as regulatory canaries, then move decisively: Jane launched after observing the 2013 Cole Memo and early state legalization in Colorado and Oregon, but critically didn't move until seeing Weedmaps and Leafly operate without legal consequences. Socrates explains: "We also didn't want to be the first...No one seemed to be getting thrown in jail at that time. And so we said, okay, let's get some good lawyers. Let's be able to understand our left and right limits, but let's go do this now." This isn't about being first-mover or fast-follower—it's about identifying specific de-risking events that signal the inflection point. Jane watched for: (1) regulatory clarity documents, (2) expansion velocity across state markets, (3) other operators achieving scale without enforcement action. Founders in emerging categories should map these trigger events explicitly rather than relying on intuition about timing. Build compliance infrastructure as a moat, not overhead: Jane deliberately avoided "touching the plant" to stay outside the highest-risk licensing category, positioning as B2B infrastructure rather than a licensed operator. While competitors took shortcuts on compliance to move faster, Jane developed the internal discipline to work within state regulatory frameworks and alongside regulators themselves. The company's philosophy: "go where it's hard." When regulatory complexity is high and shortcuts are tempting, building the compliant solution that becomes the standard creates a defendable position. As markets mature and enforcement tightens, shortcut companies fail while compliant infrastructure survives. The tactical implication: in regulated markets, treat compliance work as product moat-building, not cost center overhead. Structure legal and compliance as core product development. Convert uncertainty into scored risk through systematic information gathering: Socrates articulates the critical distinction: "There's a real difference between risk and uncertainty. Uncertainty is unknown...you try to position yourself to make uncertainty known so that you can decide and score it. Hey, is this a reward or is this a risk?" Jane's framework: (1) identify the unknown factors, (2) gather information to convert unknowns into knowns, (3) score both upside and downside explicitly, (4) decide whether the scored risk justifies action. The company wouldn't cross lines even when competitors did because certain risks (federal charges, business termination) represented non-recoverable outcomes regardless of upside. Implementation: maintain a risk register where each strategic decision explicitly documents what's uncertain versus what's a calculated risk, with clear go/no-go thresholds based on downside scenarios. Capital constraints create competitive advantages through forced discipline: Operating without access to Sequoia checks, IPO paths, or Visa processing meant Jane had to master unit economics and profitability early. Socrates reflects: "This is stuff that traditionally, you go public, you raise billions of dollars, and then you decide how to get profitable. Then you decide what your cost of capital is and free cash flow, man, we had to learn that at a very young age." The result: "really good fundamentals" that scale as the business grows. While competitors in less constrained markets can mask poor unit economics with cheap capital, Jane built sustainable business mechanics from day one. The tactical approach: "ruthlessly prioritize what you do and do not build" and "scrutinize every dollar that comes in and out of the business." For founders with capital access, consider artificially constraining spend to force the same discipline rather than optimizing for growth at any cost. Optimize for survival duration, not growth velocity: Jane's entire strategy centers on outlasting competitors in a market where shortcuts eventually kill companies. Socrates: "This is not a game of speed. This is not a game of size. This is a game of endurance. And you want to just last...if we make a fatal decision and we get arrested or we do a felony or something like that, then the business is probably over." The company explicitly embraced being early, knowing they'd face years before the market fully matured, but positioned to compound advantages while others burned out. Their decision framework: if a strategic choice risks ending the game entirely (legal exposure, existential financial risk, fundamental trust violation), it's off the table regardless of upside. For markets with long regulatory or adoption cycles, model scenarios for 10+ year timelines and ensure your burn rate and strategic decisions support that duration rather than optimizing for 18-month milestones. //  Sponsors: Front Lines — We help B2B tech companies launch, manage, and grow podcasts that drive demand, awareness, and thought leadership. www.FrontLines.io The Global Talent Co. — We help tech startups find, vet, hire, pay, and retain amazing marketing talent that costs 50-70% less than the US & Europe. www.GlobalTalent.co // Don't Miss: New Podcast Series — How I Hire Senior GTM leaders share the tactical hiring frameworks they use to build winning revenue teams. Hosted by Andy Mowat, who scaled 4 unicorns from $10M to $100M+ ARR and launched Whispered to help executives find their next role. Subscribe here: https://open.spotify.com/show/53yCHlPfLSMFimtv0riPyM  

Sophos represents one of cybersecurity's most vulnerable companies, founded in 1985 as an antivirus provider and now operating at massive scale with $1.5 billion in ARR and 5,700 global employees. Under CEO Joe Levy's leadership, the company has undergone a fundamental transformation from a traditional product-focused vendor to a services-driven platform that addresses core market failures in cybersecurity. In a recent episode of Category Visionaries, we sat down with Joe Levy to learn about the company's pivot to managed detection and response (MDR) services, their $860 million SecureWorks acquisition, and their vision for democratizing cybersecurity strategy across millions of organizations worldwide. Topics Discussed:  Sophos's evolution from antivirus origins through multiple business model reinventions over four decades  The strategic pivot to managed detection and response (MDR) services starting in 2018-2019 Building organizational support for major business model changes through experimental frameworks  Managing channel partner relationships during service transformation with 25,000 global partners  The $860 million SecureWorks acquisition and integration strategy to achieve category leadership  Scale as a competitive advantage in cybersecurity platform operations  The future vision of democratizing cybersecurity through "virtual CISO" services at massive scale GTM Lessons For B2B Founders: Address systemic market failures through business model innovation: Joe identified that cybersecurity's core problem wasn't technology quality but post-sale execution. "As an industry we have been really good at buying and selling products, but we've never been good. In fact, we've been terrible at their implementation and their lifecycle management." This insight led to Sophos's services transformation. B2B founders should look beyond surface-level customer complaints to identify fundamental market failures that create opportunities for entirely new business models. Structure major strategic pivots as controlled experiments: When proposing the MDR services pivot, Joe framed it as a measurable experiment rather than a leap of faith. "The conversation primarily consisted of, I want to run an experiment. Here are the parameters of the experiment that I would like to run... This is the investment that I think that we need to make in order to bootstrap it." This approach included specific cost models, growth projections, and profitability targets. B2B founders can reduce organizational resistance to major changes by presenting them as structured experiments with clear success metrics and defined risk parameters. Invest heavily in stakeholder alignment during business model transitions: The most challenging aspect wasn't technical but maintaining relationships with 25,000 channel partners who might view new services as competitive threats. Joe spent a full year ensuring partners viewed MDR as "augmentation and greater opportunity and an opportunity for them to offer tiering to the kinds of services that they're doing." B2B founders making significant business model changes must prioritize extensive stakeholder communication and alignment, especially when changes could affect existing revenue streams or partner relationships. Shift sales focus from product features to guaranteed outcomes: Sophos had to retrain their sales organization for services selling. "The fundamental difference between selling a product and selling a service is... what the expectations of the outcome that service is going to provide for them." Instead of selling technology specifications with implementation uncertainty, they began guaranteeing predictable business results. B2B founders transitioning to services models must fundamentally change their sales approach from feature-based selling to outcome-based value propositions. Use strategic M&A to achieve immediate category leadership: Rather than relying solely on organic growth, Sophos accelerated their MDR strategy through the $860 million SecureWorks acquisition. "It technically makes us the largest MDR operator, pure play cybersecurity MDR operator... on the planet today." The acquisition instantly provided market positioning that organic growth might have taken years to achieve. B2B founders should consider strategic acquisitions not just for technology or customers, but for category leadership and competitive positioning that enables further market expansion. Build scale as a defensible competitive advantage: Joe argues that scale is "an often overlooked but a critically important element when it comes to the selection of information technology vendors." In platform businesses handling massive data volumes and real-time operations, the ability to operate at scale becomes a key differentiator. "The customer should be asking them, what are your strategies in order to be able to scale?" B2B founders in platform businesses should explicitly communicate their scaling strategies to customers and position their ability to handle growth as a core competitive advantage, especially when competing against smaller vendors.   //  Sponsors: Front Lines — We help B2B tech companies launch, manage, and grow podcasts that drive demand, awareness, and thought leadership. www.FrontLines.io The Global Talent Co. — We help tech startups find, vet, hire, pay, and retain amazing marketing talent that costs 50-70% less than the US & Europe. www.GlobalTalent.co // Don't Miss: New Podcast Series — How I Hire Senior GTM leaders share the tactical hiring frameworks they use to build winning revenue teams. Hosted by Andy Mowat, who scaled 4 unicorns from $10M to $100M+ ARR and launched Whispered to help executives find their next role.  Subscribe here: https://open.spotify.com/show/53yCHlPfLSMFimtv0riPyM

ClearCOGS is creating a new category in restaurant technology by bringing predictive analytics to an industry that operates almost entirely on retrospective data. With $3.8 million raised, the company analyzes 100 million data points daily per restaurant to forecast demand and optimize prep decisions. In a recent episode of Category Visionaries, we sat down with Matt Wampler, CEO and Co-Founder of ClearCOGS, to explore how his experience turning around failing Jimmy John's franchises led him to build forecasting software that's fundamentally changing how restaurants operate—and how he's defining a category that doesn't yet exist. Topics Discussed: Matt's transition from 21-year-old Jimmy John's franchisee working 110-hour weeks to identifying systematic inefficiencies in food prep decisions across five locations Why restaurants remain stuck in reactive mode while sports betting and fantasy football have sophisticated predictive analytics ClearCOGS's data infrastructure processing 100 million variables daily—from 15-minute POS intervals and weather patterns to dew point and local events The product discovery process where Matt's co-founder kept asking "why" until every feature request collapsed into one core problem: uncertainty about tomorrow's demand Category creation through the Restaurant AI podcast despite no clear attribution model Building in public on LinkedIn as an enterprise lead generation channel that landed major brands within six weeks The ICP evolution from enterprise fast-casual chains (15-1,000 locations) to a freemium Toast integration targeting independents GTM Lessons For B2B Founders: Let outsiders interrogate your domain expertise: Matt wanted to build dashboards restaurant operators requested. His technical co-founder repeatedly asked "why do you want that dashboard?" then "why do you need to see that?" Every answer eventually reached the same root cause: operators didn't know who would walk in tomorrow, making food prep, ordering, and staffing decisions inefficient. This pattern held across dozens of restaurant brands. The yin-yang of insider knowledge plus relentless outside questioning revealed the actual problem worth solving versus building a feature graveyard of requested tools. Reframe category education through familiar high-stakes analogies: "Predictive analytics" meant nothing to restaurant operators. Matt's breakthrough was pointing out the cognitive dissonance in their lives: they studied dozens of variables and probabilistic forecasts for fantasy football lineups but ran six-figure businesses on Excel sheets and gut instinct. This wasn't explaining predictive analytics—it was exposing the absurdity of having better forecasting tools for fantasy sports than for their livelihood, making the gap visceral and the solution obvious. Convert forecast errors into customer intelligence touchpoints: When ClearCOGS's predictions missed, the team initially spent weeks reoptimizing algorithms. The pivot: immediately call the customer, acknowledge the miss, and say "we're on it." Customers didn't expect perfection from a system replacing Excel and guesswork—they valued having someone actually watching their operation. In a software landscape where vendors disappear post-sale, proactive error acknowledgment became relationship acceleration. Every miss became an opportunity to demonstrate attentiveness that competitors couldn't match. Segment messaging by incentive structure, not org chart: ClearCOGS discovered the messaging split wasn't finance versus operations—it was franchisors versus franchisees. Franchisors earning royalties on top-line revenue needed consistency and scalability messaging. Franchisees and on-ground operators living on bottom-line profitability needed waste reduction and margin improvement messaging. The same product solving the same problem required different value propositions based on how buyers were compensated, not what department they sat in. Test public vulnerability as enterprise sales acceleration: Matt had zero social media presence before ClearCOGS. He started posting about struggles and failures on LinkedIn. Within six weeks, a major restaurant brand reached out for partnership discussions. Later, he posted their first website draft asking for brutal feedback—50 people responded with detailed reviews, video walkthroughs, and unsolicited legal advice. When he launched the Restaurant AI podcast with unclear ROI, he treated it as category education infrastructure. In oversaturated B2B markets, authentic struggle documentation cuts through polished competitor noise and creates asymmetric enterprise access that paid channels can't replicate. //  Sponsors: Front Lines — We help B2B tech companies launch, manage, and grow podcasts that drive demand, awareness, and thought leadership. www.FrontLines.io The Global Talent Co. — We help tech startups find, vet, hire, pay, and retain amazing marketing talent that costs 50-70% less than the US & Europe. www.GlobalTalent.co // Don't Miss: New Podcast Series — How I Hire Senior GTM leaders share the tactical hiring frameworks they use to build winning revenue teams. Hosted by Andy Mowat, who scaled 4 unicorns from $10M to $100M+ ARR and launched Whispered to help executives find their next role.  Subscribe here: https://open.spotify.com/show/53yCHlPfLSMFimtv0riPyM

Defense technology has shifted from a social liability in Silicon Valley to commanding 35-40% of venture capital allocation—up from a historical 10%. This isn't just trend-following; it reflects fundamental market dynamics as SaaS becomes hypercompetitive and AI lowers barriers to entry, pushing capital toward deep tech where moats still exist. Blacklake, a defense holdco based in Austin, helps emerging defense companies navigate government procurement and expand into Europe, Asia-Pacific, and allied markets. In this episode, Jeff Crusey, EVP of Technology & Acquisition at Blacklake, reveals the emerging defense tech playbook, explains why lobbying ROI dwarfs traditional GTM spending, and details what actually matters when hardware meets government procurement. Topics Discussed: Why VC capital is rotating from SaaS to deep tech and defense The defense tech go-to-market playbook versus enterprise SaaS mechanics SBIR grant programs as non-dilutive capital for hardware development Lobbying and appropriations as core revenue drivers, not nice-to-haves Field deployment and operator feedback as the only viable iteration strategy Investor evaluation criteria for hardware-intensive defense businesses Emerging threat vectors in Arctic defense and orbital domain awareness GTM Lessons For B2B Founders: Launch lobbying concurrent with SBIR Phase 1 applications: Companies initiating lobbying and appropriations work at the moment they apply for SBIR grants hit revenue milestones materially faster than those treating government affairs as a later-stage function. This means seed-stage companies maintain Capitol Hill presence—a pattern that didn't exist five years ago. The talent profile matters: government affairs hires need proven relationships within specific congressional committees and appropriations staff. Initial engagements typically involve external lobbying advisors with established networks, transitioning in-house at Series A when contract pipeline justifies dedicated headcount. This is consistently the highest-ROI channel in defense GTM. Optimize for deployment speed over system perfection: Modern conflict operates as continuous technological adaptation where capabilities become obsolete within weeks, not years. Companies achieving persistent field presence with operators—not laboratory perfection—win iterative cycles. The tactical approach: deploy minimum viable hardware to operational environments, capture real-world performance data and failure modes, then rapidly incorporate feedback into next iterations. This contradicts traditional defense procurement assumptions about "exquisite systems" and requires founders to resist over-engineering before battlefield validation. Solve the prototype funding problem through non-dilutive capital: Defense investors require working prototypes before capital deployment due to hardware risk profiles—fundamentally different from software's low marginal cost of iteration. This creates a chicken-and-egg problem: prototypes require capital, but capital requires prototypes. The solution path combines bootstrapping to early proof-of-concept, then leveraging SBIR Phase 1 grants (tens of thousands) to reach demonstrable prototype stage. Phase 2 awards (single-digit millions) fund production validation. Strategic founders pursue direct-to-Phase-2 pathways when possible, compressing the timeline from concept to validated demand signal. Strip technical complexity from investor communications: Defense founders with deep domain expertise consistently over-index on technical sophistication during fundraising conversations, losing investor attention before reaching commercial traction narratives. VCs evaluate market timing, defensibility, and path to scale—not engineering elegance. The correction: communicate technology at middle-school comprehension levels. This isn't condescension; it's recognizing that capital allocators optimize for portfolio construction, not technical peer review. Founders often feel they're "dumbing down" their innovations, but clarity on problem-solution fit and market size matters infinitely more than technical specifications during early fundraising stages. Treat SBIR phases as progressive demand validation, not just funding: The phased SBIR structure functions as government-backed demand signaling: Phase 1 validates concept feasibility, Phase 2 confirms development viability, Phase 3 demonstrates production readiness for potential program of record status. Investors decode these phases as risk reduction milestones. Phase 1 awards indicate government interest; Phase 2 awards (especially direct-to-Phase-2 or enhanced Phase 2) signal validated customer pull; Phase 3 contracts position companies for program of record awards worth hundreds of millions annually. Beyond capital, SBIR progression provides founder-market fit evidence and customer commitment that traditional LOIs cannot match in defense contexts. // Sponsors: Front Lines — We help B2B tech companies launch, manage, and grow podcasts that drive demand, awareness, and thought leadership. www.FrontLines.io The Global Talent Co. — We help tech startups find, vet, hire, pay, and retain amazing marketing talent that costs 50-70% less than the US & Europe. www.GlobalTalent.co // Don't Miss: New Podcast Series — How I Hire Senior GTM leaders share the tactical hiring frameworks they use to build winning revenue teams. Hosted by Andy Mowat, who scaled 4 unicorns from $10M to $100M+ ARR and launched Whispered to help executives find their next role. Subscribe here: https://open.spotify.com/show/53yCHlPfLSMFimtv0riPyM

Continuum is solving the multi-party return problem in B2B supply chain—a transaction involving distributors, manufacturers, and end users that previously took 30-45 days and now completes in 30-45 seconds. In this episode of Category Visionaries, we sat down with Alex Witcpalek, CEO and Founder of Continuum, to unpack how he's building what he calls "reverse EDI" in a market of 1.5 million distribution and manufacturing companies across North America. After 13 years selling technology into this space, Alex is now growing 8x year-over-year by turning customers into the primary acquisition channel through network effects. Topics Discussed: Why multi-party returns require replicating order management, warehouse management, and procurement systems simultaneously The tactical sequencing of building network businesses: solving for independent value, achieving critical mass, then activating network effects How Continuum navigates deep ERP integrations (SAP, Oracle, NetSuite, Epicor) plus bespoke business logic across multiple supply chain tiers Facebook retargeting, BDR outbound, events, and customer referrals as the four channels driving growth in a non-PLG market Why business model differentiation is the only remaining moat when technical barriers collapse Building domain expertise distribution systems using AI-powered LMS fed by sales call recordings GTM Lessons For B2B Founders: Choose problems where you can capture 100% of addressable market, not fractional share: Alex deliberately avoided competing in CRM, sales order automation, or accounts payable—categories where even dominant players cap at 25-30% market penetration. Instead, he targeted multi-party reverse logistics, a greenfield problem no one else was solving. This strategic choice eliminates competitive displacement risk and allows every prospect conversation to focus on change management rather than competitive differentiation. Founders should map their TAM against competitive saturation: markets where you can own the entire category create fundamentally different growth trajectories than fighting for fragments. Sequence network businesses: independent value → critical mass → network activation: Alex was told by investors 18 months in that network effects "weren't going to work." His insight: "When you don't have a network, you don't sell the network. It's just in your plans and how you're building." Continuum sold P&L impact, manual labor reduction, and customer experience improvements to early adopters while building network infrastructure invisibly. Only after achieving density in specific verticals (HVAC, electrical, plumbing) did they surface the network value proposition. This sequencing prevents the cold-start problem—founders building marketplace or network businesses must design standalone value that makes the first 100 customers successful independent of network density. Exploit high pain thresholds in legacy industries as competitive barriers: Supply chain companies accept 30-45 day return cycles, manual warranty claims on paper, and playing "guess who" by phone to find inventory across distributor branches. Alex notes they have "extremely high pain threshold" from living with broken systems for decades. While this creates longer education cycles, it also means competitors won't enter (too hard) and once you prove ROI, switching costs become prohibitive. Founders should reframe customer inertia: industries tolerating obvious inefficiencies offer category creation opportunities with built-in moats, not just sales friction. Business model architecture is the only defensible moat—technical differentiation is dead: Alex is building his own e-signature platform (Continue Sign) and AI LMS using vibe coding to prove technical moats no longer exist. Continuum's defensibility comes entirely from network lock-in: displacing them requires disconnecting manufacturers like Carrier, Daikin, and Bosch plus their entire distributor ecosystems simultaneously. He references EDI (1960s technology still dominant today) as proof that network effects create permanent advantages. Founders must architect switching costs, network density, or proprietary data advantages into their business model—technology alone provides zero protection in the AI era. Match channel strategy to actual ICP behavior, not SaaS conventions: Continuum's top lead source is customer-driven network growth—distributors recruiting manufacturers and vice versa. Facebook retargeting works because their 50+ year-old supply chain buyers "are trying to comment on their grandkids' pictures," not scrolling LinkedIn. BDR outbound still delivers high win rates in an industry where business happens on handshakes, making events critical. This channel mix would fail for PLG products but works perfectly for enterprise cycles with $40K ACVs and 90-day sales processes. Founders should ethnographically research where their specific buyers actually spend attention rather than defaulting to LinkedIn, content marketing, or PLG based on what works in adjacent categories. Use 90-day enterprise cycles and multi-stakeholder complexity as qualification, not friction: Continuum runs enterprise sales motions for $40K deals because multi-party returns touch 16 constituents across sales, customer service, fleet, supply chain, warehouse, purchasing, and finance. Rather than trying to simplify buying, Alex uses this complexity as a filter—companies willing to coordinate VP of Supply Chain, COO, and CFO alignment are serious buyers. He layers three value propositions (P&L impact, labor reduction, customer experience) knowing different stakeholders weight them differently. Founders selling into complex environments should embrace multi-threading as a qualification mechanism that improves win rates and reduces churn, not overhead to eliminate. //  Sponsors:  Front Lines — We help B2B tech companies launch, manage, and grow podcasts that drive demand, awareness, and thought leadership. www.FrontLines.io The Global Talent Co. — We help tech startups find, vet, hire, pay, and retain amazing marketing talent that costs 50-70% less than the US & Europe. www.GlobalTalent.co // Don't Miss: New Podcast Series — How I Hire  Senior GTM leaders share the tactical hiring frameworks they use to build winning revenue teams. Hosted by Andy Mowat, who scaled 4 unicorns from $10M to $100M+ ARR and launched Whispered to help executives find their next role. Subscribe here: https://open.spotify.com/show/53yCHlPfLSMFimtv0riPyM  

