Podcasts about asians

A weekly magazine-style radio show featuring the voices and stories of Asians and Pacific Islanders from all corners of our community. The show is produced by a collective of media makers, deejays, and activists. Important Links We Belong Here campaign page We Belong Here Partner organizations: Asian Law Caucus |Asian Refugees United | Hmong Innovating Politics | Hmong Family Association of Lansing | Rising Voices Transcript Nina Phillips: Hello and welcome. You are tuning into APEX Express, a weekly radio show uplifting the voices and stories of Asian Americans. I'm your host Nina Phillips, and tonight we are doing something a little different. Earlier this month on Monday, November 3rd, communities of Hmong and Nepali speaking, Bhutanese Americans, fellow immigrants and allies, gathered together at a virtual [00:01:00] community event called We Belong Here. The goal: to shed light on the continued detainment and deportation of immigrant communities in the United States and the specific challenges faced by Bhutanese, Hmong, and Southeast Asian folks.  Tika Basnet: When, uh, my husband got detained on April 8, I took one week after to reach out Aisa and she told me, Hey Tika, come forward, you know, your story is powerful. People need to know your story.  Nina Phillips: That was the voice of Tika Basnet. Her husband, Mohan Karki is a Nepali speaking Bhutanese refugee from Ohio who has spent months in ICE detention, trapped in legal limbo. Tika has been working tirelessly to bring her husband home and shared her story with us at We Belong Here. Tonight, we are bringing you a recording of this virtual community gathering. You'll hear more from Tika about the Free Mohan Karki campaign and from Ann Vue, [00:02:00] the spouse of Lue Yang, a Hmong community leader from Michigan, who is also currently detained and facing deportation. Ann is leading the movement to Bring Lue Home, and we'll be sharing more later about how you can get involved as well and support both of these campaigns. You will also hear from state representatives of Michigan and Ohio, the music and spoken word performance of Asian Refugees United, and community tools and resources that a vital in helping to keep our immigrant loved ones safe. The host of this community event was Miko Lee, APEX producer, and a voice that you might be familiar with. Alrighty, without further ado, here's Miko. Miko Lee: We belong here. What we recognize right now is there's almost. 60,000 people being held in detention right now, immigrants that are being held in detention. It is a pandemic that is happening in our country that's impacting all of our people, and we need [00:03:00] to be able to take action. Tonight we're talking very specifically, not with this 60,000 people that are in detention now, but just two of those stories, so that you can get a sense of what is happening in the Bhutanese and Hmong communities and what's happening right now, and to talk about those particular stories and some actions you can take. First I wanna recognize that right now we are on native lands, so all of us except our original indigenous people, are from other places and I'd invite you to go into the chat and find your native land. I am speaking with you from the unceded Ohlone land, and I wanna honor these ancestors, these elders that have provided for us and provided this beautiful land for us to be on. So I invite you to share into the chat your name, your pronoun, and also what indigenous land you are living on right now in this Native American Heritage Month. Thank you so much to all of you that have joined [00:04:00] us. We are really seeing the impact of this administration on all of our peoples, and particularly tonight in terms of the Hmong and Nepali speaking, Bhutanese communities. These are communities that have been impacted, specifically refugee communities that have been impacted in incredible detrimental ways by this administration. And tonight what we really wanna do is talk to you about what is going on in our communities. We wanted to make sure we translated so that we have as much access into our communities as possible because we wanna be as inclusive of our world as we can. We Belong Here is focusing on the fact that all of us belong here. We belong in this land, and we are telling these stories tonight in the context of these sets of people particularly that have so many similarities in terms of Hmong folks who worked with our US government and worked with our US military during the Vietnam War and then came [00:05:00] here as refugees and stayed in this country to the Nepali speaking Bhutanese folks, who left their country from ethnic cleansing and then went into refugee camps and now took refuge in the United States. So these are all stories that are impactful and powerful, and it's really what it means to be American. we have come from different places. We see these attacks on our people. right now I would like to bring to the fore two empowering women, refugees themselves. Hailing from places as different as Somalia and Southeast Asia, and they're gonna talk about some of the detention and deportations that are happening right now. First I'd like to focus on Rep Mai Xiong, who's from Michigan's 13th District. I hand it over to the representative.  Rep. Mai Xiong: Good evening everyone. I'm state representative,  Mai Xiong, and it is a pleasure to meet all of you virtually. I'm coming to you from Warren, Macomb County, Michigan, and I represent the 13th [00:06:00] house of district, uh, the communities of Warren Roseville and St. Claire Shores. I've lived here in Michigan for over 20 years now. I came to the United States at a very young age, was born in a refugee camp and came here when I was three years old. So I grew up in Ohio. And then I moved to Michigan to attend college. Never thought that I would ever be serving in the State House. I previously served as a county commissioner here in Macomb. And, uh, last year when President Trump got elected, I had very quiet fears that as a naturalized citizen, that even I did not feel safe given the, um. The failure in our immigration system. So we have seen that play out, uh, with this administration, with the, attempts to get rid of birthright citizenship de-naturalization. And, you hear the rhetoric from officials about, deporting the worst of the worst criminal, illegal aliens. And we [00:07:00] know, as Miko mentioned in, in her introduction, that, refugees came here through a legal pathway. The Hmong in particular served alongside America during the Vietnam War and were persecuted from Laos. So my parents fled Laos. And so growing up I didn't have, uh, citizenship. Um, and so we have seen, uh, in this administration that refugees are now caught up in this, immigration effort to get rid of people who came here through legal pathways Lue is a father. He is a community leader. Uh, he is a well-respected member of our community as all of these individuals are. And at some point our system failed them and we are working extremely hard, to get their stories out. But what I have found with many of these families is that they are, uh, afraid to come forward. They are ashamed. There is a stigma involved and, uh, culturally, as many of you may [00:08:00] know, if you are of Asian American descent, and a fear of, uh, retaliation. And as the only Hmong American elected here in Michigan, I'm grateful that I have, uh, the ability to.  have those connections and to be such a visible, uh, member of my community that many of these individuals. Felt comfortable enough to reach out to me. But the reality is back in July we didn't know anything other than, the number of people who were detained. And that was through a firsthand account from loved ones who you know, were accompanying their loved one and got detained. And so it was literally like trying to find missing people and then getting the word out to let them know that, hey, there's actually, there's help out there. The volunteer attorneys, the nonprofits, the Immigration Rights Center, uh, here in Michigan, I mean, everybody has been doing a phenomenal job because I think the majority, the vast majority of Americans understand that, um, these [00:09:00] individuals that are being taken out of our communities are not a, a threat to society. They are members of our community. They've lived here for decades. They have jobs, they have children. And when you when you take an individual out of our community, it actually does more harm then it does to make any one of us safe. So that's the message that I have been sharing with others, uh, not only in having a connection and being a refugee just like these individuals, but advocating for them and making it clear that these are our neighbors, these are our children's classmates, parents, and it doesn't make any one of us feel safer. One of the things I am. Upset about that I continue to talk about is that we're not actually in a immigration crisis. We share here in Michigan, we share an international border with Canada, and we have never had an issue with border security. The [00:10:00] problem is the policies that have been put in place, that these individuals have been caught up in our immigration system for decades, and it is extremely hard for them to obtain citizenship or to even know what their rights are. And so we really need, in addition to advocating for these families, we need immigration reform. Throwing money at a problem is not going to solve the problem. If anything, we have are, we are in an economic crisis. Miko Lee: Thank you so much for joining. Um, I'd love to turn the baton over to another one of our powerful women representatives, Rep. Munira Abdullah from Ohio's Ninth District. Rep Abdullah. We pass it over to you. Thank you so much.  Rep. Munira Abdullahi: Uh, thank you for having me and also Rep Mai Xiong, it is really great to see you. I'm grateful to have been able to see you go from Commissioner to State Rep, doing amazing things on social media as well. I'm very, a big fan. Uh, my name is Munira Abdullahi. I represent District Nine in Ohio, which is in the Columbus area. Northland, [00:11:00] uh, Manette Park. Uh, a little bit of New Albany in Westerville city schools. Um, I'm also a refugee. My family fled Somalia and Civil War, and I was born in refugee camp in Kenya. And then we came to the United States when I was about two, three years old, uh, and ended up moving to Ohio when I was like four. First moved to Utah, salt Lake City, Utah, and then to Ohio when I was about five years old. And so I certainly understand the fear of being an immigrant in a new country and, um, struggling to belong and figure out where are your place is. And, and also just adjusting to a whole new society, um, with the language barriers and, and all of the the barriers are in the way. And then that fear of, your immigration status. You know, before my parents were, you know, passed their, their, uh, citizenship test, right. It was very scary. Um, and I know many families who feel the same way right now, especially with this new administration. Um, with the OCE raids that are happening that are really disrupting our communities and our [00:12:00] families. Um, we have a, a, a cons, a constituent of mine, um, who is now, uh, in prison. We have, uh, have a couple actually. One is Leonardo Faso, and then I know one we're gonna talk about soon is Mohan Karki, who is his family, I believe, is on this call. Uh, and he was taken by ICE. And he's, uh, you know, the, the breadwinner and the, the caregiver of his family. And so it's really important not to forget that a lot of these people who are being taken by ICE are like the breadwinners and, and, and the caretakers of these families. And now the family's left with a hole, uh, in their, in their home. And so, we really need to remember to take care of these families. I know there's gonna be a GoFundMe that that will be shared. Um, but finding these families and supporting them. Um, in any way that we can monetary, you know, checking on them, giving, you know, helping them with food. Now we have SNAP benefits are being cut for many, many, many Americans. We are struggling as is, but immigrants in particular are struggling a lot, lot more, um, with these raids and, and with the uncertainties. But one thing I wanna remind everyone is that, you know, through community we [00:13:00] find strength. And so that, um, understanding, you know, where our communities are, where people are suffering and finding our place and helping with that, right? Whether that might, might be, uh, maybe we have the financial capabilities to, to support, maybe we can cook for someone. Um, maybe we can advocate where, where we have the ability to advocate. Whatever we can do, we have a responsibility to do it. Um, and there are successes. I know in Ohio it's a little different where we can't really advocate anything on the state level because it's like they, we just make things worse. We're in a very rough, super minority, the Democrats and super minority, and we have bills in the State House we're trying to fight against that are trying to make it worse, where we're trying to get rid of Republicans in the State House are trying to get rid of like a sanctuary cities, um, and penalize cities that don't engage, uh, or don't cooperate with ICE. Um, we have currently a bill, which actually this is, this might be more of a, on a positive note, is we had a bill house bill one. That sought to ban immigrants, certain immigrants from owning land in certain areas. [00:14:00] But because of community engagement, because of advocacy, because of collaboration with community advocacy groups, that Bill was effectively paused. Like, as of now, it's paused because people came and advocated. They spoke to their representatives, they testified, they called, they protested, um, they had press conferences. They brought so much attention to the bill, and it just became so. Obvious that people don't want this bill. And that pressure really got to the majority in the State House. And that bill has been paused, right? It was created to keep Chinese Americans from buying land specifically. Um, and that list can change, by the way. It's an, it's a, a rotating list. The Secretary of State can add whatever countries that they want to, that list, so it's very harmful. But the Asian American community came together alongside with us representatives in the State House and, and effectively like paused that bill. So there's there are positive things we could, we could achieve as a community when we fight together and communicate and stand with one another regardless of our nationality. We're all struggling here. We're [00:15:00] all in the same place. We're all, uh, in need of one another. And that's why I was reminding people was like, when we are in need of one another. And when one person is struggling, we should all be feeling that.  Miko Lee: Thank you  Rep Munira. Thank you so much for joining us. And yes, we are all part of a collective community that needs to be working together. And Rep Munira talked about Mohan Karki and next we're gonna see a short video performance that was created by Asian refugees United, uh, Maxine Hong Kingston said, “in a time of destruction, create something”. So we're gonna watch this video that was created. Uh, it's a shortcut of a performance by Asian Refugees United. Nina Phillips: Hello, it's APEX Express host Nina Phillips here chiming in with a couple words on this performance. It's a very music and spoken word forward piece, so you should get a good sense of the production through just the audio. The youth performers from Asian Refugees United do a wonderful job of embodying the story of Mohan Karki and his family through music and [00:16:00] movement and dance as well. Very evocative. If you'd like to see this short video clip in full, with the visuals, please visit the website of Asian Americans for Civil Rights and Equality. That's accre.org/our-voices/webelonghere.  Enjoy the show. ARU Performer: Mohan Karki, I was detained by an ICE officer to be deported to a country that I never been to. A country. That I don't belong to [00:17:00] a country I wasn't born to, that I don't speak the language of. When they moved me to a detention center in Michigan, I called my wife Tika. They're taking me, I told her my voice was calm, but inside I was breaking into a million pieces. It felt like a goodbye, not just to her, but to the life we built together to the dreams that we planted seeds for. I was just 17 years old when I decided who I was before I could even speak up for myself. I stand here as a victim of an unjust system that never gave me a chance.[00:18:00]  I am a man with purpose. I worked hard. I drove trucks. I supported my family, and I loved my wife Tika, and waited for the day that I would finally meet our baby. [Speaks in Nepali] How do I tell my daughter that leaving her was never my choice? Now I wait for the news. Now would completely change everything. Will they send me back to Bhutan? Will I be deported like the ones before me? No one talks about what happens to us [00:19:00] once we're gone. We vanish. Into silence. Where do I belong?  You belong here. They belong here. We belong here. [Singing in Nepali] [Speaks in Nepali] What type of future do we wanna build? A future where we can all belong? A future where we can coexist, [00:20:00] coexist in nature. And coexist with each other. A future where another Mohan Karki does not have to fear of being displaced all over again. A future where Mohan Karki does not have to be separated from his new born baby girl. A place where people like Mohan Carkey can have home, a future and community, a future with family, a future and harmony. A future to heal. A future to grow. Above all, a future to belong. I hope the future is more generous to all of us. [Singing in [00:21:00] Nepali] Miko Lee: Can you all give it up in the chat for those performers. Nawal was our interpreter at the very beginning of this, and to show the power of how art can transform things at that performance, the ACLU was there. And actually because of that, we were able to find a pro bono lawyer to be able to help with one of, uh, Mohans Habeas Corpuses cases and just that's an example of Asian refugees United, that was their work before all of these detentions were going on. It was youth empowerment and storytelling, but they had to pivot, given the shape of our world. I wanna transition us to our panel of speakers of powerful. Again, powerful women. [00:22:00] Um, Ann Vue who is the spouse of Lue Yang, Tika Bassett, who is the spouse of Mohan Karki and Aisa Villarosa, who has been our brilliant, dedicated lawyer from Asian Law Caucus working on this. So we're not gonna go over and tell the entire stories of each of these people and what happened to them. And if you want that, you can listen to the radio show that we did on APEX Express. Tika, I wanted to start with you and just hear from you, what is your response after watching that video about your husband? Tika Basnet: Yeah, it is really beautiful story. Um, thank you ARU for, um, representing my husband story. Um, it just make, make me cry and I was crying while watching the video and it remind me what happened. Since seven month ago. And, um, yeah. Hi, my name is Tika Basnet. I'm from Ohio and I've been fighting for my husband deportation and detention since seven month ago. Without the community and without all the [00:23:00] support that I got from organization, I don't think it is possible that my husband will still be here. And the reason that this is possible is because I reach out to them without getting fear, without getting afraid of what will happen if I speak outside. So, um, yeah, um, it is really difficult. What is going on right now. Sometime I don't wanna speak because of the current policy. Uh, it make me feel, even though I'm US citizen, um, sometime I feel like if I speak something against the policy, I, they will might, they might gonna take my citizenship away. And then, um, I realized that, if I speak then it'll help me. Right now, um, ICE is not letting my husband come home, even though it is been seven month and our attorney try everything in a possible way. Uh, the ICE is not letting my husband come out. I dunno how long it'll take. I don't know. don't wanna, yeah. Thank you.  Miko Lee: No, you can speak more. Tika. Do you wanna add?  Tika Basnet: Yeah, um, especially I wanna thank you [00:24:00] ARU and Aisa and Miko. Everything is happening right now is because of them, because I reached out to them. If I did not, I feel like my husband is story will be one of those Bhutanese people that disappear. I don't know what happened to them. I hope, uh, the reason that I'm fighting for my husband case is because he deserve fear. Uh, he has a family member here. He has a community that loves him. He was supporting his parent, he was supporting us. We don't have a country. Um, this is our country and we belong here. Thank you.  Miko Lee: You. Thank you, Tika. I wanna bring Ann Vue up to speak about your husband, Lue Yang and his case and what's going on with his case. Very complicated case. What is going on with his case right now?  Ann Vue: So first of all,  Thank you guys so much for. Giving Tika and I this space just to share our stories of families who are fighting every day, um, just to stay together. So [00:25:00] currently with Lue's case right now we are, we just got his, um, stay of removal approved the emergency stay of removal approved. I might, um, have the right lingo for that, but, uh, so as of October 22nd our Michigan governor's, pardon was issued for Lue. So we were so grateful for that. I know our, our Michigan lawmakers are working around the clock uh, Michigan DHS team to bring him back to Michigan, uh, where we have a petition currently filed for his release while his case, uh, is ongoing. Miko Lee: Thanks Ann. And I just wanna point out that there's in, even though these communities are distinct and these two men are distinct, beautiful individuals, there are so many commonalities between the two. Um, both born in refugee camps, both in one case, the Bhutanese, the Nepali speaking Bhutanese, folks having escaped ethnic cleansing to then go to a. Uh, [00:26:00] refugee camp to then come to the US and in another families who worked with the American government in the Secret War in Vietnam, who then again became refugees and came to the US. Two young men who when they were young, like very young, um, with their peers, were involved in incidents that had, uh, really bad legal advice. That did not help them in the process. And that is why even though they're amazing contributing members in our current society, they have this past old, almost like childhood record that is impacting them. And both of them are impacted by statelessness because. Even though they're being deported, they're being deported to a place of which it is not their home. They might not speak that language. They might not have connections with that. Their home is here in America. Um, that is why we say use the terminology we belong here. Um, before we go a little bit more into personal stories [00:27:00] I saw from Asian Law Caucus, I wonder if you can give a little bit of an overview about the broader, legal actions that are taking place around these kidnappings.  Aisa Villarosa: Yeah, thanks Miko. And just huge love to Ann and Tika. Reiterating that these are two refugee communities bonded through not just this frustrating, heartbreaking experience, um, but also this, this solidarity that's building. To share Miko, about the broader legal ramifications, and there was a question in the chat about what's the big deal about a stay of removal? So just for starters, the system that Mohan and Lue got pulled into can be lightning quick with removing folks. Part of this is because Mohan, Lue, so many folks in refugee communities all across the country years and years ago, perhaps when they were teenagers, just like Mohan and Lue, uh, there might have been some sort of, run in with law enforcement. Oftentimes racial profiling [00:28:00] can be involved, especially with the over-policing, right in our country, decades later, after living peacefully in their communities. Oftentimes decades after an immigration judge said to Mohan, said to Lue, you are not a safety risk. You are not a threat to the community. You've done your time. You can come home. Uh, maybe some folks had some ICE check-ins that they would come to every year. Um, and then with this administration, this unprecedented attack on immigrant and refugee rights, that is when we started to see for the very first time as folks have mentioned, these broad deportations, uh, to countries that previously were not accepting refugees primarily because that is the same country of their ancestral persecution. Um, in some cases they have zero connection to the country. Um, and in cases like the Bhutanese refugees, they're actually [00:29:00] expelled from Bhutan when they're removed. Again, all this is happening for the very first time. There are some serious legal questions with due process. Even if immigration court does run on a similar track as a lot of our other court systems, there's still a duty of fairness and often that duty is completely neglected.  Nina Phillips: You are tuned into Apex Express on 94.1 KPFA, 89.3 KPFB in Berkeley, 88.1 KFCF in Fresno and online@kpfa.org. Coming up is Klezmer Dances II by The Daniel Pelton Collective.  [00:30:00] [00:31:00] [00:32:00] That was  Klezmer Dances II by The Daniel Pelton Collective. You are tuned into APEX Express [00:33:00] on 94.1 KPFA. Now back to Miko and her conversation with Tika Basnet and Ann Vue. Two incredibly strong women who are leading campaigns to bring home their respective spouses from ICE detention, and Aisa Villarosa with the Asian Law Caucus. Miko Lee: I would love to speak to a little bit more of the uplifting power of these women that are being highlighted right now. And I'm wondering both for Ann and Tika, if you could talk a little bit about your sense of resilience. because both of your spouses were, even though when they were youth, there were systems impacted in our Asian American communities. There's some shame that's associated with that. And so some people have been really hesitant to speak out. Can you talk a little bit about what encouraged you to speak out on behalf of your husband and how that has made a difference for you in the community? And I'm gonna start with Ann first.  Ann Vue: So I would say, um. In the [00:34:00] beginning when Lue was first detained on July 15th. I was scared. I am the first generation born American, uh, um, right here in Michigan. And even myself, I was so scared to say anything to anyone. I remember getting that call from Lue and it just felt so unreal. Quickly playing back to 2008, uh, which would be the third time that the embassy, Laos and Thailand both rejected Lue's entry and how his immigration officer was like, don't wait, start your life. And then fast forwarding it to what had happened, I was scared and, um. Lue and I are both, uh, Hmong community leaders as well. And Lue, of course, um, being president of the Hmong Family Association, him and I decided we're gonna keep a little quiet at first, and I started getting [00:35:00] calls from our Hmong community members. Uh, in concern to them receiving a letter, which is all dated for the same time at the same place that is not usual, where people would normally go see their immigration officer. And immediately that weekend I went to go visit him and I, it was explaining to him that I have received nine calls and I don't know what to do in immediately he. I think that the urgency around his people created that fear and immediately he was like, Hey, we've gotta start talking. You've gotta call you. You have to start making calls. Because he was detained on the 15th. On the 15th, which was Tuesday, and these letters were mailed to the community on that Friday. And immediately him and I started talking more and more and he said, “we have a 50-50 chance. If you don't fight for me and the others, then. We get sent back, you're gonna regret that for the rest of your life or [00:36:00] you fight for us. And as long as you fought all the way till the end, whatever happens, we can live with that”. And immediately, I remember speaking to, uh, attorney Nancy, and I've been mentioning to her that I wanna call, I wanna call Rep Mai. And I wanted to call Commissioner Carolyn Wright and she was like, well make the call and I'm glad that she didn't wait. And she just said, Hey, you know what? She just started talking and immediately Rep Mai called and that's how it kind of started this whole journey. So I am so thankful that I did. I did voice it out because I myself, even as a community leader, I felt hopeless. I felt like as loud as I am, everyone that I, for the first time had no voice. It became, became lonely. I became scared. Because they've got a, you know, we have a family, right, that we're raising together with small children. So I'm glad that we did, uh, [00:37:00] share our story and I'm glad that it is out. And, and that it, it opened the key to many other Southeast Asian families to do the same as well too.  Miko Lee: Thank you so much, Anna. And I remember you saying that even Lue was speaking with folks in Spanish to get their stories and share them out as well. Ann Vue: He had to learn it! And you know, I will say that with this whole detention thing, it doesn't just detain our person. It detains our whole family. We're all a part of this, you know? And so, you know, Lue had to learn how to count so he can give the numbers 'cause he was doing it with his hand motions. Because it's a hard system, it's a very complex system to navigate, which is how people go disappearing. And so for him to be able to reach out. Give me phone numbers to these families, regardless. Love beyond borders, right? And I was able to reach out to these families so that that way they know where their person was and [00:38:00] help them get set up so they can, so their families can call them. Miko Lee: Thank you so much for doing that. And you and your husband, both as organizers and continuing to be organizers even when locked up. Tika, I wanna turn it to you and ask about the courage it took to speak up and what keeps you going.  Tika Basnet: Yes. So when, uh, my husband got detained on April 8, I took one week after to reach out Aisa and she told me, Hey Tika, come forward. You know, your story is powerful. People need to know your story. And I told first thing to Aisa is our community is very just mental. They doesn't understand. And I've been looking at the video where our Bhutanese people get detained and deported and on common section, the first thing that I noticed was people are commenting, oh, these people are criminal. They are, maybe they, um, kill someone or they rape someone, you know, without. Understanding the people's story. And I, I [00:39:00] was thinking the same, whatever, if I come forward, will they gonna understand my story? Will they gonna talk to me? Will they gonna ask me personally, what is going on? And I actually same as Ann, I, um, I. Was scared to come out. I did not come out in two within two, two months, you know, when, uh, I tried to deport my husband on my due date that I was about to give birth, um, BIA, uh, grant, day of removal, you know, in two month I was crying alone. I was messaging Aisa and I was telling all my pain. And then when they stop my husband deport his son and that day, um. Aisa and ARU, everybody encouraged me. Like, you know, you need to come forward. People need to know your story. And then that day I decide, and I also remember that, um, within one minute after I gave birth, I was messaging, uh, ARU team I think his name [00:40:00] is Pravin or something. I was messaging him, Hey, I'm ready to give, uh, interview. I'm ready to give uh, a story. And that day I decide like I wanna come forward. I don't care what society is thinking, I'm the one that going through and people need to know my story. And, uh, I think, uh, and also I look at my daughter, you know, I don't want, um, her to think that I did not fight for her dad. You know, I want her to think like her mom is, is strong enough to fight and looking at her. That gave me so much power and yeah. And now like give, getting a lot of support, a lot of love is give me like, you know, I, I feel like, um, I wouldn't, uh, get all the support if I was scared and did not, uh, talk about my story. So now like receiving a lot of love from everywhere and that give me couraged to continue and talk about my husband's deportation.  Miko Lee: Thank you, Tika. And I wanna recognize that we're running late, but we're gonna get through it if those of you could stay with us a little bit [00:41:00] longer. My one more question to both Ann and Tika is what message do you have for people that are experiencing this right now? Because this, as we said, 60,000 people are detained right now. Your spouses, we, as we have said, it's not just you with your, the children, the grandparents, all the other people. What advice do you have for other folks that are going through this and do you have a message for those folks? Ann Vue: I would say, um, for anyone who is going through what Tika and I and the many are going through that, um, make sure you document everything, get your loved ones Alien Number because you want to track it as you go. Build your circle. Know that you are not alone. Uh, reach out. I'm still learning as I go too. And it's unfortunate that we as family, like have to become attorneys overnight and learn to as well. But make sure that you guys, that you know that you're not alone you know that [00:42:00] we're not fighting the system. We're fighting a system that. Hopes, uh, that we get tired of fighting it. And the moment that you speak up, they can't disappear your loved one quietly. And I am a very big, um, firm believer. There's this scripture that has always carried Lue and I and, uh, I, I can't stress on it enough. And especially to all of those, to all of our, everybody that's on tonight. And beyond that, uh, there's a scripture. It's a Proverbs, right? 3:27-28 that says, “Do not withhold good from those to whom it is due, when it is your power to act”. And so thank you to those who continues to act when action is really within your reach and. We belong here, our families belong here. And compassion delayed is really compassion denied. And so don't fight alone 'cause that's what they are hoping that we will fight alone, [00:43:00] but we're together in this.  Miko Lee: Beautiful, thanks. And Tika, what about you? What advice do you have for other people that are experiencing this with family members?  Tika Basnet: So, yeah, um, I'm encouraging everyone like we experiencing this deportation for the first time or. Come forward. You never know. You know how many support you will get. Looking at Ann and my story that if we did not reach out to the community, I don't think our husband will be here at the moment. So you are the one who going through the pain and, uh, sharing your pain will make you at least a relief and you never know. Your husband Deportes and will stop. You will get like support from, from community. So ICE is not deporting only your husband or your like wife or someone, they are deporting your dream, your hope. So when they try to deport my husband, they were deporting my husband, uh, my [00:44:00] daughter future, the future that we talk about. So I am telling everyone that come forward. Story, your story, and you'll get lot of love. You'll get lot of support. And if I did not talk before, I don't think my husband will be here. He'll be one of the person that disappear long time ago. So yeah, please come forward and see your story. And the last thing is, I wanna say we belong here. This is our home and our future is here.  Miko Lee: Thank you so much, Tika. Um, Aisa, I wanna turn it over to you. Ann was saying suddenly we have to become lawyers and, and so can you talk about, and even like with Lue's case, it was suddenly he got pardoned at the last minute when he was on a deportation plane, and then it was like, oh, that should fix everything, but it doesn't, so can you talk a little bit about some of the legal ramifications that people should know about? Aisa Villarosa: Sure. And just to say, Mohan, Lue, Tika, Ann, I mean, y'all have lived [00:45:00] several movies in, in just the span of months the amount of stress, both you yourselves as the lead advocate, your families. Uh, so, so for folks watching this is literally Mohan and Lue getting like pulled off planes because of the shared advocacy here, uh, which starts with the decision to speak out. Um, and for folks in the room who aren't sure whether they want to share their story, you know, we're not saying, oh, go to the press so much of it. Involves just opening your heart to a trusted person. Um, many of those people are here in this room uh, my organization, Asian Law Caucus. Uh, in a minute we'll share some links for some of our resources. Uh, the wonderful folks at ARU, there's such a full crew, and if you're part of a community, especially the many, many, too many refugee communities being targeted. You are not alone. So in terms of what the legal battle [00:46:00] looks like, another thing to remember is that for any case, there's usually a, a wave of folks that's needed, uh, for Lue, for Mohan. That's multiple states sometimes because in the immigration world, for example, you could have a very, very old final order of removal. So this is essentially the order that is put forward by an immigration judge. That technically allows a lot of these awful deportations and disappearances to take place. The battle to fight that can be multi-state, uh, multi-issue. So you're talking to a criminal defense attorney, you're talking to an immigrant rights attorney. Uh, but going back to that trust, just talk to someone who both you can trust and someone who has a good lay of the land because these cases are incredibly complex. Folks I work with, sometimes they're physically driving to a law office. Someone named Emily is on the call. You know, we drove to a law office. Turns [00:47:00] out the record we were looking for was, was too old. The, that previous attorney didn't have the record on file. There are so many practical challenges you don't anticipate. So the sooner you do that math and just open your story up, um, to, to a loved one, to a trusted one. And in a little bit we're, we'll share more links for what that process looks like.  Miko Lee: So we're gonna move into that call to action. We're running a bit over time, so if you could hang with us for a couple more minutes. Um, we want to one, thank all of our amazing guests so far and then move to our call to action. What can you do? A bunch of people are throwing things into the chat. We're gonna start with Rising Voices. Oh, I guess we're gonna start with OPAWL and Sonya is gonna share about OPAWL's work and the call to action there. Sonya (OPAWL): Hi everyone. My name is Sonya Kapur. I live in Columbus, Ohio, and I'm a member of OPAWL Building AAPI Feminist leadership. I'd like to share a little bit about our efforts to support Mohans Campaign for Freedom and encourage you to donate to [00:48:00] Mohans GoFundMe to cover his legal fees, and the link to the GoFundMe will be in the chat. With the funds raised so far, Tika and Mohan were able to hire a seasoned attorney to review Mohans court documents and work on his case. So your donations will allow Mohan to continue working with his legal team as we fight to bring him home. So even five or $10 will help us get closer to reuniting Mohan with his family and community here in Ohio. A really fun piece of this is that a local, Columbus based illustrator and OPA member Erin Siao, has also created a beautiful art fundraiser to help raise more funds from Mohans release campaign. So when you donate to Mohans GoFundMe between now and November 15th, you receive a complimentary five by seven art print of your choice. Families belong together on the right or on the left. To receive a print, you just email Erin and her. Email address will also be in the [00:49:00] chat, a screenshot of your donation confirmation along with your name and address. You can also send a direct message of the screenshot to her Instagram account, so please consider uplifting our art fundraiser on social media. Encourage others to donate to the GoFundMe and share Mohans story with your family and friends.  Miko Lee: Thanks, Sonya and Opal, and we'll turn it over to Emily at Rising Voices. Emily (Rising Voices): Hi, thank you. Um, rising Voices is one of the, uh, many members helping bring Lue Yang home. Just wanna share that. We do have a online petition going that directs you to email the ice field office in Detroit, pressuring them to bring him home. Um, there's also a number to call with a script provided. So nothing has to be reinvented. We please, please encourage you to share this out, and you do not have to be from Michigan to make a call or email every single email. And, all counts. And we also do have a GoFundMe for [00:50:00] him and his family. As we all know legal file, legal fees pile up, so anything counts. Thank you so much everyone.  Miko Lee:  Thanks Emily. Now we're gonna pass it over to Nawal talking about this event which is connected to disappeared in America.  Nawal Rai: Hi everyone. I'm Nawal here again and yeah, so We Belong Here. Uh, today's event was part of the Disappeared in America Weekend of Action, which is a national mobilization action to protect immigrants, uh, expose corporate complicity and honor the lives lost in detention and across America more than 150 towns and cities held.  Um. Weekend of Collective action this weekend on November 1st and second, standing in solidarity with immigrants families, uh, from holding freedom vigils outside of ICE facilities to via de Los Mortis gathering, honoring life's lost in detentions to ice out of Home Depot actions. Calling out corporate complicity this weekend was a resounding nation nationwide call for compassion, dignity, and [00:51:00] democracy, and demanding justice and due process for all. The National Action was organized by the Coalition of Partners, including National Day Labor Organizing Network, Detention Watch Network, the Worker Circle, public ci, uh, citizen, and many allied organization across the country. Thank you all. Thank you for joining us today.  Miko Lee: Thank you to everyone for showing up today. We thank all of our speakers, all of our many partner organizations. As we were saying, it takes many of us working together collectively. Even though we said there's 60,000 people detained. There are so many more than that. We know that immigrants contribute and refugees contribute immensely to the American experience, and we want everyone to know that we belong here. All of us belong here. This is our home.  Thank you so much for joining us all. We appreciate all of you, the interpreters, the translators, the folks behind the scene who helped to make this event happen. Um, shout out to Cheryl Truong [00:52:00] and Nina Phillips for really doing all the tech behind this. And to all of you for showing up tonight, we need each and every one of you to participate to show that you are part of the beloved community, that you are part of believing that America can be a place filled with beloved love instead of hatred. Um, so I would love you all to just all together. Shout out. We belong here. 1, 2, 3.  Event Attendees: We belong here. We belong here.  We belong here.  Miko Lee: Have a great night, and thank you all for joining us. Nina Phillips: This was a recording of a virtual community gathering that took place earlier this month on Monday, November 3rd. It was made [00:53:00] possible by We Belong Here, a coalition of immigrant rights organizations, Asian Americans for Civil Rights and Equality, Asian Refugees United, Asian Law Caucus, Hmong Family Association Lansing, Hmong Innovative Politics, OPAWL and Rising Voices.  As I mentioned earlier, you can watch the phenomenal video performance from Asian Refugees United on the website of Asian Americans for Civil Rights and Equality.  That's aacre.org/our-voices/webelonghere  There's also up-to-date information on how best you can support both the Free Mohan Karki and Bring Lu Home campaigns. We thank all of you listeners out there. Keep resisting, keep organizing. Your voices are important. Let's keep immigrant families together.  To close out. Here's a little more from the video performance. [00:54:00] [00:55:00] [00:56:00] [00:57:00]  Nina Phillips: For show notes, please check out our website, kpfa.org/program/APEX-express.  APEX Express is a collective of activists that include Ama Keane-Lee, Anuj Vaidya, Cheryl Truong, Jalena Keane-Lee, Miko Lee, Nina Phillips, Preeti Mangala Shekar, and Swati Rayasam. Tonight's show was produced by me, Nina Phillips. Get some rest, y'all. Good night. The post APEX Express – November 27, 2025 – We Belong Here: Bhutanese & HMoob Americans in the Struggle Against Statelessness appeared first on KPFA.

Lia and Megan go full English class today as we discuss the parallels between Guillermo Del Toro's Frankenstein and the 2023 Kdrama Mask Girl. Sound wild? Well, it kind of is, but here us out...Ready to download your first audiobook? Don't forget to click HERE for your free Audible trial.*Audible is a sponsor of Afternoona Delight Podcast*Are your family and friends sick of you talking about K-drama? We get it...and have an answer. Join our AfterNoona Delight Patreon and find community among folks who get your obsession. And check out www.afternoonadelight.com for more episodes, book recs and social media goodness. And don't forget about the newest member of our network: Afternoona Asks where diaspora Asians living in the West find ways to reconnect to Asian culture via Asian/KDramas.Last but CERTAINLY not least....love BTS? Or curious what all the fuss is about? Check out our sister pod Afternoona Army for "thinky, thirsty and over thirty" takes on Bangtan life. ★ Support this podcast on Patreon ★

THE Kim Seokjin held Run Jin encore performances at Incheon Munhak Main Stadium on October 31 and November 2nd. Join Lia, Megan and new addition to the team Becky as we dive into the unique blend of heart and humor that only Jin can deliver. Shout out to the special guest performances from J-Hope, Jungkook, Jimin and V (who even held it down wearing a backpack). Are your family and friends sick of you talking about K-drama? We get it...and have an answer. Check out our sister pod www.afternoonadelight.com for more episodes, book recs and social media goodness. And don't forget about the newest members of our network: Afternoona Asks where diaspora Asians living in the West find ways to reconnect to Asian culture via Asian/KDramas.Want to find more great BTS content? Head over to Afternoona Army for more takes on Bangtan life and links to our social media.

