Podcasts about Wilderness Act

We are taking a break over the holidays in order to finish up our series about national parks. We'll be back in your feed on January 7 with a visit to Glacier Bay National Park in southeast Alaska. We'll learn how the trickles of chilly glacial meltwater are creating a flourishing ecosystem.  But in the meantime, I wanted to share an episode from a podcast I think you'll really like called How Wild. It's from our friends at KALW Public Media and the NPR Network. The podcast looks at the meaning of wilderness, one hundred years since the passage of the Wilderness Act of 1964.  The law set aside areas within national parks and forests and other federal public lands for an extra level of protection. These wilderness areas have to be “undeveloped” and “natural” and they have to have opportunities for “primitive, unconfined recreation” and “solitude.”  But so much has changed since the passage of the Wilderness Act. In this episode, host Marissa Ortega-Welch looks at solitude and what that means these days with so many people hitting the trails. See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This year marks the 60th anniversary of the Wilderness Act, the law that gives Congress the authority to establish wilderness areas. Some of the most beloved outdoor recreation spots in our region are wilderness areas. Decades later, land managers and advocates say it's still a valuable tool to protect landscapes and hope to expand its legacy.Aspen Public Radio's Caroline Llanes, reporting for the Mountain West News Bureau, joined Idaho Matters to talk more about the Wilderness Act and what it means 60 years later.

The Wilderness Act, passed 60 years ago, seeks to protect grand natural spaces in the U.S. to the highest level — including eight areas in Missouri. The Sierra Club will celebrate the 60th anniversary of the Wilderness Act on Nov. 19 at the Anita B. Gorman Discovery Center.

The Wilderness Act, passed in 1964, gave Congress the authority to designate wilderness areas. It led to the establishment of many popular outdoor recreation areas, including the Maroon Bells Snowmass Wilderness, and Flat Tops Wilderness, where the idea first began.

We're taking a wilderness walk in recognition of this anniversary year of the 1964 Wilderness Act, which created the National Wilderness Preservation System. But long before the Wilderness Act, and long before we were even using the word “wilderness”, these lands were used and stewarded by Indigenous communities. So, designated wilderness areas are both Tribal homelands and places for recreation. Taking a walk in these lands is an opportunity to think about wilderness means to us, which can help us connect to nature and each other. Show Notes Available HERE. Transcript Available HERE.

In the 1950s and 60s, as environmental concerns grew in the United States, there was increasing recognition that the National Park and National Forest systems were inadequate to safeguard wilderness areas from commercial interests. Conservationists, alarmed by the encroachment on these natural spaces, lobbied Congress for more robust protections. This movement culminated in the signing of the Wilderness Act into law by President Lyndon B. Johnson on this date in 1964.

On today's newscast: Today marks the 60th anniversary of the Wilderness Act, and a new group — the National Wilderness Coalition — is hoping to reinvigorate the wilderness lobby in Congress; Healthy Kids Colorado Survey Data show mixed trends in our five-county area; before Theatre Aspen kicks off its annual “Solo Flights” festival later this week, the modern classic “Tuesdays with Morrie” takes the stage; and more.

The post September 3, 2024: The Wilderness Act’s 60th Anniversary appeared first on KRFY Radio.

The Wilderness Act was passed by Congress in 1964, and has protected over 109 million acres of American public lands (53% of them in Alaska) since then. But the idea was born in 1924, with the vision of none other than Aldo Leopold, who was then the Supervisor of the Carson National Forest, and had spent almost fifteen years working on and exploring the wild public lands of New Mexico. Leopold argued that among the resources the Forest Service was mandated to safeguard for the American people were open spaces for hunting, fishing and real adventure. He argued, eloquently, that these values existed in abundance on the unpeopled lands of the Gila National Forest, that they were becoming more and more rare across America, and that the US Forest Service could choose to protect them for future generations. This year, we celebrate the 100th Anniversary of the Gila Wilderness. The Gila was America's first public lands' wilderness, and the ideas and arguments that created it provided the template for all that we understand as federally designated wilderness today.  How did this come to be? Join us- Hal, Karl Malcolm, US Forest Service ecologist, hunter and wanderer of the Gila, and Curt Meine, conservation biologist and author of Aldo Leopold: His Life and Work, and Senior Fellow at the Aldo Leopold Foundation.   A wilderness area, Leopold wrote, was “a continuous stretch of country preserved in its natural state, open to lawful hunting and fishing, big enough to absorb a two weeks' pack trip, and kept devoid of roads, artificial trails, cottages, or other works of man.” ______ Enter the MeatEater Experience Sweepstakes: https://go.bhafundraising.org/meateatersweeps24/Campaign/Details    

Dan Disch returns, along with Tom Roach to talk about the Superior National Forest Wilderness Monitoring Program, and what the data tells us about the modern experience in the Boundary Waters Canoe Area WildernessSteve Roberts returns to talk about tiny pond critters, and the variety of berries that are thriving in our wet Northwoods summer.Time Stamps:(1:20) Steve Robertson(33:02) Dan Disch and Tom RoachShow Notes:Superior National Forest - Planning (usda.gov) (This is the current Forest Plan)Learn About Wilderness Wilderness Connect or Wilderness.net is a great resource for all things concerning wilderness mattersCan read the 1964 Wilderness Act, or the 1978 Boundary Waters ActCan learn more about wilderness characterLists all 800+ wilderness areas in the country and how to go about recreating within themDarkSky International | Protecting the night skies for present and future generations Learn about the International Dark Sky Association

Download our app: Apple Here  Android Here Park Ranger, John Bernstiel, from the Gulf Island National Seashore joins us to talk about the Wilderness Act and the difference between a barrier island and a wilderness island. Also big thanks to Southern Magnolia Smiles, Sea 2 Swamp, Forever Young Men's and Women Health, and Taylor and Cox Law Firm, and Dewy Dew Bugs for the support! Also our app sponsor Modern Recoil CPR & Safety. Want to be a part of the pelican gang? Check out our merch here. 

On June 3rd, 1924 the Gila Wilderness became the world's first ever administratively designated wilderness. Forty years later when the Wilderness Act was signed into law by President Lyndon B. Johnson the National Wilderness Preservation System was established and the Gila became a congressionally designated wilderness. Remarkably, even four decades before the United States Congress had the ability to designate wilderness, a U.S. Forest Service employee by the name of Aldo Leopold had a vision for the idea of wilderness protection. Leopold's unwavering commitment to protecting the Gila in its natural state led to the original designation. That initial, administrative designation began what would later become one of the most celebrated forms of permanent land protection in the United States. There are still some people who oppose the idea of designated wilderness areas, or other land protections. That was also the case when Leopold dreamed up his idea of wilderness and when the Wilderness Act was eventually passed. According to the historian James Trefethen, author of An American Crusade for Wildlife, consistent opposition was found in the House by the Committee on Interior and Insular Affairs. “The wilderness proposal was bitterly opposed by a coalition of western commercial interests, including the mining companies, timber corporations, and livestock associations.” These same industry groups continue to oppose ongoing land protection campaigns today. With history as our teacher though, we can clearly see that permanently protecting wild places for future generations pays off and in the long run these victories are overwhelmingly appreciated. Listen in as Dr. Karl Malcolm from the United States Forest Service moderates a panel consisting of Jeremy Romero of the National Wildlife Federation, Tisha Broska of NM WIld and Jesse Deubel of the New Mexico Wildlife Federation. This group of modern-day conservationists share personal stories as they reflect on the world's first ever designated wilderness. Happy 100th birthday to the Gila Wilderness. Enjoy the listen!   For more info:National Wildlife FederationUnited States Forest ServiceNM WildNew Mexico Wildlife Federation