Wultra provides post-quantum authentication for banks, fintechs, and governments—protecting digital identities from emerging quantum computing threats. In this episode, Peter Dvorak shares how he broke into the notoriously closed banking ecosystem by leveraging his early experience in mobile banking development. From navigating multi-stakeholder enterprise sales to positioning quantum-safe cryptography when the threat timeline remains uncertain (consensus: 2035, but could accelerate), Peter reveals the specific strategies required to sell mission-critical security infrastructure to regulated financial institutions. Topics Discussed How post-quantum cryptography runs on classical computers while protecting against quantum threats Why European banking regulation drives global authentication standards The multi-stakeholder sales process: quantum threat teams, CISOs, CTOs, and digital product owners Conference strategy and analyst relationships (Gartner, KuppingerCole) for category positioning Banking budget cycles and why June/July approaches fail Breaking the "who else is using this?" barrier with banking-specific proof points Positioning as the only post-quantum cryptography provider for digital identity in banking GTM Lessons For B2B Founders Layer future-proofing onto immediate ROI: Post-quantum cryptography doesn't require quantum computers to function—it runs on classical infrastructure while providing superior security. Peter sells banks on moving from SMS OTP to mobile app authentication (tangible, immediate benefit) while positioning quantum resistance as migration insurance: "You won't have to rip-and-replace in three years." For emerging tech, anchor value in today's operational wins, not future scenarios. Give struggling departments concrete wins: Large banks have quantum threat teams tasked with replacing every piece of software by 2030-2035. Peter gives them measurable progress: "We move you from 5% to 10% completion on authentication and digital identity." These teams need defensible projects to justify their existence. Identify which internal groups are fighting for relevance and deliver projects they can report upward. Banking references are binary gatekeepers: Every bank asks "who else is using this?" Non-banking customers (telcos, gaming, lottery) don't count—banking regulation and systems are fundamentally different. The first banking customer is the hardest barrier. Once cleared, subsequent conversations become tractable. Budget aggressively to land that first bank, even at unfavorable terms. Respect the annual budget cycle: Banks allocate resources 12 months ahead. Approaching in Q2/Q3 means budgets are locked—even free POCs fail because internal resources are committed. Peter's pipeline strategy: build relationships and maintain visibility throughout the year, then activate when budget windows open. Don't confuse market education with active pipeline. Map and sequence multi-stakeholder buys: Authentication purchases require alignment across quantum threat teams (if they exist), cybersecurity/compliance, CTO/CIO (infrastructure acceptance), and digital product owners (UX concerns affecting their KPIs). Start at director level—board executives are too removed from technical details. Research each bank's org structure before engaging, then tailor sequencing. EU regulatory leadership creates expansion vectors: European regulations like PSD2 and strong authentication requirements get replicated in Southeast Asia, MENA, and other regions. Peter benefits from solving EU compliance first, then riding regulatory diffusion. The US remains fragmented with smaller regional banks still using username/password. Founders should analyze which geographies lead regulatory adoption in their category. Maintain composure through 18+ month cycles: Peter's regret: losing his temper during negotiations cost him time. Banking doesn't buy impulsively—sales require patience through lengthy security reviews, compliance checks, and committee approvals. Incremental progress and rational positioning matter more than aggressive closing. Emotional control is operational discipline. // Sponsors:  Front Lines — We help B2B tech companies launch, manage, and grow podcasts that drive demand, awareness, and thought leadership. www.FrontLines.io The Global Talent Co. — We help tech startups find, vet, hire, pay, and retain amazing marketing talent that costs 50-70% less than the US & Europe. www.GlobalTalent.co // Don't Miss: New Podcast Series — How I Hire Senior GTM leaders share the tactical hiring frameworks they use to build winning revenue teams. Hosted by Andy Mowat, who scaled 4 unicorns from $10M to $100M+ ARR and launched Whispered to help executives find their next role.  Subscribe here: https://open.spotify.com/show/53yCHlPfLSMFimtv0riPyM

Anthony Lye joined Quid 14 months ago to lead a complete business model transformation. With three decades in Silicon Valley including executive roles at Palantir, NetApp, Oracle, and Siebel Systems, Anthony has operated through every major technology disruption. At Quid, he's dismantling the traditional SaaS playbook—eliminating seat-based pricing, collapsing the software/services separation, and refocusing the entire company on delivering measurable business outcomes rather than analytics tools. In this conversation, Anthony explains why most SaaS companies will fail in the AI era, how Palantir's forward-deployed engineering model creates defensible value, and the specific mental models founders need to reimagine their businesses before disruption makes the decision for them. Topics Discussed How Silicon Valley's technology oligopolies turn over every five years  Why AI shifts technology from features to benefits for the first time  Quid's transformation from social listening SaaS to outcome-based insights delivery  The separation of software and services as a structural flaw in SaaS economics  How forward-deployed engineers at Palantir and Quid collapse the services layer  Why SaaS failed knowledge workers while email remained dominant Discontinuity theory and how oligopolies resist then capitulate to disruption  The "fired tomorrow, compete with yourself" thought experiment for strategy clarity  How to build executive teams as custodians rather than functional heads GTM Lessons For B2B Founders Collapse software and services into outcome delivery: Quid eliminated seat-based pricing and module sales, shifting from IT budget to labor budget by selling insights, trends, and actionable information directly. This repositioned the product from a tool requiring sophisticated data scientists to a team augmentation service protecting brand health and driving commerce decisions. The business model change fundamentally altered buyer, buying process, and deal economics. When your product requires customization or professional services to deliver value, you've identified a structural opportunity to collapse both layers. Deploy the "fired and competing" thought exercise: Anthony's mentor advised imagining your board fires you tomorrow and you immediately compete against your own company. List the three things you'd do on day one to win. Then ask why you're not doing those things now. This exercise cuts through organizational inertia and reveals the obvious strategic moves you're avoiding. The discomfort in your answers indicates where you need to act. Match decision velocity to execution needs, not comfort: Tom Brett at Menlo Ventures told Anthony to increase from 3-4 decisions weekly to 50. The forcing function prevents overthinking and eliminates "second guessing paralysis." Organizations need clarity and direction more than perfect decisions. Write down every decision, communicate it clearly, and publicly reverse course when wrong. This builds a culture where being decisive and correctable beats being slow and theoretically optimal. Recognize when your hypothesis expires: Quid's social listening thesis was correct initially, but markets evolved while the company didn't. The problem remained valid (understanding brand health, shopping trends, product innovation signals), but the SaaS tool-based solution became untenable as data complexity demanded sophisticated users, shrinking addressable market. Founders must distinguish between persistent customer problems and expired solution approaches. Your original hypothesis has an expiration date. Identify the ox that gets gored: Every deal requires customers to stop spending elsewhere. You must be 10x faster or one-tenth the cost to overcome status quo bias. Explicitly identify which vendor or budget line you're displacing, then validate your value proposition can actually displace it. Most startups fail this calculus and wonder why proof-of-concept success doesn't translate to procurement approval. Start with blank canvas, fail backwards to SaaS: When reimagining for AI, don't bolt features onto existing architecture. Begin with first principles about what customers actually want to accomplish, design that solution using current capabilities, then fall back to SaaS components only where necessary. Anthony warns that additive approaches preserve structural constraints that prevent you from capturing the full opportunity. // Sponsors: Front Lines — We help B2B tech companies launch, manage, and grow podcasts that drive demand, awareness, and thought leadership. www.FrontLines.io The Global Talent Co. — We help tech startups find, vet, hire, pay, and retain amazing marketing talent that costs 50-70% less than the US & Europe. www.GlobalTalent.co // Don't Miss: New Podcast Series — How I Hire Senior GTM leaders share the tactical hiring frameworks they use to build winning revenue teams. Hosted by Andy Mowat, who scaled 4 unicorns from $10M to $100M+ ARR and launched Whispered to help executives find their next role. Subscribe here: https://open.spotify.com/show/53yCHlPfLSMFimtv0riPyM

Wisdom AI sells to enterprise data teams, empowering them to deploy AI data analysts that automate analytics functions traditionally handled by human analysts. As a former Rubrik co-founder and Google search ranking engineer, Soham identified the analytics problem firsthand while scaling Rubrik from intuition-driven to data-driven operations. In this episode of Category Visionaries, Soham shares how four Rubrik alumni are building a category-defining solution in the data analytics space, the tactical insights from targeting mid-market accounts to optimize deal velocity and onboarding experience, and how AI buying committees shifted from experimental budgets in 2024 to gatekeepers requiring departmental champions in 2025. Topics Discussed: Leveraging mid-market focus to compress sales cycles while refining onboarding as core product differentiation The transition from gut-based decisions to data-driven operations and why analytics remains unsolved Taming LLMs for precision and explainability requirements in enterprise analytics contexts Strategic navigation of the data ecosystem following the FiveTran-DBT merger and positioning against Snowflake, Databricks, and cloud providers Overlaying product-led trial motions on enterprise sales to maintain momentum during extended procurement cycles AI committee evolution from 2024's experimental phase to 2025's security-focused consolidation mandate Pursuing 10x productivity gains versus incremental improvement in established analytics markets GTM Lessons For B2B Founders: Use mid-market to build onboarding velocity as moat: Rubrik deliberately targeted mid-market accounts despite being an enterprise product that closed eight-figure deals. This served two strategic purposes: compressed sales cycles enabled faster learning loops, and the necessity of quick onboarding forced the team to build exceptional admin experiences that became their primary differentiation. For B2B founders, mid-market isn't just easier logos—it's a forcing function for product refinement that creates competitive advantages when moving upmarket. Find problems through operational scar tissue, not market research: Wisdom AI originated when Soham tried moonlighting as engineering's data analyst during Rubrik's scaling phase and discovered he couldn't do it effectively. This wasn't a customer interview insight—it was firsthand recognition that even sophisticated technical leaders with dedicated focus couldn't wrangle data for operational decisions. The problem proved ubiquitous across every business leader optimizing top line, bottom line, and operations. B2B founders building for enterprises should prioritize pain points they've personally hit in operational contexts where existing solutions demonstrably failed them. Engineer time-to-value in minutes for PLG overlay on enterprise sales: Wisdom AI's experiential quality—users get excited when they try it, not when they see slides—creates PLG opportunity despite enterprise positioning. The critical difference: sales-led motions tolerate weeks to first value and build confidence through process, but self-serve requires hook-to-value in minutes with zero support. Soham's insight is using PLG not for credit card swipes but to maintain champion enthusiasm during lengthy procurement processes. B2B founders should architect trial experiences that deliver standalone value pre-data connection, creating internal advocates who sustain momentum through AI committee reviews. Treat ecosystem navigation as first-class GTM workstream: Wisdom AI's success depends on partnership execution with Snowflake, Databricks, and cloud providers—all potential competitors with their own AI initiatives. The FiveTran-DBT merger created immediate dynamic shifts requiring repositioning. Rather than viewing partnerships as business development, Soham frames ecosystem navigation as core GTM infrastructure requiring dedicated strategy and repeatable playbooks. B2B founders in platform-adjacent spaces should staff for partnership complexity early, recognizing that integration points and co-selling motions often determine market access more than direct sales capacity. Architect for AI committee gatekeepers with departmental executive sponsorship: The market fundamentally shifted from mid-2024's "experimental AI budgets, try everything" to 2025's centralized AI committees focused on security, tool consolidation, and preventing organizational wild west scenarios. Soham's tactical response: secure champions owning specific important departments who can navigate approval hierarchies while trial experiences maintain grassroots excitement. The implication for B2B AI founders—assumption of longer cycles, security scrutiny as table stakes, and explicit strategies for climbing from individual enthusiast to organizational deployment become non-negotiable enterprise sales requirements. // Sponsors: Front Lines — We help B2B tech companies launch, manage, and grow podcasts that drive demand, awareness, and thought leadership. www.FrontLines.io The Global Talent Co. — We help tech startups find, vet, hire, pay, and retain amazing marketing talent that costs 50-70% less than the US & Europe. www.GlobalTalent.co // Don't Miss: New Podcast Series — How I Hire Senior GTM leaders share the tactical hiring frameworks they use to build winning revenue teams. Hosted by Andy Mowat, who scaled 4 unicorns from $10M to $100M+ ARR and launched Whispered to help executives find their next role. Subscribe here: https://open.spotify.com/show/53yCHlPfLSMFimtv0riPyM

Runway is building FP&A software that solves what Siqi Chen calls "the impossible problem"—matching Excel's speed and flexibility for thinking while functioning as an enterprise finance platform. In this episode of The Front Lines, wew sat down with Siqi to unpack Runway's mischief marketing playbook, why they enriched hot sauce pre-orders for lead gen, and how they're implementing AI as a coworker rather than a copilot. Topics Discussed: The unit economics behind the Burn Rate hot sauce campaign: $40K spend, 5K pre-orders, millions of views  How Siqi justifies creative marketing spend as CEO and CFO: downside scenarios must break even, upside gets uncapped returns  Naval's prescient 2020 advice: don't call it CFO AI because "everything's going to be AI anyway"  Why finance buyers completely flipped on AI in 24 months—from indifferent to requiring it  The three emotional triggers that drive FP&A tool adoption: frustration, resentment, anxiety  Runway's approach to competing with Excel by changing abstraction layers, not features  Building AI as a coworker (Ari) that lives in Slack, email, and comments—not a sidebar  Why proof-of-human marketing compounds in value as AI slop becomes the baseline GTM Lessons For B2B Founders: Model creative campaigns like venture bets with downside protection: Siqi's framework: $40K for 200 hot sauces wrapped with $100 bills equals 1.5 deals to break even at mid-five-figure ACVs. But the real play was generating 5,000 pre-orders, enriching the top 200, and converting ICP matches at "well above 1%" into pipeline. The math ensures you don't lose money in downside scenarios while creative execution delivers uncapped upside. For B2B founders: calculate your break-even deal count, then structure campaigns where lead gen mechanics provide a safety net under the brand play. Hire for proof of work, not creative credentials: When Cal (Taika co-founder) cold-emailed Siqi with designed mockups of Burn Rate hot sauce and Runway jerseys, that was the interview. Siqi was already a Taika customer who remembered the 415 phone number branding on the can. His advice: "There's no better resume than someone saying 'hey, I submitted a pull request' or 'here's some designs.'" For creative roles especially, evaluate the artifacts directly rather than filtering through credentials or pitches about what they could do. Sell to emotion-driven active searchers, not satisfied users: Runway identified three specific emotions that trigger FP&A software searches: frustration (manually pulling from 20+ data sources monthly, copy-pasting QuickBooks exports), resentment (department heads treating finance requests as "the stupid form" and ignoring deadlines), and anxiety (one error in 10 million Google Sheets cells breaks the entire model). These aren't rational pain points—they're emotional breaking points that drive active solution-seeking. Don't build go-to-market around convincing satisfied Excel users. Instead, optimize for discovery when these specific emotions converge. Treat abstraction changes as category creation opportunities: Siqi explains Airtable's success came from changing Excel's abstraction from cell to row, enabling databases and applications. Runway's insight: business planning requires abstraction changes that Excel can't provide—specifically treating the model as a "game engine" or "simulation of a business" rather than a spreadsheet. The category emerged from that technical insight, not from marketing positioning. For technical founders: identify where your abstraction layer change creates fundamentally new capabilities, then let category definition follow from customer language around those capabilities. Time creative marketing to buyer perception shifts: Two years ago, Runway demoed AI features to leads who "didn't care at all." Today, buyers "don't care what the AI feature is, they just care that it's AI"—a complete flip. Meanwhile, Runway's competitors use .ai domains while Runway uses .com, creating unexpected differentiation. The lesson: buyer perception of emerging technologies follows unpredictable curves. Creative marketing that feels early can land perfectly if timed to perception inflection points. Track not just technology maturity but buyer discourse and demand signals to time creative bets. // Sponsors: Front Lines — We help B2B tech companies launch, manage, and grow podcasts that drive demand, awareness, and thought leadership. www.FrontLines.io The Global Talent Co. — We help tech startups find, vet, hire, pay, and retain amazing marketing talent that costs 50-70% less than the US & Europe. www.GlobalTalent.co // Don't Miss: New Podcast Series — How I Hire Senior GTM leaders share the tactical hiring frameworks they use to build winning revenue teams. Hosted by Andy Mowat, who scaled 4 unicorns from $10M to $100M+ ARR and launched Whispered to help executives find their next role. Subscribe here: https://open.spotify.com/show/53yCHlPfLSMFimtv0riPyM

MishiPay has scaled from processing $10 million to over $250 million in annual transactions by abandoning product purity for market pragmatism. What started as a mobile-first scan-and-go solution evolved into a comprehensive checkout platform spanning self-checkout kiosks, RFID systems, mobile POS, and traditional cash registers—now deployed across 2,000+ stores in North America, Europe, the Middle East, and Australia. In this episode of Category Visionaries, we sat down with Mustafa Khanwala, CEO and Founder of MishiPay, to dissect why the "inferior" product often wins in retail tech, how trust-building mechanics differ fundamentally across geographies, and what it actually takes to maintain startup agility at enterprise scale. Topics Discussed: The seven-year journey from consumer mobile app to B2B checkout infrastructure Why MishiPay nearly failed by over-indexing on superior UX instead of adoption curves The 2022 pivot that unlocked triple-digit revenue growth with flat headcount How checkout solution requirements vary by customer visit frequency (weekly grocery vs. annual travel retail) Trust-building in enterprise sales: face-to-face requirements in Middle Eastern markets vs. video-first Western sales cycles Delivering two-week go-live timelines and 10-minute UI changes while maintaining 99.9999% uptime AI integration strategy: internal efficiency first, then customer-facing analytics and autonomous POS management GTM Lessons For B2B Founders: Adoption friction kills better products: Mustafa spent years refusing to build self-checkout because scan-and-go was objectively superior UX. The company nearly died defending this position. "Should we have started on some of our other products in 2019 instead of 2022? Probably." The lesson isn't about building inferior products—it's about understanding that customers evaluate "better" through implementation risk, training overhead, and behavior change required. B2B founders must map the gap between current state and ideal state, then build the bridge products that de-risk each transition step, even if those bridges feel like compromises. Customer frequency determines viable solution complexity: Scan-and-go requires significant user education investment that only generates ROI with weekly-plus usage. In travel retail where 70-80% of customers visit 1-2x annually, that education cost never pays back. MishiPay now matches solution types to visit patterns: scan-and-go for high-frequency grocery, staff-assisted mobile POS for low-frequency travel retail, RFID self-checkout for mid-frequency fashion. B2B founders should calculate the learning curve payback period against actual usage frequency—if users won't encounter your product enough times to justify the learning investment, you need a different entry point regardless of how good the end-state experience is. Enterprise stability with startup agility is a wedge, not a platitude: Every vendor claims this. MishiPay operationalizes it through specific SLAs: two-week store go-lives, 10-minute button changes, two-day promotion additions, two-week payment method integration—all while maintaining 99.9999% uptime that enterprise POS demands. This isn't about "moving fast," it's about architecture decisions that enable rapid customization without stability trade-offs (mobile-first, cloud-native, API-driven). B2B founders should define their agility claims in measurable timelines and uptime guarantees, not adjectives. If you can't operationalize "flexibility" into specific hours or days for changes, it's not a differentiator. Geographic trust-building fundamentally differs in mechanism, not degree: Western enterprise sales: product merit → pilot → relationship building → expansion. Middle Eastern enterprise sales: relationship building → pilot opportunity → product merit demonstration → deal. The difference isn't relationship importance (both require it), but sequencing. Mustafa noted Middle Eastern business culture evolved from pearl diving where "their whole job was to be able to look at someone in the eyes and decide if that person was going to scam them." Face-to-face happens pre-deal in Middle East, post-deal in the West. B2B founders expanding globally must rebuild their sales motion sequencing by geography, not just translate materials or add local reps. Staff productivity scales by solving the manager's problem, not the user's pain: MishiPay's roadmap progression reveals a pattern: first solve for store staff (checkout experience), then assistant managers (store operations), then store managers (performance analytics), then HQ (multi-store optimization). Each layer up requires data aggregation from the layer below. The AI analytics launch targets store-level decisions (pricing, promotions, inventory) using transaction data from POS—this expands buyer persona from IT/Operations to Finance/Merchandising. B2B founders should map their product expansion as a vertical climb through the org chart, where each new buyer persona requires accumulated data from the previous user tier.   // Sponsors: Front Lines — We help B2B tech companies launch, manage, and grow podcasts that drive demand, awareness, and thought leadership. www.FrontLines.io The Global Talent Co. — We help tech startups find, vet, hire, pay, and retain amazing marketing talent that costs 50-70% less than the US & Europe. www.GlobalTalent.co // Don't Miss: New Podcast Series — How I Hire Senior GTM leaders share the tactical hiring frameworks they use to build winning revenue teams. Hosted by Andy Mowat, who scaled 4 unicorns from $10M to $100M+ ARR and launched Whispered to help executives find their next role.  Subscribe here: https://open.spotify.com/show/53yCHlPfLSMFimtv0riPyM  

Assembled is the AI customer support platform powering hundreds of modern enterprises including Stripe, Robinhood, Salesforce, and Ashley Furniture. The company's largest customer operates a 20,000-person contact center. With products spanning AI chat and voice agents that resolve 70-80% of tickets to sophisticated workforce management and forecasting systems, Assembled's core thesis challenges the industry narrative: the best support teams orchestrate humans and AI in perfect balance rather than replacing one with the other. In a recent episode of Category Visionaries, we sat down with Ryan Wang, CEO and Co-Founder of Assembled, to explore the company's journey from eight months to first customer to becoming the infrastructure behind customer experiences at scale. Topics Discussed: The reality gap between AI support demos and production deployment Why sophisticated buyers now demand quality benchmarks and latency metrics over feature lists The hidden complexity in contact center work: KYC compliance, fraud review, and multi-system workflows How the Klarna "fire everyone" approach failed and what it reveals about the market Patrick and John Collison's all-company support rotations at Stripe The product-market fit question that ended six months of wrong direction Enterprise destiny baked into early product decisions Converting LinkedIn discomfort into a systematic storytelling engine Path dependence from workforce management to AI automation products Why customer support problems rhyme with operations challenges across industries GTM Lessons For B2B Founders: Quality-first positioning wins when buyers move past demo amazement: Ryan observed a critical market shift. Sophisticated buyers now run rigorous bake-offs with training data variability and ask for latency metrics, quality benchmarks, and production performance data. The last three AI deals Assembled closed required detailed competitive evaluations. When messaging emphasizes cost reduction over quality improvement, you lose credibility with buyers who understand that turning off support entirely would be free—they're investing in lifetime value and loyalty creation. Position around the buyer's actual objective hierarchy: quality first, efficiency as validation. The product-market fit question that encodes your entire GTM strategy: Ryan's co-founder asked prospects "What is software that you must have or you hate your options?" This single question revealed multiple strategic insights simultaneously: you're targeting painkillers in established categories, pursuing replacement sales against weak incumbents, and entering markets with demonstrated willingness to pay. For Assembled, this naturally surfaced workforce management—a must-have category with Windows 95-era tools serving 20,000-person teams. The question's elegance is how it filters for product-market fit and GTM approach in one conversation. Access the best through respect signals, not connections: When hiring his first engineering executive at 15 people, Ryan got an introduction to a former VP of Engineering at Facebook, then explicitly signaled time respect: requested only 15 minutes, clarified he wasn't recruiting, offered availability "Saturday 8pm or anytime," and had specific questions prepared. The call happened at an odd Saturday time. The insight wasn't just learning about "Dual Lands" leadership (a Magic: The Gathering reference)—it was understanding how exceptional minds construct mental models. You can reach these people through investor networks or multi-hop introductions, but earning their time requires demonstrating you'll use it surgically. Recognize when you're not "the company" to avoid strategic errors: A top recruiting firm told Ryan "you're not Stripe, so you can't sell people like you're Stripe." At any moment, one Silicon Valley company occupies a unique position—Stripe then, OpenAI now—where normal rules don't apply. That company can eliminate product managers, remove all titles, or make unconventional demands. Understanding you're not in that position prevents catastrophic hiring missteps. Ryan had to recalibrate from Stripe-era patterns where his recruiter became Anthropic's president and his onboarding buddy became OpenAI's president. Your positioning must match your actual market gravity, not your aspirational tier. Systematize founder storytelling to compound credibility: Ryan solved founder marketing discomfort by reframing from self-promotion to being an intermediary—sharing customer stories from Armenia, banking conferences, and global contact centers rather than broadcasting opinions. The system: Friday morning sessions with prompts ("interesting things from this week," "near-death moments," "challenges from 1-10M to 10-20M ARR," "why London now?"), team filters for compelling angles, three drafts weekly, then editing. The Science of Storytelling principles apply: narratives demonstrating lived experience build more credibility than thought leadership. This creates a flywheel where audience members surface their own stories in comments and DMs, feeding future content. // Sponsors: Front Lines — We help B2B tech companies launch, manage, and grow podcasts that drive demand, awareness, and thought leadership. www.FrontLines.io The Global Talent Co. — We help tech startups find, vet, hire, pay, and retain amazing marketing talent that costs 50-70% less than the US & Europe. www.GlobalTalent.co // Don't Miss: New Podcast Series — How I Hire Senior GTM leaders share the tactical hiring frameworks they use to build winning revenue teams. Hosted by Andy Mowat, who scaled 4 unicorns from $10M to $100M+ ARR and launched Whispered to help executives find their next role.  Subscribe here: https://open.spotify.com/show/53yCHlPfLSMFimtv0riPyM