Monica Harris is the Executive Director of FAIR For All,  a Harvard Law graduate, former Hollywood executive, and author of The Illusion of Division. Monica explains how her experience as a gay Black woman in Hollywood and then in "flyover country"shattered many elite narratives about America. She describes why she believes much of our current polarization is manufactured by media and political interests, and how identity-based frameworks like liberated ethnic studies and DEI are deepening division rather than healing it. We dig into the following: Why "Liberated Ethnic Studies" is dividing students, not uniting them How modern DEI programs drifted far from genuine civil rights principles Why identity-based teaching harms kids socially and emotionally The catastrophic decline in civic education—and why it matters now more than ever How the American Experience curriculum offers a unifying alternative What parents MUST know about what's being taught in classrooms today This conversation is a must-listen for parents, educators, and anyone concerned about polarization, education, and the future of democracy.   Resources & Links FAIR For All: https://fairforall.org Monica's Substack: The Illusion of Division Monica's book, "The Ilusion of Division" If you want to know about this topic, listen to our podcast with Brandy Shufutinsky: The Marxist Roots of Coursework in K-12 and our College Campuses.   Quotes "We have so much more in common than what separates us, but division is being manufactured." "Kids don't need to see each other as oppressors and oppressed—they need tools for civil discourse." "The bones of America are exceptional" "At FAIR, we're asking: what comes after polarization? Everyone can diagnose the problem; we're focused on solutions." "The entire liberated ethnic studies model flies in the face of reality on the ground. It pits students against each other at the exact moment in life when they most need to see each other as allies." ⏱ Episode Timestamps 00:00 -Welcome & Monica's California-to-Harvard-to-Hollywood story 05:00 -Leaving Hollywood for Montana: the real story behind the culture shock 07:50 - Why Monica wrote The Illusion of Division 09:20 — What FAIR For All does across education, arts, medicine & law 13:00 — Inside the American Experience curriculum 15:00 — The problems with Liberated Ethnic Studies 19:00 — Why America's system needs repair, not replacement 20:30 — How social media fuels division and fear 24:00 — "This isn't capitalism"—the economic reality young people face 26:00 — The collapse of civics education & why it matters 32:00 — How FAIR's curriculum teaches civil discourse & unifying history 35:00 — Why parents are the key to changing school districts 38:00 — What's happening in California, Oregon & other states 42:00 — When students should take the course: age, grade level & design 44:30 — The pilot program: access, cost & rollout plans 47:00 — How ethnic studies frames Jews, Asians & successful minorities as "privileged" 50:00 — Why human beings will always choose freedom over authoritarianism 51:00 — Closing thoughts & how to learn more  

We bestow our highly coveted and prestigious Asians in Baseball Awards on a new class of recipients

A weekly magazine-style radio show featuring the voices and stories of Asians and Pacific Islanders from all corners of our community. The show is produced by a collective of media makers, deejays, and activists. Powerleegirl hosts, the mother daughter team of Miko Lee, Jalena & Ayame Keane-Lee speak with artists about their craft and the works that you can catch in the Bay Area. Featured are filmmaker Yuriko Gamo Romer, playwright Jessica Huang and photographer Joyce Xi.   More info about their work here: Diamond Diplomacy Yuriko Gamo Romer Jessica Huang's Mother of Exiles at Berkeley Rep Joyce Xi's Our Language Our Story at Galeria de la Raza     Show Transcript Opening: [00:00:00] Apex Express Asian Pacific expression. Community and cultural coverage, music and calendar, new visions and voices, coming to you with an Asian Pacific Islander point of view. It's time to get on board the Apex Express.    Ayame Keane-Lee: [00:00:46] Thank you for joining us on Apex Express Tonight. Join the PowerLeeGirls as we talk with some powerful Asian American women artists. My mom and sister speak with filmmaker Yuriko Gamo Romer, playwright Jessica Huang, and photographer Joyce Xi. Each of these artists have works that you can enjoy right now in the Bay Area. First up, let's listen in to my mom Miko Lee chat with Yuriko Gamo Romer about her film Diamond Diplomacy.    Miko Lee: [00:01:19] Welcome, Yuriko Gamo Romer to Apex Express, amazing filmmaker, award-winning director and producer. Welcome to Apex Express.   Yuriko Gamo Romer: [00:01:29] Thank you for having me.    Miko Lee: [00:01:31] It's so great to see your work after this many years. We were just chatting that we knew each other maybe 30 years ago and have not reconnected. So it's lovely to see your work. I'm gonna start with asking you a question. I ask all of my Apex guests, which is, who are your people and what legacy do you carry with you?    Yuriko Gamo Romer: [00:01:49] Oh, who are my people? That's a hard one. I guess I'm Japanese American. I'm Asian American, but I'm also Japanese. I still have a lot of people in Japan. That's not everything. Creative people, artists, filmmakers, all the people that I work with, which I love. And I don't know, I can't pare it down to one narrow sentence or phrase. And I don't know what my legacy is. My legacy is that I was born in Japan, but I have grown up in the United States and so I carry with me all that is, technically I'm an immigrant, so I have little bits and pieces of that and, but I'm also very much grew up in the United States and from that perspective, I'm an American. So too many words.    Miko Lee: [00:02:44] Thank you so much for sharing. Your latest film was called Diamond Diplomacy. Can you tell us what inspired this film?   Yuriko Gamo Romer: [00:02:52] I have a friend named Dave Dempsey and his father, Con Dempsey, was a pitcher for the San Francisco Seals. And the Seals were the minor league team that was in the West Coast was called the Pacific Coast League They were here before the Major League teams came to the West Coast. So the seals were San Francisco's team, and Con Dempsey was their pitcher. And it so happened that he was part of the 1949 tour when General MacArthur sent the San Francisco Seals to Allied occupied Japan after World War II. And. It was a story that I had never heard. There was a museum exhibit south of Market in San Francisco, and I was completely wowed and awed because here's this lovely story about baseball playing a role in diplomacy and in reuniting a friendship between two countries. And I had never heard of it before and I'm pretty sure most people don't know the story. Con Dempsey had a movie camera with him when he went to Japan I saw the home movies playing on a little TV set in the corner at the museum, and I thought, oh, this has to be a film. I was in the middle of finishing Mrs. Judo, so I, it was something I had to tuck into the back of my mind Several years later, I dug it up again and I made Dave go into his mother's garage and dig out the actual films. And that was the beginning. But then I started opening history books and doing research, and suddenly it was a much bigger, much deeper, much longer story.   Miko Lee: [00:04:32] So you fell in, it was like synchronicity that you have this friend that had this footage, and then you just fell into the research. What stood out to you?    Yuriko Gamo Romer: [00:04:41] It was completely amazing to me that baseball had been in Japan since 1872. I had no idea. And most people,   Miko Lee: [00:04:49] Yeah, I learned that too, from your film. That was so fascinating.    Yuriko Gamo Romer: [00:04:53] So that was the first kind of. Wow. And then I started to pick up little bits and pieces like in 1934, there was an American All Star team that went to Japan. And Babe Ruth was the headliner on that team. And he was a big star. People just loved him in Japan. And then I started to read the history and understanding that. Not that a baseball team or even Babe Ruth can go to Japan and prevent the war from happening. But there was a warming moment when the people of Japan were so enamored of this baseball team coming and so excited about it that maybe there was a moment where it felt like. Things had thawed out a little bit. So there were other points in history where I started to see this trend where baseball had a moment or had an influence in something, and I just thought, wow, this is really a fascinating history that goes back a long way and is surprising. And then of course today we have all these Japanese faces in Major League baseball.   Miko Lee: [00:06:01] So have you always been a baseball fan?   Yuriko Gamo Romer: [00:06:04] I think I really became a fan of Major League Baseball when I was living in New York. Before that, I knew what it was. I played softball, I had a small connection to it, but I really became a fan when I was living in New York and then my son started to play baseball and he would come home from the games and he would start to give us the play by play and I started to learn more about it. And it is a fascinating game 'cause it's much more complex than I think some people don't like it 'cause it's complex.    Miko Lee: [00:06:33] I must confess, I have not been a big baseball fan. I'm also thinking, oh, a film about baseball. But I actually found it so fascinating with especially in the world that we live in right now, where there's so much strife that there was this way to speak a different language. And many times we do that through art or music and I thought it was so great how your film really showcased how baseball was used as a tool for political repair and change. I'm wondering how you think this film applies to the time that we live in now where there's such an incredible division, and not necessarily with Japan, but just with everything in the world.   Yuriko Gamo Romer: [00:07:13] I think when it comes down to it, if we actually get to know people. We learn that we're all human beings and that we probably have more in common than we give ourselves credit for. And if we can find a space that is common ground, whether it's a baseball field or the kitchen, or an art studio, or a music studio, I think it gives us a different place where we can exist and acknowledge That we're human beings and that we maybe have more in common than we're willing to give ourselves credit for. So I like to see things where people can have a moment where you step outside of yourself and go, oh wait, I do have something in common with that person over there. And maybe it doesn't solve the problem. But once you have that awakening, I think there's something. that happens, it opens you up. And I think sports is one of those things that has a little bit of that magical power. And every time I watch the Olympics, I'm just completely in awe.    Miko Lee: [00:08:18] Yeah, I absolutely agree with you. And speaking of that kind of repair and that aspect that sports can have, you ended up making a short film called Baseball Behind Barbed Wire, about the incarcerated Japanese Americans and baseball. And I wondered where in the filmmaking process did you decide, oh, I gotta pull this out of the bigger film and make it its own thing?    Yuriko Gamo Romer: [00:08:41] I had been working with Carrie Yonakegawa. From Fresno and he's really the keeper of the history of Japanese American baseball and especially of the story of the World War II Japanese American incarceration through the baseball stories. And he was one of my scholars and consultants on the longer film. And I have been working on diamond diplomacy for 11 years. So I got to know a lot of my experts quite well. I knew. All along that there was more to that part of the story that sort of deserved its own story, and I was very fortunate to get a grant from the National Parks Foundation, and I got that grant right when the pandemic started. It was a good thing. I had a chunk of money and I was able to do historical research, which can be done on a computer. Nobody was doing any production at that beginning of the COVID time. And then it's a short film, so it was a little more contained and I was able to release that one in 2023.   Miko Lee: [00:09:45] Oh, so you actually made the short before Diamond Diplomacy.   Yuriko Gamo Romer: [00:09:49] Yeah. The funny thing is that I finished it before diamond diplomacy, it's always been intrinsically part of the longer film and you'll see the longer film and you'll understand that part of baseball behind Barbed Wire becomes a part of telling that part of the story in Diamond Diplomacy.   Miko Lee: [00:10:08] Yeah, I appreciate it. So you almost use it like research, background research for the longer film, is that right?    Yuriko Gamo Romer: [00:10:15] I had been doing the research about the World War II, Japanese American incarceration because it was part of the story of the 150 years between Japan and the United States and Japanese people in the United States and American people that went to Japan. So it was always a part of that longer story, and I think it just evolved that there was a much bigger story that needed to be told separately and especially 'cause I had access to the interview footage of the two guys that had been there, and I knew Carrie so well. So that was part of it, was that I learned so much about that history from him.   Miko Lee: [00:10:58] Thanks. I appreciated actually watching both films to be able to see more in depth about what happened during the incarceration, so that was really powerful. I'm wondering if you can talk a little bit about the style of actually both films, which combine vintage Japanese postcards, animation and archival footage, and how you decided to blend the films in this way.   Yuriko Gamo Romer: [00:11:19] Anytime you're making a film about history, there's that challenge of. How am I going to show this story? How am I gonna get the audience to understand and feel what was happening then? And of course you can't suddenly go out and go, okay, I'm gonna go film Babe Ruth over there. 'cause he's not around anymore. So you know, you start digging up photographs. If we're in the era of you have photographs, you have home movies, you have 16 millimeter, you have all kinds of film, then great. You can find that stuff if you can find it and use it. But if you go back further, when before people had cameras and before motion picture, then you have to do something else. I've always been very much enamored of Japanese woodblock prints. I think they're beautiful and they're very documentary in that they tell stories about the people and the times and what was going on, and so I was able to find some that sort of helped evoke the stories of that period of time. And then in doing that, I became interested in the style and maybe can I co-opt that style? Can we take some of the images that we have that are photographs? And I had a couple of young artists work on this stuff and it started to work and I was very excited. So then we were doing things like, okay, now we can create a transition between the print style illustration and the actual footage that we're moving into, or the photograph that we're dissolving into. And the same thing with baseball behind barbed wire. It became a challenge to show what was actually happening in the camps. In the beginning, people were not allowed to have cameras at all, and even later on it wasn't like it was common thing for people to have cameras, especially movie cameras. Latter part of the war, there was a little bit more in terms of photos and movies, but in terms of getting the more personal stories. I found an exhibit of illustrations and it really was drawings and paintings that were visual diaries. People kept these visual diaries, they drew and they painted, and I think part of it was. Something to do, but I think the other part of it was a way to show and express what was going on. So one of the most dramatic moments in there is a drawing of a little boy sitting on a toilet with his hands covering his face, and no one would ever have a photograph. Of a little boy sitting on a toilet being embarrassed because there are no partitions around the toilet. But this was a very dramatic and telling moment that was drawn. And there were some other things like that. There was one illustration in baseball behind barbed wire that shows a family huddled up and there's this incredible wind blowing, and it's not. Home movie footage, but you feel the wind and what they had to live through. I appreciate art in general, so it was very fun for me to be able to use various different kinds of art and find ways to make it work and make it edit together with the other, with the photographs and the footage.    Miko Lee: [00:14:56] It's really beautiful and it tells the story really well. I'm wondering about a response to the film from folks that were in it because you got many elders to share their stories about what it was like being either folks that were incarcerated or folks that were playing in such an unusual time. Have you screened the film for folks that were in it? And if so what has their response been?    Yuriko Gamo Romer: [00:15:20] Both the men that were in baseball behind barbed wire are not living anymore, so they have not seen it. With diamond diplomacy, some of the historians have been asked to review cuts of the film along the way. But the two baseball players that play the biggest role in the film, I've given them links to look at stuff, but I don't think they've seen it. So Moi's gonna see it for the first time, I'm pretty sure, on Friday night, and it'll be interesting to see what his reaction to it is. And of course. His main language is not English. So I think some of it's gonna be a little tough for him to understand. But I am very curious 'cause I've known him for a long time and I know his stories and I feel like when we were putting the film together, it was really important for me to be able to tell the stories in the way that I felt like. He lived them and he tells them, I feel like I've heard these stories over and over again. I've gotten to know him and I understand some of his feelings of joy and of regret and all these other things that happen, so I will be very interested to see what his reaction is to it.   Miko Lee: [00:16:40] Can you share for our audience who you're talking about.   Yuriko Gamo Romer: [00:16:43] Well, Sanhi is a nickname, his name is Masa Nouri. Murakami. He picked up that nickname because none of the ball players could pronounce his name.   Miko Lee: [00:16:53] I did think that was horrifically funny when they said they started calling him macaroni 'cause they could not pronounce his name. So many of us have had those experiences.   Yuriko Gamo Romer: [00:17:02] Yeah, especially if your name is Masanori Murakami. That's a long, complicated one. So he, Masanori Murakami is the first Japanese player that came and played for the major leagues. And it was an inadvertent playing because he was a kid, he was 19 years old. He was playing on a professional team in Japan and they had some, they had a time period where it made sense to send a couple of these kids over to the United States. They had a relationship with Kapi Harada, who was a Japanese American who had been in the Army and he was in Japan during. The occupation and somehow he had, he'd also been a big baseball person, so I think he developed all these relationships and he arranged for these three kids to come to the United States and to, as Mahi says, to study baseball. And they were sent to the lowest level minor league, the single A camps, and they played baseball. They learned the American ways to play baseball, and they got to play with low level professional baseball players. Marcy was a very talented left handed pitcher. And so when September 1st comes around and the postseason starts, they expand the roster and they add more players to the team. And the scouts had been watching him and the Giants needed a left-handed pitcher, so they decided to take a chance on him, and they brought him up and he was suddenly going to Shea Stadium when. The Giants were playing the Mets and he was suddenly pitching in a giant stadium of 40,000 people.    Miko Lee: [00:18:58] Can you share a little bit about his experience when he first came to America? I just think it shows such a difference in time to now.    Yuriko Gamo Romer: [00:19:07] Yeah, no kidding. Because today they're the players that come from Japan are coddled and they have interpreters wherever they go and they travel and chartered planes and special limousines and whatever else they get. So Marcie. He's, I think he was 20 by the time he was brought up so young. Mahi at 20 years old, the manager comes in and says, Hey, you're going to New York tomorrow and hands him plane tickets and he has to negotiate his way. Get on this plane, get on that plane, figure out how to. Get from the airport to the hotel, and he's barely speaking English at this point. He jokes that he used to carry around an English Japanese dictionary in one pocket and a Japanese English dictionary in the other pocket. So that's how he ended up getting to Shea Stadium was in this like very precarious, like they didn't even send an escort.   Miko Lee: [00:20:12] He had to ask the pilot how to get to the hotel. Yeah, I think that's wild. So I love this like history and what's happened and then I'm thinking now as I said at the beginning, I'm not a big baseball sports fan, but I love love watching Shohei Ohtani. I just think he's amazing. And I'm just wondering, when you look at that trajectory of where Mahi was back then and now, Shohei Ohtani now, how do you reflect on that historically? And I'm wondering if you've connected with any of the kind of modern Japanese players, if they've seen this film.   Yuriko Gamo Romer: [00:20:48] I have never met Shohei Ohtani. I have tried to get some interviews, but I haven't gotten any. I have met Ichi. I did meet Nori Aoki when he was playing for the Giants, and I met Kenta Maya when he was first pitching for the Dodgers. They're all, I think they're all really, they seem to be really excited to be here and play. I don't know what it's like to be Ohtani. I saw something the other day in social media that was comparing him to Taylor Swift because the two of them are this like other level of famous and it must just be crazy. Probably can't walk down the street anymore. But it is funny 'cause I've been editing all this footage of mahi when he was 19, 20 years old and they have a very similar face. And it just makes me laugh that, once upon a time this young Japanese kid was here and. He was worried about how to make ends meet at the end of the month, and then you got the other one who's like a multi multimillionaire.    Miko Lee: [00:21:56] But you're right, I thought that too. They look similar, like the tall, the face, they're like the vibe that they put out there. Have they met each other?    Yuriko Gamo Romer: [00:22:05] They have actually met, I don't think they know each other well, but they've definitely met.   Miko Lee: [00:22:09] Mm, It was really a delight. I am wondering what you would like audiences to walk away with after seeing your film.   Yuriko Gamo Romer: [00:22:17] Hopefully they will have a little bit of appreciation for baseball and international baseball, but more than anything else. I wonder if they can pick up on that sense of when you find common ground, it's a very special space and it's an ability to have this people to people diplomacy. You get to experience people, you get to know them a little bit. Even if you've never met Ohtani, you now know a little bit about him and his life and. Probably what he eats and all that kind of stuff. So it gives you a chance to see into another culture. And I think that makes for a different kind of understanding. And certainly for the players. They sit on the bench together and they practice together and they sweat together and they, everything that they do together, these guys know each other. They learn about each other's languages and each other's food and each other's culture. And I think Mahi went back to Japan with almost as much Spanish as they did English. So I think there's some magical thing about people to people diplomacy, and I hope that people can get a sense of that.    Miko Lee: [00:23:42] Thank you so much for sharing. Can you tell our audience how they could find out more about your film Diamond diplomacy and also about you as an artist?    Yuriko Gamo Romer: [00:23:50] the website is diamonddiplomacy.com. We're on Instagram @diamonddiplomacy. We're also on Facebook Diamond Diplomacy. So those are all the places that you can find stuff, those places will give you a sense of who I am as a filmmaker and an artist too.    Miko Lee: [00:24:14] Thank you so much for joining us today, Yuriko. Gamo. Romo. So great to speak with you and I hope the film does really well.    Yuriko Gamo Romer: [00:24:22] Thank you, Miko. This was a lovely opportunity to chat with you.   Ayame Keane-Lee: [00:24:26] Next up, my sister Jalena Keane-Lee speaks with playwright Jessica Huang, whose new play Mother of Exiles just had its world premiere at Berkeley Rep is open until December 21st.    Jalena Keane-Lee: [00:24:39] All right. Jessica Huang, thank you so much for being here with us on Apex Express and you are the writer of the new play Mother of Exiles, which is playing at Berkeley Rep from November 14th to December 21st. Thank you so much for being here.   Jessica Huang: [00:24:55] Yeah, thank you so much for having me. It's such a pleasure.   Jalena Keane-Lee: [00:24:59] I'm so curious about this project. The synopsis was so interesting. I was wondering if you could just tell us a little bit about it and how you came to this work.   Jessica Huang: [00:25:08] When people ask me what mother of Exiles is, I always say it's an American family story that spans 160 plus years, and is told in three acts. In 90 minutes. So just to get the sort of sense of the propulsion of the show and the form, the formal experiment of it. The first part takes place in 1898, when the sort of matriarch of the family is being deported from Angel Island. The second part takes place in 1999, so a hundred years later where her great grandson is. Now working for the Miami, marine interdiction unit. So he's a border cop. The third movement takes place in 2063 out on the ocean after Miami has sunk beneath the water. And their descendants are figuring out what they're gonna do to survive. It was a strange sort of conception for the show because I had been wanting to write a play. I'd been wanting to write a triptych about America and the way that interracial love has shaped. This country and it shaped my family in particular. I also wanted to tell a story that had to do with this, the land itself in some way. I had been sort of carrying an idea for the play around for a while, knowing that it had to do with cross-cultural border crossing immigration themes. This sort of epic love story that each, in each chapter there's a different love story. It wasn't until I went on a trip to Singapore and to China and got to meet some family members that I hadn't met before that the rest of it sort of fell into place. The rest of it being that there's a, the presence of, ancestors and the way that the living sort of interacts with those who have come before throughout the play.   Jalena Keane-Lee: [00:27:13] I noticed that ancestors, and ghosts and spirits are a theme throughout your work. I was wondering if you could talk a little bit about your own ancestry and how that informs your writing and creative practice.   Jessica Huang: [00:27:25] Yeah, I mean, I'm in a fourth generation interracial marriage. So, I come from a long line of people who have loved people who were different from them, who spoke different languages, who came from different countries. That's my story. My brother his partner is German. He lives in Berlin. We have a history in our family of traveling and of loving people who are different from us. To me that's like the story of this country and is also the stuff I like to write about. The thing that I feel like I have to share with the world are, is just stories from that experience.   Jalena Keane-Lee: [00:28:03] That's really awesome. I guess I haven't really thought about it that way, but I'm third generation of like interracial as well. 'cause I'm Chinese, Japanese, and Irish. And then at a certain point when you're mixed, it's like, okay, well. The odds of me being with someone that's my exact same ethnic breakdown feel pretty low. So it's probably gonna be an interracial relationship in one way or the other.   Jessica Huang: [00:28:26] Totally. Yeah. And, and, and I don't, you know, it sounds, and it sounds like in your family and in mine too, like we just. Kept sort of adding culture to our family. So my grandfather's from Shanghai, my grandmother, you know, is, it was a very, like upper crust white family on the east coast. Then they had my dad. My dad married my mom whose people are from the Ukraine. And then my husband's Puerto Rican. We just keep like broadening the definition of family and the definition of community and I think that's again, like I said, like the story of this country.   Jalena Keane-Lee: [00:29:00] That's so beautiful. I'm curious about the role of place in this project in particular, mother of exiles, angel Island, obviously being in the Bay Area, and then the rest of it taking place, in Miami or in the future. The last act is also like Miami or Miami adjacent. What was the inspiration behind the place and how did place and location and setting inform the writing.   Jessica Huang: [00:29:22] It's a good question. Angel Island is a place that has loomed large in my work. Just being sort of known as the Ellis Island of the West, but actually being a place with a much more difficult history. I've always been really inspired by the stories that come out of Angel Island, the poetry that's come out of Angel Island and, just the history of Asian immigration. It felt like it made sense to set the first part of the play here, in the Bay. Especially because Eddie, our protagonist, spent some time working on a farm. So there's also like this great history of agriculture and migrant workers here too. It just felt like a natural place to set it. And then why did we move to Miami? There are so many moments in American history where immigration has been a real, center point of the sort of conversation, the national conversation. And moving forward to the nineties, the wet foot, dry foot Cuban immigration story felt like really potent and a great place to tell the next piece of this tale. Then looking toward the future Miami is definitely, or you know, according to the science that I have read one of the cities that is really in danger of flooding as sea levels rise.   Jalena Keane-Lee: [00:30:50] Okay. The Cuban immigration. That totally makes sense. That leads perfectly into my next question, which was gonna be about how did you choose the time the moments in time? I think that one you said was in the nineties and curious about the choice to have it be in the nineties and not present day. And then how did you choose how far in the future you wanted to have the last part?   Jessica Huang: [00:31:09] Some of it was really just based on the needs of the characters. So the how far into the future I wanted us to be following a character that we met as a baby in the previous act. So it just, you know, made sense. I couldn't push it too far into the future. It made sense to set it in the 2060s. In terms of the nineties and, why not present day? Immigration in the nineties , was so different in it was still, like I said, it was still, it's always been a important national conversation, but it wasn't. There was a, it felt like a little bit more, I don't know if gentle is the word, but there just was more nuance to the conversation. And still there was a broad effort to prevent Cuban and refugees from coming ashore. I think I was fascinated by how complicated, I mean, what foot, dry foot, the idea of it is that , if a refugee is caught on water, they're sent back to Cuba. But if they're caught on land, then they can stay in the us And just the idea of that is so. The way that, people's lives are affected by just where they are caught , in their crossing. I just found that to be a bit ridiculous and in terms of a national policy. It made sense then to set the second part, which moves into a bit of a farce at a time when immigration also kind of felt like a farce.   Jalena Keane-Lee: [00:32:46] That totally makes sense. It feels very dire right now, obviously. But it's interesting to be able to kind of go back in time and see when things were handled so differently and also how I think throughout history and also touching many different racial groups. We've talked a lot on this show about the Chinese Exclusion Act and different immigration policies towards Chinese and other Asian Americans. But they've always been pretty arbitrary and kind of farcical as you put it. Yeah.   Jessica Huang: [00:33:17] Yeah. And that's not to make light of like the ways that people's lives were really impacted by all of this policy . But I think the arbitrariness of it, like you said, is just really something that bears examining. I also think it's really helpful to look at where we are now through the lens of the past or the future. Mm-hmm. Just gives just a little bit of distance and a little bit of perspective. Maybe just a little bit of context to how we got to where we got to.   Jalena Keane-Lee: [00:33:50] That totally makes sense. What has your experience been like of seeing the play be put up? It's my understanding, this is the first this is like the premier of the play at Berkeley Rep.   Jessica Huang: [00:34:00] Yes. Yeah. It's the world premier. It's it incredible. Jackie Bradley is our director and she's phenomenal. It's just sort of mesmerizing what is happening with this play? It's so beautiful and like I've alluded to, it shifts tone between the first movement being sort of a historical drama on Angel Island to, it moves into a bit of a farce in part two, and then it, by the third movement, we're living in sort of a dystopic, almost sci-fi future. The way that Jackie's just deftly moved an audience through each of those experiences while holding onto the important threads of this family and, the themes that we're unpacking and this like incredible design team, all of these beautiful visuals sounds, it's just really so magical to see it come to life in this way. And our cast is incredible. I believe there are 18 named roles in the play, and there are a few surprises and all of them are played by six actors. who are just. Unbelievable. Like all of them have the ability to play against type. They just transform and transform again and can navigate like, the deepest tragedies and the like, highest moments of comedy and just hold on to this beautiful humanity. Each and every one of them is just really spectacular. So I'm just, you know. I don't know. I just feel so lucky to be honest with you. This production is going to be so incredible. It's gonna be, it feels like what I imagine in my mind, but, you know, plus,    Jalena Keane-Lee: [00:35:45] well, I really can't wait to see it. What are you hoping that audiences walk away with after seeing the show?   Jessica Huang: [00:35:54] That's a great question. I want audiences to feel connected to their ancestors and feel part of this community of this country and, and grateful and acknowledge the sacrifices that somebody along the line made so that they could be here with, with each other watching the show. I hope, people feel like they enjoyed themselves and got to experience something that they haven't experienced before. I think that there are definitely, nuances to the political conversation that we're having right now, about who has the right to immigrate into this country and who has the right to be a refugee, who has the right to claim asylum. I hope to add something to that conversation with this play, however small.   Jalena Keane-Lee:[00:36:43]  Do you know where the play is going next?   Jessica Huang: [00:36:45] No. No. I dunno where it's going next. Um, exciting. Yeah, but we'll, time will   Jalena Keane-Lee: [00:36:51] and previews start just in a few days, right?   Jessica Huang: [00:36:54] Yeah. Yeah. We have our first preview, we have our first audience on Friday. So yeah, very looking forward to seeing how all of this work that we've been doing lands on folks.   Jalena Keane-Lee: [00:37:03] Wow, that's so exciting. Do you have any other projects that you're working on? Or any upcoming projects that you'd like to share about?   Jessica Huang: [00:37:10] Yeah, yeah, I do. I'm part of the writing team for the 10 Things I Hate About You Musical, which is in development with an Eye Toward Broadway. I'm working with Lena Dunham and Carly Rae Jepsen and Ethan Ska to make that musical. I also have a fun project in Chicago that will soon be announced.   Jalena Keane-Lee: [00:37:31] And what is keeping you inspired and keeping your, you know, creative energies flowing in these times?   Jessica Huang: [00:37:37] Well first of all, I think, you know, my collaborators on this show are incredibly inspiring. The nice thing about theater is that you just get to go and be inspired by people all the time. 'cause it's this big collaboration, you don't have to do it all by yourself. So that would be the first thing I would say. I haven't seen a lot of theater since I've been out here in the bay, but right before I left New York, I saw MEUs . Which is by Brian Keda, Nigel Robinson. And it's this sort of two-hander musical, but they do live looping and they sort of create the music live. Wow. And it's another, it's another show about an untold history and about solidarity and about folks coming together from different backgrounds and about ancestors, so there's a lot of themes that really resonate. And also the show is just so great. It's just really incredible. So , that was the last thing I saw that I loved. I'm always so inspired by theater that I get to see.   Jalena Keane-Lee: [00:38:36] That sounds wonderful. Is there anything else that you'd like to share?   Jessica Huang: [00:38:40] No, I don't think so. I just thanks so much for having me and come check out the show. I think you'll enjoy it. There's something for everyone.   Jalena Keane-Lee: [00:38:48] Yeah. I'm so excited to see the show. Is there like a Chinese Cuban love story with the Miami portion? Oh, that's so awesome. This is an aside, but I'm a filmmaker and I've been working on a documentary about, Chinese people in Cuba and there's like this whole history of Chinese Cubans in Cuba too.   Jessica Huang: [00:39:07] Oh, that's wonderful. In this story, it's a person who's a descendant of, a love story between a Chinese person and a Mexican man, a Chinese woman and a Mexican man, and oh, their descendant. Then also, there's a love story between him and a Cuban woman.   Jalena Keane-Lee: [00:39:25] That's awesome. Wow. I'm very excited to see it in all the different intergenerational layers and tonal shifts. I can't wait to see how it all comes together.   Ayame Keane-Lee: [00:39:34] Next up we are back with Miko Lee, who is now speaking with photographer Joyce Xi about her latest exhibition entitled Our Language, our Story Running Through January in San Francisco at Galleria de Raza.    Miko Lee: [00:39:48] Welcome, Joyce Xi to Apex Express.    Joyce Xi: [00:39:52] Thanks for having me.    Miko Lee: [00:39:53] Yes. I'm, I wanna start by asking you a question I ask most of my guests, and this is based on the great poet Shaka Hodges. It's an adaptation of her question, which is, who are your people and what legacy do you carry with you?   Joyce Xi: [00:40:09] My people are artists, free spirits, people who wanna see a more free and just, and beautiful world. I'm Chinese American. A lot of my work has been in the Asian American community with all kinds of different people who dreaming of something better and trying to make the world a better place and doing so with creativity and with positive and good energy.   Miko Lee: [00:40:39] I love it. And what legacy do you carry with you?   Joyce Xi: [00:40:43] I am a fighter. I feel like just people who have been fighting for a better world. Photography wise, like definitely thinking about Corky Lee who is an Asian American photographer and activist. There's been people who have done it before me. There will be people who do it after me, but I wanna do my version of it here.   Miko Lee: [00:41:03] Thank you so much and for lifting up the great Corky Lee who has been such a big influence on all of us. I'm wondering in that vein, can you talk a little bit about how you use photography as a tool for social change?   Joyce Xi: [00:41:17] Yeah. Photography I feel is a very powerful tool for social change. Photography is one of those mediums where it's emotional, it's raw, it's real. It's a way to see and show and feel like important moments, important stories, important emotions. I try to use it as a way to share. Truths and stories about issues that are important, things that people experience, whether it's, advocating for environmental justice or language justice or just like some of them, just to highlight some of the struggles and challenges people experience as well as the joys and the celebrations and just the nuance of people's lives. I feel like photography is a really powerful medium to show that. And I love photography in particular because it's really like a frozen moment. I think what's so great about photography is that. It's that moment, it's that one feeling, that one expression, and it's kind of like frozen in time. So you can really, sit there and ponder about what's in this person's eyes or what's this person trying to say? Or. What does this person's struggle like? You can just see it through their expressions and their emotions and also it's a great way to document. There's so many things that we all do as advocates, as activists, whether it's protesting or whether it's just supporting people who are dealing with something. You have that moment recorded. Can really help us remember those fights and those moments. You can show people what happened. Photography is endlessly powerful. I really believe in it as a tool and a medium for influencing the world in positive ways.   Miko Lee: [00:43:08] I'd love us to shift and talk about your latest work, Our language, Our story.” Can you tell us a little bit about where this came from?   Joyce Xi: [00:43:15] Sure. I was in conversation with Nikita Kumar, who was at the Asian Law Caucus at the time. We were just chatting about art and activism and how photography could be a powerful medium to use to advocate or tell stories about different things. Nikita was talking to me about how a lot of language access work that's being done by organizations that work in immigrant communities can often be a topic that is very jargon filled or very kind of like niche or wonky policy, legal and maybe at times isn't the thing that people really get in the streets about or get really emotionally energized around. It's one of those issues that's so important to everything. Especially since in many immigrant communities, people do not speak English and every single day, every single issue. All these issues that these organizations advocate around. Like housing rights, workers' rights, voting rights, immigration, et cetera, without language, those rights and resources are very hard to understand and even hard to access at all. So, Nik and I were talking about language is so important, it's one of those issues too remind people about the core importance of it. What does it feel like when you don't have access to your language? What does it feel like and look like when you do, when you can celebrate with your community and communicate freely and live your life just as who you are versus when you can't even figure out how to say what you wanna say because there's a language barrier.    Miko Lee: [00:44:55] Joyce can you just for our audience, break down what language access means? What does it mean to you and why is it important for everybody?   Joyce Xi: [00:45:05] Language access is about being able to navigate the world in your language, in the way that you understand and communicate in your life. In advocacy spaces, what it can look like is, we need to have resources and we need to have interpretation in different languages so that people can understand what's being talked about or understand what resources are available or understand what's on the ballot. So they can really experience their life to the fullest. Each of us has our languages that we're comfortable with and it's really our way of expressing everything that's important to us and understanding everything that's important to us. When that language is not available, it's very hard to navigate the world. On the policy front, there's so many ways just having resources in different languages, having interpretation in different spaces, making sure that everybody who is involved in this society can do what they need to do and can understand the decisions that are being made. That affects them and also that they can affect the decisions that affect them.   Miko Lee: [00:46:19] I think a lot of immigrant kids just grow up being like the de facto translator for their parents. Which can be things like medical terminology and legal terms, which they might not be familiar with. And so language asks about providing opportunities for everybody to have equal understanding of what's going on. And so can you talk a little bit about your gallery show? So you and Nikita dreamed up this vision for making language access more accessible and more story based, and then what happened?   Joyce Xi: [00:46:50] We decided to express this through a series of photo stories. Focusing on individual stories from a variety of different language backgrounds and immigration backgrounds and just different communities all across the Bay Area. And really just have people share from the heart, what does language mean to them? What does it affect in their lives? Both when one has access to the language, like for example, in their own community, when they can speak freely and understand and just share everything that's on their heart. And what does it look like when that's not available? When maybe you're out in the streets and you're trying to like talk to the bus driver and you can't even communicate with each other. How does that feel? What does that look like? So we collected all these stories from many different community members across different languages and asked them a series of questions and took photos of them in their day-to-day lives, in family gatherings, at community meetings, at rallies, at home, in the streets, all over the place, wherever people were like Halloween or Ramadan or graduations, or just day-to-day life. Through the quotes that we got from the interviews, as well as the photos that I took to illustrate their stories, we put them together as photo stories for each person. Those are now on display at Galleria Deza in San Francisco. We have over 20 different stories in over 10 different languages. The people in the project spoke like over 15 different languages. Some people used multiple languages and some spoke English, many did not. We had folks who had immigrated recently, folks who had immigrated a while ago. We had children of immigrants talking about their experiences being that bridge as you talked about, navigating translating for their parents and being in this tough spot of growing up really quickly, we just have this kind of tapestry of different stories and, definitely encourage folks to check out the photos but also to read through each person's stories. Everybody has a story that's very special and that is from the heart   Miko Lee: [00:49:00] sounds fun. I can't wait to see it in person. Can you share a little bit about how you selected the participants?    Joyce Xi: [00:49:07] Yeah, selecting the participants was an organic process. I'm a photographer who's trying to honor relationships and not like parachute in. We wanted to build relationships and work with people who felt comfortable sharing their stories, who really wanted to be a part of it, and who are connected in some kind of a way where it didn't feel like completely out of context. So what that meant was that myself and also the Asian Law Caucus we have connections in the community to different organizations who work in different immigrant communities. So we reached out to people that we knew who were doing good work and just say Hey, do you have any community members who would be interested in participating in this project who could share their stories. Then through following these threads we were able to connect with many different organizations who brought either members or community folks who they're connected with to the project. Some of them came through like friends. Another one was like, oh, I've worked with these people before, maybe you can talk to them. One of them I met through a World Refugee Day event. It came through a lot of different relationships and reaching out. We really wanted folks who wanted to share a piece of their life. A lot of folks who really felt like language access and language barriers were a big challenge in their life, and they wanted to talk about it. We were able to gather a really great group together.    Miko Lee: [00:50:33] Can you share how opening night went? How did you navigate showcasing and highlighting the diversity of the languages in one space?    Joyce Xi: [00:50:43] The opening of the exhibit was a really special event. We invited everybody who was part of the project as well as their communities, and we also invited like friends, community and different organizations to come. We really wanted to create a space where we could feel and see what language access and some of the challenges of language access can be all in one space. We had about 10 different languages at least going on at the same time. Some of them we had interpretation through headsets. Some of them we just, it was like fewer people. So people huddled together and just interpreted for the community members. A lot of these organizations that we partnered with, they brought their folks out. So their members, their community members, their friends and then. It was really special because a lot of the people whose photos are on the walls were there, so they invited their friends and family. It was really fun for them to see their photos on the wall. And also I think for all of our different communities, like we can end up really siloed or just like with who we're comfortable with most of the time, especially if we can't communicate very well with each other with language barriers. For everybody to be in the same space and to hear so many languages being used in the same space and for people to be around people maybe that they're not used to being around every day. And yet through everybody's stories, they share a lot of common experiences. Like so many of the stories were related to each other. People talked about being parents, people talked about going to the doctor or taking the bus, like having challenges at the workplace or just what it's like to celebrate your own culture and heritage and language and what the importance of preserving languages. There are so many common threads and. Maybe a lot of people are not used to seeing each other or communicating with each other on a daily basis. So just to have everyone in one space was so special. We had performances, we had food, we had elders, children. There was a huge different range of people and it was just like, it was just cool to see everyone in the same space. It was special.    Miko Lee: [00:52:51] And finally, for folks that get to go to Galleria de la Raza in San Francisco and see the exhibit, what do you want them to walk away with?   Joyce Xi: [00:53:00] I would love for people to walk away just like in a reflective state. You know how to really think about how. Language is so important to everything that we do and through all these stories to really see how so many different immigrant and refugee community members are making it work. And also deal with different barriers and how it affects them, how it affects just really simple human things in life that maybe some of us take for granted, on a daily basis. And just to have more compassion, more understanding. Ultimately, we wanna see our city, our bay area, our country really respecting people and their language and their dignity through language access and through just supporting and uplifting our immigrant communities in general. It's a such a tough time right now. There's so many attacks on our immigrant communities and people are scared and there's a lot of dehumanizing actions and narratives out there. This is, hopefully something completely different than that. Something that uplifts celebrates, honors and really sees our immigrant communities and hopefully people can just feel that feeling of like, oh, okay, we can do better. Everybody has a story. Everybody deserves to be treated with dignity and all the people in these stories are really amazing human beings. It was just an honor for me to even be a part of their story. I hope people can feel some piece of that.    Miko Lee: [00:54:50] Thank you so much, Joyce, for sharing your vision with us, and I hope everybody gets a chance to go out and see your work.    Joyce Xi: [00:54:57] Thank you.   Ayame Keane-Lee: [00:55:00] Thanks so much for tuning in to Apex Express. Please check out our website at kpfa.org/program/apexexpress to find out more about the guests tonight and find out how you can take direct action.   Apex Express is a proud member of Asian Americans for civil rights and equality. Find out more at aacre.org. That's AACRE.org.   We thank all of you listeners out there. Keep resisting, keep organizing, keep creating, and sharing your visions with the world. Your voices are important.    Apex Express is produced by  Miko Lee, Jalena Keene-Lee, Ayame Keene-Lee, Preeti Mangala Shekar, Anuj Vaida, Cheryl Truong, Isabel Li, Nina Phillips & Swati Rayasam. Thank you so much to the team at KPFA for their support and have a good night.       The post APEX Express – 11.20.25 – Artist to Artist appeared first on KPFA.