Episode Summary This week on Live Like the World is Dying, Spencer and Inmn talk about bike packing and how cool bikes are. What is bike packing? Where can you ride? What do you need? Find the answers here. Guest Info Spencer can be found on IG @spencerjharding or at www.spencerjharding.com Host Info Inmn can be found on Instagram @shadowtail.artificery Publisher Info This show is published by Strangers in A Tangled Wilderness. We can be found at www.tangledwilderness.org, or on Twitter @TangledWild and Instagram @Tangled_Wilderness. You can support the show on Patreon at www.patreon.com/strangersinatangledwilderness. Transcript Live Like the World is Dying: Spencer on Bike Packing Pt. I **Inmn ** 00:15 Hello, and welcome to Live Like the World is Dying, your podcast for what feels like the end times. I'm your host today Inmn Neruin, and today we're going to be talking about something that I've been wanting to do an episode about for a really long time because I really love to do it. And I think what I'm going to learn in this interview is that I have been doing it really wrong. Or not wrong, but making it so much harder for myself. And it's just going to be...it's going to be a lot of fun. And today we're gonna be talking about different ways that you can travel long distances, or short distances over strange terrain, on a bicycle. And we're gonna be talking about bike packing. But before that, we are a proud member of the Channel Zero Net of anarchists podcasts. And here's a jingle from another show on that network. Doo doo doo doo doo. [singing] **Dissident Island Radio ** 01:27 You're listening to Dissident Island Radio, live every first and third Friday of the month at 9pm GMT, check out www.dissidentIsland.org for downloads and more. **Inmn ** 02:15 And we're back. Thank you so much for coming on the show today. Could you introduce yourself with your name, pronouns, and just a little bit about what you do in the world? And what you're here to tell us about today? **Spencer ** 02:32 Hi, my name is Spencer Harding. My pronouns are he/him/his. I do a lot of things related to bikes and I have for the last...oh, at least 10 or so years. I'm currently a photographer, writer, and editor for a website called theradavist.com. We do all manner of cycling related articles and content reviews. I've worked as a bike mechanic at local community coops and full on bike shops a like, and I've been traveling by bike since 2009 pretty regularly. And that's been a huge focus of my interest in bikes and kind of my forte in bikes. **Inmn ** 03:18 Cool, cool. Um, it's funny because I know you real life and we, you know, we like play dnd together and I actually didn't know that's what you for work. And I just knew you knew a lot about bikes. So cool, great. **Spencer ** 03:40 I don't love that I'll know people for years and years and years and I think in a lot of the communities I've been in for years, no one really asks what anyone does. And it's not really important because we're all just doing these weird niche activities or hobbies together. And it's kind of fun. **Inmn ** 03:55 Yeah. I'm going to immediately go offer a little script. How did you get into bikes? **Spencer ** 04:07 I got into bikes right on the verge of the huge fixed gear craze that happened in like the early aughts. **Inmn ** 04:18 Oh yeah, I remember. **Spencer ** 04:21 So I was in school at Long Beach State in Southern California. I saw some people riding around bikes. It was the begining of my second year of college. I was moving off campus and I realized that I could buy a bicycle for the same price as a parking pass. And it took me as long to ride from my apartment to my classes as it did to walk from the parking lot to my class. So I took the, what, $130 that that parking pass would have been and I bought an old Schwinn off Craigslist. And it's been all downhill from there. **Inmn ** 04:59 [Laughing] I'm sure it has not been all downhill, but I appreciate the pun. We'll get into this later, but I did a big--introduction to me and biking--is that I have always just really loved bikes. Like similarly I had this thing in high school where a car became suddenly unavailable to me. And I lived in like a suburb of a suburb of a suburb. And I was like, can I take my dad's old Schwinn that's in the in the crawl space and ride it to the city? And the answer was, yes, I could. But like, fast forward many years to going on my first bike tour, and we like went over the continental divide and I was like, "So it's all downhill from here, right?" 06:00 [Laughing] That's one of the things. You never trust the elevation profile. There's always more up somehow. You could be on top of a mountain and somehow there will be some more uphill. **Inmn ** 06:11 Yeah. Always uphill. Always. Um, cool. Well. So yeah, let's just kind of happen to it. Um, what is like...what are the different kinds of scopes of bike travel? I feel like there's like a lot of words that were new to me as of a couple of years ago where I was just always "bike touring." But now there's all these kind of other words that people use that maybe seem like little subsets of bike touring, like gravel bikes or bike packin or r maybe there's other words that I don't know about. 06:50 There's so many buzzwords, and most of it is marketing, and like an ever smaller niche-ification of bikes. When we talk about bike travel, I think the word that comes to mind is bike touring, like, everything is bike touring. You're touring on a bike, you're riding, you're exploring, you're traveling by bike. The buzzword of the last decade has been "bike packing." And there's a lot of arguments about what that means, what that constitutes, what's bike packing, what's not bike packing. I won't go down a huge rabbit hole. I feel like the word bike packing ushered in a more modern sense of ways to pack a bicycle as opposed to what was classically bicycle touring. But if you're traveling by bike and you're strapping shit to your bike, you're going bike touring, Call it bikepacking. Call it gravel biking. You can call it...there's a multitude of other things like that. But when it boils down to it, it's all bike touring in my mind. **Inmn ** 08:09 Yeah. Okay. Um, golly, I'm going to immediately go on another tangent because I... [Spencer encourages it] It's reminding me of like.... I suddenly found myself thinking about like, wait, I wonder if Spencer knows the history...like what the history of the development of the bicycle was? This is a question I should have sent to you yesterday. And I mean, maybe you do, maybe you don't-- 08:39 I'm not super familiar. It popped in my head like I should probably do some sort of research. I mean I know the vagaries of it. But nothing specifically. I couldn't sit tell you names or dates or anything like that. **Inmn ** 08:53 Totally. But it's like, it is something that people have...like people have been riding long distances on bikes since bikes were invented, which is something that I find really interesting. Like there's.... Which I know you could take like a rewritten fairy tale and call it like absolute historical fact, you know but have you ever had any Angela Carter books. **Spencer ** 09:22 I haven't. **Inmn ** 09:24 She got famous for like rewriting the for rewriting a lot of fairy tales. And people were like, "Oh, you rewrote them with like a feminist lens." And she was like, "I absolutely didn't. My goal was to bring out the innate horror in all of these stories, and these stories just happen to be really like femicide-idle. And so that reads is feminism because the main conflicts in them are misogyny." But there's this story called Lady of the House of Love. About this vampiress who like lives in a collapsing, ruinous castle in Transylvania and is the offspring of like Dracula or something, who's just like quite bored in the world at this point. And there's this like whole diatribe in the story about this guy who she lures into the castle who has been traveling around France in Europe on a bicycle. And this is my funny tie in, and this is like in... this is like, in the early days of World War Two when this... Yeah, that's what.... And it's like, it's like these little nods where I'm like, okay, it's it's a fictional story, but I'm like, that sounds like a real thing people did, just travel around Europe on a fucking bicycle. **Spencer ** 10:56 I am 100% sure that there is some real world influence. Yeah, there's all those memes, you'll see. Like, there's some Scandinavian guy who just lived by his bike forever and ever. And, you know, big beard and all that jazz. I can't think of his name. But I can only imagine that there's some truth or they met some weird guy in a cafe one day and decided to just write them into the story after that. **Inmn ** 11:23 Yeah. Okay, wait, but back to the things. So if you had to kind of put a definition on what bike packing is, what is bike packing? **Spencer ** 11:37 So I would even back up to just bike travel. So bike travel is riding your bike multi day--so that could include a single night--somewhere, taking whatever you need for that journey, whatever that may be. Totally self sufficient. Maybe just change the clothes and a credit card. But using your bike as a means to explore and travel to somewhere. **Inmn ** 12:08 Cool. Cool. That sounds right. And what.... I guess maybe this.... It's like maybe some of these specific classifications kind of seems like it maybe gets down to what kind of bike you're riding or what kind of gear you're using? Or like something? I don't know. **Spencer ** 12:35 Yeah, there's been some discussion last few years about intent. So by touring, they've gone to the more recreational side of the venn diagram. So people on vacation, people going for a weekend trip, or for enjoyment. And by packing has, since it came at a time when people were packing less stuff on their bikes in new and creative ways that lent itself to more off road or very light and fast travel. So some people had defined bike packing as like a racing intent or like a competitive intent. And there are bike packing races. Someone who's staying with me right now, Austin Trace, she's training to ride the Arizona Trail and possibly some others. And that's an incredibly long distance. That's 800 miles of off road. There's many like 3000 plus mile bike packing races that happen all over the world over. So some people say bike packing for that kind of competitive intent. Some people will say they're going bike packing, when they're going camping for a weekend. There isn't really a line in the sand that I can thoroughly really draw. Bike packing is definitely like a new buzzword that's popped up in the last few years. And it encompasses everything that bike travel or bike touring would, depending on who you talk to or how you want to delineate that. **Spencer ** 14:07 Yes. And this is another fun thing where we have like, you know, all bikepacking Is bike touring but maybe not all bike touring is bikepacking. So all road bikes are gravel bikes, but not all gravel bikes or road bikes. If you really want to get into it--and this is even...I just wrote a review talking about how the word gravel needs to be split into two things because we're getting a recreational version of what gravel means and a competitive version of what gravel means, and those things are very different. Roughly speaking a gravel bike is traditional-ish road bike. You know, curvy handlebars, road levers. You're just getting bigger tires and typically a more relaxed geometry. That's the easiest without going into a whole mess of other unnecessary details, but the just is road bikes with bigger tires optimized for riding on dirt roads, like farm roads, forest roads, things of that sort. **Inmn ** 14:07 Yeah. Okay, that makes...that makes sense. And then there's this other word that I've been hearing people use a lot lately, which is--and by lately, I mean, this is years ago and I'm just like, really behind the the ball on things--but like, gravel bikes? **Inmn ** 15:35 Okay. Where can you ride a bike? **Spencer ** 15:40 These days? Where are there **Inmn ** 15:41 Or rather where are places that you can not ride your bike to? **Spencer ** 15:46 Legally speaking or terrain-limiting speaking? **Inmn ** 15:50 Terrain. Let's go with terrain limiting for right now. **Spencer ** 15:54 Okay, we don't need to dive into like the Wilderness Act limitations on mechanized travel. There are, if you're looking into that, there are so many crazy bicycles out there these days. There are very few places that you could not ride a bicycle. You're looking at incredibly steep and loose terrain or very deep snow or sand. But even that...like there's so many cool things with...like fat bikes have opened up just an incredible amount of terrain and versatility that wasn't available even like, you know, 20 years ago to bikes. And that's even expanding now. I've heard about some cool stuff I can't talk about, but there is some cool new stuff coming down the line that I'm very excited about in the monster truck realm of bikes. So there's.... Off road in the last few years has just totally exploded with gravel, with the accessibility of fat bikes, and like what those can.... So, fat bike, if I'm talking about, you're talking about four to five inch tires. They're just massive. So you run those incredibly low pressures like 10psi You're riding on snow, you're riding on sand, like, you know, that just opens up so many things that you can experience by bike and can travel across. And you can type in "adventure fat bike," and you'll get some crazy shit in fucking Alaska. A bunch of my friends have done it and they're just like...they have little boats and they're putting a bike on boats and they're riding down beaches and like...just places you would never would ever expect you could ride or get a bike to. And they can get a bike there and they can ride it. So there's obviously limitations like verticality or steep terrain but as far as like surfaces, you're...the world's kind of your oyster these days with that. There's so many options. **Inmn ** 18:07 Okay. Wow. Some of those are new to me and I'm like, okay, cool. Cool. Cool. **Spencer ** 18:14 I have a fat bike I just built it. You can come over and ride it. Play monster truck. Come over here, Inmn. I'll show you next time you come over for dnd. **Inmn ** 18:22 Wow. Love it. I, you know, on.... So like a background for me is my first bike tour, I didn't know anything about bike touring. I just knew that I wanted to do it. And so me and my friend Marie, we like...I met her up in Portland and then we rode our bikes to--Portland, Oregon--and then we rode our bikes to Boston. **Spencer ** 18:56 Oh, wow. Okay. [Laughing with incredulity] My first bike tour was taking the train to Santa Barbara with my like messenger bag and then riding back to LA as an overnight. You went full hog. Okay. **Inmn ** 19:11 Yeah, first first time ever riding a bike more than I could ride it in a day. **Spencer ** 19:19 Impressive **Inmn ** 19:19 It...you know, we're gonna go with a blend of impressive and utterly reckless. **Spencer ** 19:30 I know and I want to talk to this in the end too. Like, you can be really reckless on a bike and if shit goes totally pear shaped just.... Yeah, and like the accessibility of things going wrong and the ability to fix those or to get out of those situations is just such a cool component of bicycle touring that you don't get with like cars or motorcycles or, I mean, I guess hiking even less so, like there's even less to pickup. But yeah, tell me the story. How did it all go, you know, on the way to Boston? **Spencer ** 20:05 Oh, those are the worst. **Inmn ** 20:05 Um, well actually, you know, we're going to talk about that a little bit later, probably. But just, as this one funny tie in, was that in Glacier National Park, we met a...we met someone who is about to finish his bike tour. And he had been...he'd ridden the entire continental divide on a bicycle with like a little, like one of those little swivel trailers. **Inmn ** 20:06 Or, actually I don't know what they're called. They're like two wheels, in line. **Spencer ** 20:20 Oh, the bob trailer. **Inmn ** 20:42 Yeah, the bob trailer. Yeah, yeah. And he had crossed the Continental Divide like 30 times or something over the course of it. And it was utterly incomprehensible to me at the time. I'm like, "Are you riding on trails?" And he was like, "Sort of?" **Spencer ** 21:03 If I may do a quick... So the Continental Divide Trail is a long distance hiking trail that is mostly not bikeable due to the Wilderness Act thing with the wilderness stuff. I think the route you're referring to is the Tour Divide. **Inmn ** 21:18 Yes. **Spencer ** 21:20 Yeah. So those things kind of get interchanged, but they're vastly different beasts. The Tour Divide is a very popular off road route that a lot of people do these days and is one of the first mapped long distance routes, and still remains one of the longer documented off road touring routes in the world, too, which is super cool. **Inmn ** 21:42 Cool. Okay, wait, I'm trying to try to follow a little bit of a thread here. [Pauses, thinking] And maybe this is where to start. How do you...how do you start traveling long distances by bike in, you know, whatever capacity, whether you're like, I want to ride to a neighboring city, I want to ride across the country. I want to ride into the wilderness. These are vastly different. How do you get started? How do you get started? **Spencer ** 22:19 So my start was literally, my friend in college gave a talk, and at the time I was a backpacker. I'd done some backpacking, like three, four days. Stuff like that. And my friend gave this talk about how she went to France and took a bunch of kids bike touring and they took all the camping gear and they put it on their bikes and they just rode their bikes for like two months. And that blew my fucking mind. I was like, wait, I could put all my camping gear on my bike and go ride my bike. And this is in the very like first few years of me riding bikes. I was like, "This is the shit. I love this. Wait, I can go camping and do this?" So that was my first introduction. And I literally, New Year's Day, 2009, I took my road bike and my like good o'le Chrome messenger bag and I zip tied my sleeping bag under my saddle rails on my road bike and I took the train to Santa Barbara and I rode from Santa Barbara down like Highway One, like out near point Magoo, and I camped for the night. And I rode back to Long Beach the next day. And that's part of the Pacific Coast bike touring route. So it's just another established route from Adventure Cycling, who also does the Tour Divide, which you mentioned earlier. And that was my first time properly traveling by bike, and I was like, "This is cool." And a few months later a good friend of mine, Julia, who had just ridden across the country, kind of as you did. I can't remeber if she started in San Francisco or Portland as well. But she did that same trans-america ride. And she was like, "Hey, I just got off school. Like, I don't want to drive back to Southern California. Do you want to just like take a bus up here, and we're gonna bike back to LA together?" So I went back a few months later that summer and tried...like I got a different bike that had racks and all that shit and some bags. And you know, as that ball rolls, you get more bags, you get more specific stuff, you get bikes that are designed for it. And then I rode back from Santa Cruz to LA and then I was like, "This is fucking sweet." So, two months later, I flew to Seattle and rode all the way back to Santa Cruz that same summer too. So that ball kind of rolled pretty quickly for me. So, I think it's literally taking...like at the time I had a messenger bag and a sleeping bag and a stuff sack and that was what I took and I had a little tiny pocket stove and a sleeping pad. I don't know if I even brought a sleeping pad. I might not have. I have to look back at the photos. It might have been strapped to my handlebars or something. But it's really what you have. If you have most any kind of like reasonably lightweight camping gear, from car camping to backpacking. Like, all of that gear translates. And if you have a bicycle, there's--especially these days--almost...there's so many ways that you can affix things to your bike. **Inmn ** 25:14 And yeah, it's kind of funny, because I feel like I've seen this funny arc of like "bike luggage" or something. I don't know what to call it. [Spencer laughs] Where, like, when I was trying to get into bike touring, it's like--I'm sure like gravel bike/bike packing/offroad stuff, I'm sure I'm sure all that stuff existed, but I was less aware of it. But in the realm of bike touring, it seemed to be all about like how to like really neatly contain a lot of stuff on a bicycle, you know? And, like, now I see people's gravel bike or bike packing setups, and it's literally just like shit strapped anywhere that it could be. **Spencer ** 26:02 Yeah, so if we're gonna get into like, if we're gonna delineate two words, we're gonna do bike touring on one side and we're gonna do bike packing on the other. If we look at bike touring luggage, or traditional touring luggage, was usually two to four panniers [rhymes with "your"], Panniers [Rhymes with "yay"]. There's a whole video you can watch about someone from Webster's talking to my buddy Russ about how to actually pronounce that fucking word. It's a bag strapped to a rack. You can argue about it all day long. Typically two to four panniers, maybe a little bag on your handlebars, some water bottles, that was kind of the traditional setup that's been around since the inception of bicycles. Bike packing is when we're moving to more off road focus. So you, obviously panniers are just little hooks on a rack and maybe a bungee. If you've ever written off road with those they don't...they tend to eject. I've got buddies who have got busted collarbones from catching someone's unwanted, flying paneer **Spencer ** 27:02 Oh, no. **Spencer ** 27:03 So in the other corner, we have more modern bike packing bags, which arose from a cottage industry of people developing bags for things that they wanted to do that didn't exist at the time. There's a ton of them, like Revelate Designs has been around since the beginning and were big pioneers in a lot of these venues. And typically what that looks like is you have a bag on your handlebars. It's typically a double sided stuff sack, say 10 to 15 liters. Smaller, bigger exist. That's rolled on there, secured with some straps. There's harnesses and all that jazz. A big thing in bike packing that has really bled out to a lot of the other aspects of cycling, it's really convenient, is using the main front triangle of your bike. So bags that fit the center of your bike and fill that space. **Inmn ** 27:56 That's like the spot kind of like underneath where you're sitting, right? It's like the space between the seat and the handle bars, right? **Spencer ** 28:01 Correct. So, if you're thinking about a bike frame, this kind of goes back to the--I wanted to actually mention this in the history too--so a double triangle, like a diamond. So you have two triangles. You have the front triangle and the rear triangle. That design has been around nearly since the inception of bikes and fundamentally hasn't changed, which is kind of miraculous. There's there's always going to be some kooky weird shit that people are cooking up to make bikes better. But 99% of bikes that have ever existed have been the same design, and it's still the best and most efficient. So, you're filling that front triangle with gear. So it's where you would typically have your water bottles and things like that, but being able to put four liters of water, as opposed to two bottles, and a bunch of camping gear is more efficient. So frame bag. And then there's a bag attached to your seat post called a rocket bag or a butt bag or...[laughs] And this is where stuff gets real bondage-y. There's like 17 straps holding those fucking things on. They sway if you don't pack them right. And there's a bunch of designs to make that better, and we're getting really close to really nailing it. So you have those kind of are your three main staples for bike packing bags. There's bags that strap your fork, there's bags that go onto your down tube, there's ones that attach to your stem to put snacks in. If there's a tiny spot in your bike, there's a bag for it, I guarantee it. And those are kind of your two corners of like bicycle luggage. **Inmn ** 29:32 I see. I see. You know, what I.... Something I weirdly really appreciate about some of these bike packing luggage, or whatever, is when I was...when I was first hearing about some of this and I was like, oh.... Like I remember like 10 years ago when people were starting to have frame bags and stuff, and I was like "Where do you get a frame bag, like where can I go and buy this?" And the answer was, you had to just know someone who fucked around and made one and wanted to make you one. And it was like...it's like watching an entire--like, you know, fuck an industry, but it does make it more accessible for people that there's like more people making these things--but an entire way of making things, or a culture of making things, like erupting from like watching some people just fuck around with fabric and like cordura and vinyl and shit and just like.... Yeah, I don't know. I feel like...yeah, it's like watching that and watching the same thing happen with messenger bags like 15-20--I know, it's been more--years ago. But I don't know, it's something I've weirdly always appreciated about like bikes is that there's been a lot of innovation not on an industrial level. It's like on the level of people just messing around with stuff in their garages and figuring out some really cool things. I don't know, does that...does that track? Is that real? Am I under the right perception? **Spencer ** 31:11 100% There are so many cottage bag makers and a lot of them have scaled up and some of them are still really small. And a lot of the innovation is still coming from those cottage industries. Big companies have caught up. So there are a multitude of companies offering frame bags produced overseas that you can get at REI or on Amazon. There's a there's a host of options. Industrial production has caught up to it. One thing that's cool that they will never be able to do is there's a bunch of frame bike bag sewers--builders? What's the word? And you can send them a photo and they've written their various different scripts and computer programs and you send them a photo of your bike with like a ruler in it. And they will make a custom tailored bag exactly to fit your bike where you can put bolts through it, like just over the internet. And that's somethingl.... Like I personally have one from Rogue Panda. Nick is a crazy mad scientist and incredibly innovative. Yeah, you can just send him a photo of your bike or if they have the dimensions already in their system, they just sew you an exactly perfect custom bag. So you can get a bunch of off the shelf things that will work for most bikes, but if you have a weird like I do, or many that I do, you can get a custom one, and that's something that's always going to be around as like a cottage level industry. **Inmn ** 32:38 Um, okay, how.... Or.... Okay, so say...let's say I want to...say I want I want to ride my bike from where I live to a neighboring city. It's like...maybe it's four days away, or something, by bike. What...or, this is a regular thing that I want to do. This is a thing that I want to kind of invest in doing. And I'm asking this from the perspective of, so like on my month long bike tour, I feel like there was a way to have a bike that I didn't fucking hate riding. And so I'm wondering...I'm wondering kind of like what kind of bike do I need to do that? What will make my life be less terrible? I was on an old Schwinn steel frame that I put a mountain bike drive train on, essentially. And some like other mountain bike parts. I like converted it to 700s [wheel size]. I didn't know anything about fat tires. I just had like-- **Spencer ** 34:03 It barely existed back then. So yeah. **Inmn ** 34:05 It was like, I don't know like one and a half inch ties. This is embarrassing to say at this point. **Spencer ** 34:14 That's fine. I can't tell you the breadth of dumb ideas around bicycle. **Inmn ** 34:22 Yeah, yeah. And it's like my life was so bad in comparison to my road partner who was riding a Surly Long Haul. [Specialty touring bike] **Spencer ** 34:34 Yeah. So to segue out of this, if you ask the internet, the internet's gonna tell you the Surly Long Haul Trucker's the best bike touring bike for blah, blah, blah, blah. I'm going to tell you right now, the Surly Long Haul Trucker rides like fucking dogshit without about 100 pounds of gear on it, and I don't think is the right bike for almost anyone in this current day and age ofbike touring. But let's get into your actual question. So the cool thing about touring is the bags will fit to most bikes without racks or rack mount. So if you have a bike that's comfortable, that fits you, it's probably...it can probably be made to be some kind of touring ready. So every bike is a bike touring bike if you have enough gumption. I've written tall bikes halfway across this country on multiple occasions. So I wanna say that you can always a specific bike tailored to the trip or the adventure you want to go on. But you can probably make whatever you have work. And I could recommend, if you give me more specifics, I could be like, yeah, you should get this size tire. This is a great bike for that. Like, height matters. All right, before I run away on this, let's start at the...let's start at the bike. So more important than any other consideration is whether you have a bike that's comfortable for you? Does it fit you? **Inmn ** 36:07 What does that mean? **Spencer ** 36:09 So bikes come in multiple sizes for different bodies, different heights. Like, I'm all torso. I've got relatively short legs for my height, but I'm like 6'1" so I ride an extra large bike. If you're 5' or shorter, you might write an extra small. That's going to be...those bikes are gonna fit differently. So there's a varying size run. So most importantly, you want a bike that fits you. And that's going to mean different things to different people, depending on if they have any back issues or what have you. So comfort is going to be kind of paramount to start. So your four day trip, is it off road? Is it mixed between the two? Is it single-track mountain biking? You're not going to take your Schwinn Varsity on a bunch of single track trails in Arizona, because you're not going to have any fillings or teeth left at the end of that ride. So, once you have a bike that's comfortable, once you have a bike that fits you, then you want to say, "Does this bike...is it adequate for the terrain?" And that's typically going to be tire size. So tires come in a bunch of different flavors, but you're pretty much looking at anywhere between a 26" rim, a 27.5" rim, or a 29" rim, which is also coloquially referred to as 700c. And those come in--oh my God I'm really in the rabbit hole here--so many sizes. But, so is your bike comfortable? Does your bike fit you? Do you now have the appropriate tire size for the terrain you hope to traverse? And we're going to assume that you have all of those things. And the next consideration will probably be luggage. So how much frame bag space do you have? Can you get a frame bag for it? Do you have mounts to put a rack on the front, or even the back, of the bike? You want to make panniers to go on there? You can strap anything, like anything with the stuff sack, you can strap. I mean the quintessential like bike co-op special is the old kitty litter boxes with hardware hooks and some bungee cords. Like, do you have a cat? Do you use cat litter? And these are all things that can become bike touring luggage. It's so up to you and how you can fit it. I've seen such a plethora. There's such a rich community of people DIYing these things. And there's ways to use like old cutting boards to make handlebar rolls to hold stuff sacks, you know? Like, I could go on and on. So the next thing you want to figure out is how are you going to pack all your shit on your bike? And okay, we've got that. There's a plethora. And next thing is food and water. Is there water available? Do I need a water filter along the way? Where can I get more food, snacks, etc... along the way? How many days of food I need to pack? Those water and food options are probably going to inform how you pack or what kind of luggage you're going to need, beecause those your essentials. Like if you want the bike to move, you have to pedal it and you have to be alive to do that. So you're gonna need to eat and drink. **Inmn ** 39:36 Yeah, can I have a little segue off that? It was funny on this cross-country bike tour, like our attitude about that changed throughout the trip, you know, where it was like--Marie definitely had more like bike touring experience than I did--but like when we started, we were in rural Oregon, we were in Montana, we were in all of these big western states. And we didn't have a water filter, which is probably something we should have brought. But like, you know, we weren't camping. We weren't--or sorry, we were camping every night, but we weren't trying to ride off to find nice places. We were like, whatever's along the road, you know? And so we were like, "Okay, well, we just have to bring all of this stuff with us." Like, I think we had like two weeks' worth of food each and three gallons of water on us at all times. And it was utterly absurd, like our bikes were so goddamn heavy. But we often went a week without going to a grocery store. **Spencer ** 40:57 That could be the reality of your trip. And there's some of these long distance routes, especially the off road ones.... Like road touring, if you're on established routes, like highways or secondary highways, you're gonna hit a gas station hopefully once a day, if not every other day. And like, you know, it's not gonna be great food. But that's...those are all considerations to how much you need to pack. And that's...that's typically the first thing I would be like where's my reasonable resupply? Especially ifwe live down to the desert, like water is the main concern and the limiting factor for a lot of my trips. Like how much do I have to carry? Where can I get it? How can I get it? **Inmn ** 41:39 Yeah, cuz it's like, you're not--unlike being in the Northwest or something, you're not just gonna happen on a stream that you can like.... **Spencer ** 41:47 Exactly. I mean, maybe you can if you know that's there. But that's a big if, and I've planned to get water from a stream and then I got there, and the stream was dry. And I was like, "Oh, this is going to be interesting." **Inmn ** 42:01 But yeah, sorry. You're talking about water, food, etc... I don't know what you were going to say next. **Spencer ** 42:09 Yeah. So once you figured out how much water and food you need to be able to carry between places that you can get water or food, then you're gonna go to gear. So clothing, is it going to be hot? Is it gonna be cold at night? And then you're thinking about sleeping. So tent, sleeping pad, sleeping bag, at the bare minimum. How warm is that sleeping bag need to be? What's the weather going to be like? Is it going to rain a lot? How nice of a tent do you need? How many people are going to fit in that tent? And once you've figured out those things, those are all going to inform all the decisions we made already about like luggage. Like oh, I need to make a three person tent because there's three of us. Are we going to split it? Yada yada yada. If you've been camping at all, you understand that these are like kind of the basic things you want to have with you. Or maybe you're going there's a hotel every night and you're like, I'm just gonna get a hotel in and take a shower, and people do that and it's great. It's a different way to tour. **Inmn ** 42:10 We met someone like that who was credit-card touring, as it's called, I think. And, you know, I have a friend who just writes crazy distances in like single times, but like meeting this person who was like...he had a very fancy performance road bike and a couple regular small water bottles and like some granola bars and in his fucking lycra pockets, or whatever, and a credit card that was it. That was every single thing this person had. **Inmn ** 43:07 Still bike touring. My 20 year old self would be would be shaking at me saying that but still bike touring. **Inmn ** 44:01 Yeah, I mean if you got a credit card and he just like fucking get a hotel every night. **Spencer ** 44:08 But, you know, these are considerations with things. Like, I've stayed at hotels on bike tours. Like I had a real shit day got rained on for like this last trip I did in the Midwest past summer. We got stuck in like damn near a tornado. And I was putting up our tent in the downpour rain and then it was drizzling the whole next day. And I was like, fuck it. I'm getting a hotel. Going off route. I'm going to a hotel. Sleep in this hotel and shower and dry all of our shit out. And these are things you want to consider and this is all part of what goes into considering to go on a bike trip. **Inmn ** 44:44 Yeah, um, so we're getting close to the end of our time for today. I didn't say this at the beginning, but this is a two part episode. And I'm wondering if we could kind of end today's episode with, could you just tell us a story about going on a bike tour. Could have gone well, could have gone horribly. Kind of whatever. Tell us about a trip that you went on and kind of like what... Yeah. Yeah. **Spencer ** 45:21 Alright, I'm gonna tell you about my favorite bike tour. And it will bring it back together because you met that lovely gentleman in Glacier on the Tour Divided some years ago. So my buddies Kurt and Sam--this was 2016--so fledgling days of kinda packing bags. This is when one of the bigger companies, Blackburn, was getting into making bags. They sponsored a bunch of folks to go ride big long off-road routes. My friends got this scholarship sponsorship thing. And I was like, okay, cool, like, I'm gonna go meet them. I just finished up work. I worked as a bicycle tour guide, but the van stuff, not so much the touring that we're talking about, but going to hotels, yadda yadda yadda. And I got off work, drove out there. I took my dad's hybrid from like 1994 and I strapped a bunch of bags to it. And we went riding down. They had like slick bikes, all the new bags. But the fun thing was they were big rock climbers at the time. So we were carrying all of our camping gear and a full 60 meter rope, a full trad rack of cams and nuts and like our climbing harnesses and shoes, and every week we were climbing at least once a week. So we're doing trad climbing up some mountains in Montana or Wyoming or wherever the hell we want that being that week. And we packed nothing. We had.... Like none of us had real tents. We have like one spare tube between us because we just didn't have room for anything with all the climbing gear. It was just so reckless and stupid. We hitchhiked a ton and climbed a bunch of shit that was really sketchy. And it still to this day is one of my favorite memories of traveling by bike, just getting to go climb and just riding those wide opens stretches of Montana, Wyoming, a little bit in Colorado. And it was just the dumbest fun. God I miss you, Sam and Kurt, if you're out there listening somewhere. That was my bike penultimate trip that had been on. It just...it was silly and dumbn. There's photos and videos of that from years ago that I can send you some links to or whatnot. But the joy I still take from those memories and that trip stick with me. **Inmn ** 47:35 Hell yeah. That's wonderful. Um, one of my like, weirdly favorite memories of going on bike tour was--and we'll talk about this a little more in part two--but is preparation, how to prepare for a trip, how tolike plan an actual trip, you know. And me and Marie didn't plan literally at all. We just hopped on our bikes and started riding. Every day we woke up and we were like, "Yeah, let's go on that road. That makes sense. Whatever. It'll be fine." Weirdly, we did end up on...we accidentally ended up on Adventure Cycling routes, you know? Which makes sense. They were the most logical roads to ride on. We just didn't know. But our lack of preparation and planning was actually the most fun part of the trip. **Spencer ** 48:39 So my buddy Kurt on that trip, and we did a bunch of subsequent trips, and I'm a big planner and Kurt hates planning. He made me fly to fucking Columbia with zero plan and like one half contact that we called when we got to Bogota and a bunch of paper maps and was like, "Nah, we're just gonna figure it out." Speaking of accidentally winding up on ACA routes, did you the pro move where you found someone riding in the opposite direction and you asked if they were done with their maps because you were going the opposite way? **Inmn ** 49:11 No, that would have been smart. But we didn't... We met a couple other people on bike tour. We were incredibly surprised. We met exactly three people on bike tour on a two month long trip and I was actually surprised about it. **Spencer ** 49:30 Wow. I wound up on that TransAm for a little bit. And I didn't have any maps because I was being a total of shit bird and would be like, "Hey, you done with that section?" cause I didn't want to buy maps. **Inmn ** 49:42 Yeah, they're expensive. **Spencer ** 49:45 I mean, Adventure Cycling is a really lovely organization that has done a lot of good and they're a nonprofit. Do you ever, did you guys go through Missoula and go to the headquarts? **Inmn ** 49:55 We did. We got the free ice cream. **Spencer ** 49:56 Popscicles and soda. Yeah. Okay, well, that's why those maps are so expensive is they gotta give free sodas and ice cream to all the dirt bag toursists that won't buy them. **Inmn ** 50:07 Yeah, yeah. Cool. Well, that about does it for the time that we have today. Before we go, are there any things that you want to plug, any projects, any places that people can find you on the internet where you would like to be found? Anything like that? **Spencer ** 50:29 Anything on social media, is just Spencer J. Harding. Like I said, I write for the theradavist.com. You can type my name in there and there's a bunch of reviews and trip reports and stuff like that. My website is just SpencerJharding.com. There's a bunch of photos organized there from a bunch of my bicycle travels, if you want to check that out. **Inmn ** 50:50 Yeah. Cool. Cool. And for folks who...just to let you know what we're gonna be talking about next time, next time being next week, we're gonna be talking about how to actually plan a bike trip, what are things you should be prepared for kind of like on the road, why traveling by bike is just a really cool idea--if you haven't been swayed already--what are its limitations, and how does this fit into preparedness models for any kind of collapse or disaster situation that we might be in. So tune in next time. **Inmn ** 51:33 If you enjoyed this podcast, then go hop on a bike and ride around and see what happens. And also, if you like this podcast, you can please just tell people about it. It's the best way that people hear about the show and one of the best ways to support us. But if you would like to support us in other, I think, sillier ways, you can support the show financially. And you can support us financially by supporting our publisher Strangers in a Tangled Wilderness. And the best way to support us is to go to tangledwilderness.org and buy some books. There's some really cool books you can buy. You can buy a cool TTRPG that me, Margaret, Casandra, and Robin wrote called Penumbra City. You can get a lots lots of other really cool books too. And you can also support us by supporting our Patreon at patreon.com/strangersinatangledwilderness. And there's a bunch of different levels of support that you can give us, anywhere from like $5 a month, which kind of gets you a lot of cool stuff. It gets you discounts, it gets you digital versions of all of the stuff that we publish and just like lots of really cool updates. You can also get a zine mailed to you every month, that we put out as part of our monthly feature, which if you also just want to hear those, you can read them on our website or you can check out another podcast that I do called Ttrangers in a Tangled Wilderness, where we take our monthly feature and turn it into an audio zine and interview the author. And then there's another fun part of it, which is that for $20 a month, you can get us to thank or acknowledge anything that you want us to thank to or acknowledge, whether that be you or a cool organization that you want to get shouted out, or whether it's just someone you love and care about. Or as I'm still plugging for, a fictional or theoretical concept. So check us out on Patreon and we just want to give some special shout outs to these folks right now. Thank you alium, Amber, Ephemoral, Appalachian Liberation Library, Portland's Hedron Hackerspace, Boldfield, E, Patoli, Eric, Buck, Julia, Catgut, Marm, Carson, Lord Harken, Trixter, Princess Miranda, Ben Ben, anonymous, Janice & O'dell, Aly, paparouna, Milica, Boise Mutual Aid, theo, Hunter, SJ, Paige, Nicole, David, Dana, Chelsea, Staro, Jenipher, Kirk, Chris, Michaiah, and Hoss the Dog. Thank you so much for everything and we hope that you're doing as well as you can with everything that's going on and we'll see you next time. Find out more at https://live-like-the-world-is-dying.pinecast.co

