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In this Building a Business on Your Own Terms episode, Sarah sits down with Matt Cross, co-founder of Harvest Chocolate, a bean-to-bar chocolate company in Tecumseh, Michigan. Matt shares how he and his wife Elizabeth transformed their culinary expertise into a thriving chocolate business that started in their kitchen during the pandemic and now operates a successful retail location with multiple sales channels. Matt reveals how Office Hours helped confirm his business was financially healthy and ready for strategic growth. Listeners will discover practical insights about: Using profit assessment to validate your business model before focusing on growth The power of creating simple revenue forecasts to set realistic channel-specific goals Leveraging data tools like Report Pundit to automatically track sales performance against targets This conversation is packed with actionable advice for food entrepreneurs looking to make data-driven decisions without getting overwhelmed. Matt's approach demonstrates how understanding your numbers leads to smarter growth strategies and ultimately the dream of "making more money while working less." Join the CFO Office Hours waiting list Connect with Matt: Website:Harvest ChocolateInstagram: @harvestcraftchocolate LinkedIn: Harvest Chocolate Get your copy of the latest Book Club selection:, The Mom Test, and RSVP for our Virtual Discussion Join The Good Food CFO Community: Follow us on Instagram: @thegoodfoodcfo Connect on LinkedIn: @sarahdelevan Watch on YouTube: @thegoodfoodcfo Become a Member: BABOYOT
There's no shortage of advice to be found on how to grow your audience. But how closely does that advice align with how podcast listeners say they actually find, choose (and abandon) the shows they listen to? It turns out, there are a number of surveys that have asked listeners to share their discovery and consumption habits. And while the data can sometimes contradict itself, it offers us as creators a peek behind the curtain into podcast listeners' hidden psychology, so that we can better meet them where they're at with our marketing and our shows. What's more, this data offers us a blueprint for the questions to ask (and avoid) when conducting our own listener research.
Growth doesn't have to mean being everywhere at once or chasing every shiny new tactic.In this episode of No Hacks, I talk with Ward van Gasteren — one of Europe's first growth hackers — about how to grow smarter, not louder. Ward shares his go-to method for helping early-stage startups: the 1-1-1 Framework — one audience, one channel, one message.We dig into how founders and product teams can stop spreading themselves too thin, avoid early-stage overwhelm, and finally find traction through focus. Ward explains the difference between growth and traditional marketing, how to approach experimentation, and why most companies waste time on strategies that don't serve their stage.Whether you're building a company, a product, or even a podcast — this conversation will help you cut through the noise and grow with clarity.Topics Covered:How to stop doing too much and focus on what worksThe 1-1-1 Framework for early-stage clarityWhy founders waste time on channels that aren't readyThe role of experimentation beyond A/B testingChoosing the right growth metrics and north starWhy organic social is rarely a growth engineBuilding scalable systems after early tractionAI's impact on speed (but not necessarily quality)How podcast growth follows the same principles as startup growthAbout the Guest:Ward van Gasteren is a growth consultant and one of Europe's first professional growth hackers. Through his platform Grow with Ward, he helps early-stage startups create growth strategies that actually work — without burning out in the process.Ward has worked with companies across industries to simplify how they think about growth, run smarter experiments, and scale what's already working. His 1-1-1 Framework has helped founders build real traction by focusing on the right things — not everything.Timestamps:00:00:00 – What does a growth consultant really do?00:06:07 – Breaking down the 1-1-1 Framework: one audience, one channel, one message00:10:27 – Brand-building vs. selling: when organic social actually helps00:15:30 – Ward's favorite growth tool (and why he'd ditch GA4)00:20:07 – Growth vs. Marketing: different teams, different goals00:25:08 – How AI tools help with speed, but not necessarily with strategy00:30:24 – Getting honest customer feedback and applying “The Mom Test”00:35:16 – Ward's growth program and where to follow his workConnect with Ward: → Website: https://growwithward.com → LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/wardvangasteren/---If you enjoyed the episode, please share it with a friend!No Hacks websiteYouTubeLinkedInInstagram
Ivan Barajas Vargas is Co-Founder and CEO at Muuktest, world-class QA 100% done-for-you. Seed funded.Here's what we cover:What is Service-as-a-Software;How do you incorporate customer research at Muuktest;The Mom Test;What are some of your goals with customer research;What questions are you asking;How are you using research insights;Do you ask customers where do they learn and hang out;Why understanding “whole-person” with your research is important and goes beyond just your product;Why is customer research important;What are your challenges with customer research;There are so many voices, who should you listen to when you do this research.Ivan on LinkedIn: www.linkedin.com/in/ivanbarajasvargas Muuktest: muuktest.com For more content, subscribe to Building With Buyers on Apple or Spotify or wherever you like to listen, and don't forget to leave a review if you're lovin' the show. Music by my talented daughter.Anna on LinkedIn: www.linkedin.com/in/annafurmanovWebsite: furmanovmarketing.com
★ Unterstützt den Podcast via Patreon und erhaltet exklusive Bonusfolgen ★---Holt euch das Buch: Gumroad (10€ ebook) oder AmazonIn seinem Buch Der Mom Test beschreibt Rob Fitzpatrick wie ihr aus euren Kundengesprächen bessere und mehr Informationen extrahiert. Anhand von vielen Beispielen geht Rob Fitzpatrick darauf ein wie gute und wie schlechte Gespräche ablaufen und wie ihr verhindert letztere zu führen. Wir versuchen euch anhand eigener Beispiele das Thema näherzubringen und hoffen ihr habt viel Spaß an unseren Rollenspielen.- Simons zweiter Podcast: Digitales StandbeinSchwarz auf Weiß Rating:Verständlichkeit F 5/5 & S 5/5Umsetzbarkeit F 5/5 & S 4/5Würde ich weiterverschenken? F Ja & S Ja---Feedback, Wünsche und Beschimpfungen könnt ihr uns gerne per Email schicken: feedback@swpodcast.deDu willst mehr lesen und dich mit Gleichgesinnten austauschen? Dann komm in unseren SW Podcast Buchclub Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.
In this episode of The Tech Leader's Playbook, David Hirschfeld shares his extensive experience in the tech industry, focusing on the transformative impact of AI on startups and business operations. He emphasizes the importance of understanding product-market fit, the distinction between needs and wants, and the lessons learned from both successful and failed ventures. Hirschfeld also discusses practical applications of AI, particularly in healthcare, and the common pitfalls companies face when integrating AI into their workflows. In this conversation, David Hirschfeld discusses the cultural acceptance of AI in companies, the importance of having a strategic implementation plan, and the fear of missing out that drives many organizations to adopt AI hastily. He emphasizes the need for companies to assess whether to build or buy AI solutions based on their core competencies. Additionally, he introduces the 'Launch First' method for startups, which encourages early customer engagement and financial commitments to validate product ideas before full development. The discussion concludes with practical advice for founders on workflow and market validation.Takeaways AI is a transformative force in the tech industry. Understanding product-market fit is crucial for startup success. Founders often confuse needs with wants in their market. Fear is a significant driver of consumer purchasing decisions. Listening to customer feedback is essential for product development. Successful startups focus on solving problems, not just building products. AI can automate processes and improve efficiency in businesses. Cultural acceptance is vital when integrating AI into workflows. Startups should prioritize selling over seeking funding. Education and training can help alleviate fears about AI. Companies often lack a strategic game plan for AI. Fear of missing out can lead to hasty AI adoption. Understanding AI's limitations is essential for effective use. Deciding to build or buy AI solutions depends on core competencies. The 'Launch First' method can improve startup success rates. Early customer engagement is key to validating product ideas. Focus on solving customer problems rather than just features. The Mom Test is a valuable resource for understanding customer needs.Chapters00:00 The Evolution of AI in Tech02:59 Understanding Product-Market Fit06:01 The Importance of Needs vs. Wants08:57 Learning from Success and Failure12:13 Navigating AI in Business14:57 Practical Applications of AI in Healthcare22:09 Cultural Acceptance of AI in Companies23:04 Implementation Strategies for AI24:26 The Fear of Missing Out on AI26:32 Build vs. Buy: AI Solutions28:35 The Launch First Method for Startups40:27 Advice for Founders on Workflow and LaunchingDavid Hirschfeld's Social Media Links:https://www.linkedin.com/in/dhirschfeld/https://www.instagram.com/tekyzinchttps://www.facebook.com/dmhirschfeldDavid Hirschfeld's Website:https://tekyz.com/Resources and Links:https://www.hireclout.comhttps://www.podcast.hireclout.comhttps://www.linkedin.com/in/hirefasthireright
This week, on Today In Space...our first 'Tech Talk' about AI & Business (with some aspirational takes on the role of AI in Humanity's future on Earth and in Space). Our guest David Hirschfeld, CEO of Tekyz, shares the knowledge of his 35-year career in software, including his origin story founding a vending machine software company that grew to 800 customers in 22 countries! We discuss business and AI; including Tekyz's take on the importance of product-market fit and early customer engagement given that "95-98%" of startups fail. David introduced "Launch First," a strategy for pre-launch sales to validate market demand, sharing success stories of securing $70,000 in 60 days for a real estate product and $250,000 for clinical trial software. Long story short - David was a wealth of knowledge and practical expertise, and we talked about almost anything and everything tech, AI, and even philosophy and business along with some laughs! With the way 2025 is shaping up, AI and technology will continue to make a difference in our lives. Our goal is to dive-in head first, try to understand the unknown and talk to experts along the way and share it with you. Our goal is to face our fear of the unknow and try to understand the magic behind it, using the scientific mindset as our guide. If AI's promise of impact is anywhere close to humanity discovering fire, then every little bit of understanding we have will help us make a better future for the world tomorrow. While we definitely recommend you do your homework, all you need to do is get comfortable, get ready to listen, and dive in with us. Alex shares some of his thoughts and concerns about AI, and the two have a great debate of ideas and topics, some of which include: The Value-Add for AI and how it can help you Concerns about AI and Corruption The Quality of data used to train AI models The Energy consumption of AI at scale The future of AI in Space Travel Examples of real life applications of AI to make life better for individuals and businesses We thank David for joining us and being such a great guest! We look forward to checking in with him in the future and see if any of his predictions were spot on. Check out his new podcast, "Scaling Smarter" at https://tekyz.podbean.com/. People interested at becoming a guest can schedule at scalingsmarter.net Note: The description above was drafted entirely by Otter. AI from the audio recording of this podcast. It was edited by a human, Alex G. Orphanos. Keywords: software industry, enterprise projects, vending software, trade show success, startup challenges, product market fit, customer feedback, Mom Test, clinician mindset, Launch First, pre-launch sales, AI tools, code generation, market disruption, self-driving cars, AI innovation, Star Trek economy, financial greed, AI training, useful data, internet infrastructure, power consumption, AI race, large language models, agentic workflows, workflow automation, podcast automation, AI as friend, AI feedback, AI bottlenecks Timestamps: 00:00 David Hirschfield's Career Journey 04:18 Early Startup Experiences and Lessons 10:41 The Importance of Understanding People in Business 14:06 Launch First and Pre-Launch Sales Strategy 27:35 The Role of AI in Business and Future Predictions 28:06 The Impact of AI on Everyday Life and Business 01:00:17 The Evolution of AI and Its Practical Applications 01:09:16 The Future of AI and Its Broader Implications 01:09:05 AI's Potential and Ethical Concerns 01:13:58 AI's Energy Consumption and Practical Applications 01:19:49 Advancements in AI Technology and Workflow Automation 01:22:48 The Future of AI in Human Space Travel 01:24:12 AI as a Collaborative Tool and Personal Reflections 01:24:30 Closing Remarks and Contact Information -------------------------- Here's to building a fantastic future - and continued progress in Space (and humanity)! Spread Love, Spread Science Alex G. Orphanos We'd like to thank our sponsors: AG3D Printing Follow us: @todayinspacepod on Instagram/Twitter @todayinspace on TikTok /TodayInSpacePodcast on Facebook Support the podcast: • Buy a 3D printed gift from our shop - ag3dprinting.etsy.com • Get a free quote on your next 3D printing project at ag3d-printing.com • Donate at todayinspace.net #space #rocket #podcast #spacex #science #3dprinting #nasa #spacetravel #spaceexploration #spacecraft #technology #aerospace #spacetechnology #engineer #stem #3dprinted #ai #aiforbusiness #aiforcreativity #bottlenecks #articificalintelligence #LLM
Get Noticed! Send a text.Struggling to find quality podcast guests or break through the noise of endless pitches? Join Jim James as he interviews Alex Sanfilippo, founder of PodMatch, who's revolutionising podcast guest matching. Discover how this innovative platform solves the twin challenges faced by podcast hosts and potential guests: connecting the right people efficiently while maintaining high-quality interactions.Alex reveals his entrepreneurial journey from aerospace to creating a platform that's matched over 100,000 podcast interviews. Learn how strategic pricing, careful guest vetting, and a commitment to serving podcasters have transformed PodMatch into a game-changing service. With insights into building a successful SaaS business, managing dual marketing strategies, and avoiding feature creep, Alex shares valuable lessons for entrepreneurs.Whether you're a podcast host seeking exceptional guests or an aspiring interviewee, this episode offers a blueprint for podcasting success.Recommended Resource: Book: "The Mom Test" by Rob FitzpatrickWorld of Work Experts on the People and Performance PodcastInterviews with experts and business leaders focused on ways to inspire employees.Riverside - Your online recording studioThe easiest way to record podcasts and videos in studio quality from anywhere. All from the browser.AWeber - free email marketing Grow, sell, and engage with your audience—simple email marketing in one place. Free trial.Podcastpage.io - Launch your podcast website in minutesViddyoze: Create client-grabbing videosClient-grabbing videos in just 3 clicks with the world's most powerful video animation platformDisclaimer: This post contains affiliate links. If you make a purchase, I may receive a commission at no extra cost to you.Support the showBe a podcast guest. Share your story.Learn how to get noticed by podcast hosts.Check out the Podcast Guest Blueprint - click the link below.https://academy.theunnoticed.cc/
What makes marketers and agency professionals natural SaaS founders? In this episode, David Hart, author of Productized and co-founder of ScreenCloud, shares his journey from agency ownership to building a successful SaaS company with over $20M ARR. Learn how to transform creative skills and strategic thinking into a scalable business model. What you'll learn: Turning agency challenges into scalable product opportunities. The importance of understanding customer needs and validation. How content marketing drives growth on a limited budget. David's journey offers valuable lessons for marketers aiming to create lasting impact. Don't miss this chance to learn practical strategies for building your own success story. Competition time
What makes marketers and agency professionals natural SaaS founders? In this episode, David Hart, author of Productized and co-founder of ScreenCloud, shares his journey from agency ownership to building a successful SaaS company with over $20M ARR. Learn how to transform creative skills and strategic thinking into a scalable business model. What you'll learn: Turning agency challenges into scalable product opportunities. The importance of understanding customer needs and validation. How content marketing drives growth on a limited budget. David's journey offers valuable lessons for marketers aiming to create lasting impact. Don't miss this chance to learn practical strategies for building your own success story. Competition time
VIDEO INTRODUCTION: This Video is Sponsored By Google Play. In today's episode of the Indian Business Podcast, in collaboration with Google Play's Startup Spotlights, we're excited to welcome Harshil Karia and Aayush Anand, the founders of Level Supermind. Join us as they share their journey in creating a leading mental wellness app that has garnered over a million downloads and a significant number of paying subscribers, all while being named Google Play's App of the Year. Discover the challenges they faced during app development, their innovative growth strategies, and how they built a loyal user base in a price-sensitive market. This episode is perfect for aspiring app developers, entrepreneurs, and anyone interested in the mental wellness tech landscape. If you're an aspiring entrepreneur or just curious about business growth, this episode is a must-listen! We'd love to hear your thoughts in the comments below! Level Supermind App: https://install.lvl.fit/c832evwe0qt0k73e8m2a0u Youtube channel: @LevelSuperMind. 0:00 - Trailer 1:40 - Intro 3:50 - How did you find a gap in the market? 8:30 - What kind of Market Research did you do? 12:20 - What is the MOM Test? 16:45 - What were the major insights from the MOM Test? 17:57- Breaking down the Science of Meditation 21:13 - When is the right time to develop an App? 23:39 - What are some Cost-effective Tools for App Development? 26:36 - How do you grow your User Base? 29:16 - What is the Product-Market Fit test? 34:53 - How do you prioritise problems as a Founder? 39:09 - Hyper-optimising with the help of Google's Appscale Academy 41:46 - What is App store optimization (ASO)? 44:21 - What is a Benchmark Test? 46:55 - Understanding the AARRR Framework? 48:16 - What is an Aha Moment? 49:05 - Feature Based Retention 54:32 - Communication based Retention 00:59:05 - How to leverage and convert users into paying customers? 01:01:49 - How do you Catalyse Referrals? 01:03:20 - What is the Traction Market Fit? 01:05:15 - Tapping into Identified and unidentified segments 01:08:46 - Power of Content Marketing 01:13:35 - How effective is YouTube marketing? Our Best Indian Business Case Studies: 1. Asian paints - https://youtu.be/jGT6ob8hV6M 2. Amul - https://youtu.be/nnwqtZiYMxQ 3. Haldiram - https://youtu.be/Z7P-t_yc8gE 4. Lijjat Papad - https://youtu.be/EdpoEmifW7M ✅Study Materials: 1. PMF Article: https://blog.superhuman.com/how-superhuman-built-an-engine-to-find-product-market-fit/ 2. PMF Tool: https://forms.gle/WDTsMnMogr41Vos7A 3. Pricing survey (not competition benchmarking): https://forms.gle/NxkLy8bZnudWQEpPA 4. Sample RICE: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1s6VE0QsFm5WqsiIiQYvyWmMV4Tyz68N_fxfwBJIgY5E/edit?usp=sharing 5. Product Newsletter to subscribe: https://dovetail.com/product-development/top-product-newsletters/ If you want to work with Level Supermind please do reach out to founders or write to us at hr@levelsupermind.com Think School is a Digital School that we all deserved, but never had ►►Check out Think School's Online courses: https://www.thethinkschool.com #thinkschool #businesscasestudy #geopolitics Credits: CNN-News 18, WION, NBC News, Money control pro, Business standard, TV18,Business Today, ABC news, CNBC, ET now ,Bloomberg originals, Financial Times, DW documentary, AL Jazeera English, BBC news, Firstpost.