Keye helps private equity investors accelerate deal evaluation through AI-powered quantitative analysis. In a recent episode of Category Visionaries, I sat down with Rohan Parikh, Co-Founder and CEO of Keye, to explore how his team bridges the gap between AI capabilities and the 100% accuracy requirements of financial due diligence—enabling PE firms to say no to deals earlier and focus resources on the right opportunities. Topics Discussed: Why ChatGPT-style search and summarization tools fail in PE workflows—summaries don't drive investment decisions The technical challenge of achieving 100% deterministic accuracy while maintaining AI contextualization capabilities How market timing created unexpected GTM momentum: PE operating partners watching portfolio companies transform with AI became receptive to internal tooling Persona-specific cold email strategies that demonstrate workflow understanding rather than biographical personalization Design partner economics in conservative industries: accepting

Voltiris has developed spectroscopy-based solar panels that filter light for greenhouse crops while generating renewable energy. Unlike traditional opaque panels that cause 60-80% yield reduction in high-tech greenhouses, Voltiris's technology harvests only the light wavelengths unused by photosynthesis. In this episode, we sat down with Nicolas Weber, Co-Founder and CEO of Voltiris, to explore how a former BCG consultant and a PhD spectroscopist are navigating multi-season validation cycles with family-owned greenhouse operations across Northern Europe. Topics Discussed: Why spectroscopy expertise unlocked a solution to greenhouse energy challenges The technical reality: traditional solar creates 60-80% yield loss in high-tech greenhouses Earning credibility with second and third-generation greenhouse operators Time as constrained resource: multi-season validation in agriculture markets System-level thinking required to manage complex greenhouse operations Offline GTM in conservative B2B agriculture: fairs, referrals, and crop advisors Platform strategy: expanding from solar to complete greenhouse energy management GTM Lessons For B2B Founders: Time constraints differ fundamentally in hardware: Voltiris faces season-dependent validation cycles where "you can throw as much cash as you want on a tomato, it's going to take one year to demonstrate that it works." Most growers demand 2-3 full growing seasons before adoption. Hardware founders must structure runway, investor expectations, and partnership terms around immovable biological or physical timelines—not software-style iteration speeds. Product-market fit exists before product in infrastructure plays: Voltiris confirmed demand preemptively. Nicolas explains: "If the technological promise holds, there is demand...the growers, they already told us from the beginning we're waiting for solution like this to come." When selling infrastructure that solves existential problems (energy transition, electrification mandates), validate market pull before achieving technical proof. This inverts typical startup sequencing but derisks decades of R&D investment. Treat early customers as co-creation partners, not transactions: Voltiris positions initial deployments as "joint creation" rather than sales. Nicolas's pitch: "This is the future vision. Are you ready to build it with us and do you want to jump into that shit with us?" In markets with 25-30 year product lifecycles and 3-year company track records, transactional selling fails. Structure partnerships with shared risk, transparent data access, and collaborative problem-solving. Master domain expertise at operator level, not executive level: Voltiris's technical co-founders became greenhouse operations experts, not just energy technology experts. Nicolas credits this: "My two co founders are now among the best experts you have in terms of how to run a greenhouse." In complex B2B environments (agriculture, manufacturing, logistics), founders must understand day-to-day operations—not just C-suite pain points—to build credible solutions. Use direct feedback environments to compress learning cycles: Dutch growers provided unfiltered assessment within minutes. Nicolas values this: "If what you're building is not good, you would know directly within five, 10 minutes...they would say, not worth my time, please, the door is here." Seek brutally honest customer segments that accelerate validation, even if acquisition is harder. Fast negative feedback prevents wasted development cycles on wrong assumptions. //   Sponsors:  Front Lines — We help B2B tech companies launch, manage, and grow podcasts that drive demand, awareness, and thought leadership. www.FrontLines.io The Global Talent Co. — We help tech startups find, vet, hire, pay, and retain amazing marketing talent that costs 50-70% less than the US & Europe. www.GlobalTalent.co // Don't Miss: New Podcast Series — How I Hire Senior GTM leaders share the tactical hiring frameworks they use to build winning revenue teams. Hosted by Andy Mowat, who scaled 4 unicorns from $10M to $100M+ ARR and launched Whispered to help executives find their next role.  Subscribe here: https://open.spotify.com/show/53yCHlPfLSMFimtv0riPyM  

Nightfall AI is pioneering AI-native data loss prevention (DLP) for enterprises navigating cloud, SaaS, and AI application proliferation. Founded in 2017 by former Uber engineers who witnessed data breaches firsthand, Nightfall addresses the architectural limitations and false positive problems plaguing legacy DLP solutions. By leveraging machine learning and large language models across three distinct layers—content classification, risk assessment, and forensic investigation—Nightfall delivers 10x accuracy improvements while enabling secure AI adoption. In this episode of Category Visionaries, I sat down with Rohan Sathe, Co-Founder & CEO of Nightfall AI, to explore their strategy for displacing entrenched incumbents and positioning as the security enabler for organizational AI deployment. Topics Discussed: Nightfall's founding thesis addressing DLP coverage gaps created by cloud and SaaS migration Three-layer AI architecture: content classification, behavioral risk analysis, and agent-assisted forensics Positioning against legacy DLP's rules-based approaches and exact data match workarounds Market education shift post-ChatGPT: from "don't use AI" to "enable AI securely" Purple brand differentiation strategy in security's dark-themed visual landscape Conference ROI reallocation: executive suite meetings versus booth presence at RSA and Black Hat Mid-market to enterprise expansion pattern through peer-to-peer word-of-mouth Founder-led LinkedIn strategy balancing market education with competitive displacement narratives Sales team composition: domain practitioners versus traditional sales profiles GTM Lessons For B2B Founders: Structure POVs to prove quantifiable superiority on one dimension: Rohan revealed Nightfall benchmarks against Google and Microsoft DLP APIs, demonstrating 10x accuracy improvements during proof-of-value cycles. When challenging mature categories, identify the single metric where you demonstrably outperform and architect evaluations to surface that gap. The key isn't claiming superiority—it's creating controlled comparisons where buyers verify it themselves. Deploy AI across three workflow layers, not as a monolithic feature: Nightfall applies AI distinctly at content classification (identifying sensitive data with high precision), behavioral analysis (distinguishing risky data movement from standard workflows), and investigation assistance (helping analysts focus forensic efforts). This creates compounding value and defensibility. Map where AI can reduce friction at multiple decision points in your customer's workflow rather than treating it as a single capability. Replace field marketing spend with curated CISO access: Nightfall redirected budget from RSA and Black Hat booths to private suites hosting scheduled executive meetings. Rohan emphasized engaging "chief information security officers who sign the checks" in intimate settings rather than booth traffic. For enterprise sales, calculate cost-per-meeting with economic buyers and reallocate spend accordingly. Design 8-person dinners as vendor-neutral industry forums: Nightfall hosts 3-4 annual dinners with 5-7 prospects and 2-3 team members (founders, head of product) structured around industry developments—like OpenAI's agent workflow builder and security implications—not product pitches. The format positions Nightfall as thought leaders while qualifying prospects through discussion quality. Agenda topics, not sales decks, drive conversion. Hire former practitioners into quota-carrying roles: Rohan identified hiring former DLP security operations analysts as account executives or solutions architects, mirroring trends in legal tech (hiring lawyers) and HR tech (hiring recruiters). For technical categories with sophisticated buyers, domain fluency in customer-facing roles outweighs traditional sales experience. This isn't solutions engineering—it's putting practitioners in quota-carrying positions. Use LinkedIn for two narratives: market education and competitive wins: Rohan posts thought leadership on DLP evolution and AI security implications alongside selective announcements of competitive displacements at enterprise AI companies and top 10 banks. He noted role postings also drive engagement, signaling growth momentum. The pattern: educate on category gaps, prove you're winning deals in those gaps, show team expansion. Avoid pure product promotion. Leverage AI adoption mandates as your demand generation engine: Post-ChatGPT, Rohan noted "board mandate and CEO mandate from every company to use as much AI as you can" created new security requirements. Nightfall shifted positioning from "prevent data loss" to "enable AI adoption securely." When macro shifts create executive-level mandates in your category, realign messaging around enabling that mandate rather than preventing its risks. Challenge category conventions through education, not assertion: Rather than simply claiming exact data match (EDM) is obsolete, Nightfall explains EDM emerged as a workaround for rules-based approaches' false positive problems—and ML eliminates the need for workarounds entirely. When displacing established practices, reveal why current solutions exist (what problem they patch) before explaining why your approach eliminates the underlying issue. //  Sponsors:  Front Lines — We help B2B tech companies launch, manage, and grow podcasts that drive demand, awareness, and thought leadership. www.FrontLines.io The Global Talent Co. — We help tech startups find, vet, hire, pay, and retain amazing marketing talent that costs 50-70% less than the US & Europe. www.GlobalTalent.co // Don't Miss: New Podcast Series — How I Hire Senior GTM leaders share the tactical hiring frameworks they use to build winning revenue teams. Hosted by Andy Mowat, who scaled 4 unicorns from $10M to $100M+ ARR and launched Whispered to help executives find their next role. Subscribe here: https://open.spotify.com/show/53yCHlPfLSMFimtv0riPyM

BlueRock is building an agentic security fabric to protect organizations deploying AI agents and MCP workflows. With a $25 Million Series A, founder Bob Tinker is tackling what he sees as a 10x larger opportunity than mobile's enterprise disruption. Bob previously scaled MobileIron from zero to $150 million in five years and took it public in 2014. In this episode of Category Visionaries, Bob shares the strategic mistakes that cost MobileIron its category positioning, why go-to-market fit is the missing framework between PMF and scale, and how B2B marketing has fundamentally transformed in just 18 months. Topics Discussed: Taking a company public: the killer marketing event versus the unexpected team psychology challenges of daily stock volatility Why agentic AI workflows create unprecedented security challenges at the action and data layer, not just prompts The strategic timing of category definition: MobileIron's cautionary tale of letting Gartner define you as "MDM" when customers bought for security Where enterprise buyers actually get advice now that Gartner's influence has diminished AEO (Answer Engine Optimization) replacing SEO as the primary discovery mechanism for B2B solutions Why 1.0 categories have fundamentally unclear ICPs versus 2.0/3.0 products with crisp buyer personas The "high urgency, low friction" framework for prioritizing what to build in nascent markets Go-to-market fit: the repeatable growth recipe that unlocks scaling post-PMF Unlearning as competitive advantage for second-time founders GTM Lessons For B2B Founders: Time your category noun definition strategically: MobileIron focused exclusively on solving the problem (the verb) but waited too long to influence category nomenclature. Gartner labeled it "Mobile Device Management" when customer purchase drivers were security-focused, not management. This misalignment constrained positioning for years with no way to correct it. The framework: lead with verb, but proactively shape the noun before external analysts do it for you. Bob's doing this differently at BlueRock by distinguishing "agentic action security" from "prompt security" early, even while the broader market sorts out AI security taxonomy. Use customer language as category discovery, not invention: Bob's breakthrough on BlueRock positioning came from asking prospects: "How would you describe what we do to your peers?" One prospect distinguished their focus on "the action side - taking AI and taking action on data and tools" versus prompt inspection and AI firewalls. This customer-generated framing revealed the natural fault lines in how practitioners think about the problem space. The tactical application: run this exact question with your first 10-15 qualified prospects and pattern-match their language, rather than workshopping category names internally. Engineer for the "high urgency, low friction" intersection: Bob's filtering criteria for BlueRock's roadmap requires both dimensions simultaneously. When a prospect revealed they were building their own MCP security tools - a signal of acute, unmet pain - they also asked BlueRock to add prompt security features. Bob's framework forced a "no" despite clear demand because it would violate low friction. The discipline: if a feature request fails either test (not urgent enough OR too much friction), it doesn't make the cut, even when prospects explicitly ask for it. Accept ICP ambiguity as a feature, not bug, of 1.0 markets: In 2.0/3.0 categories, you can target "VP of Detection & Response" with precision. In 1.0 markets like agentic security, Bob finds buyers across three distinct orgs: agentic development teams building secure-by-default systems, product security teams inside engineering (not under the CISO), and traditional security organizations. His thesis: this lack of crisp ICP definition is actually a reliable signal you're in a genuinely new market. The response: invest in community engagement across all three buyer types rather than forcing premature segmentation. Shift content strategy from SEO to AEO immediately: Bob identifies the clock speed of marketing change as "breathtaking" - what worked 18 months ago is obsolete. The specific shift: ranking above the fold in Google search is now irrelevant. What matters is appearing in the answer box that ChatGPT or Google Gemini surfaces above traditional results. This isn't incremental SEO optimization - it requires fundamentally restructuring content to feed LLM context windows and answer engines rather than keyword-optimizing for traditional search crawlers. Treat go-to-market fit as a distinct inflection point: Bob observed a consistent pattern across MobileIron, Box (Aaron Levie), Citrix (Mark Templeton), Palo Alto Networks (Mark McLaughlin), and SendGrid (Sameer Dholakia) - all hit PMF, hired salespeople aggressively, burned cash, and stalled growth while boards grew frustrated. The missing concept: PMF proves you can create value; GTM fit proves you can capture it repeatedly. It's the "repeatable growth recipe to find and win customers over and over again." The tactical implication: after PMF, resist pressure to scale headcount and instead obsess over making your first 3-5 sales cycles systematically repeatable before hiring your second AE. Build community as primary discovery in fragmented buyer markets: Bob's most different GTM motion versus five years ago: "We're just out talking to prospects and customers - individual reach outs, hitting people up on LinkedIn, posting in discussion boards, engaging with the community." This isn't supplemental to demand gen; it's replaced traditional top-of-funnel. When prospects exist across multiple personas without clear titles, community presence in Reddit, Stack Overflow, and LinkedIn becomes the only scalable discovery mechanism. The benchmark: successful new tech companies have built communities of early users before they've built repeatable sales motions. Practice systematic unlearning as second-time founder discipline: Bob's most personal insight: "What really got in my way wasn't what I needed to learn. It was what I needed to unlearn." The specific application: he's questioning his entire MobileIron marketing playbook because "blindly applying that eight-year-old playbook to marketing or sales will end in tears." His framework: periodic gut checks asking "What assumptions am I making? How should I think about this differently?" rather than letting inertia drive execution. The meta-lesson: success creates muscle memory that becomes liability without deliberate examination. Second-time founders should actively audit which reflexes to preserve versus discard. // Sponsors: Front Lines — We help B2B tech companies launch, manage, and grow podcasts that drive demand, awareness, and thought leadership. www.FrontLines.io The Global Talent Co. — We help tech startups find, vet, hire, pay, and retain amazing marketing talent that costs 50-70% less than the US & Europe. www.GlobalTalent.co // Don't Miss: New Podcast Series — How I Hire Senior GTM leaders share the tactical hiring frameworks they use to build winning revenue teams. Hosted by Andy Mowat, who scaled 4 unicorns from $10M to $100M+ ARR and launched Whispered to help executives find their next role.  Subscribe here: https://open.spotify.com/show/53yCHlPfLSMFimtv0riPyM

tiun is building auth and payment infrastructure that consolidates two traditional categories into one streamlined solution. By combining social login with instant payment functionality, tiun eliminates the standard account creation and credit card entry flow, reducing user onboarding to a two-click process. Operating as merchant of record, tiun serves online entertainment businesses, content creators, news publishers, and SaaS platforms. The company currently reaches 10 million users monthly through customer website placements and is growing transactions 15-20% month-over-month. In this episode of Category Visionaries, Sandro Zweig shares how tiun evolved from targeting news publishers to building a broader entertainment ecosystem, the challenges of creating a market for a combined category, and the data-driven approach to proving ROI before scaling. Topics Discussed: Evolution from news publisher focus to entertainment and SaaS ecosystem strategy Consolidating auth and payment infrastructure into a single category Case study metrics: 20% uplift in paying users with under 1% subscription cannibalization The 2.5x lead generation improvement versus traditional subscription models Building market-specific ecosystems as a B2B2C go-to-market strategy DACH penetration strategy before US expansion Achieving organic exposure through customer website placement Reducing integration complexity to drive adoption in an emerging category GTM Lessons For B2B Founders: Geographic density creates B2B2C flywheels: tiun's go-to-market prioritizes ecosystem density within a single market over broad geographic distribution. Users discover tiun on one platform, then encounter it across 3-4 additional properties in their consumption pattern, creating recognition and repeat usage. This required penetrating DACH (100 million people, single language, unified regulations) before considering US expansion. For B2B2C products where end-user familiarity drives business adoption, concentrate on saturating one market until the consumer-side network effect reduces enterprise sales friction. Validate with 6-12 month pilot data before scaling: tiun ran contained pilots with 3-4 customers for a full year before pursuing their long-tail market. This produced case studies showing 20% paying user uplift and under 1% cannibalization—metrics that directly addressed the primary objection (subscription revenue risk). Sandro notes this extended validation period became essential because "there is no market for it yet. We're creating the market." When creating a new category, resist scaling pressure until you have multi-month data that quantifies business outcomes and neutralizes the biggest adoption barriers. Strategic revenue trade-offs accelerate ecosystem development: tiun deliberately adjusted pricing to "pay out more to our businesses to grow a bit faster"—prioritizing transaction volume and ecosystem density over near-term take rate. This economics decision reflected that their value proposition strengthens with ecosystem scale: users need to encounter tiun across multiple properties for the solution to deliver its full promise. When building network effects or marketplace dynamics, model whether lower monetization drives the velocity needed to reach critical mass faster than optimizing for immediate margins. Integration speed directly determines category creation velocity: Sandro identified that "if the sales cycle is too long and integration is too complicated, people won't do it. Especially since it's a product that doesn't exist and there is no market for it yet." They focused on reducing implementation to 2-3 weeks, recognizing that asking companies to replace existing auth and payment infrastructure requires minimal switching costs. For emerging categories where customers must displace incumbent solutions, integration complexity often determines adoption more than feature superiority. Build investor relationships 12+ months before raises: Sandro emphasizes starting fundraising conversations well before needing capital: "If you decide, oh, I need to fundraise right now, then you will automatically get into a cash crunch. Because by the time you have established all the relationships, it just takes such a long time that you run out of money where it really hurts your negotiation power." Treat investor relationship development as continuous rather than transactional—similar to enterprise pipeline development where deals close from relationships built quarters earlier. //   Sponsors: Front Lines — We help B2B tech companies launch, manage, and grow podcasts that drive demand, awareness, and thought leadership. www.FrontLines.io The Global Talent Co. — We help tech startups find, vet, hire, pay, and retain amazing marketing talent that costs 50-70% less than the US & Europe. www.GlobalTalent.co // Don't Miss: New Podcast Series — How I Hire Senior GTM leaders share the tactical hiring frameworks they use to build winning revenue teams. Hosted by Andy Mowat, who scaled 4 unicorns from $10M to $100M+ ARR and launched Whispered to help executives find their next role.  Subscribe here: https://open.spotify.com/show/53yCHlPfLSMFimtv0riPyM  

The dental industry is chronically supply-constrained: 97% of dentists report staffing as their primary volume limiter, 95% cite extreme recruiting difficulty, yet 75% of hygienists prioritize schedule flexibility above all else. This structural mismatch created the opportunity for Toothio—a labor marketplace connecting dental professionals seeking flexible work with practices facing critical staffing shortages. In this episode, we sat down with Ian Prendergast, Co-Founder and CEO of Toothio, to unpack how he applied labor marketplace principles from hospitality and light industrial verticals to dental, why DSO enterprise customers emerged as the true ICP only after launch, and how being an industry outsider enabled business model innovation that insiders missed. Topics Discussed: How a single golf course conversation with a dentist exposed the 97% staffing crisis and validated the market opportunity Translating labor marketplace GTM from Qwick (hospitality staffing) and Steady Install (light industrial) into dental The supply-demand structural imbalance: dental growing 10.5% CAGR, 40% workforce departure in 2020, insufficient pipeline Supply-first marketplace development and why quality/reliability required deep supply pools before demand acquisition The ICP evolution from private practices (faster sales cycles, lower risk validation) to DSO enterprise (higher volume, stickier retention) Building credibility as outsider founders through strategic SME hires, advisors, and embedding in industry associations The enterprise motion: hiring CCO and SVP Sales with dental Rolodexs to access top-10 DSO decision-makers Quantifying previously unmeasured costs: 100%+ recruiting cost increases, industry-leading turnover rates, $1,560+ daily production loss per unstaffed hygienist Leveraging AI agentic systems to eliminate geographic marketplace constraints for national expansion The moat-building roadmap: layering SaaS and RCM software over the distribution channel to increase switching costs GTM Lessons For B2B Founders: Supply depth before demand scale prevents unit economics collapse: Ian's experience across three labor marketplaces reinforced one principle: excess supply is recoverable, excess demand is catastrophic. With too much demand and insufficient supply, you're "spending a bunch of money to acquire these demand users, but you're not able to fulfill the supply side. So now they're churning out at a high clip, they're going somewhere else. And now it drives up your CAC across the marketplace and reduces your lifetime value." In two-sided marketplaces, founders must resist investor pressure to show demand-side revenue before supply reliability is proven—the temporary revenue bump destroys long-term unit economics. ICP clarity requires live market data, not pre-launch assumptions: Toothio launched targeting private practices (shorter sales cycles, lower barriers, faster learning) before discovering DSOs were the actual ICP through usage cohorts showing materially higher volume and retention. Ian was explicit: "Once we got into it, we realized...the true ICP is going to be our group practices." The tactical framework: establish presence across plausible segments, instrument everything, collect 1-2 quarters of behavioral data, then redirect resources to wherever retention and expansion metrics are strongest. This data-driven ICP discovery prevents premature optimization around the wrong customer profile. Hire senior enterprise operators when you have validation plus clear TAM: Toothio broke conventional early-stage wisdom by hiring a Chief Commercial Officer and SVP Sales—roles typically considered "top-heavy"—because Ian had validated product-market fit and identified a concentrated enterprise opportunity (hundreds of DSOs). The result: "Next thing you know, we're in front of five or six of the top eight or ten DSOs in the country." The decision framework: if you have (1) proven unit economics, (2) clear product-market fit signals, and (3) an enterprise TAM with established relationship networks, senior hires with category Rolodexs can compress multi-year enterprise sales cycles into quarters. Without all three conditions, follow conventional wisdom and stay lean. Outsider economic analysis creates differentiated value propositions: Ian's non-dental background enabled him to "look at the dental office P&L and the core drivers of production with a completely neutral lens and realize that there was a lot of waste." He quantified what insiders hadn't: recruiting costs up 100%+ in five years, dental turnover among the highest of any U.S. industry, and the compounding cost of cancelled patient days (immediate production loss + 20% patient churn × $10-15K lifetime values). This economic framing repositioned Toothio from "staffing vendor" to strategic finance partner. The pattern: outsiders should weaponize their fresh perspective by conducting rigorous economic impact analysis that category incumbents haven't done, then speak to buyers in CFO language rather than operational features. Industry association involvement is enterprise distribution, not brand marketing: Ian credited local and national dental association sponsorships as "the catalyst to get us on the radar of some of the bigger orgs early" because associations created credibility signals plus network effects at scale. In relationship-driven B2B categories with strong professional associations (dental, legal, accounting, healthcare), sponsorship generates repeated exposure to concentrated decision-maker populations and warm introduction paths that cold outbound can't replicate. Founders should map the association landscape in year one, treat it as a primary distribution channel with measurable pipeline contribution, and staff it with team members who can build genuine relationships—not just write checks. // Sponsors: Front Lines — We help B2B tech companies launch, manage, and grow podcasts that drive demand, awareness, and thought leadership. www.FrontLines.io The Global Talent Co. — We help tech startups find, vet, hire, pay, and retain amazing marketing talent that costs 50-70% less than the US & Europe. www.GlobalTalent.co // Don't Miss: New Podcast Series — How I Hire Senior GTM leaders share the tactical hiring frameworks they use to build winning revenue teams. Hosted by Andy Mowat, who scaled 4 unicorns from $10M to $100M+ ARR and launched Whispered to help executives find their next role. Subscribe here: https://open.spotify.com/show/53yCHlPfLSMFimtv0riPyM