In this episode, Laurent is joined by Kendrick Dain, a licensed attorney and BASE jumper. They explore the evolving world of BASE jumping, its legal battles, community spirit, and the pursuit of freedom through human flight. Kendrick is also General Counsel for the advocacy group BASE Access, whose mission is to preserve and open site access on public lands within the United States. Kendrick and Laurent discuss the challenges and hopes of legalizing BASE jumping in national parks, Kendrick's journey through law and adventure sports, and the pivotal role of community and respect in advancing the future of BASE jumping. This episode is a dense discussion about the intersection of law, advocacy for our sport, and the culture war the National Park Service has waged against BASE jumping. https://baseaccessfund.org/ Please support this independent project by visiting: support Exit Point For more info visit exitpopintpodcast.com Producers: Laurent Frat, Matt Blank, Mark Stockwell  Host: Matt Blank Sound mixing: Mark Stockwell Music credit: Staccato Strings by Andreas Beats  Timestamps: 00:41 Exploring the Legal Landscape of BASE Jumping 01:01 Advocacy, Culture, and the Future of BASE Jumping 00:00 Welcome to Exit Point: Diving into BASE Jumping Culture 00:28 Meet Kendrick Dain: Attorney and BASE Jumper 01:01 The Legal Landscape of BASE Jumping in the US 03:10 Exploring the Challenges of Legalizing BASE Jumping 03:46 Kendrick's Journey: From Legal Troubles to BASE Jumping 12:35 The Evolution of BASE Jumping and Its Community 17:59 Navigating Legal Access to National Parks for BASE Jumping 32:22 The Administrative Procedures Act and Its Impact 48:52 Exploring the Wilderness Act and Its Impact 49:26 The Intricacies of Rulemaking and Executive Orders 51:29 The Role of Tenure in Federal Employment 54:48 Navigating the Legal Landscape for Base Jumping 55:03 The Struggle for Base Jumping Permits 01:01:02 Cultural Evolution and Legal Challenges in Base Jumping 01:06:19 The Path to Legalizing Base Jumping in National Parks 01:22:34 Community and Personal Motivations Behind Base Jumping 01:26:41 Legal Advice for Base Jumpers in Gray Areas 01:32:09 Closing Thoughts on the Future of Base Jumping