Chapter 1:Summary of The Mom Test"The Mom Test" by Rob Fitzpatrick is a practical guide on how to effectively gather customer feedback and validate business ideas through conversations. The core principle of the book is that many entrepreneurs fail to get honest and useful feedback because they ask biased questions or frame their ideas in a way that leads to misleading compliments, especially from friends and family.Key points include:1. Ask Good Questions: Instead of asking if someone would buy your product, focus on their experiences, problems, and behaviors. Questions should be open-ended and designed to elicit genuine insights rather than praise.2. Avoid Pitching: When you seek feedback, avoid discussing your idea initially. This prevents the conversation from becoming a sales pitch and encourages people to share their true thoughts.3. Listen Actively: Pay attention to what the other person says. Listen for pain points and needs that might indicate a viable market opportunity.4. Seek Specificity: Encourage interviewees to provide concrete examples rather than general opinions. This can help you understand the context of their experiences and challenges.5. Stay Engaged and Iterative: Use early conversations to iterate on your understanding of the problem and refine your ideas based on real feedback.The book emphasizes that the key to successful customer validation lies in asking the right questions, maintaining an open mindset, and prioritizing genuine conversations over superficial affirmations. By applying these principles, entrepreneurs can better gauge market needs and refine their products or services accordingly.Chapter 2:The Theme of The Mom Test"The Mom Test" by Rob Fitzpatrick is a practical guide on how to conduct effective customer interviews to validate business ideas. The book emphasizes the importance of asking the right questions to gain genuine insights into customer needs and preferences. Here are the key plot points, character development (in this context, more about the author's approach and perspective), and thematic ideas presented in the book: Key Plot Points1. Understanding the Problem: The book starts by establishing the common pitfalls entrepreneurs face when discussing their ideas with friends and family (the titular "Mom Test"). People often give positive feedback to avoid hurting feelings, which can lead to misconceptions about a business's viability.2. Asking the Right Questions: Fitzpatrick encourages readers to formulate questions that focus on real experiences rather than hypothetical scenarios. He outlines techniques to guide conversations that reveal truthful information from potential customers.3. The Importance of Listening: The narrative emphasizes the need for active listening during interviews. Entrepreneurs are encouraged to listen closely to what potential customers say and to observe their body language and emotions.4. Learning from Failure: The book discusses the inevitability of failure in the entrepreneurial journey and posits that failure can provide valuable learning experiences if approached correctly.5. Turning Insights into Actions: Fitzpatrick concludes by explaining how to leverage the insights gathered from customer interviews to refine business ideas and improve product development. Character DevelopmentWhile "The Mom Test" is not a narrative fiction with characters, Rob Fitzpatrick's voice and perspective serve as the central "character." His approach and development as a mentor to entrepreneurs are crucial throughout the book. - Tone of Awareness: Fitzpatrick's writing reflects awareness of common psychological biases and mistakes that entrepreneurs make. He evolves from the typical mindset of seeking validation to fostering genuine dialogue with potential users.- Guide and...
Undiscovered Entrepreneur ..Start-up, online business, podcast
Did you like the episode? Send me a text and let me know!!Mastering Minimum Viable Products (MVP) with AI InsightsIn this episode of Business Conversations with Pi, host Scoob and his AI co-host Pi, developed by Anthropic, delve into critical topics for new entrepreneurs. They discuss what a Minimum Viable Product (MVP) is, the importance of overcoming perfectionism, and strategies for launching an MVP effectively. They also provide valuable post-launch steps, recommend insightful books, and emphasize the importance of learning and iterating based on user feedback. Tune in for actionable advice and AI-enabled insights to help turn your startup dreams into reality."The Lean Startup" by Eric Ries: "Hooked" by Nir Eyal "The Startup Owner's Manual" by Steve Blank"The Mom Test" by Rob Fitzpatrick"Running Lean" by Ash Maurya00:00 Introduction to Business Conversations with Pi01:50 Defining the Minimum Viable Product (MVP)03:07 Strategies for Launching Your MVP05:02 Post-Launch Steps and Overcoming Perfectionism06:46 Recommended Reading for Entrepreneurs07:55 Final Thoughts and Encouragement08:29 Conclusion and Next Steps Thank you for being a Skoobeliever!! If you have questions about the show or you want to be a guest please contact me at one of these social mediasTwitter......... ..@djskoob2021 Facebook.........Facebook.com/skoobamiInstagram..... instagram.com/uepodcast2021tiktok....... @djskoob2021Email............... Uepodcast2021@gmail.comIf you would like to be coached on your entrepreneurial adventure please email me at for a 2 hour free discovery call! This is a $700 free gift to my Skoobelievers!! Contact me Now!! On Twitter @doittodaycoachdoingittodaycoaching@gmailcom
In this episode of Grow a Small Business, host Troy Trewin interviews Lilly Garrett, who shares her entrepreneurial journey that led her to building Maixia Marketing. She discusses the innovative strategies she has led that fueled significant growth at multiple early stage startups. Lilly emphasizes the critical role of data-driven decision-making and effective marketing foundations. Tune in for valuable insights on building a successful business from the ground up. Why would you wait any longer to start living the lifestyle you signed up for? Balance your health, wealth, relationships and business growth. And focus your time and energy and make the most of this year. Let's get into it by clicking here. Troy delves into our guest's startup journey, their perception of success, industry reconsideration, and the pivotal stress point during business expansion. They discuss the joys of small business growth, vital entrepreneurial habits, and strategies for team building, encompassing wins, blunders, and invaluable advice. And a snapshot of the final five Grow A Small Business Questions: What do you think is the hardest thing in growing a small business? Lilly Garrett believes the hardest things in growing a small business are team building, marketing foundations, data management,and the art of prioritization. What business book has helped you the most? Lilly Garrett's favorite business book that has helped her the most is "The Lean Startup" by Eric Ries. Are there any great podcasts or online learning resources you'd recommend to help grow a small business? Lilly Garrett recommends the following podcasts and online learning resources to help grow a small business: April Dunford, she has a blog and podcast all about positioning, it's a must read/listen for all businesses! What tool or resource would you recommend to grow a small business? Lilly Garrett recommends using Pocus, if you're sales-led and Slack for all internal comms. What advice would you give yourself on day one of starting out in business? Lilly Garrett would advise herself on day one of starting out in business to ensure you've validated as well as you possibly can (read The Mom Test) ensure to record more data asap, and collect feedback consistently, emphasizing the importance of understanding customer insights from the beginning. Book a 20-minute Growth Chat with Troy Trewin to see if you qualify for our upcoming course. Don't miss out on this opportunity to take your small business to new heights! Enjoyed the podcast? Please leave a review on iTunes or your preferred platform. Your feedback helps more small business owners discover our podcast and embark on their business growth journey. Quotable quotes from our special Grow A Small Business podcast guest: Success in business often boils down to effective marketing and understanding your customers — Lilly Garrett Don't underestimate the power of a strong team; collaboration fuels innovation — Lilly Garrett Embrace challenges as opportunities to learn and grow; every setback is a stepping stone to success — Lilly Garrett
What if, instead of asking how to integrate AI into your product, the question was, should you? During this episode, Jared Turner and Will Larry interview Senior Product Manager at thoughtbot and Founderland Startup Mentor, Bethan Ashley, who shares her insights and advice on how and when to leverage AI tooling. Sharing her career journey leading up to this point, Bethan makes the key distinction between project management and product management, and why this is essential to understand. Next, you'll hear about her views on the importance of talking to customers about your products and the different ways to reach them effectively. We get into some of the classic reasons that products fail, the appropriate time to bring in a product manager, and a few of the techniques, prompts, and exercises that Bethan favors when mentoring others. Join us as we unpack how to avoid common pitfalls, discuss practical steps to overcome the fear of failure, and share advice for those seeking to put AI tooling into their product. Thanks for tuning in. Key Points From This Episode: From building bespoke apps for companies to product management, mentorship, and more: Bethan Ashley's career journey. Distinguishing between project management and product management. Why talking to your customers is fundamental to successful products. Some of the many different ways to reach customers. Classic reasons that products fail. How to identify the point at which a product manager has become a necessity. Bethan's path to mentorship through Founderland. The Speedy Eights exercise that she uses to prompt ideas. Advice to avoid common pitfalls: just get started. Exploring the obstacle created by the fear of failure. Strategies from the book The Mom Test. Insights on AI in the day-to-day product management space. Advice for those seeking to put AI tooling into their product. Spicy takes on product management. Links Mentioned in Today's Episode: Bethan Ashley on LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/in/bethanashley/) Founderland (https://www.founderland.org/) Customer Discovery Playbook (https://thoughtbot.com/playbook/customer-discovery/preparation-and-setup) The Mom Test (https://www.amazon.com/Mom-Test-customers-business-everyone/dp/1492180742) Gamma (https://gamma.app/) Gemini (https://gemini.google.com/) Loom (https://www.loom.com/) Figma (https://www.figma.com/) Motion (https://www.usemotion.com/) WIP is waste (https://thoughtbot.com/blog/wip-is-waste#) Jared Turner on X (https://x.com/jaredlt) Jared Turner on LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/in/jaredlt/) Will Larry on X (https://x.com/will23larry) Will Larry on LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/in/william-larry/) thoughtbot (https://thoughtbot.com) thoughtbot on LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/company/150727/) thoughtbot on X (https://twitter.com/thoughtbot) Giant Robots Smashing Into Other Giant Robots Podcast (https://podcast.thoughtbot.com/) Giant Robots Smashing Into Other Giant Robots Email (hosts@giantrobots.fm) Support Giant Robots Smashing Into Other Giant Robots (https://github.com/sponsors/thoughtbot)
BONUS: Mastering Product Management in a Remote World, Insights from Tuple's Head of Product, Eli Goodman NOTE: We want to thank the folks at Tuple.app for being so generous with their stories, and supporting the podcast. Visit tuple.app/scrum and share them if you find the app useful! Remember, sharing is caring! In this episode, Eli Goodman, Head of Product at Tuple, shares insights from his extensive experience in software development and product management. Having transitioned from engineering management to product leadership, Eli reveals the key strategies Tuple uses to develop its remote pair programming service, which is trusted by companies like Figma and Shopify. Tune in to discover how Tuple handles remote team dynamics, customer-driven development, and balances tech debt with client needs, all while maintaining a customer-centric focus. Introduction to Tuple and Why It's Unique Tuple, a remote pair programming service designed by engineers, solves a pain point that its founders, all pairing enthusiasts, experienced firsthand. They were unsatisfied with generic screen-sharing tools that disrupted the flow of coding collaboration. Tuple's product philosophy is about staying "one inch wide, one mile deep" to ensure the tool stays focused on enhancing the pairing experience without getting in the way. "The details matter. Generic screen-sharing tools just don't cut it for productive pairing." Managing a Remote Team at Tuple Managing a distributed team across the U.S. and Europe comes with its challenges. Eli highlights the importance of alignment and ensuring everyone is on the same page, despite working remotely. He emphasizes the role of Product Owners as "connective tissue" and the power of connecting team members with key initiatives. Through personal conversations, Eli uncovers what motivates his team, allowing him to support them without micromanaging. "What makes you proud? What brings you shame? Understanding these emotions helps uncover what drives our team." Ensuring Effective Communication in a Remote Environment Effective communication is the backbone of remote work, and Eli shares some of the practices that have helped Tuple's team stay aligned and collaborative. From using spontaneous pairing sessions to fostering a culture of checking in, Tuple has created a remote work environment where conversations are naturally sparked, and collaboration is effortless. "We have more space in our schedules for spontaneous pairing, which keeps collaboration flowing." Lessons Learned from Pairing Remotely One of the key insights Eli shares is how Tuple has evolved its remote pairing process. In the past, pairing might have felt like a formal meeting, but now it happens more spontaneously. Tuple's app facilitates this by offering the metaphor of a phone call—engineers can call each other at any time, making collaboration easy, especially when someone is deep into a task and needs quick support. "At Tuple, engineers only have three meetings a week, leaving the rest of the time open for pairing and creative work." Pairing Beyond Programming Tasks While pairing is typically associated with programming, Eli explains how Tuple uses pairing for other activities, like design or planning sessions. This practice has extended beyond coding, fostering a culture where team members collaborate on various tasks that benefit from shared perspectives and live problem-solving. "We've expanded pairing beyond coding, using it for activities like design reviews and project planning." Balancing Customer Feedback with Product Vision Responding to customer feedback is vital, but it can also lead to losing focus. Eli explains how Tuple balances this by capturing as much feedback as possible, using tools like Product Board to keep track of customer requests. However, instead of building every requested feature, Eli focuses on synthesizing broader patterns and emotional triggers that align with Tuple's long-term vision. "Focus on discovery as a product person. Understand the emotional context behind customer feedback—that's what drives great products." Tuple's Ideal Customer and Core Value Tuple's ideal customers are teams that value deep collaboration through pair programming. The platform's most important offering is the ability to make remote pairing seamless and intuitive, something traditional tools fail to deliver. "Tuple is built for teams that believe in the power of collaboration and want a tool that enhances their pairing experience, not disrupts it." Roadmapping: How to Prioritize the Right Work in Product Development Looking ahead, Eli shares Tuple's plans to continue investing in quality and lowering the barriers to remote pairing. One exciting potential direction includes creating a "social layer" within the app to help users feel more connected with their teammates. Another idea is incorporating non-human pairing agents that could assist with specific tasks. "We want to see if we can make it feel like you're right there with your teammates, lowering the barriers to start pairing." Recommended Resources Eli recommends The Mom Test by Rob Fitzpatrick, a must-read for anyone working in product management. The book teaches how to talk to customers in a way that gets honest, useful feedback rather than polite responses that don't help improve the product. "I thought caring about people was enough to talk to customers, but The Mom Test taught me what not to do during customer interviews." About Eli Goodman Eli Goodman has been working on software teams for 17 years. He's been a full-stack developer and engineering manager at both large and small companies, including Etsy and Headspace. A few years ago, Eli transitioned to product management and is now the Head of Product at Tuple, a remote pair programming service used by companies such as Figma, Shopify, and many others in the software industry. You can link with Eli Goodman on LinkedIn, or email Eli at Eli@Tuple.app.
Is it even possible anymore for established companies to innovate like startups while leveraging their existing strengths? Today's guest certainly thinks so and he has the product story to back it up. Ben Brown, CTO of Canopy, shares his journey of spinning out a hardware+software startup from Ford Motor Company and launching an innovative truck security product in just 18 months. Canopy helps secure precious cargo in pickup truck beds - a huge problem for tradespeople who carry expensive tools and equipment as they commute between jobs. Ben discusses balancing startup agility with automotive industry rigor, rapidly iterating on hardware prototypes, and using customer research to drive product decisions. We explore how Canopy went from idea to launch in 18 months - particularly impressive for a product combining hardware, software, and AI/ML models, while complying with stringent automotive and FCC requirements. In this episode: Canopy's journey from Ford spinout to standalone startup Challenges of hardware development timelines and component sourcing Importance of customer research and beta testing Organizing cross-functional teams across hardware, software, and AI Using AI and generative models to accelerate development Balancing startup speed with automotive industry standards Lessons from rapidly prototyping and iterating on hardware Leveraging Ford's resources while maintaining startup flexibility Unlock the full potential of your product team with Integral's player coaches, experts in lean, human-centered design. Visit integral.io/convergence for a free Product Success Lab workshop to gain clarity and confidence in tackling any product design or engineering challenge. Products and Services mentioned in this episode: Whoop fitness tracker Canopy Pickup Cam Home Assistant Sense home energy monitor Husqvarna robotic lawn mower Mom Test by Rob Fitzpatrick Subscribe to the Convergence podcast wherever you get podcasts including video episodes to get updated on the other crucial conversations that we'll post on YouTube at youtube.com/@convergencefmpodcast Learn something? Give us a 5 star review and like the podcast on YouTube. It's how we grow. Follow the Pod Linkedin: https://www.linkedin.com/company/convergence-podcast/ X: https://twitter.com/podconvergence nstagram: @podconvergence
Here's the link to the (anonymous) survey - https://s.surveyplanet.com/z2yvlesg Thank you!!! (The book I mentioned is "The Mom Test" by Rob Fitzpatrick)
Jamie Keane founded Be Spotted and the NYC dog community, Dog Spotted. Through her experience growing Dog Spotted to over 10.8k followers of pet parents, she has taken that experience to teach fellow pet entrepreneurs how they can do the same. She finds it important that pet entrepreneurs are empowered to market themselves as their unique voice, personality, and messaging are what will help stand them out from the pack. In addition, she helps pet entrepreneurs with email marketing resulting in deeper connections and increased sales, AND how to create online products resulting in money made in your sleep! She has been featured in Nasdaq, Time Out NY, Thrillist, Bustle and more! She is based in NYC with her husband Pat and her beloved mutt, Lucy. Topics covered in this episode: Practical social media tips for mobile veterinarians The importance of SEO Avoiding vanity metrics like buying followers The role of personal branding in building trust with clients The significance of market research Links & Resources: Visit the Be Spotted website to learn more! Find Be Spotted on Instagram Book A Free Discovery Call with Jamie Purchase the marketing research book mentioned in this podcast, The Mom Test, by Rob Fitzpatrick Use this tutorial to gain access to the full Instagram Music Library here The House Call Vet Academy Resources: Download Dr. Eve's FREE House Call & Mobile Vet Biz Plan! Find out about The House Call Vet Academy online CE course Learn more about Dr. Eve Harrison Learn more about 1-to-1 coaching for current & prospective house call & mobile vets. Get House Call Vet swag! Find out about the next House Call & Mobile Vet Virtual Conference Music: In loving memory of Dr. Steve Weinberg. Intro and outro guitar music was written, performed, and recorded by house call veterinarian Dr. Steve Weinberg. Thank you to our sponsors! Chronos O3 Vets Rekindling w/ Julie Squires This podcast is also available in video on our House Call Vet Cafe YouTube channel
Covino & Rich are filling-in for Dan Patrick! They have fun with their Old-School topic of the week: Favorite lunch-box snack as a kid, in honor of Famous Amos (RIP!) Tons of callers have great input! The best O.G. lunch-boxes get shine & the guys get you hyped for the new NFL season! Plus, Rich's mom is sports quizzed live on the air & Flag Football at the 2028 Olympics has some fun question marks. #crshowSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
Covino & Rich are in for Day 3 of the Dan Patrick Hat Trick! They have fun sharing TV/get-to lists & discuss their social media feeds blowing up. The messages are all about a Caitlin Clark/Aaron Judge on-air debate over the two stars' popularity. Is Clark a bigger deal right now than the man who just hit his 300th homer? The crew & callers make their case, and Rich has litmus tests and hype trains! #crshowSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
Can understanding users' real-life experiences transform your product development strategy?In this episode, Hannah Clark is joined by Kevin Gentry—Principal Product Manager at Hilton Grand Vacations, & Co-founder and Host of the Product Coffee Podcast—to unveil his well-honed playbook for sourcing user insights, rooted in the principles of "The Mom Test."
In this exciting episode, Frank La Vigne and Andy Leonard sit down with Aviad Harell, managing partner at Team 8, to explore the transformative power of technology in today's business landscape. Aviad shares his mission to eliminate day-to-day bureaucracy and leverages technology to automate processes, drawing from his vast experience in the tech industry. Beyond business, Aviad reveals his passion for traveling in South America and his book recommendation, "The Mom Test," which acts as a guide for proper idea validation.As the conversation unfolds, we explore how venture capital has evolved from a hobby to a disciplined, professional field, much like the maturity models in software development. Aviad details Team 8's innovative approach to venture capital, partnering with founders early in their journey, sometimes before even fully forming ideas. This unique model includes building a robust support system of 85 professionals to ensure the success of the startups they invest in.Discover the importance of critical thinking, loving the problem more than the solution, and the journey from idea to execution. Hear Aviad's insights on why execution is more crucial than the original idea and his belief in adaptability, quoting the famous military adage, "No idea survives contact with reality."Show Notes04:56 Founders seek validation, partners provide early support.07:57 Teammate model founded on deep cybersecurity understanding.10:51 Query about venture capitalist process's modernization and perception.15:28 Entrepreneurship challenges led to significant personal growth.19:07 Unintended tech consequences changing finance and daily lives.22:47 Interested in different applications of agile methodologies.27:22 Fascinating insights into approaching venture capitalists today.30:31 Passion for skill, idea improvement, crucial teamwork.31:23 Seek advice, consider other ideas, and collaborate.36:26 Entrepreneur becomes angel investor, supports Tel Aviv.37:52 Considered new company, resisted VC, became investor.43:58 Automating bureaucracy, taxes, and legal document review.47:53 Focus on problem, not solution; meaningful feedback.50:38 Data-driven episode with Aviad Harrell from Team 8.