Implentio automates workflows between e-commerce merchants and their third-party logistics providers, starting with invoice reconciliation. The platform tackles a problem every scaled e-commerce brand faces: thousands of rows of billing data in CSVs paired with six-figure invoices that nobody has time to validate. In this episode of Category Visionaries, I sat down with Jason Bang, Chief Product Officer and Co-Founder of Implentio, to explore how two decades running operations—from analyst to COO—led him to build what operations teams have never had: tools as sophisticated as what marketing has been using for years. Topics Discussed: The margin erosion hidden in 3PL invoicing and why operations teams can't afford to audit complex billing  Founder-led growth in tight-knit industry networks where everyone goes to the same trade shows  Partnership GTM with fractional CFOs, software providers, and 3PLs themselves  Building a personal brand as an anti-social-media operations leader  Why operations teams are creative problem solvers trapped in spreadsheets  The roadmap toward AI-powered operational intelligence that eliminates manual data work GTM Lessons For B2B Founders: Industry networks unlock faster GTM than traditional outbound: Implentio's first customers came from Jason's 20-year operations network—direct texts to brand founders, warm intros to ops teams, relationships from the same trade shows and conferences. His approach eliminated typical B2B sales cycles by going straight to decision makers who already trusted him. For founders with deep industry tenure, exhausting warm networks before building cold outbound infrastructure delivers conversion velocity and cycle time advantages that justify founder time investment despite limited scale. Partner with companies who own your ICP's budget allocation: Implentio partnered with fractional CFOs who control purchasing decisions and immediately understand ROI. Jason explained their appeal: "They see the numbers, they understand the numbers. So I show them an ROI and they're like, boom, no brainer." The framework: identify which third parties influence or control budget decisions in your category, then build rev-share referral programs. Mapping your buyer's external advisors and service providers can shortcut enterprise sales cycles. Turn industry incumbents into distribution partners by solving their client problems: Despite addressing 3PL billing issues, Implentio positioned 3PLs as partners rather than adversaries. Jason's philosophy: "I'm not a 3PL adversary. I actually love 3PLs. I think they serve an important need." Implentio offers 3PLs a value-add service for their merchant clients while gaining direct customer access. The framework works when you solve what incumbents are contractually responsible for but operationally struggle to deliver, without competing for their core revenue. Pre-qualify partnership ROI using your own customer economics: Implentio learned that partner enthusiasm doesn't correlate with lead quality. Jason's example: "That $50 million brand might have $1,000 AOV. And so the number of transactions and shipments they're doing, there's just not enough there for there to be a good ROI on our solution." Implentio now evaluates partner customer lists against specific transaction volume thresholds before investing in relationships. Document minimum viable customer criteria and require partners to verify their portfolio meets those thresholds to prevent pipeline pollution. Subject matter expertise scales through teaching, not content production: Jason built Implentio's founder brand despite having no Instagram, Facebook, or TikTok, using one principle: "Knowledge is only good if you transfer it and you pass it on." He prioritizes teaching operations concepts over polished content, measuring success by whether someone learns something valuable regardless of conversion. His insight: "If I can teach somebody something, that's a win for me. Even if they don't sign up for my platform." Sophisticated buyers assess expertise through insight depth, not posting frequency. Wedge entry with acute universal pain, then expand horizontally: Jason's long-term vision is "COO in a box"—comprehensive operational intelligence spanning supply chain, fulfillment, and customer service. But Implentio launched with 3PL invoice reconciliation because every scaled e-commerce brand outsources fulfillment and struggles with billing validation. The wedge criteria: universal problem (every target customer has it), acute pain (directly impacts margin), and immediate ROI (quantifiable savings exceed platform cost). Once embedded in the finance workflow, Implentio can expand into adjacent operational data problems without re-selling the value of centralized ops intelligence. // Sponsors: Front Lines — We help B2B tech companies launch, manage, and grow podcasts that drive demand, awareness, and thought leadership. www.FrontLines.io The Global Talent Co. — We help tech startups find, vet, hire, pay, and retain amazing marketing talent that costs 50-70% less than the US & Europe. www.GlobalTalent.co // Don't Miss: New Podcast Series — How I Hire Senior GTM leaders share the tactical hiring frameworks they use to build winning revenue teams. Hosted by Andy Mowat, who scaled 4 unicorns from $10M to $100M+ ARR and launched Whispered to help executives find their next role. Subscribe here: https://open.spotify.com/show/53yCHlPfLSMFimtv0riPyM

Michael Assraf is building Flamingo, an open-source and AI-powered operating system for managed service providers. After exiting Vicarious in May 2024, he spent seven months on market research before writing a single line of code—conducting 15+ MSP interviews, mapping their complete tool stack economics, and testing distribution channels with a free community product. The research revealed a structural margin crisis: MSPs operate on 10-15% margins with 30% of revenue flowing to vendor payouts and 25-30% to technician labor. Meanwhile, private equity consolidation drives customer pricing down while legacy vendors raise prices. Michael closed a $2.2 million pre-seed in February 2025, built OpenMSP as a lead-gen vehicle that generated 1,000+ waitlist signups, and launched Open Frame with 70% of capital still in the bank. In this launch-day conversation, he breaks down why the $380 billion MSP market remains massively underinvested, how Facebook ads outperformed LinkedIn 5:1, and why he's giving away the core product while charging for hosted deployment. Topics Discussed: The seven-month research phase: 15+ MSP interviews, mapping 19 tool categories with pricing data, evaluating open source project maturity through commit frequency and VC backing MSP margin compression mechanics: 30% vendor payouts, 25-30% labor costs, 10-15% net margins being crushed by PE-driven consolidation and vendor price increases Building OpenMSP as distribution validation: four months before alpha, generated 1,000 waitlist signups and 200 Slack members while testing paid acquisition channels Why Facebook delivered 40%+ of leads at $6-8 CPL while outbound completely failed with IT-busy MSPs aged 25-50 in central US markets Launching with 70% of $2.2M pre-seed still in bank by solving for distribution and product-market fit before scaling headcount Open Frame's architecture: unified control plane over open source tools (RMM, SSO, zero trust) with dual AI agents—one for end users, one for technicians Offering both self-hosted (free, GitHub) and commercial SaaS (per-seat pricing starting January 2026) to build trust in an underserved market The MSP category opportunity: $380B market, 12% annual growth, 30-40K US MSPs, minimal VC-backed innovation against 20-year-old incumbents GTM Lessons For B2B Founders: Build lead-gen infrastructure before you have a product to sell: Four months before launching Open Frame, Michael shipped OpenMSP—a free tool that analyzes MSP tech stacks and suggests open source replacements. It wasn't a waitlist landing page; it delivered standalone value while capturing intent data. This generated 1,000 qualified signups and 200 Slack community members while simultaneously validating paid acquisition channels. By launch, he knew Facebook cost $6-8 per lead while outbound failed completely. Most founders build product first, then scramble for distribution. Michael inverted the sequence. Fire fast on sales hires in early stage, or don't hire them at all: Michael fired three VP Sales at Vicarious before learning the lesson: "The moment to bring salespeople is not when you are able to sell your product, is when someone else is able to sell your product." The critical test isn't whether the founder can close deals—founders sell vision and relationship. The test is whether a marketing person, SDR, or non-sales hire can generate revenue. Only then do salespeople accelerate an already-working motion. Hiring VP Sales at $50K ARR because the board wants "someone to own revenue" burns 12+ months and $200K+ learning this. Spend 6-12 months researching before building in unfamiliar markets: Michael conducted 15+ MSP interviews, mapped all 19 tool categories they use with pricing, evaluated open source alternatives by analyzing GitHub commit frequency and pull requests, identified which projects had VC backing for long-term viability, and tested multiple marketing channels before alpha deployment. This allowed him to launch with product-market fit indicators already validated and 70% of his $2.2M still in the bank. The alternative—build fast, iterate with customers—works when you deeply understand the market. When you don't, research is cheaper than pivots. Target categories where lack of innovation creates adoption momentum: MSPs represent 30-40K companies in the US alone, part of a $380B global market growing 12% annually. Yet VCs historically avoided the space assuming low ACV and high churn. The dominant platforms—ConnectWise, Datto, Asea—have existed 20+ years with minimal AI adoption or architectural modernization. Michael specifically chose MSPs because "in cyber security you would never get traction that we're getting right now unless you're spending millions of dollars." In crowded categories, distribution cost kills you. In starved categories, any credible innovation gets attention. Architect your product so adoption mechanically improves customer unit economics: Open Frame attacks both sides of MSP margin compression simultaneously. The open source tool suite eliminates the 30% of revenue paid to commercial vendors. The dual AI agent system (end-user self-service + technician orchestration) reduces the 25-30% spent on labor. Michael didn't find a problem and then figure out monetization—he reverse-engineered a solution where product adoption directly expands customer margins. When your product makes customers structurally more profitable, adoption isn't a marketing problem. // Sponsors: Front Lines — We help B2B tech companies launch, manage, and grow podcasts that drive demand, awareness, and thought leadership. www.FrontLines.io The Global Talent Co. — We help tech startups find, vet, hire, pay, and retain amazing marketing talent that costs 50-70% less than the US & Europe. www.GlobalTalent.co   //   Don't Miss: New Podcast Series — How I Hire Senior GTM leaders share the tactical hiring frameworks they use to build winning revenue teams. Hosted by Andy Mowat, who scaled 4 unicorns from $10M to $100M+ ARR and launched Whispered to help executives find their next role. Subscribe here: https://open.spotify.com/show/53yCHlPfLSMFimtv0riPyM

First Resonance provides factory orchestration and coordination software for scaling hardware companies. Founded by SpaceX veterans in 2019, the company focused on filling the gap between legacy manufacturing systems and the needs of emerging hard tech startups. In a recent episode of Category Visionaries, we sat down with Karan Talati, CEO & Co-Founder of First Resonance, to learn about the company's journey building Ion—their manufacturing operations platform—and how they're enabling companies scaling from R&D prototypes to production manufacturing across aerospace, defense, nuclear energy, and advanced manufacturing. Topics Discussed: Karan's time at SpaceX during hypergrowth (employee 2,000 to 6,000+) and the transition from single rocket design to production operations Why First Resonance walked away from pursuing legacy aerospace and defense giants The failed PLG experiment and pivot to enterprise sales with product analytics for expansion How the "new space" pattern is repeating in nuclear energy and other hard tech verticals Market expansion from aerospace into nuclear energy over the past three to four years Advanced manufacturing technology convergence enabling electric aviation (battery density, composite manufacturing, 3D printing) AI's role in breaking down knowledge silos between mechanical, electrical, and software engineering Defense contractor security requirements: CMMC, FedRamp, and NIST 800-171 Brand strategy targeting the new manufacturing workforce versus the retiring old guard GTM Lessons For B2B Founders: Kill upmarket plans when your core segment outpaces them: First Resonance planned to move from scale-ups to traditional defense and aviation giants. They didn't execute. Karan found that staying with scaling startups delivered faster growth and higher ROI than "long sales cycles" with customers "averse to modern technology." The lesson isn't about patience with enterprise—it's about recognizing when your initial segment is expanding faster than you can capture it. If your TAM is growing 40%+ annually from customer expansion alone, moving upmarket is a distraction. Test PLG fast, kill it faster in multi-stakeholder environments: First Resonance ran a PLG experiment and "quickly learned it does not" work in manufacturing. The buying process involves "centralized, coordinated, orchestrated, many decision makers, many influencers." But they kept the instrumentation. They use "product utilization and usage and engagement" data to "package subsequent value" for renewals and expansion. The tactical move: instrument your product like PLG, sell like enterprise, and use analytics to drive net dollar retention during annual renewals. Treat cloud service provider status as a wedge, not overhead: As a cloud service provider to defense contractors, First Resonance maintains compliance with CMMC, FedRamp, and NIST 800-171. Rather than viewing this as cost center, Karan noted "regulations are getting easier, not harder" and that this is "a benefit to innovators." For B2B founders selling to regulated industries: invest in compliance infrastructure early, monitor regulatory roadmaps (like FedRamp 20x), and position compliance as competitive moat when competitors can't move as quickly. Pattern match your wedge vertical to adjacent disruption: First Resonance saw their aerospace playbook repeat in nuclear energy "literally in the last three, four years." The pattern: legacy incumbents "too big to fail" but "so large and inertial, so hard to move, that startups are going to have to come in and close that gap." When one vertical shows this pattern, adjacent industries with similar incumbent dynamics are expansion candidates. The key signal: former SpaceX/Tesla talent founding companies in that vertical. Design brand for the incoming generation, not the incumbent buyer: With the old guard "rapidly retiring" and manufacturing becoming "cool," First Resonance built a brand with "bold colors and straight lines" that "combines cybernetic systems with inspiration from the Matrix." Karan explicitly rejected softer design trends: "throw all that out." For technical products in industries with demographic shifts, design for the 30-year-old engineer who will champion your tool, not the 55-year-old executive who signs the contract. Deepen rather than proliferate when customers expand physically: First Resonance doesn't worry about logo count because their customers are "scaling in terms of factory square footage and the number of teams." Their expansion motion: "observe product analytics and customer signals and package subsequent value" for upselling during renewals. The tactic works because aerospace and energy have "a tailwind of decades." For infrastructure software with usage tied to physical operations: if customers are adding factories or production lines, you don't need new logos—you need seat expansion and module attach. // Sponsors: Front Lines — We help B2B tech companies launch, manage, and grow podcasts that drive demand, awareness, and thought leadership. www.FrontLines.io The Global Talent Co. — We help tech startups find, vet, hire, pay, and retain amazing marketing talent that costs 50-70% less than the US & Europe. www.GlobalTalent.co // Don't Miss: New Podcast Series — How I Hire Senior GTM leaders share the tactical hiring frameworks they use to build winning revenue teams. Hosted by Andy Mowat, who scaled 4 unicorns from $10M to $100M+ ARR and launched Whispered to help executives find their next role. Subscribe here: https://open.spotify.com/show/53yCHlPfLSMFimtv0riPyM    

ZayZoon pioneered the earned wage access category a decade ago and has become the leading embedded provider through partnerships with over 300 payroll companies. With over $50 million raised and a team of 200, ZayZoon now serves 15,000+ businesses across the US. In a recent episode of Category Visionaries, I sat down with Tate Hackert, Co-Founder and Chief Strategy Officer of ZayZoon, to unpack their B2B2C distribution strategy, the economics of three-sided marketplaces, and how they're expanding from earned wage access into the connected workplace. Topics Discussed: Building for two years without revenue while signing payroll distribution partners Why embedded B2B2C distribution beats direct sales for hourly workforce products Engineering three-way marketplace economics that align payroll, employer, and employee incentives The November 2017 trade show that killed their Canadian market strategy Educating three distinct buyer personas in a category creation motion Product expansion strategy: when to stay focused vs. when to launch adjacent products Positioning shift from "financial wellness" to recruitment/retention/productivity outcomes The underwriting advantage of payroll-integrated repayment for reducing loss rates Building 300+ payroll partnerships through relationship-driven GTM GTM Lessons For B2B Founders: Solve distribution economics before product-market fit: ZayZoon spent 2014-2016 building product and signing payroll partners before generating first revenue in 2016. The insight: "Why would we go and try to sign up business by business...Let's sign up the payroll company because they're this umbrella organization." For B2B2C models, solve the distribution layer first—even if it delays revenue. Your bottleneck is partner adoption curves, not product readiness. Structure three-way economics where everyone wins big: ZayZoon discovered payroll companies had "this gold mine of employees that they hadn't yet monetized" and built a model where they pay payroll partners "a really hefty revenue share" while keeping enough margin for ZayZoon and keeping the service low-cost for employees. In platform businesses, the unit economics must be compelling enough that each party actively sells for you, not just tolerates you. Map your value prop to your buyer's actual job metrics: ZayZoon's breakthrough came from reframing earned wage access as solving recruitment, retention, and productivity—the metrics small business owners are measured on. Tate explained the unlock: "It's free for me, and it's deployed seamlessly through the HCM provider that I already use. Yeah, turn it on." Your features matter less than your impact on the specific KPIs in your buyer's quarterly review. Kill underperforming markets immediately, even after years of investment: After building in Canada from 2014-2017, one US trade show in November 2017 generated "more signed business than we had done in the previous couple of years in Canada." They put Canada "on life support" by January 2018. Resource reallocation speed matters more than sunk cost. When signal clarity emerges, move capital and team within weeks, not quarters. High-touch relationship GTM beats automation until you hit scale: Tate's core partnership advice: "Pick up the phone...be gritty as hell. Those first hundred customers that you do, be gritty." He emphasized personal outreach builds "pattern recognition and learnings that you receive from being ultra curious." For partnerships specifically, bring "humility, transparency and the expectation that you're building a ten year plus relationship, not being transactional." Automation scales what works—but relationship GTM discovers what works.   //   Sponsors: Front Lines — We help B2B tech companies launch, manage, and grow podcasts that drive demand, awareness, and thought leadership. www.FrontLines.io The Global Talent Co. — We help tech startups find, vet, hire, pay, and retain amazing marketing talent that costs 50-70% less than the US & Europe. www.GlobalTalent.co // Don't Miss: New Podcast Series — How I Hire Senior GTM leaders share the tactical hiring frameworks they use to build winning revenue teams. Hosted by Andy Mowat, who scaled 4 unicorns from $10M to $100M+ ARR and launched Whispered to help executives find their next role. Subscribe here: https://open.spotify.com/show/53yCHlPfLSMFimtv0riPyM  

AODocs manages business-critical documents for enterprises where downtime has real consequences—production lines stopping, construction projects delayed, containers sitting at ports. Founded in 2012 and bootstrapped to profitability by 2022, the company serves Google's data center builds, aerospace manufacturers' FAA certifications, and Veolia's water treatment operations. In this episode of Category Visionaries, we sat down with Stéphan Donzé, Founder of AODocs, to unpack his 14-year journey from Google ecosystem specialist to Microsoft-compatible platform. Stéphan shares unfiltered lessons from the brutal 2014-15 years when cloud platform limitations broke customer deployments, why they've reconsidered fundraising every two years but remained independent, and how AI agents finally created the urgency factor their category always lacked. Topics Discussed: Surviving 2014-15 when Google Cloud platform performance limits broke at scale Bootstrapping via services company profits until standalone profitability in 2022 Why long-term document lifecycle management (10-30 year retention) resists VC timelines Expanding from Google workspace early adopters to Microsoft enterprise accounts The failed experiment with cloud reseller partners who couldn't deploy DMS Why marketing hire ramp time equals technical hire ramp for platform products Medium-sized industry conferences outperforming 30K-attendee mega-events on cost-per-lead Positioning as document foundation for reliable AI agent information access GTM Lessons For B2B Founders: Transparent post-mortem communication converts crises into trust: When AODocs hit unexpected Google Cloud platform limitations in 2014-15—breaking deployments for customers running mission-critical workflows—they published detailed explanations of root causes outside their control and remediation plans. Stéphan explained: "We've always been extremely transparent...Yes, we screwed up here. Here is the thing we put in place so that it doesn't happen again." This approach consistently strengthened customer relationships during their worst incidents. For founders in business-critical infrastructure: your crisis response protocols matter more than preventing every outage. Bootstrap via complementary services revenue until product-market fit: AODocs funded development by merging with a Google Cloud consulting firm that deployed early Gmail enterprise implementations. Services profits subsidized product R&D while providing direct customer access. Stéphan described the deal structure: "I have a software company that has no revenue, but I can suck the profit of the service company until I make revenue." The model worked until 2022 when AODocs became independently profitable. For technical founders: identify services businesses with your target customer base as bootstrap partners, not just revenue sources. Partner technical capability trumps partner pipeline size: AODocs initially partnered with Google Cloud resellers (SATA, Onix) who had enterprise access but couldn't scope or deploy document management implementations. The inflection point came shifting to system integrators with actual DMS practices. Stéphan noted: "These guys don't really understand document management...they could not really help us deploy our product because they don't understand what we're doing." For complex B2B products: vet partners on technical delivery capacity, not just lead generation promises. Platform products require 12-month marketing onboarding: AODocs learned marketing hires need equivalent ramp time as engineering roles—not two one-pagers and go-to-market. Stéphan's realization: "It takes a year before someone is able to write the right things and to sense the essence of the product." This applies specifically to platforms with multiple use cases, not point solutions. For founders with horizontal platforms: budget full-year onboarding before expecting marketing productivity, or hire people who've sold similar complexity before. Founder must own category positioning until $10M ARR: Stéphan argues technical founders can't delegate core messaging early: "My personal take is that in the tech company the CMO cannot be anybody else than the founder itself at least for the first $10 million." This comes from watching marketing experts produce "beautiful words and lots of fluff but still not get the essence of what we're doing." For technical founders uncomfortable with marketing: you're avoiding your most important job in the early years. Regional 2K-5K conferences deliver better unit economics than flagship 30K events: While AODocs attends Google Next (30,000) and Gartner conferences, smaller regional IT decision-maker events generated superior cost-per-qualified-lead. Stéphan's finding: "If you look at the number of dollars you spend per lead that you get, the small events are surprisingly effective." This contradicts conventional wisdom about flagship event ROI. For enterprise B2B: test regional and vertical conferences before scaling spend on mega-events. Technology paradigm shifts create replacement urgency: AODocs positioned as "modern cloud-based document management" for years without forcing function to rip out legacy systems. AI agents changed the calculus entirely. Stéphan's repositioning: "If you don't upgrade your document foundation, you won't be able to benefit from the AI productivity acceleration." The urgency comes from AI agents requiring clean, validated document repositories—impossible with SharePoint chaos. For founders in infrastructure categories: look for adjacent technology waves that make your solution prerequisite, not optional upgrade. // Sponsors: Front Lines — We help B2B tech companies launch, manage, and grow podcasts that drive demand, awareness, and thought leadership. www.FrontLines.io The Global Talent Co. — We help tech startups find, vet, hire, pay, and retain amazing marketing talent that costs 50-70% less than the US & Europe. www.GlobalTalent.co // Don't Miss: New Podcast Series — How I Hire Senior GTM leaders share the tactical hiring frameworks they use to build winning revenue teams. Hosted by Andy Mowat, who scaled 4 unicorns from $10M to $100M+ ARR and launched Whispered to help executives find their next role.   Subscribe here: https://open.spotify.com/show/53yCHlPfLSMFimtv0riPyM