Remember, we welcome comments, questions, and suggested topics at thewonderpodcastQs@gmail.com ----more---- Mark: Welcome back to The Wonder, Science-Based Paganism. I'm your host, Mark. Yucca: And I'm Yucca. Mark: And today we are talking about golden ages of the past and as well as turning to look at golden visions of the future. Yucca: Yeah. I think this is going to be a fun one. We were saying right before we hit record, it's it's a right for tangents as well. Mark: yes, yeah, I imagine we're gonna, we're gonna fall down some rabbit holes on this for sure. Where this originally came from was a conversation that we had in one of the atheopagan community Zoom mixers that happens on Thursday nights, and, or and Michael, who is a member of the Atheopagan Society Council, raised this as a topic and he pasted into the chat a sort of semi facetious myth That many in the mainstream pagan community seem to embrace, which is this idea that once upon a time way back before before the Bronze Age, sometime in the late Either the Copper Age or the Late Stone Age, that there were people living in Asia Minor and in Europe who lived peacefully and in an egalitarian society where that were not characterized by patriarchy and where things were very groovy. Yucca: Mm hmm. Mark: That patriarchy came along with these bronze sword wielding invaders and the result was militarism and class stratification and eventually the snowball that led us to capitalism and to where we are today.  Yucca: Very familiar with the story and the narrative. It pops up in a lot of different forms. Mark: It certainly does. And it's a compelling narrative, right? Because part of what it tells us is it's not inherent in humans to be the way we are now, Yucca: Mm hmm. Mark: you know, that having a male dominated society is not just a human thing, that it's A cultural thing that took over Yucca: Mm Mark: from something that preceded it. And so it's understandable why that's appealing, because it offers hope, right? It says, well, we could get out from what we're in now. We could move in another direction. So, there's a lot of this backward looking, kind of nostalgic glow in these sort of root myths that inform much of modern paganism. Would you agree with that? Yucca: I think so. And I think that there's also the more recent ideas of the unbroken line of Grandmothers practicing this witchy tradition that was secret, but it survived through, you know, all of the Christian takeover and, and all of this and that, that connects in a little bit with an idea that we have that something that's old is automatically good. Or, automatically has more authority because it's an older idea. Mark: Right, that it's valid, because it's persistent, Yucca: Yeah. Mark: right, because it's lasted for a long time, it must have some kind of validity. Yeah, that's a really good point, and it's definitely something that crops up a lot in arguments about religion generally, not just about paganism or witchcraft. Yucca: Right. Mark: Of course, that was Gerald Gardner's story. Right, Gerald Gardner, the creator of Wicca although he claimed that he wasn't the creator of Wicca, he claimed that he was initiated into a lineage of, an unbroken lineage extending back into the mists of time of this tradition of witchcraft. Yucca: Mm hmm. Mark: maybe he believed that, maybe he didn't, but it's been pretty well established that it's not true. Yucca: Right. Mark: there's a, there's a book by the, the, pagan and witchcraft scholar Ronald Hutton, called The Triumph of the Moon, which very thoroughly and meticulously goes over all the different threads of this and establishes there's not really much there there. Yucca: Mm hmm. Mark: Great book, great book, highly recommend it. So, so that's another of these, you know, these stories about antiquity. Holding a different way of being that we, that we need to grab onto and try to work our way back to, right? Yucca: Right. Mark: And I was thinking about the Norse traditions, the, the heathen traditions as well. And in that case, what seems to be lionized most is Vikings, right? There's just a whole lot about Vikings. Yucca: Mm hmm. Which I get! Very, very, like, appealing visuals, and Feelings and aesthetics, and yeah, Mark: adventurous, and there's all these sort of macho, warlike values of honor and courage and strength and duty and all that kind of stuff that are all, you know, I mean, they're very macho, but they're, but they're, they're good Yucca: I get the appeal. Yeah, Mark: Yeah, I totally do, too, Yucca: I think that those are, that those can be, can be really good values, right? I don't think we should throw the baby out with bathwater with that, but you know, there's potential with anything for abuse, but you know, those are some pretty, those have their place, Mark: Yeah, yeah. But once again, it's rose colored glasses, right? It ignores the fact that people who went Viking, which was a verb, not a noun you know, you went Viking they were farmers most of the year. I mean, they were just working the soil like everybody else and, you know, getting food. And, you know, they were farmers and they were traders and, you know, all that good kind of stuff. Which is, you know, a much less heroic kind of myth than, you know, paddling an open boat across the North Sea to, you know, to, to strike into foreign lands and, you know, take stuff. And I can understand why that part of the story doesn't really get included so much but here we are, we're on a tangent, right? But still, it's about golden pasts. Yucca: Right. Mark: So, Michael's host, Michael's, you know, quote that he put in the chat was very thought provoking because as we learn more, it becomes pretty clear that none of these golden era of the past myths is likely to be very true. There are kernels of truth Yucca: Mm hmm. Mark: them. I mean, have, have there been women that were herbalists and knew natural cures for things in an unbroken line since the time of Arwen? Antiquity? Certainly. Yucca: Yeah. Mark: Yeah, of course there have. Now, were they practicing a particular kind of religious framework around that? Probably not.  Yucca: Probably changed with the time as the society around them changed, and their view of the world changed, and, right? Yeah. Mark: I mean, you know, it's like, did it make that much of a difference whether you invoked some goddess when you tied on a poultice or whether you invoked some saint? It, you know, it may, it may have been exactly the same thing. So, There's all this past stuff and that, that led to a very thought provoking conversation about kind of the nature of nostalgia Yucca: Mm hmm. Mark: and this, this very human quality that we have of looking back on times in the past and seeing them fondly, even if they were terrible. Yucca: Right. Even if we lived through them, or, but especially the ones that we didn't. I saw a short video recently of she looked like You know, maybe 16, 17 year old talking about how she was born in the wrong era, that she should have been from the 80s, right? And I remember, you know, being a teenager and, and the kids around me going like, Oh, we should have been hippies. We were meant to be hippies from the 60s. And it's, I think people just do that. Yeah. Even if it's, of course, in the 90s, the 60s seemed like forever ago. Right. Mark: Yeah it's, it's very funny. I, I mean, I was born in the early 60s, so I have, and my father was in a PhD program on the UCLA campus, so I have Other than memories of events, which I have pretty vividly, like the assassinations and Yucca: Mm hmm. Mark: body counts announced on Tuesdays and Thursdays on the news, and, you know, the riots and, you know, a lot of stuff like that, but I remember going to my father's lab And all of the students that were around him, and they were all hippies, they were all, they were all dressed in that particular way because they were college students in the late 19, in the, you know, mid to late 1960s. And there, there is, a flavor of that era that I can remember and that feels, I don't necessarily feel drawn to it, but I feel almost like it's something lost that I wish I could recapture somehow. the same thing is true of the 70s and the 80s. It gets muddy towards the 90s and later than that, and I'm not sure whether that's because we tend to have more nostalgia for times when we're younger, or whether It's because the internet came along and culture got a lot blurrier. Suddenly, I mean, it used to be like, you can recognize music from the 70s and 80s. By the 90s, I mean, there was a swing music movement, and there was all, there was the world music movement, and there was all this, you know, sort of backward looking. Yucca: I, I'm not sure I agree with that, because I think if I hear a 90s pop song on the radio, it instantly is, I can instantly place 90s or 2000s so that I would, I would guess that it is more of a 90s pop song. the age and how old we were when we were engaging with that, rather than becoming less distinctive. Mark: That may very well be the case. I may simply have not been paying as much attention. Yucca: right. Mark: You Yucca: Well, and just being in a, Mark: career by that point. Yucca: yeah, different life stage, and at least my memory of the way time has worked is, it just keeps speeding up. Right? When I was four, that a year was an eternity. A week was so long, and now I'm like, oh yeah, a year, like, you know, and I'm told it keeps getting worse. It just keeps going faster and faster. Mark: does, and I'm not sure whether it's a function of A year being a smaller and smaller proportion of your overall life and memory, or whether it's that we get into routines that cause months to fly by at a time. I'm really not sure what that's about, but it's a little frightening how quickly the years just start to go. And that's one of the reasons why, yeah, probably so, but that's one of the reasons why I feel it's really important to have a ritual practice to create sort of sublime moments. Either by myself or with other people, of shared observation and celebration of life. So that those, those moments stick out. I don't look at the last year and see nothing but just going to work and doing the tasks and stuff. There are special days that, that I remember. Yucca: I think novelty slows us down a little bit, and makes us pay a little more attention. Mark: Yeah, yeah. That's why traveling is so wonderful, right? Yucca: mm hmm. Mark: everything is new. You're in a place that's unfamiliar. And you point yourself towards experiences that are going to be novel, like experiencing museums and cultural events and architecture and art and, you know, being, being in cafes and hearing foreign language around you and, you know, all the various things. And so we tend to have much more detailed memory of times when we travel than we do when we're at home.  So, it seems kind of natural that these sorts of narratives would, would appeal to people. Yucca: Mm hmm. Mark: And I think that they may have been part of the appeal of paganism for some people. I mean, some people get into it for a vision of a better world. Some people get into it for a desire for magical power. Some people get into it for a desire for connection with and reverence of the natural world, like us. And I think all of those are compelling reasons why people are attracted to modern paganism. And I'm Yucca: combination of those things, too. Mark: absolutely, for Yucca: Yeah. Mark: for sure. Yucca: I think, also, being There's also, for some people, an attraction to being different, right, wanting something that is a little counter cultural, regardless of what the specific values are, but just something different, because whatever it was that they were doing, was not working. And so they're looking for anything that is different than whatever that was. Mark: Yes, and, and paganism specifically works very well for those folks because they tend to be folks that don't fit in very well. And paganism is very, inclusive, by and large. It's very accommodating to people who may be neurodivergent or may be strange or may just be very unique people, right? And what I saw when I first came into paganism was that there was this celebration of the uniqueness of individuals, which is something that I have worked to carry forward in my own pagan work because I think Everybody's amazing, and they all need the opportunity to show their amazingness and to have that affirmed and lifted up. Yucca: Yeah. Well, that's a good lead in to, to thinking about the now, and I guess the golden future, right? We're talking about the golden past. So, what about our visions for the future? Mark: Yeah and, and I should say that I do think that a lot of these golden past narratives, whatever their factuality, I think they're a distraction. Yucca: Hmm. Mark: if they were true, I don't think that matters very much. Because we're not then, and we're never going back then. We're only going to be here, and we're going to go forward into the future. Time doesn't work in a backwards manner, it only goes forward. So, my focus, oh go ahead, Yucca: I, I do think though that there is some value in examining those for looking at what do we value and what do we want to bring forward. So, do we, if we're thinking about, so yes, recognizing that it's probably pretty much a myth about our, our pre Bronze Age egalitarian societies in which, War was not a thing, and there weren't skirmishes and conflict between groups. But seeing that there is a recognizing our longing for that, I think is valuable. I think it's important to, to also recognize that that may not be factual, but that there is value in that. Mmhmm. Mark: certainly, of that we would like to have a world in which there was peace, in which there was inclusiveness, in which there was a better human relationship with the natural world. Yucca: Right. Mark: And, Yucca: hmm. Mm Mark: and one of the things about those myths is that they tell us that it's possible because it happened in the past. Yucca: hmm. Mark: I just choose to believe that it's possible because I think it's, it has to be possible. Yucca: Because we can choose to make it that way. Mm Mark: Yes. And we have chosen as humans to go far afield of that. Even, even in some of the ways that we have really excelled and succeeded as humans, like through science. You know, the newest science is generally applied first to creating weapons. Yucca: hmm. Mark: It's usually applied for figuring out ways to kill people. And that is a very, very sad commentary on the divorce between values and reason. That we have become very effective at applying our reason In problem solving and to understand the nature of the universe, but the concept of ethical constraints around that is, it's very tenuous. I mean, there is a field of scientific ethics, but I haven't seen much example of that actually applying except in the experimental sense. Yucca: Mm hmm. Mark: It's like, you know, no, we're sorry, you, you can't test this weird dangerous thing on live people, Yucca: Right. Yeah, we've got our review boards that we've got to get past to be able to do human or vertebrate subjects, but that's where it pretty much ends. Mark: yeah  Yucca: you want to do anything with an invertebrate or anything that isn't an animal, and it's, you know, there's, there's no red tape. Mark: yeah. Yeah. So, you know, re rethinking these things in a really deep sense is important. It's really important. And immediately that makes you subject to some accusations of being very unrealistic because you're, you're thinking far beyond the bounds of what the currently constructed society can do. Yucca: Mm hmm. Mm Mark: And and of course also being accused of being radical, right? Because To make those changes would be a radical shift in the way humanity works. Don't think either of those accusations is very persuasive, myself. Yucca: hmm. Mark: I think people are so adaptable, and we have so many examples of cultures that have not been colonized by, or have only been partially colonized by, the Western mindset that has taken over virtually everything. in the world that operate differently, that I believe we do have choices about the way that we go forward. Yucca: Mm hmm. Mm Mark: And it starts with values. It starts with making decisions about what we consider to be sacred and what we consider to be worthy. And where we draw ethical lines around not doing things that we can do, but we really shouldn't. Yucca: hmm. Yeah, agreed. Mark: Because there's an awful lot of stuff that we do that we really just shouldn't do. Yucca: Yeah. Can and should. Those are two different things. Yeah. Mark: And there is a terrible tendency, and I mean, we see this in children. Given the opportunity to make something go boom, Yucca: Oh, not just children. Mark: Yeah, I know, everybody likes to make something go boom. It's it can be really fun. But when the implications are, you know, environmental devastation and, and loss of lives we really need to resist that urge to make things go boom. Yucca: Yeah, we need to maybe get that out of our systems when it's, you know, little pop cans with and vinegar and baking soda and things like that and not do it with, you know, People and buildings and mountains. Mark: And cities, and yeah, Yucca: Yeah. Mark: So that's what I think. I think that this vision of the future starts with ideas that are around values, rather than structures. But in order to get those values really to propagate in a mass sense, it is going to take some major structural overhaul of the way humanity operates. And fundamental to that is we have to find an alternative to capitalism that works better for the planet. I think one thing that would help a lot, Would be if there were something, and I am, I'm just sort of spinning and talking while I'm thinking here, so maybe I'll end up in something really stupid, but I think international shipping is a big problem. For one thing, it causes a tremendous amount of of carbon into the atmosphere, just astronomical amounts of pollution. Yucca: Right. And so many other things. I mean, our, I think that decentralizing a lot of that would be really, really helpful. Mark: I agree. Yucca: you know, just the supply chain things that have happened over the last few years is just the tip of the iceberg with that. But if we could, return a lot of our means for survival to be in our own hands, in a more local setting, I think that that would be incredibly powerful because on so many different levels, one, just the practical, if something happens, then so many people are without a paddle, right? But also, it's really easy to control people when you control their ability to survive. you Other means to survive, right? Yeah. Mark: the exploitation of cheap labor facilitated by international shipping because producers can go shopping for the most destitute people they can find, pay them as little as they possibly can in order to produce consumer goods that then get shipped back to rich countries where people pay for them. And I mean, That's, that's not just a horror story, that is the standard operating procedure of manufacturing in the world. That's, that's, that's the way it is. Yucca: That's the origins of most of the objects around you right now. For most people, I don't know, some of you might be actually out you know, sitting in a tree with just your phone and some earbuds in. If so, that sounds awesome. But I'm guessing most people listening right now are probably in a constructed environment. In your car, in your house, you know, in a bus, something like that. Mark: Yeah, yeah. Yucca: So Mark: And there's nothing wrong with that, and I want to be very clear, I'm not shaming people Yucca: we're in the same boat, Mark: Yeah, I mean, we all have to live, you know, we're talking on computers here I've got headphones on that I am absolutely certain were made in China by someone who was not paid nearly enough for the service of having created this product. Myself, as, you know, similarly a wage slave in capitalism If that person was actually paid a reasonable wage, I might not have been able to afford these headphones, right? So the whole system reinforces itself, and no one is innocent, and no one other than the decision makers on this are really guilty. Yucca: Mm hmm. I'm Mark: You know, we, we all, we're all doing the best we can, given the system that we have, but that system needs to shift, unless we just decide we're gonna eat up the world and go extinct. Yucca: not so fond of that, Mark: I'm not either, I, that's just, you know, as, as golden futures go, that's really not one for me. Yucca: this is a topic that we did do several years back at this point. We did talk about misanthropy and I do see a a strong tendency of that in our culture today. Which is, I find, very saddening. But I, other than I don't agree with that from a value perspective it's very, it's very counterproductive. It really doesn't help us solve any of these problems, to be really down on, well, we should go extinct, it would be better for the, for everybody, or for the rest of the world, or, you know, all of that. It just, I don't think that, I don't buy that. I think it's not a very strong argument. It's kind of a, it's a cop out. Mark: Yeah, I was gonna say I agree with you, I, I don't have much truck with that either, and I think it's intellectually lazy. Yucca: Mm hmm. Mark: I think it's just, oh, there's a huge complicated problem, I don't want to think about it, maybe let's just go extinct. and, and it's a very uncompassionate, non empathetic way of looking at humanity and at, you know, The crises that we confront and I hope to do better than that and I think that we collectively can do better. Yucca: I think so. And I think it relates to our ability to choose what we are going to focus and pay attention to. And I think that's some of what we were talking about before about the nostalgia. When we're in that, we're focusing on just specific aspects of the past. Right? That nostalgia for the 60s in the hippie era. Well, there was a lot of things that really sucked about that, right? But when we're longing for it, we're not longing for the war and the turmoil and all of that. We're longing for the parts that were really positive about it. And so we, we have the ability to really shape the way That we behave in the world based on what we focus on. Not that we shouldn't pay attention to that, we certainly should pay attention to the negative things, but do we focus on solutions to those things? Or do we focus on the misery of how bad it sucks to be human? Yeah, enduring those things. Mark: Right. Right. Yeah, that's exactly right. And one of the things that I find increasingly frustrating is, is that tendency to simply say, well, we're screwed. And so let's stop trying. Yucca: hmm. Mark: Now, trying is going to involve some dislocation because capitalism gives us lots of goodies. It's totally unsustainable, but it gives us goodies that if we were to move into a sustainable modality, we probably wouldn't have nearly as many of. Yucca: Mm hmm. Mark: But the odds are good that we would actually be significantly happier because Instead of filling our desire for happiness and for satisfactions with the purchase of things, we would have stuff like culture and community and relationships and, and, and celebration like Pagan celebrations around the year, that kind of stuff. Spirituality art. All of those things that really are shunted to the side by the capitalistic frame, which is that all of those things, because they can't be monetized very well, aren't very important. Yucca: Mm hmm. Mm hmm. And so the challenge is moving out of that structure in a way that doesn't cause harm as we do it. Mark: Or the, the, the so called soft landing. You know, there are so many indicators that point towards some kind of collapse or crash coming not very long from now between climate change and and various economic indicators and so forth. You know, it is likely that there is going to be some real privation in our future, but Yucca: And there is. There is. Mark: he will, and there already Yucca: future. I think that there's a lot of places that we can point to in this moment and go, right here, here, here, here. Mark: Right, yeah, I mean, any Appalachian town that had the top of its mountains shaved off by a coal mining company, and then, which then marched off to, you know, do its next project in Brazil and left all those people with no work in a destroyed environment, I mean, that's a microcosm right there of exactly what capitalism does. And we need to have a more For want of a better word, holistic understanding about economic development. Economic development needs to be something that benefits people in the ways that most matter, and it is sustainable over time, rather than this endless boom bust thing that we see so often through capitalism. Yucca: Well, I think remembering the root of that word is helpful in this. The echo is home. That's what the word means, is home. So it remembering that everything that we're doing, we are doing, To our home, Mark: Mm hmm. Yucca: so, Mark: Mm hmm. Yucca: which we are part of, Mark: Right. Yucca: right? A home isn't just a house. A home is the people and the culture in that house. Right. It's all of the structures that the people depend on, that they're part of. Mark: And a part of the way that we can start pointing in this direction, I think, is through media. Because people need You know, we're so disconnected now. I mean, let me speak for myself and what I see around me in American society, right? People are very disconnected. They're often disconnected from their own families. Because of the nature of the job market under capitalism, families are atomized to the far corners of the world. Yucca: Mm hmm. Mark: As people seek jobs and go and work it becomes very hard for people to build communities because they're moving around looking for economic opportunities. Yucca: Right. Mark: And they're working themselves to death so they don't have a lot of time to build community and relationships and culture and all that kind of stuff. So I do feel that getting some of those warm, fuzzy, kind, empathetic values out into media is a way to kind of start the process. Mean, I can think of a couple of examples that just sort of reminded me of. Oh yeah, people can be kind to one another, people can, people can love one another, people can accept one another for who they are. And one of them is the Australian slash adults animated series, Bluey. Yucca: Absolutely. Mark: Yeah, I mean, as a mom, you, you know about Bluey, Yucca: Oh, I absolutely do. The parents in our household will be watching it, and the kids have left the room. It's a great, yeah, it really hits home. Very sweet. Mark: It's very kind and very thoughtful, and It's the kind of thing that, that moves the sorts of emotions that I think we need to be fostering more. You know, there's so much stuff out there that's all sort of, you know, post apocalyptic, war like, you know, blockbuster drama, and superhero vigilantes, and all that kind of stuff, and I just think people need to be reminded of how good it feels to be kind. Yucca: Mm hmm. Mark: the other one that I was thinking of is sensate. Did you ever see sensate? Yucca: No, I'm not familiar with this one. Mark: It's the word sense and then the, the letter, the, the numeral eight. Yucca: Okay. Mark: And you have to trust it because you won't understand what's going on until about three episodes into the series. It has Daryl Hannah in it and a bunch of people that I didn't know. But it's beautifully done. It's super queer, so it's very inclusive in that kind of way. And wonderful. It's done by the By Lana and the people who did The Matrix, Warszawski's, I, I, it's a, it's a long, seemingly Polish or Czech name that I, that I believe begins with a W. And both of those sisters are trans. When they made The Matrix they hadn't transitioned yet. So, interesting storytelling, interesting world perspective, just really worth checking out. Yucca: hmm. I've written that one down. I'm guessing that's not something you can watch with a five year old in the room. Mark: Probably not, no, there's, there's some sex in there, and, Yucca: wait for after bed. Mark: yeah and when they announced that it was cancelled, there was such an outpouring of, of rage that they made a movie to wrap it up, so that, there, the, I think it's two seasons and then the movie. Yucca: Mm hmm. Mark: It's either two or three seasons and then the movie, but anyway, yeah, worth, worth checking out because once again, it's like, oh, cool, interesting, unusual people being happy with each other. This is great. And, and it's a, it's a dramatic story. It's got tension. It's got conflict. It's got, you know, intrigue and all that good kind of stuff. It's not just people standing around being happy with one another, which unfortunately is not entertaining. Yucca: Yes. Although I wish that there maybe was some of that out there. Because sometimes that's what I, that's what I need to watch, Mark: yeah, yeah, yeah, for sure. It's yeah, it's a funny thing. It's like, media can be like a companion in some ways, but what it reflects back to us can be really impactful on our worldview and on our feelings. And so getting, you know, getting a lot of the cruelty and, coldness out of what we consume. And building a market for that more kind, inclusive, warm human kind of way of being, I think is one of the things that we can do to start to shift things in the world. Yucca: Mm hmm. Mark: And then of course there's activism. I mean, you need to, you need to just advocate that people not be exploited. That the planet not be exploited. And, Yucca: And of course, our, our everyday, just the way that we move through the world, right, working on ourselves about the kindness that we bring to the world, or don't bring to the world with us, Mark: Yes, yes. And that's particularly hard right now, actually, with the cultural divide in the United States, at least, where the rhetoric is so vitriolic. And Yucca: both sides, Mark: both sides, it really is. Yucca: demonization that happens, it's hard to breathe sometimes with Mark: It is. Well, and, you know, a lot of that is inspired by leader figures. I mean, there's, there's a lot that can be laid at the feet of Donald Trump simply for how abusive he's willing to be to other people. And people see that and say, Oh, well, then I can do that too. Yucca: right? Mark: It's, it's just Yucca: And I don't think it's a conscious process, for the most part. I don't think people actually say those words in their mind, to themselves, but that that is the takeaway, again, across the board, right? Not pointing to one aisle or the other, that that's, you That's a, it's something that's grown, at least my awareness of it has grown in the last few years. I think that it's something that's not just my awareness, I think that's a trend that has really really spread. Mark: Yes  Yucca: and I think some of that is enabled by the systems that we have. Especially with format that social media has right now. And I think social media can, can take different forms, but the form that it has right now is very, is about creating the us versus them mentality, because that's what gets the clicks and that's what gets the advertising dollars. Mark: Yes. Yes, and to be honest, if it were not for the fact that the atheopagan community spaces are online social media spaces, mostly. I wouldn't be on them at all. I, I know that Facebook does bad things to me. I, I can tell that Facebook is doing bad things to me, and I can tell by the way the algorithm curates my feed that it's trying to rile me up, it's trying to get me mad. I get this endless stream of, like, right wing Christian stuff. Yucca: Well, because you look at it. Mark: Well, even if I don't interact with it, it's Yucca: but it sees how long you are, even if you don't click on it, it sees how long you stay over that page. So the, if you just keep scrolling past it, don't look at it at all, it won't give it to you as much. But it sees that you linger for that half a second on it, and then it'll give you more the next time, because it worked. Right? And that, that is a content that, it doesn't actually look at what the content is, it looks at whether you engage with the content or not. Mark: This is why I love groups, because there are no ads in groups. Yucca: You can just go right in. Yeah. Mark: in and you see the posts that people have made in the groups, and that's it. The, the curated feed is something that I try to avoid as much as possible. And, I mean, I used to use Twitter for rapid news, but now that's turned into a cesspool. I'm not, not gonna Yucca: Oh, I would say that it always has been. It's had some rough times recently, but it's It's definitely a model for all of that. Yeah. And of course, I mean, it's, each of the platforms have their, their issues. But, well, this has actually been a huge tangent. We we left the golden golden age topic half an hour ago, right? Mark: Well, what would that golden age look like? To me, the balancing act there, the place where I won't go is the so called dark green resistance. direction. There's a book called Dark Green Resistance and it's, it's very problematic in a number of ways, one of which is that it's extremely ableist. It basically declares that industrialization is, and, and the products of industrialization are things that we're going to have to give up in order to get into sustainability. And so basically everybody who's disabled and needs that support or needs, you know, prescriptions or whatever that is, they Yucca: So the, the folks who rely on insulin or other things like that, too bad. Mark: They can just, too bad. They're, they're, they're washed out. And so I find that very offensive and, and unproductive. I think, and unrealistic, to be honest, because the fact is that people, Yucca: We're not going to do that, Mark: no. People do, they, you know, these are family members, they're people that we love. We're not going to do that, and we're not going to let it be done to ourselves, either. Yucca: Yeah, Mark: So Me Yucca: I, I really dislike the framing of the nature versus humanity, Mark: too. Yucca: right? That's just so unproductive because we are, we're part of, we're part of all of it and we have to take care of us to be able to take care of the whole system. Because, Mark: And, and I have another tangent, which is that our, that that conceptualization of the separation between nature and humanity actually informs some of the early environmental laws that we have in this country, like the Wilderness Act that was approved in 1964. Which discusses in its preamble the idea of lands untrammeled by man, which, Yucca: except that we've been here for 30, 000 years. Thank you very much.  Mark: In a completely racist way erases the presence of native people here for that entire time. Yucca: who have been actively managing that there isn't any news. Maybe some areas in Antarctica. But other than that, there's, there's no land on Earth that we haven't actively been managing for thousands of years. Mark: That's right. Yucca: That's not, yeah. Mark: Yeah, that's right. And there is still a divide within the environmental community between those who. are apoplectic that the National Park Service might allow these little tiny anchors to be pinned into rock so people can climb, because it's, it's inserting human technology into nature. And people who are much more reasonable, who understand, climbers are some of the best environmentalists there are. They love the outdoors, they love the wild, they love the wildlife, they, they, they donate, they, they volunteer, they vote, they do all the things that we need to do for our environment. And you're gonna, you're gonna tell them to get lost because they because you're upset about a totally invisible thing way up high on a rock face? I just, it's, it's, it ain't right. Yucca: Right. And there's a lot of other examples, you know, we can choose different fields for that. But that's definitely one of the ones that's like, really? That's, that's, that's, that's, That's the, okay, Mark: yeah, that's, that's the hill you're gonna die on. Yucca: what you're going to fight with? Okay. Yeah, because it's, okay, full disclosure, I am a climber, so, but but that's not even like arguing about roads, which you could have the argument of if they're improper, if they're not put in right, then you get erosion and trickle down effects from, like, problems with that. But yeah, Mark: there's a lot to be said for roadless areas. When the roadless area policy was implemented under Bill Clinton, it did some very good things for some large, unsegmented Yucca: absolutely, Mark: of wildlife habitat. Yucca: yeah. So, I see a lot of problems that have been created by roads. As a restoration ecologist, when I go in, that's one of the first things that we see is, oh, I haven't even walked up that way yet, but I know that there's a road that way. Right, so it's, it's something that, I just brought that up as something that I could see why people would be arguing against a road, but why somebody's going to argue against the little piece of metal in the, the rock all the way up there, Mark: makes no sense whatsoever. Yucca: most of the time you don't even know is there unless the person is actively climbing, right? Yeah. Mark: Yeah, exactly so. And, I mean, there, as you say, there are other examples of this as well. I mean, the, the terrible wildfires that ran through the Giant Sequoia National Park. Yucca: Mm hmm. Mark: killed 20 percent of the giant Sequoia trees. And the reason that that happened was because fire suppression practices for a century had built up fuels such that when fire finally went through there, the temperatures were so high that these giant trees were killed. So the Yucca: catastrophic fires. Yeah. Mark: because there wasn't beneficial fire, which is a natural part of the landscape and has been used by Native people to manage land for thousands of years. But that's what happened. Big catastrophic fire, a lot of the trees died. National Park Service decided, okay, well in order to help offset this, We need to plant some giant sequoias. We, you know, we need to propagate and then plant some giant sequoias. The same gang that I'm talking about, organizations like Wilderness Watch, went ballistic. No. You have to leave it alone. Wilderness is, is just that. You, you must, you can't touch it. You can't do anything to it. It must just be left to do whatever it's going to do, which on rangelands means you're going to end up with a whole bunch of invasive non natives, Yucca: You starve, you starve it. That's how you turn a range into a desert, is by fencing it off, because our grazers are gone, Mark: mm hmm. Yucca: right? And if you fence that off, and we don't have any grazers, it can't, you have just disrupted resource cycling. Right? You can't get nutrients into the soil. You're gonna get, you're gonna kill all your grasses, and yeah, you just end up with invasives. And then, you end up with bare, you end up with dirt. Mark: With bare dirt, yeah, yeah. So, I mean, this is, and I'm sure we can come up with myriad examples of this, but these are a couple of examples that have come up in the course of my work. And it's very frustrating because everybody involved in these conflicts wants to be doing the right thing, but some of them have some very strange criteria for what that is. And, Yucca: Well, and Mark: you know, I go back to, let's go with the science, let's go with what's practical, let's go with, let's, and, and particularly, to my mind, when we are still, especially in the West, having ongoing conflicts over whether nature is to be rendered into marketable resources. or allowed to flourish as nature. Surely we need to do something so that the people that care about that will continue to care about it, right? There's, there's a very human component to all of this.  Yucca: That, those of us who are, embedded into these ecosystems as part of them and rely on them for our survival, that we are, that we're not left out of that, right? Because one of the problems that happens in my state a lot is that there's a real disconnect between the urban and rural, Communities, and the urban communities will have louder voices often, and will make choices for how, what they think is good for the land, forgetting that, like, yeah, but then we have no, like, then we're going to freeze to death this winter. If you, if you say that we can't cut any firewood, we're going to freeze. Like, you can't survive in this climate if you don't heat your homes, and great, you've got propane. You don't have to even think about it because you've got natural gas and propane and all that in your city, but, you know, we still need to cut down a couple of trees each year. Mark: Yeah. Yeah  Yucca: so it's a, it's, it gets very, very complex. Emotions get high with that stuff. Mark: for sure. Yeah, so as I said, this is a big, long tangent, and I knew that it was gonna be, but it's, it's important. It's an important topic, and one that, that conservationists, We struggle with, you know, we struggle with one another about it. We sue on opposite sides of, you know, of these issues. And I don't have any, you know, quick simple answer for that, but it goes to this idea about what is the golden future. If the idea of the golden future is that, Nature is a park with fences around it. That's, you know, with, you know, all the abundant wildlife and sparkling springs and all that kind of stuff. That's not a realistic future vision. not how those things work, Yucca: and then we all live in that Wall City Mark: right? Yucca: But yeah. I think that whatever the future ends up looking like, that critical examination and reflection is, is really, I think that that's, that's key. That we not only be able to look at ourselves, but be able to look at our society and look at what, and examine what is it that we want, and how do we work towards that, instead of just sort of, just hitting the ground running and just going with whatever's happening, right? Mark: and especially what produces quarterly profitable returns. Yucca: Right? Because that, I mean, that doesn't take very much thought to realize some of the problems with that. Yeah, Mark: And there are things that we could do, there are policy things that we could do, that would make a huge difference in this. If, if legally you could not sell a stock for two years after you bought it, the economy would utterly transform. Because suddenly, The health of the, of the operation itself, and then of course you layer on environmental responsibility, social responsibility, governance responsibility, the so called ESG that the right wing is freaking out about if, if you put it that way. Corporate behavior in a frame like that, and make sure that people who invest are actually investing long enough that it, that they actually care about the performance of the company, you will have enterprises that actually succeed instead of simply cranking out something and then, you know, people can dump the stock, Yucca: mm hmm. Mark: and they will behave in a much more responsible fashion. So, there's, there are a lot of things we could do, there are a lot of things we could do. And we're not doing them, yet. Yucca: The fact that they're there is something that I find very hopeful, Mark: Mm hmm. Yucca: right, that there are things that, that's just one solution, right? And if there's one solution, how many others are there, right? So, Mark: Yeah, and far smarter people than me are, are, they're working on this stuff. They're, they're trying to figure out what kind of a, a system we could have. One of the challenges that I have in reading some of that stuff is that it's often very academic and, and Disconnected from the realities of the world because I'm a politics guy, right? I'm a, I'm a, I'm an implementation guy. I, I want to see how does your idea, how does that get traction and move forward in our society? Yucca: mm hmm. Mark: But those are answerable questions in many cases. I think that golden future can happen, and it won't be golden all the time. That's, Yucca: just like everyday life, Mark: yeah, Yucca: right? Yeah, Mark: but we can certainly build a world that is much kinder. Much more inclusive, much more sustainable, and where people are a lot happier than they are under capitalism, because capitalism makes misery. Yucca: For most people. Mark: Except for a very tiny elite. Yucca: Even then, those folks don't look very happy. Mark: They don't. Yucca: They look terrified, and you can see them going crazy. So, it doesn't, it really doesn't, what we've got going on now, and I don't know if maybe there are some elements of capitalism that are things that, there's some positive elements that we could move forward with and other things we don't want to, but what we've got going on isn't working for most people. Mark: That's right. Yucca: So, I think we need to look, to really look at what do we want to move towards instead, and how to build that. And I don't think that we're, personally, I don't like the tearing everything down, because I think a lot of people get hurt in that process. I think it's something that we need to work towards in a, to transform. not to try and destroy and rise out of the ashes because that rarely ever works. There's quite a few countries to take a look at where that, in recent history, where that's been disastrous. That's not how it, you know, people Mark: Usually what it gets you is some kind of strong armed dictator who, It promises people that they'll be safe. Yucca: So, how do we make these changes in a way that supports and nurtures as many people along the way as possible? Mark: That is the problem before us. It is. Yucca: And it's worthwhile. It's I'm grateful that that's something that we get to think about. Mm Mark: you know, I really am too. And we're, we're at a moment in human history where I don't believe it's too late, but we're definitely talking about the big picture now. we're going to make decisions that are going to impact the big picture in a significant way. And it's kind of meaningful to be alive at this time and to have a role in advocating for the kinds of values and, and ethics and behavior that we want to see. Yucca: Yeah, and getting to, to choose that, right? Mm hmm. I Mark: I mean, there are a lot of people that don't have a lot of choice about the circumstances of their lives and they aren't good circumstances, but they don't have a lot of choice about that. And they just have to keep repeating the same thing over and over and over in order to barely eke out an existence. It's a privilege to be able to work at a different level than that where you can hopefully have some traction on the future. So you were right. We had a lot of tangents. Yucca: was gonna say, I loved it. This is great. Lots to think about. So, thanks for a great discussion, Mark, Mark: Yeah, thank you. Really enjoyed it. Let us know what you think, folks. The Wonder Podcast, queues at gmail. com. That's The Wonder Podcast, all one word, and then the letter Q and the letter S. Yucca: and we'll see you next week.   