Bio David is known for his ability to deliver inspiring and thought-provoking presentations that challenge audiences to think differently about innovation and product development. His keynotes and workshops are engaging and interactive, with a focus on real-world examples and case studies. David's message is relevant for entrepreneurs, executives, and organizations of all sizes and industries, and he illustrates concepts live on stage to leave attendees with concrete tools and techniques they can use to drive innovation and growth in their own business. Interview Highlights 02:00 Early Startups 02:45 Dealing with uncertainty 04:25 Testing Business Ideas 07:35 Shifting mindsets 11:00 Transformational leadership 13:00 Desirable, viable, feasible 14:50 Sustainability 17:00 AI 22:50 Jobs, pains and gains 26:30 Extracting your assumptions 27:30 Mapping and prioritisation 28:10 Running experiments Social Media LinkedIn: David Bland on LinkedIn Website: davidjbland.com Company Website: Precoil YouTube: David Bland on YouTube Books & Resources · Testing Business Ideas: A Field Guide for Rapid Experimentation (The Strategyzer Series): David J. Bland, Alex Osterwalder · Assumptions Mapping Fundamentals Course: https://precoil.teachable.com/p/assumptions-mapping-fundamentals/ · The Invincible Company: How to Constantly Reinvent Your Organization with Inspiration From the World's Best Business Models (The Strategyzer Series): Alexander Osterwalder, Yves Pigneur, Alan Smith, Frederic Etiemble · Value Proposition Design: How to Create Products and Services Customers Want (The Strategyzer Series): Alexander Osterwalder, Yves Pigneur, Gregory Bernarda, Alan Smith, Trish Papadakos · The Lean Startup: How Constant Innovation Creates Radically Successful Businesses: Eric Ries · Interviewing Users: How to Uncover Compelling Insights- 2nd Edition, Steve Portigal · The Mom Test: How to Talk to Customers & Learn If Your Business Is a Good Idea When Everyone Is Lying to You, Rob Fitzpatrick · Business Model Generation: A Handbook for Visionaries, Game Changers, and Challengers (The Strategyzer Series): Alexander Osterwalder, Yves Pigneur · The Four Steps to the Epiphany: Successful Strategies for Products that Win: Steve Blank Episode Transcript Intro: Hello and welcome to the Agile Innovation Leaders podcast. I'm Ula Ojiaku. On this podcast I speak with world-class leaders and doers about themselves and a variety of topics spanning Agile, Lean Innovation, Business, Leadership and much more – with actionable takeaways for you the listener. Ula Ojiaku Hello everyone. I'm really honoured and pleased to introduce David Bland as my guest for this episode. He is the best-selling author of the book, Testing Business Ideas, and he's also the Founder of Precoil, an organisation that's focused on helping companies to find product market fits using Lean Start-up, Design Thinking and Business Model Innovation. He's not a newcomer to the world of Agile as well. So, David, it's an honour to have you on the Agile Innovation Leaders Podcast. Thank you so much for making the time. David Bland Yeah, thanks for inviting me on, I'm excited to be here. Ula Ojiaku Right. So, where I usually start with all my guests, because personally, I am interested in the story behind the person - are there any happenings or experiences that have shaped you into who you are today? David Bland Yeah, I think through childhood, dealing with a lot of uncertainty and then ended up going to school for design. I thought I was going to go a different career path and then at the last moment I was like, I want to really dig into design and I think people were sort of shocked by that, with the people around me, and so I really dove into that and then I came out of school thinking, oh, I might join a startup and retire in my mid 20s, because this is a .com craze, everyone was making all this money. Obviously, that didn't happen, but I learned a lot at the startups and I was introduced to Agile really early on in my career at startups because we had to go really fast and we were in a heavily regulated industry so we couldn't break stuff and we had to have kind of processes and everything. I did that for a while and then I realised, wow, there were some people that could learn from my mistakes, and so we kind of switched coasts. So we were near Washington DC for a while, and then we moved to the San Francisco Bay Area, and I started working with companies there, and I was like, well, let me see if I can just really dig in, help people learn how to apply stuff and coach them through it, and that was around 2010 or 2011 or so, and I've been doing it ever since, and I think why I love it so much is that it kind of helps people deal with uncertainty, gives them a process to deal with uncertainty, and at the same time, I have a hard time with uncertainty. So maybe it's kind of a little bit therapeutic for me to help others deal with uncertainty as well. So yeah, I just love what I do. Ula Ojiaku And so you mentioned you don't like uncertainty, but helping other people deal with uncertainty helps you, that's interesting. Do you want to expand on that? David Bland I mean, I very much like my routines and everything, and I feel like I come at it from a process point of view. So when I'm dealing with uncertainties, like, oh, what kind of process can I apply to that? So I feel a little better about things, even though there's a lot of stuff outside my control, at least I can have kind of a process. So I feel as if, when I'm dealing with people, I feel all of this anxiety, they're working on a new idea, they're not sure if it's going to be any good or not, giving them a process to work through it together, I don't really tell them if their idea is going to be good or not because who am I to judge their ideas most of the time? It's more about, well, here's a process you can apply to all that stuff you're working through and maybe you can come up to some sort of investment decision on whether or not you should go forward with that idea. So I feel as if my demeanour and everything comes off as someone that you're like, oh, I can talk to this guy and he's actually going to respect me, and so I feel like my style plus the uncertainty bit fits together really well. So I have a style where I come into orgs and say, you have a lot of uncertainty, here's a process, you're going to be fine, we're going to work through it together and it tends to work out pretty well. Ula Ojiaku What comes across to me is that you give them tools or a process to help them hopefully come to an evidence-based conclusion without you having to share your opinion, or hopefully they don't have to have personal opinions imposing on whatever conclusion that is. David Bland Yeah, it's just a process. Ula Ojiaku And so what put you on the path to writing the book Testing Business Ideas, I was one of your students at the masterclass you and Alex Osterwalder ran during the covid lockdown, and you mentioned during that session, I don't know if you remember, that you probably went for a retreat somewhere, or you went on a hike as part of the writing process and that Alex gave you a hard time or something, so can you share your version of the story? David Bland Oh yeah, I mean it was a joy writing with him. I think one of the difficult times for me writing that book…So first Alex approached me writing it and eventually, I mean initially it was just going to be me and then I mean he needed to be involved and so he played a big role strategically in helping me kind of think about the book writing process because I've never written a book like this and then also had it published and also did the whole four colour landscape style, very visual book. It's not that you just write an outline and then you start putting in words, it's a very different process. So yeah, he pushed me a little bit during that process, I would say, he would challenge some of my ideas and say like, are you explaining this in a way that where people can understand, you know? And so I feel as if it was a very productive process writing the book with him. It took about a year I would say. I think the way it came about was it was pretty much from my coaching, born out of my coaching, because I was helping companies with a lot of uncertainty, early stage ideas and they would say well we're now going to have interviews and we're going to do surveys and we're to build the whole thing. And it's like, well, there's other things you could do that are beyond interviews and surveys. And so he and I were continuously talking about this, and it's like, well, if people are only comfortable doing interviews and surveys they're not going to address all their risk, they're going to address a part of their risk, but not, you know, there's so much more they can do. And so, we started thinking about, well, is there a book that we could put that together and give people a resource guide? So, it's more like a textbook or almost something you would read in a university. My editor, I just spoke to him a couple weeks ago, he's like, this is required reading at Stanford now, and some other places in the university programs. And so it's very much like a textbook, you know, but the reason we wrote it was, you know, to help people find a path forward, to find a way to go and de-risk what they're working on. And so I felt it was very ambitious to put that all into a book, and of course, it has some flaws, but I think for the most part, it does the job, and that's why it's been really successful. Ula Ojiaku It is, in my experience, very well laid out. It takes a lot of work to distill these ideas into something that seems simple and easy to follow. So I do concur, it's been very helpful to me as well and the ideas. In your book, in the flap, it says, okay, the number one job as an innovator, entrepreneur, a corporation, is to test your business ideas to reduce the risk of failure. And I think you've alluded it, you've kind of touched on that in explaining how your career has gotten you where you are today. But what, in your experience, do you find leaders and organisations missing the most when it comes to testing ideas? David Bland I think it's hard to unwind it all, because it goes back to how do you become a leader. And so, at least in Western, in the United States anyway, where I do some of my work, I feel as if it's very egocentric, it's very about what I can do and what I know. So there's a progression of becoming a leader where you grow up in an organisation because you have the answers, or at least you're able to convince people you know the answers, and then you're promoted and keep being promoted. And so when I'm coming in and saying, well, we might not know the answers, or we might need to test our way through and find the answers, it almost goes against that whole kind of almost like worldview you've built up or someone has built up over the years where it's about me. It has to be more than just about you as a person. It's like how do you enable leaders around you and how do you create more leaders around you and all that. And so I think where there's contradiction is this idea of, okay, I'm promoted to where I am because I have the answers, but now I want to enable people to test their way through things and find answers, and you almost need a feedback loop there of somebody that's willing to say, look, do you understand how you've unravelled some of this or how you've undermined things by saying, well, I know this is a good idea, so build it anyway. Or, that's not the test I would have ran, I would have done this other thing. You give people almost the benefit of your opinion, but they take it as marching orders, whether you realise it or not, and then it becomes this core of, why am I running tests at all because my leader is essentially going to tell me what to build. And so I think there's just some unpacking a bit of, well, I searched for the right answer in school and I was rewarded for that, and I went into business and I was rewarded for the right answer, and now we're telling you, there might not be a right answer, there are multiple right answers, and different paths and choices. And I think sometimes leaders have a hard time with that because it almost contradicts everything they've done in the past to be successful. Ula Ojiaku So, what I'm hearing you say David is that in terms of, even before we get testing the ideas, please correct me if I'm wrong, it's that there needs to be a mindset shift, a paradigm shift of, you know, what leadership is all about, it's no longer going to be about the person who knows the way, who knows all the answers and tells people what to do, but moving from that to saying, hey, I recognise I have limits and I may not have all the answers and I empower you all for us to work together to test our way to find what the right path or direction would be. David Bland Yeah, it's more about your leadership style and accountability. I think you severely limit what an organisation could do if everyone's relying on you for the answers. It's going to be really tough to scale that because if all answers have to come through you, then how do you scale? But also, it goes from transactional to transformational in a way. So transactional is, it's very much like, well, I want you to do something by this date on time, on budget, and on scope, and then basically hold you accountable to doing that, and then there's a very transactional level of leadership there. It's like, I asked you to do this thing, or told you to do this thing, you did this thing, so therefore I trust you. Where I'm trying get a bit deeper is, you know, well can you say, well, how do I empower a team to go find out what needs to be built, or if there's a real problem there, and then have them give me an account of, oh, we're making progress towards that, or you know what, we shouldn't go forward with this because this isn't worth pursuing, nobody has this problem, et cetera, and respecting their wishes or at least having a conversation about that. And so I think it does require a little bit of leadership. Looking at your style, looking at the words you use, looking at how you lead teams through uncertainty, which could be a little different than ‘I need this thing by this date and keep it under this cost and this scope' It's more about, well, we have an idea, we're not sure there's a market for it, can we go test that and see if there is and if it's viable for us and if we can actually do it? And it's a little different leadership style, and I think if you apply a transactional leadership style to trying to lead people through uncertainty, it just backfires, because it's very much like, run these experiments by this date, it doesn't empower the teams to be able to give an account of how they're addressing the risks. It's sort of a learning moment for leaders to say, oh, this leadership style that's worked really well for me in the past may not actually work really well for me here, it may work against me here in trying to drive out the uncertainty of this thing that we're trying to do. Ula Ojiaku So if I may just build on your response to the question. What, in your experience, has helped, or could help, a leader who's used to, and has been in the past up until now rewarded for that transactional leadership, to make the switch to a transformational leadership? David Bland I think asking them what they're worried about. I know people try to project confidence like they have the answers, but they don't, and so being able to be open, even if it's just a one-on-one, to say hey we have this thing where we think it might be a new business line or something that we're working on that's relatively new that we haven't done before, which is a lot of my clients, they're trying to do something that they haven't quite done before. It may not be too far away from what they're good at, but far enough away that they're worried, they're worried that it's not going to work. And so I try to get them and talk about what's keeping you up at night, what is worrying you about this, and then usually in the back of my head I'm saying, okay, what can I map that to? So I love the desirable, viable, feasible framing. I use it a lot from design thinking, user centre design. So if they're worried about the customer or there's not enough, you know, there's not really a job to be done there, I map that back to, okay, he's worried about desirability or she's worried about desirability. And if they're talking about, oh, we don't know if people will pay enough for this, or if we can keep costs low enough, you know, that's like I map it back to viability, right? And then if it's more about, I actually don't know if we're organised well enough as a company to do this and really execute on it and I map it back to feasibility. And then from there, it's more like, well how will we go test that since you're worried about it, rather than just build the whole thing and launch and see what happens. And so I try to kind of, I'd be really careful of the words I'm using and I'm trying to coach them into a moment where it's okay, just let's be open and transparent that it's not just about executing a bunch of things and then we're okay. It's more about, you know, what are we worried about and then how do we go address those worries sooner versus later. And so I try not to come at them with a bunch of canvases and a bunch of mapping tools and a bunch of stuff that would make them feel defensive because one, they probably have not had experience with those, and two, it's like, oh, this consultant's more interested in the tools than helping me, you know. So I try to use words that really kind of get at, what are you worried about and then how can we go test that and then kind of back away into the process from there? Ula Ojiaku Well, it does seem like you apply quite some psychology to the whole approach, because it's really about meeting people where they're at. And I am, just back to your point about viability, desirability and feasibility. There is a school of knowledge, I mean, you are the expert here, so I'm deferring, but there's a school of knowledge that would add also like the sustainability parts to it. Or do you think it's separate from those attributes when you're looking at ideas? David Bland Yeah. Well, I work on a lot of sustainable projects at the moment. Well, even over the last several years I've been working on companies trying to be more sustainable. So companies are manufacturing phones, they want their phones to be all recyclable materials, they want fully recyclable phones let's say. So I'm working on very cutting edge sustainability projects, but I still don't introduce it as another circle because I'm trying to keep it very simple. And so I know there are different flavours of it. I know some people add sustainability, some people add adaptability, some people add ethics, usability. Before I know it, it's just, you end up with seven circles and different themes, so I really try to keep it very simple. Even Alex and I talk about adaptability, because that was a theme that didn't quite make it into the book, but he talks about it in The Invincible Company, which is the book he wrote immediately after the one we wrote together. So I have ways of addressing those things, but I don't necessarily want to add a bunch of extra themes, because I feel like it's already challenging people with a bunch of ‘ility' words. I noticed they get confused even with the three. No matter how well I explain it, I'll see things like, things that are about building it, and reframed as desirability, and I'm like no, no, that isn't about the customer. I mean yes, of course we have to build what they need, but building it is more about feasibility. So even with the three I see people get confused so I just try to stick to the three as best I can, but basically we go into sustainability projects, still using those three, with sustainability top of mind. So I don't really call it out as a separate theme but I certainly take it into consideration when we're working on those projects. Ula Ojiaku Okay, just keeping it simple. Okay, thanks for that, David. So there are some instances where the people will consider probably are outliers to the known proven principles of design thinking, of product development, customer discovery. And I can't remember, I mean, I would have attributed it to the person, but I was just reading a tweet from someone who is known in the product development world and he was saying that if, he wouldn't have guessed that with the advent of or the popularity of Generative AI, that ChatGPT, according to his books, you know, broke all the rules of products, discovery products, development in the sense that there, and I wasn't aware that they were, Open AI was doing lots of market research to say, hey, what do you want from an AI assistant or Generative AI? But within months of releasing it to the public, they gained millions of users. So what's your thought on this? Would you say it was an outlier or is it that there were some principles working in the background that we are not aware of? David Bland I imagine there's a lot going on we're not aware of. It reminds me of the older conversations about the iPhone. There was this air of, Steve Jobs had this single brilliant idea about the iPhone and then willed it into being and then everyone, it was wildly successful, right? But I look at, even like the first iPhone as, in a way it was kind of a minimum viable product. I mean, the hardware was pretty solid, but the software, the OS was not. I mean, it didn't have really basic stuff that we would expect that we had on other things like Blackberries at the time. You couldn't copy and paste, there were some things that were missing and people viewed it as a toy and they kind of laughed at it, you know, and then they iterated on it. I would say it was about iPhone three or four, by the time they really started to get market fit with it, and then you see, you know, people you wouldn't expect with iPhones with their iPhone. You're like, wait a second, that person has an iPhone. But that took a while, you know. And I think with Open AI, it's kind of a, we're still in the early stages of a lot of this, I feel, and I'm not really sure how it's going to shake out, but I imagine, you know, they seem to be very iterative about how they're going about it, you know. So I don't know how they went about the creation of it at first, but I feel as if at least now they're taking feedback. They're not just building stuff people are asking for, but they're looking at, well these people are asking for this, but why are they asking for it and what are they trying to achieve and how might we achieve that by releasing something that solves for that. And that's kind of your job, right? It's not just to build what people ask for. It's more about getting to the need behind what they're asking for, and there might be a more elegant way to solve for what they're asking for. But there's also some backlash with AI. So I see some things happening where a lot of my corporate clients have just banned it at the firewall, they don't want their employees even accessing it. They want to keep it within the company walls, so to speak, which is going to be kind of challenging to do, although there are some solutions they're employing to do that. I also see people taking it and, you know, interviewing fake users and saying, I can validate my idea because they asked OpenAI and it said it was a good idea, so I don't have to talk to customers. And it's like, okay, so they're taking some kind of persona from people and kind of building up a thing where you interact with it, and it seems very confident in it. It seems very confident in its statements. Like, that's the thing that I've noticed with OpenAI and a lot of this ChatGPT stuff is that it can be like really confidently wrong, but you find security in that confidence, right? And so I do see people saying, well I don't have to talk to customers, I just typed in ChatGPT and asked them. And I said, this is the kind of customer, what would that customer want? And it can literally generate personas that can generate canvases. It can do a lot that makes you seem like they are good answers. You could also just click regenerate and then it'll come up with really confident, completely different answers. So I think there's still a way where we can use it to augment what we do, I'm still a big believer in that, because I think it's really hard to scale research sometimes, especially if they have a small team, you're in a Startup. I think we can use AI to help scale it in some ways, but I think we just have to be careful about using it as the single source of truth for things because in the end it's still people and we're still, find all the tech problems, still people problems. And so I think we have