This week Lia, Megan and Amy get into The Bechdel Test in Korean dramas. How does a piece of media pass The Bechdel Test? It has to meet three criteria: it must feature at least two women, the two women must have a conversation with each other, and the conversation must not be about a man. This should not be a high bar...and yet? And...yet.K-Pop Rec of the Week: Spaghetti by La Sserafim (featuring J-Hope of BTS)Ready to download your first audiobook? Don't forget to click HERE for your free Audible trial.*Audible is a sponsor of Afternoona Delight Podcast*Are your family and friends sick of you talking about K-drama? We get it...and have an answer. Join our AfterNoona Delight Patreon and find community among folks who get your obsession. And check out www.afternoonadelight.com for more episodes, book recs and social media goodness. And don't forget about the newest member of our network: Afternoona Asks where diaspora Asians living in the West find ways to reconnect to Asian culture via Asian/KDramas.Last but CERTAINLY not least....love BTS? Or curious what all the fuss is about? Check out our sister pod Afternoona Army for "thinky, thirsty and over thirty" takes on Bangtan life. ★ Support this podcast on Patreon ★

This week Amy and Megan unpack why quiet, low stakes dramas are just what they need right now. We discuss the comfort of predictability, the joy of getting to just hang out with good characters, and what it's like to finally feel the Song Joong-ki effect. Join us for overalls, floppy hats, and moving plants from here to there in My Youth. Ready to download your first audiobook? Don't forget to click HERE for your free Audible trial.*Audible is a sponsor of Afternoona Delight Podcast*Are your family and friends sick of you talking about K-drama? We get it...and have an answer. Join our AfterNoona Delight Patreon and find community among folks who get your obsession. And check out www.afternoonadelight.com for more episodes, book recs and social media goodness. And don't forget about the newest member of our network: Afternoona Asks where diaspora Asians living in the West find ways to reconnect to Asian culture via Asian/KDramas.Last but CERTAINLY not least....love BTS? Or curious what all the fuss is about? Check out our sister pod Afternoona Army for "thinky, thirsty and over thirty" takes on Bangtan life.  ★ Support this podcast on Patreon ★

You're listening to Burnt Toast! I'm Virginia Sole-Smith. You're listening to Burnt Toast. I'm Virginia Sole-Smith. Today, my conversation is with Kaila Yu. Kaila is an author based in Los Angeles. Her debut memoir, Fetishized: A Reckoning with Yellow Fever, Feminism, and Beauty, came out earlier this fall to a rave review in The New York Times. She's also a luxury travel and culture writer with bylines in The New York Times, Rolling Stone, The LA Times, Condé Nast Traveler and many more. Kaila's memoir grapples with her experience growing up Asian and female in a world that has so many stereotypes and expectations about both those things. We talk about the pressure to perform so many different kinds of specific beauty labor, the experience of being objectified sexually —and we really get into how we all navigate the dual reality of hating beauty standards and often feeling safer and happier complying with them. I learned so much from this book, and this conversation with Kaila. Don't forget that if you've bought Fat Talk from Split Rock Books, you can take 10% off your purchase of Fetishized there too — just use the code FATTALK at checkout. And if you value this conversation, a paid subscription is the best way to support our work!Join Burnt Toast!

A weekly magazine-style radio show featuring the voices and stories of Asians and Pacific Islanders from all corners of our community. The show is produced by a collective of media makers, deejays, and activists. The post APEX Express – November 6, 2025 appeared first on KPFA.

In today's episode, we chat about what we're currently watching, and how we grapple with navigating fandom spaces when faced with moral dilemmas. We get deep and vulnerable, but end with hope, as we always try to do.Vulgar History PodcastPassion: A Novel of Romantic Poets by Jude MorganReady to download your first audiobook? Don't forget to click HERE for your free Audible trial.*Audible is a sponsor of Afternoona Delight Podcast*Are your family and friends sick of you talking about K-drama? We get it...and have an answer. Join our AfterNoona Delight Patreon and find community among folks who get your obsession. And check out www.afternoonadelight.com for more episodes, book recs and social media goodness. And don't forget about the newest member of our network: Afternoona Asks where diaspora Asians living in the West find ways to reconnect to Asian culture via Asian/KDramas.Last but CERTAINLY not least....love BTS? Or curious what all the fuss is about? Check out our sister pod Afternoona Army for "thinky, thirsty and over thirty" takes on Bangtan life. ★ Support this podcast on Patreon ★

Acts 20:1-12   After the uproar ceased, Paul sent for the disciples, and after encouraging them, he said farewell and departed for Macedonia. 2 When he had gone through those regions and had given them much encouragement, he came to Greece. 3 There he spent three months, and when a plot was made against him by the Jews as he was about to set sail for Syria, he decided to return through Macedonia. 4 Sopater the Berean, son of Pyrrhus, accompanied him; and of the Thessalonians, Aristarchus and Secundus; and Gaius of Derbe, and Timothy; and the Asians, Tychicus and Trophimus. 5 These went on ahead and were waiting for us at Troas, 6 but we sailed away from Philippi after the days of Unleavened Bread, and in five days we came to them at Troas, where we stayed for seven days. 7 On the first day of the week, when we were gathered together to break bread, Paul talked with them, intending to depart on the next day, and he prolonged his speech until midnight. 8 There were many lamps in the upper room where we were gathered. 9 And a young man named Eutychus, sitting at the window, sank into a deep sleep as Paul talked still longer. And being overcome by sleep, he fell down from the third story and was taken up dead. 10 But Paul went down and bent over him, and taking him in his arms, said, "Do not be alarmed, for his life is in him." 11 And when Paul had gone up and had broken bread and eaten, he conversed with them a long while, until daybreak, and so departed. 12 And they took the youth away alive, and were not a little comforted.   Key Words: Encourage, Sabbath, Bread, Speech, Dead, Alive, Comfort Keystone Verse: And when Paul had gone up and had broken bread and eaten, he conversed with them a long while, until daybreak, and so departed. And they took the youth away alive, and were not a little comforted. (Acts 20:11-12)   Download Bulletin

Acts 20:1-16 After the uproar ceased, Paul sent for the disciples, and after encouraging them, he said farewell and departed for Macedonia. 2 When he had gone through those regions and had given them much encouragement, he came to Greece. 3 There he spent three months, and when a plot was made against him by the Jews as he was about to set sail for Syria, he decided to return through Macedonia. 4 Sopater the Berean, son of Pyrrhus, accompanied him; and of the Thessalonians, Aristarchus and Secundus; and Gaius of Derbe, and Timothy; and the Asians, Tychicus and Trophimus. 5 These went on ahead and were waiting for us at Troas, 6 but we sailed away from Philippi after the days of Unleavened Bread, and in five days we came to them at Troas, where we stayed for seven days. 7 On the first day of the week, when we were gathered together to break bread, Paul talked with them, intending to depart on the next day, and he prolonged his speech until midnight. 8 There were many lamps in the upper room where we were gathered. 9 And a young man named Eutychus, sitting at the window, sank into a deep sleep as Paul talked still longer. And being overcome by sleep, he fell down from the third story and was taken up dead. 10 But Paul went down and bent over him, and taking him in his arms, said, “Do not be alarmed, for his life is in him.” 11 And when Paul had gone up and had broken bread and eaten, he conversed with them a long while, until daybreak, and so departed. 12 And they took the youth away alive, and were not a little comforted. 13 But going ahead to the ship, we set sail for Assos, intending to take Paul aboard there, for so he had arranged, intending himself to go by land. 14 And when he met us at Assos, we took him on board and went to Mitylene. 15 And sailing from there we came the following day opposite Chios; the next day we touched at Samos; and the day after that we went to Miletus. 16 For Paul had decided to sail past Ephesus, so that he might not have to spend time in Asia, for he was hastening to be at Jerusalem, if possible, on the day of Pentecost.

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  A weekly magazine-style radio show featuring the voices and stories of Asians and Pacific Islanders from all corners of our community. The show is produced by a collective of media makers, deejays, and activists. Tonight on APEX Express Host Miko Lee speaks with spouses of detained refugees. We hear about the similarities and challenges of Hmong and Nepali speaking Bhutanese refugees. We also speak with Asian Law Caucus' Aisa Villarosa about the ongoing campaigns for freedom that ALC has been leading along with a host of other community based organizations. Join us: November 3, 4pm Pacific time, 7pm Eastern Time, Join us for “We Belong Here, Bhutanese & Hmong Americans in the Struggle Against Statelessness” a live virtual event featuring my three guests tonight, along with performances and conversations. bit.ly/WBH-2025   TAKE ACTION Rising Voices campaign for Lue Yang Mohan Karki's GoFundMe   And please help support these organizations working to support detained and deported folx: Asian Law Caucus Asian Refugees United Ba Lo Project in Vietnam Collective Freedom in Vietnam & Laos Asian Prisoner Support Committee & New Light Wellness in Cambodia November 1–2, people nationwide are joining the Disappeared In America Weekend of Action to stand up for immigrant families and defend due process. Actions include protests at Home Depots, candlelight Freedom Vigils, and Day of the Dead events honoring lives lost to detention.     We Belong! Transcript Miko Lee: Welcome to Apex Express.This is your host, Miko Lee. Today we're talking about detentions and potential deportations and the atrocities that the Trump administration is creating in our communities.We originally recorded this episode a month ago, and today is October 29th. 2025 and I have with me Aisa Villarosa a lawyer with Asian Law Caucus, giving us an update in the cases that we're talking about. Welcome Aisa Apex Express. Aisa Villarosa: Thanks so much, Miko. Miko Lee: Tonight we're gonna be talking with two spouses of detained folks. One is a Nepali speaking Bhutanese community member, and the other is Hmong community member. In the time since we recorded this, there has been a big update with Lue Young's case, and I wonder if you could provide us with that update. Aisa Villarosa: Miko since we last spoke, due to some really hard fought campaigning, both behind the scenes and drawing upon allies across Michigan and really across the country. Lue Yang, received a successful pardon from Governor Gretchen Whitmer. We actually received word shortly before Lue Yang was set to be placed on a very large deportation flight. Once we got word of the pardon, it was off to the races for the legal team to quickly draft some emergency motions for Lue Yang and to realize the power of the pardon before the deportation. Miko Lee: Can we back up for a moment and give for an audience a sense of what that means? Lue Young was incarcerated at a detention facility, which Trump has called the FedEx of detention facilities in, Louisana, and explain to us what happened to him and the other members that were suddenly pulled together onto an airplane. Aisa Villarosa: When these removal flights happen, there's so much confusion, there's so much fear that families undergo, and often it's due to the perseverance of the families that we honestly even know where folks are. Shortly before what we call final staging happens, someone is moved from, in Lue's case, a facility in Michigan to a facility like Alexandria in Louisiana where the planes do take off  from. Families typically look up their loved one on something called the “ice detainee locator.” What's challenging is when final staging starts. Often that person completely disappears from the detainee locator or information gets a bit scrambled. Because ICE has a bit of a sealed box as far as even telling families where, their loved one is. Families are either left to guess or rely on each other. So for Lue Yang and the pardon what is critical for folks to know is that as powerful, as rare as a pardon is, I can't stress how extraordinary this is in these very difficult times. A pardon does not instantly, allow someone to say, walk out of an ice facility. There's, numerous legal filings that need to happen. That is why , the team was so up against the clock. Miko Lee: So let's break this down a little bit around a pardon. What does a pardon mean in our current system? Because as a lay person, you think, oh, they're pardoned. That means they're free and they can go home and be with their family. Tell us a little bit about what a pardon means in our legal system right now. Aisa Villarosa: A pardon is different from a criminal expungement, which folks might be familiar with. In Lue's case, for example, when Lue was younger, he successfully expunged this record, in criminal court. The challenge is that immigration court, is basically the entity that issues something called a “final order of removal.” This document, is basically what powers deportation for folks. An expungement does not get at the final removal order. However, a pardon has that more direct link. The pardon has the weight of what we call “vacating a conviction.” To explain more legalese and hopefully folks can stay with me. A final order of removal is an immigration court order document where , it gives ice the power to do all these deportations We're seeing for the refugee community that Lue Yang belongs to. Often these are quite old orders, and so sometimes a loved one might be detained and they might not even realize that they have a criminal conviction or a final order of removal. Miko Lee: Thank you so much for breaking that down. So we described how he was pulled off the plane that was going for his deportation. Tell us where Lue is at right now. What is happening with his case? Aisa Villarosa: The call to action very much remains what it has been, which is we're calling to bring Lue home. At the moment, Lue is in a facility in Louisiana. Our hope is that Lue can return to Michigan. There is also a call to release Lue on a supervised release. The other component of the legal journey for Lue is something called a motion to reopen. Basically this is how the full weight of the pardon is realized. The motion to reopen calls on the Board of Immigration Appeals to reopen Lue's case, because years ago he got that final removal order, so when someone gets that order, typically their immigration case is closed. This petition says, Hey, he got a pardon. Please reopen Lue's case because the underlying conviction that led to the final removal order. Has been pardoned, right? We are hoping that this motion to reopen will be heard in front of the Board of Immigration Appeals, that we can get a great result and that as the campaign calls for that, Lue can come home. Miko Lee: I know lawyers like you are doing incredible work around the scenes. You did not sleep for two days, filing paperwork to be able to make sure that Lue was pulled off that plane. But what can regular people, what can our audience do to get involved right now? Aisa Villarosa: There's myriad actions along this really terrible deportation pipeline. We're seeing that folks who might not have, any deep knowledge of the immigration system can still be so impactful. We have partners in LA in the faith community and they've started working with community organizations to do things like accompaniment, which is, joining community members like Lue, who often have these ice check-ins. As folks have seen on the news, these check-ins can be really risky because that is where ice arrests can happen. If someone misses their ice check-in, typically that means that a warrant is issued, that immigration forces can come after you. In these cases, community members, particularly folks who are US citizens, accompaniment can be a great way to dig in to show up for our immigrant and refugee siblings. Miko Lee: Thank you so much for breaking down how folks can get involved. It's so important right now in a time where we feel so utterly helpless to be able to make change. Now we're gonna go back to listen to our interview that is with the two spouses, Tika, Basnet, and Ann Vue, and also our current guest, Aisa Villarosa Tika and Ann they're part of a horrible club, which is both of their spouses are currently in detention from our immigration system. I just wanna start on a real personal note in a way that I often do with my guests. Anne, I just would love to hear from you, who are your people and what legacy do you carry with you? Ann Vue: Thank you again, Miko and Isa, for having me on. We are Hmong. We helped Americans during the Vietnam War. In Laos, a lot of our pilots needed a communication. Because we're indigenous and we are in the mountains they were able to speak with us and use us. Our Hmong, helped a lot of the pilots rescued a lot, like thousands and thousands of Americans, so that they can make it back home. That is our contribution to the American people. When we were brought to America, was to resettle because of humanitarian purpose. Our legacy of helping Americans with the war. that is who we are and what we bring to America. That's who I am. I'm actually the first generation Hmong American. I was born right here in the capital of Lansing, Michigan. Miko Lee: Thanks so much ann. Tika, can you share who are your people and what legacy you carry with you? Tika Basnet: Hi, my name is Tika Basnet. I am Bhutanese Nepali community. My parents and all the Bhutanese, they ran away from Bhutan in 1990 due to the ethnic cleansing. They came to Nepal, seeking for asylum, and that is where we born. I was born in Nepal, in refugee camp. Even though I was born in Nepal, Nepal never gave us identity. They never give us citizenship. We were known as Bhutanese Nepali, but as known as Stateless. My husband also born in Nepal in a refugee camp. Miko Lee: Thank you. Aisa, I'm gonna ask the same question for you Aisa, that works at Asian Law Caucus. Who are your people and what legacy do you carry with you? Aisa Villarosa: So much love to you, Miko and to you Ann and Tika for being here today. I just am, I'm so honored. My name is Aisa and I carry the love and, Maki Baka spirit of Filipino Americans both in my family across the diaspora. A little bit about the Filipino American story. We came to the United States as part of the colonial machine. The first Filipinos were brought as part of the Spanish Gallian trade. We made California home, parts of Lueisiana home, and it's quite a contrast to a lot of the sort of model minority seduction that many of my people, and myself as a younger person tended to fall into that if we kept our heads down, if we were quiet, we would be left alone. I'm struck because at this moment of just unprecedented government attacks, so many of our communities have this story where someone somewhere said to us, yeah, just keep your head down and it'll be fine. We're seeing the exact opposite, that this is the time to really use our voices, both individually and as one. I'm also an artist and try to infuse that into my work in fighting government systems. Miko Lee: Thank you Aisa. I will say I'm Miko. I am fifth generation Chinese American. I grew up knowing that my family was full of fighters that built the railroads, worked in the gold mines in laundromats and restaurants, and my parents walked with Dr. King and Cesar Chavez and Dolores Huerta, and I was raised in a family of social justice activists. I feel like our legacy is to continue that work and to fight for the rights of our peoples. I'm so honored to have both of all three of you powerful women join me today. As I was saying in the beginning, Tika and Anne are sadly a part of this club nobody wants to be a part of with the sudden, unexpected, harmful detentions of both of your husbands. I wonder if you can each just share the story about what happened and how you first found out about your husband being detained. Let's start with you Tika. Tika Basnet: My husband got his removal in 2014 when he was just 17 years old, high school student going from school to home. He's a teenager and with his friend, they were playing around and they wanna go home really fast. They just cross from private property. That is where someone saw and call 9 1 1. We came from the culture that we love to go people home , walking around, playing around. My husband came here in 2011. The incident happened on 2013. He just, came here without knowing culture, without knowing languages, So he has no idea. So when somebody called 9 1 1, he could not explain what happened. First of all, English is his second language, he was barely here without knowing rules and regulation, without knowing culture. The police took him to jail, gave a lot of charges. My husband doesn't know what are those charges? At that time, nobody explained, this is the three charges you got, and this could lead to deportation. He feel guilty without knowing those charges. He trusts [00:14:00] Nepali translate guy, and he told my husband, if you don't say I'm guilty, you will end up in prison for 20 to 25 years, but if you say I'm guilty, you'll go home. My husband said, guilty. At that time, neither criminal lawyer told my husband, if you say I'm guilty, you'll end up getting deport. Deport to the country that you are you never born. Deport To the country, you doesn't even speak their language. The lawyer did not explain my husband you will not gonna get your green card. You cannot apply your citizenship in your life. If those things the lawyer told my husband at that time, he will never gonna say, I am guilty to the crime that he did not even commit. When they tried to deport my husband back then, Bhutan say, he's not my citizenship, he's not from my country, We don't know this guy. He's not belongs to here. When US Embassy reach out to, Nepal, do you know this guy? They told, ICE no, we don't know this guy, like he's not belongs here. The ICE officer, told my husband, we can let you go, you need to come here, like order of supervision every three months, every six months, whenever we call you. It been 11 years. My husband is following rules and regulation. He never did any violation after that. He got married, he has a life, he pay taxes. He was taking care of his family and in 11 years he was doing everything. In 2025 for the first time they target Bhutanese Nepali community. I knew that this is the last time I'm gonna see my husband. I broke down. When they detained my husband in April 8, I was eight months pregnant. We dream a lot of things we are gonna take care of our daughter. We are gonna buy home, we are gonna work, we are gonna give her the life that we, I'm sorry. Miko Lee: Totally. Okay. Tika Basnet: I never thought like Bhutanese community can, like deport. Like my parent already go through this trauma, when Bhutan throw them away due to ethnic cleansing and same thing happening to us. It is unbelievable. I cannot believe that, we're going through this again and I don't know when this gonna be stopped. I don't know whether like my husband gonna come home. It is been five month and I really want my husband back. My daughter is, three month old. She need her dad in life 'cause I cannot provide everything by myself. My husband is the main provider for her aging parent. 'cause even now they cannot pay bills. I'm fighting for my husband case and I want my husband back. He deserve second chance because if you see his record is clean, like for one incident that happened like 12 years ago, that cannot define my husband. I cannot believe that my husband is able to get deport to the country that doesn't even accept. I don't know whether he gonna get killed. Whether he gonna disappear, I don't know what will happen to him. I don't know if it is last time I'm gonna see him. Miko Lee: Tika, thank you so much for sharing your story. Just to recap really briefly, your husband, Mohan Karki when he was a teenager, newly arrived in the country, was leaving high school, walked with his friends through a backyard and was racially profiled. The neighbor called police because he was trespassing on property. He was born at a refugee camp. Is that right? Tika Basnet: Yes. Miko Lee: There was not property that was like person's property on that refugee camp. So that whole concept of walking across somebody's land was something he was not aware of. He had an interpreter that did not give correct information. And so he signed something, including a deportation order, that he wasn't even aware of until recently when he was put into detention. Is that right? Tika Basnet: Yes. Yes. Miko Lee: Right now he's in detention. You live in Ohio, but he's in detention in Michigan, right? Tika Basnet: Yes. Miko Lee: Okay, Tika, let's talk about Mohans case and what's happening. He's held in detention right now in a detention facility in Michigan. What is going on with his case? Tika Basnet: His criminal attorney file, a Motion to Redeem asking BIA to send that, case back to Georgia. His case, that happened in 2013. Our attorney just submit documentation where he's asking to release my husband because it'd been five month. He's not risk to the community. He's not risk to the flight 'cause he doesn't have no one in Bhutan. He doesn't have no one in Nepal. All family is in here. His community love him ,he has family that loves him. We also get lot of documentations as a proof telling ICE that my husband is not risk to the community or to the flight. Miko Lee: Thank you. He has a a four month old baby that he has yet to meet. So that is a powerful reason to stay. As Tikas pointing out, the lawyer just submitted documentation along with 50 letters of support from the community from employers, from family members, all saying why he should stay in this country. Thank you so much for sharing. Anne, i'm wondering if you could share about what happened to your husband. He was also born in a refugee camp, right? Ann Vue: Lue was born in Nangkai, Thailand refugee camp in 1978. In1979 his parents and him and his older brother Granted urgent humanitarian reasons for or for public benefit. They made it to America right before Halloween. The early nineties, me even being the first generation American here, racism played a lot. We all went through that piece and our parents not speaking English at the same time, they were going to school themselves so that they can learn our English language, . They weren't able to teach us growing up. We had to fend for ourselves. I would say my husband he went out with some friends. He did not commit the crime. But of course now that is brought back to him, he understood about his particular case is second attempt, home invasion. Nobody was harmed. He was in the vehicle, in the backseat when he was caught. He didn't wanna partake, but he didn't wanna stop them either 'cause to him it was like, if I don't partake, then I have nothing to do with it. . Because if I do, then they might not be my friends anymore. It's just a part of growing up as a youth. Because he was there, and then would receive a court appointed attorney, and then provide it very similar to Tika's too. Had an interpreter, that was explaining to them, was provided bad legal advice. He had no knowledge about how this would impact his immigration status. It was advised by their attorney, take the plea it's easier, and you probably serve less than a year. You'll be out, you'll only be in the county jail anyways 'cause you didn't really commit the crime and technically it should have been a misdemeanor. But because you're an accomplice, that kind of falls under this category. So he took the plea, he served 10 months in a county jail. He actually was released for good behavior. He even finished his probation soon because he paid all of his stuff off. He even finished a youth advocate program for anybody that committed crimes between the age of 18 to 21. I just saw this form the other day and I was reading it and it talks about, the one thing about our parents, experiencing the war and coming to America, they don't talk about it. A lot of us are from communist countries. We are very afraid to voice our voices, because someone can take action. Our parents never talked about it. I read what he wrote to his, youth coordinator, he felt so bad about what he did. He created disappointment for his parents and he understands, there are sacrifices that got us here to America. He literally wrote all of this down, i'm going to be a better person. I'm going to make my parents proud now that I understand their sacrifices. They asked him, ” what was your upbringing like?” He wrote, “poor” and the coordinator wrote on the bottom of his comments said, “Lue is remorseful for what has happened and he wants to be a better person. I have no other questions. The training is complete.” He doesn't need any further, support and believes that he will move forward to be a better person. That's literally what they wrote on the document. Then fast forwarding to 1999 that's when, immigration showed up at his house. Him and I would meet in 2000, and then we'd be married in 2001. We'd celebrate. Almost 24 and a half years of marriage. We did appeal his case in the humanitarian piece of what this meant for Lue during the time where we all fled the country. Once the monks were declared enemy of the state by the LDR in Laos, we fled. It's well documented that there was a little bit over 400,000 of us there right after the genocide and the killings of the Hmong there was probably less than 45,000 of us left. Once we understood a lot of that, we wanted to do better. We wanted to really service our community. We appealed the case. The case was then denied in his appeal letters, general Vink Powell, which led the Hmongs during the war, even had a letter where he, also pled why Hmongs need to stay here in America. And why we need to bring the rest of our people to this country. The reality is our whole family, Lue's whole family was wiped out. We don't have anybody, Lue doesn't have anyone. That goes to Tika's thing too. There's nobody there. Going back to the case once it was denied in 2002. He then was forced to reach out to the embassy and was denied, entry into Thailand 'cause that's where he was born. We're stateless too, just like Tikas husband. We were denied by Thailand. We were denied by Laos stating that we are not a citizen of theirs. They do not allow or welcome any sort of entry. In 2006, they actually took his green card and then we again were denied. In 2008 we were denied a third time and that's when his immigration officer was like, just move on and start your life. Laos and Thailand, will never sign a repatriation act with America because of you guys, because of the Hmong people, what you guys have done to their country, making it the most bombed country during the war without even being a part of the war. They will never allow you guys back. So we were like, okay. So we moved forward. Then in 2014, this immigration officer, which we was doing yearly checkups at this time, was like, Hey go get your citizenship, get your green card. They're like you're doing so good. You probably could have a chance to get it. We moved forward to apply for citizenship and for the green card. We were denied in 2015 and we know how expensive this is. You pay $10,000 outright, you don't get that money back. You just have to go at it again. We decided that, we're gonna get his case expunged, and we got his case expunged in 2018. No questions asked. It was very straightforward. Once it was expunged, we continued with our [00:26:00] lives. Very involved in the community. We had six kids . This year we even called his immigration officer and he was like, “Hey, don't worry about it, Lue, we're moving you over to Grand Rapids and you should be fine. Just make sure that you stay outta trouble, continue to follow your stock.” I think what triggered it was when we applied for his work permit in April. He always meets his immigration officer at the end of the year, and we renewed his work permit is what triggered it. The money was cashed out, everything the checks went through while we were receiving that, he was gonna be here, everything was gonna be fine. Then July 15th he was detained at work, six 30 in the morning, the detained officer they told him they know who he is to the community, so they have to do it this way because they don't want any problems. They don't want media, they don't want reporters. He did ask them because he rode his motorcycle for some weird reason. He has not taken his bike out, his motorcycle out in the last three years. But for some reason that night he was like, I just wanna take my bike. So he took his bike that night and when ICE told him, do you have somebody come get your bike? You need to call somebody to come get your bike. He was like, nobody in my family rides motorcycles. I don't have anyone to come get my bike. I think there was some empathy and compassion for him. My husband was like, can I just take my bike back? I've got six kids. I've got my grandma at home and my parents are also at my house right now. I just wanna see them and wanna take my bike back. They asked him, “if we let you go, please don't run.” They followed my husband home and my husband literally called me at 6 37 in the morning and he was like, Hey, ICE is, here they got me. I'm like, “what? What's going on?” It was just so surreal. I was so shocked. It's a 30 minute drive. When he got there, they were already officers, packed tight in our driveway. We live in the country. There were like five or six cop cars there too. We had to walk about half a mile down to go see him. They wouldn't allow him to enter where our home was. The officer told, my husband, told him that they're so sorry. They have to do it this way. They know who he is. They don't want any problems, they don't want any reports in media out here. I will say my experience was a little bit different from others. They did take their mask off when they took him in, they were respectful. They even, talk to my two older boys like, Hey, you guys have money. I could put the money in your dad's account. We're, take him into Grand Rapids, we're gonna process him, and then we're gonna take him to the detention center, which is gonna be in Michigan. They were very open about these steps . My grandma has chronic pulmonary disease stage four. We couldn't haul her fast enough because we only saw him for like maybe a quick minute, and that was it. They did ask us to turn around because they had to take him back and they didn't want our little ones to see them cuffing him. Miko Lee: They actually said, Anne, we don't want any media to be watching this? Ann Vue: I don't want any problems. Miko Lee: Your husband is also quite well known in the Hmong community, right? So probably, they were worried about folks coming out and protesting. Is that, do you think that was the case? Ann Vue: That's what I'm assuming. I don't remember their exact words saying media, but do remember that they didn't want people around, they didn't want to create issues for the community. Because if he would've gotten the letter just like everybody did, which everybody then would receive the letter on Friday, and because my husband is a community leader, he is the Hmong Family Association's president, we restart receiving many, many calls where everybody just wanted to talk to Lue 'cause they needed to know what's going on, how to handle, what to do. At that moment I realized, oh my gosh, they detained my husband first. Then everybody else got a letter. Miko Lee: And the ICE officer that he had been checking in with routinely has he been in touch with him since he was detained? Ann Vue: He hasn't. Miko Lee: So they had different people come in even, 'cause he was the person that said everything's okay, keep going with your life. Ann Vue: Oh yeah. Miko Lee: And so no contact with him whatsoever since the detention? Ann Vue: No. Miko Lee: Okay. Thank you so much. I just wanna point out, for all of our listeners, how many similarities there are in these two cases. In both of these amazing women are here supporting their spouses. Both spouses born in refugee camps. Dealing with intergenerational trauma from families that had to escape ethnic cleansing or involved in a war, came into the United States under, legal properties through refugee resettlement acts, made mistakes as young people, partially due to culture and wanting to fit in. They served their time, they paid their dues. They were racially profiled. They suffered from incredible immigration policy failure with bad advice, with a system that's broken. Now both of them are detained. Not yet deported, but detained. Many of the community members have already been deported and they're facing statelessness. We're seeing this not just with Bhutanese and Hmong folks, but with Mien and Lao and Haitian and El Salvadorian. We could fill in the blank of how many other peoples in other communities are facing this. We also know that these private detention centers where people are being held, are making millions and millions of dollars, and it's connected into our corrupt political system that's in place right now. Aisa, I'm wondering if you could, talk about the case, but also about some of the deals that we think have had to be made with Laos and Bhutan in order for these deportations to even take place. So Aisa from Asian Law Caucus, I'm gonna pass it to you to go over some of the legal ramifications. Aisa Villarosa: Of course, Miko, and thank you for it for the context. There are so many parallels that we as advocates must uplift because this is not the time to be divided. This is the time to build solidarity that we've long known needs to happen. What Miko is referring to is largely something that we've observed around the travel  bans. Earlier this year, right around the time that the Trump administration took hold, there was a draft travel ban list that leaked across a number of media outlets, the Times, et cetera, and the same countries we're talking about today, Bhutan, Laos. These were historically not countries that were subject to sanctions, like the travel ban, and yet here they were. A lot of us were scratching our heads and asking, why is this happening? Our theory, and this is a theory that is now also manifesting in a number of FOIA requests or Freedom of Information Act requests that are submitted from Asian Law Caucus to departments like the State Department ice, the Department of Homeland Security. Asking the same question that Tika and Anne are asking, which is, how are these deportations even happening? They were not happening until this year. What very likely happened was a bit of a quid pro quo. So in removing Bhutan, removing Laos from this list where they could be sanctioned as a country, there was likely some backdoor deal that took place between the US State Department and Bhutanese officials and the US officials, where essentially there was some form of an agreement that there would be an acceptance or a supposed acceptance of a certain number of folks from these communities. That is why around March, for the Bhutanese refugee community, for example, we started seeing pickups very similar to Mohan's case, where, many people who had perhaps made some mistakes in their youth or had really old criminal convictions were swept off the streets and thrust into these really rapid deportation proceedings. I don't even know if proceedings is the right word, because there essentially was no proceeding. The Immigration Court is very much a cloaked process. The immigration judge is kind of judge and jury wrapped up together, which is very different than many of us might turn on the TV and see something like Law and order. An immigration court works a very different way where this piece of paper, this final removal order, basically gives ICE a lot of bandwidth to make these deportations happen. However, that doesn't mean we should just accept that this is happening. We know that just basic procedures of fairness are not being met. We know, too that in the case of, for example, the Bhutanese community ICE officers have come to the wrong house. And put a lot of people in fear. So racial profiling was happening even before this recent Supreme Court decision, which essentially now condones racial profiling, as criteria that the ICE can use. I also just wanted to talk about this trend too, we're seeing with so many cases. It happened to Lue, it happened to Mohan, where in someone's underlying criminal court case, maybe they were given a court appointed attorney. In many cases, they were not told of the immigration impacts of, say, taking a plea. There is a Supreme Court case called Padilla versus Kentucky and basically the law shifted such that in many cases there now is a duty for a court appointed public defender to actually talk to folks like Mohan and Lue about the immigration consequences of their plea. So when Tika mentioned that there's something called a post-conviction relief effort for Mohan. That's happening in Georgia. This is very much what that legal defense looks like, where, an expert attorney will look at that very old court record, see if those rights were violated, and also talk to Mohan and make sure did that violation happen and is that grounds for reopening an immigration case. For Lue, there is a really mighty pardoning campaign that's brewing in the state of Michigan. So in Michigan, governor Gretchen Whitmer does have the authority to in some cases expedite a pardon in process. Unfortunately in the immigration arena the expungement does not have that same weight as say a vacating, or a motion to vacate that criminal record. So it's super frustrating because, so much of this turns ethically, morally on- do we, as people believe in second chances, and I know most people do, and yet here we are really. Based on a technicality. I also just want to name too that Lue as a person is both a natural organizer and he is a spiritual guide of his community. So something that many folks don't know is because of so much of the trauma that Anne talked about, both from, supporting the Americans during the Secret War, many Hmong folks who came to the States, they actually in some cases died in their sleep because of this, almost unexplained weight of the trauma. It almost underscores the importance of Lue, not just to his family, but this family is a collective family. He's both a mentor for so many, he's a spiritual guide for so many. Him being away from his family, away from community, it's like a double, triple wound. for Mohan, I'd love to uplift this memory I have of a moment in June when Tika gave us a call, and at that point, Mohan had called Tika and said, they're taking me, I'm being deported. At that point, they were removing Mohan from the ICE facility in Butler, Ohio and transporting him to the Detroit airport or that deportation to Bhutan. Tika was forced to essentially delay her childbirth. It was very much in the range of when she was due to give birth to their daughter. But because the clock was ticking, Tika drove to Butler, literally begged for Mohans life as our organizing and advocacy and legal team was trying to get together this emergency stay of deportation. That fortunately came through at the 11th hour. But the fact that Mohan remains in this facility in St. Clair, Michigan, that he's never held his daughter is unacceptable, is ridicuLues. I think so much of these two cases almost, this invisible brotherhood of pain that I know Ann has talked to me about that. Because Lue right now has been in a couple facilities. He is organizing, he's doing his thing and actually supporting folks while also just trying to keep himself well, which is no easy feat to do in so many of these facilities. Especially because, in Alexandria, for example, which is a facility in Louisiana. We know that folks are sleeping on cement floors. We know that folks are not being fed, that there's a lot of human rights violations going on. Here is Lue still continuing to use his voice and try to advocate for the folks around him. Miko Lee: Aisa thank you so much for putting that into context, and we'll put links in the show notes for how folks can get involved in both of these cases. One is, Rising Voices call to action for Lue. We encourage folks to do that. In terms of Mohan, there's a GoFundMe to help support Tika and the immense lawyer fees, and also a letter writing campaign to the ICE director Kevin Roff, to try and release Mohan and Lue. These are really important things that are happening in our community, and thank you for being out there. Thank you for talking and sharing your stories. We really appreciate you. And also, just briefly, I'd love us for us to talk for a minute about how many folks in our Asian American communities, we don't wanna talk about mistakes that we have made in the past because we might consider that shameful. And therefore, in both of these communities, when we started organizing, it was really hard at first to find people to come forth and share their stories. So I wonder if both of you can give voice to a little about that, the power you found in yourself to be able to come forward and speak about this, even though some other folks in the community might not feel comfortable or strong enough to be able to talk. Tika, can you speak to that? Tika Basnet: What makes me really strong, and I wanna see that my husband case is because he was 17, people can make mistake and from those mistake, if people are learning. Americans should consider, 'cause my husband did make mistake and I wish that time he knew the rules and regulation. I wish somebody taught him that he's not supposed to go somebody else property, around in backyard. I wish he was been in the United States like more than , one and a half year. I wish, if he was like more than two years, three years. I think that time he, from high school, he could learn. He's not supposed to go there. He was just been in the United States like one and a half year just going to high school. Nobody taught him. His parent doesn't even speak English. Until now, they doesn't even speak, like nobody in our community knew rules and regulation. He doesn't have guide, mentor to taught him like, and even though he did make mistake and he's really sorry, and from those mistake learning a lot, and he never get into trouble, after 11 years, he was clean, he work, he pay taxes. That is the reason that I really wanna come forward. People can make mistake, but learning from those mistake that changed people life. The reason that I'm coming forward is because organization like Asian Law Caucus, ARU, and, Miko, a lot of people helped me. They taught me like people can make mistake and, we shouldn't be same. I really wanna give example to my daughter, that, you are fighting for justice and you shouldn't fear. What is right is right. What is wrong is wrong. But if somebody's make mistake and they are not, doing that mistake again, I think the people can get a second chance. My husband deserves second chance. He's 30 years old. He has a family, he has a wife, children and he deserved to be here. We came here legally, my husband came here. Legally, we, promise that we'll get home and this is our home. We wanna stay here and I really want my husband be home soon so he can play with her daughter to play with his daughter. Miko Lee: Thank you so much, Tika. Ann I wonder if you could talk to the strength that it takes for you to come forward and speak about your husband and your family. Ann Vue: I'm a community leader with my husband. There was a moment when he was first detained where I was in complete silence. I was so shocked. It took my attorney, Nancy, just talking to me about it. Of course, back to what Aisa said earlier in our communities, we're afraid. I was so scared. I didn't know what to do. It took me visiting my husband in Baldwin and letting him know that, hey, a bunch of community members are now reaching out. And that's that. At that moment, he was like, you have to say something. You have to say something you have to make noise because you have a, 50% chance, right? We have a 50 50 chance. 50%. They're gonna send me 50%. You're gonna feel bad if you don't say anything, right? 50 here, 50 there. It doesn't matter. But a hundred percent regret if you don't say something. I thought about it and he was like, well, go out there, be my voice. He's like, you've always been my voice. You got this right. I didn't say no to Nancy. 'cause she really wanted to talk to our rep Mai you know about this. Mai and I are pretty close too. , I just knew if I said anything, Mai's gonna be like mm-hmm. All the way. I just let Nancy help me, and my most vulnerable time. I'm glad that she did. I'm glad that we did get this out. It is the most important thing for us. what keeps me going is all of those that have been impacted by this, from people like Tika. I have many, I call 'em sisters. We're all in a lot of these group chats together. They've been also keeping me going. Our amazing team of attorneys and everybody just strategizing through this unprecedented time. It's really everyone's voices. I get to talk to Lue daily. It's definitely not cheap, but he gets to share each story of each person. I believe that everybody has a story and they might not be as lucky as maybe Tika or my husband, but at least now I have their story. I will be their voice. I will tell each person's story, each name, each alien number that I track down, my husband's even literally learned how to count in Spanish, just so he can give them like my phone number in Spanish in case they need to call an emergency. Oh, I'm be getting a lot of calls. that is what keeps me going because I think that Tika and I and many others are, hoping that there is going to be a better day, a brighter day. I hope that everyone can see that, our children are American, right? Our children, they deserve to have their fathers and their mothers. They deserve to grow with these parents. And with that being said, the most important thing to me is they're not just bystanders. They're literally the future of America. I don't want them growing up with trauma, with trying to ask me questions “well mom, if we're refugees and we helped, Americans as allies, and we come to this country, why is this payback like this?” There's a moral obligation that has to be there and they're gonna grow up and they're gonna be trauma by this. I've got children right now that's been talking about joining the National Guard. It speaks volume about what happens to my husband. He's championed the Hmong, Michigan Special Gorilla unit, the Hmong veterans here in the last two years, really  with helping them through resolutions, tributes, making sure that they have things, that they are out there, that people now know them, they are finally recognized. This puts my husband at great danger by sending him back, because now he's championed the veterans here. He celebrates our veterans here. So it's a moral obligation. I hope that, and this is to every child, I hope that every child, they deserve their father's presence. There are many people who don't even have their father's presence and they wish their fathers were around. Our fathers wanna be around. I hope that our daughter, I only have one daughter too, that someday they can, their fathers can be a part of their, the American culture. I hope that we get that opportunity and I hope that somebody stop being scared, but turn around and help us. Help us. We came here legally, minor stuff, long decade old. This detainment has been worse than when he did time back in 1997. I just hope that somebody hears our podcast, Miko. Thank you. Aisa and Tika. And they turn and they have some compassion and help us because this is the tone that we're setting for the future of our American children. Miko Lee: Thank you so much for sharing. Tika, you wanna add? Tika Basnet: Yes, I really wanna talk about what kind of husband Mohan is. Even though like he detained for five month I put lot of money in his account and there was one guy, his family cannot support him. For me, it is really hard. I'm not working. But even my husband called me you don't need to put like money in my account, but can you please can you please put money in his account? He did not eat food. His family did not have money. I can survive without eating food. I think his story is really touching me. My husband was crying listening to that guy story in detention center and then I did put like $50 in his account. My husband is giving person. He love to give even though, he struggle a lot, even though, he doesn't know what will happen when he get deport. But, him saying other guy story. Does make him cry. I think this is the reason that I really wanna come forward. My husband is giving person, he's lovely person, he's caring person. That is the reason I wanna come forward. I want people to hear our voice, rather than silent. Right now people know our story. But if I was silent then I don't know whether my husband was already disappear. I don't know whether he gonna die torture or maybe he will expel within 24 hours. I have no idea. My husband is number one support system for me, because of him I'm here sharing his story. For years I had wonderful time with him. We build our dream and until 2025, our dream is destroy. I'm trying to build again. I'm hoping, my husband is coming home soon and I'm hoping that this will be the last time that he will get detained. I hope that this will be the end. I don't want him to get detained or deported again. I'm really tired. I don't know what to do. I'm hopeless. I hope listening to my story and Ann's story that separating family is not good. It is affecting not only one person but his whole community, whole family. We deserve to get our husband back. It is not only about the wife that is fighting for husband, it is the children. They're so small, they born here and we cannot raise alone, we cannot work. We have things to pay. Paying bills and taking care of child alone is really difficult. It's been five month. I went through postpartum depression, I went through trauma and I don't wanna deal anymore. Like I don't have courage to do this anymore. We need our husband back. Miko Lee: Thank you. I think both of your husbands are also main caregivers for parents that are ailing in both cases. It's a really important that we are intergenerational communities and as you both said, it's not just about the children, but it's also about parents and brothers and sisters and community members as well. Thank you so much for lifting up your stories. I just wanna go back for one more thing. We talked briefly about the crazy expensive lawyer fees that have come up for families that they've been dealing with this, and then also Tika was just bringing up about detention and commissary fees. Can you talk a little bit about the prison industrial complex and the fees that are associated? As Anne was saying, just calling Lue every day the costs that are associated with those things. Many people that don't have a family member that's incarcerated don't know about that. Can you share a little bit about what that system is? Aisa Villarosa: Yeah, absolutely Miko. Just to underscore, a big theme from this conversation, is that the US made commitments and they have broken them, both with, as Anne talked about, the refugee experience is one that is made possible through US commitment of acknowledging what, people have survived, what they have given to the country. Folks are being removed to countries where not only do they have zero ties to, don't speak the language, but, especially in the case of the Bhutanese refugee community, as Tika mentioned, it is truly a double expulsion. So the fact that we have well-documented testimonials of folks deported from Bhutan after they're removed there into these life-threatening conditions . A community member passed away in large part because of the failure of the US to both care for them while in detention. So going back to that prison complex, but also just putting them in such a harrowing situation. In another instance, a community member was found after wandering for over a hundred miles on foot. So this is not, deportation and the story ends. This is deportation and, there is a family that is grieving and thinking through next steps, there is, this call to not have borders, break us the way that this country is trying to do. And to say a little bit about the fees, USCIS, there, there has not been a point yet in history where so many changes and charges hurting families have been ushered in, But for this year. To give a couple examples of that – asylum cases for one, these often take many years through this administration. Now, families have to pay a cost yearly for each year that your asylum application, languishes because we're also seeing that those same folks who are supposed to process these applications are either being laid off or they're being militarized. So something like USCIS where this was where one would go to apply for a passport. Now the same department is literally being handed guns and they're now taking folks during naturalization interviews. Other avenues to challenge your removal. Like I mentioned a motion to reopen. All these things used to be fairly affordable. Now they can cost many thousands of dollars on top of the attorney fees. So something that's been quite challenging for groups like Asian Law Caucus where we do have attorneys representing folks in removal proceedings, there's often this misperception that oh it's costing so much money. Attorneys are pocketing cash. Unfortunately there are some situations where attorneys have been known to take advantage of families in this desperate moment. But for many, many attorneys who are in this mix, they're experts at this work. They're trying to do the right thing. They're both overwhelmed and they're seeing these new charges, which make the battle really even more difficult. So to turn it back to the listeners, I would say that as powerless as this moment can make us feel everyone is bearing witness. Hopefully the listeners today can take in Anne's story, can take in Tika's story and whatever power one has in their corner of the world, this is the moment to use that. Whether it's your voice, whether it's learning more about a community, maybe you're learning about for the first time. This is really the moment to take action. Miko Lee: Thank you Aisa. I wanna thank you all for being here with me today, for sharing your personal stories, your personal pain, and for recognizing that this is happening. We deeply believe that we need to keep our families together. That is really important. It is written into the very basis of this American country about redemption and forgiveness. And this is what we're talking about for misunderstandings that happened when these folks were young men, that they have paid for their time, and yet they're being punished again, these promises that were broken by this American government, and we need to find ways to address that. I really wanna deeply thank each of you for continuing to be there for sharing your voice, for protecting one another, for being there and standing up for your family and for our community. Thank you for joining me today. Check out our Apex Express Show notes to find out about how you can get involved. Learn about the Rising Voices campaign for Lue Yang and Mohan Khaki's GoFundMe. On November 3rd, 4:00 PM Pacific Time, 7:00 PM Eastern Time. Join us for We Belong here, Bhutanese and Hmong Americans in the Struggle Against Statelessness, a live virtual event featuring my three guests tonight, along with performances and conversations. Please check out our website, kpfa.org/program, apex Express to find out more about our show. APEX Express is a collective of activists that includes Ayame Keane-Lee, Anuj Vaidya, Cheryl Truong, Isabel Li, Jalena Keane-Lee, Miko Lee, Preeti Mangala Shekar and Swati Rayasam. Have a great night.     The post APEX Express – 10.30.25-We Belong! appeared first on KPFA.