The Rattlesnake National Recreation Area, located minutes from downtown Missoula, is part of the Lolo National Forest. Many know the Rattlesnake as Missoula's backyard, offering ample outdoor recreation opportunities and access to the adjoining wilderness area. But did you know that in the 1930s there were homes, mines, a school and telephone lines scattered through the forest?This week, the commissioners were joined by Andy Kulla, the former Recreation Area and Wilderness Manager for the Rattlesnake. Andy details how the grassroots efforts to preserve the area from development led to its designation by Congress in 1980. They also discuss how changes in the logging industry, wildfire research and recreation trends influence public land management.Related links:Learn more about the ongoing Lolo National Forest Management Plan Revision and upcoming engagement opportunitiesRead the Rattlesnake National Recreation Area and Wilderness Act of 1980 Thank you to Missoula's Community Media Resource for podcast recording support!

On today's episode, we're talking with someone who has been making a big impact in the larger outdoor industry for a while now. Teresa Baker, founder of In Solidarity Project, is an outdoor enthusiast focusing on community engagement, creating events that encourage people to venture outdoors responsibly, and learning about our open spaces and what it takes to protect them. Teresa's commitment to creating outdoor experiences that speak to culture, environmental responsibility and inclusion is something to be admired, and she is a staunch advocate for bringing underrepresented communities into the conversation and the work. Teresa has led various organizations and initiatives that support this work, such as The Outdoor CEO Diversity Pledge, the African American National Park Event and the Outdoorist Oath, to name a few. We were so thrilled to have the privilege of talking with Teresa to learn more about her determination to make a difference in the work of diversity and inclusion in outdoor spaces. And, as 2024 marks the 60th anniversary of the Civil Rights Act and the Wilderness Act, Teresa has created a campaign encouraging everyone to get outdoors, doing whatever they enjoy, between now and July. Be sure to share photos of you and your community getting outside on social media using #CivilRightsAct60 – the photos will be turned into a collage of the country celebrating and honoring the anniversaries.  Tune in to our full conversation below to learn more about Teresa and how her work may support your efforts to build more equitable, inclusive spaces and programs in your community. You'll also learn: ·       How Teresa's work in this space began with a call to the National Park Service to tell them, “you have a diversity problem” ·       How to have difficult conversations and get out of your comfort zone ·       Why partnerships are key to pushing diversity, equity and inclusion work forward ·       How to spend time outdoors (however works for you!) and be aware of your environmental impact ·       And much more! Related Links: ·       Follow Teresa on Instagram ·       Connect with Teresa on LinkedIn ·       In Solidarity Project ·       Outdoor Diversity Alliance ·       The Outdoorist Oath ·       The Outdoorist Oath on Instagram ·       Outdoor CEO Diversity Pledge Have feedback about this episode or Open Space Radio overall? Share it with us! If you enjoyed this episode or learned something that might help you make a positive impact in your community, please consider donating to NRPA to not only support our storytelling efforts, but also our mission to advance parks, recreation and conservation efforts that enhance the quality of life for all at nrpa.org/donate.

Jeffrey H Ryan is an author, adventurer, photographer, and historian. He has written several books about his outdoor exploits, his fascination with hiking trails, and a deep appreciation for history woven into walks across contemporary landscapes. His latest book, 'This Land Was Saved for You and Me', traces the path from Olmsted's first wanderings in Yosemite to the signing of The Wilderness Act in 1964. In this episode of Nature Revisited, Jeffrey delves into the history of rescuing America's public lands, and both the notable and lesser-known people who gave their all to protect forests and wilderness areas before they would be gone forever and ensured that all Americans would retain the benefits of ownership. [Originally published Aug 23, 2022. Ep 76] This Land was Saved for You and Me trailer: vimeo.com/736277678 Jeffrey's book: https://www.jeffryanauthor.com/where-to-buy-this-land-was-saved-for-you-and-me/ Jeffrey's website: www.jeffryanauthor.com Listen to Nature Revisited on your favorite podcast apps or at https://noordenproductions.com Subscribe on Spotify: https://tinyurl.com/bdz4s9d7 Subscribe on Google Podcasts: https://tinyurl.com/4a5sr4ua Subscribe on Apple Podcasts: https://tinyurl.com/5n7yx28t Support Nature Revisited https://noordenproductions.com/support Nature Revisited is produced by Stefan Van Norden and Charles Geoghegan. We welcome your comments, questions and suggestions - contact us at https://noordenproductions.com/contact

What does it mean for land to be “wild?” It's a question that federal land managers have thought about since the Wilderness Act of 1964, which defined wilderness as areas “...untrammeled by man, where man himself is a visitor who does not remain.” Our national parks and public lands have visitor centers, fire lookouts, and other approved "installations" that help us enjoy the wild safely. But just what defines an installation has become the center of a recent debate between rock climbers and conservationists.

Two amazing guests today. Two important conversations related to community and development. First, we speak to Sam Lightner Jr. about the latest threats to climbing access in America. Sam is a prolific route developer, who is perhaps best known for developing the climbing in Southern Thailand and helping turn Railey and Tonsai beaches into the destinations they are. But he's also established many routes in the American west, and done the heroic work of replacing hundreds of anchor bolts under the American Safe Climbing Association. He was also one of the first board members on the Access Fund, and has continued to advocate for climbing access in America. We break down the latest attempt from extremist “wilderness” advocacy groups to cynically use the language of the Wilderness Act to prevent climbers from legally climbing in wilderness areas located in National Parks and Forest Service lands. Our main guest is Genevieve Walker, a professional climber and climbing guide who is working to promote greater access and representation for underrepresented groups in the outdoors. Her recent expedition to Malawi worked to develop and empower the local climbing community. Her trip reframes how we traditionally think of a “climbing expeditions,” centering a community-oriented approach to empowerment over sick sends. Last but not least, our final bit comes from Colorado climber Kyle Ward with his latest EP and the eponymous song Get Goin'. Show Notes Access Fund: Action Alert: Stop the Bolt Prohibition Submit a comment to the NPS Submit a comment to the USFS Follow Sam Lightner Jr. on Instagram Read: “Breaking the Wilderness Bell Jar” on Evening Sends Follow Genevieve Walker on Instagram Follow Climb Malawi on Instagram Follow The Global Climbing Initiative on Instagram Is Rock Climbing the Future of Tourism in Malawi? Follow Kyle Ward on Instagram Listen to Get Goin' on Spotify Become a RunOut Rope Gun! Support our podcast and increase your RunOut runtime. Bonus episodes, AMA, and more will be available to our Rope Guns. Thank you for your support! http://patreon.com/runoutpodcastContact us Send ideas, voicemail, feedback and more. andrew@runoutpodcast.com // chris@runoutpodcast.com

In 1964, passage of The Wilderness Act promised Americans that there would be lands designated for preservation and protection in their natural condition. It was a promise from Congress that the American people of present and future generations would be able to enjoy the benefits of an enduring resource of wilderness.”   When President Johnson signed the act into law, he said that “If future generations are to remember us with gratitude rather than contempt, we must leave them a glimpse of the world as it was in the beginning, not just after we got through with it.”   Where do things stand with that promise? Has it lived up to its lofty goal? To seek an answer to that question, and to get a better understanding of management of wilderness areas, and potentially wilderness, in the country, we've invited George Nickas and Dana Johnson to join us.  George is executive director of Wilderness Watch, a national organization dedicated to defending the nation's National Wilderness Preservation System and keeping it wild, and Dana is the organization's policy director.

Terry Tempest Williams is a naturalist, environmentalist, and award-winning author. In 2014, on the 50th Anniversary of the Wilderness Act, Ms. Williams received the Sierra Club's John Muir Award honoring a distinguished record of leadership in American conservation. She is currently the Annie Clark Tanner Scholar in Environmental Humanities at the University of Utah. She is the author of many books including Refuge: An Unnatural History of Family and Place (Pantheon 1991), Red: Patience and Passion in the Desert (Vintage Books 2002), When Women Were Birds (Sarah Crichton Books: Farrar, Straus and Giroux 2012) and The Hour of Land: A Personal Topography of America's National Parks (Sarah Crichton Books, Farrar, Straus and Giroux 2016)Interview Date: 6/11/2016 Tags: Terry Tempest Williams, National Parks, sacred lands, mountain lion, Big Bend National Park, Jackson Hole, Grand Teton National Park, Grizzly bear, wolves, Yellowstone, keystone species, public lands, public commons, Ecology/Nature/Environment, History, Social Change/Politics, Animals, Travel

Vintage crosscuts that were made between 1880 and 1930 are often the tool of choice for trail workers who maintain the country's roughly 112 million acres of protected land. That's ahead of chain saws and newly made crosscuts. And the reason this old tool has stuck around so long -- even in an age when there's a newer, better gadget coming out every year -- it goes way beyond the physical saw itself. The rise, fall, and unexpected second life of the crosscut saw is also the story of how America created the very concept of wilderness.The Wilderness Tool

Stewart Udall served as the Secretary of the Interior under Presidents Kennedy and Johnson from 1961 to 1969. During his time in office, he helped create national parks, protected wilderness areas, and advocated for conservation efforts. Udall was instrumental in passing important environmental legislation, such as the Wilderness Act of 1964 and the Land and Water Conservation Fund Act of 1965. The post Stewart Udall and The Politics of Beauty with John de Graaf & Tony Mazzochi, Labor Leader And Environmentalist appeared first on Writer's Voice.

New York Times bestselling author and acclaimed presidential historian Douglas Brinkley talks about his new book, "Silent Spring Revolution," which chronicles the rise of environmental activism during the Long Sixties (1960-1973), telling the story of an indomitable generation that saved the natural world under the leadership of John F. Kennedy, Lyndon Johnson, and Richard Nixon. With the detonation of the Trinity explosion in the New Mexico desert in 1945, the United States took control of Earth's destiny for the first time. After the Truman administration dropped atomic bombs on Japan to end World War II, a grim new epoch had arrived. During the early Cold War years, the federal government routinely detonated nuclear devices in the Nevada desert and the Marshall Islands. Not only was nuclear fallout a public health menace, but entire ecosystems were contaminated with radioactive materials. During the 1950s, an unprecedented postwar economic boom took hold, with America becoming the world's leading hyperindustrial and military giant. But with this historic prosperity came a heavy cost: oceans began to die, wilderness vanished, the insecticide DDT poisoned ecosystems, wildlife perished, and chronic smog blighted major cities. In "Silent Spring Revolution," Douglas Brinkley pays tribute to those who combated the mauling of the natural world in the Long Sixties: Rachel Carson (a marine biologist and author), David Brower (director of the Sierra Club), Barry Commoner (an environmental justice advocate), Coretta Scott King (an antinuclear activist), Stewart Udall (the secretary of the interior), William O. Douglas (Supreme Court justice), Cesar Chavez (a labor organizer), and other crusaders are profiled with verve and insight. Carson's book "Silent Spring," published in 1962, depicted how detrimental DDT was to living creatures. The exposé launched an ecological revolution that inspired such landmark legislation as the Wilderness Act (1964), the Clean Air Acts (1963 and 1970), and the Endangered Species Acts (1966, 1969, and 1973). In intimate detail, Brinkley extrapolates on such epic events as the Donora (Pennsylvania) smog incident, JFK's Limited Nuclear Test Ban Treaty, Great Lakes preservation, the Santa Barbara oil spill, and the first Earth Day. With the United States grappling with climate change and resource exhaustion, Douglas Brinkley's meticulously researched and deftly written "Silent Spring Revolution" reminds us that a new generation of twenty-first-century environmentalists can save the planet from ruin. This is a production of the College of Arts & Sciences and Origins: Current Events in Historical Perspective at the Goldberg Center in the Department of History at The Ohio State University and the Department of History at Miami University. Be sure to subscribe to our channel to receive updates about our videos and podcasts. For more information about Origins: Current Events in Historical Perspective, please visit http://origins.osu.edu.

For On athlete, Jeff Colt, the chase for a coveted spot into Western States had been a multi-year saga fraught with close calls and near misses, that is until a near-perfectly executed run at the Black Canyon 100k in February earned him a Golden Ticket and automatic entry onto one of ultrarunning's biggest stages. We pick up Jeff's story there and hear all about his journey leading up to Western States, a play-by-play of his 11th-place finish, and the complexities of looking back at that experience now. Along the way, we also get into topics like the Wilderness Act, the Beat Generation, books currently on our nightstands, and much more. TOPICS & TIMESGary Snyder and the Beat Generation (1:46)Working & running in the White Mountains hut system (5:49)Hardrock 100 & the Wilderness Act (12:47)Jeff's journey to Western States (17:23)Pandemic silver linings (27:04)Reflections on his performance at Western States (33:54)His interests outside of running (42:30)“What books are currently on your nightstand?” (44:57)Representing the US at the Trail World Champs in Thailand (49:09)CHECK OUT OUR OTHER PODCASTS CRAFTEDBlister PodcastGEAR:30Bikes & Big Ideas Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

In this episode, I speak with Erik Molvar, executive director of Western Watersheds Project. We discuss his guidebook writing, the state of our public lands system, the work of Western Watersheds Project, the influence of domestic livestock on Wilderness and public lands, attitudes and historical context of wilderness, Native American omission from the Wilderness Act, the relevancy and importance of the wilderness designation, how to manage public lands for the benefit of ecosystems and the human, collaborative conservation and challenging the dominant culture of colonialism and dominion over nature. Support the show

In this warm and thoughtful program you'll by dazzled by the mystery of Terry's dying mother's request for her to read her journals, but not until after her death. Terry found 3 shelves of journals only to discover all of them were blank. Puzzle about this mystery along with Terry in this far-reaching dialogue about finding one's authentic voice. Terry Tempest Williams is a naturalist, environmentalist, and award-winning author. She is a recipient of the Lannan Literary Fellowship in creative nonfiction and the 1997 Guggenheim Fellowship, and served as naturalist-in-residence at the Utah Museum of Natural History. In 2014, on the 50th Anniversary of the Wilderness Act, Ms. Williams received the Sierra Club's John Muir Award honoring a distinguished record of leadership in American conservation. She divides her time between Castle Valley, Utah, and Moose, Wyoming. She is the author of many books including Refuge: An Unnatural History of Family and Place (Pantheon 1991), Red: Patience and Passion in the Desert (Vintage Books 2002), An Unspoken Hunger: Stories from the Field (Vintage Books 1995) , Leap (Vintage 2001), The Open Space of Democracy (The Orion Society 2004), Finding Beauty in a Broken World (Pantheon 2008), When Women Were Birds (Sarah Crichton Books: Farrar, Straus and Giroux 2012) and The Hour of Land: A Personal Topography of America's National Parks (Sarah Crichton Books, Farrar, Straus and Giroux 2016) Interview Date: 5/5/2012 Tags: Terry Tempest Williams, Wangari Maathai, voice, speaking, courage, silence, Mother Tongue, reproductive freedom, language, emotional intelligence, Mormon, birth control, abortion, Carden School, teaching children, Utah wildlands, wilderness, storytelling, Wilderness Society, embodied language, uncertainty, questions, questioning, deep listening, journaling, journal, authentic voice, sisterhood, crisis, ecology of the mind, Ecology/Nature/Environment, Social Change/Politics, Writing, Women's Studies, Philosophy

Terry Tempest Williams is a naturalist, environmentalist, and award-winning author. She is a recipient of the Lannan Literary Fellowship in creative nonfiction and the 1997 Guggenheim Fellowship, and served as naturalist-in-residence at the Utah Museum of Natural History. In 2014, on the 50th Anniversary of the Wilderness Act, Ms. Williams received the Sierra Club's John Muir Award honoring a distinguished record of leadership in American conservation. She divides her time between Castle Valley, Utah, and Moose, Wyoming. She is the author of many books including Refuge: An Unnatural History of Family and Place (Pantheon 1991), Red: Patience and Passion in the Desert (Vintage Books 2002), An Unspoken Hunger: Stories from the Field (Vintage Books 1995) , Leap (Vintage 2001), The Open Space of Democracy (The Orion Society 2004), Finding Beauty in a Broken World (Pantheon 2008), When Women Were Birds (Sarah Crichton Books: Farrar, Straus and Giroux 2012), The Hour of Land: A Personal Topography of America's National Parks (Sarah Crichton Books, Farrar, Straus and Giroux 2016) and Erosion: Essays of Undoing (Sarah Crichton Books, Farrar, Straus and Giroux 2019) Interview Date: 5/5/2012 Tags: MP3, Terry Tempest Williams, journaling, her mother's journals, grief, Mormon women write, full silence, women's friendships, matriarchal line, Women's Studies, Writing

This butterfly is excited to be speaking with Jeffrey H. Ryan. Jeff is passionate about the outdoors and the conservation of public land, whose work has been cited in Forbes, USA Today, and other notable publications. He is the author of Appalachian Odyssey (2016), Blazing Ahead (2017), and a new book This Land Was Saved for You and Me: How Gifford Pinchot, Frederick Law Olmsted, and a Band of Foresters Rescued America's Public Lands that came out in September 2022 tells the story of how America's public lands—our city parks, national forests, and wilderness areas—came into being can be traced to a few conservation pioneers and proteges who shaped policy and advocated for open spaces. Some, like Frederick Law Olmsted and Gifford Pinchot, are well known, while others have never been given their due. Jeffrey Ryan covers the nearly century-long period between 1865 (when Olmsted contributed to the creation of Yosemite as a park and created its management plan) to the signing of the Wilderness Act of 1964. Olmsted influenced Pinchot, who became the first head of the National Forest Service. In turn, Pinchot hired the foresters who became the founders of The Wilderness Society and creators of the Wilderness Act itself. This history emphasizes the cast of characters —among them Theodore Roosevelt, Bob Marshall, Benton MacKaye, Aldo Leopold, and Howard Zahniser—and provides context for their decisions and the political and economic factors that contributed to the triumphs and pitfalls in the quest to protect public lands. In researching the book, Ryan traveled to the places where these crusaders lived, worked, and were inspired to take up the cause to make public lands accessible to all. In this episode, you will hear about the history of American forests, what he learned about Olmsted, Pichot, Jeff's hiking experience, and more. Some notes... More about 1treellion & Jeff Ryan. To support planting all over the world, please check out this link. The great music is credited to Pixabay.