to be careful of how we use AI in Agile and research and product development in general. Ula Ojiaku Completely agree, and the thing about being careful, because the AI or the model is still trained at the end of the day by humans who have their blind spots and conscious or unconscious biases. So the output you're going to get is going to be as good as whatever information or data the person or persons who trained the model would have. So what I'm still hearing from you if I may use Steve Blank's words would be still get out of the building and speak to real customers. I mean, that could be a starting point or that could be something you augment with, but the real validation is in the conversation with the people who use or consume your products. David Bland I think the conversations are still important. I think where it gets misconstrued a bit is that, well people don't know what they want, so we shouldn't talk to them. I think that's an excuse, you should still talk to them. The teams that I work with talk to customers every week quite often, and so we want that constant contact with customers and we want to understand their world, we want to find new insights, we want to find out what they're trying to do and trying to achieve, because sometimes that can unlock completely new ideas and new ways to make money and new ways to help them. I think this idea of, well, we can't talk to customers because we don't have a solution ready or we can't talk to customers because they don't know what they want, I feel as if those aren't really the reasons you should be talking to customers. With discovery, you're trying to figure out the jobs, pains and gains, test value prop with them, continue to understand them better. And if you pay attention to your customers, there's this great Bezos quote, right. If you pay attention to your customers and your competitors are paying attention to you, you're going to be fine because you are, they're getting lagging information, right? You're really deeply connected to your customers, and so I just think we've somehow built this culture over time where we can't bother customers, we can't confuse them, we can't come to them unless we have a polished solution and I think that's becoming less and less relevant as we go to co-creation. We go more to really deeply understanding them. I think we have to be careful of this culture of we can't bother them unless we have a polished solution to put in front of them, I don't think that's where we're headed with modern product management. Ula Ojiaku And someone might be saying, listening to, whilst I've gone through your masterclass, I've read your book, but someone might say, well, do you mean by jobs, pains and gains with respect to customers? Could you just expand on those, please? David Bland Yeah, if you look at the, so my co-author Alex Osterwalder, if you go back to the book before Testing Business Ideas, there's a Value Proposition Design book where we have the value prop canvas. If you look at the circle in that book, so the tool kind of has a square and a circle, and we usually start with a circle side, which is a customer profile. And with the profile, you're really trying to think of a role or even a person, you're not trying to do it at the org level, you're trying to think of an actual human being. And in that, we kind of break it down into three sections. One is customer jobs to be done. So you can think about, you know, one of the functional, usually functional jobs that tasks are trying to do, you could also weave in, you know, social jobs, emotional supporting, it can get really complicated, but I try to keep it simple. But one way to find out those jobs is by talking to customers, right? Then next are the pain points. So what are the pain points that customers are experiencing, usually related to the jobs they're trying to do. So if they're trying to do a task, here's all the stuff that's making it really hard to do that task. Some of it's directly related, some of it's tangential, it's there, it's like these impediments that are really, you know, these pains that they're experiencing. And then the third one is gains. So we're looking for what are the gains that can be created if they're able to either do this task really well, or we're able to remove these pains, like what are some things that they would get out of it. And it's not always a one to one to one kind of relationship. Sometimes it's, oh, I want peer recognition, or I want a promotion, or, you know, there are some things that are tangential that are related to gains, so I love that model because when we go and we start doing discovery with customers, we can start to understand, even in Agile right. If we're doing discovery on our stories, you know, we're trying to figure out what are they trying to achieve? And then is this thing we're about to build going to help them achieve that? You know, what are the pains we're experiencing? Can we have characteristics or features that address these big pain points they're experiencing? And then let's just not solely focus on the pains, let's also think about delighters and gains and things we could do that like kind of make them smile and make them have a good day, right? And so what are some things that we could do to help them with that? And so I love that framing because it kind of checks a lot of the boxes of can they do the task, but also, can we move the pains that they're experiencing trying to do it and then can we can we help create these aha moments, these gains for them? Ula Ojiaku Thank you, and thanks for going into that and the definitions of those terms. Now, let's just look at designing experiments and of course for the listeners or people if you're watching on YouTube, please get the book, Testing Business Ideas, there's a wealth of information there. But at a high level, David, can you share with us what's the process you would advise for one to go through in designing, OK yes, we have an idea, it's going to change the world, but what's the process you would recommend at a high level for testing this out? David Bland At a high level, it's really three steps. The first is extracting your assumptions. So that's why I like the desirable, viable, feasible framing. If you have other things you want to use, that's fine, but I use desirable, viable, feasible and I extract. So, what's your risk around the market, the customer, their jobs to be done, the value prop, all that. Viability is what's your risk around revenue, cost, can you keep cost low enough, can you make money with this in some way, make it sustained? And then feasibility is much more, can you do it, can you execute it, are there things that prevent you from just executing on it and delivering it? So that step one is just extracting those, because this stuff is usually inside your head, you're worried about it, some of them might be written down, some of them might not be. If you're in a team, it's good to have perspectives, get people that can talk to each theme together and compromise and come together. The second part of the process is mapping and prioritisation. So we want to map and focus on the assumptions that we've extracted that are the most important, where we have the least amount of evidence. So if we're going to focus experimentation, I want to focus on things that make a big difference and not necessarily play in a space that's kind of fun to play in and we can do a bunch of experiments, but it doesn't really pay down our risk. And so I like focusing on what would be called like a leap of faith assumption, which I know Eric Ries uses in Lean Startup, it also goes back to probably like Kierkegaard or something, and then Riskiest Assumption is another way you can frame it, like what are the Riskiest Assumptions, but basically you're trying to say what are the things that are most important, where we have least amount of evidence. So that's step two, prioritisation with mapping. And then step three is running experiments. And so we choose the top right, because we've extracted using the themes, we have desirable, viable, feasible. We can use that to help match experiments that will help us pay down the risk, and so I always look for mismatch things. Like you're not going to pay down your feasibility risk by running customer interviews, that doesn't help you whether or not you can deliver it. So making sure that you're matching your risk, and that's kind of where the book plays in mostly because we have 44 experiments that are all organised by desirable, viable, feasible, and then we have like cost, setup time, runtime, evidence, strength, capabilities. There's like a bunch of kind of information radiators on there to help you choose, and so we basically run experiments to then go and find out, you know, are these things that have to be true, that we don't have a lot of evidence to prove them out, are they true or not? And so we start then using this process to find out and then we come back and update our maps and update our artefacts, but that's kind of the three step process would be extract, map and then test. Ula Ojiaku Thank you. Would you say that there is a time when the testing stops? David Bland I would say it never completely stops, or at least hopefully it doesn't completely stop. Even if you're using discovery and delivery, I find that usually in the beginning there's a lot of discovery and maybe a little bit of delivery or almost no delivery, and then as you de-risk you have kind of like more delivery and then a little bit less discovery. And then maybe if you're in a kind of repeatable mode where you're trying to scale something there's a lot of delivery and a little bit of discovery, but where I get really nervous are teams that kind of have a phase or a switch and they say, okay, we've done all the discovery now we're just going to build and deliver. I feel as if that constant contact with customers, being able to constantly understand them, their needs are going to change over time as you scale, it's going to change things, and so I get really nervous when teams want to just kind of act like it's a phase and we're done with our testing, right, we're done with our discovery. And I feel great organisations are always discovering to an extent. So it's just really finding the balance with your teams and with your orgs, like how much delivery do you have to do? How much discovery do you need to kind of inform that delivery? So ideally it doesn't stop, but the percentage of discovery you're doing in testing will most likely change over time. Ula Ojiaku So in the world of Agile, Agile with a capital A in terms of the frameworks that originated from software development, the role of the Product Owner/Product Manager is typically associated with ensuring that this sort of continuous exploration and discovery is carried out throughout the product's lifecycle. Do you have any thoughts on this notion or idea? David Bland I think there's always some level of risk and uncertainty in your backlog and in your roadmaps. So people in charge of product should be helping reduce that uncertainty. Now, it's usually not on their own, they'll pair with a researcher, maybe a designer. They might even be pairing with software developers to take notes during interviews and things like that to socialise how they're paying down the risk. But I think if you look at your backlog, you're kind of looking at middle to bottom and saying, oh, there's a lot of uncertainty here, I'm not really sure if you should even be working on these. So part of that process should be running discovery on it, and so I try to socialise it. So if you're in your Standups, talk about some of the discovery work you're doing, if you're in planning, plan out some of the discovery work you're doing, it's just going to help you build this overall cohesive idea of, well, I'm seeing something come in that I have to work on, but it's not the first time I've seen it, and I kind of understand the why, I understand that we did discovery on it to better understand and inform this thing and shape what I'm about to work on, and so I think it helps create those like touch points with your team. Ula Ojiaku Thank you for that, David. So let's go on. There is, of course, your really, really helpful book, personally I have used it and I've taken, I've not done all the experiments there, but definitely some of the experiments I have coached teams or leaders and organisations on how to use that. But apart from Testing Business Ideas, are there other books that you have found yourself recommending to people on this topic? David Bland Yeah, I think there's some that go deeper, right, on a specific subject. So for example, interviews, that can be a tool book itself, right, and so there's some great books out there. Steve Portigal has some great books on understanding how to conduct interviews. I also like The Mom Test, well I don't like the title of the book, the content is pretty good, which is basically how to really do a customer interview well and not ask like, closed-ended leading bias questions that just get the answers you want so you can just jump to build, you know. So there are some books I keep coming back to as well. And then there's still some older books that, you know, we built on, foundationally as part of Testing Business Ideas, right? So if you look at Business Model Generation from Alex Osterwalder, Value Prop Design, the Testing Business Ideas book fits really well in that framework. And while I reference Business Model Canvas and Value Prop Canvas in Testing Business Ideas, I don't deep dive on it because there's literally two books that dive into that. A lot of the work we've built upon is Steve Blank's work from Four Steps to the Epiphany and I think people think that that book's dated for some reason now, but it's very applicable, especially B2B discovery. And so I constantly with my B2B startups and B2B corporations, I'm constantly referring them back to that book as a model for looking at how you go about this process from customer discovery to customer validation. So yeah, there are some ones I keep coming back to. Some of the newer ones, there are some books on scaling because I don't, I'm usually working up until product market fit, you know, and I don't have a lot of growth experiments in there. So there are some books now starting to come out about scaling, but I think if you're looking at Testing Business Ideas and saying, oh, there's something here and it kind of covers it, but I want to go a lot deeper, then it's finding complimentary books that help you go deeper on a specific thing, because Testing Business Ideas are more like a library and a reference guide and a process of how to go through it. It would have been like two or three times in length if we'd gone really, really deep on everything, so I think 200 pages of experiments was a pretty good quantity there. And so I'm often, I'm referring books that go deeper on a specific thing where people want to learn more. Ula Ojiaku Thank you for that. So if the audience, they've listened to what you have to say and they're like, I think I need to speak with David, how can they reach you? David Bland Yeah, I mean, davidjbland.com is a great place to go, that's me, you can read about me, you can watch videos on me presenting. I have, you know, videos of me presenting at conferences, but also, there's a YouTube channel you can go to where I have some of my webinars that are free to watch as well, and just little coaching videos I make where I'm like, hey, I have a team that's really struggling with this concept and I just kind of make a quick YouTube video helping people out to say this is how I'm addressing this with, you know, with a team. Also Precoil, P-R-E-C-O-I-L, that's my company, and so there's a lot of great content there as well. And then just in general social media, although I have to say I'm pulling back on social media a little bit. So, I would say for the most part LinkedIn is a great place to find me, I'm usually posting memes about customer discovery and videos and things just trying to help people, like make you laugh and educate you, and so LinkedIn, surprisingly, I don't think I'd ever say like, oh, come check me out on LinkedIn, you know, five or ten years ago, but now that's where I spend a lot of my time, and I feel like that's where my customers are and that's where I can help them, so yeah, I end up spending a lot of time on LinkedIn too. Ula Ojiaku Yeah, some of your memes there like, I mean, how do I put it, just gets me up in stitches. Yeah, I don't know how you find them or do you commission actors to do some of them, but yeah, it's good. So yeah, so LinkedIn, social media is the main place, and your websites, those would be in the show notes. I also heard you do have a course, an online course. Can you tell us about that? David Bland Yeah, this summer, I finally found some space to put together my thoughts into an Assumptions Mapping Course. So that is on Teachable. I'm going to be building it out with more courses, but I've just had enough people look at that two by two and read the book and say, I think I know how to facilitate this, but I'm not sure, and so I literally just went like step by step with a with a case study and it has some exercises as well where you can see how to set up the agenda, how to do the pre work for it, who you need in the room for it, how to facilitate it, what traps to look out for because sometimes, you know, you're trying to facilitate this priority sort of exercise and then things go wry. So I talked about some of the things I've learned over the years facilitating it and then what to do a little bit after. So yeah, it's a pretty just like bite-sized hands-on oh, I want to learn this and I want to go try with the team or do it myself. So yeah, I do have a new course that I launched that just walks people step by step like I would be coaching them. Ula Ojiaku OK, and do you mind mentioning out loud the website, is it precoil.teachable.com and they can find your Assumptions Mapping Fundamentals Course there? David Bland Correct. It's on precoil.teachable.com Ula Ojiaku OK, and search for Assumptions Mapping Fundamentals by David Bland. Right, so are there any final words of wisdom that you have for the audience, David. David Bland Try to keen an open mind when you're going through a lot of this work. I feel as if the mindset is so important, you know. So if you're taking this checkbox mentality, you're not going to get the results out of following any of these processes, right. So, I think being able this idea of, oh, I'm opening myself to the idea that there's some assumptions here that may not be true, that I should probably test. It shouldn't be an exercise where you're just checking the box saying, yep, I wrote down my assumption and then, yeah, I ran an experiment that validated that and then move on, you know. It's more about the process of trying to, because your uncertainty and risk kind of move around. So, this idea of mindset, I can't stress enough that try and keep an open mind and then be willing to learn things that maybe you weren't expected to learn, and I think all these great businesses we look at over the years, they started off as something else, or some form of something else, and then they happened upon something that was an aha moment during the process, and I think that's, we have to be careful of rewriting history and saying it was somebody, it was a genius and he had a single brilliant idea, and then just built the thing and made millions. Very rarely does that ever occur. And so I think when you start really unwinding and it's about having an open mind, being willing to learn things that maybe you didn't anticipate, and I think just that mindset is so important. Ula Ojiaku Thanks. I don't mean to detract from what you've said, but what I'm hearing from you as well is that it's not a linear process. So whilst you might have, in the book and the ideas you've shared, you know, kind of simplifying it, there are steps, but sometimes there might be loops to it too, so having an open mind to know that's something that worked today or something you got a positive result from, might not necessarily work tomorrow, it's, there's always more and it's an iterative journey. David Bland It's quite iterative. Ula Ojiaku Yeah. Well thank you so much David for this, making the time for this conversation. I really learned a lot and I enjoyed the conversation. Many thanks. David Bland Thanks for having me. Ula Ojiaku My pleasure. That's all we have for now. Thanks for listening. If you liked this show, do subscribe at www.agileinnovationleaders.com or your favourite podcast provider. Also share with friends and do leave a review on iTunes. This would help others find this show. I'd also love to hear from you, so please drop me an email at ula@agileinnovationleaders.com Take care and God bless!
Welcome to The Nonlinear Library, where we use Text-to-Speech software to convert the best writing from the Rationalist and EA communities into audio. This is: The Mom Test: Summary and Thoughts, published by Adam Zerner on April 18, 2024 on LessWrong. I just finished reading The Mom Test for the second time. I took "raw" notes here. In this post I'll first write up a bullet-point summary and then ramble off some thoughts that I have. Summary Introduction: Trying to learn from customer conversations is like trying to excavate a delicate archeological site. The truth is down there somewhere, but it's fragile. When you dig you get closer to the truth, but you also risk damaging or smashing it. Bad customer conversations are worse than useless because they mislead you, convincing you that you're on the right path when instead you're on the wrong path. People talk to customers all the time, but they still end up building the wrong things. How is this possible? Almost no one talks to customers correctly. Why another book about this? Why this author? Rob is a techie, not a sales guy. We need something targeted at techies. To understand how to do something correctly, you have to understand how it can go wrong. Rob has lots of experience with things going wrong here. It's practical, not theoretical. Chapter 1 - The Mom Test: Everyone knows that you shouldn't ask your mom whether your business idea is good. But the issue isn't who you're asking, it's how you're asking. Yes, your mom is more likely[1] than others to praise you and tell you that your idea is good. But if you ask "what do you think of my idea", almost anyone will feel too uncomfortable to be constructive and honest with you. It's not other people's responsibility to tell you the truth. It's your responsibility to find it by asking good questions. The Mom Test is a series of rules for crafting good questions that even your mom can't lie to you about. Talk about their life instead of your idea. Ask about specifics in the past instead of hypotheticals about the future. Talk less and listen more. You're not allowed to tell them what their problems are. They're not allowed to tell you what the solutions should look like. They own the problem, you own the solution. Chapter 2 - Avoiding Bad Data: Bad data is either a false negative (thinking you're dead when you're not) or, much more often, false positives (thinking you're good when you're not). Three types: compliments, fluff and ideas. When you get compliments, deflect them and pivot back to asking them specifics about their past. "When was the last time you had the problem? Talk me through how it went down." If they start proposing ideas (features, solutions), dig into the underlying problem beneath their proposal. "Why do you recommend that? What problem would it solve for you? Tell me about a time when you had that problem." Pathos problem: when you "expose your ego". Example: "Hey, I quit my job to pursue this and am really passionate about it. What do you think?" It's too awkward to be critical. It can be tempting to slip into pitching them. They indicate that X isn't a big problem for them. You start explaining why X probably is a big problem, or why they should consider it a big problem. There is a time for pitching, but customer learning isn't that time. Chapter 3 - Asking Important Questions: Make sure that you seek out the world rocking, hugely important questions. Questions that could indicate that your business is doomed to fail. Most people shrink away from these. Learn to love bad news. Failing fast is better than failing slow! Thought experiments are helpful here. Imagine your company failed. Why might this be? Imagine your company succeeded. What had to be true to get you there? What advice would you give someone else if they were in your shoes? Decide ahead of time on the three most important things you're looking to learn. Chapter 4 - Keeping It Casual: Things just work better when you keep it casual. Ask ...