It's almost October 31st so join your Afternoona's Megan, Amy and Lia for a conversation on all that frights and delights with Korean Dramas. What hair gave you a jump scare? Best villain? Ideas for future scary dramas? Also, Lia fights her yearly (lonely) battle demanding justice for Almond Joys. Ready to download your first audiobook? Don't forget to click HERE for your free Audible trial.*Audible is a sponsor of Afternoona Delight Podcast*Are your family and friends sick of you talking about K-drama? We get it...and have an answer. Join our AfterNoona Delight Patreon and find community among folks who get your obsession. And check out www.afternoonadelight.com for more episodes, book recs and social media goodness. And don't forget about the newest member of our network: Afternoona Asks where diaspora Asians living in the West find ways to reconnect to Asian culture via Asian/KDramas.Last but CERTAINLY not least....love BTS? Or curious what all the fuss is about? Check out our sister pod Afternoona Army for "thinky, thirsty and over thirty" takes on Bangtan life. ★ Support this podcast on Patreon ★

Join Lia and Megan as we do 5 minutes (yep, we brought out the timers—Not Today, procrastination!) of hot takes on each member. What have they been up to? What might be Yet to Come? From Dior to medical centers, from CK to Celine...and of course comeback. This episode is pure Dynamite, so get ready to Run with us.Join The BTS Buzz and get access to Afternoona Army's exclusive DISCORD channel, get shout outs on-air in podcast, and receive invitations to quarterly live support groups. Questions? Email afternoonaarmy@gmail.com for more information.Are your family and friends sick of you talking about K-drama? We get it...and have an answer. Check out our sister pod www.afternoonadelight.com for more episodes, book recs and social media goodness. And don't forget about the newest members of our network: Afternoona Asks where diaspora Asians living in the West find ways to reconnect to Asian culture via Asian/KDramas.Want to find more great BTS content? Head over to Afternoona Army for more takes on Bangtan life and links to our social media.

Follow me on X (@chinaadventures) where I post new China city prayer profiles every single day. Send any notes or comments to bfwesten at gmail dot com and find much more, including my missionary biographies, at PrayGiveGo.us! Today I begin by discussing Trump’s visit to Malaysia (today!) and how he is likely perceived by Malaysians (and Asians in general), plus a note about Doug Wilson’s Open Letter to Trump and its availability here in Malaysia (and everywhere). Check out (and share!) Doug's message to Trump at: TrumpRepent.my Next we look at this week’s Chinese cities to pray for (x.com/china.myadventures, PrayforChina.us), including a deeper look at an early missionary to Mongolia (James Gilmour: https://www.missionary.com/articles/who-was-james-gilmour). Pray for China places of the week https://chinacall.substack.com/p/pray-for-china-oct-27-nov-2-2025 Luke McKinney, the Podcast Ninja from the Comedian Next Door podcast, joins me for the second half of the podcast in a conversation we recorded earlier today (Noon on Saturday Malaysia time, Midnight Eastern): The Comedian Next Door Podcast: https://pubtv.flfnetwork.com/tabs/the-pub/podcasts/8295 We discussed our respective NBA teams (Pacers & Thunder) for the first 20 minutes or so, before moving on to a number of China related topics including Hong Kong freedom (or not), the restrictions on Chinese churches, and LeBron and the NBA’s nefarious relationship with China. Finally, the last few minutes of the podcast take us to the topic of deer hunting, but Luke’s only been out two more times than I have (and I haven’t been out at all, here in Malaysia). Subscribe to China Compass and leave a review on your preferred podcast platform. Follow us on X (@chinaadventures), and find much more @ PrayGiveGo.us. Luke 10, verse 2, the harvest is plentiful but the workers are few. Talk again soon!

Follow me on X (@chinaadventures) where I post new China city prayer profiles every single day. Send any notes or comments to bfwesten at gmail dot com and find much more, including my missionary biographies, at PrayGiveGo.us! Today I begin by discussing Trump’s visit to Malaysia (today!) and how he is likely perceived by Malaysians (and Asians in general), plus a note about Doug Wilson’s Open Letter to Trump and its availability here in Malaysia (and everywhere). Check out (and share!) Doug's message to Trump at: TrumpRepent.my Next we look at this week’s Chinese cities to pray for (x.com/china.myadventures, PrayforChina.us), including a deeper look at an early missionary to Mongolia (James Gilmour: https://www.missionary.com/articles/who-was-james-gilmour). Pray for China places of the week https://chinacall.substack.com/p/pray-for-china-oct-27-nov-2-2025 Luke McKinney, the Podcast Ninja from the Comedian Next Door podcast, joins me for the second half of the podcast in a conversation we recorded earlier today (Noon on Saturday Malaysia time, Midnight Eastern): The Comedian Next Door Podcast: https://pubtv.flfnetwork.com/tabs/the-pub/podcasts/8295 We discussed our respective NBA teams (Pacers & Thunder) for the first 20 minutes or so, before moving on to a number of China related topics including Hong Kong freedom (or not), the restrictions on Chinese churches, and LeBron and the NBA’s nefarious relationship with China. Finally, the last few minutes of the podcast take us to the topic of deer hunting, but Luke’s only been out two more times than I have (and I haven’t been out at all, here in Malaysia). Subscribe to China Compass and leave a review on your preferred podcast platform. Follow us on X (@chinaadventures), and find much more @ PrayGiveGo.us. Luke 10, verse 2, the harvest is plentiful but the workers are few. Talk again soon!

Visuals: https://getbehindthebillboard.com/episode-96-ajab-samraiEpisode #96 features Ajab Samrai, Ex-CCO of Ogilvy Japan, who not only brought incredible stories of nearly four decades in the business, but two enormous bags of apples from his orchard in the Malvern Hills.We discussed how Ajab started his career at Saatchi & Saatchi in 1987 as one of the first British born Asians to break into the industry, creating the iconic Commission for Racial Equality poster campaign. He became one of the youngest Creative Group Heads in the history of Saatchi's going on to work on some of the world's biggest brands.We discovered why he decided to ‘frighten himself' after his long tenure at Saatchi's to take up the challenge of Ogilvy Japan, an agency in a different country, with a different culture and different language. Plus the agency was stuck at the very bottom of the Ogilvy league. No pressure then!His story of success is a lesson in perseverance and belief with some incredible OOH projects for Tokyo FM and Uber Eats, helping Ogilvy Japan become agency of the year and Ajab was named Japanese creative of the year. This success helped push his awards tally to over 300, winning major honours at every show in the world.Listen to the craft that went into the Sagawa soy sauce campaign, where all the imagery was created by an artist using soy sauce. And hear how the Condomania campaign flirted with suffocating the cast on what must be one of the most insane shoots ever. We even had time to cover the Mount Fuji Rubbish Billboards which were anything but rubbish, cleaning up the mountain and at awards shows alike.Ajab thank you so much for being so generous with your stories (and your apples!). It was a real pleasure.Thanks to our sponsorsBauer Media OutdoorView2FillSuper OptimalGAS Music