Calico is building an agentic AI system for apparel sourcing and production—automating the "messy middle" of manufacturing that has operated on emails, Excel, and WhatsApp for decades. As a founder who previously built and exited apparel brands, Kathleen Chan experienced the pain firsthand: opening a Shopify store takes minutes, but actually producing inventory requires staying up until 2am managing factory communications. In this episode, she shares how Calico is creating a new category during the 2025 tariff crisis, when sourcing directors are rewriting playbooks that haven't changed in 50 years. Topics Discussed: How Calico functions as an AI co-pilot for sourcing directors and production managers Creating a category when no budget line exists for agentic AI systems Leveraging the 2025 tariff environment as an adoption catalyst Why six months of paid acquisition produced high signups but zero quality customers Sequencing GTM tactics from unscalable one-to-ones to conferences to content Building authenticity in a market saturated with AI slop and generic LinkedIn content Hiring early evangelists who maintain conviction through the startup zigzag GTM Lessons For B2B Founders: Match GTM motion to how your market transacts, not what scales: Calico tested paid acquisition for six months before realizing relationship-building converted better despite being unscalable. In apparel manufacturing, decades-long supplier relationships can't turn on and off overnight—the buying motion reflects this reality. Kathleen's approach: early-stage requires one-to-one dinners and networking to answer nuanced questions; mid-stage shifts to conferences for broader reach; late-stage deploys LinkedIn content once the market understands your category. The sequencing matters because each stage builds on the previous one's trust foundation. Brutally audit customer quality, not conversion metrics: Calico's paid acquisition drove signups and "conversions by marketing sense," creating a false signal of product-market fit. After six months, the math revealed these customers cost more to acquire than those from relationship channels and had lower quality. Kathleen's lesson: vanity metrics provide a "weird little dopamine hit" that masks broken unit economics. For B2B founders in complex sales cycles, track cost-per-quality-customer, not cost-per-signup. Use macro disruption to collapse sales cycles: The 2025 tariff crisis created an "impossible challenge" for Calico's ICP—sourcing directors forced to rewrite playbooks built over decades while tariffs changed via tweet. Rather than fighting the chaos, Calico positioned itself as the solution to this specific moment, anchoring customer conversations on tariff-driven urgency. This transformed education from abstract ("here's what agentic AI can do") to concrete ("here's how we solve your tariff problem today"). B2B founders should identify trigger events that make the status quo untenable. Create category clarity by defining what you're not: In a market where "AI could mean things to many different people," Calico differentiated by explicitly stating what their system cannot do. Kathleen prioritized "dispelling the notions of what we are and what we aren't" over overselling capabilities. This matters because sophisticated buyers—especially in industries with low tech adoption—need to understand boundaries before they'll trust promises. The tactic builds credibility in noisy markets where everyone claims AI magic. Hire evangelists who outlast founder doubt: Calico's most impactful GTM decision was bringing on early team members who could evangelize value through the inevitable "zigzaggy" early stage—when "it's exciting one day and the worst day ever the next." These people interface directly with customers regardless of whether the founder is having doubts or frustrations. Kathleen's insight: in B2B relationship-driven sales, your early GTM hires' conviction directly determines whether customers stick through product evolution. Hire for authentic belief, not just skills. Deprioritize content in high-noise environments: Calico deliberately delays LinkedIn content until later stages because "folks are a little bit more muted to all the LinkedIn content coming at them." With AI making content easier than ever to create, Kathleen sees audiences questioning whether to take it seriously and whether AI-generated content has less value than human-generated. Her approach: authenticity trumps quantity. For B2B founders, this means investing in formats that can't be easily faked (video, in-person) before scaling written content. // Sponsors: Front Lines — We help B2B tech companies launch, manage, and grow podcasts that drive demand, awareness, and thought leadership. www.FrontLines.io The Global Talent Co. — We help tech startups find, vet, hire, pay, and retain amazing marketing talent that costs 50-70% less than the US & Europe. www.GlobalTalent.co // Don't Miss: New Podcast Series — How I Hire Senior GTM leaders share the tactical hiring frameworks they use to build winning revenue teams. Hosted by Andy Mowat, who scaled 4 unicorns from $10M to $100M+ ARR and launched Whispered to help executives find their next role. Subscribe here: https://open.spotify.com/show/53yCHlPfLSMFimtv0riPyM

Freeplay AI emerged from a precise timing insight: former Twitter API platform veterans Ian Cairns and Eric Schade recognized that generative AI created the same platform opportunity they'd previously captured with half a million monthly active developers. Their company now provides the observability, evaluation, and experimentation infrastructure that lets cross-functional teams—including non-technical domain experts—collaborate on AI systems that need to perform consistently in production. Topics Discussed: Systematic customer discovery: 75 interviews in 90 days using jobs-to-be-done methodology to surface latent AI development pain points Cross-functional AI development: How domain experts (lawyers, veterinarians, doctors) became essential collaborators when "English became the hottest programming language" Production AI reliability challenges: Moving beyond 60% prototype success rates to consistent production performance Enterprise selling to technical buyers: Why ABM and content worked where ads and outbound failed for VPs of engineering Category creation without precedent: Building thought leadership through triangulated insights across hundreds of implementations Offline community building: Growing 3,000-person Colorado AI meetup with authentic "give first" approach GTM Lessons For B2B Founders: Structure customer discovery with jobs-to-be-done rigor: Ian executed a systematic 75-interview program in 90 days, moving beyond surface-level feature requests to understand fundamental motivations. Using Clay Christensen's framework, they discovered engineers weren't just frustrated with 60% AI prototype reliability—they were under career pressure to deliver AI wins while lacking tools to bridge the gap to production consistency. This deeper insight shaped Freeplay's positioning around professional success metrics rather than just technical capabilities. Exploit diaspora networks from platform companies: Twitter's developer ecosystem became Ian's customer research goldmine. Platform company alumni have uniquely valuable networks because they previously interfaced with hundreds of technical teams. Rather than cold outreach, Ian leveraged existing relationships and warm introductions to reach heads of engineering who were actively experimenting with AI. This approach yielded higher-quality conversations and faster pattern recognition across use cases. Target sophistication gaps in technical buying committees: Traditional SaaS tactics failed because Freeplay's buyers—VPs of engineering at companies building production AI—weren't responsive to ads or generic outbound. Instead, Ian invested in deep technical content (1500-2000 word blog posts), speaking engagements, and their "Deployed" podcast featuring practitioners from Google Labs and Box. This approach built credibility with sophisticated technical audiences who needed education about emerging best practices, not product demos. Build authority through cross-portfolio insights: Rather than positioning as AI experts, Ian built trust by triangulating learnings across "hundreds of different companies" and sharing pattern recognition. Their messaging became "don't just take Freeplay's word for it—here's what we've seen work across environments." This approach resonated because no single company had enough AI production experience to claim definitive expertise. Aggregated insights became more valuable than individual case studies. Time market entry for the infrastructure adoption curve: Ian deliberately positioned Freeplay for companies "3, 6, 12 months after being in production" rather than competing for initial AI experiments. They recognized organizations don't invest in formal evaluation infrastructure until they've proven AI matters to their business. This patient approach let them capture demand at the moment companies realized they needed serious operational discipline around AI systems. //  Sponsors:  Front Lines — We help B2B tech companies launch, manage, and grow podcasts that drive demand, awareness, and thought leadership. www.FrontLines.io The Global Talent Co. — We help tech startups find, vet, hire, pay, and retain amazing marketing talent that costs 50-70% less than the US & Europe. www.GlobalTalent.co // Don't Miss: New Podcast Series — How I Hire Senior GTM leaders share the tactical hiring frameworks they use to build winning revenue teams. Hosted by Andy Mowat, who scaled 4 unicorns from $10M to $100M+ ARR and launched Whispered to help executives find their next role.    Subscribe here: https://open.spotify.com/show/53yCHlPfLSMFimtv0riPyM

TwelveLabs is building purpose-built foundation models for video understanding, enabling enterprises to index, search, and analyze petabytes of video content at scale. Founded by three technical co-founders who met in South Korea's Cyber Command doing multimodal video understanding research, the company recognized early that video requires fundamentally different infrastructure than text or image AI. Now achieving 10x revenue growth and serving customers across media, entertainment, sports, advertising, and federal agencies, TwelveLabs is proving that category creation through extreme focus beats trend chasing. In this episode, Jae Lee shares how the company navigated early product decisions, built specialized GTM motions for established industries, and maintained technical conviction during years of building in relative obscurity. Topics Discussed: How military research in multimodal video understanding led to founding TwelveLabs in 2020  The technical thesis: why video deserves purpose-built foundation models and inference infrastructure  Targeting video-centric industries where ROI justifies early-stage pricing: media, entertainment, sports, advertising, and defense  Partnership-driven distribution strategy and AWS Bedrock integration results  Specialized sales approach: generalist leaders, vertical-specific AEs and solutions architects Maintaining extreme focus and avoiding hype cycles during the first three years of building  Federal GTM lessons: why In-Q-Tel partnership and authentic mission alignment matter more than process optimization  The discipline of saying no to large opportunities that don't fit ICP  Keeping hiring bars high when the entire team is underwater GTM Lessons For B2B Founders: Hire vertical specialists on the front lines, not just at the top: TwelveLabs structures its GTM team with generalist leaders (head of GTM and VP of Revenue) who can sell any technology, but vertical-specialized AEs, solutions architects, and deployment engineers. These front-line team members come directly from the four target industries and understand customer workflows, buying patterns, and integration points without ramp time. For founders entering mature markets with established tech stacks and complex procurement, this inverted model—generalist strategy, specialist execution—accelerates deal velocity because technical buyers immediately recognize domain fluency. Infrastructure plays require integration partnerships, not displacement: In established industries with layered technology stacks, positioning as foundational infrastructure demands partnership-first distribution. Jae explained their approach: integration with media-specific GSIs, media asset management platforms, and cloud providers ensures TwelveLabs fits into existing workflows rather than forcing wholesale replacement. This is particularly critical for selling into industries like media and entertainment where technology decisions involve multiple stakeholders across production, post-production, and distribution. The AWS Bedrock integration delivered 30,000+ enterprise agreements in seven weeks—a distribution velocity impossible through direct sales alone. Extreme focus on first-principles product development beats fast-follower tactics: While competitors built quick demos by wrapping existing models, TwelveLabs spent three years building proprietary video foundation models and indexing infrastructure from scratch. Jae was explicit about the cost: "It was painful journey in the first like two and a half, three years because folks are flying by." The payoff came from solving actual customer problems—indexing 2 million hours of content in two days, enabling semantic search at scale, building agent workflows for specific use cases—rather than impressive demos that couldn't handle production workloads. For technical founders, this validates staying committed to fundamental research even when market momentum favors surface-level innovation. Federal requires cultural alignment before GTM optimization: TwelveLabs' federal success stems from authentic mission alignment, not just process execution. With In-Q-Tel as an investor providing interface to agencies and founders with military backgrounds, the company established credibility through shared values rather than sales tactics. Jae was direct: "If you're kind of entering because, oh, federal market is big and you go in, you're going to get your butt kicked. So I think like you need to actually build your team in a way that's like passionate to work on this project." This matters because federal deals require sustained engagement through long sales cycles, security reviews, and deployment complexity—momentum that only comes from genuine conviction, not quota pressure. ICP discipline protects product focus and team morale: Saying no to large early opportunities that don't fit ICP is operationally painful but strategically essential. Jae acknowledged the difficulty: "Early on saying no to customers is hard... as a founder you want to grow your business and you know that's going to be good for the morale. But that's only true when the customers are actually their ideal customers." Wrong customers create three failure modes: they pull product roadmap toward one-off features, they consume disproportionate support resources, and they generate reference cases that attract more wrong-fit prospects. For early-stage infrastructure companies, every customer shapes your market position—choose deliberately. // Sponsors: Front Lines — We help B2B tech companies launch, manage, and grow podcasts that drive demand, awareness, and thought leadership. www.FrontLines.io The Global Talent Co. — We help tech startups find, vet, hire, pay, and retain amazing marketing talent that costs 50-70% less than the US & Europe. www.GlobalTalent.co   //   Don't Miss: New Podcast Series — How I Hire Senior GTM leaders share the tactical hiring frameworks they use to build winning revenue teams. Hosted by Andy Mowat, who scaled 4 unicorns from $10M to $100M+ ARR and launched Whispered to help executives find their next role. Subscribe here: https://open.spotify.com/show/53yCHlPfLSMFimtv0riPyM

With over 30 years in wireless—from helping pioneer intercarrier SMS to running mobile identity operations across Americas and Asia Pacific — Eddie DeCurtis saw what others missed: 967 of 1,000 global mobile network operators lack the infrastructure to monetize CPNI data while protecting customers from fraud. The technical challenge isn't building APIs. It's that operators spent billions on 5G infrastructure and now lack capital, internal expertise, and operational frameworks to launch authentication services. In 18 months, Shush went from PowerPoint to 30 employees, supporting 47 network APIs with full GSMA Open Gateway compliance. Eddie shares how understanding regulatory frameworks by jurisdiction, not just deploying technology, became their competitive moat—and why hiring the executive who built T-Mobile USA's authentication platform gave them credibility no competitor could match. Topics Discussed: Why operators repeatedly said "we want to do it, we have no idea how, we have no money, we don't have a platform" Validating the thesis with former AT&T Communications CEO John Donovan before launching Securing a POC with a major operator pre-incorporation—with only a PowerPoint deck The three-legged stool: technology, network integration, and business operations (where competitors fail) Why knowing privacy regulations for CPNI data sharing by country became a deal-closer Reducing network integration from dozens of touchpoints to three specific network elements Supporting 8 Linux Foundation Camara APIs and TS.43 GBA AKA authentication standard Going from 3 to 30 employees and launching at Mobile World Congress on a $75/night Airbnb budget GTM Lessons For B2B Founders: Validate with the person most likely to kill your idea: Eddie deliberately chose John Donovan—former CEO of AT&T Communications, board member at Lockheed and Palo Alto Networks—specifically because "he's going to be rough, he's going to totally ask the really hard questions." When Donovan's response was "go raise $40 million and own this space...you're not going to be alone for long," the validation carried weight because it came from someone incentivized to find fatal flaws. Most founders validate with friendly audiences or investors looking for deals. Find the battle-tested executive who has nothing to gain from being kind. Convert pre-product conviction into design partner commitments: Eddie secured a POC agreement with a major operator before Shush incorporated. "I had nothing. I didn't have software. We had an idea, we had a PowerPoint presentation." This only works when you've spent decades building domain expertise and relationships. The lesson isn't "sell vaporware"—it's that deep industry knowledge lets you articulate problem-solution fit so precisely that sophisticated buyers commit before seeing code. Infrastructure founders with 10+ years in-market can accelerate 12-18 months of product-market fit by converting expertise into early design partnerships. The enterprise moat is operational knowledge, not technical capability: Eddie's thesis: "Anybody can come up with the technology. You walk down the street in the Bay Area, 10 developers will develop it for you." Shush differentiated by answering questions competitors couldn't: How do you price SIM swap detection per query? What are CPNI data sharing regulations in Indonesia versus Brazil? How do you navigate internal stakeholder alignment across legal, privacy, and regulatory teams at a tier-one operator? When Eddie told an operator "here's the privacy rules for your country" after they admitted "I have no idea," he closed a knowledge gap that pure technology vendors can't fill. In regulated infrastructure markets, execution expertise beats technical superiority. Target the ambition-capability gap in capital-constrained buyers: Operators told Eddie the same story: eager to launch authentication services, zero clarity on execution, budgets decimated by 5G spending. This created perfect conditions for a full-stack solution. "Mid-market is hard because you have a buyer with problems that are not basic anymore, but they lack the ability to execute." Shush didn't sell point solutions—they delivered technology, integration, and business operations as a turnkey package. Identify buyers with sophisticated needs, strong intent, and constrained internal resources. That's where full-stack platforms win over point tools. Hire the operator who ran your exact use case at scale: Eddie cold-called John Morrowton, who "built this actual product and service offering at T-Mobile USA, from its inception to its execution and ran it for four years." His pitch: "I'm Eddie DeCurtis, how are you? You want a job? You're Chief Product Officer." Hiring someone who'd operationalized authentication services at a tier-one carrier gave Shush instant credibility with operator buyers and compressed years of trial-and-error into institutional knowledge. In infrastructure sales, hiring executives from reference customers eliminates "can you actually do this" objections before they surface. Minimize integration surface area to accelerate deployment: Mobile operators run highly secure networks with limited external access points. Shush "narrowed it down to three network elements that we can communicate with to provide all 47 APIs." Fewer integration points means faster deployment, lower implementation risk, and reduced operator IT overhead. This architectural decision became a sales accelerator. Infrastructure founders: identify the minimal viable integration that unlocks maximum API coverage, then make that your differentiated deployment story.   //   Sponsors: Front Lines — We help B2B tech companies launch, manage, and grow podcasts that drive demand, awareness, and thought leadership. www.FrontLines.io The Global Talent Co. — We help tech startups find, vet, hire, pay, and retain amazing marketing talent that costs 50-70% less than the US & Europe. www.GlobalTalent.co // Don't Miss: New Podcast Series — How I Hire Senior GTM leaders share the tactical hiring frameworks they use to build winning revenue teams. Hosted by Andy Mowat, who scaled 4 unicorns from $10M to $100M+ ARR and launched Whispered to help executives find their next role.  Subscribe here: https://open.spotify.com/show/53yCHlPfLSMFimtv0riPyM

Ludus operates a zero-cost ticketing platform for performing arts organizations, monetizing through patron convenience fees while transferring full ticket face value to venues. What began as a freshman year project for a high school theater director evolved into a company processing millions annually across thousands of customers. After surviving COVID-19's 95% revenue elimination and competitor market exits, Ludus captured displaced customers and achieved their growth inflection point. In a recent episode of Category Visionaries, CEO and Co-Founder Zachary Collins detailed the execution mechanics behind customer advocacy generation, human-differentiated scaling, and market expansion through systematic word-of-mouth amplification. Topics Discussed: Monetization alignment between platform and venues through patron-paid fee structures Crisis survival mechanics: reducing to two employees while maintaining core product functionality Systematic customer advocacy through documented attribution and public recognition programs Counter-positioning against AI-first competitors through human-guaranteed support availability Strategic capital deployment: transitioning from profitable bootstrapping to venture-accelerated expansion Geographic and vertical expansion from high school theater to community venues and concert halls GTM Lessons For B2B Founders: Deploy bottom-up penetration to bypass procurement friction and generate authentic adoption signals: Collins chose theater director sales over superintendent-level contracts despite longer individual deal cycles. This approach avoided forced adoption resistance while creating measurable engagement data from actual product usage rather than mandate compliance. The strategic insight: bottom-up sales generate higher-quality expansion opportunities because satisfied end users become internal advocates who influence broader organizational adoption. Implementation requires identifying decision-makers with both budget authority and day-to-day pain points, then optimizing for usage depth over initial contract size. Transform support incidents into systematic advocacy generation through zero-effort resolution protocols: When database corruption lost customer registration data, Ludus manually contacted every affected parent, reconstructed missing information, and delivered complete solutions in organized spreadsheets. This zero-customer-effort approach generates 97-99% satisfaction scores while creating advocacy moments from potential churn situations. The tactical framework: establish incident response that eliminates customer work entirely, document extraordinary efforts taken, and follow up to ensure complete satisfaction. This converts support costs from pure overhead into measurable advocacy generation with direct attribution to pipeline growth. Engineer feature request workflows for collaborative product development perception and testimonial generation: Collins maintains attribution tracking for every customer suggestion, notifies requesters when features launch, and credits contributors in public release communications. This systematic approach creates investment psychology where customers feel ownership in product evolution rather than experiencing transactional vendor relationships. The operational mechanics: implement CRM tagging for feature requests with customer attribution, maintain development pipeline visibility for relationship managers, and create regular recognition touchpoints that generate authentic testimonials from customers seeing their ideas implemented. Capitalize on crisis-driven competitor consolidation through rapid capability expansion and customer acquisition: During COVID-19, while Ludus approached business failure with 95% revenue loss, they developed social distancing seating configurations and streaming integrations. As competitors failed or lost customer trust through poor crisis management, displaced organizations sought alternatives, creating Ludus's 2021 growth acceleration. This demonstrates the competitive opportunity in market disruptions: companies that maintain product investment during crisis periods position themselves to capture market share from failing incumbents. Strategic preparation requires maintaining development capabilities during revenue downturns and building crisis-specific feature sets before market demand crystallizes. Counter-position against AI commoditization through human interaction guarantees and relationship depth: While competitors deploy AI-first support to reduce costs, Collins maintains human availability guarantees including coverage 10 minutes before customer events. This creates differentiation as AI standardizes basic interactions across the industry. The strategic positioning: as routine customer service becomes commoditized through AI deployment, companies maintaining genuine human relationships capture disproportionate value in relationship-dependent markets. Execution requires deliberate investment in support team scaling, clear AI boundary policies, and metrics that measure relationship quality rather than just response time efficiency.   //   Sponsors: Front Lines — We help B2B tech companies launch, manage, and grow podcasts that drive demand, awareness, and thought leadership. www.FrontLines.io The Global Talent Co. — We help tech startups find, vet, hire, pay, and retain amazing marketing talent that costs 50-70% less than the US & Europe. www.GlobalTalent.co   //   Don't Miss: New Podcast Series — How I Hire Senior GTM leaders share the tactical hiring frameworks they use to build winning revenue teams. Hosted by Andy Mowat, who scaled 4 unicorns from $10M to $100M+ ARR and launched Whispered to help executives find their next role.   Subscribe here: https://open.spotify.com/show/53yCHlPfLSMFimtv0riPyM

Healthcare providers waste $950 billion annually on manual workarounds caused by fragmented EHR systems and integration costs that don't scale. Shadowbox has developed a patented browser technology that functions as an API, enabling instant EHR data access without traditional integration expenses. In this episode of Category Visionaries, we sat down with Gregory Stein, CEO of Shadowbox, to dissect how the company evolved from serving desperate lab diagnostics customers to building strategic partnerships with established healthcare IT players like HC1 to reach health systems.   Topics Discussed: How the 21st Century Cures Act information blocking provisions remain largely unenforced, allowing EHR vendors to maintain data monopolies through integration fees Shadowbox's technical architecture: a white-labeled browser that accesses the document object model and API endpoints to extract HIPAA-compliant data without custom integrations Market entry strategy—targeting financially distressed lab diagnostics providers who couldn't afford traditional integration costs The HC1 partnership model: splitting the market by use case rather than geography, with HL7/API integrations going to HC1 and rapid, low-cost deployments going to Shadowbox Sequential interoperability capabilities that enable multiple vendor touchpoints (prior authorization, eligibility verification, billing) from a single data extraction   GTM Lessons For B2B Founders: Target customers facing existential financial pressure, not optimal market conditions: Shadowbox entered through lab diagnostics—a commoditized, low-margin segment hemorrhaging money where providers faced $5K-$50K integration costs per connection taking 3-6 months. Greg acknowledged labs are "the redheaded stepchild of healthcare" but their desperation made them willing to pilot unproven technology. The lesson: segments with severe unit economics problems become early adopter pools because status quo costs exceed perceived risk of new vendors. Build a partnerships function before you have market leverage: Shadowbox hired a partnerships-focused employee early to cultivate relationships with RCM vendors and lab information system providers already selling to target customers. Rather than waiting for customer traction to attract partners, they used partnerships to generate initial traction. Greg emphasized healthcare adoption requires credible references—partnerships provide instant credibility entrepreneurs can't buy. Map your ecosystem's existing vendor relationships and pursue co-sell arrangements before achieving meaningful ARR. Use early customer feedback to migrate upmarket, not pivot laterally: Shadowbox started with labs, expanded to imaging centers, but their true ICP emerged as health systems with 500-1,000 community providers on disparate EHRs where traditional integration economics break down. Greg noted: "health systems that have major outreach programs where it doesn't pencil out to have them on their EPIC system." The migration path moved from small, desperate customers toward larger organizations facing the same core problem at scale. Don't mistake initial ICP for ultimate ICP—use early segments as beachheads to validate technology before pursuing customers with better economics. Partner with horizontal competitors when you solve orthogonal use cases: The HC1 deal splits the interoperability market—structured, predictable integrations go to HC1's traditional approach while rapid deployments to fragmented provider networks go to Shadowbox. This isn't channel partnership but market segmentation by use case economics. Greg explained they bring "something complementary to and in some ways competitive" but combined create offerings competitors can't match. Evaluate whether your "competitors" actually serve different jobs-to-be-done within the same category, then structure partnerships around use case delineation rather than territorial splits. Leverage policy expertise as product moat in regulated markets: Greg's Capitol Hill background enabled Shadowbox to support the Coalition for Innovative Lab Testing's successful lawsuit blocking FDA regulation of lab-developed tests—directly protecting their customers' business models. This wasn't marketing but strategic positioning that demonstrates commitment beyond vendor relationships. In heavily regulated industries, founders with policy expertise or advisors who can shape regulatory outcomes create defensibility that pure technology cannot. Consider how industry advocacy amplifies customer loyalty while potentially expanding TAM through favorable regulatory changes.   //   Sponsors: Front Lines — We help B2B tech companies launch, manage, and grow podcasts that drive demand, awareness, and thought leadership. www.FrontLines.io The Global Talent Co. — We help tech startups find, vet, hire, pay, and retain amazing marketing talent that costs 50-70% less than the US & Europe. www.GlobalTalent.co   //   Don't Miss: New Podcast Series — How I Hire Senior GTM leaders share the tactical hiring frameworks they use to build winning revenue teams. Hosted by Andy Mowat, who scaled 4 unicorns from $10M to $100M+ ARR and launched Whispered to help executives find their next role.   Subscribe here: https://open.spotify.com/show/53yCHlPfLSMFimtv0riPyM