איך ניגשים לעשות ולידציה לבעיה שאנחנו מנסים לפתור? אילו שאלות אנחנו צריכים לשאול את עצמנו כדי לצאת לדרך? איך מגלים את התשובות לשאלות האלה דרך ראיונות משתמשים? יש לכם רעיון מעולה למוצר, מיזם, פתרון לבעיה מסוימת בעולם - ועם זה אתם מחליטים להתחיל לרוץ קדימה ולנסות לקבל ולידציה מול משתמשים. זו הדרך האינטואיטיבית שהרבה יזמים בוחרים ללכת בה כשיש להם רעיון שמרגש אותם - לגשת למשתמשים פוטנציאליים ו״למכור״ להם את הפתרון שהם מצאו. אבל יש דרך טובה יותר כנראה, שתוביל אותנו לוולידציה מדויקת ונכונה יותר: קודם כל לוודא שאכן קיימת בעיה ספציפית שמפריעה לאנשים כך שהם היו מוכנים לשלם כסף כדי לפתור אותה, ורק אחר כך לגשת לפתרון. כדי להבין את הבעיה במלואה אנחנו יכולים לשאול את עצמנו כמה שאלות יסוד - ולצאת לראיונות משתמשים, באופן שיעניק לנו את התשובות והכלים שיעזרו לצאת לדרך. אז השבוע, אדוה שיסגל מדברת עם עמיחי אבן חן, Senior Product Manager במאנדיי, על למה לא כדאי לעשות ולידציה לפתרון שלנו, איך נכון לגשת לראיונות משתמשים בתהליכי ולידציה, ומאיזה טעויות כדאי להימנע. --- תכנים נוספים שדיברנו עליהם בפרק: פרק 177: על איך עושים ולידיציה (עומרי מן ,Anchor) פרק 196: הכל על מחקר מתחרים (רן ארז) The Mom Test מוזמנים להצטרף אל קבוצת הפייסבוק שלנו ולהמשיך את השיח - www.facebook.com/groups/startupforstartup/ ניתן למצוא את כל הפרקים ותכנים נוספים באתר שלנו - https://www.startupforstartup.comSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
Lawrence Valenti is the Chief Creative Officer and Managing Partner at Scalio, a product design and development agency, as well as an acting advisor for firms in gaming, ad tech, and growth. He has managed teams with King, GSN Games, and Apple. In this episode, we discuss: The importance of design and creativity in business What happens to design in a post-AI world The role and influence of psychology in design choices Why creative strategy, iterative testing, and consumer insights matter How investing in usability and intuitive design can yield ROI Chapters: (0:00:05) Introduction to Lawrence Valenti (background & experience) (0:02:28) The importance of design and creativity in business (0:06:01) The influence of human psychology on consumer behavior (0:09:57) The use of gamification in non-gaming industries (0:11:57) The benefits of adding gamification features (0:12:38) The value of guided onboarding in complex products (0:13:07) The ‘Mom Test' as a filter for gaming experiences (0:15:23) The importance of measuring ROI on design (0:17:30) The potential impact of design on marketing results and growth (0:20:28) Mitigating risk in creative and maximizing ROI (0:21:55) The value of early validation and testing in design (0:25:33) The power of using data to inform creative decisions (0:26:23) The benefits of a disciplined approach to creative (0:27:23) The importance of testing and iteration in creative development (0:28:41) The potential pitfalls of making assumptions without customer input (0:29:34) The future of creative, including generative AI and improved tools (0:33:40) The potential for AI to automate and optimize creative processes (0:35:59) The time-saving benefits of using generative AI in concepting (0:36:53) The excitement around the current state of creativity and tech (0:36:53) The potential for increased productivity and self-expression in design (0:36:53) The role of AI in shortening the timeline for creative problem-solving (0:37:26) Analyzing tech stacks and making AI products more consumable for non-technical users (0:38:13) Using AI to automate tasks like writing dating profiles (0:38:58) Discussing the pivotal state of current AI tools (0:39:27) Conclusion and closing remarks Link to Transcript
Episode 551: Shaan Puri (https://twitter.com/ShaanVP) and Sam Parr (https://twitter.com/theSamParr) were wrong. How wrong? You'll have to listen to find out. — Show Notes: (0:00) Intro (1:00) Jenni AI's rise from $2k MRR to $300K MRR (4:00) The zoom-in pivot (7:00) First 100 customers (12:30) Fortune favors the bold (16:30) How to do a TikTok ad right (24:00) Sam's mea culpa: Hostage Tape update (27:30) Shaan's $500M L (34:00) How to pick the right market (44:00) Jason Kelce > Travis Kelce (48:00) Tracy Chapman's beacon of authenticity — Links: • Jenni - https://jenni.ai/ • The Mom Test - http://tinyurl.com/va428xyz • David Park Twitter - https://twitter.com/Davidjpark96 • Hostage Tape - https://hostagetape.com/ • Flo Health - https://flo.health/ • Palta Pitch Deck - http://tinyurl.com/ycf7e5hn • Tracy Chapman on Charlie Rose - https://charlierose.com/videos/11899 — Check Out Sam's Stuff: • Hampton - https://www.joinhampton.com/ • Ideation Bootcamp - https://www.ideationbootcamp.co/ • Copy That - https://copythat.com • Hampton Wealth Survey - https://joinhampton.com/wealth — Check Out Shaan's Stuff: Need to hire? You should use the same service Shaan uses to hire developers, designers, & Virtual Assistants → it's called Shepherd & tell ‘em Shaan sent you. Past guests on My First Million include Rob Dyrdek, Hasan Minhaj, Balaji Srinivasan, Jake Paul, Dr. Andrew Huberman, Gary Vee, Lance Armstrong, Sophia Amoruso, Ariel Helwani, Ramit Sethi, Stanley Druckenmiller, Peter Diamandis, Dharmesh Shah, Brian Halligan, Marc Lore, Jason Calacanis, Andrew Wilkinson, Julian Shapiro, Kat Cole, Codie Sanchez, Nader Al-Naji, Steph Smith, Trung Phan, Nick Huber, Anthony Pompliano, Ben Askren, Ramon Van Meer, Brianne Kimmel, Andrew Gazdecki, Scott Belsky, Moiz Ali, Dan Held, Elaine Zelby, Michael Saylor, Ryan Begelman, Jack Butcher, Reed Duchscher, Tai Lopez, Harley Finkelstein, Alexa von Tobel, Noah Kagan, Nick Bare, Greg Isenberg, James Altucher, Randy Hetrick and more. — Other episodes you might enjoy: • #224 Rob Dyrdek - How Tracking Every Second of His Life Took Rob Drydek from 0 to $405M in Exits • #209 Gary Vaynerchuk - Why NFTS Are the Future • #178 Balaji Srinivasan - Balaji on How to Fix the Media, Cloud Cities & Crypto • #169 - How One Man Started 5, Billion Dollar Companies, Dan Gilbert's Empire, & Talking With Warren Buffett • #218 - Why You Should Take a Think Week Like Bill Gates • Dave Portnoy vs The World, Extreme Body Monitoring, The Future of Apparel Retail, "How Much is Anthony Pompliano Worth?", and More • How Mr Beast Got 100M Views in Less Than 4 Days, The $25M Chrome Extension, and More
Exciting announcement! If you're keen on Mastering Product Growth and User onboarding, join the upcoming course in April. You will get personal guidance to create a stellar onboarding experience and frameworks to turn it into live. Get a 15% discount for your team (most value for PM + Product Designer together). Learn more and get early access → https://maven.com/forms/2c51ccWelcome to Growthmates — the place to connect with inspiring leaders to help you grow yourself and your product. Here you can learn how companies like Dropbox, Adobe, Amplitude, Canva, and many more are building excellent products and growth culture. Subscribe to get all episodes right to your inbox on katesyuma.substack.com.Listen now on Apple, Spotify, or watch on YouTube (new!).In this conversation, we invited Phil Vander Broek, Co-Founder at Dopt, previously Head of Growth and Business Platform Design at Dropbox. We decided to talk about User Onboarding and unpack all the truth we know about it. From this episode, you can learn: * How Dropbox approached User Onboarding and what they learned from experimenting with that* How Growth and Core teams collaboration looked at Dropbox* What Rituals can help in building a Growth Culture* and Best practices for User Onboarding from research with more than 80 companies. Beyond the Dropbox story, Phill shared his transition to becoming a Co-Founder at Dopt, and how his design background helped him play a founder role. If you find it valuable, please share it with your network and leave us a good review. Follow Growthmates podcast updates on:* Substack Newsletter (for instant inbox delivery): https://katesyuma.substack.com/podcast* LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/growthmates-podcast/* Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/growthmates_/Where to find Phil Vander Broek, Co-Founder at Dopt:* LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/philipvanderbroek/ * Website: https://www.dopt.com/Where to find Kate Syuma, Growth Advisor (ex-Miro):* LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ekaterina-syuma/* Newsletter: https://katesyuma.substack.com* X (Twitter): https://twitter.com/kate_syumaWhere to find Oscar Torres, Product Designer at Miro:* LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/oscartorrestryme/* Website: https://www.oscartorres.me/* Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/oscar_towers_/What we've covered in this episode:01:20 Approach to User Onboarding at Dropbox04:12 Surprising Behavioral Insights from User Onboarding Experiments11:57 Collaboration between Growth and Core Teams13:23 Rituals for Alignment and Building a Growth Culture21:44 Industry Trends in User Onboarding34:05 Transition to Entrepreneurship and Creating DOPT44:07 Insights and Learnings as a Founder46:28 The Connection Between AI and User Onboarding47:16 Favorite Example of User Onboarding47:29 Interactive Guides50:10 Tooltips vs Checklists51:10 Recommended Resources53:08 ConclusionResources referenced:* Product Led Onboarding playbook: https://blog.dopt.com/product-led-onboarding-playbook * The State of User Onboarding — report from 80+ companies: https://onboard.report/* The Mom Test by Rob Fitzpatrick: https://www.momtestbook.com/* How to determine your activation metric from * I bet you are doing product activation all wrong from * Get early access to the Maven course on Onboarding and Activation (15% discount for teams): https://maven.com/forms/2c51cc If you enjoyed this episode, don't forget to share it with your colleagues and like-minded friends. For sponsorship and other inquiries reach out to ekaterinasyuma@gmail.com.Subscribe to get more episodes right in your inbox: katesyuma.substack.comThanks for reading Kate's Syuma Newsletter & Growthmates! Subscribe for free to receive new posts and support my work. This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit katesyuma.substack.com
Lija Hogan is a principal on the Experience Research Strategy team at UserTesting. When she's not helping UserTesting customers understand the wide variety of topic areas they can cover using the platform, she teaches user research methods classes at the University of Michigan - Ann Arbor. Questions • Could you share with our listeners just a little bit about your journey? • Could you tell our listeners a little bit about what UserTesting is? And what do you do? • A survey was done that your company pioneered with 2000 adults. And I'd like you to just kind of talk to us a little bit about that survey and some of the key findings that came out of that survey that you believe can help organisations to have a better understanding of why AI is so important. • Where do you see the technology going for 2024? If you were to pick like a single theme that you believe Chat GPT could help an organisation to tap into delivering a better customer experience, what theme would you say they would need to be focusing on if they were going to use Chat GPT as an integration or even any form of AI that your organisation has been exposed to and work with your clients on that you think is critical for 2024 and beyond? • Now, could you also share with our listeners, what's the one online resource, tool, website or app that you absolutely cannot live without in your business? • Could you also share with our listeners maybe one or two books that you've read, could be a book that you read very recently, or even one that you read a very long time ago, but it has had a very big impact on you. • Can you also share with our listeners what's the one thing that's going on in your life right now that you're really excited about? Either something you're working on to develop yourself or your people. • Where can listeners find you online? • Now, before we wrap our episodes up, we always like to ask our guests, do you have a quote or a saying that during times of adversity or challenge, you'll tend to revert to this quote if for any reason you got derailed, or you got off track, the quote can helps to just to get you back on track. Highlights Lija's Journey Me: Could you share with our listeners just a little bit about your journey? In your own words, how you got to where you are today from where you're coming from? Lija shared that it was a very roundabout journey. So, she started with the goal of becoming an academic librarian in Slavic and Eastern European studies. So, most people are very amused when they hear that because it's a very, very focused and targeted discipline that requires a lot of education. And she started that path, actually, at the University of Michigan in Ann Arbor with a Master's Degree Programme in what she thought was going to be academic librarianship, but got bitten by the Human Computer Interaction bug really early there. And so, that was many years ago now. But that was really kind of the entry point to being focused on the user experience and the customer experience and just making really substantive connections between people to help them to transact together more effectively and efficiently. About UserTesting Me: Now, you are at UserTesting, that's what we read in your bio. Could you tell our listeners a little bit about what UserTesting is? And what do you do? Lija stated that that's a great question. So, she tends to think of UserTesting as being an enabling technology. So, essentially, it's a platform that enables their customers to connect with their own customers, their users, their employees, their potential users. And what it does is provide recording mechanisms across mobile and desktop, to enable people to have either self-guided, or live conversations with people who are looking for insights. And they capture videos and audio and screen share, to really get into the perspectives of people around the world. And so, once you've gathered all the information, the platform also provides you with some strategies around sharing that information with your colleagues. And so, you can share videos, you can share quotes, and all sorts of other data to really understand where the gaps are in your experience, and also just to understand what you can do to optimize and de risk the solutions that you're building. Survey Key Findings to Help Organizations Better Understand the Importance of AI Me: When you were originally presented to me as a guest for our podcast, a survey was shared with us that your company pioneered with 2000 adults. And I'd like you to just kind of talk to us a little bit about that survey and some of the key findings that came out of that survey that you believe can help organizations to have a better understanding of why AI is so important. Lija shared that they've actually done a few surveys around AI. And this one, really, some of the significant findings were really around just the fact that people don't understand where AI is manifesting in their lives right now. So, to a certain extent, if you ask them directly, they are answering yes and no without a clear sense for what AI really is. And she thinks one of the major findings that she had in working through that was just really leaning into the knowledge that AI is manifesting in all our lives in many ways, kind of in the background and behind the scenes. And it's already enabling us to, sometimes make better decisions, have access to more information, enrich the work that we're doing, the conversations that we're having. And that is an important benefit that we're all looking for in artificial intelligence. Organizations Using Chat GPT to Deliver a Better Customer Experience Me: So, AI exists in many different forms, because it's a broad topic. But I think the one that people most connect with and use is probably Chat GPT. It's been a year since Chat GPT was launched, I can't believe it's a year already. Where do you see the technology going for 2024? If you were to pick like a single theme that you believe Chat GPT could help an organization to tap into delivering a better customer experience, what theme would you say they would need to be focusing on if they were going to use Chat GPT as an integration or even any form of AI that your organization has been exposed to and work with your clients on that you think is critical for 2024 and beyond? Lija stated that that's a great question, because she think it's really hard to say that there's a single thing, but there are probably multiple ones that she sees as being really important. The first is, we're still trying to figure out what's in and out of bounds with regard to how people are using large language models. So, she finds the examples that we're seeing coming out of the legal profession, right, or lawyers are asking a Chat GPT to write briefs and the platform is hallucinating and making up case law, which doesn't exist. And that's a problem. So, we haven't yet caught up with creating guardrails and it's not necessarily about the technology so much as about how we reach practical consensus around what is allowable, given the constraints of the technology as it currently exists. And actually, not just as it currently exists, but with an eye towards the fact is probably going to become a lot more matured much more quickly. So, she thinks that's one. The second is really a more recent development that she's seeing around DIY, Chat GPT and so essentially, people will be able to essentially create their own version of what a large language model can do given a certain use case that they've got in mind. So, she sees the proliferation of a lot of potential technologies use cases strategies that can be leveraged by people who are both technologically seasoned and who are not, who are learning as they go. And she thinks that will be very interesting. The other main trend that she sees is the enterprise trying to make artificial intelligence safe for practical applications and business operations. And she says that because even just a few months after the launch of 3.5, back in November of last year, she was talking to UserTesting customers, a lot of their innovation teams were essentially doing tests to essentially say, within the context of our own, say, customers experience or customer support teams, how can we create an experience that is robust and safe and private and secure, and gives us confidence that we can triage some. So, essentially enrich the in person interactions that we're having with people, but also ensure that we're providing good consistent information to those customers that we might be handling using some of those more automated chatbot style experiences that are powered by artificial intelligence. App, Website or Tool that Lija Absolutely Can't Live Without in Her Business When asked about online resource that she cannot live without in her business, Lija stated that this probably is going to sound self-serving, but actually, it's UserTesting, believe it or not. UserTesting is really important because it's really a very open platform that lets you have both a highly structured as well as an unstructured conversation with the people that you want to work with or learn more from. And she thinks what's so valuable about it is you can test ideas, you can hear what's top of mind for people. And in this world where we've got access to so much data, just hearing stories brings you back down to earth and makes things very tangible and real and we need that now more than ever. Books that Have Had the Biggest Impact on Lija When asked about books that have had an impact, Lija shared that one that she thinks has been most powerful and it's because she's an optimist. And she thinks that it really gave her a research based foundation to be able to say, this is why she's an optimist, is a great book by Chip Heath and Dan Heath, they're actually brothers, they're psychologists, called Switch: How to Change Things When Change Is Hard. And the concept that she found really fascinating is their focus on not just problem solving, but actually finding those bright spots and going after those, like, where are things going right? And how can we essentially create more experience that look like those bright spots? So, she loves that idea because rather than being focused on all the negatives, it's basically saying how can we make whatever it is that we're doing look like the most positive experiences that we're providing? So, the other one, it's a really short book, it's probably less than 100 pages. But she loves it so much, it's called the The Mom Test: How to talk to customers & learn if your business is a good idea when everyone is lying to you by Rob Fitzpatrick. And even though it's kind of like a flip book title, what she loves about it is, it's a very approachable set of strategies around having conversations with people when you're trying to figure out what to build and whether or not it's going to work for people. What Lija is Really Excited About Now! When asked about something that she's really excited about, Lija stated that that is a really great question. Because there's so much, but she's actually, to the point of the books that they were talking about, the biggest area of focus that she has right now is how to listen better to all the partners that she's working with. And so, she's actually spending a lot of time reading books. So, the two that she talked about are two of them, but a number of books that are all about how does she listen better? And sometimes it's about asking better questions, that's what the Mom Test is about. But sometimes it's actually saying like, “How do I recognize that people are in a special place right now and need to be acknowledged as having been heard?” But then also, how does she change how it is that she shows up in every way, in the writing that she does, in the talking with folks that she does, in the teaching that she does, in all the interactions to help to move things forward. So, she thinks that there are so many great examples that come from working with children, and psychology, and just even business best practice, to really help to listen and to come to consensus, and just make better decisions together. So, that's really given her a lot of joy right now. Me: Are there any activities that you do with your team that kind of helps to strengthen their listening skills? Is there anything that you would like to share where that is concerned since that's an area that you'll be working on? Lija shared that she thinks a couple of things. One is she actually thinks it's kind of twofold. One is she's been spending a lot more time doing one on ones that are very unstructured. And that has given her the platform across the team that she works with, the people that she works with to really say, “What's top of mind for you, and let's talk about it.” And sometimes they start talking about their dogs and cats. But a lot of the time, what that conversation changes into is, “I'm working on this, can I get your perspective on it?” or “I'm having this challenge, can we work through it together.” And it's a great way to just stay close to what's happening in their world and their part of the organization, but then also take what it is that they're sharing, and see how she can help to pull in other people across the organization, other teams, and talk to other leaders in the organization about what they can do to address some of the themes and trends that she's seeing. And so, she thinks spending a little bit more time one on one with people has been probably providing a lot of the value that she's seeing driving those aha moments. Me: That's brilliant, that kind of reinforces one of the things that Stephen Covey talks about in his book that the most important role of a leader is to grow and develop people. So, the fact that you are actually seeing the results, because of the one on one intervention that you're doing, the time you're investing with each person, and you're seeing it twofold in terms of the benefit with the customers, then it really does prove that that is a strategy that works. Where Can We Find Lija Online LinkedIn – Lija Hogan Quote or Saying that During Times of Adversity Lija Uses When asked about a quote or saying that she tends to revert to, Lija stated that that's a great question. So actually, this is totally nerdy, but there's a quote, it's at the beginning of one of the chapters of this is where it gets nerdy, Children of Dune by Frank Herbert. And so, the Dune series, there's a movie, a remake of a couple of movies that are out right now. And the quote, and she's not going to remember it exactly, but it's really about fear and pain and kind of letting it wash through you. And understanding that it's there, but also understanding that it doesn't define you and it doesn't have to have long lasting negative implications. And so, it's basically, go with the flow, but in a way that leans into acknowledging that sometimes things are really hard and you just have to live through them and understand that it's hard, and figure out how you're going to come out on the other side. Change, but change in a way that acknowledges what's happened to you. Me: Thank you so much, Lija, just want to thank you again for coming on our podcast today and sharing a little bit about your organisation and user testing, and all the value and brilliance that you're bringing to the customer experience space. As well as some of the research findings that came out of one of the surveys that you had done recently. And just the impact of AI, specifically Chat GPT even though we spoke about that in the episode and other different forms of AI as well. But just taking time out of your busy schedule and coming on here with us and sharing all of the great insights and experiences that you've had. I do believe our listeners will gain a great amount of value from this episode. So, thank you so much. Please connect with us on Twitter @navigatingcx and also join our Private Facebook Community – Navigating the Customer Experience and listen to our FB Lives weekly with a new guest Links • Switch: How to Change Things When Change Is Hard by Chip Heath and Dan Heath • The Mom Test: How to talk to customer & learn if your business is a good idea when everyone is lying to you by Rob Fitzpatrick • Children of Dune by Frank Herbert The ABC's of a Fantastic Customer Experience Grab the Freebie on Our Website – TOP 10 Online Business Resources for Small Business Owners Do you want to pivot your online customer experience and build loyalty - get a copy of “The ABC's of a Fantastic Customer Experience.” The ABC's of a Fantastic Customer Experience provides 26 easy to follow steps and techniques that helps your business to achieve success and build brand loyalty. This Guide to Limitless, Happy and Loyal Customers will help you to strengthen your service delivery, enhance your knowledge and appreciation of the customer experience and provide tips and practical strategies that you can start implementing immediately! This book will develop your customer service skills and sharpen your attention to detail when serving others. Master your customer experience and develop those knock your socks off techniques that will lead to lifetime customers. Your customers will only want to work with your business and it will be your brand differentiator. It will lead to recruiters to seek you out by providing practical examples on how to deliver a winning customer service experience!