Jeffrey H Ryan is an author, adventurer, photographer, and historian. He has written several books about his outdoor exploits, his fascination with hiking trails, and a deep appreciation for history woven into walks across contemporary landscapes. His latest book, 'This Land Was Saved for You and Me', traces the path from Olmsted's first wanderings in Yosemite to the signing of The Wilderness Act in 1964. In this episode of Nature Revisited, Jeffrey delves into the history of rescuing America's public lands, and both the notable and lesser-known people who gave their all to protect forests and wilderness areas before they would be gone forever and ensured that all Americans would retain the benefits of ownership. This Land was Saved for You and Me trailer: https://vimeo.com/736277678 Buy The Book: www.jeffryanauthor.com/where-to-buy-this-land-was-saved-for-you-and-me/ Jeffrey's website: www.jeffryanauthor.com Listen to Nature Revisited on your favorite podcast apps or at noordenproductions.com/nature-revisited-podcast Nature Revisited website: https://noordenproductions.com Support Nature Revisited: https://noordenproductions.com/support Nature Revisited is produced by Stefan van Norden and Charles Geoghegan. We welcome your comments, questions and suggestions - contact us at https://noordenproductions.com/contact

Donate to the podcast directly with the links below. ⚡️Donate any amount from a Bitcoin Lightning wallet ( including Cash.App ) to Billy Newman https://strike.me/billynewman ⚡️Donate $5 from a Bitcoin Lightning wallet to Billy Newman https://yr.link/lightningpay5 ⚡️Donate $11.11 from a Bitcoin Lightning wallet to Billy Newman https://yr.link/lightningpay11 ⚡️Donate $50 from a Bitcoin Lightning wallet to Billy Newman https://yr.link/lightningpay50 If you feel you are getting value from this, please help by becoming a supporter and send some sats. *New* You can send a Bitcoin Lightning payment direct from the Cash.app Get a Bitcoin Lightning wallet for free instant transfers https://breez.technology https://muun.com https://bluewallet.io Value streaming payments system enables listeners to send Bitcoin micropayments to podcasters as they listen, in real-time. Start streaming value! It's easy to remember: http://value4value.io/ newpodcastapps.com I use https://fountain.fm If you're looking to discuss photography assignment work, or a podcast interview, please drop me an email. Drop Billy Newman an email here. If you want to look at my photography, my current portfolio is here. If you want to read a free PDF eBook written by Billy Newman about film photography: you can download Working With Film here. If you get value out of the content I produce, consider making a sustaining value for value financial contribution, Visit the Support Page here. You can find my latest photo books all on Amazon here. You can find my latest photo books all on Amazon here. Website Billy Newman Photo https://billynewmanphoto.com/ YouTube https://www.youtube.com/billynewmanphoto Facebook Page https://www.facebook.com/billynewmanphotos/ Twitter https://twitter.com/billynewman Instagram https://www.instagram.com/billynewman/ About https://billynewmanphoto.com/about/ 0:14 Hello, and thank you very much for listening to this episode of The Billy Newman photo podcast. 0:23 Hey, what's going on? This is Billy Newman, I'm a photographer you can see some of my work at Billy Newman photo calm or hanging out here on my YouTube page and check out some of these, these photographs that I've made a few videos about. Today's photograph is an image that was taken on film it was of really it's just kind of an interesting one. And this is what I wanted to talk about this is from a real simple kit and it's probably something that would cost less than $150 in equipment overall to make this type of image. Now that comes from this photograph was made using an old used film camera with a regular 15 millimeter lens on I bet you can go to a thrift store and find something like this for really a pretty inexpensive price. And there's an amazing amount of quality you can get from it. But this this Daisy and grass field was photographed really just right next to me beside a curb on 18th Street in my town was kind of interesting how it was but there's a nice soft evening light that was coming in low against the horizon backlighting, this little patch of grass, it's just a little patch of lawn that had a handful of daisies blooming in it. So I pulled up real close with the 50 millimeter at one, eight. And I photographed this image on film of these daisies and the soft evening light of the early springtime really cool image and I just kind of like the mood of it. But it was kind of cool to be able to talk about how inexpensively and how effectively you can use equipment that's still available. 1:54 You can see more of my work at Billy Newman photo comm you can check out some of my photo books on Amazon. I think if you look at Billy Newman under the authors section there and see some of the photo books on film on the desert, on surrealism on camping, and cool stuff over there. Thinking about a couple of the photo things that I've been trying to put up I just posted one earlier it was a backpacking photo that I'd taken when we were out in the willow mountains up in the eagle cap wilderness. And that's a really cool spot. I've talked about it a ton of times before but but it really is a special location as it goes even for Oregon which is really blessed with a lot of very nice, very approachable photographable locations. But the will our mountains have always been something that stood out to me as one of my favorites. And I've heard that region has a lot of stuff like that like as you move further over into Idaho into the sawtooth mountains in the house Canyon, there's a lot of really peculiar spectacles to go see in that area. And it's really interesting how it's laid out. I appreciate it and I love to kind of getting to go through the whole area. But the allow mountain specifically have something kind of special to him, especially when you get up into the Alpine area. And you get away from people even as it goes when you get to Joseph, you're significantly away from people but as you leave and kind of pushing further into the ego cap wilderness 3:19 number of people just drops down to less than a dozen by far. And, and even less than that, you know, as you move into the more remote areas, it's sort of interesting how there's a threshold of where people are like if it's under so many miles of a hike, there's going to be a lot more people there just sort of evolution maybe it's our you know, it's it's just a natural selection, right? It's, it's where people would naturally select their interest to be closer to the main road and then further and more competitive at a farther distance. And so it's interesting, like if you go to a lake that's six miles in, there's going to be more people there than if you went to the lake that was nine miles and it just people kind of pull out first or they pull out to the to the route of the trail it's going to not be as much it seems like but also on top of that, really. And I blame myself for this specifically. It's way busier now. This decade just generally it seems like the Rei or the the whole outdoor industry, this whole outdoor media industry outdoor adventure industry, it just seems like it's double what it was 20% up from what it was a decade ago. That might make sense. And the reason that I would say that is it just seems like there were so many more people filling the parking lot of the area than there were in the years past. And the reason I say that and the reason why that's that's qualified information maybe is it's after Labor Day. Now what's the trick used to be when I was doing a lot of the photo trips that I do, as I kind of travel east trim here and kind of do a big loop in the fall to take photos is after Labor Day where you really need Notice that a lot of these state parks, a lot of the managed locations where there's a park coast or something like that those all get shut down for the winter, it's closed off unless it's like a bigger, higher volume National Park kind of area. But all of these remote locations like the walala wilderness, or the alvord Desert that we went to these were places where there would likely be no people, especially no people, if it were off hours off season, sort of stuff, sort of visitation. But what we noticed when we were there is that the parking lot was filled up, like you know, it was 5060 7080, cars deep, they all just kind of Park in a line up above the trailhead, and that's, you know, you kind of visually just are impacted by Wow, there must be this many people from all these cars up in the mountains right now. And in the past, like when I was there in 2011. And then again, in 2012, and 13, there would be no car, like there was five cars in the parking lot. It was me, I pulled up right to the very front. And I mean, and even when we went this last time, it was a mid week trip. It wasn't it wasn't Friday, Saturday, Sunday. And even still, with that midweek trip, there was more traffic up there. So we went to our noid Lake, I believe. And that was an area that was I think, like six miles. And so a little bit of what I was talking about before about natural selection of the hike, you're going to go on that day, six miles was is less of a hike. I think the other one icelake is nine miles, maybe the other one is 10 1213 miles, you know, somewhere in there, but it just kind of progressively goes on from about six there's about one every two miles or so if you know if you kind of put you know your so many more miles after that. There's this next one, so on and so forth, as you can imagine, but a lot of people go up to this like for like a lunch day hike, which sounds like a blast not having to actually carry all the heavy stuff with you or, you know, all the equipment, all the overnight stuff that you'd have to deal with. But it was fine. It was it was cool. We went up to our North Lake, we camped up there for a night. And we did a lot of photo stuff. But it was kind of tough because I think I mentioned on that last podcast where the we were prepared, but the weather would kind of get twisted on us more often than really what I wanted it to. But the weather would kind of spin out on us a little bit. So the first night we were there, it was nice and decent. And temperature and weather as we were hiking up to the location where we're going to camp. There's only one other couple camping up there I think was like a mom and a daughter team that were there were camped out of the site. And then so we pulled away from them on a lake and you know, it's just the whole lake to us, which is really cool. It was fun. So we shot around there for a while but there's rain that picked up it was probably one of the first rains of the season while at least for me or for us or for that area but it seemed like it kind of built up over the mountains you know, like how you see storm systems kind of build up over the mountain top sometimes seems sort of like it was that like it was some kind of weather pattern that was about that allows it seemed like it was nice everywhere else. But it just seemed like it wasn't very nice there. So we camped there for the night. We got through some rain. It was nice. The next morning, we 8:01 took a lot of photos that morning a lot of photos through the day, we kind of walked around the lake and it was interesting, I guess way back before it was before it was a wilderness area. Before whatever kind of legislation went into effect in the 60s I think was the Nixon era. You know, a Nixon had just gotten in and what was like 68 and they pushed for the Wilderness Act or the wild and scenic act are brothers a bunch of stuff before that, but from way back like 100 years ago, like before, these regulations existed on what could and couldn't happen in wilderness areas. I guess it was a bot area next at Lake and they built like six or seven cabins up there. Like we just cut down wood and built these cabins so you got there I think they're still owned as private property was sort of grandfathered in. Once the whole wilderness thing was established there's a lot of those private land facilities that were grandfathered into that system because they'd already existed there. So these are all like undeveloped and maintain things that I guess you could you could pay someone to to hike up all the way there and then camp there if you'd want to. It seemed a little dilapidated to me though I don't know if I'd want to put out some cash for that after especially after hiking all day, I might as well just take my tent or hammock or sleeping pad or something, you know if I'm doing that, but it was cool to go check out and it was kind of cool to spot something a little different up there. But it's really fun. You know, honestly, I don't like the cabins because really what I want to go to the allowance for is the wilderness experiences the getting away from the cabins, the private property, the signs that say you can't go here, someone else owns this sort of thing. I'm trying to get away from that and go to public land and go to places where I have access where I get to do things. And so if it's in civilization like downtown and I see private property or whatever it might be, or you know, this is ours, it's not yours. I say all right, fine, that's okay. Because that's the that's the negotiation we've made here and civilization, but when we go way out when we've hiked in miles and miles under our own discipline, and accord to get Somewhere to spend time there and then there's some sign some indication that we're not supposed to be there or we're not supposed to be a part of it or we're not supposed to whatever we're supposed to respect their private property and it's a big open field that is a place that everyone gets to hike to that's just a big lake that's a tourist destination now I'm not respecting that rule I'm going wherever I'm going to do whatever that's your business to get a camp post to discipline not mine. So that's might be a leg that I don't go to anymore or that we won't really hike out to again I think mostly you know, photos were fun it was fine other than like not really getting the the light and the opportunity you know running into a storm roll the rest of it that kind of took away a little bit but really there's there's just not as many How do you say like priority landscape features at that at that location there's a pretty Lake it's very nice it's very Alpine looking and you know in its presentation but it just didn't really have one of those those triple A titles to photograph when you get there there's not like a lake and then this really cool perspective of a mountain it's just sort of a big Ridge that runs along this this glacial lake cool really pretty beautiful shouldn't take away from it but but when your goal is just kind of to get to a specific kind of thing and then get a photo in the can as they'd say in the beers or you know when you get to finish it it's done it's already locked off and it's already captured you got what you want then you can move on it just didn't really feel like we got there at our location in the allow amounts but it was super fun being there it was cold at night though man made mornings bad that's the thing that sucks about morning photos at night. You get the sun to heat up the earth all day and then you get to go out and take photos of it in the morning though it's just been cold the whole time especially as we move into fall as we move into winter like that cold just really starts to peak it seems like well you know we're getting really close to the freeze I'm sure it was already freezing up there above the Alpine level like we were 7500 feet something like that. So that's a lot Are you from coming down here oh man and the altitude not altitude sickness, altitude fatigue it just drew on me Marina to she really noticed it but you know, as you go around, it's like one o'clock that next afternoon you're just trying to you're just trying to have energy to sit and eat lunch it seemed like it seemed like you know, if you're really pumped up and you really got to hike in or something you could struggle through it, but just that that native energy that you would have to go do something it just was really zap that might be just from sleeping on rocks for four days beforehand, and then try to hike or something like that. But it's but it's it's weird. I don't know. I remember a couple other times he was he kind of if the backpack and you climb up in elevation, it just can be really fatiguing. 12:55 So we made it through it, I posted a photo up to Instagram today it's hitting Facebook and Twitter and whatnot this afternoon. I'm also trying to run through and find a good video clip like a good behind the scenes video clip of us kind of walking through or running around up in the clouds as we're hiking and I know I have a bunch of those of us backpacking and trying to put in some work to get to a spot to take some cool photos so 13:24 you can check out more information at Billy Newman photo comm you can go to Billy Newman photo.com Ford slash support. If you want to help me out and participate in the value for value model that we're running this podcast with. If you received some value out of some of the stuff that I was talking about, you're welcome to help me out and send value my way through the portal at Billy Newman photo comm forward slash support, you can also find more information there about Patreon and the way that I use it if you're interested or feel more comfortable using Patreon that's patreon.com forward slash Billy Newman photo. 14:03 So I wanted to talk about the training stuff that I've been doing. I think I'd mentioned I had done a good bit of work with, you know, other programs in the past. But this is really the first time that I've gotten into spending time learning specifically about some of the features and the controls in Logic Pro and now Logic Pro 10.5. So what I've done is gone to now what's called LinkedIn learning. LinkedIn learning com. They used to be a website called lynda.com and lynda.com was these these screencast video tutorials of how to use different types of software and how to be trained, you know, just training for different types of most of the time computer related skills. So I've used that service for a number of things over the years specifically I think Chris orbix Lightroom tutorial is probably like standard for a lot of photographers that have been interested in and learning about photography editing. And so all of those courses that have existed over the years have a lot of a lot of good information in them. But so I went back to, to what would be lynda.com. Now as it has been purchased by LinkedIn, through Microsoft, it's now called LinkedIn learning. Right on Hmm. So LinkedIn learning has all of the old Lynda videos, including all the updates to the videos that they're still continuing to produce. So I went on and I tried to find some training videos about Logic Pro 10. There's a number of videos for like Essential Training for Logic Pro 10. But there's nothing because now this new update Logic Pro 10.5 is really only maybe two weeks old or something. It's, there's no there's just no new video training established for it. So I think for Logic Pro 10.4, there's a full Essential Training Video that was produced by was a Scott Hirsch music producer out of New York. And he just kind of goes through the controls and the system and stuff and you get you get a good feel of like how to how to make changes, how to use different features, how to use the mixer versus like the linear tracking system, you know how to use different controls and stuff. A lot of this stuff is similar if you've used GarageBand, like I was mentioned, or another digital audio workstation that does multi tracking in the past. But it was cool, yeah, learning licks and techniques about how to apply different different compress, or how to make the settings of a compressor do more specifically the types of things that I'm wanting to do in a mix, I think was some good information for me to be learning about through the the Logic Pro training stuff. Also, in addition to that, if you don't want that, so LinkedIn learning is a paid service, you can get a one month free trial at that too, which I'm taking advantage of at this moment to get to get some new information. But what you can do is go to YouTube and look up similar, similar training videos. And there's a lot of people a lot of music producers out there that have done their own screencasts of kind of walking through different services or different techniques that these digital audio workstations provide so as looking at a guy guys website, I think it was why Logic Pro rules calm and that had a lot of good training videos on it too. He had a lot of information about how different pieces of it work and just how to how to make use of a lot of the techniques that you'd have to apply in a certain piece of the software to make it more effective. And I thought that was really cool. I really appreciated some of the stuff that he'd done and thanks a lot for checking out this episode of The Billy Newman photo podcast. Hope you guys check out some stuff on Billy Newman photo.com few new things up there some stuff on the homepage, some good links to other other outbound sources, some links to books and links to some podcasts like this a blog posts are pretty cool. Yeah, check it out at Billy numina photo.com. Thanks a lot for listening to this episode. And the lucky next

For centuries, dark stories of unusual events have been whispered around campfires in the wilderness of North America. From strange stories of lurking creatures and unusual clusters of unexplained disappearances to the countless folktales and unsettling native lore that shroud the landscapes of these majestic regions- these luring places of mysterious beauty that have become our National Parks. What dark secrets do they hide? What strange power might they conceal? The trail is laid thick with danger and whispers of the unknown. So grab your compass and triple-check your firearm as we venture deep into the heart of the Belief Hole and explore National Parks: Containment Theory. TIMESTAMPS: Get Expansion Episode: 3.20 EXP | Strange Disappearances | People Returning with Strange Stories Full Show Notes: https://beliefhole.com/3-20-national-parks-containment-theory-missing-411 TIMESTAMPS: 00:07 | Topic Preview – National Parks: Containment Theory 02:39 | Speculation and Conjecture Disclaimer 04:45 | Jeremy's Containment Theory – tying together Missing 411 and the origin of National Parks 06:58 | Establishing the National Parks to contain dangerous high-strangeness phenomena 08:57 | Expansion Discussion – Strange Disappearances: What happens when you go missing? 13:57 | Theodore Roosevelt – How the Teddy Bear got its name 15:15 | The Organic Act – creating the National Parks – untouched land 19:20 | Yellowstone's monsters guarded by calvary 21:51 | Wilderness Act – 109.1 million acres of restricted wilderness 26:20 | Expansion Preview | Sai Kung Enchantment – Strange Disappearances | STORY 29:49 | Teddy Roosevelt believed in Bigfoot (or Wild Man) 32:39 | Bauman's Story (Trapper killed by ‘Bigfoot‘) | STORY 43:57 | Wild Men… and zombies 46:27 | The Feral People in National Parks Possibility 48:56 | Unexplained Sounds and Fairy Music in National Parks 49:52 | Unexplained ‘Lake Music' in Yellowstone 52:18 | Strange Sounds in Shamanism and Alien Abduction 53:07 | Jon and Chris get Rekied! 58:13 | Channel Recommendation: Missing Persons Mysteries 59:03 | Disintegrating People | STORY 103:45 | The Others – a Missing 411 Account | STORY 110:48 | Logan's Stinger – The people burger shortage 116:12 | Stinger Signups and new Bitcoin Donation Option 118:35 | Patron & Members Thank Yous!!

At 9 years old, Robbie heard about the prospect of closing or limiting access to our national parks, and wanted to be sure his and other kids' concerns were heard. He started speaking out, and subsequently founded the organization Kids Speak for Parks, which has been a fantastic vehicle for his message since 2017.    Robbie Bond's work to speak out on behalf of national parks caught the eye of Rose Marcario, former CEO of Patagonia. Rose was recently nominated as the recipient of the 2021 Murie Spirit of Conservation Awards, an annual tradition at Teton Science Schools in Jackson, WY. The award is named for early conservation activist Mardy Murie, whose efforts contributed to the signing of the Wilderness Act of 1964. Rose has been a staunch advocate for the business sector to be a solution, rather than a problem, for our worlds' conservation needs. The awardee has the honor of naming a rising leader in the conservation movement, and Rose named Robbie as the 2021 Murie Spirit of Conservation Rising Leader.   The Murie Spirit of Conservation Rising Leader Award is among a growing list of accolades and honors the young advocate holds, making him an inspiration to young people of all ages to take meaningful action to address the worsening climate change crisis. He's such an inspiration he's even been part of the Disney+ show Marvel's Hero Project, through which inspiring kids are highlighted as heroes who try to make change in their communities and empower other children.   Bond will receive his award in a virtual event on September 9 in Grand Teton National Park. Marcario will also be honored at the same event, with the school's Spirit of Conservation Award.   Follow Robbie on Instagram or FaceBook to keep up with his incredible journey.    Thank you for your time, Robbie!

On this day in 1964, US President Lyndon B. Johnson signed into law the Wilderness Act. Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.com

Sigurd Olson is kind of a hero around here. From his work to establish the Boundary Waters and Voyageurs National Park, helping draft the Wilderness Act of 1962, to the founding of the Sigurd Olson Environmental Institute and his teaching at what is now Vermilion Community College, Olson influenced the world with his writing and activism on behalf of the natural world.

About Southern Utah Wilderness Alliance's Terri Martin, Intermountain West Organizer, Clayton Daughenbaugh, Organizing Director & Midwest Field Organizer, and Rewilding's Wildlands Coordinator Kim Crumbo discuss the opportunity to make a huge impact in the 30×30 effort by finally passing America's Red Rock Wilderness Act. New peer reviewed research shows that America's Red Rock Wilderness Act […] Read full article: Episode 75: Passing America's Red Rock Wilderness Act

U.S. National Forest Ranger, Katy Nelson, joins the Non-Standard 14er Podcast in this episode to talk about the permit system at Conundrum Hot Springs, Leave No Trace, bear bags, overcrowding, and life in the White River National Forest.  Katy is the Wilderness and Trails Specialist in the Aspen-Sopris Ranger District of Colorado.  We got to learn about the data of 3 years of Conundrum Hot Springs permits and hear about the Wilderness Act which requires the mandate to provide “outstanding opportunities for solitude.”

"People & Plants on the Move, Together" feat. Zach Elfers Zach Elfers was raised in the piedmont of the mid-Atlantic but has travelled widely around the lower 48. He is a student of the plants who has learned from mentors, elders, and most importantly, from living outside spending as much time as possible with the more-than-human world. His areas of interest include ancestral ways of subsisting, living, and knowing, and his work is focused on growing and promoting bioregional plants as food, medicine, and the foundations of our subsistence economies, rather than the imported and ecologically destructive colonial agriculture. In this episode, I am joined by co-host, Nikki Hill. Nikki has a degree in environmental science and has worked in restoration and agriculture. Currently she invests her energy in wildtending efforts. We co-authored a zine together called, "The Troubles of 'Invasive' Plants," which you can download for free at my blog: https://macskamoksha.com/2019/01/invasive-zine We discussed ecological concepts that are popular but flawed; the racist origins of anthropology; the forests of Laurasia and the Arcto-Tertiary Geoflora; prehistoric and pre-agricultural human relationships with edible plants; the Wilderness Act; anthropogenic fire; the question of whether fire is good or bad; disconnection from nature in mind and in reality; the conceit that science is absent of value judgments; and his nursery work. Future Forest Plants: https://www.futureforestplants.com/ Nomad Seed Project: https://www.nomadseed.com/ Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/heyzach Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/woodlandrambler/ Episode introduction music is "Mastermind 07" by DaveJF https://freesound.org/people/DaveJf/sounds/542200/ RADIO FREE SUNROOT: Podcasting by Kollibri terre Sonnenblume https://radiofreesunroot.com KOLLIBRI'S BLOG & BOOKSHOP: https://macskamoksha.com/ ONE-TIME DONATION: http://paypal.me/kollibri https://venmo.com/Kollibri KOLLIBRI'S PATREON: Get access to members-only content https://www.patreon.com/kollibri Support Voices for Nature & Peace by donating to their Tip Jar: https://tips.pinecast.com/jar/voices-for-nature-and-peace This podcast is powered by Pinecast. Try Pinecast for free, forever, no credit card required. If you decide to upgrade, use coupon code r-a50345 for 40% off for 4 months, and support Voices for Nature & Peace.