StrongestLayer is building AI-native email security architecture designed for threats that defeat pattern-matching systems. The company pivoted from security awareness training after early customers discovered its phishing detection plugin caught advanced threats that legacy gateway solutions missed. In a recent episode of Category Visionaries, we sat down with Alan LeFort, CEO of StrongestLayer, to discuss why architectural generation matters more than vendor reputation in email security, and how they're using transparent proof-of-concept methodology to displace 20-year incumbents.   Topics Discussed: Why AI-generated attacks with n=1 datasets break signature-based detection architectures The convergence of legitimate marketing automation and phishing techniques (lookalike domains, intent signals, AI-personalized messaging) How 2% of attack types represent 90% of breach value, forecast to reach 17% of volume by 2027 Transparent POC strategy achieving 85% meeting-to-POC and 100% qualified-POC-to-technical-win conversion Stage-based ICP selection: targeting 1,000-10,000 seats for sub-6-month sales cycles with enterprise compliance requirements Harvard Kennedy School research: AI enables 88% employee profiling from public data, 95% cost reduction for targeted campaigns, and 60% click rates versus 12% baseline   GTM Lessons For B2B Founders: Deploy transparent POCs as category displacement weapons: When attacking entrenched incumbents, StrongestLayer runs one-week POCs behind existing email security gateways with zero commercial pressure—just visibility into what's being missed. At a sub-1,000-seat company running behind a top-three market leader, they surfaced 80 advanced threats in one week. This approach converts 85% of first meetings to POC and 100% of qualified POCs to technical wins. The insight: In technical categories where buyers are sophisticated, removing evaluation friction and letting comparative performance speak eliminates trust barriers faster than enterprise reference selling. Stage-match your ICP to burn rate tolerance, not TAM: Alan deliberately excludes Fortune 500 despite universal email security need: "When their procurement team is bigger than your whole company, not a good scene." Instead, they target 1,000-10,000 seats—enterprises with SOC2/compliance obligations but without Fortune 500 security budgets or staffing. These accounts close in under 6 months. The framework: Define ICP by sales cycle length your runway can sustain, then expand segments as capital position improves. Your ICP should evolve with company stage, not remain static based on ideal long-term positioning. Trade IP opacity for velocity when architectural advantage compounds: Unlike security vendors protecting methodology behind NDAs, StrongestLayer publishes full product demos on YouTube and shares detection logic openly. Alan's thesis: "I'm going all in on velocity. I'm going to transparently share, get it in front of as many customers as we can." This works because their advantage is continuous AI model improvement velocity, not a static algorithm competitors could copy. If your moat is execution speed and iteration cycles rather than a single proprietary technique, transparency accelerates trust-building and shortens enterprise consideration periods. Quantify the shift from volume metrics to value-at-risk metrics: Rather than competing on total threat detection volume, StrongestLayer focuses on the 2% of attack types (BEC, advanced spear phishing) that represent 90% of breach value—and are growing to 17% of attack volume by 2027. They weaponize third-party research (Harvard Kennedy School) showing AI reduces targeted attack costs by 95% while increasing success rates from 12% to 60%. The pattern: Find authoritative external validation that the threat landscape is fundamentally shifting, making incumbent solutions architecturally insufficient regardless of brand strength. Bifurcate messaging by operational reality, not just title: Alan messages CISOs around risk buying-down and ROI, positioning email security as a solved problem that's becoming unsolved. For security operations teams, the pitch centers on eliminating 70% false-positive user submissions that waste skilled analyst time. Both personas use the same tools, but CISOs face board-level breach risk while SOC teams face daily toil from alert fatigue. The takeaway: Map distinct daily operational pains for each buying committee member rather than broadcasting unified value propositions that dilute relevance.   //   Sponsors: Front Lines — We help B2B tech companies launch, manage, and grow podcasts that drive demand, awareness, and thought leadership. www.FrontLines.io The Global Talent Co. — We help tech startups find, vet, hire, pay, and retain amazing marketing talent that costs 50-70% less than the US & Europe. www.GlobalTalent.co // Don't Miss: New Podcast Series — How I Hire Senior GTM leaders share the tactical hiring frameworks they use to build winning revenue teams. Hosted by Andy Mowat, who scaled 4 unicorns from $10M to $100M+ ARR and launched Whispered to help executives find their next role. Subscribe here: https://open.spotify.com/show/53yCHlPfLSMFimtv0riPyM

Lincode Labs is transforming quality control in automotive manufacturing through AI-powered visual inspection systems that replace traditional machine vision cameras with advanced computer vision technology. After nine years and $10 million in funding, the company has established itself as an early mover in bringing modern AI to one of manufacturing's most conservative sectors. In this episode of Category Visionaries, I spoke with Rajesh Iyengar, a fourth-time founder with multiple exits, about his methodical approach to market validation, the operational realities of selling into automotive manufacturing, and the counterintuitive GTM strategies that enabled market penetration in a notoriously risk-averse industry. Topics Discussed: Pre-incorporation market validation methodology: surveying 300-400 manufacturers over one year Positioning within existing "vision systems" budget categories versus creating new AI category Manufacturing engineer versus quality engineer buyer persona discovery and implications Trade show strategy for demonstrating complex AI technology to skeptical prospects Geographic arbitrage: leveraging Silicon Valley for fundraising, Michigan for customer proximity Structured investor feedback collection across 400-500 pitches for business model refinement GTM Lessons For B2B Founders: Execute systematic pre-incorporation market validation at scale: Before incorporating Lincode, Rajesh spent an entire year surveying 300-400 manufacturers through a structured questionnaire approach. Starting with 8-10 manufacturing contacts, he expanded through LinkedIn outreach to validate core assumptions about AI adoption, deployment complexity, and willingness to pay. This wasn't casual customer discovery—it was quantitative market research that de-risked his fourth venture before committing capital. B2B founders should design systematic validation processes that generate statistically meaningful data rather than relying on anecdotal feedback from a handful of prospects. Position within existing budget categories to accelerate procurement cycles: Despite building AI technology, Rajesh deliberately positioned Lincode within the established "vision systems" category rather than creating a new AI category. As he explained, "as far as customer is concerned, whether it's AI or not AI, they'll put us into a category of vision systems... so they can assign the budgets." Creating new categories extends sales cycles as procurement teams struggle with budget allocation and vendor evaluation frameworks. B2B founders should analyze how their innovation maps to existing enterprise budget line items and position accordingly, reserving category creation for later market education phases. Identify economic buyers through productivity impact mapping, not feature alignment: Lincode's initial assumption that quality engineers would buy quality inspection technology proved completely wrong. Manufacturing engineers became the actual buyers because quality bottlenecks directly constrained their core KPI: productivity. Rajesh discovered that "manufacturing engineers responsibility is on productivity, so quality kind of puts a bottleneck on that." This required repositioning their value proposition from quality improvement to productivity optimization. B2B founders must map their solution's economic impact across organizational functions to identify who controls budget decisions, which often differs from the obvious feature-benefit alignment. Deploy experiential marketing for technology adoption in conservative industries: Traditional SaaS demo strategies failed in automotive manufacturing where "AI is something which nobody wanted to just believe on a buzzword, especially in Midwest." Rajesh invested in major trade shows with hands-on demos, allowing prospects to physically interact with components and see real-time AI analysis. This strategy mimicked automotive showroom experiences where customers need tactile engagement before purchasing decisions. For B2B founders selling complex technology to traditional industries, budget allocation should prioritize experiential marketing that enables physical product interaction over digital marketing channels. Structure investor feedback as systematic business model iteration: Rather than fundraising episodically, Rajesh treated investor pitches as structured feedback collection, comparing it to AI model training: "if you give thousands of images, then the AI will work perfectly." Pitching 400-500 investors generated business model insights that shaped core strategic decisions, including the critical industry focus recommendation that transformed their approach. One investor's feedback about avoiding multi-industry approaches directly contradicted Rajesh's initial strategy but proved transformational. B2B founders should design investor interaction as ongoing strategic consulting, maintaining regular dialogue for continuous business model refinement beyond capital needs.   //   Sponsors: Front Lines — We help B2B tech companies launch, manage, and grow podcasts that drive demand, awareness, and thought leadership. www.FrontLines.io The Global Talent Co. — We help tech startups find, vet, hire, pay, and retain amazing marketing talent that costs 50-70% less than the US & Europe.  www.GlobalTalent.co   //   Don't Miss: New Podcast Series — How I Hire Senior GTM leaders share the tactical hiring frameworks they use to build winning revenue teams. Hosted by Andy Mowat, who scaled 4 unicorns from $10M to $100M+ ARR and launched Whispered to help executives find their next role. Subscribe here: https://open.spotify.com/show/53yCHlPfLSMFimtv0riPyM     

Cerebrium is a serverless AI infrastructure platform orchestrating CPU and GPU compute for companies building voice agents, healthcare AI systems, manufacturing defect detection, and LLM hosting. The company operates across global markets handling data residency constraints from GDPR to Saudi Arabia's data sovereignty requirements. In a recent episode of Category Visionaries, I sat down with Michael Louis, Co-Founder & CEO of Cerebrium, to explore how they built a high-performance infrastructure business serving enterprise customers with high five-figure to six-figure ACVs while maintaining 99.9%+ SLA requirements. Topics Discussed: Building AI infrastructure before the GPT moment and strategic patience during the hype cycle Scaling a distributed engineering team between Cape Town and NYC with 95% South African talent Partnership-driven revenue generation producing millions in ARR without traditional sales teams AI-powered market engineering achieving 35% LinkedIn reply rates through competitor analysis Technical differentiation through cold start optimization and network latency improvements Revenue expansion through global deployment and regulatory compliance automation GTM Lessons For B2B Founders: Treat go-to-market as a systems engineering problem: Michael reframed traditional sales challenges through an engineering lens, focusing on constraints, scalability, and data-driven optimization. "I try to reframe my go to market problem as an engineering one and try to pick up, okay, like what are my constraints? Like how can I do this, how can it scale?" This systematic approach led to testing 8-10 different strategies, measuring conversion rates, and building automated pipelines rather than relying on manual processes that don't scale. Structure partnerships for partner success before revenue sharing: Cerebrium generates millions in ARR through partners whose sales teams actively upsell their product. Their approach eliminates typical partnership friction: "We typically approach our partners saying like, look, you keep the money you make, we'll keep the money we make. If it goes well, we can talk about like rev share or some other agreement down the line." This removes commission complexity that kills B2B partnerships and allows partners to focus on customer value rather than internal revenue allocation conflicts. Build AI-powered competitive intelligence for outbound at scale: Cerebrium's 35% LinkedIn reply rate comes from scraping competitor followers and LinkedIn engagement, running prospects through qualification agents that check funding status, ICP fit, and technical roles, then generating personalized outreach referencing specific interactions. "We saw you commented on Michael's post about latency in voice. Like, we think that's interesting. Like, here's a case study we did in the voice space." The system processes thousands of prospects while maintaining personalization depth that manual processes can't match. Position infrastructure as revenue expansion, not cost optimization: While dev tools typically focus on developer productivity gains, Cerebrium frames their value proposition around market expansion and revenue growth. "We allow you to deploy your application in many different markets globally... go to market leaders love us and sales leaders because again we open up more markets for them and more revenue without getting their tech team involved." This messaging resonates with revenue stakeholders and justifies higher spending compared to pure cost-reduction positioning. Weaponize regulatory complexity as competitive differentiation: Cerebrium abstracts data sovereignty requirements across multiple jurisdictions - GDPR in Europe, data residency in Saudi Arabia, and other regional compliance frameworks. "As a company to build the infrastructure to have data sovereignty in all these companies and markets, it's a nightmare." By handling this complexity, they create significant switching costs and enable customers to expand internationally without engineering roadmap dependencies, making them essential to sales teams pursuing global accounts.   //   Sponsors: Front Lines — We help B2B tech companies launch, manage, and grow podcasts that drive demand, awareness, and thought leadership. www.FrontLines.io The Global Talent Co. — We help tech startups find, vet, hire, pay, and retain amazing marketing talent that costs 50-70% less than the US & Europe.  www.GlobalTalent.co   //   Don't Miss: New Podcast Series — How I Hire Senior GTM leaders share the tactical hiring frameworks they use to build winning revenue teams. Hosted by Andy Mowat, who scaled 4 unicorns from $10M to $100M+ ARR and launched Whispered to help executives find their next role. Subscribe here: https://open.spotify.com/show/53yCHlPfLSMFimtv0riPyM   

Whatagraph has evolved from a bootstrap marketing reporting tool to a comprehensive marketing intelligence platform processing data from 12+ sources for marketing teams globally. With over $10 million in funding and a decade of iteration, the Lithuania-based company recently launched "Whatagraph 3.0"—a fundamental shift from pure sales-led to hybrid PLG motion. In this episode of Category Visionaries, Justas Malinauskas shares the technical and strategic decisions behind their transformation from agency tool to enterprise marketing intelligence platform, including their multi-agentic AI implementation and the SEO strategy that generates 500+ MQLs monthly. Topics Discussed: Technical architecture evolution from reporting automation to full-stack marketing intelligence Strategic pivot from sales-led to hybrid PLG/sales-led motion triggered by mission misalignment Advanced SEO methodology using competitor pain point analysis and search behavior reverse engineering AI implementation using multi-agentic systems rather than simple LLM integration Lithuania's bootstrap-first ecosystem and knowledge-sharing networks among unicorn companies Go-to-market evolution across three distinct phases over 10 years GTM Lessons For B2B Founders: Engineer time-to-value as your primary PLG enabler, not feature breadth: Whatagraph achieved 5-minute time-to-value from data connection to dashboard generation—versus the industry standard of hours—by rebuilding their onboarding around AI-powered automation rather than manual drag-and-drop configuration. Justas notes this wasn't just UI optimization but fundamental product architecture changes: "It's basically a lot of knowledge from our last 10 years...we're able to build it like really multi-agentic platform which helps to build those things in steps, not just like drop something randomly." For PLG success, optimize your technical stack for immediate value delivery, not comprehensive feature exposure. Weaponize competitor technical limitations through content strategy: Rather than competing on generic "best marketing tool" keywords, Whatagraph dominated by creating authoritative content around specific competitor pain points. Their "Looker Studio being slow" content strategy captured high-volume searches from frustrated users by actually helping solve the problem while positioning their technical advantages. Justas explains: "The biggest problem was it's actually very slow...when we have everything in house we can make things like very quick and speedy compared to there." Target technical pain points your architecture inherently solves rather than fighting brand-to-brand keyword battles. Align your ICP strategy with your actual technical capabilities, not market perception: Whatagraph's shift to hybrid PLG wasn't market-driven but mission-driven. Justas realized their technical product could serve smaller organizations, but their sales-led approach artificially excluded them: "We were not empowering in the first place people, everyone to make those data driven decisions fast...we were not allowing everyone into the product even if our product was allowing to." Audit whether your go-to-market motion matches your product's actual technical capabilities and addressable market, not just your current revenue optimization. Build SEO moats through search behavior psychology, not keyword tools: Whatagraph's SEO dominance came from Justas thinking like customers in problem-solving mode rather than using standard keyword research. He reverse-engineered the complete buyer journey: "People go through a very much regular process...they search for a problem...find a blog post...find a product...competition...pricing...reviews...then actually buy the product." They attempted to own multiple touchpoints in this journey through strategic content placement across different domains. Map your customer's actual research psychology, not just search volumes. Implement freemium with full core functionality, not feature limitations: Whatagraph's new freemium tier includes their complete AI-powered report generation ("Whatagraph IQ") with only data source limitations, not feature restrictions. This approach lets small users experience the full product value while creating natural upgrade triggers as they grow. Justas notes: "All the core functionality...you're able to talk with your data within AI capabilities and ask questions about your data as you would pay a couple of thousands a month." Design freemium around usage scaling, not capability restrictions, to demonstrate full product value.   //   Sponsors: Front Lines — We help B2B tech companies launch, manage, and grow podcasts that drive demand, awareness, and thought leadership. www.FrontLines.io The Global Talent Co. — We help tech startups find, vet, hire, pay, and retain amazing marketing talent that costs 50-70% less than the US & Europe.  www.GlobalTalent.co   //   Don't Miss: New Podcast Series — How I Hire Senior GTM leaders share the tactical hiring frameworks they use to build winning revenue teams. Hosted by Andy Mowat, who scaled 4 unicorns from $10M to $100M+ ARR and launched Whispered to help executives find their next role. Subscribe here: https://open.spotify.com/show/53yCHlPfLSMFimtv0riPyM   

NumberEight converts mobile sensor data into contextual audience segments without capturing PII, addressing the fundamental breakdown of cookie-based targeting as media consumption fragments across podcasts, gaming, and connected TV. What began as a thesis project for contextual SoundCloud recommendations has evolved into a B2B data platform serving podcast platforms, media sales houses, and agencies. In this episode of Category Visionaries, we sat down with Abhishek Sen to unpack how NumberEight navigates the complex adtech ecosystem and the tactical GTM strategies that drive their expansion across multiple customer segments simultaneously. Topics Discussed: How NumberEight evolved from a Netherlands thesis project (contextual SoundCloud recommendations) to solving adtech's identity crisis Technical architecture: converting mobile sensor data to contextual audience segments without PII collection Multi-segment GTM approach across podcast platforms (AdSwizz, Triton), media sales houses, and agencies Why the company targets podcasting and gaming simultaneously despite different data density challenges Conference strategy: 45+ targeted meetings per event while completely avoiding booths Building category credibility through IAB Tech Lab standards work and white paper contributions The breakdown of cookie-based targeting as consumption fragments beyond web browsers GTM Lessons For B2B Founders: Execute systematic conference preparation to maximize deal flow: Sen books 45+ targeted meetings across 4-day conferences like Cannes Lions through advance relationship mapping and mutual connection identification. The tactical framework: pre-research each prospect's annual priorities, identify shared connections for warm introductions, and plan specific value propositions for each conversation. Execute daily follow-up during the conference to prevent pipeline degradation. Sen's insight: "Prep is incredibly important... we evaluate okay, Brett, head of monetization at ABC Company. Who does Brett know that I know? What is the actual proposition we want to discuss?" Avoid booth competition when capital-constrained: NumberEight deliberately avoids exhibition booths at major conferences, recognizing the futility of competing against Amazon's "entire city mockups" and Google's massive displays. Instead, they focus on authentic relationship building through targeted meetings and dinner sponsorships. The strategic principle: startups should leverage their authenticity advantage rather than attempting to out-spend established players in awareness channels where they're fundamentally disadvantaged. Maintain strict messaging separation between investor and customer tracks: Sen emphasizes the critical disconnect between vision-focused investor pitches and problem-focused customer conversations. His customer insight: "You tell any customer you're going to revolutionize... they're like 'man, you make me money, I'll be your friend.'" The implementation: develop completely separate messaging frameworks where investor decks emphasize market transformation while customer presentations focus exclusively on measurable business impact and revenue generation. Build category authority through standards body participation: NumberEight invests significant engineering resources in IAB Tech Lab white papers and industry standards development without direct revenue impact. This work establishes credibility when defining new data categories in established industries. Sen's co-founder leads technical working groups on identity-less targeting standards. The strategic value: "If you're trying to change the game, you have to be seen as someone giving back to the ecosystem and that helps drive your credibility." Time market entry around regulatory and consumption pattern shifts: NumberEight's positioning leverages two simultaneous disruptions: privacy regulation breakdown of cookie-based targeting and consumption fragmentation beyond web browsers. Sen identifies the core market inefficiency: "Consumption has moved beyond the web... but the data companies, in terms of how data is actually collected, hasn't changed. There's a mismatch." Founders should identify regulatory or technological shifts that create incumbent solution inadequacy and time market entry accordingly. Focus on vertical-specific events over broad industry conferences: NumberEight exclusively attends podcasting-focused (specific platforms), gaming-focused, or adtech-specific conferences rather than generalist marketing events. Sen explains: "We don't attend any conferences that are generalistic... The ones we attend are very focused on either podcasting or gaming or adtech focused ones. That's where we get the most bang for buck." This concentration strategy yields higher prospect quality and more productive pipeline development than broad industry networking.   //   Sponsors: Front Lines — We help B2B tech companies launch, manage, and grow podcasts that drive demand, awareness, and thought leadership. www.FrontLines.io The Global Talent Co. — We help tech startups find, vet, hire, pay, and retain amazing marketing talent that costs 50-70% less than the US & Europe.  www.GlobalTalent.co   //   Don't Miss: New Podcast Series — How I Hire Senior GTM leaders share the tactical hiring frameworks they use to build winning revenue teams. Hosted by Andy Mowat, who scaled 4 unicorns from $10M to $100M+ ARR and launched Whispered to help executives find their next role. Subscribe here: https://open.spotify.com/show/53yCHlPfLSMFimtv0riPyM   

Surgical Safety Technologies is pioneering the transformation of operating rooms from secretive environments into data-driven spaces that optimize patient outcomes. With their "Operating Black Box" platform now deployed in over 50 hospitals across the US, Canada, and Western Europe, the company has generated over 100 peer-reviewed publications demonstrating the ability to reduce patient morbidity and mortality by more than 30% while increasing hospital efficiency by $20 million annually for a typical 40-50 OR facility. In this episode, we sat down with Teodor Grantcharov, founder of Surgical Safety Technologies, to explore his 20-year journey from academic researcher to category-creating entrepreneur in the challenging world of healthcare innovation. Topics Discussed: The evolution from virtual reality surgical simulators in the late 1990s to comprehensive OR analytics platforms Breaking through the cultural resistance to measurement and transparency in surgical environments The strategic decision to target top-tier academic medical centers as early adopters Building a platform with four distinct modules: efficiency, compliance, quality/safety, and education The 10-year journey from research hypothesis to proven commercial success with measurable patient outcomes Creating the category of "data-driven healthcare" in traditionally dogma-driven medical environments GTM Lessons For B2B Founders: Use demanding customers as product validation engines: Teodor's team deliberately targeted top-tier academic medical centers as their initial customer base with a specific thesis: "If we can make the best in the world even better, then we can make anyone better." This wasn't just about prestige - these customers had "internal, very sophisticated systems" and "very knowledgeable professionals and leaders" who would stress-test the platform in ways that revealed product gaps early. The approach creates a competitive moat: once you can satisfy the most demanding buyers in your category, you possess capabilities that competitors serving easier customers lack. Build category credibility through academic validation at scale: Surgical Safety Technologies generated over 100 peer-reviewed publications before their sales process accelerated, creating what Teodor calls "irrefutable" evidence. This wasn't just marketing - the publications came from top hospitals proving 30% mortality reduction and $20 million annual efficiency gains per 40-50 OR facility. The strategy transforms sales conversations: instead of pitching features, they present peer-reviewed outcomes data that procurement committees and clinical leaders cannot dismiss. Category creators in regulated industries should consider academic validation as sales ammunition, not just credibility building. Structure modular platforms for multi-stakeholder enterprise sales: Rather than forcing binary adoption decisions, Surgical Safety Technologies created four distinct platform modules (efficiency, compliance, quality/safety, education) that can be sold individually or as a complete suite. This addresses the reality that "each of those have different stakeholders" within hospital systems. The modular approach enables two distinct sales motions: land-and-expand with single-module entry points for budget-constrained buyers, or comprehensive platform sales when "we usually upsell additional modules to the subscription." This architecture is particularly valuable in complex enterprise environments where different departments control separate budget lines. Leverage mission-driven culture as a competitive advantage: Teodor emphasizes that every hire must understand "what we do, why we do it" and that the company constantly reminds itself "this is not just a gadget or an application. We have a responsibility for improving performance and ultimately improving quality of care for patients." In industries where trust and outcomes matter more than features, a genuine mission-driven approach becomes a critical differentiator that influences everything from branding to employee retention. Time market entry with regulatory and cultural shifts: The company's success accelerated as healthcare systems became more willing to measure performance and embrace transparency. Teodor observes: "Now we see hospitals recognize that you can't improve what you can't measure." B2B founders should identify when broader industry trends create openings for previously resistant categories, and position themselves to capitalize on these inflection points.   //   Sponsors: Front Lines — We help B2B tech companies launch, manage, and grow podcasts that drive demand, awareness, and thought leadership. www.FrontLines.io The Global Talent Co. — We help tech startups find, vet, hire, pay, and retain amazing marketing talent that costs 50-70% less than the US & Europe.  www.GlobalTalent.co   //   Don't Miss: New Podcast Series — How I Hire Senior GTM leaders share the tactical hiring frameworks they use to build winning revenue teams. Hosted by Andy Mowat, who scaled 4 unicorns from $10M to $100M+ ARR and launched Whispered to help executives find their next role. Subscribe here: https://open.spotify.com/show/53yCHlPfLSMFimtv0riPyM 