If you're shopping for books this Black Friday, here are the 15 most impactful books I read before and during my SaaS founder journey. From entrepreneurship to marketing and customer interaction, you'll have a lot to put on your Black Friday shopping list.My own work is available for 50% off on Gumroad for a few days, too. Use the code BFF for Zero to Sold, The Embedded Entrepreneur, and Find your Following.And now, let's grow your library with the likes of Rob Walling, John Warrillow, Michele Hansen, and many more:This episode is sponsored by Acquire.comThe blog post: The podcast episode: The video: https://youtu.be/F9iIxqtvNUIYou'll find my weekly article on my blog: https://thebootstrappedfounder.comPodcast: https://thebootstrappedfounder.com/podcastNewsletter: https://thebootstrappedfounder.com/newsletterMy book Zero to Sold: https://zerotosold.com/My book The Embedded Entrepreneur: https://embeddedentrepreneur.com/My course Find Your Following: https://findyourfollowing.comHere are a few tools I use. Using my affiliate links will support my work at no additional cost to you.- Notion (which I use to organize, write, coordinate, and archive my podcast + newsletter): https://affiliate.notion.so/465mv1536drx- Riverside.fm (that's what I recorded this episode with): https://riverside.fm/?via=arvid- TweetHunter (for speedy scheduling and writing Tweets): http://tweethunter.io/?via=arvid- HypeFury (for massive Twitter analytics and scheduling): https://hypefury.com/?via=arvid60- AudioPen (for taking voice notes and getting amazing summaries): https://audiopen.ai/?aff=PXErZ- Descript (for word-based video editing, subtitles, and clips): https://www.descript.com/?lmref=3cf39Q- ConvertKit (for email lists, newsletters, even finding sponsors): https://convertkit.com?lmref=bN9CZw
"How to Talk to Customers and Learn If Your Business is a Good Idea When Everyone is Lying to You"
Do you ever feel like your work just isn't good enough? We have a natural urge to play it safe and avoid rejection. But playing it safe will never produce work that resonates deeply.In this episode, we break down the mindsets and strategies of the world's most successful creators. Learn how to adopt a founder's mentality, tap into human psychology, and conduct rapid experiments that help you achieve product-market fit.Discover strategies for standing out, crafting work that resonates at a deeply human level and understand why "good enough" will never be good enough.It's time to step up your game and have the courage to constantly evolve rather than playing it safe.- - -On the growth mindset podcast with Sam Webster Harris, we explore the psychology of happiness, satisfaction, purpose, and growth through the lens of self-improvement. Success and happiness is a state of mind unique to ourselves and is our responsibility to create.Through a process of honest self-reflection of what is holding us back and what is driving us forward, we can lose the ego and build awareness of how to be the best we can be.- - -Connect with Sam:Sam's newsletter on creativity - Explosive ThinkingWatch the pod - YouTube (Growth Mindset)Twitter - @samjamharrisInstagram - @SamJam.zenYoutube - @Samjam- - -Show: Growth Mindset, psychology of self-improvementEpisode: The Psychology of Creating Viral ContentChapters:0:00 Sharing Ideas01:11 How to Get Better at Doing Stuff01:27 Product Market Fit03:08 The Mom Test04:22 Iterating Your Idea06:14 Feedback is a Gift07:19 Growing the Growth Mindset Podcast09:45 If Your Work isn't Growing, It's Dying10:15 Biggest Myth in Content Creation11:54 Don't Feel Any Attachment to Any Ideas You Have14:15 Stop Making Excuses15:31 Lessons from Mr. Beast16:51 Don't be Insane18:15 Send Off Become a member at https://plus.acast.com/s/growth-mindset-podcast. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.
Brett and Shane talk about the book, "The Mom Test." and go over how to know what feedback is good for your product or service and what feedback is just something that makes you feel good.Don't forget to like, subscribe, and share. Episodes published every Tuesday at 6 am EST. We'll see you on the next one. Harmon Brothers:https://harmonbrothers.com/home (Website) https://www.instagram.com/harmon.brothers/?hl=en (Instagram) https://www.tiktok.com/tag/harmonbrothers?lang=en (Tik Tok)
Is one actor's mom causing problems for their son?
ユーザーインタビューにおいて効果的にインサイトを得るための手法であるMom testや、プロダクトが市場で勝つための条件などについて話しました Mom test https://www.mycustomer.com/experience/voice-of-the-customer/the-mom-test-how-to-learn-insights-from-customers-when-everyone-is Moat https://www.investopedia.com/ask/answers/05/economicmoat.asp Your co-hosts: Tomoaki Imai, Knot, inc CTO https://twitter.com/tomoaki_imai Yusuke Kawanabe, Software Engineer https://twitter.com/ykawanabe
Vikram is the co-founder of Galileo – an AI diagnostics and explainability platform used by data science teams building NLP, LLMs and Computer Vision models across the Fortune 500 and high growth startups. Prior to Galileo, Vikram led Product Management at Google AI, where his team built models for the Fortune 2000 across retail, financial services, healthcare and contact centers. He has a master degree from Carnegie Mellon University from the school of computer science. If you enjoy the show, subscribe to the channel and leave a 5-star review. Subscribe to Daliana's newsletter on www.dalianaliu.com for more on data science and career. Vikram Chatterji's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/vikram-chatterji/ "The Mom Test": https://www.amazon.com/The-Mom-Test-Rob-Fitzpatrick-audiobook/dp/B07RJZKZ7F Daliana's Twitter: https://twitter.com/DalianaLiu Daliana's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/dalianaliu (00:00:00) Introduction (00:04:24) How he got into machine learning (00:06:53) Diagnosing large language models (00:09:56) Addressing model hallucination (00:12:46) Metrics for measuring hallucination (00:17:30) From Google AI to starting Galileo (00:24:08) Developing LLMs and putting them into production (00:32:51) Galileo's diagnostics and explainability platform (00:43:16) Advice for data scientists when joining a startup
In a world where pricing is often feared and neglected, one woman is on a mission to bring some light to the topic. But what happens when she reveals the power of pricing to shape customer actions and boost business performance? Find out on a new episode of The Melting Pot with Dominic Monkhouse. This week we learned from pricing expert and the founder of Untapped Pricing, Jenny Millar. With a decade worth of hands-on experience in managing the fees for selling on eBay's European platforms, she has a deep understanding of how to use pricing as both a financial boost and a mechanism for customer behaviour management. She extends her ability to help organisations discover their product's true value, leaving no room for guesswork. Jenny's unique insights, drawn from both qualitative and quantitative customer research, provide game-changing guidance for businesses eager to leverage pricing to optimise growth. Download and listen to learn more from Jenny Millar. On today's podcast: Unearth the hidden power of pricingUsing pricing to shape customer behaviourUnderstanding the power of price optionsDebunking some of the most common pricing mythsThe importance of an evolving pricing strategy Follow Jenny Millar:WebsiteLinkedInThe Pricing ScoreappBitesize pricing tactics Book recommendations:The Mom Test Enjoyed the show? Leave a Review
Peter Ord, the CEO and creator of GUIDEcx, leads the team behind this innovative platform. GUIDEcx is a state-of-the-art solution designed to enhance client onboarding and implementation. Its primary focus is on improving client visibility and engagement, allowing you to efficiently manage projects, uphold transparency, and provide an exceptional client experience at every stage. Peter Ord's extensive expertise is further reflected in his role as a National Columnist for the Forbes Technology Council, as well as his prior experience as the Vice President of Sales at DealerSocket.On this episode of The Rollercoaster, Tyler and Peter discuss on how books have long been regarded as invaluable tools for acquiring knowledge and honing essential skills. When it comes to mastering the ability to build and ultimately deliver a successful product, there are several top recommendations that stand out. Three notable books worth exploring are:The Mom Test by Rob Fitzpatrick challenges traditional feedback methods, guiding entrepreneurs and product developers to extract valuable insights by asking the right questions and actively listening. It equips them with effective tools to validate ideas and uncover hidden problems.The User Method by Jeff Gothelf and Josh Seiden advocates user-centered design and agile methodologies. By prioritizing continuous feedback and user-centric approaches, it enables product teams to meet authentic user needs and aspirations.The Lean Startup by Eric Ries revolutionizes startups with a scientific approach to product development. It promotes a lean startup mindset, focusing on the build-measure-learn feedback loop.In any leadership role, whether as a parent or employer, the saying holds true: "It's easier to dampen a child's fire than to reignite it." This timeless wisdom stresses the importance of nurturing and harnessing natural passion and drive, rather than trying to revive it later. Like a flame, a child's enthusiasm burns brightly. As a leader, it's vital to recognize and embrace this inherent energy. By offering guidance, encouragement, and support, you can fuel their potential and ensure sustained motivation and growth.Embrace your entrepreneurial spirit and seize the moment to start a company. In the business world, the mantra is clear: "Just do it." Avoid hesitation and indecision, trusting your instincts and taking action. When pursuing entrepreneurship, it's easy to overthink and delay. However, true success lies in trusting your inner drive and having the courage to leap forward. Don't let fear or self-doubt hinder your potential. Starting a company requires determination, resilience, and a tolerance for uncertainty. Instead of overanalyzing, focus on planning, strategizing, and executing your ideas. Embrace the inherent risks, knowing that mistakes and failures are valuable learning experiences.Where to find Peter Ord:LinkedIn: Sirva SoundbitesExplores the latest trends and topics on global talent mobility and the future of work.Listen on: Apple Podcasts Spotify-Where to find Tyler Hall: LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/tylerchall/ Newsletter: https://www.linkedin.com/newsletters/the-tyler-hall-archives-7018241874482122753/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/sirTHALL Work with Tyler: https://www.tylerchristianhall.com/
https://mimetype.app/The Mom Test: https://www.amazon.com/The-Mom-Test-Rob-Fitzpatrick-audiobook/dp/B07RJZKZ7Fmeier.shMy Book - Foundations of High Performance Reactthereactshow.comhttps://twitter.com/TheReactShowMusic by DRKST DWN: https://soundcloud.com/drkstdwnThe Investor Friendly Real Estate AgentWelcome to the Investor Friendly Real Estate Agent Podcast where we look at real...Listen on: Apple Podcasts SpotifySupport the show
We talked about: Aleksander's background The difficulty of selling data stack as a service How Aleksander got into consulting The Mom Test – extracting feedback from people User interviews Why Aleksander's data stack as a service startup was not viable How Aleksander decided to switch to consulting Finding clients to consult Figuring out how to position your services Geographical limitations Figuring out your target audience The importance of networking and marketing Pricing your services The pitfalls of daily and hourly pricing and how to balance incentives Is Germany a good place to found a company? Aleksander's book recommendations Links: LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/alkrusz/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/alkrusz Website: www.leukos.io Free data engineering course: https://github.com/DataTalksClub/data-engineering-zoomcamp Join DataTalks.Club: https://datatalks.club/slack.html Our events: https://datatalks.club/events.html
“I had one job, which was to get the data right. Why was that so freaking hard?” asked Barr Moses, co-founder and CEO of Monte Carlo, the world's first data observability platform, discussing what motivated her to create the product. Having worked with data for 15 years, she realized so many people across the industry couldn't seem to get it right, nor did they have a systematic, scalable way to make sure data was accurate. In the world we're living in, where so many people have access to data, just a few minutes of inaccurate data can lead to poor customer experience and millions of dollars in lost revenue. It's a problem Barr says will only get worse over time, as data becomes more important to infrastructure. Barr explains what it was like to create a whole new category, something from nothing, even when some people were telling her it would never work and that she was throwing her career away. She knew there was a company to be built there, and she wanted to be the one to do it and be proud of the journey along the way—which she admits is a lot of hard work. Category creation is really solving customer problems, and in so doing, the customer becomes co-creator of the category because they have the answers. Customer happiness is at the heart of the whole operation. Barr expands upon this and other codified values that make up the foundation of Monte Carlo. Barr reveals what the two main rules any business should have, from the beginning and forever. Find out why it's important that people around you pass “The Mom Test,” what the odds are that data will ever be 100% accurate, and what it's like to be married to your co-founder. Quotes: “The idea of data being wrong would get a really strong reaction. It resonated. I think that was the first ‘aha' moment. People that I didn't even know would say, ‘Hell, yes, I have that problem, please help me solve it now. So that was the very first lightbulb moment.” (9:52-10:17 | Barr) “We're not looking for someone to say, ‘Hey we have 100 percent confidence.' We're looking for someone to say, ‘Hey, this data is important enough for us to invest something in making sure that it's accurate.' It's about treating the issue with the diligence it deserves." (15:53-16:07 | Barr) “Think about application reliability: A couple of decades ago, nobody cared if your app was up or down. But then Netflix is down for 45 minutes in 2016 because of duplicate data. Netflix being down is a hell of a problem.” (16:07-16:26 | Barr) “Customers don't give a shit about you creating a new category or not. They literally don't care. They care about, ‘Are you solving a real problem for me?' Helping people and solving their problem is way more important.” (32:58-33:20 | Barr) “Our measure of success isn't years or weeks, it's literally minutes. Every minute that you're spending on something should be high-value.” (39:50-40:00 | Barr) Connect with Brendan Dell: LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/brendandell/ YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/c/BrendanDell Instagram: @thebrendandell TikTok: @brendandell39 Buy a copy of Brendan's Book, The 12 Immutable Laws of High-Impact Messaging: https://www.indiebound.org/book/9780578210926 Connect with Barr Moses: LinkedIn: @barrmoses barr@montecarlodata.com Check out Barr Moses recommended books: The Mom Test by Rob Fitzpatrick https://www.indiebound.org/search/book?keys=The+Mom+Test Daring Greatly: How the Courage to Be Vulnerable Transforms the Way We Live, Love, Parent, and Lead by Brene Brown https://www.indiebound.org/book/9781592408412 The Score Takes Care of Itself by Bill Walsh, Steve Jamison and Craig Walsh https://www.indiebound.org/book/9781591843474 Please don't forget to rate, comment, and subscribe to Billion Dollar Tech on Apple, Spotify, or wherever you listen to podcasts! Use code Brendan30 for 30% off your annual membership with RiverSide.fm Podcast production and show notes provided by HiveCast.fm
Nadia Odunayo is the Founder and CEO of The StoryGraph, a new website and app for avid book readers because life's too short for a book you're not in the mood for. The StoryGraph helps you track your reading and choose your next book based on your mood, favorite topics, and themes. Victoria talks to Nadia about coming up with a product based on the concept of mood, what you're in the mood for to read, i.e., this book made me feel this way. How do I find a book that makes me feel similar? They also talk about keeping yourself open to feedback, the ability to flow and change direction, and developing a reviewing system that keeps biases in check. StoryGraph (https://thestorygraph.com/) Follow StoryGraph on LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/company/the-storygraph-limited/), Instagram (https://www.instagram.com/the.storygraph/), or Twitter (https://twitter.com/thestorygraph). Follow Nadia Odunayo on LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/in/nodunayo/) or Twitter (https://twitter.com/nodunayo). Follow thoughtbot on Twitter (https://twitter.com/thoughtbot) or LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/company/150727/). Become a Sponsor (https://thoughtbot.com/sponsorship) of Giant Robots! Transcript: VICTORIA: This is The Giant Robots Smashing Into Other Giant Robots Podcast, where we explore the design, development, and business of great products. I'm your host, Victoria Guido. And with me today is Nadia Odunayo, Founder and CEO of StoryGraph, a new website and app for avid book readers because life's too short for a book you're not in the mood for. StoryGraph helps you track your reading and choose your next book based on your mood and your favorite topics and themes. Nadia, thank you for joining me. NADIA: Thank you for having me. VICTORIA: And you are a repeat guest at Giant Robots. But for those who missed that episode, tell me a little bit about your journey. And how did this all get started? NADIA: Okay. Yeah, so that first time was in 2015, and that was not too long after I had just got into tech. I did a bootcamp in London in 2014, Makers Academy, and that's where I learned to code. My degree was in philosophy, politics, and economics, so rather different. I worked at Pivotal for about a year and a half after I graduated from Makers Academy. And during my time at Pivotal, I got into conference speaking, and my first talk was around game theory. So I took my favorite topic in economics, game theory, and I combined that with distributed systems because that's what I was working on at the time in Pivotal on their Cloud Foundry PaaS. I think I gave it at RailsConf, and I think someone there recommended me to Giant Robots. And so Ben Orenstein interviewed me, and it was all about different types of conference talks and that kind of thing. So after Pivotal, I left and started a hybrid kind of consultancy/product company with a colleague, did that for about a year, left that, worked for about a year with my friend, Saron Yitbarek, on her company CodeNewbie. And then, when that partnership ended, I essentially had five years of runway from money that I got from the company that I started after Pivotal because we did some consulting with a bank. I'd always been entrepreneurial. I'd been doing various entrepreneurial things since secondary school, actually, high school. It was time for me to just have time on my side projects. And so I started hacking away on one of my side projects at the beginning of 2019 in January, and I haven't stopped since. That's what the StoryGraph has developed into. VICTORIA: Wonderful. And yes, I saw that the very early stages of StoryGraph started as a creative writing e-publication. Is that right? NADIA: So what happened was when I was at university, I started a creative writing e-publication, came up with the name The StoryGraph. Because we had won or we were going for some grant funding or something like that, I set up a corporate entity. And when I stopped working on that e-publication, I remember my mom saying to me, "Don't shut down the entity. I really like the name. I feel like you'll use it for something," that was in 2012. And so fast forward to 2019, and the side project that I was working on was called Read Lists. And it was very specifically focused on tracking and sharing progress through reading lists on a dashboard. But when I was doing customer research, and the scope of the project grew, Read Lists didn't fit anymore. And that's when I realized, oh, I can use The StoryGraph thing again. And so it's basically had two different lives or two different forms, the StoryGraph company. VICTORIA: That's wonderful. And I'm reading about StoryGraph and how it's an Amazon-free alternative to Goodreads. Can you talk a little bit more about the product and why people would want to use it? NADIA: So, as I said, it started life as a very specific focused side project. And I just had so much fun working on it and working in the book space. I'd always been a reader since I was a kid such that I said to myself, I need to find a way to make me building a books product a full-time thing. And so that's when customer research came in because the only way that you're going to make sure that you don't build something that people don't want is by talking to people. As I was doing customer research and figuring out, are there pain points amongst readers, people who track their reading? What would happen was the pain points that came up drove me towards building a more fully fledged reading, tracking, and recommendations product. It actually started as a very focused recommendations product. And then, we got to the point where we needed to build more around it for it to be a compelling product. And as it was growing, we never advertised ourselves as a Goodreads alternative or as an Amazon-free alternative to what was out there. But that was clearly a pain point in the market. There were tweets about us saying, "Finally a Goodreads alternative. It's small; it's independent; it's Amazon-free. And so thousands and thousands, hundreds of thousands of people have come to us because of that. VICTORIA: Wow. NADIA: And so it got to the point...mainly when we launched our payment plan, and we were trying to figure out the reasons why people were pre-ordering the plan, it was at that point where we decided to lean into the Amazon-free Goodreads alternative because that was what the market wanted. VICTORIA: Was that surprising for you? Or were there other things that came out of your research on your marketplace that kind of were different than what you thought it would be going in? NADIA: I think the most interesting thing about the product development journey was that I at least originally felt like I was building a product that wasn't for me. So what I mean by that is in my earliest rounds of research, what I was finding was that people still didn't think that they had one place to get consistently good book recommendations. And so then I started to explore, well, how do you even give somebody consistently good book recommendations? And one of the factors that kept on coming up was this concept of mood, what you're in the mood for. This book made me feel this way. How do I find a book that makes me feel similar? And so it got to the point where I said to myself, oh wow, I'm building a product for mood readers right now; that seems to be the gap, that seems to be the thing that nothing out there yet had properly attacked. And I had never considered myself a mood reader. I just thought I'm a planner. I'm an organized person. I typically decide what book I want to read, and then I read it. And so there was a point where I was concerned, and I thought, wait, am I now building something that is not for me? But then, as I started to work and do more research and talk to more and more people and thinking about my reading experiences, I developed the hypothesis or the viewpoint rather that I think everybody's a mood reader; it's just the scale. Because there are probably some books that I may have rated lowly in the past that if I had read it in a different frame of mind, or at a different time in my life, different circumstance, it probably would have resonated with me a lot more. Now, that's not to say that's true for every single book. There are some books that are just not going to work for you, no matter what. But I do think we're all on the scale of mood reading. And sometimes we say a book is a bad book, but we just read it at not the right time. And so I think the most surprising thing for me is going on that journey of realizing that, oh, I am a mood reader too. VICTORIA: [laughs] NADIA: And I ended up building an app that's a lot less focused on just the pure ratings. I was someone who, on Goodreads, if it had less than four stars, I'm not interested. And the ethos of the product is more about, well, hang on; these ratings are very subjective. And someone else's two, three-star could be your next five-star. What are the factors that really matter? Do you want something dark, adventurous? Are you looking for something funny, light? And then what kind of topics do you want to discover? And then it doesn't matter if the five