On this week's podcast, Bob talks with Jim Lockhart and John Stansfield who both represent local outdoor advocacy group Wild Connections, and also the Pikes Peak region's chapter of the Sierra Club. They discuss the Colorado Wilderness Act and the Colorado Outdoor Recreation and Economy Act, and get into what the legislation's will do, and their impact on outdoor recreation in Colorado. Also, some thoughts on the relocation of the Bureau of Land Management from Washington DC to Grand Junction, Colorado. Wild Connections: Wildconnections.org Colorado Outdoor Recreation and Economy Act: COREACT.org Colorado Wilderness Act: https://degette.house.gov/issues/protecting-colorado-s-wilderness Please consider becoming a patron of this podcast! Visit: https://www.patreon.com/hikingbob for more information. Hiking Bob on Facebook, Twitter, Instagram and website  www.hikingbob.com Wild Westendorf on Facebook, Twitter, Instagram, and website www.wildwestendorf.com Listen on Google Podcasts, Spotify and Apple Podcasts Subscribe on Android  

Wilderness 30x30 | A Wilderness Podcast miniseriesIn this episode, I speak with Terri Martin, Intermountain West Organizer with the Southern Utah Wilderness Alliance (SUWA). We talk about the founding of SUWA, how they have been successful in an anti-wilderness and anti federal lands environment, local control efforts undermining the public trust, new wilderness as part of the 30x30 campaign, Native American reception to wilderness in Utah, Bears Ears as a catalyst for 30x30, America’s Red Rock Wilderness Act, the spine of the continent, the importance of landscape connectivity, climate mitigation and refugia, SUWA’s monthly podcast and the measurable impacts that activism has on making a difference on the groundSupport the show (http://www.wildernesspodcast.com/support)

What role can America's Red Rock Wilderness Act play in achieving the Biden administrations goals of mitigating the climate crisis and protecting 30 percent of America's lands and waters by 2030? We dive deep into two recent scientific reports that provide an answer. Wild Utah is made possible by the contributing members of SUWA. Our theme music, “What’s Worth?” was written and performed in Moab by Haley Noel Austin.

In this episode I speak with Christopher Ketcham, author of This Land: How Cowboys, Capitalism and Corruption are Ruining the American West. We talk about Senate Bill 1695 which would amend the Wilderness Act to allow for mechanized recreation (mountain bikes) in designated Wilderness, the recreation industry's grip on self-professed environmental groups, the Wilderness Act and the ban on mechanization, impacts of mountain biking and other recreation on wildlife populations, allowing mountain bikes in Wilderness as a slippery slope, recreation capitalism, recreation as a distraction and cultural pacifier and fighting for wilderness values.This Land: How Cowboys, Capitalism & Corruption are Ruining the American WestSupport the show (http://www.wildernesspodcast.com/support)

Adam M. Sowards is professor of history at the University of Idaho and a leading environmental historian. His new book, An Open Pit Visible from the Moon: The Wilderness Act and the Fight to Protect Miners Ridge and the Public Interest (University of Oklahoma Press, 2020), builds on his recent biography of Supreme Court Justice William O. Douglas to describe what happened when a major copper corporation set out its plans to establish a massive mine in Washington state. With the Wilderness Act (1964) unable to protect this area of outstanding beauty, conservationists set out to apply moral rather than legal strategies of resistance. This excellent new book shows how ordinary citizens banded together to achieve what the law could not – and how market forces ultimately worked to save Miners Ridge. Crawford Gribben is a professor of history at Queen’s University Belfast. His research interests focus on the history of puritanism and evangelicalism, and he is the author most recently of John Owen and English Puritanism (Oxford University Press, 2016).  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Adam M. Sowards is professor of history at the University of Idaho and a leading environmental historian. His new book, An Open Pit Visible from the Moon: The Wilderness Act and the Fight to Protect Miners Ridge and the Public Interest (University of Oklahoma Press, 2020), builds on his recent biography of Supreme Court Justice William O. Douglas to describe what happened when a major copper corporation set out its plans to establish a massive mine in Washington state. With the Wilderness Act (1964) unable to protect this area of outstanding beauty, conservationists set out to apply moral rather than legal strategies of resistance. This excellent new book shows how ordinary citizens banded together to achieve what the law could not – and how market forces ultimately worked to save Miners Ridge. Crawford Gribben is a professor of history at Queen’s University Belfast. His research interests focus on the history of puritanism and evangelicalism, and he is the author most recently of John Owen and English Puritanism (Oxford University Press, 2016).  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Adam M. Sowards is professor of history at the University of Idaho and a leading environmental historian. His new book, An Open Pit Visible from the Moon: The Wilderness Act and the Fight to Protect Miners Ridge and the Public Interest (University of Oklahoma Press, 2020), builds on his recent biography of Supreme Court Justice William O. Douglas to describe what happened when a major copper corporation set out its plans to establish a massive mine in Washington state. With the Wilderness Act (1964) unable to protect this area of outstanding beauty, conservationists set out to apply moral rather than legal strategies of resistance. This excellent new book shows how ordinary citizens banded together to achieve what the law could not – and how market forces ultimately worked to save Miners Ridge. Crawford Gribben is a professor of history at Queen’s University Belfast. His research interests focus on the history of puritanism and evangelicalism, and he is the author most recently of John Owen and English Puritanism (Oxford University Press, 2016).  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Adam M. Sowards is professor of history at the University of Idaho and a leading environmental historian. His new book, An Open Pit Visible from the Moon: The Wilderness Act and the Fight to Protect Miners Ridge and the Public Interest (University of Oklahoma Press, 2020), builds on his recent biography of Supreme Court Justice William O. Douglas to describe what happened when a major copper corporation set out its plans to establish a massive mine in Washington state. With the Wilderness Act (1964) unable to protect this area of outstanding beauty, conservationists set out to apply moral rather than legal strategies of resistance. This excellent new book shows how ordinary citizens banded together to achieve what the law could not – and how market forces ultimately worked to save Miners Ridge. Crawford Gribben is a professor of history at Queen’s University Belfast. His research interests focus on the history of puritanism and evangelicalism, and he is the author most recently of John Owen and English Puritanism (Oxford University Press, 2016).  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Adam M. Sowards is professor of history at the University of Idaho and a leading environmental historian. His new book, An Open Pit Visible from the Moon: The Wilderness Act and the Fight to Protect Miners Ridge and the Public Interest (University of Oklahoma Press, 2020), builds on his recent biography of Supreme Court Justice William O. Douglas to describe what happened when a major copper corporation set out its plans to establish a massive mine in Washington state. With the Wilderness Act (1964) unable to protect this area of outstanding beauty, conservationists set out to apply moral rather than legal strategies of resistance. This excellent new book shows how ordinary citizens banded together to achieve what the law could not – and how market forces ultimately worked to save Miners Ridge. Crawford Gribben is a professor of history at Queen’s University Belfast. His research interests focus on the history of puritanism and evangelicalism, and he is the author most recently of John Owen and English Puritanism (Oxford University Press, 2016).  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

In this episode, we discuss George’s background, the greatest current threats to wilderness, practicing restraint as humans, impacts of recreation on wildlife, the value of wilderness beyond human use and enjoyment, sacrificing our enjoyment as recreationalists for the benefit of wilderness, the lesson(s) of wilderness, changing our relationship to the planet, the similarities in the message of the Wilderness Act and climate activists today, recreational demand in the Gallatin Range, the GYE as a special place where we can still protect wilderness on a grand scale, all about the work of Wilderness Watch, the Three Sisters permit system in Central Oregon, noise pollution and its health consequences, noise issues in wilderness, the impacts of livestock grazing in wilderness, retiring grazing permits and climate change and its impacts on wilderness areas. "Founded in 1989, Wilderness Watch is the leading national organization whose sole focus is the preservation and proper stewardship of lands and rivers included in the National Wilderness Preservation System (NWPS). The organization grew out of the concern that while much emphasis is being placed on adding new areas to these systems, the conditions of existing Wilderness and rivers are largely being ignored. We believe that the stewardship of these remarkable wild places must be assured through independent citizen oversight, education, and the continual monitoring of federal management activities." Support the show (http://www.wildernesspodcast.com/support)

 Summary: Today we cover Justin Amash's voting record, Canada shows America up again, Joe Biden responds to allegations, and coronavirus news. Follow us or subscribe on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Facebook, Twitter, or anywhere else you can think of! Sources on the Articles page. Hello and welcome to this Friday, May Day edition of Quick News Daily where we give you the news, no fluff, no filler, just news made for 21st century. Today, we have a whole North American show, well 2/3 of North America anyway. We have a news story from our superior neighbors to the north: Canada.But first, we’ll start with something that came up as a result of I think it was yesterday’s show? Maybe two days ago? In any case, I had my first experience with a troll on a YouTube video, which I would say means I’m doing something right because someone actually found my YouTube video. I hadn’t actually promoted it at all, so I suppose that’s good news on a personal front. But it’s also just an accomplishment to have a troll come after you. They were saying that only an idiot would say that they respect Justin Amash for his respect for the rule of law and then not vote for him, or something about Biden and Trump both being sexual predators, so that’s the type of troll we’re dealing with here. But then I came back with what I thought was a pretty good argument, so I’ll address it here. So for someone who thinks that they actually have a good candidate that they can vote for in Justin Amash instead of Biden or Trump, let’s just take a quick look at his voting record. Let’s see, the Emmett Till Antilynching Act: he was a no vote. That was a 410 to 4 vote. He was one for people who said no to a bill that would help stop lyching. Protecting America‘s Wilderness Act: no. Smithsonian Women’s History Museum Act: no, and that one was 374 to 37, so again another bipartisan one there. Lower Drug Costs Now Act: no. Voting Rights Advancement Act: no. Workplace Violence Prevention For Healthcare And Social Service Workers: no. Deborah Sampson Act (a bill that increases healthcare access for women veterans through the Department of Veterans Affairs), and guess what? You’re right: he was a no on that too. And last but not least, the Corporate Transparency Act: no. Folks, he has 30 pages of voting records and that was just through page 2. Everything I just listed was through the end of page 2 of 30, so that should give you a pretty good snapshot into what Justin Amash believes deep down. He’s Republican hiding as a Libertarian; he’s voted with them for almost everything except for when he grew a conscience on one issue: impeachment. The troll also said they want to see real change and that Biden wouldn’t do it, and I snapped back and said I won’t change for the 2020s; I don’t wanna go changing back to the 1920s when you can lynch people, when drug costs are high, workplace violence is high, women and veterans don’t have as good of access to healthcare, there is less corporate transparency, voting rights again set back. That’s actual stuff that the bills would have helped to prevent, and he voted no on all of them. Basically, Justin Amash: not really a great guy when you dig deep down. Make no mistake about it, I’m not an Amash supporter. Alright, moving on here, I mentioned our neighbors to the north, and here they are: Canada has banned military grade assault weapons, and this is coming as a reaction to a shooting spree that killed 22 in April. That was like two weeks ago, maybe last week? Look how little time it took them to change their laws. Obviously, they probably don’t have a Second Amendment (which makes things very difficult to change for us), but at the same time you have some kid that shot up an elementary school and that still was not enough for us to change anything, so we should’ve known then (that no changes would be coming). But congratulations to Canada; again showing us up, doing what’s right.One of the bigger stories of the day was that Joe Biden had an interview with Mika on Morning Joe talking about Tara Reade allegations against him. The consensus that I was seeing seemed to be that it was a very powerful interview; must-see material, so I posted a couple links: one from CBS one and from NBC. The one from NBC I know for sure has the actual video of the full interview, so go check that out. One thing that I thought was interesting was yesterday when Donald Trump was asked about it, he said he was unaware of it but that Biden should respond. He also said “It could be false allegations. I know all about false accusations. I’ve been falsely charged numerous times. There is such a thing.” So I found it weird that the right-wingers were pushing this when Donald Trump has not much willingness to engage. I mean, why would he? You take one look at his past and yikes. He knows it’s smart not to engage, so it’s kind of strange to me that the right-wingers were talking about this so much since they usually take their marching orders from him. We’ll have to see how that plays out. As both a white guy and because I do feel pressure to not be hypocritical (since I went against Brett Kavanaugh so hard), I’m going to wait to jump into this one. But I will say, this is different than Kavanaugh because his situation was so obvious. The thing that put it over the top for me was those dang calendars.Like are you kidding me? Somehow these calendars miraculously appear after he was accused? Even if they were authentic, what was it supposed to say, “Rape Christine on Thursday”? Good lord. But anyway, I’m glad it’s getting covered now so we can sort this out by November. For our last story today, we end on some coronavirus news. Going back to a  story from earlier this week, today the FDA granted the emergency approval of the drug the Dr. Fauci was talking up so much earlier this week, so that’s good. In another face palm moment, those idiots yesterday in Michigan protesting and looking like they are a knock off army. And the sad thing is that that is the highest point in their lives. That’s the coolest they’ve ever felt. Ugh. Sickening, disgusting. But hey, at least they wouldn’t be able to do that anymore if they were in Canada because some of those weapons definitely looked military-grade. That’s all for today folks. Thanks for listening/reading! Check out our website while you’re here!

Here we stare down our present situation without flinching but with radical hope as Williams reminds us that love and beauty is felt in chaos and heartbreak. Healing is going beyond anger; It’s a process of eroding and evolving at once. We must let go of our certainty to come back into a place of communion and communication with each other and with the earth.  Terry Tempest Williams is a naturalist, environmentalist, and award-winning author. She is a member of the American Academy of Arts and Letters, and her work is widely taught and anthologized around the world. In 2014, on the 50th Anniversary of the Wilderness Act, Ms. Williams received the Sierra Club’s John Muir Award honoring a distinguished record of leadership in American conservation. She currently is the writer in residence at Harvard Divinity School and divides her time between Cambridge, Massachusetts and Castle Valley, Utah. She is the author of many books including: Refuge: An Unnatural History of Family and Place (Pantheon 1991), Red: Patience and Passion in the Desert (Vintage Books 2002), An Unspoken Hunger: Stories from the Field (Vintage Books 1995), Leap (Vintage 2001), Red: Patience and Passion in the Desert (Vintage Books 2002), The Open Space of Democracy (The Orion Society 2004), Finding Beauty in a Broken World (Pantheon 2008), When Women Were Birds (Sarah Crichton Books: Farrar, Straus and Giroux 2012), The Hour of Land: A Personal Topography of America’s National Parks (Sarah Crichton Books, Farrar, Straus and Giroux 2016), Erosion: Essays of Undoing (Sarah Crichton Books, Farrar, Straus and Giroux 2019) Interview Date: 12/13/2019   Tags: Terry Tempest Williams, erosion, Bears Ears National Monument, Grand Staircase-Escalante, coal production, fossil fuel industry, Diné Bikéyah, democracy, climate change, Grand Canyon, Weather Reports, Kit Jennings, Powder River Basin, Willie Grayeyes, Frontier Mormons, Tim DeChristopher, oil and gas leases, oil & gas leases, oil & gas leasing, oil and gas leasing, Dan Dixon Tempest, Hieronymus Bosch’s triptych of The Garden of Earthly Delights, Blake’s Tiger, tiger burning bright, Jonah Yellowman, Yeibichi dances, Castleton Tower Utah, anger, love, grief, Earth, certainty, Ecology/Nature/Environment, Meditation, Spirituality, Social Change/Politics, Personal Transformation, Peace/Nonviolence, Community

Here we stare down our present situation without flinching but with radical hope as Williams reminds us that love and beauty is felt in chaos and heartbreak. Healing is going beyond anger; It’s a process of eroding and evolving at once. We must let go of our certainty to come back into a place of communion and communication with each other and with the earth. Terry Tempest Williams is a naturalist, environmentalist, and award-winning author. She is a member of the American Academy of Arts and Letters, and her work is widely taught and anthologized around the world. In 2014, on the 50th Anniversary of the Wilderness Act, Ms. Williams received the Sierra Club’s John Muir Award honoring a distinguished record of leadership in American conservation. She currently is the writer in residence at Harvard Divinity School and divides her time between Cambridge, Massachusetts and Castle Valley, Utah. She is the author of many books including: Refuge: An Unnatural History of Family and Place (Pantheon 1991), Red: Patience and Passion in the Desert (Vintage Books 2002), An Unspoken Hunger: Stories from the Field (Vintage Books 1995), Leap (Vintage 2001), Red: Patience and Passion in the Desert (Vintage Books 2002), The Open Space of Democracy (The Orion Society 2004), Finding Beauty in a Broken World (Pantheon 2008), When Women Were Birds (Sarah Crichton Books: Farrar, Straus and Giroux 2012), The Hour of Land: A Personal Topography of America’s National Parks (Sarah Crichton Books, Farrar, Straus and Giroux 2016), Erosion: Essays of Undoing (Sarah Crichton Books, Farrar, Straus and Giroux 2019) Interview Date: 12/13/2019 Tags: Terry Tempest Williams, erosion, Bears Ears National Monument, Grand Staircase-Escalante, coal production, fossil fuel industry, Diné Bikéyah, democracy, climate change, Grand Canyon, Weather Reports, Kit Jennings, Powder River Basin, Willie Grayeyes, Frontier Mormons, Tim DeChristopher, oil and gas leases, oil & gas leases, oil & gas leasing, oil and gas leasing, Dan Dixon Tempest, Hieronymus Bosch’s triptych of The Garden of Earthly Delights, Blake’s Tiger, tiger burning bright, Jonah Yellowman, Yeibichi dances, Castleton Tower Utah, anger, love, grief, Earth, certainty, Ecology/Nature/Environment, Meditation, Spirituality, Social Change/Politics, Personal Transformation, Peace/Nonviolence, Community

Terry Tempest Williams is a naturalist, environmentalist, and award-winning author. She is a member of the American Academy of Arts and Letters, and her work is widely taught and anthologized around the world. On the 50th Anniversary of the Wilderness Act, Ms. Williams received the Sierra Club's John Muir Award honoring a distinguished record of leadership in American conservation. She currently is the writer in residence at Harvard Divinity School and divides her time between Cambridge, Massachusetts and Castle Valley, Utah. She is the author of many books including: Refuge: An Unnatural History of Family and Place (Pantheon 1991), Red: Patience and Passion in the Desert (Vintage Books 2002), An Unspoken Hunger: Stories from the Field (Vintage Books 1995), Leap (Vintage 2001), Red: Patience and Passion in the Desert (Vintage Books 2002), The Open Space of Democracy (The Orion Society 2004), Finding Beauty in a Broken World (Pantheon 2008), When Women Were Birds (Sarah Crichton Books: Farrar, Straus and Giroux 2012), The Hour of Land: A Personal Topography of America's National Parks (Sarah Crichton Books, Farrar, Straus and Giroux 2016), Erosion: Essays of Undoing (Sarah Crichton Books, Farrar, Straus and Giroux 2019)Interview Date: 12/13/2019         Tags: Terry Tempest Williams, erosion, public lands, oil and gas industry, coal industry, Bears Ears, seeing, Mormon, Mormonism, Creation Myths, Marie-Louise van Franz, Adam and Eve, Fazal Sheikh, State of Utah, gospel choir, Follow the Drinking Gourd, Big Dipper, Assault on American Lands, hidden violence, Nuclear bombs, uranium tailings, war games in the desert, coal and copper mines. Grand Staircase-Escalante, radioactive waste, President Donald J. Trump, Senator Orrin Hatch, Lamanites, Racism. Book of Mormon, Environmental racism is the outcome of bad stories, Ecology/Nature/Environment, Meditation, Spirituality, Social Change/Politics, Personal Transformation, Peace/Nonviolence, Community, Mythology

H.R. 5687 – Emergency Supplemental Appropriations for Disaster Relief and Puerto Rico Disaster Tax Relief Act, 2020 (Rep. Lowey – Appropriations) H.R. 3830 – Taxpayer Right-to-Know Act, as amended (Rep. Walberg – Oversight and Reform) H.R. 2474 – Protecting the Right to Organize Act of 2019 (Rep. Scott (VA) – Education and Labor) (Subject to a Rule) S. 394 – Presidential Transition Act Enhancement Act of 2019 (Sen. Johnson – Oversight and Reform) H.R. 1494 – Historically Black Colleges and Universities (HBCUs) Homeland Security Partnerships Act, as amended (Rep. Thompson (MS) – Homeland Security) S. 2107 – Protecting America’s Food and Agriculture Act of 2019 (Sen. Peters – Homeland Security) H.R. 5273 – Securing America’s Ports Act (Rep. Torres Small – Homeland Security) H.R. 3413 – DHS Acquisition Reform Act of 2019 (Rep. Crenshaw – Homeland Security) H.R. 504 – DHS Field Engagement Accountability Act, as amended (Rep. Bacon –   Homeland Security) H.R. 2932 – Homeland Security for Children Act, as amended (Rep. Payne – Homeland Security) H.R. 4737 – Department of Homeland Security Climate Change Research Act, as amended (Rep. Clarke – Homeland Security) H.R. 4432 – Protecting Critical Infrastructure Against Drones and Emerging Threats Act (Rep. Richmond – Homeland Security) H.R. 4753 – Drone Origin Security Enhancement Act (Rep. Crenshaw – Homeland Security) H.R. 2546 – Protecting America’s Wilderness Act of 2019 (Rep. DeGette – Natural Resources) (Subject to a Rule) H.J.Res. 79 – Removing the deadline for the ratification of the equal rights amendment (Rep. Speier – Judiciary) (Subject to a Rule) H.R. 1980 – Smithsonian Women’s History Museum Act (Rep. Carolyn Maloney – House Administration) S.J. Res. 68 (To direct the removal of United States Armed Forces from hostilities against the Islamic Republic of Iran that have not been authorized by Congress).  Support the show.