OpenInfer addresses the enterprise infrastructure gap that causes 70% of edge AI deployments to fail. Founded by system architects who previously built high-throughput runtime systems at Meta (enabling VR applications on Qualcomm chips via Oculus Link) and Roblox (scaling real-time operations across millions of gaming devices), OpenInfer applies proven architectural patterns to enterprise edge AI deployment. The company targets three specific customer pain points: cost reduction for AI-always-on applications, data sovereignty requirements in regulated environments, and reliability for systems that must function regardless of connectivity. In this episode of Category Visionaries, CEO and Founder Behnam Bastani reveals how external market catalysts like DeepSeek's efficiency breakthrough transformed investor perception and validated their compute optimization thesis. Topics Discussed: System architecture pattern replication from Meta's Oculus Link to Roblox to OpenInfer The compute efficiency gap: why "throwing hardware" at AI problems creates market inefficiencies How DeepSeek's January 2025 breakthrough shifted investor sentiment from skepticism to oversubscription Customer targeting methodology: focusing on business unit leaders facing career consequences Government market discovery: air-gapped environments and data sovereignty requirements Technical demonstration strategies for overcoming the 70% edge deployment failure rate Privacy-first AI positioning unlocking previously inaccessible use cases GTM Lessons For B2B Founders: Target decision-makers with career-level consequences: Rather than pursuing prospects who might "take a risk," Behnam focuses on "those that lose their jobs if they're not solving the problem" - specifically business unit leaders whose profit margins or sales metrics directly impact their career trajectory. This creates urgency that comfortable cloud users lack and accelerates deal cycles by aligning solution adoption with personal survival incentives. Leverage external market catalysts for thesis validation: OpenInfer initially faced investor pushback ("Nvidia's got everything working well. Why you think you can do anything better?") until DeepSeek's efficiency breakthrough provided third-party validation. "January hits and then there's DeepSeek... People called us, hey, you're DeepSeek on edge." Founders should identify potential external events that could validate their contrarian thesis and be prepared to capitalize when these catalysts occur. Lead with technical proof points over explanations: In markets with high failure rates, demonstrations eliminate skepticism faster than education. "We definitely have metrics, demos, and we go with those. We demonstrate what's possible... we remove this skepticalism in terms of ease of deployments, power of edge in one shot." This approach recognizes that technical buyers need confidence before curiosity. Pursue unexpected traction sources aggressively: Despite targeting enterprise ISVs, government demand emerged due to air-gapped environment requirements. "Government is actually becoming huge traction primarily because data ownership was a major topic to them." Rather than forcing initial market hypotheses, founders should redirect resources toward segments showing organic product-market fit signals, even when they require different sales processes. Build credibility through architectural pattern repetition: Investors backed OpenInfer because "we are the people that have built this twice, scaled it to millions." Repeating proven technical patterns across different contexts creates sustainable competitive advantages that new entrants cannot replicate without similar experience depth.   //   Sponsors: Front Lines — We help B2B tech companies launch, manage, and grow podcasts that drive demand, awareness, and thought leadership. www.FrontLines.io The Global Talent Co. — We help tech startups find, vet, hire, pay, and retain amazing marketing talent that costs 50-70% less than the US & Europe.  www.GlobalTalent.co   //   Don't Miss: New Podcast Series — How I Hire Senior GTM leaders share the tactical hiring frameworks they use to build winning revenue teams. Hosted by Andy Mowat, who scaled 4 unicorns from $10M to $100M+ ARR and launched Whispered to help executives find their next role. Subscribe here: https://open.spotify.com/show/53yCHlPfLSMFimtv0riPyM 

Copernic Catalysts is developing next-generation chemical catalysts using computational materials design to replace century-old technology in the $80 billion ammonia industry. The company has raised $10 million and is working with top-five global ammonia producers to prove their Neptune catalyst can deliver tens of millions in annual savings per plant while reducing the industry's 1% contribution to global greenhouse gas emissions. In this episode, Jacob Grose shares insights from his journey from BASF venture capitalist to deep-tech founder, revealing how his team is navigating one of the most conservative B2B markets while building transformational technology for both current chemical production and future sustainable shipping fuels. Topics Discussed: The century-old ammonia catalyst problem and why the industry hasn't innovated Copernic's computational approach to rationally designing drop-in replacement catalysts The extreme conservatism of chemical industry customers and how to overcome it Multi-stage go-to-market strategy from lab samples to pilot demonstrations to commercial scale Using toll manufacturing partnerships to scale capital-efficiently while building customer trust The historical significance of ammonia synthesis and its role in feeding 8 billion people Building a platform technology for multiple catalyst products across different chemical markets GTM Lessons For B2B Founders: Navigate ultra-conservative B2B markets with staged proof: Jacob outlined a methodical approach for entering markets where customers are "terrified of change" due to tight margins and operational risks. Start with small lab samples to top customers, progress to pilot-scale demonstrations over 6-12 months, then secure commercial installations. This staged approach allows conservative buyers to gradually build confidence while de-risking their decision-making process. Leverage toll manufacturing for customer credibility and capital efficiency: Rather than building manufacturing capabilities, Copernic partners with established catalyst manufacturers using an "Apple model" - they own the IP while trusted partners handle production. This approach provides three key advantages: faster scale-up, capital efficiency, and most importantly, customer comfort with proven quality control systems. For deep-tech founders, partnering with established players can accelerate market acceptance. Turn industry conservatism into a competitive moat: While chemical industry conservatism creates barriers to entry, Jacob recognized it also creates powerful moats once you're established. Companies using 100-year-old iron-based catalysts represent massive switching costs and customer lock-in opportunities. Founders entering conservative industries should view initial resistance as future protection against competitors. Design for drop-in replacement adoption: Copernic deliberately engineered their catalyst to work within existing plant infrastructure, minimizing customer adoption friction. Jacob emphasized using "base metals" (common, inexpensive materials) and standard manufacturing techniques to ensure compatibility. When disrupting established industries, reducing implementation complexity can be more valuable than maximizing performance gains. Build technical credibility through domain expertise transfer: Jacob's nine years at BASF provided deep industry knowledge that proved essential for both product development and customer trust. His background in corporate venture capital gave him insights into how large chemical companies evaluate new technologies. Founders targeting specialized B2B markets should consider how domain expertise - whether through hiring, partnerships, or personal experience - can accelerate credibility and customer relationships. Position platform technology for multiple market opportunities: While focused on ammonia catalysts initially, Jacob positioned Copernic as a platform company with computational catalyst design capabilities applicable across multiple chemical markets. This platform approach appeals to investors seeking larger addressable markets while providing strategic flexibility as the company scales.   //   Sponsors: Front Lines — We help B2B tech companies launch, manage, and grow podcasts that drive demand, awareness, and thought leadership. www.FrontLines.io The Global Talent Co. — We help tech startups find, vet, hire, pay, and retain amazing marketing talent that costs 50-70% less than the US & Europe.  www.GlobalTalent.co   //   Don't Miss: New Podcast Series — How I Hire Senior GTM leaders share the tactical hiring frameworks they use to build winning revenue teams. Hosted by Andy Mowat, who scaled 4 unicorns from $10M to $100M+ ARR and launched Whispered to help executives find their next role. Subscribe here: https://open.spotify.com/show/53yCHlPfLSMFimtv0riPyM 

Callidus Legal AI is transforming litigation practice by building comprehensive AI-powered workflows for legal professionals. With 1,200 customers and 100% quarter-over-quarter growth, the company has developed a product-led growth strategy that combines domain-specific AI tools with visual multi-step workflows. In this episode, Justin McCallon shares how Callidus has achieved rapid growth through a zero-friction PLG approach while building trust in a traditionally conservative industry. Topics Discussed: The current state and future potential of AI in legal practice  Callidus's approach to building domain-specific legal AI tools with visual workflows  The company's comprehensive case database containing 11 million U.S. cases  Product-led growth strategies that drove 100% quarterly growth and 1,200 customers  Performance marketing optimization for legal AI tools  Building trust and eliminating hallucination risks in AI-powered legal research  The evolution from chatbot-based tools to sophisticated visual workflows  Organic growth strategies including making case databases freely accessible on the web GTM Lessons For B2B Founders: Master zero-friction PLG for professional services: Callidus achieved 1,200 customers and 100% quarterly growth by eliminating traditional B2B sales friction. Justin explained their approach: "Initially we did this with zero touch points, zero friction. You don't need to talk to anybody. It's basically just you come to our website, you sign up for a trial, you start using the app." This model works particularly well for professional services where individual practitioners can make purchasing decisions independently. Focus on high buyer-intent keywords for performance marketing success: Rather than casting a wide net, Callidus targeted specific, high-intent search terms. Justin emphasized: "A lot of people focus on words that maybe are too informational with lower buy intent." They focused on keywords like "legal AI assistant" and "legal AI research" that indicated immediate need rather than general curiosity. Founders should prioritize keywords that align with their ICP and indicate purchase readiness. Create organic acquisition through valuable free resources: Callidus moved their entire 11 million case database to the web for free access, creating a powerful organic acquisition engine. Justin described the strategy: "People have free access to every case that we have. And they can search, say Brown versus Board of Education. And we'll be one of the groups that has a page dedicated to that." This approach generates organic traffic while demonstrating product value, creating a natural conversion funnel from free users to paid customers. Optimize every funnel step with ruthless precision: Callidus's performance marketing success came from methodical funnel optimization. Justin broke down their approach: "Every step of the funnel. Break it down. What conversion rate are we seeing on this step of the funnel? What's benchmark? And then for the areas that are below benchmark, why are we not doing well?" Founders should treat each funnel step as a conversion problem to solve, using data to identify bottlenecks and creative solutions to address them. Build trust through domain expertise, not just technology: In conservative industries like law, trust is built through demonstrating deep domain knowledge. Callidus differentiates itself by combining legal expertise with engineering: "We have really visual multi step workflows, we have really deep engineering, we've tied both the legal knowledge and the engineering expertise." Founders entering regulated or conservative industries should emphasize domain credibility alongside technical capabilities. Use evaluation systems to optimize AI model performance: Rather than fine-tuning models, Callidus built comprehensive evaluation systems to optimize performance across different foundation models. Justin explained: "We've gone through and had lawyers say, hey, here's my case I've worked on in the past. Here are all of the cases I would reference here... Then we can say, okay, it looks like for this API call, GPT-4 is the best, and this one's Claude." This approach allows for dynamic optimization without the overhead of model training.   //   Sponsors: Front Lines — We help B2B tech companies launch, manage, and grow podcasts that drive demand, awareness, and thought leadership. www.FrontLines.io The Global Talent Co. — We help tech startups find, vet, hire, pay, and retain amazing marketing talent that costs 50-70% less than the US & Europe.  www.GlobalTalent.co   //   Don't Miss: New Podcast Series — How I Hire Senior GTM leaders share the tactical hiring frameworks they use to build winning revenue teams. Hosted by Andy Mowat, who scaled 4 unicorns from $10M to $100M+ ARR and launched Whispered to help executives find their next role. Subscribe here: https://open.spotify.com/show/53yCHlPfLSMFimtv0riPyM 

Hamming AI has emerged as a pioneer in voice agent quality assurance, creating what founder Sumanyu Sharma calls a "new category" of QA for conversational voice agents. After spending a decade building data products at scale at companies like Tesla and Citizen, Sharma recognized an acute pain point as voice agents began proliferating: enterprises desperately needed confidence that their voice agents would work reliably before launching to production. In this episode of Category Visionaries, Sharma shares how his team accidentally created a new category by following their instincts and leveraging a decade of expertise in reliability testing, audio processing, and machine learning. Topics Discussed: The evolution from Tesla's data science team to founding a voice agent QA company How "wandering the desert" for months led to finding the perfect problem-solution fit Building a completely inbound-driven go-to-market strategy in an emerging category The decision to launch before feeling ready and building alongside customers Why the voice agent market skeptics were wrong about market size Creating enterprise trust through reliability testing at scale GTM Lessons For B2B Founders: Follow your instincts when you have deep domain expertise: Sharma spent months "wandering the desert" looking for the right problem until voice agent QA clicked. He emphasizes that when you have a decade of relevant expertise, you can recognize the perfect problem when it appears. As he put it, "when you see it, you kind of know... I am perfectly equipped to solve this specific problem. I'm built for this." Founders should trust their instincts when they have genuine domain expertise rather than overthinking market validation. Build something people want before focusing on category creation: Unlike many founders who start with category creation in mind, Hamming AI "accidentally" created their category by obsessively solving customer problems. Sharma notes, "We weren't looking to create a category. We were just looking to solve a problem that we feel passionate about, that we are already experts at." This customer-first approach led to organic category emergence and sustainable demand. Launch before you feel ready and build with customers: Sharma's biggest learning was launching with a "half-baked" product rather than perfecting it in isolation. "We didn't have a product that we thought was incredible. We just thought, hey, it kind of works, but let's actually build the product together with customers." This approach accelerated learning cycles and created stronger product-market fit than months of internal development would have achieved. Leverage contrarian insights from deep market proximity: While others dismissed voice agent QA as "too small," Sharma's data science background and proximity to builders gave him conviction. He analyzed the fundamentals: "Voice is a universal API for people. Voice agents are just becoming possible. They will be unreliable. Therefore, testing is very important. That's the math." Founders should develop conviction through first-principles thinking rather than consensus market opinions. Focus obsessively on customer success over marketing in emerging categories: Hamming AI remains completely inbound-driven, focusing entirely on making existing customers successful rather than traditional marketing. Sharma explains, "The voice space is so small where if you are doing a good job and if you build a product that people love, they will tell their friends about it." In nascent categories, product excellence and word-of-mouth can be more effective than broad marketing campaigns.   //   Sponsors: Front Lines — We help B2B tech companies launch, manage, and grow podcasts that drive demand, awareness, and thought leadership. www.FrontLines.io The Global Talent Co. — We help tech startups find, vet, hire, pay, and retain amazing marketing talent that costs 50-70% less than the US & Europe.  www.GlobalTalent.co   //   Don't Miss: New Podcast Series — How I Hire Senior GTM leaders share the tactical hiring frameworks they use to build winning revenue teams. Hosted by Andy Mowat, who scaled 4 unicorns from $10M to $100M+ ARR and launched Whispered to help executives find their next role. Subscribe here: https://open.spotify.com/show/53yCHlPfLSMFimtv0riPyM 

StretchDollar is transforming how small businesses approach employee health benefits by decoupling plan administration from funding. Rather than forcing all employees onto a single group plan, the platform allows employers to provide pre-tax monthly budgets that employees can use to purchase individual health plans they select and own themselves. In this episode, I spoke with Marshall Darr, Co-Founder and CEO of StretchDollar, about building a solution that addresses the unique challenges small businesses face in providing healthcare benefits. Topics Discussed: The limitations of traditional group health plans for small businesses under 50 employees How the 2020 IRS ruling on ICHRAs (Individual Coverage Health Reimbursement Arrangements) enabled new approaches StretchDollar's evolution from being their own first customer to serving diverse small businesses The company's cost-effective go-to-market strategy focused on inbound traffic and partnerships Building trust and brand credibility in a heavily regulated industry Optimizing content strategy for both traditional SEO and emerging LLM search traffic The decision to move away from paid marketing channels GTM Lessons For B2B Founders: Become your own first customer to validate the solution: Marshall's team used StretchDollar internally from day one, with his co-founder in San Francisco wanting Kaiser while Marshall was in Pittsburgh where Kaiser wasn't available. This real-world constraint validated their core value proposition. Rather than compromising on a "Frankenstein sort of national but very small group plan," they gave everyone $500 monthly budgets. B2B founders should consider how their own operational needs can serve as the initial proof point for their solution. SMB markets require ruthless cost-effectiveness in go-to-market: Marshall learned from Gusto that targeting small businesses demands extremely cost-effective acquisition strategies. With much smaller annual contract values than enterprise clients, "you need to rely a lot on inbound traffic, a lot on customer-to-customer referrals." B2B founders in SMB markets must build products compelling enough that customers actively recommend them, as traditional enterprise sales models don't work economically. Industry expertise enables superior content marketing: StretchDollar's content strategy works because Marshall spent years as a health insurance broker, selling "hundreds of group policies, hundreds to thousands of individual policies." This deep domain knowledge allows them to create genuinely useful content that attracts both traditional search traffic and increasingly, LLM-generated referrals. B2B founders should leverage their industry expertise to create content that demonstrates unique insights rather than generic advice. Paid marketing can be a distraction from fundamentals: Marshall's team discovered that stopping paid marketing resulted in only "a very marginal sort of drop in signups" while freeing up "tens to hundreds of thousands of dollars." The shift forced them to focus more on content quality and organic growth. For SMB-focused B2B founders, paid channels may be "so optimized right now that you need an insane budget and really good unit economics" to compete effectively. Self-service onboarding becomes competitive advantage: Drawing from Mercury's banking experience, Marshall realized SMB customers want to "knock this out" in 20 minutes without extensive sales calls. StretchDollar built their platform to allow self-onboarding while maintaining sales support for those who prefer it. B2B founders should consider how self-service capabilities can differentiate their solution while improving unit economics. Partnership strategy should target natural referral sources: StretchDollar partnered with Oscar Health, appearing on their website as the preferred destination for sub-20 employee groups. This creates a natural referral flow from a complementary service. B2B founders should identify companies whose customers represent natural expansion opportunities and build formal partnership channels.   //   Sponsors: Front Lines — We help B2B tech companies launch, manage, and grow podcasts that drive demand, awareness, and thought leadership. www.FrontLines.io The Global Talent Co. — We help tech startups find, vet, hire, pay, and retain amazing marketing talent that costs 50-70% less than the US & Europe.  www.GlobalTalent.co   //   Don't Miss: New Podcast Series — How I Hire Senior GTM leaders share the tactical hiring frameworks they use to build winning revenue teams. Hosted by Andy Mowat, who scaled 4 unicorns from $10M to $100M+ ARR and launched Whispered to help executives find their next role. Subscribe here: https://open.spotify.com/show/53yCHlPfLSMFimtv0riPyM 

Nevermined is pioneering the infrastructure for AI commerce, building payment rails specifically designed for agent-to-agent transactions. With a vision of trillions of AI agents functioning as both merchants and consumers, Don Gossen brings 20 years of AI experience to solving what he believes will be the foundational payment challenge of the next era of computing. In this episode of Category Visionaries, Don shares insights on creating an entirely new category—AI commerce—and the unique go-to-market challenges of building for a future that's rapidly becoming reality. Topics Discussed: The emergence of two distinct agent modalities: agent as proxy and agent as independent economic actor Why existing payment infrastructure cannot handle the scale and velocity of AI agent transactions Nevermined's commission-based business model focused on agent-to-agent payments The fundamental cost model differences between SaaS and AI agents Creating the "AI commerce" category and the strategic importance of early categorization Go-to-market strategy targeting verticalized AI agent builders with Series A+ funding The infrastructure investment phase versus deployment challenges in AI adoption GTM Lessons For B2B Founders: Target customers who have proven business models, not just potential: Don's go-to-market strategy specifically targets AI agent companies that have raised Series A or later rounds. His reasoning: "Hopefully the VCs that are backing them have done some due diligence. And the money they're earning is actually real." Rather than chasing every potential customer, focus on those who have already validated their revenue model and can immediately benefit from your solution. Understand the fundamental cost structure of your customer's business model: Don identified that AI agents have an inverted cost model compared to traditional SaaS—most costs are operational (OpEx) rather than capital (CapEx). He explains: "The cost model is basically flipped. Most of your cost is actually on the opex... Your operating costs fluctuate based on the request." This insight shaped Nevermined's entire value proposition around cost monitoring and settlement rather than just payment processing. Create category language early, even before market adoption: Don coined "AI commerce" in 2023 when "people were like, what the hell's an AI agent?" His approach: "It always helps to categorize and provide language that's going to allow people to understand what it is that you're talking about... It's the memeification of the category." Don't wait for your market to mature—create the vocabulary that will define it. Focus on the operational reality, not the theoretical use case: While competitors focus on connecting bank accounts to AI agents for consumer purchases, Don focuses on the underlying workflow costs: "How much does the workflow cost to actually render that outcome?" Understanding the true operational mechanics of your customers' business—not just their surface-level needs—can create significant competitive differentiation. Leverage deep domain expertise to identify non-obvious problems: Don's 20 years in AI revealed that variable AI agent responses create variable operational costs—a problem most founders wouldn't recognize. He notes: "Until recently most people didn't realize that is a major issue in operating these solutions." Deep industry experience can help you spot problems that newer entrants miss entirely.   //   Sponsors: Front Lines — We help B2B tech companies launch, manage, and grow podcasts that drive demand, awareness, and thought leadership. www.FrontLines.io The Global Talent Co. — We help tech startups find, vet, hire, pay, and retain amazing marketing talent that costs 50-70% less than the US & Europe.  www.GlobalTalent.co   //   Don't Miss: New Podcast Series — How I Hire Senior GTM leaders share the tactical hiring frameworks they use to build winning revenue teams. Hosted by Andy Mowat, who scaled 4 unicorns from $10M to $100M+ ARR and launched Whispered to help executives find their next role. Subscribe here: https://open.spotify.com/show/53yCHlPfLSMFimtv0riPyM 