people before you thought it was average; you might think it's excellent. VICTORIA: Yeah, it reminds me thinking about how bias can come in with authors and writing as well. So a simple five-star system might be more susceptible to bias against different genders or different types of names. Whereas if you have more complex numbers or complex rating systems, it might be easier to have different types of authors stand out in a different way. NADIA: That actually relates to what was going through my mind when I was developing the reviewing system on StoryGraph. You can just, if you want, leave your star rating and say no more, but the star rating is lower down on the page. And up front, we say this book would be great for someone who's in the mood for something...and then you've got checkboxes. And how would you rate the pace of the book? And if it's a fiction book, we ask you, "Are the characters lovable?" Is there a flawed narrator? Is it plot-driven or character-driven?" Questions like that because the thinking is it doesn't matter whether you are going to give the book two stars in your own personal star rating. You can still help someone else find a book that's good for them because they will be looking at the summary on the StoryGraph book page, and they'll go, "Oh wow, 80% of people said it's lovable. There's a diverse range of characters, and it's funny. So the topics fit things I'm interested in, so I care less about the average rating being like 3.5 because everything else seems perfect. Let me see for myself." And actually, we've also had a lot of feedback from people saying that "Oh, normally, I never know how to review a book or what to say. And this system has really helped me, almost give me prompts to get started about explaining the book, reviewing it for other people to help them decide if it's for them. So that's great." VICTORIA: That makes sense to me because I read a lot of books, maybe not as much as I would like to recently. But not all books that I love I can easily recommend to friends, but it's hard for me to say why. [laughs] You know, like, "This is a very complicated book." So I love it. I'll have to check it out later. It's been four years since you've been full-time or since 2019, almost five then. NADIA: Yes. VICTORIA: If you could travel back in time to when you first started to make this a full-time role, what advice would you give yourself now, having all of this foresight? NADIA: Have patience, trust the process because I can sometimes be impatient with, ah, I want this to happen now. I want this to pick up now. I want these features done now. I'm a solo dev on the project. I started it solo. I have a co-founder now, but I'm still the solo dev. And there were so many things, especially now that we've got a much larger user base, that people complained about or say is not quite right. And that can be really tough to just have to keep hearing when you're like, I know, but I don't have the resource to fix it right now or to improve it. But I think one of the things is, yeah, having faith in the process. Keep going through the cycles of listening to the customers, prioritizing the work, getting the work done, getting the feedback, and just keep going through that loop. And the product will keep getting better. Because sometimes it can feel, particularly in the first year when I was so low, you sometimes have moments of doubt. Or if a customer research round doesn't go super well, you start to wonder, is this only a nice-to-have? And is this going to go anywhere? And so that's one piece of advice. And I think the other one is knowing that there are several right paths because I think sometimes I would agonize over I want to do the right thing. I want to make sure I make the right choice right now. And, I mean, there are some things that are not good to do. You want to make sure that you're setting up your customer interviews in a non-leading way. You want to make sure that there are certain standards in the product in terms of the technical side and all that kind of stuff, so there's that. But I think it's understanding that you kind of just have to make a decision. And if you set yourself up to be able to be adaptive and responsive to change, then you'll be fine. Because you can always change course if the response you're getting back or the data you're getting back is going in the wrong direction. VICTORIA: I love that. And I want to pull on that thread about being open to changing your mind. I think that many founders start the company because they're so excited about this idea and this problem that they found. But how do you keep yourself open to feedback and keeping that ability to flow and to change direction? NADIA: I mean, I didn't set out to build a Goodreads alternative, and here I am. VICTORIA: [laughs] NADIA: I just wanted to build this specific side project or this specific...it was a companion app, in fact. Like, the first version of the thing I built, the first thing you had to do was sign in and connect your Goodreads account so that we could pull in your shelves and start creating the dashboards. So as a solo bootstrapping founder, building a Goodreads alternative was not something that I thought was going to lead to success. But through years of experience, and just hearing other people's stories, and research, I just learned that it's such a hard space just running a startup in general, and 90% of startups fail. And I just said to myself that, okay, the only way I can kind of survive for longer is if I am open to feedback, I'm open to change course, I'm patient, and I trust the process. These are the things I can do to just increase my chances of success. And so that's why I kind of feel it's imperative if you want to go down this route and you want to be successful, it's vital that you're open to completely changing the product, completely changing your direction, completely going back on a decision. You'll either lose customers or you'll run out of money, whatever it is. And so yeah, you've got to just basically be quite ruthless in the things that are just going to minimize your chances of failing. VICTORIA: That makes sense. And now, I have a two-part question for you. What's the wind in your sails? Like, the thing that keeps you going and keeps you motivated to keep working on this? And then, conversely, what's kind of holding you back? What are the obstacles and challenges that you're facing? NADIA: I think this kind of role...so I'm like founder, CEO, and developer. In general, I think I thrive under pressure and pushing myself, and trying to always be better and improve. So I'm always trying to be like, how can I improve my productivity? Or how can I run the company better? All these kinds of things. So I feel like I'm getting to explore maximizing my full potential as someone in the world of work through doing this. So that just intrinsically is motivating to me. I love books, and I love reading. I think it's such an amazing hobby. And the fact that I get to make other readers happy is awesome. So even just as the product has grown, the messages that we get about if someone got a perfect recommendation from StoryGraph, or they hadn't read for years, and now an easy form of, you know, what are you in the mood for? Check a few boxes, and we'll show you some books that fit, whatever it is. That's just so...it's so awesome just to be able to enhance readers' lives that way in terms of the things they're reading and getting them excited about reading again or keeping them excited. So those are the things that keep me going, both the personal nature of enjoying my work and enjoying trying to be the best founder and CEO that I can and building a great product. It's always great when you build something, and people just enjoy using it and like using it. So I'm always incentivized to keep making the product better, the experience better. I'm currently mid a redesign. And I'm just so excited to get it out because it's going to touch on a lot of repeated pain points that we've been having for years. And I just can't wait for everyone to see it and see that we've listened to them. And we're making progress still like three and a bit years on since we launched out of beta. What's tough? Previously, what's been tough is navigating, remaining independent, and bootstrapped with just personally trying to make money to just live my life. So I had five years of runway. And it was this tricky situation about when I had a couple of years left, I'm thinking, wow, I really like doing this, but I'm going to need to start earning money soon. But I also don't want to get investment. I don't want to stop doing this. I can't stop doing this. We've got hundreds of thousands of customers. And so kind of trying to balance my personal needs and life situations with the work I've been doing because I've been working so hard on it for so long that in the last couple of years, it's gotten to a point where it's like, how do I craft the life I want out of a product that is very not set up to be an indie bootstrapped product? [laughs] Typically, you want to do a B2B. You want to start earning money from your product as early as possible. And I feel like I've landed in a product that's typically funded, VC-backed, that kind of thing. So kind of navigating that has been a fun challenge. There's not been anything that's kind of demoralized me or held me back, or made me think I shouldn't do it. And it's just kind of been a fun challenge trying to...yeah, just navigate that. And we've been doing things like we're currently in the process of transitioning our...we have a Plus Plan. And when we launched it, it was essentially a grab bag of features. We're completely changing the feature set. And we right now have six and a half thousand people who are on that plan. But we don't have product market fit on that plan, and I can tell from when I do certain surveys the responses I get back. And so we're completely transitioning that to focus in on our most popular feature, which is the stats that we offer. And so that's kind of scary, but it's part of making that Plus Plan more sticky and easier to sell because it's going to be for your power users who love data. So they want all the data when they are reading. And then the other thing is, okay, what kind of business avenue can we start which fits in with the ethos of the product but brings in more revenue for StoryGraph? And so, we launched a giveaway segment in our app where publishers and authors can pay to list competitions for users to win copies of their books. And it's essentially a win-win-win because publishers and authors get another channel to market their books. Users get to win free books, and readers love winning free books. And StoryGraph has another revenue source that helps us stay independent and profitable, and sustainable in the long run. VICTORIA: That's wonderful. And there are two tracks I want to follow up on there; one is your decision not to seek funding; if you could just tell me a little more about the reasoning and your thought process behind that. And you've already touched on a little bit of the other ways you're looking at monetizing the app. NADIA: Since I was a teenager, I've always been interested in business, economics, entrepreneurship. I've always felt very entrepreneurial. I've read so many founder stories and startup stories over the years. And you hear about venture capitalists who come in, and even if it's fine for the first year or two, ultimately, they want a return. And at some point, that could come at odds with your mission or your goals for your company. And when I think about two things, the kind of life I want and also the nature of the product I'm building as well, VC just doesn't fit. And I know there are so many different funding programs and styles right now, a lot more friendlier [laughs] than VC. But I'm just focusing on VC because when I was younger, I used to think that was a marker of success. VC funding that was the track I thought I was going to go down, and that was what I kind of idolized as, oh my gosh, yes, getting a funding round of millions and millions and then building this huge company. That was how I used to be, so it's so interesting how I've completely gone to the other side. That idea that you could have mismatched goals and how it's ruined companies, once you take the first round of funding and you grow and expand, then you've got to keep taking more to just stay alive until some liquidation event. That just doesn't appeal to me. And I just think there's something ultimately very powerful and valuable about building a product without giving up any ownership to anybody else and being able to make it into something that people love, and that's profitable, and can give the people who run it great lifestyles. I just think that's a mark of an excellent product, and I just want to build one of those. And then I think also the nature of the product itself being a book tracking app. I think the product has done well because it is run and built so closely by myself and Rob. And so it's like, people talk about how, oh, you can tell it's built for readers by readers by people who care. And I run the company's Instagram, and it's not just me talking about the product. I'm talking with a bunch of our users about books and what we're reading. And it really feels like it's just got such a great community feel. And I worry that that can get lost with certain types of investment that I've previously thought that I wanted in my life. And so, yeah, that's the reason why I've kind of strayed away from the investment world. And then it's gotten to the point, like, now we're at the point where we don't need funding because we've been able to get to profitability by ourselves. So we don't need any type of funding. And we're just going to try and keep doing things to keep making the product better, to convert more people to the Plus Plan. And, hopefully, our giveaways platform grows in the way we want such that our goal is to just stay profitable and independent forever for as long as possible. And we think that way, we're going to have the most fun running the company, and the product is going to be the best it can be because there's not going to be competing incentives or goals for the product. VICTORIA: That makes sense. And it sounds like, in reality, in the real case, you had a team, and you had the skills yourself to be able to move the product forward without having to take on funding or take on additional support, which is awesome. And I actually really like your background. I also have a degree in economics. So I'm curious if the economics and philosophy, all of that, really lends itself to your skills as a founder. Is that accurate? NADIA: I don't think so. VICTORIA: [laughs] NADIA: I love my degree. I get sad when I meet econ grads or econ majors, and they're like, "Oh, I hated it. Oh, it was so boring," or whatever. I'm like, "No, it was so great." I'm a big microeconomics fan, so I was all about...I didn't like macro that much. I was all about the game theory and the microeconomic theory, that kind of stuff. I don't think there's anything that really ties into my skills as a founder. I feel like that's more to do with my upbringing and personality than what I studied. But, I mean, one of the reasons I did love my degree is because there are elements that do crop up. It's such a widely applicable...the subjects I did are so widely applicable, philosophy, different ways of seeing the world and thinking and approaching different people. And then, obviously, economics that's essentially behavior, and how markets work, and incentives, and all that kind of stuff. And when you get to pricing and all those sorts of things, and business, and then politics as well, I mean, everything is politics, right? People interacting. So there are definitely things and conversations I had at university, which I see things crop up day to day that I can tie back to it. But yeah, I think it doesn't really...my specific degree, I don't think it's made me a better founder than I would have been if I'd studied, I don't know, English or Math or something. VICTORIA: Right, yeah. I think economics is one of those where it's kind of so broadly applicable. You're kind of using it, but you don't even realize it sometimes. [laughs] NADIA: Yeah. MID-ROLL AD: thoughtbot is thrilled to announce our own incubator launching this year. If you are a non-technical founding team with a business idea that involves a web or mobile app, we encourage you to apply for our eight-week program. We'll help you move forward with confidence in your team, your product vision, and a roadmap for getting you there. Learn more and apply at tbot.io/incubator. VICTORIA: So what made you decide to go to a bootcamp right after finishing school? NADIA: So I'd always been entrepreneurial. I remember...I don't know where exactly it started from, whether I got it from my mom. I know she's always been very entrepreneurial and into business. The earliest memory I have of doing something that was very specifically business-oriented was in what we call sixth form in the UK, which is essentially the last two years of high school before you go to university or college; we had this scheme called Young Enterprise. And essentially, you got into teams of people, small teams, or they could be quite big, actually. It could be up to 20 people. And you started a business, and there were trade shows, and pitch meetings, and all that kind of stuff, so I remember getting involved in all that sort of stuff at school. But I'd always been on the investment banking track because when I was young...so my parents...we come from a poor background. And so my parents were very much like, you know, try and find high-paying careers to go into so that you can pay for whatever you want and you have a much better lifestyle. So I had gotten onto the investment banking track from the age of 14 when I went with a friend...at the school, I went to, there was a Take Your Daughter to Work Day. My dad said, "Oh, you want to go to try and find someone whose parent works in an investment bank or something like that. That's like a great career to go into." And so I went with a friend's dad to UBS. And I remember being blown away, like, wow, this is so fascinating. Because I think everything seems so impressive when you're 14, and you're walking into a space like that, and everything seems very lively. And everyone's walking around dressed sharp. They've got their BlackBerries. So from the age of 14 until 20, it would have been, I was very much I am going to work in an investment bank. And I did all the things that you would do, like all the schemes, the spring programs. And it got to my final internship. And I just remember at the internship being rather disillusioned and disappointed by the experience. I remember thinking, is this it? I was studying at Oxford, and I put so much into my studies. And I remember thinking; I'm working so hard. And this is what I come to? Is this it? And so around the time as well, I was also meeting a lot of people in the entrepreneurship space, social enterprises, people doing their own ventures. And I just remember thinking, oh, I feel like I've got to go down that track. And I ended up winning a place on a coding course. It was set up specifically to help more women get into tech. And it was called Code First Girls. I won a place that started...it was just part-time. What I did was I actually...I got the banking job from Deutsche Bank, it was, but I decided to turn it down. It was a very risky decision. I turned it down, and I stayed in Oxford after graduating and worked in the academic office for a while. And then, twice a week, I would go to London and do this coding course. And during it, on Twitter, I remember seeing a competition for a full-paid place at this bootcamp called Makers Academy. And I just thought to myself, having tech skills, I'd heard the feedback that it's a very powerful thing to have. And I remember thinking I should go for this competition. And I went for the competition, and I won a free place at the bootcamp. If I didn't win a free place at the bootcamp, I'm not sure what would have happened because I'm not sure whether at that point I would have thought, oh, paying £8,000 to go to a software bootcamp is what I should do. I'm not sure I would have got there. So that's how I got there, essentially. I won a competition for a bootcamp after having a taste of what coding was like and seeing how freeing it was to just be able to have a computer and an internet connection and build something. VICTORIA: Oh, that's wonderful. I love that story. And I've spent a lot of time with Women Who Code and trying to get women excited about coding. And that's exactly the story is that once you have it, it's a tool in your toolset. And if you want to build something, you can make it happen. And that's why it's important to continue the education and get access for people who might not normally have it. And you continue to do some of that work as well, right? You're involved in organizations like this? NADIA: Like Code First Girls? No. I did some years ago. I would go and attend Rails Girls workshops and be a mentor at them, at those. And while I was at Pivotal, I helped with events like codebar, which were essentially evenings where people who were learning to code or more junior could come and pair with someone more senior on whatever project they wanted to. So I did a bunch of that stuff in the years after leaving Makers Academy. And I was even a TA for a short time for a couple of weeks at Makers Academy as well after I graduated. But in more recent years, I haven't done much in that space, but I would love to do more at some point. I don't have the bandwidth to right now. [laughs] VICTORIA: And you're still a major speaker going and keynoting events all around the world. Have you done any recently, or have any coming up that you're excited about? NADIA: So before the pandemic, my last talk, I keynoted RubyWorld in Japan. That was in November 2019. And then the pandemic hit, and 2020 June, July was when StoryGraph had some viral tweets, and so we kicked off. And amongst all of that, I was being invited to speak at remote events, but it just didn't make sense for me. Not only was I so busy with work, but I put a lot of hours into my talks. And part of the fun is being there, hallway track, meeting people, being on stage. And so it just didn't appeal to me to spend so much time developing the talk to just deliver it at home. And so, I just spent all the time on StoryGraph. And I remember when events started happening again; I wondered whether I would even be invited to speak because I felt more detached from the Ruby community. Most of the conferences that I did were in the Ruby community. StoryGraph is built on Rails. Yeah, I just thought maybe I'll get back to that later. But all of a sudden, I had a series of amazing invitations. Andrew Culver started up The Rails SaaS Conference in LA in October, and I was invited to speak at that. And then, I was invited to keynote RubyConf, that was recently held in Houston, Texas, and also invited to keynote the satellite conference, RubyConf Mini in Providence, that happened a couple of weeks earlier. And so I had a very busy October and November, a lot of travel. I developed two new talks, a Ruby talk and a StoryGraph talk. It was my first ever time giving a talk on StoryGraph. It was a lot of work and amongst a lot of StoryGraph work that I needed to do. All of the talks went well, and it was so much fun to be back on the circuit again. And I'm looking forward to whatever speaking things crop up this year. VICTORIA: That's wonderful. I'm excited. I'll have to see if I can find a recording and get caught up myself. Going back to an earlier question, you mentioned quite a few times about market research and talking to the customers. And I'm just curious if you have a method or a set of tools that you use to run those experiments and collect that feedback and information. NADIA: Yes. So I remember one of the first things I did years ago was I read "The Mom Test" by Rob Fitzpatrick. And that's great for just getting the foundation of when you talk to customers; you don't want to lead them on in any shape or form. You just want to get the raw truth and go from there. So that's the underpinning of everything I do. And then, I learned from friends I made through Pivotal about how you put together a script for a customer research. You can't just have bullet points or whatever. You should have a script. And the foundation of that script is a hypothesis about what you're trying to find out in that round of research. And once you figure out your hypothesis, then you can put together the questions you want to ask and understand how you're going to measure the output. So the first ever thing I was trying to find out when I first started interviewing people was just very general. It was just like, are there any pain points? I was just trying to figure out are there any pain points among the avid reader group of people? And then I remember the results from that were, "No place for consistent, high-quality recommendations." And so then I said, okay, how are people finding recommendations now, or what are the factors that lead to people thinking a book was