Rep. Bishop referenced Earl Weaver while on the floor of the House… He’s been making reference to Earl for years. Bishop comes on the show to talk about the Hall of Fame Major League manager.

Rep. Rob Bishop spoke on the U.S. House Floor against H.R. 2546 Colorado Wilderness Act of 2019, also known as the Protecting America’s Wilderness Act. Lee shares audio on Rep. Bishop's thoughts against the resolution. 

David Ross Brower (July 1, 1912- November 5, 2000) is considered by many to be the father of the modern environmental movement. Beginning his career as a world-class mountaineer with more than 70 first ascents to his credit, he became the first executive director of the Sierra Club in 1952 and successfully fought to stop dams in Dinosaur National Monument and in Grand Canyon National Park. He led campaigns to establish 10 new national parks and seashores, including Point Reyes, the North Cascades and the Redwoods, and was instrumental in gaining passage of the Wilderness Act of 1964, which protects millions of acres of public lands in pristine condition.He delivered his speech at the 12th Annual E.F. Schumacher Lectures in October 1992.If you would like a physical copy of this lecture or others like it, visit centerforneweconomics.org/order-pamphlets to purchase pamphlets of published works and transcripts.The Schumacher Center's applied work seeks to implement the principles described by these speakers within the context of the Berkshire hills of Massachusetts. Our work, both educational and applied, is supported by listeners like you. You can strengthen our mission by making a donation at centerforneweconomics.org/donate, or call us at (413) 528-1737 to make an appointment to visit our research library and office at 140 Jug End Road, Great Barrington, Massachusetts.

With over 420 sites in the NPS, every month offers a new opportunity to Find Your Park. And while we strive to focus on the stories that make these places so special, we also think keeping up-to-date can be useful to support and celebrate these special places. With that in mind, we’re rolling out a new series called "News from the Parks." The last episode of each month we’ll take a look at what is coming down the pipeline and some of the bigger news to come out of the National Park Service in the previous weeks.  On this episode, a potential new National Park, grants to dozens of historic sites, new park superintendents, the anniversary of the Wilderness Act and more.

Welcome to Foot Stuff Podcast episode 75!'The Wilderness Act' In todays episode as usual we discuss some Foot Stuff, talk about some recent news stories, and then we take a deep dive into the Wilderness Act on its 55th anniversary!We hope you enjoy, thanks for listening. www.footstuffpodcast.com

Wilderness Areas and the BWCAW In this eighth episode of the Modern Carnivore Podcast I take a trip to the Boundary Waters Canoe Area Wilderness ( BWCAW ) with a great group of guys to go hunting and fishing. That group included Miles Nolte from Gray's Sporting Journal (but he's now a member of the crew at Meat Eater), Lukas Leaf from Sportsmen For The Boundary Waters, Rob Drieslein who is the President of Outdoor News and Jack Hennessy who is an outdoor writer and wild game cook. I also focus on Wilderness (with a capitol "W") and specifically the threats to public lands and waters like the BWCAW. The Modern Carnivore Podcast is talking BWCAW grouse hunting and fishing #grouse #fishingClick To Tweet Why Listen to The Modern Carnivore Podcast? With all the podcasts out there why would you want to listen to this one? Well, if you're looking for a new adventure in the outdoors we've got some very interesting guests talking about topics related to honest food and wild adventures. Get ready to be entertained and enlightened on topics related to hunting, fishing, foraging...and more. Here are a couple other podcasts you may be interested in: Episode 7: Chronic Wasting Disease in Deer Episode 6: Tom Landwehr, former Commissioner of MN Department of Natural Resources talking deer camp. Have a question you'd like answered, or have an idea for the Podcast? Shoot us a note at info@modcarn.com. Subscribe to the Modern Carnivore Podcast on iTunes, Stitcher, Spotify and Podbean. Please support the podcast by giving us honest feedback on iTunes or wherever you listen to the podcast. And if you do like it, don't forget to tell your friends about it! The Modern Carnivore Podcast is talking BWCAW grouse hunting and fishing #grouse #fishingClick To Tweet Transcript Of Podcast Podcast: Wilderness Areas and BWCAW Intro:   00:08                Welcome to the Modern Carnivore Podcast. A guide for those interested in hearing more about fishing and other paths to eating more responsibly. Now here's your host, Mark Norquist. Mark:   00:23      Hey everyone. Welcome to episode number eight of Modern Carnivore Podcast. Mark:   00:30       Today we're going to talk about Wilderness areas. And more specifically, we're going to take you to the Boundary Waters Canoe Area Wilderness, which is the most threatened Wilderness in the U.S. So before we get into that, let's do a little background on what we mean by wilderness with a capital w. The Wilderness Act was signed into law by President Lyndon B Johnson in 1964 and it created the National Wilderness Preservation System and it also put a legal definition around the term Wilderness. One of the primary authors of this act, Howard Zahniser, uh, defined it this way, "A Wilderness, in contrast with those areas where man and his own works dominate the landscape is hereby recognized as an area where the earth and its community of life are untrammeled by man, where man himself is a visitor who does not remain. BWCAW Hunting and Fishing Mark:   01:43             It's really protective overlay that's applied to certain areas in our country; certain areas of public lands. They could be national forest parks, wildlife refuges, any number of different places. Um, one of the criticisms that has been made in the past about it is the reference to quote man himself as is a visitor who does not remain. But I think that's the critical element of it and why it is really unique. So if you think about it, there are very few places where there are no buildings, no roads, no machines, and the only really semi-permanent structures I can think of would be these throne toilets. Basically a seat to sit on and do your business and the fire grades to control where you, where you do fires. And that's specific to the Boundary Waters where we're at today. And I think that's a pretty special thing in something that is, that is needed in this world. Mark:   02:52      

Dave Willms, Mike McGrady, and Nephi Cole visit with author and TV personality Steven Rinella, host of the MeatEater TV show and podcast, from his home in Seattle.  In this episode, the guys tackle who knows the most about dinosaurs, the best parts of a sage-grouse, history of the Wilderness Act, permitting for filming in Wilderness areas, Dave's propensity for short-range shooting, the future of MeatEater, whether hunting is a fundamental right or a privilege, and Steve's podcast tour.   Hunting, Fishing, Recreation, Wilderness, Outdoors, and Public Land Law and Policy Show notes: coming soon at http://www.itsyourmountain.com/podcast/ 

Permanently protecting an area through the Wilderness Act is a big task, but the work doesn’t stop once an area has been designated as Wilderness. In this episode, learn about all the work ICL engages in to continue to protect the land you love.

Wilderness is a fundamental part of the American land preservation equation. First designated by the U.S. Forest Service in 1924, and later formally established by the 1964 Wilderness Act, America’s 764 federally-designated Wilderness areas represent almost 110 million acres (an area roughly the size of California) of permanently protected roadless land. In this inaugural episode of Topophilia, we dig into two questions about wilderness. First: how do the boundaries around wilderness areas actually get drawn? Will tells the story of the Maroon Bells Snowmass Wilderness, and we speak with Dr. Kevin Marsh, professor of environmental history at Idaho State University and author of Drawing Lines in the Forest, about Washington’s Alpine Lakes Wilderness, and make some interesting discoveries about the role of grassroots community movements in creating wilderness areas. We also seek to determine the place of wilderness designation in our current and future political climates. We chat with Ben Greuel, Washington State Program Director for the Wilderness Society, to get at this question. To highlight the rich history of Wilderness designation in the United States, we have created this accompanying interactive data graphic, embedded here below. Click here for a full-page version. We have many people to thank for helping with this episode, especially: Ben Greuel and Dr. Kevin Marsh for their time, knowledge, and willingness to talk; our many friend-editors who endured drafts and gave great feedback; our respective housemates Liz, Sarah, Paul, Max, and Granite for being quiet while we recorded things, and the makers of Rainier for fueling our late-night recording sessions. Music in this episode courtesy of Broke For Free, Latché Swing, and freemusicarchive.org. Additional sound effects from ZapSplat.

Today, listener mailbag, then I break down IMBA's puzzling decision to submit testimony opposing the amendment to the Wilderness Act, HR 1349, which would allow bikes in areas designated as wilderness.   Text of bill Sustainable Trail Coalition IMBA's Q and A on their opposition testimony Subscribe on iTunes!

As part one of a three part series about Mountain Bikes in US Wilderness Areas we begin with a history lesson. Starting from the beginning, in 1964 when the Wilderness Act was signed moving to how it’s effected local trail associations today. We’ll hear from Yvonne Kraus, Executive Director of the Evergreen Mountain Bike Alliance … Continue reading "Ep 25 – Bikes In Wilderness Part 1: Your Introduction to the Topic"

Steven Rinella talks with Dr. Karl Malcolm, Bjorn Fredrickson, and Jerry Monzingo of the U.S. Forest Service, along with Janis Putelis of the MeatEater crew.  Subjects Discussed: The National Wild and Scenic Rivers Systems; the Cascades as a nexus for the climbing world; Karl's unlikely cure for not drawing an elk tag; the many homes of Aldo Leopold; Curt Meine's Aldo Leopold: His Life and Work; Howard Zahniser and the Wilderness Act; the societal challenges of Wilderness; dudes who just love a good conspiracy theory; Wilderness as a part of the American identity; Frederick Jackson Turner; Frontier Anxiety; helicopters in Wilderness and the "Minimum Requirements Necessary" concept; does Wilderness need to justify itself financially?; Ben Lilly and other rogue wildmen of the Southwest; and more. Get your tickets to the MeatEater Podcast, Live with Steven Rinella and Friends here. Join Steven Rinella and a couple surprise guests for a live recording of his popular MeatEater Podcast. Tickets for a raffle, with high-end prizes from Yeti, Vortex Optics, First Lite, Stone Glacier, Savage Arms, Benchmade Knife Company, Schnee’s and Seek Outside, will be sold at the event. Raffle proceeds benefit Backcountry Hunters and Anglers. Raffle winners will be drawn following the podcast recording and Steven will be on hand signing books. Check out the show notes to dig deeper into the books, ideas, and stories mentioned in this episode here.

Terry Tempest Williams is a naturalist, environmentalist, and award-winning author. In 2014, on the 50th Anniversary of the Wilderness Act, Ms. Williams received the Sierra Club's John Muir Award honoring a distinguished record of leadership in American conservation. She is currently the Annie Clark Tanner Scholar in Environmental Humanities at the University of Utah.Tags: Terry Tempest Williams, National Parks, sacred lands, mountain lion, Big Bend National Park, Jackson Hole, Grand Teton National Park, Grizzly bear, wolves, Yellowstone, keystone species, public lands, public commons, Ecology, Nature, Environment, History, Social Change, Politics, Animals, Travel

Out of the dark of the Moon Dark of the Year Cauldron of despair, Coyote ladles out Bears Ears Triumphant, (still needing us all to protect what is sacred and precious). Sane Reverent Indigenuity Spiraling into the Memosphere. Hosting Bill Hedden and Terry Tempest Williams. Bill Hedden is Executive Director of the Grand Canyon Trust, under his leadership the organization has led in developing ecologically sensible forest restoration programs and is partnering with Colorado Plateau tribes to win designation of the first-ever Native American national monument at the Bears Ears in southeast Utah. The wild lands of our collective soul in Utah have assumed human form to come tell us its story. “Today, the Navajo, Hopi, Zuni, Uintah and Ouray Ute, and Ute Mountain Ute tribes have formally united to secure a presidential proclamation establishing a 1.9 million-acre Bears Ears National Monument… The five tribes of the Bears Ears Inter-Tribal Coalition have developed a visionary and workable plan for America's first national monument that will be collaboratively managed by the tribes and the federal government. Their proposal envisions a world-class center for the integration of Native American traditional knowledge and western science at Bears Ears. The Coalition's proposal has been favorably received by the White House and appointees in the Obama Administration at the departments of Interior and Agriculture.”  (From August 11, 2016 Interview) And now – Victory! Obama has designated Bears Ears as a national monument (Article from The Guardian). We will be interweaving with Terry Tempest Williams – author, activist, naturalist and fierce advocate for freedom of speech, she has consistently shown us how environmental issues are social issues that ultimately become matters of justice. “So here is my question,” she asks, “what might a different kind of power look like, feel like, and can power be redistributed equitably even beyond our own species?” In 2006, Williams received the Robert Marshall Award from The Wilderness Society, their highest honor given to an American citizen. She also received the Distinguished Achievement Award from the Western American Literature Association and the Wallace Stegner Award given by The Center for the American West. She is the recipient of a Lannan Literary Fellowship and a John Simon Guggenheim Fellowship in creative nonfiction. In 2009, Terry Tempest Williams was featured in Ken Burns' PBS series on the national parks. She is also the recipient of the 2010 David R. Brower Conservation Award for activism. The Community of Christ International Peace Award was presented in 2011 to Terry Tempest Williams in recognition of significant peacemaking vision, advocacy and action. In 2014, on the 50th Anniversary of the Wilderness Act, Ms. Williams received the Sierra Club's John Muir Award honoring a distinguished record of leadership in American conservation. · Bill Hedden www.GrandCanyonTrust.com · Terry Tempest Williams www.CoyoteClan.com   The post The Visionary Activist Show – Bears Ears Victory appeared first on KPFA.

June 29, 2016 Trail Cast Show Page ABOUT THE EPISODE Who manages Wilderness areas, and why? Since we, the local advocates, will have to establish relationships with these agencies if the Sustainable Trails Coalition is successful in their bid to change the Wilderness Act, we’ll need to understand who manages the land. A change in the Act could allow local managers to determine whether or not to allow bike access, so it’s more important than ever to be aware of who does what. This episode is a short primer on who and what these agencies are and what they do. Plus, Drew adds in a rant about who should and shouldn’t make changes to trails. If you or someone you know is in charge of trail projects or organizing work days for your group, Drew wants you to email him. Share your projects and when your work days are, and he’ll share that information in future episodes. If you have any questions, comments, or ideas for the next episode, contact us at info@mountainbikeradio.com.  ------------------ RELATED SHOW LINKS Wilderness Area Map Shop via our Amazon Affiliate Link Trail Cast on Facebook @cotharyus on Twitter @cotharyus on Instagram Read More about the host, Drew Email Drew Support Mountain Bike Radio

Great Old Broads for Wilderness began in 1989 on the 25th anniversary of the Wilderness Act by a feisty bunch of lady hikers who wanted to refute Utah Senator Orrin Hatch's notion that wilderness is inaccessible to elders. About that time, wilderness designation had been proposed for Escalante, and Senator Hatch opposed it, saying, “if for no other reason, we need roads for the aged and infirm.”

In 2014 the citizens of Idaho and Montana celebrated the 50th anniversary of the Wilderness Act – the law that secured protection for eight million acres of wild forests and mountains in these two states. In his new book (from University of Utah Press) “Where Roads Will Never Reach” environmental historian Frederick Swanson tells the story of how, decades before the Wilderness Act, ordinary citizens halted the federal government's resource development juggernaut of the 1950s and 1960s, safeguarding some of the last strongholds of grizzly bear, mountain goat, elk, trout, salmon and steelhead. Swanson says that from Idaho's Frank Church-River of No Return to Montana's Scapegoat and Great Bear, the wilderness areas of the Northern Rockies serve as a record of lasting public concern and as a model for citizens working to protect today's threatened landscapes.

The U.S. Wilderness Act turns 50 this year and we're digging into the wilderness area in our backyard: the Maroon Bells Snowmass Wilderness. First, we’ll look back on how the Maroon Bells Snowmass Wilderness became protected. A group of local women had a hand in it. The wilderness area near Aspen is one of the busiest in Colorado. The Forest Service says some areas are being loved to death. Another problem facing wilderness is private land smack-dab in the middle of these peaceful places. One local group is working to make wilderness more wild. (photo credit: Meredith Ogilby/Wilderness Workshop)

Airport Expansion, State of Emergency, Pipeline Hearing, Wind Farm, Pot Growing Factory, Changes On Track, Spawning Salmon, Stowaway Kitty, Railroads on Parade, 50th Anniversary of the Wilderness Act

In this inaugural show, author and historian, Doug Scott, talks about the origins of the ongoing movement to protect America's wilderness. Then producer Marci Krivonen explores one of the first wilderness areas protected by the Wilderness Act of 1964, the Maroon Bells/Snowmass Wilderness in Colorado. Marci joins Jamie Harrison and Kitty Winograd at the outset of a 14-mile day-hike, despite an ominous-looking sky and muddy trail, and along the way enjoys some of the local fauna and flora. Marci visits Connie Harvey and Joy Caudill. These women, along with the late Dottie Fox, are known as the "Maroon Belles," three women who began the work 50 years ago inspiring wilderness advocates to protect pristine places in western Colorado-including much of the Maroon Bells/Snowmass Wilderness. A wilderness designation unfortunately isn't enough to protect the most popular areas, like Conundrum Hot Springs. Wilderness rangers, Kevin Frazier and Tsipora Prochovnick, and ranger intern, Noah Teller, discuss some of the challenges of protecting high-use destinations. Every visitor can help them out by applying the seven principles of Leave No Trace. Marci wraps up her visit with the rest of the story about Jamie and Kitty's hike. Doug Scott's book is The Enduring Wilderness: Protecting Our Natural Heritage through the Wilderness Act. Additional music was Spring by the artist QQQ, and Silver Sliver by Podington_Bear, both from the Free Music Archive.

The Meaning of Wilderness (starts 4:30): Fifty years ago last week, President Lyndon Johnson signed into law the Wilderness Act. It was then, and remains today, one of the most significant pieces of environmental legislation. It has protected millions of acres of land. And it established a legal definition of wilderness: “an area where the earth and its community of life are untrammeled by man, where man himself is a visitor who does not remain.” Today, many are questioning what conversation should look like hardly a square inch of land around the world is truly "untrammeled." Co-host Susan Moran discusses wilderness then and now with Dr. M. Sanjayan, a senior scientist at Conservation International. He was a correspondent on the  Showtime series on climate change, called Years of Living Dangerously. His next  TV series, which will air next February, is called Earth -- A New Wild. Dr. Sanjayan will speak this Friday at 4 pm MT at Americas Latino Eco Festival. (www.americaslatinoecofestival.org) Living Underwater (starts 13:50): This segment continues our series, “The Ocean is Us,” exploring how we all, even in land-locked Colorado, are connected to the ocean, and what’s at stake. Co-host Susan Moran interviews Fabien Cousteau, grandson of Jacques-Yves Cousteau, the late oceanographic explorer who opened a window into the ocean for millions of people worldwide in the 1960s through his revolutionary scuba diving and underwater-living adventures. Fabien, an aquanaut, oceanographic explorer, and documentary filmmaker, discusses Mission 31, his recent 31-day underwater-living experiment (one day longer than Jacques-Yves' expedition a half century ago). All features in the "The Ocean Is Us"  series can be found here.  Also, check out KGNU’s year-long series on Colorado water issues. It’s called Connecting the Drops. It’s at kgnu.org and yourwatercolorado.org. To learn more or become active in preserving our watershed and the oceans, go to Colorado Ocean Coalition. Executive Producer: Joel Parker Producer: Ted Burnham Co-hosts: Susan Moran, Ted Burnham Engineer: Ted Burnham Additional Contributions: Jane Palmer, Beth Bennett Listen to the show:

Noting the 50th anniversary of the Wilderness Act, pondering The Washington Post experiment with violinist Joshua Bell, mourning Robin Williams and Joan Rivers, reflecting on community theater productions of Shrek the Musical and Into the Woods, fairy tales, and Sir … Continue reading → The post UMTRAMMELED SPIRITS—AS WE MOURN OUR CLOWNS: first appeared on Dr. Barbara Mossberg » Poetry Slowdown.

30 Minutes commemorates 50 Years of the Wilderness Act, which was signed into law in September 1964. A new exhibit…

with Brad Friedman & Desi Doyen

with Brad Friedman & Desi Doyen

Guest Tom Uniack, Conservation Director, Washington Wild, speaks with Diane Horn about the 1964 Wilderness Act and the benefits both nationwide and for Washington State.

We recap this year's Pickathon action, and meet one of the artists at a show in the Gorge, marking the 50th anniversary of the Wilderness Act: all it's meant to Oregon's wild places and artists inspired by them.