Scalestack is revolutionizing go-to-market operations through intelligent automation, helping enterprise revenue teams eliminate what CEO Elio Narciso calls the "manual work tax" - the 72% of time sales reps spend on tedious data tasks instead of engaging with customers. With $3.1 million in funding and enterprise customers including MongoDB, Redis, and Astronomer, Scalestack has built an agentic orchestration platform that transforms how large organizations manage their revenue data. In this conversation, Narciso shares how his team discovered the massive ROI hidden in back-office automation and why the future belongs to companies that can seamlessly blend human strategy with machine execution. Topics Discussed: The concept of "manual work tax" and its impact on sales productivity  Why 95% of AI investments in enterprises are failing to produce results  Scalestack's evolution from automation platform to agentic workflow orchestration  The company's enterprise-first approach and deployment strategy with large customers  How Scalestack landed MongoDB as an early customer through targeted outbound  The role of podcasting as an ABM strategy for enterprise sales  Scalestack's vision to replace traditional CRMs with intelligent systems of action GTM Lessons For B2B Founders: Target the back-office before the front-office: While many AI companies rush to automate customer-facing roles like SDRs, Narciso emphasizes that the real ROI lies in back-office automation. He cites an MIT study showing that 95% of AI investments fail when focused on last-mile customer interactions, while back-office process automation delivers measurable results. B2B founders should prioritize automating the tedious work that doesn't directly touch customers but enables better customer engagement. Enterprise customers require co-creation, not just deployment: Scalestack's success with MongoDB, Redis, and other large customers came through what Narciso calls "deployment engineers" - essentially building custom solutions collaboratively. He draws inspiration from Palantir's model of developing technology alongside customers. This approach requires significant upfront investment but creates defensible technology that can be productized for the broader market. B2B founders targeting enterprise should be prepared to invest in customer success resources that can handle complex, bespoke implementations. Use customer language to refine your messaging: Narciso completely redid Scalestack's website based on language extracted from hundreds of customer calls and podcast interviews. He emphasizes that "customers always have the best words" because they've lived the pain most deeply. Rather than relying on internal assumptions about positioning, B2B founders should systematically capture and analyze how customers describe their problems and desired outcomes. Cold email still works with enterprise buyers when done strategically: Scalestack's first major customer, MongoDB, came from a cold email to their SVP of Sales Ops. The key was targeting someone (employee #8 at MongoDB) who had an entrepreneurial mindset and curiosity about learning from vendors. Narciso's insight: enterprise operators often want to learn from startups tackling similar problems, whether to buy the solution or implement it internally. B2B founders should research target prospects' backgrounds and approach those with startup experience or operational curiosity. Podcasting as ABM for enterprise sales: Narciso uses his "Revenue Engine Masters" podcast strategically as an account-based marketing tool, targeting specific people at target companies rather than focusing on broad reach. After recording nearly 20 episodes, he's seeing inbound interest and using the content to extract messaging insights. The podcast also strengthens relationships with prospects and customers who participate. B2B founders should consider podcasting not as a mass-market strategy but as a high-touch relationship-building tool for their ideal customer profile.   //   Sponsors: Front Lines — We help B2B tech companies launch, manage, and grow podcasts that drive demand, awareness, and thought leadership. www.FrontLines.io The Global Talent Co. — We help tech startups find, vet, hire, pay, and retain amazing marketing talent that costs 50-70% less than the US & Europe.  www.GlobalTalent.co   //   Don't Miss: New Podcast Series — How I Hire Senior GTM leaders share the tactical hiring frameworks they use to build winning revenue teams. Hosted by Andy Mowat, who scaled 4 unicorns from $10M to $100M+ ARR and launched Whispered to help executives find their next role. Subscribe here: https://open.spotify.com/show/53yCHlPfLSMFimtv0riPyM 

Tony Scott brings an unparalleled perspective to cybersecurity leadership, having served as CIO of the federal government, VMware, Microsoft, General Motors, and Disney before taking the helm at Intrusion during a critical turnaround phase. When Scott joined Intrusion three and a half years ago, the company was in crisis—running out of money, facing SEC investigations, and dealing with shareholder lawsuits after poor leadership decisions. Today, Intrusion has stabilized its technology, raised sufficient capital, and carved out a unique position in the Applied Threat Intelligence category, focusing on real-time packet-level network analysis that stops zero-day attacks and command-and-control communications that bypass traditional security tools. Topics Discussed: Scott's transition from government service to cybersecurity investment and eventual CEO role The crisis state of Intrusion when he joined and the turnaround strategy implemented Intrusion's pivot from direct sales to a managed service provider (MSP) go-to-market strategy The challenge of creating a new category in Applied Threat Intelligence Building and rightsizing the marketing and sales teams during the turnaround The realities of running a public company versus private enterprises Intrusion's unique packet-level network analysis technology versus conversation-based monitoring GTM Lessons For B2B Founders: Do your homework before the meeting: Scott's biggest frustration as a buyer was vendors who showed up unprepared, asking generic questions like "what keeps you up at night?" without understanding the organization or its priorities. He literally had a secret signal with his assistant to escape these meetings. B2B founders must research prospects thoroughly, understand their specific challenges, and craft relevant value propositions before requesting meetings. Generic discovery calls are a waste of everyone's time and destroy credibility. Fix the product before scaling sales: The previous CEO at Intrusion hired dozens of salespeople to sell a product that wasn't ready, resulting in zero sales during his tenure. Scott prioritized fixing scalability, reliability, and feature gaps before rebuilding the go-to-market engine. B2B founders often face pressure to hire sales teams early, but selling a broken product destroys market credibility and wastes resources. Product-market fit must precede sales-market fit. Find the right distribution channel for your product: Intrusion's breakthrough came when they stopped trying to sell directly to end customers and focused on managed service providers and managed service security providers. This channel strategy worked because Intrusion's solution enhances existing security stacks rather than replacing them, making it perfect for MSPs serving SMBs that can't afford enterprise-level security expertise. B2B founders should carefully analyze whether their solution is better suited for direct sales, channel partnerships, or hybrid approaches based on customer buying behavior and implementation complexity. Embrace being in a category of one: Despite pressure from analysts and customers to fit into existing categories, Intrusion discovered they occupy a unique position in Applied Threat Intelligence. While this creates messaging challenges, it also eliminates direct competition. Scott worked with Gartner and other analysts to establish that no other company does exactly what Intrusion does. B2B founders shouldn't force themselves into existing categories if their technology is truly differentiated—creating a new category can be more valuable than competing in crowded ones. Leverage legal training for crisis management: Scott's law school background taught him to analyze situations from a 360-degree perspective, understand all stakeholder positions, and develop comprehensive strategies. This skill set proved invaluable during Intrusion's turnaround and his previous crisis management roles. B2B founders facing difficult situations should adopt this approach: clearly define the problem, gather multiple perspectives, identify all stakeholders, and develop a theory of the case for moving forward.   //   Sponsors: Front Lines — We help B2B tech companies launch, manage, and grow podcasts that drive demand, awareness, and thought leadership. www.FrontLines.io The Global Talent Co. — We help tech startups find, vet, hire, pay, and retain amazing marketing talent that costs 50-70% less than the US & Europe.  www.GlobalTalent.co   //   Don't Miss: New Podcast Series — How I Hire Senior GTM leaders share the tactical hiring frameworks they use to build winning revenue teams. Hosted by Andy Mowat, who scaled 4 unicorns from $10M to $100M+ ARR and launched Whispered to help executives find their next role. Subscribe here: https://open.spotify.com/show/53yCHlPfLSMFimtv0riPyM 

Fetch Package Delivery has revolutionized apartment package management through an innovative off-site warehouse model, serving over 400,000 units and approaching $70 million in ARR. In this episode, we sat down with Michael Patton, Founder & CEO of Fetch, to explore how he built a logistics-heavy business that bridges the gap between traditional property management and modern e-commerce demands. Michael's journey from corporate finance to PropTech pioneer offers unique insights into scaling physical service businesses in markets that weren't traditionally venture-backable. Topics Discussed: Fetch's origin as a solution to apartment building package management problems The company's evolution from bootstrapped Dallas startup to national platform Building MVP in logistics-heavy businesses versus traditional SaaS Early customer acquisition strategies in relationship-driven industries Navigating the PropTech market before it became mainstream Scaling operations while maintaining service quality during hypergrowth Expanding from core package delivery to adjacent services GTM Lessons For B2B Founders: Master relationship-based selling in traditional industries: Michael succeeded in the apartment industry through personal relationship building rather than digital marketing funnels. He spent months visiting properties, forming relationships with regional managers, and even secured his first customer through a handwritten card campaign that resonated with a VP who loved dog rescue. B2B founders entering traditional industries should prioritize face-to-face relationship building and understand that decision-makers often value personal connections over polished presentations. Take calculated risks to capture market timing: Fetch grew from $1M to $40M ARR in just 18 months during 2019-2021, despite not being fully operationally ready for that scale. Michael explains: "The thing that we did right was take advantage of really intense market demand when it came, even though we weren't always quite ready for it." Founders should be prepared to scale aggressively when market conditions align, even if it means accumulating technical debt or operational challenges that can be addressed later. Physical service businesses require different MVP strategies: Unlike SaaS companies that can iterate with software alone, Fetch's MVP required Michael to personally deliver packages for 18 months while building operational knowledge. This hands-on approach provided invaluable insights: "It was so valuable looking back, to be able to see every side of the business and literally four or five, six hours a day, be the last mile delivery partner." Founders building physical service businesses should expect to be deeply involved in operations during early stages to understand every aspect of their value chain. Hire ahead of immediate needs during growth phases: During Fetch's hypergrowth period, Michael deliberately over-hired on skill level, bringing in leaders who were arguably overqualified for immediate needs but would be essential as the company scaled. This strategy of "trusting leaders and bringing in the right people to lead some of the most critical ops" allowed them to maintain quality during rapid expansion. Founders should consider investing in talent that can grow into roles rather than just filling current gaps. Build platform infrastructure for adjacent service expansion: Fetch's long-term strategy always focused on establishing the "rails" between warehouses and buildings, then adding services that utilize existing trips and infrastructure. Michael describes: "We've sort of done the dirty work of building up a labor intensive business and we have sort of underlying tech to make that a lot easier now." This approach of building core infrastructure first, then layering additional services, creates significant competitive advantages and higher margins over time.   //   Sponsors: Front Lines — We help B2B tech companies launch, manage, and grow podcasts that drive demand, awareness, and thought leadership. www.FrontLines.io The Global Talent Co. — We help tech startups find, vet, hire, pay, and retain amazing marketing talent that costs 50-70% less than the US & Europe.  www.GlobalTalent.co   //   Don't Miss: New Podcast Series — How I Hire Senior GTM leaders share the tactical hiring frameworks they use to build winning revenue teams. Hosted by Andy Mowat, who scaled 4 unicorns from $10M to $100M+ ARR and launched Whispered to help executives find their next role. Subscribe here: https://open.spotify.com/show/53yCHlPfLSMFimtv0riPyM 

Starboard is building AI-first infrastructure to transform global trade by improving the productivity of freight forwarders—the central coordinators who connect 15-20 different parties in every international trade transaction. With 15 years of experience in the industry, including roles at Maersk, BCG, and Flexport, Sumeet Trehan saw an opportunity to modernize an industry that has invested heavily in physical infrastructure but neglected technological innovation. The company has raised $5.5 million and is approaching $1 million ARR while creating an entirely new category they call "AI-first forwarders." Topics Discussed: Building AI infrastructure to automate freight forwarding coordination and quoting processes Creating a new category in the traditional, relationship-driven logistics industry Go-to-market strategies for selling to an "old boys club" industry that operates differently from typical SaaS markets The founder's decision to personally handle the first 20-30 sales before hiring any sales staff Vision for transforming global trade by creating a comprehensive platform for small-to-mid-sized importers   GTM Lessons For B2B Founders: Cold calling still works in traditional industries: Starboard generates significant top-of-funnel activity through direct cold calling, with freight forwarders actually appreciating the personal touch. Sumeet's team achieves a 10% pickup rate and converts 15-20% of answered calls to discovery meetings by being upfront about the cold call nature and immediately focusing on business outcomes. The approach works because their target market—freight forwarders—are accustomed to making and receiving cold calls as part of their daily business operations. Door-to-door prospecting remains viable for relationship-driven markets: In industries where personal relationships dominate, physical presence can be a differentiator. Starboard literally brings donuts to prospects' offices, which works because their target market values face-to-face interactions. This approach only makes sense when your industry culture supports it and when the lifetime value of customers justifies the time investment. Founders should personally execute early sales to understand the playbook: Rather than immediately hiring sales staff after raising funding, Sumeet chose to personally close the first 20-30 deals. This allowed him to deeply understand customer pain points, refine the sales process, and develop a replicable methodology before bringing on sales team members. Only after proving out the top-of-funnel motion did he hire his first SDR, and only after closing 15-20 deals did he hire a sales leader. Physical implementation presence drives early-stage product adoption: For complex B2B products still achieving product-market fit, being physically present during implementation creates stronger relationships and better feedback loops. Starboard's team travels to be on-site when clients first use the product, which helps with both adoption rates and product development insights. They maintain ongoing communication through WhatsApp and Teams channels rather than Slack, adapting to their customers' preferred communication methods. Category creation requires education over product promotion: Starboard's marketing strategy focuses entirely on educating the market about AI's potential impact on logistics rather than promoting their specific product. By speaking at events, writing blogs, and participating in podcasts about industry transformation rather than Starboard features, they position themselves as thought leaders. This approach builds trust and creates demand for the category before potential customers are ready to evaluate specific solutions. Sequencing product development based on customer feedback: The company's current quoting product serves as a wedge, with plans to expand into marketplace functionality and then full operations automation. Each expansion builds on customer relationships and data from the previous phase. This measured approach to product development ensures each step creates value while building toward the larger vision of comprehensive trade infrastructure.   //   Sponsors: Front Lines — We help B2B tech companies launch, manage, and grow podcasts that drive demand, awareness, and thought leadership. www.FrontLines.io The Global Talent Co. — We help tech startups find, vet, hire, pay, and retain amazing marketing talent that costs 50-70% less than the US & Europe.  www.GlobalTalent.co   //   Don't Miss: New Podcast Series — How I Hire Senior GTM leaders share the tactical hiring frameworks they use to build winning revenue teams. Hosted by Andy Mowat, who scaled 4 unicorns from $10M to $100M+ ARR and launched Whispered to help executives find their next role. Subscribe here: https://open.spotify.com/show/53yCHlPfLSMFimtv0riPyM 

Moment Energy is transforming the energy storage landscape by giving electric vehicle batteries a second life. With $32 million in government grants secured and a 2-gigawatt-hour facility under construction in Austin, Texas, the company is pioneering the repurposing of end-of-life EV batteries into stationary energy storage systems. In this episode of Category Visionaries, I sat down with Edward Chiang, Co-Founder and CEO of Moment Energy, to explore how his team is solving the dual challenges of EV battery waste and distributed energy storage while building a commercially viable hardware business. Topics Discussed: The $4,000 recycling cost problem facing EV owners at end-of-life How 80-95% capacity remains in "dead" EV batteries due to single cell failures Moment Energy's vision for distributed energy storage at every neighborhood block The certification maze: becoming the first North American company to achieve UL 1974 Securing $32M in government contracts from the DOE and Canadian government Commercial-industrial customer strategy targeting Fortune 500 companies The unique challenges of hardware go-to-market versus SaaS   GTM Lessons For B2B Founders: Sell on economics, not sustainability: Despite the environmental benefits of battery repurposing, Chiang emphasizes selling purely on cost and performance metrics. He explained, "We never sell based on sustainability... We just sell on typical cost and power." B2B founders should resist leading with feel-good messaging and instead focus on measurable business outcomes that matter to their buyers' bottom line. Target infrastructure decision-makers, not sustainability teams: Moment Energy focuses on buyers who "manage the energy infrastructure for the entire [organization]" because "there's a lot less education that's required. They know how to speak batteries." While sustainability teams can provide useful introductions, the real decision-makers understand the technical and economic trade-offs. B2B founders should identify the specific roles that truly own their problem space rather than getting distracted by adjacent stakeholders. Regulatory barriers become competitive moats: The extensive certification process that costs hundreds of thousands of dollars in burn testing creates what Chiang calls "a massive barrier to entry for any incumbents to come in." While painful initially, these regulatory requirements can provide sustained competitive advantages. B2B founders in regulated industries should view compliance costs as investments in defensibility rather than just operational expenses. Government contracts require commercial proof points: Chiang noted that government agencies "want to make sure that you're actually commercially ready rather than just a big marketing play." They validate systems in the field and measure actual impact before awarding contracts. B2B founders pursuing government opportunities should prioritize demonstrable commercial traction over grant-writing skills, as real customer deployments become the foundation for larger contracts. Hardware requires deeper customer conviction: Unlike software pilots, Chiang explains that their systems "cannot go down because it's not a pilot" and customers need complete confidence from day one. This means hardware founders must achieve higher customer conviction thresholds before securing deals. The extended sales cycles and higher stakes require more thorough technical validation and risk mitigation than typical SaaS implementations.   //   Sponsors: Front Lines — We help B2B tech companies launch, manage, and grow podcasts that drive demand, awareness, and thought leadership. www.FrontLines.io The Global Talent Co. — We help tech startups find, vet, hire, pay, and retain amazing marketing talent that costs 50-70% less than the US & Europe.  www.GlobalTalent.co   //   Don't Miss: New Podcast Series — How I Hire Senior GTM leaders share the tactical hiring frameworks they use to build winning revenue teams. Hosted by Andy Mowat, who scaled 4 unicorns from $10M to $100M+ ARR and launched Whispered to help executives find their next role. Subscribe here: https://open.spotify.com/show/53yCHlPfLSMFimtv0riPyM 

Growers Edge is revolutionizing agriculture by eliminating the biggest barrier to farmer innovation: risk aversion. With $30 million in funding raised in just 18 months under CEO Matthew Hansen's leadership, the company has evolved from a struggling crop insurance reseller into a multi-faceted agricultural technology platform. By providing downside protection for farmers trying new inputs, expanding into direct lending for equipment and land purchases, and leveraging proprietary data insights, Growers Edge has built three profitable business lines targeting a combined addressable market of over $400 billion. In this episode, Matthew shares his journey from private equity investor to hands-on operator, detailing the systematic turnaround that transformed the company from hundreds of thousands in revenue to millions, with some business lines growing at 800% annually. Topics Discussed: Growers Edge's evolution from crop insurance reseller to comprehensive agricultural risk management platform The three core business lines: input warranties, direct lending, and data services Matthew's transition from private equity investor to operational CEO The systematic approach to company turnaround and organizational restructuring Strategies for identifying and scaling what's working while eliminating what isn't Building a customer-focused organization versus a product-focused one Attracting top-tier talent during rapid growth phases GTM Lessons For B2B Founders: Lead with guarantee, not data: Matthew discovered that "putting your money where your mouth is goes a lot further than charts and graphs at the farm gate." Instead of overwhelming farmers with analytics to convince them to try new inputs, Growers Edge simply guarantees the performance. This approach eliminates the primary barrier to adoption - risk aversion - and accelerates decision-making. B2B founders should consider how they can reduce perceived risk for customers rather than just providing more information to justify decisions. Organize around customers, not products: One of Matthew's first major changes was restructuring the organization around customer needs rather than product lines. He explains the critical difference: "A company that's organized around products has something and you're trying to basically force someone to buy it, whereas the company that's focused on customers knows the customer, sees the need and provides a solution." This customer-centric approach enables rapid iteration and market responsiveness that product-focused organizations struggle to achieve. Scale winners ruthlessly while exploring adjacencies: Rather than trying to fix everything, Matthew focused on "watering the winners" - identifying what was already working and doubling down with resources and talent. He then systematically explored adjacent opportunities that leveraged existing capabilities, like using warranty data to inform lending decisions. B2B founders should resist the urge to spread resources thin and instead concentrate on amplifying proven success while strategically expanding into related markets. Build acquisition as distribution strategy: Growers Edge's acquisition of Aquoso wasn't about technology or talent - it was about buying a go-to-market engine. Matthew compares it to "when Budweiser buys a craft beer company and when you plug it into that distribution network, you see sales of that craft beer skyrocket." The acquired company's existing relationships with 28 banks and farm credits provided immediate distribution for Growers Edge's data products, doubling that business since acquisition. Founders should consider acquisitions not just for capabilities, but as a way to instantly access established customer relationships and distribution channels. Talent attraction follows momentum, not compensation: Matthew was able to recruit executives who had built three unicorn fintech companies not through compensation alone, but because of "the positive direction of the business, the renewed vigor of the fundraising and the support of very credible, fantastic sponsors." Top talent gravitates toward companies with clear momentum and strong backing. B2B founders should focus on demonstrating tangible progress and securing credible investors as much for talent attraction as for capital.   //   Sponsors: Front Lines — We help B2B tech companies launch, manage, and grow podcasts that drive demand, awareness, and thought leadership. www.FrontLines.io The Global Talent Co. — We help tech startups find, vet, hire, pay, and retain amazing marketing talent that costs 50-70% less than the US & Europe.  www.GlobalTalent.co   //   Don't Miss: New Podcast Series — How I Hire Senior GTM leaders share the tactical hiring frameworks they use to build winning revenue teams. Hosted by Andy Mowat, who scaled 4 unicorns from $10M to $100M+ ARR and launched Whispered to help executives find their next role. Subscribe here: https://open.spotify.com/show/53yCHlPfLSMFimtv0riPyM 

Abel Police is transforming law enforcement efficiency through AI-powered report generation technology. With $5 million in funding, the company has developed a computer vision and natural language processing platform that automatically generates police reports from body camera footage, reducing officer paperwork time by up to one-third. In this episode of Category Visionaries, we sat down with Daniel Francis, Founder and CEO of Abel Police, to explore how a former data engineer with no policing background identified a massive inefficiency in law enforcement and built technology to address it. Topics Discussed: How a personal experience with domestic violence response times led to the founding of Abel Police The discovery that police officers spend one-third of their time writing reports Abel Police's approach to integrating with existing digital evidence management systems The unique challenges of selling technology to government agencies and police departments The company's evolution from attempting full record management system integration to standalone solutions The regulatory compliance requirements specific to criminal justice information systems (CJIS) GTM Lessons For B2B Founders: Immerse yourself completely in your target customer's world: Daniel spent 32 ride-alongs with police officers across different departments, not just conducting interviews but observing their daily workflows for hours. He describes himself as "chief ride along officer" and emphasizes that he had to "creepily watch them work for hours" to understand their pain points. B2B founders should go beyond traditional customer interviews and embed themselves in their customers' actual work environment to identify problems that aren't immediately obvious through conversation alone. Start with mock data when real data is inaccessible: Unable to access actual body camera footage, Daniel created fake scenarios with friends, filming mock arrests and citations to train their AI models. This creative workaround allowed them to begin product development despite regulatory barriers to accessing real police footage. B2B founders facing data access challenges should find creative ways to simulate their target environment and data types to begin building and testing their solutions. Become an insider to overcome industry skepticism: Daniel secured a position as a "records intern" at Richmond Police Department when they wouldn't initially buy his solution, giving him access to real body camera footage and deeper understanding of police workflows. This inside access became crucial for product development and credibility. B2B founders entering unfamiliar industries should consider temporary or consulting arrangements that allow them to work alongside their target customers and gain credibility within the industry. Give away pilots strategically in government markets: Contrary to Y Combinator's advice to always charge for pilots, Daniel found that offering free trials was essential for police departments due to their complex procurement processes. He explains that "if they have to pay for something, that's a hassle" in government settings, but if they're willing to share their data with you, "they're serious about it." B2B founders selling to government should consider free pilots as a necessary investment to navigate bureaucratic purchasing processes. Build standalone solutions before attempting platform integration: Abel Police initially tried to integrate with every record management system, which significantly delayed their go-to-market timeline. They found success by building a standalone version first, then pursuing integrations. Daniel notes they "would have never sold anything" if they had stuck to their original integration-first approach. B2B founders should prioritize getting a working solution in customers' hands over achieving perfect system integration from day one. Leverage adjacent opportunities from your core market position: Once established with police departments, Abel Police identified additional problems like online citizen reporting and policy/law lookup tools. Their relationship with agencies made them "very open to new solutions" since "there's way more problems than there is solutions" in policing. B2B founders should view their initial market entry as a platform for identifying and addressing related problems within the same customer base.   //   Sponsors: Front Lines — We help B2B tech companies launch, manage, and grow podcasts that drive demand, awareness, and thought leadership. www.FrontLines.io The Global Talent Co. — We help tech startups find, vet, hire, pay, and retain amazing marketing talent that costs 50-70% less than the US & Europe.  www.GlobalTalent.co   //   Don't Miss: New Podcast Series — How I Hire Senior GTM leaders share the tactical hiring frameworks they use to build winning revenue teams. Hosted by Andy Mowat, who scaled 4 unicorns from $10M to $100M+ ARR and launched Whispered to help executives find their next role. Subscribe here: https://open.spotify.com/show/53yCHlPfLSMFimtv0riPyM