A weekly magazine-style radio show featuring the voices and stories of Asians and Pacific Islanders from all corners of our community. The show is produced by a collective of media makers, deejays, and activists. On tonight's episode, we're focusing on a particular segment of our immigrant and refugee community, Hmong and Bhutanese refugees. Both of these targeted communities are stateless with no land to call their own, and their deportation carries the very real danger of disappearance and death. Robin Gurung from Asian Refugees United and Kao Ye Thao from Hmong innovating Politics, discuss their community and personal refugee stories, and talk about the intersection of the US' deeply broken immigration and criminal legal systems, otherwise known as crimmigration. We also get to hear from the wives of two detained refugees, one Bhutanese and one Hmong, who are currently fighting to keep their families together and to protect their loved ones from the dangers of deportation as stateless people.   Important Links: Hmong Innovating Politics: Website | Instagram Asian Refugees United: Website | Instagram Bhutanese American Refugee Rights website Transcript Swati Rayasam: You are tuned in to Apex Express on KPFA. My name is Swati Rayasam. Since the onset of the Trump administration, immigrant and refugee communities have been under increased attack, being kidnapped in broad daylight, detained in unsanitary and unsafe conditions, and deported to countries many of them barely know. All without due process or communication to their loved ones and communities. On tonight's episode, we're focusing on a particular segment of our immigrant and refugee community, Hmong and Bhutanese refugees. Both of these targeted communities are stateless with no land to call their own, and their deportation carries the very real danger of disappearance and death. Robin Gurung from Asian Refugees United and Kao Ye Thao from Hmong innovating Politics, discuss their community and personal refugee stories, and talk about the intersection of the US' deeply broken immigration and criminal legal systems, otherwise known as crimmigration. We also get to hear from the wives of two detained refugees, one Bhutanese and one Hmong, who are currently fighting to keep their families together and to protect their loved ones from the dangers of deportation as stateless people. I also want to note because this is a rapidly developing situation, that this episode was recorded on August 13th, 2025, and is being released on August 28th, 2025. For the most recent updates, please go to bhutaneserefugeerights.org or check out the Pardon Refugees campaign. Now, here's Miko. Miko: Welcome to Apex Express. Thank you so much for being here today. I'm so glad to bring you all together in this time. I'm wondering if I could ask you each to introduce yourselves and tell us a little bit about the community your organization serves and what you do, and let's start with Kao Ye. Kao Ye: Hello everyone, and thank you for making space- my name is Kao Ye Tao. I use she her pronouns, and I work as the director of policy and partnerships with an organization called Hmong Innovating Politics. We are an organization that serves Hmong youth and families in Sacramento and Fresno, which holds two of our largest Hmong American communities in California. And our work with Hmong youth and families is really about developing their leadership to organize towards social justice and to get the resources that their communities deserve. Miko: Thank you, Kao Ye and Robin, could you please introduce yourself? Robin: Sure. My name is Robin Gurung. I use he, him, his, I'm from the Nepali speaking Bhutanese community. I live in Harrisburg, Pennsylvania. my role at Asian Refugees United is the co-founder and the co-executive director. We have our program in California and Pennsylvania. California programs are, are serving Asian diaspora and then, Pennsylvania programs are focused serving the Nepal speaking Bhutanese community. We work in the intersection of arts and healing, storytelling, civic engagement, leadership development. Thank you. Miko: Thanks Robin and I am your host Miko Lee, lead producer at Apex Express. And all of us are part of a network called AACRE Asian Americans for Civil Rights and Equality, which is a network of progressive Asian American groups. So you all work with refugee populations. I'm wondering if you could tell a little bit more about the backstory of your community, and also if you feel comfortable about how you personally came to be a refugee in the United States. And, Robin, I'd love to start with you on that one. Robin: Sure. My community is Nepali speaking, Bhutanese refugee community. And we are ethnically Nepali, which means culture wise and language wise we speak Nepali and follow the Nepali culture tradition. Our ancestors like maybe in 18 hundreds, 19 hundreds migrated from Nepal to Bhutan and became the citizen of that country. And most people don't know about Bhutan, it's a very tiny country between China and India. And, if people know about Bhutan, then people know it through the cross national happiness concept, Bhutan is considered the happiest country in the world. So our ancestors were in mostly in the southern area of Bhutan for generations, they became the citizen. They had their own home, their own land. And then later, 1980s, early nineties, there was a policy by the government of Bhutan, which is the monarchy government system- king rules the country. They brought a policy called One Nation, One People Policy. Which means all different groups of people would have to follow the same culture, same religion, kind of follow the same dress code and because of that policy all people were forced to stay away from following our own culture or our own religion, which, most of our folks were Hindu. Our people protested against it and because of that, the government expelled over a hundred thousand of our community members. And, they expelled to India and then from like India wouldn't allow us to stay and we had to resettle in Nepal in seven different refugee camps under different international agencies like U-N-H-C-R and other agencies. Miko: And then Robin, can you tell a little bit about your personal story and how you came here? Robin: Yeah. Yeah. So 1992 is when my family had to leave Bhutan. And at that time I was three years old. I remember growing up in a refugee camp in Nepal, from three years until I was 23 years. So 20 years of my life I was in a refugee camp in Nepal. And in 2012, I came to US through the refugee resettlement program introduced to our camps in 2008, and through it US agreed to resettle 60,000 of our committee members. By 2017, I think US has resettled about 70 to 80,000 of our Bhutanese community members.   Miko: Thank you so much for sharing. Kao Ye I wonder if you could talk about your community and the refugee resettlement program that your community was a part of. Kao Ye: The Hmong American community, or just the Hmong community overall, is a group that's indigenous to East and Southeast Asia. And through our ancient history, we've always been a stateless, people fighting for our autonomy to live to practice our customs and our culture. And particularly where we come into this history of refugee is during the Vietnam War where many Hmong people, alongside other ethnic groups in Laos, were caught in the crossfire of the United States conflict in Southeast Asia. And so with the Vietnam War. The Hmong as well as many other ethnic communities that lived, in the hills and the mountains were recruited in covert operations by the CIA to fight back against the Vietnamese, the Northern Vietnamese communist forces, as well as the Putet Lao. And so once the US withdrew from Southeast Asia, it created a vacuum of conflict and violence that our people had to escape from in order to survive. And so after the Vietnam War in 1975, we saw the mass displacement of many Southeast Asian ethnic communities, including Hmong families. And that is where my history starts because my parents were born in Laos and because of this war, they fled to Thailand refugee camps and lived there for a few years until they were able to come to the United States in 1992. And I'm actually I'm a child of refugees and so what I know about this part of my history comes from the stories of my grandparents who raised me as well as what little I could learn in the textbooks of public education. And so it wasn't actually until going to college and. Being able to access more of this literature, this history that I really learned about what the United States had done in Southeast Asia and the ramifications of that for myself and my family and so many others, refugees that. Have to have had to resettle in the United States. And so it's definitely a history that runs very close, because we have relatives that live through that refugee experience. And so it is very well and alive. And so as we now approach this conversation around ICE and deportations, it really is a reminder of the trauma that our people face, but are still facing as a people that have been seen as disposable to the United States government. Miko: Thanks, Kao Ye. Let's talk a little bit more about that. But first I wanna say, did either of you ever hear about refugees in your textbooks? I never did. So I'm wondering if, you said you learned a little bit about that from textbooks. Was that something you learned in public education. Kao Ye: I did not learn about refugees or refugees experience. I learned about the war and as a Hmong kid it brought me so much delight to try to scroll through the history books just to see if Hmong people were mentioned. And even then the refugee experience was not ever something that we talked about. I felt like definitely not in, in high school. I think it was college really, that then started to articulate those terms and that Southeast Asian identity, that is really where I think I also became politicized in that. Miko: Yeah, because I think in textbooks there might be a little section on the Vietnam War, but it does not talk about the, all the Southeast Asian ethnic peoples that actually fought in the war. We have to dig that information out on our own, but I wanna move us to what is happening right now. So the Trump administration has created. Culture of fear among immigrants and refugees, these ICE raids and disappearances. It is so intense and using immigrants as a fear tool to prop up white supremacy is so blatant right now. I'm wondering if you can each talk about, how this administration's policies are impacting your communities. And, Robin, let's start with you. What is happening right now? I know since the end of March, can you share a little bit about what's been happening with Bhutanese Americans? Robin: Sure. Sure. So our people were settled to this country with the hope that this is going to be our home. But starting March of this year, with the new policies of this current administration, we started seeing abrupt, ICE arrest in our communities. People were picked up from home, their workplaces, and from their ICE, check-ins. And, since March, within I would say two to three months, more than 72 of our community members were picked up, mostly from Pennsylvania and then Ohio, and also from other states like New York, Georgia, North Dakota. So until now, we have, the records of at least 50 people who have been deported to Bhutan and at least 72 who are detained. So more than 30 people are [at risk] of getting detained. The nature of the ICE arrests that we have seen is we don't know whether the due processes were followed. They made it so hard for the families to look for attorneys, and also to track their family members. Within days family members would find their loved ones disappeared, and then they wouldn't be able to talk to them they wouldn't be able to track them and provide the support that they needed. So for us as a community organization we did not anticipate this and we were not prepared for this. And, and we didn't have the infrastructure to really address this, right? So it became such challenging work for us. Like within days we had to mobilize our people. We had to mobilize our teams to help family members with legal support, emotional support, mobilize our community members to update what's happening with this situation. The rapid response work, know your rights clinics that we had to set up. So on one hand it's the detention and deportation in the US and on the other hand, when our people were deported to Bhutan, what we're seeing is within 24 hours, they are being expelled from Bhutan to India, and then from India because India wouldn't accept them as well, they had to enter Nepal because for most of these Deportee, they're very young, they were born in refugee camps, and for most of them, the only known land is Nepal. Right. And they had to enter Nepal without documentation. And then some of them were found in refugee camps. And most of them are unknown. Like they're, they have disappeared. Miko: So that is so much over the last few months that ARU has had to step in and take a leading, role in this situation that has impacted the Bhutanese community from focusing on wellness and youth development to suddenly translating materials into Nepali, translating, know Your Rights materials into Nepali, hosting all these different events, the work that you have been doing is really powerful. I wonder if you could share with us the story of Mohan Karki, who is a community member that's currently detained in Michigan. Robin: Sure. So, Mohan Karki is now in detention in Michigan and he's a community member member who lived in Ohio. So he was detained by ICE during his regular ICE check-in , I believe in April, they detained him and then he was taken for deportation. And last minute, the families and the community had to come together and then appeal the deportation. Right now he's in Michgan detention center and his wife, who was pregnant and had due date, when Mohan was being deported on June 10, is now fighting day and night to stop the deportation and also to bring Mohan home. Right now, Asian Refugees United and other community partners, like AWPAL, Asian Law Caucus are working together to support Mohan's family, to bring Mohan home and also running a, GoFund me fundraiser, to help the family pay the legal fees. Miko: Thanks Robin. And we're gonna listen to Tikas story right now. Tika Basnet: Hi, my name is Tika Basnet I'm from Ohio and I'm fighting my husband deportation case. So on April seven, a lot of people told us not to go to the ICE office, but my husband wanna follow the rules, he wanna go there. We went to the Westerville office inside And we sit down, we talk to each other. Nothing will go wrong. And suddenly ICE told us to come inside and they told us that my husband got travel documents from Bhutan. I told them like it is not safe for my husband to get deport in Bhutan, all the Bhutanese people run away in 1990s due to the ethnic cleansing and if my husband get deported in Bhutan, he will either gonna get killed, tortured, disappeared, imprisoned, I don't know what will happen, but they did not listen to me. So they detained my husband and I came at the parking lot and his mom saw me coming alone. So they start crying and I told them like, Mohan is gone and this is the last time I think I'm gonna see my husband. the time that my husband was taken away from Butler County on June 10 I was 41 weeks pregnant. I was supposed to deliver on, June 10. But no, I told the doctor I change my delivery time. I am not gonna go now like I need to fight for my husband. Like, When Bhutanese people started coming here in 2007. Third party promise us that in here in United States, we will get our identity. That identity will never taken away. They promise us that the way Bhutan take our identity, they will not gonna do that. we thought that this is our home. We thought that having a green card, having a citizenship, it is permanently, but no, we are, we all are wrong. And that identity is taken away within a second. And we became stateless again. So, my husband, Mohan Karki he just arrived in the United States he been here less than two years when the incident happened. He did not understand the law. He did not understand the culture. He did not know anything. My husband he was only 17 years old, high school student coming from school to home. On the way to reach their apartment, there is one private house. They are just trying to go to the shortcut from the backyard. So some neighbor call 9 1 1. And that only one mistake lead to deportation. The place that we come from, there is no boundaries. In Nepal, we are allowed to go anybody property We are allowed to walk somebody else house and because of the cultural difference, he's paying price right now. At that time, nobody can speak English. They cannot understand what police were saying and Nepali interpreter told my husband that if you say I'm guilty, you'll out of prison soon. But if you did not say I'm guilty, you'll end up in prison for 20 to 25 years. High school student he's scared he just say, I'm guilty, and he did not know what is deportation mean. He did not know what he was signing. Nobody informed him what he was signing. That signing was deportation. What happened in 2013 is impacting us in 2025 and still he wish he did not cross somebody else backyard at that time. He wish he knew that he wasn't allowed to cross somebody else's backyard. I don't know what will our future is gonna be, but I hope that he gets second chance. His community love him. He love people. He was working as a truck driver. He paid taxes. He was supporting his parent. He was supporting me. My daughter deserve to have a father. You know, she's just one month. But now the dream that I was hoping one day I'm gonna build with my husband that is taken away and I'm left alone with this child. I already went through a lot without him, i'm the only one that fighting for my husband case. The deportation is not only breaking one family, but it is breaking everybody, the community and the family. And I hope that people can support me so I can fight for my husband case. Like I really need so many attorney. I need criminal attorney to open up his 2013 case. And I have wonderful, wonderful attorney, my husband get stay off removal, but that is not guarantee my husband can get deport anytime. The attorney fee are really expensive and he still needs support. The US made bhutanese people a promise of home. We belong here. Stop the detention and deportation. Stop deporting Bhutanese people. We are stateless. We don't have country, don't have a home. This is our home. US is our home. We belong here. Miko: Of the 72 people, Mohan is the first Bhutanese refugee that we actually have a stay of release on, as Robin was saying earlier, most of the folks were moved from state to state, so you can't really get a lawyer in that time. And as we all know, nonprofit immigration lawyers are under a lot of stress because of the attack of this administration. So it makes it incredibly complicated, let alone the legal fees that it costs to help support people going through this. And right now, Mohan has a stay on his, deportation and the lawyer that they do have is drafting up a letter to be able to release him into the community and also overturn his original case that happened as a minor in Georgia, which was a ridiculous case where he was leaving school, early high school, first year in the country, leaving high school early, and walked with his friends across a backyard. And the neighbor that they walked through their yard called the police, and they arrested him along with his friends for trespassing, they gave him paperwork that he didn't even understand. He signed it along with a interpreter they gave him false information to say he'd be locked up for 25 years, or if he signed this papers, that would be fine. He could go and what the papers said was it changed his charge into a felony and had him sign a letter of deportation. So this is part of the failure of our American legal system that we're not providing adequate information. It is a lack of due process. Thankfully, the work that Asian Law Caucus and United States of Stateless and other community activists are doing to call this out and help work with us is really critical. I wanna turn now to Kao Ye how this administrations is impacting Hmong refugees, and how is it similar or different to the experiences that Robin is describing for the Nepali speaking Bhutanese community? Kao Ye: I echoed many of the sentiments and the challenges that Robin shared around what we as nonprofit, grassroots organizations are having to build and grapple with just the limited infrastructure that we have to deal with the current ICE disappearances and deportation and all the support that's needed for the families. And so thank you Robin, for sharing that. I wanted to start broad a little bit because I think that this Trump administration is happening in the backdrop of the 50th year commemoration of the end of the wars in Southeast Asia and the refugee resettlement. We had over 1.1 million Southeast Asians resettle to the United States, the largest immigration resettlement, in American history. And so this year brings so many complexities, I think as a Southeast Asian community where there is a level of looking back at policies that have impacted us and have failed, but also looking forward what is the community that we are building together to move and progress together. And so there are those complexities, I think as the fact that it's the 50th year and like, this is what we're dealing with. This is the trauma that we are grappling with. And so I wanted to put that out front and center because even I think within our communities , there is no necessarily enlightenment in terms of how we talk about what is happening to our people and how they're getting deported unjustly. So that is why it is so important to have this dialogue within our communities as well as the solidarity that we also share with the Bhutanese community and other immigrant groups too. I think that in many of our Southeast Asian communities, their reasons for deportations is very tied to past convictions, and so this is the intersection between criminal law and immigration law. And it makes it complex because our people are now having to consult not just an immigration lawyer, but like criminal attorney so that they could really assess like what kind of relief they can get in order to mitigate, impending deportations. And then also miko you had shared about the lack of adequate legal service or representation because many of these folks, right, that have had these convictions that have now served their time and are simply members of our community that make our community rich. They are now having to revisit removal orders that they signed, thinking that, oh, nothing necessarily was gonna happen because they don't have a repatriation agreement. So, in our community, there was never a thought that we were going to be deported back to our home country because of that policy. And so that is a big contributing factor as to why the Hmong community, we don't have that infrastructure to really support our members who have gone through the criminal justice system and now have those removal orders. And so HIP, as well as many other grassroots. Sadly we did have to scramble to put this know your rights information together because again, I don't think that there was visibility in the need for us in this conversation around immigration Southeast Asians are a segment of our API community and so it just, I think, multiplied the invisibility that we already faced as a group of Southeast Asians. And so the support was definitely not there. And, to Robin's point, we did our best to try to put this information together to our community, starting with the Know Your Rights. And then we also realized like it was more complex than that, and that the legal supports were so necessary because everyone's case was different. I think what we're still dealing with now is that there's always been a lack of trust between our community members and government entities and nonprofit organizations. And so, if someone is dealing with the situation, they wanna go to, a partner that they trust to help them, even if they're not necessarily equipped to do that work, is that they're going to only the people that they trust because there is such a big mistrust. And so I think that, there is still the level of trust building that is needed to be done within our community so that folks feel comfortable to come to us or come to other people for support. And I think what makes me feel emotional is just when I hear about community members feeling hopeless and just feeling like there's nothing that they can do and that level of disempowerment to me, I think is something that is real. And I can't say that we can't combat it, but I think that it is about being able to find different outlets of support for them. Miko: Thank you for lifting that up. And just , in terms of the numbers, over three months, March, April and May, there were about 72 Bhutanese Americans that have been detained. And this is just kind of starting up with the Hmong community. So we had 15 that were detained from Minnesota and another 10 right now are being held in Michigan. And we also see this happening with Vietnamese, Laotian, Cambodians, and Myan folks. All of these folks as Kao Ye you're pointing out, have had common threads, which is connections with the system, with the criminal legal/ justice system and crimmigration is something that in the AACRE network we've been talking about and working on, which is really about the education to prison, to deportation pipeline. And one of the things that this administration had talked about is, let's get rid of all the murderers and the rapists. You know, this like scare language about people that are convicted criminals, let's get rid of them all. But the fact of the matter. The vast majority of all of these people are people like Mohan Karki, a cultural misunderstanding that happened when he was a child. Like Lou Yang, who is Hmong refugee detained in Michigan right now. Somebody who was involved in something as a kid, but has since then become a leader in the community. So let's take a moment and listen to the spouse of Lou Yang, a Hmong refugee detained in Michigan in July. Anne Vu: My name is Anne Vu and I come before you today with a heart full of hope. Sorrow and a plea for justice. I am a proud American, a mother of six, the daughter of Hmong refugees who would gain their citizenship, and the wife of a man called Lou Yang, who is now detained and faced with potential deportation from the only country that he's ever known. Lou has lived in Michigan since October, 1979. He was born stateless in a refugee camp in Nongkai Thailand and his family fled Laos due to persecution. His father and like many others, served with the United States force during the Vietnam War as part of the Secret War, recruited by CIA in Laos, a conflict that most Americans do not know has happened. The Hmong were recruited by the CIA as part of the Secret War to help America during the Vietnam War. But when the war ended and the US withdrew, we were as the Hmongs declared enemy of the state. What followed was genocide, polarization and persecution by the state, and it was because of our alliance, the promise made by the US government that the Hmong refugees were legally settled here under certain migration of refugee laws and acts. And Lou arrived here as a young, toddler in infancy. In 1997, he was arrested on an alleged accomplice in an attempt home invasion, second degree. He was in the vehicle at the time. He never entered the home. He literally was still a juvenile at that time. He had a court appointed attorney and was advised to take a plea without being told it would affect his immigration status for the rest of his life. This is the reality of our immigration system – long, complex, confusing and devastating, unforgiving. It is not built for people like us, people like Lou, people who have served their time, rebuilt their lives and have nowhere else to go. We've walked this legal path, we've stayed together in the lines, and yet we are here punished today. Lou has no other charges, no current legal issues, no history of violence. He is not a flight risk. He is not a danger to our public safety. He is a father, my husband, a son, a son-in-law, a grandson and a brother to many, and our leader and a provider to our community, and to my family. He renews his work authorization and follows every rule asked of him no matter how uncertain the future felt. Together, we've raised six beautiful children. They're all proud Americans. Lou has contributed to Michigan's economy for decades working in our automotive industry and now he is gone and all that he is built is unraveling and the community is heartbroken. We didn't come from wealth. We didn't have every opportunity handed to us because we didn't come seeking a land of opportunity. We came here because of survival. We had to build from the ground up. But the most important thing was Lou and I, we had each other. We had our families, our friends, and our neighbors. We had a shared commitment to build a better life, grounded in love, respect, and purpose. And somehow that's still not enough. For years, we were told like other Hmong families that Laos in Thailand would never take us back. And that has changed. In June, 2025 the US imposed a partial travel ban on Laos, citing visa overstays, and lack of deportation cooperation. And in response, Laos began issuing these documents under pressure. Today over 4,800, including Hmong, Myan, and the other ethnic minorities are facing removal to Laos and to many other countries, many have never stepped foot in a country that they are now being sent to. Lou is Stateless like many others that is detained with him. None of these countries recognize him. He was born in the Thailand refugee camp, it does not recognize him nor qualify him for any sort of Thai citizenship and I'll tell you guys right now if forced to return, he will face danger because of his family's deep ties to the CIA and United States military. Deporting him turns him, a civil servant and respected community leader, into a political casualty, it would be a grave and irreversible injustice. To deport him now is to punish him to death. Once again, 50 years later, as we celebrate resilience this year across the nation, we are now celebrating a fight within our own grounds, right here in United States, right here in Michigan. We're now fighting the same fight within our own country. Thousands of Southeast Asian Americans, many that entered legally admitted as refugees are being deported for decade old offenses they've longed paid for. America is our country. All we ask is the right to stay in the home that we've helped to build and work hard to protect. We are not seeking special treatment. We are asking for justice, compassion, and a second chance in this country to claim what we believe in. To Governor Whitmer and members of Congress and all elected officials, please help bring Lou and the many others home. Urge ICE and DHS to release him on humanitarian grounds. Help his case. Help us preserve the integrity of our laws and the dignity of our families. And to the public allies and the media. Please call our elected officials. Please call these offices. Please share Lou's story. We need voices. Voices louder than ours alone. It is hard times you guys. It is real. And I speak to you from the bottom of my heart. Please help me and our families in the many that are suffering. This is our home. These are our children. This is my husband and this is our fight. Let him come home. Let our families be whole again, and let America keep its promise. Thank you guys for hearing me. Miko: Lou Young is a community leader. Michigan, who actually runs a nonprofit in support of Hmong folks in that community, and is targeted and also has a stay of removal. So we're doing a targeted campaign for both of these folks, Lou Yang and Mohan Karki, to be able to get them released to overturn their original convictions and they also have spouses that are telling their stories and telling the impact these detentions have had. Because while this current administration talks about getting rid of criminals, what they are actually doing is breaking apart families and community. Swati Rayasam: You are tuned in to Apex Express on 94.1 KPFA, 89.3 KPFB in Berkeley, 88.1 KFCF in Fresno and online@kpfa.org. Coming up is Deporting the Pilgrim from the Anakbayan Long Beach Mayday Mix tape.   Swati Rayasam: That was please be strong, featuring Hushed, loudmouth and Joe handsome. And before that was deporting the pilgrim from the Unec Bayan Long Beach Mayday Mixtape. Now back to the show. Miko: I wanna shift us a little bit to talking about Asian american representation in the larger fabric of immigration justice in the United States. Mostly many of our Asian communities have been like isolated, not really involved in the broader immigration movement. And I'm wondering if you could talk a little bit about the difficulty and nuance of bringing your community struggle to the forefront because many of us heard about the Venezuelans and the Mexicans that have been deported and what was going on, but we don't hear as much about these stories of our Asian sisters and brothers. I wonder if one of you could give voice to that. Robin: Before going there can I add something to Miko: of course. Robin: crimmigration conversation? So when you all are sharing about that, I was thinking about, the justice system in this country and what we are seeing right now is a broken justice system. Like you said, Miko, where families are separated where families are broken, and what I don't understand is, when, let's say your loved one gets into trouble, makes a mistake, and gets into a trouble, then, as a human being, like, don't you want your loved ones to rebuild their lives? Like Yes, of course there is a system that you have to follow, the laws that you have to follow, but at the end, I think we all want our loved ones to come back, rebuild their lives, right? And what we're seeing in this country is they're constantly breaking the families. And I don't see how we are going to build a better future when we are constantly, hurting the families. And in the cases of detention and deportation, what we're seeing is the double punishment. Like the mistakes that they had made, but then throughout their life, they have to go through that, a continuous cycle of being punished. And not just the individuals, but their family members have also go through the challenges, the suffering, right? And in the case of Bhutanese from double punishment to double expulsion to this, the state of being statelessness. Right? So what kind of future we are imagining when an individual has to go through that continuous cycle of being punished and not having the opportunity to rebuild their lives. So that's a big question mark that I think, we all need to think about. To your later question around my community and the larger Asian American context or the national context. My community is relatively new to this country. We lived, almost two decades in a refugee camp, which was a enclosed camp. And our lives were dependent on foreign aids like UNHCR or ILWF. Pretty much I would say we had our own world over there. And for us to work outside the refugee camp was illegal. There was no laws that gave us the permission to work outside. So we were not pretty much exposed to the outer world. So for us to come to US was a big step. Which means pretty much from basic every day stuffs like, you know, using a bathroom, using a kitchen, taking a bus. All of those were foreign for us. So for our community to really tap into the education system, the political landscape of this country. And also like the experience of being expelled for voicing our, our opinions, for fighting for our rights. Right? So for us, for our community to kind of step in into the politics, it's like re-traumatizing ourselves. I would say there are a lot of barriers, multi-layered barriers for our community members to really tap into the larger political, like socio political landscape, from language barriers to culture barriers to education, to pretty much everything. So right now, the way our committee has been being attacked. It's a surprise to the community. And also it is like kind of traumatizing the community and taking us back to the same place of feeling, insecure, feeling like we don't have a home. And we did hope that this is legally, this is going to be a home. Because after coming to the US most of us became the legal citizens of this country and we started rebuilding our lives. Now it's kind of like going back to the same circle of statelessness. Miko: Thank you for sharing about that. Kao Ye, would you like to add to that? Kao Ye: When I think of the Hmong American community and even the Southeast Asian community and why the narratives of what is happening still feels very invisible. I think of how our community, we were assimilating for survival. And I speak on that as a child of my refugee parents and siblings where growing up we were taught to, listen, not speak out, not cause trouble. Go through the system, listen to authority, listen to law enforcement. And because of that, I feel it's shaped a culture of fear. Fear to dissent and fear to speak out because we care so much about the stability of our families. And we wanted to protect ourselves, because of everything we've gone through with the war. And we are finding that it's been challenging for our community members to come forward with their stories. Honestly, we're still sitting on that and we're still kind of sitting through like, why is there that tension? You know, I feel like folks are going through a lot and even folks have, our impacted loved ones, but they're afraid to tell their story because of fear of of retaliation. And so I think that there is a level of, I think that lack of even psychological safety, but real, physical, real financial safety that people have. And I think that being a factor to the assimilation, but also this facade of like the American dream and like if we don't just disrupt, if we don't speak out, we will be protected. And, white supremacy, right? Like we will be okay. And it's a facade because we know that because our communities are the ones getting kidnapped and getting deported. Right. And so I think there is that fear, but there's also recognition of this now, this facade that the silence doesn't protect us and that there is a real need for us to really, be strong in speaking out, not just for our SEA siblings that are impacted, but for all of our immigrant groups, even the Bhutanese community, right. That's been impacted during this time. And so I, yeah, I think it is that multi-layered experience of being a Southeast Asian refugee community on top of, being part of this AAPI umbrella. AAPI we are not homogenous. We all have very unique histories as to how we have dealt with the systems in this country and how we came into this country. And so I think it's been challenging to make space for those nuances. And at the end of the day, I still see the interconnections that we all have together too. And so, I think it's the willingness to make space for those different stories. And I am finding that more of our ethnic media, our smaller news outlets are more willing to cover those stories as opposed to, these larger mainstream outlets. Like they're not covering those stories, but we are. Miko: Thank you. Oh, both of you have brought up so much today about our failed criminal justice system, about us punishing people as opposed to rehabilitating people and punishing them more than once. We brought up questions around statelessness and the impact that it has, and I just recently learned that the United States does not have any policy on Statelessness. So one of the things that this coalition of folks is trying to do is to get a congressional hearing to help the United States develop policy around statelessness, because it is actually our responsibility and our duty to do that. The other thing I hear you both talking about is this good immigrant, bad immigrant trope, which we've heard of a lot, but I think that's also very much connected to why so many members of our communities don't wanna speak out because this connection with, you know, quote unquote criminal history might be something that's shameful. And I'm wondering if you both see that as a divide mostly between elders in the community and younger folks. Robin, do you wanna talk about that? Robin: Yeah. I mean, initially when we were mobilizing our community members to fight against the the unjust and unfair detention and deportation, this issue around the perception around good immigrants and bad immigrants became one of the main topic of discussion. We had to deal with people, and mostly elders, but I would say some young folks as well, who would pull themselves back on speaking against this issue because for them people who are being deported or detained are criminals and they deserve this kind of mindset. And not being able to see the larger picture of how the administration is targeting the immigrant and the refugee population of this country and really trying to dismantle community power, right? So, yes, it is a challenge that we are, we're going through and I think it's going to be quite a bit of work, to really build solidarity within our own communities. Kao Ye: I feel that the divide in the Hmong community is stemming from class and education. I feel as though when folks are articulating, regurgitating these justifications of the bad immigrant as to why folks should be deported it's folks that maybe kind of made it in their lives and now they're comparing themselves to folks that were not in that situation. And there is this growing within our community as well, where some folks are getting that education, getting, good jobs. But so much of our community, we still suffer from poverty, right? And so, I think that has been really interesting to witness the level of division because of class, because of income and also the education piece. Because oftentimes when folks are feeling this, it comes from a place of ignorance as well. And so that's why I think the education piece is so important. I actually feel though our elders are more understanding because these are their children that are being separated from them. And Robin's point is that when we have loved ones that go through the system, we just want them to rebuild their lives and be self-sufficient. And I feel like those are the values that I grew up in my community where our parents were always about keeping the family together to a fault, you know? And so they don't want separation. They just want us to be well and to do well, and to turn our lives around. And so, I feel strongly that our elders, they do understand that the importance of giving this opportunity for us to, to stay together and turn our lives around. Miko: Thank you so much, both of you for joining me here today to talk about this important conversation. I'm wondering if you could provide our audience with how they could find out more about what is going on and what are next steps for our audience members. Robin, let's start with you. Robin: Yeah. I just wanted to add what, Kao Ye talked about. I do agree the patterns around the divide is based on class. And I do see that in the community, and not just the class, but in our community class and caste, I would say. And in terms of the class, there were some instances where we had to deal with even the highly educated like PhD holders kind of, questioning us like, you know, what we are advocating for, and, I couldn't understand like, I couldn't relate the education, the title, the degree that he holds and the perception around this issue. Right. So, I just wanted to echo that. So, in terms of our work and Asian Refugees United, our website is www.asianrefugees.org And you can find us in our Instagram, Facebook, Asian Refugees United. Miko: And you can also get latest news about what's happening at bhutaneserefugeerights.com. Yeah. And Kao Ye how can folks find out more about your work? Kao Ye: Right now HIP is part of a statewide network in California called the Pardon Refugees Campaign, where we are really pushing Governor Newsom to pardon all refugees, not just Southeast Asians because of everything that we talked about, about how our families, they deserve to stay together. And so, I don't think we have a website up yet, but you can follow this campaign with us. We will be having a rally and press conference, coming up soon, in the next few weeks. And so, I would say that please follow us in that work where we are really moving in coalition with all of our uh, grassroots partners to advocate for our loved ones that are currently being impacted. Miko: Thank you so much, Robin Gurung, Asian Refugees United and Kao Ye Thao from Hmong Innovating Politics. Thank you so much for being with us here today, and I hope you listeners out there take action to keep our families together, to keep our people in the communities as loved ones where they belong. Thank you all. Have a great night. Swati Rayasam: I'm so grateful that Miko was able to talk to Robin and Kao Ye. And for those who missed it, visit bhutanese refugee rights.org for the most recent updates on the Bhutanese refugees. The press conference in rally Kao Ye mentioned took place last week on August 21st, 2025, but check out the Pardon Refugees Campaign for updates from the coalition supporting Hmong, Cambodian Laotian, Myan, and other refugees facing deportation. Thanks so much for tuning in to Apex Express. Please check out our website at kpfa.org/program/apexexpress to find out more about the show tonight and to find out how you can take direct action. We thank all of you listeners out there. Keep resisting, keep organizing, keep creating, and sharing your visions with the world. Your voices are important. Apex Express is produced by  Miko Lee, along with Jalena Keene-Lee, Ayame Keene-Lee, Preeti Mangala Shekar,  Anuj Vaida, Cheryl Truong, Isabel Li, Ravi Grover, and me Swati Rayasam. Thank you so much to the team at KPFA for their support and have a good night. The post APEX Express – 10.23.25 -And We Become Stateless Again appeared first on KPFA.

This week we're framing our Uncensored episode around the ideas of escape and comfort. What dramas help us escape? What dramas bring us comfort? And how do the two idea overlap? Amy and Megan also offer their reactions to Genie Make a Wish, episode 1 to see if their thoughts sell Lia on the drama. Book Recommendation: Forbidden Wish by Jessica KhouryReady to download your first audiobook? Don't forget to click HERE for your free Audible trial.*Audible is a sponsor of Afternoona Delight Podcast*Are your family and friends sick of you talking about K-drama? We get it...and have an answer. Join our AfterNoona Delight Patreon and find community among folks who get your obsession. And check out www.afternoonadelight.com for more episodes, book recs and social media goodness. And don't forget about the newest member of our network: Afternoona Asks where diaspora Asians living in the West find ways to reconnect to Asian culture via Asian/KDramas.Last but CERTAINLY not least....love BTS? Or curious what all the fuss is about? Check out our sister pod Afternoona Army for "thinky, thirsty and over thirty" takes on Bangtan life. ★ Support this podcast on Patreon ★

This week Greg and Ed have a bit of fun revisiting an old blog post from Greg about what would be the best slogans for various malls around Bangkok. As most listeners know, Bangkok may very well be the capital city of malls and mall culture, and each mall seems to have its own identity. The guys walk through Greg's somewhat salty slogans from ten years ago to see if they are still valid.  Here are some representative examples: MBK - “Not even we know what stores lurk in our dark corners and forgotten depths.” Ed chuckles at the appropriateness of the slogan, given that MBK seems chock full of unexpected side areas and forgotten hallways. EmQuartier - “Come for the cool food hall and interesting stores. Stay because you can't find the exit.” Once again, Ed concurs, having just been at the infamously architecturally complex mall. Central World - “Stop whining, the 5 km walk will do you good.” With its renovations over the years, this mall has undoubtedly improved, but one fact can't be denied: it's freaking huge. So if you need some more steps to get to your 10k for the day, this is the mall to do it. Ed even chimes in with some of his own slogans for Bangkok's new malls, such as Icon Siam: “A mall designed 100% for Asians: as long as you are a rich Chinese tourist.” This time Greg nods his head in agreement. Listen in for our take on the bounty of unique malls through the city.  Don't forget that Patrons get the ad-free version of the show as well as swag and other perks. We also sometimes post on Facebook, you can contact us on LINE and of course, head to our website (www.bangkokpodcast.com) to find out probably more info than you need to know.  