great for them? And that's how I ended up getting to the moods and pace. But when I do my interviews, I record them all. I watch them back. And I condense everything on sticky notes. And I use a virtual tool. And I try to take word for word. When I summarize, I still just try and use their specific words as much as possible. So I'm not adding my own editing over what they say. Every single interviewee has a different color. And I essentially group them into themes, and that's how I unlock whatever the answers are for that round. And then I use that...I might have been trying to find out what to build next or whether we should go down a certain product direction or not. And so, depending on the outcome, that helps me make up my mind about what to do. So that's the high-level process that I follow. VICTORIA: Well, that sounds very methodical, and interesting for me to hear your perspective on that. And you mentioned that you do have a redesign coming out soon for StoryGraph. Are there any other particular products or features that you're really excited to talk about coming up soon? NADIA: Yeah, I'm so excited about the redesign because we're bringing out...it's not just a UI improvement; it's a user experience improvement as well. So there are a lot of little features that have been asked for over the years. And actually, it was trying to deliver one of them that sparked the whole redesign. So people really want a marked as finished button. There's no way to mark as finished. You just toggle a book back to read. And some people find this quite counterintuitive, or it doesn't quite explain what they're doing. And so when I came to deliver the mark as finished button, this was months and months ago now, I realized that the book pane was just becoming so cluttered, and I was trying to fight with it to squeeze in this link. And I remember thinking; this is not the only thing people want to see on the book pane. They also want to see when they read the book without having to go into the book page. They also want to be able to add it to their next queue. And I just said, you know what? I need to redesign this whole thing. And so I was able to luckily work with Saron Yitbarek, who is married to my co-founder, Rob. There's a funny story about all of that. And she helped me do this redesign based on all my customer research. And so I'm just so excited to get it out because the other thing that we're bringing with it is dark mode, which is our most requested feature in history. And it's funny because I've always felt like, ah, that's a nice-to-have. But obviously, for some people, it's not a nice-to-have; it's an accessibility issue. And even me, I'm quite strict with my bedtime. I try and be offline an hour before bed. In bed by 11, up at 6, and even me if I want to track my pages, I'm like, ooh, this is a bit bright. And my phone itself is set on adaptive, so it's light mode during the day and dark mode during the night. And even me, I can see why people really want this and why it would just improve their experience, especially if everything else on your phone is dark. So I'm really excited to get that out, mainly for the UX improvements. And the other thing I'm really excited to do is transition the Plus Plan to being the advanced stats package rather than the random selection of features right now. Because not only will the people who pay us get more complex stats functionalities such that they feel like, wow, the subscription fee that I pay not only does it still make me feel like I'm supporting an alternative to Goodreads, an independent alternative to Goodreads I also get such value from these extra features. But the other thing is what I found from my customer research is that if you're a Plus customer, there's often one or two of the Plus features that you love and that you don't really use the others. But they're all really great features. And so what I'm really excited about is that we're going to make all the non-stats features free for everybody. And so I'm so excited for, like, we have a feature where if you put in a group of usernames, we look at all of your to-read lists and suggest great books for you to buddy-read together. Now, there's a bunch of Plus users who aren't social and don't care about it. But there's going to be a bunch of our free users who are so excited about that feature, probably will use it with their book clubs, things like that. We have up-next suggestions where we suggest what you should pick up next from your to-read pile based on a range of factors. It could be, oh, you're behind on your reading goal; here's a fast-paced book. Or this book is very similar to the one that you just finished, so if you want something the same, pick up this one. And, again, that's behind a paywall right now, and I'm just so excited for everybody to be able to use that. When I remember starting out with StoryGraph, I remember thinking, wow, the way this is going, wouldn't it be so cool if we could just suggest books that would be the next perfect read for you? Because a lot of people have a pile of books by their bedside table or on their shelves, and they're just like, well, which one should I start with? And this tool literally helps you to do that. And so I can't wait for everyone to be able to try it. And so that's why I'm excited about that transition because the Plus Plan will be better, and the free product will be better. VICTORIA: That sounds amazing. And I'm thinking in my head like, oh, I should start a book club with thoughtbot. Because there are some engineering management and other types of books we want to read, so maybe we could use StoryGraph to manage that and keep ourselves motivated to actually finish them. [laughs] NADIA: Cool. VICTORIA: No, this is wonderful. And what books are on your reading list coming up? NADIA: Yes. I am excited to read...I'm not sure...I'm blanking on the series' name. But the first book is called "The Poppy War." I don't know whether it's called "The Burning God" or if that's the third book in the series. But it's this very popular trilogy, and I'm excited to read that soon. I'm doing a slow chronological read of Toni Morrison's fiction. I recently read "Song of Solomon," which was great, really, really good. And so I'm excited to read more of her novels this year. I'm also on a kind of narrative nonfiction kick right now. I love narrative nonfiction. So I just finished reading "American Kingpin," which is about Silk Road. And I've picked up "Black Edge," which is about SAC Capital and Steve Cohen and that whole hedge fund insider trading situation. So I'm probably going to look for more of the same afterwards. VICTORIA: Well, that's very exciting. And it's inspiring that as a founder, you also still have time to read [laughs] and probably because StoryGraph makes it easy and motivating for you to do so. NADIA: Yeah, everyone thought that my reading would tank once I started the company, but, in fact, it's multiplied severalfold. And a couple of reasons; one is it's very important in general for me to make time for me because I'm in a situation that could easily become very stressful and could lead to burnout. So I make sure that I make time for me to read and to go to dance class regularly, which is my other main hobby. But then, secondly, I feel like I can justify it as work. Because I say, wow, me being a reader and being able to communicate with people on Instagram and on Twitter about books, not just the product, adds legitimacy to me as the founder and developer of this product. And so it's important that I keep reading. And it also helps the product be better because I understand what features are needed. So, for example, I never used to listen to audiobooks. I'm a big podcast person; I love music. So between those two, when does audio fit in? And also, I didn't like the idea that I could just be absent-minded sometimes with some podcasts, but with a book, you don't want spoilers. It could get confusing. But I started listening to audiobooks because we had a large audiobook user base. And they would ask for certain features, and it was really hard for me to relate and to understand their needs. And now that I have started listening to audiobooks as well, we made some great audiobook listeners-focused additions to the app last year, including you can track your minutes. So you can literally get you read this many pages in a day, but you also listened to this many minutes. You can set an hours goal for the year, so not just a reading goal or a pages goal. You can set an hours goal. Or maybe you're someone like me, where audiobooks are the smaller proportion of your reading, and you just want it all calculated as pages. And so I've got it on the setting where it's like, even when I track an audiobook in StoryGraph, convert it to pages for me, and I just have my nice, all-round page number at the end of the year. VICTORIA: That's so cool. Really interesting. And I've had such a nice time chatting with you today. Is there anything else that you'd like to share as a final takeaway for our listeners? NADIA: If you are someone who wants to start a company, maybe you want to bootstrap, you've got a product idea, I think it's honestly just trust the process. It will take time. But if you trust the process, you listen to customers and really listen to them...research ways to talk to customers, and don't cut corners with the process. There have been so many times when I've done a whole round of research, and then I say, oh, do I have to go through all these now and actually do a synthesis? I think anecdotally; I can figure out what the gist was; no, do the research. You don't know what insights you're going to find. And I think if you just trust that process...and I think the other thing is before you get to that stage, start building up a runway. Having a runway is so powerful. And so whether it's saving a bit more or diverting funds from something else if you have a runway and you can give yourself a couple of years, a few years without worrying about your next paycheck, that is incredibly valuable to getting started on your bootstrapping journey. VICTORIA: Thank you. That's so wonderful. And I appreciate you coming on today to be with us. You can subscribe to the show and find notes along with a complete transcript for this episode at giantrobots.fm. If you have questions or comments, email us at hosts@giantrobots.fm. And you can find me on Mastodon at Victoria Guido. This podcast is brought to by thoughtbot and produced and edited by Mandy Moore. Thank you for listening. See you next time. ANNOUNCER: This podcast is brought to you by thoughtbot, your expert strategy, design, development, and product management partner. We bring digital products from idea to success and teach you how because we care. Learn more at thoughtbot.com. Special Guest: Nadia Odunayo.
This week is all about how we interact with customers – and we have a great guest who knows a whole lot about it.In fact, he literally wrote the book on it. Author Rob Fitzpatrick has been helping small businesses and entrepreneurs reach their goals for years. He's written several books, including “The Mom Test: How to Talk to Customers & Learn If Your Business Is a Good Idea When Everyone Is Lying to You.” This is something he knows and cares about – and he was kind enough to spend nearly an hour breaking it all down with UpdateAI's Josh Schachter! Topics covered in their Unchurned conversation include:Creating the “perfect customers” for software productsWhy how you frame a conversation is criticalWhy talking to customers should be like “surgery”How to find “overlap” between CS and learning about the customer The value in being “sneaky” in meetings Living the remote life in EuropeThere's plenty more they discussed, too, so be sure to listen to the full episode!
Machine Learning Engineer is one of the fastest growing professions on the planet. Liran Hason, co-founder and CEO of Aporia, joins us to discuss this new field and how folks can learn the skills and gain the experience needed to become an ML Engineer!00:00:59 Introductions00:01:44 How Liran got started making websites00:07:03 College advice for getting involved in real-world experience00:12:51 Jumping into the unknown00:15:22 ML engineering00:20:50 The missing part in data science development00:29:16 How to build skills in the ML space00:37:01 A horror story00:41:34 Model loading questions00:47:36 Must-have skills in an ML resume00:50:41 Deciding about data science00:59:08 Rust01:06:27 How Aporia contributes to the data science space01:14:26 Working at Aporia01:16:53 FarewellsResources mentioned in this episode:Links: Liran Hason:Linkedin: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hasuni/ Aporia: Website: https://www.aporia.com/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/aporiaai Linkedin: https://www.linkedin.com/company/aporiaai/ Github: https://github.com/aporia-ai The Mom Test (Amazon): Paperback: https://www.amazon.com/Mom-Test-customers-business-everyone/dp/1492180742 Audiobook: https://www.amazon.com/The-Mom-Test-Rob-Fitzpatrick-audiobook/dp/B07RJZKZ7F References: Shadow Mode: https://christophergs.com/machine%20learning/2019/03/30/deploying-machine-learning-applications-in-shadow-mode/ Blue-green deployment: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blue-green_deployment Coursera ML Specialization (Stanford): https://www.coursera.org/specializations/machine-learning-introduction Auto-retraining: https://neptune.ai/blog/retraining-model-during-deployment-continuous-training-continuous-testing If you've enjoyed this episode, you can listen to more on Programming Throwdown's website: https://www.programmingthrowdown.com/Reach out to us via email: programmingthrowdown@gmail.comYou can also follow Programming Throwdown on Facebook | Apple Podcasts | Spotify | Player.FM Join the discussion on our DiscordHelp support Programming Throwdown through our Patreon ★ Support this podcast on Patreon ★
Ryan Paul Gibson is the founder of content lift. Ryan explains how customer research can drive sales, how to make the case for marketing budget, and how to do customer research interviews that don't suck.He has worn business development hats, works alongside demand gen marketers, and really understands what it's like for organizations that are navigating uncertain times right now.Ryan also contextualizes this type of work and shares examples like The Mom Test by entrepreneur and writer Rob Fitzpatrick. Jump ahead with the following chapter markers: (00:00) - Intro (00:28) - De-risking marketing (01:27) - Arguing for your budget (03:12) - Aligning with sales (05:18) - Customer research (08:39) - Beyond personas (10:39) - Research amidst uncertainty (13:16) - Outro Find Ryan Paul Gibson on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ryan-paul-gibson/Learn more about content lift: https://contentlift.io
Join me and co-founder of Pond, Mitch Stein, to talk about the power of community building, the role of trust in doing business with nonprofits and what pink sherbert has to do with marketing. Mitch is the founder of the online platform Pond that helps nonprofits and consultants connect. Part of his journey was building trusting and authentic relationships when trust was not a given. Join us to hear what he's learned about building community and how you can apply it to your work. To connect with Mitch: Pond To connect with Mitch: https://www.linkedin.com/in/mitchsteinpond/ Quote from Mitch: "Brand IS happening whether you're intentional about it or not" To find the Mom Test: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hla1jzhan78 To sign up for Fund Your Strategic Vision visit: https://brookerichie-babbage.lpages.co/fund-your-strategic-vision/ --- Support this podcast: https://anchor.fm/nonprofitlowdown/support
There's a very particular bottleneck where groundbreaking science is more applicable than ever but inaccessible to many. The tools are unaffordable to the schools and groups who could use them to hook kids right when they're most excited, kids with a huge variety of lived experienced, who have grown up in the climate era, and in the COVID era, who see and want to solve problems they can touch and feel – but because of costs and access, they never get to try. Or the bottleneck presents as being frustratingly inefficient, to the labs who actually do this stuff every day, the ones who see a peer's research and try to replicate it, but don't have the funding or people or bandwidth or all three to spend time filling test tubes. Building better processes isn't the sexiest science you can do, but the science doesn't happen, or nearly enough of it, or fast enough, without the help of someone who's been affected by these inefficiencies. Someone who can see the whole journey and identify areas where existing ways of doing things and tools for doing things can be made more reliable, more useful, and more affordable, to more people. Roya Amini-Naieni is one of those people, and she's my guest today, straight from her lab. This is another in our series of conversations with 776 fellows, a two-year program for young people who want to build a better future. Roya is not only a 776 fellow but also the co-founder and CEO of TriloBio, where she's working on revolutionizing synthetic biology by changing the way synthetic biologists do science. Roya's had an incredible journey so far, the child of Iranian immigrants, the child of engineers, and the apprentice to so many mentors who have seen her ambition and seem to understand that Roya has identified a way to stand up for better access to the tools of the future, and along the way, maybe even put a dent in the universe. ----------- Have feedback or questions? http://www.twitter.com/importantnotimp (Tweet us), or send a message to questions@importantnotimportant.com New here? Get started with our fan favorite episodes at https://www.importantnotimportant.com/podcast (importantnotimportant.com/podcast). ----------- INI Book Club: https://bookshop.org/a/8952/9781492180746 (The Mom Test) by Rob Fitzpatick https://parahumans.wordpress.com/ (The Worm Webseries) Find all of our guest recommendations at the INI Book Club: https://bookshop.org/lists/important-not-important-book-club (https://bookshop.org/lists/important-not-important-book-club) Links: Learn more about TriloBio on the https://trilo.bio/#/ (website), https://www.linkedin.com/company/trilobio/ (LinkedIn), or https://mobile.twitter.com/trilobio (Twitter) Follow Roya on https://mobile.twitter.com/royanaieni (Twitter) Learn more about the https://www.776.org/ (776 Foundation Fellowship Program) Find your https://igem.org/ (iGEM) team Fulfill your genetic engineering dreams with your own kit from https://www.the-odin.com/ (The Odin) Get your own https://bento.bio/ (Bento Lab) Follow us: Subscribe to our newsletter at http://newsletter.importantnotimportant.com/ (newsletter.importantnotimportant.com) Follow us on Twitter: http://twitter.com/ImportantNotImp (twitter.com/ImportantNotImp) Follow Quinn: http://twitter.com/quinnemmett (twitter.com/quinnemmett) Edited by https://anthonyluciani.com (Anthony Luciani) Produced by https://twitter.com/willowbeck_ (Willow Beck) Intro/outro by Tim Blane: http://timblane.com/ (timblane.com) Advertise with us: https://www.importantnotimportant.com/sponsors (https://www.importantnotimportant.com/sponsors)
Quantum Quote: “You can't climb a mountain if it's smooth." -Andre Iguodala Investing is one of the primary ways to secure a better financial future for you and your family. But, did you know that where we bank and how our investments are managed can greatly impact our carbon footprints? Our finances, including our retirement funds, are not charity. Ensuring that these are properly invested is a must. Carbon Collective provides the opportunity to ensure that our investments not only build a better future for us, but also for our planet. As part of its mission, we have the power to create a zero-carbon society by forcing major corporations to transition and decarbonize faster through your investments. Make the right choice. Invest with impact. Save our planet. Zach Stein is the co-founder of Carbon Collective, the first investment advisory firm focused solely on solving climate change. Zach's entrepreneurial journey began with his hands on the ground, well, more accurately, in poop. He founded Urban Worm, a Bay Area worm composting farm that took free waste products– horse manure and apple pulp– and turned them into premium compost that sold for $20 a gallon. This urban agriculture base led Zach into the world of indoor farming, raising leafy vegetables and fish in controlled environments. He teamed up with James Regulinski to launch Osmo Systems, an innovative sensor/monitoring platform that would enable first indoor farmers and then the broader world of fish and shrimp farming to detect key aspects of their water quality for 1/10th the cost. They raised over $4m from top-tier VCs to commercialise the tech. Now, Zach and James are scaling Carbon Collective and rapidly expanding their offerings, team, and member base. Sign up for a free webclass to discover how easy it is to get ultra-efficient geothermal heating and cooling installed in your home – without the pain of emptying your savings account. In “The Power Of Earth With Comfort” From Climate Master webclass, you'll discover the answers every homeowner needs to know, including: How geothermal heating and cooling can draw energy from the ground beneath our feet (for pennies) Why homeowners everywhere are making the switch The secrets to securing utility incentives and tax credits to pay for a large portion of your new geothermal system and much more… If you are tired of rising energy costs and want to save up to 70% on your energy bills, go to www.AWESomeEarthKind.com and register now for this FREE special event that will show you exactly how to get geothermal heating and cooling installed in your home. SuperNova #1. So often, when it comes to climate change, individuals get stuck in a loop of "I'm terrified, emotionally. And I don't know what to do. I see these lists, and it's like you have to do everything." How should we prioritise that? What we found to be a really helpful framework is focusing on the big things, like the gears of your life that run in the background, focus where it's a weighty decision to make a change, but once you make it, you're done, and you just get to go on living your life. One simple example is where you keep your money. SuperNova #2. Remove the really big rocks first. And then you can kind of take a breath and re-establish. SuperNova #3. If you don't have effective teamwork, then you aren't going to be successful, or it's very hard to be successful. Invest in the team, and put that front and center. AHA! Moment: I'll share like, from fairly early on, we ended up doing 120 interviews with folks to try and understand where their climate anxiety took them and where they got blocked. This was before we knew that Carbon Collective was going to be an investing company. We set up all these elaborate demos to try to walk people through a simulation of what it could be. In our first interview, this guy says, "Hey, this was fine, but you really should read this book called the "Mom Test". We're like, "What's the Mom Test?" It is the best book I've ever read for people who are looking to see if a particular product should exist. It teaches you how to interview, where you go, and how to dig for past behaviors. When you dig for the why of their behavior, you see where people got blocked. Best Advice He's Ever Received: “Learn. So long as you're learning you're on the right path.” -Zach Stein Personal Habit that Contributes to Success: “Making sure I get good sleep, which has been really hard with a five-month-old.” -Zach Stein Internet Resource: Loom Magic Wand: “I think I would re-establish our deep human connection to nature and that we're a part of it. I think that if that happened across the world, so many of our environmental problems, in addition to climate change, we would just feel so much of the pain that is happening that we wouldn't need to do anything to solve it. It would just happen.” -Zach Stein WTF Moment: “I lived through the orange day in San Francisco in the Bay Area. This was during fire season. I, at the time, was waking up with the sun at seven am. There was a skylight right above my bed. It was so dark- I woke up at 10 am. It was the weirdest day I've ever been in. My wife, and I had recently bought a home in the Bay Area and we looked at each other and were like, "Did we make a huge mistake?" -Zach Stein Most Energized About Today: “Honestly, I'm really energized about my kid. He's in such a cute phase. Whenever I see him, he smiles at me. It's incredible!” -Zach Stein Parting Advice: “So long as you're learning, you're on the right path. And just trust that that's going to take you there.” -Zach Stein Connect: Website: https://www.carboncollective.co/ Email: zach@carboncollective.co Project Drawdown: http://www.projectdrawdown.org/ Project Drawdown's Climate Solutions at Work: https://drawdown.org/publications/climate-solutions-at-work As You Sow: https://www.asyousow.org/ International Energy Agency: https://www.iea.org/ Renewing America: https://www.rewiringamerica.org/
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