A weekly magazine-style radio show featuring the voices and stories of Asians and Pacific Islanders from all corners of our community. The show is produced by a collective of media makers, deejays, and activists. TAKE ACTION Rising Voices campaign for Lue Yang Mohan Karki's GoFundMe   And please help support these organizations working to support detained and deported folx: Asian Law Caucus Asian Refugees United Ba Lo Project in Vietnam Collective Freedom in Vietnam & Laos Asian Prisoner Support Committee & New Light Wellness in Cambodia November 1–2, people nationwide are joining the Disappeared In America Weekend of Action to stand up for immigrant families and defend due process. Actions include protests at Home Depots, candlelight Freedom Vigils, and Day of the Dead events honoring lives lost to detention.   The following day, November 3, 4pm Pacific time, 7pm Eastern Time, Join us for “We Belong Here, Bhutanese & Hmong Americans in the Struggle Against Statelessness” a live virtual event featuring my three guests tonight, along with performances and conversations. bit.ly/WBH-2025   We Belong Here! Show Transcript Miko Lee: Welcome to Apex Express. This is your host, Miko Lee. Today we're talking about detentions and potential deportations and the atrocities that the Trump administration is creating in our communities. And today I am so honored to have three guests with me, Tika Basnet, and Ann Vu, and Aisa Villarosa. Tika and Ann they're part of a horrible club, which is both of their spouses are currently in detention from our immigration system. But I just wanna start on a real personal note in a way that I often do with my guests. Anne, I'm gonna start with you. I just would love to hear from you, who are your people and what legacy do you carry with you? Ann Vue: Thank you again, Miko and Isa, you guys for having me on. So we are Hmong. And we helped Americans during the Vietnam War. And so, during the Vietnam War in Laos, a lot of our pilots needed a communication. And because we're indigenous and we are in the mountains, they were able to speak with us and use us. And so a lot of our Hmong, what they did or what they contributed helped a lot of the pilots rescued a lot, like thousands and thousands of Americans, really, so that that way they can make it back home, right? And so that is our contribution to the American people. And so when we were brought to America, was to resettle because of humanitarian purpose. Really because of our legacy of helping Americans with the war, right? So that is who we are and what we bring to America. And that's who I am. I'm, and I'm actually the first generation Hmong American too. So I was born right here in the capital of Lansing, Michigan. Miko Lee: Thanks so much ann. And Tika, can you share who are your people and what legacy you carry with you? Tika Basnet: Yes. Hi, my name is Tika Basnet. So I am Bhutanese Nepali community. My parents and all the Bhutanese, they ran away from Bhutan in 1990 due to the ethnic cleansing. And they came to Nepal, seeking for asylum, and that is where we born. I was born in Nepal, in refugee camp. Even though I was born in Nepal, Nepal never gave us identity. They never give us citizenship, so we were known as Bhutanese Nepali, but as known as Stateless. And yeah, my husband also born in Nepal in a refugee camp. Miko Lee: Thank you, Tika. And Aisa, I'm gonna ask the same question for you Aisa, my friend that works at Asian Law Caucus. Who are your people and what legacy do you carry with you? Aisa Villarosa: So much love to you, Miko and to you Ann and Tika for being here today. I just am, I'm so honored.My name is Aisa and I carry the love and, Maki Baka spirit of Filipino Americans both in my family across the diaspora. A little bit about the Filipino American story. We came to the United States as part of the colonial machine. The first Filipinos were brought as part of the Spanish Gallian trade. We made California home, parts of Louisiana home, and it's quite a contrast to a lot of the sort of model minority seduction that many of my people, and myself as a younger person tended to fall into that if we kept our heads down, if we were quiet, we would be left alone. I'm struck because at this moment of just unprecedented government attacks, so many of our communities have this story where someone somewhere said to us, yeah, just keep your head down and it'll be fine. And we're seeing the exact opposite, that this is the time to really use our voices, both individually and as one. And I'm also an artist and try to infuse that into my work in fighting government systems. Miko Lee: Thank you Aisa. And in the interest of fairness, I will say I'm Miko. I am fifth generation Chinese American. I grew up knowing that my family was full of fighters that built the railroads, worked in the gold mines in laundromats and restaurants, and my parents walked with Dr. King and Cesar Chavez and Dolores Huerta, and I was raised in a family of social justice activists. So I feel like our legacy is to continue that work and to fight for the rights of our peoples. That being said, I'm so honored to have both of all three of you powerful women join me today. And as I was saying in the beginning, Tika and Anne are sadly a part of this club. Nobody wants to be a part of this club with the sudden, unexpected, harmful detentions of both of your husbands. I wonder if you can each just share the story about what happened and how you first found out about your husband being detained. And let's start with you Tika. Tika Basnet: So, my husband got his removal in 2014 when he was like minor. Just 17 years old, high school student going from school to home and, he's a teenager and with his friend, like they were playing around and they wanna go home really fast. So they just cross from private property. And I think that is where someone saw and call 911. So we came from the culture that we love to go people home , walking around, playing around. So my husband came here in 2011. The incident happened on 2013. So he was just, came here without knowing culture, without knowing languages, So he has no idea. So when somebody called 911, he could not explain what happened. First of all, English is his second language, he was barely here without knowing rules and regulation, without knowing culture. The police get them and then they took him to jail I think police gave a lot of charges. And even until now, my husband doesn't know what are those charges? At that time, nobody explained, this is the three charges you got, and this could lead to deportation. And he feel guilty without knowing those charges. And just because he trusts Nepali translate guy, and he told my husband, like, if you don't say I'm guilty, you will end up in prison for 20 to 25 years, but if you say I'm guilty, you'll go home. And my husband said, guilty. And at that time, neither criminal lawyer told my husband, like, if you say I'm guilty, you'll end up getting deport. Deport to the contrary that you are you never born. Deport To the contrary, you doesn't even speak their language. And even the lawyer did not explain my husband like, you will not gonna get your green card. You cannot apply your citizenship in your life. If all of, if those things like the lawyer told my husband at that time, he will never gonna say, I am guilty to the crime that he did not even commit. And so when they tried to deport my husband back then, Bhutan say, he's not my citizenship, he's not from my country, We don't know this guy. He's not belongs to here. And when US Embassy reach out to, Nepal, do you know this guy? They told, ICE no, we don't know this guy, like he's not belongs here. And then the ICE officer, they told my husband, like, we can let you go, you need to come here, like order of supervision every years, every three months, every six months, whenever we call you. And it been 11 years. My husband is following rules and regulation. After that incident, never police arrest him. He did not even get criminal record. He did not even get misdemeanor record. So basically he never did any violation after that. So he was following, he got married, he has a life, he pay taxes. He was taking care of his family and in 11 years he was doing everything. And in 2025 for the first time they target Bhutanese Nepali community. And at that time I knew that this is the last time I'm gonna see my husband. And that is a time I think I broke down. Like, when they detained my husband in April 8, I was eight months pregnant. And um, like we dream a lot of things like, you know, we are gonna take care of our daughter. We are gonna buy home, we are gonna work, we are gonna give her the life that we, I'm sorry. Miko Lee: Totally. Okay. Tika Basnet: So, yeah. Um, like I never thought like Bhutanese community can, like deport. Like my parent already , go through this trauma, you know, when Bhutan throw them away due to ethnic cleansing and same thing happening to us. It is unbelievable. I cannot believe that, we're going through this again and I don't know when this gonna be stopped. I don't know whether like my husband gonna come home. I dunno. Like I'm fighting and it is been five month and I really want my husband back. Like my daughter today is, she's three month old. She need her dad in life. 'cause I cannot provide everything by myself. My husband is the main provider for her aging parent. 'cause even now they cannot pay bills. Like they have really hard time paying bills. And this is the reason, like I'm fighting for my husband case and I want my husband back. And I think he deserve second chance because if you see his record is clean, like for one incident that happened like 12 years ago, that cannot define my husband. Like who he is right now, you know? So yeah, this is what happened. Like I cannot believe that my husband is able to get deport to the country that doesn't even accept. And I don't know whether he gonna get killed. I dunno what, whether he gonna disappear, I don't know what will happen to him. I don't know if it is last time I'm gonna see him. Miko Lee: Tika, thank you so much for sharing your story. And just to recap really briefly, your husband, Mohan Karki when he was a teenager, newly arrived in the country, was leaving high school, walked with his friends through a backyard and was suddenly racially profiled. And the neighbor called police because he was trespassing on property.He was born at a refugee camp. Is that right? Tika Basnet: Yes. Miko Lee: And so there was not property that was like person's property on that refugee camp. So that whole concept of walking across somebody's land was something he was not aware of. He had an interpreter that did not give correct or full information. And so he signed something, including a deportation order, that he wasn't actually, wasn't even aware of until recently when he was put into detention. Is that right? Tika Basnet: Yes. Yes. Miko Lee: And right now he's in detention. You're, you live in Ohio, but he's in detention in Michigan, right? Tika Basnet: Yes. Miko Lee: Okay, Tika, let's talk about Mohans case and what's happening. He's held in detention right now in a detention facility in Michigan. And what is going on with his case? Tika Basnet: Yeah, I don't wanna say a lot of things about his case, but our attorney, his criminal attorney does file, a Motion to Redeem asking BIA to send that, case back to Georgia and we recently hired, criminal attorney to fight for his case, that happened in 2013. And our attorney just submit documentation where he's asking to release my husband because it'd been five month. And he's not risk to the community. He's not risk to the flight. 'cause he doesn't have no one in Bhutan. He doesn't have no one in Nepal. He's all family is in here. So his community love him ,he has family that loves him. And, we also get lot of documentations as a proof telling ICE officer that my husband is not risk to the community or, to the flight. Miko Lee: Thank you. And he has a new baby, a four month old baby that he has yet to meet. So that is a powerful reason to stay. And as Tikas pointing out, the lawyer just submitted documentation along with 50 letters of support from the community , from employers, from family members, all saying why he should stay in this country. Thank you so much for sharing. And Anne, i'm wondering if you could share about what happened to your husband. He was also born in a refugee camp, right? Ann Vue: So, Lou was born in Nangkai, Thailand refugee camp. In 1978 and in 1979 his parents and him and his older brother received parole for legal entry. I think the exact word was, they were paroled pursuant under section 212D5 of the I and N Act, which means that they are granted urgent humanitarian reasons for or for public benefit. Right. Because my father-in-law had helped and during the war. And so he received his visa in September. I just lookeded back at all of his history there and then they made it to America right before Halloween 'cause my father-in-law was like, I always remembered it because in the country of Asia, they're scared of halloween, scary Halloween stuff. And so when they came, they were like, oh my gosh. There were, Jesus says, I remember there were just a lot of zombies, right? And we were so scared because we were like, and so I always remember that about, you know, I'll fast forward it to 1997, right when he just turned, I believe 18 and very similar to Tika, you know, her husband too. And a lot of times, in the early nineties, me even being the first generation American here, racism played a lot. And we all went through that piece and our parents not speaking English at the same time, they were going to school themselves so that they can learn our English language, right. And they weren't able to teach us growing up. So we had to kind of fend for ourselves. And I would say my husband he went out with some friends. He did not commit the crime. But of course now that is brought back to him, he understood about his particular case is second attempt, home invasion. Nobody was harmed. He was in the vehicle, in the backseat when he was caught. And he didn't wanna partake, but he didn't wanna stop them either, you know? 'cause to him it was like, if I don't partake, then I have nothing to do with it. Right. Because if I do, then they might not be my friends anymore. I mean, it's just a part of growing up as a youth. But because he was there, and then would receive a court appointed attorney, and then provide it very similar to Tika's too. Had an interpreter, that was explaining to them, was provided bad legal advice. He had nothing, no knowledge about how this would impact his immigration status. He would take a plea, and it was advised by their attorney, take the plea it's easier, you know, and you probably serve less than a year. You'll be out, you'll only be in the county jail anyways 'cause you didn't really commit the crime and technically it should have been a misdemeanor. But because you're an accomplice , that kind of falls under this category. So he took the plea, he served 10 months in a county jail. He actually was released for good behavior. He even finished his probation soon because he paid all of his stuff off. And he even finished a youth advocate program, a youth training program for anybody that committed crimes between the age of 18 to 21. I actually just saw this form the other day and I was reading it and it talks about, you know, the one thing about our parents, experiencing the war and coming to America, they don't talk about it. And a lot of us are from communist countries . We're, we are very afraid to voice our voices, because someone can take action. And our parents never talked about it. And I read what he wrote to his, youth coordinator, and he wrote, he felt so bad about what he did. He created disappointment for his parents and he understands now after his parents told him, there are sacrifices that got us here to America. And he literally wrote all of this down, he's going to be a better person, is what he wrote. I'm going to be a better person. I'm going to make my parents proud now that I understand their sacrifices. And, they asked him, well what was your upbringing like? And in one sentence, he wrote, poor, right? So he wrote, poor and the coordinator wrote on the bottom of his comments said, Lou is remorseful for what has happened or for what ha what has happened, and very remorseful and he wants to be a better person. I have no other questions. The training is complete. He doesn't need any further, support and believes that he will move forward to be a better person. That's what literally what they wrote on the document. Then fast forwarding to 1999 , after everything was done and he served, that's when, immigration showed up at his house. And from there moved forward to explain to him what had happened. And once that happened, of course him and I would meet in 2000, and then we'd be married in 2001. Right? So we'd celebrate. Almost 24 and a half years of marriage. Right? So we did appeal his case in the humanitarian piece of what this meant for Lou during the time where we all fled the country. Once we were, once the monks were declared enemy of the state by the LDR in Laos, we fled. And once we fled, it's well documented that there was a little bit over 400,000 of us there right after all the genocide and the killings of the Hmong there was probably less than 45,000 of us left, right? And so once we understood a lot of that, we wanted to do better. We wanted to really service our community, right? So. Fast forwarding it. We appealed the case. The case was then denied I believe in 2002. And even in his letters, in his appeal letters, general Vink Powell, which led the, Hmongs during, in the war, even had a letter in there where he, to also pled why Hmongs need to stay here in America, right. And why we need to bring the rest of our people to this country. The reality is our whole family, Lou's whole family was wiped out. We don't have anybody, Lou doesn't have anyone, right? And so you know, that goes to Tikas thing too. There's nobody there. And, going back to the case once it was denied in 2002, of course he then. Was forced to reach out to the embassy and reached out to the embassy and was denied, entry into Thailand 'cause that's where he was born. We're stateless too, just like Tikas husband. We were denied by Thailand. We were also denied by Laos stating that we are not a citizen of theirs. They do not allow or welcome any sort of entry. And then in 2006, that's when they actually took his green card was in 2006 and then we prompt again we were denied. And then in 2008 we were denied a third time and that's when his immigration officer was like, just move on and start your life. Laos and Thailand, will never sign a repatriation act with America because of you guys, because of the Hmong people, what you guys have done to their country, making it the most bombed country during the war without even being a part of the war. So therefore, they will never allow you guys or accept you guys back. And so we were like, okay. So we moved forward and then in 2014, this immigration officer, which we was doing yearly checkups at this time, was like, Hey go get your citizenship, get your green card. They're like you're doing so good. You know, you probably could have a chance to get it. That's when we moved forward to apply for citizenship and for all we did for the green card and then for citizenship. And of course we were denied in 2015 and we know how expensive this is. You pay $10,000 outright, you don't get that money back. You just have to go at it again, right? And so, uh, we decided that, you know what, we're gonna get his case expunged, and so. We got his case expunged in 2018, no questions asked. It was very straightforward. Once it was expunged, we continued, with our lives. Very involved in the community. And we had all of our children by that time already, so we had six kids already. So fast forwarding to that, and then leading up to his detainment, which this year we even called his immigration officer and he was like, Hey, don't worry about it, Lou, we're moving you over to Grand Rapids and you should be fine. Just make sure that you stay outta trouble, continue to follow your stock and I think what triggered it was when we applied for his work permit in April. Because he was supposed to, he always meets his immigration officer at the end of the year, and we renewed his work permit is what triggered it. And so of course, the money was cashed out, everything the checks went through while we were receiving that, he was gonna be here, everything was gonna be fine. And then leading up to July 15th where he was detained at work, early morning of six 30 in the morning, the detained officer they they told him that they know who he is to the community, so they have to do it this way because they don't want any problems. They don't want media, they don't want reporters. He did play with them. He did ask them because he rode his motorcycle for some weird reason. He has not taken his bike out, his motorcycle out in the last three years. But for some reason that night he was like, I just wanna take my bike. So he took his bike that night and when ICE told him, do you have somebody come get your bike? You need to call somebody to come get your bike. And he was like, nobody in my family rides motorcycles. Like we don't, I don't have anyone to come get my bike. And I think there was some empathy and compassion for him. He was like, okay, let me check on something. Because my husband was like, can I just take my bike back? I've got six kids. I've got my grandma at home and my parents are also at my house right now. I just wanna see them and I just wanna take my bike back. So they asked him, if we let you go, we asked will you like please don't run. Right? And so they followed my husband home and my husband literally called me at 6 37 in the morning and he was like, Hey, ICE is, here they got me. So I'm like, what? What's going on? So it was just so surreal. I was so shocked. And so it's about a 30 minute drive from his workplace back to our house. And um, when he got there, um, they, there were already officers, like there were, it was packed tight in our driveway. So our driveway's pretty far up because we live in the country. And so, there were like five or six cop cars there too. So we had to walk about half a mile down to go see him. They wouldn't allow him to enter where our home was. And the officer told, my husband, told him that they're so sorry. They have to do it this way. They know who he is. They don't want any problems, they don't want any reports in media out here. And I will say my experience was a little bit different from others. They did take their mask off when they took him in, they were respectful so that part is that much. They even, you know, talk to my two older boys like, “Hey, you guys have money. I could put the money in your dad's account.” We're, take him into Grand Rapids, we're gonna process him, and then we're gonna take him to the detention center, which is gonna be involved in Michigan. So they were very open about these steps, what they were doing with him, at least that much. But I will say that it was my grandma, of course she has chronic pulmonary disease stage four. So at that point we, we couldn't haul her fast enough because we only saw him for like maybe a quick minute, and that was it. And so they did ask us to turn around because they had to take him back and they didn't want my, our little ones to see them cuffing him. Miko Lee: They actually said, Anne, we don't want any media to be watching this? Ann Vue: I don't want any problems. Miko Lee: Mm. And and your husband is also quite well known in the Hmong community, right? Ann Vue: He is Miko Lee: and so probably, they were worried about folks coming out and protesting. Is that, do you think that was the case? Ann Vue: That's what I'm assuming, because I don't remember their exact words saying media, but I do remember they were saying that they didn't want people around, they didn't want to create issues for the community.I am assuming that correct, because if he would've gotten the letter just like everybody did, which everybody then would receive the letter on Friday, and because my husband is a community leader, he is the Hmong Family Association's president, we restart receiving. Many, many calls where everybody just wanted to talk to Lou 'cause they needed to know what's going on, how to handle, what to do. And so at that moment I realized, oh my gosh, they detained my husband first this way. And then everybody else got a letter. Miko Lee: And the ICE officer that he had been checking in with routinely has, have you all been in touch with that same ICE officer? Ann Vue: He has been, I think in the last seven or eight years.Yeah. It's been the same guy. Miko Lee: But has he been in touch with him since he was detained? Ann Vue: He hasn't. Miko Lee: Has not, no. So they had different people come in even, 'cause he was the person that said everything's okay, keep going with your life. Ann Vue: Oh yeah. Miko Lee: And so no contact with him whatsoever since the detention? Ann Vue: No. Miko Lee: Can you give a little bit of an update of Lou's case and what's going on with him right now? Ann Vue: I don't know as much. Maybe I may have to have Aisa respond to the legality piece around it. 'cause I know we're, they've been doing, working around the clock and working hard on strategy. Miko Lee: Okay. Thank you so much, Aisa. Before we move into that, I just wanna point out, for all of our listeners, how many similarities there are in these two cases. And in both of these, you know, these amazing women are here supporting their spouses, both, spouses born in refugee camps. Dealing with intergenerational trauma from families that had to escape ethnic cleansing or involved in a war, came into the United States under, legal properties through refugee resettlement acts, made mistakes as young people, partially due to culture and wanting to fit in. They served their time, they paid their dues. They were racially profiled to be able to actually be in those positions that they were in. They suffered from incredible immigration policy failure with bad advice, with a system that's broken. And now both of them are detained. Not yet deported, but detained. Many of the community members have already been deported and they're facing statelessness. And we're seeing this not just with Bhutanese and Hmong folks, but with Mien and Lao and Haitian and El Salvadorian. And we could fill in the blank of how many other peoples in other communities are facing this. So, we also know that these private detention centers where people are being held, are making millions and millions of dollars, and it's connected into our corrupt political system that's in place right now. We also know and Aisa, I'm wondering if you could, talk about the case, but also about some of the deals that we think have had to be made with Laos and Bhutan in order for these deportations to even take place. So Aisa from Asian Law Caucus, I'm gonna pass it to you to go over some of the legal ramifications. Aisa Villarosa: Of course, Miko, and thank you for it for the context. And there are so many parallels that we as advocates must uplift because this is not the time to be divided. This is really the time to build solidarity that we've long known needs to happen. And, and this is really the moment. What Miko is referring to is, uh, largely, um, something that we've observed around the travel bans. So. Earlier this year, right around the time that the Trump administration took hold, there was a draft travel ban list that leaked across a number of media outlets, the Times, et cetera, and the same countries we're talking about today, Bhutan, Laos. These were historically not countries that were subject to sanctions, like the travel ban, and yet here they were. And so a lot of us were scratching our heads and asking, you know, what, why is this happening? Our theory, and this is a theory that is now also manifesting in a number of FOIA requests or Freedom of Information Act requests that are submitted from Asian Law Caucus to departments like the State Department ice, the Department of Homeland Security. Asking the same question that Tika and Anne are asking, which is, how are these deportations even happening? Because they were not happening until this year. And what very likely happened was a bit of a quid pro quo. So in removing Bhutan, removing Laos from this list where they could be sanctioned as a country, there was likely some backdoor deal that took place between the US State Department and Bhutanese officials and the US officials, where essentially there was some form of an agreement that there would be an acceptance or a supposed acceptance of a certain number of folks from these communities. That is why around March, around April for the Bhutanese refugee community, for example, we started seeing pickups very similar to Mohans case, where, many people who had perhaps made some mistakes in their youth or had really old criminal convictions were swept off the streets and thrust into these really rapid deportation proceedings. I don't even know if proceedings is the right word, because there essentially was no proceeding. You know, the Immigration Court is very much a cloaked process. The immigration judge is kind of judge and jury wrapped up together, which is very different than many of us might turn on the TV and see something like Law and order. An immigration court works a very different way where this piece of paper, this final removal order, basically gives ICE a lot of bandwidth to make these deportations happen. However, that doesn't mean we should just accept that this is happening. We know that just basic procedures of fairness are not being met. We know, too that in the case of, for example, the Bhutanese community ICE officers have come to the wrong house. And put a lot of people in fear. So racial profiling was happening even before this recent Supreme Court decision, which essentially now condones racial profiling, right? As criteria that the ICE can use. I also just wanted to talk about this trend too, that we're seeing with so many cases. It happened to Lou, it happened to Mohan, where in someone's underlying criminal court case, maybe they were given a court appointed attorney. In many cases, they were not told of the immigration impacts of, say, taking a plea. There is a Supreme Court case called Padilla versus Kentucky and basically the law shifted such that in many cases there now is a duty for a court appointed public defender to actually talk to folks like Mohan and Lou about the immigration consequences of their plea. So when Tika mentioned that there's something called a post-conviction relief effort for Mohan. That's happening in Georgia. This is very much what that legal defense looks like, where, an expert attorney will look at that very old court record, see if those rights were violated, and also talk to Mohan and make sure did that violation happen and is that grounds for reopening an immigration case. For Lou, there is a really mighty pardoning campaign that's brewing in the state of Michigan. So in Michigan, governor Gretchen Whitmer does have the authority to in some cases expedite a pardon in process. We're hoping that this public swelling of support from Mohan will result in a pardon, because importantly, even if Mohans conviction was expunged, which can be very helpful in, for example, state court, arenas, things like, applying for certain jobs. Unfortunately, in the immigration arena the expungement does not have that same weight as say a vacating, or a motion to vacate that criminal record. So it's super frustrating because, so much of this turns ethically, morally on- do we, as people believe in second chances, and I know most people do, and [00:35:00] yet here we are really. Based on a technicality. I also just want to name too that Lou as a person is both a natural organizer and he is a spiritual guide of his community. So something that many folks don't know is because of so much of the trauma that Anne talked about, both from, supporting the Americans during the Secret War, many Hmong folks who came to the States, they actually in some cases died in their sleep because of this, almost unexplained weight of the trauma, right? And so it almost underscores. The importance of Lou, not just to his family, but this family is a collective family, right? He's both a mentor for so many, he's a spiritual guide for so many. And so you know, him being away from his family, away from community, it's like a double, triple wound. And then for Mohan, I'd love to uplift this memory I have of , a moment in June when Tika gave us a call, and at that point, Mohan had called Tika and said, they're taking me, I'm being deported. And at that point, they were removing Mohan from the ICE facility in Butler, Ohio and transporting him to. At first we had no idea. Then we learned it was, toward the Detroit airport or that deportation to Bhutan and Tika was forced to essentially delay her childbirth. It was very much in the range of when she was due to give birth to their daughter. But because the clock was ticking, Tika drove to Butler, literally begged for Mohan's life as our organizing and advocacy and legal team was trying to get together this emergency stay of deportation. That fortunately came through at the 11th hour. But the fact that Mohan remains in this facility in St. Clair, Michigan, that he's never held his daughter is unacceptable, is ridiculous. And I think so much of these two cases almost, this invisible brotherhood of pain that I know Ann has talked to me about that. Because Lou right now has been in a couple facilities. He is organizing, he's doing his thing and actually supporting folks while also just trying to keep himself well, which is no easy feat to do in so many of these facilities. Especially because, in Alexandria, for example, which is a facility in Louisiana. We know that folks are sleeping on cement floors. We know that folks are not being fed, that there's a lot of human rights violations going on. And here is Lou still continuing to use his voice and try to advocate for the folks around him. Miko Lee: Aisa thank you so much for putting that into context, and we'll put links in the show notes for how folks can get involved in both of these cases. One is, Rising Voices has a call to action to reach out to Governor Whitmer for that. Pardon in Campaign for Lou. So we encourage folks to do that. And in terms of Mohan, there's a GoFundMe to help support Tika and the immense lawyer fees, which we discussed that are needed. And also a letter writing campaign to the ICE director Kevin Roff, to try and release Mohan and also Lou. These are really important things that are happening in our community, and thank you for being out there. Thank you for talking and sharing your stories. We really appreciate you. And also, just briefly, I'd love us for us to talk for a minute about how many folks in our Asian American communities, we don't wanna talk about mistakes that we have made in the past because we might consider that shameful. And therefore, in both of these communities, when we started organizing, it was really hard at first to find people to come forth and share their stories. So I wonder if both of you can give voice to a little about that, the power you found in yourself to be able to come forward and speak about this, even though some other folks in the community might not feel comfortable or strong enough to be able to talk. Tika, can you speak to that? Tika Basnet: Yeah. So what makes me really strong, and I wanna see that my husband case is because he was 17, people can make mistake and from those mistake, if people are learning. Then I think Americans should consider, 'cause my husband did make mistake and I wish that time he knew the rules and regulation. I wish like somebody taught him that he's not supposed to go somebody else property, like around in backyard. And I wish he was been in the United States like more than one and a half year. I wish, if he was like more than two years, three years. And I think that time he, from high school, he could learn. You know, he's not supposed to go there. He was just been in the United States like one and a half year just going to high school. Nobody taught him. His parent doesn't even speak English. Until now, he doesn't even, they doesn't even speak, like nobody in our community knew rules and regulation. So no, basically that he doesn't have guide, like mentor to taught him like, and even though he did make mistake and he's really sorry, and from those mistake learning a lot, and he never get into trouble, like after 11 years, he was clean, he work, he pay taxes. And I think, that is the reason that I really wanna come forward. You know, people can make mistake, but learning from those mistake that changed people life. And, and I think, the reason that I'm coming forward is because organization like Asian Law Caucus, ARU, and, Miko, a lot of people helped me. You know, they taught me like people can make mistake and, I think we shouldn't be same. And I really wanna give example to my daughter, you know, that, you are fighting for justice and you shouldn't fear. I think, what is right is right. What is wrong is wrong. But if somebody's make mistake and they are not, doing that mistake again, I think the people can get a second chance. And I think my husband deserves second chance and he's 30 years old. He has a family, he has a wife, children and he deserved to be here. We came here legally, my husband came here. Legally, we, promise that we'll get home and this is our home. We wanna stay here and I really want my husband be home soon so he can play with her daughter to play with his daughter. Miko Lee: Thank you so much, Tika. Ann I wonder if you could talk to the strength that it takes for you to come forward and speak about your husband and your family. Ann Vue: I'm a community leader with my husband too, right? I would say that there was a moment when he was first detained where I was in complete silence. I was so shocked. It took my attorney, Nancy, just talking to me about it. Of course, back to what Aisa said earlier in our communities, we're afraid. I was so scared. I didn't know what to do. It took me visiting my husband in Baldwin and letting him know that, hey, a bunch of community members are now reaching out and I think it's hit our community. And that's that. At that moment, he was like, you have to say something. You have to say something you have to make noise because you have a, 50% chance, right? We have a 50 50 chance. 50%. They're gonna send me 50%. You're gonna feel bad if you don't say anything, right? 50 here, 50 there. It doesn't matter. But a hundred percent regret if you don't say something. I thought about it and he was like, well, go out there, be my voice. He's like, you've always been my voice. You got this right. And so when, I didn't say no to Nancy. 'cause she really wanted to talk to our rep Mai you know about this. And , Mai and I are pretty close too. And, I just knew if I said anything, Maya's gonna be like mm-hmm. All the way. Right? So I just let Nancy help me, and my most vulnerable time. And I'm glad that she did. And I'm glad that we did get this out. It is the most important thing for us, and I've been, I will say what keeps me going is all of those that have been impacted by this, from people like Tika. I have many, I call 'em sisters. We're all in a lot of these group chats together. They've been also keeping me going. Our amazing team of attorneys and everybody just strategizing through this unprecedented time. It's really everyone's voices. I get to talk to Lou daily. It's definitely not cheap, but he gets to share each story of each person. I believe that everybody has a story and they might not be as lucky as maybe Tika or my husband, but at least now I have their story. I will be their voice. I will tell each person's story, each name, each alien number that I track down, my husband's even literally learned how to count in Spanish, just so he can give them like my phone number in Spanish in case they need to call an emergency. Oh, I'm be getting a lot of calls. Right. I would say that that is what keeps me going because I think that Tika and I and many others are, hoping that there is going to be a better day, a brighter day. I hope that everyone can see that, our children are American, right? Our children, they deserve to have their fathers and their mothers. They deserve to grow with these parents. And with that being said, the most important thing to me is they're not just bystanders. They're literally the future of America. I don't want them growing up with trauma, with trying to ask me questions like, well mom, if we're refugees and we helped, Americans as allies, and we come to this country, why is this payback like this? There's a moral obligation that has to be there and they're gonna grow up and they're gonna be trauma by this. I've got children right now that's been talking about joining the National Guard. It speaks volume about what happens to my husband. He's championed the Hmong, Michigan Special Gorilla unit, the Hmong veterans here in the last two years, really with helping them through resolutions, tributes, making sure that they have things, that they are out there, that people now know them, they are finally recognized. This puts my husband at great danger by sending him back, because now he's championed the veterans here. He celebrates our veterans here. So it's a moral obligation. And I hope Tika, I hope that, and this is to every child, I hope that every child, they deserve their father's presence. There are many people who don't even have their father's presence and they wish their fathers were around. And our fathers wanna be around. And I hope that our daughter, I only have one daughter too, that someday they can, their fathers can be a part of their, the American culture. So I, I hope that. We get that opportunity and I hope that somebody stop being scared, but turn around and help us. Help us. We came here legally, minor stuff, long decade old. Even lose share with me. This detainment has been worse than when he was, when he did time back in 1997. And I just hope that somebody hears our podcast, Miko. Thank you. And, Aisa and Tika. And they turn and they have some compassion and help us because this is the tone that we're setting for the future of our American children. Miko Lee: Thank you so much for sharing. Tika, you wanna add? Tika Basnet: Yes, I really wanna talk about what kind of husband Mohan is. Even though like he detained for five month and I cannot. I put lot of money in his account and there was one guy, I think his family cannot support him. And for me, like it is really hard. I'm not working. But even my husband called me like, you don't need to put like money in my account, but can you please can you please put money in his account? He did not eat food. His family did not have money. I can survive without eating food. But, I think his story is really touching me. And that time, like my husband was crying listening to that guy story in detention center and then I did put like $50 in his account. And my husband is giving person like, he love to give even though, he struggle a lot, even though, he doesn't know what will happen when he get deport. But, him saying other guy story. Does make him cry. I think this is the reason that I really wanna come forward. My husband is giving person, he's lovely person, he's caring person. And that is the reason I wanna come forward. I want people to hear our voice, rather than silent. Because right now people know our story. But if I was silent back , then I don't know whether my husband was already disappear. I don't know whether he gonna die torture or maybe he will expel within 24 hours. I have no idea. So I think, my husband is number one support system for me, and I think because of him that I'm here sharing his story and yeah, like for years I had wonderful time with him. We build our dream and until 2025, our dream is destroy. I'm trying to build again. I'm hoping, like my husband is coming home soon and I'm hoping that this will be the last time that he will get detained. I hope that this will be the end. I don't want him to get detained or deported again. I'm really tired. I don't know what to do. I'm hopeless. I hope listening to my story and Anna's story that separating family is not good. Like it is affecting not only one person but his whole community, whole family. We deserve to get our husband back. Because it is not only about the wife that is fighting for husband, it is the children. , They're so small, they born here and we cannot raise alone, we cannot work. We have things to pay. And paying those bills and taking care of child alone is really difficult. It is giving depression like it's been five month, like I went through postpartum depression, I went through trauma and I don't wanna deal anymore. Like I don't have courage to do this anymore. We need our husband back. Miko Lee: Thank you. And I think both of your husbands are also main caregivers for parents that are ailing in both cases. It's a really important thing that we are intergenerational communities and as you both said, it's not just about the children, but it's also about parents and brothers and sisters and community members as well. Thank you so much for lifting up your stories. I just wanna go back for one more thing. We talked briefly about the crazy expensive lawyer fees that have come up for families that they've been dealing with this, and then also Tika was just bringing up about detention and commissary fees. Can you talk a little bit about the prison industrial complex and the fees that are associated? As Anne was saying, just calling Lou every day the costs that are associated with those things. Many people that don't have a family member that's incarcerated don't know about that. Can you share a little bit about what that system is? Aisa Villarosa: Yeah, absolutely Miko. And, just to underscore, a big theme from this conversation, it is that the US made commitments and they have broken them, both with, as Anne talked about, the refugee experience is one that is made possible through US commitment of acknowledging what, people have survived, what they have given to the country. And to look at this moment where folks are being removed to countries where not only do they have zero ties to, don't speak the language, but, especially in the case of the Bhutanese refugee community, as Tika mentioned, it is [00:52:00] truly a double expulsion. So the fact that we have well-documented testimonials of folks really deported from Bhutan after they're removed there into these life-threatening conditions that in some cases have actually resulted in a community member passing away. A community member passed away in large part because of the failure of the US to both care for them while in detention. So going back to that prison complex, but also just putting them in such a harrowing situation. In another instance, a community member was found after wandering for over a hundred miles on foot. So this is not, deportation and the story ends. This is deportation. And, there is a family that is grieving and thinking through next steps, there is, this call to not have borders, break us the way that this country is trying to do. And to say a little bit about the fees, USCIS, there, there has not been a point yet in history where so many changes and charges hurting families have been ushered in, But for this year, and so to give a couple examples of that – asylum cases for one, these often take many, many years through this administration. Now, families have to pay a cost yearly for each year that your asylum application, languishes because we're also seeing that those same folks who are supposed to process these applications are either being laid off or they're being militarized. So something like USCIS where this was where one would go to apply for a passport. Now the same department is literally being handed guns and they're now taking folks during naturalization interviews. Other avenues to challenge your removal. Like I mentioned a motion to reopen. All these things used to be fairly affordable. Now they can cost many thousands of dollars on top of the attorney fees. So something that's been quite challenging for groups like Asian Law Caucus where we do have attorneys representing folks in removal proceedings, there's often this misperception that oh it's costing so much money. Attorneys are pocketing cash. And unfortunately there are some situations where some attorneys have been known to take advantage of families in this desperate moment. But for many, many attorneys who are in this mix, they're experts at this work. They're trying to do the right thing. They're both overwhelmed and they're seeing these new charges, which make the battle really even more difficult. So to turn it back to the listeners, I would say that as powerless as this moment can make us feel everyone is bearing witness. Hopefully the listeners today can take in Anne's story, can take in Tikas story and whatever power one has in their corner of the world, this is the moment to use that. Whether it's your voice, whether it's learning more about a community, maybe you're learning about for the first time. This is really the moment to take action. Miko Lee: Thank you Aisa. I really wanna thank you all for being here with me today, for sharing your personal stories, your personal pain, and for recognizing that this is happening. We deeply believe that we need to keep our families together. That is really important. It is written into the very basis of this American country about redemption and forgiveness. And this is what we're talking about for incidents that happened, misunderstandings that happened when these folks were young men, that they have paid for their, they have paid for their time, and yet they're being punished again, these promises that were broken by this American government, and we need to find [00:56:00] ways to address that. I really wanna deeply thank each of you for continuing to be there for sharing your voice, for protecting one another, for being there and standing up for your family and for our community. Thank you for joining me today. Check out our Apex Express Show notes to find out about how you can get involved. Learn about the Rising Voices campaign for Lou Young and Mohan Khaki's GoFundMe and please help to support these organizations working every day to support detained and deported people. Asian Law Caucus, Asian Refugees, United Balo Project in Vietnam. Collective Freedom in Vietnam and Laos Asian Prisoner Support Committee and new light Wellness in Cambodia. November 1st and second people nationwide are joining the Disappeared in America Weekend of Action to Stand Up for Immigrant Families and Defend Due Process. Actions include protests at Home [00:57:00] Depots, candlelight, freedom Vigils, and Day of the Dead events, honoring lives lost to detention. The following day on November 3rd, 4:00 PM Pacific Time, 7:00 PM Eastern Time. Join us for We Belong here, Bhutanese and Hmong Americans in the Struggle Against Statelessness, a live virtual event featuring my three guests tonight, along with performances and conversations. Find out more in our show notes. Please check out our website, kpfa.org/program, apex Express to find out more about our show. We thank all of you listeners out there. Keep resisting, keep organizing, keep creating, and sharing your visions with the world. Your voices are important. APEX Express is a collective of activists that includes Ayame Keane-Lee, Anuj Vaidya, Cheryl Truong, Isabel Li, Jalena Keane-Lee, Miko Lee, Preeti Mangala Shekar and Swati Rayasam. Have a great night. The post APEX Express – 10.16.25 – We Belong Here appeared first on KPFA.

In this week's episode, we discuss time travel in all its forms, from our experiences writing it, to our enjoyment of watching it in Kdramas. Books mentioned:Puck and Prejudice by Lia RileyI Love you Like It's 1999 by A.J. PineThe Seven Year Slip by Ashley PostonOona Out of Order by Margarita MontimoreThe Time Traveler's Wife by Audrey NiffeneggerThe Husbands by Holly GramazioReady to download your first audiobook? Don't forget to click HERE for your free Audible trial.*Audible is a sponsor of Afternoona Delight Podcast*Are your family and friends sick of you talking about K-drama? We get it...and have an answer. Join our AfterNoona Delight Patreon and find community among folks who get your obsession. And check out www.afternoonadelight.com for more episodes, book recs and social media goodness. And don't forget about the newest member of our network: Afternoona Asks where diaspora Asians living in the West find ways to reconnect to Asian culture via Asian/KDramas.Last but CERTAINLY not least....love BTS? Or curious what all the fuss is about? Check out our sister pod Afternoona Army for "thinky, thirsty and over thirty" takes on Bangtan life. ★ Support this podcast on Patreon ★

Hey before I begin the podcast, I just want to thank all of you who joined the patreon, you guys are simply awesome. Please take the time to vote and comment on the patreon polls so I can best tackle the specific subjects you want to hear more about and hell it does not have to be about the Pacific War, I like ancient Rome, WW1, WW2, just toss some ideas and I will try to make it happen.   This Podcast is going to be a very remarkable story about a Korean man who fought for the IJA, the Soviet Union and Nazi Germany during the second world war.  He is also a man whom most than likely never existed.   Did that catch you off guard haha?   If you have a chance you can pull up wikipedia and search Yang Kyoungjong. The first thing you will notice is a disclaimer that states numerous historians who claim Yang Kyoungjong does not exist. Yet this man exists in some history books, there is a iconic photo of him, there is a documentary looking into him, countless Korean stories are writing loosely about him, there is a pretty decent war film and multiple youtubers have covered his so-called story. So how does this guy not exist if his story is so popular?   His story is claimed to be real by military historian Stephen Ambrose who wrote about him in his book in 1994 titled “D-day, june 6th, 1944: the Climactic battle of World War II. There is also references to him in Antony Beevor's book “the second world war” and that of defense consultant and author Steven Zaloga's book“the devil's garden: Rommel's desperate Defense of Omaha Beach on D-Day”. In 2005 a Korean SBS documentary investigated his existence and concluded there was no convincing evidence of his existence. For those of you who have ever heard of this man, I guarantee it's because of the 2011 south korean film “My Way”. That's where I found out about it by the way. Many of you probably saw the iconic photo of him, again if you pull up the wikipedia page on Yang Kyoungjong its front and center. The photo shows a asiatic man wearing a wehrmacht uniform and he has just been captured by american forces on the d-day landings.   Now I don't want to jump into the is he real or not busy just yet. So this is how the podcast will go down, very reminiscent of “Our fake History's Podcast” might I add, I am a huge fan of that guys work. I am going to tell you the story of Yang Kyoungjong, then afterwords disclose my little investigation into whether he is real or not.   So without further adieu this is the story of a man who fought for three nations during WW2.   The Story   It was June 1944, the allies had just unleashed Operation Overlord, the D-Day landings at Normandy. Lt Robert Brewer of the 506th parachute infantry regiment, 101st airborne division was overlooking the capture of Axis forces and reported to his regiment finding four Asians in Wehrmacht uniform around the Utah beach landings. Brewer nor any of his colleagues spoke the language the Asian men spoke, they assumed them to be Japanese.  The four asians were processed as POW's, listed as young Japanese and sent to a British POW camp, before he would be sent to another POW camp in the US. At some point between his capture and the POW camps, he gave his name as Yang Kyoungjong, stated he was Korean and gave an extremely incredible story. To who did he say these things, no one knows.   Yang Kyoungjong was born in 1920, in Shin Eu Joo, part of modern day North Korea. At the age of 18, Yang was forcibly conscripted into the Imperial Japanese army. Korea was one of the bread baskets of Asia and the Empire of Japan had annexed her in 1910. Japan held sovereignty over Korea, making Koreans subjects.    In 1939 the Empire of Japan faced major labor shortages and as a result began conscription of Japanese men for the military, while importing vast amounts of Korean laborers to work in mainland Japan. For the Imperial Japanese Army, Koreans were not drafted until 1944 when things were dire for Japan. Until 1944, the IJA allowed Koreans to volunteer in the army. In 1938 there was a 14% acceptance rate, by 1943 this dropped dramatically to 2%, but the number of applicants increased exponentially from 3000 per annum in 1939 to 300,000 by the end of the war. On paper it looked like Koreans were registering en masse on their on violation, but this is quite the contrary, the Japanese policy was to use force. Japanese officials began press gang efforts against Korean peasants, forcing them to sign applications, it is believed over half of the applications were done in such a manner. Other applicants registered for a variety of reasons, typically because of economic turmoil. Korea would produce 7 generals and many field grade officers. One of the most well known was Lt General Crown Prince Yi Un who would command Japanese forces in the China War.   Thus Yang Kyoungjong was forced into the IJA and would find himself stationed with the Kwantung Army. Quite unfortunately for him, he was enlisted into their service at a time where two major border skirmishes occurred with the Soviet Union. The USSR was seen as Japan's number one rival going all the way back to the Triple Intervention of 1895 when the Russians thwarted Japan's seizure of the Liaodong peninsula after they had won the first sino japanese war. This led to the Russo-Japanese war, where Japan shocked the world being victorious over the Russian Empire. When the Russian Empire fell and the Russian civil war kicked off, Japan sent the lionshare of men to fight the Red Army during the Siberian Intervention of 1918-1922.    Communism was seen as the greatest if not one of the greatest threats to the Kokutai and thus Japan as a whole. As such Japan placed the Kwantung Army along the Manchurian borderlands to thwart any possible soviet invasion. There had numerous border skirmishes, but in 1938 and 1939 two large battles occurred. In 1938 the Kwantung army intercepted a Soviet message indicating the Far East forces would be securing some unoccupied heights west of Lake Khasan that overlooked the Korean port city of Rajin. Soviet border troops did indeed move into the area and began fortifying it. The Kwantung army sent forces to dislodge them and this soon led to a full on battle. The battle was quite shocking for both sides, the Soviets lost nearly 800 men dead with 3279 wounded, the Japanese claimed they had 526 dead with 913 wounded. The Soviet lost significant armor and despite both sides agreeing to a ceasefire, the Kwantung army considered it a significant victory and proof the Soviets were not capable of thwarting them.   In theory Yang Kyoungjong would be in training and would eventually reach the Manchuria borders by 1939. Another man sent over would be Georgy Zhukov who was given the task of taking command of the 57th special corps and to eliminate Japanese provocations. What was expected of Zhukov was if the Japanese pressed again for battle, to deliver them a crushing and decisive blow. On May 11th, 1939 some Mongolian cavalry units were grazing their horses in a disputed area. On that very same day, Manchu cavalry attacked the Mongols to drive them past the river of Khalkhin Gol. Two days later the Mongols returned in greater numbers and this time the Manchu were unable to dislodge them.    What was rather funny to say, a conflict of some horses grazing on disputed land, led to a fully mechanized battle. On May 14th, Lt Colonel Yaozo Azuma led some regiments to dislodge the Mongols, but they were being supported by the Red Army. Azuma force suffered 63% casualties, devastating. June saw the battle expand enormously, Japan was tossing 30,000 men in the region, the Soviets tossed Zhukov at them alongside motorized and armored forces. The IJA lacking good armored units, tossed air forces to smash the nearby Soviet airbase at Tamsakbulak. In July the IJA engaged the Red Army with nearly 100 tanks and tankettes, too which Zhukov unleashed 450 tanks and armored cars. The Japanese had more infantry support, but the Soviet armor encircled and crushed them. The two armies spared with another for weeks, the Japanese assumed the Soviets would suffer logistical problems but Zhukoev assembled a fleet of 2600 trucks to supply his forces, simply incredible. Both sides were suffering tremendous casualties, then in August global politics shifted. It was apparent a war in Europe was going to break out, Zhukov was ordered to be decisive, the Soviets could not deal with a two front war. So Zhukov now using a fleet of 4000 trucks began transported supplies from Chita to the front next to a armada of tanks and mechanized brigades. The Soviets tossed 3 rifle divisions, two tank divisions and 2 tank brigades, nearly 500 tanks in all, with two motorized infantry divisions and 550 fighters and bombers.    The stalemate was shattered when Zhukov unleashed is armada, some 50,000 Soviets and Mongols hit the east bank of Khalkhin Gol. The Japanese were immediately pinned down, while the Soviets were employing a double envelopment. The Japanese tried to counter attack and it failed horribly. The Japanese then scrambled to break out of the encirclement and failed. The surrounded Japanese forces refused to surrender as the Soviets smashed them with artillery and aerial bombardment. By the end of August the Japanese forces on the Mongolian side of the border were annihilated. On September 15th the USSR and Japan signed a ceasefire.    The battle of Khalkhin Gol was devastating for both sides. The Japanese claim they had 8440 deaths, 8766 wounded, lost 162 aircraft and 42 tanks. Its estimated 500-600 Japanese forces were taken prisoner. Because of IJA doctrine these men were considered killed in action. Some sources will claim the real numbers for Japanese casualties could have been as high as 30,000. The Soviets claim 9703 deaths, 15,251 wounded, the destruction of 253 tanks, 250 aircraft, 96 artillery pieces and 133 armored cars. Of those tank losses, its estimated 75-80% were destroyed by anti-tank guns, 15-20% field artillery, 5-10% infantry thrown incendiary bombs, 3% mines and another 3% for aircraft bombing.   Back to Yang Kyoungjong, he alongside the other Japanese, Manchu and Korean POW's were sent to Gulags in Siberia. As the war on the Eastern Front kicked off between Nazi Germany and the Soviet Union, facing annihilation the Soviets did anything possible to survive. One of these actions was to create the Shtrafbats, “Penal battalions”. Stalins order No 227 created the first penal battalions, who were supposed to be around 800 men strong. The first Shtrafbat battalion was deployed to the Stalingrad Front on August 22nd of 1942.   On order was issued on November 26, 1942 “status of Penal units of the army”, it was issued by Georgy Zhukov, now deputy commander in chief who was the man who formally standardized soviet penal units. The Shtrafbats were around 360 men per battalion commanded by mid range Red Army officers and politruks. The men forced into these were permanents or temporaries. Permanents were officers, commanders, the higher ranks guys. Temporary known as shtrafniki “punishees” were the grunts, typically prisoners and those convicted of crimes. From september 1942 to May of 1945 422,700 men would be forced into penal battalions.    Typically those forced into penal military units were one of two things: 1) those convicted of dissertation or cowardice, 2) Soviet Gulag labor camp inmates. It seems Yang Kyoungjong found himself in a very awkward situation as he would be forced into one of these penal battalions and sent to fight on the eastern front. As pertaining to Order No. 227, each Army was to have 3–5 barrier squads of up to 200 persons each, these units would be made up of penal units.    So back toYang Kyoungjong, he would find himself deployed at the third battle of Kharkov. This battle was part of a series of battles fought on the eastern front. As the German 6th army was encircling Stalingrad, the Soviets launched a series of wide counter attacks, as pertaining to “operation star”. Operation star saw massive offensives against Kharkov, Belgorod, Kursk, Voroshilovgrad and Izium. The Soviets earned great victories, but they also overextended themselves. Field Marshal Erich von Manstein seeing the opening, performed a counter-strike against Kharkov on February 19th of 1943, using fresh troops of the 2nd SS Panzer Corps alongside two other panzer armies. Manstein also had massive air support from field Marshal Wolfram von Richthofens Luftflotte 4, 1214 aircraft tossed 1000 sorties per day from February 20th to march 15th. The Red army had approximately 210,000 troops who fought in the Voronezh-Kharkov offensive, the Germans would have roughly 160,000 men, but their tanks outnumbered the Soviets 7-1, they had roughly 350 of them.   The Germans quickly outflanked the Soviets, managing to encircle and annihilate many units. Whenever soviets units made attempts to escape encirclements, the German air forces placed pressure upon them. The German air forces had the dual job of airlifting supplies to the front lines giving the Soviets no breathing space. Gradually the fight focused around the city of Kharkov seeing the Soviets dislodged. The Germans caused severe casualties, perhaps 45,000 dead or missing with another 41,000 wounded. The Germans suffered 4500 deaths, 7000 wounded. The Germans took a large number of prisoners, and Yang Kyoungjong was one of them.   Yet again a prisoner Yang Kyoungjong was coerced into serving another nation, this time for Die Ost-Bataillone. The Eastern Front had absolutely crippled Germany and as a result Germany began to enlist units from just about any nation possible and this included former Soviet citizens. There were countless different units, like the Russian liberation Army, die Hilfswillige, Ukrainian collaborationists, and there were also non-Russians from the USSR who formed the Ost-Bataillone. These eastern battalions would comprise a rough total of 175,000 men. Many of the Ost-Bataillone were conscripted or coerced into serving, though plenty also volunteered. Countless were recruited from POW camps, choosing to serve instead of labor in camps. The Osttruppen were to typically deployed for coastal defense, rear area activities, security stuff, all the less important roles to free up the German units to perform front line service.   There were two different groups, the Ost-Legionen “eastern legions” and Ost-Bataillone “eastern battalions”. The Ostlegionen were large foreign legion type units raised amongst members of specific ethnic or racial groups. The Ost-Bataillone were composed of numerous nationalities, usually plucked from POW camps in eastern europe. They were tossed together into battalion sized units and integrated individually into German combat formations. Obviously the Germans did not get their hands on large numbers of Koreans, so Yang Kyoungjong found himself in a Ost-Bataillone.    In 1944, due to massive losses in the Eastern Front, and in preparation for the allies about to open a second front, the Germans began deploying a lot of Ost-Bataillone along the coastal defense line at Cherbourg. Yang Kyoungjong was enlisted in the 709th static infantry division, a coastal defense unit assigned to defend the eastern and northern coasts of the Cotentin Peninsula. This would include the Utah beach landing site and numerous US airborne landing zones. The sector was roughly 250 km running northeast of Carentan, via Barfleur-Cherbourg-Cap de la Hague to the western point of Barneville. This also included the 65 km of land just in font of Cherbourg harbor. A significant portion of the 709th were Ost-bataillon, countless were from eastern europe, many were former Soviet POW'S. There were also two battalions of the 739th Grenadier regiment whom were Georgian battalions. A significant amount of the 709th had no combat experience, but had trained extensively in the area.   The 709th would be heavily engaged on D-day meeting US airborne units and the 4th infantry division who landed at Utah beach. In the early hours of June 6th, the US 82nd and 101st airborne divisions landed at the base of the Cotentin peninsula and managed to secure a general area for the US 4th infantry division to land at Utah beach, with very few casualties compared to other beach landings. After the landings the forces tried to link up with other forces further east. By June 9th they had crossed the Douve river valley and captured Carentan. House to house fighting was seen in the battle for Carentan, the Germans tossed a few counterattacks, but the Americans held on with the help of armor units of the 13th.    The Americans then advanced to cut off the Cotentin Peninsula, now supported by 3 other infantry divisions. The Germans had few armored or mobilized infantry in the area. By June 16th the German command was tossed into chaos as Erwin Rommel wanted them to pull out and man the Atlantic Wall at Cherbourg, but Hitler demanded they hold their present lines of defense. By the 17th Hitler agreed to the withdrawal, under some provisions the men still took up limited defenses spanning the entire peninsula. On the 18th the US 9th infantry division reached the west coast of the peninsula thus isolating the Cherbourg garrison. A battle was unleashed for 24 hours with the 4th, 9th and 79th US infantry divisions driving north on a broad front. They faced little opposition on the western side and the eastern, the center held much stronger resistance. The Americans would find several caches of V-1 flying bombs and V-2 rocket installations at Brix. After two days the Americans were in striking distance of Cherbourg. The garrison commander Lt General Karl-Wilhelm von Schlieben had 21,000 men, but many were naval personnel and labor units. Schliebens 709th had performed a fighting withdrawal to Cherbourg and were completely exhausted. The trapped forces were low in provisions, fuel and ammunition. The luftwaffe tried dropping supplies on their positions but it was inadequate.    A general assault began on the 22nd and the German forces put up stiff resistance within their concrete pillboxes. Allied warships bombarded the city on the 25th of june and on the 26th a British elite force, No. 30 Commando launched an assault against Octeville, a suburb of southwestern Cherbourg. The commandos quickly captured 20 officers and 500 men of the Kriegmarine naval intelligence HQ at Villa Meurice. As the Germans were ground down, Schlieben was captured and with that a surrender was made on the 29th.   The Americans suffered nearly 3000 deaths with 13,500 wounded during the operation. The Germans suffered 8000 deaths with 30,000 captured. For the 709th who took a lionshare of the fighting they reported sustaining 4000 casualties.    Amongst the captured was Yang Kyoungjong. As I said in the beginning Lt Robert Brewer of the 506th parachute infantry regiment, 101st airborne division was overlooking the capture of Axis forces and reported to his regiment finding four Asians in Wehrmacht uniform around the Utah beach landings. Brewer nor any of his colleagues spoke the language the Asian men spoke, they assumed them to be Japanese.  The four asians were processed as POW's, listed as young Japanese and sent to a British POW camp, before he would be sent to another POW camp in the US. At some point between his capture and the POW camps, he gave his name as Yang Kyoungjong, stated he was Korean and gave the story. Apparently Yang Kyoungjob was granted US citizenship and would spend the rest of his life in Illinois until his death in 1992.   So that is the story of Yang Kyoungjong.    The truth Did Yang Kyoungjong exist? Where does his story originate? For those of you who have not guessed it yet, the story I told you was full of details, I simply added based on historical events, with zero evidence at all any man named Yang Kyoungjong was involved in them. I did this specifically to highlight, thats exactly what others have done over the course of many years, creating a sort of mythos. If you know the game broken telephone, thats what I would theorize makes up most of this mans story. But lets go through some actual evidence why don't we?   From the digging I have done, the story seemed to originate with historian Stephen Ambrose book in 1994 titled “D-day, june 6th, 1944: the Climactic battle of World War II”. While writing this book, Ambrose interviewed Robert Burnham Brewer, who served E Company, 2nd battalion, 506th parachute infantry regiment of the 101st airborne division. This same man was portrayed in Band of Brothers by the way. Brewer gave one rather ambiguous account where he spoke about capturing 4 asian men in Wehrmacht uniforms.    Here is patient zero as told to us by Ambrose's book (Page 34, no footnote on the page)   The so-called Ost battalions became increasingly unreliable after the German defeat at Kursk; they were, therefore, sent to france in exchange for German troops. At the beach called Utah on the day on the invasion, Lt Robert Brewer of the 506th Parachute infantry regiment, 101st airborne division, US Army, captured four asians in Wehrmacht uniforms. No one could speak their language; eventually it was learned that they were Koreans. How on earth did Koreans end up fighting for Hitler to defend france against Americans? It seems they had been conscripted into the Japanese army in 1938-Korea was then a Japanese colony-captured by the Red Army in the border battles with Japan in 1939, forced into the Red Army, captured by the Wehrmacht in December 1941 outside Moscow, forced into the German army, and sent to France”. What happened to them, Lt Brewer never found out, but presumably they were sent back to Korea. If so, they would almost certainly have been conscripted again, either into the south or north korean army. It is possible than in 1950 they ended up fighting once again, either against the US army or with it, depending on what part of Korea they came from. Such are the vagaries of politics in the 20th century. By June 1944, one in six German rifleman in France was from an Ost battalion.   Now digging further since there are no footnotes, it seems Ambrose took an oral account from Lt Brewer, but did not directly quote him and instead abstractly expanded upon his story. Ambrose was guilty of doing this often. As multiple historians have pointed out, Brewer was living in the 1940s and was by no means an ethnographer, he was not a person who could have accurately known the nationality of the four asian men he captured. It is plausible he or other US units around him, just came up with Korean for the four asians who could have been from nearly anywhere in central to east asia. For all we know the men found could have been from Turkestan. What was “asian” to westerners of the 1940's is extremely broad.    If you look up the Ost-Bataillone or Ostlegionen you will see they consisted of captured former soviet soldiers. During the d-day landings, 1/6th of the German forces defending the atlantic coast were made up of the Ost-battailones. They came from numerous places, Latvia, Lithuania, Estonia, Georgia, Ukraine, Azerbaijan, India, Uzbekistan, Kazakhstan, Turkestan, Mongolia and numerous parts of the USSR. Needless to say, there were a ton of people whom would be considered asian and could be mistaken to be from Korea, Japan, Burma, etc.    It seems Brewer's vague account was transformed by Amrose, but this only covers one part of all of this, the story, what about the photo?    The iconic photograph is another matter entirely. The photograph has nothing to do with Brewer's account, it is simply a random photograph taken at Utah beach of a captured asian soldier wearing a Wehrmacht uniform. The official description of the photo states “Capture Jap in Nazi uniform. France, fearful of his future, this young Jap wearing a nazi uniform, is checked off in a roundup of German prisoners on the beaches of france. An american army captain takes the Jap's name and serial number” Author Martin Morgan believes the man in the photograph is not Yang Kyoungjong, but instead an ethnic Georgian from the 795th Georgian Battalion, which was composed of Georgian Osttruppen troops or someone who was Turkistani. In 2002 word of the story became more popularized online and in 2004 the iconic photo also began to circulate heavily on the internet. The Korean media became aware of the story in 2002 and when they saw the picture the Korean news site DKBNews investigated the matter. Apparently a reader of the DKBNews submitted biographical details about the soldier in the photo, including his name, date of birth, the general story we now know, his release, life in Illinois and death. The DKBNews journalist requested sources and none were provided, typical.   So some random unknown reader of the DKBNews gave a name, place and time of birth and even where he ended up and died.  In 2005 the Seoul broadcasting system aired a documentary specifically investigating the existence of the asian soldiers who fought for Germany on d-day.   In the SBS special “The Korean in Normandy,” produced and broadcast in 2005 based on rumors of Yang kyoungjog,  they searched for records of Korean prisoners of war during the Battle of khalkhin gol and records of Korean people who participated in the German-Japanese War, and records related to the German Army's eastern unit, but could not find traces of such a person. In addition, the soldiers who served in the Soviet army, who were captured, and then transferred to the German army's eastern units were considered by the Soviet Union to be serious traitors. Accordingly, under a secret agreement between the United States, Great Britain, and the Soviet Union, they were forcibly repatriated to the Soviet Union after the war and held in Gulags.. The SBS production team stated that the rumors that a 'Korean from Normandy' had gone to the United States and that he died in seclusion near Northwestern University under the name of 'Yang Kyoungjong', which they were unaware of, were false. The investigative team looked for any traces of a Yang Kyoungjong and found none, so they concluded although there were accounts of asian soldiers in the German army during WW2, there was zero evidence of the existence of Yang Kyoungjong or any Koreans fighting on D-day for that matter.    The 2005 SBS Special documentary sprang forth a bunch of stories by Korean authors, expanding the mythos of Yang Kyoungjong.   In 2007 author Jo Jeong-rae published a novel titled “human mask” which told the story of SHin Gilman, The story ends with Shin Gil-man, who was conscripted into the Japanese army at the age of 20, as a prisoner of war in Normandy, then transported back to the Soviet Union and eventually executed by firing squad. Another novel called “D-day” by author Kim Byeong-in was release in 2011, just prior to the film My War, the plot is extremely similar to the movie. The main characters are Han Dae-sik and Yoichi, who met as children as the sons of a Japanese landowner and the house's housekeeper, harboring animosity toward each other, and grew up to become marathon runners representing Joseon and Japan. As they experience the war together, they feel a strange sense of kinship and develop reconciliation and friendship.   And of course the most famous story would find its way to the big screen. In 2011 the film My Way came out, back then the most expensive south korean film ever made at around 23$ million.   Then in 2012 a unknown person created a wikipedia page piecing together the Ambrose story, the photo and the unknown DBK readers information. With all of this information becoming more viral suddenly in 2013, two history books hit the scene and would you know it, both have “Yang Kyoungjong” in them.    These are Antony Beevor's book “the second world war” and that of defense consultant and author Steven Zaloga in his book “the devil's garden: Rommel's desperate Defense of Omaha Beach on D-Day”. Both authors took the story, name and iconic photo and expanded on the mythos by adding further details as to how the Korean man would have gone from Korea to Cherbourg france.   So Ambrose's story spreads across the internet alongside this photo. Both spark interest in Korea and an investigation receives some random guys testimony, which quite honestly was groundless. Despite the korean documentary stating there was no evidence of a Yang Kyoungjong, it sparks further interest, more stories and a famous film in 2011. 2012 sees a wikipage, it becomes more viral and now seeps into other historians work.   And I would be remiss not to mention the bizarre controversy that broke out in my nation of Canada. A nation so full of controversies today, dear god. Debbie Hanlon a city councilor in St John Newfoundland was absolutely wrecked online in 2018 for an advertisement promoting her real estate business stating “Korean Yang kyoungjong fought with Japan against the USSR. He then fought with the USSR against Germany. Then with Germany against the US! Want an agent who fights for you, call me!” Really weird ad by the way. So it seems her ad was to point out how far she was willing to go for her real estate clients. It was considered extremely offensive, and not the first time she pulled this off, her husband Oral Mews had recently come under fire for another ad he made using a photo of the Puerto Rican cab driver Victor Perez Cardona, where the vehicle turned into a casket. That ad said “He can't give you a lift because he's dead. He's propped up in his cab at his wake! Need a lift to great service, call me!” Hanlon was surprised at the amount of backlash she received since the ads had been running for over 4 years online. She claimed to be the victim of cyberbullying and trolls. So yeah, that happened.    Did Yang Kyoungjong exist, more than likely not, was it possible some Koreans found themselves in a position his story pertains to, you know what it's quite possible. During War a lot of weird things happen. I hope you liked this episode, please let me know in the comments on the Patreon what you think, how I can improve things and of course what you want to hear about next!

Vlad hits up a small town with the family to find some balance, does some victim flexing at a cafe, rants about Teddy Swims, gives Asians tips for surviving Wog marriage & moreeeeee!DNA DISTILLERY (AWARD WINNING RAKIJA)Award winning Rakija company with immaculate celebratory beverages. Check out the entire range on the below websites, order a tasting pack or some of their flagship, amazing rakija today!https://www.dnadistillery.comCARDSTRIKE! Amazing Basketball cards, Michael Jordan memorabilia and everything collectable sports card buying and selling!!!https://www.cardstrike.com.auMETROPOLITAN STONE (Kitchens, Cabinets, Laundry, All Cabinets)We have a combined 30 years experience in the cabinet making industry in Victoria! Everything from small projects to large projects!Benchtop change overs, Kitchen facilities, Kitchens, Laundries, Bathroom cabinets, T.V units, Wardrobes etc!MENTION: VLADContact: MATT 0425797488Matthew@metropolitanstone.com.auhttp://www.metropolitanstone.com.auORANGE LEGAL GROUP (Specialising in Property law for purchasing and selling, conveyancing, in-house Mortgage broker & Chartered Account! One stop shop for ALL property needs! Wrap! FREE Contract reviews for buyers before purchasing property!Mention VLAD!https://www.orangelegalgroup.com.auEmail: property@orangelegalgroup.com.auContact: mycousinvlad@gmail.comhttp://www.instagram.com/mycousinvladSend Vlad a Text MessageSupport the showBE GOODDO GOODGET GOOD

Kej and I have been to the curry oscars in London and Sach has been on a plane where he met ANOTHER weirdo! Nando's have got new rules, Heinz have got new flavours for their baked beans and we are celebrating old school hymns!

Before Parasite made him a household name, Bong Joon-ho crafted a haunting masterpiece. Memories of Murder (released in 2003) tells the story of two detectives in 1980s rural South Korea hunting the country's first known serial killer...a case that would remain unsolved for over 30 years. Based on the true story of the Hwaseong serial murders, the film is a devastating exploration of incompetence, corruption, and misogyny. Join Lia & Megan as we revisit the muddy fields, cramped interrogation rooms, and that final iconic haunting shot. Note: We recorded this episode in early June right before Lia went to South Korea. This was before we began using video software so please note that component won't be included in this episode. Ready to download your first audiobook? Don't forget to click HERE for your free Audible trial.*Audible is a sponsor of Afternoona Delight Podcast*Are your family and friends sick of you talking about K-drama? We get it...and have an answer. Join our AfterNoona Delight Patreon and find community among folks who get your obsession. And check out www.afternoonadelight.com for more episodes, book recs and social media goodness. And don't forget about the newest member of our network: Afternoona Asks where diaspora Asians living in the West find ways to reconnect to Asian culture via Asian/KDramas.Last but CERTAINLY not least....love BTS? Or curious what all the fuss is about? Check out our sister pod Afternoona Army for "thinky, thirsty and over thirty" takes on Bangtan life. ★ Support this podcast on Patreon ★

Nancy Kwan is an actress, author, dancer, screenwriter, and filmmaker.  With films such as 1960's The World of Suzie Wong and 1961's Flower Drum Song, Nancy became Hollywood's first Asian Superstar.  Her casting in roles specifically written for Asian actresses, and in non-race-specific roles, was unprecedented, changing the way moviegoers viewed the Asian community and creating more opportunities for Asians in the film industry.  Join Shannon and Nancy as they discuss Nancy's extraordinary life and career, from her films to her friendship with Bruce Lee and what it's like to be serenaded by Elvis Presley. And be sure to read Nancy's new book, The World of Nancy Kwan: A Memoir by Hollywood's Asian Superstar, for Nancy's full story.

In this episode of The Growing Readers Podcast, host Bianca Schulze welcomes award-winning author-illustrator Grace Lin and her childhood friend turned editor, Alvina Ling, VP and Editor-in-Chief at Little, Brown Books for Young Readers. The duo discusses Grace's return to middle grade fiction after nine years with The Gate, The Girl, and The Dragon, a stunning fantasy based on Chinese folklore. They explore the collaborative magic of their decades-long partnership, the balance between artistic vision and commercial publishing, the importance of creating diverse literature, and how patience and trust allow books to become exactly what they're meant to be.Transcription: You can read the transcription on The Children's Book ReviewHighlights:The Nine-Year Wait: Why Grace stepped away from middle grade to focus on picture books and how The Gate, The Girl, and The Dragon came together piece by piece since 2016The Shanghai Dragon Pillar: The urban legend that became a crucial puzzle piece—how construction workers appeased an angry dragon sleeping beneath a highwayThe Messy Middle: Why every book is a slog, even after 26 years of publishing, and how Grace and Alvina work through it togetherPublishing Beautiful Books: Behind the scenes of creating sprayed edges, gold foil, and full-color illustrations—and how the sales team championed the special treatmentFrom Childhood Friends to Creative Partners: How Alvina and Grace's friendship since age 10 (captured in The Year of the Dog) shapes their editorial relationshipTrying Your Best Makes You the Hero: Grace's philosophy of creating relatable characters who aren't "chosen ones" but ordinary kids earnestly doing the right thingNotable Quotes:"I wanted to make books that showed people how human Asians were...that Asians are just as human, just as part of the population as everyone else." —Grace Lin"I feel like the audience is just excited with whatever you want to do next." —Alvina Ling on Grace's ability to move between genresBooks Mentioned:The Gate, The Girl, and The Dragon by Grace Lin: Amazon or Bookshop.orgWhere the Mountain Meets the Moon by Grace Lin: Amazon or Bookshop.orgA Big Mooncake for Little Star by Grace Lin: Amazon or Bookshop.orgChinese Menu by Grace Lin: Amazon or Bookshop.orgThe Year of the Dog by Grace Lin: Amazon or Bookshop.orgStarry River of the Sky by Grace Lin: Amazon or Bookshop.orgWhen the Sea Turned to Silver by Grace Lin: Amazon or Bookshop.orgAbout Grace Lin:Grace Lin is the award-winning and bestselling author and illustrator of Chinese Menu, When the Sea Turned to Silver, Starry River of the Sky, Where the Mountain Meets the Moon (a Newbery Honor book), The Year of the Dog, The Year of the Rat, Dumpling Days, and Ling & Ting, as well as picture books such as The Ugly Vegetables, A Big Bed for Little Snow, and A Big Mooncake for Little Star. Grace is a graduate of the Rhode Island School of Design and lives in Massachusetts.About Alvina Ling:Alvina Ling is VP and Editor-in-Chief at Little, Brown Books for Young Readers (a division of Hachette Book Group) where she has worked since 1999. She edits children's books for all ages, from picture books to young adult. She has edited such books as A Big Mooncake For Little Star by Grace Lin; Mr. Tiger Goes Wild by Peter Brown; Dave the Potter by Laban Carrick Hill, illustrated by Bryan Collier; Where the Mountain Meets the Moon by Grace Lin; The Land of Stories series by Chris Colfer; The Candymakers by Wendy Mass; Daughter of Smoke and Bone by Laini Taylor; and The Cruel Prince by Holly Black.Connect and Follow:Learn more about Grace Lin: https://www.gracelin.comFollow Alvina Ling on Twitter: @planetalvinaFollow Alvina Ling on Instagram: @alvinalingListen to Grace and Alvina's podcast: Book Friends ForeverCredits:Host: Bianca SchulzeGuests: Grace Lin and Alvina LingProducer: Bianca SchulzeEpisode Sponsor: https://www.claudiamillsauthor.com/books/66

To celebrate this week's release of a NEW Taylor Swift album, Lia and Megan indulged their Swiftie, Amy, in a fun little exercise. The game? Assigning TS song titles--one from each album--to the K-Drama we think it embodies. That's it! Mouse crypt and true crime stories are just the icing on the cake. We hope you'll play along!Spotify Playlist for this Episode"I Did Something Bad" from Reputation TourReady to download your first audiobook? Don't forget to click HERE for your free Audible trial.*Audible is a sponsor of Afternoona Delight Podcast*Are your family and friends sick of you talking about K-drama? We get it...and have an answer. Join our AfterNoona Delight Patreon and find community among folks who get your obsession. And check out www.afternoonadelight.com for more episodes, book recs and social media goodness. And don't forget about the newest member of our network: Afternoona Asks where diaspora Asians living in the West find ways to reconnect to Asian culture via Asian/KDramas.Last but CERTAINLY not least....love BTS? Or curious what all the fuss is about? Check out our sister pod Afternoona Army for "thinky, thirsty and over thirty" takes on Bangtan life. ★ Support this podcast on Patreon ★

The Asian Friends enjoy some rom-com weather. Jenny has a nice trip. Mic is a nano-influencer for a night.THE FAREWELL TOUR KICKOFFhttps://www.eventbrite.com/e/asian-not-asian-live-the-farewell-tour-kick-off-tickets-1656778251349F O L L O W U Shttps://www.instagram.com/asiannotasianpodhttps://www.instagram.com/nicepantsbrohttps://www.instagram.com/jennyarimoto/P A T R E O Nhttps://www.patreon.com/asiannotasianpod P A R T N E R S -Check out friend of the pod John's cabin on Airbnb! https://www.airbnb.com/slink/penXRFgl - Helix Sleep Mattress: visit helixsleep.com/asian - Nutrafol: www.nutrafol.com (Promo code: Asian) This episode is sponsored by BetterHelp. Give online therapy a try at betterhelp.com/ASIAN and get on your way to being your best self.See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

Here's what to expect on the podcast:The internal and external challenges Asian Americans often faceWhat the bamboo ceiling is—and how you can break through itHow therapy and coaching can uncover and shift deep-seated beliefs and self-sabotaging behaviorsThe seven patterns that most commonly show up in people's livesWhy belonging, community, and learning to accept help are essential for growthAnd so much more! About John:John Wang is the host of the Big Asian Energy Show, a motivational speaker, and a leadership coach, helping Asian professionals break through hidden barriers and unlock their potential.After discovering that many successful Asians were being overlooked for leadership roles not because of lack of capability, but because of cultural miscommunication and workplace stereotyping, he started doing research that uncovered why most advice like “just speak up more” often fails Asian American employees.John has been featured on WSJ, CNBC, TEDx, Audible, Amazon, and has clients from Fortune 50 companies like Google, Meta, and Goldman Sachs, blending cultural insight and science-backed strategies to build confidence and visibility. His content on assertiveness and imposter syndrome has reached over 250,000 followers and over 25 million views.John's mission is to inspire a new generation to lead with confidence. His book Big Asian Energy, launched May 2025 (Tiny Reparations/Penguin Randomhouse Publishing), offers even more tools to step into your full power. Connect with John Wang!Website: https://www.bigasianenergy.com/Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/johnwangofficial/TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@johnwangbaeLinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/john-wang-b79ba396/?originalSubdomain=caCheck out John's book, Big Asian Energy: An Unapologetic Guide for Breaking Barriers to Leadership and Success, on Amazon! https://www.amazon.ca/dp/B0DFG2YW9P?ref=cm_sw_r_ffobk_cp_ud_dp_TDEE1XBSGBJJEJKV8D5T&ref_=cm_sw_r_ffobk_cp_ud_dp_TDEE1XBSGBJJEJKV8D5T&social_share=cm_sw_r_ffobk_cp_ud_dp_TDEE1XBSGBJJEJKV8D5T&bestFormat=truePodcast (Spotify): https://open.spotify.com/show/5M7T0HbKqNpJNuFRt3DUEH----- If you're struggling, consider therapy with our sponsor, BetterHelp.Visit https://betterhelp.com/candicesnyder for a 10% discount on your first month of therapy.*This is a paid promotionIf you are in the United States and in crisis, or any other person may be in danger -Suicide & Crisis Lifeline Dial 988----- Connect with Candice Snyder!Website: https://www.podpage.com/passion-purpose-and-possibilities-1/Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/candicebsnyder?_rdrPassion, Purpose, and Possibilities Community Group: https://www.facebook.com/groups/passionpurposeandpossibilitiescommunity/Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/passionpurposepossibilities/LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/candicesnyder/Shop For A Cause With Gifts That Give Back to Nonprofits: https://thekindnesscause.com/Fall In Love With Artists And Experience Joy And Calm: https://www.youtube.com/@movenartrelaxationClick this link to receive your FREE TRIAL to The Greenhouse Communityhttps://www.thegreenhousecommunity.com/checkout/the-greenhouse-membership?affiliate_code=11e889

In this episode, we discuss some challenges ARMY faces: How do we verify information before sharing? What are our responsibilities when it comes to rumors and mistranslations? We explore the balance between fan enthusiasm and respecting artist boundaries, and tackle uncomfortable questions about shipping and solo stanning.Afternoona Army is on PATREON!Join The BTS Buzz and get access to Afternoona Army's exclusive DISCORD channel, get shout outs on-air in podcast, and receive invitations to quarterly live support groups. Questions? Email afternoonaarmy@gmail.com for more information.Are your family and friends sick of you talking about K-drama? We get it...and have an answer. Check out our sister pod www.afternoonadelight.com for more episodes, book recs and social media goodness. And don't forget about the newest members of our network: Afternoona Asks where diaspora Asians living in the West find ways to reconnect to Asian culture via Asian/KDramas.Want to find more great BTS content? Head over to Afternoona Army for "thinky, thirsty and over thirty" takes on Bangtan life and links to our social media.

A weekly magazine-style radio show featuring the voices and stories of Asians and Pacific Islanders from all corners of our community. The show is produced by a collective of media makers, deejays, and activists. The post APEX Express – September 25, 2025 appeared first on KPFA.

What does it mean to be “cute”? Beauty standards and perceptions of attractiveness vary across cultures, but one thing is clear: being called “cute” is something entirely different. Is there a scientific explanation of why our brains perceive some people as “cute” and others as “beautiful,” “hot,” and so on? We're about to answer all of them with the help of science! Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

This week, we discuss a hotly debated topic in both romance novels and Kdramas: The Third Act Breakup. We get into what we love about it, what we don't, when we think it's done right, and when it makes us rage. We are eager to here your thoughts!Ready to download your first audiobook? Don't forget to click HERE for your free Audible trial.*Audible is a sponsor of Afternoona Delight Podcast*Are your family and friends sick of you talking about K-drama? We get it...and have an answer. Join our AfterNoona Delight Patreon and find community among folks who get your obsession. And check out www.afternoonadelight.com for more episodes, book recs and social media goodness. And don't forget about the newest member of our network: Afternoona Asks where diaspora Asians living in the West find ways to reconnect to Asian culture via Asian/KDramas.Last but CERTAINLY not least....love BTS? Or curious what all the fuss is about? Check out our sister pod Afternoona Army for "thinky, thirsty and over thirty" takes on Bangtan life. ★ Support this podcast on Patreon ★

There are shit bags in every nation, race, continent, neighborhood..........   They come in every shape, size, and form.    I know a lot of good Asians, Blacks, Mexicans, Africans.......Europeans.....   I know the good and bad in every sector represented in the human race.    They're everywhere.    One thing I can tell you is, you can't group everyone into one category just because one of them has made mistakes or became a bad example for their people.    We can't lump people together in anything.    Operating with absolutes.    It cripples us as a whole.    What I can tell you is, we do have a responsibility to call people out of every race, creed, color, etc.    As the human race, we have to make clear the directions of what's acceptable and not acceptable in society.    So, the next time you hear someone of a certain race, color or creed did something fucked up, just know there's a counter balance in existence.    One person does not have the power or authority to represent one whole population or segment of people.    Keep it light and do right, no matter the shades of good and bad.    About the ReWire Podcast The ReWire Podcast with Ryan Stewman – Dive into powerful insights as Ryan Stewman, the HardCore Closer, breaks down mental barriers and shares actionable steps to rewire your thoughts. Each episode is a fast-paced journey designed to reshape your mindset, align your actions, and guide you toward becoming the best version of yourself. Join in for a daily dose of real talk that empowers you to embrace change and unlock your full potential.    Learn how you can become a member of a powerful community consistently rewiring itself for success at https://www.jointheapex.com/   Rise Above

whether you're from the east, the south, or the mid-west of the US, WE SEE YOU! jen, emily & madelyn dive into their backgrounds hailing from the tri-state area, texas, and the midwest, & how their journeys ultimately led them to the west coast where they reside today. 0:00 welcome to hot pursuit 1:55 jen's history with ABG  3:56 jen, em & madelyns coming together as nextgen 5:43 friendship dynamic between jen, em & madelyn 8:54 origins of the name “hot pursuit” 13:02 growing up in 3 different regions: tri-state, the south, the midwest 27:43 moving to the west coast & meeting california asians 32:31 why asian representation matters in media 35:17 how your proximity to asian communities shapes your views 38:30 moving to the west coast is a healing experience CONNECT WITH US Connect with us @thehotpursuitpod on Instagram/TikTok/Youtube.  Email us at hello@thehotpursuitpod.com.  THE HOT PURSUIT PODCAST Hosted and written by: Jennifer Han, Emily Lin, and Madelyn Ong Produced by: Hot Pursuit Media and AsianBossGirl Edited by: Josh Jang and ⁠AsianBossGirl Theme song: Shawn Halim Graphic art: Kelsey Cordutsky ig: @kcord0912 Motion graphics: Matt Ebling ig: @matt_ebling Special thanks: Travis Morningstar, Melody Cheng, Helen Wu Wang, Janet Wang, Josh Jang  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Last time we spoke about the battle of Nanjing. In December 1937, as the battle for Nanjing unfolded, terror inundated its residents, seeking safety amid the turmoil. General Tang Shengzhi rallied the Chinese forces, determined to defend against the advancing Japanese army. Fierce fighting erupted at the Gate of Enlightenment, where the determined Chinese soldiers resisted merciless assaults while tragedy loomed. By mid-December, the Japanese made substantial advances, employing relentless artillery fire to breach Nanjing's defenses. Leaders called for strategic retreats, yet amid chaos and despair, many young Chinese soldiers, driven by nationalism, continued to resist. By December 13, Nanjing succumbed to the invaders, marking a tragic chapter in history. As destruction enveloped the city, the resilience of its defenders became a poignant tale of courage amidst the horrors of war, forever marking Nanjing as a symbol of enduring hope in the face of despair.   #168 The Nanjing Massacre Welcome to the Fall and Rise of China Podcast, I am your dutiful host Craig Watson. But, before we start I want to also remind you this podcast is only made possible through the efforts of Kings and Generals over at Youtube. Perhaps you want to learn more about the history of Asia? Kings and Generals have an assortment of episodes on history of asia and much more  so go give them a look over on Youtube. So please subscribe to Kings and Generals over at Youtube and to continue helping us produce this content please check out www.patreon.com/kingsandgenerals. If you are still hungry for some more history related content, over on my channel, the Pacific War Channel where I cover the history of China and Japan from the 19th century until the end of the Pacific War. So obvious disclaimer, today we will be talking about, arguably one of if not the most horrific war atrocities ever committed. To be blunt, it may have been worse than some of the things we talked about back during the fall of the Ming Dynasty, when bandit armies raped and pillaged cities. The Nanjing Massacre as its become known is well documented by both Chinese and foreign sources. There is an abundance of primary sources, many well verified. Its going to be extremely graphic, I am going to try and tell it to the fullest. So if you got a weak stomach perhaps sit this one out, you have been warned. Chen Yiding began evacuating his troops from the area surrounding the Gate of Enlightenment before dawn on December 13. En route to Xiaguan, he took the time to visit a dozen of his soldiers housed in a makeshift hospital located in an old cemetery. These men were too severely injured to participate in the evacuation, and Chen had to leave them with only a few words of encouragement. Little did he know, within days, they would all perish in their beds, victims of the Japanese forces. Upon arriving in Xiaguan later that morning, Chen was met with grim news: his divisional commander had crossed the Yangtze River with his chief of staff the previous afternoon. Now, he was on his own. He didn't linger near the riverside chaos, quickly realizing there was nothing he could do there. Instead, he chose to move downstream, hoping to find a secure spot for himself and his soldiers to wait out the next few days before devising an escape from the war zone.  He was fortunate, for soon the Japanese would live up to their notorious reputation developed during their advance from Shanghai; they were not inclined to take prisoners. That afternoon, several hundred Chinese soldiers arrived at the northern end of the Safety Zone. The committee responsible for the area stated that they could offer no assistance. In a misguided attempt to boost morale, they suggested that if the soldiers surrendered and promised not to engage in combat, the Japanese would likely show them "merciful treatment." This optimism was woefully misplaced. Later that same day, Japanese troops entered the zone, dragging out 200 Chinese men, the majority of them soldiers, for execution just outside the city. On December 13, Japanese soldiers started patrolling the riverbank, shooting at anything and anyone floating downstream. Their comrades aboard naval vessels in the river cheered them on, applauding each time they struck another helpless victim in the water. Civilians were not spared either. While traveling through downtown Nanjing as the battle concluded, Rabe observed dead men and women every 100 to 200 yards, most of them shot in the back. A long line of Chinese men marched down the street, numbering in the hundreds, all destined for death. In a cruel twist, they were compelled to carry a large Japanese flag. They were herded into a vacant lot by a couple of Japanese soldiers and as recalled by American correspondent Archibald Steele "There, they were brutally shot dead in small groups. One Japanese soldier stood over the growing pile of corpses, firing into any bodies that showed movement." The killings commenced almost immediately after the fall of Nanjing. The victorious Japanese spread out into the city streets, seeking victims. Those unfortunate enough to be captured faced instant execution or were taken to larger killing fields to meet a grim fate alongside other Chinese prisoners. Initially, the Japanese targeted former soldiers, whether real or imagined, but within hours, the scope of victims expanded to include individuals of all age groups and genders. By the end of the first day of occupation, civilian bodies littered the streets of downtown Nanjing at a rate of roughly one per block. The defenseless and innocent were subjected to murder, torture, and humiliation in a relentless spree of violence that persisted for six harrowing weeks. At the time of the attack, Nanjing felt eerily abandoned, houses stood boarded up, vehicles lay toppled in the streets, and the once-ubiquitous rickshaws had vanished. However, hundreds of thousands remained hidden indoors, seeking refuge. The most visible sign of the city's new rulers was the display of the Japanese flag. On the morning of December 14, the Rising Sun flag was hoisted across the city, seen in front of private homes, businesses, and public buildings. Many of these flags were hastily made, often a simple white sheet with a red rag affixed, hoping to be spared. As the days progressed, horrifying accounts of violence began to emerge. A barber, the sole survivor among eight people in his shop when the Japanese arrived, was admitted to a hospital with a stab wound that had nearly severed his head from his body, damaging all muscles at the back of his neck down to his spinal canal. A woman suffered a brutal throat wound, while another pregnant woman was bayoneted in the abdomen, resulting in the death of her unborn child. A man witnessed his wife being stabbed through the heart and then saw his child hurled from a window to the street several floors below. These are but a few stories of individual atrocities committed. Alongside this there were mass executions, predominantly targeting young able-bodied men, in an effort to weaken Nanjing and deprive it of any potential resistance in the future. American professor, Lewis Smythe recalled “The disarmed soldier problem was our most serious one for the first three days, but it was soon resolved, as the Japanese shot all of them.” On the evening of December 15, the Japanese rounded up 1,300 former soldiers from the Safety Zone, binding them in groups of about 100 and marching them away in silence. A group of foreigners, permitted to leave Nanjing on a Japanese gunboat, accidentally became witnesses to the ensuing slaughter. While waiting for their vessel, they took a brief walk along the riverbank and stumbled upon a scene of mass execution, observing the Japanese shooting the men one by one in the back of the neck. “We observed about 100 such executions until the Japanese officer in charge noticed us and ordered us to leave immediately”. Not all killings were premeditated; many occurred impulsively. A common example was when Japanese soldiers led lines of Chinese POWs to holding points, tightly bound together with ropes. Every few yards, a Japanese soldier would stand guard with a fixed bayonet aimed at the prisoners as they trudged forward. Suddenly, one of the prisoners slipped, causing a domino effect as he fell, dragging down the men in front of and behind him. The entire group soon found themselves collapsed on the ground, struggling to stand. The Japanese guards lost their patience, jabbing their bayonets into the writhing bodies until none remained alive. In one of the largest massacres, Japanese troops from the Yamada Detachment, including the 65th Infantry Regiment, systematically executed between 17,000 and 20,000 Chinese prisoners from December 15 to 17. These prisoners were taken to the banks of the Yangtze River near Mufushan, where they were machine-gunned to death. The bodies were then disposed of by either burning or flushing them downstream. Recent research by Ono Kenji has revealed that these mass killings were premeditated and carried out systematically, in accordance with orders issued directly by Prince Asaka. A soldier from the IJA's 13th Division described killing wounded survivors of the Mufushan massacre in his diary “I figured that I'd never get another chance like this, so I stabbed thirty of the damned Chinks. Climbing atop the mountain of corpses, I felt like a real devil-slayer, stabbing again and again, with all my might. 'Ugh, ugh,' the Chinks groaned. There were old folks as well as kids, but we killed them lock, stock, and barrel. I also borrowed a buddy's sword and tried to decapitate some. I've never experienced anything so unusual”. Frequently, the Japanese just left their victims wherever they fell. Corpses began to accumulate in the streets, exposed to the elements and onlookers. Cars constantly were forced to run over corpses. Corpses were scavenged by stray dogs, which, in turn, were consumed by starving people. The water became toxic; workers in the Safety Zone discovered ponds clogged with human remains. In other instances, the Japanese gathered their machine-gunned or bayoneted victims into large heaps, doused them in kerosene, and set them ablaze. Archibald Steele wrote for the Chicago Daily News on December 17th “I saw a grisly scene at the north gate, where what was once a group of 200 men had become a smoldering mass of flesh and bones, so severely burned around the neck and head that it was difficult to believe he was still human.” During the chaos in the beginning, whereupon the Japanese had not yet fully conquered the city, its defenders scrambled desperately to escape before it was too late. Individually or in small groups, they sought vulnerabilities in the enemy lines, acutely aware that their survival hinged on their success. Months of conflict had trained them to expect no mercy if captured; previous experiences had instilled in them the belief that a swift death at the hands of the Japanese would be a fortunate outcome. On December 12, amid intense artillery fire and aerial bombardment, General Tang Sheng-chi issued the order for his troops to retreat. However, conflicting directives and a breakdown in discipline transformed the ensuing events into a disaster. While some Chinese units successfully crossed the river, a far greater number were ensnared in the widespread chaos that engulfed the city. In their desperation to evade capture, some Chinese soldiers resorted to stripping civilians of their clothing to disguise themselves, while many others were shot by their own supervisory units as they attempted to flee.Hundreds, perhaps thousands, of individual escape stories emerged from this period. In some rare instances, entire units, even up to divisional strength, successfully infiltrated Japanese lines to reach safety. For others, such as the 156th Division, there were detailed plans outlining escape routes from Nanjing. Several soldiers and officers adhered to this three-day trek, skillfully evading Japanese patrols until they reached Ningguo, located south of the capital. Nonetheless, these cases were exceptions. The vast majority of soldiers from China's defeated army faced significant risk and were more likely to be captured than to escape. Some of Chiang Kai-shek's most elite units suffered near total annihilation. Only about a thousand soldiers from the 88th Division managed to cross the Yangtze safely, as did another thousand from the Training Division, while a mere 300 from the 87th Division survived. Even for units like the 156th Division, the escape plans were only effective for those who learned of them. These plans were hurriedly disseminated through the ranks as defeat loomed, leaving mere chance to determine who received the information. Many stayed trapped in Nanjing, which had become a fatal snare. One day, Japanese soldiers visited schools within Nanjing's Safety Zone, aware that these locations sheltered many refugees. They called for all former soldiers to step forward, promising safety in exchange for labor. Many believed that the long days of hiding were finally coming to an end and complied with the request. However, they were led to an abandoned house, where they were stripped naked and bound together in groups of five. Outside, a large bonfire had been ignited. They were then bayoneted and, while still alive, thrown onto the flames. Only a few managed to escape and share the horrifying tale. The Japanese were of course well aware that numerous soldiers were hiding in Nanjing, disguised as locals, evidenced by the piles of military uniforms and equipment accumulating in the streets. Consequently, they initiated a systematic search for soldiers within hours of taking control. The Safety Zone was not spared, as the Japanese Army suspected that Chinese soldiers had sought refuge there. On December 16, they raided Ginling College, despite a policy prohibiting the admission of men, except for elderly residents in a designated dining room. The soldiers brought axes to force open doors that were not immediately complied with and positioned six machine guns on the campus, prepared to fire at anyone attempting to escape. Ultimately, they found nothing. In cases where they did encounter young men of military age, the soldiers lined them up, scrutinizing for distinct telltale features such as close-cropped hair, helmet marks, or shoulder blisters from carrying a rifle. Many men, who had never served in the military but bore callouses from hard manual labor, were captured based on the assumption that such marks indicated military experience. As noted by Goerge Fitch the head of Nanjing's YMCA “Rickshaw coolies, carpenters, and other laborers are frequently taken”. The Japanese employed additional, more cunning tactics to root out soldiers. During an inspection of a camp within the Safety Zone, they struggled to get the approximately 6,000 men and women to surrender. Before leaving, they resorted to one last trick. “Attention!” a voice commanded in flawless Chinese. Many young men, conditioned by months or years of military training, instinctively responded. Even though most realized their mistake almost immediately, it was too late; the Japanese herded them away. Given the scale of the slaughter, efforts were soon organized to facilitate the killing and disposal of as many individuals as possible in the shortest time. Rows of prisoners were mowed down by machine-gun fire, while those injured were finished off with single bullets or bayonets. Much of the mass murder occurred near the Yangtze River, where victims could be disposed of easily by being pushed into the water, hoping the current would carry them away.As the weeks progressed and the Japanese grew increasingly concerned about the possibility of former soldiers still at large, the dragnet tightened. Beginning in late December, Japanese authorities implemented a registration system for all residents of Nanjing. At Ginling College, this process lasted about a week and resulted in scenes of almost indescribable chaos, as the Japanese also decided to register residents from the surrounding areas on campus. First, the men were registered, followed by the women. Often, women attended the registration to help save their husbands and sons, who would otherwise have been taken as suspected former soldiers. Despite these efforts, a total of 28 men were ultimately seized during the registration process at Ginling College. Each individual who registered received a document from the authorities. However, it soon became clear that this paper provided little protection against the caprices of the Japanese military. That winter in Nanjing, everyone was a potential victim. While systematic mass killings primarily targeted young men of military age, every category of people faced death in the days and weeks following the Japanese conquest of Nanjing. Reports indicated that fifty police officers from the Safety Zone were executed for permitting Chinese soldiers to enter the area. The city's firefighters were taken away to meet an uncertain fate, and six street sweepers were killed inside their dwelling. Like an uncontrollable epidemic, the victors' bloodlust seemed to escalate continuously, seeking out new victims. When the Japanese ordered the Safety Zone committee to supply workers for the electricity plant in Xiaguan to restore its operations, they provided 54 individuals. Within days, 43 of them were dead. Although young men were especially targeted, the Japanese made no distinctions based on age or sex. American missionary John G. Magee documented numerous instances of indiscriminate killings, including the chilling account of two families nearly exterminated. Stabbings, shootings, and rapes marked the slaughter of three generations of innocents, including toddlers aged four and two; the older child was bayoneted, while the younger was struck in the head with a sword. The only survivors were a badly injured eight-year-old girl and her four-year-old sister, who spent the following fortnight beside their mother's decaying body. The violence was often accompanied by various forms of humiliation, as if to utterly break the spirit of the conquered people. One woman lost her parents and three children. When she purchased a coffin for her father, a Japanese soldier tore the lid off and discarded the old man's body in the street. Another soldier, in a drunken stupor, raped a Chinese woman and then vomited on her. In yet another incident, a soldier encountered a family of six huddled over a pot of thin rice soup; he stepped over them and urinated into their pot before continuing on his way, laughing heartlessly. The atrocities committed at Nanjing were not akin to something like the Holocaust. Within places like Auschwitz killings became industrialized and often took on an impersonal, unemotional character. The murders in Nanjing had an almost intimate quality, with each individual perpetrator bearing the blood of their victims on their hands, sometimes literally. In this sense, the Nanjing atrocities resemble the early Holocaust killings executed by German Einsatzgruppen in Eastern Europe, prior to the implementation of gas chambers. How many died during the Nanjing Massacre? Eyewitnesses at the time recognized that the Japanese behavior had few immediate precedents. Missionary John Magee compared the situation to the Turkish genocide of the Armenians during World War I, which was still fresh in memory. Despite this, no consensus emerged regarding the exact number of fatalities, a state of affairs that would persist for nearly eight decades. In his first comprehensive account of the atrocities following the conquest of the capital, New York Times correspondent Tillman Durdin reported that 33,000 Chinese soldiers lost their lives in Nanjing, including 20,000 who were executed. Foreign correspondent Frank Oliver claimed in a 1939 publication that 24,000 men, women, and children were put to death during the first month of the city's occupation. As time progressed, much larger figures began to circulate. After returning to Germany in 1938, John Rabe held a lecture where he cited European estimates that between 50,000 and 60,000 people had died. In February 1942, Chiang Kai-shek stated that 200,000 were slaughtered within one week. The Nanjing tribunal established by Chiang's government to try Japanese war criminals in 1946 and 1947 reported that more than 300,000 lives had been lost following the city's fall. The highest estimate recorded comes from a Chinese military expert, who put the death toll at 430,000. Currently, the figure most commonly accepted in official Chinese media is 300,000, a number also cited by various authors sympathetic to China's contemporary regime. The debate over the Nanjing death toll has been a complex and extensive discussion, likely to remain unresolved to everyone's satisfaction. As missionary and Nanjing University teacher Miner Searle Bates remarked when he testified before the International Military Tribunal for the Far East in July 1946, “The scope of this killing was so extensive that no one can provide a complete picture of it.” On December 16, American missionary Minnie Vautrin witnessed a truck passing by Ginling College, loaded with eight to ten girls. When they saw the Western woman, they cried out, "Jiu ming! Jiu ming!" which means “Help! Help!” Vautrin felt powerless, fully aware of the fate that awaited them. As early as Tuesday of that week, she had documented rumors of girls being raped. The following night, women were taken in large numbers from their homes. Another missionary, John Magee wrote to his wife “The most horrible thing now is the raping of the women, which has been going on in the most shameless way I have ever known”. A tentative list compiled by Lewis Smythe detailed instances of rape occurring soon after the Japanese Army entered Nanjing: four girls at noon on December 14; four more women that evening; three female refugees on December 15; and a young wife around the same time. The accounts revealed chilling individual horrors. A 15-year-old girl was taken to a barracks housing 200 to 300 Japanese soldiers and locked in a room, where she was raped multiple times daily. Victims ranged from as young as 11 to over 80. American correspondent Edgar Snow recalled “Discards were often bayoneted by drunken soldiers,. Frequently, mothers had to witness their babies being beheaded, only to then be raped themselves.” Y.M.C.A. head George Fitch reported the case of a woman whose five-month-old infant was deliberately smothered by a soldier to silence its cries while he raped her. Such acts were a gruesome form of humiliation, designed to demonstrate that the vanquished were powerless to protect their own families. Japanese soldier Takokoro Kozo recalled “Women suffered most. No matter how young or old, they all could not escape the fate of being raped. We sent out coal trucks to the city streets and villages to seize a lot of women. And then each of them was allocated to fifteen to twenty soldiers for sexual intercourse and abuse. After raping we would also kill them”. Women were frequently killed immediately after being raped, often through horrific mutilations, such as being penetrated with bayonets, long bamboo sticks, or other objects. For instance, one six-months-pregnant woman was stabbed sixteen times in the face and body, with one stab penetrating her abdomen and killing her unborn child. In another case, a young woman had a beer bottle forcibly inserted into her vagina after being raped, and was subsequently shot.  On December 19, 1937, the Reverend James M. McCallum wrote in his diary “I know not where to end. Never I have heard or read such brutality. Rape! Rape! Rape! We estimate at least 1,000 cases a night and many by day. In case of resistance or anything that seems like disapproval, there is a bayonet stab or a bullet... People are hysterical... Women are being carried off every morning, afternoon and evening. The whole Japanese army seems to be free to go and come as it pleases, and to do whatever it pleases”.  Rabe wrote in his diary dated December 17 “wo Japanese soldiers have climbed over the garden wall and are about to break into our house. When I appear they give the excuse that they saw two Chinese soldiers climb over the wall. When I show them my party badge, they return the same way. In one of the houses in the narrow street behind my garden wall, a woman was raped, and then wounded in the neck with a bayonet. I managed to get an ambulance so we can take her to Kulou Hospital... Last night up to 1,000 women and girls are said to have been raped, about 100 girls at Ginling College...alone. You hear nothing but rape. If husbands or brothers intervene, they're shot. What you hear and see on all sides is the brutality and bestiality of the Japanese soldiers”. In a documentary film about the Nanjing Massacre, In the Name of the Emperor, a former Japanese soldier named Shiro Azuma spoke candidly about the process of rape and murder in Nanjing. “At first we used some kinky words like Pikankan. Pi means "hip", kankan means "look". Pikankan means, "Let's see a woman open up her legs." Chinese women didn't wear under-pants. Instead, they wore trousers tied with a string. There was no belt. As we pulled the string, the buttocks were exposed. We "pikankan". We looked. After a while we would say something like, "It's my day to take a bath," and we took turns raping them. It would be all right if we only raped them. I shouldn't say all right. But we always stabbed and killed them. Because dead bodies don't talk”. Without anyone to defend them, the women of Nanjing resorted to desperate measures for their safety. The young and attractive cut their hair and smeared soot on their faces to diminish their allure. Others donned boys' clothes or the garments of elderly women. However, the Japanese were well aware of these tactics and were not easily deceived. As American correspondent Snow described, it was an orgy of unprecedented debauchery, involving not only the lower ranks of the Japanese military but also officers who turned their quarters into harems, bedding a new captive each night. Open-air sexual assaults were common. During the first ten days of occupation, groups of Japanese soldiers entered the Ginling campus ten to twenty times daily, brandishing fixed bayonets stained with fresh blood. So overwhelmed, Vautrin decided to prioritize saving lives over salvaging possessions, spending those early days frantically moving across campus to prevent marauding soldiers from taking away women. A particularly tense situation unfolded on the evening of December 17, when Vautrin and other staff members at Ginling College were called to the front of the campus to confront a group of Japanese soldiers. Earlier, Vautrin had received documentation from another officer affirming that the area was a legitimate refugee camp. The soldiers torn up the document in front of her. For hours, with armed Japanese soldiers encircling them, Vautrin and her colleagues were left standing or kneeling, uncertain of what awaited them. Gradually, it became clear that they had been lured to the front gate so that other soldiers could enter through a side entrance and abduct twelve women. As Vautrin recalled “Never shall I forget the scene. The dried leaves rattling, the moaning of the wind, the cries of women being led away.” The staff remained at the entrance until 11:00 pm, fearing that hiding soldiers might fire on them if they moved. This was the only time that Vautrin was unable to prevent rape, a failure that would haunt her for the rest of her life. Some Japanese soldiers, seeking young girls, ordered a middle-aged Chinese woman to assist them in finding targets. When she either could not or would not comply, they shot a rifle across her abdomen, narrowly missing and taking away “three handbreadths of flesh.” When the Japanese Army entered Nanjing, little damage had been inflicted on the buildings, as noted by U.S. missionary James McCallum at the end of December. On the first day of their occupation, Japanese soldiers immediately dispersed into Nanjing in small groups, breaking shop windows and looting the goods within. They carried away their spoils in crates and stolen rickshaws. Initially, the looting was partly a makeshift response to the poor logistics of the Japanese Army. Combat soldiers had arrived well ahead of their supply lines and faced severe food shortages until the roads reopened and the Yangtze River became navigable.  Every building in Nanjing was looted and turned upside down. Everything not nailed down was stolen: doors and window frames were removed, safes opened with rifle shots or grenades. Japanese soldiers often pillaged property while the owners were present, threatening them with bayonets. Abandoned cars littered the streets, typically overturned and stripped of useful items, including batteries. Like Russian soldiers in Berlin seven and a half years later, the rank-and-file soldiers displayed a particular interest in watches. As the scale of plunder grew, transportation became scarce. By the end of December, looting was being conducted using trucks. When vehicles were unavailable, Japanese soldiers resorted to wheelbarrows and even children's prams. Mules, donkeys, and people were also commandeered. Just as during their advance from Shanghai to Nanjing, the Chinese were forced to assist in looting their own homes. A common sight was a Japanese soldier leading a group of Chinese down the street, laden with stolen goods. While Chinese soldiers had also engaged in some looting during their evacuation of Nanjing, it was nothing compared to the scale of the Japanese victors' plunder. The Chinese forces had deliberately avoided breaking into foreign buildings, a distinction that the Japanese disregarded. The American, British, and German embassies, along with the ambassadors' residences, were ransacked, stripped of everything from bedding and money to watches, rugs, and artwork. The American School was looted, and its wall breached to remove the piano. As the Japanese stripped the city, they also began to burn it. While the winter sky could have been sparkling, it was instead filled with smoke from thousands of fires across the city. Some fires resulted from carelessness, such as when soldiers cooked meat from a stolen cow over a bonfire, accidentally igniting an ancient building. Others were acts of mindless vandalism. The Nanking Music Shop saw all its instruments and sheets piled in the street and set ablaze. The extent of the massacre can, to some degree, be linked to a breakdown in discipline among Japanese soldiers. Released from weeks or months of hardship on the battlefield, many soldiers experienced an intoxicating sense of freedom, resembling misbehaving boys. The deterioration of order among Japanese soldiers astonished those familiar with the stories of the stringent discipline within Japan's armed forces. Observers commented on soldiers laughing at proclamations from their own officers or tearing up orders and tossing them to the ground. Some foreign witnesses speculated that this lack of discipline was exacerbated by the absence of visible individual numbers on soldiers, making it challenging to identify wrongdoers. The issue also stemmed from the quality of the Japanese officer corps and their ability to manage a large army of young men, many of whom were experiencing freedom from societal constraints for the first time. Not all officers rose to the occasion; Vautrin witnessed an officer almost fail to prevent a soldier from raping a girl. Even worse, some officers transitioned from passive bystanders, guilty by inaction, to active participants in prolonged rape sessions. While a few attempted to instill discipline among their troops, their efforts often fell short. A Japanese colonel, for instance, slapped a soldier attempting to rape a Chinese woman. Another general was seen striking a private who had bayoneted a Chinese man and threatened two Germans, raising questions about how much of this discipline was merely performative for the benefit of foreign observers. Ultimately, disciplinary measures had little impact. As Rabe noted in his diary dated December 18th “The soldiers have almost no regard for their officers”. The absence of effective higher leadership during this critical period likely exacerbated the problem. General Matsui had been suffering from malaria since November 3, which left him largely incapacitated from December 5 to 15. A subordinate later testified that he had been informed of "incidents of stealing, killing, assault, and rape and had become quite enraged.” Although Matsui may have been displeased by the unruly behavior of his soldiers, it is conceivable that his inaction led to even greater levels of atrocity than might have occurred otherwise. He insisted on holding a victory parade on December 17, immediately after recovering from his illness, which likely triggered a security frenzy among Japanese officers concerned about the safety of Prince Asaka, uncle to Emperor Hirohito. This reaction likely prompted a surge in searches for, and executions of, suspected former Chinese soldiers. The Japanese high command in Tokyo was also aware of the unraveling discipline. On January 4, 1938, Army Headquarters sent Matsui an unusually direct message ordering him to restore control among his troops: Our old friend Ishiwara Kanji bitterly criticized the situation and placed the blame on Matsui “We earnestly request enhancement of military discipline and public morals. The morale of the Japanese had never been at a lower level.” A detachment of military police eventually arrived in Nanjing, leading to some improvements, though their presence was mixed. Some officers stationed outside the Safety Zone ignored atrocities occurring before them and, in some cases, participated directly. At Ginling College, the experience with military police was decidedly uneven. The first group of about 25 men tasked with guarding the college ended up committing rape themselves.  Despite frequent visits from Japanese soldiers in search of loot and victims to assault, the Safety Zone was perceived as successful. Many believed that both the zone and the work of its managing committee were responsible for saving countless lives. W. Plumer Mills, vice chairman of the committee, noted that the zone “did give some protection during the fighting…but the chief usefulness of the Zone has been the measure of protection it has afforded to the people since the occupation.” Shortly after the Japanese conquest, the population of the Safety Zone swelled to a quarter million people. Around 70,000 of these were organized into 25 pre-arranged camps, while the majority sought accommodation wherever possible. Makeshift “mat-shed villages” sprang up in vacant areas throughout the zone. Nanjing quickly became informally divided into two distinct cities. Outside the Safety Zone, the atmosphere was ghostly, with a population dwindling to around 10,000, while within the zone, bustling activity thrived. Shanghai Road, which ran through the center of the zone and had once been a wide boulevard, transformed into a hub of barter and trade, resembling a festive market during Chinese New Year, overflowing with makeshift stalls, tea shops, and restaurants, making it nearly impossible to traverse by vehicle. The Japanese held a degree of respect for Westerners, although this sentiment was not universal and did not always offer protection. Many foreigners tried to safeguard their homes by displaying their national flags outside, but they often found that Japanese soldiers would break in regardless. To protect Ginling College, American flags were displayed at eight locations around the compound, and a large 30-foot American flag was spread out in the center. However, this proved to be “of absolutely no use” in preventing Japanese soldiers from entering the area. Despite this, there was some limited outright hostility towards Americans. Stronger negative sentiments were directed towards the Russians and the British, who were viewed as representatives of nations with competing interests against the Japanese Empire. The Japanese displayed particular reverence for one nationality, the Germans. Rabe would shout “Deutsch” or “Hitler” to command respect from unruly Japanese soldiers or show them his swastika armband, indicating his allegiance to the Nazi Party. Germany was seen as a rising power and rapidly becoming one of Japan's closest allies, a fellow outcast in global politics. However, as time passed, the limits of this respect became evident; individual soldiers began searching for women within the German embassy compound, and eventually, nearly all German buildings were broken into. Despite all the challenges, there was no doubting that foreigners offered a form of protection unavailable elsewhere. Within days of the Japanese conquest, women and children began appearing in large numbers outside Rabe's home, kneeling and knocking their heads on the ground as they begged to be let into his already overcrowded garden.  At 1:00 pm on January 1, the Chinese were proclaimed rulers of their own city, or at least this is what Japanese propaganda sought to convey. On the first day of the new year, a puppet government was established in a ceremony held just north of the Safety Zone. A new five-bar flag, the one associated with the early Chinese republic was raised, signaling a patriotic spirit in a gesture that felt unconvincing. As the new leaders took office, vowing to resurrect their city, buildings burned all around them. The ceremony marked the culmination of two weeks of preparatory work. As early as December 15, General Matsui met with a local Chinese leader, referred to in the Japanese commander's diary only as Chen, who had been selected to assist in forming this new puppet government. Chen had been present in the northern port city of Tianjin two years earlier when Matsui helped establish the Chinese chapter of the Greater Asia Association. He subscribed to Matsui's concepts of “Asia for Asians,” but cautioned that Chinese fears of the Japanese would complicate the governance of the conquered territories.   The new government aligned with the Japanese army to implement a system of indoctrination centered on conservatism, primarily targeting the youth, who were perceived as most likely to resist. The indoctrination included messages like, “You must follow the old custom in marriage, letting your parents make arrangements for you. You must not go to theaters or study English, etc. China and Japan must become one, and then the nation will be strong.” Few were deceived by these attempts to win hearts and minds. The government-sanctioned newspaper, the Xinshengbao, or New Life Journal, was immediately dismissed as a crude vehicle for propaganda. Additionally, the government made minimal progress in more urgent tasks, such as restoring peacetime conditions and revitalizing Nanjing's economy, a challenge made formidable by Japanese brutality. Given the fate of the first group of volunteers at the electricity plant after the conquest, no one could be found to fill the needed 40 to 45 worker slots. The same was true for firefighters. The predictable outcomes followed. Water and limited power were restored to parts of the city by January 2, but within two days, the city was plunged back into darkness. By January 13, the waterworks were still non-operational, and the power supply remained intermittent while fires continued to blaze well into January. The government was not taken seriously, struggling even with the Japanese. It quickly built a reputation for being venal and corrupt. One of its names was the Nanjing Autonomous Government, which a clever member of the foreign community humorously rebranded as the “Automatic Government,” reflecting its actual role as a puppet regime devoid of autonomy.  While Nanjing endured its own nightmarish reality, the city's inhabitants had little understanding of the events transpiring beyond its walls. The first radio news that reached foreign residents came on January 7, reporting Japanese air raids on Wuhan. There were also unconfirmed rumors suggesting that Hangzhou was experiencing similar horrors to those in Nanjing, but details were scarce. It was perhaps expected that reports from afar would be limited in wartime, yet information about situations closer to Nanjing was similarly scarce, and the horrific truth gradually dawned on the city's populace. A Westerner who managed to escape east from Nanjing in early January reported that all villages within a 20-mile radius had been burned to the ground. Outside the city, Japanese soldiers were randomly shooting civilians, including children. A German who drove an hour from Nanjing encountered no living souls. After the conquest, Chinese who managed to leave Nanjing reported that every pond between the city and Juyong was filled with the decaying corpses of people and animals. Many of the atrocities committed during this time appeared to stem from boredom and a search for cheap thrills. American missionary Magee witnessed a young farmer who had sustained severe burns on his upper body. After the soldiers demanded money from him and he failed to comply, they doused him in kerosene and set him ablaze. Similarly, a young boy suffered horrific burns after he failed to lead a group of soldiers to his “mama.” People in the rural areas surrounding Nanjing faced danger from numerous directions. Not only were they potential targets for marauding Japanese soldiers, but they were also at risk from bands of Chinese outlaws, who preyed on the large influx of refugees on the roads and the few souls who remained at home despite the fierce conflict raging nearby. Magee encountered a 49-year-old woman whose home was invaded by bandits looking for money. “When she and her husband said they had none they battered her head and breast with a stool and burned her feet until she revealed their savings of between four and five dollars.” In the absence of a formal government, informal authority was often wielded by secret societies. For instance, the “Big Sword Society” reportedly offered protection not only against Japanese soldiers and local bandits but also against small groups of Chinese troops seeking to escape back to their lines and resorting to theft for survival. What a blast from the past eh?   Rumors began to circulate in early January 1938 that the Chinese Army was preparing to retake Nanjing and that Chiang Kai-shek's soldiers had already been spotted inside the city walls. Many of the small makeshift Japanese flags that had appeared outside private homes in mid-December suddenly vanished, and some Chinese residents who had been wearing Japanese armbands hastily removed them. There was even talk of launching an attack on the Japanese embassy. Word spread that the Japanese were becoming frightened and were searching for Chinese clothing to disguise themselves as civilians in the event of a retreat. In reality, none of this was true. The Chinese Army was still reorganizing after the costly campaign that had forced it from Shanghai to Nanjing and then further into the interior. However, this did not imply that the Japanese had achieved complete control over the city. After six weeks of terror, Nanjing began to reassert itself. Japanese soldiers faced fatalities and injuries in skirmishes with members of secret organizations like the “Yellow Spears” and the “Big Sword Society.”  After the New Year, the population within the Safety Zone began to dwindle. A week into 1938, the number of refugees at Ginling College, which had peaked at more than 10,000, fell to around 5,000. Less than a month after the conquest, many former residents started returning to their homes during the day and then coming back to the college at night. Still, the city was far from safe, and even for those whose homes were located within the Safety Zone, Vautrin believed it was unwise to stray too far from her refugee camp. One month after Japanese forces had surged through its gates, Nanjing was a thoroughly devastated city, with fires still being set every day and night. By mid-January, estimates suggested that more than half the city had been burned down, with the main shopping district completely gone, as well as the entertainment area surrounding the Confucius Temple. Nevertheless, slowly but surely, the shell-shocked city began to pull itself together and started the long process of renewal. Vautrin considered opening an industrial school offering four-month courses for women to help compensate for the loss of labor resulting from the indiscriminate killing of men. Chinese New Year fell on January 31, 1938. Celebrated throughout Asia, it was also recognized by the Japanese. It was a “dismal, muddy” day, and as many feared, soldiers who appeared “too happy” from excessive drinking attempted to enter the Safety Zone in search of women but were stopped. The sound of thousands of firecrackers filled the air, fulfilling the age-old purpose of scaring away evil spirits. Refugees in Rabe's compound presented him with a large red silk banner adorned with a gold Chinese inscription. His Chinese friends translated the message for him “You are the living Buddha For a hundred thousand people”. I would like to take this time to remind you all that this podcast is only made possible through the efforts of Kings and Generals over at Youtube. Please go subscribe to Kings and Generals over at Youtube and to continue helping us produce this content please check out www.patreon.com/kingsandgenerals. If you are still hungry after that, give my personal channel a look over at The Pacific War Channel at Youtube, it would mean a lot to me. In December 1937, the battle for Nanjing left its residents in terror as the Japanese army advanced. Following the invasion, a horrific massacre began, with thousands targeted in brutal killings, torture, and humiliation. Civilians and soldiers alike were indiscriminately slain, and the Japanese military showed no mercy. To this day the Nanjing Massacre stands as a testament to the unbelievable evil man holds within him.

This uncensored was a doozie! Today we reflect on our K-Drama watching tastes and how they've changed in the almost FOUR YEARS of the Afternoona Delight Podcast. We discuss how we keep our dramas we watch for the pod from feeling like homework. And we dive into our feelings on K-Dramas as adaptations of source material. And we touch on the age old question of how many open browsers and tabs is TOO many open browsers and tabs. Looking for your next romance read? Check out Amy, Lia, and Megan's books to find your next HEA!Ready to download your first audiobook? Don't forget to click HERE for your free Audible trial.*Audible is a sponsor of Afternoona Delight Podcast*Are your family and friends sick of you talking about K-drama? We get it...and have an answer. Join our AfterNoona Delight Patreon and find community among folks who get your obsession. And check out www.afternoonadelight.com for more episodes, book recs and social media goodness. And don't forget about the newest member of our network: Afternoona Asks where diaspora Asians living in the West find ways to reconnect to Asian culture via Asian/KDramas.Last but CERTAINLY not least....love BTS? Or curious what all the fuss is about? Check out our sister pod Afternoona Army for "thinky, thirsty and over thirty" takes on Bangtan life. ★ Support this podcast on Patreon ★

Performance marketing is one of the most popular ways brands try to grow. But here's the problem: too often, leadership decisions create gaps that keep campaigns from reaching their full potential. In this episode, Sonia Thompson sits down with Laura Lee—growth marketing expert, fractional CMO, founder of LL Consulting, and board member of Asians in Advertising—to explore a major miss in performance marketing today. Together, they discuss how decisions around values, customer understanding, and whose voices get prioritized can mean the difference between clicks that fall flat and strategies that drive loyalty and growth. If you want to close the gap, strengthen trust, and ensure your marketing resonates with today's evolving consumer base, this episode is for you. Get the Inclusion & Marketing Newsletter - www.inclusionandmarketing.com/newsletter Laura Lee on LinkedIn - https://www.linkedin.com/in/llee01/ LL Consulting - https://www.linkedin.com/company/teamllconsulting/ Asians In Advertising - https://www.asiansinadvertising.com/

Episode 678: Andrew's favorite Seinfeld meme day of the year is ruined. We'll never forget. How close is Chinatown to Manhattan? Visiting the largest Buc-ee's in the world. Barbara Walters documentary. Peacemaker - season 2. The French Dispatch. Goon and Goon 2. Discovering the month of September. Too many Asians; where are all the Jews? Oak Ridge, TN, WV State Penitentiary, Codenames, and Gabriela's bad driving.

Piggybacking off an earlier episode about sexual tension, this week Megan and Lia delve into attraction in Kdramas. What makes a character attractive? Do we fall in love with emotionally available characters or swoon for the tortured hero... or both? Ready to download your first audiobook? Don't forget to click HERE for your free Audible trial.*Audible is a sponsor of Afternoona Delight Podcast*Are your family and friends sick of you talking about K-drama? We get it...and have an answer. Join our AfterNoona Delight Patreon and find community among folks who get your obsession. And check out www.afternoonadelight.com for more episodes, book recs and social media goodness. And don't forget about the newest member of our network: Afternoona Asks where diaspora Asians living in the West find ways to reconnect to Asian culture via Asian/KDramas.Last but CERTAINLY not least....love BTS? Or curious what all the fuss is about? Check out our sister pod Afternoona Army for "thinky, thirsty and over thirty" takes on Bangtan life.★ Support this podcast on Patreon ★ ★ Support this podcast on Patreon ★

2 - Why are Asians the “inconvenient minority” to the Philadelphia public school system? 215 - Dom's Money Melody! 220 - Where is Ellen DeGeneres when we need her most? Returning to the voting battles within the Commonwealth and beyond. 235 - Will we get new files regarding who was behind 9/11? Your calls. 240 - The Charlotte train assailant has been federally charged by Pam Bondi. 250 - The Lightning Round!

12 - We kick off today with legendary journalist and author of a new book ”Confronting Evil”, Bill O'Reilly! Does he still get butterflies on release day? Bill is making headlines for his comments on Mamdani in the NYC Mayor's race. Why is a vote for Zohran a vote for condoning evil? What historical event does this election remind Bill of? Just how evil is Vladimir Putin? Why do we not use the word “evil” enough? What is something readers will be looking for in the book? Why are Illinois' leaders failing them and wasting time arguing with Trump? Which media pundit isn't bringing any opposing views onto their television show? 1215 - Tuco Salamanca is in trouble! 1220 - Brian Stelter deflects from talking about the murder in Charlotte and instead bloviates on the racist comments on social media regarding the situation. Are we valuing crazy people 1230 - PA Senate President Pro Tempore Kim Ward joins us today after the state government decided to side with Republicans regarding what to do about SEPTA funding, in part thanks to Lt. Governor Bradford! How good was the messaging by Republicans on this ordeal? Where do we stand on implementing school choice? How are we hurting our kids by trapping them here in Pennsylvania's public schools? When will Kim join us in Philadelphia? 1245 - Side - person you would not want as your boss. 1250 - Does the governor of New Jersey have the power to end the plastic bag ban? 1 - Which big music acts are coming to town? Who is the biggest? As the White House plans to debrief the public on the Charlotte murder, what can be done about getting people like the assailant off the street? 110 - Why does there need to be a face of crimes like this one on the train? Your calls. 115 - Dom Giordano will not serve white wine! 120 - Is there BYOB in South Carolina? Your calls. 135 - John McGrody of the Philadelphia FOP joins us today. Is The Inquirer correct in reporting there's a “blue divide” within the city's police force? Are there journalists looking to expose how much police funerals cost? Why has 1210 been a beacon for the local FOP? 155 - Finishing the hour. 2 - Why are Asians the “inconvenient minority” to the Philadelphia public school system? 215 - Dom's Money Melody! 220 - Where is Ellen DeGeneres when we need her most? Returning to the voting battles within the Commonwealth and beyond. 235 - Will we get new files regarding who was behind 9/11? Your calls. 240 - The Charlotte train assailant has been federally charged by Pam Bondi. 250 - The Lightning Round!

It's just two of your noonas this week. Amy and Megan are here to discuss the Amazon Prime drama, Head Over Heels. This drama has some of our favorite tropes, a great blend of comedy and drama, and--yes--a bit of a messy ending. But guess what? We still loved it. Also, maybe you can help settle an argument. Does Megan actually like high school dramas now?K-Pop Rec: MONSTA X, 'Do What I Want'Ready to download your first audiobook? Don't forget to click HERE for your free Audible trial.*Audible is a sponsor of Afternoona Delight Podcast*Are your family and friends sick of you talking about K-drama? We get it...and have an answer. Join our AfterNoona Delight Patreon and find community among folks who get your obsession. And check out www.afternoonadelight.com for more episodes, book recs and social media goodness. And don't forget about the newest member of our network: Afternoona Asks where diaspora Asians living in the West find ways to reconnect to Asian culture via Asian/KDramas.Last but CERTAINLY not least....love BTS? Or curious what all the fuss is about? Check out our sister pod Afternoona Army for "thinky, thirsty and over thirty" takes on Bangtan life.★ Support this podcast on Patreon ★ ★ Support this podcast on Patreon ★

08-21-25 - BR - THU - Survey Asks What Is Perfect Salary - SciNews On Saturn Storms And More - John Can't Watch Asians Eating Odd Foods In Bret's VideoSee Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

Now that the Iran crisis is passing, attention is returning to President Trump's sweeping domestic agenda. Stephen Miran of the Council of Economic Advisers makes the case for why the BBB must pass not only to secure the border and deliver on Trump's campaign promises, but also to unleash American economic growth. Plus, Harmeet Dhillon explains the agenda of the DOJ's Office of Civil Rights, which is in position to unshackle American police and roll back institutional discrimination against whites, Asians, and more. Watch ad-free on members.charliekirk.com! Get new merch at charliekirkstore.com! Support the show: http://www.charliekirk.com/supportSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.